Finding a churro lady in the subway makes me so happy I can almost overlook dirty trains, crowded platforms and rude passengers. I love their entrepreneurial spirit and I love delicious churros. Maybe the police could spend their time catching pickpockets, flashers and other creeps. Churro ladies are just low hanging fruit that fill up the arrest quota.
46
I know I'm supposed to feel sympathy for this woman, but I'm a health inspector, and I've worked on foodborne illness outbreaks.
The problem is the process, which is supposed to keep people safe, but which has become a political game, encouraging unsafe practices. The rules for keeping people safe are now the same rules endangering them.
I don't know that I agree with the gender slant of this article, although, women are typically the people who start cottage food industries to supplement income. I'm surprised the domestic violence people haven't jumped on the bandwagon, as these businesses tend to be one way women gain economic independence. But, men and women have cottage food industries.
While I agree with changing the process, and hope the Times doesn't move on to another "hot topic" and forget the issue, I don't condone the continued sale of uninspected food. Illegal drugs kill, and food can kill. There aren't good statistics for foodborne illnesses, however, unless it becomes very large. THe technical definition is two or more people made ill from consuming the same food.
People think of food as benign, because they eat every day, and have occasionally consumed something expired with no repercussions. Such thinking is a mistake.
Change the process. Hire more people to conduct inspections, which I think should be done quarterly. But, do not stop enforcement.
52
It's against the law
This is 10 citations later.
With the food recalls for listeria and salmonella in the news on a monthly basis I would be hard pressed to eat unregulated subway food.
41
@kate
Agree with comment regarding food safety.
But so far as being unregulated, I've seen some very unhygienic things from regulated carts too.
14
In Yogi Berra's words, this is Deja Vu all over again. $200 licenses renting for $25,000 each? This is a replay of the taxi medallion issue: artificially limit the number of licenses or medallions tp way below the true demand, so that predatory middlemen get into the game, investing in licenses as financial assets (read Emily Badger's superb article on medallions at https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/06/20/taxi-medallions-have-been-the-best-investment-in-america-for-years-now-uber-may-be-changing-that/). Meanwhile, otherwise honest people (like the gypsy cab drivers around 125th street) are forced to break these unjust "laws", whose only purpose is to benefit a few.
24
Shouldn't there be laws against those leasing their permits for more than the $200 cost of the permit? Issuing more permits would only enable those quick to get the new permits to lease them again for exorbitant amounts of money.
14
@Zoned Leasing them should be illegal, but the way around such a regulation would to establish a silent partnership, much like cow shares for people convinced raw milk cures everything from acne to cancer. Still, the legal recording of a partnership would allow better tracking of who is actually preparing the food and the conditions under which it is prepared.
2
How is this a news story? Everyday, violators of health and consumer laws are given warnings and/or summons. Stop making cops the bad guy. Save your vitriol for this mayor and his unqualified wife. Get back a few million from ThriveNYC and put it to good use. If I misused the millions his wife has already, I'd be in prison. You get what you vote for. Incompetence.
40
For those commenters that decry the use of 4 officers to detain a middle aged female street vendor, you are ignoring the public safety necessity of this type of policing. The disproportionate display of strength saves lives and reduces arrests by establishing officer control of any questioning, detention and/or arrest process.
In short, the more police, the less likely that a situation escalates.'No escalation' is almost always the best outcome. Suspects are less likely to run, resist, or attack an officer. They are less likely to face additional charges. Bystanders who question police action are less likely to physically interfere with the officers' duties. Officers are less likely to feel threatened and are thus less likely to draw their weapons. And there are no split second decisions that can go really wrong really fast.
34
I went to my regular diner today and asked "What is a churro?" No one who worked there knew. What are they. Do media assume everyone knows about obscure foreign foods?
7
@Andy Martin just because you don't know about something doesn't make it an "obscure foreign food". I can remember churros being sold in my school cafeteria back in the 90s (and I lived in a mostly white suburb with no substantial foreign-born population), and at dozens of county fairs and sporting events. A quick google search to confirm my memory of having these as a child shows that churros have been sold at Disneyland (a pretty American place) since 1985.
I mean, even if you haven't eaten an actual churro, churro flavored stuff is popular too-- Ihop has had churro flavored pancakes, and I've seen churro flavored cereal in the grocery store.
37
I love to see the churros vendors in the subway. I don't eat them but I'm going to start. Next time I see one of those lovely ladies in the train station, I will buy a bunch. Even if just give them away. The vendors are resourceful, enterprising, and I never before knew how brave.
19
Their carts impede the flow of crowds.
32
My biggest concern with street vendors is food sanitation. If the Department of Health cannot regulate food preparation standards, we leave ourselves open to food-borne illnesses.
Personally, I avoid food vendor carts for this reason. Think about it: where are they washing their hands? Where is the cold storage? If the meat has been on the grill for over what period of time, is it discarded or mixed in with newer supply?
Add the subways, where I won't even open a candy bar or water bottle, the last thing I would do is buy unwrapped food sold off the top of a granny cart. Potentially dodgy preparation mixed with a vendor not wearing gloves and dirt blown up from the tracks: NOT appetizing!!!
44
The woman continually broke the law. The City is becoming inundated with food carts and now shopping carts as with this individual.Of course,the restaurants are Graded for sanitary conditions these other vendors aren’t.
Our Mayor and most of the City Council are in favor of lack enforcement of Quality of Life issues.
Forget Second Hand cigarette smoke the bigger threat is Second Hand Marijuana smoke!
Homeless folks are left on the streets and Public Urination is common place.
And lastly, bike riders are out of control as they ignore even the most basic traffic rules.
41
Stop feeling pity for these illegal vendors, who pay no taxes or fees for hawking their products, while ignoring summons after summons demanding that they cease and desist. They should be rounded up, prosecuted and fined, just as the illegal vendors who line the streets and avenues of Manhattan should. They likewise pay no taxes, while stealing business from legitimate storefront business owners. Whatever happened to the rule of law? de Blasio happened, that's what.
49
Is there any limit to the laws we can ignore under the guise of ‘disparate impact’ or ‘systemic racism’ or ‘policing poverty’?
Respect for the law = respect for each other
38
A perfect example of government aiding illegal enterprise, criminal enterprise that is.
9
no one is forcing anyone to eat food from anyone/anywhere. What is appalling about this situation is the amount of police that surrounded this woman for selling burritos in a subway station and placing her in handcuffs. Yes, against the law. However, there is so much related to our social constructs of the day in this picture: Immigration, policing, permits, inequality of who gets what. The Police dept mishandled this situation. Thankfully, they did not escalate into tasing or more physical abuse.
9
@p fenty , churros, not burritos.
7
Others have already pointed out the various types of licenses to sell in public spaces, especially the ones issued to Veterans that are not bound to a fixed location. That entire system certainly deserves more than one critical look, and possibly reform. A clear guidance on how licenses to sell food is of special importance, as food-borne illnesses are very real. The ability to instruct and then enforce proper hygienic preparation and handling of food for immediate consumption is key here.
@NYTimes, I would love to see a follow-up article on this subject, maybe with some of these questions - what's the incidence of street food-related illnesses - answered by the City's department of Health and other experts. Thanks!
8
Just make the $200 permit non-transferrable. You get a permit, YOU use the permit. No profiteering.
17
Yet another story related to food vending permits. I am likely the one person who has the longest involvement in the street food vending business in NYC. I literally grew up in it as my father Ed Beller & his partner Marc Monies produced probably the first stainless steel hot dog carts and food trucks here in NYC . The NY Times has written articles about them and the NY Public Library had their history as part of an exhibit called Lunch Hour NY. I am still involved in the manufacture of carts trucks etc with Worksman Cycles and have testified in front of City Council multiple times since the 1980's advocating for changes to make permit availability more equitable, as well as making the equipment inspection process more transparent. What I have found is, as is so often in things political, that there is a lot of conversation by politicians and others who are vested with power and influence by virtue of economics; but in the end very little changes and if it does; usually it is not in the interest of those who are not empowered.
The non-transferability of the food vending permit has always been. They were not intended to be like taxi medallions. They were; and continue to be non transferable, not leasable. They were intended as a vehicle for the recent immigrant or other persons of limited means, who had an entrepreneurial spirit, to start a business and gain a foothold in the capitalist system here in NYC. Perhaps one day this will again be the case, but I doubt it.
20
@Jack b As you well know this is not something new. Many years ago I watched a policeman push a hot dog cart along Houston Street. He had to push the cart, but he could not sell a hot dog. Someone called out for one. Our policeman should not look embarrassed or be demeaned. NYPD should not have to do this. Steps should be taken to resolve the situation. As you said it should work as intended not as what it has become.
The headline is misleading, and omits key facts. This is not another case of police brutality!
The woman was handcuffed and escorted out
after repeatedly ignoring prior warnings that selling anything inside any subway station or train is illegal, and, on the day this happened, refusing to leave and accept a citation.
Now, I am all for demanding proper conduct by police officers, but that is exactly what happened here - they enforced the law after repeatedly warning the vendor. The question of whether anyone should be allowed to sell their wares in tight, crowded public spaces like subway stations and trains is a different matter entirely.
44
@Pete in Downtown Thank you. And the reason for an overwhelming police presence on even the smallest of little crimes is the need for witnesses to the police officer's behavior, and crowd control, thanks to an overly sensitive public armed with cameras.
16
This is a scam similar to the taxi medallion bubble. The city should crack down on license permit holders who illegally rent them to poor immigrants. It should also issue a greatly expanded number of food vending permits at low cost so these people can make an honest living.
25
Corrupt politicians and corrupt city workers (and some cops) are the cause for what amounts to unlawful detentions and the elimination of a free market where there is high demand. End the corruption and the problem is mostly solved. Even those with vending permits sell food that is bad and filled with pathogens.
2
We should not sell food in the subways which are messy enough BUT more women and minorities should have access to permits for modest prices and let them sell on the streets. BTW, it’s very risky to eat some food like mangos that are uncooked but that’s up to you.
15
How does the Times have space for this article in search of a story? The vendor broke the rules ; no one is allowed to vend in the subway. When confronted by the police, she refused to leave. She was arrested. That’s how it should work. This has nothing to do with immigrant status, gender, or anything other than a person breaking the law. Bravo to NYPD for doing their jobs.
65
I know what she did is illegal, I know the cops are just doing their job, but the extra police presence is to make the subway safer (and catch fare cheaters). Couldn't they just give her a ticket and move on? Over policing just feels oppressive.
7
She wouldn’t accept the ticket and move on.
19
I understand the vendors want to make money. It can be a fast and affordable way to grab something to eat on the run but all I can think of are the health hazards and what type of conditions the food was prepared under?? Someone’s dirty kitchen? No one washing their hand? That is what turns me off. I feel sorry for the woman involved. She is just trying to earn some money but unfortunately she is not following the law. Nevertheless the cops could be nicer about it.
10
Just a hunch, but my every instinct tells me that most illegal food vendors are also illegal immigrants. Which means that making licenses more readily available would not change their modus operandi.
14
How is this story getting so much attention from the press? What she was doing is considered illegal. Don’t like it, change the law. And all the reporters and media covering this story, please go to your local schools and report on the horrific meals served our children and the waste associated with it. Do some real investigating for a change.
31
She was told numerous times to leave by NYPD officers in English and Spanish and she refused to comply with a lawful order from a police officer. Police Officer’s don’t make up the law they enforce it. The USSC has stated in numerous cases no citizen has the right to resist arrest from a police officer. People need to stop blaming police officers for laws they enforce. If they don’t like the laws elect new politicians and get involved in local politics.
55
I find it interesting that nowhere in this article did it mention that the station was way to congested for her to sell her "wares" there, or that she was told on 10 separate occasions not to sell them at this location.
Blaming the police has become the "go to" solution in our society.
Just a question: what would happen if we had no laws. just a
"free for all"?
How about , for a change, we blame politicians like AOC who suggests it is always the police who are at fault.
Where is the outrage there?
38
The solution to the black market seems simple to me. Surely the licenses were applied for under a name, and have expiration/renewal dates. With only 2500 or so vendors, the city or police could verify in a matter of weeks, in person, that the license name matched the id of the cart owner. If not, the license is revoked, thereby freeing up a license for a waiting vendor. The fact that some paid outrageous amounts to lease a license is too bad but irrelevant. It is illegal to transfer, and thus fraudulent to use. If such black-market licenses were checked and revoked, the black market would quickly disappear. Of course people could create false id’s. But going forward, if you had photo-id licenses that renewed in person every year, it seems that most of the problem would be solved (after increasing access to licenses generally).
5
What's male dominated have to do with this arrest? I don't want unlicensed vendors pushing food on me during my commute and apparently neither does the city. For once we are in agreement.
29
Ain’t freedom wonderful? All we have to do is regulate it—and we get what we’ve got now.
Sure, we need food and subway platforms to be safe. We need a lot of other things to be safe, too. And not just chalupas and tacos.
But somehow laws and the policing of laws don’t seem to be the answer.
2
Sounds like the city government created the problem and it is its responsibility to fix it.
3
One can’t even get on the wait list because the city is not accepting anyone to be put on it. I tried twenty five years ago, I gave up. Yet, in midtown Manhattan I see food vendors with mostly Halal carts selling under licenses which are not under their names. The food vending license permit process is extremely corrupted, under the table cash paid to move up the waitlist. It’s been that way for at least twenty five years since I first attempted to get a food permit.
17
She broke the law and had been warned many times. If people are frustrated by her situation, they should be lobbying for systemic changes in the laws to make them equitable for all, not blaming police for enforcing them.
38
If she was smart, she would get in line at Popeyes before they open & resell the chicken sandwiches in front of the store for a few bucks more. They even taste great cold!
2
If you are male and not understanding why there are more obstacles faced by female vendors – how about a vending cart weighs 2400 to 3000 lbs? How about carts cost $18-$30k to build? How about business loans aren’t being offered? How about women vendors don’t have a network for the underground market permits and if they did it costs $25k anyway instead of the city fee of $200? How about women vendors aren’t invited in to the Commissary? How about women vendors aren’t recruited by the city for the waitlists for new permits? How about women – many of whom have no bank account – are fined disproportionately and spend hours dealing with resolving those tickets? How about women need flexibility because they are responsible for a family and taking care of them when they are sick and after school and for appointments, etc. Why is there respect for your mother but none for women in general? Just bite your tongue a minute and think from someone else’s perspective – to all the troll haters. Next time you eat a home-cooked meal that you made – think all that went into it. Oh, maybe you never made a meal for yourself before? Try it. Respect.
30
These sound like things someone who doesn’t want to work would say. The business world doesn’t “invite” you to participate or come to your home with coffee to offer you a loan.
9
@Steve Try being a woman - study the topic. There is a country club out there - and if you aren't in the network you aren't 'invited to the table' as Shirley Chisolm famously said - “If they don't give you a seat at the table, bring a folding chair.” That is what I do all day long in my architecture office - as a woman-owned small firm - the city doesn't seek me out, the developers and the banks with loans don't seek me out - I have to fight every day for a piece of business. That is what these women are doing. Show respect.
You have always been invited to the table, sir.
18
Street vendors provide a service that we all appreciate – affordable food for people on the go.
Why would the City allow such a corrupt underground street vending market? It is the City’s inability to do anything about it that has caused this mess. There is a ton of innovative and creative ways to handle this. It is not ‘so complicated’ that you can’t do anything. No, you need to do something. The fact is the status quo is not safe. It is not fair. It is not equitable. I see instead that it is the restaurant, hotel, and grocery store lobbyist city - eh? And that is really a shame because their building footprints are WAY more carbon polluting compared to the Halal Guy’s char broiler grille that they like to complain about. We all have a role to improve ourselves so that the city can be a better place. But scapegoating one group who has less power than you do is not a way for a just society to behave. A creative, problem-solving government with clever and motivated staff would solve this through dialogue and action.
There is an enforcement provision in the Intro 1116 bill plus vendors already do face enforcement by Dept of Health, Dept of Sanitation and NYPD. There is plenty of it. Creative design solutions needed just as DOT did for bike lines. We have room in our public spaces – DOT has control over 27% of the land of the city – we can design some great areas for street vendors. We can all be here and thrive.
26
His can a $200 permit rent for $25K without the city knowing full well the system is corrupt?
3
Anyone can empathize with this story and to believe that women are not disproportionately arrested is disingenuous. But there is an overarching problem not being addressed putting aside the empathy most have for the woman described.
Lifting the number of permits, dramatically, is absurd if not coupled with enforcement mechanisms that are rational. The NYPD simply cannot enforce vending regulations. There are too many. Too detailed. Not important enough.
Every vendor should have a designated spot that is legal and NOT on the sidewalk, which is intended for pedestrians but rather in a protected parking spot. And the spot should be marked with their vendor number which is on their license which has a picture just like my drivers license. No more than one vendor per intersection. Simple enforcement. NYPD checks your license number, it matches the number on the street (plaque) your face matches the picture on the license and you are legal. If not, goodbye. No black market.
Frankly I think we can do better for our veterans (and immigrants) than “thank you for all you did for us...welcome home you can go hawk scarves on the corner in the rain, snow, heat , cold. How about regulating the system and doing something decent for veterans. And, get vendors off sidewalks into parking spots (customers can line up on sidewalk). Sidewalks are for pedestrians. There are so many permitted uses on our sidewalks that the congestion is untenable.
19
I pity these women They are probably sending money back to their impoverished families.
2
If they are illegal, can they hopefully be deported?
15
Some might say it goes from churro ladies to squeegee guys, three card monte dealers, and guys selling loose joints.
16
@Observer In all likelihood marijuana will be legalized in New York state in the next generation. I'm so tired of the claim that if we don't over police our citizens, we will fall back into the 70's. Not only is that impossible due to technological and social advances, but our finances are nothing like they were 50 years ago. This kind of speaking only stands to stir up the conservative outliers who blindly support the police no matter what. We can do better than arresting non violent offenders. We need less police interactions not more.
2
I think it naive to think that we have “advanced” to the point where we are immune from social decay cycles. Broken window is a real thing. If public spaces become unpleasant, people will avoid them. People who stay home (or just go to-from work) don’t buy things. Stores suffer and close. The cycle gets worse. The reason NYC is a nice place is because it puts controls on public behavior.
14
@Steve and we do that by choking unarmed men to death, arresting churro vendors, pulling guns on unarmed teens on crowded trains, and harassing people who close their eyes on a subway bench? Is that what you’re telling me?
2
I've always wondered where these food handlers relieve themselves and wash their hands.
37
I live next door to illegal venders. The food is prepared in their basement apartment and we have a rat problem.
23
@Jane S I always recall the news item where a busy hot dog cart operator was caught by inspectors using a bottle under his apron while serving with his other hand.
6
She had several warrants, failed to pay fines and disregarded the police warnings. How long is anyone allowed to thumb their noses at the police, unpaid fines and warrants then be allowed to conduct an illegal business. I am no fan of the police and as as a ADOS/Black man I am their target but in this case they are correct. If you don't like the laws elect folks to change them, don't violate them then claim to be a victim.
92
So then, the liberals in New York City are upset that the police were enforcing local city law, department of health regulation no less... that the liberals themselves created? When does the hypocrisy become apparent? No wait, it wasnt that they enforced the law, it was how they enforced it, because the perpetrator became upset in the process. And was released, despite having two warrants, with another summons that she would otherwise ignore. But, if she were pushed off the platform along with her cart during rush hour, or poisoned someone with a bad batch of sweet candy, the liberals would be first to jump onto the scene, point fingers at authorities, and yell for more more more regulations.
40
So typical. The legislative branch of government (the politicians) has failed to address the obvious shortcomings of the antiquated laws governing food vendors.
So who are the bad guys in this story?
Is it the politicians who have failed to address the core problems with the food vendor laws????
Naahhhh......let's make the bad guys the police.
10
I understand she did not have a permit and was a repeat offender. At some point the law needs to be enforced, no? And another thing: Her gender has nothing to do with this, let's not throw the gender card every chance we get.
75
You can have sympathy for someone trying to earn a living however in this case they do not have a permit, have not applied for one, and were in a place where any vending is prohibited.
No mention was made on whether or not they have paid previous fines. How DOES the City deal with unpaid fines? What is the total amount of uncollected fines leveled on food vendors?
No mention was made on where the food being sold was produced. Is she making it at home or buying it from another? Did the kitchen used meet health code standards? How could you know if you were a consumer?
It seems that there are issues with legal permits. No 'leasing' or renting of permits should be allowed. Why not computerize those records allowing easy enforcement?
As for legalizing all street vendors.... more competition means lower earnings plus all the existing problems.
29
And more competition should mean lower prices to eat for all the low earning workers who get by on street food because they have not the time or the budget to sit in a decent Manhattan or Brooklyn eatery.
NYT is all over the place with this column. Food sellers, licensed or not, cannot sell their food in subway stations. It sounds as though one or both of these women were warned repeatedly about breaking the law and they chose to ignore those warnings. The police were correct in arresting them.
The conversation about raising the ceiling on the number of available permits and whether the permit world is dominated by men is a topic for another column(s).
59
@Lynn in DC I agree, it seems the emphasis of women vendors is a force-fed component of the article, highlighted by the mentioned study of 50 individuals, which seems like a blip on the vast street-cart-scape of NYC. They are more vulnerable, arguably, and that's where a study could have been more interesting. That said, we would be have then been then left talking about street crime, which the NYT has been careful to leave to other tabloids. A mention of crime might compromise the idea that we're over-policing, which is a critical tenet of today's Progressive Left.
So what happen is the topic turns to a VERY un-Progressive topic of de-regulation, and allowing more permits and vendors.
It's a headspin of moral tenets espoused here in this concerned piece. Do we help illegal immigrants just trying to survive? Do we keep the subway orderly? Do we cease giving tickets, and de-regulate in the style of a right-wing talking point? What, there's a backlog of permit applications? My, I'm shocked! There's no backlog for any other application process of the many that exist here, from housing to for-hire vehicles. I would need a permit to cut a tree on my property, remove a beehive, move my bathroom, open a coffeeshop or turn a bathtub into a shower stall. And perhaps for the best, right?
Everything here requires a permit, and suddenly it's touching a nerve only now.
23
The law is the law and regulations need to be obeyed. And who wants to consume food that is prepared God only knows where? And by whom? Especially churros which are deep fried! The subway stations are crowded and dirty, and between the beggars, homeless and pole dancers, New York is beginning to have a Third World patina about it. Sorry, but we can’t allow a free for all. And I think increasing police on the subway is very appropriate.
51
Really who wants to eat from an open cart in the subway?
57
As DeBlasio has recognized, she had numerous previous summonses for the same offense. Enough is enough.
65
OH PLEASE this is New York!! When have we NOT had street vendors? Beyond being somewhat of an insurance against worst practices and a revenue stream for the city and state, there is no reason to pick on these women!!!!
2
She wasn’t on the street; she was on a subway platform. Also, street vendors have licenses and she had none. Read the story!
21
These folks are making an honest living selling food, churros. They are not selling heroin, cocaine or fentanyl.
5
She was breaking the law and refused to leave. It wasn’t her first offense. Enough.
25
The last place we need more people, particularly if they aren't going through food quality checks and health department permitting is in the subway. Why shouldn't a churro vendor be held to the same standards as someone who wants to hawk cronuts in a storefront? Oh, that's right, the former aren't white or Asian so the NYT doesn't think any standards should apply to them...
39
I’ve seen this lady many times. She never bothered anyone. How about cracking down on aggressive, belligerent panhandlers who curse out everyone who doesn’t give them money???
6
It is not a binary choice. Why not arrest murderers and not rapists ?
4
Of course, the inflammatory headline says it all: "Arrested for Selling Churros."
The Times does have its favorites, and they're not people who need to get from point A to point B without being subject to loud radios, flying feet, tired churros on crowded platforms, and noxious panhandlers and bi-polar types.
21
I would like to know why the heckler was allowed to obstruct justice by questioning the police officer who was simply following orders in the arrest of the vendor who was warned several times prior to this altercation. Citizens should butt out when an officer is doing his duty -- tears not withstanding.
29
In my Manhattan neighborhood, where I live and do all of my shopping, there is only one salesperson who knows my and my children's names: A pushcart vendor.
3
Look at those classic pictures of the Lower East Side around 1900. Pushcarts all over the place, and it was chaos. Mayor LaGuardia brought some order to the situation by placing restrictions on the vendors. For those who want no limits, how would they feel about 5 people selling food, etc. outside their house? Probably not very supportive then. Will the vendors pay taxes? Get a letter grade from the NYC Health Dept.? I doubt it. Streets are crowded enough. More vendors will just make things worse.
24
The subway platform at Lexington Avenue and 59th Street, on the lower level where the N and R trains, gets so crowded after 4pm that two MTA employees stand directing riders who try to come down the stairs from the downtown 6 above. In some places, the width of the platform between the tracks and a staircase base structure is about 3 feet! If everyone is polite and mindful, an accident can be avoided. But right there is a small women with a large shopping cart selling churros. I find it infuriating. No comment on this case, but the prohibition of vendors on subway platforms is essential!
80
In 1991, the State Legislature voted to limit the ability of disabled veterans to obtain street vendor permits but only in NYC because the Fifth Avenue Association with the concurrence of the NYPD successfully lobbied all four caucuses in the Legislature (R & D in the Senate and R & D in the Assembly) to vote in favor of the restrictions. The veterans associations were opposed to the change and actively lobbied legislators against it but lost. There would have been no need for the change but police were administratively incapable and disinterested in enforcing the existing regulations. The Fifth Avenue merchants mostly objected to the visual clutter, though they claimed competition from the pushcart and card table vendors, which was nonsense.
Now, once again, the real problem is the City's incompetence and lethargy in enforcing existing health and safety regulation, and the City's unwillingness to do the research to establish a fair and realistic number of permits. This would include the lethargic City Council, which having granted themselves a big raise a few years ago, does no more effective work than it ever did. The City should establish and enforce a strict ban on the black market in permits and lift the permits from any vendor engaging in the "rental" of permits. Is that so hard for a $90 billion government? Well, apparently it is...!
4
If you don’t want to be detained, don’t break the law. If you don’t want to be arrested, don’t break the law on a regular basis after being told by the police to stop doing it.
103
It is very simple if we are to be a city of law and order people have to comply with orders of the police. A "harmless" churro vendor or not, if she operates without a license it is a public safety issue and when asked to stop she can comply or risk being handcuffed that is SOP for anyone - she had a choice, we all do. Law or chaos, pick one.
73
Maybe the press should refrain from blaming law enforcement and encouraging illegal behavior. The woman was warned multiple times and given ample opportunity to cease her illegal activities. Yet she persisted. Defending the innocent from a corrupt system is brave, but such is not the case here.
86
Sidewalk capacity in a city like New York is a public safety issue. It could be that there are too many vendors, not too few. Since the 80s, residential and commercial development in the denser parts of NYC have increased pedestrian traffic dramatically. That makes them better locations for street vending, but also more constricted and less efficient in moving people around. It's a tradeoff, but I don't think it will be improved with more vendors. I think spqrxxi's comment below is instructive.
24
It seems that the reporter is conflating two rather distinct issues. On the one hand, there are the systemic issues and subsequent inequities regarding vending permits and licenses in NYC, which would appear to impact a disproportionate number of immigrants and women.
On the other hand, Ms. Morochoduchi has never applied for such permits/licenses. And even if she were in possession of such documents, she would have still been in violation of the MTA's prohibition of selling food in stations.
I might also add that, according to NYPD Detective Sophia Mason, Ms. Morochoduchi has been issued ten summonses in the last five months for unlicensed vending at the same station.
The primary issue is not that she is unlicensed; rather, the issue is that no one is allowed sell food in subway stations.
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I visit NYC regularly and buy an occasional hot dog from street vendors. What I wonder about food vendors, licensed and unlicensed, is where the Health Department (or whatever you call it in your neck of the woods) comes in. How do consumers know if the churros, etc. were made in sanitary kitchens? I'm guessing that you can't know. It's like the 19th century in NYC all over again.
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@Okie Sanitary kitchens. Aw, that's cute.
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@Okie
This is the reason I can't join the very trendy and hip "street food" craze. I like to know what I'm eating.
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@Okie And where do these vendors who handle food relieve themselves and where do they wash their hands afterward ?
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In the meantime Amazon uses the subway system to deliver its packages; I've run into delivery people pushing carts with packages in the subway quite a few times. Does Amazon have a permit, or pays for, the use of the subway system to deliver its packages?
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I bet their delivery people pay their fare.
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@Patagonia
Is it illegal to transport things on the subway?
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@Patagonia This is quite a strange conflation of narratives. Amazon uses the subway system? I've been taking the subway twice a day for 18 years, I don't think I've seen what you're suggesting. UPS guys with Amazon boxes? Are you sure those weren't people who'd picked up boxes at their offices and were hauling them home to their doorman-less buildings?
But Patagonia, you might be onto something. For one, I think you should consider applying to the NYT local beats desk. I'm sure you'd contribute strongly to the powerful reporting of narratives such as this conflation of sexism and permits, on a story about a permitless arrest. There's simply a shortage of people who can weave narratives from thin air in today's media landscape.
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It is time for the City to create a sensible system for street vending. It could be based on common principles.
1) The permit would be linked to a person and maybe one attendant, not be able to be resold or leased out to create rents out of arbitrage from the use of public space.
2) Pre-approved locations citywide should be designated, not the free for all we have now. A lottery system, as has been suggested in other comments, would make sense.
3) Commissaries make the big money in the system. Those should be licensed as well, and it should be clear where each cart "lives" at night.
4) The most prominent locations should have market-based rents assigned to them, to benefit the city, as is the case for Parks.
5) Renewal of ones' license should be based on rule compliance. The rules are not that hard. Many vendors simply choose to ignore them.
6) Standards for appearance should be setup: no more diesel generators, crazy strands of pictures of hot dogs, and a maximum size for carts. Carts are getting bigger every year as the City ignores the issue.
Disclaimer: I work for a Business Improvement District. BIDs are not opposed to street vending. We are opposed to chaotic behavior on the streets of the City.
25
The woman churro-seller whom everyone is so exercised about has never applied for a license, so I think your common-sense approach does not apply to her.
Subway stations are crowded enough without having to make room for food vendors when exiting trains or waiting on platforms. Reason enough, never mind hygiene, to get rid of those carts.
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@B. For those, who live from hand to mouth (pun intended), the permit and license fees are huge. The vendor likely didn't apply because she struggles to make ends meet. That's why I suggested a permit fee of, say, $5. The goal is to remove an obstacle to licensure. But until the City Council moguls take pity on those less fortunate...
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@Jay E. Simkin
It seems that those who use the subway agree that the vendors make a difficult situation impossible.
Rather than give a person in need permission to do something where they make limited money but also create an unsafe and unwanted situation, why not bypass the unwlecome safety violation and simply give them money?
5
Open up the permits and let them buy one from the city. Street vendors add charm to a city as long as they're not allowed to scream at passerby's.
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@Pamela G. The charm only goes so far. In busy tourist areas of Barcelona, vendors lay out blankets nearly edge to edge, impeding foot traffic and blocking entire sidewalks. And let's remember that they pay no taxes, and take business away from already stressed retailers.
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@Pamela G. I see zero charm in selling dirty looking food on the subway. And yes, those churros look dirty and smell like overused oil.My Spanish father (who made amazing churros) taught me to be more discerning in my churro choices.
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@Elizabeth A Similar in Bangkok.
4
First, there is a law in NY that permits disabled veterans to be permitted as street vendors without the restrictions/limitations/caps imposed on other applicants. The vast majority of veterans are males. So leaving that out of the analysis on how we got here is a miss.
Second, we should be wary of how any addition to permits is carried out or you'll wind up with even worse sidewalk congestion in the most heavily trafficked/touristed areas of the city. Even if the system needs reform, the market also needs regulation for simple quality of life reasons.
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@Peter Thank you-- I added the information about the disabled veterans, who can sell food without restriction around the perimeter of city parks. Sharon
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@Peter Thank you for your informative comment about veterans being exempt from the permit requirements! I'm not a veteran, but am deeply appreciative of those, who have gone in harm's way.
2
Let me get this straight: a permit costs $25,000 whether the applicant is male or female. Therefore, according to this article, women work without one. Have to work without one? Only women? What's the sex of the vendor have to do with the permit process?
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@Ronald Weinstein
The permit does not cost $25,000; the permit costs $200, the license $50. But according to the article, there are no permits available, all 2,900 having been given out, and the waiting list for them, capped at 2,500, has been closed for 12 years. When there is such artificial scarcity, some permit owners realize they can make more by illegally leasing the permit for $25,000 than by actually using to vend.
But to answer your question about what the sex of the vendor has to do with it all: Old boy networks are not only for rich white men, or even rich men, period. Add to that clubbiness the desire to "protect" women vendors from harassment (as has been documented lately) by not letting them be out working on the street, rather than to stop the harassers. And the proven circumstance of women having less access to capital for starting a business, which means that fewer can even purchase the illegal lease. Lots of reasons the sex of the vendor matters.
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@Ronald Weinstein
"The issue is lightly researched, so it is impossible to know. On the lucrative, tourist-rich corners of Manhattan, mobile food vendors tend to be men. But in some immigrant neighborhoods, the majority of the sellers are women."
the author using her scientific method, smh.
5
Vending from a pushcart or a hand-carried-tray is hard work. Those, who seek to do this, usually have few alternatives. it is beyond cruel - it is barbaric - to arrest and to fine those, who want to earn an honest living,
Seizing Ms. Morochoduchi's push-cart was a cruelty that one would expect in Saddam Hussein's Iraq or Kim Jong-Eun's North Korea. Such cruelty is repulsive.
Rather, public authorities should embrace those, with so strong a work ethic, that they are willing to do this work. Thus, permits and licenses should be available for a nominal amount, e.g., $5 per year.
Let customers decide whether or not sanitation is adequate. As things stand, someone who paid $25,000 for a license - but who has active but undiagnosed tuberculosis - is a greater threat of public health, than is an unlicensed vendor, who is healthy.
As to vending in subway stations, if space allows, an area should be set aside. Those, who want a space in those areas, should submit their names or permit numbers. In a public drawing, names should be picked from a barrel. The winners get a six-month or one-year "lease", which is personal to them or their spouse/partner.
Many immigrants boot-strapped themselves by selling food or other things "on the street". We should respect those, who want to do this, and wish them every success.
The City Council should at once revise the relevant laws and issue regulations as a matter of urgency.
Finally, Ms. Morochoduchi's cart should be returned.
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@Jay E. Simkin
> Let customers decide whether or not sanitation is adequate.
Sounds great until you get food poisoning.
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@Jay E. Simkin
Read "The Jungle" by Upton Sinclair. A story of "letting the market decide."
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@Joe, I agree. There are some basic public health and safety regulations the government should make. Sanitation is one. Safe passage along subway platforms is another.
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I see this as bureaucratic overreach. The process needs to loosen up. People are just trying to make a buck and survive. This is a victimless crime. Plus, the churros taste great. C'mon, can we have a heart? Loosen up the process so the vendors can (a) be permitted with fees that are fair, and (b) pay their bills.
14
There are two separate issues here. One is the outdated system of vendor permits and the lack of enforcement of the no subleasing rule. Gradually increasing the number of permits is a start, but a crackdown on subleasing is needed, too.
The second issue is selling food in the subways. No way can this be allowed to become a thing. The platforms are already dirty, confusing and crowded. And vendors will congregate at the busiest stations, adding to overcrowding.
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@Elizabeth A
"Food" and drink are already sold in the subways, at news stands. It is totally nonnutritious snack food for the most part, and its packaging is part of the dirt and garbage that contributes to track fires. (And people bring food into the subway system to eat on platforms or trains while traveling. But that is indeed a separate issue.) Perhaps the MTA should ban the sales of junk food at news stands before the police arrest any other vendors.
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@Elizabeth A Should we disallow using the bathroom? Surely that's dirty, too. Yuck!
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@Suzanne F Only healthy churros, is that your idea?
8
Drawing the line at going after a woman selling churros without a license and permit seems to the extreme. I agree that illegal is illegal, but the increase in police force was to help curb meaningful crime - I doubt that included illegal food vending. Article indicates that permits have not increased since 1983 - what few things in New York have not increased in price or volume since 1983. Maybe there were too many permits issued in 1983? The city must keep up with the demand and allow people an opportunity at making a living albeit as difficult and meager as a small food cart in a subway stop.
3
I understand that arresting someone for selling churros in the subway seems harsh but at some point you have to draw the line and enforce the law. This article highlights a number of different issues for street vendors such as illegally leasing their permits and the fact that the cap has not been increased since the 80's so these things should be remedied, however permits are necessary and they need to be enforced otherwise we would be overrun with vendors and hawkers on the streets and subways.
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@William F It's not harsh at all. The permit system is in place for good reason. If buyers get sick from eating food from an unlicensed vendor, how are you going to track down the problem?
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@Ronald Weinstein
If vendors are subleasing their permits to others with cash under the table, how would the system help you know whose cart made you sick?
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@William F
An inconsistency? You seem to advocate increasing permits with your comment about the cap not being increased. Then you express concern about being overrun with vendors.
2