Denying Turkish Air permission to land at US airports, freezing Turkish accounts in US banks, locking Turkish corporations out of US stock markets, sponsoring a UN Security Council resolution condemning Turkey’s incursion into Syria— all these and more represent possible levels of pressure Trump could have used. But no, he is too busy tweeting.
92 civilian deaths have resulted so far from actions of Turkey and associated militias.
7
" we did everything short of a military confrontation to prevent it". Perhaps Morgan Ortagus could offer even one example? (Threatening economic sanctions days after the fact in no way counts as an action worth mentioning).
5
The world will come to peace only when the American public opinion and its coy manipulators will come senses on real-politics. Boy scout opinions of boyish sentiment does not make a resilient world peace.
4
@izmir tolga great comment!
1
History has faithfully, without frailer, betrayed Kurds. Their homeland was divided up by colonial powers after World War One. Since then, the Kurds have been cast in the role of the pawn in powerful countries’ games of chess. They do much of the hard work only to be sacrificed when checkmate is in sight. The Kurds found themselves in the vulnerable position they are now in, scattered across Turkey, Syria, Iran and Iraq. By moving U.S. troops in Syria out of the way, Trump gave a green light for Turkish forces and their jihadist thuggish proxy army, to slaughter our only allies in Syria. Turkish invasion will lead to unstoppable war of annihilation. The truth is that, Trump has never shown restraint, self-control or loyalty to anything but his own self-enrichment, he has surrendered Syria to Putin and Erdogan. Now, Syrian Kurds are in a very precarious position, facing a reactionary jingoistic Turkey that would love to slaughter or ethnically cleanse them all. The cruelty of the Turkish atrocities will heap suffering on people who have already suffered enough.
2
So “on the ground” Roebuck wanted the US military to start a war with Turkey over Syria? I guess it’s safe to say he wasn’t “on the ground” with the small US military outposts there.
2
Bravo Mr. Roebuck!! As somebody with a huge knowledge of Middle East, and how Turkey is turning AWAY from Ataturk and becoming an Islamic-Terrorist state under Erdogan; me thinks that Trump is clueless, and buddying-up with Saudi and Turkish tyrants JUST BECAUSE he has a few luxury hotels in those countries. Yes, he is after $$$ for himself. And YES, I am a white, Christian, and I would still VOTE REPUBLICAN.
1
Mr Roebuck wants a ‘…. comprehensive political solution for Syria’. Since Mr Thump is a business person, whose offer to purchase Greenland was rebuffed by the Danish Crown, will now have a chance to sell Syria to Mr Netanyahu: a solution through dissolution.
2
Those shuffling ill-educated, narrow minded ideas concerning the geography, history, cultures, politics and economy of northern Syria need to do some more reading/researching.
The Arab population of northern Syria along the Turkish border was gradually displaced for "nation-building" purposes, for the past 50-60 years, based on premises of defunct 1920 Treaty of Sevres of 1920.
Treaty of Lausanne, that established modern borders of Turkey three years later, have not been accepted by adventureres and "nation-builders."
Nation-bulders, boys and girls, it is all over. Learn to live in peace and prosper!
1
The Protection of Oil, PoO, for the Syrian people? Why does a senior American Diplomat believe that the Syrian government in Damascus, or the Syrian Arab refugees returning home from Turkey should not exercise control over and benefit from Syrian Oil?
The Syrian Arabs will get ONLY poo, while America gets 100% benefit from the oil, and the Kurds will eventually get a just reward for their perfidy.
2
@Chaudri the peacenik: perfidy?
The historical, cultural and political complexity of the region is not understood by mosy Americans.
For those that are knowledgable, it is a region where MONEY talks. That is; current and future oil resources and shipment corridors will predominate. It will become a region for manipulation and bartering.
Very much similar to the post WW1 period of the Brits, French and Italians. Now it is USA's turn.
1
Madame Ortagus, the State Department spokesperson, speaks from both sides of her mouth. From one side she declines to comment, from the other sides she utters tirades against peaceful actions of the American administration. She seems to be asserting that Syrian refugees presently in Turkey returning to Syria are somehow jeopardizing American security and national interest. Such convoluted, nay bogus, logic would be beyond a person having an IQ above 70, i.e. above the level of a moron.
1
America has actively participated in the breakup of Muslim countries. The hiving-off of Timor-Leste from Indonesia, the breaking-off South Sudan from the Republic of Sudan. American intension with regard to Turkey, Iraq, Iran, and Pakistan are suspect.
Most nations and individuals are now convinced that America is a mercantile nation. No alliances and treaties are sacred; no help in the past rendered to America will lead even to present understanding of the other’s position if that position is perceived to be against transient American interest. This is how ‘freedom fries’ were created when France did not join an American mad-hatter project.
Poor Turkey, after shedding blood for American war in Korea, after 3 score, and some, years as the NATO front-line nation against the Soviet tanks, and bombers, now BEGS America to understand its position vis-à-vis the perfidious Kurds, hired by America in order to exercise hegemony over Muslim lands.
3
@Chaudri the peacenik great comment!
All readers with historical knowledge and familiarity of the region will appreciate your comment.
The USA needs to urgently review its policies, short-long term, to value proven alliances and develop and implement its military, economic and political policies, accordingly.
1
How charming of Mr Roebuck to say that Turkey should ‘bear the brunt of the costs for military operations’, while he wants the Kurds to fill their bellies with oil money; and pay their American masters the ‘protection fee’, as demanded. Conditions of Trade: Each cartridge will be SOLD to the Kurds for 10 barrels of Oil.
3
@Chaudri the peacenik...well summarized.
Money talks. It has nothing to to do with sovereignty, cultural rights and mutual rights.
1
The United States encouraged the Syrian Kurds to be its allies in the fight against ISIS. The Kurds were good allies, who not only fought ISIS, but also built a fledgling democracy in the Middle East. When this upset Turkey, the United States arranged to curb Turkey's fears of the Syrian Kurds (who are related to, but are not the same as, some Turkish Kurds, whom Turkey fears) by persuading them to dismantle Kurdish defenses along the Turkish border, in exchange for Turkey's not attacking them, with both sides accepting that the Syrian Kurds were under United States protection. When Edrogan then called Trump saying he would attack the Syrian Kurds no matter what the United States did, Trump needed to tell Edrogan to keep his end of the deal, and to assert that any attack on United States allies would be considered and attack against the United States. A call from the United States to NATO headquarters, explaining the awkward situation that Turkey threatened to attack its fellow NATO ally, so that the United States would soon be at war with Turkey, surely would have changed the situation. This would, of course, have forced the United States to fight back any Turkish incursion, which would have required increasing the number of U.S. troops in Syria, along with major air strikes; but, at least all of NATO would have been pressuring Turkey to withdraw, even if the other NATO nations had not come to the defense of the United States in its fight against a NATO ally that strayed.
2
Mr Roebuck's memo seems mere diplomat-speak re the largest cause of the Turkish invasion--Donald Trump's permission given in his infamous phone call to Erdogan just days prior. While the eventual withdrawal of US forces from Syria would have given the Turkish leader his moment of opportunity at a future date, "The Great Divider" Trump virtually gave his blessing to such an invasion and excused Erdogan from any real accountability.
We know how a diplomat still accountable to Trump makes such a basic error, but how does your reporting of this communique not address it? Even an unbiased non-opinion article like this one purports to be has to tell a more unvarnished truth.
The Syria policy debacle is in fact a Trump willed catastrophe against the advice of the top US military and administrative leadership. Such a treacherous policy reversal was simply conceived to facilitate the Russia backed Turkey military offensive against the Kurdish militia fighting the US war in Syria-Iraq against the ISIS. This was to appease Putin in hope of getting Russian support to win next presidency.
3
The article leaves out the important reason why Turkey intervened in Northern Syria: SDF is formed by YPG/PYD which are associated PKK, which is an entrenched Marxist terror group causing 40000 Turkish/Kurdish deaths over the decades. PKK is considered a terror group by the USA and Europe. Until a few years ago YPG/PYD was classified as such. In a total reversal by Obama in 2015 these groups which have been killing Turkish and Kurdish citizens and terrorizing the southern border of Turkey became SDF, the best allies (!) of the US. A shameful reversal of US policy. Now grabbing the oil of a sovereign country and continue protecting these terror groups the US is going into a worse quagmire. The US should leave Syria and save whatever honor and decency there is left in its alliance with NATO's
second-largest country Turkey.
4
@Oya Bain
Ever since the Iraq War based on CIA lies, and the hundreds of thousands, millions maimed and lives and country wrecked... and the the US did Libya and is still trying to do Syria...
The US has no honor or decency... just "national Interests"...
4
@Oya Bain great summary!
2
Mr Roebuck states clearly albeit in diplomatic terms the harm this administration has inflected on our country through their incompetent, ignorant President. The harm inflected by abandoning the Kurds adds to the diminishing of American opportunity to lead and influence in the international arena. The abandonment of the Kurds is a stark example of how this regime does not understand how trusted international relationships advance America's role in this world. This current administration cannot demonstrate their ability for healthy relationships in their private or public relationships, let alone those that involve their work serving the United States of America.
2
If the current administration can't deter Turkey, can you imagine how well we would handle Russia and Putin?
3
That Turks would commit genocide against our hard fighting allies, the Kurds, was obvious to everyone. But Trump cares about his business interests in Turkey more than he worries about an I.S. resurgence. Behind the Iraq War and its faulty intelligence, and behind our abandonment of the Kurds is the Electoral College, which takes the American presidency out of the majority vote. The E.C. has outlived its purpose.
5
And so has the USA
1
“It’s a tough call but probably not”. Guess the future will have all Presidents being publicly second guessed by employees of the government. This was an appropriate review written for internal consideration except nothing is kept inside any longer.
@Gailmd Perhaps if your hypothetical “future president” is too thin skinned to weather criticism or second guessing from the subject matter experts working for their various agencies, he/she shouldn’t be president. I’m pretty sure debate and dissent is only stifled in autocracies and dictatorships.
2
The Administrative State should have no public say in USA policy. We didn't elect them - we elected the President. The subversion is alarming.
1
@Cathy Alarming? No, it’s called debate, or dissenting opinion. It’s the type of measured criticism a subject matter expert is expected to give when assessing the fallout of policy actions. What’s alarming is the belief that men and women who have dedicated their lives to service to this country are being vilified as unpatriotic or some type of vast “deep state” conspiracy players for doing their jobs. Stifling dissent like you describe is what we expect in a dictatorship, not here.
3
For Trump, America’s relationship with the Syrian Kurds is purely transactional. He has no strategy on the whole, only keen on making headlines for the next moment, without thinking through the longer-term consequences of his actions.
He pointed out that the Kurds had been given a lot of money and equipment. But they had fought along side American forces, giving their lives – 11.000 had died – in helping the US fight ISIS. In recent weeks civilians were killed as a result of the Trump-Erdogan agreement, giving Turkey the greenlight to invade northeastern Syria, driving the Kurds out of their homeland.
The US has let the Kurds down before, but Trump’s sheer callousness has made it hard to imagine that they will forgive the US for this betrayal. It will certainly not be easily forgotten by the international community.
3
Once again, Trump acted for the benefit of our enemies, especially Putin.
Brave career officials like Mr. Roebuck, are pushing back on what Trump does. Someone must know why he continually helps Putin. Hopefully, that person will step forward and tell us why he has been doing that.
2
Thank you for this excellent coverage of what will be remembered as one of the United States' further loss of moral standing in the region. The silver lining, if there can be one, is that Mr. Roebuck has reminded us of who we should be as individual Americans and as a nation.
3
I don't understand how any person who has ever worn a U.S. uniform is not totally disgusted by Donald J. Trump. He abandoned the Kurds, the Kurds who gave thousands of lives fighting our proxy war against ISIS, the Kurds who fought side by side with our troops, the Kurds who we swore to protect, apparently because he just couldn't be bothered. Trump has disgraced the flag that so many Americans have given their lives to defend.
9
Maybe after all of trumps catastrophic decisions are listed for all progressives to see, maybe progressives will understand that trump is incorrigible. Progressives have to stop thinking that he reasons before he makes decisions. All of his reasons are self serving. STOP looking for the TEACHABLE moment with trump. There isn’t one.
3
Could it be any clearer that our CIC is the weakest we've ever had? Not because he believes in peace (like Carter), but because he's completely incompetent, and has no interest in actually advancing and/or protecting the interests of the US (which include protecting our allies) in the international sphere? Will America ever recover? History will not look kindly on this administration, and its shrill declarations of "America First!" as we dither and bumble and enrich the few while the many suffer.
4
Great article.i can never understand why the US is so weak where Turkey is concerned and thought it was dreadful when President Trump pulled his forces out allowing Turkeys invasion and then to announce an invitation for Erdogan to come to the US was unbelievable!
4
What is a U.S. diplomat doing in Syria? If he is so upset by Turkey and its Islamic jihadists proxies attacking Syria, why not support the the government of Syria? Syria, with the help of its long time ally and supporter, Russia, will eventually defeat these Turkish ISIS leftovers and our "good rebels", as we called them, who were the actual ones responsible for many of the chemical attacks and carnage, and will reclaim their country. Our disastrous plan for regime change will go down in the books as one of our biggest blunders. Saudi and Gulf states will now not be able to build that long, sought after natural gas pipeline through Syria to supply Europe and take away both economic and political leverage that Russia now has doing the same. This was never about Assad being a bad man, or democracy, or any other excuse that the mainstream media's propaganda machine pushed. This was about strategic geopolitical leverage and money. Syria, a Russian proxy since the Cold War and which has had naval ports there allowing them Mediterranean access, has been in our, and the Saudis and Israels, crosshairs for decades. Obama, against his better judgement, but pushed by Sec. Clinton initiated the CIA covert action that disastrously led to the quick rise of ISIS and a host of other fundamentalist Islamic jihadist groups in Syria, and almost turned Syria into a failed state infested with uncontrollable, rouge terrorists groups. Look to Libya if you want to see what Syria almost became.
@FXQ almost turned Syria into a failed state? Do you consider what is going on there currently a success?
3
Turkey wanted to kill Kurds, who have for many years resisted Turkey's dictatorial regime, and rightly so. Turkey said ISIS was no longer an issue for them, just eliminating Kurds.
Trump wanted to preserve his long-term business relations with Turkey, and, fulfill a campaign promise to bring troops home. He sided with Erdogan to maintain his business relationship, and agreed that ISIS was not a threat.
Giving Russia a foothold in the Middle East could have been part of his thinking.
All the way around, the winners of this negoiation are ISIS, Russia and Turkey--three repressive regimes, aided in this matter by Trump. Trump's personal revenue streat was preserved.
The losers, U.S. allies against ISIS, the displaced or dead Kurds, Syria, now controlled by Russia, Turkey and Syria's president, Europe, with increased middle East instability at its doorstep, and American trustworthiness and credibility.
State and the Joint Chiefs did nothing to stop this, despite their protestations. Trump should never have been negotiating with Turkey solo--he lacks competence and conscience.
6
The USA diplomatic corps is a staunch defender of USA values in the face of a presiedent, vice president, secretary of state and administration that is incompetent and reckless. The alleged "deep state" is the only thing in foreign policy between us and dictatorship.
5
Propaganda, lies, and misdirection will not obscure the terrible disaster that Donald Trump has visited on our foreign policy, and our National Security. History will expose the roots of Trump’s betrayals and his incompetence and will destroy what remains of the Republican Party. Assad, Putin, ISIS. And Iran benefited from this deceit and blunder. America, Europe, and Israel are losers. What is Trump polling in Israel? If the polls have not changed, American Jews must ask: what influence does Russia have on the Israeli population?
3
My key takeaway from this memo is that the US, under the current administration, lacks the diplomatic, economic and military clout to deter even a NATO “ally”, Turkey, from — I quote — an “unprovoked military operation” on foreign soil.
As the article states right up front: raising the question of whether tougher American diplomacy, blunter threats of economic sanctions and increased military patrols could have deterred Turkey from attacking … Mr. Roebuck wrote “… probably not.”
17
@David
For unusually objective NYT reporting on the Syria/Kurd/US/Turkey situation read
"The US Created A Tinderbox In Syria's North
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/15/world/middleeast/syria-trump-kurds-interpreter.html
Two interesting quotes:
"While the president promised withdrawal, Pentagon and State Department officials reassured Kurdish groups with promises to stay. Last year, the State Department, bowing to Turkish objections, quietly blocked a Kurdish effort to begin reconciliation talks with Damascus."
“It was, ‘We’re going to use a permanent occupation in the northeast to force Bashar al-Assad to cut his own head off,’”
so much for US concerns for the Kurds...
Special Envoy Brett McGurk wrote in the NYT 10/29 "The abrupt withdrawal of American forces from northeastern Syria..."
In Foreign Affairs May/June 2019 he writes, "But in late December 2018 Trump upended this strategy... gave a surprise order to withdraw all US troops from Syria..."
Trump's decision was not sudden.
The military and the foreign policy/CIA/State Department folks had plenty of time to plan, but they simply did not want to follow Trump's order. Erdogan probably TOLD Trump he was crossing the border with troops to create an are free of Kurdish FIGHTERS on his border. Probably that forced Trump's decision or risk fighting with a NATO member.
Weirdly clear, that any president might not be the one making foreign policy decisions, and that should bother citizens.
2
"In a searing internal memo, the diplomat, William V. Roebuck, raised the question of whether tougher American diplomacy, blunter threats of economic sanctions and increased military patrols could have deterred Turkey from attacking. Similar measures had dissuaded Turkish military action before."
Is Mr. Roebuck implying that Trump's letter to Erdogan was not tough diplomacy? See below:
"History will look upon you favorably if you get this done the right and humane way. It will look upon you forever as the devil if good things don't happen. Don't be a tough guy. Don't be a fool!"
2
Everyone knows Trump was bluffing when he sent that letter. He had already given Erdogan the go-ahead after conferring with Putin, no doubt. The letter is just a red herring.
6
Schoolyard bluster is not tough diplomacy. Our president is a carnival barker, always able to attract attention with noisy declarations and promises. But his ignorance and incompetence are what we see when we look for actual results.
When his deficiencies and failures become apparent, he lies, and then creates another commotion to distract us.
He is an ever-present danger.
2
The US government is in chaos. How is it that diplomats can openly, in public, permit themselves to dispute the very policies that are set by their bosses in the State Dept. and White House? Why doesn't Trump simply fire all these people?
2
Meanwhile, as we invest lots of energy into figuring out whom to blame, the President of Russia smiles briefly then gets back to work on his chessboard; queen's bishop to Damascus, king's knight to Mar-a-Lago, pawn to New York, ...
Do any of the geniuses in either party believe that Mr. Putin is simply enjoying the splendid caviar and laughing at our hapless, feckless President? Do we think the Russians are done?
Uncle Vlad is already 5 or 6 steps ahead of Trump and at least 2 or 3 ahead of the Ukrainians. Will his next move be a head fake or the real thing? Will he pretend to be angry with his cyber army or is he really going all in with ... whoever?
We had better hope our intelligence agencies are on their toes after all the idiotic treatment by our genius-in-chief. Putin has already won this skirmish. After the next one, there will be no excuse and no one to say, who could have seen that coming?
When was the last time our country was this far back on our heels?
5
This sickens me. We have let our current president act in illegal, immoral, and unthinkable ways. This will, however, turn out bad for Mr. Erdogan, I pray.
I am proud of Mr. Roebuck for his dignity, integrity, and professionalism. He represents my United States of America, not our president.
3
Someone should do a point by point analysis of all of Trump's decision and correlate them to whether they serve America or Vladimir Putin.
Assign a grade to each decision.
A grade for Putin's interest.
A grade for our American interest.
I bet we lose consistently.
One would find that Donald Trump's loyalty to America is deeply doubtful.
Hey, did anyone ever see his birth certificate?
I bet he was born in Russia.
And if he shows it, just say it's a fake.
Give Trump a taste of his own foul behavior.
2
Is the State Department the only organ of our government in which patriotic Americans allow themselves to tell the truth?With the exception of Lt. Colonel Vindman, a serving Army officer, all of those who have testified about the Ukrainian fiasco have come from their ranks. When will the rest of the deep state, those whose roots are in the Constitution and in American values, come forward to indict the Trump administration?
1
The United States abandoned allies. We did that. We are responsible. We, as a people, are responsible. Trump did it as a representative of the people of the United States. Putin is a beneficiary. If you don't understand the significance of this, then you don't understand that our Republic has been compromised and is in jeopardy. Human beings died because of this callous decision and the only people who are responsible are the people of the United States. The President represents us. If you don't understand that then you don't understand anything at all.
2
Agreed and this decision will have consequences going forward.
Did the Russian soldiers enjoy the food and equipment that we left behind in our hasty departure?
1
I'm guessing a lot of people agree with Mr. Roebuck.
2
Trump has the intellect and attention span of a five-year-old child (those in his immediate circle are equally callow).
Why should we have expected a better outcome?
1
Trump's goal of getting the US out of endless wars in the Middle East is not an unworthy one. The region is a sinkhole. Iraq, cost the US too many lives both KIA and WIA along with tremendous sums of taxpayer money. Iraq is now pivoting towards a closer relationship with Iran. Notwithstanding, how you accomplish a goal is just as important as the goal itself. Stabbing our allies, the Kurds, in the back illustrates that the US cannot be trusted thanks to Trump. It's a lesson that our other allies are not oblivious to. The US no longer has any leverage in the region and the tin-horn dictator, Erdogan, won a partial advantage but the big winner is Putin and he'll call the shots in that region going forward. NATO should consider kicking Turkey out of NATO so there is no longer any commitment to support them militarily. NATO countries should no longer sell military equipment to Turkey. They can buy it from their new friend, Putin. The EU has already opined on Turkey's application to join the EU, basically telling Erdogan that he should live so long.
2
I don’t think by agreement a NATO member can be expelled.
The same day Trump’s ill-considered decision to abandon our Kurdish allies was published, another story was also reported in several European papers. This story declared that the US is once again a net oil exporter. Coincidence?
5
One moronic letter to Erdogan from the weakling who caved on the phone days before isn’t enough?? Who knew?
4
Who decided endorsing and electing the Worst President in American History was a good idea?? Next time more Voting Americans should ignore any Russian recommendations for our President!! Where's the MAGA? What a ...MESS!!!
7
Such a shameful part of our history now-abandoning our allies to mass murder by Turkey!! Call it what it is-NYT-it’s not “ethnic cleansing” it’s genocide!!
7
Let's invite Erdogan to the White House next week instead.
4
Yeah that because trump let them walk in and kill whoever they wanted.
5
Duh! Trump basically told Erdogan to go ahead. So why this idiotic headline?
5
Prevent? It was encouraged by the buffoon in the WH.
9
Who has just won from this? Not the Kurds. Not America. Turkey and Russia. ISIS too if they decide to rebuild the organization. Trump gave ISIS all the ammunition they need to recruit more people. We did this same thing to the Montagnard people in Vietnam. We used them and then we abandoned them. But we did admit some to the United States as refugees. Trump won't even do that for the Kurds or for any Muslim who helped us. We are not going to recover soon from this betrayal.
Secretary of State Pompeo doesn't even support his own people so I'd assume that his attitudes combined with what Trump did will drive more experienced professionals out of the State Department and out of the diplomatic corps. Way to go.
6
Yet another career diplomat speaking out against Trump’s catastrophically bad decision to abandon our Kurdish allies in northern Syria. Trump’s incompetence is costing real human lives. This is not a reality show, no matter how bizarre and unreal it seems.
9
Erdogan had surveillance & intercepts which were damaging to MBS and Trump.
Simple leverage.
5
"failed to do more"
I'd say he enabled the offensive. How much more could Trump have done other than load the weapons for the Turks?
9
Trump loves to make brash decisions that make angry headlines, good or bad, because it puts him in headlines on the news. It might be all he cares about, his face in the news.
Think about that a bit when you consider how complicated and precarious is the stabity of the allies and enemies of the US. Trump sends them all reeling and then gloats over the headlines and his power to threaten US force. It has nothing to do with considered judgement, he has none. It's just throw a wrench in it, mess it all up and sit back and gloat over the widespread mayhem he has produced.
If you think that is a good way to govern the huge and complicated and precarious US, and a good way to interact with the rest of the world, then you are part of the same problem, and responsible for the mess as well as Trump.
Trump is making the US a country no one wants to associate with. China may still have a lot of US real estate, Russia has the obedience of Trump. The US thinks it is invincable, but all that is in the past now. We are alone and friendless, unless you count the Russian wolf as a friend. Other countries look on the US as an unstable and explosive risk, a country that has more guns than people and a crazy president. Steering clear of aliances, they look elsewhere. Trump has tarnished the flag.
7
@joyce
Highly observant, well-thought-out comment. Chapeau!
1
Trump's Syria "policy"and how he greenlighted the annihilation of Kurds by both Turkey and Assad's seems copied from England's four stage modus operandi for any foreign crisis.
Stage I: Nothing is going to happen. -after he gave Erdoğan permission to invade.
Stage II:Something maybe is going to happen, we should do nothing about it. -after Putin forces moved in.
Stage III: Maybe we should do something about, but there is nothing we can do. -after ISIS prisoners were set free.
Stage IV: Maybe something we could've done, but it's too late now. - Erdoğan and Putin have a six hour meeting and they agree to divide N Syria among themselves. Given Moscow a stranglehold on Syria.
I wonder if Boris Johnson have given him the gist of it.
3
This after years of hearing Republican right-wingers bellow ‘Benghazi’ at every opportunity - that incident somehow having become the gravest diplomatic and military blunder in the history of humankind.
Along the same lines as the Republicans’ feigned concern about the federal deficit. None of it matters to them at all — unless you can blame a Clinton or a ‘Socialist’ for it.
19
It seems that reminiscent of the colossal bundoogle that was the Vietnam War, in Syria it's the foot soldiers, the younger diplomats and the military's old hands who are the first to call out a government policy that seems tone deaf and unconcerned with the carnage that ensues after the leaders back in Washington attempt to implement policys on the battlefield that no one understands, and that the guys and gals on the front lines don't support.
And yes, what is even more pathetic is our guys on the ground know that without a steady hand, just as in Vietnam, the end result in Syria is bound to be more needless confusion and more treasure and lives lost.
8
We have betrayed and abandoned our allies left and right. Macron, who tried to make nice with Trump, is now visiting Xi and talking about tariff free trade, driven by Trump's real and threatened tariffs. Xi is talking to Putin about North Korea. Xi is leading a pacific rim trade pact which leaves out the US. Erdogan convinced Trump to sell out the Kurds and get out of the Middle East so Russia can move in. Pretty soon these leaders will be talking about how they will carve up the US. Just another bankruptcy to Trump's credit, but this time with lots of help from the Republican Congress
16
First bit of good news.... carving up the US.
Neat!!
What a difference an election makes.
How can 63 million have been so deluded?
13
Low information fear/hatred of change and difference = Trump’s base.
4
I think we have one of the least educated populations in the western world. Google most ignorant countries.
5
It is not that Trump failed to prevent it...he went along with it. He aided and abetted it. And it is disgusting how he turned on our ally.
17
We could use these troops down on the US-Mexican border. Drugs, fentanyl, heroin, coke are flowing north. Money and guns are flowing south. Phoenix teenage girls are being recruited as mules. Families are being slaughtered and burned to death. This is the current reality of the US southern border. The mexican federal and state gov'ts are owned by the drug cartels.
3
And to “Trump” it off he invites him to the White House. Yes, it is true that Assad and Putin win and it is true that Trump has acted the fool yet again , only this time at the behest of Erdogan.
9
A searing Roebuck memo? Okay. Back to the article.
2
Not enough? As far as I can tell, nothing was done at all.
And if those checkpoints had been overrun and American killed under a real President, parts of Turkey would have been burning wreckage the next day.
Trump is this strange combination of bombastic self-promoter, verbal bully, utter sissy, and shill for his creditors.
And we know who his creditors are.
13
This was a Trump decision on-the-fly with absolutely no consideration for any diplomacy. It was pulling the rug out from under Mr. Roebuck, and the Kurds no doubt. Mr. Roebuck is being very diplomatic here with his wording. But the truth is Trump screwed the Kurds and America will be paying for this for years to come, as I predict we will have to go back into Syria for our own national security reasons for years and years to come with much greater casualties because of the mess Trump has made!
16
Is Trump the "Manchurian Candidate"? During the election didn't he say "Russia, are you listening?". The next day Russia released the Democratic party emails which severely discredited Clinton and helped swing the election in Trump's favor. Ceding Syria to Russia is Trump's "Quid-pro-quo" to his buddy Putin...
Trump is a liar, traitor, and coward... Time to "Lock him up!"
16
Pelosi was right-all roads lead to Putin with Trump!!
4
Guard the oilfields, let the civilians be slaughtered.
Making America great again indeed.
10
The US has always been a malignant influence in the Middle East and Assad was correct in calling Trump "transparent" about US intentions. Mr. Roebuck may call the regional belief that the US is in the region for its own narrow interests and to steal the local oil supply a "conspiracy." Most other people would call it "obvious" and "common sense." The US's abandonment of its Kurdish allies should hardly be surprising, either - this is the third time the US has betrayed the Kurds. As I indicated, the US has always been a malign influence in the region and its departure is probably not a bad thing; however, Powell's "pottery barn rule" does still apply. The US broke the ME; simply getting up and walking away from a mess it created and/or exacerbated hardly builds confidence and certainly reveals character.
6
This article puts the farce of American policy towards Syria on full and shameful display - two sentences confirm that US policy is based on US strategic interests, not a stable and unified Syria: "The negotiations cemented Mr. Putin’s strategic advantage: Russian and Turkish troops have taken joint control over a vast swath of formerly Kurdish-held territory in northern Syria. The change strengthened the rapid expansion of Russian influence in Syria at the expense of the United States and its Kurdish former allies." Something is wrong with this "story" when the legitimate interests of Turkey and Russia are given zero consideration and positive outcomes are not mentioned. Russia has clearly helped prevent Syria from turning out like the great Middle Eastern success stories of Iraq, Libya and Palestine and is helping protect the Kurds. The US has and will use any means it judges is necessary to overthrow the Assad government - and stories like this ignore this basic fact and now the progress Turkey, Russia and Syria have made in defusing a potentially situation that unfortunately does not enhance the power or prestige of the US.
2
Trumps cronies say he's basically too dumb to know about the quid pro quo? But yet, he's allowed to run our military and make decisions regarding life and death? God help us all.
13
He is not a diplomat. Diplomats work in foreign countries legally and on invitation of those countries' legitimate governments. This person entered the illegally occupied Syrian territory without a visa or any other proper authorisation. So he could be a spy or unofficial envoy or a representative. But he is definitely not a diplomate and does not enjoy any privileges afforded to diplomates such as diplomatic immunity.
1
Which direction do you want? End US military incursions across the globe, or take more assertive military positions designed to enhance and protect US power? One thing that is not acceptable is to support one position when pursued by an administration you like, while opposing the same position when pursued by an administration you dislike.
5
Regardless of its flaws and policy mistakes, the US, until 2016, had a stature of the leader of the free world with significant leverage on the oppressive regimes.
Mr. Roebuck's memo just highlights that thanks to one orange haired puppet in the WH with several autocratic masters (Putin, Erdogan, MBS, Kim) and more manipulators (Netanyahu, Orban), that status has diminished to laughable lows.
And yet, Trump's enablers (Pompeo, McConnell, Graham, and Barr) and court jesters (Nunes, Jordan, Gaetz, and Rand Paul) are continuing to defend him.
As a nation, we are continuing to go lower and lower and lower.
16
In Britain and elsewhere it is being reported that Trump pulled out of Syria because he was blackmailed by Erdogan.
That there is a tape of Jared Kushner ordering the operation on Jamal Khashoggi. Erdogan threatened to release it.
So it was a case of foreign policy being led by a Trump family cover up.
Allegedly.
9
I grew up west of Boston. Many of my childhood friends were Armenian. So many of their ancestors were murdered by Turkey. One of my best friend’s grandmother escaped, but saw her little brother murdered.My heart goes out to the Kurds. We are witnessing a genocide. Just heartbreaking that in 2019, this can be happening, and sickening that our President helped.I hope we as a country can regain our moral compass.
11
Another hit piece to discredit Trump by Deep State. I don't think this guy said anything when half a million Syrians were slaughtered during Obama time.
5
@Alex E
Can you please specify what/whom you refer to when using the term "Deep State"?
I suspect you are unable to answer; have no idea what or who "The Deep State" is other than "Trump Haters"; and are just regurgitating the propaganda flowing constantly from Fox News, the Oval Office, Breitbart, and other unreliable sources who picked up the phrase sometime in 2017.
Trump doesn't need a fantasy "Deep State" nor any "hit piece" to discredit him.
He deserves no "credit" for anything decent, worthwhile, praiseworthy, or positive in his entire self-serving career.
It was bad enough when he was just a cheesy NY real estate guy, limited to stiffing suppliers and workers; suing anyone who crossed him; and bankrupting little guys ("losers") while inflating his shabby reputation. His baleful nfluence and capacity for harming others increased as he developed political ambitions and led the charge on the Central Park Five, followed by his more ambitious and equally fact-free attack on Obama's citizenship.
As POTUS, he threatens every value we Americans adhere to -- or aim to uphold. He has no scruples, no policies, no capacity for empathy. Ruining reputations, putting children in cages, assaulting women, sending the Kurds to slaughter, giving aid and comfort to enemies like Putin -- there is nothing too despicable for him.
He is simply a vile excuse for a human being.
No hit piece necessary . . . other than to add more fuel to the bonfire of his vanities.
9
I have nothing to add to your excellent reply, other than to say that it’s laughable how Trump supporters try to brand every truthful article about his shameful and disastrous presidency as a “hit piece”. Trump writes his own personal hit pieces every single day.
6
@Clairette Rose
You have aptly described the man who lost the popular vote to his opponent and managed to eke out a 77,000 vote lead in the Electoral College after taking key States: PA, WI, MI and OH. If Clinton had bothered to campaign in PA, WI, and MI we would have an educated competent Head of State. She didn't, so here we are. The damage done to our reputation and our fiscal management will take decades to repair. It is not possible to underestimate the loss of revenue due to permanent corporate tax cuts. A change in tax structure will now need a super majority in the House where the Federal budget is overseen, and a complicit Senate now controlled by McConnell. Clinton's loss was major in terms of how our government will be funded and managed.
Mr. Roebuck implies that American diplomats in Syria
were not included or consulted before the U.S. gave Syria
to the Russians and the Turks and abandoned the Kurds. Speaking out now, he likely will need to find a new diplomatic post or retire and write a book on the state of U.S. diplomacy
3
can someone explain to me why Turkey is still a NATO member?
8
Elect a clown, expect a circus. These are the results.
9
If that was what was required to get the Turks to get on board with the operations related to the killing of Al-Baghdadi, I'm fine with it.
1
@Objectivist Who said the killing of Al-Baghdadi had anything to do with the Turks? It was the Kurds who helped us find him, not the Turks (I believe there are reports that members of Al-Baghdadi's family were actually taking refuge in Turkish territory). And the operation was American, as far as I'm aware.
If, prior to Trump's idiotic decision to suddenly withdraw, the Turks were not "on board" with killing Al-Baghdadi, then that would be a problem in itself. I would like to know why they objected to it, and if they did why they are still regarded as friends of ours.
6
I guess you don’t follow the news too closely. Trump’s rash decision to pull out and hand the keys to the Turks almost ruined the operation to get al-Baghdadi. The perfect genius is quite a strategist. Not.
2
Erdogan was clearly closely following the U.S. illegal intromission in Syria and elsewhere and was enchanted seeing the illegality as the new 'normal' in the Middle East. Well, France and the UK were there sharing the same stance.
1
Not "trying harder"? How about not trying at all while holding the door open for the Turkish Army who gave us the finger as they drove by.
Meanwhile the Kurds gave us al-Baghdadi.
9
And I Say Not Enough Was Done to Avert Drug Cartel Attack on US Citizens.
1
What else would you expect from a president who has no appreciation of how cultures behaves in the Middle East. Between his 'unmatched wisdom" and Erdogan's badge of dishonor, otherwise known as treachery, it is our allies who lose, the Kurds.
7
Is this newspaper just going to ignore the reports in Britain and elsewhere that Erdogan blackmailed Trump to pull out of Syria with a threat he would release a tape of Jared Kushner ordering the Jamal Khashoggi operation with the Saudi's?
US foreign policy AGAIN being a function of covering HIS hide, or that of a family member.
5
Another whiny State Department assessment. If the author was seriously concerned, he would have resigned. Instead, he authored a milquetoast memo that was unclassified, which assured that it would be leaked to the media.
Nor does he disguise his clientitis. And Syria is not now and was never a vital US interest; thus, we really do not care whether there is a “comprehensive political solution for Syria.”
2
Trump's incompetence and venality simply beggars all belief.
5
Trump's sanctions was purely optics to the world, noticed how fast he removed it afterwards. I surmised its been planned, agreed upon and executed with a juvenile letter to Erdogan letter to top it off....surly will go down in history as one of the many dark moment in this presidency
2
Every article about this subject should start with, "Our NATO ally, Turkey, whose border was attacked repeatedly by our other allies, the Kurds from the terrorist group, the SDF..."
There Fixed it. :)
1
So I can not believe that we could not have done more. All that would have needed to be done is to stay in there camps on the border. The Turks would never have dared to kill Americans, who is anybody kidding here. Never!!
4
What is meant by, "Not Enough Done to Avert. . . "
?????
Trump enabled it.
3
The congressional investigation of this is going to make Benghazi look like a tea party.
8
Trump, while attacking American intelligence, POW's, Gold Star families, and decorated military heroes has been a useful tool for Erdogan, Putin, the Crown Prince, and their ilk. His betrayal of our allies, the Kurds, in our fight against ISIS is what we should expect from a walking national security risk like him. Someone else always pays the price for his self-dealing. Hopefully history will correct itself when he is run out of office.
5
Trump did not handle this well. But we know that Obama and Hillary started the mess throughout the Middle East.
It is hard to say if Trump was just a coward on the pressure of the Democrats made him feel he could not act.
If he had acted, that would have been used by Pelosi against him.
It shows that our internal fighting is not in the best interests of the United States.
It is a shame that the Kurds have to suffer because we can not get along.
1
@Sigmund Silber Obama. Hillary. Pelosi.
I guess that means they're running the country, eh?
Poor Donald, just being dragged along wherever they take him.... Making America Great Again.
2
Cue the career destroying machine. Rogue diplomat. Not speaking for administration. Never trumper. Pompeo bungles the response. Giuliani obfuscates. Donated to Clinton's campaign. Praise jesus.
We're not describing policy anymore. We're not even describing party politics. This is good vs. evil.
It's not Trump's party at the root of this evil. Its root in the poisonous hatred spread for 3 decades now. This is 'Rush's party'.
2
All these high level diplomats who are taking public issue with President Trump's decisions and actions are certainly free to and have the duty to advise the President on their opinions but that is all.The Constitution is clear,the President is in solely responsible for foreign policy.
Only the President can have "The Buck Stops Here Plaque on his desk as President Truman.
2
@Patrick49
The idea that Trump ever takes responsibility is ludicrous.
3
Ms. Ortagus of State is blowing smoke when she says State did everything they could to stop the Turkish attack of the Kurds. State, being in Trump's cabinet, goes along with his wishes.
In this case, Trump sided with Turkey, with which he has had long-term business dealings.
Trump wanted a two-fer: to protect his business dealings with Turkey and foolishly fulfill a campaign promise--bringing troops home. He has no loyalty to the Kurds, America's allies against ISIS in Syria.
He's loyal to his hospitality business and himself -- that's it. He's insulted every one of the U.S.'s traditional allies, and sided with every dictator he has met.
Whether people live or die is not Trump's concern, as exemplified by his environmental and healthcare stewardship, in particular. So Kurdish deaths mean little to him.
Democratic leaders don't abandon allies and let innocent people die--victims of genocide. They don't give enemy countries more power and permit them to threaten allies. They protect democracy, not dictators.
Not Trump. He kept his wallet full, and brought troops home.
Consequences? Turkey got to kill the Kurds (U.S. allies, and resisters against the Turkish dictatorship), Russia got a foothold in the Middle East, America is untrustworthy.
7
@Lilou
Except he hasn’t actually brought troops home.
1
@T -- yeah, he did, but he sent new ones in, almost exactly the same number, so the whole proposition was a loser.
1
Does Jared Kushner alleged "green light" to MBS to kidnap khashoggi that might have been recorded by Turkey play into this at all? Or is it just as simple as Trump playing into Putin's hands?
5
This is the direct result of having a imbecilic clown driving the bus that has our national security and foreign policy on board. Totally predictable!!! He hasn't the slightest clue about our national interests or those of our real allies ie. the ones that have been standing shoulder to shoulder, doing the fighting and dying, with our troops. The Turks stopped being an ally a long time ago. I keep reading references to their being a member of NATO, no other member of NATO is buying completely incompatible anti aircraft missile systems from Russia. Their pivot is obvious, we never should have given them a green light to kill our brothers in arms. Having never served under arms, the clown has no concept of what that means. Serving isn't a prerequisite to understanding the concept, but having a brain is. No one that I can think of serving in our government, now or in the past, would have done what he did. His snap decision twitter behavior is infantile, but the results of it are all too real, just ask the Kurds that have buried love ones and fled their longstanding homes what they think of his bright idea.
6
@Dick Montagne
If, by infantile you mean Early Onset Dementia, you are on the right track. Trump is not functioning as a 'normal' adult; this has been the case for some time. The GOP wanted permanent corporate tax cuts and a conservative Federal judiciary; they played into Trump's greed, lack of empathy and lack of credible diplomatic skills with smarmy flattery and approval of laundered money for loans from Russian oligarchs in London via Deutsche Bank. Historians will write a devastating history of one of the most corrupt Administrations in U.S. history.
This is by far the most accurate account of the U.S.'s tragic situation at the moment caused by Trump's shameful betrayal of our Kurdish allies to the demands of Turkey's Erdogan and should be read by all. Sadly, it also represents an unnecessary and unforgivable capitulation to a racist regime which bullies us at will and disgraces our country's honor before the dictators of the world.
6
Now is the time for an open letter to the nation signed by all the top brass in the military and intelligence agencies calling out Trump for his abysmal ineptitude regarding the betrayal of the Kurds and our other allies in the region. That and all of his other blunders as "Commander in Chief." They should in themselves be grounds for impeachment. The man's leadership abilities are nonexistent. He's an embarrassment.
6
Ethnic cleansing and genocide seems to be a pattern for Turkey. Not so long ago, we were discussing the Armenian Genocide. Wasn’t that warning enough?
As for weakling Trump, he is unfit to be dog catcher, let alone Commander-in-Chief of the United States armed forces. Republicans in Congress are no better, as they abet his malfeasance on a daily, if not hourly, basis.
7
We need a transcript of the Erdogan telephone call that seems to have been the predicate.
4
After impeachment, a war crimes trial is warranted.
7
Trump foreign policy is a total failure but not for Trump 's friends : Erdogan and Putin.
3
I hope his resume is updated, because he will be needing it soon.
1
Mike Pompeo is a disaster for the U.S. State Department and all the dedicated officers and diplomats who work there, like Mr. Roebuck, Ms. Yovanovitch, and Mr. Taylor. In order to do Trump’s bidding he sacrificed Jamal Khashoggi, held Ukrainian security hostage, and then betrayed the Kurds. He is as much of a disgrace as his boss.
9
Shame.
As an American, all I can feel about this is shame. We have already fallen so far in the eyes of the free world and this seals the impression that we are no longer the defenders of Democracy. We are now no better than any other corrupt dictatorship who see no problem stabbing their allies in the back and abandoning them as a gift to another corrupt regime. DT has real blood in his hands and now, so do we.
9
Just one more untenable and foolish decision by the man up for impeachment.
Can he be terminally impeached?
2
Seems like neither Obama nor Trump can get us out of these silly and wasteful wars. Eisenhauer was right: Beware of the military-industrial-complex (deep state).
2
@Terrence Zehrer Eisenhauer?
You mean like Kenteny and Nixann?
And all those other presidents before Trump ?
Credit to Mr. Roebuck for having such a strong grasp of the obvious. Trump basically issued an invitation for Turkey to invade Rojava--almost like calling Erdogan's bluff. It will be a costly venture for Turkey, all though the short-term optics look swell for Erdogan just now, and effectively gave him a bit of a political boost.
Cui Bono?
The big winners, of course, are Putin and Assad.
131
@Outerboro
Putin a winner? Moscow has just inherited responsibility for rehabilitating a devastated country (Syria), containing a resurgent ISIS terrorism threat, controlling Iranian resupply of Hezbollah, resettling millions of refugees, and balancing the competing interests in Syria of Iran and Turkey. As for the Kurds: the US alliance with them was a marriage of convenience and provided great mutual benefit. But the US has never sought a Kurdish independent state, and everyone involved in this alliance knew that once ISIS was driven from Syria, a reckoning would have to take place. Traditionally, Syria has always been aligned with Moscow. And that is largely why Syria is not now and has never been a vital US interest, unlike Egypt, Israel, Jordan, and some of the gulf states. I believe that history will record Mr. Trump’s decision to pull our troops out of Syria as one of his more intelligent foreign-policy decisions. As for Mr. Putin... be careful what you wish for.
3
Flynn worked for Turkey and Russia, Trump works for Turkey and Russia. Manafort works for Russia. Democrats never said a word during the election. The NRA washed millions of Russian dollars in contributions to Trump.Trump's Impeachment should be about economic treason, for selling out the US to foreign Countries.
16
@David H Yes, Putin is a winner. Moscow has just inherited, in Syria, warm water year round access to the Mediterranean which Russia has wanted since Tsarist times in the 19th Century.
No need now to be concerned about the potential strategic threat of the bottleneck of the Bosphoros and Dardanelles.
In any case, Putin now seems to have neutralised the Bosphorus for now as he has Turkey's Erdogan in his pocket as well as Trump.
8
You're on the wrong side of history when Bashar al-Assad calls you the best American President he's ever seen.
235
@Kevin Brock
And you're extremely naive to take anything Bashar al-Assad says at face value.
2
The Pollyanna notion that we can pull out and everyone will behave honorably, while we ignore evidence and intelligence to the contrary, seems to me to be similar to the mindset which allowed the unfortunate attack in Benghazi that the GOP doggedly investigated for a decade. If we've learned one thing from history, it's that we don't learn anything from history. We repeat the same mistakes, thinking it will be different this time.
1
@Mike But. Isn't it the actual definition of Insanity, "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results"?
“It’s a tough call, and the answer is probably not,” Mr. Roebuck wrote in the 3,200-word memo. “But we won’t know because we didn’t try.”
Of course we didn't try. In the aftermath of the Turkish incursion into Syrian territory to disperse the Kurds, Trump plainly said "Let them fight it out."
Addressing a rally in Dallas: “It was unconventional, what I did. I said, ‘They’re going to have to fight a little while’. Sometimes you have to let them fight a little while. Then people find out how tough the fighting is ... Sometimes you have to let them fight. It’s like two kids in a lot, you’ve got to let them fight and then you pull them apart."
The Kurds...the same folks who put their lives on the line to help us fight ISIS.
120
@ernieh1 :
if i remember correctly, djt also said,
supporting the kurds was no longer really justified:
"they didn't help us in world war 2,
they didn't help us in normandy, so ..."
some reasoning, my goodness!
15
@°julia eden What he meant was "they didn't help me get elected."
7
@ernieh1
Trump’s policy, evidently, is to speak loudly and carry a green (easily bent) twig.
The State Dept's political appointee cannot hope to whitewash this administration's actions.
How can anyone infer that the US leaving Syria, promising not to interfere with the anticipated ethnic cleansing of the Kurds by Turkey, selling out a key ally in the fight against ISIS, and giving Russia a greater toe hold in the Middle East, secures America's national security?
No wonder Russian media was reporting the gleeful phrase 'Trump makes Russia great again.'
7
People are dying because of this man who is self-dealing, impulsive and a push-over for the men who are already tyrants. Trump wants to join their club - and maybe he already has become one.
He's our largest national security threat. Nick Kristoff says in his column today that someone overseas said that if Trump is not a Manchurian candidate, he's doing a very good imitation of one.
And yet....people keep acting as if Trump's is a 'normal' presidency. He wants to be a tyrant.
I so appreciate diplomats speaking truth to power.
8
@sophia ...I do not think an army private could get away with the things he says and does. It totally is baffling scary and hurtful.
In trumps mind, he’s a hero .
Never mind the deaths and displacement of Kurds. Their lives don’t matter.
Just trump getting his hotel matters.
5
Trump’s seemingly sudden give away of northern Kurdish occupied Syria to Turkey’s Erdogan never made sense. Yet, the press seems to have given Trump a pass. “Rumor/s” has it that Erdogan has tapped phone compromising conversations between Kushner and the Saudi crown prince? Who knows, but something is simmering just under the surface.
3
State Department employee wants more overseas wars. Repeat ad infinitum.
1
I guess that "less than nothing" is not the same as "not enough." What I read about the whole process was that the Trump administration did everything short of sending out engraved invitations to the Turkish dictator to invade and kill as many of the US-allied Kurds as possible as quickly as possible.
3
How is it that the people who are so completely fine with Trump's actions in this regard were completely losing their collective minds over Benghazi?
6
All fine and good (and disgusting), but don't we think by now that Trump is more concerned about what the Russian diplomat in the area had to say?
2
In "1984", George Orwell's novel of a future totalitarian dystopia, the official language is "Newspeak", designed with an ever decreasing vocabulary meant to limit the range of thought, and to train the populace to believe that "War is Peace"; Freedom Is Slavery. Ignorance is Strength.”
Excerpts from today's article indicate some of us are not living in 2019, but in 1984:
2019:
Mr. Roebuck, a respected 27-year diplomat and former United States ambassador to Bahrain, who has spent two years working on the ground in Northern Syria, wrote:
“Turkey’s military operation in northern Syria, spearheaded by armed Islamist groups on its payroll, represents an intentioned-laced effort at ethnic cleansing,” . . . calling the abuses “what can only be described as war crimes and ethnic cleansing.” The negotiations (between Pence and Erdogan) cemented Mr. Putin’s strategic advantage: Russian and Turkish troops have taken joint control over a vast swath of formerly Kurdish-held territory in northern Syria. The change strengthened the rapid expansion of Russian influence in Syria at the expense of the United States and its Kurdish former allies.
1984:
Vice President Mike Pence agreed to a deal with President Recep Tayyip Erdogan of Turkey: Mr. Pence hailed the agreement as a diplomatic victory for President Trump, calling it a “solution we believe will save lives.”
In other words: WAR IS PEACE!
PERFECT! BELIEVE ME! WE HAVE ALTERNATE FACTS!
3
Not only was not enough done to prevent an attack by Turkey, it appears that Trump sanctioned the attack in the first place, based on his removing our troops immediately after speaking with Erdogan. Trump has no sense of intelligent foreign relations for the good of the country, being apparently interested only in his own good. This should be an article of impeachment in itself.
5
I don't Turkey belongs in NATO anymore.
Genocide is not new concerning Turkish history as witnessed by their actions against Armenians.
The Republican Senators will not deliver the verdict required to remove this monstrous man who is out of control in so many areas and a danger to our very republic. He vilifies people who no longer support him, he has undermined our foreign service that may never recover.
If Trump isn't impeached and removed for his crime regarding blackmailing Ukraine that will set a precedent for future schemes in the future. The Congress authorized those funds and Trump negated Congress which upsets the balance of power and safety of the slowly shrinking free world.
Does anyone know what Trump's vision is for Israel, Turkey, Russia and the lot?
Mr. Roebuck's memo illustrates the point that Trump has no use for non-political career foreign service officers. He wanted a Hotel owner who bought an ambassadorship to carry the Ukraine ball with that New York City joker, I don't want to spread his name any farther, trying to spread a false story of fraud and other nonsense.
The Republicans start shouting down questioners, not answering questions and yelling things that have no basis in fact like rabid dogs. When their patriotism is questioned they fall short.
6
If, as predicted the House impeaches Mr. Trump and the Senate fails to convict, the House might well impeach Mr. Trump anew over his bungled decision to abandon the Kurdish freedom fighters in Syria. The Ukraine extortion plot has been a fiasco for Trump, but hasn't done much to weaken his support among his base voters. However, abandoning the Kurds was the worst U.S. foreign policy mistake and abandonment of an ally in the 21st Century. Trump's off-the-cuff decision has cost untold lives, including civilians, created a new refugee crisis and probably will lead to a revival of Islamic State power and terrorism. Trump is a traitor who is taking his orders from Russia's Putin, and we need to get him out of office as soon as possible.
5
It is interesting that in the photograph, members of the State Dept. diplomatic security services...i.e., special operations forces...are standing ready to take down anyone willing to do Mr. Roebuck harm...at a ceremony for our Kurdish 'allies'.
1
This guy had it plain wrong. We pulled out and 10 days later the parties came to deal. It's all over and our troops are no longer in harm's way in this region. This leak is embarrassing to the diplomatic corps.
5
It was clear from trxmp's public statement to Erdogan that the US had no intention of stopping their invasion. So of course they could have tried harder!
1
If the United States of America went to war, claiming that Iraq and Afghanistan performed acts of terror against America. How come we won’t let Turkey defend themselves against the Kurd’s terrorism inside Turkey?
6
The Electoral College is such a waste. In two elections it has left us with presidents who led us into lose-lose situations in the Middle East.
2
When Putin says jump, Trump says, "how high" on the way up. No matter how many pixels are wasted on describing foreign events involving the Trump administation directions, it is obvious to me that Putin controls Trump.
2
Only One Question:
SYRIA -- Does it serve Putin's goals.
Same Question for Ukraine:
Did hold up of military aid serve Putin?
Did demand to accuse Ukraine of the Email hack- instead of "Russian interference"-- serve Putin?
Did demand to investigate Biden son, serve Putin.... yes to that too.... after all - when will Putin ever have a shot at controlling another US President.
Am I off track here? Or why doesn't the media talk about how almost every foreign policy move supports Putin's goals.
4
@Carole
Getting out of Syria, which Russia has been closely allied with since the early '60s, helped Russia. And it helped America too.
Please tell me how having US troops in a war zone where at least four major military powers and various militias all deeply hostile to the United States operate, helped the United States. Can you define our interests there? Our goals there? What we can accomplish or should try to accomplish?
I'm sorry on behalf of the Kurds. But this reflexive bashing of Trump's desire to get out of a war zone we never had business being in in the first place - simply because Trump did it - is reactionary, silly, and depressing.
1
Mr. Roebuck, you must shift your paradigm to work for Donald Trump. No more of that gibberish about truth, justice or the American Way, Trump needs to do what Erdogan and Putin tell him, or they might reveal his crimes or refuse to give him political assistance.
3
Jim Jordan, along with Warren Davidson (R., Troy), were the only members of the Ohio Congressional delegation that voted in October 2019 against a bipartisan resolution that passed the House 354-60 condemning President Donald Trump's unilateral withdrawal of U.S. Military forces from Syria.
2
Trump has no interest in being president except when it involves tax cuts, dismantling environmental rules, sabotaging Obamacare, and filling up his hotels. Even Iran is simply a way of hitting at Obama's legacy. Being president is too much work, too much detail. And then all these experts coming at him, disputing his "gut." Poor world. Syria would tax FDR's skills, and we got Trump.
5
Fire him. Instantly.
The President sets policy. If he won't follow it, he should resign, and if he won't resign he must be fired ASAP.
We are getting out of Syria. Finally. Too slowly, too incrementally, but finally.
The war hawks don't want to leave. They'll criticize and sabotage the end of the war. Fire them. No excuses. Fire them all.
6
Trump never intended to deter Turkey from invading northern Syria last month.
Because of Trump, we should pass a law requiring that ALL high-level Administration communications be achieved - including calls, emails, Tweets, etc.
Trump's crooked hands are in this and I am sure he cut some kind of under-the-table deal with Erdogan and Putin to cede parts of Syria to both.
Geez, I'm SO glad that we have a fake president that is looking out for OUR interests (NOT). Trump is little more than a war criminal.
2
Does it really matter? From Mexico will pay for the Wall to huge deficits for an ill-conceived tax cut to lie after lie, as long as judges Trump appoints will eventually do away with Roe. Nevermind these children will mature in a dystopian world where facts are fake and lies are truth.
VOTE!
1
I hope the diplomat is prepared to be eviscerated by presidential tweets, soon to be followed by personal attacks from elected Republicans.
3
"Mr. Pence hailed the agreement as a diplomatic victory for President Trump, calling it a “solution we believe will save lives.”"
What about all the lives already snuffed out due to ethnic cleansing?
VP Pence can make the most horrendous decisions sound like apple pie and motherhood. What a royal hypocrite and apologist for his awful boss.
3
It's going to get really interesting if the reports that Turkish intelligence had blackmail material on the Trump administration via Jared Kushner's link to Jamal Khashoggi's murder are corroborated via coming testimony.
This administration's corruption and negligence is actually getting people killed.
1
Promises made, promises kept. The question is, to whom? Was Trump’s stand down payback to Erdogan in exchange for not making public all the intel on the Khashoggi murder by MBS?
2
In a democracy there are no secrets; "today's" classified briefing is "tomorrow's" headline, as it should be. If patriotic Americans do not recognize that Trump"s awful decisions are based on knee-jerk reactions rather than carefully planned policies, then, we will die as a nation. Right now we owe a debt of gratitude to career foreign affair professionals who are shining a spotlight on Trump's horrible decisions.
139
@Bruce Egert
Au contraire.
There have been far too many secrets in this democracy, a problem not limited to the Trump Presidency.
The NYT has contributed to this problem.
Remember that warrantless wiretapping and domestic spying story that the Times held back on reporting in November 2004? We might have limited W to one term if that story had come out when the Times learned about it - BEFORE the election.
4
@Bruce Egert
Yet we hear nothing of our failed CIA coup attempt in Syria. Never discussed in the open halls of Congress. Never discussed in the press. How was this disastrous policy allowed to go forward without the American people's knowledge? Over a million dead Syrians and Iraqis, most of them civilians and tens of millions of displaced refugees. Let's finally air all this dirty laundry and have a frank and honest discussion of just how we got to where we are today. I would think Congress would want to declassify our CIA Timber Sycamore program and discuss how and why it was started. What were the goals?
2
@FXQ Why would the CIA attempt a coup in 2011? Assad had implemented neoliberal economic policies that aggravated an extremely severe prolonged drought that had devastated agriculture in Syria. Plus a war was still underway in neighboring Iraq. Assad appeared to be a reformer unlike his father. He was married to a British born and raised wife and had planned on living in Britain with his wife and to work as an optometrist until his father died and he was summoned back to run the country. The U.S. had no interest in Syria.
The massive protests that broke out against government policies were even briefly met with offers of negotiations, an early election and reforms of the constitution. Then the killing started of unarmed demonstrators. Who was responsible was unclear. It may even have been Russian affiliated interests with a long history dating back to Soviet times that may have been concerned about losing power and acted with force. As a result thousands deserted the Syrian military and joined the rapidly swelling ranks of the rebel forces. Islamist extremists exploited the emerging chaos. No CIA was needed.
1
This abandonment of the Kurds will be a dark stain on American history. When there are no more Kurds in Syria, Turkey will be blamed but the U.S. will also be attacked for telling the Turks it was okay for them to "clean out" the Kurds. No country or group will ever want to be an ally of the U.S. in the future. This is the sad legacy of the Trump presidency. As a retired Foreign Service Officer I can only decry how American diplomats are ignored by Trump and how the “tool of diplomacy” will be unavailable to the United States going forward.
125
@Michael V.
we've abandoned the kurds a few times. They still curse Kissinger for one of the original abandonments.
Throughline from NPR has a great podcast (came out today) about this.
2
Thank you for your service.
And, question for pro America “wholesome nationalists” of the Rich Lowry type: does the Presidents betrayal of our Kurdish allies not abuse the foreign policy power, stain our military honor, and harm the standing of the country? To benefit a leader with whom the President has developed business ties? No? Not “impeachable” enough? Give me a break.
1
@Michael V. –
Moreover, Trump has again demonstrated that he is a wimp when he deals with foreign authoritarian leaders.
1
Why do we get the feeling these representatives, such as Mr. Roebuck, for international issues always have to feel they need to at least half way protect Donald Trump?
Donald Trump has no clue what he’s doing. He never has since January, 2017. Stop protecting this man. He is destroying any integrity the United States of America has ever had, either on home or foreign soil.
320
@MIMA
They're not protecting Trump, they've been trained to write and behave like professionals. We've become so acclimated to unprofessional behavior -- let's not get to that place where we're also willing to "go low".
2
@MIMA The half- measured indirect criticisms __ in thi case deflected toward the agreessive Erdogan and his Islamist procies--are a means to avoid Trump's vindictive pettiness by praising his face-saving backtracking of redeploying US forces to protect the "oil fields." One foot in is better than no foot on the ground, just like being at the table as active diplomats with skin in the games influencing events on the grounds is better than howling at the moon from the outside as ex officials with no clearance or resource to affect change. Far from the naked "emperor," these officers can simply ignore Trump impulsive, errattic improvizations.
3
@MIMA
As a retired Foreign Service Officer who served on two assignments in the region (not in Syria or Iraq), I understand Roebuck’s language in his memo to State Department colleagues and other Washington addressees. I don’t agree that he was being half-apologetic for Trump’s sudden decision. We should ask who advised Trump about the situation of our small troop contingents next to the Turkish border and was there any consultation with Roebuck and other diplomats before he made his snap decision? Most likely not.
Diplomats like Roebuck, being on the ground and dealing with many of the players in a complex situation, have the responsibility to report on the situation, the players, the prospects for resolving conflict peaceably, and the ties to American national interests. That’s a big task. Our diplomats are trained to use language sparingly and carefully, unlike some of our media pundits and uninformed commenters. So, we should read Roebuck’s memo and study the context in which it was written. He’s not grinding an axe, though he writes that the sudden withdrawal of the two small U.S. troop contingents prior to Turkey’s sending in Syrian Arab militias to do its dirty work was a mistake that has cost us credibility and leverage among the Kurds, the Syrians, and the Turks. Russia and Iran have benefited from Trump’s unforced error.
2
Ambassador William Roebuck is just the latest civil servant to step forward to detail how Donald Trump has endangered our national security by his lone wolf, off-the-books approach to foreign policy. Not only was Trump not "trying harder to prevent Turkey's military offensive" into northern Syria, he actually gave them the green light to invade a foreign country and to engage in ethnic cleansing of the indigenous Kurdish population who had been our loyal and most valuable allies in defeating ISIS. This Neville Chamberlain-like appeasement of a ruthless dictator and the loss of life it caused was a not only a craven betrayal of an ally, a surrender to those like Syrian President Bashar al-Assad and his protector, Russian Federation President Vladimir Putin, but also a "crime against humanity" like that of Serbian President Slobodan Milosevic that led to his conviction in the World Court. Although it is not being considered by the House impeachment inquiry, it represents a equally serious "dereliction of duty" by our Commander-in-Chief that put our military in harm's way, destroyed all trust in our foreign commitments, and resulted earlier in the resignation of Defense Secretary Jim Mattis and a stinging and threatening rebuke by Admiral William H. McRaven (ret.) who call for his removal from office.
9
Where were all the NYT readers on this forum getting the vapors over Trump's abandonment of the Kurds when Obama left Iraq?
Obama did the right thing by leaving. But he objectively "abandoned" the Iraqi people as much as Trump has the Kurds. And in terms of human cost and chaos, our exit from Syria doesn't even come close to what we precipitated by leaving Iraq.
Of course, Trump does everything for the wrong reasons.
But if the argument for withdrawing from Syria was that our allies would be hurt - or eek! another big power might hold sway there - you just made the case for "forever wars." You just condemned Obama's Iraq policy.
If we must wait for ideal conditions to leave war zones, we'll never leave.
5
@Livonian
You aren't leaving. You are staying to protect the oil. When the US feels like it, the troublemaking will resume. The only decent thing the US has done in the region was to protect the Kurds and the Christian communities that the Kurds protected.
Now you are giving up the role of protecting Christian communities to Russia. You are staying to weaken the possibility of the Syrian govt to use oil monies to rebuild bombed infrastructure.
You are leaving the warzone to avoid responsibility for your actions and because there's no money in it for you. You'll go back when there's money in it for you.
Nothing you can say about Obama or anything else can justify this. This is a stain on American honour that will never be removed.
1
"Mr. Roebuck’s memo appears to be the first formal expression of dissent on Syria from a Trump administration official to be made public."
"Mr. Roebuck is the second senior American official in the past week who has challenged whether the United States pressed hard enough to avert a Turkish offensive into northern Syria."
This counting stuff is really difficult. But which is it? The first dissent or the second?
2
@CC
But you have to admit, Mr. Roebuck's quid pro quo is in plain sight, unlike our President's, whose quid pro quo is nowhere to be seen.
1
@J Brian
"I would like you to do us a favor, though" is quite clear.
2
A person whose life depend on having a war, will of course get mad when the war is ended.
We should never have been there, and am glad we are leaving.
4
This, in addition to other choices Trump has made, makes you wonder who's best interests this president is supporting.
3
The odd thing is this article assumes that we have a right to occupy the territory of a sovereign state?
We are not at war with Syria. We are not in hot pursuit of ISIS forces that were threatening American troops in Iraq. We have not been invited in by the internationally recognized government of Syria.
Yet here we are having a discussion over troop deployment and whether the Turkish invasion from the north is more or less legitimate than our invasion from the south.
The American people are tired of 18 years of Middle East war. We have never had a legitimate reason for being there other than the illegal control of Iraqi and now Syrian oil.
There were no WMD's and we had no right to stay as long as we have.
Any grad student could have told the administration that once we armed the Kurds that there would be a response from Turkey.
For the Times to assert that we aren't adequately protecting the Kurds is nonsense. We never should have used them as our foot soldiers in the first place.
By doing so we put them in jeopardy and the Turks are doing exactly what they said they would do--securing their southern border and keeping the Syrian Kurds from uniting with the Kurds in Turkey.
If we had any sense we would be participating the initiative between Russia, Turkey, Iran and Syria to bring about a cease fire and then a peace plan.
Syria and the Syrians need stability, even if it is under Assad. You can't build democracy while the bombs are falling.
1
Trump's idolization of strongmen dictators stems from his own weakness and insecurities. His own masculinity needs to be supported by others--like Putin, Orban, and Erdogan. He caved to Erdogan in what I understand was a brief phone call. Erdogan established his dominance when he visited Trump. Erdogan's own popularity has been fading as he the position of Mayor of Istanbul, his hometown, fell to his opponent in the March election. He was furious and ordered a second election in June. The first loss was by a small margin; the one in June was a landslide for his opposing party. And the same scenario occurred in Anakara, the capital. His own insecurities have seen him increase religious influences, violating Ataturk's, the founder of modern Turkey, secularism. Religion, mythology, is the path for the insecure.
5
It appears Mr. Roebuck may need to begin packing his things. His services will likely no longer be needed since he’s not towing the Trump/GOP line.
3
Words and accusations are flying around, but not the right ones to stem a bloodbath in northern Syria. People died and are continuing to die, and this is happening on our watch. Trump may or may not have been elected legitimately, but he's in the White House now, and the longer he's there the more chaos he will cause.
Our country is significantly less secure than it was before the careless troop withdrawal. We have enabled Turkey's ravaging of people who thought we were their friends. Who can blame them if they see us as their enemies now.
5
Sounds just like General Westmoreland and our abandonment of the South Vietnam government. The bottom line is that once an administration makes an awful mistake like in Syria and Libya (Bob Gates was right.), no future administration can correct it. Right?
1
This is why it’s so important for Presidents to place their assets in a blind trust At the minimum or preferably divest entirely.
Trump has business interests in Turkey. Even if he’s honest about not being directly involved, he knows he has business interests there. This gave Erdogan leverage with regards to Trump’s personal finances. You’re being very naive if you don’t think that influenced our national policy here.
6
Our Kurdish allies?
Can anyone name one instance where they fought "with us", and did not, at the same time, engage in a land grab?
Nor, should anyone forget the extensive "Kurd on Kurd" violence that has left thousands of Kurds dead - with their blood on their own hands - as members of the PUK faction and the KDP faction murdered each other.
There is much more to being an ally, than having a common enemy. Nobody is naive enough to think that France is actually our ally, so what is the reason, that everyone is so delighted with the Kurds now?
2
The Americans never abandoned the Kurds. It has always been Donald Trump who would do anything not to upset his dear Turkish friend and protector of ISIS, Erdogan. Trump has financial interests not just in hotels in Turkey, but other more profitable yet illegal, which he knows Erdogan has vital leverage against his best friend Trump if he was not on the same page.
2
What the United States of America, would do if an ethnic group decides to declare themselves a Nation? That is actually what the Kurds have been doing in Syria, in Iraq, and the United States of America helping those separatists. How can we justify that aggressive behavior to their motherland? Ah, I remembered now the motto “divide and conquer”
Not to worry Pompeo is leaving to run for the Senate and he will win. The State Department and the United States have become a terrible joke and nations know not to count on them except Saudi Arabia where Trump and Kushner are making money. I served in the military and was outraged when the infamous Lt. Calley was given a pardon by Nixon shortly before resigned. Of course I back the military a tough nasty job, but now I see Trump is going to give pardons to two men who were convicted of murder. One was turned in by his own men who he had ordered to shoot three men that they deemed not to be a threat. It is being pushed by the charged Congressman Hunter whose wife has already pleaded guilty. He and she were charged with fraud around charity funds. It will probably be seen by some in the military as Trump (who bought his way out like everything else in his life), as a good thing. For me one is taught the Military Code of Justice and how we are better and believe me to be convicted in a military court takes much more evidence than in a civilian court. Like policemen military officers do not take lightly convicting service personnel. It appears the Secretary of Defense was against it. It will be announced on November 11th. To meit spits on every service person that did their job with honor. Yes, battles today are tough, but what Trump did to the Kurds and now pardons shows he is just a buffon who relishes the power he never earned. Jim Trautman
3
@trautman -- relishes the power he never earned -- so right. and doesn't like nor want the responsibility and honor to even remotely pretend an interest in serving we-the-people, who pay his bills. I woke up this morning thinking about those gop senators, wondering what they see when they look in the mirror.
1
When the article says the SDF will get revenue from oil, it fails to mention from whom that revenue will be generated. In reality, SDF will sell that oil to Assad; hence, the US will protecting a trade between SDF and Assad, which doesn't make sense at all.
2
Erdogan has a tape of Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, greenlighting the Saudi crown Prince, MBS, to kidnap Jamal Khashoggi in Istanbul. He played it for Trump in a phone call before the Turkish invasion of the Kurdish areas of Syria. He's using that to compel Trump to put the interests of Turkey over those of the US and its other allies. Trump is compromised, compromised by the Russians and now by Turkey - and probably by others too.
2
It's been a good year for Vladimir Putin. Surely Trump is in line for that same Russian Order of Friendship medal Rex Tillerson got.
In the U S. we are all Kurds, betrayed by Trump.
25
I know more than the Generals. Ha
14
Wake up people. We have a hideous monster in the White House. It gets worse by the hour. We are in real crisis territory now.
17
Was Roebuck's "searing" memo a catalog of complaints? Did he wish for different orders? Did he think our national interest had been malled? Did he invite wholesale condemnation? Did he charge our allies were sold out? Was the reporter smirking when he chose the word "searing" for a story abput Roebuck?
Once again history shows the hold the Russians have on our POTUS. It is as transparent as the actual words of the president claiming the Kurds did not support us in WW11. And that was a good reason to annihilate the Kurdish population. It's less than six degrees of separation. Once again Moscow Mitch has aligned himself with the Orange Russian puppet.
11
@Everett Murphy Moscow Mitch and the entire GOP!
1
Erdogan has something he’s holding over Trump’s head that is leading to a lot of double dealing by Trump that is contrary to American interests.
In response to Trump’s early and intense anti-Muslim vitriol, Erdogan threatened to terminate the president’s Trump Towers Istanbul franchise.
Suddenly that threat was ended. No more threats were made and Trump has tolerated the intolerable from Erdogan, including his security guards assaulting Americans for protesting on public spaces in Washington
Erdogan, an authoritarian, crammed through basic changes in Turkey’s Constitution to stay in power indefinitely by limiting democracy. Voters demonstrate unhappiness with his increasingly authoritarian rule.
Kurdish citizens in Turkey expressed disapproval of Erdogan, including his labeling of all Kurds as terrorists by voting in parliamentary elections. Erdogan engaged in blanket reprisals against Kurdish cities and areas.
The claims Erdogan made about the Kurds in Syria made no sense except in extending Erdogan’s power. All Kurds are not terrorists.
Erdogan faces increased overall opposition in elections with voters anxious about his power grabs and deep corruption that has made Erdogan’s family incredibly wealthy.
Whatever Erdogan does. Trump applauds or looks away. A reasonable person looking at Trump’s businesses, his continued unethical actions, his family’s nepotistic involvement, must assume Trump is acting for himself, not the US interests. Corrupt meets corrupt.
30
@jmc "Erdogan, an authoritarian, crammed through basic changes in Turkey’s Constitution to stay in power indefinitely by limiting democracy."
I won't be surprised if Trump has fantasies of doing the same thing.
3
@jmc
Trump predictably plays fetch, wags his tail and rolls over for dictators and strongmen.
2
They share the bond of being lackeys for Putin. He’s got the goods on Trump.
1
Could we have expected anything done differently by President Bonespur?
26
The whistle blower opened the floodgates. Patriots and professionals are, and will continue to come forward. trump’s ignorance and petty motives will more and more be revealed. trump is an incompetent buffoon. He needs to go. Now!
36
please spare us the crocodile tears about syria.
the u.s. shouldn't be there.
end of story.
13
@flaart bllooger
Yes, the US shouldn't be in Syria....however, there is a correct way and a wrong way to do things. This was done the wrong and we should recognize that fact. There are lessons to be learned.
3
@flaart bllooger Crocodile tears? We may be in agreement that the US shouldn’t have been there in the first place, but the fact remains that we were, and that choice to meddle gave us a responsibility to the people to not desert them and leave their region in more danger.
2
@flaart bllooger Actually, it’s just the beginning of the story.
Russia won with Resident Donald Chernobyl’s help. Traitor, international mobster moron criminal. Dump trump, quickly.
28
Fellow readers have provided various points concerning this issue, many of them relevant. I would add one more; Will Mr. Roebuck testify in the impeachment hearings? He seems to support the testimony of Ambassador Taylor.
39
The Revolt of the Ambassadors seems to be gaining strength. More power to them!!
Pompeo should resign. He's not a leader, he's not supporting them and they aren't supporting him.
The American Flag may be flying over the Embassy but it is a long way from home. These diplomats need respect and recognition, not disregarded and discarded like Trump's subcontractors.
To paraphrase Khrushchev: "They will bury him."
56
@RLG
Not only is Pompeo not supporting career officers in the US State Department, he is undermining and sabotaging them -- just ask former Ambassador to Ukraine Marie Yovanovich.
And why? Since the first day of his Administration, Trump has been undermining all of our Federal Agencies, (*); and tops on his list was the State Department, so demoralized that in the first year, dozens of diplomats resigned in disgust, decimating the agency under Secy Tillerson. And Pompeo has turned out to be even worse.
(*) Other agencies have been sabotaged by the Trump/Bannon/Stephen Miller "Fox in the Henhouse method of appointments, e.g.: Betsy de Vos as Secy of Education; Ryan Zinke as Secy of the Interior; William Barr as AG - aka one of DJT's "personal" attorneys -- the list is long. Just google for yourselves. But not on a full stomach.
6
@RLG I agree.
We can hope. What I find sad is that with Trump our diplomats are ignored, disdained and abused.
Trump knows nothing about anything except his own business interests and even that is far less than most have assumed.
Trump’s knowledge about the world and diplomacy is very shallow. He’s not the first President with that problem, but others did not proclaim themselves as geniuses expert in everything from science to world affairs.
Making “deals” of Trump’s sort are worthless. His breaking the Iran deal has already led to their resumption of nuclear activities.
4
Ohhh...a "searing" memo.
That sounds bad, right?
Maybe the diplomat can find a way to make having a boss with a different opinion a "crime." Maybe get an anonymous "whistleblower" to line up the right talking points with a House committee before leaking their "concerns" to spark an "investigation."
That apparently is now standard fare in the State Deparment / intelligence bureacracies. For some reason, departmental disagreements are being weaponized by partisians, and publicized by their media allies to make the squabbling sound legitimate, but only if the complainers are anti-Trump.
Sounds like some sort of "resistance."
10
@Fred Rick
It's not anti-Trump. It's simply anti stupidity. Russian and Turkish military patrolling the area? No doubt, a gift to Putin.
8
@Fred Rick RW Whining is so annoying. Trump is not the victim. American values are.
8
@Fred Rick
I think you should back Rudy Guiliani for President next. Who needs a state department when
we 've got Rudy !!!!
7
The truth is that ever since even before DT was elected, if there hadn't been ignorant, arrogant, and horrific ideas about the world, the presence of American military troops around the world, there wouldn't be any policy at all. Anyone, in DT's administration, who had experience, years at the state department, and years working abroad, were not given any ability to follow through in whatever, and wherever they were, to advance the good for all those they were working for with, etc. It is even hard to fathom that things around the world could go from shaky, to disasters overnight. He alone, and those sycophants, who refused to publicly stand up against what he was doing, were, and are responsible for the deaths, suffering, etc. that went on not only in Syria, but other places in the middle east, Africa, Asia, etc. Help out of this White House, not at all, other than for strong men around the world.
10
Was Trump doing Russia's bidding? Was he protecting his financial interests in Ankara? There's so much to investigate and probably to impeach this man for that it makes one's head explode. But Republican's see no evil and hear no evil.
56
@Rich
Hard to see from the inside out.
1
@Rich Denial is a very powerful force.
@Rich - Russia is in Syria because President Obama dropped the ball on his famous red line. Russia grabbed the initiative and went in, with Syrian permission.
1
There is hardly a difference between ISIS and the Turkish backed Syrian militias. Both look at those that don't share their extreme beliefs as infidels that deserve death, but ISIS goes further and carry on the execution.
Erdogan's Turkey, along with its close allies in the Region have been the foremost supporters of Islamic extremists. They ought to be condemned, not befriended.
18
@KMZ
yes, but you must consider.... what's Russia's point of view? so closely aligned with ours....
1
Russia I believe is trying to build an alliance of autocratic states. Toward this end, will try to draw Turkey out of NATO and join this alliance. Unfortunately the Trump administration does not seem to care enough to check Putin's anti-democratic strategy.
1
Expecting Trump to reverse any of his decisions is sheer folly. Someone convinced Trump that the Kurds were bad and the Turks were good.
Trump talks to Erdogan and buys his story about the Kurds. Erdogan's advice gibes with the goals of their mutual friend Putin and advances his ambitions in the region.
That's it. No need to look any farther.
22
No. It's much simpler than that. Trump's got property in Istanbul.
The Republicans are America's greatest enemy. This is not hyperbole, it is fact.
96
Watch for Trump Tower Istanbul, coming soon. Next week’s meeting with one of his favorite dictators is basically just to get clearances for construction to begin. The dough will be rolling into the Trump family for decades, in their new Florida/Cayman Islands headquarters. Constitution? What Constitution?
34
@Robert M. Koretsky
It's already there. I have no doubt the Trump Tower Istanbul will have a very successful year. Of course there was no quid pro quo. It was just part of doing business. Good relations with Erdogan is good for Trump's business.
2
@Robert M. Koretsky Trump Tower Istanbul was built a while back. This stuff was done on Putin's orders.
1
He already has a Trump Towers in Istanbul, a two-tower combined office and apartment complex.
1
trump came into office vowing to break things up, not to fix or re built. and that's what he's doing. the only thing emhe said he would build is a wall and even that does not seem to go anywhere.
6
And Trump will kick off the Veterans Day parade?
7
@db2
Oh, no! Really? Let's hope the crowds give him the BOOOs he deserves!
5
@db2
That should be fun to watch....
New Yorkers hate his guts....
protests should be amazing..... hard to believe he agreed to do it...
Everyone who cares for the United States of America and our reputation and our promises and sees what Trump is doing as wrong SPEAK OUT!!
24
I don't know if William V. Roebuck understands how difficult it would have been for Trump to have improved on a "perfect conversation".
8
Syria is a sovereign country. America was not invited into Syria by Assad, nor is there a UN mandate for the U. S. to occupy Syria. The U.S. is there to presumably defeat ISIS, based on U.S. national security concerns. If ISIS is now defeated, what is the American military doing in Syria? What happened to the concerns back in 2012 about having American ‘boots on the ground’?
8
@J House
The Kurds are maintaining some 10-12,000 ISIS fighters as prisoners, and apparently about 60,000 ISIS supporters are under detention.
If they are released, the fighting starts all over again.
ISIS is not defeated.
18
ISIS is damaged not defeated. Left alone it will rise like a phoenix from the ashes. Moreover, what ever damage ISIS has suffered could not have been inflicted without our Kurdish allies. Precipitously withdrawing from Syria at the behest of Turkey without having assurances from the Turkish that they would not attack the Kurds was a betrayal of the first order.
2
@J House ISIS was defeated by the Kurds, albeit with weapons from us. They were our allies. We deserted our allies. What is so difficult to understand (I agree that this is what we have been doing lately and so perhaps should not be surprised any more)?
2
Will we ever know what's behind Trump's apparent service to Putin? It seems more than transactional.
I keep wondering about that televised event where Maria Butina, later identified as a Russian foreign agent, was in the audience; she stood up to ask Trump a question. She started saying she's from Russia. On hearing that, Trump gave a very approving "aah," as though just being Russian was admirable. That was such an unusual response, it begs an explanation.
A comment below said the Kurds should have known not to trust the US. Sure, but it's the US that had the power to help. If you're drowning, you grab whatever life raft is available.
25
@citizen vox Not only service to Putin. Please add all the authoritarians that he favors. Perhaps this is the brotherhood of oligarchs replacing the Kings, Kaisers and Czars of the past to rule over us, the bourgeois, the future serfs and foot soldiers that will feed and protect them in their gold lined parlors. Note also that domestic policies are designed to diminish the population. Too many of us common folk occupy the museums and universities.
Thank you Mr. Roebuck for putting Trump's folly into writing. As a Republican voter, I deplore the weakness, short-sightedness and unreliability of Trump's rapid retreat at the behest of Turkey's authoritarian ruler Erdogan. Trump's odd affinity for authoritarians like Erdogan and Putin was a key reason I could not vote for him. He lacks ideological mooring, and his foreign policy bears little resemblance to historic positions of the G.O.P. His weak abdication to Ergodan and Putin not only sacrificed Kurdish allies, it also put our ally Israel at greater risk. (A U.S. presence would have deterred Turkey not because of the number of U.S. troops there, but rather because of the strength of the nation backing those troops. Today, that strength is in question.)
99
@Wesley
Bravo. A pity more Republican voters do not share your good judgment.
4
@Wesley...thank you. What happened to the RP in that a balanced, logical assessment like this is the exception? And, TrumPutin's penchant for human swine is only predictable when we consider how entire populations--eh, hem---are seduced by the same egotistical idiocy.
4
@Wesley It must feel bad to have supported a party that turned itself to sycophants at the feet of a traitor. I sympathize.
But we cannot clean this mess up--and remove Russian influence from our own political system--until we remove Republicans from any position where they might exercise power. They are all either corrupt or have condoned corruption.
I'm not saying we don't have to keep an eye on Democrats. We do. That's the beauty of our political system. But right now the clear and present danger to our republic is the Republican party.
Congratulations to Virginia for getting us started down the path toward redeeming our republic.
2
Given what we've learned about Mr. Trump's self-serving agenda, we have to wonder if his actions regarding Turkey/Russia are related to the 2020 election. What promises did he extort in return for allowing the invasion?
52
@JD Athey Or, in other words, what did Putin threaten to do or not do if Trump did NOT allow/encourage the invasion?
Trump was made an offer he couldn't refuse. By his patron, Putin, who told him to withdraw U.S. troops or be run over by Turkish troops. He complied.
39
perhaps there are other things Putin holds over Trump to force him to comply to Russian demands?
"For not trying harder"? Did Trump try at all?
This seemed to be typical of Trump decisions, whomever got to him last, that's who he'll listen to. Did he even understand the situation for the US and the world, or was he just interested in his "two, not just one" towers in Turkey?
This danger to the USA, Mr. Trump, must be removed from office before he endangers the entire world any more than he already has.
88
@Inkspot : I heard a report right after this happened that Erdogan yelled at Trump for about a half an hour and Trump just wanted to get off the phone, he couldn't handle it.
I bet there was something transactional going on, too, though.
3
Trump, because of his ignorance on this situation, has caused an ethic cleansing of the Kurds.
Mr. Roebuck, the top American diplomat in northern Syria, calls the abuses “what can only be described as war crimes and ethnic cleansing.”
Pence, however, believes that the deal with Erdogan for a five day ceasefire [which didn't hold] was 'a diplomatic victory for President Trump'. Sorry, the Kurds were our allies. Ethnic cleansing of them is not a diplomatic victory in any sense of the word.
Because of this blunder, Russian and Turkish troops have taken over a vast swath of Kurdish-held territory in northern Syria.
Why does Trump support dictators over our allies?
52
@Carol Ring
"Ethnic cleansing of [an ally] is not a diplomatic victory": Amen!
If I were an Israeli politician, I'd be trembling ion my boots at the prospect of a nuclear Saudi-backed large-scale intifada. After all, Trump has shown he's in bed with M.B.S. (giving him a free pass for the execution and dismemberment of an American resident). And that would surely be popular with the many anti-Semitic & white supremacist segments of his "base"....
6
@Carol Ring
Oh stop. Our Kurdish allies were wrongly abandoned and they have paid a heavy price. But there has been no "ethnic cleansing" of the Kurds. Not even close. Let's not overstate things just to show our anti-Trump bona fides.
"...Russian and Turkish troops have taken over a vast swath of Kurdish-held territory in northern Syria."
Who cares? They only American thing that their dominance in Syria threatens is our ego. Let them have that bombed out war zone.
1
There is a kind of core pathos in the memo, that the diplomat thought his president was not as petty, weak, and corrupt to upend, in the course of a phone call, all the diplomacy that was preventing "war crimes and ethnic cleansing," not to mention the rekindling of terrorist threats to Europe and The US.
Elections really do matter, sometimes in lives.
38
I've read this article twice and I still don't know how America benefited from this massacre of the Kurds, our reputation and our efforts to wipe out ISIS. Whoever this betrayal was done for, the American people, their safety and their interests, never made it into the equation.
41
Somebody stroked Trump's ego and lied about the situation. Trump folded like a cheap suit, again. Now people have died, families are left without a husband and father and Trump goes off to a rally to hear the roar of the crowds. The U.S. is seen as unreliable, indecisive and cowardly. Way to go Trump.
3
The question for me is what does Putin really have on Trump? There has to be something really big because it just makes no sense any other way.
70
@Harry Putin owns Trump lock, stock and barrel. When no major banks would lend to the recurrently bankrupt Trumps (other than Deutsche--probably with Russian funds) the Russians did. And in the bargain, Russian oligarchs have been able to launder money through Trump enterprises.
Trump has been in bed with the Russians since the 1990s.
Russian oligarchs don't lend their money without some security. Because Trump has been complicit in all of this money laundering, they have at least that to hold over his head. I suspect they have a whole lot more--including the ability to bankrupt him with a phone call.
So Donnie Bonespurs is going to do what Putin says. And be grateful for the opportunity.
4
@Harry
The 2016 election.
3
The top American diplomat on the ground in northern Syria has criticized the Trump administration for not trying harder to prevent Turkey’s military offensive there last month — and said Turkish-backed militia fighters committed “war crimes and ethnic cleansing.”
Well the answer is quite simple, Trump is a traitor working for the benefit of Putin and the Russians who hold his debt and preventing the Turks from invading Syria and wiping out the Kurds was not part of Putin's plan. Trump did what Putin wanted -- he gave Erdogan the OK to invade.
67
With reference to ongoing Ukraine saga, Lindsey Graham was quoted as saying “What I can tell you about the Trump policy toward Ukraine. It was incoherent. It depends on who you talk to; they seem to be incapable of forming a quid pro quo." I disagree with much of Sen. Graham says and does, but on this he was correct. And the same comments about being “incoherent” and being “incapable” apply to Syria and much else. The chief architect of what passes for our foreign policy the president. So, how could someone so incoherent and incapable become president of the U.S.A., why is he still in office, and why do Sen. Graham and others still support him?
31
The Trump Regime had no interest in averting a Turkish attack. Conversely, it had interest in aiding what happened there, and in promoting Putin and Russian objectives in the region. Trump consistently aids Putin's foreign policy aims. Like has been said often: All Roads Lead To Putin.
31
Trump owns this action. There are many ways the Turkish offensive could have been prevented. Clearly Trump gave Erdogan a green light, abandoning our most effective allies in the war against the Islamic State, throwing our foreign policy into chaos, and signing a death warrant for numerous innocent civilians. The State Department must be totally frustrated that Trump undermines our allies and empowers the Russians, the Iranians, and Assad. I know I am.
17
I am not qualified to make psychological diagnoses so I don't. Yet I will say that everything we can observe about Trump says that he doesn't care about anyone but himself.
I am qualified to evaluate bad thinking, however, and I can say that Trump's ability in that area is rudimentary at best. Everything we can observe about Trump says that he doesn't really think; let alone badly.
This man should not be in the White House deciding matters of life and death for people People who are in a position to stop his incoherent selfishness and are not doing so are acting both immorally and unpatriotically.
59
I am qualified to make a psychological assessment. I was the director of research at the Michigan Center for forensic psychiatry. Trump is clearly not mentally Ill but rather a common criminal. He is guilty by reason of sanity.
4
Trump grovels at the feet of dictators. There is nothing he won't do to elicit one word of praise from them.
42
Trump didn’t care about any facts. He just did what Putin told him to do. So now we are defending oil rigs and allowing the slaughter of the Kurds.
30
The current White House resident demands, and generally gets, loyalty to Himself personally, rather than to protecting the Constitution.
One must ask to whom does He give His loyalty? His lifelong pattern is that of self-service. But for unclear reasons, virtually all of His decisions as national figurehead, whether harming NATO and our other allies, gutting the intelligence services, or encouraging white nationalism and internal strife, benefit one person. Putin.
When history is written, unless, of course, the White House gang writes it, Putin's hold on the current regime will shine darkly.
26
Article by Peter Galbraith in latest New York Review of Books fleshes out this story. Hard to read. Mr. Trump should have no supporters in Congress or in the electorate right now.
It's possible to decry the waste in human life and resources of these wars and want them over without bowing to the feckless
policies of a president who knows zero and cares little about the world around him.
36
Trump's bellicose blathering is seen by the world as just that. His threats mean nothing. In that case more "talk-talk" could have been productive. Now what do we have? Anybody out there know?
6
Mr. Roebuck represents the interests of the American people and our allies
Donald Trump represents Donald Trump
There is a Trump Tower Istanbul
There is no Trump Tower Kurdistan
QED
29
With reference to ongoing Ukraine saga, Lindsey Graham was quoted as saying “What I can tell you about the Trump policy toward Ukraine. It was incoherent. It depends on who you talk to; they seem to be incapable of forming a quid pro quo." I disagree with much of Sen. Graham says and does, but on this he was correct. And the same comments about being “incoherent” and being “incapable” apply to Syria and much else. The chief architect of what passes for our foreign policy is the president. So, how could someone so incoherent and incapable become president of the U.S.A., why is he still in office, and why do Sen. Graham and others still support him?
8
In response to the headline.....You think? Mr Trump has the blood of so many innocent people on his hands. Children completely abused and neglected by his separation policy. Kurds who gave up huge numbers fighting alongside us. And on and on. When his son said on “The View” that so many people thank him for making them wealthier, I have to ask, has he ever toured the streets of cities in America, where homeless people languish and die young? Of course not.
27
@GGram
Thanks for your simple, moral response.
If it gives you relief, NY demanded his tax records and the court ruled that he must give them up. He is going to the supreme court, in a delaying tactic. It is likely they will refuse to hear the case, on the grounds that the lower court ruling is so clear and the case quite simple. Regardless of the outcome, this establishes the precedent that being president does not insulate anyone from prosecution. Of course Jim Jordan and the gutless republican sycophants will scream and holler ... That is what ear plugs are for.
Perhaps I'm dreaming, but my hope is that impeachment will be merely the first step.
He belongs in jail for the rest of his life.
1
not enough was done because Trump INTENDED to give Syria to Turkey and Russia
28
The Kurds are a brave and proud people. They deserve their own country. What is now Kurdistan was once a part of the Ottoman Empire.
Allowing the Turks to storm the border and sweep the Kurds out was an unwise and cowardly act of abandonment by the administration and should be counted as an impeachable act.
25
@chuck most kurds already live inside Turkey, and have for centuries. Are you proposing war against a NATO ally to carve a Kurdistan.
1
I think we are forgetting that Turkish officials have audio recordings of the detailed castration and dismemberment of a journalist at the Saudi embassy in Turkey. They also have phone records showing the Saudi assassin’s then reaching out to Jared Kushner afterwards thus giving the Turkish government enormous leverage over the behavior of our ethically and intellectually challenged President who instinctively acts to protect his son in law and, as always, himself.
23
@Matt Malloy
I haven't seen the allegations that you make reported as news in credible journalism. It would help , if you provided sources/evidence.
Not defending Trump et al...but looking for truth.
Nope. If Turkey attacked, it’s on Turkey.
4
If only the world was that simple. Read history.
1
@PC
Isn't that something Don Vito Corleone (aka Marlon Brando) said in "The Godfather"?
1
Trump's bottomless ignorance abetted by his total lack of real interest in his Presidential responsibilities is just cause to remove him from office ASAP. The Kurdish military as well as the U.S. military in Syria are the latest victims of his mania. It would be interesting to learn the true reason for this latest breach or protocol.
14
@Pauline Hartwig We can only guess at motivation most of the time, though it's clear that Trump is interested in business in Turkey, to put it mildly. For me, it's more than enough that he tries to justify terrible decisions that are clearly not in the interest of the American people.
2
"...the senior official acknowledged that the Turkish-based Syrian force included ill-disciplined Arab fighters — the Arabs and Kurds have a history of sometimes bloody rivalry in the region — and that some embrace radical Islamic ideology."
There it is. Another victory for Trump, Putin, and Erdogan: Turkish-countenanced atrocities committed against the Kurds by Arab fighters. Words fail.
4
Perhaps in November 2020, the name of the Republican presidential candidate on the ballot should be Vladimir Putin, because in every meaningful way, the Republican Party is in service to him.
32
@Michael The morning that the 2016 election results were released, someone asked me who won. My answer was "Putin." I still stand by that response.
2
The reckless individual who ordered this foolish and abrupt abandonment of our Kurdish ally —
Needs to be held accountable.
20
"... AVERT Turkish attack?" WHAT?!
Are we sure he didn't send a formal INVITATION to attack?
14
This is what happens when you put a “very stable genius” in charge of things.
14
People are understandably losing trust in America.
14
Outrageous and disgusting. This surely qualifies as crimes against humanity conducted on the orders of the "very stable genius" Donald Trump. A very dark moment in American history. This is not ...ever...how we Make America Great Again!
20
Incompetence just keeps piling up upon the Trump Administration. This one adds another layer to the already extant idiocracy, the incompetence of Pompeo and the traitorous fecklessness of the Republicans in Congress. It is ALL on Trump and his “boys” (the term “men” would be a misnomer).
They will NEVER stop playing this like a reality show without consequence. People die because of them, every day, and they do not care. Whatever “allies” we HAD, we no longer have - they cannot trust Trump and will not commit themselves to his ignorant follies.
We need someone with BRAINS, COMPASSION and strategic process in the White House; someone NOT REPUBLICAN. They have shown only the ability to obstruct, steal, grift and whine about how everyone except them is a traitor. Quite the opposite if one cares to actually look at FACTS. I don’t expect Trump’s dwindling “base” to waste their precious time actually seeking truth - they’ve had their chance many time and have not risen to the level of decent Americans that PARTICIPATE in our Democracy other than to demonize those they false perceive as their political enemies.
A short point - were it not for the Democrats, the rabid Republicans would no longer have the freedoms of speech, voting or most other Constitutional guarantees. Trump would have trampled them all and declared himself God.
18
Memo from foreign service careerists: It’s not our fault!
Wow, what a surprise.
Maybe someone ought to be developing a workable policy after the humiliation in Libya, a nearly decade long massacre in Syria and, coming soon, a nuclear Iran.
These guys sound like the generals of Vietnam. They are completely incompetent.
1
@Erin The Foreign Service does not run the U.S. government, and it functions under a political appointee as Secretary of State. It does its best to promote the interests of the USA in many different areas, includng conflict. But, when the US president is as conflicted as trump is, and there is no guidance on true diplomacy from trump's lackey pompeo, it is impossible to solve or reasonably deter the problems that have been constantly caused with the assistance of rudy guiliani and trump. If you voted for trump, include yourself in sharing the blame.
3
@Erin Trump himself created the potential for a nuclear Iran by his bigly incompentence in withdrawing from a pact that all other countries involved confirmed was in fact working to keep Iran from going nuclear.
The Times should check the President’s phone logs to see if there were any timely conversations with Putin beforehand. Let’s not lose the thought that Moscow may be calling all the shots here.
16
You can practically hear all these diplomats saying "...he's our ignorant, naive and amateurish commander in chief, but what can we do?"
5
It appears that this was staged from the beginning. Turkey has no Business in Syria. Russia is ok with the rape & murder of Syrian little kids and woman. The United states of America made an amateur move telegraphing its leave and the abandonment of its Bases to our long time enemies the Russians. The Question is why is Donald Trump handing Russia a gift. Congress and the inter departments of our Government has an Oath to the people of our nation. It's not being fulfilled.
8
Thank you Mr. Roebuck for speaking truth to power. The current dotard in the White House is inept, immoral, and a disgrace to our country.
16
Who cares what he thinks? It isn’t his decision
3
@Michael Livingston’s It certainly wasn't Mr. Roebuck's decision, but his opinion matters. He is a very intelligent man who knows the situation. That is far more than our "stable genius" and his White House staff can claim. And I, as a voter, care very much what Mr. Roebuck thinks.
1
Well all you Republican Senators, cat got your tongue? Oh, I forgot, the new Republican mantra, Senator reelection first, then Trump, then party, then, ......, and finally country.
8
When do the Senate/House “Benghazi style” hearings began on this?
10
The President who isn't. Rather, he's a liar and a borderline "traitor" to our nation when it comes right down to it.
I look forward to seeing him impeached and tossed into the gully of deceit and self-interest.
Don't let him get away with it, folks.
16
Of course, Putin's approval of the Turkish Invasion couldn't be countered by Trump.
"I"m no Puppet"
Yeah, you are.
14
But, but maga. Right?
4
Turkey's history of killing Christians is well-known. How can the Evangelicals justify Trump's abandonment? What would VP Pence have done if he were president?
5
@Thinking Silent Pence would ask Mother what she thought.
North Syria is a war zone , Maybe you meant top military. Cus diplomats place are in the capital city of that country .
1
Every day more news surfaces about Trump's blunders and corruption. Every day he babbles incoherently on Twitter. Every day he dismisses all criticism as fake news. And every day virtually all Republican voters and literally all elected agree with him.
Just once I'd like to see a comment in the Times from a Trump supporter saying something like "Yeah, he's a fool, illiterate, corrupt, a liar and a blowhard-braggart and I sure wouldn't want to hang out with him much less let him anywhere near my wife or daughters, but I'm opposed to Democratic policies so I feel he's the lesser evil."
I could at least accept the logic of that view. But they simply parrot his nonsense; really depressing that half the people in this country are either that disingenuous or that stupid.
10
Trump green-lighted the invasion in a phone call with Erdogan. This is what you get with an incompetent president who thinks he's the smartest guy in the room and who has a certain affection for thuggish foreign leaders.
15
OMG, another poison pen memo assailing Trump. It seems everyone has taken extension classes from the James T. Comey Institue.
3
@John Doe
Tell that to the Kurds!
5
Truth is problematic for liars. Trump cannot avoid the truth of the blood on his hands in this mess.
@db2, this sudden American obsession with Kurds. You realize don’t you this is not Little Miss Muffet.
Five letter reason P-U-T-I-N.
15
Every drop of blood is on the hands of the despicable and destructive orange monster in the White House. And the GOP is STILL standing by him. Astounding.
18
Trump's propaganda twitter feed is going to blow a gasket trying to disparage all the long serving and decorated patrots he claims are "never - Trumpers".
Most people will be proud to wear that hat.
13
Just another Trump Hater in the State Dept. Americans would do good to just ignore these Never Trumpers selectively leaking to msm.
2
@John Gilday I have news for you. The world doesn't like your man Trump because he's a boor. You are living in a bubble trying to explain away his lurching attempts at statesmanship. For instance, how do you explain the fact that he turned his back on the US government's Kurdish allies allowing them to be massacred? Doing something like that just isn't normal behaviour for a head of state. Also, what about his thuggish demands of Ukraine's new leader to get incriminating info on Biden and do it in public or face the withholding of the military aid Ukraine desperately needed. If you read this paper you must know all this so why do you still cut Trump slack? It doesn't make sense.
1
Trump has proven that the Mark Twain quote is true:
“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”
― Mark Twain
Trump has destroyed any morals and institutions we value. Thanatos is alive and well in the white house.
20
Trump wanted the Turks to invade Syria. He all but said so. And within days he will host President Erdogan at the White House. He showed no empathy for the plight of the Kurds, and offered no help. Some might say it seems he conspired with, Erdogan, Putin, and Assad to invade Syria. As this article describes, he did nothing to deter it, and everything to encourage it.
25
Trump's abandonment of the Kurds is one of the greatest betrayals in American history.
Almost everything Trump does seems worthy of impeachment.
301
@Socrates "Everything Trump touches, dies" ...
10
Trump has been in power since the beginning of 2017. Any foreign person or diplomat should know by now that any involvement with Trump will ultimately result in being lied to, criticized, dishonored, and left in the gutter. The Kurds are not ignorant people. They should have known better than to trust Trump. In their case it was worst of two evils: the Turks or Trump. Most Americans don't even know who, what, where about the Kurds. Yes, unconscionable, but there are so many horrible lines drawn in war one begins to stop counting. In the Middle East a new terrible line is drawn every day.
21
@Me Too
Why should the Kurds have known better than to trust Trump? I think all this falls into the "it's hard to believe" category. Who expected any of this? Most Kurds who have hope the US will help them probably feel like most of us who live here and ask everyday: Are we safe with him in the WH? What will he do next? Who would ever have thought the POTUS can't be trusted?
5
Watch Congressional supporters compartmentalize this as if it were the first foreign relations blunder of the Trump Administration. Since day one Trump has disparaged our allies and played up to the world's dictators. To use his terminology he's 'Bad News.' Those who remain with him in his administration are not people of high caliber, they're just lap dogs. They've taken a long term situation with Iran and made it worst; they've glorified the North Korean dictator and achieved nothing. Last month they abandoned an ally in Middle East and then scurried off to reward on dictator and ceded the area to Putin and Assad. Tired of winning yet?
45
@Michael Kelly
You left out soooo much . . . what about undermining NATO? Withdrawal from the TPP, allowing China to consolidate power? Impose tariffs on Canada, due to "strategic" issues - for god's sake, Canada?
And many, many, more.
Trump has the Midas touch in reverse - everything he touches turns to poop.
6
@Chris
Of course I left out a great deal. The list would be pages long.
Speaking of leaving things out. The Democratic thrust is on only one thing. And legal geniuses like Lindsay Graham don't consider that a misdeed.
It's really not a mystery why this happened. As Nancy Pelosi succinctly put it, with Trump, all roads lead to Putin.
129
It sounds like Syria is not aware of Trump's [primary] intentions to help Putin. How naive and clueless of them to make their suggestions or even to have their anger.
9
A complete fiasco. A betrayal of our allies and our troops. Reports of a Turkish attack on an ISIS prison are coming in. This is falling apart along the lines we feared. And Erdogan is coming to the White House next week to cement the betrayal.
46
I'm not sure it's fair to make the argument that someone didn't try hard enough to put out a fire when they themselves are the one who started it.
33
Trump probably approves of the Turkish offensive.
The 1923 Treaty of Lausanne in 1923 established the borders of modern Turkey, Syria and Iraq but denied the Kurds their own state. For decades, Kurds have been working to carve a homeland—Kurdistan—out of the Turkish, Iraqi and Syrian borderlands. Many Americans support the Kurds efforts to establish a Kurdish homeland, but this has never been U.S. policy
As a Wall Street Journal columnist recently pointed out, “Turkey is an Article 5 NATO ally. We have obliged Ankara for two decades by designating its Kurdish separatists as terrorists. The U.S. has never advocated breaking up Syria (or Iraq, Iran or Turkey) to allow a Kurdish state. U.S. support for an autonomous Kurdish enclave in Iraq was dependent on the Kurds’ recognizing Baghdad’s sovereignty and not using Iraqi Kurdistan as a base to subvert neighboring states.”
Turkey is a U.S. ally. Turkish soldiers has also fought alongside U.S. soldiers. The Kurds have been conducting guerrilla operations from their Syrian enclave. To assert that the United States should used military actions to prevent a NATO ally from protecting itself from cross border attacks is absurd.
6
Turkey WAS a US ally; now we kowtow to their wishes
2
It wasn’t that long ago that Americans in general were blathering in these boards and elsewhere that our activities since Dubya’s war began had cost us too much blood in the form of deaths and disabilities of our troops, killed thousands upon thousands of innocent middle easterners, flushed much of our economy away, and ruined our credibility generally. That we are not the world’s policeman and we ought to back off and let the rest of the world handle its own problems.
And now it’s all about Trump betraying the Kurds, and how the worst thing we could do is stop playing the middle east’s adult in the sandbox. Make up your minds. We’re in it or we’re not.
I can't remember more continuous revelations about an administration's current foreign policy than under the Trump-Pence. And this is coming from all levels of the diplomatic corps. Either the Deep State has bubbled to the surface in a coming-out party or people are making decisions to save themselves from something.
31
@Richard G I would say they are making decisions to save the country and the integrity of our government.
Career employees--and a handful of political appointees with loyalty to the country--adhere to their oath of office that includes "to defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic. ..."
8
@Richard G Two sides to every coin. My understanding is that attempts were underway to create a demilitarized zone along the Turkish/Syrian/Iraqi border. Assumption is that Cadet "Sharpie" Bone Spurs was oblivious to that. Not surprised.
4
This internal memo is very reminiscent of the "Blood Telegram" dispatched by US embassy staff in Dhaka, in the former East Pakistan.
The embassy staff were horrified by an ethnic cleansing campaign by paramilitary forces of Pakistan, a US ally. They were even more disturbed by Washington's silence and inaction. What followed was the most strongly worded telegram in the history of the US Foreign Service:
"Our government has failed to denounce the suppression of democracy. Our government has failed to denounce atrocities. Our government has failed to take forceful measures to protect its citizens while at the same time bending over backwards to placate the West Pak[istan] dominated government and to lessen any deservedly negative international public relations impact against them. Our government has evidenced what many will consider moral bankruptcy,..." - March 27, 1971
The genocide would continue until December 1971, when an Indian intervention (which the US opposed) restored normalcy.
So what happened in Syria is nothing new. It's just history repeating itself. 38 years later this same telegram could well have been sent by a US diplomat to Washington to describe the latter's approach to the Kurds and the abetting of Turkey's murderous actions.
40
@Jack This was done by the last rethuglican president who had to be impeached, richard nixon. There appears to be something genetically different with them, an important piece, one that makes people honest and compassionate is missing.
4
Pelosi is right: all roads lead back to Russia with this President. Maybe we won’t know for years why but in the meantime he needs to be impeached.
182
@Covfefe And removed.
9
We already know why. Trump is indebted to the Russian mobster state. It bailed him out of bankruptcy and win him the election.
6
The diplomat is being diplomatic. Erdogan called Trump and Trump moved the few US troops that were on the border. Turkey would never have attached if there had been a chance to hurt or kill US troops. The 2 dozen US troops were a trip wire or human shield. Aside from being a NATO "ally" Turkey would not have risked that for fear of US economic and military response.
81
@Denis We do not know what Trump received in return, the Quid pro Quo.
6
@Denis The Q p Q may have have just been the the approval of a strongman/dictator, the type that Trump so admires.
3
@Denis A NATO member siding and patrolling with Russia what was once an American allies territory, at the behest of our current president. What is wrong with these Republican senators and congress that they cannot see the duplicity in their leader?
3
This is the B of the Trump ABCs. Betrayal.
Trump's impeachable offenses are ABC: Abuse, Betrayal and Corruption. This comes from an analyst on either MSNBC or CNN, I can't remember which one. Abuse, he abused his power as president for personal gain by trying to get Ukraine to investigate his political rival. Betrayal, he betrayed a strategically important American ally, Ukraine, who was relying on our military aid to fight off Russia. Corruption, he tried to get a foreign government to meddle in our election.
Here, in Syria, so far we only know about B, betrayal of an American ally thereby allowing the ethnic cleansing discussed in the memo. But it would not shock me if we learned there is also an A and a C in Syria, too. He is just doing what he does.
108
Mr. Mark, "Corruption, he tried to get a foreign government to meddle in our election."
Again. This is not the first time.
10
If Mr Roebuck doesn’t show some more patriotism towards Russian national interests he is going to be fired and attacked by Trump very soon. Remember: to please your boss, you need to please your boss’s boss.
114
People of color, especially those not feeding money to the Trump Empire, have no meaning for Donald. He could care less about the memo.
39
It is obvious that all the Big Guys knew what was to occur.
19
Nice scoop! The Trump Administration is a collection of hooligans.
45
@Imperato
"Hooligans"? You are too gentle on the Trump Administration. A "hooligan" is a "young troublemaker"
Trump now heads a full-blown crime syndicate. They are all crooks and thieves; grifters; lawless and ferocious in their attacks on anyone who crosses them.
The one thing that is unusual is that their leader is not smart. Trump is pretty much just a crude-talking puppet -- the Charley McCarthy to McConnell's and Putin's Edgar Bergen.
It will be fascinating to see what happens when the Keystone Kops (Giuliani, Sondland, maybe even Trump himself ) testify in public.
6
Yes, well said, Mr. Roebuck. And shame not only on the cowardly Trump, bending to dictator of Turkey, Erdogan and fellow dictators Putin and the odious Assad. You spoke truth to power and Pompeo was morally AWOL as usual. Let's see Pompeo shuttle off again to Kansas to steal the GOP nomination for the vacant Senate seat. What a disgusting shill for Trump Pompeo is, sucking up to Trump to get the CIA job but always had State in mind. Pompeo, Congressman for Wichita, where Koch Bros HQ is who funded Pompeo's business there and funded his campaigns. A loathsome individual. It's on Kansas voters now and they are looney Trumpers, most of them. You get the lickspittle if you want him. Invertebrate McConnell wants Pompeo to run. Hope McC gets the bum's rush in Kentucky like Bevin did on Tuesday.
69
@Michael
Wrong about KS voters being "looney Trumpers". KS voters just voted out a Rep gov for a Dem & SOUNDLY defeated Kris Kobach's bid for gov. We replaced a Rep senator with a Dem. KS voters are capable of thinking clearly.
4
That internal memo is based on a wrong premise. The problem is not that the US didn't try harder, it gave its approval to the invasion. It's not that the Kurds feel betrayed, it is that they were betrayed.
493
@Michael OFarrell
They were betrayed because, according to Trump, the Kurds didn’t help the US during World War II... and they didn’t help during the Korean War, Vietnam, Civil War and the American Revolution. So there! (Tongue in cheek)
32
@LT Left out War of 1812 -- landlocked country - no navy - no way to get here. Trump unaware of that.
9
@LT trump didn't help the US during any of those wars either. his bone spurs were forever acting up. To bad they aren't acting up now, so he can at the very least not involve us in any foreign entanglements his feeble mind cooks up.
10
Trump gave Turkey the go-ahead on their military offensive! There was no attempt to prevent it.
213
To get a much greater appreciation of just how far we have fallen, thanks to Trump's ignorance, corruption, and debt to Putin, one needs to read Emmanuel Macron's interview in The Economist.
The lack of American leadership in Europe and the Middle East have the net effect of de facto abdication of its position as the world power in favor of the former Soviet Union.
It makes it all the more infuriating that the so-called #Resistance has been so timid in taking Bob Mueller's work and applying it in Congress and taking the latest scandal, Ukraine, and jailing officials who refuse to testify. The entire Trump administration should be prosecuted for its first high crime: treason. The rest is just more stuff...
How long will it take to regain the trust of our allies and put things right? I hope voters choose wisely this time.
438
@Rima Regas
IMHO — definitely should be an NYT Pick
20
@Rima Regas
Well said Rima, long time no hear; you OK?
10
"American priorities are changing. When President Barack Obama, who was intent on pivoting towards Asia, chose not to punish the use of chemical weapons in Syria it signalled that America was losing interest in the Middle East. Mr Trump’s recent abandonment of America’s Kurdish allies in Syria not only reinforced this, but also undermined nato. America did not inform its allies, and Turkey, a nato member, promptly invaded Syria. “Strategically and politically,” Mr Macron says, “we need to recognise that we have a problem.”
Asked whether he is confident that an attack on one nato member would today be seen as an attack on all—the idea that underpins the alliance’s credibility—Mr Macron says that he does not know. He acknowledges that nato thrives operationally, but he calls for Europe “to reassess the reality of what nato is in the light of the commitment of the United States.”"
The Economist
https://www.economist.com/leaders/2019/11/07/assessing-emmanuel-macrons-apocalyptic-vision
16
Avert the attack? Trump seemed to encourage it.
315
@Dan B That was my impression also.
56
"In a searing internal memo, the diplomat, William V. Roebuck, raised the question of whether tougher American diplomacy, blunter threats of economic sanctions and increased military patrols could have deterred Turkey from attacking. Similar measures had dissuaded Turkish military action before."
My understanding is that Trump affirmatively gave permission to Turkey to invade Syria, rather than merely failing to resist.
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@MainLaw That was my understanding too. It seems that our beloved president has the authority to permit or forbid other countries when it comes to their own military actions. What a guy !
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@mainlaw
as terrible & sad as it is, i think you are right... and i think the same is true for the brutal murder of jamal kashoggi... the saudis asked for and got green light beforehand just like erdogan got the permission to kill the kurds...
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@MainLaw
Agreed. Trump is clueless and Putin probably has 'UI' against his name (useful idiot).
This truly awful state of affairs has been made possible by those pathetic shills, sycophants, and sellouts on the right in Congress who have allowed Trump's idiocrasy to get as far as it has; I'm talking about people like Moscow Mitch and Lindsay Graham.
So sad for those allies of ours who we left to a near certain death when we pulled out so fast that we even left the Cokes in the Coke machine.
I'm a 20 year veteran and can't understand a single person in the services voting for traitorous Trump.
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