Byron York just blew you out of the water Savage and NOT with conjecture, but with the facts. The ACTUAL "Nunes Memo" and what was actually in the FISA warrant.
Simply put, Comey, Shief, Brennan, Clapper, the DNC, etc. are ALL now proven liars!!
Just a matter of time before we find out Obama either ordered and/or authorized spying on the GOP/Trump campaign by "weaponizing" our Intel Services.
3
If I were Trump's lawyer I'd quit now. He's going to incriminate himself at some point. Then he'll turn around and blame his lawyers for not doing their job. He is truly not worth defending. All he does is reveal how incompetent he is at everything.
5
Let me get this straight. Trump and the GOP are releasing highly classified material and attacking our intelligence agencies for monitoring someone who engaged in “clandestine intelligence activities” on behalf of Russia and had been the target of Russian government recruitment?
This is clearly not the behavior of people who believe they are innocent. How long are we going to allow the treason of this administration and congress continue?
6
In politically sensitive issues like this with the control of the government on the line, it is incredibly important to be credible and dispassionate about the facts. I appreciate that the story concedes that the dossier was an ‘important’ part of the application (Nunes used the world ‘essential’). I also appreciate that while there was a footnote admitting that the source was out to discredit the ‘candidate’, it later said the FBI deemed the source credible. I also appreciate the memo did not mention that an opposing political party funded the research
In this situation, there is no reasonable way to conclude anything other than the Democratic Party drummed up a report and influenced several Democratic FIB agents to set in motion wiretapping of Trump. It is blatantly obvious. This does not in way diminsih the seriousness of the bad behavior of Trump, but this constant denial and downplaying of the what the Democratic Party did has done nothing but play into Trump’s hand and create grassroots support. The wiretapping was a massive, massive political mistake
2
Nunes will probably admit to spending too much time under crop dusters.
1
The case against Page and Trump,was so open and shut that Strozk decides to through a dinner party for FISA judges and does not even bother to update subsequent request for extensions with say evidence obtained from the first warrant.
At the end of the day Trump is the rightfully elected President of the US. At the end of the day any support of this slow motion coup are not an affront to Trump but rather the democracy of America
5
This describes one of the most-fascinating tribal colluding violent psychopaths-forms of extremely bigoted hypocritical greed-based contradiction of executing values and legal policies, which any one can observe and study coming perpetually from such religious fundamentalist dark-money oligarchs, as by the NRA-Republican establishment as well as their emotionally and cognitive defiant voters:
If all these very legal evidences of the Intelligence-related investigations of money-laundering and Russian mob-connections now piling up against the corrupt NRA-administration would have been in reverse complied by the FBI against ,citation, "the Black Socialist, Muslim" Obama-administration, the majority of the NRA-Republican careerists, the majority of average Republican voters and the military generals would have called that clearly treason. So, the question is why are the same normally hyper-nationalistic jingoistic overtly proud patriotic NRA-Republican, Christian and other religious fundamental leaders who support Trump,as well as ( polls supposedly show) why not NRA-armed Republican voters who shouted "SOCIALISM" then at the Obama White House not shouting and demanding equivalent now?
Question: why would self-declared "WINNERS" + hate-crimes-inducing, their guns-& other-stocks-always-benefiting Facebook's fake news-sponsors display these kinds of extreme discrepancy in the supposed "values" said NRA-Republicans supposedly have??
I don't no
Best,
A.E.
Projectheureka LLC;
How could the FBI have used these FISA warrants on Page to spy on Trump?
Page had already left the Trump campaign when the warrant was granted.
However, Page was also the subject of a FISA warrant starting in 2014, when he was being actively recruited by Russian intelligence.
Interestingly enough, the only time Page was NOT under FISA surveillance was when he was actively working for the Trump campaign.
6
Don't want to be called a spy?
Don't be a spy. It's pretty simple. It's a personal choice the one makes to either support their country or work to subvert it.
One is not born a spy. One becomes a spy by choice and training. Do not let anyone tell you otherwise. You don't accidentally meet up with oligarchs and henchmen of corrupt dictators. You don't accidentally forget to register as an agent of a foreign government. You don't accidentally have connections, money and power from thin air. They are given or taken.
7
@Tom two SMALL problems, Page said he was "never" contacted by any Russian to spy for them. Conversely, he VOLUNTERED info to both the CIA and FBI upon the completion of each visit to Russia.
Sound like a SPY to you??
Anybody care to ask why the Republicans are doing this, lying about the investigation? There are only two options about this. Either they believe for real that this is a political witch hunt or they know that it is not...and then what? I would say that this country is in serious trouble if the latter is true, and it is really starting look like it is. We are hosting a group of people who are willing to sell their souls only to push their political agenda. These people are the true globalists: their ideology is more important to them than anything else. They are exactly the kind of hysterical radicals that the Founding Fathers warned us about.
2
Oh my, someone involved in the Trump campaign that took meetings in Russia. How many is that now?
Carter Page, in his interviews on MSNBC, was pretty much a flake. He seems to enjoy his time in the news. I’m not at all sure what he has to offer either the Russians or Trump. But from his performances, I wonder why anyone would trust him with anything.
His long involvement with Russia and then popping up in Trump’s campaign seems to me a big red flag. Looking out for characters like that is the job of the FBI. And they were doing it. All the rest is just pointless noisy argument.
6
Facts and the truth are unimportant of to Trump and his Republican zombie supporters. They change their narrative and attack, based on no real evidence, but on what they can get away with. It has been a slow and steady decline in what passes for comment.
One common theme is the inability of Trump to engage in thoughtful, meaningful discussion with any adversary, Democrat or Republican.
As Trump continues his assault on US policies and values, his cult will follow him despite Trump's ill thought out policies being bad for most of his supporters. I fear his cult will never accept Trump is the problem, despite it being obvious, every day of his presidency
2
Incessant lying is standard operating procedure for our morally defective president and an effective ploy in firing up and misleading his pliant, poorly informed base. A self-serving, unprincipled perversion of postmodernism, Trump fully understands that specious unfulfilled promises and the hope they engender are enough to secure the loyalty of his bewildered, anxiety-laden followers in this age of poorly-defined and misunderstood relativism. Facts matter and no amount of story telling will change that fact.
2
From NYT (7/23/18): "One central issue was whether the F.B.I. gave the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court sufficient information about the funding of Mr. Steele’s research to understand that he had been commissioned to dig up information about Mr. Trump’s links to Russia by someone with a political motive, even though he had been a neutral source in the past....Republicans had also faulted the application for not explicitly identifying Mrs. Clinton’s campaign and the Democratic National Committee by name. But that criticism ignored the fact that law enforcement officials were following a general policy not to name Americans, even referring to Mr. Trump only as “Candidate #1” in renewal applications despite noting that he was now the president-elect and then the president."
From WSJ (7/23/18): "It’s true that the first application doesn’t mention any names. But it does refer to “Candidate #1” (who is clearly Donald Trump ), “Candidate #2” ( Hillary Clinton ) and “Political Party #1” (Republicans). The FBI had an obligation to tell the court that the dossier and its “credible” source had been retained and paid for by “Candidate #2” and “Political Party #2” (Democrats), but it didn’t."
4
Page must be made to immediately plead guilty to all charges.
But of course he has been charged with nothing so far.
1
I just saw Chris Hays interview Democratic Rep. Adam Schiff on MSNBC. Hays used the word “lie” three times in the interview, in reference to Devin Nunes. He even asked Schiff directly if Nunes lied. Schiff, in each response, referred to Nunes’s “false statements,” without ever invoking the word “lie.”
Maybe I slept through the history lesson, but I can’t recall George Washington saying, “Father, I shall never tell a false statement.”
At what point are our leaders and the media going to call a lie a lie? Maybe when the bovines come home.
2
Here's my issue with the Times in particular and the press in general: You have not adapted to the New Normal and as such you are abdicating your vital role in a healthy democracy.
What is the New Normal? It's where no matter what you say here, Trump goes on Twitter and undercuts you. You aren't the final word anymore, you are no longer the voice of authoritative wisdom.
And yet, here he goes again, telling vicious lies, saying north is south and black is blue and here you go again saying "Latest Study Shows That Blue Is Still Blue, Undercutting Trump's Claim."
You see my point? Yawwwwn.
I hate to be the one to tell you this but you will dissolve into irrelevancy if you don't lace up your boxing gloves. "Release Of Justice Warrants Confirm That Trump Lied" ("and continues to lie in his latest tweets.")
Then go on Twitter en masse and make sure the word gets out, the man is lying. Completely lying. That's not at all what these documents show. Push back, push back hard, push back every time.
That's the New Normal. Are you ready?
8
What complete drivel. The government is required under federal guidelines to verify the allegations in support of its FISA application. The point of the Nunes memo was that the FBI and the Justice Department failed to independently verify the allegations raised in Steele's reports, which Steele admitted were passed on to him by subagents, who in turn obtained the information from unnamed Russian sources. Verifying Steele's credibility is not sufficient to meet that requirement. As far as the government's information about Page from 2013, that information could not give rise to a current FISA warrant. It would be background information at best. Moreover, self serving, uncorroborated statements in the FISA application, such as the bureau “believes Page has been the subject of targeted recruitment by the Russian government and that he had been “collaborating and conspiring with the Russian government” aren't evidence. To obtain the warrant, there needs to be contemporaneous evidence that Page was acting as an agent of a foreign power and that he was engaged in criminal activities. There is no verified witness evidence supporting those allegations in the application. These are important legal issues. The rule of law is meaningless if the government fails to follow its own guidelines and administer the law in good faith. The FBI and the Justice Department failed to do so in this case.
5
@Tom Williamson And yet the warrant was reauthorized by four different judges.
9
We are not in an age where you can confront a lie with the truth.
We are in an age where you need to bully people with your point of view.
For that the democrats need a tall, white Christian man who served in the armed forces and has a vocabulary of at least 160 words.
He need not tell the truth. He just cannot have heel spurs.
Trump has been "hoist by his own petard"...and doesn't have a clue that he did this to himself. I"m sure that sometimes many of us are very frustrated when we learn that Trump has made comments or taken action opposed by his closest and most trusted aides. In this case, I'm glad that this time he ignored the advice and once again acted in spite of good counsel.
The problem is that Trump never learns from his mis-steps. Ignorance and arrogance like stupidity cannot be cured. Trump will continue to do more harm to himself and America too.
4
Nunes should be charged with obstruction.
NOW.
7
Republicans reserve for themselves the right to lie, cheat and steal, and commit treason.
8
Trump has studied well Putin's policy of "disinformazia," disseminating lies about, and attacking valid news sources, as well as lying about and attacking the characters of people who disagree with him politically.
This must stop, or we will have American leaders who control the information we get, and control who is elected or appointed to the courts---based on loyalty to the Party.
Call this out! And Vote!
1
I cringe every day at the latest atrocity committed by this awful man, this lying traitor. He represents me on nothing. Worse is his party, and even worse yet, are the people who will vote for him in spite of every disgusting revelation, every filthy word he utters, every person he denigrates either verbally or literally.
I don't know how our nation will survive this.
7
Jail to the Chief!
8
The Republican's obfuscation of the facts is not so much a defense as it is a strategy designed to muddy the waters and to create doubt. In Trump world, truth has become an endangered species.
2
Republicans Criticism of the information in the Steele Dosier is based on faulty reasoning that is described by the term "genetic fallacy" whereby information is judged as either good or bad on the basis of where it comes from, or from whom it came.
The fact that the Clinton campaign funded the later phases of the investigation of Trump's campaign doesn't make Steele's analysis incorrect. Because the judge was informed of potential bias, there was nothing improper in the FISA application.
2
This is not how innocent people behave.
An obviously guilty President with a complicit and spineless GOP-led congress is slowly eroding the public’s faith in our intelligence agencies and destroying the values of honesty and integrity right before our eyes.
I assume this must mean that there are many who agree with what has been happening these past 18 months or so and/or a whole lot of willful ignorance and that is the scariest and most disappointing fact of all.
2
Carter Page described HIMSELF as a staff adviser to the Kremlin. Should the people of the United States have concerns about his influence/involvement in the presidential campaign? It definitely bears investigation.
DT will never learn that others in government, and even business, follow established rules and procedures when taking action. They keep meticulous, verifiable records. They approach the courts for permission to investigate further, as required by the Constitution, without considering the political affiliation of the judge and/or the judge's appointing president. And why is this? Because unlike DT, these others live under the rule of LAW, not the delusional, ever-malleable rule of a despotic, narcissist-in-chief.
7
If Carter Page is a Russian spy why, after 2 years, has he not been indicted? For anything?
Amazing to read the opposing sides analyses of the application.
One side is happy that the FISA judges were Republican appointees and that the app vaguely mentioned political sourcing. Case closed!
The other side notes that standard FBI/DOJ procedure is that evidence itself must be verified. Verifying that it correctly reflects Steele's commentary is not the same thing and is grossly inadequate. Further, no independent evidence is visible in the app. And of course, years later, Page remains unindicted despite the 400 pages of "evidence". Case closed!
Neither side treats the other side's main point as even worthy of comment.
3
@Larry Stevens Great comment. Very true.
It may not have begun exactly with the Steel dossier, but it was sure boosted, legitimized and
accelerated with the dossier.
1
It shows nothing of the sort. Nunes's memo is completely exonerated with this. Byron York argues forcefully that the release of the heavily redacted FISA warrant application documents on Carter Page have vindicated Devin Nunes. By the same token, Andrew McCarthy now judges that the documents completely disgrace the FBI and James Comey, Democrat partisan.
3
@netprophet Byron York does very little analysis, except to quote Nunes and then declare his statements to be "accurate."
And I wonder why Democrat partisan Comey revealed zilch about Trump being under investigation, whilst publicly reopening the Clinton email probe just days before the election?
What amazing spin. In fact, the FISA warrant confirms all the key paragraphs of the Nunes GOP memo. All of them. The FBI relied heavily on Steele and his "dossier," yet did not verify it independently according to the standards and procedures stated by the FBI itself. It was flat wrong the Page was a Russian agent. It is unlikely there could have been any FISA application without Steele, since it was he who supplied the hearsay, which we know to be false, that Page was working with the Russians.
It would seem that some paranoid schizophrenics desperately need to belief that Schiff and his Democrats were right and Nunes were wrong. But then, there is the actual FISA warrant.
7
@Stephen.....So explain why the wire tap was then reauthorized several times. The reauthorization of the wire tap would not in any way have been based on the Steele dossier as you allege.
7
@W.A. Spitzer That, Mr. Spitzer, is for you to explain not me. There is no real explanation--if by that you mean real legal showing of probably cause--to justify a wiretap on an American citizen (who had worked earlier with the FBI to convict Russian agents who approached him).
It's a mystery that should be looked into.
@Stephen And explain why Page was the subject of a FISA warrant long before he met Trump.
3
There is an old saying, "What's in the wash, will always come out in the rinse."
Trump would celebrate that the Confederacy won the Civil War. I'll share this opinion here, again and again: Trump clearly, repeatedly demonstrates via video and audio ample behavioral features of a dangerous mental (behavioral) disorder. Everything that comes from him can be traced to this pathology. This type of disorder can be managed humanely only by containment or a type of behavioral quarantine because of the total lack of insight capacity.
5
No new Supreme Court appointments until the Mueller Special Council Investigation is completed. Please pass on and please repeat.
6
For the love of God, did you actually read the materials before writing this tripe?! Every element of the Nunes memo was proven to be accurate and the one point where it was not perfectly accurate, it was directionally correct. Listen, all you are doing is moving us closer to the point where we cease to be a free Republic. But you're happy with this sort fo behavior from the Deep State because right now it's supporting your ideological proclivities. For those of us who actually care about freedom, not so much.
5
@JMR...…. "Every element of the Nunes memo was proven to be accurate." ….Except Nunes conveniently left out critical pieces of information, and how do you explain that the judges in question (all appointed by Republicans) reauthorized the wire tap?
9
Maybe you didn't read it. Nunez was not right.
The foundation of the Nunes memo is not "shaky" it is nonexistent and the title should say so unambiguously.
7
Trump was capable of corruption and factual distortion on a grotesque scale while running his businesses.
There was no reason to think he'd change as the president.
And he didn't.
14
And they get away with lying - yet again. Openly. There has to be some consequences for these traitors.
4
Several days ago, you all ran this piece...
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/17/opinion/robert-mueller-william-webste...
“…To accuse Mr. Mueller of trying “to frame” Mr. Trump is wrong…
Probably true – but the NYT has been trying to frame him for more than a year, and shows no signs of letting up…
For every hyper-rational Mueller and Horowitz, there is some unhinged doppelganger that held an equally lofty perch in our national security apparatus, mouthing off as vituperatively as Trump…
And – like the NYT – purposefully conflating general (alleged) inside-the-Beltway corruption with specific Trumpian (alleged) beyond-the-pale Russian collusion…
By the numbers and by the patina, any Russian damage to Clinton was more likely (allegedly) wreaked through Stein’s candidacy in the election and Sanders’ candidacy for the Democrat nomination…
As is becoming clear through the growing catch in Mueller’s web…
(before anyone hits the “outrage” button – no collusion in either of those places…Just think of the Russians as one more super-size and secretive PAC that operates independently of the candidates)
The best defense may be “Everybody was doing it” – though you still need to pay your taxes…
Or – looking through the other end of the binoculars…
Putin was doing everybody…
To do in Clinton…
She had – as she had done with Nixon – made it personal…
In turn – so did they…
PS
Trump’s genius has been that he makes it personal – with everybody…
4
@W in the Middle If you can show some proof that the NYT has been trying to "frame" Trump, please provide it. Otherwise, consider the NYT investigative reporting what it is: the truth that looks bad for Trump.
9
@W in the Middle...By the numbers and by the patina, any Russian damage to Clinton was more likely (allegedly) wreaked through Stein’s candidacy in the election and Sanders’ candidacy for the Democrat nomination…Which has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that Russia interfered in the election.
4
Facts don't matter for this administration or for most Republican office holders because the facts don't matter to the great majority of Trump supporters. As long as that is the case, Trump can claim with impunity that his campaign was spied on, that the Mueller investigation is tainted, that the claim that Russia interfered in the 2016 election is a hoax etc. Persuasion is a lost cause with Trump supporters. The only remedy is brute political force, i.e. show up and vote Trump and his enablers out of office.
6
Note that Page's translation of paid foreign agent turns into "informal adviser."
3
I watch a lot of "Law and Order" reruns. In many of them, Lenny (the cop) takes a short cut during an arrest, like maybe not getting the right warrant to search a suspect's house. In the trial later, Jack (the D.A.) has to fight getting all of his evidence thrown out because of Lenny's foul up, even though we (the audience) know the guy is guilty as sin. That is what is happening now. Trump and his backers are trying to get all of Mueller's evidence thrown out because they think the origination of the FISA warrant was based on false evidence. They contend that none of the evidence Mueller has undug since should be counted. My question is: Why not? If the original warrants were granted on thin evidence, they surely have lead us in the direction of some major crimes. Why would we not want to finish the investigation and turn over all of the rocks? The truth will set us free!!!
2
Carter Page is calling himself " an informal Kremlin Advisor" which means he was a Russian collaborator. Trump hired him in campaign team because of his relation with Kremlin and Putin. The declassified memo proves that Russia was meddling in our election in favor of Trump. More over, Putin said it very clearly in joint press conference in Helsinki. How the traitor Nunes got so much power? Is he a Russian agent too? Why FBI can not stand up to him? Trump is out of control but he is the president. Nunes is out of control too. But who is he?
3
Don't let the smoke get in your eyes. The release of the memo has NOTHING to do with vindicating trump.
Instead, it is to signal those who are being watched, what processes and tools our government has and uses in order that they can know how to elude the government.
trump and his legal team are using the press as the conduit for communication the same way they did to announce to witnesses that the witnesses might get pardons (if they don't talk).
4
Everything that comes from Trump is make believe. It has one purpose - to avoid accountability.
2
Trump might be a little more circumspect in his decisions to release information if he'd ever learned to read more than isolated sound-bites.
1
Either the FISA document released by Rod Rosenstein accurately reflects the Nunes memo or it does not.
This isn't a difficult reading exercise for highly educated NYTimes readers.
3
Here's the thing. We have about a 33% of the population that has went all in for Trump's little cult. They think he did a wonderful job in Helsinki and the press conference, they have no problem with him having a two hour secret meeting with Putin. The fact that Trump doesn't trust the American people or his own government to be in on the meeting seems perfectly ok to them. The meeting will be about whatever Trump chooses to say it was about whenever it suits him until his boss Putin says otherwise. Seems legit to these people. They will never read this article or any other that contradicts their dear leader. The rest of the entire planet is being just mean to Trump for no reason at all other than trying to make Russi...er America great. We need to remind these little traitor loving 33% percent that they are the minority and we need to do it hard. Should be easy. Just vote for anything that doesn't have a "R" next to their name. C'mon November.
3
One wonders about the growing support for Trump even in the face of astonishing incompetence. Is it possible that it's nothing more than petulant defiance? That those who support this increasing monstrosity are emulating the pettish child who jams his fingers in his ears when a parent is trying to make him understand something he doesn't want to hear?
I know that's condescending! I know most Trump supporters aren't childish! But the building frustration in trying to understand that support and its seeming indifference to the incredibly negative impact the man is having on our country defies my comprehension.
5
Dear NYT:
Your opinion writer (and reporter, how does that work?) Charlie Savage betrays a fundamental disqualifying prejudice, claiming (without evidence) that the FISA records "plainly demonstrated that key elements of Republicans’ claims about the bureau’s actions were misleading or false."
Not so.
Given all the redactions, it is impossible to know if the probable cause findings in the Carter Page FISA application are based on anything more than the Steele dossier, which remains uncorroborated and unreliable. This over-reliance on unverified Russian sources was the gist of the GOP critique, not the chicken droppings cited by Savage.
The released FISA text does not inform the court -- or us --as to the identify or reliability of any of Steele's primary Russian sources -- who very well may be feeding him -- and all of us -- disinformation that The Times was all too eager to promote.
What -- other than Steele's still-secret Russian government and intelligence sources -- is the evidential basis for the finding that Page was an "agent" of Russia, colluding with Russia's efforts to disrupt our election?
And Mr. Savage entirely ignores that Steele flat-out lied to the FBI when he denied being the source of Michael Issikoff's Yahoo article -- which was the primary corroboration for Steele's dossier (another key GOP critique).
Perhaps Mr Savage needs a lesson in news analysis: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/fisa-warrant-application-support...
7
as usual....it's clear POTUS didn't actually read the documents first....and neither will his cult.
4
Page will have his day in court- he is accused of breaking laws - just as Trump and Co. broke laws - taking money from give leased hotels, his commercial holdings, and the hats!!! Trump is accustomed to his Mafia-like strong arming. Page is a pawn.
You guys just can't deal that we elected Trump President. He's ugly , rude , a Queens brawler, a serial adulterer, a liar but who cares? It's about policy results , not aesthetics. Tax cuts, stronger defense, Justices who call 'balls & strikes' , vastly less regulation and radio silence on LGwhatever issues and most importantly he's not Hillary. It's called 'democracy'....and it's you guys (and your buddies in the Deep State) who are really attacking "our democracy" by not accepting the election results . Just keep moving Left which will help us lock up the 3 Branches and you can all take great consolation in your 'virtue signaling' to one another.
8
Bravooooo!!!!
1
NYT says President Trump, “claimed without evidence....” How does the NYT know that?
The NYT fails to admit that Trump has access to far more classified material than it or we do. So, it would be accurate and honest to say that Trump, “claimed without evidence of which we are aware.”
“But the uncensored portion does also discuss a prior investigation into a Russian spy ring that tried to recruit Americans as assets in 2013. Mr. Page is known to have been one of its targets.”
Sounds ominous, right? That's because we're *not* told that Mr. Page assisted the FBI when Page learned of Russia's alleged efforts. So, a US citizen's efforts to assist the FBI are used to cast suspicion on that citizen!
“The application contains a page-length explanation that does alert the court that the person who commissioned Mr. Steele’s research was 'likely looking for information to discredit' Mr. Trump’s campaign.”
1. It certainly didn't take the NYT a full page to “disclose or reference the role of the D.N.C., [and the] Clinton campaign ... in funding Steele’s efforts....”
2. And, amazingly, that “page-length explanation” simply couldn't squeeze in the Clinton campaign and DNC funding roles.
“a general policy not to name Americans”
But that wouldn't apply to naming those with an ax to grind who funded “research.”
The FBI fired Steele for prohibited media leaks and then lying about it – but *continued* to vouch for his honesty to the FISA Court.
So, still “without evidence?”
7
@Gerry K.
Well said.
It should not take a full page footnote to disclose that the Democrats and Hilary secretly financed the dossier. And the "general policy not to name Americans" was not implicated in the slightest, given that Hilary was already elsewhere cited as Candidate No 2, as was the DNC. No names needed.
More important, the court was not informed as to the identity or bona fides of the Russian sources cited in the "dossier," nor told that these sources were second-hand and repeating hearsay -- and may indeed have been part of disinformation campaign.
Nor that the dossier claims relating specifically to Carter Page were then -- and remain -- unverified.
Nor was it disclosed to the court that Steele flat out lied to the FBI about not being the source of the Michael Issikof article -- which was the primary corroboration cited in the filing.
Similarly absurd is The Times' claim -- without evidence -- that this FISA release somehow undercuts the Nunes memo.
For a genuine "news analysis" check out: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/fisa-warrant-application-support
4
@Gerry K.,,,,"NYT says President Trump, “claimed without evidence....” How does the NYT know that?".....Duh. Because he made the claim without providing any evidence to support the claim.
1
A lie is halfway around the world before the truth gets its pants on.
It’s important that politicians be honest and that there be an honest party for which to vote. But the Democrats are not going to best GOP lies with honesty. We see the results now. The Democrats need liars tgst can push emotional buttons now to win. They can be honest when they take the congressional leaders’ gavels.
Given the history of the FBI, IRS and Intelligence agencies being used by those in power to fight their political opponents ( J E Hover, Nixon, etc.)-- Congress needs to pass a law that any group of five members of Congress can have an independent counsel created to investigate a suspected abuse with extremely broad powers to see documents and question those in and outside government with a grand jury.
The trigger for doing this needs to be far below that of a Congressional majority or a committee majority, as those involved in the abuse may be of the same party, or otherwise affiliated with those who committed the abuse. Inspector General investigations as not sufficient as they are part of the permanent government.
No one is above the law, especially you, liar-in-chief. I applaud our officials in the Justice Department, your dedication and unbiased work is saving our Country from a corrupt gang in the WH and Congress. Vote everyone
3
I am willing to reserve judgment on this and other issues until the Special Counsel has spoken. In the meantime, the Republican Party collectively needs to grow a spine and stand up to President Trump. He is doing far more harm than good and our country needs to begin the healing process.
5
Unfortunately too many readers of the Times as well as the NYTimes itself seem incapable of being remotely objective when it comes to Donald Trump. President Trump is difficult to like and in many ways he is like a bull in a China shop.
I have been a life long Democrat and did not vote for President Trump but I do not hate him and find he has some real accomplishments in the economy and foreign policy. President Obama, especially involving the latter had been a disaster. I therefore feel that given the level of hatred of the President within the FBI, it is hard to conceive that many, especially at the highest levels, worked to undermine him. If remotely true, and I believe it is, the idea of security agencies taking active sides in politics is a far more serious threat to democracy than anything that the President does.
5
@jefny....Oh boy. You do know that Comey is a Republican? His replacement Wray is a Republican. Rosenstein is a Republican. Muller is a Republican. all four judges involved in granting the wire taps were appointed by Republicans. If you have any suspicions that politics is involved you are completely on the wrong side of the street.
14
Carter Page is a hoot! Even though he is clearly in some serious trouble, he loves to go on cable television and grin like a useful idiot. Trump certainly knows how to pick the best people.
As to the issue at hand, two things stand out:
1. The Steele Dossier was not the significant justification for the FISA warrant. The Republicans saying so is just political gaslighting.
2. In all the absurd back and forth, it seems no one mentions that the Steele Dossier has been proven substantially accurate. Even if the Clinton campaign paid for it, that does not diminish its validity.
Evidence of conspiracy is evidence of conspiracy. Nunes and his cronies are treasonous and I hope their day of justice arrives.
7
@Barking Doggerel....The Steele dossier was originally commissioned by Republicans during the Republican primary.
11
@W.A. Spitzer Yes, I know. I was making the point that even if it was the Clinton campaign (which it became) it would not invalidate the findings therein.
@W.A. Spitzer
Not true. Steele was hired only after the handoff to Hilary and the DNC.
And to this day, the Steel dossier has not been verified with respect to what matters -- the explicit claims made by anonymous Russian spies paid for by Hilary Clinton's oppo researcher -- against Carter Page, Paul Manafort or the president's attorney. Zilch.
If you have got any corroboration for the dossier, let's see it.
When the particularized allegations comprising a claim of criminal conspiracy fall apart -- as has happened here -- it is an odious abuse of prosecutorial discretion to carry on, and a failure of objective reporting for a newspaper of record -- such as The Times claims to be -- to ignore it.
Please, let's get back to fact-based journalism.
1
The jury is in, not on the Russian infiltration investigation, but in the complicity of the GOP. And it is yes.
7
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of stupidity."
Frank Leahy
4
Carter Page's smugness and unbridled condescension begs the question, i.e., what is he trying to cover up? His perpetual smirk mimics Martin Shkreli, another disingenuous pariah who had the smile wiped off his face when all was said and done.
7
Has American Citizen Carter Page been charged with Espionage. With being a foreign spy. It's NOT likely that he was some sort of spy or mastermind of a conspiracy. And yet he was targeted not once, or twice but 4 times in a secret FISA that meant one party/administration currently in charge on the other party. If there is an ounce of respect for privacy and against unreasonable search and seizure and spying on American citizens and on campaigns for American Presidency, lets preserve please. We are going to need it for every subsequent Administration be they Republican or Democrat. Grow up and wake up people.
In other words, congressional GOP members were lying! Just say it.
4
@proffexpert
That would be fake news. Their report was utterly factual. The NYT is attempting to obscure that truth. Given your comment the NYT is succeeding.
4
The rule of law lies with the person who will use his fist. - Donald J. Trump's New America
Donald Trump could not care less what the FBI did to Carter Page. He could not care less if Carter Page is a Russian Agent. Neither could anyone in the GOP.
There is one reason and one reason only why Trump and the GOP would attack this warrant so vehemently. It was this warrant, I believe, that captured proof of Donald Trump's conspiracy with the Russians.
When Donald Trump learned of the Carter Page wiretap is when he accused the FBI and Obama of tapping him and Trump Tower. Accusing them of being Nazis.
It isn't Carter Page they GOP and Trump want to protect, it is the evidence that investigation uncovered they don't want to see the light of day.
1
Why does the NY Times keep referring to the Steel dossier as DNC funded when it was really started by republicans?
6
Vote out every GOP incumbent and pro-Trump candidate running for office in the 2018 midterms. And do it again in 2020. It's time for citizens to 1) remove those who have abused their power by knowing and willingly refuse to follow the rule of law and instead lie like rugs; and 2) deny pro-Trump candidates the opportunity do the same.
7
President Trump and his allies, and the GOP, Republicans et al, reserve for themselves the right to lie, cheat and steal.
4
Watch his next trick - ramping up rhetoric on Iran.
3
I think you have it backwards. The FISA application completely verified the Nunes memo.
5
@Scott
Please explain, I could use a good laugh.
6
This is not about the FISA warrant. Stay on topic.
@Max Deitenbeck
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/fisa-warrant-application-support
Shaky Foundation ? How about we call it Lies.
Because they are .... deliberate lies.
11
@Fed up
Attack everywhere about everything to distract. Own the news cycle. Move on fast to distract elsewhere. Tell differing stories to all so no one can find a truth. - The Art of War
Democrats need to stop their gape jawed thunderstruck gaze and attack. Trump IS the Art of War. Read it and anticipate what he will do and stop it.
3
the whole mueller probe was supposed to be a slam dunk , dig in find some evidence , indict trump or send the evidence to congress so they can impeach trump and then move on focusing on the mid terms , thats how democrats and some of the never trump crowd in the GOP envisioned it !
Now over 400 days in the entire thing has become a liability for the democratic party and they have no idea how to get rid of the beast they created .
The problem is not just that the whole thing has the party so galvanized that they totally forgot about focusing on the issues that really matter to the american people ahead of the mid terms but also that there are more and more things coming to light that democrats dont want to come out and that mueller is taking more and more actions that even moderates are calling out as pure propaganda stunts with no practical value !
Take as example the indictment of 12 russian intel officers , none of them will ever stand trial in any american courtroom but that never was the intent of those indictments to begin with .
If mueller truly was interested in prosecuting those individuals than the indictments would have been sealed , then arrest warrants would have been issued and authorities in allied countries notified about those people being wanted , when any of the 12 had entered a country with a current extradition agreement they could have been nabbed and brought to the US for trial but as i said thats not what mueller wanted !
4
@fritz baier Not true, Fritz. Of course the Russians who have been indicted -- specifically named, including details of their ranks and positions -- will never be extradited to the U.S. for trial. Even before they were indicted, they never would have set foot out of Russia. They, and their superiors, are not crazy! No, the purpose of these indictments was a "shot across the bow" of the Russian SVR. Just a little message from our intelligence guys that we know what they doing -- and who they are. And, in spite of the President's love for Putin, we are watching.
Second, the notion that Mr. Mueller's investigation was supposed to be a "slam dunk" is absurd. Investigations of this nature are extremely complex and take time. How the Republicans and Fox News can say that there is nothing going on is just living in a fantasy world or an alternate universe. Paul Manafort, Trump's former campaign manager is about to go on trial. And there are many other people who have pled guilty and who are cooperating with the investigation. Including Flynn. Or haven't you heard?
7
A quite interesting article. Readers might want to compare it Byron York's examination in the WA Examiner on Nunes' report and what the released document actually reveals. Not surprisingly, York's take is that the "FISA warrant application supports Nunes memo". What is interesting is the blow by blow analysis with full quotations.
6
@ODIrony
Expertise in cherry picking and sculpting. Here, you can read the FISA application/renewals for yourself and find out what it "actually" reveals.
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/4614708/Carter-Page-FISA-Appl...
5
@Rw
Mr Savage's lede aims at the GOP, claiming Nunes memo is belied by the FISA release. This is a bizarre claim.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/fisa-warrant-application-support
1
Trump is banking on his supporters accepting his declaration of victory, and not looking beyond it to examine the actual content of the court documents. He's gotten away with this tactic before.
But wouldn't it be great if a large portion of his base decided to actually read the evidence in this case? We might actually a surge in people realizing he's been duping them all along.
10
Devin Nunes must have taken Joseph McCarthy as his model.
5
Am sorry but you should mention like you did in your October 2017 article who first funded the research that produced the Steele dossier, Paul Singer. From your article "The Washington Free Beacon, a conservative website funded by a major Republican donor, first hired the research firm that months later produced for Democrats the salacious dossier describing ties between Donald J. Trump and the Russian government, the website said on Friday."
1
You are wrong.
The initial anti-Trump Fusion research was started by Anti-Trump republicans but did not include he Steele component.
The Steele was 100% DNC & Hillary funded.
Therefore the FISA was obtained using DNC & Hillary fiction.
2
@Peter
Opposition research has NO VALUE if it isn't true. Since the bill was paid we can assume it is all true.
@Peter And the fact that Page was investigated long before he met Trump?
Trump/GOP are Russian assets. They work for Russia; not America. FISA warrants were legal . Security clearances are legal; Trump is a petty little weak man; not worthy of a title. Sanction Russia. Vote out GOP. Ray sipe
7
This is meant as more fodder for Trump loyalists. Trump has done such a remarkable job of diminishing Mueller's investigation, his acolytes will never admit the crookedness of their leader. The independent and Democratic vote should crush Trump in the mid terms anyway.
8
When does this stop? Or more to the point when does someone stop this so-called man. Is there no smart constitutional lawyer that can put together a proper case to declare him unfit and impeachable? Every day is more unbelievable than the last.
11
@Em
He's been impeachable for years now. The Republicans have made it clear that nothing he does will be considered wrong - no amount of blatant private collusion with Russians, no amount of interfering with justice, no amount of profiting from his office will deter them from turning a deliberately blind eye.
7
Trump is losing it.
He couldn't get a security clearance and now wants to remove security clearances from people who don't need them.
Rand Paul should re-activate the push for a Nobel Peace Prize for his sycophantee Trump. What about a joint Putin-Nobel Prize.
8
This cover up piece essentially corroborates almost the entire Nunes memo as it tries, in it's own cute and clever way, to refute it. Dismissing the fact, her confirmed, that the FBI failed to mention that the primary "evidence" it was relying on was financed not just by political opponents to Trump, but by his main rival and the party she represented. It then failed to mention to the FISA court that virtually all the "evidence" was unsubstantiated, unverifiable and by all indications false. Oh, like this fake news or opinion article, and it really is, the FBI did it's best to reveal all this--and more--by concealing it with words and phrases to provide plausible explanations and deniability for leaving out such vital information. Its breathtakingly shocking that the NYTs and its liberal worshipers can now summarily dismiss and explain evidence that the most powerful law enforcement agency in the nation used such weak and tainted information to attack a presidential campaign. If this was happening to a Democrat there would be rage and fury emanating from the pages of this once grand paper, there can be no doubt. Now all liberals, including liberal news outlets, have proclaimed that no rules may apply if the target is a Republican. They will rue this stand as they have come to rue supporting the removal of filibuster rules to confirm judges or encouraging Obama to circumvent the legislative process with executive orders.
6
@Allen So the FBI is a liberal organization? Nonsense. Most FBI people -- including those at the top -- are career law-enforcement types, who in general are conservative, and skew Republican if anything. They are also very professional, and do not allow their personal political views interfere with the job.
And Allen, your very first point is completely incorrect. The FISA warrant DID disclose the fact that some of the evidence relied on a politically motivated source. Clearly, you did not read the article -- which states:
"The application contains a page-length explanation that does alert the court that the person who commissioned Mr. Steele’s research was “likely looking for information to discredit” Mr. Trump’s campaign. It goes on to explain why, notwithstanding Mr. Steele’s “reason for conducting the research,” the F.B.I. believed it was credible."
Further, you should be aware that the article here also states that Mr. Nunes wrote his memo, "though he admitted in February that he had not read the application documents." How amazing that he knew the application documents were faulty without reading them first! Esp, I guess.
5
Sometimes it is good that Trump does not read.
7
The author is badly mistaken. Tunes was in fact right and this shoddy 'warrant" vindicates him completely
5
@John in Chicago....Nunes was clearly using selected pieces of the warrant request to contrive a case. Please note that four different judges were involved, all appointed by Republicans, and all agreed that significant evidence was presented to them to approve the wiretap. No serious person would believe the Nunes version.
3
Ah.
So the Republicans aren't just the "Party of Potted Plants".
They also lie and deceive.... just as trump does.
If you don't have your own copy of Christopher Steele's "Dossier", then find one and print it out.
Use it as a scorecard on how truthful these "Potted Plants" are.
So far, trump is batting .000.
5
How much can one really twist the fact.
A dossier funded by Hillary and DNC is used to get FISA warrant on an American citizen under a democrat president.
And these progressive defend the right of thugs who are caught with guns and drugs while driving erratically.
Hypocrats.
7
@PJ. It is absurd to speak about the blindness of progressives when supporters of an autocrat’s deception participate in it. It is also extremely telling. Surely you are aware that you aren’t telling the truth. The released documents are clear. The investigation of Mr. Page began long, long before the Steele materials even existed. Those of us worried about the future of democracy and the survival of the American republic can only shake our heads and asked, “Why? Why do they need to lie? Why do they need to do fervently deny the truth? Why must they defend the man who day by day destroys the fabric of democracy?” There is no ambiguity in that document. Your description of it is completely invented. This alone terrifies those of us who believe in the survival of one of the greatest experiments in self-government in the history of mankind. Those of you who would watch it die, and indeed help it die, leave the rest of us stunned and horrified.
13
NO...the issue is the evidence used to obtain the FISA warrant...it was the Steele Report, which was a DNC & Hillary fiction!
1
"I will make a bargain with the Republicans. If they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
Adlai Stevenson
23
This is what a manufactured defense strategy looks like when the suspect is guilty and has no real defense:
Obfuscate, fabricate, cloud, confuse, accuse, slur, slam, denounce, deflect, redirect, repeat...
Hey, it worked for OJ...
13
I go through Elisabeth Kubler Ross' five stages of grief every week: denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance: the President is a charlatan or an imbecile; the republicans put themselves and the party before the country; there is not a jot of personal courage or integrity left in Congress. Example after example of the demise of truth and democracy. Voting hardly seems sufficient.
13
If their lips are moving, they are lying.
7
Please, Republicans, wake up. trump is destroying our country. We must remove him from office as well as every trace of everyone in his administration. We have been attacked by both a foreign enemy, Russia, and a domestic enemy, trump. America is a noble concept and trump is the anti-noble concept. Please, Republicans, show your love of our country and get trump out of our lives.
8
Stepping back, the reason there is even a story here and a plausible claim by the GOP that the FISA warrant was obtained inappropriately is because it is of the utmost importance to ensure that law enforcement and counter-intelligence investigations cannot be co-opted for partisan political advantage (i.e., political espionage akin to Watergate).
The risk of such inappropriate partisan espionage is much, much more troubling than a foreign government's attempt to spy on the U.S. Foreign espionage happens every day of the week.
Domestic espionage on a political opponent -- co-opting the power of law enforcement for political advantage -- does not. Because it is much more nefarious and Constitutionally troubling.
The Times reporting on this issue doesn't seem to appreciate the gravity of the issue. It has been largely dismissive. Perhaps there is smoke but no fire, but it still warrants a sober investigation.
5
@Mmm
Did you read the story? They were talking entirely about what you just said, the sober and thorough and ONGOING investigation of whether or not the FISA warrant was necessary shown in the release of all the documents. And this information showed all along that it was warranted.
Have you considered that when so many lifelong Republican prosecutors are seeing clearly illegal actions - maybe it's not some partisan game?
6
as I have said before, Trump is a clear and present danger
8
Thank the lord, the heavens, the gods, for the Times! Saying that multiple times a day.
12
Here's my opinion: I believe there are two main reasons the GOP aren't stopping Trump and standing by him, 1) Power, but 2) because some of them are complicit in taking money from the Russians and they don't want Mueller finding this out.
Those are the reasons I believe they are trying to discredit the Mueller investigation and aren't pushing back on DJT - period.
8
Yet another attempt of President Trump to conspire to obstruct justice. Yet another attempt of the Republicans in congress to conspire to collude with President Trump in his conspiracy to obstruct justice. This simply is not sustainable for the long-term viability of our nation.
2
do you want to know the truth? the GOP can't handle the truth. Their pursuit of the greenback and it's cover up can't encompass the evidence against them. Kavanaugh was selected to be their ace in the hole, the deciding SCOTUS vote to exonerate Trump should any criminal or civil suits arise
5
The Times is selling water in the desert here.Their readers all want to believe that Trumps is somehow an agent of Russia, even though before being elected President, there was never a hint of Trump having anything to do with Russia.
Hes got half the country duped. That must be it. That has to be it, because the alternative is too scary to even consider - that Americans are turning away from liberalism.
Going to be a very depressing 6 years for liberals. But dont worry, the soothing calm demeanor of President Pence will will point us in the right direction for the 8 years following 2024.
3
@Sports - So explain why everyone of his cohorts spent time with the Russians and then lied about it.
3
Oh, I think Pence will be president sooner than you think......
2
"The Times is selling water in the desert here."
@ Sports: People cannot survive in the desert for long without water... Not sure how your analogy defends the traitor.
@ NYTs: Thanks for yet another drink of the truth in this parched Earth desert of GOP lies...
6
Republicans are bent on turning this country into Russia 2.0.
I never thought I’d see so many Americans stand for this. By the time all the bad decisions come to fruition, Trump may be out of office and living in his Putin supplied clubhouse in Russia. From their actions, Republicans must not care about this country at all. They intend to turn us into a 3rd world dictatorship.
15
I agree. Republicans and their President do seem bent on turning the US into one of those countries Mr. Trump referred to. Not Norway. One of the countries that he considers to be much like the mammalian waste removal aperture.
6
The gig is almost up for the Liar in Chief...Even the slowest learners will finally get what trump is about: Lies, disinformation, spin, fabrication, smears, propaganda, etc. So sad to watch this evilness take over the country.
17
With Trump in the White House, we long for the time when the enemy was in the Kremlin or in Beijing.
13
As we hear more about Russians infiltrating National Prayed Breakfasts and the NRA, you begin to see why the Republican Party has so much to lose from the Mueller and other federal investigations into Russian collusion
23
When the Dems decided to run Hillary for President they opened the door for Trump and knew it. Hillary didn't care. She thought she and Bill were "due" for leadership despite their serious shortcomings and the bad taste they left for much of the electorate. Their trail of disasters caught up with them. The repeal of Glass-Stegall by Clinton, his failure to regulate derivatives, and the prolonged, intense dislike he created with his tawdry affairs set Bush up to win. Hilllary's baggage including her abuse of e-mail privileges and wholesale sell-outs were bad but not as bad her failure to reveal the fraud she knew was taking place regarding the Iraq War. There is no question that through their contacts with Richard Clarke and others they knew what was taking place. Now we have this train-wreck of debt, total chaos, and international disrepute.. Those are the facts.
A lot of people should have known better.
2
In the original FISA surveillance application, because they knew it to be a fact at that time, the DOJ / FBI could have said their info comes from (Clinton) Candidate #2's law firm, Perkins Coie's contracting with Fusion GPS's ex spy Steele's (Source #1) to author a series of salacious and unverified reports (James Comey's words) and feed them into the media and the FBI. Instead, they allowed there "maybe was a likely possibility" this was political research, the same Comey mealy-mouthing used to discuss foreign powers hacking onto Hillary's unsecured, FOIA proof, email server. As it was, as we learned from Strzok's Congressional interviews (see Louis Gohmert). And apparently it was by China.
There is indeed something to all this. Find neutral reporting and educate yourself on how a Title 1 FISA Surveillance allows you to spy.
https://nationalinterest.org/commentary/nsa-three-hops-youre-out-8766.
BTW, Page worked with the FBI in nailing Russian spies in 2013. It was in the Times. So what's up with that? Why's he a spy now?
The Trump Campaign was spied on as was the Trump presidency. This should give everyone pause, regardless of political stripes.
There is indeed something to this. Find some neutral reporting and try to consider it without bias.
And read this https://nationalinterest.org/commentary/nsa-three-hops-youre-out-8766. They were spying on the Trump Campaign, and, later, the Trump presidency. This should give everyone pause, regardless of political stripes.
2
so the democrats say the FISA warrant application disproves the Nunes memo and the GOP says the FISA warrant application validates the claims in the nunes memo ! who is right ? i strongly encourage anyone to download the nunes memo as well as the FISA warrant application and then compare the two !
I found that both correlate quite well there are a few differences but about 90% of whats in the nunes memo can be found in the FISA application
3
Perhaps you should read them both again? Perhaps you swapped the Democrats’ memo for the Republicans’ memo?
7
The latest from trump's White House, seeks to revoke security clearances from his critics (long time capable security professionals).
Who's the real risk to America's security people who rightfully criticize trump. Or trump himself, who shared highly sensitive information with the Russians in his earliest days in Office right on through his private meeting with Putin.
Not to mention giving North Korea a political victory while getting next to nothing for U.S., certainly nothing solid. Well, he "saved" us 12 million on (useful) war games only to waste a similar amount on his useless ego parade.
Trump is a national disgrace. He must go. Trump is the biggest and worst risk to American security since Aldrich Ames.
Trump becomes more and more Putin-like every day. Except Putin is more articulate and has many more billions than Donny does. OTH, Donny is taller, fatter, wears long red ties and has "better" hair than Vlady does.
We are so *not* in good tiny hands with trump at the tiller of our ship of state. Look out, we are heading for a trump induced crash.
14
I'm not a trained professional in this matter, but the overwhelming odor I'm picking up from all the Republican and Russian explanations is that what you hear when the guilty are cornered.
The line they are trying to thread through this growing thicket of horrifying evidence is unnatural. Everybody can see it, hear it, smell it. They've been caught in a long and complex criminal conspiracy of money and power, and they, as a very large group, are in a lot of trouble.
We can all see them hiding in plain sight.
"Hey, we can see you, you know?"
Yep, there they are.
17
The lengthy footnote, its length no doubt designed to muddle rather than clarify, could have easily been one or two sentences long: "This dossier was paid for by Hillary Clinton and her campaign for President. It is unverified as true."
That is the truth and should have been on the very first page.
2
@Len FISA Basics 101: identities of Americans are not revealed in a FISA warrent.
4
So ... the GOP lied ... (feigned gasping sound resounds) ...
6
It's done. The U.S. is in the hands of Putin and the oligarchs. Trump and Pence are bought. Congress is paid for. The Supreme Court is stacked. Governorships and statehouses are lined up. Old friends are unfriended - we can't even appeal to Britain and Europe and Mexico and Canada and Australia to help save us any more.
We are serfs now and the NRA-Nazi-KKK hitters are ready to show up at our homes and offices and churches if we whisper a protest. The Franklin Graham-evangelicals are praying furiously to Jesus to cast us into the eternal fires.
Russia commands the elections and Republican office-holders won't stop them.
We were given a democracy and couldn't keep it. It is over.
13
@jr
We still have elections, we still have votes, we can change it - unless people believe in "it's hopeless, give up!!!!" messages.
2
Time to change the word Conservative to Terrorists to describe the religious, the republicans, the 1%ers because that is exactly what they are. No different from the nazis of the 1930s. Treat the republicans and the religious as the enemy not friends. Don't be fooled by their niceness because it is only a Cheshire Cat smile to get what they want. They care nothing of others as per their actions not words and stop with the empty "thoughts and prayers" trash. No soul. No humanity whatsoever. And don't fool yourselves at this is a dictatorship not a democracy. Began under Reagan and accelerated under war criminal Bush and now look another dictator, Trump who is similar to Neville Chamberlain and Mussolini and Hitler. Change Administration to Regime.
What is this aversion to not putting these dictators into jail?! We didn't do it with war criminal Bush and look what happened because of weakness and apathy.
11
I don't know what upsets me the most, Trumps lies or the republican congress' acceptance of predestined lie after lie after lie... obvious, proven and disastrous lies affecting our security, democracy, financial strength, and our relationship with our world allies. And the rest us are just letting him go. This man, most of his appointees and possibly his family are traitorous.
He's cancer in our society. He, the republican party and everybody who supports him need to go. Particularly the religious right, his most ardent supporters along with the National Rifle Assoc. and their band of Nazis ... well paired and not a moral fiber among them.
We have only one hope,
REMEMBER NOVEMBER!
14
This is not an analysis, it is a lot of conjecture and spin.
How about a nice line-by-line fact checking....NYTimes ought to try it sometime:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/fisa-warrant-application-support...
4
@Senate27 You call quoting paragraphs of the Nunes memo, followed by a claim that "that's accurate" line-by-line analysis and 'fact-checking'? LOL.
3
Nunes, another Joseph Mccarthyite clown who had Paul Ryan any integrity at all would be long gone from the front page.
7
Why is NYT weasel-wording this report? The facts are incontrovertible: the FBI had a legit probable cause to do surveillance on Carter Page. Any statements, by anyone, to the contrary, are lies.
Tell it like it is, for once, New York Times!
11
Just another Monday with more New Speak and Double Talk from Fake President Trump in his Neu Amerika.
7
All of the lies spewed out by Devin Nunes, and the Liar of All Liars, Donald Trump, were directed to their low information voter base, the morons who elected these clowns in the first place.
6
After the blip of the Trump administration's term(s) will it be then acceptable to replace some confederate banner with an image of Trump forever fastened to the back end of an automobile for the duration of its life on the road and into the pasture weeds?
Given Carter Page's extensive interest in Russian energy including Gazprom, as well as his frequent contacts with Russian intel agents, it would seem there is a strong foundation for probable cause to monitor his activities. One might even suspect that he could be a double agent, playing both the US and the Soviets for information, as he apparently helped the FBI at one point as a source. So, given Mr. Page's extensive activities in Russia, and his high level contacts with both intel services, it is not credible to see him as a victim of an erroneous FISA investigation. Simply put, the investigative record points toward probable cause and suspicious activities. Good to know that he was monitored.
3
Is it not correct that the first hiring of Fusion GPS -- which led to the Steele oppo research and dossier -- was done by the Washington Free Beacon, which is bankrolled by Republican Paul Singer, whose preferred candidate for 2016 was Marco Rubio?
Mr. Trump's beef here should be with his fellow Republicans.
7
@David in Toledo Sorry, David. You are correct, however, the Free Beacon discharged Fusion GPS. Fusion GPS was later in the year hired by the Clinton campaign. It's under the latter contract that the development of the Trump dossier began.
1
Trump's purpose is simple enough: to gaslight his Fox voters because, well, they will believe anything their network and their president tells them. The facts? This article outlines in detail every bit of contrary evidence to Trump's claims and it will make not one bit of difference. The only people reading this, already knew Trump was lying---but thanks for the evidence and laying it out so plainly.
6
The bias of most of the commentators here is unreal. If Carter page was guilty of any thing (including a parking violation) he would have been indicted by Mueller's team by now. The fact that he hasn't been is prima facie evidence that he wasn't a spy and that the FISA warrant was "Trumped up" so to speak.
3
I looked up "prima facie" to be certain of the meaning. Here are some things about Trump which can be accepted on a prima facie basis:
1. He is a White Supremecist
2. He is a Pathological Liar
3. He is a Malignant Narcissist
4. He is a Misogynist
5. He sexually assaults women
6. He is functionally illiterate
Those are unbiased fully proven facts.
5
There are number of reasons why Page hasn't been indicted yet, none of which mean he will not be after all evidence is fully laid out.
Geez Louise, enough about trying to normalize Trump's lies. He lies like he breathes, he opens his mouth and lies fall out. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE stop trying to normalize this malignant narcissist. He is seriously mentally ill, he displays this in every action and statement he makes. As Maya Angelou said "When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time." No need to re-hash every freaking tweet, he has shown us REPEATEDLY who he is - a liar, a con man, a cheat, who is desperately trying to cover up his Russia connections in every way possible with deflection and distraction. It's not working, the noose is tightening, but articles like these only serve to continually try to portray him as a normal guy acting abnormally. HE IS NOT NORMAL.
7
@Sheila
Giving up means letting his lies stand as the truth.
A lie, unchallenged, becomes the truth.
1
In the end, the gain for DT in all of this is an opportunity to make statements that frame the truth with lies and deception that are taken and then given further and considerable distortions and lies by the propaganda arm of his administration that is Fox news and right wing media. The truth doesn't matter. The lies and support of those lies are used to keep power by DT and his complicit Republican party. We are witnessing a process that happens in dictatorships. Our system is being attacked by external forces that support this fall into dictatorship and internally by those who have chosen to break their oath to the Constitution and the people of this country. That they have public support should not be the deciding factor in regards to their accountability. It is clear that the current majority and this president are not acting in the best interest of this country and using their positions in service of greed and accumulation of power for themselves. The Constitution, the people and the truth are something to be ignored or manipulated. Service to the people is not .
This must be stopped and the consequences must be appropriate and swift. They are destroying this country and the impact on the rest of the world are potentially horrific. We may not survive this egregious attack on freedom, the truth and the rule of law. It is an egregious insult to the people of this country and those who have defended our way of life and it's freedom who lost their lives doing so. VOTE
2
Trump is illiterate and he is banking on his supporters illiteracy to allow him to make claims without reviewing the actual documents.
7
Money laundering it is everywhere.
2
Republicans understand the cold reality lying beneath all their defensive posturing: the truth really doesn't matter when all you have to do is deny, distort or prevaricate the truth to death.
Their voters can't, don't or won't read, so even if the truth does make it through to the light of their day, it usually arrives there with big words and lengthy tendrils of logic the brain must work to follow to reach truth. And, by that time, they've tuned the whole thing out and declared victory.
Like warfare tactics had to be modernized to accommodate new technology, so must political warfare evolve?
I suggest a "reality" type show, offering a rather big prize for the fastest unraveling of a complex, cnvoluted @GOP lie in words no longer than two syllables.
2
Trump continues to behave and tweet like a man with lots to hide rather than one with any desire to get to the truth.
That's not a surprise to those of us who know trump's history of lying and obfuscation. Over 3200 Lies in 17 month.
Trump could clear up a significant portion of Mueller's and our concerns by releasing his tax returns (like every other president did).
The disgraceful republican "leadership" and members of CONgress must end this travesty and demonstrate that they value our Democracy and Country more than their crumbling party.
Pass the legislation protecting independent counsels. Demand trump release his tax returns (like he said he would). If need be subpoena that interpreter. It was never before permissible to have zero official record of discussions between the U.S. president and a leader of another country let alone one that's an adversary as Russia is!
If your base can't handle the truth (as opposed to more Fox propaganda) that's too bad.
That's what true patriotism is, making a sacrifice... being willing to stand up and risk losing ones position or even suffer bodily harm (as a soldier does) not issuing limp 'tuts tuts' and 'gee that's not something we agree with' weasel worded statements.
Actual patriotism is more than wearing a stupid flag pin standing in front of a couple of American flags. I'm talking to you Mitch McCONnell and Paul Ryan and the rest of the GOParty *Over* Country. Call Congress the people's House of Hypocrisy.
9
The question of what it is that Putin has over Donald Trump continues and speculation returns again and again to the salacious p tape, while the real answer is, and has as ever been, money.
Russia is a classic kleptocracy, and as such needs money launderers to shift rubles to dollars. Thus Trump's “miraculous” recovery from six bankruptcies. And as Eric Trump told us, Russian money was the only money the Trump's used after their credit turned toxic at every regular bank.
Putin has the record of every Russian that Trump laundered money for. He owns Trump and Trump acts as his wh ore. Mueller will prove that, even to the dwindling number of Trumpie fools.
3
Just two words: Mark Felt.
1
What we've learned is that the FBI did misrepresented its case (lied) to the FISA court. As per today's news reviews, the FISA Court was not told that the opposing political campaign (Clinton's campaign) was behind Steele’s work. Nor did the FBI tell the Court that Steele had himself said that he had accessed much of his information through "Kremlin sources". Nor did the FBI and Justice Department inform the Court that Steele’s allegations had never been verified.
To the contrary, each FISA application — the original one in October 2016, and the three renewals at 90-day intervals — is labeled “VERIFIED APPLICATION” (bold caps in original). And each one makes this breathtaking representation to the Court:
"The FBI has reviewed this verified application for accuracy in accordance with its April 5, 2001 procedures, which include sending a copy of the draft to the appropriate field office(s)."
In reality, the applications were never verified for accuracy. This was a total lie.
2
A wealthy Republican donor originally financed the Steele Dossier earlier in the campaign, as anyone who followed the news a year ago is aware.
4
@Mad Town Patriot Unfortunately, it's just not true, mad guy. The right-leaning Free Beacon originally hired Fusion GPS using the coin provided by a Republican donor. But The Free beacon discharged Fusion GPS in early 2016. Fusion GPS was later in the year hired by the Clinton campaign. It's under the latter contract that the development of the Trump. The development of the dossier was not done under a contract with the Republican donor.
Could the New York Times tell us whether it reported Peter Strzok's message to Lisa Page that concerning collusion between Trump and Russia “There’s no big there there” that Ms Page specifically interpreted as there is no real evidence of collusion? Page and Strzok are the FBI agents who were lovers and texting each other thinking the NSA was asleep.
Like reporters at the Times and most readers, I do not like Trump and think he's is a most dangerous president and I also agree truth demands attention. Please explain this “There’s no big there there” and Page's explanation.
Trump claims another instance of 'complete vindication' for himself. Regardless of whatever positive happens in this world, Trump takes full credit for its happening.
NewsFlash:
Donald.....Thai Emergency Responders and Thai Seals safely rescued 12 boys and a coach from a treacherous ordeal in a cave. The Thai Government wants you to know that they just don't know how they would've pullled it off without you.
DJT = Ignorance Personified
2
I read this NYT article and then compared it with Mollie Hemingway's analysis and Andrew McCarthy's. I encourage readers looking for both sides of the issue to do the same. Links below.
Hemingway and McCarthy are much more analytical and persuasive. Mr. Savage fails to address at all key points such as what "verification" of hearsay entails. The NYT piece unfortunately comes across as a partisan defense of the abuse of the FISA process.
Come on, NYT, at some point can't you move beyond the distaste for Trump and look at the larger issues?
http://thefederalist.com/2018/07/23/confirmed-doj-used-materially-false-...
https://www.nationalreview.com/2018/07/carter-page-fisa-applications-fbi...
4
“These national security considerations were cast aside by President Trump, whose decision to declassify the Nunes memo — which misrepresented and distorted these applications — over the fervent opposition of the Department of Justice, was nakedly political and self-interested, and designed to interfere with the special counsel’s investigation,” he said.
Adam B. Schiff
Sounds like Obstruction of Justice to me. Bigly. You're going down clown. If Putin comes here in November he needs to be taken Prisoner. We have been, are being, and will continue to be, attacked! #POWPUTINNOVEMBER
2
Trumps, talking idiots like Carter Page, and religious voters in general disdain facts. Moreover, they do not even distinguish between facts and what they believe/say/imagine. That way, they cannot lie deliverately because they don't know any actual facts to lie about. They literally believe every word in the Koran, Bible, Kama Sutra, or whatever they believe in.
This has created a quandary for the checks and balances perviously furnished by our news sources. About 40% of all potential voters are believers of beliefs who do not believe in facts. Murdoch saw this promising market and has made billions off it in his media empire, including many newspapers and Fox News. Believers elected Donald J. Trump with help by Vladimir Putin and the RPT or whatever the KGB is now called.
Carter Page is the perfect spy for the age of beliefs-rule: he doesn't know what his mouth is saying or even what his brain is thinking. He is a mole waiting to be briefed by anyone who can pay him. He cannot lie because he cannot distinguish facts from fantasies. He just wants to get paid. He's the perfect innocent robot - a perfect Russian mole. And he thrives on publicity.
3
Is this author even reading the stuff..or writing from notes supplied to him by the DNC?
Let me ask all you fair minded and reasoned people.
If Donald Trump has his FBI And DOJ issue warrants to spy on Kamala Harris' foreign policy advisor next summer...and uses a law firm as an intermediary to hire a research firm who serves as an interemediary to hire a ex British spy as another intermediary who then hires 12 Russians to provide 2nd and 3rd hand gossip to put into a dossier he then sneaks into the DOJ through the side door of an employee of one of hte cutouts to get those warrants issued...that then leads to major leaking right before the 2020 election that Kamala Harris is a Russian stooge...would you stand for it?
1
@Erica Smythe - If Kamala Harris ever starts hanging out with Russians and then lies about it I absolutely want her investigated.
6
The Times has limited space on Page 1A to work in all of the facts, so I'll throw in a few minor tidbits - not nearly as relevant as Rubio's never trump cant and Schiff's canned comments which certainly warranted the fifth of the article's space that they graced. Fact. Steele declared in a Guardian article - yeah, that Guardian - that only 70 to 90% of "the dossier" was credible. He didn't expound on which 10 to 30% he thought might be bogus - why spoil the fun. The FBI surely included that bit of factuality in their subsequent submissions to FISA - surely. Fact. The Democratic National Committee paid $6 Million for that swiss cheese "dossier". Yeah, the Same DNC that shafted Bernie - not that that is relevant to anything other than the Democratic presidential primary. Needless to write, facts should not stand in the way of secret court machinations and the pursuit of trooth and democrazy.
2
We should also note that Steele ways initially working for Republicans looking for dirt on Trump during the primaries, so a portion of the research was paid for by Republicans. Clinton continued the work after the primaries.
4
The Times should have mentioned that the original funding for what became known as the Steele dossier came from Republicans who were interested in stopping Trump. The Democrats and the Clinton campaign stepped in only after the Republicans decided to quit supplying money to the effort.
10
Yeah, but what Trump and the Republicans are relying on -- and can from past experience -- is that their supporters will not do their own homework and simply parrot the nonsense their heroes put out. We can point to the facts all we want. It's of no use as long as they remain in power. Witness another lead article today showing that despite the facts -- losing jobs, business and pay -- the lemmings continue to believe. There's no way to reason with people who not only will not think, they won't react to what is actually happening to them in blind fealty to those who lie and hurt them. I think that's referred to as a "cult".
17
Pointless exercise without the complete data. Aren't the redactions a legacy nicety from the days when politicians more or less followed laws and norms? If under this Republican administration it's going to be left to the citizens themselves to prove that up is up and down is down, then let's have the full report.
1
If Trump is found to have colluded with Russia, the Republican Party has colluded with Russia. They are one in the same. Trump is the leader of the party, and has been fully supported by Republican leadership. History books will not have pictures of so-called "hand-wringing" and "concerns" when these chapters are written. What a disgrace to their offices and betrayal of US citizens.
10
It's time to require every Republican official (starting, of course, with Trump) to submit to a Psychological Examination.
8
@Ken, even Freud himself would jump off a cliff if he had to analyze the level of deceit, bombast, malignant narcissism, arrogance, lack of humanity, pathological lying, inherent evil, and stunning deviousness of these republican fascists.
8
@Elin Minkoff -- bingo! :)
Like so many things these evil clowns touch, now "security clearance" is a meaningless term.
The only thing I'm getting out of this president and his party is a harsh education: so much that we take for granted is suspended by the fragile gossamer of "accepted norms."
Republicans are vandals and nihilists. True to form, they take glee when their fellow citizens are rightfully appalled.
Democrats will eventually clean most the debris -- the task they are always given by voters -- but I'm afraid some things are damaged beyond repair. It is like ancient temples and artifacts at the hands of ISIS.
5
People want to see what this was all about. We’re always told that you could indict a ham sandwich (and probably in under 10 minutes with the right grand jury), especially if it was crafted knowing that it would never go to trial.
Everything Trump says, tweets or does boils down to this: " Rather than back down, or admit I am ever wrong, I would rather chance the death of every single American in a nuclear war"
7
If this was Hilary doing all of this. All you people out there who voted against her to send a message I hope you understand what's going on here.
4
Facts and truth are irrelevant to Trump's base, who will believe anything their master says. It is similar to a cult, and 40% of ignorant Americans are drinking the Kool-Aid. This is the result of Republican party deception and right-wing propaganda machine over decades.
"I love the poorly-educated!"
DJ Trump
13
GOP attacks our own Americans; supports Russia. Ridiculous.
Congress needs to enact sanctions against Russia. Russia attacked/attacks America;Trump supports Russia and attacks our own intelligence services. Sanction Russia. Ray Sipe
7
Yeah, we keep talking how awful everything is with this #45 but as the first page of the NYT reads, the ranchers, oil and mining companies are "blooming." If this is democracy I want to try another system! And, hey! how this man, #45 keeps referring to Ms H.Clinton as "Crooked Hillary Clinton"?! Just for this way of twitting, this man, his family and his buddies (GOP) should have a free ticket to fly to Moscow! We don't need this kind of people here!
5
At this point, based on facts and evidence that Russia attacked our country, any member of Congress or news media outlet encouraging Trump's treasonous lies should also be considered to be guilty of treason.
We should have a tally of who in Congress believes our intelligence agencies and who is a collaborator, siding with the increasingly desperate traitor in the White House.
4
What do you expect? The core "value" of Republicans is to lie all the time.
10
It bothers me to no end that the NYT continues to fail to mention that the original sponsor of The Steeler Dossier was "The Washington Free Beacon, a conservative website funded by a major Republican donor" (NYT10/27/2017)
If you're going to write about who was paying for it cover the full history.
15
Everyone's arguing over a "heavily redacted" document which may well contain very revealing content that is denied to the public. The FBI and Justice Department, whose reputations are in question, are the ones responsible for deciding which content can be revealed. So the accused get to act as judges in their own trial. Please forgive my cynicism.
1
@William Johnson - The only one questioning the reputation of the FBI and the Justice Department is a serial liar who has publicly committed treason.
2
I have questions both the FBI and the justice dept. for 40 years but they are not always wrong and they do seem to be onto something here.
"The power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them... To tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then, when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed, to deny the existence of objective reality and all the while to take account of the reality which one denies - all this is indispensably necessary. Even in using the word doublethink it is necessary to exercise doublethink. For by using the word one admits that one is tampering with reality; by a fresh act of doublethink one erases this knowledge; and so on indefinitely, with the lie always one leap ahead of the truth."
President Trump and Republicans just need to go ahead and shut down the Mueller investigation like they've wanted to since the start. Take a vote, Republicans. Go on record. Show the American people that some of us ARE above the law when one political party with control of Congress sets out to protect their own.
1
The GOP spent two years enabling Trump's craziness and all the while ignoring facts and turning a blind eye for what was right for the future of this country. Now since mid-terms are closing in, they would have to portray themselves as otherwise - starting with being honest. And sadly they would succeed in fooling the voters to forget the last 2 years. One can only hope for a good voter turn out of people with basic common sense.
2
Yet another reason to vote out every GOP candidate in November. Elected officials like Ryan Paul and Devin Nunes need to be held accountable for constantly lying to the American people and trying to dismantle our democracy.
3
@Abe Rosner: So, Abe, if they need to be held accountable, SOMEONE IN AUTHORITY has to arrest them, and they must be indicted for crimes against the American people. They are NOT now accountable to anyone or to anything; they basically do whatever they please, and say whatever they want to say, even if it is totally false. Dishonesty is the name of their game. I think that constant deception designed to lead American citizens astray, and constant lying to our population should be punishable; it should be considered a crime when government officials do this. Right now, instead of being a crime, it is republican POLICY. And yes, it is crafted to dismantle our democracy, and to install in its place an authoritarian, despotic, totalitarian regime. Like Russia's. And they are getting away with it so far. Do we have to turn into people akin to the outraged, rebellious, and ultimately murderous citizens of 1789 France, because we have no one IN AUTHORITY who holds these criminals accountable? In my life, I have never seen anything like this. And I have seen some pretty awful stuff, in politics, and in social behavior. This administration of monstrous, outrageous, foul, miscreant thugs simply takes the cake. Richard Nixon was a puppy dog compared to this crew.
3
The essential facts in this matter are:
The primary basis for the FISA application was the Steele dossier.
The dossier was funded by the Clinton campaign and the DNC.
This dossier is unverified as testified to by Comey, McCabe and Steele himself.
The non-partisan issue is simply this:
Should an unverified dossier funded by an opposing political party be used as the primary basis for a FISA warrant?
1
But why include any hearsay in an investigation of a political party during an election if not for political purposes?
“One central issue was whether the F.B.I. gave the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court sufficient information about the funding of Mr. Steele’s research to understand that he had been commissioned to dig up information about Mr. Trump’s links to Russia by someone with a political motive, even though he had been a neutral source in the past.”
Growing up in the 50's and 60's I never saw a bald eagle. Today I can sit on my deck and watch several flying over the lake behind my house.
Today if we were blaming DDT there would be claims of false science and discrediting of the link. All for $$$.
4
Our country was attacked by Russia and the best defense we currently have are our intelligence agencies but the President and GOP-led congress is attacking and attempting to destroy these institutions which are critical to our democracy.
In the meantime Trump is inviting the person who meddled in our election to the white house and Mitch McConnell continues to block a vote for a bill that would protect Mueller from being fired.
November can't come soon enough.
5
Our country was attacked by Trump with help from the Russians. It’s a subtle difference but an important one
1
The FISC has more professional integrity than anyone that would ever associate themselves with Trump. I’d be willing to bet our national security on it.
3
I hope all of these actions, comments and tweets by Trump to discredit the Russian investigation can be used by Mr. Mueller to make his case.
3
The more heinous and malevolent he and the Republicans in Congress become, the more his supporters love him. It seems to me that we are headed for either dictatorship with the suppression of Mueller indictments and convictions or civil war. Trump supporters will not abide his removal from office.
7
Fortunately or unfortunately, there is enough there for both sides in this nonsense to claim yet another pyric victory. However, the use of the dossier in any shape or form by anybody in the government should be a cause for concern since it is cross pollinizing political dirty tricks with true law abiding principles. That beckons trouble for us all.
Donald Trump has, without just cause, claimed “victory” or “vindication” or “fabulous accomplishments by my administration” so frquently during his 18 months as POTUS, these erroneous self-aggrandizing statements and tweets should no longer be a major focus in articles such as this.
In Trump’s opinion it seems that every action he takes leads to victory or vindication. And every action critical of him taken by others, reveals an illegal plot against him and his administration.
Mr. Trump’s heads-I-win, tails-you-lose perception of reality is no longer journalistically worthy of more than a passing mention. His daily erroneous claims are a nonsensical constant. Not a newsworthy event.
5
In short, Mrs. Clinton and the DNC paid Fusion to make up fake stuff about Donald Trmp and then used it to obtain FISA warrants to spy on Carter Page more than once. The FISA judges were never told that the basis of the warrants was made up stuff paid for by the opposition party. This whole thing stinks to high heaven. Obama never had any ethics or honor.
1
@P McGrath - Why would you tell a lie that is so easy to disprove?
2
@P McGrath: you do know that the Steele dossier was funded by conservative donors through a conservative website until they stopped funding it and the Clinton campaign took over ( apparently after most of Steele’s findings were “ in the can”)?
2
Every time I read a thoughtful, fact-based article in the NYT contradicting a falsehood tweeted by DJT, I feel I'm part of the choir being preached to. This is okay, but I worry that people in Jerome, Idaho, or Martinsburg, West Virginia, are only getting the tweet and not the analysis of its veracity. Trump has weaponized Twitter to the point I wish the medium would go away.
4
So they release documents that directly contradict and expose their lies, then tell us that the documents vindicate them? I've seen 8 year old kids that have better deception skills.
Also, it seems that this administration and Congress do not have to follow any laws. So, why should the rest of us?
4
Trump was and is right. He was mocked for using the term "wire tapped", but his campaign really was secretly spied upon by a federal agency. We should ALL be concerned about this. Its NOT a partisan issue. To deny this is evidence of liberal's fascism and hatred of conservatives.
1
Uhm... trump said he was personally wiretaped at Obama’s order. You do see the difference between going after page because he was obviously being recruited to
Spy and what Trump says happened?
3
@Patrick McCord: Liberals are not fascists! republicans ARE! FASCISM: An authoritarian and nationalistic right wing system of government and social order. Does that sound like Democrats to you????? Hatred comes from the right, Mr. McCord. When people are racists, anti-Semites, Nazis, xenophobes, misogynists (and these characteristics are ALL republican characteristics), this is hate-mongering, and it is FASCISM. Liberals are the farthest thing from being Fascists! YIKES! Check the definition of a word before you apply it to a group of people who have no association with that word, or system of government!
2
With everybody’s busy lives today… Especially the people that are stressed with rent and other things… Who has the time to read all of this and figure it out ??… I think that’s what some people are counting on..
4
Which is why The NY Times does a really awful job of pulling it all together into the sinister whole that some others have done. See Josh Marshall’s talkingpointsmemo.com among others.
Carter Page bragged in 2013 that he was an adviser to the Kremlin." But now that inconvenient data point doesn't fit the Trump narrative and revisionist history.
Who knew alternative facts could be so complicated.
4
Who in the world is taking him seriously anymore?
2
It’s becoming more and more apparent that “draining the swamp” is an inaccurate aphorism, and that “sluicing the sewer and applying industrial-strength disinfectants” would be far more appropriate a phrase, and to include Congress, the WH and the flies humming around Trump in its remit.
1
The Republican Party is doing everything it can to stop us from investigating Russia's hacking into our elections. Putin helped Trump win the election in 2016 and now Russia is helping Republicans in the 2018 election. Scary.
7
What the release of this information should signal, above all, when pitted against the public statements of particular officials, is just how committed to Trump the entire GOP is, including some whom the media constantly portrays as independent stalwart mavericks.
Rand Paul is one such official. He's nothing more than a Trump shill.
===
The Elevation of Idiotic Republican Shills: Rand Paul, SCOTUS & Russia Edition
https://www.rimaregas.com/2018/07/15/the-elevation-of-idiotic-republican...
26
@Rima Regas: Ron and Rand Paul are libertarians. My definition of a libertarian is a republican on steroids. Yup, they are idiotic trump shills, and they support the idea of a fascist oligarchy, with the most vulnerable in our society left to rot. Famously, (or infamously) when the elder Dr. Paul was asked what to do about sick people who cannot afford health insurance or health care, he snappily replied: "Let them die!" Charrrrrrrming individual, and a physician no less.
4
The Republican Party leadership are convinced that power is everything and laws which constrain those in power are only good when they constrain their competitors for power. That places they and all who choose to conduct themselves only to maintain power in opposition to government by law instead of by powerful individuals and parties, and are determined to disenfranchise the people as a whole, the only legitimate sovereign in our system of government. It’s a rebellion not unlike many before where republics have been replaced by oligarchies headed by self proclaimed ‘best men’.
14
Call a lie a lie. Calling this "shaky ground" is weaseling out of your journalistic responsibility to properly describing things. You are the reason they get away with lies. Call a lie a lie, loudly and clearly. Weasely is not clearly.
22
Mr. Trump's game plan: When you have no evidence, shout loudly, all caps on Twitter, repeat frequently.
30
OK. Debbie Downer. You got your leak, and all you do is pout.
Republican dishonesty! Really?
9
“Thou shalt not bear false witness”. Forget where I read that but clearly trump and the republicans have never read it, wherever it may have originally appeared.
1
@Mad Town Patriot: Isn't that one of the Ten Commandments?
So, the FISA court was informed that the Steele Dossier was likely commissioned to discredit the Trump Campaign and didn’t care and the Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee lied to conceal those facts.
Doesn't the oath of office mean anything to these people?
21
Correction: so the FISA court was informed of that and still found there was enough other evidence for the warrant.
3
Wow! What spin. The FBI lied when they swore that ALL the information in the FISA warrant was known to them to be true. THAT is the real scandal. The FBI has admitted that they knew the Hillary paid for dossier was not true in major ways that they had already determined when they SWORE it was. They also lied when the SWORE that Carter Page was an agent of the Russians. This term "agent" has a legal meaning and they knew he did not meet this definition.
The NY Times is intentionally misleading it's readers. If you care about truth you should be outraged.
9
Anyone who is this fixated on "lies" should pay more attention to what comes out of the mouth of the man in the White House.
4
@Steve W
What do the redacted parts say then?
1
@Cmary Politicians lie. It is what they do. Name me one who has not but the FBI should NEVER lie on a warrant.
If everyone is not outraged that our top law enforcement agency lied, tried to cover it up and is now caught then that person is far too partisan. And for the NY Times to try to obfuscate that fact is just awful and an assault upon the very concept of justice.
This congress is as corrupt as the this president. Are there any republicans with an ounce of shame? You can end this charade now.
35
A million lies here, a million lies there, and pretty soon you are talking real lies.
35
"[The FBI's FISA application] goes on to explain why, notwithstanding Mr. Steele’s “reason for conducting the research,” the F.B.I. believed it was credible."
Really? Did the FBI really believe that?
Didn't Comey testify in June 2017 that the information in the Steele dossier as “salacious and unverified"?
And didn't the FBI’s former deputy director, Andrew McCabe, tell Congress that the bureau tried very hard to verify Steele’s information but was basically unable to do so?
And didn't Steele himself call the information he provided to the FBI as “raw intelligence” that was “unverified”?
9
So far, much of the Steele dossier has been corroborated. Nothing has been found false. Christopher Steele is a well-regarded expert on Russia who America has relied on for years for Russian intelligence gathering. Republicans call something fake if there is a whiff of criticism about Trump -it doesn't matter that it is true. Republicans are a danger to our democracy.
5
@Ian Maitland
The author didn't why to get confused by the facts. Notice how the Times places all the comments supporting this faux news report upfront in its commentary section. All those like you who disagree with author and take exception to the FBI and DOJ's use of a phony unverified FISA application are posted later in the day after hundreds of rabid anti-Trump comments. I guess the Times doesn't think anyone would notice. That tells you all you need to know.
2
@ Times: I post here all the time and read lots of comments both pro and anti trump: Your statement that the NYTs manipulates the comments section does appear to be at best a paranoid delusion on your part, and at worst, an outright lie.
3
Have really enjoyed the pile-on of Trump by the various TDS sufferers, the RINO's, and of course the embedded Deep Swampers who are scared to death of a POTUS who doesn't play by their rules.
So, let's regroup and have a reality check.Obama capitulated to Putin on anti-missile defense systems in Poland and the Czech Republic, on Ukraine, Georgia and Crimea. Obama gave Putin free rein in Syria and supported Russia’s alliance with Iran on its nuclear program and its efforts to save the Assad regime. He permitted Russian entities linked to the Kremlin to purchase a quarter of American uranium. And of course, Obama made no effort to end Russian meddling in the 2016 elections.
Trump,in contrast, has stiffened US sanctions against Russian entities. He has withdrawn from Obama’s nuclear deal with Iran. He has agreed to sell Patriot missiles to Poland. And he has placed tariffs on Russian exports to the US.
So if Trump is Putin’s agent, what was Obama?
12
Jacob, to answer your question "...what was Obama?" I'll start with: American, honest, decent family man, well educated in constitutional law, the one took us out of the recession that threatened to equal The Great Depression, a President who won both the popular and electoral votes (twice)...shall I continue?
5
Congress has imposed sanctions against Russia. Trump has refused to enforce them. At the White House Trump gave the Russians classified information on our ally's efforts in Syria, endangering our ally's informants and agents. He has sided, before the world, with Putin's narrative about the 2016 election over American intelligence agencies. The above is common knowledge to most Americans and the rest of the world. Trump's base refuses to acknowledge reality - chilling.
2
Don't forget that Trump got increases in NATO military spending and U. S. spending and NATO is primarily a check on Russia, that he is fossil fuel friendly in competition to Russia's chief economic expeorts, and that he criticized Merkle for making Germany dependent on Russian natural gas.
He has decidedly acted against Russian key interests.
2
Once again blind belief in one man will be the downfall of many. Nunes start packing your bags. Your stupidity has caught up with you. Republicans beware the trap you set for yourselves...it is opening up to get up to get you. You have walked into trump's trap without even looking.
26
At what point does Representative Devin Nunes’ efforts to bolster Mr. Trump and undercut the Russia investigation become obstruction of justice?
22
As I understand it, these documents were obtained by Judicial Watch.
https://www.judicialwatch.org/press-room/press-releases/judicial-watch-o...
This is why I support Judicial Watch.
9
@the Oracle
Actually that "please donate" press release is solid evidence as to why you shouldn't support Judicial Watch. If you had read the NY Times on Saturday you would know that:
"On Saturday evening, those materials — an October 2016 application to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court to wiretap Mr. Page, along with several renewal applications — were released to The New York Times and other news organizations that had filed Freedom of Information Act lawsuits to obtain them. Mr. Trump had declassified their existence earlier this year."
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/21/us/politics/carter-page-fisa.html
1
The surveillance of Carter Page is a perfect example of Federal overreach which must come to an end immediately. Thank you.
6
@Southern Boy: Yeah. Well. Gee, golly whiz. If you are up to no good, and you are you are clearly spying for, or working for the interests of a nation that is hostile to our own, you just may get surveilled! Treason is considered very, very naughty, as in BAD TO THE BONE. People who do not get involved in traitorous and nefarious doings, such as collaborating with an enemy nation, would usually not get surveilled. If surveillance uncovers a terrible crime against the United States, isn't it a good thing? If you love America it is a good thing, right? On the other hand, if you are like trump, and you HATE America, and you are working WITH the Russians, it is a bad thing. Why would ANYONE who LOVES America act like trump? Russian agents were seeking Americans who would cooperate with them, and the Russians found a useful idiot in Page. Page even bragged about being associated with the Kremlin! And I guess someone found out what was going on, (DUH!)and then...well...that is how you get into trouble. Keep your nose clean! Oh, just for your information: This is an example of Federal overreach which must come to an end immediately: Separating the children of immigrants seeking asylum from their parents, incarcerating them, and then finding out that some of them may never be able to be returned! It is WORSE than Federal, overreach; it is a human rights violation, which should be maximally punished by the law. Thank you. And God bless America! Stand beside her!
1
Good read.
4
Obviously a FBI conspiracy to infiltrate the Trump campaign would not involve getting a warrant on someone after they left the campaign. One would think they might have tried surveillance on Trump, Trump Jr or someone actually involved in the Trump campaign. Could our dear leader have a case of paranoia to go with his narcissism?
16
I keep waiting for the NYTimes to update this headline from:
"How a Trump Decision Revealed a G.O.P. Memo’s Shaky Foundation"
to
"FISA Application Release Shows G.O.P. Deliberately Lied and Mislead Public in Nunes Memo"
But, it doesn't happen.
Instead, the general reading population is left to infer that "shaky foundation" is open to interpretation.
Thanks again, NYTimes editorial staff.
Keep the book deals coming!
15
Paul Ryan is a fraud and a coward. Any real leader would have removed the treasonous Devin Nunes from the House Intelligence Committee when it was obvious that his loyalty was to Trump, not the country. Ryan has sold his soul for tax cuts and deregulation. Historians won’t be kind to him.
23
no more GOP. the DON (Destruction Of Nation) party with don the con at the head couldn't tell the truth if it tried. if they can't win an argument with better and honest ideas they simply bear false witness as big lound and often as they possibly can & have Faux News broadcast it
disgusting
9
For a very long time, all the information, actions, behavior, strategy and maneuvers from the GOP members has been about fraud. Lies, deception. Organized crime, sweetheart deals. Greed. Power. Control. Destruction. Stupidity. Ignorance. Dinosaur thinking. The GOP is the party of fraud and crime. I will vote for any and all democrats except for Bernie Sanders. We are experiencing the global shakeout of organized crime and when they are swept away into prison, the world will be a safer, saner place functioning based on the rule of law. Everyone VOTE!
11
The House Ethics committee needs to have hearings on Nunes. But first they need to look up ethics in the dictionary.
14
Having listened to Mr. Page on the various talking head shows over the past 2 years and after now reading the FISA court warrant, I can only say that he is an embarrassment to our alma mater (USNA). At best he is a dupe and at worst a traitor.
22
The fatal flaw with the NYT argument is that Page has not been arrested for anything. The surveillance was not justified and one can only conclude it was a ruse used to spy on Trump's campaign.
5
@jaco
The "fatal flaws" in your comment are: the initial FISA warrant wasn't applied for until a date in October, 2016, long after Page had left the trump campaign. The fact Page hasn't been arrested means nothing and has nothing to do with the legality of the FISA warrant application/renewals and the granting there of.
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/4614708/Carter-Page-FISA-Appl...
3
Everyone here needs to remember, this is just a deflection from Helsinki!
10
If I had been interested in spying on the Trump campaign, I would have filed the FISA application while Page was still part of the Trump campaign.
If I was interested in Page's alleged ties to the Russians, I would have filed a FISA application even after he left the campaign.
7
Democrats and the left--unless the economy dramatically collapses President Trump will be reelected in 2020. The GOP could not have been given a better set of circumstances with the Democrats moving to the far left with proposals to abolish ICE and other leftist proposals. The personal wealth of many Americans has increased significantly since President Trump took office—that is if they had stock investments. Unemployment for blacks and Hispanics is much better, so those groups while they might not vote for President Trump will not go to the polls for the Democrats. If you look at the history of one-term Presidents they all lost because the economy was weak. The Democrats ran Clinton on the “we hate Trump” platform and lost. What do the Democrats have to offer—more Socialism—hardly a winning platform. Democrats will probably nominate Sanders—that will be fun to watch. Remember how badly Reagan beat Mondale—looks like we will have a repeat.
5
@Jonathan - Why do you persist in repeating this drivel when it's so easy to disprove all of it?
1
I for one and am tired that the GOP appears only to be interested in winning elections and basically do nothing the rest of the years. The white house wrecking ball is dismantling the country and all GOP cares about is winning the midterms and putting conservatives in office.
So which is more important the destruction of America or listening to the GOP give fantasy interviews laughing all the way to the banks for there own financial benefit.
8
@Tony - Republicans do plenty, they poison our air and water, erode our system of education, tread on our civil liberties, weaken our financial protections and most of all they enrich themselves at the expense of the rest of us.
That's hardly nothing.
2
Charter page was a cooperating witness in an FBI case against Russian spies who attempted to recruit him well before his involvement in the trump campaign. So yes, he was known to have contact with Russian spies. This article is written in such a way as to lead a casual reader to think that that never happened. While linking to it in another purposefully deceptive but technically correct article. Which is why I don't trust the times coverage of this issue.
4
Is anyone really surprised by what the declassified FISA Warrant Application shows? Is anyone really surprised that the R's staked their position on their failure to really read the warrant application and understand what was in it rather than their determination to protect their anti-middleclass, pro-wealth, anti-tax, anti-environment, anti-choice and pro-gun agenda? You can email Senators not from your State, but the only way to reach House members, is by phone or fax. Start calling (of faxing, if you can) all Republican House members now! Ask if they are on Putin's payroll. If you cannot reach their DC office, call their local office. And, when they ask if you are from the district, just say you are from the USA! These dishonest people need to hear from all of us, all the time and all day long! They need to know that people are watching, reading and listening to their lies.
3
Trump can get away with lying and double down on lies, because he made it an issue between the ‘liberal press’ and ‘himself’. Fake news versus conservative. His tweets never meant for educated people. They always meant to those who pay no attention and think every one does it. It is just the press is trying to get him. Honestly, who will read all those reports. You either trust the press or you don’t. For that reason, he made it upfront that the press cannot be trusted. Now, the trust advantage the press has got eliminated among Republicans, motor bike riders and those who think ,everybody does it’. The support from that group will be rock solid for Trump. For this reason, Democrats should focus on winning the independents plus all Democrats should go out and vote.
2
We are living in an era where Trump's defenders are trading in their red make America great again baseball caps for the tin foil bennies protecting them from the deep state intrusion of a mind controlling politicized FBI and Justice Department.
There are several posters here arguing the GOP's deflection points that the investigation of Carter Page was unwarranted and politically motivated by a deep dark conspiracy from the left.
The GOP's arguments ignore the proverbial 300 pound gorilla in the room. Specifically, Carter Page made false statements about contacts he had with Russians and with individuals tied to the Russian government and the FBI knew his statements about not having contact with Russians were false.
That fact alone is adequate to justify any FBI investigation into Mr. Page and his dealings with the Russians, and his involvement in the Trump campaign.
At this point in light of the established fact that page made false statements about Russian contacts any further obstruction of this line of investigation by the GOP can only be interpreted as suborning treason.
25
Although I believe that history, some day, will vindicate against Trump and his policiies, now I fear that I might not live to see it.
We are now in another America revolution and must tirelessly protest against the anti-democratic forces that Trump, and his ilk, are bringing to bear. Millinum or not, if we don't find a way to coalesce, in order to defeat his agenda, we are all going down.
To me, just because DTa supporters favor a detente with Russia's, does not indicate their support for a more socialistic approach to government. They want a strong man or, if you will, a dictator who will reflect their interests. This is not a time for those of us, opposed to DT, to war within ourselves.
......
2
Thirty years ago, Ronald Reagan joked into a live microphone: "My fellow Americans, I'm pleased to tell you today that I've signed legislation that will outlaw Russia forever. We begin bombing in five minutes."
Now, his own party is running an aggressive and disgracefully dishonest cover operation. Covering up a ghastly and previously unimaginable level of Russian intrusion into the heart of our democracy. Poor Ronny must be flipping over in his grave every single day.
Republicans like Devin Nunes, Andy Biggs, and their fellow travelers are engaging in a conspiracy to shut down an investigation that is not only obviously legitimate but absolutely vital to our country. They need to be held accountable.
The Helsinki summit revealed just how deadly serious this matter is. Putin has something on Trump, probably more than just one something. Videotapes of Donald's sexual perversity, detailed accounts of money laundering and criminal financial activity. Trump's conduct approaches or crosses the line of treason.
Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell need to remove Nunes from his position, immediately. When the Democrats regain control of the House, an investigation into Nunes must be ordered. His gross dishonesty is bad enough. The fact that he's complicit in acts of treason is appalling. Poor Ronny's exhausted by this. Republicans in bed with the Russians. It's appalling.
10
Does a party that creates a fake dossier have the right to complain about Wikileaks?
6
@Joe Goldstein The dossier was created for The Mercers in their backing of Ted Cruz. Hillary's campaign bought after Cruz dropped out and were approached by GPS. Turn off Fox News - you are getting bad info.
17
@Joe Goldstein- Only if they believe in fairy tales and Faux News like some folks here... besides, the GOP has created quite a bit more than just “a fake dossier”.
Shoot, look at the fake president they’re propping up!
14
@BoubbyBow
No, the Steele dossier was paid for by Clinton campaign, hidden in legal fees, after Cruz stopped oppo research when he lost the primary. You should stop just reading headlines and comments.
I hope that the November elections permit rational voters to take back the Senate and the House and get back control over our Democracy. The Republicans in control of the Senate and House are obviously too concerned with their Trump infused power to act to save our country and its values. They are blind to the fact that Trump is an irrational egotist without the foresight or ability to think through complex issues and/or take advice from competent advisers.
10
Each and every day (and sometimes several times a day) yet another variation of the Big Lie by this disgrace, whereby up is down, wrong is right, and truth is eviscerated.
9
This is what government by a Reality TV personality looks like.
22
This harkens back to a line from the Wizard of Oz: "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!"
Thanks to Fox and Twitter (Twitter ignores its Terms of Service in the case of Trump), #45 realized he can lie and still win with his base. He's doing his best to disparage the FBI in an attempt to mitigate the brazen attack by the Russian military and government on our country.
Thanks to karma, Nunes' 15 minutes of fame may be coming to a close. Who comprises his base in central California? Farm owners. They're the same folks getting killed by Trump's immigration efforts that don't allow for migrant field workers. The owners are the same folks who are getting slammed with tariffs. If it wasn't so horrible for the migrants, it would be amusing to watch Nunes' decline.
We used to talk in hushed tones about Russian spies among us. Now we have to come to grips with the stark reality that they might be home grown.
18
@Sarah
Nunes is a disgrace to my state. Perhaps these GOP dullards are just dupes for money, sex, and power. The original triple headers of corruption.
Please vote Nunes out in November, my fellow Californians. We did our part down here and got rid of Issa and his stain on our great state.
4
@Sarah, The Wizard of Oz is the complete opposite of Trump, preferring to govern invisibly.
@John Harper, Issa is an American legend. The guy started out as a car thief and wound up the richest critter in Congress.
The elephant in the room is the Supreme Court decision that organizations are people for campaign money purposes. We need publicly financed elections. Then, the motivations of candidates are narrowed to the best interests of the United States - or at least there's a better chance. Now each player has a different motivation and is willing to lie and twist the facts to suit his needs - and we, the public, can't always easily determine those motivations without much more transparency. Too many conflicting truths out there.
Releasing the aforementioned FISA document is a great help towards needed transparency now. Should the policy of keeping so much secret be revisited? Transparency is extremely lacking in Government at this time, and that lack is part of the reason Trump's lies are so easily accepted by his supporters. They aren't used to a Government that believes in the value of information and our news outlets are just starting to push back and demand that information.
Trump is being allowed to lie continuously. Why isn't there more push back against his secret meeting with Putin. Why was he allowed to meet with anyone in secret? What other conversations, as the reported phone conversations, has he had with Putin? What was their content? We're not at war where plots against an enemy need to be kept secret. Or are we?
23
@Barbara Snider
Barbara I think it not fair to paint everyone as being loose with the facts. There are some honest (though misguided) souls even in the Republican party.
@Barbara Snider, Lying to twist the facts is evidently the raison d'etre of this court of phonies, who cannot even give a straight definition of "establishment of religion" in the "establishment clause" of the Constitution, thereby establishing that life-term appointments don't unchain them from obedience to their nominators.
1
@Bunbury, I find many Republicans way too loose with their "sincerely held beliefs".
1
This guy's attack on democracy is unprecedented. How do so many people not see through his facade of narcissism and apathy? He lies his face off constantly to get ahead, just as he has his entire life. November can't come soon enough.
16
Let them drink Koolaide!
6
They already have.
3
I came across some fascinating material on Devin Nunes' devious dealings with Portugal, reporting in this paper. US national interests and the truth? I don't think so.
The whole article is worth reading, but how many people know about his efforts to put the Azores front and center?
"How Devin Nunes Turned the House Intelligence Committee Inside Out: In inquiries on Benghazi and Russia and beyond, the California congressman has displayed a deep mistrust of the expert consensus on reality — a disposition that has helped him make friends in the current White House" https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/24/magazine/how-devin-nunes-turned-the-h...
"The chairmanship of the House Intelligence Committee is one of the most plum assignments on Capitol Hill. .... privy to America’s most sensitive national security secrets. As chairman, Nunes now had the power to pursue any number of foreign policy issues — from defeating ISIS to containing Russia to checking Iran. The item that topped his agenda, however, was hardly a geostrategic imperative: He was, according to multiple sources, obsessed with the Azores, the semiautonomous Portuguese archipelago in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean. Nunes’s fixation on the Azores would come to dominate his initial years as chairman ...
"In part, Nunes cared about the Azores for personal reasons. His family traces its heritage to the Azores; his wife has roots there as well."
10
Interesting times. Trump just met privately with head of one of the United States's most serious adversaries, a man who is the former director of the KGB.
Revelations keep coming whether they are about coordination between Trump's attorney and AMI in the "catch and kill' story about Trump's year-long extramarital affair with the Playboy model, the looming Manafort trial, the imminent turning over of Assange to the U.K. authorities, the potential cooperation with prosecutors by Michael Cohen, or more tapes surfacing.
There seem to be a lot of skeletons in GOP closets these days. Soon maybe it won't be only Putin who knows where the kompromat is buried.
15
@smb, Trump's education in human psychology is but a tiny sliver of Putin's.
1
I somehow get the feeling that Trump sounded off without reading a sentence of these documents, and that Trumpists are impervious to reason or fact.
38
They refuse to come to terms that they've been duped. It is now getting dangerous, because we have a government that is not working for the benefit of the country, but rather is working only for themselves.
197
@Robert, you are correct. He does not bother to read or understand any of these documents. He just puts out what he believes his supporters want to hear and they accept that. This weekend I saw a scary article about evangelical supporters. One supporter said that the bad things Trump has been doing are a test of the faith of his supporters and he will soon start doing all good things soon. That is some seriously delusional stuff. The solution is to seriously turn out and vote when the time comes.
22
I think it is entirely possible, at this point, that Trump cannot read, or properly process the written word.
16
The Republicans rely on the assumption that there is no one who can or will stop them.
So far, they have been correct.
22
As long as there are no consequences, they'll keep lying. Funny, if they tell the truth their constituents won't back them. Conservatives act like they're in a cult these days.
21
I'm beginning to see a pattern with Nunes and Trump. My guess is that Trump will select Nunes to head a Federal agency for his loyalty to the clan and "good work"
10
Every Russian agent I know confirmed they were an agent when I confronted them with my suspicions, so when Carter Page denies being an agent, we must believe him.
;-)
11
@Ricardo
Then again he is not in jail and hasn't been changed with anything despite the surveillance.
2
@jaco The question has always been whether Carter Page actions warranted an investigation.
When will reporters ask Trump - or if he is hiding, his surrogates - whether he actually READ the FISA warrant information? Then ask (if they hedge or try to imply he did) ok, which page(s) support his conclusions? We all know he never read it, or any other important document (e.g. the Iran treaty), so why accept his "conclusions" without challenging him directly? If we all know the document in question does NOT support his tweets, then say so directly and ask him to prove that his conclusions are true. Since it is unlikely he will make himself available to reporters, then the White House press corps needs to step to the plate, do their jobs, and ask Sanders to prove it.....and keep asking when she hedges.
6
@gk The Iran agreement wasn't a treaty because everyone know that Republican Senates don't ratify treaties other than surrenders to the US.
1
Another perspective, from a conservative who has been generally accepting of the need and apparent propriety of the investigation in general, and this FISA application in particular: https://www.nationalreview.com/2018/07/carter-page-fisa-applications-fbi...
@Adam
I read Andrew McCarthy, every word, every article. Whatever objectivity McCarthy had has been long gone. The degradation of his diction alone exposes his lack of objectivity. If one is to continue reading McCarthy, reading of the many peer reviews/critiques of McCarthy's opinions are a necessity.
1
@Adam, I read the article at the link you sent. It is not really another perspective, it is a fabrication, and he completely ignores that 4 separate Republican appointed judges approved and then renewed the FISA warrant over time. Also, that National Review website is loaded with pop-ups/ads and I'm getting security warnings about it. Use at your own risk.
3
@jeffk,
I used to work for a judge who became a FISA Judge. This Judge is not involved in any of the current topics, nor did we discuss sensitive information. But I have been keen to follow the role of the FISA court ever since.
There a constellation of claims in these matters, which partisans tend to lump together either offensively or defensively. FISA's unmatched record of judicial success is, sadly, a bi-partisan affair. In this case, one could argue that the entire FISA process is so rubber-stampworthy that what is "merely" a civil liberties issue in the usual course can become a vehicle for unduly politicized investigations in the rare instance when it is used in connection with an ongoing campaign. If Trump had been a conventional GOP politician - rather than black swan seemingly from Mars - perhaps some hesitancy would've crept into the proceedings. It's impossible to know. Where I do agree with McCarthy is that the FBI claimed before the FISA court that the Steele allegations had been "verified" - using that term in a highly opportunistic and exceptional way in this case. That shouldn't happen ever, but particularly not amidst a presidential campaign.
This is a perfect example of one side disregarding their own, trmendous bias as they identify bias they perceive coming from the other side (see a polar opposite take on this issue in Byron York's Wash. Exam. article today). Where are the neutral parties when we need them.... certainly not in mainstrem media.
3
@carl bumba: I am tremendously biased against lies, and tremendously proud of it!
10
Remember Alexander Butterfield? He was the Nixon aide who revealed the White House taping system. Once we knew that there were tapes of Nixon’s role in Watergate (and a lot of other stuff), we knew that, whatever the obstacles, eventually the tapes would all come out. (You can now listen to them online at the Nixon Presidential Library—I swear, I am NOT making this up.)
Does anyone really believe that we won’t eventually hear all the Cohen-Trump tapes, now that we know they exist? I’ll bet the bookies in Las Vegas are already taking bets on how long it’s going to take before the transcripts appear in the New York Times and the Washington Post.
9
I am so tired of reading that Trump's supporters in their unwavering loyalty to him "will not care" whatever lies he sputters forth on a daily basis. The New York Times and other media outlets should emphasize more vociferously that there are at least 3 million more of us who "do care" and who demand the truth and are working tirelessly in our resistance to overcome his mendacious administration in November.
We represent a majority "base" formed by patriotic citizens who recognize the damage this president is doing to our democracy.The nation and the world should know our message loud and clear in the press instead of constantly emphasizing the implacable support of his faithful no matter what insanity their strongman may do next. We already know that his followers will never budge so what's the point of their mention every day?
We, the contra Trump masses "do care" about his propaganda of lies, even if they "don't." Please tone down the Trump 'base' platitude for a while; it is getting annoyingly old and even has slight defeatist intonations. Get some real numbers about how many supporters nationwide are on each side (should be quite easy to count those in Congress, although gerrymandering for the general population might prove to be more difficult!). Here's hoping that our numbers rise higher than what they already are when we go to the polls in November!
18
@Helen, and I’m sure plenty of heads will roll once you’ve regained your grip on power. It will nice to see how it’s supposed to be done.
I recall, months ago, listening to Carter Page being interviewed and remembering conversations with seriously demented patients who could express themselves more clearly. Upon focusing more carefully on Page's rhetoric, it became painfully clear that he was caught in a such a convoluted series of lies that he couldn’t find his way around them. And then I remembered having questioned my listening skills when I had first entered into a conversation with a dearly demented man, Clarence, so lost in his thinking that he had pulled me into his jumbled thoughts and was drowning both of us. The difference between listening to Clarence and listening to Trump and Page, et al, is that Clarence was not trying to be deceitful.
These days, I have to remind myself that it's not my inability to follow the rhetoric of Trump and his cohort that is the problem. I have tried to understand what they're trying to tell me, but as my mind tries to dissect their arguments, I remember Clarence who was trying to find his way out of his mental morass rather than pull me into it. I am pretty sure the communication that comes out of Trump's WH is intended to manipulate me and pull me into the chaos. I finally gave up trying to understand Clarence and simply listened and loved him for trying to connect.
I am losing my patience with the Trump administration's lies and deceit. The constant stream of falsehood, nonsense, and dangerous threats is a shameful and insidious form of misleading the public.
29
I don't think Trump lies, I think he simply has no use for the truth. In fact, his entire life can be seen as a prolonged attempt to escape the truth. He was exceedingly fortunate to have inherited wealth, allowing him to construct and inhabit an elaborate latter-day Potemkin village in which he is always right, always the best, always the boss, always mega-successful. Despite failing at every legitimate business he's ever attempted, despite having a career consisting entirely of kitschy scams of one sort or another, he's never taken responsibility for anything because he's never failed. Just ask him.
One thing has remained constant, though - the kind of person who falls for his cons. That makes his presidency his grandest scam of all, because there were three million more voters who had him pegged than didn't or didn't care.
One by one his defenders will fall silent as the truth comes out, until only one is left - the man who could never, ever admit being wrong. About anything. We just have to hope that he doesn't then try to blow up the planet out of spite.
12
@Three Bars, Trump won't ever back off, and his objective is having us all die with him.
3
Shorter version : Trump administration chooses to reveal documents which clearly show how and why Devin Nunes and his colleagues blatantly lied and misled in official reports and documents they released.
12
If a Candidate #2 was mentioned anyway in the application why didn't it say the dossier was paid for by the Candidate #2?
4
@areader
Have a read, areader.
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/4614708/Carter-Page-FISA-Appl...
@Rw,
Where? I don't see it. Could you please cite it?
Thank you.
Expecting Donald Trump to try to stop election sabotage that benefits him is like expecting gravity to make heavy objects float in the air. Due to Trump's narcissistic personality disorder (and perhaps even sociopathy), he is literally incapable of understanding why ANY President - or, for that matter, any person - would be motivated by anything other than their own personal, short term self-interest. Trump SCREAMS this reality at us every single day. The question is why we, as a nation, incessantly dwell on what he says while completely ignoring - or at least refusing to act on - what he is so clearly telling us.
10
House Republicans had no intent whatever of conducting an honest investigation. They only wanted a sycophantic toadying defense of Trump. Voters should punish them in November, but I'm not holding my breath. The push to protect white privilege in red states, and red districts, like Devin Nunes' is overwhelmingly powerful.
20
@William O, Beeman, The district Nunes represents consists of a few very rich farmers, and whole lot of others just hanging on. One wonders how the votes get counted there.
7
We must be very careful not to try to find stuff that is not there. One cannot extract blood from a stone. Be patient and Trump’s blinding narcissism will eventually rip through in baby rage. It would be too bad to spoil the vindication of that moment.
3
The Donald wants to have it both ways. He disingenuously accuses the Obama administration of doing nothing about Russian interference but when there is proof of the Obama administration doing something about Russian interference, he moans and bellows about his 'unfair witch hunt'.
10
Another great OPINION-- oh, sorry, News Analysis piece!
5
@Wondering, it’s only inevitable. This feels like watching a dog chewing on an old bone where any meat is long since gone. Nothing but merely grinding of teeth is all that’s left for the poor dog to do, that and maybe possibly dreaming of meat.
1
Donald J. TRAITOR is accusing four FISA judges nominated by REPUBLICAN POTUSes to Federal judgeships (Dearie- Reagan, Conway, Mosman – Bush 41, Collyer – Bush 43) and ALL appointed to FISA by Chief Justice John Roberts as being disloyal? REALLY?
The FISA warrant requests plainly explain where the Steele Dossier came from.
The FISA warrant requests clearly describes a great deal of other supporting information, including the fact that Carter Page was under investigation as a Russian collaborator as early as 2013.
The FISA warrant requests include additional information at each renewal. the documents get longer each time. Look at the page counts.
Donald J. TRAITOR LIES AGAIN. SURPRISED?? NO!!
Devin Nunes is a lying fool.
8
Including Trump, of course, can anyone in government be more incompetent than Nunes? I doubt it.
5
The left and the fake news media would do well to read this:
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of losers. --Socrates
3
It’s not slander when the evidence and data prove otherwise.
4
Don’t we all know . . . Trump uses the slander tool in just about every tweet he releases.
9
What in the name of God are you talking about?
4
“Still, information from Mr. Steele — who had provided credible intelligence to the United States government in the past — was clearly an important part of the application. The application cited claims he had gathered about purported meetings between Mr. Page and two Kremlin-linked Russians during a trip he took to Moscow in July 2016; Mr. Page has denied meeting with them, although he later contradicted his claims that he had not met any Russian government officials on that trip.”
Page was clearly trying to cover his tracks and lied about it. So did Sessions. Page even told Sessions he was going to Russia.
"In Nov. 2017, during more than six hours of closed-door testimony, Page said that he had informed Sessions about his coming July 2016 trip to Russia, which Page told CNN was unconnected to his campaign role. Page described the conversation to CNN after he finished talking to the House intelligence committee."
https://www.cnn.com/2017/11/02/politics/carter-page-testimony-russia-tri...
I am filled with dread that our country is being led by liars and fools. Hopefully we will survive these days and come out stronger.
10
OK Page -you've " never been an agent." Just a DOPE- no make that DUPE. And your pal Donald- he who doesn't read - just made that obvious.
5
Republicans making false and distorted claims for political purposes, yet again... nothing new to see here!
7
In this crazy, unprincipled government, spin is the name of their game. Not only Trump lies, but his minions suffer no qualms in doing the same. NRA tied to Russia, trips, meetings, deals with Putin . And to think of the audacity of flag waving, and patriotic rhetoric heard from this group. Saddest time of all. We are witnessing the destruction here and now of what was a beautiful land. God help America.
4
This man is forever declaring victory against....... The USA. Huh??
8
Trump's aid to and defense of Russia's attacks on American security are already established facts, so no one will be surprised that he has selectively declassified parts of a FISA court petition for his political purposes. But what about Nunes? Is he merely a Kremlin sympathizer in order to get some favor from Trump? Or is there more?
1
NYT, 4/23/15 “As the Russians gradually assumed control of Uranium One in three separate transactions from 2009 to 2013, Canadian records show, a flow of cash made its way to the Clinton Foundation. Uranium One’s chairman used his family foundation to make four donations totaling $2.35 million. Those contributions were not publicly disclosed by the Clintons, despite an agreement Mrs. Clinton had struck with the Obama White House to publicly identify all donors. Other people with ties to the company made donations as well.”
3
@Zion
Hillary Clinton is not president. If there was evidence of wrongdoing, I am sure the GOP would had had it prosecuted. You do recall how vigorously they investigated Benghazi? Your reference was from 2015, why can't you move on? She lost the election, let it go!
1
"GOP caught lying again" doesn't even qualify as news now. It's just who they are
10
Congressional Republicans have simply taken a page out of Trump's playbook. They know that Trump voters don't care that he lies about every action he takes, that he lies about Mr. Mueller's investigation, and that he lies about his criminal wrongdoing and collaboration with an enemy nation.
This is why the memo was released. As long as Trump and his Republican toadies say it vindicates them (yet another lie), Trump voters are thrilled. They are truly members of a cult now, and can no longer be called sane, thoughtful citizens. They have shown that they want to continue to be brainwashed. Trump knows this, and Congressional Republicans know this.
But we must understand that the real damage to our nation isn't what is reported in this memo, or any other action taken by Trump and his toadies. The real damage is caused by Trump voters. They have willingly made him a dictator of this nation, and will do literally anything to keep him in power. But for them, he would have been removed from office by now, much as Nixon was. I remember the Watergate years quite well, and although Nixon supporters were reluctant at first to leave him, as the proof of his wrongdoing grew, they did turn away from him. Here, we see the opposite -- Trump voters becoming more rabid in their support of someone who is truly a deranged tyrant. He knows he could release proof that he had molested a 3 year old, and his voters would continue to support him. And they are the threat to this nation, not Trump.
4
Where are the Democratic leaders speaking out against Trump’s daily lies? He can’t make up his own facts just because Twitter allows anything. Pushback from Democrats — loud media-grabbing pushback — is required. Where is it?
7
@joymars - Where is the media coverage of Democrats, interviews etc.?
You mean the responses quoted in the article, or the daily broadsides that you don't listen to?
1
The FISA court reviews & approves surveillance subpoenas. Period!
Those are based on "reasonable suspicians" of criminal activity based on national security. The last report out of Trump was that Page didn't even work for his campaign!
2
@Bob
Like he denied knowing Stormy Daniels?
Hey, don't blame the Republicans. They're only doing what frightened cowards do, and It's hard to be a coward. You have to swallow your pride and try not to look at yourself in the mirror. But you do have an excuse. Your president has justified and sanctified lying, loudly and often, so there's no reason you shouldn't also. And it doesn't hurt that their constituents find nothing wrong with all this so they don't say a word to their Republican wusses.
6
Those who have read this article know how to read and most NYT readers probably possess critical thinking skills that can distinguish fake news from real information. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said for Donald Trump, our delusional egocentric POTUS who probably never reads more than tweets, and gets much of his info from Fox News and other internet Fake News sources like those already-indicted Russian counterintelligence agents. And then there is Devin Nunes, Trump's slobbering lapdog, who probably never learned to read. But most egregiously there are all those Republican voters who still support Trump despite the fact that he is tearing America apart rather than making America Great Again. This is exactly how Hitler rose to power in the 1930s. Is history repeating itself? Soon we will all be citizens of the latest SSR (Soviet Socialist Republic) Amerikanskaya.
4
Can he stop, for once and for all, to stop calling people by names ( or Mrs Clinton)?
Please please stop
You look like a 2 grader !!
Please
2
Where is the surprise? They are liars and we all know it!!!
5
Devin Nunes is a flat out liar and I’m sending $100 to his Democratic and patriotic opponent!
8
Trump and his administration lies. Nothing new here. At this point, that’s what I expect – at all times.
Trump is a lying racist bigot, but Republicans like that he'll sign any policy they give him. It's not like he reads any of this stuff, nor do most of his supporters (Nunes). So why not say whatever anybody wants to hear, even if it changes 180 degrees mid-thought, to sell it?
6
Yeah. Sounds a little shaky.
1
When did lies amount to a “shaky foundation”? Traitor Nunez couldn’t be bothered to pretend to read the warrant application, Benghazi fetishist and retiring coward Gowdy apparently has difficulty with reading comprehension. Four republican-appointed federal judges approved and re-approved the warrant. Now that’s what you call a deep state. Republicans commit treason every day they permit the racist Traitor Caucus to control the House based on the pedophile Hastert’s “rule” and subvert the intelligence oversight role. They issued their “final” report months before the indictments of Russian military cyber-commandos. Sad. #GOP=Treason
3
All this hand wringing about the Steele dossier undermining the FISA warrant. After last weeks performance, it's pretty obvious that the Steele dossier is credible.
After the Porn Star and Playboy model payoffs does anyone think that there isn't a "Pee Tape" held in the vault of the Kremlin?
This isn't about the President colluding with the Russians. Obviously he colluded and is in Putin's pocket. This is about stealing another Supreme Court seat, destroying environmental legislation, tax cuts to corporate interests and the gutting of the social safety net so Republican interests can transfer those payments to the defense lobby.
He colluded and the Republican Congress is colluding to push an awful agenda that looks a lot like corporate payoffs to lobbyists.
10
When a memo's very foundation is "misleading or false," it is Not "Shaky" - it's fraudulent, counterfeit, crooked, deceitful,
phony and a sham.
There you go, gentle NYT headliners - try those adjectives on for size - and accuracy.
13
For a sitting President transmogrify a lawful surveillance warrant approved by four federal judges (all appointed by Republicans) into illegal spying says everything about Trump's respect for words, and the oft quoted "rule of law."
In his world, that phrase means mischaracterizing proper legal procedure under the Fourth Amendment's prohibition against unreasonable gov't intrusions -- the requirement of probable cause with enough specificity to satisfy a sitting judge - when it serves his interest.
What's really happened here, and the GOP has enabled this step, is that while everyone expects Congress and the White House to be partisan - almost by definition - Trump has now turned the Administrative Branch of our Federal gov't into partisan camps. He's pitched one against the other, regularly ignores or contravenes their policies and advice, just like he handles his minions. He thinks getting the agencies to spar and dislike one another is good because it's the only form of competition he knows or understands.
All other forms of genuine competition or working together are alien to Trump so that's what we're left with. The normally sleepy and dumb GOP is now forced to play along with Trump's approach to law and order, and it's starting to look beyond the pale. How many Congressmen and women are lawyers who understand what it takes to get a search warrant approved by four federal judges? Their silence speaks volumes as to Trumps total mastery over those fools.
7
So apparently the Democrats would be fine if a Republican candidate and the RNC funded an anti-Obama or Clinton dossier, funneling money to a law firm, using an informant that communicated with high levels of the Russian government that was then used to spy on a former Obama or Clinton campaign worker. Please explain.
In addition, the judge asked to sign off on it was never told that the dossier was completely unverified and that the Republicans had funded it.
It's clear that the dossier and the subsequent leaks about it were the main reason the judge signed off. No matter how the NYTimes spins it. Most other news outlets are reporting this.
6
@Jackie, What do you call that moronic Whitewater investigation that turn up nothing?
2
@Jackie: Apparently none of what you claim happened. Please explain, after you actually read the article...
12
@Jackie
1. It was originally funded by a conservative PAC who were against Trump.
2. Hillary and DNC never used any of the dirt.
3. The dossier was not the primary driver in the application
4. The warrant had been signed off on 3 times before the existence of the dossier was even known.
5. Check the sources of your outlets. Sound Russian.
3
GOP and Trump using lies and propaganda that would make the USSR proud.
18
When will Devin Nunes be interviewed by the NYT regarding the now declassified material?
Surely voters in his district are entitled to know more about why he mis-representedthe FISA issues.
53
The Times erred here, in my view, by prioritizing its own analysis over that of important Republicans who are at long last showing a tiny bit of spine and opposing Trump.
I am speaking principally of Marco Rubio, who rejected Trump's claim that the FISA application documents support his claims that "Crooked Hillary" had the FBI spy on Trump's campaign.
"The only plot is to interfere in the election by the Russians," Rubio said. The Times reported this -- but put it in the very last paragraph of the story.
Times team, your analysis is often extremely good, but in this case it was much more important news that a prominent Republican senator openly broke from -- and rejected claims made by -- Trump.
This story would have been much more compelling if you had pitted Trump against Rubio and Democrats -- rather than Trump against a long-winded Times analysis.
If a prominent Republican -- heck, almost any Republican -- has the guts to take a stand opposing Trump, that is big news and you should cover it, er, bigly.
8
@Peter S., what Republican say is irrelevant to what they do. It is the hallmark of the whole party.
1
@Peter S., when Rubio or any other Republicans take responsible action instead of just mouthing indignation, then I'll believe that they are putting their country ahead of their party and its handlers. Until then, I am not holding my breath.
3
If, as the Trump administration claims, Carter Page was never a significant part of the Trump campaign, then how could wiretapping of page be construed as wiretapping the campaign? You can't have it both ways. And, what is the evidence that any wiretapping of any member of the Trump campaign has ever been communicated to anyone affiliated with an election opponent of Trump? There is none.
18
Everyone who authored the Republican Memo, including those who ascribed to it and attempted to validate it (including trump) are co-conspiritors in a scheme to assist the Russians to undermine our democracy, influence the outcome of the 2016 election and cover up the conspiracy to do so.
Everywhere one turns it reeks of Russian....not Venezuelan....not Vietnam...not Congo....but Russian.
62
I have long believe Trump has modeled his presidency on that of Groucho Marx's president of Freedonia in "Duck Soup."
He also more and more seems like Chico when he says to Groucho "who you going to believe, me or your own eyes?"
One can only hope Trump will fill out his imitation of the brothers and, like Harpo, shut up.
10
@Steve,
Fredonia without the humor.
4
Trump should have read it before releasing! Makes Nunes look like a stooge and a liar. Trump's lying will not change the facts.
16
Trump can't read well. He can't seem to comprehend what he reads. He cannot process information that way. He cannot establish actual facts in his mind and then repeat them orally. There's something neurologic going on (and being a pathological liar is probably a separate issue). He depends on his base being as functionally illiterate as he is, and depends on them having the same minuscule attention span that he has.
25
Paul Ryan, do your job and remove Nunes from the House Intelligence Committee.
31
When has Congressman Nunes ever declined to comment?
4
I truly am beginning to wonder, did Nunes and other Republicans (possibly some Democrats, who knows) take campaign money from Russian operatives? I just cannot wrap my head around their behavior otherwise. Are they that rabid in wanting to hold power? Or are they complicit?
Perhaps Mueller should add them to his investigation. Or perhaps he already has. This is just unbelievable. But its not a Reality Show folks, its really happening. I truly hope I am reading something into this that is not true. I tend to be a very rational, skeptical person, so I cannot believe that I am even saying this out loud. Sigh.
8
@wolf201
As I have heard said before, it’s all green. So, sure, I have no doubt that Russian greenery has made its way into our money driven political system.
1
There isn't any US politician at all representing a genuine national constituency. US "democracy" is as fake as Trump.
4
Along with Trump, the GOP is obviously in great panic mode over everything Trump.
They are about to be exposed for allowing this unhinged man to continue to engage in treachery and conspiracy against the United States. Is the GOP complicit?
The American people wholeheartedly want to know the TRUTH about Trump, his campaign and his bizarre affinity for Putin.
Why are Trump's GOP comrades are so frantically trying to block the Mueller investigation from publishing its findings? It's making them look complicit and very guilty themselves.
This GOP Congress has obviously forgotten they work for us, the American people, not Trump.
The American people are anxiously waiting for Mueller to finish his investigation and report the FACTS. Actually the whole world is waiting.
We, the American voters, will then make our decision who will represent us in running our nation, not Putin.
11
@JM
In theory, you are correct. The entire premise of this so-called representative democracy was that those who were rightfully elected by the people would then represent those people in the best way possible. Of course, political parties weren’t part of the original calculus on any of that, and money wasn’t considered a “voice” to be protected, either.
So, over time the interests of the people - the “little guys” - became secondary (perhaps more like “tenthdary,” if there was such a word) to the interests of political parties, corporate benefactors, powerful interest groups (with MONEY), and anyone or anything else that could most directly and immediately impact an elected official’s standing, status, and longevity.
We are operating in a very much bastardized system of government from that envisioned by our generally noble and genuinely patriotic forefathers. I sincerely doubt that any of them could have envisioned what their original model has morphed into a mere 250 years later.
No, I’m sorry, but the will of “the people, and the best interests of “the people,” are the LAST things most modern day politicians care about. Money may not be the root of all evil, but it sure has made our “representative democracy” just about as unrepresentative as it can be.
1
Stop the inane tweeting, Mr Trump,
and instead have the courage to thoughtfully participate in regular broadcast interviews and live press conferences. Stop trying to hide behind your thumbs.
9
@DK
I am in total agreement with your message here. But seriously, you might as well be trying to reason with a peacock - all strut and show, but still possessing a bird brain.
6
I think Paul Ryan is proving himself to be as incompetent as Donald Trump, for allowing Devin Nunes to compromise and use the Congressional Committee as an avenue to push Donald Trump driven conspiracy theories.
Paul Ryan, if you can't act like a real Speaker of the House, then you should resign right now, before you disgrace yourself any longer.
18
after shameful performance with Putin in Helsinki, Trump continues to discredit US intelligence work, without credible evidence. so we know the charade of "would" and "wouldn't" was just a show to calm down the fury from all sides. unfortunately GOP congress ate it up. history will look back and wonder WHO are these people. are they REAL Americans, and just Russians living among us.
2 years after "winning" the presidency, Trump is still haunted by "crooked Hillary" images. comeuppance ? ! he needs an exorcist !
11
Reality never had any more meaning to Trump than reality has to do with his dumb "reality" shows.
This is exactly the way he treats the country.
It was obvious before the election.
13
Another bizarre development at the White House. A perfectly appropriate approval by the group of Federal judges to authorize a wiretap of a man with links to Moscow’s ongoing effort to subvert the USA is labeled a “witch hunt.” Trump and his sycophants are a strange cult. Trump is Stalin’s dream come true.
11
Rubio knows a sinking ship when he sees one. He’s trying to quickly jump off
10
The documents were misleading or false according to the left's narrative of lies and distortion.
1
A year ago, th NY Times claimed the FISA court was a kangaroo court, rubber stamping everything. Today they claim is a very deliberative body, trading footnotes on page 22 and considering constitutional implications that haven't been tested in courts before.
3
@John - Please provide a link to this claim.
Just FYI: Well here's a funny little coincidence -
Mariya Putin, Vlads eldest daughter just so happens to run a children's endocrinology charity, guess who specializes in endocrinology?
Spectrum Health of Michigan.
The same site that all the computer traffic was going to and from Trump Tower and Alfa Bank of Russia.
Spectrum Health is owned by Betsy Devos.
That, ladies and gentlemen is called an implausible coincidence.
Devos didn't get a cabinet position because she was qualified (an understatement)! She got that job because she's right smack in the middle of all this!
They used her companies computer servers to communicate with the Russians and they thought no one would notice! I'm sure she's terrified right about now.
If we all know what she did you can best be sure Robert Mueller knows what she did.
53
The Republicans are complicit in all of Trumps crimes and misdemeanors.
When will they uphold their oaths of office to protect and defend the constitution of the United States. These documents, Helsinki, Russian Interference in our election.
They turn a blind eye to collusion when all one has to do is replay all the lies leading up to the discovery of meeting with Russian agents in Trump tower. First no meeting with Russians. Then the number of Russians in the meeting and discussion about “adoption “. Then Donny Jr. email to meeting participants if you have dirt on Hillary , “I love it”. How about timing of Wikileaks release of Hillary emails just a day after Donald looked into the camera and asked Russia to hack/release emails. This is collaborative behavior with Russian operatives intent on damaging the United States.
Voters need to come out in record numbers and vote for Democrats to insure an appropriate check and balance to a unstable dictatorial liar residing in the White House.
9
Hoist by his own petard.
5
Fake News! What do I mean. This is a front page presumably news story. News stories are about who, what, where, when, FACTS. This story is an analytic editorial piece. Start with the very first sentence, then the second. It is a disgrace that this was allowed to be presented as a front page news story. This is about journalism, not politics. This is the type of reporting that fully justifies the FAKE NEWS label so successfully being attached to news organization. The public is getting sick of it, though I am sure die hard anti-Trump readers are content to wallow in the editorial commentary masquerading as news.
1
@drcmd
You're abolutely correct. It's surprising that your comment was posted by the biased Times amid the blizzard of Trump hatred on this comment board. FBI and DOJ officials were irate that their favored candidate didn’t win and were determined to unseat the victor, who had the temerity to win a national election.
1
@times - Fascinating. How is it that all those Republicans came to be such ardent supporters of a Democrat?
Who'd have thought that dimwitted sock puppet Rubio would actually speak some truth and do so openly.
As much as I want this useless leech off the taxpayer payroll I appreciate him finally doing his job, something his fellow Republicans refuse to do.
7
Who woulda guessed - Nunes & Trump would/wouldn’t, could/couldn’t did/didn’t get their facts straight. Shocking! 107 days....
9
News flash: you're being lied to. The Trump and GOP base don't know and maybe don't care. Most everyone else already knows this and get daily headline reminders and Trump Twitter feeds.
3
I genuinely believe that a number of Republican congress members are compromised by Kompromat.
Starting with Devin Nunez......
Just wait and see....
18
Who to believe, Donald Trump or a Grand Jury who indicted 12 Russian Military officers?
For credibility, I’ll stick with the Grand Jury.
24
It’s beyond any logic how anyone can support a president that constantly lies. All politicians stretch the truth at times but lies are the only consistent thing about this president.
One minute black is white and a couple of hours later white is black. It’s amazing that most of the world has figured out trump but not a large number of US citizens, who don’t seem to have a clue or just don’t care.
18
@KLKemp
They’ve backed themselves into a corner, and there’s no way out for them, unless they’re willing to make a mess and look foolish.
Hubris - good old-fashioned hubris won’t allow those who know he’s wrong (and even dangerous), and who know they were wrong in supporting him, to admit their culpability.
And then there are the members of his cult who would support literally anything he says or does.
2
More bad journalism. The set up to this “analysis” to hook the reader in is that “key elements of Republicans’ claims about the bureau’s actions were misleading or false.” A reader would reasonably expect to see a litany of facts supporting this tantalizing premise. None are given. Instead, there’s a recitation of vaguely supported opinions and conclusions that are standard TDS profession of faith mantras. Buried in this op ed masquerading as “analysis” is the grudging admission that Steele’s DNC-bought dossier was “clearly an important part of the [warrant] application” (a central Trump criticism of the warrant). But fear not, we are assured, Steele is a “credible” fellow who can be absolutely trusted (again, no supporting facts). It is dismaying to see yet another example of the steady erosion of the NYT’s journalism standards.
1
If the Justice Department and FBI wanted to spy on the Trump campaign, why didn't they pick a target that was still on the inside? Page was fired from the campaign for his Russian ties before the first FISA warrant.
Republicans never let facts get in the way of their narrative.
12
Unless bald eagles get the vote and vote solidly republican, they are doomed.
6
Let's get this straight:
Trump's disreputable dealings, his support from oligarchs, and Russian interference in our election are sacrosanct. Exposure is by definition suspect because it comes those who oppose him. The only politics above reproach are Trumpistanians' biased assertions. People who believe the truth don't buy his con and are therefore in a conspiracy to reveal it.
Got it: only Republicans in office have the one true word from their wannabe godkingemperor and his impresario chaos creator Putin's devious minions and oligarch investors.
Setting us at each other's throats serves the minority party in power, which has taken over our executive, legislative, and legal branches and their eel like twists and turns.
Trump behaves with Putin like the victim of a mob enforcer who has shown him the pains and penalties of disobeying his master. Trump, who is without morality or care for his "subjects" has a master whose depth of deviousness is out of the reach of his limited understanding: Putin has risen from the ashes to become the richest man in the world.
I doubt he cares for Trump who is an unappealing blowhard but a useful tool.
How quickly America has been made the opposite of great. Degradation by the day, with a topping of cruelty and autocracy.
Poisoning the planet for profit, taking from the least fortunate to give to shortsighted greed. Reducing women to objects, forcing egotistical ideas of property as religion, encouraging violence and hatred.
11
"Much of the dispute in February over the surveillance of Mr. Page centered on the fact that the F.B.I.’s court application included unverified information it had obtained from Christopher Steele, a former British intelligence agent who had been hired to research Mr. Trump’s ties to Russia by a firm that was in turn being financed by the Democratic National Committee and the Clinton campaign."
Good article, good information, but wouldn't it have been more accurate and provided better context to write:
"...who had been hired to research Mr. Trump's ties to Russia, first by the Republican Jeb Bush's Presidential campaign, then by a firm that was in turn being financed by the Democratic National Committee and the Clinton campaign"?
14
With Donald Trump now outed in Helsinki as a man in favor of Russian Federation President Vladimir Putin's foreign policy over that of his own intelligence agencies, the heretofore Keystone Kops antics of Rep. Devin Nunes aided and abetted by Speaker Paul Ryan and Reps. Jim Jordan and Mark Meadows have taken on a much darker and ominous tone of conspiracy to obstruct justice. Under normal circumstances Rep. Nunes would be censured if not impeached. But, these are not normal times, but the most perilous moment in our nation's history as we have a President who is apparently under the control of Vladimir Putin and a Republican Congress that is controlled by Donald Trump. It is our very democracy that is now on a "shaky foundation" as the forces of betrayal in both the Executive and Legislative branches of government are working relentlessly in support of autocratic rule rather than the Constitutional "rule of law."
28
Nunes's memo was a suite of lies tailor-made for the dim and dishonest, although, at this point, even they can now see it's threadbare.*
(*Assuming they've bothered to read the application and/or the stories about it.)
3
So I think today is the first time I’ve heard Trump use the words “Mueller Witch Hunt.”
This serves him two purposes. First, it takes a news cycle or two away from his disastrous performance in Helsinki last week, and subsequent “clarifications and contradictions.”
Second, it inches him closer to a position where he feels justified in firing Mueller. I don’t think even the GOP would put up with that, but then again, they said very little about Helsinki.
Dangerous times for our country. Please, for anyone interested in preserving our democracy, evaluate candidates and their positions carefully, and get out and vote in November. In my 63 years, I don’t recall a more important election.
14
I'm confused. Last year you told me the FISA court was a kangaroo court, rubber stamping everything it sees, a political tool of oppresion. Now you tell me the FISA court is a deeply deliberative body, carfully considering constitutional issues on a footnote on page 22 that haven't been litigated elsewhere.
1
@John. I don’t see praises of the FISA cpurt here. Though they do mention that all the judges who approved this wiretap were Republican appointees. Is that what you mean? Regardless of the quality of the deliberations of the FISA court, the wiretaps were legal, and legally obtained and from what has been disclosed the FBI did not mislead the court in order to secure the wiretap.
2
The only thing I can think of that would make individuals continue to support Trump must be a terrifying and embarrassing case of buyer's remorse. What stage of grief are they in?
5
dig deeper.
Trump supporters seem to share a lot of similar feelings of alienation, of fear, of being cheated out of their due, of social displacement, and more. plus most seem to have daddy issues that make them respond to a tall, famous, blustery authoritarian. Trump is their knight in shining armor in what they believe is a raging battle they are losing against forces they don't understand.
you know, like the war against Christmas.
The disturbing takeaway from all this is that it makes it very apparent that either: (1) Trump is not very smart, (2) Trump has cognitive issues that interferes with reading comprehension, or (3) Trump is displaying symptoms of dementia.
7
Did Trump or Nunes actually read this FISA application or did they think that it would obviously hurt the DOJ or FBI thus making it moot as to what it actually said. But I am sure that Trump's apologists will believe Trump's misdirection before reading the document. That Republicans oppose reading as their leader does may actually turn out to be their downfall. But until then Trump's bluster fills the minds of his supporters so completely that they will continue to ignore evidence.
4
@just Robert
Donald doesn't have the attention span to read the back of a cereal box. Everything he comes up with are talking points from someone else.
1
Perhaps Devin Nunes is a bigger doofus than we thought. He probably did believe that evidence of Russian attempts to compromise the 2016 American election was all a hoax just like the delusional Trump who thinks the "Russia investigation" is all about Donald Trump, not about Russia's (aka Putin's) attempt to destabilize American democracy as a way of strengthening Putin's government. Putin, Trump, Nunes These are all VERY DANGEROUS MEN. Unfortunately Republican voters don't realize just how dangerous they are.
9
Any attorney (Comey) signing and submitting these criminal applications implicitly represented to the FISA court that he/she had fulfilled the independent duty of "candor to the tribunal," which is of particular importance with respect to ex parte applications such as these.That means fully disclosing to the court all of the material facts, which is the opposite of what occurred here.
1
Sadly, a small minority of American voters believed the Trump con and joined a black is white universe like the Trump "University" suckers. The quickest exit is the Mid-term elections; the real solution is (a) term limits; (b) "at large" elections ending gerrymandering; (c) direct election of the president; and (d) the demise of Citizen's United and stripping entities of the political rights of natural persons.
20
Devin Nunez needs to go. He authored the fake memo. His job was to read the documents. He deliberately lied to the American people on a serious national security issue.
He cannot be trusted with classified material. His word cannot be trusted. He needs to pay a price for his betrayal of the American people.
We need Democratic control of Congress so there can once again be justice in America.
23
Mr.Trump is busy alienating our allies, starting a trade war, appeasing Putin,engaging dictator Kim of North Korea which is all horrible.But his greatest sin is trying to marginalize the Justice Department and selectively declassifying materials.The pleas of the Justice Department fall on deaf ears.As mountains of evidence against the Russian collusion in our election pile up Mr.Trump's efforts to taint our Justice Department increase.Democrats and Republicans cannot allow this to happen.We must protect our democratic institutions!
8
I love Trump’s questions as to why Obama didn’t stop it or at least tell the Trump campaign, and how they work on his base. Seriously, you’re going to alert the criminals that you are on to them?
4
Let's go back to the GOP campaign and ask how did Trump become their candidate?? (I thought Cruz wounded worse.)
Obviously, wrong questions being asked and wrong answers.
Another actor for president??!!! With no political experience.
Reconsider that!!
3
More misinformation and distortions by the liberal news media in its attempt to defend the indefensible regarding the misleading FISA application leading to the FBI’s spying on Cater Page.
Steele could have been a credible source in the past, but that does not ensure that he is always a credible source; and clearly he was not when it came to the dossier. There is no evidence that Steele ever personally substantiated the veracity of claims in the dossier.
Bowing to the political bias within certain elements of the FBI, the bureau used the dossier in its FISA application, relying on its reputation to support its claim of the document’s credibility, though it was not, at the time, nor has it today, ever been fully vetted by the FBI. Clearly, use of the credibility claim was deliberately misleading.
And then there is the intentional obfuscation surrounding the source and funding of the dossier. There is a significant difference between the obtuse reference to the dossier’s stated origin and the out right declaration of the political party and candidate that initiated and paid for the document in question.
Hopefully, now that the corrupt top echelon of the FBI, Comey, McCabe, and Strzok, have been removed from power, the FBI can regain its well deserved reputation and avoid politically motivated witch hunts in the future.
Devin Nunes should be charged with obstruction of justice.
13
Speaker Ryan: How much more do you have to hear before you remove the disgraceful Devin Nunes as head of the Intelligence Committee?
23
Facts and truth simply do not matter to the GOP and Trump. Emotion and ideology do. Perhaps this is why tapes of crying detained children seemed to strike a cord with this lot.
5
There undeniably was ample justification for monitoring of Page. GOP-appointed judges affirmed this. This was simply our law enforcement agencies doing their job.
Trump knows he used Russian operatives to help him in the election. Desperate to avoid accountability for this, he pressures his lackeys like Nunes to echo his baseless cries of "witch hunt. " Since neither Trump nor Nunes ever bothered to read the FISC warrant application, it's no surprise that they didn't recognize that their release only serves to undermine their false claims.
Trump cannot run away from the truth.
9
An excellent article and another chance to hear Trump declare what he cannot prove while those who can prove are rejected. There appears to be a distinct divide among the public - those who read and those who rely on television pundits and Trump's sound bites. That is a most compelling argument for a free press.
21
@Anita M, Without the "fairness doctrine", all we see are endless repetitions of prescription drug ads.
1
@Anita M - It's also a compelling argument for beefing up our educational system.
3
@DR no nation as backward as the US has ever dug itself out of ignorance like this without a centrally-administered education system funded by broad-based taxation.
I found it an interesting exercise for myself reading this article. I believe it. But when I ask myself why I believe it, it comes back to trusting this source of information. I'm not going to take the time to obtain and review the public documents. In the same way, those who don't believe it fail to believe it because of their sources of information. Wanton lack of truth is utterly toxic to the fabric of society, and any public official who engages in it consistently should be resounding rejected. Taking things up to the supreme court, what is to be done when you have judges who set aside precedent after precent that used to more fully protect "the little guy"? Getting out of this great big mess will be a long and very difficult struggle that has no hope of success unless people redouble their dedication to civility and honesty and refuse to give up the fight for justice and truth. And we must try harder to be understanding toward the misinformed.
8
"The application contains a page-length explanation that does alert the court that the person who commissioned Mr. Steele’s research was “likely looking for information to discredit” Mr. Trump’s campaign. It goes on to explain why, notwithstanding Mr. Steele’s “reason for conducting the research,” the F.B.I. believed it was credible."
Does the explanation you cite mention Fusion GPS, HRC, DNC or the Clinton Campaign?
Why is Mr. Page not in jail and/or why has he not been charged with any crime?
3
@John Xavier III
I don't think I've ever heard of any law enforcement agency that tells a judge more than necessary or relevant in order to get a warrant.
4
@Rick
So you think the fact that the dossier was ultimately commissioned and paid for by the HRC campaign, using multiple cutouts to conceal this fact, was not "necessary or relevant" to get a FISA warrant?
Yes, and the Earth is flat and the sun revolves around it. I suppose people believed that for 1000 years, so you are on safe ground.
Even for a normal warrant, those facts are extremely relevant.
But a FISA warrant is not a normal warrant - this is not a normal judge, this was not a normal hearing, FISA applications, hearings and warrants are anomalous, so you need to be triply careful that you share all information that might be relevant ... obfuscation is not permitted.
@John Xavier III
With all of those redactions, I don't know what else those judges were actually told anymore than you do. You are drawing inferences from a couple of paragraphs that you think may qualify as misleading. This is the only FISA warrant ever made public so it isn't like we have anything to compare to. I think your points have value if you want to participate in Trump's non-stop efforts to obfuscate, so I can't blame you for using them.
Once again, Trump's disconnect from reality is in full view as he "declares victory" for his viewpoint regarding the Carter Page surveillance warrants.
But then, the United States could be annihilated by all sorts of nuclear weaponry, whether they be from Russia or North Korea, and Trump would declare victory. And what's worse is that his base would believe him.
6
I don't think it's Trump that colluded or conspire against USA. It is GOP leadership, which colluded with Russia to steal election, which they could never win in fair game.
That is why there is no effort from GOP side(even though they're in power of all 3 branches of Government) are doing nothing to prevent the hacking but doing all to undermine a fair investigation.
Election for 2018 is decided; GOP will keep majority in both houses and may even increase.
1
Why are the Democrats doing so well in special election after election? Are the hackers and voter suppressors snoozing? Despair is not sn effective strategy.
This is appalling, since Trump does not pay attention to anyone's counsel or notice, he has little if any understanding of procedures. All he can see is that he might be tainted by Carter Page, and therefore wants any investigation into Carter Page and Russia discredited. These papers NEVER should have been declassified to begin with. Trump, outside of the fact that a President needs to know what is going on with the government, should not have ever had access to security protected information. If he were a private citizen applying for a civil service job, I doubt he would have passed even a Top Secret Clearance (nor been hired on capabilities).
By the way, what has Jared been looking at lately, and just how high does his clearance go? Where has he been traveling and what kind of real estate deals has he been lining his and the Trumps' pockets with?
As another aside, Nunes should be thrown out of the House of Representatives for he devotion to Trump and the violation of a three-branch government. HE does not serve at the will of the President, but at that of the People.
29
We must not lose sight of the single most important fact. This is not solely about Trump. He is surrounded by a gang of cohorts that are (as mentioned earlier) complicit in his crimes. This includes those in the G.O.P. and his base who continue to disregard the truth, disrespect our democracy and ignore their subservience to our highest authority - the law of our land. WhenTrump goes down EACH and EVERY ONE of his executive actions MUST be deemed null and void. This includes his nomination and the appointment of two supreme court justices, and ALL the policies he, his appointees or the G.O.P have repealed.
If he won the election illegally each of his actions while acting illegally in the position of President become NULL and VOID. Nothing Trump has done with his illegal win can remain.
23
Nicely written. Clears up a complicated situation. Trump's Twitter probably couldn't follow the logic in this article, though.
3
At best , this all shows that the Russian effort was at the margins of the campaign and dealt with people who had prior interactions in business or consulting. Russia was a good client to have as was Ukraine to represent their legitimate interests in the West.
Collusion , accepting that there is no such actual crime, would have been from the inside out for the express purpose of providing false information. The irony here is that the hacking revealed that the DNC was neither fair nor honest in its representations. Many are willing to accept that it is ok to hide the bias against Sanders and the effort to discredit Trump via the dossier. The fact that it was true but revealed by a third party seem not to be of interest.
Yes the Russians trolled and hacked ...and preferred Trump as they hoped to get sanction relief...but , in fact, they got more . Germany provided Russia with the deal that they needed and Trump railed against it. Some collusion....
Trump is hardly admirable but on this topic he will be sustained. And when he is , it will empower him more. If the Dems were a bit smarter they would give this up and just focus on policy and expertise ...but they hate him too much and it makes him so much stronger for it
3
@Joel Levine "Collusion" = "Conspiracy". Conspiracy is a crime in the United States in many instances.
We should all bow to your omniscience and detailed knowledge regarding the inner workings of the Mueller investigation. I can assert that Trump's treasonous actions will soon see the light of day, and that the public airing will not strengthen him, but like you I would only be speculating.
1
@Joel Levine...…."The irony here is that the hacking revealed that the DNC was neither fair nor honest in its representations."...….The DNC is not a public organization. It has no official or legal standing with regard to the government. Theft of its private communications is theft. To argue otherwise is to suggest that the "Watergate Break in" was also legal and justifiable. Same thing.
6
The president continues to do damage to our intelligence services by the release of the FISA warrant. He was so certain that releasing the warrant application would exonerate him and cast a negative light on the special counsel and democrats but it had the opposite impact. If the man would just read he would cut off over half of his stumbles but he won't or can't read. There was sufficient probable cause for the court to grant the warrant. There was reasonable suspicion to indicate that Carter Page was conspiring or at least a pawn being used by the Russians to influence the election. Clearly the Russians did not want to deal with a strong Hillary Clinton, they set their sights on a weak Trump.
7
There is no doubt that the Steele dossier is the main information the DOJ/FBI used to obtain the FISA application. The FBI/DOJ buttressed the dossier with allegations that Page was a Russian agent.
The problem with the latter allegation is that Page was, only months before, an FBI source which assisted in breaking up a Russian spy-ring attached to Russia's UN mission in Riverdale. It is simply absurd to suggest that an individual who helped secure a conviction of a Russian spy ring in March 2016 was, at the same time, a Russian agent who infiltrated the Trump campaign.
Moreover, as Steele began to act outside of FBI imposed boundaries (talking to Isikoff and potentially ruining any DOJ case), the DOJ doubled down and again propped up his ill-sourced dossier.
It is also curious that the FBI/DOJ never told the Trump campaign that Russians were working to infiltrate the campaign via Carter Page.
No matter how much deflection the press and law enforcement agencies attempt, the story is falling apart. Every day that Mueller does not charge anyone involved with the Trump campaign with a Russian conspiracy, the more improper and illegal this whole investigation looks.
4
The impatience on the right is just part of a continuing campaign of disinformation. By historical standards this investigation is still in the early stages. You will have your indictments and the GOP can choke on them.
7
@Chuck Burton
It's pretty simple Chuck- Carter Page wasn't a Russian asset. Nor is there any evidence he is a Russian asset.
Even worse, the dossier was compiled using Russian sources and was likely a misinformation campaign.
What if the only thing Mueller ever uncovers is that the Russian military and surveillance service ran a full throated operation intended to move the outcome of our election. Does that not cause you grave concern? Whether or not U.S. citizens collaborated in the operation does not, in my mind, reduce the need to investigate it intensively. I would have a completely different opinion of Trump if he were directing the investigation rather than working to undermine it. We need to know exactly what happened to defend ourselves.
1
"To End a Presidency"- The Power of Impeachment, by Laurence Tribe and Joshua Matz. I'm half-way through this must-read book. Every American should read this book - it isn't very long, is an interesting read, and obviously written for this "national nightmare" we are currently enduring.
1
How can Paul Ryan let the out of control Nunes continue to deceive the people? How can Mitch block the Senate from investigating blatantly obvious threats to our democracy? Our government and a whole way of life is virtually at risk because of Russia’s meddling yet the collusion deniers are still denying.
11
Trump is doing his lying, misdirection thing. If the sun comes up, it means the Mueller investigation is a witch hunt. If if rains, the Mueller investigation is a witch hunt. If Putin says its so, it is. As long as any liberal initiative can be reversed or ended or curtailed, Trump is just fine to the vast majority of Republicans. Your only option if you want something different is to VOTE.
76
Trump give us all reason to doubt his sanity, his ability, and his judgement. He had this released to prove he was right there is a witch hunt and it does exactly the opposite. It certainly puts Page in a bad light, which he deserves as another headline-seeking, wannabe "fixer" for Trump. Nunes also is exposed for being a willing huckster for Trump.
If this is a witch hunt Mr. Trump, then you are the witch who set the dogs loose.
69
Has anyone ever said that the information Steele dug up wasn't true?!?!
43
No, but many parts have been corroborated, including those relating to Carter Page.
Yes. And it has been discredited. FBI has said that there is no evidence to corroborate the information in the dossier that was published by Hillary and DNC.
I wish that more could be done to protect Rod Rosenstein. Since he signed off on that last extension, he seems to be next on the list of people that Donald would love to eliminate.
31
How do you cherry pick from an already cherry picked (read heavily and no-doubt strategically redacted) FISA court application? Why did it take a FOIA to compel what has been withheld so assiduously? Only to have it now touted as evidence of an above-board basis to spy on the Trump campaign? As for the omission that the Steele memo was commissioned by the Clinton (and not some nebulous) campaign specifically to preserve the "identity" of Americans, so as to spy on other Americans, is indicative of the convoluted FISA process.
4
Let's see.
1) Citing a full page of justifications is hardly cherry-picking, especially when it was initially stated that the justifications were a footnote.
2) It almost always requires an FOIA request to get government documents that are not published as a matter of course
3) It is touted as evidence because it belies the lies promulgated by Nunes and company
4) Yes. The FISA process is convoluted, but since the purpose of the FISA application was to determine if Mr Page had been compromised, and the motivations for the dossier were elucidated, the commissioning agent was not germane.
5
@riclys
Actually the Steele Dossier was commissioned by Republicans.
The Clinton campaign continued the project.
2
@Omrider You mean HRC paid Russians for dirt on Trump. That project?
The more I read articles such as this the more I understand the story about The Emperor's New Clothes. Only Trump and his die hard supporters can see the claims he makes as real.
52
From Merriam Webster dictionary:
Truth -
a (1) : the body of real things, events, and facts : actuality (2) : the state of being the case : fact (3) often capitalized : a transcendent fundamental or spiritual reality
b : a judgment, proposition, or idea that is true or accepted as true truths of thermodynamics
c : the body of true statements and propositions
We have yet to see any actions or statements from this administration that are in accordance with this definition. That is what is truly SAD.
24
There seems to be another endangered species: Republican lawmakers with courage and integrity.
82
@Liberty Apples
Already extinct.
As treasonous as Trump's lies are about the nature of this report, it should be pointed out that he has access to the redacted parts which explain the full range of sources used to justify examining Page's role in undermining our elections for Trump's benefit. Those "patriots" in congress who do not hole him accountable for his daily lies should be tried as his co-conspirators.
34
So … I see that Mark Meadows now complains that the redacted portions of FISA applications -- no part of which should ever have been disclosed, even to the House "Intelligence" Committee -- should be 'unredacted' … because it is there, he 'suggests' in 'rabidly' blind partisanship and ignorance, that the personnel of our nation's intelligence agencies would be 'revealed' as Clinton campaign 'associates' who illegally spied upon trump and the trump campaign, as part of a conspiracy to defeat trump in the 2016 presidential election.
ASTONISHING … but becoming less so with every passing tweets-of-trump day and House-republicans 'inquiry.'
21
Trump holds an orange up to America, saying it's an apple. His supporters see an apple. This is getting scary.
66
@RJB
Agreed. What is happening when these GOP "patriots" refuse to defend the basis of democracy??
6
This, perhaps, more than Putin is what is so dangerous for our democracy: Trump's base believes whatever they're told to believe.
Our only hope is the advice given even by Republicans: this November swallow your pride and vote Democrats into office.
2
"Republicans had also faulted the application for not explicitly identifying Mrs. Clinton’s campaign and the Democratic National Committee by name. BUT that criticism ignored the fact that law enforcement officials were following a general policy not to name Americans, even referring to Mr. Trump only as “Candidate #1” in renewal applications despite noting that he was now the president-elect and then the president."
Did the application identify that dossier was paid by a “Candidate #2”?
4
So, now Trump is releasing classified documents pertaining to national security. And he's doing so, because in his mind, the FBI's probe into the Russian attack on our democracy is a criticism of him and his presidency.
Doesn't anyone in Congress understand that acute sensitivity to criticism, however small, is intolerable to a narcissist--to a person such as Trump?
It is clear that Trump has a significant emotional disorder. That disorder is damaging our country's national security.
Where are those in Congress who willing to stand against this? Perhaps our electoral processes have become so corrupt that we are now electing people who refuse to place country above personal ambition. Are we at fault?
27
@micheal Brousseau
Don't you wonder what classified information he gave Putin. I tell ya, Trump is a traitor who would sell out his country for a hotel in Moscow.
30
The warrant process worked as it should. Page was investigated for cooperation with Russian operatives. When no evidence was found the investigation ended. All this hoohaw is nonsense!
1
I would be interested if the Republican majority in the House has the spine to finally censure Nunes and strip him of his chairmanship for 1) blatant campaign finance corruption and 2) subverting for his own purposes the role of an investigative committee meant to protect American democratic institutions. I doubt it even though his transgressions are not merely for personal financial gain, like those of Newt Gingrich, but implicate the national security of the United States.
25
Where is the "damage" to Trump? His approval rating is still at about 42% and his supporters don't care if he perpetually lies. They have completely bought into the Witch Hunt theme, so there is no need to let let the facts get in the way here. The "rational" wing of the Republican Party (Rubio, Flake, Corker, Kasich, etc.) doesn't control the party - Trump and his toadies do. The FBI can't save our country- but perhaps elections will.
43
The Russians trying to influence our elections (they do, as we do theirs) is of far less importance than whether our institutions, the FBI, Justice Department, and FISA courts, are being used for political purposes. The FISA court is a virtual rubber stamp, rarely refusing warrants. Parsing what they were told about the Steele dossier is disingenuous. Carter Page has not been indicted while many others subsequently have. Trump can be forgiven if he thinks the FBI is out to get him when high ranking members explicitly say so, and the FBI does stuff like this. Trump claimed he was surveilled, and it appears to have been true. Obama knew of all this and said he didn't want to interfere because of how it would have looked. In other words, to protect the Democratic brand, he allowed our election to be compromised without saying anything because he thought Clinton would win. And the Times and their readers have no problem with this because if it is anti-Trump, it is OK. If our democracy is at risk, it is not because of Trump but because of the un-democratic reaction to him.
7
@Epistemology
When you claim that Trump was surveilled, do you mean personally targeted, or perhaps caught at times talking to someone who was? Do you think that a separate FISA warrant existed for him specifically?
3
@Epistemology That was some Cirque Du Soleil level contortions you just did to support Trump. I'm not even mad, I'm kind of impressed.
7
@Epistemology You can't have it both ways. Did Obama personally order Page to be surveilled? If not, there was no political motivation in doing so, unless you think the FBI was after Page for political reasons. They were doing what they normally do, and I believe independently of what Obama thought or wanted. Obama did try to interfere but Mitch McConnell wouldn't work with him (you can fault him for this but you can't say he didn't do anything). The Russian interference thing did come out prior to the election BTW.
Now, law enforcement in general pushing the limits of what they are allowed or even going above it is an important issue in general, but Page was treated no differently than anyone else just because he was affiliated with the Trump campaign. Contrast this to Trump's actions who is playing politics with law enforcement explicitly. IMO in politics it's always about the lesser evil and the Obama administration is less evil than Trump's.
4
It doesn't matter that what says is the opposite of the truth. His supporters will believe what he says is the truth regardless of the evidence.
11
How many people from one campaign have had so many indictments? How can this not implicate the person at the top? Accountability is a thing of the past, like so many other values.
28
This man Trump lives in an alternate universe. He interprets news as he sees fit regardless of its true content. He colors any adverse reporting with blatant cries of 'fake news', or he distorts that same reporting as vindication of his agenda no matter the truth of his claim. He never offers evidence or proof of his claims. Trump often promises timely clarification of his statements--then does not deliver.
Trump survived in life by persistent bullying, and thinks that posture will always win for him. Maybe he's right. After all look at the electorate he has already convinced.
11
It seems that this report bends over backwards to be nonpolitical not mentioning the names of organizations or candidates. it was approved by four Republican judges who also seemed only interested in being nonpolitical even though they could read between the lines and see where reports were generated. Republicans claim that to be fair these judges and investigators needed to show political motivations thus compromising the investigation and its purpose which was to investigate possible treason and Russian connections. More things will come out, but it appears that the FISA court made a perfectly reasonable decision to allow the investigation.
18
There will be ample recordings and other forms of evidence released that will leave no doubt that Page had considerable contact with known Russian operatives. Mueller, DOJ, the FBI, intelligence agencies, and the judges who approved the FISA warrants are neither fools nor political hacks. Trump does things like this to give the base ammo and talking points. Trump's tactics are not working for a clear majority of Americans.
33
@HighPlainsScribe
To keep up the surveillance, the FBI had to give the FISA judge new information on Carter Page. This means that additional damaging information has be found.
6
Sure. plenty of evidence but no indictment yet.
It is like investigating someone for murder and indict him for speeding.
Because he says it is so, does not make it so, except in the minds of that 35 or so percent who will follow him over the cliff and of course the Republicans in Congress. Our only hope is that the judiciary and the next congress will not fall into that group.
29
It has been painfully apparent for some time now that Trump will only become more erratic and unhinged as Mueller's investigation continues.
In the future, candidates for the presidency should be required to:
1. Submit to independent mental and physical exams.
2. Pass a basic civics test.
3. Release tax returns for the past 20 years.
4. Have an extensive background check to determine prior problematic associations.
74
@Greengage
All reasonable requirements that the existing process used by the voters can enforce. We chose Donald J Trump despite ample evidence of his narcissistic personality and obesity. It was perfectly clear prior to the election that Trump had fundamental misunderstandings of basic civics. It was perfectly clear that Donald had no intent of releasing his tax returns and that one giant reason was a dubious $900M write off from his casino bankruptcy that should have been a tax bill instead of a write off. The Trumps freely admitted that they did a lot of business with Russia and if you listened to the Howard Stern show or the Access Hollywood tape there was no doubt about problematic associations. Yes the Trump presidency has revealed many weaknesses that could be removed by new legislation that we now realize we desperately need. But such legislation will not address the underlying (pun intended) problems that gave us President Donald J Trump.
2
5. Be able to form a sentence.
3
@Rusty Carr All my suggestions would have prevented Trump from becoming a candidate. Can't vote for a non-runner.
So Trump is hurling lies about the Carter Page investigation in order to divert attention from his lurching week of damage control after the Helsinki summit. At the same time he is lobbing violent rhetoric at Iran, and moving to dismantle the Endangered Species Act. While also rekindling the racist NFL kneeling distraction. As North Korea makes his ludicrous claims about having eliminated any threat there more wrong by the day. After NATO and the E.U. move forward on securing their borders and economic security without the partnership of the U.S. for the first time in well over 50 years. Meanwhile Trump is charging the U.S. taxpayer top dollar for every service rendered to his entire clutch of staff every time he travels to one of his own resorts for the weekend, as foreign visitors grace his properties with their business in order to curry favor. Oh yeah, and he is under active investigation for cooperating with a Russian effort to influence the election and obstruction of justice for trying to hamper the investigation. And yesterday he put quotes around "justice" when he mentioned the Justice Department.
I'd like to remind my American friends that all of these actions are being taken by your president. The president of the United States of America, Donald J. Trump. It's been a year and a half and I still struggle to believe it.
134
@Rob
Believe it Rob. It's true.
1
@Rob
You don't have to remind us. We wake up to this reality every day. Those of us who love our country and it's institutions are sick with disgust and horrified that we have leadership in our government who instead of protecting this country and it's people as they were sworn to do, take actions that further his egregious acts against our nation. The voters who support this been fed propaganda for years by these people and a media machine, have been manipulated by feeding their hate, ignorance and fear as a means of garnering their support. They have been misled and believe that these leaders have their best interests at heart, not being used to gain and keep power. We on the left have failed our country as well. We have been complacent and mislead by our leadership as well. That our leadership has been idle or complicit while the right has actively pushed big money into our politics to the benefit of both sides, is just as destructive to our freedoms. Add to that, the voting record of the citizens of this country is appalling, and shows a willingness to abdicate responsibility for the country to others. We take our freedoms for granted and have been complacent due to our laziness and leadership that does not demand we vote. Our civic duties are not a priority. We all own this mess and if we must step up and fight to take our country back from the rich and power hungry. We must vote and demand truth and acts, in service of the Constitution, and the people they serve. VOTE
The president can lay the blame for this embarrassment squarely at the feet of Devin Nunes. It was Nunes who led the Republican cavalry charge to destroy the Mueller investigation that resulted in his "memo" that later proved to be unsupported and flawed. The president and Nunes deserve each other but the American people don't deserve either one of them.
103
The basic problem with Trump's propaganda is that it is not based on facts which are true or very difficult to verify. After a while, no one believes the propagandist. The more in control Trump is of the message, the less effective his messages are.
11
Let's hope that Nunes' opponent in the upcoming election, Andrew Janz, can persuade enough voters that such a liar is unworthy of a Congressional seat that Nunes gets booted out. The FISA court documents prove what many already knew: Nunes is a shameless, bald-faced liar.
But what about all the other Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee? They have now been revealed and proven to be equally eager to lie about national security and intelligence matters, in order to spread a conspiracy theory that accused the Deputy Attorney General of the United States and the FBI of plotting to undermine Trump, both as candidate and as president. And they're in control of Congress. The only way to clean this House is to vote against every single Republican in every district.
44
One has to wonder as Russians with some contact to the Trump campaign continue to fall out of the woodwork, why the president hasn't given a major speech delineating the problem and what his administration intends to do before the midterms to secure our democrocratic process.
It just boggles the mind that we are fighting war on another front and DJT barely recognizes the fact much less does anything to stop it.
The inability to clearly see the content of this FISA warrant application for what it is simply adds more fuel to the blaze.
The complicity of all involved is staggering.
22
We are leaderless.
2
America will either continue as a democratic republic, or it will have a king named Donald.
It is mainly in the hands of the Republican Party and we will hold them accountable.
54
@rich we will hold them accountable, I hope so. If that is to happen then congress needs to shift at midterms- get out the vote.
2
Unfortunately, 100% of Trump voters couldn't be bothered with "analysis" like this.
85
@day owl
The analysis is necessary.
The message sent to the opposite side will be more focused hopefully.
The basic objective is to get rid of their saviour without them doing nothing more than waiting for their next saviour. One should not forget that Trump's message works because some people need it.
4
@day owl I agree with you completely, but maybe the analysis will get through to some Republican members of Congress? Those are the people who count here. One can hope.
6
@day owl So this is what is meant when it is said that Democracy has within itself the seeds of its own destruction. Republican voters care more about Party than about Country. The "Founding Fathers" never envisioned this Republican Party with Donald Trump as its president.
1
It's actually confusing and misleading to keep representing the idea that 'truth' to Trump means what it does to the rest of us. Really the rest of us, even most of the GOP toadies (who do know).
Trump is a sociopath. One of his features is that whatever he says, it's the truth, to him. He's a megalomaniac: whatever vision of the world he imagines, is simply 'true.' If someone--a person, a newspaper--says something counter to his vision of the world, that's 'fake news.'
And to him, that's right, because his vision simply doesn't include anything he doesn't want to be true.
Almost nothing Trump says is 'true' according to the standard definition. It's the World According to Trump.
Herodotus would have had a field day with Trump. And so will history. And it will have quite a lot to say about our keeping this maniac in office, too. Perhaps when we all look back at history, with smug hindsight--the 1930s in Germany, for example--we should change our eyeglasses.
25
Representatives of the GOP needs to grow a semblance of a spine, preferably as soon as possible. They should also remember that their job is not to further themselves but that they work for the people and the laws of the land.
19
Devin Nunes belongs behind bars. I hope I live long enough to read a breaking news item that Robert Mueller has indicted Nunes for obstruction of justice. Just for openers.
The GOP knows Nunes and Trump are in bed with this Carter Page drama. They just don’t care.
125
Well, the release of these documents sure didn't help Trump's cause. What do to? Threaten Iran. That ought to do it.
149
@RNS: You nailed - distraction and deflection, Trump's two of three biggest tools aside from lying.
Will the Fake News channel that supported this latest Gaslighting Over People fake story line for months and months now issue a formal retraction, apology and correction to its cult viewers ?
No, of course not.
They will look to the next new Republican fake news story and blast it from the rooftops as 45% of American voters continue to subscribe to North-Korean-type loudspeaker propaganda throughout Trumpstan.
Note to Trumpistan voters: you are living in a destructive right-wing, authoritarian echo chamber that warms the cockles of Joseph Goebbell's heart; it will not end well.
314
@Socrates, when full-blown tariff war with China and other countries comes on, leading to job loss, high inflation, loss of healthcare, bad air leads to more health issues, ....then tears might shed. Americans hate "socialist healthcare system", yet have no problems with Trump embracing Putin. what gives ???
1
@Socrates
Treason and "The Emoluments Clause, Impeachment, And Trump: An Explainer" Huffpost need to be better understood in Trumpistan.
Vote November and text for Beto -now.
2
Sorry to say, Socrates, but few Trump voters have any idea who Joseph Goebbells was - Heck, most Trump supporters couldn't find Germany on a map.
2
Why did trump declassify those documents? If he knew the content of those, why would he do that? He isn't that bright, is he?
102
@Armo For Trump's supporters, it doesn't matter what is actually in the application. He will tell them that it exonerates him, and they'll believe him.
10
@Armo
Trump believes that his base will only read his Tweets.
And, he is probably right.
6
@Armo
He did not read and understand the documents, since they are waaaay beyond Twitter length. He simply thought they would help him.
The only way the American people are going to get a real and thorough investigation of Russian interference into our elections and Russian penetration of political organizations is to have Democratic majorities on congressional committees responsible for conducting those investigations. The Republicans have proven over, and over, and over again that they will choose party over country every time. Come November, VOTE!
70
Once again the unethical "missuse" of declassification for political gain blows on their face. Unfortunately they will find a way to spin, to lie, to justify and to gain public support from the FOX audience out of this. Otherwise they would have learnt from their prior bad acts.
10
None of this matters because, once uttered, such accusations by trump and his enablers become hard, proven facts in the minds of his "base," and no amount of evidence to the contrary will change their perceptions.
35
When Trump doubles down with a straight face, it doesn't mean he's not lying. It means he's playing poker, and bluffing the bluffable.
14
@CED - So you're saying that POTUS, the man who managed to bankrupt his casino, is gambling. Interesting.
#Thetruthshallsetyoufree
1
No matter how much Trump, Nunes and the rest what is still called the GOP to cover their lies and deceit, the truth will catch up with them, sooner or later. Hopefully (much much sooner.)
38
Devin Nunes IS distorted in his zeal and inept attempts to help Trump. His reasoning is sloppy and biased at every turn. He is a poor Chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.
29
@Elizabeth I will have to a chance to vote him out of office in November. However, there are still too many here who support him. Janz needs all the help and support he can get.
13
“The only plot is to interfere in the election by the Russians,” says Mr Rubio.
That and the evident plot by Republicans to block any investigation into the matter. Makes one wonder why they are doing this ...
45
@David
Follow the NRA money. Oops, recently changed IRS rules don't require NRA to list their "corporate" donors.
I smile every time I hear the Republicans invoke the bias argument. The way I see it, the Republicans took the bias argument away from themselves when the very biased Devin Nunes unrecused himself.
19
...four judges "appointed by Republicans" Bushes don't count... if they were the appointing personnel... the skinny
third rail facts of of 9/11 is had and known ... in fine point detail .. all of this folderol is purely a defensive screen and deflection against the reveal of the most dastardly corruptions and scandals in American history.. It takes skill knowledge and patience to land big fish .. the bait has been taken ..
the effort in landing will soon begin ( but not too far in advance of the mid-term elections)
11
The footnote describing the genesis of the Steele dossier and its possible bias was a page long. As is standard, Americans are not named. Trump is referred to as Candidate #1 and Clinton/DNC is referred to as an entity seeking to discredit candidate #1. The possible bias is clearly stated and acknowledged.
Mere months ago, Devin Nunes and his GOP colleagues were rampaging across our TV screens accusing the mostly Republican FBI led by mostly Republican top leadership with a current head appointed by President Trump himself of deliberately concealing this possible bias.
Rather, Nunes himself was deliberately concealing the truth: that the warrant was proper, alerted the court to the possible bias and the truth of the genesis of the dossier, and that the Republican judges nevertheless granted the request, finding that the FBI's other evidence, their prior history with Steele as a talented asset providing solid intel, their previous concerns about Carter Page dating back years before the campaign and the quality of the FISA application itself merited granting this request.
Nunes continues to deliberately mislead the American public. Currently his obstruction of justice seems to rival that of Trump himself. Given what he said, and the fact that he is now proven to have lied, it's time for Paul Ryan to act. Nunes should be stripped of his House Intelligence Committee role.
Now Nunes is going after the redactions! The man has no shame. This is the true witch hunt.
201
@Joanna Stasia
"As is standard, Americans are not named. Trump is referred to as Candidate #1 and Clinton/DNC is referred to as an entity seeking to discredit candidate #1. "
Orwell would be proud of you. So you think this identifies the DNC and Clinton? In what universe, on what planet?
Nunes' memo was completely correct.
1
@Joanna Stasia, may be Nunes hopes to take over Michael Cohen's position to be next Trump's fixer, after he is kicked out of congress by his constituents.
2
Trump is desperately seeking to draw attention away from his meeting with Putin. The sad part is he already got his soundbite. The pro-Trump news media will run the story with what President Trump says about the released documents. Not what the documents actually contain. Viewers will only see the headline "Trump lash's out over illegal surveillance." The typical Fox News audience won't know or doesn't care that Trump's statements are factually inaccurate. Meanwhile, another major Trump political scandal is dumped from the news cycle prematurely. I don't see why any respectable journalist wastes ink reporting on what Trump says anymore. Just stick to the facts instead.
72
Sad day for democracy. Trump's attacks on law enforcement and our intelligence agencies is literally sickening. He is just like a malignant kid who burn his parents house down because he can't get what he wants.
92
Trump, along with his Republican enablers, are continually in the habit of beginning with an end goal ---the FBI spied on the Trump campaign---and then engage in all kinds of mental, verbal, legal, and legislative contortions to fit the end into a means---documents proving legitimate grounds for wiretapping--- that reveal the exact opposite of the end.
10
You rightly point out the deceptions now seeing light, but then you quote the lies, sustaining the false narrative. That isn't balanced, it's ridiculous.
12
So, right at the top of the piece is the usual deflection, deny and lay blame where may not belong in this instance-with the Justice Department in collusion with "Crooked Hillary Clinton". And his masses, along with the comedy entertainers on Fox "News" are giddy at each tweet that lacks any semblance of truth. Perhaps "Daffy Donald Trump" should take a deep breath and have someone finger read the content of the documents and realize there was no help at all for his nemesis, "Crooked Hillary".
Trump needs to refocus on where the servers are.
6
Trump was installed by voter suppression, using a Red (Republican) computer program called "Interstate Crosscheck". Trump did not "win". He is not "President". The Russian sabotage helped but was not necessary. The Reds have burned the last straw of American democracy. Our voting system is completely corrupt.
16
The republicans that made the misleading statements did it to obstruct the Mueller investigation. They will be found guilty of obstruction of justice. The rest of the Trumpies will, in addition to obstruction of justice, be found guilty of treason and conspiracy to commit treason.
38
@tbsThat day can't come soon enough.
1
Memo to Devin Nunes:
Dear Sir:
Truth is a sometimes painful corrective to lies, misrepresentations, and blatant acts that look like un-patriotic activities.
Only cowards fear the effects of such truth.
Your public comments are required sir!!!
One of tens of thousands of American citizens who ask you to now speak to such truths.
19
@John Eudy, like Trump, Nunes can see no truth, hear no truth, speak no truth and know no truth ! wonder if his constituents understand these.
So.. how long will you put up with this guy?. There is a lot of talk about russians these days, but the leaders in their soviet alter ego was sensible enough remove Chrustjov from office when he simply put became too hot to handle. I see a lot of Chrustjov mentality in Trump, have not yet seen the banging of shoes on a table.
Please remember that the U.S.A is not a kingdom with a god-almighty leader, it is still a democracy.
26
@Ingemar Johansson -- to use a boxing analogy, the US president is like Floyd Patterson going up against your namesake in '59 and the entire world knows how that ended. The president's glass jaw is no match for your "toonder" and lightning.
1
People who believe they are divine creations never grow up, and tend to be dishonest about everything. Service to bullies is all that gives meaning to their pathetic little lives.
12
"If you can get them to believe your lies, you can get them to commit your atrocities." - Voltaire
America's greatest enemy is ignorance.
193
@Ed Mahala
Not just ignorant but, willfull ignorance.
@Ed Mahala: and indifference. I have friends who think voting is a waste of time and all politicians are the same. They sell our democracy down the river just as much as the complicit GOP voters/supporters. No matter how much I try to talk sense into them that our democracy is in danger of turning into an autocracy, that we may lose our precious freedoms, that our government is of the people, by the people, for the people and we absolutely need to vote Dem to save it, they still use whataboutisms and false equivalences to justify their non-vote. I don't know what's more frustrating - trying to talk sense into a GOP voter or an uninterested non-voter.
1
@Ed Mahala
It is worse than that. The Trump supporters, Trump himself and many of the GOP leaders are not only ignorant but they wallow in their embrace of ignorance.
To remove Trump ASAP....and the past and immediate damage
he has caused and continues to cause to our nation....is to
do this:
Hold to task those in the House and the Senate who support
Trump's actions and his continuing lies:.....shame those who
are only supporting Trump to save their seats in the House and
in the Senate....because if the Fourth Estate concentrates on
every Trump insane tweet ...we will never make those who could vote Trump out of office accountable...
Go after Trump's lemmings....and keep their feet to the fire..
The Fourth Estate will not be able to control Trump....but they
can expose the GOP jackals who are doing so.
22
The United States Senate, under Republican leadership, has become the an embodiment of anti-Joe McCarthyism. Who woulda thunk it?
5
@Quoth The Raven ... So sorry for the early morning typo. Should have read: The United States Senate, under Republican leadership, has become the embodiment of anti-Joe McCarthyism. Who woulda thunk it?
A Republican with integrity, once again, is shown to be a mythical creature like the unicorn. Are all Republicans LIARS like their pretender to the presidency?
19
@Robert Capuzzi - Yes.
When I was younger I lazily adopted my parent's politics but found out that the only way to be a Republican was to deny facts and remain willfully ignorant. I'm ashamed that it took me way too long to realize this. I left the party after G.W.'s first term.
11
“Shaky foundations”???
How about “deliberately misleading and false”?
Devin Nunes should be nowhere near the HPSCI and this proves it. He’s working against Congress and against his oath of office.
Remove Nunes now.
And the NYTimes editorial staff needs to do much much better with these headlines!
Good grief.
89
@R
"“Shaky foundations”???
How about “deliberately misleading and false”?"
x100!
Not 'fair and balanced' if Trump lies are not called out as just that.
2
The dossier was funded and started by Paul Singer a Republican hedge fund manager not the Clinton campaign.
43
Both parties have problems with the truth but Republicans win the contest hands down when it comes to lying.
7
Since when does accuracy matter to this Administration. They can control what others say accusing them of fake news, but when it turns out that they are the arbiters of "fake news" they take no responsibility. Just as Trump takes none when he is found to be a philanderer. Now we read even more frightening that this President is probably laundering money for Putin, and that the NRA is as well. And that one step more, the Christian right (who are a shadowy group, not named) are buddy buddy with Putin. And yet the President has 88 % of Republicans on his side. They adore him.
11
@JHM
they adore for three simple reasons.
he is white.
he is not female.
he is not a democrat.
Showing more of the deck of cards, the FBI would clearly have been remiss NOT to surveil Page! Despite J Edgar and all his illegal wiretapping of Americans, these republicans seem more Russian than American at this point. We should buy trump and Nunes and their families one-way tickets to Moscow if they like Putin so much.
23
Some of us recall that the comic hero Superman fought for “Truth, Justice and the American Way!” The latest, and long-overdue disclosure of the FISA application that guts the falsehoods of the Nunes “majority” memo, simply validates what many rightfully suspected was a no more than a flimsy political gambit by his Republican Congressional accomplices to support Trump’s bogus narrative. The substance of the FISA application shows the Nunes report for what it is and what it isn’t. What it is, is another deliberate lie. What it isn’t, is the product of hard work by elected members of Congress. Unfortunately, the predictable partisan response to yet another revelation of the lengths to which Trump and his accomplices will lie to cover up their treachery will be a big, fat “who cares?” or “it’s all Obama’s and the liberals’ fault” or “fake news!”. Back to Superman - without truth, there will never be justice. Without truth and justice, kiss “the American Way” good-bye. To quote DJT: “You know, I know it, everybody knows it. Or maybe not.”
9
You mean Donald Trump and his toady Nunes are lying? What a surprise. But we will continue to focus on the Liar in Chief's traitorous conduct so clearly illuminated by his meeting with Putin and by the craven Republicans who collude with Trump rather than pursue impeachment.
16
The President is convinced his base will believe anything he tells them. He has said the media is the enemy of the people and cannot be trusted, therefore if he says something that disputes the media, he expects his base to trust him and ignore news reports to the contrary.
And the most amazing thing is that led by Fox News and toadies like Devin Nunes, they do.
6
The Trump Bubble: Deny everything, even if they have pictures.
If you don't like the factual narrative, just make one up. Trump is either the luckiest person on the planet or we are the most unlucky country in the world. I suspect both are true.
History will not be kind to the Trump Administration's legacy.
8
The thing is that those who support the president blindly and believe every word he says will not be swayed by this release. The focus for them will be that information from Steele was used ergo all is tainted. It is so disheartening.
6
Trump's weekend response to the government's release of documents showing the grounds by which the FBI acted upon an aspect of the 'Russian-meddling', the obscure involvement of Carter Page, has certainly revved up something (the Mueller investigation) President Trump's pit bull attorney Rudy Giuliani-months ago mind you, proclaimed just weeks away from being over.
And with the Fall-election now less than100 days 'till the voting starts, Trump's lack of discipline continues to show itself. His inability to ignore the February-Nunes thing-just not letting it shrink away into the crowded news cycle the latest example.
And if he can't control his simple Tweeting, what's he doing one on one with the likes of Putin.
7
Just another disingenuous effort in a long long line of deception put forth by this man of no credibility. I could understand a person trying to bend the truth a bit on occasion and maybe even be okay with it. But to do it flagrantly and each day is eons beyond acceptable.
8
Putin has compromised our president. Since Trump lacks any sense of moral decency, he would only be concerned about being shown to be clearly breaking the law. Putin may well have proof that Trump broke some law, or more likely has proof that he colluded personally in the election meddling.
11
So painfully obvious from the beginning that Nunes and the House GOP have been covering up incriminating information. These men are criminals who , hopefully, will in time be held to account in federal court.
10
Does this administration really believe that its constituent millions of American citizens are so lacking in intelligence that they would take the word of a man whose acquaintance with the truth is non-existent ?
Carter Paige , a loose cannon and certified ditz , has been under FISA surveillance since 2013. He had multiple contacts with the Putin administration and at one time , actually described himself as an advisor to the Kremlin.
If this type of behavior , playing footsie with an avowed enemy , is not worthy of surveillance what is ?
What is with this subservient relationship with Putin and other dictators of note? Trump was eviscerated by both Kim IL Jun and Putin in their respective meetings and yet characterized both meetings as an outstanding success.
Are we actually unable to believe our very eyes and ears in favor of the unending propaganda and lies emanating from the Oval Office and the Trumpian sycophants that surround it ?
It is a disgrace and an embarrassment to us and our allies to be so disrespected and it is well past time to wake up and eradicate this terrible stain that has tainted America and the world.
13
@Laurence Voss, unfortunately his base CAN'T see the irony. such as the Evangelical Christians, even though they have to hold their nose when it comes to Trump's behavior, violating many of the 10 commandments they hold dearly to their hearts, yet they will overlook that because he serves their purposes: anti-abortion , anti-immigrants....."ends justify the means".
1
“though he admitted in February that he had not read the application documents. “
The toxic effects of ignorance are boundless.
Nunes or Trump, take your pick. Both refuse to read, reason, or behave as citizens in a civil society.
Society itself has an obligation to shun these malignant agents and protect itself from existential damage.
Vote, but until then, shun.
20
What happened to, "If you see something, say something."? Were the Papadopolous revelation along with Carter Page's history to be ignored, because of their political party affiliation?
Devin Nunes (like Sean Hannity) will stop at nothing. They will compromise US intelligence, reveal sources and methods and create whatever damage to this country is necessary to remain in power. Win at any cost.
When this administration ends, as all inevitably do, action needs to be taken to investigate the actions of these perpetrators as well as to strengthen legislation to prevent such enablers from ever being able to hold US democracy hostage again to partisan self-interest.
20
@David K. GREENWALD, good luck dealing with all those "Federalist Society" dyslexic judges.
Sadly, Fox News will not report this reality, and the Trump sheep will not let reality affect their unwavering support for their guy. As long as Trump appears to work to make life harder for immigrants and dark-skinned people he will be keeping his campaign promises.
10
Perhaps Paul Ryan will close the Devin Nunes Detective Agency after the memo and hearing debacles. What Nunes, Jordan, and Meadows are doing is an utter travesty.
21
@Njlatelifemom, fat chances ! Paul Ryan and family sustained on welfare provided by the US government. now he is in power, he wants to make it harder for people like his old self to get similar benefits. and he has no spine.
1
"Republicans lie in pathetic attempt to cover up for incompetent and unqualified President" is no longer even worthy of a headline it happens so often, especially in the House, but it is important to remind voters of this every moment until November.
Hopefully the voters will begin to correct this tragic and unprecedented mistake by supporting the Democrats.
12
The Republican greed knows no limits when it comes to exploit the nature and earth even if it means threatening the lives and livelihoods of the forest dwelling communities or sending the rare
species of the endangered wildlife to extinction with catastrophic ecological consequences. The planned dilution of the Endangered species Act just illustrates the point.
6
Devin Nunes admits that he never read any part of the memo. He’s the chairman of the committee for gosh sakes. That’s part of his job. I realize that volumes of paper probably cross his desk and that he can’t read everything.
Yet, the topic in the memo is important and relevant. At the very least, Nunes is a very poor manager, and has no business running the House Intelligence Committee.
62
"But in respect after respect, the newly disclosed documents instead corroborated rebuttals by Democrats on the panel who had seen the top-secret materials and accused Republicans of mischaracterizing them to protect the president."
This isn't the first time the president has been caught with his pants down, making his conspiracy theory rantings in response to what he thinks released data show seem more bizzarre than normal.
Thank God it was released, even if the action was unprecedented. It re-exposes Devin Nunes as the connniving fool he is, and undercuts these presidential tweets.
The president's obsession with looking under every rock to justify his usually made-up claims is really hurting our national security. In addition to the public learning details of the FISA rationale, it is now available to everyone, even Trump's top autocrat pal.
Yes, there are no "sources and methods" leaked, but that's besides the point, given all the news about the references and widespread knowledge of who "person A" etc. is.
When you have a president with such power issues, his nonstop tinkering in matters of justice is a very dangerous thing.
Give him an inch, he takes a mile, calling DOJ "My Justice Department," acting as if it's just an office down the hall.
The worst thing the whole sordid episode reveals is how the president can't be really embarrassed by this memo, since he never fully understood its contents in the first place.
172
It is also a very important point that each time the FISA Court was asked for permission, there was a wealth of new documentation as to what was being obtained from the monitoring - to wit:
66 pages in the 1st application
79 additional pages in the 2nd application
91 additional pages in the 3rd application
101 additional pages in the 4th application
Prez. not-Obama violates his Oath to protect and defend the Constitution when he suggests that such a lengthy, legal process producing tangible results was in anyway illegal.
Such Tweets are merely another manifestation of what psychologists know to be projecting.
"The state of our Union is lawless." - Rep. Eric Swalwell, (D-Ca), Jan. 30 2018
"If conservatives become convinced that they cannot win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy." - David Frum, former Dubya speechwriter
290
If this is Trump and Nunes idea of vindication, then they should plan to rejoice when the Mueller findings are made public. For those who barely recall the Steele Dossier, now is a good time to read it again, perhaps highlighting the many allegations that have been substantiated by mainstream media and Mueller himself. It remains a truly stunning roadmap of how America got into this nightmare and provides a trove of reasons why Putin very likely has power over Donald Trump.
448
@Doc Yes, Putin does have power over Trump, even if it is only the ability to ridicule him in the eyes of thoughtful voters. For this power at the least encompasses all his phony business dealings there...just like Manafort and the other American traitors, I am very confident Carter Page is among this number.
6
@Doc, I did just that a few weeks ago and current events and findings make the dossier crystal clear. Steele had it covered and was right to be so alarmed.
Sadly, the GOP chose to discredit Steele.
When all is said and done the GOP roots of corruption will prove to be very deep.
4
@Doc
Trump famously said he could shoot someone on 5th Avenue and it wouldn't matter to his base.
This is just another iteration of that initial statement: Trump can say that black is white, or the moon is green cheese, and it wouldn't matter to his base.
Alternative facts and alternate reality are strong in Trumplandia.
But, the fact is that there is still, no information presented that would suggest that Carter Page was ever a Kremlin asset. That's a pretty high bar that would be required for the approval of the surveillance of an American citizen and the FBI and the FISA court failed on 4 separate occasions to produce such evidence. So, two years later, there's still no evidence that this whole investigation, which later morphed into the Mueller investigation, was ever based on any real threat to the United States.
3
@Michael, 4 Republican appointed judges, sitting on a secret court and on multiple occasions, found valid reasons to approve the warrant, and they have un-redacted copies of the applications. You, I assume, do not.
1
@Michael, you do understand that every single intelligence agency in the US, as several of our foreign friends (if we still have any) have confirmed that the Putin-led Russian government attempted successfully to sway the election of 2016 and install Trump as president. I consider that action as a real threat to our democracy.
3
@Michael
Well, other than the multiple indictments and guilty pleas by Trump connected advisers and campaign officials, no......
1
Trump is always the first to rant and rave and
open his mouth without thinking. I guess thinking
is for lesser beings than Trump because we know
already Trump knows the most of anybody on Earth
and that nobody knows more. Not even God?
I think Trump and God need a summit real soon
or America and the world are in deep trouble.
But Trump cares only about himself and would
probably claim he "knows more than God and I'll prove it".
Such an attitude could be really, really dangerous to
America and the world even if it appears to get positive
results in the short term. Having a loud mouthed bully, narcissist and megalomaniac as President can't be a good thing no matter what "get's accomplished".
25
"He claimed without evidence"
That sentence should be on Trump's tombstone. Are there four words in the English language that better characterize this man's life?
416
@Ed L. There are two words that better characterize him. "He lied."
10
@Ed L.
"Are there four words in the English language that better characterize this man's life?"
Yes.
Donald Trump lied. AGAIN.
1
@Ed L., For the stonecutter's ease, how about just, "Liar."
2
“Now we can see that the footnote disclosing Steele’s possible bias takes up more than a full page in the applications, so there is literally no way the FISA Court could have missed it,” he wrote on the blog Lawfare. “The F.B.I. gave the court enough information to evaluate Steele’s credibility.”
Nunes put forth lies to discredit the FISA warrants and the Mueller investigation broadly.
So for the first time, ever, a FISA application is made public. All to defend Trump. And it disproves what Trump and Nunes say.
644
@Dan Nunes should be removed from his chairmanship and then from Congress altogether. He is a scurrilous liar and a Trump stooge. The debacle where he went to the WH to deliver but in fact to get the damning info is more than enough evidence of a lackey stooge. Totally disgraceful.
1
So the surprise here is that Nunes and his GOP cohorts simply created a biased and largely fictional account of the warrant application to discredit the FBI and to advance Trump?
For reasons simply to retain political control, the GOP has been lying steadily and enabling Trump since his nomination. There is really nothing surprising here, but it is good to have confirmation.
That Trump will claim that the released and well redacted application supports his view further exemplifies his disdain for truth. He has said that "you can tell people anything and they will believe it."
That is the crux of the whole Trump problem.
134
I think you mean the "Republican problem". They have been lying since Reagan's genial voodoo economics lies. The only change is the brazenness of their lies. Oh, and at least Reagan smiled a lot.
11
Why does nearly every article fail to mention that the research company was initially hired by REPUBLICANS doing opposition research on trump at the beginning of the campaign? This is significant, is it not?
681
agree 1000%. Just yesterday I saw it referred to as the "notorious democratic funded" dossier. Easy enough to research it and find out it started with the GOP.
13
@Avatar: It may not matter to Trump who sought research to discredit him..he wildly attacks all critics.
3
@Avatar
True enough, but it was the Democrats who later funded the research that resulted in the Steele Dossier, the #1 talking point in the "fake news" defense.
1
That sure looks like evidence that the FBI had a reason to look at Trump and crew before the Steele dossier. I wonder why the Republican House inquiry didn't note it when they presented their investigation's findings? Could their motivation in lying to the American people by exclusion be collusion perhaps? Vlad is that you again?
Vote every Republican out of Office.
372
@Jason
"I wonder why the Republican House inquiry didn't note it when they presented their investigation's findings?"
Devin Nunes ADMITTED that he had not read the document before he spewed his lies.
THAT is why. He just did not care what it said. He made it up as he went along.
I agree that we should vote every Republican out of office. They are just Trump's enablers and lap dogs.
8
Now all the usual Republican talking heads will be scrambling to come up with entirely new unsubstantiated claims of the persecution of their dear Don...that is until those claims are debunked as well.
Our esteem in the world has suffered under Trump but the Republican Party will be forever (I hope) damaged by it’s embrace, promotion, and defense of a charlatan sham president.
179
Devin Nunes never read the memo. Did he take the President at his word about the facts?
Wow, apparently Nunes is unable to read and come up with his own conclusions regarding the facts. He appears to be following the President's take on the events. His commentary,
Spin, rinse, repeat and ignore the facts that the Russians meddled in the elections.
Nunes does what is right for the Republican Party(Trump) and ignores what is right for the American people.
152
Nunes was a lying, cheating sack from jump street. The problem is that there have been so many acts of mendacity and greed it is hard to remember who Nunes even is. Now these monsters want to attack the Endangered Species Act!! Work, contribute, do what ever you can as hard as you can to take the House and Senate in November. Your children and your grandchildren's futures depend on it.
127
So Trump spouts inaccurate information? Nunes mis-spoke and was lying? Once again the Democrats were correct and truthful?
Thi article seems to think any of that matters. Facts and honesty and careful analysis mean nothing to the public. How is sounds and how it feels is most important.
Truthiness Trumps Truth, especially when it feels good.
23
Trump's consistency in being wrong (indeed, willfully wrong) about, well, everything, is a wonder to behold.
Trump has been galactically wrong about such matters as international trade, North Korea, the importance of NATO in preserving the world order, Putin and Russia, illegal U.S. immigration, and on and on. Thus, in the great scheme of things, his decision to declassify the surveillance memo that showed the FBI's actions were justified -- and the Republican's claims false -- was entirely predicable. Indeed, compared to his sins (noted above), this decision was relatively quaint.
Also entirely consistent is Trump's attempt to characterize everything he does -- as a "win." Claiming a "win" with respect to his decision to release the memo is but one minor example.
The sad fact is that Trump's consistent wrongness, and his consistent claims to the contrary, are so oft-repeated (by Trump) that for me, it is enough at this point just to read the headlines, because it is obvious what the content of any given story about him is going to be. I expect Trump to do precisely what he always does -- make the wrong decision and then claim a "win". I know he will not be talked out of whatever crazed decision he makes, I know the Republicans will not lift a finger to stop him, and I know his base will cheer.
It is frightening to me that I am no longer sufficiently frightened when I read about the latest Trump catastrophe.
18
"Shaky foundation" is a weird way to spell "LIES."
111
The torturous reasoning of both the Democratic and Republican descriptions of the FISA memo is curious. For example: yes, the Repubs skated around the fact that the application for surveillance did say the dossier was opposition research. Yet the Dems did their own odd spin: a “page-length explanation” of who paid for the dossier certainly was space enough to explicitly state it was paid for by the Clinton campaign.
All this nonsense could be easily cleared up by an unredacted release of the original FISA application and all the renewals. Until that happens we will just get these kinds of weird Dems said/Repubs said stories.
Governments need to keep some secrets, but when they govern only in secrecy do we get this kind of rubbish.
5
The dossier was originally requested and paid for by a Republican think tank. They did not want Trump to be the face of the Republican Party.
29
@David The Repubs told Fusion GPS to stop its research of Trump in May 2016, once it was clear he would be their nominee. Then the Clinton campaign hired Fusion (through a law firm). It was the part the Dems paid for that became relevant to the FBI FISA application. But all of this could have, and should have, been explained to the FISA judges. Remember that several news organizations were given the opportunity to publish the findings from the dossier, but nearly all passed on the offer. No one could verify the information collected. That the FBI would use the dossier at all demonstrates how reprehensible their actions were.
We have too many secrets in this republic of the people for the people to make sound judgements on who should be their representatives. This is how we get a Trump.
@David
Well stated, but why isn't there more mention of this-the 'dossier' originally the product of a Republican think tank?
This is about much more than simply Trump protecting his ego regarding his 2016 win. Trump very likely conspired to undermine our democracy and is doing everything in his power to keep it hidden.
596
@John McLaughlin Very likely? Where's your hard evidence? The federal government hasn't been able to produce any evidence of such a conspiracy even after over 2 years of investigation.
2
I don't think Trump's intent is to undermine democracy. It's just collateral damage caused by a self-possessed autocrat.
As much as Trump is a flawed president, much blame belongs to the Senate and House for enabling him. McConnell and Ryan have the ability to derail bad policies. They just don't have the political will.
10
@Michael "Hasn't been able to produce any evidence of such a conspiracy"? How about the indictments, the guilty pleas, and this week a trial? Are you so far out in left field that you don't see the correlation? Mr. Mueller will tie all this together when he releases the results of the investigation. Two years is nothing in time to what he is finding out. Other investigations by the Republicans were longer and produced nothing in the way of evidence of wrong doing. No indictments, no charges, nothing. The investigation is not complete and no prosecutor anywhere releases evidence until they have the mark completely tied up. It's coming.
Nunes was part of the Trump campaign. And the fact that Ryan didn't bother to remove him as the chair of the committee let alone from the committee altogether shows the whole GOP has complicit (Ivanka, this is the definition of 'complicit').
History will not be kind to these people
908
@Bos When Trump goes down, the swamp that supports him must be held accountable. Persons like Nunes, Gowdy, Jordan, Graham, McConnell, Ryan know they are at risk and hunker down to stop the Mueller Investigation and attack Hillary at every opportunity. She explicitly warned that Trump is Putin’s puppet.
13
@Bos
@Bos, I can't agree more concerning your mention of History and it's holding Trump and his sycophants in its crosshairs.
I also don't understand how shortsighted they all are, how they can ignore the notion their legacies will last forever, condemining their families, their decendants to forever trying to explain, defend their actions.
6
@Bos, and now Paul Ryan is going to meet with Trump to discuss pulling John Brennan’s security clearance? I never particularly liked Ryan but I did think better of him than this. I once thought Republicans in Congress were just spineless. Now I think they are deliberately conspiring with Trump to misdirect and obfuscate the truth. Even Lindsey Graham, a Senator, I once respected is taking the same path as Trump and Nunes. Just look at his comments from yesterday on the release of the FISA document. Is there an honest Republican left? Maybe Dan Coats. I really miss his style of governing even though I disagree with a lot of his views. He served in the Senate during a time that we could respect and trust members from both parties.
4
Give Donald Trump long enough and he will eventually shoot himself in the foot. His erratic behavior is not a quality we should support. Every day he does something else to undermine our lives, obscure the truth and stir confusion among the populace. How long can so many ignore his obvious danger to us.
791
@Livin the Dream? It is obvious that his base will ignore the danger to our democracy as long as they remain a minority. America will either continue as a democratic republic, or it will have a king named Donald.
It is mainly in the hands of the Republican Party and we will hold them accountable.
5
In Germany it took 13 years
7
@Livin the Dream
Congress is the danger, and someone commented that Nunes doesn't read. Basic requirement -- and why we got into the Iraq, etc. War.
Democracy?? Fixed voting machines in Ohio (Kerry vs. Bush). Electoral College still in place?? Gerrymandering galore. Blame an immoral unethical legally trained Congress and its various cohorts.
2
Facts don’t matter. Never did for this administration.
All of this posturing and multiple confabulations are to set the goalposts of public discussion and reporting. Keep repeating the lies and at least some will stick.
The operative word here is Orwellian.
630
Specific facts do matter rather than broad statements about Mr. Page were made.
Of particular interest is if the specific legal standards were met included:
1. Was due diligence done in communicating the credibility of the Dossier including I believe the dropping of Steele related to press leaking, any funding of the dossier specificsll originating from the DNC or HRC compaign.
2. Did Rob Rosenstein read the FISA extension he signed in that he apparently declined to answer Congress when asked.
3. I understand new evidence is required for a FISA extension. What specific new evidence of any was presented.
I expect Russia does what they can to interfere but the question WRT the investigation of the Trump admin here is not that. but if the Trump admin illegally conspired WRT the elections with the Russians. While other potential crimes were found, I believe nothing regarding illegal collusion between Trump admin and Russia has. The investigation has impeded a constitutionally elected president.
I remember reading “1984” many, many years ago, thinking this could never happen in America.
It IS happening. Up is down. Left is right. Rinse and repeat and eventually enough people will believe it. Scary.
2
What if we keep repeating the truth? Maybe some of that will stick.
2
It’s revealing that Mr. Trump declassified the FISA warrant on the understanding that it would support Devin Nunes’ characterization of it as politically motivated, a characterization enthusiastically amplified by Trump’s allies in conservative media. Had he read the document he would have known that it in fact showed the deception in Nunes’ claims. Trump’s attention span seems to the the length of a tweet, and he couldn’t be bothered with even that small degree of focus on a topic that clearly obsesses him.
And his supporters won’t care.
601
@ChrisM Your point is a good one. That Trump obviously did not read the FISA application, and the fact that his national security briefings are reduced to a few pages with a lot of pictures, make me wonder if he is functionally illiterate and uses a talk-to-text app to tweet. That would explain why some of his tweets are so error-prone, too.
3
His supporters don’t care. Our only hope to save this democracy is for enough other people to evaluate candidates and vote for people who will stand on principle, and for the truth, and not for this liar of a president.
1
@ChrisM Read? Not a chance.
1
If Page hadn't been the target of a counter-intelligence investigation by the FBI it would have been malpractice. That Trump attacks DOJ and the FBI to save his own skin is a violation of his oath of office. Neither DOJ or the FBI are perfect, but they are acting in good faith. Trump is not. We the people need to find out soon what his cover-up is all about. Before Kavanaugh gets on the SCOTUS and before Trump starts a shooting war somewhere. And before his trade war drives the economy into a recession.
656
Even when the truth exposes the liars the liars survive unscathed. How so? How can a proven, incompetent, prevaricator such as Devin Nunes continue as chairman of the Intelligence Oversight Committee without being heckled from his seat? How ridiculous McConnell is to allow Nunes to continue? How can no one in the GOP credit the dignity of honesty and act accordingly?
Ugh. It's all so discouraging.
388
Ever hear of 'Liars Poker'? Well, our country is obviously being currently run by world class players.
@opop Frauds keep their stripes, even under cover. We'll see if his constituents have finally had enough of a fraud who used campaign funds for $15K in Celtics tickets, winery tours and Vegas trips. Oligarchs are funding the Nunes campaign not locals. Yes, it's discouraging, and I hope the Blue Wave keeps crashing on our shores. https://www.fresnobee.com/news/politics-government/article215099780.html
McConnell is in charge of the Senate. Nunes is in the House of Representatives, therefore, it would be up to Paul Ryan to remove the sketchy Nunes and replace him with someone with at least a little bit of credulity and honesty that would stand up for our great country and the American people.
1
The fact that the Republican party voters continue to back this administration at unheard of levels (90%) explains away all the outright fraudulent and obstructive conduct of the party representatives as with the House Intelligence Committee.
Much bigger than Trump is the tribal warfare, more specifically GOP tribal warfare, occurring in the United States. Not unprecedented and not good.
246
@JRing: Fortunately for us, they are only 26% of the voting population, so 90% of 26% makes no difference. What we need to worry about are the oligarchs in our country and around the world who are continually working hard to undermine our democracy by voter suppression, gerrymandering, and possibly illegal vote counting/changing through e-voting machine manipulations. How do we really know who won any local, state or federal election if our public voting is controlled by private companies that refuse to share their vote counting data or software? We already know that Russians have hacked into many of our states' voter rolls, who's to say that they aren't colluding with the oligarchs to bring down our democracy? Anything can be believed at this point given the level of lies, obfuscations, and denials coming from the GOP.
5
@JRing, Evangelicals preach that public adherence to the most preposterous beliefs will assure their converts a prosperous life after death.
4
Fomented by Russia. We are under attack! It's unconventional asymmetrical crypto-psychological agit-prop warfare and our President is the ENEMY. Our internal dissension, though always there, has been supercharged by cyberwarfare and FAKE NEWS.
1
Why is Devin Nunes still the chairman of that House intelligence committee?
He has clearly lied on multiple occasions. He is clearly working in concert with the White House to discredit the FBI's work.
Paul Ryan makes occasional mealy-mouthed weak words of support for the Russia investigation, but that he keeps Nunes in that role shows his true goal is to undermine it.
Is the entire Republican party dirty?
523
@J Yes, the ENTIRE Republican party is dirty, starting with Sen Mitch MCConnell and working on down to the local dogcatcher.
1
@J
"Is the entire Republican party dirty?" The short answer is: "Yes."
The long answer is: "Yes."
1
@J:
Is the entire Republican party dirty?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I think that the answer to that question is quite evident.
3
Declassified memos! Sunday tweets! Deflection accomplished! Y'all have moved onto the next thing. What exactly happened last week? I don't remember...
136
Trump licked Putins boots and insulted our friends in Europe. The months before? he insulted Canada and the G7, ignited a multifront trade war, and enacted a policy of kidnapping. Is your memory refreshed?
5
@Bartleby S
I remember. Trump betrayed our country in Helsinki. I will never forget.
1
How is this a thing? How can Nunes put out a memo full of lies and still be an integral part of the intelligence committee. Time and time again this man lies and he faces no consequences - not a one. This is absolutely shameful.
568
@Red Sonya: This entire administration is absolutely shameful, and criminal, too. Perpetrating any acts of legislation and policy that they can to disenfranchise, harm, and perhaps even kill American citizens. How can this take place in the United States? And it is as blatant and outrageous as can be!
8
@Red Sonya Andrew Janz is the Democratic running against Nunes. That can be the consequence.
1
Can you identify a specific Nunes lie from his memo and specific original source evidence that it is a lie?
If not, how do you know he lied?
There seems to be so much spin in politicl claims that I think we need to get down to specific quotes in the context of both non factual statements and the evidence that they are untrue.
I believe Russia tries to meddle. However, I believe including the Trump admin in the investigation is a tool to damage th rd admin far more than it is a legitimate investigation.
I would like to see a specific analysis of the legal requirements of an independent counsel investigation and FISA to see if the law was bent, which means broken.
For example, as due diligence done in communicating the HRC campaign/ DNC funding links (not just a footnote) and the fact that Steele was apparently dropped after leaking to the media.
There is no way out of this really. The GOP can embrace and acknowledge facts- or they can run from them.
DJT and nunes and a majority of the gop have made their decision, to ignore facts supported by documented intelligence materials and take a stance that is contrary to known dates times and data.
Let that marinate a bit.
Leadership at the highest levels of our government tell a story that is contrary to known fact, like Wednesday is after Tuesday and Christmas is in December.
They want (so, so badly) for the US electorate to think otherwise.
Sorry “devin”, the voting public is now paying very close attention and the more we look the worse the gop looks.
Facts are stubborn things!
269
@Is_the_audit_over_yet
"A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still." Mere, simple stubbornness is at the bottom of this mystery, I'm tempted to think. I fear that the same people who are now ignoring what's clearly set before them are the same ones who spent eight years convincing themselves that President Obama "was the worst, most corrupt president in history!" They believed that, and wouldn't be budged. These are the same people who believe "alternative facts" actually exist, as though fact were a malleable thing.
I wish I could sign on to the "truth will out" brigade. But I just can't. I am increasingly convinced that Trump is going to ride out his term and sail into the sunset having wrecked our economy, our justice system, our international standing, our civil liberties, our mutual tolerance, and, oh yes, whatever thin threads still united Americans after eight years of Republican efforts to delegitimize and destroy Barack Obama, culminating in the theft of a Scotus seat and, finally, of an election. (OK, you can argue that it was the second theft of a presidential election in 16 years.)
Several well-regarded polls just out show that since Helsinki T's standing among his base has improved; he is up to 45% overall approval in the NBC poll. Like it or not, he is changing this country in fundamental ways, and it is not obvious to me who or what can stop him. No matter what Mueller turns up, T has primed vast swaths of the country to reject it, and Republicans will take their cue from that as they have up to now.
His power over the thinking of grown men and women grows steadily. And that is what scares me the most.
I think we know the answer to "At long last, sir, have you no decency left?" The truth is, he never had any to lose. So why are we surprised at what we are seeing? And who is there who can stand up to him and bring down the fever? I fear the answer is : no one.
247
@A New Yorker
I sympathize with your fears. I wept with tears of frustration when the republican memo came out, and do so again reading this article. It seems the truth just doesn't matter anymore.
BUT, heading into another election, it might be a good thing we're not feeling complacent. Those who didn't vote before might turn out.
1
Let's concentrate on the 55-60 percent and get out the vote. To your point, our last best hope.
1
@A New Yorker Let us all remember that Trump supporters are a MINORITY in the U.S. We are only lost if Americans fail to vote. There is no legitimate excuse for sitting out the vote in 2018 and 2020.
1
This is a very odd defense, particularly in the public realm. Rather than arguing that Page is not guilty, they argue that evidence against him should be suppressed because it was not obtained appropriately. We're supposed to ignore a spy in our midst, they argue, because the government should not have investigated him.
This is a defense typically employed by the guilty.
It sure sounds to me like they had 'probable cause,' but I'll let the courts decide. But I won't ignore the fact that he's a spy.
192
@Justin Just so that you understand how the legal system of the US works: No one needs to prove that Page NOT guilty of anything. The government needs to prove that Page IS guilty in order to convict him of espionage. The reality is that the government did not - and apparently does not still - have enough (or maybe any) significant evidence against Page. Note that he's never been charged with a crime resulting from these investigations, his passport has never been seized and his surveilled activities have never been tied to a crime committed by anyone else so far. This seems to be the profile of an innocent man (so far).
2
@Justin
we are a nation of laws not a banana republic and therefore we have certain standards and procedures that law enforcement has to follow REGARDLESS of party affiliation !
If those procedures are followed and evidence is obtained in a proper manner than there is nothing wrong with using the evidence but if evidence is obtained in a inappropriate manner than it needs to be thrown out otherwise you encourage law enforcement to cut corners
2
When you're the President but think you never have to read anything,this is what you get. What a fool is this awful man ! Should have his head examined....