Probably worth mentioning that the New York Times built (had built) it’s “new” headquarters on a site acquired through eminent domain, with the land leased at a considerable discount by the Empire State Development Corp., and received $30 million of tax incentives. Likely a lot richer incentive package per new job than the Amazon deal.
A better choice would be the south Bronx where development and jobs are sorely needed.
1
I used to work in the Court Square building soon to house Amazon. One of the biggest draws of LIC was the transportation system that goes directly into building. Living in Midtown, I was able to go from my apartment building to work without barely going outside if it was raining - plus it only took 15 minutes from door to door. It also has several subway lines so I always had numerous options to get around, including a short bike ride over the bridge. That said, while the neighborhood has changed considerably, it still has a heavy, creepy feel to it and I couldn’t wait to get back to the city after work. Yes, there are more options and stores than there used to be, but you’re still very limited. There is also a weird wind tunnel near the building that feels like it could knock you down on a windy day. I think having Amazon move in will cause the neighborhood to further change and give LIC a better vibe! If so, it has the potential to be an extension of the city, similar to downtown Brooklyn.
@Maria
Or, employees will get off the subway inside the building, as you did. Work late. Get back on the train to Manhattan and never set foot outside in the neighborhood. Or, employees will move into the area and surrounding areas, driving up housing prices and bringing in trendy (expensive) bars and restaurants and shops that the public housing residents can't even think about affording. They'll not only be trapped in public housing, but in a neighborhood where they're not welcome.
To President Trump and his White House Staff: surely this is not what you meant to see happen from your tax policy. President Trump has spoken out about Amazon's abuse of postal breaks. If ever this was the time to take on Amazon, Trump, this is your moment. Virginia and New York can't ask for more federal dollars when they squander their state tax dollars and federal tax breaks in this way.
2
We need to stop making 'gentrify' a negative in seeking public money for distressed areas. It's political correctness without any sense to it, as we see in this article where areas are being flagged bizarrely based on the share of residents with college degrees or are or white. What does that have to say about someone who is willing to put a financial stake in a "distressed" area with the hope that that the neighborhood will improve, and that they may even get a return on their investment some day? That someone could be anyone, even if they are, 'gasp', white! We should stop giving gentrification a bad name.
9
@David Godinez
It's not the gentrification per se, but the question of whether tax dollars should be used to make rich people take over a neighborhood. Fine, let them gentrify, but gentrify with their own pocketbooks and Amazon's own billions of dollars, not taxpayer money.
10
What about the folks, regardless of their heritages, supposed to do when they find themselves prices out of their homes and neighborhoods? You could look at the gentrification of Pilsen in Chicago or the East End in Cincinnati, the former Latino and the latter Appalachian. The 'hoods may "improve" but at a cost to those who have far less means then the newbies.
5
@David Godinez
If Amazon was willing to "put a financial stake" in the ground of LIC that would be one thing. It's another to have the city give them billions of dollars and have struggling taxpayers subsidize their payroll.
4
I live in Jackson Heights, Queens. I rent a sponsor unit in a co-op, the unit is owned by a large real estate firm which also manages the co-op. My rent has been relatively stable in the nearly 10 years I've lived there. I'm worried about real estate prices. Will the co-op board try to sell off the rental units? My apartment would easily sell for $500k with some renovations. If they sell off my apartment, or substantially raise the rent, where am I going to live? Where will my neighbors go? We are a middle- and working-class community. There aren't many other neighborhoods that "regular" people can afford where there isn't a commute over an hour into Manhattan.
In LIC, I'm concerned for the small shops that have opened up, particularly the nano breweries. There are a TON of small breweries that have popped up in LIC over the past 5 or so years in part because there is space to be had for relatively cost. Will these place (e.g., Transmitter, Big Alice) be able to stay open if rents get too high?
What about the LIC Community Boathouse? They host FREE kayaking trips out of Anabale Basin where the new Amazon facility will be. Is Amazon going to continue to let them use the space?
How about LIC Food & Flea?
Where are the 25,000 people going to send their kids to school? Western Queens schools are already bursting at the seams.
19
It seems as if most Americans don’t realize these tax breaks for the wealthy are going to come out of their own pockets with interest added. It seems to me that these truly distressed areas already provide incentives, because of the relatively low cost of property and labor that exist in these places. A lot of these places exist in areas that were once considered prime places to build for various reasons and a lot of those reasons are still present. Is there really many thoughts of trying to help the poor people in those areas? I doubt it, the idea behind it is there are poor people living in prime locations and need to be removed so that a better class of people can use it. In other words, it’s mostly just another way scam the taxpayers.
19
@Timothy Phillips If the program takes low value, low tax property and turns it into high value, high tax (real estate) property then it’s a win, not a scam.
6
@John Not for the people living there already. Not to mention that the incentive is that the developers won’t have to pay high taxes. It’s a win win for the billionaires that’s for sure.
2
@John
For those who own property, that is true, but not for residents in rental apts, nor for small local businesses that rent the corner store, the dry cleaner, the pizzeria, etc.
4
I just moved to Astoria and I fear being displaced. I’ve lived in 4 boroughs in NYC and Astoria, Queens is the best deal so far, I’m afraid my stay will not be long. It’s really sad that the little people are not considered in a situation like this.
13
@Miriam I hear you! and I'm a successful adult who owns my apartment and I STILL feel like a little person!!! We need subways! We need uncrowded schools. We need neighborhood shops. We don't need amazon!
6
Yet another example of the false notion that in order for the average to prosper the wealthy must have everything. I doubt that there is any satisfaction or thankfulness by the world's richest man nor one of the richest companies to have a significant permanent tax break, personal tax breaks not available to the average, and discounted real estate transactions not available to the average or even to the local residents. And willingly people harness themselves to the plow of the new feudalism.
9
I spent several years working at Amazon in Seattle. In my experience this company hires its personnel from the elite universities - not the State university graduates (like myself) that the misguided proponents of having them in NY are busy touting.
2
Amazon deal aside, I don't understand why all these activists get so upset over gentrification. Nothing happens, that's bad, something happens, that's bad too. I agree that organic growth is best, but it's a corollary of the capitalist system that change is disruptive and usually upwardly priced. I absolutely think that there needs to be a conversation about affordable housing and commercial diversity in NYC and elsewhere, but trying to preserve cities in situ is anti-urban; metropoles are dynamic, to treat them as wax museums is reductive.
Gentrification prices people living in one of these zones out of there homes and disrupts communities? Bring in the high cost real estate, the "good" schools, nice grocery stores, but not for those pushed out. Financial types and economists argue it's good for local economies. But whose interests are served? Who benefits? And who wants a low wage dead-end service job for Amazon or some business feeding off of it? We all need to question if government incentives for business investment serves public interest, is fair, and is such a win win as taughted.
5
@Rich
Everything prices people out of somewhere. Nobody has any sort of special claim on any city or neighborhood. The only claim a person has is the rent s/he can afford to pay. But i don't get why people like neighborhoods. I do get why people like nice people. But I've lived in nine different apartments in my life (not including dorms and my parents' home). Most college educated people are very accustomed to migration and displacement. One could say that "gentrification" (meaning mobility and change) is what defines the college educated. Most leave their neighborhood to attend college away from it.
1
"New York gave Amazon up to $1.7 billion in state economic incentives to help secure its location in Queens."
Why is my state asking me, middle class and a retiree, to subsidize a billion dollar behemoth with a CEO richer than Croesus and known for cruel exploitation of his employees?
4
@Judy Your state is not asking you, it's simply doing what it wants regardless of your input. We the people don't have a say on whether we'd like to subsidize corporations. The gov takes our money and that's the end of it. If we're lucky, we might get some crumbs...
2
@D True.
I am sure the Kushner an Trump crime families are already positioned to take advantage of this opportunity. Write it down.
2
Some facts: the area is federally designated as
“Distressed”. Poverty rate is near fifty percent where median incomes are below $20,000. The designated zones are meant to draw investments to economically struggling areas.
What happens to those poor folks when their rents rise? Do they get a high paying job because Amazon moved in? The argument that business investment benefits people in poor areas is spurious.
1
Here's an example of what happens. Adams Morgan in DC was a low-income haven for immigrants for decades. An Asian immigrant started a local grocery/variety store, loved by locals. The Post reported that despite its success and local support, it's closing. The landlord, big eyes looking to take advantage of increased gentrification, was going to increase the rent by 30%. So that owner, in business started by his father decades ago, has to close.
Republicans voted the tax credits, Democrats designated LIC as an opportunity zone, 2019-2020 bipartisanship will be great for the riches.
1
Where will the automotive shops who repair the trucks who deliver the Amazon packages go? And their children's, children's children...
Amazon was a disaster no matter where they landed. I wouldn't want their headquarters within 500 miles of my town. We're gentrifying just fine on our own, thank you. The last thing we need right now is more tech people pretending they know how to rock climb. Someone please tell them to stop. You're not hip. You're dangerous. Back country skiing is even worse. I hate watching the rescue copters haul the injured bodies back. But I digress...
Andrew Cuomo is looking at this from a budgetary perspective. I know. I used to conduct economic impact studies for a different state governor. You model everything and apply all your best predictions. The politician goes out and says whatever the heck he or she wants to happen and holds up your report as proof that the idea was right. They don't even normally bother to quote the report unless you write them bite size talking points. Graphs are better.
I also once lived in New York. I can tell you without hesitation New York is not going to appreciate the change. Whatever numbers Cuomo and de Blasio are pushing, you shouldn't believe them. They are looking for public justification. They do not care whether the deal is actually good or not. Long Island City is going to get transformed and the people responsible aren't even reading the impact studies. That's a big yellow caution sign for you
2
@Andy This is a corporate headquarters and not a warehouse with trucks.
1
@David
It was a reference to Luc Besson and Mark Kamen.
Most of LIC apart from the Hunters Point area looks pretty distressed to me. In fact it's a pit.
3
Wondering whether the developers of the glass apartment blocks in LIC had anything to do with the bid.
How many Amazon workers are getting killed or hurt delivering their merchandise?
And killing and injuring other people in the process.
I am concerned about the speed with which my orders are reaching me -- sometimes even early the next day -- and have started telling their drivers to slow down when they are delivering toothpaste and aspirin to me.
This whole preoccupation with speed has gotten thoroughly ridiculous.
Amazon and the other delivery services need to slow things down so we and they can smell the roses again.
3
Let's be realistic, why wouldn't New York want the presence of Amazon? NO ONE CRIED when MIKE BLOOMBERG welcomed Google with open arms. Chelsea has been destroyed by all of the tourism and high tech business that has moved in. I live in Chelsea, but I moved there to enjoy the egalitarian elan of that very diverse community. That no longer exists, I live with a new generation of aggressive money hungry young people who have no concept of the rich history of the community - which is home to two projects, a union housing development and HUD housing for the visually impaired. Give Amazon the tax credits and just hold your breath until Long Island City morphs into another Park Slope. Yorkville is gone, so is Lenox Hill but does anyone cry about the loss of those communities. When I retire it is doubtful I will be able to remain in NYC because the City Council remains and has always been greedy and self serving. Quality of life for the middle class is never a priority for the leaders of NYC.
2
@Mark M
The City Council had no say whatsoever. Times coverage specifically noted that the City Council’s land use authority had been eradicated in service of this deal, just like in the real estate giveaways at Hudson Yards and Atlantic Yards. Next up, Sunnyside Yards, bigger than Hudson Yards nd Atlantic Yards combined.
The governor granted the subsidy, partially financed by those in. Binghamton, Buffalo and lots of other areas with no benefit to gain from Amazon in LIC whatsoever. The Times has opposed this deal, but endorsed the man who made it. If someone on the Times Board of Ed had taken fifteen minutes to google “Buffalo Billion” they would never have endorsed “Amazon Cuomo.”
1
can anyone confirm if New York has agreed to change its name to New Amazon?
Rise up, feudal serfs of America!
Do not pay for the great lord's castle.
You'll also have to build it for minimum wage, then perhaps be privileged to work there under sometimes unbearable conditions and hope you can support a family on the lord's bounty.
Enough!
If New York politicians are going to provide billions of the people's tax dollars to the richest man in the world, we should throw the bums out.
Asking the people of Washington State how the great lord's presence has worked for them.
Ordinary people, arise! You have nothing to lose but a system designed to exploit you, keep elite politicians in power and subsidize the richest corporations and individuals on the planet until our country implodes into all the ills that despair and hopelessness ignite.
5
3 words for Amazon: East New York.
5
I’ve lived in LIC for ten years now. I loved it when I moved here.
Since then the area’s potential was no longer just my secret.
Easy commutes, beautiful views. Decent rent prices.
Money was to be made and the developers went to town and they continue to do so. The problem is that the there’s not enough infrastructure to support the boom.
Subways are crowded now. Not enough regular priced food markets. More schools are needed. The beautiful parks get too crowded and aren’t supervised enough. The library has become a boondoggle. The area has become too dense. The rent costs are going up. The beautiful views are being closed off.
So what is Amazon going to do for the immediate community?
A rec center? Internships for local kids? Build a school? Pay to make the Vernon Jackson subway platform bigger?
10
They're going to have "conversations" about affordable housing. As they say, talk is cheap. And in Va. Amazon's going to host job fairs at the low-income developments, so they can clearly communicate that no one is suited to work for them. No talk of free tech training.
How is Long Island City an Opportunity Zone? I live in the neighborhood. Rents start at $2,500 for a studio! Its a great location with developed infrastructure. If Amazon needs tax incentives, there are plenty of neighborhoods in NYC that need investment.
3
Boy, it's getting tiresome to see the NYT twist every single thing about this deal into a negative for NY State/NYC.
There will be jobs, but the jobs will not go to the "deserving".
There will be development, but the development won't solve NYCHA's decrepit housing stock.
The location selected by Amazon is not in the absolutely worst part of Long Island City.
What is next?
Shoeshine rates will go up when Amazon comes in?
8
@Baron95
There are two ways to look at businesses vs society.
A business should drain every bit of society's resources in order to make more profit.
A business should help and benefit the society that supports it.
6
@gratis
There's a third way: Trickle down economics.
Ever meander through LIC. Mostly it's a dump. And that construction that's taking place near the railroad tracks will make it a dark, gloomy, densely populated dump. You want to bring up kids over here?
6
The issue, the bigger question is, what does "Opportunity Zones" truly mean? Is it aimed towards all types of businesses? Or really only aimed towards the Giants, with the means and money to be preferred suitors?
Somehow I think the term, and how its being generally applied is all about the Giants. Is an OP-Zone near Cleveland (I'm picking random cities) really seeking to attract a multitude of diverse businesses - like we all grew up around? Or is the OP-Zone near Tulsa, seeking some Giants to come in and land one of their Mega-Complexes where it won't truly fit the location or the surrounding populations? Because its easier to zone and allow over-development - by one or two entities - instead of taking care to nurture a diverse zone, that would better serve the site and the people?
The LIC site deserves careful gardening, not the letting in of an invasive species. That will overrun the place, and undermine the native environment and local species.
That's what NYC, what all US cities, large or small, need to be doing. Careful and diligent planning. Not this. This will be a debacle.
Careful planning would include making Amazon build to the neighborhood, preserving buildings, building the shore line up for multi usage, etc, and not dropping a megalith of Bezo-Ego in LIC. Or any other place for that matter.
3
" gentrifying, based on recent upswings in median income, housing costs and the share of residents who have college degrees or are white."
So being white counts the same as having a college degree? Sounds sketchy, designed to fuel identity politics agenda.
5
Long Island City is certainly distressed. There is no there there. It is an ugly sprawling post-industrial landscape now cluttered with generic high rises situated on exit ramps. The capacity of the Court Square transit hub was exceeded several years ago and the traffic anywhere near the 59th St bridge entrances is forever clogged with horn blasting trucks. Imagine the impact of the L train closure and the Amazon HQ2 on all of this?
5
@thewiseking
I think the idea is that Amazon workers will live near the HQ and recreate near the HQ. I think the assumption is that people won't commute very far.
2
@thewiseking
Nonsense. The site abuts upscale Gantry Park, surrounded by luxury high rises, the construction of which lines Jackson Avenue right to Queens Plaza, giving Long Island City itself a skyline to rival, say, Philadelphia’s
1
The Grey Lady's writers like many Americans really need to challenge the idea of what gentrification means. There have bee a host of studies in the past decade that compare things like housing cost - movements of people in and out, etc of 'gentrified' areas versus non-gentrified areas.
You know the basic conclusion? The in-migration and out-migration and housing status is most areas undergoing 'gentrification' is not radically different than before they were 'gentrified'.
This is yet another case of the ol' 'everybody knows' actually means most folks who have not read the material don't know.
1
For those who are reflexively opposed to Amazon's decision to open offices in LIC bringing 25,000 jobs to the area, consider how we would receive the news that a large corporate employer plans to move out of the city, taking 25,000 jobs with it. Would that be cause for rejoicing?
8
depends if said company is paying their fair share of taxes.
9
No one seems to calculate the income taxes government draws upon the employees who work there. There are many ways local govs get paid from a big corporate arrival.
1
@Mike Magan
NYS income tax tops out at 7%. Pretax deductions for 401K, Transit chex, FSA/flex spending and the like could lower the average salary from $150K to about $120K. Then itemizing could bring tax revenue even (much) lower than $7000 for each job.
At a Bloomberg estimate of paying $61K per job, it could be ten years, or the year 2040 before the tax breaks might be amortized, assuming debt service was accurately considered, which I highly doubt.
1
Why did Amazon turn it’s back on Newark where the investment might merit the tax breaks? This is such a greedy move on their part, taking tax breaks to move into an already-affluent area that neither needs nor wants them when there was a very good option nearby with access to transport and extensive labor force, where they could actually have made a difference,
20
@Wednesday Morn
Because Amazon wants to attract the best employees, the top candidates, and now they can lure them with NYC as bait. Newark isn't as attractive. Amazon wants to attract the best graduates from the top universities.
Nobody is trying to make a "difference". They are trying to make money, That's what companies and workers do.
16
@Wednesday Morn
Having to deal with Chris Christy
3
Newark is commutable from NYC and the NJ burbs which are full of highly educated people and where you can actually have some standard of living on a software engineer’s salary. They’ll all be living in LI Burbs on those salaries. LiC is for people making 300k a year at least.
2
Just this week a giant new luxury apartment complex was proposed for a site in Inwood on a site that had stalled for years. Why now? Because Inwood is also an Opportunity Zone - in Manhattan!
As an urban planner living only a short subway ride from the new HQ, I am of two minds about the announcement. On the one hand it is great to see New York strengthen its position in the technology sector and increase the number of well paying jobs in the City. On the other, as someone with significant economic development experience, I agree with the critics who decry the massive subsidies spent to woo companies to one city over another which could be better spent on fixing schools and infrastructure and affordable housing problems. This applies to the incentives for building sports stadiums as well. If the move is well orchestrated and prompts the City to improve public transit, affordable housing and programs to lift people out of poverty this could work out to be a boost but past experience suggests this is not the norm.
7
@Lewis
how can that money be spent, if it doesn't exist? the government didn't give MONEY to Amazon. It just gave them a tax break (complete). You're talking as if the government gave Amazon money. It just promised not to collect taxes. There was never any money. None was given away. There would be money, only if some other big company that offered to pay taxes came instead of Amazon. In this scenario, no money has changed hands. The city has just agreed not to charge taxes. In exchange,the city gets 25k new workers who WILL pay taxes on their personal income from Amazon. If Amazon were not in the picture in any way, you'd just have some undeveloped real estate that doesn't generate any tax revenue at all. It's not as if Amazon REPLACED other business that DO pay taxes. At best, Amazon HQ will replace a few small businesses that didn't generate much tax revenue. Amazon has not blocked some preexisting tax revenue stream.
14
@richguy " the government didn't give MONEY to Amazon. It just gave them a tax break (complete). You're talking as if the government gave Amazon money. It just promised not to collect taxes. ..."
Your statements mischaracterize the issue:
---
"It costs us nothing," he [Gov. Andrew Cuomo] said at a press conference Wednesday — since, he contends, we are only foregoing taxes we wouldn't get at all if Amazon didn't come here in the first place. He says we will make back $9 for every $1 in tax foregone, give or take.
The problem with this analysis is it assumes all the economic activity we're buying with the subsidy package wouldn't happen without the subsidy package. And that's not true. Google's impending expansion in Manhattan — where it will develop a campus nearly as large as the one Amazon plans — shows a mega–tech firm might locate here even if you don't give it billions of dollars.
Plus, when we do bring Amazon in, it will tend to crowd out other businesses and especially other people that might have located where Amazon is going. New York is crowded — there's more demand for housing than supply, and the number of top development sites is limited — so the case that subsidized economic development means more net economic activity is much weaker here than it might be in, say, Cleveland.
---
http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/11/why-new-york-is-paying-amazon-usd3-billion.html
4
N Yorker: the economic activity being attracted with the package would absolutely not have happened without it. Why otherwise would the site be vacant and underutilized for years.
At best the small industrial buildings there now would change hands, get a paint job now and then. The parking lots might get built on in a small way. If we were lucky the buildings and infill wouldn’t look too sorry. It’s doubtful they would have any connection to the waterfront. And in no way would the result be anywhere near 25,000 new jobs.
2
$138,000 median income is a distressed neighborhood? Talk about LIC in the 1960s---now that was distressed. But $138K will get nothing in the post-gentrification era.
3
Well if Trump's tax law was an element in Amazon coming to New York it must be bad. If 25,000 jobs come to NYC it must be bad. If their families contribute to the economy of NYC this must be bad. Frankly I can't recall when the NYT credited Trump with anything yet the economy is roaring, the world is still at peace, and missiles are not flying over Japan from North Korea. This may just be an example of alternative facts.
3
I don’t believe they are saying that Trump’s tax law was the reason Amazon came to NYC. They are simply pointing out that the law may be used by developers to exploit Amazon’s arrival. The law of unintended consequences.
2
So the Republicans gave the owner of the Washington Post a massive freebie. Democracy dies in stupid, eh?
How can you speed up gentrification in LIC? It's been unaffordable for about 10 years now.
4
Agreed. This is an absurd location to offer tax incentives. Newark could reasonably have hoped to benefit from a big give away given it’s need for further investment and development. LiC is a Gold Coast as it is now and was only headed up without Amazon. In fact, Amazon most likely contribution will be fresh burdens on transport and traffic.
3
LIC hasn’t been distressed in at least a decade. It’s home of some of the highest rent and highest cost housing in the city. Anyone else notice the dozens of luxury skyscraper developments lately? Anyone had a stroll down Vernon Blvd lately? Full of trendy bars and restaurants as far as the eye can see.
The saddest part about this deal is that the rest of queens will be affected. Astoria is right next door. What is now a semi-affordable neighborhood will become less so. Where are people supposed to move now to find affordable housing?
7
This is as saddening as it is unsurprising. The rich make each other richer, leveraging the tax code and gullible elected officials, while the rest of us muddle through.
5
In a nutshell. Amazon is distressed, but my food stamp benefit was cut to only $35 per month starting last month.
4
All of the hand-wringing about the effects on the subway ignore the fact that this will be a reverse commute to an outer borough, which the city has been trying to encourage for decades. At least for the many workers who will choose to live in Manhattan. The real question mark is the many who will live in Brooklyn. Maybe it's finally time to do something about the only Queens-Brooklyn direct line, which is in an advanced state of decrepitude.
4
You are convinced these jobs will support Manhattan rents? More likely they will be commuting out from gentrifying places like Jackson Heights on already crammed subways.
3
@HKGuy
$150K won’t go far in the Manhattan housing market, think Hudson Yards, particularly if this engineer has student loans to pay, too.
1
Let me get this straight: Trump's tax cuts for the wealthy involved tax increases (loss of SALT deduction) for middle class New Yorkers, as well as subsidies for Amazon to move to LIC, which is bristling with new luxury apartments? it all adds up ..... for the top 0.01%.
7
My grandparents raised 3 kids in an LIC apartment on 21st Ave, across the street from Paragon Oil ("Earl" as Grandma would call it). My grandfather would walk down to Silvercup where he would make bread until he retired in 1960.
I've lived in Seattle since 1993 and I've seen what Amazon can do to a city. Amazonians don't interact with the neighborhood they work or live in. They eat at the food trucks during the day or visit the Amazon food store (where you take what you want and walk out, your account is debited-Big Brother Is Watching). Go out into the South Lake Union neighborhood after 5:00 where Amazon has it's headquarters and it's a ghost town. Amazonians go home, long-on and order in.
It is going to be very sad to see the gritty, working-class neighborhood that my Mom grew up in change into an Amazon Desert.
1
@AD I has been in the process of substantial change for several years.
3
I’ll bet Trump didn’t foresee benefiting Amazon when he put this in his tax cuts.
1
@Ann Jun
You really think he read the bill, let alone understood it?
Laugh of the day!
1
No wonder they didn't choose Austin!! Glad to see a low income area get 25K jobs! Otherwise, Austin may have had a good chance, as its a lovely city.
Lol. Low income neighborhood with $900k 1 bedroom apartments. Residents of LiC could buy and sell large swaths of Austin even as rich as that city has come.
4
Long Island City is far from being a low-income neighborhood. There are plenty of those in NYC but those are not the neighborhoods Amazon is investing in.
1
Why am I not surprised...
2
When did avoiding taxes and having public funds pay for your stuff become "investing"
10
@Ed
Probably always, we just didn't know it.
Until government returns to supporting only the common good and not special interests, using tax dollars to incentivize rich people, we will suffer these ongoing forms of corruption and fascism.
7
Queens doesn’t need amazon, amazon needs Queens. Hope we can somehow block the move.
4
Amazon is evil. Amazon is NOT reproduction of Sears and Roebuck, rather the opposite. What is has led to is the destruction of normal human interaction of purchasing goods while developing strong personal and economic bounds within communities. Fight back, this toxic so-called business does not have to be our future.
4
Great Lakes State
Unfortunately the future is here.
Distress — where fake progressive politicians are ready participants in the theft of billions of taxpayer dollars with their corporate patrons
7
In all the discussion of Amazon's decision, no one has noticed that DC and NYC are among the very few metro areas that can absorb 25,000 jobs with barely a hiccup. I suspect this was a factor in Amazon's decision. (Chicago also, but it's apparent Bezos wanted an East COAST HQ to complement his West Coast HQ.)
5
Seems like a sweet deal for investors. Viewing the map of Los Angeles where these zones are drawn they reside in prime areas where the market has already been explosive. Where do I invest? Is there a fund I can get into? Of course Trump was all in. This is easy money. This is how the rich get richer. Affordable housing? Anyone?
3
More than anything, this is a massive failure on de Blasio's part. I really thought he would be different than Bloomberg in term of selling the city to the highest bidder and subsidizing luxury development. Shame on you de Blasio for not doing better for your constituents. I left years ago, but my heart goes out for the folks on the middle and lower class income ladder trying to get by in a city that's increasingly only for the children of oligarchs and the tech bros.
11
Stop giving tax breaks to wealthy developers and corporations!!!
20 year tax abatements for luxury condos while the subway crumbles, helped along by the influx of newcomers the condos bring?
MAKE THEM PAY!!
Amazon, one of the most profitable companies in the world, does not need tax breaks!
MAKE THEM PAY!!!
Otherwise, we working New Yorkers are subsidizing the richest demographic, while long time residents lose their homes through displacement and runaway gentrification.
STOP STICKING TAXPAYERS WITH THE BILL FOR PROFITS THAT GO TO ONLY PRIVATE CITIZENS!!
JEFF BEZOS ~ WELFARE QUEEN!!!
54
So Jeff Bezos gets to take advantage of a Trump tax giveaway? Has anyone pointed that out to the donald?
4
I'm a small business owner on the Upper West Side. We have been in business for 37 years. Every year it gets harder to make ends meet because of Amazon and other online retailers. I have faith that we will survive, but giving Amazon 2 billion dollars in subsidies is a slap in the face and a punch in the gut to long time local retailers that live and work in this city.
NYC is still a walking city and there is a need for local businesses that serve their communities. But these local businesses need some protections from monopolies like Amazon. Our local businesses, schools and communities need to be put first. We have plenty of high paying jobs. We need middle class and working class jobs for the people that already live here.
68
@Jared I live on the UWS and I am so glad business owners like you stay with us. I went down Bleecker Street today, my old neighborhood, and half of the storefront are empty. It's so sad. Please stick with us, and thank you for the reminder to SHOP LOCAL as often as possible. NYC doesn't need amazon. Buffalo does.
13
This is maddening that those tax incentives are given to a company that bankrupts small businesses! Shame!
4
Please! As a former LI to NYC commuter I assure you, the Amazon employees will not be living in LIC but rather live on Long Islanf where they can have 40 minute commute on LIRR and enjoy the transit tax breaks they receive as well as not have to pay NYC income tax. There are too many tax incentives for working in LIC but living on LI.
2
@Ally Except that your argument doesn't hold water when you calculate the vast differential between city residential taxes and those on the island, which are the highest in the country. Anyone who requires proof need only look at the price of comparable houses in Little Neck and Great Neck. You're also ignoring the fact that many of these worker bees will be young professionals who prefer to live in the city.
5
@HKGuy
yes that's true but one pays zero NYC income tax when living outside the five boroughs or Yonkers so its a bit of a wash.
I believe the same will occur in Westchester and to an extent NJ.
City Re taxes are going through the roof and the increases are more aggressive than ever. Unless you live in one of the protected areas (UES) your the taxes are no bargain anymore.
Does it mean Amazon will also pay for a complete overhaul and upgrade of the subway system in ALL of the boroughs??? If yes, then they are more than welcome. I just suspect this won’t be the case
3
The next story that needs to be written is about how much lobbying was done to influence governors' designations. These days, it would not be surprising to see a correlation between property owners' political activity and subsequent OZ designation.
3
The developers' lawyers, it seems, are always smarter than the government lawyers.
2
Tax breaks to real estate developers is how you get elected to public office around here. It's not BDB's city, it's REBNY's city.
7
I really wish they had chosen Newark instead of LIC. Newark has great potential and it would flourish with such an infusion of jobs and investment. LIC on the other hand- it will just manhattanize LIC, Astoria, Woodside.
I have an open mind though and I hope steps will be taken to share the prosperity with the diverse working class who built this city. Cab drivers need a place to live, too, as do teachers and healthcare workers, without a crazy exhausting commute.
17
I agree LIC is "distressed"; it has been since I was growing up on Long island in the 1960s. If is so "distressed" than why did New York State promised them $1.5 billion?
Also, how much money is New York State and New York City is going to ask for to upgrade the various transit option to get people to LIC? I think we know that answer, massive fare and toll hikes by the Port Authority.
Thanks to Google Maps, the LIE and Grand Central Parkway have the same lane capacity today, as they had in 1984, the last time I drove them. The LIRR, still has the Jamaica choke point, as it always had. My guess the subway/bus service to LIC is also stick back in the early 1980s.
Of course, where do you put 25,000 more people who cannot afford to live in Manhattan, Brooklyn or Queens? The Bronx? Nassau? Suffolk? Westcheester? Hoboken? Staten Island? ON an average $150,000/year salary we are talking about a 35 mile commute, if not more. And, the further they live away, it means tolls, fares and higher property taxes, where these employees choose to live.
I'm glad I left Long Island years ago; it was expensive in the late 1970s, it looks like it is going to get much more expensive now. By ht eway, Bentwood, and Wyandanch could use gentrification, as those spots are the cheapest, most crime ridden, places to live in Suffolk County. They do have the benefit of being next to the LIE and LIRR.
2
@Nick Metrowsky Why can't Amazon's 25,000 folks afford to live in Brooklyn or Queens?
1
@Nick Metrowsky
The Port Authority tolls are on 4 bridges and two tunnels connecting NYC and New Jersey. The MTA controls the subway, buses, LIRR & Metro North commuter trains, and the tolls on six bridges and two tunnels within NYC.
AMZN has taken the playbook from free agent athletes that pit teams against each other to bid up their own contracts. AMZN has done the same thing to play other cities against NY and DC. Bezos knew all along he was going to the east coast. NYC for the culture and ability to draw the best talent. DC- he wanted to be close to the lobbyists that he has already paid over 23 million dollars to lobby politicians for his company. Essentially a cynic would say a big part of this new HQ search was a big smokescreen to move his corporate soldiers closer to DC for political access.
As for the argument that the 25,000 employees who will live in NYC will spend many millions when they shop for merchandise, appliances, and other apparel. Where do you think these people will make their purchases? Where else? AMAZON!!!
4
As a N.Y. expat I am happy for L.I.City that they won the lottery and not Boston. Rents in this area are already beyond affordable. Hey New Yorkers, don't kvetch about your subways until you ride the T system. Having Amazon here would have overwhelmed the the Trolley /subway system, the oldest in the country. The highways in and out of this city are even worse than the dear old Long Island Expressway/Crawlway.
The rents in L.I.C and Astoria for the old Bodegas, Pizza joints and the neighborhood Greek deli's will be priced out of existence. Here comes Whole Foods.
Amazon has killed retail but will make a few people richer while the rest of us will be left with the scraps.
As automation takes some of their jobs away and autonomous cars (what a word) replace driver's jobs, we will become drones. Orwell and 1984, a few years too early will be upon us. Have a good day!
1
@Guitarman
I just drove the Mass Turnpike and rte 9. They seemed fine to me. The turnpike was great. Same with Memorial drive and rte 2.
I grew up in Boston. I haven't taken the subway since 2000. Back then, it was very good, especially the red line. I never much relied on the green line, but I've taken it to Brookline from Boston.
@richguy
Of course the traffic volume varies with the time of day. The Green line works but it is slow and as they say in Down East Maine, sometimes "you can't get there from here" Didn't mean to dis Boston metro. I love living here. You can take the New Yorker out of NY but you can't take New York out of the guy. or something like that.
Happy T'Day.
I love it when progressives give billions in tax breaks to massive companies and rich people, and then claim to represent the poor. How many poor people will be forced out of their homes by Amazon? How many homeless people will get jobs from Amazon? Progressive policies at their best. The rich get richer, the poor get poorer, and mass transit and public housing suffer.
12
Its all part of the plan. Thank you.
1
@Southern Boy
As always....thank you for nothing.
7
Bozose will also have a nice slip to park his “boat”, Anable Basin. Hopefully Amazon doesn’t shade out the rare urban sky on Vernon Blvd.
3
All NY state tax payers paid 1.7B bribe money to Amazon to come to NYC. Time we stop giving free money to corporate America and 5 years of tax exemptions this is the Cuomo way of doing business. NY state is broke and in a fiscal cliff. Shame on Andy for abusing tax payers money.
11
Tax breaks for the rich. Corporate welfare. It is insane the republican policies. It is killing the USA.
9
@P Wilkinson As if a good business can't compete or grow without coerced tax dollars taken from the masses to give to the few.
2
New York gave Amazon up to 1.7 billion in state economic incentives. Amazon will bring in 25,000 jobs with average pay of $150,000 (that is $3.75 billion a year.). When they move in, they are going to pay NY state and city income taxes. They are going to spend their earning and saving to invest in housing, shop for furniture, go out to restaurants, buy insurance and many more. They are going to make some industries grow to support the need of the Amazon employees and in turn the business will hire more just to support. Amazon's new Tech incubator may encourage more growth f tech in the area.... It is not just the new 3.75 billion from the Amazon hire, it is triple the local business.
New York Governor is doing a great job to get Amazon in. People against it is not only short sight, it does not have the economic knowledge to make the call. Luckily, they are not the one running New York. God bless the newly elected progressive congress woman. She needs to take more economic and financial courses to really work for her constituents.
When spending money, you need to see what is the return on investment. This investment to get Amazon is a no brainer.
20
@corinna106 But businesses are supposed to invest to grow, not government by taxing citizens to see if they can make a buck. Government needs fair rules that apply to anybody, not to a specific company. That's special interests and violates equal protection under the law as well as the natural obligation to serve the common interest.
5
@corinna106
Read more closely. The jobs must only appear by 2030, but the subsidy comes up front. The maximum the state and city could stand to glean in tax revenue is between $4-7000 per year per job. It will take a long time to amortize the subsidy at that rate.
1
It thrills me no end that Amazon and Jared Kushner are able to get tax breaks that are not available to me.
21
Of course Amazon gets to take advantage of tax breaks intended to stimulate (not replace) neighborhoods, just like all the big landlords and developers in the five boroughs get to pay no taxes for 10, 20, or more years on buildings they build (already for massive profit) because...because, uhh, because. Oh right, because that's how the deck is stacked, and one wonders why those big landlords push everybody around like they own the world.
16
Opportunity Zones can be a great vehicle to revitalize impoverished areas. The problem is how those zones are selected. The blame here goes squarely to Gov Cuomo who designed LIC as one such zone. The same has happened here in Oregon where Gov Brown designated most of downtown Portland as an Opportunity Zone. While LIC may technically qualify for Opportunity Zone designation, the reality is that there are so many more areas that are "more worthy" of such incentives. There's another problem because if you're an investor, you're more likely to invest in LIC which then makes it harder for other "more worthy" Opportunity Zones to attract that capital.
3
@DaiTau Government "opportunity zones" suggest unequal protection, giving special interests and a subset of the population a big boost at the expense of common taxpayers. Fascism and communism are both bad uses of government with respect to business.
People are trying very hard to make the argument that 25000 people coming into a city 9 million (15 million metropolitan area) over a period of 10 years, will alter the fabric of the city to make it worse and that there’s no benefit at all for New York to be home to the largest most important tech company for the coming decade.
8
Jim Tankersley says ... a tax break was pitched as a benefit for distressed communities. But critics fear it could primarily help wealthy investors ... (and) ... the opportunity zones are meant to draw investment to economically struggling areas that lack access to capital. Wealthy investors are rushing to set up funds to plow money into those areas. I say - don't blame Amazon driving a good 1.5 billion dollar bargain; blame Cuomo and De Blasio for not pushing for a simple capture of land value in LIC going forward. That "corporate welfare" could easily be recouped by collecting $400 per month from each of the 25,000 new households whose breadwinner is an Amazon worker (plus the ripple effect to another nearby 50,000 homes) over 3 years. Amazon is not the bad guy; it's your political leaders who pretend to help distressed areas only to enrich landowners to the increasing land rents (sparked from Amazon's move) from society.
4
I lived in LIC for about 10 years starting in 2002 and the rental costs went from fairly reasonable to exorbitant during that time. The area surrounding the Amazon sight has not been "distressed" in terms on cost of real estate in quite awhile. The spot is highly desirable and will have a view of the Manhattan skyline and is one stop on the subway to Grand Central. It is of course nice to have new jobs in NYC, but there was quite a price to pay for this deal, $2.2 billion or so of tax payer dollars. The real estate in the area will become less affordable because of Amazon; a 660 square foot 1 bedroom apartment that doesn't look at Manhattan is now around $3,600 a month, so it's good Amazon will be paying some workers $150,000 a year. They will need it, as real estate expenses will increase around Queens and into Brooklyn and probably all the way to the better school districts in Nassau County. Not much room for the middle class in "the city" anymore; we finally conceded defeat and left NY for a place that does not strangle us with real estate costs.
7
"it could primarily help wealthy investors..."...gee. you think??
2
Vast portions of NYC are in poverty if you consider how expensive it is to work and live there. Of course Amazon's employees will be making that even worse, and perhaps driving out some if not many. It happened on the west coast, so it probably will in NYC.
3
CORPORATE WELFARE. . .the only accurate description of free tax payer money to corporations. because these corporations are robust and really do not need support, fairness would dictate such free money would be accounted as unearned taxable income. . .just like a gift exceeding a few thousand dollars is subjected to Federal Taxation.
With all of the inequities around us, it remains unconscionable to waste tax dollars, be they city, state and / or federal, on wealthy corporations instead of properly investing the funds in resolving human misery much of which is a result of greedy corporations business practice of 'playing' one city-state against another for short term gains.
6
Seems a stretch to link Pres. Trump as a bad guy to a very positive thing for NY. I'm no Trump supporter but it's starting to feel like we're needing to link everything to Trump being the devil. If this area hadn't given Amazon the tax benefits it might not be there and another city would be reaping the benefits of employing all those people. I'd encourage the NYT to try and not link so many things to just point out how bad Trump is. You lose credibility as a journalistic organization when the goal seems to be "make Trump look bad".
2
I can’t comment on the proposed locations for Amazon. But I can comment on the expanding high tech industry in the Bay Area. The area is overflowing with young professionals, contributing to higher prices in an already unaffordable real estate market. Middle class families strain their budgets or leave the area. The community is becoming predominantly affluent and/or transient. As beautiful as the bay area is, it feels, at times, like a Disneyland for young professionals.
25
Long Island City as a designated zone for IDA and EDC Tax abatements was a sham designation to enable Cuomo and DeBlasio to be in the running.
Nothing more than an agenda at the expense of all the other property tax payers.
6
President Trump's tax law primarily benefits wealthy investors? I am shocked, SHOCKED to hear this!
29
Time for some serious national 0.1% welfare reform.
The federal income tax code, the state and city handouts to the richest among us is what makes America swirl around the never-ending drain of record income-housing-educational-socioeconomic-inequality.
Add up the collective local-municipal-city-state-federal-income-sales-real-estate tax burdens of the average American and compare that to the tax 'burdens' of the richest Americans and the richest corporations and we'll see that taxes really are for the little people.
“We don't pay taxes. Only the little people pay taxes.”
- Leona Helmsley
Welcome to Leona Helmsley's America.
Now shut up and eat your gruel and enjoy the 0.1% bladder fluid from Amazon and the rest of corporate America and the gilded class.
It's almost time to get out the guillotines.
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Good Old Jeffrey.
Looking for every single way to steal from WE THE PEOPLE that he can.
He wants OUR tax-payer federal dollars to "improve" the neighborhood. He want OUR government contracts to sell OUR personal information to them. He wants to destroy ALL competition in his demented quest for power and OUR elected officials coddle and bow to his wishes? For what? Low paying jobs and destruction of neighborhoods?
Jeffrey makes The Con Don look like a piker. No wonder The Con Don detests him.
What HAS our United States of America come to that these demented Robber Barons control it right now?
WE THE PEOPLE are the only ones who can/will stop them and NOW is the time. Hit the streets, Good People of New York and Virginia and DEMAND that Jeffrey - one of the greediest people in the world - pay YOU to use YOUR cities/state.
32
Sure, Long Island city is just like Eastern Kentucky - or at least Detroit. No one wants to live there, housing market is down. Thanks to Amazon this area will now grow and prosper, people will finally move there and the great already existing subway system (G train, 7 train, L train!) will be no longer empty.
7
@Oliver Maybe the area will grow and undoubtedly some people will prosper but the prosperity will be shared in a very limited way. Detroit has put pretty much all of its reno $$ into downtown/midtown filling it with niche shops, eateries, large sports and entertainment venues and ever more expensive lofts and cool apartments that are logistically and financially out of range of families. More and more, we have created "two Detroits" with the gap in between increasing daily
3
@mary therese lemanek If I can suggest you peruse the real maps illustrating this project. People have a tendency to read articles that criticize without 'seeing' the proof.
This is a very damning article starting in the first paragraph with the median income. Not fair. Take the train one stop and you are in parts of Queens that are not as affluent that rely on subways to trek into the city- and there are apartments with affordable housing some of which must be built as a part of the deal, some standing at the ready; Schools will follow; these jobs will be great because they will be varied to provide services too, not to mention the number of large construction projects, parks, improvements to parks, existing buildings, complexes, services and things the community needs.
Most people look for the negatives of large capital investments before they actually read WHAT the project is all about. We have several city and state colleges (City University shout out) one Cornell campus already built by the Bloomberg administration that can all be feeders to these lucrative jobs. There's Silvercup/Bklyn studios within a stone's throw where they can do productions..Amazon has already committed to building 1.5B worth of construction... now how do we see this as negative when all of this tax support is tied to increasing jobs? As residents of this city we are obligated to pay attention to the ways in which the positives outweigh the negatives: View the maps here: https://bit.ly/2B5MDbf
6
@Oliver You mean plenty of white people do not want to live in Detroit, because that would demand a commitment to the struggle, which they the bigoted white ruling class would prefer to have the poor, particularly those of color commit to, while they grab and keep the good stuff. Financial treason.
The legal gist is this: Opportunity zones are a good tool for revitalizing impoverished areas, but opportunistic investors, assisted by inattentive political oversight, are using zones which are already on the upswing to enrich themselves.
Perhaps, with all are data crunching power, we should be phasing out the opportunity as neighborhoods improve.
13
This is just another example of the truism that tax laws are just loopholes for the rich.
27
Okay wait, I'm bad at math.
1) A place with $138k/year median income is considered a "low-income community"?
2) New York gave $1.7bn for this secondary headquarter? Just how many jobs is that meant to create? How much revenue? Aren't they operating at a loss?
3) I should ask "how do we know developers would have come anyway" but actually, "how much did that tax factor weigh in Amazon's decision in the first place?"
Trump taxes, or how to throw money by the window.
7
@François
1) Yeah, exactly right, because gentrification has already hit but the designation hasn't been reassessed. Oops, or more likely business as usual?
@François: If you drill down into this deep enough you will find the Trump organization has any number of fingers in this pie.
I moved to Arlington-- to Crystal City-- 30 years ago. I live in Arlington still, and I'm worried about the pay-offs that we're supposedly going to receive for the incentives. I hope this is not like the Olympics-- which the County leadership also went after-- huge hopes, huge costs, and in the end, no gain. I hope this isn't public funding and private gain.
The County has had a high and persistent office-vacancy problem for years, which has put a lot of pressure on property taxes. We're faced with building a new elementary school which is expensive and difficult in this already built-up area. The metro is doing poorly, with neglected maintenance, funding quarrels, declining ridership-- and limitations of the original design. Our roads are clogged. Housing prices are already prohibitive, as are rents. We have become markedly less diverse-- economically and racially. We are a highly-degreed, compulsively competitive community that exhibits the Washington characteristic of "I gotta be first in line!"
Who's going to pay for those "incentives" and who's going to pay for the improvements to infrastructure, as we wait the years for a substantial number of jobs to materialize? Will we at least get a rebate on our Prime memberships?
Of course, we are also a stone's throw from political power--a short launch for the tax-dodging Amazon to bombard any legislative efforts to rein in the behemoth.
3
@Kristine Montamat If you have a vacancy problem, solve some of it by converting it to that school you need, instead of building a new one. Try being creative!!!
It will be distressed. Just like sf. It seems like they will need a good pr person to make this go down nicely.
How much money are they getting to “help” out the area?
They should be required to put in parks and schools and other public set services to offset damages.
5
While one can appreciate the idea that the creation of such development zones may be fraught with politics, the idea that someone should fear "gentrification" is classist and borderline racist. As areas of cities bring more wealth and economic opportunity, we should applaud. For those who are displaced economically speaking, we should and to some extent do have government support for their own economic development, including free schools and libraries. I wish people would take advantage of the relatively stable society we have to become the next Jeff Bezos instead of complain about class and race based concepts.
8
@Think Strategically
You may “think strategically”, but perhaps you should try “living reality” as those who are “lucky enough” to avail themselves of free schools and libraries. Just be sure to note the underlying thesis of this article, that such large tax break incentives have to be extracted from some city government pocket. Does your calculus factor those chronically underfunded free schools and libraries into its equation? Those magnanimous government gifts are a lot less likely to serve as the stair step-up they’re purported to be when their positive effect is continuously compromised by a broken tread. This is the truest example yet of 21st century “opportunity cost”.
5
@Eric B. I started my comment by saying that no soubr politics plays a role. But your calculus is one of a zero sum game, and that's not the reality of economics and develop. Wealth is not just transferred (although I do agree with you there are elenns of that that occur), bit it's also created by the likes of Bezos.
I commend people for pointing out instances where the development rules are being abused, and we should know that abuse does and will happen and guard against it.
I was speaking out about the odea that gentrification is bad. Wealth creation is good. Making places more wealthy is good overall. It's not a zero sum game, no matter what you've been indoctrinated with.
@Eric B. I started my comment by saying that no doubt politics plays a role. But your calculus is one of a zero sum game, and that's not the reality of economics and development. Wealth is not just transferred (although I do agree with you there are elements of that that occur), but it's also created by the likes of Bezos.
I commend people for pointing out instances where the development rules are being abused, and we should know that abuse does and will happen and guard against it.
I was speaking out about the idea that gentrification is bad. Wealth creation is good. Making places more wealthy is good overall. It's not a zero sum game, no matter what you've been indoctrinated with.
Not 'near' LIC, but from Long Island, where NYC boroughs make up the majority of jobs. Outside of the how the LIRR and subways will be able to support an additional 25K workers without major changes will be interesting to watch, I say bully to *any* decent company that wants to bring in all those new well-paid jobs.
There are many locales that wish they were chosen, let's put ourselves in their shoes and count our blessings. Funny thing is, many naysayers I know of are avid Amazon customers, so why the backlash? It would have been developed anyway, instead by thousands of smaller companies, but I guess with a single target like Amazon, people get to focus their misplaced frustration. People will complain about anything.
6
Handouts for billionaires - that will end well.
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@Maureen
Yes, for the developers it will...
To classify any NYC waterfront property today as "distressed" or an "opportunity zone" is ridiculous. An organization like Amazon taking advantage of such tax classifications is shameful but par for the course.
72
John Lettieri, "president of the Economic Innovation Group, a Washington think tank that helped advocate the creation of opportunity zones," got called out by this entire charade - and in this article - and doesn't even have the guts to admit it.
5
The bellyaching over every aspect of this deal is getting tiresome...and it's only been a few days. I am all for skepticism and investigative journalism. But did The Times send out reporters to find out everything that is wrong with Amazon coming to Long Island City? And did it tell them to make something up when they can't find something wrong?
In this case, we are talking about a federal law trying to favor certain zones for development. Is it perfect? Of course not. Are there pockets within a zone that don't deserve/need help? Of course. Are there pockets outside of designated zones that need more help. Of course. Will there be zones that recover somewhat but still qualify for tax breaks because of a lag ? Sure. But these are the products of a large government (in this case Federal) micromanaging economic and geographic concerns. If we are in favor of big government getting involved in these areas, then this type of thing will happen...every time.
More important is some perspective. Thanks to a variety of factors, businesses want to be in New York, and in this case it includes an outer borough, and it's not Brooklyn. For those who remember the opposite case, this is all pretty remarkable and should be appreciated.
28
Perhaps the "distressed" zone change was a deliberate one, aimed at megacorps' sane-state city projects to starve states' tax coffers of money and thus make THEM demand money like the GOP ones do now and look like the leeches.
"covfefe" is brazenly spiteful like that, and his GOP happily compliant to get their cut.
Leave it to them to find misery the company it loves.
1
It's easy, folks: don't buy stuff from Amazon. They are truly evil, in the way they treat employees, the way they squeeze suppliers, and the way they rip off the tax payer. It's not that hard to buy stuff from reputable sellers. Do it.
56
We pay more sometimes but we never use Amazon. This is been for the past 3 years at least. The New York Times wrote quite an expose about the cruel treatment of employees by Amazon. We feel the only moral thing to do is to avoid them completely and we do. We no longer shop at Whole Foods, either. It feels good!
14
@AG
I don’t buy from them for the reasons you cite.
4
@AG It's not always easy to buy stuff from reputable sellers, AG. I went to three supermarkets looking for unbleached paper towels made from recycled paper (and not a measly 10% recycled). No luck.
I once purchased a particular face cream (pretty organic) from a local seller. Then when it was time to buy a new one, four trips to four places yielded nothing.
Local, small independent bookstores? None in my area.
Finding certain clothes that are made fairly and fit a tall, long-waisted frame? Not here. Or shoes that fit a size 10.5 woman's foot. A joke.
So, then after searching a few websites and yielding no certainty, yeah, sometimes I turn to Amazon.
I don't love the power they have and how the wield it, but don't be so certain that folks all across the country have it easy trying to buy things.
6
One more insult to the human animal, this much more pressure to make a life choice that draws families away from physically and mentally healthy lives in order to go live in urban hell. That much more in paychecks dumped into unreal costs for everything from food to rent. Thousands more just that much farther away from trees or mountains, lakes or proper forests & streams. Lives, forcibly engineered to become more ugly for more people over the course more of the future. The rulers of a political entity called New York City become this much more empowered, with a bigger tax base to waste on already over-burdened urban landscape. More dirty lungs, out of shape bodies, and tired urbanized minds. This all because one man has rocketed beyond the previously understood Greed Barrier that decent ethics provides cultures as a check to the poisonous leverage of unmitigated money.
The alternate reality would be an improvement in life quality for these same children of the future and proper humanist development outside the constraints of an urban hell. Livable or even outstanding incomes building fresh schools & uncrowded roads in a geography that includes nearby nature, fresh air and natural aesthetic. Calmer minds, healthier bodies, and space. Wealth & development located with wise planning where expense is not immediately astronomical, where peace and quiet are built-in lifestyle multipliers for kids and families.
Naw, Bezos is the richest guy on Earth. Give him what he wants.
8
It’s one of the many ironies of this administration that when it does something “good” for people, one cannot trust the news about it. Since Trump lies so much and claims that everything he does is perfect, reasonable people have long learned to roll their eyes. Trump is the prisoner of his own nonsense. Hence, reasonable people have come to dislike everything associated with the White House. Trump’s own doing, all these “haters”.
And so begins another four years of the Times professing how deeply, profoundly troubled it is by the Mos Eisley-esque ethics of Albany and one Andrew Cuomo...
...followed by endorsements of Andrew Cuomo in the 2022 Democratic primary and gubernatorial race.
54
@knockatize How very true. Case in point: natural individuals and corporate individuals alike, we've all forgotten about Andy Cuomo, his corruption, and his Moreland Commission shutdown.
And writing as a registered Democrat, now we have union-busting liberal, Jeffrey Bezos, moving into town, a move which will trouble no one in the wide array of entities that make up the state's Democratic Machine.
19
It's fascinating how this article doesn't go in the realities of Long Island City. The entire area is booming with new "empty" commercial buildings. The water front starting at the ferry landing are lined with million dollar condos that are for the most part vacant.
One has to wonder if the billion dollar tax give away was more for the benefit of the Real Estate developers who have New York politicians in their pockets. How much of those 20,000 jobs will actually materialize, and how much income and sales tax will actually make up for the lost tax revenue.
I'd like to see more reporting the Real Estate developers who stand to benefit from the Amazon move.
99
@Don Yes, regarding "real estate developers", what does Trump still have as far as real estate in his old stomping ground, Queens? Anything in Long Island City?
6
@DaveG or Jared.
2
@Don Or when the next "super storm" damages all those buildings in flood prone areas we will be spending even more.
6
Hi, I'm an editor in the newsroom's Reader Center. We'd like to hear from people who live or work near Amazon's proposed new headquarters, in Queens, N.Y., and Arlington, Va.
As Amazon unfurls its plans, I'm curious what the mood is in your area. How do you feel about Amazon's decision? Be sure to include your city, state and, if applicable, neighborhood. I may pass your information along to a reporter or publish your perspective in another story.
12
@Kelly Virella, Editor, Reader Center
There goes the neighborhood! LIC already has a major shortage of schools, sewage treatment infrastructure, and no shortage of greedy corporate landlords who will raise rents on tenants in a heartbeat. There seems to be no shortage of entitled young professionals in the area, whose families may subsidize their lifestyles from far-flung places. Now we will have even more of them! Time to head for the suburbs!
30
I live in Astoria.
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@Kelly Virella, Editor, Reader Center - I've lived in Long Island City for nearly 4 years now (8 years total in the city), and I've watched the neighborhood grow and change significantly in that time period. Personally, I welcome Amazon's arrival!
Plans were already in the works to rezone properties surrounding Anable Basin, where Amazon is set to build most of its office space. I have mixed feelings about the $1.7 billion incentive package offered, but most of my frustration there is directed at our mayor and governor (Cuomo controls the MTA). Ultimately I believe the neighborhood's infrastructure will be able to support the influx of new workers, but I wish Cuomo had the same zeal for subway upgrades as he does for airport redevelopments.
Finally, look to Hunters Point South, where hundreds of permanently affordable units are in the pipeline, and where many were recently completed. That's great news and will help the neighborhood stay affordable. But the onus to build more of those kinds of apartments is not on Amazon; I do not blame the company for taking incentives our elected leaders willingly offer it.
In summary, I am looking forward to seeing LIC change - I did not move to New York to live in a place that stands still. I just hope our elected officials realize the importance of a comprehensive plan, and I hope Jimmy Van Bramer can help give the community a voice in the process.
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