If the Democrats nominate a progressive candidate they will lose in 2020. There is no progressive majority in America & never will be. The numbers are simply not there. And there certainly is no progressive Electoral College coalition in America that could get to the needed 270 votes. This point can't be emphasized enough: almost every progressive candidate in whom Democrats invested tremendous time, money, & emotional energy in 2018—Beto O’Rourke in Texas, Andrew Gillum in Florida, Stacey Abrams in Georgia— lost. Almost every significant progressive initiative on the ballot in this country was voted down. If this election is about kitchen table issues: jobs & healthcare there's no way the Democrats lose. If it's about reparations, immigration, & wedding cakes there's no way we win. These are the only issues that would compel independent swing voters to hold their nose & vote for Trump again. If any of the far-left candidates are the nominees in 2020 we will lose and lose decisively. What progressives & their co-dependents will never understand is that far-left mobilizes it's opponents to an even greater degree. Anti-left” will always beat “anti-Trump” in most places in this country but especially in swing states like Ohio & Florida. Our best chance is to run from the center....that's where the votes are.
42
@Bill Brown Why can't we just focus on the economy and health care and focus less on social issues like reparations and wedding cakes? I still want someone progressive on the economy and health care. One doesn't need to be a centrist to avoid coming off as a crazy activist.
17
@James People aren't stupid. Most of these candidates have already taken positions that is way to the left of most mainstream voters. The 2020 race will turn on policy. Warren is for reparations. In poll after poll, the majority of American voters are against this. Reparations are the only issue that would compel independent swing voters to hold their nose & vote for Trump. Reparations guarantees the Democrats will lose the working-class vote. Voters are also strongly against any legislation that would increase the flow of illegal immigration. But Warren is for policies that not only decriminalize illegal immigration but encourage it. They & their progressives allies are on the wrong side of this issue. Last January NY lawmakers voted to allow illegal immigrants the ability to receive scholarships & financial aid. How are Democrats supposed to tell voters that state aid to help afford college isn't available for them but is available for those who are in this country illegally? Many state Democrats are now offering illegals free healthcare, welfare, drivers licenses, schooling, & sanctuary. This is unsustainable. Why is the only answer, that they have an unrestricted right to come to the U.S.? The more benefits we give, the more will try to get here. It's an impossible equation. If a far-left candidate is the nominee then we will lose. Biden is leading in the polls because he gives us the best chance to win in 2020.
9
@Bill Brown
You don't mention climate change, the #1 issue to a lot of people.
5
The Democrats will lose a substantial amount of votes from feminists who reject the new leaning of what was once their advocating political party. Now the “progressives” approve of the marketing of women’s bodies in surrogacy and “sex work”. And any male who claims some sense of “being a woman” is now free to walk into females’ locker rooms, safe shelters, and displace females on women’s sports teams. I’m an independent voter now - no longer a Democrat - and I would never vote for Elizabeth Warren due to her erasure of what “woman” rationally and scientifically means: female.
38
Do you really think a Republican will do more for women than Elizabeth Warren will? Because a Republican will be picking Supreme Court justices for another four years if enough moderates sit this election out.
I have sympathy for your concerns, but Warren is the one to watch.
7
@Step This comment places you squarely in the win column for the "divide and conquer" culture wars. The world is not black and white, there are many issues and obviously people are going to differ in their support or opposition. How do you feel about locking kids in cages, ignoring the almost absolute scientific consensus on climate change, denying health care to people for any reason, how about the rise of white nationalism - each one of these, and countless others, are great reasons to not vote Republican, if you are so inclined to vote single issue. I wish people would take a higher view of the candidates, there is a lot more to people than their position on any one issue. I wonder if your comment is real or just some bot account that is designed to push certain buttons - "no longer a Democrat" was a campaign in 2016 to discourage Dems from voting by attempting to create a crowd mentality around the idea false idea that people are fleeing from the Democratic party. It was effective and will no doubt be used again in our upcoming election.
13
to me this issue is moot. We have evolved almost as quickly as the transistor radio into sexual equal rights, partner preference, and other new norms such as "being political correct, etc. etc. Of course there are those in the population that won't change from "old" norms and I guess we all got to live with that. The pressing issues of the day: global warming crisis, respect and equality for all species, somehow reigning in megacorporation hegemony, and erasing borders. These are the biggies. Lets solve them.
13
For the last 3 years, I've only ever heard on these pages the histrionics of the damage that Trump and his administration have done to the LGBT community.
As a gay man, I have yet to feel any difference in the quality of my life since Trump took office. So what exactly is the damage the Trump administration has bestowed?
Asking anyone to articulate the issue, I hear only feelings devoid of any obvious facts. Transgenders can't serve in the military? Well maybe people undergoing psychological testing shouldn't be allowed in military roles where their state of mind is mandatory for gender transition. I can certainly get behind that law.
What else exactly? I'm still waiting to hear for the last 3 years how life has changed for us. Please fill me in...
46
Specifically, the trump administration is currently asking the courts for authorization to eradicate discrimination protections for federal workers for being LGBTQ Americans. They’ve pushed through judicial appointments for judges who are hostile to legal protections for our fellow citizens who are LGBTQ.
They’ve stripped Title IX monies, used federal funds to try and undermine same-sex couples from adopting children from foster care, dIsmantling ACA protections, stripping away protections through HUD for public housing, and accelerating the destruction of the planet. It’s all terrible for humans, but specific groups of our neighbors are disproportionately targeted and LGBTQ Americans are one of them.
95
@Jason W
Perhaps you did not take notice that among Trump's most ardent supporters are the extreme wing of Evangelical Christians whom, in reality, would like someone like you either put in jail or eradicated from society altogether.
Go ahead, vote for Trump in 2020, then see what happens. If he, by chance, were to be re-elected, along with the disappearance of democracy in America, all the other rights that are in the process of being stripped away from the LGBTQ community and the discrimination and potential for increased(tolerated) violence towards this group, then you might want to get back to us. To think otherwise, you do so at your peril.
34
Deus,
It takes a lot of chutzpah and a strong sense of entitlement to lecture minorities for rejecting victim narratives, especially from a soapbox in a foreign country. I admit Trump makes me anxious, mostly because of his influence on the courts. Nevertheless, gay men and lesbians have never enjoyed so many freedoms and such acceptance, and increased acceptance—and the visibility of people like Buttigieg—makes it unlikely that SCOTUS will rollback our gains. Actually, my biggest concern is the public’s conflation of gays and transgender activism. The backlash to the latter for its excesses has already begun, and could very well take us down with it.
13
It was very encouraging to read this. Barring the increasingly unlikely late entry of a Dem superstar on the level of Michelle Obama or Al Gore, a Warren/Booker ticket is probably the party's best bet from the standpoint of both "electability" and base activation. They give inspiring speeches, balance each other ideologically and would hopefully give at least some African Americans who preferred Biden to Warren a candidate they can root (and turn out to vote) for.
14
I find myself wishing I had only read the article and not the comments. I am most disheartened by the comments that start "as a gay man", "as a feminist", not to mention the implicitly dismissive references to "men who say they feel like women" and the discounting of the murders of trans women of color. The words that followed those introductions sounded to my ear like a cry to pull up the ladder and an odd belief that expanding human rights somehow diminishes the rights of others. Isn't it a tenet of progressivism and/or liberalism that one strives to expand rights to those from whom they are being withheld? As to trans activist tactics, what civil rights movement did NOT include a degree of militancy? Every movement whose goal has been to acquire a share of normalcy for its constituency has required both incremental steps AND something that approximates shock tactics. Change is uncomfortable and does not happen without challenging the status quo.
I am glad to read that this forum took place though had not known it was happening despite claims in this comments sections that the MSM can talk of nothing else. And it sounds like many candidates acquitted themselves well. Will the 2020 election hang on LGBTQ issues? No - though as a voter I appreciate knowing where these candidates stand on these issues and am heartened to read of their passion for protecting the rights of us all.
23
The best way to go here is sure but careful on progress.
What I. mean by this is learn from the great leaders. Lincoln saved the union first and then ended slavery because without the former he could not get the latter. The Abolitionists wanted him to break the constitution and jail all slave owners and free all the slaves immediately and not to deal with the border union slave states. Lincoln ended slavery (plus saving us all), the abolitionists didn't in almost 100 yrs.
FDR gave us the great domestic programs with the great deal. The extreme left did not want him to deal with racist southern democratic senators because they were not for integration. FDR gave us the great programs and not another civil war like the extreme left wanted, ie overthrow capitalism and end segregation ASAP.
LBJ (along with MLK) gave us Civil Right in 1964. The extreme left wanted him to get voting right too. LBJ knew he could not get both ASAP, so he waited for the other and shortly thereafter got it.
There are countless other example in our history.
Same thing here. condemn the extreme conservatives for not protecting the GLAAD people and giving them basic rights but don't go along with the extreme left and make wedding cake Supreme Court cases more important than blue collar job losses, unneeded war, Wall Street running wild etc. etc.
8
No surprise that Warren is terrific on these issues. Massachusetts leads the nation on gay and trans protection laws, and I’m proud to have her as my senator.
I’m pleased to hear about Booker. I don’t think 2020 is his presidential year, but I think he has a significant future. We need to develop and advance leaders who are loving and culturally competent.
109
I'm now thinking a Warren/Booker ticket would be UNSTOPPABLE - for a whole bunch of reasons!
10
I have long been a Warren fan. As a candidate this year she is well read in the issues, proposing realistic solutions, and demonstrating she has the ability to communicate them with a quiet passion that rings true
When this season began I truly saw Biden as the person to beat trump. However Biden has long history, which makes him a target for the kind of hindsight guilt from which dems suffer.
It is no surprise to see a piece like this. As a person, as senator, as a scholar, Warren shows she wishes to serve all americans. And, it's not a new point of view.
88
Sanders signed a Gay Pride Day decree in Burlington in the 1980’s proclaiming it a civil rights issue.
Sanders opposed the Defense of Marriage Act.
Sanders opposed Don’t Ask Don’t Tell in the 1990’s despite pressure from the Clintons
In 2000’s Sanders supported civil unions in Vermont.
But he misses one gathering where people talk about what they’re going to do and he’s a loser? Please, he’s been out there doing for four decades.
78
Leo,
I’m not a huge Sanders fan, but that’s an impressive track record.
9
@Leo
The MSM don't want to hear or see it. The "status quo" is preferable.
4
@Leo I didn't see anywhere in the article any statement that Sanders was a loser. I do wish he were stronger on women's reproductive rights.
3
Warren/Booker. I like the sound of it. Would make a fantastic, winning 2020 ticket!
5
“Do I go sit down?” Biden asked.
Yes, Joe Biden, you get to go sit down for a very long time.
It's amazing that people support this buffoon.
11
@Socrates
"It's amazing that people support this buffoon."
How nice.
He wasn't such a buffoon when he took down Paul Ryan at the 2012 VP debate and righted a campaign that was sucking pond water after Obama's lukewarm performance against Romney in their first debate.
Sure - Joe's an old dog but like many an old dog, there's still a lot of fight in him.
6
During the crack epidemic my mother took the bus and the subway to Bellevue hospital to rock crack babies. She did this on her own because she cared. While reading the never ending ageism that goes on about Joe Biden she should of just disappeared into the shadows because she had nothing to offer. All the jobs she held, didnt matter because she had the nerve to get old.
Warren is the only one who put context to what the event was all about. Its not the words that we say it is the actions that we put into place. It is about caring enough to do something everyday. Warren and Biden care about the American people, the NYT keeps pushing Harris and Biden in our reading material as if they care, then where is the policies to support the words. Show a roadmap how to get to the destination [policies do matter.
The NYT should of attached the videos and speeches of the con man administration destroying all of the laws and support system that the Obama Administration built on executive order because the pretend GOP refused to allow President Obama pass legislation because of their hate for anyone who isn't old white bigots like they are. They have been bigots for decades . Use the world old correctly vs as a weapon against Biden and people who do great works.
Ben Carson is an old surgeon who should of retired but he needs to insult people otherwise he would not fit in with all of the religious hate.
1
“ gives Mike Pence something to think about “. The Hoosier Preacher has plenty to think about. Pleasing his Master, staying away from frisky females, and serving HIS version of Jesus.
God help us ALL.
2
Eighteen “women of color” murdered most likely by marginalized other. Taboo question?
7
is the hand waving secret LGBQ code?
1
All good. But, if Booker is himself gay, why hasn't he come out and said so? Seems hypocritical.
1
From Ms. Boylan's Column:
"There were three losers of the forum … and [d]onald [t]rump for pretty much everything: for the damage his administration has done to queer America, and for his passion, as abetted by Russian trolls, for pitting us against one another."
From Me:
But from this 70YO Straight "White" Male's 'perspective,' I have to give trump this one-and-only credit: He and his 'ilk' have brought all of us who are (or at least would be and wish to be) "decent" -- Straight or Queer, "Black" and "White" and all other "Shades " -- closer together.
I just hope that we can be "we enough" to pick someone other than Joe or Bernie to 'throw the bums out' in November 2020 -- but, even if it be 'through'Joe or Bernie, my greatest (most desperate?) hope is that 'the bums-in-place' be made to go (as 'unceremoniously' as possible, 'if you will').
Warren and Booker are both brilliant! As a queer person and a senior citizen, I am all in for Warren. I would be thrilled if she picked Booker to run on the ticket with her.
5
women need to be protected from male violence, whatever clothes the males are wearing
13
You know something. I just want to say, the amount of money the healthcare system makes off of transgenderism really demands for a kind of accountability here. Where, just as with landlord tenant issues, we have landlord organizations and tenants organizations, we need something OTHER than the healthcare industry, flush with profit off of transgenderism, speaking up for the interests of gays. And I note the same point could be made with regard to Big Pharma profiteering off of all the other issues gay men have in abundance, like STD's and AIDS. I am a gay man and Jennifer Finney Boylan does not represent me. I, furthemore, resent her daring to set herself up as representative of gays. And I take issue with the corporate funded New York Times propagandizing on behalf of the Business Community in this regard as well.
5
"Senators Warren and Booker shone in a forum focused on the lives of L.G.B.T.Q. Americans."
An America that is just, hopeful and united for heterosexuals will be an America that is just, hopeful and united for people who aren't heterosexual.
We desperately need to jettison Trump. He is a cancer slowly eating his way through our national body.
Shortly after his sickening election in November, 2016, The NYT published "The End of Identity Liberalism" by Mark Lilla. Lilla was right on November 18, 2016 and he is no less right today.
I'm a woman, very mindful of misogyny, but I don't want a campaign built around women. I want a campaign built around all of us, yes, including Trump voters, who are getting shafted no less than those of us who voted for Hillary Clinton.
I remember, a few days before the election, visiting Clinton's Facebook page and seeing if there was anything, at that late moment, I could do.
HRC was selling t-shirts divided by group. HIspanics for Hillary. Gay men for Hillary.
I shook my head in despair. I was, alas, correct to do so.
7
Not all LGTBQ Americans are created equal.
Pete Buttigieg chose to hide his sexual orientation in a powerful privileged white male gay closet. In and out of their closets white European American Judeo-Christian gay males are at the pinnacle education, politics and socioeconomics.
Being black and LGTBQ is to have one meaningful physically identifiable characteristic that can't be hidden in any closet. An identity that defines anyone with one drop of blood aka 1/32nd of black ancestry as all and only black African American and subject to discrimination on that basis.
The Stonewall Revolt was led by black LGBTQ. But it is claimed by white LGTBQ.
Each and every American disabled, gender, color, ethnic, national origin and sectarian group has historically tried to paint themselves inside the legacy of humanity denying black African American enslavement and equality defying separate and unequal black African American Jim Crow.
Those tales of human woe don't fit. And they never will.
The black African and brown First Nations experience is sui generis outside the white European American Judeo-Christian majority immigrant legacy.
1
When Jesus spoke about the sheep and the goats in Matthew 25 he was speaking about people with real problems like hunger and thirst, not about sexual issues.
3
"You cannot lead the people if you don't love the people." And if you don't love other people you can only lead the GOP.
3
The quote about public love looking like justice is taken from Cornel West. The quote about not being able to lead the people if you don't love the people is also a quote by Cornel West.
3
It's not Sleepy Joe as trump calls him, apparently it's Clueless Joe.
Hmm. If Joe Biden had lifted moderator Lyz Lenz off the floor in a bear hug, he would be widely excoriated. But Cory Booker gets big points for doing that with moderator Zach Stafford and he is the star of the first hour?
Having said that, I am not a Biden supporter, and I do not think he acquitted himself well in this forum -- he was ill at ease, confused, and did not know how to handle the interviewer's challenges to his past. His sarcastic "YOU'RE a lovely person" was sadly beneath him.
Pete Buttigieg was thoughtful and inspiring as always. What a president he will make!
3
I am shocked--and really quite angry--that you obliterated Marianne Williamson, who was the first candidate to appear. I will not bother to enumerate the many reasons why I support her; they will not, obviously, convince you to take her candidacy seriously. But your failure to even mention her name, to simply dismiss her out of hand as if she had not even been there, is inexcusable. Shame on you.
7
For those who want to paint a picture of Joe Biden is some crypto-conservative, please remember that it was he who forced Obama’s hand on marriage equality.
6
“What does love look like in public?” Booker asked. “It looks like justice.”
Amen.
1
Biden's performance was surprisingly bad.
"Love in the Time of Democrats."
For those who don't know, haven't heard of, or haven't read Gabriel García Márquez's novel, Love in the Time of Colera, well, highly reccomended.
It would be a good tonic for this craziness we live.
18 transgender women of color have been murdered this year. That is horrible indeed. But according to the Violence Policy Center, THREE WOMEN ARE MURDERED EVERYDAY in the U.S. by romantic partners. I suggest we set aside identity politics and instead focus on the domestic violence crisis against ALL women.
13
@KJ No reason why we can't act to protect both trans and cis women. This isn't zero-sum.
3
Unfortunately, it looks like Senator Booker's campaign is dying for lack of support.
1
Ironically, that the last sentence in the article is essentially the question and answer proffered by one of the Patriarchs greatest white males. Plato.
1
Yes, I understand that the landed, white, male, privileged, heterosexual gentry have ruled the planet for centuries. But it's also that privileged elite who have supported, at least to a degree, a system which has opened its mind and heart to those who are multicolored, female (or multi-gendered) or gay (or multi-preferenced) or, most dramatically, anything-but-privileged.
The righteous, unyielding demands of those who, like Ms. Boylan, use to be on the fringes will destroy any chances they have to further their cause, except, of course, among the righteous, privileged and oh-so-victimized, whom members of the liberal left love to lionize.
If the liberal left continues to unquestioningly bow to those whom, however right in a perfect world it may be right to bow, they will lose.
8
Biden is a "sweetheart" who is incapable of getting the message he needs to get: history is beating him up. Those who don't identify as traditionally gendered individuals would have reasonable qualms about supporting him.
Warren and Booker especially are people far more attuned to a range of Democrats, straight and queer -- and independents, and thoughtful Americans -- looking for both emotion and analysis. Together, perhaps we have an even chance of removing an authoritarian dictator from office, along with his puritanical VP.
3
Joe Biden could've left the political stage with dignity and become the Grand Old Man of the Democratic Party. He could've been mentor to any number of younger party leaders, including presidential candidates. Instead, he's become an object of pity, someone clearly past his prime who believes his own press releases.
6
Would Ms Warren have also read out the names of all of the members of the Transgender community who have taken their lives I would have been persuaded that this was little more than a political gimmick. It is a fact that Transgender individuals attempt suicide at up to 9 times the rate of the general public. Does Ms Warren care about them, and care that mental health issues are an even greater threat, or is she using that community as she did native Americans simply to get a few more votes?
4
Nobody seems bothered by Booker's bearhugging Stafford and lifting him off the floor. This seems far more invasive than the incidents of touching for which Biden is harshly criticized. But somehow the issue hasn't been mentioned in any of the coverage I've seen.
3
Whenever I see any two people in love, I envy their glow, and I think they are so very, very lucky to have found each other.
“What does love look like in public?” he asked. “It looks like justice” and...it looks perfectly natural and normal.
6
For once I agree with Joe Biden; he needs to just go sit down.
6
Noble for sure, but the rest of America is indifferent at best and disdainful at worst, as they shake their heads in disbelief that the Dems just don’t get it.
Can’t imagine that this is a win for anyone other than Trump.
4
Transgenders should obviously be protected under the law, like everyone else, but why are the Democrats falling all over themselves for this distinct minority?
Larger issues matter more. The Supreme Court, the environment, health care, protecting Social Security.
If transgenders fail to see the importance of these issues, then I can't care about their concerns. It's a waste of my energy.
9
@David Henry Have you not noticed that the candidates praised in this article also have plans on health care, the environment, Social Security and more?
Why should they have to ignore the LGBT community's needs ?
3
Giving emotional empathetic speeches on behalf of a minority is something the Dems do very well. Before the 2016 election, they were right up there on the battlements in the great Bathroom Wars.
Meanwhile, the US crumbles, lurching towards revolt.
5
Every article I read and every time I see him I wonder why Booker is not higher.
I think it's worth mentioning the most powerful moment of the discussion (actual discussion not the introductory performance stage) is when Pete recalls first time as South Bend mayor when it was time to promote the annual blood drive.
"Then I realized I cant – I cant be part of it"
1
Matthew 25 has been quoted to Vice President Pence before.
It doesn't seem to work.
3
Kissing up to gays is not what the candidates should be doing. The Democrats have that demographic wrapped up anyway. Plus, they're only a couple percent of the population.
What the Democrats need to do is kiss up to the white working class in a few swing states. The vast majority of those people don't care much about gay issues. They care about jobs and income, the opioid epidemic, immigration.
I am a resident of WA state, which is in the bag for the Democrats. Don't feel too bad, gays. The candidates will pay less attention to Eastern Washingtonians than they will to you.
4
This was a nice event. Unfortunately, the candidates could have held similar events about the lives and discrimination shown to each of (1) African Americans, (2) Hispanic Americans, (3) American Indians, (4) the elderly, (5) Jews via anti-Semitism, (6) Muslims, (7) women in the workplace, (8) veterans, and especially disabled veterans, (9) the disabled generally, and (10) the homeless.
My point is not to question the author or the need for legal rights for the LGBTQ community. It is to point out that we have many groups in this country who have suffered due to hate, bigotry, intolerance, indifference, lack of education and the utter failure of our political leaders. The LGBTQ community is but one of them.
The Republicans have run their recent campaigns by catering only to, essentially, three groups: (1) white evangelical Christians, (2) white suburban families, and (3) the white uber-wealthy. The Democrats will need to peel some of these voters away from Trump with a message of hope, compassion, fairness and America's history of inclusion.
4
What consent did Booker get before he bear hugged Abbott and lifted him off the floor?
5
Its comforting to know that Democrats believe that identity politics will carry the day. This is America and although I support personal choice relative to sex and relationship it is not White, Gay, LGBT, Black, Hispanic, Feminine or Other America. It's "America" period.
7
thank you. as usual, excellent writing from jfb.
2
For all their idealistic language, the founding documents protected only a minority of the American people. Picture the benefits of liberty corralled within a pin spot of warmth on a windswept prairie. So many other people trapped in the cold outside the light have contributed to but have not been allowed to share in the country's success.
In order to gain perspective on this, consider the dichotomy between our nation's stated international ideals and the crimes (that we know about) our government has perpetrated against nations that have defied, or even miffed, us.
So, in the 243 years since the writing of the Declaration, the radius of warmth has grown, but so much more slowly than those mortals relegated to darkness might have wished. A treasure trove of reasons cited to exclude people of color, of women, of the non-straight, has been the Bible, which many Americans seem to think is more important than, or at least the co-equal of, the Constitution.
It's instructive to remember that each time the pin spot has widened to include, say, union workers, the backlash from those who sense a loss of privilege has been severe and sometimes sickening. Today, pious hypocrites employ fear and loathing to inculcate rage in their children against fellow citizens.
At some point, the chasm between religious training and the principles of a free government will become too blatant to ignore. Believing in spirits is everybody's right, but every delusion has a price.
3
“What does love look like in public?” he (Booker) asked. “It looks like justice.”
Seems to many of us that love has less to do with justice than it does caring about one another. Being a Good Samaritan even if we're not Samaritan is a good place to start. We show love in our doings.
Justice is administred by the courts, blind of the differences among us.
Love is administered by each of us to each of our neighbors, irrespective of our differences.
4
LBTQ issues are not a major problem in the United States today. If the Democrats keep pushing this nonsense they will I hope to elect Trump again. Do they think that’s doing much good?
8
Let them vote for and against themselves because of being ill informed. Hope all these people like when their Medicare and Social Security is cut because of the $1 annual budget deficits under Trump. If the bigotry continues, I hope these Trump voters are prepared for a gutting of these programs. And he won’t care if he gets a second term.
3
@Roy Greenfield If you're not interested in what you call "LBTQ issues" why not just ignore them? Why go out of your way to decry candidates for noticing and caring about the fact that some of our fellow Americans are still facing "major problems" due to discrimination?
3
Enough already with Joe Biden! Instead of trying to look for some candidate who might draw in the "undecided moderates," just make sure you get off the sidelines the nearly 50% of black and hispanic democrats who aren't currently enthusiastic. For goodness sake, if you want to appeal to supposed "undecided moderates" then you'll probably have to nominate Mitt Romney. Undecided moderates don't exist. Only if you no longer have a conscience can you be undecided as to the choice between a Democrat (any Democrat) and any current Republican in the White House and the Senate and the House or Representatives. I do hope Booker gains more visibility and traction. Warren with Booker would be a vibrant, strong, caring and THOUGHTFUL duo leading this country.
10
@nycptc--NO BIDEN. He does not represent the real concerns of the majority of voters. He's not qualified for this job. He lives in the 1080's, and does not recognize the things he did wrong. He will not dig in and begin the cleanup we need, after the horrible destruction of the tRump "administration." He doesn't have the mindset for it. Pick someone else, please. Anyone else.
5
@nycptc if Warren can continue to talk about corruption as she did in Washington Square Park, she can attract voters from various constituencies. If she keeps focusing on free college, Medicare required for all, and “big structural change” that sounds to many people like pipe dreams and like more dismantling of the government at a time when we already have the inhabitants of the White House doing that, she won’t.
Her ideas can be expressed as deeply patriotic and American. I wish she’d take that tack ninstead of saying “I have a plan.” Anyplana candidate proposes needs to get through Congress anyway.
@nycptc
I support Biden as a winner. When he wins the nomination I hope you'll vote for him. If not, I will look at you for reelecting trump
Elizabeth Warren proves again and again that she is knowledgeable, passionate, and likable...the latest Iowa poll also shows that she is electable.
The fact that the GOP hope to run against her just shows how ingrained is their misogyny. Even my Trump-voting husband says he would consider voting for her. And let's not forget when Tucker Carlson quoted her economic plan verbatim and then stated that she "sounds like Trump at his best."
7
One has to wonder why Joe Biden is even running. If he does not want to or is unwilling to take advantage of podium appearances to their fullest and at least draw the obvious distinctions with Trump then just sit down now. To all those who question Elizabeth Warren’s empathy, courage and ability to connect with all voters you haven’t been listening and you should read this column. Finally, Bernie Sanders will not win anything avoiding opportunities to inform the public on his stance toward LGBTQ rights.
7
@Daniel Salazar As other commenters have said, Bernie was at a historically black college and also at the climate strike in Greensboro North Carolina speaking in support of climate action, climate justice and the Green New Deal. No candidate can be in all places at once. Look Bernie's record up. He supports LGBTQ rights and has his entire career.
2
I'm a feminist. From my perspective, this forum and trans-activism have little to do with love and everything to do with men who "feel like women" invading women's spaces. It's a laughable argument. How could someone born a man have any idea what it is to be a woman? Initially I loved Warren. But as I've learned more about her stances, I've realized I can't vote for someone who would allow men who "feel like women" dictating the terms for women's privacy, sports teams, workplaces and discussions.
25
@moderate af
You write "How could someone born a man have any idea what it is to be a woman?"
And yet I could just as easily say, "How could someone born as a cisgender person understand what it is to be transgender?"
As a cisgender male, even I recognize that the key is empathy and love. When someone tells me that they need to live as the opposite gender to be true to themselves, I accept that as true. They know themselves better than I do. There is nothing laughable about this, and I'm convinced it is a better perspective than "you don't belong here."
12
@moderate af
As a feminist as well, it's disheartening for me to hear a feminist dismiss someone else's sense of self so casually. As a cis-gendered, straight, woman feminist I want all people to be able to live as who they know they are, free from discrimination and bias. Each of us should have the right to say who we are and how we want to present ourselves to the world. I don't know what it feels like to be assigned one gender at birth and feel that it's the wrong gender, as you obviously don't either, or to feel uncomfortable with a label of a specific gender any more than I expect a man to know what it feels like to be a woman. But, as I choose my life's path, I don't want to be dismissed for it. I certainly wouldn't dismiss someone else's path. What's confounding to me is why you need to call other people "laughable" because they have life experience different from yours. Keep in mind that men still consider many women's experiences laughable. Maybe try to be respectful to others in return.
7
I respectfully disagree, speaking only as a feminist approaching late middle-age. I see nothing laughable in the deaths of the 20 women, and respect Warren for reading their names. I see nothing trivial in thousands of individual's identity denigrated as something akin to a game of dress-up.
What is your litmus test for being a woman? I can recall earlier 1960s definitions that folks wanted to impose (e.g. marriage, children, not working outside the home, nylons, girdles), later definitions attempted (it's not that long ago that lesbians weren't considered *real* women, correct?), or some new current definition of which I'm not aware.
My belief is that being comfortable in one's own skin and identity takes many routes and has many manifestations, and expecting and receiving equal treatment and consideration is not a ridiculous ask.
But, hey, I'm only a woman.
8
Reading much of this thread is a big Debby Downer experience. Too many responses are pessimistic on Senator Warren's chances, or worrying about trivial distracting issues. Warren has real answers to the huge inequities that the Trump years have exaggerated. She doesn't have the baggage that Clinton carried. She is an inspiration and will be a wonderful president. I love her.
44
Right there with you, Lynn!!
2
Since I didn't see anyone mention this, I'll point it out:
Young people care quite a bit about LGBT rights.
In order to have a chance of winning the presidency and the senate in 2020, we need a big turnout of young people and other groups who are most likely to vote Democrat.
Therefore, Democratic candidates had best show that they do care about LGBT rights, especially protection as full citizens of the U.S. And when an LGBT person is murdered, the police and legal system should do everything it would for a straight person to find the killer and bring him to justice.
The Democratic candidates must pay attention to young voters and their priorities in this election (which includes the climate crisis, the affordability of college, universal coverage for health care, gun control, as well as LGBT rights).
33
@JediProf......And if the Democratic candidate does in fact "pay attention to young voters and their priorities", they better return the favor by putting down their phones for the 45 minutes or so required to actually get out and vote.Having once been in their shoes, I wish I were more confident it would happen.
10
@JediProf Young people may care quite a bit, but young people don't vote. If young people had voted in the 2016 election, we wouldn't have Trump in the White House; poor turnout from potential voters under 25 in Pennsylvania, among other places, gave us the current administration.
Right now, I have no faith that young potential voters will do anything re: the 2020 election beyond posting memes on social media.
8
Young voters proved in 2016 that they don't care enough about any issues to vote. Most of them didn't vote in 2016.
Youth vote in the United States - Wikipedia
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youth_vote_in_the_United_States
They like to make a lot of noise online about how woke they are, but they won't care enough in 2020 to vote either.
2
Pragmatic John Locke(ian) tolerance winning political strategy; mandating acceptance while threatening social ostracism ensuring trump into 2024.
12
We can get married now. What is there left? We have all the rights we could want. Enough. Move on to the real issues like jobs, income inequality, student loan debt, horrible health care costs... etc...
The dems are going to lose big time in 2020 unless they change their message.
33
@N
Hi N. Perhaps you haven't heard the saying, "Married on Sunday, fired on Monday." 28 states in the U.S. have no LGBTQ non-discrimination protections.
This October 8, the Supreme Court will hear oral arguments on whether Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 applies to cases of anti-LGBT discrimination, and whether workplace discrimination is prohibited under existing federal law -- or not. Although about half of all LGBTQ+ people in the U.S. are protected from employment discrimination at the state level, no such protections exist at the federal level.
According to Omar Gonzalez-Pagan, senior attorney at Lambda Legal, a civil rights organization focused on LGBTQ people, “These cases will affect the ability of LGBTQ people to be full members of society and to contribute to society by entering the workplace and be free of discrimination.”
This is the biggest civil right case of the last 50 years, and if you think your life was changed by 'marriage equality,' just get ready for SCOTUS's ruling on this one.
33
@N Did we not just hear about a trans person found burned to death in a car? The hate is real and I don't see what is so wrong with taking an evening to discuss the subject. All the issues are important, but in a country as diverse as ours why would we not talk about this? From what I see and read there are pretty good sized crowds attending. Although I have not attended one myself I think it's a worthy thing to have presidential candidates talking about.
3
The hijacking of ENDA, the Equality Bill’s predecessor, by transgender activists in 2007 is the reason there is no federal anti-discrimination law to protect gay men and lesbians. As long as gender identity is included alongside sexual orientation in a law that would also establish self-identification as the sole basis of transgender status, there will be no such legislation anytime soon.
With the legalization of homosexuality in 2003, military integration in 2011, and marriage equality in 2015, homosexuality is being normalized, the long-time goal of all but the most radical activists. In this political climate, it the most gay men and lesbians can hope for.
If transgender, non-binary, gender fluid, genderqueer, agender, bigender, asexual, demisexual, pansexual, polyamorous, and queer-identifying activists insist on pressing ahead with their agenda right now, they should do so without gay men and lesbians as “TQA .”
5
Of all the issues, healthcare, immigration, and the rest, this is near the bottom of the list as far as the vast majority of Americans is concerned. I don’t care who marries whom, but the level of attention this gets from the candidates is absurd.
43
As a gay man, I absolutely agree. With the exception of federal non-discrimination, a pipe dream as long as Republicans control one chamber of Congress, SCOTUS, and/or the presidency, we have achieved everything we set out to do. The reality is “LGBTQ ” organizations have shifted all their resources to transgender activism. Whereas the gay rights movement was incrementalist, transgender activism demands radical change from a divided public growing increasingly hostile towards their tactics. It is a losing issue for Democrats. Transgender activists must pursue bottom-up instead of top-down strategies if they hope to make any progress in the Trump and alt-right era.
24
If it wasn't for Biden, Obama would not have embraced marriage equality when he did. Biden deserves a lot of credit for this. If Trump gets re-elected then good luck on LGBTQ issues in our lifetimes.
16
Bernie didn't come and says he will not come to future such events.
No problem.
Warren is channeling him almost 100% in all of his policies. She even welcomed the endorsement last week of the voice of Democratic Socialism in America, the Working Families Party.
Bernie, who was endorsed by them in 2016, said that this party is the closest to his brand of Democratic Socialism that exists.
I agree.
Warren is doing great in the polls.
She will be a fine president were she to be elected.
It would be nice to have a woman and Socialist in the White House ( she says she is a capitalist - wink, wink- but we all understand that she just has to say this to not alienate people who are repelled by the Socialist label).
10
I would point you to Joe Kennedy's (JFK's father) defense of FDR. I'm paraphrasing, but he basically told his fellow rich folk that, no, Roosevelt was not a socialist, and that if they wanted to see what a socialist revolution looked like in America, they just needed to keep on blocking the New Deal, and one would happen.
Warren is not a socialist (neither is Sanders). She does not believe in the elimination of private property or the collectivization of the means of production. She wants to reform our current system, albeit drastically, but that is only because the system faces a drastic crises brought about by mismanagment and (in some cases) deliberate sabotage.
28
@Jesse
You say that neither are Socialists.
They think differently.
Sanders ran as a Socialist in Vermont and still proudly identifies as such. He says he is a Socialist. Can't argue with that.
Warren says she is a capitalist but agrees 100% with everything that Bernie says.
They are ideological twins.
She is Bernie lite though at 70 just shy of her mentor's age.
She welcomed the endorsement of the party that Bernie in 2016 said best represents "Democratic Socialism".
She is about as Socialist as Bernie in all but name.
1
The problem with LBGTQ activists is that there are no compromises. 1) The general public and increasingly women's groups are or will be opposed to allowing transgender men to compete in women's sports. 2) Our military exists to defend us from our enemies, not as a social justice experiment. Again the public doesn't believe the military exists to pay for the lengthy transgender transition process. Aside from cost, these "soldiers" won't be available for service. In both these cases the dim candidates will go all out against these objections. Both are common sense, not discriminatory.
33
@Bob: Want to point out that the issues you are mentioning are exclusively for the T. Unfortunately, gay and lesbian men and woman are being pushed aside for what many consider fringe concerns.
20
@Bob
Not every trans person undergoes a length transition process, or any physical changes at all, completely destroying any argument for their blanket prohibition. In that case, we could always simply not pay for transition services. No, this is and has always been about small-minded voters, and the red meat their politicians serve them.
6
@Bob "I also think the military wasn’t designed to be an instrument of social change. Problem with that is, that’s what they were saying about me 50 years ago. Blacks shouldn’t serve with whites. It would disrupt the unit. You know what? I did disrupt the unit. The unit got over it. The unit changed. I’m an admiral in the US military and member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. Beat that with a stick."
Percy Fitzwallace
West Wing Season 1: Let Bartlet be Bartlet
The "military isn't a social experiment" argument is an old tired accuse for discrimination.
Not to say reality is fiction. Nor to dismiss honest concerns, such as trans persons competing in women's sports. And social activists could be less uncompromising and work in a more effective manner.
15
I watched the whole LGBTQ forum and the most "breathtaking" moment was when Pete Buttigieg stepped onto the stage: a happily married gay veteran, young, with intellectual chops and raw political talent not seen since Obama and who can speak to lgbtq folk from EXPERIENCE. Watch it on Youtube - he is amazing!
30
If President Obama had used his first two years with a Democrat House and Senate effectively both LGBTQ Rights and Immigration would have changed for the better. Sadly, he wanted bipartisan effort and didn't get it. I think the same will happen again no matter which Democrat we elect unless we have strong people in a Democrat controlled House and Senate that will carry the heavy load to change.
4
@Rev. Henry Bates. The WORLD economic order was on the brink of the next Great Depression when Obama took over — those enormous economic issues sorta “distracted him” during the less than 1.3 years he had a majority of both House & Senate.
2
Sometimes I fear that Biden defeats Trump, then gives a lame inaugural address that just asks “why can’t we all get along?” while Republicans laugh and Democrats cringe, realizing we are going to be stuck in neutral for four years.
He can pretend to be Obama II, but the truth is Obama could have won two terms with a ham sandwich as a running mate and as a VP. Biden is no Obama. He’s got no charisma, no message, no leadership. If he’s the nominee, I’ll vote for him. If he wins, I’ll give thanks to be done with Trump, which is a big deal. Beyond that, I’ll not be excited.
24
@M.i. Estner
I commend you for realizing that "excitement" is probably not the most best criterion for choosing to support a candidate. For the record, some people do see charisma in the person of Biden, and to say he has no leadership qualities belies the number of times he's been elected to public office. No, Biden is no Obama, but the fact is that Obama saw him as essential part of his advisory team.
12
@Mark
Years ago, I liked Biden when he and I were young. In baseball, they say “the game will tell you when you are done.” Biden should be listening because the game is talking to him.
3
@Mark he has been elected to office as Biden not Obama accessory in Delaware and has never won an election on his own anywhere else.
I am confident of DE electoral votes whoever is the D candidate
1
I doubt that Booker can beat Trump, but I'm pretty sure Biden can. Case closed.
9
@Michael K. Have you watched Biden on the debate stage? He is lackluster and often appears befuddled (this is not about age but about competency). While the polls have him beating Trump, we know how quickly opinions can change (also polls show the other top Dems beating Trump). Trump will destroy him on the debate stage.
1
Biden is a comfortable pair of bed slippers, not a major party's nominee-to-be.
It's over for Clueless Joe.
1
@Michael K. I do not have your confidence. In fact I’m confident you are wrong Case closed?
This coverage is upsetting to me for this reason - the Powers That Be Have Decided to anoint Senator Warren as the okay candidate, completely ignoring Senator Sanders just like last time. The same scenario will repeat because Senator Warren cannot win. We, the little people, are not “ allowed “ to have the real change agents- Sanders. Meanwhile, our planet is burning up. The hypocrisy sickens me. I’ve been crying, watching the children.
5
@Ellen
Actually, this article was about the GLBTQ forum and how different candidates handled it. Sanders simply was not there. So, the grievance you express, though duly noted, has no meaning in this comment thread.
That said, Warren is doing well, but there is no evidence that the "Powers that be have decided" anything. I'm sorry if your guy is not doing as well as he did in 2016 - things change.
45
@Anne-Marie Hislop
Of course I know what tge article was about, but my point is a general one and thus, I believe, has total relevance here. I see the country headed down the same path as in 2016. Just as I predicted Senator Clinton wouldn’t win, I see the same outcome this time for Senator Warren. At almost 80, I’ve been a student of our politics for a long time. The only “ good “ Democratic president we’ve had was Lyndon Johnson. Though he ended up with the heavy yoke of Vietnam hanging
around his neck, he brought us Medicare- a giant accomplishment.
Pardon me if I see Senator Sanders as the FDR for our times...I will continue to send $27 to his campaign whenever I can afford it.
3
@Ellen -- I supported Sanders last time, and I would again.
Still, I'm not upset if Warren can close the sale that eludes Sanders. I don't think he'd be all that upset either.
Sure he'd like to be President. He's said so often enough. He'd also like a lot of other things he could see done with Warren as President, and with himself as influential in any number of ways, many ways.
There can only be one President. If it is too late for Sanders, okay.
Far more important to me, and I suspect to him, is the ideas he has brought to the fore, ideas that are running strongly in this campaign because of what he's already done.
11
Bookers a poetic sham, and so also Kamala, Castro much more than Biden. Just histrionics on the stage! The rest are admirable but Warren shines the best and hope she keeps at it! Fingers crossed! If she falters or comes out phony that will be a huge disappointment!
8
Biden and Klobuchar made me cringe. Biden wanted to give an opening statement. Klobuchar clunked in with her shout out to Mayor Pete. Booker? That bear hug was embarrassing and almost an assault. Harris looked tired and a bit offended when told she hadn’t answered the question that was asked. Mayor Pete was his usual solid self. I didn’t see Warren. She can’t win. First woman president will unfortunately be a Republican.
4
"She can't win"?
You might want to start paying attention to the polls.
29
It is great that this forum took place, and shows how far things have come from when LBGT rights were a third rail for political leaders.
But I would not hold it against Joe Biden that his presentation left more to be desired. Biden's good heart most shines through in moments that are not scripted. Very memorably, when, as VP, he was asked if he supported gay marriage, his unhesitant answer was yes. That encouraged President Obama to speak up for marriage equality. So Biden was on the right page earlier than many others.
25
(With apologies to Charles Dickens...) It was the worst of times, it was the worst of times.
Yes, we are in a truly rough patch. As a nation, as a world. Our very survival is at stake. It is difficult to remain optimistic.
But through the fire and love displayed in this forum, we have been reawakened, challenged and refueled. Thank you, Mr. Booker, Ms. Warren, Ms. Ellis. And all of you LGBTQ heroes--named and unnamed--who daily fight and, yes, die for justice.
12
I just watched Elizabeth Warren at the Iowa LGBTQ Forum. She was electrifying: heartfelt compassion melded with righteous anger, and seemingly boundless energy. She appears at about 1 hr 48 minutes into the Forum. Watch her.
22
@Greg Colbert
Perhaps the first time in history Warren has been called "electrifying." Hyperbole is the order of the day for Warren supporters. Yes, she's energetic, bright, competent, but those of us who live in New England and have watched her career have seen few electrifying moments. She's boldly leftist and that's just the beginning of her problems as a general election candidate.
12
@Mark
I think the 20,000+ who turned up at her rally in Washington Square last week, including those who waited four hours for selfies, might disagree :).
18
@Greg Colbert
Bernie Sanders 2016 Washington Square rally even more electrifying but not transcending.
1
Yes, yes, yes -- to everything in this article.
And delighted that Ms. Boylan finally saw the light about Joe Biden. And does Bernie's absence not speak clearly about the degree of his interest in this humane civil rights issue? -- Yes, it does.
And good for Warren and Booker.
33
@Robin Cunningham
Bernie's long standing record on LGBTQ is beyond question. While Sen Warren was still registered as a republican (during the homophobic Reagan era no less) Sanders was declaring gay rights as civil rights in Burlington, Vt.
The man has been a fighter for everyone's rights his entire life and has been at the front of the line for the LGBTQ movement.
To suggest, as this hit piece clearly does, that Sanders is not a friend of the movement is highly disingenuous.
4
@Robin Cunningham
"And does Bernie's absence not speak clearly about the degree of his interest in this humane civil rights issue?"
Oh count the beans! See the record of his actions.
As someone else, said, the Warren-Booker ticket is the winner based on intelligence, energy, and charisma. Warren in 2020 & 2024, and the Booker in 2028 & 2032. The Dems need to be looking at elections into the future. To run Bernie or Biden in 2020 means someone else will have to run in 2024.
57
Hmmmm. Hadn’t thought of a Warren Booker ticker. I could get behind that.
1
Gasp. Inspirational. Breathtaking. Historic—a barnburner of a night. For heavens sake, it is as though we're discussing the end of the world as we know it. And through it all old Sleepy Joe, well—drum roll—sleeps. So, over to Warren, who'd better think up yet another plan—seeing Sanders has announced wiping $81B medical debt off the books—if she wants to stay current. Booker?Gushed as the star of the first hour, should ready himself for an Oscar, if not mortality.
4
@Stanley Jones - "…Warren, who'd better think up yet another plan…"
Plan? We don' need no steenkin' plan! These so-called "Plans" are just way too complicated for us 'Mericans! We'd rather have another GoodBrain who shoots from his (ample) hip!
MAGA!
1
Feels like a cheap shot at Bernie for not attending yesterday. He was at a town hall meeting at an HBCU yesterday (part of a three-day tour of HBCUs in the south) and spoke at a Climate Strike event.
36
@Sarah A
All this was anticipated in that we saw it in 2016 and we are seeing it again. The MSM loves the "flavor of the month", NOT policies and ideas coming from candidates who wish to upset the "status quo", yet, they still don't understand why Harris is falling in the polls and Booker is barely hanging on.
4
@Sarah A Senator Sanders makes his choices. So he takes credit for many of them, so should he take the blame for others. He missed an event that many other candidates made time for. The specifics are irrelevant. He wasn't there.
8
@Tom Henning: It is disingenuous of Finney Boylan to throw his absence out there without explanation. He was addressing race relations and the climate: two issues many reasonable people consider more important than those addressed at the LGBTQ event.
3
Warren/Booker; Booker/Warren, either way our country (inclusively) would be in capable/inspirational hands!
21
For an absolutely hilarious take on the prospect of Joe Biden as President, see this week's edition of Real Time with Bill Maher. It is at the very end of the show during Mahers list of "New Rules". You will laugh because Joe's hypothetical behavior is nothing compared to what we see in Trump today. All against the background that Joe is most electable.
11
It is not so much anymore about ''tolerance'' for the community, which means to be passive in so many ways such as just showing up, saying a few words, and ''mailing it in.
You must be ACTIVE, and promote not one group over the other, but to demand human rights and laws are applicable to all. IF they are not, then they have no meaning, for justice denied to one is justice denied to all.
The day we accept each other as who we are, and not project what we want each other to be, is the day we are all free.
24
Warren is simply not electable.
When interviewed by Stephen Colbert he asked her how she planned to pay for all her massive programs. Instead of answering the question, Warren launched into a tirade how all those evil insurance companies weren't allowing honest Americans to get the healthcare coverage they deserve.
Now: I've read insurance adds about 6% to healthcare costs, so the real math shows Warren is a DEMAGOGUE, at best, and an OUTRIGHT LIAR at best.
So spare us the fantasies. We need a moderate Democrat to win. If you guys hate Biden so much, find us another moderate. Bennet and Klobuchar meet that bill.
Everyone else … it will be HELLO President Trump, second term.
I would have a hard time pulling the lever for a Demagogue on the FAR LEFT or the FAR RIGHT.
25
@Pat What makes you think we need a moderate to win? Didn't work so well in 2016. Turnout was down from 2012 among core Democratic voters. Perhaps having a moderate run is likely to cause us to LOSE. Are moderates even a plurality? Nobody knows.
34
@Pat
Like you, I presume, as one person, one vote, I think she is!
Trump was an electoral college winner. He seemed to want to be running against Biden, now we know why.
15
@Pat
If you think Warren is not electable then you are not paying attention to the polls. In addition you are not learning from history and you are just reinforcing the meaning of "the definition of insanity"!
Prior to the mid-terms in October of 2018 and in the previous eight years, the so-called "moderate/centrist, corporate/establishment democrats saw almost 1000 of their seats at the state and federal levels disappear, two-thirds of the states now controlled by Republican administrations and previous THREE, now luckily TWO of the Executive.
Moderate democrats are nothing more than Republicans dressed up with the democrat label pinned on their chests and their "Republican Lite" policies confirm it along with the unconscionable election in 2016 of the Presidential candidate with the worst approval rating in history.
16
I found the moderators to be embarrassingly unprofessional. None appeared comfortable or prepared, often sounding more like they were hosting a drag show at the local bar (“Is everybody having a good time tonight?”) than addressing candidates for the highest office in the land. More than once, they appeared to leer at those that they were interviewing. At such a critical time in history, is this really our community at its best?
18
@POP
Don't over-think it.
People not accustomed to being taken seriously by the status quo will inevitably feel awkward when they find themselves in a serious forum.
I think it's more about american culture in general than our community per se.
Over the years I've seen plenty of people from other marginalized groups have trouble finding their voice when after a lifetime of neglect they were given their fifteen minutes. It can happen to the best of them.
I think Americans just think everything has to be entertaining some how, that it should all be done Broadway style or given the Hollywood treatment. They're more comfortable putting on a show than putting their foot down because we live in a culture were to be unpopular is considered to be worthless.
We may finally be acknowledging our multiculturalism (it's been here since the native americans) but the weight of conformity and the cult of the winner still stifles people with fear.
I expect to see many more hiccups and embarrassing show offs along the road to social justice. They're not our enemy, just our humanity.
7
Honestly, it sounds like a lot of political theater. Warren and Booker knew to say the right things in a big way and therefore are the "winners".
What did Warren and Booker win anyways? Is this a sporting event? Is the future of the country being decided by who wins each game? Did someone already win the primaries? I don't get why we are obsessed with who wins forums and debates when we could be focusing on substantive issues. Maybe if they won more supporters that's interesting, but I doubt there was a big change over this forum.
I think LBGTQ is of very little importance to most Americans. It's of huge importance to activists. But most Americans are straight, cisgender. Things like healthcare, the economy, and immigration are much bigger concerns. Most people have probably long accepted that gay rights won (though not completely under the law yet) and that gay people are expected to be treated with tolerance and have equal rights now. I think most people accept that transpeople exist and should be treated with equal dignity. Though I don't think they want to lose their jobs for using the wrong pronoun (thanks to a bunch of activists). Gay rights and trans rights are weirdly related: Is gender real and a gay man should be allowed to marry a man or is gender just a social construct? For me and most of the public, this is either a nonissue or losing issue. Mostly a nonissue.
54
@James: I support lesbian and gay rights strongly. The trans lobby, however, leaves me cold. I can't get on board with their dismissal of women's legitimate safety concerns and insistence on being shoehorned into Title IX protections.
48
@James: I find this comment wrongheaded. Ms. Boylan listed the names of 18 trans women of color who were murdered in the past year. It's emphatically not a "nonissue." Defeating systematic patterns of discrimination against groups of people for their sexuality and/or gender identity means not falling into complacency just because "most people" are on board, and I'm not even sure that's the case. We in the LGBTQ+ community may be in the minority, but that doesn't mean our rights, and, for those 18 women, our survival should be seen as "unimportant" or that they're not "substantive issues." I'm grateful that so many of the Democratic candidates are not in agreement with the stance you offered here.
17
@Grmadge To be fair, Boylan quoted Warren listing 18 names of trans women of color who've been killed in the last year. That's 18 people out of 327 million Americans, all of whom are impacted by the economy, global warming, health care, and more. Some of whom who have died due to gun violence, opioid addiction, health care problems, etc. Warren listing those names in a campaign forum was clearly political theater. It was a strategy to get support and votes.
Your post uses language like "trans women of color" and "systematic patterns of discrimination". People are cold towards the trans rights movement because they are sick of activists ideologues are use such language and bully around the rest of us. Mind you, they aren't necessarily cold towards gay people or trans people, they are cold towards activists. There is no LGBTQABCDEFG+ community, that's an umbrella term used by activists to include many different causes like gay rights and trans rights and used to speak on behalf of people you don't know. If you want to get anywhere politically, you might want to consider how your post looks to others.
It's not that gay or trans people and their rights don't matter. But I don't think this is a top priority of most people, including gay or trans people, compared to the economy or environment. And I think people are sick of being bullied by social activists. And of politicians saying slick things in forums and commentators selecting "winners".
30
Voters who love the experience of being carried away by a great speaker with a message close to their hearts should certainly take a second (or third) look at Cory Booker. However, be prepared to be challenged to do your part in cleaning up Trump's various messes after 4 years in possession of the presidency. Sen Booker expects his words to change behaviour, but his results in Newark have been mixed because, like President Obama, he is willing to be an agent of change, but not carry the burden of the whole change. Booker's voters should expect to "pick up the mops and not just watch others work at protecting democracy in the USA.
What a contrast any ticket with Cory Booker on it would have to the two old men on the Republican ticket!
1
@Lynda
Cory Booker STILL falls under the moniker of a corporate/establishment democrat, i.e one who takes money from lobbyists and corporate interests whom ultimately determine that candidates choice of policies.
He may say "some" of the right things but when it comes to real change and supporting good progressive policies, he isn't your man.
4
I love the quotes that Booker spoke. I agree he is often poetic and eloquent. However, if you search the phrases online, you'll find that they were spoken by Cornell West first.
17
@the quiet one
if Booker is quoting Cornel West, that's certainly ok by me!
@Charles Alexander I don't have a problem with that either! Just giving credit to West.
1
If Warren gets the top spot, Booker is her VP. It would be a formidable ticket.
111
I don't for the life of me understand why Booker isn't higher in the polls. I love our other candidates too of course; but he's capable of poetry.
36
@Sophia I don't like Booker. It's because of his poetry. Booker seems like your standard politician who will say anything to get elected. Of course it's poetry, it's scripted.
Also, Booker smirks when he talks about himself being president. He seems a bit egotistical and full of himself. I want someone to fight for me, not just for his big ego.
We elected one guy, Obama, who gave great speeches already (and better speeches than Booker). How'd that turn out? Okay, he got the Affordable Care Act and we got 8 years of steady governance and good speeches rather than a Twitter troll as president. But Obama promised hope and change and we are all waiting for change. Obama never addressed the major problems of our country. Like I said, I don't think Booker will fight for me.
Do you have a better reason for supporting Booker than poetry?
23
@James
It’s actually not scripted. I know Cory (met him when I was 16 and he was maybe 20), and even then, he was special and different in how positive he was and in how much he cared for other people. When he ran into that burning building to save someone, that was very much him. I don’t even know if I know anyone else who would have done that, but Cory — no question. He’s upbeat, positive, caring, optimistic and a public servant to his core.
14
@James Obama is by far the best president we've had in my lifetime. Just saving the auto industry alone would be enough to put most presidents near the top of the list. And the ACA, flawed though it may be, is huge.
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I love the Booker quotes. He is visionary.
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@Mary M They are both quotes from Cornell West. They are great though.
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Please can we stop hoping that Pence and Trump will behave better. We know their characters by now; they are not fit to be regarded as members of the human species.
Warren on the other hand, continues to surprise us with hidden qualities. She exemplifies what Bertrand Russell said: "The good life is guided by knowledge and inspired by love." What a lovely person!
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Of course L.G.B.T.Q. Americans should have equal rights.
But I'm more worried about the Supreme Court which will not survive four more years of Trump.
It's poised to deny many kinds of rights to all kinds of Americans.
It will also undermine Social Security, Medicare, environment, and everything else we take for granted for a civil life.
I'm sure the L.G.B.T.Q. would agree that it's not only their concerns that matter.
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@David Henry
That means ALL Americans and the LGBTQ community are as well.
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David,
I’ve commented elsewhere that, as a gay man, I feel the same way. The truth is there has never been a better time to be a gay man or lesbian. The elephant in the room is transgender activism.
Most gay people were never on board with the forcible addition of “T” to “LGB” in the 2000s by non-profit elites and gender studies scholars. Sexual orientation has nothing to do with gender identity, after all, meaning the issues facing each population are totally separate. Indeed, the transgender agenda—essentially, codification of gender identity as distinct from and superseding biological sex—is significantly less popular with the general public (not to mention that transgender participation in the gay rights movement is wildly exaggerated).
This intense focus on an increasingly confusing menagerie of gender identities will only hurt Democrats in 2020, guaranteeing four more years of Trump and an even more radically conservative SCOTUS. Unfortunately, the left has given up incrementalism for an all or nothing strategy.
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I am so glad to read this piece. I am such an admirer of Cory Booker. I would so love to see his name on the ticket. My dream Warren/Booker.
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@Fromjersey
I wouldn't mind Warren/Booker, but I would be ecstatic at Warren/Abrams. Stacy Abrams nearly won the Governorship of Georgia and would pull in a lot of Southern votes.
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I was just saying this to my husband yesterday!
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@Fromjersey
Warren/Booker
Two very left leaning Dems from the East. Whatever happened to trying to win over the non-college educated white guy in the mid-Western states that Hillary lost in 2016?
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I'm so glad I read this article, and so sorry that I missed this Presidential Forum. I'm going to see if I can find it online and listen. I especially want to hear Cory Booker. Again - thank you.
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It is not so much anymore about ''tolerance'' for the community, which means to be passive in so many ways such as just showing up, saying a few words, and then sitting down.
You must be ACTIVE, and promote not one group over the other, but to demand human rights and laws are applicable to all. IF they are not, then they have no meaning, for justice denied to one is justice denied to all.
The day we accept each other as who we are, and not project what we want each other to be, is the day we are all free.
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I absolutely agree about "tolerance" and "acceptance." Makes it sound as if people are deigning to "put up" with something that's "not right." The human experience is vast and beautiful. Let us celebrate human diversity and be grateful for everyone who enriches our world. Same is boring.
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@Bob - And stop seeing each other as The Other. Step back from myopia and we're all One.
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@FunkyIrishman: do you tolerate or embrace those with whom you disagree? Tolerance is a huge step for many.
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As ever, Biden continued to prove that he is the most qualified Republican candidate for president.
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@Gavriel
For what reasons do you make this observation? Based on statements in the article about this forum, I would totally disagree with you.
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@Charlton
Joe Biden's participation was churlish and reluctant. He belittled and dismissed his interviewer for questioning his positive characterization of Mike Pence, whom I and most attendees to this event would consider a bigoted religious zealot.
Biden calls Pence a "decent guy", and probably means it, because LGBTQ issues are obviously unimportant to him. You say you read this article, which characterizes Biden as "phoning it in." I see no basis for disagreement on this issue.
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@Charlton
Read closely to get the joke. @Gavriel, thanks, I LOLed and I totally agree!
I like Booker’s positive intensity.
He’s a strong new generation of leaders and am looking forward to him catching on with democratic primary voters.
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@Brad
Well if you lived in Newark New Jersey and saw that under his leadership nothing changed in the city, I think you might see him in a different light.
He has always wanted to be a celebrity and with the support of Wall Street he is auditioning for a cabinet position. Good with the words but horrific with implementation to really make a change in peoples lives. We dont have time to pretend we know how to be president, you need to know how to be president and move the country forward from the swamp we are now in.
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@Brad
me too!
Ok, so you trashed him so I assume you’re Bernie supporter.
That’s how trump will be re-elected.
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