How this church is still in business defies the imagination. How they can continue to proclaim to be a pipeline to the Divine has become an absolutely profane construct.
22
The Catholic Church is now attempting to stop abortions early. They are showing pregnant women ultrasound images of their fetus. Hoping to change the mother's mind. I think they can help by supporting the mother to full term and putting the child up for adoption if the mother cannot raise the child. They have the finances to do this and it could be their penance to reverse years of abuse to all genders.
Also, the Church has to face the music and give up on the idea of celibate priests. They are currently allowing married protestant priest into the Church due to the current shortage. How about women taking over the hierarchy of the Church? Or just face the fact that they will not be around much longer to abuse anyone.
7
Just when you thought the Catholic Church was just terrible, they have to have another revelation (yes, pun intended) that makes it worse
7
Today’s news is that Russia clapped a guy in jail, classifying the Jehovah’s Witnesses as a threat to the public. We have similar conflicts with many religions, even here in the US, where tolerance extends no further than public safety. To exempt anyone who claims to report to a no-evidence higher power, as does, for example, the Vice President, is contrary to the rule of law, as well as common sense. So we leave the priests alone as long as crimes are hidden. We leave evangelists alone until they morph into political force. We justify our blind eye on the basis of some hypothetical benefits of organized religion, their utility in convincing young men to take up weapons of war, their proven ability to keep a lid on secular excursions, like revolutions.
Pretty much, our culture is just as culpable as these weird (in the old use of the word) sects, and it is up to education to clean up the consequences. Threat to the public... not a bad analysis.
7
The Catholic church today can be considered religion's version of organized crime. The pope is the equivalent of the "Capo d tutti Capo", Bishops serve as the "Capo regime". Upon ordination priest take an oath of omertà. Women are not allowed to participate.So there you have it, another reason for practicing catholics to abandon the church.
16
"Even though the abuse of nuns gets less attention than the abuse of children and young men, it is not new."
And, sexual slavery?
This is the first I've heard of this, and it is sickening.
6
Dear Vatican,
Do not blame secularization, science, or other external forces for your shrinking flock. Your biggest enemy is not out there; it is in you—the unbelievable hubris of an institution that considers itself holier and more knowing than-all, and holds itself above the law.
Your empire is crumbling from within.
- A very disappointed Catholic
21
Any organization that limits its leadership and positions of power to the sex most prone to engage in sexual abuse should have a very good protocol in place for reporting and sanctioning abuse. The Catholic Church definitely failed that test.
(Oh wait, that describes any organization in the world until recently. Nothing particularly special about the Catholics I am afraid.)
6
Is this a surprise to anyone? Nuns have long been the fodder of abusive priests with no questions asked. Time to let this archaic practice go. You can Love God without the sanction of Roman Catholic marriage in a nunnery. Stop the insanity.
6
Lock them up. All of the Rapists, and all those that cover it up. Want to solve 99 percent of these problems in Churches ??? Women Priests.
And ONLY Women.
10
It is past time to open the Catholic Priesthood to married men and women.
The Orthodox Church, the original Church born from the conference of Nicea, from which the Catholic Church separated, allows married men as priests and has zero reported incidents of aberrant sexual abuse.
The Catholic Church appears to have been a clarion call for sexual abusers. Those who are willing to hide behind celibacy to abuse little boys, nuns, and who knows what else.
It is time to open the church to the mainstream. Married people. Just this one step will essentially eliminate the entire culture of abusing little boys in the church because it will attract those who already have their sexual appetites assuaged.
16
@Michael - A Catholic church near my hometown has a married priest. He’s got a wife and kids and everything. The last I heard, he was working out well, and the congregation liked him.
How did this happen? He was apparently an Episcopal priest at one time but converted to Catholicism and wished to continue his ministry within the Catholic church. By the time he came to this decision, he’d already married and started a family, which priests can do in the Episcopal church. Now the Catholic church certainly wasn’t going to tell him to divorce his wife and sign away his parental rights, so they welcomed him and his family. They did this because they were, and still are, facing a priest shortage: there simply aren’t enough men who want to become priests and remain single and celibate for a lifetime in order to do so. There are more churches in need of priests than there are priests to go around, so when this guy showed up with his family in tow, they took him because there weren’t any other options.
I know that, had they not faced a priest shortage, they probably never would have accepted this married father - a literal father - into the priesthood. But it just goes to show that if they can do this when their backs are up against the wall, and have it work, they can do it all the time. It’s time for married priests. Nearly every other world religion has married clergy. The Catholic Church needs to get on the bandwagon with this.
6
This writer has it exactly right. The move by the Catholic Church in the 12th century to make celibacy mandatory made it a haven for pedophiles and sexual abusers of all stripes. This problem and perpetual stain on the Catholic form of Christianity will never be erased until priests are allowed to marry, as they are in all other Christian faiths, which have very little of this problem.
5
The seemingly endless revelations of sexual depravity among the clergy of the Roman Catholic Church make it seem more like a cesspool of moral depravity rather than a beacon of moral authority. At the very moment when the world desperately needs a new awakening of morality that preaches tolerance for all races, religions, gender identification, sexual orientation, and women, we have the weakening of the out-dated, male-dominated, 2000-year old religious institutions across the world. Instead, we are confronting increased autocracy, bigotry, racial and sexual discrimination. The immorality of the Church is reflected in the immorality of world leaders like Donald Trump and the corruption of political institutions aimed at controlling it.
7
"...admitted the Roman Catholic Church had faced a persistent problem of sexual abuse of nuns by priests and even bishops."
the pope means: persistent since the middle ages. nunnery graveyards replete with infant burials are well known. excoration of priests for "worldly ways" has been around since long before the Romance of the Rose.
and when it comes to abuse, please don't forget to throw in a few of those wacky renaissance popes. they really knew how to treat a girl wrong.
6
First, the Pope's comment that the Church is already on "a path" to addressing this strikes me as extremely weak, like dripping a cup of tea onto a house fire. Articles nearly 20 years ago in 2001 show the problem was widespread then. What has been done in the interim? Second, he acknowledges "sexual slavery" in the abuse of nuns. He does not acknowledge, and the Church does not acknowledge, that when women have no choice in bearing young, like the Church would have -- banning abortion and contraception -- women are then reproductive slaves. Third, the rank hypocrisy of the Church in allowing these crimes against women (and they are CRIMES), for keeping a blind eye to forced abortion of victims by their priests and bishops, for ignoring the production of fatherless children, and covering up the abuse of minors, reeks like the stench of pure rot. This absolute patriarchy is absolutely corrupted. But it also shows why women MUST have reproductive choice. If someone else controls a woman's reproductive choice, she is a slave and the controller can force either birth OR abortion.
21
Over 900 comments on another main stream paper, only 218 here. The NYT does not censor based on content, right
3
@Mary - They didn’t censor your comment, apparently.
1
What, no comment from NYT's columnist Ross Douthat?
I’m looking forward to his next column where I suspect he’ll twist himself into a pretzel explaining away sexual crimes of nuns and boys by priests and bishops for decades, if not centuries, blaming democrats, non-church goers, and liberalism instead.
20
Wewe and Basha think and recommend: The church should take a hands on approach to keeping priests urges at bay. The rest of us at the Balanitis Research Commune support Wewe's and Basha's recommendation that the priests take a hands on approach to solving the sex abuse problem. The Pope should acknowledge that there is nothing like hands on experience when solving such a problem.
All the comments about how if priests were allowed to marry it would solve the problem are beyond naive. How is marriage a cure for pedophilia? Sexual predators join the priesthood knowing they would have unfettered access to the trust of innocent children. It should be obvious that allowing them to marry will only make it more difficult to weed them out.
6
Francis, please lead; end celibacy, allow women priests and married priests before it's too late.
11
An old limerick (not exactly on point, but close): "From the depths of the crypts of Saint Giles/ Came screams that reechoed for miles./Said a monk, "Goodness gracious, /Don't Brother Ignatius/ Know our good bishop has piles?"
4
"Francis spoke about a case in which Benedict dissolved an order of nuns “because a certain slavery of women had crept in, slavery to the point of sexual slavery on the part of clergy or the founder.”"
Typical that Pope Benedict dissolved the order of nuns. Wouldn't it have made more sense to get rid of the clergy that enslaved the nuns? Were the priests kicked out as well or were they relocated and hidden, so they could continue in their chosen field--sexual predators.
18
Some have only been suspended? Yet anyone working in any other non-religious organization is summarily fired for behavior less than sexual assault.
Is the Catholic Church so desperate to keep these criminal priests because they are finding it so hard to attract other men to the priesthood?
All of these abused women should leave the church and file a class action lawsuit. Nuns having abortions? What a hypocritical organization, preaching against abortions and out of wedlock sex, all the while it's going on right in its own house! The trust of so many good people continues to be betrayed all over the world.
I wonder why Catholics all over the world do not rise up, withhold all financial support and demand a cleaning of house. If it results in even more parishes closing, so be it. That is a very small price to pay for truth, decency, and following the tenets of their faith. Anything less would be allowing these tragedies to continue. What would Jesus do....?
9
When I was a child I was a devout Catholic. When I would look at a sister or a nun, I would say to myself that they were God's women. Had I been told then what I have just read when that young, I would truly be convinced that you were out of your mind and needed serious help. As an adult my religious beliefs have evolved, and while I still deeply believe in a supreme entity, I'm not traditionally religious. I believe all religions have the right to see God as they seem fit, because I believe God to be infinite in every sense of the word. I also believe that we all face a reckoning of some sort. Strangely(or not) in my advanced age, while not a practicing Catholic, I still perceive nuns and sisters as God's Women. While I believe that God is most forgiving, I would hate to have stand before any manifestation of God and try to explain abusing God's small children and God's women.
6
Weobserve: At least some Catholic males (priests) were oriented toward females. Therefore the church can righteously claim that there was no gender discrimination ... We of the Balanitis Research Commune condemn those who perpetrate such horrors against either gender.
1
From the day you are born, it is (figuratively) beaten into you, "The is the only true church, the only one that God has chosen, the only Truth. Everyone else is misguided, or is doing the work of Satan." From birth, this is foisted upon you, and there is no alternative, "It is the way it is". From not questioning anything being said, to assuming (and being absolutely sure of) and that the guy in the pulpit, that is up there preaching Hellfire and Damnation, is always right, all powerful and must be obeyed, I can see how they retain their followers, it's all they've ever known. I was raised by a Japanese mother. When I was a kid, they had me go to a local Baptist Church (my father's side was Southern Baptist). They never went though, I asked my mother why. she said she was not a believer, but she wanted me to decide for myself. When the preacher paddled me for something I didn't do, I never went back.
That's the difference. My parents taught me what all the religions practiced, and let me decide for myself. You generally will not get an adult to change and believe this stuff, that's why they try to get them as kids.
6
When are these men going to start being held accountable for their crimes instead of being sheltered? Imagine the lives that did not have to be ruined, damaged or lost if these men were brought to the light when their dirty deeds were known. Ugly things flourish in darkness. There is no need for discussion. Release their names and press criminal charges.
9
@Mark - True, the Church has done a great deal of good, particularly for the poor. Its educational institutions are often far superior to those of some other faiths (there is no comparison between Georgetown and Liberty University, for example). They are willing to go to parts of the world where no one else will go to help the suffering. They have done much good.
They’ve also done much harm. The sexual abuse scandal is a major example. People’s lives were ruined, and the Church looked the other way. Now we hear that nuns, those people who really are in the trenches serving the poor, were being raped by priests. Some of these nuns got pregnant from these assaults. What a betrayal it must have been for them to be raped and have the Church do nothing about it.
Pope John Paul II infuriated my mother when he went to Africa during the AIDS crisis and told the people there that it was a sin to use condoms. John Cardinal O’Connor infuriated her further when he kicked homeless people out of St. Patrick’s Cathedral: they were sleeping in the pews one winter night because the Cathedral was warm and safe, and NYC in the 80s was a disaster. The esteemed Cardinal turned them out anyway. As Catholic school students in the 50s, my mom and her classmates were subjected to a Monsignor who would visit the classroom on the last day of school and slap the kids who had bad report cards. This isn’t about the actions of “a few”, because it’s more than a “few”: they are many. They are Legion.
8
All religions are just fairy tales from ancient and medieval times. It is just what fairy tales you want to believe in that denotes your religious denomination. All Pope Francis has to do is call a conclave and make it ok for priests and nuns to marry whoever they want. The church will go on and nobody will be struck by lightning. The Catholic Church with its celibacy rule is just going against nature. Interesting that nuns were forced into having abortions. Nuns that were abused by priests should go to the police and report their abusers. The abusive priest are only men with large sexual appetites and no morals.
7
Women have a mind of their own. Even nuns. My step-mother was a nun, now with five children, happily married for 30 years. Nuns, for the most part are very intelligent, informed and determined women. To have the NYT portray nuns as victims of abuse by men does a tremendous disservice to nuns who have chosen to serve God and to women, at-large, defining women as too weak to say, “No!” Nun’s, particularly and generally, are not push-overs. All women, like men, have passions of the heart. They have desire and, at times and as a consenting adult, an overriding / overwhelming will to act on those desires.
The article stereotypes women as being too weak and vulnerable to assert their real wishes which contradicts the preferred belief that women deserve / have a right to equal status with men. Good men and women do not respect men and women who are push-overs. They view them as dangerous / a threat. The article also suggests that men cannot control themselves where women are always in control thus the only way to have slept with a nun would have been through an unwanted sexual assault. Not my experience. Too many times I’ve been on the receiving end of a woman’s secret, impassioned, desires that she, in advance, had admitted were inappropriate yet expressed a wish to proceed. I’ve concluded that I cannot read and interpret what is on a woman’s mind and then associate the interpretation with my own thoughts. Thus I’ve found it hard to deny what a woman may feel she needs from me.
There is no moral currency left in the coffers of the pontificate ,
And the dearth of responses (relatively )
To this horrific news in this article is a testament to the allegiance to silence
And stealth with which the the souls of the most vulnerable in our communities have been stolen and crushed in service to the narcissism
And entitlement of the Catholic Church and it’s band of rapists and criminals,
Speaks volumes about the inequities And
Disembodied perpetrators,and their ice cold
Hearts.
The next day they donned golden robes
And raised golden chalices ,
And placed little wafers on our tongues,
Even reciting blessings ................
What horrors followed?
3
Can the state of the Catholic Church get any worse? I left decades ago before I even knew how abusive it was. I left because women were not respected in the least. Now I know how really evil this religion is.
7
This sexual abuse of nuns by priests and bishops is extremely upsetting and disappointing. I am glad Pope Francis is admitting to this horrible behavior.
As a lifelong practicing Catholic, I will continue to attend Mass and practice the rituals of the Church. I will still say my prayers and recite the rosary on a regular basis. The Church needs our prayers more now than ever if we want to rid this evil from our Church. I attend Church for the main purpose of praying to Jesus and receiving the Holy Eucharist which is the center of our faith. This is what my faith is all about. Faith is a gift and I am blessed to believe in a higher power. This will not change as long as I live. This is who I am.
1
are these priests and bishops in jail? why not? did the church report the crimes to the police or prosecutors? if not, why not? are the leaders of the church criminals? if so, why not?
is this organization supposed to be treated any differently than any other crime family engaged in illegal drugs or murder?
8
The investigation must include sexual abuse of girls by nuns. Yes, nuns. I know someone who was sexually abused by a nun over sixty years ago. It was reported to the bishop and the nun was moved to a different city. I don't know if she was punished in any way and I've always wondered if she abused more girls in the city that she was sent to.
26
Please ignore my comment from a few moments ago. I see it is the lede in the World section.
2
Way past time that Catholics start cleaning their own house and stop trying to tell the rest of us how to live!
12
This iceberg gets bigger all the time.
9
In earlier times, priests were allowed to marry. Perhaps returning to this sensible approach would help.
What makes human beings 'different' is that we are all 'part god & part human' -
Dogs and cats are wonderful, as are deer and salamanders and ladybugs and sharks and elephants ... Part of why we love them is that they live in the moment while always obeying the 'program'.
Humans have this gift / curse of seeing beyond our lives, beyond our bodies, while always 'confined' ... Head in the stars, feet on the ground.
Members of the clergy should be the best example of this
'duality' and marry, so they may fully contribute to society.
4
We lived in a beach resort east of a heavily Catholic metropolitan area. My family owned motels, and my stepfather told me that the higher echelons of Catholic priesthood — Monsignors and the like, several at a time — would rent efficiency apartments off-season and bring along selected nuns. They’d stay in their rooms getting drunk and carousing for a week. He had minus respect for them. This was back in the early to mid-‘60s. I’m amazed it’s taken this long for the truth to come out. The pedophilia scandals of recent decades have made those old stories seem quaint by comparison.
9
I am Protestant but was raised to respect the historic Catholic Church. Many leaders knew about the abuse and covered it up: What 20,30, 40% of the leadership or more knew? Even the priests knew about - what 10-20% of them? It is hard not to consider the Catholic Church bureaucracy to be organized crime - a sex abuse racketeering organization. And to expect the peers of the abusers to clean this up defies what we know about human psychology. 40 years ago it might have passed as criminal negligence. Now it looks like organized crime.
10
Why is this a surprise? The Church's demand for celibacy is unnatural and inevitably leads to all forms of abuse. It's all about money. If male (and it should also be female) priests could marry the Church would have to support families so they preach celibacy.
4
@rob orchard Why all the excuses and justification for various forms of sexual predation and abuse against children and women, as a result of choosing a "life of celibacy". Predators are predators. Likely they sign up for this life, in order to have a muffled means to feed their premeditated true desires. Has little to do with being married - they are predators and should to be charged accordingly. Marriage likely will not cure their predatory desires - it's just another excuse by people not willing to call it what it is... sick pedophiliac and abusive desires.
2
let people get married. its a natural basic instinct to procreate and have sex. how can you even give advice to married people when you cant relate
4
This story, like so many others about the Catholic Church, makes me want to vomit.
The current leadership still resists change.
If you don't like change, how are you going to like extinction?
12
its about time the country called vatican city got to work building a prison
4
30 conceptions through non consensual sex in one congregation?
Imposed abortions?
What in the name of the lord is going on with the Catholic religion?
9
At what point will religion stop parsing who the evildoers are? Cardinals, Bishops, Priests. How about we just call them male?
4
Nuns having abortions... So will they be forgiven or be judged as murderous sinners? Pope Francis's latest revelation is telling as to the debauchery, perversion, and corruption within the Catholic Church. I say this as a Catholic born and raised. This is medieval patriarchy, control, and power at its worst. It is ruthless and amoral. This religion which judges harshly and preaches mortal sin is damning itself.
I thank Pope Francis's forthrightness. But it is not enough. The Church is in the process of self-destruction. It is at fault, not we. It is The Sinner, not we. They must atone. But can we forgive?
8
Maybe it is time to shut the doors to holyland and use the tax free money, which includes MOB money, to rebuild, educate, and improve the world..and lock up the thousands of Pervert Priests and see how much they enjoy life" behind" bars! If you take our religions as a whole, and move them to Mars, they would have no meaning! Spiritualy, charity, kindness, inclusion, tolerance of all creeds and beliefs are a given, but these antiquated fairytales are
outdated and nothing more than tax free Disneyworld!!
3
The Catholic Church is an on going Criminal Sexual Conspiracy
"Religion began when the first charlatan met the first fool."
- Voltaire
Think about it:
If there was a God, you’d know it. “Belief” wouldn’t have anything to do with it.
If there was a God, you’d see his fingerprint everywhere; there would be no room for doubt.
If there was a God, his revelation to humanity would be clear, unambiguous, and available to anyone at any time.
If there was a God, reality would make sense.
If there was a God, all who ask for help would receive it, with no conditions or caveats.
If there was a God, those who pray for peace on Earth would receive it.
If there was a God, he would be free; anyone could come to him at any time without having to do this or say that or believe this.
If there was a God, you would receive answers when you ask for them.
If there was a God, miracles would be happening everywhere, every day, for all to see.
If there was a God, no one would go hungry.
If there was a God, there would be no such thing as fear.
If there was a God, nothing could possibly be arbitrary.
If there was a God, and you knew it, you would stop hurting.
- Ben Love
4
This is news? Why did it take the Pope this long to make this statement publicly? It is obvious that the Church has committed these crimes. It is also obvious the Church cannot control this or properly communicate the scale of the problem.
The Pope does not seem to understand that the Church is burning to the ground. The credibility of the Pope's statements and the Church's actions are questionable.
36
The National Catholic Reporter reported on this as far back as 2001, I believe? Now we’re going to do better? How much longer will the nuns give the homilies, distribute communion, visit the frail and ill before they too can finally be respected and hold the same title as priest, bishop, cardinal? This gig is up and it’s criminal behavior and it belongs in the criminal courts. Seems the only ones left alone from their abuse may be their big bucks contributors. Check those Koch Brothers giving to Catholic University and their influence on their business school....promote the rejection of worker rights, work for deregulation, economic stewardship, etc etc. Holy, holy, holy Lord God Almighty?!
3
Now tell me about the Catholic Churches pro- life stance.
11
Too much obedience, too little questioning. Being a good little girl is generally a problem in itself. Try nailing things on church doors for the symbolism.
7
Why all the excuses and justification for various forms of sexual predation and abuse against children and women, as a result of choosing a "life of celibacy". Predators are predators. Likely they sign up for this life, in order to have a muffled means to feed their premeditated true desires. Has little to do with being married - they are predators and should to be charged accordingly. Marriage likely will not cure their predatory desires - it's just another excuse by people not willing to call it what it is... sick pedophiliac and abusive desires.
4
This is yet another example of separation of Church and State. Criminal behavior requires the victim to call the police not the local Church pastor. Criminal activity - regardless of what it is - rape, sodomy, financial impropriety through theft, etc. or anything else is a civil or criminal matter. It is not a Church matter - ever!
6
I’m so glad I never wanted to be a nun!
3
Strong hierarchies that endow their authority figures with an aura of saintliness and moral authority, are always in danger of seeing it abused.
Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
4
I know of a woman - right now - who is the daughter of priest. She’s got a Ph.D. And teaches in a top tier college.
I know nothing of her mother, who lives in another country. Was she a nun? Is she one? How did it affect her to have a child without benefit of matrimony?
The woman I know is a an immigrant to the US. But I can only imagine the toll there must have been - for her to grow up knowing her father was a priest. Probably having to hide that.
How does it affect the multiple people this type of abuse causes? It results in widening circles of secrecy. In feelings of betrayal and shame.
3
Amazing the amount of abuse still present in this religion. It's been such basically from the beginning and continues unabated. Giving lip Service to this tragedy is akin to condoning it.
4
Why does the catholic church still get a tax exemption? I'm not catholic; why am I forced to pay for their crimes? Let's be clear - they're crimes, not "sins." This is not about religion. This is about organized crime.
9
"An article last week in Women Church World, the women’s magazine of the Vatican newspaper L’Osservatore Romano, blamed the abuse on the outsize power of priests."
I would place the blame on the outsize power of the Catholic Church that perversely mandates celibacy for the clergy and prohibits woman from becoming priests.
44
@Bar tennant, and Jesus had women disciples.
Your point is ... they didn't have the proper anatomy?
5
I admire Pope Francis for saying all the right things. But it is long past time for him to back up those words with actions.
12
One should EXPECT it (the truth) not admire it. Plus why admire hollow words? The pope has no credibility.
1
The Church has been rife with misbehavior by the clergy, including bishops, cardinals and popes, since the Middle Ages, so today's revelations are not a surprise. The Church is far from the one that Christ established 2000 years ago; it is just one historical interpretation. Reformers have come and gone in the Church since the Middle Ages, something the Church actually may view with pride, given its emphasis on constancy.
10
Maybe they should get rid of the priesthood
11
Unfortunately the last shoe has yet to drop. The class action settlement concerning Indian Residential Schools in Canada has obtained evidence of many claims of sexual and physical abuse by nuns against young boys and girls. The problem is not restricted to priests.
9
@David Paterson
Really? That is not yet news down here.
Anyway, there are likely many. many more shoes to drop.
2
People, mainly the minority community (including women and children), would have a far better life if the influence of religion is diminished and, eventually, vanish. There are so many reasons why people who know more about religion believe less in it- https://goo.gl/q3CPgD
Generally speaking, less religion in a country makes it more innovative (https://goo.gl/2aZ2uP), more prosperous (https://goo.gl/DoAxQk ), and most importantly, happier (https://goo.gl/bWQJRS).
13
Don’t blame the Catholic Church.
This is the work of The Devil.
4
@New World . Sure thing. Let's blame everything on the Devil. Unlock the prisons. Criminals can't be held responsible for their actions.
3
@New World perhaps it's the catholic church that's evil. Your comment is disgusting; obviously the blame falls onto the catholic church. These sick abusers should not have tax-exempt status (unrelated, but just saying).
5
Isn't that opportunity the reason why they become priests?
6
Tell us again, right wing Catholics, how clerical sexual abuse is all about homosexuality...
21
disgusting
6
The one takeaway that can't be denied anymore is that celibacy leads to aberrant sexual behavior. Denying one's nature is defying God not following Him.
13
@Rick Gage, with respect, you are incorrect. Celibacy does not cause the ill behavior. Many people who molest children are married and/or have children themselves. Celibacy may be unnatural, but it is chosen freely in the case of men who become priests. Perhaps some day the church will allow them to marry. In any case, celibacy does not equal pedophilia.
3
@Rick Gage Good points from both Julie and Emily, I may have painted with too broad a brush. Celibacy is an artificial form of self discipline that mirrors the failure and criminalization of Gay aversion therapy (pray the gay out). It cannot add to a healthy sexual environment and it is antiquarian, authoritarian and sectarian, since it didn't come from the teachings of Christ. We are sexual beings. I cry for those who are lonely and crave company. I have no tears for those who impose those restrictions on themselves.
There is no moral capital left in the coffers of the pontificate ,
Only rooms full of decorative robes and triangle hats adorning narcissism at the alter of the Catholic Church feeding on the vulnerability
Of the humbled and sweet souls of women and children too intimidated to even imagine the predators monstrous intentions .
These are criminals,
Worse then murderers ,destroying thousands of lives and relationships,
And breezily putting on their golden robes to raise a chalice the next morning at Mass.
Laying a little wager on your tongue
With a blessing.
They should’ve in Jail.
Interesting that there
Are so few ( relatively)
Responses to this
Article.
It speaks to the unacceptably of talking about
The truth of these crimes generally.
Knell at the alter of
Free Press instead!
11
@Susan Dveirin Susan
I think the reason there are few responses is because this story line has been reported on for 30 years and been whispered about for centuries.
Recently 4 diocese in Texas here I am located has named priests who have been credibly accused of child molestation.
I think when enough money has been paid out to the victims and the revenue dried up by supporters leaving the church will you see real reform and action take hold.
4
Back in the late 80s, I believe, I could be off on the years, there was a $60 million dollar judgement or settlement with the Catholic church about biased kids, I thought that would be the end of it. But apparently, it was just the cost of having a bunch of pedophiles inhabiting your church/business (because no matter how you define it, the Catholic Church is BIG BUSINESS) It is still going on, I think they just have accepted it, and keep paying out, and keep molesting kids, and now nuns too. I just can't believe people still give their kids to them. And money. I guess God wants it that way.
2
Finally, a Catholic hierarchy sex scandal in which gay priests will not be made scapegoats.
4
How is an abuser a scapegoat exactly?
1
To all you Catholics out there....
"As in all the congregations of the Lord’s people. Women should remain silent in the churches, They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church."[1Cor. 14:33-35]
Kinda says it all, doesn't it.
20
@Doremus Jessups
Written by Paul, a man who never met Jesus and was raised as a Jewish zealot, a man who never married - at a time when not marrying was abnormal for a Jewish male.
2
I am very disappointed that this article appears at the very bottom of the scroll. It is extremely important that the New York Times editors view this issue as vital information for all to see. It should be placed where even the casual reader will see the headline.
10
Checks and balances everywhere.
1
I don't understand why the pope or anyone else in the religion needs to address this. Isn't this criminal? Shouldn't the police and legal system handle this instead?
17
And these are the MEN who work so ‘tirelessly’ to take the right and freedom from women to make the reproductive choices for themselves and their families.
Shame shame shame. Take care if your own house and leave us to care of ours.
20
And yet the Church arrogantly seeks to invade our secular government with its arrogant insists that the government enforce its religious rules on everyone! It’s time the Church focused on its own issues and left government alone.
There is only one wall we need that is the one that separates the Church from the state!
15
Why any women would engaged in these ancient religious institutions is beyond me.
7
Truly, is it not time, past time, to hose the whole thing down?
5
The catholic church has no business representing any divine beings.
9
This is yet another outrage to the Catholic Religion. I am Catholic by birth and training however the failure of the Church to stem and stop the abuse has driven me away and my utter disgust for this institution grows exponentially with each scandal. The Church has had plenty of time to clean up their mess yet they continue to sweep these crimes under the rug.
It is time for the proper authorities to take over and bring justice to this situation.
For shame, for shame!
71
@Fred
Don’t complain to the bishop, CALL THE POLICE!
12
The celibacy rule surely contributes to the perverse undercurrents persistent in the Catholic clergy. The more substantive driver is the authoritarian culture protected and advanced by the leadership for centuries. Men in the clergy are granted tremendous social and political power. In some countries that has meant priests semi-openly "married" to local women. In others that culture has contributed to abusive treatment of children. In the earlier part of the 20th century, in many immigrant communities, priests held close to political power over their congregations. Nuns, of course, got the short shrift - meager pensions, limited public role, often denied the identity of a last name (e.g., Sister Mary - in my memory, the priests always got to use their last names). What pains me is the many dedicated and wonderful individual people - clergy and laypeople - whose good works are wiped clean by the old men at the top. This is about more than celibacy, and the feeble responses we get from the Church hierarchy is shameful.
4
It's not clear to me from this article if all sex between a priest or bishop and a nun is classified as abuse. Or is some of this "abuse" really just the result of people developing feelings for each other.
For example, in 1970, Daniel Berrigan was a Jesuit Priest who married a nun, Elizabeth McAlister. He remained a priest for 3 years, keeping his marriage a secret from the church until she was pregnant.
1
@Gary - Abuse is abuse, Gary. This isn’t about consenting adults developing feelings for one another, deciding to enter into a sexual relationship, and simply choosing not to tell anyone about it until the woman becomes pregnant. This is about predators abusing victims and getting away with it because the Church hierarchy conveniently pretended it wasn’t happening. Framing this in any other way lets these monsters off the hook.
Catholicism is the religion of my childhood and the religion of the vast majority of my family. I am deeply upset at how the Church has tried to sweep these crimes, and the vulnerable people caught up in them, under the rug while telling us that we’re not good Catholics if we use birth control, support women’s right to choose, and refuse to vote for Trump. They’re talking out of both sides of their mouth, and I resent it utterly.
70
@Gary
If its not clear to you, then you are only reading what you are comfortable with. Sounds like you are sympathizing with the priests and bishops.
You exposed your true feelings when you put the word abuse in quotes.
Shame on you
3
13 years of Catholic school and I can honestly say I never, experienced, saw and heard credible stories of abuse in my schools. However, I do believe it all and no longer associate with the church in any way. The Catholic church needs to do more than acknowledge, relocate and pay damages. The offenders need to go to real prisons. They can ask God for forgiveness there.
50
I suspect this is just the tip of the iceberg.
The claim that nuns have been sexually abused by priests is not a new one. This has been going on for centuries. The Catholic Church is in need of serious self reflection and reform. They also need to arrest the perpetrators (a simple DNA test will prove or exonerate the men in question). The vow of celibacy isn't working and should be replaced with the right of marriage for priests and bishops. It is time for the Catholic Church to come into the 21st century.
5
For the love of heaven, who HAVEN'T Catholic priests and bishops abused? Maybe the idea that human sexuality is natural and applies to EVERYONE is something to recognize? Maybe the idea of celibacy and expecting a human being to be married to God alone isn't such a good idea? Maybe one's HEART can be married to God AND YET there's enough room in there for a spouse as well, made of flesh and bones and additionally providing an outlet for HEALTHY sexual encounters that we all need in order to maintain our very sanity? Seriously, the whole idea of human behavior and sexuality and how it relates to the human spirit has been forever tarnished within the Catholic Church and I don't think it will ever be able to recover in it's present form. Unless serious and significant changes are made to the very structure of the Church, I cannot imagine it's existence continuing for more than one or 2 generations, at least in the countries of the West. I know that predictions of the eternal faith and it's demise have been made for centuries, but this is a REAL turning point in history, when a country like Ireland which only a few years ago didn't allow divorce or abortion of any kind now has a gay man as it's leader. THAT is progress and the Catholic Church had better get with the program if it wants to remain relevant in a world changing faster than ever before.
4
I had a brilliant therapist who said that emotions can be divided into four groupings: happiness, sadness, anger and sexuality. He said that if we repressed any of these emotions they would be expressed inappropriately at a later date. He further told me that through our forties we kept masks on but they needed to be removed if we were to live a fulfilled existence. To me it is very clear that the Roman Catholic policy of enforcing celibacy for priests and nuns and pretending that everyone is heterosexual is at the root of "the global sex abuse crises that is threatening the pope's legacy and the moral capital that is the currency of his pontificate."
If Pope Francis and the Bishops want to create change in the Church they will need to open the doors to a discussion of celibacy in the priesthood and among nuns. They will need to open a discussion about opening the welcome mat to LGBT couples into the Church. The Roman Catholic Church is facing a moral crises so deep it needs bold action. If the Bishops continue to put their heads in the sand, folks won't attend church anymore after reading stories as gruesome as this one.
1
Within the age of the internet, it seems many fundamental worldly organizations are under severe pressure, as their cloaks are pulled back to reveal perhaps a truer sense of transparency and oftentimes hypocrisy.
Organized religion could well be one of the best-marketed and most destructive concepts in the history of humankind. Catholicism ( and others ) harboring clergy with pedophiliac desires. Catholic vs Protestant conflicts often leading to destruction and war, Sunni vs Shia conflicts often leading to destruction and war. Christian vs Muslim beliefs often leading to destruction and war. Christianity vs Judaism vs Muslim vs Other beliefs often leading to destruction and war.
So, for all the destruction, why does the USA gov’t provide tax exempt status to organized religions that are influencing gov’t policy. Organized religion was globalized centuries ago. Why not have religious organizations only provide comfort and support at the local community level. Why does a local religious parish need to “report up” to the various levels of huge global synodical coffers. It all simply takes on the characteristics of typical hierarchical corporate structure and thus, often corruption and personal gains.
Why is there not a “fix” for this type of crime. Chemically altering one’s sexual desires ( chem castr ) has been around for a long time. Why is this not part of EVERY convicted pedophiliac’s reform regimen, regardless of religious preference.
Its too bad that I see many similarities between the attitudes of people commenting here about the Catholic Church and Trump. So many people are anti Church and anti Catholic just as they are anti Trump. The Church has done good things for people throughout history. It has given people a conscience when maybe they would have had none. It has given a moral compass to those without. Jesus is a good example for anyone to follow. The message gets lost these days because of the actions a few in the Church.
1
@Mark
The church has given no one a conscience. As long as you can confess, say a few Hail Marys, and all is forgiven, you have a license to commit crimes.
I question all of the "good" the catholic church has done. I think it needs misery in order to exist.
While Jesus is a good example for anyone to follow, the catholic church does not follow Jesus.
Finally, it's not the actions of a few. The last pope had to resign because of his crimes. This is the actions of tens or hundreds of thousands of priests over millennia, and the willful blindness of parishioners who allow it.
1
@Lee, no one has a license to commit crimes, no matter how many times they confess. If one is not truly repentant deep in the heart, or has every intention of re-committing a sin, he or she is not truly absolved. And, just FYI, Pope Benedict did not resign due to "his crimes." He did not commit crimes as far as I know. He may have come to the end of his ability to manage or affect people and circumstances and thought it best to step down. Whatever else one might have thought or believed of him, that action took courage.
Yes, the inquisitions did a whole lot of good. Let's just ignore these "little" problems and move on. Nothing to see here!
When you ignore the corruption and violence of the church it will persist just as in any institution.
Luckily the Catholic Church does not own the good character of Jesus because the church has surely soiled his name.
1
Prosecute any Catholic priest or bishop or other male clergy who commit a sexual crime involving women, or men. Defrock them if guilty, in addition to their having to serve time in civil jails. Meanwhile, try to solve the problem by, for a start, ditching the celibacy stricture for priests, allowing them the possibility of having normal sexual lives. Also, open up the priesthood to women.
2
I seem to remember a story in the Chicago Tribune in the mid 90s about a priest in Africa that was raping nuns and using a coat hanger to perform abortions on them. More than one of the nuns had died from what this priest had done. My children were attending catechism at the time and I promptly went up to the school and told them that I was immediately ending anything to do with Catholicism. I remember one of the women working at the school that said "You can't quit Catechism!" I told her what I had just read in the paper and she instantly stopped talking.
I am a member of a large family and all of us attended both Catholic grade school and high school. my oldest sister also went to a Catholic University. now the only time I will ever set foot into a Catholic Church is for a funeral or a wedding. Other than that I will never ever go to a Catholic Church including for my own funeral.
I don't understand how people continue to sweep all of this nonsense under the rug. Catholic Church will not change until everyone walks away from them
6
Sin exists everywhere and everyone, religious or not, is tempted to do wrong and offend God and his/her neighbor. Bishops, priests and religious are subject to temptation because they, like us, are fallen human beings. Only Jesus and his Blessed Mother were without sin some 2000 years ago. The Roman Catholic Church, as suggested here by one commentator, cannot be taken over by "the people." The question is how can the Church do a more effective job of weeding out abusers. Celibacy has been in place in the Roman Catholic Church for centuries and is unlikely to be eliminated now or in the future.That said, the evildoers described in this article must be identified and removed from the clergy.
"But if the wicked man turns away from all the sins he committed, if he keeps my statutes and does what is right and just, he shall not die." Ezekiel 19:21
2
This is an astonishing story.
Why are priests not being prosecuted for these crimes?
You know, the romanticized Dispute between Henry 2 and Becket arose because a priest had committed murder and Becket as Archbishop refused to turn him over to the Law for punishment.
Close to 1,000 years have passed and the Catholic Church still considers itself Above the Law-. many Catholics seem to agree.
2
Amazing how little uproar there has been over the years when Catholic women are abused. We heard about the abuse of Catholic boys for years, and it became a big outcry with films and accusations to the pope, while at the same time NOTHING was even mentioned about similar rape and abuse of women.
Not only the church leadership, but normal Catholic men have ignored an obvious problem. Says a lot for how these men think of women. Makes the church look pretty sick and a bed of hypocrisy.
We've learned in business that companies become more accountable when upper management is held accountable. Let's do that for sexual assault. CEO's and directors set the tone of the organization; popes, cardinals, and bishops set the tone for the church; so holding them accountable will slow down the misbehavior of their underlings. I'll bet that many priests' misbehavior took place under the same bishops, etc, since they knew it would be silently accepted.
3
It's a horrifying notion that many of the comments herein blame celibacy for the abuse of nuns and children. Rape has nothing whatsoever to do with one's sex drive. Rape is power inflicted on those the rapist believes to be beneath his status. Rape is and always will be an abuse of power. Rape is objectifying women and children, to relieve a bodily urge. It is barbaric and rapist should be treated accordingly.
9
@momb . You are so right -- lots of men pointing fingers in the wrong direction because that is easy and comfortable for them to do. Women, too, because no one wants to think about her husband or son being sexually abusive.
No one will say it so I assume it's hideously un-p.c. but it is MEN who do these things. Pick any walk of life, any socioeconomic situation, any religion, and you will see one common thread -- miserable, needly little men playing power games with their sexual organs. Some of them feel so powerless that little children are all the challenge they can handle. Some go after adults. NONE OF THEM GO AFTER PEOPLE WITH HIGHER STATUS.
1
None of this is new. Read the Devils of Loudun (1952) by Aldous Huxley based on the true story of Ursuline nuns in a convent in the small town of Loudun in 17th-century France, and their young, charismatic and allegedly Satanic confessor, Roman Catholic priest Urbain Grandier. I read it when I was just seventeen and was transfixed. Over forty years later, it's still by far the most brilliant non-fiction novel I've ever read, and in my view was Huxley's greatest achievement.
1
The Catholic Church should close it’s doors and go out of business.
The photo of the Pope getting on his airplane walking on red carpet all the way is disgusting. It’s anti Christ in the worst way.
Whatever good the Church has done is more than offset by the harm it has done.
The US should immediately bring home our Ambassador and cancel any further government to government relationship with the Church.
8
The RC church in our town recently rearranged its schedule to include one less mass a week. Due to poor attendance.
I doubt news like this will help them regain those members.
Every cancelled mass is a victory to be celebrated on the way to the death of this rotting, vicious, corrupt to the core institution.
7
Sorry but religion guarantees nothing. If those that preach and those that preach belief can't be a lawful human, what good is religion.
I am no longer a believer of Christianity, question the overwhelming inconsistencies in the Bible and overall have decided it is just blind faith.
If prayer works then how did we get where we are?
The rationale is always strange for me.
Stories such as this are sickening. Why nuns are not strong enough to resist is another question.
There are preachers, people of the church that commit crimes everyday. What a farce.
Moving criminals around within the church, making excuses, isn't going to stop these criminal acts.
1
Just a recommendation, perhaps Pope Francis should stay at the Vatican and focus all of his energy to righting the horrible sex abuse wrong that his Church, Bishops and Priests have inflicted on children, adults and nuns.
6
In the United States, rape, pedophilia and sexual abuse are felonies. Arrest, trial and ultimately imprisonment upon conviction for such heinous crimes is a matter of law. Why are religious institutions immune from these laws?
4
When the Catholic Church chooses a woman to be Pope, that will be the day the Catholic Church gets down to serious business.
2
This is religion. This is all religion. The only purpose of organized religion is to elevate a few to allow them to subjugate the "lesser".
5
Sexual abuse in the Catholic Church is not an outlier, it is the norm. It always has been. It is ingrained in it’s customs as much as the Priest’s collar and the nun’s habit. That the church is just now admitting the problem is evidence of how entrenched it is in it’s culture. What amazes me is that anyone was ever shocked by this. Before any of these stories broke, we all knew it was there. We heard story after story after story. When will we finally acknowledge that it is a morally bankrupt organization and should be disbanded?
2
Celibacy doesn’t breed abusive behavior.
These men are abusive because they have the power to ride roughshod over the nuns, who don’t have power.
Power is the ultimate corrupting force at work here, not celibacy.
88
@(not That) Dolly
So why don't we see the same issues with Episcopal priests?
3
And it’s clear many are not celibate.
2
@(not That) Dolly
i think it also has to do with the age at which men enter a seminary. Around 17 or 18, what are normal boys thinking about? Repress that natural instinct with sin and shame and the only thing that is unexpected it that some actually did grow up to be emotional whole.
2
This has been going on for centuries, and many discoveries of infant burials have been found throughout Latin America, Ireland, and probably other locations.
Monasteries were built close to convents and tunnels connected them, those were used for burials as well. When the church wonders why it's losing some many of the flock, it should use a bit of introspection, and the truth might set them free.
3
It is good that the Holy Father is beginning to address this, however incrementally. It has probably been going on at least since Constantine made the Church the official religion of the Roman Empire.
When any Church becomes wealthy and powerful, it attracts men who want not God but wealth and power. Such men are far from the renunciation of worldly satisfaction which the ideals of the Church demand. But because the Church has become wealthy and powerful, it needs such men in order to look after its interests. In this, it has utterly lost its true purpose, which is to teach liberation (or salvation, if you prefer) from the world through love and contemplation of Christ. A secondary purpose is to minister to the poor and sick.
The evils of evangelism are evident here, too. When Christianity decided, in the apocryphal final verses of Mark, that its purpose was to go into the world and preach the gospel to every creature, it became -at least partially - a force for evil in the world. Its agenda was now to gain followers and influence, instead of to gain heaven. And once that original, ascetic intention was lost, the narrow gate that Christ proposed was thrown open to people who saw the Church as a vehicle for worldly fulfillment.
Had the Church remained as a cloistered, desert religion, with no wealth or power, this legacy, as well as the many other horrors perpetrated by the Church and by Protestantism throughout history, would be negligible.
11
Priests have been suspended? Why haven't they been arrested?
Members of the Order of St-Jean were enslaved, so their order was disbanded? You left these women homeless and rudderless as the *solution* to their having been abused?
Once again, I am disgusted.
127
The doctrine of celibacy, whether priestly or practiced by nuns, denies the reality of human existence. Regardless of the reasons, and in spite of its philosophical underpinnings, the flouting of celibacy rules within the Catholic Church has existed since its inception.
As a non-Catholic, I am surely in the relative cheap seats, but as a human being, it strikes me that elimination of the celibacy rules would go a long way toward reducing the sinister behavior that priests and nuns find themselves engaged in. It would also make the Catholic Church far more relatable, and credible, as it relates to its pastoral duties.
21
@Quoth The Raven so we are going the blame the nuns who were abused?
2
And this deserves tax exemptions?
86
@northlander. All tax exemptions and other privileges granted to religious entities of any belief system should be ended NOW!
8
Consumers would freak out if Apple, GM or, say, Uber would have such problems.
I can only suggest to anyone who believes in a religion or faith that involves sexual absence that he leaves that faith. It is not worth it. As a human being, it is only natural to have sexual desires. We are not machines or robots. A religious stoic sexual life might impress a few of us. But apparently it does not work for most people, not for most priests either.
So why are we so overwhelmingly more tolerant with our religions and churches than, say, any company out there?
24
Men in secretive societies where there are women present are bound to break vows and laws. "Get thee to a nunnery" was not supposed to be "get thee to a bordello." The church cannot survive without dramatic change.
10
This is a great time for the Catholic church to change their policies on marriage for priests and nuns.
12
All religions should be recognized as interesting relics of the past.
57
@Brynie
These religions are not just relics, they are meaningful to billions of people today. These billions will not recognize them as relics but as relevant and functional. Even in the USA government, religion is a driving force behind many politicians and their constituents.
If we want them to become interesting relics of the past then we must make education free. Education and data are the greatest liberators.
1
@Brynie, (which is not to claim I have a complete understanding of everything)
The NY Times is to be congratulated and thanked for its excellent coverage of the Catholic Church's sexual scandals in the U.S. and throughout the world now and over the past decades. I sincerely hope this dedicated journalism will continue. At the same time, I would suggest that sexual abuse scandals in other religious denominations, Christian and other, be reported with equal dedication and thoroughness.
31
@Brian Hogan
Brian, The Catholic Church makes big claims for itself- the biggest imaginable. You have to expect scrutiny.
Moreover, at least with regard to the "...sex abuse..." scandal- a term which itself hides the problem to the advantage of the RCC- it appears that some laymen knew all along that there were priests to be avoided.
Simply put, many lay Catholics tolerated clerical rape in the same way that Organized Crime gets tolerated in certain communities.
This is a story, Brian. It is a huge worldwide story- CARDINALS are implicated. A Cardinal is standing trial right now in Australia.
"...Keeping scandal away from the Church..." is not the Media's job.
6
Notice the story is no different than in any other group or organization. When the abuse was discovered, it was the women who were removed not the abusers.
61
@Emcd blaming the victims is a worldwide, ecumenical problem that has infected every society and culture.
3
How is the Catholic Church still possibly in business?
31
@V
Great Question: why do believers accept this? But I guess if Trump can become President, and create support then our nation is certainly filled with a loyalty complex that I don't understand.
11
Yeah! Why do people still send their kids to these guys? Apparently, it was a pedophile's "Dream Job". I cannot fathom how people can justify giving so much mlm money to these people, there are new scandals every day. And why do we give them tax-free status? We're just laying for lawyers' fees, settlements, and the retirement of their pedophile priests to a comfortable home when they get caught too many times.
3
Sexual abuse of children and women, nuns included, by priests is far, far, more rampant than Pope can even think of. The same is present in each and every religion- only the extent varies. More closed the religion and society is, more extensive and intrusive it would become.
16
What did he know, and when? I don’t even care for the response. We don’t need more evidence to see just how insidious and corrupt this institution is.
15
"Pope Acknowledges Nuns Were Sexually Abused by Priests and Bishops"
As a born, raised and educated in the catholic church and schools up to college, I am appalled that so many clergy give so little respect to the vows they take.
These revelations of child abuse and now nun abuse as well as priest running off and getting married leads me to believe that maybe Martin Luther and his Ninety-five Theses of 1517 needs another look.
The celibacy vow is only about a thousand years old and was instituted for the wrong reasons. Francis had better issue an edict that terminates celibacy as a requirement and allows married men to become priests.
19
@RetiredGuy
The Catholic Church from inception was violently misogynist, well before any celibacy mandates. Many popes were married and many sons of popes became popes. All of Jesus' apostles were married.
The celibacy nonsense arose in the 4th century, when male church leaders invented rules to eliminate women as competition for leadership positions in the church and society. i.e. that females were inferior, as was earlier claimed by orthodox Hebrew males. It was the 11th century before priests signed on to that idiocy. Misogyny was a core teaching of the Jews and then Muslims, who emulated the wholly misogynist Greeks before them.
The historic roots are the classic Catch-22. Males in early civilizations and religions let themselves off the hook for their moral and ethical behaviors and instead held females responsible for everyone's virtue, especially the men who chose to be immoral and unethical - blaming their transgression on the influences of the very people in their society who increasingly had no power or control over anything, even their own lives: girls and women. Religion epitomizes that male psychopathy. Early on, the males saw how to use it to their individual and unfettered bro cultures, heightened by their envy that females give life and thus are natural controllers of a family and group. Can't have that, so misogyny and rape became the most effective tools to traumatize and control.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/597662.A_Brief_History_of_Misogyny
4
@RetiredGuy, Pope Francis stated last week that he would not "take that to God." He will not initiate or endorse a ban on celibacy OR endorse a choice to marry. He has also closed the door on women in priesthood, referencing John Paul II's pronouncement against it.
1
There is enough religion in the world to make people hate one another but not enough religion to make people love one other.
20
The Catholic Church is facing many problems and is in a crisis. Many of its polices, practices and doctrines are not fit to the modern world. Priest and nun celibacy, power concentration in priests, unequal treatment of nun and woman, unnecessary importance given to sacraments and rituals, selection and training process for priests and nuns, not giving the faithful due recognition, etc. are major problems. To solve the crisis, the church and its properties and institutions must be brought under the control of the people. The people should have the power to hire and fire bishops, priests and nuns. Obsolete and unnecessary practices should be ended or reformed. Instead of rituals and doctrines, the church has to go back to basic teachings of Jesus, love one another. Pope Francis probably has been trying and may have some ideas to reform, but it appears that he does not have the desire to give up the power structure and priest domination of the church affairs.
6
Even though we continue to allow this immoral church to operate under nonprofit status, the abuse will continue until Catholics everywhere realize that they are supporting an abusive, criminal institution rather than God. This institution no longer abides by anything Jesus taught. Get your morals back people, and choose another church.
16
This has happened all along the history of christianity and of the Church .The aristocracy of the Church was not even submitted to celibacy and had wives and mistresses .
Let's not talk about the crimes of catholic nuns themselves in Ireland for exemple. The investigation of thousands of hidden murders of children "rescued " by the catholic church of Ireland is taking a recent turn with the new discovery of mass graves of young children coming from unwanted pregnancies .
Starved to death or dead from lack of care .
9
@JPH. I am appalled at the Catholic Church but let’s get this straight there are entire countries ruled by theocracies that force women to do many things so that men won’t attack them. I realize that in the current climate one cannot name that religion but we need to condemn those countries and those religions as well.
1
one of the largest criminal organizations in the world, but of course, this same organization has benefitted society for many many years. the secrecy and coverups of criminal and outrageous conduct does not serve the organization very well. the light of day and the Lord would go a long way of helping the Church and it's leaders to repent.
4
I was raised Catholic and no longer "subscribe" to the religion. My parents set me to a Catholic grammar school and nuns were the teachers in the school. The Church has the nuns take a "vow of poverty." In the mean time, priests could and still can own cars, houses, etc. None of this surprises me. What surprises me is that people continue to support this organization. Those supporters and members should watch the film "Spotlight." A fine representation of the corruption of the RCC. The film illustrates how for decades the RCC got away with the crimes the priests perpetrated on small children. And now this abuse of women comes to light.
19
@susan
Spotlight was an excellent film. I in fact have watched it several times. Highly recommend this film.
5
@susan - "Spotlight" is an excellent film, one that everyone should watch. I am a born and raised Catholic, and had a Jesuit priest and a nun in my family. They were kind people, and one of the things I resent about the Church's non-response to all of this is the fact that their inability to rein in the criminals in their midst creates difficulties for the decent people who really want to serve God. My kindly Jesuit relative was a chaplain in Vietnam, and the nun was quite possibly the sweetest lady on the planet. Both are now deceased. They were, to me, what the Church was supposed to be all about: service to others, thoughtful intelligence, and love.
The Catholic churches I attended as a child, with their sermons that sought to make Good Samaritans out of us all, seem so far removed from the Church of today, with its anti-abortion, anti-birth control, and anti-same sex marriage drumbeat. Throw in the fact that crimes are still occurring, and I felt I had no choice but to leave. I go to an Episcopal church now. I guess you could say I no longer "subscribe" to the religion either, and there's a certain amount of sadness there for me about that.
As to priests owning cars, at the last Catholic church I attended one of the priests drove a Mercedes. This was the same guy who told us that we needed to vote for Trump because he was anti-abortion. The Church needs a makeover from the inside out. It's very clear that some people shouldn't be in the clergy or at the pulpit.
12
@susan
"The Keepers" series on Netflix skillfully unfolds the layers and the lengths to which criminal priests go to rape and murder while remaining in power and colluding with other criminal Catholic men in positions of power: law enforcement and politics.
5
Wow, just wow. Not sure why the Catholic dynasty, for that is what it truly is, can continue to look away and protect sexual predators. They are like the holy mafia. We need more reporting on this, more outrage, more arrests. They preach a lot but never adhere to their preaching. They break the law but police themselves to protect the law breakers. We spent Christmas one year at the Vatican. I thought it was so lovely, but now feel deceived. I didn’t know about this then. A lot of the nuns are just young girls. This is an outrage.
23
Wonder when he’ll acknowledge the appalling treatment of women as second class?
28
The Catholic Church, and and many other churches in general, have been committing horrible crimes for centuries either in the name of their god and/or under the protection of church power. It is a rotten system and has been for a very long time now. Why does anyone expect modern churches to be any different?
13
Until the Church rids itself of the demand that only those who can remain celibate may serve as priests— a demand that goes against human nature — it will be plagued by priests who are sexual deviates. Who else would claim they can meet the criteria?
9
@S H
I disagree that no priest could fulfill the criteria of celibacy. However I agree with your view that it would not be the majority. It does not take a rocket scientist to come to that conclusion or does it?
3
It’s happened here too. An Irish nun of my acquaintance was many decades ago “pressured” into a sexual relationship (she wouldn’t call it rape - I would) by an older priest. She’s now in her 80’s. I’ve wondered if #metoo has impacted her. I’m not Catholic but I’ve encountered the victims of celibacy. In my twenties i dated a former would-be priest after his suicide gesture - he was sexually victimized in a monastery. His damage at the hands of predatory priests was incomprehensible to me, a Protestant.
11
@Post motherhood The sad part is it happens in other religions, but you'll never hear about it because victims may have not been believed. At the same time, there is something unique about the way this has happened in the Catholic Church and how it has been covered up by the hierarchy, which is probably not equivalent to any other organization even where abuse has occurred. I'm guessing if any other organization has a problem, the Catholic Church's problem is exponentially worse, exacerbated by the tacit approval of the Pope down to the parish priest.
5
@Post motherhood
" I’ve encountered the victims of celibacy."
To blame these acts on celibacy lets the monster rapists off the hook. Don't let them make victims of themselves for being under the rule of celibacy.
4
The Catholic church operating in the United States is not on sovereign land. They operate within our country and as such they should be obeying the laws of this country.
We need to stop excusing horrible behavior... by spending time and energy debating whether or not women should be ordained or whether priests should be allowed to marry. While those are important issues, in my opinion they are not the crux of the matter.
The larger issue is that an organization operating within our country feels itself so superior that it doesn't need to follow the laws of our land...while taking money from the public and paying no taxes.
This is straight-out criminal behavior. Coverups everywhere you turn. Police not called and records hidden from public view for decades. So many lives ruined.
Prosecute every case....and if the Catholic Church doesn't obey the laws of the land, then the Church's ability to operate here should be shut down.
Prosecute every case of failure to report in a timely manner. Time and time again we have seen that these 'leaders' cannot police themselves. Why should anyone allow them to?
Would this behavior by any other organization be tolerated? I think not.
173
@Leslie
Well said! Thanks for bringing pragmatic clarity to the issue.
7
@Leslie Celibacy rules stemmed not from "purity" or "holiness" but from the Church's desire to keep any property any priest may have right to at the time of his death, as opposed as the wife or children inheriting it. As per the women, there are countless examples of the subservient role they must play, so...
I don't think this would curtail abuses to children or women, though. The predators in a position of power look for a safe place from where to pray upon the innocents.
The only way they could atone is merciless persecution and excommunication to all found guilty opening the way for criminal prosecution. An Internal Inquisition of sorts.
It is not lost in me the irony of priests preaching for abstinence and against abortion while not abstaining, having sex out of wedlock and forcing the women they violated to abort. Trauma on top of trauma. One wonders how is this evil allow to happen in the first place.
5
Until the pope--when he hears of a sexual offense against children or nuns or young seminarians--immediately contacts law enforcement, he will continue to be simply another criminal enabler and protector of sex abusers.
And, just to go a bit further, nuns themselves have been largely overlooked in their own history of being abusers. See the fine films "Philomena" (with Judi Dench) and "The Magdalene Sisters," both of which focus on the near-prison workhouses for unwed mothers and their children, in which hundreds of children died. Anecdotally, my childhood Catholic pals said the nuns at their schools were as touch-happy as the priests and brothers.
16
It's difficult to understand the moral authority the church wields not only for its parishioners but to the larger world in light of its inability to guide its own priests. How, therefore, is this organization situated to counsel others when it has this rot within it?
Perhaps they might start with ending the stricture of celibacy for priests, as they are human after all.
This story of nuns being raped is one that I do not believe the world at large has heard, and when added to accounts of child abuse within its organization, it really is a bit staggering.
Until the church comes to terms with its heritage of abuse, and develops a plan where women are eligible for priesthood, perhaps a boycott would be in order.
5
We need a strong, vibrant and well respected Catholic Church and Vatican in order that their great works of charity, health care, education, athletics and counselling continue with strength. But to get to this goal, the church needs to come to grips with the mandate that its priests need to live a life that is unnatural. Sexual drives are normal, healthy and strong and the mind will see to it that the urge will be achieved, even if it means molesting children or being intimate with nuns. May God bless the church in finding a REAL solution to this problem.
3
It's no secret that nuns (and women in general) are second class citizens in the Roman Catholic Church. Nuns do the toughest, most thankless tasks for the lowest wages and little respect from the male hierarchy. How many American girls aspire to be nuns? As a student I resented the nuns for their discipline; many years later I can see their great love and devotion.
I recently attended a very moving mass said by a woman priest. It was Episcopal (or as Robin Williams said "Catholic Lite".) If enough Catholics are outraged at the church's bigotry against 51% of the world's population, they should vote. With their feet. With their pocketbooks.
18
Keep in mind that sexual abuse has been a secret for so long because it is intended to be kept secret within the Church, and that no one should "give scandal" in the reporting of it. Aside from the abuse detailed in this article, nuns are very often treated as handmaidens to priests. Keep in mind that although nuns take vows, they are not clergy. They are lay people. Of course many sisters have exercised their authority and power especially in the US, but they are still vulnerable.
7
@New reader. The scandal is in the doing of the act not in the reporting of it.
1
There comes a point when you know that your toaster (or your car) is broken beyond repair. Your choice then is very simple:
1. make do without
2. get another one.
The same goes for all religions.
19
As a religious scholar it is gratifying to finally see a Pope who walks in the light. He places himself in danger, speaks out for the voiceless, kisses the diseased, and focuses his efforts on the plight of the poor and spreading peace.
Is he perfect, no, but he has done more for the Catholic church and their movement towards modernization and compassion than anyone in modern history.
As a young person it gives me a lot of hope.
8
@Alynn. Walks in the light?! Are you kidding me? His answer was almost dismissive. I must say I am not impressed.
7
The second take-away in this article (see my earlier comment) is: abortion for nuns. Three words no Catholic could ever imagine seeing together in print. Abortion is forbidden and condemned by the Church. Opposition to abortion by Catholic lawmakers and Congress-members is encouraged by the R.C. hierarchy. Catholics who identify as Conservatives rally to the Republican party's opposition to abortion. But if nuns made pregnant by priests can have abortions, then abortion is permissable for all. Taking a broader vision, the Catholic Church should once again allow priests to marry, like the Russian Orthodox, and as Catholic priests were allowed to do until the Middle Ages. Those of us who were educated from childhood by nuns in Catholic schools recall being warned that the forces of hatred would spread vicious rumors about the Church, but that we should not listen to such satanic mischief. Well, it's not rumor, and it's the pope himself who is admitting and denouncing this.
12
Maybe there is the need for new leadership ? Trump says he is committed to protect the vulnerable or perhaps a woman for next Pope ! It is curious how Roman Catholicism in particular is in such a parallel universe as to global society. A place where looking askance and impunity hold reign in a kingdom where heavenly values would hold.
1
Pull the church's tax exempt status. The church will clean itself up in a New York minute it that happens.
29
For that matter, all churches. But that won’t change this which occurs on other continents.
9
When in the 1960s the Québec government was prosecuting Dr Henry Morgentaler for illegal abortion, one of the witness of the defence was Dr Augustin Roy. He was explaining to the court that as a Catholic he was against abortion, but as a medical doctor it was his responsibility to provide the best services to his patients and those services included abortion. And he explained to the court that he had to provide an abortion to a nun whom was put pregnant by a priest.
13
This comes after how many decades of denial, silence, continued abuse and institutional mismanagement?
9
For God's sake, what do they expect from an absurd policy of celibacy?
Celibacy attracts the wrong kind of person to the priesthood, the man who isn't comfortable with his sexuality and hopes to repress it, and it leaves men without a normal sexual outlet. It is the perfect culture medium for sexual abuse of every kind.
Celibacy is a medieval policy with no theological necessity, as is the sexist exclusion from the priesthood of women who could challenge the boy's club conspiracy of silence.
46
@Josh Hill Frankly you and others here appear to be offering celibacy as an excuse for sexual abuse and rape.
The notion that eliminating the celibacy requirement would largely eliminate sex crimes in the Church is pretty clearly ridiculous. A moment of considering what happens to countless women and kids every day around the world will immediately reveal that.
1
The Catholic Church is a fundamentally sexist institution, and these revelations starkly illustrate the devastating results of an unapologetic patriarchy. How is it that in 2019 we permit one of the most powerful organizations in the world to continue its blatant abuse of and discrimination against women? This anachronistic, oppressive power structure nullifies the Church’s moral authority.
47
The nuns do the heavy lifting in the Catholic Church. Without accolades they nurse the sick, educate the poor and take care of the orphans. So what did Benedict do to the abused nuns? He dissolved their order. I wonder what happened to the priests.
Anyone who rapes women and children should be handed over to the law. Why does this men's club get a pass?
The Catholic Church has far more skeletons than those secretly buried in convent grounds.
65
Priests raping children and women. Not acknowledging parentage and abortions. At what point do these men go to jail for their crimes? The Pope saying the church is on "the path" to working on this is absurd. The path is clear and needs no extended period of "reflection". The hypocrisy of this religion that so many submit too and allow to run their lives is breathtaking.
93
Sexual abuse of children and women, nuns included, by priests is far, far, more rampant than Pope can even think of. The same is present in each and every religion- only the extent varies. More closed the religion and society is, more extensive and intrusive it would become.
26
I think a fundamental problem in the church is that the people in power have lived lives devoted to the church. That is, the church itself, as an institution. Not the mission of the church or the well-being of the flock.
When the first response is always to protect the institution, these things continue to happen
28
Why aren't these abusers in jail? Call the police, not a bishop!
54
@LT Because the church, like most religions, views women as lesser beings....its that simple.
12
Wow! The Vatican tries honesty and transparency as a strategy.
Their many Centuries too late for that.
If this “club leader” is serious, I suggest some pragmatism in the mix might help this “ leap of faith” appear credible.
Men need women. Or women need men. Or men need men. Or women need women. This is our beautiful human nature. To deny this is a destructive neurosis which goes WAY back. It is like denying a setting sun, a rising tide or a flowering plant.
It should have zero bearing on faith, philosophy and spirituality for these are human constructs that must adapt to the Nature—- not the other way around.
The result of that failed belief system is most heart-wrenchingly apparent to all.
25
@Joey Green
Yes. Been reading for a while and finally found acknowledgment that allowing all people to couple, as created and serve as willing, could shine light into very dark hidden church corners around the world!
2
Could we please gather around to help bring more awareness:
Stop calling this issue a "problem" (is the Pope really using this word?)
It is a CRIME = action must be taken if it happens ONCE.
205
At this point the idea that priesthood is reserved for men only is not only false, but most likely the noise dive death of the Catholic church. The church needs radical change, but the boys club can't fathom not having control.
46
It's not just celibacy, folks. It's the exclusion of women from the priesthood that's a central problem.
87
Over the course of time religion is at the root of conflict between people, societal groups and nations. Religion has been used to foster resentment, as a pretext for war, for slavery, for the furtherance of illiteracy and on and on. It uses 'Gods grace' to justify all manner if ill behavior. The past several decades have exposed the Catholic church in a very harsh and condeming light and yet they continue on with their 'work'. I don't get it. Why is the dogma so strong as to keep so much of their flock? If the Catholic church were a public corporation they would have been broken up, disbanded, bankrupted and their heirarchy imprisoned. Absolution and forgiveness would not be allowed or tolerated by the public, the press or the courts.
But, they are messengers of a just and merciful God. What kind of god can this God be?
33
Over 30 years ago I left the Catholic Church. There were many reasons but in the end the root cause was the absent representation of women in leadership. It lacks equilibrium and balance. We will continue to see the Church’s decline and these sickening crimes unless the Church wakes up and appoints women to positions as Priests, Bishops, Cardinals and yes, Pope.
41
The Church's obsession with any and all things sexual are at the core of its problems. Sexuality is not a flaw nor a failing. Get over it. Drop celibacy, ordain women or close shop.
78
@Thomas
Neither the Vatican nor any religion will eliminate the circular prison of misogyny.
Its very premise is that females inherently have too much power as both life givers and human beings who enjoy sex. Men everywhere feared then as now females having any control of a group or society, displacing males. Thus, males have gone to ridiculous lengths to invent rules and laws to insist females are inferior for childbearing, and for enticing men into sex.
That's the double whammy wherein males can then claim sex is evil and wicked, as are females, apart from breeding duties that produce more offspring, soldier sons and breeding daughters.
5
As Gomer Pyle would say: SURPRISE ! SURPRISE !
Not really. The surprise is this pope is finally opening the lid to a lot of past injustices and criminal behavior of the lower level personnel and subsequent cover ups by those in charge.
As a Jew I think this is why Pope Benedict, the previous Pope quit. He saw the mess that was going to hit the fan and thought this is not what I signed up for. I don't want to mess up my red shoes.
I have a few Catholic friends who I love and respect but we don't discuss this. Their faith in the goodness of the religion has helped them get through sickness and other problems. Some of us are approaching 70 so the misdeeds of wayward priests while horrific is outweighed by the comfort that faith in a religion can bring.
I don't always believe since religion was never a big part of my upbringing but I have witnessed a few miracles or unexplained things in my lifetime. Maybe after such a long period of sweeping these matters under the rug the Church is opening up and will finally cleanse itself.
Other religions should take notice and do the same.
31
EVEN bishops? The inference that abuse by bishops is surprising is naive. When do abusers stop? Why should promotion change the way a person thinks or stop them from persisting in abuse? The investigations in Philadelphia and Boston showed that cardinals had been involved in abuse. Your current White House resident has even been recorded making remarks about abusing women. We cannot assume for one second that giving a person a title and reward is going to stop them behaving appallingly badly towards women and children.
The current pope has only acknowledged serial child abuse all over the world by his priests so recently as to be risible. He has called a meeting of his bishops this months to discuss it. Those same bishops, possibly some of whom are abusers themselves, have spent decades moving paedophile priests from parish to parish, moving on to abuse in pastures new under his protection. This has destroyed the lives of countless thousands in my country. It has certainly done the same in many, many other countries.
So far Frances has not effected any changes to protect any child or adult from the ravages of his priests, his employees. I despair.
51
This is not about celibacy.
This is not about female priests.
This is not about birth control or abortion.
This is about unquestioned power. Catholic priests, bishops and popes are formed in a culture that deems them infallible.
In this way, priests are not much different than any of the other prominent men all over the world who abused women without power. But the Catholic Church has made a special art of this.
Francis has to choose between truth and hierarchy. My bet is that he’ll choose the latter.
265
@Cousy Yes, it is unchecked power buttressed by secret laws that insist that the bigger problem is "scandal" rather than the abuse itself. The other issue is the strong network among the clergy and hierarchy which literally allows and promotes the movement of rapists and pedophiles across parishes, dioceses, archdioceses, countries, and continents. Without a thought for the safety for the victims. Few other organizations, if any, could match the coordination and corruption that has occurred in the hiding of predators.
21
@Cousy
The Power of being “set apart” - as if more godly, “chosen” and therefore more righteous.
Clericalism is itself an evil.
5
My heart goes out to the nuns who must have felt such a sense of powerlessness and abandonment. "Continuing problem and that the Vatican was working on the issue." What does working on the issue look like?" What changes will its supplicants see? The fox has been guarding the hen house for far too long. Parishioners must be speak out, boycott, deny funds, become a power. They must not abandon these children and nuns as the church has. If they do, they are no better than the perpetrators. I am sickened to read of this world power that speaks in the name of Jesus and acts in the name of Judas.
181
@Janet
No more dollars in the collection plate. Not. A. Penny. That's the only thing that will work.
26
@Ellen
Anyone who contributes even one penny to the collection basket is silently approving of and supporting the abuses, and there is absolutely not one other way of interpreting that. Period.
4
What has become of the Catholic Church? I grew up in a strict catholic family and either the church has changed dramatically changed or I was very naive, Maybe it's a little of both, but this is intolerable. I admit that I'm not a practicing catholic any longer, but if the vow of chastity doesn't mean anything any longer then abolish it. The idea of abortions involving nuns is mind boggling. If the Cardinals and Pope were aware of these crimes then they should all resign or be defrocked. The Church may never recover from what has been uncovered these past couple of years and rightfully so.
55
@VMG We were all naive. This isn't new.
9
@New reader
I find that very sad.
1
I've heard these rumors for many years.
The church's sexual abuse problem is obviously not limited to closeted homosexuals, as so many American and Italian conservatives had previously attempted to argue.
Celibacy is unnatural for the vast majority of non-elderly human beings (and unnatural even for some of the elderly) - and it is the Catholic Church's obsession with it that leads it to attract the wrong sort of people.
And this isn't just a men's problem. The physical and psychological abuse imposed by Irish nuns in the Magdalene Laundries demonstrate that the real problem is the Church's unnatural, toxic ideology with regard to human sexuality.
Martin Luther made his share of mistakes, but he figured this one out over 500 years ago. The world is still waiting for the old men of Rome to come to the same realization. What are they waiting for or afraid of?
98
I think if the Catholic Church did away with the celibacy requirement for their religious members (brothers, priests, and nuns) there would be less obsession with sex and it would take its normal and healthy place in everyone’s life.
4
It seems as if we have been reading about the problem of sexual abuse in the church for decades. It isn't a stretch though to believe that it has been going on for centuries. Clearly the solutions being put forward by men to stop criminal behavior by men in an organization run by men isn't working.
86
There is so much good that comes from local support, shelters, food banks, clothing, sanctuary, etc. It's a shame the parent org feels the imperative to cover up centuries of abuse. They've been supported by tax sheltered 501c status allowing them a huge market advantage on real estate, earnings, and payroll. I suggest they lose their 501c as a penalty. Allow the local food bank and shelter to remain tax free but get restitution from the church. It may not be such a lucrative, well paid business if they have to pay their share.
37
The Catholic Church is one of those western institutions that we are all brought up to respect, admire, and revere, when in reality it couldn't be more sordid and immoral. It is no different than Greek organizations on college campuses that portray a veneer of sophistication while numerous reports of sexual assault of women go on behind closed doors.
The ultimate irony is that these same priests who sexually abused women and children are constantly preaching about forgiving your enemies who have wronged you, to "turn the other cheek." No only do they commit abuse, they guilt trip and gaslight their victims into forgiving them.
104
Given the vows of Nuns any sexual involvement with a nun, even if there could be a claim of consensually, is rape.
Rape is a crime, one of the worst crimes, no matter who commits it and if the church knows of such cases it has an instant responsibility to report those accused the crime.
That this happens in the Catholic clergy is not a surprise. It is universal. What makes it different in the Catholic Church is the hypocritical notion that theology can change human biological, sexual conduct, impulses driven by the nature of us all.
The fear and loathing of human sexuality commanded by the church is both unnatural and an inevitable cause of perversions by its clerics.
69
@Carl Zeitz " Given the vows of Nuns any sexual involvement with a nun, even if there could be a claim of consensually, is rape".
Does this apply to Daniel Berrigan and Elizabeth McAlister? He a priest and she a nun. They did eventually get married.
1
How many more sins will be committed and lies will be told before the Church acknowledges that its celibacy dogma is ill-conceived and damaging to everyone involved.
65
This seems so obvious. Why the reluctance to accept it?
12
@Skutch
Because it has been a core tenet of their practice for 1500-1000-ish years and established canon law. The Church has a tough time changing their internal laws due to politics.
The Eastern Catholic Churches, which are in full communion with Rome, allow priests to marry, interestingly enough.
8
I am sick to my stomach at the thought that I have called myself a Catholic. The actions of the clergy are a betrayal on so many levels.
81
Is the church based on lies? Or faith?
Who said it takes two to tango?
Who is surprised?
What difference does it make?
Is this pope trying to be honest?
Is he safe?
Why does he eat in the cafeteria?
How far will he go?
Will he survive the Vatican?
Beyond questions about the unknown, why do we need religion?
Does God exist? Do we need proof?
Is there a single religion free of sexual abuse?
Why are religion and philosophy taught in the same building on the campus at Chicago?
Do you believe in evolution?
Who is Charles Darwin? Did he believe in God?
Are we wiping out life on planet Earth?
How?
9
The Catholic Church should pay reparations for the women it has enslaved since the dawn of its religion.
38
@Sarah It should also be devoting its trillion-dollar portfolio (including an estimated $15 billion worth of artwork in the Vatican alone) to caring for the poor and the sick, as Jesus directed, rather than living in palaces staffed by servants. (Francis moved to smaller digs, but most of the crew did not.)
When clergy do something good, the Church takes the credit. When they do something bad, the Church blames the individual and paints itself as above human wrongdoing. This will be no different. Power and money.
30
This is abuse of power and trust at its worst. Also, I simply don’t understand the logic that this “problem” arises from forcing priests to be celibate. Rape is rape. I thought that we had somewhat stopped trying to justify it based on the state of mind of the rapist. Also, suppose a priest is married, and his wife is unable to cater to him as much as he would like - then would it be ok if he raped women and kids? That’s how absurd is the argument that celibacy is the root of this problem. The root of this problem is abuse of power by narcissistic men. Hmm. Now where have we seen that before?
73
Why was the order of nuns in France dissolved when their "slavery" was discovered? Seems it would have made more sense to dissolve (and hold to account) the priestly order who were the source of the problem.
Another case of women being punished or made to compensate for their male abusers' bad behavior.
241
Pope Francis and the Catholic Church must accept human nature (it was not created by God?) and permit priests to marry to avoid this gigantic wave of proofs of the inefficacy of struggling with it.
14
@Guedalia Naveh
Rape is a crime of domination not sexual release.
Of course priests/nuns anyone joining any religious organisation should marry.
Rape has nothing to do with that.
10
@Geraldine Bird - Agreed - sex between consenting adults, regardless of man made rules to prevent it will occur, and is a force of nature - people will find a way. Predatory and non consensual sex is rape and a crime anywhere it occurs. Confession to a fellow priest and penance doesn't make it better. Its time for the church to come clean and deal with these issues so that every time a priest opens his mouth he's not viewed as a representative of an organization that is rotten to the core and his words viewed with suspicion.
5
The women religious orders in the U.S. have been ,to a certain point, autonomous of the clergy. Many women religious orders here own property in the order's name which gives them independence of the priests. All transfers were made by the Mother Superior not the Bishop. If anything, over the years, I saw a real dislike for priests.
14
"Some priests, he said, have been suspended."
Am I wrong in thinking that the priest's behavior was criminal? An I wrong believing that sheltering a criminal from the law is also criminal.
If I am right the priests, bishops and others should be in jail.
145
@irdac
You are correct on all 3 counts.
14
This Pope who is trying like St. Francis to rebuild a fallen church on the teachings of Jesus Christ is fighting against a bureaucracy who also tried to undermine Pope John last century.
It is clear that reaching out to other religions and ideologies is the first step to "Blessed are the peacemakers." But there are those who, like the militaries of the world, are deeply invested in retaining power. And we know the results of absolute power.
Corruption has run deep, but it shouldn't be heaped on Pope Francis. That is a ploy to replace him with someone who will affirm the divisions among us as in the old days. This is a new day of respect for ourselves as we cleanse the temple and learn to love our neighbor as ourselves as Jesus did.
29
“Don’t report to bishop or priest as the first step to deal with the situation,”
I have stated several times, through several types of stories, that there is one truth and constant: predators protect predators. They have to. Self preservation. Keeping the pry vulnerable and the hunting grounds safe - for themselves.
Predators must be called out for what they are. Remove their camouflage and expose them. Don't expect the predators to police themselves.
"nuns having abortions or giving birth to the children of priests."
Remember the sanctimonious hypocrites every time they preach on the value of life. Every time those using religion want to impose their values on others where do as I say, not as I do is the 11th commandment.
"Turned to nuns for sex during the spread of AIDS."
Turned to. In other words they believed the nuns to be safe rather than their usual sources of sex. The same people. The same church that condemns others for sex and the results from it.
I am happy to hear the Pope recognize the problem publicly but the church needs to do more. And it must stop inserting itself into the laws of the land. Especially as it has set a different standard for itself.
39
The priests, bishops and the popes that have led them are doing more than any atheist wishing to disrupt or encorage people to leave the church could ever do.
31
I am happy that Pope Francis is bring abuse facts into the open and I suspect that the latest about Nuns being abused is only the tip of the iceberg. As a Catholic I always saw the Nuns as running the schools, teaching and preparing the Churches for masses and even conducting and assisting in performing mass. Priests were seen as aloof individuals and we now now they had serious dysfunction and even criminal individuals among their ranks. Pope Francis is obviously going public because someone else would get there first or he is coming clean about the mountains of information on abusive practices from all corners of his Church.
15
In these last three years under Trump I have been given the gift of being free to be extremely cynical and critical of my faith, a relative of Catholicism, mainline Protestant (Presbyterian USA). I have sought out those near and far who join me in this e.g. journalism's own Peter Wehner, Michael Gerson and the lesser known Ruth Graham of Slate, longtime left wing pastors, Tony Campolo and Jim Wallis, and of course friends, family and fellow progressive Christians. We find in the words and actions of Jesus and in the overarching history of our faith tradition so much of value that we continue in its path and under its banner as iconoclasts. Even if it is just one nun who has had an abortion it should give all Christians pause to examine the hypocrisy rife in the system.
19
Transparency.
Financial and administrative transparency.
This alone should be the request of the church.
12
The Catholic church needs to acknowledge - and act on - the distinction between crime and sin. What we are seeing is crime on the part of priests and bishops against children, seminarians and nuns. Too often, the response of the church is to ask forgiveness and to speak of healing. Forgiveness and healing belong to the realm of sin. What is needed is investigation, arrest, trial and imprisonment - the domain of crime and civil justice. In the Middle Ages and after, were "heretics" treated with mercy and forgiveness by the church? I think not. They were burned at the stake. Mercy and forgiveness have their place but so do civil law and justice. Why not have forgiveness prayer sessions in prisons where bishops and priests are serving time. I say this as a Catholic-educated former member of a religious order.
P.S.; the Catholic church may be the worst offender, but not the only one. I would like the NYT to investigate similar crimes within other religious groups in the U.S. Does one well-known Christian institution still require nude swimming in its gyms, with spectator balconies, as in the 1950s-60s?
40
Women and children are the primary victims of priests in the church. Nuns having abortions because they are trapped and traumatized. The Catholic church needs to step up and acknowledge their crimes, but further they need to acknowledge the crimes of the church in its antiquated view of sexuality and birth control. The church continues to preach against modern contraception and abortion and still only provides for natural family planning, which is essentially no family planning at all. Millions of poor catholic women have been harmed by the churches failure to modernize. The overpopulation of Catholic countries around the globe is a sin against humanity. It is immoral. The world has more than 7 billion souls, the Catholic Church needs to change its position, thereby granting women rights over their own bodies. It is far past time.
317
@Emily According to this article even priests raped nuns, who have eschewed sex in favor of God. Your statement is ridiculous, sex is part of human nature, like hunger, and the sooner the church acknowledges and addresses it, the better.
3
@EmilyApparently you've never heard of men forcing women to have sex...
3
The morally bankrupt Catholic Church wants you to follow its strict religious rules while it runs a bordello and sponsors an international pederasty festival.
“Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.”
— Steven Weinberg
292
@Socrates
This intolerance isn't helping.
7
@Socrates
If it was a not a church but say some international sports league abusing women and young boys and girls, it would have been dismantled years ago and it's "pope" put in prison.
How can the world tolerate this criminal organisation !
25
@Cousy
"This intolerance isn't helping."
So you'd prefer us to tolerate the rape of children and nuns?
To each his own. But my reaction would be to lock up these criminals, expose and bring down this disgusting institution, sell off their billions in art and treasure and use the money to educate a gullible populace to the reality of religion.
26
If nuns and priests were allowed to wed, a lot of these sex related problems would go away. The vows of celibacy have long since outlived their usefulness if indeed they ever had any.
135
This is “sexual abuse by priests” against women and children. These are criminal acts and should be treated as such.
Whether a vow of celibacy should be there in the 1st place is a separate discussion. Let’s try not to conflate these two.
Being celibate, or accepting celibacy as part of a priesthood, does not give a person the right to sexually abuse another person—man, woman or child.
216
Being married didn’t stop Jerry Sandusky from abusing little boys...
92
@Sohrab Batmanglidj
"The vows of celibacy have long since outlived their usefulness i" - untrue, it helps to preserve church's riches, no heirs no widows...
22
Right, this from the Pope who gave a benediction for Cardinal Law...
46
We no longer try to figure out why Catholic church pews get emptier.
172
It’s time for the Catholic Church to get rid of the tradition of celibacy for priests, which was only introduced in the 12th century anyway.
116