Mr. Sanders' Bernie Bros are abusive, in the manner white male supremacists abuse ladies in social media. They are abusive in the manner Trump supporters abuse anyone they please in social media. I have been on the receiving end of this. It is disturbing, to say the least, and does not speak well of what we can expect from them if Sanders is elected.
5
In reading the comments here by some of Mr. Sanders' supporters, I keep hearing the notion that the system is rigged or that some how there has been foul play by the DNC.
This is very much the message that Moscow is trying to send to discourage voters. If you listen to this Russian paen you will have been had by Mr. Putin. We must resist this notion.
Vote blue no matter who.
4
I agreed with most of what Sanders has to say about the need to have a government shaped by the needs of common people rather than oligarchs. And I would vote for Elizabeth Warren's dog before I would vote for Trump. But I would have voted for any other Democratic candidate before I would vote for Sanders.
I believe he would be a terrible president. I believe he is inflexible and unyielding, which may be a good thing as you struggle to gain power, but is a fatal flaw for a leader. I doubt he could make the transition from campaigner to leader.
When asked how he would deal with Republican opposition, his response has been he would go to the people and campaign against them. Using the bully pulpit to argue policy is great, using the bully pulpit to campaign against your opposition is a disastrous strategy for the leader of a country with a political system that is becoming more and more tribalized every day.
Like Trump, once in office, I am afraid he would vilify and attack his opponents and become president for his followers and true believers, not for the whole country.
We need dramatic changes in campaign finance, health, environment, education, finance, and labor policy. But I am afraid a Sanders' presidency would further tear at the fabric of this country and not achieve any of these needed changes. Bernie is a scold, not a leader and scolds belong in the Senate, not the White House.
13
If Bernie could persuade Warren to be his running mate, by making her a co-equal partner in the campaign and crafting a platform based on their points of agreement, and guaranteeing his would be a one-term presidency so she could run in 4 years, I think they could win. Biden’s poor record and obvious dementia are very concerning. We need very sharp people to repair the immense damage Trump has done to the Federal government and foreign standing and alliances, and to move quickly against the climate catastrophe. Warren’s the sharpest person around.
49
@Portia Absolutely.
5
@Portia If the voters were interested in sharpness, they wouldn't have rejected Warren "too shrill!" or Buttigieg "too rehearsed!"
4
@Portia
Warren will not be his running mate. Warren till not endorse Bernie either. The Bernie Bros were awful to her and she stated Bernie is responsible for that. Not to mention Bernie told her not to run and scrambled to humiliate her in her own home state!
Second most of Warren's high income supporters will go to Biden.
Third Warren is also over 70. Either candidate would select a running mate under 60!!!
5
Can Senator Sanders still win the nomination? I sure hope not, because he can't beat Trump. Sanders' signature issue (Medicare for All) is an unpopular plan that Trump can easily use to win over the voters who tipped the House to Democrats in 2018.
Let's be clear: Sanders' "Medicare for All" plan (M4A) is not really Medicare. Rather, it is an untested plan with no premiums, co-pays, co-insurance, or limits. No nation in the world has a health plan like M4A . M4A is like giving children unlimited free candy and expecting the candy industry to somehow meet the demand while the government sets the prices and piles on mountains of new regulations. Sen. Sanders cannot overrule the fundamentals of economics. M4A can't work.
Remember how badly the Obama Admin. fumbled the roll out of the ACA exchanges, even with years to prepare? That was a tiny hill compared to the mountain of M4A.
Remember "Harry and Louise," the insurance industry campaign that killed Clintoncare in the 1990s. If the health insurance industry was able to defeat a plan involving government regulation, just imagine what they will do in the face of a plan that would put them out of business.
Remember endless litigation against the ACA? It's still going on now! After 4 years of Trump packing the federal courts, any M4A plan would be crushed by litigation.
We need a nominee who can beat Trump and who can govern effectively. Sanders cannot do either.
28
@The Judge
There are plenty of countries with single payer coverage, which is what Sanders really means. Medicare for All is used because that's what people know, the don't know "Single-Payer". What cannot work is the healthcare system we have now--and Sanders is quite right in his criticisms of it. I'm not sure why you think lukewarm nostalgia act Biden will both A) govern better and B) have a better shot at beating Trump.
23
@Bret You are buying into the Sanders line without addressing the obvious flaws in that line. I.e., Sanders says we can have M4A because other countries have national health care. That is a weak and obviously flawed argument. First, as I said, there is no country in the world with the system that Sanders is campaigning on. Claiming we can have System X because other countries have System Y doesn't work. And there is no country in the world that attempted the scope of change to a built up healthcare infrastructure over the time period Sanders is describing (4 years). And all the other countries he cites have parliamentary forms of government, which allow the majority party greater freedom to legislate. In the US, the minority party has much greater power than in parliamentary systems. I agree that the current system is inadequate, but M4A is not the answer. This is obvious to anyone who steps back and stops engaging in wishcasting.
Also - it's obvious why Biden will have a better chance of beating Trump: because Biden isn't a socialist promising to take away health insurance from 150 million people. I don't favor Biden (none of my preferred candidates even ran in this election). But at least he isn't engaging in political malpractice. If Sanders is the nominee, Trump will win by a bigger EC margin than his margin over HRC.
6
@The Judge
One thing I've noticed watching the Sanders/Biden thing over a long period of time is a question that has always seemed to be avoided/never answered when put to people with definite opinions pro-Sanders.
The man either Bernie or Joe will be running against very obviously has no good will at all for Democratic well-being, & thus a great deal of interest in the party’s fielding the candidate perceived as the weaker of the two.
Why has that man, sowing division in the party, thrown his direct "support" specifically behind Sanders, trying to make people believe he was cheated in 2016? Inasmuch as it's in his/GOP's interest to run against the weaker candidate, would he not logically therefore do all in his power to assure that candidate is the Dem nominee?
There's by nature only one answer to the question, is there not? Occam's Razor, folks....
3
There is no way Bernie wins the democratic nomination. And no way he wins as an independent.
Bernie's dozens of out of this world costly proposals would break the U.S. Bank into a million pieces. Bernie cares not a whit about how they should be paid for, but the rest of the democratic party does.
Bernie's supporters in 2016 trashed and threatened Hillary and her supporters non stop. Guess What Bernie Did??? Absolutely Nothing. Same story, different year...threats against Warren. Why Bernie's supporters do not own up to their mistreatment and abuse of women candidates is anyone's guess. But do not count on Bernie for correcting that mistreatment and abuse. It is not in Bernie's DNA to do so.
And last and certainly not least, Bernie will never, ever grab independents and undecideds, because he's a dedicated, confirmed socialist. This country does not elect a socialist, no way, no how.
trump's only chance at winning in 2020 is if Bernie is on the ticket as an independent in November. That is his only chance. And that is why trump is doing everything he can, right now, to tout Bernie over everyone else, and to increase the chances that voters will tip the scales towards Bernie, to keep Bernie's hopes alive so that Bernie does not drop out.
Joe without Bernie's support against trump...anyone's guess. Joe with Bernie's support against trump...slam dunk for the democratic party.
Who do you support Bernie? Democrats, or trump? Get your ego out of the way, and decide.
8
Remember, Biden did not win in the first 3 early states till South Carolina. There are reasons that voters in those early states,who had the unique opportunity and a lot of time to closely examine Biden, decided to reject him as the party's nominee. Historically, the first Caucus and Primary were designed to examine any presidential candidates closely, and No Candidate Who Finished Below Third In Both Iowa and New Hampshire Had Ever Been Elected The President Of United States. Normally, such campaign will go nowhere. But because the Establishment have no alternative to replace Biden, they have to unite and do his class work for him because he's a special student and they have low expectations for him. But That Means Disaster in November General Election if Biden is the Nominee. Once again, history shows that No Candidate Who Finished Below Third In Both Iowa and New Hampshire Had Ever Been Elected The President Of United States. Those who ignore history are on the path of destruction. If Biden is the Nominee, prepare thyself for disappointment and snatching of teeth the night of November 2020 general election.
34
@Ukosi No candidate with zero government and military experience had been elected President in a very long time (possibly the entire history of the nation) before Trump. You can't make the case against Biden based solely on statistical oddities.
Also, your caps keep seems to be malfunctioning.
3
I knew right from November 2016, after Hillary lost to Trump, that A Female Presidential Candidate Will Not Win in 2020 Because People Are Suffering From Hillary's Lost Post-Traumatic Syndrome (HLPTS). I said right from November 2016 that it's going to be Bernie versus Biden, and I know that Democrats Will Lose If Bernie Sanders Is Not The Nominee just as it was in 2016. I said the same in Summer 2016 after Bernie Sanders dropped out, that Trump will become the President. And It Came To Past because most Sanders' Independent supporters that I met here in Pennsylvania chose Trump as their second choice. They Have No Love For Either Republican or Democratic Establishment; just like Bernie Sanders himself who's also Independent.
11
Sanders certainly could beat Trump. But the “traditional” Dems just made sure he’s never gonna get that chance. So instead, we will be forced to watch The Terminator Donald Trump destroy Bambi Joe Biden in the general election. Sadly, it will be a stomach-churning spectacle that will leave all of us in deep despair.
5
Call me cynical if you want, but when both Buttigieg and Klubucher drop out just two days before Super Tuesday voting starts and both endorse Biden that quickly, it makes me think that there might have been some discussion of a quid pro quo with Biden and the DNC. It wasn't fair at all for the dropouts supporters and voters and does not reflect well on the character of Buttigieg or Klubucher.
4
Call me cynical if you want, but when both Buttigieg and Klubucher drop out just two days before Super Tuesday voting starts and both endorse Biden that quickly, it makes me think that there might have been some discussion of a quid pro quo with Biden and the DNC. It wasn't fair at all for the dropouts supporters and voters and does not reflect well on the character of Buttigieg or Klubucher.
2
No. Just my opinion, but a considered one.
Call me cynical if you want, but when both Buttigieg and Klubucher drop out just two days before Super Tuesday voting starts and both endorse Biden that quickly, it makes me think that there might have been some discussion of a quid pro quo with Biden and the DNC. It wasn't fair at all for the dropouts supporters and voters and does not reflect well on the character of Buttigieg or Klubucher.
2
Why does this analysis ignore the very real win in popular votes of Hillary Clinton. The only musty odor I'm picking up here doesn't emanate from Obama years. It is mansplaining that erases women's considerable achievements.
2
No, he can't. He never could have and never will.
Q: Can Bernie Sanders Still Win?
A: No.
1
Can Bernie Sanders Still Win?
Not if the NYT has anything to do with it. Headlines on the front page as I submit this comment:
>>Biden’s Rise Gives the Establishment One Last Chance
>>Bernie Sanders Is Going for Broke
>>Can Bernie Sanders Still Win?
>>Why Warren Supporters Aren’t a Lock to Get Behind Sanders
>>As Bernie Sanders Pushed for Closer Ties, Soviet Union Spotted Opportunity
And the only other one to mention Biden, besides the one above:
>>Joe Biden is quickly moving to hire aides from the campaigns of candidates who have left the race.
Need I (or you, NYT) say more?
4
As long as Bernard Sanders still has the smiling, smirking, hacking, interfering and meddling support of our Russian Czar Father Vladimir Putin and his key henchman our Israeli King Father Benjamin Netanyahu as their Democratic Party nominee preferred choice to lose to their mutual pawn pet puppet Donald Trump in November, 2020 then there is a chance, a hope and a prayer that Sanders can still win this race.
Putin's foes tend to end up in hospitals, mental institutions, prisons, urns and coffins.
1
Bernie's a revolutionary. His speech is polarizing which is makes for good movement building -- but ultimately, you have to be able to win over voters with charm, affection and genuine relationality, and some basic sense of how the revolution fleshes out in human -- and not ideological -- terms. Bernie seems to lack some of this messaging ability.
Let me say too, that even with this drawback, I have funded and knocked doors for Bernie in 2016 and 2020, because I believe that the radicality of his message in the only thing that has cut through the fog of disinformation of the 1% gilded class. Without someone ranting full-time about injustices and gathering millions of supporters, all the powerful people would simply keep falsely droning that we are living in just, moral, ethical world. They love gaslighting the public. Bernie is what prevents their spin and lying from gaining traction.
I have supported four candidates, in the following order: Warren, Sanders, Buttigieg and Williamson. Kobuchar and Harris always seemed a little bit too much of political animals for me.
If, by some miracle, Bernie could have some type of enlightenment experience and admix unto his personality some Elizabeth Warren and Marianne Williamson, he might make up some ground. But the personality is notoriously unmaleable. Getting the apple to fall further from the tree requires suspension of the laws of gravity. Not impossible, but notwithstanding a revelation, unlikely.
Biden is the risky choice. Hillary Clinton was undeniably the moderate choice in 2016, and voters in PA, WI, MI demonstrated they would rather take a chance on an extremist like Trump than a status-quo, run of the mill candidate like Hillary Clinton. Joe Biden represents EXACTLY what it is that swing state voters rejected in 2016, with the added bonus that he is about 100x less mentally sharp than Mrs. Clinton. Donald Trump will run circles around Joe in a debate, and it's a sad thing to say.
Though Bernie has his own elect ability challenges, he can run on a populist economic platform that challenges Trump in the rust belt, rather than forfeiting that argument to Trump (NAFTA, TPP, PNTR, etc...). Joe Biden will not only have to convince people that he is mentally equipped for the job, but that he is offering something fundementally different to voters than Hillary was, and on that front, I don't think he has a shot. I will leave this, with a list of the moderate candidates in the past elections:
Moderate in 2016: Hillary Clinton
Moderate in 2012: Mitt Romney
Moderate in 2008: John McCain
Moderate in 2004: John Kerry
Moderate in 2000: Al Gore
And that's why the moderate argument should scare us.
5
of course he can still win- IF Warren endorses him. But- SHE WILL NOT DO THAT! she is waiting to see who the winner will be- and then pursue that winner in order to become Vice. This is what she did in 2016- abandoned Bernie and endorsed Hilary. What does this say about the authenticity of her professed political beliefs????
4
No he cannot win. The DNC, DCCC, and corporate media and pundits will make certain he doesn't.
1
@Magan
Bernie's biggest challenge is the Fear the status quo has programmed into the population; they've been entirely cowed to believe they cannot dream or hope or have a better life. The pandemic has doubled that false fear.
We only have the fear of fear to worry about. It's deadly, making us small-minded do-nothings afraid of failure, which hollows us out.
Moderates are amazed at how Trumpsters can vote against their interests yet every moderates starts their comment with, "I am in favor of what Bernie says" then goes on about voting for Biden.
Trumpsters are well programmed by Fox News and the moderates are just as well programmed by the mainstream media. Each group of believers is unaware of this.
In fact, (google The Perception Study) Fox viewers have a perception of reality gap of 5%, but moderates, due to NYT and WaPo status quo programming, have a gap of 6%.
Furthermore the most highly educated Democrats have a 30% gap - only beaten by the least educated Republicans (who are programmed by alt-right media) with a reality gap of 35%. But overall the Republicans are more in tune with reality.
Moderates need to realize their assumptions are not data or reality based, but are due to status quo programming and their personal susceptibility to availability and confirmation biases, exactly like the Trumpsters.
Those with the most accurate perception of reality were those who did not follow the news - they escaped the programming.
Without a doubt, Sanders could have won the nomination in 2016 or in 2020. What might he have done differently to have been successful (mistakes future progressives might want to avoid when running for President):
1. Branded himself as an independent, a progressive or an FDR-Democrat rather than a socialist. Why say you are a socialist, and then say that you are not that kind of socialist?
2. Positioned himself as wanting to reform the Democratic Party rather than calling it out as corrupt as an outsider.
3. Avoided dumb statements supporting failed socialist governments in Cuba, Venezuela, and the USSR. What is the point of lauding Castro and Chavez?
4. Laid out a realistic vision for how to get from current state to single payer and low tuition college in public universities, emphasizing more the cost savings and emphasizing less that everything would be "free".
5. Been more optimistic and positive, and less of a critic and gadfly. Few want a cranky gadfly as President.
There is a long history of fighting the good fight on the left, and taking pride in losing (Henry Wallace, Adlai Stevenson and George McGovern come to mind). If folks want to change America for the better, they need to get in synch with where people are, not where they wish they were.
If a candidate is not prepared to be more patriotic and more optimistic about the future than the opposition, then why run for the Presidency?
12
@MVonKorff
Liz did most of that - even copied Bernies's ideas - and he beat her from the start. Voters don't like pandering at all, they'd prefer an authentic no-compromise black coffee type of candidate to a Starbuck's Mocha Cookie Crumble Frappuccino.
1
Bernie has been very successful in perpetuating the fiction that his support comes from the "working class." In reality, his most vocal supporters tend to be white, highly educated elites on the East and West Coast who grew up in privilege, in upper middle class or upper class families, later on rebelled against their parents whom they regard as too middle-of-the-road or boring, and now condescendingly portray themselves as speakers for the working class, whose lives and hardship they never actually experienced.
7
Of course he can. That is, if he’s the nominee and we ALL vote for him. If, on the other hand, it’s Biden, will we, including Sanders people, ALL vote for him?
3
What’s remarkable is a Biden turnaround—it’s that voters have finally had a chance to weigh in after months of unhelpful debates and 24/7 Trump, and have spoken so decisively. For Sanders, the path to the nomination that you suggest, unfortunately is “change your message, change your brand” to appeal to more moderate voters. It’s a few years, not months, for that.
2
Biden deelectrifies the election. But he can win. Trump's narcissistic corrupt bigoted mindless presidency is begging to be repudiated. The business cycle is ending Trump's only mainstream issue. The coronavirus was a catalyst that broke the stock market of its debt driven assent. The last four months the stock market was a bubble waiting to burst. The GOPs tax cut has not performed the way they promised. These huge tax cuts that mainly help the wealthiest never do. In its wake trillions of dollars were accrued in the national debt. Trump's response to the public health crisis has been belligerent and centered on himself rather than on the corona virus. Sanders' campaign to bring democracy to the aide of the poor and middle class who are mired in an income inequality cycle that is the worst in the history of the country. This cycle is far from over. Biden and the establishment Democrats will low ball the issue claiming that directly attacking it will harm the economy. Much as they did in the Obama years. Citizens United has allowed a concentration of political power to the wealthiest. Sanders is running on the fact that a universal health insurance system is a national security issue. Gov't sponsored health insurance is the norm in the developed world. The USs insistence that private insurance is good because alleged socialism is bad doesn't hold water. The USs health care system wastes money with poor outcomes for those not favored with affluence.
1
Voters did not go with Biden on Super Tuesday because he was their first choice. They did it because they lost their nerve hours before the vote.
Biden won South Carolina, a state that will likely vote for Trump in the general election. Exit polls in Virginia indicated voters agreed with Sanders' platform but were worried about "electability," despite the number of polls showing Sanders to be the most electable person in the lineup.
A friend of mine, a former Republican who left her party over the meanness of Trump's campaign, voted for Sanders in the primary of 2016. She emailed me that she had voted for Biden this time. When I asked why, she said she didn't think the superdelegates would let him to win, and she had been touched by the fact that John McCain's survivors referred to him as "Uncle Joe."
I have equally nice "uncles," but I wouldn't vote for them. This race offers us a chance to get a progressive in office for a change. Or at least to demonstrate to the superdelegate kingmakers that the party MUST start taking progressive.
I live in Virginia. I didn't weenie out.
My main issue: I'm sick and tired of American policy being dictated by Big Money donors who have no interest in our welfare and think an establishment Democrat will allow the money-based status quo. And they are right. But we in fact need change, not a return, given that that's how we got in this mess.
You want warm and fuzzy? Get a dog. A dog will always have your self-interest in mind.
4
"Mr. Biden’s weaknesses may become more apparent now that the race has narrowed. "
This is all that matters. Democrats have been reluctant to discuss and think about the decline in Joe's mental acuity but it will sink him in the general.
The knockout combination of clear corruption allegations vis-a-vis Hunter Biden and the senility of Biden is a gift to the politically savvy incumbent president.
Whether you think Bernie will be able to push his agenda through congress or not you have to deal with the reality that Biden guarantees us another four years of Donald Trump. Anything less is pure fantasy.
1
@John He's got a better shot at it than Sanders - far better. My grand fear is that a Sanders' loss in this leadership race will lead to tens of thousands of his adamant supporters displaying a grand political temper tantrum by staying at home on Election Day - as many of them did when Hilary Clinton was chosen as the nominee in 2016.
2
@Luke Fisher
You are correct, and that will happen. Can't blame them after four years of being screamed at by the Moderates for electing Trump -
Even though 80% voted for Hillary and Bernie held 39 rallies to support her, which is what gave her the popular vote.
(Still waiting for the Moderates to thank Bernie and his millions of supporters, waiting for Hillary to thank them, too.)
After four years of irrational disparagement the Bernie Bros are set to take their Revenge.
That 80% will never again vote for a corporate status quo shill, instead those millions will vote for the anti-establishment Trump.
Guess the Moderates didn't learn a thing and made another mistake with Biden. It will be their last mistake.
Dumb actions have consequences.
1
On the one hand, I'm not surprised by where we are at the moment; on the other hand, I'm dumbfounded. I always knew Sanders' fight to reform the Democratic party was an uphill battle. But in the end, moderates chose to rally around Biden, of all candidates?
I understand concerns about Sanders' politics, but Biden is quite obviously not in his mental prime. If President Trump, of all people, can make the case that Biden isn't all there, why on earth did moderates choose him in the first place? Is this really the best the Democratic party can do?
Please tell me that we're not counting on "yeah, but Trump is worse" rationalizations to win the general election. We know from experience that those negative arguments don't motivate voters in sufficient numbers. People need to be positively inspired to vote for the Democratic nominee.
If Biden wins the primary but loses the general election, my faith in the Democratic party leadership will be gone until all of them are replaced, the sooner the better. Losing twice to a loser like Trump would be inexcusable.
5
@Chris I believe that Biden can beat Trump and that Sanders cannot. Biden is calming, Sanders makes many of us feel as edgy as we have these 3 plus years with trump as president. Biden is a democrat, Sanders is not. Biden is securing endorsements from a wide range of prominent democrats, including Jim Clyburn who is a gentleman and a tough politician. Sanders told Rachel Maddow that he was not interested in Clyburn's endorsement becasue "I don't share his politics." Biden will be able to attract the voters he claims he will, Sanders is not delivering the youth vote nor the Latino vote that he promised. So we disagree. But I hope the democratic party takes your final paragraph to the bank WHEN Biden WINS. They must never again put We the People through such a nightmarish run-up to an election. They need to bring back Howard Dean the day after the November election.
2
So who will run in 2024? We can set that up now. It is the VP race.
After 8 years of Trump and two defeats of the backstabbing DNC, it may be that some real reformer could win the race against someone like Pence.
This may be the best we can do now.
5
Sanders' problem is the same one he's always had: He's great at identifying problems but terrible at coming up with and delivering on solutions.
The commentary from Bree Newsome Bass is out of line. The "white" establishment decided this? No, apparently black voters had a great deal to do with it, too. The "grassroots" movement is only a movement if your supporters get out and vote. Young people get polled but do not vote. That is the problem.
And this is coming from someone who voted for Sanders. I'll happily take Biden instead. All Sanders has done is disrupt the Democratic presidential primary and foster anger and resentment for the last 6 years. He's great at making people angry like him. He's not a good leader.
5
This primary race is far from over between Sanders and Biden. However, if Biden wins the nomination it will be another four years of Trump. Firstly, it was moderate democrats, such as Biden, who created the conditions for a Trump candidacy in the first place by not promoting and passing quality progressive policy that actually helps Americans. Secondly, to say a moderate candidate is a safer option is nonsense considering Bill Clinton, Al Gore, Obama, and Hillary were all moderate presidents or presidential candidates who either were followed by a very conservative Republican or lost to a very conservative Republican. Hillary Clinton should be a prime example because she lost to the most unpopular presidential winner in modern history. Thirdly, Biden has dementia and cannot put a coherent sentence together and will get destroyed by Trump during the debates. Sanders still has his mind, knows how to debate, and will stick to the issues that most Americans care about. In conclusion, the Democrat Party may need to learn the hard way again in 2020 that moderatism doesn't work. Old habits die hard.
3
@Demetrius Qiang , Al Gore won and Hillary Clinton won. Democratic leadership needs to make electoral nonsense and cheating by the GOP an important part of their planning from day one of the Biden presidency. Our democracy is very fragile at the moment, and brushing the crumbs under the rug like Barack and Nancy did when THEY won in 2008 will not suffice this time.Loyal dems do not want to only "look ahead." We need to insure a cancer like trump and his GOP enablers never happens to us again.
1
It was never a distinct possibility outside the fevered speculation by the media anxious to keep readers and viewers attention.
4
The failure of all those enthusiastic young voters to vote on Super Tuesday is a why Bernie cannot win.
8
@Joseph Huben. Just an anecdote from CA. I know of 6 young people in their 20s (including my son) who sat out the 2016 election, in spite of the exhortations from their worried parents. This time they all voted-- not a one for Sanders.
Just amazes me that so many think that Biden is the one with a chance against Trump. Biden is a huge risk and I'm afraid Trump will have a field day with him. Could be painful to watch.
3
I agree with Michelle Goldberg on this one.
Sanders is an intellectual giant compared to Biden. It will become very evident in the next debate that Biden is senile and the DNC won't be able to tip toe around this stumbling block much longer. I'm appalled that the DNC rallied around Biden, knowing about his condition. The Republicans will shred him into pieces.
We'll talk again after the next debate.
5
At her Cambridge doorstep, Warren speculated that her assumption there was a “Middle” lane alternative to Sanders’ “Progressive” and Biden’s “Moderate” paths to victory (of liberal Democratic principles over Trump’s version of Republican conservatism) was wrong. As others have pointed out, the manifesto of needed reform of the Democratic Party was borne out of the Harvard-based Democratic Renaissance Project (DRP) and its intellectual predecessors and progeny, whose successful “scholar-politicians” included Obama, Warren, Buttigieg, and (Katie) Porter. What the DRP and its Harvard-trained practitioners need to do to find the middle path to victory over Trumpism is to move out of the Green Zone of safety to win the real “battle of the streets.” I think Betsy from Oklahoma, rather than Professor and Senator Liz, will still do just that (perhaps as VP, Attorney General, or Secretary of Treasury - her choice - in a Biden or Sanders Administration) once she and her still redoubtable team help the default candidate of choice of the Democratic Party better define and embrace the populist Last Mile of Heartland America where most of the dispossessed live - and die. Betsy, it’s time to decide whom to endorse and then to move on. No more agonizing.
The 'Please not Sanders Democrats' are Republicans in disguise. They hope the best for themselves, but not for the rest of you. And certainly not for the oppressed, the poor, the sick, the homeless, the students etc. And, I think that is really important too, not for the rest of the world. Image my country, already for the bigger part under sea level. Go for Bernie, please!!
4
People in Iowa and NH got to examine Biden for the better part of a year and voted the way they did. You may argue they aren't representative of the rest of the country, but the weaknesses they saw in Biden are weaknesses he still has. I support Sanders, but I get some people might not be ready to do the same (the Times is certainly doing its part to frighten them--see the ridiculous piece today on the Burlington-Yaroslavl sister-city thing). For Biden to pull it off in November though, IF he becomes the nominee, everyone is going to have to close their eyes to what he really represents: a "consensus" that is running on fumes and needs to change, but won't. We're going to be playing poker with a pair of threes, don't be surprised if we get cleaned out.
3
All of these former candidates piling on for Biden is a bad look for the party.
1
@George Bukesky Why? If the moderate vote outweighs the progressive vote but is divided, how is it a "good" look for a progressive candidate to win that way? What would it mean if a progressive candidate won the primary and then had to earn the support of a majority-moderate base that didn't agree with him? In my view consolidating the moderate vote in a head-to-head battle is the more democratic contest. If Bernie can't win over moderates, that's a Bernie problem, not a party problem.
3
@JRK There are a lot of young voters who are leery of party politics. This makes two elections in a row where the party appears to be falling in line for the establishment candidate. If Biden can't win this on his own he doesn't deserve the nomination. To be clear, I don't have a problem with other moderates backing out, I just think they shouldn't take sides.
1
Sanders represents a third party that doesn't exist, and whose members, if it did, vote in low numbers. It is a fools errand for Biden to try and "reach" Sanders' ardent supporters, if it means compromising the centrism and maturity that most American voters are looking for. Will Biden definitely beat Trump? No, of course not. But Sanders' nomination (as evidenced by the gleeful Russian web activity on Sanders behalf) totally guarantees Trump's re-election. Biden should be nominated, with no post-election hand wringing if it doesn't work out and he loses. He is the only logical choice.
4
Elizabeth - have a sit down with Joe. Distance yourself from Bernie. He is far too strident and well knows that Socialism is the 3rd rail in American politics. Come fully into the Democratic Party tent. Continue to express your views and policy proposals. Stay in the Senate and work to overturn the destruction caused by Trumputin and his facilitators. Restore the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, white collar crime still far too prevalent. Calm down AOC. Pragmatism is critical. Moderation and incremental change is paramount. Joe will choose qualified and ethical staffing. Dump trump, Ditch Mitch, bar Barr, emasculate Graham, flip the Senate, increase the House Democratic Majority, drown the Tea Party phony patriots. Lot's of work to do.
4
I think as Super Tuesday sinks in Sanders may get more support.
4
"Electability" is now code for not wanting to vote for Bernie.
But predicting electability is probably futile.
I would just like to ask all those black voters in the South who voted for Joe Biden:
How is his close relationship to Wall Street and his being corporation friendly going to help you?
Do you really want to support a guy who has called for Social Security cuts four times over forty years?
Biden backed bills to make it harder for Americans to reduce their student debt. Bills Obama voted against.
How exactly is Joe Biden going to help you again?
4
@Joe Answer: Biden will help the thoughtful voters of South Carolina by not being trump. By restoring dignity, calm, and competence to the whitehouse.
2
@karen
So, the status quo. Where nothing gets better.
Are they happy with what they pay for health care?
How many of them have filed for bankruptcy because of medical bills?
There’s absolutely nothing historical about electing an old, rich, white, moderate guy who served as VP with a status quo platform.
It’s played out, by definition.
1
Please take your head out of your... bubble. Bernie appeals to the very left wing of the Democratic party, full stop. There has been no rush of new voters, (especially young voters) who were supposed to lift him to victory. He is NOT a democrat - never has been. He is a self declared socialist, which scares most people under your bubble. Those who get insurance from their employer (the majority of voters) do not want to give up that coverage for medicare for all, and they certainly don't want to be forced to pay higher taxes to get that coverage.
A sanders candidacy would be an unmitigated disaster for Democrats - only left wing radicals think otherwise
3
I don’t see Biden winning against Trump as he is obviously mentally declining at a time when he really has to be focused and quick to respond.
3
Biden never really explained why his son worked for Burisma. Now, imagine trying to explain that to Trump.
3
I'd rather have a President with mental acuity problems than one without a heart. And Trump is CONSTANTLY saying things that make absolutely no sense.
3
Poor Joe has enough embarrassing gaffes on video right now to make a full-length movie, maybe two.
If the Republicans make that movie and run it often, Joe will be hamburger by November.
And Joe can't wiggle out of his predicament: If he goes in for a psych exam and even passes with flying colors, just the fact that he did so will will cause others to doubt his mental faculties; they will even start seeing what they may have overlooked.
Nonetheless, President Joe will have the best people around him; his policies, actions, and spirit will be light-years better than the Orange Menace's.
And Bernie scares a lot of Americans: a revolution? Howsabout we just talk tough, but keep things pretty much as they are? Just look at that stock market; no, wait, don't look there. Oh, I know: Look at that Mexican Wall; putting kids in cages and separating them from their parents staunched the invasion of rapists, murderers, and thieves, thus keeping America great, which did amazing things for our global reputation: It really moved the needle!
1
Sorry he is toast. Medicare for all is not going to pass the Congress and so M. Sanders comes across as a huckster to Texans. On three things his statements leave him out of step with the majority of people in this country: Medicare for all, unbridled immigration and anti-Israel.
1
Corona virus frightening
Stock market crash frightening
Let’s go for the trifecta and have a political revolution!
Sanders is done.
2
Bernie Sanders can still win some states like Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania because Biden is getting whacked by the press for being a whack job and sooner or later he may no longer get a pass on what exactly the Burisma and China corrupt deal was. I think NY Times should find out whether the Ukraine deal said to have been debunked was really bunk and that there is nothing there. Just like Mike's past comments came to haunt him, there is a lot of what Biden said since the beginning of his career in elected office by today's ethical and moral standards will be found offensive to the African Americans, Women , people of Indian origin, native Americans and the very groups that propped up Biden on super Tuesday.
2
Sanders has led Vermont to the bottom of the economic barrel in the US. He has claimed AIPAC is “racist,” praises left-wing dictators, has photoshopped an ad that falsely aligns him Obama, has had a notably unproductive legislative career, and is a zealot whose “brand” will not allow him to compromise to grow his base (not that anyone would believe him if he tried). He is simply a dyspeptic fellow, unappealing beyond his base, who also happens to be the Republicans best hope to reclaim the House and Senate. That said, it would be best for America if he wins the nomination and runs in 2020, so we can finally put this particular debate to bed.
1
Nice try. Good luck on this failed experiment. I am much older than you and I look through my experienced lenses at Bernie. All I see is a very angry old munchkin who is as self absorbed as Trump. I don't care how much we agree or disagree with his policies. More screaming and anger and rigidity will not get us there. Did you not notice that the people are speaking, or that even before Tuesday, Bernie's numbers were way below 50%? He had almost the entire super liberal lane to himself while Biden had to share those moderate votes.
Also, please note that his supposed comrade Elizabeth is chafed at all or your Bernie Brother nastiness. Those of us with a shred of decency recognize that these immature young men do not represent us. If Bernie can't control them, then how can we trust Bernie to control anything. I suggest you get a life and forget red-faced finger-pointing Bernie. Elizabeth already has. You are young. Find a new passion like sex.
5
I’ll be a lot more convinced when the followers of St. Bernie start showing me numbers proving that they’re getting way bigger turnout among what they swear is their base, stop telling black voters that they’re clueless about their own best interests, and start honestly dealing with the fact that when you tell people M4A means you have your employer bennies taken away and replaced with taxes and a government plan their support goes poof.
Be nice if more of them actually knew what was in Obamacare, the diff between “universal,” and, “single-payer,” what health systems actually look like in Europe, too.
1
I love how yesterday there was an article in this same spot titled "How Bernie Sanders Can Still Win", guess that one slipped past the bigwigs upstairs? So glad to see NYT staying on brand by replacing it with a much more derisive article, you wouldn't want to seem even handed or anything.
2
Sanders has simply "Berned" too many bridges. Even his longtime friend, Elizabeth Warren, is fed-up with him, seeing him for what he is: dishonest, ruthless and self-serving.
3
"Can Bernie Sanders Still Win?" No
2
As was once said of FDR, "he hs a second-rate intellect, but a first-rate temperament," so is this true of Biden. He's decent, he's emtionally stable, experienced in government, all more important than Biden's verbal gaffes. And anyway, for the Democratic primaries, it is close to game over, Biden blow-out victories in Florida and Georgia and other major states will leave Sanders in the dust.
2
There will be a lot of handwringing as to why once again a woman can't be POTUS....
Well, we need to look no further than Bernie Sanders.
1] Had Bernie not divided the Dem party with his one-note divisive and nonsensical politics in 2016, HRC would have been POTUS and there would be only 3 token conservatives, heading to 2, on the SCOTUS.
2] Dems in 2020 way have been more likely to take a risk with nominating a woman.....etc.... a risk they are unprepared to take this yr.
3] In 2016, tens of thousand of Bernie supporters WENT to the poll in key states and did not vote for HRC, or any candidate, and there is no telling how many didn't go at all or voted for DJT.
Bernie Sanders has inflicted unmeasurable damage to the Dem party, which I think is his and his 30% fanatic base goal.
No Bernie; HRC is in the WH.
So Bernie is the reason why we don't have a woman POTUS.
"Enlightened times will enlighten only a small number of honest people, the vulgar masses will always be fanatics.”
Voltaire
To answer your question NO
2
I am with De Vito: Bernie’s going to do it! His mental capacity is undisputed, undiminished, Biden, is not match for Sanders! And Biden’s policies go against the middle class grain.
1
My wife and I laugh when I read her these comments talking about how Biden is more electable than Sanders. Have non of you her Biden talk? He has dementia and can barely form full sentences. Trump will crush him in the general.You will lose the Supreme court for a long long time because you listened to the Corporate wing of the party.
Its Trumps America now because you blinded yourselves to Clintons faults. You are doing it again.
2
If Bernie could re-make himself the way Bokat-Lindell suggests...
Great ideas...he's done it before, but he was much younger then. I wish he could but we'll have to see. As for Biden, he's a walking pinata and there isn't any remedy for that. It looks more and more like the black leaders in South Carolina have shot us in the foot.
1
Bernie should win, but most likely he won't, and that fact may give Trump the White House again.
Look at those Southern states who voted for Trump last time and will vote for Trump again this time in the national election. Sure, Biden won the irrelevant black votes, and those votes will probably give him the Democratic nomination, but come fall, those black votes may be deceptive, as Trump may do better than Biden in the north, where Bernie may have been able to garner the needed votes.
Or do people actually think the South will stop voting racist? Thanks to the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965, the South is still lost to the Democratic Party, no matter how many African Americans vote.
Hope I am wrong. But I have no doubt that Trump is practicing dogwhistles in his spare time.
Hugh
1
Michelle Goldberg is wrong again as she once again tries to push for sanders over biden. she is connected to sanders supporters and sanders himself in ways that limit her ability to be fair and unbiased. she cant stop making false statements about biden and never talks about sanders hiding his medical info which would show that he is a heart attack waiting to happen. look at his red face-high blood pressure, he wont let us see the items in his medical report which show he is 70% more likely to have a blockage once again either kill or severly maime him; his demeanor has changed for the worse making him desperate and extremely unattractive to voters; check out his many lies which only a few have fact checked. this is not the person who should be leading the country. our allies begged biden to run and hate the thought of another obnoxious liar like trump ala sanders.
Apropos your Headline: I sure hope not.
No
Of course he can! Just like last time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHS-K7OuLAc
Keep those dollars coming! After all, he probably has his eye on a fourth house.
"Can Bernie Sanders still win?"
NOT A CHANCE. Even the Democrats recognize a Socialist/Communist when they see one.
A vast majority of Americans know there is such thing as FREE LUNCH.
Some one hag got to pay when the other guys don't. Then we the working people who pay taxes have to pick up the Tab.
SANDERS IS DONE!!
Just go away, you tiresome, joyless demagogue.
1
If Biden is the nominee, he will have a chance of winning the election. If Sanders wins the nomination, he will probably lose the race. BS is an all-round disaster.
And for those who complain that media coverage of BS is too critical, I ask you to compare his coverage to that of Warren or -- especially -- of HIllary Clinton in 2016. Why isn't coverage of BS MORE critical? He's such a flawed candidate, with his one speech, cluelessness about how he might put into practice any of his ideas, and constant shouting and finger-pointing.
1
Sanders: "free child care and pre-K and six months of paid parental leave...common-sensical in many other countries, and foregrounding them could win over “anxious suburbanites”
Yes - he is about more than medicare. And his rhetoric allowed a conservative (mistakenly called "moderate") backlash.
Bloomberg: “I don’t think the country wants revolutionary change I think the country wants evolutionary change."
It's a mere matter of degree. Sanders does not aim to dismantle the Constitution--THAT would be a revolution--like rejecting Monarchy/Aristocracy. He wants government FOR common people, as opposed to FOR oligarchs/moneylords/royals. That's NOW a big evolutionary change--but in keeping with US political origins and mythology.
Bloomberg is an oligarch/moneylord. He and Biden are conservatives--pro status quo--maybe even more perks for moneylords. THAT is Aristocracy; it's been creeping up--evolving--for two centuries. It is also the real revolution--the wheel going full circle--overturning the original US democratic revolution. Sanders and Progressives want to change that.
Paradoxically it's progress by remembering the ideals of 1776. Revolution by going back to the original revolution!!
The NYT even calls Sanders a Poplulist--which applies also to Trump. C'mon.
Sanders (and Warren) are Progressives (= pro-progress, change for the better).
Bloomberg/Biden are at best Conservatives = beneficiaries of the status quo--oligarchs/moneylords or their "oli-groupies".
80
Michael, why does the NYT not pick this excellent piece of thinking and writing. Come on NYT!
2
@Michael Kubara
You should be working for Bernie, because if you could remake him - or even "re-brand" him - as a progressive, he might have some kind of remote chance in November.
But you're Trump-like in using words to mean what you want them to mean.
To say that "He's no revolutionary - he won't be tearing up the Constitution" MAKES HIM SOUND like "the Rand Paul" of the Dem. Party - someone, just a little further out on an unmistakable branch of the Dem. Party.
When Obama was linked to that radical and unsavory clergyman, he distanced himself - effectively!
From day one this year, Bernie - because that IS WHO HE IS - had one answer for being (yes, it's as disqualifying for him as Bloomberg's 3 terms as a Republican Mayor were) a Democratic Socialist - "I AM, and I'm proud of it!"
Had luck and a few other things been with him, he might have snagged the Dem. nomination - heck, he still could - but that answer made - AND MAKES! - him unelectable in the USA in 2020.
Truly, you don't have to take my word for it - the voters in Newton, MA wrote it in 30 foot high letters this past Tuesday. It took a JFK to win a close one in 1960 - ditto, Obama in 2008. You know what's coming - and it's incontestable - Bernie is no JFK, Bernie is no Obama.
The NY Times (and a majority of its readers) do NOT pick the US President - people in Milwaukee's suburbs do. They've been polled and now (STILL!!) favor Trump. But to ignore Mass.'s message would truly be criminally insane!
@Michael Kubara
The meaning of terms like “progressive” and “conservative” changes over time. The people now called conservatives are not supporters of the status quo; they are what used to be called radical right wing nuts. Ronald Reagan and Barry Goldwater would not be welcome at a CPAC meeting.
Biden is not a conservative, by either the old or the new definition. He’s what used to be called a progressive reformer, when that meant people like Teddy Roosevelt.
Some, me included, would welcome four years of Biden’s calm incrementalism. We’re bleeding from the wounds inflicted by Trump, and we need time to heal.
6
Thank you. Reading a more balanced view of Sanders in the NYT is both refreshing as well as rare. Yes, the number of young and new voters Bernie spoke about has not materialized and that is a problem for his path to the presidency. But his ideas are overwhelmingly wanted by most Democrats and Independents and that too is a path to winning the Presidency. I hope that some of your ideas for improving his campaign are heard by the Sanders people. I say this as a Bernie supporter and volunteer.
1
This might all be academic. On Maddow last night Warren was decidedly more warm and fuzzy about Biden that she was about Sanders saying "I know Joe will always do the right thing." If she endorses Biden, Sanders needs to pack it in. If he fights to the convention it's apparent he is in it for Bernie and for no other reason than his ego.
5
By stridently self-labeling as a 'Socialist' Bernie has created an unnecessary cognitive roadblock in the way of expanding beyond his current base of support.
"If I vote for the 'socialist' does that make me a 'socialist'? I don't want to be a 'socialist' (or have people think of me as one)"
People may have been more supportive of many of his 'New Deal' policies if he also didn't make it feel like they had to 'join the team' to do so.
2
A choice between 2 old men is not a choice. That being said, Bernie has never displayed the ability to play well with others nor is he much of a compromiser. And, he would be 79 yrs old when elected. Pair that with having heart disease and no matter how good he looks or how vigorous he seems, taking on a highly stressful 4 yr commitment is risky for him and the country. While Joe was not in my top 4 choices, he does play well with others and hopefully instead of focusing on a revolution that will be very difficult to pull off, he will have the smarts to put together a stellar cabinet to repair the damage that Trump has done and begin making the changes that our country needs going forward. At this point, under the existing circumstances, Joe is the best option.
12
@Kris Bennett
I disagree, though perhaps not for the reason some might think. It clearly *is* a choice -- a choice of vice-president. So, the answer? Look at who each old man favors as a running mate, because that's where the choice is.
1
@Kris Bennett Joe certainly plays well with the credit card industry.
1
Democrats largely agree on the goals. We differ on how fast we get there. So we should just unite behind the nominee. Bernie deserves a fair shot and he is getting it. But if loses, fair and square, then he should support the nominee just as Biden should if he loses. Either nominee is not perfect but much better than the alternative, period. Democrats can debate what can be done given the post-election reality of the Senate and the House. That is everything from changing rules, and what can be done in 4 years, or as part of longer term goal. Every Democrat needs to know there are those who will try to divide us. Don't let them lie and cheat their way to victory. Let's take our country back and then we reinstall the rules of law and justice and start progressing society forward again. Whether its first or second gear we can debate only if we win.
3
@Mark The fact that we know what Biden would do if he lost, but we aren't sure what Bernie would do, is reason enough to say Sanders should not be the nominee. He's not a Democrat, he's a Berniephile.
2
Sanders has some good ideas but a bad campaign. Its built on division and 'everyone is conspiring to get us'. That is what drew me to Warren, similar ideas just presented differently.
If Sanders has any chance to win the nomination, he has to change his tone and messaging. What he and his campaign is doing now is not working outside of his base, which according to an NYT article has shrunk since 2016. He's also has to do something about his internet trolls.
Sanders has to include more people instead of shouting at them.
3
Dear Joe, Bernie,
Here are some simple words that you could use in your campaigns that would be music to my ears in Michigan:
Reduce taxes on the poor and middle class.
Increase taxes on the rich.
Protect and enhance Social Security
Protect and enhance Medicare
Reduce the costs of Prescriptions
Enhance the Affordable Care Act
Reduce the deficit
Follow the Constitution
Stay off Twitter
7
Though I am appalled at a race between two old men, as of Monday I still had Biden at the bottom of the list and hoped that Bernie would bring hordes of new young voters into the race. I do believe in his policies. But he didn’t and won’t and he will lose without them. It is time to get real. We are in a national emergency and winning is all that matters. My best idea: Draft Michelle. Biden-Obama 2020. Win first, figure the rest out later when things get back to normal. Pass it on.
11
@Chuck Burton Biden? why not Warren as VP and then President in 2024? Seriously, it's almost as if people assume she can never win.
1
I have no objection. Warren has been my preferred candidate. But my ticket will win big. That’s why.
1
@Chuck Burton I'm sorry, this thinking is out of touch. We have a populist president who won after an 8 year term of a very popular president and an upswing economy. Let's be reasonable. If we have a serious dialogue of why this happened, we will have to reconcile hard truths. The country reacted against a form of celebrity elitism that came from the Obamas. The "do as we advocate but not as we do". It's all feel good with little substance as many citizens fall through the cracks. The swing voters went from twice for Obama to Trump. You can't pin it all on Russian interference. The left are talking about trans rights and reparations for black people while the stock market under Trump surges and the economy expands more greatly than ever in our history. People care about this! Publicly they may not say it, but they do. Michelle Obama? You've got to be kidding me. Quit watching Ellen and read about economic policies and the effect of global expansionism. No, I am not a Trump supporter at all. I voted left my entire life. This is a heart to heart wake up call.
5
Computer says no.
America, like all other large Anglospheric nations, is by deep cultural default a center-right nation that only occasionally dabbles in relatively brief progressive spasms, to be followed by much longer periods of reaction.
Young socialists imagine an American electorate - and not structurally chopped up the way it is required under the federal and state constitutions - that is fundamentally different than the one that exists. Good luck with that at the state and national level; there will be some successes at the municipal level, but some of those may prove Phyrric, others not.
Life is tragic. Anyone not accepting that reality will get smacked hard by it.
6
I noticed the first half of this compilation of other opinion pieces was all about why he could NOT win, but of course I expected as much.
I intend to vote for Sanders, mainly for Medicare for All, but I can see he needs to change his message based on what motivated, apparently, Super Tuesday voters. His change agenda, while I want most of it,is overwhelming. It makes people think he can't get anything done and write him off.. Focus on no more than three ambitious plans, please. Give me one or two concrete reasons I can tell friends and neighbors when they ask, "Why are you supporting Sanders?"
Then, lay off the Democratic establishment. It sounds like you're biting the hand that feeds you and I know you will need that establishment to get things done in office.
Thirdly, speak from your good heart and describe the positive vision you are working for. We all need that inspiration. To that end, change your stump speech music from the "Man the ramparts!" fight anthems to something like the Beatles' "Imagine" and hey, even a patriotic anthem like "This is My Country (Land That I Love.)" Nothing is more American than change.
5
I tend to agree with much of which Sanders says, but he is an advocate, not an implementer. His record as a Senator shows this. If he is the nominee 2020 will be a total blowout just like 1972 and progressive policy will be set back at least a decade.
9
@C. Neville I support a lot of what Sanders stands for too. It's just that he approaches it all with such bull-headedness. He repeats slogans with zero sense of how to accomplish his goals and how he would work with people to make them happen. It reminds me of a wall that Mexico would pay for. Most of all, Bernie -- to me -- embodies the misogyny of American politics. Does anyone really think a roundish, socialist, female senator from Vermont would be taken seriously as a candidate? That's not even counting the heart attack. And no -- it's not his fault that our political culture is what it is. But it's a fact. I find the misogyny his campaign represents (and sometimes expresses) maddening and will find it hard to vote for the guy if it comes to that. I will, of course, even though I don't think he can beat Trump.
1
Sanders has proposed new federal programs to overhaul the nation's health care system, tackle climate change and wipe away student debt.
A budget estimate by a nonpartisan think tank provided to NBC News suggests that despite new proposals on how he would pay for them, his plans would still result in a $20 trillion budget shortfall over 10 years.
NBC News asked the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget to respond to an itemized list the campaign released last week explaining how the Sanders, I-Vt., intends to fund a range of his proposals, including "Medicare for All," the Green New Deal, free college and housing for all.
The $20 trillion estimate is similar to a study the CRFB did of Sanders' 2016 campaign, which estimated that his proposals then would result in a $19 trillion shortfall.
Will Bernie enthusiasts listen? Never.
5
@Tim Bernies' Army far too strident. Off putting. Rude and insulting. Trumpism on the left. Stay away from ideologues.
Berni Sanders could win if ... he was not Bernie Sanders. In the age of demagoguery he managed to get the attention of a part of the electorate that seemingly seems excited about talk about "revolution". Even when there is as much revolution in his platform as there is in a Che Guevara T-shirt. The reality is that Bernie Sanders is good at one thing: a stump speech. He authored seven pieces of very minor legislation in 30 years in the Senate, he authored zero from 2016 to 2019. And he has no political allies. He manages to alienate everybody. Including the very people people who are close to his positions. Take Warren as the best example, who he managed to call a lair on National TV. So, no, hopefully Sanders will not win the nomination. He should withdraw now and give all his support for Biden. Unfortunately that is not going to happen, as it did not in 2016 helping Trump to get elected.
16
@Davide
I'm not sure if you say, but an interviewer asked him during a debate, "if he called Warren a liar," or something along those lines. He responds with "no," and the interviewer proceeds to ask Warren how she feels about Bernie calling her a liar.
1
@Liam well maybe just watch the debate again and judge for yourself instead of thinking the press, or Warren, makes this up. It seems pretty clear how Warren feels about the episode, and that is the point. Bernie managed to alienate one of the players closest to his positions.
1
It's interesting that, with the exception of Michelle Goldberg and a couple of pretty young columnists, every link here that is positive about Sanders is from a publication other than the New York Times. It's pretty clear that your editorial board, along with the rest of the party establishment, have decided to stick it to Sanders. Or are the negative columns about Joe Biden only slated to come out if he wins the nomination?
Where was all of this six months ago? It skews the process when the press waits until someone is perceived as a front runner and then rips them apart, whether the intentions are good or not. It also means that perfectly good candidates were virtually ignored and failed to get traction.
That process is part of how we go to this point. Congrats. Looking forward to the next 8 months of hand-wringing.
21
@Full Name , if you haven’t seen scorn for “old, old” Biden in the NYT columns, or noted that the paper didn’t endorse him, you must not be reading the NYT I read.
3
@Full Name
Bravo. It seems I am not the only one who has noticed the Times's anti-Bernie bias.
It's not just this newspaper. Check CNN's home page. Every day, it's full of anti-Bernie/"Joe is our savior" items. Chris Cillizza is a ventriloquist dummy for corporate interests.
MSNBC? Matthews is gone and Chuck Todd should be.
Even NPR ,of all places, has run anti-Bernie pieces.
It all comes down to this: all these entities are owned by corporations and Bernie is anti-corporation. Joe Biden is corporation and Wall Street friendly.
Of those two, who would do the most for the 50-60 million people in the US at the bottom of the socioeconomic chain?
2
@Full Name Berniess' flaws long well known. To some extent, yes, the press has egged on a Democratic battle that did not need to happen. Sells papers. Trumputin has always been the focus and everyone knows it. Barr issue reinforces that focus. Massive cleanup necessary. Let's get everyone on the same page. VOTE!
Mehdi Hasan gets it: Democrats are trying to re-do 2016 by throwing Biden at Trump. If Hilary failed, Biden will too. There are little to no rational moderate thinking people left in the Republican party. Throwing establishment moderation at Trump is like throwing flowers at tanks: very high-minded but bound to fail. We tried flowers in 2016. Now we need to bring in heavy weapons, lots of heavy weapons.
15
@Sisifo Nope. Ballots are bullets.
2
Who is the enemy here? Is Biden the enemy? Is Sanders the enemy? Or is Trump the enemy? Any future debates should have Biden and Sanders outlining their policies and position compared to Trump, not each other. The focus has to be on defeating Trump.
16
@Quinn , you said it, pal.
3
Couple of months ago, I took several NYT/WP test to see which candidate I most agree with and I was surprised to see that my results were not even remotely close to the candidate my heart wanted to vote - Warren. These tests always pointed me towards Biden or Bloomberg. We are the product of our upbringing. I was raised by a military father. We were always told, nothing is for free, work hard and play hard. Be kind but be strong. Although I liked some of ideology calling out the unjust and the income inequality in this country, his constant campaign slogan of free college, free this and free that just pushed me further and further away. I am a middle class American but when I hear Bernie's utter dislike for the rich , I realize, he is not my candidate. If you work hard and make billions , you should not be chastise for it. Tax reform is a much needed policy in the country but to say the billionaires should not exist is dangerous.
6
@ALN There it is. In a concise nutshell. ALN - thank you for helping me consolidate my feelings. Great minds think alike. Have a good day. VOTE - ballots are bullets. No apathy. Polls do not vote. People do.
1
I am not a rabid Bernie Bro. In fact, I’m a 72 yr old woman who is financially comfortable, went to Harvard and got a Ph.D. In Physics from Berkeley. Given that Bernie doesn’t really offer much in the way that would improve my life I think he could help our despairingly sad and unjust country be better, especially for younger people whose world it will be in coming years.
Can he beat Trump? I have no way of knowing and neither does anyone else. One thing I would bet on though, Biden will lose to Trump. As a lifelong liberal, I will be voting third party if Biden is the nominee.
34
@Landy - "I will be voting third party if Biden is the nominee."
My heart sank when I read that. That statement is unfathomable. Trump has to go, for the sake of our sanity, our democracy, our country, our world, our planet, and our children's future. And yet there is a faction out there that would try to insure a Democratic candidate's failure by voting "third party?" And after Biden's show of force and Sanders' second place in the Super Tuesday primaries? What kind of thinking is that? To me, that is cutting off one's nose to spite one's face.
36
@Landy
But Joe will try to expand the ACA, which will help all those people. Trump wants to cut Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security; and a vote for a third-party candidate helps Trump.
So how are you helping those that need it by a protest vote?
God gave us nose-pinching fingers for just such occasions.
13
@Landy
I'm in the same boat, though likely less prosperous.
I despair at the mess we are leaving young people to deal with.
9
Speaking of "witness protection," the editors apparently decided to run the negative arguments on Sanders first. You have to search half-way down a rather long and terse column before you find a counter point. There's not much a debate when we know the average reader's scroll depth is shallow. Especially on cell phones. A fair debate would have alternating positive and negative positions.
For the same reason, I think Democrats just made a serious miscalculation in rallying behind Biden. You've once again alienated young voters. Biden is the farthest point from their preferred choice. A Sanders defeat will now appear as an establishment victory. It certainly has the echos of Clinton.
And by "young" voter, I mean anyone Millennial on down. That's now 18 to mid-to-late 30s. That's quite a large portion of the electorate. You don't think 30 year olds vote? They vote alright. But not when you disrespect their preferences. A point which highlights the most notable absence from this debate.
It's not who the nominee is so much as how he or she wins. Buttigieg and Klobuchar throwing themselves under the bus to service Biden and establishment preferences reeks of bad sportsmanship. And although you might celebrate because your team is "winning," voters can sense the foul play and they are displeased. That's a problem. Ultimately you need these voters are on your team.
Democrats just fouled their own teammates in practice.
20
@Andy
Dear Andy,
According to the article the much anticipated massive wave of new (mostly young) voters never materialized for Mr. Sanders. Perhaps they will next week but the trend is not visible now. I don't think they should be alienated, but so far they have been a moot point.
Candidates have been bowing out of races for centuries and recommending their followers back their favorite candidate. How is this "bad sportsmanship" or "foul play".
Mr. Sanders has a very narrow gap to squeeze through for the nomination but he has a chance. Why are so many of his acolytes upset at this point? I didn't vote for him in the primary, but will vote for him if he is the nominee.
I find the notion that the system is rigged is very much the message that Moscow is trying to send to discourage voters. If you listen to this Russian paen you will have been had by Mr. Putin. We must resist this notion.
2
@gpickard
Progressives don't need Moscow to come to the "notion that the system if rigged." The actions of a clearly corrupt DNC and the recent story in the Times about the hidebound "superdelegates" who will decide the nominee (and of course want an establishment type) are quite sufficient.
2
It might already be too late, but I can't help thinking a head to head debate between these two is going to be a SERIOUS mismatch.
6
Biden is getting the record turnout that Bernie has been boasting about all along. It seems to consist of disaffected Republicans looking for an alternative to Trump that doesn't terrify them ideologically. It should have been Warren because she was the best candidate with a willingness to compromise. Sanders can't win and this is made evident by the fact that he can't win Democrats. I will go so far as to say there are so many Conservatives who hate Trump, that if all the Bernie Bros stay home, Biden would still win. As for the gaffe argument, he would be running against an orange man who told everyone it's OK to go to work with Coronavirus.
9
I am getting tired of people misinterpreting these Medicare for all polls. What they show is majority support for single payer healthcare, YES. But what they do not show is necessarily majority support for Sanders' healthcare plan. Why? Because the devil is in the details. Support for Medicare for All consistently drops below 50% when you add additional information, such as "this plan will abolish current health insurance plans" or "this plan will require you to wait to receive care as mandated by government healthcare guidelines" or "your taxes will rise significantly to pay for this program" (this last one works even when you mention the savings of no longer paying for private health insurance because people are bad at math). It's not that M4A is a bad idea - in the long term it is likely the right idea - but in the short term people aren't ready for the specifics of the plan once it is explained to them.
Additionally, and perhaps MOST importantly, this poll (like many polls on this topic) was worded in such a way that it could easily be interpreted as being for BOTH M4A AND a public option. So in the end, this poll doesn't even measure anything beyond "do you think there should be a government role in healthcare".
So stop referencing these polls like they prove anything about support for this policy.
10
Bernie Sanders - alas cannot win. His supporters, however, are assured of victory. They will vote for Trump in protest, show up the rest of us, ensure the Caligula-Nero dynasty and the further devastation of the republic. They will win, hands down, self-satisfied and smug, that they defeated Biden, and the country.
9
I love these 'politics of despair' arguments. We want to do good things but the Republicans won't let us. We want Bidden to beat Trump but... Bernie won't let us (or Stein or Nader...). You are already making excuses for your losses in November.
7
@Kalidan "vote for Trump in protest?"!!! I really don't mean to be rude, but are you insane? The biggest reason for my support of Sanders in this race is because he is NOTHING like Trump, regardless of how some like to stoke that lie. He's smart, he's passionate, and he cares and is committed. I believe in his ideas, AND he probably actually reads every so often. There is absolutely no comparison.
Insane, or possible disingenuous. Please stop with the cynical assumptions and false equivalencies.
2
@Kalidan Trump has been president for 3 years now. The country is pretty much still here. You are just as free as you were under Obama. The idea that magically in a second Trump term the entire republic will fall is an insane and deranged conspiracy theory. At worst you can say that Trump doesn't act presidential and has bad policies like the trade war with China. Even then, most of what Trump has done has been your standard Republican policies like tax cuts, or even things Obama did like separating immigrant families.
In truth, Democrats hate Trump mostly because he is Republican and a populist. You hated W Bush just as much. And Republicans hated Clinton and Obama too. This is some bizarre tribal thing where both parties constantly hate on each other while maintaining the same status quo.
The rationale behind Bernie or Bust (at least for me) is that Democrats elected Biden because he was more electable and to maintain the status quo (rather than a populist revolution). Biden losing proves that Clinton, Biden, etc are not electable. That Bernie was worth the risk. And that progressives are an important voting block that need to be courted to win, not just a group you provide lip service and dismiss and can still win. I'm not self-satisfied or smug, I'm desperate. The only way forward I see for things that matter is to nominate Bernie or have Biden lose.
1
Senator Sanders and Vice President Biden should hit President Trump hard, not each other. The strategy that “Mr. Sanders should hit him (Joe Biden) hard on his record of calling for cuts to Social Security, as well as his support of the Iraq war,” will backfire. Sanders will look angry and narrow his base. The candidate who prevails in this mud slinging contest will be weaker in the general election.
Senator Sanders took a clip on Social Security out of context attempting to show that Joe Biden favors decreasing Social Security. It looked like a lie. Both candidates looked worse.
Most of the people in the United States, including Hillary Clinton, the U.S. Congress, and the NYTimes, supported starting the war against Iraq based on the mistaken belief that there were weapons of mass destruction. While I was against that war because I am against all war, I do not hold that mainstream vote against Hillary Clinton or Joe Biden. Sanders will feed his base, but not broaden his base, with this argument.
16
Some of us do hold votes of war mongers against them.
1
@David No, they should go hard against each other, better to expose weaknesses now and try to do something about them then letting Trump deliver them. Especially Biden needs to sharpen his defense otherwise Trump will have a field day with him.
1
I'm sad to see this turn of events. I was a Warren supporter, but I like Bernie. I'm generally fine with Biden too, especially if he pulls out the Pennsylvania union support version of Joe Biden. I'm kind of glad though, because IF Bernie or Warren got the nomination and went on to defeat Trump. Don't think Trump would go away. Unless it was a resounding defeat that caused Republican leaders to rise up and publicly repudiate him (which isn't going to happen). And Mitch McConnel is not going away. Which means, a Sanders or Warren presidency would likely be a one-term deal and they would be unable to get anything done, and all the pundits would say (falsely) that this was the nations repudiation of the progressive economic agenda. If Biden wins, he can still push progressive agenda forward (if more slowly) and perhaps over time more of a consensus on medicare for all would emerge.
5
@Mike K in Indianapolis Yeah except moderate Obama, after trying so hard to reach across the aisle, ultimately had to push everything forward alone, and then now it's all being undone.
There is no hope of incrementalism *with the Republican leaders*. The only hope is to quickly create something that the *Republican base* likes so much that they won't let their own elected leaders undo it.
4
@bess There is no’Third Way’
Biden wins the nomination in the south. So what? All those states will vote for Trump. Does any of this make a Democratic victory in November more likely? Why is becoming the front runner in states you’re definitely going to lose such a cause for celebration? Is this simply the DNC Party bosses celebrating their close call with having to support something other than a status-quo restorer?
17
@Peter
The classic Marxist trope. All those black and white Democratic voters in the South (is Maine in the South?), East, and mid West don't count because they are members of the establishment. You Peter are in CT and I'll bet you Biden carries CT in late April.
3
@Peter I absolutely agree with you! Well said!
@Peter
Of course TBH we do need to keep in mind that GA & NC are purple & getting purpler, & VA is thoroughly blue instead of red now.
This is 2020, much more akin to 2018 than it is 2016. Do we really want to autonomically kiss off the south just because old prejudice actively dismisses it? Doesn't seem to make sense to me.
1
In answer to the question posed in this headline: hopefully not. If Sanders wins Trump wins.
13
Sensible Democrats are alarmed by the prospect of either candidate. So very important from that view to defeat Trump and this is the best on offer?
4
@Frunobulax I agree. I was torn on the moderate-vs-progressive decision, but Warren was the best progressive and SOMEONE other than Biden was surely the best moderate--Buttigieg? Klobuchar?
If, to win, Bernie must “modulate” his message, how will that sit with his more ardent supporters? How many moderates will be fooled by a change in tone, as when he ludicrously made nice with Rachel Maddow? And if he’s able to pull this off, what then? How does a man govern from the far left of one party without building majorities of allies in Congress—something Bernie has never been able to do, and which recent primaries did little to suggest is possible? I am not gloating over the possibility of a Biden victory, but I am relieved at the idea that real progress will at least be possible once Bernie folds his tent.
6
@angus
In the impossible (yes, impossible) event that Biden were to beat Trump, we'd be re-entering the cycle of center-right Democrats hand-wringing and making excuses to the progressive wing why we can't pass any legislation that will improve the lives of working people. They will then get trounced in the following election, tell progressives we can't afford to go left because we need to preserve our seats in Congress, lose the general election, and repeat the cycle over again. This is a process that will destroy the party, if it hasn't already destroyed it. We need a strong third party that provides an alternative for working people to the make-work program for the consultant class that is the Democratic party.
11
@Angus Bernie's main tragic flaw is that he is incapable of modulating anything and has been since 1965. He's a left wing reactionary conservative.
One of the cognitive errors people make about Medicare for All is that it would cut out the insurance companies. Since Medicare for All could be enacted by executive order (just lowering the starting age) it would probably have a similar structure. This includes, as we with Medicare know, Advantage plans. These have been a boondoggle for private insurance companies and would make the companies even more money. Of course Advantage plans offered by private insurance companies dictate your Network and what doctors you can see but that is what goes on now with employer-provided insurance.
2
@John : What makes you think the President can lower the Medicare eligibility age by executive order? If Congress won't pay for it, it won't happen.
4
If the most persuasive argument for Sanders is a one-line tweet from a has-been comedic actor, then there is no argument at all. The conclusion of this op-ed put the lie to all that came before it. The best candidate is no longer in the race and the arguments for either Sanders or Biden are weak. At this point, beating the Current Occupant is the only consideration that matters and the arguments for and against the contenders in that regard are about equal; neither has the edge. But if the argument boils for Sanders boils down to "Danny Devito supports him," there's no argument at all.
6
@Father Eric F I'm shocked that member of the clergy would speak heresy about our savior Danny DeVito.
With all candidates being over 70 and hence more susceptible to the grim reaper (especially under corona virus reign). my eyes are going to be focussed on the VP spot. If Biden starts getting Michelle Obama to come on at various platforms, even if she does not speak but is present, then a lot of Sanders supporters and quite a few even of Trump supporters will get behind Biden even if he is sleepy. Game over.
8
Sanders will be crushed by trump in the swing districts. The youth surge Bernie crows about doesn't exist. The majority of young voters in my rural area are trump supporters. Some of the older folks are weary of trump. They will consider Biden but not anyone wearing a socialist moniker. Bernie's past support for south American socialist leaders will play endlessly in trump's attack ads. The Democrats can kiss Florida goodbye with a Sanders nomination. Bernie's support for the elimination of fracking will cost the Democrats Pennsylvania. This election is too important to lose. The political pundits should spend some time in the electoral districts that the Democrats must win , before speculating on a Sanders victory.
30
@Roger Is Biden really a stronger candidate than Bernie in the swing states, given that Trump will (and already is) running against Biden's record on NAFTA?
5
I can only express what I hear from my neighbors on a daily basis. Biden will get votes ,Bernie will not.
Why would they ever vote for Bidden?
1
The biggest problem Bernie has is himself.
It's not that his ideas as so bad, it's the messenger. In an era of Trump fatigue, the prospect of nominating yet another divisive demagogue to replace the current one is not a very palatable prospect to many Democrats. He was divisive in the 2016 primaries and seems to have learned nothing from the experience.
People are voting for Joe because they see a leader with compassion and decency - something many of us would like to see restored to the presidency.
54
@Joe Can you just see Biden on a debating stage with Trump? It will be an embarrassing wipe out. Mumbles, difficulty finding words, and verbal gaffes just don't look very good on a stage. Whereas with Bernie, the Orange One will have met more than his match.
2
@Alex Levy Yes I can see it. Unhinged Trump on one side, and a decent, stable, earnest man on the other - the difference couldn't be more stark.
I can also envision Bernie debating Trump - a shouting match between two demagogues with spittle flying everywhere - two opposite sides of the same coin.
3
Just two points. One is that Mr. Bidens' win in the South may not be all that signicant in in a general election. When was the last time the Solid South voted Democratic? Those states are all reliably Republican, and will change nothing in the Electoral College.
My second point is that the critique from the right has focused on how expensive Medicare For All will be, that it will raise taxes significantly. Mr. Sanders has tried to address that point by saying that he would increase the taxes of those who could most afford them, what he calls the "billionaire class". That may be a good idea, but it is the wrong argument. He should be pointing out that people would save money by being relieved of huge premium payments, co-pays, and frivolous denial of services caused for any number of frivolous reasons. While opposition has also come from union leaders who fear for their so-called Cadillac Plans, the problem with those plans is that they are not portable;that if a worker gets fired, he finds that suddenly he and his family are without any kind of health insurance. Medicare for All would be available to all Americans at all times, and as to the quality of service provided, I have yet to hear a complaint by a single Senior who is on Medicare. For the middle class, it is all about money, about just holding on in difficult economic times. Medicare for All would improve the life of every single American family, sick or healthy.
47
@Alex Levy
How about Virginia, North Carolina and Minnesota (relative swing states)?
And how is Sanders' win in California at all important given that it will be democrat (Sanders got far and away the most delegates there)? Your logic simply doesn't hold up. Biden has actually performed better in swing states thus far.
To your second point I think your logic is sound but convincing people that their overall bill will be lower despite higher taxes is a very tough sell in our age of disinformation. A public option is way easy to understand and less scary for people and is a actually a pretty doable policy. It's certainly way easier to pass through Congress (still difficult of course as evidenced by Obama's efforts) than Medicare for all
20
@Alex Levy
Bernie does repeatedly make your second point; however, in the debates opponents have (dishonestly) refused to acknowledge it.
6
@TS Those three states have voted Democratic in a presidential race recently? I didn't know. . . And Minnesota is a Southern state? Didn't know that either. Thanks.
The media pushed hard on the narrative of scary socialist, and establishment democrats made it their business to stop Sanders.
Ultimately they aligned with a candidate who has a record of supporting austerity measures including cuts of social security and medicare, who opposed busing, who wrote the 1994 crime bill and coined the phrase "super predator" for young black men, who not only supported Bush's war in Iraq, but championed it, who made it illegal to apply for bankruptcy over student loans, who opposes a living wage, who will not end private prisons, who supports fracking, keystone pipeline, and nuclear power.
Is this the future we deserve? Is this the best we can do? Biden is the weakest candidate.
68
@Mel
"The media pushed hard on the narrative of scary socialist.."
I believe the first one to use the socialist term to describe himself was Bernie wasn't he? and he is sincere He *IS* a socialist.
3
@Mel The problem with your critique of Biden is that its irrefutable. Everything you list is, unfortunately, established fact. With Biden's track record, I'm not reassured by vague arguments that he's compassionate, decent, or "safe."
2
@Chris
It is NOT irrefutable!
All of it is fake news!
That's what I can't take about Bernie supporters - they are as naive and guilible as Trump supporters. They believe anything Bernie says just as Trump supporters believe anything he says. All of them lies.
History has shown that promised massive turnouts of young voters have never materialized to swing an election. 1972 is a good example. Brandishing those with wealth as the enemy may play well emotionally. However remember that JFK (Medicare advocacy) and FDR (Social Security) were from the very class of economically advantaged that Sanders disparages. So his appeal and energy must be respected, Sanders' message simply will not translate into electoral success nor effective governing.
14
I took an online test once to see if I had any biases. The test result was that I am slightly but consistently biased towards the under-dog. Maybe it's because I was raised by a father with a strong sense of Irish identity. Little Ireland that finally overthrew the British Empire after 500 years of colonial domination.
I imagine other Bernie supporters are also biased towards the underdog.
Don't count Bernie out.
48
I'm among the many - I admit it - who thought that Biden was a dead man walking 10 days ago, but the turnaround was stunning, and I've all but written Bernie off at this point.
So, the article is a great lens through which to view the state of play!
Mr. Bokat-Lindell does a great job of laying each candidate's vulnerabilities out, but here's the killer "tiebreaker" in my mind:
ONLY Biden (a centrist) can beat Trump … on the numbers! Given the Electoral College, there is simply no way that the critical swing voters in Wisconsin, Florida, etc. are going to OPT FOR a middle class tax hike. Yes, they hate the realities of our healthcare system, but for most, that boils down to "What if one of us gets very sick and the folks at Empire or United nix this or that treatment." The reality that in April 2022, Bernie will figuratively send out payment demands to all but the poor in this country… makes a Trump win a certainty.
True, one has to hope that Joe has an above average few months in terms of gaffes. (As every SNL and the other late night shows hammer home, he'd be going up against someone even less able to put together 2 sentences that make sense.)
Yes, when Bernie squares off with Biden, it could get "bloody" and messy starting with their opening statements, but nothing will change the reality that Blacks and suburbanites would prefer almost any Democrat to almost any Socialist. (Pencil in the 2 exemplars, and Biden will trounce Bernie in most of the remaining primaries.)
7
Four hundred years of oppression has convinced most African-Americans, especially those who have lived the longest and experienced the most oppression that a progressive candidate will never be able to win... that the best hope is to play defense and seek the status quo or at best incremental change.
When I went door to door for Sanders in working class neighborhoods in the North Carolina, rarely did anyone ever tell me that they supported Biden. There were those who said they supported Warren, Buttigieg, Klobochar, and even Bloomberg, Biden's name actually came up the least. In fact, older African-Americans almost always told me they were "undecided."
Yet, Biden won by a landslide.
Secretly, they wanted to vote for Sanders platform. It was so evident. They liked it, but just could not believe that these progressive reforms were possible. Thus, they voted to play it safe and cast their vote for Biden.
What I think they failed to realize is that the average White person who lived in their neighborhood was not really financially that better off than they were....that they had much more in common with working class Whites than they imagined because the media always focuses upon race rather than class.
Some working class Whites are more optimistic and this is understandable. Of course, working class Whites are more likely to choose Trump in the South.
The working class continues to be divided by race and the rich get richer.
67
@Robert Scull
I'm wondering if there was a push by DNC African-American leaders in those states to support Biden, and that's what really put him over the edge. I find it hard to believe that all those voters thought "pragmatism" in their vote. Name recognition and support by local leaders that came with all those other Biden endorsements seems more likely to me.
14
@Bret
I agree that this was an important factor. Also the cleverly orchestrated endorsements the weekend before the election built momentum for Biden that crossed racial divisions. But to me it is interesting that the Biden vote was truly a triumph for the secret ballot.
3
@Robert Scull
"What I think they failed to realize is that the average White person who lived in their neighborhood was not really financially that better off than they were..."
Er, not so fast:
" a typical white family's wealth is nearly ten times greater than that of a black family ... "
Examining the black-white wealth gap - Brookings Institution www.brookings.edu › blog › up-front ›
Feb 27, 2020
2
This sudden surge has nothing to do with Biden but everything to do with fear. The safe bet, many believe, but I’m not so sure.
77
@LFK
Yes. The Biden surge is a surge of fear, of desperation. It’s an unfocused lashing out at Trump, and a fanciful leap of faith that a nice moderate guy will ever-so-incrementally put all the pieces back together again.
Meanwhile the Coronavirus rages, the climate hurtles toward apocalypse, and the economy, and the healthcare and educational systems work only for the wealthy. Uncle Joe is the perfect candidate to ensure that this situation will stay the “normal” because, god-forbid, we don’t want any “radical” strategies gumming up our return to normalcy.
Win or lose, Bernie Sander’s lasting legacy will be that he opened the door to real progressive ideas and inserted them into the conversation in a way no one before him has been able to do.
It’s a huge step in the right direction in the hope that America will someday join the rest of the developed world in realizing that everyone in a society needs to benefit from that society’s profits - otherwise, that society will remain a Darwinistic cluster of factions at war with each other.
10
@Michael
"Darwinistic??"
No, he can’t.
In 2016, Republicans thought moderate Jeb, was the guy, then they saw which way the wind was blowing and realized radical Trump was their ticket to the White House. People wanted change. The Democratic Party bosses have been unable to see their mistake in 2016, so they will repeat it in 2020. They never had any intention of nominating Sanders, in fact, they never had any intention of nominating anyone other than Biden. The odds of them figuring out which way the wind is blowing by 2024 are pretty slim.
17
@Peter 2016 was an issue of sexism and Hillary derangement syndrome. If Hillary had been a man, Trump would not be president. It's sad and pathetic but it is true. Add to that the 30 years of media and GOP hit jobs she has had to endure and it was just too much to overcome. How many times did we hear: "I don't know. I just don't like her." When comparing her to Trump there is no other explanation than almost any man would be better than any woman that makes sense. I still have the voice of my colleague ringing in my ears: "I'm not a sexist. I'm Ok with a woman president. It just has to be the right woman." My response: "So ANY man is better than the 'right' woman?" I thought to myself, who is the right woman? Wonder Woman?
2
@Peter
I think you're right, … but the context matters. The rules got changed so that Bernie DID have both a fair shot and a genuine one.
Only, America (still) isn't ready for Socialism. I happen to be Jewish, and every year … roughly a month from now, we say things that boil down to "when the Messiah comes."
I'm sure there are some - children, mostly - who think that might be "in their lifetimes." For most others - and it's more like 99%, they get that this is a metaphor for "If only, our best hopes - e.g., lasting world peace - could possibly come to pass because we so very much want them...."
Even Bernie's brand of "Democratic Socialism" is DOA in the same few States that let DJT beat HRC in 2016. But where you see "the apparatchiks" making a similar mistake (if Biden is the candidate) to the one they arguably made 4 years ago, *I SEE* a repeat of the McGovern experience - a 49-1 shellacking.
OK, maybe NY and California would leave McGovern's record standing, but it's not remotely likely that there'd be a Dem. majority in the House.
Rocky as the last 4 years have been, ask yourself what an unhinged and unchecked Trump could and would do with a compliant Congress - check the current Senate for how that goes - and an accommodating Supreme Court, one which he "locks down" with Brett-like replacements for Ruth and Stephen.
@Peter It's never that Bernie didn't get enough votes. It's always the establishment and MSM holding him back.
Give me a break.
Bernies rabid online base didn't get off the couch to vote. His promise of huge turnout is failing to materialize. He is done after Tuesday.
2
The momentum is with Biden and the remains primary demographics favour him as well.
Bernie needs a bold stroke
I suggest he convinces Elizabeth Warren to be his running mate and the announcement is made immediately.
20
This might work as a full partnership with Warren. She has her own policy proposals and they’re powerful. If Bernie could be the guy to respectfully collaborate with her, that would do a lot to repair his reputation for curmudgeonly intransigence.
9
@John Warren is going to endorse Biden. Lumping her in with Sanders fails to understand who she is and what she truly believes.
4
@Jonny Walker , Still can't get your teeth out of her, can you? I'm from her hometown, went to her high school, and have been a liberal from birth, having fought many battles for the hope of decent life for all. I have followed Warren from her publication of "The Two Income Trap," warning of the great losses to workers even 20 years ago. And on. I know what she truly believes, and your pretense that she is anything but a champion of the people, all the people, is disingenuous or misinformed. But I find that many partisans say things as you so, dark insinuations for the purpose of persuading the gullible. Too many of Sanders' fans do that, all while posing as the only virtuous fellows around. It's not a factor that will draw honest people to your cause.
5
Our democracy is teetering. People want a back to normal government before we swing, perhaps in the future, to left of center and left. I think that’s why Elizabeth or Amy didn’t get the vote. People didn’t want something new, although in reality, those two very intelligent woman would have been fine for the office.
5
I'm a lifelong democrat and more liberal than most. I like Bernie and think his ideas are aspirational. Bernie could convince me only by showing me he can reach out to others -- his colleagues, and democrats who are less liberal. He seems unable to do that. He strikes me as a scold. His ardent supporters are impassioned yet only inches away from maga supporters in their zeal. It's enough of a turnoff for me to walk away. Bernie is the leader, he needs to fix that.
87
@Tom J. Bernie is a pragmatic and is able to work well with others, even Republicans (as this paper reported early in the 2016 campaign). See also: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/07/bernie-sanders-is-a-loud-stubborn-socialist-republicans-like-him-anyway/450597/
See also Republican Bob Ney talking about working with Sanders: https://www.democraticunderground.com/1287268885
6
@Tom J Bernie, for years, has been succinct in his policies. Little flip flop. These are my beliefs for improving government, he has said over and over.
And he is correct. America, the greatest country, has the poorest medical of first world countries. Student debt. I went to The City College of New York, free. What happened? Corporations so entwined with government, who’s running the show?
We are living with the most corrupt government, incompetent government, fraudulent government. Bernie could have been the answer, but we want our comfort zone.
5
Lovely article. Basically tear down the front runner by making personal attacks on Joe's long history of gaffes and hope that crippling him will be enough to get you some votes from his coalition.
Of course something not mentioned is that big states that Sanders need to win from now on, includes GA and FL which Sanders will get blown out of irregardless how much he tries.
Another added caveat would be the greatest surge of voter enthusiasm is happening in the suburban moderates but will be completely deactivated with Sanders nomination.
Bravo. We have 4 more years of Donald Trump.
22
@Lewis Yes, once again the people pointing out, in the primary, the obvious flaws of a candidate are to blame when those flaws cost them the election.
1
@Lewis
Just because Black voters showed up this primary (as opposed to 2016) and sent Joe to victory in Red states, the pundits and sheeple think Joe Biden has somehow transformed into a different candidate than he was before Super Tuesday. He's hasn't. He is a ticking time bomb when he speaks off the cuff. If he gets the nomination, I will vote for him, but I will be changing my voter registration to Independent.
1
@Lewis
Yes, because if these issues aren't brought up now Trump won't use them when Biden is the nominee. If Biden can't handle the heat now, he has no chance to handle Trump, who will attack him much more aggressively and disingenuously.
The fact is that Biden is an incredibly weak candidate. He has even more baggage than Hillary Clinton or John Kerry, and few advantages. Vote Joe Biden to lose against Trump in November.
1
Please don’t scare me. There’s little worse to me than having to vote for Bernie.
26
@A Dot Don't be afraid, Joe Biden really, really loves you.
@A Dot
Well, there’s nothing more depressing to me than having to vote for Biden.
2
@A Dot How does moderate reform scare you? Joe Biden is the risky candidate, there's a reason that his campaign ran a "low information campaign", people like the idea of Joe Biden not who he actually is.
1