Bernie is all about promising amazing stuff, and not about doing it. His path to victory is the same.
11
Bernie has won Vermont and could have a rich harvest of delegates going into the post super Tuesday phase of the Democratic party and possibly all the way to the convention. This time the world is watching closely and although I don't think Bernie will never be acceptable as president to an independent like me, I would not like Bernie to be knifed again by the Democratic party and the Donna Brasille gang. Already the establishment Democratic party is circling their wagons around gaffe prone Biden. Former presidential candidates Pete, Amy, Beto are ganging up against Bernie and I expect Warren to do the same if she loses her home state of MA.
5
Sanders is the Jeremy Corbyn of American politics. Like Corbyn he has been largely ineffective. A visit to Congress.gov will show that of the 422 bills Sanders was lead sponsor on during his 29 years in Congress,three became law; two of those three were to name post offices. Sanders supporters try to add to the gravitas of their candidate by saying he was a force on healthcare negotiations with the ACA.The Senate Majority Leader Reid recalls it differently conveying that Sanders ideas on community healthcare as were more of a suggestion than a bold policy stance as described by Sanders supporters.
11
The NYT columnists are doing it again-playing extreme favorites using selective data. Election data for the past decade suggests that voter groups as it relates to presidential elections tend to vote the same way. Ezra Klein argues such in his recent book "Why We are Polarized." The only group during the last election that had a substantial difference in behavior was non-college educated white male who swung the election in favor of Trump in a few swing states. Biden isn't going to win because he did well with moderates, can win African Americans, or that he can win states like SC. All the states that he's winning atm will go republican come November. He will either need to convince this selective group of voters that the economic injustice and the worsening inequality that has defined this past 2 decades and led them to overwhelmingly vote for trump is something he can fix or increase overall turnout. And if you believe the data out of Nevada, he's doing neither. I personally think Bernie will do better with this group and I really wish the "establishment" and the NYT stops with this biased reporting and stop trying to convince us that a Bernie election will end the world.
7
@Cody
Biden won your state, NC.
7
@Vicki Yes, he won on the backbone of african american, a group that historically votes remarkably the same. In november, the data suggests the majority of african american will vote democratic regardless of who is representing the democratic party. the question you should be asking @Vicki is how did Biden do with with non-educated whites and/or did he increase overall voter turnout.
8
@Cody
So far it looks like Biden is driving the higher turnout in VA & NC, but let’s see the final vote. Sanders is not expanding his numbers with black voters, which is the same problem he had in 2016.
3
I voted for Senator Warren for her hard work, her strong record as a progressive leader and her plans to improve the lives of those of us regular people, helping the 99% not the 1%. She is the most qualified of all of the candidates and the one who really cares to make a difference. Women have been elected for top government positions all over the world, but in the U.S. they cannot convince the electorate that they are the best choice. Warren will get things done right. She is the best so she gets my support. I voted for the candidate that I believe in, not the one who has a chance to win I hope she does.
10
"given all of Biden’s baggage"
What baggage? You mean being an excellent VP for Obama for 8 years. Or do you mean being an excellent advocate for blue collar voters and the middle class his whole life?
The one with the baggage is Sanders. His baggage is empty with lack of getting any major legislation passed.
Where is the beef Bernie.
7
"...the 2018 elections saw the highest midterm turnout in over a century, yet most of Democrats’ improved performance “came not from fresh turnout of left-of-center voters, who typically skip midterms, but rather from people who cast votes” in the last two national elections and “switched from Republican in 2016 to Democratic in 2018.”
This op-ed would seem to refute this.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/28/opinion/bernie-sanders-polls.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage
"In all but five of the 41 seats picked up by Democrats, increased Democratic turnout alone would have been enough to flip the seats without any Republican crossovers."
5
Bernie's Plan A: Shake your finger and yell.
Bernie's Plan B: Shake your finger and yell louder.
10
I want Bernie to win. I have friends who will vote for Bernie. I have never met anyone who says that if Bernie is not nominated, then they will not vote at all. Who are these people? If they exist, they are not representative of the majority Bernie voters. The sad things is that it is so hard to tell if it just a boogieman story going around, in times of high anxiety and fear of change
9
@Mariana The 2018 midterms were only 16 months ago. Conservative Democratic districts were responsible for flipping the House, not progressives. That's a fact, and a clue.
5
@Blair But what you are saying is that there are more moderate democrats than progressives. And what I am saying, is completely unrelated. That if a moderate president wins, the majority of Bernie voters would vote for the moderate. I think Biden is a I-challenge-you-to-do-push-ups fool, but I would definitely vote for him if he is nominated.
3
@Mariana
" I have never met anyone who says that if Bernie is not nominated, then they will not vote at all. Who are these people? If they exist, they are not representative of the majority Bernie voters."
Mariana, I've been thinking about this q. on this forum today. The answer is that Sanders' supporters are not monolithic:
I actively - phone banking and canvassing - support Sanders; and I have never encountered a declared 'I will stay at home' citizen either.
But I'm guessing they do exist: a socially demolished and - as a result - politically alienated young generation drawn into politics only by Sanders...in other words: nonvoters who are saying, 'I'm only even thinking about voting because of anti-establishment Sanders.'
The upshot? Establishment lib's can blame Trump's re-election on supposedly 'rational' Sanders supporters who - as rational actors - 'should know better'...
...but the reality is an irrational Sanders bloc who must be compromised with...if the 'rational' establishment Biden supporters want to stop Trump.
2
Ho-hum - lies, damn lies, statistics; what's a NYTimes regular to do between now and Dem convention but to continue with the routine Bernie bashing?
Beyond the young or new voters, Sanders might well also appeal to elders fully aware they've been lied to as American has been stolen from them over past forty-fifty years, by one party largely intent on that end, by a second partly passively complicit in the corruption and gutting of the American Way.
Bernie Sanders - frequently adequately echoed by E. Warren - is the ONLY candidate to address that theft, with a sense of drive toward restoration of our nation to its citizens, DJT now seemingly a premonitory con as he also awakened his audiences to alternatives to the oligarchic fraud.
Given a workable Congress, Bernie will provide wonders of 21st-Century governance for the American people, in direct defiance of GOP and GOP-lite corporate Dems who all, for fear of losing the privileges of their entrenched aristocracy, will fight and oppose and denigrate him by any means fair or foul ever step of the way to the convention, including via relentless attacks in such Establishment paragons as the NYTimes.
9
The anti-Sanders rhetoric in the Times has gotten out of control. A few days ago they published a piece by someone who has likened Bernie supporters to “nazis” and in said piece implied a Sanders nomination would “short circuit democracy”. This type of behavior just cost Chris Matthews his job. When MSNBC displays more integrity than the “paper of record” you know we’re in a dark place.
10
get back with us tomorrow, won't you?
1
Nothin’ but dudes on the floor of the NYSE.
Nothin’ but dudes in party control in Beijing.
I look forward to your next Opinions, Michelle.
2
The republicans can choose a mean spirited draft dodging womanizing lying ugly fat man who is as much a democrat as a Republican, and all the Republican white lemmings will still vote for him. Democrats instead have a mixture of competing and often mutually exclusive ideologues, all of whom will choose not to vote for anyone if their pet needs are not addressed. The only time democrats win is when some economic or other disaster that can only be blamed on republicans has occurred, and a few republicans stay home in embarrassment. That’s not today’s realities. The only good news is that both Bernie and Biden are expendable. The future leaders will be back in four to eight years.
Stay home and complain—the Democrats creed
4
Why should anyone listen to NYT columnists about which Democrat can win in November after the 2016 cycle? Seriously!
9
In short, vote for Biden,
2
Bernie cant count on new voters because as Tulsi Gabbard said today the US intelligence agencies need to stop rigging the election. Forget Russia the deep state wants Biden.
2
The Moderate Democrats turning on Bernie has really thrown into sharp relief that the party does not stand for what I think a lot of us thought it did.
Universal healthcare? Nah
Climate change? Not really
Education reform? Just enough to feel like you did something.
Criminal justice? lol
Income inequality? LOL
Regulating Wall Street? HA!!
Turns out most middle class white Democrats just want a polite Trump who says the quiet parts quiet and defends the status quo.
10
Give it a rest Michelle. I love your columns, but your dislike of Mr. Sanders has overtaken your common sense.
And don't quit Elizabeth no matter what anyone says or what Joe Biden offers you. i will happily vote for you if you are my nominee.
All this Bernie Bro noise is sounding like Clinton's "Deplorables". Be careful Democrats. we need all of us at the polls. we cannot win otherwise.
6
Bloomberg would be the best president as well as the nominee most likely to beat the Trump-Pence-Putin ticket.
5
Only Democratic party elitists who have never had a political ground game going door to door and in every way possible, going the extra mile to build a political movement, think like this.
Elitists sneer at grubby street politics, but that is what gets the low turnout people out to vote.
PS: Don't mention moving elections to the weekend so people could vote! That would kill this elitist argument!
3
Sanders never has a plan B, just a loud screeching plan A where he is always right. He is every bit as arrogant and self-absorbed as Trump.
13
anybody who stays home giving trump the election deserves what they get!
2
All anyone has to do to determine Bernie's electability is look at the faces in that crowd facing him in that photo. How many black faces do you see, young or old?
3
Four years of "mill-yun-aiz and bill-yun-aiz." Do they make enough ear plugs?
1
Elizabeth Warren for President! If not Warren, then Sanders!
All the others: just disappear, you are not who we need.
5
Did not vote for Trump in 2016. If Bernie (or Warren) is nominated, I might have to hold my nose and fill in the box for Trump. Trump is a pig, but Bernie has embraced communist and socialist regimes and has no regrets about it. Of course, the Millennials and Gen Z don't care. They are the antithesis to America's Greatest Generation.
4
@T.S. Trump has embraced homicidal fascist regimes in Turkey, the Philippines, Saudi Arabia, and Hungary. He is best friends with the Russian kleptocrat. He has even 'fallen in love' with the North Korean dictator.
You say Bernie has embraced communists and socialists, but don't mention any specifically. Of whom do you speak? I know he has acknowledged education under Castro, but that's a little bit short of embracing the entire regime.
4
It makes pragmatic sense for Bernie to reach out to suburban white women, and everyone else, in the election; it also makes sense from a fairness and justice perspective. Suburban white women, just like every one else, deserve to be heard.
I appreciate Michelle's dose of reality, but one factor not mentioned is the passage of 2 years since 2018 and 4 years since 2016. During that time, more millennials and post millennials have joined voting ranks, and more boomers have exited (RIP).
I don't know how much difference it will make, but no one can escape demographics.
2
Michelle I am 71 years old and have been a Bernie Sanders Supporter since his first presidential run in 2016. I live in a town in Western Massachusetts (~1850 souls) where the median age is 64 years the support for Bernie Sanders in town is very substantial among all age groups with Elizabeth Warren a close second.
There is simply no way that Bernie's popularity is limited to the young. We will be counting our paper ballots at 8:00 PM and I will be there along with about 9 other volunteers and based on the election signs and conversations in town I will be very surprised Bernie does not win by a landslide! among all age groups.
3
A vote for Sanders is a vote for Trump, pure and simple. Aside from the Bernie Bro Cult, Sanders doesn't have any constituency. In fact, he would probably flip the house back to the Republicans.
8
Senator Bernie is entertaining. As President he would undermine our constitutional fabric. Only the left elasticizes the constitution to accommodate its economic, political, and social agenda.
Elizabeth Warren’s admirers do not realize how she appears to the rest of us: a shrill, overly gesticulating, more radical version of Hillary Clinton. She greatly overestimated her own appeal. Popular in graduate student-infested Massachusetts, she is box office poison elsewhere.
3
We still refer to Sanders a the ' progressive candidate " (see the heading of this article). We should stop using this euphemism ( and others . such as "social democrat " ) and call a spade a spade. Sanders is the " socialist candidate" . Period.
3
Perhaps ironically, some of the best examples of why the fanaticism of Bernie's most ardent supporters – even those who aren't technically "bros" – are so off-putting to mainstream Democrats can be found right here in the replies to the Times Picks & Reader Picks comments for this op-ed.
A fact-based remark that Bernie hasn't won a majority in a single state, and isn't projected to do so except in Vermont? 74 heated replies. (At this writing.) Another factual comment about Bernie's base mostly not extending to people of color, women & religious minorities? 57 furious rebuttals attempting to argue the sky is not, in fact, blue. A flat-out conspiracy theory about the DNC "playing back room politics with Buttigieg and Klobuchar" to get them to drop out before Super Tuesday? 57 replies (again), mostly in agreement.
I agree with Ms. Goldberg that Bernie can't count on new voters, but I'd go even further and suggest an additional reason: his obsessive supporters – for whom compromise is NOT an option, period – are doing just as effective a job of alienating sensible-minded voters as the man himself.
10
Bernie is a bust and Biden is too. A couple days ago Biden said he was running for the Senate and that if you did not like him as a candidate you could vote for the other Biden. We are in trouble Democrats.
2
I'm a first time voter, having obtained citizenship after living her for 18 years and I'm voting for Bernie. The same pundits that were sure Trump would not win, are now predicting Bernie as non-electable. The high rate of political participation, the fact that we have under both Democratic, and Republican governments swung to the right of center, over many decades now, and Bernie's consistent messaging should make it obvious he's the right one to defeat Trump. The Democratic party missed this in 2016, and hopefully have learnt their lesson now.
2
The more I think about it the more I realize that denying Sanders the nomination at the convention would not cause the party the harm many think it would.
Why?
Precisely because so many of Sanders supporters are not really Democrats at all. They're people that will only vote for Sanders. If they leave the party after the election it's not like the party splits in half because Sanders supporters are not half of the party. Plus, it would probably be only a portion of the Sanders supporters that would leave. AND they probably won't vote again. So they effectively remove themselves from the equation for future election.
They're certainly not progressives. They're worshippers at the alter of Saint Bernie.
In short, the Democrats might be better off without them.
You're hearing this from a real progressive - not a cult member.
Bernie's Thugs have managed to alienate both progressives and "moderates" while Bernie gives them tacit approval.
If it comes down to a convention I would support taking the nomination away from Bernie. For the good of the party and the country.
5
This election could create a new 3rd party. Perhaps moderates that are Center-left to Center-right realize that the purity tests in the conventional parties are impossible to overcome. The GOP is extremist and driven by ethnic superiority. The Dems, and the youth, are showing to be socialist and driven by increasing state control of enterprise to mitigate inequality.
If Sanders is the nominee, many “centrists” will vote for him to get Trump out. This lesser of evils is wearing thin.
A 3rd party might better align Americans ideologically across the spectrum.
America won’t vote for a self-described democratic socialist. Though polls may suggest Bernie beats Trump, the United States uses the electoral college to vote. This severely disadvantages Sen. Sanders, as many swing states heavily rely on natural gasses in their economy, which Sanders wants to rid of in order to help stop climate change.
I think Sanders has the right moral idea here. But that doesn’t matter if he can’t get votes in swing states. We need to rally behind a singular candidate who can beat President Trump in order to actually get things done.
There is simply too much to risk by nominating Sanders. Supreme Court justices are likely to pass away within the next few years. The climate crisis is only getting worse. Nominating Bernie also increases the likelihood that Democrats lose the house. We can’t solve any of these issues if Bernie loses, and there’s just too large of a chance that he might.
7
I'm 19 and he can count on me! I voted early by mail in CA while away at college. It's circumstantial evidence, but many of my friends and peers are voting in their first elections and primaries this year. I do believe that those who are becoming adults now are more politically active and aware than previous generations were.
1
Four years ago, all polls said that Hillary Clinton would win easily. She was extremely pleased when Trump was nominated. On the Republican side nobody gave Trump any chance: Jeb Bush all the way. In 2016, there were 8 million voters who voted for Trump who had previously voted for Obama. These won't be coming back for Biden or Bloomberg. Millions of others voted for Jill Stein who had previously voted for Obama. Unlikely they will go for Biden or Bloomberg. The 18-45 year demographic overwhelmingly supports Bernie Sanders against all others, including Trump. The working class, which has already abandoned the Democrats, won't return for Biden or Bloomberg; and they are still about 34 percent of the electorate. They might very well come back for Bernie. Even polls concur in that.
4
The source of the funding for a candidate is critical. You can’t bite the hand that feeds you. You can’t fight climate change in an effective way if you depend on big oil donations. You can’t take on insurance companies if you depend on them for financial support. Medicare for all is basic and is only undercut by those who favor Medicare for those who want it. You call those supporters part of corporate liberal pretenders. I support Bernie because I know he has a vast network of ordinary people behind him, not billionaires and not large corporate entities. He fights the good fight and he has has from the getgo.
4
What I call them is knowledgeable, actually.
And has it ever occured, O supporter of socialism, that basic marxist theory says that money is the universal solvent, dissolving all human values and relations into itself? No, not just that dirty, dirty corporatist money...all of it.
Bernie brags about his money, in fact. What happens the first tome he needs to tell HIS donors an inconvenient truth? Does he stand up and spit in they collective eye, or pander?
1
Trump promised a massive free lunch, tax cuts, massive new government spending, zero sacrifices required. Bad policy/perfect politics. Bernie offers the opposite—good policy/ horrible politics. He will cost the Dems the House
Maybe, just maybe, people will decide Bernie can't possibly be as bad as a second term of Trump. In fact, that's a good slogan. "Vote for Bernie, he's not as bad as Trump."
1
Michelle... let me spin it like this Bernie voters can not be counted on to vote for a less progressive candidate. Truth be told, the democratic party is split down its core between "Progressives" (who are by nature authoritarian and completely tribal to the woke crowd), who will NEVER vote for a moderate. On the other side are moderates who understand freedom and economic detriment that socialism (communism) causes and will never vote for the "Progressive". With this serious split there is no way... let me repeat it NO WAY as democrat can win in this election.
1
@Mystery Lits
You are making it look much, much worse than it actually is.
2
@CarolinaJoe November will tell.
Sanders snubs Republican women in the suburbs at his own peril. Those ladies are reliable voters. The young people he is counting on can't be counted on. Especially if there's a viral cat video distracting them on election day.
8
@Doug Hill
53% of Republican Women voters voted for Trump in 2016.
After these results, are you still going to pin your hopes of a Moderate winning against Trump on Republican women?
3
@Doug Hill
The whole Democratic Party should ignore what Republican women want.
Your insulting attitude about young people is the reason why we shouldn't care. That kind of thing can stay with the Republicans.
3
In some ways, Sanders has the single-mindedness of Trump. He's determined and willfully energized to do the right thing. And his followers are drawn to his light, and repulsed by the dark side of our system. Maybe that's what it really takes to win. Ask a young person....
1
Enjoyed your article, but two key points are missing, both of them unfavorable to Sanders!
Point #1
CNN has reported how the Tea Party has formed "Operations Chaos" to encourage Republicans to go to Primaries to vote for … Bernie Sanders.
This means: Biden still won South Caroline despite all the over-voting by the Right wing to try to get Sanders nominated.
Point #2 You ignore what Republican tactics will be to reduce Sander's support, especially among moderates:
I) All Trump has to do is advertise how Bernie's program will require Middle Class taxes to go up substantially too (same as what we see in Europe)
2) Then start a SCARE tactic the Socialists are coming to destroy America, to get their base out to vote in droves. ..
Factoring this in means: A Sanders win in the primary guarantees that Trump wins -- in a landslide.
3
@Pat
Point #1: If Republicans were indeed engaging in "Operations Chaos" and all voting for Sanders, he would have won South Carolina.
The fact that Joe Biden carried it away with 256,111 votes versus Sanders 105,226 votes.
There are a lot more Republicans than that in South Carolina. If Republicans indeed were running "Operations Chaos", they failed miserably to get a win for Sanders in South Carolina.
Sanders supporters seem to forget that his numbers are way lower than in 2016, and moderate candidates in aggregate have higher numbers than Hillary in 2016.
5
I'm in Wisconsin, the latest Marquette poll shows Bernie winning in the Primary and being the only candidate from the democratic side with an edge (within margin of error) over Trump in the General. Seems pretty clear to me. Of course I could do a lot of hand-wringing wondering if I should nevertheless vote for a so called "Moderate" based on everything the pundits are saying. One more thing, some people like to compare Bernie's chances of winning in the General to McGovern's in "72. They don't take into account the current electoral map of States that are now solidly Red or Blue. In addition, we also have more recent history for a clue: Gore, Kerry, & Clinton to guide us with regard to "moderates" being the solid, "electable" choice.
3
Lots of discussion about the young people and Sanders. But it is my
perspective from age 81 that the old people actually get out and
vote (as I did this morning). For Biden.
13
Broockman said that if either Warren or Sanders is on the ballot, more Republicans will likely be motivated to go to the polls in response. “When parties nominate candidates further from the center, it actually inspires the other party to turn out,” he told me.
----------------------
Which would've made sense except that, obviously, Clinton lost despite being more towards center than her opposition. Trump didn't drive support by appealing to the middle of the political spectrum. Why can't it work for Democrats too?
And as an aside, I think I'm at the point where I'm okay if Trump wins, assuming he does so with by actually winning the popular vote. If that many people would rather see him get another 4 years, then so be it. That's how democracy works, and my vote isn't any more important than anyone else's vote.
@JT
That’s how democracy dies. And Trump is getting worse and worse. He will eat Bernie for lunch.
2
Have you noticed, a recession is coming - and soon! When it arrives Trump will loose a good part of his base. He will not be renominated again because he couldn't possibly win. A more reasonable Republican will be nominated who would surely lose to Biden, but would probably be able to beat Sanders.
2
I'm 52 and voted in every presidential (and almost every single) election since I turned 18.
I don't see the point of waiting in line to vote for Biden.
I live in NY, so my vote doesn't really count anyway, and there is absolutely nothing that inspires me. Yes, it would be nice to get Trump out of office, but maybe this country deserves another four years of the orange menance.
BTW, I'm not a Bernie Bro either.
5
@city worker
So vote absentee if you don’t plan to wait on line. NY votes April 28, so we may well matter if the primary race is still close.
1
What these types of analyses are missing is consideration of the fact that in the Democratic primary, Trump is not on the ticket. This means that the anti-Trump vote is underrepresented. Anecdotally, I have observed a good amount of voters who don't really care much at all who the Democratic nominee is, caring instead about being able to register their opposition to Trump.
3
How can we expect the angry antidisestablishmentarianism candidate to bring in the voters who are either middle of the road Democrats or anti Trump Republicans? We cannot.
And Bernie’s pie-in-the-sky ideas will go nowhere with the Congress we have now and certainly will not work if Dems loose seats if Bernie Sanders makes into office. I will vote for any Democratic candidate that represents the party, but I fear that more people will stay home and not vote for anyone if the candidate is Bernie.
And a vote for no one is a vote for Trump.
Please, pass the Xanax.
7
so Bernie advocates for a state religion. who knew?
@Andrea
"antidisestablishmentarianism," I haven't heard that word since I was about twelve, many, many moons ago. It was, for its time, touted as the longest word in the English language, until it was replaced by "pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis." It was spoken by the local JD, who years later stabbed his mother to death. No reflection on you; just pointing out why it sticks in my mind.
2
Another thing that gives me extremely little confidence in Bernie for president is that his support is concentrated in the very youngest voters, the demographic with the very least experience in life. As a generalization younger people have a lot to learn from their elders, and that is the reason that the average professor is older, more experienced, more educated, than their undergraduate students. That is how our educational system works, and how life works. All of which supports the view that Bernie for president is not a great idea in spite of his support from very young people, in fact because his support is so concentrated in the very young and inexperienced.
6
The best candidate in the world isn’t worth a damn if he can’t win—and Bernie can’t win. It’s not spite or dislike that compels me to say that; it’s evidence. Bernie’s path to victory depends on high turnout, especially among new voters. But turnout has been underwhelming in every state but one: South Carolina (and we all know who won there). So why does anyone think he can win?
8
@YN
that’s right. Plus the turnout uptick in NH went to Buttigieg and Klobuchar.
6
@YN
Bernie's path to victory, like any other candidate, depends on victory. If he wins the most states and the most delegates, that's his path to victory.
Biden has won one state, let me repeat: one state, and the moderates are already throwing confetti. It's way too early for either candidate to breathe easy. It's going to be a long run. Get comfortable.
2
Many comments here about voting for Biden to defeat Trump, that doesn’t seem to have any basis in reality. It seems to me if Biden wins he will be like the dog that catches the car. Then what?
People are having serious problems for decades. Our democracy has systemic serious problems. Why don’t I feel like Biden has solutions? Why does he keep wanting naively to work with the other side that sabotaged Obama for eight years while he was his VP?
6
@sapere aude
Then what? Are you serious?
If Biden gets both houses of the Congress, then Congress will pass legislation. You can bet that the House, where the legislation is initially written, will come up with pretty progressive versions that will need to be negotiated in Senate. Public Option with lower premiums, lower drug prices, more affordable college and many common sense elements of new green deal. Plus progressive judges, maybe some elements of gun control.
4
I'm more optimistic. I believe that Bernie has demonstrated he's a candidate that can rally people and instigate a massive surge in support (small donations) and voter turnout. I will bet that if Bernie's the nominee against Trump... Bernie will galvanize massive voter support. Dems will come together..and the anti-status quo Republicans and Independents who voted for Trump in 2016, will quickly realize that Bernie, whatever "warts" he may have in terms of infelicitous comments about Cuba (etc.)..Voters will realize Bernie is (a) authentic (b) not going to trash our capitalist system...just do all he can to end "unfettered capitalism".. He's a democratic socialist. OK so he supports a better life for workers and disenfranchised swaths of the middle class in America. His policies and legislative lans are superb! He may well come around to a "private option" for healthcare, like Warren's... And when he picks a running mate - I have a feeling that will be a clincher..A huge positve about Warren as VP might be that if Bernie changes his platform to include a private option - that would show flexibility and a tipping of the hat towards anxious centrists... Tammy Baldwin (progressive from Wisconsin, a swing state) is also a fascinating choice. So Bernie's candidacy after the convention will, I think, coincide with a huge anti-Trump mobilization. Bernie is an ethical man, not a quack. He's not "red"...He's a reformer, what we need. He'll beat Trump..in a landslide.
6
Bernie Sanders has been talking about his ability to have this massive turnout for 5 years. It didn't materialize in 2016, not in 2018, and so far, not in 2020. Turnout has been lower. As to authenticity, his immigration stance is pandering as is his cromonal justice stance. As to his ethics, he has never acknowledged that he got less votes in 2016. He tried to overturn the will of the voters with superdelegates and his representatives on the Unity Reform Commission wanted to keep low turnout, votes suppressing caucuses because he did better in them. He also broke his promise to release his full medical records. Especially, in light of his recent medical issues, his supporters have a right to know that he is healthy enough to serve, if elected.
3
@Christopher
Bernie had much more support in 2016. There is no sign of “revolution”.
2
Michael Moore is right, we can't vote out of fear or Trump wins. Biden has already made a fool of himself several times against other democrats. Imagine how he will fare against Trump. Trump will destroy him and win again. Moderate voters are not thinking clearly. The general election debates will be the last critical deciding factor. Make the right choice!
9
I am an 85 year old New York liberal Democrat and I am older than Bernie. Bernie is an angry old man. He is always right and everybody is always wrong. He has become a leader of the wise old man cult. There is a difference between a politician like Bernie and FDR who is my lifetime idol. If FDR could not get what he wanted one way he tried another is substance or approach.
Persuasion is lacking here and I spent my career a professional persuader, I was a trial lawyer for 40 years and it was my job to persuade the jury or a judge that my client should prevail. This was a selling job. Sometimes I noticed that the jury wasn't buying what I was selling. The next thing you do is to have a plan B. If the jury isn't going to buy the Fox Trot, slide into the Tango,
Don't lie, persuade, but if a few were not buying your plan A such as Medicare for all, than perhaps plan B the public option is just what the doctor ordered before the jury decides against you.
Yet I recognize they angry an compromising old man, so unless Liz Warren stays viable I will be supporting Joe Biden because I want Trump defeated.
14
@Sheldon Bunin
He is not an angry old man. This is just negative propaganda. He is more committed , fairer and wiser than any other democrat running. He will bring about positive change and focus to the party. There are too many democrats financed by republican money!
3
@Sheldon Bunin
Supporting Joe Biden is the best way to re-elect Trump.
2
The comparison with Obama getting out the black vote seems a bit out of left field. Regardless of how impressive/unimpressive Obama's efforts were, there are totally different set of variables at play re: Bernie's support from young voters.
Apples and oranges.
1
It is more than obvious that the party establishment does not want Sanders to win the nomination. It is just as obvious they have zero chance of defeating Trump without Bernie's voters.
Therein lies the dilemma.
5
There's a difference between change and revolution.
Warren is fighting fiercely for the necessary, systemic changes we need. She's in excellent health, has never called herself a socialist, has never lost an election, and is the only candidate who has beaten an incumbent Republican. She has actually accomplished something: the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. And she's a championship debater.
Sanders is calling, angrily, for revolution. Anger and revolution appeal most strongly to the very young, but not to the crucial swing voters who will decide the outcome in November. If you want Trump to win, vote for Sanders.
Biden just wants everyone to be nice to each other.
15
Warren is my favorite and always has been. Yet it appears she has no path to victory. Part of it is the Bernie backlash among progressives to anyone who isn’t Bernie. Part of it seems to be the fact that she is a woman. I hate to say it. I hate that it’s true. I can’t think of another reason which accounts for her inexplicably low popularity. People seem to be reluctant to nominate another woman after Clinton’s loss, associating defeat with women. I don’t think it’s all outright misogyny, although that definitely plays a part. After Warren killed it in the debates I lost count of how many people called her “shrill” and a “scold” and “screechy.” (Sorry if this veers into mansplaining. But I’m with you!)
134
@Ben
I would wager my house that the 2nd choice of most Bernie supporters is Warren. The problem is you don't pick your second choice. I think she'd be a great president but I think Sanders would get more people out to vote (though maybe she would attract more swing voters?)
2
@Ben
Bernie supporters are often not progressives at all. They are cult members.
Real progressive know that the progressive movement is not defined by any particular candidate.
So, I don't care what Bernie's supporters think. I would support taking the nomination from Bernie at the convention. And I'm a REAL progressive.
6
Or biggest hope is that Bernie isn't the nominee. "Polls might be underestimating how hard it will be for Sanders to beat Trump." And Dems would lose big down ballot.
8
I don't know who the next POTUS will be, but I'm certain it will not be Bernie.
10
Ms. Goldberg's logic is impeccable: she thinks that new ideas and energy cannot remake the political scene. Does she, therefore, think that old ideas and a failed neoliberalism can? Why would anyone argue for that status quo? If Ms. Clinton couldn't do it, how can a man who can barely form sentences?
An old corrupt elite, of which Ms. Goldberg is a part, argues against the change we need. Elegant!
10
Or, she thinks that all the ballyhoo doesn’t seem to have come close to doing what St. Bernie has been swearing up and down je’d do: drastically amp up voting, especially among the young and Latinos.
‘course, voting WAS way up in one state: South Carolina.
How’d that go for you guys? I forget.
6
@Robert Perhaps you missed Nevada, where Bernie carried 80 percent of the Latinx vote? Or NH, where Bernie carried more of the youth vote than the rest of the field combined? Make sure you bring your facts next time, good sir. And an editor!
We do, btw, know that 10-15 percent of Black males voted for Trump. Hillary couldn't offer them the prospect of real change or help against the most unpopular candidate in US history. Explain to us how Joe "Nothing Will Fundamentally Change" Biden is going to do that?
The truth is that the Democratic establishment would rather hang on to its perquisites and jobs and see Trump win than be separated from the corporate teat.
2
Ms. Goldberg is an old corrupt elite? She never struck me as such. But to Bernie supporters, anyone who isn’t all in on Bernie is an old corrupt elite. Except for Trump supporters, whom they seem to have more sympathy for than they do moderate Democrats for some reason.
3
While phone banking for Warren this morning, a man in Minnesota said he's voting for Sanders. I asked why not Warren. I pointed out my reasons for Warren. But, as he later revealed, he voted for Trump in 2016 and wants him to win again this year. So that's why he's voting for Sanders today, despite anything I told him about Warren.
That's Putin's reasoning also.
131
@citizen vox I had a similarly enlightening conversation with a guy who came to fix our oven. Bloomberg was speaking in the background on a TV I left on in the background. He stopped to listen for a moment and said, "Of the democrats I like Bloomberg the best since he's not on my side" it doesn't matter."
6
@citizen vox And not just in Minnesota, all around the states this is going on.
6
@citizen vox
Your argument against Sanders amounts to, "This one guy said this one thing this one time, therefore..."
Not working.
7
The biggest concern is the "Bernie or no one crowd" and their impact on the election as a whole is that they will reduce the total vote by about 17 million. The effect is that Trump wins 17 million votes that could have gone to a democratic opponent.
Trump's "base" is somewhere in the 20-30 million range. The Evangelical and anti abortion vote is in the 10-15 range. There are 3-4 million in the 1% group and another 10-15 million in the "just plain stupid group".
That covers just over 64 million votes for Trump.
Taking the entire democratic vote potential (including Sanders) there are about 67 million voters. Take Sanders 17 million votes away and Trump has a landslide.
The problem is that the Sanders crown is angry, immature (even the old ones) and "out to get the man". They look upon any democratic voter who is not part of Sanders' cult to be "the man".
They can really screw the "OK Boomer" crowd by getting either Sanders or Trump elected. Doesn't matter as long as they get their "participation trophy".
2
I’m for Bernie and I don’t know what you are talking about. The Bernie crowd is not monolithic. Some of us are simply tired of giving up on our dreams and ideals and don’t want to vote pragmatically moderate AGAIN! Been there, done that, went nowhere. We need big changes and the people need to make the changes that matter ... health care, income inequality, climate, corporate welfare, guns, education. For starters. And we need a leader ... Warren, Sanders, Booker, Castro ... someone who will fight for the future.
3
Bernie’s followers can always vote for Trump like they did in the last election. This phony so-called ‘Socialist’ is self-serving and destructive.
7
Want to get rid of Donald Trump?
No problem.
Just convince a majority of American voters that they want to live in a Socialist country.
Absolute insanity!
4
@Tigerina
Want to ruin the Democratic Party? Just convince a majority of Democrats that voting for anything but a same old, do nothing moderate means we turn into North Korea.
Absolute insanity.
1
if you don't like Bernie .. don't for Bernie ..
.. but be sure to vote the democratic ticket for every other race on you ballot ..
.. must take control of legislatures away from the republican party (the party of trump) at state and federal levels
4
For decades my left friends have been chasing the chimera of non-voters previously turned off by mainstream candidates, seeing in those nre voters a new source of progressive advantage. It hasn't happened, and my guess is that it won't happen -- there isn't a hidden source of left-wing strength out there. I hate to say this, as my own inclinations are with them, but I don't see it happening. So we're just going to have to persuade the voters that are already out there. Which is doable; lots of work, but doable.
6
How many of us who support Bernie will not turn out for Biden? At least 2 in this household. Biden has announced he is open to a Republican for VP. What the country needs post Trump is someone who will make real change, not the status quo. As a progressive social Democrat, I see so many reasons that Bernie is the one who will bring real muscle to tackling climate change, student debt, and health insurance. With the coronavirus about to reach epidemic scale by the end of this month in the US, we see the absolute necessity to have universal health care. Viruses are not choosy when it comes to who they will infect. If the poor cannot receive treatment, they will become ill and infect others. In this paper I read that one man who is uninsured thought he might have contracted COVID-19. He went to the emergency room where he tested negative but had a bill for $3200.
As to Biden, the way he humiliated Anita Hill will forever live in my memory. His ardent support for the Iraq war means he lacks intelligence and judgement. I have voted for moderate Republicans running as Democrats since Clinton. Those days are over. We need change and Biden will not bring it. Bernie will. I would love to see a Sanders-Warren ticket. I have done my share of compromise. For the first time we have a candidate which I can support. Let's get it done.
6
@Daisuke Daisn
Please explain just how Sanders will get it done. If he does not have the house and senate in support of his policies he will not get it done. As much as I wish everyone had excellent healthcare we are still 30-40 years away from that. And to pay for everything he is proposing he will have to raise taxes on everyone including low wage workers.
The problem with Sanders supporters they are just like trump supporters - they think all he has to do is say it will happen.
At least Warren laid out how she would pay for her visions.
Sorry I cannot support Sanders - to me he is like trump an angry old white man and it's my way or the highway.
5
@Daisuke Daisn
Sanders-Warren, or Warren-Sanders: the only two worth voting for.
4
@Fred
"Get it done" doesn't happen by magic. It happens when your party fights for it until you convince enough people and you get the votes. That's how Republicans have gotten it done. The Democrats, meanwhile, haven't convinced anyone of anything.
How you don't get it done: keep fighting tooth and nail against any bold new ideas and become an irrelevant party.
1
I'm a Minnesota Democrat - well to the left of Klobuchar, but on Monday I was driving to City Hall to vote a day early and I still had not made up my mind between her and Warren. Just as I pulled into the parking lot the news said Amy was dropping out. So to my surprise I colored in the little oval next to Biden. I like Bernie but calling himself Socialist albeit a Democratic Socialist - while no problem for me - was a huge and unnecessary tactical error. I also saw the interview where for no good reason he pointed out the upside of a Castro policy - which was true enough - but just piled on another huge unforced tactical error. Last night I watched Pete give a good speech standing in from of Biden - then Biden followed with easily the best speech I have heard from him. Guess I am all in for Joe.
13
@Peter, endorsing Hillary Clinton was also a huge tactical error for Sanders, because there were many people (including myself) who supported mainly because he WASN'T Clinton. He alienated many disillusioned former supporters by doing that, rather than offering no endorsement and just going quietly back to work in the Senate.
Ever since, I don't believe a word that he says, and I'd never vote for him. Why did he think that he could "work both sides of the street," calling himself a progressive and a socialist, yet throwing his support to the arch-capitalist, warmonger, and Senate seat carpetbagger Hillary? For crying out loud, she sat on the board of directors of Walmart!
I think that Sanders is a phony, and that he has no intention of keeping any of his extravagant campaign promises. And like Holden Caulfield in "The Catcher In The Rye," I just can't abide a phony.
I also want my twenty bucks back!
2
Rollo Nichols
It is because of purists like you that we have a sociopathic Putin puppet mob boss conman in the White House now.
In 2016 Bernie was smart enough to realize that trump would be a disaster, and so did what a lot of voters did. We voted for HRC even though she was not our first choice. Sad that even after 3 1/2 years you either haven’t figured it out or you are in massive denial.
1
It’s true: polls are unreliable. The 2016 election - if nothing else - demonstrated that with a vengeance. In my view, the biggest problem for American Democrats is that they don’t vote. The kids. The impressionable ones. The Sanders do-or-die crew. Dicey.,.
All those blue-haired ladies of a certain age and duffers with red $40 baseball hats are already in line to vote. Reliable. Steadfast. And they ain’t socialists.
The other thing no one is talking about much is if this socialist dream - and I think it definitely falls into the “la vida es sueno” category - was realized, Bernie would be a very ineffective president. All of his out-there socialist ideas are going nowhere even if the Dems do manage to take back the Senate.
Trump is not just screwing up America, he’s screwing up the whole world (with a little help from his friends - Russian military intelligence). And given that disturbing fact, now is the time for the Democrats to stop screwing around and get behind “one” (as in 1) candidate who can not only win the election, but govern effectively.
And now - at last - it looks like Joe Biden may be the “1”.
8
@Vidal Delgado
"blue-haired ladies of a certain age": if you looked around you, you might have noticed that "women of a certain age" no longer bother to color their hair.
And if you used your head, you would not assume that Biden, the serial loser, will "win the election" or "govern effectively."
1
I think Sanders has big ideas, but his approach is too narrow. He needs to be or appeal to be more open. On the other hand, Biden has no ideas; he simply wants to be president for the sake of being president. This is his 3rd and final shot at achieving his ultimate political goal, but for what purpose? To restore normalcy to the WH or normalcy to corporations and their lobbyists dictating US policy home and abroad or caving in to Republicans in his sick attempt to show that he is bipartisan.
I preferred Warren, but I will support either candidate. However, if Biden is elected we, those of us who demand more, will have to hold his old, unreliable, sycophant feet to the fire.
4
The Times has all hands on deck in its effort to derail any substantial change after the election by defeating Sanders now. Whether this is due to a mandate from the owners or derives from spontaneous decisions on the part of its reporters, editorial staff, and op-ed columnists, the drumbeat has been consistently anti-Bernie for months. But let us look at the alternative that we are being offered. Joe Biden just does not have it anymore. He was never the most coherent or adept politician, plagiarizing Neil Kinnock and others, losing every primary he contested until Saturday through three campaigns, stumbling over words and names repeatedly, and failing to offer a coherent vision of what he would do as president. Biden's political record is not particularly good either. Although he was ahead of the curve in pushing Obama to support gay marriage through public comments in their first term, he forged an agreement with segregationists to end school busing in the early 1970s, a move with momentous effects on racial inequality in this country ever since; he supported the over-policing and oversentencing, much of which has been racialized, including the 1994 crime bill; he many times supported efforts to reduce Social Security, entitlement spending, and welfare for the sake of a grand bargain with Republicans, policies that would have or did have massive deleterious effects on the poor; and he is unrepentant about all of this. How will this candidate do better than Hillary?
3
No, let’s look at YOU.
What’s with all the whining about politics being, dare I say it, political? What’s with all the distorted recaps of a political history, when if you and St. B were what you keep bellowing you are, you’d just beat Joe on ideas?
Guess who else sounds a lot like that?
If Bernie Sanders is the nominee, I vote for him, period. But while I very much hope I’d be wrong, I think we’d lose.
And YOU are part of the reason. You think it’s your guy or nothing, and you can’t so much as consider being way wrong.
2
Biden will get eviscerated in the debates with Trump. His record of waffling between issues will be eaten up by the Right Wing Media and Pundits. These will further lower turnout. Bernie if nothing else sticks to his guns, makes informed arguments, and is taking on issues that would actually help the "people".
8
@Jon Ham
You are right, but Biden will sell more newspapers than Sanders.
@Jon Ham I've said it before and I'll say it again, the democrats should not give the rabid traitor the oxygen of media coverage he needs for survival. Do not debate. Or put conditions on the debate:
1) release all personal and business tax returns going back to first year of visit to Moscow.
2) reconvene Muellers team and provide public testimony.
3) have every member of administration called for oversight or impeachment inquiry testify under oath before the relevant Congressional committees after all documentary and telecommunications evidence is provided to Congress.
Absent addressing these preconditions democrats should rightly conclude there is an illegitimate criminal gang represented by the republican party and do everything possible to defeat them and then hold them accountable.
1
Who are the people? More importantly, who are NOT the people? Who isn’t human, in your eyes?
1
Has anyone considered that Biden is a much worse candidate than Hilary Clinton. Think about that now or when you wake up the day after the election in November.
9
@Denis. it's hard even to IMAGINE a worse candidate than Hillary Clinton, but you're right. Not to mention that both Biden and Sanders are close to 80 years old and they've both had very serious health problems.
There should be an upper age limit on running for president, a "bookend" for the lower one. The standard private-sector retirement age of 65 is a perfect yardstick for what that age limit should be.
Do we really want to elect another William Henry Harrison or Woodrow Wilson or Warren G. Harding, all of whom died or became incapacitated while in office? Apparently, many people do, but I'm not one of them.
And by the way, Sanders fans, Warren G. Harding died of a heart attack— and he was much younger than Bernie is now, at the time.
3
@Denis - Hillary was and still is the BEST candidate for president. But Biden (and Bernie) have something she lacks: a penis.
3
@A Dot, BOTH of the endlessly self-serving and nakedly greedy Clintons absolutely disgust me, and I've never even considered voting for either one of them.
As to male vs. female biological equipment, yes, both Joe and Bernie have something that Hillary lacks— but at their ages, it's strictly ornamental.
I voted for Elizabeth this morning and will heartily go to bat for Bernie when the time comes to do that. Both of them have had the Democratic establishment against them...so they MUST be on the right path for this country.
5
The Democratic establishment is also against Trump. Is Trump good for the country? I don’t think so.
6
@Ben The Dem Establishment would rather vote for Trump than Sanders.
What does that tell you? Greed wins?
3
I see no evidence of your assertion. The Democratic establishment seems to be all in for defeating Trump.
5
I seem to remember back in 1996, that Hilary was the safe pick, and the leaders of the Democratic party got totally behind her as the moderate candidate, and the safe pick.
How did that work out. The thing that Bernie has going for himself are passionate voters that will go to the polls. Biden doesn't have that.
Biden is milk toast, and what I worry about is how Trump will ridicule him in debates, and possibly get him totally flustered.
Personally I support Warren, whom I think would be able to calmly put Trump down, and show his pettiness.
3
@jimgilmoregon
There has not been uptick of turnout for Bernie so far. Quite the opposite, his numbers are well lower than in 2016.
" After all, Sanders partisans sometimes insist that Democrats have no choice but to nominate their candidate because they’ll stay home otherwise, a sneering imitation of traditional centrist demands for progressive compromise."
Name me a single self-labeled centrist, or moderate, Democrat who has stated that they will stay home if Bernie is the nominee. Nobody I know will do that. I voted for Biden but if Bernie prevails, so be it, he has my vote.
Know what we say to a Bernie-or-Bust person? MAGA (or KAG, or whatever sorry acronym Trump's people have cooked up).
3
@Ron
"Name me a single self-labeled centrist, or moderate, Democrat who has stated that they will stay home if Bernie is the nominee."
Exactly. We have to be the adults in the room because so many Bernie bros threaten to throw tantrums that will hold the whole system hostage (or blow it up by voting for Trump) if they don't get their way. I'll vote for Bernie if he is the nominee but know that we can't count on Bernie supporters to do the same if a moderate is the nominee.
6
Hmmm. College educated white suburban Republican women. Moderate, persuadable, grossed out by Trump. Perfect strategy. Wait. Wasn't that Hillary's strategy? Did you see her final ad? Worked out well, didn't it. All those college educated suburban white Republican women turned out for Hillary (one of their own!!) -- but they didn't. They voted for Trump -- despite his documented boorishness, despite his rather open and flagrant misogyny. I know it's hard work to get out the youth vote as well as the vote of half the voting population which has been effectively disenfranchised. What's the alternative? Having our politics and our national policies over-determined, and legitimated, by the wealthiest, most conservative sectors of the population?
6
@Mark Rabine The 2018 midterm election is now more instructive. They voted Democrat.
4
"...a sneering imitation of traditional centrist demands for progressive compromise..." Ms. Goldberg has done a great job taking to heart and exemplifying the adage that it's always the other person who needs to change.
3
The only way to win the presidency is to win at least 270 electoral votes, which means carrying some "purple" states that lean somewhat conservative. The Electoral College stinks, and it's anti-democracy, and it's not a fair way to elect a President. However, it is the system we have now -- like it or not -- so we need to figure out how to reach 270.
10
The demographics of those who vote may differ from those who can vote, but the policy preferences of voters and non-voters are more similar than not.
There will come an election where the Millennials will seize their power and responsibility. This very well may be it.
4
@Logan Green
Let's hope not.
we now have real-world data from the first four states to lend to these theories, and it shows that Bernie has not produced any notable increase (let alone an unprecedented level) in young or first-time voters. (in fact, in NH, any increases came in areas that voted for the other candidates).
5
To me this is a serious issue. Michelle history in her columns and speaking on The Argument show she'd love a Bernie presidency. So if she has these concerns to me it's a red flag, and I say that as someone who prefers Sanders/Warren in the primary, and *whoever* *wins* the nomination come November.
6
@SamwiseTheDrunk
"Michelle history in her columns...show[ed] she'd love a Bernie presidency. So if she has these concerns to me it's a red flag."
The estimable Ms. Goldberg is nonetheless embedded in a mainstream news culture it is hard to stand outside of.
This opinion piece essentially repeats the latest iteration of an "electability" argument by Goldberg's right wing NYT colleague, Sydney Ember - a pov and reasoning she is entirely surrounded by professionally.
Like Ember, Goldberg adopts two political scientist's most apparent findings uncritically - that is, she does not interrogate the weaknesses of that argument, but - trying to be "realistic" and "clear eyed" - takes them at face value.
There are counterarguments - I have listed some in an earlier post today - not least of all, Biden's staggering weakness as a candidate; but, as they say, you only find what you look for - and, in her anxiety and in the mainstream media culture of the NYT, Ms. Goldberg has regrettably failed to interrogate the political scientists' research.
At any rate - despite the Democratic establishment's massive effort to drive out other candidates and form a united Biden front - today's voting should give more info about the Sanders movement's power to mobilize.
3
As long as Sanders is in the race, Warren is toast. When Bloomberg drops out and throws his money and support to Biden, Joe will become the destined candidate that will eventually defeat Trump. The writing is on the wall. No further action or postulating needed. Trump will be out and Joe Biden will set to work to right the country.
3
Trump proposed cutting regulations and government, and he is doing it. Most of the regulatory bureaucracy is still there, but it has been beheaded and is much less effective.
Sanders proposes more, and more effective, regulation, to reduce business power to do what it wants to pursue profit. He also wants to redistribute some of this profit to the rest of us.
So our citizens have a clear choice in a Sanders-Trump contest -- to reduce government power and taxes and increase business freedom, or increase government power and taxes and reduce business freedom. Thanks to the enduring influence of St. Ronnie, they are inclined to the former.
We are engaged in an experiment to determine if we the citizenry can survive and prosper with smaller governments more influenced by business. Trumpsters do not see our present course as an experiment, but rather as a victory to be made permanent; its reversal would not be a different experiment but rather a defeat to be reversed by the ongoing struggle.
Trump does not experiment to determine the truth. He knows the truth and imposes it on the world; sharpies are useful here.
1
I do not believe that voters will switch their votes to Trump if Sanders is the nominee. I believe that many, like me, will write in some pleasant name..second cousin Jake maybe.
1
It seems like the title is admitting something Goldberg is having a hard time admitting herself; which is that Sanders will have a hard time defeating Trump. First of all, it's not like Sanders doesn't have things Republicans can use against him. Second of all, we have had three election cycles that have shown that neither Sanders nor his acolytes can inspire the turnout needed for victory. Third of all, in his words and in keeping in the spirit of his populist campaign,he seems relatively uninterested in building the coalitions necessary to win. He may very well be the nominee but the research (and the Republicans) are telling us what will happen.
5
All this speculation on what may or may not happen is not credible and a waste of time.
A week ago Joe Biden was supposed to be finished, could not raise any money, was sliding in the polls. Now he is the front runner.
A little over a week ago the US was behaving as if the world was not facing a pandemic.
No one can predict what Bernie can "count on" if he wins the nomination.
4
Historically young voters are the most idealistic and vote the least. If you think getting 11% more of them to vote is hard, try enacting just Bernie's untested and uncosted M4A. It will pale by comparison. Politics is not conducted in a vacuum, and we are no longer a functioning democracy. When the other side is trying to tear down a functioning government as fast as possible, the first objective in triage is stop the bleeding. The second recovery. The third step, which is essentially what Sanders is pitching, rebuild. All that takes time, lots of it. Canada, which is much more homogenous and vastly smaller, took 20 years to enact M4A.
Obamacare, achieved by 1 vote with Dems holding both houses, is only active in 33 states, and is undergoing it's 4th, or 5th attack in the SC. Think M4A would not face the same? Aspirations are great, achievable goals on a massive group scale, better. Incrementalism, as clunky and dysfunctional as it can be, works, because some change today is better than no change for the next four years, and vastly superior to going backwards full speed, as we are now.
6
As someone who lives in a state with tens of thousands of jobs in the health insurance industry I cannot in good faith support sanders. It would be too many unemployed looking for jobs that no longer exist.
I’ve been complaining about trump since 2016, I wanted him impeached and removed but my income is at stake if sanders wins. I am the breadwinner is my household- we would end up on the streets.
I appreciate what sanders wants to do but I can’t support someone who has policies that would hurt me and my family.
5
@Chris
"I appreciate what sanders wants to do but I can’t support someone who has policies that would hurt me and my family."
Are you aware that M4A plans spend a terrific amount of money over 4 years on "worker transition" costs?
If you are aware of it, you do not see fit to mention it.
If you are not aware of it, ask yourself why you aren't.
3
@Chris
Healthcare jobs would not disappear.
1
About half a million voters voted in the 2020 South Carolina democratic primary.
Over 2 million people voted in South Carolina's general election.
Let me know when Biden's numbers are good enough to win the state in the general election. Because as it stands, in the general election, all of those votes will count for Trump (such is the absurdity of our Electoral College system).
1
Okay here's the thing. My *impression* of Black Americans is that (when not disenfranchised) they're actually really reliable voters. So getting their numbers up by 5% is tough. Young people are low-hanging fruit, insofar as there are a ton of them who don't vote, so, in principle, getting an extra 12% of them to vote is easy.
Of course: famous last words. The point that they are unreliable voters still stands.
Finally, vis a vis energizing the opposition: again, from what I've read, Republicans are very good about going to the polls regardless, so raising their numbers won't be so easy. (BUT: that's in normal elections. Perhaps many would be unenthusiastic about voting for Trump, under the right circumstances.)
1
We cannot forget the effects of voter suppression. White suburban women will be able to cast their vote, but Republicans continue to make it harder for those that are unlikely to support their candidates.
All you really have to say here is Hillary. Hillary was the moderate. She was the safe bet. She was the pragmatist that would get moderates to vote for her. She appealed to soccer moms and never Trumpers. She had the party backing. She was the most experienced candidate ever for president. She lost. A bare and painful truth for the moderates in the party. She lost and don't bring up the popular vote. She is not president, so she lost. All of the things I said above can be said about Biden, except he hasn't lost....yet.
5
Yeah, Hillary lost. So why nominate the guy who lost to Hillary by millions of votes in the primary? That’s not logical.
7
@Typical Ohio Liberal
"All you really have to say here is Hillary...She lost."
Clinton had one set of awful weaknesses, Biden has another that will very likely send him down to defeat.
Sanders' ostensible weaknesses cannot be considered in isolation from Biden's - if one really wants to be clear-eyed and realistic.
2
@Ben
That is a logical fallacy, because the voters in each contest were different. Essentially, you are comparing proverbial apples to proverbial oranges.
Nobody really knows anything for sure, now more than ever. Two huge factors could be the Latino vote, and the 18-29 yo vote. Both have been historically low percentages and if they ever turn out in large numbers, 60% of higher, they will decide not only the next president, but the makeup of the house and senate as well. A word to the young from an old boomer: it is your future, you need to take hold of it and make it yours.
3
So lets get Warren in for v-P and get out there a mobilize the young uns to vote for the things they really need which does not include a new I-phone.
Why the pessimism??
PS Sander supporters will not vote for Trump.. They will vote third party or NOT vote at all.
1
@Anna
"Sander supporters will not vote for Trump.. They will vote third party or NOT vote at all."
Yes, I do think things are at a generational breaking point: establishment Democrat's deride the young for a 'Bernie or bust' refusal to support Biden.
But that doesn't really grasp what's going on: it's not simply that the youth vote is singularly attached to Sanders; it's that an anti-establishment Democrat like Sanders is all that could mobilize this politically alienated generation to show up in large numbers in the first place.
2
@Jackson Where does the number come from that as many as 12 million switched from Bernie to Trump in 2016. Why should we expect different in 2020 if Bernie doesn't win the dem nomination?
Finally, having done this twice now there is no evidence that Bernie is inspiring any more younger voters to go to the polls than the more salient issues driving all demographic groups voter turnout?
@Songsfrown
"Where does the number come from that as many as 12 million switched from Bernie to Trump in 2016."
My apologies - it was 12% as I'm sure I've normally posted on the NYT.
But my points - that a) research shows it was conservative Dem's that flipped, and b) that this flipped the states - remain.
Here is the link:
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/8/24/16194086/bernie-trump-voters-study
Joe Biden acted with almost Trumpian indifference to appearances in Ukraine. Rudy Giuliani probably collected a mountain of garbage on Biden in Ukraine, since his two stated missions were to investigate corruption and to locate the server that would prove Trump's innocence of foreign collusion. If Biden is the nominee, that story will be the principle campaign issue of 2020.
1
Maybe it's buried here or elsewhere but the question is: if Dems (every or most eligible Dems) voted, would we win? If yes, then it's a matter of getting out the vote. Biden ain't gonna inspire certain voters (like me) and Bernie will turn others off, but if the message, regardless of the candidate, is DEMOCRATS FOR DEMOCRACY, are there enough of us to win? Come on, people. Just vote (making Election Day a holiday so we could all get to the polls, albeit with kids in tow, would help).
1
First, we Democrats must unite behind our nominee, whover that is. Without unity we lose. If the nominee is Bernie, he must make a special effort to unite us all in the fight ahead. If he does not, we lose.
With unity we can reach out to Independents and anti-Trump Republicans. But only a unified party can win. We must not repeat the mistakes of 2016. We need a ticket of National Unity.
1
@M Philip Wid - Oh, if Bernie is the nominee, he will definitely “make a special effort to unite us all,” since it’ll be for himself. The problem will be: Will Bernie make a special effort to unite us all if “a corporate Democrat” is the nominee?
1
Goldberg makes some good points, and let the debate begin. But I find that the pollsters and commentators don't provide us with the relevant information to decide who is more "electable". OK, the polls cited distinguish according to age, but I assume they're all national polls, whereas the real crucial information is what's happening in a handful of swing states. If sampling is proportional to population, a lot of it is telling us about CA and TX, which are not contested except in landslides. Tell us who fares better against Trump in WI, PA, MI, MN, and AZ. I'll vote in the Expat primary for the candidate who has the best chance to win where it counts.
3
@Stan
Hi Stan - Agreed - plus you made one my above arguments more pointedly.
Winning this election should be easy for Democrats: Trump's approval ratings have never even approached 50%, and even many Republicans who supported him in 2016 are sick of his dishonestly, corruption, and constant reality TV melodrama. Many, many people are ready to vote for "Any Functioning Adult in 2020," as the bumper stickers say.
So it should be easy. Nominate a functional adult and unite behind him or her. Focus your campaign on swing state Independents. Boom! You have a Democratic president, a Democratic House, and a decent shot at a Democratic Senate.
Or you can take a chance on a self-professed socialist whose proposals to raise taxes by trillions of dollars to pay for a government takeover of the healthcare system and promises to abolish ICE feed directly into Trump's narrative that "radical Democrats" want to raise your taxes, take away your freedom of choice, and give the country away to illegal immigrants. (Not that I agree with that assessment, but you have to admit: with Sanders, the attack ads practically write themselves.)
That's a HUGE risk. If the nominee is boring old Joe Biden, he'll coast to win on the strength of widespread disapproval of Trump. If you make the election a referendum on socialism, you can only win if you get an unprecedented influx of new voters. Which means you probably lose. And you damage the changes of moderate Democrats from purple states who are trying to win seats in Congress.
The choice seems pretty obvious to me.
7
@Joe M.
"If the nominee is boring old Joe Biden, he'll coast to win on the strength of widespread disapproval of Trump...[If Sanders is nominated,] "you can only win if you get an unprecedented influx of new voters."
1) It's not "boring old...Biden" that concerns me; it's baggage-laden, mentally deteriorating Biden.
2) Re "new voters" - young pro-Sanders voters are a uniquely politically alienated bloc: in a generationally awful economic/life expectation predicament, they are alienated from establishment Democratic politics, and they support Sanders, but many are affiliated w/his movement only via internet or their own lived culture.
That is, though Sanders will doubtless bust his hump for a nominee if he's not nominated, as he did last time, he does not have the power to command this large bloc to go to the voting booth for another nominee.
Neglect to consider this at your peril.
1
@Jackson Oh, I've considered it. And to me it only reinforces the idea that non-voters are typically disinterested in politics because they tend not to see the connections between the act of voting and the societal conditions we live in. Which is why they have been non-voters and why they tend to remain non-voters. If I have to choose between one strategy that courts Independents and moderate Republicans who vote in every election, and another that depends on the involvement of a large group of people who, even in 2016, felt like voting has never been worth the trouble, I think it makes more sense to go after the voters.
@Lupito "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts. Bertrand Russell"
A crude, plagiaristic paraphrase of Yeats - far weaker than Yeats' emotionally strong - though intellectually weak - utterance.
"The best lack all conviction, while the worst/
Are full of passionate intensity."
1
oh wow, another op-ed against Bernie Sanders in the NYT? Y'all are starting to sound like a broken record to this millennial. Bernie captures a certain swath of Trump voters thst Biden would never begin to entice, 2016 showed that. I'm so tired of the one-sidedness of the NYT coverage.
7
@Lee Kaplan-Unsoeld
"Bernie captures a certain swath of Trump voters thst Biden would never begin to entice, 2016 showed that."
And that includes young blacks whose support for Sanders is on a par w/Biden's.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign-polls/484611-new-national-poll-shows-sanders-surpassing-biden-with-african
2
@Lee Kaplan-Unsoled: Guess WHAT? If the Times were a Conservative-leaning publication, it wouldn't surprise me if people like you complained if it were Trump who was getting too much attention; which is what appeared to happen in '16. Trump was and still is a master at manipulating the media.
1
Can we stop with the articles about why Bernie Sanders will lose and start with some articles about why someone else will win?
Because I don't see Biden turning out an enthusiastic voter base. And I absolutely think Bloomberg would be destroyed in the general election.
The constant anti-Sanders drumbeat is really getting exhausting. It's turning me off to the party altogether. If you don't support Sanders' policies, that's fine. But I see more opposition to Sanders and his followers than to Trump. That doesn't encourage me to vote for the party's nominee in November.
At this point, my prediction is that Baby Boomers will give us Biden as the nominee, and he will lose to Trump and it will be the cherry on top of the messed up world for that generation, their final grand screw-up.
6
Millennials and Hispanic voters can force trump out of office and decide this election regardless of who the democratic nominee is. All of the math seems to be pretty consistent in predicting that. The question being asked in all of these articles is, “will they choose to do that”? The fact that no one can predict whether that will happen, whether the two demographic groups with the most to lose from more trump will decide they need to vote, is what makes these articles compelling.
Logic makes Biden almost a default choice. Millennials and Hispanics should turn out in droves to vote for him due to self interest and he picks up a smattering of suburban white women and he depresses republican turnout a bit because a few are tired of trump drama and Biden seems “safe”. The last two things (a bit of a “safety” buffer) are not available with a Bernie nomination
Michelle Goldberg — And now, after all the Times opinion writers (Times writers) she too invalidates Sanders. No matter, that I'm sure she personally has little objection. Her husband works for the Warren campaign, how different are the two.
That so many Democrats here are crying wolf over Sanders, or are clutching their pearls as it appears Michelle is doing here. This is a major NYTs disgrace.
Casting Sanders as extreme and, or, radical, what the Times and the rest of our socially positive phony citizens do should signal alarm on the left.
There is nothing radical, or far left about Sanders. His agenda for our country are not nearly all imperative for us to survive the right who are demonstrably radical, something the American press seems unable to recognize no matter the tide in Europe, and the US where the mongrel right is gaining power each day. Even as, when confronted, here and there, are unable to articulate anything backing their rhetoric.
And how shallow can we get, or remain, as the election is treated as a personality contest. Whether or not you would like to share a drink with Bernie or any politician is absolutely irrelevant. And as per usual the Times chooses to ignore the many votes Biden has cast disenfranchising working Americans.
Wake up people, you are being manipulated by the wealthy left who mainly are moved to maintain their top of the heap gravy train.
At seventy years the lack of maturity in the American voter is depressing to say the least.
9
If Sanders wins the nomination, it is incumbent upon all of us who understand to help others understand. The lights need to come on in America.
The fear of the socialist menace has been nurtured over fifty years of Cold War. That fear has promoted the "liberal" economics that no liberal endorses. Liberal economics is "free" economics - free from regulation, free from government, free to do whatever devious thing it takes to make huge profits for the wealthy few. Free to legally rip off the 99%. And that they have done.
If Sanders wins the nomination, it will be incumbent upon us all who know to enlighten those who don't - and get them to vote.
Young people need to hear that their elders can't be trusted - which they can't. I've been living with them for 75 years - they are stupid, almost beyond belief. Who knew that you could fool half the population ALL of the time? It's enough to make one despair over humanity.
Anyway, Sanders, as president, would not be as much of a dictator as Trump - so stopped worrying. Chose - liberalism or mean and stupid conservative fascism. Oh yes, fascism!
9
I don't see that Biden is bringing in new voters either, so what is the argument for going with him, other than by default?
7
Some suburban white women actually do vote for him and he doesn’t spike republican turnout like Bernie would
1
So Americans have the boldly corrupt 1% super wealthy gang of thieves in charge now and Sanders is shouting about stopping it and some people don't like that?
Better wake up and listen to what he's saying about income inequality and healthcare and the rich running things.
You might be worried that his policies will tax you more, but if income inequality continues, you'll have nothing to tax.
10
So, the study cited shows that the real problem is not that a small portion of Sanders supporters are Bernie or Bust voters but that a very large percentage of moderate Democrats would switch their vote to Trump if Sanders gets the nomination. It seems to me that it is those moderate Democrats and, more importantly, the centrist candidates they support, who should be receiving all the negative press for their disloyalty.
Likewise, Super Delegates are openly threatening rebellion and justifying causing damage to the party in their zeal to stop Sanders. Can anyone imagine such a thing happening in the Republican party?
Bernie dominates every poll among voters under 50 years old. Shouldn't demonstrating, like Biden has, an inability to inspire young people to vote disqualify you? The anti-Bernie spin and the framing and the double standards of virtually everyone writing at The Times is just astonishing.
256
@Joe
Not astonishing at all. I wouldn't expect it to be otherwise. In fact, a pro-Sanders piece would make me awfully suspicious. Especially after that rare one in '16 where the article was edited to be critical of Sanders well after it was posted.
21
@Joe Superdelegates don't get to vote unless there is a second ballot, i.e. a brokered convention. These are the rule changes the Sanders campaign demanded. And now, once again, there is this talk of how the rules are "rigged" against him.
Also, I seriously doubt there are many Democrats voting for Trump. The swing voters they are talking about are largely independents. Yet only 53% of Sanders supporters say they will support the Democratic nominee if it isn't Sanders.
55
@Joe , go back and read more carefully. The surveys imply moderates, period. This includes independent and cross-over Republicans. Also, it is more likely they’d not vote at all—not vote for Trump. Without their votes, no matter the size of the popular vote, Bernie won’t win the electoral college. It will be a repeat of 2016.
58
My candidate of choice was Elizabeth Warren but I am now convinced that only Biden can beat Trump. To me, his defeat is imperative. I believe that the road to victory lies with independent voters who lean more toward Biden. If Sanders wins the nomination fair and square, I won't object by falling on the floor, kicking my feet and holding my breath. I will support his candidacy with vigor.
190
@Whole Grains I voted this morning for Warren, my candidate from the start. I did so today not because I think she can make a miraculous rebound and win the nomination but because she is neck and neck with Bernie in the polls here in Massachusetts and my intent was to stop his momentum as much as possible. I feel this way not because I disagree with much of what Bernie advocates but because, even if he wins, he will absolutely kill Democrats in down ballot races. He has this illusory notion that he can build some sort of coalition among those who normally don’t vote. Yet, his showing in South Carolina, where blacks are the dominant force, was abysmal. I fear that Nominating Bernie would be tantamount to kissing off major swaths of the country. We just can’t afford that.
124
@Whole Grains
I was in the same boat as you: supporting Warren in my heart, but thinking about another candidate (Bloomberg) as being more electable.
I went for Warren this morning, and it fits my heart and strategically: the best way to weaken Bernie is to support his closest progressive rival, which is Warren.
13
@Livonian
"[T]he best way to weaken Bernie is to support his closest progressive rival, which is Warren."
Thanks for putting into words what is doubtless Warren's unspoken reason for staying in the race, Livonian.
11
I'm voting for Joe Biden. Bernie is not bringing in more people and will not have a revolution. Pipe dream. Would I like a revolution? Of course, but Americans are not ready for one.
3
It’s disappointing to see that the Dem primary “choice” comes down to two old white men.
Of the two, only Sanders has repeatedly come to my community to hold rallies and earn votes.
Not excited or inspired, but will absolutely vote blue no matter who.
3
The moderate wing of the Democratic party will deliver another defeat in Nov 2020.
The number one issue with all segments of the democratic base is healthcare. No one wants to hear about reviving Obamacare which has come apart like a cheap suit.
The moderates have disparaged Medicare for All with a great deal of dishonesty and fear-mongering. The facts are that it's entirely doable and at a substantial cost savings. So who's best interest are the moderates looking after ?
7
Everything changes after today. The proof that Bernie can win will be obvious. Bernie will own the DNC by the time the convention arrives. I know this saddens the NYTimes but they must realize they are on the wrong side of history.
4
This is a dumb fight. Biden would be no less moderate than Barack Obama, perhaps he is a little to Obama's left. Bernie would be left of that, but not as far left as FDR's program to rescue the country from the Great Depression. No matter who is elected, unless Bernie arrives in office with 60 democratic socialist Senators, you're not getting Medicare for All, more likely a reduction in the eligibility age for Medicare to 50 or 55, or free public college. Even if Bernie's election got more public university systems to lower tuition, they're not giving away room and board any time soon and that accounts for anywhere from half to a third of the cost of a university education at a state university. Biden might be a safer, albeit uninspiring choice compared to Sanders, but either way it is a significant trade up from the current occupant of the oval office.
2
Always intelligent, constructive analysis from Michelle Goldberg. Thank you.
1
”But it does mean that if Sanders wins the primary, his campaign has to learn to persuade people, not just mobilize them”
It also means they have to stop bullying and yelling at us. I’m voting for Warren because I think she would make the best president. That is what primaries are for. But Sanders supporters are constantly screeching and bullying and calling Warren a snake for having the audacity not to drop out after only 4 primaries.
When they aren’t yelling and me or Warren, they swarm black women with abuse online who say they don’t support Sanders. This is no way to win over people.
Enough. I voted for Sanders in 2016 then was happy to vote for Clinton in the general. This time I want to vote for Warren. The obnoxious behavior of Sanders people, and the myopic #BernieorBust folks have really turned me off.
But don’t worry, I’m voting blue no matter who in the general, because I realize that we need to get Trump out.
8
I guess we are going to find out just how badly the Dems want to beat Trump vs beating the revolution drum. Note when you vote out of anger Trump is what you end up with.
1
and Joe Biden can’t count on people showing up obligingly for him to vote, including me ... don’t have to and don’t want to
3
This column is about polls and prognostication. You might remember how well that turned out for Hillary.
2
Biden is the old way....big money politics.
That's what you'd get....watered down policies affected by lobbyists.
Do that with defense contractors and you get wars.
5
Unfortunately, many states make it very difficult for students to vote. This is a typical Republican ruse and will be particularly effective against the "new" voters that Sanders is hoping to mobilize.
1
Without a huge youth vote - so far not materialized - Sanders will not be competitive with Trump, Goldberg writes.
Goldberg depends on "electability" research by political scientists also cited by the NYT's Ember and Cohn.
Statistics - not my strength, but a few points:
1. Seems the rise in the youth vote is not as unprecedented as the political scientists say:
[https://fair.org/home/bernie-sanders-cant-win-by-as-much-unless-youth-vote-surges-like-it-recently-has/]
2. This research is apparently national - and so does not examine its applicability to the crucial and demographically distinct Midwest swing states where, in 2016, 12% of conservative Democrat/independent voters went from Sanders in primaries to Trump in the general - evidently drawn to Sanders economic populism to start, then to Trump's bogus economic populism and racism after Sanders was out; but, in either case, unwilling to vote for an establishment Democrat.
[https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/8/24/16194086/bernie-trump-voters-study]
3. The research 'corrects' for impact of attack ads on candidates...but between Biden's mental decline, political record, and Trump's unscrupulousness, the authors fail to gauge how Biden/Trump debates would harm Biden - essentially, how weak a candidate he is:
[https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jan/04/joe-biden-electable-trump-2020-election]
4. The study does not consider how a brokered convention handed to Biden would demolish Sanders support.
1
The problem with this analysis is self-evident. You're not relying on every young person to vote. That's not elections work. You're relying on Sanders activists to generate young voter turnout. If you alienate the activists, turnout will be lower for any candidate. The question is whether Sanders activists are more organized and effective than other activists. The answer appears to be yes.
Whether the activists are effective enough to elect a Jewish Democratic Socialist is different question. (Interesting how Goldberg just happened to throw "Jewish" in there on Super Tuesday.) However, the activists are much more effective than any other Democratic candidate. That's why Democrats should fear their discontent. Democrats need trained activists more than the other way around.
Allow me to put things in perspective: Have you ever spent cold nights wandering around unknown neighborhoods knocking on doors to support a political cause? I have. It's often a miserable and depressing experience. There were some nights so cold we would wrap plastic bags over our socks just to keep our toes from freezing. Bathroom breaks are also interesting when you're dropped off in a random neighborhood without a car.
I'm sorry but your typical Biden supporter is unwilling or unable to go through these hardships. But you know what? They work. You need the young people to go do the organizing. Young organizers overwhelmingly support Sanders. That's the only math you need to know.
8
@Andy
As another commenter pointed out, Bernie has lots of individual donations, and most are likely from the young.
Does anyone who donates, not vote?
1
Bernie, if you happen to be reading this, can I help you answer differently the next time you discuss the keys to you election. Good God, do not state that you do not believe that the way to beat Trump "is to just speak to Republican women in the suburbs.” Instead, PLEASE say, "YES, I need Republican women in the suburbs, I need young people, I need moderates...."
I believe Hillary Clintons Deplorables comment was one among the many factors that led to her razor thin defeat. She may have won had she not made that foolish statement. Yes, like many of her statements, it was taken out of context and misrepresented, as was her statement that she planned to put coal miners out of their jobs. But that is the way the ugly game of American politics is played. Having Republicans run ads that say "Bernies says he just does not need Republican women voters" could be your deplorables equivalent. And don't praise Cuba!
5
@MRod
Sorry but Bernie does not pander - you get what you vote for.
1
Why can't we wait until the results of Super Tuesday
are in before making a statement that a progressive can 'remake' the electorate. Seriously - who would have thought that Trump - a racist - would remake the GOP? Bernie will own the DNC by the time the convention rolls around, so please be fair to Bernie.
1
"As Ruy Teixeira, a senior fellow at the Center for American Progress, pointed out in The Washington Post, the 2018 elections saw the highest midterm turnout in over a century, yet most of Democrats’ improved performance “came not from fresh turnout of left-of-center voters, who typically skip midterms, but rather from people who cast votes” in the last two national elections and “switched from Republican in 2016 to Democratic in 2018.”
Am I missing something? Turnout among 18- to 29 year-olds the 2018 midterms was 79% higher than in the 2014 midterms, according to the Census Bureau, https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2019/04/behind-2018-united-states-midterm-election-turnout.html
That was far and away the biggest increase among any age group, more than double the 37% increase among the next largest group, those aged 30 to 44 years. The smallest increase was among voters 65 years and older (11%).
3
Comments here confirm the self destructive tendencies of centrist Democrats.
Listen people, all of you on the left —
Vote blue no matter who.
How any of you can talk about anything else reveals faulty thinking. There is no issue more important than stopping Trump.
Sheesh, at this critical juncture so many are pole vaulting over mole hills.
I wanted Warren to win but she inexplicably fell victim to unforced errors. So I moved over to Bernie though I will vote for Biden if he is nominated.
Never mind that Biden has been on the wrong side of nearly every issue that crossed his path for nearly five decades.
Do people understand Biden's record? More importantly do they recognize that all the fears over a Sanders nomination are cooked up by our own party? And that most would only apply were we electing a king.
Sanders is on the correct side of most every issue, yet many of you are easily manipulated by nonsensical propaganda, much of it, thinly disguised, right here in the Times.
Anyone not Trump, no matter who, vote blue. Anything else is a vote for Trump. How can it be that so many are unable to grasp this?
3
@The Iconoclast
Your "vote blue no matter who" falls apart if the nominee is Biden. He will lose big to Trump - because the Progressives will either sit it out or vote Trump; 12% voted Trump last time, 40% will do so this time. That's the reality.
And why would a Progressive vote for Biden, a Republican shill?
There's a huge upside to Biden's loss to Trump - the Moderates will be destroyed and we can finally get at the Republicans.
Progressives rightly prefer an anti-establishment Trump to a status quo shill.
Both brexit & Trump were elected, despite the polling, because large numbers of people who never voted, voted. It’s not complicated folks, if millennials, gen z, & the millions of POC who don’t vote sit out this election we get Trump again regardless of who the dems run.
saunders vs trump?
I have not missed voting in an election in over 40 years. Have never voted for a Republican. No way I can vote for Trump.
Bit if it comes down to this match, may find myself not casting any vote for president.......many of my friends feels the same way.
The left Elite simply don't get that they are actually in the minority. Have they actually stopped to listen to what many Democrats in Republican strongholds are saying????
7
I will never ‘fall in line’ for the oligarchy candidate again. Enough.
3
The low percentage of young voters under 35 is not only discouraging, but disgusting. I guess they do not care about their future or even their present reality.
1
People: Is everyone crazy to think that a socialist candidate is going to win in a capitalistic society! Just think about that and the implications for the tax code, healthcare and child care and other big ticket items that Bernie simply mouths along at his "youth" rallies with no credible financials behind those programs. Bernie is telling everybody in his "base" what they want to hear. Am I saying that Bernie is loopy-loopy? Yes I am. Bernie comes across as a mean spirited bitter old white man who knows that this is his last rodeo and he wants to put his thumb into the fatcat's eyes. Bernie, to date, has NOT enlarged his "youth" base wherein we are seeing new millions of young voters registered or are registering to vote. Bernie does not come across as a person who is willing to compromise on anything but yet he wants to initiate a socialist program when he gets to the White House! What a fool's errand that is. It would be four years of gridlock because any GOP controlled Senate would smack Bernie down each time he came to them with some socialistic gibberish and then Bernie would feel betrayed because nothing is materializing regarding his policy programs. Someone needs to have an in depth national interview with Bernie and pin him down on the costs of his LA-LA programs and how he would get them through Congress. That would be a discussion in which you would see the paucity of his programs and the trillions it would take to fund them.
4
What a choice to give the American voters; an unqualified populist, or an unqualified socialist.
Really, can't we do better?
3
The largest block of voters currently existing in America are the 100 MILLION or so that DIDN'T VOTE in 2016 and unless there is a significant increase in the turnout for democrats in 2020, it won't matter who the nominee is, Trump will win another four years.
2
It's the inability to acknowledge facts by Bernie supporters that really bugs me. There is evidence that Bernie isn't bringing out a huge wave of new voters. His vote total remains close to 2016. It's another example of how moderates feel Sanders may have too much of a cult-like following like Trump. Sanders would be a tough vote for me, a life-long Democrat and it shouldn't be.
4
Bernie cannot gain votes in the suburbs (let alone rural areas) and that would give the election to Trump. It wasn't Bernie Dems who flipped two Iowa House districts in 2018. And understand this: Suburban voters don't "like" Trump but they can rationalize voting for the GOP agenda and, even more so, the economy, which they believe the Bernie agenda will ruin.
3
The childish part of me hopes Bernie secures the nomination and then goes down in flames in November to finally prove to progressives who continually claim his past losses have been the result of establishment meddling and that Hillary's 2016 loss was somehow proof that centrist liberalism is irrelevant now. A good hard thumping might prove to them that you do in fact have to reach out to the center to actually win a general election and that compromise is not only not a dirty word but essential to getting things done.
But the adult part of me knows that this election is too important to worry about whether progressives learn some humility or nor. We simply need to win and replace a reckless and childish man unfit to be commander in chief of the US. So I will vote for whoever wins the nomination. If we all did our duty and turned up to cast our votes for the greater good, would easily win.
5
@Gunnar The child me who lives in NJ will not vote for JB in November. There is no adult me if he gets the nomination. I don’t even want to have to live through a Biden Presidency frankly so loathe am I to watch him suck up to Republicans Obama-style. I am disgusted by our Republican-safe society and no longer wish to participate. Enjoy winning.
1
I'm in a wealthy suburb of Los Angeles. Almost all of my friends are voting for Biden today, including myself. I believe that Sanders would lose a lot of voters, especially in swing states and among more educated voters, in the general election. Most of the voters that gave Democrats the house in 2018 were crossover voters from Trump in 2016, not young, progressive voters. Also, I'm 18, so I am very young, as are most of my friends. I do not believe that Sanders can create a turnout advantage among younger voters that will outweigh the disadvantage caused by lost moderate voters.
5
It seems to me that a party needs the House, Senate, and the Presidency to pass sweeping legislation that has some degree of staying power. Every time Sanders receives the logical question about how exactly he plans to make his policies a reality, he utterly fails to explain, both in terms of how we will pay for the programs and how he will make them into law.
I do not dislike his ideas. However, I also understand the many challenges, having witnessed the difficulties with passing the ACA, and that was with a Democratic House and Senate. Not all Democratic districts support candidates like AOC, and it is foolish to behave otherwise because the strength of the party rests in its diversity. Moreover, Sanders has not explained how he will pass his agenda nor shown any ability to grow the House and Senate to make his ideas reality.
Sanders will need a coalition of folks to make anything happen, and much more for something as grandiose as what he proposes. At least Warren can explain her plan and is forthright about the cost. Sanders's words offer hope but forgive me if I doubt his ability to produce. Furthermore, I submit that because he paints with such a broad brush negative comments about those with differing ideas, he may harm Democratic candidates running in moderate districts.
Sanders seriously concerns me. I will still vote for the winner of the Democratic primary.
6
@Darren Good thing Martin Luther King didn't give up when he realized that racism wouldn't be swept away the day the Montgomery Bus Boycott ended. Just because something can't be accomplished immediately doesn't mean that it's a waste of time to try, or to elect people who believe in the same things we do, even if others don't.
2
MLK was a great compromiser in the service of his overall agenda. That, and his obvious willingness to sacrifice his own life, were his great strengths. He knew where he wanted to go ultimately but understood that the only way he could get there was by continually taking small bites when and where he could and by getting people who ordinarily would not be inclined to help to at least not get in his way. Bernie doesn’t seem to think in the same way.
1
It's refreshing to see more and more commenters who are 45 and older females express their support for Bernie Sanders.
It's important for people to know we aren't just a bunch of dirt-poor, disaffected or angry young men who threaten not to show up at the polls if the nominee isn't Bernie (I feel that is a tiny, tiny percentage of Bernie supporters--most I know who supported Bernie in 2016 voted Hillary with the hopes of keeping) Trump out, myself included.
Some of us know that will a little more in taxes, overall expenditure on healthcare (including what we would pay in premiums, copays and out-of-network specialist fees), would go down considerably. We pay as much or more per capita in Medicare and Medicaid taxes (excluding private insurance and all fees) than some countries with better outcomes spend total per capita on healthcare.
Some of us know leveling the playing field a little (Rich will still be rich under Sanders but will support the American economy instead! This ISN'T Communism!) will create better opportunities for disadvantaged and working class, which will in turn increase morale and eventually decrease crime. Increasing morale leads to happier, more productive workers as well.
Medicare for All provides mobility--no longer do you have to be tied to an unsatisfying job because you are grandfathered into a healthcare insurance plan! And now employers can attract workers by through higher wages rather than unclear benefits packages.
5
@Rhonda Here is another older woman who has been giving Sanders contributions for over a year now. I want a better country for the 40% of Americans who are treading water or drowning in economic disaster. I want health care for all and accessible university education and other benefits and I am fed up with our bloated military budget and our regime change wars that have wasted trillions!
Bernie will win New York. AOC will stomp for him, Mike won’t carry the vote, and Biden is too moderate.
3
Biden doesn’t win New York in a general election against trump? Do you seriously believe this?
My vote for Biden was cemented last week when I spent time talking to a number of liberal professional women (white, black, and brown) who have always voted for Democrats, and expressed the view that if Sanders were the nominee they might just not vote for a Presidential candidate. In California that won't be a big deal, but if women like these in swing states just don't vote for either candidate then we are in trouble. We cannot afford to take risky paths and it's not just "Republican" women who might not vote for Bernie -- it's lifelong Democrats who just find him too much. But they will vote for sure, and we cannot rely on a huge youth surge for which there is currently no evidence. Biden wasn't my first choice, but he is the best choice to beat Trump and begin tackling issues like climate change that cannot wait another 4 years.
4
I don't think we will get much from career politicians like Sanders and Biden. I believe Bloomberg will bring not only integrity to the job but also new ideas that will make for greater benefit to the country.
4
Were Republican voter suppression activities factored into this analysis? I think that they are significant enough to consider. Basically, who has the more likely voters that are more likely to have their votes suppressed or their voting machines manipulated by Russians with no paper ballot backup?
2
Today we are voting to recruit or dismiss an army of one million extremely motivated volunteers ready to bust their tails for Bernie Sanders and defeat Donald Trump. I'd like to think they'd do it for any dem nominee, but the fact is, the vast majority won't.
4
Why would we fight for continued oligarchy? Why would anyone?
4
And that didn’t take long
2
Short answer:
The Democratic Party must muster every resource to coalesce around the clear leader, Senator Sanders. It is past time to do this so that we unite the Party to defeat Trump and restore democracy.
There. It's on the DNC. They have the billions, and let's face it, they have a lot of apologizing and making up after their disastrous thumb on the scale the last presidential election. Donna Brazile is now the poster gal for DNC perfidy. Perez MUST not merely be seen as "acting" transparently, but must actually perform. That the DNC leadership is so heavily stacked with corporate reps does not bode well.
Right?
5
@Portland Dan
I saw a video the other day in which one of the senior delegates to the democratic convention stated quite clearly, it was THEY who will ultimately determine who the nominee is, NOT the voter. The "democratic" in the democratic party's name is a contradiction in terms and I suppose, the primaries are basically just a sham to determine the real nominee at the convention
For those voters who think their vote really means something, think again.
1
ANY of the remaining candidates would be fine, and NONE of them would see all of their proposals realized.
And ANY remaining candidate can defeat Trump if ALL Dems unite and vote for the final nominee.
We should drop the angst over picking the 'right' candidate and focus on uniting around our 2020 nominee and getting every democrat to the ballot box.
4
Biden talks incessantly about reaching across the aisle and establishing "trust" with Republicans. He put this ideology into practice when he decided to trust his esteemed Republican colleague George W. Bush and vote yes on the Iraq invasion.
We can absolutely depend on Biden to do something equally insane and destructive if we make the mistake of electing him.
4
Bernie Sanders campaign is now coming to an end. Objective analysis, most recently from FiveThirtyEight sees Biden achieving either a majority of delegates going into the convention or a clear plurality. Either way he will be the nominee. Sanders will not give up, as is his right, but don't be surprised if his followers ramp up their angry rhetoric and threats to stay home once reality begins to set in. Sanity prevails in the end. Thank you Democracy.
1
@John By the time the DNC convention rolls around Bernie will own the DNC just as Trump owns the GOP.
"The primaries have yet to demonstrate that Sanders can generate the hugely expanded turnout his campaign is promising, though that could change when the Super Tuesday results come in." So before you start saying he can't count on new voters, Ms. Goldberg, let's wait 24 hours before you start making claims like this with negative headlines like this one.
4
I am not holding my nose to vote for another uninspiring corporate centrist. Not again. Make the right choice.
6
@theda _ skocpol me either I will have other things to do that day as well as something on Netflix to watch
2
Enjoy four more years of kids in cages, environmental destruction, and massive lifetime appointments for right wing judges! If you can’t vote against that, who needs you?
You're looking in the wrong place for the new voters. Tens of millions of poor voters don't usually vote. Stacey Abrams and Bishop William Barber have been traversing the country getting those people interested in going to the polls.
The main complaint of the poor, the really poor, the really marginalized, is that they are ignored. Some people are finally going to talk to them, listening to what they have to say, and those votes could change the game for everybody.
5
The analysis in this article is correct, I believe. But the argument would have been bolstered by noting that in the 2018 mid-terms moderate Democrats won where the Sanders-like progressives were wiped out, unless they ran in deep blue districts such as Brooklyn.
If either Sanders, or Warren is the nominee, there will be no massive turnout of the young; they will lose. I would bet my life on this proposition. While 2020 is not exactly a repeat of 1972, the foundational dynamic is unchanged; the country is comfortably ignorant and conservative.
If you want to live in a country with social democratic values, single payer, gun control, a social safety net and good governance, leave. You will never get it in America. For this, you can thank the Republican Party.
Seriously, if you are young, educated and ambitious, leave; you will never regret it, and your children will thank you for having done it.
2
My family is ‘blue no matter who’, given the existential threat of Trump.
However, I have college age children who will only support Bernie in the primaries. They are repelled by Biden who looks and acts ancient. (Slow Joe rings somewhat true.) Also, Bernie is the only candidate who has repeatedly come to our community to earn votes.
Sad that with such inspiring, young, and diverse leaders, our party has settled for a couple of 70-something old men.
2
I think analysis like this, which you see a lot of, are incomplete because they fail to account for the mysterious group of dissatisfied Rust Belt working class voters who are looking for revolution. In 2016 they saw revolution in Bernie and in Trump. With the choice of Wall-Street-free-trade-centrist Hillary they went for Trump. They would have gone for Bernie in 2016, and would probably go for him now, given that Trump did not turn out as expected. But it is unlikely they will be convinced by a centrist Democrat, i.e. Biden would need a running mate like Warren or say Stacy Abrams. If he does not realize this, he will lose. But I’m skeptical of any election analysis that ignores this factor. It is not just millennial Bernie voters, it is working class voters that are looking for big change, whatever it is.
Ms.Goldberg identifies the big question: Do Democrats lose more votes by having angry Biden Moderates stay home, or by having angry Sanders Radicals stay home? She offers no opinion, then confuses me further in the last paragraph by saying that even if Sanders gets enough young people to turn out and vote, it won’t be enough. Isn’t enough enough? If you get enough votes, don’t you win? Or is she saying that even if Sanders wins in the primaries, the DNC will give it to Biden, just like they are rumored to have done with Clinton? The worst thing about this is that the election story has become Biden vs. Sanders, not the Civilized World vs. Donald Trump.
2
Maybe Sen. Sanders should learn to talk to moderate Democratic voters in the suburbs because he’s not going to mobilize enough young voters to win this contest, imo. To be clear, I’ll vote for him over Trump, but finding myself increasingly disenchanted with him, his stubborn ways and his decades old tunnel vision. Bernie voters can you promise the same????? Will you vote for whoever wins the Democratic nomination?
Sanders voters, expecially the younger, less jaded ones are in for a shock, there is little to no chance the senator will be able to muscle in Medicare for all, free college tuition, etc. Don’t you Bernie bros ever wonder why Trump is urging Republicans to vote for Sanders in states (like mine) where no party affiliation means anyone can vote in the Democratic primary? It’s not out of the kindness of his heart, no serious person thinks Trump has a heart.
2
Another example of remarkable bias and conflicts of interest by the author.
The story today should be about California's Democratic Party voter suppression effort that blocked probably over 500,000 Sanders voters.
The current propensity of young voters is very different from past elections. Young people actually have something to vote FOR - which is a novel concept,
1
No one knows whether Sanders, or any other Democrat, will beat Trump. It’s all speculation loosely tethered to past experience, which may or may not be a good guide to the future. After all, our last two Presidents have been a black man with the middle name Hussein and an obvious con man. Who could have predicted either of them?
What we do know is that if we elect Bernie Sanders he will push to enact policies that benefit common people. That’s good enough to earn my support.
3
Are these moderates going to acknowledge they were wrong about the costs of M4A? An apology to Sanders is warranted.
“Multiple studies show Medicare for All would be cheaper than public option pushed by moderates
Yale and Harvard researchers: Medicare for All reduces costs, while public option makes health care more expensive”
IGOR DERYSH - FEBRUARY 22, 2020 11:00AM
2
The thing that amazes me is how disciplined Bernie is, not getting sidetracked from issues into personal spats, a la Mayor B & Sen K. Vide: the Warren stage ambush, it would have been easy to fire back for weeks...
That said, and while there are many "rational" arguments to support Sen W, it is time to stop making sense in a mere academic way. Pragmatically a vote for Sen W now, with the centerist astroturf fest of " coal-essence", is a vote for centersism.
Progs supporting W needs gut check. Like Today.
As far as Nov goes, 1st step in any worthwhile pol sci is: what happened in Nov 16? T got 47%. Odds are that turn out will be that high again, and no one who voted against him then will vote for him now.
So any Dem should get more than 50%. The question is which Dem.
Part of the whole Biden SURGE narrative has been to underplay the inevitable wins (has anyone quoted the polls in AL, TX, AR... no...why not). These inevitable 1sts can be trumpeted as big surprises. (More on SC below)
But here is what is also inevitable- Dems will not win those states come Nov.
Should we run the guy who wins where we lose, or the guy who wins where we must come Nov?
To decide that it would be nice if MSM focused on BIG policy questions. Like what would "he" do if another 2008? Or if )WHEN) Supremes outlaw ACA?
There is the Acid Test. Let's get to it.
& a guy running to restore dignity to the Presidency isn't offering $$$ to the hoi poli. Because we all know: no $$$, no dignity...
@M. J. Shepley
not that anybody but one poor overworked underpaid moderator will see this but
(I didn't get back to SC...cuz unlike TV moderators that Sen K just bulldozed through for extra minutes, when your "time" is up The Times cuts you off...
The prelude is, while a believable narrative that voters stayed home or flipped in Milwaukee, etc; there is, of course, a conspiracy theory. Someone did a Don Corleone, picked up a phone, asked for "a favor" and enough ballot machines were rigged...
you get it...
Now, that SC deviated so radically from pre polls is weird. Maybe cool. But maybe locals, not Biden's team, did a wink and a nod and overdid it. Too much thumb on the scale...
Even once, if Trump Troops get proof (or GRU FSB for that matter) it may be surprise news in Oct...
& I admit polls are oft propaganda, like those that said Hillary was ever ahead 10, 12, 14 pts, when it was always between 2-3. The instant polls putting Biden up are the same schlocky stuff
)
The really sad thing is that if all these blinded young Bernie voters don't go out to vote in November if their candidate is not on the ballot, they will be the ones who will bear the brunt of a radically rightwing Supreme Court, crazy far right laws that will be hard to overturn and will stand or get even worse during their lifespan.
Bernie is likely to lose all the middle of the roaders and my bet is that Trump will get reelected because the majority of Americans don't want a radical turn to the left. They know that he cannot fulfill all his pie in the sky promises as you'll need a strong Dem majority in the senate and House. Without that, all those progressive ideas end up in the trash can as Bernie is not a bridgebuilder.
Vote strategically; isn't the ultimate goal to rid us from Trump and his radical fascist agenda? Again think of the young rightwing judges on the Supreme Court: their rulings will last a lifetime. Your lifetime!
Use all that progressive energy to take the senate instead? If you do, you might just get some of what you want.
2
Well, it’s an opinion..
Interesting that in the photograph accompanying this article I could spot no more than four people of color and about that many seemed over forty. I guess if Sanders was going to cancel my college debt I'd be for him too but I had to pay off that debt myself. But anyone who thinks that the demographic in that photograph alone is enough to win the electoral college is delusional.
1
I am so tired of people down selling Sanders and moaning about how he can’t beat Trump and/or that down-ballot candidates will suffer if Sanders is the nominee. All the naysayers are the same people who gave us Hillary and were sure she would win. How did that work out!?
It is distressing that establishment Democrats and media types would rather fear monger and contemplate taking the nomination away from Sanders if he gets to Milwaukee with a plurality of delegates, not a majority. Does no one recognize how undemocratic and elitist that would be!?
In my view, Biden is the worst candidate the party could put up. He represents the past, not the future, and I can’t tell you a single policy position that he has advanced to date. “Soul of the Nation”...what’s that!? I’ll tell you what it is. It’s a completely vacuous and forgettable campaign slogan that rivals Hillary’s “Better Together”.
I believe that if nominated, Biden will lose in a landslide. It will start with an embarrassing stumble in a debate and go downhill from there. Mark my words.
1
@Braxton and may it please also result in the complete rejection and universal disgust of the pundit class shoving JB down our throats - who pays them to tell us what to do?
Our elections are perverted by big and purposeful via Citizens United. It is our path to an Oligarchy. The top 5% of wealthy people are now the primary beneficiaries of our government and the laws written by it. The courts have have been loaded with, "conservatives" to assure that the wealth and the power that comes with it, is aggressively defended. The majority of people in this country have been pushed aside in service to wealth. Lies, manipulation and years of calculated cynicism have trained the masses to accept this. We bought into the lie and now we are paying for it. Trump is the result and even with this hard push to the edge of the precipice, the people of this country still don't get it. The Joe Biden's of our political leadership are complicit in this loss of power for the huge majority of the people in our Democracy. "More of the same" and the promise of "stability" will not stop our fall from grace, and if you don't believe that, then you have not been paying attention. I am not a Bernie fan. But I understand his position and feel that we need at the very least, someone like Elizabeth Warren who sees wealth disparities' danger. Billionaires and moderate Democrats will not fix this. Taking back from the rich and re-framing our Democracy so that it that serves us all, is going to take real effort and meaningful change. If we don't demand those changes, we will no longer be a Democracy. DT has forced the issue and exposed the lie. He is our wake up call. VOTE.
5
Does the alignment of the media, pundits, and Democratic Party against Sanders have a cost? By most metrics (donations, votes in primaries) so far he is the front runner. What will happen if the system is again manipulated to defeat him? Remember the DNC server kerfuffle? This time the orchestrated effort is more public, but the impact is the same. Millions of people are going to resent this orchestrated attempt to deny this man his day-- people who are choosing him over the others. I think the fallout is being underestimated by all involved.
1
"Most metrics" are from four states. Says very little.
Andrew
The voters will decide.
Once again I fear the pollsters will replicate their sampling errors from 2016. First, just because a sample is huge - 40,000 is insanely large - does NOT guarantee its representativeness. I'd need to know a lot more about how that sample was selected and gathered to give it any more weight than any other sample. Second, I want to know how they are defining "who is going to vote in 2020". THAT is the key question in the polling data and it is not answered in this column.
2
@it wasn't me Exactly right. It agrees with her narrative so she cloaks her personal agenda in the guise of 'science' but doesn't really check the science. It's misleading.
1
Trump will obliterate Sanders if he's the nominee. Biden isn't ideal, but no one in the middle or middle-right of the Democratic party is going to vote for Sanders. On top of all his Dem-bashing, he is just not someone who considers reaching across the aisle, and the aisle in this case is between his personal socialist party and the Democratic party. That is not a winning strategy.
8
My concerns about Bernie Sanders are several, first one is, that when you go to his web site no where does he explain how he will pay for his “free college,” nor how he will pay for “paying off everyone’s student loans.” My husband, an Independent, and fiscal conservative has read everything Bernie has put put and nothing convinces him that Sanders has a solid plan. In fact, my husband concluded that Bernie is lying to his Millennial supporters.
4
@Mari Your husband had drawn that conclusion before he read anything Sanders wrote.
As for paying for the program. Not buying 10 B1 Bombers should pay for almost all of it. The defense department has more than enough money and no one ever asks, how will we pay for these 30,000 tanks we never intend to use.
1
This analysis seems totally wrong. You're saying the most reliable Democratic voters will not vote or vote for Trump if Sanders is the nominee? I don't think there's much evidence of that. I'm not a huge Sanders fan (I voted for Bloomberg), but he's light years better than Biden. Getting voters who normally wouldn't bother showing up out to vote *could* be enough to win big in November. We won't know until it happens.
2
If Biden is the nominee, Trump wins the electoral college. Biden is a business-as-usual Democrat with no plan to address income inequality and get rid of private for-profit healthcare providers, which is what kept voters from showing up for Clinton in 2016 in key states. Conservatives, even moderate ones, will not vote for a “Republican-lite” Democrat when they can just vote for a Republican who has promised to overturn Roe v Wade. Conservatives see the political process as a war against “liberal ideology”, it’s about time Democrats understood and ran as bold progressives who champion working people instead of trying to appeal to imaginary centrists who would be ok with voting for a dangerous racist demagogue instead of a Democratic Socialist simply because they don’t want to pay more taxes so we can all benefit from a more generous social safety net.
4
I will vote for whom I believe is the best candidate.
It might be the only chance in a long time to have real change in America
1
The reasoning here assumes a Biden candidacy that is not subject to the constant stream of (sometimes) fake scandals that will naturally muddy things, much in the same way Hilary's email scandal did. I think what this analysis leaves unanswered, and unaddressed, is what those moderate Republican and independent likely voters will do in the likely 2020 context - a flood of Burisma, Burisma, Burisma! from Trump on the entire Republican party propped up by a media still trying to show itself as "fair" to "both sides," a depressed and disengaged sector of young voters (egged on perhaps by Trump himself) convinced Bernie was unjustly denied the ticket and willing to alienate the moderates with their (probably justified) righteous anger and frustration. How many moderate Republicans and Independents, in this context, will actually vote for Biden? I say not as many as these academics profess. How do you begin to measure that? There is no way. So those voting for Biden as a pragmatic solution to beating Trump, in my view, are just as delusional as Bernie supporters are in their claim to increased youth turnout. The difference is, Bernie stands for actual change, and has an actual movement. In my view, it's much better to at least try to beat Trump with a message of real, progressive change.
4
I think Bernie will hold a massive base of supporters that will give him far more than enough to capture the DNC candidacy. But then, as unfathomable as it might be, I think the DNC will not allow it to happen and go with Sleepy Joe. And as you wrote, it will tear the party to shreds. I already have a problem being associated with Democrats because of their continued failure throughout my 70 years. I voted for HRC but felt disgusted with that act. I've never understood why working class or even middle class people, white or black, would vote against their own self interests and those of the entire nation in sticking with the Democrats. It's probably because of the contrast with Republicans and their continually lowering standards. But still.... It is a puzzle to me.
3
Excellent points raised on both sides of the Bernie-Biden divide, but perhaps being overlooked at this juncture is the looming danger of the general election debates. Sanders would more than hold his own, as he has throughout the primary debates. But Biden v. Trump on the debate stage will underscore Joe's undeniable mental frailty, and his inevitable "gaffes" will be replayed and repurposed for Trump ads to the point of national (and international) humiliation. We cannot afford that risk.
7
Democrats who consider themselves progressives are torn between the "our way or the highway" populist progressives on their left and the compromising triangulating liberals on their right. This choice is represented by the Sanders and Biden campaigns, respectively. And perhaps the biggest factor in the choice is who is most likely to defeat Donald Trump. Another important factor is who is most likely to help win the Senate and House. The polling results described here represent one bit of information for deciding which side to support. The fate of this country may rest on this decision.
1
I am so tired of sanders same old rants and ravings and no answers on how he will pay for all his freebies.
The youngsters who think everything is owed to them need to grow up, get out of their parents basement and get a job. Nothing is free in this world and the middle class will once again, get stuck with taxes to pay for the sanders gravy train.
Remember kids, this will be you in another 10+ years.
Health care for all is very important but no one paid my student loans off, I actually worked and did that myself. And yes, when I was younger I had some pretty crappy jobs but with determination, ended up making pretty good money and believe me, there is pride and a sense of accomplishment when you do it yourself.
3
Two things jump out at me in this piece, both of which have been troubling me about Bernie. First, his plan for getting elected appears to require massive turnout among non-voters. Yes, that's possible but unlikely on the face of it; we call them NON-VOTERS for a reason, they don't typically vote. That Obama was able to bump participation among black voters only 5% shows how hard it is to actually increase voter participation, even with an extremely able, popular candidate. If Sander's plan is to turnout massive numbers of hitherto non-voting young people, that dog won't hunt.
Second, you touch on Bernie's stubbornness, which has bothered me since he talked about Castro's literacy program in Cuba. You can appreciate what Castro did to improve education and infant mortality in Cuba without doubling down, as Bernie seemed to do, to the massive discomfort of Cuban-American Florida Democrats. It was unnecessary to antagonize anti-Castro Cubans (Fidel will stay dead in any event). He could have talked about what he intended to do for Florida Cubans with family and connections in the old country. Here, you point out Bernie's apparent determination, I'd say stubborn determination, to pin his hopes on young voters, who typically don't turn out, rather that suburban women who typically do.
I just want a Democrat to defeat Trump, and an unrealistic game plan, stubbornly pursued, will not get it done imo.
8
@Arthur Marroquin
If non-voters don't vote, the converse is also true: voters vote.
Are there really voters who prefer Biden to Trump, but Trump to Bernie Sanders?
I just don't see it. Either Trump is a wannabe dictator who flouts the rule of law and undermines every institution that sustains the Republic... or he's not. This election is a referendum on Donald J Trump. If you don't see Trump's re-election as an existential threat to survival of the Republic, you're probably voting for him regardless of who the Democrats nominate.
6
Here's a quick example of why I think this writer is incorrect in her assessment:
My mother, a right-leaning independent in her 60s, would have voted for Bernie over Trump in 2016. She, like millions of others across the country, would never vote for a Clinton, and agreed enough with some of Trump's positions and his politically incorrect ways to vote for him in 2016 as an agent of change. (She voted for Obama for similar reasons.) She's now grown exhausted with his misbehavior, and wonders if a strong economy has been worth it.
Don't discount the voters who consider personality just as much as policy - many of whom seem to have had it with Trump. To my mother, Bernie at least seems like a decent, honest guy, and that's enough to get her vote at this point.
9
@Brian, how does your mom feel about Biden?
I've been a Warren supporter this entire campaign but this morning I'll be voting for Biden. I'm a lifelong progressive Latino and I'm also pragmatic. The consolidation around Biden over the last few days has convinced me that a vote for Warren is a throwaway vote. A vote for Sanders, in my opinion, is unwise if not foolish, as Goldberg has reasonably pointed out in this column. Biden was probably my 4th choice for most of the primaries. Now I'm in his camp.
That being said, if Sanders wins the nomination I'll be all in for him, bumper stickers, lawn signs, and donations. The goal is beating Trump. I hope my fellow Democrats put their differences aside and commit to that goal, no matter what happens.
10
@Tony, same with us in WA state. I wanted Elizabeth, but I’m leaning towards Biden.
2
The biggest thing holding Sanders back is resentful "Resistance" fighters who still blame him and his supporters for Clinton's loss in 2016.
2
@Talbot Not the biggest thing. Just as the main obstacle to Clinton winning in 2016 was Clinton herself, the main thing holding back Sanders is Bernie himself.
2
@Talbot, nope. We are worried that the Millennials won’t vote! And we need everyone to unite and vote if we are to beat 45. I have two Millennial kids, they vote, we taught them the importance for it, but what about everyone else?
2
This is why left-wing establishment politics fail in America. Republicans see poll they don't like and do their best to move the numbers. They talk to people, they make their case, and as often as not they can move the electorate.
Corporate Dems, on the other hand, point to polls as an obstacle and assume that poll numbers can NEVER be moved. This is absurd, and flies in the face of all historical data we have.
You will never get progress that you don't fight for.
4
Teixeira's analysis of the 2018 electorate appears to contradict other published analyses which indicate that the increased turnout for Democrats was mostly Democratic voters, not Republican switchers.
1
Yes we can!
3
"...those of us with doubts that America would elect a Jewish democratic socialist president..."
Nobody cares that he's Jewish. I voted for him and his Jewishness could not have been more irrelevant. People who say "so and so can't be elected because (insert race, gender, ethnicity) project their own misgivings about race, gender, and ethnicity onto other voters. It's psychology 101.
6
@David If Bernie is the nominee, you'll find out just how relevant it is to some people (a certain number pro, but overwhelmingly con). That's Politics 101.
Wow, pundits such as MG predicted there was zero chance Trump could beat Clinton, yet here we are 4 years later taking these same folks’ opinions seriously again? Amazing. Stop with the prognostications and write something original please!
6
Bernie Sanders is not a Democrat. He has declared the Democratic Party his “enemy.” “Vote Blue no matter who” does not apply to him.
4
Obviously Blue isn’t what it used to be or could be.
The Hordes Of Bernie Fans apparently took the weekend off in S.C.. Right ???
4
This is what worries me! That the Bernie supporters won’t vote!
1
Bernie Sanders is too far left-wing progressive for the corrupt crony capitalist corporate plutocrat oligarch likes of Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping.
Jesus Christ of Nazareth was a left-wing community organizing pacifist socialist.
I seriously doubt one-time Presidential campaign loser Bernie Sanders is either Dick Nixon in 1968 or Ronnie Reagan in 1980.
There is no precedent for a two-time Presidential campaign loser like Joe Biden winning his 1st primary ever garnering the nomination of his party and being elected President of the United States.
1
If you want a revolutionary POTUS—Vote for a woman.
If you want the smartest candidate to be our next POTUS—Vote for the woman.
If you want you want someone who has shown us her health status and has prover to be healthy—Vote for the woman.
If you want someone who can think fast on their feet—Vote for the woman.
Who is the he most prepared candidate who can fix trumps dumpster fire, run circles around him and beat trump—the woman.
Break your addiction to believing old, white men can save our country, because it isn’t working.
Vote for Elizabeth Warren because she’s the best candidate running and she will start fixing what trumps destroyed on Inauguration Day.
6
Michelle, as you may or may not have noticed, both the American people and the Chinese people are ready for a "Revolution Against Empire". [Justin du Rivage]
My own optimism is reflected in my comment to your column here, and IMHO, the growing support in the people of China regarding rising up against Empire and virtual Emperors may well equal or even exceed the coming of a brave and principled people's peaceful and complete "Shout (not shot) heard round the world" to ignite an essential "Political/economic & social(ist) Revolution Against Empire".
We are approaching a truly global "Revolution Against Empire" --- as Geremie R. Barmé's 3/3 article of "China’s Coronavirus Crisis Is Just Beginning" demonstrates the beginning of people around the world ---- within which all the people of 'our' world are igniting, in our mutual choice of global democracy over Global Empire:
Where, then, is the country headed as it increasingly stymies the rights of its citizens and stifles civil society?
“True Men” had come forward to defend it. Now, Xu Zhiyong was pointing out caustically to Mr. Xi:
“How can you expect there to be a ‘True Man’ when you, The Revered One, sit at the pinnacle with millions fawning at the foot of your throne? Autocracy encourages sycophants to crowd around the Emperor, but this particular Emperor’s new clothes are on full display for all to see. Yet, even now, the people of China dare not ‘comment inappropriately’ about what is in front of them."
1
A lot of Democrats, myself included, will need to hold their noses, but .... Vote Blue No Matter Who, whether it is Joe, Bernie, Mike or Winnie the Pooh.
4
So disappointed in your anti Bernie Sanders columns. And also on the other hand but really part of the same thing is the Democratic establishment desperate to support Biden! Really!??? He cannot beat Trump. I think democrats establishment secretly doesn’t care so much about beating trump as they do keeping the status quo. Getting re-elected and holding onto power is really vastly more important than saving the planet, creating housing, infrastructure and helping the working class.It is truly disturbing and disgusting. I will support Bernie. And I cannot get behind Biden because it will be 4 more years of trump. Pretty soon you all at y he NYT will be supporting Bloomberg.
From 1950 to 2000, Democrats and Republicans largely gravitated towards each other, leapfrogging to hold an economic center that ended with globalization and the internet.
They have pulled towards their ideological centers once more, but the outdated terms "national socialist" and "democratic socialist" no longer mean what they did from 1900 to 1950. They are still catchy news media phrases, tho, for sources who don't actually believe that Trump is a Nazi and that Sanders is a Communist.
1
I think Bernie could mollify status quo Dems by choosing Klobuchar as his running mate. She is a Midwestern female who would be a counterweight to Bernie in virtually all respects. And she is much younger and in good health.
2
Many of the 'swing' voters, or the White working class we are told are almost entirely single issue voters. The issue is guns. Sanders is reviled by some Democrats for not having a perfect 0 rating from the NRA. This is why Sanders is the most electable. The usual Republican scare tactic, 'they are coming for your guns!' This will not work on Sanders. Isn't this a good reason Sanders will win among the vaunted 'White swing voters'?
2
Many comments about Bernie's ability to secure many small contributions - but has anyone considered that there are people with money to give who are sitting on the sidelines? Prime examples are my brother, my parents and me. We are all staunch Democrats, have given money to local and national candidates in the past and will Vote Blue No Matter Who - but none of us has made a contribution to any candidate thus far, as the field has been too crowded and the infighting unhealthy. We've been investing in Congressional and Senatorial campaigns for now. That will change when the nominee is chosen.
2
Young people and their allies are painfully aware of the Climate Crisis - this is an extremely consequential factor in the stakes of this election and shouldn't be ignored.
Bernie refuses to seek funding from the corporate powers that have enriched the few at the expense of a viable ecosystem.
Greenpeace and Sunrise Movement both rate Bernie strongest on the environment, with Sunrise Movement endorsing him by name and actively lending their youthful energy to elect him as the climate champion of choice. These organizations are not agonizing over the tea leaves of poll numbers, but are focused on the foremost issue that always already unites every single one of us.
I trust Bernie to prioritize the grandchildren of the world. He is virtually guaranteed not to be a sell-out, and we are absolutely out of time for magical thinking that somehow a moderate approach to bottom-line profiteering will allow for the transformative re-prioritization now necessary to save our only home.
3
So much of the debate over Sanders comes down to this: people are afraid of change. Sanders represents change, Biden doesn’t, period. You can come up with any rationalization you like for Biden over Sanders, but it’s all about fear of change. Change, to many people, is terrifying. But to me, the status quo is even more terrifying (and by status quo I mean Biden, not Trump). There are absolutely no possible scenarios in which a Sanders presidency could be anywhere near as bad as Trump. None. Which makes it all the more depressing that given the choice between change (Sanders) and mere “stability” in Biden (stability being a code word for “no change from past Democratic presidents”) non-Trumpers choose to be cowardly. As a nation, with climate change and now pandemics looming, we are far beyond the point where “stability” will save us. Big solutions require radical change—not incremental. If we choose the status quo, if we choose the solace of normalcy, we all deserve what we get from the cumulative impact of our presence on the planet. (And believe me—Trump’s impact is nothing compared to what is looming worldwide.)
5
You have that exactly backwards. The majority of us are sensible enough to understand that a Bernie candidacy will likely mean another four years of Donald Trump.
Best case scenario:
Democrats win the White House, the Senate, and retain the House.
Livable scenario:
Democrats win the White House, Congress stays as is.
Horrifying scenario:
Democrats lose the White House (Trump even more COMPLETELY off the chain), Congress stays as is.
Apocalyptic scenario:
Democrats lose Electoral College AND lose both houses of Congress.
I don’t see any room on Bernie’s coattails for our very moderate Democrats in Virginia. A Bernie candidacy, in the opinion of all the liberal Virginians I know, increases the likelihood of the horrifying and apocalyptic scenarios.
8
Buttigieg and Klobuchar each suddenly decide on the eve of Super Tuesday to switch to Biden. And Elizabeth Warren is to stay in to the convention. While David Leonhardt simultaneously explains to us, in all seriousness, "Your choice is Sanders or Biden." And now, Michelle Goldberg explains why Sanders won't bring new voters into the Democratic Party. Hmmmm. It sure seems as if the DNC/"liberal" media fix is finally taking root.
4
The best way Bernie supporters can stick-it to the DNC and media elite, is to vote Trump in November.
Sarah Oh
What a crazy thing to say! Conspiracy theories are for the ignorant and the disingenuous.
Buttegeig and Klobuchar looked at their numbers and made a thoughtful and reasonable decision. No way forward for them. They should be applauded for making the very unselfish decision to drop out so the rest of us can figure out who will be the best candidate to beat trump.
BTW Klobuchar was my choice. I donated to her campaign and hoped she would catch on.
The main reason I’m not voting for Bernie, now or ever, is because of the vicious, paranoid, conspiracy-mongering rhetorical style he’s inspired. “Corporate shill.” “Snake.” “Establishment conspiracy.” You should be embarrassed.
Your efforts to hack away at Sanders' chances mirrors the desperation of the DNC...you know, those folks who think they knew what was best for us way back in, oh, 2016? Write about something where you can at least pretend to be a real journalist and save you soap-boxing for Warren for that remote chance she'll ask both you and you husband to chip in and actually speak in front of a crowd of people.
3
"The youth vote will turn out in record numbers" Just look at the proof: Dukakis, Gore, Kerry, Clinton, etc.
1
@Dr. Pangloss
Right. They were all status quo candidates.
It would be a pleasure to see Michelle Goldberg refrain from talking on the weekly podcast about how much she would love to see Bernie elected, followed by a concern trolling column talking about how that is impossible, unlikely, deeply worrying or problematic his candidacy is.
I admit that it provides a slightly different Stop Bernie note from those sounded by Collins, Friedman, Stephens, Krugman, Bruni, Blow, Cohen, Dowd, Leonhardt, et al.
But not VERY different.
2
If I wanted someone endlessly windmilling his arms and shouting, someone Marxist who never met a communist regime he didn't like, someone with trillion dollar plans that have no hope of fruition, then I'd vote Bernie. Or even if smoking pot was my primary cause and life's meaning, yay Bernie.
2
Lol. Joe is not the answer to Bernie. Did deeper people.
2
Sanders has no chance. This country is not quite ready to have a Marxist as president. Give us a few more years of spoon fed propaganda and then we’ll be ready.
1
Trump will trounce stammer goofy Biden.
OK, eviscerate him. That's more accurate.
Go Sen Warren...PLZ
3
Yes Sanders can.
Are we going to pretend Nevada didn’t happen?
Step out of your comfort zone and read what investigative reporter Greg Palast (dot com) is doing in Georgia.
The Crosscheck Purge list that stole the 2016 election has been released by a Federal Judge in Georgia and anti establishment Democratic last names that have and will vote for Sanders nation wide. The revolution is ON.
3
You say you want a revolution?
Well so do I! I am so sick of watching the status quo stifle our best and brightest with ridiculous college loans. We actually have the STUPIDITY to charge INTEREST in those loans. At the same time our politicians dole out BILLIONS of dollars in corporate welfare. What in god's name is WRONG with us?!
We are facing an existential threat to our democracy from the "Orange gas-bag of lies" in the Oval Office. If anyone can feel otherwise after listening to DJT move his mouth for ten minutes, you must simply think that being able to use racial and sexist slurs in the presence of others of your persuasion is more important than our democracy.
But if you think that you are going to see young voters pull the lever on four years of same ol' same ol' from the DNC playbook, then you really do NOT get how FED UP today's left-of-center voter feels. We are tired of seeing millionaires and billionaires con everyone into thinking that if we don't let them own the world, than the rest of us will somehow break it.
After the 2008 financial crisis, we should have confiscated the bank accounts of those who caused it. TODAY, we'd like to see a commitment from the Democratic candidate saying DJT will be indicted on day TWO of our new president's term in office! I don't see Joe Biden giving us that. He is pretending that we are starting Barack Obama's third term. That is simply not going to cut it. For us, that ship sailed FOUR YEARS AGO!
5
Which of your family members works for a "stop Bernie" candidate?
2
Now come on all you “Berners” and all you “moderates” too! Republicans vote R all the way down the ballot, every time! The RNC mails out sample ballots, already filled out, telling them exactly who to vote for! While I personally find that disgusting, that’s the kind of “party loyalty” it’s going to take to defeat them in this election cycle! Then you can go back to constantly fighting amongst yourselves.
2
Here's the key difference between Bernie Sanders and Joe Biden:
Sanders is Grandpa with a New York accent in a wrinkled shirt.
Joe Biden is an Everyman Leader (his gee-whiz aside).
3
You are on the money. Study history. What has happened to fringe candidates, whether they be Goldwater or McGovern. And, does anyone truly believe America would elect a Jewish President, particularly in today's increased level of ethnic hatred? Only Biden has a chance to defeat the evil force in the White House.
3
What happens to the moderate candidates Mondale, Dukakis, Gore, Kerry, Clinton?
Michelle, as always you provide a lot of political science, socioeconomic , and statistical 'big data' proof --- or what passes for truth --- regarding these proffered claims of your, "doubts that America would elect a Jewish democratic socialist".
However, you might want to open up your insight to a time when a two millennia earlier dark-complexioned Jewish democratic socialist came to earth to confront the then nearly global Roman Empire and attempted to overturn humanities Empire and Emperor deadly oppression, tyranny, and inequality with nothing but Love (for which he received the consolation prize of death).
We have now been living through over three millennia of perceived and nearly global Empires --- from ancient regimes of Egyptian Empire, to the Roman Church-centric age of Empire, and according to Paul Kennedy in his:"Rise and Fall of the Great Powers 1500 to 2000", Empires; British, French, Nazi, Japanese, et. al. and the next to the last Soviet "Evil Empire" (aren't they all, Ronnie?).
IMHO, we, the human species, now face a Disguised Global Crony Capitalist Empire which not only portends to be global, but which makes our coming choices (particularly in America under symptom Emperor Trump) a new chance for redemption with an American people's peaceful and complete Second American "Political/economic & social(ist) Revolution Against Empire".
When we go to vote there are only 2 levers; one labeled 'democracy' and the other 'EMPIRE' for God's and our sake.
2
It seems rich wall street liberals are forcing Biden on us as Sanders will stop their looting of America.
8
I love you for stating the truth, Ugly and Fat Git. Thank you.
1
Democrats deserve a nominee who actually loves America—not a man who when he contemplates America sees only a hateful legacy of classist, racist oppression.
1
Wow! The Democrat establishment is out with blazing guns hunting for Bernie. The NYT has three articles against him just tonight. The Superdelegates and Bloomberg are promoting contested convention. Hope Bernie’s heart can withstand this assault.
2
This is malarkey; why are these pollsters credible?
1
The question is can he count on your vote, Michelle?
1
The Bernie Wave is Coming ! Respectfully, please ask your husband to ask Liz Warren to drop out or just endorse Biden too .
Bernie Sanders-he’s what’s for breakfast, lunch and dinner starting January 2021.
1
It might be news to some but in a country that worships money it comes as no surprise that the majority of people who come the polls do so to protect their tight little fists’ grip on it.
2
You have no real evidence. All you have is your own desired outcome and you attempt to frame it that way.
The NYT has made it clear it doesn't want Bernie but thank Gd you can't make people vote the way you wish. Have you done any research on the declining influence of editorials on vote counts?
4
Despite my city, I've never been on board for Bernie, but hack article after hack article, I've read about why Bernie will fail while he keeps earnestly chugging along. I've always liked BIden, but the Democratic party seems determined to put their finger on the scale.....again. please dont.
4
Well, I guess we'll never know......again.
1
I am a reliable voter - have not missed an election since voting for JFK in 1960 - any election including local, state and federal. I voted for Klobuchar in the primary though now it won’t matter and I will vote for Biden for President if I have to write him in. I will
Not vote for Sanders.
3
Come on USA ,this is your opportunity to create a more just & equitable society. Health care for the rich & poor alike. Programs to help the less fortunate be independent.
Nordic countries are compassionate & are much happier & healthier.
Bernie Sanders exudes passion & commitment. I would be thrilled if he becomes president.
For those who fear a hit on their pocketbook I would suggest that more caring social policies will cost less in the long run.
Your system favours it's well off & privileged , time is ripe for change.
5
Fair enough. If Sanders is the nominee, I hope the party will give him constructive help in reaching out to all voters. And if that support consists of more than just flat demands that he completely abandon his platform (we all know he won't), I hope he'll be receptive.
But you're right, Ms. Goldberg; let's see what the Super Tuesday results tell us about Sanders turnout before jumping to conclusions.
1
With a Biden presidency we could return to the days of the Obama administration, when Republicans reached across the aisle to enact legislation that helped average working Americans. Remember all that bi-partisan accomplishment? Neither do I. We need a progressive president who doesn't know the word compromise when it comes to fighting for the working class. The oligarchs control a corrupt Republican Congress and they will treat Biden just like they treated Obama. Remember Merick Garland. Nice gets nothing in D.C.
4
As we move into a time of global pandemic, as a Canadian, I know that if I or anyone in my community feels ill, we can contact a doctor without consideration of what it may cost and whether we can afford it. It’s somewhat reassuring to me to knowing that.
What is not reassuring is that although Canadians, like Americans, must seriously consider the loss of income involved in staying home when feeling sick, and many low wage workers in strategic areas of the economy, such as the food and service industries , could therefore become vectors of spreading the virus through the community. At this moment, this is a major weakness in our defences.
What is most frightening is that I know that if I lived only 60 miles to the south, the cost of calling a doctor would be a very serious consideration and might cause me to delay until it was too late. The existence of the private health care system in the US complicates and exacerbates the problem of containing the virus on the continent as a whole.
6
According to a 2010 Duke study, 25% of Clinton's primary voters in 2008 voted for McCain. So what's the point, really?
The double standards and wrongful stigmatizations aren't helpful.
If there's any chance of beating Trump, Biden would need to move on from Obama's legacy and stop dismissing all progressive ideas, Bernie would need to broaden his appeal and emphasize his work on Obamacare (100% support record, plus successful amendments) and his legislative work with McCain.
4
“When parties nominate candidates further from the center, it actually inspires the other party to turn out,” he told me.
Then turnout in the general against Trump should be pretty high, regardless of the nominee.
A lot of the people complaining about how Bernie hasn't turned out like they'd hoped are forgetting that he turned out Latino voters in Nevada en masse, which is a voting bloc that Democrats have long wanted to capture. My hope is that California and Texas show us more of the same.
7
I am 24 years old and I have friends who probably won't vote at all come election day. I feel that at least I have a chance to convince them to vote if Bernie is our candidate. You might call them Bernie-or-bust voters, but honestly they just aren't that political. Bernie would be the only candidate I can see bringing them out to vote, even if that's only because I will push them to vote for Bernie every single day if I have to. If Biden is our nominee, I'd probably remind them to vote once or twice. Perhaps that is on me, my vote is in MA while my friends are in PA. A lot of it probably relies on Biden's debate performances without Pete or Amy now.
4
Is your objective to "erode" voters' "comfort" that we might finally get someone in the White House that is fighting for what Americans need and have long aspired for by sighting academic "studies" that seem to go against polls?
When lose or draw, the establishment is throwing every compromised asset in its corporate arsenal at Bernie to make sure that giant multi-national "citizens" and the oligarchs and plutocrats behind them keep their stranglehold on the government, keep big money as the main driver of political decision making and keep all of us average Americans from having a voice in government.
Which side are you on?
5
@Tom Paine I'm on the side that beats Trump; not an un-vetted socialist, extremist, populist idealogue cult-leader with zero noteworthy accomplishments as a senator after multiple decades who will inspire a stampede of GOP voters to rush to the polls in November. Oh, and he's not a Democrat and, if 2016 is any indication, he will do whatever he can to sabotage the Democratic nominee. Between his unpalatable positions and the anti-socialist sentiment in this country, he is 100% unelectable.
5
@Ed
Bernie beats Trump in every poll. Bernie is socially responsible, battle tested Senator, who didn't vote for Jim Crow incarceration laws, didn't vote for the war in Iraq and all their laws.
Bernie didn't champion the TBTF Wall Street Bank, Credit Card Companies and payday lender and the rest of the crooked lobbyists but joins Liz Warren in fighting such corruption.
As I said, between the 2005 Bankruptcy act to help the super rich usury business turn Americans into debt slaves "act" Joe championed and his major leadership role in helping put millions of African Americans in jail through his support of all the worst Jim Crow, highly racist votes on drug war policies, mandatory minimums and "throw away the key" racist policies, I don't care if he can "also" beat Trump.
We don't need another trojan horse for the TBTF, we need People in our government fighting for the same rights that every other socially responsible major industrialized capitalistic country has. Bernie is an FDR style Democrat and I know who Eleanor likely would have chosen.
Joe is a political hack in my view and a good one.
Bernie is a true public servant and believes that every American should have excellent health care, a roof over their head and that excellent, free education and an economy based on innovation and execution of Green Technology is how we put Americans back to work and save our planet.
Sanders says FDR was called a socialist too and his ideas were truly revolutionary as well. That's true, but FDR became president when the country was on the verge of an economic and political collapse.
Sanders is running with unemployment at an all-time low, the lower 50% accumulating wealth faster than any time in history, and 78% of Americans predicting 2020 will be their best financial year.
Other differences: FDR criticized evil. Sanders doesn't seem to be able to criticize Castro or Maduro and he blames Trump for Iran's horrific human rights violations.
FDR supported the rights of Jews to an independent country and his Vice-President was the first leader to recognize Israel. Sanders wants to give foreign aid to Hamas, a terrorist organization, and calls the democratically elected leader of Israel a "racist" because he doesn't like the results of Israel's election.
FDR didn't propose more spending than our GDP and then offer no way to pay for it, unless you have "2 hours". He didn't lie and say there are 87 million uninsured and underinsured Americans when there are 20 million uninsured Americans and no underinsured Americans (minimum insurance coverage is federally mandated).
At the Vegas debate, Sanders told the culinary union Medicare is better than private insurance. If that's so why isn't Sanders on Medicare?
Sanders isn't FDR. FDR wasn't a fraud and a Marxist. That educated Americans can't see this doesn't say much for our educational system.
10
@HGreenberg
Don't believe everything you on the Internet. It is a cesspool of misinformation.
By the way, how did Trump pay for his tax cuts? How did Congress pay for the - what? - 80 billion gifted to the military? How does Biden pay for expanded ACA and what will he do if the supreme court declares it unconstitutional? That is a real possibility. Will Biden join the Republicans in their efforts to cut Social Security and Medicare/Medicaid as he has four times in the past?
5
Just because minimum insurance mandated by Federal Government doesn't mean it will protect people from devastating medical bills . Remember, surprised bills are not paid by insurance. And in Law Vegas Bernie was talking about his M4A, not about Medicare now.
A politician is a fool if he does not try to persuade a potential voter to switch allegiances.
Every vote should count.
Haven't we learned anything since 2000 and 2016?
2
Nobody knows anything. Sorry that only makes everyone more afraid but... In sports they say about the world champs that sometimes the other team "just wanted it more." Trump wants it. He needs it to literally keep out of jail. He needs it to further enrich himself. In a strange or not so strange way, Bloomberg "wants" it. He is driven by ego and return on investment. The only other one who seems to "want" it in the same way is Sanders. He has been fighting and campaigning for it for 5 years. Biden and the others see it as a call to duty because Trump is so abhorrent. You can just hear it and see it in their speeches.
It's amazing how for the last three days the Democratic Party has "Mean-Girled" Sanders. Where exactly does the party think that he and his millions of supporters are going to go? Just quietly off into the good night? It is so obvious about the back door politics with Pete, Amy and Beto. This party all of a sudden cares about down ballot races ever since Bernie took the lead. Young, new, Democrats will go to the polls to vote for Bernie. Who else do you think that they are going to vote for down on their ballot? The Republican Congressperson or judge?
Biden has never given any real response about his son and Burisma. Trump will beat it into the ground. The GOP is already pushing it full steam in the media. The message that will get through to the Bernie people about Biden if he is the nominee is that Biden is corrupt too. They will stay home again.
5
I just don't see how Sanders can win over Trump when 70% of voters call themselves conservative or moderate. Trump's minions will make mincemeat of Sanders - Socialism, Communism, positive talk about Cuba, women's rape fantasy essay, being a deadbeat dad for over 10 years, "free everything" programs for Millenenials, no real job until 40 years old, not passing any legislation of substance while being in the Senate for 25 years, being anti business... the list goes on and on. He will lose, well end up with a Trump Administration that will do whatever it wants.
5
@kcl Why does the GOP need an opposition strategist when you have basically outlined all of Bernie's fatal flaws in a single paragraph?
As we should be painfully aware from 2016-when Clinton was beating Trump in nearly every poll-don’t believe the polls! While I respect Bernie-he alienates many voters especially crossover ones that the Dems really need! Remember, if you can’t win you can’t achieve anything!!
4
And how do we know that He alienates the voters?
1
While there may be "little evidence a progressive candidate can remake the electorate" (whatever "remake" might mean), there's plenty of evidence (2016) that a corporate democrat like Biden (she, whose name shall not be mentioned) in the neoliberal mold of a Republican-lite candidate will lose.
So Michelle, do you wanna take a chance at winning with Sanders, or do you wanna do the sure thing and lose with Biden?
4
@Kip Leitner ...except she who remains nameless won the popular vote and would have also won the electoral college if it wasn't for meddling by Russia, Comey and Wiki-leaks.
3
So, the Republican lite party, disguised as Democrats, has struck again, by betting on Biden. A man without the natural desire to challenge Hilary Clinton four years ago. Clinton went on to run a campaign of entitlement supported by the establishment, while Sanders continued to grow a movement. Biden? He hibernated as the entitled habitually do. Now, the Democratic establishment, ably assisted by the usual unimaginative suspects, fault Sanders for being too angry about the fact that Democrat and Republican establishments helped to create the ugly, ultra partisan conditions that currently exist in Washington DC. Conditions that favor the wealthy. They tell voters to ignore Sanders and Warren. Why? Because both dare to eschew flim flam politics for the real truth. They're all in now, for a man who spent eight years as Vice President, but has no self built organization behind him. A man now propped up by losing opponents like Klobuchar, Buttigieg and O'Rourke is their wedge against Sanders. The same lite crowd that repeatedly allow Republicans to bully them, from Clinton to Obama, now tell us that Biden will be different, "because only he can beat Trump". They whine more about so called bully tactics from Bernie Bros, than they do about elected Republicans gleefully kicking them around Capitol Hill on a daily basis, like dirty rags. They bet on Biden, "to bring everyone together" they say, because he did that so effectively as a Senator and Obama's VP?
5
How sad to get your inspiration on who to vote for by interviewing political science professors and consulting polls. Vote for the person which you feel has the best policies and stop trying to read other voters' minds before making your vote.
4
@John How is moving farther to the left going to reduce partisanship?
Trump, to his everlasting discredit, can't unite the county. Heck, he seems to actively hate more than half of it. Trump intentionally trolls Democratic politicians and candidates (except Bernie). He counter-programs rallies during Dem events like debates and primaries. And the divisive tweets never stop. He's the meanest of mean kids who never left middle school.
My point in mentioning this is that it should take a big tent to win an election and then bring the country together. It also takes a degree of forbearance and toleration for alternative views. And I'm concerned Bernie and many of his most ardent supporters totally miss this bigger point.
Instead the movement seems to consist of too many true believers, sometimes bordering on cultish. While I suspect there's more than a small amount of malicious trolling among these comments, the depiction of moderates and pragmatists within the Democratic coalition as sellouts or DINO's is disappointing, to say the least.
If the majority of Dem primary voters prefer someone other than Bernie, and their delegates can coalesce around that nominee, then that's what our democratic process requires. It shouldn't matter whether that's what the DNC or 'insiders' or the 'establishment' want.
The sooner we can form a working majority capable of winning a broad mandate, the easier it will be to win races up and down the ballot and then govern and legislate. I'd settle for ousting Trump, but I'm hoping for much more.
2
Yesterday Ms. Goldberg wrote yet another endorsement piece for Elizabeth Warren. She previously disclosed that her husband worked for the Warren campaign. And today yet another hit piece on Bernie Sanders, not her first, appears in The Times, referencing a polling study that has been published everywhere else. Warren was the editorial pick of this publication for President. So is Ms. Goldberg being compensated by the Warren campaign? Is her husband being compensated at a greater level because Ms. Goldberg is helping him do his job? Is The Times encouraging this arrangement? Certainly the editors are not telling Ms. Goldberg it is not a good idea for her to continue her online campaign for Warren despite her husband's position with the campaign. Why doesn't Ms. Goldberg, a gifted thinker and writer, write something other than campaign pieces for her husband's boss or hit pieces trashing Warren's opponents?
5
Bernie got 26% of the vote in New Hampshire—his lily white backyard—barely squeaking past an unknown small-town mayor.
Not exactly an overwhelming mandate.
7
Uh... how about that Latino vote in Nevada?
sounds right. thank you.
Bernie’s aspirations are good, well-intentioned — but this country, in the wake of the chaos of the Trump administration, is not ready for or seeking revolution. Remember that Trump ran on a similar theme — drain the swamp, eviscerate the government bureaucracy, aka ‘the deep State.’ Never forget that Bannon — and Gorka and Miller — all wanted to tear down the structures that we have. How’s that going?
3
If it is down to Trump & Bernie, then Trump will wipe the floor with Bernie during the debates and expose him for what a communist he is.
Trump 2020
Bernie NEVER
The Dem vote in Nevada was up 20 per cent.
2
We will see in a short while, won’t we.
1
The Dem party establishment has gone from 'Hope and Change" to:
"Hope for no-Change"
4
Like Pelosi said, "With Trump all roads lead to Putin." So make a political ad with the hammer and sickle behind Trump's head before the Repuglicans do it to Bernie.
All these statistics in the article don't mean much if one thinks back to 2016 when the pundits were all oh so wrong about Trump. Good to see that Pete, Steyer and Klobuchar left the race. Warren should leave as well as much as I like her. As usual the voter gets to vote on the least of evils for candidate and president.
It doesn't get any more evil than the Trump. Kids in cages, assaults on women, incompetent appointments, government by superstition, environmental destruction, more nuclear weapons we don't need, inability to maintain alliances, stock market bust, trillion dollar national debt runup to give tax breaks to his corporate shills, psychopathic lying, embarrassing bathos of self aggrandizement, paranoiac projection of his failings and weaknesses on to others, inability to take responsibility for mistakes, love affairs with Kim Jong Un and Putin, racist attack on a judge, slander of honest Americans. Every morning a new chapter in failure and disgrace for the US and any remaining values be they moral or ethical.
5
Disclosure: her husband works for Warren.
2
These are the same pundits who said that Trump could never win. Why do they even waste their time writing such opinions?
3
Elizabeth Warren is a very intelligent woman. She would make a great president but.....
She has been in the lower tier in each of the elections. She needs to take a que from Pete and Amy and do whats best for the country
3
By now I have become highly skeptical about NYT coverage of these elections. Most of it seem to be in the interest of 1% rather than facts and evidence.
2
@Mr. N Did you actually read the article? It is nothing but facts and quotes from others who performed their own data analyses. Sure, you can question the methodology, but you cannot honestly say that the article lacked substance.
1
I wish Warren would quit! She has no chance. She is staying only to persecute Bloomberg tonight at the debate. Just watch!
The worst type of women. (And I am not a man).
1
Et tu Michelle? Have you become so timid?
Do you really think that all the readers who rely on you to speak for the exploited and oppressed will follow you in supporting a tired centrist who lacked the moral courage to oppose the catastrophic invasion of Iraq?
Joe Biden also lacks any vision for the future. He is Hillary Redux but lacks her intellect.
Sorry I could support either Warren or Sanders.
But Biden. Nope. Nada. Never.
3
Bernie Sanders 2020.
Shades of George McGovern 1972.
1
Joe Biden 2020. Shades of Walter Mondale 1984.
1
Really? After four decades of voting for the Dems, working as an engineer/scientist my entire career, and I'm going to have vote for one of two yelling white men that behave just like the nasty bosses I've had all my life? The arrogance of these old white men in even entering the race shines bright. Bernie better start acting with way more humility if the Dems are going to win.
2
That’s exactly what they said about Trump...
1
All this talk is a real downer.
Hillary couldn't beat Trump, how the heck is Biden gonna do it? Wasn't the impeachment all about Biden? Too many skeletons in and out of the closet...
Our family is financially stable and if things get really bad here, we can pack up and leave. Primary care docs are in need all over the world, but what's going to happen to the millions of Americans living pay check to paycheck, going into bankruptcy due to health care costs?
Every man for himself, that's the American way these days...
1
My nightmare scenario about a no-compromise President Sanders is this: if he winds up with a Democratic-controlled Senate and House, and they send him a bill to shore up Obamacare and reinstate the non-compliance penalty to render moot the current Supreme Court case against it, he'll veto it, costing 30 million Americans their health insurance, and then try to game the ensuing chaos to implement Medicare-for-All.
In the process of course he would fail, we wouldn't get Medicare-for-All, and the Dems would lose control of both houses of Congress in 2022 and the presidency in 2024.
Meanwhile I can see a President Biden signing such a bill, expanding access to health care, and then sign a repeal of the Trump Tax cut to pay for implementing a Medicare-For-55+. Incremental. And since 55+ people are the core of the GOP, the GOP would not dare take that away from them or campaign against it.
3
You often hear that Biden has "a baggage". Maybe it is time to talk about Sanders's baggage. It's a different kind from Biden, but perhaps heavier. He's been in the Senate for a million years and hasn't done anything. He does not know how to govern, how to build coalitions to get things done. He is an inflexible ideologue who (as Trump) is capitalizing on a broader disillusionment with the political establishment. His admiration for the Soviet style autocracies is a truly worrying trait that he exhibited numerous times throughout his political lifetime. It is all a baggage if you ask me.
6
Why is everyone so excited about Joe Biden winning the South Carolina primary? It's arguably the most conservative state in the union, and will go to Trump anyway in November.
2
@Allison Because it was a referendum on Bernie's support among black people. Without the support of black people, the Democratic candidate is toast. So, based on SC, Bernie does appear to be somewhat charred and crispy around the edges.
2
@Ed: You mean a referendum on Bernie's support among religious conservative black people. Black people are not a monolith.
1
Here we are again the DNC picking the same old same old. Sanders is right about them in a panic. It would also seem that half the Democratic party dose not care for FDR's policies any more until they need them! Warren and Sanders as far as I can tell are the only ones looking after the have nots. Talk about Sanders voters siting out last election what will be the difference now, I'm not so sure the progressive wing of the party will not sit out or vote red to protect their money should Sanders win. The DNC should get behind Sanders and bring Biden's people with them.
1
From 1980 though 2016 youth turnout in presidential elections has never been higher than 52%, in 1992, dropping to about 40% in 96’ and 2000, rising to 51% in 2008 and 45% and 46% in 2012 and 2016 respectively. Sanders is counting on an 11 percentage point rise in youth turnout, to 57%, i.e. 11/46 = 24% rise. This seems unlikely. Sanders is gambling with our future, with less than 50:50 odds. His desire to fulfill his lifelong dream of a ‘Revolution’ is blinding him to the risk. Over the cliff we go.
Figures are from https://www.census.gov/newsroom/blogs/random-samplings/2017/05/voting_in_america.html.
1
@walkman Biden's campaign was dying when he was the focus of the debates. He's very lucky that Amy and Pete took the spotlight then presented him with endorsements. Once Biden goes back to being in the spotlight on the debate stage, I am sure his odds will be less than 50:50 as well.
1
@Kevin All Biden has to do is repeat over-and-over "socialist" and rattle off all of the socialist governments that have failed and then quote word for word Fareed Zakaria's last op-ed in the WaPo about the reality of Scandinavian socialism. Bernie thinks we can eliminate one-third of the private sector and double (triple?) the size of the federal government without any adverse consequences. Really, Bernie has a lot more 'splaining to do than Biden.
Yes, Goldberg puts her finger on what those of us who like Sanders worry about the most: can he or his advisors develop the rhetorical and policy flexibility to show that he can mature as a candidate.
It bears repeating; it's obvious, but broadening your appeal and finding ways to allay doubts about what many see as your negatives is part of any successful candidacy. having a truly fired up base is the other. Bernie has already got that.
Change has always been incremental and that includes progressive policies. The Bernie backers are idealists and desperately want change which is completely understandable and OK. How I wish that my daughter's college debt could be completely eliminated and Medicare for all could be a reality. But Bernie is espousing untenable dreams; our Congress would not pass it right now. Plus he has never been a real compromiser. A public option and or improving on Obamacare might be a reality with a center-left candidate-- like Obama who knows the art of compromise would be a better choice. At the end of the day circumstances will worsen terribly for our youth if they dig in their heels, don't vote and Trump prevails.
@C Hernandez
“Change has always been incremental and that includes progressive policies.”
That's wrong.
Incremental change only happens when there's no opposition. When there is opposition, which is always the case, only big hairy audacious goals work.
Big goals create their own motivation, momentum, and emotion.
Small goals do not. No one gets excited over an incremental goal. Incremental change is easily co-opted, diverted, slow-walked, and watered-down.
That's why there's been no positive change in this country for decades. The status quo has made everyone into small thinkers and naysayers.
Small thinkers are fearful do-nothings, afraid they might fail. Progressives like failure because they know it's part of the learning process, and there is always a better tomorrow if you don't give up.
Every company or country that wants to become great only does so with big audacious ideas, like the America of old.
@Fourteen14
“Nature loves courage. You make the commitment and nature will respond to that commitment by removing impossible obstacles. Dream the impossible dream and the world will not grind you under, it will lift you up.”
— Terence McKenna
Ms Goldberg presents are wrong analysis because it is irrelevant.
The question is not whether it might be tougher for Bernie to beat Trump than we realize. The relevant question is will Bernie have a higher probability of beating Trump than Biden.
The answer is yes because Bernie will subtract away those 12% of Bernie supporters who voted for Trump in 2016, whereas they will stick with Trump if Biden is the alternative.
That's about 7,500,000 votes that Bernie will get and that Trump will lose, which equals 15 million votes.
12% of Bernie voters went for Trump last time, if Biden is the candidate it's likely that 40% may go for Trump.
Bernie may also motivate some of the usually apathetic voters who sit elections out. He doesn't have to get many because that’s a pool of 93 million voters.
Bernie vs. Biden is not neck-and-neck, when considered against Trump. One wins in a landslide, the other loses in a landslide.
Moderates do not understand this because they're thinking of this election exactly as they did in 2016, as between Republicans and Democrats. That's why they lost and why they will lose again in 2020.
There is no party unity at all right now and it's foolish to expect that to change for the election, as it has not changed since 2016.
This election, exactly like in 2016, is the status quo against the People. 80% of Bernie supporters voted for Hillary, but that will never happen again — it's likely 40% of Bernie supporters will vote Trump this time.
2
Fourteen14
I will vote for either Sanders or Biden, who ever gets the democratic nomination.
I find it hard to believe, your premise that Sanders voters would vote for trump over Biden. Voters will have had almost 4 years to see how truly dangerous trump is to our country. I just can not believe Bernie’s Bros would vote for trump, even if they did in 2016.
My big concern with Biden is that he will be cut to ribbons by trump in a debate. My big concern with Sanders is that the middle-of-the-road voter will be frightened by the Republican rhetoric about Sanders. I do not think there is any danger of giant, radical changes being made under a Sanders presidency. All policies, like healthcare reform, educational reform, etc, still will need to get through a middle of the road congress. But I am not confident that voters really understand that process, and they will be frightened by the scary republican smears of Sanders.
1
Your calculations might prove to be true, but you are ignoring the reality of the Electoral College. In a democracy, the popular vote should determine the outcome. It’s beyond time to abolish this dinosaur.
4
@Ninotchka
Those simple calculations predict the election.
Another way to predict the election is to look at the polls, which were 80% correct in in 2018.
Right now, nationally, and in the Six States, Bernie beats Trump in the Electoral College.
Google Sanders versus Trump Wisconsin, for example, and do that for all the states.
Another way to possibly predict what will happen or at least what is most likely to happen is to realize there are far more progressives than there are moderates.
The Democratic party is 28% of the electorate and 35% of Democrats are moderate, whereas 46% are progressives. Moderates have been shrinking for 20 years and progressives have been gaining for 20 years, so moderates are not the future.
There's also huge numbers of progressives in the Independent party, of which Bernie is the leader.
The distribution of the electorate is bi-modal, there is not a bunch of moderates in the middle as in a normal distribution.
Moderates mistakenly think they have the numbers because they're thinking 20 years ago in the past when they did have the numbers, and because the progressives have voted with them as they did (80%) in 2016 giving Hillary the popular vote, and because moderates have the programming of the mainstream media on their side.
Biden is absolutely not the safe candidate. He will guarantee a Trump landslide which will take the House, and the Supreme Court, and will destroy the Moderates forever.
1
Keep your eye on the prize. Democratic voters only care about one thing, and that's health care. And well they should; the coronavirus is driving it home to them.
Sanders is the only candidate, socialist or not, who is promising all voters a maximum effort at a radical change in the way we receive health care. Whether he succeeds or not is beside the point. His heart is in the right place; even his detractors feel this.
5
I am 70, one of those expected to become more conservative as she ages. Not so. And I would have had far more respect for Klobuchar and Buttegieg had they endorsed Warren.
I'm not a huge fan of Bernie's despite agreement with him on the basics of inequality and climate. I worry about his supreme confidence in his own rightness. Nonetheless, Biden's policies on inequality and climate are weaker than Bloomberg's. And that is a huge problem for me and everyone I know.
I doubt Biden grasps the severity of the crisis we are facing on both these issues, the urgency with which we must act. He also fails to understand that bipartisanship is dead right now; Republicans cannot be trusted to support any ambitious efforts to mitigate our twin crises. Lisa Murkowski's tepid energy bill is a good example of wishy washy legislation that will keep us dependent on fossil fuels long into the future. That's alarming. We do not have 4 years to waste on this nonsense.
9
The extreme anger against center-left Democrats such as Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, Hillary Clinton, etc, among the uncompromising left has to manifest itself in some way and right now it is being manifested as the Sanders campaign. That is probably more constructive than the Occupy Wall Street movement which was leaderless and lacked demands. If the Sanders campaign is not as revolutionary as Occupy Wall Street it at least provides a leader and specific demands, above all, Medicare for all. An obvious problem is that this movement is too far left to find any common ground with conservative Republicans. And it is also too far left to get many votes from moderate Republicans and even from independents. This populist insurrection that is challenging the Democratic Party establishment might actually get a presidential nominee but when all is said and done the real winners are likely to be right wing extremists. The study described by Michelle Goldberg provides some of the reasons why.
3
Is it right to bash Sanders to maintain a broken health care system? At 65 I have Medicare. My son is 26. He is well aware that a real process to change his future starts with single payer. The petty entertainment of the past to kill Obama Care is in real trouble with 4 more years of the status quo.
3
Pushing Biden isn't going to work.He can even form full sentences anymore.
6
In my business I work exclusively with Millennials and GenZ. From 10 years of experience here's what I know: They don't show up. They need to be proded and while holding their hands they want to be put on the path not shown where it is or given tools so they can take the first step. Easily distracted. Easily influenced/manipulated. Don't count on them to vote. They won't show up for you.
5
No Democrat can work with Republicans. Stop pretending it is a factor.
6
Aha, the mythical crossover republican voter is once again offered as the key to elections success. Your moderate candidate is going to convince those Trump voters to change their opinions, is she? Well, Ms. Goldberg, I don't buy it. Never met one of those swing voters. And I bet you haven't either. All the Trump people I know are motivated by bigotry, or greed, or both. And despite what they say to pollsters, the people who voted for Trump obviously lack the moral compass to respond to reason. In fact, they lie a lot . Weak argument Ms. Goldberg. Not up to your usual high standards.
7
Wylecoyoteus
The rest of trump voters, the ones not motivated by hate or greed, are unable to reason, to seek out facts and information, and then process it. They are swayed by the repetition of lies.
1
If Michelle Goldberg had any integrity, she would have refrained from opining about candidates in the 2020 election, once Mr. Michelle Goldberg signed on as a consultant to Elizabeth Warren. The appearance of a conflict of interest renders her support for Warren suspect, however independent of a pay check that advocacy may be. Further, the near unanimity of anti-Sanders sentiments regurgitated daily by the cabal of NYT/DNC pundits makes Goldberg's variations redundant.
The data Goldberg cites are dated now that a pandemic has encroached on the body politic. How many Americans will continue to accept a pay-or-die system if enough of them are hit with a bill in excess of $3,200 for a mere diagnostic test for a highly contagious and potentially fatal disease? The lack of affordable healthcare makes it harder to track and control an illness that initially presents with symptoms of the common cold, but may become very serious indeed if left unattended. In civilized nations where healthcare is a right and not an economic issue for the individual, people don't hesitate to see a doctor to have a cough or sore throat examined. Millions of Americans wait until they're so sick that they have no choice but to head to the ER for treatment, and that was the reality before COV-2. Only Bernie Sanders will implement socialized medicine. Clinging to a corporate "healthcare" system will ensure needless death and suffering.
4
An election is not about you selecting and/or getting your own personally crafted, boutique quality President. When the day comes to vote for our new leader, you will have TWO CHOICES.
Pick one. Millions of Americans in the past and billions more around the world have suffered and died for an opportunity to just do that.
3
Entera
I totally agree with you. Our elections are binary. 2016 voters seemed unable to grasp that and we see how well that turned out.
And purity tests or perfect platforms are ridiculous standards to demand when we have as an alternative a sociopathic, Russian puppet, mob boss.
2
College over educated white woman here. Belong to several groups in the NY and Palo Alto. I can tell you one thing the common thread in my groups, the despise of Bernie and Bernie bro’s. It’s not vote blue no matter who. I doubt any of us I’ll vote for Bernie ever. Most if forced will vote for the devil they know. There are about 100 in our networking group, city and suburb, mostly employed and mostly at 6-7 figures. The two women shelters we help with, women on the opposite spectrum, some associate Bernie with free everything, others with the screaming man they left behind.
1
DS
Very disappointed, and a little frightened, to hear that a well educated woman would even consider voting for trump over Sanders.
Trump is in deep with the Russians, money laundering for decades for them. (You read the NYT? Deutsche Bank, the only bank who will work with Mr Bankruptcy Defaulter Trump is the go between. And you read the Mueller report, right?) Trump is going to use the assistance of russia again in this election. Trump is an existential threat to our
democracy. And you and your colleagues only care about your 6 or 7 figure salaries? You don’t care about our democracy, or our environment, or the health and well-being of the most vulnerable people in our very wealthy nation? Why don’t you just say that?
BTW Making an extra donation to food banks or helping in shelters does nothing except somehow make you and your friends feel charitable.
1
My liberal friends and I are praying (and voting) for a Biden victory. We know what folks in some parts of the country either don’t know or won’t admit—Bernie can’t win in states like Virginia. It’s just not that shade of blue here!
8
@Babs
Bernie beats Trump right now in Virginia by comfortable numbers. So you were saying he can't win? He already wins.
1
Thanks for the input. As to polls, we will have to wait and see. But voters in Massachusetts aren’t voters in Virginia. Moderation is a by word here.
In the event Bernie wins, there are significant projections that moderate Democratic Congress members such as Representative Spanberger (and a number of others) will lose—possibly costing the Democratic majority in the House.
Unlike some Bernie supporters, I will most DEFINITELY vote blue, no matter who.
3
@Babs
Sure they are, I've lived in Virginia twice. See here:
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/va/virginia_trump_vs_sanders-6989.html
And nationally:
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_sanders-6250.html
Bernie Sanders is Americas best hope to defear Trump, and reverse Americas slide into chaos and corruption. The giant banks; the multi~national corporations: Wall Street: and secret groups who wish to destroy our Constitution and establish a fascist dictatorship. America is in grave peril and we need a fiery leader to start us back onto the road to freedom and democracy. Putin and his gang of oligarchs expects Americans to continue fracturing into small groups of ideologues that will easily be crushed by Russian surrogates. Our young citizens must become trully motivated to save our Constitution and their future.
3
Here's what the "Bernie or Bust" crowd would really be yelling; "Like the skinheads and oligarchs, I prefer Trump to Biden". My preference would be the world Bernie would work to create, but if the path to M4A has to pass through the public option to get there, I'll walk that path. The alternative is too painful to just watch unfold.
2
@dAvid W
Progressives much prefer anti-establishment Trump to status quo Biden, and there are far more progressives than there are moderates.
Moderates implore progressives to give moderate candidates a chance, but they can’t seem to give progressive candidates a chance.
Moderates all say they like Bernie's ideas but they don't like him shouting, or they don't like his supporters, or they think his hair is messed up.
What they need to do is clutch their pearls and get behind Bernie to beat Trump. Because otherwise the progressives will vote for Trump in a landslide. That's the reality.
1
Why repeat the term "democratic socialist" as if it were a valid political label? Any validity it may have can only be in the America where words mean anything you want them to mean.
Let's imagine a Democratic Catholic Church: the parish of Templebwee is having its annual general meeting. The moderator says: "And finally, we come to this years review of the Commandments (yes, what used to be The Ten.) Last year, you redacted two. This year, there are separate proposals. One proposes the redaction of two more. And another proposes the insertion of three new commandments, to keep abreast of the times."
"Liberalism" has lost all meaning at the hands of the partisan media. Now it seems "socialism" is headed for the scrap heap.
1
@Des Johnson Alternatively, Bernie could falsely label himself as a "capitalist" like Liz Warren, despite the fact that she does not have a single policy that will actually spur economic growth in the private sector.
Moderates, you do realize the best you're going to get is "the appearance" of moderation? Shielding yourself from reality is what you do.
A moderate could win and not antagonize the right too much, but what you won't acknowledge is that the right is done working with moderates and the left.
It's time to confront them now and evermore because it's the honest, albeit uncomfortable, thing to do.
https://www.governing.com/columns/assessments/gov-urban-penalty-legislatures-cities.html
1
Always, above all, we must be fearful and timid.
5
Michelle I love how you talk about ‘Biden’s baggage” but not Bernie’s baggage which is real and worse. Let’s start with him not being a Democrat. Bernie, if you’re so pure and determined to be the Democratic nominee why haven’t you switched parties? Or are you so entitled that you think you deserve it without even signing up? Bernie’s an avowed socialist. Last time I checked that wasn’t too high a priority in swing states or with the majority of the Democratic Party. Bernie has done one piece of meaningful legislation in 30 years. ONE. WHATS HE DOING IN THE SENATE? He says the same thing over, and over and over but does nothing.
I’d say that’s plenty of baggage.
3
Rails
Sanders had passed 7 bills, just to be accurate.
And I agree with you. Sanders is all angry rhetoric. He believes his rhetoric, and he isn’t a liar or a hypocrite, but he cannot connect with the majority of voters enough to win.
I want trump out. Our country cannot withstand another 4 years of his lunacy.
3
Sanders 2020:
Climate science is real.
Political science is fake.
1
NY should be supporting Bloomberg, who got many things done - as Mayor. Under his watch, students were protected. Under De Blasio's watch, students are being denied a decent education. The BoE's Charter Schools all closed in failure. De Blasio left the kids in the lurch. Under De Blasio's watch, protected nursing home was giving special certification (after a donation to De Blasio) and sold so it could be rezoned as commercial, rather than non-profit. Nice move! Same for the carriage horse move to Central Park. Not good for the horses, but good for real estate sales. Bloomberg wouldn't pull that nor would he grant more contracts to the owner of a plastic bag company with a failing product. The product supposedly stunk and did not do the job to repel rodents, as promised. So, De Blasio awards another contract for the bags. The fiasco of NYHA failing the neediest residents, taxpayer $$ used for goodie bags, burner phones, and gift cards to reward career criminals who no longer face bail and can commit more crimes. We were safer with Bloomberg. Bloomberg gets positive things done as opposed to our current Mayor. Unlike the current President, Bloomberg made his own money, came from a working class background, has intelligence, doesn't deny climate change, does not put himself first over the country, nor is he corrupt. Bloomberg is the best chance we have from getting vermin out of the White House.
2
Why would we even think to listen to advice from these NYT pundits. They have been SO wrong at predicting political outcomes in this race and in 2016 - and everything in between. They will never recuse themselves - no matter how consistently wrong they are. It's up to us to listen to those who have proven track records of understanding the American people.
2
Congrats to Joe for winning S.C., Alabama, Arkansas, and all the other states that should serve as no bearing on who should get the DNC nomination. Let’s see how Sanders fares in MN, CA, ME, MA, VA, and TN
3
@Pete So, in other words, if certain (highly black) states do not support Bernie, their voices should not be heard?
1
@Ed It is a rather sad circumstance that those democrats are disproportionately black; however, the dem voters in those states have always fallen WELL short of flipping the state in a national election. It's not a racial thing, it's a "can we really count on these voters to effect change" kind of thing. Let's focus on the true swing states, some of which are still significantly black like TN and NC, but let's not put too much stock in South Carolina, Alabama, and Arkansas. It's stupid to do so.
1
And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why nominating Bernie spells death for a repeat of the blue wave in the down ballot races.
5
Why? Do you really believe that Reps attracted by Biden will vote for Dems down the ballot?
If you can watch some of the interviews Biden did over the weekend and not be worried, you might be as old as he is. He's forgetful, incoherent and blaise. Seriously, it's very worrying.
And Biden can't count on any new voters either.
3
Now that Buttigieg and Klobuchar are gone, the only centrist left is a dude who's very clearly in cognitive decline. Is no one in the center troubled by that?
3
The fact that none of the Democratic competitors who withdrew joined with him, and pointedly endorsed Biden, says all one needs to know about Sanders’ capacity to attract “new” followers. Hillary Clinton spoke the truth about Sanders. Counting on “youth,” who have no experience with the political systems Sanders’ endorses, is not his strength, it is his only recourse to grow his base.
1
This article is an opinion article hiding behind the guise of "data" when in fact it is based on assumptions. Please let the electorate make up its own mind. They know best. Stop interfering with democracy.
2
Sanders can’t even count on all Democrats voting for him.
1
But he can count on an old voter like me.
3
In fact, no one -- expert or layperson -- knows who is going to win the election (even if they act like they know).
2
"But it does mean that if Sanders wins the primary, his campaign has to learn to persuade people, not just mobilize them."
This, I know and understand and sincerely believe, will not happen.
Keep attacking the Democratic "establishment"--as if moderates in purple swing districts had less of a right to vote their views than you do.
Keep calling the first openly gay candidate a rat.
Keep calling the progressive woman who does your homework on M4A a snake.
Keep acting like any and all means justify your REvOLutIoN!
1
I am in for Biden; better to have a steady center after years of turmoil. And Sanders would bring turmoil from the left. It’s not that I don’t agree with many of his proposals, I do, and I would even vote for him, despite my loss of Biden as a candidate. So when I hear these “Bernie” supporters sneer about not voting if he isn’t the nominee makes me sick. Some , not all,but a sizable number of Sanders supporters are nasty juvenile men and women who if they don’t get their way, will take their vote home. If you really want what’s good for the country as a whole, you would swallow your pride and vote against Trump. But I am not truly surprised by their arrogance and veneer of superiority: Sanders exhibits the same attitudes: he is as rigid a demagogue as Trump is an ignorant narcissistic. No flexibility over 40 years: it’s one thing to hold certain beliefs, but when evidence occurs where modification is justified and new facts are presented, isn’t it the mark of a mature politician to grow and expand and yes, modify ones beliefs?. Does Bernie still think the Sandinistas were the “good” guys? There were no good guys in that horrible civil war.Did Castro’s literacy program expand the books one could read? Or was the program merely a tool for indoctrination? The mere fact that Bernie either cannot see that or refuses to see it, almost as bad as a serial liar like Trump.
2
He can count on me as a life long NYCer.
1
Nor can Warren animate new voters, so are you suggesting we support Biden?
1
Simple solution: give Sanders your full support, don't give rotten people like Bloomberg the nomination, stop with the identity politics and focus on the issues, we all know that the 2016 election was rigged for Hillary, so let's not do that again Mr. Corporates, if a Mexican outside of your country can see that, surely you don't think your own people are daft? Don't play dirty again, let America's dad win fairy, he's the only one with a consistent background of all the candidates, he doesn't lie like someone called Biden and he doesn't buy he's way to the top like some called Bloomberg, here in México that's called "cheating" and it's BAD, we're taught that since we have use of reason. Do the right thing people, vote for the guy doing the right things for your future and not the ones that only care about pleasing their rich friends over the well being of others, oligarchs don't care about single mother of 4 Susan with 2 minimum wage jobs from Mississippi.
My biggest fear is that Bernie's die-hard supporters get angry again, and stay home in November. Four more years of Trump might cure them of this, but it will be too late for women's rights, the environment, medical care, and basic voting rights, once the brown shirts start to march.
2
Bernie lost my vote and most likely many others when he made his little speech about Cuba. We don't need a socialist, much less a Communist in office.
What we need is to restore dignity and grace to the Oval Office.
What we need is to regain the respect of our allies.
What we need is to rid ourselves of that egotistical, self-serving, narcissist, racist, vulgar bully, who is very devoted, yes, devoted to himself and no other.
2
The objective is to beat Trump while at least maintaining down ballot Democrats.
Being perceived as a socialist is Sanders weakness. The Ukraine and his son rumors are Biden's weakness. Trump will exploit both big time.
Bloomberg's weakness is NDAs and stop and frisk. Trump is worse on both subjects. So he can't use it against Bloomberg.
All things considered, I thing Bloomberg has the best chance to accomplish what Democrats are trying to do.
1
Bernie will also be losing a lot of voters. The conservative Jews in Pennsylvania and Florida may not vote for Trump but many won't vote for Bernie.
2
It’s “ Bernie AND Bust “. Way to lose the Presidency, the Senate AND the House.
Seriously.
5
I'll vote for Trump.
Better to implode on Republicans' dime than explode on Democrats'.
Wow, great plan. Polarized America in a nutshell.
1
OK, so you and everyone else who is worried about Trump winning can start reaching out to new voters to make it happen.
Oh, right--your husband works for Warren.
1
Why am I not seeing Democratic 'register to vote' tables everywhere?
1
Our best chance to save America and we’re going to blow it because, “unless my candidate is nominated, I’ll vote for Trump or stay home”. If this causes 4 more years of this, we’re blaming you!
1
The idea that the Ancient Marxist has any chance v. Trump is ludicrous. First of all, Trump will easily paint him as anti-American. This guy Sanders, who’s running to be an American President, despises America. He and his equally crooked wife luxuriate in American wealth, yet hate America. He’s a fraud with 3 houses who travels first class.
He’s also a grifter who makes money from his own political ad buys. Read Schweizer’s “Profiles in Corruption”.
Trump will read Schweizer’s book verbatim from his rallies. Just watch.
3
Trump matches the people at his rallies perfectly, God help us.
1
You want progressive... here is progressive:
You can't vote until your 18 years old and you can't vote if you're within 18 years of dying (according to life expectancy for male and female)
You can't be President if you're under 35 years old or if you're older than 70 years old.
Get rid of this stupid two party system and join the world in facilitating multi party systems. Try it... you might like it. It never is either black or white... there is a lot of gray.
Most democracies have 3,4 or 5 parties that one can choose from.
I therefore ask you this:
Would you really consider shopping in a supermarket that offers you only 2 choices when you buy an article. Of course not and yet you are content with a system that discourages and makes it virtually impossible for other points of vue to be heard. Democracy? I think not.
1
Why in the world would Bernie-or-bust voters seem like an argument for Sanders? If these people think "my way or the highway" is a winner, they should try it out on their boss and ask for a raise.
4
They tried, that's how they learned that such attitude does work
Amen. The theory that Sanders' candidacy brings out a hidden supermajority of first-time, under-25-year-old voters is at best speculative. The theory that Sanders' candidacy brings out a hidden supermajority of far-left voters is at best speculative.
But neither theory is new. We heard identical arguments from Beto O'Rourke (in connection with a statewide race) and Ted Cruz (in connection with his 2016 Republican primary bid). Both failed.
Unfortunately, Bernie may have already poisoned the chalice: Bernie supporters with whom I have spoken say they will not vote for any other candidate (including Senator Warren!). My congratulations to them on their ideological purity: they will on that theory re-elect Trump.
5
It is funny to require Bernie's supporters to vote for the moderates, while claiming that the moderates will not vote for Bernie.
1
Not thrilled about Bernie or Joe - but I'll take either one.
Bernie has become obstinate, a little arrogant, a little entitled - like he's owed the nomination. For the record, I donated to Bernie in '16.
Joe - well Joe is Joe. A decent man, not without some smelly
baggage. I have serious doubts about his mental acuity and stamina.
Bernie can't deliver anything without a democratic House and Senate.
Think of Joe as a placeholder for one term, if he would choose a progressive VP who would then run in '24. If he would concede to this, I think many who share my concerns - moderates and progressives - would be less reluctant to support him now.
Cleaning up behind trump's colossally damaging reign will require herculean effort beyond what any one person as President can achieve alone. A VP pick who has the ability to do some heavy lifting on day one is important.
I'd rather see Bernie, Liz and Amy in the Senate where enacting their policy proposals might actually see progress.
The danger of a trump re-election can not be overstated. This election may be our last chance to save our country, our democracy, our planet and a future worth living.
Please, vote for whomever gets the nomination. Secure the chance to achieve what Bernie, Liz want to do. If trump wins, we've all lost. Voting your conscience, your principles by abstaining will come at a very, very dear price.
4
@Deb Very well stated. Thanks
1
Sanders seems constitutionally unable to reach out and try to court voters. It's not just the Berners on Twitter, or his high-level campaign aides. It's Bernie himself. He dismisses people who support a different candidate as centrists, and Democratic elected officials who have been doing their best as part of some "establishment" - is that like "the deep state"?
If he is the nominee, I will vote for Bernie, but it won't be with a lot of confidence or enthusiasm.
5
You and those myopic academics forgot one thing- candidates run differently in the primaries than in the general election. How could you of all people forget that all US dem candidates run more to the center during the gc than in the primaries. If Sanders rightfully wins the nomination, his incredible team and a huge movement will do what it takes to generate the voters. Also, I really wonder where they got their pool of 40,000 voters from.
The attraction for Bernie by younger voters is that he labels himself as a Democratic Socialist and the knock on him by older voters is that he labels himself as a Democratic SOCIALIST. While Trump conflates this with Communism, Bernie rarely defines his political economic policy beyond the label. Let's look at the definitions:
SOCIALISM - the means of production is OWNED by the state
DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISM - political democracy w/socially owned economy; w/emphasis on workers rights in a democratically controlled economy
SOCIAL DEMOCRACY - form of democracy aimed at reform of capitalism to remove perceived injustices and wealth inequality
COMMUNISM - a political/economic system in which the means of production is owned by the state and in which all workers are paid by the state based on their needs
If you listen to Bernie, while he may have held some sympathy for communist gov't in Cuba and Russia in the past, there is nothing in his current positions that suggest support for either Socialism or Communism. His comments seem to suggest a position that is on a spectrum spanning Social Democracy (such as many Western European gov'ts) and Democratic Socialism. However, while he champions workers rights and input into business governance, he does not advocate gov't ownership of the means of production & distribution (i.e., he is not a socialist). Bernie would do well to redefine his position as a Social Democrat, but his rigidity prevents even this modest change.
3
I don't know how anyone watches Biden during the debates and thinks he will be a strong matchup against Trump.
This race is basically down to Biden and Bernie and if you think Biden will do more to beat Trump than Bernie you basically have to ignore polling, ignore voter enthusiasm, ignore fundraising, ignore the importance of organizing a ground team, and ignore the recent history of moderate turnout. That's an awful lot to ignore and risk just because you don't care for Bernie.
6
@Keith
The people pushing the anti-Bernie message are not the ones who will suffer under a second Trump term. Their lives are comfortable and they are white.
3
I just voted in a Democratic primary. I voted for Bernie Sanders.
I had been on the fence but the spectacle last night of Amy, Beto and Pete climbing aboard the Biden train made me realize that it is important to recognize the significance of the grassroots politicking that the Sanders campaign has organized. I hope that the Democratic Party elites make more of an effort to reach out to the Sanders constituency. It represents the future of the party.
8
Young people don't vote. That's fact. The young generation now, brought up on a discipline system of "time outs," can be counted on for little more than clicking "like" on various social media platforms.
Don't count on these kids to vote.
8
The 2020 election is a battle for the future of this country and electing Sanders would be just as dangerous as electing Trump - they are flip sides of the same coin. Though they come from opposite ends of the political spectrum both men are convinced they are "right" in all things. They are frankly terrifying. It is scary that so many young voters seem to think the message "it's my way or the highway" is a formula for running a vast, multi-cultural society. As a grandmother, a liberal Canadian and a woman I am genuinely worried that the electorate in November will fail the test that will ensure a future for my grandchildren. Bernie Sanders is not a registered Democrat - why is he even allowed to run for the Democratic nomination? If Broockman is correct a Sanders nomination will almost certainly give Trump 4 more years to finish the job of destroying our democracy.
5
@Mary Pat
Don't act out of fear. You are repeating smears without knowing it. As Goebbels wrote, if you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it is true. Look at a Youtube video of Sanders in West Virginia. He will show you what kind of caring human being he is. He NEVER makes fun of or treats any ordinary person with derision of anger.
You don't have to like his policies, but at least see him for the compassion person he is. The middle and working classes will not have another champion anytime soon and if climate change is not addressed as vigorously as he proposes, there will be no future to comment on.
Thanks for keeping an open mind.
1
@nora m One of the things that has bothered me about Sanders is the way he falsely describes how other western democracies manage health care and student loans. Let's start with one I know - Canada. Each province has their own medicare system which is honored in the other provinces with the exception of Quebec. Private insurance is available in Canada and many people have it through their work. It enhances the government system. Students do get loans in Canada but the cost of a college education is far less than here in the US. Tuition, room & board are usually less than $25,000 per year. The Canadian social systems are a better comparison than the northern European ones. We are not Denmark - we are a mutli cultural, inter racial society with a huge population. Bernie is misleading his supporters.
1
Neither Sanders nor Biden have a strong message to beat Trump. Sanders is a one message candidate on healthcare that scares anyone who is not under 25 years old. Biden has a muddled message - what is it exactly? - that we need to go back to 2015 Obama policies? Until the message is sharpened with specific policies seen as achievable - gun safety laws, women's right to choose, minimum wage for all with healthcare, infrastructure, immigration, climate, just talking about how Trump is a bad guy and a liar are not going to cut it.
3
Sanders has plenty of support from those over 25. If they’re afraid of something, it’s the timidity and muddleheadedness of the electorate, not universal healthcare.
Sanders sounds plenty of other notes, too. Trade policy, the environment, and taxes on the wealthy, to name a few.
But surely you know that? If you don’t like his proposals, fine, but please try to be accurate.
3
Not sure you’re right about Warren alienating centrists, especially women.
If she can overcome the false advertising of the great Republican smoke machine and the ‘I don’t care what it is just give me a story’ media, she’ll do fine. She’s a pragmatist, and she’s absolutely right about corruption, structural change, etc. It’s common sense, not dogma.
Big ‘if,’ I know, but she’s clearly the best candidate and would be the best president.
3
@jamiebaldwin
Show us her path to victory? She has eight delegates. She hasn't been in the top three since Iowa. She may have good ideas (mainly from Sanders) but she is a zombie candidate who is only going to serve the DNC by splitting the progressive wing.
1
@nora m
If it looks like the choice is between Sanders or Biden people may go to Warren—or Bloomberg (but she’s poked some holes in his balloon). Tons of delegates to be allocated still.
Not saying it will happen. Today’s the day we’ll know if it can.
Sanders can excite his base, just as Trump does. The critical voters are those around the fringes of their bases. It will be easier for Trump to peel off Sanders' supporters than for Sanders to attract some Trump supporters. Although they both use fear, anger, and hate, Trump is more prone to create fuel for those, real or imagined.
And, Sanders' coat has not tails to carry down-ballot candidates to the Senate and keep the house. A Real danger!
4
Many of the young voters turning out this cycle, probably majority, are also motivated by the purpose of defeating Trump. So they will turn out for Biden too. Bernie or bust is the meme of the lunatic activists only.
4
Hillary Clinton, as everybody who reads these columns is well aware, won the popular vote by 3-4 million votes but still managed to lose the election because of approximately 70 thousands votes in three crucial swing states.
How is it possible that Bernie Sanders can't at least hit that same level of turnout? Hillary bled out a good chunk of Sanders, Stein and Johnson followers who idiotically either didn't vote out of spite or threw away their votes on silly, vanity candidates.
Moderate Democrats, all desperate to get Trump out of office would never not vote for a Bernie Sanders for the satisfaction of throwing a momentary, petulant tantrum.
If we lose ostensible never Trumpers like David Brooks and Bret Stevens in the process, so be it. We'll live.
Unless rock solid polling indicates that there is no numerical way that Sanders can compete in those crucial swing states, I just don't see how we can't let Sanders give this a shot.
Michael Moore seems to believe this, and he more than anybody else in our party seems to understand the dynamics of the politics surrounding this debate.
He saw Trump's victory coming when everybody else was in denial about it.
I'm going to listen to him this time.
4
If the possibility of a second Trump term can't motivate young people to vote then I'm as disgusted with them as I am with those willing to condone Trump's antisocial, incompetent and destructive behavior. I can't imagine being so aloof or uncaring.
5
@Kevin McKague Agree. But I teach these kids. They're entitled and apathetic.
2
I could not be more impressed with Buttigieg—and Klobuchar—for dropping out ahead of Super Tuesday. I hope to see more of these candidates that made a choice to put the good of the country first.
6
@Babs
Some of us saw that as self serving and a status quo movement to stop progressives. I saw it as exactly opposite of the way you do,
I’m about to cast my ballot today for Biden. I really wanted to vote for Warren but I believe Biden has a better chance of beating Trump. Hopefully, he will choose a progressive VP.
If Bernie wins, I will vote for him but we will definitely not win any seats in the senate and most possibly lose to Trump. We can’t handle 4 more years of this garbage.
4
Michelle: you're forgetting the power of voter fraud. It may still get the job done for Bernie.
@Ulysses According to all credible sources, very tiny, except in the minds of hysterics and conspiracy theorists.
1
@Carl Yaffe yes, it is truly a wonder: in every other area of life, where there is power and big money at stake, there is rampant fraud. But we are to believe that our voting system is pristine. Just one example: people in the North who move to Florida often vote in both locations. And then of course you’ve no doubt heard of Chicago? I rest my case.
The screaming and abusive Sanders campaign has turned me off big time. I voted for Warren but will support Biden going forward. I will vote for the nominee but hopefully it won't be Bernie! We need decency and teamwork not screaming.
7
First of all, Sanders is NOT a Democrat. He is an Independent Socialist who should not be allowed to run on the Democratic ticket. He is a joke to the Democratic party.
Nominating Bernie is a national suicide pact. He is not electable.
Well, to be fair, it is hard to find something Bernie has done in his three decades in Washington.
6
It remains a mystery to me why Bernie won't run as the Independent he claims to be. I am a lifelong Democrat and don't even want to consider the possibility I would have to vote for him. Where are his health and wealth records? His misogyny, hysterical demands and DNC having to cut a deal with him in the past - that he got to approve - this is not what I want to be thinking about in this election cycle. He is hamstringing another election with his ego and intransigence.
I'll vote blue no matter who but hope Sanders never runs again.
6
Bernie is espousing policy that has worked in all the Nordic states for over 50 years. These governments are all true democracies (unlike ours) and they are all capitalist market economies. They are also the most educated,healthiest, and happiest people in the world. That could be us if you just don't buy in to the red baiting propaganda...most people don't anymore that's why Bernie's winning ....Bernie the real populist will beat the sham populist with the fake tan..
2
Bernie or Biden, Bernie or Biden. It’s the existential question of the day.
Good cases can be made for both. Biden seems safer, Bernie seems risky. Biden is the past, Bernie is the future. There’s a greater likelihood of moderate and swing voters turning out for Biden than new, young, disaffected voters turning out for Bernie. (Or the opposite.)
I supported Bernie in 2016 but voted for Hillary. (Of course!) I support Warren in 2020, but am tired of voting for losers.
Coronavirus scares me. The Democratic nomination worries me.
As Scotty would say to Captain Kirk in his Scottish brogue when things looked bleak, “Cap’n, we no canna take much more of this!” Of course Scotty was talking about Klingon warships, but he expresses how I feel, and probably many others.
3
Today, at this point in time before Super Tuesday results, I see trump as our next president in the 2020 election. With help from the DNC, it's 2016 all over again.
1
We have seen this over and over and over. Polling 40,000 people is no better than polling 500 people if those 40,000 are all drawn from the same group within the electorate. The number of people in the study matters little if it is not a representative sample. This is the basis of modern scientific polling and that Ms. Goldberg doesn't appear to know this means her article is based on pseudo-science and simply meant to further her own agenda cloaked in magical thinking. This means she can not be trusted to write honestly.
For more than 30 years so called centrists have ruled the DNC, and this is their last gasp-- Biden-- who cannot remember what state he is in in any given moment-- who couldn't even manage to show up for his NY Times Interview. Biden who gropes women and children. Biden who stood against Anita Hill when in her brave "me too" moment.
Biden who lost his bid for president in 1988 because he kept lying about his record as a civil rights activist (He never was a civil rights activist and his staff begged him to stop lying). Biden who continues to lie about his involvement in the civil rights movement and now recently lied to say he was arrested while on his way to meet Mandela in South Africa.
Sanders will prevail. He's honest. He's consistent and the issues he is championing are extremely popular.
6
Ms. Goldberg mentions “all of Biden’s baggage.” Until Trump and company launched their smear campaign over Biden’s son, I can’t say the former vice president struck me as anything more than a back-slapping official who knows how to operate the levers of power.
Bernie Sanders and Joe Biden carried the same baggage into the campaign. Old. I would have preferred something I could roll with into the future, but there we have it.
Bernie reportedly sponsored seven bills in 25+ years in the Senate – two to name post offices! Maybe his grumpy demeanor turned off his fellow senators. He is the only person who can revolutionize America. Sound familiar?
I’m stunned that only 37% of Democrats voted in 2016; yet Hillary Clinton got three million more votes than then the know-it-all in the White House. Trump and Sanders stir up their supporters to intimidate the rest of us.
I don’t like being pushed around – far right or left.
3
Michelle is quick to pull out the religious bigotry card in fearing the Sanders selections will slide into election infamy, but there is no need. The line of demarcation and electability is clear. Religion aside, Bernie Sanders represents an anathema to American representative democracy and a capitalist economic system. It is simple and direct. Mr. Sanders is a Marxist. His ruling philosophy is born out of the models from Marx and Engels in Das Kapital and the Communist Manifesto. Bernie Sanders’ regressive ideas are from the nineteenth century. Instead of discarding them, Mr. Sanders clings to totalitarian models proven as oppressive failures from Cuba and Venezuela to the Soviet Union, while he waves the pom poms regarding Denmark, a small socialist version with near homogeneous Caucasian ethnicity.
1
Tell us when was the latest time - or even the first - that Warren or Biden drew crowds of 13,000 (Boston Commons on Sat), 26,000 (Brooklyn), or 35,000 (LA on Sunday)? They generate that kind of support?
If Biden drew a crowd of 35,000 it would be the headline. When Sanders does it, it is a yawn and never mentioned.
You and your allies at WaPo are working as hard as you can to demonize the one person who can beat Trump. When he gets re-elected, don't blame it on Bernie.
4
If Biden becomes the candidate, he will be the most pathetic democratic presidential candidate in decades. He can hardly speak, is wishy-washy on almost every position, and has a voting record that frightens most progressives. Yeh, he is somehow like an average-Joe-alright-kind-of-white-collar-worker-type, but so are millions of real workers, that would not be fit to be president. Much fun is made of Trump lurking behind Hillary on the debate stage, but I fear if Trump starts dancing circles around Biden on stage, he literally might simply fall down and land on his back like a turtle. Now that Mayor Pete and Amy K have dropped out in a strategic battle plan to stop Sanders, why does'nt Michelle's husband advise Warren to do the same, and let the two wings of the party have a go at it? Fair and square?
2
Reading the comments, as a sampling of opinions, tells me Trump wins in 2020. The Dems are divided. Bernie won't welcome moderates and vice versa. Biden will be crucified by Trump over Ukraine - same play as Hilary's emails (flat learning curve by DNC leadership who can't see it). It's that simple. And everyone is ruling Bloomberg out, even though he is Trump's worse nightmare. It's our fault if we lose 2020 because we are invested in emotions rather than unity and strategy. The Trump team is invested in strategy and has a united GOP behind him...even Ivanka drank the Koolaid.
2
I am one of the demographics of people who “can” vote and I promised myself that it Bernie Sanders gets the nomination I will be in the demographic that “will” vote.
3
Bernie or Bust. So, the Bernie Fans will just not Vote, or vote third Party. And the rest of us are supposed to give In to their threats and tantrums? NO. Show us that you can actually be bothered to VOTE, then we’ll listen. Until then it’s meaningless drivel and whining, from spoiled Brats.
Seriously.
4
Sanders is a radical leftist who has given Florida to Donald Trump on a silver plate and will not get the vote of moderate suburban women. Biden tells crowds to vote on "Super Thursday" (at least he caught the mistake this time).
Sanders cannot get elected. And on a late day in October when Trump is doing three or four campaign events every, Biden will be resting up after making multiple embarrassing gaffes the day before.
Economy good and this virus gone and long forgotten on Election Day, Trump wins. Bigly.
1
For the life of me I will never understand people who don't vote.
3
Democratic Socialists and Progressives are too radical. Moderate or middle of the road are more reliable. In any event, the Democrats need a strong turnout.
1
I’ll vote blue no matter who. My preferred candidate has been Warren since day 1. She focused on household issues for real people: early childcare/education, consumer protection, healthcare...and even more importantly the cost of pharmaceuticals for chronic conditions who’s lives depend on affordable medications. She seems to have a plan in place and the ability to convince others. Her main problem is that she campaigned for Hillary in 2016 and is now seen as HRC’s surrogate with boomer women complaining about the sound of her voice.
Bernie has all the big ideas, but none of the practicality to bring the plans to fruition. He doesn’t play well with others. Great for a revolution leader, terrible for a President charged with leading ALL the people. His polarization and his naming himself a socialist will scare otherwise moderate or liberal boomers away from voting. (My boss said she’d stay home) The word socialism brings up Cold War memories for Boomers. They are scared of socialism the way Millennials and Gen Z are of school shootings. Its DNA level fear.
Biden is staid and normal. I hope he’s the eventual nominee. I hope the GOP stops messing with Hunter, just because it’s malicious but honestly no voter cares. Look how short my description of Biden is. I hope he’s healthy! This is the same thought I had about McCain in 2008.
3
And Joe Biden can't count on many of us older voters.
When will Sanders release his medical records? When the audit is over?
2
The reason why suburban women don’t like Bernie is because he does not like competent women who show some moxie. Ask Governor Kuhn, Hillary Clinton and Elizabeth Warren.
Biden is reassuring voters by putting together a progrssive-to-center coalition (Beto,Pete, Amy, Harris - maybe Warren too int he end) that will have a much farther reach.
2
It seems as if this article predicts that neither the pollsters and pundits have a clue as to who Trump's going to defeat in November. All they know for sure, going back to 2016, will be how to apologize for getting it all wrong. Again.
'DEWEY DEFEATS TRUMAN' Dèjá vu always gets an encore.
Listen to yourself and no one else.
1
I think everyone would be better served if Ms. Goldberg simply took a few months off to work on the Warren campaign, and come back tothe paper when Warren drops out. To read the same constant veiled attacks at Bernie's electability is growing tiresome.
4
Michelle 'calling the bluff' of Bernie argument one day before CA Primary? Is it not 'too late'? Bernie is going to 'plunder' delegates in CA and the best that will be left for Biden will be to catch him if he can.
Democrats did not adopt Rank Choice Voting but allowed 'way early voting'.....there is no end to party's non-sense. Tom Perez did not get many things right.
Bernie is probably coming unstoppable tomorrow and thereafter it is all going to be a headache - Trump trashing Dems and GOP winning in landslide all 3 levers of the government.
Yah - Californians wanted to have a role in primaries. Here they are the single most responsible party for 4 more years of total GOP domination.
Bernie, Michelle and Californians - all delusional of same rank with no ability whatsoever to 'see the reality'.
It's the not-going-to-vote individuals who got us stuck with the impeached trump in the last election. And what a mess he and his unqualified administration have made of things.
Don't let that happen again!
Get registered, then VOTE for the democrat candidate - federal, state and local.
1
There is also no evidence that a moderate can get people to the polls. Much evidence suggests otherwise--John Kerry, Hillary Clinton, etc.
1
Young people do not vote. They never will until they reach middle age.
2
I'm puzzled that so many NYT op-ed folks don't look at the stark difference in campaign fundraising by Bernie v. Biden. Biden is taking corporate money; Bernie doesn't. Yet, Bernie is way ahead in fundraising -- from ordinary folks. An unbiased columnist might see that as a very big clue that Bernie has more grass roots support from actual voters.
2
I’m a Pete Buttigieg supporter who watched the august press in the form of the Grey Lady question his political correct credentials and am dismayed that you’d raise the four fire alarm now.
The people have spoken and they will have Bernie. Whether we go down the Jeremy Corbyn route is entirely up to them. Your political pundits have zero credibility hereon.
#hellnojoe is a HUGE liability to the Dems. Lukewarm didn't win 2016 and it won't win 2020. Period.
1
Plan B would be for the Democratic establishment and the mainstream media (like you, Michelle Goldberg) to get behind Bernie or risk giving us another four years of Trump.
3
If Sanders can't pull it off tomorrow, he's done.
On Super Tuesday, Sanders is predicted to win in Texas and California, the two big prizes of the night.
If Sanders wins, it could be because he has assembled a strong coalition of blacks, Latino, Asian Americans, Gen X, Millennials, Gen Z, progressives, Jews and working class whites - in other words - an emerging democratic majority.
We saw the outlines of this result in Sanders' numbers in the Nevada caucuses.
In 2002, John B. Judis and Ruy Teixeira, published their book, “The Emerging Democratic Majority,” forecasting major changes in the composition of the electorate which would favor Democrats over Republicans for years to come. More than a decade later, we were still waiting, and in an article in The New Republic in 2017, Judis walked his argument back.
https://newrepublic.com/article/144547/redoing-electoral-math-argued-demographics-favored-democrats-wrong
Maybe he spoke too soon.
Sanders raised $46M in February - all from small donors.
Next Wednesday morning, pour yourself a cup of coffee and crunch the exit poll results.
You will be looking for evidence of a tectonic shift in voting patterns.
Cheers
With the DNC "choosing" their favored candidate, befuddled Biden, they are going to stick us with a 2nd term of Trump. SAD for the United States.
2
I can't stop staring at that Sanders rally crowd photograph. Easily 80-90 percent men! That's a bigger gender imbalance than at some of Trump's rallies. Are all the progressive women in Boston at a Warren rally across town? I hope so.
4
Biden will get crushed by Trump.
Biden will spit and sputter in the debates .He can barely form full sentences.
Trump will refuse to debate Sanders.
2
I heard Bernie speak & inspire yesterday and he changed my mind. I will vote for Bernie. Joe fails time & again to fully address the future needs of our Republic. Bernie can tromp Trump.
1
I favored Warren but she's not really in the running any more and Bernie would be torpedoed by the "socialist" label, which red-scared MAGA hats will conflate with a communist takeover. So it's got to be Biden. I hope and pray that enough Dems will realize this and coalesce behind the only candidate who can beat Trump and perhaps get rid of his sycophants in the Senate.
3
“When parties nominate candidates further from the center, it actually inspires the other party to turn out.”
Trump is pretty far from center. So, doesn't this work both ways?
And why does this publication go after progressive candidates so enthusiastically?
The Democratic leadership put forth a 2016 'Republican-Lite', Hillary Clinton, as their presidential candidate. How did that work out? Senator Sanders is an FDR democrat. We need him. It's great that Ms. Goldberg isn't worried about medical bills, and no collective bargaining rights, and a powerful oligarchy with its jackboot on the neck of the middle and working classes, but darn it, I am.
Anyone not a Bernie Bros knows all this. The best way to lose an election is count on winning votes from young people who have zero history of voting.
The telling example is Obama, who was an historic candidate, the most important African American political figure in American history since MLK. And for all that, he increased African American turnout by a “whopping” 5 percent.
Backing Bernie knowing that beating Trump requires 19 year olds to vote is political suicide.
1
There's little evidence a progressive candidate *needs* to remake the electorate.
The time is ripe for a big break from the status quo, both the politics of the last 50 years or so in general, and from the toxicity that is Trumpism in particular.
No self-styled "moderate" can, or even wants to, provide that.
Thank you! You hit to the heart of the matter. Turn out for voters 18-29 has been DOWN in this election, and that stat is being overlooked far too much. Bernie has homepath if his voters dont show up. So far, they have not.
Thank you for writing about this. Boomers and others who are over 45-50 are turning out. Let's see if these trends hold today!
1
Interesting analysis but other than the college educated white women snippet it said nothing about how Biden fared. Is there data supporting Biden as a better bet than Sanders, especially in the crucial swing states? That is the question.
Actually, I think the author framed the core Bernie issue extremely well. It reduces to two fundamental points:
1. There are a not insignificant number of moderate Democrats and Independents that simply will not vote for Sanders.
2. As the article says, they'd need to be replaced by turning out a significant number of new voters.
It is true that there are a great number of Americans that do not vote. (In fact you have to go back to 1968 to find an election that had more than 60% - turnout has been hovering around the mid 50s for some time now.)
So the central question is whether Sanders could jump that turnout by a large enough degree to offset the moderates that he alienates (as well as the increased Republican turnout he'd likely cause).
Is it possible? Absolutely. Obama's first election saw a 58.2% turnout - up from 55.7% in the previous election. (Might sound small, but each percentage point represents over 2 million voters.) Obama made himself very comfortable to traditional, moderate Democrats, but also brought a great number of new, farther left folks to the polls that hadn't voted in years (or ever).
So possible? Yes. We live in wild, unpredictable times. Likely with Sanders? That's the big question.
Sanders won the NH primary but turn-out by first time voters and younger voters were both down by about 2% over 2016.
I can't find similar data for Nevada.
Sanders had better have long age-related coattails. I doubt he has much in the way of down ballot coattails.
The hubris of Sanders' response that he doesn't need to speak to Republican women in the suburbs to defeat Trump, like so many other of his positions, speaks volumes to why his intransigence is a losing formula for Democrats.
3
Bernie Sanders is going to win in a landslide today, with a broad coalition of voters that only excludes boomers.
I don’t know how pundits can keep getting away with being wrong over and over. I wish I had that kind of job security.
3
The numbers show 18-29 year olds have not been showing up so far. Not in the numbers he needs them to. It will be interesting to see if that changes today. He has a great chance in CA, which will give him a lot of delegates. Let's see what happens!
3
The key line in this column is that in order to win, Sanders will "have to learn to persuade people, not mobilize them." So far, it's pretty clear that his inflexible, one-note style isn't persuading anyone other than the excitable, naive idealists in his base. As we saw so clearly in 2018, the distaste for Trump among independents and moderate Republicans was key to the Democrats' gains in the House. With Sanders at the head of the Democratic ticket, it's a good bet that many of them would hold their nose and vote for Trump.
3
If Joe Biden is the eventually Democratic candidate, his running mate will be extremely important because he probably won't finish out his term. He is a non-stop gaffe machine and seems to get confused at every turn. He and Bernie may be close to the same age, but Bernie seems to be a lot more on the ball. I am moderate, but I don't fear a Bernie Presidency as much as I fear 4 more years of Trump. After all, the President isn't a dictator (although Trump would prefer that) so he can't propose anything that won't pass a more moderate congress.
1
Bernie blames the corporate establishment. The blame lies in himself. He is consistent in his inflexibility. He is too independent for a job that requires a person who is inclusive. As in. What kind of cabinet would Bernie appoint? (I draw a blank on that one.)
I can easily imagine any of the other candidates reaching out to talented people who are not ideologues. But not Bernie. He appears to eschew the kind of people he would need.
1
@pat Bernie Sanders has passed legislation with John McCain, a Republican...
Bernie-or-bust feels a little like extortion to me. And (call me Ukrainian or something) I do not like being extorted. Nice election you got here, sad if something should happen to it. In order bring down the current regime and have a chance at moving the nation back onto the path of helping people live better, more meaningful lives, we need to focus, and that means tamping down sectarian (in a political sense) emotion and ramping up rational discourse.
3
The "strategy" of alienating--in fact, directly antagonizing--reliable voters in favor of low-propensity voters, is the main reason Sanders is toward the bottom of my list. This despite the fact that I'm closer to him on the issues than I am to Biden, who's been wrong about a concerning number of big things over his very long career. (I am a committed Warren supporter, but sadly I doubt she'll still be in the race by the time my state votes next month.)
All I care about is winning this election and buying the country, and the world, a little more time to address the existential challenges of climate change and inequality. If there were grounds to believe Sanders really could drive a surge of new voters to the polls, I'd probably be willing to take the leap of faith... despite the vicious ugliness of his social media cult and my real doubts about his ability to function as an executive in a pluralistic system. But so far, no dice.
I'll take the moderate suburban moms, the win in November, and progress toward the big goals that should unite us all as Democrats. Come to think of it, that feels like a solid manifestation of "Not me. Us."
7
Obama inspired a 5% increase in black turnout, but black turnout was already pretty high. Despite being blamed for Clinton’s loss, the “low” black turnout in 2016 was a decent 59.6%. It speaks to Obama’s unique appeal that he boosted black turnout in 2012 from this strong baseline to an impressive 66.6%.
Youth turnout has always been dismal. But that means a 5% increase is easier to achieve than squeezing an extra 5% out of a community that already shows up to vote.
It’s fair to flesh out the numbers behind Bernie’s calls for revolution. But it’s important to provide context for those numbers.
2
The research paper is made on assumption that the young people will not vote even if they said they would, on the other hand the paper assumes that Reps will vote for some Dem candidates if they said so. But on what data is this assumption based?
3
I would much rather place my bets on the suburban swing voters who turned in 2018 then the youth vote which never turns out in great numbers. And if those younger voters vow to not vote or vote for Trump if Sanders isn't the nominee well they are going to have to live a lot longer then I will with our planet's ruined environment and an even more conservative Supreme Court.
4
"...by nominating Sanders, Democrats would be trading some of the electorate’s most reliable voters for some of its least. To prevail, Democrats would need unheard-of rates of youth turnout."
Every election, the youth vote is the Holy Grail. In college towns, that vote seems overwhelming. If you go 100 miles from a college town, the 18-24 year old person is looking for free wifi and cheap food. Voting, retirement and infrastructure are from an AMC or FX show.
Elders and retires show up to vote at every election. Without fail.
You know how this ends. Bernie, Joe, Bloomberg and Warren won't be around in 2024.
Unfortunately, when I point this out to young voters who rabidly support Sanders, they come back with, "You can't trust polls." Which, you can kind of understand.
I can't stand Bernie and don't see him as a viable candidate in a general election. He hasn't faced a real, sustained opposition attack yet. The Democratic candidates, for whatever reason, have treaded lightly around him in 2016 and 2020. The Republican machine will not be so deferential. I can only imagine the ads they have waiting for release. There is a reason why Putin and Trump want him to win the nomination.
7
@MMS I get it. That's why I voted for Biden, early. I'm with Trump for the win.
The failure lays with the DNC elite. Biden wasn't their first choice. They couldn't stop Bernie. Now, the DNC has co-opted Amy and Mayor Pete. The average Dem voter gets a redux of 2016.
The cautionary note about Sanders’ assumption he’d pull huge new young voters into the election flies in the face of actual experience: older voters are far more likely to follow through and vote, however the final Dem-nominee shakes out; older voters treat elections as a civic responsibility. Younger voters, not so much.
3
In 29 YEARS in Congress, Bernie Sanders has gotten exactly THREE bills passed—and two of them were renaming Vermont post offices.
Sure it’s fun to be part of a “movement.” But I’d rather vote for someone who can actually get things done (not to mention WIN).
9
He introduced many amendments, including one that allocate mony for community health center. He, actually, was a cosponsor Of the bill allowing to import medicine from Canada to lower the prices. Thank to 13 moderate Dems(including Booker) who could not upset the corporation, the bill failed, but that showed the value of Sanders 's of the moderates.
2
@Babs
He's actually done a lot especially when you consider he's been fighting against the corporate Democrats and the corporate Republicans his entire life. He's been the lone light of reason and morality.
“A campaign ad for Sander said, "Bernie Sanders passed more roll call amendments in a Republican Congress than any other member."
That’s a very specific way of slicing and dicing Sanders’ effectiveness as a lawmaker, but it’s accurate. From 1995 to 2007, when Republicans controlled Congress, Sanders passed the most roll call amendments (17) out of anyone in the House of Representatives.”
- PolitiFact
Thank you Michelle Goldberg! I am not sure that Joe Biden can win the general election but I am far more inclined to believe that Sen. Sanders cannot win the general election. By far, the most admirable, most intelligent, selfless patriot who most clearly understands and defends the values that sustain our democratic republic that I have observed in the Democratic race is Mayor Pete Buttigieg. His speech on Sunday night reminded me how an American leader should act, think and speak. Every American should listen to that speech and take it to heart. Pete Buttigieg is now supporting Joe Biden. That's all I need to know.
9
Very liberal 22 year old here. If Biden wins the most delegates, sure I will vote for him. Climate change will continue to worsen, wages will continue to stagnate, and many people won't have healthcare, but at least it will be a little better than Trump. But if Bernie wins the most delegates and the establishment gives it to anyone else, there is ZERO percent chance I vote for them, and the Democratic Party will alienate millions for the foreseeable. It's simple really.
5
@Zachary A plurality does not a majority make. These right now are the rules, and they cannot be changed so late in the game. I am an older "very liberal" person, but until the rules are changed (they were changed after the 2016 to not allow the super delegates to vote in the first round), then we have to swallow a bitter pill and go with the flow. I will never ever do that for trump, but I will for any Dem candidate. I cannot take 4 more years, and the health of many of my aging loved ones cannot either. I want Sanders or Warren because I want the future for our youth to be much better, but the youth also now have to understand that 4 more years of trump can affect their elders more than they realize. Please reconsider.
4
Everyone is certain of the outcome (expanding the electorate, contracting the electorate) before the election and then there is voting. And nearly everyone gets it wrong
Politics is a complex process.
What you can say of a candidate today is likely wrong - particularly with dynamics in play with more than two candidates.
Lets see, didn't nearly every poll and pundit say that Trump would lose and that Clinton would win?
Prognostication is not even an art, it is a cudgel put to subtle use against ones foes.
1
Well put, but this is no ordinary election. It's about Trump.
If Trump is reelected, it will be a veto for democracy.
(Veto and vote contain the same letters. Please note)
If Democrats want to win, with Bernie or Biden they need reasons.
The reasons given, so far, lack emotional appeal, for voters.
I suggest Democrats search for more compelling reasons, now.
Trump is so attractive, because his threats dominate the media.
Good news and bad news, about Trump, still fuel Trump's media.
So, I hope Democrats will start convincing voters to veto Trump.
They can push (Bernie or Bidden) for a new democracy wave.
(Trump is like a democracy-virus)
"Democracy is coming to the USA" (Leonard Cohen)
1
This country is getting older, not younger. Roughly 55% of Americans are over 35 years old. Only approximately 21% are between 19 and 35. Sanders better start doing his math and expand his base beyond the millennials he already has in his pocket. He needs to start attracting the very people he’s scaring away now, people like me. Otherwise many older Democrats will just stay home. Moderate your message Bernie. Don’t lose us.
4
But millennials are here to stay longer. They will be ones who will be 40, 45, 50, 55 and so on. Bernie want to change the society, not just win the election.
I like Elizabeth Warren, but given her poor performance in the primaries and poor poll numbers she should withdraw in favor of Bernie to get a more accurate read on the progressive/centrist contest for the Democratic nomination.
3
No she should stay in so that when Bernie fails on the first vote at the convention she can step forward as a progressive from a red state whose numbers add up.
It makes complete sense for her to stay in unless you’re one of the 30-35pct of 55pct who is already committed and to Bernie. FYI that’s is ~18 pct of the total electorate.
Elizabeth Warren's support of Bernie will give the progressive platform a significant boost. What makes you think that a Dem brokered convention will turn to anyone but Biden ?
Given a choice between going out for a pizza and beer with friends or standing in line with friends to vote, most young voters will choose the former. Yes, they will.
5
Unfortunately I have to agree with you. I work with a group of under 30s and I assume most are not Trump supporters. After every debate I asked whether anyone listened or watched. None. But the majority of them admitted to watching the Bachelor instead. I hope the Bachelor isn’t on television on Election Day.
6
Am I wrong, or is it unreasonable to bestow the nomination on someone who wins the plurality, but not the majority vote. To me 40 vs 20-20-20 should not win if the three 20’s get together and make one 60. 60 beats 40 where I come from. So why is this even an issue. The only challenge is because of the super delegates. If they take the nomination away from Sanders, I understand. Which begs the question, why do we still have super delegates?
4
But why should 20 vs 40-20-20 win?
If a moderate voter refuses to vote for the Democratic nominee, they should go ahead and change their party status to Republican.
5
I'm in the swing state of PA and mainly hang out with 30-something Democrats. No one I know likes Sanders. Most have been supportive of Pete and Warren, and all prefer Biden over Sanders. At a party last weekend, I lost count of all the people going on about how they couldn't stand Sanders. With his deep ties here, PA would be an easy win for Biden but I don't think Sanders would have a shot here in the general.
709
@JD
Just the opposite here in Michigan. I've seen no passion for anyone but Sanders. That's not to say there isn't support for other candidates, but it's that kind of mild support Hillary Clinton had here. She lost the state.
158
@JD Anecdote hardly beats data, and the data says Sanders is polling better than Biden in PA. I don't mean to discount your experience, only to suggest that perhaps one's social circles cannot provide a full picture of an entire state.
183
@J.C. Biden is a PA native and has long had ties to the blue collar voters who went for Trump last time (I mean, he was born in Scranton after all - that's the swing district heart of PA). In general, people really respect him and view him as a 'good guy' and, ultimately, that's what can win him the critical swing voters who absolutely would stay with Trump over Sanders.
72
The likely winner already sounds like a different kind of elitist who rejects reaching out to Republican women in the suburbs in places like PA, WI, MI. Well educated, they are potential swing voters. Are they Sanders' deplorables? After all, they have money, wealth. Sanders' young friends see that pecuniary identity as evil. In Sanders' view, you don't persuade your opponent, you overwhelm your opponent, in his case with millions of young, fresh voters, first time voters, who will swarm the polls for him. If he can get rid of Donald Trump, his way has its merits. To govern that way, however, makes me worry that another autocrat is on the way.
430
@blgreenie
Please. Bernie has been a politician for over 40 years. Which part of his record offers even the slightest hint that he is "another autocrat"? It's the moderates' scaremongering that is starting to look deplorable.
72
It surprised me that the people still believe in the power of persuasion after years of futile attempts that slowed the progress and delivered the number of victories to the Reps. Maybe trying Sanders's way, it is not just a bad idea. After all, look at Trump. He ignores half of the electorate and yet delivers on the conservative agenda.
42
@yulia
Truly strange that McConnell delivers for Trump. Trump has captured the R's and they fear his tweets and losing their power. Can't quite see Bernie doing that, even if he tried. Democrats aren't wired that way.
23
Bernie voters are much like the candidate himself - selfish and thinking only of themselves. Already a large percentage of them have said they will not vote for the Democratic nominee if it isn't Bernie.
Some ten percent of Bernie voters voted for Trump in 2016. https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds We are careening toward a dictatorship because of Bernie Bros' tantrum four years ago. His rival, by the way, got four million more primary votes than he did, but then, facts just don't seem that important to many Bernie Bros. They believe he "deserved" the nomination anyway.
We are headed for a replay, and as Ms. Goldberg points out, Bernie and his ideologues have done nothing to bring in new voters.
Bernie Bros, mostly young white males, know their own lives will be little changed under a continuation of the Trump presidency. They know they'll never be racially profiled. The overturn of Roe v Wade means nothing to them. And they will never have to fight for equal pay for equal work.
People of color, women, religious minorities - these Americans have never been on Bernie Bros' "conscience". I'm a woman of color in my 60's. And my life, and the lives of tens of millions of other Americans like me have been made immeasurably worse with Trump in office, than had Mrs. Clinton won. I speak for millions of people who have paid the price of Bernie Bros' tantrum in the last election when I say - grow up.
634
@Orion Clemens This is the kind of response that makes me want to vote for Trump. Which maybe is your purpose(plant?) I'm a Sanders supporter in my 50s. I switched parties to vote for Sanders in 2016. I plan to vote for Democratic nominee if the primary process is fair. If Sanders somehow loses, and Sanders declares he has lost fairly and endorses the nominee(as he did in 2016), I will vote for that candidate. Cut the "Bernie Bros" crayola as well if you want his supporters to vote.
223
@Orion Clemens
A large portion of Biden supports--in these comment pages have said they would not vote for Bernie, so it goes both ways. We cannot control those on either side, and it's a weak argument to mention this on one side and not the other.
To want universal health care, higher minimum wage, and free tuition so everyone can live a good life and to tax the rich is not selfish. It really saddens me to hear someone call that philosophy and the people who are supporting it with their donations selfish.
321
I am a 78 year old Bernie supporter - am I supposed to grow up? I was born during the Franklin Delano Roosevelt administration, a real Democrat, in my opinion.
You Republican Lite so called "moderate" folk would be seen as right wingers in Europe.
If Biden wins enough delegates to be the nominee, I will vote for him but will not if DNC finagling gives him the nomination.
254
Sanders might be Jesus himself but if he causes losses in the Senate and the House, he will be completely ineffective as a President and his term will be similar to Carter's and Obama's. They were fine men with fine ideas. Winning the Presidency is simply not enough.
Remember also that Supreme Court judge appointments are in the hands of Congress and they won't approve any Bernie suggestions if he loses Congress - very likely given his disinterest in Republican swing voters and (incredibly) in Bloomberg campaign help should Sanders get the nomination. This should be on the minds of every Democrat today especially.
5
If the frustrated Sanders supporters stay home if he is not the nominee, then they do not understand the process or political history. I support many of Bernie's positions. If he isn't the nominee - so what. The president is not a legislator and does not have to be the most liberal person in the party. Would these voters have supported Lyndon Johnson - probably more of a Washington Insider than has ever existed? Would FDR have been too wealthy to understand the problems of poor people? Even Nixon did some fairly progressive things (along with some pretty bad ones).
So this group will stay home. Stay home and not support their local house rep who is probably very close to them ideologically? Stay home and avoid voting for local and state offices? Stay home and not support their senator if they are running? If they aren't going to help any of those candidates, then how can they be counted on to vote in November - regardless of the nominee.
Bernie talks about a movement from the ground up. If that is the case, hit the ground, and focus on local and state elections. That is how change happens. And that is why we find ourselves in our current predicament.
6
Bernie, like Trump, is not the least bit interested in expanding his base. They are candidates for true believers and no one else. They are both too old, arrogant and set in their ways to ever consider compromise. They are my way or the highway dudes.
That it is demonstrably false that Sanders is actually turning out the youth vote is beside the point. Better to fail nobly and lie about it when our democracy collapses.
6
I got the impression that 'm way or highway' is way of the moderates considering how much they are trying to deny Sanders nomination. Just because you in the middle of road, doesn't mean you are not authoritarian.
1
@yulia No one is trying to deny Sanders the nomination. If he gets a majority of delegates, he will be the democratic nominee and I will vote for him.
But vigorously opposing a candidate who is not even a democrat and will likely lose in a landslide is a very sensible strategy for those who see him as Trump lite.
3
@Sparky Well, if the moderates vigorously opposed to Bernie, why they expect Bernie's supporters to vote for their candidate? Why would Bernie lose in the landslide unless the moderates will not vote for him? And if so, isn't it classic example "my way or highway"?
Sanders is the nuclear option. It's not good and should never have come to this. The war is on. I'm an older libertarian and I'm supporting Sanders because it's the most honest position.
It's not going to work, coercion never does.
I would prefer my capitalist friends voluntarily work towards a better society, but they've shown no interest, and I'm convinced, they never will. It's sad.
Moderates are complicit in all this. They're the worst because they never think it's a good time to confront ANYTHING! They're milquetoast.
When there are wrongs being done, and there have been so many terrible things done, the time to sacrifice some comfort, grow a spine, and confront them is necessary and justified.
Beyond the punditry regarding previous US election cycles where both the analysis of demographic trends and polling got it wrong in actual voting (as dramatically evidenced in the 2015-2016 Hillary-Trump debacle), one has to look at the insidious growth of populism across the globe, as well as in our country. In the Bill Clinton era, it was “the economy, stupid.” In the post-modern era of rampant populism, like it or not, it’s “the fear of outsiders, stupid.“ This is the troubling phenomenon in need of resolution. I hope our political leadership is up to the task, otherwise we are in deep trouble.
3
"After all, Sanders partisans sometimes insist that Democrats have no choice but to nominate their candidate because they’ll stay home otherwise, a sneering imitation of traditional centrist demands for progressive compromise."
God, I hate this attitude with a passion. Once again, voting is not about "expressing your values, etc." It's about filling the vacant seats in Congress, in state legislatures, and that big seat in the White House.
2
“The key to this election is, can we get millions of young people who have never voted before into the political process, many working people who understand that Trump is a fraud, can we get them voting?”
No, the key to the election is getting Trump out of power, not giving young people and working people a civics lesson.
The only thing that restrains greedy politicians is the fear of losing the next election. If you want to know what they do when they're not afraid of voters, look up the history of Jim Crow. Then people were prevented from voting. CHOOSING not to vote is like walking up to a politician and saying "Please kick me."
2
What sad choices. This ailing republic needs some sunshine and fresh air.
None of these three sputtering, old men - Trump, Biden, and Sanders - comes anywhere close to Warren in terms of energy, genuine optimism, character, and intellect. In fact it would be a blessing if those guys just got off the public stage. Enough of this nonsense.
2
"About 37 percent of Democrats and independents under 35 voted in 2016." That's pathetic. Why is it Bernie's job to push that to 48 percent? Those (non)voters will get what they deserve by not voting. They have the power, but will get Trump. Sad.
1
The fact that we're even having this conversation about who has the best chance to defeat Trump is a major indictment of our educational system. Trump has repeatedly broken the law, norms, and has conducted himself shamefully. He should be polling at 1%.
2
All the polls show any Democrat beating Trump by a small or wide margin. Have we already forgotten Hunter, Ukraine, and corruption? Trump dropped all that when it looked like Biden was sinking, but it gives us just a taste of what the Trump machine, which runs from Fancy Bear to Lindsey Graham, will do to whoever wins the Democratic nomination. No one should take any solace from today's polls.
Four more years of Trump will mean a flood of far right judges, and almost certainly at least one more Supreme Court nominations, all vetted by the Federalist Society and rushed through by Mitch. It will mean not only no action on the climate but a reversal of what little has been done. It will mean further gutting of environmental regulations. It will mean more sanctioning of racist, misogynist, and xenophobia hatred. It will mean gerrymandering after the census on a scale only dreamt of by Republicans. It will mean the enshrinement of voter suppression laws. The list, it seems, is endless.
I don't know who will beat Trump after the Russians and Republicans are done smearing, lying, and, you may be sure, launching Congressional investigations; after Barr authorizes investigations into Democrats but not Republicans; after who knows what outrageous claims are laid against the Democrat and amplified in the blogosphere.
Turnout, soft Republican suburban women, college students -- what will make the difference? No one knows.
2
Bernie supporters are beginning to wake up from their dream and will have to reckon with reality. The many fallacies that they've been lulled into believing include:
1. Sanders plans to double the federal government will be largely paid for by tax increases on millionaires and billionaires. This is false. The middle class will foot the majority of the bill because it is far larger than the top 1%.
2. Sanders is inspiring so many young and new voters that turnout will propel him to victory. Also nonsense, as revealed by Ms. Goldberg in this op-ed. Turnout is flat or down.
3. Billionaires are to blame for everything from student loans, expensive healthcare, the nonsensical tax code, our crumbling infrastructure, the demise of unions and everyone's lot in life. Sanders never offers a shred of evidence to support these claims and neither do his supporters. Yet that doesn't stop them from trotting this ditty out any time they are pressed to justify his radical campaign platform.
4. Democratic socialism isn't socialism at all. Nonsense. Any expansion of the government into the private sector, in particular where the private sector is replaced by the government, is socialism. Bernie's plans to implement M4A in America is socialism 101. If it is illegal for the private sector to "compete" with the public sector, it's socialism folks. Say it with me...Bernie Sanders is a socialist.
2
Bernie's youth need to take off their blinders. Bernie is
high risk against Republicans and that moderate swath
of voters down the middle. I really think that Bernie's ego
is the problem here. How badly does he want Trump
defeated? Is the adulation getting in the way of Bernie
realizing how risky Bernie is? This is not the time for risk;
Bernie's defense over Medicare For All has big holes in it.
He is fueling Democratic Party conspiracy theories against
him which is duping his inexperienced followers. And that
is not the right thing to do at such a critical juncture.
1
All these polls, commentaries and analysis about 2020 are meaningless if the Russians can convert any vote against Trump into a vote for him through cyber warfare. We are not smart enough to prevent this. Expect Trump to win by cheating. He has decimated the intel communities and the amateurs running them have no clue what the Russians are doing and going to do.
2
How nice to think it is just the Russians “duping” voters. It isn’t- at all. Look into the RNC digital strategy, their willingness to target voters based on psychological warfare tactics, and their overwhelming financial advantage.
The RNC has our data - that we just sign away blithely- and they have weaponized it against the electorate. Combine that with the Fox News machine...
It would be nice to think it is all the work of a foreign power because we might not have ourselves to blame them. But there is a reason Republicans aren’t breaking from the president. It’s not loyalty to him; it’s access to that data.
1
What if the tables were turned, and it was Biden who was getting large, energized crowds, and amassing huge campaign donations, and had won the first three states, and was leading in the polls for California and Texas and elsewhere for Super Tuesday? Do you think for a moment the DNC and Establishment would be trying to tear him down and doing anything it could to stop him?
Of course not!
How stupid would that be? To actively undermine your strongest candidate, the one who shows he's consistently the one to likely beat Trump in almost all the polls? Wouldn't that be dumb?
And yet, that's exactly what the DNC is doing. They are so desperate to keep Sanders from the nomination, and the chance that he could become President and proceed to upset the Status Quo, that they'd rather risk losing and having Trump for four more years! At least with Trump, the patronage system they all gorge themselves off of continues unabated, and the power structures remain unchanged. As bad as Trump is, and as much a threat to our democracy and well being, the Establishment prefers him to Sanders.
Does that sound like democracy to you? Is it not clear that our system is broken already, and serves only the very few?Trump is the visible sign of this rot, but the DNC is every bit as guilty doing their damage in the shadows.
The only way to get our democracy back is to take it back from the oligarchy by electing Bernie Sanders. We're at a turning point...choose your direction wisely.
2
I’m astonished that we cannot nominate a woman for office. Bernie Sanders is the nominee for wealthy Marin County and their kids. And face it, these men are old, one foot on the banana peel.
3
If Bernie gets the most votes and gets cheated out of the nomination, the party will self-destruct. I'm not a young spoiled brat. Americans of all ages are demanding democracy. It should not come as a surprise.
2
Those voters actually did turn out for Bernie in the primaries. Then they didn't turn out for Hillary in the general. Bernie can turn them out, but the machine politicians can't. That does not make them unreliable voters, it makes them discerning voters -- they won't vote for trash offered up instead of what they support.
4
Biden will get new votes from the vast number of disillusioned Republicans while retaining Democratic party dependables. Bernie won't.
This fact, coupled with how undependable his so-called new voter group is, means if Bernie wins the Democratic primary, Trump wins the general election.
3
Looks like it's between Bernie and Biden. Biden already is a disaster. His record is terrible, and there is a corruption scandal waiting in the background. Poor fundraising and he doesn’t have volunteers on the ground. No message, except that he is the establishment guy. And he can barely campaign. I truly feel sorry for him, because the man is not doing well. Trump will mop up the floor with him.
The Democrats are behind the same losing strategy from 2016, with a much worse candidate. Either they are criminally incompetent, or they are in so love with power that they would rather have four more years of Trump than Bernie. Who can win, and not just because he has an inspiring message and is incredibly popular. His campaign has been on the ground organizing, and just this month ordinary people contributed $46 million to his campaign.
Right now the only way out of this mess is to vote for Bernie. I promise it won’t be nearly as bad as you fear, and so much better than you imagine.
1
"...young people who say they won’t vote, or will vote third party, unless Sanders is the nominee."
What is wrong with these young Sanders supporters that they do not care about their future enough to vote, or to vote third party, which is the same as voting for trump, if Sanders is not the nominee? How immature is that? I am 63 and support Biden, but I will vote Democrat no matter who the nominee is, because trump is such a threat to our country and our future.
1
So, let me get this straight:
Bernie's youthful supporters may or may not vote. And Bernie is unlikely to swing many undecided or Trump voters who have finally regained consciousness.
And Biden, with his wide appeal to moderates and African-Americans, inspires no-one, but may swing undecideds.
What a choice!
We may be cursed with 4-more years of the most corrupt, incompetent and venal administration ever! Ugh.
2
Bernie can't count, period. His math skills are atrocious. He keeps on selling the free lunch when someone, sometime must pay. There are revenues, obligations, and disbursements in the finance and accounting world. Bernie hasn't the faintest idea of these notions.
1
Sanders wants our (Democratic) name, brand, money, and nomination, but refuses to join us as he attacks all of us that don't support him as in the pockets of billionaires and the Party as being corrupt.
Don't poison the food bowl where you plan to eat if you want to win the election.
End the chaos. Defeat Trump and Putin. Nominate a Democrat.
3
Sanders is doomed because the DNC is going all out to steal the election.
The surprise was that Pete and Amy selling out tonite. At the end they showed their true colors.
Sanders will not be allowed to win by the very party he represents.
For shame.
I'd never vote for Mr. Trump. But I'd never vote for Mr. Biden, either. The latter would return the country to its slow course of annihilation of the middle class and do-nothing road to destruction of the environment. I would like my vote to mean something.
I’m happy either way. If Biden gets the nomination, he stands a reasonable chance of beating Trump. If Bernie gets the nomination, he goes down in flames and loses the House in the biggest landslide of modern times. The courts go hardcore right wing for two generations. And Bernie’s supporters will have to face the fact once and for all that their ideology is not nearly as popular among Americans as they think it is, and that their revolution was a stupid pipe dream. That alone would be almost be worth the crushing defeat of rational America. Except they’ll probably insist the numbers are fake and it was all a conspiracy once again to defeat the poor little Vermont democratic socialist.
2
All the polls show any Democrat beating Trump by a small or wide margin. Have we already forgotten Hunter, Ukraine, and corruption? Trump dropped all that when it looked like Biden was sinking, but it gives us just a taste of what the Trump machine, which runs from Fancy Bear to Lindsey Graham, will do to whoever wins the Democratic nomination. No one should take any solace from today's polls.
Four more years of Trump will mean a flood of far right judges, and almost certainly at least one more Supreme Court nominations, all vetted by the Federalist Society and rushed through by Mitch. It will mean not only no action on the climate but a reversal of what little has been done. It will mean further gutting of environmental regulations. It will mean more sanctioning of racist, misogynist, and xenophobia hatred. It will mean gerrymandering after the census on a scale only dreamt of by Republicans. It will mean the enshrinement of voter suppression laws. The list, it seems, is endless.
I don't know who will beat Trump after the Russians and Republicans are done smearing, lying, and, you may be sure, launching Congressional investigations; after Barr authorizes investigations into Democrats but not Republicans; after who knows what outrageous claims are laid against the Democrat and amplified in the blogosphere.
Turnout, soft Republican suburban women, college students -- what will make the difference? No one knows.
1
This ridiculous speculation rings of desperation. Have you actually interviewed any young people? I have yet to meet a single teenager who does NOT support Bernie. The youth of America will turn out as it’s their future, and trends indicate that they will. In the midterms many precincts showed a 500 percent increase in the under 25 first-time voter category. Bloomberg doesn’t figure whatsoever in this age group and Biden doesn’t inspire them. The fact is, you just don’t know. What we do know is that Bernie has been polling at getting 60 percent of the voters under 30, and that was when there were 10 candidates.
He still has my vote.
2
In 2016, the largest number of voters were the 100 MILLION that "didn't vote"! Sanders is right, unless democrats galvanize a significnt number of these disaffected democrats to substantially increase the total number going to the polls, it won't matter who the nominee is, they will lose!
Trump won with fewer votes than McCain received when he lost. By disenfranchising voters with uninspiring candidates, the major parties kill democracy.
After a few weeks of having Sanders supporters here accusing those of us who do not support him and in fact are terrified of a Sanders nomination of planning to stay home in November rathe than vote for Sanders, now that Biden has a good shot, I worry a lot that Sanders supporters not only will stay home but will launch their 2016/Trump refrain about the DNC rigging it for Biden, and thereby rationalizing not voting for Biden. I wish Sanders supporters would get real about this and realize this election is not about Medicare for all which cannot happen even if Sanders becomes president, but is about one thing: Getting Trump out and literally saving American democracy, which is on very thin ice right now, and even arguably already a banana republic with Barr having corrupted the DOJ. That is what this election is about. Sanders cannot defeat Trump in the Electoral College. I wanted so badly to vote for Buttigieg, but I, very sadly, gave it up last week and decided I have to vote for Biden, even though I don't care for him. (Then Pete made it easy for me by bowing out). This is not about me, or you...this is literally about getting our Democracy out of the strangling hands of Donald Trump and his cabal of corrupt cabinet heads. His base won't do it. We have to, therefore.
The divisive rhetoric of Bernie and his supporters even here on nytimes.com is so disheartening. I have been a Democrat for 50 years and I resent this constant hectoring against “the establishment” and “boomers”. Of course I will vote for Bernie in the general election if I have no other choice, so stop insulting me in the meantime. If you alienate Democrats like me, imagine what you are doing to people who are unpersuaded but might still be persuadable.
I guess corporate money + Stockholm syndrome still beats millions of individual donations from actual citizens. Sad!
I'm just looking for someplace to make this comment. I just voted. On the way there, I wondered if one of the men at the polling place would make comments or jokes like they usually do. And one did. He started joking about my middle initial. I just want to ask why these older egotistical men can't just leave women alone when we are trying to do our solemn duty and vote. This isn't something that has just happened once. It happens every time with different older men every time I vote or go to a Town Meeting or other electoral event. It may seem like small potatoes in the grand scheme of things but why can't these men grow up and stop with the EGO TRIPS? I say it in light of Chris Matthews too. He had many good qualities but he also fell into the trap, like Bloomberg, of treating women as constant objects of male flirtation. Or just not being able to leave women they don't even know alone. By the way, I am in my 70s and this has happened my whole voting life. No comments please from annoying men!
Polls said Hilary would destroy Trump.
Voters should vote for who they want and we share ups count the votes to see who won.
This kind of vague prognosticator is useless and making a living off of it is theft.
The way centrist Democrats are doing everything in their power to prevent Bernie is disgusting and breathtakingly undemocratic. Democrats are beginning to look a lot like Republicans.
Interesting to see the DNC backlash against Bernie Sanders being picked up and even supported by the NYT in articles such as this, however subtle it might be.
The establishment candidate did not do so well last time as she was perceived by the voters to be exactly that. Please, for the sake of the rest of the world as well as your own fine country, don't make the same mistake again. Show your voters you have integrity in your systems and let the best person win fairly and squarely and according to an impartial and objective process.
The electorate is already made up. The anti-Bernie media just wants to pull it in a more centrist position.
But the centrist positions gave us a more divided country by introducing an embarrassingly racist “anti-crime” bill, an anti-labor NAFTA, repeated bailouts of millionaires and billionaires over the past four decades, a greater divide between the haves and have-nots, wars of choice and internationally destabilizing policies, hard right Supreme Court justices, and an affordable care act that has been watered-down and may soon be ruled unconstitutional by the previously mentioned justices.
And that’s just the start.
The centrist Democrats like Michelle Goldberg are just asking us if we want some more of that “good stuff.”
No thanks.
None of us possess accurate crystal balls; none of us here can be as sure as our assertions here seem to suggest.
Defeating Trump strikes me as pretty important to the survival of our country, but again, how can I know that a second Trump term will be the catastrophe I think it will be?
The problem with the opinions here is that they are only from readers of the New York Times, which is not a representative sample of the entire electorate.
I don’t see Bernie winning; when this country has elected Democrats, they have always been middle of the roaders. (Carter, Clinton, Obama). For years, I have said that if I were saddled with 7% interest on student loans, I would be marching in the streets, as I did to protest the Vietnam War (not that those protests worked either, but at least I felt better). I have seen insufficient numbers of young people do anything to object to the needless deficiencies in their lives (high cost of education and health care, lack of a decent minimum wage). To expect them to come out in the huge numbers necessary to elect Sanders is wishful thinking.
That Joe Biden is the only alternative is depressing; he was never a successful candidate when he ran in the past and now seems old beyond his advanced years.
Perhaps a Bernie nomination would not be as bad as I think it will be; again, no crystal ball. But as someone who knocked on doors for a George McGovern, I’ve learned that being right on the issues is no predictor of success.
Any one who voted for Trump or who stays home or votes third party in a pout is voting for autocracy.
Trump is a one man band, and the GOP will allow him to play any time he wants. Trump unbound with no checks on his power is what we will get.
And, then there is the Supreme Court. RBG cannot live forever. Does any Bernie supporter really want a seven-two conservative court not to mention the lower courts that Trump and craven political back Mitch McConnell and his gang of GOP liars and thieves are busy filling with unqualified right-wing extremist baby judges who will possibly be on the bench for the next forty years?
Let Us get real. We cannot play with this election.
Biden supporters who won't vote for Sanders and Sanders supporters who won't vote for Biden in the general election may be more morally repulsive than Trump supporters because they (unlike the MAGA-hatted minions) know how much harm may come to the nation and the world from another four years of Trump. And are these fratricidal Democrats so naive as to think that the Republicans won't use every despicable tool available to them to retain power in 2024, 2028, and beyond? Come together to defeat Trump in 2020 or kiss democracy goodbye.
There's a reason Moscow prefers Bernie.
So I hope the Democrats will nominate Joe Biden, even if I have to wear several clothespins to vote for him.
1
So it comes down to who’s the bigger threat: bitter centrists voting for Trump out of spite or young people who can’t be bothered to vote.
I’d still like to give the youth a shot rather than 2016 redux with a worse candidate.
1
The media is constantly attacking Sanders. It’s so obvious in the media. Just say you want the power structure that exists and benefits people like you. Stop lying to our faces. You don’t want Americans to have medical or a real option. You don’t want to be taxed. You don’t want the established authority questioned. You don’t want Americans to be represented.
Instead of helping get voters to the polls your argument is they don’t fix. Why? In all the debates did moderate questioners ever talk about voter suppression? You don’t care about the will of the people. You don’t care that we make it as difficult as possible to vote and republicans are actively suppressing it. You don’t care that employers punish employees for voting.
You see the data and instead of helping represent the will of the people you make the argument we need someone who doesn’t represent the people because they don’t vote. Instead of solutions we have obstruction. Instead of helping we have excuses.
Maybe it’s a good laugh. Attack progressives who make up at least half the electorate and future voters as illegitimate. Talk about shaking hands and passing republican policy instead of working with progressives. It sure seems like progressives are the bad guys not republicans. The only thing you complain about is Trump says mean things publicly instead of behind closed doors like Bloomberg.
Bernie Sanders’ Rise Prompts Media Meltdown, Establishment Panic: A Closer Look - Seth Meyers
Exactly.
Sanders voters are the least logical thinking people I've encountered in my lifetime.
60 trillion dollars in programs and no plan to pay for it? A socialist getting elected president of the United States?
Get real Democrats.
A vote for Bernie is a vote for Trump
1
And all of this even before Mr Trump, the master of the fear campaign, turns Mr Sanders policies to electoral poison.
1
I still can’t believe Trump is President. Tell me which poll called for his election.
Polls are unreliable at best.
1
Other than casting shadow over a potential Bernie nomination, I don't see the point of this article. There's a lot of speculation, and all of it redounds negatively for Sanders. For example, the author predicts against a surge in new voters for Sanders, but then confidently pronounces that Sanders's nomination will bring out otherwise unlikely voters for Trump.
I wish the New York Times editorialists would have the integrity to start their "analysis" with the acknowledgement that they don't want Sanders to be the nominee. At least this unending advice to voters against Sanders wouldn't be such an insult to the paying readers' intelligence.
1
Are we just going to spend the next 8 months pretending that Joe Biden is "safe"? Joe Biden is a walking liability.
He has been riding through this primary with training wheels but the reality is that Joe Biden is bad at campaigning, bad at debating, and carries a half century of baggage that if nominated we will spend 2020 defending exhaustively.
Thats to say nothing of republicans in congress and the Justice Department furthering high-publicity farce investigations into his 'corruption' in Ukraine and whatever' scandal' they can dredge from the Obama era. They will completely reuse the Anti-Hillary playbook and Russia is waiting to assist from the sidelines.
1
Middle aged white woman here. I will vote for Sanders if he’s the nominee, but some of my friends are leery. I wish he would assure voters that his main interest is in taxing corporations and billionaires. If one is older and has a nest egg, it is scary to think that your investments will be taxed. And he needs to reassure Jewish voters that justice for Palestinians doesn’t mean abandoning Israel.
Hoping all readers here will do some homework. Sanders writeup on Wikipedia looks like it was concocted by him on his own laptop. For a broader and more in depth take - go to the 2/29/2020 edition of the Economist. Look up and read the article on Bernie Sanders. Far more revealing than campaign hoopla. The man is best left in the Senate. Lot's of goodies in his proposals. No indication that he has done his math. Elizabeth Warren on the other hand has done her math. My wish at this point - Joe Bide/Elizabeth Warren ticket. Joe for 4 years to sooth the waters and move our country back in the right direction. Elizabeth as VP to push the restoration of huge amount of damage done by Mitch and trump. Then, Elizabeth, tested and honed, break the glass ceiling and serve for two terms. Republicans into the wilderness for 12 years of more. Flip the Senate, dump trump, ditch Mitch, emasculate Graham, bar Barr, drown the Senate Republican tea party phony patriots. Send Repubs to the wilderness with personal copies of our Constitution, the Mueller Report, and the trump/Ukraine impeachment report. Maybe the will finally take the time to read all of them. Long past due.
There is a reason trump wants Bernie to win. It's because trump feels he can beat Bernie easier. With Biden, trump will lose and he knows it. That's why trump tried to smear Biden with the fake Ukraine scandal. Whichever way people vote, it cannot be for trump if we are to remain a Democracy.
1
National popular vote polls are irrelevant. We elect presidents based on the Electoral College (EC), period. Hillary Clinton beat Trump handily in the popular vote. So what? The only polls that matter are state polls, so that one can determine EC votes. Is anyone in the opinion or editorial department not getting this message?
Sanders believes his path to victory are the millennials? good luck with that.
2
Bernie’s campaign is all based on dreams of various utopian ideas, all of which have been tested in the real world, none of which have panned out. We need to snuff Bernie’s dreams.
Article number 95 in the Times trashing Bernie. When will it end? Perhaps when it occurs to the punditry that most of us actually like him and agree with him. The way he is being treated by the press is a disgrace.
1
Good going Michelle. Keep reinforcing the "No We Can't" and "Keep Hope At Bay" wing of the electorate. Find any desperate angle you can. Take off your shoe and pound it on that bully pulpit of yours at the gleaming Times glass house and hammer home the intransigent power of the conventional wisdom. That's what journalism is for, no?
As for me, I was always moderate, or more aptly reasonable, never given to grand conspiracy theories or tremulous beliefs in overarching power structures, especially in this grand old America of good folks betwixt the shining seas.
But the scales are falling away, and more hastily so by the hour, especially in these last days. I am sickened by the establishment and its desperation to cling to a dying age and its reductive privilege and grotesque inequality.
Whatever you do, Michelle, keep working every angle you can to compel the forgotten people of this Gilded Age to keep voting against their own interests. You'll be rewarded.
1
Backing Biden is supporting a candidate who has run for President in 3 previous elections and who has lost badly each time. In fact, South Carolina is the first state he has ever won in a presidential primary. And the only reason he won in South Carolina is because of an endorsement based on his association with Obama, while Obama himself has so far refused to endorse him.
This country needs real change for the future of our children, grandchildren, and the planet, not more recycled, establishment candidates who are out of touch with the real issues and are incapable of coming up with a compelling platform. We don't need a candidate who was too afraid to vote no to Iraq.
We need someone who will stand up to the establishment so that we improve infrastructure in this country, address climate change, increase minimum wage, and provide healthcare and education to our citizens. These are things we should expect to have in a wealthy, first world country. It is our right. We need someone, Bernie, who understands that linking public school funding to real estate taxes means that inner city schools are perpetually underfunded. Bernie is the only candidate with a comprehensive K-12 plan. Bernie understands that education is the key to future success for ALL our children, so that they can become leaders and innovators capable of dealing with the massive problems they are inheriting.
Bernie beat HRC in states she lost to Trump. He can beat Trump. NYT, stop biased Bernie bashing!
1
My vote as a middle aged Caucasian Democrat woman doesn’t mean anything to Sanders or his supporters. I’ve been bullied online endlessly for simply stating I don’t support him. He doesn’t care about me and I don’t care about him or his angry, self absorbed, campaign. If he’s the nominee I’m writing in the name of a Democrat.
1
Michelle....” comfort us with polls”
Really?
Nope !...voters , the wage earning type.
are not looking at polls or meta data or position papers and platforms and voting records .
A week before the actual election most Americans decide who to pick thru peer pressure and better commercials and empty promises.
Whatever the DNC calls this primary season and most recent alignment it stinks of big money and big party politics.
Bernie isn’t our answer either.
We have made no progress for wage earners
We placate WallSt. Again at our demise.
Pandemic time.
Chaos theory is no way to run a nation but trump has been allowed to do so.
1
No evidence to support the columnist's claims, but we shall see what today brings. I fear the DNC has not learned its lesson from last time around in 2016. Only time will tell
1
I sincerely hope that all of these op-ed columnists who attempt to push Bernie out face the same fate as the GOP in 2016- their attempts at casting out an enfant terrible backfired!
And it is good journalism if these op-ed writers consistently acknowledge their vested interests- in this case, it is Goldberg's husband working for Elizabeth Warren.
2
I voted for George McGovern in 1972. He lost to the "I am not a crook" crook, Richard Nixon. Derek Thompson wrote an article in "The Atlantic" (2/21/20) titled "Bernie Sanders Is George McGovern" with the byline, "The similarities between 2020 and 1972 are too astonishing to ignore". Besides the similarities of the political climates then and now, what each candidate advocated are alike; e.g. healthcare is a human right, single payer healthcare, and "contrasting corporate profiteering with the plight of workers". While George McGovern won an overwhelming majority of minority voters, he won only the state of Massachusetts. The research cited in this column suggests Millennials are unreliable voters. Senator Sanders compromises his candidacy by not reaching out beyond his grassroots supporters and by not openly supporting down ballot candidates at his rallies like VP Joe Biden does. As much as I admired George McGovern then, I remember how much my parents had affection for President Nixon (my father took pictures of him and his motorcade going through Twinsburg, Ohio), and therefore, not wishing to replicate history, I think Senator Sanders is an unacceptable choice for POTUS.
1
Warren voter/supporter here. I'm soon to be 55 y/o and will most definitely vote for Sanders if she loses the vote count.
1
Good grief, I am so tired of all the negativity about Bernie Sanders. Is the entire purpose of this election voting for the safe choice to oust Trump? Even if Biden is nominated, he might lose anyway. Trump will stop at nothing to get elected, and that includes election meddling. It sounds like even if more Democrats want Sanders than Biden, the party and Biden supporters will still try to force him on us. He's safe, boring, and uninspiring. Even Biden supporters don't really like him. They just think he is more likely to beat Trump than Sanders is.
Politics is like a marriage. There is a relationship following the wedding. They have a job to do. Inauguration is not the end of it. If Biden is elected, he might not get anything accomplished either. Neither Bernie Sanders nor Joe Biden is our Holy Grail. I'm not sure if either of them will accomplish their goals, but I'm not trying to demonize Joe Biden. Please stop trying to make Sanders supporters Biden supporters because you are so sure Sanders will destroy the country. None of us have a crystal ball and none of us know for sure what will happen. 2016 is ample evidence of that.
2
Young voters would be a wonderful sign, even if they make the same mistake I made in 1972 in thinking McGovern could win. But it's the ordinary voter who will determine when and whether the US populace believes it's worth their dwindling hope energy to vote.
Biden also wants the little and the middle to thrive, and he is so much more likely to have less singular effects: coattails, negotiation with reality, and a pervasive decency and compassion.
1
Bravo Michelle! Thank you for giving us the hard numbers that unmask truth as tough as it may be to swallow. I go to the Virginia polls today, shifting my loving (with a bit of currency thrown in) support for Elizabeth Warren to winnable for the nation, up and down the ballot, Joe Biden. She and Bernie will still nip at the heels of moderates pushing us all to an even better place.
1
Sanders has failed to increase turnout, lost by a huge margin in a state with large percentage of black voters (South Carolina), and received only 25% in a primary he previously dominated with a majority (New Hampshire).
I voted for Sanders in 2016. I'll vote for him if he's the nominee. He'll lose to Trump, and lose the House.
Sanders' strategy is to join his Socialism with outrage culture ideas, increase turnout among young voters, black voters, white working class and rural voters, as well a suburban women.
It blew up in his face in New Hampshire and South Carolina.
If you want to see what's going to happen in a general election, look at New Hampshire, not California. It's a classic swing state with more independents, (and whites).
In 2016 Sanders won a massive 22 point victory, (and 60%) against a popular opponent. In 2020 Sanders received only 25% and barely won by 1.3% against a former mayor of a city ranked 306th who lost his single run for statewide office by 25%. Sanders lost 38% of his voters from 2016.
As FiveThirtyEight detailed, Sanders ran the popular vote up in 6 cities yet suffered major loses everywhere else, including suburbs, and working class and rural areas.
Suburban women are the reason Democrats retook the House, yet Sanders' Socialism is toxic to them. His embracing outrage culture alienated socially conservative working-class and rural white voters. He hasn't increased turnout among young voters to compensate.
It means he'll lose to Trump.
2
I’ve just listened to ten friends, who were supporters of Klobuchar and Buttigieg, tell me they’re voting for Bernie or Warren in their upcoming primaries. And they want a Sanders & Warren ticket or a Warren & Sanders ticket. So...my direct evidence contradicts the entire claim here. Bernie IS getting new votes, thanks to Amy and Pete for clearing themselves out of the field and backing liar, and white good-old-boy rich democratic establishment Biden.
3
What you're providing isn't "direct evidence", it's a very small sample of anecdotal evidence, and it proves nothing.
Sorry.
2
This politics business is tough stuff - let's start with admitting that fact.
First of all, you need an energized base on your side, as that was the difference between Obama and Clinton in 2012 vs. 2016. That includes inspiring the minority vote.
But, at the same time, you want the swing voters to be on your side - those who had such an impact in the 2018 results. To inspire both swing voters and the base takes quite a candidate, which we don't seem to have, due to the fear about Bernie being a self-described socialist, and concerns about Biden's sharpness for a very tough job.
While all this is happening, you have to give thought to the energizing of the other party and their base. Then, you have to consider Sanders's point about getting new voters to vote.
This is all just political science, as well as various factors which are hard to calculate. Both Sanders and Biden have weaknesses - whether it is the base inspiration or the ability to attract moderate voters to our side. The calculation is whether Biden and the disdain for Trump is a winning combo, or whether we need a firebrand like Bernie to stand up and face down Trump, so that the Senate can be taken by sheer turnout.
That's why when we don't factor in all these areas we are missing important parts of the equation. Any discussion going forward should center on approximate voting numbers and rates for all voters - as best as possible.
2
All in for Biden now that Pete and Amy have bowed out. Was never too much of a Warren fan, even though I admire her accomplishments. Hopefully Bloomberg will make a dignified exit, too. Of course if Bernie is the eventual nominee, I'll vote for him but I doubt he can beat Trump.
1
I got the feeling from reading this that Sanders doesn’t plan to go out and persuade anyone. The worst way he could win is with broad moderate support. Much better to double down on the fabled liberal turnout so he can claim greater validation of his “movement”. He’d risk losing to get that affirmation.
2
Biden hasn’t stopped dismissing and antagonizing the progressive wing, contrary to Bloomberg who’s at least trying.
Both candidates have their work cut out for them, not just Bernie.
2
An interesting and insightful proposition by Ms. Goldberg, to be sure, but none of her conclusions are supported by the then surprising Trump victory in 2016, which the political analysts, data-miners, media pundits, pollsters got completely wrong.
3
I disagree...Bernie has shifted the Overton window in American politics back to the left a little, a needed shift given how far right the GOP has gone in defining the “center”. Polling for things like Medicare for All is on the rise meaning that he has contributed a meaningful shift in what is “acceptable” for us to even discuss politically.
2
Actual vote data thus far supports the study's conclusions.
Trump only won NH by less than 2%. He won it in 2016 by over 20%.
His win in NV was down by about 1% from his 2016 numbers there.
He picked up about 5% in SC from 2016, but still lost it.
In SC, Buttigieg did better turning out voters who had never primaried before. Given the reports of moderate Republicans who may have converted to vote for him, this doesn't bode well for Sanders.
1
You mean Sanders, right?!
I’ve yet to read a cogent strategy from Bernie’s campaign about how he’s going to register and mobilize all these new young voters. Rather, what I hear is that his very presence as the nominee is going to magically inspire young people to flock to their polling places. According to Michelle’s column today, that doesn’t seem to be happening. Most of the comments here seem to be ignoring the gist of Michelle’s argument; that so far Bernie is not bringing out new voters in the record numbers required to offset lost swing voters if he is the nominee. Further, he’s not attempting to appeal to these swing voters as a backup plan. I’m not reassured at all that Bernie can win against Trump.
8
It's remarkable that someone who is presumably politically savvy and whose husband is also involved in a campaign could be so confident about polls. The lesson pollsters should have received in 2016 should be more than sufficient to have bred a new humility about predictions based on their putatively "scientific" algorithms. More to the point, any lead by Sanders over Trump at this stage in the game is meaningless. Ms. Goldberg has discounted the GOP attack machine that will go to work with a vengeance on Sanders, a man with far more rich targets on his back that than any other candidate. It's not only the vast programs he proposes sans budgets, taking away choice from Americans on healthcare, et., but also decades of vigorously defending far left positions and leftist foreigners heads of state who are anathema to most Americans. His relying on the feckless youth vote is the least of his problems. When the GOP makes his whole life story the equivalent of a made-for-TV epic, he will sink like a stone.
4
The GOP attack machine will go into overdrive no matter the nominee is.
Take Biden.
Ukraine scandal. They'll traffic the lie that he intervened for his son. He's corrupt. He, not Trump, is the one who was the bad guy in Ukraine.
Nepotism. They'll focus on Hinter's lucrative Burisma contract and Chinese gig.
Obama-Biden administration — every single thing will be dug up and brought out — expanding the war into Afghanistan, lousy trade deals, part of the global corporate elite, against the working class, bailing out the Big Banks, fun running to Mexican drug cartels, etc.
They'll hang him out to dry with the racist, anti-minority crime bill.
They'll rail about his opposition to bankruptcy reform and favoring the credit card industry.
It's hypocritical for sure, but they have no shame.
They're trying to tar Bernie with the socialist label, claiming he's a communist as Bloomberg did, but that will not have nearly as great an impact as their attacks on Biden. Sanders has already said he's a *democratic* socialist and has decried authoritarian, communist regimes, especially China and North Korea, which Trump coddles. They can't hang militarism on him, either, as he's a stronger critic of U.S. interventionism than Trump is.
The point is that it's no as simple as people make out. If it were, John Kerry would have been elected President. They'll “Swiftboat” Biden just as they did Kerry.
Your husband is consulting for Elizabeth Warren? That doesn't speak very highly for the objectivity of New York Times Opinion Columnists.
Clearly, you have a personal interest in bad-mouthing Sanders. You should be opining on the new Baseball season - not on this primary election.
7
@Peter Zenger Where is Sanders being bad-mouthed here in the article? The author is reporting on pollsters' results and interpretations .Because the conclusions drawn from polls and the primaries and caucuses thus far are not supportive of Sanders's ability to turn out a surge of progressive voters to win a general election doesn't make them partisan.
2
Peter, *she's* not consulting for Warren and she's disclosed that in virtually every election column. Plus, you clearly didn't read what she wrote as she specifically said that the electoral weaknesses she was was describing applied even more so to Warren than to Sanders!
Goldberg is a progressive and is doing a dispassionate analysis. While I disagree with the fundamental premise of the column — that Sanders' electability rides on turning out the *youth* vote — she's making a reasonable analysis of the facts and her huband's Warren connection isn't a factor.
Here's the problem with her analysis. As to Sanders, the *bulk* of his support comes from older voters, those aged 30-64, not 18-29; just as much from “somewhat liberal” voters as “very liberal” ones; about as much from women as men; about as much from college educated vs. without; etc.
While I, too, favor Warren, Sanders is building a diverse, multiracial, multi-age coalition that spans classes, ethnicities, and ideologies. It's been impressive to see and we'll know more about it tomorrow once the dust settles from Super Tuesday.
In the meantime, let's not carp about a skilled progressive columnist!
1
Let us review the definition of progressive. Is it selling pipe dreams? Like the con man does with his relentless lies and fear mongering? The progressive in this case does the same selling”free for all” propaganda to manipulate voters. The progressive knows well that none of his proposals have zero chance of passing thru Congress. The progressive has zero legislative skill as evidenced by his poor legislative accomplishments during his 30 political years in Congress. We are extremely polarized and his poor skill will not lead to any success. Of course, we live in an era where populists are very successful in manipulating people. People should realize that Bernie changes his color during the election as it suits to his self centered goals. He is an independent during election for senate seat and then he changes his color like a lizard when it comes primary for the Presidential election. It is a travesty that some people cannot see his true color beyond “free for all” propaganda rhetoric. Based on his socialist cum independent cum democrat persona disguise, Bernie will be a toast by con man’s propaganda machine. People wake up - our goal id to defeat the corrupt con man with zero integrity by a landslide. Let us get united and support a winnable candidate.
5
Ultimately, the Dems need to let the primary season play out and let the voters choose their own path to a loss against Trump. It is highly unlikely that anyone but Biden can beat Trump in the Electoral College battleground midwest states.
4
"Plan B" is Sanders' "50 state" campaign strategy, clearly and widely broadcast already. The majority never wanted Trump and given his behavior especially since 2016, we never will. Sanders' "50 state" strategy goes even further to cover the HRC neglected Electoral College territories. Voter turnout, IMO, cannot but help Sanders. I've almost always totally agreed with Ms. Goldberg's opinion pieces, and I appreciate the data shared by her. She at least points to data rather than just gives opinion. My support remains with Sanders, but I'll also remain in that majority by voting blue no matter who.
4