Mexicans should be protesting their own government not ours. Let them stay home and fix up their own nation.
This is spiraling out of control. President Trump needs to be reigned in or removed. The United States is in peril from within. We must demand as a nation that our congress exercise the separation of powers with which we are constitutionally endowed. Our Executive branch has ceased to function in the best interest of the nation.
13
Well I guess El Paso has been effectively "occupied".
1
Thanks to all those who have marched in El Paso in opposition to building a border wall.
15
@EM: DITTO!
3
The razor wire and wall would not be needed if the people flowing through Mexico would file for entry legally and wait their turn to come. These people have NO respect for our laws and feel they have the right to simple become border bunnies and hop the fence. 1700 arrived last week after being bussed by the Mexican government right to the doorstep of the unsecured portion of the border. Another 12,000 are currently massed and ready to head north within a week. Its got to stop. These are uneducated and unskilled persons. In short all they would be is a drain on the economy. We do not want or need them. We need higher walls, we need multilayers of razor wire, and we need them now. Especially at the remote areas that run along the Mexican hwy. We also need laws allowing BP to capture and then deport immediately any and all illegals no mater the sex or age. Once deported they should not be able to apply for a visa or asylum for a minimum of 5 years.
8
Razor wire (concertina wire) is not the same as the single strand barbed wire found across the West. Rather than pointed spikes that are each like the end of a nail, razor wire has long, sharp metal edges like an exposed razor blade.
https://zhuoxin-wiremesh.manufacturer.globalsources.com/si/6008845195109/pdtl/Razor-wire/1149848479/CBT-60-SS-430-Razor-Wire.htm
Would you like your children to walk to school next to a wall covered with exposed razor blades?
Please support the people of Nogales and demand that our military stop placing razor wire from the ground to the top of interior border fencing.
It's bad enough to see a coil on the top of a fence (shades of a German concentration camp), but it have the razor wire where any US citizen walking past can be sliced to ribbons is a nightmare.
Imagine a child dropping a notebook of loose paper and then trying to retrieve their project from between all the exposed razor blades.
17
@ Aaron
This “crisis” was manufactured by refusing to process perfectly legal asylum claims. Imagine going to the DMV to renew your drivers license, taking a number, and then being incarcerated indefinitely, separated from your children. Putting it in layman’s terms for you.
14
@CorbinThe problem with that analogy is the United States owes no obligation with respect to the asylum seekers to process their asylum claims, since the asylum seekers are not citizens of the United States. On the other hand, drivers who are citizens of the United States and their particular states have rights with respect to their own government.
3
@AF
The United States is a signatory to the UN 1967 Protocol respecting refugees. The nation also passed the Refugee Act that specifies that we will accept 50,000 refugees per year. So, yes, we do have an obligation to hear asylum petitions and see if the asylum seeker is qualified.
8
@Heather...but we are getting much more than that...easily double
The federal government waived 28 environmental laws to expedite construction. So much for Law & Order! Some laws just don’t matter I guess...
20
Trump lied about the emergency. Makes one wonder how many billions Trump stands to make off of this fake emergency. It's a clear Abuse of Power, an impeachable offence. Add it to the pile of his other crimes and let's focus on that because that is the real national emergency.
28
@kay You are on target.
Too few people are asking pointed questions about the specific amount of money demanded. The little I've read suggests no specific plans are in place, with specific price tags.
It looks like trump wants a slush fund of $5.7 billion that is not assigned to developed and approved projects.
Who has the grifter promised this money to? And why is the lack of spending plans for this proposed slush fund not a top news story?
9
@kay
Who will be awarded the no bid contract to build the wall?
8
I was looking for on the ground responses from citizens on the border, their stories, why they personally don't want it, instead I got NYT giving commentary on tweets made days ago and a focus on the actions of a few politicians.
Maybe actually explain the situation. Give it a human element, let individual voices be heard. That's sort of what a person expects, when looking for an article about a protest movement. This reads like propaganda instead.
5
The Democrats support open borders and unlimited immigration in light of the coming human migratory pressures due to climate change. One simple reason why I will not vote for any Democrat again until they resolve this anti-American position.
15
@Derry "Democrats support open borders and unlimited immigration" -- That is what Republicans say Democrats say. The problem is, it is not what Democrats say.
7
this article reminds me a lot of the time a thief broke his leg trying to jump over the fence and tried to sue us
12
No question Texas is a principal gateway for illegals finding their way into the US--so it's quite understandable that there would be protests against making the southern borders secure by any means, not just walls. Nonetheless, let's not forget that the goal for border patrol is zero apprehensions.
7
I would like to see our press reiterate the real cause of all this bruhaha and national emergency: Trump lost face to Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh. We were all set with no shutdown until these two unelected talking heads mouthed off and Trump was blown off his feet by criticism from the far right extremist blowhards. Shutting down the government for no good reason but the hurt pride of Individual One. And add in Lindsey Graham's prophetic pronouncement that the Trump Administration is done without his all important WALL.
In a land where we have to cater to these three and the emperor who has no clothes, please let's have the free press try to keep FACTS at least in our national conversation.
46
@Mary
Do you think federal workers and contractors have standing to file suit? Bankrupt these frauds who are unelected, but running the country.
3
The day will come when the undocumented residents will get old and retire. I need Medicare and Social Security and savings to survive.
An undocumented person who arrived in the late 80's will soon find life without ability to collect Social Security or enroll in Medicare as a survival crisis.
I'm not a wall person. But I'm not a person who crows about the reduced number of crossings. Because whether it's 1 million a year or the current 350,000 a year, being undocumented will not end well.
18
What if Trump threw a manufactured crisis and nobody came?
4
Protesting for the wall in Spanish....
Not the best optics
18
@ William
People have been speaking Spanish in El Paso since before they were speaking English. As the saying goes “the border crossed us”.
7
You want to avoid a wall?
E-verify
27
@Frank Scully The government won't do it because of the big business lobby. It would cost them too much to pay fair wages rather than exploiting illegal workers.
11
@Frank Scully Can we start that with Trump who gets his workforce from these (oh so dangerous) illegals to work at his properties and clubs?
6
@Mary
They were all recently let go.
1
I signed a petitition at my church yesterday in support of the mayor of Nogales, Arizona calling for immediate removal of this dangerous wire. The wire is offensive to both cities.
22
Trump/GOP in a nutshell: hate; racism and greed. Democrats in a nutshell:People; the World and the Environment. Your choice America. Ray Sipe
18
Yes we must have more and more poor illiterate people who don't speak English and didn't graduate high school flowing into this country. And it's critically important to listen to the views of Mexican nationals on U.S. immigration policy. It's a crime against humanity that one person from anywhere south of the Rio Grande not be allowed to move to the US.
27
I think wall supporters who don’t live near the border need to think about how they would feel if the federal government took their land for massive construction projects and upended their communities. Would you really want a barbed wire covered wall in your town?
24
@E I'd like the Latinos who have clearly broken our immigration laws in my community to go home and stay there. They use welfare, crowd local schools and make no effort to learn English. They're also fond of waving Mexican flags while whining that how awful it would be to live there.
In exchange for expanding his money-laundered, mob-funded business "empire," Trump is implementing the treacherous, divisive tactics of his master Vladimir Putin. Ironically, we are witnessing his own animosity toward the "Deep State" -- i.e., the Federal Government--boomerang against him.
3
At a funeral reception last summer, I had a relative from the Midwest, who had never been within 700 miles of the border, tell me drug dealer rapist illegal immigrants had overrun Texas.
Living in Texas, with a wife who routinely travels alone to "The Valley" (what Texans call the border region), I disagreed. Bolstered by years of Fox News watching, he continued to argue with me that the state was essentially a post-apocalyptic wasteland due to illegals.
So I invited the relative to come down to visit me, to travel to the border, to stand on it and see for himself. He got offended, and I left. Regardless of how many facts you provide, some people have been so brainwashed that there is no hope of convincing them otherwise.
56
Exactly- many people have no clue that culturally there is a huge overlap in south Texas with Mexico because at certain times it WAS Mexico. Six flags over Texas is not just a theme park.
7
States rights are taking on a whole new meaning during the dictatorial Trump administration.
Mr. Trump, your manufactured border wall "crisis" is backfiring.
1. Why are you ignoring the many security experts who say investing all those taxpayer dollars in to your big, ugly wall is largely a waste of money and won't be effective.
2. So why are you upsetting so many Americans, federal workers, and federal contractors with your threat again of yet-another government shutdown if you don't get what you want.
3. And publicity hound that you are, cannot you not see that the optics are not good for you and your vanity wall in the southern border towns where the unwanted wall is to be built? It really does not look good for you when state and town officials and lots of regular people are standing up strongly and adamantly against your insistence on getting that expensive, ineffective Wall built, no matter how bad an idea it is.
I don't think Trump is or will listen. Tragic!
12
Good for you!! Thank you for standing up for the truth.
3
"As the number of migrant families in recent months has overwhelmed the government’s detention facilities,"
Wait a minute.. I just read in another NYT article that overall "illegal immigration" from the Southern border is at the lowest number since 2006.
So which is it?
If we are at our "lowest number" why would our government detention facilities be overwhelmed?
Will somebody please start telling the truth around here! My goodness!
15
@Aaron both are true, actually. The government is holding more people until their asylum hearings, instead of releasing them and telling them to come back to court for the hearing. This overwhelms the facilities, even though overall crossing numbers are lower.
13
@Aaron The Times is controlled by a Mexican national who loves it when we care for his underclass.
With Social Media and the Internet in general being the main forms of news and communications for many, the real war is being fought in cyberspace and that war is called "Information War".
Putin is using it to a large degree.
Trump is using it a great degree as well spreading false claims and fear about immigration and attacking media outlets that publish opposing opinions and news stories by calling them fake news.
Trump sees this Wall construction project not as a means to address illegal immigration but as an opportunity to give out lucrative contracts to fellow cronies and corporations for further enrichment and kickbacks. The "crisis of illegals" is a just a cover up.
Trump is simply that selfish and greedy!
8
ICE should be out there in full force checking IDs.
16
Scare tactics from people that have never lived near the border. Come down here and see how peaceful it really is and don’t forget to try our wonderful Mexican food!
5
I live at the border near Nogales, Arizona and find Trump's political ploy to create a false narrative of what life is like at the border, completely disturbing. What's in Trump's psychotic mind has spilled-out into the reality affecting ordinary people's lives here. Border communities have a good relationship with the people just across the border in Mexico. Historical cultural, trade, work and family relationships are all being negatively impacted by Trump's derision on immigrants and our southern neighbors. This has encouraged right-wing militias and other aggressive and misinformed activists to stake-out the border and create trouble. Trump NEVER listens to political official's and law enforcement personnel who want to educate him on real life at the border. Trump only listens to those that support racism, fear and isolation. Get out Trump! NO BORDER WALL!
35
One of the saddest aspects of our national discussion of our immigration policy is that it's not a discussion at all.
It is not a dialogue; it is two monologues taking place simultaneously. Equally unproductive is that each side reduces its "argument" to buzzwords that grotesquely ignore the nuances and subleties in our broken immigration system.
It's just symbolism and theater. Problem solving it is not.
This is not leadership. It is an abdication of leadership by both Democrats and Republicans.
More importantly, folks, is that for decades we all participated in creating the problem by our national insistence on cheap ... cheap food, cheap consumer products, cheap childcare, cheap construction, cheap hotel rooms.
Look in the mirror, folks. Pogo was right: We have met the enemy and he is us.
15
@barcoderanch
Why the false equivalence? People who are against White Supremacy are not the same as White Supremacists. Don’t paint us with the same brush if we are part of the solution.
3
@barcoderanch by Very good point, rarely recognized. We have a long history of outsourcing picking our crops to illegal cheap labor. Formerly called "migrant workers." In Florida they used to be forced to live on the farms e.g. in chicken coops rented in the '70s for $80/month. All was fine until this abuse was no longer tolerated. When they became visible living in towns and cities they were called illegal aliens. The demographics made them visible and undesirable.
2
The wall is just a distraction. Let’s look at the score card:
China - no deal, just talk
North Korea - no deal, just talk
Imbalance of trade - took actions and is making farmers suffer so Trump added subsidies for the farmers. Lose!
Tax cut for corporations- good for big companies, almost zip for the average worker.
Tax overhaul - not much for the little guy, good for multi millionaires.
Golf - more golfing than any other President.
Climate change - moving backward.
Balance of power since Trump elected - swinging blue.
Infrastructure rebuilding - nope.
In short, the President needs to focus on the wall cause he’s not getting anything else done.
15
In a state with great income inequality and poverty, more tax dollars are diverted away from actual citizens.
15
A nation's border should have a buffer zone that does not allow private ownership.
8
Nationalizing private property? You really think that is a good democratic principle?
3
A nicely organized article, but I started reading to see why people of border towns appose fencing.
I got:
No barbed wire
Environmental reasons that seem unrelated to towns
And the economies of the towns have been linked
Just a couple comments:
The point that barbed wire is used only for war seems to be a huge stretch. Granted, it is not super attractive, but everybody knows that ranchers, businesses, and industry have used barbed wire since it was invented.
Regarding the economy being intertwined, if e-verify were instituted than border walls would be less necessary. Also, it wouldn't hurt if newborns being made citizens only applied to mothers legally in the country.
There are smarter ways than the wall, but the Democrats talk about limiting beds and ICE. I don't get it.
8
@Frank Scully Read a bit more closely. This is NOT the barbed wire I repaired on my Dad's fences. This is razor wire. The two types differ by orders of magnitude. Read up on it.
Tangling with traditional barbed wire hurts. Tangling with razor wire kills. It does so because it's intended to.
As to birthright citizenship - that would require a constitutional amendment. Not likely to happen on this question.
1
@Frank Scully
Democrats don’t want to give Trump a blank check to build more concentration camps. Do you get it now?
I will test these theories when the presidential elections are declared Nov 2020!
I am tired of being depressed by a a failed president and his tweets!
2
My feeling is we should start with internal changes first:
1. We absolutely must eliminate Sanctuary Cities ! This sends the right message to ALL that the Citizens of the U.S. will not tolerate breaking the laws.
2. We must improve e-Verify and require ALL employers to participate! This will reduce the incentive for illegal immigrants to cross the border for jobs...
3. We absolutely must stop automatic citizenship of anchor babies where both parents are NOT U.S. Citizens.
4. We must enforce and follow through on ALL existing laws dealing with Illegal Immigrants. At this point the only people illegally entering our country are criminals, spies and low lifes.
5. We must balance the inflow of who comes into my country by severly limiting legal immigration from Latin American countries and increase legal immigration from Asian, African & European countries. As for middle east countries...my feeling is it should be carefully managed/monitored.
If these changes are implemented - I doubt there will be a need for the type of wall that Trump/Republicans or deplorables are clamoring for AT FAR LESS COST!...
13
@DP So you missed the news that one of the employers of those without papers is Mr. Trump.
2
If so many families are flocking to our border from Central America, the UN should occupy those countries and restore peace so that we can immediately return all of these people to the loving embrace of their countrymen.
9
Funny how all of this could have been avoided if we had done exactly three things for the last 40 years:
1) Come up with an immigration policy
2) Enforced the immigration policy
3) Changrd the policy through legal means if we wanted
It is an insane idea but I think there are other nations that do it, such as virtually every other nation on the planet.
15
@John We have one. Mexicans imagine themselves exempt from it. Worse, imagine they can dictate it.
Let's hear the side of the argument which favors allowing people to illegally sneak into the country.
14
The Republican solution to illegal border crossing is an affront to our entire society. Building a 30 foot wall along the entire border is neither necessary nor wanted. Many of the border communities thrive because of their location. Making a military, hostile border will only create negative emotions and attitudes on both sides. In addition, it will not stop those people who are truly dangerous to our country. Drug and human traffickers will find a way to make their money transiting the border. All new walls will do is stop those who need safe harbor; families and minor children fleeing from harm. Mr. Trump's plan is stupid, costly and short cited. We need smart people to create a real answer to the southern border issues, not political hacks.
2
In other words, 'resistance' against attempts to control border. What's the parole there, 'butterflies, not fences/walls' ?
Come think of that, isn't it sort of stupid to call all this 'resistance'? A large number of people voted for some sort of barrier, and they actually happened to have their man in the position of power, fair and square. Why would you 'resist' any solution that is not to your liking? And in this particular case, when all is said and done, the attitude of those opposing the barrier seems to be, 'just go on with the things as they are', which is to say that they see no issues with illegal immigration.
You'll get 4 more years of DT.
9
@ss, mexico was going to pay for the wall, remember????
1
It is not fair to many thousands of Asians, Indians, and other to wait for immigrant visas, while people from Mexico and Central America walk through an open border area and live in the US. We allowed these millions of people who entered this country dictate our immigration laws by mob rule. So much for the rule of law.
17
Since the Rio Grande Valley is one of the most biologically diverse regions in the country, the last remaining endangered ocelet habitat in North America, and a major bird migration route it is highly questionable why the Trump administration would choose to waive 28 environmental regulations for the wall construction here.
As Executive Director of the National Butterfly Center Trevino- Wright has stated " The issue is not whether butterflies can fly over the wall, the issue is whether private property (farms, businesses, and homes) should be seized and destroyed for a project that does not serve the greater good or enhance national security."
10
We do not need a wall or even fencing at the border. The great majority of those crossing illegally are doing so for the opportunity to work.
Dishonest Donald the Swindler uses that to claim they are taking American jobs, much of it seasonal, hard labor, piece work in agriculture and ranching. Not too many years ago they would work through the season,then go home. Once they were prevented for that, they would stay here because they could not get back after leaving.
Many also got jobs in construction, chances are at least half of you live in homes that were framed by these immigrants. They did work cheaper, but you could not have afforded those homes if they did not, it was mass construction, the good carpenters went into finish work. There is a shortage of these workers in Huston, Santa Rosa and other towns that burned and need rebuilding.
Harvesting work is seasonal, and requires following the crops, very few Americans will do that today, moving from state to state and living in cramped housing campers for long duration. Allowing them to cross and return lets them keep their families in Mexico and kids there. Their presence in the farm communities have aided the economies of both countries, many businesses depend on them, this is all being destroyed but ignorance and bigotry.
25
@David Underwood Your entire argument goes again a century of advancement in labor law.
What's the point of all that advancement if we make exceptions for people who came here illegally?
Higher wages and work standards lift the economy for all in the lower income bracket.
Would you suggest to Starbucks, when they talk about a minimum $15/hr wage, that they hire undocumented immigrants so we can have cheaper coffee?
The jobs Americans won't do argument only makes sense because it is an advantage to the employer, who looks to hire such workers to compete with the other person who does the same.
Believe me, without undocumented workers working in the shadows, the labor market will find its level, and more people will have more money to buy those homes. Think Henry Ford.
19
@David Underwood If we had many more people like you in the past then by this time the good old USA would had been a third world country.
11
@JP
Nonsense we had them all through WWII. My uncle had them through the 1980s on his apricot farm, as did all the other farms in the area. East LA is not a third world country, nor is Orange county. We have the sons and daughters of those immigrants and they are doing well. Some of those farms their parents worked on are now owned by them.
Yours is just a bigoted opinion sans facts.
5
Good Job, Truly Good People of OUR United States of America. This whole "wall" fiasco must end. It is NOT needed or wanted.
The article says, "The federal government waived 28 environmental laws to expedite construction."
The "federal government" did not waive them. The Con Don and his Robber Baron democracy-destroying brethren did.
Please, media, use the right words. It is so important. I am part of the "federal" government because government is simply the people. I sure do not support gutting environmental laws and or building a wall.
The real news of the damage being done by the Koch brothers 40+ year hostile financial takeover of OUR governments - culminating in The Con Don lurking around OUR white house and his Robber Baron brethren destroying OUR laws and institutions 24/7 - must get out to the public.
The headline should have read, "TRUMP WAIVED 28 ENVIRONMENTAL LAWS TO TRY TO BUILD HIS WALL".
94
@njglea
Somehow, I do not think that a wall is going to stop the migration of birds and butterflies.
6
@njglea. Environmental damage from border security structures needs to weighted against damage done by cartels with trafficked labor growing marijuana in our wild forest and private lands. Most illegals brought in by traffickers travel far inland, where environmental and quality of life damage happens. Pesticide herbicide fertilizer and garbage in grow areas, overcrowding a drop in quality in our schools, reoccurrence of once eliminated diseases, large underground untaxed economy.. some with cartel money .. honest businesses and contractors can't compete with cheap labor are just a few examples of damage done far inland. Cloaking open borders policy other issues is disingenuous.
6
@njglea
ow about the headline reading: TRUMP IS DESTROYING WILD LIVE SANCTUARIES, with the subtitle: He should be walled in for destroying them.
9