Blah blah blah…So how do we secure affordable healthcare for all? How do we create real jobs that won't disappear in seven weeks. And where will our children live?
Answers:
1) healthcare has failed and will only fail us more as we age.
2) Jobs are the worse thing in the world for the "market". Less jobs, more profit. Humans are a big stumbling block to profits.
3) We'll end up in huge apartment blocks like they have in Russia. Or maybe just a tent. Whichever is moderately affordable. Or not.
I'm sick of pundits. I'm sick of moderates. And I'm really sick of politics. All of it.
53
An excellent column from Mr. Friedman. I used many of the same arguments in making the case to my kids on why they shouldn’t vote for Bernie. But Mr. Friedman fails to support his reference to the “gross and widening inequality that we see all around us.” He must have missed the cover page and related story “Inequality Illusions” in a recent issue of The Economist. A number of respected economists are finding material errors in and refuting the conclusions of Thomas Piketty et al. regarding growing income inequality. Unsurprisingly this has not been considered news that’s fit to print herein.
54
In 1848, Germany and much of the rest of Europe reached its turning point, and failed to turn. Except in Denmark. There the King and his supports welcomed constitutional monarchy. In the U.S. when the Oligarchy is challenged first they used billy clubs. Then they used Fox News and then MSNBC.
16
Bernie never studied or travelled to Denmark he went to Cuba and nicaragua and apologized for socialist dictators. It’s Good to have this conversation about income equality but Bernie has been fatally irresponsible.
Also the meanness or his campaign switched me off from him. Hope you guys and gals learn not to boo and harass people. Shame on you.
31
This article is a red herring. Friedman started off with an either inexcusably ignorant or purposefully fraudulent misrepresentation of Bernie's vision, and then built an argument off of it. This is irresponsible.
74
So many angry Bernie fans who are missing the reality because they prefer a wonder world that can't exist. Without trade the US has a mediocre economy, which would be true for every trading partner as well. Jobs are not the result of demand but of companies that higher workers to fulfill demand. Know the difference.
You want universal health care. Be prepared to pay more taxes, not less. As noted in this piece, that's how single-payer health care coverage is funded everywhere. The wealthy are not going to fund your healthcare so you don't have to. All citizens pay for it. It's still far less costly than the current system in the US, but it has to be paid for.
Sanders cannot succeed as president if he can't compromise and negotiate. Either-or is not leadership and it's not democracy. It won't happen. To fix what needs fixing cannot be forced into existence by yelling in print or in person. Citizens have to participate and be prepared to compromise. Bernie doesn't do compromise, which is why he has been so ineffective in congress.
Eclectic Pragmatism — http://eclectic-pragmatist.tumblr.com/
Eclectic Pragmatist — https://medium.com/eclectic-pragmatism
26
I wouldn't get too excited about Joe Biden just yet. He still has a lot to prove. Every time I see him and hear him speak, I feel like he's walking on egg shells. And why does Biden's candidacy feel similar to John McCain's, in terms of being so out of sync with the times?
Please tell me again what Biden's fresh, new ideas are for America? I can't think of any. In fact, Bernie Sanders has been providing the democratic party with all of the new ideas for the past two presidential campaign seasons.
49
Friedman hits the nail on the head!
I have worked with the Danes in Copenhagen (and the Swedes) in Stockholm back in the late 80s and early 90s and have never seen a more competitive market oriented capitalist mentality in my life.
But coupled to that they have a mentality that mixes two great ethics together that too many of us in America seem to have never learned...or conveniently ignore: WE are our Brother's (and Sister's) Keeper and...WE are all in this together.
Bernie is an ideologue about the two social mentalities I note above to the point he ignores or dismisses the market based capitalist mentality which makes his two more social realities possible in places like Denmark. He cannot achieve his dreams because he articulates no understanding or respect for the reality of what the market capitalist mentality achieves and the fact that is essential and is not going away in America.
Biden is a pragmatist who has demonstrated his understanding of the need for all three mentalities in his long career and in his personal conduct. His goal is balance and progress toward the promotion of all three national ideals.
Meanwhile Trump is neither a pragmatist nor idealist. He is a bully, a liar and narcissist with a cult that blindly believes his lies.
He must be removed.
I urge everyone reading this piece by Friedman to forward it, and talk about it with you friends, both those who support Bernie's dreams and independents and GOPers who may be tired of Trump.
35
And then there is the problem that Americans are not Danes. We are not raised to put community interest before self interest, or to keep our expectations modest. “Because you deserve it!” is not the guiding principle for a Dane. Great column!
32
Really well explained. Nicely done Mr. Friedman.
It is somewhat discomforting to think that secure economic property rights (individual and collective) may be stronger in Denmark than the USA.
Then Americans are quick to make racial, ethnic or other sectarian exceptions to secure economic property rights....
11
Good article. I've always felt Bernie's bandwidth is too narrow. All he talks about is redistributing wealth - not how to create it. We need more equality but we also need to keep the economic engines fully functioning. I think Biden gets that. Bernie doesn't.
20
As a former risk-taking entrepreneur, who started several small local businesses, I can say that our capitalist system has progressed to the point at which no sane person would start a business unless they could raise $100MM. The consolidation and amalgamation of businesses has ruined our local economies. You can't go to a local hardware store any more, very few local clothing stores, downtowns are decimated by Walmart and Home Depot, citizens don't have the money or the interest any more in buying creatively chosen products, everything comes from China. I would never again be able to invest my money in a local business the way I did 40 years ago. Also, the banks don't want to take the risk lend to small businesses.
34
Well said Mr. Friedman. I am a life long Democrat who has voted for Democrats for President since 1972. I’ve also worked hard all my life as a professional and have invested money in stocks and bonds. Does that make me greedy or corrupt? Being successful in business or in a profession doesn’t make you a bad person. Mr Sanders sees Wall Street as bad and Main Street as good. What an oversimplification! There are good and bad folks in both sectors. Indeed, the sectors are dependent on each other. Please Mr Sanders, don’t demonize me just because I’ve been successful and have invested money in stocks and bonds. Also, please don’t demonize corporate America. As Mr Friedman points out, corporations and entrepreneurs risk capital and provide jobs for millions of Americans. Dividends and interest provide income to people, including the elderly. Corporations employ many hard-working people. Mr Sanders’ rhetoric only plays into the hands of the Trumpers who will use every opportunity to portray him as an in-American socialist.
25
Two things that the author seems to have missed their names: First, the State, the job-creating entity that is the god of the socialists. Second, what makes Nordic countries like Denmark stand out and above others as model societies is the majority of citizens who agree to place the People above all else, or at least the material. And the preference for people is true, unlike the so-called socialist (because no communist country has ever called itself by that name) propaganda that includes universal brotherhood and class struggle on the way to collective ownership and comprehensive rule of the proletariat (all false).
5
Bernie is a Capitalist! He did not hesitate to put his wife on the Texas Low Level Radioactive Waste board when VT decided to ship it's LLRW to East Texas. And she didn't do it for free. And it's not an area where she has any expertise. She didn't work for a 100 student college in VT for free, either. Her $160,000 a year salary was about equal to $1,600 per student. All day students. Until the $10,000,000 loan Mrs Sanders arranged lead to the tiny school's demise. So much for debt-free education.
The head of UMichigan leads a veritable city of 44,000 plus students, with a complex of research and residential facilities, for a bit more than $21 bucks a student.
Bernie is no Elizabeth Warren, with the ability to parse complex financial transactions and protect vulnerable stakeholders. Joe Biden may not be either, but Warren's CFPB was created while he was Veep, and ACA happened too. Pass the Danish.
19
Whenever Americans tell me how lucky we Danes are to be living in a welfare state that dispenses all those wonderful free services, I point out that far from being freebies they are in actual fact prepaid. If the majority of Americans would be willing to fork over half their paycheck to the government, they would be able to enjoy the same life saving services. The response I inevitably get is a look of absolute horror at the notion that anyone in their right mind is willing to voluntarily part with so much hard earned money. We Danes do indeed complain about our high taxes, but the bottom line is that we would rather do that than risk "American conditions," as we call it. I love my new country, and it has been good to me. But I still miss the safety net that we Danes consider a basic human right.
48
The problem with USA is that there is too much greed and individual rights far outweigh the common good.
I urge everyone to read “The Social Conquest of Earth” by Edward O. Wilson.
USA is out of balance- and with Mr. Trump it is just out of bound.
17
Friedman continues to grovel at the Altar of multinational corporation Free Trade, even after it has hollowed out all Western economies and prepared the ground for right-wing populism to flourish. Yes, its great that all those Asians were lifted from poverty, but let's be clear about the cost and the beneficiaries now.
21
This column reads like a lot of malarkey. The large "American Pie" mentioned toward the end of this article came from our parents and grandparents who helped win WWII. We were the richest and most powerful country in the world after that by a long shot. Trump pines for the 1950s, and he demonstrates why much of that nostalgia is misguided, in light of the Central Park 5 affair.
Millions of mostly white Americans reaped the benefits of the WWII victory. Friedman like myself was born in the 1950s. OK boomers here's the missed point- the same year, 1955, that two other white kids like us were born, named Steve Jobs and Bill Gates, Emmett Till was executed by the same American public reaping the benefits of WWII. Job's story is a bit more interesting being half Syrian and given up for adoption by his young parents, he was an adopted kid given to two new white parents, and grew up in Silicon Valley at just the right time to do so. Wealthy Boomers, don't discount your serendipity, you were not all hard working entrepreneurs and risk takers, you were born at the right place and time.
Wealth like Biden's Friedman's, Jobs' and Gates' protects white American from the crushing inhumanity they were responsible for in the USA and continue to sweep under the carpet now using Joe Biden as their savior to perpetuate this status quo.
Friedman is a member of the donor class, he knows Bernie will tax him more than he is now, so the wordsmith whipped up this feel-good little tome.
23
To those like Mr. Friedman who choose to demonize Bernie Sanders, it looks like you are going to get your wish for a Biden nomination. We will see how that works out. I am not optimistic. Hopefully, it will work out better than Mr. Friedman's expert advice to us all on the Iraq War.
21
Mr. Friedman distorts Bernie's position on corporate greed and corruption and portrays him as anti entrepreneur. This is not true and far from an intelligent and fair portrayal of Bernie's brand of Democratic Socialism. He should read the piece that Bernie prepared several months ago to explain in simple, clear terms how he defines DS. Friedman's comparisons of Bernie's policy reform platform and the Danish economy are wrong and lack nuance. This piece is yet another example of the NYT's relentless efforts to undermine Bernie's valiant quest for economic justice for the majority of Americans.
22
I always said Bernie was not a good messenger for two reasons.
1) Bernie is always vilifying all billionaires. He can't be attacking all billionaires all the time.
Does this mean there are no billionaires who are good, honorable and want to contribute back to society??
So a billionaire can't make a contribution to a campaign or ever run office?
2) Instead of pushing "socialist" agenda, he should have campaigned on the slogan of "capitalism with a safety net".
Which meant health care for all, a good education etc, etc.
We as a country want and believe in capitalism. If a few people become billionaires that's ok.
12
New jobs might come from risk-takers, but most jobs aren’t new. Nor does “risk taking” cover the full picture.
After all, General Electric created jobs and increased its profits by dumping toxic waste from its factories into the Hudson River. The risks were conveniently imposed on others. The only risk incurred by the owners and managers of GE was the possibility that their massive theft of value would be discovered by the victims, something they managed to deflect for a long time.
20
A truly just social safety net:
Universal health care.
Education.
Child care.
Infrastructure.
Housing initiatives.
Equal rights for women.
What's not to like? Plus, this can all be yours for less than the GDP that currently gets vampired up by the "health" industry.
21
The main question is: if Biden wins the delegate race and the nomination, will Sanders support him and urge he "Bernie Bros" to vote for Biden? Would Bernie, in a fit of pique, give us four more years of Trump?
5
@Cassandra -- Yes. You've been warned, and are now warned again.
Offer real reform, or lose. Period. We can get no reform from Trump.
2
If Sanders demonizes all businessmen, Friedman demonizes none. Some businesses misbehave. Oil companies pooh-poohed the global warming their scientists told them was real, muzzled the scientists, and sought out pseudoscientists who would spread false information. Purdue Pharma hid the addictive dangers of its product. Financiers and bankers sought more profits through more leverage until the financial system almost flatlined.
Denmark's entrepreneurs are well-behaved competitors who look to win by superior performance rather than cheating or cooking the books or fixing the rules to benefit them over everybody else. Our entrepreneurs will be the same as soon as we get their attention -- by beating them repeatedly and putting some of them out of business.
Wells Fargo cheated its customers and stockholders for years. It should have gone out of business. We had three credit rating agencies, and one of them, Equifax, allowed its data to be stolen. We could survive for a while with two such agencies; Equifax should be out of business, and if we need three such agencies rather than two, the third should be a new company.
Businesses do what they have to do to survive. If rules are not enforced on their competitors, they will join their competition in trashing the rules, because doing so will be profitable. Whether their managers do so joyfully or regretfully is irrelevant.
17
I agree with the majority of Friedman's opinions in this article. However, I do take exception with his statement about the creation of jobs by risk-takers.
I'll never forget what Nick Hanauer, a very wealthy, progressive venture capitalist/entrepreneur I've seen and read in the financial media had to say on this matter- basically that jobs are really created by the demand for goods and services in large part by middle class people. It's a point we shouldn't forget as we reside in a second Gilded Age that over the last 40 years has seen the pendulum swing so far toward capital and away from labor.
13
Friedman decries Sanders’ self-described democratic socialism as centrally planned because of the word socialism, then goes on to praise capitalistic free-markets in Denmark, where taxes, higher than in the US, provide support for socialist programs more extensive than in the US, apparently oblivious to the irony that vaporizes his argument.
14
He leaves out military spending. We spend a huge portion of our pie on the military industrial complex. I have a lot of criticisms of Bernie and supported Warren but he is right on finally bringing this up.
8
Finally, someone gets it! We need balance, and demonizing the entrepreneurs and risk takers only eliminates the opportunity.
9
Mr. Friedman says "America is now out of balance. We all sense it in the gross and widening inequality we see around us." My roots are in Europe and I strongly disagree. 1) America has always been out of balance, since its founding, and by design. 2) "we" don't all sense that the widening inequality is gross. if by we Mr. Friedman intends citizens at large, rather than liberal progressives alone. Too many, too wealthy Americans are quite oblivious of, willfully, and if aware, unconcerned with that situation. Again, that inequality has been nurtured by design, to ensure the power, superiority and privilege earned, or rather bought, of the de facto ruling class.
I should clarify that I consider myself a social democrat in the spirit of the Nordic countries, particularly Sweden, which I know fairly well.
12
"Risk Takers"? Why should a society, a world, capable of producing an abundance for all be subjected to "risk takers". Kindergarten Kapitalism? This is the kind of baloney we have been subjected to since infancy: the religion of capitalism. Down with this system of insured poverty, misery, crime, wars and perennial uncertainty. Establish true democracy in industry - "ownership"of the world's productive facilities by all.
9
Once again Friedman seeks to denigrate and pillory Sanders but employs the same tactics of hyperbole, extremism and absolutism he accuses Sanders of. Sanders does not advocate removing the US from being a market economy, but simply looks to employ the same tools found in other countries that would bring to the most prosperous country in the world some degree of balance that would not see millions of children attend grade school hungry and denied lunch or being imprisoned for lacking the means to obtain and pay for their healthcare.
14
I disagree with the author. To suggest that Biden's views are anything remotely close to the social democratic model that built the modern social safety net in Scandinavian countries is patently absurd. The Democrats have just given Donald Trump another four years in the White House.
10
Wrong. Friedman didn't read yesterdays editorial piece about the deep history of socialism in the US. He simply thinks it's all communism. No nuance, no historical perspective. Friedman is afraid and apparently not that well educated about his own country. How else could he say things so utterly out of touch. Has he even heard of Eugene Debs? The entire nation needs education on these issues but what we get primarily is fear mongering based on experiences which were horrible and even fatal for millions, all the while neglecting to mention that authoritarian dictatorship in any form, socialist or capitalist, is the actual problem. Like throwing the baby out with the bath water. We had a social democratic movement here. It thrived and culminated in FDR. Was that so bad? I urge everyone to educate themselves about the social democratic movement. It is American history, nothing to be afraid of. Friedman could clearly use a refresher course. Of course, it only makes sense that mouthpieces for the Neoliberal rich democrats would want to keep all this quiet. People might realize just how unjust late stage capitalism has become, oh yeah right. Trump.
13
Yes the guy who has wanted to cut social security every time a bill comes up, is more Scandinavian than the guy who wants to give healthcare to everyone and tried to stop Obama from cutting it. You guys are good at convincing yourselves of these inane things but not so much anyone with an inkling of intelligence.
10
For goodness' sake Tom. Your status quo candidate who's being paid through campaign donations to NOT have things change is going to most probably win, unless he has one too many senior moments in the next debate. This kind of ridiculous, false-assumption-ridden column now trying to tell us that the corporate-funded pol who took the little guy backward, or fought to, on welfare reform, bankruptcy law, crime and punishment and integration, to name a few, reflects poorly on you. Command economy? Anti-entrepreneurial? Sanders isn't cherry-picking his facts. But even if he were, it beats making them up. We have a corrupt political system that buys the legislation it wants. That's what the establishment is. A corrupt, but legal, system of pay to play. Biden's a part of it and, by supporting the politicians you do who want to perpetuate it for their own personal careers and gain, so are you. You've chosen a side. It isn't the side of the little guy.
10
In addition to your solid comments, we would like to add a question that we have asked many times during the last 60 years: Why the so called socialists (of 21st century?) always present the very same thinking, in spite of the clear failure of the economies under the same kind of psycho rigid leaders? Bernie Sanders, because he still thinks that the word "revolution" has not been tarnished by so many dictators, so many times. By using it he is remembering to many Americans, and their families, the horrors that happened during the Cold War. Cuban missile crisis, Vietnam War, Berlin Blockade, Berlin Wall, Imre Nagy anyone?
2
@M Martinez - Or the horrors of Denmark, perhaps? What about the horrors of a country where sick people are afraid to get tested for COVID-19 because they can’t afford the $3,000 bill? You choose your selective examples and I’ll choose mine.
10
Where do jobs come from?
Someone who makes something Better, Faster or Cheaper.
Not someone who graduates from school with a debt or has a medical burden they will be paying off well into retirement, working min wage or in the bowels of a giant non union multinational.
I used to laugh at Sanders because all I heard was “Free This and Free That” or he’s a Communist and wants the US to be like Venezuela. Well, the more I read ridiculous poorly researched arguments like this the more I wonder if Bernie has got it right.
11
Thank you for this opinion piece. I've long tried to describe the nordic countries as not being socialist. Norway may come closest as the government owns the production of oil off the coast, but even there, capitalism is their economic model overall.
Many won't like hearing this, but Bernie is really verging on communism, by definition. The thing I most dislike about this man is his hypocrisy and his desire to sow divide between what he claims are the haves and have nots. He actually believes that we should not be independent, but instead depend entirely on the government. Those that don't have to are seen as evil to the core. Bernie is only wealthy because of his time in government; that should tell us all something about this hypocrite.
3
Very well said. Thank you.
The division of our society into "us" and "them", which is a tactic as old as time and which has been flaunted by Trump and his thugs on an ethnic basis, is just as pernicious when used by someone who has no idea how to support and sustain prosperity.
We are not flailing about because we need income to be redistributed. We are flailing about because the structures put into place by government have limited the ability of people to benefit from their own productivity and the resources that are so widespread. These limitations include poor distribution of access to education, inadequate and weakened protections for workers and society's weakest members, insufficient interest in maintaining the real wellbeing of the populace.
We are also flailing about because one of our major political parties has hypocritically denounced science, human decency and receptivity to new people and ideas. They have, instead, capitulated to the forces of ignorance, religious zealotry and bigotry.
Bernie is no less ignorant and bigoted than Trump. It's just his targets that are different. He represents an authoritarian of a similar intolerant temperament and a similarly closed mind.
3
I don’t usually agree with Mr. Friedman on most thing but on this I do agree.
1
Spot on. Bernie's problem is his huge ego and rigidity. He is so cock sure that he doesn't review new information that may differ from his. His way is what he decided back in his hippie formative years. He is a loner and has no use for expanding his knowledge or base. Look to his supporters: other aging hippies who also don't get where other people's money comes from, fellow disgruntled poor folks, misfits, and kids who don't know anything about anything yet but love the new and shiny or whatever is contra to their parents. Case in point: they gleefully attend the rock concerts, post selfies, and then sleep it off on election day.
3
Democratic Capitalism is probably the better name. Capitalism is a good method of generating wealth - the US is good at this. The issue is distributing the wealth and the US is bad at this. The majority of us are screwed, many do not know it, the system has an interest in keeping it this way. Sanders offers a way to shake the system up to benefit the common man/woman. Biden will not do this. Either is infinitely better than the current potus. The really change US politics we will have to elect women.
3
I am an American writing from Denmark. As a side note, I thought I ducked out of New Rochelle just in time to avoid the coronavirus only to learn that the small Danish town I am in just announced its first case. Go figure?
I have been traveling to Denmark for nearly 30 years since meeting my wife in the US. And in that time things have changed greatly. The Danes buy more “stuff” now and the “stuff” costs a lot less today with the exception of cars. Denmark charges close to a 200% tax on cars but augments the lower proliferation of vehicles with a robust public transportation system. They also bicycle everywhere beginning at an early age.
Danes are taxed heavily but don’t bitch about it. They recycle everything. And when it comes to “green” they are as serious as a heat attack. Oh and speaking of health related issues, everyone has access to head-to-toe care. Many who can afford supplemental insurance have it. If you need non-critical surgery you may have wait a little. If you have private insurance you eliminate the wait.
Post high school education is free but not for those who don’t want to study. And there is no such thing as a starving student as college includes a living stipend.
Old people are generally well cared for and live with dignity. And that’s covered too.
Politicians don’t scream and yell at each other and everyone loves the Queen.
The magic of Denmark has and still is the breadth & size of its middle class. Danes live in the middle and so does Joe.
11
This was the best commentary on Sanders I've seen to date. Sander's problem is not the goals of his progressive platform, but his divisive approach and his disdain for capitalism which is the hallmark of this nation.
Has he ever given a thought about REALLOCATION OF THE FEDERAL BUDGET, with prioritization given to the most important agendas and scrapping or cutting back or re-evaluating the thousands of less essential programs the government pays for?
Has he ever given any consideration to the fact that many who have retirement IRAs and 401K plans have their money in financial investments--and that this is GOOD for business and consumers?
He had the audacity to have Bill DiBlasio endorse him, when DiBlasio is a prime example of progressive going bad. He is the WORST mayor in the history of this city. He pledged to help "his people," and has been a dismal failure especially in housing, homelessness, and education.
The problem is not the goals but very much the APPROACH. Businesses are not the enemy of the people, they ARE the people.
Time for Bernie to retire once and for all.
5
Dear Mr. Friedman,
I don't know what you mean by "jobs" (is raising a child a "job"?), but if you mean work for payment in national currency, then the primary employer is always and only the Federal Government.
Sorry to break it to you, but the first employer to pay employees in national currency is by definition the Federal Government.
For all other "job creators", employment is a cost to be minimized.
The "job creators" you're so proud of only hire people if they know they can make more money from them than they cost.
More importantly, businesses only hire when there are enough customers who want to buy things.
And customers only buy things when they have enough national currency from the Federal Government.
So once again, if you want to know "where jobs come from". The only correct answer is the Federal Government.
8
This is an excellent column. It does make me wonder how many Danish titans of industry and their multinationals have moved to tax havens? Does the social compact there lead the very wealthy to understand that greed is shameful? And the essence of unpatriotic? I like to think so. In the US too many follow our 'I don't pay taxes because I'm smart' leader in not understanding the words 'give back.'
2
5.8 million fairly homogeneous Danes to 327 million diverse Americans, a county the size of Delaware to a nation that spans the middle (and more) of a continent, these are two physically and compositionally different countries. However, that doesn't mean we can't look at areas of the Danish model and see where best we could employ programs similar to but modified for us. I have no problem utilizing ideas and programs that are shown to work elsewhere, here. Are we as a nation ready to employ such forward thinking processes to achieve goals that a large majority of people support? That will take a broad coalition of people to come together across political, ethnic and income divides. The me first attitude that is pervasive will have to be tempered. Much of the juvenile behaviors on display in our leadership and ourselves will have to left behind. In short, we need to grow up as a country.
3
One must admit that the taxes for the average Dane are breathtaking. For those financially independent, young (healthy), childless and not desirous of a college education I think I'd want a lot better take home pay. Yikes!
Thirty years ago I was consulting in Germany and had a similar conversation with a German doctor about our economy and tax structure compared to theirs. She acknowledged her country's high taxes and her government controlled income. But she also pointed out what she gained economically, socially and psychologically from their system. I was impressed not just with their social safety net, but with how insecure people are in our system dedicated to individual wealth, not the wealth of the whole country.
11
Friedman demonizes Bernie by confusing the complexities of all the many forms of 'socialism' with the boomer stereotype of authoritarian 'communism'.
Biden should unite with Bernie on one ticket and unify the Democratic party. Their differences are not so great; they like and respect each other. Their combination will be a powerful team against Trump. Honor. Dignity. Union.
3
The model of Denmark is existential: everyone in a small country surrounded by potential invaders (see last 2000 years, also known as history) must bond together in health and feel it that bond through painful taxes and accept that pain. Don’t forget: history shapes the evolutionary economic model is shaped more by a pragmatic history of security and defense of ones own people more then a bunch of economic professors in a conference or online forum. We argue about ideas, but we live history.
1
@Not Pierre
historically, the Danes usually were the invaders. The Vikings were economic entrepreneurs. Danes have always punched above their geographical weight in the annals of European history.
3
These risk-takers who start companies and create jobs are reluctant to do so today because they know they will lose their health insurance if they quit their current jobs. And if they do "max out their credit cards" and their businesses fail, as many inevitably do, they will be unable to get debt relief because of a bill Vice President Biden sponsored. Even if their businesses succeed, they will be more reluctant to hire full-time workers because healthcare costs are prohibitively expensive.
Senator Sanders' agenda, by strengthening safety net provisions, encourages individuals to take more risks and start more businesses, in turn creating a more innovative economy.
7
I respectfully disagree with Friedman on his opening assertion that entrepreneurs create jobs. I have worked for many startups. The last thing an entrepreneur wants to do is hire. He or she is strongly advised against adding headcount by investors. Personnel are the greatest expense in most small to mid-sized businesses. Only when there is absolutely no choice, when the enterprise is unable to meet demand, does hiring begin. Jobs come from demand, not from "job-creators." The biggest sector of the U.S. economy is consumer goods and services. Disposable income among average Americans is the most powerful engine of job creation. Where does disposable income come from? It comes from a lower proportion of income dedicated to healthcare, childcare, housing, transportation, and education. Want to create jobs? Stop stimulating the stock market and take these crushing financial burdens off average Americans. That is what Sanders stands for. Biden's good intentions will be diluted into oblivion by the dirty politics of the post-Gingrich Republicans.
10
Friedman writes "Denmark has managed to become wealthy enough to afford the social safety net that Sanders rightly admires — as do I: access for all to child care, medical and parental leave from work, tuition-free college, a living stipend, universal health care and generous pensions." The fact is America has failed to provide any of these services. The reason is: our system is broken as Sanders diagnosed, and it works for the rich and powerful. Here are some key statistics: In Denmark the top 1% owns 11% of wealth while in the USA the top 1% owns 39%. Similarly, in Denmark, the top 10% owns 24% of wealth while in the USA the top 10% owns 77%. Friedman should have exposed the root cause of income and wealth inequality in the USA instead of lashing out at Sander's social democracy.
6
Someone commented that Biden is running a campaign of nostalgia. So is Bernie. Nostalgia for a time when Congress worked together and big things not only passed, but were enacted and funded well. It will take years, if not decades, to return the US to any semblance of that type of governance---if we ever get there again. No matter who wins, if a health care bill passes, it will be chock full of compromise, will most likely be toothless in regards to corporate insurers, and will likely be far from universal coverage. Biden is pushing reality, Bernie is pushing the dreamscape.
3
As Mr. Friedman notes, Denmark provides “ access for all to child care, medical and parental leave from work, tuition-free college, a living stipend, universal health care and generous pensions.”
All for a top tax rate of about 58%. What a bargain! I would gladly pay that tax in order to receive such bountiful services.
Most US families can’t afford even one or two of these social benefits even when much lower tax rates are supposed to provide them with enough discretionary capital to comfortably do so.
9
Friedman seems more and more hysterical every day as he trades in trite stereotypes (his M.O.) while promoting corporate capitalism. He writes that Bernie "...seems to believe that the American economic pie just miraculously appeared and exists on its own."
No he doesn't.
Bernie understands that the foundation of America's wealth was genocide, slavery, and unprecedented resource extraction; that most rich people inherited wealth, and that wealth is maintained through resource exploitation, failure to pay for externalities, and exploitation of labor to maintain wealth inequality and thereby maintain the control by a white male minority, - oh, and to create the false belief that there is no other viable alternative.
Denmark has a similar model of capitalism, except MUCH smaller, culturally homogeneous and without resources to extract. And except that the social contract there, with housing and health care as rights, sets the poverty level much higher than we do. The Danish model is great - as long as you're a traditional Dane, but not so much if you're an immigrant and especially a person of color.
5
This is one of the most absurd slights of hand pulled by Repubs and conservative Democrats: claim that the Nordic model is "actually capitalist." Well, call it what you want, but Bernie's socialism is what they would call "social democracy," which is exactly what Bernie is advocating. Call it mashed potatoes if you want.
Tom obsesses over "markets," yet nothing in Bernie's plan would jeopardize markets. They would simply function more equitably with greater union power, partial employee ownership of large companies, and single payer healthcare. No, Bernie would not fail to get elected there, he'd fit right in.
Please note that the word "socialist" itself is contested terrain. Bernie, socialist or not, has never advocated taking over "the means of production" as this article suggests. Again, look at the policies. Us socialists are more interested in normalizing radical ideas than we are in defining what a perfect socialized economy would look like. You can thank those evil socialists for normalizing the 8hr work day, workers' comp, and unions.
No, Biden is not a Nordic; that's like calling Trump the "actual liberal" in the 2016 election. Biden is a hardline conservative; it's just that the Repubs are so far off the charts that Biden looks comparatively liberal. He's been on the wrong side of every issue and he helped drag the Democrats to the right in the 80s.
Most importantly, Biden will get crushed by Trump if he's the nominee, so it won't matter.
4
An excellent column by Thomas Friedman. Personally, I believe that Switzerland might be a better model for the US. It delivers with reasonable taxation a good level of social security, health care for all, an excellent education system with world-class universities, and a first-class infrastructure. Importantly, the Swiss bored heavily in 1848 from the US, when we drafted our constitution after a civil war that led to the creation of the Swiss Federal State. This laid the foundation for the prosperity of Switzerland.
2
Just wondered where Denmark is in the realm of income inequality. If the gap isn’t that wide, how do they pull that off? Taxation for social programs? Can an argument be made that a thriving market economy like Denmark’s relies and thus kind if support? Economists and others please answer.
@Debra Mowat The GINI coefficient -a measure of inequality - is 0,26 in Denmark and 0,39 in the US. That is the disposable household income according to the OECD.
There are three reasons for that. Strong unions, social democratic governments and an efficient economy, where all has a stake.
Strong unions and high salaries presses the employers to raise productivity. The median salary in Denmark is around 30 USD pr hour and the minimum salary around 17 USD. We also have a 37 hour working week, 6 weeks of vacation and a year parental leave. If you have to pay that kind of money it demands high productivity pr hour. If you only pay 10 USD it don't really matter, and you don't need to invest.
A strong labour movement has secured free health care, free education, affordable housing and child care, social benefits, unemployment support and reasonable pensions and affordable nursery homes.
Because employers and employees don't see each other as enemies but accept their different interesses, they cooperate in baking a larger cake, because everyone gets an extra slice.
Since 1973 the real hourly salary for workers in US industry has not increased at all, but in Denmark it has increased 70% in the same period.
We still have a lot of agriculture and manufacturing in this country, but it is mostly high end products. We haven't outsourced it all.
That is the result of 120 years of fighting and discussing, and now we have a flexible ever developing compromise.
6
T.L.F writes: "To listen to him (and his surrogates) is to listen to someone who seems to believe that the American economic pie just miraculously appeared and exists on its own.
This is the closest I seen T.L.F. come to a blatant untruth. Bernie has said many times that wealth is created by workers. He has also noted that entrepreneurs often create wealth through lobbied-for tax breaks that workers pay for through higher taxes.
Then there's the claim "Denmark is not socialist it's democratic." This is an error, a category mistake, one would expect (and I got many times) from a college freshman.
Socialism is a system of economics. It's about how to produce and distribute goods.
Democracy is a system of politics. It's about how rulers get the right to rule and for whom.
Not only are democracy and socialism consistent, the only way that socialism could work well is in the context of a democratic politics.
5
Well done for a person from St. Louis Park, Minnesota. The manner in which you articulate is quite parallel to that by Robert Wright in Non Zero: The Logic of Human Destiny.
I recall a President Clinton urged/required his administration to engage with the ideas. In the main, the book centers on game theory, which transcends the paradigm of zero sum.
Again, well done sir.
1
Friedman, you tout the free market capitalism of Denmark yet ignore that in the U.S.A. we have the means but not the will to provide the social safety net. As a society we would rather let many sink while fewer and fewer get to swim. Sanders is right that as a group the very wealthy not only enjoy their wealth but also hold passive surplus which is not reinvested to the benefit of society as a whole. As a society, we have let the wealthy hog the pie, and it is time to reset our priorities to ensure a basic standard of living for all. Sanders is right that despite notable exceptions to the contrary, the wealthy do not have the best interests of this country at heart. The systemic inequities do not encourage it, and Sanders is right that it is time to change how the pie is distributed, or before long there won't be any way to bake much pie. It is not so much a matter of demonizing a class of people as it is a critique of our social reality.
7
Let me ask, when was the last time a President was elected that delivered on his promises? I am not sure why people think that you can elect one person and the multitude of issues that can not be resolved because 2 political parties wont pass each others corrupt bills. Each party has things that they tack on to each bill that only benefit specific people and will not pass unless there is a promise of reciprocation of other corrupt earmarks tacked on their bills. That is what the real debating on legislation is about. Everyone agrees that the basic legislation needs to be passed but won't because of earmarks. Eliminating these earmarks will help accomplish the work of the people.
1
I am surprised by how many readers see Biden's desire to "return to civility" as policy driven versus an undoing of Trumpism in the executive branch. I am also surprised by readers misunderstanding of Biden's policy agenda. As a moderate, I'd be compromising to vote for Biden with this agenda. I voted for Obama in 2008 despite a policy agenda too far to the left and here is Biden even further to the left than Obama! Sanders has had his effect on the platform and that needs to be enough. The country obviously does not want Sanders. None of the Trump voters want him and fewer than half of the Democrats want him.
3
As a risk taking small business entrepreneur from Scandinavia I can guarantee you that Biden is no champion of what is Scandinavian social democracy. A social democracy I love and that have enabled me to own my own (very small) business.
It is definitely true that Scandinavia countries are pretty free market havens, but what makes this work is the highly progressive fairly height taxes, combined with very effective minimum wages.
Sanders policies are clearly those most in line with our society, and Biden would be way to the right of our most right wing politicians economically speaking.
10
@Sigmund Aas Where Sanders and Biden would stand on the scale of Scandinavian politics is interesting to know, but totally irrelevant to our elections.
1
@Carl I agree, but it is Friedman that is deciding to make this an issue. I am just telling you that he is wrong. Biden is not the Dane, Sanders is.
Does that matter to the American election? Probably not.
4
Ah the Danes are right! What both you and Senator Sanders miss is not subtle, but it is very important. Entrepreneurship and and a market economy work well in matters of production, but poorly in the creation and preservation of "public goods," that is education, police, fire protection, highways, clean water, health care, etc. Also the free market and its competitive imperative naturally produces losers and it is a societal role to balance this with some redistribution of benefits as a public good. That is a health society, a goal in which we fall far short.
7
How much does Denmark spend on national security. I would venture to guess not $750B per year. In fact it’s less than 2% of GDP as we know from Trump’s anti NATO rants. Obviously their corporations pay taxes. Their citizens pay taxes at a much higher rate than we do. Until we start making some basic economic decisions, we could never have an economy like any Scandinavian country. A basic economic choice is do you spend on guns or butter? We repeatedly choose guns and tax cuts.
7
Well said. I wish you were running. So few politicians actually understand economics and our economy. The fact is we need to reduce the level of wealth inequality in this country, we need to have a culture which is not always revolving around profit rather than people and we need to start accepting and working with our differences rather than condemning them. I hope we can get there.
1
Thank you for this column Mr. Friedman. I've had long conversations about this very topic with my college-age nephews, who see "socialism" as the cure for today's "capitalism."
The problem is they don't understand that Trump's policies aren't true capitalism. He doesn't support the free market and he doesn't support entrepreneurship. What he has created is a crony-capitalist kleptocracy, a criminal-government enterprise that picks winners/losers based on fealty to the great leader and willingness to support the criminal scam.
This may not be capitalism, but socialism isn't the cure for Trumpism, either. While it may not be as obvious a criminal enterprise as the Trump administration, or as insidious, socialism too places too much power into the hands of functionaries and bureaucracies that are not the most adept at making the best decisions for public welfare.
Only a truly free market philosophy that encourages the best to innovate, and provides the rules of the road to share, elevate, and support the entirety of society, can do that.
What we need with a Biden presidency isn't a "return to normal." As Mayor Pete insisted, there are going to be too many ruins to pick up after Trump is gone, Coronovirus being just one of them.
What we will need is excellence unleashed, a return to science and respect for the best in character over perfidy and wretchedness throughout every institution. I hope Biden is up to that monumental task, but he's the best hope we've got.
4
@Marty I agree mostly and respectfully disagree on the notion that only a truly free market philosophy is able to deliver common good. The notion of market failure is very real. Truly free market may give rise to monopolies, which inevitably extract benefits at the cost of society. For example, I recently read a study that showed that the salaries enjoyed by the financial sector are about double relative to their contribution to Total Factor Productivity when compared to other sectors. In other words, the financial sector is extractive: it extracts greater benefit to its members than it contributes in terms of economic productivity. The salaries in the financial sector should be about half their current level to be in line with what they actually contribute. I know a lot of people in the US hate this, but you do need smart regulation to correct the distortions an unfettered free market occasionally (not always!) can create.
2
Oh good lord, it's an entire article written to say "Not All Capitalism." This article is taking down a straw man image of Sanders the writer heard described through a game of telephone begun by a Trumpist colleague. The place he ends, having a vibrant economic taxed enough to pay for a just safety net, is Exactly what Sanders is arguing for. But modern America has already proven Very Adept at making profit. It is the single thing at which we excel. So Sanders spends his time talking about the ways that hurts us, those that take the pursuit of profit too far and behave badly, and what we can do to curb that bad behavior in the future. Do we need Every Single Politician to pay lip service sucking up to corporate America, telling it what a wonderful special pretty pony it is? Or can we honestly address the fact that there are some Very Bad Actors here? Those that, even by Ayn Rand's standards, act more like her Villains, with their "Washington Men" than her heroes?
Our house is on fire, and this writer argues we should be going around to all the other houses and thanking them for housing us before we actually put it out. Meanwhile here comes Sanders with a hose.
8
@Grandtheatrix I found it interesting how all these posts suddenly showed up after I made my post in order to bury it down the comment chain.
The think tanks are out there doing the same bidding that Friedman is doing (a man that makes over $1m/yr).
1
Having lived and worked in the Nordics I want to say Friedman is correct. This is way I’ve been for Biden since he announced.
1
"which provides a high level of security for its citizens, but it is also a successful market economy with much freedom to pursue your dreams and live your life as you wish.”
Imagine THAT! SOunds like what the US was meant to be.
3
Biden may be the best way to defeat Trump. Bringing up Denmark, and making the case for Joe and the better person to run a Denmark like country seems an odd way to go after Sanders. This may turn off conservative and independent voters. Did you mean to do that? Folks here would be happy to be rid of Trump and have some kind of Obama like "normalcy", and that simple message is likely the most compelling in the moronic leadership of Trump in the midst of a biological threat. Bernie is the guy bringing in Denmark. I hope you don't expect Joe to say, vote for me, I will make America more like Denmark than Bernie will! I love you Tom Friedman, but this seems a little off.
1
Sorry I missed the time when Bernie Sanders vilified all entrepreneurs. That's likely because he's done no such thing. The people he has vilified are billionaires, and I happen to agree with his attack. There is no conceivable universe where someone can make a billion dollars and keep it, without trampling over citizens in some form or another (be it through tax evasion, or exploitative labour practices). I dare you to name a billionaire who didn't inherit their wealth, who is squeaky clean ...
7
In the U.S.A., we can never achieve anything remotely approaching the Sanders vision with the inequitable tax policy that is presently in place.
Sanders' attempts to carry out the agenda he describes would fail outright on virtually (perhaps literally) every front under our structure of taxation.
Equitable Tax Policy, First and Foremost.
Tax policy change will go nowhere until we rid government of trickle-down charlatans and believers.
And good luck with that.
6
A superficial, often nonsensical representation of Sanders’ position, and of the deep issues of our society.
9
The only two people that have been lifted out of poor incomes by Bernie Sanders policies are Bernie and Jane Sanders and they have done that by suckling on the taxpayer provided income and benefits provided to elected officials.
He has no concept of how jobs are created and risk taking and thinks that government ( with him being charge) is the answer yet history around the world has proven this be incorrect as well.
He is a devout socialist and only uses the word “ democratic” in front of socialist to mask his true intentions.
1
As a individual from scanda-hoovian country(minnesota) one has to ask, did sanders mean, Norway or Sweden? Believe you me! There is a big difference around these parts.
If Twitter, Facebook and comment board posts were actual votes, Sanders would be winning in a landslide.
As the Sanders supporters painfully found out yesterday, it's one thing to dominate Twitter and the NYT comments page and another thing altogether to translate this social media dominance into actual votes.
2
Friedman is also cherry picking Denmark.
I have also been there several times and maybe met a greater variety of ordinary people as well as some people in government.
Ask a sample of US ordinary citizens if they are satisfied with their health plans.. not well to do people like Friedman but people with huge deductibles, a 60 year old with severe rheumatoid arthritis who cannot afford her meds unless she gets admitted as an in patient. Talk to people in Denmark going to University vs. those having to pay indecent loans to do the same thing in the US.
This is an article Friedman has written before. I am a retired Pediatrician and question people when I travel. In Denmark people are happy with their health care system and are not in huge debt from University education. Friedman is not credible on these issues.
6
If I had a nice side job of speeches for 100,000 dollar a pop I too would be concerned about the redistribution side of things.
OK Tom. Let me know if Biden is aboard with 42% capital gains taxes, effective 23% corporate tax rates such as Lego pays in Denmark, universal healthcare and education, and other hallmarks of Danish life. Is Biden committed to driving down the wealth gap? Because Denmark is 3rd best in the world in this respect. So have another think, come back with an updated column.
9
Some solid reasoning from the “earth is flat” advocate, and the voice of billionaires. They will create the the position of the czar of insourcing and outsourcing in the Biden administration just for Tom. His buddy MBS can be charge of venture capitalism.
2
Mr. Friedman, “This covfefe by the lying dog-faced pony soldiers must stop! If you don’t like it, vote for the other Biden. We have truth on your side, not facts”, but here is my truth and my fact: the Scandinavian Biden has no credibility, much less electability. He is the laughing stock of the whole Europe. The Scandinavian Sanders is a Center Right politician around here, but he is the one who gets the facts and speaks the truth.
5
@nr Respectfully, who in Europe is laughing at Biden? I know a lot of people who used to laugh at Trump until they grew too weary of him. As a European, I know a lot of people who have zero respect for Trump but none who would not respect Biden, whatever his flaws might be. Perhaps this may be just the bubble I inhabit, but nevertheless...
If the world economy took that socialist Jesus’ words in Matthew 25 — or their equivalent in whatever faith or benevolent non-religious worldview—to heart, we’d all be better off.
2
Vote Biden! A Republican you can trust!
“We have to give tremendous credit to Donald Trump,” Mr. McAuliffe said. “He has been the single biggest driver to the Democratic Party of Virginia. There are a lot of like-minded Republicans who said, ‘I can’t vote for Trump but you got to give me somebody who we can vote for.’ Biden was always at the top of that list.”
NYT 4, 2020
2
edit
NYT March 4, 2020
They don’t care if we die. Clinton, Biden, Warren, who proved she doesn’t care by not endorsing any policies when it would have counted, twice, and any of those who have endorsed the most senile candidate who will continue to allow the American Oligarchs an iron grip on our lives. How many of us will continue to die unnecessarily because we don’t have universal healthcare, as a I’ve received in Japan and France? And let’s face it, if we are beyond the tipping point, we are all dead from climate change, by what? One more generation? They have proved with their actions and words, the do not care if we die. What does it matter if we vote at all? They don’t even care if we die.
3
Tom Friedman should be one of the moderators of the next debate. I would love to hear Bernie's answers to Tom's questions. Bernie's ideas just haven't been adequately challenged in the debates so far.
1
Friedman has "a few questions that I’d love to ask Sanders about his democratic socialism." Well why doesn't he, instead of assuming what answers he would get?
5
Jeez, where too being...I'm a Canadian and Bernies did come here to look at our healthcare system, as a matter of fact so did Hillary way back. It's not complicated, universal health care for all is the cheaper way to go that's been proven. I think Mr. Friedman is twisting some words, Bernie is a democratic socialist and does not believe in socializing oil or whatever, He still believes in the market system. The media has been part of this to scare the American people that he might be a communist! Too funny. The real issue here is greed, it is a national shame that you don't have universal health care for all. Joe Bide, will not do it, it'll be a miss mash> Mr. Friedman is part of the elite.
6
Wow, color me surprised, another Friedman column that blindly hues to neoliberal talking points that have allowed immiseration to flourish in nearly every sector of society barring those with extreme wealth.
5
And of course you understand the reason you'll never get to ask those questions of Senator Sanders is that all of your commentaries reveal that you've made your decision; it doesn't matter how Sanders answers, you've already listened to your personal biases. And you surely also understand this means you are not a journalist, you are a polemicist in the Fox News mold.
4
I read these comments by NY Times columnists. I wonder if any of them has ever had to worry about having enough money at the end of the month. Week. Day. I wonder if they ever stressed about medical bills, child care, education for the kids. Paying back education loans.
Somehow, I do not think such events are within their life experiences. They cannot relate.
6
I note that all the actual Danes or Americans who have lived in Denmark seem to be telling Friedman that he doesn't know what he's talking about.
7
Then, Tom old man, what do you make of Biden telling a roomful of billionaires, “nothing will fundamentally change” ? What construction do you put on that? I seriously want to know!
8
Mr. Friedman was this some kind of cruel political joke? it doesn't even warrant analysis no matter which candidate one supports.
5
Sorry, Mr. Friedman, but you are not someone I'd turn to for expert knowledge of who is "the true Scandinavian." You have far too much vested interest in trying to stop Sanders and boost Biden, any way you can. Move along now.
7
Methinks Thomas L Friedman totally misunderstands Bernie Sanders.
7
My friends wife came from Denmark. If you ask her she will tell you of the excellent education she received growing up but then she and her two brothers all left Denmark for greater opportunities. My own great grandfathers left Switzerland and Germany for greater opportunities. Bernie Sanders pie in the sky ideas resonated mostly with college students and the idealists. The realists, those of us who know that you cannot remake this country overnight, also know that whenever you enact a social program such as the affordable care act(Obamacare) there are those like the republicans that will turn McCarthy on your butt and rant on Fox News that you are destroying American values. And will take away your guns to boot.
Barak Obama had it about right. And most historians will agree. Look up his ranking among American presidents and you will find that he is in the top twenty. Sensible regulation is the path forward.
2
I'd be interested to know what Denmark does with the idiots, phonies and climbers. They're everywhere and they will eventually bring down any system. Maybe what Denmark has is the increasing side of the curve and they haven't yet reached the point where the dead wood outweighs the new growth. Thanks to that demolition program started in 1939 Europe is, compared to some nations, enjoying a new youth. Don't forget how ossified parts of it were before that.
It's also good to ask how recently the utopia was founded (and who does the janitorial work) before pronouncing that this is the way forward forever and ever amen.
1
@Daedalus
In Denmark, the janitor gets a living wage and his children have the same educational opportunities as the children of his employer.
5
I would love for more balanced opinion pieces. Why does the NYT have so many and frequent negative opinion pieces about Bernie Sanders? This is not balanced journalism. Why is the media so silent about the many shortcomings and limitations of Joe Biden as a candidate? Recently, Biden's brother had his office raided by the FBI for possible healthcare fraud (check on Politico). Biden's son also doesn't look like an honest and stable man, having benefited from his father's political clout to get ahead. Come on, people? Are you all blind to the Biden's liabilities? Do you really think he will cruise to victory against Trump?
7
To be fair, and speaking as an American who has lived in Denmark for 23 years, there are also a lot of Danes who misunderstand what's behind Denmark's safety net. Sanders' attitudes are very common among Danes to the left of Mr. Rasmussen's party. Many have no idea where Denmark's wealth comes from – they just assume it comes from the government.
3
@Tony
Not just Danes, but Europeans do not understand their own governments, laws, and what makes it all work. There is only so much knowledge that can be crammed into a high school student in 12 years. Most Europeans do not even have a high school education, they have 9 years elementary education followed by vocational training. The university students consider themselves the navel of the academic universe, but the university degrees are myopically focused on faculties, a general higher education is not possible, except for the new bachelors programs, but they are only 6 semesters, so even only a circumcised American bachelors. Primary and secondary education in Europe fails to educate in the practical matters of their state. Even simple Democracy many high schoolers there mistake for anarchy.
2
@LHP I have often suspected that this is the case. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
What's really up for debate here is the American dream going forward. Reality is forcing cultural adjustments. To the many liberal arts college graduates with crushing student loans it is becoming obvious after 8 semesters and a bachelors degree that there are no jobs of their level of no-skill set. They finally learned the hard way that a barrista at Starbucks does not earn enough, and the cost of living. The nations will come around to that conclusion soon, too. So more of the same, only free now, paid for by the already stressed tax payer, will not add up mathematically either. Same goes for healthcare for all. You gotta pay the dues, or it's a no-go. Same with housing, the 3000 sqft in 6 acres can not be the American dream, it doesn't add up either.
1
This piece would have a lot more merit if you were able to show that the average Scandinavian agreed with Biden's policies more that Sander's. You seem to be insinuating that Bernie is anti entrepreneur. What he is is anti oligarchy and anti big business in a country where the current system discourages new and innovative entrants to the economy unless they go to the right people for money or be crushed by the existing business climate. If that is indeed the way they do things in Denmark, I want no part of it.
4
Every time I pay my telecommunications bills I cringe. There is little competition, the big four have colluded to fix prices and we pay twice as much as we should. On top of that service is terrible. So what I want Mr. Friedman is some tightening of the rules companies operate under such as inforcing antitrust laws. Our tax system is rigged for the wealthy. The lack of campaign finance laws is creating a highly corrupt election system. In many industries there is too much profit going to the top. Read your own paper to see documentation of this.
I think a little more "socialism" would be good to correct the maldistribution of wealth. And I see a major political party making selfishness a top public policy.
6
Bernie lacks the leadership to get even some of his ideas in place. It's the way it is and we are lucky it is! Imagine Donald Trump with even more power than now? Good ideas are a dime a dozen and lots of them floating around this election. Getting Congress to do the hard work isn't done with a speech and a pen. Bernie belongs back in the Senate as a voice. It's the only thing he is actually good at.
3
Pure capitalism works, but creates inequity.
Socialism is fair, but it doesn't work.
We need both, the model that every modern nation has is a mix of capitalism and a social safety net to protect humanity.
5
It is not those who are willing to take risks who start businesses in America, but those who have contacts or inherited money.
The government subsidizes certain businesses at the expense of the rest of us. That is why it is called crony capitalism. Banks lend to certain favored clients. Nobody starts business by maxing out their 39% master cards--only people who "qualify" for low rates use them to profit.
It is Sen. Sanders who understands Scandinavia and America, not you.
3
I can see, that I am not the only Dane here, who want to nuance mr. Friedman's picture a little bit.
He is right in saying, that Denmark is a capitalist country, but first of all many large companies are either foundation owned (partly, but with the foundation keeping the majority) like Novo, Carlsberg, Velux ect, cooperatively owned f.ex. by the farmers - Arla and Danish Crown, family owned - Maersk and Lego, consumer owned - like SEAS/NVE and other electricity, heating and water providers or partly state owned - like Orsted, the largest sea wind energy producer in the world.
That structure secures long time planning, because it is not about quick profit.
Second the Danish welfare state eases the pressure on the employers, They don't have to pay for health care or education, and it is easy to hire and fire.
Third about trade. Denmark has an export surplus and has had it for many years - mainly as members of the EU. Many calls the EU protectionist and that is actually the whole idea.
We don't want to participate in a race to the bottom, so we protect our own by demanding high quality and environmental standards - also for imports to the EU.
We also want a level playing field, when it comes to protection of workers rights. That is why we have no trade deal with the US. We don't want their undercutting of standards.
Although the US is richer pc. than the EU, most people in the EU lives better and more secure lives with affordable health care and education for all.
11
At the turn of the 20th century, American business convinced workers to forego socialism with the promise that they would implement welfare capitalism (free-market capitalism with a high level of social welfare benefits). WWI was used as an excuse to delay delivering on that promise and then it was ignored.
Bernie is negative on business, and, in my opinion, overly so, but Joe is a welfare corporatist (believes in supporting business interests with grants and tax incentives with the hope that jobs will follow). Neither pursues the idea of freeing business of many regulations and other impediments to allow it to be creative while taxing profits to provide a high level of social welfare benefits. That's what we need: a strong business culture allied with a generous welfare culture.
2
Yes, there are many good people in in corporations, and much of the success of America is do to capitalism, at least the way it worked back in the 40's through the 80's. But corporations also work every day to prevent or destroy unions, maximize profits at the expense of workers, and buy and control government. Comparing RJ Reynolds or Exxon who actually cause massive harm to people to Joe Blow trying to set up a little business on main street is disingenuous. But that is the kind of thing that people in Tom's class do to confuse and mislead the American public.
4
Yes, Sanders may be strident/bombastic, his use of terms like transformative change & revolution more threatening than uplifting and politically unwise. But he has normalized the idea of $15/hr minimum wage when Hillary called it unrealistic, Bloomberg calling raising the minimum wage a mistake
And 1-2 million small donors believed his policy goals were more than lip service and made real his idea that a presidential campaign didn't have to depend on and be beholden to the big money donors and corporate wing of the Democratic party. And to many Sanders and Warren supporters this has been a fundamental/bedrock difference between them and the other candidates that will make it difficult for Biden to gain their support.
A thought experiment: if it was Warren vs. Biden instead of Sanders vs. Biden, where would Friedman be coming down, given that her deep policy commitments/views are not that different from Sanders', but presented in a less bombastic, less strident, more mainstream way.
In short, they have done both the talk and the walk, the others more talk less walk.
5
One of the best columns I have seen in a long time. The question of our interest groups willingness to engage in Danish-like cooperation remains. Can anyone change it without burning our system to the ground and rebuilding it totally? I’m worried by the greed and corruption in our current players.
Taxes are actually lower in Denmark! Look what each citizen gets back for their taxes compared with everything we DO NOT GET in return for all the taxes we pay in America. Add in the cost of education and healthcare alone to your American tax bill and who actually pays more? Never mind the better more modern infrastructure in Denmark.
Indeed, while most Americans live paycheck to paycheck, the American kleptocratic class live tax cut to tax cut paid for by the rest of us.
Socialism American style benefits the ultra-wealthy kleptocratic class. Socialism Danish style benefits EVERYONE - rich and poor alike and THAT is what offends conservatives so much.
Biden is more the status quo candidate - granted, that is astronomically better than the Venezuelan style corruption going on in our trumplican government-for-one.
7
@PAN Expenses for some things are much higher in America, but taxes are not. Danish taxes are, by our standard, confiscatory.
And most Americans do not live paycheck to paycheck, though far too many do.
1
Onion headline based on this column:
"Sanders calls for Nationalizing Anheuser- Busch and Hasboro"
The entire column is a red herring. Friedman makes up out of whole cloth a fantasy that Sanders is hostile to the entire free enterprise system and then proceeds to tell us why that's dumb by lecturing the reader about Denmark. Friedman actually claims that Sanders is hostile to Carlsburg Beer and Lego! What?
Friedman has to know that the lack of hostility between labor and corporations and the investment in social welfare by the Danes that he celebrates, are exactly what Sanders envisions to for our country.
Sanders does not vilify corporations like Lego and Carlsberg. When was the last time you heard Bernie trash talking Anheuser- Busch or Hasboro. Come on now. Sanders saves his ire for very specific villains- drug companies (including Novo Nordisk who does stuff like this; https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-05/u-s-sues-novo-nordisk-over-victoza-seeking-12-15-billion
health insurance companies, the fossil fuel industry, Amazon, and the financial services industry
If you want to take issue with why vilifying these sectors is bad, then do it. Don't bring beer and toys into this. That's low, real low Tom.
8
I'd like for the world to look like an episode of Star Trek: Next Generation, too, but it won't for a few hundred years, and to get to that level of security and fulfillment, it's going to take a few hundred years of incremental change.
1
This country and pardon my French Clinton and Obama and Republicans have continued to approve actions since the 80s to further erode any assurance of economic survival and principally access to medical and education as thousands lost their jobs since the eighties.
Now I would Not consider it possible to have Or government pay Medicare for all.But a program that would enable who need it pay into the system. if needed
No. No.No. poor children or people with jobs with no benefits cannot afford the best education for their kids.
No.No.No. since eliminating Glass Seagall
the nation protects the Banks more than its citizens.
I read your informative column and envy your flyer status but you and Samuelson forget the Americans born or nationalized
as all are not in ur league.
Can someone explain to us the millions and millions in defense war other vs as and Medicare
Medicare for all. Undoable. it is also hypocritical of Biden and Pelosi to shut eyes and ears and signatures from robbing Medicare fee for service for Advantage and permit the monopolies of hospital and services farmed out to criminals masquerading as HMO and medical services to many who began losing their jobs since 80s
. When Politicians become millionaires after being in politics !!!!! do you think any consider less fortunate ones? Do u know how many people over 40 cannot get interviews amply qualified? How many bright kids may not afford college.
How many will die in horrible conditions?
1
This is so frustrating to read. You are intentionally exaggerating Bernie's statements and ignoring actual truths in what he's said, in order to encourage this false narrative that Bernie has absurb, unaffordable plans that disagree with basic American values.
You say Sanders is "demonizing all risk-taking American entrepreneurs as corrupt" which is an intentional falsehood which you should be ashamed of writing. He has clearly, repeatedly, stated that he is against specifically the 1%, which are billionaires and multi-millionaires that indeed depending on your standards and moral code can be considered to have profits that are "all ill-gotten by definition", as you say. Think of Whole Foods, owned by Amazon, that cuts health care for workers while Jeff Bezos buys a second mansion. These companies could not make such large profits if they did not treat their workers so poorly. You try to make it seem like small business owners and dangerously rich business congelmerates are all the same group of entrepeneurs.
Then you ask the classic 'how can he pay for all of this', which is intentional ignorance on your part, as he has explained many times his plan to pay for his programs, all of which is detailled on his website. It's clear that you'd rather repeat a tired phrase then do actual research on the person you're criticizing.
Telling that 3/5 of the NYT top picked comments support the article, and most of the reader picked comments point out the innaccuracies.
6
Biden fan here. I've liked Joe for ages and I think he can really win the day.
But I will vote for Sanders if he gets the nomination. I am concerned that some Democrats will only vote for *their* person and do other.
This is partly how we got Trump
I agree with Tom's assessment of Sanders here. Bernie's often cherry-picked his data.
Also, I would worry that Bernie doesn't really have a constituency among fellow-politicians to get thing done.
Honestly, I think Hillary is right: nobody likes him.
3
Tom does not mention a worker's efficiency. I believe workers in Scandinavia are more efficient than American workers. More focus on the job, not medical bills, child care bills, education bills. More efficient because they do not come to work sick. More focused because their colleague sitting a meter away is not sick. More efficient because of coming back from a 4 week paid vacation, and not forced to work unpaid overtime or lose the job. As a worker on the floor, all this stuff matters to me. Management, not so much.
4
The Democrats have lost my entire generation. Good luck turning out anyone under 55 after yet again us that addressing our problems isn't "electable." Those worried about student debt, raising kids during climate change, and rising medical costs do not belong in the same party as Joe Biden.
1
@theda _ skocpol :
I wish for Bernie's policies, but your generation did not show up to vote. At the base, it is not policies, it is who shows up to vote for them. That is why the GOP at 40% has control of so much of government, and the courts. The GOP shows up to vote.
4
When given the choice, the GOP opted to decrease the votes of Democrats via voter suppression of people of color and gerrymandering, rather than trying to widen their appeal and thus increase their base. Their base is now a dwindling group of white non-college educated voters and they know they can’t win on the numbers, so they establish their dominance through cheating and voter suppression—minority rule. Our job now is to un-rig the system so we have true representative democracy again.
2
@Cassandra :
For comparison, Scandinavia turns out 85% voting participation.
2
I would say Bernie Sanders' biggest problem has been not communicating his message properly. He never advocated communist-style anything, nor did he ever say we need to copy EXACTLY another country's system. I waited, and waited, in his last few interviews and debates, for him to modulate his message, to emphasize that he is not against capitalism (like Warren did). But I never heard it, in fact, he doubled down on the revolution semantics that works only with the young, and those very new to the system.
Bernie's failings at this level encouraged his enemies and made their attacks potent and effective, like Tom Friedman's attacks here.
4
The President is not a dictator and should not be the source of all policies. If Congress and the Senate passed progressive legislation that is financially defensible a President Biden would not veto it. If a President Sanders did not have a Democratic Congress and Senate we would lose another four years in addressing healthcare, education, infrastructure and environmental issues. We need a head of state who will restore decency, respect for dissent, humility and honesty to the Presidency, so that our nation can heal from the trauma of the Trump regime.
Biden does not deny climate change, medical science, or the nightmare of income inequality. He will not come up with solutions for our nation's problems with out a lot of help and support -- but he would not reject good policy or genuine expertise if it were put in front of him. A Democratic Congress and Senate would step up, and there would be an abundance of talent eager to take jobs in a BIden administration, even without the 10% unemployment rate we might be facing next year of the epidemic gets out of control.
Anyone who says there's no significant difference between Trump and Biden is ignoring the big picture, and contributing to the existential risk America now faces.
Biden was not my first choice for President but I can handle my disappointment about that much better than I could deal with another four years of Trump and his GOP enablers.
3
It's no surprise that older Americans do not support Bernie and Medicare for All.
Here is an oft-heard, if slightly tongue-in-cheek, response:
Of course I'm not voting for Sanders. He wants Medicare for all. I'm already on Medicare now, so you think I wanna wait in line behind you?
2
"[W]here do you think jobs come from?
"They come from risk-takers who borrow money from banks or relatives or max out their credit cards or spend their own savings to start companies they hope will become profitable. "
Actually, good jobs come from middle class businesses. The kind of businesses that are displaced by massive corporations who replace good paying jobs with minimum wage jobs.
3
Most of what is in this column is willful nonsense. But you are right that the Nordic model “is an expanded welfare state, which provides a high level of security for its citizens, but it is also a successful market economy with much freedom to pursue your dreams and live your life as you wish.” And by deciding to tax it’s citizens, Denmark provides those things impossible to provide by relying on a “ free market” - access for all to child care, medical and parental leave from work, tuition-free college, a living stipend, universal health care and generous pensions. That kind of mixed economy is what Sanders advocates, if you are willing to listen. It is called social democracy or democratic socialism. It is not what Biden advocated when he encouraged cuts in our minimal social security.
4
Agreed. Indeed, like so many NYT pieces, this is also Orwellian to the core. It’s heartbreaking because I know the amount of despair this type of lie and propaganda is responsible for.
Just as you accuse Bernie of cherry picking Denmark, you cherry pick Bernie. The point is to focus on where we can do better, rather than condemning those who criticize the status quo. Bernie does not advocate stifling innovation or entrepreneurship, he actually is pro-business in one of the most important areas: relieving corporations from providing health insurance for their employees, or in the case of many large corporations (Walmart for example), paying workers minimal wages and letting them rely on Medicaid and Food Stamps to survive. With respect, you need to widen your lens just as you want Bernie to do—it should not be one way street either way.
5
Where was this discussion two or three months ago! I have been trying to convince people that it is not Venezuela we should be looking at, and Trump keeps pointing to, but countries like Denmark and Germany that have market driven economies. They have implemented Third Way systems that work.
@Frank Purdy
Priority #1 must be to eject the current Oval Office occupant. There will be no Green Deal Paris Accord, or decent response to the virus until we get a competent President who is not a Russian asset.
Virtually all Democrats agree that health care must be available to all. There is nothing wrong with making incremental steps to get there while we work out the details. The concerns of those with existing health plans they like should be considered, not dismissed.
3
What has Biden ever said or actually done to demonstrate his commitment to a strong social safety net, as the Danes have in place? It takes money to provide benefits for a citizenry, and the more prosperous you are the more you contribute - that’s the Nordic model. Bernie wants to encourage productivity by eliminating redundancy and making space for genuine creativity; to wit, medical insurance companies have to go - preserving obsolescence does not “grow the pie.” Think of the financial freedom Americans will have when 30-40% of their income isn’t sliced off the top for health care bureaucracy.
2
I have not seen or heard anything recently about a "third way", that is, the use of cooperatives, which are a means of people owning more of the businesses they patronize (not the typical capitalist owning of shares and making a profit off of others). During the Great Depressionn of the 1930's, there was an expansion of this idea in the U.S. The idea of cooperative businesses predates that time. Cooperation can also be used successfully in other kinds of business enterprises. The point is, to minimize losers and maximize life for more of us. Co-ops require that those who help develop them be educated towards cooperation rather than exploitation.
1
Bernie's ideas a great. His problem is his stubborn unwillingness to listen and work with others. That's why I'm such an ardent supporter of Warren. I'll vote for whomever I need to in order to get Trump out of the White House, as just about anybody's values are closer to my own than his are, but I'm disappointed that Bernie was in second place. He's got great ideas, and no way to implement them. Warren has great ideas and ways to get them done.
3
Nobody ever said I lived in a Socialist state, but we look and sound like America, with all the social advantages of Denmark. With a diverse population, a welcome mat for immigrants ( with limits) and a parliamentary system that does get things done, why doesn’t Bernie make the point that a fairer comparison would emphasize? We have better health outcomes at half the cost ( do factor in the missing expenditures on the insurance infrastructure when you do the Medicare math), so let’s get real , folks.
7
@Shelley Corrin My wife, who is Canadian, says that it's a Socialist state. And yes, just like the mashed potatoes used as a stand-in for vanilla ice cream in restaurant displays, Canada looks much like America. But in reality we are very different.
If you want to get real, get rid of the idea that most Americans would prefer to be Canadians.
1
If only most Americans could be Canadians. But they cannot for one simple reason: we have a long and honourable tradition of taking care of our fellow citizens. Even “ red Tories” so-called, knew that all must benefit or all will sink. America fails on that score, and its many insults to the lives of fellow Americans ensue.
We do not have the wealth that you have, but we have social peace. We do not have mass shootings every week, nor do we have uninsured health . That you do not see the plusses there is , well, a reflection of who you are, not who we are
2
Friedman misses a central point. In Denmark, the millionaires accept their social contract: the idea of a national health care system, a decent minimum wage, subsidized education (from K to grad school) a commitment to the environment, etc.
In the US, not so much. In Biden’s views, not so much. This is why he was able to tell Lawrence O’Donnell that he would veto a Medicare-for-All bill should it somehow miraculously land on his desk in the Oval Office.
Don’t tell me that Biden would make a better Scandinavian socialist than Sanders. Friedman’s defense of Biden is a defense of the status quo. Trump will do just fine for that purpose.
9
@HarryP Trump is not fine for any purpose whatsoever.
@Carl Yaffe
I agree.
Marx himself conceded that capitalists are valuable because they take risks and provide capital. The problem is when their wealth becomes political power to the exclusion of labor and far out of balance with their risk. When capital and media are synonymous and even workers are anti-union, well, it makes Denmark seem like another planet.
4
Why don't you ask Americans what their health insurance (plus out of pocket costs) would be as a percentage of their family income?
If it were not subsidized by their employers, the cost is almost $25,000 PER YEAR.
Given that the typical two earner household has incomes around $79,000 a year, that's almost 32%.
Add that to whatever local/state/federal taxes you already pay. For most middle class families that comes to between 18% and 30% a year (a lot depends on which state you live in). So the total outlay is 50% to 62%.
BUT you don't get subsidized college education and this does NOT cover your retirement (although I did include SS and Medicare taxes in the totals).
If the NYT does not post this information, I know what is really up: suppression of information.
5
My health insurance, not access to healthcare, does cost me $25,000 a year. My annual income is $60,000. I would do anything for a Sanders presidency.
3
@Lilly It's even worse. Note that I said that the numbers did not include cost for college education and retirement. Add 20% of income for those things.
I ask people: do you think people can cover their standard of living on the remainder (18% to 30%) of their income - INCLUDING HOUSING OR RENT.
This is why the whole thing does not work. There are are no cost controls, no quality controls and few fraud controls. And politicians continuing to deny reality is what got us here.
@Larry L Also note how the healthcare part is BIGGER than TOTAL TAXES PAID.
Cutting taxes is meaningless for the middle class. Don't fall for the bait and switch.
Thomas, I think you need to spend more time with working class people who are living paycheck to paycheck and can't afford good health insurance. Or maybe meet with recent college graduates who are in debt and forced to live at home and often not finding jobs aligning with their education. Please tell me what policies Biden supports that will change this picture?
8
@DJ :
I think such things are beyond Tom's life experiences.
Hanging out with Prime Ministers, though....
5
Let's talk taxes. If you include my medical insurance premiums, I pay around 35% in taxes. What do I get for my taxes? Well nothing for childcare. I get medical care with a $3200 deductible, a 7K out our pocket max, per person. A max of 20K out of pocket for a family and that’s provided that I stay “in network”. Out of network, well that’s 40K out of pocket max per family. That would be every year, which is why people go bankrupt with insurance for things like cancer diagnosis. I also don’t get college tuition or even affordable college tuition. I don’t get any technical or vocational training. While this is what I don’t get, we have people like Bezos and other billionaires who are paying well under 35% in overall taxes. Warren Buffet mentioned he pays under 20% and that’s obscene. Additionally, I pay 6.2% in payroll taxes. Someone who makes 250K pays ~3.4% and someone who make 500K pays ~1.7%.
You try to make the number 55.8% sound scary. Or even 45%. 45% in taxes is 10% over what I pay currently and I don’t get much for my money other than corporate tax breaks, give backs to billionaires and endless wars. If you want to tax me more but I actually get a benefit we have a place to start talking. But I’m not interested in taxes that hammer the doctors, lawyers, accountants, etc. and let off the hook hedge fund managers, billionaires and those who live off of “clipping coupons” in the stack market.
8
"According to Investopedia, Denmark’s progressive income tax tops out at 55.8 percent, and the average individual pays 45 percent. The Danes pay an 8 percent labor market tax, a 5 percent health care tax, as well as hefty municipal taxes and a social security tax. Denmark also has the highest national sales tax in the European Union — 25 percent — on most goods and services, a big tax on the middle class." There is no such thing as a free lunch and that is what Sanders is selling by making it sound that taxing the 1 % would be enough. Denmark has a social contract with all of its citizens who agree to pay more in taxes to fund a strong social safety net. We have some of that here - Social Security and Medicare but building a stronger social safety net will require higher taxes for all. Sanders has brought the inequalities in our system to the fore and that is very important but solving the problems will require honesty about costs and a balancing of competing interests. Demonizing those who are scared of losing what they have will not get us there.
2
Disagree with the basic premise. Scandinavia does economically well because all the people get paid a living wage. This wage is high enough so everyone pays income tax AND has disposable income after paying taxes.
In the US, not everyone pays taxes. The poor get Earned Income
Tax Credits, Corporate Welfare, taxpayers subsidizing Corporate profits, Corporate Welfare. The Rich hire lawyers to not pay taxes. Many people simply do not have disposable income.
A country where everyone has disposable income to purchase goods and services will have its small business thrive. And country where half the people cannot take a $500 sudden hit and the corporations have all the money will do less well.
2
It might frighten people less if we used the term "social democracy" instead of "democratic socialism". There's just something about the "ism" that makes it seem more extreme, even though they mean more or less the same thing.
4
Anu Partanen in her book The Nordic Theory of Everything says that for universal health care, free education from pre-K through college, pensions, child care, the average Finnish citizen pays 30.7% of her income in taxes. She says that the average US citizen pays 24.8% ( p. 284). I would gladly, gladly pay an extra 6% in taxes in order for everyone in my country to have free education, health care, pensions. I would gladly.
5
Tom, Tom, you are so spot on talking about Sanders' proposals. But, and it's a big but, you only mentioned in passing several key historical facts which come into play: slavery and all its consequences, a Supreme court which now allows money to buy votes, huge corporations which avoid any tax, an enormous diversity here as compared to the Scandanavian countries, and perhaps the biggest player, a country which has become so enamoured with greed as to obliterate what we were founded on. Our soul is lost, and no Joe or Bernie will easily find it again.
3
In business school one of the first concepts you learn is that in a perfect market economy there are no economic profits, meaning that the profits of every enterprise adjusted for risk and opportunity cost are zero. Then you spend the rest of the two years figuring out how to beat that expectation through various forms of trickery. Among these: nefarious corporate strategy which is mostly monopolization of one form or another and psychological manipulation through branding and marketing.
Solving problems through risk-taking and innovation is the heart of economic creation and is where all jobs begin, as Friedman rightly points out. Sanders and his supporters would do well to remember this. But economic capture, rent seeking, and monopolization are often the goals of corporate leaders today, not innovation. These behaviors do not expand the economic pie but rather redistribute it, causing much of today’s economic inequality. This situation is “unnatural” in the sense that the beloved classical economics of conservative pundits predicts the opposite should happen. Biden and his supporters would do well to remember that.
3
When and how do you get the likes of McConnell, Graham, Norquist, Fox, Limbaugh et al to become willing to recognize mutual interest with the middle and lower classes? To view government as a vehicle for the benefit of everyone rather than something to be dismantled to leave an unfettered playing field for those with wealth?
Effective demonizing has been practiced for decades by the Right. It's embedded and structural. Sander's version is noise at the margin.
2
The best written piece on the Scandinavian safety nets I have laid eyes on for some time.
Short and to the point.
Thanks.
5
Bloomberg was injected into the Democratic race for the sole purpose of destroying the Sanders campaign. He built a band wagon, gathered enough voters to his camp, and then gave the band wagon to the candidate considered the best bet to beat Sanders. Bloomberg started the the Biden band wagon, the media including Friedman, Stephens, Brooks, and Krugman, collectively pushed the band wagon as hard as they could. Sanders was left standing in the dust, victim of the establishment machine (for the second time).
The American people were taken for a ride.
4
@Greg
Poor Bernie. So you think the American voters want revolution?
The devil is in the details. Thank you for explaining some of them. Not complete though, because Denmark has limited possibilities and resources on its fertile ground of industry. The USA has far more possibilities, like heavy steel industry, which Denmark lacks, and so so so much more where enterprise does its work. Another thing, and this is a biggy in the arena of healthcare, no one lives unregistered, transient, foot lose and fancy free in Denmark. The possibility of tax evasion and healthcare fraud are zero in Denmark. Not because its people are more virtuous, although their expectations in life are far more down to earth (no California dreaming there), but because everyone knows their neighbor, by name, by registry, and by social contact. Denmark is a village of middle class people who have been where they are for generations. The USA has a prison system dimension that all of Europe couldn't pay for, and certainly would bankrupt Denmark in a hurry. This costs money, lots of money, and many attorneys who have to make a living with attorney kinda things. Which means litigation is rare in Denmark, but all the rage in the US with even prime time tv commercials enticing customers to try their luck and suit each other. Chasing money is about the most immoral thing in the world to Danes, and the most desirable thing to most Americans.
3
The number one priority regarding this discussion needs to be, “Who is most likely to defeat a Republican candidate?” Until that is decided, all other discussions are moot.
As much as I love most of Bernie's ideas, it seems to me that of the two choices, Biden has the widest appeal and is most likely to attract potential swing voters.
Liberal leaning voters must, above all, be united in the principle focus of defeating the incumbant.
2
When defending Capitalism Friedman calls upon the image of a hard working creative person who saved money to develop a better mouse trap in the basement of his home, and then sold them for a handsome profit.
The market capitalists of today in the pharmaceutical, energy, communications, mining, financial and manufacturing industries don't work in the basements of their homes or use much of their own money to develop the products and services they sell. What they do is generate enormous profits, pay themselves handsomely and sequester their money in tax shelters that their lobbyists got the government to approve. They get governments to subsidize their development and compensate them, with tax breaks, for building new facilities.
Socialist governments with a small "s" recognize the value of State involvement in paying for infrastructure and security (police and fire for example) and the education and welfare of a competent workforce, without which modern capitalist enterprises could never exist.
Capitalism with strong government involvement that the people's representatives approve is the democratic socialism that will end the shame of the gross inequality which exists today.
2
"They understood that it was the balancing of all their interests that made Denmark’s economic growth and generous social safety net possible."
It's amazing what can be accomplished in a society where public policy is devoid of input from religious absurdists.
Where intellect and competence are revered.
3
Mr. Friedman is not fair to Bernie – he doesn’t have “hostile attitudes” toward free markets and free trade; he just wants a Danish-style “social contract” where all parties share the benefits of capitalism.
Bernie also wants a Danish-style campaign system where private donations and corporate money have no role in elections. Therein lies the root of the inequality in the U.S. and the reason we cannot achieve an equitable social contract.
I doubt that either Bernie or Biden could be elected in Denmark but I’d put my money on Bernie in that scenario. I prefer ‘change agent’ Bernie to ‘status quo’ Biden in America, but I’ll vote for either.
2
The successful welfare model of the Nordic countries relies on a great doses of nationalism. IT is welfare nationalism. Although nowadays they have become a bit more multicultural societies, they are clear mono cultural solidarity countries. The Swedish Social Democrats in the 1930s created what they themselves defined as the "people's home" . National solidarity rather than universal solidarity. The Danish Social Democrats today adopt policies towards immigration that are related to the populist right.
You can be in favor of the Nordic model, and that is ok. But you better got the full picture. My modest opinion is that welfare nationalism and somehow a return to monoculturalism is the future , (precisely under globalization) whether we like it or not.
1
@arik :
Interesting. I never got that sense when I lived and worked there.
@arik : Not a topic I recall when I worked in Sweden or Norway. Lots of talk about social equality, justice, environment. Some Swedes wanted to be colonized by Norway because Norway has way more money.
This has become an argument about which is more important, the chicken or the egg. Government in part is put in place to protect us from our baser instincts and as such is an implied agreement. It's when the rules allow any individual with, say 90 billion in personal wealth, to say "there's not enough to go around" then that government is failing it's population.
4
@Michael Carter What individual with $90 billion dollars in personal wealth has said "there's not enough to go around"?
Capitalism is best at producing wealth (and ruining it). What is needed is honest, ethical and accountable capitalism. What we want is a social democracy where after profits taken allowed we devote the surplus to the common good. Most Americans want the services but have seldom every wanted to pay for them, hence our huge Federal Deficits.
4
this is very true. I grew up in Austria in a high time of social democracy and ALL people were benefiting and the so called Social Partnership worked very well.
The workers and business representatives in constant exchange and good cooperation, none of them too greedy and respectful with each others views And talking until a good solution for both was achieved.
Has nothing to do with communism or planned economy.
4
Also Sweden where I originally come from has been able to create a system with universal health care and free universities due to a very successful market economy. My home country has more billionaires per capita than the US. A typical family with 2 children and let's say a collected annual income of 75000 dollars has paid parental leave when the children are small, paid sick leave, minimum of 30 days vacation, universal health care for all in the family and both children can go to university for free. How much do you need to earn in the US to have the same benefits?
3
@Ralph Sorbris The typical Swedish family you cite might easily end up paying half or more of that income back to the government in one form of tax or another to support those services/that lifestyle. So the comparison is a false one. And please don't claim that the university is "free" - that's ridiculous. No government service is "free", even if the costs are hidden and indirect.
Denmark has a population smaller than the Houston metropolitan area. It is pure fantasy to believe that a small, ethnically homogeneous country can be the template on which the US can pattern itself on. The American ethos has never been about cooperation between different stakeholders like in Denmark but rather a winner takes all mentality that rewards risk and the rewards that come with it. We are an entrepreneurial nation that believes in pulling oneself up by the bootstraps. A Nordic model is alien to our culture and would destroy what made our country great.
5
@Iconoclast Texan :
I have not seen any study that demonstrates the model cannot be scaled up. Western Europe has similar policies and structures and does only slightly less well.
Correlation, not causation.
I have supported Sanders since before 2016 (in his Congressional campaigns) though I disagree with him about guns and trade because, unlike practically all other national political figures except Elizabeth Warren, he is focussed on the corrosive effects of massive income inequality, low taxation and pathetically bad social services. I hear him railing against billionaires but not against capitalist competition. Like many NYtimes pundits, Friedman's account of Sanders' positions is a caricature. Read the comment by a Dane on this column. Biden running for office in Denmark would be regarded as a joke
there. Furthermore Friedman is so overjoyed that Biden is not going to disturb the status quo (as he has explicitly promised) that he overlooks (or refuses to acknowledge) that there are serious questions about Biden's technical competence. I'd rather have somebody smart with whom I disagree on some issues in the presidency than a bumbler likely to make terrible mistakes.
1
Bernie Sanders is engaged in a three card monte game. For decades he has cozied up to dictators like Fidel Castro, Daniel Ortega and Hugo Chavez. Now that these countries are a total disaster, he does a switch and talks about Danish, Norweigan and Finnish Socialism. The only problem as you call it out is that these countries are Democratic but not Socialists.
Also, I would love the press to examine how many times Bernie has been to Scandinavia to learn from this successful "Socialist" model. I have to hand it to Bernie, most politicians promise something and don't deliver while in office (bait and switch). Bernie is switching before even taking office.
5
While Bernie has had a consistent message for the past 20-30yrs, he also been consistent in the use of divisive rhetoric to push his message. Bernie equates wealth with corruption, he uses the language of the cold war 60's in demonizing the "corporate class" and "billionaire class", and calling for a revolution. Yes, there is extreme wealth inequality in America that must be addressed, but inciting class warfare is not the way to remedy this ill. His inflexibility and unwillingness to accept any solution that is not in lock-step with his own; Biden's goal is also universal healthcare coverage. However, unlike Trump, Bernie has ethics and respect for the Constitution. But let's be serious, he is a politician and will spin facts to his advantage. His unwillingness to compromise and accept half a loaf is a major failing in our democratic system. Bernie must decide if he wants to be the iconoclast on the hill, or does he actually want to govern. His past and current behavior says to me he chooses to be the iconoclast. Consequently, I choose Biden who wants to govern in a manner to heal our country. After a trauma, one has to take baby steps first and Biden is more likely to facilitate our national healing process. If, however, Bernie does become the Dem nominee, I will vote for him as he, even with all of my concerns, is still far superior to the continued trauma of Trump. I only hope that Bernie's supporters will also make the same choice and vote for Biden in November.
2
Denmark is both small and much more homogeneous than the United States. Part of what drives Trump and his voters is the sense that the "wrong" people get welfare from the "right" people.
3
While it's true that soem "risk takers who borrow money" create the organisations that supply our wants and needs, that's note even half the truth. What's more, it's a misleading one.
More important by far is the truth that customers create jobs. No one will take any risks, low or high, either to start or expand a business, if they don't see potential customers lining up outside their doors.
Nor do those risk takers really risk that much. On the contrary, they try to minimise risk. A necessary feature of any "business case" for new investment is the claim that it's nearly risk free. Most those "jop creators" will not innovate because it's too risky to do so. Case in point: Kodak, which actually invented digital photography, but didn't invest in further development and marketing because their analysis showed that continuing in the film business was lesy risky.
And the desire for minimal risk is the reason so many starry-eyed punters put money into the Sure Thing, and support fraudsters like Bernard Madoff.
2
And where is Kodak today? Risk/reward is a fundamental element of the US economy. I have started three different businesses. Trust me, there is no such thing as “risk free”, though to people sitting on the sidelines it probably looks that way.
2
Spoiler alert:
Godot never shows...
1
I find it telling that Mr. Friedman didn’t ask the questions “that I’d love to ask Sanders about his democratic socialism.”
He writes for the New York Times; are we to imagine he could not get a few minutes of interview time with the candidate?
2
Tom Friedman, thank you. You earned every one of your three Pulitzer Prizes.
As someone who saw the Soviet Empire up close and personal, back in the day when Sanders, after his honeymoon there, said the people were "happy and content," I have been waiting impatiently for anyone to hold Bernie Sanders' feet to the fire, and make him respond frankly to questions about his proposals.
Some want us to believe that Sanders is benevolent but too good for American voters. Hogwash. There is nothing benevolent about Sanders' program, and I rejoice that voters are rejecting it.
It's sad to reflect, though, that Sanders received more votes in the last presidential primaries because he was running against a woman, and fewer votes this time because he is running against a man.
Sanders deserves to be trounced on the basis of his skewed and failed ideology.
4
@Danusha Goska -- "Sanders deserves to be trounced on the basis of his skewed and failed ideology."
And we need to be what, relieved that we, the people will still be paying 'healthcare insurance' corporations a Very Healthy Skim on our exceedingly precious actual Healthcare dollars?
Please. Look at the rest of the Planet. Our 87,000,000 un- and under-insured will not be enjoying adequate Healtcare -- a RIGHT, everywhere else -- anytime soon.
And look -- yonder comes COVID-19. How on Earth are we even remotely prepared for a pandemic, when people cannot afford to go to a doctoer, let alone STAY HOME WHILE SICK?
Even Wall Street spooked. Biden's apparent victory has done nothing to assuage their -- and our -- fears.
Does that make you feel better?
1
When you have the richest and largest multinationals paying $0 in taxes that is an unbalanced system. Look no further than Amazon.
4
@Paul Amazon pays billions of dollars annually in employment taxes, real estate taxes, state and local business taxes, etc. Your statement is a complete distortion of the truth. (And no, I don't work for them.)
1
@Carl Yaffe :
Not the right perspective. The proper question is, "Does a company pay enough taxes to replace the resources it consumes?"
I am not helpful to society if I use $100 and pay $50.
@gratis
Perfect description of why welfare is a failure. How about 100% to you and zero to society? Like those numbers?
Nailed it.
2
Trump and Hans Christian Anderson are rarely linked, but having read Friedman, Brooks etc worship at the altar of Joe while the DNC paves the road, it will be Donnie who cries about the emperor's clothes, which in this case will be mental decline, NAFTA, Iraq, credit card company lackey..... dear lord it looks even worse in writing
4
"Obviously, in a small, largely homogeneous country of 5.8 million people, it is a lot easier to generate that kind of social trust than in a diverse nation of 327 million."
Yes, that is one of many reasons why we must devolve power back to the states where it belongs.
2
Scandinavia has put the welfare of its people first but didn’t go nuts.
5
Oh give it a rest, Tom.
It is unseemly to dance on Bernie Sander's political grave on the eve of his demise.
Your questions are insulting to educated adults.
2
@howard Not when his demise is decades overdue.
Spot on.
Why can’t we just vote for you Tom Friedman? Always spot on. Understands the globe, and America’s place and responsibilities in it.
3
Bernie Sanders looks and sounds to me like a scold. But then, Biden and Trump look and sound senile, to me.
3
Repackaging Bernie’s platform as a subset of Biden’s is a clever way to poach voters. This is predicated upon the false assumption that “only Biden can deliver what Bernie aspires to.”
The only reason why Denmark works is because it's homogeneous. Sanders is a yeller who sometimes comes off as a bully.
1
First, I love the entrepreneurs in the United States and so does Bernie. Second, Tom--have a definition of "21st century socialism"? If so, define your 21st-century terms FIRST. Third, if not for Bernie, the democratic party establishment would have been 100% co-opted by the GOP by now. Fourth, and you got to love this: "They [jobs] come from risk-takers who borrow money from banks or relatives or max out their credit cards or spend their own savings to start companies they hope will become profitable." Think that one over for a moment = spending what you don't have. That unbridled, spend-it-all capitalism kind of goes with 'invest in dig-drill-and-destroy for resources that will hasten climate-change.' Fifth, to quote Rasmussen with "The Nordic model is an expanded welfare state, which provides a high level of security for its citizens,...." eats your argument. Why? Because "...expanded welfare state" is what Bernie means by 'democratic socialism.' Furthermore, the U.S., with the 2nd amendment, ready-access to all kinds of weaponry, homicide-mindset, totally CDC-botched response to the SARS-CoV-2 outbreak (shunning both So. Korea and Germany's, already-in-place testing apparatuses), and for-profit-lousy-results' healthcare system, provides nota modicum of "...a high level of security for its citizens." Note the real difference by actually LIVING in a country with an "...expanded welfare state, which provides a high level of security for its citizens" Tom. Then you'll know.
2
Paid for by yours truly,
The Billionaires.
5
Agreed!
What happened to Thomas Friedman’s unity ticket of three weeks ago? When Bernie looked like the nominee, Friedman wanted him to announce Klobuchar as VP, Bloomberg as Treasury, Mitt Romney as Commerce, and Joe Biden as State. Today’s column does not sound like the same Tom Friedman. Does he want Biden to name a true progressive leftist for VP. Will Friedman advocate that Biden name Sanders, Warren, and AOC in prominent roles? By mischaracterizing Sander’s criticism of corporate socialist trade agreements and their relationship to wealth inequality, it seems that Friedman is now falling back on tired old smear tactics designed to scare voters from progressive government and settle for the complacent middle right establishment. Tom, what a difference a few victories make, but don’t take it for granted progressive voters will fall in line if Biden goes back to his comfort zone and reaches rightward across the aisle to his great old friends.
2
This is not an election about ideology and social change. It is about who can beat Trump. Sanders has to many past statements which Trump would use to his advantage to foil voters. Biden has a long history and it has all been revealed over the many years he has been in government.
1
Looking at the comments the media assassination of Sanders is complete. Enjoy another term of Trump!
"Safety Net"
"Progressive"
"Liberal"
All of these terms are Liberal oxymorons. There are many Liberal oxymorons. "Fetus" is one. "Affirmative Action" is another. "Gender Confirmation" is another. The list is both extensive as it is false. In fact, one could easily argue with concrete examples that the entire philosophy of the modern NeoMarxist Liberal is a complete oxymoron.
Nothing that modern Liberals believe in represents reality. Every policy, all of their terminology, slogans, lexicons, definitions, and arguments are completely devoid of any sense of reality. The modern Liberal existence is a bubble reality of contrived experiences based on their ridiculous world views.
2
Friedman totally misunderstands what's behind Denmark's safety net - and Sweden's and Finland's and Norway's.
Have read many, many comments including a large number of them from us expats who live in one of these countries.
Perhaps the Times should give us a forum and simply let us report.
As for Times Picks, please tell us who makes them. Case in point BLM who describes Elizabeth Warren's RANTING AND RAVING at him (Bloomberg). We in Sweden were blocked from seeing some of the debates but there is only one highly placed American for whom those two "ing" words apply and it is not Warren. I leave it to BLH to guess who I have in mind.
BLH repliers apparently do not agree with Times Picker. Neither do I.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Citizen US SE
2
The Times pile on is complete. Dr Krugman joins the chorus burying Sanders.
1
Wow, Thomas Friedman, what a straw man of a column. Sanders is not categorically against all capitalist's ventures. He is against corporate greed. You know, like U.S. Pharma charging ten times here what it charges in other countries. Or banks that engage in fraud to rip-off consumers. Yes Wells Fargo I am talking about you. And Sanders issue with taxes is how little big corporations and CEOs pay. Like zero! At the same time those CEOs pay themselves millions in compensation while their workers try and survive on pauper's incomes. Sanders is promoting a kind of capitalism that would eliminate the reality of three men controlling more wealth than half of all Americans. Sanders wants infrastructure projects to create jobs for American workers, among other things. He knows that workers will need corporations to build the equipment to build new roads, airports and schools. To say that Sanders is against those corporations categorically is false and unseemly. It seems to me that it is worse that that. It is disingenuous. I thought that you were better than that, Mr. Friedman.
3
@J. Colby
Perhaps that opinion was gained by learning what regimes Sanders has admired and verbally promoted during his lifetime. In that frame, when Sanders talks about revolution today, he actually means revolution, not mere legislative controls on the excesses of free enterprise.
@LHP I don't know what it means to say "actual revolution." I guess the range would be, in the extreme, annihilation of capitalists to free daycare for children. Some would like us to believe the former but Bernie talks about the latter. True, it can't be done w/o knocking a few CEOs and Senators off of their thrones. But, it's not annihilation. let's be, clear as Bernie would say.
@J. Colby
Well Bernie admired Castro, Che G., Venezuela, et al, born out of revolution, maybe that's a clue about Bernies idea of a revolution. I am not going to take a chance. Besides, the country needs more machinists, electronic technicians, definitely not more liberal arts bachelors with no productive skills. No way am I paying for extended party time after high school, when most should really be working with their hands at 16, because they will never be interested in a lifetime of academic study.
Democratic Party = Republican Party = Wall Street Party = Global Capitalist Empire Party = War Party
The DNC got their guy by means of their normal underhanded shenanagins plus some good ole voter suppression (one polling place for 40,000 UCLA students, c'mon).
Corporate Socialism is acceptable America! Always has! For example, due to their patriarch's genuis, Sam Walton's progeny are worth hundreds of billions while their employees are on Medicaid and Food Stamps. Heck! They even expect us to check out our own groceries! What gall! How about the TBTF bank bailout costing $29 trillion.
So the guy who advocates that health coverage for every American be a right rather than a privilege is being demonized as a Red Scare Communist. Richest country in the world, richer than Denmark, just can't guarantee affordable healthcare for every American because that would be SOCIALISM! You'd think corporations would be all in on 50% cheaper Med4All for it would help their bottom line. Geesh! We might not have to bag our own groceries!
3
And Mohamed Bin Salman is a Democratic Reformer. Sheesh, Friedman is the George Costanza of politics. Whatever he says, the opposite is true.
1
I've read very few op-ed pieces in the Times that exhibit the sheer ignorance that Friedman exhibits in this column. Or perhaps it is plain malice. In any case, to accuse Bernie Sanders of advocating a kind of command economy socialism that cratered the USSR is irresponsible. To assert that Joe Biden is more closely aligned with the Danish social contract is sheer propaganda. Friedman is sounding especially shrill lately. It's somewhat understandable; no one sane wants Trump in the White House for another four years. But to try to run a cynical piece of writing like this past Times readers is beyond the pale. This sort of column is what opens the Times to charges of outright bias. Or perhaps you have another piece in the works that takes equally misguided aim at Biden?
6
Well there you have it: Friedman backs corporate America and unbridled capitalism. He probably still believes in the "trickle down" theory.
4
In summary:
-Denmark’s social programs that Bernie Sanders advocates for are good
-Businesses there thrive despite high taxes that fund said programs
-Something about “redividing” magically appearing economic pie (???)
-Bernie Sanders says mean things about capitalists
-Thus ... vote for Joe Biden?
1
Instead of penning this hit-job Mr. Friedman, why couldn't you have just sat down with Sen. Sanders and published your interview based on your questions?
1
Let’s all grow some pie and break down Thomas Friedman‘s thinky thoughts:
-Denmark’s social programs that Bernie Sanders advocates for are good
-Businesses in Denmark thrive despite high taxes to fund such programs
-Bernie Sanders says mean things about my capitalist friends in high places
-Thus ... vote for Joe Biden?
My questions for Thomas Friedman:
How exactly does one “redivide” a magically appearing pie? Is it already divided? If so, do we mince the pie?
1
The biggest criticism of Sanders and his "not Russian Socialism (even though I vacationed there and was a useful idiot for their Sister Cities propoganda)" argument comes straight from his website.
He proposes to give workers ownership of the companies they work for. Fine, I think, he is going to buy out a portion of the company from the current owners & give some shares to the workers. Then I see that he is also proposing to reduce the wealth of current owners. Which means only 1 thing, he is going to use the government to seize a portion of current businesses and "give" to the workers. Which is what the Russian socialism is.
1
James—wrong, wrong, wrong. Providing employees with company stock (which initially costs the company nothing) in addition to cash compensation has proved very effective for many companies and their employees. This takes nothing away from anybody but over time results in greater equity. Such plans have long been encouraged by providing federal tax benefits for them. Problem is that today’s greedy stockholding blocks don’t like the idea of sharing their lucrative enterprise with worker stockholders.
1
@McFadden You are deliberately missing my point.
1st of all, Enron (as has GE) has shown the perils of regular employees owning stock in their employer instead of a diversified portfolio. Adding risk to an employees portfolio seems very anti-worker (yes, there is upside potential and many company's have supplemental stock ownership plans, but experts don't agree that this makes sense for regular employees).
Second, encouraging ownership of the company by a broader base of employees is fine when done under voluntary contracts. If the Feds want to come in and buy Apple stock from Tim Cook at a market price, that would be fine. But that would be the government directly benefiting an existing rich shareholder and giving an employee a riskier asset.
Bernie means seizing the means of production from existing owners, without fair compensation to said owners.
One Trump is enough.
Black people voting for Biden over Sanders is like going to the church of creflo dollar instead of rev dr william barber.
1
As usual, Friedman is misleading and destructive. Biden will lose to Trump and Bernie Sanders will be blamed. I have voted Democrat all my life. But the Democratic Party is now the party of Bill Kristol, Jennifer Rubin and Tom Friedman. Thanks but no thanks. Bye Bye
3
Wrong, wrong. As long as fear mongers like Friedman get such a public voice in the NYT we shouldn’t be surprised that the one single candidate who could not bring three intelligent sentences in a row to the debate wins the race. The one of 20 more or less well spoken candidates is being supported from NYT and Friedman?
This is laughably incorrect.
First of all, the entire article focuses on what Sanders isn't – until you get to the last 3 paragraphs, only one of which actually mentions Biden, and then fails to even mention specific policies Biden has endorsed that would steer the US anywhere toward Denmark (or Norway, Sweden, the Netherlands, etc).
Friedman just writes that he thinks Biden harbours these ideas. He doesn't.
Where is Biden proposing any type of social contract wherein Americans pay 45% of their income to taxes to help other people? Or even 37.35%, my current tax bracket. Joe Biden appears more willing to want to fight people who disagree with him through push-up matches than actually navigating toward a society where people look out for each other.
Opinion pieces like these are why Americans and our money-first society are so often mocked. Utterly clueless.
2
Another hit piece against Sanders by the New York Times.
In fact, virtually this whole edition of the NYT has an anti-Sanders tone.
Friedman’s article is a mishmass of straw man arguments and half-truths.
Perhaps the worst of these is his reference to an imaginary entrepreneurial class.
The nation is not owned or run by risk-taking job creators, but by entrenched big businesses whose purpose is to maximize unearned income for their shareholders and executives.
In fact, business startups are usually small, not unionized, and pay pitifully small wages.
Using Denmark as a tool to attack Sanders’ entire campaign is just petty, and is such an obviously false representation of Sanders’ proposals.
2
Another thing about Scandinavia: those who become very rich, like tennis players and such, don’’t stick around to have their money taken away. They dodge 30 percent of what they owe by parking their money in tax free havens like Monacco. Here’s proof:
https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2017/6/7/15745978/tax-evasion-zucman
3
Well what do you know.... a NY Times column that defends capital, corporations, and entrepreneurism! That's only for today though.... the other 364 days, those things still stink.
2
So good to read this column. Sorry Larry David, it's over!
2
Now you’re an expert on Scandinavia. Can’t wait to see what you know everything about next week!
1
An op ed that completely misses the point and makes many false arguments. A command economy? Eliminate corporations? Sanders has never said those things. Why doesn’t Mr. Friedman spend some more time doing actual research about or reaching out to the subjects of his pieces instead of creating hypothetical call and answer situations in his head?
Sanders has been advocating for decades for a more equitable society with elements that work very well in Scandinavia and his platform proposes sweeping changes, that will help US society move the needle. Of course, with how our govt works it will be decades before we are close to a Scandinavian society without “working poor”, but at least the needle can be moved meaningfully. Friedman practices some weird mental gymnastics to conclude that Joe Biden is suddenly the one who has been fighting like Bernie and will advocate like Bernie in office.
This whole piece felt like a poor take on Freaky Friday where a bystander (Mr. Friedman) is actually the one confusing two different characters.
The “liberal” media continuously publishing thin attack pieces like this that paint a false picture of Sanders vs Biden as “a crazy radical” vs. “a true progressive” are why so many younger (mid twenties) voters like myself are disenfranchised by the (now trite expression) of “mainstream media”.
1
Lol I think you misunderstand Bernie, not Bernie misunderstands Denmark!
You are so sore Bloomberg lost you are taking it out on Bernie. Go ahead pile on..and don’t come back trying to get Bernie supporters’ votes for Biden, come November, ok? That’s a deal!
Perhaps sit down with Paul Krugman and he will explain it to you.
Or better still Professor Liz Warren will do an excellent job of educating you, kindly reach out to her.
You are totally Losing it dude because your candidate Bloomberg lost!!
2
I think your off-base on this one Friedman. Your analysis on his political / economical stance lacks any consideration for nuance.
3
The Friedman critique pragmatically glosses the responsibility for the recent Great Recession that clearly belongs to our financial class. But that message was going to leave a host of potential Republican converts unmoved, weakening the chance not only to unseat Trump but to create an enduring Democratic coalition by the addition of Republicans sickened by the course their party has taken. It won't give us the solidarity of a small nation like Denmark, but it will improve decency's chances against the undemocratic and the lawless.
While we have thrived for several hundred years as being the world's melting pot and for good reasons that diverse, multi-cultural world has made the USA what it is, there is also one other piece not mentioned that is at play for not just Denmark but a number of European and Asian countries - they have a very high percentage of their population that is not only one race but also one nationality for multiple generations.
This is not a suggestion that you stop immigration but it is a recognition that to get a large group of people who are of the same makeup to move in the same direction and to agree on what needs to be done is considerably easier than to try and do that with a large group of very diverse people from many different cultures. Both have their pluses and minuses. Almost 87 percent of Denmark's population is of Danish descent. 97.2 percent of their population is of one race. Being that homogeneous is good for decision making but not so good for creativity, challenging the norm, etc.
1
Biden closer to a Scandinavian-style of governing than Sanders?!
I don't recall Biden ever pointing in the direction of social reforms that would take this country there.
For Biden, there is nothing wrong with capitalism as it is practiced in the US.
No contortions will change that fact.
@SV
You are right. But Bernie hasn't attempted to assuage Friedman's fears. Republican administrations consistently increase our debt and weaken the overall economy. (Think GW squandering Bill Clinton's zeroed national deficit.) Then Democratic administrations come in a fix it. (Think Obama's post-Bush recession recovery.) Democrats make great things happen for entrepreneurs. Warren and Sanders failed to promise a National prosperity that could excite Wall Street, not threaten it.
1
I am a small business owner and I form corporations for expansion and new plans. Yet, I also recognize it is possible to be highly critical of the role corporations play in our society without seeking to destroy or abandon them and the legal form they represent.
We are moving toward, if we are not there at the moment, rule by corporations. Wall Street controls how companies operate and punishes those that don't operate with enough pure greed as a driving principle. Corporate power has gathered, taken, information and files on all of us that would have been the envy of the old KGB in the Soviet Union. Credit reports determine how much excessive interest we will pay or whether we can buy a house. The list goes on...
One of the central questions of our times, and for the future, is whether we can have a humane, decent society and still have vigorous enterprise capitalism. It could be an either/or choice. Humanity requires reasonable health care for all including dental care. (25% of those over 65 in our country have no teeth, which probably also means that many underwent years of pain and excessive bacteria in the body from the mouth.)
With the power of unions pushed to the breaking point and the Republicans in control of much of govt., there are very few forces working against the power of corporate rule.
3
Prior to writing this opinion piece, Friedman was asking himself "How can I criticize someone who supports a fair distribution of wealth and opportunity? And how can I make it sound well-reasoned?"
I personally disagree with Friedman's claim that survival of the fittest is the most sensible of societal structures. And I particularly dislike Friedman's deifying risk-takers, the philosophy whereby 'business decisions' is a euphemism for disregarding the people whose dedication and sacrifice are thrown out the window when companies encounter hard times or simply when a way is seen to increase profit at the expense of employee livelihoods.
Friedman's attitude belongs in the distant past.
1
This is one of the most reactionary columns of the election cycle. Neoliberalism has dominated the political conversation and consequently our society since the late 1970s. That Bernie is not waxing poetic about the "job creators" so benefited by government policies since then only proves that the conversation needs to change so we can have programs that encourage both market capitalism and those that guarantee the dignity of every American. Bernie understands that the political conversation must necessarily focus on the later if we are ever to achieve economic justice in America.
3
I mostly agree with this article. My preferred candidates have all dropped out of the race. Aside from what was mentioned in the article, a major problem I have with Sanders is that he has done nothing substantial while in Congress.
2
Thank you for this explanation of Denmark. While so many Bernie liberals yearn for this free-for-everything-paid-by-someone-else society, it flows against American culture. Denmark is 5.8 million. The US is 330 million or 5x. Americans have a survivor-of-the-fittest, frontier mentality. All the successful Danish companies you mention are over 50 years old. Great American technology companies - Amazon, Google, Facebook - are from 1994, 1998, 2004 respectively. You can build a business that changes the world today in America.
Sanders is a revolutionary ideologue. Biden is a left-of-center pragmatist. In today's world, the choice is easy.
1
While Bernie’s ideas may sound good to many, the reality, if some thought is given, is they probably wouldn’t fly. Unfortunately, the electorate has never realized that all the promises they want to hear from presidential candidates are contingent upon support from Congress, unless power is blatantly grabbed a la Trump.
We still have the winner takes all mentality in this country. If someone can begin to make a lot of money they mostly believe they should get to keep it all. The idea of society and the idea of you alone weren’t responsible is foreign.
On a more realistic note, trying to get ideas like Bernie’s enacted is going to meet a firestorm of resistance from the right. Just like many of Trump’s enactments have been stalled by lawsuits, so would Bernie’s.
America isn’t ready for great change. Fear of the unknown is a strong emotion. Generally, it takes some cataclysmic event to allow great change to happen.
2
Mr. Friedman’s comments helped me sort through my mixed feelings leaning towards outright discomfort with Bernie’s candidacy. I totally agree with the end point he envisions—universal healthcare, a “new deal” for wage earners, especially aggressive climate change action. But the demonization of business builders is what turned me off.
After years of 80 hour weeks as a Family Physician, I started a medical informatics company in the nineties. Ultimately successful, my wife and I struggled for almost a decade with maxed out credit cards, home refinances etc to support up to 30 family wage jobs, scoring countless sleepless nights in the process. It was hard. Very hard. But exciting. We felt we were making a difference.
The majority of jobs in the US come from small companies, some of which grow into large companies. Applying a “balanced” approach to both encouraging entrepreneurship and worker justice should be the mandate—not painting one side with one (negative) brush.
3
Getting to the position of Denmark and other West European countries requires millennia of evolution.
I doubt that if contemporary European society were to have been imposed upon a stone age culture only a few centuries ago we would be where we are today in terms of social justice.
The American ego has not yet passed thru the veil of humility where the individual is meaningless in the face of collective peril.
1
An excellent article. Scandinavians are not Sandernistas. They're free-market capitalists who combine support for a strong social safety net with support for private industry. Sweden, for example, a country with a population of 10.12 million, is the home or the origin of the private multinational giants Volvo, Ikea and H & M. Can Americans learn from Scandinavians? Of course. But they can learn as much about success in private business as in so-called socialist enterprises. But before America is compared with Scandinavia, and attempts are made to emulate its successes, it should be kept in mind that all Scandinavian countries countries have a small population. America has the third largest population in the world; California has the fifth largest economy. In many ways, it's impossible to compare America with Scandinavia. Nor is there any need. America has its own social-democratic tradition, with Eugene Debs, John Dewey, Norman Thomas and FDR. This is a tradition that has attempted to ameliorate the ravages of unfettered capitalism without replacing it with state-run organizations. Many Americans have their retirement income invested in the stock market. They want capitalism to prosper. As the sensible black voters in South Carolina and the educated white suburbanites in Virginia and Michigan realize, a tax-payer subsidized government takeover of American business would be a disaster.
3
What Sanders gets wrong is most of know that corporations have to make a profit in order for us to receive a pay check. And most of get treated fairly by our employers. We want more billionaires so they can create more high paying jobs. Bill Gates, George Soros, Mike Bloomberg and Warren Buffet use their wealth in socially positive ways. We want more of them, not less.
"Corporate greed" invented the cell phone, drugs that cure diseases and as a result created millions of jobs and made our lives better. Sure, we can improve the system by tamping down drug prices and increasing the minimum wage, but let's not throw out the baby with the bath water. For most of us, we live far richer lives because of "corporate greed."
So, let's improve the system, not blow it up.
4
I agree with the gist of Krugman's article especially the seeming obliviousness of many on the left of where good jobs come from. However, although small business people may be risk takers it seems that many entrepreneurs, such as the one in the White House, find ways to put OTHER people's money at risk in ways that don't risk their own personal wealth.
1
What is a politician to do? The message here is really about shared experience and a sense of social responsibility. For whatever reason (and there are many reasons why the Danes enjoy a sense of shared experience) the leadership class of Danish society feels that they share in the obligation to assure their citizens basic securities. Now ratchet back to the United States where the Koch network specifically and philosophically believes in and peruses a regime that celebrates selfishness and derides those who suffer as failures. This is the atmosphere in which this article chooses focus on Sanders’ political strategy. Why? Our country is being riven and torn apart by an effort to deliberately pit one against another. Our leadership class not only is failing to address our problems it is engaged in exacerbating them. That is why Sanders campaigns as he does. This article celebrates Biden’s practice of cooperating with our leadership class but we are not in Denmark.
1
As a democratic moderate, I was prepared to start a Moderates for Bernie campaign when it appeared Sanders was going to run away with the nomination. Sanders’ laser focus on reshaping the economy to work for the 99% makes sense and is inspiring. The debate within the democratic party is more about how we get there, and I was more than willing to jump on the Bernie bus if he were the nominee. But now we’re witnessing an unprecedented political comeback by Biden, and this will require some rethinking by the Bernie supporters. I’d love to see Bernie Bros for Biden signs when this primary is finally over if Biden is indeed the democratic nominee. To the extent Biden represents the incremental change that Bernie supports find unacceptable, please give some thought to what Republicans and Trump want to do and ask yourself: Can the working poor that you want to help really endure another four years of this? Please, Bernie supporters, help us take power away from Republicans who will continue to their onslaught of the Americans most in need if don’t do something about it.
6
The power structure in America is brutal in manner, not relatively benign and balanced as in the Scandinavian nations, for instance. The US grew with a frontier ethic, and hasn't transcended it. "America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between." - Oscar Wilde
6
Some comments as a Democratic Socialist (old-school, *not* a Sanders supporter):
Free enterprise and trade is the cornerstone of our economy and any healthy economy. Obscene profits are not.
There are some industries, e.g., health-related goods and services, transportation, including oil and gas, communications, electricity/power, banking, transportation, etc., that should not be 'for profit.' Goods and services that are for the public welfare (you remember, Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness) should be non-profit. It is this group of industries that should be under government control; however, it is also acceptable that there be a government-run option in order to let market forces control prices.
Captains of industry should not be making 1000s of times more than the lowest-paid worker. If the lowest paid worker is earning $8.00/hr, the CEO should be making, at most, $80.00/hr. If he/she/they don't like it, then pay the workers more so you can earn more.
At issue isn't the free market, at issue is exorbitant pay for CEOs, companies designed for the public good that are making outrageous profits, and workers not earning a decent wage (this assumes it is above a living wage).
4
Most americans have a incorrect view on the wealthy european countries such as Denmark. The word social is almost a dirty word in the US. On average, people in scandinavian countries and the Netherlands work less, make more money have better healthcare and are more happy than in the US. I don't think that any of the european countries would ever choose a US politician. The european dream is more realistic for most people and the american dream only applies to the happy few. Cultures are too far apart and we like out politicians much younger.
8
what all the critics of america's shortcomings when it comes to the safety net totally ignore, except bernie sanders, is the huge cost of our defense budget. cut that in half and we could afford everything that denmark provides. but of course we have to get ready for war with china, don't we?
6
I agree with much of what is said here, but the author doesn’t address one of the prime opponents of the “secret sauce”. The demonization, as he presents it, flows from Sanders and his movement to the rich, corporations and entrepreneurs. But that is to erase the almost forty years of history since Reagan. Remember his “welfare queens”? Remember the “lazy” poor, taking from the rest of the deserving Americans? The myth that so-called entitlements were bankrupting us? Remember the drive to eliminate Head Start preschools because, though it raised the IQ’s and school performance of the children and living conditions of whole families, when the support (and food) disappeared in first grade the children lost the gains they had made? As a psychotherapist I saw many, many people whose life histories, abuse, family histories of mental illness, health problems and just plain bad luck kept them in the category of the “poor”.
Demonizing the poor has long been a feature of American politics, along with lack of compassion. Taking away Medicaid from people with so-called “intermittent illness”, like people living with MS, is just the Republicans’ newest assault on an already vulnerable population. The social contract and the warm social ties you describe means demonization ends on both sides. Illness isn’t a weakness that should result in bankruptcy. Healthcare should be a right, not a privilege. When corporations support these ideas, I bet their demonization ends.
12
Come on, this is historical revisionism-- Denmark didn't become what it is today because the "steady iteration" of reasonable entrepreneurs, etc, etc.
The gains of the Danish people came about through the relentless pressure of workers movements and the threat of a General Strike that initially led their monarch to resign from political life. It was the pressure of these worker movements, Social Democrats, Socialists, even Communists that led to the creation of their social safety nets and high standard of living for workers.
Friedman's revisionism is a misrepresentation. If his version of history were true, the benevolent engine of the free market should have turned Chile into another Denmark when Pinochet turned it into a perfect market laboratory under Milton Friedman's guidance. All of South America should look like Scandinavia by now.
But that completely leaves out the absolute necessity of strong, organized labor, workers associations and a worker's party in electoral politics. That the author completely overlooks this reveals how much of an ideologue he is.
6
Not a very clever opinion. It is pathetic when "Scandinavian" is explained internationally. Usually it is to promote some personal perspective with very little relevance to what happens in the Nordic countries. To make it short: Everything is different in those countries; economy, law, culture and ideals. How can you discuss single bits of such a puzzle? If you see something you like in Scandinavia, you got to try to find out how it could fit in, and all the things you would have to change in the US to get some benefit. Forget about Scandinavia, and enjoy your "productivity" by inequality.
3
Very balanced and accurate. Thank you, Mr. Friedman.
Vintage Friedman: "I know a little something about this because in March 2018 Rasmussen, who was then still the prime minister, invited me to give a talk about globalization to a retreat at Marienborg." He gave a talk so he knows about something!
1
"Have you ever been to Denmark? It’s democratic but not socialist."
This article again assumes the ridiculous premise that Mr. Sanders is advocating for setting up a socialist state in the model of the USSR. You are arguing against a strawman.
Have you ever heard Mr, Sanders' policies? They are "socialist" but not authoritarian.
A.P. Moller-Maersk, Danske Bank, Novo Nordisk, Carlsberg Group, Vestas, Coloplast, the Lego Group and Novozymes pay their taxes, their CEO's ,managers and workers pay theirs at a rate that dwarves what our corporations, CEO's etc. pay (if at all).
All progressives are really asking for is a tax rate like Denmark's. All we are asking is that the Uber-rich don't have the ability to buy the laws and politicians that will favor their interests at the expense of everyone else.
I'm guessing that the personal venality, vanity and greed of Danish Billionaires is no worse than Sheldon Adelson's or the Koch's or Walton's.
I'm not comfortable with demagoguing and demonizing billionaires, but passive acceptance of their status and the worship of "our betters"as if this were 18th century England sticks a whole lot worse in my craw.
They don't merit the guillotine--just a Danish-style haircut.
5
Capitalism is good. Bernie agrees with that.
Unfettered, rogue, wild-west robber-baron style capitalism is not good. Bernie agrees with that, too. Thomas Friedman does not.
3
This is so far off the mark, that I must deduce that the DNC is very nervous. Biden isn't even in control of his own faculties, how can you trust a declining mind to do anything than just maintain the misery of the masses, i.e. the current state of the majority of Americans, let alone accomplish, free healthcare, free education and pay fairness, in other words what Denmark's got. Being a Scandinavian myself I know this article is not correct, Bernie is a true Socialdemocrat, very much like the Socialdemocrats that built the Scandinavian welfare state.
2
Friedman reveals himself to be directly aligned with much of the GOP.... how can I put it? Why is he so frightened of Sanders ‘ policies when most modern democracies already live by them..?
1
"The Nordic model is an expanded welfare state, which provides a high level of security for its citizens, but it is also a successful market economy...devoted to free trade and expanding globalization." In other words, everything Trump and the Republican Party he hijacked are against. The MAGA-hats want to eliminate the social safety net, end global trade, halt all immigration and wall off the United States from the rest of the world with an alligator-filled moat.
4
If Bernie were an honest man, which he is not, he would drop the Democratic part from his billing. Bernie is a 19th century socialist stuck in the 21st century. He has never had a real job in his life outside of politics.
The man has no idea of what it's like to have to be productive at work every day.
The man is an unmitigated disaster.
1
Biden is the true Scandinavian?
I know Scandinavians and believe me Biden is no Scandinavian and never will be.
Scandinavians don't bankrupt their citizens with student loans and medical expenses.
Thomas your obsession to get rid of Trump is clouding your intelligence.
Bernie is not the enemy of Democrats but columns like this one is making his followers feel like they are.
4
Neither would get elected in Denmark!
I have been a big proponent for a long time for a Biden/Harris ticket but not any more. Kamala took a long time to endorse and could have endorsed before California primary. Biden has to pick a African-American female as his running mate. My suggestions would be in this order: Michelle Obama, Stacey Abrams or even Oprah Winfrey!
1
Gosh, Mr. Freidman -- Bernie's not advocating for eliminating Capitalism -- he's calling for a social Democracy where Corporations are NOT people, too, my friend. Why do you simply Refuse to see that?
Perhaps, this?
“It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.” --Upton Sinclair
2
“I like to pay taxes. With them, I buy civilization.”
― Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr.
3
So many straw men I lost count. Doesn't matter when you're defending the elite I suppose. Fortunately for you, you will be deceased before the ultimate effects of massive wealth disparity and climate change arrive!
2
Tom, do your really believe a man like Bernie Sanders "misunderstands" what sustains "Denmark's safety net?"
Your analysis is replete with "cherry-picking."
Of course Bernie understands the importance of entrepreneurship to thriving economies. His bete noir is the grossly unfair division of wealth and access to goods and services in America.
America is a heterogeneous society, unlike Denmark, and black and brown people are disproportionately poor and lack access to goods and services.
"Biden not only genuinely cares about the working class and the homeless — and understands the need for access to lifelong education and health care — he also knows that you don’t get there by demonizing the engines of capitalism and job creation."
The Affordable Care Act is unaffordable.
This is the most disingenuous sentiment in your piece, the suggestion that Bernie is less genuine in his sympathy for the working class and homeless than Biden. A cursory review of Bernie's political career suggests the unfairness of your rant.
Bernie maintains a home and purchased a cabin in Burlington VT through the proceeds of his book sales. Joe was the handmaiden to MBNA and other corporate interests.
For some reason Tom, you and your NYT op-ed colleagues, with the exception of Elizabeth Bruenig--the youngest among you--have identified Bernie as fair game while exempting others far more culpable, especially on the Republican side.
What gives?
Hesitant to bite the hand that feeds you?
Mr.Friedman! This is how hypocrisy works.This is why plutocrats are selfish-centered people. This why we call individualism, and this is why “hoarders “don’t want Bernie. Many Americans people like you, DNC moderates, the media made sure the ignorant get scared of Bernie. Bernie changed the tired subject , lies and promises. Why defend Corporations if most Americans that worked for them have a ridiculous health care, vacation, with zero security for their future. Capitalist will not change,, obviously we need to regulate them to make sense for every workers. American multinationals know well how they can get enormous profit from foreigner workers creating local corruption , with zero environment laws, workers protection... health packages.you name it. This why they left us behind. I say us, “ citizens of the world”. Republicans and 95% of Democrats completely accepted that, until this moment. We know well how Biden will keep things the same. Unregulated markets and financial institutions are destroying American working class and middle class, and is incredible how many people wants to keep doing that. This is obvious why they hate Bernie platform. Bernie don’t want to destroy billionaire capitalists. Bernie want to make “fair “ . He wants policies to help all citizens, giving a chance to go ahead , claiming more steps to survive with dignity and prosperity. He wants to stop Inequality but They want to continue pulling up the ladder behind.. .
I think he means in the viking pillaging sense of Scandanavian.
No one said Denmark. Norway, Sweden and Finland are the social democrat nations. And no Joe Biden is not even close. Joe will move along giving the insurance companies what they want. That’s his money backing.
Once again Friedman inverts the world to suit his definition of corporate socialism.
CNN just called Michigan for Biden. It's over for Bernie and it's over for Trump.
1
A great day for the democracy illusion, a great day for medibusines$.
1
You are going to need to do a lot more gas lighting to make me believe a man who doesn't know what day of the week it is the best bet moving forward and that you can afford 750 billion to bomb brown people, but medicare is out of the question.
1
Thomas, I'm an avid reader but this is too much. If you recognize trump as the existential threat he is, then you should know there's no need to bury Bernie's supporters (whose votes we need) under this kind of stinging rebuke, especially on a night that's got to be filled with plenty of sadness. Some even feel despair! I wholeheartedly support Biden because I think he matches up very well against trump, end of story. Thank goodness Biden possesses the decency not to spike the ball in the end zone like this: this kind of lecturing on "job creators"and "risk takers" would be catastrophic. What if we had pointed out on the night your preferred (joke) candidate ignited half a billion dollars in the cold night air just to be named honorary "King of American Samoa" for a day, that nominating yet another New York billionaire, one who personifies Wall Street culture, has a history of crudeness towards women, and three terms of unreformed "stop-and-frisk" Republicanism to his discredit, was a stupefyingly laughable howler of a blunder even to suggest? The very elements of the Democratic party you were busy teaching the real meaning of capitalism in this article would have seen Bloomberg as the confirmation and avatar of all of their fears, marking the day that Wall Street finally occupied the Democratic party and bought the nomination outright. Also for the record buying $100M of gov't bonds, that should be rated AAAA, and waiting for your gov't check isn't risk taking, it's welfare
Our problem doesn’t require socialism, it is just in need of more democracy and less racial stereotyping, inequality, corporate greed and politicians dividing us to ratchet up their control over us. The Dains figured this out a long time ago.
I lived for over 20 years in Northern Europe. This column will almost age as badly as the world being flat.
Look, Bernie lost. You got your way. Can we all be gracious and move on please...
1
1. Bernie says the US should be like Denmark
2. Author supports this notion
3. Author endorses Biden (who does not say the US should be like Denmark)
A bit over the top. Exaggerated, cherry picked and simplistic regarding socialism to get your point across and demonize Sanders. OK. But it reminded me of the idiotic demonization of Obama by the GOP for attacking "job creators"
1
It’s all on deck in attack mode against BERNIE.
1
And I would trust Trump to get us there.
Socialist policies require a backbone of capitalism to survive.
Thank you for this oped. The kernel of it is the question “where do you think jobs come from?”
Sending this to every Bernie supporter I know.
Tom:
Didn't Fareed Zakaria write essentially the same column a week before you?
One can be quite sure that Joe Biden has little or no clue about economic models other than his own Delaware as a de facto off-shore corporate haven.
3
Milton Friedman 2.0
I will not comment on Sanders but Biden would sure not fit in in Danish, or Scandinavian politics , and Mr Friedman a short chat with a Danish PM doesn’t make a person an expert on Scandinavia
Have a nice day
4
I've been reading Thomas Friedman's columns for decades and they basically all amount to "Free market = good." Well good for, you Thomas Friedman. How about, just for once, challenging your viewpoint by talking to people not like you instead of assuming you know better from the outset and then searching (in your books) for people who simply agree with you? (Yes, I have read some of your books, even though I don't agree with you generally.)
Thomas Friedman perhaps more so than any other member of the New York Times has advocated the Clinton Third Way agenda that has ravaged working-class communities. It is basically Reaganomics with socially liberal views. I don't disagree with all that he says here about Sanders, but I just don't trust Friedman and his ilk anymore. Their time is done. For the good of our country and the planet, we must support the working class, move away from fossil fuels, and make capitalism work for more of us. Friedman has continuously supported policies that harmed our world. Bernie Sanders may not be perfect, but he is attacking what needs to be attacked - and it's about time Friedman and his ilk took that seriously by looking in the mirror.
1
The problem with this, as with all Friedman columns, is that combined with Stephens and Brooks, the milquetoast Republican proved wrong on every major prediction time after time point of view, is decidedly over represented in the Times.
1
At the end of reading your reflection Mr. Friedman, the following question came to my mind: who is the real demonizer here?
One of the arguments for the Danish model of government is that the generous social safety net— healthcare, child care, education, and sick leave...—allow for a freer and more efficient society. Think about it: if you aren’t worried about paying your hospital bill, or missing work because you are sick, you are more likely to focus on your job, and maybe, just maybe, innovation.
Brooks, in an earlier column, previewed what Friedman seems to be saying here: America is best when we are all pulling together.
Bernie Sanders is just like Trump. He never studies anything, makes up things that suit his fancy and delivers it as if it was all true. God save us from these two samples
1
Terrific column based upon first hand experiences in Denmark. When do we get journalists who have first hand experiences?
Dear Mr. Friedman,
How exactly do you churn out one excellent column after the other? Everyone should read what you write. Thank you.
Thank you Thomas Friedman for your well-stated knowledge and wisdom.
Hans Frederik Jacobsen,
Hotspur was my 13th great grandfather, can I become a citizen?
Sanders doesn't demonize capitalism, he wants to regulate its excesses. Millions agree. But Friedman demonizes Sanders.
See 2 NYT op eds by Anu Partenon, Finnish journalist, lived here after marriage.
“Finland Is a Capitalist Paradise. Can high taxes be good for business? You bet.”
And
“The Fake Freedom of American Health care.”
Says “Sanders and Ocasio Cortez are demonized as dangerous radicals. In Finland, many of their ideas are normal —not particularly socialist.
Many Finns are surprised that the U.S. with its wealth and capitalist enterprise, had not set up universal public health care and tuition-free college…These are the “ bare basics required for any business-friendly nation to compete in the 21st century.”
Says “Nordics demand their governments provide high-quality public services for all citizens. This liberates businesses to focus on what they do best: business.
Then, all Finnish residents—from laborers, to managers, to the wealthy, benefit hugely from the same single-payer health care and world-class public schools.”
Says "Nordic capitalists focus on business — with negotiations with their unions — while letting citizens vote for politicians who use government for robust universal public services.”
But “U.S. capitalists slashed taxes, weakened government, crushed unions and privatized essential services in the pursuit of excess profits.”
Tom, read Partenon’s book, “The Nordic Theory of Everything: In Search of a Better Life”. Then write a column.
1
NYT. This article should be read by every american and some...
Mr Friedman knows exactly what he is talking about.american politicians except the honorable few, are not in the same league as the Danish counterparts....too much greed in USA...and too many uneducated and poor people in this country...
Biden might be the right choice, but Sanders is definitely not the one.
We have to get trump out no matter what...
So NYT we are in your ball court for more articles like this one and try somehow to educate the populace so that we never have a career gangster in the oval office again.
Bravo Mr Friedman
1
Right on, but just a week or so ago you advocated for everyone to get behind electable Bernie. Our world is moving fast, as we know {hot and flat}.
Wasn't Friedman endorsing Bloomberg like a sycophant only a few weeks ago? Now he slavers over Biden, a man who will return this country to the neoliberal incongruities of the Obama and Clinton years? This man truly has no limit to the depths of toadying he's sink to.
2
Earth to USA; Can I just get my country back?
President Biden sounds good to me.
1
Dude truly has succumbed to his own success. Please find a new cast of opinionators. This guy is done... stick a fork in him.
And I thought there was something rotten in Denmark.
In modern times the saying would be there is something orange and rotten in the White House!
This column gets Denmark exactly right -- it is a hyper-competitive market economy -- but contemporary capitalism in the United States badly wrong. Please, please stop spouting the myth of the job creator. It is an intentionally misleading stalking horse (most good jobs are at established businesses) to argue for 'deregulation' of the American economy, a political process that favors business over workers and well-financed insiders over new entrants. Ask any Danish businessman and they will tell you that the U.S. market is anything but competitive. An firm/industry's political clout in DC matters more than its competitiveness. Denmark is a competitive market economy because it has to be. The Danish market is simply too small to support the kinds of obscene rent seeking and anti-competitive behavior that are common in the U.S., and that must be brought under control ("regulated") if we are to emulate the Danish model. Your column is just as blind to the realities of present-day American capitalism as Bernie Sanders.
2
This was SO informative. Thank you.
It would be interesting to know if Danish corporate CEO's have insanely bloated salaries, and how estate/death taxes are managed.
2
I'm surprised that Tom Friedman, whose wisdom over the years I've respected, fails to realize that Sanders does not want to dismantle capitalism. He falls into the capitalism v socialism trap that roils in our political discourse. I've never heard Bernie espouse the government takeover of the means of production or have more control of prices of commodities. We have a mixed economy. He advocates for a different mix, including health care and college education having more government support, like hospitals, libraries, medical research, highways, power grids etc. He advocates for a different mix to correct abject inequality. The column plays into Republican narratives that conflate Democratic Socialism with totalitarian regimes. Fine to argue about how much of a role the government should play in healthcare. But don't expand Conservative tropes about Bernie. That said, I believe Bernie made a big mistake in choosing a label for himself, knowing that it is a lightning rod. Republicans have bad ideas with effective messaging. Good ideas can be lose traction with bad messaging.
1
Are there three billionaires in Denmark whose combined worth is equivalent to that of about half of the rest?
Bernie might not be the kind of leader we want but we need to thank Bernie for starting a conversation that most Americans considered it a taboo. Thanks to Bernie, candidates run their campaign talking about medicare for all, tax reforms, wealth tax, paid leave for families, affordable college tution. He has move the needle a little bit, let's give him credit.
3
The one criticism I have of your article, Tom, is that you try and lump big corporations in with entrepeneurs, and that is the fallacy. Most new jobs are created by small businesses, entrepeneurs, there is no doubt ( and yes, Bernie lumps them all in). The irony is that the kind of way Denmark does things, with national health care and the like, is it allows small businesses to compete for labor, bc they don't have the cost of health insurance on them.
On the other hand the inequality we have in the US is mostly due to big corporations, not entrepeneurs. Big corporations create relatively few jobs, and because they are public companies the 'activist investors' and of course their own executives do everything they can not to hire people and to keep raises nonexistent, because stock analysits hare job growtrh. The one thing Biden should look at as Bernie has is Wall Street and looking at how it works against the kind of capitalism you are talking about. Hedge funds, private equity funds, work on the operating principal of taking as much out of the company as they can as fast as they can, if Biden has half a brain he will go after those going for short term profits. Hedge Funds and Private equity funds are the domain almost entirely of the top .5% (mutual funds, pension funds and the like don't invest in those, they are long term), and going after executive compensation based in stock, which has helped suppress the wages of workers.
1
Not only does Sanders cherry-pick his factoids, but if elected he would be able to accomplish almost nothing. For one thing, the Democrats would lose the House of Representatives. Many Dems in the House fought hard to get Obamacare passed. Now the top of the ticket would be saying to throw it away in favor of Medicare for all. Their opponents would have a field day with that massive flip-flop. Thus the down-ballot candidates would be smoked.
Also, I'm willing to bet that a large number of Americans think the President writes proposed bills. He doesn't; Congress does. If the Dems lose the House and Republicans keep the Senate no Sanders-endorsed proposals will even get to the stage of being voted on. He's that divisive.
2
Sanders is not against capitalism. He is for giving working people a control on it.
3
As a first generation "Scandinavian American", I take issue with your narrow cherry picking assessment, not only of Denmark but Bernie Sanders. You begin your column with a hypothetical question for Sanders and then proceed to answer it as if you've interviewed him and gotten a definitive response. But the fact is that you and mainstream Democrats are very afraid of him and are making rash decisions and interpretations out of that fear and misunderstanding. As you and others continue to bash Bernie with bogus assumptions and conclusions, supporters are urging him to run as an Independent come November. Be careful what you wish for.
2
I don’t believe Sanders would do that (run as an Independent) to the country he loves.
I like Sanders in that I believe he's an honorable person who believes what he's saying. Yet I've been waiting all during this campaign for him to shift into the next gear: to go from telling us what he wants to fix to how he's going to do it--including that he needs a Dem congress.
This hasn't happened. He presents a set of real problems that are complicated, and the only thing I've heard so far is that all those new taxes on "the rich" will fix everything. That only goes so far, and he can't get it done by executive fiat.
It looks to me like he's made a decision to continue stressing how unfair some of the systems are in order to stay with an emotional appeal to people who believe that if a candidate just has enough fervor, he or she will be able to make their wishes come true. Unfortunately, that's not the case.
For centuries, most change starts with extreme ideas then finally occurs through center left actions. Sanders and Biden, respectively, fit that paradigm. I'm grateful to both of them.
1
Taking money out of politics, increasing corporate tax rates, making the richest companies pay fair share of their taxes in the first place, increasing marginal tax rates for incomes above specific level, using deficit--if necessary--to pay for the things that Danes enjoy as a human right, making US more like Denmark (still a "hyper-competitive" capitalist economy, but with a strong safety net) .... what a dark, evil, authoritarian world that would be. Criticising Sanders by erecting randian strawmen such as the one about "job creators who maxed out their credit cards" or that he is anti-democratic (Brooks, Stephens) is pure Bretibart-style propaganda. Krugman's recent columns on Sanders are much sharper pointing at the flaws that Sanders campaign should have done something about but did not.
1
One of today's political pathologies in America is a right wing embodied in the Republican Party that refuses to acknowledge that social wealth is generated by everybody and not just those at the top of the food chain. Many of those at the top believe, and support politics for, the proposition that they should have the whole pie and not simply the lion's share.
With policies that assure human dignity to Americans who live close to the economic trenches -- such as workers, customers and pensioners -- those at the tip of the pyramid are in no substantive way demeaned. They still have their yacts, trophy houses and vacation retreats. Power to them if they've earned it, but not ALL power to them at the cost of everybody else's health, education and welfare.
The Nordic countries understand this. I have lived in one such country (Finland). There, the social fabric is steely strong; all citizens have access to dignified participation in their own governance. Wealthier Finns do not suffer unduly and those of more modest means are kept out of the ditches.
I know Germany, and I suspect Denmark, Sweden, Norway and the Netherlands among most others, have high levels of entrepreneurship. Much higher than the US.
Part of the reason undoubtedly lies in the high levels of education and training (not just college bound, but craft, trade and job training - by state schools at low or no cost not fly by night rip-offs. No lingering school debt.)
The second would be the existence of a true social safety net. If I try and fail, I don't lose my home and means of subsistence. I can "...pick myself up, dust myself off, and start all over again." This truly encourages self-sufficiency and risk taking. Not a paradise for the unmotivated, fertile ground for those who will plant the seed.
1
Peter Hoeg, the Danish novelist, shows us a contrasting underside to this somewhat rosy view of Denmark, however. His marvelous Smilla's Sense of Snow: A Novel shows that official Denmark can be as devious and smoothly dishonest as any establishment anywhere. Borderliners and The Quiet Girl portray really wicked attempts at imposing uniformity on children. That Hoeg has not won the Nobel Prize is, year after year, a most unpleasant surprise. His exquisite comic timing, intricate plotting, free-range imagination and critical acuity stand tall in contemporary literature. I like Denmark enormously but, like every other human creation, it needs to be held up to the light once in a while. Peter Hoeg does that. Mr.Friedman is, as always, trying to perform a public service with his writing. But I for one would appreciate a column written after he has read Peter Hoeg. Last, while Bernie's indictment of CEOs and corporations is sweeping, any equally sweeping endorsement of them is also off the mark. The truth is more complex, and the virtue of Sanders is that he leads us to think about the role of capital and capitalists in society.
I find myself somewhat in the middle of the comments on this column. On the one hand, I do agree that Sanders comes across as a bit heavy handed on wealth. On the other hand, I also believe that his primary intend is to elevate the discussion of the type safety net Scandinavian countries have in place. He hasn't advocated state ownership of productive capacity, nor central economic planning, at least as far as I can tell.
That said, we are kidding ourselves if we compare our nation to those in Scandinavia, just as Friedman points out here. Our society is vastly more diverse - culturally, economically, educationally. In years past our diversity was our strength, whereas now cynical interests have for decades used it to turn us one against the other. We need to rediscover that strength, before it's too late. And Job One is removing Trump from power. And I do believe Biden is best positioned to accomplish that.
1
If Bernie Sanders wanted to live by his ideals he could (1) give at least 10% of his income to charitable causes; and (3) he could stop misleading the public when he says Medicare for All would save money and not hurt the middle class. The current salary of a US Senator is $174,000 plus generous benefits. While he is barred from earning more than $26,100 in outside income (15% rule), income from writing books is not capped. Perhaps Bernie would like to turn one of his three homes into a shelter for victims of abuse.
This superb article should be mandatory reading in every civics course in America.
In addition to the (entirely fair) punishing analysis of Sanders' demonization of capitalism, it might have been helpful for Friedman to make at least a passing reference to the equally damaging demonization of government by the right (starting with Reagan's infamous assault on "the government").
As Friedman writes, we need both private enterprise and effective government equally in our country; e pluribus unum.
2
I have in India during the Nehru administration in India. Nehru a professed socialist introduced Soviet style five year state planning for industrial progress. India built large steel mills and power plants. But he introduced myriad rules and regulations that institutionalized corruption and graft in every sphere. That corruption has choked the life currently, a point glossed over by two Nobel economists in their writings. I have lived in Finland, a country of high taxes and egalitarianism. But Finland is also great for start up. companies and business. Like Nehru, Bernie lives in the past and his surrogate AOC in her youthful exuberance ignores to learn from the experience of those countries.
@Mr C India is all about jugaad not socialism.
You wrote the entire column w/o mentioning that Danish equivalent of E Pluribus Unum in Denmark, the hygge. Sounds like hug, sort of is like a hug, but means to Danes a sense of being comfortable, at home. Your clarification as to the closer definition of Denmark in its social and economic methods was excellent. Bernie found his voice perhaps at about the same time Kennedy, I believe, knocked the income tax rate for inheritance tax down from the high of 55% to the level before Trumpf knocked it down more, or 38? or whatever it is currently.
I favored Sanders, not because I believed his policies would be put in place lock, stock and barrel. But because his commitment to them would be able to wrest necessary concessions from the financial elite that, up to now, they have been unwilling to agree to and have fought lost, stock and barrel. However, Sanders’ ideas have resonated enough with the American electorate that a change in the direction of Democratic Party has been fostered and — temporarily at least — been secured. The Party’s enunciated principles today look more like those of Sanders, than they do of Clinton. If Biden, who is steadily becoming the presumptive nominee, is to win in November, he will have to reach out and convince the “Sanders wing” of the Party that he and the latter really have turned that corner. If not, he will lose and Trump will get another four years to further dismantle what the Founders and subsequent generations have built. It’s that simple.
324
@John A. Figliozzi
And I favored Warren because while I agree Sanders' heart has always been in the right place, I think he — more than any other candidate running this cycle — would be LEAST able to get anything done. He has shown he does not play well with others.
With Warren out, I will reluctantly support Biden, who was my second-least favorite. But that's democracy.
52
@John A. Figliozzi - I hope that final thought is not one shared by the average Sanders voter.
How does 4 more years of Trump get you what you want, especially if, as you say, the Democratic party's principles look so much like those of Sanders?
Continuing to work within the party structure to advance your preferred outcomes would probably lead to actual success realizing them, no?
27
@John A. Figliozzi No, because of the Electoral College, it's not that simple. The fact is that if not a single Sanders supporter voted for Biden, he would still get the electoral votes of your state and mine. And the same is true of California and Illinois - that's 3 of the 6 most populous states.
So the picture is actually rather complicated.
9
Well, to begin with, Bernie would be your average center-right candidate here in Denmark, probably a candidate for the Liberals. Electable, but yells too much. Not the way we do it here. Of course, his gun stance would be outrageous here, but so would the stance of 99% of American politicians. Biden, with his refusal to consider Medicare for All, would be a laughing stock to us if he were to run on a platform like that. Wayyyy outside the Overton window, not to mention Republicans, who make every Dane want to scream their lungs out. I've never spent a night in a hospital, but sometimes I wonder how much it would have cost in the U.S. to just have gotten my split lip stitched up that one time. I simply cannot get it into my head that it would cost anything. I'm a student in Copenhagen, I receive approximately $820 a month in study grants (not a loan), and I pay 37% of my pay in taxes, which is the lowest rate. We're doing okay in our (capitalist) social democracy. Novo Nordisk is good, Maersk is good, and Bernie's ideas are good.
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@Mads Lyshøj An important note regarding Medicare for All. Most Democrats agree it is the preferred end goal, the differences in opinions come from; how do we get there, how fast should that transition be, and is the government capable of taking up the task?
Implementing such policy for 5.8 million people is simply not the same as doing so for 300 million especially when a system is already in place.
I get very frustrated anytime a M4A supporter pins any Democrat who simply asks these questions or tries to support some gradual plan as "advocating for people to die".
58
This response strikes me as authentic and informative.
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@Mads Lyshøj
Electable by the liberals? As a fellow dane I disagree, Bernie Sanders fits more in to democratic socialist party SF, and not the social democrats and far from either the social liberals or the liberals. But this is a hypothetical and theoretical discussion:-)
However, in a way it is absolutely ridiculous to compare the federal American political system to Denmark. Denmark is a homogeneous nation of 5,8 million people, it has less inhabitants than say the state of Massachussets. It is much more prudent to compare what happens at a state-level in the US to what happens in Denmark, and what happens nation-wide in the US to what happens in the EU and its member countries on an overall level.
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The problem is Biden doesn’t want to get us there. He wants to return us to the past. He’s running a campaign of nostalgia.
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@Kate
Absolutely,which is why his base support comes from people of retirement age.
9
@Kate you can’t replace the present without a plan that appeals more than Biden’s: an enhanced status quo without Trump. That may be a modest standard, but Bernie’s vague rhetoric does not meet it. If it somehoww we’d did, he would have a shot at victory. Too bad for all of us!
8
@Kate Public option, progress on renewables, debt free community college...read about him please. Biden can actually take steps forward.
40
Thanks Tom. That's about it in a nutshell. I would call the Denmark model "compassionate capitalism". Capitalism becomes untenable when its is grounded on runaway greed and favors just a small percentage of a population. Capitalism also fails when there is not a sufficient safety net to protect our most vulnerable citizens. Danish capitalism is just about the right balance.
Many of Sander's followers do not understand the difference between socialism ( an ideology and an economic system ) and social ( an adjective , as in social democracy) . Sanders ( who knows better) uses the two interchangeably when it is convenient.
1
The basic difference between the Nordic Model and the US is culture, not economics (on which I have posted before)
The Nordic model is that we all sit in the same boat.
The US model is everyone for her/himself
From the "we all sit in the same boat" flows a policy that tries to minimize inequality by massive transfer payments from the winners in a globalized economy to the left behind.
Mr. Sanders gets it. Mr Biden does not.
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@Woof
Friedman is pointing out that, unlike the Danes, Sanders doesn't know, or even seem to care, where that boat we are all on comes from or is going to. He is too busy rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic.
44
@Woof In America? It's a pipe dream. The Nordic model is successful because it is nationalist -- a shared nation and ancestral heritage. That is, racially homogeneous. There are many reasons why the "I got mine" mentality is so prevalent in America; race is a big one and too many people refuse to acknowledge it.
35
@Woof everyone for her/himself.....unless of course there's a hurricane, or floods, or somebody needing a loan or your spouse is murdered or......
15
Mr. Friedman - Perfect. absolutely perfect. Bernie ignores the fully evident wide extent of Free Enterprise in our nation. The millions of small businesses in our towns, cities and countryside. Entrepreneurs abound. Risk takers all. Hard working, determined, innovative. You can see them every day as you drive through our neighborhoods. They have my full respect. The Denmark model is a worthy goal. We are not going to get there via the Socialism model Bernie touts. Liberalism is the correct route, and we started down that road already. Let it continue. Incremental change is inevitable. Revolutionary change is not the answer.
4
Tell that to the people sleeping on the sidewalk. I’m sure they’d be pleased to hear that incremental change is what we need and if they only be patient and wait twenty years, they might get a tiny bit of help. I’m sure that will go over well.
2
Here we go again.
The Bret Stephens, David Brooks, and Thomas Friedman tag team sends another missile trying to destroy the Sanders campaign. Clearly the objective is to prevent a Sanders presidency and the changes to US foreign policy that would result. Respect for international law, UN resolutions, and human rights conventions would be a disaster for the country they are working for.
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@Greg
Not a convincing reply to Freidman. Instead, you engage in conspiracy accusation. That has long been the response of Sanders' supporters to criticisms of what he proposes. That's not engaging in an honest debate.
111
And the aforementioned guys were all for invading Iraq. Bernie was not.
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@blgreenie You are saying that they above mentioned--and most of the op ed writers-- haven't been doing that? What have you been reading? It's not paranoia when they are in fact after you.
29
Refreshing to hear a common sense explanation. I am sick of being vilified by friends and colleagues when I point out these obvious flaws in Bernie's thinking. The idea that you can make everything free just by taxing a few dozen billionaires is clearly nonsense - do the simple arithmetic and there is a huge gap. The bulk of taxes come from all the small businesses (like mine) that create 10 or 20 jobs. We are not all greedy crooks - I have on several occasions taken out loans to make payroll (and payroll taxes). I love what I do and am happy to create a few jobs along the way. We also give paid leave, sick leave and other benefits. I don't think that Joe Biden is the ideal candidate by a long chalk. However, Bernie is worse that Trump by many reasonable measures. It seems that the voting public has the sense to see through his bluster. MI will tell.
954
@RW The income tax in Denmark DOES max out at 55.8% though, which is far higher than in the US. The US has had a top income tax bracket at least that high in the past, and it has been good for the government. There is no good reason or excuse for it to be as low as it is now.
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@Daniel The point isn’t that the wealthy pay enough or shouldn’t pay more. The point is that everyone pays more.
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@John Yes, except the wealthy should pay especially more, that is the whole point of a progressive tax system. Otherwise we'd just have a flat tax.
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Here's a big difference between Denmark and the US; we are assaulted all day every day with propaganda stating that government is the enemy, government is the problem, not the solution. All GOP politicians launch their campaigns with vows to cut taxes, especially on the wealthy.
Denmark practices a different brand of capitalism than what is now practiced here: companies there feel a responsibility not only to shareholders, but to workers, the community and the environment. Danes are willing to pay high taxes to achieve benefits for the greater good. Here, the wealthy and their GOP allies would love to make massive cuts to our already skimpy social safety net.
Mr. Friedman sounds like a Republican.
2
Nice job trashing that straw man you built.
3
I don't understand the reason why Sanders picked up Denmark in first place.
All Scandinavian countries operate more or less in the same democratic method of free enterprise system. We don't call any of these countries socialist or social democratic .
Although I assume that Sanders is not against private businesses but only against greed and the minority ruling over the majority . The middle class is disappearing and the 1 percent rules and gets richer .
All Scandinavian countries have social security that makes Americans just wonder how they do it. Paying taxes and more taxes. That is the answer. But in the end our standard of living is quite high and everybody gains.
Denmark , Norway and Sweden are kingdoms. They support their royals and that means more taxes too.
Why Sanders chose Denmark stays a mystery in my mind.
Our Republic has a very flawed design rewarding geography, the rural, and small states over the large. Because of that our government doesn’t represent the views of the majority of the public.
Instead it is often divided and the Republican Party
has become a reactionary force that prevents even modest progressive reforms. It maintains its power with voter suppression, gerrymandering, demagogic propaganda, and appeals to White Evangelical Christians with reliance on issues like abortion, gun ownership, a Conservative judiciary, and anti immigration bigotry. Their solution to every problem are tax cuts with benefits directed to the ruling elite and deregulation. It is a toxic brew and they are most interested in preventing any success for a more progressive agenda through exploiting government dysfunction and cynicism.
1
Apples and oranges - rotten apples and fresh oranges. As Friedman points out, Danish society is small and homogenized. And cooperative. Sanders’ anger and confiscatory attitude arise out of the relentless, entitled greed of American capitalism supported by generations of Republican tax cuts for the rich and demonization of the poor. I don’t see how anyone even begins to change that culture. Violent revolution doesn’t seem like a good idea. Perhaps a political revolution in which enlightened Progressives complete dominate the government. Or, possibly, a complete economic collapse. I’m not the only one who imagines a new feudalism, but that seems to be pretty close to where we are headed.
Utter nonsense! Danish corporations pay taxes on their incomes. GE and Apple among other American corporations do not pay taxes. Indeed, some get rebates. The 2016 tax code changes benefited annual incomes of over $500M. Yesterday, our president said we need to have a payroll tax reduction for the workers who did not benefit from the 2016 changes. Warren Buffet, with crocodile tears, laments paying taxes at a lower rate than his office minions. Both Republican and Democratic parties are structured to protect and grow the oligarchy. Our industrial base has been so hollowed-out that rank and file Americans are too afraid to protest. Except Bernie's supporters. They have nothing to lose.
1
Let us consider some of these Danish "risk takers". They focus on business.
Let us consider American "risk takers". They focus on business, too. And their personal health care costs. And perhaps the healthcare costs of their employees. And perhaps the kids' child care costs. And future education costs. And retirement. Lot of really smart, talented people are cowardly, and will not risk their families futures, so do not even try.
Those who study such things say that Denmark has 3 times the socio-economic mobility that the US does.
Danes have a better economy and, on average, better lives. But then, they are "risk takers".
Not like Americans. Hence, Tom Friedman. And Joe Biden.
This is ridiculous. I am from Denmark and I cannot imagine how Biden would win over Sanders in a theoretical primary in Denmark. In 2016, the Democrats abroad primary went to Sanders. Voting ends on March 10, so let us see what the result will be in 2020. I guess living abroad and experiencing the freedom and safety that universal healthcare, free education, and paid maternity and paternity leave (for up to 1.5 year in Sweden) brings you, makes you wish the same for your family and friends in the USA. My family-in-law worries about how to pay of school debt and how to pay for the care for their parents when the money from their house has been depleted by memory care or hospice. All I worry about is the the weather. Here it is going to rain as usual.
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I don’t know why anyone is anxious to compare us to Denmark. Denmark has 5.7 million people which is comparable to approximately one sixth of the population of California. What works in that small population won’t necessarily have any bearing on what might work in a Country as huge as the U.S. Let’s just stop with the ridiculous comparisons.
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@Bodyman it's not just Denmark but the Nordics and several countries in Europe. And the basics like universal healthcare or paid leave are more or less ubiquitous in the Western economies. The U.S. is not so exceptional and special that it can't learn from other countries.
What an absurd argument you're making. We need the social net in order to encourage people to be risk takers who boot strap businesses. Sanders isn't demonizing entrepreneurial spirit whatsoever, he's advocating for a government structure that supports people to do those things in a fair way. And final point: starting a business doesn't always involve going into debt or spending your savings...
3
The difference is that Scandinavian corporations don't run the government, or run the economy into the ground. Americans have GOOD REASON to despise and distrust American corporations, which are dishonest, tax evaders, exploit workers, and destroy the environment (Monsanto etc.), but don't pay to clean it up. Please don't talk apples and oranges. American corporations have crushed and destroyed America. I would support any leader that would destroy American corporations - and happily welcome Scandinavian corporations!
1
Hard work is bad. Right. Risking your own capital to make money. Horrible. The USA wouldn’t be where it is today without it.
Is the system perfect? No chance. It has a lot of room for improvement. But for those who chastise the rich solely for being rich, don’t complain if you can’t find a job because they decided not to put their money, Time and experience on the line.
1
"…the gross and widening inequality we see around us. Sanders sincerely wants to eliminate that. Alas, so do a lot of us.”
"Alas"?
I'm rather glad that a lot of us want to eliminate the gross and widening inequality.
I kind of think you underplay the GREED endemic in our system and in so many of our actions in the US.
When I listen to what Senator Sanders says I hear someone who is fundamentally asking for less greed and more equality; for more cooperation and less competition.
I don't hear someone who hates all entrepreneurs.
I think you have exaggerated and mischaracterized him.
But perhaps we both are seeing what we want to see.
You will find in general Danes are not big on bling. I think the Rolex-BMW-Let me show You my Ego purchases.
They also are very socially aware, from the richest to the poorest.
Americans have been fed the We are All Individuals, Everyman for himself and it is a dog eat dog world.
Notice how our politicians all are fear mongers, and unfortunately so are all our news organizations.
1
This is simply too simplistic.
Again, Sanders is dead-on with his understanding of our
wage-slave servitude to the Corporate bosses and our
need for many crucial changes in direction, and that a moderate Biden Presidency will not get us there.
But sadly Bernie to just too vulnerable to attack.
Most of us these days see all of these negative, anti-socialist
postings in social media and exaggerated glimpses into
Bernie's past, blowing statements made thirty five years ago way out of proportion and distorting and lying about him.
It is frustrating to take some of them to task with Snopes and Politifact only to have them counter with criticism of the truthfulness of well-recognized fact-check sites.
More Trumpist truth denial and fake-news distortions.
So now, most moderate Dems are so disgusted with Trump that they choose Biden as a safer, more secure way to defeat him, get him out of our government.
It's a case of first things first.
1
This excellent column by Tom Friedman, using the economic system and social safety net of Denmark as an example, leads the thoughtful reader to two different conclusions about Bernie Sanders, neither of which is favorable to the senator from Vermont.
On the one hand, the stubbornly inflexible socialism of Bernie Sanders reflects a man who lives in a fantasy world, foolishly believing that the world of business and corporations is the enemy, and that the benefits of free healthcare, free college education and free early retirement simply by levying hefty taxes on corporations and the products and services they sell.
On the other hand, Bernie Sanders may be more dishonest than foolish. He may know that the only way to achieve the Utopian world he preaches about at his rallies is for the people to own the means of production in a collective state purer than anything existing under the old Soviet Union or under Mao. If Sanders believes that, he must hide it from the young idealists who applaud his speeches.
Joe Biden can and will improve the lot of Americans, and he doesn’t need to tear down America to accomplish that feat. Biden can win in November, and he will end the nightmare of Donald Trump.
1
Denmark's "secret sauce" is its rejection of ostentation and "every-man-for-himself" Horatio Alger--type nonsense, along with its emphasis on contentment rather than happiness through acquisitiveness. This attitude toward life is called "hygge," and it is very, very far from free-market capitalism.
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This is a lot of nonsense that merely supports the current status quo that Bernie Sanders is fighting against. There is no question that Mr. Friedman is taking liberties with Bernie’s positions and ignoring all the incredible harm Big Business has done and continues to do to America. Mr. Friedman gets it all wrong in attributing Joe Biden as the person to advocate change. He has had a lifetime of merely supporting our current corrupt business model of empowering the wealthy at the expense of the poor and middle class. Who is he kidding!
Keep this in mind: simply removing Bernie Sanders from the equation leaves an entire machinery generated by the right whose purpose has been to denigrate labor unions, demonize "tax and spend liberals," make a racist appeal to white voters, and otherwise appeal to the innate bigotry of the human species. This behavior has driven "social trust" down in the US far more than anything for which an unrealistic progressive movement is responsible. And they're still here.
1
Does anyone acknowledge that the the corporate-capitalist industrial-consumerist model is utterly unnatural & suicidal?
We only need Sanders & the revolt of big Labor because of the inherent abuses of Big Business.
Big business only 'succeeded' in the Capitalist age through extractive exploitation.
Think for a minute, how your beloved 'job creator' model would've fared if business ever had to pay the real costs of its exploitation.
I'd have preferred a model described in Naomi Klein's 'The Take', where everyone in an enterprise had ownership & made the same.
But try that in the corrupted American model where even workers bought into the fallacy: They don't want the burden of cooperative collectives, they want their industrial wage-slave 'jobs, jobs, jobs', a paycheck & a fat truck & fat consumerist junk & fat, industrial junk food. They don't want the responsibility of making a business, ore a wholesome livelihood, actually work.
One of the greatest crimes of WW2 is the postwar world of industrial consumerism.
Gone was any self-reliance, the garden, canning, local anything. Gone are local artisans & farmers.
Your myth of of consumer-capitalism & 'free trade' was built on petro-exploitation & offshored slave labor.
You think it's so great, but its a fallacy, destined to fail.
Healthcare is the bottleneck. It is unaffordable, or eats up a huge chunk of your income, or pushes you to bankruptcy. And it costs businesses exorbitant amounts of time and $, which in turn suppresses wages. It traps people. It is THE #1 issue we need to solve. Five percent of your income sounds right, I’d take that deal. Public option or M4A, we need to join the rest of the developed world.
We are the country of small dreams, the country of every man for himself, the country of winners and losers, the country of adulation of the biggest takers in society, not the biggest givers.
We are forever the country that would rather just forget about those less fortunate than ourselves, those who are the victims of endemic and systemic racism, those who but for fortune go you or I.
We are forever the nation of lauding the greatness of our ancestors, their bravery and their foresight,
"With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation's wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations."
But now we are the small men, the hollow men, the quick buck men, the snarly aggrieved men, the too cowardly to dream men.
To stay as we are, in our glittering hovels, never daring to think of the nightmares we shall bequeath to those who come after us.
What man will be proud of this point in history when our highest aspiration is to do no more than rid ourselves of a buffoon conman who stole the throne.
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Frustrating. Centralized power, undue influence by corporations- especially leading media outlets, post Fairness Doctrine, are wrong. A strong social safety net allows people to take risks.
Sanders is right to bring these ethical challenges to the fore. He seems to have no idea or strategy on how to implement them or on how to govern beyond the sexy rallying cry of "We need a revolution!"
Trump is wrong and Sanders is wrong to demonize groups of people and target "others" to rally supporters. Pointing at intellectuals and elites as targets of opprobrium was done in Europe in the '30's to bad effect. One calls out "The Deep State" and one calls out "The Establishment." The distinction is blurry. His populism that depends on an enemy he lately suggests includes all who vote against him is just ugly.
I would vote for Sanders over Trump. Trump is a vile, lying con-man debasing gov't and honesty for his self promotion at the expense of his fellow citizens– his marks. The need to defeat him is paramount. Sanders must recognize and act on this threat rather than just using it to promote his campaign. He must get out of the race now that Tuesday's results leave him no chance to beat Biden. His presence can only weaken Biden, divide the Dems and help Trump.
If Sanders cares to serve justice and work against racism and inequality he has one path forward. He must choose Biden or Trump, just as I would have to choose in a vote between Sanders & Trump.
2
Yje DNC conduct has been disgraceful. I don't care for the way they forced other candidates to drop out and support Biden.
Biden is a frail old man who apparently is not capable of standing up for a debate since the Dems have allowed candidates to sit for the debate. We know it is not Bernie Sanders who is the weak one. Look at how they have shortened his speeches out of fear of Biden's fumbling mistakes. Remember the man you saw in the first four debates is the REAL Joe Biden and the DNC is afraid that the REAL Joe Biden will emerge again.
1
Wow! So much falsehood in such a short essay!
First- does Friedman not consider Ben and Jerry, two of Bernie's major spokespeople, entrepreneurs? Or does a capitalist need to be a "centrist" or a Trumpist to qualify?
Second, minimalizing the value of the safety net on a society is totally misleading. The majority of wealthier Danish citizens who pay 50% in income taxes are not complaining, because Denmark has made sure that they have cradle to grave social security. This choice is the basic, fundamental right that Bernie promotes. Trust this traveler, you will not see Danish people homeless, panhandling, unable to survive without a car, going into medical debt, or making choices about food or rent.
Nothing in Biden's resume, platform, or statements indicates any intent to move in a direction of securing the lives and health of all
Americans.
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After 7 years living in Sweden and Denmark I do believe their model is the eventual future of all modern nations. It’s the logical outcome of a country realizing that the development of its people is its best resource and wellspring of wealth. Friedman’s assessment is correct until he goes overboard on Bernie bashing.
Mr Sanders is justifiably enraged at the same gross inequities and blatant thefts that disgust my Swedish wife and I about the present state of America. Making him out to be clueless crank does none of us any service nor does it foster the communal engagement needed to dismantle the Right’s propaganda machine.
Biden? The guy whose reiterated a number of times over years, he’s willing to reduce Social Security benefits? Whose been the cheer leader for wars of “Regime Change”? You’ve got to be kidding me. I’ve come to share the late George Carlin’s views about politics, “it doesn’t make any difference how you vote”. I think I’ll just sit out this election.
Mr. Friedman, I don't disagree with you on the need for risk takers. However, the culture of a big company CEO with a huge pay check, and even bigger checks when ousted, is insane. The CEO of Boeing departed in disgrace with 60 million dollars. How is he a risk taker? He is not unique. How do you justify these payouts?
I think Mr. Friedman owes an apology to Bernie Sanders and readers like me for insulting our intelligence. Painting Bernie as some sort of Soviet style socialist, when in fact he does support the Nordic model, or if you prefer; the Rhenish capitalist model, is misinformation that could have been sourced out of Moscow. Perhaps even more insulting is positioning Biden as a True Scandinavian. What a joke that is! If one did not know he was a Democrat, looking at his record would easily put him in the pseudo Republican category! Unfortunately, Bernie made a mistake when he positioned himself as a Democratic Socialist in a country where the label will allow some to put you in the Vladimir Lenin category. As expected, the political assassination by the media and Dem. establishment has succeeded. What's remarkable is that Biden is irrelevant and yet another weak status quo Dem. candidate in the pocket of Wall Street and corporations. The real measurement in November will be whether Trump supporters in Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin are still with him and what percentage of the Dem. party electorate will vote! If Biden wins, the country can go back to sleep and enjoy some minor rehab. for 4 years...same old! More middle class/working class Americans will get very angry over time feeling the government/our "democracy" no longer works for them. Extremes will develop, on the right and the left. In despair, they will look for simple answers. Dictatorships provide those!
And there is a third even more delicate reason it works in Denmark: trust and solidarity, based on...cultural homogeneity.
1
I remember when you sat down with employees and the CEO of a Fortune Ten company in Dallas and talked about how great it was for America to give corporations big fat huge corporate tax cuts. I really don’t know what happened to your humanity.
1
Nonsense, Joe's a lot more like Trump and the Republicans than Sanders, this column is "moderate" Democrat status quo gaslighting, from wealthy democrats who don't want their taxes to go up to fair levels.
Trump will go after the Hunter Biden Burisma socialism straight away, where a DINO political fatcat's son gets an $80,000? per year job after a Ukranian arm-twisting earlier than Trump's. Biden's been in politics for the money like the Clintons for decades. Both Biden and Trump soil the American electorate, corrupt the American voting public. This is no purity test question, its who has the American working and lower middle class's backs more, Biden or Sanders? Who tells fewer lies to the public?
Sanders over the decades has been much more consistent on humane forms of government and less of a warmonger. Who would provide better healthcare and college education and more likely insist on living wages for the millions who work gigs without humane benefits at Walmart, Amazon, fast food franchises, Uber, Lyft, Home Depot, Kroger, or uncountable smaller businesses. Who'd really treat the African and Hispanic working classes and America's young voters better? Who would cut Social Security and Medicare first? Make schools safe for our kids again?
OK fellow boomer, this left leaning Democrat won't vote for either Biden or Trump, based on principle. The DNC and their media minions manipulate outcomes for the Democratic donor class more than our old foes in Russia and Red China.
1
Unfortunately, the chief class warfarists in America are its executive-rentier class who have rejected accommodations with unions, consumer interests, the welfare state, and regulation. Not only that, they hate the free market itself, with their illegal wage/price fixing and relentless lobbying to destroy what's left of antitrust. Their extremist training camps are business schools, legal societies, and think tanks that indoctrinate the next generation of right wing class warfarists.
1
Sanders's frustrated supporters, in a blind rage after once again being marginalized by American voters too stupid to see their truth, are going to torpedo Biden the same way they did Hillary in '16, giving the election once again to Trump. I cannot work up anything like outrage toward Sanders's acolytes ... just a sad resignation that they, too, are my fellow citizens. Sad, as well, that such charity is something that the Bernie Bros are unable to offer those who disagree with them.
1
What a terrible column! Mr. Friedman exaggerates Sanders' opinions, misunderstands democratic socialism, hears only the opinions of a few representatives of Danish society, and so on. Democratic socialism isn't against innovation; it is against the abuses of corporations and capitalists (i.e. those who own the factories, buildings, tools, etc., without in so many cases having produced or invented anything at all), and the need of a democratic government to make certain that all members of the community have what they need to lead a productive and fulfilling life. Capitalism thrives on greed. We democratic socialists prefer compassion.
How much more do Danish CEOs make than the average Danish worker?
Bertrand Russell on returning from the Soviet Union thought that the communists were motivated by hatred of the bourgeoisie and not love of the worker. Anything he thought that was motivated by hatred was doomed. So with Bernie’s campaign.
Wow. Someone decided to channel their inner Sean Hannity with this one. Several paragraphs dedicated to demonizing a blatant mischaracterization of Sanders' record, message, and vision, followed by 3 sentences insisting that Biden is "better" because "he is."
The least persuasive argument I've read since trump's most recent tweet, and one equally dedicated to ensuring his reelection.
Biden is a joke of human, let alone as a candidate for president, and his strategy of cut-and-pasting DNC talking points will be suffocated by Fox's coverage Hunter's investigation.
1
Mr. Friedman, you are cherry picking Bernie Sanders. Denmark has a flourishingmarket economy? Denmark finances a balanced society through fair taxation? I think these are the issues Bernie stands for when visioning a new America and he says it out loud. His opponent has made it his top priority to get elected, what happens aterwards is anybodys guess.
1
Friedman's happy dance is a hymn of relief for the Establishment.
Corporate media came through for Big Money.
Trump declared war on MSM and won. Heaping contempt on them and bypassing them to talk to the public directly, his clown car of non-stop entertainment has mesmerized a critical mass of the public.
Trump's immunity to their attempts at revenge has caused them to target a seemingly softer alternative: Bernie's Progressive Movement. Guess his talk of dismantling information monopolies along with other predators, raised their enormous panic and bloodlust. COngratulations to Bloomberg, Murdoch, Network TV, and NY Times-- and Trump. The rogue running the table so far
1
Thank you for this great column.It should be required reading for all citizens.
great column...Haven't we had enough chaos and disrespect. Bernie sounds just like Trump....blaming everyone else for his loss. It's not the media, young people or corporations.....it's his platform. No-one has the stamina for another Revolution. Step down Bernie and throw your support behind Joe Biden.
1
Another shaky and inaccurate straw man developed by Mr. Friedman to demolish Mr. Sanders’ standing as a respectable choice.
Can anyone say what Biden stands for? Incrementalism is killing us.
1
Sanders has placed himself in the position that Friedman sees him in with the nonsense language (such as corrupt, establishment, bought, etc.) that he uses to state his positions. Talk about policy, Bernie!
I am a Canuck living near the border and I possibly watched my last MSNBC and Bernie wasn't my number one pick until it was Bernie and Biden.
I listened to all the gaslighting and see Thomas Friedman 's column and the real facts are never addressed. I lived in America and the facts that matter is the America least blessed by God is the America that needs science, math and engineering and technology the most they will not vote for Sanders and they will not vote for Democrats.
South Carolina, Mississippi and Alabama lead the way. They are followed by Louisiana, Tennessee , Oklahoma, Indiana, Wyoming, South Dakota,and now Florida. That is 20%+ of the US Senate making evolution pretty well impossible and I know I left out an Iowa or two.
Bernie cannot win nor can any Democrat because much of America does not believe in an America where church and state are separate.
This ain't Scandinavia but we have a booming economy and a future as promising as Scandinavia. We take care of everybody and provide healthcare, access to education, and a relatively secure future for everyone. Our government is democratic and combines democratic socialism, liberalism and British preThatcher conservatism.
Our world is however 4.5 billion years old and in Quebec it is we the people that will determine our future and that of our children not a corruption of my ancestor's sacred texts.
Get the gods out of the places you determine the future!
Without evolution all there is is a past.
2
Really good article, but the lingering "Flat Earth" ideas need a bit more squelching. Balance is right - but the world is out of balance, because we can't seem to climb down from the globalization mania.
Biden is the best we've got - and I hope he can turn the tide and get Democrats to understand where things have come off the rails. Failing that, Republicans - Trump and other future fascists - will show us all, why oceans are good things to have.
And this idea that we, the giant, can pass through the same door as the Scandinavians is not a good starting point for any debate. Let's be real!
This is all very silly. The Nordic countries have as their primary interest their citizens. They protect them from day 1 and give them everything they need to succeed. Whether they choose to become entrepreneurs or not is their choice-not based on income and education. This has made for a safe, healthy and happy populace with lots of independent thinkers-
Spotify
Teenage Engineering
IKEA
Vattenfall
Electrolux
Volvo
Saab
Cheap Monday
1
There are lots of us who question if the Danes should really be considered Scandinavian, at least these days, Dr. Friedman.
1
Mr Friedman as usual has drunk the centrist KoolAid and it is getting really tiresome. Your explanation that the Scandinavian model is a market economy with a robust welfare system is far more needed by all the Republicans who equate government intervention with socialism - not Sanders who knows this already.
You are probably right that his failure to articulate the value of markets to expanding prosperity has allowed the socialist label to stick to him to the point of toxicity. But if you don't acknowledge that rural white America is hurting from a lack of opportunity, that the Banks greedily crashed the economy and destroyed jobs and got no punishment for it, that Enron imploded taking the pensions of thousands of its employees with it, that drug companies gouge the sick putting profit over wellbeing and on and on all indicating a rigged and unjust system, then you are not helping to save capitalism. Your victory dance over Sanders's fall is unseemly and short-sighted, the system needs an overhaul with or without Sanders.
1
Heard Biden on MSNBC's O'Donnell show last night. Biden was incoherent and blathering.
He does not have the vigor or chops to take on Trump. He sounded confused and pathetic.
Trump is going to shred him in debates.
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Huff Post, June 19, 2019. "....Joe Biden told a roomful of well-heeled donors that he would not “demonize” the rich if he’s elected president. “I need you very badly,” he told the group.
To the 100 or so guests at a fundraiser at the swanky Carlyle Hotel in NYC, Biden said he’d gotten into hot soup with “some of the people on my team, on the Democratic side” for his earlier comments about rich people being “just as patriotic as poor people.”
That’s “not a joke,” he said. “I mean, we may not want to demonize anybody who has made money.”
Appearing to suggest that his tax plan would not include excessive taxes on the rich, Biden said “no one’s standard of living is going to change” if he’s elected."
Many voters think that what's excessive is the tax breaks the rich are given by our govt.
Biden is just much better than Trump. That's all we can say. Trump's worst damage may be to elevate mediocre Dems.
Even if you dislike Sanders, he did raise his money from small donations from ordinary citizens, who perceive that our democracy is not giving them proper representation for their taxation. We learned about that American ideal in our history classes on the colonies overthrowing King George the 3rd.
Today, proper representation for our taxes, would be a major step in progress to an operating democracy.
"...hypercompetitive...relentlessly entrepreneurial capitalism...unleashing its entrepreneurs on the world..."
This alone, gives away how little you actually know Mr. Friedman about Denmark, couched, as it is, in language only an American could write.
You totally misunderstand Denmark.
I know a little something about this because I, an American, lived in Denmark for several years, worked, paid taxes, and was married to a Dane, and understood from within how Denmark works, with the added benefit of a perspective outsiders might be able to bring with them.
The way it works isn't how you describe it. And the assertion about Denmark's "less obvious, but more important" secret sauce is one of the most risible things I've read in this paper.
No. Live there. Spend time there on something other than corporate retreats. Get to know regular Danes. Pay those taxes (which no American would countenance). You will quickly begin to understand that the root cause of Denmark's success is something much deeper and cultural and historic than retreats in which stakeholders respectfully interact. Indeed, it is the force that precedes and makes possible such retreats and detente between stakeholders in the first place.
2
Actually the candidate best suited to make America move closer to the Denmark/Nordic model - Social Democrat - was Elizabeth Warren. But she is a woman, so she had no chance to be President in America. She is gone.
Sanders is a self-described Democratic Socialist, but most his programs can be also described as Social Democrat - left of and less practical than Warren, but not that far from Denmark/Nordic model, no matter how much Friedman mischaracterizes them. Sanders has never said that he is opposed to free markets or regulated and reformed capitalism. He opposes the crony capitalism that is corrupting and choking democracy in America. But Friedman, Stephens, Brooks really didn’t need to worry, a self-described Socialist, even a Democratic Socialist, has no chance of being President in America. Bernie will be gone soon.
Biden is Democratic Leadership Council, neo-liberal, aligned with corporate/billionaire interests first, but decent person who will fight for middle class and poor within the boundaries of what corporate/billionaire class will allow. He is not a Social Democrat in the Denmark/Nordic model nor will we lead us there - have no idea how Friedman got there? We will go back to the normalcy of Obama years, but that’s also a continuation of 40 years of stagnation for middle class and poor and more income inequality. Just infinitely better than Trump - who isn’t- and Republican cult.
So Biden is our man! Primaries are over!
Vote Biden/Democratic 2020!!!
Another hit job on our best hope for the future,Senator Bernie Sanders. I am not going to address Biden’s precarious health situation. I wish I could live in your rose colored Neoliberal Fantasyland for a couple of days. Unfortunately, I am living in the real world . I will be a “Clothes Pin on the Nose “ voter for Biden if he is the nominee. Thanks.
3
As a Swedish citizen I generally agree with the sentiments in the article. There is in my opinion a useful qoute from a prevous swedish social democrat prime minister, Göran Persson.
"The market economy is an excellent servant but a lousy master."
You need common sense regulation, as in scanidnavia.
Thank you for setting the record straight. As a Swede living abroad and an avid NY Times reader, I always get annoyed when Bernie Sanders calls the Scandinavian countries socialist. Not to mention Fox News and Donald Trump himself who seems to have no idea about Scandinavian and Nordic countries at all. Social Democracy and Socialism are NOT the same thing. I can only confirm what you write in your article. Thank you again.
If Biden wins, and he will, then he will have 4 years to save the Democratic Party. If he can’t, and I don’t think he has it in him, then I see the party will fracture into a centrist party and a populist left party. The future leader of the latter is AOC. This will rock the steady American political ship albeit one full of holes at the moment.
Friedman conveniently twists Sanders viewpoints. Before Sanders we didnt hear Friedman or the establishment democrats talk about a stronger social safety net such as health care for all. Denmark model was never part of the discussion, it was always free trade, capitalism without any recourse or correction for the excessive greed and inequality that is on display. Bernie, ofcourse knows that jobs are created by entreprenuers, capitalists, he just wants them to be more responsible (the idea of corporate responsibility to the society) and sharing of the wealth that is created. Just look at how grotesque Jeff Bezos accumulation is, he doesnt believe in distributing stock grants to his employees like Apple or some other companies. Please get off your high horse and appreciate Bernie for being extraordinarily brave and calling for fairness in our capitalism.
2
Thank you for this very clear and logical essay. I wish everyone could read it carefully without prejudice. I wish the conspiracy theorists and sloganeering cultists could stop mindlessly reiterating the slander and lies, take a deep breath, and really think, in a reality-based calm and compassionate manner, the best course for all Americans, realizing that nothing is free—there is no Santa Claus or tooth fairy.
You are correct. Bernie was ignored again by his party and replaced by a real, old Guard, candidate, Joe Biden. Biden is now pronounced better, more in-line liberally, than Bernie and Bernie's supporters just need to "get in-line" and vote correctly. Lets see how this works out!
Corporate Denmark and Corporate US are very different animals.
Denmark does not have the income inequality that the US has.
I'm scared of how your man Biden will stand on the debate stage with Donald J Trump. He better have one flashy VP picked out.
I'm really tired of reading so many different versions of "the economic system that is hurtling us towards a climate catastrophe is fine"
1
This is honestly one of the least intelligent things I've ever read. I was going to use a stronger word but decided to stay civil.
Calling this a straw man argument would be flattering it way too much. Thomas Friedman paints an inane cartoon of Bernie Sanders and then proceeds to argue with it. "Do you believe the free enterprise system is the best?" and so on.
No Mr Friedman, clearly Bernie Sanders wants a total government takeover of all businesses, despite the fact that he's said over and over that he wants no such thing, and talks about social democracy like they have in Denmark.
So Friedman, imagining some comic book version of Sanders that it sounds like he got from watching FOX News or listening to Donald Trump, starts lecturing Sanders about how Denmark is a social democracy, despite the fact that Sanders has said repeatedly that what he recommends is social democracy.
To recap:
Sanders recommends a social democracy like Denmark (honestly. Go Google it. He uses those words)
FOX News and Donald Trump say "Sanders wants a communist state with no private ownership!"
Thomas Friedman, outraged, puffs himself up and writes:
"Mr Sanders, do you know that Denmark is *not* a communist state with all private ownership outlawed??"
Yes Thomas, he knows.
1
A little moderate lovin' couched in rhetoric. Bravo. I honestly didn't expect that.
It’s Pile On Bernie Sanders Week at the OK Pundit Corral. The line forms to right. Be careful where you step. Coming up: Take an Oligarch to Lunch Tuesday. I mean, “Job Creator.”
There are varying reasons why Sanders lost to Biden. None of them have anything to do with Denmark or socialism. If Jim Clyburn casts his benevolent gaze elsewhere, it’s a whole different ballgame.
The delicious paradox of Democratic presidential politics is that the kingmakers have become older black voters in reliably red southern states. The most disenfranchised of the disenfranchised have been momentarily glorified.
No one is more horrified of Trump than southern blacks. They know exactly what backsliding into authoritarian white nationalism really means. They want to take no chances.
Clyburn and the good ladies at the church social want the blandest, most inclusive, least threatening and controversial straight white male candidate they can find. They want a folksy, friendly unifier who can appeal to everyone of good will. After due consideration, they have conferred their blessing on Joe Biden.
Or as Tina Turner might have crooned, “What’s socialism got to do with it?”
Excellent column. One thing Friedman doesn’t note is that, historically, Denmark is where it all started—it all then shifted to Britain, which somehow in the popular mind gets all the credit. The oldest significant capitalist country in the world, of course, is China, although the freedom required for innovation has been relatively absent over the last few centuries.
Another omission is that capitalism is essentially mis-named. Every country and culture has capital accumulation—note: including the Soviet Union back when anything “capitalist” was anathema. We shouldn’t call it capitalism, which, since Marx, or, better, Engels, has been misunderstood (sorry, you, too, Weber, in important ways). It‘s better named entrepreneurialism. Spread the word.
(I suspect even Sanders gets it, but he’s suckered himself into the chalkboard theory called democratic socialism.)
Friedman gets it, as have those in Scandinavia, for many, many years. It thrives under conditions that used to be called, quaintly(?), liberty.
"Senator Sanders, where do you think jobs come from?
They come from risk-takers who borrow money from banks or relatives or max out their credit cards or spend their own savings to start companies they hope will become profitable."
Dear Mr. Friedman,
The paragraph above describes my post-grad-school perfectly.
Thanks!!
This article is almost as big of a dumpster fire as this country. If you want to know why the tide is turning against capitalism read your newspaper. Capitalists have irrevocably ruined the planet, enslaved each successive generation with more debt, created the ‘war on drugs’ until a pharmaceutical company made an even more addictive drug and profited from it at the expense of the public, has made health care not an option for most young people which our peers in every other developed country are guaranteed, and continues to exploit the citizens in other countries for their own end.
This column shows that not only does Sanders not understand the difference between (democratic) socialism and social democracy, but that Tom Friedman doesn't either.
Just going to say that I stopped listening to the previously-occasionally-interesting Friedman when he declared that Bloomberg would be the best candidate.
Joe Biden is a true predatory capitalist... a breed unleashed by Reagan and helped out by every president (less so George H Bush) since. Clinton deregulated Wall Street; GW Bush got us involved with the tarbabies in the Near East, Obama favored the banksters and the FED oblige by keeping the interest rate close to zweo and propping up the banksters as much as possible.
If the US can't afford Medicare for lll, it can't afford more tax cuts or a stimulus... whatever that won't due. It would be great if people got sick and tired of acquiring and then throwing away.. the garbage economy!
At least Trump has not gotten us involved in another shoot-em up war-- we just have class warfare... Where does it end??
Mr. Friedman, quite frankly, needs to do his homework. This is from Bo Lidegaard's (editor of Denmark's leading newspaper, Politiken) history COUNTRYMEN (Knopf, 2013): "Denmark was on the brink of revolution around Easter, 1920, but the leader of the Social Democratic Party, Thorvald Stauning, intervened and stabilized the situation. Stauning later became prime minister, governing with a firm hand from 1929, and he steered the country in the critical years as the depression swept the world economy..."
Yes, people can try to start a business here, or have children for that matter, without fear of personal ruin. But Denmark's entrepreneurial possibilities are because of the protections of welfare state, which were achieved through political struggles throughout the 20th century. They didn't happen by magic because a few corporations made a lot of money.
Last but not least, shame on Friedman for suggesting that entrepreneurs "max out their credit cards." I suspect that he would be one of the very people shaking their fingers when those enterprising citizens wind up in bankruptcy court. This is essentially a "let them eat cake" sort of comment.
Do people and Mr. Friedman truly understand how much money $1billion is? It would take a person making $50,000 a year, 20,000 years to make that much money. Not 2000, 20,000.
2
Thank you Tom. You have been a voice of reason with your thoughtful and insightful columns, especially over the past 3 years.
Americans will keep the same overpriced healthcare with Biden. That’s not what people have in Scandinavia! This is because Biden is financed by big Pharma.
Friedman would have argued that the owners of large plantations in 1859 were the risk takers that made the southern economy go. He would have been right, as well as an useful stooge then, too.
1
All the points in this column were true weeks ago. It would have been nice if Mr. Friedman had the nerve to speak up when it was still a race.
Some sixty years after the socialist revolution in Cuba, the average Cuban makes $25/month. Bernie now needs to fold his tent and suspend his campaign.
Finally the truth about Denmark; a capilitist country first and foremost; but with a social conscience.
Friedman doesn’t know much about Sanders’ version of democratic socialism. Richard White’s piece, also published on March 10, makes clear that Friedman is basing his piece on a bad caricature of Sanders.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/10/opinion/bernie-sanders-socialism.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage
1
If readers want an factual and direct synopsis of Sanders' word-view they can find it here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Kho7JpSz_g
(A longish interview Sanders gave to CNBC not too long ago).
I suggest Friedman and readers who like this column watch the clip. I 'm sure they will find much to disagree with. At least then they'll be engaging with the Sanders' actual ideas.
1
Not unexpected comments from the newly appointed Chief Marketing Officer of US Capitalism Inc. Of course he likes a centrist, so called.
1
Interesting.
So it sounds like what you're really saying is that if we vote for Joe Biden in November, don't expect any universal healthcare, or affordable tuition, or any real rise in wages for ordinary mortals.
Because those things are silly European programs rooted in quaint European ideas. And we are 'Mericans and those kinds of things aren't really gonna work for us.
After all, capitalism is all about winners and losers and if you aren't happy with what it has become in the last 50 years, well you must be a loser.
Mr. Friedman, I'm sure with such an electrifying platform and groundbreaking vision of our future, you and the rest of the corporate establishment democrats will have people running to the polls to elect your candidate. Because your candidate will be so much better for the ordinary folks who voted for that other guy.
FYI: 12% of people who voted for Bernie in the 2016 Democratic primary ended up voting for Trump in the 2016 general election. But that could never happen again... right?
2
Mr. Friedman utterly distorts Sanders' positions, then demonizes the false portrait he paints. It's the kind of intellectual dishonesty I expect from the GOP, not a Democratic "pundit."
1
Another fake argument by Mr. Friedman. Our capitalism is rapacious at the expense of the man of the street: in NYC they can write off 10k champagne bottles as a business lunch expense.: it takes many ordinary Americans 2 to 3 months to make that money after tax if at all. But, most importantly, the Danes behave like human beings to each other as you tacitly recognize; we are only superficially decent to each other but secretly cherish our success at the expense of others, or, alternatively, resent their success. There can be no remedy within the existing status quo and that is Sanders’s strong point. Win or lose, he has called out the fake omniscient pundits for what they are: lackeys eating at the oligarch’s feast. I lived thirty years under communism and never dreamed that the USA would begin to look like a caricature from a Soviet textbook on capitalist excess. Mr. Friedman, get of your high horse and come to a Ohio to see how the real people live: you may find a lot of resemblance with the developing world countries you like to pontificate about, telling them they should become like us. Really? Why not more like Denmark?
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I wonder if Mr. Friedman knows the difference between 1 million and 1 billion ? Or to put another way, does he realize that it would take a worker making $50,000 a year, 400 hundred lifetimes to make a billion dollars? That's 20,000 years.
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Mr Sanders, I have a host of false dichotomies I'd like to force you to pick a side on so that I can then construct straw men with which to mock you.
2
An unparalleled and elegant analysis that should be debated among Democrats!
Surprising that Friedman would write such a bias piece, for he was raised in the most "socialist" State in the U.S. Minnesota. Still has the largest Scandinavian population outside Scandinavia. "Land of 10,000 taxes" nick name to support all those social programs up there. Minnesota has highest number of refugees per capita of any US state, had same sex marriage in law before California, put the first Muslim in congress, a slew of liberal politicians came from there, one who was the democratic presidential candidate in 1984 and chose a WOMAN to be his running mate 35 years ago! Taxing corporations their fair share, health care for all and free college education is not really that bad, if any country can afford it WE CAN. Stop pushing the CON, you would pay lower in taxes for medicare for all then you do now with your current health insurance premium, inefficient and bloated cost of health insurance isn't sustainable. Nor is our current state of affairs in this country.
1
Fear is how elections are won. Just ask those who voted for Biden, if they can even admit it, just ask the DNC, the NYT writers, like this one, for supporting the unified hysterical how can we stop Bernie and just ask Trump. The strange thing is, we are in a mass extinction event, and the most wealthy, the only ones ‘served’ by Biden winning, will be dying sooner than later too. Is finishing off the middle class and cementing the gilded age of the American Oligarchy more important than the basic cornerstones of civilization and than even life on Earth, the things we who support Bernie, the only truly decent politician, are fighting for?
1
Thank you Mr Friedman. You’ve re-enforced my opinion that Sanders is what America needs.
I've lived in Scandinavia all my life. The columnist has no idea what he's talking about. The point is that social democratic policies doesn't disrupt a capitalistic model, not that we're not social democrats or democratic socialists...
Try conferring with actual Danes, Swedes, Norwegians or Finns next time. We would overwhelmingly reject a dinosaur like Biden.
1
Denmark and Sweden are monarchies. Both have very wealthy people, hard-edged capitalistic corporations, social democratic government, and happy people. And Denmark has better beer: a sweating mug of Tuborg on a table in a cobbled square with a jaz combo playing under sun-shades... Beats Pripps any day.
1
This article is important part of a larger story. But, one wonders what the discrepancy is between CEO's income in Denmark and their line workers. Are business decisions ruled mainly by short-term profits for stockholders? What percentage of Denmark's corporate leadership is in the top 1% of wealth? When compared to American corporations, how strong is the commitment of successful corporations in Denmark to environmental and humanitarian causes? How secure are workers jobs in Denmark's compared to the US? To increase profits, do Denmark's corporations move their operations abroad to exploit low-paid workers? To what extent are the successes of Denmark's corporations' due to the many social services provided by the government and that corporations do not need to provide (e.g., healthcare)? These are the questions I'd like to ask Mr. Friedman.
An interesting point of view with some truths and some stretches of credulity. But the underlying problem here in America is that Americans consistently want low taxes, unfettered capitalism and strong safety nets. Nothing converts a conservative to a liberal faster than a pink slip. Right now the Oval Office keeps swinging undamped between far left and far right politicians because the political conversations that need to happen are drowning in huge PAC dollars and vicious personal attacks. Although I disagree with the logic of this opinion piece I concur with the conclusion- Biden is much more likely to bring about useful conversation than Sanders. Sanders has already won by brings no his large ideas into everyday conversations.
As a Dane I am very proud to read this column. And I agree with Mr. Friedman: Sanders hasn't a basic understanding of the Danish model. On the other hand I doubt that Biden will fight inequality and poverty if he becomes president. But let us see, hopefully next year will be the end of Trumps presidency.
2
Denmark is a very different country and culture compared to America. During my long carrier on research, I closely observed the Danes and Americans through my association of premier international conference committees where Danes were closely involved. Danes intellectuals are contemplative, full of empathy and motivated by higher causes. Americans were aggressive, individualistic and motivated by success and wining. Danes find satisfaction with simple experiences in life and look to other Danes lovingly.Americans needs complex and expensive experiences to find satisfaction and views fellow Americans as competitors. Socialistic administration in a market oriented economy suits Danes, it will be a disaster for American culture. Each society is beautiful on its own context - Sanders and his supporters should accept the reality of life.
In business school one of the first concepts you learn is that in a perfect market economy there are no economic profits, meaning that the profits of every enterprise adjusted for risk and opportunity cost are zero. Then you spend the rest of the two years figuring out how to beat that expectation through various forms of trickery. Among these: nefarious corporate strategy which is mostly monopolization of one form or another and psychological manipulation through branding and marketing.
Solving problems through risk-taking and innovation is the heart of economic creation and is where all jobs begin, as Friedman rightly points out. Sanders and his supporters would do well to remember this. But economic capture, rent seeking, and monopolization are often the goals of corporate leaders today, not innovation. These behaviors do not expand the economic pie but rather redistribute it, causing much of today’s economic inequality. This situation is “unnatural” in the sense that the beloved classical economics of conservative pundits predicts the opposite should happen. Biden and his supporters would do well to remember this.
1
Once again criticism with no suggestion of how to move forward toward "balance". Forget that the criticism is way off the mark. How will Biden get the haves to the table? Maybe by pointing out how much support Bernie has and that people are fed up. Because " pretty please" won't work. Its about self interest and power. At least Bernie could say: "come to the table or we'll do it without you".
As Paul Krugman has pointed out, Bernie Sanders policies are much closer to those of a Social Democrat than those of a Socialist. Does Bernie know this? I'm not sure.
2
Very insightful column. The point about raising taxes to create a social safety net while also “growing the pie” is very important. While Bernie rails against the “parasites” in the health insurance industry, what happens to them when you eliminate their jobs? There are an estimated 1.8 million people working in the health insurance industry. If they all become unemployed, how does that NOT have ramifications for the economy? Wouldn’t it be better to regulate and improve the existing system to ensure that everyone can get covered than to blow it up and hope for the best?
1
Another hit job on Bernie Sanders by Tom Friedman. Here are the answers to the 3 questions he asked. First, yes many jobs come from risk-seeking entrepreneurs. Unfortunately, jobs also come from very large corporations where the "pioneering spirit" died long ago. They're the ones beholden to the stock market and who will not hesitate to sacrifice jobs for incremental earnings improvement and higher pay for directors. It's those greedy "hungry ghosts" to borrow a term from Buddhism, that are Bernie's targets.
Second, most corporate leaders believe you can blackmail the government on the job front to get what they want. They set themselves up as heroes in the eyes of the public, who believe in cutting taxes and regulations, no matter the impact on other stakeholders and the environment. That's how you end up with someone like Trump can be president.
Third, Of course free enterprise is more desirable. But, there is a responsibility in that freedom. A capitalist system gone mad as we have now is highly destructive. There must be meaningful regulations to curb the excesses. That should include more effective antitrust legislation. The current drive to reduce all regulations is highly misguided.
Bernie is a social democrat not a socialist. His left of center platform would be mainstream in most developed countries. At this writing, it seems that the coordinated mainstream media offensive against him is succeeding. The young will get shafted again.
4
Wealth is a good thing. Wealth creates jobs. Poverty is a bad thing. Poverty foments revolution. The balance between the two is a vibrant middle class that can still dream of social mobility. Progressives should stop pretending like the wealth pot is a pool of finite resources that was unfairly ripped from their clutches. The wealthy should stop pretending like the poor are do-nothings trying to get something for free. If you want a vibrant middle class you need to celebrate wealth and have disdain for poverty.
1
Sanders is about as much a Socialist as Dwight Eisenhower. Apart from healthcare, most of Sanders's political economy would've been fine by Ike. Marginal taxes were higher than Denmark's as Eisenhower carried forward the New Deal. He was the last really pro union president, calling them the lifeblood of capitalism. Not surprisingly he had 2 terms in the middle of the greatest shared prosperity in US history. Sanders's biggest mistake might be labels. He's a New Deal Democrat. As opposed to a Reagan Democrat like Biden. I know Sanders knows how Denmark works. It's important to put emphasis on the Danes' cooperation between state, business and unions. It would be good for America too. The only problem is that Reagan and Neoliberalism have hammered and gutted unions. With help and votes from Reagan Democrats like Biden.
3
This is a great column. I hope that the Sanders voters read it. It is about time someone put in plain english what Sanders gets wrong. Thank you Thomas Friedman.
2
This a brilliant column. Both Friedman and Sanders, however, need to more fully explain that:
Marxism was born in the heart of Europe, and communist and socialist parties were mainstream for many years. The U.S. on the other hand was separated by two oceans from vital experiments with capitalism influenced by socialism.
As a result, the so-called free market in America is much less community oriented than in many European nations
Sanders fell into a trap by using terminology that the movement conservatives have spent more than a half of a century demonizing: socialism and revolution.
2
At last a good factual comment on Denmark. It should have added that Denmark is a member of EU which closes the door of an hypothetical "socialism" in Denmark.
Denmark can be called one of the very last welfare state… at a price. Selfish (and near violent) nationalism is rampant as well as intolerance against non white or non europeans, and laws against immigration are so stringent they're not far from institutionalizing racism.
The "tragic" thing about Sanders is that he had 40+ years to hone his views on real "socialism" and weigh the pros and cons about Cuba and other socialist countries who tout their accomplishments "for the people" which are most of the time a hoax or achieved at the price of fostering a police state.
Sanders saw nothing, learned nothing, forgot nothing : that makes him all the more dangerous.
2
Right on! An interesting article that offers a helpful perspective.
1
Just a quick note -- open-ended questions are better than closed ones. I am much more interested in who he may name? Which company or individuals or systems are destroying..."
Good points though on socialism -- none is pure and most are hybrids...
Thanks for writing the last TLF article I will ever read. After 20 years, its glaringly clear how much the Sulzburgers, Likkud, AIPAC and China pay you to promote wars of resource domination, single party hegemony, the march of global corporate neoliberal corporatism, huge biometric ID databases and "benign despotism" of corporate government, BUT NOW you're making up things out of whole cloth to satisfy a timely deadline. Having connections and interests in Denmark, I can tell you Bernie Sanders is regarded by many business owners as the ONLY sane and trustworthy political leader in America worth negotiating with. They've thrown in the towel on Trump. The Danish companies you mention are well regulated and CHARTED to adopt a model of ECONOMIC FAIRNESS and sustainability. Their workers don't end up on food stamps and their factories don't despoil the environment. They enjoy high profits despite the high taxes BECAUSE their employees are healthier, happier, less stressed, more productive, less distracted and better educated than American peers. Management plans tend to run decades, not this quarter's bottom line, and they've known since the Middle Ages that kingdoms, empires and lieges rise and fall, but the needs and ethos of a people remain.
5
This is a good break down of the situation in Denmark. What Friedman misses is that pay is also commiserate with this model of good behavior. When pay in this county is brought up to that in Denmark, around $16.00 dollars an hour for the lowest paid jobs, then we can start having the conversation about trust. However, in a country where business has done everything in its power to suppress wages while making record profits. Vilifying the people who are at the bottom of the ladder while taking advantage of them at every turn. Making statements that seem to indicate that if you are not well off it is your fault while paying poverty wages. You sometimes need to start out on the fringe just to negotiate to the middle. Since Clinton in the 90's the establishment Democrats like Biden have started in the reasonable middle and consistently negotiate to the right. It is time to start negotiating on the left and moving to the reasonable middle because it has become clear over the past 30 odd years that the Republicans and business interests will not negotiate in good faith toward the reasonable middle. That Mr. Friedman, is what Bernie and many of his supporters are about. Some times you need to be extreme just to get people to be reasonable.
2
When you reduce the employees of a company or business to a group, they get the majority of the revenue (money taken in before profits). If the profits that go to the greedy owners /stockholders/ 401k owners.....were spread out over the employees it would be nice for them, but wouldn't make as big an impact that marxists think. Socialists like Sanders think that the wealth of billionaires is cash they keep in an underground bunker.
The gap between the haves and have-nots decreased this last week.
Interesting: the columnist agrees with Bernie on issues although fails to understand that his proposals aren't about socialist statesation but about restating FDR's wellfare state which can't be delivered by Biden given his past position on those issues.
1
@Shinzato
It can´t delivered by anybody because there is no backing by the Democratic party as a whole let alone by some additionally required GOP representatives in Congress so there will be no majority for the indispensable comprehensive legislation in sight. Everybody whith a clear mind knows this.
So there is just an overaged old school agitator on the stage talking whole day lomg about "socialism" and "Denmark" and there is an also overaged political dinosaurus whio has been representing "the system" for some 50 years, who´s only personal perspective is restricted on fixing some flaws of a legislation process he had participated over 10 years ago in person (ACA) and several smaller topics just for the reason he knows that he will never get the money for deeper reforms because this would require higher taxes and a relatively evading-proof big tax like VAT he won´t never ever get through legislation in present situation.
His advantage is: He says so so there will no danger he is going to try some adventures that could be financed. So he is a relatively better option than an agitator with his feet in the sky.
Now it´s also clear why no person who definitely knows what the Scandinavian (European welfare state) model is all about and how it works showed up in this race: There is no way to implement this model as such and even less way to raise badly required funds by taxes and/or contributions in USA today. So it makes no sense to get worn out by a mission impossible.
Let's check in on how wonderful our capitalist system is doing with an example. Take Amazon. It's no longer a new company, it is a well established very successful company. It has allowed the man who started it to become the richest man on earth.
Yet even though Amazon made nearly $12 Billion in profit, it paid NO federal tax. And it expected cities to use tax money to pay for Amazon to locate a second HQ in their location. So that is two sets of government subsidies they demanded.
Even so, they cannot pay all employees a living wage. And ultimately that is another government subsidy they expect. NONE of these subsidies is available to small companies.
Yet for some reason in Denmark companies, even large ones, pay people a living wage - perhaps not extravagant, but living. Of course, it helps to have good healthcare, affordable education, and high taxes.
Mr. Friedman - time to rethink!
7
Amazon pays a $15.00 minimum wage. That is pretty nice for all the Whole Foods Market employees here in Boise. Further, Amazon has just announced a $5 million assistance fund for small businesses, primarily restaurant and retail, who are located in South Lake Union near Amazon HQ and have been impacted by Covid-19. Frankly, many of us will rely on Amazon for delivery of vital goods, as the virus will increasingly mandate social distancing. Tax reform is a much larger issue than Amazon, and yes, does need addressing.
Capitalism is clearly the best system to generate prosperity for all if it is properly controlled. We need to acknowledge that the taxes to pay for physical, legal, educational and medical infrastructure is the price we must all pay to make society work for all. Bernie seems to believe that burning it all down and starting over with some socialist utopia will actually work but there is overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Perhaps he should go ask some Bloomberg employees if they are happy with their compensation and benefits. I expect he would find most of them are very happy that Mike Bloomberg identified a market and started the successful company that enables those employees to make a nice living. Bernie has no idea if the Bloomberg companies are “sharing the wealth “. My guess is they are.
Thank you! Right on target... Bernie was and is angry, and while he talks about needed changes, he does it with a hard edge that fails to give any credit to anyone. He just assigns blame.
There is no doubt that Big Business has flaws which need to be addressed, but the all or nothing idealism that Bernie promotes is purely divisive. We don't need any more division thank you.
the Genius of "and" please, not the Tyranny of "or". Big Business with good profits and respect and dignity for the worker stakeholders. Let's get our heads around that and promote that, as it seems to happen in the Danish Model.
2
Sanders has never come out against free enterprise or trade in general. What he has come out against is a system where there is growing inequality. He has come out against a system where US corporations pay virtually no taxes, have no obligation to provide vacation or family leave time to workers, can fire workers at will, and are allowed to limit unions. He has come out against a system where there is no universal health care and companies also don't need to provide that as a benefit. He has come out against a system where pensions and retirement benefits are not a given.
These are all things that Denmark addresses without undermining free enterprise. The idea that Sanders is simply against free enterprise is silly. And so is the idea that Biden who does not support universal health care, free child care, increased leave benefits, subsidized public higher education, and other key social benefits that Scandinavian countries give somehow understands those countries better and will do more to give people the things he has said he does not support.
1
Well, if you go to the paragraph that cites income tax at 55.8 and the average tax paid at 45 percent, isnt that what Bernie wants and preach? And the prior paragraph: access for all to child care, medical and parental leave from work, tuition-free college, a living stipend, universal health care and generous pensions. Isn't that what Bernie wants and preach? This is a propaganda piece against Bernie because in the end, Ms.Friedman is praising a society exactly for the same reasons Bernie is fighting for on his campaign.
3
I think your representation of what Bernie wishes to do is accurate. And that is why he won't get the nomination. And your depiction of the Scandinavian economic system is accurate. What I would like you to report is what the Scandinavian people think about this system. How do they feel about paying high taxes? Is a sizeable percentage of the population seething with anger over paying taxes and how much of that is wasted on the undeserving like it is here? What Americans don't see is how Scandinavians get so much for their taxes: decent health care, child care, elder care, great public transportation, and a decent retirement. And the Scandinavian companies you mention still make lots of money. They are what most Americans aren't: very, very happy. As to American wealth being built from entrepreneurship: I think you fail to see how much wealth now is handed down, not earned. How much of a risk did those people take? And what's wrong with the American system is the notion that if you allow people to take a chance and make money, that once they succeed they will share it with those that help them be successful. The difference in the two systems is in Scandinavia the investment in the people is made via taxes. In America it's a promise that is never kept. And then you wonder why the Trumps and Sanders model emerges. Sharing in Scandinavia is a pillar of society. Here it's a mortal sin.
4
Yes! Friedman says it all. This is why Dems are flocking to Biden, not just the fact that he’s more likely to beat Trump.
6
Persuasive as this from Friedman is, I think he leaves out some of what is valid in Sanders's accusations. For example, Sanders sees it that wealth can be and is used to influence -- and with the cost of campaigning that is a HUGE flaw in our system.
Unfortunately, Sanders (and Warren, too) use a tone of condemnation, demonize and fail to differentiate among the rich and among those who do wrong.
We do need change and reform, improvements such as with the ACA rather than Medicare for All immediately.
I think we have a chance toward those improvements with Biden at the helm. But the corrupt "establishment" we've been under is more the product of Mitch McConnell than it has been the programs and conduct of our executive branch.
1
Hopefully Biden and Sanders can have such a conversation to discuss how Biden will work on these issues. Sanders supporters are a good 30% of democrats. Many of them are young and can be passionate or not. Biden said in his speech last night that he felt health care was a right not a privilege but more quietly remarked that improving on Obamacare was the way to go about it. Can he assure us that he will really address this? I would like to see such a conversation in the next debate rather than a take down by either one of them.
Friedman omits the fact that Denmarks' richest person has a net wealth of 7.3 billion and our richest person is estimated at 160 billion. That's a big difference and when the Walton family accumulates a wealth of 152 billion while paying their workers minimum wage with no benefits, this is NOT the Danish model. These are the inequities Bernie rails against. Excessive wealth(aka greed) at the expense of the poor and working class. These richest people and corporations have also paid near zero in income tax and get massive tax incentives to set up shop as opposed to the average middle class worker who pays 33% on income and top rate property and state taxes. That is the opposite of how the Nordic model has built social trust and cooperation.
5
I thought your description of the "retreat" was fascinating. Different stakeholders, all discussing issues with respect. What really struck me was that the "corporate titans" were actually sitting down and discussing issues with the "workforce labor union." This is part of what Bernie rails against. In the US, the "titans" meet behind closed doors while the workers have to stand out it the street and scream in protest, ultimately being ignored. Mr. Friedman, you work for a newspaper. You, of all people, should know about the utter devastation corporate greed and malfeasance has wrought upon your industry.
4
I think this is a very unfair article. The idea that Bernie Sanders hates free enterprise or advocates centralized planning has been projected onto him by people like Friedman who are trying to scare Americans about his possible nomination. Bernie Sanders' big socialistic idea is a universal single payer healthcare system in which profits for insurance companies are removed and health care as seen as a right. He also has the idea that the government use its bargaining power to drive down the costs of drugs from the pharmaceutical companies. He has an idea about launching a Green New Deal where government shifts away from its subsidies for fossil fuels and redirects it towards green technology. These ideas are very popular and they don't undermine free enterprise. I'm supporting Biden but it galls me to see these hit jobs on Bernie Sanders when he's the only one that has identified key obstacles to our moving forward as a nation. Having said that, I'm getting behind Biden and hoping Bernie's movement and the economic desperation of so many he has identified will begin to inspire real change in Washington.
4
I despair of Americans, including Senator Sanders himself, ever properly distinguishing between “democratic socialism” and “social democracy.” They are two very different animals. Europeans understand this; Americans are clueless.
All the Nordic block countries and indeed all the EU nations are social democracies — societies that embrace market capitalism and then through governmental action (regulation, redistribution etc) mitigate the worst aspects of it by creating robust safety nets.
Democratic socialism refers to fundamentally socialist states that are based on planned economies and the whole or partial ownership by government of the means of production — leavened by democratic institutions. I couldn’t actually name you one country like that. Help me out please.
7
Great explanation of a difficult topic. Like most things in life, its all about balance. This article is like a summary of the history and the argument laid out in Transaction Man by Nicholas Lemann for a re-balancing of an economy that went off the rails in the 70s. Lemann describes how Alfred Berle argued in the 20th century that we need the large corporations and risk takers, but we need to harness their power to help everyone. Tom Friedman's article here fits beautifully into this long-arc historical background of economic changes in America that need to be re-balanced.
2
Those Scandinavian tax rates might seem outrageous until one crunches the numbers for what Americans pay in Federal and State taxes, then add cost of health insurance and education - not a big difference and not everyone benefits.
Paying for such a social safety net is less an issue than making the transition from a huge for-profit industry which would need to cooperate along with the lawyers. A tall order for any politician. It would take 20 years of bipartisan cooperation, at least.
5
@Chuck Mack Yes, indeed. A US household that wants to send two kids through college and perhaps university, will have to find probably $60-100,000 in their budget somehow.
The Danish family - paying higher taxes - will have to find $0 in their budget, as College and University here is tuition free. Education is an investment in the future.
1
@Thomas In many cases a good deal more than $100 K for each kid, not to mention the cost of health insurance each year.
"The less obvious, but more important, feature of Denmark’s success is the high-trust social compact among its business community, labor unions, social entrepreneurs and government. That’s the real secret of Denmark’s sauce."
We can never be Denmark because there is no high-trust social compact here.
And there never will be.
4
When you factor in all the taxes (sales, gas, property) on top of the income tax I pay, I already give above 50% of my salary to the government, yet what do I have to show for it? Is education robustly funded? Are infrastructure projects going forward? Do I have government funded healthcare?
The American public is being fleeced so money can go into the pockets of the military, farmers destroying the earth with useless corn crops and bail outs for banks and corporations. I want a government that uses my tax dollars to create a comfortable society for all.
5
I cannot believe the high school level knowledge of economic theory that Mr. Friedman continually relies on, in light of his obviously prominent position in the media. He acts as though the only economic actors are "entrepreneurs" that produce widgets and not the multinational mega corporations that long ago abandoned production in favor of financial manipulation for the safe of profits. If "entrepreneurs" are the job creators, Mr. Friedman, tell me, how are the "profit makers" for the entrepreneurs. Clearly, workers. Without the value the add, there would be no profits.
7
I am confused. You recognize the need to redistribute wealth in America. But Biden has not campaigned on a platform hat includes a plan to redistribute that wealth. Yes, Bernie may have ignored the economic essentials inherent in a capitalist economy, but Biden seems to ignore the absolutely essential need to address the woeful financial circumstance facing a large number of Americans. Also, allowing most of the nation's wealth to be in the hands of a small number of citizens does not always result in job creation.
4
I think one of the major reasons that government-sponsored health, education and welfare programs work so well in countries like Denmark is that everyone looks alike. The countries in which universal health care, child and family subsidies, and programs for the elderly have worked best are those with fairly homogeneous populations. In the U.S., where, until now, we have prided ourselves on our diversity, we seem to deem those who don't look like us the "other" or as "those people" and we are less inclined to share our wealth with them. It seems to me that there will be less internal generosity in those countries with strong social safety-net programs as their populations become increasingly more diverse as a result of the infusion of refugees from war-torn countries and of the European Union's loosening of member-states' borders.
4
@RGB
You’re imagining how Scandinavia looks. I’m there now and at least 20% of the population is decidedly unnordic. These countries have been very accepting of and generous to immigrants for a very long time and it shows
@Scandiphile- I understand that Denmark and other Scandinavian countries are much more diverse now. However, do you think such progressive social and economic measures would have been introduced and/or passed when they were originally put into place if the population looked then the way it looks now? 'Not sure about that.
I agree, BLH,,, Good Column! I see it as "the goose that lays the golden eggs... must be cared for and must be allowed to grow in numbers" so that WE CAN afford the things that would improve society. Imagine if we had a health care plan EVERYONE wanted to be in as opposed to few wanting to be in it, but being penalized for NOT joining? We need to start SMALL, work out the problems and then proceed from there. Where jobs come from is as important as where our food comes from.
1
The demonizing came first from the let us say the makers side of the mix under Reagan. Welfare queens, freeloaders and union thugs. However Denmark came to have this great ecosystem balance does not seem to be available to us here in the U.S. Also, when politicians on the left here try to make income taxes more progressive (like they were back in the robust economy of the 1950s), they are accused of class welfare. Criticize Bernie all you wish, but no one here so far has been able to carve out a way for this country to become more like Denmark. At least Bernie tried.
1
Much as I admire Friedman, I think in this case he's setting up a straw man. Could it be instead that Bernie does understand the source of Denmark's achievements, and claims we need a revolution because instead of following the same path we have jumped so far off the track? Bernie isn't against capitalism, he's against what we've let it become. So what if he claims the .1% are corrupt? Sometimes you need some hyperbole to make a point.
4
One of the most timely, well-laid out pieces I've read from Friedman in a long time. Well done and thank you, Thomas.
5
If Sanders wishes to continue his social contract monologues and harangues, he should do so as often as he likes. Perhaps they will gain the traction necessary to convince more and more of us to follow his uninformed and somewhat misleading premises. The best way for all concerned is that he retain his stature, support Biden, help unite not divide his supporters as well as the Democrats and defeat the illegitimately elected, legitimately impeached despot and his kakistocracy.
Do the right thing, Bernie!
5
Misses the point, Tom. Bernie’s emphasis is less on destroying capitalism than in reining in the excesses of corporate capitalism. The “corporate” is the key. This has resulted in the exponential growth of the financial sector which produces absolutely nothing. The health insurance industry, again producing nothing. Jobs paying sub-standard wages, with no benefits and no security. The concentration of wealth in a few hands. These are the logical outcomes of runaway, unfettered corporate capitalism.
Unfortunately, Bernie doesn’t always articulate this well, painting with a too-broad brush. It’s a shame because if he could explain this more fully, he would have reached more people. And we’d have more important fundamental change.
4
This is a welcome, well-informed comment on how the 'Scandinavian model' works. Just to give you one example on societal trust. The guys who founded SuperCell (think about the highly popular Clash of Clans game) in 2010 eventually sold their business to the Chinese TenCent for a cool $10 Billion. They then declared that since they had benefited so much from the Finnish infrastructure and public support (start-up programmes etc), they wanted to pay their taxes in Finland, in full. No use of tax havens (think, e.g., Bermuda) to siphon off their wealth outside the reach of the tax authority. As a result, these guys personally paid more tax in a given year than did Nokia or the largest bank in Finland. And they were still left with more money than they can spend in their lifetimes (or their children's lifetimes for that matter). And they did that proudly and because they saw it as the fair and right thing to do: they got a lot of help from publicly funded infrastructure and support, and when they struck gold, they wanted to give back.
20
@qed
While I admire the example of societal trust that you detail, I'm even more gratified that I had never even heard of the (highly popular) Clash of Clans game. I think I'd seek absolution too, if that's what 10 billion dollars buys in these modern times.
1
The Danish government has not (yet)been captured by special interests in a rigged system. That much Mr.Sanders knows and that much Mr.Friedman seeks to avoid.
9
I will hazard a guess that most Americans don’t have a notion of the kind of poverty we are still dealing with in Alabama. Coronavirus is going to bring the household financial insecurity of our neighbors to the forefront. If most Americans don’t have $400 for an emergency, how can they deal with even one missed paycheck? Is this acceptable, for hard-working Americans to be so close to homelessness?
Yes, Americans lack in social solidarity—or what is also called neighborliness. The question is whether we can change that. I am grateful to Bernie for trying to advance the discussion. “Not me. Us.” Keeping our neighbors out of harm’s way should be mere common decency—and a moderate idea.
14
Expect Republican spinning to say that the NYT is now calling Joe Biden the true socialist in the race, as a (doomed to fail) tactic of scaring voters into thinking that a Democratic win in November will be a victory for socialism in America.
The reality is that using "socialism" and "late stage capitalism" as scary words is meaningless in modern economic terms. As TF rightly points out, the true measures are market economy or planned (command) economy. Denmark is undoubtedly a market economy. The US with its traditional industry subsidies and tax breaks and now it's trade policies looks a lot more like a command economy. Or, as Sanders says, a country with socialism for the rich -again the meaningless term better understood as a planned economy favoring entrenched or particular interests, where those interests may be "the oligarchs" or "the working class".
3
Don’t come down on Bernie now, he knows that we are the most developed country in the world but we’re not developed. Bernie has seen how our political system works, telling us one thing and doing the opposite, that’s why he’s an Independent. Politics and Corporate American have used each other as foils all the way back to Carnegie it’s just now we are more tuned in due to Trump. Even among the lower sixty percent wage earners we still have our hierarchy and right now everyone is scrambling trying to hold on and there is despair everywhere. Bernie sees it and speaks to it like a Ralph Nader but he is to old for a revolution. To quote my friend Boris Badenov the next thirty years are going to be verrrry interesting
4
No mention of Elizabeth Warren? This is exactly the kind of system she endorses. Biden may be closer than Sanders, but Warren was there.
8
For some people in Europe, "capitalist" and "socialist" are relative rather than absolutist terms. I lived in Denmark for two years and I can tell you that it's far more socialist than the U.S. while at the same time being pro-business and pro-competitive. It's a question of getting the balance right in a mixed economy. The U.S. is way off the chart in this sense and a relative basket case on many important measures including poverty, equality, healthcare, education, human development, crime rates, murder rates, etc. Using the Nordic social models as a frame of reference is not a bad idea if the U.S. wants to shape up.
14
Frankly, this is a silly piece. Sanders' policy platform includes universal publicly provided health insurance, more and more progressive taxation, free public college, expanded child care, greater ease in union formation. This is exactly what Scandinavian countries have. Sanders is running as a social democrat which he calls Democratic Socialism and his policies are very similar to what the mainstream of the Social Democratic party in a country like Sweden argues for and maintains.
7
@Ethan, you’re reinforcing the main point of the column, which is that Sanders wants the social safety net from Denmark’s model while he demonizes the capitalist steel that forms its cables. Elizabeth’s Warren was much closer. Sanders is no kind of economist.
7
@NotMyRealName (1.) Spend some time in Scandinavia (I lived in Sweden for 6 years); the rhetoric of the social democratic party isn't that far different and frankly Sanders doesn't spend much time excoriating any capital income earnings but rather the incredibly excessive inequality currently present in the U.S., (2.) what is much more important than words used is policies supported and, in this regard, Sanders is arguing for a set of policies that is quite close to what many Scandinavia countries currently have; Biden's set of policy proposals (i.e. expansions of Medicaid and the the individual markets created from the ACA) are much further - thus, the title and premise of the piece is rather silly.
Our businesses compete for market share to increase profits. That competition involves getting the most output from the least input. The least input is us. The lowest wages possible, the least benefits possible, the most hours possible. And yet somehow, the CEOs and upper management make much much more than their underlings who get the least possible. The competitive capitalist system in America drives income disparity. It's the system itself.
To simply say that entrepreneurs are the job creators is missing the point. Even the leaders with noble intentions are playing in a game that is designed against the regular people.
Wildly over compensated leaders create Seattles, San Franciscos, and NYCs, with crazy prices for rents and services and pockets of misery on the periphery.
Tax the rich now, or eat them later. Denmark does this. Nobody is abandoned like here, where millions of people have no good options, only bad ones.
Sanders is angry. That's his strength because most of our politicians are comfortable with the status quo. Tweaks at the margins don't address the fundamental problem– the system itself.
8
I visited my relatives in Denmark three years ago. I saw amazing entrepreneurship there. My great uncle was a retired beer distributor, a cousin owned a bedding shop, another cousin owned a farm with a bed and breakfast, her son owned an egg factory. We visited a large family owned farm, a few small family owned farms, a family owned jumping horse farm, and the gorgeous home of a retired architect. They are, indeed, a capitalist country with generous benefits (and high taxes). Bernie 's descriptions are just not true.
8
Thank you NYT. This can be a good material to teach my kids logical fallacies and media literacy.
2
Bernie Sanders is an ideologue. Ideologues are loved by some members of the Press and political class because they are not flip floppers. Of course Joe Bidden is a flip flopper he tries to adjust to the current circumstances he does not believe the policies that may have been popular and /or did not work 50 years ago is what he should still be promoting today. During a crisis all Americans are Socialist. Right now the Republican president believes that a healthcare crisis needs the leadership and money of government. During 2008 financial crisis Capitalism was bailed out by government money. You point out where Denmark and most democratic entrepreneurial socialist countries differ from Americans is that a large swath of Americans do not want to pay taxes, in Denmark they do pay taxes. Of course in Denmark they get something for that tax money. Americans expect the government to bail them out when they or their group is in trouble. American capitalists big and small socialize their debt; but capitalize their profits. Tell us how to change that. As long as America can print as much money as it wants or needs, the debts will continue to rise and little will change.
2
Well said! Friedman's analysis of what is causing the current dysfunction in the US is right on point. We need more recognition of the root causes and the possible routes to a solution. Redistributing the pie is not the answer.
4
@jpduffy3 sure "socialism" is the threat (redistribution) not rigged greed.
In defense of Mr Sanders he has to cherrypick because he has to simplify the Danish example for the US voters to understand his argument. If he were to explain it in the way Mr Friedman wrote his column, no American voter would understand. Mr Sanders also is not against capitalism. Unfortunately for Mr Sanders, his temperament, his bellicose manners and words as well as his status as an "independant" which he has carefully crafted throughout his long career, are now coming to haunt him when the Democratic Party, as an institution, is now rallying around one of its most precious own. And, Denmark is lightyears ahead of the US. The US national temperament (work hard and you will get the american dream) stands in the way of an American mind sufficiently open to trying new solutions to turn the tide on the drastic and punishing American socio-economic inequalites.
9
Mr. Friedman echos my thoughts. Upon my retirement my family bought a rent stabilized six family building with our life savings in 2017. Then came the brutal majority of the socialist democrats in New York Assembly and they changed the rent laws. Now I realized that I do not own the building, the state does. The state and the city controls all aspects of my investment. I cannot even get an apartment in the building. I cannot get a reasonable return for any improvement I make to the building not even to pay the interest I pay to make the improvement. Who will make risky investments like this any more in New York?
4
Denmark does not have the option for big pharma to make money off of drugs as they can in the US. As Bernie states, U.S.citizens get to pay for the drugs twice. Once through the public funding of research development and the second time through gouged profits that go to the likes of the Sackler family and Purdue Pharma. A current article highlights the practice and the role Sanders has played over his many years of commitment to the middle class.
Search The Intercept - How the Senate Paved the Way for Coronavirus Profiteering for further details on the specific issue and where Sanders and Biden stood on it.
8
I am an American living in the Netherlands. I’ve always thought that Sanders should have used the Netherlands as an example of how healthcare should work, as well as paying for a university education. Thank you, Mr. Friedman, for your column.
6
Isn't it clear for everybody that trying to make a profit when offering health care is against the simple idea of health care ( as good school ) for all citizens, paid by progressive taxation ?
Do American believe that's communism ?
11
And food producers should not make money.
And those who own apartment buildings and rent out apartments should not make money.
You forgot those.
This is just another in the long line of anti-Bernie posts by New York Times columnists, supported by an institution who is afraid of their taxes going up.
I would hope it's not because they are so callous that they have been pushed to the "why should I pay for your health insurance?" argument.
What kind of person doesn't want others to have health care?
Because, you see, if you ask the average Swede or a Dane, Bernie Sanders is a moderate, not a wild left radical.
There is nothing undoable in his quest for health care. That's the main concern.
"Senator Sanders, is there a single American entrepreneur or corporate leader whom you admire?"
Why should he? He speaks for millions of us who think that most corporate leaders NEED to have their taxes raised.
22
I think that this is an excellent article that shows the rather childish crudeness of Bernie's thinking.
That said, the Scandi model is built on a level social cohesion that the US has never had. So its not transferable to the US. (Friedman hints at this.) We can definitely learn from the Denmarks of the world, and they present a good model as to what can be achieved in terms of equal opportunity, better wealth distribution, education, childcare, healthcare, etc. But we have to come up with solutions that match the political reality of America has it is now, fractured and broken. That won't be easy.
9
Good article. It's not always easy to differentiate populist demagoguery and egalitarian eleemosynary edicts... but Bernie isn't (nor ever has been) an enlightened thinker nor successful social organizer/builder.
I like and agree with Bernie's general precept of lowering income/wealth inequality, but his solutions simply won't work here (or probably anywhere).
Review all of his "accomplishments" in his 30 years in D.C. for an indicator. Not that hasn't done a lot of good for VT and USA... but the "Amendment King"is not in the House or Senate reform 'bigs' by any measure.
1
You're missing the point that in Scandinavian countries, people aren't worried about getting affordable healthcare and paying healthcare bills when they lose their job or are self-employed.
They aren't stressed about what will happen if they become temporarily or permanently disabled. (In the U.S., short and long term disability is utterly unaffordable to those of us in the 1099/gig economy.)
In Scandinavia -- and much of northern Europe -- there are also some minimal payments to the unemployed, even if they weren't paid on the equivalent of a W-2 instead of a 1099. Unlike in the U.S., where 1099/gig workers get NOTHING when they lose their jobs.
This is a constant source of stress and fear for those of us in the U.S. in the gig economy.
Also, public universities in Scandinavia -- heck, in most of Europe -- have trivial tuition and fees compared to those in the U.S., meaning that workers are stressing about saving for college and retirement while juggling massive healthcare bills and no safety net if the lose their 1099 income.
The amazing thing is that when you provide a basic safety net for people, it frees them up to become entrepreneurial, rather than having to rely on a W-2 "day job" for healthcare and access to disability and unemployment insurance.
I'm all for capitalism, as long as we have a social safety net. I have yet to hear Biden propose anything that change that.
20
If I think I’m going to lose “it” — any it, but, say, my not-so-great medical insurance that makes us both pay $300 in Pharmarcy costs before it covers anything, excludes a LOT, is overly fond of denying physicians’ treatment recommendations and has a penchant for Surprise! bills (like $125 for extra mammogram views because the doctor decided he needed more on a 360-degree-view image system I deliberately chose), I’d be tempted to hang on tight because right now, something other—let alone better—is all theoretical. Hey it could be even worse than spending $5,000 or more annually for two relatively healthy people WHO CARRY INSURANCE.
Yes I’ve shopped Canadian online pharmacies at times over the past 30 years. Yes I’d consider medical tourism if I needed something serious addressed. Yes I’m thinking living overseas in retirement might be preferable.
But NO, I’d rather not have to do any of those things.
The best time to have addressed this was decades ago. The 2nd best time is NOW.
12
Tom...I'm so disappointed with you again. This is just more of same...Bernie is a socialist clap trap that your paper keeps perpetrating. I have never heard Bernie argue for government ownership of business. I have never heard him say he is anti-capitalism. What is he for?
1) Campaign finance reform so that all people, rather than just the wealthy influence the decisions made by our elected representatives.
2) Medical care for all, paid for through our taxes, so that everyone has access to excellent healthcare, not just those with the means to pay for it.
3) Extending free public education to colleges in trade schools. We already do this for K through 12 public schools, and Mr. Friedman knows very well that a high school degree is not enough to do well in our ever changing world.
Finally, he is asking those who have benefited the most from our society to pay more to insure that we have a healthy, well educated communities..., whose elected representatives are paying attention to all of their constituents and not just the few who can fund their next run for office.
Nothing of what Bernie is proposing has anything to do with being anti-capitalist. Rather, his proposals help to insure that we have healthy, well educated communities, free from the worrying how to pay for their children’s education or medical care. As many of your Scandinavian readers have commented, these forms of social support encourage risk takers, which supports capitalism and job creation.
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@John Peters
Great reply, being scandinavian myself I now officially declare Bernie Sanders the true scandinavian!
8
If Sanders makes a distinction between entrepreneurial, ‘conscious capitalism’ and corrupt, rent-seeking crony capitalists, I haven’t heard it. I can understand his appeal to young people who have gotten a terrible deal in school debt, jobs and housing in today’s predatory capitalist environment. But we have a chance to reclaim our government from this disastrous WH, hold the House and (hopefully) gain the Senate majority if Democrats - including Sanders supporters - and independents join together. M4A is a nonstarter, but a public option can win votes.
Biden needs a good, younger running mate (preferably a woman or person of color), a compelling vision beyond dumping DJT, a commitment to face our climate emergency, and a strategy to develop the next generation of progressive leaders. There is so much that needs doing and Biden is the best chance we’ve got.
3
The Denmark model would not work in the US even if the Danish PM became US president. The US is a super capitalist nation that will never accept the high taxation rates required to implement the Danish model.
So in summary, neither Biden nor Sanders will take you there.
Also, Trump’s going to win.
1
Sanders has always been a pony promiser, never really putting forth how the ponies will be paid for.
Elizabeth Warren put forth ideas to better our society, but then also showed how she would accomplish them, like the details for her medicare for all plan; she lost her standing for doing that. I suspect that people are seeing what Sanders ideas might cost...
1
Of all the well made points in this column, Friedman's insight about social trust is the most significant. We cannot advance as a nation until we find ways to mend the bitter divides that are separating us. Balancing interests requires thinking beyond oneself, one's tribe and one's larger identity group. It requires empathic engagement with others in this sprawling and diverse nation. It involves a kind of clear minded duty and yes, sacrifice for the good of the whole. I'm not talking about a naive passivity, but more the spirit of "Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country."
7
One thing common to all these NYT hit jobs is that they never cite a single quote from Bernie. I doubt that Bernie has ever voiced contempt for small business entrepreneurs. But Friedman likes to conflate such entrepreneurs with the monopolistic mega corporations which dominate the U.S. economy. Maybe the Danes are so polite with each other because they already have a health care system which is not run for profit and an energy policy which aims to radically reduce fossil fuel consumption. In the U.S.A. we are still fighting for these changes.
23
Sanders core idea of democratic socialism is fully consistent with the Denmark model. Democratic implies that power and wealth in a society are distributed to the people while socialism suggests that the overall goal is welfare and equal opportunity for all. The phrase is powerful and is in opposition to concentration of power and wealth whether thru capitalism or thru the state. Fundamentally it is an affirmation of the Constitution with its checks and balances intended to prevent concentration of power in state institutions. Sanders emphasis on socialism expresses the other concern - to prevent the concentration of power thru wealth. In the U.S. at present the overconcentration of wealth endangers the survival of a Constitutional Republic in the U.S. with abominations like Citizens United legitimizing the power of wealth over the basic concept of the U.S. Republic which is that sovereignty comes from the people.
Biden should not only praise Bernie supporters for their dedication and energy to receive their support. He needs to affirm Sander's core message and restore the U.S. as a fundamentally innovative society whose core political instrument is designed to protect the people as the source of sovereignty for the state. Citizen's United needs to be overturned to restore the American people as the source of state power. The excessive concentration of wealth that exists at present calls for serious consideration of ideas of socialism to achieve the balance of Denmark.
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@Vid Beldavs
Excellent comment.
If only Bernie would use his podium to Define for many US citizens the terminology.
IMHO Bernie has continually squandered many opportunities, actually every time he speaks, to educate.
Education must be critically upgraded in many parts of this country. Dumbing down the electorate is killing us.
As I Dane, I can agree with many points in this article. The so called "American Dream" is here in Denmark and and alive. Social mobility quite possible but with a safety net, so nobody is left behind. But, alas, high taxes. Will Americans be prepared to pay so high taxes?
10
@Mr Larsen They already do. It's taxes in the form of inflation and collective suffering.
Good column. Misses one point (which is one in the eye for Republicans) - the Scandinavian Social Democracies have high rates of business formation and serial entrepreneurship - though when you research this issue online you initially find a string of articles from the American Enterprise Institute (a right wing group funded by the US billionaires) and the Institute of Economic Affairs (a pro-Brexit right wing lobbying shop pretending to be a scholarly think tank) trying to refute this reality. This has been confirmed by non-partisan data from the OECD, so, for example, in Sweden overall, there are 20 start-ups per 1,000 employees, compared to just 5 in the United State, while 65 percent of Swedes aged 18 to 64 think there are good opportunities to start business compared to just 47 percent of Americans. The same sort of data is available for Denmark, Sweden and Norway.
A crucial aspect is the Scandinavian social safety which encourages people to take the risk of being an entrepreneurs, because failure is less of a catastrophe for them or their family. University is free, essential health care is guaranteed for free, childcare is heavily subsidized, social housing is secure, etc. People know that they can take the risk of being an entrepreneur and many of their and their family's necessities will be covered.
9
Of course, Denmark is half the size of New York City.
Good column indeed! America is corrupt because it believes in low taxes, the utmost expression of social egoism and greediness. This is why it chose a president that truly represents "American values." On the contrary Denmark stands by high taxes as an essential national value and rightly so.
6
I see the “high taxes” as an investment in it’s people. If we can get rid of the word “taxes” and replace it with “investment” perhaps we would look at it differently.
All polls say that the Danes are very happy with their system where all pay very high taxes and business & innovation are supported since they are the creators of wealth and jobs.
Who among Democrats would propose Americans pay 50% income tax on salaries from around $65k and 25% value added tax on all goods except basic foodstuffs?
7
Jobs are created by consumer demand. Ask any businessperson.
Wealth is created by labor. Ask any businessperson.
Very good column, Mr. Friedman. I think you point out that Mr. Sander’s articulated view of what a model country is simplistic. One of the things that makes Denmark special is the philosophy of its people. Although, as you point out, Danes are capitalistic and self- reliant, they are also modest- as a society. Their neighbors to the north- the Swedes have a word for this modesty: Lagom, or “just enough.”
We, as Americans don’t have this vocabulary in our culture. But we have other words or expressions: a more perfect union, for one. And we have achieved the fairness Mr. Sanders wants before through things like The New Deal.
Thus, in order to obtain the social safety net Mr. Sanders desires, we will need to develop out of our own culture and vocabulary a unique solution. I don’t think Mr. Sanders has the intellectual heft or leadership skills to do this, unfortunately.
6
All of the nonsense about socialism is missing two points.
1. The voters who like Bernie's ideas are in their 20's. This generation feels entitled to anything they want without having to earn it. Democrats are not socialists. That's why Biden's poll numbers are much higher than Sanders'.
2. The US, being a debtor nation, does not have the mountain of ready cash that would be required to implement socialism. We owe huge amounts of loan funds to China. Not only do we need to pay these off, but we need a cash supply that will allow us to pay all socialistic services for at least one year before we tell Americans they can get free educations, free medical care, cancellation of student loan debts, and reparations for citizens who are African American, Hispanic American, Asian American and European Americans whose ancestors were mistreated upon arrival in the US. Finally, the ignorant Americans who think socialism sounds good generally haven't considered the fact that socialism in Scandinavian countries frequently results in paying 80% of wages in taxes before the freebie government payouts begin. We need to stop politicians from telling youngsters that "you'll have pie in the sky when you die".
2
Bernie Sanders does himself no favors by trademarking his policy as 'Democratic Socialism'. Denmark is not Socialist; we have never had a Socialist Government in our 1,200 years of existing as a national state.
As for the US, I see very little chance of successfully adopting principles from Social Democratic welfare state spending (unless we are talking defense spending); it requires high level of trust between the Government and the population; it requires higher taxation and it requires the mentality and care taking of the common good (all for one and one for all), as opposed to individualism.
15
@Thomas
What most Americans don´t get -above all Mr Sanders- is that the European welfare state is a comprehensive package from social model to tax system.
The so-called "free" benefits Mr. Sanders is almost exclusively focussed on are neither free nor the central element of the social and economic model of such state. It´s a core element but an element among others. Europe had to learn in the 80ties and 90ties also that the extent is always subject to the securing of financing. Particularly Scandinavian countries made strong cutbacks and reallocations just to keep the system affordable and to remove financial disincentives. Central Europe did also. So costs are always the guideline for it´s extent.
Mr. Sanders ignores particularly the importance of VAT that has to paid by all consumers depending on their individual consumption. In Germany for example - numbers are availiable easily here - VAT yields almost one third of all taxes:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umsatzsteuer_(Deutschland)#Verteilung_des_Umsatzsteueraufkommens
while wealth tax had to be abandoned in many countries just for practical reasons.
So without VAT any European country could never afford big parts of tax-paid social benefits. Mr. Sanders doesn´t care. But while he is orientated towards the social model of European social democratic welfare state at least Mr. Biden is not. He is just focused on fixing the flawed ACA without financial adventures. So he is definitely not a "true Scandinavian".
2
@Thomas
Your remark about trust might be the most important observation.
Given, that a sizeable part of the Americans isn't even willing to let go of their weapons for fear of the government, America taking a turn into the Danish ways is highly unlikely.
It is also important to note, that this trust is earned the hard way, e. g. by allowing literally any citizen to walk into the majors office asking for access to documents regarding city affairs. I wonder, how many American officials would be comfortable with that.
Living in Germany, which takes sort of a middle ground on these issues, I rather like it to develop into the danish direction.
That said, size matters too. Without the cohesive forces within Denmark, it wouldn't have had a chance of snowball in hell to survive its abrasive neighbors and business partners - that is to say: the sense of community was forced by outside pressure.
Denmark is able to sustain its social welfare programs and provide its citizens with generous benefits not due to entrepreneurial ingenuity, but because it exports its poverty. All those 'inspirational' multi-national corporations you cite exploit labor in poorer countries across the globe. And that's to say nothing of Denmark's colonial exploitations. I also find it laughable that you could claim Denmark lacks corruption after Danske Bank's money laundering has been laid bare. I'll agree with one thing, though: Sanders IS wrong about Denmark. He's wrong for suggesting the Danish model is something to be emulated. No, what's needed, rather, is an economic model that provides all people with dignity in their labor, whether or not they reside within America's borders.
1
@Amy
1. The bulk of goods produced by Danish companies, are produced in Denmark and/or EU member states. Our largest export sector (foods and agriculture) produces +80% of its goods in DK.
2. The Danske Bank money laundering scandal is a real thing, yes. But money laundering is not corruption and the crimes were carried out by a Danske Bank subsidiary in Estonia (another sovereign EU nation) where Danish authorities have no jurisdiction. So, I'm not sure how Danske Banks crimes committed in Estonia reflects badly on the Danish welfare state...?
3. You write you 'want dignity in your labor'. Do you have any suggestion of your own as how to achieve that goal? What model would you like the US to emulate?
6
@Thomas,
Money laundering is not corruption?
What a novel excuse.
I am a Scandinavian American and am currently involved in the labor movement.
Meeting this article on its own terms, historically, this grossly mischaracterizes socio-political-econmic history of Scandinavia. The was not a peaceful process, but one of struggle and conflict.
This included, for example, a general strike in 1909 involving 300,000 individuals.
I can't necessarily speak to the rhetoric used by leaders at the time but - even though short of a revolution - it was a process of strikes, marches, riots, and conflict, hardly emotionally detached deliberation.
While, the political situation has shifted in the decades since then, the social services probably required "demonizing" the people that were trying to stop them from being instituted (or simply making a frank appraisal of the power dynamics as they were).
It's doubtlessly worth noting that a major opponent of those who sought to achieve the social safety net the Mr. Friedman is nominally in favor of, is not only the Conservatives but also the Liberals - who consistently hedge, but ultimately uphold current economic and power structures.
7
@Jacob Adamson
Just fyi; 'Liberal' in a Danish context, means something entirely different, than what is means in an American context.
As a European who spends a lot of time in the US - I think this article is absolutely spot on.
Many Proggressives in the US point to the welfare state of many european countries and infer that these is the product of anti-capitalist policies.
And many Conservatives in the US look to Europe and see a failed Socialist project teetering on the bring of communist takeover!
They both have it completely wrong - these countries are robustly and proudly capitalist. In many respects they are *more* capitalist than the US and rank higher than the US on indices of economic freedom and protection of property rights. Nearly all of them rank higher on 'ease of doing business' measures.
Several European countries *consistently* rank as having the highest quality of life in the world - with the best healthcare systems, education, work-life balance and close to the top prosperity. These same countries *fundamentally* rejected Socialism and embraced market based capitalism - combined with relatively high taxes to pay for excellent public services and a social safety net. As the article says, only with pro-business policies can you pay for a good welfare state.
Perhaps some of the partisan divide in the US could be softened by a slightly more honest discussion about the achievements of some of your closest allies in Europe.
8
This column is very wrong both in its portrayal of Sanders as well as it's descriptions of Denmark. Sanders does not demonize businesses if they are paying and treating their workers well, which is required in the Scandinavian countries due to strong work environment laws and strong unions.
Also, Denmark is not led by the conservative and quite anti-immigrant Rasmussen anymore - like Finland and Sweden, they are led again by the center-left - the prime minister is Ms. Mette Frederiksen of the Social Democrat party.
One must remember that in Scandinavia, center-left is not what it is in the US. Even the far-right parties of Scandinavia are for a single payer health care system, and in that way Joe Biden is further to the right than the far right of Scandinavia. That is how far off the US is from Scandinavia politically. Bernie Sanders is clearly the candidate with the most Scandinavian outlook.
I have lived in Norway since 2006.
23
Denmark became Denmark by ensuring that all their citizens benefit from their robust free market. All citizens have health coverage, family leave, etc. As it stands in the US today, it is shareholders who reap monetary benefits while citizens are left without health security and the increasing specter of retirement insecurity. Denmark and the other Scandinavian countries know that social security is a powerful tool for safeguarding their robust free market.
14
Exactly! Sanders's misunderstanding of "the Nordic way" limits his world view. If he read Marquis Childs's 1936 book, "Sweden: The Middle Way", he'd have a better understanding of today's Nordic countries' approach to capitalism and their social contracts. That being said, some of the social contract risks being frayed because of the rise of right wing opposition to immigration, but on the whole, the Nordic way seems generally secure.
As I consider whom to vote for and living in Vermont as I have for 13 years, I remember that Senator Sanders is the junior senator in a state whose total population (625,000,+/-) is far less than the population of the zip code of the Brooklyn neighborhood I grew up in, and that when Bernie was mayor of Burlington, VT, the town's population was around 38,000. That causes me to question Bernie's breadth of experience and potential suitability as a leader of broad coalitions and a big country that is far more diverse than the state of Vermont.
4
@Michael Keane
The strong limitations to immigration & migration proposal was embraced by the left in the Danish elections last year, increasingly by all Nordics for very rational reasons.
"As various scholars have pointed out, there is a fundamental contradiction between a very liberal immigration policy and the survival of the welfare state.
A welfare state simply cannot afford anything other than a restrictive immigration policy if welfare arrangements are to remain at a reasonable level. This has now been fully agreed upon by the Danish Social Democratic leadership."
https://samf.ku.dk/presse/kronikker-og-debat/the-danish-social-democratic-case/
1
Now who will be the new Bernie for 2024?
Or are we abandoned now to hyper-capitalism in both parties? Our media certainly seems intent on that abandonment.
6
There is no Santa Claus, plain and simple. Democratic voters finally decided to give that myth the boot. The question now is whether the there will be unity or division by the disgruntled followers of old Saint Nick.
5
Aside for wordplay about what Sanders means by 'socialism,' I don't follow Thomas Friedman's logic.
Sanders has been advocating for policies like those of the Danish government for years. Biden has attacked Sanders' programs, but wants similar proposals to those of Obama or Clinton.
So if you like the Danish government, Friedman tells us, vote for -- Biden?
Let's play along for a minute. How is Biden going to get the proposals he rejects through a Republican senate? That has less chance than getting his own programs from the Republicans.
Unless, unless you believe that Biden's proposals are what Republicans want - that's certainly not the Danish type of government.
8