More guns = more gun deaths.
Less guns = less gun deaths.
No guns = no gun deaths.
It's simple, unassailable logic. And, it's borne out by the many other countries in which there are very few guns -- and, as a result, very few gun deaths.
7
"Raising the minimum age to purchase a firearm to 21 and extending the waiting period to three days" is considered "the most aggressive action on gun control taken in the state in decades".
That definition of "aggressive action" is as alarming and frightening as what occurred in that SunTrust Bank.
Why do so many of these allegedly murdering heartless creatures look like characters out of a Stephen King novel? Every one of them resembles a heinous monster.
4
I think its about time a Democratic president is elected and declares a National Emergency to once and for all deal with this gun crisis.
4
How does this young man get to walk out of this alive? Young men suspected of far less, guilty of far less or anything at all, have been gunned down by law enforcement for little more than having brown skin, unlike this self-proclaimed murderer. I don't wish death on this 21-year-old at all, but the notion of how differently this would have gone if he looked different -- if he looked like me -- makes this all the more devastating, the fact that he is still breathing.
Toxic masculinity and white male privilege win again. And as those who feel entitled to wield that type of masculinity as a weapon or cower behind that privilege as a shield - many and more of us, of every stripe, will suffer. We all (of every stripe) deserve better.
Praying for the families.
5
The majority of people with mental health issues will never harm anyone and in fact are usually the victims of violence. So it is unfair to label them as The source of this violence. The majority of people who commit these crimes have social issues and would easily pass most psychological tests. I call it the Ted Bundy syndrome where they can keep it together long enough to appear normal while seething with rage against humanity. Maybe there needs to be a reevaluation of these tests that are suppose to red flag these people.
2
It does not matter why he did it.
What matters is how he did it.
5
Five people...and no huge outcry, call for action, or collective outrage. Simply business as usual. Hundreds of thousands of lives are currently in turmoil over a manufactured crisis, while the real threats of climate change and gun violence are being ignored.
4
Again it is a sad day for innocent victims of gun violence and their families, and their friends and for all of us who feel pain when guns are used to kill humans. And yet reasonable gun controls seem to be off the table for yet another term of Republican leadership in Florida. We will not stop fighting this scourge until we can again live in peace and safety without these kinds of threats wherever we go. Schools, churches, banks, movie theaters, workplaces, nightclubs. All these and so many more places where nobody needs to have a gun. Keep them for hunting. Have one in your home (safely stored so that children or unstable persons cannot access them) but get them off our streets. And get rid of high capacity and semi automatic weapons that have no place in a modern society other than the military. What will it take to change this culture?
1
Rhode Island has a gun death rate of 4 per 100,000.
That includes suicide,most of the total.
We had a death rate from opioid overdose of 27 per 100,000.
Yet our governor,who took money from Purdue Drugs,identifies"gun violence" as our most pressing issue.
We are 49th among states.
The day in,day out means of death outweigh guns,but lack the dramatic impact.
I spent 25 years in ground level law enforcement and seized a lot of firearms,none from legitimate owners.
Yet another incident of people going about their business, living their lives, only to have them ended in a murderous rampage by a deranged individual.
Until the country has the political will to actively take steps to regulate gun ownership, the average citizen has to have an action plan on what s/he can do when faced with an active shooter situation. Because it can happen to anyone, anytime and anywhere.
The initial news reports on this latest tragedy in Florida was that Xaver ordered everyone in the bank to lie down and then he methodically walked up and down assassinating the five victims. This is exactly what happened at Virginia Tech in 2007. Students sat in their chairs waiting for Cho to walk up to them to kill them, doing nothing even as he was pausing to re-load his handguns.
My son entered Virginia Tech the following year. My advice to him was if he was faced with a similar situation and could not escape to safety, he should attack the shooter, throw a chair at him, hit him with the nearest object, claw his eyes out - anything. What is the alternative?
People are going to have to come to grips with the reality that they must fight in these situations like their lives depended on it, because they do. If you can escape safely, great, but if you cannot you have two choices.
For me, I would rather die trying to stop the threat than meekly lying down and waiting for death.
31
@Len I've been facedown on the floor, in a popular women's boutique, with a gun pointed at my head. When the armed robber (a well-dressed white man) walked into the store, ordering us facedown on the floor - "If you turn your head, I'll pop you one" - I spent about a second wondering if I could make it to the other exit. I fast realized that my best option was to do what he said, lest I get shot in the back as I try to escape.
See, this is what so many people don't understand, unless they've had a gun pointed directly at them. What are the odds that the gunman won't pull the trigger if I try to defend myself - whether it's reaching for my own firearm or throwing something at him? In my situation, I felt that the odds were definitely not in my favor. As a result, the only thing I lost was my wallet, not my life.
14
@Len
What "regulations" woukd you suggest? The shooter was a former corrections officer, passed his background check, and purchased the firearm legally. Once again, the non-existent government mental health system, not the gun, was at fault. According to a woman claiming to be his ex-girlfriend states he was thrown out of school after saying he woukd shoot it up. And nothing was done.
The national news media and social media companies need to stop publicizing the names and photographs of the perpetrators in these incidents. Modern social-media-fueled youth culture is fixated on fame, which has bred a subculture of angry loners who feel compelled to do something sensational to show everyone that their lives have value.
Gun control measures are limited in their ability to stop these incidents because too many guns are already in circulation and there's no realistic way to track them all down or to positively identify every potential mass shooter before the fact. Addressing this problem with gun control would take years if not decades. On the other hand, an agreement to stop publishing names and photographs could be enacted immediately at little cost.
14
@C Walton. You're likely correct about publishing names and faces of the offenders who are seeking fame. Would have to disagree in regard to your comment of the limits of 'gun control measures" because we have to start somewhere and sometime. The sooner, the better since every journey starts with a single step.
9
@C Walton regulation of ammunition can address the large #s of guns already in circulation. Ammunition is only good for a few years - perhaps 2 or 3
3
As American as apple pie, our well regulated sacred militia at work, the founding fathers especially Madison turning over in their graves.
This is the direct opposite of what they wanted when they passed the 2nd amendment.
160
@Paul It was written by Madison to get the necessary southern colonies to ratify the Constitution. The militias were meant to be the slave militias which the southern colonies used to put down slave revolts. Scalia's majority opinion in the D.C vs. Heller decision was a colossal misinterpretation of Madison's intent.
27
It needs to be repealed.
11
@Paul Correct. They (the fathers) would want EVERY bank customer there to carry a weapon, and to organize a meaningful defense to the shooter killing him in the instant. That is the only way with mentally deranged at that stage of the game (when they are bent on shooting up places).
White male walks into a church in Texas kills worshipers, white male in Las Vegas- Madalay Bay opens fire on concertgoers, white male opens fire in Movie theater in Aurora Colorado, white male opens fire on children in Sandy Hook elementary, white male opens fire at parkland high school, white male opens fire on Rep. Gabby Gifford killing 18.....etc should I go on? If it was a black male or a Muslim then it’s an act of terrorism. Nothing scares me more than a white male with a gun.
Remember: don’t let them take your guns because you are a responsible gun owners
25
It's unbelievable how the media and law enforcement keep going on about trying to figure out a motive. Stop acting like this is some rarity. He's just a murderer with no respect for human life so stop the attempt at mental health excuses.
If he was black he would have been called multiple names with comments about drugs, gangs and bad parenting. Then there would be posts online justifying discrimination. In the meantime they need to keep a closer eye on criminals who look like this guy instead of the black guy getting a cup of coffee or working out at the gym.
23
The only aspect of gun control we should ever entertain is the removal of millions of guns from private ownership and severe limits on gun sales.
12
This is just too insane and it needs to stop. There are just too many people out there with mental problems that can lay hands on mortal weapons.
It is my personal feeling that everyone, EVERYONE connected with the National Rifle Association is coupable in the killings of the innocent lives that are being taken.
15
I want to know how a guy like that could have a girlfriend. But seriously it’s kind of scary to think there are warped minds all around us that would countenance and then act on killing innocent people in cold blood. I suspect there are a lot of fragile minds out there that snap under the pressure of a daily onslaught of nihilistic messages being sent from right-wing media and the darker corners of the internet. This case may seem isolated at the surface, but it’s part of a disturbing pattern that’s obliterated any notion of a civilized society.
2
How do you sensibly kill five people in a bank? Did the author mean that we don't understand the shooter's motivations? There would be no sensible or valid reason to murder a group of strangers.
5
This should be a serious day of self reflection and reckoning for Florida and its lack of sensible gun control. This state has the highest rate of recent mass shootings. Time for Floridians to call out the NRA and their mouthpiece in the state, Marion Hammer, for the human toll of lax gun laws.
12
Common sense gun laws are long overdue!
Going to school, the bank or movie theatre must not be a life threatening event.
Vote for life, not the NRA, and their devious Russian propaganda public relations lobby.
14
I just read about this over on the FoxNews site. Apparently, the answer to it is: more guns.
4
He's a terrorist, plain and simple. Walls don't stop his type. Imprisonment or execution only stops one single individual. It's time to have federally funded mental health clinics right next door to every single US Post Office in our country. We're the greatest nation on earth, we can do it. Restore the corporate tax rates of the 1960's.
4
5 people killed in another act of gun violence, and it's not even the headline. The new normal?
6
And the Supreme Court just decided to take up a case where the City of New York is being sued by some NRA-sponsored gun nuts. The issue is that New York licenses guns for home defense — that is, guns that remain in the home — and these guys want to be able carry those same guns around. Their case was shot down by lower courts, and now the Supremes are taking it up.
How long until one of these guys decides he should step into some situation where the police are needed and bullets start flying? What about the safety and security of MY family?
We can be sure the SCOTUS will do the right thing — the far right thing, that is.
6
@Philip S. Wenz Mr. Wenz, the problem with guns is not the law abiding citizens and their guns. The problem is the criminals using their guns, which they hold illegally, for criminal purposes. You want more laws? It's already illegal to use guns for crimes.
2
@Ernest Montague
"Criminals" are law abiding citizens until they commit a crime.
To accept the current situation as fine is beyond sick.
19
This is a uniquely American pathology--allowing unstable people, allowing losers, to have guns. We can't identify all of the unstable people and all the losers, and we don't want to try given that most of them will never commit acts of violence. In fact, they are more likely to be victims of violence than perpetrators. No, it's only by restricting the sale of guns that we will bring about the end of this senseless bloodshed.
The NRA's hands are dripping with the blood of so many thousands of Americans.
22
Dear New York Times:
I would very much like to know how this person came to own the gun or guns used in this crime.
I think even more Americans would support intelligent gun-control laws if there was more information about how guns flow through our society, if we understood how the gun cartels operate.
Every law-abiding gun owner is a law-abiding gun owner - until he's not.
12
@DaveInNewYork
Gun cartels? You mean the NRA,right? Read the story in WAPO today about the guy who bought guns in Virginia and sold them in D.C. His cousin was killed with one of the guns he sold. There is your "cartel".
9
@DaveInNewYork . . Far more people are killed every year by cars driven by idiots than with guns used by idiots. Should we perhaps tighten up laws there first?
1
@Ernest Montague - false equivalence. Cars are used much more frequently by more people than guns. Besides cars are designed to save lives. If someone days is not a direct result of the design which with guns is to kill.
We have lots of driving laws. We are willing to entertain more. We have lots of safety built into cars. We legislate more.
But try to get just one more rule or regulation concerning guns and you's swear it was the end of our country. If there was a fraction of the effort apploed to guns and gun ownership as applied to cars and highways we would be safer.
11
People are offended by a wall because it makes no sense. But background checks for people who ALREADY have guns is fine by them. Go figure.
@btb - How about if we restrict the background checks to just those who own guns AND a MAGA cap ?
9
@RationalThinker9
Why not, who needs rational laws when feelings will suffice?
Sadly, just another day in America. sigh
6
I'd like to see us get rid of the Second Amendment. Period.
10
If we had a wall this wouldn’t have happened. Right?
9
I would like to see the NYT story updated to include the facts that this is a white, native-born American man.
14
another big win for the NRA in florida. if not a corrections officer, xavier could perhaps have become a school security guard.
13
Not the first thing in my newsfeed, or the second, or the third...you get it. What made America Great was the illusion that individual human life had some meaning. Ha! My “thoughts and prayers” have devolved to this: “Please don’t be undocumented. Please don’t be undocumented. Please don’t be undocumented. And Please Please Please Don’t be a Jew.” We are doomed and you know it.
2
Once again, yet another senseless crime committed by someone who is NOT AN ILLEGAL ALIEN.
News outlets should place that statement on so many reports . . . .
12
The National Republican Army keeps insisting that a Good Guy With a Gun™ will miraculously appear to prevent these calamities.
Well, Dana? Where was he?
8
What will it take till Florida learns the lesson
You would think that with all the mass murders in Florida, the people of Florida would be demanding gun control, if nothing else for their own safety, and the safety of their loved ones, but obviously that's not the case. I live in New York City, where there are 9 million people living in close quarters we have strict gun control here, guess what, there hasn't been a mass murder yet, while every week it seems there is another mass murder, or some tragic shooting in the State of Florida which has lax gun control. In any other nation on earth the results of gun control in NYC would be a perfect example how gun control keep its citizens safe, while easy access to guns leads to one massacre after another, but in America 2019 people only see what they want to see from their own political point of view. The new Governor of Florida, who got elected because he promised not to change the gun laws, better get ready to stand in front of a many podium, on many days like this. Remember, Governor...thoughts and prayers, thoughts and prayers.
6
More thoughts and prayers for more victims as more "law abiding" people are granted more lethal rights. The governor said this killer will receive "swift and exacting" justice; a big help now.
6
And that state just elected a U.S. Senator and a Governor who are opposed to controlling access to unnecessary weapons. Go figure!
4
Another mass shooting, another tragedy with lives taken and loved ones left bereaved.
But this story needs to include more information. What kind of firearm was used? How and where did the shooter acquire it? Did he pass a background check?
Without filling in these details, the media coverage of mass shootings merely sensationalize the killings, and do not provide us enough information to begin finding solutions to them.
4
@scb919f7
Do you realize that the NRA puppets in congress has refused to allow the ATF from keeping electronic computerized records of gun sales? They are kept the old way, paper records in filing cabinets. They also banned the CDC from tracking gun shootings.
6
It is with a badly broken heart that I ask this question:
WHY?
WHY?
WHY?
WHY?
WHY?
Profound condolences to the loved ones and friends of those five innocent souls.
6
Legal change: the political power and propaganda of the gun rights lobby must be overcome and the Constitution amended to repeal or modify the 2nd Amendment (nullify the "right to bear arms" found by the Court in the Heller case). It appears unlikely that this Court is going to overturn or sufficiently reverse Heller.
Political change: we must collective acknowledge a violent history in forever wars, repudiate advocates of a militaristic foreign policy and promote peace and justice at home and abroad. Put savings into education and universal health care, including mental health.
Social change: it takes a village.
18
My condolences to the families of the five victims.
I am sure a mental illness defense is being prepared for the killer as I type but I don't think he is mentally ill. A desire to kill and lack of remorse for doing so seems the norm for a growing group of people. We are lucky that law enforcement has foiled some of these planned attacks such as the "upscale massacre" in Toledo and the attack on "the Muslim community." This may not be sufficient and I do not know where we go from here.
Why was the killer allowed to wear violent-themed attire in his booking photo?
3
@Lynn in DC
Why in the world would you say this person is not mentally ill. Do you have some info the rest of us don't. I am not saying he is mentally ill. Only that we do not know that answer right now.
1
@Lynn in DC - That is a very good question.
Sorrow for the families of the victims. This perpetrator looks pretty sick...with anger. Where is it all coming from?
1
@MJB- What is the motive? Where did he go off the rails? I like hearing from mental health professionals. Even they can't tell when a person is going to be violent, or whether their mental illness requires permanent commitment to a mental institution.
1
Crazy man. How did he not get discovered? However, Guns access is a big problem. Interesting to see how he was able to get guns.
1
He was a "law-abiding citizen" right up to the time he . . . wasn't.
6
WHEN will our RIGHT to LIFE and not be shot in public be secured? Why do we have to live in fear. You have better odds of being shot to death than winning the lottery in America.
21
Too bad so many people are not as concerned about our home grown acts of aggression as they are about the possibility of an illegal immigrant committing crimes, which data show is a lower rate per capita than US citizens. If they really want to do profiling, they may be focusing on the wrong groups of people.
23
@Thera
The data on violent crimes committed by illegal aliens is falsely depressed by the fact that many of their crimes are not solved because illegal aliens do not cooperate with authorities. Crime rates are higher in illegal alien communities.
Every illegal alien who snuck over the border is guilty of a crime. A misdemeanor for the first offense and a felony if repeated after having been previously caught. Therefore, over half of illegal aliens are criminals, in addition to any tax evasion or identity theft crimes.
The less than half of illegal aliens who entered legally but overstayed their visas are guilty of a civil offense and have not necessarily committed a crime. A substantial proportion of those individuals, however, have engaged in criminal identity theft and tax evasion by working off the books and not filing income tax returns.
More than half of illegal aliens are criminals. That is higher than the rate of criminal activity on the part of citizens.
Facts matter.
1
@ebmem
How about the fact that their employers were committing criminal acts by hiring them, paying under the table, and not paying employment or withholding taxes? But to you that doesn't count?
Guns (which are expressly intended to maim and kill) need to be regulated, not as much as cars (which are expressly designed to transport), but much, much moreso than cars.
We are a perverted nation. We have dozens on rules on how to maintain a car, who can own a car, who can drive a car, under what conditions that car can be operated, and so on. And yet, little to no regulation over GUNS?
Also, in instances where a minor (and typically a toddler or young kid) gets a hold of a loaded weapon and then kills him or herself or another person nearby.... we need to stop referring to those as 'accidents'. And the gun-owning adults who left a Loaded Weapon out in the open need to be brought up on manslaughter/murder and child abuse/negligence charges.
We need to dismantle the NRA. They are pure evil.
30
@Lisa
We can't dismantle the NRA but all the people who support common sense gun laws must speak up and lend support where we can. In other words we can't dismantle the NRA but we can expose this evil organization for what it is.
5
@Lisa
The right to own or drive a car is not a constitutional right, first distinction.
If one wants to drive a car exclusively on private roads, one is not required to have insurance. If one wants the privilege of driving on public roads, the state requires that one carry liability insurance against the probability that the owner of a car will be financially responsible for injury to others or to their property.
If insurers were involved, they would want policy holders to be trained and to secure their weapons when not in use. Why did NYS an insurance for gun owners?
Our Republican leadership is so concerned about the scourge of drugs coming over the walls of our Southern boarder (when most come through open doors and gates), and about Muslim terrorists.
Where is the outcry against the domestic terror of gun violence? Where is the protection of our Constitutional right to life?
28
@Concerned Citizen
Most of the drugs that are identified and stopped by customs agents are coming through the open doors and gates. How did you assess how many are coming through illegally through tunnels and other illicit access?
Every shooting like this is tragic. If there was an easy solution we would have implemented it. Even with confiscation of all guns, the crazies will find a way to kill multiple people.
1
@Douglas
We can't and we should not confiscate all guns but it should also be pointed out very clearly that countries with fewer guns also have fewer murders. Common sense gun laws are the answer. And I do not mean guns laws for individual states and cities. I mean the entire US. Our country will become a safer, happier more economically successful place if this were to happen. The majority must speak up.
7
Thank goodness our new border wall will soon prevent these tragedies.. what it was a homeboy? Oh, then thoughts and prayers.
42
Terrible news.
Notice....no politicians say anything about this, but if the shooter was an illegal alien, President Sniffles and his squad would be yelling to high heaven about this.
28
Why is it that this killer walks out of the crime scene without a mark on him, but a black man with his hands in the air can be taken down and beaten because the cops think he in in a stolen car?
50
And of course, it's another white male.
38
@Scientist, Right, because there are never any POC murderers in the Boston metro region.
2
@Scientist...
Yep. America's dirty little secret.
3
@JM...
The difference is, that when whites commit murder the entire race is not held up for examinations of moral character, criminal tendencies, IQ, or basic humanity.
12
I would be curious for the NYTimes to find out how many hours of single shooter video games he played on a weekly average.
5
The 2nd Amendment at work.
I will never understand why Americans accept this senseless gun violence without doing a thing about it.
This is not normal.
40
@Andrew unfortunately its has become normal in the US , similar to car crashes. It is not even headline news!
6
@Andrew We have 340 million people which means at least .05% are psycho or 17 million. Gun laws or not, I am surprised we do not have more shootings.
2
@Andrew
Do you know WHY we have a 2nd Amendment?
There is a reason. A good one.
2
This is awful. I find myself feeling terrible grief for the mother of these killers. As a woman with similar demographic points (single mother of socially challenged white teen/male) I see how easy the path is towards this tragedy.
Here is what I imagine happens: the child is a loner and as he goes into his teenage-social years, becomes weird, isolated. The mother is the one who feels responsible for the child's mal-adjustment because nowadays, single mothers carry it alone. She hears that "he needs a dad" as if she failed by not creating one. She feels like the failure is all her and so, with so much self loathing, has less to give to her son. And yet she is all he has. It's not like there are still communities and adults around who will pitch in and feel any real obligation to someone else's child.
And the child knows all this. He knows he is a disappointment. The world tells him he is nothing. Video games offer a fantastic alternative. So he becomes more and more enthralled with the powers and joys of winning and playing in this world where shooting can win. As he gets older, this metastasizes into a real life fantasy, and the horrors - oh my, I could cry.
I think we all shoulder some of the responsibility.
15
The NRA buying legislators; Another example of corrupt politics as bribery is decriminalized. Whether tax laws allowing vast accumulation of wealth, the military industrial complex getting billions to finance endless loosing wars or local developers getting zoning waivers...never expect government to act on behalf of the people. Lobbyists with suitcases of money write the laws.
13
@simon rosenthal Maybe the 2nd amendment to the Constitution has a role-and the NRA was not around at that time.
@Douglas The NRA wasn't around...neither were machine guns or nuclear weapons. The Constitution is a living document designed for a culture almost 250 years ago. This is the only "first world" country on the planet that allows pervasive gun use...and thousand die each year as a result.
This unfortunate young man looks so similar to the defendant in the WI case of murder of parents and kidnapping of their young daughter that I had to look for the name.
Both have symptoms that place them on the Asperger spectrum particularly complete lack of empathy. The Sandy Hook killer was the same.
Given the fact that none if the above three had a psychiatric diagnosis or a criminal record made it impossible to deny them the possession of a firearm.
There is no solution to this problem.
8
@Edward Blau
One more thing in common: neither was an illegal alien.
8
Republican solution is to arm more Americans. "If there were more guns, we would all be safer. "-GOP
Who truly believes that more guns is a solution?
Would we feel safer with no guns or more guns?
Trained police officers miss more than they hit their live targets and somehow a grandma with a gun is going to hit the desired target.
21
@CA Dreamer
The kid was a liberal.
How about we ban all liberals from owning guns? Then we would be safer.
@CA Dreamer
I remember Barack Obama mentioning this after one of the gun-fueled massacres that took place while he was president (aka The Good Old Days).
He said there was one gun in this country for every man, woman and child, and asked how many more were needed.
16
If grandma has a gun and the potential perpetrator knows that then likely he would go after someone else instead. Sometimes guns are pure prevention without being actually used.
1
When will my right to live free from the fear that myself or a loved one will be shot supersede someone's right to bear arms?
53
@Ed Mahala Never. Sorry. Welcome to America. Sigh.
2
so, if any crazy person out there can legally buy a gun, then just randomly shoot everyone in a bank, doesn't that harken to the law denying me the right to a peaceful life, free of fear? and, in this instance, who gets sued when i prove that the gun laws are a threat to life? who do i sue? back up to the supreme court again?
21
The SCOTUS is choosing this moment to hear a gun safety law in the State of New York, a fairly certain indicator that they will, in their current configuration, most likely serve to weaken protections currently in place. How disgraceful.
8
This is the real crisis that keeps repeating itself. It's not at the border. It's internal. And it's being done by people who most likely never once set foot out of this country since they were born.
38
I will wager we will find out this is yet another “Incel” (Involuntarily Celibate) who is a loner, a (violent) video game addict (a neighbor has already said they heard him at night angrily yelling at his video games), angry at the world and women in particular (for their “rejecting” him, in his view), egged on by the online fraternity of “Incels” to take revenge on the world and all the women in the world who he imagines have rejected him. He may also be on some kind of pharmaceutical having been diagnosed with depression or anxiety, and missed doses or has his paranoia fueled further by the pharmaceutical, which can be a side effect. This is an epidemic that has to be dealt with, starting in the mental health community (simply prescribing an anti depressant is not the whole answer) and then by gun laws as they relate to the mentally disturbed (access must be curtailed), angry young men, particularly those that identify as Incels, incited to violence by online forums, with access to guns.
14
Florida lost “only” 5 people in this latest shooting. So it stands to reason that it’s news way way down in the newspaper. I guess shootings are only important if they involve double digit victims. Although the response in the usual “how awful, terrible etc.” How about gun legislation, how about gun control? How about outrage at how often this happens? I’m not going to ask how many more dead will it take before there’s action and guns are no longer available to anyone. I already know the answer, so save your righteous second amendment arguments.
11
Eventually, after enough lives are touched by gun death, and enough people say "enough," we will finally have sensible gun laws. One senseless death at a time.
8
The word militia appears 6 times in the Constitution.
1) Powers of Congress: To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;
2 & 3) Powers of Congress: To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
4) Powers of the President: The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States;
5) 2nd Amendment: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
6) 5th Amendment: No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger.
So you see the right to bear arms is for the purposes of the MILITIA.
And here we have another proud member of the MILITIA... feel safe?
21
@Doug Marcum
The 2nd Amendment conveys the right to the people.
Welcome to Florida Governors office, Mr. DeSantis. Will you be the leader that reduces the need for so many thoughts and prayers or more of the same?
7
What is wrong with boys and men that they kill? And so often it's strangers, totally randomly.
How has our society and their upbringing failed?
These are questions BEYOND the guns that need to be answered.
9
End the NRA, the most influential and best-funded terrorist organization in the United States. Find a petition online and sign it. I can't post them here. Or, just keep living with the growing and very real fear of being shot to death for no reason in a country unwilling to do anything to prevent it.
14
@Chris: THe NRA gets most of its funding from the Gun industry, not members. Also only a small proportion of gun owners actually are NRA members. number of gun owners who join the NRA is a very small proportion of the total gun owners. It is the mouthpiece of the gun industry not the majority of gun owners.
What all the fuss? He’s just another 110% murkin exercising his Scalia court given right to bear and use arms. And looks like the guns worked to specifications, killing and maiming. That’s what they are for, after all.
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Schools, post offices, offices, open air music concerts, movie theaters, churches, night clubs, shopping centers and on and on. This country has become one big shooting gallery where almost any mentally deranged aggrieved individual can easily obtain a gun and also if he so wishes build up a veritable arsenal of guns and ammo in his home - with no one the wiser until...
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@Susan
I think we should start profiling young white males. We don't seem to have a problem profiling males of color.
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Obviously, he was merely standing his ground.
Thanks, NRA. 2020.
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Another great day for the NRA and Republican Congress.
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The emergency at the border is more like the emergency of gun violence perpetrated by native-born Americans. Where's the 5.7 billion for that?
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This story, relegated to the "In Other News" section of the paper. Just another day...sad, and senseless.
Tax them, make them buy liability insurance, and stop the bloodshed. Like someone else wrote, "This is the true state of our union."
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Whew!!! I am glad that Florida has extensive gun control laws thanks to Gov. Scott! How’s that working for ya?
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Please post photos of the deceased if/when appropriate. Sensible gun control doesn't hit home for some people until they can see with their own eyes gun violence is real.
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Another proud day for the NRA. We in Canada look south with amazement and disgust over your lack of sensible gun laws. With Republicans in charge, gun murder and gun suicide rates will continue to lead the free world. By far.
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Does the NRA sell ‘Thoughts & Prayers’ t-shirts? Maybe it could find a Russian manufacturer.
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And the NRA solution? Guns everywhere, all the time.
The utter and shameless depravity of such a policy is incomprehensibly stupid, and for the millions of Americans who have suffered maiming, trauma, and death--an incalculable tragedy.
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Forget about the wall; use the money to provide better mental health care.
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Anyone notice he is neither an immigrant or a minority? How many people who were strangers to the perpetrator have been killed in the last 50 years by mentally ill white men versus by immigrants or minorities?
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Paul makes the point that's been made many times over the decades which has fallen on deaf ears with gun owners and the gun lobby. The 2nd Amendment does not in any way provide for people walking in public with guns strapped to their sides.
What it specifically does refer to is providing for simple gun ownership to allow for is a Well-Regulated militia. Emphasis on Well-Regulated. Nothing could be clearer!
Gun owners and gun lobbyists don't want to follow the Constitution as it was written.
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In other parts of the world where guns are heavily controlled or banned, other methods of killing are more widespread, like using knives or bombs. Example, lately a mayor of major city in Poland was knifed to death. Poland has very strict gun laws. When people want to kill they will find a method to do so. While this latest event in Florida is tragic, let’s do not assume that banning one tool to kill will change the behaviors of some who are inclined to kill. Prohibition and regulations are rarely effective long term, just take a look at the drug and opioids use. Cultural values, hope and expanding social mobility are better tools to decrease the number of these killings.
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@Martin the perpetrators with knives are only able to kill maybe one or two before being knocked out or apprehended. Not saying any loss of life is ok of course—but guns, especially with machine gun or modified magazines—make for mass killings. Very different than a solo killing by some knife-wielding maniac—sorry.
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All the self-appointed militias in the US should take note of the tank. Many local and state governments have them now. Consider the chances of a ragtag band of amateurs against trained, well armored law enforcement.
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How is it that this man was allowed to train as a corrections officer? Do they not do psychological testing on applicants?
Until Florida and the rest of the nation pass common sense gun laws like banning assault rifles, requiring thorough background checks no matter how long they take and raising the minimum purchase age, we will continue to see these senseless shootings on a regular basis.
This is not what the founders had in mind when they passed the Second Amendment.
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@Barbara I agree but the majority of violent crimes are committed with a handgun. I think we should follow Great Britain's lead and ban or severely restrict handguns.
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@D. C. Miller I agree wholeheartedly. Unfortunately, I don't think we'll see that any time soon in this country, so we need to strengthen existing laws and pass laws that at least try to contain who has guns, and perhaps how many they have.
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@Barbara - How is it that this man was allowed to train as a corrections officer?
I haven't kept records, and I am sure there will be denials from the corrections officers, but I am struck by the number of times I've read something similiar where someone who was/is a corrections officer, or wanted to be one, or be a cop, who didn't cut it turns to violence. I think there is something in these jobs that attracts those who want to hurt others.
My idea is that there is no such thing as a career corrections officer. All officers take turns patrolling our cities and towns and also our prisons. This would also go a long way to stopping some of the sense of turf, abuse, and familiarity with prisoners at facilities and relationships between guards and prisoners that have sometimes lead to escapes.
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A society that steadfastly refuses to allow even the most modest gun control laws creates a culture which gives tacit approval to crazies to use firearms for their intended purpose - and there will always be crazies.
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@W.A. Spitzer Yes, human nature being what it is, there will always be crazies and that is precisely why we cannot permit lethal weapons to be widely available. It is so simple.
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@W.A. Spitzer
We already have stringent gun control.
Go try to buy a gun and see what happens.
Yet another coward with a gun. It seems he wanted to make a name for himself by shooting people who could not fight back or escape. In the process, he took 5 lives and hurt families that he did not even know. Just senseless, mindless killing. When will enough be enough?
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No, this was mindful killing. Don't give the shooter an automatic insanity defense. Assume he knew what he was doing and did it anyway.
13
Another day, another senseless shooting to devastate the families of innocent victims.
This is the true State of our Union.
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Rick Scott signs an "array of gun limits" into law and the NRA sues. And so the madness continues.
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We do need common sense gun laws; strengthened background checks as an example; but America's random murders and violence needs to be addressed first by asking--------why does our culture/society, lead the world in mental health disorders; in short, mental illness? Until we confront this there will be no fundamental solution.
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@Lee Paxton We do not lead the world in mental illness. the % of individuals with schizophrenia is about 1% around the world. IN other countries they cannot so easily get a gun.
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@MN But our community mental health services have been gutted everywhere, and this is particularly true in Florida.
Full disclosure: I live in Sebring. I am painfully aware that the social services here are far below what is needed for our population.
In Sebring, last summer, a very well-respected state trooper, William Gentry, was murdered in the line of duty by a convicted felon on probation, who also had a history of violence against law enforcement officers. By existing Florida law, this man should never have been able to purchase a firearm, but he did, in part because the probation office was too underfunded to supervise him properly.
If all that sounds reminiscent of the multiple abdications of responsibility that preceded the Parkland shootings, it should. Underfunded social service agencies, poor enforcement of existing laws,constant attacks on government in the press and by politicians, leading to a "keep your head down and don't make trouble" climate among front-line workers -- all of this has contributed to a breakdown of authority in society, which in turn contributes to the ongoing epidemic of gun violence. It's a complex problem and one that requires thoughtful solutions.
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@MN
Schizophrenia is not the only mental health disorder. I have no idea whether we lead the world in mental health disorders, but we definitely lead the world in allowing people to easily purchase guns and ammunition.
4
What a horrible tragedy. Five innocent lives. Our heartfelt condolences to their devastated families.
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Melt them down. It is worth spending public money to reduce their numbers to well under one gun per American.
Tax them heavily. It usually takes pain in the pocket for people to act.
Require registration, training, medical exams, licensing, and testing. If I had to do that in order to fly airplanes, gun owners should also. Any activity that can harm innocent people should require all of these.
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@Bob in NM
Firearms owners should have to buy liability insurance as well as your other suggestions.
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@New World
Liability insurance would not pay out for claims arising out of intentional conduct such as this. It would still be a good thing for accidental injuries, of which there are many due to gun use in this country.
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@New World
very good idea
5
Another great example of a “well regulated militia;” JUST like our founding fathers dreamed of.
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