I believe Trump has cast a "Bernie Madoff" effect over the U.S. economy.
Many of Madoff's victims strongly suspected he was doing something crooked to create the prodigious returns he gave early investors. But as long as Bernie fattened their portfolios, they were willing to look the other way. Only after he took their money did they question his ethics.
I believe many investors and business leaders today feel like Madoff's early investors toward Trump. They know Trump is crooked. But as long as he gets them what they want, they've been willing to overlook Trump's glaring corruption.
Will the coronavirus market crash break the spell? Perhaps. But one thing is sure. Trump is a bigger crook than Madoff.
When Trump gets his comeuppance, millions of Americans will suffer.
5
I read that some greedy factory in Thailand was cut out repackaging used facemasks and selling them as new. Best not to buy a face mask unless it is made in the USA or NZ. There's a couple of companies in NZ that make face masks for commercial use only; one just started up recently.
1
It is an amazing signal. Since its effect takes time, it also implies that the effect of Covid-19 will be serious and will persist over a long time.
It is not clear that the political forces that pushed for that move understood the implication.
I never was the greatest student. The only thing I got out of finance class was "The Reinvestment Problem". What are you going to do if you sell you stocks... and the market goes up like it did on Monday? Put it in bonds and what happens if the interest rates go up? You'll lose a ton of money.
By the way, a 2.8% decline from from Monday's 4.6% leaves you with a net gain of 1.8% for one day. I wish I had that ever day; I'd catch up to Jeff Bezos pretty quick. So, why all the hysteria?
The big fear should be that a slow economy will just kill some more small businesses that can't whether 4-8 months of decreased revenues. I don't see Microsoft, Intel, Google or Facebook suffering that much.
4
Powell fell in line fearing his head would end up on a pike.
3
“I’m gonna run the government like I run my businesses.”
— Donald J. Trump, failed businessman, serial bankrupter, equal opportunity philanderer (affairs with both a Playboy Playmate and a Penthouse Pet at the same time)
Well.
Promises made, promises kept.
10
Question…
Do you think Trump and his businesses benefit from the lower rates?
If the answer is yes - then you might know how this president thinks, operates and acts………
The presidency is nothing but a business opportunity for Donald J Trump and family…Never mind the collateral damage it causes to millions of other folk………..
5
Fed Action & Market reaction! Pros and Cons:
Pro: The monetary stimulus is the wrong remedy for a “natural disaster”! In an already debt-ridden economy replete with risky high yield bonds, etc., ‘more of the same’ is unwise! The market reaction is a scold by investors to the Fed & the POTUS!
Cons: Genuine “Supply Side” stimuli like Infrastructure projects take time to execute and bear fruit! Continuing “easy money” is the only way to sustain the Elderly, the Retired and the Middle class --- thru 401K, etc.! Besides, a sudden stop of money supply may precipitate a ‘market-economy’ crash --- a godsend to the Bernie Sanders Socialist presidency and an existential threat to our beloved “Casino Capitalism”!
I looked everywhere for this important news story all over right-leaning publications, and I found nothing. How would Americans ever know about stories of economic uncertainty during the Trump era without the New York Times?
2
Every novice trader in our office knew that lowering the interest would have ZERO affect on the stock market. But... apparently... the President of the United States and his entire administration didn't know as much as our trainees.
I understand that Trump supporters are impressed by Trump macho statements and his false claims of brilliance, but this entire corona episode makes it abundantly clear that Trump has no clue what he's doing. The fact that he used bankruptcy to bail out his repeated business failures should enlighten supporters.
Perhaps after a few million unfortunate Americans die because Trump's admin refused to order testing kits in January will wake up the brain dead.
Not sure why so many are oblivious to something so obvious. The man is completely incompetent.
5
@bill Cullen, author
Sounds like a reason (in his mind) to cancel the election. And we all know that’s in the realm of the possible.
So The Donald got his half point interest rate cut and the market’s dropped nearly another 800 points. So much for economic wisdom from a guy whose companies went belly up—what is it, now—four times?!
1
“I alone can fix it!” Apparently not.
2
Wow, who knew that completely bungling the response to a pandemic would turn the markets more than a 1/2% Fed rate cut????
1
Not to sound like a broken record, but is it too soon to cut taxes? Freedom!!!
1
Doesn’t mean that at all. These decisions to sell or buy are mostly herd reflexes on the part of investors, fund managers, and stock traders. Bring on the reseat!
The answer here, clearly, is for Trump to go on Twitter and start denouncing the coronavirus. Like the Republicans in Congress, the virus is sure to surrender and just go away.
2
Just when I thought things couldn't get worse the Fed listens to financial advice from a guy who bankrupted his casinos.
2
Typical DJT he is trying to fix a complex scientific and geopolitical issue with money.
This takes thought
This takes leadership
This takes empathy
This takes courage
Which means DJT is incapable of solving it!
4
Trump has eviscerated the Feds' ability to prevent recessions by bullying them into lowering interest rates to pump up the markets and overcome the effects of his tariffs.
He has bankrupted the Treasury by cutting taxes for Rich, Inc. and running up $1 trillion annual deficits.
EVERYTHING has been about his reelection campaign (which, by no coincidence, he announced the day after his inauguration). And we're all about to find out exactly how much we've contributed to that campaign.
4
I say again: Donnie told us that there were only 15 cases and it would be down to none quickly. He also tells us a vaccine is just around the corner. Why is everyone worried?
3
Listen people: DON'T PANIC! (until I can escape the burning theater).
1
trump's cluelessness in regard to vaccine production was on full display today. No, trump, vaccine development doesn't happen any faster, even if you yell at, gag or fire officials. Berating the CEOs of pharmaceutical companies doesn't work, either.
It would have helped if the funding for pandemic response teams, a measure Obama put in place in 2014, was cut by trump in 2018, but it was an Obama program.... It would have helped to not purge 'disloyal' employees who insist on speaking truths that are at odds with trump's fantasies. It would help to have the CDC relay as much information about the virus and its spread, but that might make our narcissist-in-chief look bad. It would help if trump actually listened to experts instead of Limbaugh and the talking-head sycophants at FOX. It would help if he'd put someone in charge of the response who had a record of managing health crisis and scientific information well, but instead, trump appointed Pence. It would help if the US had mandatory sick leave and universal medical coverage, but those smack of programs the Democrats proposed...
The ineptitude of this administration has gone beyond pathetic. It now endangers us all.
3
This will be interesting to watch...
1
Trump has been calling for the "boneheads" of the Fed to cut interest rates. So, they've now done what he wants, and stocks still fell.
How long will it be now until he berates them as "boneheads" for "scaring the market"? How long until he blames this on the Dems and the fake, anti-Trump media?
While I feel bad for the families all over the world that are suffering because of the virus, I'm enjoying watching the economic impact it's having on the US. To all those "real" Americans in Red agricultural states who voted for Trump but now can't sell their produce to China (because Chinese shipping has shut down), I say: "Boo-hoo; you reap what you sow." To all those "real" Americans in Red Rustbelt states who voted for Trump but now can't materials for their manufacturing products, I say: "Boo-hoo; buy American."
Maybe if these "real" Americans feel some real economic pain it'll shock them into realizing that Trump and the rest of the Republicans have set them up for this mess.
Vote them all out!
1
They told you so! 'They' being the smarter economists & other types of specialists. They warned that Central Banks had no room left to stimulate the economy, & even they did they couldn't help the looming recession. Now I offer some common sense solutions:
Cancel all remaining tariffs on steel & aluminum.
Cancel all other tariffs including those on China.
And of course get the other sides to cancel their reciprocal tariffs.
The US Treasury has collected multi $billions in tariffs (paid by Americans). Get that money flowing into the economy.
Cancel the huge tax cuts given to the rich. Even add a 'wealth tax'?
Use all that revenue for two things - Infrastructure! And a boost to 'social security', on things like 'unemployment benefits', because there are going to be lots of layoffs. And a guarantee that nobody or family is going to be bankrupted due to medical expenses.
And cut the Pentagon military budget. That is unaffordable & getting out of hand.
Infrastructure? Hire Chinese engineers to show you how to build roads, bridges, railways, high rise buildings, 3 to 4 times faster than anybody in the US. And 500 times faster if you need COVID-19 hospitals & clinics.
Stop the 'non tariff barriers to trade' on Huwaei, Chinese drones & other technologies. Buy the stuff & take advantage of the lower costs. And how about improving city transit with electric buses.
Lots of opportunities when you think about it. Fed interest rate cuts aren't going to help.
Guess this puts a bit of a damper on Trump’s main re-election brag as he seems to think the gauge of a good economy is the market. No worries ... he’ll lie about this just like about the million virus tests (that we don’t have) that will happen this week. And his base will believe him if he says night is day and it’s all a plot be the evil Democrats.
Trump loves interest rate cuts because it helps his, his kids' and Jared's businesses.
He can't lose, personally, no matter which way the economy goes.
Now, losing at the polls -- at which he is already very experienced at -- that would bug him. Let's bug him. And. boot. him. out.
2
If a recession drives Trump from Office, I think this is the silver lining. I would not respond or cry in the face of Trump tantrums. Obama had to deal with far worse with a Republican Congress that tried to sabotage everything he did to drive him from Office simply because he was a black man. We need better leadership. We cannot sustain this path indefinitely. The Feds cannot solve every problem with low rates.
4
We can thank the media for hyping coronavirus. The facts are that the only way for it to arrive in the US is by coming in a host who became infected by contact with a person or persons who were vectors for the virus. Once here, it requires proximity with an infected person or persons. The fed fell victim to the hype and entered panic mode in a vain effort to thwart "potential" damage to the US economy. If we somehow become ensnared in a widespread diffusion of coronavirus, there is little a bunch of bankers can do. Therapy requires medical intervention. This rate cut has to be one of the worst tactics the Fed has ever foisted on our economy.
"The drop in stocks and bond yields suggests investors think the Federal Reserve’s interest-rate cut won’t contain the economic impact of the coronavirus."
Nice idea, but how could doing that possibly help quell the fear of a virus? Is this move a little like after 9/11 we were told we'll feel better by going shopping?
We learned the Co V 2 virus ignores:
1. a pencil from the Fed
2. casual lies from Trump and his team non scientists
3. tweets from anyone
4. being ignored
But not mentioned in what might work:
1. start with a billion for a vaccine, prepared to go to ten and another billion for an effective medicine
2. test when a doc in the pits asks for one
3. prepare quarantine centers commensurate with the numbers expected
4. tell citizens the truth if known or that you don't know if that is the case; we can take some unknown. do it daily with experts answering the questions, not party hacks
5. pay for all medical care related to this epidemic
6. expand HHS
7. organize a Manhattan style project on how to handle this epidemic
1
A fantastic exhibition of Voodoo economics.
2
re: Fiscal Stimulus.
I'm no Investor Extraordinaire--- but please,
before we transfer more Wealth to those who
are taking Risk--
Can we wait to see how this evolves?
(our Pres says it's fine, will go away!)
Just a short Pause?
They certainly don't share it on the way up!!
It is a sad situation that none of the 13 contributors did come up with a pathway that is just and sustainable. I am referring to the credit-based monetary/financial system that has been under discussion in the non-establishment economic thinking since the 1930s in the US and UK. I, being a sustainability sociologist with training in divinity, international affairs and sustainable communities predicted this morning before the interest rate reduction that it would not work because unlike the 2008 crisis the so-called “exogenous variable” of the corvid-19 disease causes both demand and supply problems, an argument that Kenneth Rogov convincingly made in today’s Guardian Newspaper, US section.
I am in the middle of updating my Verhagen 2012"The Tierra Solution: Resolving the Climate Crisis through Monetary Transformation" book where the commercial, intellectual, ecological, ethical and strategic dimensions are seminally presented. Basically, the Tierra Monetary System (TMS) is grounded in the monetary carbon standard of a specific tonnage of CO2e per person which, in turn, forms the basis of a credit-based financial system.
The one among you 13 who first calls me (919 240 7164 or 917 617 6217 cell) will be granted an interview, either via Skype, Whatsapp or in person by having that lucky person come to my villa at the Carolina Meadows continuing care retirement home in Chapel Hill, North Carolina.
US Treasury bills are not the world's safest investment.
Germany, Japan, Sweden, Denmark, Germany, France, Switzerland & Netherlands all have negative yields for shorter term debt in particular. They charge you for investing, so you get back less than you invest.
This is a resounding vote of no confidence. In a parliamentary government, it would means the end of the current executive.
6
Generally, I find that people who end up in bankruptcy court 6 times don't make very good leaders.
21
@J Anders
"Only I can fix it" was another red flag.
1
Do you know Donald J. Trump?
Obvious to anyone who has been reading the Times or any other credible news source, the Fed was pressured by Trump to put this band aid on an economy that might be sickened by the Corona virus. The market today just shook their heads, knowing that none of us knows the extent of the illness but early signs show that it will have to just run its course. And it ain't a skinned knee here that we are looking at.
Trump is very fearful, that much is clear. If the economy slips into a recession he could very well lose the election. With the White House in Democratic hands Trump's administration's past behavior will be under scrutiny. His immunity gone, his tax records exposed. Very vulnerable indeed.
Trump knows that if he leaves the White House he may be headed for the Big House. I guess we have to ask ourselves what the genius will do to our economy (and to us) in order to save his own skin...
32
Its difficult to comprehend how the markets went up over 4% on Monday with all the worsening coronavirus news. An extremely plausible explanation is that word of the impending cut was leaked to insiders over the weekend.
17
@Mark
A very likely scenario. Think of the money to be made by all involved.
3
The market is in very bad shape. This country is in deep trouble.
10
The Fed cannot stop supply chains from being disrupted. Under current conditions, additional rate cuts are like trying to push a rope.
10
Speaking strictly from an investor’s perspective, I think Trump needs to show much more leadership in dealing w coronavirus instead of relying always on the Fed Reserve. Where’s the global coordination? Where’s the massive medical response/innovation to meet this massive deadly infection? Where’s the call up of the scientific institutions to figure out this problem? The financial markets and the American people don’t want anymore Trump politics speak. We want real Trump solutions. For God’s sake- you’re the most powerful person. Act like it!
12
All Trump cares about is the market. I apologize that I voted for him. I will vote for any Democrat at this point.
35
@Mixilplix As a lifelong Republican, I know how you feel. Trump GOP using their same global warming denial playbook with this deadly epidemic. Trump told us no need to worry- “This flu will be over in April’s warmer weather.” Instead, now we have a pandemic killing us. Trump GOP should’ve been way out front on this 2 months ago, but they did nothing except give pardons to wealthy felons.
2
@Mixilplix:
Thank you for seeing what POTUS is really like. If you have family and friends who voted for him, would you try to get through to them that he is a terrible president (along with being a vile human being)?
2
@Mixilplix
Aw, shucks. You are forgiven...but I do understand. I held my nose and voted for HRC.
Would feel a lot better if the steps being taken addressed the problem instead of glossing over the issue.
7
Trump cannot handle this. Bernie cannot handle this because he doesn't know economics. Warren, as intelligent as she is, cannot handle this because she is a lawyer who knows little about business and economics, and the economy is collapsing. Biden can handle this. He handled it before. That was the Great Recession, and he was part of the administration saved the country.
11
Well, wait a minute, you could’ve argued the same thing about Obama in 2008.
It’s not straight forward.
One thing i know though, 45* definitely can’t handle this mess that is about to unfold.
10
@Joe Warren wrote the book on bankruptcy and how the middle classis collapsing but sure, she's just a lawyer.
1
How much quantitative easing can the fed do? Will that help in this type of crisis?
I admit that I could help understanding how continued quantitative easing isn’t just printing money to artificially boost the economy. From my limited understanding it seems like the Fed Reserve version of Hotel California.
1
This country's elites have been chipping away at the base for decades. Not even a convenient run to the nanny state will prop them up this time. We are all about to fall on their sword.
4
@David St. Hubbins Calm down David. Recessions come in ten year cycles, so we were overdue. It'll pass.
@CritterDoc:
A recession may pass what at what cost? Many of us don't have a full life ahead of us in order to recoup what we're losing.
7
Recessions pass but epidemics and pandemics don’t until they are contained. Old saws don’t cut wood.
2
Obama took months to deal with the Ebola. See the following excerpt from article by Save Gahary in the Washington Examiner on Oct 26, 2014:
"Since the World Health Organization (WHO) reported a major Ebola outbreak in the West African nation of Guinea in March of this year, it seems that the Obama administration is doing everything in its power to make sure the virus spreads across America. A series of blunders and shocking policy moves highlight how the federal government is allowing immigration from the affected African countries to trump the nation’s public health, even to the point of risking a spread of the virus across the country. Most shocking is the fact that .... around 100 to 150 Africans from the Ebola region are entering the United States each day, testified Thomas R. Frieden (01:56:54) the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), to Congress."
1
@MCH Did Obama spend most of his time before Ebola telling his electorate that the institutions of the United States are not to be trusted? Did Obama contradict the information given by the CDC and the NIH during Ebola? Was Obama more concerned with the plight of the stock market than the health of the American people?
I'd say the answer to each of those questions is a resounding no. So please don't attempt to equate Obama's handling of Ebola to Trump's of COVID-19.
1
@MCH There were only ever 11 Ebola cases here, with only 2 being contracted in the USA. We already have 118 Coronavirus cases reported in the USA as of today. Your argument is a false equivalency.
1
@MCH
Obama established an entire infectious disease department in the CDC especially to deal with Ebola and other dangerous outbreaks.
Trump fired them all in 2018 and cut 40% of the CDC's budget.
I don't want to hear any more about Obama - it's funny how we only hear about him when Trump doesn't want to take the blame for something.
1
Impossible for this question to get answered, but it's still very interesting - how much of the current turmoil is due (i) to fears over the virus itself and how that affects the economy, or (ii) in the alternative to concerns over the glaring incompetence of the Trump administration to deal with the crisis.
Shifting gears, Trump hasn't hesitated one second before climbing on Obama's shoulders to claim ..ALL.. the credit for Obama's work in pulling things together after 2008 Great Recession created by Bush and the Republicans and setting the scene for the sustained recovery that began in the last years of his administration and has continued till now. And for whatever reason, most people allow Trump to take credit for something he hasn't done simply because he's currently in office.
Based on this 'reasoning' shouldn't Trump also be held ..ENTIRELY.. responsible for the pending economic downturn/crash, even though he has no real connection to the virus? Wouldn't that be fair?
10
@Francis:
I think the current turmoil is due to both (i) and (ii).
And, yup, totally agree with you about POTUS—should be taking the responsibility for the downturn since he takes the credit for the good economy, but of course he won't. And his supporters won't blame him either. I wish journalists would ask him to his face why he takes the credit when good but won't take the blame when things are bad. That exchange would be fun to see.
8
@Claire Your comment about journalists asking Trump the magic question is almost spot on, and misses hitting true only because there are so many other questions that are just as deserving, ... a real embarrassment of riches in a sadly negative sense.
There's a palpable reticence on the part of most journalists to ask questions that even remotely imply that the answers they've received are evasive and/or untrue. That seems to be considered as bad practice. But in my view, whether somebody in power is playing straight is maybe the most relevant bit of information that a journalist can reveal.
So here's the question that would be at the top of my list when some parasite like L. Graham, M. McConnell, J. Jordan, D. Collins, D. Nunes et al. offer up their nonresponsive, evasive folderol: "Thank you for your reply, and while there may be a remote, theoretical possibility that your statement is true, can you explain why it would be unreasonable to believe that you are lying and dishonest, and that your statement is an attempt to distract attention from your responsibility for the [crisis/scandal/you-fill-in-the-blank]?"
@Francis Yes. It would.
Surprise. Surprise. This is what happens when the Fed appears to be taking its cue from Trump. If Trump says the Fed rates are too high the Fed should have raised its rates.
5
Call me naive, but I believe that President Trump can do for this nation EXACTLY what he did for Atlantic City!
37
@Big Text Have you noticed the federal deficit and the national debt? He already has done for the US what he did for Atlantic City. He just hasn't yet walked away leaving everyone else to pay for his failure.
1
The job of the Fed is to see that the money supply is constantly growing at the same low rate, not to pander to Trump's stock market.
14
Months ago I wrote, in commenting on a NYT article about The Donald, "There are at least 100 million Americans who would make a better president than Trump. I am one of them, and so are you."
I rest my case.
31
Smart money is taking dumb money.
Smart money bought on Friday and waited until the good news to sell.
There is no information here about coronavirus or economics.
1
One would have thought that after the last three Republican fostered recessions (including the worst one-Bush ll's) would have taught us that providing unlimited access to the US Treasury to the Wealthy or the Corporations that they control can never end-up good for the rest of us. Now just waiting for the 'Too big to fail' talk of bailing them out, following the November Elections..
13
Oh no, they cut my less affluent person's retirement income from my savings account interest and the more affluent people's retirement income from their stocks and bonds! Oy vey.
Those poor economic decision makers overwhelmed by a little microorganism no one could have predicted wreaking such havoc even a month ago.
3
Trump just keeps repeating he has everything under control. Don't worry be happy.
9
Woof, a fiscal stimulus package from a thrice-bankrupted business failure with a cabinet full of grifters is a scary prospect.
26
@Brooklyn Dog Geek 6 times, actually. Trump declared bankruptcy 6 times.
1
What happens when the rate hits zero?
3
but Oh those bond prices!! the silver lining
1
Too many unquantifiable and unpredictable variables in play here... poor Fed trying to propagate illusion of power and leverage... Wizard of Oz stuff here...
5
This is what happens when you have an incompetent White House administration advising the Central Bank. Trump wants to stimulate the economy....just like he wants to distribute untested Coronavirus vaccine YESTERDAY ..... ugh...... Furthermore not a single reputable economist thought that lowering interest rates would force or encourage Chinese and South Korean manufacturing and exports to suddenly turn around. Now we've wasted 1/2 a percent that could have been used to initiate much needed infrastructure projects. Can you finally understand why this loose canon declared bankruptcy a half dozen times?
19
@PeterH
We understand why he declared bankruptcy. The problem is that he doesn't.
14
What rate cut makes sick people go to work or the supermarket?
17
So, the Fed hands a virus an interest rate cut- and still, the markets aren't happy and Asclepius ain't impressed.
4
Fed has been wasting the last few arrows in its quiver since Janet Yellen was practically sacked. We have record low unemployment and record high stock market as well as record high deficit. To top it all, Nancy Pelosi cut the Republicans a blank check by raising the debt limit way past regular renewal period.
I hope President Trump wins a land slide with a long coat tail to sweep away the house from hapless democrats. That will bring the day of reckoning for everyone including red state people who follow Trump like chicken following the colonel. Democrats are pathetic in their sense of altruism while McConell has achieved everything the most right wing Republicans could remotely dream of.
The debt collector will always come in the final act.
Trump does not have anyone to blame for the decline in the market but himself. Upon taking office, he eliminated the pandemic infrastructure in the White House, cut the budget to CDC, and reduced forward communicable disease teams from almost fifty to ten worldwide. In addition, as Covid-19 raged in China, it does not appear as if the Trump administration developed a plan to minimize its impact on the population. Well,the virus has arrived in the U.S.; and the Trump administration has not been effective in encouraging the people.
Now, the stock market is reacting to a potential pandemic by behaving in an erratic manner.
19
The gutting of the CDC by the administration is the problem that needs to be fixed. But as usual this administration's only concern is for the very rich and their investments.
17
For a cat to bounce, it needs to hit the pavement, it likely caught an updraft on Monday...
4
Provide free medical to anyone who gets tested for C19 and provide free medical for anyone who suffers through treatment.
Offer FEMA type loans to small business to help them weather the coming storm. That would do much more for the economy than rate cuts and tax cuts.
16
We don't know how long this will last but it would help if we had a President who wasn't pushing the FED to do things that won't cure the problem. (We are not suffering from a lack of capital or cheap money.) Leadership is an ability Trump sorely lacks. Plus he has no idea what he's talking about. More quantitative easing? Good grief, dude, the problem is external to our monetary mechanisms. Certainly I can understand bulls wanting to buy stocks that are much cheaper than they were two weeks ago (cost-averaging), but if the equity markets are going to fall during this impending crisis (forgive me if I'm over stating the issue) the FED can do nothing about it. However, the President can. First he needs to get a bit of erudition about how monetary policy works, about how the equity markets work and finally, about how the coronavirus' effect on other countries can greatly affect our economy, even if we dodge a major American outbreak.
6
Republicans think of numbers, numbers aren't needed at the moment. Calming with effective leadership for an increasingly terrified nation is what's needed. Trump isn't good at calming. Lying and firing people are his strengths. Pence is good at praying (lying too) and his prayer meeting in the WH against the virus hasn't worked so far. National anxiety will rise as it's apparent that we have leaders fully incapable to help people face this crisis while continuing to mislead them. Meanwhile Democrats are about to nominate a candidate who is feisty, who will add to the polarity we have. Hardly a calming influence.
6
I hope this crisis will lead to a recognition of the deplorable state of American health care and inspire decisive action to fix it. And since Trump wants a vaccine so badly, I hope he will do the right thing and offer himself and his family as test subjects.
23
No it won’t. The neoliberal Dems will join forces with the Republicans to prevent free health care for Americans
2
@Zejee Good insight. I agree. They are the folks lining up behind VP Biden.
3
@Maron A. Fenico and Zejee You're both right, I'm afraid. But, as Trump likes to say, we'll see what happens. If entire school districts have to close, hospitals are overwhelmed, and the both the GDP and the stock market go way down the people affected won't be happy.
1
This hasty and sudden cut just showed the anxiety of the Fed and the President. Not a good sign. And cutting now is of little effect now. So why cut now, if not in a desperate attempt to prop up stock prices.
9
There’s nothing left but humor.
Humor is in good supply.
9
The road to trying to limit the economic fallout from Covid 19 is through an intelligent and overwhelming health care response, not an interest rate cut. The market is telling that story today very clearly, and the thinking being demonstrated is that they have no confidence this administration is up to it.
29
Monetary policy is the wrong tool for natural disasters like plagues. Need a competent response from the executive branch to treat, contain, and reassure.
All that's been shown here is that the fed is no longer an independent institution - which is terrifying in and of itself.
29
Trump and his administration fail to foresee the results of their actions. We need professionals in charge, not the amateur hour going on right now.
32
I am concerned about economics and pandemics. However, THROWING money at asset classes for the “rentiers” is a sop. Having a public health ministry and general public plans and credible communication is the needs to confront the virus. Throwing around public money is the lazy man’s way to present to address the symptoms rather than the malady.
8
Genius! Market was healing itself.
Fed listens to BLOTUS, cuts rates thereby deepening and amplifying the crisis. Pure stable genius!
28
So—anybody thought about all the criticism coming from the White House to Jerome
Powell? Looks to me like 45 bone spurs
Is trying to lower the interest rates on his loans. The action of the fed can’t contain a virus. Pretty clear that the public understands this.
19
I long for the days of an independent Federal Reserve under the leadership of Janet Yellen rather than the Trump-Powell era of sycophancy. But then, that must be "nostalgia," for an "Establishment" Democratic Obama presidency.
16
Yes, and here we have the leftist NYT and its desperate Democrat followers cheering for a U.S. economic slowdown, which is based on the coronovirus and nothing else, to hurt Trump's chances at reelection. Always party before country.
@Scott
We were on the edge of a recession before the Corona issue. I'd eat beans and rice for a few years to rid America of Trump.
30
@Scott
NO ONE is cheering on an economic slowdown. When you need to invent straw men to argue with, it advertises
that you cannot argue with real positions held by real people.
And you have the gall to say the Dems put party above people?????
8
@Scott Facing up to reality is hard. No one is cheering.
8
Fiscal policy, not monetary policy, is the way to address this problem. A rate cut is stupid, as the markets just told us. Americans need to be reassured that Uncle Sam has their backs when it comes to their health. Trump should announce that the US Treasury will pick up all of the health bills of all Americans for the next 90 days--and apologize for his stupid tax cut that could have paid for this humanitarian effort.
17
Who believes this administration will tell us the truth? Who believes they will put the wellbeing of the country first? Who believes they have the competence to deal with a real crisis? After what we have been through over the past three year, nobody in their right mind would believe any of that.
18
While the coronavirus is not Trump's fault, his administration's lame response is all on him. Markets and the economy need confidence, and a rate cut is a little bit of insurance, not stimulative. The more Trump dillydallies, the stronger the likelihood Bernie will become his Democratic opponent and the more likely non-progressive Democrats will be ready for a major overhaul of our financial and healthcare systems.
20
After 9/11, the stock market closed down until 9/17. Is there a reason or are there reasons why this could not be done again?
It seems that there is much panic selling on the Market today as there was last week. This can only be harmful. I am now now a panic seller and I do not want to be.
WHAT IS THE NEXT STEP ? THIS CANNOT CONTINUE
3
Another gift to the wealthy elite few....want to revive the economy do Pres. Bush's "helicopter money" to the american consuming masses.....to use a phrase of former Sec of Treasury and Goldman CEO Hank Paulsen this FED cut is just a reward for "moral hazard".
3
This is such a predictable and ineffective response from such an inept administration that only understands greed and power. I remain bewildered and disgusted at the sight of people cheering at Trump’s personal gratification rallies.
22
There is not an economy policy in the world to start
Foreign supply lines in a world wide epidemic.
The Oval Office is occupied by the most incompetent
Individual in the history of the world supported by the most incompetent supporters in the history of the world.
Our entire culture is changing to live in a epidemic infested world.
Trump Needs to go.
22
The market didn't need an interest rate cut. It needed reassurance. Nobody can really stop this virus and it's not really anybody's fault. But our government could certainly get together a plan to manage the health, social, and economic crisis caused by the virus. So far, I see no evidence of a shred of a plan. In 5 minutes, 10 average Americans of good will working together could probably brainstorm enough good ideas to form the basis of a plan. But we have Trump and Pence. They can't work with anyone and they aren't people of good will.
25
Put things into perspective. People are dying and the lead story is about how we can save the economy against the negative impacts of our global economy meltdown. Trust me, the “economic down turn” effects no one except the rich who happen to also be the least vulnerable part of population to a pandemic. If all goes well, the rich can pick up a few bargain priced investments while the poor are dropping like flies. Bravo!
15
The Fed signals panic, and the markets respond accordingly.
27
"Lower rates will do nothing to address the cause of potential economic distress, namely supply disruptions and halted economic activity caused by the coronavirus outbreak."
That was going to be half of my comment, but since it is already in the article, I will just highlight it and move on to my second half:
Which means that in Powell Donald has found his Barr. The action is harmful (taking away ammunition we may soon need to fight an actual recession) but it plays into Trump's propaganda. Imagine if Powell had said "Lower rates will do nothing to address the cause of potential economic distress." He would have been right, and acting independently as he is required to, but think of Donald's tweetstorm he would have incurred. Instead, Powell chose to barr.
10
I supported Barack Obama when he was my state senator. I supported Barack when he ran for Senator from Illinois and I supported Barack when he ran for President. I could do so through my American wife.
I still respect his intellect and integrity but his Presidency was a failure and gave us Donald Trump.
Hope and change was about a fairer and more equal America and the growth of inequality accelerated instead of diminishing.
I have encounter Barack on a number of occasions but conservatism will not diminish inequality socially or fiscally.
I am lucky I don't have to decide who to vote for.
I see the Obama Biden legacy the hope and change they promised is now no hope and change only for the worse.
We in Quebec had a quiet revolution and we are more American than America. Equality before the law and equality of opportunity has made us rich beyond our wildest dreams and has made a better future almost a guarantee.
We are lucky we have a wall stronger than steel or concrete. We speak our own language. It took an election for Ontario to realize America is not a good example.
4
@Montreal Moe Interesting. Which American presidency did you see as successful?
1
@DragAzz Hill
If I might be allowed to be totally subjective and go back to America's metaphysics of an evolution to equal justice, opportunity and social status. America was quite successful until 1965 but a nation of law rather than justice meant progress was erratic.
Did Eugene V. Debs accelerate the new deal? Eisenhower did not build the consumer economy but he helped by financing the infrastructure that built the suburbs that stored all the consumer goods.
Capitalism has served the material interests of most of America's voters for over a century.
Even after the turmoil of Trump I see Reagan as the absolutely worst president and see him as the best gaslighter in the history of the Presidency. Jimmy Carter was the most decent, bravest and wisest President but by that time greed and lack of empathy amplified his inability to combat the worship of Mammon.
The poverty rate for the world is moving steadily downward and I credit the USA for much of that decline. I am not American so not America firster but the people of the world are more wealthier , healthier and better educated and secure than ever before.
Here in Quebec we are rich beyond our widest dreams and healthcare, access to education and security are far beyond anything I could dream about when I was young. We are however far more American than the USA.
I have no great love for the Clintons but they made the wiorld a much better place but left America in the hands of of the greediest and most clueless. ,
1
Our reaction to the virus will result in much more damage than the virus which we will
learn is relatively benign.
4
Just like the so-called endless war on terror which has bankrupted us
1
@Yuri Pelham "relatively benign." Relative to what? The Bubonic Plague, perhaps, but certainly not to the Spanish Flu, not by a long shot.
1
And as Trump sits in our White House brooding about an imagined conspiracy by the Media, Democrats and the Chinese to bring his sacred Dow Jones and with it his administration to its knees, we have one of his a loyal stooges in Congress floating an idea of subpoenaing Hunter Biden to appear before the senate. It’s a nice try to distract America from the fact that when it needs a leader that it can trust to do the right thing for our society we find ourselves with a liar in chief with no moral compass, no idea or interest in what to do to get the nation on track for physical recovery but only what he can do to get re-elected and in doing so keep himself and likely 3 of his children out of jail.
14
This is why we need a president, not a mob-boss who is will say anything and to prove he knows nothing about the economy, the federal structure, or anything about the public oppinion. This is a real problem, but we don't have a real president.
20
The NZX today, Wednesday, just opened at 10a.m. and our markets are up, what your USA markets closed at, in the USA. Co-incidence? Maybe USA people are investing in NZ stock market as they know they don't crash like Wall Street.
1
Well President Genius
what's left in the magicians hat to pull out ?
As Submarines skipper has oft been known to say :
Dive Dive Dive ..!!
3
Must be nice for the corporate investors to have 44 watching out for them! In the meantime, medical professionals are warning us that there are not enough respirators nationwide! Only 60K when they need to have 750K! Another story about an American who went to the hospital, was tested for Covid-19 and ended up with a bill of over $3000! But....Trump only cares about the Stock Market! He has his supporters believing that the Stock Market is the ...economy, wonder who will break the truth to them?!
3
Our dear leader says that the COVID-19 outbreak is all a HOAX!
"The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." — George Orwell, “1984”
This is a key pillar of the trump agenda widely abetted by powerful GOP politicians whose thirst for power manifests a new reality of an emerging authoritative political system.
14
The algorithm's aren't buying the stable genius strategy, the Dow is down 3 percent.
9
Buy the rumour (yesterday), sell the fact (today)
4
Dummest move yet by Fed. Powell intimidated by Trump.
8
As this is a people health crisis, interest rate cut helps only corporations and useless for real people. Federal Reserve should print money to support a 30 day fund for a voluntary self quadrantine program for every person in the US up to $5000. Also include one month of free medical for every person in the US - great example of Medicare For All one month trial.
That is a better and 10X less expensive solution to the Trump-GOP head-in-the sand self inflicted, self-fulfilling prophecy US Coronavirus pandemic.
1
At this point I want a depression to hit harder than a bomb. The investor class needs to taste punishment so they abandon Trump. Yes it means suffering for the rest of us; apparently that’s what it will take.
4
@sedanchair
Yeah, so they have 10 million instead of 25 million. No more Beluga cavier for a while. They don't really suffer in a downturn.
2
The rate cut simply does not make sense. The stock market is plunging because of panic selling caused by fears that the continued spread of the corona virus will cause a major slowdown of business activities. The rate cut will not change such fear-induced behavior. As interest rates are already very low, the Fed is limiting its future options when they could make a real difference.
It all smells of an act aimed at pleasing an incompetent president who knows that he badly messed up managing the corona virus outbreak and who wants to cover up his incompetence by pushing stock prices higher.
5
@Konrad Gelbke
I'm not so sure he knows he messed up. He probably thinks his handling of it is 'perfect'
But, no matter what happens, he always thinks goosing the stock market will magically fix it.
1
The DJIA closed nearly 800 points down, despite the rate cut. What does Trump say now that the Fed did what he screamed that he wanted them to do, and, oops, it didn’t work for even one day? The multiple bankrupted businessman and reality tv show host doesn’t have the foggiest notion of what to do. Snake oil, lies, and sleight of hand are his stock in trade for his base, but they are meaningless for the rest of the world and accomplish nothing. What next? We are in for difficult times.
9
Looks like the Republican/Trump house of cards economy is collapsing. Who would have thought?
7
Maybe we should stop trying to rationalize the market's behavior? After yesterday's market headlines, the commentary is beginning to look foolish. Rate cuts and virus aside, we've been staring down a global slow down for a while now and intelligent people can find the truth between the sensational headlines.
4
Now would be the time for the US to work together with our friends and allies and show some leadership.
Unfortunately Trump is incapable of this.
6
@Herschel78
The rest of the world seems to working on the problem pretty well in difficult circumstances. What is the function of this 'leadership' you're promoting?
1
@Herschel78 "Leadership" from the back of the bus? We flubbed the whole test kit opportunity, and now we have no idea the scope of the virus infection.
And "screening"? That only identifies the sick. So much for "leadership".
1
@nolon. Sharing information, joint research, leaders of the world standing together with the President of the mist powerful country in history telling the we all stand together.
That type of stuff.
Great. I’m an old man who retired about a week ago and now there’s a new virus trying to kill me and my IRA.
5
The erratic swing of the stock market is just a mere reflection of chaos and inconsistencies of the White House. The public and the investors are looking for a factual, deliberate strategy to control or contain the pending epidemic in the US here.
I cannot see how Trump can derelict his duty in this real
emergency not like so many others that he proclaimed in the past. Numbers cannot lie. Last week in press conference, Trump said the infection is under control and no death. The confirmed cases jumped from 60 to over 100 and 6 deaths. In his rally SC, Trump said, " The coronavirus infection is a hoax weaponized by the democrat ". No, Mr. President , this is real.
By cutting half a point by Federal Reserve is the wrong medicine for this contagious outbreak. We need a consistent factual message from a qualified health professional and not from a long time politician with obfuscated talking point like Mike Pence.
4
Well, let's see, the Fed actually did exactly what Trump wanted and the market still tanked. Does that mean we can finally get this nonsense out of our heads that he knows what he's talking about at all?
13
I'm frustrated that a public health crisis that will affect, and likely kill, many thousands of people around the world, is primarily being reported on as an economic crisis.
You don't take your 401(k) with you.
6
A very stable market for a very stable genius president.
5
Excuse me, but who ARE these people who buy and sell stocks based on the whims of each day’s news? Up 1,300 points yesterday, down 1,000 today? Are they ignorant, frightened people who don’t understand long-term strategies? Are they cynical institutional players who make ruthless minute-by-minute bets based on algorithms or what they think other investors will do? Just a total mystery. But this is my retirement they’re playing with.
4
Cutting interest rates against what, a virus?
The problem is an untrustworthy, lying President's words that the markets wouldn't believe, and an inept administration's ridiculous attempts in treating it like something minor, a "hoax".
Fix that, and the markets will right themselves.
3
The market has been on a “sugar high” for several years, and everyone knows it. This is Trump’s economy. You know, the same Donald Trump who settled a $25million fraud lawsuit right before taking office. The same Trump who has taken hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars to go golfing. The same Trump who couldn’t even operate a casino without failing.
11
The Trump market tank. Trump's incompetence is finally paying dividends. He owns the recession he's now causing.
7
I know you can't think of everything but you should be able to think of important things that could hamper you.
For instance, I carry a bic lighter to light my camp stove or in an emergency a camp fire. HOWEVER, I also carry a surefire fire starter (waxed matches and steel wool).
The most devastating things for an economy, besides a meteor hitting us, is war on your territory, famine and pestilence. The latter two have high probability compare to the first.
So we have this humongous military to prevent war on territory and a modest surplus of food to mitigate (not prevent) famine. Obama did his best to provide a buffer against pestilence but Trump discarded it, and like Obamacare, had nothing for a replacement.
As the saying goes: "Snooz, you lose."
The wealthy will get hit by this downturn much harder than a Warren Wealth Tax and will have nothing but empty talk to show for it. At least a Warren Wealth Tax had a payoff.
Vote Blue...down ticket, whoever the Democrats nominate for President, if you want your kids to have a decent, didn't say good, decent Life.
9
Why is the central bank bailing out investors? What have they done to stem the pandemic?
It looks like the 'moral hazard' of the first decade of the 21st century is now a Fed policy.
11
LOL, there is no financial tool from the Fed that can stop COVID-19 short of paying everyone to stay at home.
Seriously, even if you reduces rates to negative which is paying people to borrow most people would still stay home best they may not live to enjoy the money.
5
In this day an age the virus and the possible discovery of its cure is less of a problem than what goes on in wall street and how many luxury one bedroom apartments at four million dollars will not be sold.
It is interesting how fragile the staging of our reality is.
7
This just shows that the FED Reserve and our government have no idea what to do and are in panic mode.
We are on our on everybody!
5
@cathy, getting the the worst case Coronavirus is starting to feel like the only thing that can save us from us.
2
Is this really surprising? Of course the levers of the market can't stop economic losses due to people either just not showing up to work or elsewhere. Why did they think this would fix anything...?
8
Surprise.
It's not always about money.
18
This is more evidence that Mondays rise was a blatant manipulation.
12
This was predictable.
Monetary policy is not the remedy to a global pandemic.
This is in stark contrast to the 2008-2009 Financial Crisis. Lower interest rates were critical to refinancing high private debt levels and residential mortgages.
Basel III made sweeping changes to bank asset quality, solvency and liquidity ratios.
Dodd-Frank improved fundamental issues in mortgage underwriting and securitization.
Cutting interest rates in the face of a global pandemic simply illustrates how ineffectual monetary policy is at this stage in the expansion.
Trump is to blame for browbeating the Fed to cut rates 75 basis points a year ago while simultaneously claiming the US economy was never better.
Also, his poorly targeted corporate tax giveaway created record fiscal deficits exceeding a trillion dollars annually. He thought this would lead to investment, but corporate investment fell instead.
He created massive structural fiscal deficits also while claiming America’s economy was never better.
He slashed the CDC and NIH budgets that could have contained the pandemic, and failed to address climate change or rebuild infrastructure.
He built a wall on the Mexican border that fell down with a gust of wind (see climate change).
Trump is directly responsible for the health and economic impact of COVID-19. He is a disaster as the illegitimate occupant of the White House.
34
But he will utterly destroy the US which will benefit world peace. No more regime change wars and loss of corporate control of the country as there will be a depression such has never been seen before.
1
The world monetary consensus was not to lower rates, but when you have a Stable Genius literally ordering functions of government by fiat to save his own skin, this is what we get.
18
The problems with the Markets are called ' uncertainty and Consumer Confidence!' Bring honesty and integrity into government and confidence will return. This is not going to happen until the current administration leaves office.
17
What was the justification for an interest rate cut? Since the general public was jittery anyways because of the nonsense emanating from the trumpites, this cut sent the wrong message to people; "What else aren't they telling us". Reports from around the globe have indicated that the Corona Virus will disrupt economic activity, something those with a sound business model could weather. The cost of money would not change economic reality that much under such circumstances. May be the results of Super Tuesday will calm frayed nerves if it appears someone capable of defeating trump will emerge from the primary process.
8
This is not just panic selling. What we are witnessing my friends is the bursting of the bubble.
37
Everyone is selling.
The rush out of the stock market and the flight to safety is what caused the yield on 10-year Treasury notes to tumble below 1 percent for the first time ever.
11
Duh ... as if this would cure the coronavirus; don’t know what the stock market was expecting - another huge tax cut for corporations and the richest so they won’t lose as much as the rest of us ?
13
Thank goodness I live in New Zealand and our government paid Universal Superannuation is adjusted annually to be 60% of the minimum wage. No matter what happens we have guaranteed government pension.
In Australia there is no tax payable on the first $20,000 of income. That's what Trump should've done in the USA as it's the people in the bottom half income brackets that spend and keep the economy running.
26
@CK
But he DID do that. Only it's the first $20k of UNEARNED income / capital gains.
3
Judging by how quickly the Feds dropped interest rates, when it comes to the coronavirus it seems Trump cares more about the health of the stock market than about the health of Americans.
51
OK, let me see if I have this straight: The market has a hissy fit because no one will give them free money. Isn’t that what it is when interest rates approach or are zero? But it’s not free. I pay. Just looked at a few of my monetary savings instruments, the interest rates have changed already…in the negative direction. The world monetary consensus was not to lower rates, but when you have a Stable Genius literally ordering functions of government by fiat to save his own skin, this is what we get.
34
I've been harping on about how since Trump was elected, that he should have not given tax cuts and should have paid down government debt that is in the trillions. If you governments debt is low then the government has more room to manoeuvre when the nation hits a rocky period or rainy day. It's a domino effect, what worked once, like lowering interest rates won't work once the rates hit rock bottom and will have a negative effect on the markets. The rich won't loose anything as most of their companies on the stock market will be limited liability.
Our government in NZ has set up a Corporate Welfare fund to pay wages of companies affected by downturn in export orders and tourism. Our government has been squirrelling away money for a rainy day so we'll weather this better than the USA.
12
My students and I just had a jarring and inspiring conversation about collective karma, and what it says about US that the state of the stock market not only continues to compete with news and headlines of the actual suffering and deaths tied to the virus itself, but that it in fact continues to take precedence over the latter.
It's actually quite sickening...
32
I would greatly appreciate an economist's explanation of the theory here.
Why would a rate cut help the economy when supply chain issues and softening demand due to understandable fears of the virus are what appear to be the issues?
If we're going to make it harder for those who shouldn't be in the stock market (older folks who need certainty with their money, say) to be unable to get interest rates to keep them at least marginally in line with inflation, shouldn't that explanation be provided?
7
@Gambel's Quail MBA from University of Chicago. Specialization in finance & economics.
Agree that supply chain issues and lower growth forecasts are going to be an impact to revenues & profits. The rate cut will allow companies to weather the weak period, rather than sell assets (drives prices lower) or layoff workers.
The stock market is reacting badly to the rate cut - analogy I can think of is a patient being told "You qualify for chemotherapy" It is great that there is a drug that can help, but the patient also realizes that they were sicker than they previously thought.
Stocks are going down because the Fed has given more confirmation that the low growth scenario is more likely. Since stock price is NPV of future cash flows, low safe rate of return will raise prices but lower future cash flows lower prices. In this scenario, the lower future cash flow is dominant.
3
@James
Thank you - your explanation is very helpful!
The Fed needs to stop spending all of its time trying to prop up Trump's reelection chances. The economy is still doing fine, so why do they keep lowering rates?
16
@Steve Acho
Maybe so that real estate developers can get cheaper loans?
16
I’m not an economist nor a medical practitioner but isn’t using lowered interest rates to create demand during a supply-side crisis analogous to using antibiotics to fight a virus? Just wondering.
24
"Corporate borrowing could get cheaper."
Gotcha.
28
How the Market will react and respond to ANY hiccup that comes its way is about as mysterious as the coronavirus itself.
8
There have been 500 people tested for the virus, 100 found to have it, and 6 people died. Extrapolate that out over the population of the US and it seems very serious. Are those good numbers? No, but what other information do we have. It's clear that the virus is already widespread and that it is serious. No spin from our fearless leader and his groveling experts will change that and no rate cut is needed since the corporations are sitting on piles of cash that they use only to buy their own stocks. I suggest they put all of their cash into buying their own stock, you know, if they think it's such a good investment, and they are such brilliant corporate leaders. Surely they think so. They have told themselves what geniuses they are every chance they get, so that must be correct.
11
Today, nine deaths.
4
@Chris
9 deaths now.
4
Trump rode the Obama economic rebound for three years, claiming it as his own and blaming every bump in the road on someone else. Take credit for everything, take responsibility for nothing. Thankfully this extended train wreck is coming to an end.
50
emize.
Just make sure all expenses in healthcare are deductible. Further, make this deductible for all, not just those that itemize.
If you want to go further, replace a worker’s lost income if they become ill.
That is, if helping Main Street is the question.
5
We both know it’s not. These people are Republicans. If anything, they’re buying shares in casket manufacturers.
2
So the Fed slashed rates, and the markets still fell. I think traders and everyone else can see what's going on here--an obsequious Fed trying to prop up the market. Monetary policy is a poor substitute for actual economic activity--and that is quickly shrinking because of a ham-handed response to the rapid spread of the COVID-19.
Despite Trump's claims, reality has a way of catching up with you, but of course Trump will find a way to blame Obama, Hillary, Democrats even if he is the one who slashed budgets to be ready for just such an event.
21
Australia and NZ are doing the same, or thinking of doing the same. In my opinion, it's just delaying a recession and market crash. Borrowing more money isn't the answer and the money has to be repaid. Better watch out you don't go into negative interest returns for investors as you'll see the banks with no money as the investors will withdraw all their money from the banks and banks will go bankrupt or have to foreclose on properties or however it works. Not much room for movement by the government as interest rates creep lower. Just delaying the inevitable.
7
Donald Trump, the man whose businesses claimed bankruptcy nine times (I have been told) is sticking his nose into places it does not belong. He knows nothing about monetary policy, and less about the control of a pandemic. If he had a brain in his head, he would stop speaking to the issues, and Twittering like a twit, and let the experts do their magic. We need new leadership in the White House.
26
How does this cut benefit the Trump family?
15
They’re in debt to their eyeballs.
7
Well, that backfired. Cutting rates is supposed to make markets confident. Not only did it not work, but now monetary policy makers have spent a good piece of ammunition. This is trouble.
18
@J.P. Johnson
Clearly, the move appeared to investors as desperate and ineffective in a world economy where supply side attrition is the real issue at hand. Interest rate cuts simply won't address the problem.
But you know what.. it pleases Trump and gives him more bragging rights about how he cowed the FED into dropping rates.
5
Does Trump understand anything about markets and the Fed? If markets and economy are doing well, actions by Fed to loosen money only serve to signal market weakness.
POTUS, please stick to your reality show schtick and leave the markets (and healthcare, and anything to do with science, etc.) to the professionals.
16
Mental exercise for the strong: Imagine that the stock market continues its dive. The American economy follows, disintegrating. President Trump, wildly, obviously mentally and emotionally afflicted, remains in charge, having delegated empty suit Mike Pence to command our nation's defense against coronavirus. That's the virus blamed for stock market dive. Provide your own resolution to this absurdist drama.
8
Its always for Wall Street and the rich. What about us peons who live on our IRAs and investments? We get hit.
15
If Trump hadn't squandered 1.5 trillion dollars for his useless tax cut for the rich, we would now have more resources for a stimulus to fight a very possible recession.
Back in 2017, many economists warned the GOP about the shortsighted decision to cut taxes in the middle of an expanding economy.
We may now experience the consequences of arguably the most incompetent administrations to ever run the country.
59
Trump is desperate for the stock market to go up.
I believe if he resigned, along with Pence, the stock market would go up.
Nancy would know how to deal with the epidemic. And we’d all live happily ever after.
28
@TheraP
I'm afraid Nancy is going to have to deal with the epidemic. Trump gallantly shipped all the patients taken off the Japanese cruise ship to a military base in her district.
You *know* that was deliberate.
1
Swing, and a miss!!
Market is falling because everyone knows it's too early for such a big move. Either the government knows a disaster is coming (which they don't) or they just wasted a couple of bullets displaying their false bravado.
17
Wow-The incompetence of this administration is frightening! I really wish they'd work on getting this virus controlled and less on the stock markets and trump re-election campaign.
19
The FED has been bailing out Wall Street banks at least since Alan Greenspan flooded the markets with liquidity after the 1987 crash. All it's done is create bubbles, produce more wealth inequality, and encourage reckless speculation.
16
@James
Unfortunatley, bubbles, wealth inequality, speculation were the intended consequences. Can't make tons of money in a slow and steady environment.
1
I'm going to be living on SS and my 401K that I started about three years ago (okay decades before that but then my parents became my children and it all went bye bye) and will not be retiring for another 10 years, so now my 401K contributions are being purchased at a discount! Score.
7
@Jane Doe, so much for “winning”!
1
Welcome to the future: globalization and climate change. Both are inevitable, both require planning, leadership, difficult choices, courage to face reality. The U.S. cannot remain the world's richest economy with a "leader" who has none of these skills, whose only value is "what's in it for me."
30
How could it be possible that a rate reduction could solve a supply chain problem? This is not a problem that needs an investment boost—-it is a problem that needs to be solved as a healthcare matter. The Fed has now tied its hands for the time when a rate manipulation will actually be needed.
9
It opens up cheap borrowing, allowing people to create alternative supply chains, or turn on local production more easily. Preventing liquidity from drying up in a crisis is a great short/medium-term move
Yep—-will stand by to see iPhones manufactured in Kansas.
1
@Marcus
Yeah, just turn on that "local production"!
1
The Fed cuts rates. Because nothing says "don't worry, calm down, everything's under control, prospects are good" like an "-emergency-" rate cut. And one again, Trump promotes this. Lower interest rates won't help fractured supply chains any time soon. Lower interest rates won't help consumer spending as sick people stay home, companies lay off workers and close plants due to component shortages, and demand falls as those people cut back. Lower rates will, however, help real estate investors... and the lower bond rates make Trump's huge deficit and debt accumulation less a burden in the short term. The wrong solution, but at least Powell's trying.
3
I see the Feds decision to lower the interest rate more as a vote of no confidence in the current administrations ability to handle a crisis, than as any meaningful way to boost the economy.
President Trump has done nothing meaningful his entire term to prepare for such a disaster, and his administration has actively striven to undermine affordable healthcare for workers, while leaving our country in a worse spot to respond to this type of crisis than we were 4 years ago.
20
Unfortunately Keynesian economics and as such the Fed is of little help for the any person who's livelihood is going to be crushed by the economic fallout from the supply chains collapsing. No amount of interest rate benefits or freer credit can help if there is nothing to buy. This rare, gut reaction, by the Fed will be of little benefit for the stability of the US economy.
Things are going to get way way worse before any of this gets better. The Fed should have held onto this cut for the recovery. Using it now is equivalent to creating more demand when really the supply is the real issue.
11
Argh. Please show and discuss the fact that this 'plunge' has only taken us back to where we were in *MID NOVEMBER*. It's ridiculous how overblown the commentary is - the market was zooming up all December, and now it's dropped back. Yes, coronavirus is a concern, but c'mon!
4
Trump took credit for the strong economy he was given. He can also take credit for the implosion he has caused. Fair is fair.
30
@Alex - on what planet is Trump responsible for the coronovirus? Give me a break.
1
@DRS Trump is responsible for the Economy; not the virus. Trump has been taking credit for the economy for 3 years; he can not claim no now
4
Planet I gutted CDC funding just in time for COVID-19?
7
Maybe if my taxes hadn't gone up so much with Trump's tax changes I would have more to spend albeit in a Blue state. I am $4K out of pocket already so my consumer spending is down except on Purell. How about I get my tax breaks back.
20
"So we’re at the low level. As they get better, we take them off the list, so that we’re going to be pretty soon at only five people. And we could be at just one or two people over the next short period of time. So we’ve had very good luck."
If I'm running against Mr. Lucky, his picture with this particular gem is on a loop 24/7. It's plastered on placards, billboards, and millions of handbills distributed from one side of this country to the other.
10
Finally, work from home can be valued for all it’s worth!
No costly office space, fancy clothes for the office, and an hour or two 5 days a week sitting in traffic jams.
And with Amazon and the grocery stores making free home deliveries physical contact can be reduced further.
Basic Question: what’s the age distribution for contracting the illness and dying?
7
My take from this is that Powell is a tool of Trump, not an independent agent with any foresight or fortitude. I suspected as much, now I have no doubt.
52
Within the next 1.5 hours, I believe all of yesterday’s gains will have been erased.
And the corona-infected cat will be dead.
15
Once I saw the Fed rate was cut a 1/2 a point,
I opened up several domestic factories,
started a huge hiring spree and flooded the market with high quality goods.
78
@Blue in Green
Thanks for the humor. It worked better than the rate cut.
22
One day the GOP will have to admit they actually need a federal government. Until then they’ll just keep cutting taxes, lowering interest rates, and hoping for the best.
43
The Fed's feckless rate cut highlights the impotence of low interest rates. For years, the average American worker has been shackled to the whims of the corrupt, pyramid scheme stock market as alternative safe savings products have been reduced to near zero returns by Fed policy that favored debt over savings.
21
This is an impotent move by the FED as our economy is about to be pummeled by a shocked economy where recreation and buying non essentials will be no more. In King Co. the Wa. Governor said to avoid: hand shaking, public events, restaurants and shopping malls due to a 30 person outbreak with 6 deaths in 48 hours. He said to be prepared to stay at home, work from home and well have your emergency plan ready. The markets and people fear this reality. COV 19 is in our communities and our health care system is underfunded, not coordinated and short on tests for COV 19. The sick will just stay at home=not working vs going broke by going to our for profit hospitals. In Oregon a local health care union stated that it is under staffed to refill a group of quarantined dozen or so nurses at a med center where two people have COV 19. The county quarantined over 50 because of an infected school worker. The school closed for 3 days=loss of work for parents and teachers. In Eastern Or. a casino worker has the COV 19 so the Casino is shut and 100's if not thousands were exposed and job days are lost. News just said that he also attended a high school basketball game were hundreds more were exposed so the county prudently cancelled large sporting events = janitor, concession, school rental money is lost. If people are sick they cannot work or spend money, period. The US economy is built on NON essential purchases, so we are in deep trouble even with a negative interest rate.
13
A financial tool (rate-cut) can't solve a medical/public health problem.
26
Trump - the king of debt - benefits personally from lower interest rates.
That's all you need to know.
98
@Simon Storey
Yep. He was pushing for lower interest rates long before the corona virus epidemic.
10
@Simon Storey EXACTLY what I thought. Given his background in borrowing money, this is all he can come up with.
1
Socializing all bad bets by the financial sector fraudsters and banksters. I thought the “market” involved risks? Alas, the “markets” are a scam. High Frequency Trade much? (80 plus percent of daily trades). Look at the one hundred year DJIA chart. What goes up will always go up? Just make the number whatever you want it to be. 30K coming on soon. The equity markets are irrelevant to the vast majority of our people. And they “say” both very little and untrue things about the state of the economy.
6
Investors want central bankers to act. By doing what? Will Powell show up at the CDC and lend his brain power to the development of a vaccine? Will another governor go to China and start working a factory line? Etc. These people kill me. The market is reacting to a problem money supply and interest rates can't fix.
11
Trump doubled dared Powell and he took the bait, so he'll be the first fall guy, but not to worry, Pence in waiting the wings to be replaced by Nikki Haley.
15
This is similar to the band playing upbeat music while the Titanic is sinking,
16
donald trump has been whining about interest rate cuts for over a year now, and finally the fed has caved in under the guise of trying to head off a national disaster, so my first instinct was to ask who is going to be the biggest beneficiary of all this ill advised rate cutting, the national interest or trumps' own personal and corporate financial interests. taking financial advice from someone with his track record of financial failures is a formula for disaster.
7
So Trump whines this morning that the Fed chairman “Should ease and cut rate big” and, hours later, the Fed ‘cuts rate big’ by a full half a percent. The pre-autocratic days seem quaint now, when the Fed’s independence mattered.
Now Trump is whining some more that the Fed must “further ease” and that not doing so is “not fair to the USA” (read: to Trump). Clearly, he is panicking that the stock market bubble he has juiced by running up the deficit will burst and ruin his re-election prospects. And of course the media and Democrats will be to blame every step of the way.
Is it too much to ask for some statesmanship, empathy, and unity at a time of crisis?
16
From this president? I’m afraid not.
3
Trump is unqualified for statesmanship. Empathy is not even in his vocabulary. So, no to your question.
4
Can the Fed create a vaccine?
I thought not.
13
This is an absurdly reactive response to this modest correction. Let it run its course as we learn the real ramifications of the virus, and focus attention on the public health issues at hand.
The 2008 crash was completely different, as it was a measured response to the precipitous collapse of a well-known and oft-measured international bubble.
This is a (probably political) and utterly unwise and unnecessary over-reaction that is being done on behalf of the top 10% of Americans (by income) to calm them as their ridiculous and gratuitous profits from the 84% of the stock market they own are slightly trimmed.
This is not a catastrophe. The virus, on the other hand, might well be. Let's keep our priorities - and our focus - where they ought to be.
9
Trump and the Republicans are ready to fight this virus with every tool available and conceivable: tax cuts, interest rate cuts, increased defense spending, Senate hearings on the Bidens, civil service purges, press censorship, and police raids. That's how you fight an epidemic America. And of course we'll need to order some teeny tiny handcuffs.
28
Who would have thought a president who declared bankruptcy 6 times would offer the Fed bad economic advice?
41
This is insanity. Money is free. There are trillions sitting on balance sheets uninvested. We are artificially inflating an already gigantic asset bubble. Like a balloon. It's going to explode eventually and there will be no tools left to fix it. No deficit to increase. No interest rates to lower. This might be the worst Fed leader and board since its creation.
10
The Fed cannot control this fake Trumpian economy. It will have to take its course and economics will follow suit. The more Trump meddles with our Markets, our Fed and OUR country, the worse off we will be. He knows NOTHING, especially for a "stable genius", and his "advisors" are all "yes men and women", sworn to obey him and not US.
15
I believe that stockholders know that Trump is incompetent. They just haven't cared until now because an incompetent president in the midst of a pandemic is a risk to public health and the economy.
5
And the market plummets. What a circus.
5
The Market is a real time mirror of the chaos on the White House.
10
Everything Trump does has to do with the 2020 election.
Everything.
15
@Ann
statute of limitations means that re-election is the only way he can stay out of jail....
8
@Ann That's because he's desperate to stay out of prison.
4
@brian Rubbish, America has never and never will jail a former president. Instead, they’ll issue a pardon. More realism please.
What the world needs now is an expert immunologist leader who understands viral behavior and not an ignorant real estate developer who understands nothing.
When will this president relent and accept the enormity of the medical reality that faces the people of this planet?
5
Never.
2
“. . . and all you can talk about is money and fairy tales of eternal economic growth. How dare you!”
Money over common sense and fighting the virus or the other looming crisis that Greta was addressing. Shows you fools are in charge. Pence, Muenucin, and Kudlow, help please.
What the markets heard was: "This is really serious, will cause further economic disruptions and a slowdown, if not recession."
That the Fed lowered rates by a good chunk is simply the exclamation point to the above statement.
The economy wasn't slow and slowing due to the cost of money, but in reaction to what is more clearly a systemic economic operational impact from this virus. It may not in fact be that bad from medical perspective, but it will slow economies materially. A lower cost of money will not make it all better.
And the Fed just clarified that bit of reality. Time to sell while you can.
5
Hey Donald, that interest rate cut you have been bullying the Fed about really helped the market go in the direction it needs to go. Like down around 700 points.
4
It's pretty clear Trump is manipulating the stock market and the USA economy. Why anyone trusts a man who has had so many bankruptcies is a mystery to me. I wish the Federal Reserve Board would act in the best interests of the people and the country and not Trump.
10
I believe there are bio-experts at Trump University who are keeping Trump abreast of the quickly changing viral factors.
17
Apparently, readers don't know what they're talking about. The Fed lowered rate to support future economic growth. As Powell reiterated during his press conference, this was not made to halt a market slide which - at that time - was not in any free fall. That came shortly afterwards and it seems to have scared the market. Bad timing on Fed's part.
@MCH Powell said the right things, but Trump has been saying the Fed should lower rates to stop the market's slide right now. That's why people are making the comments that they are. You may think Powell acted autonomously. Americans apparently doubt it.
10
To be fair, attention to this issue is warranted. HOWEVER, in times like this, it should be taking up a fraction of the news, not the headlines. Hence the void of any communication that would be a major part of any effective response to this pandemic.
2
Maybe stocks would rally if we released a definitive and realistic plan to fight the Outbreak and stopped minimizing it on one side of Trumps mouth while screaming for FED intervention with the other side
11
Interesting how things have changed since 2008. Look at the picture of Bush signing stimulus. Notice Nancy and Mitch. Today there is no way, no matter what was being signed, that they would stand so close, smiling.
2
Question from Monday's brief and short-lived rally is now answered by the response to the Fed's interest rate cut: Monday was a Dead Cat Bounce.
12
Within the same half day the Fed cuts rates, Trump is on camera asking if a generic flu shot can prevent the Coronavirus.
The economic issues are not a result of interest rates.
33
It would seem a Fed rate cut by J. Powell, when the American economy is regarded as "strong", is kowtowing to expected Trump tweets to cut , cut, cut.
Cutting interest rates is a "guaranteed" Trump fix.
Trump believes the stock market is a direct indicator of the economy (market up = economy up, market down = economy down).
Sort of like climate deniers who think if the outside temp is down, so must be the climate.
Well, it seems Mr. Powell did kowtow, and what did it produce?
The Dow immediately shot up 700 with the sugar high.... sweet.
However, 1.5 hrs later the Dow was down ~620, a swing of negative ~990 at that time.
It would seem traders who actually understand the situation are not easily fooled.
As I type this at 1:22 PM EST , the Dow is down ~550.
The tweets are coming.
Well, at least Jerome Powell, as a good soldier, can say he tried.
16
Clearly, Trump realizes that the only thing he can pin his hopes on for his presidency is the stock market.
Any reasonable person would pin his hopes on the people of the U.S.
12
A jittery market would have been calmed far more effectively had the administration demonstrated basic competencies in dealing with the pandemic. But this administration has no basic competencies.
32
These daily and even hourly 500 to 1,000 point swings in the Dow create the potential for a lot of insider trading and other mischief.
Anyone who knew in advance today of Trump's rate-cutting Tweet or the Fed's precipitous rate cut could have made a killing in the stock and bond markets and in currency trading.
Hopefully, the SEC is doing due diligence and reviewing all large trades for any signs of insider knowledge or suspicious trading.
17
Wonder whether Jared and Ivanka and co have been doing any investing?
These daily and even hourly 500 to 1,000 point swings in the Dow create the potential for a lot of insider trading and other mischief.
Anyone who knew in advance today of Trump's rate-cutting Tweet or the Fed's precipitous rate cut could have made a killing in the stock and bond markets and in currency trading.
Hopefully, the SEC is doing due diligence and reviewing all large trades for any signs of insider knowledge or suspicious trading.
2
Some CDC test kits would be more in order to keep Americans safe than any rate cut. trump is unfit to lead a paper bag much less a nation. We are all endangered by his incompetence. And how about not changing people for their testing and quarantines.
8
The markets (traders, banks, and billionaires) want socialism for the rich, capitalism for the rest if us. I am retired and the rate cut just cost me big time on my hard-earned savings. No bailout for me.
39
As long as trump continues to measure his own success by the performance of the Dow, his efforts will be focused on propping up that metric. It may actually be to our benefit that he is so focused on the stock market because that preoccupation keeps him busy and away from underplaying the potential impact of Coronavirus and overplaying the "effectiveness" of his administration. As long as he's not directly involved in the task force, there's hope we continue to get a glimmer of truth from folks like Fauci.
8
Somethings will never change no matter what. Volatility and unpredictability will remain due to the complexities of the current state of flux.
2
@Girish Kotwal
The market was frothy and a correction was in the wings. It took Corona to fan the flames of fear.
1
@Les SW Florida. Corona did not fan the flames. Fear, Panic, ignorant investors and the media hype fanned the flames. Chicken little and the sky is falling mentality is always at the heart of every problem.
1
It appears as though Wall Street is more interested in, if not dependent on the administration getting (working)tests, proper face masks and issuing truthful statements to the public than they are in rate cuts. When Trump campaigned proudly as a “disruptor,” who could have predicted he be this kind of Atomic Wrecking Ball? A lot of predicted that...a lot of us.
10
We should of been raising taxes and interest rates the past few years. Instead we've been acting like an addict who's heroin supply would never end, and who threw out the methadone.
We are running a trillion dollar annual deficit due to tax breaks for the weathly and corporations. Plus we have kept interest rates at extreme low rates far longer than needed. What this means is that our typical tools to get us out of a recession have already been used. Typically we have tax breaks, stimulus spending and lowering interest rates to jump start the economy. Well, we've been using that economic stimulus while we didn't need it.
What now? All I can imagine is massive deficit spending....
35
Next up is to see the Trump administration’s tax cut proposal.
Sadly, Trump and Republicans are complete frauds when it comes to tax cuts.
We’ll see something that helps people who really need a cut along with Trump’s tax returns and his health care proposal.
11
Trump knows that his base's perceived notion of a booming economy is all that keeps him afloat. And the xenophobia and racism of course.
27
New Zealand Parrots could make better decisions than Trump:
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2020/mar/03/study-finds-parrots-weigh-up-probabilities-to-make-decisions
8
@TheraP: Hey, don't make fun of parrots.
The old paper towel to the rescue routine.
Except this time it’s more money for his cronies.
20
Only one way to solve this upcoming pandemic. Another tax cut for the wealthy. (Sarcasm off).
7
Trump pulled out all the Stops:
* Big Rate Cut
* Powell News Conference
POW! POW! Wile E. Coyote and the Road Runner
11
Cut all the interest rates you want. My discretionary cash goes to the savings to make up for the lack of savings rates.
13
Of course as others have pointed out lowering interest rates in response to a public health crises seems absurd but it is illustrative of an endemic problem in our public discourse which is the focus on "growth" as measured by GDP or market indices as the sole measurement of prosperity/economic well being.
12
The Fed should invest in coronavirus testing kits, instead.
20
I hope Fed Chairman Powell is not worried about his job more than doing the right thing.
Today’s action suggests otherwise though.
Hope I’m wrong.
10
@freeasabird
No, you are not wrong. Trump is purging federal appointees that are not loyal to him. I'm not worried. The Stable Genius is at the helm...of a sinking ship.
1
@Les A sinking pirate ship. Chairman Powell will be walking the plank soon.
I know there is tremendous pressure to do something - but everyone knows this won't help more than, at best, a tiny bit. The Fed is a one-trick pony, and few people are fooled by their trick.
21
@David
we know that don the con had at least two tricks --- paid both of them to not talk, and even THAT didn't work
complete and utter lack of leadership in this administration
1
The half point cut means that the Fed has taken an aggressive step to halt the slide of the stock market. It worked -- for about half an hour. I just looked, and the Dow is now down about 2.25%.
A frequent estimate is that commerce -- people buying stuff -- constitutes about 70% of the economy. If people stop travelling, stop going out to eat, stop going to events and start hoarding what cash they have, we are looking at a serious recession.
And there is very little more the Fed can do about it.
478
And....this is a public health crisis first and foremost. The economic repercussions are secondary. So far, the federal response to the public health crisis has been.....what would be an accurate, non biased word....wishful.
62
@Andy Beckenbach
Trumpcession. He OWNS it.
But, of course, he'll successfully shift the blame to someone else.
85
@Andy Beckenbach Apparently, you don't know what you're talking about. The Fed lowered rate to support future economic growth. As Powell reiterated during his press conference, this was not made to halt the slide which, at that time - was not in any free fall.
3
Apparently, the traders aren’t buying it. Even administration apologist Jim Cramer just said he’s even more worried about the economy because the Fed felt compelled to lower the interest rate a half point.
15
Maybe it's because I'm not an economist, but I just don't get it. Business is bad right now because we're in the throes of an epidemic. That's likely to continue until the epidemic has passed.
We're not having a crisis of 'high interest rates'. Rather than lowering interest rates, it would perhaps make sense to offer loans to specific affected businesses if they are having difficulty staying afloat. To the layman, the rate cut looks like a bald manipulation of the stock market.
613
@ShenBowen
It’s called socialism for the rich. Or is that communism. Republicans love that word lately.
227
@ShenBowen Yes. The same knee jerk response typical of a Trump administration. During his infamous incoherent press conference, Trump announced he was going to close the southern border. Even though there were no cases of Corona virus south of the border.
91
@ShenBowen
" To the layman, the rate cut looks like a bald manipulation of the stock market."
Because that's exactly what it is. Rich men trying to hold on to what they have even though the ship has sprung a leak.
170
The traders know a minion when they see one. I believe people are more shaken by the fact that the Fed is now just another Trump instrument and can not be relied upon for independent guidance and decision-making. LOL - Trump leading the economy...
477
We remember his bankruptcies. He is just a talker
55
@Chris P.
LACATST
laughing and crying at the same time
4
This isn’t a banking problem. This is a viral epidemic.
The appropriate response is to assist public health organizations to reduce the risk of spread of the disease.
Viral epidemics do not get better with interest rate cuts or with lowering corporate tax rates.
900
@Chris I totally agree with you!
My own slightly conspiratorial theory on all of this is as follows:
1. the Larry Fink's of the world drive some major selling activity last week, taking profits and pressuring the Fed to take action, their ultimate goal being to inflate stock values
2. Fed decision makers privately communicate with Fink and his brethren over the weekend that they will cut a half percentage point Tuesday.
3. Assured of the action, Fink & others do major buying yesterday to buy low in face of pending Fed action
4. Fed lowers rates today. Aha! Fink and his cohorts have won the first round!
5. Now it's time to sell again (i.e. Tuesday - markets not reacting well to the rate cut), taking more quick profits and raising pressure for additional Fed action.
The cycle continues, add some QE to the mix, etc.
the whole stock market thing is a complete scam! we're eventually headed to an implosion where the Fink's of the world will make a killing and all of the smaller holders planning their retirements (and over invested in stocks) will get hammered.
BlackRock (and similar) can literally control all of these cycles to their advantage.
48
@Chris
Chris - I agree. Despite the machinations of the global economy, it's a day to gain some level of confidence that, at least at the state level, public health officials are paying attention. The CDC has so far failed on many counts, so whatever we should hear from VP Pence, or Trump himself, who knows. Here in California, I voted (for Bernie) at a polling place showing a steady stream of people coming in. The rush is expected from 4 p.m. on. There was plenty of hand sanitizing liquid available.
Governor Newsom is working with public health officials to provide the best possible defense against the virus. The market ups and downs take second place.
13
@Chris
And as an added bonus we now have fewer options once the next banking crisis arises. That's a pretty nifty two-for-one value on incompetence.
22
Trump blamed the Fed for the tanking stock market. They lowered rates and the market declined. Who will he blame now? Now it will be Schumer and Peloci's fault. Trump's incapacity to take responsibility for anything except exaggerated credit is monumental.
439
And the media.
14
Next he'll blame the illusory server or Ukraine.
10
@C Cue the "It is all a hoax created by the media and dems to hurt Me me me me...."
36
Interest rates? This is a public health emergency. The utter vapidity and incompetence of our current so-called leadership is breathtaking.
We’re absolutely hopeless at actually containing the spread of this deadly disease, fixing our disaster of a health care system or helping those in need. But hey, let’s cut interest rates so the investor class might keep squeezing out their massive profits for a few extra weeks before millions of Americans might die from this thing.
Our country is not in a good place, folks.
744
@David Cutting interest rates and attending to the health emergency are not mutually exclusive. Like it or not, capitalist or socialist, keeping the economy humming is in everyone's best interest. Recession would be terrible for all. Even Bernie would agree.
8
@Rob D Not mutually exclusive if a competent POTUS is at the helm. Thus, the warranted fear and whiplash.
57
@David "deadly disease"? get real. this panic and hyperbolic language is doing more damage than anything trump can or cannot do about it.
3
The Fed has tried to take a hammer to a virus, and today’s wild market swings — from ecstatic immediate reaction to several hundred point drop — show that the impotence of that tool (for the task) was eventually recognized.
188
@ChrisMas The most rational thing the stock market has done in a while.
5
All trump cares about is the singular success he crows about..the market Obama left him.Without that all he has is chaos, death and destruction.Interest rate cuts and tax cuts will not eradicate a pandemic, the real cause of the market "correction".
9
Reading these comments has led me to the conclusion that Economics should be a required course in high school.
5
Would you please elaborate.
Thank you in advance.
5
@freeasabird Just read them. Many are just knee jerk politically motivated statements that have no basis in fact or knowledge of the differences with or relationship between the economy (domestic and global) and the stock market. They talk of trashing capitalism and replacing it with what? I am not in favor of the rate cuts and no fan of DT by any stretch. Capitalism may be the worst economic system but it is better than all the others.
2
To calm the markets and the public in general, whenever the CDC or the media reports on the latest coronavirus infection figures they should list the latest figures for flu cases and deaths right along side. Maybe throw in motor vehicle accidents and deaths as well. What this country desperately needs now is PERSPECTIVE. The good news is that, unlike useless face masks, you can’t run out of it.
3
@Jay Orchard
I think people are concerned that the contagion rate is much higher than the flu. Maybe you missed that in the past several months of articles on the subject.
A 3 percent mortality rate is 20 to 30 times higher than the flu’s, compare percentages, not totals.
2
@Ben Balcombe
So what? Are you telling me that the flu mortality rate you're willing to live with but anything higher than that you're not? When did you come to that conclusion? Do you even know what the flu mortality rate is? I assume you're not afraid of being hit by lightining even though the odds of that happening may be greater than the odds of a meteor hitting earth. The point is just because the mortality rate from coronavirus may be higher than that of the flu doesn't mean you should be overly anxious about it.
2
Helping the wealthy is good business. Leaving the less well off to die is Gods will. It would would be a slippery slope to help, besides we might get our hands dirty.
10
People get sick, even die on global scale, scientists scratching heads, our Stable Genius flailing but hue and cry is: Oh, the Money!
6
What kind of American-bred idiocy is this, anyway? To have become so superficial and clearly ignorant as to panic about money over human life. THIS...is a response? A response to a biological threat of which COVID-19 is but a mild precursor?
Never has it been so true...it really is the economy...........STUPID.
8
Lots of talk about helping the economy, but near nothing from the federal government about healthcare during an outbreak. Is Trump's administration prohibited from using the word "healthcare"? If it wasn’t news from the states and other countries we wouldn’t know the extent of the issue. And still no idea how people in the US will receive medical help and who will pay for it. Some stories of people paying thousands to test themselves is scary.
Yes, “rate cuts” can fit on a bumper sticker so those who don’t know better can rally to it, but it doesn’t address the actual disease.
4
Our economy is much too dependent on cheap imports from China.
If China's economy comes to a grinding halt because of Coronavirus, there will be a supply shortage. Rate cuts are effective for boosting demand. But they aren't as effective - if at all -- at boosting supply, since the supply shortage from China is caused by factors that are entirely outside the Fed's control.
In the short term, this rate cut might be effective at postponing the death spiral of massive layoffs. Emphasis on 'might'. But in the medium to long term, it's just about anyone's guess.
We have become so entrenched in our ideology of Capitalism curing itself of any and all ills - All Hail the Invisible Hand! - that we didn't even consider the possibility that a virus might bring down the entire house of cards.
So, here we are, in the 21st Century, like a deer in the headlights, with no plan, and no clue what to do next.
Rate cuts and tax cuts don't work on viruses.
8
@Bob The Builder
If walmart goes out of business because of Chinese supply shortages I won't lose any sleep over it.
2
There's only one reason why the fed is getting involved and that is because Trump is worried about his reelection
38
@Johnny
Jay Powell would have become Public Enemy No. 1, replacing Hunter Biden. Since the rate cut hasn't quite had the desired effect, Powell is not out of the barrel yet.
2
The deeper context concerns me. Under Trump, annual deficits increased by 70 percent to a stunning sustained rate exceeding 4 percent of GDP per fiscal year. Interest rates are at historic lows. The national debt is aroung 80 percent of GDP and is projected to continue to grow as fiscal deficits outpace economic growth.
These are unsustainable numbers on their own. Those numbers in the context of coronavirus are frightening. Coronavirus presents a potential shock to the economy both on the supply and demand sides. Supply chains may be disrupted abroad. Domestic demand may recede.
Where are the macroeconomic tools to combat simultaneous supply and demand shocks? Looks to me like both the Fed and the Treasury are short of bullets.
Trump's goofy macroeconomic policies may come home to haunt him. The sad part is that the burden will be borne not by him and the one-percenters, but by people in the middle- and lower-income brackets.
21
Stock Market was supposed to be erratic after rate cut as it already jumped ~4.5% in anticipation of today's rate cut. It will start falling soon, so i guess, another tweet from president and another rate cut from fed?
Mother nature is telling us that we should not be so reliant on an enemy like China for critical manufactured goods and medicines.
Nature and common sense say we should have the capacity to be self sustaining and self reliant. We've been sold out by financial interests who engineered an America that is so dependent on a foreign power.
4
The “stable genius” has created an unstable market. This rate cut smells rushed, the act of a desperate Trump to keep his reelection chances alive.
Well, folks, this shows why Trump failed at business and why he has no understanding of domestic and global markets. Fire Trump 2020.
The markets clearly do not have confidence in his decision making.
34
Although it is true that central banks cannot keep disease from spreading, prevent workers from losing hours at work, or mend broken supply chains amid factory delays, they can prop up the stock holders who safeguard our nation's wealth. If the government can't protect our wealth what's the point of even having a government.
1
@Keitr
Are you kidding?
Government is for things other than protecting wealth.
But, yeah, what you say is what a lot of people believe these days.
Like Bernie says, “America is a socialist country for the rich, and a capitalist country for the poor.”
20
@Keitr I assume this is written as sarcasm... if protection of our nation's wealthiest is the only role of govt, we have failed even more than I thought.
6
Dear All,
In all seriousness anyone who has been following US government policy and doesn't think it is primarily about the interests of share holders and private enterprise hasn't been paying attention. Not to belie Christian concern for the afflicted and downtrodden, particularly fetuses oppressed by the matriarchy, public policy debates tend to focus on concerns of the wealthy, such as government debt, business regulation, taxation, workforce training and voter suppression.
1
Feds have emptied the tank, for Trump. He wanted a cut, he got the larger slice. The EU will have to react, as this is causing Havoc in Italy and jitters with its neighbors.
5
So even the Fed is afraid of Trump.
Cutting rates to deal with a public health problem makes no sense.
If the Fed could arrange for competence in the CDC and the other agencies involved in dealing with this crisis it might help but in the absence of basic protection for health care workers and the ability to contain the spread of the virus a 50 point drop in rates is no substitute for an accurate rapid screening test like other countries have.
15
It is so bizarre to watch the results of all these day traders bounced around by every twist and turn in the news. The pros are taking them to the cleaners.
4
Like it or not the US is saddled with terrible political leadership. It order to mitigate the serious growth of the national debt because of Trump's tax cuts he dismantled or cut the budgets of the organizations that are most helpful in a time like this. The coronavirus is here and spreading. How fast? How many people will be affected? Trump and his advisors are still blaming the news media for spreading hysteria for political effect. Which hasn't inspired much confidence in his leadership. As was stated its uncertain what effect cuts in interest rates will have on the economy since this is not a demand issue. Worries about the stock market will have to wait until the public gets a handle on what they are facing.
8
In hindsight, maybe corporations should have invested Trump's tax cut in ways that would -- at the very least -- have positioned them for productivity and growth in the future.
As it is, CEOs blew the money on stock buy-backs because their compensation's tied to share prices. Those expenditures won't help them recover when the plague's gone.
There was an initial, talismanic response to the rate cut, but the Federal Reserve *obviously* can't mitigate the impacts of a pandemic. Given the mood, and America's irrationality in general, volatility on a downward trend-line seems likely.
But in a couple of months, as Q1 earnings come in, we'll see hard data on the effect of the virus. At that point, the market's drop will be rational.
9
It took traders an hour, but they figured out that the Fed is cutting rates because it’s economic forecast has changed dramatically to the downside.
3
Who will benefit from this interest rate cut? What problem will it help fight? As already shown after the initial jump, the stock market is not impressed. Free money is good for the financial criminal class (still unindicted) but does not improve health care at all. It will not provide relief for those quarantined without pay either, if it comes to that.
8
Now they’ve sent Powell out.
And the markets went straight down!
Looks like nothing is going Trump’s way.
5
It's hard to think of anything more ridiculous and bizarre-- in an administration stuffed to the gills with the asinine and bizarre-- than obsessing about the stock market when the world is on the verge of a viral pandemic. It shows just how rudderless the USA is now, concerned more about the phantom wealth of the stock market than keeping the nation safe from a deadly virus. And we're to take this sham government run by a third-rate crime family and reality tv swindler seriously?
40
Let's call all this financial reporting rather than the spread of disease EXACTLY what it is: a barometer on the re-electibility of Donald Trump.
9
We really have the best of the best looking out for us. Trump is urging the fed to do what they can to make sure the market doesn't crash while Pence is praying the virus away. What a bigly effective combo.
15
Caronavirus - the trump “correction”
4
Moving quickly to cut interest rate is an indication that the fed believes that the economy is wobbly.
And, saying they may even make further cuts before the June meeting is a sign of panicking.
Not reassuring.
16
@freeasabird
Buttressed by markets tanking even as Powell spoke.
2
Does anyone consider that stocks are over valued? It seems that almost any almost de minimus move by the Fed pushes their value one way or the other. This current health scare is real and the markets are also seeking reality.
8
U.S. stocks erratic after rate cuts. Stocks whipsaw. You sure your not talking about the White House whipsawing and erratic?
14
The coronavirus crisis for Trump amounts only to whether he can point to a good Dow in his reelection campaign. I’ve never seen a President who holds the well-being of Americans in less regard, and never thought it possible that 40% of us wouldn’t mind being spit upon constantly.
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@Dagwood
regarding your comment, "I've never seen a President ..."
That's because we've never had one !
6
A cut of this size certainly shouldn't instill confidence in anyone. Maybe the Fed really was in one of those tight, no-win situations where a half-point cut is necessary and justified, as in the face of a major financial crisis or other shock. If so, then there's a very rocky road ahead, because a rate cut never solved anything.
15
@Mford
Rate cut: markets struggle
Power speaks: Markets Tank
Virus shows no signs of stopping due to rate cut. Or Powell.
12
Dollars again. Generation Wealth.
One thing we know for sure, Pence is history.
18
Trump has placed his biggest bet.
He has poor track record. Even bankrupted multiple casinos.
Looks to me like the markets are struggling - even to stay above yesterday’s close.
I’m not a betting person. But it looks like the Fed (pushed by Trump) has played this game poorly.
NOW WHAT?
Having cut rates this much, with so little to show for it?
I picture Trump raging int he White House.
For once, he cannot control events, cannot make himself the center of them, and likely his security team wants him to stop having these rallies - to protect his health.
26
If this doesn't work then it's time to dust off the middle class tax cut. And if that fails.......THE CARAVANS ARE COMING!!!!!!!!!
26
@RNS
Similar to Bush / Cheney trotting out Osama just before the election Remember the video ?
Republicans are so predictable as well as dangerous !
4
Socialism for the wealthy. A market enabled by government control. Forty years of reactive governance and artificial support in a free-market has created a junkie market dependent on government interference. The economy is like one of those giant bubbles people blow in the Park. Beautiful and temporary.
18
@Mike Smith
That's the everlasting beauty of Trickle-Down Economics. Boom, bust, boom, bust.
2
So lowering interest rates will make people go out to (take your pick):
1. Dinner
2. Movie
3. Vacation
4. Concert
Etc.
Etc.
It’s scary that this is the primary govt. response. Cheaper money ain’t going to fix this at all.
62
The only ones who benefit much from these cuts are the TBTF banks and the vulture capitalists who play the derivatives markets, mostly among the TBTF and their largest clients.
The Fed and an utter lack of financial regulation in the derivatives market, set up by Greenspan, the entire Goldman alumni and the rest of them to create what Buffet has to call financial WMDs and others call a debt bmb.
When cut interest rates, you enable giant corporations to buy their stocks back at ultra-low prices even as they continue to issue junk corporate debt to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars.
You can not Twitter away or cause the impact of a massive business to slow down through lower interest rates FOR BANKS. If anything, rates should have continued their upward trajector to signal confidence from the Fed.
If you want to stimulate the economy, give money to people who need it, working people, struggling with the debt-induced in many cases because of of the 2005 bankruptcy act for TBTF banks, credit card companies and payday lenders that eviscerated the right for people who went into debt due to a lack of insurance or losing their job due to the TBTF induced crash of 2008, which caused many to lose their homes, their life savings and were left only with credit cards to put food on their kids tables.
The Central banks have long been the nemesis of this nation and they continue to be ineffectual at best.
60
Readers, please understand that this rate cut is just a smokescreen to lift the market long enough and give cover for insiders to de-leverage, sell, and go to cash before things implode on the less sophisticated retail investors. By goosing the market with reduced rates, stocks climb for just long enough that the rich can trade out undetected before this house of cards collapses. You have been warned.
254
@Daniel Lake
Oh, I think we understand all right. Many financial gurus have been warning that with interest rates so low if a real economic crisis comes the Fed has nowhere to go. So with this move, we're close to the wall and soon will pay banks to house our money rather than earn the pittance that we've recently had to settle for.
I will happily lose every cent if it also means the only place Trump has to go is out of the Oval Office.
What a cluster.
31
Retired or elderly people should go to a rural location for a few months because the fatality rate is quite high for them.
11
@BJ
I’m elderly. How do imagine we should do that? Where should we stay? How should we get there? There’s less medical care in rural areas! Fewer hotels, restaurants.
10
I’m just staying home as my immunity too low to go anywhere and risk becoming a corona case.
Again the Rich, Corporate greed are being rescued over and over again using massive amounts of money.
Why isn’t that money being used for a down payment to some form of Universal healthcare?
God forbid that money would be spend on regular people.
Why do people still vote as both party leaderships have show no interest to improve the life of tens of millions of Americans who live on the edge of a Republican abyss.
Americans have to stand up against the complete lack of choice they have in an election, the only winners will always be the corrupt rich. And if not,
the Supreme Court will make sure they win.
32
@Johan D.
We did stand up. The people in power just don't care. They won and we will not ever be rid of them. They took the last three years to dismantle our system of governance and whip up a frenzy in those who could care less about the consequences by validating their "anger." It's basically the Mussolini play book, page for page. The fix is in and voting won't change a thing. The best thing you can do now is start looking for a place to go, but we're running out of those. Authoritarianism is the new fad and everyone wants in on it.
8
@Johan D.
You're in California and want universal healthcare? Vote Bernie today.
2
@Johan D.: "both party[s] show no interest"...this is simply not true and not fair. Dems and their leaders have passed dozens of bills to help Americans and McConnell refuses to let the Senate vote on them. With McConnell's obstinacy and the mad king in the White House, Dems just don't have power to make anything happen. Blame the voters in KY.
What a dumb move.
20
Don’t we have like 6 to 9 months of this to go in the US? Why cut now?
They are going to have to go negative to socialize the losses on Wall Street.
9
Open Letter to Trump Admin:
This is NOT an economic crisis like 2008-09.
This is a HEALTHCARE crisis (which will spill over to the economy).
You should be throwing TONS of money at our best scientists, doctors, et al. TONS.
Lowering interest rates one half percent sends the wrong message (“we believe things are worse than we’ve publicly stated”) and provides liquidity in the wrong area.
Trump? Pence? What, me worry?
11/3/20. VOTE.
182
"Investors have been watching for any sign of action from the world’s central banks in battling the economic impact of the coronavirus."
The term "investor" is delusional! The average "investor" has absolutely no say or affect on the stock market. It's the huge banks, hedge funds, insurance companies, and uber-riche millionaires and billionaires.
Ao please stop using the term "investor" inferring that it's the average person!!!
29
“Stocks surge” “Stocks whipshaw” “stocks are erratic”
Three headlines in 45 mins says it all really. The Fed should not be propping up stocks and pumping the economy because a baby is crying in the WH. This is hugely irresponsible.
144
@Mark Hall
The man in the white house is faced with something he cannot con or manipulate to his own benefit. He has no idea how to make a deal here with a virus.
60
@Old Cowgirl Maybe Pence can suggest abstinence?
4
Magaman! You've done it again. That caravan virus gets one look at those fantastic interest rates and will cut and run. We can all go back to our regularly scheduled programming now. Let's see... where did I put that remote?
72
There are reasons for the market’s movements over the past three trading days.
On 2/28/20 the market opened with its third “down gap” from its previous close. It then stabilized due to a support level established between March and June of 2019.
On 3/2/20 it then reopened and closed the gap from 2/28/20. Today, 3/3/20, it closed the gap from 2/27/20.
It will likely continue to struggle up this week to close the gap on 2/24/20.
After doing so, it probably need to test the S&P 500 bottom of ~2900 before hitting a new high.
Lowering interest rates at this point simply increases volatility.
9
How is this not socialism for the class which participates in the stock market? Make no mistake. I am glad to see this given that I am 63, employed as a salesperson making housecalls, and my retirement accounts got beat up last week. I am also very healthy and unlikely to have a serious physical impact from this virus should I become exposed. My 91 year old mother, not as healthy, will likely die if she is exposed. Perhaps also my two week old granddaughter whose mother has a month left of unpaid maternity leave. The expense to any of us from a quarantine will be unmanageable. Compound that with high deductibles if we do in fact get sick, and this interest rate reduction will seem like a pointless bandaid. We could be at a soup kitchen for Thanksgiving. We need more and better safety nets in this country. Universal healthcare would be a fair start.
300
@Gigi
We now know what is important to Americana, and it sure isn't Americans.
17
@Gigi Thank you. Yes, the main point; people not profits. It seems so simple; could that be the problem?
10
@Gigi
Don’t worry about the baby, numbers from China show children under 9 almost never have severe reaction. Take care of your mother.
3
The Fed is acting like a casino boss, quickly handing out credits to keep the party going.
How is this going to shake out when nobody has saved any money? Where will the Fed be when we have a million homeless seniors?
88
Why so much focus on interest rates and the stock market? What about all the uninsured and poorly insured Americans who will make health care decisions based on ability to pay? What kind of discounts and waivers will they receive? Why don't we have more (free) test kits, and why didn't the Trump administration stockpile these kits six weeks ago? As I recall, he was prancing around in India when he should have been in the US focused on this crisis.
What are the options for the millions of people who don't have telework jobs or who lack sick leave? What about childcare? How will that work if schools close but parents still need to work outside the home?
There are no breaking news alerts about these issues.
Everything is focused on calming and appeasing the only victim that matters: Trump. The media seem obliged to blast favorable reports on the markets, updated every hour on the hour. Pence, Azar, and even CDC officials are practically silent or spreading unhelpful and even watered-down information.
The only people who are focused like a laser on the American people are the frontline health care workers and the local, county, and state officials. What happens when they get sick? Hello?
206
@PABD This is a big problem...many cannot afford medical support/services in the USA!Any vaccine will not be deploy before 18/24 months; medical support during this period is a must because it will be the only tool for those infected... measures of containement are not in place and not enough testing is conduct! It will be a mess, mark my word.
2
The interest rate cuts are totally not worth it. This is not good news for Wall Street. This is very much a bad thing. What we need to make the markets go up is to stop cutting interest rates and keep the buyback. Therefore, cutting rates are not a good thing to buy.
10
...but we are yet to hear who will be picking up the billing tab for this testing and whether the government will finally step in and assure everyone there won’t be surprise billing for coronavirus tests and treatment! Of course to our president it’s more important to maintain the stock market well being rather than protect the people from the greedy insurances and healthcare providers!
40
To me is seems like bad news that the rates were cut like this. The government is desperate.
66
They hate regulation, they hate oversight, until the Fed comes along and bails them out.
297
"The Federal Reserve has developed a tremendous coronavirus vaccine !"
"We're also working on a tremendous tax-cut vaccine that we think will be tremendously effective.....thank you....thank you so much."
President Tremendous has solved our coronvirus crisis with stock market bubbles.
What a sad excuse for a Presidency.
517
@Socrates It's all the fault of the Crooked Democrats and the Crooked Coronavirus!
(With apologies to Tom Tomorrow.)
14
@Socrates Don’t forget one trillion a year in deficit spending. It’s not that anyone was warned, but lemmings off of a cliff is apropos.
9
They are now defenseless. Pathetic.
25
What happens when the Federal Reserve lowers interest rates to zero or below and the stock market begins collapsing again?
Oh yeah.
Trump hands out free paper money and bitcoins in front of the White House and the IRS mails checks to you and me.
31
He’ll get the Federal Reserve to double down on getting to work on that vaccine!
6
... free $100 bills and bitcoins ....
3
Outta ammo gunny, fix bayonets.
41
There is no reaeon for economic panic. The media hype over the dangers of the coronavirus has much more dangerous consequences than the virus itself. I am a Professor of Medical Genetics. There are numerous unexplained cases of coronavirus in the US and elsewhere. This raises the possibility that the Coronavirus was for a long time indigenous to humans where only recently a pathogenic variant or unknown co-factor. result in a flu. If true, asymptomatic carriers were for a long time present in the human population. I suspect that population wide screening will show that in every country a certain % of the population are corona virus carriers. The test kit just enables to quantitate indigenous coronavirus carriers that have been there long ago. In other words, it may well be that the hundred of thousands of people that are known to come down with the flu each year in spite of the flu vaccine, actually were infected with the Coronavirus instead to the 4 variants of the common types of influenza viruses: A, B, C and D. The bottomline-Covid-19 is essentially a flu with low mortality rates like the common flu that may have went molecularly undiagnosed for a long time. Caution & 14 days quarantine of carriers are a good approach until a vaccine is at hand, but all the hype and economical panic may have much more dangerous consequences than the virus itself.
15
As a microbiologist / molecular biologist I can say definitively that there is no evidence that Covid-19 has been circulating in the population for a long time. This is simple speculation. Nothing more.
46
@lieberma You say: "it may well be that the hundred of thousands of people that are known to come down with the flu each year in spite of the flu vaccine, actually were infected with the Coronavirus instead to the 4 variants of the common types of influenza viruses: A, B, C and D."
Very interesting and believable theory. Do you know of a way to test it? And what's the story with clusters like in this Seattle nursing home? Is that a sign of things to come or just some weird outlier? (It now appears that outside Hubie province in China -- another outlier? -- the prevalence and virulence is pretty low (maybe even lower than the flu?)
1
@Dennis Byron
Yes. The wat to test it is to check in serum/blood specimens of these patients (which are available) for antibodies against Corona virus or for Corona Virus genome itself.
It's depressing to me how the economic impact of a deadly virus seems to take precedence over the human toll.
348
@James - Yes, too much reporting on economics today, not enough on virus developments. These articles belong in the business section. If we take our eyes off the actual viral ball, we will lose sight of how fast it is picking up steam (or not).
47
If panic arises resulting in some form of economic collapse then there would be a massive social toll greater than the virus itself. Think of unemployment, social unrest, rise in crime rates, murders etc. So yes, economics matter -- they matter a lot.
19
Or how Wall Street acts like a petulant child when they don't get that cookie right away.
96