This is a win for whoever standing with human rights. Bravo America.
6
I agree with Trump on this one; however, how long will it take for him to reverse his course?
4
Thanksgiving Day of the United States, day of thanksgiving to the US – the guarding angel of freedom.
1
So much still to destroy and only one year to do it in! Rudy? Military? At least Ed stills owes me...
If I remember well the US has now sanctions on 37 countries. It seems only a matter of time before it has sanctioned the remainder of the planet.
In the meantime the US is withdrawing from treaties, how a lower life expectancy and higher imprisonment than almost any other Western country.
It looks like its criticism of other countries is meant to deflect the attention from the problems it has itself.
7
@Wim Roffel
The US economy is rocking. All those countries it has sanctioned not so much. How's yours?
2
The “chosen one” should take the same stance against our domestic terrorism instead of ducking the issue. Congrats for the baby step, now how about his troubling language and actions against women, civil servants, diplomats? The “stable genius” needs to start early, he has a long road to travel.
3
Trump's Double Standard - Vociferous with China but subdued when it comes to Putin's heavy hand against internal dissent and Russi'a invasion of Crimea.
"The only thing worse than being blind is having sight but no vision." – Helen Keller
5
It would of been difficult for the draft dodger not to sign the bill. He has nothing going for him the last two weeks have shown how a degenerate president he is. His enablers are traitors to American and happy to be a follower of a cult leader who loves Russia.
With the American country people who actually think turning against him, the coverage of the people of Hong Kong fighting for their democracy is his worst fear. He is very afraid that the people of the US will take to the streets in the same manner that the people of Hong Kong are standing up for freedom. One more sexual assault story involving this president, one more Rudi con game, people are fed up with this corruption in plain sight. Barr just needs to be quiet.
People are taking names in America who dont support freedom across the world.f
4
I found this article to be informative, however I was greatly disturbed by Addressing PRESIDENT Trump as Mr. Trump throughout the article. But Addressed our Past President appropriately. This is disturbing to me.
3
Read the article—like, say, the first sentence. They (falsely, of course) DID call him President.
The Times always uses "President" once, then "Mr.", for all of them—it's just what they do.
6
@Kevin O'Brien
Well in order to get respect one needs to give respect. this individual has insulting names for the NYT, WP, Democratic s and has enabled the GOP to insult all members .
What about those nasty rallies where he trashes people in the audience who dont look loyal enough for a dictator.
Respect begets respect, he has no respect for America so why should the NYT give respect to a traitor. to America.
Fox News gives Trump plenty of respect, after all Fox s is running the presidency not Trump
3
I am pleased to see that President Trump has finally decided to support the pro-democracy movement in Hong Kong and China. I am not a fan of our President and will definitely not vote for him in the upcoming election, but I will give him some kudos for standing up to China, economically and politically. I hope this is not just a triviality and that our government will continue to act in strong support of democracy world-wide.
9
Wonderful! No matter what one may think of this Administration, Trump's forthright condemnation of the abuse by the Chinese of the Hong Kong demonstrators is a win for the basic concept of peaceful protest. I think it also puts Xi et al on notice that we Americans continue to stand united behind Freedom loving people worldwide.Great way to begin our Thanksgiving Holiday.
11
It's amusing to read all the anti-Trumper posts dismiss the presidents signing of the Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act as a fait accompli that the president only signed because it had "veto proof" support. Never mind that these same posters on any other occasion dismiss the republicans necessary to insure a veto proof passage as a "cult" commanded by president Trump. Of course that assertion begs the question of whether republicans would have voted for the legislation in the first place without the presidents support and instead buried it under Mitch McConnell's desk. The inconsistency is precious.
2
I'm sure that was a tough one for Trump to sign as he worries about doing a "good deal" he can brag about with China. Maybe we have a system of checks and balances, after all. Let's see how the Senate votes on impeachment.
Trump hasn't changed his mind on the protesters. He still wants to be a dictator like Xi, and still doesn't care about the protesters any more than the Kurds, kids at the border, rebuilding Puerto Rico, asylum from drug wars, or the Palestinians' rights.
He did this only to avoid his veto being overridden, which would be an embarrassment for him and a dangerous shift as the Senate considers the impeachment trial.
This will probably have little effect on the trade negotiations, which aren't really going anywhere anyway. It's nothing more than a clumsy stumbling move in the middle of a clumsy stumbling trade war. He could have just left it unsigned until it became law and avoided any clash with Xi over it; but that would suggest Trump thinking strategically, and I would never suggest that of him.
3
You have to give President Trump credit, supporting Hong Kong's efforts for democracy is the right thing to do. However, this will stand in the way of China/US trade talks and so must have been very hard for the President to do knowing that it will hurt him in an election year due to possible economic fallout. I am happy to see the President providing this support even when it could have adverse impacts on his reelection.
9
@G G
Those trade talks weren't going anywhere. they exist only in trumps mind, for something that was going to be so simple this like the Middle East plan, building the wall however putting children in cages Trump and the SS guard do quickly enough.
The US pro-democracy legislation in support of the Hong Kong protesters is a good gesture of political and moral support for the movement but not beyond that if the purpose is really to force China to correct its repressive policy course in Hong Kong.
1
anyone else on the dripping irony of Trump signing Pro democracy legislation?
7
This selective " outrage " by the House and the Senate is laughable. Hong Kong ,except for a period of 99 years when the British took over it as a " lease " has been always a part of China. The suppression of the Hong Kong's democratic aspiration by China is condemnable. But can you compare the oppression in Hong Kong to the oppression, brutalities and occupation of Kashmir by the Indians. Over a hundred thousand people in Kashmir have been killed in cold blood by the one million Indian occupation army. Hundreds of school going kids have been blinded by pellet guns. Rape has been used by Indians as an instrument of terror. Hundreds of thousands of Kashmiris have been beaten up, tortured and thrown in prison; Internet and telephone has been shut down and there has hardly been any resolution condemning India passed by the House and Senate. Except for Bernie sanders , not a single Democratic or Republican candidate has voiced his/her anger at the plight of Kashmiris at the hands of Indians. Kudos to him. Why is there such a disparity in condemning China and Indi ? Where is the threat of sanctions against Indian officials , military and civilians who have been responsible for the terrible situation in Kashmir? So please spare me this hand wringing and crocodile tears about Hong Kong.
2
@Syed Abdulhaq The difference is that Kashmir agitation is inspired by fanatical Muslim terrorists for creating a separate country for them or to join Pakistan. Kashmiris will be treated like any other Indians in any other part of India.
1
Thank you Donald Trump!
5
Thank you Mr President
6
@clarity007 Yes, Thank you Mr. President (for signing something that both parties put together and presented to you with the ability to overturn a veto.)
2
He was forced to sign the bill as both houses had the votes to over-ride a Presidential veto. Better to sign it and appear that he really cared about democracy in Hong Kong.
9
Will Trump impose “tough sanctions” on the US for the human rights abuses taking place in our own immigration detention centers?
6
@Janette Yandrasits
no Trump wont do anything that takes a dollar away from his rich friends pockets. he cares nothing for human rights or for people in general. Its all about him and his Russian loving GOP gang.
Two Dear Leaders. Both punishing their citizens.
USA & China, among dozens of other countries all over the world.
The rise of authoritarian crypto-fascists are everywhere, including here in good old USA.
When will democracy return to all.?
6
The protestors are screaming for freedom and democracy.
Why then do so many People twist things around just so they can find a way to support Communist China over America?
3
For once, Congress is United and passed legislation by veto proof majority. You can’t trump that! If only they could do that when it comes to addressing our county’s problems!! But this president always takes 1 step forward and 3 steps back!!By POTUS signing this legislation,he has infuriated the Chinese. This emboldens the pro democracy protesters. It also sends a message to the mainlanders... just maybe they can do the same? However let’s not forget this is a communist country! They will crush the opposition if they have to! The Soviet Union fell apart when the people, then the leaders lost faith in their system of government.
1
This seems very unlike Trump to take a tough stand against authoritarianism. What's his angle?
1
@Mford smokescreen
The authority of a possible congressional override at home trumped Trump. He could never countenance that.
5
It WAS my understanding that the US Constitution provided certain separate roles and powers the the Executive, Legislative, and Judicial branches of government and that foreign policy was an exclusive role of the Executive Branch (with the exception of funding).
Now it seems everything has changed. Not only has the Executive Branch been divided and conflicted between the White House and the State Department, but now we witness the Legislative Branch initiating US foreign policy in both the far east and the middle east.
Where is the United States of America headed in the absence of a meaningful Constitution?
2
@Greg You apparently don't understand how this works. Congress has the right to determine if we enter into wars against foreign powers, they must ratify treaties (although Obama simply ignored this and made his own deals with foreign powers like Iran), they must ratify most trade deals, etc.
The President does NOT have exclusive power when dealing with foreign powers. That said, it is interesting that the Democrats are the ones who created and passed this bill (yes with bipartisan support), but because Trump signed it suddenly it is his bill and whatever happens in response will be his fault). The vote for the bill was so overwhelming that had he vetoed it, it would have been easily over ridden. Not a good political move.
1
@Greg
No worries, the legislation passed by the House and Senate is nothing more than peacocks preening their feathers. Although it requires the "State Department to annually review the special autonomous status it grants the territory in trade considerations", our constitution makes clear that president Trump as chief executive controls any action that may result from it.
@Tom B
I thought the Executive Branch can declare/propose a war effort which had to be ratified by Congress, because it involves funding (with ethics in consideration).
Similarly I thought that foreign policies, including treaties and other international agreements, were the purview of the Executive Branch and that only those with US financial implications had to be passed by Congress. Hence all trade deals had to go thru Congress.
My point is that in all cases the Executive Branch was to initiate and in some cases the Legislative Branch to ratify. Now we have the Legislative Branch initiating foreign policy, often without any US financial implications.
1
I'm somewhat surprised Trump signed the legislation because it made the Chinese leadership furious at a time Trump wants a trade deal. it could be Trump and his trade negotiators have decided a satisfactory deal is unattainable and there was nothing left to lose.
@Mark McIntyre
There is plenty to lose if China prevails. Millions of
blue collar jobs for one.
1
@Mark McIntyre The Chinese cannot be confronted only on one front. Trade is not the only issue. China is expanding its influence militarily and has put a halt to a more tolerant approach to ruling their people. Dissent is being cracked down upon harshly. I also want to comment that this is not about ideology; it is nothing less than China having imperial aspirations that must be thwarted. The EU of course will stand back as the cowards they are. leaving the Free World to be defended only the USA.
1
Time to admit it.
Trump was right on China all along. China was a major platform for him during the 2016 election.
The US currently has the strongest economy in its history and China has struggled. The US, at aggregate, has easily weathered this 'trade war'. It was all doom and gloom but we keep breaking dow records monthly. It is a hard time to be a liberal.
China cannot do anything to retaliate and the fact they're letting the US get away with it says it all.
The NYT ran a great article about the detention camps, and there is evidence of organ harvesting as well.
Trump, for all his moral failures, did more to China than centrist Obama ever did.
4
Oh boy - shouldn’t we take care of our own before handing out advice to others? No doubt the Hong Kong people need support from all, but like where was Senator McConnell when the eastern half of his state was being fed opioids? Did Nancy know? How about Trump? Shouldn’t we be leading by example? And, if our country subscribes to these rights, which they proclaim, how on earth are candidates like Elizabeth Warren and Bernie trailing in polls? Elizabeth is the first to finally recognize the “unsung nobody wants to pay for” role of daycare providers - a 50 year-old problem. And Bernie is our national treasure (as others noted) the only man who understands and fights for the basic needs of all men. And yet, the people can’t get behind one or two of these candidates? Just more of the same? With such brilliance, China will lead! I think it’s time to return to leading by example, and that starts with forcing decent wages, providing healthcare, which doesn’t cost your arm and leg, and educating our youth. (I still cannot believe we had the audacity to charge interest on their student loans!) And, there is so much which needs to be done!
@rebecca1048
Sorry Rebecca but the House is too busy with impeachment to address your concerns.
3
@clarity007
And Senator McConnell obstructed everything for eight years — I’m really tired of it, all!
1
China must understand that Trump signed this legislation because as Trump put it -- “I signed these bills out of respect for President Xi, China, and the people of Hong Kong,” Trump said. “They are being enacted in the hope that Leaders and Representatives of China and Hong Kong will be able to amicably settle their differences leading to long term peace and prosperity for all.”
He was doing Xi and China a favor. I guess Trump thinks that China's leaders are as gullible and uninformed as Trump supporters. Sure.
1
Oh my, once again the rather toothless weapon of imposing "sanctions" on foreign individuals we disagree with is being deployed.
Sanctions on individuals isn't strategy -- it's about as effective as a toddler stamping his or her feet when she doesn't like something.
This is nothing more than another sad commentary on the ineffectiveness of US foreign policy.
2
@George
What would you prefer?
1
@George It worked with Iran. It also worked with Russia - why do you think Putin wanted Trump elected?
1
@George
Would a China/U.S war satisfy?
1
Sanctions on Communist China.
Sanction on Communist Corrupt Russia.
Finally - a President who is smart and politically brave, standing up for democracy and liberty!
4
@Dr. John
Wow, we do read what we want to believe.
Actually, these sanctions are NOT against a country. They are against a few individuals in HK.
Hardly a blow for democracy and liberty. More like a whimper.
6
And this is so unlike Trump. Can you say “orchestrated.”
@Dr. John
That’s the deceitful, propagandist, and psychological advertising impression that this Disguised Global Crony Capitalist Empire is trying to impose on both the brave and honest Hong Kong Revolutionaries — and much more cynically on ‘we the American people’ to distract, disempower, ‘divide’, and delude us.
1
Like everything else this will become a bargaining chip for Trump. When he gets too much heat for his trade war or when a win is needed for his campaign, he will suspend sanctions for his own benefit. Trump might also exchange the sanctions for a thorough investigation of the Bidens. So far Trump has placed tariffs on Canada for "security" in order to gain the upper hand in trade negotiations, banned Huwai for "security purposes" and then offered to back off to cement a trade deal and declared an "emergency" in order to grab previously appropriated funds to keep his campaign promise of building a wall. The man is shamelessly self centered!
2
I'm no fan of the totalitarian, capitalist Chinese government. Protest in China is limited to people showing up in the same general area and milling about pretending they have no reason to be there. Any speech more aggressive than that lands you in a re-education camp, which some times, as the recently released Uighur files show, results in mental abuse extreme enough to shatter your mind.
However, as a US protester, I would say that the Hong Kong police have been far more respectful of peaceful protest than US police departments.
Water protectors in North Dakota were tear gassed, shot with rubber bullets (which were often aimed directly at the cameras of journalists), attacked with dogs (resulting in bad bites), shot with water cannons in the middle of a 20 degree night, etc. This was coordinated by Obama, the "community activist."
In Ferguson, where police, City Manager, and Judge were proven by emails to use bogus tickets to jail monirities to make up budget shortfalls by charging then for their jail stays, those that protested were tear gassed and shot with large rubber rounds from armored vehicles.
While the Tea Party was allowed to go to Democratic Town Halls to push and shove, peaceful Occupy protesters were regularly beaten, pepper spayed, and falsely arrested.
Bloomberg also arrested many commuters who happened to be near the Republican Convention, and kept them on a pier for two days.
Where is the bipartisan law to protect the First Amendment Rights of Americans?
10
@McGloin Holy mother of false comparisons. You should do some more research. The Hong Kong crackdown, in terms of individuals injured and arrested, has been far more severe than any of the incidents in America you mentioned.
1
It must be galling for Xi to see the Hong Kong protesters standing next to a banner depicting president Trump standing atop a charging tank, assault rifle in hand while waving the American flag. I suspect its even more galling for the "resistance" cabal that occupies many quarters of our State Department. One can only wonder what is more offensive to them, the obvious adulation being afforded the president or the visceral demonstration of what real resistance looks like.
3
@tim k
I'm sure that most of the State Department recognizes that Trump's action here is one of the most normal and responsible things he has done in foreign policy. Any other recent president of either party would have signed these same bills in the circumstances. It's only notable for Trump because he does not particularly adhere to the idea that America should support democratic aspirations everywhere, and was publicly wavering just days ago.
Another proof of Trump's unique way of dealing with world affairs. He wants to advance American interest, not surrender it to the interest of others. That is why he imposed tariffs on Chinese goods to force China to sign a trade deal. At the same time he wants to protect basic human freedoms as much as he can by pushing governments to do right things,but without creating more misery. He wants to avoid Tiananmen Square like situation in HK, that will be disastrous. He is using his usual tactics here, praising Xi to the maximum while taking punitive actions. He has been much tougher on dictators of China, Russia, Iran, Turkey, Saudi, Cuba, Venezuela, etc. than Obama, but fake news report he is codling with dictators.
6
@Alex E -- This is sarcasm, correct?
@cec You feel it a sarcasm because you believe fake news as truth. So, let me know which part of my comments is not truthful.
1
Some compare human rights violations in the US with those in China. Crushing democracy across Hong Kong and re-education of the Uighurs are more egregious than the separation of children at the border. I suspect that the problems at the border are much better known than China’s abuses. The more you know about Chinese abuses the better you will understand.
2
Hong Kong(CNN) Protesters in Hong Kong will hold a celebratory, pro-US rally Thursday after President Donald Trump gave them what one prominent activist termed a "timely Thanksgiving present."
How are the Democrats responding? With more demands and subpoenas for an impeachment that is DOA. How foolish they look and out of touch with history and what is happening in the world.
3
@Edward
Actually, we Democrats in both the House and Senate overwhelmingly PASSED the bill that Trump then signed!
You see, Edward, in our democracy the Legislative Branch first passes the bill and then it goes to the Executive Branch (i.e. the President) for enactment via his signature....
7
@Edward
Trump deals with the world as it exists. Finally. His actions are not based on wishful thinking but the behavior of other countries and leaders. And most importantly, American interests.
2
Hard to trump a veto proof majority.
Expecting executive disorder overriding law any day now.
Good people on both sides foreign policy is just another euphemism for chaos.
4
"The bill had passed both the House and the Senate by veto-proof majorities."
Congress is behind this bill actually leaving Trump out of the loop. It does however reaffirm America's commitment to democracy, Let's hope this bill has more bite then bark considering how the last 40 years of American democracy has placed many Americans left behind.
11
Finally someone responded to the Chinese.
They’ve been getting away with far too much.
- Brainwashing thousands of Uighurs
- Crackdown on Hong Kong demonstrators
- Oppressive surveillance of its citizens
- South China Sea islands militarization
Just to name a few.
Even though I usually disagree with President Trump, it’s a strong gesture towards China that it’s not a one way road.
10
Hope the Hong Kong people get their freedom soon. In spite of all the depressing articles is in today’s New York Times, at least we can be thankful that, in the United States, we still have freedoms and rights that are just a dream in Hong Kong and much of the world.
5
@GCAustin Isn't that the real point of the Impeachment hearings (not just the fact that he broke the law).....that Trump is becoming an autocrat, a dictator, and will soon be scaling back our "freedoms and rights" as you put it.
For the past 4 years, by far the most dominant story in the news, with the exception of the Trump presidency itself, has been alleged Russian meddling in American affairs, and American elections.
And now we have done something far stronger with regard to Hong Kong and China, than has been alleged about Russia and its actions in the US. Like most Americans, I am not happy with many of China's policies towards human rights, including in Hong Kong. But the simple fact is that Hong Kong is part of China. The legislation passed the US Senate a few days before elections in Hong Kong.
The Hong Kong legislation was bipartisan, and strongly encouraged by American media, including the same publications and broadcast journalists so quick to raise ire against Russia and Putin.
This legislation will set back our relations with China, and may well do much more harm than good as far as human rights in China are concerned.
The Chinese government is correct to be angry at us. Passing these laws was extraordinarily hypocritical, given what has been alleged about Russia, and was a major policy mistake.
4
This Thanksgiving I am thankful the American people get to choose their leader. While I don't always agree with him, this time Trump got it right. For this I'm happy.
Every time I think Trump has done something so outrageous, and yes...even offensive, that I could not vote for him again he demonstrates he has something his predecessor did not have-at least in regards to foreign affairs-he has a much better functioning moral compass.
While Obama had the disappearing red line in Syria which led to Russian hegemony, the lead from behind in Libya which has led to nearly a decade of chaos, human trafficking, and misery there, and a worldwide apology tour which included condemning our allies in Colombia and Israel; at least Trump followed through on attacking Syria, recognized Jerusalem as Israel's capital, supported democracy in South America, and confronted China.
Give credit where credit is due. China's treatment of dissent, especially in Xinhua province, is pure Nazi-like evil. Hong Kong's treatment violates our values.
Trump's policy on North Korea is a disaster, so has every President's since Clinton's. The mess he created in Ukraine, while not impeachable, is still a mess which destroys much of our credibility. His attacks on NATO over financial issues is stupid and rife with repercussions.
Nevertheless, let's applaud our Commander in Chief for moral courage and taking a stand for our values. I agree he's inconsistent but what President isn't?
Godspeed Donald!
9
@jkemp The credit you accord belongs, for once, to Congress, not the President: "The bill had passed both the House and the Senate by veto-proof majorities."
15
I’d like to see same human rights proclamations for Russia, and Saudis. This is nothing short of a stick up to China. He’s not really helping HK people by forcing the position. This will only achieve in greater opposition from China and making it harder for HK people. Now China gov will have even less room to make amend with HK protestors because WH does not understand Asia cultures and think only way to achieve is by brute force. Well this is going to be interesting. I’m sure his friends unloaded before the market closed.
2
Americans fund the greatest military expansion in world history. China has militarized the South Asia Sea, just as Japan did right after the Pearl Harbor attack. And finding Chinese spies in US government, academia, industry is daily news. Japan gave 3000 cherry trees to plant around our National Mall at the end of WW1. Gift accepted, Japan started its US spy network. Trade with China is suicide.
I’ve been to Hong Kong many times and i love that city and the people who live there. I was there before the Brits turned it over to China and have been there after and there was a part of me that sensed this might happen eventually , but I never in my wildest dreams thought our country would rip children away from their parents and place them in cages at the border because their skin was brown or that they simply wanted a better life for themselves. Those sounds of kids crying for their parents in those despicable conditions is a stain on this country we should never forget. Where is the humanity and compassion? Is it always just about money?
6
I hope the Chinese people on the mainland heard about this now and will start demanding Democracy. Then i would like to see those Communist leaders put is high maximum prison or worse. It took Trump to long to do what was right. He is no better a leader i and is destroying our climate with coal use. Lock him up.
3
I’m absolutely amazed that Trump did the right thing for once.
4
@L "The bill had passed both the House and the Senate by veto-proof majorities."
7
Well done, America! My country has no appetite for further antagonizing China after arresting Weng Manzhou, at America’s behest. It’s about time that the US comes out of the shadows and confronts its foe, face to face.
5
My guess would be that he didn't want to have an override in Congress. With significant bicameral support, such would have been the case had he vetoed the bills. Congress can do some good when its members are not bickering amongst themselves or following crazy ideas down the rabbit hole of Faux news. If only Congress would act in the same manner for the Uighers.
4
If he had not signed it, both Houses already had a supermajority and he would have experienced the humiliation of thoroughly bipartisan defeat. Signing it however means the Chinese populace and the Chinese leaders have a personal grudge against him. He doesn't support democracy for Hong Kong - he has already indicated his favoring the Beijing dictator. This indicates that he will sacrifice policy for his personal feelings.
What policy is he sacrificing? Well, reducing his trade war, but I think he never wants that trade war to end. Beijing for weeks has been whipping up its public with announcements about Hong Kong: the pro-Democracy forces are funded by foreign governments, they are unpopular in Hong Kong and the election results would be overwhelmingly pro-Beijing. Beijing was shocked to find itself publicly proved wrong. I expect that Beijing now sees its only choice as terror. Trump's personally identifying himself with Beijing's humiliation means we have less chance of holding off massacres in Hong Kong. Trump apparently does not mind.
5
No reasonable person {excluding by definition 45's supporters) could conclude anything other than the following.
There is no evidence to support the claim that 45 cares one whit about the Hong Kong demonstrators for several reasons. First, the legislation is simply a bargaining chip meant to force China into a box on trade and surrender to his demands.
Second, if 45 any concern for them he would have spoken out forcefully when the demonstrations began and demanded sanction legislation immediately.
Third, he has demonstrated that he knows nothing and cares nothing about democracy in this country. Indeed, he and his henchman are, at this very moment, determined to destroy our Republic.
So why would he care about Hong Kong? I know what your're thinking. The evidence overwhelmingly militates against any argument that he is "on the right side of history.
Case closed.
6
Trump's foreign policy is utterly incoherent. The Russians and Saudis, his great friends, can kill dissidents and journalists, even on foreign soil, without a peep from Trump. But China clashes with protesters in their own country (yes, Hong Kong is under Chinese control) and new legislation expressing outrage is quickly signed, which could lead to sanctions. And all of this in the shadow of a trade war with China. This new legislation will only make it harder to resolve it.
Look, I don't like what's going on in Hong Kong, either. But what exactly are Trump's values relating to democracy and freedom? He wants it in China, but for Russia and the Sauds, don't worry about it? The Russians and Sauds can assassinate people with impunity, but the Chinese can't try to put down violent protesters?
Like everything else with Trump, this makes no sense, either.
6
As Trump has been manipulating the markets, through his term, and again the markets rose to new record levels; come Friday morning expect a major drop. After the drop he, Bloomberg, and the rest of the 1% will swoop in again to pick up bargains. meanwhile, those who are building IRAs, 401ks, or living off of them, will take a major hit.
Trump cares nothing about human rights; his record proves that. Just look how many children are in custody along the border, without their parents. Look what he did with the Kurds. And, look who he calls "friends" the autocrats of Russia, North Korea, Saudi Arabia, Turkey and China.
Trump will just blame the Democrats if the market crashes, because China made the trade war worse. This is Trump in self preservation, and poison the well, mode. What better way to deflect from impeachment, than to create a US financial crisis.
5
I guess Putin gave Trump the ok to sign.
2
If only Donald would take a strong and principled stand for democracy and human rights in the US. Given the veto-proof bipartisan support of these bills, Donald had no choice but to sign--or face public rebuke and humiliation. But as usual, words mean nothing to him. Don't expect him to take any meaningful action.
7
Trump sees the world only through the prism of his potential for re-election. And Congress, which has only about a 10% approval rating, sees our own country principally as a mechanism for their own re-election. Anything either does is predicated on keeping their powers, cushy jobs and gold plated health care and salaries. Congress is their name - but posturing is their game.
2
We condemn China for interfering Hong Kong's internal affair even though Hong Kong is part of China. Now we are interfering Hong Kong's internal affair. And Hong Kong is not part of us nor under our control. Thus, it should be none of our business.
Why we don't help Puerto Rico which is under our control? If we really care about Hong Kong, we should care about Puerto Rico. For that matter, we should care more about democratic movement in Catalonia of Spain or any democratic movement in the world.
In this case, Senator Marco Rubio's intention on future US presidency cannot be more clear. Ignore Puerto Rico's problem, which is not too far from his state, but instead stretching his arms on Hong Kong, a far distance from Florida, is a first step of his intention.
4
I understand most NYT readers dispose Trump. I think it's a gutsy move. The last few presidents allowed China to have their way, and operated in fear of China. Standing up for the rights of free expression and one party rule is an American value.
8
By issuing a signing statement Trump will ignore any enforcement of the sanctions. China will bluster, but after a private phone call by The Donald assuring them there will be no actual enforcement, things will proceed as normal.
3
Trump calls for civil rights and long term peace, but doesn't look at his own record. People notice that.
While pressuring China, should he consider that his call out for China to interfere in our elections might not work in his favor?
Who knew these problems could be so complex?
Gee, Mr Trump, where is the State Department when you need them to give you a full picture?
1
Trump is lucky. China and Iran will collapse on his watch, and he will get the credit for it because he stood up to them on principle. No business as usual. No craven capitulations on trade. No plane loads of ransom money. It’s as simple as that.
17
@Edward
I don't see China collapsing any time soon, but I do believe Trump will be recognized for having taken a tough stance on trade (and intellectual property) with China. A first.
There are many things only Trump has been willing to do, and it's unlikely any other traditional politician will ever do them as strenuously.
It really does take an outsider.
4
@Edward I think it's more likely that the Trump Regime will collapse first.
10
@Edward
China, a country with thousands of years of civilization behind it, will collapse on Trump's watch. Right.
7
Has Trump reversed himself on this yet? It's only a matter of hours, given his past record of erratic foreign policy.
Like what Mark Twain said about the weather in New England--"If you don't like it now, just wait a few minutes."
18
Would like to see Congress draft similar legislation concerning Saudi Arabia and other repressive regimes. I know, oil.
24
Happy Thanksgiving! Where is Donald Trump's pro-democracy activism for America? How come human rights of the Hong Kong citizens of China are more important to America's lawmakers than human rights here at home?
President Trump condemned his great friend, PRC President Xi Jinping, for trampling on the human rights of the Hong Kong Chinese while Trump is busy trampling on America's human rights at our border and in his crooked governance of the US.
President Trump signed the Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act before flying south yesterday to Mar-a-Lago, his preferred home in Florida for Thanksgiving. We don't know what the fallout from our Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act will be, but we have an inkling of Beijing's authoritarian leader's ire. No chocolate cake at Mar-a-Lago for him! How about sanctions against China now?
16
This aggressive approach is not the best way to ensure the one country two systems approach is allowed to have the ameliorative impact it was designed to have on both actors.
How exactly is or was Beijing "cracking down" on HK? An unpopular extradition bill was introduced by the HK gov which has now been rejected following protests. Beijing quite rightly and intelligently stayed out of it despite the instant China experts predicting an impending blood bath which is what the China baiters and neocons wanted all along to further US interests in the so-called "systems" competition they now see themselves in. Those HK kids need to read their history if they think the US is going to put anything serious on the line let alone US troops for HK. Not going to happen. That's why the adults in the room who really support the increasing democratization that the two systems allows for in HK and more long term China understand poking China with sharp sticks on this matter is not really the way to go.
Fortunately, China did not take the bait offered by those seeking to goad it into violently responding in HK. What we need now is for China and HK to reset their relationship. The real prize for Beijing is the peaceful return of Taiwan and that as Taiwan polls show is very much in play. How HK fairs is key. But, an at peace China with Taiwan back in the bosom of the motherland is the last thing US neocons want. Unfortunatley, from a neocon perspective the more unrest in HK the better.
9
Those who say we should not intervene in Chinese disputes are espousing isolationist principles. Isolationism is America First. I suspect that more than a few Trump haters actually agree with him. They just didn’t know it.
10
Like most things this Congress produces...it’s not worth the paper it’s written on. This was a sop to his buddies Lindsay and Mitch so they could look like we actually still function as a government. Trump’s base can barely find HKG on a map, let alone understand or care why the are protesting and what the issues are. Trump is making a huge mess with his trade war...this is just part of the spin.
11
Great to see that the executive and republican led legislative branch couldn’t get together for a cohesive foreign policy but they sure did to get a cohesive strategy about the impeachment proceedings.
5
The issue on the table is China, and the nature of our future relationship with China. In case many haven't noticed, China cannot do much damage to us more than they already have. We, however, can. (not that we should, but we do hold the power in the relationship when you boil it all down).
So we have the luxury of deciding how to proceed. China has the largest manufacturing sector in the world and is integrated in the global supply chain. Very clear. Our decisions on tariffs and resultant corporate uneasiness has had a significant effect on lessening our dependency on China, as our imports from them continue to slip and they fall behind Canada and Mexico in the rankings of our primary trade partners.
I'd like to see the necessary trade relations and political communications continue with China as we need to in our best interests, with agreements tied to lowering our trade gap with them; almost an automated formula of sorts. There will always be a trade gap with China ( at least as far as I can see) so it is a matter of narrowing and nothing more.
All of the Chinese students can go home however. If we have young people of any and all colors who are American citizens and in need/desire of education as a way of advancement -- then lets give them the chance as a priority. Our social contract with our own is more important for our country, and the Chinese students, however kind and qualified, can be used and manipulated by their own government on a moment's notice.
5
@Mark To balance your suggestion about sending all Chinese students home, consider a couple of other points:
1. The huge fees that foreign students pay are a significant source of income to the university industry, and allow for American students to enjoy lower fees, sometimes free, if they go to an in-state school.
2. The Chinese students who get educated here are the ones who most oppose Cjina's human rights problems when they go back home, if even if they have to do it privately and quietly among trusted family members and freinds.
15
@Mark
Chinese and other foreign students come here and learn about our democratic way of life. Hosting them through education does more good for us in the long run than anything else. I do not see Chinese students as some sort of swarm of potential spies for the Chinese government.
I'm hoping we begin serious financial support for our own American kids who go bankrupt trying to get an education here--then, if they can compete with foreign students who are, quite frankly, kicking our butts in math and science, then they can take seats in our university because they earned the slots and not because we're excluding foreign students because we're afraid of them.
4
Trump’s action is being met with the predictable response from his critics who don’t like anything he does, but he is on the right side of history. The Hong Kong protestors prove that the Chinese system of government is unsustainable because it is impossible to be capitalist and Communist at the same time, to be a modern nation able to compete in the global economy but ruled domestically by rigid Communist bureaucrats who are living in the past and know nothing about how to run a modern economy. The split between the old guard and the entrepreneurial technocrats is irreversible and with added pressure from the West the end of the current Chinese system of government will be hastened. When things happen, they happen fast, and those who are unable to adapt or accept change will be left out. The cultural Revolution with its insular hatred of the West is over as China takes its place among the nations of the world.
9
@Edward Sure, I'm a critic in this case. That's because no one can be assured that Trump won't suddenly reverse course due to comments by Rush or Hannity.
Or maybe it's all about pressuring China to investigate the Bidens or grant business advantage to Ivanka or to bail out Jared's skyscraper or perhaps to compel payoffs to Rudy or....
7
@Edward
I was about to comment that I finally applaud something this incompetent president did....until I saw the veto-proof majority. Now, the applause is muted. Maybe next time.
3
Trump can be as bad as you say, but the bigger picture is that the collapse of the Chinese Communist system is inevitable, and he took advantage of its inherent weakness. Anything wrong with that?
3
If you want to punish the wealthy Communist Chinese show their real estate holdings through LLC or corporations in the United States. In the hundreds of billions. Show all the luxury real estate they own throughout the world as they claim to care about their people as they steal tens of billions each year and then buy luxury condos throughout the world . They torture and murder any political opponent in their country and have since the 1940’s. Corporations have profited off of this behavior.
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@Ralph Petrillo
China is no longer communist. In the early 1980's Milton Friedman's Economics Department of the University of Chicago (the Chicago Boys) went to China and helped them reorganize their economy to be a capitalist economy. I saw it first hand in 1985.
Thomas Friedman (no relation to Milton) told us that this would create democracy in China. That didn't happen. Now China is a totalitarian capitalist country run by the billionaires that control the Central Committee of the "Communist" Party.
In the early 1990's the Chicago Boys went to Russia and gave away the entire Soviet Economy (which belonged to the People) to a handful of people we now call the Oligarchs.
Russia is also a totalitarian capitalist country.
It turns out that capitalism doesn't require democracy at all.
Now the Republican Party led by "president for life" Trump, calls our Republic their "enemy," and attacks it's basic functions (taxing, spending, and regulating), while praising those who attack our elections and attacking our defenders.
If Trump is allowed to be president for another term, the USA will be a totaltalitarian capitalist country too. Bush and Obama gave Trump the keys to the most highly advanced surveillance system in the world in the name of "security" with the Republicans demanding that and "small government" at the same time.
What they mean by "small government" is a massive milliary-police-surveillance state regulating your womb instead of global corporations.
@McGloin
You are incorrect. They are both dictatorships.
1
All the average person reading this is going to get is nonsense from this article. Tell me that China is angry. Tell me what that means, and exactly who in China is mad, and what they are likely to do about it. Meanwhile for all the past years, how mad or happy were the USA and China? Mad or happy is the language or a child, and that is all they want us to understand.
7
We should have signed TPP. Then we would be in a stronger position to apply regional pressure to China.
In the middle of a trade war where we are resorting to paying off farmers to compensate for lost profits, this is a dumb move. It does nothing for HK and even less for our prospects resolving this economic power struggle with China.
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@Kat
Trade without rules benefits those that manipulate markets and chase the lowest wages and the least regulation, polluting the planet and hurting workers and consumers everywhere. That is a race to the bottom.
TPP was a massive give away to global corporations of our Sovereign Right to make our own economic policies.
"Unfeterred free trade" for the owners of capital (while humans that try to follow that capital are trapped behind borders) has been bad for economies around the world. Growth, under neo-liberal, supply side trade policy is down, not up. The US, China, and Europe are all stagnating. China grows fastest because it invests in itself, building modern infrastructure like high speed trains and modern airports.
Supply Side policies demanded by the Republicans for 50 years and aquiessed to by "centrist" Democrats is now rejected even by the Right base, which is why Trump had to start his fake trade war to appease his voters.
Unfortunately, centrist Democrats are still protecting a policy that no one wants except the global billionaires and their corporations.
Meanwhile the Left has been protesting against this nonsense the entire time.
The real economy thrives on fair markets and stability. Smart governments create a level playing field and invest in their own workers, instead of encouraging capital flight to distant lands. Fasttracking hurts everyone.
Fair, stable trade requires long pubic negotiations that respect cultures and local governments.
The wealthier China gets, the greater the opposition to dictatorship. Then boom. If we wanted to, we could walk all over Russia. So the only obstacle we face is ourselves. Unfortunately, that one is looking bleak.
2
@michjas
The way to punish the Russians is the same as the Chinese just simply show their asset holdings in real estate which they want to hide from all involved. Freedom of information undermines their rhetoric.
2
Didn’t you just have an article a week ago claiming “Trump won’t support Hong Kong protesters with legislation” ? So which is it? What would actually make the left happy?
13
@JOSEPH By "left" do you mean people who believe in democracy?
10
@JOSEPH - what a difference a week makes. Now Trump doesn't object to something Congress has just supported on a bi-partisan basis. Now Trump needs Republicans to help him with that impeachment problem. There's no evidence of a leftist conspiracy, but lots that shows a certain someone acting in his own self interest.
3
"China, if you're listening, could you please just get this epoch over with and call in all of the debt owed to you by the USA?" We really need to start this whole "Country" thing over again.
1
@Richard
What exactly do you mean by "call in" the debt. They buy treasury bills, notes and bonds for fixed terms in exchange for which we pay them absurdly low interest rates. Given the negative rates in Europe and Japan, it's doubtful there would be much impact even if China stopped buying.
5
Trump pounding his chest about signing legislation to defend democracy in another country?
Do the same to protect the U.S. from Russian interference in our elections and then you'll be believable.
39
Why wasn’t the headline that Congress forced trump to sign the bill?
If there had not been veto proof numbers in both houses, do you think he wound have signed?
I know it says this in the article but a quick look at this gives the wrong impression.
11
I chuckle every time Trump says he likes Xi Jinping and the media castigates him for it. They say he lies all the time, yet take him at his word when he says he likes Xi.
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I'd guess he very much does *not* like Xi. And he's been doing a pretty good job making Xi's life miserable these past three years.
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Like him or hate him, Trump is taking on Beijing, something that was long overdue.
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And you have to love Congress for putting aside politics and reminding us all what America stands for. Great jobs on these bills.
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Happy Thanksgiving.
8
The bill was sponsored by Marco Rubio and supported by Republicans. It stands up for human rights.
You might need to read that again.
8
Waiting for Little Marco to sponsor human rights legislation that ends our immigration crisis and punishes abusers like Saudi Arabia, the Philippines, and Russia. #Consistency
1
China is economically powerful but arrogant, violent, and dangerous towards its own people. Guilty of widespread historical and current human rights violations (it currently holds two Canadians in reprisal for the arrest on US behalf of Meng Wenzhou of Huawei), it undoubtedly needs to be challenged and checked by the international community.
The United States is economically powerful but arrogant, violent, and dangerous towards its own people. Guilty of widespread historical and current human rights violations (it currently has a white supremacist as president), it undoubtedly needs to be challenged and checked by the international community.
Tyranny, regardless of nationality, needs to be stamped out. It’s heartening to see Trump sign a bill that protects Democracy and Human Rights in Hong Kong. It might be even more profound if he signed another guaranteeing the rights of US citizens in America.
2
@Marcus Brant Fair point, but we have a document in the US that guarantees the rights of all citizens. It’s just that the president and his allies treat it as something to be tested to its breaking point, not respected. Congressional republicans could end this disaster in a heartbeat, but they are mere cult members now.
5
@Marcus Brant “ The organs of state must practice democratic centralism, they must rely on the masses and their personnel must serve the people. ” History shows that it is inevitable that Hong Kong, Taiwan, and the rest of the capitalist world will be absorbed into the global democratic centralist organism predicted by Chairman Mao. Capitalist democracy, the paper tiger, will be obliterated by democratic centralism. It’s as inevitable as the Sun rising every morning.
I guess Trump has decided there will be no Trade Deal.
The American people have always “interfered” with China in caring about the Chinese people. The Communist Party would not be ruling China today if we did not care enough to get get drawn into our largest foreign war ever because Chinese people were being mistreated by Japan and we elected to interfere with an oil embargo against Japan and sending American airmen to shoot down Japanese bombers. The Communist Party did not complain about that interference. It would make no sense at all to continue special trade status with Hong Kong which is predicated on its status as an enclave of freedom if it no longer is such.
2
It was a win-win for Trump. He will take credit for the results of the Hong Kong election without having to lift a finger. If Chinese leaders thought Trump had any allegiance other than to himself, they have been mistaken.
2
I along with the vast majority of Americans support the Hong Kongers in their quest for a free and democratic state. I just wish Congress would spend more time working on an immigration reform bill to alleviate the suffering of all legal and "illegal" immigrants(like a pathway to everyone staying) and a budget bill(including a plan to reduce the deficit).
1
We have an excellent president. I wish the anti-Trumpers commentators removed the tree branches from their eyes and look at his accomplishments despite having 95% of the media against him. Amazing.
5
@Cjmesq0
please list these accomplishments.
3
When the GOP leads, the President follows. They need to take leadership like this more often.
2
Sanctions, economic pressure, unfair competition and open interference in other countries' affairs; is this what 'American leadership' means?
All the while: Flint, MI still doesn't have clean water, the mortality rate among 25-35 year olds is growing at an alarming rate, the US sovereign debt is over $20 trillion forcing the Federal debt ceiling to be raised again and again.
Otherwise everything is hunky-dory.
Happy Thanksgiving, everyone.
7
The US can't even clean up its own house first. We have many urgent problems and needs in this country: healthcare, education, infrastructure, prison/justice reform, ignoring science on climate change, etc. We are not justified telling other countries how to behave when we can't even behave well ourselves.
5
Yes long overdue.
But:
During the 2012 debates between Barack Obama and Mitt Romney, I vividly recall both skirting the issue of the balance of trade with China ( not human rights).
I desperately waited for either of them to have the courage to say
" No matter which one of us is president, you the people have the ultimate power as consumers as a free people to dictate this issue when you purchase consumer items"
Neither had the courage to say anything of the sort.
Trump finally did something right.
But once again, we the people living a democracy fought for by our ancestors ultimately have the power to control China's world power with our pocketbook.
4
The US human rights record is a joke.
Considering how we just abandoned our Kurdish allies to Turkish genocide it is long passed time we sit down.
No one takes us seriously on human rights. They like US aid but our moral authority is trash.
2
With veto proof votes in the House and Senate, this was no pro-democracy shift of the pro-authoritarian policy of the republicans over the past 3 yrs. It was a weak capitulation by a weakened president.
The republican's friends in N. Korea, Saudi Arabia, Philippines, Russia, Turkey, Assad's Syria, etc have nothing to fear, the republicans cult and its leader djt still have your back.
NATO, Japan, and South Korea have nothing to celebrate. This is not a reversal of our kick in the pants to them. They are still on the black list. At least until djt and the republican cult are defeated at the election polls.
As to the wisdom of interfering in another country's internal politics while you are negotiating trade deals with them, now that is stupid. Greedy, narcissistic, self-defeating, but then again, this is the modern republican cult.
26
@kirk It might be wise to determine the positions of European NATO, Japan, South Korea, Australia, etc. on the issues in question involving Hong Kong human rights. Most likely, you will find "extreme reticence" to express position. General international policy: Global trade supersedes internal domestic disputes of foreign nations.
I feel awful for agreeing with Trump on this,
9
@Full Name (required) . Happy Thanksgiving. We have a terrific president. Be thankful.
2
Gosh, I know it's a coincidence and Trump will likely change his mind, but so do I.
1
Did we also sanction Saudis Arabia for their gross violation of human rights? I believe we sold them more and more weapons, which are directly violating human rights.
103
@Melanie
Saudi Arabia is a monarchy. Subjects (not citizens) of the king have no rights. That is why Trump is such a fan of Saudi Arabia, especially their policy toward journalists, which includes murdering a US journalist and sawing him into little pieces.
6
@Melanie
A bipartisan majority in Congress attempted to end the Saudi arms sales in July, but were unable to override Trump's veto.
It is interesting that he is less willing to clash with Republican Senators now.
2
He had no choice.
12
There was a time around the First and Second World Wars in our democratic states that when sitting on a fence, playing both sides was considered mealy-mouthed, flip-flopping, wishy-washy and opportunistic, as well as a dangerous. especially to children.
This administration has failed in Venezuela, Honduras, called back bombers going into Iraq, snuggled up to N.Korea and this with China better than the TPP? Just wait for it, the other shoe to drop in a few days when this administration changes its mind.
11
It is incredible that a regime with no achievements (unless you include successful theft of IP on a grand scale, unprecedented oppression of its citizens and an utter disregard for historical accuracy as achievements ) and no legitimacy (by way of transparency, rule of law and democratic accountability) can pit itself against a nation that has revolutionized communications and academic research (I’m thinking of space exploration and genetic research). Incredible - but it’s happening.
2
@Robert Travers
I hear you man, but you also have to realize that China has brought the most people up to the middle class in the history of humanity. There is that, and that fact that in the West people are slipping out of the middle class.
1
Why is the United States of America acting like they own the world? Telling countries what to do? Pushing for American style democracy? The United States of America is playing a dangerous game of domination. The United States of America has been destroying Latin America elected governments, democracies that don’t go with American domination, multinationals taking over natural resources. This can go for a while, although not for ever. Latin America will eventually cut ties with the USA and will look to the East for partnerships.
6
@RBR
We aren’t telling them what to do. We are telling them what WE will do if they mistreat our friends and take away their freedom. We won’t sell them the tools to do it. We won’t pretend it never happened and continue special trade status as if HK we still free instead of just another communist city. We won’t allow officials who destroy the free institutions of HK to use our institutions for hiding or transferring their wealth or otherwise personally enjoying the use of freedoms.
5
China, could help out by signing pro-democracy for America:
1. The Senate, Electoral College, the Cabinet and Supreme Court stand as enduring bulwarks against any democratic rule in America.
Every state has two Senators from a half million people in Wyoming to 39.5 million people in California.
Presidents are selected by the Electoral College where individual votes cast in one state don't count nor matter in any other state.
Nor is there any national right to vote nor consistent 50 state basis for determining the qualifications of voters.
Members of the Cabinet and the Supreme Court and lower federal courts are nominated by the Electoral College President without the advice and consent of the House of Representatives. Nor any votes by the American people.
2. The size of the House of Representatives is capped to the disadvantage of more populous states. And the Electoral College is inextricably intertwined with House size.
3. American citizens living in American Samoa, Guam,Puerto Rico and U.S. Virgin Islands are separate and unequal.
4. Indigenous Americans are separate and unequal living in concentration camps because they aren't 'Indians' and they have no lobby looking for canards and tropes that deny their humanity and equality.
5. The black heirs of enslaved Africans are massively incarcerated and 2nd class citizens by every positive educational, health, housing and socioeconomic measure.
38
And we need to stop meddling in the affairs of other countries, which includes destroying some and forcing regime change in others.
6
@Bartolo
Women in American are still not as equal and united as the male heirs of the white Anglo-Saxon Protestant men who owned property who are deified as the Founding Fathers.
While black African women are even more separate and unequal than any other Americans except for brown indigenous Americans.
3
@Bartolo
Why do we use the word "meddle" when talking about human rights?
4
Whether Trump would sign was a "matter of debate." That's a nice way of saying his critics began immediately criticizing him without any knowledge of whether he would sign. They, then, proceeded bashing him for alternatively signing and not signing.
6
@AACNY
I'm OK with bashing Trump for being Trump, after all Republicans do the opposite.
2
I'm not sure what this accomplishes. Supposing China refused to enter trade negotiations until America treated minorities better. Or until Trump was impeached? This is feel-good diplomacy that doesn't accomplish much on the ground.
56
@Michael Livingston’s
True. but it is nice to see the country do anything about China at all except sell ourselves out to China. Trump will reverse himself again soon anyway most likely.
8
@Michael Livingston’s You forget that the bill authorizes sanctions, which are feel bad, not feel good.
4
@Michael Livingston’s
Then why did Congress do it?
2
"Mr. Trump said his decision was not a sign of disrespect toward Mr. Xi, even though China’s government had demanded that the president reject the measure."
The president's stance on human rights is more dependent more on the backbone of Congress than on any personal belief. Schumer was right to call him out for hinting he might not implement provisions that might usurp "executive authority." This latter point reveals Donald Trump's belief that Congress is not a co-equal branch of government.
But my question to Republicans in Congress is this: why can't you also call out Russian aggression in Ukraine, North Korean aggression, and human rights violations in the Phillipines?
Even more important, why can't you accept the findings of America's own intelligence agencies that debunk crazy conspiracy theories Trump uses to misinform the public?
25
@ChristineMcM
Actually, the Republicans, with Democrats, have put sanctions on Russia, which Trump did his best to stall and undermine.
Republicans use these sanctions to claim that Trump is tough on Russia, even though he has done his best to thwart every move against Russia, and has obstructed the investigation into Russian attacks on our elections and refused to coordinate a defense against those attacks by US Intelligence agencies. Instead he has attached our entire US Intelligence Community as a "treasonous Deep State" fomenting a "coup" against him, with zero evidence, while praising Putin and Russian intelligence. Trump has even taken up the Russian propaganda that Ukraine attacked or elections.
But, the Trump Administration has slowly implemented sanctions against Russia, seemingly behind Trump's back, even as he tries to slow walk them.
Then his supporters say, but Trump imposed "the toughest sanctions ever," like that is more important than defending our elections from attack, directly.
@ChristineMcM
Don't forget Saudi Arabia, the Philippines, and Turkey.
This is a terrible development and only adds credence to Beijing's claim that foreign powers influenced the recent Hong Kong election that sent very clear messages to both Beijing and the puppet government in Hong Kong that the people of Hong Kong are fed up with an incompetent and unrepresentative government and that they want democracy. This foolish bill written largely for USA domestic political points will damage local aspirations for more democracy as Beijing tightens its grip.
39
@Arthur Lavin, MD Beijing considers HK an integral part of China and China hates foreigners meddling in what they deem to be an internal affair. The trade tensions between Washington and Beijing will likely become much more difficult to resolve with this foolish attempt by Washington to take a stand on what is happening in Hong Kong. All feedback I have had from locals is very damning of America's intentions.
2
@Arthur Lavin, MD
I agree, Arthur. I also question the assumption that this hurts the cause of Hong Kong’s citizens. It probably would have been worse if for the sake of some $$ the US indicated it was willing to look the other way as the Chinese Plutocracy subjugated its own people. America’s stance on pushing for Democracy in some cases can have a colonizing influence but doing nothing carries greater risk here.
The world looked the other way as China imprisoned massive numbers of its own Uighurs. Certainly many experienced misery and death as a result. How did turning a blind eye help there?
China is a strong global force. Like it or not, China could crush these demonstrations. The Chinese government has demonstrated such brutality in the past and been held to minimal account. What is holding them back? Maybe they are constrained by a complex array of internal forces but I imagine international pressure can also aid the people of Hong Kong, people who recently overwhelmingly voted pro-democracy candidates in.
As for the argument of foreign influence, the Chinese authorities may make that argument and would regardless of US action but its a weak argument. The Hong Kong protests run too deep.
Also, these issues go beyond China’s borders. If China treats their own people that way, do we really want to support their rise in global power? Better to cut off trade in that case, which is why, despite his unpopularity, Trump’s tariffs resonate with many here.
4
I am curious, how does a bill standing with the pro-democracy people of Hong Kong, including penalties for China's attempts to quash, hurt democracy in Hong Kong?
23
I dislike Trump, hugely, but this is the one thing I agree with. China is far too embedded in our lives and considering their stance on free-speech and so on, it's a risk.
But if you're going to promote democracy in one area, why not in the other? Sort out human rights issues on your own soil.
102
@Rob
Cheap Chinese labor makes cheap American commodities and specialties.
China has an abundance of rare earth elements that are essential to our high tech technology.
About 20% of the human race is ethnic Han consumers looking for a better life.
Chop suey and General Tso's chicken are not Chinese.
America has 25% of the world's prisoners with 5% of humanity.
And while only 13% of Americans are black like Ben Carson, Will Hurd and Tim Scott about 40% of the prisoners are black. Because black folks are persecuted for acting like white people do without any criminal justice consequences.
Prison is the carefully carved colored American exception to the 13th Amendments abolition of slavery and involuntary servitude.
Xi Jinping has not called the press ' the enemy of the people' nor mocked ' the failing New York Times' nor 'the fake news'.
Xi Jinping didn't attempt to enact a Muslim ban.
China didn't hack, interfere and meddle in the 2016 American Presidential campaign and election.
8
@Blackmamba “Xi Jinping didn't attempt to enact a Muslim ban.” No, he went a lot further by sending a million muslims to “reeducation” camps...
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/11/16/world/asia/china-xinjiang-documents.html
“Xi Jinping has not called the press ' the enemy of the people'...” No, he simply has journalists arrested. See the case of Lu Guang for example.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/08/opinion/sunday/lu-guang-photographer-missing-china.html
Please remind me of the last time the U.S. government arrested a journalist, never to be heard from again.
You are right to point out that the U.S. isn’t a perfect country, but that cannot serve as an excuse for what China has been doing recently.
9
@R
The US’ treatment of its own non-Euro people is comparable in scope to China’s. In addition to what is current US practice as described by Blackmamba, one doesn’t have to look far back in history to see it all laid bare, unless one chooses very rosy glasses.
Its surreal watching Trump sign a document condemning the actions of a government he wishes the US was.
Trump hates Free Speech (unless its his & the Reps), Freedom of Religion (unless its his Christian Evangelicals), and he Loathes Free Press, even sniping from time to time at his own propaganda machine Faus “news.”
Trump would LOVE to turn America into China and he is doing his utmost to do so.
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92
It is his and his vile GOP's attacks on jobs and employer regulations, though, that REALLY turn workers into the sort of impoverished fearful serfs that xi "loves" most.
Whether Republicans become Americans again by trying to vote them out, or would rather reward their Costco-card's-worth of tax "cuts" and loss of union power and health insurance, remains an open question; but for the many among them who've resolved to put revenge over reality, bigotry over basic sense, and "liberal angst" over love of America, it's one that's asked and answered.
They want to watch the world burn under the rule of their very own xi, and pretend they're getting what he said he'd give them—like jobs, the Southern-border bigotry monument, or a President.
2
@SR
Exactly. You either oppose violent fascism, or you help it. There is no center for them. Trump kept calling for violence against citizens without due process. That is an attack on our constitution. He threatened us with "the military, the police, and Bikers for Trump." The Republican Party cheers.
Compared to the right, the Left IS moderate.
Choose a side, or let them win.
3
Mitch McConnell actually let the Senate vote on something!?!? Yes. President Trump signed the Bill. The question is "Will the President's need for a LEGITIMATE Trade Deal make this Bill moot"? A Trade Deal eliminating tariffs on both sides accomplishes nothing since it just returns Us back to where it all started.
4
Out here in flyover land, people remain far more concerned on how Trump’s stance on Hong Kong could negatively impact the availability of Chinese take out during the upcoming holiday season. While local, this is significant, if not a paramount issue, that could negatively impact Trump’s base out here in fly over country.
10
The significance of these bills comes from the fact that Republicans were prepared to join with Democrats to advance morally principled legislation; in the face of Trump's opposition.
Trump signed the bills into law to avoid the spectre of the legislation proceeding in spite of him. His ego could accept that loss of "face".
This event implies that there may yet be Republicans with shreds of decency and conscience. I commend those Republicans who have shown support for the people of Hong Kong, and the Democrats who worked with them.
3
The President is not afraid of China despite trade deals etc which the Chinese will capitulate in signing eventually. Hong Kong is not a backwater in a far corner of China. Hong Kong has been a thriving semi-autonomous democracy which China want to quietly change without the glaring spotlight that the constant demonstrations and heightened protests have brought in the last year. The President must be supportive of Hong Kong pro-democracy and his recent action demonstrate this quite forcefully. It addresses the commitment for Hong Kong over our trade negotiations. It's not the line drawn in the sand as a threat, it now actionable.
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Fascinating development. Will human rights of foreign nationals, in their native country, supersede the significant economic concerns (and needs) of American citizens in the US-China trade dispute. Which issue will become dominant in American policy. (Most likely, the domestic.) China, if it regroups in position, will make concessions on bilateral trade. (To the advantage of American manufacturing, intellectual property and general reduction of the trade imbalance.) Hong Kong, to China, is an internal subject.
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Good negotiating tactics in the middle of a trade war. OK, Congress made him do it and "I did say Xi was my friend". Where is the protocol of the call between him and his "friend" Xi where Trump promises to slow walk any of the sanctions Congress will try to impose when Xi finally cracks down?
8
How is that interfering affairs of China if it is a Bill that has passed both the Senate and the House with landslide majority, which means the will of most Americans? America, like any country in the world has the right to see decide on whether certain people can enter their country, and do business with. China, stop interfering the legislative process of America! (like you do in other Belt and Road countries)
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@Wayne Don't forget Russia who interferes in all of our elections as well as in EU countries. How about Saudi Arabia, with its most human rights violations. And of course our own not free elections, considering what was said above. Two Senators for a state with less than a million has the same count as two senators with 40 million in a State like California, New york and Texas. The Citizens United, The Electoral College, the Gerrymandering. We have a very broken system, not afair democracy.
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Interfering in other countries is something that trump likes to do but does not like other countries to do to him in the US. How about the kids who have been living away from their parents in cages here for 2 years. Isn't that abuse of human rights????
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@Linda Howell
If that were actually happening it would be...The "cage" facilities you are talking about are short term processing centers. No one and especially not kids stays there for long.
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Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act.
President Xi will introduce the Immigrant Human Rights and Democracy Act for rights of the immigrant children held in deplorable conditions.
undreds of immigrant children who have been separated from their parents or family members are being held in dirty, neglectful, and dangerous conditions at Border Patrol facilities in Texas. This week, a team of lawyers interviewed more than fifty children at one of those facilities, in Clint, Texas, in order to monitor government compliance with the Flores settlement, which mandates that children must be held in safe and sanitary conditions and moved out of Border Patrol custody without unnecessary delays. The conditions the lawyers found were shocking: flu and lice outbreaks were going untreated, and children were filthy, sleeping on cold floors, and taking care of one another because of the lack of attention from guards. Some of them had been in the facility for weeks. -NYT
The Border Patrol agent, a veteran with 13 years on the job, had been assigned to the agency’s detention center in McAllen, Texas, for close to a month when the team of court-appointed lawyers and doctors showed up one day at the end of June.
Taking in the squalor, the stench of unwashed bodies, and the poor health and vacant eyes of the hundreds of children held there, the group members appeared stunned.
their outrage rolled through the facility like a thunderstorm. One lawyer emerged from a conference room -Propublica
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What Trump should do now: tell China that he will place an immediate moratorium on existing tariffs if the Chinese government accepts to end its internment of Uighur people. A quick win for both as it would allow the two sides to claim a victory of sorts. An even bigger win for human rights.
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@C
You are referring to Trump's well established reputation for recognising and advancing human rights; at home and abroad?
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@C
American workers might disagree.
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