Far-Right Proud Boys Reeling After Arrests and Scrutiny

Dec 23, 2018 · 82 comments
Ed (Uk)
This lot aren’t political, there hooligans who will use any excuse for a mass brawl. Reminds me of the football hooligan culture that took hold in the UK during the 80s/90s
General Noregia (New Jersey)
This is the junior Aryan Brotherhood except for the fact that they walk the streets. People beware, it was organizations like that helped Hitler and the Nazi party come to power. Only the Buffoon in Chief would made the statements that he did after Charlottesville. Put them in jail where they belong for a long time. They love to fight, in jail they will have plenty of opportunity to do so especially if the jail is full of Bloods and Crips, lets see how tough they really are.
MMercer (Westchester)
It's interesting how McInnes claims not to be racist, and then immeadiately launches into using several racial slurs. Groups like these, and their leaders, claim not to be hate groups, yet their actions directly prove that they are. These groups claim minorities dont deserve to have any rights, especially any that they should have to abide by. Nothing makes more clear the mentality of these groups than their vocal support for Alex Fields, the convicted killer of Heather Hyers. Numerous alt-right/nationalist groups, including Proud Boys, loudly condemned Fields conviction. Every action of these groups prove that they are indeed hate groups.
Jackl (Somewhere in the mountains of Upstate NY)
Makes me long for the days when a bunch of jocky Irish lads just wanted to do bar fights with no pretense of a "message".
Jack (Florida)
What are these so-called "boys" have to be so proud about? They are nothing more than street hooligans led by the trim-bearded McIness who always look neat and well-groomed, much the same way the "black shirts" did during the Nazi's rise to power. They were Hitler's henchmen who pummeled Jews and other targets into submission, softening them up for the final death blow to come. "Blut und Boden" was the slogan used by the Nazi-like proud boys --"some very fine people," as our ignorant president referred to them as -- during their terrifying, torchlit march through the streets of Charlottesville.
Alan Mass (Brooklyn)
What I find curious is that an organization called the Metropolitan Republic Club decided to welcome the Proud Boys to a gathering at their building. A cursory reading of the internet would have informed these club members of the racist and divisive beliefs of the Proud Boys. This invitation seems more questionable than the violence that the Proud Boys precipitated outside. Maybe we need to learn more about the Metropolitan Republican Club. Do they have any official ties to the New York Republican Party?
Emma Amborn (Maine)
It’s the headquarters of the New York Republican. It’s used as the campaign headquarters for Republican candidates. I was surprised that the Republican Party would want to be so closely associated with Gavin McInnes and the Proud Boys, but I guess that’s where the party is now. They claimed they allowed him to speak because of “free speech” which is always their excuse for giving deplorables a platform.
GR (Canada)
Time for these 'boys' to grow up, take responsibility for their disappointing lives, and stop blaming others for their bad luck and failings.
Mike (USA)
They just need to rebrand themselves as Antifa and do the exact same thing with impunity.
Chris (SW PA)
Heather Heyer was the person killed at the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville. Yes, sure, it's just a fun group that enjoys bashing people in the head. Loads of fun.
JR (Chicago)
Today's KKK has a modern marketing department. The well-groomed spokespeople for today's version of white supremacy rely on dog whistles and sanitized language to bolster recruitment and deflect scrutiny for what is otherwise the same old agenda.
Craig R. Brittain (Phoenix, Arizona)
No one "started it", no matter who the video says threw the first blow. Both of these groups are violent, and that's okay. Our press wouldn't have any stories to write if not for the mobs that they deliberately created in order to have something to write about. The average person in America is so non-violent, peaceful, civil, tolerant and educated that the mainstream news media has to go to great lengths to find anti-white extremists, feminazi bigots, white supremacist neo-nazi offshoots, Starbucks-stomping black-clad ninja wannabes and other tiny minorities and increase their numbers, because if not for them, the News would have to report that things are actually going pretty damn well and that's not a story. If these people weren't rioting in the streets, they'd be working for the New York Times - and some of them are. Meanwhile the actual philosophical groups that pose the greatest ideological challenges to America are blacklisted from press coverage. The Greens and the Libertarians and other 'outside' ideologies outgrew ANTIFA and Proud Boys 10-to-1 in 2018. Yet that doesn't make CNN. Doesn't make MSNBC. Doesn't make Fox News or the NY Times, that this is the age of the Independent. Let's be real here, the sooner both of these groups stomp each other - and the New York Times - the sooner our society moves towards a truly freethinking worldview and a truly independent free press not owned by the corporate slavemasters and the donor class. Let them fight.
JR (Chicago)
@Craig R. Brittain Nothing you've said changes the content of the article - which is that the groups you seem to laud are in disarray, and that the rule of law will continue to function in this country as they determine fault on a case-by-case basis. "Being real" should entail abandoning hokey conspiracy theories starring "corporate slavemasters"... good grief, that would be cringe-inducing even if you were an angsty teenager, which I doubt you are.
B Doll (NYC)
Look at these people, look at their faces...there's no pride. There's nothing at all in their faces except anger, menace. How does it happen that person becomes so reduced, their humanity so diminished that they dissolve their own being into bludgeons. Ugly and scary for sure, but from a safety of distance (at least) these guys are sad stuff. Just look at them.
Hyphenated American (Oregon)
The article does explain which group, the “proud boys” or the hard-left “antifa” start the fights. Weird.
r mackinnon (concord, ma)
Far right racists like the unctious Coulter, Ingraham, Limbaugh (and Trump himself) are trying to rebrand hate and bigotry as "idealogical diversity" Colleges even feel compelled to allow haters a platform. Let's not kid ourselves- hate is hate. Intolerance is intolerance. Ignorance is ignorance. Let's continue to call out the so-called Proud Boys, KKK, and most of The Low-Information Base for what they are. No more sugar coating.
Hyphenated American (Oregon)
@r mackinnon: let’s also agree that communists, socialists, marxists, islamists are haters and shouldn’t be allowed to teach in universities...
Alan Mass (Brooklyn)
@Hyphenated American I'd like to see the statistics on which you base you view that all "communists, socialists, marxists and islamists are haters." Groups like the Proud Boys hate all people who are different from themselves based on race, nationality and religion. They don't distinguish between conservative Muslims and ISIS. They don't distinguish between those who want a more just system than current capitalism and Joseph Stalin. Nor do you, it seems.
JR (Chicago)
@Hyphenated American Ok, sure - and while we're at it we can also agree that those things don't actually exist outside of whatever feverish propaganda swamp that you get your "news" from. Show me a gathering of "communists" or "islamists" in this country that has a political voice or else stop peddling nonsense.
GG (New Windsor)
I think the town of Wunsiedel in Germany has the right idea when dealing with these groups. When the neo nazis show up and march there, the residents and local businesses donate money to anti hate groups for every step these neo nazis take. The residents cheer them on gleefully.
Hyphenated American (Oregon)
@GG: can we do the same when new-communists, socialists, marxists, islamists, black supremacists, anarchists show up and march?
Angel (NYC)
Arrest all of these criminals. Throw away the key.
F. Ahmed (New York)
Many of the proud boy’s gripes against minority groups are similar to what Hitler said about Jews and gypsies after WW1 to rile the defeated Germans.
Joan H. (Seattle)
@F. Ahmed same with the Women's March organization and British labour party
H.L. (Dallas, TX)
This group claims to be more culturally and genetically advanced than others, and yet they not only resort to, but revel in, the most primitive form of engagement: violence. Is this contradiction lost on them?
R.G. Frano (NY, NY)
Re: '...and yet they not only resort to, but revel in, the most primitive form of engagement: violence..." {@H.L.} One IS reminded of the 'waterhole' scene in "2001", except that the 'Hubris_Boys' feel they're above the pitifully, obvious / oblivious level they're actually, displaying! Many apologies, to 'Australopithecus' for an insulting, but necessary comparison!!
QTCatch10 (NYC)
Let us emphasize that these people were in NYC at the invitation of a local republican club. Just ponder for a moment the type of organization that thinks Gavin McInnes is possessed of ideas that deserve to be heard and given respectability and considered soberly and picked through to find a reason to proclaim that “you can’t dent some of this makes sense!” They just can’t resist. The GOP can’t denounce it outright. They are compelled to defend these people and I don’t even think they all fully understand why. It’s happening on an emotional level.
Quincy Mass (NEPA)
I wonder how many of those MEN (as their ages denote) still live with Mom.
Ford313 (Detroit)
IDR? Grown men referring to themselves as Boys? Oh...the jokes write themselves.
Chris Banks (United States)
Can we stop with the overwrought hysterics, please? The "left-wing" protesters wore masks and circled around to confront the Proud Boys members. Even if they did not throw the first punch, they were clearly not innocent bystanders (it says a lot they refuse to cooperate with police). And so what if MicInnes said Spencer seemed "perfectly reasonable in converaton"? NYT included this quote with the implication that McInnes is therefore racist, but that seems like an unfair assumption. And this group has been banned from social media? They're a bunch of insecure boys who have grown into men - are they really deserving of censorship? The overreactions from the left to these people only pour fuel on the fire.
James (Citizen Of The World)
@Chris Banks Funny how you call it "censorship" there is a difference between "censorship" and consequences. Yes, there is free speech, but that doesn't mean that free speech is free from consequences, or that they have to be given a platform for their hate speech. Why don't they buy airtime on Fox News, or buy a radio station, oh right because of the decency act.
Centrist (NYC)
@Chris Banks Overreactions from the Left? I am in the middle of the political spectrum and I find these "boys into men" appalling and frightening.
Dale C Korpi (Minnesota)
@Chris Banks Are you in fact from the US?
Jack from Saint Loo (Upstate NY)
Open letter to "proud boys": There were a lot of really intelligent white men throughout history. Isaac Newton, J. S. Bach, Stephen Hawking, Dickens, Locke, Descarte, etc, etc, etc. But you, "proud boys", aren't them. In fact, you're mostly a bunch of insecure dummies. You think your white complexion somehow means you have an intellectual gift in common with the aforementioned geniuses. But you don't. You're simply frustrated little white men, frustrated by your lack of power, your inability to get a date, your inability to do much of anything, really. You're jealous of women who in at least half of the cases, are more intelligent than you, and of racial minorities who are advancing faster than you. You've been surpassed by minorities in sports, intellectual pursuits, and in many cases wealth, and it's eating you up inside. My advice to you- quit associating with racists. Go back to school and work really hard on something, until you've actually accomplished it, instead of claiming the work of dead white geniuses as your own. Above all, try to be kinder, not only to women and minorities, but to yourselves. There's only one life, so you should stop wasting it by following clods like Gavin McInnes, and try to accomplish something important on your own.
Boregard (NYC)
@Jack from Saint Loo brilliant!
Matthew Carnicelli (Brooklyn, NY)
@Jack from Saint Loo Post of the year.
Boregard (NYC)
"“This whole idea of white nationalists and white supremacy is a crock,” he added. “Such people don’t exist.”" Uh...no. They are real, and they very much exist. Any comment to the contrary is the bigliest of fake news. But these sorts of comments made by many others besides McInnes, is easily swallowed by those white males who are too young to know the history, or rather refer to not know the history. Which IMO, and experience is more the case. Too many white males these days, be they Trumplodites, or the types portrayed here are bereft of any real historical knowledge, that involves factual and rigorous study and intellectual honesty.Instead they rely on the rants from various blog-posts and RW/Alt-right pod-casters to makeup their education. You'd be hard pressed to meet any of these regular members or hangers-on who has ever read anything contrary to their too often hardened beliefs. How many have read anything by MalcolmX? Baldwin? Instead relying on the propaganda of their faux messiahs as the whole of their education. Deplorables. Yes, they are...deplorable in beliefs, and more so in their lack of self-respect, that they NEED messiahs and prophets of rage in their lives. Fall so easily for sugar coated dreck...deplorable!
Jeff (VT)
@Boregard I've read James Baldwin, Cornel West, Angela Davis, and bell hooks, and I think Gavin McInnes and the Proud Boys are unfairly vilified.
Gustav Aschenbach (Venice)
“This whole idea of white nationalists and white supremacy is a crock,” he added. “Such people don’t exist.” "What water?" said the fish. "I don't see no water!" But what a fish does when you take it out of water is pretty much what we've seen from white supremacists after the United States elected its first African American president.
nurse betty (MT)
“The victims...refuse to cooperate...” with the prosecution of their own assault???? WHAT?!? Taxpayers are funding the protesters defense and the protesters won’t help in their own defense. For crying out loud. So it’s just for the thrill of it all on both sides.......why am I so surprised.....
Katrin (Wisconsin)
@nurse Betty It may be that they simply don't want their identities made public because of the harassment that would certainly bring them.
Jeff (California)
@nurse betty: Taxpayers are not funding the protesters. The taxpayers are paying for the enforcement of the laws and the prosecution of law breakers. With the rise of violent far right extremists, it is logical that their victims would be hesitant to be identified. Once identified they risk more attacks by the far right thugs.
James (Citizen Of The World)
@Katrin But if they believe in the rhetoric that they are spewing then they should be proud to take one for their alt white "team"......but, since they are scum, like scum, it floats on stagnant water, usually found in umm, swamps....
njglea (Seattle)
Good Job New York prosecutors. This is odd: "One challenge facing prosecutors is that the victims of the attack have refused to cooperate with the authorities, which means the case will rely heavily on videos from security cameras and onlookers." I'm not surprised because I believe all these hate-anger-fear-violence operatives are paid by the same Robber Barons to cause trouble around the world. Think about the Women' March, the Scientist's march, Black Lives Matter and all the other grassroots demonstrations taking place. They are non-violent. Tens of Millions of people turn out and carry signs with no violence. It's only when groups like white supremacist and anti-fascist groups show up that things get violent. WE THE PEOPLE - average people who want relative peace and social/financial equity in OUR lives - must continue to show up and not let the media give OUR demonstrations to the hate-anger-fear-violence boys and girls.
Hyphenated American (Oregon)
@njglea: there were plenty of riots led by the black lives matter groups. In fact black lives matter activists committed acts of mass terrorism.
Sony (Houston)
No they did not.
tom (midwest)
Proud haters is more like it.
James (Citizen Of The World)
@tom Tom, are you speaking for yourself....
tom (midwest)
@James no, just the proud boy follower I met recently. full of hate.
Susan Weston (Kentucky)
The free-lance videographer is Sandi Bachom. Her work deserves proper citation.
W Smith (NYC)
Unfortunately, Southern Poverty Law Center designations are meaningless. They used to be principled, but now they label anything right wing as a hate group. The NYT needs to stop quoting them as an authoritative source, otherwise the NYT just loses credibility with its reporting.
Christopher (San Francisco)
@W Smith Probably indicates that the right wing has embraced racism, when you really take time to think about it.
LEM (Boston)
@Christopher Exactly. The question you should be asking is why the Proud Boys were speaking at the Manhattan GOP club. If Antifa were speaking at an official Democratic club you would never hear the end of it on Faux News or even right here in the NYT.
Amanda (Los Angeles)
@W Smith Can you provide an example of Southern Poverty Law Center making an incorrect hate group designation? I haven’t been able to find any such instance. Thanks!
Randy Weinberger (Brooklyn)
Since when is protesting Nazis and white supremacy considered "leftist"? In my opinion, protesters should be considered considered patriotic Americans.
Boregard (NYC)
@Randy Weinberger Yes. You are correct. They should be called normal, everyday, patriotic Americans with a some historical perspective. I recall a sign held up at the after-protests at Charlottesville. It said something like, "I can't believe I'm still fighting Nazis 45 years later!" The young woman holding it had on a WonderWoman costume-like top and head piece. Point well made.
Trg (Boston)
@Randy Weinberger Exactly!
Hyphenated American (Oregon)
@Randy Weinberger: how about protesting socialism, Islamism, communism, Marxism and anti-white racism?
Chris Anderson (Chicago)
How come you never see Far-Left wing leaders arrested??
Steve (NYC)
@Chris Anderson like who? The fictitious ANTIFA? Remember unless you are a fascist...you are anti-fascist!!!
Gean (Durham, NC)
Yes, why don’t you think about that, while assuming that the arrests take place correctly, as they did here? Why is it that the right-wingers keep fighting, driving into counter-protesters killing people, shooting up places? The whole world is not against the far right, but will simply not tolerate terrorists and neo-nazis. Maybe you should ask yourself why you support someone so violent so much.
hb (mi)
@Chris Anderson Name a far left leader, who can you name. I’ll even give you all of history, name one as dispacable and violent as the idiots labeled right wing. Is Putin left wing, how about Assad, Cheney or even Fidel fn Castro. They are all just power hungry angry men. Right or left labels mean nothing.
Ben (Syracuse NY)
The only thing to consider is who is funding these losers? Surley someone is financing them. Who?
James (Citizen Of The World)
@Ben Like the KKK, they drum up millions f dollars a year from donations. The KKK is a 501C non profit corporation, (most people are unaware of that fact) that bring in 7 million a year, and until they were sued, (while David Duke was a grand pooba..I mean wizard) and lost a majority of their assets, which were quite large. In fact David Duke, has never worked a day in his adult life, instead, like Trump, Duke is also a con man. In 1979, after his first, abortive run for president (as a Democrat) and a series of highly publicized violent Klan incidents, Duke incorporated the nonprofit National Association for the Advancement of White People (NAAWP) he contacted Bill Wilkinson, and offered to sell him the names of KKK members. Duke was caught on camera, and video. So these people along with the no job having David Duke, have money, they make money, but pay no taxes. Apparently, it pays to be a bigot.
Frank (Colorado)
When your leader encourages and accepts violence, these scared ignorant "boys" come out of the woodwork.
Ifonly (Nj)
No doubt some of the “good people” in Trump’s America. R a c I s t s.
Bsheresq (Yonkers, NY)
If you voted for Trump, these are your bedfellows. If you think you're not tainted by them, you're delusional.
James (Citizen Of The World)
@Bsheresq Well, as Owen Wiston said, "Once you side with a man, that's it."
Jus' Me, NYT (Round Rock, TX)
I came across Mr. McInnis while Youtube surfing without knowing about these events or connections. Jawdroppingly misogynist! Overt hatred and sense of male superiority. Don't let the door hit ya............
Mike_F (Westchester)
I will contest the Proud Boys assertion that they “aren’t going anywhere.” They will *always* be going somewhere, because members of civilized society have seen their kind before and don’t want them. We will always be chasing them, pushing them back into the shadows, or trying to convince them to abandon their hatred and lies and return to civility. They will never rest as long as true citizens of this country reject their ideology as false and dangerous.
James (Citizen Of The World)
@Mike_F You can never convince those people or people that think like them to convert to being non-racist. You would have to change a lifetime of being indoctrinated into hate, and you can never do that. In fact, there is a story in my family, I never really knew my biological father, I had met him, as a teenager, but I've never spent a day with him. Not that my mother wouldn't have let me, she never talked badly about him, other than to say that my father had abandon us while we were stationed in Germany. Anyway, the story goes, that during the Korean war, my father who was from Klamath Falls Oregon, and a bigot, was wounded, and lay bleeding, unable to help himself, a medic put his life on the line to save my father, the only problem, that medic was black. Right up until the day my father died, he never once gave credit to that medic for essentially saving his life...sad....Glad I never got to know him....
s anthony (ny)
what's with the "x's" on the rainbow neckerchief donned by the clapping go-pro guy behind mcinnes?
Jim (California)
The question facing those claiming to be 'liberal': will you convict these thugs OR remain silent believing they are only young men on their learning curve to a more fulfilling life?
James (Citizen Of The World)
@Jim Convict them, providing they did actually commit a crime. Other than the crime of being ignorant.
Sony (Houston)
Question for conservatives. Pretend they were black. Would you?
Susan Anderson (Boston)
The Florida Republican party has direct ties to the Proud Boys, who helped them suppress the vote in November. (Also, it is not reported enough how the police stand by and prevent peaceful protesters from defending themselves, sometimes arresting the protesters and sending off the violent perps with a warning.) "Anti-fascists were stabbed at a neo-Nazi rally. Then police tried to charge them "Revealed: California has not prosecuted anyone for the stabbings, but sought hundreds of charges against counter-protesters" https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/dec/05/antifa-charges-california-activists-stabbing
Jus' Me, NYT (Round Rock, TX)
@Susan Anderson Evidence, please? Really, anyone can say anything, do you know that? Hey, bet you didn't know I'm a millionaire.
James (Citizen Of The World)
@Jus' Me, NYT Evidence of what, the article said that no one had been arrested. Now had someone been arrested, then evidence would follow.
Bob (Greenville SC)
This so reminds me of the Nazi Brow Shirts. But it's not suprising considering out POTUS seems to encourage violence, and division. Hopefully 2019 will bring us some much needed relief from this debacle of this supposed Presidency...
Lord Snooty (Monte Carlo)
@Bob I'd be wary of affording too much "credit " to The Proud Boys and their like in America in likening them to the Sturmabteilung (SA), a VAST paramilitary organization in 1930's Germany. America's tiny far right groups are frankly negligible when compared to Rohm's SA and its default use of violence,killings and sheer brutality to all those it opposed.
Gean (Durham, NC)
You are not looking far enough back in Nazi history. Sure, such thugs are not at the level of the brown shirts yet, but they’re exactly at the levels of the more marginal organizations that preceded them starting in the early 1900s. None of this stuff appears overnight, and if it’s not stopped, it will grow in the same predictable pattern.
Some Dude (CA Sierra Country)
@Lord Snooty Surely the brown shirts started small and grew. Let's take that as a teachable moment and not allow a repeat. The proud boss are nascent brown shirts American style.