This shutdown is selectively defined to serve Trump's political desires. Trump can fly to a campaign rally in Iraq or send the Homeland Security Secretary to Texas to show "concern" about the death of an immigrant child, but it can't accept flood insurance applications or help Mexico investigate a helicopter crash that killed a state governor and her predecessor. The FBI spokesman is there to answer questions about "emergencies" but can't answer questions about other activities. Government lawyers defending Trump policies say they're not allowed to work, while government lawyers who decide what's shut down or not are working. Treasury officials are out there pushing government debt. All this issue of government shutdowns is just a big game, and debt ceilings are another. It's a federal crime to spend government money without an appropriation, until they start indicting people you will know it's just more spin, spin, spin.
6
Democrats should push the counter-narrative that Donald Trump wants the shutdown to continue so as to delay the emoluments case and other criminal investigations being conducted by the SDNY and other courts.
19
Trump likes to use "surprise" as a major tactic for keeping us all off balance. Doing the unthinkable; regularly.
So? Time for us to adopt and adapt. I think it might put him off balance if-
First order of business- Democratically controlled House of Representatives: Impeachment of The President.
Really, folks. It's time.
17
Nancy needs to have at least one news story a day about the progressive agenda being stymied by Trump's shutdown.
7
In 1980, I was taught in geography class that the number one item imported into the District of Columbia was paper and the number one export was waste paper. The picture of the piles of boxes and the dumpster in the hallway of the Capitol building suggests that not much has changed since then. It is a glaring symbol of waste generation by the government.
Likewise, a wall on the border with Mexico, if constructed, would be the quintessential symbol of government waste. Oddly, the people who support it call themselves conservatives.
9
The Smithsonian, etc., will have to shut down if the money isn't approved by Jan. 2????
We operate this close to the bone???? That's VERY disturbing!!
4
What's a balanced Supreme Court worth? Give Trump the $5BN. In exchange for the next two SC nominations, to be picked by Bernie Sanders. Art of the Deal.
7
How many of you are or know someone who works for a government contractor? Or work directly for the government? Our family is dependent on the funding as our only source of income. While our president wants for nothing but a ridiculous wall between us and Mexico. Is he also gonna want a wall between us and Canada? How much will that cost?
Just pointing out how racist this wall between us and Mexico is. He campaigned that Mexico would pay for it, not us. This 5 billion comes from the taxpayer and the property owners in this country, many of whom work for the government.
Well our president is now holding US ALL HOSTAGE to his view and he has been one of the most corrupt presidents short of Nixon. His true nature is showing, the same one who is a corrupt landlord and racist. It’s pretty obvious if you just look at the fact record.
None of the GOP representatives or senators want to disagree with him for fear of reprisals. Let’s face it he’s turned on and fired anyone he could that didn’t agree with him. He thinks he’s the “Emporer” but he’s not the President of a totalitarian regime, or is he? No CEO could get away with the kind of retaliatory acts he’s been doing since he came to office. Now even bipartisan support can be had and Trump is pitching a tantrum, if I don’t get my wall I’m not gonna pay my own government.
Reminds me of an ancient Chinese proverb.
“When elephants fight, the grass suffers”.
Many of us are the grass, and we ARE SUFFERING!
11
The authors state "ceremony-soaked return to the speakership". Can we dispense with the snark. Where is this coming from anyway and it is irrelevant to the subject matter.
10
I know everyone wants to blame the President for the shutdown but let's look at the facts. No matter what the President has stated or what he said during the W.H. meeting with Pelosi and Schumer the shut down belongs to Congress. They did not send a spending bill to the President for his signature. If they had and he vetoed it then it would be his.
Now it has now become a power struggle between the President / Republicans and the Never Trump Democrats. Remember Obama was in favor of border security and so were the Democrats including Chuck Schumer but as soon as it became a rallying point of the Trump W.H. it became another anti Trump rallying cry of the Democrats.
The real sad thing about all of this is that these people actually get paid to run our government.
1
@Fred...To be exact, 26 Democratic Senators voted for the "fence" back in 2006. Among them Schumer, Clinton, Feinstein, Biden, Obama, Wyden. The final Senate vote was 80 "yea", 19 "nay". The Democratic flip-flop must have caused a lot of vertigo attacks.
@Fred this is what you call looking at facts?
5
@Fred - You seem to have missed the fact that Trump said he would be responsible for it.
10
there is no negotiating with a double-crossing liar like Trump. They need to go the override route. Not surprised to see cowardly republicans dumping the cleanup of this mess on the incoming democrats.
10
Why is the wall not a public works project along the lines of Hoover Dam, retraining new and displaced workers, and letting ancillary contacts to small businesses, while including a plan for economic development along its path?
That legislation--public works, job training, economic development, small business contracts--would win bipartisan support!
The truth is Trump wants the wall to fail, he wants blame and chaos--even when given the opportunity for real success.
4
A plan for economic development along its path? Seriously? The wall, if built, would destroy the economy along its path. What a monumental waste of public money.
5
The House should pass what the Senate passed earlier this month. It will be interesting to see how McConnell explains his opposition to something he supported not a month ago. If Trump wants to veto it, then the shutdown is all on him.
10
Trump said he would take responsibility for the shutdown, but then he blamed Democrats instead. How does one negotiate in good faith with someone who doesn't keep his word?
14
'Bone Spurs' Trump holding America hostage for a racist campaign promise. Sad and sickening that we have shown the world what fools we have become electing a habitual liar and huckster as our president. And even worse is the Republican congress who have placed their politics above the nation. For shame, for shame.
8
Trump obviously thinks if he shuts down the government he’s shutting down the Mueller and House investigations. Or at least delaying them.
7
The Democrats are right of not to negotiate with the quick-flipper Trump, as you write that there is "little incentive to negotiate with Mr. Trump after repeatedly reversing himself."
Of course because Trump's promise, Trump's word, is worthless. What the Democrats have to do is negotiate with Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter---as distasteful as it is to cater to these stupid. stubborn braggarts, whose heads are swollen, incapable of reasoned analysis because of self-conceit. But to have a successful deal, sometimes one must deal with the devil. Maybe slip Rush and Ann a bribe to smooth the negotiation.
There's no else to talk to.
4
I do not understand how Trump can sleep knowing he's forced thousands of people to lose their paychecks because he won't budge on this stupid border wall which the majority of Americans don't want. My heart breaks for those people while Trump sits in the White House, sacrificing NOTHING but continuing to throw temper tantrums. He makes me physically ill.
13
I'm pretty certain that the Democrats don't take control until Thursday. Unless the days have moved backwards.
3
President Trump can't get his priorities in the right order. The wall funding is not a priority right now.
When the new year begins in a few days, President Trump will have an acting chief of staff, an acting secretary of defense, an acting attorney general, an acting EPA administrator, no interior secretary, and no ambassador to the United Nations. His former campaign chairman, deputy campaign chairman, national security adviser and personal lawyer have all pleaded guilty to crimes. His campaign, his transition, his foundation and his business are all under investigation
12
I have a suggestion for a compromise. Congress should pass a bill that allows Trump to pay for the wall with his personal funds, and, as compensation, allows him to brand the wall as the "Trump Wall."
For a start in the branding process, he can use the T-R-U-M-P, in big letters, that have been removed from a number of residential buildings in Manhattan that have had their TRUMP branding removed.
Seems like a win-win to me!
8
4 Jan the US House convenes and{-
1. Revise IRS Code to remove deprecation (+all special tax breaks)(for real estate developers). Let Mr Trump pay for h[s Wall!
2. Replace IRS with an automatic tax on all electronic movement of money. No need to file a tax return. The tax rate would be set at a level to balance the budget and amortize the National Debt over 20 years.. Adjustable every 6 months. All bank deposits would be taxed. No more payroll withholding. Set a household Poverty Level for each person in a household. All cash deposits taxed. Cash crossing borders taxed. Cash smuggling greater than $1000 forfeit
100%.
This is the age of computers - it can be dine,
3. Many years ago Sen Monahan (NY) proposed giving each newborn a $500 Federal Trust Fund. In 60 years there would no longer need social Security.
2
Our government cannot function because Mr. Trump cannot lead. There is nothing more to see here.
78
@Patrick Stevens. No, there's a lot more to see here. And it's all bad, horrid sickening.
6
Regarding the “wall:” have any of these Republicans heard of El Chapo?
3
An undercurrent to this sordid mess is that the Republicans want to rain on Nancy Pelosi's return to the role of Speaker of the House. In a large part the Democrats returned to a majority by saying they would defend Obamacare, which Pelosi, in a masterful performance, passed without a single Republican vote. Once again, the Republicans openly display the misogyny which is one of the core tenets of their party. Disgusting
7
@Bewley5...Did the House convene secretly just to crown Nancy Speaker in advance of the official term? Maybe Trump's endorsement of Pelosi prompted Democrats to re-write House rules. How ironic is that?
The elitism of the “populists” is beyond chutzpah. Unpaid federal workers should consult their attorneys? Really? I have a better idea. Why don’t the Republicans and their Wall People set up a “GoFundMe” legal fund for the workers? Or would that not be P.C. for this elitist group of white grievance voters and their elected ones?
6
@M&M....Surely part of their union dues goes into a rainy day account. I mean, why belong to a union if it doesn't take care of you when the chips are down?
1
Here is what I propose: The Mexico Border Wall Funding Act. It could pass the House and then it's up to the Senate and Trump. Problem solved.
2
He should never have been given a "yes" on settling out of court on those three class action lawsuits that were filed against his fake university for FRAUD AND RACKETEERING.
If he'd gone to trial, he'd be in jail instead of the oval office.
9
Do any of the affected federal workers have the Trump family as landlords? Wouldn't surprise me if the Trumps evict them for delinquent rent while they are bereft of pay... (NYTimes, send someone to check!)
9
A 25 foot ladder trumps a 20 foot wall, yet Trump wants to squander billions of U.S. taxpayer money on this ineffective "solution" instead of ones that actually work.
It is Trump who is for "open borders," not the Dems.
6
There is nothing normal about a government shutdown, that effects 800,000 working stiffs, and at of all times, during the holiday season, when people need money the most. Needless to say, this also cannot have a good effect on consumer spending or the growth of our economy.
I know this is not Pelosi’s first rodeo. I hope that the freshmen class of Democrats doesn’t overplay their hand, and delve our country into even more chaos. Mueller needs to finish what he started so we can all move forward.
I hate to think things can get worse, but anything that can go wrong, will go wrong, as we are seeing in this White House.
It’s a bittersweet time in American politics. This year alone, the passing of John McCain and George Bush. The retirement of Jeff Flake, Paul Ryan and the firing or resignation of many top White House aides, who clearly want nothing to do with “Trumpism”.
Let’s hope that 2019, is a year of change, but a change that we can all live with in the end.
9
Underneath the article is a sample letter for federal employees to send to creditors and landlords. The economic ripple effects of this shut down seem like they've started.
9
Rep. Mark Meadows of the "Freedom Caucus" is quoted on the futility of messaging over legislation. I would almost respect Trump if he admitted that Mexico is never going to pay for the wall but that he truly believed it is important to security and therefore he is willing to own the shut down until he could get a deal. But no, he can't accept responsibility. Maybe that's a message that plays to his base.
5
Trump is now happy! He has managed to inconvenience and make angry a large number of people. These factors make him happy. Perhaps the US voters will now wake up and try to make him unhappy by not voting for him next time.
8
Time for a TV/Cable Blitz !
Advertising Blocks MUST be bought for every major news network - ESPECIALLY - FOX and the Sinclair Group.
Play the 15 second video/sound of Trump "Taking Full Ownership of the Government Shutdown" - over and over and over again -
And Then another 15 seconds - Splice many of the Edits of Trump stating; "Mexico will Pay for the Wall"
Recommend repeating "At Least" as often as we heard; "Lock Her Up" !
There is rock solid evidence to eliminate ALL of the doubt as to who "really is the blame".
It appears that the GOP Electorate and die-hard Trump Supporters - can only absorb tiny bits of information repeated ad nauseum.
This just may be the only ad campaign yet - where I would not seethe when seeing Trump on the tube !
14
@Leonard D...Great idea, Leonard! Don't forget to include those videos of Clinton and Obama campaigning for the Border Fence Act of 2006 and the importance of border security. Might want to include references to the 26 Democratic Senators [well, there's Chuck Schumer casing a "Yea"] who voted for the BFA of 2006. Maybe a nod to Obama's border policies - remember the Great Deporter? This stuff would be riveting, don't you think, Leonard? But, just in 15 second bursts. Hypocrites have a short attention span!
It is absolutely mind boggling that Trump and his republican serfs are shutting down the government over the fake threat of a migrant invasion while not doing a single thing about Russian meddling in our election.
Shame on the Republican party! Selling our country down the river.
13
Republicans currently hold the majority in every branch of the U.S. government. Any blame placed on the Democratic Party, the underdogs, is unabashed propaganda.
15
With democracy passé in alt-right circles, Huckabee-Sanders can't bring herself to use the correct name for her party's opposition - the Democratic Party - instead, choosing the alt-grammar alternative (the DemocRAT Party), in an example of either childish ignorance or childish name-calling.
No, Democrats wil not be cowed by your administration's attempt to extort $5 billion in exchange for giving 740,000 American workers, of both parties, their deserved and hard-earned paychecks. Your boss has already owned this shutdown - possibly, the first thing he's gotten right since entering office.
9
Trump is so firm in his conviction that we must have the wall only after Ann Coulter informed him that he would have no chance of being reelected if he caved to the Democrats. Now that's what you want in a president true conviction to his principals. Unfortunately his principals have nothing to do with the good of the country just is personal ego and accumulation of his wealth.
4
Government is Democracy; if you shut down a democratic government then you don't have democracy. Look at the world corruption index and see how the governments of those nations operate. It's part and parcel of those nations culture, for government officials to accept bribes to pay their bills. Instead of stopping crime and corruption the republicans are encouraging it as officials will be tempted to turn a blind eye and accept bribes to pay the bills like other corrupt nations.
7
Let El Presidente stew.
Patience is not his strong suit and he will continue to post misspelled outrages on twitter, further his chaotic and inept image.
Work on a rational funding compromise which involves effective border protection, punishment of employers for employment of illegal immigrants, deficit control measures.
Let him publicly veto it.
13
I just read the letters that the Trump administration has provided for people to share with your landlords. The question every reporter should be asking Trump is what would he do if any of these people with his tenants?
10
I think we know.
4
"They say a house divided will not stand."
Actually Abraham Lincoln said that - not "they".
I wonder if Republican Senator Pat Roberts has ever found out what Abraham Lincoln had to say about know-nothings.
6
@Jbugko...Actually, Abraham Lincoln didn't say "that". Look it up.
1
In Britain the House of Commons is playing a similar game (Brexit or not Brexit). Unfortunately voters both in the USA and in the UK tend to have short memories and will have forgotten the stupid behaviour of their so-called leaders when the next elections come around. And it is of course a little unfair to compare Mrs May with Mr Trump, as she is only irrational in one respect, while it is difficult to find anything rational about the President's behaviour.
2
This must stop NOW.
Trump should come down by half for his allocation request, to $2.6 Billion.
On the Dem side, they must simply ask: how much have you allocated from last year’s amount ($1.3 Billion)? If he can prove that he really cares for this issue and has properly allocated last year’s funding, the Dems agree to double the actual amount allocated by his administration last year: $1.3 allocated in 2017 gets him $2.6 Billion this year!
Problem solved!!
UNLESS, if he only allocated $1B of last year’s amount, then we know on the one hand he really does not care for security so much as fulfilling a bizarre campaign promise - and should only have that amount doubled: $2B in total.
In actuality, HE ONLY SPENT 6% OF LAST YEAR’s ALLOCATION.
So I say the Dems hold firm to a position held by any responsible manager and reward him with a whopping DOUBLE of 10.% of last year’s allocation: $260 MILLION and that is it. Period.
Let his cult clearly understand why that number was generously reached and the Dems must remain there. Period.
He lies. He cares not. He spent 6% of funds allocated last year. Offer him a MAXIMUM of $260M and let him explain all of that to his acolytes in Congress and his uninformed cult. At least the truth shall set them free.
$260M and not a penny more.
4
The Republican party is an out-of-control child. The Democratic party is an adult that unfortunately will once again have to step in to clean up the child's mess.
9
This is Trump's and the Republicans problem. Let them keep it!
7
We shouldn't have fake shutdowns. If there's no funding for Air Traffic Control, then the air traffic system should be closed. If there's no funding for the DoJ, then there's no FBI & no trials. If there's no funding for immigration & customs, then the ports and points of entry are closed. In there's no funding for DoD (there is this time), then DoD sends everyone, including those on active duty, home. If it was clear at the outset that this is what would happen, we wouldn't have shutdowns at all. So, why doesn't Congress change the rules and end tantrum shutdowns?
9
Is outside magazine the only news source that will report on the devastating impact this wall will have on over 100 species who migrate across our border?
No concession should be made on this concept. Pass 5 B for cameras and border security technology like drones, but passing it for a physical wall will devastate the ecosystems along our border.
8
Trump threatens to overthrow all other branches of government and become King Donald of America.
2
This will all be over if only there is one politician in Washington who has the spine to hand over the phone to Trump and tell him to call Mexico and ask for construction money as he has promised.
And when Trump—the coward that he is—demurs, call him to his face that he is a coward and a liar.
Unless somebody does this, the whole USA will be held hostage by this infantile sexagenarian.
9
I liked the CNBC "wall"..... you can buy a curtain and the rods and Amazon will ship for free... for the whole border.. at a fraction of the cost.... it was a hilarious segment but real as well..
5
Rational conclusion Sarah? The only RATIONAL conclusion is the felon you work for is trying to deflect attention from his criminal enterprise by inhumane behavior. Again.
14
Lots of people who voted for Trump at the last election collect government pay cheques and shutting down the government was a stupid move on the part of the Republicans who have millions stashed away in their bank accounts for a rainy day. People won't forget the miserable Christmas of 2019 caused by rich people in government living in their ivory towers having no idea that bills still have to be paid, and people eat, even though Trump wants his border wall funded. Whatever happened to Americans first! Talk about the Republicans cutting off their nose to spite their face. Unbelievable!
11
@CK Perhaps you didn't receive this in New Zealand but our president tweeted that he believes that the federal employees not getting paid are Democrats. Seriously.
8
Simply put, the way our democracy works is you pass legislation and you appropriate funds when you have the votes. That is simple and easy to understand. If you do not have the votes, you then yield to the will of the people and compromise. You do not shutdown the government. The president does not have the votes for this, period. He is like a spoiled brat that threatens to take the ball home if he does not have his way. This is undemocratic and ridiculous. Government shutdowns are not the democratic way. Giving in to Trump would only encourage this bad behavior.
15
Trump is punishing everyone in the US until US taxpayers give him $5 billion for his wall. This is a far cry from “Mexico will pay for it.” Now it’s extortion for Trump’s boondoggle and threats (“seal the border”) for his indefensible and irrational position on border security. A horrible way for this President to act towards all of us, the American people.
10
The Dems better not budge or their base will go bananas. Stand firm. No wall.
13
The Trump Administration is now telling federal employees affected by his shutdown to “provide maintenance services” to their landlords in lieu of rent (!)
Back in 2010 Sue Lowden (R-NV) proposed a “Chicken-Barter” plan to pay doctors in lieu of Obamacare. Later in the year, Nevada voters fired her.
Proposing dumb solutions to important matters seems to be a career-killer. Like Ms. Lowden, President Trump’s time will come soon too (2020).
What will American voters do?
9
Mattis and Kelly leave (grownups depart)
Democratic House sworn in (grownups arrive)
We have learned two things in the last two years that are now irrefutable
1. DJT IS compromised by a foreign power
2. The GOP is incapable of governing
January will be busy but in the end DJT will get nothing, zero...for his wall.
And all of Mexico will laugh!
Next up the Democratic push to retake the Senate and WH.
10
It is said that our personalities are mostly frozen in time when one reaches their mid-twenties. I can't believe that our president is throwing a tantrum for a wall he promised someone else would pay for and ruining the holoday's and new year with his child-like manner.
I would like to have seen what type of man DJT would have been if his personality was not frozen in time as a toddler and where we may be today because of it.
5
The democrats want technology used at the border. Drones and cameras do not effect arrests. If the dems don't want a wall but want technology, let the drones be armed and the border declared a "deadly physical force" zone with authority to prevent or terminate unlawful border crossing. Otherwise, 'Build the Wall."
Drones and cameras do not effect arrests? Has it not occurred to you that drones and cameras can locate the people you want arrested - or vaporized - and provide officers on the ground with that information? This and related technologies date back to the Army's Quick Fix helicopters of the late 1980's, and likely to years before that. Drones and cameras are a force multiplier; a wall is not.
9
“Build the wall”...if Mexico is paying for it (as vehemently promised by DJT).
Another promise broken....
6
@Jay
Dear, illegally crossing the border is a misdemeanor crime. Execution for a misdemeanor is a perfect example of cruel and unusual punishment; and could be considered an act of war. Truly a very, very bad idea.
4
It's time for the Democrats to start a media campaign. Just replay, especially on Fox News, the Oval Office sound of trump taking ownership of the shutdown.
9
The do nothing GOP left us in this great mess . I am very confident the GOP will impeach Trump and get the government running again. We have lived through the worst ten years with full culture of corruption GOP control ever.
2
This entire fiasco of shutting down the government is Trump's way of throwing a monkey wrench into the Democrat's assumption of control of the House. If Republicans were truly interested in the welfare of the country, McConnell and Pelosi would forge a compromise bill and both the House and Senate would vote to pass it with a veto proof majority. Totally bypass the roadblock known as Trump. Of course, this won't happen.
4
The TRUMP SHUTDOWN is causing much harm and grief for those workers who rely on their paycheck to pay their bills. Trump and his crime family have plenty of money to spend so they cannot know how not receiving one paycheck is a huge set back for the 800,000 employees not getting paid. Trump, McConnel, Ryan and the Uber wealthy oligarchs got their much coveted trillion dollar tax cut last summer. What did regular American citizens get? Zilch. On top of that McConnel and Trump and Kevin McCarthy are working on stealing our social security and Medicare. Wake up America. Your decades of SS and Medicare you’ve paid into is being stolen right before your eyes and you’re letting the wealthy take it from you! TRUMP’S SHUTDOWN is one more unhealthy action perpetrated by the conman occupying our Oval Office.
7
The art of the deal alright. Trump had a good shot at funding for his ridiculous wall some months ago, then another last week. Someone please tell this carnival barker of a president that, Fox News aside, this is not "The Apprentice." This is politics, and if you can't play nicely and equitably, get out of the game.
9
While Pres. Trump canceled his Florida trip due to the government shut-down, as well as his New Year's plans, and went to Iraq to visit troops, Rep. Nancy Pelosi whiled away her hours in a lavish Hawaiian hotel suite.
Pelosi was spotted Thursday vacationing in Hawaii at the Fairmont Orchid resort, where room accommodations range from $899-a-night for a standard room to $4,899-a-night for the presidential suite. Evidently, denying 800,000 federal employees their Christmas paychecks and bonus hasn't interfered with Nancy's holiday plans.
1
Assuming Pelosi was in Hawaii then you can bet Pelosi paid for time in Hawaii. who but OPM said no negotiations before 2019?
2
Happy Trump didn’t get to spend an undeserved 16-day taxpayer-funded vacation....imagine what we’ve saved by having him stranded at work!
5
@batazoid - That's OK, Trump already spends plenty of time on vacation and no matter where he is he spends most of the day tweeting and watching TV.
While in Iraq he lied to the troops faces and used them as photo ops. Not exactly something to brag about.
3
Does the President, Senators, and House Members receive their salary during the government shut-down ?
8
@G. Andy Dancer
you bet they do
3
Let's ask the Texas landowners and Texas corporations along their souther border if the Federal government can take their land away to build a wall. Eminent Domain has not entered this debate.
9
I understand Trump now can blame everything on the Democratic House. The mid term was a double edge sword. But better that he scapegoats Democrats than migrants, minorities, women, and other people who lack political prowess to fight back.
I’m pleased Trump will more than meet his match in Speaker-in-waiting Pelosi.
11
@William Fang
FYI. It's migrants, minorities and women who not only got out the vote, but also now constitute a large part of the incoming Democratic House.
1
@William Fang
She was also a lot stronger than Weepy Boehner and apparently a lot more sober.
That's more than likely why Trump and his GOP co-horts are always insisting they have more "strength" when they've proven that they're not smart enough to negotiate their way out of a paper bag.
5
I have faith in Nancy Pelosi. I am confident that once Congress and the House return in January, she will rally the forces, will march forth with a clear plan, firm convictions, and she will end this shutdown quickly and responsibily.
And, furthermore, she will leave us all wondering why we ever doubted that she was the right person for Majority Speaker.
13
@Nuffalready - Agreed. She has earned my respect and support.
4
One point to add to the many good comments: I don't want a single dime released for "the Wall"; but, if they insist, then we must insist in return that they pass a TAX on high income people to fund it! Why am I not hearing this? Also, we need to replay, non-stop, the videos where Drump claims that "Mexico will pay for the Wall" !
15
@dave I think the people need to pass a Constitution Amendment (they can). If the budget Congress passes isn't paid for in full without new debt, then the income tax rates from 1946 are implemented. (the highest bracket in 1946 paid 96%). If that doesn't encourage them to balance the budget nothing will. .... or is there? How about any elected official (at any level) who votes for an unbalanced budget may never stand for election or hold office... ever.
3
"The president has made it very clear..." We keep being told that. But Trump spins like a top.
The measures to reopen the government and address pressing needs that the Democrats plan to introduce sound well thought out to me.
Republicans own the shutdown, and 800,000 of our fellow Americans are suffering over the holidays because of Trump and the same small group of House Republicans who led the 2013 shutdown that cost the economy $38 billion.
9
I would vote for a $5B wall - steel slats actually- to enclose all the corrupt and crooked people beginning associated with this administration. Cohen, Flynn, Kushner, all the Trumps, and Zinke. Lock them up.
19
@BR Nah.... send them to the most exclusive US resort. Guantanamo.
5
And your writers don't think Nancy Pelosi is up to the "challenge"? How naive of them.
8
The narrative on this whole border wall thing is totally bonkers. The administration hasn't spent funds already allocated and hasn't really decided on what kind of wall and where. The $5 billion is estimated to cover maybe a hundred miles, so clearly not a solution to "border security." Nor does anything the President has suggested increase security along the Atlantic and Pacific coastlines and the Canadian border. Haven't these people ever heard of ladders, tunnels, aircraft, submersibles, hot air balloons, etc.?
9
So Trump is going to blaming the DEMS for not doing the very same thing the GOP refused to do?
I hope there is some way to override Trump.
9
Huge numbers of workers won’t get paid
And the shutdown means they won’t get aid
Too bad Trump’s foundation
Suffered a cessation
It might have helped the folks he betrayed
7
Of course, a Democrzatic House will impeach Trump and the Republicans will have Pence to do their bidding.
3
Stephen Miller's grubby fascist fingerprints all over the shutdown, along with Trump's attempt to consolidate military support prior to establishing martial law.
First order of business, on Jan. 3 at noon, is to order investigations into Trump's finances. Hopefully, it will be soon enough - then, with Trump in prison, we can plaster the cracks in the Constitution to prevent this from ever happening again.
17
This is a game changer for the Democrats. Prove to me, a life long Democrat, that you can govern and that you have the intellect and the courage to stand up and fight the destructive GOP and Trump. Do not cave in as you always do.
23
Trump owns this shutdown. Don’t let him change the story.
18
A wall is treating the symptom not the disease. Origin Central American countries like Honduras and Guatamala are so corrupt that their people are forced to flee. Better to invest in de-basketcasing these nations.
8
It's like playing card games with a six-year-old child.
8
The wall is low tech and archaic. Even if funds were approved, there are land owners, ranchers and businesses along the border who will fight eminent domain and keep this tied up in the courts for years. This nothing but a ridiculous political stunt to appease his minority base. And now he's talking about shutting down the entire border. I can't help but wonder when the GOP senators will have seen enough to finally agree that this man is bad for our country. Seriously. It's past time to walk away from his base. Yes, you might lose an election or two, but it's a good sacrifice for your country. The Democrats did it in '64. The GOP needs to do it today and throw this incompetent liar out of office before he does any more damage.
13
Tea Party trump supporters: why isn't 5 billions of dollars enough to start with? Why isn't trump spending the billions they already have for border security?
Also, since we know you Tea folk are totally about fiscal common sense, ahem, where will the offset be to keep those billions of dollars 'deficit neutral'?
Just asking, since my conversations with trump folk never seem to go anywhere NEAR how they felt about deficits when Obama was president. Oh, my, what a difference. I don't ask why trump does what he does. I know his type. I really don't get why former TEA partiers now just bluster that the current president is getting treated unfairly, what all those economic questions! trump says 'print money', and now you agree?
I'll look for any responses that don't consist of "Look! Hillary!". Your president and your republican Congress-critters have had rock solid power for two years now. IF you applied your own (easily documented) supposed fiscal policy beliefs from, say, 2010 to the current president, you'd be screaming nonstop about it. Sooooo, it's not exactly easy to take you seriously, since you have made a 180 in your values. Not trump. You.
10
Nobody on the republican side answers this question. Where are we getting the 5B from? We have to get the money from somewhere. What programs are going to be cut to have that money? So yea great want 5B but it doesnt magically come out of thin air. If anything it should come in installments because even if they did secure the 5b it won't be used all at once anyway.
7
@Matt You get the $$ from the same places you get the $$ to pay for the upkeep of all those illegals who are streaming through our border.
1
@MCH - Those people pay taxes and save employers money. No wall is going to do that.
3
The House should vote to reopen the Government and the Senate should send the bill to the WH. If the President vetoes it, Congress should vote to override the veto.
11
We've been waiting 8 years to regain some control in the congress, to gain some leverage over the Mitch McConnell agenda of obstruction and the Donald Trump agenda of destruction. Now that we are there it is imperative that House Democrats, and particularly Nancy Pelosi, use this control and leverage to rein in the lunatic impulses of Trump, and bring to bear a discipline that his Republican enablers are incapable of providing.
First and foremost this means not acceding to Trump's demand for a border wall. This is not about the wall itself, or border security; this is about his DEMAND for a wasteful, ineffective political bauble that he can dangle in front of his MAGA crowd at the next rally. And make no mistake, if he succeeds in getting this funding he will not compliment the opposition on their bipartisan cooperation --- he will gloat over having beaten them, over having gotten a "win", as he referred to this in his last twitter rant.
This is now a point of principle and the beginning of a restoration of sanity to our governing process. The Constitution provides for checks and balances against the abuse of power. For the last 8 years those checks and balances have gone missing, and the results of single party governance speak for themselves. The House Democrats' mandate must be the restoration of those checks and balances, and it starts with denying funding for the wall.
9
Any way you look at it, this basically amounts to is a hostage situation whereby the president is putting his political interests before the welfare of the country by shutting sown the federal government until he gets his way.
The People of the United States of America deserve better than this.
12
To make this discussion about votes and money is to frame a bank robbery as capital gains! This shutdown is hostage-taking pure and simple for no purpose other than the sheer ego rush of out-bluffing an opponent in a high-stakes game of chicken.
Most of those who are suffering are the lowest paid civil servants or temporary contract workers, some of whom don’t even have sick leave or vacation as a buffer. It’s food service, janitors, grounds keepers, doormen, security guards, call center staff, data entry, clerks, etc. In one shutdown a recently widowed GS-05, whose husband had died suddenly, lost her little house. OPM advice to “ask your landlord or bank if you can make partial payments” (good luck with that) is as shameful as it is fatuous.
As to a border wall: Couching the vulnerable folks at the border as public enemies ridiculous. As a nation of immigrants, we have everything in common with these brothers and sisters, who are forced to flee their normal lives by tyranny, poverty, violence. This includes the non-minority folks among us.
Half the original 13 colonies were penal colonies, populated by folks some of whose crimes were as minor as pick-pocketing. The frontier was populated by a stratum of those just out of debt-driven indentured servitude. The Indian lands of the Midwest and West were settled by Central and Eastern Europeans, fleeing war and famine. American industrial might was built on the backs of Irish, Italian, Chinese, Polish....newcomers.
8
Trump's Wall... a scar on the face of the continent.
13
The House of Representatives averages 138 days in session annually, while the Senate averages 162 days. If we go with the higher number, even though the House has more members, every week the government is shut down represents 4 1/3% of the time they are in session. Perhaps all taxpayers should just deduct that amount from their Federal taxes next year for each week the government stays shut down. I don't like to pay for services not rendered, and I'm certain many Americans feel the same way.
6
The Wall worked in Israel. There issue was different, but still the result of illegal border incursions. In Israel, terrorist attacks dropped by 90%, as a result of the wall.
But, the Democrats will not even consider $5 Billion, which represents 0.1% of the federal budget, as long as a plurality of Americans falsely believe that the shutdown is Trump's fault. To summarize, it doesn't matter what happens to America, as long as they look good.
1
False equivalency. Mexico is a valuable trading partner and sovereign country, not an occupied state.
8
@James. The majority of illegal immigrants in our country are visa overstayers. Moreover, the overall influx of people at our southern border is down. The number of illegal immigrants in the country is not increasing. Native-born Americans commit far more crimes than these immigrants. As such, the wall is a grotesquely expensive (overall costs estimated to be as high as $50 billion, plus nearly $1 billion in annual maintenance) response Trump’s fear tactics and propaganda. There are far smarter, more effective ways to craft immigration and border control policies.
8
There has not been a single terrorist attacking by an undocumented immigrant who crossed the US/Mexico border. Ever. Your “analogy” falls way short. Israel protects itself from those sworn to destroy it (at least according to official pronouncements), while those try to enter the US are either escaping violence and/or hoping to make a better life within the US, a country they admire.
3
Imagine if the Senate Minority Leader, whom New York is supposed to be so lucky to be represented by, proposed to the President something like, ok, fine: $5 billion for the wall for $5 billion for the subway? Nope, DACA is the number one priority.
1
This is just another example of what a lot of us have believed for some time. Republicans cannot govern. All they know how to do is obstruct.
13
The first four words of this article seems to sum up the GOP regarding public-minded legislation and meaningful oversight of the Executive branch since the inauguration: Republican leaders gave up.
4
Note to Sarah Huckabee Sanders: “The only rational conclusion” is that the President openly choosing to keep the Department of Justice closed to stall investigators and the courts in investigations and suits against himself.
Pronouncements on the border wall divert legislative, media and public attention from the profound damage he and his administration have done and continues to do pertaining to the environment, health, medical care, basic sciences, defense, foreign policies, intelligence, among other essential federal functions.
Oh, and don’t forget his assault on the press and the Constitution. He has imprisoned the Constitution behind a wall of his own making. Legislative appropriations won’t remedy that injustice, but impeachment and conviction will.
11
Why did the reporter feel the need to make a negative, sarcastic reference to Rep. Pelosi’s alleged “ceremony-soaked” return to the Speaker of the House position? I am beyond tired of the inherent sexism with which she and other powerful, effective women are treated.
9
Offer Trump a $5B package of border security funding that the Border Patrol actually wants along with a DACA package. If he rejects that he will be seen as being unreasonable. Then the first order of priority should be prescription drug prices reduction. All the polls say this is the number one issue (health care) and this is the one thing that something can be done about (however, the dems are owned by the pharm industry as well as the repbubs). The anti-corruption bill is just too impractical to implement, the only way to get it to work is bipartisan and that is going take a lot of time, but just some bill the house democrats pass is going nowhere, just a political ploy.
2
The Republicans hold the government until Jan. 3rd. If they want to stop the shutdown, why don't they? All they need to do is vote to pass a budget with money for the wall that Trump will sign. Why blame the minority party? It seems Trump should be pressuring his own party to give him his wall before the 3rd. If he can't even do that, he's a pretty weak president and might as well give it up.
12
@Ms. Pea Need 60 votes in the senate because republicans in 2009 changed the rules and made it so you could filibuster without filibustering. Republicans don't have 60 votes in the senate. Maybe they shouldn't have done that in 2009/2010? Now democrats will never give them anything and force them to get 60 votes for everything. Broken legislature branch thanks to mitch mcconnell
6
For the past two years, the Republicans have controlled the house, senate and White House. They had ample time to push the wall through. They had a deal that addressed the DACA situation and funded the wall. Republicans got their windfall for the rich/bankrupt the government tax plan through, have decimated the environment, and upended the world order, so don’t tell me there wasn’t maneuvering possible to fund the wall. This is irresponsible, Republican shenanigans at their illogical extreme. This proud American expects our government to govern, not give in to Trump’s two year old style temper tantrums. Pass a clean CR, override the veto, and get on with governing.
13
I can think of so many other problems to solve that Trump could work on that could bring real benefits to the people. Affordable health care, infrastructure, green energy etc etc. Democrats govern , Trump hallucinates.
11
If Mr Trump were able to learn from recent history he would only need to look at the recent experience of Illinois where the Republican governor refused to negotiate with the Democratic majority in the state legislature. A budget never agreed upon for over two years because of intransigence on both sides. But in 2018 the Republican governor lost bigly and in 2019 there will be one party Democratic rule in the state. Trump will own the blame just as Governor Rauner did in Illinois.
9
The Democrats should trade re-enstatement of the environmental controls protecting our air and water with approval for the wall. Lack of controls will really harm people. The wall will not stop people from crossing the border, but it will create construction jobs for years.
59
@Art
The wall is an environmental problem too. It would certainly cut off animal migration, limit access to foraging areas, and could indirectly affect habitat in such a sensitive environment. It's a bad idea 3 ways from Sunday.
33
@Art The Democrats should trade NOTHING for wall funding. This is Trump's shutdown. Let him cave. I hope he leaves it closed for months. Try as he might to pin tis on the Democrats, beyond his shrinking base, he can't. A veto can always be overridden. Of course it would require spineless Republicans to vote to overrride, but so what? Why is it the Democrats always have to be the ones to make concessions?
40
@Art
If Trump's wall is ever built, not only will it be a boondoggle, but it will create significant environmental problems of its own.
Better that the construction jobs be created building a smart electrical grid.
32
Sorry about the Trump shutdown, I really am. But “The Wall” is NOT a solution to illegal immigration, drugs or any other real or perceived threat from the “others.” Israel just uncovered a 5th tunnel under its wall,; most drugs from Mexico come in through incomplete screening at approved entry points and much Chinese fentynal comes in through Canada. STOP THE NONSENSE of bargaining with Trump over a bad idea. Tell Americans the truth, use facts and actual verifiable data and if his “core” of 25-30% , Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh don’t like it....TOO BAD.
192
@Concerned MD
But walls do work. You are making a false argument.
Just because "some" people still get in, it does not mean that far FEWER get in with a wall in place.
The entire argument from the left on this is juvenile.
They point to specific individual examples of someone evading a wall, while not pointing to the overall numbers pre and post wall construction anywhere they have been built.
Walls work, and that is precisely why the Democrats are fighting building one so strongly. It's as simple as that. Democrats want open borders, anything they say to the contrary is a lie.
They don't care about border security, they don't care about American citizens, they care about optics and holding on to power, period.
There is literally nothing you can say to me that will convince me otherwise on that front.
4
@Concerned MD I agree! Stop negotiating with Trump and the Republicans in the press. Everyone should start stating the facts about border "crossings," the lack of any threats from most of those people massed on the other side of the border; the steady decrease in those who have been coming across; the fact that many of those ignoring the law are the those overstaying their visas--few of whom are the brown folks from Central America and Mexico. Remind people that the so-called wall or euphemistically, "border security" is meant to be a monument to Donald J. Trump. He thinks such a monument will equate to Mount Rushmore in the future. Not so. Anne Applebaum of the Washington Post wrote a fine piece outlining the facts about "border security" and immigration laws. I recommend it.
21
@Jim; "There is literally nothing you can say to me that will convince me otherwise on that front."
OK
"Democrats want open borders, anything they say to the contrary is a lie."
OK
At least you are open minded about this.
9
The senate passed a bi-partisan bill to fund government through Feb 8 with 1.3B added for border security. The bill got 71 votes. Trump said he would sign it. One day later he changed his mind, and together with Republicans in the House, now hold totally unrelated government funding hostage to try to force a minority’s view on the rest of us.
I’m sick if it.
People I know who supported Trump are also sick of it (and him).
As McConnell said, the Republican Party owns the government shutdown brand. This is totally on them and Trump.
By the way, that little campaign rally yesterday in Iraq should be paid for from Trump campaign funds and not taxpayer money. I’m thinking of filing a lawsuit myself if he doesn’t reimburse the government for that trip. Every taxpayer in the country deserves reimbursement.
189
@Michael
Agreed. And since there is no evidence that Trump himself has ever been a taxpayer, no reimbursement for him or his offspring.
32
@Michael wrote: "I’m thinking of filing a lawsuit myself if he doesn’t reimburse the government for that trip."
How can I help?
29
@Bystander I will help. I do hope every commenter begins to use their entire real name. We could get an actual conversation going.
12
The newly elected Democrats couldn't expect anything positive from Trump except for this fund for wall blackmailing from Trump which they are capable to counter with enough legislative means available to them despite the shutdown spectre forced by the bluff master President who is already vulnerable to several investigations into his scandalous deeds. So the shutdown accompanying inauguration of the new House might not be as ominous as it erhaps looks;for it might rather help strengthen the Democratic resolve to fix President Trump's executive excesses.
3
Trump promised that Mexico would pay for the wall, why does he need money from US Taxpayers?
15
“The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people,” Sarah Huckabee Sanders...
It's the DEMOCRATIC Party and you and your lying boss will get the respect you deserve. Ms. Sanders, you will be remembered as the lying mouthpiece of a corrupt and immoral administration. Your children will be so proud.
11
I think Americans would be helped by knowing exactly where Democrats stand on immigration -- somewhere between don't let anybody in and let everybody in. The Republican description of the Democratic position is certainly not adequate. This is a mistake Democrats make regularly, allowing the Republicans to define the parameters. Also any funding bill should include funding for all the federal employees' back pay!
10
You're right. If you read, you'll see the Democrats would prefer to spend money on high tech border security and increase court personnel who hear asylum cases to remove the backlog. A majority of Americans would probably agree with strategy, but it's hard to articulate in a sound bite that can be chanted, like "Build the wall".
6
In many peoples opinion, the border that needs to be walled in is 45's Borderline personality.
10
The San Diego Tribune is reporting a much larger migrant caravan on its way from Honduras. The timing could make the need for an improved physical barrier at the border more obvious if photos of young men climbing the existing fence are published once again by the media.
https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/migrant-caravan/sd-me-another-caravan-20181227-story.html
2
Democrat chaos begins in January, leaving Pelosi and Schumer incapable of leading anybody out of the wilderness they fostered.
The Trump shut down is ALL don con's doing. We ALL heard and saw him on TV "I'm glad to shut down the government, it's all on me." Credit where it's due.
Now he's blaming Democrats. The liar-in-Chief (well over 7,000 documented LIES told since January 2017) will say ANYthing to weasel out of responsibility or to claim credit for positive things he had zero to do with.
Trump's border wall is a total waste of money. It will be as effective and useful as a degree from trump university. Anyone familiar with the actual border situation (as opposed to trump's phony "crisis") and 7,000 troops costing hundreds of millions) KNOW this.
The only security that trump truly cares about is his own. Everything else is window dressing for his gullible base (many of whom are racist).
The "self made" billionaire who started out with $411 million from racist daddy Fred. Trump did manage to come up with five "self made" bankruptcies.
He's busy tweeting and creating noise and distractions from the Mueller investigation and his own vast incompetence.
Being rid of Donald Trump as soon as possible will be his first real step toward "making America great again" or as I like to put it... Sane again.
Pence will be NO picnic (total tool of Koch Bros et al donors, not too bright, religious fanatic, homophobe, and more)... but an improvement over trump until 2020.
7
First the dems need to convince fox and friends that a Virtual Wall is the way to go. Playing into the the hands of the “Space Force” who then could bean the Illegals up as they climb or tunnel the “Virtual Wall”and transport them back to their country of origin. Easy Peezy. This “Virtual Wall” would also be paid for by Mexico in “Virtual Pesos” there by keeping his “PROMISE” that Mexico will pay for it! Problem solved.
2
Referring to Nancy Pelosi “...her ceremony-soaked return to the speakership.” What does this mean? Here’s an example of MSM tilting perception of a powerful woman. Is this sarcasm? What’s the intention in the use of these words? Certainly they add nothing to the reporting of facts and if these words are relevant, how so? I find them insulting and adding nothing to the facts.
10
Welcome to the 116th Congress of the United States. It will not be difficult to predict what this group will be able to accomplish, if anything. Partisan politics and all of the attendant recriminations and stonewalling will certainly sink to new levels. What about the needs of the American people?
Trump is talking to the wrong people. Sure Trump promised to build the wall, but he also promised that Mexico would pay for it. The Democrats should offer to match any funds that Mexico provides for the wall, and Trump should display his incredible skill for the art of the deal by convincing Mexico to pay up. A win-win for everybody!
3
The Democrats in the House should understand in no uncertain terms: If they cave in to this unpopular, dictatorial and arbitrary demand the Democratic party will have ceased to serve a function and will go the way of the Whigs. And since there would be no party to replace it, our country and our democracy would be even more imperiled than it is. Compared to that, the partial shutdown and the negative effect on the stock market etc. are minor and temporary problems.
1
I wonder if the shutdown is Trump’s way of trying to protect himself from being held accountable for his actions. I think that Trump could care less about the amount of hardship he has caused the actual government employees.
5
Trump's border wall is like putting a band-aid on a deep knife wound before cleaning it and checking if it hasn't done damage to underlying organs. Looks good for a while, before the gangrene sets in. Trump just wants the patient to look good for his base with some make-up, while Democrats want to cure the disease. There already is a bipartisan bill to address immigration and border security, the only thing that needs to be done is enforce it.
3
We have thousands at the border, sky rocketing insurance premiums and out-of-pocket spending on healthcare, but the Dems want to focus on voting rights and anticorruption legislation? First, what is anti-corruption legislation? Congress can no longer exempt themselves from their own laws? Cannot accept one penny of value from a lobbyist? And what is the focus on voting rights legislation? We've hundreds of bills that include voting rights and we've the courts that enforce them. The NYTimes tells me my rights were violated because I waited in line for 1.5 hours on election day, but that is ridiculous! Will the Dems come in and waste another 2-4 years + on 'over-reaching' legislation that continues to waste tax dollars or will they actually do something? I fear more time is spent trying to fight/obstruct Reps than enact reasonable, practical, enforceable legislation. How about NO NEW bills; fix the ones already written so poorly that no one really knows what to do.
@Ma, you're watching too much Fox Fake News!
You're living in an alternative universe if you blame the government debacles and funding crises on Democrats. You conveniently forgot that Trump is president, the Republicans controlled both houses of Congress, and that they passed a massive giveaway to the rich!
Over the past decade, as most nonpartisan analysts have documented, it's the Republicans who have blocked common sense legislation, violated the Constitution, and undermined the rule of law. Trump and the Republican leadership have been opposed to just about anything Obama did, even though he saved the country from another Great Depression.
Finally, remember that Trump promised health care for ALL at LOWER prices, but then supported the Republican repeal of the Affordable Care Act that would have thrown 20 million people off insurance and raised premiums for millions more. They also sued to repeal the act, thereby ending coverage of preexisting conditions!
7
You should take a political science, and ethnic studies class at you local community college. Through in some history too. I’m not trying to put you down in anyway, but it seems like you have valid question which I hope you find answers to outside of comment sections. Education is enlightening.
6
Let’s not forget that a deal was made. But Trump couldn’t get Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh to sign off on it.
16
Congress could override a Presidential veto with 66% of the votes (and the guts to do it) in each Chamber.
4
Trump won’t care about a shut down until it affects him personally. Perhaps furlough the Air Force One pilot and his Big Mac butler.
8
A firm I used to work for years ago would shut down the week between Christmas and New Years because nothing much seemed to get done anyway, even though without pay however, and most of us who worked there saw it as a benefit. At least give Trump credit for picking the most preferential time of year for a shutdown.
This is what it comes down to: Republicans are holding the country hostage unless Democrats cave to Trump’s demands.
No negotiations with terrorists. The GOP must go. Impeach them all.
5
Building a wall is 10th century technology. All walls have gates and that’s where the vast majority of illegals enter. They overstay visas and work permits.
5
FOX NEWS has divided our country. Freedom of Speech to tell the stories the way they want to tell them. It's just the southern strategy gone national. Fox viewers up in arms over 1 death by a illegal yet claim patriotism with guns when a American murders and maims 100's. Their forgotten viewers have been forced to read lies and innuendo and claim....who knew??
7
Must be quite a frightening scenario for the Trump-owned GOP, they've created such a false image of Representative Pelosi, actually an accomplished and effective public leader. They never fail to include her name in their daily 'must hate for no good reason' lists. Ms. Clinton, Mr. Obama and Senator Schumer all strike fear into die-hard supporters of their failing crooked misogynist. Investigated for more years, with no convictions whatsoever. The Don's lawyer, campaign manager, cronies and cabinet are already a crowd of convicts serving time for very real crimes.
It is now time for the People to be represented by a House we truly elected to represent us. To make sure the staunch advocates for the murderous Saudis & Russians, the Trumps inside our White House, are further exposed as a total fraud. His empire is a fake, he had to steal charitable funds to campaign, and he cheats so badly on his taxes that he remains obsessed about the possibility of his returns being made public.
8
Democrats should keep emphasizing that the wall is a useless waste of resources, as well as a destructive and ugly assault on some beautiful terrain. Sometimes Republicans try to shift the topic to "border security", but that isn't the issue at all. Republicans try to back away from it, but it always comes back to the reality that Trump is talking about an actual large physical wall to be built across the whole southern border. There are so many reasons why this is a stupid idea that it's hard to know where to start, and Republicans, and sometimes even Trump, try to pretend that that's not what they are really talking about. But that is what they are talking about, or else we would be debating real problems with our immigration system. (There would be a lot of disagreements there, also, but we will have to start discussing them at some point, apparently sometime in the future, when the "wall" fantasy is finally shelved.)
4
Let him own the consequences of his actions ... Do Not Back Down ... Ignore the Tantrums ...
7
Republicans in concert with Trump have almost decapitated the military decision making function of OUR government.
In a REAL crisis we are in trouble. The danger to democracy is palpable.
3
While "chaotic White House" may feel accurate, "immature, unprepared White House" is a far more realistic statement.
4
NO NO NO! If Democrats want to keep my vote: just say NO ( to the Wall!)
6
Trump's shut down of the government is a hale Mary pass, a last ditch attempt to destroy the government before it will kick him out of the presidency. He may bill it as protection of our security, but it is merely a power play. He does not need extra funds to begin his wall as it is already there unspent.
Trump's gambit is much like the GOP attempt in Wisconsin, Michigan and North Carolina to change rules in their favor before Democrats take control in the House and state Congresses, a naked grab for power to secure their position before losing it. It is down and dirty politics, but normal for the GOP when they sense that they can not win in any other way and Trump is a master at this.
6
Ryan and McConnell, this is on you. Total control for two years and what happened. Nothing good!
11
That Sarah Sanders is a bad piece of news. It is incredible that she can get away with spinning a lie that she must know is recognized as a lie to anybody who has followed the saga. This is in the same class as when the Russian assassins who killed an ex spy in Salisbury said they were there to look at the cathedral.
"“The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people. The president does not want the government to remain shut down, but he will not sign a proposal that does not first prioritize our county’s safety and security.”
Every word of that statement is a blatent shameless twist of the facts. And she doesn't even blush. I pretty the American people who must gasp in frustration hearing such a thing.
8
You are not getting a paycheck and can't pay your bills, but your "employer" tells you to contact your personal attorney? If you cant pay your bills how are you supposed to hire a lawyer? And what is the lawyer going to do for you if you don't have an income? File bankruptcy?
Trump's campaign promise was that Mexico would pay for the wall, not American taxpayers.
8
The House play call seems pretty obvious. Pass the exact same legislation which already passed the Senate. No changes whatsoever. If the bill fails in the Senate, you can blame the Republican Senators who changed their vote. If McConnell refuses to vote on the bill. the failure is now McConnell's fault. If the bill passes and Trump vetoes it, the government shutdown is now twice Trump's fault.
Mark Meadows sounds foolish again. Republicans are up the creek without paddle on this one.
9
This is the height of irresponsibility in governing. For 2 years with majorities in both the House & Senate, the Republican party failed to give Trump funding for his wall. Now on their way out the door, House Republicans throw a carrot to the White House and leave Democrats to clean up the mess. Clearly the intent of this was to give Trump fuel to shift blame to the Democrats, and to sabotage Nancy Pelosi's legislative agenda for the new House, all at the expense of real Americans' livelihoods. Just awful.
8
Top four items on the Thursday, Jan 3 house agenda.
1. Swear in new members.
2. Pass senate version of the bill to reopen gov't ASAP.
3. Begin impeachment proceedings.
4. Break for lunch.
The awful mess left by the outgoing congress is shameful. Time to drain the Republican swamp.
10
In addition to relentlessly replaying the Trump soundbite that said he would LOVE to shut down the government for a wall, the soundbite that MEXICO WILL PAY FOR IT should be, too!
Why are democrats so hesitant to advocate for themselves? It’s infuriating!
9
As much as I hate the wall, here's an idea: Give him $5B for the wall that must be paid for with a tax increase and in return, protect dreamers and reinstate the Obamacare mandate.
3
Like all who work for this administration,the laid off workers are advised to “Consult with your personal attorney”
Comedy this farcical is hard to write but comes naturally to Trump’s World.
5
It's Trump's Shutdown, no matter how much he would like to blame the Dems. And demanding $5 billion for a useless wall -- or steel slats, or beaded curtains, or chicken wire -- when he hasn't even spent all the $1.7 billion previously allocated shows what a spoiled child he really is. I hope he enjoys his Mar-a-Lago vacation because he faces an endless vista of subpoenas and investigations when the House gets back to business next year.
1
If Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky is not a captive of Trump or is not a political opportunist, he would’ve acted bravely to confront Mr. T and his allies as a statesman. Well, common between him and retiring Paul Ryan is self proclaimed detail-orientation with coward shrewdness and partisanship.
3
Trump keeps saying the Democrats need to compromise.
They already have, when Trump was offered $1.3B or $1.6B or any other amount.
Trump wants capitulation, not compromise. The whole $5B.
Give me my wall or the country gets it.
No way.
Don't give in to this grifter.
Trump is about to get an education in how Congress really works. It will be a shock to a man who's never had to answer to a board of directors or shareholders.
McConnell and Ryan have let Trump muddle along like the country is another one of his failing businesses, ignoring their Constitutional responsibilities.
Pelosi, Schumer, Hoyer, and Cummings will not be bullied, nor fall for flattery.
It's going to be a bumpy ride. Hang on.
8
@D. DeMarco
It's been a bumpy ride ever since he got into office...
2
It keeps getting lost in all the noise: Part 2 of Trump's promise was that "Mexico will pay for it." Look to Mexico for payment, not us.
4
Democratic leaders need to go into Trump's office on day one of the new congress with a copy of his Tax Returns in a briefcase and tell him the shutdown ends or impeachment procedures begin in 24 hours.
4
@Phil Dunkle change to shutdown ends AND impeachment procedures begin in 24 hours.
1
If you want to know how this president's actions regarding the wall will play out, just look at his previous actions so far:
- he's embraced dictators, America's enemies
- he's broken and upended strategic alliances protecting us
- he's made unilateral, uninformed decisions without plans
- his only "accomplishment" is a huge tax giveaway to the rich
- he's denied services to American citizens (Puerto Rico)
- he's pitted groups of Americans against each other
- he's sought to discredit journalism and the free press
- he's approved soiling the air and the water
- he's letting climate change endanger the entire planet
- he's hired ignorant, inexperienced, unqualified employees
- he's hired multiple corrupt employees leaving under a cloud
None of these have brought unity to our country, none has brought universal economic prosperity, none has "cleaned up the swamp," none has shown good stewardship of our planet, and none has improved the workings of the federal government.
This kind of track record does not inspire hope that another boondoggle - his "wall" - will fare any better. He doesn't understand, he doesn't care, it's all a game to him.
To shut down the government for this boondoggle is criminal, and he's the architect of this administration's corruption and criminality, aided and abetted by the Republican Party.
6
Democrats should pay for Trump's stupid wall, but by reversing the deep tax cuts to corporations and the top one percent. Make Trump and the GOP choose. It will either reopen the government or at least send a message that Republicans can't have both an economically libertarian government and one that spends billions of dollars on a wall on one of our borders.
2
Sanders says, “The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people.”
Really! Here’s another likely conclusion – this is about political positioning for votes and campaign money by both parties – not a wall.
The Democratic Party is working to stop a 17th century solution, on one boarder, to a 21st century problem and to stop Trump and Republicans from declaring a “win” during their re-election campaigns. Neither party seems to care that we are so deep in national debt that we don’t have the money!
We must find a way to hold self-interested Elected Politicians, government officials, their staffers and operatives from both parties personally liable, responsible and accountable for the lies they have told US, their gross mismanagement of our county, our $21.9 T and growing national debt (106% of GDP), and our $80 T in future, unfunded liabilities they forced on US jeopardizing our economic and national security, while benefiting themselves, their staffers, their party and special interest donors.
2
As much of a mess as our government is right now, I am pleased that there is a party back in power that reflects my priorities. I agree wholeheartedly with the new House Democrat's stand on priority issues. This, at least, is refreshing and reassuring.
4
It would be good to include a highly visible LADDER -- as a stage prop -- each time Democrats are filmed discussing Mr. Trump's useless wall.
Democrats have not yet taken control of the House gavel - Republicans are still in charge - and the President has shut down the government under total Republican control by “saying” he will not sign legislation that does not include funding for a border wall at American taxpayer expense.
Where is the clause in the Constitution that requires Congress to fail to act on necessary appropriations legislation just because a President verbalizes refusal to sign it? Where in the Constitution does it require the Legislative Branch to fold to unreasonable, irresponsible, childish, ineffective Executive demands? Where is the courage to act in the best interests of this country?
It is the President and cowards in a GOP-majority Congress who have shut down the government. That cowards in US House have been conned into using their power for all the wrong reasons and having passed new legislation to appease a President with an anti-democratic, inhumane, immoral agenda, they have again demonstrated they simply are unsuitable to govern.
The border wall is nothing more than an optical “delusion” for a bigoted, anti-democratic base of support for a bigoted, anti-democratic President.
This nonsense will not end until Republicans gather the courage required to protect and to defend the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic.
6
Why does Trump so desperately need a wall?
Because (as Miss Manners would say), Dear Reader, it is oxygen for his ego. Without it, he fears he will die unnoticed.
Here's an ironclad guarantee: If Trump does get the wall he wants, you would not, if you were to walk its entire length from the Pacific to the Caribbean, at any point in the trek be out of the visual sight line of a "TRUMP" embossment protruding from the concrete.
3
Punish anyone hiring illegals, severely. No wall needed, self deportation likely if ever they came after the news spread that America suuuuucks bro for jobs. Fruits and vegetables will be picked by union labor and will be expensive eliminating food waste, carbon transportation and water consumption. When the next recession arrives plenty of menial labor jobs for everyone.
5
Things are only going to get worse. How could they get better? Little that the House passes will be approved by the Senate. Little that the Senate passes will be endorsed by the House. Dysfunction will rule, chaos will follow, and when the masses re-elect Donald Trump...
Idiocy, close to its best. The promise to the blind followers was Mexico will pay for the wall. Umpf will pay for the wall out of his billions. Lies, lies, and worse lies and orange needs some sort of karmic payback for all of this.
Solution: Dems get house, reverse the tax raise the 1% got, take the money the children (include the Mercers) is making through ignoring emoluments, and still don't build (as a pundit put it) a "4th century wall".
6
The Democrats need to be highly visible & out on the airwaves giving lots of interviews reminding busy Americans what the truth is about the shutdown & playing video clips of Trump's lies about who caused this unnecessary shutdown to build a multi-billion dollar wall across our border that is wasteful, ugly, & won't really keep illegal immigrants from going under & over a wall.
I heard on NPR there is one town with a big wall, & immigrants store ladders on the Mexican side to climb over the wall; they built tunnels under the wall; & even cut a door in the wall to walk right through.
Is this how Trump plans to deflect our attention from the Mueller investigation & the terrible mess Trump has made out of his presidency??
How about a big bipartisan "No" to Trump & his stupid, costly, unworkable wall of shame,
8
I'm still absorbing that this whole stupid Republican mess is because Rush Limbaugh and Ann Coulter said mean things about Trump and he didn't have the backbone to tell them (1)they don't make policy, and (2) he does his job based on the good of the country and not the approval of his base.
Oh, wait.
Never mind.
16
Shut down the money for all presidential (and entourage) transport, especially for rallies and golfing fun. Air Force One needs to be mothballed for the duration.
6
January 3, Trump will blink.
2
trump is not trying to negotiate with Democrats. He had a lunch with hardline GOP & Miller but no McConnell or Democrats. How does he propose to get along with the new House if he won't talk to them? Of course, the last time he made an a** of himself with the Democrats by televising his reality TV show trump the prez. When did he get a company to build the wall, when did he get the money? Why has he said it will be built by such & such deadline when he isn't talking to anyone? Who approved the bids for the builders? Who are the builders? How much was their bid? Or is this just another day in the Fantasy Island presidency of djt? Lie...Lie...Lie...hoping someone will believe him?
6
Since the spectacle of the shutdown is so large and literally will affect millions of people, I am beginning to wonder if it’s a distraction. Here’s something you can rail against and wring your hands about because Our Great Leader broke the tax code so badly last year that no one will be able to get a return...or that it will take until after the fiscal year to get one.
And then where’s all the money?
4
There is a flip side to all of this. Since the vast majority of taxpayers will be unaffected by the 800,000 furloughs, perhaps it will only reinforce the image of a bloated federal bureaucracy. Democrats don’t want to own that image.
3
There are 22 million people in the US in violation of immigration law.
When do the Democrats propose to do something about enforcing immigration law?
Instead they want to abolish Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
Democrats mock immigration law and mock the 1 Million Legal Immigrants who come here, following the law, every year.
2
@Frank How about looking at Trump and the Republicans, who have had the Presidency and both chambers of Congress for the past 2 years? And before you say they need a handful of Democratic votes in the Senate, keep in mind that a true leader would have found a way to bargain for them.
5
There are more boxes outside his office, than it would take, to move my entire three bedroom house.
3
Ostensibly, the shutdown is about funding Trump's Folly. What is truly at stake is the role of the Congress as a separate power and check on any abuses imposed on the American people by the executive branch. The Congress could end this stalemate and avoid self-destructive submission to Trump's bullying tactics by over-riding his veto of a bill to fund the government. It could then go on to address immigration and border security issues in a serious manner, as it has in the past, only to capitulate in fear of Trump's veto. Ryan and McConnell, as leaders of the Congress, have served Trump well but not the country or the thousands of federal employees held hostage by Trump's self-serving and tyrannical intransigence.
3
Here's a plan for the Democratic House to offer Trump: The House will match, on a dollar-for-dollar basis ALL funds that Mexico contributes to building "The Wall." Of course, the House will ask that verification of Mexican funding comes from Mexico, and not the Trump Administration. So, President Trump, "Show them the money!"
2
“They say a house divided against itself cannot stand. That’s about where we are,” said Senator Pat Roberts, Republican of Kansas.
Yes, "they" say that because they are quoting Lincoln. And yet the "party of Lincoln" has been using the divide and conquer strategy for quite some time now. If you're ready to help us repair the house you've been tearing down, OUR house, we're ready for you to join us.
4
@Albert Ross - Has anyone else noticed that Republicans can't come up with anyone since Lincoln to boast about?
1
@DR
I'm not exactly thrilled with Dem leadership either. If H-Dawg hadn't Pokemon-gone and called folks "deplorable" (itself a divisive statement which in one moment was more damaging to her campaign than the email scandal or the billions of hours of right wing anti-Clinton denegration) we wouldn't be here. My fingers are crossed in hopes that the incoming Congress can restore decorum and bipartisanship but I won't go as far as holding my breath.
1
So here we go, blame, blame, blame, and then obstruct. Paul Ryan had plenty of time for a stop/gap bill but decided to go on vacation. Now Trump, the I will take full-responsibility-for-the-shut-down President, is now blaming Pelosi and the Democrats. They are not even in office yet. The republicans are a party who, by choice, do not lead, they created issues to divide and did not do there jobs for the past two years. Don't be fooled by them as we move into an era of blaming and obstructing, because this is the best they've got and this strategy is how they prove their rhetoric that government doesn't work...because they do all they can to make it not work. Leading is difficult and they have proven they are both unwilling and incapable.
7
The only thing a wall creates is the industry to evade it.
Want border security?, start with immigration reform. Solve the problem, don't wall it off.
6
I don't believe Trump wants a wall. What he wants, and is getting, is a fight over the wall.
8
Trump always says he won’t compromise. His land developer style is one dimensional. It’s also ineffective. So he will not get his “win”. But he will cave and then start his narrative of blame the democrats and invent something he can take credit for. It doesn’t matter the outcome; this is his play.
As with most of Trump initiatives, the only result is that real, working people will be hurt. Nice job a Republicans! Hurt the people you need and love! But uphold your “principles”, above all else.
4
800,000 government workers go without pay over the holidays, and Congress leaves Washington on a paid vacation. What's wrong with this country is not very complicated to understand...
5
A big part of the issue is Trump now has to deal with a woman, and a woman who knows how government works and how to win. This would embarrass Trump to no end and he's terrified.
11
Yes the Trump Shutdown.
4
Here's a summary of what we've learned over the past 24 years:
1) Republicans should never be allowed to handle policy and governing; and
2) Democrats should never be allowed to handle PR and messaging.
Short, simple, succinct. What the majority of voters understand. Learn from past mistakes.
11
@chandlerny Great post. Dems message as if everyone has a graduate degree -- except when they believe their policy is so obvious and correct that they don't bother messaging at all. They also believe that they are engaged in an honest debate of ideas, whereas Republicans view politics as, to quote McConnell, "a knife fight in an alley."
6
@chandlerny: 2008: Federal debt $10.9 trillion. Obama elected. 2017: Federal debt $20 trillion. Obama leaves office. Conclusion: Democrats should never be allowed to manage spending.
I love McConnell in all this - "I may be in charge of one-half of Congress, which means I could be instrumental in overriding a presidential veto, but I'm going to pretend like that's not an option because the optics of the resulting fight between the other party and the President might be good for my team."
6
this is real question: why is President Trump's proposed wall considered "security" and not infrastructure? if it's National security, why not find the funds already allocated in our gigantic and bloated defense appropriations, perhaps cutting a few fighter jets or howitzers? $5 billion is only a small part of what we're spending on defense, and here Trump claims we're being "invaded" and need tne wall for defense? otoh, if it's a construction, infrastructure, why not fold it into an overall infrastructure bill, considering it a bribe to a corrupt NY real estate developer in order to get what he also promised: repair and replacememt of critical tunnels, bridges, highways, waterways, power grids, roads, and all the rest? didn't Ike push through the interstate highway system by selling it as a vital national defense investment? call his bluff, Nancy. if anyone can do it, you can! (or, just send Mexico the bill.)
4
You can negotiate with a person that has 'zero' credibility and has a history of going back on his word time after time.
4
An alternative budget proposal Trump might take is to fund statues of Trump in every state capitol. Much cheaper than the wall and would serve the same purpose: feed Trump's ego. In addition the statues would do about the same as a wall would in "securing the borders" of the US.
1
“We just have to get through this,” said Senator Pat Roberts, Republican of Kansas, who presided over the session. He added, “They say a house divided against itself cannot stand. That’s about where we are.”
The senator must be describing the outgoing Congress, which could scarcely get anything done, except to pass a massive tax cut to fund welfare for the wealthy. Otherwise, with the exception of a bill reforming federal sentencing, the Republicans, divided into warring factions in the House, couldn't legislate their way out of a paper bag.
3
Trump touts himself as a deal maker and job creator. He can't make a deal and has temporarily unemployed roughly 380,000 workers, roughly 2 months worth of new jobs created. This is how we should respond to his failure to sign a spending bill. Hammer home the point that he is not making a deal and taking away jobs. Call your Senator. House should meet with Senate to come up with deal. You can override vetoes.
2
If the government is shutdown for an extended period of time, then Trump can be removed for incompetence or nonfunctional reasons.
3
Trump is acting like a kidnapper asking for ransom. He is holding the federal government of The United States of America hostage for $5 billion. The U.S. does not negotiate with terrorists and the Democrats and other correct-thinking Americans support this policy.
We choose to fight terrorism where we find it and in any guise. By his actions and words, Trump is a kidnapping terrorist as well as a liar.
8
Whatever happened to Mr. Trump’s infrastructure bill that he promised during his campaign? Five billion dollars to get the country working on repairing our nation’s bridges and derelict roadways would have been a much more partisan way to get the country working again. Tax cuts and a border wall without the infrastructure bill have proven to be a sell out to Trump’s base while the rest of us are reeling.
12
Why is congress so afraid to pass a bill that Trump might veto?
Especially when they can muster enough votes to override it.
8
This would be an excellent opportunity for Democrats to roll out comprehensive immigration reform and border security bills.
The immigration reform bill should include protection and a path to citizenship for the DACA kids, a means for otherwise law abiding illegal immigrants to legalize their status, an expanded guest worker program, an expanded E-Verify program with substantial penalties for employers who fail to use it,
The border protection bill should include personnel, technology, an increased capacity for handling asylum claims, humane holding facilities for people awaiting their hearings and where it makes sense funding for a physical barrier.
9
If the government were like the private sector it would realize that half of the furloughed workers were not needed and they would never be invited back.
2
@Daphne - Interesting. I'm curious. What do you do for a living that makes you so valuable and what expertise do you have that makes you an expert on government employees?
4
Especially the Secret Service, Border Patrol, TSA, the EPA inspectors who inspect the nuclear power plants, the Public Health workers, DHS, NASA...l'm sure the public would not mind volunteering a couple days a month towards these efforts.
4
@DR
Did your employer reduce staffing during the recession? How did management decide which staff to let go? Did they restaff to the same level after the recovery? In my experience that was not the case.
Living near the border is not a dangerous place in the USA. The current numbers of green and white Border Patrol vehicles, checkpoints, aerial supports (including huge Aerostat blimps high in the air) and trained uniformed personnel on duty has grown enormously in the past 30 years. There is no extreme emergency.
Therefore, from where we stand, it seems obvious that Trump is blatantly at work using the current government shutdown to expand daily news coverage, and to once again distract, deflect and distort the border issue to avoid our noticing his serious legal and political problems.
Let the 116th Congress begin legitimate constitutional oversight. We need action in government that is based on truth and courage, not perpetual panic and fear of some holographic foreign invasion on our borders.
18
Just to be clear the Republican Speaker of the House and the
Republican Majority Leader of the Senate adjourned Congress with no budget even attempted. However , it is the Democrats who are in control . Bring on George Orwell to assist Sarah Sanders in her Press memos please. I want better prose in our bizarro world.
10
Only 9 Republicans are needed to override a veto by Trump of what will now be a Democratic budget to get the Government shutdown to come to an end. It would be wise if nine Republicans who are up for re-election in 2020 to vote with the Democrats to override a Trump veto.
Susan Collins has been a disappointment since Trump’s election, but maybe she will step up to the bar now. McConnell can no longer afford to waste his power on holding up a budget and any Republicans in the Senate considering running for President will not want to be responsible for the shutdown.
So there is hope that there will be bi-partisan cooperation on the budget
7
@Jean senate voted unanimously for the bill. It's the house that refused.
The longer the public witnesses these increasingly frequent shutdowns the clearer it becomes to them that there are an awful lot of superfluous government workers.
1
@daphne This is the second post you have made trying to make a point for which you provide no facts or data to support it. You clearly have no idea how much govt employees do to make your everyday life possible. Things you take for granted have to be done by someone. Is it perfect? no, but neither is the private sector. Am I a govt employee, no, I was 20 years ago, for a short few years, but left due to inefficiency, and lack of sufficient help to get things done, excessive managers, and ability of Congress to fund budgets in a timely manner. Someone you love is on Social Security, Medicaid, Medicare, travels in airport and needs TSA security, would like to visit a national park or museum that isn't open, would like to fix a tax problem, might be relying on DOJ to run to settle court cases which rulings affect them, want NIH/NIMH and CDC to continue research for cures to protect health, monitor and stop food borne illness like recent recall with Romaine Lettuce (people died before this was recognized and warnings made, many more c
ould have died) You rely on EPA for safe water and air, not tainting our food supply with dangerous pestisides, Keeping safety standards at work in force so you are less likely to die on the job. Maybe you have vets in your family who rely on VA for health care, or a family member or friend relying on govt finding for an opiate treatment program to operate. The examples go on. We are our govt. It is not a nameless, faceless entity.
5
Here is win-win proposal: Democrats can allocate 2.5 billion dollars for the wall which can be spent provided the remaining 2.5 billion dollars are paid by Mexico. This way Trump can claim that he got the wall and Mexico paid for it.
2
Trump is holding the country and 800,000 federal workers hostage to his agenda. As a federal employee, I need my paycheck to pay for my rent, bills, and food just like anyone else. The suggestion quoted within the article that we request our landlords to reduce our rent is illogical, especially coming from the party of free market capitalism (no Republican really believes this would or should happen). My independent landlord in NYC has no reason to reduce my rent because the government has chosen to withhold work and pay. I saw a comment last week by a republican voter that implied that all federal employees deserve to have our pay cut because we ‘make too much.’ This is simply untrue. I make a small salary that is just enough to live on. I do not have extra in the bank to replace wages I’m not making. I am saddened to see that the Reagan-esque argument that government is ineffective or too big has spread so far that a voter will demonize any federal worker, including those who keep our much needed federal services and agencies running. Ignorance is rampant among voters but spread knowingly by the right.
20
@Emily - You have my deepest sympathies and my full support. Hang in there.
3
Give Trump his $5 billion and fund it by fully or partially reversing the useless tax cut he gave Corp, himself and the rich.
5
Surprise, surprise. The games of spiteful non leaders.
6
Did I miss something? What are the three approaches?
1
From the article:
House Democratic leaders plan to pass a stopgap measure to fund the government into February, another stopgap measure that would fund it through September, or the bipartisan, yearlong spending bills for everything but the Department of Homeland Security. That department, which handles the border, would be funded by a separate stopgap measure that maintains current financing levels and policies.
7
Pelosi and Schumer have not agreed on any approach to end the chaos. They are incapable of leading.
1
Schumer shutdown wil fail. Trump will get his wall. Another promise kept.
4
Did you already forget? Trump is proud to own the shutdown! It is his and his alone, and all the spin in the world won't hide that fact from clear-eyed observers.
7
@Steve - Too funny. What about Trump's promise that he would own the shutdown? What about Trump's promise that Mexico would pay for the wall?
Where's the Trump promised amazing health care and fabulous infrastructure?
6
@Steve And what about "Mexico will pay for it?" Another Trump promise broken?
5
“The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people,” Sarah Huckabee Sanders, the White House press secretary, wrote in a statement Thursday afternoon.”
When this administration’s tenure has mercifully passed, we must resolve never to normalize or whitewash this worst kind of politicking and hate mongering. Sarah Sanders and her ilk should become pariahs.
15
Could Trump start a "Go Fund Me" tweet to "Finish the Wall"
6
Let my people go... back to work. End the Trump shutdown!
9
Huckabee: “The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people...”
Translation: Our baby boy-king is going to keep up his tantrum until the grown ups cave. And by the way, no, this is NOT "the only rational conclusion..." It is not even one of them.
14
What are the three approaches being considered?!? Are the Democrats not saying or did you forget to put it in the article?
1
It is upsetting, to say the least, that most NYT coverage of this shutdown fails to mention that Trump's campaign promise about building a border wall included the promise that Mexico would pay for said wall. Why has this been so constantly under-reported here?
21
Trump’s wall is the Israeli wall. Thank you Jared. What a role model.
6
And we see how well that eventually worked out every day on the world’s stage. How much hatred and angst it sows. How much violence ensues to take back what “rightfully” belongs to one side or the other. In 50 years do we really want to be shooting rockets at a major trading partner? Or them to be shooting rockets at us? We’ll end up in a perpetual war—and a race war—with anyone who speaks Spanish and has brown skin.
2
Control of all 3 branches and another shutdown? Maybe it’s a problem with the greedy Republicans!?
15
I have this sweet dream that Trump does not make it past the 2020 primaries.
14
I have consulted with my personal attorney before posting this comment and she has advised that No, my creditors are not willing to allow me to make partial mortgage and bill payments during this most recent government shutdown while Our Great Leader lounges about Mar-A-Lago and continues to obliterate democracy with his thumbs while pinning blame on everyone but himself.
23
Why didn't you say the president gave up?
3
The Gimble and Gyre:
1- GOP Senate say No Barrier, no cash for barrier.
2- Trump announces if there’s a shutdown, he’ll bear full responsibility.
3- Trump says if there’s a shutdown, “it’ll be a long one”, because when the House reconvenes, “It will be a Democrat< sic> shutdown.”
4-Huckabee-Saunders says shutdown occurred because Democrats in the GOP-controlled Senate wouldn’t vote for the wall. Uh, with Trump’s party able to cast decisive party-line votes, it’s the Democrats’ fault he was turned down?
5-Trump tells the world Federal employees working without pay or furrowed tell him they’ll do without because the wall is so important to them (could we have some names? Then interview 10-100 to 1 civil servants who disagree.
6-Trump calls baffled reporters to the Oval Office Christmas Day - demonstrating his commitment to his claimed religion.
He demonstrates he is either literally mad, or ha committed a long list of high crimes - hiring contractors he cannot remember names of after secret bidding process to build wall with funding and concept rejected by Congress.
7-Republican House leadership says “no votes until Democrats control the House - surrendering responsibility to legislate until the end.
Would some vidioid please set these tapes, in order, for YouTube?
Too many members of our public refuse to accept the reality of a week of events unless they see them all together, with dates and times (they’re probably all on the Fox News stream) on TV, or they’re not “real”.
8
Fix this now
We elected you to serve the people not your
Donor class.
This as the past two shutdowns ... belongs to trump : Miller !!!
9
Let us mark this moment as the last gasp of Paul Ryan.
Adios, amigo. Good riddance.
11
politicians are so petty.
3
Nouveau Pelosi ringing in the year.. Decades of ignoring and
violating existing laws... Votes for the Dems -- reliable economically fit labor for the GOP... 5 Billion to keep lawbreakers out 145 Billion to usher them in.... makes no sense.. a third of Latinos are voting Republican .. expect more on they way...
Everyone knows that in meeting with Speaker to be Pelosi and Senate Minority Leader Schumer Trump embraced a government shutdown and willingly accepted responsibility for it. Now, of course, he and Republicans in general seek to place blame on the Democrats. This is vintage Trump and the Republican Party he has made.
11
if Trump wants to go two years without a budget, let it be. It weakens Trump more than the Democrats. The voters resoundingly voted for Democrats to govern in the midterm election and the 2016 and midterm national elections. In Illinois the Republican Governor vetoed every budget proposal for more than two years and he and his cronies were resoundingly voted out in the last election.
19
If "the wall" is so essential to the safety and security of America, I'm sure those in the wealthiest one-percent would gladly give up their recently-acquired tax breaks for their country...or at least they should.
Why should the 99% of us who did NOT benefit from Trump's tax "plan" not only have to be the ones to ultimately pay back the huge new debt that plan created, but also this ridiculous piece of theatrical sculpture?
22
Funny that Trump wants to build the wall but ignore the far more serious cyber threat that allowed Russia to literally control the minds of millions in this country. Although in his defense he probably doesn’t know what the term “cyber” means.
22
What cracks me up is that Republicans have controlled every branch for two years and all they seemingly passed was a terrible tax bill, many rollbacks to destroy our environment and a pretty good but watered down criminal justice bill. If immigration was so high on their to-do list why couldn’t they come up with an immigration bill. It’s so much easier to combat than to legislate. For eight years under Obama all they had to do was complain complain complain about everything especially the ACA. However, when it came time to actually legislate they showed themselves for the hollow and center-less group they are. No real solutions. To quote our president, “Sad!”....
21
the Republicans and President Trump himself have all but told us: it is not about security, it is not about the stupid wall, it is about the fight. the wall is just a symbol, a rally-round for their embattled army of ideologues , and they're milking it for everything they can no matter who becomes collateral damage or how it undermines our country. of course, none dare call it treason. they just demand and insist to show their power, holding ther infantile breaths until they turn blue. talk about deplorable!
3
It's all simple.
Pass a bill that has $5 in it for the border wall. Tell the President that this bill contains the funding he requested. He's not going to read it. He'll sign it and get $5 for the wall.
Yes, five bucks.
12
Trump clearly stated that any shut down would be his doing, continues to blame anybody but where the true problem lies, and I do mean "lies".
He continues to say that he's living up to his campaign promises, well this promise said that Mexico would pay for the wall and if they don't then there's nobody to blame but Trump for failing to live up to that promise.
No wall, no 45th.
9
$5B as a downpayment towards what total cost? Has anyone seen an engineering study with cost estimate? This project is guaranteed to be a money pit, endless expenses with few returns!
Soil in the Rio Grande valley is mostly sand -- remember the story Jesus told about the man who built his house on sand?
13
This article describes a shameful, but classic, abdication of responsibility by Trump and the Republicans, all of whom continue to get paid and will be enjoying their long holiday weekend while thousands of Federal workers wonder whether they will be able to pay their rents and utility bills.
The OPM "guidance" to the Federal workers -- hire a lawyer -- who are being stiffed can be summed up in one phrase: "Let them eat cake."
I hope that the Democrats will make relief for unpaid Federal workers their number one priority next week. The Senate should be willing to participate in a high-priority bipartisan effort to put a pay bill on Trump's desk and force him to choose between Federal employees and his stupid fantasies.
So, skip the speech, Nancy. Impeachment and investigations can wait. Don't waste any more time trying to make a deal with the Trumpists about the wall. Take care of the people first. There are enough decent Republicans left in the House and Senate who will support you.
10
@NKClark amen. It is absolutely shameful that hard working public employees should suffer over such rediculous, and worse than that - petulant, bullying, and mean spirited - nonsense.
1
“The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people,” Sarah Huckabee Sanders...Marijuana is now commercially legally available in Washington, DC?
5
How about IMPEACHMENT instead.
7
@Chloe Hilton, we do NOT want Pence in office. While his policies are hawkish and theocratic, he’ll run the office under almost absolute secrecy. As such, we would risk a re-election of the GOP in ‘20. We MUST keep Trump in office so that he can serve as the poster child of why we need to vote non-GOP in ‘20.
3
As of Jan.3rd, the House is held by Democrats who will have to contend with McConnell who now heads a Senate held by Republicans.
We saw what McConnell et al did to Obama's attempts to get thing done. Why would they do anything now to help the Democrats try to change things?
6
@Sajwert- Fine. Then it will become the Trump/McConnell shutdown. Also, with subpoena power, maybe the House Democrats will be able to find out how much Russian money McConnell took and distributed among his Republican colleagues.
4
Since we have a president that is used to have it his way, today is the 7th day in which he vengefully ordered a government shutdown and many government workers aren’t being paid. It all started when he realized that Republicans in Congress weren’t appropriating the $33 billion for border; including $18 billion for the wall - they weren’t even negotiating. After this crude awakening; President Trump decided to shift the blame upon the Democrats who’re taking over the House of Representatives on January 3rd. I’m certain Democrats will try to negotiate some funding but only for border security. This President needs to be stop before he bankrupts this country.
5
This doesn't look good for either party. Fortunately for democrats, though, Trump's tomfoolery (i.e., verbal and Twitter dialogue) makes him and the GOP look all the more culpable, which indeed they are. Once again, Trump is his own and his party's worst enemy. The GOP needs to separate itself from Trump or be prepared to suffer the consequences.
9
as we can all see from ther positions and actions on climate change, Republicans do not understand the concept of consequences; they understand raw power, right now, and how it can be used to benefit themselves, immediately... like with their vile base of willful idiots viewing tonight's news. a lot of this is political theater, and a lot comes from some kind of twisted business school philosophy of bonuses based on quarterly profits but jobs held only tenuously because humans are disposable. there is no Republican long term only a very short term defined by greed.
3
@[email protected] No, they do understand consequences. Fortunately for them, though, the consequences have been few and far between so far. But if you think they're happy with the results (consequences) of the mid-terms, you would be overlooking the evidence.
2
Suggestion: Pass the exact same bill the Senate initially passed. Then both versions are identical and it goes to Trump for signature. FORCE HIM TO VETO IT! Then it is clear as can be who is holding up things. Who knows, there may be enough reasonable Republicans to override the veto . . . do ya think?
9
The Democrats should be smart. They should not oppose the WALL. All they need to do is tell Trump that if he wants 5 billion dollars, cut 5 billion from other programs and keep the total budgt the SAME for the American tax payers. Thuis will put the pressure on Trump and his Republican Trumpets to show where theywant to cut the funds. ANd they will be most likely hit the middle class,
Also follow the Voltaire's advice described in another column in the NY Times today - Mock Trump in his own words. He does this in his speeches to please his non-elite crowds. Use Colbert's way to mock Trump.
4
Ridiculous and embarrassing. Two years of Republican control of government and we are at a standstill in the last week? Did Trump just wake up? He has had ample time to address his boondoggle.
Maybe he has been watching too much tv, golfing too much, and too much visiting other countries and glowering at allies. Time to do some work.
Promise Trump a stand alone bill addressing border security after hearings on the most effective form of Border Security.
Trump says a physical Wall, others say that electronic surveillance combined with barriers would be more effective. Let’s hear what experts have to say.
7
We already know what experts say. And he was offered deals from all sides.
1
Look: This is a pivotal moment for Dems. Absolutely no compromise on the stupid Coulter Wall. Any perceived win for the increasingly unhinged and serial lying president will only encourage him. Just say no, no, no while trotting out bill after bill funding the government and securing the borders by modern means. Put pressure on the GOP Senate. Sooner or later it will find that collaboratoring is not in its best political interest and cut loose this menace in the WH whose behavior is probably described somewhere in the latest iteration of the DSM.
21
Narcissistic Personality Disorder is my hypothethesis. Psychiatrists qualified to make the diagnosis have said it before.
1
....and I certainly hope that all GOP voters who helped elect The Donny in that 800,000 federal workers affected understand that their petulant man-child brought on their government shutdown unemployment and their lack of a paycheck / paychecks ...and I hope they remember that in 2020 !!!
10
The democrats have to clean up the mess created by the man-child president.
In the meantime, the Saudis will continue the killing in Yemen, the North Koreans will build more nuclear weapons, the Russians will interfere in all elections and the Chinese will steal and sell us more goods...
Life moves on...
8
When in a negotiation it's incredibly important to place conditions on compromises. In this case the Dems would do well to require the following concessions from Trump so he can build his "wall":
1) A "hand's-off" policy on Social Security and reforms to ensure its funding (take the cap off contributions for one).
2) Similar safeguards for Medicare and Medicaid.
3) Instituting serious penalties for those hiring improperly documented workers via prison terms, huge penalties and no exceptions for executives or owners.
4) Nationalized funding post high-school training and internships in order to retrain the workforce.
5) A $2 trillion infrastructure spending plan with the establishment of regional infrastructure banks/administrative authorities to ensure proper spending and implementation of projects.
Look, give Trump part of what he wants but demand that he give the American people what they need. He's supposed to be a great negotiator and, as such, he should understand this process.
6
He’s already agreed to deals several times. Then, he reneges.
7
I hope that Speaker Pelosi's plan to separate funding votes for Homeland Security and for all other government spending will gain enough GOP support to allow the US to reopen next week. If it does not, why not consider paying for the Great Wall of Trump by imposing Homeland Security surtaxes on the top 1%? Say 40% on AGI greater than $2M and 10% on grater than $500,000? That would pay for the real cost of the wall and for a lot of infrastructure repair & replacement also.
6
Some Progressive individual or SuperPAC ought to buy ad time and play Trump's "I'm proud to own the shut down; I won't blame the Democrats" speech a few times a day until the shut down ends. Maybe during the Super Bowl, too.
15
This is a new language. A shutdown is 80% of wide open.
2
To those who think this president will ever keep a promise I got news for you. This president has never ever ever kept a promise. He’s a grifter. The lies that spew from this person and his party are out for all to see. A few choice pushes from Faux News cannot hide this fact. Neither can his twitter feed.
19
@The 1%
Maybe DJT has kept some promises. After all, we still don’t know what DJT and Vladimir Putin discussed in Helsinki. Maybe the troop withdrawal from Syria is a promise to Putin fulfilled. It certainly made Putin happy.
Democrats determination to prove what responsible governance is
will prove to the voters that the instability suffered by a Trump
regime will be overcome; and order in the House and Senate will
no longer be the rule of the day.
Goodbye Trump....Goodbye and Good Riddance to these months
of corruption and chaos....
Hello Nancy...!!!
5
I’m somewhat late to these comments, but I believe the Times buried the lede.
One has to read several paragraphs to hear about how a Democratic congressman attempted to introduce the same bill that the Senate had already passed, but the Republicans “refused to recognize him”.
A legally sitting congressman. Refused to recognize him.
20
The Republicans are with and for Trump.
6
@Scott - Yep, and look how that's working out for them.
1
It is not a rational conclusion that "the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people,”. In fact, I am tired of hearing these false and worn out accusations about democrats not wanting border security or wanting "open borders" or not supporting strong immigration policies. We have strong immigration policies. We have border security and we have security. That there are people that try to subvert or avoid the process has always been true and will continue to be true with or without this idiotic wall/fence. slats. But they are a minority and hardly the biggest problem in the country. The way republicans crow on and on about Mexican immigrants would make you think the Mexicans have invaded and are just about to storm the White House. Its just not true. Its not about security other than security for republican power. Its about race. All you need to do is ask yourself one question, why has Trump never proposed a border wall between the U.S. and Canada? Nobody comes in that way? Hardly. But they are white and white people may come and go as they please. And, Mexicans that can afford to fly to Canada may then walk across the border without having to climb over that stupid wall. It all starts and ends with anyone who thought and still thinks Donald Trump should be president.
10
Republicans leave chaos after controlling all branches of the government for the last two years! Within days Pelosi will send a bill to fund the government to the Senate. This puts McConnell and the Republicans on the spot to pass it. Since they control the Senate if it fails to pass it will be their fault. Pelosi can keep sending the same bill every week and say the one part of government we control has passed a bill to reopen the government. The problem is Trump and the Republicans.
16
But since even Fox News is cocky enough to crow that 'Trump does best when he has a foil...' they shouldn't expect to much cooperation from Trump. He now want's the issue, not the wall.
4
800,000 non-essential government workers affected by this stalemate? Let those non-essentials find private sector jobs instead. Since we now know we can do without nonessential services lets make it permanent and save $billions - cancel the wall while we are at it. Maybe the money saved could go towards building subsidized healthcare plan instead.
4
Democrats need to pass a bill on day one that prevents more funding of a "wall" until at least 90% of previously-allocated funds are used up. Otherwise, this whole debacle is just using "new" funding as a theatrical prop.
If they haven't spent most of the money already allocated for "border security" it truly begs the question of how serious the GOP and the President really are about improving border security.
20
Simply amazing that Senate Republicans, who in years now long past would have been the ultimate adults in the room, are now ready to blame the Democrats for the continuing shutdown. Meanwhile, upwards of 800k employees are going without pay because the 'Pubs, Senate and House, are comatose with their loss of power.
6
Since Ryan can call a vote in the House, this is the Republican shutdown. Sadly, many Americans do not understand how bills get passed so it is easy for Trump to blame others.
10
The last 2 years have demonstrated Republicans cannot govern. They are puppets of Trump, doing his bidding, condoning his sewer presidency, looking the other way as he transgresses and trashes traditions, norms, the Constitution.
In November the American people said enough. Democrats were elected where elections were not gerrymandered, not bought by Republican dark money PACS.
What should Democrats do?
First, introduce legislation to end Republican corruption: "changes to campaign finance law, outlaws gerrymandering, and restores enforcement authority to the Voting Rights Act." Expect the Republican Senate to ignore.
Second, force the Republican Senate to choose between supporting Trump or supporting the American people.
Introduce legislation to end the government shutdown without funding a wall but funding improved border security. Expect the Republican Senate to ignore.
Introduce legislation to fund the government including Trump's 10th Century B.C. wall. But. Tie the wall funding to:
1) DACA granted permanent citizenship,
2) An increase in taxes on people earning over $1 million gross income to 50 percent; an increase in taxes on people earning over $10 million gross income to 70 percent.
Let Republicans choose to end the government shutdown, resolve DACA, build Trump's wasteful, ineffectual wall but pay for it with new taxes; or choose to continue supporting Trump, keep the government shutdown and prove to the American people that Republicans cannot govern.
10
Gee, Republicans can lower taxes but they can’t seem to run or pay for the government. Too hard Mitch, Paul and the Donald?
10
Sarah Huckabee Sanders, the White House press secretary, wrote in a statement Thursday afternoon. “The president does not want the government to remain shut down, but he will not sign a proposal that does not first prioritize our county’s safety and security.”
Then Trump should resign, for his very presence has become the country's greatest threat to its safety and security.
14
What is really facing Democrats is taking back our democracy, reaffirming the rule of law, and bringing forward the will of the majority. An awesome responsibility, which they need to be as forceful and demanding in pursuit of as the founders of this great country. The harder they push for human rights, across the entire spectrum, from voting, healthcare, and the environment to immigration reform and the treatment of minorities, the better the quality of the lives of future generations will be. Set the bar very, very high!
7
Why should the Democrats do anything before they take over the House? They did have a deal with the GOP until Trump puled out the rug from underneath them. The Guy, who as POTUS has sent shock waves through the entire world, is determined to get his "Wall" because if he doesn't his base will be disappointed. Remember, this is the first president in my memory (and I'm an old guy) who has made no attempt to bring the nation together. Instead he travels around the country to receive the cheers from his minions wearing their red hats bearing the words "Make America Great Again." I have never understood why the word "Again" is part of that slogan. No one has been able to explain it to me.
6
The Democrats should offer DJT a new proposal: a series of strongly worded billboards, instead of a wall. DJT will find this hard to resist if he is told that his face (14 feet high! 48 feet wide! Talk about terrifying!) will be on all the billboards. The text can inform would immigrants just how very much they are not welcome here; and tell them to go “back where they came from.” This would be far less expensive than a wall. It even has the potential to become a tourist attraction. After all, Burma Shave signs were very popular. And the billboards will be more effective than the wall: they will make a perfect visual setting for DJT when he goes down to the border to strut and flounce around, praising himself to the heavens. Also, they will be a better deterrent than a wall. The huge, repetitive pictures of DJT will induce nausea and revulsion. People will be reluctant to pass under that evil visage. Crossings numbers will plummet downwards with the installation of the first billboard. Winning all around!
6
this looks deliberate by Republicans, anything to diminish the ability of Democrats in Congress to govern
5
Essential government workers are required to go to work without pay or be court marshaled (e.g. the Coast Guard) while Congress adjourns again. Congress and the president should be required to work without pay eight hours a day SEVEN days a week in one place, together, during government shutdowns that their failure to work effectively have created.
10
The "wall" is Trump's version of Reagan's Star Wars pork project. Useless and expensive.
The GOP hasn't changed at all.
11
You can almost hear Ronald Reagan now ... "Tear down (the shutdown over) the wall, Mr. Trump."
The maladaptive fantasy is that shutdown only impacts 800,000 government employees is "Trump Truth." It endangers all of us, especially single working mothers, children and the elderly who cannot afford to have Congress' vastly older white male millionaires and billionaires playing politics with their lives. Millions rely on government services that are endangered by this ridiculous political gamesmanship.
The tried and true Congressional mix of ignorance, arrogance and testosterone is horrific for our citizens. We the American people will vote the ineffective, dead wood out in 2020. We did it in the Midterms, and we will do it again. It would be more efficient if the self-serving members of Congress could find their morals and ethics before then, but there's no chance of that. New blood is the only solution.
Is it too much to ask that they people we've hired, the ones earning well into the six figures for the privilege of serving the nation, actually do their jobs? Work for a living? Like the rest of us?
Stop the shutdown, then pack your bags.
13
1. Why are we allowing the "president" of our country to hold us hostage?
2. NO extortion money for #45's border wall!
3. Use our hard earned Tax payer money for Health Care and rebuilding our U.S. infrastructure.
15
“The Office of Personnel Management encouraged affected federal employees on Thursday to ask their landlords and other creditors if they would be able to pay just part of their bills for the duration of the shutdown. The office also advised employees to consult their “personal attorney” if they had further problems.”
How clueless are these people?
18
Call me crazy but I would imagine one great way to "prioritize our...security" as Huckabee Sanders says, would be to pay our border agents and coast guard while they work!
14
I do not want a single penny of my tax dollars paying for this.
15
"When Democrats sent Representative Jim McGovern of Massachusetts to the floor to try to force consideration of a stopgap funding bill that the Senate had already passed, Republicans would not recognize him."
So that's the GOP's method of "governing in a bi-partisan way", to just ignore a person if they don't want to even consider a proposal.
How is a Congress to work together, if one party will not even recognize the presence of a member of the other party?
10
Typical of the GOP to leave a mess behind for the DEMs to clean up.
I wonder if they did it on purpose, to slow down the implementation of the DEMs' own agenda.
10
The sheer hypocrisy of closing the government for $5 billion to build a useless wall when the Trump administration has spent only 6 percent of the $1.7 billion allocated during the 2017 and 2018 fiscal years for physical barriers on the border vividly demonstrates the absurdity of the President's demands. If he were serious about dealing with these refugees he would instead ask for money to provide more judges at the border to handle the large number of asylum seekers. There is no excuse for this, and I can only hope the American voters will see how poor the Republicans and Trump are in running the government and will fire them at the earliest opportunity.
504
It’s even more clear now than it was before that this is an ego trip. He doesn’t want to extend ‘a wall’, he wants ‘his wall’. He wants something to call his own and only his, from start to finish.
I’m convinced that he thinks this will be added to the wonders of the world and go down in the history books as “the great wall of trump”.
51
@Sammy - Brilliant post. It's a weapon - that is, the American people are a weapon - in his political strategy. He is using the wall nonsense to incite his base, to deflect from the onslaught of criminal investigations into his team and himself, and most importantly: Once the democratic House is in place and will not allow the 5B, he can lay the failure at their feet rather than his own where it belongs. It's a strategy to have done this now and if there are a few things we know about Trump, it's that he's a con artist and completely devoid of morals and humanity. That he has people who believe in his nonsense is a complete indicator of the lack of education in the US as well as the undercurrent of racism. No one should believe in this clown, and nor do they without one of those 2 things.
52
@Sammy - My guess is that Comrade Cheetos is holding out because he either promised some 1%'er or corporation that they would profiteer off of his wall or he himself is the one lined up to profiteer off of this project. After all, he's going to need to continue raising funds to cover his escalating legal fees.
34
TRUMP'S POSITION In the matter of border safety is DOA. He is too impaired in his thinking to acknowledge that security experts have requested a border fence with electronic monitoring devices at the sum of $1.3 billion. Trump denies the advice of the experts. His plan will leave the country more vulnerable than before, because it moves away from the goal of increasing border safety. Trump's claim that the Israeli fence is very highly effective is yet another of his pack of "alternative facts" (AKA LIES). In fact, the Israeli border wall is a focal point when the terrorist group Hamas mounts armed attacks against Israel. The evidence is clear: weapons imported from Iran and other states hostile to Israel enter Gaza and the West Bank in underground tunnels. Does Trump truly imagine that those who wish to harm the US are capable of importing arms via underground tunnels dug from the Mexico side of the border into US territory? The problem is that Trump imagines NOTHING other than his infantile demands. Once again, the US government is reduced to shutdown due to Trump's inability to engage in constructive problem-solving. He is a TRAITOR! (Disclaimer: The expression DOA, or "dead on arrival" is intended to describe the status of the demand for $5 billion for a border wall solely and exclusively. No harm is intended toward the person of the president.) Trump CANNOT dictate US policy via a Tweet-ocracy. It is no substitute for a DEMOCRACY as the founders envisioned.
5
Trump, the ultimate patriot, should pay for the wall himself.
After all, he’s a multibillionaire isn’t he?
8
The current shutdown of the US government promulgated by the POTUS constitutes DICTATORSHIP. In a democracy, the will of the majority is supposed to prevail. It is apparent that the majority of US voters and Congress do not support the southern border wall that the POTUS wants. His tweets and other statements have made it clear that the shutdown is because HE wants the wall -never mind that it is causing hardship to government employees during the holiday period from Christmas to the New Year. Both Republican and Democrat members of Congress must act now to halt continuing the whims of the dictator "president".
4
"The Office of Personnel Management encouraged affected federal employees on Thursday to ask their landlords and other creditors if they would be able to pay just part of their bills for the duration of the shutdown. The office also advised employees to consult their “personal attorney” if they had further problems."
This exposes Trump's strategy for what it really is: A thoughtless, narcissistic game of chicken with the American people, who may soon get tired of 'winning'.
5
I hope they stand firm. Trump has publicly before the world declared that this was his Shutdown. Mexico was supposed to pay for this Wall, not the taxpayers.
4
There is a rule that you don’t negotiate with terrorists, well you can’t negotiate with liars who renege on every deal they make and are goaded by radio shock jocks into recklessness. If Democrats let Trump get away with this there is no telling what other brinkmanship he will use.
Democrats should spend the next two years showing the country what a responsible legislature does, they should legislate. By sending bill after bill to the Senate where Mitch McConnell will inevitable sit on them, they will show the country that the Republicans are the true obstructionists. They can pass bills to: reopen the government, protect Robert Mueller, shore up the ACA, build real infrastructure, enact ethics reform, place more sanctions on Russia, restore President Obama’s environmental protection agenda, fight climate change, fund science, protect women from sexual harassment in the workplace and more. The Democrats should spend the next two years demonstrating to the American people all that needs to be done in this country and all that could be done if Republicans didn’t block everything, so they can pass tax cuts for the rich and build useless walls.
They should give the country a preview of what a Democratic Congress, Senate and White House could do, showing Americans the real choice in 2020. A choice, not just between a responsible adult in the White House and an incompetent clown but a choice between a country that is stagnating and one that is moving forward.
9
I expect the entire government to work for the best interest of the American people. Yes we have large immigration problems, we have the Dreamers, people here illegally, outdated laws, flooded immigration courts, outdates holding facilities at the borders, none of witch will be fixed or addressed by a 40 foot, 1500 mile wall. If we have an extra 15 billion plus to spend along with plenty of political capital lets fix the problems, not use it so trump can tell his base and pals he won.
7
A sure way to cure government shutdowns is to dock each member of both houses five days paper day of shut down. If the shutdown goes more than 5 days they would be docked at 1% of their retirement benefits in perpetuity per continued day of shutdown. This penalty would applied to the president as well. That automotive ate those folks to do something useful.
3
The Dems need to be on the airwaves hammering home a succinct, obvious message:
1) Trump said Mexico was going to pay for the wall.
2) Trump hasn’t spent the $1.6B allocated to border security last year, so he obviously doesn’t care about actual security.
3) The wall is a boondoggle.
Then pass a bill that has DACA protection, voting rights protections, retroactive tax filing requirements for the President, and protection for Mueller along with with 5 billion for the boondoggle. If he wants it, Individual 1 needs to pay for it.
9
I think the democrats are going to lose on this one, if you call passing legislation to appease a child in order to keep the US government from collapsing losing.
Reasons being:
Trump believes that the federal government is mostly made up of democrats
Trump does not care what happens to Americans who didn't vote for him
Trump will not be bothered by any problems related to the shutdown as long as unemployment stays low and the stock market goes up - which are 2 indicators he can understand
Trump believes that building a wall you can see from space will ensure his legacy as a great president
For all of the above reasons, he will happily watch Rome burn. Like the traitor he is.
280
@Turgid
Stock markets are going down rapidly, despite the upward bump the other day.
11
@Turgid Never give in to terrorists, hostage-takers or traitors!
25
You mean the unemployment data source he called cooked before the election?
18
“The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat Party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people".
I have to think that Sarah H-S, given her upbringing, believes she will will be called to account for her actions at the end of her life.
Yet, she can lie like that with a straight face.
There were more apprehensions and deportations under Obama (Democrat) than under Bush (Republican) or Trump (Republican).
In fact, apprehensions in 2017 were at their lowest since 1971. BTW, the source for that figure is the U.S. Border Patrol.
4
Some possible alternatives or solutions for the use of $5 billion to enhance border security instead of a wall:
a) Provide more assistance to Mexico in the fight against illegal drug trafficking and corruption.
b) Provide aid and investment in businesses in Central America to provide work for people that would otherwise be immigrants.
c) Most of all, cease all support for despots in Central American countries that create a climate of fear and violence in their countries.
In general, help to create a social and economic environment in Central America two that the people living there won't want to or have to leave their countries.
7
"The office also advised employees to consult their “personal attorney” if they had further problems." Really? If working class people cannot pay their rent how can they pay attorneys? The question is not do we need secure borders? We do. The question is whether Trump's wall is the best way to effect this? The wall will supposedly deter drug smuggling, for example. Cartels use tunnels, boats, light aircraft and maybe even drones to get drugs across the border and a wall won't prevent this. Israels wall is effective? True, but their borders are not as long as ours, the walls are mainly to keep terrorists out, and the wall is policed by the IDF and special border police. The military cannot be used in the same way in the US as a matter of law. A wall in the US has downsides such as environmental, commerce between border towns, breaking apart families, etc.
4
The President made it a really rough holiday season for hundreds of thousands of government employees. He put our National Parks in jeopardy, but he cares little for anything out of doors except perhaps golf courses. He would probably happily cede all parks to corporate interests. And then there are agencies like the IRS. Things may get a bit disagreeable though when Americans try to get tax refunds and find that the software is not available to complete and submit tax returns online. Hmmm, and what if returns are delayed because so many IRS employees were furloughed. The Trump shutdown is a gift that may well keep on giving. And, dare I opine, ah, hope even, that more and more Republicans are getting sick of his petty petulance and bullying.
4
If a foreign nation shut down the US Government. But the President and the Republican Congress do it and they’re heroes.
1
All Congress has to do is refuse to vote or discuss any bills the President wants until he stops this foolishness. To be blackmailed by him into doing something that will waste $5 billion of our dollars is unconscionable.
329
@ExPatMX
Or, Congress could vote on a reasonable bill, let Trump veto it if he chooses, and vote to overturn the veto.
42
@ExPatMX
A 2/3 majority in both houses would pass a funding bill over the president's veto. If GOP senators don't join to provide a 2/3 majority, it will clearly be the whole Republican party's shutdown, making America great again.
36
@Lascaux McConnell won't allow that to happen!
9
Those directly impacted by this monstrous symbolism of division under the guise of providing safety and security are the people whose properties exist along the 1,900 miles projected route.
Homesteads, ranchers and businesses, along with established Native American Tribes will be uprooted and forced to relocate. And should they resist, the Gov't will simply use the power of eminent domain.
I envision this barrier will come to be referred to as the 'wall of shame', a blight on the environment, and forced, unreasonable displacement of Americans who've lived there for generations.
205
@November-Rose-59 Yet even the power of eminent domain is litigable in federal court, and the cases can drag on for years (there are already some from the Obama administration) because of the "just compensation" element of the "takings clause" in the 5th Amendment. The ranchers and tribes and other landowners will tie up the federal government in court for years. The great irony, of course, is that many of the landowners are (very) conservative and may have voted for tRump, and they will turn on him when it is their land, their livelihood being taken by an overreaching federal government. Or at least I hope so.
21
@November-Rose-59 Yes! The border is an incredibly peaceful and secure area. People who are unfamiliar with it don’t understand it. For centuries, people have been crossing it and going back and forth. It’s the busiest border crossing in the word. When Trump says he’ll close it, that means that Americans are being kept in. As you say, to negatively impact ranchers and Native American nations like that is irresponsible. Not to mention the environmental damage.
10
@November-Rose-59 Great point and not discussed nearly enough! I don't think enough people understand the impact on the environment, the people and wildlife that live along the border.
6
On January 2nd the House Democrats should simply pass a new federal funding bill identical to the one already approved this month by the Republican Senate and send it to Trump - funding for border security but not the Wall. Then it’s all up to Trump to either sign the bill or he can continue to be responsible for the government shut down.
238
And then let us see who votes to override the veto.
17
@Don P.
Yes, thank you.
7
Trump will never take responsibility even when he says he will welcome and own a shutdown. He lies to cover up his lies.
15
President Trump says there's an emergency on our borders, but has administration has not even spent the border monies allocated when the GOP controlled both the House and the Senate. His 'national emergency' is mostly poor innocent Central Americans fleeing gang violence to request asylum, as is their right by laws and international treaty obligations. He wants people to ignore his past campaign promise that Mexico would pay for his grandiose wall, and now to ignore his more recent commitment that he would accept personal responsibility for closing the government. The Democrats won election control of the House, by millions of votes, partly on their promise not to fund Trump's wall and to reassert the co-equal responsibility of the House as a foundation of our constitutional system of government. Time for the GOP controlled Senate to step up to their responsibilities and for Congress to agree on a national budget resolution. If Trump vetoes, Congress should then override, and protect our rights to a functioning federal government. Voters will have an opportunity in 2020 to say yes or no on this and other issues!
9
The only question now is whether we are going to get the old Democratic caucus/party, or are we going to get the new one ?
The old way of doing business was for Democrats to continuously bargain in good faith with republicans. It would invariably lead to Democrats caving on some sort of new tax theft for the rich or corporations to save some little social program here or there.
The NEW Democratic party, is chock full of new representatives that are far more Liberal and Progressive and demand a new paradigm. No longer are the people going to be held hostage by republicans for more tax theft, a wall or whatever.
Ms. Pelosi was one of the best Speakers of the House in American history, as well as the most productive. I expect now to the same, if not more productive with more Progressive votes. There will be bill, after bill sent to the Senate and the House for approval and signing.
It is now up to the press to show who is truly holding up the country, If they fail and start down the usual path of false equivalencies, then we will all lose ...
8
The only question now is whether we are going to get the old Democratic caucus/party, or are we going to get the new one ?
The old way of doing business was for Democrats to continuously bargain in good faith with republicans. It would invariably lead to Democrats caving on some sort of new tax theft for the rich or corporations to save some little social program here or there.
The NEW Democratic party, is chock full of new representatives that are far more Liberal and Progressive and demand a new paradigm. No longer are the people going to be held hostage by republicans for more tax theft, a wall or whatever.
Ms. Pelosi was one of the best Speakers of the House in American history, as well as the most productive. I expect now to the same, if not more productive with more Progressive votes. There will be bill, after bill sent to the Senate and the House for approval and signing.
It is now up to the press to show who is truly holding up the country, If they fail and start down the usual path of false equivalencies, then we will all lose .
3
> But Mr. McConnell could also choose to bring whatever House Democrats pass up for a vote, allowing it to publicly fail as a way to force Mr. Trump and Democrats to the negotiating table.
This would be true if the White House demonstrated itself as a consistent negotiating body. I think given that Trump first torpedoed a one month stopgap bill, then arbitrarily increased the amount of money he was willing to accept, Pelosi and Schumer could easily reply to McConnell doing this with 'We have no expectation that the White House will negotiate in good faith, as he as repeatedly proven in causing this shutdown in the first place.' We expect the Senate, and its Republican majority, to step up and do what the President will not, and open our government.
Whether it's Trump or Republican Senators that get the blame, I don't see how McConnell could believes Democrats will be blamed for the Senate voting down a spending bill. Come January 4, they'll be the one governing body in D.C. which promises 'opening the government right now, with this bill, immediately.'
4
The only question now is whether we are going to get the old Democratic caucus/party, or are we going to get the new one ?
The old way of doing business was for Democrats to continuously bargain in good faith with republicans. It would invariably lead to Democrats caving on some sort of new tax theft for the rich or corporations to save some little social program here or there.
The NEW Democratic party, is chock full of new representatives that are far more Liberal and Progressive and demand a new paradigm. No longer are the people going to be held hostage by republicans for more tax theft, a wall or whatever.
Ms. Pelosi was one of the best Speakers of the House in American history, as well as the most productive. I expect now to the same, if not more productive with more Progressive votes. There will be bill, after bill sent to the Senate and the House for approval and signing.
It is now up to the press to show who is truly holding up the country, If they fail and start down the usual path of false equivalencies, then we will all lose.
1
Maybe this is the point of the shutdown. By forcing Democrats to clean up this mess it will limit the power Democrats have to move their agenda forward.
1
This is a proposed budget for a short term, just a few months. If the Democrats cave, will this happen every few months? The silence of Republicans about possible damage to the country by not only this shut down, but also these short term budgets rather than long term allowing for plans is appalling. Probably the Republican concern about damage to the government or to the people in the country from these budget fiascos doesn’t seem to exist, because they hope government becomes a very limited thing. The federal judicial appointees seem to have been carefully selected for those beliefs. By the way, have more judges been pushed through during this budget crises while our attention is elsewhere? There has been limited news about the radical changes being made to our third branch of government.
4
While minority is ruling right now, Trump & co cannot force their way on the majority. And American people know it - thus 47% fault Trump for causing the shutdown, an opposite of Clinton-Gingrich duel - no matter how Hunkabee tried to spin it
Of course, Trump's wall is as much a Mueller sleight of hands as a way to rouse his base. You know the wall is not a solution to our immigration problem, long or short term.
14
Prediction: Congressional Republicans, their backs to the wall, will reject political Hara - kiri. They will bend to the rising ire of the American people. They will tell President Pathological, aka President Grifter, where he can put his stupid, wasteful, foolish wall.
27
I don’t believe in portents, but I recently watched the 1950 film “Born Yesterday” & was startled at how closely the Broderick Crawford character foreshadows a certain Washington newsmaker. Garson Kanin must have written the screenplay with the aid of a crystal ball. And Judy Holliday reminds me of someone too.
7
I am far from being Trump's supporter, but I respect his willingness to keep all the promises he gave during his campaign, one of them building the Wall. I think my democratic friends should at least learn this aspect of Trumpism - keeping election promises. We all remember the promises to close Guantanamo prison among other things by some other president.
5
Not keeping campaign promises because there is good reason not to is different than keeping a promise that makes no sense at any cost.
9
Your sentiment regarding keeping election promises falls flat when it comes to spending over $5 billion on an ineffectual wall for a dubious goal when that money could be spent on things of greater value in our nation. Fighting poverty, improving education, healthcare and many other, more noble goals come to mind among many others.
8
No, President Trump has not made an effort to fulfill his most important campaign promises. Health care is the most visible of his failures. The Trump Wall is solely a political act on his part, and he has put forward no factual analysis to support the effectiveness of The Trump Wall. He can’t even tell you what it is. He’s digging in his heals to deflect attention from the many investigations into his corruption and lies.
Let’s see a comprehensive plan for border security that includes physical barriers where effective and needed, plus technical devices and border patrol presence. Seems like funding has been made available to address this in the past, and is included in the Dem proposals. Even McConnell has no idea about exactly what Trump wants, except $5B for a Wall. Don’t waste my tax money on an ill defined political stunt.
6
The Republicans only know how to complain - not how to govern. It's a lot easier to complain and take one side and pretend other issues and facts don't exist - but that is not governance.
28
@Details
Oh i think the republicans are good at a lot of things besides complaining, unfortunately. They've gotten rid of lots of those pesky regulations that protect our water, food, and air, sold off some of our public park land, stymied healthcare improvements, made voting more difficult, and this list could go on and on.No the problem isn't that they're incompetent - its that their competent at bad things.
4
The threat to America is certainly not a bunch of penniless impoverished immigrants from Central America coming over an allegedly porous border. Putin's very effective strategy of sewing discord and disruption in the American political system is a greater threat, as is the prospect of cyber attacks on our economic system and our privacy, and the manipulation of America's silly fatuation with social media (which has been show to be so easily owned by outside forces).
Trump's border wall temper tantrum (and the partisan tainted trip to visit our service men and women) is clearly a very effective distraction from his mounting legal woes, and his ineffectual loosing foreign policy. How does he get away with the blatent lie about military pay, and claiming he alone was responsible for a 10% military pay increase? This is not even how the American government works!
The new American oligarchy is winning in a big way-most Americans are being left behind while their neighborhoods are being despoiled and America's natural resources are being sold off to Trump's small cadre of wealthy constituents aiming to reap a short term gain from environmental deregulation.
The idea that the Democratic Party is in favor of illegal immigration is laughable. The only people benefiting form illegal immigration are Republican supporting business owners that are reaping great profits by underpaying and exploiting undocumented workers.
Yes, we are making America greater every day!
47
Sarah Hucksterbee is just a Trump mouthpiece, no reason to even consider her words of any value, plus she's out post NYear. Let the Koch Bros or other rich Rep. donors pay for a DJT 'memorial' wall, to be engraved w/the names of what have been sacrificed for it (clean air, water, education, healthcare for US citizens, nat'l infrastucture, etc).
27
Trump has tried everything to destroy, hinder, criticize, marginalize, diminish, demean, our great country. From the FBI, to the Department of Justice, our Judiciary, many, many government agencies, he has done nothing but create a hostile working environment. NOW, he just shuts the Government down, like a 2-year old with a temper tantrum....A half million people are out of work and not getting paid. What else is this madman capable of? Who cares or wants to find out. It should be very apparent to even those misguided supporters he is the WRONG person for the job! Make America Whole Again= Get rid of trump!
29
Schooling costs $20,000.00 per child.
When you add up free housing, medical care and food, the total is $50,000.00 per yer.
If the wall stops 20 kids, that is a savings of a million dollars a year.
1
Which 1) is peanuts and 2) would be an investment in the future of the country.
6
So, if the wall stops 20 kids a year for a savings of $1,000,000 per annum, the wall will pay for itself in 5,000 years. Doesn’t sound like a great return to me.
9
the 40 parents of these 20 kids would be paid about 30k per year and would bring about 50K to their employers, which is about 2,000K. US business, not to mention the IRS, would clear 1,000K.
5
Trump shutdown, trump shutdown, trump shutdown. Never forget.
20
I'm old enough to know the Democrats always have to clean up the Republican pig sty after they make a mess of the country. I love that the first bill addresses campaign finance. You'll have to fight the Justice department who always sides with those with the big bucks. They looked the other way to the Corporate campaign cash, Republican lawmaking favors back to the campaign funders. Forget the wall. The troops are good sentinels. The wall is dumb. The military is supposed to defend the land anyway.
14
Trump supporters' trust in this 5-billion-dollar drama IS MISPLACED. The already allocated $1.3B only achieves 84 miles of FENCE. More importantly, Trump is now double-crossing the American worker.
As of 3 December, Homeland Security announced plan "to alter the lottery-based selection process for H-1B applications to favor people with master’s degrees or higher. The agency has also said it plans to revise the definition of a “specialty occupation,” in order to enhance the visa program’s ability to obtain “the best and the brightest foreign nationals.”
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mercurynews.com/2018/12/21/h-1b-homeland-security-secretary-signals-change-to-controversial-visa-program/amp/
Republican Congress couldn't pass "merit based" immigration reform, so Kirstjen Nielson is simply changing the procedures of "lottery system", so that ENTIRE quota of 85,000 H-1B visas holders have MASTER DEGREES OR PHD's.
Parents can stop worrying about whether their children will have enough opportunity. New tech positions WILL be filled by foreign candidates who WILL work less.
While our military looks for ISIS in a group of lettuce pickers, Kirstjen Nielson is now ensuring that next 85,000 immigrants will have a masters degree and a confirmed job. SIMULTANEOUSLY, she is claiming that she protects the American worker from THE KNOWN H-1B visa abuses.
The Red State Gullible Gus has not a single clue of the foreign competition that the Super Donor Party is bringing.
8
Please Democrats, be relentlessly open, honest and Crystal clear on how Trump and Republicans have served their own intrests, the intrest of the ultra weathy and the intrest of the money bloated corporations that continue to offshore jobs while holding out their grubby mitt's to recieve taxpayer money.
All the while they treat average Americans like lazy, expenible subjects for not being born with a silver spoon in our mouths.
12
Has there ever been a more vile, lying and delusional Press Secretary in the history of the US? Sarah Sanders is so much like her father (the clueless and fibbing part), he must really be proud.
26
trump, the deal maker..... trump, the negotiator..... no where in site. crazy thing is he was ready to make a deal but his media lapdogs bit him and he backed away.
7
@Aaron: But, not nearly as alarming as Trump's idiotic belief that a wall will keep illegal immigrants from Latin America out of the U.S.
This is more about scoring political points, by pleasing his lily-white base.
Say what you will about the Democrats. But, like ot ir not, more than half the country is not in favor of a wall, either.
9
The incoming Congress should introduce a bill to re-start the government, minus any money for "the wall", and reintroduce the same bill with a sweetner each time it is vetoed, until enough Republicans in the Senate cross the aisle to support it in defiance of Trump. Otherwise, let them live with the optics. This leaves Trump with no wall, no recourse, a split GOP, the enmity of the MAGA crowd - and a lame duck.
11
So our President, whom just a week ago, bragged that he would gladly own the shutdown is back peddling once again and trying to place the blame on the democrats. Then, there's lying Sarah Sanders. Where does she get her facts from, the back of a cereal box? I hope the Democratic House stays the course.
11
Dems should offer LESS. Less every week.
20
Has Trump commented on how this will affect the 800,000 government employees, who were so casually told to basically try to figure out how to live without being paid? How is it Making America Great to treat govt employees like dogs who must go beg and yet, somehow be committed to their jobs?
Sarah Huckabee Sander's comment about this Democrats caring more about immigrants than Americans is ludicrous and shows how far she has sold her soul (Christian, indeed) and intellect (if there was any) to stand by her guy: this gutless, cowardly, egoistical fool. How I wish that Trump's followers could figure out that their emperor has no clothes! I am baffled how they don't.
23
The incoming democratic house should offer 5 billion Mexican pesos to pay for the wall. It would seem fitting since Mexico was "going" to pay for the wall in the first place anyway, so any funds Trump gets for it, should at least come in Mexican currency.
4
Trump said the wall would have prevented the California cop from being murdered by an illegal immigrant.
Guess what. The cop himself was an immigrant from Fiji.
9
"They have offered Mr. Trump $1.3 billion for border security and not budged." Again, we still don't have a coherent Democratic plan for immigration, so it's just here's some money for the wall and we'll just continue to criticize you for it. Pathetic.
So do tell me all the great plans the Republicans have.
Explain why for two years of completely control nothing's been done.
(Answer: ultra-right SCOTUS judges and $1.5 trillion in tax thefts for the rich were more important.)
5
First, the $ in the bill Trump originally agreed to ... before lunatic Limbaugh and cronies started whining ... is for normal security, not a ridiculous, ineffective, wasteful "wall."
Second, the Gang That Can't Shoot Straight hasn't spent the $ from the previous budget for border security. This whole dustup is just Trump's desperation to deflect from the corruption that's endemic to his Swamp Monster mob.
Third, a bipartisan immigration bill couldn't get through the GOP Senate in Feb 2018, a compromise that Trump swore to veto anyway. The failure is Republican. Own it.
Thanks for your contribution to the low-info ideologue file.
3
You mean like this one?
https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/immigration-reform/
2
Trump persistently equates the “Wall” with border security, and Dem’s opposition to the “Wall” as support for open borders.
Now the logic in this equivalence is clearly faulty. But Trump sees no problem in repeating non sequiturs, possibly because he has seen constant repetition of idiocy eventually established it as good sense. It is the basis of much advertising.
To overcome Trump’s campaign, pointing out the illogical isn’t helpful, because those who think Trump is the Messiah aren’t engaged by careful wording or facts or reasons.
However, a blitz of TV and radio spots could work, illustrating amusingly that there are more suitable alternatives to securing the border. They must be entertaining, original, and cause a chuckle. No preaching and no hectoring.
As a counterbalance, another blitz of videos about the wrong-headed treatment by the Trump organization of asylum seekers should shame their lack of humanity and imagination.
Making Trump and the GOP by turns both ridiculous and inhuman on every TV, billboard, and radio station can submerge these charlatans if they are ubiquitous and well done.
7
@John Brews ..✅✅
Republican voters and a large proportion of "independents" and "swing voters" simply don't have minds that work that way. Remember when W. Bush invaded Iraq in order to defeat Al Qaeda and put a stop to international terrorism? Prime example of a non sequitur right there. Democrats pounced on it and launched a year-long TV ad blitz pointing that out. It didn't help one bit. Bush even won the popular vote in 2004. When it comes to the American voter, appeals to reason, humanity and shame are never going to work. In an age when most voters shun television and radio and instead get their information from anonymous sources of uncertain nationality on the Internet, we are utterly defenseless against information warfare launched by hostile foreign powers. Our government cannot respond in kind with large scale counterintelligence operations of our own, because our enemies have focused their efforts on propping up a single political party whose agenda is inherently anti-American. Therefore any attempt to fight back would be explicitly partisan and not acceptable to our political system.
2
This is affecting real people. Today a low income technician was in tears because her pay was short 12 hours for work she did last Saturday. Rent is due and with Xmas things are tight. She is still expected to show up to work and to add insult to injury she received an email warning her of the restrictions on outside employment. The callousness of this administration is disheartening.
563
@Joseph
During Clinton administration, two full government shutdowns during 1995 and 1996 lasted five and 21 days respectively. During the Barack Obama administration, a 17-day government shutdown occurred during October 2013.
This is not posted to to continue to wage any back-and-forth validation nitpicking, but you'd have to admit that singling out this administration for alleged heartlessness is a bit low on substance.
6
@Joseph. She should learn to prioritize her spending a little better
1
@JBC I was present for the 2013 shutdown as well and there differences. Obama wasn’t sending tweets or making statements saying federal employees were happy to work without pay or that those affected were mostly democrats. Department secretaries were also sending messages in 2013 that were encouraging and showing gratitude for the work of excepted employees and regret for those furloughed not messages reminding staff of standards of conduct of restrictions on outside employment. This administration is handling this with the same grace they handle pretty much every other issue. So yes, let’s get into a back and forth.
76
The shutdown will continue until the New Democrat majority hope starts. The they can send Trump a bill that includes money for the wall, but also makes him get back on board with protecting the environment, including the Paris Accords. He might agree. If not, I guess the shutdown continues until 2020. It should be interesting.
1
Government employees are encouraged to ask their landlords if they will accept partial payment for rent, etc.
Sure that Donald Trump, the landlord of landlords, would have allowed late rent payments because a president encouraged government shutdown.
8
As a person who sits on the far left (and is a minority), I haven’t heard the Democrats propose an alternate plan to the wall. Both parties agree our immigration system is flawed, yet I’ve heard no proposal of a solution from my party. I’m 100% anti wall and disappointed Dems can’t articulate a plan. Not feeling hopeful for 2020.
1
You're not listening. If you want a personal message, you're not going to get it. Complain to the NYT for not devoting an article specifically to the subject, yes, but read articles on the overall subject and you'll see it.
Dems have proposed normal security measures - drone surveillance, more border cops, more money - and in fact, the adminstration hasn't even spent the $ provided in the last budget.
Something a little suspicious about the "far left" and "a minority" tag in the "John Hancock" post -- reads more like a paid Republican concern troll.
4
So, basically D's are weighing 3 ways to grandstand, none of which has a chance to get funds flowing. Very sad. Pelosi is wasting an opportunity to get DACA moving.
1
In March, the President met with Pelosi and Schumer...they offered money for border security (or toward the "wall") in exchange for DACA path to citizenship....Trump seemed to agree, only to backpedal later when his conservative wranglers disagreed.
Republicans have disregarded their job to govern. They've had all 3 branches of government for 2 years and all they've accomplished is a huge tax cut for corporations and the wealthiest, and added another $1.5 trillion to the debt.
Dems are in a much more powerful position now. They shouldn't give him a dime for anything.
4
I have a great deal of concern for ALL the Federal Employees who are having their pay withheld due to the Government Shutdown. The person who needs to be held accountable for this malady is Donald Trump. He initiated and caused this shutdown. He had other options that the entire Senate both Republicans and Democrats had agreed upon. Again, Donald Trump is responsible for the government shutdown and it is he who the entire country should hold accountable for this egregious and self-centered act.
7
Two years isn't much time for Pelosi to work her old time religion, especially if most of it is dealing with government shutdowns and impeachment snipe hunts. More chaos for 2020 on the way?
1
BTW, no one in the Congress or White House should be getting paid during the shutdown. If you can't do your job, you don't get paid. That would ensure a speedy resolution to this farce.
7
This is sorta the GOP standard move these days. Democracy doesn’t fit your idea. Shut down democracy. Make a play that its being “principled” but really, if I can’t win on ideas. I quit the game....And toss the board on the ground.
5
Once again, Trump creates a crisis in order to divert attention away from the increasing exposure his and his administration's corruption (ala the "Caravan").
He clearly has no sense of or concern for the hardship he is creating to his country, its citizens, and those who seek safety here.
4
I would be interested in the excuses from trump supporters about trump claims that Mexico would pay for this. Why do they not care about his multitude of lies? Did they actually believe him when he said it about a hundred times on the campaign trail?
6
The GOP knows one thing and that is the Democrats can’t get out of their own way. Where on earth is the commercial paid for by the Dems with a montage of Trump saying that Mexico was paying for the wall cutting to US citizens saying I guess we are paying for the wall. Promises made Promises broken. Show it on TV, Instagram, Facebook etc.
Follow the up with an ad that the wall is a waste and keep blaming the GOP over and over again.
11
I work for a large American corporation. If there were operational issues in my area impacting customers, everyone would be expected to work around the clock to fix it. We could certainly never ever leave that mess & go off for a prolonged holiday. It's beyond comprehension.
It boggles my mind that Congress & the president just left the federal government shut down & could go off for a holiday. And didn't the "deal maker" shout over the rooftops that "Mexico will pay for the wall!" ? Why aren't Democrats & media throwing that in his face. I barely hear that.
7
The GOP is very good at using the levers of government to obstruct, but is oddly incompetent at getting them to do anything useful
5
Roughly one third of American adults will support Trump ... regardless. Mostly die hard Republicans, extreme evangilists, racists, and the already mega rich. Most of these people also believe the Earth was made as it is by God roughly 6,000-10,000 years ago (Gallup poll). So its likely that the Repubs will budge on anything until after the 2020 election. The Tea Party, extreme right wing owns the Republican party now.
So, there will be no easy resolution of any struggle. Dems need a compromise that gets something VERY important. Like Social Security reform and funding. Not the Dreamer deal. Too many people see the Dems as very soft on Open Borders. In truth, there are likely 2-3 BILLION people who would jump at the chance to come to the EU or USA if they could. It's naive and simple to only help the people knocking on the door and leave BILLIONS of faceless desperate people to their local doom. Much of the local doom stems from aversion to family planning. Many cultures, countries and religions have ecologically ruined their own country and need to dump their demographic excess anywhere else. THe Four Horsemen come for many countries. THe Earth is finite. resources are finite. and life is a struggle.
Trump and the republicans decided on that last 3 day shutdown to keep the national Parks open with no oversight, rangers, services etc. The consequences from just a 3 day shut down resulted in a lot of resource damage from illegal activities such as off road vehicles, dogs on trails, illegal parking and camping.
The idea of leaving the door open with no oversight was to let the public feel like there are no consequences to a shutdown of our national treasures.
Well, there are. And the longer this goes on the damage will mount, not just to workers paychecks either. Poaching, defacement, and other resource damage will be inevitable. What if people start to go into Yellowstone and shoot wolves? Or Joshua Tree NP and spray paint rocks?
This is all about one man's temper tantrum; one man who has the power to affect all the American people. McConnell needs to finally step up, get the 60 votes on January 4th to help pass a clean spending bill. If he doesn't, he is complicit in feeding the baby-in-chief.
5
The saddest part of this whole fiasco is that Trump and his Republican Party have already won. They won by making this all about "the wall", a fantasy that has absolutely no relevance to the current fiscal debate. $5 billion will not build a wall. It will not even be enough to maintain and expand the fence that currently exists. The fact is that Trump voters hate the government. They think Trump is a hero for shutting it down. They want to see the people who work for the government punished, even if those people happen to work for ICE or Homeland Security. The fact that the shutdown began in the first place is a win for Trump. The longer it goes on, the more Trump wins. That means he will only end it when he gets everything he wants, and then he will win yet again. Do you really think $5 billion is going to satisfy him now that he has the power to demand literally anything he wants? I can't emphasize this enough: the government shutdown is a GOOD thing for him. Therefore he will not pass any spending bill from a Democratic House unless he gets to dictate absolutely everything that goes into it. Whenever the Democrats finally cave and give this mouse his cookie, they have totally and permanently lost the war and their House becomes a lame duck immediately and irrevocably. It's a choice between stalemate and checkmate. The shutdown cannot and will not end, and that's just fine if you're a government-hating Trump fan. The Democrats lost because they care. So long, Democracy.
3
It's all good. We will be shutting down the Republican Party in 202O in its entirety. For good and forever; but this time we want them held fully accountable for the mess they have made.,
3
As the Times has noted, there already is a wall. I appreciated the article and the map.
Points that need repeated reiterating:
Most illegals enter through airports.
Most of the remaining border is privately-owned, and will be tied
up in eminent domain lawsuits which will go on indefinitely, and
ultimately be dropped.
Ecological areas will be damaged.
Border towns are not interested in any more barriers.
Money allocated to date for this new Maginot Line has not been
spent.
And of course—Mexico is supposed to pay. And they will not, and obviously should not.
7
If I were the Democratic Party, I'd spend every last penny I had in marketing to run ads with the following 2 soundbytes:
"Mexico will pay for the wall" and "I will be proud to own this shutdown." I wouldn't debate. I wouldn't get into details. I wouldn't bargain. All I would do is repeat those two talking points over and over again until their ears bleed.Then I would cross my arms and wait. When you have the lead in a football game, you should simply run out the clock. It's when you try to run up the board that you risk a fumble and give the other guy a chance to get back in the game.
6
Despite the disinformation being pedalled here the wall IS the problem. $70 billion to finish and $1 billion to maintain every 5 years. How many hospitals, schools, roads and bridges will it steal from.
This money should be spent on making America great again. Lifting people from poverty and giving them the quality of life that Americans are working hard for.
This Trump tactic is shameful and anyone promoting it should go and look at the suffering it’s causing.
The real reason for the wall is to pay for votes in the South of the USA. Follow the money.
7
Seems to me that handing the Democrats a non-operating government is just another act of sabotage by losing Republicans. 2018 in a nutshell
3
Democrats please stick to enhanced border security, a wall isn't the answer, and let's also include DACA in these negotiations. Let's get federal employees back to work so they can serve our country instead of being pawns in 45s temper tantrum.
3
Democrats should make clear all previous offers are off the table.
Now if Trump wants any funding for the wall, it will require at least:
1. All steel must be American
2. All 11 million undocumented here now with no felony conviction get citizenship, including all DACA qualified people
3. No wall built with confiscated property from eminant domain
4. Environmental impact statement of minimal damage and maximum amelioration, e.g. cannot destroy the butterfly preserve and park in South Texas
I'd gladly give him the same $1.6 Billion offer he had with those conditions.
But I also like adding the Mueller protection and unlimited budget if he wants a penny more.
It's time for 'Nancy and Chuck' to show him what negotiating a deal requires.
6
As usual, Democrats will fix another mess created by the GOP.
3
I sure hope all the folks affected by TRUMPS government shutdown remember who is really to blame for their troubles (Trump and republicans) next time an election is here. Just sayin.
2
Trump hates government and would be happy to see all of these furloughed people just quit. How better to starve the beast and eliminate all that wasteful government spending? He'll never strike a deal ; as soon as he's given 5 billion to waste he'll demand more. No one can work with him. No deal can be struck. Use those powers of investigation. Subpoena his tax returns and publish them widely. Whenever possible, do the opposite of whatever he wants. Walk out on him when he appears at meetings, and hold the meetings somewhere else, without him. Let the hundreds of thousands of furloughed employees March on Washington like Coxie's Army, and force his removal from office. He does not deserve the benefit of any doubt, and there will not be any sort of honeymoon period. Have no illusions.
3
GOP's exiting House control with a whimper, and doubtless will seek to blame the Democrats with a fraudulent, risible, manufactured reason that won't fool a third-grader unless that 8-year old is part of the party base.
2
In this day and age, the GOP is so dumbed down, their most precious ‘policy objective’—as evidenced by the fact that their willing to shut down the government indefinitely over it—is: build a wall.
2
More like a showdown.
"the only rational conclusion..." Sarah Huckabee Sanders your as disgraceful and audacious as they come. The perfect voice for all the lies and propaganda the Republican Party are peddling. I hope everywhere the Republicans Senators go, people shout the truth at them. Show them the facts in the face of their lies. Make sure they understand clearly that our eyes are open. And when they start feeling uncomfortable just remind them, that's how we feel every day they remain in the Whitehouse.
1
Is this yet another plan by DJT to delay his impeachment (at the expense of the country)?
1
Yes, Mr. President, Israel's great Wall works wonders -- especially when Palestinian protesters (AND clearly-designated medical techs) thousands of feet away are shot by snipers behind that Wall.
Are WE gonna have snipers, too, Mr. President? We could get up to that magic 99.9% too, if we're willing to. I for one am not.
Let's treat refugees and asylum seekers like the terribly displaced* Human Beings they are.
*let's not deny our own Culpability in encouraging the ongoing disasters in Latin America, especially our efforts to overthrow Democratically-elected governments we just didn't happen to like.
3
Sad.
No-one wins here.
Not Republicans, whose timidity and callousness are once again being put on display for all of us to gawk at,
Not the Democrats, who have to somehow deflect blame onto the one person who deserves it, and clean up the mess,
And not His Nibs, who by playing to his base is hemorrhaging political capital by the day .
The irony being that if he were a caring responsible adult, SO many more people would approve of him - and maybe even like him..
98
@Kealoha I do not believe he acts alone. His agenda is to disassemble the United States of America as we have known it. He will play to his handlers. As they are think they are playing hardball, one day a mistake will change the scenario hopefully sooner rather than later. I expect the erratic staffing and poor financial management will take its toll.
16
@Kealoha The only people who would possible like Trump if he was more caring, would be non-Americans, aka as his Russian handlers. Trump nor his handlers have America's best interests in mind.
8
That’s a mighty big “IF” you presented there - so big, in fact, as to be an impossibility.
4
If the Democratic House passes a bill to fund the government again, perhaps with some disaster funding added, and it reaches the Republican Senate where it fails, then the onus is still on the GOP for the shutdown. Several hundred federal workers as hostages is not sustainable, and it is Trump who is holding them hostage. The last Senate CR was passed with unanimous consent.
The Democratic House will find plenty of other bills to pass. Trump has lost his Nunes safety net, including this new information that confirms the Steele Dossier.
McConnell will no doubt continue to obstruct. The Party of No has little to show for its tenure of holding all three branches of government for years.
There was a midterm blue wave. The number of voters was the largest in history for a midterm. Voters rejected Trump; they rejected the GOP.
Trump and the Republicans will be singing the blues come the New Year.
14
looking at it from up here I should say come up here looking at it down there the Democrats don't seem to have purpose they're not running with anything for example they don't have a leader
@Peter
There is a new generation of leaders emerging, so Democrats will be fine. Democrats have the same values we have always had. Provide opportunities through education, fair pay, minimum wage and job growth in sectors that include renewable energy, re-training, and other growth areas. Take care of the vulnerable who need healthcare and a safety net. Protect the environment and human rights and fair elections as well as law enforcement and national security. Move towards the future with science, technology and research, as well as updating the infrastructure, working with our international partners, and so forth.
All Democrats believe in all these values.
I have deep heartfelt sympathy for those federal government employees who have been furloughed but are still expected to work and may not get paid - including my son-in-law - but I am still glad OUR Senate and U.S. House didn't cave in to The Robber In Chief. Hopefully they will figure out a way to pay the workers back when OUR new U.S. House convenes in a few days.
The Con Don has painted himself into a corner and I hope he can't get out of it until he goes to prison or runs away like the coward he is.
127
@njglea
Just another means of reducing government--a good thing.
It's good to see Nancy Pelosi not giving in to Trump's demands. Progressives didn't like her because they thought she'd cave into Trump's demands but she's proving them wrong. If she wants their support, this is a good start. Finding a way to open to government back up without caving to Trump's border wall, as well as improve current border security WITHOUT a wall, sounds like the perfect plan to show that Trump is wrong and that we don't need one. Besides, this whole point of border security was never a problem until he made it sound like it was with his hateful rhetoric towards immigrants of Central and South America. This can be a point where he begins to lose control of that conversation and people begin to question him.
452
I’m aure that we all esgerly await the glorious moment when “progressives,” arrive in a position where they’ve got the headaches Nancy Psloai now has, and can show everybody those genius moves, and the raw courage, we’re always being lectured upon.
3
@Joshua This progressive wanted a change from Nancy Pelosi because the Democrats lost too many elections (national, state, and local) under her (and other) Democratic leadership. And because in polls, she is often the most disliked national politician in the country.
5
@F. T. The Trump/GOPers are good at smearing competent politicians. They got Hillary and are now trying for Nancy. The question is whether the voters will be fooled twice.
34
The best line in this story was the Office of Personnel Management suggestion that federal employees to ask landlords and other creditors if they would be able to pay just part of their bills for the duration of the shutdown. The office also advised employees to consult their “personal attorney” if they had further problems."
The OPM folk from Planet Bozo need to take a break from their day-jobs and explore the reality of this country. How many of us have a “personal attorney”, and are more than 2 paychecks away from serious financial difficulties?
176
All federal employees should refuse to work unless they are paid
7
@Mr. Louche
Well said, sad that we can't pay our federal employees while the rich become richer with the huge tax cuts doled out by the GOP
7
@Mr. Louche
The Republican Party is comprised of professional thieves (see earlier reference to "Thief in Chief" Trump). They perceive their responsibility to be to steal from America's common wealth, privatizing what they can (funneling public monies to their oligarchic patrons, who in turn fund their political careers), flat out distributing the rest to the wealthy, as they did with the huge tax boondoggle.
...thieves, who clearly do not remember how to legislate, subsisting on lying and cheating. Treason at the top of the Republican hierarchy, larceny in the middle, abject stupidity at the bottom (a boon, however, for those who are heavily invested in Knucklebalm shares)..
9
Dereliction of duty by the outgoing GOP house under the “leadership” of Paul Ryan.
85
@Njlatelifemom Thank God Ryan is gone...If only that fate would befall a few others..
1
So, let me get this straight. Trump says he will gladly order a government shutdown and Ms. Huckabee-Sanders states that Democrats will own responsibility for the shutdown?
Republican voters, are you listening? If your answer is yes, you're even less informed than I thought you were and that is saying something!
84
They don’t care!
2
@Glenn Thomas Very few R's here to ready your post, most have their own news bubbles.
1
Mr Trump’s initial price tag of between $8bn and $12bn has been widely disputed.
The 650 miles of fencing built under President George W Bush cost an estimated $7bn, and it could not be described as fulfilling Mr Trump's promises of a "tall, powerful, beautiful" barrier.
A number of very different estimates have been put forward by other official bodies.
Mitch McConnell, the Republican majority leader in the Senate, stated the cost would be between $12bn and $15bn, while a report by the US Department for Homeland Security estimated the wall would cost between $21.6bn and $25bn.
Meanwhile, a report by Senate Democrats, said the wall could cost nearly $70bn to build and $150m a year to maintain.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/idt-d60acebe-2076-4bab-90b4-0e9a5f62ab12
14
Except: Trump wants a 30-foot barrier(which, incidentally means say goodbye to the Monarch butterfly, among other migratory species that don’t do 30 feet.
I’ll donate to any organization that files suit demanding a full Environmental Impact Statement on this one.
Walls can be tunneled under, and spending money on a Berlin Wall Matcher means time to plan routes and methods for those who buy the lies about organized criminals and Middle Eastern terrorists coming through.
Another lie - recently, US agencies showed how most illegal “recreational” drugs were made/grown here in the US, are small capsules of stuff a couple of orders of magnitude stronger than Fentanyl are coming in, a large capsule at a time, from China.
That leaves cocaine the ONLY drug coming in - from Columbia, one of the few places in the world cocca grows.
Which political “fact” is true?
The Old Boomer has some truth to lay on you who learned about the War in Viet Nam in History class:
During the early 1970s, the Dept. of Defense developed a set of sensors that could detect the presence of people in dense jungle. General practice was any areas near Viet Cong (South Viet Namese who preferred Thr North’s dictatorship to our dictators installed and killed at our will)
Anyway, with 40 years of new development in sensors and drones, we could probably lay down cheap gear pinpointing someone crossing the border without a stripe on the ground. Walls don’t work as well as making a helicopter pickup & a ride back.
4
Let the government stay shut.
This seems to be an improvement.
14
How cavalier you are towards workers who won’t be getting paid.
3
@G
Start with shutting down the White House, this President and Sarah Huckabee. They are part of the government. And then don't send out social security checks. That should please you even more.
4
Wait until the bill comes in - raising the deficit by @$1 billion a day.
And the death rate from disease carried by uninspected food reaches Third World levels. And the IRS audits you because the treasury’s dry and you’re easier than folks on the Fortune 500.
And without adequate warning, a couple of earthquakes cripple our economy. Or nobody’s watching the electrical grid during a winter failure, and you die from exposure or carbon monoxide poisoning.
Or, without inspectors to spot failures, a major highway bridge collapses while you’re driving on or under it.
Etc.
You are one of those who doesn’t realize what a relatively invisible, quiet, well-controlled government means to you. Try a month in a wintery third-world country - and then you might learn.
5
Shameful that political squabbling damages lives. Someone has to step up and play Solomon and since Trump is afraid to break his wall promise to his base (he already failed in his promise to force Mexico to pay) the Democrats should save the poor souls deprived of income and agree to the 5 billion.
3
Why - how is giving into a madman Solomonic?
Nobody in government wants the Wall.
Only the biggest bigots in Trump’s “base”.
Tell you what, let’s approve the wall, complete with razor wire and searchlights and guard posts with 50-cal machine guns and troops ordered to kill anybody trying to cross. To be built section-by-section as Mexico sends us hard currency, gold or oil.
Each time a billion dollars arrives, another billion-dollar section goes up.
That’s Solomonic. If Trump keeps his silly promise, we’ll build the wall with Mexican funds.
2
@nzierler
Let Trump blackmail Congress and we may find ourselves with a dictator for life. We are supposed to have a system of checks and balances. Congress has been remiss in doing this and should not give up the legislative responsibility and the purse strings to an imbecil.
3
@nzierler
$5 billion is about one quarter of the entire infrastructure in the United States. There are structurally deficient bridges and roads that desperately need to be repaired and modernized. This isn't play money no matter what Trump thinks. It is taxpayer money that would be thrown away on a wall that would be inefficient, costly, and a simplistic solution that correlates with 2,000 year old concepts like Hadrian's Wall and the Great Wall of China.
If Democrats give in to this $5 billion, what next?
You don't negotiate with terrorists, and you don't collaborate with fascists.
5
there’s an especially telling fact revealed in this story...
“When Democrats sent Representative Jim McGovern of Massachusetts to the floor to try to force consideration of a stopgap funding bill that the Senate had already passed, Republicans would not recognize him.”
no question about it: the republicans own this shutdown lock, stock, and barrel.
173
Sarah, it's not the "democrat" party. All you Democratic Party haters need to cut this out. It's so childish.
65
@Ms D
She does it solely to get under the skin of people; I have to remind myself of that every time I hear her say it during a press briefing (i remind myself not to punch my television).
5
@Ms D Maybe it's time to refer to the GOP as the Republic Party.
2
@Ms D
She doesnt have to be the stooge for a criminal.
Dont expect anything honourable.
She is culpable.
She is spouting her lies and nonsense because she wants to.
2
I'll say this about the Republicans - they never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.
36
Coincidentally, this Trump shutdown stalls Trump lawsuits.
"Lawyers for President Donald Trump are invoking the government shutdown to seek a delay in a court case over claims that Trump is illegally profiting from business his Washington hotel does with foreign countries. Justice Department attorneys representing Trump asked a federal appeals court on Wednesday to postpone indefinitely all further filings in an appeal related to a suit that the governments of Maryland and Washington, D.C., filed over Trump’s alleged violation of the Constitution’s ban on foreign emoluments."
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/12/26/trump-lawyers-shutdown-delay-emoluments-case-1075676
24
@Dan
I hope Trump's attorneys got on their knees for their appeals to be heard so no doubt would be left as to their positions in life or their fealty to a whacko no matter the consequences for their country.
1
Who cares. The government is so bloated it's been closed a week and if nobody told me I'd have no idea.
7
@Mons
Right. Who needs"bloated" FEMA, NASA, the CDC, the FDA, Homeland Security, and Social Security? And Trump knows the IRS and the Treasury are corrupt. That's why he doesn't pay taxes.
3
@Mons - It's the "little guys" who get hurt. You'd say something different if you had a government job. But we all expect no thought or sympathy from republicans. It's ok.
3
@Mons
Mons, a little bit more sympathy would be nice. People are losing their paychecks, people visiting parks are cancelling plans, people who make money from people visiting parks are now losing money. That's just a small sample of the effects that ripple through our country. It may not be affecting you directly, but it sure is hitting others pretty hard.
3
It is shameful that we elect a president to become the most powerful person on our planet and blame him for what ever bad that happens around the world and yet in reality he is so powerless that he has to let the government shut down over a small fraction of an entire budget to secure the border and keep illegal entry of drugs, criminals and human traffickers.
The issue of border security was key to Trump defeating Hillary in 2016. The same issue has persisted and if it continues to persist in 2020, Trump will defeat any democratic nominee and this time by a land slide. So let the democratic house realize that they should not squander their majority on continuing the shut down and letting the border security issue fester if they want to continue to have a majority beyond 2020.
Frankly, Pelosi will have a major challenge to continue as speaker. If she gets over that hurdle she has to deal with extreme left wing of the party and she needs to deal with the aggressive DACA crowd that shut her up when she tried to say something in front of them. If Congress futz around with stupid investigation instead of doing the people's work before you know it 2 years will pass and the bums will be thrown out by the people who wish they had not voted for them.
Pelosi and her gang has got a chance to prove that they can be effective and shape up or ship out.
5
@Girish Kotwal
So was, "and I'll make Mexico pay for the wall". Remember that part of his promise or have you conviently forgotten that?
5
"With No Votes Scheduled, a Shutdown Will Greet the Democratic House"
And with the shutdown will come a load of trouble for the big baby with the temper tantrums! Aspirin, Mr. President?
14
Modest proposal for the new Congress:
Pass a single bill with all of the following:
1. $5.0B for border wall.
2. Comprehensive immigration reform, including DACA.
3. Protection for Special Counsel.
4. Statutory mandate for canceled or circumvented environmental protections and enforcement , voting and other civil rights protections, consumer (including educational loan) protections, and including enforcement funding.
Call it the “American Border Protection and Civil Security Act of 2019.” Hire a good PR firm to create Good sound bites. Go on the offensive, please.
Let the Senate balk or Trump veto his wall. “The Wall” is neither the answer nor will it be the problem. It is a symbol, and as horrid as that symbol is, crafting a real victory on the issues by “funding the wall”, would be well worth it.
456
@Rick Gilbert
Brilliant.
My only suggestion: double Trump's measly $5 billion.
10
@Rick Gilbert
The wall IS the problem. $70 billion to finish and $1 billion to maintain every 5 years. How many hospitals, schools, roads and bridges will it steal from.
The real reason for the wall is to pay for votes in the South of the USA. Follow the money.
69
Oh. Do what Pelosi already said she wants to do, and hope Trump and Mark Meadows turn sane all of a sudden.
Good plan.
14
...Well this is not complicated, and the solution is readily available. House democrats should pass a long-term funding bill that gives the president $2B for "steel slats" since he's willing to accept that branding and should cost less than an opaque wall. Then in the same token attach Mueller protection bill and removal of individual mandate $0 provision in the new tax law on which ground the judge in Texas ruled against the healthcare law.
If the president wouldn't sign the funding bill at that point then democrats can dig in until the other guy blinks first.
Healthcare was a major factor in democrats's victory and they should prioritize that policy thrust immediately, and other set of important bills can follow afterwards. If republicans want to make the fight about the wall/immigration which plays well with their base, then democrats should redirect the focus on healthcare which plays well with majority of the country.
More so, house democrats can adopt this slogan as their cardinal principle in the new congress; Security through Scrutiny. The same way Reagan popularized Peace through Strength. Security through Scrutiny, will insulate house democrats from presidential harassment claim, a talking point that will be on full display once subpoenas begin to go out to the administration. Got to be two steps ahead of this presidency and take the initiative before it redefines the playing field. Democrats hurry up and wait.
14
@Chochodey Interesting idea. Here's one suggestion...why not raise the individual mandate penalty from $0 to $1 to circumvent the recent federal court ruling that it is "not a tax?"
2
@Richard Exactly that's the exact figure that came to my mind while I was writing the comment and somewhat didn't add it before I sent. Thanks for filling it in for me. Democrats should stop using conventional classical logic when dealing with this erratic presidency, rather they should begin to adopt dynamic fuzzy logic to outwit this Lyin' Wonder in the oval office.
In the past I was not a supporter of government shutdowns, especially when I worked for the federalized government, but now I am all for it and I hope it continues until Trump gets what he wants! Thank you.
6
So you are against extortion except when it might get you what you want.
40
That sounds childish. Until Trump gets what he wants.
28
@Southern Boy
You should be very proud of your hypocrisy and infantilism.
You make a fine Republican.
50
Democrats are playing chess. Republicans, still playing checkers with Trump over their shoulder, will lose. Trump will not get a penny more than the $1.3 billion promised for the wall. There will be no $5 billion. No way. That ship sailed before Christmas.
This will demonstrate the mere shell of a deal maker Trump really is.
46
Why don't the Democrats in the House as soon as possible pass the stopgap funding bill that already passed in the Senate that doesn't include the funding for the wall and send it to Trump. If he vetoes it then it will be clear to all that he is responsible for the shut down. When this occurs many congressional republicans will think twice about continuing to support him and be associated with the shut down. Also when sending the stopgap funding bill to Trump the Democrats should publicize the level of funding for border security and note that the amounts previously provided for border security remain to be spent by the Trump administration.
35
That can't happen until Jan 3, at which point the Senate bill will have to be revoted by the new Congress. Republican senators won't approve a bill without assurances from Trump that he'll sign it.
1
@P Lock already been tried, and of course, Trump refused. Like Nancy said "It's some kind of 'man' thing for him!"
3
Not to worry, our public servants are getting a fully paid vacation over the Holidays. Good for them, helps make up for delayed pay raises.
3
@Joseph McManus Wrong, most are showing up for work but not getting paid.
20
@Joseph McManus
No. They’re not getting paid, unless/until the shutdown ends and Congress passes legislation to provide back pay. And believe TSA and others in Homeland Security are still working, for no pay.
Sad.
3
@Joseph McManus I‘m a teacher working in a government capacity and will not get my paycheck this week. At 35, I was embarrassed to ask my mother to cover my January rent. Overspending? I don’t think so. It’s called repaying student loans on a $39,000 salary, child care costs, paying exorbitant rent, paying for groceries and health costs. Real paid vacation there.
3
800 K government workers are held hostage by the president and Congress, neither of whom are suffering financially and neither who feel the urgency these people do. Given this fiasco they should all refuse to report to work. Neither Trump nor Congress can fire 800 K people.
17
Tell Trump he is allowed to use one of his companies to bid. Wall gets built, no one has to pay a dime.
6
Remember when Ronald Reagan said, "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall?" That's what we need now.
26
This NYT article states that “the Office of Personnel Management encouraged affected federal employees on Thursday to ask their landlords and other creditors if they would be able to pay just part of their bills. The office also advised employees to consult their “personal attorney” if they had further problems." This quip, typical of Trump administration's mind set, belongs with the famous quote "let them eat cake". The administration assumes that just like rich Trump who has a phalanx of lawyers for his sordid affairs, middle and low level federal employees have a personal lawyer or two. Yes, the high level federal employees, by necessity, must be engaging a lawyer even before they accept a job with Trump's Cosa Nostra. Come to think of it, given the Trump’s proclivities to ask employees to engage in unlawful acts (as per Rex Tillerson), may be the US Congress should extend free legal help to all federal employees.
26
Well, current House Speaker Paul Ryan leaves his post as the feckless, inconsequential, irrelevant cipher that he has been throughout his years of congressional incumbency. Farewell Paul; you won't be missed, not even by your Republican colleagues.
103
OK, the USA federal government is partially shutdown. Got it. Now here’s the question, what happens if no one notices? The saying goes, ‘he, who governs least, governs best.’ I guess the current shutdown will make or break that aphorism. People get the kind of government they deserve.
2
Tax time is right around the corner. People will notice when they don't get their tax refunds.
3
People may not "notice" the shutdown yet because essential staff are being forced to work without pay. Remove that mandate, and I think that people might notice that we no longer have a Coast Guard or airport security.
2
Ok, the House to present the same bill that Paul Ryan and the "Freedom Carcass" shot down last month. Send it to the Senate and it should pass as before. Let Trump veto it. The Democrats have no Hastert Rule, so get enough reasonable Republicans to join with the Democrats and override the veto. Same with Senate. Trump must be taught a lesson, the sooner the better.
23
It is incumbent upon Pelosi to pass a clean spending bill on her first day as Majority Leader. One penny for the wall and Democrats will ensure she is removed from power.
9
The wall is a bad idea. People can go over it, under it, and they can pass drugs through the gaps in the "slats". It will cost a fortune to maintain. There will be no reduction in border patrol personnel. In fact, they will need more people to repair the wall. And if nothing else people can still take boats across the Gulf of Mexico. And dems should not be subject to extortion by the President. Still, leaving government workers furloughed is a lousy situation. I suggest: Give Trump $2.5B, and in return get Obamacare some money and the debt ceiling lifted for at least a year.
71
@Tim Democrats need to ask for protection for the DREAMERS and Robert Mueller as well.
27
The absence of a "unified" message from the Democrats is alarming.
How hard is it to get everyone on a conference call and say, "Here's what we tell TV networks....."
The GOP is much better at this tactic than the Dems.
It is obvious none of the Democrats want wall funding- what they want is more money and resources to assist the thousands of illegal immigrants as they enter the U.S. illegally! This is basically telling them to come over- we will take care of you.. We can't operate this way anymore! It isn't fair and it isn't right to the millions of American citizens trying to provide for themselves and their families.
I am a Democrat and I'll vote for Trump [again] just because of his stance on illegal immigration.
8
@Aaron
There is no crisis of unlawful entrants other than the one in Trump's and T Party's heads . . . and apparently yours as well. How easily you forget that unlawful entrants to US dropped by about 80% under Obama. The remaining part does not need a $5 billion wall.
40
@Aaron Please look at the statistics, Pew Research has a very good breakdown of the numbers as well as government sites. Mexican illegal entry has been trending down for a decade, and there is no border crisis to speak of. Everyone in government agrees that our immigration system is inefficient (which promotes illegal behavior because of long wait times for visas etc) but a wall is the wrong solution. Inform yourself.
36
@Aaron -- great another one issue voter ignoring every other positive policy just to spite their own face, nose or whatever.
"It isn't fair and it isn't right to the millions of American citizens trying to provide for themselves and their families."
Why doesn't this statement also apply to the Republican tax cut, environmental policies, lack of infrastructure, lack of health care, threats to social security and Medicare, the increasing inequity in wealth distribution, and finally the fact that immigration is really not a big problem, only for bigots. This one issue mentality is ignorant. the same can be said about abortion and gay rights, issues that really don't affect most people directly, in the sense that if you don't want an abortion don't have one, if you aren't gay then what is the problem?
64
I'm looking forward to Nancy Pelosi pushing forward the same bill to extend the government funding that was agreed on by the Congress and put it in the Mitch McConnell's lap to now pass the bill they had agreed on before the shut down.
123
Absolutely
Go Nancy
If he wants a wall a beaded wall is .007 percent the total cost of Trumps
Trump wants to pocket the billions
Criminals republicans
Aren't there more pressing issues for our country that Sarah Huckabee Sanders should be focused on than the wall? Who does she serve the president or the people?
17
The people don't like a liar, and the President still hasn't been sworn in. Sarah Hucksterly, who wears her partisan-hack credentials with pride in calling the House's new majority party the "Democrat Party", serves neither, and instead serves only the occupant.
8
@Citizenz As u should know Sanders lies for this president about as much as he does. She sold her soul to him a long time ago.
1
She serves as the mouthpiece of a corrupt president. She reminds me of the mob lawyer in The Godfather movies. Just as amoral.
1
The strategic thing for dems to do would be to author a juicy immigration reform bill, including the requested $5B for the wall.
This puts the Trump admin in a bind: either they accept the bill (and in the process deliver a huge win to dems - well, all Americans) or they reject it (and thus show that all their noise about border security was a farce).
It would be incredibly refreshing to see the dems play offense for once. $5B is a pittance in the context of federal spending, and could only result in a laughably shambolic 100ft stretch of 'wall' - assuming the WH is competent enough to create a shovel-ready project.
15
We've given the occupant far more money than he has ever needed or deserved to prolong border cruelty against immigrants—did he even need it to tear-gas the border crossers, or kidnaps those thousands of children we STILL haven't fully accounted for?
The more we give him, the larger his National Bigotry Monument (which will "wall" off NO one) will be and the more a subsequent sane government must spend to exhume and apologize for it—so any such placation will only help the GOP's anti-Democratic (and anti-democratic) "those lib'ruls tax and spend!" marketing to brainwash more covfefeans to vote for them.
The only good Bigotry Monument dollar is NO Bigotry Monument dollar. If anything the House should double down and nix the border "security" funding to punish "covfefe" for his tantrum-shutdown. (I'd've said "...until he promises never to gas or kidnap a child", but promises are meaningless from him.)
3
President Trump claims to have already gotten 3.2 billion dollars for his wall. Various fact checkers say that, as is his habit, he is NOT telling the truth.
But let us take Trump at his word, at least a little. When the Democrats control the House, they should pass a clean government funding bill that gives Trump 5 billion dollars for his Wall, with just one small proviso. Each billion dollars becomes available only after Mexico ponies up a billion dollars for the Wall. Until Mexico gives that first billion, no government funds are to be spent on the Wall. Trump cannot object to that - he bellowed out hundreds of times (some of them after he had become President) that Mexico would entirely pay for the wall. And he will have had two years as President to accomplish it - plenty of time for a Very Stable Genius, as he refers to himself.
35
Maybe we should just cut out the middleman and tell the contractors to bill Mexico directly, with no recourse to the US Treasury. If the free market believes Trump's promises that Mexico will pay, there should be many contractors who will jump at the opportunity.
3
Everyone needs to remember this is Trump’s shutdown.
He promised it and promised to own it.
240
The Republicans have owned the government for two years, and accomplished nothing except to throw the DACA recipients into turmoil. Even the Senate attempted to push forward stop gap funding to keep the government open. But the president's ego is so needy, and he is so susceptible to the Fox talking heads, that he picked open the scab to create this crisis. He owns this. The GOP owns this. No one wins, but we all lose.
39
"the president said on national television that he would proudly shut down the government to secure wall funding"
I wish one of the major Democratic donors would buy a ton of 15-second spots showing Trump claiming the shutdown. Including on Fox News, if Fox allows them.
72
The Republicans has two years to take care of this. And they spend the last week doing nothing. They do not deserve to lead the House.
40
So the president thinks he’s a great businessman? What kind of chief executive shuts down his own company? Because that is what he’s done by closing the government... now civil servants know how the Trump casino workers in Atlantic City felt: cheated.
70
How does “modern technology” stop someone from entering illegally?
You can track people all you want, but in the end, someone or something has to stop them - physically.
Border patrol can’t stop everyone across a very long border and every would-be illegal alien has now learned to say the magic word “asylum” when caught.
This sets up weeks and months of “process” until an overwhelmed system is forced to release them into the country and hope they show up for a hearing.
Hence, the wall.
3
@JQGALT
Modern technology makes it harder to earn a living off the grid, harder to enroll your kids in school, and harder to sign a lease. When it is harder to make a life here, fewer will come.
4
Illogical! With or without a wall, migrants can still say “asylum”. Unless you want a wall to prevent people from speaking.
4
Except most illegals are entering on Visas and overstaying them. Wall won't help with that.
I am BEYOND grateful that the people of this nation were smart enough to at least flip control of the House over to Democrats last month. If Republicans still controlled both chambers in January, can you imagine where we would be? I don't know what would happen.
This is no way to run a country, people. And it happened under GOP control of all branches of our government. Remember that.
63
Marie L: yep, three shutdowns in one year (must be a record)...
14
The president has created this funding crisis. Every working person deserves to be paid. There are 800,000 federal workers being effected by "Trump's Shutdown" including coast guard employees and border security workers that are being furloughed or working without pay. I can remember ten days ago Trump boasting to Chuck Schumer and Nancy Pelosi that he would own this shutdown.
29
This is the Trump shutdown, and the Democrats must not back down. The House Democrats can now pass whatever funding bill they want. My suggestion is that they allocate $5 billion for border security that would only fund increased judges, medical personnel, and a hi-tech wall composed of drones and other surveillance equipment along the border, but no money for a physical "wall" however it's defined. Let Trump either refuse to sign it, or more likely claim a "win" for funding his hi-tech wall.
13
.... and the government send out draft letter to assist those who face potential shortfalls in rent and mortgages etc...
Now how about this:
Comes April 15 we all send a note to the IRS justifying not being to afford tax services this year and offer in kind work to the IRS instead?
13
We have a government shutdown because the president gets his marching orders from right wing news outlets. He bragged that he would own a shutdown if it came to that and now he's turning tail and ducking responsibility for a stalemate of his own making. He's president for just 29% of American voters. The rest he doesn't care anything about.
24
This episode will form the basis of a new civics textbook: "How a Ransom Demand Becomes Law".
8
Starting January 3, House should vote up or down on a stand alone bill authorizing funding for a wall. Any dollar amount you like. Get every rep on record. Bill will likely fail. Trump's move. Elections have consequences.
6
November 2020 is coming.
But nothing will happen until all of us, YES YOU, get motivated NOW. Changing minds 2 weeks before an election does not work. The ground work needs to be done long before and if you live in a swing state, then get off your hands now and SAY/DO something. Please.
23
Trump’s shutdown of the government is an embarrassing temper tantrum that hurts working Americans and our economy. It will also hurt him politically.
14
Every TV Station, particularly Fox Stations, need to replay Trump's meeting w Chuck and Nancy when Trump said he "was proud to 'OWN' the shutdown!"
Republicans need to hear Trump's words day after day after day after day! Republicans need to own this shutdown!
25
800,000 federal workers going without pay; some of them still working hours for which they will never be paid.
I wonder ...
Does this include the President & Vice President, all cabinet members and all members of Congress?
(And will DHS & ICE blame the next deaths of children in detention on the shutdown?)
5
@J Boyce
After every govt shutdown in the past, all employees were paid retroactively for all time owed. As an IRS employee, I'm enjoying my paid "vacation". It's a waste of taxpayer funds, but it's worth it for the world to see what a loser the President is. He's just assuring that he'll join the list of one-term Pres. Is it 2020 yet?
The Office of Personnel Management encouraged affected federal employees on Thursday to ask their landlords and other creditors if they would be able to pay just part of their bills for the duration of the shutdown. The office also advised employees to consult their “personal attorney” if they had further problems.
As if all these people that Traitor Trump has abused all have a "personal attorney" standing by. When do the attorneys get paid?
What a joke!
24
Typical Republicans. They make a mess, refuse to clean it up before they leave work and then blame the Democrats.
30
I’m retired federal so my income is secure (unless The Donald does something) but I strongly suggest that the Dems not redefine a “wall” just to satisfy the m_rone in the WH.
Make America Great Again and he puts 800,000 people out of work. As they said in the 80’s: Who’s zooming who?
5
Between the fiction that Daffy Donny brays and what his press secretary releases all I see and hear is, well, never mind.
When all of those Democrats that work for the federal government and those same people that support the Trump tantrum get together maybe something will happen, or, is the Democrats and support for the wall more fiction.
Trump needs some to write in crayon how the majority of illegal immigrants and drugs enter the country and it ain’t over the southern border.
4
Does anyone remember the civility and comity by which the Democrats handed over the House gavel to Republicans in 2010? Sure, the Dems lost an election (badly) but back in those good ole days, it was understood to be a normal part of the democratic process: You win some, you lose some, you come back to play another day.
Contrast that with today's vituperative GOP, having lost the midterms just as colossally as the Dems did in 2010, and which spent the past 8 years blackmailing the previous president, shutting down the government (twice), stealing a SCOTUS seat and, finally, using Russian help to install history's worst POTUS, Donald Trump.
And to cap it all off, the GOP will be handing (or throwing?) the gavel to Democrats in 2019 in the middle of the 3rd government shutdown in 7 years (the 4th if you include the short one in 2017 that lasted a weekend).
What a contrast to 8 years ago.
And what a fitting end to a Republican congress lousy with representatives who trafficked in lies, 'enemies' lists, and propaganda, for the maintenance of power, and to support Donald Trump.
Good riddance, and goodbye, Republicans. You were worse than we ever allowed ourselves to imagine you could be.
19
No wall. See the list of agencies that are being punished by trumpshutdown. Dept of Transportation- headed by Mitch McConnell’s wife is not on the list. Many Indian nation agencies are....
14
If Individual 1 wants his vanity project he can fulfill his campaign promise and make Mexico pay for it.
Stand strong Dems.
19
Immigration reform, healthcare, deficits, environment, gun control, the economy, Russian hacking of our Democracy. Two years to do anything and GOP promotes nothing but destruction, chaos, and pathetic slogans designed to divide the country. Oh yeah, let's not forget the tax cut.
Remember when Trump said his billionaire friends were mad at him, because of the tax cut? Seriously, who believed that? His friends are laughing all the way to the door with their latest direct transfer from the Treasury into their bank accounts.
Now as these Freedom Caucus government destroyers scurry away into obscurity. Please, just leave and don't steal anything on the way out. And don't come back to Washington D.C. Ever. Get out of town.
Let the Democrats clean up your mess as we always do.
341
I don’t believe that Trump has any friends.
20
@Miriam Chua
Hilarious! And so true!
6
A pocket veto occurs when a bill fails to become law because the president does not sign the bill and cannot return the bill to Congress within a 10-day period because Congress is not in session. ... Congress can override the veto by a two-thirds vote of both chambers, whereupon the bill becomes law.
Pocket veto - Wikipedia
So the democrats can call a vote to pass the emergency bill, then the Republicans will not have and excuse for the shutdown.
9
Hey Daycare Donnie.....maybe some of the billionaires and rich corporations you just gave a trillion-dollar tax-cut to will start a GoFundMyWall website for you and your dumb wall.
In the meantime, try governing instead of bloviating, you tiny, tiny, tiny, little man.
181
So today (or was it yesterday?), the Democrats tried to force a vote on a stopgap funding measure that the Senate had already passed, but the Republicans refused to recognize Rep. McGovern.
Come January 3, the shoe will be on the other foot in the House, but the GOP will still have a majority in the Senate. Thus, as far as I can tell, the only difference in the process come January is that the "no" will move from the House to the Senate.
True, the House Democrats will be able to undertake investigations, with subpoena power, and they will have a target-rich environment. But the Republicans will do everything in their power to block or obstruct such investigations, and any measure that requires Senate approval will be DOA.
Can we survive two more years of this? I wonder.
23
When trump can't even handle a Christmas phone call from a 7 year-old, should we really expect him to be capable of handling a country of 330 million people?
473
@DP
What is putin phone number, one can bet he has the answer, or answers.
11
@DP
In the 2016 Presidential election 63 million American voters including 58% of white people along with Julian Assange, James Comey, Mitch McConnell, Benjamin Netanyahu and Vladimir Putin thought that Mr. Melania Knavs Trump would make a much better President of the United States than Mrs. William Jefferson Clinton.
And Mrs. Clinton lost the popular vote in 50 separate sovereign state elections that determine the allocation of the Electoral College vote majority. Votes cast in one state do not count nor matter in any other state.
MAGA!
7 year old? He’s talking to an upper classman. IMHO.
2
The GOP masters got what they wanted from Congress and neither the vacating members nor Trump are useful any longer, Trump just doesn’t know it yet. At least they’re signaling defeat as they leave, white flags at half mast, tails tucked all the way to Wisconsin and California.
22
Shutdown over the security of our nation due to hate of Trump. And today we have the murder of a police officer, in a sanctuary state/California, by an illegal immigrant. Pretty sad when hatred of a president (and that is what it is) over rides the safety of America and it's citizens. Sickens me to my core.
2
To put this comment into context, Sarge is a small green plastic soldier in the Pixar cartoon Toy Story.
11
@old sarge
No...what’s really sad is Trump and the GOP’s hatred of gun control laws that over rides the safety of America and its citizens.Those getting killed in schools, churches, synagogues, music festivals and dance clubs are being shot by American white men, not illegal immigrants.
26
@old sarge: Trump is the only one in our Government who can shutdown the Government and he did, but you like most Trump supporters can always find and excuse for Trump and blame liberal Californians. BTW, the police suspect the California cop killer is illegal but don't know for sure. Also if you look it up almost all cop killings are carried out by America born citizens who "legally" have guns.
23
"[The Democrats] may have the 10 Senate votes, but we have the issue, Border Security. 2020!" So even according to Trump, his government shut down is really about politics, not security. Small man!
65
@displaced New Englander
Take him at his words. He stated he’s responsible for the shut down . . .
So what are the three options for reopening the government that are under consideration? This article seems to be focusing on rehashing widely-reported drama here at the expense of reporting actual details that might inform us better about what's going on.
9
@Anonymous They are explicitly listed: stopgap thru Feb, stopgap thru Sept, or fund everything but negotiate budget for DHS separately. Please read.
12
@Anonymous
It's all there in the article.
Option 1 - Stopgap funding thru February
Option 2 - Stopgap funding thru September
Option 3 - Funding for the entire year.
13
Let's see, the Republicans control the White House (so to speak), the House and the Senate. The Senate already passed bi-partisan short-term stopgap funding in consultation with the White House. Then FOX and crew, with help from the Republican controlled House and the President, scotched that idea. The House passed their own version to please the President's base which was doomed on arrival in the Senate. The President called for the nuclear option from the Senate majority leader to get around the Democrats. The majority leader said no to the President. Today the Republican controlled House once more refused to take up the Republican controlled Senate's stopgap funding proposal. That's how the Republicans do business when they control all the levers?
I forgot. One last piece of brilliance, blame the Democrats for the shutdown. Case made. The Democrats are guilty, guilty, guilty.
53
Inasmuch as federal employees are not being paid, it would be just for House and Senate members, also federal employees, to not get paid, especially since they are the ones who are responsible for this mess.
107
@MIKEinNYC
Trump is responsible for this mess. He said so. Lordy, there are tapes of that.
But you miss a minor detail. Most of our legislators are millionaires; some are multimillionaires.
They do not need their measly $174,000 annual salary. They can live quite well even if they are not paid for a while.
Oh, wait, ... I am pretty sure that they put in money to run Congress into every spending bill until one is passed and signed into law for the upcoming year.
13
The Executive Branch should also have its pay withheld. If you recall, the House and Senate came up with a plan to fund the Gov’t and Trump supported that compromise. Enter Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh, and Trump changed his mind. Facts matter.
13
@KateF
Kate, don't forget that trump magnanimously stated that he would not take a salary, but was gifting our nation with his amazing skills.
4
The word "hypocrisy" doesn't seem to quite be enough to properly define the silly Republican Party. If any government is shut down over this border wall funding issue...shouldn't it Mexico? Aren't they supposed to be providing the funds? When is the sophomoric Republican apparatus going to demand Trump come clean on his blatant reversal of his campaign promise and is not howling for U.S. tax dollars to fund it? When are the 24/7 conservative talk venues going to rant and rave about this blatant reversal? And for any Republican reading this: Having the U.S. military build the wall is the same as paying a border wall building contractor (i.e., either the deficit or your precious taxes increase).
14
@David Yes, the right was all over Obama's claim that you could "keep your doctor" during the ACA fight.
2
Nancy Pelosi just needs to go over to the white house and show Trump her exhaustive list of investigations the Democrats are going to open. From (Epstein) sex scandals, Russian tower deals, subpoenaed tax returns, corrupt cabinet officials, etc. Then let Trump decide how tough he wants to be. One thing we know for certain. Trump's sense of self preservation will "trump" everything else.
51
@joe Trump's tax returns are his kryptonite. Publish them and he will totally implode.
16
As I said before this is exactly what the ”man with no name” wants he is energizing his base. The Democrats are being played if they don’t wise up it will be the “MWNN” in 2020.
1
The Democrats’ position here, regarding the inane border “wall”, is certainly justified.
But they should have also held the line at the end of 2017 and shut down the government if necessary to prevent the $1 trillion tax scam fraud that affected every American from being put into law.
[That ALSO would have prevented Trump from bragging (as he’s salivating to do with the “wall”) that something was “accomplished” during his entire foolish year of 2017.]
7
@srwdm
The bill was designed to be passed using the budget reconciliation process so only a majority was needed to pass it in each chamber. The Democrats were powerless to stop it.
1
I can't stand Trump (and have never voted for a Republican in my life) but he is really only "responsible" if he uses veto. And that can't happen until Congress passes something.
Pass something and make him veto. (He hasn't vetoed anything, btw.)
7
@JDK
The Senate passed a CR 100-0 : certainly a veto-proof vote>
But the Republicans in the House, who could have followed this sane path, wouldn't even allow a vote on this, just bowing to their Fox Masters and the Trump tweets
"When Democrats sent Representative Jim McGovern of Massachusetts to the floor to try to force consideration of a stopgap funding bill that the Senate had already passed, Republicans would not recognize him."
18
@JDK He told Senate/McConnell he'd sign the bill that passed on the 21st or McC wouldn't have put it up. Fox News freaked out, and Trump told the House he would not sign it after they passed it, so they put up the bill Trump wanted. Two bills, can't be reconciled b/c the House bill won't pass the Senate. Won't get to Trump's desk. If he had not changed his mind after the Senate vote, the House would have passed it and it would have reached his desk. This is 100% his fault.
14
Trump essentially vetoed the stopgap bill put forth by the senate and which would have been passed by the house by changing his position on the border wall at the last minute and insisting on 5 billion.
Vice President Pence assured the senate that Trump would sign a clean bill (no wall funding) but the president made the vice look foolish.
Then of course the right wing media got to Trump and he reversed course.
7
Why do departing GOP lawmakers refuse to hold a vote to reopen the government before the new year? They could. Why don't they?
Why did they not recognize Rep. McGovern (D) when he went to the House floor for consideration of a stopgap funding bill? They could have. They chose not to. The Senate had the votes to pass it, too.
Do they not care about 800,000+ federal employees who have been furloughed or required to work without pay?
No, they do not.
Do they not care about services that Americans will go without?
No, they do not.
They prefer to not be embarrassed by not getting GOP votes to reopen the government without a wall.
They prefer to leave Democrats a mess to clean up. Again.
They prefer to then blame Dems when DJT does not get his wall.
They prefer to falsely accuse Dems of wanting open borders.
They prefer to score cheap political points.
They prefer to let federal employees suffer and worry.
They prefer to concern themselves with optics.
They prefer to disregard the needs of Americans.
They prefer to not do their jobs.
Too gutless and spineless to eat the huge slice of Humble Pie they have cooked up.
My disgust for today's GOP is exceeded only by my disgust for their leader.
297
Amen to (all) that!
5
@Mary
I second that @a.'s Amen! @Mary, your post should be a NYT Pick and the top Reader Pick. Thank you for your writing!
5
Cut off funding for White House staff, limit travel budget, do anything and everything within your power to get his blood pressure up.
54
Do we want to be walled in like Israel? What kind of a country would the USA be like with walls everywhere? What would be next -- a wall along the US-Canadian border -- then "walls" along the Pacific and Atlantic coasts? I guess we could send the Statue of Liberty back?! As Robert Frost said, "Before I built a wall I would want to ask what I was walling in or walling out and to whom I was like to give offence. Something there is that doesn't love a wall, that wants it down."
13
This time the Democratic takeover of the the house will be different. My humble request to the Democratic leaders, please be transparent from the get go and let the American public know of every negotiation you do with the President before he tweets lies. Please remember why we voted for you. Please don't go high when he goes low and give in to his rediculous blackmailing. Please hold him accountable and don't succumb to threats and bully.
47
@LakshmiN Surely if the Democrats give in to Trump's blackmailing they will be 'going low'. Only by resisting his blackmailing and holding him accountable will the Democrats be seen to be 'going high' This comment seems to be very confused.
2
@Cass Phoenix - I think you're the only one confused about it.
When I listen to C-SPAN radio callers talking about the importance of a wall to solve our immigration problem, it just boggles my mind. There is simply no factual justification for a wall -- and certainly not a wall of the type Trump and his base seem to be envisioning. Yes, we have immigration issues, but most people who are here illegally are those who overstayed their visas. We need sane immigration policies, not walls. But if you want a "wall" that works, then you're looking at the North Korea model. I've been to the Joint Security Area inside the Demilitarized Zone (DMZ) that separates North Korea and South Korea (and technically been on the North side of the Military Line of Demarcation (MLD)). Virtually no one gets across that border, even though it's not a "big, beautiful" concrete wall. No one, of course, is trying to get IN to North Korea. They keep people from getting OUT by torturing and killing anyone who makes the slightest move to escape (as well as their family members), and shooting to kill when anyone gets close to the MLD. So I guess if we want to keep people from countries in Central America from crossing our southern border we'll need to (1) somehow create a 30-mile buffer zone between the U.S. and Mexico; (2) get all the Central American governments to agree to torture and kill all of their citizens who try to leave; and (3) if anyone does manage to leave and get to the actual border, shoot them on sight. Sounds like a great plan to me.
11
With respect to Barack, there really are 2 Americas. One in power; corrupt, racist, misogynist, engaged in legal theft, lethal non-violence, and denying amendment nine rights, increasing the debt; ruling by fiat without due process.
The blood and souls of children (in Yemen, 85,000 starving; in the US, 1000s held in cages, lying on prison mats) are on the hands in power. Teump handed Syria with its ports to Russia. With Crimea, Russia now has strategic presence in Europe’s interior waterways, with England and France in decline. Russia’s gift of Syria is the first time the US has given the hegemony of an entire country to a foe.
The chaos tariffs caused on pricing and supply chains enhanced Russia’s military presence along these trade routes; Russian energy heats Europe (liquified natural gas). What happens without a nuclear agreement or NATO?
Security? Are we better equipped for the next school attack? Why is the wall not like Hoover Dam, public works, training workers? It provides no economic stimulus.
$5 trillion. For something that can’t hire you, can’t feed you, can’t house you, can’t teach you or pray for you; it won’t heat you or heal you or pay you or build a future--it won’t fix a road or build economies of scale. It’s cold steel, not even a prison, in the ground.
$5 trillion! We get no training or jobs. Just cold steel in the ground.
10
House Speaker Paul Ryan, who is retiring a few days, had an opportunity to be a hero and he blew it. He could have allowed the Republican funding bill to be voted on in the House - and then if the President vetoed it, he could have put together enough votes to override the veto. Since the bill passed on a voice vote in the Senate, it is likely the Senate would also have voted to override a veto - It could have been the beginning of congress taking back its power and Paul Ryan would have been remembered for it.
138
@FJF, a leopard doesn’t change its spots.
The last GOP hero died earlier this year.
17
Cut Paul Lyin' loose—you will find in him nothing good, not when his idea of being a hero is helping the villain. He's one of the Bad People who impose the Bad Policy of the GOP in Bad Faith.
He's not cowed, he's collaborating.
17
@FJF . Ryan has a career into lobbying to protect! Don't ask him to start acting with integrity now!
28
Why aren’t democrats speaking with one voice reminding everyone that Trump is responsible for the shut down? Video of his comments owning the shutdown should be replayed relentlessly. Also, why aren’t democrats regularly reminding everyone that money allocated for border security for this year has not yet all been spent?
Democrats-take a page from the republican playbook, create unified messages & keep them in front of voters & potential voters.
It will be informed voters who save our democracy in 2020.
1072
@Marion My gosh Marion - they are. the bell is starting to ring very loudly. We don't need the democrats to step up, we need the sycophantic, enabling republican senate to stand up.
55
@Marion Agree 100%. An additional strategy might be to graciously approve the $5B wall spending, and let the 'wall' get built. The result would be laughable and small.
For dems, it could become the ultimate political battle axe - photos of a circumventable 500 ft 'wall' could be played on loop - a far more potent messaging tool than all the rhetoric in the world.
13
@Marion While this makes political sense, don't you think this is a slippery slope continuing the toxic and divided environment the country faces at the moment? If all proponents takes on this response expect the future to look like it does now. And that future is a poor one.
11
On the first round, just pass a CR that parallels the one Senate already passed. No wall.
On second round, offer up a rider that provides contingent authorization for border barrier funding but ONLY IF the sovereign nation of Mexico first sends a check to the US Treasury to pay for it, as Trump promised. Hold him to his campaign promise.
208
As with the Bush/Republican financial crisis in 2008, Republicans have no qualms about leaving a mess for Dems to fix.
106
Too bad trump isn't insisting on 5 billion for infrastructure. What happen to MAGA? The wall makes nothing great except the contractors building it. And maybe the companies that manufacture shovels and ladders.
22
Trump demonstrates on a hourly basis the adage, "Just because you have one doesn't mean you have to act like one".
Actually, it could easily be applied to any of his cabinet, his appointees or his fans.
It is gender neutral, if you think about it.
It works equally as well for Kirstjen as for Chris.
15
I have family members furloughed by this decision. They live paycheck-to-paycheck, and this has ruined their Christmas. Their furlough impacted my Christmas because they were unusually stressed and worrying about bills that are coming due. They blame Trump, and they are looking forward to a Democratic House.
229
Almost 60% of Americans are opposed to a border wall. Framing this as a safety concern rings hollow. It’s really an attempt to whip up fear and scapegoat immigrants to nurse grudges. The American people as a whole are not fooled. GOP, this is not a winning strategy.
35
After everything we've seen Republicans capable of doing in order to forestall and obstruct a Democrat President from accomplishing any kind of meaningful legislation, it's hard to imagine that this current government shutdown, as orchestrated by Mr. Trump is anything other than an extension of that.
23
I don't see many quotes from Democratic leaders countering Trump's obsession with the wall. At least, I haven't seen much in the Times.
Why is my party not hammering home a consistent retort, loud and clear, demonstrating exactly where they stand on immigration and the wall?
I am tired of the silence, and Trump hogging all the tweet attention.
185
@Jules Few if any media outlets seem to interview Democrats these days.
4
The Democrats just need to wait until they get control of the House. In the meantime, let whomever bluster and bleat about the need for barrier.
1
The Republicans are like a bunch of spoiled, rich juvenile delinquents, who amuse each other by engaging in vandalism, delighting in lying and corruption, celebrating guns & violence, bullying and stealing the Democrats' lunch money.
The GOP has one heck of a party for itself as long as they are in office, where they destroy as much of the federal government as they can--cut taxes for the rich, wage un-winnable wars to shift taxpayer dollars to the Military-Industrial Complex and private military contractors, remove government regulations from the environment and financial corporations, deny affordable health care to those who most need it, and privatize what is public (education, health care, transportation, infrastructure).
So the Democrats come in a dutifully try to clean up the wages of Trumpism, campaigns of lies and obstruction, and get government back on track.
These cycles have been going on since Nixon and Reagan. But every time the Republicans are in charge of government, which they say they hate, the people, this country, and the planet's survival lose considerable ground.
Here's hoping the middle class, political Independents, and GOP stronghold regions, such as in the South, Midwest, and parts of the West, finally wake up and see the pattern.
Hint: The Republicans are not your friends, if you are middle or working class, salaried, like clean air and water, and see the need for ethics, fair laws, and justice for all.
94
No one in Congress should be taking vacation right now! There is work to be done and federal workers without jobs and/or paychecks. Time off shouldn’t happen while the government is shut down.
45
I understand quite a few Republican House members are so deeply, utterly and desperately tired of winning that they're packing up, leaving DC and moving back home. Bon Voyage!
18
Ms. Pelosi is determined to prevent the shutdown brinkmanship from interfering with the Democrats’ assumption of power and her ceremony-soaked return to the speakership.
They allow peacocks in the chamber? Must be a service animal, especially when from California, go figure.
Sarah Huckabee said, “The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat party {wants] to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people.”
That's not the only rational conclusion. There's also this one: we think a wall is wasteful expenditure that won't solve the problems of illegal immigration. I understand that a big, beautiful wall looks promising to many US Americans, but in reality, most illegal immigrants overstayed their visas rather than crossing the border illegally. Also, we should look more closely at the causes of illegal immigration that drive families to put their lives at risk to get to the US. And finally, while we need to address illegal immigration (and we should have addressed it more vigorously starting generations ago), it is simply not a grave threat nor even a big problem that the US faces today. It is a political ploy.
152
@Matt I've also heard that migrants at the border are coming due to drought in Central America. Maybe these are climate change refugees.
2
A cynical ploy by Trump, McConnell and Ryan, who have calculated that concern for the families of government workers is not an issue for their base, They have demonized these folks for years so they can act like they are for the little guy while they pick their pockets and line the pockets of their rich supports. All politics, no concern for the government workers who clean their offices, run their subway in the capitol complex and keep their private gyms open. And no concern for consequences to the taxpayers, who foot the bill for this foolishness.
This makes it all the problem for the Democrats, not because they caused it, but because they will need to fix it. And you can bet slick Mitch will hinder them at every turn.
15
It seems Nancy Pelosi knows what to do:
1. Pass the exact same bill that the Senate already pass.
2. Shame the Senate into voting the same as their prior vote.
3. Send the bill (without Trump's Vanity Wall) to the president.
If the bill gets vetoed, override the veto in Congress. If the votes aren't there, the Republicans totally own this disaster.
24
@Biji Basi That would require the Senate Majority Leader growing a spine.
The Trump shutdown is just another catastrophe executed by Trump and the Republican party to the detriment of the citizens of the US. If Trump and the Republican party were really serious about immigration and border security, then they would work on a plan with the Democrats. But they are not serious; they truly do not care about border security or dealing with immigration. This entire Trump Wall fiasco is designed for one thing only: perpetuating the lie that immigrants are a danger to us all.
80
@Dogs are the best
As an immigrant, I am not a danger. But now, I wish I could be.
Almost 50 years later, Trump does not represent me or anyone I know's. America.
He will go into eventual notorious oblivion. And Ph'd's will be granted on WHY did he ever get there ????
8
Whoa, everyone calm down a minute! There really is nothing to report until January 2nd. Save for those G-men and women hoping for their next paycheck, we have nothing to fret about. Just kidding!
Just throwing it out there, come January the house can pass a no wall budget - or something similar - and there is a chance the Senate will approve it without amendment. Naturally, Trump will veto it and the next question is will the Senate and House have enough votes to actually resolve the shutdown by overriding his veto? If that's a tough question for the Senate (66 votes) it is probably impossible for the House (290 votes). So, with that option unlikely, Trump can stand to wait and so will the furloughed Government employees. And you thought last week was ugly? The meltdown I expect around mid-January is going to be, um... SAD.
7
Totally unable to govern, the Republicans skip town and with that Trump's best hope for his racist vanity wall is gone. The Democrats will pass a clean CR next week and send it to the Senate. Hopefully McConnell will be smart enough to pass it. Trump will veto. Hopefully McConnell will be smart enough to override that veto.
11
The Republicans hold all the levers of power until the House goes to Democrat control in January. They are to blame. I think the House in January will offer a clean continuing resolution to fund the government. If the GOP gums up that you cannot with intellectual honesty blame the Democrats.
11
@Anthony Since when does intellectual honesty enter into the equation where Republicans are concerned? They couldn't care less about intellectual honesty; they're just concerned with repeating (ad infinitum and ad nauseam) talking points that their base will believe.
4
Dems are the responsible adults in the room. Dems will pass a budget and get Govt running again. GOP only cares about making money and supporting Trump. Dems will investigate and prosecute Trump and enablers. It will take the Dems decades to clean up the GOP mess. Ray Sipe
6
The American people voted loud and clear in the midterm elections last month. End of discussion!
17
Forget the wall.
We need to dismantle the electoral college Before 2020!
We can't have 4 more years of this madness!
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@Dantethebaker There is a way to in effect get rid of the Electoral College without a constitutional amendment and we are almost 2/3 of the way to getting it done. See www.nationalpopularvote.com Eleven states and the District of Columbia with a total of 172 Electoral votes have already joined the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact and states with a total of only 98 more are needed for the Interstate Compact to go into effect. If your state hasn't yet passed the National Popular Vote bill, write to your state legislators.
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“The only rational conclusion is that the Democrat party is openly choosing to keep our government closed to protect illegal immigrants rather than the American people,” Sarah Huckabee Sanders
I CANNOT wait for this woman to go away. How does she--and her fellow enablers sleep at night?
Something about gaining the world and losing the soul...
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You mean the Trump shut down.......why more the spot light from the trump-tweet-only show in town now?
If the GOP claims there is no money other than to u=again increase the debt...look at recinding the tax breaks given to the 1% for the last 20 years. Why are the next two generations of the working class again asked to pay for the trump and his cronies as they move their tax break wealth off-shore as our infrastructure crumbles.
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It is beyond absurd for Trump to blame Democrats for not funding his wall. Trump had two years with a Republican Congress and didn't get such funding from them, either! For that matter, how about his oft-repeated pledge that Mexico would pay?...
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Just like the Republicans to blow everything up leaving a mess for the Democrats to come in and clean up. Paul Ryan will go down as one of the worst Speakers in history. Other than the tax scam what did they do for 2 years?
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By allowing Trump to define the argument that his silly “wall” is about security instead of the political stunt it really is the Democrats are already playing defense. They are going for the “we are the adults in the room” strategy that served Hillary Clinton so poorly instead of hitting back at Trump and calling him out as the lying buffoon he is. The wall isn’t about border security anymore then the Syria pullout and the Afghanistan drawdown are about well thought out foreign policy. Both are political theater by the grifter in chief hoping to tie up the House democrats in endless distractions and debate knowing his supporters are too blind to tell the difference. Once they give in on this he’ll be doing the same routine the next two years. Remember he doesn’t really care about governance only about “winning” the cost to the rest of us is irrelevant.
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The Democrats need to put the blame for the government shut down exactly where it belongs - on Trump's and the Republican's shoulders. Call him and Republicans out on this. He stated publicly that he would gladly take the blame for the shut down. Make him eat his words. I have had more than enough, more than my stomach or nerves can stand of Trump, the bully-in-chief, and the Republican bullies shoving everything down Democrats throats. Make them own this. Make Trump own his words of stating over and over again that Mexico would pay for his "beautiful wall". The majority of this country does not want a wall built to essentially stroke Trump's out of control narcissistic vanity.
When a child throws a tantrum over something he or she wants and you give in, what happens the next time? We all know what happens, a fit is thrown every time the child demands something. To quote Nancy Reagan: "Just say NO". Lord knows, the Republicans said that to everything Obama proposed for eight long years. Are we going to have a government shut down now every time Trump wants some other useless piece of legislation passed and the Democrats are opposed to it?
The government workers who are not receiving pay are the real losers in all this. This is not fair to them. Those in Congress , their staff members, and the President, his Cabinet and their staff members should be required to work without pay when the government shuts down. That is fair.
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So, what are the three approaches?
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Under the canopy of paradoxical conditions, I hope Ms Pelosi and the house, can do the work that is necessary to rid the country of this unfortunate stain that resides in the White House.
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Good riddance, Speaker Ryan. Perhaps the Trump Organization will offer you a very lucrative position doing p.r. for the "Trump International Hotel and Casino-Moscow ", planning to open in 2021. You would be an ideal "yes man" for the company's senior management.
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Can I suggest building a wall around the White House and a declaration by DC that everything within the wall has been designated as a foreign country (Trumpmania perhaps?). The US can then get back to something approaching normality.
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I'm not familiar with how these things work but since the House has already voted and approved on a budget that includes funding for the border wall could the new House work with the Senate and pass another bipartisan spending bill that would override Trump's desired spending bill or does the Senate have to work with the previously passed budget?
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David, the Senate did take a procedural vote on the House bill to move it to a vote. It only got 45 votes, not enough to proceed. There were not enough Republican votes to move it. Democrats did not have any role in this. The Trump administration has not even spent the previous allocation by Congress for border security.
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In reality, the wall will not matter much except for the money being blown building it. Offer to trade Trump money for the wall in return for meaningful health care reform such as enabling Medicare to negotiate prescription drug prices and forcing the American medical juggernaut to rein in prices. Out of control health care costs are the real crisis in the country.
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Republican leadership needs to announce to the public that there will be no votes the rest of this year to re-open government. It's one thing to snub the Democrats. It's entirely another to snub the public, and that is what they are doing.
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Doesn't abuse of power as well as the emoluments issue fall under solid reasons to impeach? Just askin'.
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@Metrojournalist
I've been wondering about the Emoluments Clause ever since Trump opened that Hotel on Pennsylvania Avenue...
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Full steam ahead! Impeach indict arrest jail trump, pence just as culpable, treasonous mcconnel and grassley et al all republicans. Don't mess it up this time as you did with war criminal family Bush! The earth is at stake. Stop being weaklings Pelosi as you did with war criminal Bush. Also, stop watching the children's network channel Fixed Noise and grow up. It's Mueller Time. Forget about the US Constitution and the 25th Amendment etc as there is nothing at all in the 27 Amendments that doesn't say you cannot indict arrest jail a president. Now, go do it. Stop with the lame excuses of whatever you may come up with and if you cannot or won't then git out. And git out of the way. Tax the rich, tax the corporations, tax all the republicans and their supporters and voters out of existence. Just like Teddy Roosevelt and FDR did 100 years ago. Full steam ahead!
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@republicans r a disease.
"tax all the republicans and their supporters and voters out of existence"
This reads like a Republican's idea of a Democratic agenda. Healthy taxation is the heartbeat of the body politic. Too much is just as bad or even worse than not enough. The goal is a sustainable economy that works for all Americans, not hurting the rich or Republicans or anyone else.
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This is why Democrat’s will keep losing elections, instead of actually helping the legal citizen working American they will waste millions of taxpayer funds in their endless and ultimately fruitless attempt to subvert a legally won election result. Endless hearings, endless investigations that will lead to nowhere.
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You know that if/when Trump and Pence are gone, Pelosi will become president, right? Isn’t that the most delicious thought?
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As usual, the incompetent, uncaring Republicans leave a mess for skilled, thoughtful Democrats to clean up. Of course.
Will Americans from the midwest and the south EVER wake up to the fact that the GOP has no interest in actually governing? Wake up Republican voters! The GOP doesn't care about you.
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@B They will not wake up. I can only remember back to when Regan was president and it was the same ignorant people then who could not see that the Republican party does not represent them economically. But really its not about economics. Its taken me 35 years to understand it starts and stops with race. Stop hoping they will wake up and work to move forward without them.
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@B
Donald Trump was elected by the votes of 63 million Americans including 58% of white people who knew exactly who he was and was not. Trump was never a covert stealth subtle candidate.
And since " incompetent and uncaring" beat " skilled and thoughtful" you sound a bit confused about who is who and what really matters. Mrs. William Jefferson Clinton lost to "deplorable".
" Winning isn't the most important thing, it is the only thing." Vince Lombardi
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I assure you that there are millions of responsible
Democrats in the Midwest.
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As usual the republicans are leaving everything in a wreck.
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@Bill
But just like the orange-haired baby in the Oval Office, they're going to blame the Democrats for this mess!
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@Bill
As usual Democrats are not mechanics nor repairmen.
Most importantly, I hope the newly elected Democratic-controlled House governs as intended by the US Constitution versus the flaccid performance we’ve seen by the Republican Party. Who knows where the truth will lead us, but it will clearly be a different path.
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When Democrats sent Representative Jim McGovern of Massachusetts to the House floor to attempt to force consideration of a short-term stopgap funding bill already passed in the Senate, Republicans would not recognize him.
That should account for at least 380,000 and as many as 800,000 Democratic votes in 2020. A good start. Keep it up, GOP- sooner or later as you burn down the house you're going to have to call the fire department.
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@Mark
So, with this non-recognition, the Republican House members chose to keep the shutdown going.
How can non-recognition of an elected, fellow House representative happen??? It's an amazing lack of courtesy, and a slap in the face to the voters who elected Mr. McGovern. MAGA, indeed (cynical snort!)
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