Just a reminder to the lawyers, judge, and jury — and to Mr. Weinstein and anyone reading this: Any time you engage in physical sexual activity with someone who doesn’t want to do so at that time, from whom don’t have un-coerced, competent consent (verbal or nonverbal) to engage in sexual activity, it will be experienced as and probably legally defined as assault. This is true whether the other person is a stranger, an acquaintance, a friend, a date, a spouse, and coworker/classmate or as alleged re Weinstein, an employee/contractor.
Even if s/he was an enthusiastic sexual partner before; if s/he doesn’t want to do it right now (or isn’t competent to decide) but you go for it anyway, it’s selfish, wrong, and a moral and legal affront.
Assuming he’s guilty, LOCK HIM UP.
“His lawyers argue that the women who have accused him had sex with him willingly to advance their careers”
In other words, Harvey is admitting to sexual harassment and discrimination in his employment, contracting, and other activities; possibly slander or fraud as well (lying about why he favored one actress over another); and possibly to engaging in psychological/ psychosocial and economic coercion and/or abuse of the women in question (and probably plenty of others).
1
Hate to defend him if he did these terrible things to some of my favorite actresses, but since when is hearsay evidence? His own PI's testimony has weight, at least. And can he possibly get a fair trial after years of intense press coverage and tweet storms, many men losing their life's work and loves, etc., not to mention women empathizing with other women?
1
Ms. Sciorra revealed to interviewers over two years ago that she had slept with a baseball bat under the bed since Weinstein's attack. That sounded real (and harrowing) to me.
7
Brava to all of the women who have come forward to testify. It takes strength and courage.
9
I can't stand Weinstein, with his fake, phoney walker ploy, but I'm not hearing any real legally sufficient evidence here.
12
You’re not sitting in the courtroom so you’re not hearing anything. All you’re doing is reading a summary of some testimony. So how would you know if it’s legally compelling? That’s for the jury to decide.
56
@MIKEinNYC
It's not fake. I saw him in person about one year before #MeToo broke, and he was using a cane -- at least on the day that I saw him -- and his skin was grey.
2
As a matter of law, sworn testimony subject to cross examination in open court is “legally sufficient evidence.” What you are really saying is that you don’t believe her. If a victim testified at trial that someone held them up at gunpoint and took their wallet and identified the defendant in court as that someone, would you not find that “legally sufficient evidence”?
13
YES ROSIE
10
I don't believe a word of any of this testimony. Despite what the liberal media and phony experts claim, one doesn't maintain a warm and close, and sometimes sexual relationship, with ones rapist. Common sense must play a role in this trial. Is Weinstein a jerk and sexual opportunist? Almost definitely. But I'm not buying the rape allegations. Unfortunately, this guy will die in prison because the verdict has already been decided in this North Korea-like show trial.
1
Have you ever been raped? Are you speaking from experience? Do you know an extensive number of people who have been raped by someone they know? What expert position are you in that allows you to determine that the experts' claims are "phony" and driven by the "liberal media"?
24
@MJG
what does being raped have to do with liberal media?
because these women are coming forward?
People like you are the reason they don't, because they are often not believed, or worse, accused of " asking" for it.
If your daughter were an aspiring actress and this man assaulted her, you would not call it rape?
Because he was " helping" her with her career?
wake up man and you sure must be a man.
Times have changed so quickly it's almost unbelievable. Rosie Perez' recollections remind us of the time (most of the time I remember) when Weinstein was a terrifying huge powerhouse in entertainment, and to cross him really meant destruction. Even out in the general public, people had the impression of a monstrous, maniacal, brutal and omnipresent individual who could make a career -- Damon, Affleck, Paltrow -- or utterly destroy it, as it sounds like he had done or threatened to do. It is heart-rending to imagine the suffering people like Ms. Sciorra had to endure both at Weinstein's hands and subsequently, steering the course of her own career through such shark-infested waters. I hope she gets some relief from all of this, and that Weinstein never sees the outside of a very dark cell. In this case, he deserves everything he gets.
25
I just hope he spends his last miserable days in jail.
4
I appreciate that the NYTimes has a policy of not naming alleged rape victims. However, I'm not clear why your policy doesn't include the victims of other forms of sexual assault, You name the woman Weinstein forced oral sex upon. Why the difference?
5
The testimony by Ms Perez is indirect, through the phone, split in different time periods....
It could help lynching a villain. In a court of law....it won't do much.
He belongs in jail. For a long time hopefully.
3
I am thankful this case has gone to trial here in New York City.
Over on the West Coast, The Los Angeles District Attorney refuses to bring rape charges against the actor Danny Masterson, who has been accused by multiple of women of rape.
Sadly, the pets of his accusers are being mysteriously poisoned.
Another example of how many suffer when we look the other way
4
Happens to men, too. It comes down to power and who has the upper hand. We all know these attacks are not necessarily sexually motivated but acts of dominance and violence. I applaud these women. But there are predatory women as well. I know this firsthand, unfortunately. And you stay because you need the job or for a variety of other reasons. And when it's over (if it ever ends), you feel shame for allowing the person to have that much control over of your life.
47
@Ulysses
Thank you for making this point. It might help to reduce the gender- ization of coercion into any unwanted behaviors by workplace superiors, period.
5
@Barbara And the thing that should be discussed more is the fact that it changes you - not only in the obvious ways (which are all valid and heartbreaking), but it makes you more suspicious and wary of anyone new that comes into your life. And that's the change I resent the most. I liked people before this happened to me. Now, I'm forever wondering if the person I just met is capable of doing what the other person did. That other person seemed nice at first, too. In ten years, it went from pulling her aside and asking her not to speak to me that way in front of others, to sitting in my car not wanting to go into work. I eventually lost a job I loved - a job I had for twenty years. She terminated my employment the week she asked me to put my hand up so some of the female employees could put their hands flat against mine while they made comments about how large my "hands" were. It was humiliating. I was fired with no reason given after receiving excellent reviews year after year. I'm convinced, although women seem more vulnerable based on societal expectations, it should never come down to men vs women, but good vs evil.
9
@Ulysses : There is a difference. The human primitive behavioral strategy is one of many predefined sets of behaviors that evidence a profound gender difference.
The female primitive strategy is only similar to the male behaviors in the most superficial ways, most notably the goal of surviving the exploit. The specific behaviors meant to carry out this goal are completely different.
That said, it is true that there are many examples of females instantiating some version of the male behaviors, as you describe.
The important fact to remember is that these behavior patterns are not inherent, but secondary. They’re learned, taught through having been subjected to one or more male’s primitive strategy exploits.
Essentially, these woman are the victims of trauma, acting out what has been done to them. Keeping that in mind when faced with such situations can aid in avoiding falling prey to the same traps women face every day.
Not necessarily an easy task, though. This stuff is everywhere, and we’re literally programmed for it to work. Breaking it can be a lonely and supremely difficult experience.
Having a close trusted partner that sees the same dangers helps. That’s what Rosie Perez was for her friend, probably the only reason Ms. Sciorra is able to come forward.
That implies there are many woman out there who have ‘adjusted’ themselves to what Weinstein did to them, no idea why they’re unhappy with their lives.
Sad but very likely true. —T&K
3
This literally is a "show trial". Even the witnesses are professional actors.
How anyone could believe the emotions expressed by the professional actors is testimony to the ultra-bias of those persons believing the emotions expressed are sincere. These actors are very accomplished and skilled at portraying any desired emotions on command.
Their words may or may not be truthful. But their emotions should be distrusted.
13
@Overwhelmed By Evidence
I agree that there is a great amount of acting by any participants in many trials. My point is that when it is done by amateurs it is very risky because the chance of their acting being transparent is high in which case it would work against them.
But a professional actor has no such risk. And acting any emotion is an easy activity for them. For both reasons, it is therefore much more likely that they would do it.
As for reliving ancient events, I think that is but one example of a larger phenomenon of women crying very easily generally. As children boys are discouraged when they cry. Eventually, they largely cease doing so. But girls are not discouraged. Furthermore, girls quickly discover that crying is very profitable for them....so they get rewarded for doing it. That is why any women crying on the witness stand should be viewed as suspiciously insincere. And, before you go off on me for saying that, I think women on juries are more suspicious of female witnesses crying that men on juries are (because the women know how easy and often the crying is summoned instead of spontaneous).
4
I understand how a woman can continue a working relationship with a rapist. I also understand why a woman would delay reporting her attack and keep silent about it. I don't understand how a woman can have a sexual relationship with a man after he has raped her. That part is not adding up to me.
11
@Sharon J
I don't know the truth of the charges but find it hard to believe that as Ms. Sciorra stated that after hearing a knock on her door late at night she opened it without even asking who it was.
This is something a child in NYC might do. I don't know any adult residents of the city in at least the last 50 years who would do this especially that at the time she did so, crime and especially murder rates were much higher than they are now.
12
@Sharon It’s dissociation, the psychological defense mechanism that allows someone to split off part of oneself to protect another part of oneself.
6
@Sharon J
It happens all the time. It happens in marriages and all sorts of relationships. If you have never experienced it then you are lucky. If you spoke to victims then maybe you would understand.
5
When women who work in factories and big-box stores are sexually assaulted by their managers, they continue to work under them, even smile and joke with them. Why? Because they need the job. They have kids, car payments, debts. And if they report the assault, they are harassed or fired, or both.
Just because these women are actresses doesn’t mean they weren’t also vulnerable. Weinstein was extraordinarily powerful and could — did — destroy careers.
That’s the real horror of sexual harassment. If you go public, you lose everything. And then no one believes you anyway.
17
I can't wait to find out what the jury is thinking. We shall see soon enough.
1
I have no doubt that Weinstein is a serial sexual abuser who richly deserves punishment. But a rapist? That may be a bridge too far.
And Ms. Sciorra is not the witness who will help us cross it. One look at the YouTube video Weinstein's defense lawyer brought to the jury's attention during cross, and Sciorra's credibility is pretty much destroyed -- or at least the ability to believe her beyond a reasonable doubt is destroyed.
Readers should take a look at it. In it, she not only talks about being a fantasist -- bad enough -- but eerily constructs a lie right on the spot about a sexual relationship. She says she is having an affair with Robin Williams. Now she does it with a hint of irony -- and apparently with the intention that we realize her claim is a "joke." But she does it with such a straight face, and is so convincing, that it takes a moment to catch the irony, much less the joke. For a moment, the claim hangs in the air -- and a viewer is not sure what to believe. After viewing that, this viewer, if a juror, would conclude: "I'm not putting someone in jail for life over what this witness says. Let's move on."
I think what Weinstein did was repeatedly use his power to make or break actresses to coerce sex and then intimidate the victims into shutting up about it. It may not technically amount to rape, but it's plenty bad enough and deserving of a significant number of years in jail.
2
Why don’t women report rape? Why do they quietly try to return to their lives, even look for ways to normalize a relationship with their attacker?
Go through these comments and read the ones written by men.
This is why.
43
@Chickpea Women certainly do report rape, which is not to say there aren't multiple unreported accounts of it. There can be many reasons for not reporting it, the realization you could not prove it was not consensual, the time and effort involved in reporting it, fear of retribution, and fear of friends and relatives not believing you.
2
I understand why Ms. Sciorra is allowed to testify about a crime not being prosecuted, in order to establish a pattern. I do not understand how Ms. Perez's testimony is not prohibited as hearsay, however. All she can testify is that Ms. Sciorra claimed to be raped, and Ms. Sciorra's own testimony already established that.
1
I am amazed Weinstein's attorneys are trying to argue women slept with him to advance their careers. None of their careers were advanced. Instead, they were ruined or almost ruined.
2
Ms. Sciorra testifed, “I said, ‘No, no,’ but there was not much I could do,” she said. “My body shut down. It was so disgusting my body started to shake in a way that was unusual. It was like a seizure or something.”
“She swore me never to tell anybody,” Ms. Perez said. “I told her to go to the police, and she said: ‘I can’t. He will destroy me. He will destroy my career.’”
These kinds of reactions are so common that they seem to be inbred behavior - if not in all women at least in large numbers. It appears that serial rapists like Weinstein and Epstein have discovered this phenomenon, recognize it in their victims, and take advantage of it. The victims become unwilling accomplices in the crime, assisting in the coverup and enabling the perpetrators.
We must seek to understand better the psychology of rape victims both to educate them to protect themselves during and after rape, to educate police and attorneys, and reform the justice system to accommodate the mental state of the traumatized victims of this horrendous crime.
It is appalling that in this day and age millions of victims of sex crimes, women children, and men, are living among us, some interacting with their abusers on a daily basis, suffering in shameful silence, because they know that seeking justice will be painful and often unavailing.
11
In trial work we always had to beware of One lies, the other swears to it. The emails from these witnesses are the centerpiece of the defense. Juries often believe the written word over oral testimony. The NYT needs to examine the circumstances of those emails. To convict the accused the prosecutor better have the witnesses explain their emails.
2
She’s not just backing up *that* it happened. She’s backing up the terror and subsequent silence surrounding it. This is huge.
7
Why would Weinstein request that Anson investigate "red flags" if he had nothing to hide?
4
Why would Ms Sciorra go public and tell this horrid tale if it weren’t true? Look at what happened to Anita Hill when she spoke truth to power.
10
I realise that this doesn't rise to even the top 10 things to take away from this article but I bristle a little at the idea that Annabella Sciorra is only know for a guest role in season 3 of The Sopranos. Jungle Fever and The Hand that Rocks the Cradle were very big at the time and are arguably better showcases of her leading lady credentials for the casual reader trying to make an association.
26
Some feel amazed that, despite Weinstein's (undoubtedly) formidable legal team, he's likely to be held accountable for his actions. Some of us, in our youth, were inspired by people who actually stood up for the right thing in court. No one ever though whoever paid most was going to win. It's gratifying that in other case everyone is watching, the best hacks the defendant can persuade to work for him are from no name law schools or are otherwise so morally compromised it's unsurprising....our president's of course.
6
@Yann it is because we have seen so many rich and connected people pay to get off and don't forget that Cyrus Vance Jr had to be forced to bring this case against his will.
So yes, until the guilty verdict and the loss on appeal, I will continue to feel amazed
1
The subtle, unspoken conviction that the victim of a rape has become a "fallen woman" always blurs her credibility. When a woman has been "violated" forcibly, she is still suspected of having invited the act, and very likely might have participated in it willingly.
No matter how consistent the stories are about Harvey Weinstein's brutality toward women, it appears that there is always a seed of doubt about the truthfulness of his accusers and their witnesses. This isn't just a guy thing, although they do seem to get some satisfaction about putting women on the defensive.
20
“It was very, very traumatic for her,” Ms. Perez said,"
So now the court allows her to give speculative evidence on the hearsay state of mind of another person.
There is something wrong with the US justice system if a witness is allowed to give prejudicial evidence of this kind. The same applies to ( even more so) if witnesses are allowed to allege the defendent commited other acts which are not before the court.
Alleging a "Pattern of behavior" by these means is grossly prejudicial.
12
Rules of evidence: 803
@Sydney Kaye American justice in the #MeToo era I’m afraid. Sells a lot more news so here to say.
1
@Sydney Kaye
Right. When a friend confides in you about an experience such as - oh, let's see, being raped by a powerful superior in his/ her. field of work, with even an implicit threat to keep his/ her mouth shut, ... Yeah, it's a big leap to say that is a traumatizing event! I'm sure Ms Sciorra was laughing gaily when she confided in her friend Ms Perez about the fun of being sexually victimized by a powerful superior in her field of work.
4
It is hard to predict the outcome of a trial at this early stage. But based on the searing evidence of Ms.Sciorra and the similar fact evidence principle in the Cosby case Mr. W. is in deep trouble. Even his high priced legal talent will not be able to save him.
17
@Milton Lewis Don't underestimate the power of race. I am not defending Cosby-- I believe he is guilty. But it will take double the evidence to convict Weinstein and fair sentencing
16
@Sylvia
Don't underestimate the power of ethnicity. I am not defending Weinstein - I believe he is guilty. But I think it will take half the evidence to convict Harvey than was required to get "America's Dad".
4
Sylvia you do not understand the biases of jurors. Convicting Cosby was much more difficult due to African American’s support for him. They are always more reluctant to convict.
That is why the conviction rate is so low in heavily black cities. I wish you would look at data before making these comments.
Oh, I have tried multiple cases in Philadelphia.
2
There should be no statute of limitations on rape. It should be treated the same as murder. Weinstein is a predator. I hope he gets his just desserts.
144
I think he got his just desserts, many times. That’s the problem.
@susan There is a big difference with murder. You have a body as proof of the crime with murder.
It is interesting that anytime there is sex sleaze, sexual predatory behavior, sexual misconduct, or sex crime, one will invariably find associated with it the name of Bill Clinton: Weinstein, Epstein, Paula Jones etc etc. What a jerk!
8
@Valentin A or, the name donald trum;, interesting indeed...
1
Was Perez there during the alleged rape? If not, I don’t understand how she can corroborate anything other than what Sciorra told her. So where is the proof? Weinstein might be guilty but I haven’t heard about one example of irrefutable evidence against him so therefore he’s presumed innocent, no matter how much #MeToo might hate that fact.
11
@ManhattanWilliam You miss the point. Sciorra’s testimony contributes to the prosecution’s contention that Weinstein is a long term predator. Perez’s testimony lends credibility to Sciorra’s because it demonstrates that Sciorra accused Weinstein of rape long ago, however traumatized and halting her accusation, and not just for this trial.
84
@ManhattanWilliam : What do you suppose ‘irrefutable’ evidence would be? If you had video, you would probably argue for the possibility of a twisted interpretation that absolves Weinstein.
Get used to this irrefutable evidence: the words of a victim.
That’s how it works. The fact it can be boldly doubted with impunity is scientifically interesting. The reason turns out to be somewhat bizarre, unexpected, surprising, and definitely bad news for guys who would like to reserve their right to act as Weinstein has.
The time is coming. —T&K
2
@Tom and Kay Rogers “Irrefutable evidence: the WORDS of a victim”. That’s the world the #MeToo would like to live in but look at the fact that HOW MANY have been convicted of criminal conduct since the slanders have started? The idea that criminal guilt should be determined by one person’s words over another’s is outrageous. If a victim of a crime doesn’t come forward and allow the police to gather EVIDENCE, there will not and should not be convictions of those that break the law.
3
While I take a lot of MeToo accusations with a grain of salt — the complaint against Aziz Ansari has made me look askance at all accusations -- I have no doubt that some women consented to Weinstein’s aggressiveness in exchange for career advancement, but I also believe that some of them were, indeed, raped or harassed.
One thing this movement has accomplished is that it is making people — including me, a gay male — think twice about what we say and do. I’m embarrassed to admit that when I had a powerful position in a high-profile company, I didn’t always act in an appropriate manner. Did I ever physically force myself on someone? Absolutely not. Was I overly aggressive about pursuing sexual dalliances with people who were below me? Absolutely yes. Did I think that I was lording my senior position over them, and insinuating that giving in to me would lead to career advancement? Never. Did they perceive that I was, though? I don’t know; if they felt that way, it was never my intent, and I never helped nor hurt anyone based on whether we slept together.
I am sorry for anyone I put in an uncomfortable position, and am thankful that we are more aware of what we say and do. It is unfortunate that some people get cancelled because of unfounded accusations, but I’m also thankful that people who deserve to be called on it have been. I was not in the room when Weinstein attacked these women, yet I have no doubt that it is true.
35
claiming to not know whether subordinates felt compelled to sleep with you to advance or protect their careers, after admitting that you were in a position of power and aggressively pursuing sexual relations with these subordinates, is likely a part of the defense that weinstein will use.
i can’t tell if you’re castigating weinstein’s actions or using this comment section to issue a mea culpa to all those you made feel “uncomfortable” (understatement of the century).
3
@Brian Nash Great comment. This is exactly the change that every victim wants from the Me Too movement. Your honest reassessment of your past behavior and the changes you’re making now — fantastic. Pass it on!
5
Mr. Weinstein has also been part and parcel of a Hollywood fantasy world where most, if not all, working women leads in any film end up seduced into bed with a boss, co-worker, client, subordinate and stalking is part of rom-com boy gets girl adventures.
So in Hollywood fantasy land most often there is no such thing as rape and sexual harassment.
However, now Mr. Weinstein is finding out--better later than never-- that his playing out Hollywood fantasies in real life only could result in the prosecution of the crimes they really have been.
21
@Lynne Shapiro An élément that can make fantasy such fun is the suspension of reality and sometimes of the rules.
Even with all his talent at storytelling he could never be a charmer or a sweet love object. Harvey could never seduce or keep up a pretense to be other than a threatening bully, throwing his weight around to terrify and trap.
Pretending that he cared for anyone but himself, that “his stars” were equals & willing partners in love, making great art together was bedeviled in each beginning by his constant volcanic temper and a constant craving for assault and rape. His fantasized about then later committed horrendous crimes.
Where his heart should reside is just a fist-sized lump of coal.
1
@Lynne Shapiro I cannot veil my disgust with Hollywood and the many vile films and TV shows it produces. The combination of sex and violence has had a tragic effect on our culture.
3
What jury can question Sciorra & Perez...there is no reasonable doubt when understanding Weinstein, his history of sexual entitlement/threats/aggression as well as his grotesque physical & interpersonal style.
Should we soften our judgment because 'times have changed' and male assault was expectable behavior as Boys will be Boys.
Girls expected to push them away in high school where their earnest pressures started.
But when a movie mogul abuses his power, intimidates his victims to block criminal reporting- this is witness tampering or worse.
15
@Sara Media trials are inherently unfair, let's wait to see the actual evidence the prosecutors have on him.
“Mr. Weinstein was once a Hollywood giant, a feared executive who reshaped the independent movie industry with Oscar winners like “Shakespeare in Love” and “Pulp Fiction,” and who was a donor to former President Bill Clinton and other Democrats.”
How is being a donor to Democrats relevant?
66
The pattern of Ms. Sciorra’s admissions to Rosie Perez and Ms. Perez’s perception of what she was trying to communicate are pretty much exactly what we would expect of a person who has been raped.
Ms. Perez was interpreting the communication linearly, in the only way she could; Ms. Sciorra was communicating from an entirely different place, actually, several different places, all generated by the ‘normal’ mechanisms of a particularly traumatic primitive strategy exploit.
It would have taken Ms. Perez an extremely unusual frame of mind to correctly follow her friend’s path through her string of conversations; essentially, she would have had to recalibrate her estimation of who she was speaking to each time, and develop an estimate of how she could expect the conversation to warp when they next spoke.
Ms. Sciorra’s view from the inside of such a jarring chain of disjoint experiences (that is, her own perception of her conversations with Ms. Perez) is hard to imagine, but speaking from personal experience with such victims I can assure both her and Ms. Perez that they did a pretty good job of riding atop it, not letting it sink them both.
Extracting the basic linear sense of what she experienced from such a potpourri of presentation styles and changing views is extremely difficult. But recognizing the pattern helps, because it is invariably associated with trauma, in this case certainly rape.
They’re lucky to have each other as friends. Well done.
—T&K
42
Long before Annabella Sciorra was in The Sopranos, she was in Spike Lee’s, Jungle Fever, as was Rosie Perez. Both actresses gave memorable performances. I had wondered what had happened to Annabella Sciorra because she disappeared from film. Now we know. We know not only that Weinstein was/is a sexual predator both from the reporting by Jodi Kantor and Megan Twohey, and also by Ronan Farrow, we know that he ruined lives, ruined careers, and many women gave up their dreams of becoming actresses. He stole women’s lives. He has to be held accountable. I have absolutely no pity for him. Many women weren’t actresses but production assistants or directors, or functioned in some other capacity in the film industry. To say Ms. Sciorra and Ms. Perez are “acting”, is a shameful denial of the reality that Weinstein deeply hurt and scarred scores of women. That’s right, scores of women. I believe Annabella Sciorra. I believe Rosie Perez. I believe Mira Sorvino, another promising, Oscar-winning actress who was also attacked by Weinstein and disappeared from film.
169
@Joanna And Ashley Judd, once a headliner of movies and then suddenly, disappeared.
I figure that if it took 30-something women to convict Cosby, 90-something women (on the record, who knows how many more) are required to convict this rich, well-connected white man. Because, you know, the other 89 are obviously acting, suspect, after money, secretly in love with him (room here for attorney's other excuses).
60
Yes, Sara. Ashley Judd, Rose McGowan, Gwyneth Paltrow and many, many others.
3
@Joanna
Rosie Perez was not in Jungle Fever.
1
In these testimonies, I do not find anything that convinces me that this man is guilty.
Sorry not to howl with the pack...
10
@Jean Roudier Do you think the women are lying? If they are not lying then they are telling the truth.
32
@Jean Roudier These 25 year old allegations are totally unfair to present. Testimony that old is just unreliable. They prosecutors may have a really good case but I think this is an incredible mistake to present these old accusations and may weaken the strong case they present later...we'll have to see.
3
@Baruch To say the testimonies from 25 years ago is not accurate does not mean the people are lying. Our recollections of events change with time. People claim they know exactly what they were doing when JFK was assassinated but often the people's stories are shown to be false, the people aren't lying they are just mistaken. Look up flash bulb memories.
1
How did the DA get around the hearsay exception? That they had a conversation is OK. The sum and substance smacks of possible error and coupled with what has transpired before, any possible guilty verdict could be reversed on appeal. Weinstein has the money to keep fighting.
This trial has turned into a legal travesty.
Weinstein's actions may be shameful, but the corruption of the legal process is a disgrace.
5
@Bob Fiedelman Ms. Perez's testimony is not hearsay because it's being offered to show what Ms. Sciorra told her and when (facts of which she has personal knowledge)---and not to prove what Weinstein allegedly did (facts of which Ms. Perez does not have personal knowledge).
62
Harvey Weinstein is a predator, but a rapist?
As it pertains to the two cases here (remember those are the two victims with ripe allegations) I am not sure.
Waiting a decade? Continuing to talk to him and say nice things to him? Trying to introduce him to mom? This is all questionable.
There is reasonable doubt.
10
@Mark I was assaulted by an uncle when I was a minor. It was probably 15 years before I even told my parents and they are still the only people in the family who know it happened. I still have to see and socialize with this Uncle at family gatherings and I play nice while I'm just secretly waiting for him to die.
99
@Mark I'm a psychotherapist and I've had at least two patients who were raped and then dated their rapists. In one case the person was in denial. In the other, she wanted to prove she was "the better person," which didn't make sense, but this is how some people deal.
44
@Mark I’m sorry if I’m a bit harsh here, but I just have little patience anymore with this line of reasoning. It shows an utter refusal to evolve and recognize that your perspective is from the safety and security of never having gone through this same kind of nightmare.
We repeat the same conversation every time a woman comes forward after being sexually harassed or assaulted. Why did you continue any kind of relationship with this person? Why did you contact him? These very same questions have been answered and explained convincingly and articulately by brave women for decades — women like Anita Hill and many others as well as by empathetic and insightful medical professionals who deal with sexual assault victims regularly.
And yet...the next high-profile case arrives and the woman gets put on trial again and it’s suggested that there is reasonable doubt for the suspect because the victim didn’t refuse contact with him — in this case, with a power broker in her business who could destroy her career even before it got off the ground. Is that really so hard to understand what an emotional crisis that could present? Do we even have the capacity to learn and evolve anymore?
52
I cannot adequately express my respect and gratitude towards these Women. Hold your heads high, and know that Millions of us are thinking about you and sending you our very best wishes.
153
I agree that Weinstein is a particularly noxious specimen of a human being. But he is by no means the only one on the planet. The thing that allowed him to do the things he did was a SYSTEM of thousands of enablers who agreed on every level to let them happen . These systems are entrenched in many industries and allow those without power to be abused for the sake of survival.
Okay, so now It doesn’t matter wether Weinstein is convicted on a criminal account or not, his life has been destroyed. One down, millions to go.
I think real change re rape and sexual abuse of women and children will only happen when we attack the systems that enable them, and not just specific individuals. This is where the #metoo movement leaves me cold. Although it has opened a widespread and much needed conversation re the effects of abuse and why victims remain silent in the wake of it, it has lost considerable support in denying due process to the accused - injustice for injustice- and has come to represent more of a revenge mentality rather than a strong argument against the powerful systems that promote abuse and how we can change them .
Monumental and long standing systems of injustice, like slavery, take a long time to change. And they disproportionately victimize the poor the most. Just witness the brutal sexual abuse in Third World countries.
We might start with raising and nurturing our girls to have a healthy self esteem, and strongly encourage financial independence.
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@Gwen Vilen
When we say women need to be strong and learn to avoid these situations it is shaming in my opinion. It's like saying if you were stronger it would not have happened.
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@ FerCry’n Tears. In no way did I even imply that “women need to be strong and avoid these situations “ in my comment. The comment is intended to look at the big picture of injustice re sexual abuse and rape. Without that, we as women will fail to do the long term hard work of dismantling these systems and equalizing the power imbalance between women and men. Oddly enough Northern European countries have done much better than us on this score. A lot of it has to do with a generous social safety net and and subsidized or free education - also National health care. There is a long list of women leaders at every level of government and business in these countries that are role models for girls growing up. Many solutions to systemic problems are not sexy - and connect with other systemic problems like education, the environment, government policies and income disparity.
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@Gwen Vilen It seems mportant to remember that #metoo itself has not taken job from an accused man.
#MeToo has helped some women come forward and share how they were badly treated or even criminally preyed , the dismissals etc. have come from HR or legal depts. When boards see serious allegations and photographic evidence, copies of texts sent, video evidence and the like, they often réalisé that the bad guy is hurting the brand (and can be used to an advantage to competitors).
Harvey’s court case, like Cosby’s will be instructive.
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It really is funny to see the difference in perspective. It's so easy for me to understand why a woman would silence her objections and stay in touch with her assailant, especially in the time period being discussed when the male has power over your career. When you are in a subordinate position, and feel isolated and unsupported, there is such huge pressure to play along.
Yet it is so difficult for others (often men, but not always) to understand the behavior of women in Ms. Sciorra's position. All I can say is those people who don't 'get it' must either have amazing integrity and self-esteem - or a lot of financial and cultural freedom, because that's what's needed to walk away from challenging situations. Don't most people have an experience of having to submit to undeserved but non-sexual abuse in some lower-stakes context to survive - like family or employment? Can't they extrapolate that to see how it would also apply here?
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I think probably most working people have put up with some negativity in the workplace because they felt like they didn’t have a choice.
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@Tim Phillips
There's a difference between extreme negativity or verbal abuse, which I have experienced, and sexual harassment or assault.
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@ann I fortunately have never been in any similar situation. Maybe it’s luck or upbringing. Who knows? Notwithstanding, I completely get it and understand the horror these women went through. Just reading about it makes me ill. God speed Annabella.
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