There comes a time when doing the right thing matters without worrying about how it plays in Peoria. If so few people care about the president using their tax dollars to abuse his power with no care how it impacts our national security, then they deserve the autocracy that will be in full view when Trump wins and the GOP smugly declares, "We did it." America has become a country where, thanks to the electoral college and policy of 2 senators per state with no term limits, the minority and oligarchs rule. And, like all formerly great civilizations, our country eventually will be relegated to the dustbin of greed, lies, and shame.
21
Really Ross: Economic climate aside, Watergate was legit burglary/espionage /coverup and an attack on the democratic party!.......Monicagate was small potatoes. We Americans know when high crimes and misdemeanors occur. We will look at evidence and support impeachment as we support the consititution and law of the land. No one is above the law . No one.
11
He survives because a significant portion of the population identify with his character, or lack thereof. They cannot get enough of him, his tweets, his insults, his street mouth, his fake macho, his everything that is the worst of the human condition.
Does not bode well for our species.
17
What a crock! Who'd ever believe that Americans cared more about Crimea during the Obama years than they do now. Face it Douhart (and Republicans) - McConnell et al with Fox news declared war on Obama and brought racsist overtones into US politics.
12
This piece could have been written any time since Trump was elected. As his catalog of outrageous behavior continues to increase, the same excuse is rendered time and time again.
But Trump won't stop. A day, a week, a month from now they'll be using the same excuses to defend another Trump "disruption." Up to and possibly even after he does shoot someone in cold blood on Fifth Avenue. "Was it self defense?" "Did the "victim" have it coming to them?"
Will this become the new norm?
9
Were not the winds blowing on today's economic weather vane originated from the Obama administration economic policies?
Did not Hitler get the German economy roaring before he destroyed the nation? Better to take your eyes off the weather vane and look deeply into the character of the man holding office. The wind is very changeable, character is resolute.
16
Assuming everything said in this column is right, it is still a damning commentary on the citizenry that it will tolerate, and some enthusiastically embrace, a manifestly corrupt, racist president who is tearing away at the norms and institutions that are essential underpinnings of a democratic society, most importantly the rule of law.
13
Trump survives because this whole thing is political garbage and we are tired of it.
49
@Pilot
Impeachment is a political proceeding. Perhaps a reading of the Constitution instead of Breitbart will give you a bit of elucidation.
47
@Pilot maybe in Denton, but few other places
20
@Pilot What would it take for this not to be considered garbage? What aspects of due process exist independently and fairly without being a slave to one opinion or its "worst" half. Without the convenience of any sort of clear definition or objectivity, aren't we to obliged to find effective non-obstructive paths to truth discovery despite our motivations or their repercussions? Isn't that what enables us to be better?
16
"The idea that the Trump era is stable..." you got to be kidding me Ross. Let's just take one example for starters. Say the challenges to the EPA's clean air and water standards, the hollowing out of professional scientists at said agency and the ludicrous reign of Scott Pruitt and his successor's cozy relations with the fossil fuel industry. In my book that's not stability and neither is it part of Trump's hypocritical "drain the swamp" ethos. In fact it's a seismic change since the agency was first created during the Nixon Administration with bipartisan blessing.
8
Please consider this carefully derived statistic: a majority of the population is ignorant of government, its functioning, and its purposes. Most people have little direct contract with the federal enterprise outside of tax time, retirement and the days of Social Security/Medicare or when a natural disaster strikes. All that most people know is that they want the government to DOING SOMETHING when they are in trouble and, the rest of the time, who cares?
So, people operate on impressions rather than hard facts and careful study. Besides, we get our general outlook BEFORE we get our facts. An attitude set is generally inherited from family and social connections then we scurry about, when scurrying seems required, look for proof we are right.
One nearly unbendable rule is that the party in power stays in power when the economy is up and the obverse, the party out of power wins it back when the economy is down. This reflects a great fear of the founders, that people, given the vote, would always vote their pocketbooks rather than the national good.
Millions will vote for a strong Democrat simply because of Trump fatigue: they are tired of all the controversy, the noise and the hassles from the White House. Otherwise, it will take a candidate will a clear vision and message to win.
6
Ross D: Your editorial is like the 7 year old claiming that "Tommy made me do it." The truth that you as a Conservative so obsessively avoid is that Trump is a fascist crook and the Republican Party is his enabler because the Republican Party is no different than Trump. Conservatives are interested if just a few things. 1) "The good old day now long forgotten." 2) Money and 3) keeping "Those People" from voting. That is why they keep screaming that the USA is a Republic and not a Democracy. By the way, Trump is not my President. Mine is Hillary Clinton who actually got more votes than Trump.
7
Why does he survive?
Because a majority of voters are now fully aware unelected Bureaucrats are running the Deep State government - and have become the very thing our Founding Fathers fought against.
2
The reverse is actually the case: It's a sense of impending ethnic doom that herded Obama-shocked white voters to the polls in 2016. It is this sence of impending catastrophe that keeps Trump's numbers where they are, and as he builds his wall and fills his barbed-wire cages with more and more dark-skinned children, his stability among the same voters continues unquestioned. This frights-for-whites campaign (and its entertainment arm, FOX News Network) was not enough to save his party a drubbing in 2018,and it won't be enough to save him the suburbs he must have to be re-elected in 2020. But it's enough to serve as ballast, as far as impeachment and removal is concerned, and so long as he has that ballast, his ship won't sink, at least not prematurely. Though he will need to shove plenty of crew overboard.
3
Here is a provocation that might just be true:
the reason that Trump got elected is because people like Douthat and Will and Krauthammer couldn't stomach Obama's intellect and pushed him down to make yourselves look cleverer. You sold out.
5
How Trump Survives?
It's simple. He is the daily media subject.
If CNN and MSNBC gives up a day without mentioning his name, he would really get a panic attack.
So no fooling anyone as to how he survives Ross. His media coverage is way ahead of the literature many church members have, you know, that thing called "The Daily Word."
Tell CNN and MSNBC to cover him less, and man he will have a panic attack.
3
@Nigel
Should be; "If CNN and MSNBC goes a day without mentioning his name..."
Leave the job up to newspapers where people have to read.
2
If the 70,000 voters in electorally crucial states do not turn out to turn this failed president out, then America has entered a catastrophic decline that echos the fall of Rome, the end of all empires (Spanish, Muslim, Dutch, British, et al) and the new age of China.
Only turn out can save the nation.
10
How Trump survives? Republican craven capitulation...
4
Umm, I think you overlooked something that has most of Americans pretty spooked: the recurring disasters associated with climate change. They're not going away, and Trump is the primary obstacle to reducing the carbon emissions driving the warming of the last 50 years. Trump's withdrawal of the U.S. from the Paris Climate Agreement has encouraged other countries to backslide on their commitments. Precious time to avert even worse disasters has been lost. Trump must go. Then Congress can get to work on bipartisan climate legislation, such as the Energy Innovation and Carbon Dividend Act.
4
Trump raised my taxes by $2,000. We are solid middle class workers who do not accept the Republican's magic economic schemes.
10
It's just low standards that makes Trump so passable to Douthat. The Republicans think the stock market, which Trump bribed higher with tax cuts for the wealthy and corporations, is an act of greatness. So what if a few Kurds died? So what if "there were good people on both sides"? So what if the president runs rampant over emoluments? Climate change and environment slamming? It's all small to Ross and the like. Give 'em their two justices, judges, tax cuts for the wealthy, and some good Democrat bashing, and they are in Republican heaven.
They have the most mediocre policies, but they win elections, because they have mastered the politics of fear.
6
Ross, I think it’s all much more simple than you think: nothing sticks to Trump because there are just too many scandals, too many outrages and too much corruption in his administration. As soon as the dimensions of his latest scandal begin to emerge, another scandal emerges, taking over the previous one. And on and on it goes. Everything becomes a blur. Eventually an “it’s just Trump” sentiment settles over the public. His supporters are fine with it. The rest of us are just exhausted.
10
At least the NYT has done its part since 2016.
This is not the time for objectivity.
This is the time for I object and thankfully the NYT op-ed page has heeded the call.
Schiff and the NYT have worked tirelessly for the past 3 months for impeachment. We can only give thanks for this effort.
5
"Is the economy O.K.? Is the world falling apart?"
Since the world is quite obviously falling apart, probably only the first question really matters. The world falling apart only becomes an independent causal factor if there were to be a spectacular catastrophe about two weeks before the election date. Anything much further out than that would be overtaken by the next news cycle and have disappeared from popular consciousness by the time election day arrived.
3
I am beginning to think the most simple, yet complex and utterly haunting answer is: Russia.still
Look how many of the actions that baffle us actually benefit Russia. The list is long. Why is that?
8
When he says the D's have swung to an "ideological extreme", I know that this is absolutely opinion. The R's have been at an extreme forever. All that is is a bit of "fair minded fallacy" hyperbole. Shame on this author for such stupidity.
10
Douthat must have joined those coastal elites. He truly believes the economy is doing well.
The economy is fabulous if your income is derived from securities. That kind of limits "doing well" to the upper echelons of the social strata.
We aren't doing so well here in sky-high health insurance, exorbitant Internet, and poor infrastructure land. Things could be better in polluted my water for profit ville and don't want to have kids because of climate change berg.
But for some, it's just great.
8
It’s really pretty simple. Trump was elected to serve 4 years. He’ll run for re-election and either serve another 4 years, or not. In either event, I promise you that 20 years from now a generation of 8th graders not yet born will confuse him with Barack Obama on a civics test. The sun shall continue to rise, columnists continue to write and the nation continue to prosper.
1
The Dems should not impeach. The "protect the Constitution" or "the Constitution requires us to" rationals are losing propositions.
They should use the investigations for as long as possible to air the dirty Trump laundry for the eventual nominee to hammer him with.
Russia and finances are the real dirty underwear. He is selling all Americans down the Moscow river. Use the investigations to get that skeleton out of the closet.
Do what Trump does: poison the waters.
No need for impeachment.
2
Which “late Obama era crime increase” are you talking about?! That is an extremely disingenuous comment. Nearly every crime indicator fell in the period between 2014 - 2016, part of a 25 year historical trend. During Obama’s 8 years term crime rates fell dramatically. Between 2014 - 2016 violent crimes increased in some parts of the country. Your words, were misleading if not outright false.
12
Good job getting this pompous doofus elected, Ross. And no, you are NOT forgiven.
10
Has Ukraine invaded the United States? Are Ukrainian tanks rolling down Fifth Ave or Pennsylvania Ave in DC? Not last time I checked. If not, where are the “high crimes”?
2
That’s what you think it takes?
6
So, the next line in this argument is, what? — Mussolini got the trains to run on time?
10
So only educated liberals can recognize a con man, a compulsive liar, a bigot, a racist, a protector of war criminals, an enabler of despots, all rolled into one? How sad that educated, and uneducated, conservatives are so devoid of such realization. That,of course, would make them sociopaths.
4
No there is nothing more "Something Worse" than Trump in the White House.
8
It's my humble-ish opinion that Mr. Trump finally decided to run for president because the chaos following the great recession was abating toward the end of Mr. Obama's second service. Certainly my 401k had reached it's peak during Obama's last year (it's been up and down since Trump took office); Obama had already embarked on the champagne to fight the Islamic State in alliance with the Kurds; National security measures were already in full swing to monitor the web for future recruits into the extremist Islamic groups. I don't think President Trump is as stupid as many of my fellow progressives claim--he's more like a scheming Iago, a jealous schemer who will do anything he can to undermine any esteem voters have had for Obama--hence the northern campaign. Trump has made promises to single issue voters--some who may have not voted much before--to address things he does not care about himself, merely to cement their support. Abortion, gun rights, tax relief for the rich, stopping the flow of undocumented workers across the border--these issues bind his base to him, and he knows this.
4
Could someone here tell me if mr. Douthat reads the comments here? Or is he juist interested in his own 'truth'. Wouldn't it be a good idea that the editor asked columnists to respond to, say 5 or 10 comments, as some do? Would Ross Douthat be brave enough to do that, seeing that all of the commenters clearly tell him that he is wrong? If not, the NYT should get rid of him. Readers want to be able to read 'alternative' stories, but surely they don't want to be told things that are so doubtful (a euphemism) that they undermine truth.
10
No. Just No. This paints a portrait of an electorate that is so cynical, selfish and ignorant that I don't want to believe it's where I live. And you're wrong on just about every fact, as per usual. Again, as per usual, you ignore the climate crisis, the income equality (very few people except the top are sharing in the prosperity that despite his absolute best efforts, DJT has not managed to ruin) and the utter moral bankruptcy that I'd think you, world class prig, would be way more upset about. And you're completely wrong in comparing Nixon and Clinton. Are you just willfully ignorant about all the things that came out after Nixon left office? The enemies list? Using the IRS to attack political opponents? Trying to strong arm the FBI? Prolonging Vietnam for political gain? I'm sure I'm leaving out a lot. Clinton was a disgusting pig -- that's not in the same moral universe.
9
Unlike Nixon, Trump is going to stand for re-election in less than a year. A fair number of voters, especially independents, oppose impeachment because they believe the Senate should not pre-empt the election next November. Democrats need to choose the right candidate make the case why the US would be better off with a Democrat in the White House. Questions about the current Democratic frontrunners may also be helping Trump avoid impeachment.
3
trump survives because of the republican party. They have no ethics or backbone and will do anything to stay in power. That includes working for Russia.
11
Generally correct. Impeachment as a constitutional remedy is probably dead absent a Firth Avenue murder or something close. Independent voters, all who really matter, tend to be happy if there are no new foreign wars and politicians stay out of the way of the economy. Aside from the trade issues Trump has a passing grade and impeachment has been a rather dull partisan sideshow.
4
Stabiity? People do not stuff the ballot box for a candidate sitting who sits on a stable economy. Trump gets out the vote because he stokes stokes xenophobic, simplistic and racist populism in his base.
They may not love Trump but they hate the people he hates, and that's good enough to get their votes.
9
Nice RD. But your analysis of politics will be impoverished until you realize certain historical facts. Clinton was not removed from office solely for the reasons you state. Clinton was not removed from office, because sex shaming lost it sting in the sixties, and the American people knew exactly what the cons were doing; this is the point in time that RD states as the default time, away from small government, community, family, and church. Turns out that all those 'sinners,' too had family and the rest. And although conservatives thought they had made 'the sale,' (persuasion works different from this; but if you equate good business with good government you miss this point), but they did not, and turns out the base voted for other reasons, than conservative principles. Which is really sad because what we are missing today is not a progressive voice, but a conservative one.
4
" of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme. "
Excuse me?
Since when is holding a criminal accountable for his actions an "ideological extreme"?
The reason he survives is that pundits like yourself, dishonest and corrupt politicians and Fox news propagandists throw the people of this country and the Constitution under the bus.
Give me a break.
8
“How Trump Survives”
It’s not all that complicated. He is keeping his promises: he keeps the rich people up, the black people down, the brown people out, and the base entertained. The rich and the base are having fun, and the rest of us, scattered and diverse as we are, don’t matter to him.
14
I think Ross is fundamentally correct here. Any deviation up or down in opposition to incumbent presidents is mostly determined by fundamental economic and geopolitical factors, much more than the actions of politicians. Trump has a low ceiling because of his terrible public image, but not so low that he can't survive impeachment or win reelection. The rhetoric of politicians on either side have no impact on his prospects: which is why it's so incredibly stupid and empty for Democrats to fixate on the electability of one candidate versus another. If Democrats remain organized behind the eventual nominee, they will each have roughly the same odds against Trump. Most discussions of electability in the media are just a facade that masks political bias in objective language, and have absolutely zero grounding in empirical, measurable reality.
1
Trump will get crushed in the next election, the only reason he won is because so many people thought Hillary was a sure thing and didn't even bother to vote. The Trump experience has been so vile and obnoxious that I doubt many people will be sitting home at the next election.
8
This column is depressing. It seems to say what drives most of us is the attitude that, "As long as my belly is full, I really don't care if yours is."
Thankfully, many individuals throughout history, not necessarily even the smartest or the most able, felt differently. Even cavemen, having to live cooperatively to kill for their food (and to cultivate it), and to raise their children, had better ethics than what this column suggests drives most of us.
6
"it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased"...it's the only thing that matters
7
"Is the economy O.K.? "
"for what is a man profited if he may gain the whole world, but of his life suffer loss..."
I thought even non bible thumpers knew this one.
6
Trump will lose. He won by the thinnest of margins, he's surely lost that margin already. Democrats will coalesce around a good candidate. The economy will continue to tick along. Sound legislation for the 21st century will pass. FCC will clamp down on misinformation. We'll get a couple constitutional amendments passed, and possibly write an updated Bill of Rights...I hope.
9
President Trump will survive because he is tenacious and has strength. He outlasted his competitors in all the debates including career politicians such as Hillary Clinton. Adam Schiff and Nancy Pelosi are no match for our president. He has staying power and will remain until 2024.
1
The current economy is growing at 1.9% which is less than the 2.4% it was growing as Mr Obama left office!
12
"though the likelihood of such a disaster the longer Trump remains in office is one reason to wish for his removal, even his fiercest critics should prefer stability, and the necessity of defeating him at the ballot box, to the Something Worse that might expedite his fall."
Something Worse that facilitates Trump's fall and removal from the White House -- whether in the Senate impeachment trial or (more likely) in the 2020 election -- is likely to be Less Worse than what would happen if Trump is reelected in 2020.
A Trump 2nd term -- when his cognitive decline has accelerated, when he is unbound from the need to seek reelection, when the law of averages brings him a true crisis -- would be an absolute nightmare, and likely the end of the America that we know and love.
11
If you think the economy will continue to trend up continuously while our debt piles up and the stock market will continue up ( driven by share buy backs due to low interest rates), then you are living in a dream world. It is another bubble that will burst, either for the evil man in the White House ( I hope not since they won't be able to handle a financial crisis) or certainly the next President, who will be a moderate and decent Democrat.
8
There continues a failure in recognition of the source of Donald Trumps power. It is not, as this op-ed suggests, the economy. It is not, as this op-ed suggests, whether or not "is the world falling apart". Trump's base is motivated by "resentment politics". The repeated message is that it is "us against them". It is us against immigrants, Muslims, socialists, LGBTQ, scientists, liberal elites, freeloading allies, etc, etc. The economy and world stability do not matter at all.
9
I think all of this is beside the point. The main argument for why Trump survives is because the left has abruptly and mysteriously radicalized in recent years (which may not even be related to Trump per se; it could be a separate development). So regardless of how much you hate Trump, if you still think (as you did in 2016) that borders are OK and normal, that there are two genders, that men can court women, that there shouldn't be free healthcare for illegal alien, and so on, then Trump is actually a better choice than the new insane left. Something happened to liberals and they've lost their marbles completely.
5
What makes this impending impeachment unique is the new world of competing news sources available to anyone (to read or to pontificate). So instead of examining facts and debating what they portend, we have facts versus alternative facts with Truth and Fabrications getting equal billing.
The consequences of this situation extend far beyond impeachment proceedings, but if in 2019 we produced recordings of White House conversations that implicated the President (as we did nearly half a century ago), we would find ourselves at loggerheads not over the magnitude of the malfeasance but over whether there was any malfeasance at all!
Those who don't believe this must have missed this month's hearings. We have a phone call summary. We have a Parade of Patriots testifying. We have blatant and unapologetic obstruction. But we also have a fact-free counter narrative that is immune from evidence and whose swampy sources are given equal weight to this august publication.
Utter nonsense is awarded great currency as we cleave ourselves into tribes and somewhere in Moscow Vladimir Putin wears the smile of satisfied success, even as he plans more of the same.
6
Doesn’t matter. The human species only has 5-8 years left on this planet. Under Trump or anyone else, won’t fix anything.
Time to stop wasting time and sign off from this “news and politics” nonsense.
1
I think our timeline runs a little longer than that, buddy
2
Five to eight years? Seriously?
2
I can't find in the Constitution anywhere that a 'clear cascade of disasters' elsewhere needs to be in place before the House impeached a President. An impeachment is not a referendum on a President's policies and performance while in office. It is a trial over alleged 'crimes and misdemeanours.'
9
Mr Douthat, From an article in The Journal of Policy History "...congressional Republicans, with surprisingly few exceptions, publicly proclaimed Nixon’s innocence and opposed either his resignation or impeachment until nearly the end". so I guess we can rule out that Republicans were more honorable in 1974. You go to great lengths to somehow make Trumps tenure seen as stable,but unless one is blind and deaf or on another planet, that is impossible to do, the economy notwithstanding. To make any argument that the Trump presidency has been stable and therefore explains his not being removed from office is ludicrous. What a stretch.
10
Complacency is the biggest problem with the electorate, specifically the middle or center, who the general consensus is Democrats must capture in 2020. It’s feeling that things are ok, good enough, even if not great. This group is in the middle both politically and economically … they don’t especially care for Trump, but have jobs, wages increasing a bit, & 401k’s growing. They don’t feel the urgency for change because they are too comfortable. They are not tuned in to the danger & rot in government that is eroding our democracy because there are no stormtroopers beating on their doors and the teaching of Russian isn’t yet required in public schools. They are the proverbial frog in the pot.
Only when the middle begins to feel the economic heat will more progressive ideas & a desire for change in leadership catch a spark. We can only hope they haven’t been cooked & consumed by then, and that there will still be enough of our nation for real patriots to salvage.
The takeaway for Democrat candidates is the same as it’s always been, it’s the economy & how things could have been and could be better if Trump hadn’t wasted four years serving his own interests.
7
Hmmm, Ross, You may well be correct in your assessment of what actually motivates the American polity today, but implicit in your argument is the suggestion that the only 'sure fire' way to impeach a sitting president in this country is to 'engineer' either an economic collapse, social unrest or the threat of violence domestically, or an unpopular war abroad. If true, that observation then outlines a subversion strategy for any minority political party when it is dissatisfied with the incumbent president. Hardly a ringing endorsement for how the American experiment in democracy has progressed since 1776. If we as the electorate cannot agree on, or refuse to recognize, what constitutes corruption, high crimes or treason, we no longer have the moral compass our founding fathers and mothers expected would guide their fledgling experiment. If 40% or so of our electorate is satisfied with temporary economic prosperity and view public disparagement as 'entertainment' while the foundations of our democracy crumble,then Putin and Xi will lead the rest of the world into the 21st century.
8
Trump survives because this political system and this country, is fundamentally racist and #45 ran his campaign off of racists and racism. IJS. https://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/12270880/donald-trump-racist-racism-history
6
I see what you're trying to do there and it is laughable tripe. Nixon lost out because he was engaged in criminal acts that he had to make a deal for, or he risked going to the same place his criminal vice-president went.
Clinton won out, because he was being prosecuted for lying about an extra-marital affair, in the face of the republicans back then (some still around) all acting like summer visiting pastors for revival. The same party has now elected a creature devoid of character, ethics, or morals. The gop elected this creature because he perfectly reflects their own collective lack of such trivial things and they still support him because he is a republican and all they care of is winning and delivering the goods to the folks who already have plenty of goods, some of which are given to them as rewards for delivering regularly.
It is important to note, also, that one can write articles for reasons other than providing a platform to make false equivalencies or spread complete bunk, such as the supposed "radicalism" of democrats.
If today's democrats are radical, my rural Georgia mountain grandpa and grandma must have been revolutionaries, and FDR a complete bolshevik, but they weren't were they, and everyone on the right knows that, which is why they want to convince everyone today that they were.
15
Preach!
4
"campuses and cities have been relatively calm"
They are.
If the Democrats who lead on impeachment were really speaking for their identity groups on campus and in cities, then why are those groups so quiet before, and still in the midst of impeachment?
Perhaps that is because those voter groups are not behind Trump, but also not behind the moderates doing impeachment to talk about only Trump.
They are behind the current leftist populists like Bernie and Warren. Their money and activism is there, and they are not rioting because they are making real progress against the Democratic advocates for the status quo, and against Trump's abandonment of the rebellion against the status quo.
They've got leaders, and they are making progress, and that is not in the impeachment arena.
2
I would generally agree with Ross's thesis. The Ukraine matter will not bring about removal or serious political damage by itself. There are so many other accusations that would have to be raised all at once in the same removal proceeding, including alleged campaign contribution violations, obstruction of justice in the Russia investigation, obstruction of justice in the Ukraine matter, Trump Foundation violations, emoluments clause issues, etc. (The unexplained Syria withdrawal???)The Democrats appear not to have the stomach or the time to do all of this and will probably pay the price.
1
He survives because so many Republican leaders and donors share Trump's conviction that gov't should be run for the benefit of Wall Street and their bottom line. They have a much greater problem with a politician who wants to diminish their power - i.e. tax their wealth - than with an oligarch.
This is why they don't insist that he release his tax returns. They don't care whether or not he has paid taxes. They don't care about his self-dealing. They don't care about his conspiracy mongering - so long as he doesn't interfere with their ability to amass as much wealth as humanly possible.
Another reason he survives - religious fundamentalists who cannot acknowledge other people's sense of morality and whose belief system, coupled with their sense of unease with the current system, makes them susceptible to consparitorial/apocolyptic thinking.
10
Trump still the best president we have , our business triple , yes we need outsider to govern not a bunch of Harvard idiots attorneys, all democratic candidate they promise but nothing done .. governments employees they are not motivated they just looking for next pay check and power rule and increase fees.
1
Yes he is the best President we HAVE. Let’s try for a leader who lives his country and trusts the people.
7
His base loves him because he's a bully and a gangster and they think that's what it takes to get on in this world. They don't care about high crimes and misdemeanors.
8
Sorry, old son, but you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
6
I think this analysis is partly correct. But I think that in past impeachment investigations, the general public was better able to distinguish facts from partisan opinion because most people obtained their information from traditional sources that were trusted to be balanced and objective...at least in comparison to the current situation. It is also worth remembering that "stability" is both transitory and illusory. External events that are largely outside the president's control can occur with shocking speed and effect and sometimes only after the impeachment process has begun (as in Nixon's case).
2
Impeach this guy. You won't be able to rewrite history; meaning that the impeachment will always be the asterisk on the predator in chiefs' moniker.
6
I dislike calling this article rambling and self-contradictory but that is what it is. First, Clinton's policies for granting credit to unqualified borrowers set up the financial collapse G.W. Bush inherited and had no hope of remedying while fighting a war on one then two fronts at a time. Barrack Obama inherited those two wars which, although fairly stable, spawned ISIS and further polarized the Middle East as well as western Europe - but his administration recovered from the crash (let's quit calling it a recession), stabilized the economy, and rapidly created the booming economy Trump is claiming credit for. Although unemployment has continued to decline during Trump's reign of incompetence, gains in the real economy and employment pale in comparison to those under President Obama and it's his policies that continue despite the wreckage Trump has caused around the world's economies. The new Democratic president and Congress (both Chambers) will inherit a national and worldwide economic and political debacle worse than anything since Hitler's and Mussolini's rise to power. All the big dreams will go on hold for the next 8-16 years while the Democrats repair the damages caused by Trump and his Republican lackeys. Stand by for rougher waters before we once again reach calm seas.
6
"Russia’s aggression has given way to stalemate" I stopped reading right there. Like too many Americans, you Mr. D. believe b/c Russia has limited military capability that it's aggression takes no other form. Have you been napping for the past number of years?
10
As he often does, Douhat starts out with reasonable and more or less accurate basic assumptions, then he goes off the rails. I stopped reading after "Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme." Just slip that little lie right in there. The reason Trump survives? Doesn't take a hole column to explain: Republicans are mad for power and immoral, and Fox is their corporate version of Goebbels. It's really pretty simple.
10
@steve
I would like to use your statement .
Fox is the their corporate version of Gobbles.
The only change I would make is FAUX news.
We can thank Reagan for doing away with the Fairness Doctrine which allows Faux to be a propaganda outlet
I
5
A fine but garbled and in eloquent explanation as to why impeachment will not succeed. Not enough bad stuff happening to get rid of bad orange man.
1
"Meanwhile the economy has grown steadily, leaving a majority of Americans in their best financial position since the days when Clinton survived impeachment." Did you drink the Repub Koolaid, Ross?
There is NO reliable record-keeping of those who have spent the last decade begging for work, most simply thrown off state unemployment rolls while Trump's Department of Labor touts the under-4% rule (no federal aid if the unemployment number is below 4%... ergo, no one to account for).
Many "workers" are now performing underpaid "gig" jobs in their chosen professions, or pitching boxes at Amazon, stocking shelves at Costco, or working from home waiting for AI robots to forward a spam call that's been foolishly answered. (The Labor Department counts THOSE as jobs!)
Our economy is in free fall. For one better standard deduction, there are now another 15 deductions that have been demoted or erased.
The share of investors in the much-touted stock market has dropped 10% since 2008, i.e. the rich do get richer!
Buying power APPEARS greater, but is the result of billions of goods (appliances, clothing) that are cheaper because international shipping is cheaper, and practically everything is made somewhere else by people who are paid barely living wages.
Trump and his ever-changing cabinet should NOT be impeached; he (and they) should be voted out of office in next year's election, and in a manner that sends a clear message to The Donald and his mesmerized base: never again.
Trump is surviving -- so far -- at least in part, if not mostly, because it is a different country now than it was in 1974, with a different Republican electorate and cadre in Congress. Generally, both are much more debased, coarse, and heedless of facts and principles which do not suit their purposes.
26 Nov 19 1603
1
Okay, now Douthat is writing an editorial about his feeling that its calmer now than in the last years of Obama. Hard to argue that.
However, about his concluding remark that Trump is better than some horrible event that could spoil this Pax Maga I have two questions I don't expect him to answer:
1. How does it get any worse than when the White House lawyers argue Trump should be King and Republicans throughout Congress and country agree.
2. What horrors lurk below the surface waiting to envelope us in terror and grief because of this President's ignorance and his refusal to use advisors, like the ones we saw in the Impeachment Inquiry last week, to help him make informed decisions?
3
Donald Trump will survive the impeachment process and will be reelected in 2020. I will likely sit out this presidential election. What amazes me is the support Trump receives from my former work colleagues. (Law Enforcement.) Almost to a ,man they support Trump. They see the Democrats as a party of crazies and they like the looks of their investment portfolios.
3
A survey by the Annenberg Public Policy Center showed that 75% of Americans can NOT name all 3 branches of government. 33% can NOT name a single branch of the government.
Basic ignorance is the real underlying problem.
6
Until you so-called 'experts' can wrap your heads around the fact that Trump is a SYMPTOM not a cause your prognostications will continue to be wrong. The majority of Trump VOTERS (as distinct from Trump supporters) dislike Trump, have never liked Trump, and have never believed Trump. They hate Washington. To paraphrase Don Rumsfeld after 911, 'You use the wrecking ball of Washington that you have, not the wrecking ball you wish you had'. It's not that Trump VOTERS disbelieve the facts, they simply believe the facts are irrelevant. Only the destruction of the Washington (and the bi-coastal Establishment) matter.
3
Part of what needs to be factored into the equation is the cynicism of partisan politics. I am convinced that the GOP accepts the folly of Trump and won't impeach him in the Senate because they really believe the Dems are just as corrupt as anyone (given the opportunity) and so, it is a question of having power, not of being morally acceptable.
Nixon was to be impeached after losing the house and the senate. This is not the case for Trump. He still owns the senate and the GOP still likes power. The ends justify the means, even in America.
"a period of general stability at home and abroad"....Are you kidding? NAFTA (oh, I mean USMCA) has yet to be approved, though it has been negotiated. There's the Brexit debacle, the fact that Israel cannot form a government, the destabilization of NATO by this president, North Korean missile tests, Turkish incursion into Syria, the dismantling on short notice of US bases there, the ongoing war over the Crimean peninsula, Hong Kong. This is not a stable world, either economically or politically.
4
None of the Douthat thesis holds if
(a) the Electoral College disappears; and
(b) Congressional districts aren't gerrymandered for the Republicans to the extreme.
5
Ross does not seem to recognize that the Republican Party is now so far to the ultra right wing fringe that they cannot even see the center anymore. Which, of course means he is also to the far, far right. Row, let me clue you in...Democrats are not extreme, they are solid center and holding out for basic human rights, something republicans would never, ever do.
6
We should not ignore the trial of Andrew Johnson. There was never a vote to remove Nixon, so we will never know how many senators would have voted to eject him. Removal of a president requires a supermajority, which may never be possible without an even more egregious violation of the law than Nixon’s conspiracy. The impeachment of Andrew Johnson may be from a radically different era, but the failure to remove Johnson provides an important lesson. Even with a supermajority in the House and Senate and an unelected and incompetent president blocking the Republican efforts to rebuild the US and reform/reconstruct the South in the wake of the Civil War, there were still enough Senators who were unwilling to eject the president. Even if the US were in the midst of a recession, how many Senators would be willing to remove the president with an election only months away?
1
The stock market moved up about 12,000 points under Obama's 8 years and the economy was strong when he left. But one of the lessons we're supposed to have drawn from Clinton's defeat was that not everyone was sharing in the good times and many of those went for Trump. A lot of people still aren't sharing in Trump's strong economy, despite his promises. Which way will they vote now?
9
Trump survives because the republican party is willing to shield him to keep the White House. The Russian/Wikileaks saga is one thing. This time Trump tried to induce a nation Ukraine to commit corruption on his behalf. And the irony is that Ukraine was trying to shed its culture of corruption...Bloomberg is running to save America from another 4 years of chaos and corruption, and perhaps a tragedy in matters of war and peace especially in the Persian Gulf, etc.
6
No one has mentioned the shootings that are happening just about every other day.
The question then is: Is crime really down? and Why is no one doing anything about guns?
Also, the economy is a deficit economy, that's what's feeding the good times.
9
"Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
Of course Ross, you got it wrong. I'll fix it for you. "Of course it matters that Trump's (and your) party is craven, debased and has swung to an ideological extreme that Goldwater wouldn't recognize. Democrats are mostly at the same place Republicans were in the 60's but not near as far left as Democrats of that era."
9
It’s true that people don’t pay much attention. Everyone has troubles and worries of their own. Still waiting for worse revaluations about Trump. It’s a matter of time.
Right now the Republican support of Trump is like Catholics defending predatory priests because they are good fund raisers for the church.
Trump is getting ready to retire to Florida. He didn’t just change his residency to avoid NY state taxes. Everybody knows he has plenty of reasons to plan his escape route.
9
Great and very sad analogy.
5
This is another of Douthat’s simplistic-reasoning columns that end up not holding Trump and the GOP accountable for actions and lies that should sink any administration.
This column, for example, turns Syria and the Kurds into a positive for Trump. Douthat will say that he’s just reporting what happening, but by ignoring the mendacity and by trivializing the outcomes of Trump’s actions, Douthat continues to be another Trump enabler.
Douthat ignores the devastating testimony of multiple witnesses last week. Mr. Douthat—even the Constitution spells out bribery as an impeachable offense. Do you have any doubt that Trump bribed the Ukraine by withholding Congressionally approved funds for their war with Russia? And that he did it for completely personal, political gain? Of course you and every GOP member knows it.
Trump should be impeached, and you should stop trying to nullify that.
9
What Trump attempted to do with Ukraine is most accurately described as extortion which in moral terms may be worse than bribery but unlike bribery is not specified in the US constitution
1
So tired of hearing about the great economy when the cost of everything is getting beyond my reach.
14
@K. Molyneaux
I've been having the same thought lately. I make a good salary and I find myself simply not buying things, and not big things either, because the costs just keep going up so much. I guess the higher prices mean a good economy for someone else who is making money off them.
I mean we should all economize where we can to not waste our money, but things that used to be reasonable have passed that point and I don't just cut back or buy smaller amounts, I just don't buy it any longer.
9
I had to stop reading when Ross said that the Democrats have swung to extremes. They have not. Some running for president are further left than the broad electorate, but those who align to these policies are still a fraction of the democratic party. Ross is a fraud, who refuses to admit that the republican party officials -- not just its zealous religious gun rights fringe -- supports actions that are to the right of the majority of Americans.
9
Okay, now Douthat is writing an editorial about his feeling that its calmer now than in the last years of Obama. Hard to argue that.
However, about his concluding remark that Trump is better than some horrible event that could spoil this Pax Maga I have two questions I don't expect him to answer:
1. How does it get any worse when the White House lawyers argue Trump should be King and Republicans throughout Congress agree.
2. What horrors lurk below the surface waiting to envelope us in terror and grief because of this President's ignorance and his refusal to use advisors, like the ones we saw last week, to help him make informed decisions?
10
Nixon went down because of the tapes, not the economy.
7
Nixon resigned because there was a Democratic majority in Congress. It is doubtful if he would have with a Republican majority.
And no one liked him. However it never occurred to me that Nixon while paranoid and guilty that he he had nothing else on his mind, that he wasn’t smart, and that he was patriotic.
Trump meets none of those criteria. This is a corrupt enterprise which has no benefit to the country as a goal. Part of the reason that things aren’t falling apart is that it hasn’t and foreign leaders are ignoring him and he’s bullying the others. The other places may fall apart because we’re not in the room where it happens
I think of the man who jumped off a60 story building who when passing the thirtieth floor yells So far so good
1
Have to agree with Ross but the economy is running on gas added to a smoking fire with deficit spending Democrats are not talking enough about growing economy directly. They talk about savings from health cure which dubious and require higher taxes. The only talk about taxing the Uber rich which will be easily reversible and is being funded to proposed programs. Simple ways to increase money I. Everyone’s pockets has to come out of their mouths of Democrats if they want to win and would shed a less shiny light on the economy. It may help impeachment it may help electability and would be hard to reverse. CUT THE PAYROLL TAX RATE TO 1.5 to 2 percent on both employees and employers and apply the double rate to all other income. It will be revenue neutral and someone earning $50k would see both his and his employers tax go down a total of $5560, 2.5 dollar raise at least half going to employee. If 150 million people making close to 200k all would see increased spending money. Not sure how hats distributed but 150M x 5560 is about 850 billion dollars per year with lower tax rates and would go into pockets at least half to employees and employers may have to pay more to employees or with this stimulus would likely result in more jobs. Simple and little opposition. Lower tax rates by Democrats. Imagine that.
I do diverge from topic. Sorry
2
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”― Edmund Burke
Seems trite at this point, but still true as I look daily at the depressing silence from the Republican Party.
6
Yes doing nothing is easy as is ignoring the future. Remember even though the economy is growing and we haven’t started new wars, his approval is 49. Clinton’s was I the 60s. Let’s hope people vote
1
“... it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme.”
I stopped reading there.
Is Europe a continent of left wing extremism?
Of course not.
And Democratic positions are pretty much in sync what is considered middle of the ground social democratic policies.
What is fundamentally wrong with conservatives and Republicans (who are not conservatives by any measure anymore) is how far they have swung to the right.
They have lost their political and ethical compass: climate change denial, voter suspension, moral collapse, violation of democratic norms, and ideological alignment with an amoral and autocratic man in the Oval Office.
As long as Douthat doesn’t stop his false equivalence tactics he will not be taken serious by the well educated reader of the NYT.
He should not even be read, or even better published.
10
In other words, the Republicans knew exactly what they were doing when they tried to make a bad economy worse to limit Obama to one term. It did not succeed.
6
Occams razor applies, why make this issue complex.----Trump, GOP fecklessness, Fox News and the rest of the hypocrisy and irrationality movement of the Right can be explained by a simple and obvious truth--their support comes from a demographically narrow but populous group--mainly White, less educated, more religious, less tolerant, not surprisingly the same group which had an irrational and disproportionate hatred of Obama. For everything Hillary got wrong she was spot on about the "basket of deplorables" and this country sure better hope that a coalition of the young and of minorities and of rational principled citizens finds a way through in 2020 or there may not be much left of this country by the time the deplorables finally die off.
9
Douthat seeks a uniform field theory to explain the indictment of a president by the House for bribery, treason, and other high crimes. He is on a fool’s errand.
First, “high crimes” are crimes by presidents, vice-presidents, and cabinet officers against the State, our Constitution or their corruption of their oath of office. these are acts that jeopardizes the very existence of just government.
Second, acts that violate criminal statutes are not “high crimes” unless their motive is the corruption of equitable governance—think encouraging Russia to Help elect Mr. Trump by election fraud in 2016.
If Mr Douthat is correct in his judgment that the 2016 election and the stonewalling of congress are insufficient corruption to warrant impeachment, then let the Republican party in the Senate exonerate him, let the Electoral College re-elect him and ,thus emboldened in his delusion that “L'État, c'est moi”, let Trump be the first president to be impeached twice. To paraphrase Rob Emmanuel, some crises become too great to be wasted.
4
"Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased ... " Sounds right to this Independent voter. I have problems with Democrats, but the Republicans have gone completely off the deep end.
9
Ross needs to listen to himself more. He's making a trains-run-on-time argument. We've seen that before, no thanks. Not that some segment of us aren't, apparently, susceptible to that argument. Not that one of our parties is not mendacious enough to shove such an argument down our throats. Ross is also making the implicit argument that de facto state propaganda works. Sure it does. That's why we need to fix it. The same single central fact remains. If the Senate doesn't convict, 2020 will not be a free and fair election. Trump's Ukraine extortion scheme will stand. He will be free to do the same around the world.
8
Geez. This should be a no-brainer. Trump is morally and intellectually unfit to hold high public office. Impeach him or vote him out, it's that simple. I think the so-called "thinkers" of this era in American history have lost themselves in overanalysis and in subscribing to it we have become confused. As I see it, domestic welfare, foreign policy and our dying planet are all that matters. Trump fails on all three. We're sliding into an abyss not unlike the late 1930's simply because the world has yet to spin off its axis. Wait.
6
Mr. Douthat, Trump IS the disaster that is afflicting our country. He models law-breaking, lying, self-dealing, bullying and an extreme lack of interest in governing in the interest of the public good. If he is not held accountable, the lesson is that this is the way to behave in our country. What does all the money in stock market gains and lower taxes on the wealthy do for us, if we become a corrupt individuals behaving just like Trump in our interactions. Is this what we want our citizens to learn? I view the society that this would create as poisonous to our well-being.
5
We are experiencing what is probably the worst disaster facing the US and the world - Climate change. And it has been exacerbated by the ignorance of Trump and his fellow deniers. That should be enough to turn public opinion against Trump. The problem is that the general public does not recognize climate change as a disaster. Pity our progeny.
6
The longest explantion of "it's the economy stupid" that I've heard. Much of the acceptance of Trump's awfulness and evil is baked in. Why? Because his voters are angry, and that apparently Trumps everything else.
Since Trump's election I have wished for a recession. Sadly, it may be the only chance we get to make America great again. It's inevitable anyway, and it's the one turn of events Turmp can't lie his way out of. The people who care about impeachment or Ukraine or North Korea were not Turmp voters in the first place.
4
Ross, I think you have something here. Sad to say, it says more about us, then it does Trump. If JFK were to come back to life today, and repeat his famous request. "Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country" he'd be booed off the stage.
3
The most important concept of this piece is:
And though the likelihood of such a disaster the longer Trump remains in office is one reason to wish for his removal...
This "stability" that Trump supporters base their vote on is a house built on sand. Crises always arise, and this President will either cause one or have no capability to deal with one. Basing your livelihood on luck is foolish. Luck always runs out. Move your house to safer ground before the storm comes.
2
Too many Americans receive false and misleading news from unregulated, unaccountable social media and Fox News. This is the problem.
3
We know that disasters--not scandals--remove individuals from the US presidency.
What helps keep men like Trump in power are columnists that support autocratic or demagogic behavior from white men who find Trump's behavior concerning: but not so concerning to call for or support removal from office. Loyalty to one's morals or ethics deserves no credit when one's morals or ethics are rotten, giving scoundrels the benefit of the doubt.
4
A bad economy probably gave Nixon’s impeachment a nudge, but more likely because he committed a crime, Congress was solidly Democratic, everyone read the Washington Post and the New York Times, not just liberals, and most congressmen could remember World War II and presided over the Vietnam debacle. Interestingly, former Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott cast a no vote on Nixon’s impeachment in a Judiciary committee vote, a hint maybe of hyperpartisanship to come.
3
Lets all not forget how important the beautiful First Lady's "Be Best" program has helped our children. It seems to have tamped down Donald Trumps demeanor just a hair. I am thankful to live in a law abiding country of patriots like Trump. I am sure he will survive and be fine for another 1 or 2 terms.
p.s. Have you seen the Dow Jones today!!!!
1
Isn't Melania Trump's signature program a campaign to stop cyberbullying?
3
“Law abiding” and “Trump” should never exist in the same sentence.
2
In any other era, none of this behavior would be tolerated. This President exhibits moral corruption almost daily, and each time all it does is raise the bar to a new standard of acceptability. Taken individually most of these instances don’t meet the standard of high crimes and misdemeanors. Taken collectively, with a continual obsession for deceitful, deceptive and outright lying behavior, the aggregate unquestionably indicates Trump’s unsuitability. Trump frankly can’t help himself, he’s psychology impaired, but those who are complicit in supporting this lying, narcissistic charade presumably can, if so desired.
3
Trump survives because a corrupt Republican Congress would prefer to endanger the US Constitution and criticize the Constitution than to say anything negative about Trump.
Nixon left because the Republican Party used to have some members with principles. The single one, Justin Amash, was drummed out of the Republican party for putting his country over his corrupt President.
4
“Educated-liberal revulsion with Trump’s style”. This country has fallen into a deeper abyss than I thought if you characterize the disgust at Trump’s behavior as simply liberally Political Correct. It is based on common human decency People are tolerating his obscenities for a desperate last gasp for power in a changing world. Shame on them.
7
I don’t buy Ross Doubthat theories.
Trump is where he is, not only because of the Republicans in the Congress and his base but because the journalist who are supposed to call out the lies ( which is their obligation) are not calling it out in simple straight forward language. It’s not limited to FOX only, who are at least openly on the side of lies but some opinion writers in NYT, WAPO etc also. They can’t make up their mind if it’s time to call out a spade a spade, a lier a lier, misogynist a misogynist, an extortionist an extortionist. Until that happens these kind of analysis has no value
3
Spot on. The cattle graze contentedly and oblivious until they are led to the slaughter house.
2
How about the view that Republicans in general and conservatives in particular are moral hypocrites.
2
Half the populace is at the other half's throats, hate crimes and mass shootings are increasing, the federal government is unraveling, the country is on the brink of dictotorship. That's your idea of stability?
5
I would not argue that it is a time of stability - more a time of anxiety. What stupid thing will Trump do next and will America be able to recover and who is left in the administration to do the recovering.
3
The lesson of the Trump fiasco is that the Republican Party is so greedy and power-hungry that they have abandoned the Constitution, the rule of law and decency as they willingly and aggressively promote and support the ignorant, incompetent Trump - a servant of Vladimir Putin. The lesson is that the Republican Party have become traitors to our country and no longer serve the interests of the people of the United States.
6
I must admit sadly that, although I have read the NY Times, the Washington Post, The Guardian daily & listened faithfully to Anderson Cooper every day on 360, watched the debates, the impeachment hearings & other such gobsmacking Congress hearings (ie Kavanaugh) for the past 3 yrs - ok, I don't have a life, as I am mostly bedridden with MS - but Trump's administration has been the most in-depth history lesson I've had in my 78 yrs of life in Canada about our neighbour to the south. I've followed the whole sorry saga exactly as one reads or watches a British detective/murder mystery - constantly unfolding hr by hr.
I finally have reached even my seemingly limitless limit. If I see his face, the thrust of his shoulders & chest, hear his voice, listen to panelists & pundits ponder over one more lie, I am undone. The mere thought that Americans could vote him in for another term scares the bejesus out of so many allies.
Please, stop the madness.
9
The high bar for considering impeachment has been lowered by the trial of Clinton for lying about sex. Trump breaks all records for non-presidential behavior. It seems like he gets up early, pushes his briefing books aside (written by deep-state actors), studies his twitter feed, re-tweets some regrettable items. insults some people, commends somebody who loves him. Then it's on to television. More tweeting. More insults, maybe he issues a few threats and orders some federal actions from the keypad of his phone. If weekend is approaching it may be time to bundle his entire entourage onto Air Force1 for a visit to one of his golf clubs at public expense. On the way he can complain about how much various "hoaxes" and "witch-hunts" are costing. But remember the bar has been lowered. Bull markets do not last forever. And Trump is a record-breaker. He will probably be impeached more than once.
4
Wonders never cease. I think Ross is right.
3
This is an astonishing piece of hokum. The disaster is right in front of everyone's eyes. Just because 1/3 of the country doesn't see it or recognize it doesn't mean the rest of us do not.
Arguments that start from the premise that the "American people" think this that or the other thing are specious by definition.
5
Ross,
I was a Republican in 1974, and I am a Democrat now. It became sadly clear to me in early 1974 that it is a high crime for a president of one party to conspire to break into an office of the other party.
President Trump's crimes are significantly higher crimes than President Nixon's.
3
False equivalency alert....false equivalency alert...
In what way, exactly, have the Democrats "swung to an ideological extreme," Mr. Douthat?
2
Trump is a rabbits foot for the S&P, and we’re the rabbit.
1
@Sarah
Pay attention, all of you who make this complaint about extremism - THE POLICIES OF BERNIE, et.al. are extremist in AMERICA. Maybe not in Europe. But, here at home they are unacceptable to the majority.
Try a different argument. like decency vs indecency.
3
@minimum Don’t get sick.
2
So you argue that one should not (or could not) remove a criminal and corrupt president from office unless an major disaster is in progress? That speaks poorly of the rule of law and American leadership in the world, especially when there is clear and present danger that the elections are being rigged by the president himself colluding with America's foreign adversaries.
While there are some extreme historical examples of your theory (the rise and fall of Hitler in Germany), I would HOPE that Americans are more vigilant.
4
He survives because of people like YOU Ross Douthat! YOU enabled him and his supporters and only recently have YOU changed YOUR tune.
6
Scandals?
Trump is running a crime syndicate out of the White House.
6
If Trump survives and may be even become reelected it goes to show that the American Constitution does not protect the country from lawless Presidents. Germany in the 30's was a democracy but was not protected against Adolf Hitler who had dictatorial ambitions. One of his promises was to make Germany Great Again.
4
That Douthat doesn't see the disasters right in front of him is just as much a willful form of ignorance as every Republican coward in Congress who doesn't see a criminal president.
3
How about Crimes, Ross. Does that work for you?
4
I have always voted Democrat, I despise Trump and, born as I was in France 3 months before VE-Day, Mussolini and Hitler have made me allergic to populism. With all that, I remember the many ways I minimized, in my mind, the transgressions of Bill Clinton, that led to his impeachment in the House only to be acquitted in the Senate (spoiler: this time will be a replay). So I forgive my Republican friends for their craven hypocrisy and I wish my fellow Democrats would spend more effort presenting us with a list of candidates that are neither crazy leftists nor brain dead centrist (I do like you Mayor Pete, but your time hasn’t come ...yet). Sigh ...
3
For the last three years I've been praising Barack Obama for leaving this country in good enough shape that we could afford to waste time on a Trump Presidency.
If Mr. Douthat is correct, I'll have to rethink that.
1
Oooohhh!!!!!! I like that, Republicans were more honorable in 1974.
Stop there, and agree.
And where.....are they now?
Kevin McCarthy: “There’s two people I think Putin pays: Rohrabacher and Trump (republicans surrounding laugh)......Swear to God"
5
Ross:
Really? Your going full on Captain Obvious to day that Americans are either too stupid, too complacent, or too jaded that the Majority of Voters (not the electoral college) would keep a racketeering mobster as the leader of the free world? Give us a little credit...
Love,
The Actual Majority whose votes don’t Count
3
If voters truly don't care about the rule of law, our founding principles, or the competence of their elected leaders then we do not have a country. We have a bunch of people drifting around asking "am I better off than I was four years ago".
Reagan in many ways was our death knell.
4
Trump voters would like to see non heterosexuals incarcerated for their sexual behavior, rape victims forced to give birth even if it endangers or destroys their health, non whites reduced to second class status, women denied economic and legal equality, immigration of non europeans halted and the ascendancy of religious belief over civil rights or some combination of the above.
Race hatred and religious bigotry run rampant through a portion of our population similar to the prejudice that inflamed 1930s Germany. Feed hatred, breed lawlessness and violence. And, like Hitler, a leader who will feed that hate will be excused anything.
4
Keep it simple, stupid. "KISS".
Trump will be re-elected.
The lurid bottom line is this:
it is to be expected!
The business of America
is business, plain and simple.
The rest is esoterica.
Its morals? Just a pimple.
Keep it simple, stupid. "KISS".
America won’t swerve.
The wisdom we all have is this:
we get what we deserve.
Who cares that Trump is everything
we never thought we’d be?
Guess what? It’s us who voted him.
There’s nothing here to see.
If we want change, our pocketbooks
must hurt beyond belief.
If they do not, don’t mind the looks.
The Don will be our chief.
2
Trump's survival is a perfect storm. The Trump phenomenon is made possible by a confluence of factors like a legislative branch controlled by lobbyists owned by billionaires, gerrymandering, an electoral college, and a low information society fed on internet conspiracy theory and 24 hour cable propaganda. Ironically, the populists that support Trump have been voting against their own self interests for decades, creating the vicious cycle of their own demise-- see the opioid crisis, the price of college, the labor movement, red state public education, and the status of the rust belt.
5
The more I see and hear about all this, the more I think about the lyrics in Simmons & Garfunkel's "Sounds of Silence".
I agree with Ross on this. If the average American has their beer and cable TV, and no one is foreclosing on their home, they probably can let the Constitution gather dust.
6
Ross Douhat likes to pigeonhole everyone. Douhat thinks “liberals” and their idea, for example, of healthcare for all is radical. Note to Douhat: No country has ever achieved healthcare for all without a Medicare for all-like system with heavy government control. In post WWII advanced democratic countries “liberals” and their progressive ideas are considered NORMAL. Only in fascist authoritarian countries are “liberal” ideas considered radical. Mr. Douhat please quit peddling your nonsense that “liberals” are radical and all the false equivalencies you conjure up for your writings. Get normal, and while your at it, tell your Republican Party sympathicos to do likewise.
7
The time to defuse a bomb is before it blows up, the time to remove a cancer is before it metastasizes, the time to start addressing climate change is before you to need to redraw coastal maps, the time to save your dying democracy is while you still get to vote.
The time to remove the unstable, corrupt, racist,
xenophobic authoritarian Trump is now.
Tick ... tick ... tick ...
6
He should be tried for crimes against humanity for separating nursing infants from their mothers and locking them in cages!!
6
@Homebase There is no evidence that nursing infants were separated from their mothers and locked in cages. A single anecdote describing such a practice was debunked. If you can prove otherwise, please do so.
1
Hmmmmm, didn’t a fairly recent President who was impeached, but not convicted once say: “it’s the economy stupid”??
38
@stevevelo Actually, I believe it was James Carville, Presidential election advisor who said that, but you do have the correct Presidency.
6
@stevevelo
And they impeached President Clinton with the Whitewater investigation which was about Clinton's personal finances before he was president.
It went on for 4-1/2 years at a cost of $100 Million in today's dollars.
I'd go for that for Trump.
4
@stevevelo - No, James Carville was neither president nor impeached.
3
Donald Trump's presidency, his willing enablers, the insulting stupidity, the cravenness and, finally, the sheer exhaustion of it all has done one thing for me: I fear death less than I used to. Whatever happens after, it'll be a relief to be free of all this horrible, wasteful nonsense.
4
Don’t look now Ross, it’s bad -- Trump just shot our military's honor down on Fifth Avenue and is getting away with it.
Please Dear G-d, give us a stock market collapse.
That's the only thing left that will get rid of him.
5
I am a Trump supporter who stands by him because of my horror at some of the liberal Progressive policies of the Democrats, and the demand that we reject all standards of common sense and survival in the name of the planetary greater good. We have tens of thousands of would be migrants on the other side of the Mexican border, and Americans who demand that they enter without undergoing any scrutiny as to whether they stand any chance of supporting themselves in our nation. We have people in tent cities on the sidewalks of our major cities, and Americans who think it's understandable and acceptable that they're defecating in the storm sewers. Both parties are ignoring the deficit, but I stand a better chance of a Republican Administration quietly putting the brakes on some expenditures (that's happening already) than I do with a self-righteous Democratic Administrrtion that wants, for example, to give 100 billion dollars to the developing nations to promote renewable energy, while totally not mentioning that China, one of the recipients of such UN funding in the past, opens a coal fired energy plant every week. And I can't afford to vote on the basis of "don't worry, they'll take office and never get any of their ideas through Congress". So yes, I'll go try and reach my Democratic House Member this holiday weekend at a town hall and tell him how very little I care about the Ukraine having to wait a few months for their military aid.
2
@Mary I'm hearing a lot of me, me and mine in your weak rationalization for supporting a criminal thug.
How would you like it if your children, as infants and minors, were taken from you, put in cages, then sent away, while you were sent hundreds of miles in the opposite direction, such that you never found them again?
How would you like it if your Social Security check, or your unemployment benefits, or the heat and electric that runs through your home were withheld from you at the precise moment when you needed them most, to benefit some well-fed ogre who had no legal right to do so, and then lied about it?
What if fire fighters or EMS passed up your house just when you were crying out in distress? What if you or your spouse died while the services were withheld?
Did your offense deserve the crippling remedy imposed?
A liberal is one "who does not refer to any specific past tradition or scheme while discovering a new solution to a present problem or issue." Period. If you knew any liberals, one might tell you that.
Apparently you live a life which never requires you walk a few steps in the shoes of others. Unfortunately, 62 million others believe as you do. They are as foreign to objectivity and empathy for others as they are to moral judgement.
4
I guess having a criminal for a president doesn’t matter to you. Sigh.
3
I really think you are on to something here.
Yes, those deck chairs are arranged real purty there......
3
This is where I stopped reading: "Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme." Ideological extreme? Really? Really???
Douthat's argument, that the times more than the misdeeds, determine the outcome of impeachment of the president, is deeply flawed. We would not exonerate a murderer or a bank robber if the crime was committed in a hurricane rather than on a sunny day. We would not condone a Hitler because the alternative might be government extremely ideologically dedicated to basic human rights.
Enough with the argument for a morality of "situational criminality!"
4
Disasters? The criminal-incompetent trump and his equally foul republican party are walking, breathing, evil, cruel disasters. Sadistic, ugly, deceitful disasters...If these sub-human horrors are not disasters, please define them as otherwise? Are they noble? Are they compassionate? Are they patriotic? (They are selling us out to Russia, piece by piece!) Are they moral? Decent? Do they have integrity and good character? NO! They are a collective disaster; the antithesis of what is right, good, and honorable. You just have to listen to the lying mouths of nunes, jordan, meadows, pence, kennedy, stefanik, ratcliffe, conway, miller, and the biggest, loudest, lying mouth of all--trump--and you need know nothing more in order to define these monsters.
5
just plain wrong, with a sneer. I was there. economic conditions were not a factor in Nixon's downfall. and sneering at Democrats for rightly denouncing newt's impeachment of Clinton is simply a pathetic ruse.
1
If Democrats stood by their choice HRC instead of hit piece after hit piece on her integrity we would not be having this endless conversation about the latest Trump travesty. I am talking about you NYT you had a reporter that couln't say enough about her frigging emails. How trivial that all seems today. Now you know the consequences of idenity politics. Yes you need a voice but when it comes down to the election hold your damn nose and vote for the one who will make your life less miserable. Trump did nothing for people of color, LBGT voters, or those who are poor. Everytime I see a column about how bad Trump is, I think about how great it would of been if we just voted for HRC.
5
All Ross Douthat is stating here is that the typical American voter doesn't rise to the ankles of the Founders, who made sure that there was a mechanism to respond to abuse of executive power - irrespective of the alleged condition of the economy or the nation.
Douthat also demonstrates just how out of touch he is with both the typical working American and with the facts about the US economy and the US role in the world.
Trump has made sure that every American institution would be attacked and undermined - from executive agencies to Congress to the courts to every consensus domestic and foreign policy and every historic American value and norm.
As to the state of the economy, Trump's farmer bailout is already more than twice as expensive as Obama's automaker bailout - but for a problem solely of his own creation: the disastrous tariff war with China. The deficit is rising and the national debt is entering the stratosphere, yet the nation has nothing to show for it in terms of infrastructure enhancements, a social safety net, let alone the US at the helm of global stability and international cooperation.
The state of the nation and the world could hardly be worse, and the corruption in the White House has reached historical and unsustainable levels.
This is precisely the situation the Founders created the impeachment power for.
4
Ross Douthat would argue that since Hitler was democratically elected and popular, it is fine that he was not removed for failing to follow democratic principles.
Richard Nixon was elected in a sweeping landslide of the popular vote. Nixon won nearly every state and was far more popular than Trump.
Ross Douthat must be very angry that in the 1970s, some of his fellow Republicans didn't refuse to impeach. Douthat would rather attack those nasty Republicans who supported impeaching Nixon for not listening to their constituents than recognize that they did the right thing.
1
The impeachment process did not change many American minds once the testimony was over. Those who want to impeach and remove still do and those who do not still do not. The Democrats thought they had in nipped in the bud but they were wrong. The longer this impeachment process goes on the more unpopular they will become. They are hurting their election chances for 2020 but it surely helps keep President Trump in office and the Republicans gain seats in congress snd the senate.
So we wait for a "disaster" before impeaching? Which in this case would mean, what, a Russian takeover of Urkraine? Or of our own White House? (Putin's Poodles should know their way around the place, having received a Trump-led tour on the day after FBI Director Comey was fired.)
I am so tired of walking on eggshells around this bizarre buffoon. Impeach, remove, return to the rule of law and protect all future elections from the Trumps and Trumpers.
6
Mr. Douthat may well be right, but it doesn't change the fact that we have somehow managed to elect a man with no concept of what it took in thought and courage to found this nation, the first of all nations to define itself as its inception as the embodiment of the dream of democratic government which the Enlightenment had brought roiling to the surface in a world which had hitherto seldom questioned the need for top-down rule and 'the divine right of kings' (a concept that Mr. Trump undoubtedly espouses). We have elected a man with no moral compass save self-interest, no understanding of a nation of diversity, no idea of serious political thought, no concept of attempting to bridge the political gulfs which divide us, no idea of the actual effort or compassion or humility or courage or simply humanity involved in leading 'the last best hope of the earth', and who lacks the intelligence to do so even if he wanted. Trump is a condemnation of what we have become.
2
I think it’s more like this; all the senators and congressmen and women who are shielding our quisling president from the obvious consequences of his greed and incompetence think, ‘there but for some political god go I’. However, they should understand that when they hang together with this fool of a president, they will quite likely hang together with him.
3
Interesting, but the premise is flawed.
Things are not stable for many. Global warming is accelerating catastrophically. Neo-nazis, hate and harassment are on the rise. Mass shootings continue. A frightening new international alignment is taking place before our eyes. Kids are in cages. ICE is terrorizing American neighborhoods. The TSA is interrogating friends of mine for no reason. The border patrol is filled with radical right wing kooks. Coherent facts are becoming obsolete. Internet behemoths are asserting ever-increasing control. Suicide is rising while life expectancy is dropping.
To accept the above as stability is a racist, Neville Chamberlin style appeasement.
3
@Theo Baker it sounds as if you don't like law enforcement. Since ICE and TSA and Border Patrol protect our country from ILLEGAL aliens and this offends you why would you not want to move to Mexico, just a guess, there is no foundation of law there???
Amazing!
p.s. Global warming is not accelerating. Climate change is (this also includes climate cooling)
Mexico has a system of law. (Compared to Ferguson MO Mexico looks like a city on a hill.) Global warming is accelerating. ICE is locking kids in cages. The TSA is holding and interrogating my friends for no good reason. And the border patrol had a massive Facebook group dedicated to racist tropes.
I support lawful responsible police action. I will never support federal agents coming into my neighborhood and splitting families apart, or sending mentally disabled diabetic men to Iraq to essentially die. Our revolutionary mothers and fathers wouldn’t either, and neither should you.
3
If that is the case why is the NYTs reporting the US is working with the Kurds in E. Syria against ISIS? Cook of the Cook Report stated on C-Span that there is not nearly enough support in the country to remove Trump from office. Despite the herculean efforts by major corporate media outlets and the Democrats they have laid a major goose egg. The neo con aided demolition of Syria seems not to worry the NYTs a whit. Just the removal of Assad and the attendant humiliation of Putin is there mission.
You failed to mention the vastly different propaganda environments between Nixon era vs Clinton onward. We've had conservative radio basically calling liberals cockroaches for 30 years.
5
Trump is a “disaster.”
3
This whole saga is the perfect example of why a two-party political system can't support true democracy. I know very few people who feel truly represented by either major party. Imagine if there was a small group of conservatives who were not part of the GOP and who would take a moral stand for what is right and defend the country and constitution against Trump's destructive corruption and the GOP's lack of integrity, courage or both.
Support real democracy. Support ranked choice and instant runoff elections.
1
Trump survives solely because of Fox news and everyone knows it
4
In other words, American voters are equally as stupid, selfish, and short sighted as those good Germans on the eve of World War II.
History may not repeat, but it certainly rhymes, and when those ignorant Trump voters crawl out of the rubble that was once our great country, they will exclaim, "If only someone had told me, I didn't know, I never imagined, I didn't really support that man, it was those other people who caused my destruction".
4
The Whitewater impeachment was about Clinton's personal finances before he was president.
It went on for 4-1/2 years at a cost of $100 Million in today's dollars.
I'd go for that for Trump.
if we dont vote this guy out in nov. 2020, the chances of civil unrest go way up. the two groups we now have cannot coexist.
For once I agree with you, sir. Many Americans can barely see past the next month and their immediate world. They do not know history or civics; nor do they care because in general their lives are better than 99% of the world's people. They have lived in the lap of luxury of a reasonably ordered country, although one many American's strove and died to create. Unfortunately the economic instability and dangerous world you point to are on their way because of Trumpism. The arc is longer than 2020. He and the craven GOP will leave us with a slow rolling disaster that will surely be blamed on whatever President comes after 2020 or 2024.
2
My suspicions indicate to me that there are several in the media and even a few here that are not 100% in lock step with our President. That's OK just because you may disagree with his demeaner but that doesn't mean you should shun the congratulations for all his good policy efforts and international leadership. I'm sure you will get used to him by his 2nd or 3rd term.
2
" . . . Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme" Thus ending my reading of this story. Most Americans support some version of the policies Democrats propose, Medicare for all, Medicare for more, improving the ACA, expanding Medicaid, public option. Republicans want regulatory rollbacks, tax cuts for the rich and Donald's supporters demonize and dehumanize people of color, especially migrant asylum seekers.
4
If the moral imperative for the impeachment and conviction of the POTUS mainly relies on:
"Is the economy O.K.? Is the world falling apart? "
Then that is a very sad standard indeed.
5
Ah, never mind. No point in discussing anything with a “conservative”. These radicals have pushed an agenda so far afield we are now in an existential crisis for not only our country but humanity as well. The USA will not survive another four years of Trump — not as we know it — as the dictator in training will have had his chops approved by the senate for his next round, that is, if the senate doesn’t boot him out now. The Test of our Constitution will have failed and we will therefore put the whole document on the back burner. Too bad his supporters and pseudo supporters feel comfortable enough to vote him in for another round of insanity while they slowly lose their rights.
Then, there are the two most recently issued reports from scientists heralding climate catastrophe. Climate denier in chief and his minions in Congress will do everything they can to spew increasing tons of CO2 and methane into the atmosphere, insuring the slow demise of humanity within the coming centuries. I guess they’re thinking of waterfront property and a trip to the moon? I guess if this means their supporters are comfortable with things as they are, who am I to argue with them? I may unleash my grandchildren on them, though.
4
"Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
These type of false equivalencies are always dropped in right leaning op-eds. And too often they go unchallenged. Yes, Trump's party is craven and debased, but the ideas from the likes and Warren, Sanders and AOC are not ideologically extreme. Curbing climate change, health care for all, appropriate tax system -- these are conservative values. They only seem ideologically extreme because of how the Grand Old Trump Party has tried to spin that they are extreme. Looks like Douthat has taken the bait. Please, stand up for the conservative values rampant in the Democratic Party, and stop the spin seeded by the real extremists in the Republican Party -- for it's that Trump party that wants to enable global warming, perpetuate oligarchy, and commercialize medicine. The Republicans are craven, debased and ideologically extreme -- get it right.
351
@PE I agree. Since when is a health-care system more in -line with the rest of the Western world (Canada, Great Britain, Germany, France) ideologically extreme?
Ideological extremism is thinking that laissez-faire free-market healthcare would solve the ills among our ill, and that's the policy of quite a few on the right.
34
Spot on PE...especially your last sentence. Douthat should issue a retraction and apology for his misleading and false blanket statement about the Dems.
14
@PE Absolutely right that Douthat is making another false equivalency. Trump is the outcome of a republican party that has been headed in his direction for a very long time. Hurtling into the maw of an indecent man and an indecent presidency. Purple prose perhaps but nonetheless true. And what is this extremism that he talks about. What is extreme about a very wealthy nation providing health care for all its citizens, or welcoming those less fortunate to work within its borders or to make sure that global warming doesn't destroy the earth as we know it. Unless, of course, you are a social darwinist otherwise know as an evolutionist with a silver spoon in his or her mouth.
11
Trump will remain in power in 2020. He will remain in power after 2024. By then, republicans would have abolished elections because they are fake when democrats win, and 'for life' when republicans win. Trump will remain monarch for the rest of his life, and leave behind his heirs to succeed.
All this will be made possible not just by republicans, but centrist and left voters in America who - more than anything else - enjoy being perennial victims - and will not come out to vote for a democratic candidate for virtually any reason.
4
@Kalidan where do we sign up?
1
"Maybe it matters more to Trump’s not good but stable — amazingly stable — approval ratings that he is presiding over a period of general stability, at home and abroad." There's some truth to Mr. Douthat's generalization, but only if one turns a blind eye to the implacable, accelerating dynamics of the changes (geophysical and biological) underway in the growing global climate emergency. While the American public, along with many in other countries, largely continues to overlook (and in some cases flatly deny) these realities, one wishes that no NY Times columnist would not use the paper's platform to blithely encourage, even if just by omission, our whistling while a graveyard looms due to our inaction.
2
Probably the furthest I've read a Douthat column and found myself agreeing with him. But, among other points, it's absurd to tell Trump's opponents that they should rely on defeating him at the ballot box. He was elected in part by the corruption of the 2016 election; he has worked to make 2020 even more corrupt. And by the way, when Trump gets re-elected by a narrow electoral college margin, with say a deficit of 5 million popular votes, where does Douthat think we're going to be as a country?
6
Please spare us all articles like this and others which express similar opinions. They are premature, defeatist and opinionated in nature and are based upon personal predictions of what may transpire in the next year. Neither Mr. Douthat nor others are time tested fortune tellers of what may happen in a year. Please save us the anxiety and dread of contemplating another four years under this administration. Your words make me and so many others more depressed than we already are. Let us enjoy the holidays in peace and hope with all the collective power of our positive thinking and prayers that this national nightmare will soon end. Thank you.
8
Firstly , the economy isn't falling apart, the economy is in transition from industrial to knowledge based and some places like here in Quebec we are desperate for workers as the economy booms while resource based economies try to survive. The world is not falling apart with the greatest peace in human history continuing and for most earthlings life continues to improve.
The prophets of doom and gloom continue to hold sway in America as change renders "conservative" and right-wing ideology continue trying to destroy a world where liberal democracy continues to grow.The problems of an ever growing demand for the goods and services whose abundance continues to grow.
We are kinder gentler and more considerate despite areas where government and corporate power is dependent on alienating us from one another.
The world knows that America was great when it was leading us into a better future and conservatism meant moving forward with caution was understood to be progress not entropy.
America elected to stop moving forward when it elected Reagan. America has continued to grow richer and more powerful yet without its soul and its prime directive of creating a more perfect union all the gold and silver sees America close to death.
My ancestors fled Ukraine a century and a half ago and as Ukraine falls in love with truth, justice and the American way the USA reverts back to the British Civil War and its barbarity, hatred and superstition.
8
Here's the "thing" as tv commentators are wont to remark. Nixon was deservedly impeached because there was still a sliver of comity in politics. LBJ convinced southern racists to support civil rights. Barry Goldwater marched up to the White House to give Nixon his marching orders. The isle separating the right from the left has broadened and deepened. It is now an unbreachable moat. What was once a dialog is now a shouting match, a high school football game between rival communities where winning is not the most important thing, its the only thing. Huntley, Brinkley and Walter Kronkite have been transmogrified into Sean Hannity and Racheal Maddow.
Yeats in his great poem "The second coming" declaimed "the center cannot hold". The center has disappeared and the multitudes fiddle while the planet burns.
5
In which case any strategy congressional Democrats pursue or any defense served up by Jim Jordan or Lindsey Graham matters less to Trump’s fate than the answers to two basic questions: Is the economy O.K.? Is the world falling apart?
How sad that a third question isn't asked: Is the US falling apart?
6
I agree that it would take the slap in the face of a disaster to move an over-whelming majority to impeach; however, I disagree that Trump was elected in the midst of chaos. It was actually the relative stability brought on during the Obama administration that gave Republican voters the freedom and comfort to embrace the fantasy of Trump. The current sense of stability is American industry just running as usual. The only immediate changes are the scales tilting more favorably to the rich and a general shift in climate of owning the liberals.
The past 3 years has had it's share of chaos with the immigration crisis, trade wars and domestic gun violence and terrorism. The disastrous effects of this administration's policies and incompetence will not be immediately felt so the cultural war that the country is having with itself may persist.
7
If you are a traditional Republican, there is a disaster that's already happened, namely the take-over of the party by the populists. There does appear to be "one last chance" to turn that tide, which would be for 20+ Republican senators to vote to convict Trump and throw him out of office, and then try to reconstruct a "decent" Republican party. Aside for this (highly unlikely but doable) scenario, the only other late-breaking tipping point that could turn everyone, even the populists themselves, against Trump would be evidence that there has been collusion with Russia, after all. If this is true, evidenced by someone like John Bolton via revelations about Trump's communications with Putin, that should do it (and the populists at the rallies could be told "don't worry, we'll just replace Trump with Pence.").
5
A large percentage, if not most, voters vote on the basis of what effects them personally. The fact that Mr. Trump asked for favors from the Ukraine in exchange for giving them funding does not impact their daily life; a bad economy leading to high prices or job losses does, as does an international crisis leading to their children being deployed overseas. Those of us of a certain age will remember Tip O'Neil's dictum that all politics are local; it goes even farther in many cases, from local to personal.
There are certainly ideological voters, for whom political overreach by a President are very important issues and who will be influenced by the testimony during the impeachment hearings; but for many it is just Washington hi-jinks and of little import to their day to day life.
1
I think the writer is spot on. Nevertheless, it seems still morally, if not necessarily effective in the shorter run, to push through an impeachment without the slightest hope of a conviction, relying instead on ultimate public fatigue with Trumpo's daily, constant behavior to win out at the polls. I still remember how the near-constant, drip, drip of Jimmy Carter sanctimony finally pushed me to vote for the sunny disposition of Ronald Regan, even though I disagreed with much of his simplistic dogma - just to get Jimmy off the air and out of daily sight! That may yet be our salvation.
@Old Bob Let's leave President Carter alone. For starters, how about the Camp David agreement between Israel and Egypt, that has held now for almost 40 years. That was hard diplomacy at work. But I do also agree that Reagan had a sunny personality. And, speaking hard diplomacy, he did help end the Soviet Union. As for Trump? The words "surly" and "in your face" come to mind, as well as just "stupid."
Trump is a paradox.
He is a disaster for our democracy.
But his destructiveness generates constant interest in politics!
Yes, Trump is tearing the Constitution apart.
And Democrats and critics seem powerless to stop him.
I hope the Democrats wake up and that they focus on solutions.
Democrats need to stay interesting, with drama and goals.
Democrats need to stop rambling on and on, and get interesting.
I suggest using the "Democracy" song (Leonard Cohen, 1992)
"Democracy is coming to the USA"
Also, I hope the NY Times discusses the "Democracy" song.
"Democracy is coming to the USA"
I agree with Douthat about having modesty about your opinions, especially the opinion that things have been more stable under Trump. Trump has been the single most destabilizing force in government EVER! We've had more chaos with his hand-picked minions being fired and reprimanded than with any other president. He's lied and betrayed the ideals of the constitution more than any other president in history. If there is any stability to be found in Trump, it would be in the consistency of his destabilizing actions.
7
Let’s take the radical step of actually listening to what Trump supporters say they think they’re getting from their support of Trump and what they say they were getting from others prior to Trump.
Let’s take the latter first: what they were getting was what the late political philosopher Sheldon Wolin called “managed democracy.” The “new class” in American politics, college-educated and believers in social engineering (by both the right and the left) and well-connected to the instruments of manipulation, including the ubiquitous social media, they’ve pretty much made clear that what they think we’ve had has not been genuine democracy.
And what they’ve now got may be chaos, but it’s closer to what democracy means than “managed democracy.” Is it worse?—well, yes, probably. Are they being manipulated by Trump and his henchmen, formerly called Democrats? Well, yes, certainly. Are they aware of it? Often, not.
But we nevertheless need to listen. There’s also some truth in listening.
2
@rjon What the...? Should be “formerly called Republicans”...my dyslexia is showing.
Trump is, by all evidence shown thusfar, a criminal. He violated campaign laws, obstructed justice (vide Mueller), committed sexual assaults, set up a fraudulent charity for his personal benefit, attempted bribery. But no smoking gun...UNLESS his tax returns are investigated and found to be fraudulent. That would be his Al Capone moment.
Could happen, and documentary evidence of fraud cannot be denied or minimized or interpreted to be anything other than a high crime, worthy of removal from office.
6
I've come to this conclusion: conservatives believe the "abuses" (whatever those may be) of President Obama are no worse than what Trump is doing now. As insane as it sounds, I believe it must be true. Obama was never impeached. Obama was born in the USA. Obama used majorities in congress to pass legislation. Nothing illegal. Yet conservatives view his "strong handedness" in passing ACA as some sort of affront that Trump is correcting. I know people who could easily brush everything Trump does under the rug and sleep at night thinking "Obama did worse". Not sure what you do with that sort of attitude.
7
It's true, in many ways the world feels somewhat "stable".
E.g., economically - we haven't seen the dire consequences of Trump's reckless tax cut ... yet. The health care industry hasn't collapsed ... yet. We haven't gone to war with country XXX ... yet. We haven't seen catastrophic, world-wide climate change disasters ... yet.
These awful eventualities are (to my thinking) inevitable and the only thing keeping them from happening ... yet, is that there are a lot of very good, technically proficient individuals working very hard behind the scenes to "still the waters".
But, those individuals are leaving the government in droves and they are being replaced by incompetent know-nothings.
Another term with Trump as president will, I fear, see all of those "yets" converted into certain, unequivocal facts.
2
When Douthat accuses the Democrats of ‘swinging to an ideological extreme’ I presume he’s talking about their belief that no American should die or go bankrupt because they get sick?
9
How Trump survives.
People like Douthat. That is how.
9
The President leveraged a foreign government for political gain, all the while aiding a long term hostile power.
Richard Nixon was a piker who oversaw coverup of silly domestic burglary. That's a scandal.
Trump directly and indirectly has aided an enemy that poses an existential threat. Trump fomented a disaster in the making.
Russia is the enemy. What don't you understand about that, Ross?
5
Sorry to say this, but bring on the recession.
122
Schadenfreude? Progressives will better survive a downturn than the majority of Trump’s base.
7
@Michelle
Spoken from a true position of privilege.
8
@T. Warren I'm nowhere near privileged....but if a recession will hasten the demise of Trump and the Republicans, by all means bring it on.
22
This is how a conservative religious intellectual prays for Trump.
3
I do think Ross is on to something. Many people simply do not pay close attention to the daily drum beat surrounding Trump. Rather, they go about their lives accompanied by an impressionistic sense of what is happening in the broader world. Feeling relatively safe and economically secure can take the sting off reservations many might have over even a vile leader.
112
@Jeffrey Waingrow Oddly enough, following the Trump news day to day can arguably lead to the same vague sense of stability, too. If the only bad news that hits the headlines every day is about Trump, one might start to get the sense that it's a slow news day everywhere else. It's an erroneous perception, of course, but strangely one that you can arrive at either way.
12
@Jeffrey Waingrow They don't pay attention to it because, unlike the economy that affects their job or the international news that may send their son into harm's way, they see no change to their life if Mr. Trump did or did not pressure the Ukraine over aid.
9
@michaelscody I don't think you can paint everyone the same way and that's a pretty negative outlook. Life is busy, difficult and often overwhelming and the reasons for which someone may or may not pay attention to something, especially something like American politics, are infinite.
4
Criminals are 'wildly entertaining', look at the percentage of TV shows that are about crime.
As we watch Trump and his lackey's, we see Reality Crime Show TV.
Yes, 'entertaining'.
Like a forest fire is oddly fascinating to watch.
But in this case, we are the trees.
And there is no fire department with a water stream strong enough to put this fire out.
It's getting scary. Like about 1933.
3
You cannot credibly discuss Trump's robust support without including racism.
Trump is assured re-election for one vital reason: he is the champion of white racists and xenophobes.
His devoted followers don't care about his love affair with Putin his betrayal of the Kurds or his corruption.
All they care about is that Trump is going all out to keep America white and slamming the door to immigrants.
4
Trump wanted a reality tv show and the Democrats gave him one. The editorial pages here give him it in written form yet you still haven’t learned that this just helps him more and more by discrediting your “objective” reporting. A person who reads this paper must think of it slightly better than the Enquirer whenever it reports on Trump. Days of Trumps.
2
And now The New York Ties punditocracy, perched at the top of the journalism hierarchy (and what could be more "privileged"?) sorts through the wreckage of their coup attempt. How odd--Mr. Douthat never once mentions the most obvious reason that the Schiff Circus failed: there's an election in a year, stupid!
If anything, this column perfectly illustrates the inbuilt arrogance of our New York/Washington deep-thinkers--Trump may be a man of many deficiencies (most of them stylistic), but he is the devil we know and a firebreak against the moralizing, finger-pointing and guilt-dispensing ultra-left.
We in fly-over country are frankly tired of this elite; we fear their unlimited desire to revolutionize our country more than what we have seen of Trump. We can live with his defects; we are scared to death about the left-mob being uncorked.
3
Mr Douthat is giving too much energy to why so many Americans still give criminal trump a thumbs up. The reality is that we are living in a post Obama era & all the racist are sticking like glue to their master.
3
Unfortunately, disasters are also great ways for would-be dictators to rationalize to the public "emergency measures" that suspend the rule of law and thereby end democracy, shoehorning them and a handful of fanatics into total power. And where there is no convenient disaster, one can always be invented. Reichstag fire? Invaders from the south? Coup staged by the Democrats? The current impeachment is not based on scandal but criminal bribery of a foreign government. Our country is under major threat by the monster in the White House. We minimize this threat to our imminent peril.
3
Stability and instability have become largely a matter of how the media presents them -- and who is paying attention to which of those media. To those on the left, things are going to hell in a flaming hand basket -- to those on the right, Trump is finally restoring America to its rightful place in history, and his critics are loathsome turncoats.
Trump has got most of us used to his soap opera scandals by now. Soon, SCOTUS decisions will support his dictates. I agree with Mr Douthat -- only a disaster will provide a rude awakening for enough people to jump the Trump ship. And who knows whether we'll all be sunk by then or not.
1
This has been over 3 years of disaster now, Ross.
OK, Ross Douthat, you're telling us that it will take a disaster, a catastrophe, an Armageddon to remove President Trump from office? OK, will he survive? Just askin'
1
"It’s possible to persuade these lukewarm voters to turn on him". Kind of like the analysis: lukewarm, warmed over, blah.
Douthat is an apologist for Trump and his base, including the Republican party.
1
Democrats and their desire to gut our military are a threat to our national security. They call Republicans criminals and racists, while they actively try to hand Putin a win by wrecking our economy. Not going to happen while Trump is in office.
Nope.
The lesson of post-Nixon impeachments is:
Nothing a Republican POTUS can do is impeachable. Not violating marital oath and paying off porn stars in violation of election law, not violating oaths of office, undermining national security for personal gain, not soliciting foreign interference in elections, not enabling family and friends to cash in, not using federal contracts to reward friends and punish those whom you don't think aren't adequately obeisant (Microsoft over Amazon), obstructing justice, undermining our allies and promoting the interests and reputations of enemies and dictators, etc, etc.
But, lie just once about extra-marital sex while Democrat..
"Vales Voters"? Yeah, right....
2
Mr. Douthat, you miss what is right before your eyes.
This presidency IS a disaster!
Right, Ross. Oral sex in private, between 2 consenting adult persons (Clinton) is the same as engaging thieves to break into private offices to obtain dirt on a political enemy (Watergate), as both offense are judged by sets of identical partisan eyes.
And 'general heuristics'?? The heuristic of Trump is his twitter rants, and whatever Hannity rants. Also, that he's a white supremacist, a wealthy oaf, liar and scofflaw, who is taking revenge on the country for renting 1600 Pennsylvania to a colored couple.
4
the next disaster is unfolding right now. Russia is doing a great job of splitting up the country and Putin is using Trump as his puppet to destroy us.
3
Let’s look at what government should be focused on:
-gun control
-infrastructure
-global warming
-stamping out extreme wealth concentration
-universal healthcare
Europe and Canada have these things. Americans overwhelmingly want them. We don’t have them, and we never will. Why? Because our government was long-ago purchased by the highest bidder. It simply can’t act in the interest of the majority (if it ever could).
Trump gives us the true face of the overlords - arrogant hypocrisy and infantile narcissism. Obama gave us the traditional cloaking devices - extreme, PC-dripping sanctimony and mind-numbing bromides. which is closer to the truth?
This administration - which is everyday accused of weakening institutions - is actually engaged in a useful idiots’ exercise of inadvertently undermining many of the support columns of our unaccountable political class. Things like executive privilege and universal immunity. All the “rats” are lining up to testify. The White House will never be the same.
1
trump is a disaster, so I don't really understand what more it takes. Unless he starts shooting people and even then I wonder if the Republicans would care. After all he did brag about it.
And when that catastrophe happens, we have the least qualified, least competent, and laziest president in American history to deal with it. What could go wrong?
Trump survives because Republicans aren’t patriots.
I don’t consider them Americans.
Support Trump? You are no American.
1
I live in the middle of a bunch of soybean farmers all of whom Trump has turned into welfare queens----on the dole of the federal government. Yes, the soybean farmers are now affirmed socialists due to Trump's tariffs. They don't seem to perceive the irony and, of course, will vote again for Herr Fuhrer again in 2020, a notion confirmed by a facebook message sent to me by nearest neighbor advising me to send a Happy Thanksgiving message to "our wonderful President." Imagine Trump unburdened by the need to seek another re-election. I doubt that it will temper his behavior.
2
Time to subpoena the God, DT, Mini me (Trump Jr.), the baby face son in law and the goddess "The daughter". America wants to hear the truth nothing but the truth from this family. Dont forget Huckabee sanders, Lindsay Graham, Jim Jordon, Rudy and his best buddy David Nunez. We need to hear from them "The Truth, nothing but the Truth".
Reply
I haven't looked at a Douthat column in years, and was just reminded why.
You forgot to mention Nixon had a secret plan to end the Vietnam War — “Keep fighting for five years and then escape on a helicopter.”
What "emergency" brought on Clinton's impeachment?
For once the NYT opinionaters make a modicum of sense. Trump will not be removed from office and if the hapless Democrats want a chance at winning the election, they need to present a clear case as to why the country would be better off with them at the helm. So far, they aren't exactly killing it (see Bloomberg).
38
@Robert
The country's institutions are in tatters because of Trump's corruption. Our government is cozy with one of our determined foes (Russia). Our deficit is spiraling. Wages are stagnant and the economy is tenuous. How could the country not be better off without a man who works only for his own interest at the helm?
31
@Eric
Your average American cares about keeping his job and putting food on the table, and nobody among the Democrats are promising to do anything about stagnant wages that Americans of all political stripes now complain about. The integrity of hallowed institutions and foreign policy chess are all cerebral matters for political nerds to worry about.
6
@T. Warren That's just not true. Warren and Sanders and Yang are all talking about the drastic income inequality and taking it on.
I agree that to win, Democrats need to talk about the problems facing people and stop thinking that Trump is the source of all our nation's ills.
But, there is something to be said for the importance of our institutions. We got decades of wage stagnation because Americans looked only at what was right in front of them and ignored the future. Short-term gain outweighed long-term gain in their voting habits. We shouldn't make that same mistake today.
19
If I believed in miracles, I’d say it’s one that Trump has not yet precipitated a catastrophe. And I certainly don’t wish for one. But I wouldn’t mind seeing his picture in the history books with a scarlet ‘i’.
"even his fiercest critics should prefer stability, and the necessity of defeating him at the ballot box, to the Something Worse that might expedite his fall."
If the Something Worse is inevitable by the end of a Trump second term, and there is 50-50 chance of his being reelected, then Something Worse now is the better alternative.
We were a little more than a week away from seeing the military aid to Ukraine expire when the IG stepped forward with the whistleblower complaint. There were little more than 100 hours left before the clock would run out when the hold on aid was lifted.
So, it didn't happen does not mean nothing should happen. Otherwise, unsuccessful felons like Richard Colvin Reid would be walking the streets.
Republicans need to ask themselves what would have been the "unintended consequences" for Ukraine had the aid not gone through. After all, the ranking member on the House Intelligence Committee, Devin Nunes told us President Trump doesn't really like the Ukraine. Remember, the Kurds were weren't angels, either.
Everyone "in the loop" put politics above national security in making this quid pro quo reality. They were committing bribery to attain their goals in a manner antithetical to U.S. policy.
Had they been successful it would have been a win for Putin, as Zelensky would be weakened. If Trump didn't release the aid, it would have been a much bigger win for Putin, as Ukraine would be vulnerable to further incursion by his troops.
Also, Putin cannot be allowed to win by ignoring our Constitution and "leave it to the people decide impeachment" at the ballot box. That is not the American way, as none of this has been.
1
With the November 3, 2020 election now less than 12 months away, the primary value of the Democrats' impeachment hearings well may be to have turned over the rock on the Republicans' out of touch, party-before-country governing philosophy. I wouldn't be surprised if someone like Ohio's Rep. Jim Jordan actually thinks he has come out of these hearings looking good.
1
I think Douthat’s explanation is not that convincing. He looks beyond the impeachable conduct itself to its context, e.g. the economy, the presence of a world crisis, etc. A simpler explanation is that the Democrats simply haven’t made their case. Even Schiff seems to be in a thoughtful phase signaling defeat. The countdown to the elections continues apace, but the Democrats seem wistfully focused on the past rather than on the future.
What is needed is not disasters. What is needed is an opposition party that can stop worrying about what its donors think and start worrying more about what the voters think. An opposition that can summon moral courage that goes beyond virtue-signaling. But they don't, because they can't, because being in Congress is such an amazing racket, just the way it is. To actually upset the DC status quo would require breaking a lot of people's rice bowls, and neither Polosi nor Schumer nor anyone else except Sanders, AOC, and the Squad are willing to do that. Never forget: The Dems could have brought Emolument charges against Trump practically from Day One. Why didn't they? Because that's just a little too close to what they do themselves. What do they do instead? They wait until the year before the next election to bring charges. So Republicans can accuse them of only doing this for political advantage. Great! Instead of solid financial crime, we get this comedy-ready charge, even if you assume it is true, custom-made for Republicans to call "a lot of fuss about a phone call." Ah, Democrats, always "fighting for you" and always losing.
2
Fox News - that's how Trump survives.
241
@SDC
Trump is a paradox.
He is a disaster for our democracy.
But his destructiveness yields constant interest in politics!
Yes, Trump is tearing the Constitution apart.
And Democrats and critics seem powerless to stop him.
I hope Democrats wake up and that they focus on solutions.
Democrats need to stay interesting, with drama and goals.
Democrats need to stop rambling on, and get interesting.
I suggest using the "Democracy" song (Leonard Cohen)
"Democracy is coming to the USA"
Also, I hope the NY Times discusses the "Democracy" song.
"Democracy is coming to the USA"
3
@SDC Bingo!
7
@SDC I AGREE. Every other explanation fails in comparison.
5
Ross never seems to want to actually grapple with Trump's bad behavior and its risk to the country. The recent intrusion into military justice is but the latest example of his destructive instinct and will. Hoping or planning for a disaster is exactly what he wants you to think so you will ignore the steady drip of destructive acts whose legacy will be years in the unmaking. He has ruined our international reputation, destroyed our clout, weakened our economy along with the international economy, trifled with military justice, lied about pretty near everything, practiced nepotism, etc and so forth.
Ross has again missed the point with his dreamy view of the world.
4
Here is a provocation that just might be true.
There will be an impeachment solidly grounded in facts, law, and Constitutional appropriateness. But there will not be a conviction in the Senate because Republican senators there are steeped up to their eyeballs in bad faith and pusillanimity.
That last 50 cent word simply makes the point that there are no Profiles in Courage among Republicans. Not a one.
Ross should check the Constitution and the Federalist Papers. Impeachment, and conviction, is not a power the Founding Fathers gave to the electorate as a whole.
Nor is it a power given to a President who may, because of force of personality, psychopathic lying, and new means of mass communication, be able to keep his own congressional party cravenly in check for fear of their elected seats and perks of power.
It is a power given to Sen. Lindsey Graham from South Carolina, Sen. John Kennedy, Democrat expediently turned Republican from Louisiana, Sen. Mitt "What you have done is terrible, but I'll still go to lunch with you and kiss your ring because I know, in your vanity, you don't want to lose a single Republican vote" Romney.
There will be a successful Impeachment because of Profiles in Courage such as Nancy Pelosi and Adam Schiff, but no conviction because of the basket of moral deplorables which constitutes the senators in the Republican party.
Don't blame it on the American people, Ross. It's your party which is at fault.
All the way down.
3
As I read the several lead articles today, I am struck that we have made this about defeating a narcissistic, petulant, amoral TV star than stopping his cabinet's rampant pillaging of air and water quality, rollback of climate control measures, failure to produce reasonable gun regulations, or improve access to or cost of health care to folks who did not benefit from his corporate-favoring tax cuts. We will live to rue our partisan tactics when clean water becomes the new oil.
1
The success of free-market capitalism and Americans' relatively high standard of living makes people ambivalent about politics. As long as Amazon delivers your packages in two days, who cares about what's happening in Washington? (He says cynically).
1
I find this article unpersuasive. It doesn't deal with the underlying fact that a lot of people are feeling left behind in our economy and that wealth is spread so unequally that they can't get the education, training and basic supports of life (health care) they need to get ahead. Yes, things are stable, but that's only because our political system is so bankrupt of leadership that there few good ideas for getting ahead are getting through. We are gradually spiraling down, and people don't know how to get out of the spiral. Trump, meanwhile, is offering bread and circuses to people who have no hope.
2
Great column. We should keep this perspective in mind.
And it sets the stage for the following questions. Is it true that, when Congress impeaches and removes a president, Congress can also choose whether to also bar the president from running again for the office? If so, how exactly does that work out? Does it depend on the senate? Does it depend on how the house words the articles of impeachment?
If it is true that Congress may, but need not, bar an impeached and removed president from running again, we should discuss and weigh in on the question. In our divisive tribal times I think it would be best to impeach and remove the president for a clear abuse of power but allow him to run again if he chooses to do so. Making it clear, if we can, that the voters have the final say even while also making it clear that personal gain cannot drive government policy seems to me to be the best prescription for our current moment.
1
Trump's illogical grip on the GOP and his base underscores a country that has lost its moral compass. The rule of law has become partisan. Mainstream media fake news. Impeachment process is maligned as partisan. Logic and common sense has been turned upside down.
3
Democrats have NOT swing to an ideological extreme. Report, don't judge.
5
If I am to believe Mr. Douthat, the sad truth is the Constitution doesn't really matter to most American.
4
The compromise of the entire GOP House and Senate is a catastrophe. All of them have become obstructers of justice and destroyers of the Constitution. They are enacting a catastrophe before our eyes--we just can't believe it. If Putin wins, it's a catastrophe all right, and the end of America as we have known it. We go into the darkness.
2
If by "Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme" and "progressive overreach" you mean "revulsion at a black president", then yes, you have correctly identified the reason for the stability of Trump's support numbers.
4
A lot of wasted words Ross. Here is how trump survives: Electoral College.
3
Mr. Douthat, let me help you out. Trump survives, thanks to the corrupt Republicans in congress and the increasingly right-wing judiciary. Glad I could help out.
4
"the likelihood of such a disaster the longer Trump remains in office is one reason to wish for his removal, even his fiercest critics should prefer stability, and the necessity of defeating him at the ballot box, to the Something Worse that might expedite his fall."
Right, give the Great Liar another year to fix the elections because the stock casino appears to be paying off. Frogs, meet the slowly heating water.
"Russia’s aggression has given way to stalemate"
May I ask in what world? Russia has continually increased their aggression towards Western values since 2016, embolden by Trump's election. Remember the poisoning of Skripal? Or the sabotage of power grids in Europe? Or the jamming of our radar/radios in Syria for Assad's benefit? Or the courting of NATO nations / sale of arms to them (Turkey, Hungary)?
Putin said, "I think we can all agree one of the greatest tragedies of the 20th century was the fall of the Soviet Union." And Putin is deadly serious. To reunite the satellites of the USSR would be a political windfall domestically.
I struggle with how conservatives, by and large, think Russia is our ally. It's morally repugnant.
1
How Trump survives is not so much his loyal, misinformed base, as it is the GOP-controlled Senate. It’s the Senate that must convict an impeached president. Their unwillingness to protect the Constitution has brought us to this tipping point. The GOP members are all complicit in the crimes committed by Trump and his administration. They have always been putting party above country since Reagan. They are no longer a legitimate political party. Instead, they have become a criminal enterprise.
1
Ross - Once again, like most Republicans, you miss the entire point of America. To paraphrase you and other apologists, “Trump is OK, the stock market is up and he has been lucky to not have had to deal with an international crisis - so ignore all the egregious insult he has brought upon our Democracy and office of President.
A far wiser man than you once said: “Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” - Ben Franklin
5
yes, read Eric Fromm’s Fear of Freedom....
1
The Trump show is not entertaining. The reason for ratings is the fear factor. Game of Thrones.
1
I don't see this stabilty that Ross Douthat is writing about. Things seem rather unstable these days. Violent protests breaking out worldwide, nationalist fascism digging in its heels and on the rise, Trump aligning with dictators and criminals and throwing our allies under the bus, Britain on the brink of collapse (will the EU follow?), the endless wars in the middle east (we are back in Syria by the way), things on the verge of blowing up (and I mean blowing up!) between India - Pakistan, Iran - Saudi Arabia, the effects of climate change just beginning to be felt, the rapid expansion of the surveillance state (and surveillance capitalism), the undermining of the public trust, facts and science under attack, an economy that only benefits the rich and is (as its been for the past few decades) both a shell game and a house of cards, small towns keeps dying, robots taking our jobs, unregulated capitalism following its natural path towards monopolization, intractable divisions and polarization in society tearing society apart, bigotry coming out in the daylight, an entire political party embracing corruption, attacking the nation's defenders and spitting on the Constitution, etc … etc… And a LOT of this instabilty is exacerbated if not directly caused by that belligerent mob boss wannabe who so laughably refers to himself as a "stable genius".
1
Stability? I think you are looking at the weather and not seeing the climate.
1
Husband: “Honey, can I retire at 55?”
Wife: “Well our retirement accounts are up almost 100% under Trump. Plus our taxes have been reduced, gasoline is cheap, our gas heating bill has dropped, and Trump is trying to bring your nephew home and stop his endless deployments to to the Middle East.”
This is how President Trump survives.
3
This analysis cynically claims Emperor Nero's "bread and circus" policy will keep 45 in office and beyond. The questions will then remain unanswered and our democracy severely damaged. 1) Is it alright to abandon 250 years of history and change the Presidency into an authoritarian office with no accountability to the people? 2) Is bribery to be unchecked; using Congressional appropriated funds as barter to get a foreign government to investigate an American private citizen who is also a political competitor? 3) Is it alright to use foreign citizens, known felons, to smear our ambassadors, and then believe the smear over the job record of honors and remove the Ambassador? 4) Is it alright to have a POTUS who is demonstrably incompetent and untrustworthy; his word is not his honor? The times have found us. In the face of POTUS being an unindicted co-conspirator to a felony, it is time we the people resist, restore and reconstruct our democracy and democratic institutions. Impeachment is the first step.
1
It's hard to remember all the things Donald has done that feels like a poke in the eye. But if we're wearing safety goggles, all is well.
There is one thing we can't excuse: white supremacy.
To support Donald, notwithstanding a steady economy, one either is racist, or doesn't mind that Donald is.
And if you don't mind, it's because you're not a target. You are white.
And if racism is okay as long as it doesn't affect you, that is the definition of white supremacy.
Donald has a fundamental character flaw from his birth. All the rest is piled on.
2
I dislike Trump for myriad reasons but attempting to be objective will concede the Middle East is stable, the economy has been positive (especially for the top), and he, despite his inept, incompetent leadership has managed to stay afloat. The majority of the electorate will hold their noses and sign on to another four years of this wannabe autocrat given these aforementioned very important considerations and I'm afraid all of the moral, ethical and real-life concerns about the man will be swept side unless the bigger issues still matter tp people - climate change, the gutting of the environment, the slow and unremitting attacks on the free press, a nonexistent foreign policy and Trump's imposed isolation and despotic nationalism. Not to mention his flagrant violations of his oath of office which by the way constitute legitimate grounds for impeachment. So yes, things are for the moment stable and the dollars are flowing but the bigger picture issues won't go away and will only get worse if Trump is reelected - caveat emptor. you get what you pay for. And this bipartisan voter will never cast a vote for this man.
2
He's the chosen one, no doubt. However, he's been chosen for the role of the 'Anti-Christ'. As an atheist, this is difficult to admit.
5
Anyone defending this president for this crime is guilty as an accomplice to the very same crime. Supporting America's enemies in time of conflict is treason. At any time that any of these defenders speak up, they must immediately be charged with the crime of treason. There are severe penalties for treason. This rule applies to any of the defenders, even if they are members of congress. Traitors, all of them.
I do not recognize the world you describe as "chaotic and dangerous" in 2014 - 2016.
Trump survives because the GOP is thoroughly corrupt. Full stop.
2
Sorry, but we have a disaster. A POTUS that abuses the rule of law, to the point of undermining our credibility both domestically & abroad. It's too bad that some 35% of Americans are OK with it. They are deluded & deceived by Trump's disinformation scheme. The rest of us are NOT. We see the disaster and it is affecting our psyche in the worst way. We see our country being destroyed by this man & too man people enabling it. This IS a disaster!
2
The world and the country are falling apart, Mr. Douthat.
The Trump presidency has been one big disaster. Haven’t you been paying attention?
The Trump era is theoretically stable in spite of, not because of, Mr. Trump.
The Trump era is theoretically stable because it is not stable at all.
I live in Indiana and it does not take a very stable genius to follow local and statewide news. Industry and farming are sounding the alarm.
Indiana was the canary in the coal mine in 2008. I hope the harbingers of a frail economy that I am hearing are wrong, for the sake of our country.
"And if you don’t pay attention to the chaos in the nation’s capital, as quite a few Americans do not, the Trump era has been arguably calmer than 2014-16."
And why wouldn't all the members of Congress, House and Senate, be fully aware of the "chaos in the nation’s capital"? Which party, which individuals are ignoring, rationalizing, justifying this chaos? Why should "Susan Collins (or, perhaps, Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema)" be the focus of representatives who are struggling with the facts and ethics of the impeachment proceedings? Isn't this a struggle every Congressman and Senator faces?
Douthat's analysis is cynical and patronizing.
2
Due to floods and trade wars, 40% of us farm income is coming from insurance and govt aid for this year.
Education costs are rising and attacks on the ACA are causing the number of Americans without healthcare to increase, along with costs for everyone.
Unemployment and other general ecomomic trends have basically continued straight from 2009. Venezuela, Hong Kong, Brazil, Chile, are in terrible condition, North Korea is building up nuclear weapons, as is Iran. People are dying in Ukraine fighting Russia.
None of these are in DC. I think the people supporting the president because things are ok are misinformed.
3
A lot of truth in this piece;
Also, Eric Fromm’s analysis of the public’s leaning towards an autocracy in his book Fear of Freedom sadly explains how Trump is so revered....
I wish I could feel optimistic.
How Trump survives? Trump has survived.
A more perceptive column would be how do Democrats unravel the impeachment fiasco without damaging their 2020 prospects.
Start by calling Brenda Lawrence, the African American U.S. House member from a blue collar district north of Detroit. She came out AGAINST removing Trump via impeachment yesterday. If the Democratic House leadership can't hold members like her, how are they flipping GOP senators?
Lawrence, and presumably many others, are hearing from constituents that they have no interest in removing Trump by a political process.
My Democratic party better coalesce fast around a candidate not committed to spending $40-60 trillion on fantasy projects like the Green New Deal, Medicare for All, Reparations, Free Health Care for Illegal Immigrants, and Student Debt forgiveness.
Otherwise America may decide they don't want to remove Trump via the ballot, either.
3
Stability? Trump and his administration are the epitome of instability. He has very little impact on the economy, other than imposing tariffs and policies that work AGAINST the best interests of farmers and manufacturers. His tax cut to billionaires has had zero effect on the economy as a whole while plunging us deeper into debt by trillions. And exactly how is the rollback of environmental laws and initiatives, which change daily depending on who has his ear, foster any kind of stability? Trump has many, many negatives that will be a huge factor in his reelection bid, not the least of which is the impeachment inquiry. If he prevails we're all in deep trouble.
2
A thoughtful piece, probably correct--except for the fact that the economy is NOT fine. It merely looks fine because Trump borrowed a trillion dollars and gave it to the rich. This provides a sugar high to the economy and the illusion that it is "fine." The economy cannot be fine when I am basically paying the rich even while typing this comment. Supply-side economics has been proven wrong since the Reagan years, its major effect being a grotesque inequality which distorts democracy.
2
First, SOME Dems went to an extreme, if you want to call it that, only after almost the entire Republican Party became right wing extremists and insisted that the "middle" was way over on their side. When Obama's efforts at centrism were met with the back of the hand, what were Democrats to conclude from that?
Second, Americans better wake up and realize that with Trump we are frogs in gradually heating water. Trump degrades America and gets pulled back a bit as the "adults" muster to mitigate the problems he creates; then he debases it again and maybe gets pulled back a bit; then again and again. And suddenly we're going to realize we're all in Putin's pocket and the earth is going to hell in a hand-basket and people will go "Wha'happened?" and blame whomever is handy at the time.
Even if a clear majority of Americans try to reset the nation in the 2020, we no longer have confidence that it won't be overturned by Russians, Republican chicanery, and mischief wrought by 223-year old Constitutional compromises.
1
The devil you know is still a devil.....
1
Perhaps that's true, Ross -- but this time seems different. Consider the possibility that so many decent Americans are just sick and tired of the very stable genius sucking all the oxygen out of the room and dominating the news headlines day in and day out. This president's ego gratification trip is a roller coaster ride that most of us just want to be over. And if the stock market should drop a few thousand points, or when some new remote hostilities (driven by climate change) flare up somewhere else around the world, we will all still heave a sigh of relief that it's back to business as usual and we can try to deal with the real issues facing us, rather than focusing on the particular bug that's crawled up Trump's rump that day. Even during the awful Nixon and Clinton episodes, it seemed the adults were still in charge, competence and experience mattered, people seemed to take science seriously, and the earth wasn't simultaneously frying and drowning. Hard to make that claim today.
2
How the President Survives? It was said the Titanic went down was partially due to a Captain that never saw disaster. Trump is a walking Disaster so you could say he's had plenty practice surviving. He has survived six bankruptcies. If anything, the lesson he's learned is--you don't need to learn any lesson. This Country enables a Bull that carries his own China Shop.......
1
What is the connection between Trump's popularity or the lack thereof and the outcome of impeachment? As every minimally knowledgeable reader knows, the sole determinant will be the vote in the Senate, which at the moment appears to vote against impeachment. But we have neither a full account of Trump's machinations in the Ukraine and Russia, neither his tax returns. Would they be so devastating as to shame even Senate republicans into voting for impeachment? Is this an objective analysis of the political reality or the author's wishful thinking?
It would be smart if Democrats resolved to CENSURE not impeach. They can explain the priority to avoid a long fruitless senate trial, but the value of the inquiry to both educate the public on national security issues and self-serving abuse of power as well as framing non-impeachment investigations of non-presidential wrong doing for the future.
2
Ross Douthat's argument is convincing, but only if you pretend that there is in fact a cause and effect relationship between important contextual factors like economic prosperity and national security. Even with a few qualifiers thrown in for good measure--"might just reflect", this relationship is never explained in his essay, and we're left to assume that it simply is the case that the results of an impeachment process are caused, ultimately, by broader contextual factors. The reasoning here is fairly simplistic: things that happen at the same time are linked. I think it's a bit more complex that this.
1
"...One reason Trump managed to get elected..."
Ahem.
Trump lost the popular vote by almost 3 million. He is president because of the electoral college. And no one--not even Trump himself--saw that coming. No one.
So the thesis that Trump was elected because of promised stability is bunk. If his approval rating is stable it is because many people made up their minds about him in 2015. But do not tell me the American people chose him because he promised stability because that is not what happened.
4
Other factors may have been involved in why Nixon was forced to resign. First, this was the first impeachment in modern history. It had the shock value that "firsts" have, whether they be urban riots or antiwar demonstrations.
Second, Ross, you didn't mention the end of the Vietnam War. Nixon was the first American president to preside over the United States clearly losing a war. And this was after his "secret plan" to win it.
Third, the media were much more cohesive then. When I did my PhD dissertation at Stanford on presidential popularity, covering Kennedy through Ford, it was possible to create a variable representing events by coding the story in the upper right column of the New York Times each day as favorable or unfavorable to the President. We studied the correlation between this and the lead news story on each of the three networks' evening news programs, and it was high enough to make the Times analysis, which was easier to do, a good stand-in for TV.
How could we do that today?
Another thing from my dissertation was that the greatest predictor of presidential popularity was the passage of time. Over time, the President's popularity becomes more stable, possibly because people make up their minds about him, and it takes more to change this.
Finally, impeachments and elections are not the same. There are those levers between how the people feel and how their representatives act. Study those levers. So Trump will not be removed, and 2020 is still in doubt.
2
"Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
Those "extreme" ideas like universal healthcare... that every other industrialized nation already has...
6
Interesting thesis that I find difficult to argue with. While trump reigns over a very popular economy, has luckily kept us out of catastrophic wars and skirmishes, and will very likely be re-elected, his next term may very well go pear-shaped and it all crashes to the ground. There is nothing that says we cannot impeach him during his second term, especially as details emerge around his tax returns, obstruction efforts during his first term, emoluments violations and campaign law violations. The economy may well enter recession as the business cycle is past due for a correction. Stay tuned as this soap opera is just getting started.
2
If you're right, Ross, here's how he'll slide to victory on his trail of slime: he'll bring us to the brink in a few, strategically timed provocations, of fear of cataclysmic war with China. (Remember his provocation of "Little Rocket Man" with his threat of "fire and fury never seen before"?) And then, he'll "resolve" the whole thing, trade war, tariffs, South China Sea aggression, by giving away the store, rhapsodizing about his bro, President Xi, and sending the stock market skyrocketing. Just in time to save the world and the 2020 election for himself, he'll spin it as a triumph of his way of hard-nosed deal making as a new world order, and people will buy it, because their terror will subside, their portfolio will surge, everyone will be optimistic again. He'll win, Republicans will become a new kind of international Mob, and the next four years will cook our goose ("cook" applying equally to the climate disaster thus ensured and the incineration of the remaining institutions of our rule of law. How can anyone miss the "made for TV" dramatic formula?
1
There are only two things that defeat an incumbent President running for re-election:
1) Health of the economy and near term economic outlook
2) Being stuck in a quagmire (war) where Americans are being killed on an ongoing basis, and where the people have turned their back on support for that war.
That's it.
3
"The migrant crisis and white-nationalist terrorism have both worsened, but the late-Obama-era crime increase appears to have subsided, campuses and cities have been relatively calm, Russia’s aggression has given way to stalemate, the Islamic State’s defeat has been mostly completed and Islamist terrorism has grown more sporadic than in the period that gave us Charlie Hebdo, San Bernardino and much more."
This is blather, and absurd historical revisionism. The "migrant crisis and white-nationalist terrorism" can be tied, directly or indirectly, to Trump and his rhetoric and actions. The "late Obama-era crime increase" were statistical blips still half the level of the early 1990s. Campuses and cities have been and remain calm for decades. The Islamist terrorism citation is to a tragedy in France and a lone wolf shooting that has been eclipsed by 4 separate shootings since Trump took office, including one explicitly white supremacist act and a shooting where nearly FIVE HUNDRED people were shot by one man. And there's no evidence that Russia's aggression has given way to stalemate. Rather, there's much evidence that Russia has increased its aggression and foreign interference.
7
About a third of the American electorate find trump entertaining. Or they are deluded into thinking that he has wrought the most wonderful economy in the history of the universe never mind the rates of poverty and inequality.
He finds the base clueless, gullible suckers who will swallow anything he says, but he loves their adoration. His wonderful base.
Trump and his base either don't know the rules, history or the law, or if they know, don't respect or care about any of that. Don't care about diplomacy, decorum, or civility.
That's all political correctness for snowflakes and silly people like women, immigrants, minorities and all treasonous democrats. And our most important allies.
It's a willingness to swallow outrageous lies and hateful proclamations by a near lunatic with no idea what he wants, except more money, attention, power. His supporters will never waver in their adoration of him. He is both their savior and circus clown. He's entertainment. I'll never understand it.
And then there are the Lindsay Grahams of this world ... explain that to me.
10
Sure, I agree in part, but when I here about our "glorious" economy, I cant jump on the band wagon. An economy based on consumption, which requires that we buy stuff we don't need, then throw it away, is not sustainable. An economy based on capitalist freedom to destroy our environment for the sake of profit, is not sustainable. Impeachment would occur if the balance of power in the senate was different. Due to our decayed moral fiber and lack of backbone, he will not be impeached.
1
For a change here we have a Douthat article which reflects realities on the ground versus a Democrat wish list. With the exception of the fringe elements on both parties, most Americans still want basic things - good jobs, decent health care coverage, opportunity for consumerism, affordable education and access to fresh air and water. Global affairs are at best secondary to people's day to day lives, and after many decades of international interventions costing precious lives and money, people are asking why we remain the primary police force across the world. Trump has figured out the policies as well as the messaging for the times. Unless Democrats act quickly to counter with a reasonable candidate, he likely to be elected to a second term.
2
It's curious. Where some see stability, others see a crisis the likes of which the nation has never seen before. While some are happy and complacent with what the current regime is doing despite its style, the many watch with growing anger as America is destroyed by a tsunami of stupidity, cruelty, greed, hate, crime, and depravity. This could not have happened if the United States were still a democratic republic. The right despises democracy. Look at what they do to people who are not their supporters. Look at what they do to any law that would hold them to account. Look at what they do to our common home. They have conjured a maelstrom and called it stability.
6
Trump survives because the GOP is the Party of Lawlessness.
4
Ah! So as long as any president of the USA doesn't interfere with 'one chicken in every pot' it is a free-for-all at the coliseum. I get it. You should have titled this installment of your column: Trump trumps 'High Crimes and Misdemeanors'. Turns out there are no laws governing the Presidency afterall. It was always a game of slight of hand.
In that case, Trump should just shut up and get on with exploring human tolerance for graft.
In the underlying sentence of your article you say “it takes disasters”. The current POTUS is a disaster in every way, shape and form !
2
The Marxist view is that change does not happen without catastrophe.
It looks like we are headed there.
2
Ross, Dear, Trump IS the Disaster. Every day, in every way.
Wake up.
5
Your reasoning is fallacious because Al Capone technically went to prison for tax evasion.
President Trump is the most corrupt individual ever to hold our nation's highest office.
Taking one glaring example of that corruption and removing him from office, like convicting Capone for tax evasion, is perfectly rational.
3
I agree with your conclusions but am sad about the timing. In a few years, certainly before the 2024 election, we again have raging inflation and stagnant wages (still) no matter who sits in the White House.
Why? Because of Trump’s stupid, did-no-good budget and artificially low interest rates. They will soon produce a real economic mess. Just wait.... and pity the Democrats if they win, because they will own it.
2
Seriously? Relative stability abroad??? (Cartoon Head Shake with sound effects) from trade wars to real wars, I see little stability and threats to existing alliances everywhere. Korea and Japan are close to falling out of their cool embrace. The EU, assisted by US presidential malfeasance is disintegrating. Even the Pence/Erdogan “deal” cited by Douthat is a sham serving no purpose other than to cover Trump’s ample rear, left exposed by his idiocy, ignorance, impulsiveness and admiration for strongmen.
The economy, through no action of his own, is the single sheet of thin ice on which indulgence of Trump’s occupancy of the White House continues. I’ve never welcomed a recession before but it would be a far easier thing to recover from than a second term of this monstrous misadministration.
1
Trump survives by trading on the reputations of others. In this mornings tweets, he wants Mulvaney, Pompeo, Perry, etc. to testify. What Trump really wants is Mulvaney, Pompeo and Perry to lie and perjure themselves for Trump. Get others to do the dirty work and get others to take the fall for you -- that's how Trump survives.
Not that every one of his henchmen have sterling reputations. Most were shady, but not to the level of go-to-jail shady, e.g., Rick Perry. Trump exploits their moral and ethical weakness, turning them into sycophants. ("Trump is the chosen one.")
Gotta say it -- Trump is like every lying loser that I ever taught in class. And, yeah, the losers bullied the good kids and the losers never could be taught anything.
3
Could someone please explain to me the difference between Fox News and fake news. I thought that one was a subset of the other...
1
"...might be that it takes disasters,..."? I can't imagine a larger disaster than we have: treasonous activities, self-dealing, emoluments, security scandals, nepotism, 14,000 lies, constant campaigning, three-day golf weekends (dereliction of duty), aiding and abetting White Nationalists, separating children and families at the border, eliminated independent science advisory panels in a quest to remove fact from policymaking, chosen to cozy up to leaders who murder their own people, etc, etc.
HOW is that not a sufficient DISASTER? The impeachment portion of the constitution should be removed if it is not used in such egregious cases!!
3
I recall my very educational trip to Mt Vernon, George Washington's plantation, now a museum. If more Americans could visit there this would all be over. George, the president who refused to be king, would be very disgusted that his nation now tolerates something so close to a dictator.
3
Clearly he has support and that support is by people whose loyalty and adoration for him is absolute. What it reveals about America is beyond sad. It's tragic. Folks who have hitched their wagon to this outspoken racist—and a man who bragged about grabbing women's genitals—have clearly lost their way, if not their minds. If they ever had a moral compass it has been abandoned. Fear not what Trump may do next. Fear for what he has exposed about us.
2
The idea that the general public (and not the inside the beltway crowd) views the economy and events as MORE stable during the last 4 years than during Obama's terms is ludicrous.
The stock market grew more, and more regularly, during the Obama administration, as did economic growth generally.
Ask ANYONE in rural America if today's trade wars have raised havoc with their local economy.
Charlottesville, and the openness of white nationalism are today's phenomenon.
The majority of Trump's cabinet and major appointments have resigned, and the majority of those were called idiots by Trump on their way out.
Nuclear proliferation is growing in N Korea and Iran.
I do agree with one difference: Trump's repeated, reflexive lying has swamped some ability of public opinion to perceive reality.
2
'To the extent that this reductive......is true, and it's at least somewhat true.....'
Squishy, vague, pillow discourse again. Ross (and David brooks) always wonder if all trump's malfeasance might maybe be simply the fault of impolite ideologues on the left...you know, 'that's how you get trump'.
Milquetoast platitudes pretending to be centrist. trump himself says you can't believe your own lying constitution, for heaven's sake!! Most republicans just sneer openly at 'never trumpers' or smear heroes like Lt. Col. Vindman, John McCain, etc., but conservatives like Douthat delicately wipe their eyes and sigh that since the economy teeters on the higher end of the eternal boom/bust cycle right this moment, it means something about how Dems ought to approach impeachment. Ugh. Impeachment is the right thing to do because trump has committed several impeachable offenses. That is all.
3
Ross: Trump survives because the great unwashed masses can’t understand your vocabulary and rather than look the words up,
they turn their heads.
1
Trump survives, unfortunately, because the Dems have overplayed their Trump assault hand, starting with their
Russiagate fiasco. He may survive another term (unbelievable) because the Dems fail to provide America with a candidate in tune with the majority of Americans.
2
"Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
The first part of that statement is true.
The second part is something only a right-wing ideologue could say. We don't have an actual left wing in this country. We have the Right and we have the vaguely-center-left.
5
This could all be solved very shortly if there were a singularly strong Democratic candidate.
But there isn't.
2
Mr. Douthat, the Trump regime is a criminal enterprise and a Disaster. Its just that conservatives are too intellectually and morally debased to recognize this.
As to economic shocks, they are a GOP specialty ... having presided over 89% of the 111 months our economy was in recession over the post-war period since Ike. It will happen, but probably not in time for 2020.
4
The process is not pointless, even if he is not removed from office. Few smart people think that is likely to happen. What is important is to peel off a few undecided or wavering voters in swing states and galvanize democrats who might not show up and vote for the less-than-perfect nominee unless they really think we're tossing out a crook. We learned last week that the hearing process actually works to get clear information on the airwaves. It's a lot of work for a few votes, but that is where we are. Definitely worth doing, unlikely to remove him from office, but could help tilt the balance next November.
2
The 1800 election ended up in the House of Representatives where each State gets one vote. The decision was between Jefferson and Burr. Alexander Hamilton was a fierce foe of Jefferson, yet he threw his support to Jefferson. The reason was that even though he disagreed on most things with Jefferson, at least Jefferson had principles, and Burr did not. Jefferson would put the Nation’s interest above his own and Burr would not.
We face the same choice today. Every Democratic candidate has a moral compass. Trump does not. If you are afraid of a Warren or a Sanders Presidency because of their left leaning views, remember, they cannot get anything enacted without Congressional support.
We desperately need a person in the White House who does have a moral compass and puts the National interest above their own.
Also consider this; we just saw professionals testify before Congress. People who work in the country’s interest. How many of them will leave if Trump is re-elected. Consider how he treated Ambassador Yavanovitch. Why would anyone continue to work for someone who treats people so terribly when it serves his purpose?
2
With Trump most Americans know who and what they're dealing with while the Democrats are all over the board with a plethora of widely diverging political views and candidates. So they've turned to a strategy of never Trump and it's not getting them any political traction. Even a billionaire candidate, which the Democratic left vehemently oppose, is littering their landscape and clouding their water furthering dividing their base. The only thing the Dems have left is apoplectic drivel. The will of the American people always has and always will be done. It's the minority which have to wallow in their dregs.
The majority of Americans didn’t want or “will” this. Empty land masses and the minority scattered throughout them did. The electoral college, helped along by extreme partisan gerrymandering, doesn’t reflect the will of all Americans so stop pretending that it does.
3
@Therese
Said like a true embittered villain of democracy. You don't like the rules and want to change those which have served us for the better part of two hundred years; good luck with that. Also, those who inhabit the empty land masses you describe, they're no better than you.
What a bunch of mumbo-jumbo.
Trump survives because of Fox news. Period.
Any instability that was felt (by Fox news watchers) during Obama's tenure was because of Fox news. Anything that any Republican thinks or feels about Trump or Obama or anything or anyone for that matter is because of Fox news.
Fox is in control now. They control what Republicans think. They control what Republicans prioritize. And they control what Republicans believe.
Fox supports Trump. They will lie for him. And propagandize for him and worship him. And it's viewers are enthralled by him.
12
@William
Reagan opened the door for Faux News by doing away with the Fairness Doctrine.
I was born in DC but have lived in Montana for 30 years
Sadly even though Tester is a Democratic Senator
MT will most likely vote to re-elect Trump.
@William
Amen.
If lies, abuse of power, subversion of the truth and the constitution; a breakdown in morality and the rule of law at the highest level; leaders who subvert justice for their own power who are murdering our democracy - A television network called Fox News pushing its own version of the truth to pollute fallible minds - if all of this is not a disaster at a level not experienced in recent history, then short of war and nuclear fallout, I don't know what constitutes "Something worse" and tremendous instability as well as a national emergency right now!
3
Trump didn't get elected because of any 'external' factors that made voters here feel insecure. Trump got elected because: A) 25 years of right wing trashing on Hillary - and a lot of it stuck. B) Mitch McConnell and the Republicans shutting down any positive legislation that would actually help people coming out of a major recession - infrastructure spending, etc...
For six years the Republicans followed a scorched earth policy that put their own personal power ahead of this country. By the time 2016 rolled around the only thing people believed was that government didn't work (it didn't) and they wanted to blow it up.
Enter Donald J. Trump.
9
nobody expects that he will be removed. but this process puts the facts in front of the voters so they can decide based on reality, not based on the Trump reality show of lies, corruption, and cover-up.
3
What? Trump IS an extreme emergency. He must be removed from office as expeditiously as humanely possible. Democrats are ideologically extreme? In this context. Come on now, Ross.
1
Trump will be dislodged when more Americans will listen to a moral code they have put aside for the pleasure of power.
1
Trump is going to survive the impeachment attempt and win the 2020 election because he is delivering on his promises; the only Republican President in the post WWII era with the courage to fight against a corrupt bureaucracy, their allies in the media, and political correctness; and unafraid to do the right thing.
In 3 years he has lifted a trillion dollars of regulatory burden off of American industry; given us tax reform, started building the wall, stood up to China, reimposed crushing sanctions on Iran, increased European defense spending; given the Ukrainians lethal weapons, moved our embassy Jerusalem; reformed our criminal justice to give many black Americans another chance, given terminally ill American a chance to try experimental drugs, destroyed the credibility of ideologically driven media by bypassing and exposing them, and made it socially acceptable to once again tell the truth about systemic problems and say Merry Christmas.
Compared to this record of accomplishment, not promises, what are the Democrats offering us: a more intrusive and overbearing government. Good Luck, not.
1
Perhaps you have this backwards?
You really think people who support Trump care about what he does in Styria? do they even know about it, first of all? You suggest that the people who support him pay attention to what's going on in Syria--but not so much in Washington. Hunh?
You say that the reason his support level, as measured in polls, varies little, is that the country is relatively stable. Isn't it 1,000 times more likely that his supporters are ignorant of policy and current events altogether?
Comparisons with the Clinton and Nixon impeachment episodes get you only so far. Doesn't it seem likely that the American people were unwilling to support Clinton's impeachment--rightly or wrongly--because they believed that it mainly concerned sexual misbehavior?
As for Nixon, he was an unappealing character without the kind of personal following that Trump has. Far from a saint, but not a very good demagogue, either.
What motivates Ttrump supporters is not ideas, beliefs or knowledge: what motivates them is hatred, fear, prejudice against women and black and brown people. It is a question of attitude only. If you doubt this, think about what he emphasized in his speech announcing his candidacy. He knew what his "market" was. That's how he was able to eke out a narrow victory.
Trump's level of support is stable because his supporters know he feels the same way, regardless of current events.
1
How does the Republican Party survive? If the majority of Americans were literate and better educated, it could not, because too many people would understand that its single goal is to transfer the wealth of this country and its citizens to a few.
A smarter America would be an existential threat to the GOP.
4
Because he is the GRANDSON of a GERMAN BARBER. as he claims his HIGHER GENE comes from Freddie, the Granddaddy, the guy who crossed Atlantic in 1885 for AMERICAN MILK & HONEY. Not only in Germany, all over world barber has a higher gene, because they come from lowest echelons of society.
A single catastrophic illness would wipe out most people's 401(k) gains. People know that, and will overwhelmingly vote Democratic in 2020. Just wait and see.
3
Trump survives because the same people who were "tough on crime" locking up low-level offenders for trivial things are now locked arms in protecting their own from serious crimes.
Laws do not matter in America. Race, money and power are the only things that mean anything in this country. Laws are arbitrary based on your race, money and power.
The American right sold our electoral system to corporations, the billionaires that run them, and the rich foreign investors that keep them flush with cash.
Do you think our measly laws, the Constitution, and and so-called "American values" stand a chance?
Does it matter if the "economy is ok" if our "representatives" only answer to the rich, voting machines are hacked, media pumps us with foreign propaganda, and our vote is gerrymandered out of relevance?
Money or rights?
Capitalism or democracy?
Security or liberty?
As Ben Franklin said, “Those who give up liberty for security deserve neither.”
And they get neither too.
2
First it takes a president who has committed proven crimes against the constitution and second it takes members of that criminal presidents political party putting country above their own party and careers to remove an impeached president.
With Trump you have the first in spades and with todays conservative Republican Party you have the opposite of the second.
2
I would argue that when the president is leveraged by Putin, the world is indeed falling apart. Only a corrupt AG kept obstruction of justice charges at bay. In addition to a wide range of corrupt and criminal activities, trump's attacks on the environment are cause for alarm and vigorous protest. The GOP is a radical, broken party. trump will pass. The danger to our country and the planet are with us for the foreseeable future.
1
If this country was a corporation and Trump was its CEO or Chairman of the Board, undoubtedly he would be placed on paid leave until the corporation could get to the bottom of the serious charges leveled against him. I would have no problem with Trump being permitted to officially remain in office until the next election all long as all of his Presidential duties and responsibilities are transferred to someone else pending the conclusion of a full, non-partisan investigation of his (alleged) wrongdoing. This would be like an Article 25/impeachment hybrid. And like other hybrids the country would be run more efficiently and get a lot better mileage out of such a process then a pure impeachment effort.
2
By this reckoning, support for Impeachment should be high since Trump is presiding over possibly the greatest number of violent domestic attacks in recent history. Sure the economy is pretty good, but when you have to get your child an armor-plated backpack for school, that should say something. Are we not blaming the president for inciting violence? Has this become yet another "normal" that we just have to accept being American?
1
The disasters are coming - a new great recession that we won't be able to fight because we are already using all those tools; collapsing infrastructure because Republicans refuse to pass any bills in the Senate; myriad small scale social disasters because, again, Republicans refuse to even discuss any bills that come out of Democratically- controlled House; social unrest because the Republicans have strangled government; and all the disasters (floods, fires, hurricanes) that climate change will increasingly visit on us because the Republicans willfully deny science. That last one we cannot recover from because, well, physics is physics and does not care about human civilization.
3
Even if Trump did enjoy the majority of popular support, which he does not, it wouldn’t matter. Dictators world over claim or actually have popular support but we don’t live in a dictatorship. The US is a constitutional republic, there is no national vote regarding impeachment - our representatives are elected to look and make decisions regarding abuses of power based on the Constitution not the polls.
The argument in this column is that the economy and other factors determines the outcome of an impeachment. If that were true in the absolute sense, then the House would not have gone to the Democrats. Democrats articulated augmentation to a good economy, such as healthcare and other local priorities and won. We saw this replicated in VA, KY and LA.
My point is that a good economy plus the culture war is not enough to counter the repulsive behavior and continuous scandals.
The president won't be removed due to hyper partisanship and control, but he will be impeached. The Senate trial will not eject him, but showcase vulnerable Senators and risk Senate control.
2
If Trump survives - and he almost certainly will - it's solely because of the cowardice and betrayal of oath of the Senate Republicans.
You may try to diminish Trump's crimes by hiding behind the ignorance and partisanship of voters Ross, but you're ignoring the pertinent facts of impeachment and our system of government.
First, the Founders didn't trust direct democracy, and found it unwieldy, so they created a representative democracy. We elect people to represent us, and trust them to have honor and to uphold their sworn duty. This is why the President is elected by electors, and how Trump won the election even though he lost the popular, direct vote. So we're not going to put the impeachment question to the voters for their decision.
Second, the Founders wanted to provide a "safety valve" in the event a President (or other elected official) did not live up to his sworn oath, and committed "high crimes and misdemeanors". That's what impeachment was designed for. Only the most craven and obtuse defender of Trump can deny that he has clearly met the bar for impeachment - and this is only based on the things we KNOW. If we actually knew the full extent of his perfidy, treason might well be proven. He engaged in bribery and extortion, and acted with a foreign government to interfere in our democracy, two specific "crimes" noted by the Founders.
And while you might not consider what Trump has done to our nation a disaster, it certainly qualifies as such.
2
He is thriving because the value of US industries have increased over 2 TRILLION dollars since he became President. He has worked to deliver on the promises that got him elected, and never deviated. AND he is wildly entertaining.
52
I suppose he’s “wildly entertaining” in the same sense that soap operas are entertaining...mindless and fake. Oh and on the verge of total extinction.
158
@Walter
So overall market caps have increased (or otherwise, merely inflated) dramatically - but at what cost? Essentially achieved through heedless de-regulation and ill-conceived tax policies benefitting the least need. Glad you're enjoying the show - but you might not want to stick around for the conclusion.
122
@Walter
No offense. But if you want "entertainment", I suggest you go to the circus.
What this country needs someone who is up to the job, and inheriting a strong economy then taking credit for it is hardly "delivering on the promises that got him elected".
Or haven't you noticed the jobs aren't coming back and these trade wars are slowing down our growth?
No offense.
But wake up!
184
If a burglar is caught trying to rob a home, people would be all for putting him in jail, even if he was unable to steal anything. However, if the owner of the home said it was no big deal and nothing happened, the people's fervor would abate, and they would not be so keen about incarceration. In the Ukraine issue, since the President of Ukraine said it was nothing, that he felt no pressure, the scandal becomes muted. That has had an impact on people's fervor for impeachment. (It does not matter that the President of Ukraine, needing the USA, forced himself to say that he felt no pressure)
@SP What was he supposed to say with Trump and Putin literally holding a gun to his head?
Best economy since late 1990’s? Not from where I sit. The late 1990’s were the breaking through the height of 1989-90 economy. The tech boom was seemingly expanding with no ceiling. People were optimistic.
Today, the economy is working for a few with the right portfolios. Everyone else has cut back and is living with less, or struggling. Yesterday’s article on Amazon spoke to how retail companies, a major economic engine, are barely surviving in what should be a robust time for profits. Economic times are good for top tier executives, but not for the people doing the work. Workers’ pay has been either stagnant or reduced. Many who have been re-entered the labor pool from being laid off or fired, etc., are doing so receiving a 20-50 percent cut in salary. This goes for both blue and white color jobs.
I’m no economist, but from my point of view the economy report is a lot like our county’s leadership—a con job. A general belief is being peddled that times are good, but it’s a manipulated argument not reporting all sectors.
5
This is the problem. Trump is not a scandal. Trump is a disaster, only a slow-moving one, and too many Americans seem unable to see that. Worse, too many more seem to be cheering it as it unfolds. Congratulations to Vladimir Putin.
3
Is the economy OK? is the only barometer: always has been, always will be. Is the world falling apart? is way too subjective, and some disasters prompt voters to not reject, but to Rally around, the President. I think the Republicans did pretty well in the 2002 elections after the catastrophe 9/11, if I recall.
But voters voting their pocketbook is very objective: am I doing better now than before? Do I have more money to spend, are my savings and my investments growing?
Obama's last years were great for the economy: we were noticeably pulling out of the Great Recession, the debt was under control, etc. Voters didn't reject Hillary because of instability abroad, they rejected her [in Electoral College, not in popular vote] because they didn't like her -- and very narrowly so in those Rust Belt states that secured Trump's Electoral College victory. A few more thousand African Americans in each such state could have voted instead of sitting it out, and she would have won.
Is the world falling apart? is a red herring -- it's the economy, stupid.
"Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
Another false equivalency and this one is a doozy. It's BOTH side's fault! Those "extremist" Democrats actually want a president who committed high crimes and misdemeanors to be impeached while the craven and debased GOP denies reality. See-- both sides are the SAME!
7
The funny thing with the American ideology is that it is the very idea of freedom or liberty that sustains the new semi dormant fascism .
Americans have definitely understood everything about fascism and Liberty .
Probably much more than half of Americans are unable to express the concept of Liberty with justesse .
It would rather be a definition closer to fascism.
Lessons of the past are useless in understanding Trump's success. The past offers no examples of a cartoonish, mendacious narcissist president being propped up by a wildly biased television news organization and supported by an electorate driven primarily by spite rather than self-interest.
The pattern has repeated many times:
1. Trump says or does something stupid, illegal or damaging to U.S. interests.
2. Knowledgeable people, usually from both sides of the political spectrum, sound the alarm bells.
3. Trump defends himself with a fusillade of lies and attacks his critics. Fox News distorts the story to benefit Trump.
4. His base of voters stand behind him as they rejoice at the exasperation of "elites".
If there ever really was an age of reason, present day America has wholly abandoned it. The president is a belligerent feral id, Republican politicians are sniveling sycophants and Republican voters are impervious to facts. On top of all that, Trump has proven that the president is entirely above the law. He cannot be indicted while president. The devastating public hearings have actually increased Trump's support (as per the four point list above) and decreased support for impeachment, so that last remaining mechanism for removing him is useless.
That leaves the 2020 election. Guess what - Trump will cheat in ways that will take years, if ever, to unravel. He is emboldened from beating the Mueller Inquiry and impeachment. Who can hold him to account? No one.
3
This is such a crass and superficial argument that it can only come from the bowels of the republican cult.
In her recent ruling, Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson expressed the essence of what an American is. It is not what the republican cult thinks it is. It is what Fiona Hill so eloquently expressed as her reason for becoming an American. There is opportunity, freedom and equality in the US.
The republican cult believes that money only is the way to respect in this country.
The next year will see who wins. The crass, superficial, rich republican cult or the hard working, idealists such as Judge Ketanji Brown Jackson or Fiona Hill.
I still believe that the majority of true Americans choke up a little when they read the words of the judge or hear the words spoken by Fiona Hill.
Smash these crass superficial republicans on impeachment and at the election poll in 2020.
2
Trump should be removed from office because he wasn't qualified for the position when he was elected, he still is unqualified and in fact now has caused severe damage to the Office of the President and the foundations of our democracy. The fact that he has committed impeachable offenses too boot is just the icing on the get-him-out-of-there cake.
4
I stopped reading when Mr. Douthat started describing Obama’s tenure as more unstable than Trump’s. Partisanship, anyone?
5
I guess mass shootings and gun violence in America don’t count as a crisis? Climate change must not count either even though catastrophic weather events happen frequently and are worse than ever, courtesy of warming temperatures. And I guess that the divisions that are deepening in America that this president encourages and delights in are not a crisis. A president who lies daily and about everything, who calls fake news tv shows to whine and complain for almost an hour about petty stupid things isn’t a crisis. Not trusting the judicial system, Congress, or the president isn’t a crisis. I often have to stop listening because the state of this country is a crisis and I feel helpless to change things.
4
Depressingly cynical, but probably correct. Maybe we should just let a robot be president; or better yet, an algorithm. With a handsome professional actor to appear at ceremonial events.
2
Trump survives..... unless the House comes up with something more 'serious' than we've heard so far.
Sorry, Democrats.
Or am I missing something here?
Frequent gun fire massacres by fellow Americans.
An environment headed towards making the world uninhabitable.
U.S. life expectancy dropping.
More children without health insurance, even unaffordable health insurance.
I’ll leave out the abuse of asylum seekers on the borders, they are foreigners, they don’t count.
Is this the stability that you’re taking about?
2
Sorry, Ross. I can accept your assertion that "Trump's party is craven and debased...", but blanketly positing "...that the Democrats have swung to an idealogical extreme.." is a carelessly pejorative and unsupported cheap-shot. Not helpful to any dialogue.
3
Trump will survive because most of America does not embrace extreme ideologies like socialism. While Obama was held in high regard by the left the right did not wage war and fake impeachments nor did they chant death to cops. I along with most of the people I know laugh every time a Democrat creates a new identity box for their constituents. Now basically everyone except an old white rich man is a protected class and illegal alien criminals have more rights then unborn children. I read the post and understand the posturing and the ostentatious language but most fail to realize the answer is right in front of them. Climate change is another area of misdirection. I have 2 degrees in science and can tell you that mother nature cures itself by whatever means nec. That means while we create carbon dioxide the plant life that breathes this stuff exhales oxygen, changes in weather patterns bring rain to areas needing more plant life creating more carbon dioxide breathing plants. The media and CNN experts wont tell you this because climate change just like the oil companies is a cottage industry. The right also understands that the planet will not die off in 12 years and yes the climate has always been changing. The short answer to this article is that Donald Trump survives because there are enough normal and reasonable people that are not swayed by scare tactics. P.S. China loves it though!
Democrats will make a monumental blunder if they hang their hats solely on the Ukraine affair. They should throw the book at Trump and leave it to the Republican controlled Senate to demonstrate their cowardice and hypocrisy by acquitting him on bribery, extortion, abuse of the emoluments clause, and scores of actions obstructing justice. Let voters observe the laundry list of Trump's impeachable malfeasance. Trump will survive the impeachment process but will be in peril of winning the 2020 election. I cannot imagine anyone but his steadfast base voting for him again unless the Democrats nominate a candidate as unpopular as Hillary.
2
Nixon got what he deserved. Clinton should have been thrown out of office for lying to congress, then lying about lying about it.
But aside from Nixon's crimes being much more egregious, there was a clear difference between these men. Nixon was sort of sinister-looking. The shift-eyed guy who has to shave twice. Clinton was a warm fuzzy who loved everyone, from foreign dignitaries to day laborers. He was a man of the people. Even when bad, he was easy to like and forgive.
Now we have Trump, an ugly human being in every possible way, but a TV star and a tabloid wonderchild.. That artificially made him what Clinton did in person. A friend you'd invite into your living room.
Then he stole the silverware, but it hasn't been noticed yet.
1
The "disaster" is one of epic moral failings that make Clinton's extramarital affairs trivial.
What pure ignorance of the fact. Trump needs to be removed. Period.
Babble on...
1
Trump will only be convicted if does something actually decent.
1
What possible disaster is worse than Trump?
2
Trump is a common thief. The Trump "charity," alone should be a basis to impeach him. Even a 5th Avenue type of voter can identify with the veterans and donors who were scammed.
3
While Trump may be presiding over low unemployment and a rising stock market, the fact is he has once again been the fortunate recipient of a hand-me-down success story, though the stories are very different. Remember, he was born with a silver spoon passed down from a relatively corrupt father who made his fortune ensuring no minorities moved into his apartments. He was given millions to play with and then tutored by the likes of Roy Cohn. As his hunger for self-aggrandizement grew, and Cohn died, he was leeched upon by Roger Stone - a proud dirty trickster. He then took advantage of the collapse of the Russian empire by helping Russian gangsters move their money where it would be safe - in his properties. They bailed him out of one bankruptcy after another. Then, fast forward, and he manages to insert himself into the Republican campaign and, with the help of criminals and the Russian government, wins a minority of votes, but inherits from Obama, the man he loves to hate, a stable economy with a slowly appreciating stock market and shrinking debt. Admittedly this isn’t just luck. He combines an instinctive sense of how to manipulate people with a complete lack of ethics and decency. It’s a lethal combination. He is a phony, a con-man and a fascist at heart who shamelessly panders to a base all of whom have an agenda that has nothing to do with making America a better place for everyone.
2
It's curious. Where some see stability, others see a crisis the likes of which the nation has never seen before. While some are happy and complacent with what the current regime is doing despite its style, the many watch with growing anger as America is destroyed by a tsunami of stupidity, cruelty, greed, hate, crime, and depravity. This could not have happened if the United States were still a democratic republic. The right despises our democracy and would gladly endow a republic of masters and slaves, offering nothing but death to all those who do not meet their definition of deserving. Extreme you say? Look at what they do to people who are not their supporters. Look at what they do to any law that would hold them to account. Look at what they do to our common home. They have conjured a maelstrom and called it stability.
4
So the argument is - as long as the masses have their soma all is good with the world. Please I’ll take the red pill. The blue pill with a soma chaser is too depressing.
1
Douthart is right about one thing, and one thing only! It’s as tiny a sample size as you can get.
There is no way to use a base of two impeachments to derive any answers, especially when the circumstances are so radically different. A case of a sex lie, vs corruption throughout the White House with definite criminal activity, a scandal that grew and grew until the tapes were exposed.
And his analysis is irrelevant since this is not an opinion poll but a trial. The only opinions that are relevant are those of 100 Senators, who are supposedly independent actors and who will swear an oath to decide impartially on the evidence ( and hear a sarcastic “sure”!) Remember that McConnell and others still around voted “guilty” on Clinton! The invertebrates who inhabit the Republican benches are scared of losing primaries or their lobbying jobs
Blah blah blah....
Trump abused the power of the presidency. You need to be held accountable for misconduct when it happens. Democrats are doing that. Republicans aren’t.
I don’t care if impeachment fails in the senate. I don’t care how well the economy is doing. I do care that Congress does it’s job, and Democrats are, and that’s enough. Excellence comes from respecting the process, not the result.
5
Given that Trump is a disaster for the country, the planet and the world our children and grandchildren will inherit I guess he ought to be out of office by lunch time.
2
Trump and his presidency is a disaster if one considers people and American democracy important.
3
But Mr. Douhat, Trump is a disaster all on his own.
2
So, Ross, selling out US military might for political gain, undermining NATO and assisting Russia in its quest to return to eastern European dominance is just a scandal? Columns like this one are why no one can take you seriously, mate.
3
Ross writes “...craven and debased...” as a description of the Republican party which is really his way of saying DEPLORABLE.
This is why Trump will win in 2020.
Interesting thoughts, but it’s hard to take them seriously because Mr. Douthat laces them with partisan potshots, and plays the Republican game of labelling everything he doesn’t agree with as “extremism.”
1
You said: "but the late-Obama-era crime increase appears to have subsided, campuses and cities have been relatively calm, Russia’s aggression has given way to stalemate"...
You must have quickly forgotten about mass shootings, increased student debt, and Russia sowing discourse as I type. We're living in an NRA-loving, groper-acceptance, hate-speak, climate crisis-denying, education-disinterest, child-forgetting, democracy-ruining country happening now. Now is the problem.
5
Should Trump be impeached?
Obama has nothing to do with this question. Clinton has nothing to do with this question. World affairs in Turkey have NOTHING to do with this question as Presidents make stupid decisions all the time. That IS an election issue. And don't forget, Nixon was reelected.
So, were journalists writing analysis of this and that, while comparing Nixon's transgressions to previous president's illegal activities or world events?
No. They were looking at the evidence, of wrongdoing by Nixon, as it was discovered.
We don't need history lessons, wasting precious column space, when there is known evidence, against Trump, that requires commentary.
So far there is only one Conservative NY Times columnist who has done so. Thank you, Mr. Brooks.
2
"Of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
Truly incredible and truly delusional. Americans have been so brainwashed by right-wing propaganda that the "center" is not the center and is instead far to the right. When positions like wanting healthcare for all citizens and a wealth tax are seen as "extreme," you just give the game away. Individuals like Mr. Douthat lack the self-awareness and perception to realize that they are part of the problem. That their views have created the mess we are in. They have allowed the wealthiest to horde extreme wealth, get richer and richer, and be beyond the law as millions toil without health insurance and/or in poverty. We underestimate how pervasive and effective right-wing propaganda has been. It doesn't just impact our rambling relatives. It impacts and influences the worldview of people who are qualified and educated enough to write for the New York Times.
2
Ross, the Trump presidency IS a disaster.
2
I can remember Nixon going on the Carson show during the Watergate investigation to plug his book called "Six Crises".
Carson quipped, "You shoulda called it Six Crises and a Catastrophe" Ah,,,the good old days.
So morals and values and ideals just don’t matter to you? Well, they still do to some of us.
1
Trump not only got help from a foreign country to win the 2016 election, he encouraged it. He asked for that help on television.
He's doing it again. Right now. In public. In our faces.
What part of that does Ross Douthat not find chaotic or a crisis?
Or a crime.
4
Trump survives because people are desperate for transformation from the alleyway dumpster to the dining room table.
"His fiercest critics should prefer stability, & the necessity of defeating him at the ballot box, to the Something Worse that might expedite his fall."
I certainly dread the potential Something Worse Trump seems capable of.
But we can't tempt fate to see what that might be.
We're in Something Worse than we've faced in my 60 years - before a president absolved Nazi sympathizers, caged children, overrode a war crimes conviction or betrayed allies who fought alongside us.
We must not wait for the election to defeat Trump because an investigation concluded Trump was installed as president after an intervening act of war by Vladimir Putin that sabotaged our electoral sovereignty - sabotage Trump encouraged & welcomed.
Trump is inviting foreign powers to sabotage the 2020 election right now. His insistence that Zelensky interfere in our election is a violation of our sovereignty & abuse of his office.
Trump's abuse of office is real & visible, not "partisan concern."
Trump is not "seen" as presiding over crisis or potential ruin.
Trump is presiding over crisis & potential ruin.
If our Constitution & democratic elections are our foundation, Trump's tenure is a crisis & existential threat to us graver than a terrorist attack, crashing stock market or collapsing polls.
Trump is destroying what we hold dear: the American experiment in democracy.
Benjamin Franklin said "A republic, if you can keep it."
Trump and the Republican Party are betting against our country.
2
Look around you Mr. Douthat, Trump is a disaster.
A disaster of major proportions.
Our republic is under attack.
If Trump survives, our nation may not.
2
Doing it again Times. That subtle, nothing can be done shtick to rid us of this man, despite the Blue Wave a year ago, Blue Virginia, Kentucky, Louisiana. It really is reprehensible.
And there is Nothing Remotely Entertaining about him. That bizarre photo op with the dog yesterday. Good Lord that was weird. Why not just stage a "Game" in Ye Olde Coliseum..
1
Every day Trump walks into the oval office a potential disaster is waiting to happen.
1
Ross Douthat has authored the Times' most insightful look at the doomed effort to impeach the President. Presidential impeachment is Congress's least democratic and most destabilizing power. As devoid of character as he is, the American middle senses this is not the time to remove the President . November 3, 2020 is that time -- unless the Democrats squander it by failing to look out for hard-working Americans.
28
@Ed MacColl Trump will gut medicare and ss. He will continue his assault on the public sector. Did I mention he is a public servant? How many jobs does that represent in addition to the downsizing of blue collar jobs as Amazon and other corporations eat up small business. There will be blowback as people realize that their families across the us are increasing struggling to keep afloat. Why are Russian oligarchs shaping our government policies. I think that's called treason. When did they become our friends?
17
@Ed MacColl - Is the American middle aware of general civics knowledge which is necessary for a functioning government. According to the Annenberg Public Policy survey conducted this year, 22% of those surveyed couldn't name any branch of government. 25% could name one branch, 14% could name two branches and only 39% could name all three co-equal branches. Although 99% could name all of the Kardashians (I'm kidding!) 83% of those surveyed knew that the 2nd Amendment guarantees the constitutional right to own a handgun. 45% inaccurately believed that illegal immigrants have no rights under the Constitution.
This lack of basic knowledge illustrates that the large middle of America ranges all the way from the functioning illiterate to the purposefully deceptive (e.g. Senator Kennedy). Would the same sensible middle advocate for removing the President now if he conspired with a foreign country to attack Pearl Harbor or would they want to wait until the next election to ensure fairness?
12
@Ed MacColl Donald Trump is being impeached for using the office of the presidency to rig the election in his favor. He must be removed from office.
16
Are you arguing that because we have some economic prosperity for at least a few that we should reelect Trump? And if this is so what does this say about our ability to see beyond our own economic interest. Are we willing to sacrifice our soul for our pocket books? Christ would weep.
Democrats have been presenting plans to address economic needs for a huge swath of people including most republicans., things that republicans say by their actions or lack of actions that hey don't care about at all. If integrity sill not sway people perhaps their own economic interests might, but I doubt it.
Big Sigh.
1
You cannot impeach a president because you do not like him but that is what the Democrats are trying to do. They have wanted to do this since he was elected and have spoken about nothing else. They do not like the policies that he promised the American people he would support and has been successful in implementing. The decision of whether or not to remove the president from office will come in 2020 at the ballot box. My guess is that they will not and he will be elected to another term of four years.
@KMW
This is not about "liking" or not liking -- or has the fact that this president was holding up much needed financial aid to a country that's fighting for its very existence just to get some dirt on a political opponent?
Where is your mind?
1
Trump survives when we allow him to spread lies without a real-time check.
As a veteran of foreign wars, I have incredible respect for the chain of command, both in the military and civilian space; but I would never allow my chain of command to lie about easily verifiable issues.
2
Mr Douthat is quite right. The economy is booming and the nation is at peace. Let the good times roll.
The Trump Presidency is like a game of Jenga. The tower stands until it doesn't. There's no in between. No slow decline. Just horrible crash. It's coming. It always does.
289
Oh my god, all these comments about the impending economic implosion are freaking me out. I never got to enjoy the “boom!” I actually took on a second job a few years ago, and I still have to stagger my bills (23-year teacher here, not exactly retail). Where was this great economy everyone keeps talking about?
8
There is a huge difference between Johnson, Nixon and Trump and Clinton. Johnson's loyalties were suspect and he was sleeping on the job, Nixon condoned burglary for his political purposes and Trump by far the worse took Nixon's political self dealing and took it overseas endangering our National security. The evidence is there, it is plain to see. No logical person accepts the spin. The problem here is the country has become so deadlocked politically that when a President does the wrong thing, it is unlikely his party will remove him for any reason. That is not in the best interest of the Country. The one thing that might be an excuse is that Mike Pence who has proven to be the weakling Trump desired when he picked him could be cast aside as well for his involvement in this shady deal and that would mean Nancy Pelosi would be President which is more than Republicans are willing to handle. At this point it looks like the only way to remove Trump is an electoral loss both by a Democrat winning the majority of votes and spread throughout the Country so Trump's electoral college scheme fails this time around.
1
Ross, the evidence from Presidential elections from the last 70 years also show that disasters determine viability of second terms. It isn't just impeachments.
Strong economies are credited to the President in office at the time with total disregard for prior history. Obama's policies for recovery from the Recession is the major factor (not the only one) in our expansion, yet Trump takes most of the credit. A weak economy is virtually certain to sink the hopes of any President for a second term.
The only absolute certainty for a Democratic landslide in 2020 is a recession early in the year. Otherwise it will be a squeaker with turnout in swing states being the major factor.
1
Mr. Douthat is not living in the same world I am.
My household lost 20 percent of its income this year because of a job loss in manufacturing due to uncertainty in the supply chain. That uncertainty was created by tariffs on China. An analysis by the Port of L.A. predicts 1.5 million jobs will be lost due to tariffs in shipping alone.
Every day we wake up, we wonder if it will be the day that the GOP's lawsuit against the health law will pull the rug out from under our current access to health care.
We studied. We worked hard. We did everything right. Somehow, we failed to earn our way into the safety and certainty of the world in which Mr. Douthat lives.
6
@Tariffs Kill Jobs
Should we allow China to abuse us?
Mr. Douthat:
All other considerations aside, could it be that impeachment is
a matter of principle, of law, of duty? Could it be that some of us prefer to live in a country where the difficulty of doing the right thing is still worth the struggle? Could it be that this column is just another convoluted effort to support the indefensible?
4
Well, whilst we have all been ruminating over impeachment, it appears that Trump has now appointed Jared to build THE WALL. Maybe we can get some Russian money to help fund it.
Along with middle east peace and justice reform. Surely Ivanka can be delegated some major task to relieve Jared of what now looks like a heavy lift in the run up to 2020.
1
He survives because he has a core group of supporters who are willing to excuse any misbehavior. Unless they start to care, he will survive anything except perhaps the 2020 election.
2
Mr. Douthat states “The idea that the Trump era is stable probably seems unpersuasive to people who follow the D.C. carnival obsessively; the idea that it is more stable than the later Obama years may seem like a joke.” This is the only thing I wholeheartedly agree with him on, although I’d change the anemic verbs “probably seems” and “may seem” to declarative ones. Stable? Seriously? No US regime has ever done more to wipe out the whole concept that there is an objective thing called “the truth” and that it matters. If Mr. Douthat believes that moral, strategic and functional chaos in governance is compatable with stability, I think he’s crossed over into fantasyland, where, unfortunately, many Republicans have recently taken up residence.
2
Douthat is advocating in FAVOR of the heckler's veto here. Putin doesn't like a particular president? Just start a random war somewhere, to make the world seem "less secure". Problem solved!
This is the counsel of fear. Republicans have been running on fear-based positions since at least 1980. They've spent literally 40 years cultivating an electorate of anxious old white men, who will vote for anyone who promises that there will be fewer scary bumps in the night. Do not fall for it. Elections do not affect scary bumps in the night. They happen. All elections affect is our nation's response to them. Are you really happy with Trump's response? I know I'm not.
3
Perhaps this is just "educated-liberal revulsion at his style," but here goes anyway.
The big problem with "defeating him at the ballot box" is that he comes from the party that has institutionalized quasi-legal cheating at elections. He has made no secret of his own desire to cheat at elections. And he has given little indication that he would actually leave office if removed, either via impeachment or defeat in the election.
Christopher Buckley's "The White House Mess," in which Reagan didn't leave office, was satire. Trump's refusal to do so will be as "unpresidented" as any of his other outrages.
He has said he deserves 20 more years. We should not doubt his sentiment.
4
"The lesson of past impeachments might be that it takes disasters, not just scandals, to remove a president from office."
How - by any reasonable definition - is Trump not a disaster?
5
Says Ross: “neither the nature of the crimes nor the state of the political parties matter”.
An erroneous estimate.
Trump would be long gone we’re it not for the GOP controlled Senate, a body run by Mitch and a battery of mindless marionettes in thrall to a mob of Trump supporters mesmerized by the most extraordinary many-tentacled brainwashing machine in history, a machine funded and operated by a cabal of bilious billionaires enjoying Oligarchy and pumping for even more power.
3
I agree with Ross that chaotic or even threatening world events influence the impeachment process, however there is so much to the "Trump Story". His incompetence as a leader, a manager of others and the extremely complex process of governing, his lack of morality, his siding with the world's dictators and white supremacists, his attempt to take over DOJ and the military, etc. all will influence public opinion and those that vote for or against impeachment.
Suggesting that trump represents stability in any sense of the term is comical and a thesis that’s completely false.
4
Mr. Douthat, you have a lot of nerve to compare Trump to Obama and conclude that the Trump era is more "stable" than the era of probably the most good, decent, and wise man ever to occupy the Oval Office. Your reasoning is seriously skewed.
5
Ross you are pointedly wrong. The Democrats are NOT extreme. It’s the republicans that aren’t even Americans any longer.
4
The Clinton’s impeachment was fundamentally crass and lied under oath, but it was not a crime against the country. Whereas, Trump asked a foreign power to help him cheat the election. Further, more recently, he asked China to help him investigate Biden, once again. Trump has compromised national security which is treason, plain and simple.
5
Trump was never going to be removed by this process. Knowing that, I'd been against impeachment until the whistleblower complaint broke public. At some point, you just have to stand up and say this is wrong, even if we all know Trump's lackeys in the Senate will never turn against him.
My only hope is that a sliver of voters who went with Trump in 2016 are actually turned off by the revelations from the hearings and have learned how they were lied to. Surely only the brainwashed buy that literally everyone who testified is lying and out to get their messiah.
1
Trump is living proof that you can't solve inner problems by manipulating the exterior world. It doesn't work. He's risen as high as a person can possibly go without becoming an emperor, yet he shows every day that he is not sure he deserves it.
The outer world certainly presents its own set of problems to be solved, but it takes wisdom and judgement to determine which problems come from inside and which are imposed on you from outside. He is a master of manipulating the outer world, and I'll wager he doesn't even acknowledge that the inner world exists. He thinks that the source of all of his feelings and beliefs is "out there".
This dilemma affects many people, but Trump is an extreme case. Knowing that this dichotomy exists and spending a bit of time in introspection is the best way to mitigate this dilemma. The right therapist can help too.
Instead, he's driving us towards a cliff, and getting himself impeached in the process.
I have a question for the rest of you. What parts of your disgust with this man are driven by the the drama itself, and what parts are the result of something inside yourself? I'm sure there's plenty of both to go around.
I wonder what praise Trump would have healed upon Lt. Calley a few decades ago?
2
Trump has broken the mold for sure but If a Democrat gets elected imagine over a billion people from 200 nations all sitting side by side along the Mason Dixon line holding hands, eating impossible burgers, drinking strawless latte's, singing Kumbaya while breathing pure oxygen and telling our kids stories of a distant past where people had to go to work, make tough decisions and provide for themselves.
I think not. I'll take Trump again!
2
What the lack of overwhelming support for impeachment and removal tells us is that most Americans don't actually care about things like freedom and democracy and the rule of law and fair elections and independence from foreign influence. We just care about our own lives and so we get the President we deserve.
528
@Jack
that speaks, indeed, for those who have the most tenuous grasp of our country's law. Congress, the Courts, the Military all have mulitiple actions to take. Citizens have one - to vote. And that is predicated upon citizens following news, articles, reports. Or it is citizens just voting for their party. Or it is citizens not voting. The last is unacceptable. To vote is the one responsibility of an American.
12
@Jack Agreed! That was my thought exactly on reading the article.
6
@Jack I fear that's true. If there ever was something noble about rugged individualism in this country, it's given way to an all-consuming selfishness.
15
OK, so Ross Douthat doesn't recognize our current circumstances as a catastrophe. Just as most of us can't feel the urgency of climate change in our bones. Too long range. But a catastrophe, nonetheless.
4
Not sure how this period of stability meshes with the make America great again narrative of the lost America where jobs area scarce, opioids are on the rise, the average American can’t afford a house, jobs are shipped overseas, and hordes of immigrants want in.
It seems as though the state of the world is a Rorschach test in which the data changes by the minute to support whatever conclusion a person finds expedient at the time.
Good points to remember and keep in mind.
But in my mind, although the things you listed as Trump's survival are indeed valid, there is this lingering doubt over who is controlling the narrative.
You cite the happening in Syria.
The image of as the Americans are leaving Syria and the plight of the Kurds are in doubt, the Russians are rolling in to what? 'save the day'?
Our economy is moving swimmingly.
About this time in 2007 through Sept 2008, our economy was seemingly in top shape. even though there were rumblings.
But from my perspective, I'm prone to keep my eyes on Trump's relationship with Vladimir Putin.
I truly believe that Trump is the under the thumb
of Putin.
I read somewhere that Putin blames the US and Europe for the break up of the Soviet Union.
A person who is filled with hate and getting even, play and lay in wait for the long game.
We in this country would be crazy not to keep that in mind.
2
In 1974, the US, which had not had a major recession since 1958, was heading into what would be the most significant recession since the depression, along with an inflation rate of 11%, was a factor in depressing Nixon's support, including with GOP voters.
So short version (always possible and needed with Mr. Douthat): do we no longer deserve the Constitutional government created by the Founding Fathers? That may be the case, and I am profoundly resentful of the American Right, both the Republican officeholders and their voters, who are throwing away decency, truth, and the rule of law for a pitiful short-term political gain.
4
I think a reason for the lagging support for removal of the president is the public senses that the Cong. Democrats don't truly believe their brief. If they did, the hearings would follow regular order.
The Judiciary and not the Intelligence Committee would be running the proceedings; no or very few depositions and testimonies would be taken in sequestered settings; the GOP and the president would be fully represented with respect to witnesses, lawyers, documents, etc.
Also, the crimes alleged would not be subject to public polling and cobbled together by hearsay accounts that often sound like policy and procedural disputes rather than forensic analysis.
Its hard not to see the matter as one of "maladministration" rather than "High Crimes" especially since the military aid was delivered and no announcement of investigations was made with respect to the Bidens, much less commenced. Lack of a consummated crime can't be dismissed as an important ingredient in the mix. In fact, the record reflects that even after this nonsense Ukraine is stronger militarily than before Trump manhandled it all.
None of this is to say that Trump was "perfect" in the matter - far from it; when is he ever? He's a bruiser and sometimes thuggish. But I think we're "Defining Impeachment Downward", as D.P. Moynihan might say. Nixon ran a racket from the Oval Office, Clinton had a tawdry affair and now Trump drove a clown car into Kiev.
People are waiting for 2020 to have their say.
I believe he will survive and be reelected. And that is when things will really get ugly and unfathomable. Or he will lose and throw the transition into chaos by rejecting the outcome. I think what many of us are counting on is the rule of law and adherence to the Constitution. I think there is enough evidence at this point to understand that the rule of law is meaningless when confronted by a powerful group who have dropped all pretense, and are engaging in a naked grab for permanent power. My question though is, if they achieve this--if they weaponize the justice department and the courts against the 60% of the people who reject their vision, what will be the fate of that permanently disenfranchised majority of people? Of course, this all sounds ridiculous. The problem is, if I --and you--were to go back only five or six years and be told all that has transpired in the past two years would have transpired, we would have thought that all to be ridiculous, too. Time will tell. Time will tell...
280
@Terracewalk One would hope your "horseman of the apocalypse" scenario does not come to pass and he loses resoundingly.
5
@Terracewalk
Well said. Counting on "rule of law and adherence to the Constitution" is probably not enough. Hope is not a strategy.
8
@Terracewalk
He is going to jail and all of his minions will be in the adjoining jails. If anyone thinks that is GOP pals are going to take a fall for him, think again. Pence is going down as they all are.
There is no loyalty when your looking at the orange jump outfit . Cohen, Stone, the two Rudi associates, Rudi. Jordan, Nunes.
The rats will leave the sinking ship
7
Forget Nixon and the Kurds for a minute.
One of the main reasons Trump seems to prevail is due to the complicit support he's receiving from the Republican party, which for all practical purposes, he has taken over.
We're talking folks who are in massive denial about all the wrongdoings perpetrated by this president, and who have given him a swift pass with little more than a wink and a nod.
The House Impeachment hearings are an excellent example of that.
There was more than sufficient evidence and testimony to prove that there was something hideously wrong, but Devin Nunes, Jim Jordan and friends put up a steady defense of the indefensible without even taking a breath.
And the fact that the White House stonewalled witnesses in the administration to keep them from coming forth, then started screaming about how they couldn't present their own witnesses is simply laughable.
As long as this is how America is run, by a bunch of ideologues stuck and uncompromising in their ways, supporting a resident who has run amok with the U.S. Constitution Trump will survive.
And heaven help us all.
4
Part of the problem with trump is that far to many Americans firmly believe ALL politicians are corrupt no matter who or which party. That allows just about any corruption to flourish as long as the economy is zinging along and everyone isn't cast out to the streets to fend for themselves.
1
I don’t buy the premise of this article. The case and charges against Trump are far more serious than those against Nixon, and while the economy is artificially good at the moment, one can hardly refer to 1973 as being an economic “disaster”. No, it’s that standards of morality and decency in politics, while always questionable, have gone from “barely existent” to “below detectable”, plain and simple.
3
For one thing, Russia’s aggression has resulted in victory, not stalemate: Trump is president. As for the economy, Mr. Douthat might want to look a bit beyond the stock market to the average soybean farmer’s balance sheet, or the young family’s bank account. The cracks aren’t just showing, they’re gaping. If enough voters still choose to ignore them a year from now, well, the author will have his disaster. So will the rest of us.
3
Ah yes, the oft-mentioned voter who pays little attention to the day to day politics of Washington. Little do they know or care of the rotten smell emanating from the nation's capital. To them, a pittance of extra change in their pockets and headlines of a roaring stock market (of which they have no participation in) means that things are good. Those things that the Democrats complain endlessly about? Problems hundreds of miles away. Yessir, the sun is shining (hotter than usual for this time of year), the birds are singing (fewer birds than expected), and it's a beautiful day in America. Ignorance truly is bliss.
2
RE: "as whether an embattled president is seen as presiding over stability or crisis, over good times or potential ruin."
Well, the other big difference not mentioned is the rise of right wing talk radio and FOX News which have served as the propaganda arm of the Republican party and for millions tells them whether a president is seen as presiding over stability or crisis, over good times or potential ruin.
And no, despite what the propaganda says the "liberal MSM" is not the same for the Democrats. If it were it would have never published the negative reports of Hillary Clinton.
2
Indeed, from the Mandate of Heaven common in Asian societies, to support of the great man in Africa, to our inability to act against a President who is manifestly lawless and criminally transactional, humans blindly follow their leaders, however the man achieved leadership. This is clear in our histories. How often did northern European communities defenester corrupt officials anyway? Mr. Douthat has brilliantly connected the disaster dots with our support of this POTUS. Sadly, we have a hard time seeing the locomotive of our collective malfeasance with respect to our Earth environment and each other (gross inequality is not due to Boy or Girl Scout behaviors) bearing down on us during this brief interlude between lesser disasters, which arise as a matter of course in human affairs. I wish us luck for the next year. Mr. Trump isn't suited to respond well to disasters; witness Puerto Rico and the immigration crisis. His strategy was to ignore Puerto Rico and imprison, abuse, and expose immigrant children to death by various means. Our own racism allows Puerto Ricans to continue to suffer and immigrant children to die. These are heavy karmic debts we will not pay off in how many lifetimes? Add those to the deficit that has ballooned under Mr. Trump and the GOP, as well as the trust destroyed between the US and its allies since WWII. None of these disasters have convinced the US voter to abandon Mr. Trump. This is The People's failure. Time to evolve.
1
Sadly, the gist of Mr. Douthat's commentary is probably quite right. I hadn't considered the fact that during Nixon's impeachment hearings the country was having a lot of deep problems. That they were not of his making didn't matter.
These arguments make it obvious to me that the best case scenario here is to get through the hearings, leave Trump with enough deep scars to weaken him during his election campaign. I believe that there are now enough open wounds exposed to the elements to defeat Mr. Trump in 2020. It's starting to seem to me that just about anybody in the Trump administration who could be indicted, has been indicted. And many convicted as well. Certainly an inordinate number.
We members of the jury, the American voters, find the defendant guilty of so many moral and ethical lapses. And we believe that to allow said defendant to remain in public office constitutes a grave threat to our republic. Penalty to be announced on the night of November 3rd, 2020. Fire the liar. Dump Trump. Decency counts.
1
Douthat is right, the Current man will be re-elected and survive impeachment. I think for more or less the reasons provided.
I take issue with the tiny charge that Democrats are extremists. Why is it extremism to want to return the tax code to the great-again 1950s, and have the health care system that Canada has? This is not Leninism. It just a society that works, and doesn’t have people ruined because they got sick.
2
It's all about numbers. As long as Trump has enough White nationalist voters to keep him in office, he won't be impeached since these same people also keep Senate Republicans in office. Big Business, which keeps these same Republicans awash in campaign funding, will also do their part to keep Trump in office, since he is their man in the oval office. A sorry state of affairs and only in America.
1
Mr. Douthat, I’m not feeling this stability you seem to believe Americans experience. Instead, I believe many are deeply disturbed by unpredictable mass shootings, racial hatred, and chaos in the White House and Congress, not to mention violent unrest across the globe. Listening to our president and Republican politicians lie daily gives me grave doubts about their basic mental health and integrity - the opposite of stability. As a recent retiree, I’m expecting a stock market crash any day now. At least some of us are frozen, watching the dike sprouting multiple holes without enough fingers to plug them all. I can’t trust America anymore if we can’t uphold the rule of law and impeach a criminal president.
4
I disagree with Mr Douthat assertion that it will take an international or national crisis for Republicans to abandon Trump,
Lets break down what Mr Douthat claims were contributing factors in getting Trump elected in 2016.
But one reason Trump managed to get elected was that the waning years of Barack Obama’s second term felt chaotic and dangerous across multiple fronts.
1. With the rise of the Islamic State,
I doubt that this was a talking point over family dinners in Scranton Pa.
2. The Russian seizure of Crimea and the Ukrainian quasi-war,
The average Trump supporter could not point to The Crimea on a map, turning to Ukraine, other than their certainty that Ukraine has something to do with the Dems Witch Hunt against Trump, I doubt the average Trump supporter knows that Kiev is Ukraine's capital .
3 Modest increase in crime and a series of terrorist attacks domestically.
Mr Douthat may have touched on something here,Trumps claim that Mexican immigrants are all criminals , and Muslims are terrorists who hate us and want to kill us, may have struck a chord, and I am sure gained Trump many votes.
4.And a version of the child migrant crisis that has recurred under Trump.
Really so back in 2016 your average Trump supporter was a progressive ,advocating for DACA and a reform of our immigration laws ,'I think not'.
Mr Douthat, Trumps support then and now is largely motivated by one factor 'Race'. That is an Opinion piece I doubt you will ever write.
3
We have coasted through on his first three years. The stock market has stayed up, although most analysts say the president has little to do with that. Therefore shortsighted Americans think all is well. They like Trump because like them, he can’t see anything but here and now. No deeper thinking required. Slogans and simple solutions to complex problems.
However, behind the scenes they Republicans are gleefully destroying all kinds of regulations which will have long term effects, probably after the fool is even dead. Also, chaos as the norm might slide by in somewhat stable times, but what happens if a real crisis occurs? Chaos, instability, a mercurial personality, huge ego, bullying temperament, faith in one’s gut, lack of understanding and a propensity to blame others are not good ingredients to meet a time of crisis.
Also, he has created upheaval with our allies, bootlicked our enemies, and acted like he rules the world. Who knows what would happen if the right circumstance occurred and how our “allies” would respond? If I’m another country, I don’t send my military into harm’s way to bail Trump out.
It amazes me some of our enemies hav acted in a more overt manner.
1
“Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme.”
I get so sick and tire of this both-siderism! The Democrats have NOT swung to an ideological extreme. The furthest of them are still to the right of FDR and the rest of the first world nations. They are NOT ideological, they effectively solving real problems with practical solutions.
3
This President has unprecedented corruption. Democrats who undertook this Hearing gave a lot of their time, effort, sweat, and toil to make sure this endeavor was fair. It's easy on the sidelines to make calls, but they are on the front. A thankless job............
2
Where is all this Trump corruption? He is not selling access or America's resources for personal gain as the former SOS did. He is not using the IRS or other departments of government to attack the opposing party. He's not secretly pushing guns into Mexico. He's not bribing other countries with planeloads of cash. He is not spying on his opponents. Everything he does is transparent, unlike his predecessor. Making a suggestion to the leader of a notoriously corrupt country doesn't seem quite so bad when viewed against the above abuses.
2
Great: A well stated argument for just muddling and accepting widespread corruption and mediocrity. And not a word about climate change, the destruction of our national parks or the decimation of the EPA.
Yay America.
2
If there were Republicans in Congress who gave a hoot about this country the President would be removed. What we are witnessing with Trump's criminal conspiracy to subvert the 2020 election is a disaster. Good try at rewriting history though.
3
In the matter of Andrew Johnson, there was "a clear cascade of disasters," although it mostly amounted to horrific violence against black people. I'm sure that at the time, there were profoundly silly people who thought the Radical Republicans who opposed him had swung too far to the "left." Maybe that's why Johnson survived impeachment.
Impeachment as a campaign tool rips the country apart.
1
The economy may be good, but any gains made or sustained under the Trump administration are purely accidental. They are the product of forces over which Trump has no control, dedicated public servants who keep America on course despite the chaos, and simple luck. With the high rate of turnover in his administration, unfilled and/or acting positions of responsibility in various agencies, and Mr. Trump’s disordered style and lack of a predictable course of action, it’s any wonder our country has not crumbled. The fact that it has not, speaks to the strength of the republic and our form of government. But even the strongest nation can only withstand so much abuse.
Trump survives from the dereliction of duty and violation of the oath of office of Republican members of Congress.
Nothing else.
308
@Justin Yes, there are no "heroes" among Republicans like in past administrations. They will fight for Trump and leave him in office so they can have a 2nd term and destroy the US and the rest of the World.
12
you know what? all these thoughts by columnists and responses by readers are all very fine and well....but I gotta live day by day in a state of anxiety and disgust due to the onslaught of activity by both the media and the political world- I'm old now, and have lived through watergate, irangate and now this.....and this is the scariest one yet because more is at stake and the current media diaspora makes it impossible for people to know what is really going on
2
@Darby Moore For the truth turn to FOX news. For the anxiety get an emotional support puppy.
See, not difficult.
Russ, I think you just "proved" that Americans can't actually manage a democracy. Thankfully, we have Donald Trump running the ship of state and he is on a mission to remove the last vestiges of the old style democracy.
1
Re”The lesson of past impeachments might be that it takes disasters, not just scandals, to remove a president from office.“
No— it’s a distinction without a difference.
A close cousin to the false equivalency trap.
Don’t fall in.
1
Americans are a little more concerned about safeguarding our shared freedoms then Mr. Douthat gives with a superficial is the economy good or is the sky falling. Americans enlist in the US military every day with the oath to defend the constitution from enemies foreign and domestic. As a Federal judge stated yesterday this president is attempting to turn our nation into a monarchy. It is very comforting to see our institutions rejecting these ideas that reduce liberty and increase tyranny. The US Constitution will survive Donald Trump.
It sounds like Mr. Douthat is suggesting that there are shifts in government when there are periods of instability. My years of following politics (around 50 years) lead me to suggest that it isn't so much instability that leads to change and that stability supports the current government, but that it is the *change* from stability that leads to the change.
It seems to me that Americans are reluctant to 'change horses in the middle of the stream' and so will stick with whoever is in the WH through the crisis period and then when the crisis subsides and the light at the end of the tunnel is, in fact, the end and not the train, we will vote for someone different to live in the WH.
If the destabilization happens early in a presidency, the voters will choose to remain with that president until it is all clear and not attempt to change horses midstream; should the destabilization happen toward the end of the term, that president is toast. For example, had the hostage crisis during Carter's presidency happened closer to 1976, Carter would've been re-elected.
We are in a period of apparent stability, so I suggest that Trump will neither be impeached nor defeated at the ballot box.
I agree. Unless Trump's actions affect them personally, some Americans don't care what he does. Unless Trump shoots one of their family members on 5th Avenue, they're okay with him shooting people. Trump is not the entire problem. The problem is our country's own apathy.
The irony of all of this, is that conservatives among the GOP once were the party of family values, moral ethics and fiscal responsibility. All of which has gone out the window in the mad grab for power, money and fame.
Trump is only a symptom of a greater problem. A segment of our country puts party over country. Their 401(k) over immoral behavior. And snapping their next Facebook selfie over democracy.
Thankfully, that's not all of us. Thankfully, America still stands for something. In the past, whenever our country has swung too far to one side--during the next election America tends to auto-correct.
Am betting whoever the Dems put up on 2020 wins by a landslide.
Even with repeated scandals, foreign/domestic policy disasters and constitutional/moral transgressions Trump is surviving, it is because the complete surrender of the Republican lawmakers to his command and the ready willingness to abdicate their constitutional duties as the lawmakers.
In the days of Nixon, we had Republicans who put country first. Now we have the likes of Jordan and Graham, who don't offer a "defense" — so much as outright lie, pushing "fictional narrative" worthy of Putin's propaganda department, all in violation of their own constitutional oaths. It "matters," greatly, Mr. Douthat. Why you gloss over their complicity says much about your party and its participation in the erosion of democracy. Trump's entire presidency has been one unchecked, lawless "disaster." Keep looking the other way.
3
@Brunella Fox first, country last. This is how republicans roll - and will be remembered.
No Ross, what all this says is that many US citizens are incapable of rational analysis.
263
@Brian - I agree but would amend your observation as: Incapable of rational analysis when it runs counter to emotional biases and comforts. I am reminded of a very old tv comedy sketch in which one character closes his eyes, plugs his fingers into his ears and loudly hums “Three Cheers for the Red, White, and Blue” to avoid hearing unwanted opinions. These days we call that Fox News.
14
@Brian Funny, Brian -- that's just what people like me think about those who believe they have a sound basis for impeaching and convicting this President. Precisely what we think. (And, yes, some of us were rational enough to get through law schools become and remain members of one or more state bars.)
3
@Percy41
There’s no shortage of crazy lawyers out there. And an appeal to authority (or in this case, one’s credentials) is a classic logical fallacy. The basis for trump’s impeachment is perfectly sound.
21
Can't wait to check in on the "best economy of all time" in 5-10 years. I'm sure climate change and environmental collapse will do great things for it.
1
Haven’t we had enough disasters to qualify?
I prefer not to wait for more and worse.
3
The polls show a nearly 50/50 split regarding removal of Trump from his duties of the presidency. That means half of the U.S. citizenry needs to be convinced that they are in harm's way. So we need to define each segment that comprises the U.S. citizenry, then define the problems they encounter day-to-day, and then determine whether or not their problems are being adequately addressed. Skip the D/democrat-versus-R/republican branding -- and even history. Focus on who is hurting in the present sense -- and why, and for how long -- and what that segment of humans will need to do as their part in the solution. Our humble opinion is hereby respectfully submitted.
1
Even if 100% of Trump's supporters who voted for him in 2016 vote again for him in 2020, it's not enough. Trump only needs to lose one battleground state and the electoral path nearly disappears.
The only way Trump can win again is through continued Russian intervention into our elections, and more voter suppression. Now both of those are likely to still occur, but many people are just plain tired of the chaos and drama and nonstop Trump.
1
Sometimes I wonder why decision makers do listen to Noam Chomsky who said, and rightly so, that it was not politically wise to start impeachment procedures. The democrats are driven but as a party do not seem to come to well thought through steps to take. Scary, regarding what is at stake and very understandable that Michael Bloomberg thought he should run.
2
my financial advisors always run monte carlo simulations of past market performance in order to put bounds around future market performance.
past is prologue or, in financial speak, the future is just the past, but better.
still, after 2008, i'm not inclined to view the future as just more of the past -- but better.
i'm inclined to view the future as: less of the past, and "oops!"
no, i won't rehearse my sermons about complexity and marginal costs and whatever.
but i will say: the country has devolved into two countries posing as a single country. it's like trump, pretending he's a republican, but taking over the republican party.
john mccain died, and whatever you think of heroes that were captured, now you have republicans who merely spew russian propaganda because they think it keeps them in power.
shouldn't there be two USAs, then, one for the people who just spew russian propaganda, and a second USA for the rest of us who still trust our intelligence establishment?
after all, "intelligence" just means educated, and "establishment" just means elites. and those educated elites, where have they taken us, really?
aren't they hiding the fact that the earth is flat, and contrails are poison, and the ukrainians did it, and jesus is our savior? i rest my case.
so, yes: let's do what needs to be done in iraq, and split the country into two parts.
let the futility of impeachment teach us all: there's no other alternative available.
Well, the way he is going about it, I would not be surprised if Trump’s foreign policy led to a “real” disaster in his second term, should we be unfortunate enough to see him re-elected. By then it will be too late.
1
If you ignore his awful behavior, speeches and tweets, Trump has a decent record.
The economy is doing well. Unemployment and inflation is very low; GDP is rising at a healthy rate. Markets are doing great. All he needs now is a China trade deal.
Internationally he hasn’t gotten us into a major conflict, and is pulling us out of unpopular ones. Most Americans see at least some merit in his overtures to our adversaries - Russia and North Korea, and respect his decision to pull back from bombing Iran.
Many on the left criticize his policies Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia and Israel, but most Americans either aren’t following these issues, or aren’t so sure he is wrong.
This is a good record to run on. The question is whether his bad behavior is enough to change the outcome. I don’t know, but agree with those who say that it largely depends on who the democrats pick as the alternative.
3
@Steven Roth Spot on.
Steven, your notion of Trump’s “record” is simply a list of coincidences. Trump, the brainless inarticulate posturer, is capable neither of executing any steps to produce these results, nor of appointing anyone who can.
A man who can’t count, can’t tell whether he is standing in the rain, and can’t stay on topic long enough to finish a compound sentence.
Trump will survive because his impeachment is partisan. Nixon was so bad that once Republicans jumped on the bandwagon, he was doomed and resigned rather than face conviction in the Senate. Clinton's impeachment was partisan and the effects were a backlash against the GOP for pressing the issue unilaterally. Remember that although Clinton clearly perjured himself and obstructed justice, there was no one on the left that thought it worthy of impeachment. Republicans today are being demonized for not jumping on the Democratic bandwagon which does little to make converts to press the issue. Trump, like Clinton, has committed dreadful and illegal acts, but dreadful and illegal is not enough. Two parties must agree to remove a president. That is the bar yet to be reached.
As I have said in another place but perhaps worth repeating, temporary economic gain trumpian immorality doe snot equate with good governance. We have lost the forest for the trees as we think comfort for some not all makes us a great nation. Perhaps I am shouting into the wind, but at one time I thought our integrity as a nation which Trump disregards really the source of our greatness.
3
"But one reason Trump managed to get elected was that the waning years of Barack Obama’s second term felt chaotic and dangerous across multiple fronts "
If Obama's second term felt increasingly chaotic, it was because the GOP stonewalled any attempts Obama made to address problems.
7
"... conservatives can argue that Clinton survived and Nixon didn’t because Republicans were more honorable in 1974 and Democrats more partisan in 1998."
Huh? Really? They can?
Unlike you, I lived through Watergate. Nixon was NOT brought down by the economic shocks of 1973-74. He engaged in serious criminal behavior and got caught. That's why he had to resign. He was hurt by things like not paying income taxes while he was president, to which add that he was hardly a likable guy to begin with. But we don't impeach a president because of gas lines or unemployment.
2
Like many Americans who lived through the nonsensical Clinton impeachment over lying about an extramarital affair between two consenting adults pushed during the apogee of the Republican morality wars of the 90's, we bristle at any comparison of Donald Trump's genuine crimes and misdemeanors. Even Nixon's botched breaking and entering scheme seems quaint compared to the global scope of Trump's crimes. Trump's impeachment is indeed both morally and Constitutionally correct regardless of it not succeeding in the co-conspiratorial Republican controlled Senate. Doing the right thing is never wrong. Otherwise, corruption and chaos wins and ethics and lawfulness loses. Democrats should be more than fine in 2020. At some point, one would imagine enough independents and even some Republicans will decide they have had enough of the horrendous reality television show unfolding in the White House. Besides, Trump's brief history in the White House portends more undisciplined and reckless behavior and tweets ahead of 2020. He won't shut up which should be ultimately beneficial for Democratic chances.
3
Whether the President will "survive" impeachment will depend on his political support in Congress, not on some perception by "lukewarm" voters that things are generally okay. Mr. Douthat apparently forgets that President Nixon resigned when he lost that support, and President Clinton was stayed in office because he kept it. President Nixon's support collapsed when conclusive evidence emerged that he plotted the Watergate cover-up a few days after the break-in with the release of the so-called 'smoking gun' tape (ordered by the Supreme Court), and not before. This is the kind of evidence that is missing in the current impeachment inquiry, and why President Trump has not lost his political support, yet. It will take that kind of direct evidence for that to occur, not the parade of permanent government types that have graced the hearing room to this point.
Outside events do create the context for all of this. Indeed, context, image, along with short term and long term historical memory work together to generate how people respond to any situation. If Nixon had simply admitted the whole Watergate situation was wrong to begin with, I doubt he would have had to leave office. For his part, Clinton survived because of the success of the economy at that time, but I believe his actions in the White House did have an impact on the 2016 election. Who among us was not a little more than nauseated with the thought of Bill Clinton once again wandering the halls of the White House where - as President of the United States - he'd had an affair with an intern? What we've learned about him since his time there has only deepened how America feels about his creepy actions. If the Me Too movement was around in the 90's, he'd have been out on his ear. The same is true for Kennedy, who did far worse than Clinton, but times were different then. Trump (ready for this. . . ) out trumps Nixon and Clinton, but I doubt he'll be forced out of office. It's going to take a genuine crisis that has a major effect on white America, and I don't see that happening - yet. Trumps behavior has forced the Democrats to impeach him, but the culture - the conservative white culture - is blind to the moment. Rebuke him now, and work to vote him out next November. Work at it. Wishful thinking won't do the trick.
1
What "idiological extreme" is it that the Democrats have swung to, Mr. Douthat? You mean wanting to access healthcare without going bankrupt, or having billionaires pay taxes just like the rest of us? Maybe we're tired of having our votes discounted by an unelected body of people called the Electoral College, or being able to afford college without going into debt for the rest of our lives.
Too extreme for what? It may be too extreme for you but it hasn't been for the other developed and civilized nations on earth who provide these things for their citizens.
19
@Entera \
Hear, hear.
A decent society takes care of its own. All of them.
Health care is a right in my country. It may not be perfect, but we can get to a doctor when we need one and if we get really sick we don't have to lose our homes to pay for it.
1
@Entera
And never mind that Medicare for All is supported by over 60% across the political spectrum --
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/2020-polls-national-health-care-plan-favored-by-most-americans-cbs-news-poll-finds/
1
When I retired from managing an organization that on paper and in minds of customers/employees was going great, a retired colleague in another industry offered up the following observation: "Congratulations---you should know that your successor will take about three years to dismantle what you have built and then another two years to suffer through the decline of a once successful business." The same could be said about Trump Presidency--it is taking about three years to dismantle the systems and economy built by Obama, and now, the next year and maybe four, we will all suffer through consequences of systems and policies that bear no resemblance to Obama's tenure, and, will reflect Trump's brand of executive bankruptcy.
7
The strongest argument against impeachment may be to avoid throwing a molotov cocktail at the members of the Trump cult who are extremely well armed and under-educated and will heed Trump's inevitable claim that he is the victim of a liberal coup d'tat.
The problem is that Trump will make the same claim if he's soundly defeated at the polls in 2020 and the same group will embrace his claim as literal gospel.
2
"Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
Can we please stop the false equivalency? The most "extreme" Democrats are more like the mainstream European left: subsidized college education, universal healthcare, living wage. Debatable, but nothing "extreme" here. Trump and the Republican party is acting to end political asylum (at least for non-white people without money), denial of climate change and any scientific evidence which they don't like, normalizing collusion with foreign governments to smear political opponents, and dismantling any social welfare program that may exist. The only equivalency is that both parties have an endless desire to increase military spending (i.e. corporate welfare for defense contractors).
5
An alternative for the Democrats is to decline impeachment but create a scathing Censure proposal that is extremely well written to effectively box in a lot of Republicans. In other words, call out Trump’s ethical lapses and corruption so perfectly that Republicans must come along for the ride and vote for it too or be explicitly seen as corrupt themselves and worthy of being voted out as well in 2020 or 2024. The Censure could even state “a vote for is a vote against the corrupt behavior, a vote against condones it”. Republicans need to have their toes held to the fire to separate themselves from Trump. If they can’t be brought along to convict in the Senate, then at least force them to either declare themselves either exactly like Trump, or separate from him, in the House.
1
It's simply not true "that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme." Fighting for affordable health care, higher education and housing, for addressing climate change and income inequality, for reigning in corporate excess and addressing big tech monopolies are not extremist positions. They are supported by strong majorities across the country. So tired of extreme right-wing rhetoric!
14
On this, Ross Douthat is right. It's difficult to draw a bold line connecting his conduct in Ukraine to the well-being of the average American.
But if Americans truly understood the danger that the climate crisis represents to today's children and their children, even the MAGA crowd would join in riding Trump out of town on a rail.
CO2 levels continue to rise, and Trump continues his disinformation campaign on climate change and promotes the use of fossil fuels. What he did in Ukraine was a crime. There are any number of ways in which he has violated his oath of office. But what he is trying to do to the environment we depend on for life is the greatest crime imaginable.
3
@writeon1
What is your plan to require China and India to reduce their CO2 levels under force of law?
1
@Dr. John
You have a good point, but if you were Chinese or Indian, I think you would be saying exactly the same thing about the US. If we all wait for the other guy to take action, we are doomed.
First of all, we can lead by example. Why should anyone listen to us about reducing the use of fossil fuels if we are working to increase their use? Secondly, we can form trade alliances that favor nations that are working to reduce CO2 emissions. Nations that don't should become international pariahs. Thirdly, by developing and using clean energy technology we can drive its price down and market it to the rest of the world. Those are just a few ways in which we can influence the behavior of other nations. We can't coerce them by "force of law" or militarily. But we can make it less expensive and politically beneficial for them to join in the effort. And we can move the whole process along by getting rid of the world's leading climate change denier who currently resides in the White House.
@writeon1
Imagine if France told the 1700-1800
settlers of the US to stop cutting down trees and destroying virgin forests.
The lesson of past impeachments is that they've never succeeded.
Another lesson is that there will soon be four impeachments in our history, and three of them will have happened in my lifetime.
2
Your colleague David Brooks has pointed out more than once that impeachment is not playing well across broad swaths of America. It is not showing up on grocery lists. Many, many Americans apparently see this as just another political spitting match in DC. And, apparently, this is showing up in the polls.
President Clinton's strategy, as described by Mr. Hitchens in a less than flattering book about the former president, was described as triangulation, basically taking the wind out of your opponents political sails by co-option.
Here is my solution. Democrats vote against articles of impeachment in the House saying that the American voter should be the jury for or against the corruption, the abuse of power. This avoids a mock trial in the Senate where the result is more or less assured. It actually empowers American voters to vote their conscience in deciding whether to give this president another four years. Clearly, their message could be, the evidence is unassailable, you decide.
3
I’ve been thinking about this too. I think a strong statement of censure and public condemnation might be most effective at this point in time. But we really need trump to be gone. Sooner rather than later.
1
The economy is great and he’s entertaining. That’s enough for me. This Obama voter is sticking with Trump.
1
@M
Thank you for explaining why the U.S. is a failed and failing state.
Americans care about their wallet and their personal security. Whatever events transpire in Washington or abroad are always filtered through the lens of I, me and mine.
3
The propoganda has been effective. The economy is going very well-- for the well-off.
What about the 45% of Americans who don't have an investment portfolio? And, in 2016, the richest 10 percent of households controlled 84% of the total value of these stocks. Or how about Americans who don't have or cannot afford health care? What about the families drowning in debt and student loans? Farmers and Minimum wage workers... how y'all doing?
2
What is proved time and again is that the power of any body of law depends on the willingness of those who administer government to act in good faith. For all Nixon's faults, ultimately he acted in good faith by resigning after Watergate. With subpoenas, evidently anyone with enough clout can defy them long enough to win a battle that ultimately depends on timing: benefit accrues by not testifying within a certain period of time, so that eventually submitting (paying no penalty for the delay) is relatively worthless to the opposition.
Numerous examples of good order depending on good faith abound. Mitch McConnell vis a vis Garland-to-Gorsuch. The GOP storming of the Bastil- er, the SCIF, ordering pizza and other silliness. Complaining about House hearing rules even though your party is the one that changed the rules the other now works from. State legislatures voting in bills right after an election that limit the scope of power for the incoming administration.
They're examples of things that are legal or not illegal per se, that just should not be done if operating in good faith under the law, precedent, and fair governing.
Trump has exposed this feature of government. He cares nothing for law, precedent, good faith, etc. And since any body of law has gaps (one reason we have judges), a bold enough criminal can live in those gaps and cause a lot of chaos. And Trump is, if nothing else, an agent of chaos.
Btw, allowing Ukrainegate type shenanigans would be a disaster.
3
The reason Trump survives is he did nothing more or worse than what every politician does every day.
If the allegations are true, the calculus underlying his official actions included his own personal political considerations, including how to weaken a potential opponent.
Every politician does this every day. From members of zoning boards to town councilors to state senators to governors to US House and Senate members. And presidents.
That's why US voters (except rabid Dems who would have impeached Trump on day one) don't care.
9
Strongly disagree.
Every president takes politics into consideration, and every president conditions aid to foreign countries on compliance with our human rights and anti-corruption demands (among other democracy-promoting policies). But this president is alone in conditioning foreign aid ($ from bipartisan law adopted by Congress) on compliance with demands that promote not our national interest or policies but his own personal political benefit.
That is the crucial distinction. In our system, the president must advance the policies and interests of the nation, that is the job.
tRump tried to use the vast powers of his office to rig the next election in his favor by extorting foreign help. Textbook impeachable conduct.
60
@Stuck on a mountain your title says it all. In my city I have worked with Councilmen of both parties on a few local issues. They are men of integrity. So is my Congresswoman and both of my Senators.
Younger folk still have hope. Where did yours go?
5
@Stuck on a mountain
Strongly agree!
Impeachment has no credibility since it was uttered on day one.
2
A provocative article. But as I reflect on the two recent impeachments, I remember that Nixon was already very unpopular with young voters and Republican insiders who were opposed to his vice presidential nomination under Eisenhower. Nixon, like Trump was infamous for his “dirty tricks” campaign style. Clinton on the other hand was unpopular only with the increasingly fanatical Republicans. (You should look into them a bit more Ross). The Trump impeachment has much more in common with the Nixon impeachment with its “dirty tricks” than any other issue, such as global stability.
3
The staggering national debt seems a high price to pay for a "strong economy". Can it even be described as such with that high a cost?
Trump's casinos were cash cows until it came time to pay the bills. There's no bankruptcy relief for the Treasury.
5
@Casey
The Democratic House is now responsible for spending and taxes.
Most conservatives prize loyalty and sanctity. Although sanctity is being challenged by this administration, and some, including Douthat, have peeled off because of this, most conservatives remain loyal to their hero and will not be shaken. This explains the solid base of Trump support. The quote about shooting someone on Fifth Avenue was one of the few true claims by Trump.
2
Writer and analysts would always have opinion and can accurately analysis events that have already taken place. But they failed to predict any future in their analysis. More often, they are wrong !
And the economy grew continuously for six and a half years under Obama. I’d guess it rose a lot more than $6 trillion from the depths of the recession during that time. The economy has CONTINUED growing, effectively at the same rate. Sort of remember Trump made a promise on January 20 2017: “ to protect preserve and defend the Constitution” Certainly hasn’t delivered on that one!
5
I'm most intrigued by the disregard of the law, itself. Article II Section 4 of the Constitution specifically provides that the "The President...shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of...Bribery.
If Mr. Trump committed bribery, which now appears to be provable beyond reasonable doubt, then he "shall" be removed from office.
There shouldn't be any discussion of what the public opinion may be.
The only discussion should be whether the Senate will follow the law.
8
Allow me to outline Ross’ companion piece, which you will see here in four years: And so the economy continued solid and Trump was re-elected after the most divisive, nasty campaign in history, littered with blatant voter intimidation and suppression efforts in the swing states Trump narrowly carried. A reenergized Trump took this as a mandate to make up for time lost to the restraints of his first term, committing a series of retaliatory nasty acts aimed at political and business rivals, foreign and domestic, culminating in a purge of thousands of government employees who were not political appointments. That’s when the business cycle started to trend down. Trump reacted to the bad news by blaming everyone and everything but himself. He impulsively reacted when the economy called for steady action, turning recession into depression. That’s when we went to war. And throughout, somehow his support remained at just under 40%.
4
Mr Douthat: What is "ideologically extreme" about the Democratic majority in the House of Representatives trying to conduct their Constitutionally obligated duty and try to restrain the illegitimate overreach of the Executive branch, which just happens to include ethical and moral misconduct that borders on criminal activity.
In your heart you know the President actions required this impeachment inquiry. After all, the GOP spent 6 years chasing Clinton under similar circumstances--they wanted to overturn the voters choice. It took an insider to reveal information obtained from a personal conversation that was probably made in confidence before the finally found something from which to pursue impeachment. Not unlike Trump's defense of his own misconduct ("it was a perfect call"), it was Clinton's own denials that brought on the impeachment actions in the first place.
In the case of Clinton's impeachment, he was eventually trapped by the GOP's continual investigations into all aspects of his professional and personal life. Conversely, Trump's own behavior and actions alone drive the need for the investigations. That is where the parallels end.
10
Mr. Douthat we have a natural disaster occurring right this minute and Trump and the Republicans have left us to solve it for ourselves. Climate change has reached disastrous proportions and yet the Trump administration has done everything possible to increase the American carbon foot which is contributing to rapidly increase climate change. Impeachment in your opinion may not be the perfect solution but the only near term solution to recognizing that facts do matter and the biggest fact we face is America is on a crash course with science and that Republicans support for Trump just maybe deadly.
3
@Jena-Exactly - except let's not call climate change a 'natural' disaster. It is a manmade catastrophe that didn't have to be had humans been evolved enough to think far beyond their current pea-brained capability. Failed species.
2
Hate to disillusion you, Jena, but the earth will still be here in 12 years (even 100 years) and there will still be seasons...like cold winters and warm to hot summers. The beachfront properties will still be there. The weather might be slightly warmer or slightly cooler because nobody can predict the future.
2
So Democrats have swung to an "extreme", meaning a diluted version of New Deal liberalism promoted by two its presidential candidates, and with the balance of the party best described as right and center-right, given the usual democratic norms in rich industrial democracies today?
If that's extreme, what do we say of Republicans?
And what do we say of Ross Douthat?
4
There sure is some irony in citing "the Russian seizure of Crimea and the Ukrainian quasi-war" as a jibe against President Obama. We now know that trump confidantes, including Manafort and Gilliani, among others, essentially acted as paid assistants to the Russian state during that aggression. They acted, behind closed doors, against US policy and interests - just to make a buck.
13
Here's a provocation that *is* true: people-- especially the growing number of voters under the age of 40-- are not aware that Trump is ACCELERATING GLOBAL WARMING. Singlehandedly, Trump-- with full support by Republicans-- is destroying earth as a habitable planet.
Anyone who is aware of what is coming is thankful to be old enough they won't see the worst effects of global warming, or is bitterly angry if they are young enough that their normal lifespan would take them 50 years into the future.
Earth is on a path to loss of plants, fresh water, pollinating insects, habitable shorelines as mega-fires, flooding, and storms increase in strength and size, causing death and destruction-- as increasing human populations take out wildlife at ever increasing unsustainable rates. Recent disasters are just a sample of much more in store.
WHY I MUST SPEAK OUT ABOUT CLIMATE CHANGE
https://www.lifeintherightdirection.com/speak-out-about-climate-change/
Video
https://www.ted.com/talks/james_hansen_why_i_must_speak_out_about_climate_change/transcript
What can we do about this, to start?
Vote Trump and Republicans out of office.
They've shown how much they care about you: show them you care too!
2
@M Sure M what you say is absolutely true but hey , look at how great the stock market is doing . Why should we care if we’re destroying everything good on the planet as long as we have a few extra material possessions before we have no place to live . Let’s hope that there’s intelligent life on some other planet because there sure isn’t here .
1
This article should be framed as a template. Not because it is accurate but because it is riddled with errors.
1. The misconduct of Nixon and Clinton were viewed differently. That of Nixon was seen as being criminal (burglary, plain and simple) while that of Clinton was seen as being unethical. We all know which one would seem more egregious as it pertains to the behavior of a leader. So Nixon got outed and Clinton survived. The economic argument was irrelevant even considering that the Clinton administration had put us on a surplus compared to the historical deficits that we suffer when Republicans are in office - please look at the deplorable record of Ronald Reagan.
2. It is not just simply revisionism to portray the later part of the Obama years as being chaotic but quite simply wrong as borne out by data - gun violence, Russian aggression, Islamist based terrorism, unemployment trends etc. were all steadily on their way down during the Obama years compared to when he took office. The one data point that conservatives like to point out, quite erroneously, as proof that the economy is doing well - the stock market - performed spectacularly during the Obama years : 2009-2016 with annualized gain of 17% per year in the SP500 compared to an annualized gain of 12.6% per year during the last 3.
3. Poverty rates have ticked up sense Trump assumed power. Anybody notice it ?
So please make arguments that make sense. The NY Times is not Breitbart News.
27
A demonstrable violation of your constitution and a failure of the president to uphold his oath to protect it really ought to be the only issues on the table whenever you are considering the removal of a president.
To state the obvious, Trump has demonstrably violated the constitution, repeatedly, and has as often failed to uphold the oath of office he took.
Boot the guy to the curb immediately and don't look back.
8
So, Ross is making the argument that is the thesis of 'Hillbilly Elegy': Living is a chaotic culture is the only life the author had ever known. Chaos is its own form of stability.
Spousal abuse, drug use, alcoholism, child abuse- every form of harm and irresponsibility could be normalized in a chaotic system.
146
@ R Ho Plainfield, IN 55m ago
In the name of Heavens, how does one normalize Evil in a chaotic system?
2
@R Ho
Please note, it is the American center that wont call it, and the American left who normalized, the spousal abuse, drug use, alcoholism, child abuse as just alternative lifestyle choices of people from different cultures. Both have taken great care to not call it what they see it as, spoken of cultural and moral and intellectual relativism and post-modernism (post-truth world). This is the world to which they have contributed the most.
@Tuvw Xyz
A blindfold is a useful artifact.
2
"Of course it matters that Trump’s party is craven and debased; of course it matters that the Democrats have swung to an ideological extreme."
I absolutely deny that Democrats have "swung to an ideological extreme." In fact, it is the Republicans who have swung to an ideological extreme AND become craven and debased. Look around you. Abortion rights are being rolled back all around the country. Frank white supremacists are running the White House. Gun rights have never been more expansive. Restrictions on Christian fundamentalists legislating their worldview on everyone else have been thrown out. The feeble and powerless four members of "the Squad," and Bernie Sanders, are at one and the same time the result of Republican extremism, and also completely unrepresentative of Democrats in general. Meanwhile the most extreme Republicans of all are in Republican leadership.
This "both sides-ism" IS the problem. Until it is generally acknowledged that our current dire crisis is NOT the result of anything Democrats have done, but 100% the result of a Republican party gone frankly insane, we cannot possibly solve the problem. For the love of the country, Ross, stop being mealy-mouthed. Say the truth.
3
Most important question:
Do Americans feel safe?
Daily, we must fear mass shootings, skyrocketing life/death healthcare problems and devastating climate change disasters.
Yet Donald Trump resists any and all gun safety measures, continues to tear apart the ACA, rescinding healthcare for millions and just scoffs at warnings about climate change catastrophes, claiming windmills cause cancer.
Instead our Presidents sits in his robe all morning (executive time) tweeting attacks on anyone who might challenge his reckless behaviors and dangerous decisions.
If none of that matters to voters, then Trump's support and devotion to Vladimir Putin should.
Trump's secret meetings and calls with Putin
should terrify every American.
3
Completely lost in this discussion is whether or not the state of the economy is or should be even remotely relevant when we’re looking at the level of corruption and blatant abuse of power we are seeing from this president.
5
I would argue the reverse: Trump's instability, fascinates media!
Yes, there is some stability, but stability can become very boring.
Trump is not boring. He is a "cartoon" hero / villain, who amazes.
By contrast Democrats are so borrring. Obama was "no drama"
Democrats ramble on and most of what they say is forgotten.
Democrats need to stay interesting with real drama.
Democrats need to focus on simple ideas and goals people like.
For example, I suggest a focus on a new democracy, after Trump.
Democrats might use the "Democracy" song of Leonard Cohen.
"Democracy is coming to the USA"
Wake up, Democrats, and stay interesting, for the daily media!
"Democracy is coming to the USA"
(Please discuss the "Democracy" song, NY Times)
1
My response to this article....the economy is NOT okay and the world IS falling apart. This presidency has made the rich richer and the poor poorer. Large parts of the country hurting, in debt, barely getting by. Homes are too expensive. Healthcare and basic needs unattainable. Corporate profits get higher at expense of consumers. Further, we are losing our role as the leader of the free world. We are respected less every day. Seen as a corrupt banana republic. Our self dealing, grandiose president is living large, spending our tax payer dollars at his properties. Hijacking our money to extort foreign governments for his personal gain. He is hiding behind a wall of lawyers who say he is above the law and not subject to inquiry. If this is not impeachable...god help our country.
7
You need a clear cascade of disasters? Real world horrors? Venice flooded, Australia and California on fire, hurricanes of unprecedented ferocity and frequency, species extinction, melting polar ice...I could go on. Why aren't you and the rest of the media more focused on this administration's fealty to the fossil fuel industry, anti-environmental policies, indifference to warnings of national security implications of climate change from the military, and on and on? Connect the dots.
3
It was entertaining - but one term is enough.
1
“It might just be the case that in our system it takes a clear cascade of disasters to pre-emptively remove a president, even a manifestly corrupt one.”
If that’s the case, and it takes persuading voters to remove Trump, will the truth come out and overcome the ability of Republicans and the likes of Fox to use a false narrative to blame the Democrats?
Self preservation is nature’s most dominant force. Trumpeteers yell their loudest when their exenophobia is challenged.
“why give foreign aid, when that money should stay here in our pockets?”....”immigrants take away our jobs”....”who cares about
the U.S fighting foreign wars.”..and so on it goes gradually ascending into a chorus of nastiness showing the worst of human lack of compassion. Me me me abounds!
We are so much a nation of conflicting beliefs it is, as it always has been , a total miracle that order can come out of chaos as America has shown the world. That simply has to be our great example to the world that such an achievement can even exist.
When jobs abound and money is in pockets, whomever he or she might be the current president, the shouts of support are the loudest. So, after all, like we all know ,the presidency comes down to money! Forget all other concerns , domestic or foreign.