To the point and spot on once again, thanks Ms. Goldberg.
Jordan's job is to talk really fast and insert as many obscure individuals' names and inane details, tidbits of context-free trivia that could represent shadowy Deep State Conspiratorial actors--while simultaneously avoiding his own alter persona as the memory-challenged, uber-oblivious OSU wrestling coach denying his way out of a systemic scandal.
Then he asks a few questions--to embellish the pretense that he is interested in any germane fact-finding--as far afield as possible from the substance of the hearings. His lines of inquiry are as relevant as the fact that 'Gordon' rhymes with 'Jordan.'
But in the record. And shown ad nauseum to a cloistered audience of Trump supporters who can then watch the 'news' without closing their eyes and covering their ears.
3
If this is allowed to slide then American democracy is not as strong as democracy in Canada, Australia, UK, and various other Western countries. You guys are supposed to be the leaders in liberal democracy, yet the inability to flush this disease of an administration from your system indicates that your system is inherently weak. Its go nothing to do with politics, Trump is just toxic and rotten to the core, he has multiple personality flaws and is categorically unqualified to hold the powers of the US presidency.
15
What’s ironic to me is that Biden is doing a pretty good job of digging his own gaffe filled hole. Republicans are so ham fisted, they didn’t need to go to the trouble of doing anything. I think the Democrats are right to impeach, but it is a colossal waste of time and resources.
Shame on the Republican Party for going down the Trump path. In my opinion none of these politicians deserve to be in office and collecting tax payer paid salaries. The President and the Congress are wasting everyone’s time.
1
Hey republicans, do you really want to go down with this criminal? There are only so many moments left to jump ship. He needs you more than you need him. Surely there are people in the GOP who care about morality and decency.
10
If repubs were truly interested in corruption and nepotism then why haven't they started an investigation into the jared,Ivanka,DJ and Erics dealings.They''ve made vast amounts of money from daddy being president,yet repubs don't and won't utter a peep.
8
Today, Fiona Hill put the icing on the cake. She in effect stuffed thick woolen socks down the throats of Jim Jordan, Devin Nunes, Kevin McCarthy, Paul Ryan, Lyndsay Graham and the rest of Trumputins ship of fools. Thank you Fiona. Warning - Steven Miller and Donny working on some insulting tweets. Mitch notably hunkered down - closely consulting the Machiavelli book - "The Prize". Looking for a strategy to match the William Barr destruction of the clear and convincing findings of the Mueller Report. Pence - empty suit - engrossed in the scriptures. No answers yet. FOX pundits scrambling for counter punches - as expected - no journalistic integrity there. Supreme Court Justices must be scratching their heads as they weigh in on law suits to overcome Administration obstruction. Seen that puppy before. Now we will see the parsing of integrity and ideology. The final judgement will probably be in the hands of the American voter. The ballot is the equivalent of a bullet. Use it - vote - pump out the overflowing septic tank. Dump Trump et. al. Take America Back!!
4
Devin Nunes, a U.S. citizen knighted by a foreign country for services rendered, is the last person you want on this beat.
Yet here he is. Arise, Senhor Devin, and walk.
2
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Exactly. Thank you, Ms. Goldberg.
3
Brava, brava! Especially: "This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
4
If Giuliani is a scoundrel who lied when he said Trump ordered him to demand a public announcement of an investigation as a requirement to release the military aid against Putin's army, how come Trump did not fire him?
This is the smoking gun that Trump had ordered the quid pro quo.
Lock them up, both are traitors.
4
It's too bad: "Doesn't pass the smell test" has become such a meaningless trope. GOP gaslighting and Trump's doggie-doo defense have risen to the level of greenhouse gasses -- most notably noxious diatribe.
3
Q: Why was Sondand's "note to self" that quoted Trump saying "No Quid Pro Quo" and "I want nothing!" written on an "Aboard Air Force One" notepad?
1
The evidence flowing since the transcript of the perfect phone call, damning in its own right, confirms a conspiracy to bribe Ukraine. The GOP cannot accept the evidence contorting themselves offering bogus explanations. Why?
Is loyalty to Trump the true answer? Trashing the rule of law based on personal loyalty risky business. The deeper answer stems from the realization Trump owns the flock of GOP voters. Repudiating him a finger in the eyes of voters prompting a backlash for Republican members of both Houses. It is the voters loyalty to Trump putting fear in the heads of Senators.
1
Are there any adult public servants available to start running this country again?
2
The big mystery still is what is at the root of the Trump and Putin relationship, from Trump’s side. It’s obvious what Putin is aiming for and gaining. Putin wants to bring the USA down and isolate us from allies, getting Trump to accomplish this for him, in order to re establish the Russian empire and hold the most power possible.
What is Trump getting? Aggravation and undermined legitimacy.
Ironically even as a fragile narcissist who can’t see beyond his own interests and attention needs, Trump doesn’t need Putin. Once president, he had all the power and attention anyone can have, there’s nothing Putin can give him he wouldn’t already have, if only he acted like a ‘normal’ president without deferring to Putin’s interests and undermining ours.
1
I'd like to see the House Dems build on Fiona Hill's testimony ASAP, and push McConnell & the Senate to now enact significant legislation and money to protect our 2020 election and educate the public about Russian bots, etc. The GOP might possibly give in to show they are not also Putin's puppets. If they don't, it's another election talking point for the Dems running for Senate seats. Wishful thinking I suppose, but maybe...
1
It is not legal to enlist a foreign government to assist any public official, let alone the president) in their own election efforts. Period. And to hold funds, legislatively signed into law and cleared to go, till the receiving country agreed to get some dirt on your opponent in that coming election is clearly extortion.
Does a president have a right to conduct foreign policy in line with a policy I might not agree with? Sure and it's happened lots of times.
But if what Trump, Mulvaney and this group did was not done via the usual channels...but why a shadow process? Why not the usual channels? After all, Pompeo is one of Trump's boys. They knew it was wrong, and so Giuliani and the goons Igor and the other one strong armed Ukraine and voila. Another instance of abuse of power.
3
In response to Cal Prof:
Thanks for your Paley quote. It relates to one from Saul Bellow:
"A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
The willful ignorance and self-delusion regarding facts and the rule of law on the part of the Republican members on this committee is the very essence of the contempt that Paley referred to,
3
My concern is that most people aren't paying attention at all. I found the prepared testimonials riveting (and inspiring) but couldn't force myself to listen to the partisan Q&A that followed them. And the news services seem to be focused on the partisan spinners rather than the witnesses' content. Let's hear from the 20 Republican house members who are not seeking reelection, shall we?
And learn (if we can) from our history. For a sense of deja vu all over again, listen to Season 1, Episode 5 of Slate's Slowburn ("Why did so many people stand with Richard Nixon for so long?"). It is frightening how contemporary that feels.
6
I haven't heard one word about the concept of a "speaking agent" binding the principal to what they say. Those rules of agency and evidence certainly should apply to Sondland and others to bind the President as if their statements were his own. Application of the rule is particularly appropriate where, as here, the principal (Trump) uses his agents to speak in his stead to avoid direct attribution and culpability.
7
The Republicans make much of the fact that the Trump administration provided Javelin anti-tank missiles to Ukraine while the Obama administration failed to do so. It reminds me of the Charlie Brown cartoon with Lucy putting down the football for a field goal attempt by CB only to snatch it away at the last second. Thus Trump approving the Javelins for Ukraine and then putting them on hold gave him another way to pressure Zelensky to agree to announce an investigation of the Bidens.
11
He took an oath, he has violated his oath. The Republicans also took an oath to uphold the Constitution, not Trump. We are the United States of America NOT the United States of Trump. The impeachment isn't the politically safe choice for Democrats, but it is flat out the right thing to do. Pres. Clinton was impeached for far less. Go back and listen to Lindsey Graham's impeachment speech back then, apply it to the current occupant and then we'll talk.
25
@Cyndie The Constitution also provides for an electoral system that Democrats are trashing. The people in 30 states elected Trump and the vast majority of them want him to complete his term. Democrats tried to frame Trump with the Russia collusion delusion accusing him of the capital crime of treason and now they are trying to frame him with trite charges of bribery that are not holding up at all.
Biden is the one who should be investigated. His family made $3 million for what? For nothing. That is corruption on its face, also known as prima facie corruption. There is no rational reason a foreign corporation would pay that kind of money to the son of the VP in charge of Ukrainian foreign policy unless they were coerced or believed they were being coerced. An investigation needs to be conducted as to what part J Biden played in arranging that bribe.
I don't necessarily trust polls, but Trump's numbers are being strengthened by the impeachment hearings. In the Emerson Poll, Trump's approval is above water, 48-47, for the first time since June. Here's what they say:
"Support for impeachment has flipped since October from 48% support with 44% opposing to now 45% opposed and 43% in support. The biggest swing is among Independents, who oppose impeachment now 49% to 34%, which is a reversal from October where they supported impeachment 48% to 39%."
The people generally know that the Democrats have been trying to figure out how to get rid of Trump since before he took the oath. This is just the latest flimsy effort. In so doing, they prove that they are not Democrats at all, that they don't support the people's right to choose their president. Trump won pluralities or majorities in 30 of 50 states. Democrats are spitting on that result.
Democrats (and I use the term loosely): I will ask you the question that no Democrat has been able to answer: why is it a crime for the President of the United States to ask the leader of a foreign nation to investigate a high ranking official in a previous American administration who may have arranged for his family to get a $3 million dollar bribe in that country? Do you know that J Biden was not behind soliciting that bribe?
Because Biden is running for president is not an acceptable answer.
The $3 million is prima facie corruption.
4
And I ask you: if Trump is so convinced that there is some sort of criminal activity relating to the Biden’s, why doesn’t he just launch an investigation? Why stoop to strong arming a weak and desperate country under siege by Russia?
5
@Dougal E
Right. Hilary Clinton won the popular vote by 3 million votes.
Donald Trump won the presidential election thanks to 80,000 people in three states -- Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin. Trump won those states by 0.2, 0.7 and 0.8 percentage points, respectively — and by 10,704, 46,765 and 22,177 votes. Those three wins gave him 46 electoral votes; if Clinton had done one point better in each state, she'd have won the electoral vote, instead. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/12/01/donald-trump-will-be-president-thanks-to-80000-people-in-three-states/
The Internet Research Agency (Russian troll farm) conducted a surreptitious social media campaign. https://intelligence.house.gov/social-media-content/
Russian Influence Reached 126 Million Through Facebook Alone https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/technology/facebook-google-russia.html
Oh, and Facebook got paid in rubles for ads.... like these. https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/01/us/politics/russia-2016-election-facebook.html
Think it made a difference?
"Russia, are you listening ..."
Think foreign governments should be allowed to interfere on behalf of a candidate?
Again? "Ukraine, I need you to do me a favor, though..."
5
Republicans can pretend that evidence doesn't exist, that it is insufficient for impeachment and whatever defense they try next, but the truth is out and reasonable people have heard it clearly. Then there are the ten additional issues of obstruction from the Mueller inquiry. Just how much evidence do Republicans want before they admit this president's perfidy? They are getting what they want, so they just don't care.
9
The wheels on the bus go round and round. The gratuitous rage of Nunes, Jordan and others on the minority side of the aisle is worthy of an autocratically led banana republic. Since Donald Trump will throw anybody under the bus these self righteous toadies better wise up. Trump won’t have your back. Let’s hope the voters don’t have these representatives’ backs either. They are showmen in a sordid roll out of lies and protection for our indefensible President. Not worthy of the dignity of their office, or, their salaries.
15
The feelings of diplomats or leftist Democrats do not matter here. The fact is while this is certainly bad behavior, there is no crime. Not that it matters to the Democrats that have been looking for any pretext to justify impeachment since the election.
Problem, of course, is that none of this matters. Impeach to satisfy the radical leftist base, but everyone knows 20 GOP senators will not vote to convict. Even if Trump is caught with a smoking gun standing over a still warm body, the Senate would not convict. The simple reason for this is that 9 or 10 months from a presidential election, the senators do not want to tear apart their party. Trump still enjoys a better than 90% approval rating amongst Republican voters. The sitting Senators see what happened to Corker and Flake. Nope, they will acquit no matter what.
Even worse, the Senate trial will be right on top of the early primaries and run by Mitch McConnell. Yikes. One can assume that both Hunter and Joe Biden will be subpoenaed to ‘splain their apparent corrupt sweetheart deal with Burisma. Do you think Mike Pompeo will hesitate to release all conversations between then-VP Biden and the Ukrainians?
Oh, no, this trial will be a disaster for the Democrats. Mark my words. One would think that Pelosi would foresee this, but here we are. The show is just beginning.
3
Sondland did not know(regretfully) that anyone who comes in contact with Trump gets tarnished. He could have stuck with just donating $1 million to the inauguration. But Oh no,no. He got trapped into the temptation (a life long dream??) of agreeing to be the EU ambassador. Then the roller coaster ride started which stopped only inside the congressional hearing. Saving his own skin was the natural human instinct . He told the truth about Trump's shady dealing with Ukraine. Sondland was immediately disowned and disavowed by the president( "I don't know the gentleman"),not an unusual theme with this president whenever he is caught. But the sad part is that the starry eyed Sondland(like many others before him) did not know what he was in for if he took this post. Tragic !
4
This is what the Republicans want to become the new normal for presidential conduct:
Bribery; Treason or placing the interests of a foreign nation above our own: Election fraud; Attempting the tamper with the outcome of future elections: Refusal the comply with the emoluments clause of the Constitution, and the Constitutional structure of our democratic government, the separation of powers and the powers of Congress for oversight of the executive branch and the lie that the voters should hove known that Trump would be an autocrat, voted for hum anyway and got what they wanted and of course lying all the time and putting the president's interest, financial or political, above the interests of the nation and to cover it up with obstruction of justice and abuse of power.
This will be the right of all future Republican presidents. There will be no Democratic presidents as we will be a one party nation.
4
Go ahead, continue to pretend you don't understand the underlying truth here: the President was fully justified in requesting , or demanding, as a quid pro quo, that Ukraine make a public announcement of investigating Burisma and Bidens, based on the undisputable public record. The fact that Biden unilaterally decided to run for office does not erase the apparent conflict of interest that all of the witnessess have agreed existed, nor does it negate the President's right to conduct foreign policy and pursue corruption issues in Ukraine that may have involved US officials or affected the 2016 election.
27
@SonomaEastSide
This was an entirely predictable (and indeed, predicted) evolution of the Republican cult's defense of Trump, from first denying it, to eventually, when it was impossible to deny any longer, claiming it was perfectly OK. The Trump cult will excuse any Trump crime, or any Trump betrayal of his oath of office.
261
No. That is for the Justice Dept to do if it deems the allegations are credible. 45 cannot use his office and congressionally authorized funds to coerce a foreign government to investigate a political opponent.
205
@SonomaEastSide: The Congressional board of directors has the right and power to pull the plug on its renegade CEO.
104
The executive branch of our government is like a hive with thousands of connected but separate cells and subcells. Dealing with Ukraine is just one.
However going bad is defined -- ineptness, inappropriate motivation, grift and graft, and many more elements--what are the chances that this is the only one that's a problem?
Administration defenders say Democrats have pushed impeachment since Mr. Trump's inauguration. Maybe the GOP should start considering at least the possibility that the Trump operation of government machinery has been flawed since the beginning.
8
It should be suggested to Gordon Sondland to take notes, even basic notes, in the future. “I don’t take notes, never have,” he said.
Sounds like some cocky braggart who is a little above what’s expected in business.
5
@Denise . So,are we expecting Sondland to be a witness to another shady dealing involving Trump in the future, where he could take down notes?? I hope not,for the good of the country and the tired spectators. Enough of this already!
Like a murderer on death row, Trump is entitled to a defense. Republicans are currently serving that role despite the increasing absurdity of defending Trump. Someone has to do it. The criminal is still entitled to defense.
The strange thing about impeachment is the attorneys are also part of the jury. They get to vote on whether their own defense was compelling no matter how absurd. I suspect I know the talking point Republicans are cooking up after Sondland's testimony. If everyone was in the loop, bribing Ukraine couldn't possibly be an impeachable offense. Trump was bribing Ukraine with complete transparency the entire time.
This is the legal equivalent of shooting someone in the street and saying, "No crime. We were standing right there in the street. Everyone knew we shot someone."
Sadly, in impeachment, this defense will probably work. Republicans don't have enough to lose in acquitting Trump right now. That fact is doubly true now that Pence is implicated. They'll take their hits politically but removing Trump now is all but impossible no matter what the evidence. Republicans will pretend it doesn't exist.
The appropriate conclusion to this sad episode in history ends with a President Pelosi. Aside from validating the false accusations about a coup, there's really no universe where Republicans would accept this outcome. They'll take the hit politically.
5
This is like a three ring circus the way it is being run. Way too much irrelevant testimony and very little that gives credence to any kind of smoking gun. More political pontification than relevant questions by those doing the questioning.
If this were a court case, it does not come close to any burden of proof for a conviction at this point. Much of the testimony would have been tossed as hearsay.
A president has every right to control his ambassadors and channels of communication, even if they are not "normal" ways of doing things.
A president has every right to use federal aid as leverage over the behavior of another country. Quid Pro Quo is used all the time at this level. This is nothing new.
A president has every right to ask the Ukraine investigate Burisma and Hunter Biden. Hunter Biden is not running for office in case anyone has not noticed.
Trump has been unorthodox and certainly unethical and is certainly a jerk with his words towards some of these folks. But again, none of that is illegal.
Even IF you somehow had a smoking gun (recording, transcript, email, tweet) that showed that Trump himself directly withheld aid in return for investigation into JOE Biden, I am not sure that is even illegal. I could see it being impeachable. But I don't see it resulting in a removal from office.
At this point, with all that has been seen, I don't even see this as validly moving to the Senate. A House censure is warranted, but that's about it.
5
@Marvin
He committed a Federal felony, a type of official corruption, by demanding to sell official acts including one he was required by law to do, deliver the aid, for supposed dirt on political opponents, in front of witnesses. Pay attention, please. That isn't just corrupt, it's selling out America. This is disgraceful. Please think about this. You may approve of his policies. This is him lying and cheating and twisting a foreign country's arm to help him win the next election. He got caught; he's disqualified from serving.
13
Who is trump going to use to get dirt on democratic candidate if it is not Biden? Is Rudy out there looking now since he has dropped out of sight? Now trump is going to have to dig up dirt on 4 or 5 of the leading candidates. He was so sure Biden was going to be the one going up against. trump knows he cannot win a fight fairly so he cheats. I just hope he keeps getting caught at his corrupt ways of winning. He cheated in 2016 & is trying again. Impeach or Vote Him Out in 2020.
8
The stunning hypocrisy of demanding that a foreign ally carry out corruption on his personal, political behalf, while our diplomatic and military departments are working hard to support them in repelling an emboldened, brutal and dangerous Putin’s Russia kills their people, also, to a certain extent, on our behalf, (and in our best national interest!), while admonishing them to clean up their own corruption... As in keeping with my experience with a malignant narcissistic personality, there is no low below which this president who is holding our nation hostage will not sink below. I beg the Republicans to reconsider their continued unequivocal support of him, which has damaged our nation in every conceivable and even in previously inconceivable ways.
We all realize that Mitch McConnell will bury this as a non-issue, that’s all he cares about us maintaining power, and Trump will use it as a signal that his unacceptable abuse of power can continue. Putin, the most dangerous man and our enemy, already thanks you for your service to his consistent plan to weaken our country.
11
Trump's attempt to disgrace his opponent via the Ukraine scandal and his sycophancy toward Putin are connected: Trump wants to emulate Putin's creation of an authoritarian state built on the bones of an elected government.
But America is not Russia, and Trump is not Putin, except for one thing: Trump will not take no for an answer.
Whether his defeat comes from impeachment or loss at the polls, do not expect Trump to step down without a fight. At his rallies he is already sending out this message to his goon squads.
7
Where are those Republicans who remember the oath they took prior to ascending office? That above all else, they are loyal to the Constitution of the United States, Not to any President, not to any Party, but to uphold the Constitution. If not loyal to this country, then clearly they are Traitors to this country. We need a Barry Goldwater.
5
I know that for trump 'being the best' means everything. Well, there is one thing in which trump is really the best (Nobel price stuff, stable genius stuff, 'my gut feeling' stuff).
Here it is.... trump is the absolute best at being the worst.
I just hope that all of the swamp creatures go down with the best worst one.
5
Everyone who comes under Donald Trump's spell seems to leave with their integrity in shreds.
4
"In his opening statement, Sondland described how Giuliani wanted the Ukrainians to investigate an imagined Ukrainian role in hacking the Democratic National Committee in 2016,..." What..what? Giuliani wanted a Ukrainian president himself to say his own country had interfered in the elections of none other than the United States? So they were expecting, "Yes, Mr. President of the United States, we did that ...Now, please give us aid"? Are we nuts? That'd have been political harakiri.
"A horse, a horse. My kingdom for a horse," said Richard III. I'd give that putative kingdom to see Volodymyr Zelensky shaking his head in disbelief and talking to his wife or musing to himself.
1
Gordon Sondland, the perfect "yes man".
Sondland dies not like the idea of people protesting in front of his hotels.
1
The beauty of reading comments:
- Jim Jordan: “Do you know what a quid pro quo is?”
---Guy appointed as an ambassador after donating $1M to Trump’s inauguration: “I do.”
[From yesterdays WaPo article by Dana Milbank]
1
Hmmm.....let's try some Trumpian logic on this one:
Hmmm.....let's try some Trumpian logic on this one:
Joe Stumblebum robbed the only bank in Left Overshoe, NY. Stole the entire contents of the vault. A dozen witnesses saw him do it. And he left fingerprints, his mask, and a this-is-a-stick-up note at the scene. But no one in Red State America heard of the stick up. Or could care less if they did.
Conclusion:
Joe is not guilty. In fact, he never robbed the bank. Was never there. He asked for nothing. And he was perfect too. Case closed. So what to do? Investigate Joe Biden for the heist.
5
It is amazing (I’d say amusing but none of this is funny) to listen to this testimony while trump is tweeting “it never happened” and the Democrats should get back to running the country. This while the senate sits on hundreds of bills passed by the house. The ridiculousness of all this is beyond belief. There is no doubt that trump is your basic thug, anyone who believes otherwise just has their heads buried in the sand.
10
Trump and his enablers have only one strategy: lie.
Tell one lie till it's debunked, and then move onto another lie.
Keep summing up your lies and their most salient points.
You will never run out of lies.
You will never be stumped.
Sondland is a great guy; you hardly knew Sondland; Sondland just cleared you of all wrongdoing - even though he just pushed you out the window. whatever. there's always another lie you can tell.
3
go girl
1
Wasn't Manafort convicted for something to do with "consulting" in Ukraine?
6
Today, here, we see that the best minds of the GOP have slunk out of their Fox holes to defend the president's perfidy.
6
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve."
This really hit a nerve. Excepting any billionaires reading this, who would you like to have watching your wallet? Steve Mnuchin or Lt. Col. Alexander Vindman?
When the people in charge are untrustworthy and self-serving, and worse, when they systemically try to destroy our values, reputation, and even the decent and honorable among us, we're in trouble. And we're in it up to our necks.
3
It will be a pleasure to watch all the toadies get their comeuppance.
You lay in bed with a dog, you get fleas. This is what you have devolved into, GOP. You lay in bed with Nazis, white supremacists, the rotten Saudi state, you can expect it all to come out into the open, no matter how much you attempt to obfuscate, deny, lie away the time.
1
Ambassador Gordon Sondland was a problem for the Democrats because he said clearly that when he asked Trump what he wants from Ukraine, Trump emphatically and repeatedly said " I want nothing from Ukraine. I want the president to do the right thing" and he is a problem to Trump for saying his impression was that there was a quid pro quo. But overall he was a problematic joker who did not recall, did not have detailed notes, was not aware of what was happening in the news and his statement that the quid pro quo was restricted to Burisma and to meeting of the 2 presidents in the white house and NOT a quid pro quo related to our national security as some overzealous career diplomats and government staff had said.
No one tried to throw Gordon Sondland under the bus. He was an unreliable witness, and a loose cannon, trying to be funny and vulgar. He was certainly the most fearless and bubbly witness so far. His direct conversation with Trump and first hand interaction with Trump, is what could be admissible as solid evidence and fortunately for the president that is what will make the sham partisan inquiry an exercise in futility and a trivial pursuit that will ensure the reelection of president Trump in 2020.
21
@Girish Kotwal That was AFTER the WB complaint was delivered, not before. Before he was singing a different tune.
Keep voting for Trump. As I say, the country deserves whoever it elects.
57
@Girish Kotwal
Trump can bellow all he wants, even refer hilariously to his oversize note pad and you can parrot him, but the evidence of the shakedown is already in the record, thanks to the bravery of Colonel Alexander Vindman.
Ambassador Sondland's testimony serves only to indicate how widespread the conspiracy was.
86
@Girish Kotwal why did Trump wait until 2019 to investigate Biden instead of when he first heard of a public servant's wrong doings? Why did he ask a foreign government to begin an investigation. Why is he playing more gold than Obama did at the same point in their respective presidencies. Why do people need credit checks and other checks but not have to submit their tax returns so one can see who and what are their sources of income unless they're getting paid under table
42
To me the biggest joke of all is the claim that Trump was concerned about corruption in Ukraine. If Trump was genuinely concerned about corruption in Ukraine it was because he wasn't getting his share of the proceeds.
7
I’m watching the majority of the impeachment hearings to listen to the opening statements of the witnesses. For me, these statements are the guts of the hearings. I am an independent voter and retired veteran. I care deeply about the integrity of our institutions and our constitution, which I swore to defend. Tears come to my eyes, as I listen to witness after witness provide their factual recollection and opinion regarding matters striking at the essence of this inquiry: releasing aid for bogus investigations into Burisma\Biden. My eyes tear as I hear testimony and evidence that our country’s bedrock formation is crumbling and disintegrating due in part to a corrosive tribalism that is supporting a lawless failed businessman elected President, who cares nothing about our constitution.
12
Trump probably won't be impeached, I have no faith in the McConnel republican majority senate. However, one day this Trump era will end, and we must never forget what these republican congressmen did to protect him, the lies and the smearing of decorated war heroes. In the coming years many of these people will try to rewrite history and we must not let them.
13
What the Republicans and apparently the press don't get is that "Quid Pro Quo" extortion and bribery are variations of the same thing.
9
It boggles the mind how many people do not see or refuse to see that the really horrible thing is an American President asking a foreign power to investigate another American. The rest - that it benefits his political ambitions, that presidents have powers, is just that - the rest of it.
7
I'm all for enforcing the constitution and ensuring that a corrupt president gets his dues, but put into the context of recent presidential wrongdoing, Trump's behavior barely registers on the scale of severity. If he is going to be punished for his misdeeds, what about the individuals that brought us a criminal war inflicting incalculable mental and physical damage around the globe? At the very least Halliburton should become the property of the state and doled out in the majority to those who suffered most directly from its disasters. The evidence is clear that Bush and Cheney perpetrated an unmitigated war based on the fabrication of evidence and manipulation of US agents here and abroad. Trump is the opposite of a war monger but he doesn't get recognized as such. Perhaps that's why he's attacked so vehemently, he's not boosting the coffers of the military economy as much as is customary by presidents. If we're going to go after him for his Ukraine deeds, lets put Bush and Cheney behind bars for crimes that actually resulted in the deaths of 100s of 1000s if not more.
1
Honestly, Michele, can we call them what they are? To label the completely made up stories known as Burisma and Crowdstrike as "conspiracy theories" gives these Republican lies a lot more credibility than they deserve. And there's nothing theoretical about them at all, they are simple assertions that have no basis in fact.
What they share with other Republican talking points is their loose or nonexistent relationship with the truth, which
Republicans compensate for by repeating them so many times that they begin to gain traction through means other than reason. That's their strategy, is to get their claims repeated throughout media and in conversation.
When you blandly broadcast Republican talking points and assertions without actively calling them out, one by one, every time, as false and ridiculous and undeserving of consideration by reasonable people, you are actually doing the work of normalizing their false narratives.
2
At a certain point, republicans have to make a choice, get on the bus or prepare to be underneath it
1
Ms Goldberg, your summation says it all.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
There is no redemption possible in the minds of partisans on either side. Supposed Republicans, who have abandoned all pretense of adhering to traditionally conservative values, and
Democrats who must persist in argumentation based in logic and fact, are at loggerheads. When one side is committed to telling any lie, straining any possible credulity; and the other side must continue to present factual evidence in support of their position there is no longer a debate.
2
(TrumPutin) in 2020. Two Peas in a Pod.
5
For mental health reasons, I have opted out of watching the hearings and TV news in general about our national nightmare and it is only what I read in the NYT and the LA Times, newspapers that have not been consumed by Gannett that keeps me somewhat in the loop. To some degree, it is helping as it is amazing what else I am able to accomplish in a day. One thing I continue doing though is after reading this piece I stare out the window across my back yard at the naked trees and the snow and let it sink in, and try to understand why my wife gives me such a hard time that I have cut her BFF from my life and plan on limiting the time I spend with her sibling in Atlanta over the upcoming XMAS holiday - you see, they voted for the Gutter Rat. And I try to understand where they are coming from as well. Why did they do it? I will go to my grave before I know the answer. And my now three-year-old-grandson will be living in a very different world. It is all so overwhelming.
4
The lengths Trump is going to, to try to protect Russia is unbelievable. What does Russia have on Trump that makes him Putin's lap dog?
Like Cuba, Russia is known to video tap and record prominent individuals who stay in their country. I can only imagine what Trump's video looks like. I'm eagerly awaiting the holiday release on Netflix.
Sondland linked all Trump's main cabinet to the Ukraine bribery case. How in the world can anyone at this point, believe that this Republican White House is here to serve for the good of the people? Not one person has any credibility, integrity or honor left. They have all sold their soul to serve at the feet of Trump.
In the words of our cowardice leader: "Sad"
5
Mulvaney directly confirmed Sondland's reasoning of a trade of military aid for public statements on Burisma and 2016 DNC hacking. Turns out 2 + 2 does equal 4.
3
Goldberg writes, "This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away." Amen, and today's testimony by Dr. Hill, who directly asked Republican Representatives to stop endorsing the Russian security apparatus's false propaganda in direct opposition to United States national security interests, drives home that point. In short, to the extent that the United States is involved in a 'hot war' being fought against Russian aggression along Ukraine's national borders, the President, his lawyer, Chief of Staff, and Representative Nunes and his cronies, are traitors--plain and simple.
4
I am pretty sure "Rudy" is the current Presidential fixer. A short history lesson on the last "fixer" will show how Trump does business. BTW, the last fixer is in jail. Ambassador Sunderland is the patsy because he really wanted the job he has, and is so inept at it.
After the current raft of Trumpists go to jail, "Fearless Leader" plans to march with his TiKi torch "good people" friends back into the White House, or burn it down if it looks like he will loose. Republicans are shilling for Rush Limbaugh and Fox news because they get eyeballs and votes that way.
"SAD"
1
This guy's smugness and cavalier attitude really bothered me. This is not a joking matter. I suppose he's been promised a pardon so isn't worried about what he says or how he comes across.
1
Trump pardons people if he thinks his base will approve. Consider Arapaio (spelling?) and the SEAL. Sondland is in for a surprise if he's counting on a pardon.
1
For Pete's sake, JIM JORDAN is a former wrestling coach, I repeat wrestling! Is this what we've come to? Not to denigrate sports figures, but I'm an attorney and highly value education and research sources. A wrestler is the last person I would turn to for intellect.
5
@Mary Rivkatot
From what I've read, he's a law school graduate who never took (passed?) the bar exam. Not wearing a jacket seems like semiotic "common-man" signaling.
5
Remember Jesse Ventura ?
1
What’s with Sondland? What’s his agenda? He initially did not support Trump in the primaries, but once Trump was elected, he changed his mind and donated a million bucks to the inauguration... buying himself an ambassadorship for which he has no qualifications. Then, he got himself injected in Ukraine although that was not his posting, and became part of a back channel effort to circumvent the State Department, led by the President’s personal lawyer, and aiming to coerce a foreign leader to lie in public just to benefit Trump’s re-election bid, and he didn’t realize this was wrong? Sondland was an enthusiastic co-conspirator up to and including the time when he was called by the House to testify, then he subsequently reversed some of his story and changed his tune to save his own amateur neck? He didn’t remember much, including that before the election he knew Trump was a shady character at best. So, what’s Sondland’s motivation (other than short term self preservation)? He bought himself into this position, can he buy himself out? He supposedly made a mountain of money in hotels but he comes off as such a jerk this seems improbable. So, who does Sondland work for?
1
What Michelle Goldberg said today is without a doubt the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. She said, "(t)his administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away". Thank you so much!
Virtually every day we witness yet another outrage and I am not just referring to impeachment, as important as that is to our country. To my fellow Americans what more do you need? This corrupt traitorous regime and its republican supporters show you daily that they put their power and their financial interests ahead of everything including our nation. We must stand up and get rid of all of them, and do so overwhelmingly and unambiguously. Let's send a clear forceful message to this regime and its corrupt enablers and also to those who might entertain the thought of behaving this way in the future. You country need you now.
1
Sondland knew Burisma was the Bidens. He was still lying to save himself, over the good of the national interest.
More proof, if any Republicans actually need any further proof, (which is itself a surreal nightmare), that whether unwittingly or not, Trump’s undermining, no, complete destruction of the integrity and respect domestically and internationally of every aspect of our country makes him Putin, the most dangerous man in the world and our enemy’s perfect agent.
4
Forget the bus metaphor---how about something larger, like being thrown underneath the Titanic.
1
The only way Donald Trump cares about corruption is in making sure he gets a piece of the action.
5
The use of public office for private ends = Corruption.
135
@MAKE-LYING-WRONG-AGAIN : Perfect user name -- thank you. And it added a little happiness to this grim time -- thank you.
7
The stunning hypocrisy of demanding that a foreign ally carry out corruption on his personal, political behalf, while our diplomatic and military departments are working hard to support them in repelling an emboldened, brutal and dangerous Putin’s Russia kills their people, also, to a certain extent, on our behalf, (and in our best national interest!), while admonishing them to clean up their own corruption... As in keeping with my experience with a malignant narcissistic personality, there is no low below which this president who is holding our nation hostage will not sink below. I beg the Republicans to reconsider their continued unequivocal support of him, which has damaged our nation in every conceivable and even in previously inconceivable ways.
4
Trump's "Gordon problem" has just been overshadowed by his "Fiona problem."
3
Remember the movie, "It's a Wonderful Life?" Cons are set to give us the alternative reality that's presented in that movie. They're George Baily, willing to commit suicide--throw American ideals and values into the river--and give Potter (trump) what he wants. The result is, Pottersville, where corruption is like a cancer--everyone is tainted with it, and the world becomes a terribly ugly place.
1
Pence not only was involved in this whole shameful affair but he has been active in the cover-up. Pence needs to be impeached. He is dirty as the day is long and this should be the end of his political career.
2
Good for Sondland, who is not someone who is as easily influenced by Russian money as, say, Devin Nunes. Sondland had the guts to defy the gag order Trump and his cronies have given. Chairman Schiff is doing a remarkable job of lining up witnesses who have decided to not take the Trump gag order as "law." My question: if Trump is so innocent, why the gag order? Why can't Mulvaney, Pompeo, Pence, McGahn, Hicks and others testify? Looks very very bad. Looks very very guilty.
3
You conclude, "This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Hear, hear!
3
It struck me as I read this piece that Donald Trump seems to really doubt his own legitimacy as president. Why else would one go to such lengths to establish and bolster it? How pathetic is that?
5
@RichardL
Of course he doubts his legitimacy. He's in office courtesy of Putin, and he knows it.
It is a measure of how insane Trumpworld is that they truly believe someone like Sondland should have fallen for the grift and paid $1,000,000 to Trump's campaign for the "privilege" of committing perjury on Trump's behalf and then going to jail for it.
Sondland declined to participate in that particular insanity so he will forever be considered a traitor to Trumpworld.
A traitor because he wouldn't go to prison to protect a grifter.
Insane.
2
Hopefully Secretary of State Pompeo, Acting WH Chief of Staff Mulvaney, and others will fill out the details by testifying in the impeachment inquiry.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2019/11/20/now-trump-has-big-gordon-problem/?outputType=amp
1
Trump is rotten to the core and also the apple of Republicans’ eyes.
3
Re the DNC server: They want to build up a cloud of suspicion with discrete bits they will pretend hint at some hidden plot, which they never quite spell out. And they never spell it out because if you draw back from the Suspicious Details it looks about like this: the DNC colluded with Ukraine to hack the DNC’s own emails so Assange and Cambridge Analytica could torpedo the DNC’s own election campaign and make it look like the Russians did it, so after Trump won we could impeach him. And then they hid the server, which as we all know is a box you can keep all your emails in so no one can find them if you hide it. Kind of like hiding the moon by taking a picture of it and putting it in your closet.
So yeah, they need to do it all by innuendo because when you actually say what it is, it's daffy.
1
Why would ANYONE other than Vladimir Putin want Devin Nunes to represent them in Congress?
6
The president is an extortionist. Republican congressmen & senators aid, abet and sanction his actions and readily break their oaths to the constitution which they auction for their personal gain just as the president did for his. Their constituents should give them the respect they deserve.
The comical aspect of this is the sheer stupidity of Republicans in this digital age believing some villain out of Indiana Jones would secretly steal and carry a server by truck and secret flight to the Ukraine and hide it- presumably next to the ark of the covenant. These graduates of a Betsy DeVos school might have saved some trouble buying a $50 drive and downloading the digital data or just stored all the emails they wished in a small Dropbox or iCloud account.
Still, I do like the notion of Nunes with a Sherlock Holmes hat and Jordan with an Indiana Jones scarf & hat trekking through the wilds of Ukraine in search of their grail guarded no doubt, by armed Democrats wearing turbans. SNL?
3
All the supporters of Trump are lying. They know they are lying, we know they are lying, and they know we know they are lying. They should all be locked up for treason.
3
Any normal American citizen would be in jail for any of these crimes; or may be in Rykert - if they're minority.(Luck for Stone that he was not a minority).
Why aren't Trump, Rudy, Pompeo, Pence in jail yet - because their brother Barr is in charge.. (& #MoscowMitch - would anyone has any doubt that Trump would have behaved - if #MoscowMitch would have played by the rules.)
GOP has sold the America for few $$$ and power..
I will work hard to get as many votes against GOP as possible in 2020. They need to lose, but they need to loose big so that we can free our Lady Liberty from such dark souls.
3
Well, it is all there in black and white now. I wonder if most of the fox show viewers can read?
3
The last two sentences in the column summarize the ugly truth.
3
Trump has officially lost it
2
Now those last two sentences are ALL the news that’s fit to print. “Rotten to the core” is like using etiquette on a pack of rabid hyenas, moreover.
Perhaps the Times would consider an article or survey asking the public if they would still vote for Trump if he were impeached but not indicted?
2
Michelle, your last paragraph says it all. I would love to see them all got to jail. They are traitors to the USA.
4
"A few Republicans have tried to massage Trump's claims of Ukrainian election interference to make them sound marginally less insane."
These are pathetic displays... really not commensurate with intelligent adult behavior.
1
Thanks, Michelle, for this lovely summary.
Talk about nerves of steel. These guys told little Ukraine: Hey, we know Russia is trying to take you over, piece by piece, and your people are dying every day in the fighting. But do us a little solid.
We don't want Russia to take the blame for having helped trump win. So, Ukraine, you fall on your sword and pretend that maybe your people tried to help Hillary, and were so inept that trump won instead. And when you agree to do this--you don't have to actually do it--we'll use your statement to slime one of our elder statesmen and trump can win again, again by lying. And then, unless we think of something else we want, we'll give you the money our Congress has approved, and you can defend yourself against Russia. Maybe Russia will be nice to you since you pulled their bacon out of the fire. They'll make you your own county in the new Russian Empire.
Utterly amazing, shameless and immoral. A crime mob of the highest order. We may get our first female president by default--even pasty little Pence seems to be involved in the corruption. What will Mother say?
3
You might say that the President has a Gordian knot to deal with!
3
Congresswoman Jackie Speier made it as plain as the growing nose on the Republicans' face. No matter how Sondland obfuscates and how the GOP try to frame the Democrats as liars, Trump wins big. Ironically, he wouldn't be lying if he said, "I get the most Pinocchios! No one gets more Pinocchios than I do! Never in the history of the world has a president gotten more Pinocchios! And I pick the people who get the most Pinocchios!".
Trump sounds as ridiculous as Baghdad Bob (remember him from the Iraq War II?), saying "Move on! Nothing to see here!" as the bombs and bullets fly in the background. They are equally pathetic in their attempts to deny what's actually going on is deeply damaging to their side.
1
President Trump said I barely know Sondland. I'm waiting for President Trump to say he barely knows Rudy Giuliani.
5
Might I suppose Sondland is a more clever fox than we give. Although also a bit of a rube too. By prevaricating a bit in three instances of testimony in sequence, he has evaded any sort of perjury attack by coming ‘cleaner’ in his revised testimony while at the same time allowing the Republicans to ‘impeach’ him as a reliable witness on account of his development of candor and ramped up recall.
2
Micheal Cohen wanted to be the "John Dean" and failed. Maybe Gorden Sondland will will be DJT's "John Dean", flawed but in the main, correct about the malignancy.
With Thursday's testimony, the real problem is that Sondland has a problem with the truth
Jim Jordon is no Barbara Jordon.
He thinks trump wants to eliminate corruption in Ukraine. Hahahahaha. That’s like saying John Gotti wanted to eliminate mobsters.
7
I've been surprised that more commentators have not drawn a parallel between Trump's association with Roy Cohn, Michael Cohen, and Rudy Giuliani. The man hand picks a close associate to be his fixer, empowers him with extraordinary authority (sometimes including the portfolio of others), and hides behind the privilege of silence. "Where's my Roy Cohn?" "You'll have to ask Michael." Now it's, "Talk to Rudy."
1
". . . . . . .I am steeped in blood so far
Returning were as tedious as go o'er."
Thus Macbeth. Gosh, there's no help for it, is there. You guys--you wretched guys in the GOP--
--who have hitched your wagons--all those clumsy, creaking wagons!--to Mr. Donald J. Trump and his fast waning star.
Like poor Mr. Macbeth, you CAN'T turn back now. Or (to vary the metaphor) like the unfortunate Emperor in Hans Christian Andersen's famous tale. The guy KNOWS he's striding along Main Street without a stitch of clothing. Everyone else knows it too.
BUT--
--same old, same old. CAN'T turn back now. GOTTA--just grit the old teeth and go through with it.
AND SO--
--Messieurs Nunes and Jordan et al.--
--they simply gonna circle the wagons. Take their positions. "Don't fire till you see the whites of their eyes"--
--and await the Democratic onslaught.
Just like cowboys and "Indians" when I was a kid.
We used to root for the cowboys. Not now.
We're rooting for the "Indians" right now.
I think most of us are "Indians" right now.
I know I am.
Thank you, Michelle Goldberg, for your contribution.
Trumpian task --- One requiring sychophants to make their leader's shifting, illogical claims "sound marginally less insane".
Sincerely, Editors of Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary
1
The democrats have their own Gordon problem. This is their bomb shell witness and from what I can see no one in the general public cares. Ask people on the streets who Gordon Sondland is and maybe one out of ten would know. Nobody is watching this TV show.
Let us see who or what will cut the "Gordon's Knot" that is still blinding the Republicans on that committee.
1
I don't understand how Sondland could be so relaxed. He smiled his way through a confession of guilt - a party to the dirty tricks. He was refreshingly honest, but an example of the type of person who felt it natural to buy his way into his ambassadorship. This is Trump cleaning up the swamp?
1
A country where 2/3 of the inhabitants don’t believe in evolution. game over
2
I call that bold talk from a nation that has Boris as PM and approved Brexit.
This is all happening because trump's ego is so fragile. He can't accept that Russia interfered in our 2016 election so he instead fouls his own nest and damages US foreign policy as he pursues a wacky conspiracy that says Hillary and the Ukrainians conspired against him in 2016. Yeah! That's the ticket! It was Hillary!
We elected an obviously seriously defective human being in 2016 and we are paying the price.
2
Hey, tunnel-vision leftists reporters and commentators: The President has a lawful duty to retain foreign aid if the country is corrupt. Everyone agrees Ukraine is corrupt. In fact, 60% of the Ukrainian populace have admitted to bribing public officials and local bureaucrats.
The Ukrainian High Court, as a matter of law, found Americans and Ukrainians have colluded in election meddling and graft.
Burisma is a corrupt oil and gas company. Biden had them put his kid on the board of directors and got paid handsomely. Recently, Ukrainian prosecutors have indicted Burisma CEOs and others.
Hillary and the Dems, for years, used Ukraine as a slush fund. Politico reported in early 2017 that Ukraine worked with the DNC and others to actively work for a Hillary and against Trump in the 2016 election.
Barr and Durham have already convened a criminal Grand Jury. This impeachment scam is solely designed to somehow blunt the indictments against the Dems and their Deep State coup plotters that will be coming down soon. Horowitz’ IG report on FISA abuses under the Obama Regime is over 500 pages long and will be released the first week in December.
It does not take 500 pages to say that there were no FISA abuses.
2
@Cjmesq0
Barr, Durham, Horowitz.
Soviet-style police state persecution of honest public servants perceived as political enemies. Trump and his henchmen are destroying exactly the things we were all taught to be most proud of America about. Trump is the kind of ridiculous megalomaniac dictator we would see on TV; we would feel so grateful as Americans that only other countries had to suffer such monstrous fools. There will be nothing credible about politically motivated prosecutions intended to satisfy Trump's paranoid, vindictive rage.
Oh yeah, Trump broke the law in holding back the aid, so, no, that wasn't his lawful duty.
The Biden and Clinton stuff is
1. total garbage with zero evidence and zero truth, and
2. smears Trump can use in the next election to distract from his own repulsive oozing sliminess, just like he did in 2016
4
Trump drained the swamp and replaced it with a toxic waste dump.
3
I don't understand how Sondland could be so relaxed. He smiled his way through a confession of guilt - a party to the dirty tricks. He was refreshingly honest, but an example of the type of person who felt it natural to buy his way into his ambassadorship. This is Trump cleaning up the swamp?
This whole vipers’ tangle of cheaters, liars, profiteers, extortionists, and third-rate crooks took its time, but it has finally gotten itself organized - into a circular firing squad.
3
At least as damning: Later the same day, Laura Cooper of the DoD testified. She formulates and runs military aid policy to Ukraine and she dropped a (figurative) bombshell.
Later in the day after the Trump-Zelenskiy phone call, two members of her staff were emailed by two different Ukrainian contacts, each seeking assurance that their aid was not in jeopardy. She testified that nothing like that had ever happened before.
We can split hairs and quibble about the meaning of “Do me a favor” but the Ukrainians who have skin in the game understood exactly what he meant.
Minor but important point: she hadn’t kept this a secret. She was unaware of it but her staff read her deposition and two of them came forward to correct her. Her deposition was hundreds of pages long. Her staff was probably very interested in the topic.
1
Asked how he came to his conclusion, Dondland should have said "Duh."
1
By the time this wraps up, Nuñes and Jordan will be unmasked as the clowns that they are.
Vindman put Nuñes, who never served, by asking him to call the purple heart awardee by his Lt Col rank and Nuñes choked on his own saliva before ultimately complying. Vindman also shut Jordan up, who also never served, in his unfounded smears by reading a stellar perf eval.
And Sondman, who is supposed to be their stat witness and fall guy, threw Trump, Pence, and Pompeo under the bus.
No wonder the Republicans are keen on reverting to “Soviet-style” hearings — they want to keep the truth from coming out.
In the meantime, the stable genius is back with his Sharpie.
1
Republicans. Russia's useful idiots.
7
I’ll never be able to take A$AP Rocky seriously again. This aggression cannot stand.
On a more serious note, I will never forgive Republicans for making me come to terms with my latent institutionalism. I came to fight the man, and this is what I’ve been reduced to.
1
Half of the country doesn't believe anything particularly serious happened. Nobody was hurt, no money was spent or received, no wars were started. Who, after all, is the injured party? What would have happened if Trump had succeeded? Nobody would have reacted to the Ukraine investigating Biden's son, and Biden is fading as a candidate anyway. This may be very exciting for Democrats, but Republican voters are not interested, and independents seem to agree. Most Americans think everyone associated with Washington is corrupt. It's their corrupt guys vs. yours. Hunter Biden's job just confirms that. Remember that the congress holding this hearing has a less than 20% approval rating, less than Trump.
22
@Tom Meadowcroft
It is not true the Independents seem to agree. It's been reported a few times lately that recent polls show that they are the ones making the difference in public opinion and they are not on the side of the President.
110
@Tom Meadowcroft Sounds as if you've given up on our system. Do you have an alternative in mind?
I'm not too confident either. A good portion of our electorate seems to think he's affiliated with Jesus somehow. Another portion seems to think that there is no such thing as a politician who isn't evil. Another portion would like to stuff their fingers in their ears and sing "lalala" until it all goes away and everyone can just be friends again.
It's hard to have confidence in the collective wisdom of such a population.
58
@Tom Meadowcroft - What does Hunter Biden's job have to do with it? The Republicans say that he had no experience in energy so how could he get the job? Well, take a look at the board of directors of Microsoft or Amazon and you will find that almost everyone on the board has absolutely no experience in coding or selling books. Amazon has a board member that was a senior advisor to the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. That is not even a business.
And $50,000 per month? The average salary of the Amazon directors is quite a bit more than that.
Biden had been put on the board of directors for Amtrak by George Bush and had been in the Department of Commerce. You need trains to move natural gas around Europe and someone needs to know something about commerce. Plus he is a lawyer. He has more than enough credentials but once again, Republicans never bother to dig any deeper than what Sean Hannity tells them. And no Republican made a big fuss when Bush put him on Amtrak even though he never owned a train company or is an engineer or anything of the kind.
83
Beyond all the poppycock, Land-of-Oz GOP fantasies that Ukraine and not Russia was responsible for the 2016 election meddling, is the real issue that's being rather ignored:
Why the hell is this administration so bent on protecting Russia from the widely proven and accepted fact that IT was responsible for the 2016 election meddling? WHY? What is it that Putin has on Trump, making him so hell-bent on deflecting attention in other directions? I suspect, because such effort has been put into hiding them, that the tax records will speak volumes, but maybe it's even more. WHAT?
Sure, Trump should be impeached and removed from office for what he did with regard to Ukraine and his associated obstruction of justice, but I also want to know what it is that underlies all of it. THAT seems to be the nuclear bombshell story to be exposed. I dearly hope someone is working hard to uncover that.
4
Michelle Goldberg sees the world through a looking glass. Gordon Sondland was helpful in clearing the President, period. His rather peculiar way of presenting his impressions in the same manner as facts has allowed the Democrats to run with the ball, but the whistle was blown when he clearly stated that he has absolutely no evidence to support the impeachment.
And it seems that it is overlooked here that the President wanted Ukraine to seek the truth on Burisma/Biden via investigation, period. This does not at all equal a benefit because that truth, if what Democrats & Biden maintain is correct, would have HELPED BIDEN and hurt the President.
So the President could not have been asking for a benefit, because he could not know one yet existed. Only if Biden is guilty of some unknown wrongdoing that an investigation would have uncovered would it have helped Trump. And if that is the case nobody can suggest that serious wrongdoing should remain hidden to support one candidate over another.
2
@CK
That's just cheap baloney. Trump didn't even want an investigation. He wanted the public announcement of one, by Zelenskyy, on CNN. He certainly wasn't interested in the Bidens being exonerated.The whole thing was just a scripted media event, to smear Joe Biden. Please, try reading the editorial again and responding to the account of corruption it presents rather than reciting these empty talking points that don't even work.
3
@bob - The fact is, an announcement of an investigation by the most corrupt country in the world would mean nothing, and not "smear" Biden. 95% of Americans have no idea where Ukraine is, or who Zelensky is, and could not care less either. As for Biden, if you think Hunter Biden got $3million for nothing it makes sense you listen to Michelle Goldberg, who would set her office on fire for that amount of money.
2
@CK
It doesn't matter what Americans know or think about Ukraine. They would hear the smear, check that, they are hearing it, from the President of the US, while he dishonestly pretends he had nothing to do with this trumped-up garbage coming up now.
I don't know what Burisma got for whatever they paid Hunter Biden. I do know that no credible or even plausible, specific allegation of conflict of interest has been made, and no specific basis for even starting an investigation has been put forward, against either Biden, only witnesses with zero knowledge of any misconduct acknowledging Stefanik's contemptible question about the "possible appearance" of conflict, and endless wretched speculation from those who want Biden discredited for purely political reasons.
As far as I know, you just threw another baseless slur, at the columnist. What you don't do, again, is address the multiple accounts of Trump's disgusting corruption discussed in the column. Try again, please.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Thank you, Michelle, for saying it in plain English.
3
Sondland said, “Everyone was in the loop." A Gordian knot that Trump and his complicit members can not get out of.
Combining Mulvaney and now Sondland statements you get:
Yes, there was a quid pro quo. Everyone was in the loop. We do this all the time. Get over it.
4
It doesn't matter what the facts are. The Republicans are so corrupt they just ignore them.
3
I watched much of the testimony. What I came away with was that Sondland said that he "presumed" that there was a quid quo pro surrounding a meeting with the POTUS but that when he spoke with the President directly, the President said "I want nothing from the Ukraine. No quid quo pro." Nevertheless none of this is impeachable. The only impeachable situation here is Hunter Biden being paid millions to sit on the board of Burisma while his father was VP and overseeing Ukraine policy. I'm am grateful that the Democrats and media have helped bring that sleazy behavior to the attention of America. Thank you New York Times!
2
@rpe123
Pray tell, how do you impeach someone who isn't in office?
Your last thought should be repeated in every election next year. "This administration is rotten to the core....disloyal to the country...so is every politician who tries to explain its corruption away." These same Republicans were so alarmed about Trump that they tried to prevent his nomination in 2016. Now they are cowards who will not take him on as they are afraid of his tweets which would mobilize the Trump cult base against them. They will not fulfill their oath to support the Constitution and should be thrown out by the voters in the next election.
1
Does it matter? Where is the line? We accept it. Ask the Navy Seals.
2
Of the many bizarre and amazing things we keep hearing from Trump and Trumpists, four consistent bases stand out:
1. I couldn’t care less about this country, or its governance, or its civil servants, or its military, or its citizens. There is only me, and the rest of you shadows better bow down before me right quick.
2. There is no such thing as evidence; there are only the stories I tell, no matter how ridiculous they are, no matter how completely debunked they are. If you don’t Believe, I have a cure. Bluster and threats.
3. I can make any fact, action, craziness, graft, greedhead grabbing, laziness, incompetence, whatever, go away. By stamping my little feets.
4. I get to make any threat, throw any slander, attack with whatever weapon I choose, and you better shut up and take it. And don’t you dare let out a peep in my direction: I have feelings, and I’m always right.
2
Sondland was Schiff's chief eyeball witness, who, beyond telling us his opinions and presumptions, told us exactly what Pres. Trump said when asked his intentions on Ukraine, "I want nothing. I want no quid pro quo. I want Zelensky to do the right thing."
Case closed. Game over. Matchpoint.
@batazoid
We always believe it when the accused, who knows he's already been caught, says he didn't do it, then says it a couple more times for emphasis.
Is that really all you've got?
2
when the movie is made...
1
I was at a car repair joint in upstate NY Wednesday morning,. I commandeered the remote control and tuned in to the Inquiry. Four white men came in individually, after me--puffy, overweight, not so healthy looking--wearing gimme caps and cowboy hats and sporting scruffy beards. They writhed like Boschian demons before the TV, but I would not give up the remote.
Poor guys. Already hard hit by "me too" (many of their wives now recall being pawed or molested repeatedly back when), they presently are staggering to this incomprehensible inquiry. Their unimpeachable gramps is speaking incoherently and walking into walls. If impeachment goes through, even if the Senate dispatches it, a large portion of the white male cohort will be hurtin'.
The temptation to get really snarky is there, but I have to remember that one of these these guys may be the EMT who pull me out of danger, on some indeterminate day. We all need to go to a higher ground perspective. Who can lead us there?
If anyone should recognize that Ambassador Sondland is in prime position to deploy the "useful idiot" defense, it is the ones who tried to use that defense to deflect responsibility for Russian interference and the subsequent follow up.
Much like the president, Ambassador Sondland was hired for a job he had no preparation for and perhaps his experience was worse than having no preparation. That he was hired anyway makes it difficult to be overly harsh on him for contributing to a shameless plot now that he has at least partially come clean - and he is smart enough to know this.
His experine may be the tipping point where Trump and those who stick with him have to be far more fearful than those who cross him. We may have watched the air be let out of the (baby Trump) balloon.
Oh what a tangled web they wove when they set out to deceive.
But at this point, all they can do is obfuscate. ... Sondland said, “Everyone was in the loop. It was no secret.” This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away.
Precisely! Shout it from the rooftops!
Gordon Sondland made "a carnage" out of the president's and Republican defenses of his Ukraine bribery. Sondland, a billionaire with nothing to lose except his "ambassadorship", some prestige and self respect, came clean with the impeachment committee and threw caution to the winds. Republicans then went after him like a pack of rabid, snarling dogs because Sondland made a liar out of the president and his supporters.
Sondland is now persona non grata in Republican circles but at least he put his country ahead of his party. VP Pence, SOS Pompeo, John Bolton and others would do well to follow Sondland's example.
Sondland was careful to tie the quid pro quo to a meeting, and not to the cleared congressional approved military aid. Doing some presuming, like Sondland did, he was coached to tie only a meeting to Trump's demands for investigations. Since an exception to requesting a meeting is specified in the bribery statute, he's still licking his big man's shoes and trying to protect him while performing a faux tell-all.
I am oh so glad that I don't live in Ohio in the districts these attack bulls represent. Their demeanors obscure any other message they intend to convey. If they weren't so transparent, I'd be scared.
POTUS and GOP tried, and succeeded, in throwing their old pal Diplomat Sondland right under the bus, they just forgot to let go. Ouch !
Hmmmmm, here in the heartland, where the Democratic National convention will be held next year, that message is not as clear as it is in The NYT’s Opinion Dept. Yesterday, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reported that Marquette U. polls indicate that support for impeachment has DROPPED in Wisconsin, and that Trump leads the top four Democratic contenders!! Now to be fair, the Marquette polls also showed Hillary winning the state...
Anyplace Russia see's weakness or the ability to undermine, they take advantage of it. Trump has been fawning over Putin for years before he ran for President and Putin knows how to handle and control an asset.
It would not surprise me that Putin suggested that Ukraine was behind the 2016 election interference in one of the secret meeting he held with trump. Being of small intellect, trump bit hard at that idea.
People who believe in conspiracy theories have "...the desire to maintain a positive self-image.)* Trump has always worried that someone would pull down the curtain and show the world what he really is, a scared failure that needs attention. That is why he hides his tax returns, that is why he never wants notes taken in meetings and that is why he is absolutely incapable of being a good President or a decent human being.
"Trump is only interested in the big things that help him". Paraphrase of Sondland quote. This "big thing" is going to be tough to recover from.
*https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/talking-apes/201801/why-do-people-believe-in-conspiracy-theories
Calling out Devin Nunes, and Jim Jordan, two of the most dishonest incompetent figures to inhabit the house in modern history was the right thing to do. Both are so transparently complete Bozos I can't imagine anyone actually believes in them. They are simply a huge embarrassment to our country
2
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption".
1
“An administration rotten to the core says it all”.
1
Lets hope he takes them all down. Its a long list of enablers, traitors, and greedy corrupt politicians. What a dream come true that would be.
1
Considering this charade will ultimately be decided by the 21st-century version of the O.J. jury, no surprise to see Kato Kaelin on the stand. And just as endearing, in his goofy way.
Smirking Sondland ---he'll say and do anything. Then avoid being set up as a fall guy.
Our politics is poisoned, creating the soil for this repugnant cast of characters out of a Hollywood crime saga. We see exposed the naked manipulation for power---in a nation pretending to be a positive role model of democracy for the world.
We and the world watch this crime syndicate operating in positions of our govt.
How will it end?
How many election cycles will it take to start the cleansing our diseased political culture?
And restore the respect of the world?
This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away.
Good Bye GOP , WE HARDLY RECOGNIZE YOU!
Lock em all up! Trump, Trump Jr., Giuliani, Pence, Mulvaney, Pompeo, Jared, Ivanka, Barr, Hannity, Jordan, Nunes and, after the vote, Republicans who do not vote to impeach. They are ALL un-American.
1
Trump's unbelievable mafia-like behavior is boomeranging and, indeed, throwing him under Sondland's bus...as it must. The office of the presidency is just too big for his meager stature, and not even a republican scooter complicit in his incompetence may carry him far enough. Will he ever learn that no one is above the law, no matter what his personal lawyer, AG Barr, says?
How can "I would like you to do us a favor though," be construed as "I want nothing!" When you start a sentence with I would like a favor, it is clear you DO want something. It can't be both ways. There is a transcript, in writing that states a favor is desired. As Jimmy Stewart put it in Rear Window, "What do you need? Bloody footsteps leading up to the door?"
Sondland has spilled the beans and Nunes' and Jordan's attempts to spin and obfuscate are pathetic. I just can't figure out why Pompeo, et al. stand by and let Trump break the law. Are they afraid of Trump and his tantrums? Trump is seriously disturbed and clearly decompensating. This nightmare will soon come to an end.
It'll all come out when someone sticks a mike in front of Giuliani and he's sufficiently angry about being used.
If We the People of the United States do not vote ALL of the Republicans in Congress out of office for their shameless defense of Trump's criminality, we will deserve the morally compromised government that we have allowed.
The GOP has gone nose blind to the moral rot at the core of their party that stinks to high heaven.
History is watching.
VOTE BLUE NO MATTER WHO!
VP Pence and mother actually begged to be part of this. The only thing worse than being corrupt and lying about it is being corrupt and being sanctimonious about it.
1
Ken Starr’s comment that yesterday was “....one of those bombshell days...” tells you all you need to know. I expect that the Rs will still rally ‘round Trump in then Senate but anyone with a train in their head knows the Truth.
Looks like Trump and the Republican Party have found themselves tied with a Gordian knot.
1
Man that Sondland cat got played
He paid a million and he was the lay
Ignorant of legal and ethical international intrigue
This patsy was way out of his league
trump removed the one obstacle
Place Sondland right in the middle
While the mark wondered the halls of diplomacy
Rudy twisted the arm of a weak country
Trying to kill two bird with one stone
Russia and Bidens Brisma the clone
Sondland went from Ambassador to a man named S
Pence Rudy and Pompeo the guess
Using the peoples money to get a Quid Pro Quo
Its easy to get elected with other people dough
Sondland said it was a Quid Pro Qou
But he didn't know Brisma was Joe
Maybe all these Republicans should be brought to justice, too, for aiding and abetting a criminal enterprise. They are behaving as if they are his lawyers, but in fact they are just all trying to drive the getaway car.
1
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Ms. Golberg, your perfect summation should be tattooed on the forehead of Trump and all his minions, starting with Trump, followed by Nunes, Jordan, and most especially, Lindsey Graham.
1
Sondland's gifts
To the Dems: Quid Pro Quo.
To the Trumpists: No connection to the Bidens in the Burisma connection..
To the American people: Impeachment now a little closer.
Thanks, Gordon.
39
@RLW Lets not forget that the American citizens put this bunch in power and allowed this behaviour to continue and flourish.
A minor query: Isn't it strange that the President apparently already knows the Bidens are corrupt, yet still pressured the Ukraine to conduct an investigation??? Why bother with pressuring the Ukraine for an investigation if the President already has the evidence....just hand it over to the Justice Department, whose job it is to investigate such things?
So far the only 'evidence' we've seen is that Biden called for removal of a Ukraine prosecutor, in concert with other European governments, because the prosecutor was known to be corrupt. And US and other governments' policy toward the Ukraine was that it should reduce its corruption. And his son was on the board of one of a great any companies on the list of potential investigations.
2
You realize that the serial defeats of all these defenses won't mean anything to the brainwashed Trump base, or to mere Republicans who want to believe. All they will remember is the long list of reasons Trump is just fine, not the proof that they are all hogwash. "And the list gets longer. The impeachment case looks increasingly weak," they'll crow. And it will seem persuasive to lead poisoned brains. You can't win a stupidity contest.
1
It's time for The Times to seriously discuss the psychology of cultism
3
If Republicans want to dispute Sondland's, Cooper's, Vindman's, Yovanovitch's and everyone else's damning testimony, nothing is stopping them from providing all the documents, emails and records sought by the House. If they want to provide exonerating testimony, Messrs. Pompeo, Bolton, Pence, Giuliani, Mulvaney, Vought and Perry, and Sen. Johnson are all free to testify under oath.
What's that I hear? The sound of silence is deafening. That's because the Republicans have NOTHING to offer but lies, obfuscation, smoke screens, and empty conspiracy theories. Trump abused his office and every Republican in the country knows it.
2
Where have you gone Mittpierre Delecto?
Our nation turns its lonely eyes to you.
Woo woo woo.
Interesting that amongst your commentators we do not seem to find defenders of "The President" Have even Putin's Trolls recognised a lost cause?
1
Too bad Putin's stooges in the House aren't also giving up.
@Will
How I wish you were right. However, several of the usual suspects are here trolling away, cut-and-pasting stale Fox talking points.
Frankly, I don't know why they come here, unless they're just contrary, have nothing better to do, and truly think their tripe registers with these readers. Maybe they're paid. I wouldn't be surprised.
Oh, please take them all, along with GOP complicit bunch.
It's really easy to connect the dots...
Ukraine, Russia, Trump.
Why all this nefarious mess in Ukraine?
Everyone knows Putin wants Ukraine back in submission, he can't afford the former Soviet State drifting away from his steely clutches, he is also much more vulnerable that people on a West realized.
Most of former Soviet Union republics want independence from Putin's Russia, a.k.a. Baltic, Georgia, Ukraine, Armenia, etc...
That's what terrifies Kremlin the most, his dream was restoring the empire, without Ukraine he is no longer have this...
We can be sure Putin explained all of his preoccupations to our submissive useful idiot in a simplest terms, and ordered him to act accordingly.
That's why the notes of interpreters were destroyed to never see the lights of day!
Oh! the secrets of this "transparent" cabal!
For the most part Americans can't understand what Ukraine has to do with all this mess.
Well, it's pretty easy...Putin needs Ukraine to remain in power and trump needs Putin to get re-elected, instead of ending up locked in a prison cell.
As simple as that!
I heard some expert characterized Russian system as Gangster Capitalism.
Let's make sure we won't end up in this category...we're dangerously close!
I hope Americans will rise up to pressure Senate to remove this dangerous person from the WH.
1
The endless delusional incantations of Nunes, Jordan and other would-be defenders of Donald J. Putin continue this morning. But they have long since lost any possibility of being believable by any ratioal observer. Lets hope they get what they deserve in the 2020 election, along with the treasonous liar they defend.
So this means our President will be impeached and removed from office.
Nope, as usual, wrong again Michelle.
Have your fun now.....I can't wait to see the ongoing "fake outrage" from the Dems when this all dies in the Senate.
I say "fake outrage", because as you know from the start of all this impeachment nonsense Michelle, just as the Dems will vote in a bloc in the House for impeachment, so will the Reps in the Senate to acquit our President.
And rightfully so.
2
@DYoua re proud of the fact that your party ignores evidence of corruption? Good for you. 2+2=5, amirite?
Because you want Putin to get his way?
@terry
Hmmnn...Putin?
Oh yes - he's the Russian leader which Obama was soooo scared of as to NOT help the Ukrainians.
I remember now...
Sure, Republicans wanted to throw Sondland under the bus. But they also understand that there was nothing Sondland could have said that would have affected Trump's voters in the slightest.
Sondland's testimony about Trump's role was damning. He stated without equivocation that he acted on Trump's express orders vis a vis the Ukraine bribery affair. But even this damning evidence - which should have seen the public resignation of Trump this evening - will have absolutely no consequence.
We all know that Trump has committed numerous felonies while in office. We've had a surfeit of respected, credible witnesses testify to this, under oath.
But Trump will continue to be untouchable. Why? Because his voters will never leave him. His poll numbers have been virtually unchanged for more than three years. He knows that Senate Republicans are terrified of them. And because of this fear, they will never vote to remove him from office.
We now live in an America where forty percent of our citizens have absolute control over the rest of us. And these forty percent have the power to keep a felon in office indefinitely.
So while we may want to castigate Senate Republicans for shirking their Constitutional responsibilities, we must place responsibility where it really lies - Trump voters. If shoving Hispanic children into internment camps didn't weaken their support, surely his corruption, bribery and extortion will not. And Trump voters should finally be held to account.
2
Nunes has shown himself yet again to be a brainless Trump sycophant whose petulance and word salads sully American politics whenever he opens his mouth. It is astonishing that this degree of dysfunction occupies one soulless humam carcass.
1
It's been obvious to me that Trump just wanted the announcement of an investigation into Burisma, the Bidens and blaming Ukraine for interfering in the 2016 election. It's totally his m o. Remember when he sent investigators to Hawaii to find President Obama's birth certificate. Or the other day when he said he had dirt on Lt. Colonel Vindman. He is a straight up LIAR, every day, every way. Corrupt to the core.
1
This Stefanik lady thinks she's increasing her profile and probably thinks she's doing great, but she just comes off as some female Nunes-clone, which is not good. She's terrible.
2
Is Amb. Sondland still employed this morning?
If only Ukraine had a shiny Trump Tower on the Black Sea.
1
Sondland is a multi millionaire hotel chain owner. His ambassadorship to the EU was a vanity job, given to him for a $1m donation to Trump. He expected to drink champagne and host cocktail parties in European palaces. The Europeans describe him as a bull the diplomatic china shop, nobody took him seriously. He was out of his league in a diplomatic job he never understood and was suckered into being a bag man for the Trump White House. One thing he made clear yesterday at the Impeachment Hearings, he doesn't need this job, he has plenty of money, another job waiting for him back in Oregon and was not going to go to jail for Trump.
2
Sondland is a laughing hyena and should go to jail for perjury because he knew
Many close to Trump are complicit in his shake down of Ukraine. This scabrous bunch of hangers on will cling to the boss as long as the heat isn't lapping too close to their shoes. If they sense warmth they will do a Sondland.
Sorry, this is NothingBurger 2.0
2
Every Republican defense of Donald Trump is essentially the same thing - A big massive lie covered in excrement.
1
I've been waiting all week for Fiona Hill. Sondland's testimony was damning, but unfortunately it is the third version of his testimony. Hill has been utterly consistent throughout, and she is our window onto Bolton.
At this point, I’m not even angry anymore. I am just broken hearted that the Republican Party seems hell bent on giving this administration a pass on conduct that is fundamentally un-American and completely unforgivable. God help us all.
1
Bring the bus back around, we'll need it to haul the lot of these traitors to prison.
1
With all the Republican bootlickers in the Trump Administration and Congress, I have to say that I'm impressed with Sondland's decision to take that bus he was to be thrown under and start driving it himself.
137
@Morgan
Republican boot lickers forget this fact.Dems know they will never get their votes,dems are after independents and others who cast a vote for trump and are regretting it.They are also after an enraged populace turning out in massive numbers in nov 2020 to throw the crooks out.
4
@Tom Meadowcroft "No one was hurt." Really? Trump has shredded, peed on, and trampled The Constitution. That hurts all of our people. It doesn't matter if you are Republican, Democrat or Independent, you have been insulted and harmed by the denial and repudiation of your rights and heritage as Americans under The Constitution. "No one was hurt," indeed - only if you don't care for your rights.
1
All of the GOP defenses fail to explain why the Ukraine aid was withheld for 55 days. Congress appropriated the aid and it would be gone if not given before Sept. 30 of 2019. Trump does not care about corruption as he has shown many times. So why delay the aid to this front line ally at war with Russia?
Not all of the U.S. voters are idiots.
@Michael
You are right. Many of us are actually smart enough to understand you are mad about Trump delaying aid that Obama REFUSED to GRANT. Never a word against Obama for denying to give the aid? But we didn't notice that did we? You assert many voters are not idiots but act as if you believe they are.
The Republicans sound like mob guys complaining of mafia harassment from law enforcement.
They should all spend Thanksgiving at a social club together in little Italy and then spend the night at a strip club. It would be more pure that way.
$20 says that MRS. Sondland told her husband "If you go to Jail, I'll divorce you and run off with your money & the pool boy."
That's why he flipped.
1
Sondland, in plain speak, is a weasel. He scampers arrogantly and agilely in between light and darkness, that shadowy place inhabited by the morally corrupt and criminal. He's right at home in the Trump crime mob.
Crooked is as crooked does.
Do your really think Trump's supporters care that Trump and his people are rotten to the core. I know many, and they don't, they Trump and crew are just peachy.
What was worse: the testimony, or the fact that he saw absolutely nothing wrong in his actions - or Trump’s?
This really is a pack of rats, mobsters and kleptocrats all!
Trump truly picked the best people - for him. Complete loyalty means being willing to help the Trumps Rape and loot the nation - and the world - for their own benefit. “I was only following orders” should mean absolutely NOTHING here. The lookouts and the one who drove the getaway car, are equally guilty in the robbery...
When will all of these scoundrels go to prison? All of them!
anyone seen Rudy lately?
1
Trump vs the Congress is another iteration of
the eternal dispute between those who imagine the world to suit their policies and those who must adapt their policies/beliefs to confront the realities of the world -- and life itself.
One side has become insanely rich with dreamers who want to emulate them and who learned how to get control of successful companies so they could rip them apart and sell the pieces for profit. They were too young then (in the 80s) to recognize the communities they disrupted and the nation they blighted.
The other side simply wants to meet family needs: To create & contribute, and realize the benefit of cooperation, education, and economies of scale. But, they encountered privilege, poverty and chaos because our government failed to control our system.
Meaningful representation was weakened because community "boosters" who knew their community, its people, and their needs; and who sought out and cultivated promising young people to become future leaders -- ceased to be electors.
"Electors" have been reduced to aggregate numbers of popularity, stripped of wisdom.
Presidents should be selected by a gathering of the boosters who gambled their energy & resources to find and promote emerging leaders. Leaders who have their own community at heart.
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness"
What makes us happy ?
-- when power is the ability to control the happiness of others
-- and our primary goal is just to make as much money as we can?
As in Watergate, Trump's inner circle is coming clean rather than face perjury charges. This will be the undoing of Trump as it was for Nixon. We just need the "tape" in its current digital format, and Trump is finished. However, unlike Nixon, Trump will never resign no matter how damning the evidence is against him.
67
@Jefflz
Which brings to mind the words of Michael Cohen, Trump's former personal lawyer when he said he feared that if Trump wasn't reelected in 2020, there would be no peaceful transition.
7
@Jefflz You have something much better than a tape: live witnesses like Sondland, Col. Vindman et al.
7
@Bruce
Perhaps, Bolton as well.
3
While it may seem he was primarily interested in dirt on the Bidens, I think this ultimately comes down to Trump's fealty to Putin.
He held up aid that Ukraine desperately needed in its defensive war with Russia. That fact overwhelms everything else. This is exactly what Putin wanted--to render Ukraine helpless against Russia's onslaught.
Further, if these machinations could drive a wedge between Ukraine and its bi-partisan support in the US, Ukraine would be even more vulnerable. Putin is capable of 3-dimensional chess (Trump struggles with tiddlywinks).
So while the president is clearly guilty of bribery, it seems he's also guilty of treason.
2
For those who view the impeachment process as a Biden issue, please take into consideration it is the President of the United States pursuing a conspiracy theory despite proof from all National Security Agencies that Russia interfered in the 2016 election. As Commander in Chief it is frightening to think Trump has no confidence in those agencies and the citizens that work in them while choosing to believe Putin over the facts. Trump directed his personal lawyer to participate in international diplomacy not compatable with State Department protocol which sets a dangerous precedent. Lt Colonel Vindeman said it best in reference to the power Trump holds as opposed to Zelensky's vulnerability, simultaneously at war with Putin and dealing with Trump, a Putin sympathizer. It is a credit to Zelensky he did not cave under the methodical, constant pressure while forming a new government. Do not forget Ambassador Vonanovitch was a casualty, her reputation in question globally in order for Trump to achieve his goal. Impeachment and removal from office for the entire cast of characters who participated in this diabolical party is essential for this country to regain respect for the Democratic process. They have all brought shame upon us.
2
And after all of this evidence trump will escape impeachment at the hand of Mitch McConnell and the Republican Senate. Let us hope that the 2020 elections do have consequences, we need to rid our democracy of Mitch McConnell and his followers.
4
By far the strongest "argument" Trump supporters have is the so what, who cares? "argument" where they are quick to point out that Ukraine did get its aid, they got more than Obama ever gave them (Kelly-Ann Conway on TV last night) and all because Trump cares so so much about helping them. Also, Zelensky himself said there was no quid pro quo, and he should know, right? There's no reason why he would say anything else, right?
Anyone who sees the impeachment inquiry as a waste of time "because" of the above is probably unreachable. I just hope that's a small and in the end inconsequential number of people.
4
@sunandrain
Put me in that group. That rather large group I would add. Care to offer an argument why 'the above' shouldn't be a reason to dismiss this impeachment? Explain why its ok for Obama to deny the aid but impeachable for Trump to delay it, if you can.
National policy on one hand, personal Political gain on the other. Really not tricky.
Riding Trump's bus is apparently an electric Kool-Aid acid test.
7
Devin Nunes bases Trump's defense on Russian propaganda. It all blows my mind.
10
It took several attempts at the end, but Gordon Sondland eventually let it drop that there's no doubt what the true goal of those "investigations" meant, and whom would be the greatest beneficiary of them; namely, Donald Trump.
After watching all of those called before the House Intelligence Committee hearings, it's hard to argue that this president didn't insert his personal agenda in the conditions for Ukraine to receive the $400 million already earmarked for them, to support their efforts in fight the encroaching Russian troops on their territory.
And yet Devin Nunes and the rest of the Republican cabal did their best to make it look like there's nothing wrong with the U.S. President interfering, while continuing the false narrative that it was Ukraine, and not Russia that influenced our 2016 elections.
How anyone in their right mind fails to see what this is really about is beyond me.
All this has become more than an attempt to find the truth behind what's going on -- it has become a test of democracy, and not only for Ukraine, but of our own.
7
Trump is always slinging the label of "treason" essentially on anyone who isn't onboard with his agenda. As Speaker Pelosi noted he frequently projects aspects of himself on to others. Nunes is a fool and definitely doing a disservice to truth and democratic ideals. I hope the voters in his district send him packing.
@mmk
And it's also true when Nancy Pelosi says: " All roads lead to Putin."
1
Appears truth is being spoken to Republican power and that power will do as it pleases: keep Trump in power, betraying their oaths to the Constitution notwithstanding.
7
Before this inquiry my vote was undecided. It is no longer undecided. We simply can't allow democrats to divide the country by letting the media impeach a president they can't beat at the polls. Probably not here but most of America can see right through this.
3
@RS I strongly disagree. What we cannot allow is for Trump and his supporters to lie their way into another year or more of control of our government. The Trump administration has demonstrated itself to be a wholly owned subsidiary of Vladimir Putin's Kremlin.
15
Democrats beat Trump at the polls. He did not win the popular vote. And be careful aboit enabling a lawless president.
1
RS somehow I seem to get the impression that you have not at all been undecided.
Since quid pro quo, per se, is not unlawful, the Democrats now alleged that the president attempted to bribe President Zelensky. They alleged Trump offered Zelensky an invitation to the White House in exchange for publicly announcing the opening of investigations into the Bidens’ relationship with Brusima and alleged Ukrainian interference in the U.S. 2016 presidential election.
However, the federal bribery statute requires prosecutors to prove defendants acted with corrupt intent. If President Trump sincerely believed Ukraine interfered in the 2016 election and that the Biden’s connection to Brusima is corrupt, he did not act with corrupt intent. Many witnesses have testified Trump actually believes these allegations.
1
Oh, stop. This is like saying that because it’s okay to swat flies, you get to bust the toddler next door in the mouth because he’s annoying.
Nobody’s buying this trick of zooming out and generalizing until nothing means anything, okay?
@William Case
You can't have it both ways, William. The only putative corruption in Ukraine Trump has ever expressed any interest in is the baseless notions about the Bidens and Crowdstrike that Trump has already been using against his political opponents in the next election, despite being told that there's no responsible support for these ideas. If Trump has no criminal intent because of his sincere belief that these fantasies are real, then he is subject to the 25th amendment. In other words, your argument boils down to Trump is not guilty by reason of insanity.
@bob
Many witnesses tested the president was concerned about Ukraine corruption in general and that the United States was paying more than its share of aid to Ukraine in addition to Brusima and Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election. The Obama administration expressed the same concerns.
Thank You! for the last paragraph. It needs to be on billboards and buses and subways and grain silos and water towers all across this nation.
9
I remember when Republicans simply could not believe that Richard Nixon had anything to do with the Watergate break-in.
But they continued to say the same things even as the evidence grew. Even as the president was implicated, some republicans continued to support him.
As some point, what seemed a lack of imagination became a cover up.
There is a lot to laugh at about Nixon, as with Donald, but history has no sense of humor.
13
@Occupy Government, Occupy says "... but history has no sense of humor." But repeated history does have a sense of irony. Watergate injured the GOP for years--Trumpgate should do far more damage.
If the Senate does not give a full and serious consideration to these charges, they will have opened the door to corruption at every level of American government. We will be paying bribes for construction permits and local policing, and school board races will be fixed. The Republican party is very close to subscribing to this dream for our collective future. We we allow them to represent us?
14
seems as though the chaos and dis connectivity Putin has sowed in Russia and trump is sowing in the US will go international in a big way if we cannot stop the republicans and trump. there will be no facts. corruption will be virtue and virtue will be unrecognizable by the average person.
2
The Democrats could continue to stack proven facts from here to the Sun and the Senate will still acquit. The quote that comes to mind is from William Paley in the eighteenth century (often mis-attributed to Herbert Spencer): “There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is a proof against all arguments, and which cannot fail to keep a [person] in everlasting ignorance — that principle is contempt prior to investigation.”
259
@Cal Prof
Excellent quote. I will answer with another one.
“It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.”
Upton Sinclair.
70
@Cal Prof: Excellent quote! Thank you.
13
@Cal Prof -- Sad, but true. But, all the testimony will be part of the historical record of Trump's presidency, along with every ridiculous thing he's ever tweeted. Presidential scholars of the future will have a field day with 45. Trump will certainly be remembered as our most ridiculous and puerile president, to be sure.
34
seems as though the chaos and dis connectivity Putin has sowed in Russia and trump is sowing in the US will go international in a big way if we cannot stop the republicans and trump. there will be no facts. corruption will be virtue and virtue will be unrecognizable by the average person.
1
Sondland has the same disease as Trump. He does not tell the truth. How can Sondland’s credibility be worth a grain of salt after all his retakes in testifying?
2
Sondland's testimony should be a crippling blow to the GOP's thin as bathroom tissue defenses of Donald J. Trump. Based on the Soviet style disinformation campaign they're waging, Nunes and Jordan seem to believe not just in different facts, but a different version of reality than the rest of us. If we still believe that facts matter, or that truth has any place in our political landscape, then Sondland obliterated the arguments of Trump and his corrupt minions as surely as a flame thrower torches a pile of kindling. The Senate may not convict, but after watching the Sondland testimony, the American people will be treated to a cavalcade of GOP Senators actively doing the wrong thing and voting against the constitution to preserve their jobs, right before the 2020 election. Not a good look for the GOP. Will preserving their jobs and defending Trump even be compatible after yesterday's revelations? We live in interesting times. Pass the popcorn.
4
@wildwest: The Electoral College and Senate apportionment should be the hottest issues in the present campaign. Why aren't they?
7
@Steve Bolger : agree. Add to that the very overdue size of the house from the 435 members set in 1918 to something proportional to its defined duty as the peoples house. Why aren't the dems talking about this stuff?
2
@Steve Bolger
I agree completely. The Electoral College has long since outlived it's purpose and should be abolished. Senate apportionment is also way out of whack. We need one person, one vote, period.
Republicans claim to love this country. This brings to mind a lyric from Van Halen’s debut album: “Ain’t talkin’ bout love. My love is rotten to the core.” Thanks for memory jog, Ms. Goldberg.
There are many comments that describe a fog of uncertainty. It's as if a criminal can't be convicted unless he's announced his intent to commit a crime in advance, and only if they use the proper legal terminology, like "I'm going to use a quid pro quo to get what I want." Criminals are rarely this cooperative, but this has become one of the primary talking points used by Republicans and it's ridiculous. Like Sondland said, "two plus two equals four."
4
Its always fun watching a stack of dominos fall.
1
While I fully expect that the GOP has issued another set of laughable talking points, it’s become clear that after seeing Roger Stone go to jail for lying to Congress, no one else is willing to follow suit.
If the GOP is so eager to get firsthand accounts, they should demand that Bolton, Giuliani, Mulvaney, Pence, Pompeo, and Trump all testify under oath.
I mean, what could possibly go wrong? 🤷♂️
7
It will be very interesting to see how long it takes before Trump fires this army of truth tellers in our diplomatic corps who are testifying before this Congressional committee. I can imagine the whole Republican cabal, trying to find the sweet spot timing to fire the lot of them as “disloyal” to Trump, before they are replaced with loyal toadies. I’m guessing that is topmost in Trump’s vindictive brain, and he must be tormented by the fact that he can’t yell “You’re Fired!” whenever he wants. I’m enjoying this little nugget of schadenfreude, amidst the despair of realizing how far our country has fallen.
3
We should congratulate Congressman Devon Nunes , who is apparently the only Republican Congressman who has managed to stoop as low as Donald Trump in his day-to-day activities. By also becoming a professional liar. people like Nunes think that creating “spin” is a legitimate way to play politics . But when one goes as low as Donald Trump , the lying can prove to be eventually harmful to United States interests ,particularly when the President and these pathetic Congressmen continue to flaunt Trump’s line of disinformation in order to protect him. What these misguided men (Jim Jordan included) do not understand is that they are also becoming an unwitting accomplice to Russian interests in much the same way that Donald Trump has been in every single day of his presidency. Remember Helsinki? These are now the overtones that are sounding from earlier disgraceful moments within this administration.
And Devon Nunes should be mindful of what has happened to people who have closely aligned themselves to Donald Trump.
Maybe Mr. Nunes should think upon the names of
Michael Cohen , Paul Manafort , and Roger Stone ... are you getting the picture?
6
Sondland bribes Trump (whom he didn’t originally support) for a sweet Ambassadorship post, and could go into the history books as the guy who brought down a President.
Not a bad return on his investment!
2
" This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away".
This is a fact that should not be forgotten after the impeachment process reaches its inevitable end. The enablers, at this point, should be viewed as co-conspirators.
6
When Trump claims that he "hardly knows" people who implicate him in wrong-doing, I suspect that we're hearing him use tactics he learned from Roy Cohn. (We heard similar things years ago when Trump tried to distance himself from his private helicopter pilot Joseph Weichselbaum, a thrice-convicted felon).
Roy Cohn's clients included men at the top of organized crime -- men who tried to insulate themselves from those committing crimes on their behalf. If a mob boss "associate" was tasked with "negotiating" protection-money payments from a legitimate business owner, and that owner's shop then mysteriously burned to the ground, the crime boss would invariably tell police that he had no connection to his "associate." It's this technique that Trump may have learned from mobster attorney Roy Cohn.
4
"This administration [and its party--GOP]is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away." How can anyone not guzzling Trump Kool-Aid not agree with these last two lines.
How well we recover depends on November 2020. Vote Blue!
2
About that bus Republicans are throwing people under. They need a new bus. It's gotten too crowded under there.
5
@William it’s a javelin I heard..
1
I would suggest that the correct adjective that describes politicians who try to explain away the corruption we see is not "disloyal", but "traitorous".
And though I more often than not agree with Stephen King's policy of avoiding adverbs whenever possible, the politicians I have seen supporting every single illegal act committed by Trump with arguments they seem to actually expect the general public will swallow, they are ridiculously, shamelessly, odiously, vilely, and abominably traitorous.
They should be publicly denounced, then kicked out of office to make room for true Republicans who first and foremost respect the Rule of Law.
4
Good lucking finding a member of that extinct species. Remember when the Communist Party was illegal in America because it posed such a threat to the nation? There’s precedent to declare the GOP as it currently exists a threat of at least equal magnitude. Tell that to the cow boy.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Michelle, I'm sure you thought long and hard before putting that down in your op-ed. I thank you for doing this. I just doubt that enough of us will hold or come to hold this view to put the fear of doom into the Republicans. Their destructive journey downward will likely continue. Rep Jordan comes from a gerrymandered district that will gladly follow him deeper and deeper into that polluted swamp come what may.
3
It won’t matter. Trump won’t be impeached. He will re-elected.
4
To paraphrase Daniel McCarthy, "Trump Is Doing Exactly What Putin Had Him Elected to Do".
4
Let's play a game…
Remember when Obama realized in the summer of 2011 that Mitt Romney was his likely opponent for the presidency the next year?
And, remember how Obama made a phone call to Benjamin Netanyahu, prime minister of Israel, who Obama believed had dirt on Romney?
He knew Israel was counting on delivery of Patriot anti-missile weapons to combat incoming missiles from Hamas. The Patriots had been approved by a bi-partisan vote in Congress.
We all recall how Obama had unilaterally held up delivery of the Patriots and, on that phone call, asked Netanyahu to "do him a favor" and announce an "investigation" of Romney.
That phone call, that pressure on Netanyahu, combined with Obama's attorney making mischief in the Israeli diplomatic corp, sent a message:
You WILL do this for me or no Patriot anti-missile weapons.
Remember how a whistleblower spilled the beans and how much trouble Obama got into?
No, you don't remember any of that.
Because it never happened.
A normal, non-criminal president wouldn't dream of such unscrupulous, anti-American behavior that extorts an ally.
But, if it had happened, the Republicans would be running around on fire with charges of abuse of power.
And, they'd be correct.
And this liberal would have supported them.
I'm an American first.
And, I know right from wrong.
Republicans do too.
But, bucking the "Trump First Gang" is dangerous.
Remember America?
Do you, Republicans?
5
Soap Operas have come a long way in my life. From sets in one room to the "glory" of the United States Congress. Trouble is the folks putting them on still think of us as the fans of Queen For A Day. Get back in the kitchen with yer new appliances, the business boys behind the scenes bark.All the retired boomer political junkies watch with baited breath to see who killed JR.
Somebody arrest these people before something real happens.
In the last three days the "3 Amigos" of the Republican Party have given their best shot at destroying the credibility of a very top end military individual as well as attempting to humiliate a billionaire, businessman, huge donor, and lifelong Republican, good thing those guys aren't all paranoid, and all in the name of a grifter who has committed crimes against the Constitution of the United States of America and our own Republican Senators apparently don't have the moral courage to even speak out, let alone impeach a now known criminal in the White House.
This is how a society breaks down, 101.
2
Phantasmagorical. Obfuscate. Perfect. Between Nunes and Jordan, Trump has the perfect foils to attempt to slither through this mess. Yet they have been foiled themselves by the wiles of Rudy Giuliani and Gordon Sondland. We now have a basketball team to field when the championships occur next November. I just can’t wait to see them all blown off the court.
Michelle Goldberg continues to be the single most substantive, intelligent, and persuasive of the Times's columnists. This piece admirably demonstrates her value to American democracy.
2
While his testimony was certainly interesting I don't believe it rises to the historic level of John Dean's famous appearance in front of the committee where he announced that was a cancer on the presidency. I'm very doubtful that 50 years from now we will see Gordon Sondland on CNN talking about the latest political scandals.
1
I saw John Dean testify. Believe me, Gordon Sondland is no John Dean.
I’m amazed that someone who has such a faulty memory as “Ambassador” Sondland doesn’t take any notes. If he praises himself (of course in a non-braggadocious way!) of his daily interactions with heads of states and other movers and shakers, what’s the merit of them if he can’t recall if, or when, or what about they talked? Compare this to the work ethics of Ambassador Yovanovitch...
Sondland is another tremendous and beautiful example that Trump only hires the best people.
2
Trump now knows what it means to be thrown under bus one businessman to another.
God I love Michelle Goldberg. She offers up some of the most lucid, penetrating comments about Trump and his evil cabal, like this gem:
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Thank you, Michelle, for adding a dose of sanity to my morning routine.
3
@Dconkror It is obvious by his comment on FOX that even the cruel and careless Ken Starr, willful destroyer of a legitimate presidency-- agrees with Michelle's assessment of the administration and the corruption of its enablers. His remark bears repeating in tandem with your quote from Michelle:"This obviously has been one of those bombshell days." Indeed.
I am surprised that this is not mentioned anywhere in The NYTimes . This is Ambassador Sondland responding to a question from Mr Schiff yesterday about a quid pro quo — Trump demanding from Zelensky — before there would be aid, security assistance offered to Ukraine, he says to Sondland, “Is this an accurate reflection of your discussion with the president?”. Sondland answers “I believe I just asked him an open-ended question, Mr. Chairman. “What do you want from Ukraine? I keep hearing all these different ideas and theories and this and that. What do you want?” And it was a very short, abrupt conversation. He was not in a good mood. And he just said, “I want nothing. I want nothing. I want no quid pro quo. Tell Zelensky to do the right thing.” Something to that effect”. So what do you mean that there was quid pro quo?
3
@Carla I think there's an assumption being made that may be false: that Trump actually knows what a quid pro quo is. Of course he could care less if he did know the meaning. Or it could go something like this: I hit you in the back of the head, you turn around and confront me asking why I did that. I reply," I didn't do anything."
Oh how deliciously ironic it will be if Sondland, who contributed a million dollars for the Trump inaugural festivities to buy himself a plum ambassadorship, contributes the most instrumental testimony leading to his destitution.
Trump blatantly tells the world that the US is a rogue state, thieving, racketeering superpower that will not hesitate to use both its military and economic might to serve the interests, not of the American people but, of the handful who always profit from such practices. What Trump has done, is to deprive the naive American people of the false claim that their country is "spreading democracy", that they have "values", that they "care for the oppressed and downtrodden" in contrast to Obama who was a master of disguise. He camouflaged his war-mongering with Nobel Prize for Peace; his whiteness -- with his blackness, his materialist rapaciousness with idle talk of equality, democracy, and pseudo-spirituality. The hypocrisy disguising greed, war-mongering, and WASPy superiority were not just Obama's of course. They were of the country that had chosen him as the president.
1
@Michael Sorensen Okay, I will play your game. Let's say that everything you state about Obama is true: are you suggesting that the magnitude of evil, greed, stupidity, narcissism that rules every step of every day for trump-- is EQUALLY shared by Obama? Are they really one and the same?
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Amen.
Conservative interests have only a few more months to straighten this nightmare out with their conservative peers
before the American voters do it for them. I wouldn't wait for the election if I were them.
Can we expand the impeachment proceedings to include Pence, Pompeo, and by extension, that nitwit Mulvaney? Michelle is right: the whole administration is rotten to the core.
Reminds me of the inverse apple barrel theorem: why root through a barrel of apples that all appear rotten on the prospect you might find one good one in there somewhere?
All of them need to go.
1
What is truly disturbing is that after all of this is said and done Trump may just pull off his greatest con by remaining in office . It may be by being impeached but not convicted or by being re-elected . One would think that with all the overwhelming evidence building up the Republicans would start to realize that the Trump presidency is no longer valid.
Oh no they have to have their conservative judges to overturn the social progress that has been made, they have to keep being in power no matter what , they have to enact thier crazy tax cuts. Putin has to be smiling . After all that we went through during the Cold War the Russians may have actually won. We have been to date a nation of laws. Our elected officals take an oath towards the Constitution not one person. Here comes Trump and his "goon squad". He may be the last president as we have known them to be. Trump's incompetency bankrupted 3 casinos. Now he may bankrupt the nation through his tenure in office stained by his malfeasance, total lack of morals and outright greed. Trump in his desire to win and have bragging rights may make this great nation the loser. The fools that believe that he is making America, "great" may never see what is really happening or even care about the end of our representative democracy as we have known it. It has been said that domestic turkeys are dumb. Compared to Trump's loyal followers in the public realm and the US Congress they are absolute geniuses.
Sondland is a smug plutocrat who bought himself an ambassadorship for which he was not qualified. Had the whistle blower not blown the whistle, Sondland would still be a willing participant in the Ukraine shakedown.
In fact, had other witnesses not completely shredded his previous testimony, Sondland would be blissfully walking the streets of Brussels, pretending to be a man of international influence, and waiting to be served with a warrant for perjury.
Worse, and often lost in the GOP sleaze, is that Trump and enablers played games with Ukraine military aide while innocents were dying fighting the Russians.
What could be more unforgivable?
2
Rotten to the core perfectly describes the Republican Party and every Republican Congressman and Senator questioning witnesses is lying to cover for Trump, a world-class liar.
The Democrats should call for an impeachment vote today since the vote would be the same in 30-60 days.
The Senate may not impeach Trump but whatever damage the Democrats hoped to inflict has been inflicted.
Take the vote for impeachment now!
It’s so sad to know that while we put our children in bed with a kiss in Washington there are people backstabbing all of us.
I was in High School when Watergate went down. Thought to myself: "Glad *that* will never again!" How naive I was.
Instead of Nixon's: "I am not a crook!" we're getting: "I am the best of crooks! A perfect crook! There has never been anyone as crooked as me!" Only the word `crook` is replaced by `President` or `Presidential`. Only now, the admission/boast is in third person and spoken by hacks.
1
@Iko our high schoolers are witnessing history being made. Trump will forever now be remembered as a President who faced impeachment, there is no escaping the fact. Trumps voters always say he is fulfilling all his election promises but they did not realize at what cost and how trump is willing to disregard rules laws regulations thinking that he is completely untouchable and totally above the law. Big mistake. We the little people will make our voices heard..just as we did in the midterm 2018...
1
The Republicans trying to defend the indefensible would just be sad, if it weren’t also highly dangerous to our democracy. Said defenses range from the ridiculous to the nonsensical to just pretending they didn’t hear the witness say what she or he plainly said.
Donald Trump is simply the most corrupt and destructive President in American history. Every day he remains in office is a bad day for our country. Here’s hoping there won’t be many more of them.
Being "rotten to the core" is not impeachable if there is no constitutional basis for impeachment. Sondland plainly admitted having no evidence of impeachable behavior. Even if Trump had overlapping motives (avoiding corruption, stopping interference, and getting at the Bidesn), political motivations are not impeachable, or every presidential action by a first-term president with an eye on reelection would be grounds for impeachment. That is an unworkable standard.
If you think the president is rotten, the answer is to throw the bum out at the polls.
If this charade does not end soon, the Democrats will have dug their own grave. It's amazing to see the self-immolation of a party by its own smug leadership.
2
As usual, the Bard has said it best. " There is something rotten in the State of Denmark." Will the rot and stench ever go away?
“Throughout the proceedings, Devin Nunes, the ranking Republican on the House Intelligence Committee, has glowered, sneered and repeated some of the same conspiracy theories that Trump and his personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, wanted Ukraine’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, to substantiate.”
According to reporting in the Daily Beast, Rep. Devin Nunes’ trip to Europe in 2018 was facilitated by Lev Parnas, an indicted associate of Rudy Giuliani.
No wonder Rep. Nunes is fighting so hard to hide the truth.
4
Putin's friends are doing so well. The GOP's all out efforts to exonerate Russia from the 2016 election interference are setting the stage for 2020. I think Nunes wins for best comrade.
Ronald Reagan is rolling over in his grave.
I could not understand the fact that how Sondland could just pass of his presumptions as being an order from the president. And looks like he intentionally had the "I want no quid pro quo, as him to do the right thing" after his 45 minutes monologue.
2
What struck me is that Mike Pompeo has alotta splainin´to do. What are the legal consequences for him for having carried out this scheme? How does Pence wriggle out from this as well? At this point, Trump has lassoed Mulvaney, Pompeo and Pence into his wrong doing. Will they cut their losses and come clean or will they try to form a circle of denial? Do they have aides that will come forward to shine the light of truth in order to uphold a clean democracy?
2
When Trump promised to drain the swamp he forgot to append “to create an even bigger, - the best - and more beautiful, deep swamp that will also create more jobs (someone’s gotta look like they’re trying to drain it). A Swamp like you’ve never seen before!”
1
Trump's Base "In Sondland's own conversations with Trump, Trump says he doesn't want a quid pro quo, just for Zelensky to do the right thing."
If a thief declares he doesn't want to rob a bank...then proceeds to rob a bank...do we care about what "he wanted" previously???
There is now a "gordian" knot on the Ukraine/Trump/storyline as the saga of the Ukraine continues. Subtext: Russian invasion into Ukraine, Trump and Putin's bromance and US/Russian relations notwithstanding this relationship. Without Sondland, we speak with such forked tongue. Trump is of course canny enough to get Guilani out front, and get rid of those in the Ukraine like former Ambassador Yovanovich, sully her reputation as "bad" and take on Lt. Col. Vindman in similar style. The goons on the committee, Nunes and "Gym" Jordan, Ratliffe from of course Texas, do their alley fights in public. while the nation looks on in a mixture of disbelief. Up is down, down, up, as Alice in Wonderland would say. How presidential the twittering of Trump during hearings, the press outside w/helicopter wings beating and yelling ensues with the "president" yelling his remarks and pointing and shouting. So presidential, Donnie Johnnie.
This is my mantra beginning when the imposter took office: "Rotten from the top to the bottom,"
Trump is not just a corrupt politician, he is also a coward and a traitor to his country.
He has sold his country’s interests to a foreign power for his own personal gain and is willing to do so again. This is not speculation, his own statements and facts prove this beyond any doubt.
The case for impeachment is beyond any doubt. Impeachment is a done deal at this point.
If the GOP wants to save its soul and save the country from an irreparable split it should take these charge seriously and remove Trump from office. Not doing so would represent setting the Constitution in flames and destroying what this country represents.
1
'Who didn't do it'? Gordon Sondland
Unless Barron Trump wrote those talking points for his father he is the only person in the Trump Organization White House who can be presumed innocent unto proven guilty. And in any event he is a juvenile,
2
theres gonna be a handful of people going to jail. wonder what the bet is in Vegas
What the news media keeps missing is that most of the GOP admires Trump for his overt criminality, thuggishness, foul mouth: they misconstrue that for STRENGTH (and wish that they too could get away with his crimes - cheating on taxes, taking and offering bribes, threatening people with impunity, cheating on his spouse, etc, etc). His GOP supporters are small frightened people who need a BIG MEAN DADDY to make them feel safe in their beds at night. It is absolutely true that he could shoot people on 5th avenue and the GOP would acquit him (and admire him the more for it).
2
All they have to do is create soundbites for Fox news to broadcast. The facts here are irrelevant when the people you care about are only engaged at that level.
More like the Gordon Knot...
Modified political quote: "How do you tell if a Republican is lying? Their lips are moving."
Facts are indeed stubborn things.
1
Ambassadors have to be confirmed by the Senate.
By now Sondland, the Ambassador to the EU has landed in Brussels.
One has to wonder if by tomorrow evening he will be replaced by Putin's poodle by a Charge d'Affaires, one that doesn't need to be confirmed.
I doubt that Rudy will apply for the job. The pay is far too low.
1
Gordon Sondland's attempt is the right thing to do. Thug government is countered. In Los Angeles truth by court officisl could thwart corruption cause by the little mentioned "LAPD Crime-buster Vigilante Facebook " scandal. Our California Attorney General, Xavier Becerra now covers-up police use of vigilantes to regulate homeless. Violence and stalking is the results. The courts are used to incarcerate homeless with misleading LAPD reports. LA also needs a rigorous investigation where a ‘Gordon Sondland” character shows up and tells the truth.
Devin Nunes is compromised. Jim Jordan spent earlier years ignoring victims' complaints that they'd been sexually assaulted in the shower room. They are both weak and amoral.
1
Who has everything to gain from muddy up Biden? Answer Mitch McConnell, the Republican Party, and Vladimir Putin. That is why the entire infrastructure, politically and financially, of the Republican Party was behind the shake down of Ukraine. What do we do as a county when one entire party is a criminal enterprise.
2
The only problem there is that Donald Trump is the original zombie president; you might throw him under the bus, but he'll get up again even dirtier, stumbling, moaning, and blustering through the job of the presidency. Republicans, are you listening? You've unleashed a monster on the world, and you need to take care of your own mess.
Anyone with a functioning brain can figure out that if Trump was, in fact, hellbent on eliminating corruption in Ukraine he would want widespread investigations, not just into the Bidens. And, turns out, he didn’t even want real investigations; he wanted the President of Ukraine to simply go on television and announce that he would be looking into Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election and also the Bidens! So this image the Republicans are trying to foist off on the American people of a heroic Trump fighting corruption wherever he goes is laughable nonsense. A lie. What else is new.
I’m in and out of these hearings. The Republicans are so loathsome, snarky and vicious, it’s toxic to witness. When Jordan comes on, I leave the room. THIS man, Jordan, is the one they put their faith in? He’s almost as hideous as his fearless leader. Jordan is lower than a snake’s belly. I still cannot fathom how these people sleep at night and look themselves in the mirror in the morning. Trump’s slime is all over them. The BEST people?
2
Sondland didn't throw Trump under the bus alone. Giuliani has one foot and two toes of the other in prison.
All that remains is for the republicans to set in stone just how corrupt they really are, with their vote.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away." Yes, yes, yes, it is so clear that the Republican party is anti-American, anyone voting for a Republican cannot be paying the least bit of attention.
I've never understood the alternative conspiracy theory. The Clinton Campaign conspired with Ukraine to hack into Democratic Party servers so that they could release emails that damaged Hillary Clinton's chances of winning?
If you polled Kindergarten classes around the country, they would find that absurd.
2
Trump is like an addicted family member .. the Republicans feel like they have to help him, but they know he's bad .. he's stolen, he's lied, he continues to lie, he makes those around him lie, and until he acknowledges his addiction, we are all going to suffer.
I wonder if Rudy is paying attention to the way Trump and his sycophants are treating Sondland? Since Gordon is fighting back, Trump is going to need to find -someone- to hang this whole thing on... and Rudy, "attorney-client privilege" doesn't protect you from criminal consipiracy. And Trump can't pardon you from prison... think about it. Maybe now is the time to cut loose and come clean, just for history's sake.
the president can pardon all federal crimes. He cannot touch State convictions
1
Why is everything Trump does seems to be in the best interest of Russia? He publicly sides with Putin over 17 US Intelligence sources and “Putin said the Russian’s did not interfere in our election and I believe him...it could have been was someone working from their mother’s basement”. He lifts sanctions on the Russians 5 minutes after they were implemented and we prove Russia did hack our computer servers. He attacks our EU and NATO allies behind the guise of “they need to pay their fair share”—ironically from a businessman who never pays his debts or taxes— and starts a Trade War with the EU and China but no punishment for the Russians and they benefit by default. He betrays the Kurds in Syria and secures Russian dominance in the Middle East by withdrawing our embarrassed troops. He bribes the Ukrainian government by withholding promise military aide in their war with guess who? Russia. He wants the Ukraine to say they started an investigation to prove Russia never hacked our computers and exonerate them. Am I missing something or is their a traitor with orange hair running our country—married to a woman recruited from a former Soviet/Russian republic who pretends she does not speak Russian?
1
One of the problem when you have a liar as president is that you can’t believe anything they say. Early in his administration, there was a transcript of a conversation he had with the president of Mexico where he said pleaded with him to say he was going to pay for the wall even if he wasn’t going to. In the Ukraine case, he wanted Zelensky to say he was going to investigate the Biden’s even if he wasn’t going to. How do we know he isn’t plotting with Kim Jung Un to say he will denuclearize even if he isn’t going to or have the Chinese to agree to certain terms of a trade deal even if they don’t. Not that I ever believed a word he said but it is pretty dangerous to have a president more concerned about looking good than being good.
1
Why are the Democrats so poor at planting messages? The Republicans seem to have all studied it in graduate school...
Start asking questions like this:
“So, if Rudy Guliani would come and testify, he could clear this whole thing up about whether the President ordered this, right?”
Then substitute for “Guliani”, at the appropriate time, every other name of persons who are refusing to appear -Mulveney, etc.
When Jim Jordan thunders about no evidence that the President stopped Ukrainian aid, the next Democrat should ask the witness, “Couldn’t we get the evidence Mr. Jordan seeks from so and so from the OMB? Did you know that the White House ordered them not to come to testify?”
This is what ordinary Americans will understand.
When the Republicans counter that they don’t blame folks for refusing to participate in this “witch hunt”, then ask a witness what he or she thinks would happen to our justice system if subpoenaed witnesses at trials could decide on their own whether or not they would come to court to testify? How
many mafia chieftains would have ever been convicted of anything if they could get away with telling their seconds in command or others not to obey subpoenas, while claiming the trial was a witch hunt?
The Democrats must realize that exposing the truth these days is not enough. You have to grind the truth into the brains of Americans. The Republicans are grinding lies into their heads right now.
1
The response of the Always Trumpers -- including the Wall Street Journal, in an editorial "Unimpeachable Offenses" https://www.wsj.com/articles/sondlands-unimpeachable-offenses-11574294949 --- remind me of the old Woodie Allen joke:
-- My brother-in-law thinks he's a chicken.
-- Why don't you get him help?
-- We would, but we need the eggs.
I think the Always Trumper's eggs are just as illusory, but how to tell them?
"Enjoy the eggs, but realize that Fox Putin is in your hen-house?"
Trump's quid pro quo is exactly the kind of foreign entanglement the Founding Fathers were worried about. Maybe time to re-read the Federalist Papers #65, 66 and 68?
1
" This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Amen.
Hear that sound? It’s crumbling Bone Spurs.
Sad.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away." Well said. Sums it up perfectly.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve."
Michelle, I've been saying almost these very words from the day the Trump administration and its cabinet took root at the White House. There's never been a more perverse group of word-scrambling obfuscaters, regulation destroyers and outright liars in charge of running the country than this bunch. Thank you, dear lady, for putting my words (and yours) into print.
3
I don't understand how Sondland could be so relaxed. He smiled his way through a confession of guilt - a party to the dirty tricks of our President. He was refreshingly honest, but an example of the type of person who felt it natural to buy his way into an ambassadorship.
" . . . Sondland said, “Everyone was in the loop. It was no secret.” This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
That's it. "Rotten to the core."
Vice President Pence is a particularly odious example of a self serving hypocrite, he carefully did not say a word to Ambassador Sondland’s statement that he (Sondland) believed it was obvious that an investigation desired by Pres. Trump had to be started before aid appropriated by Congress would be released, he simply nodded yes. All the better in order to deny later. Predictably, that is what happened. Mike Pence is a practiced world class phony, as has long been obvious, but far worse, he will doing anything to retain power as he waits in the wings hoping for Trump to fall.
4
For anyone to believe that the majority of Republicans in this administration actually believe in duty, honor, and doing what is right is the kind of naivete that sort of went out with the 1950's in this country.
We are nothing like that now. And a lot of this started with teflon
Reagan--people mouthed a lot about patriotism but went about dismantling as much as they could and dishonoring everything they could. Pure Machiavelli. Live with it folks, you allowed it then and ignored it. It is not going to stop ..
2
We the people still govern this country. If we become apathetic and do not vote and do not protest then we the people will lose.
@Anita van Asperdt I'm 61 and have watched what this country has become. Roughly the breakdwown is just over 50% voting. When Reagan won his "landslide" in the 84 re-election only about 27% of the country actually voted for him. The US is a disgrace among democracies now.
Sondland, who like Schiff says one thing one day and another the next day, will not be a credible witness in the Senate trial. Kenneth Starr, former independent counsel, said after the Sondland testimony, the impeachment hearings come "nowhere close" to laying out impeachable offenses. Starr said that the witness testimony so far does not "reach the level of treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors." Wish what you want but the only path to removing Trump from office is to beat him in the general election, not in the Senate.
@B. T.
Gee, I didn't hear that. What I heard Starr say was that it was time to "walk to the White House."
Imagine if the Republican congressional majority was still in place. It’s pretty obvious that given the GOP willingness to follow Trump lemming-like he would be off the hook. Trumps lack of a moral compass, his lack of ethics would be overlooked. The Democratic House is all that’s standing between Trump and his feckless acolytes. Scary.
119
@GK
They're not feckless acolytes. they've directly benefitted from the tax cuts for individuals and business, and they benefit when lobbyists get to draft federal regulations under the guise of "advisors" to Trump's appointees. Follow the money.
2
Michelle Goldberg writes as if any of this evidence matters. It's kind of naive and cute. Like we're still in 2015. The Republicans will never vote to convict and we'll be stuck with Trump for 4 and possibly even longer years.
Mr. Sondland showed up with a smile on his face determined to personally extricate himself from the great mess he stepped in when he first began dealing with Trump.
He more or less accomplished that, which I give him credit for.
But the mess is still there, and notwithstanding Mr. Schiff's admirable efforts, Trump remains secure.
2
If we are still living in a democratic republic, Sondland's testimony should be a crippling blow to the GOP's thin as airport bathroom tissue defenses of Donald J. Trump. I say "if" because I have serious doubts that one of our political parties wants to participate in a democracy anymore, based on their Soviet style disinformation campaign. Nunes and Jordan seem to believe not just in different facts, but a different version of reality than the rest of us. If we still believe that facts matter, or that truth has any place in our political landscape at all, then Sondland obliterated the arguments of Trump and his corrupt minions as surely as a flame thrower torches a pile of kindling. No, the Senate won't convict, but after watching that, the American people will be treated to a cavalcade of GOP Senators actively voting against the constitution to preserve their jobs. Pass the popcorn
1
"Further, Sondland testified that Trump didn’t necessarily care about investigations per se, only the public announcement of investigations. Zelensky “had to announce the investigations, he didn’t actually have to do them,” he said."
This type of chicanery dovetails perfectly with Trump's modus operandi concerning his supposed "investigators" in Hawaii who were ostensibly looking into the authenticity of President Obama's birth certificate.
If you'll recall, Trump would repeatedly and hilariously announce something to the effect that "they cannot believe what they are finding" in describing supposed "bombshells" about Obama's true birth place.
Does anybody believe those investigators actually existed, and if they did, that they accomplished anything more tangible than drinking a few mai tai's while they were there?
Funny how we never found out about the "results", isn't it?
4
The fact that holding up aid appropriated by Congress is illegal, regardless of reason, seems to be lost in all of this.
3
The evidence against Trump is overwhelming. If Republicans continue to stand by the President in the face of all this testimony, they risk political suicide and for what? Many of Trump's defenders are are otherwise intelligent, insightful people. But by defending Trump, they are proving that they value loyalty to a leader as more important doing the right thing. They are willfully ignoring obvious facts and proving themselves incapable of unbiased decision making. In short they are proving themselves unfit for office because they cannot objectively evaluate the evidence before them and come to a fair and just conclusion.
1
Regardless of what Sondland said or did not say I submit that this is not rocket science. Like Adam Schiff said so succinctly - Within 48 hours after the whistleblower complaint was made public the aid was released to Ukraine. Trump got CAUGHT. I did not hear Nunes, Jordan or any Republican on the committee dispute this fact.
1
Through all the noise remember this:
All the witnesses who have testified under oath have acknowledged this scandal.
All the people who are defending Trump, refuse to testify under oath.
4
Sondland's propensity to lie continues to be a problem. Claiming he does not recall his "victory" phone call to Trump from the Kiev restaurant is unfortunate. That call is first hand evidence of Trump's obvious involvement.
Instead, we have to listen to Republicans chatter about Trump's later, no quid pro quo call with Sondland-- the one he made on the day the whistle blower's complaint was released to Congress.
Trump's self-serving lies are obvious even to a child, and yet his crowd of followers cling to every word he utters as if it is the absolute truth.
If we are still living in a democratic republic, Sondland's testimony should be a crippling blow to the GOP's thin as airport bathroom tissue defenses of Donald J. Trump. I say "if" because I have serious doubts that one of our political parties wants to participate in a democracy anymore, based on their Soviet style disinformation campaign. Nunes and Jordan seem to believe not just in different facts, but a different version of reality than the rest of us. If we still believe that facts matter, or that truth has any place in our political landscape at all, then Sondland obliterated the arguments of Trump and his corrupt minions as surely as a flame thrower torches a pile of kindling. No, the Senate won't convict, but after watching the Sondland testimony, the American people will be treated to a cavalcade of GOP Senators actively doing the wrong thing and voting against the constitution to preserve their jobs. Will preserving their jobs and defending Trump be compatible after yesterday's spectacle? Only time will tell. Pass the popcorn.
The Republican defense that this was a legitimate use of power relies on breaking down the individual actions and taking them out of context. Let’s translate this to the classic fifth avenue example:
So what if President Trump fired his gun? Is firing a gun illegal? No. So what if the alleged victim was struck by a bullet? Is getting shot illegal? No. So where’s the problem? I just don’t see it.
It’s a very dishonest argument. This is why they also have to muddy the facts, if you forget the context or somehow lose sight of it their arguments start to seem more reasonable.
1
The NYT’s editorials and commentators keep painting Sondland’s testimony as being the nail in Trump’s coffin. But listening to what he said about quid quo pro, comes out just the opposite. “What do you want?' And it was a very short, abrupt conversation. He was not in a good mood and he just said 'I want nothing. I want nothing. I want no quid pro quo. Tell Zelensky to do the right thing, something to that effect." That reads pretty clear. In any case Trump had tight to ask about the event around the firing of the prosecutor who was bringing criminal charges against the company that Hunter was board member. Biden had already told his version in a televised interview in 2018. The prosecutor was to be fired within six hours or the Ukraine didn’t get the promised aid. The prosecutor was fired, a new one was hired, and all charges dropped. Trump wanted the Ukraine’s version. We know the purpose of all of this. Keep Trump off the ballot in 2020. Trump doesn’t need the Ukraine to beat Biden. He doesn’t look like can even defeat the other party candidate. None of this matter to the Democrats. So, take the vote and send it to the Senate where it will end. AS David Brooks, no Trump fan, says this about Impeachment, “Congress is supposed to do what is in the best interest of the country. And this process could be very bad for America.”. And, it is bad.
1
the conversation you are referring to happened two days after The whistleblower report became public knowledge. I wonder if the aid would have ever been released had the country not learned that there was a whistleblower.
1
@Ron
Everything you said about the Bidens is incorrect and I have 3 guesses as to where you got your disinformation.
I saw the tape of Biden talking about the Ukranian prosecutor - did you?
Biden had the prosecutor fired as a in accordance with US policy, in concert with the EU and other entities.
And Congress *is* supposed to do what's right for the country - not take it upon themselves to be Donald Trump's personal defense team.
After listening to the people testifying it is apparent to me that The President of the United States tried to "shake down" a foreign government to create "political Dirt" on a domestic challenger.
That in an of itself is such an act that he should be removed from office, even if I agreed with everything he stood for politically.
The fact that majority of the Republican Party is willing to allow that behavior is direct evidence that the Republican Part has violated is oath of office to, "...defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic..."
The Republican Party's congressional Representatives have in fact become traitors to the constitution. They care more for power than that ideals enshrined in that sacred document.
Since that is the case, I can only foresee three possible outcomes in the decades that come.
1. We tug of war between the hard left and the hard right, while the center keep its head in the sand, and nothing is done on the critical issues of the day and the slow cancer that is destroying us continues.
2. We get an Authoritarian Government, of either the hard right or the hard left and the Constitution becomes just another piece of paper.
3. We have all out Civil War until one world view of the USA utterly crushes the other. No doubt without the grace that 1st Civil War left on the losing sides This time the losing side will be likely be "cleansed"
History will show that Trump was the begging the end.
Again and again, the US Supreme Soviet is serving its master - Putin - let's stop calling it the GOP - it isn't. These traitors pledge allegiance to a different flag - it isn't the stars and stripes. It may take more extreme action to regain control of the country from these imposters - occupiers. How many US-citizens are willing to actually fight to restore the republic and move forward? I wonder every day if we are up to the task or if we will simply allow ourselves to be mowed over by these occupiers. The fact that I must wonder is what frightens me most.
Sondland's testimony was disturbing as the day wore on.
Sondland clearly linked a bribery and extortion attempt with Ukraine's President to Pompeo, Pence, Perry, et al and most specifically Giuliani all under the direction of the President.
Sondland also implicated himself whether he knew it or not.
If people cannot see that then they are suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome and watching way too much Fox News.
Trump's ludicrous rant with his note pad on the White House Lawn yesterday thinking that he was now absolved of any wrongdoing is indicative of how deranged he is.
We all know that the GOP members of the Intel Committee are not interested in the truth and their only mission is to obfuscate the hearings and maintain power.
Article 2 Section 4 of the Constitution is at least one of the articles of Impeachment that should be recommended and sent to the Judiciary Committee.
@Futbolistaviva
Yes, I saw that rant too and I couldn't believe it. He just kept shouting the same thing over and over.
This is really doing him in.
Now that the case against Trump is proven beyond all reasonable doubt can the editors change phrases such as "Jordan mounted a strong defense of the president" to "Jordan weakly attempted to defend the president", as by definition you cannot defend the indefensible, and lies and obfuscation are not a 'strong defense'.
All roads lead back to Russia. Trump was probably getting orders from Putin to shift blame to Ukraine instead of Russia for election interference. That is why Trump was pushing the conspiracy theory of Ukraine hacking DNC servers. Then as a bonus, Trump could use Ukraine to bring down Biden.
1
The good thing about the impeachment hearings is that the GOP House members have been memorialized on television before the American people as joined-at-the-hip with the Trump Administration as the most corrupt and inept in American history. The bad thing about the hearings is that it's sickening to know that the GOP, as one of the country's main political parties, is not even willing to follow the facts. The GOP has joined with Trump in trying to gaslight the American people and that verges on the criminal.
Is using What's App as wrong or worse than having a private server? Who doesn't know & understand the Russians, and others who are interested, are listening?
1
The left is in fantasy land. Trump's base simply does not have the same interpretation of events and if anything these hearings are increasing his support among working class people in the states Trump won in 2016. Other than Tulsi Gabbard who was the only sensible one on the stage , that is the most pathetic group of Presidential candidates I have seen in my 65 years. Not one of them has a chance of beating Trump in the electoral college
2
a summary of the phone call released by the White House has a request from Trump to a foreign country to investigate a potential political rival. That is illegal. It is sad that political tribalism trumps the constitutional requirement to protect and defend from all enemies foreign and domestic
1
"Representative Jim Jordan, the Republican recently added to the Intelligence Committee because he’s seen as an effective advocate for Trump, has argued that Trump was genuinely concerned about corruption in Ukraine..."
Well, they say Washington is Hollywood for ugly people, and Jim Jordan certainly comes off as a frustrated actor.
2
Sondland's testimony about "Burisma" not "Biden" is very interesting. He was very aggressive in making this point (as was Volcker in the previous day). He clearly wanted to make the case that he didn't know the "investigations" were not about a political opponent. Furthermore, his facial expressions were quite different when making these statements than during his other statements. If you can find a U-Tube clip of it, it is an interesting example of a "tell".
It’s so disconcerting to hear the narratives of the Republicans. But what is so bothersome is that 90% of the Republicans believe them…no matter what! The reason: racism.
The impeachment inquiry hearings have demonstrated ad nauseam that Trump is a Mafia Boss; his only interest is himself – not his country. Plain and simple.
Whoever wins the Democratic presidential candidacy should get the vote of every Democrat. Please do not make a replay of the Hillary-Sanders episode.
If not, the world, not just USA, is in peril.
If Trump had a conscience, or even a functioning brain, as Nixon did, he'd resign.
But Trump is a selfish, greedy transactionalist.
I suggest that Bernie or some other leading Dem go into negotiations with him to remove him, just like was done with Ferdinand Marcos and many other despots.
Offer him a guarantee of a fine and no jail time, maybe a new television series, in return for the resignation of him and his entire gang, including Preacher Pence.
If not, prosecute all of them and throw them in jail, like they did to an African-American woman in Texas who voted when they claimed she wasn't eligible to vote.
Be sure to put them in the same jail where Epstein was.
3
This bears repeating:
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
Every GOP member who still tries to defend the president (and his men) is disloyal to his oath of office, is disloyal to his electorate, is disloyal to his family, is disloyal to the United States of America.
Please at least consider that this will most certainly go down in the history books, and that this disloyalty will preserve your names in infamy.
This will happen. You will all be covered with the same slime that covers this current White House, and it will not wash off.
Do the right thing, before it's too late.
3
Well, that was a million dollars worth spent.
Maybe the writer missed this part of the testimony:
Sondland, Nov. 20:
I believe I just asked him an open-ended question, Mr. Chairman, “what do you want from Ukraine? I keep hearing all these ideas and theories and this and that. What do you want?” And it was a very short, abrupt conversation. He was not in a good mood. And he just said, “I want nothing. I want nothing. I want no quid pro quo. Tell Zelensky to do the right thing.” Something to that effect.
@Objectivist And maybe you missed all of the other evidence that puts that exactly in the place where it belongs: Trump's denial that there was quid pro quo once it was pointed out to him that there was a quid pro quo for personal benefit. Trump always denies the truth when it flies in the face of his actions, and he always will.
3
last phone call occur 2 days after the public learned that there was a whistleblower. this is an example of covering your fanny
3
@Objectivist The writer didn't miss that like many criminals do, after Donald Trump realized his crimes were being examined, he started saying false things that would lead the gullible to believe that he hadn't already used extortion and bribery.
However, the factual record shows that your grifter hero attempted to use Congressionally-allocated funding as a bribe to get a foreign government to fabricate dirt on a political rival.
2
You build a wall one brick at a time. Yesterday, we made several bricks. This is Trump's wall and he's going to pay for it.
152
@Denis
Brilliant observation. Thank you.
2
@Denis
You can dismantle the tallest tower, one brick at a time. that is what you are doing to your party, and have been since Trump was elected.
2
@GregP So you just assume that Denis is a Democrat because of his witty observation? When Denis says "we" he may simply be referring to all Americans who oppose Trump's corruption. You have no idea which political party, if any, Denis belongs to.
2
Sondland stated he never heard FROM THE PRESIDENT that aid was held up until investigations were announced. That is all the Republicans need to dismiss his testimony. It is all nothing and the man in Office, far from being thrown under the bus, is driving it, in full command.
The testimony of those appearing before the House Intelligence Committee is compelling and ultimately damaging to Donald Trump’s presidency. It’s a forgone conclusion that the House of Representatives will impeach Donald Trump but the Senate will fail to convict him. Do Trump’s actions rise to the level of high crimes and misdemeanors? Our Founding Fathers established a very high bar to remove a sitting president from office. If the Democrats held a majority in the Senate similar to the majority now held by the Republicans, it would still very likely fail to convict due to the 67 super majority requirement. It’s a forgone conclusion that the decision to remove Trump from office will be left up to the American electorate in November of next year. I believe it’s a fair outcome.
@Jake: The founders gave Congress the powers that have characterized boards of directors of corporations ever since.
2
Our Founding Fathers woulda thrown a clown like Hizzoner far out into the Potomac early last year. In fact, his kinds of arbitrary and capricious behavior is the essence of what got the bill of indictment that’s half the Declaration drawn up.
1
What seems to get lost in the testimony given at the impeachment hearings is the humanity of the Ukrainians who have suffered from Trump's withholding of military aid in their fight to hold their country from Russian incursions. While Trump’s minions swan around Kiev, with their sophistic conversation with “locals”, young men and women, military and civilian, are dying on Ukraine’s border trying to hold back the Russians.
Retired Adm. James Stavridis, who commanded U.S. forces in Europe from 2009 to 2013, said regarding the withholding of military aid: "Doing so is a gift to Vladimir Putin". This is what the American President is doing to our ally in need.
8
Many people seem to believe Mr. Sondland received his appointment to be an ambassador because of his $1 million donation to the Trump election campaign. I would not be surprised if the cost were actually much higher, and involved payments that were made for the personal benefit of Mr. Trump. Mr. Sondland may have evidence for this, and that might explain his willingness to testify without fear of retribution. This possibility should be investigated. After all, a recent Illinois governor was convicted and imprisoned for attempting to sell a U.S. Senate seat. Selling high federal government positions should be at least as much of a crime.
5
One defence that almost everyone seems to be forgetting, but don't be surprised if Trump ultimately plays the card, is that of the Unitary Executive Authority. It is a construct of the US Constitution that basically says, "whatever the President does is not illegal." A shocking concept to many, and when Richard Nixon first spoke those words people were incredulous, however Nixon didn't ultimately take that defence.
Former White House Counsel, under Nixon, John Dean, has explained in the past: "In its most extreme form, unitary executive theory can mean that neither Congress nor the federal courts can tell the President what to do or how to do it, particularly regarding national security matters." And there's the peg for President Trump to hang his hat on. Whether he will remains to be seen, but it is the proverbial "Get-out-of-jail-free" card.
Dick Cheney, during the G.W. Bush Administration, made sure that this interpretation was registered at the US Justice Department in order to protect Bush (and ultimately Cheney) against any accusations of warrantless surveillance or torture during their time in office.
2
@Robit17
The Federalist Papers specifically debunk that defense. Hamilton in particular makes clear that Impeachment is in the Constitution as a safeguard against abuses of power by the President. No honest reading of the documents and history could uphold the Unitary Executive Theory.
4
There is nothing comical about Ukraine, a former captive nation of the Soviet Union now fighting a deadly war against Vladimir Putin’s reconstituted Soviet empire, being withheld weaponry because the leader of Ukraine’s protector, America, is the self-centered Donald Trump.
There is nothing funny about the fact that Trump admires Putin and is more interested in having Ukrainians invent a scandal against Trump’s political rival that win its war for survival against Russia.
There is no humor in the willingness, even eagerness, of an American president to destroy the reputations of patriotic members of our diplomatic corps and of our military, simply because they dare speak the truth to the American people and criticize the venality of Trump.
There should be no amusement at the deceit of Republican politicians in Washington, who join Trump in his insults and threats against American heroes and who rally to excuse the maneuvering of Trump’s personal attorney, Rudy Giuliani, to make millions of dollars by Ukraine’s precarious position.
And, yet, this gang-that-can’t-shoot-straight, has human faces. It is appropriate that we join the laughter at someone like Gordon Sondland, who Donald Trump tried to use to further the Trump-Giuliani plot, but who spilled his guts with a smile.
11
I had a heartfelt moment with my 8 year old daughter this morning when she came to me and said "daddy can I get a Trump 2020 t shirt for Christmas". My heart melted like butter.
2
So republicans are relying on the ‘fact’ that trump didn’t say that there was a quid pro quo. I’d be interested if anyone could highlight any previous examples of the president using Latin.
15
"So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
I wanted to know about this. Is there any possible repercussion for Gym Jordan or Nunes for so abjectly denying the facts?
9
When only one side is willing to testify under oath, and the other side conducts its own hearing unfettered by that constraint, there's little chance that justice will prevail, no matter how compelling the evidence is.
Donald Trump's Gordon problem is not a problem in the same way Trump's lies are not a problem in such a world. Facts no longer matter. America has a problem, not Trump.
9
Sondland testified that Trump didn’t necessarily care about investigations per se, only the public announcement of investigations. Zelensky “had to announce the investigations, he didn’t actually have to do them...”
So that blows apart the claim that Trump was really concerned about corruption, else doing them, rather than announcing them, would be the thing he wanted.
6
Another great article by Ms. Goldberg. If a Senate trial becomes necessary, it makes one wonder how the GOP is going to present a fair and credible trial.
4
Ms. Goldberg does not even reference the cross-examination of Sondland, which was devastating for the Dem's impeachment efforts.
When all is said and done (and Trump is not impeached), Ms. Goldberg and the Dems will come to see that they were taken in by the foreign policy professionals who were mostly concerned with creating a counter-narrative to offset the Inspector General's report and the coming DOJ indictments. Of course, the Dems will remain generally silent about the impeachment ruse, just as they generally remain silent about Mueller.
2
@Ulysses: Well over 1000 legal experts considered the ten instances of obstruction of justice that Mueller found impeachable offenses. The only reason Mueller did not indict Trump was because according to a DoJ memo, a sitting president cannot be indicted. Mueller passed judgment to Congress instead. Read the Mueller report.
26
@Ulysses
What???
You must've been celebrating an early Happy Hour during Sondland's testimony or had the sound turned off.
As a service to the boozy or GOP ethically and morally handicapped, here's a refresher of the high point(s).
Re: Trump ordered the deleterious and illegal Ukraine pressure campaign.
Question: "Was there a 'quid pro quo?’".
Sondland: "The answer is yes. It was no secret"
2
Evidence, Ulysses? Or just assertions?
I didn’t hear anything revealed by the Republican questioning, such as it was. You didn’t cite anything specific. Your comment actually reads like it could have been generated by a Russian disinformation bot, designed only to sow confusion and doubt.
1
For those wondering why Trump still has Republican congressional support, I will enlighten. Republicans know they have 20% of the adult population locked-in as one issue voters: Pro-lifers and gun advocates. Trump has taught them they have 20% more: anti-liberal, therefore, anti-Democrat.
To these Americans: a Republican, Trump-like, politician can literally commit murder on 5th avenue and still win votes.
That is a base they will not abandon under any circumstances.
29
@Sydney Carton the irony of being pro life and pro gun... anti women's’ reproductive choice is more accurate. Their pro
life - ness stops when that life leaves the womb. Then it’s sink or swim time.
@Sydney Carton: I'm pretty sure that we all know tRump has a base that will remain loyal, a small base. They will at some point in time become extinct, though. Old age, bad diets, addiction to alcohol and opioids and gun violence in their communities will hasten their demise. The old, obscenely wealthy ones who think he is their savior will find some other selfish, stupid dictator to prop up.
@Cindi T Unfortunately that base is well cultivated by the right-wing media, enhanced by Russian propaganda, exploited by Trump and fairly large.
Trump has been doing far more harm than good for our country for the entire time he's been in office. These hearings only confirm how damaging his presidency has been and will continue to be. Still, Senate Republicans, willing to do anything to stay in power, will continue to toady and will not vote to impeach. Only in America.
40
@Indigo
Only in America, Russia and other corrupt oligarchies.
Sondland testified there was a quid pro quo attached to the White House meeting, but he also testified there was no quid pro quo attached to military aid. So his testimony shoots down the Democrats' claim that Trump held up military aid for political advantage.
Volker and Morrison testified there was no quid pro quo, bribery or extortion attached to either military aid or the meeting. President Zelensky, members of his staff, and the Ukrainian foreign minister have repeatedly said there was no quid pro quo, bribery or extortion.
Sondland testified the president told him there was no quid pro quo, but Sondlan said Giuliani told him there would be no meeting unless President Zelensky announced he was investigating the Bidens. Giuliani posted a tweet flatly denying telling Sondland there was a quid pro quo.
Only Sondland testified there was a quid pro quo. All the others say there was no quid pro quo, bribery or extortion. Volker said the Ukrainians really agreed to Trump requests, even staying up all night to draft a plan to combat corruption. There was not need for quid pro quo or bribery.
4
@William Case
Tell your tale to our dead allies.
The part I love most abou this cockamamie “argument,” is that it rests entirely on the astonishing notion that when it comes to behaving as a crude, greedy bully, why, Trump just ain’t that kind of guy.
Check again: Sondland absolutely linked the military aid to the “investigations”. https://youtu.be/IMgIclly_3w.
Changing his sworn disclosures over time, Sondland finally realized that being a member of the Trump administration has become a dog eat dog existence. Yesterday, he was doing his level best not to become dog food.
For all of the encouragement that Ambassador Sondland offered to Trump impeachment supporters, he is no paragon of virtue, notwithstanding the long recitation of earlier achievements offered up in his opening testimony.
That does not make him wrong for ultimately coming clean, but his primary intent was to save his own skin. Sondland's credibility over time is suspect, and his complicity in the entire sordid affair should not be willingly overlooked. There were many earlier occasions when he could and should have spoken up publicly, and he chose not to do so.
The Ambassador is no saint and he is not lacking in ego. He is clearly impressed with himself, which doesn't make him unique among successful business leaders or politicians. But while he offered valuable information and insight into the web of deceit and wrongdoing woven by members and associates of the Trump administration, I cannot help but believe that had he not been caught due to the forthrightness of others, he would have remained silent and relished his position in the pantheon of Trump lieutenants.
Sondland isn't only his wife's Gordon problem. He is his own.
9
One wonders how much longer Sondland will be Ambassador to the EU. Trump will soon be busy removing dismissing him and anyone else who testified about his crooked dealings with Ukraine in his attempt to manipulate yet another election. There will be many thrown under the bus including Giuliani.
No question. No one is offering Sondland a medal. He finally came to understand what was obvious from the start: he himself had done nothing illegal, and served himself best by telling the truth.
Upside to sticking with Trump? Another ambassadorship? A pardon?
Downside, for lying to congress to conceal the truth? Prison.
Not much of a choice, really. Odd how long it took him to figure that out.
@Quoth The Raven: Many a criminal would have run free if not for partners in crime who became informants to save their skin...
Your description of Ken Starr is woefully inadequate. It should include reference to his role at Baylor. From wikipedia:
"Later the president and chancellor of Baylor University in Waco, Texas, from June 2010 until May 2016, and was the Louise L. Morrison chair of constitutional law at Baylor's Law School. On May 26, 2016, following an investigation into the mishandling by Starr of several sexual assaults at the school, Baylor University's board of regents announced that Starr's tenure as university president would end on May 31. The board said he would continue as chancellor, but on June 1, Starr told ESPN that he would resign his position effective immediately. On August 19, 2016, Starr announced he would resign from his tenured professor position at Baylor Law School, completely severing his ties with the university in a "mutually agreed separation"."
This is who Fox "news" and the Republican party turn to for legal analysis and character judgement.
24
Character will always win out. Ken Starr showed the world who he really was when he led the pointless impeachment investigation into Bill Clinton over his embarrassment at having a sexual affair revealed. Mr. Starr’s glee in pursuing every sexual nuance and violating a space that should be private even for presidents was sickening. The man has no ethics and no limits and that is why he was picked to prosecute Clinton. Starr made an embarrassment of himself and this country and even people who did not like Clintons policies rallied to his side. Clinton left office with a higher popularity rating than when he was elected. Starr went back to Texas covered in slime. I am amazed that any university would consider this dishonest man for any position. Baylor deserves the disgrace he caused them for having the bad judgement to hire him to begin with.
Sondland's testimony was devastating to the President. The case against him is overwhelming.
Trump needs to appear before the hearing and testify. He is the only one who can defend himself.
17
Democrats have now fired every weapon in their arsenal and still haven't been able to take Trump down. Politicians think they're very smart, but that's because they only play against themselves. Along comes Trump, whom they cannot beat.
Pundits and the media are angry because even when all their firepower is added to the mix, Trump is still standing.
7
@AACNY -- The Daily Caller, a conservative website, conducted a poll of all 53 Republican senators. They found that only seven of them dismissed impeachment outright. So, enough Republicans may yet be disgusted enough to vote to impeach. It's not over yet. Trump stands today. Let's see what tomorrow brings.
37
Politicians will decide Trump’s fate. Only the senate stands between him and private citizenship. They keep him there only as long as convenient.
You may have not noticed how quickly Trump jumps whenever McConnell objects t something he did. The Mexican tariffs, for example. He’s a pillar of weakness.
6
@AACNY
Trump good and all powerful, Democrats bad and weak. Yeah, we got the message. His twitter feed with all those childish insults prove how great and smart he is. His brilliant chopper talk moment when he asks China to join Ukraine in investigating the Bidens is proof he is a stable genius.
1
Trump's best hope is that Barr blocks any immediate indictment, Trump wins a second term and the statute of limitations runs out. Second best is he resigns and Pence pardons him.
2
@mzmecz: It's Congress that impeaches and convicts, not the Department of Justice.
@mzmecz - Pence will go down with Trump.
It is impossilble to believe that Trump is genuinely concerned about corruption in the Ukraine. He certainly never seems to be the least bit bothered by the pervasive corruption in Russia.
35
So, according to the Republicans none of this is objectionable to them? It used to be the Republicans looked the other way because there were people in place preventing the whole thing from getting wildly out of control. Now the career officials are the problem and need to be removed so there are no guardrails. The 'phone call' happened the day after the Mueller report 'exonerated' Trump. So if he is excused for this behavior, does anyone think he will have learned a lesson? He had many bites at the apple , business wise, and one bankruptcy wasn't enough for him. No Sir. He kept at it until he got the biggest bang for his bankruptcy buck. This will be no different. It's not two wrongs don't make a right. Rather it's keep at the wrongs until it becomes right. What a joy it must be for Trump to have lots of people who used to consider him to be a terrible person who now can't defend him enough. It's kind of like a guy who walks into every bank in your town trying to hold them up. Over and over. The bankers all say what a terrible person the robber is. But then, suddenly, every one of the bankers stands in the lobby and welcomes the robber in and says "Come back to my office, we can have coffee". As the robber's associates clean out the vault. And the bankers say to the other customers: "He didn't do anything wrong. He was with me the whole time." And lots of those customers shrug their shoulders and say "Makes sense to me."
7
This "connect the dots" moment in our nation's history will long be remembered. The noticeable lack of questioning of Sondland and inane five minute ramblings from Nunes and Jordan show the desperation to hang on to any branch, at this point a weak twig, that will get them out of the tree.
I am waiting for the obvious dots in this tragedy to be succinctly explained by Schiff or other astute committee member. All roads lead to Putin, which is to say that all roads lead to money. I am confident that Russian oligarchs have been laundering money through Trump's properties for some time, and he doesn't want us to know the specifics of these deals. He has been masterfully used by Putin and the threats from him are real and utterly consequential to Trump and his entire family. He really is a Manchurian candidate sponsored by Putin and the Russian oligarchs, as well as the Russian mafia.
30
@Lisa Rogers
What surely drives Humpty Trumpty even nuttier, as well as his 63 million bootlicker GOP voters is that it was (president) Hillary Clinton and Nancy Pelosi who stated "all roads lead to Putin."
1
@Lisa Rogers
"Russian oligarchs have been laundering money through Trump's properties for some time, and he doesn't want us to know the specifics of these deals. He has been masterfully used by Putin and the threats from him are real and utterly consequential to Trump and his entire family."
Absolutely. In addition to money laundering, I am confident the Russians have loaned him money - money he cannot possibly repay if they were to call the loans. You can't declare bankruptcy and say "tough cookies" to *those* folks.
1
“This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away.”
And yet, as we speak, and as we watch the hearings, it’s a sure bet that the administration is not only getting rid of any evidence related to any personal deals Trump may have made with Erdogan to allow Turkey to ethnically cleanse the Kurds, but it’s almost certain that they are also continuing to conduct multiple other corrupt schemes, both internationally and domestically, in real time. It’s in Trump’s DNA. He cannot help himself. When history finally takes an accounting of this administration, the level and amount of corruption will be beyond our comprehension. Watch for Republicans to try to rewrite it.
18
Trump wanted Ukraine to investigate their interference in the 2016 US election, and THEN asks them to investigate his political rival in the 2020 election. Astonishing.
9
To save himself, he's shining the light on the word corruption as a smokescreen. He lives in a bubble of self-love and believes he's operating free of any scrutiny. He took for granted he could shake down Ukraine because they have a reputation for being corrupt. Thank God we have genuine intelligent career officers who know and want to do what's right. Trump is a living textbook definition for corruption. He knows how it works and he plays the game for his own benefit.
14
And let’s not forget the frequent mentions of official government messages via What’s App in both the US (bad enough) and the Ukraine (where Russians are monitoring most communications). After ‘Lock Her Up”, this is particularly brazen and egregious.
13
Of course, an op-ed on these very pages gives a beautiful GOP story about how Trump was only doing "what he was elected to do." In that telling, withholding aid is common in order to get other countries to shape up. Trump is painted as the cure for/antidote to the establishment (deep state) 'business as usual of which all the Bushes, the Clintons, and Obama are part and guilty of not being all that they should have been. Trump, according to this right-wing writer, is actually just living up to what a POTUS really should be. And, oh, Hunter Biden was paid thousands a month to sit on that board (insinuation - that must have been corruption)… That story will be more than enough for Trump's base, for many 2016 wavering Trump voters, and maybe others...
5
Trump is the ringleader of the "Gang that Could Not Shoot Straight." He promised to hire only the smartest and the best. In fact, what he actually did was SELL positions to the highest bidders. Mr. Sondland gave Trump's inaugural committee $1,000,000- It got him a fancy title but I have to wonder if he still feels it was money well spent.
10
Republicans haven't been able to answer a simple question: If Trump was just in a noble venture trying to get Ukraine to investigate Biden, why have both he and Zelansky completely stopped in that effort, ehhh? If he was doing nothing wrong, why did he stop in his tracks once caught?
I wish Democrats would ask this question.
17
And it's not a surprise that all of the GOP (Congress, Cabinet) are adopting the line that there was nothing wrong with the extortion, they were all aware and involved!
If holding up guns and a visit to the WH for a public commitment to investigate US citizens for political gain is worthy of being ejected from office, then the entire Administration should be gone. Good riddance.
6
Sondland comes across as a guy who has never ever found himself on the losing side, so savvy that he could read people accurately and absolutely confidant that he could control any situation.
With that hubris, he bought himself an ambassadorship from Trump. So, as the old saying goes, he bought a "pig in a poke" - and what a hog it is. That ambassadorship had conditions attached that placed him smack dab in the middle of a Trump plot to use Ukraine to further his political ambitions -- including pleasing Russia. And he was savvy enough to intuit ("presume") what he was supposed to do - like all great aides -- but not savvy enough to see that Trump would never leave concrete proof of his initiation of the events.
His testimony did nail Trump - and Giuliani - as the central figures -- but they aren't lying under the bus. Yet. The GOP demands DNA, blood spatters, full audio recordings ( which OC the Pre HAS but will never release) - - and they know their members. They believe in Trump tax cuts and deregulation, and that is the core of their religion.
So we will end up with impeachment by the House, and the GOP aortic block in the Senate.
if Schiff - or someone else - is able to translate all the testimony into a simple to follow event timeline, the wider public could be convinced
of the underhanded dealings in regard to Ukraine - and why they are an attack on our country. This isn't Watergate, alas.
4
We now know for sure that this Trump administration is run by a pseudo mob boss,Trump, who uses his own brand of mob tactics to keep people in order. He wants to be a dictator because he was raised among the New Jersey mob and has never left those tactics behind. He knows nothing else and is at home with this basically criminal existence. He is bringing this viewpoint to the world stage and to the power of his position. The US under Trump is rapidly trashing the rule of law because it is a civilized procedure and he has no use for civilized behaviour. The republicans under his cult-like thrall are in locked step behind him. They will be doing goose steps next. This aberrant scene will continue until something shocks them out of their trance. Hopefully it will not be too late for democracy to recover. The US is making itself extremely vulnerable. I sincerely hope the general public is smart enough to figure this out despite the smoke,mirrors and conspiracy theories emanating from the right. Democracy takes courage and commitment and some intelligence and independent thinking. The US has changed character under Trumps mob rule.
9
"Genuinely concerned about corruption." Hey, cut the guy a break, he just paid a $2M fine for running a fraudulent charity. That's a lot of concern right there.
14
@WilliamB - I wish one of the Democrats would bring this up during the hearings.
5
The difference between a banana republic and a democracy is not the fruit. It's whether people in power can break the law with impunity or not. The GOP talking points in defense of Trump are just bananas. I hope to God America doesn't become a banana republic.
8
It is already a banana republic. No other electorate of a “non-banana” republic will elect Trump, McConnell and Pence even to run the local grocery store.
The people that have bought the GOP lines will also tell you no one can convince them other wise. It's easier to con a man than it is to convince him he's been conned. Pride of what we think is stronger than facts in your face.
5
The Republicans are blind to the reality of how the majority of Americans view Trump. They ignore the results of the mid terms, they ignore recent results in Virginia and Louisianna.
Their continued support of Trump will lose them more votes
than they can retain. Trump is a lost cause. His con is up.
To support him in the 2020 election is folly. Better to find a clean candidate who advocates a return to pretrump Republicism
5
Now that we have cracked the Trump administration on Ukraine, the investigation into Trump and Russia must be revisited. The pattern has been established.
Now that others have been more forth coming and insiders have been exposed, Muller's cowardly failure to indict what he could not excuse carries less credibility. Everyone but Always Trumpers know in their hearts Trump is far from exonerated on the Russia charges and that his administration,as Sondland put it, is"rotten to the core".
Trump is going after a 2 for 1 deal to both secure the election while also serving Putin. I have only one thing to say to Trump: You're Fired!
McConnell and top GOP Senate members? I don't believe for a nanosecond they are out of the loop. Time to go hunting.
5
It surely is a blessing that Republicans have such poor memories. Otherwise, they might have to face themselves.
4
A simple question: why does anyone agree to work for this man? No one leaves without being smeared.
5
Compare and contrast professional Diplomat William Taylor with tourist Diplomat Gordon Sondland. Taylor, serious, experienced and advancing US interests. Sondland, flippant, transactional, incompetent in the extreme and looking to burnish his personal status. His "what me worry" demeanor in the hearing said it all. He dodged perjury charges with a self satisfied smirk that Reps on both sides of the aisle wanted to wipe off. He never should have been offered this vanity posting in the first place. Trump claimed he hardly knew the man yet gave him this important position nevertheless. Why not – could be a useful contact in the hotel business later.
4
Sondland left out the part about Trump explicitly telling him he wanted to quid pro quo. How is that damming except to Sondland?
@DJ trump’s Latin skills are legendary...
It's a fantastically devious strategy, however: present an impenetrable wall of resistence to facts and reality, and the Impeachment is forever "partisan," just a "Democrat" hoax.
If we spit on and burned every flag in the country, it still wouldn't compare to the disrespect to American ideals that we're seeing from Cons.
6
Let's give some extra credence to Rep. Jackie Speier's efforts to remind us all of Michael Cohen's point that the occupant never directly says or orders that his employees do anything specifically, but that everyone who works for him understands what he wants to be done. The occupant is no fool, at least in this regard.
There is absolutely no reason to believe that the acknowledged and tried and true speech pattern of the occupant has changed simply because he sits in the White House. He still speaks indirectly but everyone around him understands what he wants them to do. If there were ever a reliable way to prove a person's "intent", the occupant's consistent speech pattern, with it's accompanying results (!), is a prime example.
Michael Cohen made plain the road map to use when parsing the occupant's words. Rep. Speier's remark should not be left on the floor, but should be taken up by additional focused questioning by the Democrats sitting on the impeachment panel. If it looks like a duck, it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, it's a duck.
9
@MC
Let me remind you that Michael Cohen is in federal prison for, among other things, lying to Congress.
Perhaps another appeal to authority?
"Representative Jim Jordan, the Republican recently added to the Intelligence Committee because he's seen as an effective advocate for Trump..." I don't know what Republicans were thinking when they installed Jordan on the panel. He has been embarrassingly inept and ineffective. He comes off as an actor auditioning for the part of a tough and tenacious prosecutor but fails miserably in a hammy sort of way. Nunes is just as bad. They both keep repeating the fiction that it was Ukraine who interfered in the 2016 U.S. election, propaganda that was initiated by Vladimir Putin according to yesterday's testimony by a reliable witness who would know. You would think that it would bother Republicans in the House and Senate that Jordan and Nunes have become mouthpieces for Russia.
8
One has to realize that the Republicans in congress are actually employed by McConnell's 'donors', and they know this, and they live in fear of being 'laid off' if they don't do exactly what their bosses want. These people don't give a fig about any oath of office. So far the 'donors', the American oligarch class, don't care how corrupt the GOP or its leader, Trump, is. They only care about having a tax law that allows them to cheat the country out of their share of the tax burden. These are the unfortunate basic facts of America today.
8
This can not be repeated enough: "This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
This rottenness is passionately supported by about 40% of the electorate. What keeps that support at merely 40%? Why not 45%, or 49%, or 51%? We are lucky this time, maybe. We will not always be so lucky. This sickness needs to be studied, and remedies developed -- or else the profound spiritual sickness displayed by every single Republican on the Intelligence Committee might one day, and soon, become ascendant, and that would be the end of democracy in the USA.
4
@Dominic Holland what keeps it at that level? People of colour and increasingly white suburban women not joining the trump train . White men are hanging in there. Largely because they enjoy seeming trump embody their worst traits.
1
You must have heard a different testimony. He said there was no quid pro quo. It’s too bad that came out later and not in his 23 page opening statement.
2
"Unfortunately for Republicans, Mick Mulvaney, who was reportedly directed by Trump to put the hold on Ukraine aid, has already said, on television, that the aid was frozen as part of a quid pro quo for investigations."
It seems likely that Mulvaney is the next person being set up to take the fall. I wonder if he'll go under the bus willingly or if, like Sondland, he'll refuse to go quietly or alone.
3
Michele, this is a perfect article. You captured exactly what has transpired in the hearing with Sondland and others. What I agree with most is, "This administration is rotten to the core."
3
I have a Gordon problem too! It makes me sad to see these opportunists who had no qualifications for the jobs they got represent the US, going all over the world enjoying themselves using the taxpayers money.
5
Trump is about to throw Giuliani, and possibly also Pompeo and Mulvaney under the bus.
These guys better make sure when the music stops, they have a chair, especially Giuliani.....
While Trump demands loyalty, he doesn't offer it back as seen by people he has disparaged and discounted (regardless that he hired them and worked with them for years). Many of these people are now in jail.
The only person in the Nixon impeachment that got pardoned was Nixon. Everyone else spent YEARS in federal prison.
.
5
I wonder why no one is asking why Rick Perry, the Secretary of Energy, was being sent to Ukraine to do foreign diplomacy. It couldn't have anything to do with Ukrainian natural gas companies and money, could it?
3
A feeling of dread came over me during yesterday's Sondland testimony. Watching Trump's henchman Jordan, Nunes et al savage Sondland has convinced me that if Donald Trump came clean and admitted he tried to bribe and extort Zelensky the GOP would still have his back. The Republican party has devolved into a cult controlled by a demagogue. Once the impeachment process moves to the Senate, McConnell and his fellow sycophants will exonerate Trump and create a precedent that having a mob boss occupying the White House is perfectly fine.
6
After the pitiful display the Republicans put on yesterday, there's no reason to ever vote GOP again.
4
The thesis of your article is that today’s GOP is utterly corrupt. That has been obvious for a long time now due to their continuous loop of voter suppression efforts combined with the shameless hypocrisy of the diametrically opposite positions the GOP takes, depending on what favors them in the moment. The only solution that will break the back of that corruption is BlueWave2020. We need at least two political parties, but the one that emerges from the GOP ashes hopefully will have a more principled soul.
2
Mr. Trump claims, he does not know much of
Mr. Sondland. From the testimony, we learn
Mr. Sondland was in a position to speak to
Mr. Trump anytime. Do they still not know each other?
5
Ambassador Gordon Sondland was a problem for the Democrats because he said clearly that when he asked Trump what he wants from Ukraine, Trump emphatically and repeatedly said " I want nothing from Ukraine. I want the president to do the right thing" and he is a problem to Trump for saying his impression was that there was a quid pro quo. But overall he was a problematic joker who did not recall, did not have detailed notes, was not aware of what was happening in the news and his statement that the quid pro quo was restricted to Burisma and to meeting of the 2 presidents in the white house and NOT a quid pro quo related to our national security as some overzealous career diplomats and government staff had said.
Gordon Sondland was the problem and he is having several problems of his own and he was providing testimony under duress and is being defended by lefty lawyers. He shared what he presumed was true without any evidence to back him up. No one tried to throw Gordon Sondland under the bus. He was an unreliable witness, and a loose cannon, trying to be funny and vulgar. He was certainly the most fearless and bubbly witness so far. His direct conversation with Trump and first hand interaction with Trump, is what could be admissible as solid evidence and fortunately for the president that is what will make the sham partisan inquiry an exercise in futility and a trivial pursuit that will ensure the reelection of president Trump in 2020.
3
Sondland took his attorney's advice and told the truth.
The Rs. were shockingly unprepared for his
blistering testimony.
Everyone was in the loop.
and it's clear the Ukrainians knew they weren't going to
get the aid in Jluly
Sondland wiped out all the GOP defenses.
2
Jim Jordan's near apoplexy and Sondland's laughing at Jordan's ridiculous questioning were some of the best moments of Sondland's testimony. If Jordan is seen as an effective advocate for Trump, then Trump is in trouble. Jordan comes across as a man ready to blow to pieces. He's providing some great TV moments.
4
It was a strange postscript to hear that Sondland had a plane to catch and apparently was planning to resume his ambassadorial role in Brussels. Perhaps he feared being locked out of the embassy! Though he appeared tired and wan in the afternoon, Sondland appeared to get into the spirit of Trump by chuckling, joking and rather convincingly acting nonchalant. Trump's late afternoon flourish consisted of writing in his black Sharpie in caps: I want nothing! Nunez, Jordan, Stefanik and company repeat the same three or four points, seeking to undermine the process by obsessively criticizing it, while at no time addressing the witnesses. When I occasionally check in to Fox they adopt a similar "what a joke" mentality, but apparently may be sued for defamation based on besmirching the character of Vindman.
3
Those almost 7 hours of testimony by Gordon Sondland were painful, uncomfortable, and wobbly.
The morning session appeared to be a slam dunk for the Democrats because of the free flowing of information Sondland was sharing with the committee. I kept shaking my head and thinking out loud, is he really saying THAT?
And then after the brief break ended, the Republicans started their aggressive and relentless questioning of Sondland. And of course Trump tweeted out of context tidbits to make a loud splash of his innocence while Sondland was still giving testimony.
Even though Sondland implicated many in his infamous "They were all in the loop. It was no secret." I cannot help but agree with Ken Starr's comment that "Republicans will have cooked up talking points pretending that nothing Sondland said actually matters."
The layer of false information the Republicans continue to tell and believe is so thick, they will never vote to convict Trump of even spitting on the sidewalk. They would change that narrative to a passing hawk “doing what's natural”.
What Gordon Sondland said matters deeply and greatly. He was "telling the truth" as his boss told him to. The problem is neither Trump nor the other Republicans liked what they heard and will continue to discount his testimony, his presence, and anyone else who does not support their narrative that Trump did nothing wrong.
316
@Marge Keller
Right after the hearing the GOP proclaimed that Sondland's testimony "vindicated" Trump and proved he was "completely innocent".
They truly don't care about anything but maintaining power. I fear this is the end of our country.
69
@The Poet McTeagle
I am always fearful when any political party writes an takes information out of context and writes an alternative narrative which completely benefits their party.
This is an extremely scary and dangerous period in history.
My husband refuses to watch these hearings because he believes everything the Republicans are say and what Fox News writes.
There is no penetrating that hard head of his. It's this kind of mindset that got Trump elected and may get him re-elected.
45
@William Case
Hello Mr. Case. Thank you for your extremely well written comment. While the "serious allegation against the president" seems by many to have been dismissed, this is surely not the only serious allegation being charged against the president. There are still issues surrounding obstruction of justice, i.e., refusing to release a plethora of documents pertaining to these hearings; refusing to adhere to subpoenas; demanding various individuals to ignore their subpoenas to testify as well; and then there's abuse of power scenarios.
Perhaps the "quid pro quo, bribery or extortion" issues may appear murky, at best, the other charges are equally serious and damaging.
I so appreciate you taking the time to share your views, even though I do not agree with your assessment.
21
All of the testimony is filled with confusing details about who knew what when and who talked to whom and when that occurred .Lost in the fog is the fact that Congress appropriated a military aid package to Ukraine early in the year.The aid could have been delivered as early as February-it was nowhere to be seen by May and there were questions about when it would arrive.It was being held up while Ukraine tried to hold off an aggressive and well financed Russia which was occupying part of the country and trying to take more territory.Ukrainians were fighting and being killed to save their country while millions of dollars of aid was being withheld.Our interests are with a free Ukraine allied with the interests of Europe.Putin wants even more Ukraine territory under the Communist domination.The withholding of military money to Ukraine was a big favor to Putin.Trump punished a move toward democracy in favor of communist takeover.
467
@JANET MICHAEL
Just a small correction. Russia does not identify as communist, since the dissolution of the USSR. Russia under Putin is rather a capitalist quasi-dictatorship.
30
@JANET MICHAEL: Agreed. Similarly lost in the fog of details is that, immediately upon the Ukranian people electing a new leader on a reform platform, the US should have decisively and loudly backed that new leader, if only to send the right signal to Moscow. The issue was not whether the new government would implement a particular reform program that might meet certain US specifications; those are process details that the diplomats and others would address over time. The claim that we needed to see if promised reforms would really happen is a laughable, childish excuse; we did nothing of substance to achieve that goal, nor could we have done in such a limited time. It couldn't be more obvious: Trump had temporary leverage over the new Ukrainian leader and withheld official acts to exploit that leverage for personal, political advantage.
Donald Trump's entire life and career is about exploiting leverage. 'Quid pro quo' might as well be tattooed on his forehead.
36
@JANET MICHAEL
I have an issue with your last sentence. It is my understanding that Russia is no longer communist. Putin is an oligarch and pines for the land that used to be part of the Soviet Union. Putin's excuse is that wherever people want Russian to be the national language, he will help them.
Putin wants the land and resources under his control. Isn't he the richest man in Russia? He lives in a gigantic mansion that looks like a huge hunting lodge. I never hear any mention of Putin's affordable living complex.
This is about Russia Inc. Not communism.
32
The Republicans’ strongest argument seems to be Trump’s insistent “No quid pro quo. I want nothing,” disclaimer during a phone call with Sondland. The odd thing about the account of that call is that in Sondland’s telling it comes across as a strident response to a question that hasn’t specifically been asked. Sondland suggests he asked Trump to clarify what he wanted from Zelensky and got an angry denial instead of an answer.
It’s hard to know the broader context that prompted Trump’s outburst, but I guess when your entire life is a con, you learn what needs to be done to protect yourself. In this case, however, Trump’s denial is about as effective as a Nixon’s “I am not a crook.”
243
@Richard Frank
I think a question should be researched, then asked: Who was in the room w/ Trump when Sondland was talking to him in the restaurant? He apparently felt some pressure to be on the record saying the right thing.
12
@Richard Frank …."The Republicans’ strongest argument seems to be Trump’s insistent “No quid pro quo. I want nothing,"....The statement to which you refer occurred AFTER the White House was aware of the whistle blower complaint and AFTER Congress began an investigation into the hold on military aid. Given the time line the statement is meaningless. Sort of like getting your hand caught in the cookie jar and saying you really didn't want to steal a cookie, you were only counting them to be sure they were all still there.
19
@Marian
Those are two different calls, not the same one. The restaurant call happened on July 26 and included the President asking Sondland about the investigations. The "I want nothing" call happened on September 9, after news of the whistleblower had been released.
7
Ambassador Gordon Sondland may have thrown Trump under the bus in the Impeachment Hearings yesterday, but Donald Trump may still win a second term as our most impeachable president next year. Will Impeachment do the trick of removing trumpian governance from America? Or will it goad his sychophants into louder praise-rants (Trump's G.O.P. House loyalists, Nunes and Jordan)? The one whom Trump should throw under the bus without further delay is his personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, who has told the world Trump won't fire him because he has "insurance".
74
@Nan Socolow
The one whom Trump should throw under the bus without further delay is his personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, who has told the world Trump won't fire him because he has "insurance".
The wheels on the bus go round and round. I'm pretty sure Rudy is on his way under those bus wheels right now. In fact, tire tracks are already appearing on his back for all to see...
11
@Nan Socolow . . .my friends, the election results will ultimately be up to the Electoral College, which is a broken system and no longer serves the American people as it was intended. This president did NOT have the support of 2.8 million people for this reign of corruption. Yet, here we are with a president that is morally, ethically and intellectually
(maybe psychologically) unfit for office. If ever there was a time to get the vote out and amend the way the Electoral College functions, this is the time.
21
@Nan Socolow I wonder what that "insurance" is.
4
There is something cult-like about this Trump. I simply cannot understand why so many intelligent Republican lawmakers are willing to turn their principles into toilet paper, and their brains to play-doh, simply to please the Boss. The sad and increasingly frantic mental contortions of Nunes and his ilk are painful, embarrassing, and sad to behold. When will they wake up, shake themselves, and realize "something here doesn't square with reality"?
Up until last year I genuinely thought most Republicans leaders at least *believed* that they were working in good faith for the benefit of the country, even if their actual policies were (in my opinion) misguided. But over the past two years, and especially in the past two months, it's become clear that they will do anything--and debase themselves ad nauseum--to stay in Trump's good graces.
Why does Mr. Trump deserve such loyalty? How can men (and it's mostly men) allow themselves to be held in such thrall? They are marching toward their own irrelevance--willingly. And for what?
362
Kompromat, for some.
For others, it is entirely clear that the path to lucrative employment after Congress depends on their willingness to remain in the loyalty cult. The big business interests in the U.S. behind Citizens United operate exactly like the mob in that way - you're either with their "more riches at whatever cost" or you're not. Vote your conscience or for that antique notion, the good of the country and your constituents, and you are forced to resign and find yourself without speaking fees, without board seats, without employment or influence or access to all the things very big money buys.
52
@Sara You got it right! Big business owns the GOP and produced trump. They got their money back already and want to secure their investment in the next election. Good by Democracy if GOP wins the next election!
39
@Dwarf Planet The short answer is MONEY. The GOP is not likely to receive much cash from individual constituents. Imagine all those fat checks arriving from the rural communities of Mississippi and Alabama, for example, red states that receive far more federal money than they put in. Rather, the GOP relies heavily on dark money from a network of corporate entities headed by the Kochs et al, entities that rely on underpaid labor too desperate to complain about wages or environmental damage for fear of losing their jobs. With their funding consolidated in a few big sources rather than many smaller ones, the GOP has done the opposite of what any wise financial expert would advise: "diversify." ("Diversity" is a naughty word in Republican rhetoric.) The GOP's fortunes are tied to the fortunes of an elite few, whose whims outweigh the needs of the country at large. They must prop up the con man, because they have no other option. Integrity? Not likely.
40
So Republicans admit there was foreign interference in the 2016 election. Why are they not out in front supporting security measures to combat interference in future elections?
15
@Louisa Glasson : For a simple reason - the interference benefitted *them*. Had the interference been in favor of the Democrats, they'd be screaming about it.
They put the fortunes of their party and its sponsors above that of country long ago.
3
Sondland reminded me of an entitled teenager trying to throw everybody but himself under the bus for a crime he was also involved in. His flippancy indicated he believed he played by a different set of rules.
While his opening statement was important, I wouldn’t call it explosive. He used the fact that he doesn’t take notes as an excuse for “not remembering” key conversations. He tried to have it both ways- amend his initial testimony while still holding back. I immediately recognized that this guy was going to be slippery and circular in his answers to questions.
The hearing with Sondland was a window into Trump’s lackeys: Wealthy, entitled inexperienced yes-men paid to do Trump’s bidding. At least he showed some spine in coming forward.
13
@Wendy Simpson That's not spine but self preservation. The draft "public statements" exchanged with Ukrainian officials are going to come out. He could feign a lack of memory as long as no witness testified about what he said. However, once those witnesses testified, he had to admit at least what he knows will ultimately be revealed via those draft public statements and accompanying correspondence. Chances are, the draft public statements don't mention Biden by name because Ukraine would not want to get that deep into purely internal U.S. politics. News reports already reveal that Ukraine was trying to get Trump to accept a generalized anti-corruption statement and Giuliani would not accept it. However, Sondland could no longer deny the existence of the quid pro quo without running the risk of a perjury charge. Moreover, he could clearly see the GOP slowly shoving him, Giuliani, and Volker under the bus on more serious charges by claiming they weren't acting at the direction of Trump. The only bit he omitted is the quid pro quo for the military aid, but it is for purely self-serving reasons - a legal loophole he can arguably use to protect himself if the quid pro quo was for attending a meeting vs. no loophole whatsoever if the quid pro quo was for military aid. However, it's moot as he testified under oath that he personally said to a Ukrainian official that the military aid would not be provided without the investigations, which is the definition of a quid pro quo.
@Wendy Simpson
Exactly what "crime" was Sondland involved in?
Watching Nunes and Jordan defending Trump is like watching Borat and Inspector Clouseau. I don't know what Jordan was trying to prove in his shirt sleeves but it only made him come across as an ill-mannered boor. As for the "process defense," nothing was more laughable than hearing Republicans first complain that Democrats shouldn't be taking testimony "in secret" and then have Wisconsin Sen. Johnson complain that we shouldn't be airing our dirty laundry in public and the hearings should be held behind closed dooors.
23
I am a college teacher. Students who are not passing often plead with me to reconsider. If I were to say, "Well, let me look over your grades again. I need a favor though. I know your dad is a lawyer and I've been having this issue with my neighbor. Do you suppose he could look into that for me?" I would have broken state ethics laws and I would need to be fined and/or fired. It's plain as day and as the night is dark that Trump and his people committed a crime. Republican sophistry, smoke and mirrors, and outrage that evokes a Shakespearian notion of protesting too much only help cement the case.
31
Report on the FISA abuses is coming out Dec. 9. Any damage done by the bus you think Trump was thrown under will be invisible to the voters after that. Doesn't matter if the report is ignored by many. It will still be seen by everyone who will be in the voting booths in Nov of 2020.
3
Unfortunately, all democracies come with a little corruption. Politicians aren't angels. But in the past we've always risen to the occasion when it's gotten out of hand. The question is whether we will this time. It's time for all hands to be on deck if we want to save our country.
12
How can the Democrats ever expect to reclaim the senate or presidency? trump is soon to be impeached by the house then defended by the senate. We all know how this will play out. That said, trump and the GOP folks running in the next election will feel free to use whatever means available to get elected. That will now include corruption, foreign government help, offshore money, vote manipulation....whatever they want, knowing that in the end all will be forgiven or accepted. trump supporters may be laughing now but will they still be enthralled at the 2028 election rally with only Eric or trump jr on the ballot.
8
Trump and the GOP would do taunt the Dems from now through the election and use all means possible to win in 2020 whether the House was holding these hearings or not. Pelosi might as well prove the art of Trump's deals all lead back to Putin and Trump's personal interests. If that isn't an indictment of a corrupt administration then the American voter jury gets what they deserve - a complete collapse of the country's government and economy.
4
Still to come, "Jared, I hardly knew ye."
14
The notion that that our president cared about corruption in Ukraine is laughable. He doesn’t care about corruption in his own country.
Anyone who follows our president knows he only cares about one thing, himself, period.
29
Sondland's testimony was a bombshell, throwing the Republicans completely off guard. But no matter how many bombs are thrown at Trump he's still standing. It reminds me of the famous lines in "Hotel California":
"They stab it with their steely knives,
but they still can't kill the beast."
9
@Hamid Varzi
How about the line about our continued inability to hold him to account and thus get out of Trump's America -
"You can check out anytime you like,
but you can never leave."
2
The Gordon Sondland testimony was refreshing ,candid and alarming, he spoke like a man who just swallowed a truth serum.
Republicans were caught off guard because they were not expecting the "whole " truth.
The truth has a way of cutting through hours of legal tricks.
After Sondland finished his opening statement and the answering of questions from Democrat Attorney Mr. Goldman, it was clear Republicans were flabbergasted.
Republican attorney Castro pushed his chair back, looked at the ceiling and let out a defeated sigh.
15
@MichaelStein , yes--but it's "democratic attorney." I don't know how the republicans have been so successful in literally setting the terms to their liking. Their lockstep repetition, I guess.
3
I find it disgusting that the members of the impeachment inquiry committee have blatantly gone in with their opinions solidified and are trying to make the facts fit their opinions, rather than doing their job, which is digging for the truth. That is why it's called an inquiry. I'm looking at you, GOP.
24
@Anna
Made me smile.
1
If democrats had a real case, we wouldn't be hearing from so many witnesses who assume and presume and heard it from someone who heard it from someone who heard it from someone.
This is a charade. Let's not try to pretend otherwise.
3
@AACNY Oddly, the people who know things firsthand like Trump and Mulvaney don't want to testify under oath and won't release the documents. But I totally agree. Let's force them up and make this a real investigation.
27
@AACNY The people with direct knowledge of the crime have been forbidden to testify by Trump or have refused to go on the record about it (although Mick Mulvaney confessed on TV about it) , the verbatim transcripts of his calls have NOT been released, and even what was released showed a shakedown. Then there's the 10 instances of obstruction of justice outlined in the Mueller Report; Trump's "shocking pattern of illegality" with his Foundation; inability to tell the truth; phony university that scammed cash from desperate people - and that's the short list. Those are all individually reasons for impeachment. Let's not try to pretend otherwise.
18
Who heard it from someone who heard it from someone who heard it from someone”???
We had testimony from 2 witnesses who heard Trump’s phone call directly.
The White House is forbidding other direct witnesses to testify. If their actions were above board, why aren’t they testifying?
3
At least Sondland is getting a return on his $1M homage to trump. He got to hobnob with European leaders, had trump on direct dial, and when dissed by the same group he bought into, had a whale of a time destroying Republican talking points. There is no honor among thieves or men with power.
Everyone else in trump's menagerie have to be lawyering up and sitting with their backs to the wall when in the Oval Office. If a million dollar donor suddenly becomes someone trump barely knew, the carpetbaggers and hangers on will soon be thrown under the clown car too.
237
@Zeke27: so true! I was thinking along these lines all day, yesterday. You succinctly put my meandering thoughts into words.
4
@Zeke27 Sondland's response to Trumps denial was "Easy come, easy go" He seemed not at all surprised.
8
@Zeke27: As I mentioned as a reply to another comment, this is often about being able to "name drop." You've described Sondland very well in that regard.
It must be sad to have to stoop so low to feel like you're somebody, eh? (Not you. Sondland and the rest who are just like him.)
2
With all the rubbish my president is responsible for, any other person would have been ousted by one means or another quicker than you can say Al Franken. But this guy? He just claimed Sondland's testimony was "Fantastic." And that ain't the problem. The problem is many people are gonna believe that nonsense claim over the actual testimony.
Oh yeah- So enlightening is the fact that Nunes and Jordan can repeat and repeat stuff that has been debunked and debunked each time they bring it up in hearings of such importance. I don't know if it is a credit to our country that these people can spout nonsense without someone yelling at them to shut up or if it's a flaw.
On a note of the state of our country: At the drive-up window of a fast food restaurant, after placing my order, instead of being asked if I wanted anything else, the person yelled, "What about Hillary's emails!"
17
In the face of the overwhelming evidence against Trump, I'd like to dare Devin Nunes to prove that he's smarter than I think he is and to conclude that the jig is up for Trump.
15
@Eddie M.
There is zero, I repeat zero evidence of any wrongdoing.
@Eddie M.
You re wasting your time.
And the Republicans keep pushing to expose the whistleblower. No matter what.
That in itself shows what corrupt animals they are. At least have some decency, Republicans. The whistleblower is an American, too.
Perhaps the last thing this whistleblower ever dreamed of was being in a position to damage good old Donald Trump. Like being someone in a neighborhood that comes across a robber, murderer, lawbreaker, when perhaps least expecting it.
Republicans should at least have the integrity to protect, for humanity’s sake. But looks like they’ve left humanity behind somewhere.
19
@MIMA
Hate to burst your bubble but the whistle blower is known. Everyone who wants to know the name knows it. Also the background. Even the partisan details of the background are known. Pretend otherwise all you want.
1
We Democrats may be heading for a disaster.
If Hunter Biden was involved in shady activity the President will argue that he had had to use his power as chief law enforcement officer to pursue the truth.
Both father and son Biden will have to testify. Since rules of evidence will not apply Jordan will make them look crooked. Nunes will point out how difficult it is to police American corruption in Europe when powerful retired politicians still have influence.
Trump will be impeached by the house and acquitted by the Senate. His supporters will come out of hills and reelect him in 2020. His campaign will eviscerate the Democrat running against him because the party allowed the congress to cover up Biden's sweetheart money-making deal.
If we think Trump is dangerous now just wait until he has a chance to write his legacy. He is narcissistic and inclined to self-destruction. Let us hope the ink he uses is not blood.
2
@Charles Roemer Nunes does not run the House. He cannot compel Biden to testify. Even if he did, there is no evidence that Hunter did anything else other than use his name to get a bunch of cushy jobs, something entirely familiar to Don, Eric, and Ivanka. Hunter didn't run Burisma, and Burisma wasn't under investigation when the prosecutor was fired.
I think you are being entirely too pessimistic about this.
7
The classic lawyers' joke:
My client couldn't have done it because he wasn't there;
But if he was there, HE didn't do it;
But if he did it, he was insane at the time.
Trump didn't do these terrible things;
OK, he did them but there's nothing wrong with it;
OK, it's wrong but he's the President.
And on and on...
10
Ultimately, Sondland doesn't need Trump. No way was he going to be 'thrown under the bus.' He came to that realization and therefore was able to creep closer to the truth. It's a bit delicious.
11
@CA Reader Even more delicious to me is that he testified, and then immediately boarded a plane to return to his job in Europe. Such cheek surely must irritate the orange one. Because Sondland really can't be fired, and if he were, would that not be yet another accusation of wrongdoing, firing without cause?
Good to see heat will be applied to Republican Senators who vote "to acquit": need to get them all out.
9
Did I miss DJT's tweets deriding his million dollar donor, you know, similar to those he sent out about Ms. Yovanovitch? Or did DJT have no comment? Hmmm! I see! But, wait a minute. Does he really think that Mr. Sondland is going to give him another campaign donation?
9
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve."
Ms. Goldberg fundamentally misunderstands this president and his administration. What is the country it purports to serve? Is it her vision of the US? Or is it Trump's vision? Undeniably, he actually does serve that vision, a vision of an immigrant-country for whom immigrants are a lethal threat, a high tech country for whom coal is a strategic asset no matter its impact, a capitalist country suddenly enamored with trade barriers and trade wars. And ultimately, for far too many, a country of white people, for white people (voter suppression targeting black Americans is but one of many cases in point).
As a country, we will survive Tump, but in the long run, we will not survive the hypocrisy, the cynicism, and the greed of the political class protecting him and his values.
207
@elMago
I do not believe trump intends to serve ANY country. He simply caters to anyone who will flatter, fund, or kowtow to him in his need to be emperor.
7
@elMago
"We will survive Trump"?
Not so sure.
Millions of his supporters see nothing wrong and now expect (and actually cheer) bald face lies and rampant corruption from our politicians.
This Trump infestation will be be very difficult to exterminate.
5
@elMago What column are you TALKING about? Your comment does not seem to have any relationship to the one written by Ms. Goldberg.
It's always the same with these organized crime types: they get caught, they sweat, and pretty soon they're throwing each other under the bus. Sondland is the loudest voice in a growing chorus of people singing like canaries, but I doubt he'll be the last.
11
Putin did place the blame
for the election attack on Ukraine
He gave Donald Trump
an election bump
And Jim Jordon now maintains the same.
6
Would you want to work for somebody who will let you go to jail so he can be a TV star? Me neither.
4
Sondland's four-word statment sums up pretty much his worldly philosophical view of his relationship with Trump: "Easy come, easy go." That was his comment when a representative pointed out Trump's 2 messages/posts sent just a month or so apart--the first praising Sondland to be a good/great man, the 2nd denying any knowledge of who he was. So it was: S donated a big fat check to the Trump campaign and got a cushy ambassadorial seat in exchange. How quickly Trump disavowed any affiliation with him, in order to save his own skin. Easy come, easy go indeed.
12
@Someone
It may have been a cushy ambassador’s seat but he was hand-picked for a dirty job. And he even had to pay for it.
Congressman Nunes keeps returning to Ambassador Chaly’s op-Ed, as an example of Ukraine’s meddling in the 2016 elections and it greatly upset and hurt President Trump’s feelings.
This is just one more example of how our President has not a clue that words have meaning and ultimately consequences.
Russia annexed Crimea from Ukraine with military force. Trump then does not condemn Russia but recognizes Crimea as rightful Russian territory. The Chaly editorial was nothing more then the logical patriotic repsonse by an Ambassador looking out for the best interest of his country. Here was a presidential candidate showing deference to Russian aggression and undermining the safety of an ally and Trump was expecting the Ambassador to endorse him? Trump poked a bear and the bear then poked back. Again not meddling just a guy saying perhaps the candidate (any candidate) who does not support the military invasions by our neighbor might be more aligned with our nation’s best interests....
Trump asks for something from Ukraine in exchange for aid and he is again hurt that we don’t much like bribery and self interest to be intertwined in our foreign policy decisions. Just say the right words Mr President and we will stop drawing the wrong conclusions.
14
@Leslie
Yeah, why doesn’t Trump just face the Impeachment committee?
"But at this point, all they can do is obfuscate."
Isn't that all they ever do? Muddy the water enough that the facts don't stand out from the mess? Then when the signal to noise ratio becomes high enough they collectively bury their own heads in the sand, sort of a group ostrich strategy.
18
The one thing that Nunez keeps repeating in his opening comments is that the Democrats had made the bogus accusation of Trump of being a Russian agent. But oddly, this is exactly what is being confirmed with each hearing. Trump’s pushing Putin’s narrative of Ukrainian interference, coupled with the withholding of vital military aid. Sondland seemed to be hinting of a more sinister idea that he was becoming frustratingly convinced that there was never any intention of releasing that aid given the untenable demand that Z. falsely blame his own country in a public statement. Congress and the whistleblower are, of course, only what changed that. But that the whistleblower was CIA... In other words, the entire affair was not about bribery, extortion or quid pro quo, but outright treason on the part of the President to irreparably weaken Ukraine to Russia’s benefit. This would explain a lot, like the whistleblower’s prior communication with Schiff, the Head of the Intelligence Committee, the other thing Numes keeps saying.
21
The Republicans are clearly not interested in the truth. Just "winning". They truly have become the party of Trump.
21
If you read Daniel McCarthy's Op. Ed (Nov. 20, 2019), you can see what the Trump defense will boil down to. After all the misdirection and obfuscation, all the "it's only hearsay" and "they're all never-trumpers", the defense is, Yes, Trump did everything that is alleged and he had the legal right to do it.
9
Sure, we're supposed to believe that the president who promised to "drain the swamp" and then turned it into a bottomless cesspool, who opened the way for Turkey to attack our Kurdish allies, who refused to produce translations of his one-on-one meetings with Putin, who kidnaps and traumatizes refugee children, who has been fighting tooth and nail to hide his tax returns, who steers visitors and the military to his own properties for his personal enrichment, is concerned about corrupt politicians in a faraway country? Only insofar as he can profit from their dishonesty.
28
I totally agree.
Impossible as it seems, everyday Republicans wholly disagree.
While its objectively correct to say that GOP senators' arguments are "phantasmagorical," it only reaches people who already predisposed to agree.
What exactly is this spell, who cast it, and how can it be broken?
8
@Alix Hoquet
The spell can be summed up in 4 words. White male christian supremacy. Racism, misogyny and religious intolerance are so easily manipulated and the GOP has turned that into an art form. Ironically, they never actually deliver anything to their base unless of course it so happens to be a part of the real agenda. Finally, when will it be broken? When people realize that they have been taken advantage of and have voted against their self-interest for to long now.
My favorite line of the article: "Pence just nodded." Therein lies the problem with this president and this administration and why it is unfit to continue.
13
"Speaking of Russia’s role in 2016: A few Republicans have tried to massage Trump’s claims of Ukrainian election interference to make them sound marginally less insane."
It doesn't work. Insane is insane, after the thouroughly documented, Grand Jury evidence put together by Robert Mueller.
The notion that Ukraine spirited away the "DNC Server" (how did they get it?--breaking into DNC headquarters) and hacked it themselves so they could blame it on Russia for the benefit of Clinton is one of the most bizarre theories I've ever heard. I often had to mute Devin Nunes as he fabricated dates, times, and characters from this Alice in Wonderland scheme.
No, Sonderland isn't the most reliable witness, but just remember the phrase "they were all in the loop"a master plan directed by the president. Seemingly pleased as punch they weren't going to nail him, Sonderland said in plain language what we all have instinctively known.
Too bad the president's party won't buy it.
15
Donating $1 million to a victory party is an after-the-fact subscription likely only as self-serving. Knowingly staying in a room at the wrong time has consequences ~ a titanic experience with few lifeboats that money can't buy.
5
This process has been enormously helpful. In the admittedly unlikely event that I am ever accused of a serious felony, I will simply say, "But Hunter Biden!"
12
Nothing anyone says matters. Democrats in the house are investigating a political rival because their political rival asked a foreign country to investigate a political rival. Yes I know it's not the same thing but much of the public sees it exactly the same way.
A Juror of Republicans, many of whom have already defended the Presidents actions, are campaigning with him and directly taking money from his fund raising will be on the jury. Not exactly anything representing a justice system that any American will feel good about.
What this impeachment proceeding is not about is the rule of law. It's a tribal, political process at best and at with a divided Congress and Citizens United in place, it's a totally corrupt system that further undermines faith in our Congress and strengthens the President.
10
@HL They are not investigating a political rival. They are looking into credible allegations that the President was using foreign aid to shake down a very needy ally of ours in order to force them to say they were investigating his political rival for the 2020 election. This is where he was holding our foreign policy objectives hostage to his wants. Ukraine is a vital ally and is trying to hold off Russian aggression. There is one former Republican that is on board for the investigation (Justin Amash). What is wrong with the rest of the Republicans.
21
@HL
To the contrary, the House is doing the job it is sworn to do to protect us from an authorian would be Putin who has committed clearly impeachable offenses as they are described in our Constitution. That strengthens our democracy, it does not diminish it.
11
@HL Simple question: If Trump was really worried about corruption, why didn't he do it through legal channels? Why send Giuliani through the back door? Why hold up aid if you are suddenly outed? Tribal? Who would stick with the GOP after watching Devin Nunes, Jim Jorden, prance and perform for their party of one..Trump. Not the voters...Trump.
9
If this was Trumps second term and he couldn't run again Republicans would strongly consider impeachment. But he can run again and dumping him would be seen rightly so as throwing away the presidency for four years. Thus the base would dump them. So Trump will be impeached and acquitted in the Senate with a vote of 55 to 45 to impeach. The real jury will be us in November 2020.
26
Republicans defense is literally down to "The president didn't specifically say quid pro quo, therefore there was none."
AND
"We do stuff like this all the time in terms of withholding military aide."
So they simultaneously deny AND admit there was a quid pro quo. Fascinating to watch. Do they realize this is being captured on camera?
41
@Joe Arena,I would agree with you Trump does this chicanery all the time,we,I don’t think so.
Supposedly so concerned about corruption's in the Ukraine, Trump wanted the Ukranian president personally to make a statement regarding investigations into Burisma and the Bidens. Once the money was released – after the threat of the whistleblower report - the statement was never made - it was dropped. So, of course, the two things were connected. If Trump wanted to look less obvious he would've still pressed Zelensky to make the statement.
Trump has been in office for almost 3 years, this corruption concern in the Ukraine only heated up when Biden looked likely to run.
33
@BLH And note that again and again, the emphasis was on "the public statement that we have been discussing for many weeks." The statement, or the "headline" as they sometimes referred to it, was the deliverable because that would constitute political ammunition, whatever the outcome (if any) of an actual "investigation." The political ammunition was what they wanted, and they made it abundantly plain.
And they were right, it would have worked if not for the whistleblower, because it was exactly the kind of bright-shiny our political media have conditioned themselves to chase after, and they know it and have played you the same way times infinity. So pay attention to your own role: the whole scheme absolutely depended on you. This shadow falls on you, too.
7
Change the constitution,
Panacea that actually is exactly that.
1
It's interesting that William Barr's name did not come up much, given that he was mentioned several times by Trump on the July 25 call. Exactly how/if Barr fits into the conspiracy is still something of a mystery, but Barr's claim that he knew nothing about it seems weak, especially since he was traveling around the world trying to get evidence for the Ukraine/election meddling/crowdstrike conspiracy theory. Attorney General John Mitchel went to jail after the Watergate conspiracy was revealed. I'd be surprised if Barr's involvement now was any less important than Mitchel's was then.
41
@Jon Gordon
You're chumming with guesses and supposition, nothing more:
"something of a mystery"
"seems weak"
"i'd be surprised"
"was any less important"
Mulvaney [is] "the White House’s acting chief of staff and head of the Office of Management and Budget"--how convenient: one-stop shopping for Trump. One wonders why Mulvaney, Pompeo, and yes, Trump, are so unwilling to appear before the committee to testify in person and refute all these claims which they claim to be untrue. A few hours of testimony would clear away all the "lies." Why won't they testify?
34
@Anne W.
"Why won't they testify?" Of course they will not testify because under oath, the threat of perjury and jail is real. They are condemned if they tell the truth, and condemned if they lie.
Trump has little control of what comes out of his mouth which is why he was not permitted to testify to Mueller, but gave answer to questions probably written by an aide or attorney.
Can you see him babbling on, repeating each sentence while he struggles to come up with another? Blaming and cursing everyone and everything? Giving ample proof of his mental instability, aka insanity? Na, I don't think so.
1
As a bystander watching television hearing to impeach Pres. Donald Trump one can drive a point to misleading witnesses , from text messages and meetings that Sondland and other members to do the dirty work President, from the Republican GOP to drill their point of view. Even though they were wrong Representative Jim Jordan and David Nunez, and Ratcliff and other Republicans that the President had the authority to fire somebody or withhold money to a country fighting the corruption of Ukraine.
It's unlawful as we know to ask a foreign government to dig up dirt on campaign rival like Joe Biden and his son.
What in the world with these official thinking they must the known it was unlawful all the people that were involved are intercessory to the fact of breaking the law.
With all the lawyers the Pres. Donald Trump has and paid by the American people could tell President Donald Trump that it was unlawful to break the finance campaign-, what was he thinking . His own ego .
It's good for the American people to watch the unlawful acts of Pres. Donald Trump. You can blame the Democrats because they didn't break the law or stop him from doing his job Pres. Donald Trump what does he say to his young son it's okay to be corrupt.
3
The Republicans have painted themselves into a corner. They blindly supported Trump for so long that they no longer know how to get out of his shadow. Their juvenile attempts at denigrating the witnesses testimony even when it was their witness is really sad.
29
The Republicans are trying to make a mockery out o the Inquiry, but all they are accomplishing is making themselves look like the lightweights they are. Sondland had some brilliant moments, but he should have stopped at his opening statement.
Sondland and Giuliani are the ones who are going to be the fall guys for Trump. The only thing that will prevent that is having those who have not answered the subpoenas held in contempt of Congress and arrested by the Capital Police.
I wish Pelosi would do that. Maybe then the Republicans will stop the circus and do the right thing.
I am engaging in magical thinking.
41
What’s clear is that Republicans aren’t interested in upholding the law, only in holding onto power. They will make any number of vague excuses to find Trump innocent; they don’t even have to make sense.
It all but certain that Republicans in the Senate have concluded before the hearings began to find Trump innocent of all present and future charges. I’d bet my house on it.
43
@David R
McConnell may be forced --for self preservation if nothing else -- to have a secret ballot.
In which case, Jeff Flake's prediction that some 35 republican senators will vote to convict will come true.
1
The reality television tenor of the Trump administration has become harder and harder to ignore. Initially the Survivor type program provided the essential dramatic structure during the primaries and run up to the election. After that the program structure assumed that of The Apprentice in which people whose main qualification for being on the show was fame and telegenic qualities. He even had his greatest Apprentice star, Omorosa, cast in the role of director of African American outreach for his campaign and kept on in the administration as an aide. She was, like everyone else there, having to sustain herself in the constantly shifting and interpersonally exploitative universe of the Trump White House until, like most people on the show, I mean on the White House staff, are eventually fired.
The hearings now indicate a shift from The Apprentice to WWF wrestling shows of the 1980's. Caricatures of real wrestlers engaging in broad displays and participating in clumsily produced morality tales. The audience, or in this case, the electorate know whats going on, but frustrated by the realities of modern politics, they escape into the spectacle and are willing to participate by cheering and booing.
We may be lucky and be part of a great Procedural Crime show next, where all the parties on both sides are subjected to investigation, prosecution and adjudication.
50
@Zinkler My bet is on Trump being offered a starring role in "The Biggest Loser" for his TV comeback.
@Zinkler ...nice analysis...right on the money...
@Zinkler
Hmm. Law and Order, Undercover DC?
I still can't figure out why the Republicans want to call Hunter Biden to testify. He was not present at the phone call, he was not part of the 3 Amigos, he was not involved in Ukrainian politics, and so on. He would not be a fact witness. Obviously, since the Rs complain that so-and-so did not do any of the above, his testimony would only be worthwhile if he could be used to defame his father. Not really a good look for the GOP, weak, scared and subservient.
66
@Beth Glynn
and it draws comparison to Donald, jr. and Ivanka. Hardly poster children for decency and honesty.
What a bad political move! But it is too late; the GOP has already made it.
2
@Beth Glynn
Learning more about his "role" at Burisma could certainly provide fodder for the argument that there was substantial corruption at Burisma that warranted a call for an investigation.
1
@Beth Glynn : Just by showing up, tgey cab claim a victory. They can spin it to the ignorant that two people are on trial - Trump and “the corrupt one.”
Reality and Justice don’t matter worth a darn here: only the ever malleable optics of Trump’s fantasies... and amoral, ruthless Republican ambition.
I noticed all the "I assume" and "I presume" too. He was not being direct in his testimony.
11
Don't try to throw a $1MM donor with a SUCCESSFUL business legacy under the bus. They have a reason to bite back, particularly if the culprit is a business failure.
59
I wish I could be as sanguine about Sondland’s testimony as the columnist. Of course we all believe he knew that the targets of the investigation were the Bidens, but he claimed no knowledge of the connection. Many of what would have been salient points he claimed to know only now, from the testimony of others and media reports. He tried to walk back some of the stronger points from his opening statement.
If I had watched only the opener, I’d be feeling pretty confident, but I watched the whole thing. If you step back and quit seeing exactly what you’re looking for, I think you have to admit that Sondland’s testimony was more ambiguous than we would like.
29
Exactly. He “presumed” a quid pro quo. Trump’s phone call explicitly stating that he wanted “nothing” from The Ukraine and the ‘Who’s On First?’ statements of the other passengers in the White House Clown Car provide no clear evidence of a quid pro quo to investigate the Bidens.
The MSM ‘interpretation’ and misleading click-bait headlines about the ambassador’s testimony do not serve the public well.
Detesting Trump in Mass
Ms. Goldberg's excellent column addresses the substance of the impeachment hearings and the failed (offensive and blatantly dishonest) defenses put up by Republicans, but fails to address the bottom-line - Republicans and Trump supporters - all proud MAGAts - simply do not care.
I was struck by Mr. Sondland's opening statement as to why he defied orders of the president not to testify - why he did come to testify at the hearings. He said "I agreed to testify because I respect the GRAVITY of the moment and believe I have an OBLIGATION to account fully for my role in these events." (Emphasis mine.)
In direct contrast to the "gravity" of the impeachment proceedings and as a commentary on the "obligation"(s) of Congress, Mr. Sondland (regardless of his faults) stands as a profile in courage, which by direct contrast, exposes the dishonor, dishonesty, cowardice and betrayal of country by the Republicans. They have attempted not just to mislead the country on the evidence and import of Trump's extortion attempt but also to make a mockery of the proceedings.
"Representative Jim Jordan, the Republican recently added to the Intelligence Committee because he’s seen as an effective advocate for Trump,..." NO! Let's be clear, Jordan was added to the committee to make a spectacle of himself, to create a circus atmosphere and to mock the Democrats, witnesses and the hearings.
Jordan, Nunes and most of the Republicans have endeavored to make a joke of the seriousness of Trump's crimes.
96
Republicans have endeavored to make a joke of the seriousness of Trump's crimes, to mock Democrats and demean the witnesses.
They are playing to the MAGAts, providing them Altrnate-reality TV entertainment and fueling their anger towards Democrats, truth, facts, law and order, the values we cherish.
We must recognize that Trump is only a temporary, small part of the problems facing our nation. Republicans are a bigger more insidious problem. MAGAts are an enduring dangerous problem. We have generations of work ahead.
18
@JABarry
You are so right. If the hearings revealed that Trump gave Putin our nuclear codes, and the Democrats nominated Jesus Christ, himself, as their 2020 Presidential candidate, Trump would not lose a single Evangelical Trump base voter. Not a single one. And, the Republicans in Congress are well aware of this.
4
A bus driver attempting to throw a passenger out the window of a moving bus is a dangerous move, to be done by professionals only. WARNING! DANGEROUS! Do not try this at home. For trained professionals only!
27
One aspect of this still needs to be examined: why Republicans have not begun 'peeling away' from Trump, even though a number of them have announced they will not seek re-election (one would assume it is because they feel having Trump at the top of the ticket will gravely damage their chances for re-election). So, it will be interesting to see who hires them, how they land on their feet (the Texan Hurd comes first to mind) after they leave Congress.
41
@Joe
Their time in office is only one part of the equation... it’s all the goodies that come after they leave, when all those favors can be cashed in and it’s not considered bribery... you don’t bite the hand that feeds you before you get your final treats and they have no intention of ruining their retirement plans.
These individuals were all “hired” long ago by whomever they are in deepest with... petroleum, tobacco, banks, drug companies, foreign investors, agriculture, telecoms... pick anyone or any industry that needs to alter the laws in their favor.
You also have to look it as more of a “thieves guild” than a political party... they have a good front going that’s raking in big bucks for all the guild members and you don’t ruin it for everyone else before you go out the door.
People tend to argue their actions as if there is any credibility to the pretense of them being there for a greater good of some sort... they are all “employees” of some faction or other, be it corporations, wealthy billionaires, foreign actors or a little of each... this isn’t about the good of the nation, it’s about their careers and comforts.
Quid pro quo?
Lobbyists will scoop them up.
I have noticed that all the trump supporters I know have been reduced to a "he's the president and he can do what he wants/serves at the pleasure of the president" argument. I have also noticed this argument is greeted with smirks and eye rolling from listeners.
55
I think Mrs. Goldberg summed it all pretty well. And despite Pompeo once admonishing those who use punctuation marks, Mrs. Goldman very carefully used them correctly. There's no mistaken about her profile of yesterday's impeachment hearing.
She offered the following: "Leave aside that there is nothing illicit about public officials expressing their opinions about matters of urgent concern to their own country."
"Much of the republican case, going forward, is likely to depend on pretending that this confession doesn't exit.''
Very perceptive, Mrs. Goldberg. Nunes has been aware of this throughout the hearing giving one to believe he has a higher stake in this then the rest of the republicans. Jordan on the other hand likes throwing himself into the ring. He likes engaging in matches where he holds the advantage over his adversaries and always thinks he got them down for the three count. I noticed how he uses this time up privilege for all it's worth. Hopefully, in the next election the fine people of Ohio will give him his three count and makes this his final count. Match over verdict. And one one will expect less of him if it happens to cry foul.
"
45
I found Mr. Sondland's testimony yesterday was peculiar. He gave the appearance of being forthcoming on all issues that could be substantiated by others, but evasive, if not dishonest, on issues that no one could verify such as his private conversations with Trump or his knowledge of the Biden investigation. Knowing the Biden investigation was illegal, he made sure that he was "out of the loop" on that issue while implicating many others. He was strangely jovial for someone under the spotlight who had lied in his prior deposition. All in all he followed his lawyers' script very well, walking a fine line that could come back to haunt him at a later date.
40
@Robert Antall
I saw a very, very nervous man. Who was mostly likely wondering why he paid a million dollars for this.
50
@Curious I learned that a long time ago. The rich have a different playing field but they can fall just the same. Money does not buy character.
18
@sjs : I saw nervousness, too. He put Marco Rubio to shame in the water department.
1
I thought that it was interesting people thought he would take the Fifth, and he did not.
My, what a moment in history for the books.
33
'While everything changes, Everything remains the same.' --Aristotle
In Nixon's day it was called a 'smoking gun.' In Trump's day it's become $400 million worth of Javelins. The technology's advanced but the corruption hasn't, except in the latter case it now involves our most formidable sworn enemy and Republicans prefer to obfuscate instead of cooperate, escalating a constitutional crisis to an existential one.
BTW, there's no room left under that one bus. Time for a fleet of Greyhounds.
47
Trump undermined both Ukraine and US national
security by withholding and weakening Ukraine’s
defense against Russia’s aggression.
2
@Guido Malsh Not Aristotle but Jean-Baptiste Alphonse Karr: “Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose” (The more things change, the more they stay the same).
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/plus%20ça%20change,%20plus%20c%27est%20la%20même%20chose
@Guido Malsh
Forget conventional buses, you need monster truck buses with jacked up suspensions and huge tires.
The House has the power not just to impeach the President, but also his appointees. Those who have been implicated by this testimony should all be targeted for impeachment before Trump himself is formally impeached and subpoenaed if they haven't been already. If they refuse to answer their subpoenas they should each be impeached for their role in the affair and for obstruction of Congress.
At the same time the impeachment hearings against Trump should be expanded to include the full range of his misdeeds to tap into the broadest base of popular disgust with this man. From Stormy Daniels to emoluments to child separation, it all needs to be included in the final charges to put the maximum pressure on GOP Senators to vote to remove him from office.
Nothing less than this sort of full-spectrum approach is going to shake the spirit of impunity that Trump has created around himself. Only the imposition of unrelenting pressure on both the administration and Senate Republicans is going to cause key individuals to crack and to set in motion the sort of mass defections necessary to actually bring Trump himself down.
We need to understand the stakes here. Such an approach may or may not succeed in removing Trump from office, but if properly pursued should sufficiently damage him as to make him unable to win re-election and to hand the Senate to the Democrats next November. Anything less runs the unacceptable risk of facilitating a slide to dictatorship.
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@Christopher
Impeach even more people? This reminds me of the SNL skit, "More cowbell", a spoof of those VH1 shows. It has a music producer demanding more and more cowbell in the song until it is ruined.
1
As long as his base does not weaken all this is remains fodder for academics, retirees and concerned citizens, (regrettably) nothing more.
17
@s.chubin , "concerned citizens" are a large cohort and growing by the day. Trump's base wasn't a majority even in 2016, and it's not growing. The tarriff blows to farmers, the wrecking of a stable trade relationship with China, the abandonment of the Kurds, and so much more have not been increasing that base, but chipping it away. His disrespect for General Mattis largely lost him the military officer ranks, just as an example. Trump steps on people, not understanding that he may need them again. Look at his former minions lining up to testify now for an example of how well that served him. Meanwhile those on the left who didn't bother with voting in 2016 because Clinton was a sure winner have seen the error of their ways. Winning the WH or Congress doesn't depend on converting what remains of Trump's base. Those opposed far outnumber them. We need to stand together, and certainly we can prevail.
53
@s.chubin: Trump's base isn't big enough to win him the election on its own. His base wasn't even a majority in the last election and many things are different this time. He's won't be running against Hillary Clinton. Foreign interference will not be so influential. Voter suppression efforts will be opposed. Few people will vote for Trump expecting him to change for the better (most will understanding that he is likely to get worse). He will have spent four years making a mess of the Presidency, the government, the country, and the world. And it seems that he is inspiring Democrats to get out and vote. None of that means that Trump can't win, but his base does not guarantee him victory.
I'm a retiree and a concerned citizen and I don't just write comments to the NY Times; I also donate and vote. Here in NY my vote is not likely to make much difference but I can still send some of my money to the races where it will matter the most.
11
From your mouth to the ears of all available deities
We have heard former Trump appointees claim that keeping the president from self destructing was part of their job description. Sondland and Volker both suggested they tried to do the same but were not successful. However, to receive the recognition they both desire for doing so they both need to be truthful. I do not find their common denial of the Burisma-Biden connections credible. As Sondland testified, everyone knew what was going on including both of them.
33
The one error in Amb. Sondland's testimony was his choice of the word 'presumed' to describe his thinking. Sondland is street-smart but possibly without highly-refined linguistic skills. At times his word choice wasn't the best--and I'm not talking about the four-letter words. When asked how he knew there was a quid pro quo, Sondland said that he presumed this. Sondland used the word 'presumed' when he should have used the word 'concluded' to describe his thought process. Then he allowed Castor and others to bind him to this word. It's clear that Sondland didn't presume something out of thin air. He 'concluded,' that is, he deduced, inferred that there was a quid pro quo based on all that Trump and Guiliani said and did. Sondland deduced that the inaction on the meeting and the hold on the military funds were motivated by Trump's over-arching purpose of pressuring Pres. Zelensky to announce the investigation. The Republicans shouldn't be permitted to discredit Sondland's testimony based on his choice of the wrong word.
66
Gym Jordan keeps asserting that Trump was checking out the new guy in Ukraine to make sure he was corrupt. And when he concluded he was legit Trump released the aid.
Taking Jordan at face value, I'm sure he will produce the final paper resulting from the "checking out" process, the project management plan for the effort, and the work products.
Anyone cynical enough to think we will never see any of that?
26
Last night the PBS News Hour gave a lot of time to showing Trump's response to this bombshell. It came down to, "I didn't want anything," repeated numerous times. I found that puzzling. Leaning over backwards to be "fair" contributed to this mess we're in.
65
@Betsy S The PBS News Hour has become mediocre at best. As you point out, they go out of their way to be “fair” even when it distorts the actual news. I am less and les inclined to support then. If I wanted to listen to propaganda, I’d watch Fox.
@Betsy S
Regardless of your views on the current White House occupant, on which we likely agree, this sounds like "fair" reporting.
At the start of Sondland's testimony he repeatedly mentioned that he would have been able to give more accurate responses if he had the notes that Barr's Justice Department is withholding from Congress. It wouldn't hurt to remind the public of this part of the administration's obstruction effort.
159
Let's be clear. Sondland "revised" his testimony under duress. Perjury charges loomed if he didn't refresh his memory. Volker and Morrison, despite their admirable credentials, at points in their testimony seemed willfully naive about a President who snarls at the truth. Morrison's claim to remove conversations to a more private server to avoid public consequences colors his character in an unflattering way. These hearings put into further undeniable relief Trump's long history corruption, payoffs nothing more than hush money, tax returns denied public access, numerous dubious bankruptcies, a scurrilous charity organization.
The GOP tried to throw Sondland under the bus. Trump will go even further. Both Pompeo and Mulvaney must be quaking in their boots.
68
@JT His attorney Robert D. Luskin was Carl Rove's attorney that saved him from perjuring himself.
2
@JT ... It is amazing how terrified all these people are of Trump. He is truly "Don" . By name and nature.
1
Was it just me? Retired and time to watch the hearings the Dems just seemed to allow the waters to get muddied to the point that I thought the viewer could too easily feel as if they were being transported to the looking glass world of Alice. Nothing made sense, nothing was as it seemed, and there was a cloud of smugness that was smothering any hope of day light common sense. Why were the Dems walking on eggshells? Why did they get so mired in details while what was needed for someone to climb to 30 thousand feet and be a broken record to rebut the broken record of inane minority talking points. And, more than anything put aside the mind set of prosecutorial questions and engage in old fashion oratory that captures the dark truths and offers inspiration to counter that darkness. Capture the attention of all, particularly the trump supporters. Something is missing in the dem narrative. There is a void in the art of persuasion. Is it just me?
27
@william phillips No it is not "just you". I too am retired able to watch this live. I yelled at the TV a few times during all of the hearings. It is as if the dems are missing opportunities to be concise in their questioning.
Trump supporters will not be swayed, for whatever their reason(s) they continue to support him regardless of what he does or say. I do wonder how long trump will keep Sondland in his position.
14
@william phillips
With respect, because it is a hearing, not a debate. They are trying to nail down facts on record, not trying to persuade the audience.
51
I too am retired and watching it live.
The Democrats have not succeeded in convincing me, an independent voter, to believe their contorted narrative.
This whole charade is very much like a Pirandello play - characters in search of an author.
And the great tragedy of this impeachment is that by the very nature of its frivolousness, it sets a precedent for the impeachment of every president going forward into the future.
Every president.
4
It's been suggested here that voters should take a simple civics test to determine knowledge of how government works. A better strategy would be to put strict laws in place about lying and deceiving the American people once in office, with the stiffest possible penalties on discovery. Those sworn into office should take an oath of honesty. We do this for witnesses in court cases; is it any less important to do so for our government with elected officials?
87
We could use a third party and a vote of No Confidence added to the Constitution. Trump would have been gone long ago.
4
@kay They already do that. They swear to uphold the Constitution. Nothing more is needed.
1
@Jeffrey
"Nothing more is needed." -- Except for needing for those who so swear to match the actual deed to the word.
Trump has been on Russia's side against Ukraine since 2016. During his presidential campaign and after hiring Manafort, he said he'd recognize Crimea as Russian territory and lift punitive U.S. sanctions against Russia. He even convinced the GOP to reverse their official position on the platform.
Throughout his term, he has been obsequious to Putin and resistant to imposing sanctions, even after the intelligence agencies determination that Russia interfered in the election. Trump, through Giuliani and the sycophantic GOP Congress/DOJ/Cabinet, has tried to rewrite that history through this fiasco.
Who would have benefited from all these shenanigans?
Russia.
Follow the money. Russia has something on Trump, and he's doing his best to keep it under wraps. Trump cares nothing about the rule of law or his oath of office. His only concern is himself.
183
@kfranz2 Your insights are imperative. The question every American needs to ask themselves is this. WHO would benefit from Mr. Trump's need to destabilize Ukraine? Certainly, not Ukraine... the EU... or the United States. Vladimir Putin is the big winner in this sordid mess. ALL Americans need to ask themselves this question. WHY is Donald Trump so beholden to Mr. Putin? Any human being with working brain cells has to recognize that Donald Trump only promotes and protects himself. He'd throw Melania, his sons and daughter under the bus if he thought it would enlarge his bank account. WHAT DOES Vladimir Putin have on Donald Trump? Follow the money.
7
Russia is Trumps bank. They own him and the public knew it when they voted for a Russian agent in 2016. Most of the red states hate the Democrats more than they hate Russia, a foreign power that is trying to weaken our national defense. How did that happen? The Democrats have got to get serious and understand why they are the most hated party in America. If they can’t figure it out they can always ask Bernie.
@kfranz2 Would you like to guess where the funding for a bankrupt casino operator and real estate developer came from ???
Those in the middle are put off by impeachment fervor. Trump’s approval rating has gone up over the past month. I’m not in the market for a Pyrrhic victory. But that’s looking like the story line.
4
@michjas
For once, public sentiment and polls should be put aside to do what's right. And the sad truth is that if Trump's approval ratings have, in fact, gone up, and if he gets re-elected, this country deserves no better.
39
@michjas
According to fivethirtyeight Trump’s approval rating has gone up and down a tiny bit but has essentially stayed at 42% throughout. Same as it’s been for three years now.
11
@brooklyn
I totally agree there is no choice but to have these hearings. Who cares what the polls say.
29
Perhaps this is a naive question, but is it normal for POTUS to appoint a "guy" he doesn't know and "has hardly spoken to" as ambassador to the EU which includes Ukraine in his dossier?
EU and Ukraine are extremely important to the US, strategically and economically. Ukraine, in particular, if Trump was so worried about corruption there, would be an area that would warrant a more seasoned ambassador. No?
50
@Lola
As long as the "guy" has donated large pots of money, e will be appointed. Normal? Who knows, a column should be written about the history of ambassadors and how they obtained their positions. This "guy" was ambassador to the European Union without the slightest bit of experience. It needs to change.
43
@Lola
Yes, it's routine. Obama's ambassador to Iceland had never been there. Caroline Kennedy was made ambassador to Japan without any foreign or trade experience. Moreover, more than half of Obama's ambassadors were political (that is, not from what is known as the "career pool"). Clinton's and Bush's ambassadors were about 30% political.
1
@kay. One of the things I miss about President Obama is that he always appointed highly qualified people to important positions.
11
The only goal that the Republicans have is to get to the closing date before the termite infested structure collapses of its own weight. Kinda like what happened in 2008. Problem is, Inspector Obama got in, declared that all the structure needed was an infusion of cash to make the mortgage holders whole, slapped a coat of paint on it and put it back on the market. Future generations will look back and wonder, hopefully.
8
I say let the GOP rascals ride the SS Donald into the abyss as they seem inclined to do. They've passed up so many offers to board the lifeboats, mainly by propagating the lie that the ship is intact or by attacking those who have sounded the alarm. As a political class, they're of course busy looting things--like the planet, for instance-- while the water literally floods each deck level.
Then there's AG Barr who just wants us to have a king again...one exempt from those nice rules the rest of us play by. His bizarre rationale is that the voters spoke clearly in electing our "strong unitary executive" and that this all then is really about democracy...about defending the people from an overweening parliament. Nevermind that Trump pitched explicitly out to the Russians to tilt the election, the Russians actually did try to do so, Trump rewarded them, the GOP blocked efforts to address the electoral assault, then did their best to suppress the vote, and still lost by 3 million votes. Nevermind that Barr serves happily as the errand boy for the Federalist Society which is using the corrupt GOP Senate to stack the judiciary for the long term. If Barr were doing his job for the people, he'd be protecting and expanding the vote like AG Bobby Kennedy did. And he'd be prosecuting organized crime like AG Kennedy did rather than supporting its entrechment in the Whitehouse.
94
Sadly, Ms. Goldberg and her flock are wearing blinders. And the worst nightmare for those of us who prefer Ms. Pelosi seems to be coming true. While you were watching TV, countless news sources reported that Trump’s approval rating has gone up during the hearings.
4
@michjas I just looked at fivethirtyeight.com and Trump's approval ratings seem to be converging - up one point for approval and down one for disapproval.
20
If popularity was all that mattered in American politics, Trump never would have been elected president in the first place.
4
@michjas
Consider that Trump's approval has remained strong despite 2 years of a Russian collusion investigation and now impeachment. This is a remarkable feat.
1
Mr Trump could try a surprise strategy, and simply "fess up" to the accusations, claiming a lapse in judgement, and express an interest in making his foreign policy exemplary of honest presidential diplomacy. Unfortunately this would fly in the face of many other examples, that reflect a less than truthful stance, on the part of the President. Discrediting or firing Mr Sondland probably wouldn't make much difference, this late in the game.
2
@Eric S
And pigs should learn to fly.
DJT is congenitally unable to admit fault.
Arrogance is usually the downfall of the powerful. More so than whatever misdeeds they originally engage in. The arrogance leads them to them to deny, obfuscate, cover-up, and blame underlings. And that is what usually catches them in the end.
Of course, none of this is relevant if the proverbial light bulb doesn't go on in the heads of the Trump "psychophants" who have, unfortunately, the right to vote in this country. It is all too evident that the priority of Republican lawmakers is not upholding the Constitution but, rather, their own re-election possibilities.
If America survives this next era as a democracy, I believe we should require people of voting age to pass a simple test on how our government is structured. Just basic US Government 101 concepts, mind you; no "big stuff" that would pose an unsurmountable intellectual challenge for Trump voters.
59
@Kris: The Electoral College and Senate apportionment have concentrated and amplified the votes of the least cosmopolitan people in the US.
48
@Kris No, absolutely not. America is not going to trade our present lurch toward oligarchy for an 18th century aristocracy. We will continue to do what is right -- that includes impeachment -- and take our political arguments to the American public. Everyone should have the right and access to vote, end of story.
17
@Kris Let's not. Structures are what matters, not what they were originally purported to do. You are proposing a qualification test for voting, period. And then at sopme point the Republicans write the test. No, let's not. How about we just make our democracy more democratic?
12
Schiff got it right at the end. "This is the world we live in", a world where Trump can do whatever he wants w/o recourse.
It is apparent that no amount of evidence, proof nor public pressure will result in a conviction in the republican controlled senate.
We are a banana republic with the 1% pulling the strings. They have the power and will sacrifice democracy to keep it. The end of the 243 year experiment is in sight.
133
@Jack H. "The end of the 243 year experiment is in sight." As a country we have had our backs against the wall before. We have the ability to "create a more perfect union". Do we have the will? As a country, we have the government we deserve. We elected these people, from both parties. We are to blame for the mess we are in. If we could just get money out of politics and only elect honest, effective leaders who will run our country with wisdom, justice, heart and grace. ... Fat chance that will happen. You are right, we are in real trouble.
37
@Exiled To Maui A system with feedback will evolve to serve its purpose well. Obstruct the feedback and it remains less honed. Instead of designing the system to cushion possible errors of mass judgment we could design it to be highly responsive both to bad impulses and to insistence on reversing them. Our system now is designed to be on the cusp between the two principles. It fails and corrects very slowly.
9
@Jack H. And 70 years of dishonest politics has made renogotiation of the Constitution a profoundly risky proposition.
2
Almost as despicable as the miscreants Sondland has identified & exposed are the apologists for leveraging America's national interests & security for personal political gain. The irony of Congressmen (and one woman representative) accusing the Democratic Party of partisanship as they defend the indefensible solely because they share the Republican label with the Miscreant in Chief is impossible to miss.
We don't yet know what the short term consequences are for this President and the once-proud Party he has dragged through the mud, but whether accountability comes from the House & Senate or whether it more likely comes at the ballot box next year, it should be harsh - not as retribution but for the sake of our country where this can never be allowed to happen again.
Register. Wait in line. Vote.
137
@tomreel - Wait in line? I vote at my desk wearing my slippers, drinking a latte, and listening to Zappa. We get our ballot about a month before any election, take our time voting, and then either mail it back for free OR drop it off in special drop boxes all over town usually at our local library. As for registering? Any time you try and renew you license/id or apply for food stamps or anything else with the state, the first question they ask is, "would you like to register to vote?". They take all the info we give them and just automatically register us.
27
@tom harrison New York finally has early voting. So it will be even more convenient for my neighbors to vote for Stefanik again so they can defeat the SAFE act.
4
@tomreel Just registered for absentee overseas ballot. Voted last time 6 days after quad bypass surgery. Hoping everyone will take it seriously this time.
3
I look forward to the day when have a President who not only understands the concept of Rule of Law, but can explain it. In my humble opinion the Teflon Don can do neither.
48
The “Gordon Problem” was the term Fiona Hill used. Looking forward to her explanation of that on Thursday.
24
@Vicki Gordon Sondland was a problem because he kept interfering in and undermining Ukraine issues when he was supposed to be ambassador to the EU; that union does not include Ukraine as one of its members. Unbeknownst to those whose portfolio encompassed that country, he was acting at the behest of Giuliani, Pompeo and Trump.
13
A friend asked me today why the Republicans are doing this. Was it because they want to keep their jobs? What about their principles? I said that the Republicans have no principles; all they care about is power. He nodded.
126
@WZ
It's only and always about power. The Congressional Black Caucus is on record that prison and jobs are two big contributors to Black poverty. Trump has respectably addressed both, and the CBC is trying to impeach him.
@WZ
They've sold their souls.
If they ever had one.
@WZ and as a polite Democrat I need to send Republicans a thank you card. It will read "THANK YOU SO SO SO SO MUCH for turning the suburbs blue"
You are always superb, Ms. Goldberg. Thank you. The last two sentences in this piece--brilliant.
52
Trump throws people under the proverbial bus to protect himself and his interests. People associated with him do the same thing for the exact same reasons. Sondland has the best lawyers money can buy, he was well coached and believed he is actually driving the bus. He may be wrong.
18
To paraphrase Chief Brody in Jaws, we’re gonna need a bigger bus.
@Jay Tan The rats are biting each other's tails.
@Jay Tan: Right, Because Vladimir Putin is driving the bus.
1
A member of the Harvard debate team might be given a hopelessly arguable position and it is their job to defend it. i.e.
Argue pro and con "Is the earth really flat?" Their job is to eagerly, aggressively and whole heartedly defend that position, even when they don't believe it to be true. Their merits will be based on the vigor of their arguments.
The current job of the Republican party is to convince the American public not that the earth is flat, but that Donald Trump has done nothing wrong to deserve impeachment. And how wonderful are their arguments, that not even they, believe for a second.
128
@kel I am a senior. I firmly believe thanks to GOP we're losing America as an ideal. We're losing the spirit to be better in ways that really count! We are becoming venal, self-serving, amoral.
Am senior, know we've not always been perfect. We've also had wrongs to right and prejudices, stupidity and injustice to battle. And we did - and I was proud!
Even of my Military Service though I detested the war I fought in. The Service had real honor. And was PROGRESSIVE in many ways.
So whether In the streets to drive needed change, being a good soldier in our military, thoughtfully voting, or honestly paying my taxes I proudly did it for my Country.
I viewed the essence of my Country as noble always.
To protect and advance our liberal democracy; to ensure that liberty and justice for all have appropriate modern implementation; to give as many people as possible real compassionate understanding, hope, fairness, and opportunity.
And it always seemed that my Country would eventually do the right thing. That it would eventually recover and improve its strides from its stumbles. We citizens only needed to do our collective civic duty to nudge it right.
I fear the Nation I always loved is regressing; morphing into something I'd not fight for; something incorrigibly and permanently beneath the ideal.
That 44% are OK with this saddens this senior to tears. Literally.
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Poisonally, I rather enjoy watching themselves twist themselves into logical Klein bottles from which they then try to drink.
Regrettable, watching the shabby likes of Devin Nunes debase the Constitution, and the whole idea of facts....well, that is far less a fun treat.
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I think his opening statement lasted almost an hour. Five hours of questioning later he was still able to laugh. I wouldn't be able to do either. I think he is qualified for his post simply by that performance. It would be kind of funny in the ironic sense, if he took Trump down. Not deep state, not partisan, but simply more honest, when it matters, than Trump's administration is.
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@athena I dont know, he tried to have it both ways it seemed to me- kind of like trump- it depended on the last person he was questioned by- kissed repub _ss, (as Sondland likes to say) than the dem., but seemed more comfortable agreeing wiht the repub.
It's interesting that I have not seen mentioned the fact that, unlike other witnesses, Sondland has no vested interest in the impeachment. He is not constrained in his appearance at the inquiry by a reputation to protect , a job to protect, or a pension to protect. Unlike some of those working around Trump, Sondland is wealthy. He can afford to have fun. There is no bus for him to be thrown under. The metaphor doesn't apply.
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@Dumbhaole: It seems to me that that is why he has changed part of his story. He has relatively nothing to lose by doing so, whereas he could face prison time if he goes down with Trump. His "career" as a diplomat is not at stake, since he didn't have said career, unlike the civil servants in the foreign service. As you suggest, he doesn't particularly need to protect his current gig as an ambassador.
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Well he could go to jail for the crimes of others, which is what the setup is about.
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Which witness has this “vested interest?” Please do specify; after all, even a nasty smear requires some precision.
I'm not a Republican and I disagreed with John McCain on most issues, but one wonders whether we'd be looking at an entirely different impeachment scenario if McCain were alive to lead a requisite number of Republicans in the Senate to vote yes on impeachment given what's unfolding in the testimony. It's hard to believe he would have sat by passively and watched this.
Sometimes history really does turn on a single figure. Or in this case, doesn't turn.
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@CAP Lindsey could have been that senator, but she chose to ignore her mentors path. It’s pathetic to watch senator graham self emulate.
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@CAP Well, after watching the Impeachment Proceedings I have one question to ask EVERY American Voter. Mr. Nunes, the person who most frequently refers to the Hearings as a Democratic Circus is the loudest and most disgusting clown in the room. It is clowns like Mr. Nunes that are stoking the fire that will burn and leave the American Democracy in ashes.
The Republican leader is now Lindsey Graham, God help them all.
It strains credulity that Trump could be concerned about corruption. This is a man who wanted to host the G7 at his own resort. This is a man who ordered officials to give his son-in-law security clearance that was not merited. Trump has not pursued corruption anywhere else but Ukraine, specifically in relation to his political rival.
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@Al Bennett
But Trump is NOT pursuing corruption with Burisma and the Bidens. Trump made it clear that he simply wanted President Zelensky to make a public statement that the Bidens are being investigated.
But Zelensky really didn’t need to go through with it!
Trump is all about show. It’s why the term “Infrastructure Week” has become a laugh line. He gets up in a big truck cab, pretends to drive like some five year old. Has American made equipment lining the White House Drive....but no bills have been passed. The only infrastructure he cares about is that wall on the Southern Border.
And now Jared announced that they want streaming cameras 24/7 along the border showing the wall being made! Of course this would be a disaster as American builders are needing to trespass on the Sovereign Country of Mexico to position their earth moving and fence building equipment.
Trump is superficial. He doesn’t care if anything is found out about the Bidens...only the APPEARANCE that there is a problem.
Reminds me of when Trump said he sent investigators to my home Hawai’i to “get to the bottom of Obama’s birth certificate” then saying “You can’t believe what they are finding!” Nothing.
It’s all a show and I want it to stop.
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I would say that Trump has pursued corruption everywhere he has ever gone. He has pursued it with both hands and stuffed his pockets with as much corruption as he can get. How is history going to describe this guy? Are there even words?
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@Al Bennett - He recently sent money to Venezuela and he has sent weapons to Mexico. Mexico makes the top 10 list of most corrupt nations on earth. Ukraine is pretty far down from that one.
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"So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away." Ok gosh, there again goes the 4th Estate, tiresomely articulating the deviations of permissible exoneration. You don't suppose, a snapshot of Atlanta before the flames could be invoked to illustrate, at this late date, what we've lost?
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I teach history and I can’t figure out what your post means. Please try again, I have a feeling it’s a good draft.
we listened all day. Jim Jordan sounded foolish. but that is only our opinion, Hope the truth will come out
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@christina r garcia
If you still haven't seen the truth, I sincerely hope you are not eligible to vote yet.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away."
I couldn't agree more! How can the Republicans not see that by defending Trump they are defending a man that acts against the interests of the United States and it's democratic allies? How can Republicans put criminal behavior and party over our laws and our national interest?
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@Pluribus They won't see what they don't care about. As for your final question, follow the money trail.
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Money.
"This administration is rotten to the core and fundamentally disloyal to the country it purports to serve. So is every politician who still tries to explain its corruption away.' This statement by the Michelle Goldberg perfectly describes the complete abdication of duty to protect the constitution, country, and the American people, by this treasonous cabal.
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Zelensky “had to announce the investigations, he didn’t actually have to do them,” he said. Okay, this destroys the defense that Trump was interested in corruption. He was only interested in harming Joe Biden. Trump is as big a crook as can be imagined. When he speaks, you hear mob boss language. The sooner he is removed from office the better. And now we know Pense was involved. President Pelosi anyone? (I'm only half kidding. The whole administration is corrupt. But do the Republicans in the Senate care? Apparently not.)
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@SC Reminds me of the first weeks of Trump in office (was it really only 3 years ago??) when he told the President of Mexico in a phone call that Mexico really didn't have to fund the border wall - only announce that it intended to. We have a showman in the office. Nothing more. And a very shallow one at that.
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Pelosi might be the best possible choice for the next president. She could only stand for one term (she is too old to endure more) and the Republican base would be so enraged over her administration that they would overwhelmingly support the next Republican to run no matter who he is. The Republicans would have a chance to be out of the spot light long enough for the base to forget that they are Russia loving traitors and the Democrats get thrown a bone just long enough for them to disappoint once again.
Everybody wins.
Small point, but the D’s need to remind everyone how long it took to learn who Deep Throat was. Might help underscore idiocy of the Republican mantra that the investigation absolutely requires ID of the Whistleblower. But people are a lot dumber nowadays than they were back then, so who knows if it would help all that much to have that pointed out?
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Republicans want very badly to call the whistleblower... knowing full well that he/she would provide complete and powerful testimony indicting Trump’s behavior. So they care not a whit about what this person has to say, they only want to put a real target on the WB’s back. If not illegal, that is despicable.
Should this brave person be outed and become a victim, it’s quite clear on whose hands the blood would be.
BTw, everything in the WB report has been corroborated
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@RMF
It’s not just that people are dumber, but we have a significant portion of the population who only gets their “news” from dubious sources like Fox News, Breitbart, Rush Limbaugh, etc., that function like a state sponsored propaganda machine. The country is so divided, in large part, because there are two alternative realities out there and no more commonly accepted single source of facts, like network news used to be. Nixon would have served out his full term if he had the same type of propaganda machine backing him up.
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"Who would have imagined it was this easy to completely flip the beliefs of the Republican Party!?"
Is anyone surprised? this is 40 years in the making. The lipstick is off the pig and you see naked, raw, no compromise power in a Party that has no morals, no scruples.
bring us together? not in this life.
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It’s really America’s “Gordon’s problem” So-called “brilliant Meritocrats” have gamed our institutions, like “Ambassador Sondland” or the stock market, and have been able to get away with insider trading and algorithmic market manipulation and other crimes. I.e. the Sacklers. It’s not so much brilliance that’s made them billionaires as fraudulent behavior. Enough!
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Sondland made his money in hotels, not arbitrage. Rail against insider trading, but that is not the problem here.
Talk about buyer's and seller's remorse. Sondland bought himself an ambassadorship and then turned on the man who sold it to him.
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According to Trump what you hear, see, and read is not real. What there has been to read and now to hear adds to the monstrous lies, that is at the real core of Trumpworld.
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Chris Wallace of Fox News, of all people, may have had the best line on "Trump's Gordon Problem."
Wallace said, ""To a certain degree, he [Gordon Sondland] took out the bus and he ran over President Trump, Vice President Pence, Mike Pompeo, John Bolton, Rudy Giuliani, Mick Mulvaney -- he implicates all of them."
About sums it up.
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@RK So my question is, can they all be impeached or fired along with Trump?
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Keep in mind that Sondland was just fine with Trump extorting Ukraine until he got caught.
All the President's men, indeed.
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@Josh Wilson : He could have quit. He said yesterday that he and the 3 Amigos had no choice but to do the president's bidding because they wanted to support Ukraine. But he and the other two did have a choice. They could have quit and noisily quit, they could have come together and gone public and then quit.
But they all chose to play Trump's illegal, immoral, un-American game. Until they got caught.
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And Putin is loving every minute. His grand masterpiece.
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@Paul Can't wait for the book. Putin will millions for it.
@Paul : Putin made a statement yesterday that it was Ukraine, not Russia, that interfered in our 2016 election.
Unbelievable. We have a traitor in the White House. His enablers know it and they continue to support him. His cult fans will support him til the end of time. We must hope that an overwhelming number of voters will support his ouster at the ballot box and we can begin to recover our democracy.
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@Paul yes of course. He released the golden apple of eros (sic) on the US...chaos ensues..
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I spent today visiting the Clinton Library in Little Rock. It’s a wonderful facility. I’ve also been to the Eisenhower and FDR libraries. In every instance I’ve left feeling inspired. Sure, each was imperfect, but each loved America and left the country better than it was when their presidencies began.
What lessons could a Trump library possibly hold for future generations?
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@Gimme Twitter will not exist in time. What else could be in the library except notes written solely in upper case as if for a low grade level of reading? A Trump Library experience for future generations will be like us now looking at 8-track cassettes, that is, as dated and unusable artifacts.
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@Gimme Shelter: Oh, there are so many possible lessons that could be learned through the tweets and documents of the Trump administration! Let's start with the following well-known phrases (biblical and otherwise):
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."
"Honesty is the best policy."
"Pride goeth before a fall."
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@Gimme Shelter: Trump's library would be a little wooden box on a pole outside of one of his golf courses, a free library where no one every checks out a book.
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Once again it's all roads lead to Putin when it comes to Trump. The extortion of Ukraine and the hold up in funds benefited Russia and also served to put Ukraine on notice that you either do what Trump wants or he will defer to Vladimir.
The transcript I want to see are all the calls Trump has made to Putin locked down in a super secret server why? What is in theses calls that requires this procedure to be followed?
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The Republicans' outrageous, behavior in these hearings brings to mind, not Watergate, but Sen. Joseph McCarthy's persecutory anti-Communist hearings, which should be a lesson to Reps. Nunes and Jordan: "As an amazed television audience looked on, Welch [attorney for US Army, whose legal associates McCarthy accused of Communist ties] responded with the immortal lines that ended McCarthy's career: "Until this moment, Senator, I think I never really gauged your cruelty or your recklessness." When McCarthy tried to continue his attack, Welch angrily interrupted, "Let us not assassinate this lad further, senator. You have done enough. Have you no sense of decency?" Overnight, McCarthy's immense national popularity evaporated. Censured by his Senate colleagues, ostracized by his party, and ignored by the press, McCarthy died three years later, 48 years old and a broken man."
We should be so lucky. And back then, unlike now, majority of Republicans, lawmakers and supporters, actually had decency.
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It was still possible to shame a political hack back then. Today we live in an alternative universe of state propaganda lies where no such information can be disseminated. So there is no shame, only social media viral comments. We are in the post information, post logic age. The Republican base are reliable robots who can be made to dance to any tune. It is worth considering how this system of national brain washing and propaganda could be legal and how a democratic country could have voted away its ability to think.
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Adam Schiff's closing statement after Sondland's testimony gave me chills. He is so right. It was interesting how the GOP witnesses, Morrison and Volker, tried to thread the needle and distance themselves, "trying to help Zelensky" "Not a three amigo". Hope their plight inspired others with knowledge of the other horrific crimes no doubt taking place to come forward.
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