Corbyn needs to lead.
2
God save the UK! Nobody else seems interested.
1
It appears that whatever Britain chooses at this point, it will remain divided. Cameron made a grave mistake when he set up a referendum thinking Brexit would be voted down. Now all British people are paying the price.
3
I have not heard any post-May deal vote discussion of the "Norway" option, of Britain advocating for a similar relationship with the EU as Norway has. Would lack of discussion indicate this isn't an option?
And if there's a second referendum, how would that be phrased? Could such a referendum have multiple options--hard-Brexit, remain, May's deal, Norway option or maybe something else? I don't see our professional journalists doing their jobs of clarification on this story (again).
This is the largest crisis to our economic well being since the country was foundering in the 1970’s under the weight of union and government mismanagement; The ‘sick man’ of Europe, we were.
After Corbyn and his party this week voted down the only exit deal on the table, he now says that he will not discuss any solution till the PM rules out a no-deal!
For reference, the countdown following Article 50 started nearly 2 years ago and the U.K. leaves the EU at the end of March with or without a deal following an A50 vote in parliament which Corbyn and Labour supported, following an election in which Labour campaigned to carry out Brexit.
Now rejecting the exit deal followed by an insistence that we shouldn’t exit without a deal is the worst sort of chicanery.
A view is emerging that the only rational explanation is that he is deliberately trying to engineer a hard Brexit with no deal as he believes the ensuing chaos will be the catalyst to a socialist revolution.
This does seem to be resonating with the public as he is now polling third in the question of who would make the best PM; Behind both Theresa May of all people and ‘don’t know’. For context, at this point in Margaret Thatcher’s downfall, she was 20-odd points behind.
It is heartbreaking to see how the party of Clement Atlee and Nye Beaven, let alone Blair and Brown, has descended into this Hohxa/Tito’esque parody of the last Stalinist of Western Europe.
1
@Mike If Corbyn is insisting that a hard Brexit must be ruled out before considering other options (something our article of comment doesn't deal with), then what manner of contorted, ungenerous thinking has him hoping for a hard Brexit to instigate a socialist revolution? Isn't he just a little too establishment and attached to conventional politics to imagine such a scenario?
Far be it for this American Anglophile of some liberal-to-moderate leanings to discern the anomalies of British politics, but when I try to digest the context of your remarks, I get a stomachache.
2
Interestingly, that Labour feels that this can't be done from inside the EU. It seems that Corbyn really can't see the bigger picture. It's not just the UK that has the problem. All the other members have the same issue. If the AI predictors are right, it will be possible to remove 40% of the work force with AI. This suggests big changes are coming whether people are ready or not.
2
Spare me! Corbyn is the quintessential socialist/communist. He has no more chance of getting a good deal than P.M. May or an other pretenders to the throne on either side of politics, but will plunge the UK into the sort of mayhem that existed prior to Ms. Thatcher. In other words, he is a worse choice than no-deal.
1
Huge fan of Corbyn on everything other than his handling of Brexit.
Come on Jeremy, get off the fence and support a second referendum - it's the only way out of this mess.
5
As a nation in control of its own currency, Britain holds the cards when it comes to negotiating trade deals. Britain has no need to stay in the EU, it can do business with those nations on its own terms, and with the rest of the world as well. The EU has become an autocratic technocracy working mainly for the benefit of Germany. The euro is just another name for the Deutsche mark. The stubborn reliance on neoliberal ideology is hurting the nations in the EU, which is beginning a new recession as a result. Pure economic poison.
3
Democracy that is one vote, one time, is meaningless, especially when what was voted on bears no resemblance to what is actually on the table. In a democracy, the voters are allowed to change their minds if they choose. A second vote seems rather an obvious necessity. If Brexit fails, then the UK can still continue to push for needed changes in the EU, with the threat of a possible later Brexit helping to focus minds on the task. If it passes a second time, then the people will have chosen knowing the risks.
69
@le
Yes - But this time UK intelligence services must focus efforts to curb Russian involvement. It was a close vote the first time around when the Russians were up to the same tricks they pulled in the US.
3
@le I lean toward commending a second vote, as long as it incorporates the new context of British politics. I recommend several different ones, meaning options that won't likely meet the standards of the Briitsh common good. (Still the best among bad options--like democracy.)
Then the top 2 vote-getters--presuming no option gets 50% of the vote--run off to determine Britain's EU future. Do it all in quick order, as opinions have been pre-formed. If the result doesn't incorporate some measure of what "leave" or "remain" advocates want, then I fear many bad consequences, but at least this process let's Brits have a semblance of democratic rule.
1
He-he, Brita are sure in trouble if they trust some posts on Facebook, much more than their own press and the Government.
The last paragraph, about mobilizing the economic anger in the country and directing it away from immigration and towards the failed policies of the political and economic elites, is also good policy for the USA. Trump and the Republicans are trying to divert attention away from their rapacious capitalism and blaming immigrants for the working class woes. What we Democrats should argue is that the economic policies since Reagan's era has decimated the working class. NOT immigration
167
@Miguel Cernichiari: Thank you! I had to read through many, many comments before finding one that hit the last paragraph. Folks, it is hard to win a battle when you can't accurately identify the enemy. The financier class takes all it can grab, and grab quickly, and then whines when there are impediments to grabbing more. True in UK, true in US.
10
@Miguel Cernichiari:
I would argue that immigration is one of the the clubs by which BigMoney hits working class over the head with; others would include things like outsourcing jobs and factories overseas.
In 1977, in highschool, I got a summer job as an unskilled construction labor at my highschool's remodeling & made over $20/hour (or $80 in today's money). I'm now unemployed, but have designed advanced state of the art manufacturing systems to help make companies like Caterpillar, GM & Boeing competitive using Japanese 'just-in-time' lean techniques, oh, and I also have a law degree from a tier 1 university.
In 2012 I had a temp job designing a system for a telecom giant that paid $22 an hour, today I talked to a company offering me $17 an hour. In law school I learned that in a society based upon free contract, what you earn is a function of your bargaining power. The way to undermine that is to undermine unions and force people to compete against workers in or from low wage companies.
From 1945 to 1972 GNP went up 100% & the median wage went up with it. Since 1972 GNP has gone up 150% but the median wage has remained flat!
Meanwhile Med Doctors pay has gone up because they have a strong union (the AMA) and they control & constrict the number of people who can become doctors.
During the Obama years, the economy created 10 million jobs, but the US also allowed in LEGALLY over 10 million immigrants, many needing jobs.
Some immigration's ok. Rampant is not.
9
Nonsense.
Apparently, you ignored the countless articles featuring white working-class trump voters.
Most of them in Appalachia and the rural south still want coal & manufacturing jobs that disappeared long ago (due to automation and outsourcing). They want the same jobs and benefits that were available for their parents, typically with only a high school education.
They sneered when Obama and Hillary suggested they acquire new skills thru education and training. Nope, they want to turn back the clock, while conveniently blaming “others” (ie, immigrants) for their plight.
2
You can only work to get rid of decades of neoliberal policy if you have a functioning country left to make policy for.
You can only reduce poverty if you don't first throw your economy off a cliff.
The EU is much, much more than a banker's club. It's critical to the UK's survival, whether Corbyn likes that or not. And it's long past time he got with the programme and started acting like an actual leader for the good of the country. As far as I'm concerned, he's part of the problem, not the solution.
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@Elle
But where in Britain is an alternative. This morning, there was a parade of 70-odd Labour MPs who support a people's vote. Just 70!! That is all they could manage after May suffered the greatest governmental defeat in UK history. I was imagining Cooper and Starmer and Grieve and the LIb Dems and SNP all meeting last night, and showing up with a new political block that could command power in Parliament and save the country, but clearly all they could do was parade a miserable 70 MPs out of 650. No politicians in Westminster seem to have any imagination or drive. Not one is willing to risk his or her party career for the sake of the country. Pathetic!
16
@Julian I completely agree with you in much of Labour as a whole is refusing to step up! It also shows a lamentable lack of strategy on their part to me, given that the majority of both their members and their voters overall are clearly in favour of a people's vote. But they are following Corbyn's lead on that.
To me, the Lib Dems (with some notable Tory and Labour allies) are the only real adults left in the room at this stage. They are clear what they want; clear that any Brexit will be hugely damaging, that no deal is not an option and that signing up to follow EU rules without any say in making them is a ludicrous thing to do under the name of "taking back control."
My husband is an EU citizen who got British citizenship because we were afraid of what would happen after Brexit. I'm in the UK as an EU spouse. We've told local Labour canvassers flat out that because of Brexit, he's voting Lib Dem until Labour leadership grows a spine.
14
@Elle
I agree, Elle, but with one proviso. While I bemoaned the measly 70 MPs paraded in front of Parliament, I did not do so merely because their numbers were insufficient. More serious to me is the utter lack of vision and leadership that will galvanize the country towards some solution. In the absence of such galvanizing energy, I fear that any effort for either a second referendum or canceling Article 50 will be seen across the UK as a soft coup, and will just make everything even uglier, possibly much much uglier. The political means here are more important than the ends.
11
A second referendum and that's it--full stop.
3
Imagine if Scotland and even Northern Ireland were to embrace the twin notions and referenda of both a Brexit choice and v independence concurrently ? This hardy motion to divorce from Europe could rupture the Greater Britain’s sibling ties and leave a Wales/England rump looking to return to its state sizeof 500 years ago.
2
As the saying oft goes on both sides of the pond - it is a lot easier to govern in the shadows or the wilderness than it is to bring and hold together in the middle that of the middle and the edges. In other words to take the inglorious decisions of actual governing.
3
“The predicament mirrors questions confronting left-wing parties in Europe and the United States about how to fight populist movements that trade on anti-immigrant sentiment.”
“Populist” movements that are ill-informed must be confronted repeatedly. If the experience of the 1930s and ‘40s taught us anything, it’s that the choice is really not a difficult one to make.
How it is done gets tricky. But the decision to fight ignorance is not.
3
Corbyn isn't respected and will not be deciding anything as he does not have a majority. He is almost as despised as Trump on our island.
The vote to leave was in many of our minds for two reasons:
1) to regain control of immigration to allow in the people who will contribute positively to our country (just like almost all non-EU countries do!).
2) take back control of our laws and decisions locally.
Americans don't grasp the concept of the EU until one explains to them to imagine there's 50 countries, and no central government. A central government is created for trading purposes then one day the central government becomes dictatorial to all citizens of all countries and negates their laws.
That was NOT what the UK voted for in 1972 but what the UK has voted to leave from.
2
For goodness sake the British representatives in Brussels were always treating their continental companions with disdain. Now it’s time for them to get real. All treaties and other contracts between nations are complicated relationships demanding give and take on both sides. They joined and now they want to leave. Okay but you can’t have something like Norway’s relationship with the E.U. until the divorce is pronounced.
3
Corbyn's real problems is that it was his Labour party base that largely voted leave. His game right now is damaging the opposition party but not enough to actually have to govern and own Leave. Thus May survived the no confidence vote and the game continues for now.
1
"A recent poll showed that Labour would have the support of roughly one-fifth of voters if it backed Brexit, and close to 40 percent if the party instead campaigned for a second referendum."
The momentum for a second referendum exists but the outcome will depend on the quality of the questions it poses voters. What interests me is that a movement amongst Labour MPs to support the formation of a Citizens Assembly made up of representatives of UK regions chosen randomly, but proportionally, and qualified, following the jury model, by judges. Its purpose would be to propose to Westminster the wording of a second referendum.
Such a process was successful applied recently in Ireland to reconcile long-standing and fiercely opposing parties on the issues of abortion. It therefore holds promise of doing the same for the divides now paralyzing political debate in the UK over its relationship to the EU.
3
The UK needs to stay in the EU and use its considerable standing to change it from a bankers' club into the social democracy it should be. That will mean internal changes in the UK as well, with much more attention to the status of the ordinary worker. It is a mistake to see the EU as an unchangeable bureaucracy. It is a bureaucracy to be sure, as were all its predecessors, but the idea is right in general and right for the UK specifically.
3
Now that the Brits have had an opportunity to mature their views on Brexit, why not hold a second referendum?
4
The German decision to welcome 1.5 million migrants from the middle east and Africa was a huge factor in the Brexit vote because of their consequent rights to migrate to Britain as part of the EU. However, the most consequential factor in Brexit is the accountability of the EU, personified by Theresa May, the head of UK government negotiating with an appointed bureaucrat, Michel Barnier. Brexit is inspired by the same complaint that inspired the American Revolution. As it has turned out the revolt is not just against unaccountable bureaucrats in Brussels but unaccountable politicians in the British House of Commons. Corbyn and May have shown their true colours and they need to held accountable to the voters.
While May is boxed in by her own party but Corbyn is hardly a trustworthy type.
If they are to join force, they should choose Referendum 2.0. The soft Brexit is just a no-calorie cheese cake, it doesn't exist! Why would EU want to set an example for the others to have the cake and eat it too?
Even if they succeed in Referendum 2.0, the damage is done. They will lead to put the country before their party to repair the damage, to convince people reversing whatever exodus plans set in motion. They should look at the U.S. to see what could happen to the U.K. when they put their part before the country
1
Oh dear the Remainers in the Tory party have destroyed Mays government, with her able assistance. And now the Labour Party member elite Remainers threaten to turning on their own. Never mind the electorate, nothing can stop the Remainers desperate to surrender to the EU/ECB globalist elite.
1
I am almost as tired of reading about Brexit as I am of reading about Trump. It is literally the same thing day after date, week after week and month after month.
Honestly, call me whem something is decided, will you?
2
Jeremy has brought the Labour party thus far. Blair Mandelson et el, is not finished with Jeremy. They want to make sure he is not in 10 Downing Street
This reporting, in fairness, none of the reporting in Britain has clarified for me what's going on with Corbyn. The Labour Party has had zero influence or impact on the negotiations. Contrast this with the impact of the DUP, their 10 deputies approx 300,000 votes total (about half the population of Bristol!) - a party that schemed for Brexit with a "donation" linked to Ukraine/Russia, that is evangelical Christian, in evolution denial/creationists, against marriage equally, or choice, against Irish language rights that are laws in the rest of the UK for Welsh and Scots-Irish - these 10 deputies have torpedoed May's negotiations throughout. In December 2017, May had accepted a deal with the EU - Northern Ireland while an integral part of the UK in EVERY respect would have a special status with all that comes with full membership but with a sole requirement for adherence to European Court of Justice and some checks on goods trafficking between mainland Britain and Northern Ireland. But when the DUP got word, they torpedoed this and Corbyn was silent. This planned Dec 2017 deal would have had overwhelming support in the London Parliament. If May doesn't tame the DUP, British democracy is in an immense crisis.
5
What's the bigger threat--migrants or elites? See quote below. This is what our media should discuss here and abroad---our rigged economy. "Anglo Saxon economics"?US and UK.
Quantify it, simplify it, publicize it---for the voting public.
"On the left, she said, the most successful campaigns ....have taken “the existing economic anger and, rather than mobilizing it against migrants, mobilize it against elites and the establishment that have rigged the economy.”
2
Corbyn must go. he is a poor leader and doesn't understand the importance for Britain to stay in the EU, and how it can help the poors in the long run. Not adopting the Euro was already a big mistake and a sign old fashion nationalism has a strong and dangerous grip in Britain.
3
The British, of all people, should recognize in Corbyn a Hamlet who was not meant to lead but to hesitate.
4
I find it indefensible, and insulting to the electorate, that Labour (Corbyn) has not taken a position on Brexit for 2 years - even if I understand very well the reasons why that was. They can call it "a small matter" relative to other all they want, but it is the biggest decision this country is going to make in years, if not decades, impacting all areas of the economy and everything else.
How can you be the second largest party and not participate in this process? Again, all thinking of politics and not of the good of the country.
5
The driving force behind Brexit was anti-immigrant, pure and simple. Whatever happens that sentiment will remain and must be reckoned with.
8
@Alan brown Using your explanation of Brexit, that would make the Disney workers who had to train their H1B1 visa replacements "anti-immigrant." It's a little more complex than you think, I believe.
4
@FXQ Conflating a referendum in Great Britain with Disney Workers in Florida and California is a little obtuse.
It is indeed complex but the referendum was presented with no questions about the issues, and the vote in my town was almost totally based on the simple notion: they are coming and taking our jobs. No mention of who "they" were, nor which jobs they were taking, many being the ones nobody was qualified to do or jobs that were considered too demeaning. The impact of the shortage of nurses and care workers, for example, is now hitting us badly. It was an emotional vote without much idea of the possible implications. Beyond that it has been distressingly wearisome watching the antics of politicians, treating us as though it was such fun and we were merely an exciting debate.
1
Honour the referendum results: grant Scotland its independence so that it may remain in the EU, reunite Northern Ireland with The Irish Republic so that it may remain in the EU, and finally England and Wales can break with the EU on terms which will inevitably be dictated to them by the EU.
5
Corbyn seems as buried upside down in the sand for labor, as does Mrs. May 's narrow focus "not split the conservatives."
Neither is really paying attention.
It appears that Corbyn should switch to remain and stick with a short list of the public's most consistent majority requests; and fight hard for those with EU. Stay but drive a hard bargain. After all, Macron has ignored the people of France. The UK should play this as an opportunity, and bankers & business should take responsibility for doing their part for the common good of the people of the UK and agree to a coalition of substance with Labor.
What do I know? I'm an American with cousins in the UK. A lot of time has been wasted.
3
With Labour in power and Britain out of the EU, Britain would still be free to set a liberal, multicultural immigration policy. Contrary to the implications in parts of this article, this isn't a binary choice between supporting multiculturalism or supporting Brexit.
Even though the most significant pro-Brexit campaigners of the referendum were Tory free-marketeers or racists like Nigel Farage, that doesn't mean Brexit itself is a clear cut left- or right-wing event.
With the right currently in power, Brexit could benefit certain constituents among the Tories in the short term. But Labour should be thinking long term. Brexit has much to offer the left in the long term. Corbyn is correct in portraying the EU as a neoliberal club. The foundational premise of the EU is the entrenchment of market and capital freedoms, and it was designed to prohibit left-wing redistribution and industrial aid policies, etc. that distort market competition within the bloc, even though it later implemented some EU-wide social and redistributive policies of its own.
In the long-term, the left has much to gain from Brexit. During the original accession debate in the early 1970s, Labour knew this and overwhelmingly opposed the EU.
The EU has done much good for Europe as well, and I am personally torn on whether Britain should stay or go. But just remember that contrary to the media portrayal, Brexit isn't a clear cut left or right wing event, nor is it a clear cut "populist" event.
1
“Migration, Migration, Migration”
We could have avoided Brexit entirely, perhaps even Trump, if only the Political Classes had listened to the people.
Migration is the key thread that links Brexit to Trump to the Rise of the Right across Europe. The images of uncontrolled throngs passing unimpeded across the borders of Europe in 2015, Police standing helplessly by, cemented the idea in many that Britain needed to take back control of its borders.
And it is not simplistically just about Identity, it is also about Citizenship. What value does the contract between the Citizen and the State have when non-citizens are offered the same rights & privileges? Under European law non-EU migrants seeking Asylum are afforded the same rights to housing, healthcare, education and social welfare as citizens.
It just doesn’t undermine this contract, it negates it.
This is the stuff of Revolution, an Unnecessary Revolution, all because the political class & technocrats did not listen to the people.
2
The first Brexit referendum was a classic example of unintended consequences.
The popular vote to leave was dreadfully uninformed and, to some extent, it would not be unfair to say that it was motivated by racism and a desire to return to the delusional imperial grandeur of the 19th century.
The better course of action would have been for Parliament to vote to leave the EU, then enter into negotiations, and only conduct the referendum after all the complex details had been negotiated -- and only after Parliament and the British people had a complete, clear understanding of all the issues. In other words, let a now better-informed people decide about the deal, not just the emotional issue of whether to leave. Parliament and the people have learned so much over the past two years.
A second, better-informed referendum is the only way out of this mess. It could be an exceptional act of stateswomanship on the part of the Prime Minister. Aside from the benefits to British democracy, it also would force both the Conservatives and Labour to figure out where they each stand on Brexit and perhaps on other issues as well. In recent years, the two parties have sometimes become almost indistinguishable to many British voters. The experience of a second referendum could therefore have long-lasting benefits far beyond its specific scope.
The weightiest decisions of a democracy should never be a one-time all-or-nothing game.
3
Regardless of what one thinks of Brexit, the people have spoken. How can a true democracy function if every time the people "did not vote the right way", according to pundits and the ruling class, we should repeat the vote until "they get it right"? Why not have a third referendum if the 2nd one fails? My heart says that we should have repeated the 2016 US presidential election, but my brain says "no way!"
8
@Henry K., why would you keep the people from a second vote if they wat it? On a matter with generational consequences, having a one-shot plebiscite was foolish to begin with. People have had time to reflect, and a single past vote need not be a self-imposed strait-jacket. That would be self-defeating to say the least.
29
@Henry K., presidential elections are held every four years. So yes, we certainly can and do repeat them.
23
There hasn't been a "true democracy" (i.e., direct democracy) since 5th century BC Athens. What we have now is "representative democracy", where we leave the details of complex policy matters to elected representatives, who are (hopefully) better qualified than the unwashed masses they represent to get the tricky details right.
Perhaps more than anything the Brexit debacle illustrates that Plato had a point... direct democracy degenerates to rule of the ignorant mob. Plebiscites may have their place, but the limiting factor is the complexity of the question you are asking the people to consider. I can think of few more complex questions than "remain or leave?". It seems even the elected elite failed to grasp the full ramifications. Fail, Mr Cameron.
19
Knowing very facts about this situation, I have to observe that there has been little publicity as to what the people of Britain do desire in the split with the E.U. Immigration seems to be a big problem in Europe as well as the U.S., threatening the white minority in both places. Corbyn is wrong in saying that the biggest problem facing the country is lack of faith in the government, the big problem is that the country voted to do something, and the time to arrange how it is going to be done is running out.
Another observation that I have to make is that the House of Commons needs a new house. I am amazed at how crowded the Commons is. I realize that tradition holds a big part of government in England, but the number of representatives has apparently grown considerably.
4
@Scott Holman Hi Scott a couple things to help out. We who voted leave never voted (at least to all we know) to keep Britain white. We voted to stop us becoming Europe's go-to free-for-all coming in state. Our vote means very similar to your visa programmes.
The House of Commons isn't as crowded as the (useless!) House of Lords where anyone with enough influence or ££'s can gain appointment. HoL in many times is completely and utterly cluefree in how to conduct matters.
1
There are leaders. There are managers. Then there are politicians. These three roles mark a progression downwards from decisiveness towards enabling—and not the good kind. A role of a leader in a democracy is to inform the people with more than information, but to explore the future with them by looking at the consequences of different pathways.
Mr. Corbyn is a politician who clearly has some ideas that have brought him to the top of the Labour pyramid, but that rise shows no evidence of a concomitant rise in leadership qualities. He’s reflecting the same type of attitudes about globalization from the left that are posited by conservative American voters on the right. The problem with that is a rejection of the reality that the world is now an interconnected economic and social web. There is no turning back without enormous hardship that usually results in civil and international strife.
Mr. Corbyn would do better to help his constituents understand this reality and work to improve their lives within this new global framework. The EU was, and is, an effective answer to globalization by combining the strengths of European countries into a major system to address the challenges of globalization together. Brexit will clearly be an economic disaster for the UK, but Mr. Corbyn's current approach of trying to once again muddle through the situation will not work any better.
It’s time for a leader. Can the UK find one?
38
@David Potenziani
As you suggest in your insightful comment, this is a great opportunity for either Mr. Corbyn or Ms. May to be that leader.
1
@David Potenziani
Corbyn's apparenty fence sitting is a concern. That's not what a true leader does.
Managerial politicians can be disastrous too. Look at Neville Chamberlain.
6
Henry VI reincarnated. From my comfortable remove, it looks like the best next step is for Labour to vote no-confidence in Corbyn. Then push for a new referendum.
9
Really explanatory writing by Benjamin Mueller. Brits are in the same mess that we are in with trump and his trumpkin supporters:
“If you look around Europe, center-left parties are facing a dilemma,” said Tim Bale, a professor of politics at Queen Mary, University of London, who has surveyed Labour membership on Brexit. “How do they maintain or even get back an electoral coalition of workers and middle-class, more educated voters?”
The solution is to stay in the EU, but then there is a discussion over immigration. In the U.S. the Republican Party lost its rational mind under trump, so there is no rational discussion.
Good leaders have to lead their citizens to a better place. Brexit and trump are bad phenomena that demagogically game citizens to the wrong place. Corbyn might correct that condition.
2
He's a quisling and Labour should move on.
15
Corbyn's no confidence motion failed, he is a busted flush. His performance at PMQ's today was woeful, as a Parliamentary combatant, he is pathetic, he wouldn't have survived a school debating society. However, more importantly, just like Rees Mogg, he wants to leave the EU, but cannot say so, because the young people who have flocked to Labour under his leadership are pro-EU and want to remain.
The hard right and hard left both want to leave the EU because membership anchors you in the centre ground, which is a very good place to be.
12
Weakness on both sides does not bode well for the British.
Both parties, grievously wounded with respect to their baser [sic] principles, should go away and leave the stage to....well...who...or...whom?
The Brexit plebiscite was a fool's gamble fiddled by Emperor Vladi of one of the Russias as a run-up to the tilting of the US presidential election.
What's wrong with another round of popular voting? Perhaps it might go the wrong way? Teach me, history.
Jeremy is a fool with no liver and Teresa is the leader of a party with no guts.
Throw them both out - oops - the rest are the same.
Too bad, I once liked the Brits.
wb
3
Corbyn is not a "project". EU is a project. Second referendum is a project. Both those projects can and should be killed. The fact that any socialist Labour person could support UK's membership in EU, let alone that most of them do, simply boggles the mind. Maybe Labour Party does not deserve a leader like Corbyn, if its membership is so stupid and brainwashed by globalist corporate propaganda.
3
They really don't deserve Corbyn. They deserve much better.
3
Neoliberalism has choked the people of Europe, America, Latin America and indeed the world for 35 years. The result: massive profit for finance and speculative capital for the privileged few and increasing hardship and impoverishment for the many. Tories as stalwart defenders of privilege and finance capital in The City will hold true for their corporate masters.... now can Labour parry and win the day?
3
It was often said that the prime minister was asking Brits to take a leap of faith to jump off Brexit cliff.
All because, she was triangulating to get a deal - any deal.
But it appears that it is Mr Corbyn who has jumped off the cliff without anyone having faith in his triangulating.
With a decisive defeat of Brexit - he had every right to have faith in the parliament that a no confidence would pass.
Unfortunately, he miscalculated the self preservation of faith of Conservatives and his own members.
No sitting politician would want to face voters in this most confused and angry state. Results would be unpredictable just as they were when the prime minister called the last election.
She had hoped for a resounding majority - only to find gasping for survival.
Ditto here - there is no guarantee that Labour would win the next election.
And even if they win - the poisoned chalice of Brexit is what they will get.
And as quoted in a nearby NYT story of C L Lewus quote that beginning can't be changed but ending can be.
Unfortunately, for Labour - if they were to win the next election - they would be staring at the same beginning as in deja vue all over again.
And the ending us still no where near.
It's time for Mr Corbyn to put up or shut up or make way.
3
The problem is that Britain is a destination for Eastern EU and economic migrants from Africa Pakistan and other places. The health service is over burdened as are the schools rents are sky high. Being in the EU means taking in migrants who will work for less. Making the elites and corporations rich and improvising native born blue collar and middle class. Then there is the question of sovereignty EU laws over ride British laws
In the EU we set border controls. You may have forgotten this.
3
Corbyn has to fish or cut bait. Crunch time. Labour has to step up with bold clear proposal or be relagated to minority yet again. Amazing that the left in UK unable to cobble together enough support from a beaten down people to form a majority government
Ditto in the US.
2
@JL If Corbyn reveals the truth of his views, he'll bid fair to lose the Labour Party members who in the majority want to remain--many younger people whom he needs to satisfy his political ambitions. But you're right that he can't hide his affinity for the remain camp much longer, or his willingness to arrange only a hard exit, a crash that could usher in a recession. He hoped to finish off May and gain power before the truth came out.
2
There is a lot of myth making being peddled by Remainers. The best estimates are that over 60% of Labour electorates voted to Leave. Labour Remainers were clustered a few major urban centers, London being the biggest. It would be a massive error in judgement on Corbyns part to ignore this and undermine Brexit just to please a minority of Party activists... he treading carefully for good reason.
1
Counting on Corbyn to act like a statesman and put his countries best interests ahead of his own?
The slogan went from Keep Calm and Carry On to All Hope is Lost!
4
Had to stifle a laugh at your article's description of Corbyn as "soft spoken." I bet he would too. What he is is a bit of a grandstander, and all too often on the most critical matters -- from Brexit to his party's anti-Semitism -- a waffler and dissembler who wants to have it all ways. I doubt, hence, that a majority of Britons will ever back him as the nation's leader, even as Theresa May loses ever more support. I daresay one reason she will not lose a vote of confidence is because few want Corbyn at the helm of power.
8
Party membership and Labour voters are two different things, one in hundreds of thousands and the other in the tens of millions. Over 60% of Labour electorates vote to Leave. Corbyn would do well to respect the democratic will expressed to Brexit if he wants to get into ten Downing Street. No need to Save the Treacherous Tory remainers.
" “If people start to think that Corbyn is just another politician like all the other politicians..."
No, he's much worse.
2
Sounds like British opposition party is the party of NO. Oppose, oppose but they have no idea what to do either! By voting to exit, British voters caught the tail but now don't know what to do with it!
4
All I see is more selfish men putting Party ahead of Country. What a world.
6
Can we ignore Putin’s unseen hand working to destroy the EU?
11
Revoke, renegotiate and then referendum.
3
May is preferable as Prime Minister 2:1 by the British population.
Corbyn doesn’t mind Brexit while being in charge of a party that does. That cannot continue in the long term unless the party reforms around him.
He is literally the left wing version of Donal Trump only saying left wing things instead of right wing.
8
It's not Jeremy Corbyn's job to ride to the rescue of the Tory party. This is their mess, let them own it. As much as I'd like to see Brexit reversed, Corbyn pursuing a soft Brexit in the full knowledge it would split the Tory party in Two, is more than acceptable.
4
Brexit is not about just Brexit. Leaders across the board are well described by Dylan's Ballad Of A Thin Man: "You know something is happening here but you don't know what it is, do you Mr Jones."
The EU started to come apart years ago, its elites losing touch with their own nationals. It had a chance to realize the transnational project wasn't working when it couldn't deal with the Balkan Wars, but they remained complacent, assuming newer generations shared the perspective of those who, after WW II, nobly envisioned a transnational effort to stop European carnage.
The EU has been unable to deal with immigration, terrorism, and the monetary/fiscal policy disconnect. Being out of touch, its leaders were surprised when these issues resonated strongly with many Europeans, especially those in the East, which had essentially no history of democracy and little with liberal values.
Meanwhile, British elites failed to grasp the anxiety of their own people, leading to the absolute shock at the vote for Brexit. Had Brexit lost, the half the people who supported Brexit or were simply p.o.'d about something, were still out there, their complaints, some of which were legitimate, still needing to be reckoned with, a task neither May nor Corbyn indicate an ability to deal with.
It has seemed for a decade that many Brits, as with Europeans in general, have been losing a sense of collective identity, the consequent vacuum filled by long-standing national, ethnic, and religious identities.
19
God help us all. Corbyn has been destructive to the process. He, along with much of the Conservative Party, has weakened the prime minister's hand in negotiating with foreign governments. He is seriously compromised by some of his recent history (a fact I was forced to accept kicking and screaming being a Labour voter myself), and has demonstrated that he doesn't have any new ideas for what a deal should look like.
Unless he has a sudden spasm of usefulness, he is unfit to lead and will not get Labour back into power. If there is a new election, someone from the Conservative Party will arise - or be pushed - to lead. The fact that there is no obvious successor to May - thus the outcome of the confidence vote - is a sign that the Tories are just as compromised. The entire political structure is in tatters.
I am beginning to think that a second referendum is inevitable. It would be an ugly mess and it may not turn out the way so many people think (anti-Brexit). I also don't know if it can be done before March 29. But throwing it back into the hands of the voters, admittedly now better informed, would be yet another dereliction of duty on the part of the government. In that respect, it will solve nothing.
12
Completely agree. Corbin is totally unfit to lead and as long as he stays as party leader Labour will stay on the sidelines.
6
Corbyn stuck between Old School Labour [most current MPs who hate him] and rank-and file Momentum & BAME [who are in love with him]!
The former, and so does their working class supporters believe, that the customs union, which leads to free movement of all resources, is stealing jobs from British citizens. They tend to look the other way when British citizens are moving to Spain or Germany etc. There is an element of truth. The labor UK is exporting are high-skilled Oxbridge educated while it is importing low skilled labor from Romania or Latvia. While Corbyn is hated by this group, they have a working relationship with Corbyn. Corbyn also cannot offend them
The latter is a different animal. They are educated. They are the youth who saw that the railroads were sold and the money appropriated to fight lost wars in the Middle East. [Money is, after all, a “plug compatible module”]. They are the youth who sees the financial sector taking over the economy and colleagues moving to Germany or Spain or France for work. They are the people who are repulsed by the racism and Islamophobia of the Tories. These are the people who want a more integrated and less insular Britain.
For a variety of reasons, Corbyn is their God. At least for now! Corbyn too cannot offend them.
It is not an easy choice to make!
6
There are a lot of us who aren’t Labour members and see the many flaws in Corbyn but would still vote for him specifically because he is Not-A-Tory. This is not due to simple party politics, this is a visceral loathing of conservative ideology and a will to vote for whoever is likelier to smash them to pieces electorally. Currently that is Labour.
Sure, if the Lib Dem’s ever crawl out of the hole they dug for themselves in coalition, then maybe they’d get my support. But probably not, as some things are hard to forgive and forget. Maybe the Greens, hopeless but at least the conscientious choice - assuming Labour vanish, anyway.
Labour remainers potentially can switch to the Tories when they dump May and get a Brexit leader. That is Corbyn’s risk and well founded fear.
An old man without any ideas...just against everything...another idiot from the left...
16
No article about this man should be written that doesn't mention he is a vicious anti-Semite.
28
Left out of this puffery for dear old Jeremy are these inconvenient facts: his "shadow" Chancellor of the Exchequer (as they call the opposition proposed office holder in the UK) is an undisguised unapologetic Marxist favoring nationalization of vast segments of British institutions. Corbyn himself was a back-bench oddity in his own party for two and a half decades, and loathed Blair/Brown's successful and more moderate New Labor.
Corbyn refuses to do anything to solve this crisis as it might anger all of the newly enfranchised members of his party brought in to swell the hard left ranks. Moderates were shown the door. Persons who love Venezuela's various dictators, the Castro brothers, and any Marxist movement in Latin America past or present. Persons who find all sorts of excuses to back Middle east groups uniformly labeled terrorist.
This student 1980 radical who never evolved is going to save the UK? Perhaps, but I'd not lay any wager on it even if Britain is a wagering society.
16
@Unworthy Servant
Jeremy represents the many, not the few. If that means we need to return to a classical socialist government, so be it. Because the today's US and British fascist governments only represent the few.
Eat the rich!
1
Does Corbyn have a plan? All I've heard or seen have been sneers and digs at Teresa May. How is it even possible that nobody knows what Corbyn thinks should be done at this late stage? He doesn't appear to be much good in terms of achieving anything but vehemently criticizing those who ate at least trying to deal with the situation. If you do get power, Mr. Corbyn, then what?
32
@jb
Then you'll find out what his plan is. Why should he provide the Tories with any ideas when they have no viable ideas themselves.
Labour. For the many. Not the few.
Eat the rich!
1
@BKWANAB, I'm a liberal too. But no, telling people they'll find out your plans only after you're in power is not acceptable. Trying through hiding from cover to avoid rebuttal or counter arguments while casting stones at others' efforts is low, whoever you are. And we do know that much about Corbyn.
3
Corbyn needs to do what the significant majority of his party wants: support a second referendum.
24
@Andrew
I believe he will, when it's Labour's best option. It isn't yet.
2
The options with the most support from Labour are a 2nd referendum which this article says 1/3 of Labour voters support (only 1/5th support Brexit). These seem like the important statistics, buried halfway through the story, and they make one wonder why Corbyn hasn't supported a 2nd referendum or as soft a Brexit as possible.
In addition, with the way Britain has bungled their exit from the EU, the close Brexit vote would be likely to come down on the other side - Remain - if held today. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/06/britons-would-now-vote-to-stay-in-eu-want-second-referendum---poll.html
Even more reason to question the previous vote: the will of the people in 2016 was manipulated by dishonest campaigning by the pro-Brexiters, funded by millions from shady groups, including 5 of the UK's richest businessmen (link below) and there is suspicion that Russia interfered with that election too. There is no good reason to hold up the 2016 vote as the informed will of the people, even in 2016, but especially not now that they have seen the truth about the consequences of Brexit.
Labour has a clear path, but for some reason Corbyn is standing in the way of it.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-leave-eu-campaign-arron-banks-jeremy-hosking-five-uk-richest-businessmen-peter-hargreaves-a7699046.html
14
60% of Labour electorates voted Leave!
Sleepwalkers.
Blair, May, Corbyn, Merkel, Tusk and the money laundering guy from Luxembourg.
If any were modestly competent, there would be no Bexit.
4
@Tom What was Merkel supposed to do? The EU gave the UK a bunch of special favors and they still weren't happy. There is nothing Merkel could have done to stop the UK from voting to leave, she has zero power over their government or people.
4
Corbyn is a brexiteer. He’s just as anti-trade, xenophobic, and isolationist as Bernie is. Both naively think that if only we could go back to some mythical utopian time when the steel mills were working, all would be well.
Simplistic sloganeering and pandering to white men....I guess that’s Farange, Johnson, and Trump too, on the other side of the political aisle. They are all nasty dinosaurs.
23
@Lisa Wait... wasn't Bernie super liberal on immigration? And pushed a bunch of policies that helped minorities? Now, I know it sounds crazy, but people who support diversity and immigration tend to not be xenophobic or isolationist. Crazy I l know.
2
If Labour wasn't run by a raving anti-Semite, they might have a chance of gaining power.
19
Does Corbyn have a Brexit plan, full detail? If so, I sure haven't seen it. Everyone seems to know what they DON'T want.
9
Isn’t amazing that Mr. Corbin would be the next PM in the UK, and it would not be the end of the world. In the USA is another thing, for some Americans hateful of the left, they firmly believe it could destroy the USA. I believe the right wing are racist and classist, although they call themselves Christian, they entirely are against the basic teaching of Jesus.
13
@RBR
Well, there's your problem. The US people continue to ignore their Constitution when it does not suit them. They can't separate Church and State. especially the religious bigots that do not seek a God. They seek wealth and power over the people. The US has yet to progress beyond the Reformation.
I don't need a God fearing person in the White House. I need a serious pragmatist that will represent the entire US population. For the many. Not the few.
3
With 7 Billion folks on this planet, we need to come together - not drift off onto Planet B - British and US Republican party’s dreams. Humanity’s planet is small globe, mostly covered in water - and the land is slowly disappearing do to burning carbon.
For the British, Simplistically, suspending Brexit, staying inside is an easy option. One can enhance border security; immigration concerns can be dealt with in an adult way in line with the Schengen agreement.
Taking advantage of the Brexit leave vote, we should allow N. Ireland to stay as a part of Eire - then no border backstop needed. The Irish voted to stay! Scotland voted to stay in Britain because this would jeopardize their EU membership, and then to stay in Europe - they should now be allowed to just that!
Having a new referendum on staying or leaving - what are folks voting for - Hard Chaotic Brexit - Remaining because they will mostly be better off? Or Mrs May’s negotiated plan loved by none?
4
With the rise of Russia, a fractionalized Europe is not a good idea, and again, Britain will be an island all alone and surrounded by who?
17
Seems obvious that Theresa May is Jeremy Corbin's best frenemy, indispensable to his preferred outcome, which is fully indifferent to what happens on March 29 so long as he personally is not responsible for it. He can then ride to the rescue like Alice's White Knight, antique Fabian solutions dangling from his saddle, to save the nation. He is nothing but perturbed at the prospect of actually governing through any Brexit, or any decision to postpone or revoke the Article 50 process.
20
Corbyn only wants to throw rocks, he knows he can’t govern.
25
I do not think the issue is black & white: either pro v anti immigration
The way to pose problems/solutions is to determine where they sit in regard to principles of fairness, reasonableness and stability/Security
In the US the median wage has been flat since 1972 even tho the GNP has gone up 150%: in the 30 years prior to that both GNP & median wage went up 100% in lockstep. The former is neither reasonable nor fair nor stable; the latter was on all points
Since some worker’s wages have gone up (healthcare & tech), that means everyone elses declined. This is inherently unsustainable w/out help by elites from both parties.
Immigration played a part. During Obama year over 10 million net new jobs were created. At the same time America allowed in LEGALLY 10 million immigrants. At least some of them need jobs. The net affect is to undermine wages so that many people taken down by the Great Recession never recovered. Those people cast their vote with Trump
They are willing to undermine if not destroy the American deal because their lives have been undermined if not destroyed.
If Trump ruins things for the rest of the country their reaction will b “welcome to the club”
So immigration has to be adressed & it should be significantly restricted. That doesn’t mean eliminated nor purposely immoral or inhuman
For Corbyn: leaving the EU will drive up xaction cost & wipe out millions of jobs. Staying in the EU & establishing a status of constricted immigration should be possible
4
I've always hoped for a strong labour party here in the U.S.
Unions are gathering more steam as workers are crushed by
sky rocketing greed and thankfully Bernie Sanders has
educated millenials as to what the possibilities are .
Jeremy Corbyn delivers the message more powerfully
than Sanders .That said , as the song goes " the times they
are a changing ".
hopefully each of them will bring forth a more fair and equal version of capitalism . Who can tell ?
8
@JLANEYRIE
Bernie Sanders has educated millenials as to what the possibilities - we all not that unions existed and we all know that aside from providing great benefits to works they also committed a lot of errors such as allowing incompetent works to continue in their jobs, being unresponsive to global changes.
How is Jeremy Corbyn going to pay for his resolution of the hateful and damaging austerity, with the UK adrift from the EU and with little economic dynamic strength and much social decay? No way.
Then, philosophically, in the British system of government, does the leader of the opposition stand in representation of his or her party, in which case Corbyn must go for a second referendum and win a remain vote, the will of 78% of Labour voters? Or can he act as an individual politician, in which case he can do as he has done, equivocate until others fail so he can succeed with his far-left fantasy, a somewhat dishonorable path?
Corbyn and May, what a pair! The world's last-but-one empire, originator of our universal language, English, brought to its knees, while the successor empire flounders as its leader chomps Big Macs and acts out.
But all this, too, will pass.
11
We can be thankful that when the Lisbon Treaty was enacted, at least a process, albeit a confusing one like Brexit, is preferable to our own civil war in the U.S.
During 1861-65, the U.S. lost nearly 700,000 people in a war that finally determined that no person could legally own another and that no state could legally leave the union.
While the debate over Brexit is often uncivil, the process in the E.U. at least allows a peaceful resolution when a country decides to leave it.
4
@JT FLORIDA
Faint praise indeed!!
3
Corbyn is anti-EU, while May would prefer staying in. Both "lead" parties where their majorities disagree with them. May wants the best thing that isn't the EU or No-Deal. Corbyn just wants may to fail.
May at least wants nominally the good of her country. Corbyn wants political advantage which is why the only thing Corbyn will commit to is being anti-May.
England and Northern Ireland deserve a no-deal leaving. If I were the EU. I would let them go, and make them beg to get back in later with none of the exceptions the UK currently gets under EU law.
Wales and Scotland really should consider independence. The majority of the English don't like you, nor care for your interests. Like with the Scottish referendum where the defense of Union was part of a greater Europe. It really was only local domination by a racist conservative England.
9
@Edward Brennan:
I recall during the last general election in the UK, Cameron openly actively and vocally campaigned on the idea that voting Labor was an existential threat to the United Kingdom.
So he got elected, issued the referendum, and if followed through, a majority in Scotland will surely want to be part of the EU, and so that could lead to the end of the UK.
So it turns out, voting for Cameron and electing a new Tory government was an existential threat to the UK. Attaboy Cammy.
If the UK leaves, transaction cost between England and millions of customers in Ireland and on the continent, as well as suppliers will skyrocket. That means radically fewer transactions. It is a golden rule of thumb that productivity & wealth are a function of transactions. So we can expect a huge decline in GNP in the UK.
Meanwhile firms trying to stay in English speaking area but get around the transaction cost will relocate to Ireland.
Most of the highly productive automotive jobs in the UK are there because the Japanese universally study English so doing business in England to get access to the EU market lowered their transaction cost. Now those factories will be cut off from continental suppliers & customers.
What they are contemplating is insane.
There is more wiggle room that comes from staying in and working with other member countries to establish a political block wanting to create a status of constricted immigration inside the EU.
Ah, so much for retiring in Spain, eh.
6
@Edward Brennan
Actually, Northern Ireland voted Remain, and Wales voted Leave. Now that that people have learned how dire the consequences of Brexit would be, all bets would be off if Brexit became a fact; Scotland, NI and perhaps Wales would probably leave the UK and rejoin the EU, leaving England isolated both from them and from Europe. However, I wouldn't rule out renewed factional troubles in NI.
2
All right Corbyn, are you just a clever game-player and triangulator?
1
@srwdm
If he said yes, would you believe him or would he be playing games? If he said no...?
More seriously, I think he's far less complex than he's being painted here. He isn't trying to play 3D chess; he is simply something that we don't see much of anymore: a person with deeply held convictions that drive his political actions. Based on his beliefs, as the article states, his actions make simple sense.
That being said, I do wonder what role Putin and his cronies are playing in this, because Corbyn's actions at this time do appear to amplify the chaos that is so valued by Moscow.
4
Thanks a lot NYT for this sharp analysis. Haven't read anything similar in British or European newspapers.
8
One reason why Brexit is deadlocked is that Corbyn as PM represents absolutely the worst case scenario for a lot of people including many past Labour leaders like Tony Blair and the Miliband brothers.
This is a man who:
1. Who wishes to eliminate UKs nuclear deterrent.
2. Who is openly hostile to the US and NATO.
3. Who is a pacifist who would not stand up to the likes of Assad and Putin.
4. Who declined to condemn Maduro.
5. Who would not commit the Labour Party to accept a widely accepted definition of anti-Semitism until he was arm twisted into accepting it. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/27/opinion/jeremy-corbyn-anti-semitism-labour-britain.html
6. Who admitted to being present at a wreath laying ceremony in honor of a terrorist involved in the killing of Israeli athletes in Munich. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/aug/13/jeremy-corbyn-not-involved-munich-olympics-massacre-wreath-laying
The list goes on but even if one were to ignore the list above, Corbyn’s Indecisive vacillation has put of many in his own camp.
Yes the type of Brexit may depend on his position but I don’t think he has an indentifiable position on the matter.
26
A second referendum can only be justified by a change in circumstances. Most of the blue collar workers voted for Brexit because of the heavy amount of Eastern European immigration since 2004. Now, the numbers are rapidly diminishing (net migration has probably gone negative in the last few months, though Britain's Office of National Statistics only publishes year on year numbers). The reason is demographics (birth rates dropped drastically 25 years ago) and economic convergence. Therefore, Brexit is now pointless, and must be put to another vote.
3
Corbyn is a disaster and elevating him to PM would a horrific mistake.
24
@BMD
As compared to what? When confusion is the only alternative, go a different way.
1
Because everything is just perfect right now, right?
2
Corbyn is paralyzed politically.
TWO no confidence votes in two months and May is still at the wheel. That's enough proof that a majority of non-Labour MP's aren't going to get on board with him. They'd rather cling to the deck of a sinking ship.
14
@matty
Your comment makes no sense. The failure of the vote has to do with the fact that none of the Tories broke with their party whip, and they have a majority with DUP support. The result tells us nothing about the Labour party.
6
Sigh. No. There was one VONC in the Leader from the Conservative Party, which was an internal matter for Tory MPs, and one VONC in the Government, which we had tonight.
The lesson is that a large number within the Tory party hates her, but that the party unites over which party should be in power.
5
@Julian
Labour hasn't the power, or the will to power.
And there are enough English (and Welsh) philistines left to support them till they've got nothing left.
See below:
.....but that the party unites over which party should be in power.
The Ulster Unionists have no business dictating UK power from their provincial nest in Belfast.
I have a shocking suggestion for Mr. Corbyn that is to do the right thing for England as push for a second referendum.
It may not be the right thing for his party but then again it might be.
I can understand the urgency of Labor to oust the Tories whose austerity policies after 2008 have hollowed out the NHS, frayed the safety net, plunged more people into proverty and cut spending for education to the bone.
But doing the right thing would show the general public the contrast between them and the Tories who like to pretend they are living in the England of Downtown Abbey.
It might be fantasy but an England returning to the EU might just be able to reform and remove some of the annoying EU policies.
20
@Edward Blau England? What about Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland?
The usual array of ill-informed centrist drivel from the smug, aloof, so-called “liberal” NYT readers here. Bemoaning the conservatism in their own country, groping about their poor healthcare and uncaring government, while apparently not recognising a party that will fund the NHS properly and ensure the public are prioritised over the interests of bankers and business. Come over and sample austerity in the inner city, then maybe you’ll think again. Meanwhile, enjoy being exploited by your Washington Masters, you pitiful peasants.
11
Thanks for sharing! Do you feel better now?
10
A little, thankyou.
Jeremy Corbyn is "soft-spoke"? Does the writer know who Corbyn is?
12
@FusteldeCoulanges Yeah, I had a hard time finishing the article after reading that description of Corbyn, too. He's a poisonous little man.
“Soft-spoken outsider”? Are you kidding? Did the author of this article listen to the same blustery call for a “no confidence “ vote from the grizzled and dyspeptic Corbyn that I did? “Outsider”? He’s been in Parliament since the 90s so taking about “fake news”...
21
@ManhattanWilliam since the 90s? ))) Try 1983
8
I don't pretend to be an expert on Brexit, but this seems to make good sense.
And kudos for a journalist using the word "neoliberal" without scare quotes or some other dismissive qualifier.
14
“Brexit is actually a relatively small issue compared to the social issues facing this country,” said Callum Cant, a Labour member and Corbyn backer. “Regardless of people’s position on the E.U., we need to fight together for a larger project of social transformation.”
There would be no "larger project of social transformation", because if Britain crashes out of the EU, there will be no money.
47
@angryexpat I completely agree with you - that quote made me see red.
I'd like to see him try to say Brexit is a relatively small issue if the country goes into a depression with 6.5% inflation, and unemployment shoots up to 7.5% as the Bank of England forecasted - on top of decades of already strained social services. Good luck getting their beautiful social transformation then; they'll be up to their eyeballs just putting out fires.
19
If he is a true statesman with the best interests of the country in mind, Corbyn will call a referendum for the British people to make their voices heard, free of Russian interference.
20
@Casey Penk I am afraid this is a very Americanmedia-informed read of this. The only "Russian interference" on the ground out in Brexit coutry was the enormous and very sharp unmanaged influx of Russian-speaking immigrants from the former Soviet bloc countries newly admitted to the EU in 2004 and 2008. Ironically it was the anti-Russian sentiment behind EU enlargement that had created this wave, that then scared the British working class into Brexit.
1
@Olga, really? Please tell us which Russian speaking countries have joined the EU in 2004?
@Olga Just not true, comrade. There was plenty of documented Russian support for the Brexit campaign. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/29/world/europe/russia-britain-brexit-arron-banks.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_Brexit_referendum
And migration from former Soviet Bloc countries, while at first large, has withered away.
3
Corbyn's hands-off stance is working and he should stay the course. He gains nothing by choosing one of bad options. He should let May's government crumble so Labour can take power, which is all that matters. Brexit is a very minor issue compared to the need to turn the page on neoliberalism and authoritarianism and stage the comeback of democratic socialism.
28
@Michael
I profoundly disagree. Labour taking power is not all that matters. It is exactly the opposite. This crisis is much larger than which party takes power in the next Parliament - Brexit is fast becoming an existential emergency for the UK, and short of a second referendum in order to clarify things, both Labour and the Conservatives will have to get together to forge a way forward.
34
@Rick Morris
True, Brexit is serious, but Britain has handled emergencies much more existential. What I meant is the differences between Brexit outcomes are minor compared to the medium-term reckoning which is coming to the European project.
The currency union without fiscal union, the immigration rules which provide a ready-made scapegoat for authoritarians, and the pro-German austerity regime are all doomed to failure.
Corbyn must help lead this reformation. I agree with you that Labour and Conservatives must forge a way together - but there are plenty of those conservatives within Labour. The more Corbynites become the strongest extant force, the more Conservatives and Labour conservatives are forced to work with them.
6
This “hands off” approach is what I resent in opposition politics: Let somebody else do the “pushing and shoving”, criticize all day, and hope the government fails. How noble! One more for the history books...
13
The last two years have been a time of bluff-calling. In the UK Boris & co were unable to negotiate a something-for-nothing Brexit from the EU. In the US Trump's GOP have had all the levers of power but health care costs continue to rise as does inequality. In case there was any doubt, tax cuts are not paying for themselves.
Now we can get real.
28
You missed the part where he said, a couple of weeks ago, that he would follow through with Brexit? It seems like the kind of thing you should have mentioned here.
21
Corbyn has a long history of hanging around with anti-Semites and supporting them. This has led to much of Labour's traditional Jewish base dissociating itself from him.
He may be a nice guy but like Trump he has enabled haters to come out of the woodwork.
Rep King is being rightly called out as a racist. When will the left do the same with its anti-Semitic elements?
26
@simon sez
It is a moral imperative that all of us fight Anti Semitism. However, the greater national interests of Israel and the wholesomeness of the larger Jewish nation demands that one does not conflate criticism of the policies of the hardline Netanyahu’s government, the Likud coalition government which includes settler parties advocating ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians, with Anti-Semitism.
Jeremy Corbyn’s staunch support of the Palestinian rights to self-determination is not anti-Semitism; nor is his opposition to the anti- Palestinian policies of the hardline Netanyahu’s government anti-Semitic. To wit: recently Corbyne condemned Israeli government’s killing of 27 innocent Palestinian protesting Israel’s collective punishment of Palestinians on the border of Gaza. Corbyn opposed British sales of weapons to Israel if and when used against Gaza on the ground that it is a violation of international law, the Geneva convention of 1899 and 1907 Importantly, his critique was nearly identical to the editorial position of Harratz, the major liberal paper in Israel. What is Anti-Semitic about the Geneva Conventions?
It is probable that Corbyn may end up as the next prime minister of UK, if Brexit fails. Some members of AIPAC and Republican supporters of Israel are making a grave mistake when they accuse the leader of a major UK party representing millions of UK citizens of Anti-Semitism.
16
@Jim Bob
Claims about Corbyn's anti-semitism have nothing to do with his support for the Geneva conventions. There are plenty of British politicians who are openly critical of Israel's policies in Palestine. There's a more extensive history of the issues outlined in this BBC article: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45030552
4
@Jim Bob So you are saying that, because some of Corbyn's anti-Israel remarks are not anti-Semitic, he should get a pass for his other anti-Semitic remarks and actions? Not too logical. Some criticisms of Israel I would even agree with. However, that does not make his anti-Semitic actions, his support of terrorists (both the Munich Olympic murderers and Hamas), and his failure to criticize other's anti-Semitic comments at events he has attended any less heinous. And for some reason, terrorist murders of Israeli children are not worthy of Corbyn's obsessive focus on Israel. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/27/opinion/jeremy-corbyn-anti-semitism-labour-britain.html
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It surprises me that nobody has suggested that Russia's involvement in the first Brexit vote has not received more comment. If it's outcome was more a matter of Putin's Plan to destroy the EU than an expression of the will of the British people, it would seem to me that, by itself would be justification for calling for another vote. Invasion via Social Media is no less destructive than "conventional" warfare because it captures the mind, and after that, the body (whether individual or corporate) mindlessly follows.
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Bring us proof that Russian interference was a bigger influence than decades of media and political Europhobia coupled with the casual disdain vast numbers of British treat Europe with. Then, if after that you still believe Russia is to blame, then bring proof that it was enough to sway millions into voting the way they did.
Otherwise, enough of “it woz Russia” and face the unpalatable fact that Brexit is a British problem - yes, based on decades of defunct public attitudes or right-wing media and politicians spinning anti-EU disinformation, but a homegrown issue nonetheless.
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@Mat
Brexit is a British problem, yes, but Putin can see that too and no doubt acted based upon that fact. We shouldn't just blame Russia, but if laws were broken that fact could be used to invalidate the vote... although it is a bit late now.
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Centrist foamers and corporate hacks in the vein of Beto O Rourke, except British, regularly demand a “Mueller Style investigation,” and pine for a political party like the Democrats to replace Labour. But as an American I would sacrifice half if not more of the Dem seats if the rest adopted Corbyn-like policies, the Democrats focus on relitigating the past, stoking neoconservatism and feeding greedy donors and Wall Street goblins over proposing socialism. I’d say Corbyn is doing a fantastic job.
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It is pretty obvious that he goes with the soft Brexit deal, getting to point that UK is out of EU (and getting that flag off the pole), gets UK out of European Parliament while still preserving many of the items his party wants from EU membership. It took awhile to get here, but it could only happen after the Tory hard core did its failed coup and in process gave PM May a 12 month contract. Then she can go to Labor and make a deal.
Brits have forgotten what the Labour party did before Thatcher? The economy was in shambles, British cars, motorcycles,and planes were of abysmal quality because of union dictates. Coal mining was so inefficient it was cheaper to sent imported coal to Newcastle.
Seems after a generation or 2 people forget the inevitable decline in wealth in all segments if society when leftists convince voters they can do better.
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Boring, outdated waffle. You can not compare the global economic environment of the 70’s with that today, and a left-wing government of the 21st Century will not just push the country into a time machine but will rather suit this age. Honestly, this argument is so, so tired and worn out.
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You know we did have one vote, and as we thought, one time, in June 1975, when the British people voted to STAY in the EU (or Common Market, as everyone called it then.) I was 19 when I voted stay, I've never changed my mind since, even though on occasion the EU has been frustrating. People who complain that 'The people have spoken" and we can't have a second vote, forget that 2016 actually WAS the second vote. So why not a third? Corbyn needs to get down off the fence and choose a side.
I didn't vote this time because I no longer live in the UK (although I still have a British passport) and I didn't feel that I had the moral right to take part in a referendum in a country in which I no longer pay taxes. But I have siblings there, and everyone is uniformly horrified at the prospect of Brexit, deal or no deal.
There is no such thing as a perfect system of government, what we have is probably the best of the available options. The EU may block some left wing policies but arguably it also blocks some right wing ones, maintaining a middling (muddling?) sort of course; peace in Europe has been mostly maintained, prosperity has mostly risen (yeah I know it's uneven), food production is stable, most people have health care, and I think the Little Englanders who see some kind of return to colonial glory days, have taken cynical advantage of people left behind by the economy.
And all this distracts from the #1 issue - the environment. Now that really IS an existential threat.
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@essexgirl1955
I am also a UK citizen living in the US, and we weren't allowed to vote in the referendum. Nor were (more importantly) UK citizens living in Europe. Had they done so, the Remain side might have squeaked a victory.
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The Common Market was a very different construct than the EU. You voted for the Common Market. You were never given an opportunity to vote on the EU.
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@Skippy
And the reason was because the governments of their day knew they would get a dusty reply. I think many of the electorate fail to understand that a 'representative' of the constituency is not the same as a 'delegate'. Most MPs are trying to do what they consider is best for their constituents (though some are obviously playing politics - JC?) and are voting against their constituents' wishes. Needless to say this is leading to increasing cynicism about MPs' motives. So, a third referendum could leave us in exactly the same place. And I shudder to think what the result of a General Election could be. The democratic deficit would be enormous with MPs elected on very low turnouts.
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So much of the trouble in Europe today comes down to one simple issue.
Neo-Liberalism. The EU ministers decided years ago that a fundamentalist free-market agenda was their mandate. They just didn't ask anyone.
Imagine if they had decided instead to support and expand the social-welfare model, (which the Europeans are justly proud of) and the cultural and political individuality of the member nations (the Swiss model).
But what they gave Europe was a bad idea from back in the days of Disco; a leg up for the wealthy and austerity for everyone else.
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Each set of philosophies has its strengths and weaknesses. Each works it certain climates/contexts. It's the only my solution mentality that doesn't work. The stagnant economy of the 70s greatly benefited from increased competition of the classic model. The progressive policies of Roosevelt and his successors greatly improved the competitiveness of our work force and improved living standards. It also grew the economy by unleashing consumerism.
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@Mike,
Ah, but this philosophy, at this time, hasn't worked. Sure, it's done wonders for high end real estate. And stocks are way up. But most families are poorer than they were, inequality is through the roof, and the level of political/social anger is getting dangerous.
That's no way to run a civilization.
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Mr. Corbyn's play is straightforward: any Brexit that can be blamed on his political rivals.
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If only Corbyn would realize that the guy in the mirror is the only reason that Theresa May is still in power.
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Sounds like a political fight along the lines of “Make Britain Great (Britain) Again” MBGA.
Just one democracy's version of political sloganeering, and authoritarian decision-making, with no common-sense political thinking.
US leaders should learn some sort of lesson from our cousin’s inept governmental leadership regarding international relations.
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Corbyn hasn't a clue. He wants to stay in the customs union and be, as many of the Brits see it, a "rule taker," that is having to follow EU rules but having no say in their construction. Most of the Conservative Party, and Labor too I think, members will have none of that. His party members, to which he gives a ton of lip service, want a new referendum with the likely result of remain.
It's time for leadership in the Labor party to be turned over to Keir Starmer, (Shadow Brexit Secretary) who expresses the will of the Laborites and whose stand has a fighting chance of success.
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Party and his own career before country.
Please exit stage left Mr Corbyn.
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In his career, Corbyn has had no real executive responsibility. He has a flair for marching through the streets protesting the actions of those who do, leading merry bands of agitators. His routine carries much more meaning when power resides in London, rather than Brussels, which is why he supports Brexit.
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The real problem is that Corbyn is not a true leader. Rather than someone who triangulates for political advantage, he could easily become the next Prime Minister with an example of true leadership. What he could have done this over the past few years is hold town meetings in pro Brexit areas of the country wearing his socialist hat. He could listen to the concerns of people who have been displaced in the economy and explain that what they really need is more investment in their community rather than the austerity the Tories gave them. He could point out that attacking the problems caused by EU membership in some regions can be addressed with specific remedies rather than a chaotic exit from the EU which will aggravate rather than help. His shadow government could come up with a set of policy proposals based on the feedback form the town meetings. If done well it would allow him to position himself as a solution to Britain’s problems rather than just another political infighter when May crashed like she did yesterday. Unfortunately, it would require political and leadership skills that he does not have. Instead he has immersed himself in political maneuvering and controversy over anti Semitic comments. The only adult in the room in Britain seems to be Nicola Sturgeon who unfortunately is not in any position to take on a national leadership role.
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@JS
Absolutely. The SNP is the best party of government in the UK at the moment. England should become South Scotland and ask Edinburgh to take the lead.
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@JS
I was with you all the way until you got to Nicola Sturgeon.
The SNP tactics in the Scottish referendum were akin to the worst intimidation I have ever witnessed.
They target, attack and overwhelm any who dare speak against them.
I actually think trump learned a lot from them as they are masters of the alternate fact and repeating falsehoods until people believe they are true.
A tactic her and Salmond honed when they were excluded from normal life at university because of their weirdness.
I think the inclination of the British to disconnect from the central banking regime and control their own borders is a good one.
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@mr. mxyzptlk - Unless you live in Northern Ireland, where you might actually have a physical border at the end of the street. Taking the country back 30 years to a time no one wants to revisit. Apparently, no one outside Northern Ireland gave that much thought when they voted for Brexit. I suspect that if Brexit goes through, it will ultimately lead to the break up of the UK.
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@mr. mxyzptlk
Britain is already disconnected from the Central Bank. It already had control over its own borders.
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It’s ironic that some Britons actually place their financial/security/cultural hopes in Corbyn and Labour.
That’s the Party (and philosophy) that Margaret Thatcher faced when she inherited a moribund economy, compliments of Labour.
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@David G.
Yes. Corbyn is explicitly attempting to undo all the damage done since the Thatcher years. Now he might inherit a post-Brexit destroyed economy, compliments of the incompetent Tories. Corbyn might well be what Britain deserves right now, not a leader we might have wanted had there been good government in recent years, but a corrective to a decade of incompetence.
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Corbyn, for all his faults, isn’t wrong about the EU. The French Socialist Party promised a “social Europe” (in the European definition of social) when Delors was president of the Commission and Thatcher PM in Britain, and the Party will likely run on a platform of a “social Europe” in the coming election in May, in 2019.
Europe isn’t social. For a variety of reasons, mistakes, accommodations, and oftentimes British sabotage, Europe isn’t social. It is more often than not a bankers’ club than a workers’ paradise.
There are a plethora of EU directives, rules, and even Treaty provisions that make a social Europe quasi-impossible. Does that mean that life outside of the Union will be better? No. Sometimes life is like that, with no perfect outcome anywhere in sight.
It is also ironic that Britain, who has done the most to make the modern EU what it is and weaken any centralized social protections, is also the one who wants to leave due to working class voters feeling abandoned (mostly a national issue, and when a European issue, the fault of Britain anyway).
The modern EU, loathed by so many in the UK, exists as it does due to the UK.
Anyway, I would personally support Brexit come what may (as I said, Britain has rarely had the Union’s best interests at heart); and I would be content with no Brexit too, as Corbyn’s Labour’s robustness would be a welcome boost (and left-wing push) to the Party of European Socialists in parliament, which is headed for historic losses.
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Hard though it is to hear, given the astonished panic and shock about the vote in Parliament, but Brexit is only a minor issue for many people in Britain. Yes, a hard Brexit might damage the economy, but for large chunks of the country the economy has never recovered from the 2008 recession. The Brexit vote was caused as much by the sense of dispossession and abandonment by people across the country's rustbelt as by jingoistic dreams of recreating Britain's imperial past. Corbyn is one of the few politicians who keeps his eyes on that fact, and he seems to be playing the long game.
So let's see what happens. Corbyn does not play the role of Leader of the Opposition as he is expected to do, and he is no doubt frustrating many in his own party and across the country who feel sure that there should be a second referendum, or who just want to cancel Article 50 and stay in the EU. Yet those folks under-appreciate how that would be seen as a bitter betrayal, and would probably lead to a boycott of any "People's Vote", stripping it of legitimacy. I think Corbyn sees that.
Personally, I think the 2016 vote should never have happened and Cameron deserves to live in infamy and shame, but it did. For the sake of democracy, it might be best to let the Conservatives utterly fail, so that a resurgent progressive force can re-make UK politics and, more importantly, can rebuilt British society.
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@Julian A leader is supposed to LEAD, Corbyn is not a leader and will lose the next election no matter what the Brexit outcome if he prevaricates as usual
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@Michael Kelly
Do you mean procrastinates? There is quite a difference!
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@Michael Kelly
Absolutely! Corbyn is not a leading as you might want him to lead. He might well lose a general election, and goodness knows what might happen. He is playing a long game, but he might not win it. Given the circumstances, though, even if he lost the election, the country couldn't be in a worse situation than it is in now. I would much prefer Tom Watson (who just gave a brilliant speech) or Yvette Cooper, or Kier Starmer, and one of them will probably replace Corbyn if the political knives come out. Yet the UK is in complete crisis, and Corbyn clearly has a plan that makes sense given his priorities .
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This article is almost completely about strategizing in politics — apart from Collum Cant, there were no questions about what’s in the best interests of the UK and its people. This may be a deliberate focus of this piece, but political strategizing without regard for consequences has been a feature of Brexit from the beginning. Maybe it’s time to try something different.
Labour MP David Lammy recently said that the UK is suffering from a crisis of leadership in its hour of need. He’s exactly right.
And for what it’s worth, so is the Republican Party.
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If this hatemonger becomes PM watch as thousands of British Jews become Israelis and the urgent necessity of Zionism and Israel becomes self-evident once again.
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@TMDJS
Yawn. Corbyn is not an anti-semite. He is pro-Palestinian. One of the many misfortunes of our times is that so many people insist that the two are the same.
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Unless you've had in the sand for a year or two you'd know that Corbyn is a cheerleader for Hamas, Hezbollah, and Iran (his friends the terrorists). He's said blatantly antisemitic things in public, backed antisemitism in his party and whitewashed a report to investigate this problem. He's not just "pro-Palestinian" he's demonized the state of Israel. That is antisemitism, He's a disaster.
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@Charles Marshall He is most definitely an anti-semite and as much has said so himself -- one only has to reference his comments about British "zionists" not being able to appreciate British irony, let alone his persistent support for those like Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran and other entities that have sworn violence towards Israeli Jews, and his making excuses for other anti-semites in the Labour Party. Ask anyone in the mainstream Jewish community in Britain (many of whom are leaving your country as a results of Corbyn ascendancy) and you will understand that the extent to which Jews are fearful of him.
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Yes the EU is a bankers club with City bankers being the worst offenders. So Jeremy, please start putting your own house in order, so the rest of Europe has more of a chance to follow suit.
It‘s mainly been the City‘s bankers that have been blocking financial regulation of the sector. Whenever other EU countries tried to do something meaningful, like establishing a capital gains tax for instance, the Brits vowed to not follow.
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I still cannot understand why and how Britain would end their longstanding relationship with the EU, based on a narrow public referendum. A two point shift would have made a tie. Treaties (or their dissolution) take a two-thirds vote in our Senate. Surely something as drastic as the EU withdrawal should have merited similar standards. "First, do no harm" is one of the measures of the Hippocratic Oath. Perhaps politicians on both sides of the pond should be required to make a similar vow.
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@kingfisher1950 I think the current crisis shows that the referendum wasn't as definitive as you suggest. Only parliament can end EU membership, and whether/how that should happen are now the subject of debate.
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@AGS
kingfisher1950 says it was not definitive.
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@kingfisher1950
I agree with you that making a decision on whether Britain should leave the EU on the basis of a voter referendum was a bad idea. But the reality is, that referendum was held, and the voters voted to leave. As much as I would prefer that Britain "remain," it is fundamentally anti-democratic to contend now that the vote should be ignored. If Labor takes that course now, it could haunt them for years--as well it should.
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