Trump may have just contributed to the end of Israel as we know it. The two state solution is probably dead now -- Netanyahu will annex the Jordan valley and some other vital areas making it all but impossible to create a Palestinian state. The Palestinian Authority can admit defeat, dissolve and have Israel take over the entire thing. This means the world will have to deal with an apartheid state or Israel will have to grant citizenship to the Palestinians. Not a good outcome either way for Israel.
3
The Palestinians at present are in a weakened position, with no ability to resist the Israeli occupation. Israel has evolved into a regional superpower and can dictate any terms it chooses. The corrupt, autocratic Arab rulers are more interested in saving their own skins than supporting Palestinians. Most of them will toe the line advanced by Netanyahu, Trump and Kushner, no friends of Palestinians. It is ironic at the 75th anniversary of the horrors of Auschwitz, Netanyahu and his fellow extremists have no empathy with or concern about the plight of dispossessed Palestinians, the original inhabitants of the land what is Israel now. The two-state solution is no longer feasible and even less so after the current Trump plan. The only alternative is a single state, democratic, and secular, in which every citizen enjoys equal rights and has equal responsibility. If the Palestinians have any sense, they would demand a state, with one person, one vote
4
Over 83 years the Palestinians have turned down 5, now apparently 6, offers of their own state and peace:
1. 1937 The Peel Commission 2-State Solution: 80% of the disputed land would go to the Palestinians and 20% to Israel. Israel accepted, the Arabs refused.
2. 1947 UN Partition Plan: The UN offered a state of Palestine and a very small, disjointed Jewish state. Israel accepted, the Arabs refused. The day after the Jewish state was officially formed in 1948 the Palestinians and 6 Arab countries launched the War of Independence.
3. 1967, Khartoum: At the end of the 6 Day War Israel offered to return it’s captured lands, Jerusalem, the West Bank & the Gaza Strip, in exchange for Peace. Israel accepted, the Arabs refused with 3 Nos:
No Peace with Israel
No Recognition of Israel
No Negotiations with Israel
4. 2000, Camp David: Israel offered Yasser Arafat a Palestinian state in the Gaza Strip, 94% of the West Bank with east Jerusalem as their capital, and compensation for the Palestinian refugees. Arafat turned down Israel's offer without making a counter and launched the second intifada.
(2005: In a good faith effort toward peace Israel unilaterally left Gaza, the Palestinians turned Gaza into a launching pad for missiles firing thousands into Israel.)
5. 2008 Olmert Plan: Again Israel offered a Palestinian state in the Gaza Strip, 94% of the West Bank with east Jerusalem as their capital, and additional lands. The Palestinian leader, Mahmoud Abbas said NO.
6
This was never a serious plan. It's only a way to take attention away from Trump's impeachment trial and Netanyahu's indictment.
1
This is nonsense. How can you negotiate a peace plan when a key participant was not invited to participate ? Why would they think the Palestinians would agree to this ? Or maybe they didn't care . Trump and Netanyahu need distractions.
1
It is important to note that the Palestinian "leaders" rejected Trump's plan so quickly without even reading and considering carefully the thoughtful over eighty item Trump plan. One of the unmentioned and probably unmentionable issues in resolving the Israeli-Palestinian issue is how many Palestinian Muslim persons embrace an unreformed form of Islam that has a rigid pervasive political Sharia law-based system that is inherently incapable of compromise with representative forms of democracy.
3
Have the Palestinians ever presented any peace plan that wasn't based on total eradication of the Jews?
6
Let me see if I get this:
A and B are in a dispute.
C offers to mediate, OK.
After long consultation between B and C, but no discussion with A, C announces a "plan".
This isn't a plan!!!
Peace requires *ALL* parties to be involved in the solution.
4
The illusion that this administration could be an honest broker on the Palestinian/Israeli issue can now be officially put to rest.
5
Palestinians should stop being a cry baby. Understand the ground reality and move on.
Waiting for another U.S. president to turn the tide would not be useful.
2
Of course, the plan ignores the fact that Palestinians are the indigenous people of what's now Israel. Of course, it also contains several lies about the history, such as that Israel conquered the occupied territories in a defensive war (Israel attacked first in 1967), and that "similar [to the number of Palestinian refugees] number of Jewish refugees were expelled from Arab lands" shortly after the Palestinians were expelled (some Jews were expelled, but mass numbers left voluntarily). As such, the plan is just Israeli propaganda, bent on maintaining superior privilege for Jews and making permanent Israeli imposition of apartheid.
5
When only one party (of two) is willing to participate in discussions or negotiations, it seems logical to me that the one party who participates will benefit more.
At any rate, the proposed plan is open to further negotiations. If the leadership of the Palestinians will participate, peace could be had. If they will not, Palesinian people will continue to miss economic opportunity until they are able to select and elect new leaders.
1
The world has not condemned Israel for what they have been doing to Palestinians. Yes, Palestinians have not been passive themselves, but there is no comparison in how much they have been wronged, not just by Israel but by the US.
Each peace proposal is worse than the previous one. To understand the present map, read Hollow Land by Eyal Weizmann—Palestinians will be surrounded by zealot Jews. Their land has been broken into pieces where they will be monitored on land, by air and below ground.
Past 70 years have shown us that the world is not looking out for Palestinians. Each successive proposal for two state solution is worse than the previous one. They should take what they are getting, stop throwing stones, educate their youth well, and stand up to Israel with their intellect. They can do it, that will be their best revenge.
It should also be acknowledged that a fully functioning country like Israel is not and should not going to disappear. Those who dream of getting rid of Israel should wake up.
1
In response, the Palestinians should withdraw from the Oslo Accords, which was a rubber stamp for apartheid anyway.
Dismantling the Palestinian Authority, which is what withdrawing from Oslo would do, puts the onus on Israel to take care of the Palestinian people that still live under occupation. That would require both a major increase in Israeli responsibility for infrastructure for the population, and an approach other than occasional military raids to drag people off into detention.
4
Why don't Palestinians, or at least the PA, come up with a response or counter-plan that reveals, with equal specificity, what they regard as an acceptable peace?
1
@Want2know They've already stated their acceptable plan: "Palestine from the river to the sea."
2
Even an attractive monetary gift is not a powerful inducement when your people have been displaced, and the plan had no chance of success. Why is Trump involving himself in this endeavor when his own country has more important problems to solve? More hotels? The most telling reason:
"But the guests invited to the East Room, including the conservative Republican megadonor Sheldon G. Adelson and evangelical Christian leaders, greeted the plan with enthusiastic applause." Quid pro quo all over again.
3
Most of the obvious aspects of this "deal" have been covered so I'll turn to this one: Has anyone else has noticed how this deal is, once again, rewards Hamas? While the Palestinian Authority has been working hard to tamp down terrorism, Hamas, in Gaza, has been firing rockets and digging tunnels to unleash terrorists and kidnap Israelis. And yet, this deal will more than double Hamas's land while the more reasonable West Bank Palestinians will lose half of theirs.
The fantasy is that a moderate Palestinian puppet...er...government will take over the whole new state and West Bankers who lose their land can establish new settlements along the Egyptian border. They can get there through their nice new tunnel! (Financed by...?)
In reality, only one of two things is going to happen: 1) The two governments aren't going to unite, and it will be Hamas in their expanded country and the PA in their reduced and sliced up country. Or 2) Hamas takes over the whole thing.
I believe the second is more likely because Israel and it's US sponsor, have again and again shown to the Palestinian people that terrorism works.
2
Right. Let's take the most complex political situation on the planet and put it in the hands of Donald Trump. What could possibly go wrong?
We are the laughing stock of the world.
6
trump is not a deal maker no matter how hard he tries to get people to believe he is. He doesn't make 'deals', he just tells people what they are going to do.
3
Not sure how can we broker a deal when Trump is so unilateral Israel. The Palestinians have never been crushed and treated so badly as they have been now. Literally have been made slaves. Very sad. When certain people are treated so unfairly, then frustration and anger arise and makes people hopeless and violent.
5
A "peace plan" that doesn't include one of the impacted parties in its development. Brilliant, King Donny and Prince Jared.
6
The plan seems to be a good start. If only the Palestinians would stop protesting long enough to actually try to work together. I don't recall the Palestinians ever advancing their own peace plan.
2
@kkabler They did...to the Balfour group in the 1940's but were out wined and dined. How about Oslo? Who assassinated Rabin? Not that simple.
6
We and the United Nations must impose a peace deal on both Israelis and Palestinians since they can't agree on one. A century of hostility and conflict is long enough for the world to let them make up their minds.
It's dangerous for the world letting this conflict continue in an arms race between Israel and the states allied with the Palestinians. Our government has had the delusion, influenced by Israel's leaders, that Israel will always have a military edge provided by us over the Arabs and Iran and other Muslim countries because Israel has nuclear weapons. The Palestinian plight however has over a century become a Muslim and Arab one. It symbolizes Arab and Muslim aspirations for the future. A just settlement between Israel thus no longer involves only this generation, the next one, or future Palestinian ones.
Israel's treatment of the Palestinians is disrespectful and its settlement terms humiliating for all Arabs and Muslims. So Israel's attitude and position are not conducive to peace. On the contrary. Israel's position is a challenge to each future generation of Arabs and Muslims, who must conclude that negotiations with Israel are pointless, and they have no choice to restore their dignity, honor and pride other than to challenge Israel by any means possible.
4
As though $10 million per day to our "greatest ally" along with settling all their fights with their neighbors wasn't enough.
Such a strange cohen-cidence that we never had any enemies in the Middle East until we had Israel for a friend.
6
Rather lost. Is this a deal, a plan or a proposal?
It cannot surely be a deal, as the Palestinians have not agreed. If it were a proposal, it would need Palestinian agreement in order to be implemented. Since Netanyahu appears to be going ahead unilaterally, I suppose this means that it is a plan agreed to by Trump and Netanyahu. What I don’t understand is Trump claiming that it was a tough when no negotiations have taken place.
This is just kicking the can down the road.
6
And Netanyahu’s job is also at risk right now. How opportune for both he and Trump to change the subject.
4
This deal has been drawn up by two players: America and Israel; and for their benefit. These two players have issued the Palestinians a fait accompli. There’s no evidence of even-handedness here. Further, in my opinion, this doesn’t seem like a sensible way of achieving lasting peace in the Middle East. For lasting peace, the deal has to be fair to all. This deal is not.
7
A peace plan ensuring to end all peace.
7
The NYT should call it a 'Bibi-Trump plan' not a 'peace plan', since the latter would imply that all parties are around the table.
2
You have to investigate what has caused this massive pro-Israel government gift. Follow the money. Our foreign policy has become transactional just as in Ukraine. POTUS called his 7/25 call “perfect” just like this plan.
6
Yet another retreat by America from the worldview of FDR.
He envisioned a world where all nations were united in following laws that ensured peace and justice. He set afoot the foundation for the United Nations.
Our retreat started early after the birth of the UN with Truman's disregard of its mandates when he impulsively recognized Israel.
Each President following him has been complicit in enabling Israel to avoid compliance with numerous UN Resolutions and continue to imprison millions of the natives of Palestine.
Trump's general lawlessness and instinctive disdain for the principles of the United Nations (of which I am sure he could not even understand) has brought us into the kind of dangerous dog-eat-dog world that FDR had tried to put behind us.
6
How many people have a shocked face upon hearing this? Trump and Netanyahu have no intention for any real peace and that suits the Hamas just fine
2
Trump doe not really have a plan, except to give everything to Benjamin Netanyahu. Somehow, this will make Netanyahu a hero in Israel and he will be protected form the corruption charges against him. It gives nothing but a false promise to the Palestinians.
5
Let's arm the Palestinians with nuclear weapons to counterbalance Israel's nuclear arsenal.
Then, let there be either genuine permanent peace negotiations with a realistic two-state solution or nuclear war.
This one-sided "Manifest Destiny" war promulgated by Israel needs to come to a complete stop, one way or another.
3
The timing is interesting. I don't suppose it has anything to do with the announcements regarding the content of Bolton's book vis à vis the impeachment trial, nor does it have anything to do with the indictment of Netanyahu.
46
Well. Palestinians time after the time rejected all proposals which were made to them. Now they are in way worse situation then they were 30 years ago. This plan is very last chance to get the state of their own. When they reject it, they will be expelled after 20 years to Jordan and Egypt, and Palestinian dream will be ended once and for all. No one will remember them in a hundred years
1
So, you want to expel them and then erase any history that they ever existed?
That’s your plan?
6
Several things are clear: 1. The Palestinians will reject it and it will not serve as the basis for talks. 2. Of course it is tilted toward Israel but it would improve the lot of Palestinians but so have other attempts to bring peace and the Palestinians cannot bring themselves, perhaps on penalty of death,( remember Sadat, Palestinian leaders do?) to give up on achieving something they can only achieve by war and they have lost all of them. So, yes, this is a political document to show Trump is working for peace and to assure donors and to improve his prospects in November but bring peace between Israel and the Palestinians. That is like untying the Gordian knot.
3
It is a very generous offer for peace, peace will bring progress, suffering will be lessened. What is bad about that?
2
Why in god's name do you refer to this as a "peace plan"?! It's annexation and subjugation.
14
As Mel Brooks sang "All I want is peace! Peace! A little piece of Poland, a little piece of France..."
12
I will give this to Trump: at least his plan gets rid of the ridiculous argument that the US has ever been an "honest broker" in the Middle East. That transparently ridiculous lie has been trotted out for decades as US administration after administration facilitated Israel's ever-creeping annexation of occupied Palestine, all the while running interference for Israel at the UN and elsewhere and providing Israel with the biggest foreign aid package of any country in the world. The US has always had the leverage to force Israel to stop its illegal colonial activities. It has chosen to make those activities possible. Trump's plan makes the argument for BDS more clear than ever.
8
Who better than Trump to run a real estate swindle?
11
Read Leviticus 18:28. Google it. Then you will see what will be the result of this peace plan.
The Bantustan plan. Isolated chunks of unviable desert whose inhabitants will have no choice but to work as indentured labour with no civil or employment rights for those who stole their land.
9
In 1948, President Truman initially favored a state in Palestine that would include both Jewish and Palestinian citizens. As the '48 presidential approached, he altered his position, agreeing to the Zionist desire to partition Palestine into Jewish and Palestinian spheres. Truman reversed course because he wanted to win the Jewish vote in New York, Illinois, and California in an election predicted to be close. Secretary of State George C. Marshall strongly opposed Truman's policy, arguing that an Jewish state would create problems for the United States in the Middle East far into the future. How prescient of Marshall.
Well, here we are - 72 years later - with a historically-clueless president again seeking to garner Jewish votes in an upcoming election, again currying favor with the Zionists, and again selling out the Palestinians because they lack influence in U.S. politics.
By the way, notice on the map that Israel controls all the water sources - one more ruthless jab at the Palestinians.
9
It’s not a peace plan. Redact then headline.
3
The proposed new boundaries for Palestine are absurd. Even the most half-witted could not consider this a fair proposal, much less one that the Palestinians would entertain. Three years of work and this is the result? Yes, if you are Jared Kushner.
4
Boy. Trump sure is bound and determined to start WW3. I guess it’s not enough to destroy the country’s soul. Or people’s relationship. Or the global climate. I guess when you’re the dark lord of destruction, only total annihilation will do.
Well. Sounds like a very solid step, Mr. Voldertrump.
4
Let's say something positive: 1) At least the map wasn't drawn with a sharpie. 2) Mexico isn't going to pay (because the Arabs are). 3) The planned tunnel (tunnel!) under Israel, uniting the Gaza area and the West Bank, ought to eat up most of the promised $50 billion quite nicely--and all the construction will take place in Israel. 4) And if all goes the way these things go, American companies will get the construction contracts anyway.
Winning Bigly since 2017.
5
Enough already. Cut Israel's allowance off and let them figure this out on their own. I for one will never forgive them for Netanyahu deriding President Obama after he just authorized $40B in welfare, the most ever at that point. How dare they!
9
Very simple, Israel must occupy only the land given to them legally. We, the US Taxpayers stop providing $38 billion dollars until they return to their borders. Not another cent until this happens. The Citizens must demand it. Remember, at tax time, to insist your Representatives will comply or be gone. Stop Trump's latest Dictator giveaway!
7
".. signed by 11 of his colleagues, calling the proposal a “one-sided” blow to prospects of a “viable” two-state solution."
So just 12 Democratic Senators dared to sign the letter? That shows you who is in charge of both parties.
3
Palestinians, whose leaders have led them into two announcedly genocidal wars (1947-48 and 1967) against Israel have never accepted a peace plan. That is why so many former Arab residents of Mandatory Palestine, and their descendants, now live in other lands.
Palestinians are misguided in thinking that the deals they are offered will get better and better; in fact, they are getting worse and worse. Eventually, if no agreement is reached and Palestinians continue to murder Israelis, there will be more and more former Arab residents of Mandatory Palestine, and their descendants, living in other lands or in tightly-controlled "reservations" (a la Gaza), where they are less able to murder Israelis.
3
The proposed gerrymandered Palestinian map tells all. I would say it is a crime to call the plan 'a win-win opportunity for both sides.' It cannot be further from the truth and just another lie from US president Donald Trump.
In the long run the plan jeopardizes the US interests in the Mid-East and harms the credibility of the United States in the international communities.
6
The "plan" is this; "If I say we support anything you want, will that help in your election, and will you help in mine?". After all, what are friends for? It won't solve anything, but that is not really the point of it anyhow.
3
Could it be? Under the cover of "Peace Deal," plans are drawn, framework and rules are written, and the goal, if one is honest?
More votes, for oneself. Could it be?
The 'traditional path' Jared Kushner chose to forgo is actually the only path for a peace deal that isn't a joke, or an effort to get indictments and impeachments off the front page. Do we accept settlements in any other realm of law that only involve one of the two parties? I didn't think so.
1
... this took three years to come up with?
1
Since it’s so one-sided, why did it take almost three years before being unveiled?
Oh, yeah.
5
I was deeply moved hearing Ronald Lauder speak at the 75 year liberation of Auschwitz. It must never be forgotten.
But there was one sentence that I have to disagree with him, though I understand why he said it: "Anti-Zionism is Anti-Semitism". I believe this sentence is stuck in the past. It probably was true from the 1950s - 1980s. But today? Zionism (the right of Israel to exist - which I believe in) has become something else: the denial of the right for others to exist.
11
Who is being denied the right to exist? This may or may not be the best deal but the Palestinians are the losers in a series of wars they started. What other country has given back land to those they have vanquished? Whatever they are being denied is the result of their own government.
Middle East peace plan. This is full 1984...it's enabling full annexation of the West Bank.
Call it what it is. 'Giving Israel exactly what it wants to help the re-election of myself and my good friend Benjamin"
8
If Palestine statehood has not happened in the 53 years since the 1967 6-day war, then I don't think it will ever happen.
Just let Israel absorb all of Palestinian territory with the stipulation that Israel must allow Palestinian reside in the enlarged Israel Then let Israel decide whether to officially practice Apartheid and be a "democracy" in name only. Or to integrate Palestinians and give up the idea of a Jewish state but become a true democracy.
An American ally in the Middle East was crucial when OPEC held sway. But now with Russian oil and American oil (via fracking) also as major players, plus the need to ditch oil, there's no geopolitical.
Also China is more sensitive to Mideast oil. Let China worry about regional stability. They want to be bigger global power anyways. And given Iran and Saudi Arabia are so antagonistic towards each other, it's not likely a Pan-Mideast supra-nation will emerge and wield oil as a weapon as in the 1970s.
Lastly, wealthy Arab countries can absorb Palestinians, even if as migrant workers. Just the UAE alone has about 5-6 million South Asians. Let Arab countries step up to the plate and stop decrying American meddling in the Mideast.
2
@William Fang - Interesting and helpful comment that if my memory is right has elements of what Tony Judt discussed in various ways and places in the last years of his life.
The question might be posed to Netanyahu for starters - Can you consider as alternative an Israel in which all people with a line of descent tracing back to Arabic speaking peoples will be citizens of Israel with absolutely the same rights?
We know from our long experience in the USA that declaring these Arabic speaking people as full citizens is only a first very small step. The many forms of racism in my country of birth show what these Arabic speaking full citizens will face for many decades, maybe forever.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Citizen US SE
This is not in Israel's interest either, never mind an insult to Palestinians. To the extent that Arab countries and others (the US and allies) support this, it's a betrayal of the Palestinians right to self-determination and justice they are owed.
It's apt or ironic that this comes at the time of Auschwitz 75th Anniversary memorials. There might be no Israel were it not for the Holocaust as well, such was the pressure on the world for the need for a home for Jews. But this state, let us not forget, was built upon eviction of Palestinians in no small measure. And when they say they were made to pay the price, they have been argued out of that claim, but they have been right in large measure.
Israel will never be right with itself, nor with many of us (many troubled Jews included) if it does not provide either equal citizenship for all Palestinians between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea, land which Israel rules over, or they allow a viable sovereign independent state for Palestinians to live in peace side by side with Israel.
This is Israel's existential problem, not Iran.
9
Since Trump's attempt to win the next election by bribing Ukraine has fallen apart, his latest strategy is to try and buy the Jewish vote. As a Jewish American I am disgusted by this lose-lose plan and hope that any other ethical Jew sees this opportunistic announcement for what it is. Both Trump and Netanyahu deserve to be removed from office.
6
The I/P issue will be decided by the ICC. When Israeli officials start getting arrested across the world, they may change their tune to a more reasonable stance.
3
having spent 4 weeks in israel, i can tell you that the secular israelis who pay taxes, run businesses, go in the army and actually make the country work, want the settlements gone. americans are not really aware of the political strife in israel. these same people want bn in jail and want the rightwing settlers to fend for themselves and are tired of paying for the welfare and protecting them, yet the rightwing has the majority .it is very unfair to the industrious israelis
5
Who knew that peacemaking in the Middle East could be so complicated?
Two corrupt politicians are trying to save each other.
4
Many options have been proposed over the decades. The Palestinians refuse to accept nothing less than Israel's demise.
I blame the Palestinians and Iranians if this fails, not our President.
3
Glad Jared solved that one. Now just need a Sharpie for the final touches.
3
One of the only things Trump is doing that I wholly agree with. Just because Trump does something doesn’t mean it’s wrong automatically. The Palestinians have been given many chances at peace and rejected them all. If we were in Israel’s shoes, we wouldn’t even know what a Palestinian is...
3
So, really interested to read the NYT's views on this charade of a peace plan.
Don't cavil or try to defend this indefensible offence to decent people's hopes of a fair settlement. I wait to read your Editorial but offer the following views in the meantime.
The reality is that this plan, developed by dodgy Jared, and endorsed by two corrupt thugs who to their countries' shame are their Presidents, is a moral outrage.
At the very least it's a slap in the face and an offence to decent people on all sides hoping for progress and leadership.
It will be really interesting to see who lines up to support it.
That will flush out the extremists posing as moderates.
Poor Palestine, a toy for desperate and despotic regimes.
3
This DOA as noted by the Saudis “appreciates the efforts of President Trump’s Administration to develop a comprehensive peace plan.”, enough said!
Only someone not interested in a solution would unveil a plan of peace without having negotiated with both sides. Two callous men who deserve nothing but wrath.
4
Just more distraction for Trump from the impeachment trial. Waste of time; it's not going anywhere.
2
Egged on by the right wing extremists in his in inner circle, Trump has unnecessarily provoked some players in the Middle East and and allowed others to act with impunity. He doesn’t understand the complex dynamics of that most volatile region and his actions in time will probably be deemed more reckless and dangerous than those of George W Bush whose pointless war in Iraq has so far been the worst disaster in modern US foreign policy.
3
Really? It took the boy genius, Ivanka Trump’s husband, three years to come up with this? The centerpiece is effectively a bribe. Or rather, an attempt at bribery. There is enough blame to go around for why this situation continues to fester, but if Trump thinks that this is the sine qua non of Middle East peace proposals, he’s even dumber than anyone thought. What’s really at work here is another kind of bribe — one intended to reap Jewish and (so-called Christian) evangelical votes in November. Not dissimilar to Trump’s Ukraine strategy.
4
The proposal will be hugged by the evangelist and the likes, with their tears of happiness. But it will not fly to the rational people, let alone with the Palestinian.
Geopolitically and economically this will give legitimacy on the illegal occupation in West Bank, deprive the Palestinian the real access to Jordan River and the fertile land in the river valley. In the end it will make the prospect of economically self sustaining Palestine bleak.
Ideologically, the lack of access and (partially) imprimatur to Jerusalem will never going to be accepted by anyone, except the Israelis. Back to basic principles of a deal, it involve at the very least two parties. If only one accept it, this will not count as a deal.
He (Trump) may call it peace plan. In essence this is just a way of his administration to appeal to his Republican Christian base, and pro Israel Democrat base.
3
May I suggest that one of the best people known to me to write about this might be the novelist, Nicole Kraus, author of FOREST DARK.
Forest Dark was described in the Times Literary Supplement with these words:
"An elegant metaphysical reflection on the breakdown of a marriage, writer's block, Kafka, Israel, and the fate of a once powerful man who falls under the spell of the death drive and gives away everything."
We no longer have Kafka but Nicole Kraus can surely give us a Kafkan novel that will have two (once - my hope) powerful men who give away everything.
I have read the book twice and may start the third time today after reading this article and also,especially, Swedish-born, Tel aviv resident Nathan Schachar's analysis of the proposal in my Dagens Nyheter.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Citizen US SE
2
Win-win for whom?
I agree with some others here in that the only true peace that will be had will be a state where all share power. I've never been able to understand Israel can call itself a democracy when it uses a tiered citizenry concept. Everyone on both sides needs to realize that together they can achieve more than by being in conflict. Both Palestinians and Jews have equal claims to the same land. Any solution which doesn't start there will never work in the long term.
2
The Palestinians should be happy with this plan. Right now they have nothing and will continue to have nothing unless they accept this. Why is fair to Israel, after having to defend itself again and again, that they should have to give land to the people who attacked them? The Palestinians should be grateful for whatever they got because they had the chance to get more land but instead decided to attack Israel in 1948, 1967, 1973 and countless other times instead of accepting a country that was actually bigger than Israel in '48.
3
Former Allied powers that started this hostility still control the political outcome of the region. And so like King Solomon, they, not Jews and Arabs, hold the key to peace.
Threaten, then, both Israelis and Palestinians with a take-it-or-leave it offer, the threat being for both Israelis and Arabs to live under international martial law. Like King Solomon, propose that unless the Israelis and Palestinians agree to a peace, take control of both entities, threatening, effectively, to take self-government away from them both.
Clearly, after almost a century of hostilities, it makes no sense for Jews or Palestinians to keep trying to satisfy the demands of the other, when there is so little land, unified and viable, as for them separately to divide equally under two governments. Either one will control it or the other, as at the Dome of the Rock. There is also no way to go back in time and reverse the occupation of most of the Israeli seized land, no way for the Palestinians to accept what the Israelis offer always far less than what the Israelis took from them. They can not make peace in any union between them. Only we can.
Negotiation without negotiation. Sovereignty without sovereignty. Peace without peace.
Interesting strategies.
5
The proposed new state of Palestine looks to me to be an administrator’s nightmare.
How does one propose to deliver services equitably to four non-contiguous territories? How does one guarantee reliability of supply of goods across three unique transport corridors with no alternative routes? How does one protect a border so long and meandering that the cost of patrolling it would render any sovereign state financially burdened from the outset? (And does anyone really think Israel is going to protect Palestine’s borders for Palestine’s benefit?)
A high speed train link sounds good until the cost is calculated and its construction and control is determined. Likewise access to the port facilities at Ashod and Haifa sounds like a winner until the realisation dawns that it will give Israel a choke point over Palestinian economic growth. Let’s bypass entirely for the time being the issue of administering Israeli enclaves inside Palestinian territory and its recipe for friction.
Eventually the tyranny of service and supply issues would degrade one area and then another as Palestinians saw their neighbours in the next district better off. Put another way, the plan has an inherent “wrong side of the tracks” built into it at conception.
I doubt any American citizen would tolerate such a situation. Indeed, the Palestinians may, like voters in the mid-west, eventually elect their own version of Trump. What an ironic result that would be for Israeli supporters of this proposal.
1
Bravo, President Trump. This proposal should have been put forth 20 years ago. And if the Palestinians don't like it, too bad. They have consistently rejected every proposal put forth, even those that will much more generous.
The Palestinians have Jordan which is much larger than Israel. They have Gaza. How many countries do they need?
After almost 4 years I think we can say foreign policy isn't really this President's strong point...
Curious as to what either leader DJT or Bibi have to say or do to face serious consequences or removal. Apparently neither can be budged!
1
An immense amount of thought and reflection has gone into the 22 Sections of this Plan. As stated, many Palestinians desire the benefits that will flow from physical independence and economic autonomy. Huge support will be required on many fronts, as for the two Germanys. It may have some flaws, but it is a galvanising step for humanity and deserves serious consideration by all parties. Side note: I thought it odd that the State of Lebanon did not appear as an interested party.
1
Well, all those years of gerrymandering in the US have been put into practice on the international stage! That looks just like a congressional district in a swing state. Huh.
2
Makes good sense. This is a win-win.
1
A peace agreement was first proposed at the U.N. Security Council in 1976. Israel refused to attend. The U.S. vetoed the resolution and did so again in 1980. Israeli and Palestinian negotiators held a meeting in 2001 to resolve differences from the failed Camp David talks in 2000. The final press conference reported that they were close to reaching a full agreement when Israel called off the negotiations early. As a consequence of those actions, all progress was stymied yet again. Informal discussions at the highest levels continued later and eventually developed into the Geneva Accord, which was itself rejected by Israel and ignored by the U.S.
4
Working for a solution to this situation is complicated, but there is zero chance anything proposed by President Trump will be useful.
It doesn't really matter what plan is put up by whom.The end game for the Palestinians is the anhialation of Israel. And that my friends shall not occur. So it will remain business as usual, with israel supplying water, gas, power healthcare and emplyment to the Palestinain people, with the Palestinian leaership siphonong off millions in aid dollars to their offshore accounts whilst their people remain expendable pawns. So sad.
3
That proposed map must be the most absurd and unworkable configuration of territory in human history.
5
An impeached President and a indicted Prime Minister trying to come up with a peace plan that no one wants. Classic
3
This is not a "Peace Plan". It's a Dirty Deal.
Israeli settlement enclaves in Palestinian territory ,creeping in more and more year after year until Israel occupies everything : The underhand plan's been obvious for years : Push the Palestinians out.
And who in their right mind would trust Trump ,Netanyahu and Kushner ?
2
Palestinians will never accept such a disgraceful deal. Israel must stop its settlement building.
5
What gives the U.S., and Trump in particular, the power to ordain a land grab by Israel?
6
Is it just me or does this map look like a GOP-drawn Congressional map?
1
It's clearly a nonstarter. Based on the geography alone, it's just plain stupid. The Trump/Netanyahu arrogance is appalling. This is not a peace plan, it's a campaign platform.
4
Jared Kushner is one of the architects of this supposed 'peace plan' - enough said. He apparently thinks the Palestinians, and the rest of us, are stupid enough to be fooled by the deceptive language in the proposal.
3
The maps resembles apartheid more than a peace plan.
5
So trump took 3 years to come up with a peace plan that was rejected the moment it was announced. I don’t like to brag, but I could have accomplished the same thing in just one day.
8
Palestine looks like a gerrymandered congressional district. How is this a real plan? How is this a "great opportunity"? The only people applauding are the people this works for. Yeah...don't miss out on this Israel wins, Palestinians lose opportunity!
14
We should never forget those Israelis and Palestinians that want a real peace deal. I hope the day comes when they are the majority on both sides. Shalom. Salaam.
14
It's not a peace plan. The Palestinians were not invited to the table. It's a political effort to boost Netanyahu's popularity ahead of the next election in March. Both the US and Israel know the Palestinians could never accept such a proposal.
19
I think the United Nations should now step in to defend the Palestinians, some of which are Christians. Meet a biased deed with justice.
13
Trump used the American peace treaty with the Cherokee Nation as his model.
23
So here we have Trump's "peace plan" that has excluded one of the two parties involved from drawing it up while concurrently he and the GOP refuse to answer subpoenas or allow witnesses or evidence at his impeachment trial.
3
"Mr. Trump called on Mr. Abbas, who played no substantive role in shaping the plan, to join talks with Israel’s government."
No "substantive role in shaping the plan?" Does that mean they played a minor role? If so, what role did they play in shaping it?
1
Of course, Israel has complete control over the lives of Palestinians. The Israelis can annex even more territory than this so-called plan allots so long as the Americans are behind them. However, the one thing that the Palestinians do have is time. There are, if I am right, about 5 million Palestinians in the territories currently and their growth rate exceeds that of Jews even allowing for migration. They cannot be integrated into Israel proper because that would destroy the Jewish majority of Israel. They cannot be forced to migrate from the territories in the same way the ancient Jews were forced to migrate by the Romans.
If there is no peace plan acceptable to both parties, then the only alternative is the current status quo where the Palestinians are stateless and under strict martial law. The status quo can continue for quite some time yet but at some point, Israel will have to ask itself whether this is really acceptable.
At this point, the Palestinians don't have much to lose by rejecting Trump's plan. What can Israel do? Annex even more territory? Subject the Palestinians to even more humiliation? Paradoxically, it is Israel that has more of a stake in finding a permanent solution to this problem.
10
I support a one state solution where Palestinians a granted equal rights. The two state solution has been poisoned beyond repair. Palestinians need to change tact and give up on a dream which has created a nightmare for all. Let the Israelis build all the settlements they want until the only option left is an Israel for all its people. Both Arab and Jews.
54
@Steven
Let's get this straight. You favor a "one state solution where Palestinians a granted equal rights."
So there would be, what - 24 Muslim states and 1 state where everyone has "equal rights."
And there would be no Jewish state (however you define Jewish, i.e. religious, ethnic, cultural, national).
You think that's just?
13
@Steven There are already plenty of Arabs in Israel (20% of the population are fully-enfranchised Israelis). The problem is that when Arabs were the majority population, as was the case during the Mandate, there were massacres after massacres by Arabs against Jews.
It's understandable that the Israeli Jews don't want to be subjected to minority status yet again; it has never turned out well in the end. It would involve enormous privilege to pretend this isn't the case.
11
@Steven Although I agree with you, the one-state solution is problematic. Look at the Israeli Arabs, they are treated as second rate citizens
6
Israel is getting richer all the time. Eventually they'll be able to buy a good deal if it makes every Palestinian rich like the oil Arabs. That's as long as the Palestinian leadership will put it to referendum.
There's no other solution to a King Solomon's Baby situation that the Romans set in motion almost two millennia ago.
It looks like a congressional district after the republicans get control.
9
A major flaw of this plan is that it divides the Israeli capital, Jerusalem; but given that the Arabic-speaking non-Jews who've adopted a Palestinian national identity are rejecting it out of hand anyway, it seems that it won't come to fruition. Regardless, it is in Israel's interest to unilaterally implement part of this plan and withdraw from areas in the formerly Jordanian-occupied "West Bank," even if it means evacuating some civilian Jewish communities over the Green Line, while retaining security control over vital areas of the Jordan Valley and the Samarian hill ridge. If the Palestinian Arabs wish to declare their state in the areas allotted to them, then that is their prerogative but Israel has to do its utmost to disengage from this population to the extent possible to avoid a calamity of a binational state inwhich Jews will potentially outnumbered and Israel will be voted out of existence.
1
I support Israel. I support a two state plan. But this is not a plan that will ever work, nor will it ever be accepted by the Arabs. For one it ignores the Palestinians, Egypt, Jordan and the rest of the world. It accomplishes three things in my mind. 1) It "fulfills" Trumps promise of a peace plan in the Middle East even if it will never get anywhere. 2) It distracts from the Impeachment 3) It aids and distracts from Netanyahu on the day he is indicted in Israel and (while mentioning the opposition leader B. Gantz) it downplays Netanyahu's opposition in his upcoming elections.
This is self serving claptrap and typical of the Trump family's complete lack of diplomacy and understanding on the world stage.
Questions should be answered:
What is J Kushner's bonafides in this area?
What's in it for them (Trump and family)?
Do they seriously believe money is the answer to everything? $50B that will likely never be seen by the Palestinians beyond a token payment in the beginning.
Do they seriously believe the rest of the US (beyond the Republican base and Evangelicals) and the world will buy into this?
10
“We say a thousand times over: no, no, no,” Mr. Abbas said on Tuesday in Ramallah, in the West Bank."
Nothing new about that. The Palestinians have been saying no since 1948.
Imagine what would have happened if they said yes in 1948, just one time.
It makes no difference what is offered good or bad. Unless it is total capitulation to total Palestinian demands the answer is the same: “We say a thousand times over: no, no, no,” Mr. Abbas said on Tuesday in Ramallah, in the West Bank."
6
@Joshua Schwartz
Sir, either have not looked at this scam of an offer in detail or you are speaking in bad faith.
4
@CitizenTM Indeed they have had better offers starting in 1948 and they always them down. As I wrote, they had an offer in 1948 next to a small Israel.
There is a limit to how many do-overs they are entitled to.
1
@Joshua Schwartz Gee - Israelis want a do-over from 70 CE, when their kingdoms were soundly defeated by the Romans -- the 11th time they were conquered and deposed. At that time they definitively lost their sovereignty, their lands and their right of residency. How many do-overs do they want in the modern era, 2,000 years later?
2
"limited sovereignty" is a concept like "a little bit pregnant"...no, you either are or you are not. In this case, the proposed state of Palestine WILL NOT be sovereign.
Netanyahu will use this opportunity to sieze more land, under the false pretense of legality, and further tarnish the state's reputation in the world. Israel will rue the day they side with Trump to advance their occupation and annexation.
9
Everyone who collides with a Trump deserves the consequences. Israel may be making a fatal mistake like it did 2000 years ago.
Exile is their repetition compulsion.
2
Let's just call this what it is: A sloppy yet brazenly colonial attempt to hand over legitimate Palestinian territory to the Israelis by two corrupt politicians, both of whom are in legal legal jeopardy and facing re-election.
This plan not only will not create peace, but will result in further bloodshed and chaos for both sides.
12
Isn't the expression sort of "the war isn't over till the other side says yes it's over"
Well this bit of nonsense is DOA.
Perhaps when Israel cleanses its government of the Bibi and his corruption, people will start to see clearly the reality of their situation and that peace isn't just another transaction that people think money alone solves. Also Israel can pay it's own way. I can spend 50 billion at home on alot of other things. I'm not anti Israel, just anti grifters and criminals.
7
This looks more like a land grab under the guise of a peace plan.
9
What a joke.
Best outcome would come from a one-state solution. All Palestinians and Israelis become citizens of a unified "Israelistine" or "Palesrael", the Jewish and Palestinian diaspora is allowed right of return, all peoples are allowed access to the holy areas in Jerusalem, anyone is free to move anywhere and buy land, the new state takes up responsibility for developing infrastructure in West Bank and Gaza, and all citizens have to serve in the military.
7
@Ali
and turn it into another Lebanon.
Utterly outrageous and utterly reprehensible. A fraud of the highest order and a disgrace that will have devastating consequences over decades to come.
14
This is how rich people get rich. They're robbing the public piggy bank once again like with the tax cuts. Now it's a 50 billion dollar gift to thieves.
8
Those borders are absurd. That's not a country. It's an inkblot test.
10
Very similar to the “solution” forced on native americans by the usa. However, these “palestinian reservations” will have no water and be surrounded by walls, barbed wire and the israeli military. Peace plan indeed....
14
Two comments.
First: all articles that quote the Palestinian Authority should, by standards of good journalism, also quote direct surveys/polls of the Palestinians themselves. Why? Because the Palestinian leadership is, at present, unelected. Abbas is in the 15th year of his 4-year term, and elections are nowhere on the horizon. Gaza is governed by Hamas, a terrorist organization, having pushed out Abbas in a civil war. If an article claims that these 'leaders' represent the people (along with potentially supporting photos like a staged demonstration), then this is simply inaccurate journalism.
Second: an economic plan in favor of the Palestinians was set-forth, which effectively takes it off-the-table as a threshold negotiating item. This is a big benefit for the Palestinians in terms of negotiating the terms of this deal.
Overall:
Once the Palestinians begin to negotiate and focus on moving forward, they will set realistic goals for themselves. That should be the focus of the 'international community'.
The region is a mess. Syria. Iran. Lebanon. Iraq. Lack of economic prosperity. Radicals. Terrorists. Disfunction. Many in the region now realize that having a stable, functioning democracy, with law and order, economic prosperity, and a strong and ethical military is a positive force in the region. The Palestinian cause will not overcome these realities - the best outcome will result from beginning negotiations vs. waiting some more.
6
This is just another ploy to deflect attention from the impeachment hearings. Trump understands nothing about the Middle East and has never made any effort to understand the complex feelings and aspirations of the Palestinians. This plan is just more empty rhetoric and will help neither Israel or Palestinians in any way.
11
@Rebecca Hogan
I agree with you - except calling the desires of the Palestinians for peace aspirations. I call it a right to exist. Just like Israel has a right to exist. These These people have been subjugated by Israel after a war, that they did not start - but was started by the neighbors in Egypt and Jordan.
1
I’m no fan of this President nor his administration, but if one actually reads the plan and considers the history of this conflict and why previous deals failed and then considers the tactics being used here to pressure the Palestinians to at least come and negotiate based on this as a starting point, it’s actually a fairly compelling strategy (can’t believe I’m even saying that!). Kushner’s interview with Amanpour earlier today is surprisingly good (far better spokesman for Trump than anyone else I’ve seen put on CNN).
Weird politics aside, I actually wonder if this might work (though indeed only if Trump were to win again, I suspect — which I don’t want for many other reasons!).
6
The Palestinian State offered by Trump and Netanyahu is so extremely gerrymandered that it appears to be a joke. It's like a nightmare jigsaw puzzle. A tunnel to connect Gaza to the shriveled "West Bank" which no longer reaches the Jordan River?
But it's not a joke. It's an insult.
15
Another one for the history books. How does Donnie it?
So much winning.
7
When Trump ordered the assassination of Qassem Suleimani, the immediate response from Israel was, "Don't look at us..We didn't know anything about it."
If they are such a powerful ally of the United States, why weren't out on the front lines supporting Trump and his illegal assassination?
2
@Aaron
I believe Israel and Iran behind the scenes have more mutual economic interests and interdependency than is openly acknowledged. Americans, westerners, don’t really understand the Middle East mindset as it really exists regarding such things.
2
He's consulting with both sides. Netanyahu AND Benny Gantz. A sure recipe for success in the West Bank.
2
The sound of one hand clapping.
4
With “peace” plans like this, I’d hate to see a war plan.
But don’t worry, Donnie Ballgame and Jared Genius will have this whole Middle East thing solved in a jif.
As another brilliant Republican President, George W. Bush, once remarked, “this foreign policy stuff is kinda challenging.”
5
Jared, you've done it again!
4
Trump's expected acquittal by a jury of impartial jurists seems on the same wave length as the bizarro universe Kushner and Netanyahu expecting the Palestinians to agree to the philistine
understanding applied by a quid pro quo arrangement among one under impeachment, the other under indictment for corruption, and both up for re-election. Shades of Ukraine, Batman!
1
Here's my advice to the Palestinians: call their bluff and take the deal. Trump and Bibi concocted this thing to guarantee the Palestinians would reject it. Turn the tables and take the deal and the money. Be a fact on the ground, like the settlements. I know it's not the best deal by a long shot. I know it reeks of colonialism. I know it's unfair and vulgar. But, they don't want you to take it, so do what's in the interest of the Palestinian people and not what's in the interest of Trump and Bibi.
6
@g. harlan
That's a risky strategy. Some nasty landlord offers you reduced rent on your run-down apartment (that he is supposed to upgrade) if you forfeit the use of the bathroom and the backyard. He expects you to say no. Should you say yes just to call his bluff?
1
I used to live in Kuwait back in early 80's. Kuwait had free 0ress then.
Arab Times was one of the freest newspapers owned by a Kuwaiti.
I forget his name but he had written one of the best editorials on Palestinians obstinacy over two state, one state etc.
And the editorial only had maps with few words. The maps showed that starting in 50's - Israel got physically bigger and the Palestine kept shrinking.
Despite chest beatings by Palestinians - they have kept losing real estate to Israel - first because Israel means business and second, we protect them.
So, here is another plan - the Palestinians are about to reject.
They may want to read that Arab Times editorial again - because in another few decades - they will be left with even less real estate.
Unfortunately, the Palestinians never lose a chance to throw an opportunity away.
And this will be just another chance.
4
@Neil
They did in the past. Camp David / Oslo could have been the beginning of normalization.
But this one? It's a poke in the eye, not a deal.
As usual, this is a typical mob style "peace plan". It is designed to favor Netanyahu while undermining the Palestinians. It is a plan designed to encourage a war. If it's Trump, it's aggression, attack and demean. Why bother with meetings and negotiation when you can use force? Fortunately, force rarely wins in the long run.
2
In what bizarro universe is this a Middle East peace plan? Trump just gave Netanyahu a political pat on the back by endorsing a massive land grab. The Palestinians are already expressing their displeasure and unequivocal rejection in the streets.
Donald and Jared need to go back to the ol' drawing board. They might even want to consider talking to the Palestinians next time.
5
The “deal of the century” is nothing short of embarrassing, at least for all the diplomats that have worked with previous administrations tin getting Israel and Palestine to agree on sharing a piece of land.
Dictating the terms of an understanding that never was, imposing an outcome that favors Israel, and its claim to occupy Palestine territory in exchange of a mysterious newfound land that he failed to identify, and agreeing that the holy city can be both the capital of Palestine and of Israel, but not exactly how we understand it, it’s probably the lowest point of this presidency, if we forget about everything else.
It’s easy to understand why Netanyahu kept on thanking Trump: never in a million years would he think of managing to get the USA to actually run his campaign for him
2
Three years to come up with this unworkable plan? Jared is certainly not a genius. Takes after his father-in-law.
4
The JCPOA didn't include the involvement of any Arab countries. A bigger sham. In any case, every US president has tried to offer up a peace plan. The Palestinians reject every single one no matter what is offered and offer up nothing in return ever.
Because Hamas runs Gaza and a corrupt PA runs the West Bank, it all doesn't matter anyway. Its all DOA because there is no partner on the Palestinian side and there never has been.
The Arab world no longer prioritizes this issue and we would be wise to do the same. The Palestinians fortunate enough to live in concert with Israel in the West Bank are far more fortunate than their brethren in Syria, Lebanon, and everywhere else.
The best answer is the New State solution but nobody wants to talk about it.
5
@Mark at least the JCPOA included Iran unlike this plan with Palestine.
2
@Kevin Niall There is no "Palestine." And territory is in dispute only because there is an argument. Muslim Arabs living in the West Bank truly have no claim to land lost by Jordan in a defensive war on the Israeli side. There is no historical connection to the West Bank for the Muslim Arabs that are living there. I am amazed Israel even tries to offer anything to a leaderless group of tribes and clans that have no true interest or trust in a centralized government anyway.
1
Can you put up the map that the UN used in 1948 to delineate proposed Jewish and Palestinian enclaves. It would make a useful comparison.
7
Most people are confused about this deal.
It isn’t part of a negotiation, it is simply an offer. Lacking any international support or even interest at this point, the Palestinians will eventually accept the offer once they realize that there will be no better alternative, now or in the future.
The Israeli/Palestinian conflict is over, and Israel won.
"The strong do what they can, the weak suffer what they must." In 2,500 years, this has never changed.
5
It's called a "plan," because it's certainly not an agreement,
7
No water resources, no major city to serve as the economic engine for a more advanced economy, total dependence on Israel which does not have to swear off violence against Palestinians in a treaty offered by a nation that for centuries has broken promises. What a great offer of poverty and abject subjugation. Why would the Palestinians possibly reject this?
8
@Peter Schaeffer Reminds me of an African State in apartheid South Africa.
2
Looking at the map proposed by President Trump for the new Palestinian territory evoked the suspicion that it was drawn with help of Republican demographers, experts at gerrymandering electoral maps, except that instead of trustworthy voters their target was the most fertile or useful land. To compensate for the losses Trump proposes giving the Palestinians patches of desert along the Egyptian border. The travesty really sinks in when you look at the areas with Google's satellite imagery at close range, both in the desert and along the Jordan river.
7
"my vision" "Mr. Kushner and .. officials chose not to pursue the traditional path of brokering talks between the two parties that could lead to a joint proposal but to hand one down from Washington." This isn't diplomacy this is embarrassing. The scary thing is that this family have no clue as to world stage historical positions and diplomatic processes; this isn't just real estate.
5
two white men in trouble in their countries trying to dictate the lives of brown people? lolz
can even israelis take this serious?
all you have to read is "Israel agreed to limit its settlement construction in a four-year “land freeze,”
like this is all a dumb show that will backfire on israel in the long run
15
Yeah, that'll work.
5
When Trump says it's a "win-win" for both sides, he means Trump and Bibi's.
20
I only wish that American Jews would understand this is all about the Christian Zionists hoping to bring about the Rapture and Second Coming.
They are only using, very effectively, the donald and Kushner to bring that about. Netanyahu thinks, as all these awful men do, that they are doing the using. But he, too, is wrong.
The evangelicals are destroying this country.
31
@Better American than Republican
I always laugh when I see Evangelicals being escorted around the Holy Land by devout Jews, who seem oblivious to the fact that they are viewed merely as sacrificial lambs who must be die to usher in the Second Coming. One benefit of Trump's tenure is that most of the country now sees Evangelicals for the outrageous hypocrites they are, eliminating any lingering doubts. They are about the only friend Israel still has in the US, and when Trump is out of office, Israel will wake up, shocked, to a new, more unforgiving relationship.
5
An ambush on the Palestinian people. This MEPP will create a massive concentration camp. The largest so far in contemporary history. From an economically and militarily powerful ethnic, religious and cultural group to another ethnic, religious and cultural group, but economically and militarily weak. The two groups have the right to exist, but not in a concentration camp --after Auschwitz. The phrase "Never Again" is just a phrase, nobody applies it.
18
Pluses and Minuses
Plus: It faces reality
Minus: It rewards Israel for 30 yrs of breaking International Law
There is no easy solution, so Trump settled for getting the pro Israel vote in the US.
10
Apparently the $50B is contingent on the Palestinians opening an investigation into the Bidens.
34
It's Russia and the Ukraine all over again.
5
I hope to be among the first guests at the new Trump Hotel Palestine. When will it open?
9
something is more than nothing
5
Who made up this "plan?" Yasser Arafat?
At a minimum, I'd expel all Arabs from Gaza and put them on a one-way bus to the West Bank. An Arab enclave on the coast means security for Israelis can never be certain.
2
@Steve_K2
Jordan would be better; unfortunately it can't be implemented. We must live in the world of the possible. If I had a magic button that would send all the Palestinian Arabs in Gaza and the West Bank to a parallel dimension to guarantee Israeli security; I'd press it. But since this doesn't exist, the best thing I can hope for as an Israeli citizen is to separate from the Palestinian Arabs to the extent possible. I'm neither a fan of Bibi nor Trump, but I support this plan with some qualms.
3
yeah, like dantzig saved poland back in 38
2
We have a family house in the West Bank. Do I get the keep or Trump gave permission to take it away too.
7
Is the next step to recognize Russian annexation of Crimea?
14
@P. Preston
Ummm .... think that’s already been done.
2
"...years of suspense" You gotta be kidding.
4
Unbelievably one-sided. This is a dictated solution from a dictator and his son-in-law. Arrogant and uncaring about a real peace plan. Nothing will happen during Trump's limited time in office.
8
After reading about 100 of the comments written here by New York Times readers, I am heartened by almost all of them. So many bright, and more importantly, fair-minded people. I feel proud to be be with you in your rejection of this disgraceful ‘peace’ plan.
23
Going along with The Don can make the Palestinians self supporting in a fairly short time. And prosperous in the long run.
1
So we're talking about a two state solution in which the Palestinians sacrifice land for peace? You'd think thee Americans consulted with only one side.
1
The leadership of Netanyahu ensures Israel will be under attack for a long time. Israel is digging itself into a hole that they will never get out of unless they start turning around now. There is no sign of that happening. His ignorance is exemplified by his embrace of Trump.
7
There is a world of difference between an Israeli wish list and a peace plan.
11
In the past If some diplomat - politician come up with a plan which is accepted as historically important, they call that person, Architect of XYZ deal, peace plan etc.
Brilliant Mind, Great Middle east political guru , son in law Jared Kushner is the architect of this great peace plan.
Trump should crowned his achievement with Presidential Medal, and if Nobel committee has an inch of credibility they should give Nobel peace prize To Trump-Kushner.
1
This is when American Jews need to say this is wrong. That is really where we are at.
I know this is a tough thing to say, but America is the hope of the world and America needs its Jews to contest this with everything they've got.
12
@Joe
As a dual citizen of Israel and the USA, thus an American Jew, I will say this plan is wrong -- because it gives the Palestinian Arabs in part of Israel's capital city. That's fundamentally outrageous.
1
@Meir
Your comment points out why dual citizenships are inherently dangerous. They are like being a double agent when the national interests of the two nations do not align.
1
No one can ever explain to me why Israel, built on the pain Jews felt after WWII, after the indescribable horror of the Holocaust, cannot empathize with the Palestinians, upon whom they are choosing to inflict similar horrors.
Such a deal, by two crooked leaders, is an insult to humanity, to us all.
33
@Suzanne
I have personal friends and met survivors of the Shoah, who have rejected the way contemporary Israel behaves. But overall I would say the trauma of systematic extermination without much of a fight back from within the Jewish community and with zero help from the rest of the world made Zionists feel they have no choice but to fight for their survival.
I remember the pain when Arafat walked away from the best peace plan that existed ever. The pain that this was the ONE AND ONLY chance was huge.
1
America doesnt have billions to keep feeding Bibi. Our deficit is in trillions now. Trump just keeps printing money. Why wont Bibi stay home? He comes to the WH everytime he needs money and Trump writes him a blank check. Vote them out!
8
@pb
Republicans love deficits, as long as the money flows towards them.
While reading this article I became fixated on the Hebron street photograph by Sergery Ponomarev for the Times that's embedded in the story. I've been to Hebron. What strikes is that this picture looks very much like the spot where, in 2016, a Palestinian was shot point blank by an Israeli (IDF) solider, found guilty in court and later turned into a hero by the Israeli public. There's a (graphic) video of the shooting accessible on line. If I'm correct about this picture - the location is significant if I am - the cynic in me wonders if the Times knows full well what Trumps "peace plan" will bring to the Palestinian people.
13
Trump and Netanyahu have thrown down the gauntlet.
Will the UN stand up?
Will the EU stand up?
Will the Israeli liberals stand up?
Will the American political parties stand up?
Will the American people stand up?
Will the world's Jewish communities stand up?
It is time to choose between the legal and the illegal, between the moral and the immoral.
20
Yeah, the world never stands up to Israel. All those UN resolutions have been against some other Israel?
Throwing the Evangelical base yet another bone.
15
How could it be a "two-state solution" (according to Trump) when Netanyahu calls it a "state-minus." What the heck does that mean?
And the map seems even kmore gerrymandered than North Carolina.
This "peace plan" is really just a "piece plan," i.e. leaving the Palestinians cleaved into bits and pieces with no autonomy.
This is the worst possible combination of gerrymandering, apartheid, and colonialism, all rolled together.
22
As we all know, Prince Jared, internationally recognized as one of the foremost experts on the Middle East, and one of the most skilled and highly regarded negotiators ever to walk the planet, has been working tirelessly to bring everlasting peace to that region.
Success is all but assured, but do keep your fingers crossed! Just in case.
9
This is no peace plan. It is the terms of surrender for the Palestinians. They're better off fighting for equal rights in one state than to accept this plan.
10
In 1947, the Arab world rejected the UN Partition plan which would have given them half the area of the British Mandate of Palestine.
In 1967, the Arab world could have gotten most of the West Bank and all of Gaza. Instead, they met in Khartoum and voted for the Three No's: "no peace with Israel, no recognition of Israel, no negotiations with it."
In January of 2001, Arafat rejected an agreement negotiated by President Clinton at Taba, which would have given Gaza, and a big percentage of the West Bank, to Palestine.
In 2005, Israel created an independent Palestinian mini-state in Gaza. The citizens of Gaza elected Hamas in 2007, ending the possibility of negotiations that could have led to independence for part of the West Bank.
As time goes on, the Jewish population of the West Bank is increasing and the possible area for a Palestinian state is growing smaller. This being the case, it behooves those bearing the responsibility for the political future of the Palestinian people to do whatever they can to engage realistically with the situation.
The Palestinians are the only independence movement that has rejected independence because of a boundary dispute.
15
Exactly right. I would add that Israel has the right to defend herself against belligerents, as all nations do. The Palestinians negotiating position has continually weakened since 1967. They would do well to focus on improving the lives of their citizens and stop pouring their resources and energy into an unwinnable conflict.
5
@George Jochnowitz not sure why the Palestinians or the Arab should have accepted it in 1947, a deal offered by colonizers? While I believe at this juncture that it is far too late to re-imagine what could have been done back then that considered the existing population in a non-colonistic way....to make this about a 'boundary dispute' is like expecting you and all your neighbors to pick up, leave your homes and start somewhere else where you have to pass through a check point to get to work.
2
I’ll be real, if there was a time for this to be done, it would be now. Most of the Muslim nations don’t seem to really care whether or not Israel exists except for Iran and the Palestinians. It’s kind of strange, but I think of some right this could lead to an end of the whole issue. However, I doubt President Trump will be able to do it right. We shall see.
6
Did anyone else look at these details:
Trump’s Proposal for a Palestinian State
The White House proposed new boundaries for the Palestinians, which would not require Israel to uproot settlements in the West Bank.
[Yet}
Talk about unenforceable gerrymandering.
1
Are the critics, and there definitely are difficulties to the plan, forgetting that acceptance depends on 4 years of negotiating? That Israel must agree to halt building in the West bank for those 4 years? That it's understood the Palestinians will insist on better terms, more land? You can be sure there is some wiggle room left for the Palestinians.
Yes, on the surface, this plan is clearly more favorable to
Israel. But, no workable plan can ignore Israeli security, which means they must maintain, for years to come, control of the Jordan River Valley. Plus, not mentioned here, Palestinians must accept Israel as the legitimate Jewish state.
That, not arguments over land, is the toughest thing for the PA/PLO to do. Next toughest part - reconciling with Hamas, and that all parties/terror groups must agree to end all terrorist activities, accept Israel's right to exist, otherwise, quite frankly, no Palestinian state of any type, on any land.
So, before Bernie screams NO, send him to the Middle East to explain, guys, you are all in this together, or you get zilch.
6
The U.S. has had a problem being an honest peace broker, ever since the negotiations began in the early 1990s. Expecting that trend to change under Trump is like wishing for snow in summer.
The modus operandi for Israel and its biased ally, the United States, has been to offer bread crumbs to Palestinians. Palestinians (and any sane people on Earth) reject the offer. They then get accused of not being interested in peace.
If and when this charade ends and Palestinians are offered all land occupied by Israel since 1967 (as mandated by UN Resolutions), there will be a realistic chance for a permanent settlement. Until then, the U.S. should stop pretending to be an honest broker.
12
The proposed Palestinian state reminds me of some Republicans’ gerrymandered USA Congressional districts... with the same goal of disempowering an entire population.
21
Well, thank you Trump and Jared. You have just legitimised Russia's annexation of the Crimea. After all, if Israel can annex territories seized by military force, then why can't Russia. As they say, What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Oh well, Putin is Trump's best friend.
21
Almost every country seized part of its current border by military force. Why is this one so different than every other country?
2
@Howard
The Crimea had been recognized by the international community as sovereign territory of the state of Ukraine since the Ukraine became independent of the USSR in 1991. By contrast, there's never, ever, been an independent, sovereign Arab state (or any other sort of state)called Palestine that had recognized sovereign control any territory whatsoever.
1
@Kev You are right about that...so right = might. But,we the US, shouldn't pretend that it's anything other than that, a land grab that serves our interests.
Trump seems to be trying to bask in the goodness of others, from the anti-abortion march to this to cover up his evil.
4
I think the analysts who say this is nothing more than a stake-in-the-ground statement of a bargaining position are correct. To call it a "peace plan" is a gimmick.
7
Clearly this is another Jared Kushner flop.
14
This couldn’t be more cynical. These two “world leaders” are both in deep trouble at the moment, and both will probably always be. So they get together and announce a big breakthrough to at long last bring peace to the Middle East. Except the party that will be the toughest to please, the Palestinians, is reading about it in the paper, as we are.
Except that doesn’t matter, since there’s no way they will agree to this. So the whole thing is 101% for show from the very beginning. How evil is it to toy with an issue like this that has changed millions of peoples’ lives and caused thousands of deaths, just to get a little temporary P.R. boost?
But wait, if that was all this was about it would be bad enough. But Netanyahu is using his concocted peace breakthrough as a pretense to solidify Israel’s claim on major parts of the West Bank, including the Israeli settlements and most of East Jerusalem. And Trump hopes this will give him a badly-needed boost with those Jewish voters (hopefully a small portion of all Jewish voters) who care about nothing else than a blind backing of the Israeli government. I'm sure he hopes this might also score points with a few fundamentalist “Christians.”
It’s just amazing that two such important countries have such unworthy leaders. But hey, aren’t the Israelis trying to get rid of Netanyahu? While they work on that, here in the U.S. we now have even more motivation to get rid of our unworthy leader—it’s less than ten months until election day.
12
@Jerry Schulz
Hear, hear!
If you look at the map you will probably see that this must be the first gerrymandered country in world history. And for good reason. Just as the dominant party shapes its voting districts here, the Trump plan shows what happens when the dominant parties (US and Israel) draw the map. The Trumps seem to have absorbed American democracy. But only its worst parts. Poor Palestinians .
12
The plan clearly violates International Law, advocates occupation, and violates the integrity and sanctity of the Palestinian people, instead controlling them with bribes of billions of dollars. It is not a peace plan but a plan to manipulate, objectify and control.
14
Yet another reason Trump needs to be removed.
9
It’s essentially the same plan that Wall Street offered the American middle class. What could go wrong? The brilliant strategists will turn overnight billionaires at the expense of the people. Today is the day of the billion back stabs.
3
The article refers to the "1967 borders." This is a misrepresentation of the facts. Those were armistice lines drawn after the cessation of hostilities in the 6-Day War. Borders were to be negotiated between the Parties to the conflict.
9
It looks like the district maps they keep drawing in North Carolina.
7
A peace to end all peace.
8
A non-contiguous state is ridiculous.
Muster some courage and tell West Bank Palestinians that they can forget about an independent state on the West Bank. They had their chance. They didn't take it. That ship has sailed. The region's demographics have changed.
The West Bank should be incorporated into Israel-proper. West Bankers would get full Israeli citizenship and rights. Palestinians who lost land, money or businesses should get Just Compensation as under the legal Doctrine of Eminent Domain. Forget about "right of return". People get cash instead. You want something back, take your cash and buy it back if it's available.
West Bank Palestinians can get some autonomy as do French Canadians in Quebec. And that's it. Case closed.
With the huge influx of Jews since 1948 the region originally allotted for Jews is too small to support a viable state for Jews much less two states.
At the same time, the UN should declare Gaza an independent state whether Gaza wants it or not. Israel vacated Gaza years ago. Egypt doesn't want Gaza back. Right now Gaza is a big nothing. Independence is the only viable outcome. There's your Palestinian State. Gaza!
3
The only reason the west bank still exists as occupied territory is that israel will do almost anything not to give millions of palestinian arabs israeli citizenship. That is actually the most important issue for israel. Just look the plan map, all the arab areas are carved out.
1
@MIKEinNYC So because the land 'allotted' (read stolen) wasn't big enough that justifies stealing more land from the inhabitants there prior to this 'allottment"?
1
Excellent report Jared. Looks good on the surface, but could not anything relating to legality or morality.
3
It’s nonsensical to call this a peace plan because the Palestinians are not involved.
10
The Palestinians have a weak hand that gets weaker by the day. The major arab countries care more about peace with Israel and possibly an alliance against Iran than the Palestinians. Everyone know that Arafat threw away a good deal during the Clinton years. It seems like the only supporters the Palestians have left are American leftists on college campuses. Their leaders need to give their people a dose of reality and get a deal while they still can.
12
@Todd Several American main line churches also support Palestinians, it’s not just college students! The religious community is involved and not just the Evangelicals.
1
Only Trump could look at the camera and pronounce that the peace plan would bring peace or that's it's fair. Usually I'm sympathetic to Israel in these dealings but this time the inequities are so grotesque and shameful as to embarrass me. Of course Trump is embarrass proof so he doesn't see it, but the world does.
14
@xprintman
Wrong. Over 1.5 Israeli Arabs/Palestinians will remain in Israel. Is that part grotesque, or unequal to you? How many Jews live in Palestinian cities, outside of the Israeli section of Hebron? Maybe half a dozen far leftist, secular Jews, nothing more. Anywhere else. Check it out.
That shows how embarrassed Palestinians should be for being overtly anti-Semitic.
1
Looking at the maps, it appears that Jared subcontracted his task to one of the Republican gerrymandering experts, carving this land up not for partisan advantage in elections, but more in the nature of how Western lands were carved up to relegate Native American tribes to the least desirable and livable land as their reservations.
Two noxious state criminals, desperately trying to distract from the walls of justice closing in on them.
17
When brokering a peace deal, Step 1 is bringing both sides into the room.
15
I agree with Trump on this. Kushner’s peace plan is a win-win, it’s a win for Trump and a win for Bibi...but it’s a huge loss for Palestine and American credibility.
17
There isn't an agreement Trump puts his name on that I would trust for five minutes. It will not be honorable, fair, transparent, good for both sides, nor will it stand the test of time. Trump is not in an honest broker nor is Netanyahu. This is more distraction from impeachment for one and indictment for the other of our two "leaders". How generous of them to create a plan without one major party present. Another sad display of men with no real character or vision.
14
These comments in advance of the announcement speak volumes as to one of the problems with negotiations:
“In anticipation of the revelation of US President Trump’s Middle East peace plan – the so-called ‘deal of the century’ – the PLO, the PA, and Fatah are emphasizing their rejection of the still unknown plan. They have also announced a ‘day of rage’ on the day the plan is revealed, and called for ‘escalation of resistance’ – a Palestinian euphemism for violence and terror.”
and this gem from Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas, “We will redeem you with our blood, #Palestine” Abbas also announced that “there is no discussion with the American administration, neither brief nor long,”
Palestinians in the Gaza Strip, an enclave ruled by the Palestinian terror organization Hamas, marked the anticipated announcement with violent protest.
5
@Bill B. We're contributing our own share of bloodletting and drone murders to the situation
1
@Alx would you please supply a reference to when the last United States drone killing of Palestinians took place to support your claim?
Trump and Kushner are obviously giving Palestine what they think is an, "offer which they cannot refuse". The so called state would not even have an internal integrity being sectioned up into separate parts with narrow Israeli corridors providing deep access to all of it and with Israeli settlements dotting it like tenderized meat. Not only would the state not be able to have it's own defense force, it could not even provide basic services without the permission and cooperation of the Israelis. There are no people on Earth who would accept this proposal, it's simply an attempt to humiliate the Palestinians by offering them worse than nothing.
10
This is a peace plan like Trump is a president.
22
This "plan" is a deliberate attempt by Trump to court the votes of Jewish-Americans. I hope they can look at the plan and circumstances objectively and make up their own minds.
I'm neither a Jew nor a Palestinian but there are some Jews in America who may vote solely or heavily based on how Israel is treated. I hope they can look beyond that. Remember you are Americans first if you a citizen before you are an Israeli.
Many years ago - and I can see its impact today -- my mother ask me if I would choose China (my country of ethnicity) or the US in a dispute. I told her first I would go with which country was right in their actions and then after that, the US. After all, I am not a Chinese citizen nor have I lived there much despite knowing the language, history, literature, culture, and food.
7
two flawed leaders . one under indictment for fraud and corruption and the other is on trial by the Congress for abuse of power. are deciding the fate of an absent and under occupation people.
10
There isn't going to be peace between Israel and the Palestinians. But forging these peace plans is great for distracting Americans from other important matters where progress might actually be made, and making it look like the US pres is doing something substantial on the world stage. It's been an industry unto itself, creating these peace proposal charades, for many decades now. And this is such an opportune time for Trump to take his turn trying to shine a light on it, and hope it somehow eclipses the bright light shining on the impeachment trial. I'm sure that with his base, it will. The rest of us surely aren't fooled.
4
This will simply lead to more armed conflict, which strongly favors Israel. Having lost the sympathy and support of many who formerly supported her, it appears that's all Israel has left - a plan for permanent, armed occupation.
15
Let's assume that the proposed plan has components that could be of interest to Palestinians and might, in a different setting, bring them to the negotiation table.
Then the question to ask is: why should any sane Palestinian do that? The Palestinians know that this not a United Nations' proposal; this is Mr. Trump's proposal. The man has no credibility and has shown time after time that his words mean nothing. He has been lying and cheating all his life and has lied more than 15000 times just in the last 3 years.
Any Palestinian leader will be rightfully worried that the minute Mr. Trump realizes that some provisions of this plan is no longer politically palatable to his base, or run against his personal interest, he will not hesitate to break any promise he has made or unilaterally withdraw from any agreement he has signed.
13
Israeli's; absent malice, I simply don't believe anything you say any longer. You should have paid for the land.
10
As a descendent of Palastinians, on the one hand I am heartens by the gradual shift in public opinion which is evident in the comments. On the other hand it is also demoralizing that the fate of a people's aspirations is in large part dependent on convincing enough ordinary American citizens, thousands of miles away, that their cause is just and worthwhile.
25
As long as Hamas and other Palestinians promulgate culturally ingrained extreme hatred of Jewish people and participate in violence against them, the Palestinians will not achieve their goals or receive anything beyond token support from the American people or their government.
There is already a backlash against ignorant anti-Semitic and anti-Israel demagoguery on American college campuses.
3
How does one country give away another to a third one? Should we worry Canada might give the US away to China? Somewhere is a mention of $5B. Is this more or less than the Palestinian taxes Israel has been withholding from Palestine? Who is going to pay it? Surely the Palestinians know that their land will be gone and the check will be in the mail.
21
It looks like they used Republican gerry-mandering software to design that bizarre joke of a proposed discontinuous Palestinian state.
40
Trump just gave the BDS Movement a huge gift.
27
Since when is Israel our property to "give" to anyone?
19
Reading the comments here, you would think that another obvious solution is at hand for this easy solved problem.
We got nothing to lose.
This is a change of tactic from honest broker to Israeli ally / facilitator. Maybe $50B and threats work and maybe they don’t. What I do know is that we have pretty much tried everything else. If somebody else has a better solution, by all means.
5
We HAVE NOT tried everything else.
We have never tried fairness.
18
The Palestinians don’t want a two state solution, they want a one state solution- and that state is Palestine. Anything less than the destruction of Israel is unacceptable to them. Once you understand this, you’ll understand why a peaceful two state solution is impossible.
In other words, trying to resolve this conflict peacefully in a way that satisfies the Palestinians is impossible, just as it has been for over 70 years.
16
Oh...so blaming the victim is now ok?
6
Hard not to be cynical ...
4
I hate how it's coming from Trump, because people will criticize and denounce this plan for no other reason, but this is the Arabs best chance to date for their own state in Palestine, and it's probably the best one they can ever hope to get.
Don't forget there has never been an independent Arab state in Palestine. Palestinian nationalism didn't even exist until the past century. Yes, the majority of Palestine became Arab/Muslim... because of Arab/Muslim invasions, occupation, conquest, and the forced religious conversions that came with it.
Palestine belonged to the Ottoman empire for hundreds of years. They allied with the losing party in WWI, and lost their claim to it as a result. The winning party decided to try to give both Jews and Arabs their own state. One side accepted, the other illegitimately refused, and are paying the price today.
The Israel-Palestine conflict is really that simple.
I don't personally agree with settlements, but I realize the Arab aggression towards Israel predates them and occupation by decades, so they can't be driving the conflict. If you're going to be attacked regardless, why not build more secured homes.
The sad truth is there is no stretch of land in Palestine that would be suitable to the Arabs if there is even one square inch that's sovereign, Jewish land. Nothing other than complete submission and domination is acceptable.
Never again. Jews are finally free from the yolk of Christian AND Islamic persecution and oppression.
16
Why do Americans always back the wrong horse?
16
You mean like the French revolutionaries, the Brits and French in both World War I and World War II, the Solidarity movement in Poland, the anti-totalitarians in the former Yugoslavia, East Germany, etc.? If you yearn so dearly for the days monarchical autocratic and/or totalitarian and rabidly misogynistic, racist, xenophobic and imperialistic governments/societies, move to Gaza and try living under the fist of the women-stoning Islamic “Republic” of Iran’s proxy, The Islamic Jihad; or the currently Iran-fawning, sometimes finger- and head-chopping and women-stoning Saudi-supported Hamas, both in a totally Jew-free Palestine.
4
@Ugly and Fat Git It is not the American people who support the injustice in Palestine , it is the AIPAC controlled Congress. eg
1/ Alan Dershowitz wrote “We (the Israel Lobby) became part of what is perhaps the most effective lobbying and fund-raising effort in the history of democracy. “
2/ AIPAC has twice been rated as the most feared lobby in DC by the staffs of members of Congress.
3// A 2014 NYT`s article quoted B. Baird a Dem. congressman: “The difficult reality is this: in order to get elected to Congress, if you’re not independently wealthy, you have to raise a lot of money & you learn pretty quickly that, if AIPAC is on your side, you can do that.” It also quoted J. Yarmuth, a congressman from Kentucky, on upholding the interests of the United States: “We all took an oath of office & AIPAC is asking us to ignore it.”
3
@Ugly and Fat Git
Trump is offering a beautiful cash cow to Palestinians, lift them out of poverty, and 4 years to thrash out some better terms.
They will never have a militarized state, the nonsense right of return, or a Palestine from the river to the sea. If they can't live alongside Israel in peace, let the objectors move to Jordan or Syria, both which have NO JEWS as policy.
3
Of course, Trump's plan "Strongly Favors Israel!" It strongly favors the criminal Bibi!
Why should we expect anything different than corruption from this Administration!
22
It is typical of xenophobic people to try to make peace without considering the wishes of those they want to make peace with.
15
It’s laughable that you call Israelis xenophobic, particularly given their recent history in the Middle East and the long history of judeophobia in Islamic-dominant and Christian-dominant societies.
Have you ever been to Israel? Have you ever gotten to know a number of mainstream Israelis?
4
Readers should look closely at the decision to create a Palestinian "entity", not a state.
States have very specific rights and duties under international law. Israel is subject to those duties, but it routinely ignores them.
An "entity" has no definition under international law, which is precisely why that language was chosen. If Palestinians were a minority within the state of Israel, they would be subject to the protection of Israel law and international law.
But by defining them as "entities" which are no more than a new version of South African Bantustans, they avoid conferring the rights of a minority on the Palestinians, while also denying them the sovereign rights of a nation state.
This "deal" is designed to turn the Palestinians into a legal nonentity. Israel will claim that they are not occupied, even though they are confined to small areas surrounded by the state of Israel.
Nor will they be an Israeli minority because Israel is giving them self governance on these reservations.
This is exactly what the white South Africans did when they created black Bantustans and proclaimed them to be independent states. The Israeli's don't even go so far as to even imply statehood.
So, official American policy is that we support Israeli apartheid, even though it has been outlawed under international law.
And this is done in our name. Support for Israel is now support for apartheid. I opposed SA apartheid and I oppose Israeli apartheid as well.
36
Does Congress get to vote on this?
Is the UN officially dead now ?
19
@Chris
The U.N. doesn't resolve such contentious issues. Note, will China ever agree to resolve its occupation of Tibet?
Have India and Pakistan ever resolved the dangerous conflict over Kashmir, which has lasted longer than the Israeli occupation of the West bank?
Who ended the conflicts in the former Yugoslavia? Not the U.N. America got involved.
The U.N. might as well be dead regarding difficult, long lasting conflicts.
4
The unilateral-ness of the plan is almost like holding a trial but not allowing any witnesses that are unfavorable to the side you support.
14
Or it can be described as a rushed inquiry with no bi partisan support.
Where are the commemorative pens ? Or is that only a Democratic thing?
4
The two state solution is now impossible. There can only be a one state solution now. Abbas and the rest of the Palestinian leadership should now disband.
2
While this is going on a glacier the size of England is melting in Antartica. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, these people and people like them, can do right.
13
Israel drafted this plan and Trump usurped the credit. What does Israel care..? We are giving them billions of US Taxpayer dollars which they'll never have to pay back..
21
No reason to trust in anything Trump or Netanyahu say or do. So No to the plan.
14
This plan is terrible for the Palestinians as well as the Israelis. This will never bring peace and will only incite further violence.
It’s really sad how Yasser Arafat really destroyed the Palestinians best chance for peace. They came so close in 2000 w/ President Clinton and Ehud Barak but Arafat just P’d it down the drain and now look at the terrible deal that’s on the table. Such a tragedy.
12
For those who might question whether Israel is indeed a Neo Apartheid state - this “peace plan” should settle the question.
It is not a peace plan it is a provocation.
Trump is “interfering” in Israeli politics by bolstering Bibi with this
obviously bogus plan.
M
20
Israel is most certainly not an apartheid state, even if it’s current leader (who could barely get re-elected) espouses problematic policies, just as America is not a racist totalitarian regime even if our current leader and imperfect policies regretfully express some of the worst characteristics of those forms of governance.
2
This map looks like a cartoon and a gratuitously insultingly one with the text about Muslims who come in peace
9
The important issue here is not Trump's impeachment diversion or Netanyahu's re-election ploy.
The important issue here is tolerance of the unlawful. Can we afford to have nations acting outside the law and past agreements? Are we willing to abandon the idea of rules-based societies? Are we prepared to accept the chaos and consequences of permitting national leaders to disregard UN resolutions, world trade agreements, international law, and human rights conventions?
We risk that Trump and Netanyahu will set precedents for the likes of Bolsonaro, Kim, el-Sisi, MBS, Putin, and many others to follow.
11
This is not a plan for peace, it’s a plan to support Israel.
23
Another Trump and Netanyahu tag team sham. Trump has never uttered a true word in his life. Why would he start now? He is only attempting to deflect attention away from John Bolton and the Senate trial that he doesn't take seriously anyway.
Trump panders to Jewish people with this disgraceful attempt to prove that he cares about Israel or the Middle East or anything for that matter. He has proven again and again that he only cares about himself and that is what this so-called "plan" is, a self-reflective farce.
The headline says "strongly favors Israel!" Strongly? Favors? Israel? Where is the editor? This so-called plan doesn't strongly favor Israel, it is only about Israel. It has nothing to do with anything but Trump and getting Jewish American voters, especially older ones, who seem to be unable to analyze the conditions on the ground.
This Trumpian charade will go away quietly in a few days. Then he or Jared or Bobo or all three will blame the Palestinians for not being a good partner. Really? A good partner? To what? Rolling over and giving up?
19
The only good deal, well known to people who know anything on the subject, is one in which everyone gets less than they wanted. This "deal" is a political ploy to help Bibi get reelected and to give DJT something to crow about -- which he needs, since crowing about that nothingburger of a "deal" with China fell on deaf ears.
10
Palestinians need to come to accept their role in the world irregardless of how diminished that may be. Only by practicing gratefulness for the lives they have been gifted will they find peace and happiness.
5
There was a photo in Your Tuesday Evening Briefing that linked to this article; the photo was President Trump & Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu shaking hands. I was immediately struck with the saying, "Shake hands with the devil."
I have a problem: I can't tell who was whom.
10
Perhaps starting a war in the middle east is a way to get out of the impeachment?
6
Talk about Israel a nation of laws a democracy is that a joke. I have trouble understanding how Bibi has been unable to form a government not once, but twice and yet he is still in charge. How does that work and also how does it make anything they do legal some law some constitution and they talk about the Arab states. When a President loses here he leaves of course with Trump and FOX that will probably all change. The plan is a joke a get rich scam for Kushner and the Merry Thieves. They believe everything can be bought with money and the Trump motto has always been why use your money when you can steal someone elses. Jim Trautman
5
A horse trader trading a horse that doesn’t belong to him and calling it a deal. What did cowboys do to horse thieves?
10
trump is going to make Palestinians so angry that his "peace" plan risks violence.
2
How can a proposal that gives one side everything it craves and the other side a lump of coal be called a "peace plan"? Talk about fake news. It is a capitulation plan that the Palestinians should and have rejected out of hand.
What we of course have in reality is a "political plan" for the reelection of the Larceny Twins -- Don and Bibi. Trump uses it to court American Jewish voters. Bibi touts it to Israeli voters as proof of his Most Favored Crook status with the American president as he attempts to break an electoral deadlock with Gantz.
But the plan itself is going nowhere -- DOA.
12
Wow, talk about a non-starter! I guess putting a slum lord in charge of world peace isn't the going to work. And I so thought he was going to solve it.
11
This plan sounds so brilliant Giuliani must be behind it. Who else would have come up with a way to describe it as a "win-win" for both parties, when it's all stacked in Israel's favor? Even if Donald were offering US financial assistance for Palestine (which he's not), we've all seen how reliable such aid is. Donald is such an anti-corruption crusader, Palestine would likely have to announce investigations into every Democrat before they'd see a penny. Heck of a job with our international reputation, Donny!
7
If Israel had a liberal progressive government right now, I wonder how much Trump would support them...
7
This is not a peace plan, this is for the politicians of both countries to address their bases for the coming elections.
Maybe America and Israel politicians should let the other countries in the region be the ones to address what is best for the people of Israel and Palestine.
7
The Palestinians should negotiate. I feel the outrage and indignation as I write this, but hear me out. I've spent time in the West Bank and Gaza during the 2nd Intifada, I have Israeli and Palestinian friends. I have been a supporter of a 2 state solution for decades. However, every iteration of a peace plan in the past three decades has gotten progressively worse for Palestinians. What these comments are missing is that as time passes, Israel creates more facts on the ground, which make it all the more difficult and unlikely for the Palestinians to have an independent state as they envision. If there is no negotiation or plan, this will continue whether Trump is re-elected or not. Please don't assume life couldn't get more difficult in the WB and Gaza. It can. Over time, I have seen it happen.
So, facing that reality, I suggest that Palestinians not pass on yet another extremely flawed and unfair deal, but use this as an opportunity to negotiate a better plan, which will undoubtedly not yield all the results they want, but may at least provide a state and economic security for the Palestinian people.
10
Brilliant. But I expected nothing less from Jared Kushner. This is not even remotely a piece plan. It's simply an endorsement of one criminal for another. No surprise the Palestinians have already rejected it. You don't negotiate for lasting peace by putting a gun to the head of one of the parties involved.
But then again, this was only for the voters in the US and Israel, and not really meant to solve a problem.
The United Nations should take leadership in negotiating between the two parties. The US has sadly lost its place at the table.
12
@UB the United Nations has had more than 70 years to solve this problem and has failed abysmally.
7
Basically you're saying that if Einstein couldn't figure out a unitary theory of gravity, then the answer is to consult with J. Fred Muggs (look it up, a TV personality from the 50's).
@mark Do you have a better idea? Clearly, this plan will not fly
Just another PR stunt from one man already on trial and another with a trial to come. A diversion. Without Palestinian involvement, it’s either meaningless or just plain autocratic.
10
This plan is 'fair' according to the same metic which describes Kushner, an orthodox jew and personal friend of Netanyahu, as 'impartial'.
Obviously Trump is desperate for a 'victory' to help him win the upcoming election: N. Korea is still threatening Asia, Putin doing whatever he likes, the G7 laughs at Trump, Mexico is willing to sign an 'IOU' for 'the wall' ... I'm sure I forgot some items ...
Almost as awesome as his tax cut for the 1% and slashing of environmental standards, both of which will cost us 'bowkoo' dollars the future.
Did I forget anything ?
I suppose he thinks this will help in the impeachment process. Whether he is impeached and removed or not, Trump will not be re elected, and the flood of fed, state, and local charges will make impeachment look like a picnic.
7
I lived in Israel/Palestine for 8 months in 1973 when there were only a couple military outposts along the Jordan River and no illegal Israeli settlements in the West Bank, Gaza, and Golan Heights. People could freely travel in the West Bank. I lived on a Kibbutz with a large, abandoned stone house on the edge of town, a Palestinian home the family will never occupy again.
Americans must understand Israel perpetuated most massacres until 1970 and learn about the Saliha, Deir Yassin, Lydda, Abu Shusha, and Al-Dwayima massacres to better understand Palestinian concerns.
Two developments are essential for peace in Israel/Palestine. Israel must recognize they have no right to the land between the Mediterranean and Jordan River, as most Israeli settlers believe and abandon the settlements. Palestinians must realize their Right to Return will probably never happen for most families like the one that lived on the outskirts of the Kibbutz where I lived.
6
No right to land between the Mediterranean and the Jordan River. Ya, sure. Very practical.
1
So what do they do? This just feels hopeless.
This isn’t a peace deal. It appears that it is a one state solution done with the US and Israel only. They didn’t even invite the Palestinians.
It basically says the occupied lands that are illegal under international law are now Israels.
That is all this is. It makes the occupation permanent.
Could you imagine a peace deal with let’s say two countries where one of the countries wasn’t even in the room during the deal? That is what this is. It’s not a deal.
12
@Mathias
Versailles is the closest to this kind of a dictated deal.
3
A plan without the input of the Palestinians, brokered by Jared Kushner (who couldn't get a security clearance), sounds like a workable solution...NOT!
12
Ethno-nationalism: acceptable for some, not for others.
Got it.
4
I see lots of photos of Netinyahu smirking. I think this is going to be a disaster.
The Palestinians have been used as hostages. And if they stay they will be slaves. They haven't been left enough arable land to survive. You can see that Israel has taken all the arable land.
It is time to accept that the Palestinians must be recognized as refugees.
4
More of the same segregation and apartheid.
Go ahead. Attempt to say I am wrong. And convince me the Palestinians the aggressors when Israel has the bigger weapons.
Lastly, I am not anti-Semitic. I am anti suppression of others. If that includes the Israelis then if the shoe fits....
8
"America First" becomes Israel First.
5
He’s playing to Evangelicals and right wing Jewish donors.
10
Are we surprised?
When Trump is under impeachment, find something to rouse the base. Since domestic agendas would die in Congress, choose an international agenda.
What better agenda to rouse the base than Israel? (Unless he can find someplace to bomb). The Christian evangelicals and conservative Jewish eat this stuff up with spoons the size of shovels. Do you see Netanyahu's smirk?
6
It doesn't sound like the artist of the deal even talked to the Palestinians. Some peace deal. Same old elephant seal in chief.
7
It will be difficult to reduce antisemitism when you have politicians like Trump and Netanyahu and a Jarred Kushner.
7
Trump's vision of Middleeast peace is like the old Idiom "Head I win, tail you lose." Here we have only one winner and that is Israel
6
The Palestinians should be given powerful and far reaching, precise weapons. The Israelis would come to the table in good faith and there would be a deal in no time flat.
14
It was heartbreaking watching Trump and Netanyahu dictate their terms to the Palestinians in the caress of cheering, adoring, applause emanating from an audience that contained, apparently, not a single Palestinian.
The paternalism displayed was appalling as Palestinians were treated like recalcitrant children by two men, one impeached and the other indicted, confined to their spaces while the adults, hypocrites all, talked about them.
This is a recipe for conflict: there’s enough in there to enrage and inflame both Palestinians and right wing, orthodox Israelis for whom any concession is too much.
15
There’s no difference between Israel annexing a third of the West Bank from the Palestinians and Russia seizing control of the Crimea from Ukraine. They’re both taking someone else’s land by force. It’s a violation of numerous UN resolutions, the UN’s founding charter and many international treaties. But for both Netanyahu and Trump it’s typical thuggish behavior.
18
The difference is that the Crimea was annexed with all it's property rights intact.
The Palestinians are having all their property rights stolen from them.
6
@Jack Bush
I believe the majority of the people in Crimea voted to join Russia.
Big difference
1
Trump Plan for mideast: A non-starter reflective of his term in office.
3
No one will in good faith mediate with Trump. He does not keep his word; he is not transparent; he is less than truthful; he knows nothing of the complex geopolitical history (perhaps Miller or Kushner gave him a crash course, because they know ... ) of any region. I could go on, but why? In a lawsuit, no one would mediate with a mediator who is said to have those qualities. This news hurts all three parties, no matter how much Trump wants to help Bibi and show his base of voters he will go down with the Christian Right (out of respect to the Jewish community, I would not suggest this was intended to help Israel; I can't guess who this is supposed to really help--see thoughtful comments by others here). Perhaps he he can now build a hotel in the West Bank?
4
Soooo Trumpian. Announce that an offer is a plan and roll it out with an event. If you can get one party in a rancorous multi-party situation to join your dog-and-pony show, maybe the momentum will exert pressure on the others.
Author Trump described the technique and it also may have featured in the negotiation lessons offered by Trump U.
The PBS reporter talking now carelessly said "the Palestinians are not part of this deal" but I'm in the other room and couldn't tell if he used air quotes. (It's not a deal until all parties agree.)
Total coincidence that his impeachment trial is in contentious session.
6
For reasons like this, and many others, our president must not be reelected. This is not a peace plan, as how can there be a peace plan when one side dictates the terms of the proposed plan with no representation at the table from the opposing side. It will be rejected, and rightly so, by the leaders of Palestine.
I stand with Israel for the most part, and totally stand with them on the concept of "Never Again", however, attempts to solve the crisis without true, meaningful negotiation on both sides is bound to fail and the status quo ante will continue, regardless of what President Trump dictates with his faux plan...
5
Trump's peace deal has as much chance of gaining legitimacy as one of his bankrupt casinos has of coming back, or his bogus University reopening, or his fraud charity helping anyone in need.
14
This is the best move for Arab Palestinians. As Abba Eban once said, " Arabs have never lost an opportunity to lose an opportunity " and for too long now Arab Palestinians have held the world to their game of victimization and corruption.
Now, for a change, Trump is the adult in the room telling the kids to do what is in their best interest.
What Arab Palestinians need is a future for their children and grandchildren, with jobs, human rights and freedom. This is what this plan can give them and they have four years to come to this realization.
For those still clinging to the pre 1967 borders, just remember that these were fragile armistice lines that Arab Palestinians never accepted. From 1949 to 1967 Arabs had full control of Gaza, the West Bank and East Jerusalem and it clearly never occurred to them to create the State they now claim. They had their chance and blew it, with marketing to the world that Jews having no right to live in the West Bank, where in fact they have thousands of years of history. Now it is time for the grow-ups to tell the kids what to do.
10
Nazis and Europeans (to an extent) targeted Jews over centuries, force them to flee, then decide to offer them a homeland by kicking someone else out of their home..
The step number is a disaster
Now USA brokers a new deal which is a slap on the face for Palestinians..
How I wish John's words come true
"Imagine there's no countries, It isn't hard to do, Nothing to kill or die for, And no religion, too"
8
Lucky Palestinians - u get 10% of your original lands !
20
Two potential convicts leading two once great nations.
The question really is, who will be the first to go to jail?
13
I find it difficult to determine what "plan" if any would work.
Palestinians demand that decendents of the war of 1947 be allowed to return to their homes. A policy that has never happened before. Israel will not remove any of its settlements on land it won in the war of 1967. Palestinians demand that Jerusalem is theirs historically-which is just not true. The Trump plan was developed with any input from the Palestinians and basically is a take it or negotiate it. Negotiation will lead back the questions of removal of settlements and the right of return etc. And again we wind up in the same place we started.
5
This is not a decision for the United States to make. The leaders of every major democracy agree that the Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory is illegal under international law and annexing those territories is an even worse violation. Until Trump came along this has been America's position as well. Does anybody really believe that the Palestinian people will simply stand by as the Israelis steal their land?
21
Like when Trump tried to make deal with Korea, he promises big money for development of Palestine if they agree to his deal. Korea kept asking where the money was, and it never came. Can't trust this guy. Time for him to go.
8
I struggle to separate "Israel" from the political state of israel.
It is like separating "America" from trump.
Wake up "Israel" !!!!!
6
I’m confused. Netanyahu reportedly plans to moved quickly to annex West Bank settlements; and asserts he may do so without seeking approval from the Knesset (Israel’s Parliament). I may be wrong, but this seems like something Donald Trump would do, i.e., usurp the power of the legislature in order to rule by executive fiat; something akin to Trump’s secret, provocative attack on Soleimani, but on a grander and more far-reaching scale.
It also sounds more like a provocation than a settlement overture; a thumb in the eye rather than an olive branch.
What am I missing?
19
How sickening this is. An impeached President of one country and a prime minister indicted for crimes get together and celebrate their idea of how Israel can take over even more land from the Palestinians. The spectacle of it. A hallmark for the current state of the world.
59
Don’t hold your breath for a Palestinian counter-proposal. Their leaders make millions off of anti-Israel Europeans and Arab sympathizers. Palestinian families are paid for life if a family member terrorizes or murders an Israeli. You want them to give up welfare and actually get to work building a country? Never gonna happen.
16
@XLER do you mean the same way that the Israeli leader is currently charged with making millions of sympathisers?
4
Oh, so then it is OK to blame the victims?
It's not a "peace plan" if it is clearly detrimental to one side and favors the other and only one side agrees to it.
417
@coloha - if there was ever a situation where both sides could be treated equally and fairly, Trump and his villainous family wouldn't recognize it - fairness just does not compute. For Trump, the GOP and Trumpists - if one side isn't getting the shaft, it just isn't being done right.
45
@Caloha In fact the plan is greatly beneficial to Arab Palestinians...... I mean to women, men and kids in the streets, but of course it is not beneficial to the corrupt leaders who have deceived their people for so many years now.
17
@KLJ:
Well said.
5
Netanyahu and Trump deserve each other. How about letting them share the same jail cell. They could say the law finally caught up with them but not until a ripe old age!
19
Colonialism by real-estate written by Jared Kusher.
22
Trump and Netheyahu two Grifters greasing each others palms. Trump attempting to influence the upcoming Israeli election and have the criminal Nethanyahu reelected.
Nethanyahu further embarrassing himself by showing up at Trumps little circus designed only to deflect from the fact that in 20 minutes his attorneys were about to enter the United States Senate to attempt to do the do the impossible. Defend the indefensible .
In both instances no one is being fooled we are all sadly way too familiar with how these two operate.
17
Doe Trump think an IMAGINARY Nobel Prize will get him elected?
6
A peace plan involves, by definition, due consideration of both sides.
This sounds like a war plan to me.
20
To expect anything better out of Trump is impossible. The man is not intelligent enough to make a true negotiated anything. His reputation for negotiation was all self-promoted. Unfortunately, before the election too many people bought in to his fraud.
9
Just wondering if this is the result of the Boy Wonder Jared's work. If so, Awesome dude! Worthy of Solomon! Hey. . Jared . . In your spare time, can you dispose of this pesky cold fusion problem that scientists have been fumbling over for years
8
You had me until you called it a land seizure
How dare you refer to it as a ”seizing” of land
Israel was attacked
Their army defended and was able to move forward
Should they have stopped at the border and wave goodbye?
10
Some Peace Plan. Apparently, Trump, Bibi, and Kushner forgot that there can’t be peace in the Holy Land without the Palestinians.
401
@Julio Wong This is simply poor historical information wrapped in evident bias.
10
@Julio Wong
The idea of a Palestinian state on territory provided by Israel is now history.
They will no longer get any more offers for land.
This is the best deal they will ever get.
Since they turned it down they can find someone else to give them territory for a state.
Ain't gonna happen.
Good bye, Palestinians.
Your so-called leaders are your worst enemies.
Israel holds all the cards and they gave you many, many opportunities to do a deal..
Those days are ended.
21
@Julio Wong
Thus this attempt to atomize and marginalize them further.
8
The optics are terrible. This makes a mockery of the impeachment defense, which states Trump withheld aid because he is so very, very concerned with corruption. Yet, here he is back slapping in the White House with an Israeli leader who has been indicted on corruption charges. And not a whisper about halting aid during the two-year investigation leading up to his indictment, and even with the indictment Israel continues to receive aid!
14
Another autocrat that Trump is propping up.
13
Is there some reason we should not favor Israel? It survives in an extremely hostile environment and has never conducted acts of terrorism anywhere in the world much less against the United States.
8
We do favor Israel. We give them billions of dollars a year. But a peace deal requires compromise, carrots for both sides. This will go nowhere.
5
One impeached, the other indicted. The Art of the Deal, International Edition?
17
This isn't a solution it's a distraction. A desperate attempt to appear presidential by two corrupt, power-mad criminal frauds trying to stay out of prison.
9
The long awaited Jared Kushner “peace plan” is D.O.A.
10
I must’ve missed something. Why does it matter what Trump’s plan is? Should the Palestinians even care?
3
Reminds us of the Black Homeland Citizenship Act of 1970, a denaturalization law requiring all South African Blacks to become citizens of one of the self-governing territories and thereby lose their citizenship in South Africa... According to the law, "No Black person will eventually qualify for South African nationality and the right to work or live in South Africa because they will all become aliens, so will only be able to occupy the houses bequeathed to them by their fathers, in the urban areas, by special permission of the Minister." See: sahistory.org. Sorry Donald, hard to see how this would ever be a "great deal" for the Palestinians especially since their proposed land is not even contiguous. I agree that a win-win for both sides should be sought, but this ain't even close. Forcing a bad deal on these displaced people will be another of your political and moral crimes.
9
With the caveat that I despise Hamas and stood in solidarity with Israel during the previous intifada, it is truly a blessing that there has not been another round of Palestinian violence. It would certainly be warranted by the reckless unilateralism of Netenyahu’s corrupt government. How quickly Israeli voters forget what Rabin died for, at the hands of one of Netenyahu’s supporters no less.
4
Dear NYT:
The Palestinians should reject terrorism and seek to cut a deal with Israel along the general lines proposed by President Trump. This is a real opportunity to bargain better lines, with more contiguous territory. All it takes is a good faith approach.
Palestinians are at the end of their rope. They will not keep getting more opportunities -- much less better opportunities -- for a Palestinian state, despite the well-meaning but mistaken advice of liberal Americans who do not have skin the game.
Israel and Palestine have suffered enough.
The Times should put aside its distaste for Trump, and give peace a chance, even if mean another Trump victory.
10
Trump, Netanyahu and Kushner, three wheeler dealers who’s idea of fairness to Palestine, is a joke. Trump pledging $50 billion is also a lot of money to commit to building Palestine. Are there no problems in the US that could be helped with $50 billion? Just impeach him.He knows nothing about foreign and domestic policies.
6
Gosh, they’re just so crass. Like they forever are eating glass.
‘Speaking in Tel Aviv on Monday, Nikki Haley, Mr. Trump’s former United Nations Ambassador, suggested that such Arab support could force the Palestinians to come to the table. “If the Arab countries respond favorably to the plan, or even if they don’t run to the Palestinian side, that’s going to be a huge, telling lesson to the Palestinians that they may not have the backing they had before,” she said.’
Ugh.
6
The Palestinians missed the first class car, then business, later economy. I see them standing on an empty platform: no more trains.
13
Can we go back to Nov. 29, 1947, and start over?
6
What ever happened to equality and justice for all? How is this not apartheid? Link Palestinian areas with tunnels as though people should be content to live underground.
12
Right or wrong the fact is that about 72 years ago the Arabs and the Palestinians (same thing) lost a war and the state of Israel came into being. The Arab world for the most part and especially the so-called Palestinians- the leaders they have chosen, have never accepted this defeat, the legitimacy of Israel, a Jewish state in the middle of an Islamic world; their loss of land and the power to control that land. There have been subsequent wars and skirmishes and on and on and the Arabs/Palestinians have pretty much lost every time and every time they lose their position becomes weaker and weaker, they lose more territory, more power yet still they remain in denial that they have lost; they. or most of their leaders believe that time is on their side and somehow, someday they will be able to conquer and destroy the State of Israel and reclaim all of this land as their own. The Israeli State get bigger and stronger; it's position in the world of military power, technology and science, culture, etc (not to mention land itself) gets larger and larger. This is just the facts, right or wrong. In some ways it's similar to what happened to the Jewish people about 2000 years ago and the reality they had to accept. as a defeated people. Arabs who have accepted this reality have made good lives for themselves and their families living in Israel where they do have a voice though not equal to a Jewish citizen.
9
One is indicted, the other is impeached, they're both corrupt and neither one is going anywhere any time soon. It's desperately sad for democracy, and sad for both countries, but the underlying failure in both countries is ultimately by the public. For the Palestinians, it's a victory in an unlikely garb. It will lead to Israel's total isolation when Trump is gone.
2
After three years the Trump administration produces not a blueprint for peace, but rather a blueprint for failure:
The NYT got it right: "a political document by a president in the middle of an impeachment trial working in tandem with a prime minister under criminal indictment and about to face his third election in the span of a year."
I'm willing to bet that Trump trumpets his "Perfect Peace Plan" at the Republican Convention.
2
For 70 years the "Palestinians" have allowed themselves to be represented by a series of corrupt "leaders" more than happy to spill their blood in order to enrich themselves. It's impossible to consider a Palestinian state when its supposed inhabitants can't even agree on who their leader is let alone sign an agreement on their behalf.
After 70 years the world is tired of waiting. The Palestinians made their bed. Now they get to sleep in it.
11
The Palestinians have had numerous opportunities to create an independent state, but have repeatedly rejected the offers:
In 1937, the Peel Commission proposed the partition of Palestine and the creation of an Arab state. REJECTED
In 1939, the British White Paper proposed the creation of a unitary Arab state. REJECTED
In 1947, the UN would have created an even larger Arab state as part of its partition plan. REJECTED
The 1979 Egypt-Israel peace negotiations offered the Palestinians autonomy, which would almost certainly have led to full independence. REJECTED
The Oslo agreements of the 1990s laid out a path for Palestinian independence, but the process was derailed by terrorism, thus the real reason for the creation of a separation fence/wall which has stemmed terrorism in Israel.
In 2000, Prime Minister Ehud Barak offered to create a Palestinian state in all of Gaza and 97 percent of the West Bank. REJECTED
In 2008, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert offered to withdraw from almost the entire West Bank and partition Jerusalem on a demographic basis. REJECTED
January, 2020 Trump Unveils Plan for two-state solution. Will most likely be REJECTED
The critics of Israel can continue to blame the Israelis but the facts are indisputable:
The Palestinians have proved they have no desire to negotiate with Israel. When they finally decide to recognize Israel’s right to exist and renounce terror, maybe the two-state solution can be the new reality.
17
Why is this called a “Peace Plan?”
10
Fine you don't like Trump's plan. Where was Obama's peace plan?
7
@James
It was called the JCPOA and it makes this "plan" look like a Trump/Kushner toddler doodle.
7
@James - while it's true that for all Obama's nuanced understanding of the Israel-Palestine problem along with good intentions and lofty rhetoric ended up not getting anywhere, it was not for lack of trying. And not for nothing, but understanding and good intentions alone still put Obama light-years ahead of the self serving grifter and his entitled son in-law to enter into a corrupt deal with another corrupt leader which has nothing to do with peace whatsoever.
3
@James
It is called the JCPOA and it makes this "plan" look like a Trump/Kushner toddler doodle.
Trump's plan is "a win-win".
So, Israel comes out with "a win". And Trump gets to claim "a win" for coming out with "a plan".
Too bad it's DOA with the Palestinians. Too bad it has no relationship or contact with the reality on the ground for the Palestinians.
Remind me again - just what are Jared's qualifications for being a Senior White House Advisor?
14
Since Trump is such a tireless "corruption fighter" there must be considerable concern that he will cut off aid to Israel given Netanyahu's corruption problems.
21
The arrogance of Trump's plan leaves me speechless. The injustice of it leaves me sick at heart, and frightened by how this could further destabilize the region. The U.S. is not immune to repercussions. Can we not see injustice when it slaps us in the face?
14
I see Trump is still channeling Andrew Jackson when it comes to indigenous populations and their land. That's why the Indian Territory is still there, right?
7
I would call it an imperial piece plan announced by colonial rulers.
10
It is a 'win-win' plan for an indicted Prime Minister and an impeached President, and a 'lose-lose' plan for the Israeli an Palestinian peoples. The dangling of economic aid to Palestinians will be as effective in buying them off as it was in getting North Korea to denuclearize.
11
Sometimes a picture really is worth a thousand pretenses. Trump and Netanyahu have made a peace deal for the Middle East. (I hadn't realized we have been at war with Israel)
Like his NAFTA 2.0, Trump repackages the Status Quo Ante in a gold foil wrapper and puts a red bow on it. There. Mission Accomplished! And we couldn't have done it without Jared. "Peace in Our Time."
Why do I still feel that this isn't Camp David? Who's missing from the video?
8
Despite my general disdain for Trump, his policies, and his behavior, this plan is actually a realistic one. The Palestinians don't want peace and they don't want a state alongside Israel. They want Israel to be gone. That is not going to happen. Maybe a new generation of younger, wiser Palestinians will arise who won't miss another opportunity. Maybe the younger Palestinians will realize their leaders, and their Arab brothers, have sold them out. Where is the Palestinian Mandala? The Palestinian Ghandi? The Palestinian Sadat?
13
Two indicted/impeached leaders appearing together with a bogus plan. How quaint.
23
This doesn't seem like such a bad plan, especially with the aid to Palestine.
9
For both politicians, Trump and Netanyahu, this „deal“ comes at exactly the right time. Netanyahu faces year another election and Trump has to deal with an impeachment. What a coincidence....
5
not a peace plan, it's more annexation. Not sure how a plan could be developed without the Palestinians involved. Land grab is more like it
15
Amazing that even in the 21st century, there can be a discussion of a so-called “peace plan” that excludes those indigenous to and residing on the very land being parceled out.
But then again the Palestinians weren’t consulted about the Balfour Declaration or the 1948 partition either.
I suppose one could argue that demonstrating that the bogus "two-state solution" - which was never viable even decades ago - is totally dead is a "win" for the Palestinians. But it should be obvious that Trump isn't smart enough - let alone enough of a critic of Israel - to be a serious proponent of a bi-national state. And the Palestinians will get nothing real from that "win".
So more of the same from the US. Total support for Israel, total lose for Palestinians. Nothing will change on the ground - except that once the US decides the Palestinian's "last chance" has been rejected, it will green light Israel to go full speed ahead on its slow motion ethnic cleansing.
At least for the first time in the 52 years since the Six Day War, there is a map that indicates for all to see what ISRAEL believes it can live with in the context of Palestinian state - which (having examined the map) is Israel's total effective control of 5 non-contiguous and isolated Bantustans sat within Israel. There is not even a remote possibility of an effective and viable Palestinian state in the "great plan" illustrated by that map.
The only viable option left is a single state of Israel with equal rights for all.
Shalom
9
The demographic reality is that the Israel will continue to be surrounded by Islamic and Arabic peoples, many of them identifying as Palestinian. Just as the American Southwest will never be able to segregate itself from a large presence of peoples who descend from Central and South America, Israel is going to have a very tough and isolating experience in its region of the world, like a giant gated community with rigid ethnic segregation. Israel needs to evolve better democratic institutions and diplomatic relations that allow it to respect the indigenous human rights of the Palestinian peoples who also claim the region as its aboriginal homeland. Israel's benefactor Donald J. Trump would love to drive out and keep out all of the indigenous-descended peoples from Central and South America who now make up a sizable part of the population in the USA but the demographic reality is such that barring the most sinister genocidal methods, the southwest USA is destined to be reclaimed by peoples with indigenous roots in the Americas. So it shall be in Palestine/Israel, unless Israel and the USA forget the lessons of the Holocaust and apply similar methods to the Palestinian peoples.
6
Two corrupt men who are in trouble with “The “Law”
come up with a deal that would like benefit both, but not the Palestinians ... fits the parameters of “quid pro quo”.
7
Do my eyes deceive me, or is the region being offered to the Palestinians completely contained (except for the blockaded Gaza coast) within proposed Israeli borders? That's not a "state," but the more apt term for it is apparently forbidden here.
7
Peace deal of the century. Nothing positive will come of this. It is just a payoff to Sheldon Adelson and other donors.
14
The Secretary General of the United Nations must clearly state that the current American peace proposal does not conform with UN resolutions and does not conform with established international law.
Some member of the UN Security Council should refer to multiple US violations of the UN Charter (Jerusalem. Golan, and now the West Bank) and put forward a motion to suspend the membership of the United States of America from the United Nations pending US re-establishing conformance with the UN Charter.
15
@Greg
France can always offer its own peace plan.
2
I'm trying to decide which makes less sense: Trump's impeachment defense or this Middle East deal.
19
Remember the reaction Trump got from Denmark when he wanted to buy Greenland? Multiply that sentiment exponentially if you want some insight into how the average Palestinian might react to Trump's $80 billion pay off.
And I'd just like to ask, is there anyone who really believes that there are Arab nations out there that are eager to come together around this plan and put pressure on the Palestinians to accept? Most Arab nations have never formally recognized Israel as a state!
This plan was concocted by amateurs to no good effect at tax payer expense.
13
Had the Palestinians accepted the land division during the nascent State of Israel's formation, the bulk of what is now internationally acknowledged as Israel, as well as the West Bank and Occupied Territory would have been theirs. Now the situation is reversed.
Palestinians were unwilling to accept those original terms the past 7 decades of struggle has brought them, and Israelis too, nothing but destruction and grief. The politics of the Middle East unnecessarily prolonged the Palestinian decline as their conflict was used as a proxy to deflect from the disastrous policies of the entrenched Arab regimes throughout the region. Now the neighboring states see little advantage in dismissing Israel as illegitimate, leaving the Palestinians to their often self-inflicted morass.
I believe any plan by Trump to be suspect, even if it seems on the surface to advantage Israel. What is required now is an honest plan giving the Palestinians a legitimate state that is responsible for both honest self-governance AND responsibility to seek a long-term political solution with Israel.
The demographic challenge of a One State Solution is, and has always been, insurmountable. Israel wishes to remain a Jewish State and the Palestinians are entitled to establish a state to their desire. Neither side will trust the other for decades after any division so some compromise will be needed regarding an armed Palestinian state.
Trump does what is in his interest... be wary of gifts from Trump!
8
Some plan. Trump (and I assume his stooge-in-law, Jared) cook up a plan that Netanyahu enthusiastically endorses. No consultation with or involvement of the Palestinians but they are supposed to accept it as announced? Israel has an unequivocal right to exist in peace and safety and the Palestinians have a right to a state of their own. The only was this will ever take place is for the parties that have the most at stake to sit down and haggle our a compromise. It will take as long as it takes but only the Israelis and the Palestinians can come to a solution.
8
@David DiRoma Palestinians have refused their contribution to the plan, as it was not in their interest. Their is a crazy position ! They have only to gain from this plan.
6
It is time for the EU to make it clear that the American peace plan does not conform with established international law and violates the basic human rights of the Palestinian people, and therefore is rejected by the EU.
12
@Greg It was always time for EU to try to do something, but what have they done beside supporting (only with words) Palestinians?
4
This is the inevitable result of Arabs starting wars of annihilation against Israel, losing them and then trying to dictate the peace terms as if they had won. Eventually, Egypt and then Jordan gave up playing that game and made peace with Israel.
The Palestinian Arabs, egged on by supporters who always proved themselves to be far more anti-Israel than pro-Palestinian, are being offered a final opportunity to climb aboard the peace train and take charge of their future. But that would require regime change at both the PA and Hamas levels and a recognition that their erstwhile allied have treated them as pawns not people. What will the Palestinian Arabs do is the question of the moment.
17
A peace plan in which one side lists what it wants, period, is not a peace plan. With characteristic chicanery, Trump’s people have merely hatched a false phrase so Trump can pretend to be making peace (or even wanting it) when he is not. If mendacity were a fog, we wouldn’t be able to see the White House from six feet out.
11
This is NOT a serious proposal.
It is a charade with 3 purposes:
1) distract Americans from the impeachment trial
2) pretense that Trump is making real progress on foreign policy.. which is as laughable as his "progress with Korea", progress with "Russia", "Progress with Iran".. etc. etc.
3) an attempt to give cover to Netanyahu as he tries for a 3rd time to run for election and form a government in Israel.. while this time also facing serious corruption charges.
These guys are both corrupt to the core.. don't fall for the distraction here.
13
As the article points out, the proposal is so one-sided there is no realistic chance of the Palestinians accepting it. But peace is not really the point. Trump is signaling to the militant pro-Israel lobby groups to pressure Senators for support in impeachment proceedings and to PACs for campaign funding for November.
5
I will always support Israel, but not Netanyahu. And not this sham plan, concocted by Trump's useless Son in Law who is completely prejudiced, and has made a plan that has nothing to do with bringing peace or a compromise to the region or the Palestinian/Israeli issues to a fair resolve. This is a joke, like the rest of Trump's foreign policy and his negotiating which by no one's definition has anything to do with negotiating.
11
It is depressing to see two indicted criminals attempting to obfuscate for their mutual retention on he levers of power by presenting a paper tiger "peace" accord that will be so easily abandoned once they both are assured said retention of their respective holds on power.
They seem untouchable, but perchance they will both be touched in the end, god willing...
10
“Nearly three years in the making and overseen by Mr. Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner ....”. Meanwhile, Republicans argue Hunter Biden was unqualified for his position. Now that’s chutzpah.
45
President Carter got Begin and Sadat to meet at Camp David and work out a peace plan together. For this he received the Nobel Peace Prize
Trump meets with Netanyahu alone and proposes a plan without Palestinian participation, a plan which favors Israel. This one sided approach is doomed to fail.
Trump will demand the Nobel Peace Prize which I doubt he will ever receive. Perhaps Netanyahu will get jail time and Trump will be impeached. Pray for justice.
23
Trump is simply playing political games to please his base.
6
Classic Trump negotiation tactic.
Ask for the sky and wait for a counter.
Unfortunately, the incompetent Abbas will just scoff and ignore this and the Palestinians will suffer more.
6
The only "win-win" for Israel, Palestine and the U.S. of A. would be trials and convictions of both netanyahu and trump.
(But I would hope as well to see jared forced to return to the only business in which he has demonstrated any expertise -- collecting monthly [over]charges from economically-challenged tenants renting rooms in his substandard housing.)
12
For the Zionists,the creation of Israel required the forcible removal of 700,000 Palestinians and the destruction of their villages. Much of modern Israel is built on top of these ruins. Over the past decades,the Israeli government has continued to confiscate even more lands. All the so called peace proposals have continued to ask the Palestinians to accept their losses and make further concessions to the Israeli government. This plan seems to be a continuation of that process.
14
It’s always Israel’s way or the highway
3
@Vincent
Not unlike Trumps' evangelicals here!
Nonsense. The Arabs mostly fled beause the Arab armies told them to move out of the way while they annihilated the Jews. The Arabs lost the 1948 war and the others they started. The Palestinian Arabs have become professional refugees living off the dole ever since.
What about the 1 Millions Jews forced out of the Arab countries at gun point with only their clothes on their backs? The Jews had lived in these places since Babylonian times when the Romans forced most of them out of ancient Israel. Why no reparations for them? Why the double standard for Israel?
5
Sounds like this deal will guarantee many more years of U.S. involvement in the region. Mucho Banko for the war profiteers, which is really the point right?
8
Halt financial support to Israel until a mutually acceptable peace is agreed, and peace will come within 60 days.
7
It’s a win-win solution for Trump and Netanyahu, meaning in the extremely short-term political sense.
It could help two of them win the next elections.
For the Israelis and the Palestinians, it’s the lose-lose proposal in which both sides are going to suffer in the long term.
The plan is designed to create the bad blood between those people, thus dooming them with the never-ending conflict and war.
Instead of teaching them about coexistence, tolerance, cooperation, mutual shared future and love for the first neighbors, it promotes the brutal land conquest as the way of solving the problems.
The Ottoman Empire has been conquering the Near East, the Northern Africa and the Southeast Europe for almost six centuries.
The endless wars distorted their worldview, minds and souls.
At the very end the Turks lost everything.
Is that what Trump has planned for the Jews and the Palestinians?
7
This plan has as much hope for success as any other except for one thing: It comes exclusively from Israel and the U.S. or, more accurately, Herr Trump, America's would be dictator. It makes no mention of consultation or cooperation with the United Nations or even neighboring Arab countries. Will the Palestinians be mollified by a bribe? Unlikely. And who is going to impose this solution? Israel? How is that different from what is already happening? I oppose neither Palestine nor Israel, nor even Trump in this case, merely the concept of two would be autocrats making a self-serving deal and calling it a solution.
7
@Dan Shiells. No Arab input? I guess you forgot about the big economic summit that was held in Bahrain last year. Then again, perhaps the ambassadors from Bahrain, Oman and the United Arab Emirates just stumbled into the White House when Trump unveiled the peace plan.
The sad fact remains that once again the rulers of the Palestinian Arabs prefer to enrich themselves at their people’s expense by refusing to try settling the conflict in realistic terms. They deliberately boycotted the entire Trump process - and tried but failed to have the Arab countries boycott it too, which should have made them understand that the political winds of the region had firmly shifted against them. Then again, they embarrassed President Obama by not even dignifying the parameters Secretary Kerry has proposed with so much as an answer - a true marker of their lack of interest in peace on anything other than their maximalist terms.
The Palestinian Arabs have lost their long war against the Jews. They are now on the verge of losing the peace as well.
11
@Charlie in NY
See map. UAE, Bahrain, and Oman are not NEIGHBORING states, simply rich oil sultanates with a vested economic interest in Trump and America. Not sure about who was at or what was discussed at economic summit in Bahrain but certainly no plan or emerging consensus was announced at that time. Nor is there evidence of Congress being consulted. It is not required that they be consulted but, since they will have to fund it and support it, it would seem prudent. I agree that the Palestinians have squandered opportunities through unreasonable intransigence. And they hardly would be the first people to essentially be conquered or absorbed by another country. I just don't see how two men, both elected by a minority of their country's voters, can dictate a territorial adjustment to a third party and call it a solution.
I'm sorry, but just how long is this "West Bank-Gaza Tunnel" supposed to be? And is this supposed to be a pedestrian tunnel, a rail tunnel, or one designed to accommodate automobile traffic?
I only ask because all of them sound like potential death-traps, it's just a question of how many people are going potentially going to die.
If it's a pedestrian tunnel...how are they going to move people and goods through what looks like 20-30 miles of underground passages. (It's hard to tell because the scale at the bottom is so small, and the photo such poor resolution, but for perspective the Chunnel is about 31.5 miles long).
If it's a rail tunnel, how is it going to be built and maintained in a "nation-minus" without any heavy industry or existing rail infrastructure--and how are they going to respond to security or safety issues that arise underground?
And if it is a traffic tunnel, how are they going to mitigate the exhaust from thousands if not millions of cars and trucks? My God, imagine the fumes generated in the Holland Tunnel--which is just a paltry 8,600 feet each way, and accommodates only 90,000 cars across four lanes of traffic. Now imagine enduring those fumes for 20-30 miles.
And on top of that, imagine that the Holland Tunnel is the ONLY land route connecting the most densely populated city in the Middle East to the rest of the "country(ish)," and the only land route connecting the "country(ish)" to the Mediterranean.
4
@Anonymous Bosch totally impractical and unattainable, seeing as construction would have to stop every time they find something of archaeological importance.
3
It violates established international law.
It violates the UN Charter.
It violates basic human rights.
It violates decades of official American foreign policy.
It does not deserve the light of day.
14
@Greg
Then I guess France should solve the problem.
From a negotiations standpoint the series of events leading up to this deal produced the current lack of results. The Israelis ate all the carrots by unilaterally declaring Israel the capital of their state and assuming full control over the Galilee.
The Trump administration did more damage by cutting funding to the Palestinians, closing their offices in Washington D.C., withdrawing from UNESCO and tacitly approving Likud's proposals to annex more disputed territories with utter silence on the matter.
This seems like the makings of a raw deal for Israel's neighbors.
5
@Eric
The Palestinians had their chance and they blew it.
3
Neither side is willing to make the sacrifices necessary for peace. Israel is unwilling to make the sacrifices of land necessary to accommodate the Palestinians reasonable needs. And the Palestinians - which includes Hamas and Islamic Jihad, among others - are unwilling to stop the terrorist attacks on Israel, which at least in part explains the Israeli reluctance to sacrifice land. Only once the hardships on both sides become untenable will they be more open to making the sacrifices that true peace requires.
7
@Schneiderman In the plan the size of the Palestinian State is TWICE as big the land where Palestinians currently live.
2
I like the part where all the Trumpists think the $50 bil is actually on the table.
13
Americans have a simplistic view of world conflicts - conflict is bad, something else is good. So, to understand all the issues in the Mideast, you must examine each side's position. Having this conflict exist now for some 70 years plus without resolution, the simple and logical answer is that neither side wants a change to the de facto detente.
Israel will certainly not give up anything - land, reparations, right of return, control for starters since they know none of these will end conflict. Palestinians also need their status quo "victimization" to remain ensuring handouts from around the world. They also know their demands will never be accepted so they keep making them to ensure failure of any such plan from outsiders. Nothing changes nor will it
8
@irv wengrow I think the Palestinian side wants a change, but Israel won't accept the change that the Palestinian side wants. This situation seems like a balanced stalemate - the US funds Israeli defense, Israel is pretty safe internally, and Israel participates in the world's developed economies. What the heck could they possible get from the Palestinians at this point? Zip.
1
Neocons & Neoliberals need to get Likud everything it wants before Bernie Sanders takes office next year & tells the Israelis that the party is over and it's justice time.
4
*45's only strategy seems to be cruelty in everything he does!
NY Times: When are you going to call for *45's removal and/or resignation.
7
This should clear up any confusion about who is running the country and dictating foreign policy: Israel is the tail wagging its American dog.
19
Why is Trump spending time on Israel and Palestine? America is unraveling at its seams.
23
one word: evangelicals
3
This President is the very lowest of the "low lifes", could never be trusted for a single word he has to say, or action he makes, and his "plan" will be entirely rejected by every and any remotely sane person the world over.
15
Amazing how many americans commenting here know exactly what is going on in the middle east but obviously have no clue as to what is happening in their own country!
9
This 'plan' is disgusting. It is a one-sided, two-party criminal conspiracy. It is a slap-in-the-face attempt to justify, to legalize Israeli atrocities. It a crime against humanity, U.N. resolutions and international law.
It benefits Israel only. That it was brazenly presented as an humanitarian, Nobel worthy 'deal' is beyond obscene. It is a faux justification for future Israeli war crimes.
It is a slight-of-hand declaration of war.
Trump's bigotry equating his Saudi Arabian business trip as an essentially de facto visit to Palestine is ignorance personified. It is a cultural insult as large as equating Central Americans need for asylum with drug trafficking via Mexico.
This 'peace' illegally encourages Israel to annex the West Bank, to steal Palestinian land via Jewish settlements and occupy Gaza. It gives Israel complete political control of Jerusalem. It robs Palestine to its right of self-determination.
Wholly defined by Israeli/U.S. over-site it demands--with military consequences--total, comprehensive Palestinian compliance. It annihilates the peace of the Iranian nuclear accord.
It is bribe. Its 'prosperity' is oppression in disguise. It imagines that 0.000025% (50 billion) of 1 single year's worth of America GDP (20 trillion) is an equitable 'win-win'. No, it is price-fixing, is U.S. economic exploitation.
It grants Palestine sovereignty in name only. This 'Deal of the Century' is unconditional poli-economic surrender. It is the STEAL of the Century.
10
It's a great new destination for Russian mob money and Trump-branded Hotels!
10
From plan to plan, it gets smaller. Peace plan 2050 would propose a Palestinian state in the size of a small bazaar.
23
So I do not understand why America would have to pay 50 billion to build Palestine. It seems to me that Israel should pay for the transition. They are the ones who are gaining a nation given to them 70 years ago. We already give Israel 30 billion a year. Can't Isreal stand on it's own two feet by know?
16
@oscar jr
Actually ... the article says the $50 billion with international financing. He never said how much America would pay, if anything.
3
@Oscar Jr - this is Trump's plan - there will be no $50 billion. Trump ponies up for NO ONE
2
The US most certainly NOT give 30 billion dollars to Israel each year.
1
This so-called peace proposal will soon be cited in major dictionaries as an example of naivete.
4
@Aurora More like an example of perfidy!
Maybe this is the shining object meant to divert attention, Trump's defense lawyer Jane Raskin was referring to.
6
Nobel Prize for 45th's son-in-law for solving this problem.
1
@Trevor Diaz yeah. The same way Mr Trump should have got a Nobel for bringing peace to the Korean Peninsula. Why on earth doesn't everyone recognise peace when they see it?!?
1
@Trevor Diaz ..Trevor ? Surely you jest,right ?
4
“My vision presents a win-win opportunity for both sides"
Your vision President Flim Flam is to divert attention from the avalanche of evidence that you should be removed from office which has been presented in the Trump Impeachment Trial.
Your Middle East Peace Plan will undoubtedly be, as all your plans are, a passing puff of foul smelling vapor.
7
Immoral, corrupt national leaders must stick together.
8
Here in Hawaii, there is a saying that asks how can you have Aloha without Hawaiians? How can you have an Israeli Palestinian Peace Plan without the participation of the Palestinians? This will much harder than trying to get two Corinthians to make peace.
8
A typical Trump ‘both sides’ argument claiming total equivalency where there is none. Just as he whines that any situation in which he loses out is ‘unfair’.
5
So, basically they are making demilitarized Palestinian reservations that are heavily policed and overseen by Israel. Is the jobs plan to open casinos like our Native American tribes do here?
11
@Kathy Do you think Donnie would let anyone else have casinos? He would be the first to claim them for himself!
The timing of this "announcement" makes it laughably disingenuous. It is solely designed to deflect interest from the POTUS's criminal activities and make it appear that he actually has some negotiation skills. This "deal" is about as sound as the one made with his "lover", Kim. Good grief.
12
How could it be the greatest peace plan in history when the other side didn't even show up and didn't agree to the plan? Any President could have done that any time.
11
At some point, after having exhausted all efforts at a bilateral compromise, the victors in a conflict are absolved of taking input from the loser on how to move forward. That is what is under way.
Palestinians are being told to you can get 80% of the West Bank, a land swap for the 20%, and $50B. In four years, Israel will be in an even stronger position having annexed 20% and likely opened diplomatic relations with the Gulf. Then, your input will be even less important. So make a deal now.
Frankly, Trump is right. This is how you negotiate in the ME. If anything, $14k for every Palestinian and a land swap is more than what should have been put on the table.
6
@Sagi Well, let’s see if the Palestinians agree with you, Trump, and Netanyahu.
I won’t hold my breath.
1
Basically, Trump drew a line around everything Netanyahu wanted and offered $50B to the Palestinians if they would take what's left. This plan was probably designed in fifteen minutes -- no reason to have taken three years of the Trump presidency. There's no hope of acceptance. Trump and his minions are operating on the assumption that everything has a price. Good luck.
9
Why is Trump involved in this? He needs to make peace in his own country.
7
The Palestinians brought this on themselves. They rejected the 1947 UN partition, rejected the Omert and Barak peace deals, which were far more generous than Trump's plan, and blew up the Geneva accords through violence. They refuse to accept Israel's right to exist and stop violent acts against civilians. Since when does the loser dictate the terms of settlement after starting and losing multiple wars? Enough is enough. They have a Palestinian state. It's called Jordan but notably, the Jordanians don't want the Palestinians nor do the other Arab states. Gee, I cannot imagine why. They should compromise and get on with building something positive rather than constant violence.
13
Blaming the victims seems to be en vogue these days.
3
@Chris
He wasn’t blaming Israel
2
The best offer they'll get for another 10 years.
7
This isn't even "four wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch". It's two wolves pretending that the lamb was at the table, while planning how they'll get the lamb ON it.
6
So 'the King' thinks he can broker a peace without having both parties at the table. It's not really a 'peace plan' so much as Trump granting Netanyahu's wish list. A pair of corrupt criminals, looking to distract from their domestic woes. Hey Trump- you're more than happy to abandon our allies and claim we need to get out of the ME... let's start here. Let Israel and Palestine work it out among themselves and stop arming both sides. Isn't that what you've been saying about every other country we're involved with?
4
How do you announce a peace plan with only one side present?
6
Seriously, are there even any gerrymandered House districts that look as ridiculous as this?
The only countries I know that are more discontiguous are Indonesia and the Pacific Oceanic microstates, but at least their islands are separated by water barriers rather than an armed and hostile land-based foreign power.
5
This strong arm pitch is without a doubt absolute madness. Really nothing more than blackmail once again from the great deal maker. He is giving away what was never his in the first place.
4
I recall one "peace plan" rejected by the Palestinians that gave them land but little access to water resources. They are SO unreasonable!
4
In divorce proceeding have you ever wondered why people don't all just simply agree to submit to settlements drawn up by their mothers-in-law?
7
Arbitrary lines on a map do not make a nation which is essentially what they have been doing for a very long time. No need to bet who was the driving force behind this so called ‘deal’ this totally has Kushner written all over it.
3
Why would anyone take a deal from the US knowing its president could nullify the thing based on a whim ?
7
Israel under Bibi is an apartheid regime and president Trumps proposal is merely a provocation. A provocation that invites the victims to submit and accept Israeli aggression. Israel should withdraw from illegally occupied territory (as accepted by the UN) and cease the sub human treatment of its fellow humans. This would be a brave statement and one which would be supported by the global community. If the 75th anniversary of the liberation of the camps tells us anything it’s we should never accept the brutality of the strong over the weak or allow fellow citizens of the world be without a voice when it occurs.
20
In 2000 Clinton had Barak willing to settle in terms close to Resolution 242. Arafat rejected it as not including the right of return. Since then changes in both Israeli and American politics have made the renewal of such an offer impossible. Add in Hamas being a client of Iran which alienates Sunnis the Palestinians there is no real pressure to give them an equitable deal.
5
This was just another dog and pony show, like the USMCA presentation or the speeches after various assassinations. Everyone knows the plan is never going to work. For Trump the substance is not important, rather the amount of applause and the ability to divert attention from his scandals are the measuring sticks. I wonder what his lawyers and senators say in the washrooms and gyms about their president.
14
Coming soon:
The Trump West Bank-Rupt Hotel and Casino!
16
Nobody asked the Palestinians in 1948. Why ask them now, right?
17
Actually they did. The UN plan divided the land into two states with the Jewish one being indefensible and only 3 miles wide at its most narrow. Despite this, Israel accepted the deal and in return had 5 Arab armies invade it including Jordan and Egypt who controlled Gaza, the West Bank and east Jerusalem from ‘48-67. You should Ask yourself why those Arab countries, occupying the land Palestinians want for their own country today, didn’t give them to the Palestinians then?
4
So a biased partner of the 51st US state designed a peace plan that does not recognize the sides in the issue. LOL. Talk about fake news.
9
And, of course, this one-sided plan is released the DAY after International Holocaust Rememberance Day. How exploitative can you get?
23
Israel will self-destruct if it follows anything promoted by Trump and Netanyahu.
15
A Middle East peace plan is announced by the US and Israel without a single Palestinian present. Perhaps Benjamin Netanyahu should explain the meaning of the word “chutzpah” to Donald Trump and the rest of the world.
18
International Investment in Palestine? I wonder how many of those investments will earn money for Trump and his cronies. Win/win situation except for those Palestinians who have lived in an area for years and years only to have their land expropriated by Israel, forcing them into what amounts to a ghetto. Israel has succeeded in making criticism of their policies tantamount to anti-Semitism so no one is permitted to question anything they do. And Trump uses his support for Netanyahu to buy votes from Jews who support Israel's hard line policies. Trump is not your friend as much as he would have you believe it.
9
What a sham! Trump has offered a half carrot with a hidden retraction date. Refuse or simply fail to respond in a timely manner (Trump's version), and Israel will declare land now held by Jewish settlements as permanently theirs. This isn't a peace proposal; it is a proposal to increase tension not only between Israel and Arab Nations but among the Arab Nations themselves.
9
Two corrupt heads of states offering a deal to a third corrupt head of state without letting him sit at the negotiation table. Sounds like a winning plan.
10
Three years of work to produce this?
Kushner is even more incompetent and ineffectual than any of us ever imagined.
His father in law of course swallowed the idea wholesale.
What an abysmal band of reprobates.
21
@larrea
In all honesty, I have never seen such levels of incompetence!!!
5
@Steve it's really quite shocking isn't it? Almost incomprehensible.
Good grief. Two alleged criminals trying to strike a deal without involving Palestine. Follow the money!! The rest of the world watches in disbelief.
13
Israel's cowardice is astounding. They alienate the entire world with their actions, not because it's bad and cruel policy, which it is, but because they wouldn't do it without US support. Shameful
12
Ok, I just took a look at the Jared Plan. This is an outrage -- against the entire fabric of international law.
The Times is compromised by publishing this as news. This is a grotesque PR stunt.
10
The Trump peace plan: If the Palestinians surrender, I promise someone will give them lots of money. It took them years to come up with this. A total waste of time.
14
Since 1938, when the Arabs refused half of the British Mandate and instead waged genocidal war on the Jews, there have been other opportunities offered and refused.
While Israel continues to thrive, Palestinian leaders have created a dismal situation for their people.
When Israel is 100 years old, we who love her will celebrate!
And the Palestinians will still be saying, “No!”
12
This so called "Peace Plan" doesn't favor either Israel citizens or the subjected Palestinian people. It strongly favors the politics of Theodor Herzl's Zionist Movement. It would be a victory for the colonialist, racist, exceptionalist ideology that Netanyahu and his Likud Party stand for.
This "Peace Plan" calling for Zionist subjugation of the Palestinian people has no place for approval in the 21st century.
10
The Palestinians have known for years what a one-sided tragic joke this process is. I’m an American and I have absolutely no faith in anything either of these two criminals, Trump and Netanyahu, have to say. The US is an even handed broker, my foot - what a horrific LIE that has been perpetrated on the Palestinians! Israel deserves whatever harm comes to it, as does the US.
7
It's sad to read all the comments from wannabe statesmen spouting glory to the failed policies of the past and no light at the end of the tunnel for the future. This will not be decided by the readers of this paper but by the Arab princes and their bankers in the Middle East. It's about time for the death and destruction to end and a stable civilization to rise. I haven't read the entire plan, but there should be some mechanism for the new civilization to share in the royalties of the offshore gas fields in Israeli waters.
1
Given that Israel controls the land right now any deal will be subject to their agreement. Any idea otherwise is fantasy.
3
Can we please just vote these two clowns out of office already?
Maybe we can save some money and they can share a jail cell.
This is a mutually-beneficial distraction for both of them.
Luckily it's still buried as a deep fourth behind Bolton and the international health crisis in China, and even Kobe.
7
"Win-win for both sides?" Of curse, Trump means for himself and Netanyahu, not for Palestinians. This more nearly resembles the Anschluss of 1939 than a peace plan for people to live together in long-contested lands. This is an award of land like to the farmer Lincoln had a story about; he, the farmer, said he wasn't greedy, he just wanted the land next to his. In this cradle of civilization, Trump and Netanyahu send any peace hopes to a grave where claims and hopes will be reborn no matter how many elections are held.
4
“He promised to provide $50 billion in international investment.... America and many other countries, we will be there.”
From a guy that didn’t even pay the contractors who built his casinos. Sure, Donald, other countries will be happily chipping in billions to your little scheme, who could possibly doubt it.
Words cannot express how loathsome this huckster is or how utterly cynical and fraudulent this “plan” is. Of course, Israel loves it, or at least Netanyahu does, and we know how important Bibi’s wishes are to the Republican donor class.
What a transparent farce. The world is rolling its eyes.
15
A cooked up "peace plan" designed only for the political benefits of Netanyahu and donald trump.
10
You voted for this guy, you have to incur his actions. I left New York a ways back! This will likely get us attacked again.
3
It's the best ever peace plan between the US and Israel. Only a stable genius could have conceived it!
1
I am forever appalled at the lack of good faith shown by Trump and his few friends. I am more appalled by the apparent gullibility or stupidity of those who applaud. The idea that assertion constitutes fact based argument is nauseating as many of the replies show. No the Arabs in this part of the world no matter what you call them have been disposed and continue to be.
3
Two corrupt politicians under indictment, proclaiming their "win-win opportunity." A win-win for some but not all, depending on your religious and cultural beliefs. Trump and Netanyahu are birds of a feather and in each case, their nations' democracies are trying to maintain the rule of law while they ignore it.
6
I'm thinking if Jared Kushner is qualified to broker a "peace plan" then Hunter Biden can work for Burisma.
11
Dear NYT , tell the truth, you are very surprised that the Trump's plan does include a two States solution which you already and loud had given for not not possible under Trump.
But of course you can not give Trump any credit !
1
@Mary Yeah. They should celebrate that Mr Trump has finally caught up to the world consensus from 15 years ago.
2
@Mary How can you say that were not trying to give Trump credit? That's what the impeachment and senate trial are all about.
I was going to comment on this plan, but then I was afraid that it would just encourage them.
3
This is just playing to the cameras.
Distract, divert attention from the criminal activities going on behind the curtain.
Boy, I would love to be near Saint Peter when tRump has to face God.
4
@Gdnrbob
Oh ye of little faith! Despite his claim of being "the chosen one", Trump will never meet St. Peter! He will have somewhere warmer to go.
The plan gives the "Palestinians" 4 years to accept. In the meantime Israel will be able to build on the 30% of Judea and Samaria that will remain under Israeli sovereignty.
Anyone who believe the "Palestinians" will ever achieve their dream of eliminating Israel by forcing it to withdraw to the 1967 armistice border and allowing millions of "refugees" into Israel is dreaming. It will never happen, nor will an Israeli withdrawal from Jerusalem or Jewish towns in Judea and Samaria. And the false dream peddled by US Presidents from Clinton to Obama will increasingly become a nightmare -- in particular for the "Palestinians" who have lost most of their support in the Arab world.
This is the last, best hope the "Palestinians" have for a positive future. It will allow them to normalize their economic, social and governing institutions and increase their quality of life. Let's see if, after their initial tantrums subside, they can finally take yes for an answer.
7
Trump's plan calls for a Palestinian state with limited sovereignty. What exactly does that mean? Would it be something like the reservations where Native Americans were forced to live or would it be more akin to the "homelands" in Apartheid South Africa?
11
Just 2 criminals making decisions that impact the entire planet. No big deal.
11
Trump is paying off his corrupt counterpart (Netanyahu) for getting him elected. The Russians interfered, but Israel did so as well.
Only Trump can see this as a deal!
7
Makes you wonder who the "both sides" are in this case.
3
@GreystoneTX Republican and Likud voters.
Trump says his wonderful Mideast Plan is a “win win” for both sides. Like when you went to his casino. The casino always won and you had a good time. Win Win.
5
Two corrupt "leaders" doing everything they can to distract, distract, distract.
6
We can't hear you. This distraction isn't working. We've got a president on trial, who needs to be removed from office. Isn't America GREAT!
4
Unfortunately for Trump, peace plans involve two parties.
6
Even if Abbas and the PA were willing to negotiate, the part about Hamas disarming and giving Gaza back to PA control is a demand they could never deliver on even if they wanted to. All sides know this poison pill was included to guarantee the proposals rejection and thus give Israel a green light to move forward with annexation. This was clearly the real goal for all parties (including the Palestinians, who get to remain victims and recipients of billions in foreign aid) this whole time.
2
The dispute between Israel and the Palestinians is about land. According to the map the DT plan allows the Palestinians only a small portion of the land. A plan destined to continue Palestinian resentment, more support for Hamas and continuing trouble for Israel. A $50B "bribe" to the Palestinians by the US should be a non-starter. We should not be paying any money. A forced Agreement is no Agreement.
5
Why not work exclusively with the Palestinians, build a plan that meets with their approval, and then share it with Israel? I wonder if that sort of approach would have produced a different outcome.
10
I love the area on the map showing "Residential Areas" in the Negev desert. Reminds me of the great deal we gave Native Americans in the 1800's.
12
"And it sent a grim message to the Palestinians that they have missed their chance to win the “two-state solution” they long pursued — as least so long as Mr. Trump is president."
No, several times Pres Trump used the expression 'a start'.
The Palestinians should respond by demanding sovereignty NOW.
3
@Michael Anasakta I'd recommend just waiting for either Trump or Netanyahu to leave office, as one or both are likely in the near future.
1
Regardless of what is in the plan there is literally no path forward as long as Hamas rules Gaza. Any plan will have as pre-requisite the disarming and removal of the terrorist organisation. They would be giving up thier arms, their fame, their religious vows to destroy Israel and essentially all that they cherish and hope for. It is not the Palestinian people that necessarily reject overtures for peace, but the leadership is intractable and will sacrifice the lives of their people to prevent peace if necessary. The chronic question remains, exactly who is Israel making peace with? Fatah? Hamas? Themselves warring factions who agree on almost nothing. A united arab world would have to place inordinate pressure on Hamas for concessions of any kind much less total disarmament.
5
Maybe they missed the photo op but I don't see any one from the Palestinian Authority on the podium, that is of course assuming they were present, invited, to this 'event'. Evidently Not, so a word of wisdom to Trump, Jarred et all. In order to broker an agreement you need two sides and a mediator . One side and a mediator is not worth the paper it is written on.
I am Jewish and a supporter of Israel, though not not the corrupt Nethenyahu or his government. I am more than frustrated by this little circus that Trump put on today .
Was it to help Nethanyahu in the upcoming election to deflect from Trumps Impeachment , I am not sure.
What I am certain of is that neither the Israeli people or the Palestinians have been served well by this deal, that was years in the making.
10
Consider that the right wing including Netanyahu sees Israel not as a modern state governed by men but as the reincarnation of the land given to the Hebrews by Jehovah as their homeland, and to achieve that end to slaughter all people who would prevent that outcome. I would not be surprised if expelling the Palestinian Arabs from Israel and all the lands making up a contiguous and unified country is not the long term goal. I would not be surprised if killing those resisting might be a real alternative means to that end.
3
Actually, your describing the plan of Hamas and their ilk.
If you want a glimpse of the future with Trump after impeachment, you need look no further than Israel.
Before Prime Minister Netanyahu's reign, I was a
in awed of Israel. The raid on Entebbe after their jet was high jacked was more daring than any writer could have conceived. Flying in a night, without permission, rescuing every hostage present ( one was in the hospital) was impressive.
Prime Minister Netanyahu is definitely a man Mr. Trump has openly admired and apparently emulated. The terms 'fake news' and 'witch hunt' are all claims that have been first made by Netanyahu . Sound familiar?
When Netanyahu applied to the Parliament for immunity from prosecution on corruption charges, it was viewed as an admission of guilt. Now he has withdrawn that request 'complaining that he would not have gotten a fair shake'. He " decided not to let the dirty game continue." The indictments for bribery, fraud and breach of trust still hang over his head but will not prevent Netanyahu from seeking re election.
Any solution these two corrupt politicians come up with is not worth looking at. Neither one is fettered by morals, ethics and both believe the're above the law!
8
This plan is not a serious attempt at Peace but rather more grist for Trump's base composed of radical right-wing Israeli nationalists and evangelicals who believe that they are safeguarding the Holy Land.
For starters it is not just to reward the Israelis with land obtained by military means and the capital of both states should be an open international city located near the holy sites for all religious groups involved.
Peace will not come with 50 Billion $, nor will it come at the point of a gun. There will be no Peace without Justice.
5
This is not a viable or even serious peace plan. The key announcement of the day is that Israel care taker Bibi government is getting ready to annex previously stolen land in the West Bank. This American president is giving cover to blatant land theft from a people that can’t defend themselves. What happened to the plans of defending freedom and democracy in the ME?
4
They are being asked to give up their sovereignty for a plate of lentils. It is to be noted that the amount of money offered is to be "international". Trump undoubtedly expects others to do most of the paying. The US ha long lost its role as honest broker and the conflict will continue.
19
@Frank Casa, no different than Jacob trading Esau his birthright for a plate of stew to get us where we all are today. It’s like history repeating itself.
Whether you like Trump's deal or not, one thing is certain: the Israelis are largely ok with the status quo. Their economy is humming along, their alliances with foreign countries are improving, there is no existential threat facing them.
Meanwhile, the Palestinians are languishing, mostly due to decades of poor leadership. Arafat and Abbas have accomplished exactly nothing in 60 years.
If the Palestinians want to improve their lives, they need to start building a working economy. Or, they can continue to complain about the unfairness of the Israelis, and languish for another few decades.
23
I’d be curious as to how you think they can do that given the bear total blockade around their “country”?
6
Hard to build an economy when all the good land has been stolen, your population is under constant surveillance and subjected to pervasive checkpoints, and every time you overcome all obstacles to build something it gets plowed.
7
How does one “build an economy” without freedom of movement or control over one’s own borders? What free trade pacts are the Palestinians going join? What airport are they going to use to ship goods in and out? Israel keeps the Palestinians isolated from the rest of the international community. No economy can thrive in isolation. Especially one that’s been kept under martial law for over 50 years. Trade and the rule of law are the foundations of a modern functioning economy. The Palestinians have access to neither.
5
Is it a coincidence that these two people both face charges in a court of law? Not to mention Congress in Trumps' case.
13
It looks like the 21st Century version of the Sykes Picot agreement where the affected parties aren’t considered, except that here, Israel is standing in for one of the former colonial powers.
6
Is there any doubt Nikki Haley has abandoned all pretense of civility and humanity in pursuit of her political goals?
13
Serious question. What legal standing does this document have?
4
Answer: None.
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@A Citizen
It would be nice if the media reported the story that way. There is no agreement between the parties, so this carries no more weight than a Facebook post. It's not worth the paper it's printed on.
2
Does anyone really think this is about Israel or "Peace'?
It is about 2 leaders trying to get re-elected:
Trump is trying to peel Jewish voters away from the Democratic party.
Netanyahu is trying to win another term, by appearing 'strong', to forging a coalition with the far right.
5
This isn’t a a serious attempt at fostering peace, not at all.
This is all about a couple of crooked politicians trying desperately to survive scandal.
15
Another step in the wrong direction.
6
What is a peace deal without the Palestinians being present? If the US really wants a peace deal, they should invite other countries to join them to help negotiate a peace deal.
7
@ALN The U.S. can no longer broker a peace deal in the middle-east. In the past it at least pretended to be a neutral broker. Now, even that pretense has fallen away.
2
An impossible proposition is an exercise in futility while attempting to look presidential. If you sat him down, Trump could not find the Gaza Strip on a map. Nor does he understand the issues - something that is now patently obvious.
I am strong supporter of Israel and I oppose BDS. However, the reality is that Israel cannot sustain an army of occupation. If the Palestinians commit to Israel's right to exist and if we commit to limited enforcement then Israel should commit to a two-state solution.
At least four former-leaders of Shin Bet (Shabak), Israel's secretive internal security force, believe that Israel is on the wrong track. I suspect that there is also widespread dissent in the IDF.
3
Trump-Netanyahu peace deal is absurd and both know it. Only fools amongst their respective voter base will find it appealing.
The better plan was proposed and accepted by Arafat in December 2000 - Arafat & Barak (PM Israel) agreed that Palestinians would receive back 94% of disputed territory and sign peace treaty with Israel (2 State Solution per Oslo). Of course, Arafat reneged and substituted the 2nd Intafada. In 2008, the same proposal was offered to the new leader of the P.A. , Abbas. Abbas dismissed it entirely.
The only salient comment in this NYT article is this: IF the other Arab nations would put pressure upon Abbas, a peace treaty would be forthcoming. Again, sadly, the other Arab nations despise the Palestinians for their numerous terrorist activities by way of support for the Muslim Brotherhood; as such, they fear a vital PAlestinian state would bring along renewed terrorism.
1
Amen
What a loss for us all that Arafat could not give up his victim status when Ehud Barak offered the deal of a lifetime.
2
The plan is dead on arrival until November. If Trump is re-elected, we'll see what actions unfold. If he doesn't, the plan is permanently dead.
1
and how many hotels are going to have Trumps name on them?
9
@jed AMAP: as many as possible.
There will never be peace until the Palestinians accept the existence of the State of Israel. There were serious offers made under PM's Barak and Olmert. Unfortunately, the Palestinian delegation always said no. Not sure how 50 years of saying no has worked out for the Palestinian people.
11
If, let's say China, decided that everything west of the Mississippi was now a state for people China didn't want, and suddenly you were pushed off your land or made to be a second-class citizen in your own home, how would you feel?
1
@Errol Where have you been, Erol? The Palestinians have recognized Israel's "right to exist in peace and security" multiple times. most recently in 1993 when they met all diplomatic requirements. You can read those documents, as I did, on the website of the Israeli Foreign Ministry.
ThIs is about as unhelpful as can be. Trump's claims about being the only deal maker forget about Carter and Oslo and all those who came before. This problem will never go away until Israel realises that there are consequences for stealing land and abusing an entire people. Media throughout the world is saying that the proposal does everything for Trump and Bibi, but nothing for Palestine. Equity deamands "clean hands" and fair dealing..
3
When Israel unilaterally removed themselves from the Gaza Strip, the Palestinians had an opportunity -- with millions of dollars in aid --- to turn the place into the Singapore of the Med.
As they've done decades before, they chose wrong, and chose poorly.
7
@badubois I respectfully disagree.
Palestinians could not turn Gaza into anything viable while the Israelis controlled literally everything that went into and out of Gaza, prevented Gazans from developing any ports and airports, and even restricted how far from shore their fishermen could go. Gazans are not completely innocent here, but they are barely surviving in an Israeli-enforced ghetto.
1
This plan is dead on arrival. Nothing to see here, except to note that this is further evidence that the strategic aim of the US and Israel is to make permanent an apartheid system from the Mediterranean Sea to the Jordan River.
Thank you, Mr. Trump, for making apparent and incontrovertible what so many of us have been arguing for years to supporters of Israel who still hold on to the obviously false narrative of Israeli moral uprightness.
2
So let me get this straight -- the plan really depends on other Arab support for viability. So why wouldn't the administration check first with them and THEN announce a plan instead of announcing a non-starter and looking like fools?
2
@BillG Because the purpose of this plan is not to bring peace to the middle-east but rather to shore up the base support for Netanyahu and Trump. There's no coincidence that it was announced during Trump's impeachment trial and the day corruption charges were laid against Mr Netanyahu.
4
Gee, I wonder why the Palestinians have rejected peace deals before?
Could it be because none of them were offered in good faith and all were as much of a “win-win” as this gem of a “peace plan” ?
9
Two elected policymakers, who have been charged with various crimes, are colluding in the open, to harm an unknown number of diverse people- lives, limbs, psyches, norms, values and ethics- in order to save themselves, while surely not being personally accountable, based upon their histories, for the temporary and more permanent expected and unexpected outcomes.
And complacency and active complicity by a range of agendaed stakeholders, and ordinary people, can enable THEM to succeed in their harmful ummenschlichkeit.
This is aside from a reality in which the complex, multidimensional “Israeli-Palestinian conflict” may not be (adequately) resolvable for..., whatever the efforts. Timely or not and by whoever.
3
The only part of this plan that surprises me is that trump didn't push for isreal to annex some of iraq as punishment for wanting us troops gone.
1
"...a highly touted peace plan that was widely considered dead on arrival. Rather than a serious blueprint for peace, analysts called it a political document by a president in the middle of an impeachment trial working in tandem with a prime minister under criminal indictment and about to face his third election in the span of a year."
That pretty much sums it up.
18
Piece plan.
We take your 400 year old olive trees, the Golan Heights, The Suez canal and Jerusalem.
You get the Gaza strip.
Ok ?
17
When the Israeli government wiped Palestine off the map, like every other domination and oppression documented by the historians, this illuminates the fundamental axiom of government -- the powerful eat the weak.
4
If Trump wanted this to work, he should have made it very clear that some (not many) settlements, in both sides, would have to move.
To the contrary, Trump emphasized that no person will move. By itself, this makes the map so fragmented and fractal and infeasible.
Why is that important? In Israel, the forthcoming elections are a referendum of this plan. After tbe elections, politicians will stick to the letter and make negotiation impossible.
Too bad .
It is as if the plan has been designed to fail negotiation.
4
"The PLO and Palestinian Authority shall:
Refrain from joining any international organization without the consent of the State of Israel.
Take no action and shall dismiss all pending claims against the State of Israel, the United States and any of their citizens before the International Criminal Court, the ICJ, and all other tribunals."
Wonder why that's included. After all, all I've ever heard is how well Israel and the US have treated Palestinians, as demonstrated by this farce of a plan.
14
@Vukovar It's because the ICC is considering war crimes charges against Israel. And because some Palestinians are associated with the BDS movement.
It's part of the trap, you see. Palestinians must agree to have no recourse, no matter what Israel does to them.
1
Why would the Palestinians see Trump as an honest broker? He gave up that position when he moved our Israeli embassy to Jerusalem without negotiating with the Palestinians. Both Israel and Palestinian consider that city to be their capital. More recently, he's doubled down by offering a large section of the West Bank to Israel (like it was ours to give). This so-called peace deal is more of the same.
You can either pick a side or be an honest broker, but you can't do both.
11
@Saints Fan
So did Bush. Neither did because they wanted to remain honest brokers. Both wanted it to be part of a negotiated peace deal. Now it's off the table and, as usual, Trump got nothing for it. Well, nothing for the USA.
1
Peace Plan = Playing President
More smoke and mirrors to give the impression that he is actually accomplishing anything.
But boy he really does love to puff himself up and stride around proud of his "presidential achievements".
He loves playing President on TV.
7
One of the main reasons the borders of Trump's new Palestine state are noncontiguous, is so the Israelis can maintain security checkpoints at key junctions.
They offer a house but not the hallways.
4
Why was Kushner absent if this was his deal? Stands to reason that this is not the deal he bargained for. That would explain his canceling his trip to Jerusalem. I wonder what deal it would have looked like before others hijacked it.
1
It was probably worse.
3
Are we allowed to mention that presidential son-in-law and peace broker Jared Kushner has a $25,000,000 line of credit from Discount Bank of Israel and, until 2015, led a foundation that funded Jewish settlements in the West Bank, considered to be illegal by many in the international community?
29
@winchestereast - No, that would be anti-Semitic.
5
I suppose we should be thankful the NYT actually had an article informing us of Mr. Trump's proposal, but it would be hard to imagine a more negative, biased spin than the one put on this. Personally, I would prefer an article actually explaining the offering, and the journalist could maybe put their spin at the end, saving us from having to listen to sniping from the balcony.
9
If Trump is involved in anything the NYT will write a hit piece on it. He could offer asylum to every person living south of the border and this paper would spin it into a negative.
As for this issue it is first attempt for him and any effort is better than none at all. If it does not work you regroup and try again. I doubt either side will come together as both want it all to themselves.
1
Just more evidence that there is no complex situation or difficult problem in the US or in the whole wide world that Trump cannot make worse.
Trump's and Netanjahu's self-serving dishonesty and digital grandstanding will not fool any of us who care about Israel's future and Palestinian dignity. And despite their showboating, both men are going to wind up where they belong in the relatively near future, behind bars.
7
This is not a plan. It's a full throttled directive announced by two domestically, legally embattled national leaders. It's all Trump, all the time in announcing that our national leader tells a foreign people who want a fully own nation that our country does not want them to have their self managed homeland, but granting a place to live under the "watchful" military of a long time opponent. Certainly sounds like so many other subjugated peoples over the centuries,including Native Americans.
It's Trump only seeing what he can get, in this case another election screaming point, and his woeful desire for a Nobel Peace Prize that will not come. And it's Trump, Kushner, and all his sycophants not understanding a culture that does not run only on a deal for cash, but rather is driven by principles and freedom. The directive makes the Middle East and the world less safe, giving the current Israeli government a free hand at any and all military actions against the Palestinians. In the yearly Sedar Jews around the world annually pronounce a wish of "Next year, Jerusalem" in their hope to assemble in the future. It's been a wish, a goal cited for millennia, showing how deeply a concept can run and be the ultimate desire, THE GOAL. Jews everywhere should recognize that the offering of money does not provide the driving force behind thousands of years of hopes and dreams. The current directive provides an analogous driving concept for the Palestinians. This brings no peace.
This has nothing with peace, and it has everything to do with the re-election of Bibi. So it is a Netanyahu protection plan.
7
@Bill Whitehead
And a typical Trump distraction, this time from his trial.
3
Nikki Haley is in Tel Aviv? That's the only positive news here. The "peace plan" is in effect a deed bestowed on Netanyahu, with some easements. It will be seen, correctly, as most important for its timing, which is intended to help its two indicted sponsors win re-election. It oozes cynicism. It would cordon off the Palestinian Arabs into ghettoes, whence they might be released as day laborers (as from bantustans), without citizenship, without the right to vote for their rulers, and subject (like Native Americans on reservations) to continuous land grabs.
5
Important to note that the status quo on the Temple Mount means that Jews are essentially forbidden up there and completely forbidden to pray. Only Muslims have religious freedom
5
Under the agreement, Palestine will pay for The Wall.
7
Why would anyone, any country believe one word that comes out of Trump's mouth?
9
The sight of Trump and Netanyahu together always makes me nauseated. It is especially vile to hear them espouse anything having to do with peace.
A sustainable peace requires authenticity in the brokers and principles. Neither is present in
12
I remember how the Palestinians were allowed to vote on the partition of Palestine in 1947. Will they be allowed to vote on this also?
3
This plan is President Trump offering Trump University Grad School to Palestine.
Why would the Palestinians trust President Trump after Puerto Rico, steel workers, farmers, Mexico, Ukraine, infrastructure week, Michael Cohen...
4
"If Israel doesn’t find a way to halt Iran’s (new) Precison Guided Missile Project, the very character of its wars will change. Despite a steady stream of attacks perpetrated by their enemies in recent years, the Israelis have not needed to fight long or particularly bloody wars. Instead, they have been conducting limited operations. Israel has, in fact, often been able to determine the beginning and end of these flare-ups. Iron Dome’s ability to neutralize rudimentary rockets has made that possible. But now, with PGMs in play, Israel may no longer be able to dictate the terms of conflict when its enemies want one.
And let there be no doubt: They want one.
--- Commentary Magazine, January 2020.
Regrettably, Israel has more to worry about right now than a peace deal with Palestinian leaders who have been fundamentally uninterested in one for the past 72+ years.
6
@A. Stanton
If Israel came to an agreement with the Palestinians, Iran would lose its entire grievance based posture.
But hey, that realization doesnt help build "Greater Israel." Gotta please the sky wizard.
His reality show plan for rallying his loyal MAGA fans to support him in the midst of the Senate trial. And with a “not guilty” vote, rallying his MAGA fans for their votes for a second term by winning crucial swing states’ electoral votes.
3
This is nothing but politics, a ploy to try to secure votes for the upcoming election.
6
This is a transfer of political capital to Netanyahu. He is corrupt, with legal cases seeking to prove it. Any pretense peace plan is simply a way for Bibi to show to his staunch supporters that he tried to offer the Palestinians peace, leading to his foregone conclusion that they don't want peace. Under these terms, who would? Bibi is in a precarious political position. He supports Trump's warmongering with Iran, just as he supported neoconservative warmongering with Iraq. And he also opposed Rabin's peace plan and contributed to the fundamentalist anger against Rabin that had tragic results. No, Netanyahu is not honest about wanting peace.
4
Well, I'm not sure why we're surprised or upset. Trump favors the authoritarian view of the world. But, the Palestinians have been all but forgotten. Moderate Arab states are making peace and deals with Israel. "Allies" like Iran are losing credibility and becoming more isolated. European countries pay lip service but will never challenge the US in the region. More and more countries are recognizing Jerusalem as the final capital of Israel. I see a one-state solution coming, it may be apartheid but the next chapter is being written.
3
This is how powerful Television is utilizing the visual cortex for total control. You are what you watch.
The art of the deal:
1. Talk only to those who are on your side.
2. Ignore the other side.
3. Call it a win-win.
4. Complain when the other side rejects the deal.
5. Repeat.
14
The Trump show is over today and the new episode is this. Indeed, the Daily Chaos.
5
The one real estate deal that Kushner did is a spectacular failure. Why did anyone think his peace plan would be any different?
While the cult will tell you that Kushner is smarter than Einstein, the only reason Trump keeps him around is that he can smell Ivanka on him.
6