Only a complete simpleton believes that a physical southern border wall would make a dent in illegal immigration. A. Complete. Simpleton.
We clearly have so many people who believe Trump's lies about the impact of "illegal" immigration on our economy. They refuse to acknowledge that American jobs have been sacrificed on the altar of international corporate profits. You know, the same corporations enjoying windfall tax breaks while our infrastructure investment goes begging for lack of tax revenues. You know, the same corporate theft that will be used as cover for destroying the social safety net in which many Americans have invested their entire working lives.
If strengthened border security makes people feel better about losing their Medicare and Medicaid, fine. But invest in aerial and electronic surveillance that might actually work instead a Trumpian-Folly Edifice Erection.
And for heaven's sake...quit conflating DACA will broad-brush illegal immigration. The Dreamers are among our nation's most valuable assets today...especially compared to the many under-educated, shiftless native born types in our midst.
Strong immigration policy is needed but good judgment is equally important.
3
What are they so afraid of?
I agree with all the xenophobes in these comments. In fact I think we should deport all those whose great grandparents were not here. Of course Mexican Americans were here since part of it was their country, blacks were here because they were kidnapped, but for all the others who see themselves as pure Americans look back a few generations. The same cruelty that you want to show was shown to many of you. We defeated the no-nothing Party when it hated the Irish and we will defeat you.
1
It will be interesting to see if the "Dreamers" are used as a Trojan horse in an effort to provide amnesty for millions of foreign nationals who knowingly violated US immigration laws. Will these unauthorized foreign nationals be held accountable?
6
We used to have a seasonal worker program with Mexico. It allowed farmers to bring in temporary workers who returned to their families in Mexico, at the end of each season.
When the program ended, the farm workers kept coming. But without visas to cross the border, they chanced getting caught so some settled their families here. Farmers wanted them to be able to stay, but labor unions feared this would encourage more migrants to come, undermining American workers. Charles Schumer crafted a compromise bill which gave amnesty to the migrants who were already here, on the promise to end all further illegal migration.
Schumer’s so-called compromise was not a compromise at all. Rather than stopping illegal migration, it encouraged millions more people to illegally come here on the expectation that they, too, would be allowed to stay. Schumer’s bill gave a path to citizenship to about 3 million illegal migrants. We now have at least 4 times that many, with an official estimation of between 11 and 12 million.
If Congress agains offers another amnesty to illegal migrants, it will encourage an endless number to come here illegally. Instead of an amnesty, Congress could again create a program which would allow farmers to bring in workers who would return to their families, in Mexico, at the end of each season.
4
Ann,
The US still has the H-2A visa, which allows seasonal farm workers and which is uncapped, meaning that the farmers can get as many workers as they need. It also stipulates that they abide by wage and hours laws, supply housing & some travel, etc. Workers can do their seasonal work in the US and then go back home to their families where living is cheaper for months at a time.
It is easier and cheaper just to hire illegal workers and provide none of the provisions that have been stipulated.
The old canard of crops rotting in the fields should join the check's in the mail and I'll still respect you in the morning as obvious lies.
1
Why hasn't this problem been carefully and wisely addressed long before now?
Both major political parties use the issue to their advantage. The goal in Congress right now is to not give the opposition anything they can run on, especially with the dictatorial Mitch McConnell who has arrogated to himself alone what bills will come before the Senate. The course of our government and our nation is being determined by what could be used in radio and television ads against someone, not by the needs of the country.
Democrats gain by being able to portray Republicans as cruel and heartless. Republicans have gained for years by looking the other way, while talking tough, so that merchants, restaurants and farmers can employ illegal labor at low cost. At least the Democrats have some measure of consistency in saying they want the problems addressed and in putting an arm around those who were brought here as children and had no choice in the matter, legal or otherwise.
We, the people, should take neither side, should support neither party, but look for comprehensive solutions. How many legal immigrants per year should be allowed? Are we gaining from their experience and economic input, or are we losing more than we gain?
Mexico is a special problem. As a Catholic nation, and by long tradition, big families are seen as a blessing, even if there are no jobs or education when the kids grow up. The solution is in Mexico, not in border walls and ripping children from parents.
2
I keep hearing about a broken immigration system. For my family who applied at the American embassy in Seoul Korea, and waited 20 months to obtain an immigration visa, the system was not broken. What is broken is how to address the millions who entered illegally, ahead of those who followed the law. Gee, if I dont pay taxes, is the law broken?
6
I would very much like to enter into the country of my choice and just stay. Make my demands for English, multiple benefits and citizenship. Yeah, that'll work out really well for me and my family. This is not reality in today's world. And if you don't believe me try doing this in Canada. Or Mexico. There are too many people in the world today. It is simply impossible to take everyone in. American citizens and their children come first.
7
One of the deep problems with immigration bills is that a lot of people still remember how we got cheated in the 1986 Amnesty legislation. The American people were promised strict enforcement if we agreed to an amnesty. The Dems and Liberals got their amnesty, we never got enforcement but instead wound up with 11 million illegal aliens in this country.
1986 hangs over any current legislation. That is why there is so much disagreement. We do want enforcement FIRST - that is our insurance that our immigration laws will be enforced. We want E-Verify made mandatory for all employers big and small. That is the fastest way to turn of the spigot which draws illegals to this country.
While everyone talks DACA and the exceptional individuals in the program, the press and DACA supporters forget that not everyone who has benefited from DACA are exceptional. Some are even less than mediocre. Politicians like to show us pictures and talk about the exceptional DACA recipients, and ignore the mediocre, failures and some criminal who got kicked out of the program.
Talking about DACA saves both parties from discussing enforcement and I mean real enforcement like universal E-Verify. Without something like this in place, all other legislation is just another effort to fool Americans like the 1986 bill did. Nibbling around the edges with this bill or that bill will not be worth the paper it is written on unless we turn off the spigot that draws illegal aliens to come here.
5
Look at the time, effort and money that is wasted on the subject of illegal immigrants in our country. I for one am tired of it. Enough.
It's such a shame that the children in the Dreamers program were brought to the US illegally by their parents. It's not the citizens of the US who are to blame for their situation, but the parents of these children who purposely and willfully violated US laws.
When their parents were sneaking over the border wall, walking through the desert to avoid security, or over stayed their visas, they knew exactly what they were doing. Now US citizens are heartless because we want our laws upheld.
The children end up being victims, but only because of the actions of their parents. That is where the Dreamer's anger should be directed - not to US citizens who simply want immigrants to obey our laws, but at their parents.
If a person (child or adult) is in the US illegally, they need to be deported to the country of their origin. That's the law. End of story.
9
But deportation after some 20 years? That's cruel. Where's the cut-off? There should be a 'general pardon' (like was done here in The Netherlands some years ago) to acknowledge that the US government keeps kicking this can of worms down the road as well as the many contributions these Dreamers have made to the US while they've been in the US illegally through no decision of their own. They've been living cleaner lives than some US-born Americans, simply because they've had to or they would have been dropped from the program.
2
George W. Bush would have signed the comprehensive immigration bill that Congress drafted, but his party preferred to have the campaign issue to run on. And they certainly did that. Donald turned it into a cri de guerre and... he lost the popular vote.
Putting party politics above the national interest is not likely to subside in an election year, even one where Republicans have little chance to retain control of the House. I'm not hopeful.
I think I understand how Paul Ryan got into leadership. He was willing to put his name on truly draconian budget cuts to entitlement programs. More cautions Republicans were too wary of another "Dan Rostenkowski moment" when senior citizens attached his car. But Ryan made a splash so he moved up in GOP hierarchy and got the nod from Mitt Romney. Failure never seemed a barrier to his progress.
But Kevin McCarthy? How did he get there? Or is the party so bereft of leadership that he amounts to something?
The problem with immigration is abuse by capitalism. Illegal immigrants come to the USA mainly for jobs. Americans and American companies continuously hire illegal immigrants. In this process only the "brown colored" immigrants are the people that bear the full legal and judicial brunt of the punishment.
The white Americans and America companies that violate federal immigration laws by hiring illegals are never held accountable for their crimes. Any company that is raided by ICE for employing illegal immigrants never faces severe consequences. Any penalties are administrative fines that are eventually reduced to pocket change.
But when the topic of illegal immigration comes up, the Republicans carefully and purposely highlight only the "brown skinned" people from Mexico and Central America as the problem and law breakers and not those that profit off illegal immigration.
We can't expect foreigners to obey our immigration laws when Americans don't follow them and are not prosecuted for breaking them.
6
First of all, the data clearly shows that most illegal "immigration" is from Central America, mostly Mexico. The overwhelming majority of DACA enrollees are Mexican. So, the reason "brown skinned" people are highlighted in the illegal immigration discussion is because most of the illegal "immigrants" are brown skinned.
Secondly, most employers hiring illegal workers haven't broken any laws. That's why they usually aren't "held accountable". All an employer is required to do is look at a Social Security card or other work authorizing document and get a completed I-9 form. Illegal "immigrants" present Social Security card forgeries as good looking as yours and commit perjury to complete the I-9.
We need mandatory eVerify, just as the Goodlatte bill insists.
4
Organized labour's complaint that it can't find enough workers is code for not being able to find enough people who are forced to work for slave wages.
I don't disagree that most undocumented illegal workers deserve a better life, but they are driving down wages which disproportionally affects American's non-white legal residents and citizens to obtain employment at a living wage.
People who support and employ illegal immigrants are discriminating against the country's non-white population of legal residents and citizens. But it just ain't PC to state the obvious.
2
Seems to me that if somebody could explain the complexities of modern security systems such as night vision, drones and trained boarder personnel to the dim wit who still thinks the Great Wall of China is great technology we’d get somewhere but grampa has the dementia and we’re afraid to be the first ones to say Assisted Care Home.
Here's a plan: let's make citizens of any Dreamers we would find acceptable using a merit based system for legal immigrants.
Legalizing all Dreamers, AKA illegal "immigrants" who self selected, is essentially random. And the requirements to stay under the DACA program were absolutely minimal, an unacceptably low bar: age, involvement with any kind of school or job at all, and a criminal record that isn't too bad.
Contrary to popular belief, DACA enrollees are not required to have a clean criminal record. They can have a record with one misdemeanor for which they spent up to a year in jail, or up to three misdemeanors for which they served up to 90 days each!
And here's a guess: the reason many "Dreamers" did not attempt to enroll in DACA is they knew they couldn't qualify. Would we seriously consider making citizens out of any illegal "immigrants" who are less qualified than DACA would accept?!
No one should forget: this country does not OWE this population anything at all. The only reason this issue even exists is due to massive lawbreaking by their parents.
"Being brought to this country through no fault of their own" is hardly a qualification for citizenship.
7
Immigration showdown?
How about beginning with Melania Trump?
Unless and until the third wife of Donald Trump can prove by documentation that she did not illegally work in the United States and then obtain her naturalization by fraud the broken English speaking Slovenian model Melania should be arrested and deportation proceedings should begin.
3
As John Boehnor said recently, there is no "republican" party. Most operatives are singular actors with only their personal interests, and those of their Robber Baron money masters, in mind.
Pass no bill right now, Good People in OUR U.S. Senate/House. Wait until WE THE PEOPLE elect /hire Socially Conscious Women and Men to make up the majority in both chambers so they can pass true, equitable Dreamer and Immigration bills.
Republicans have neglected to pass meaningful immigration reform because their Robber Baron money masters are the biggest employers. They can't have it both ways and WE THE PEOPLE are going to DEMAND that real immigration reform - with reinstatement and enforcement of temporary worker visas - be passed.
NOW is the time. There may never be another time if Dictator Con Don has his way.
5
There is nothing " Socially Conscious" about overpopulating the United States through the catastrophic mass importation of poverty.
4
The Democrats lost their opportunity to man-up and force a DACA solution with their faux government shutdown maneuver. They could have forced the issue when they had a chance. They simply caved to the Republicans demands, as usual, and now we see the result. Month upon month of hardship upon hardship for the immigrants and honest naturalized citizens in every sense who are living in darkness "like animals." Congress has become a completely ineffectual government body. Nothing is accomplished without some sinister political calculus in play.
A pox on both your Houses!
4
There is no win for the GOP here, if they get the vote then with Democratic support it passes and is then either stopped in the Senate, or vetoed. They get no credit for legislation, while the no recess spotlight is on them, and they lose the xenophobic vote that is their base. I understand that for the 40 this could be a life saver and it would be smart to pass it and not bring it up in the Senate. But ideological purity rarely equals political sagacity on either the Right or the Left.
The Border Patrol estimates it catches about 54 percent of illegal border crossers, a figure the Border Patrol Union says is inflated. The Border Patrol intercepted more than 50,000 in May. This means about 50,000 illegal border crossers eluded the Border Patrol, many of them with children who will become the next generation of Dreamers. There should be no amnesty for Dreamers except as part of a legislative package that curtail future illegal immigration.
Since the presence of more than 11 million unauthorized immigrants within our border demonstrates the federal government cannot stop illegal immigration by itself, the legislative package should explicitly authorize state and local police to assist the Border Patrol by arresting unauthorized immigrant just as they help the FBI arrest bank robbers and kidnappers. The legislation should also authorized states and cities to require proof of citizenship or legal resident status for state and city services, such as auto registration, utility hookups and other transactions.
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-border-cross-20161006-snap-stor...
18
Most people come here illegally because their are jobs available to them. Unless you address the issue of employers hiring illegal immigrants, no efforts at border control will be effective. We need to issue bio-identity cards to people who are here legally, and require that employers verify the bio-identity card before a worker is employed. We also need to issue more green cards (with bio-identity). People will not choose to cross illegally if the process of crossing legally is easier. Further, if someone can more readily cross the border legally to work, they are far more likely to return home. To me the issue is that we want everyone who enters the country to cross legally and be properly documented.
Most employers hiring illegal workers haven't broken any laws. We need better laws. We need mandatory eVerify, which is a key component of the Goodlatte bill.
In my comment, I proposed making E-Verify mandatory nationwide. It is already against the law to employ illegal immigrants. The law simply needs to be enforced. E-Verify makes it easier to prosecuted employers who hire unauthorized immigrnts.
Speaking of "spines", why don't the House Republicans find one and just vote on these issues and let the chips fall where they may. One of the reasons for such low approval ratings of Congress is their inaction. If you want to save the Dreamers, then vote on it (with no attachments). If you want to change legal immigration, then vote on it. Why does the White House have to be considered? Do something and perhaps the Legislative branch would start gaining respect.
2
Most Americans want both gun control and immigration reform. Most GOP politicians mostly favor immigration reform and border control, and most Democratic politicians favor gun control.
Here's an idea, both compromise, for the American people - the Republicans accept much better gun control, and the Democrats accept much better immigration reform.
But this will never happen and unfortunately, both will remain out of control at the total expense of the American people.
12
This is such a great point. The notion of compromise seems to be lost in our current polarized atmosphere.
Keep the kids here who are full-time students are fulltime in the workforce, or are married to someone who is full time in the workforce, as of today. Send the rest home, and send ALL the border jumper parents who broke the law home. This is the proper balance of compassion and justice. On this issue, we need both.
13
Kids? Hardly. Most DACAs are 25 years of age and older.
4
Where are the million or so DACA parents, waiting in the wings and hiding out in our country? This is never discussed.
They should ALL be deported. No mas amnistia.
19
It might be a good idea to review the age of people living in the USA. We need those young people, educated, healthy and able and eager to contribute their skills to the USA. Not to mention raising families for the future success of our country.
We seniors should look in the mirror. What kind of example are we setting for the young? Further, THINK before you vote.
2
Many think of Dreamers as you do. The word was nicely chosen. The reality is this group is not very well educated, will not likely be high earners. Here's the profile. Read down to the section on education.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/01/25/politics/daca-dreamers-by-the-numbers-tru...
4
Ending extended chain migration, ending the Visa Lottery, and instituting mandatory E-Verify should be enacted and implemented at the same time that we institute only temporary 3 year renewable work permits for the original 700,000 DACA beneficiaries. Most importantly the DACA legalization must be made conditional to the 3 enforcement measures being implemented. No implementation of these 3 conditions, then no more renewal of DACA legalization. I don't want to see DACA recipients amnestied and then have these 3 enforcement measures challenged in the courts for years.
The amnesty and open borders supporters gave away their plans when Trump set the travel conditions: Challenge on any issue whatsoever and keep challenging, because challenges delay implementation. Anti-enforcement only has to win once to slow or derail enforcement measures whereas pro-enforcement must win every time. Using temporary legalization would mean that if the 3 conditions don't go through, the DACA beneficiaries can again become illegal and subject to deportation. That is the only way to ensure enforcement. We simply cannot trust those promoting amnesty to keep their word once they get amnesty.
23
Until we end the lunacy of Birthright Citizenship, and holder of a "temporary" work permit can become the parent of a US citizen child, often at US taxpayer expense. Then the caterwauling begins to make the "temporary" into permanent.
Birthright Citizenship destabilizes any immigration system.
4
Like I said yesterday, have Jeff Sessions round up all the Dreamers into one room, Donald Trump sweep your presidential pardoning hand over them all in one felled swoop and be done with whole mess.
1
If the current political maneuverings conclude with a similar proposal the Trump administration placed for consideration earlier this year, it will be an excellent outcome.
Before you reply with a negative comment, I am from El Salvador and lived as an undocumented worker for nine years.
3
As usual, the more vocal fringe elements of the left are conjuring up an issue that will lose democrats the election. The broken immigration system in this country is why Trump is now our president. Way back in 2015 when Hillary started making immigration an issue, I predicted PA would turn Red over this single issue unless the democrats left the issue alone. Well- it was enough for a few more states and there goes the electoral college. We all recall the first of candidate Trump's promises was this wall..... its not a coincidence. The democrats need to start listening. Sit up and pay attention! Immigration is why you lost. I'm as liberal as anyone else, but having experienced the changing reality here due to immigration [legal and illegal], its hard to dispute the rationale for conservatives' hard line on this matter and why it resonates with the population. We should provide funding for border security in the amount trump is seeking, just not for a dumb concrete wall. Make a deal for DACA citizenship for a few measly miles of 30 foot wall and the rest electronic with more agents and some respectable holding facilities and fuel for the planes to send them home. Put the issue to bed as far in advance of midterms as possible. Please learn for your mistakes for all our benefit and the good of the country.
23
Trump will not settle for an electronic wall. He does not even understand how that would work. He is only interested in something he can see, touch, and show off to the less knowledgeable, less rational and more reactionary segment of his base.
3
The "Freedom" caucus needs amnesty from ignorance.
1
There should be no citizenship for DACA recipients. At best, they can be given visas that will allow them to stay and work, but will not allow them to vote or sponsor family members. Any DACA recipient with a criminal offense cannot receive the visa. Reality is that many in the US will not support another amnesty. Equally, many people don’t have the heart to watch the deportations on the news. So, offer a program that minimally allows these people to stay, but make it unattractive enough that it’s not a magnet for more people to illegally enter our country.
The accountability for having DACA recipients here, for crossing our borders illegally, and for requesting asylum when you know you won’t qualify (but hope to disappear into the shadow economy) belongs to the people doing these things. We US citizens aren’t accountable for this, yet we bear the consequences. We need to do everything possible to discourage people from entering or staying in our country illegally, minimizing the need for the draconian actions we are currently employing at the border. If granting another amnesty will be like throwing out a welcome mat, then we can’t do it. It’s bad for us, and often very bad for the illegal immigrants.
26
If Denham doesn't get this done, his re-election chances are Toast. If he loses, the probability of the Dems taking the House improves significantly.
Therein lies the political calculus - and dilemma - for the GOP. They can always fight for their stupid wall again later IF they retain control of the House. The Wall has always been more of a dog whistle than a construction project, anyway.
It's too bad that it takes this political problem to motivate the GOP to actually consider doing the Right Thing by the Dreamers, but we can be grateful for it.
2
This is how government is supposed to work : In the light of day, a free up and down vote on the issue(s) and for the electorate to see exactly who stands where. (and whether they are true representatives of the people/their constituents)
It is far better than not holding any votes at all, or worse making backroom deals where the votes have been calculated already. (furthermore, where there are token votes against for those in a tough reelection and their hypocritical and craven attempts to hold onto power)
Let Democracy reign.
3
So why doesn’t a devout Catholic like Paul Ryan ask himself—or his pope—what Jesus would do about the Dreamers? Because he—like all his allegedly Christian Republican colleagues—know exactly what Jesus would do. They also know that someone running for office on a Jesus-based immigration policy would never make it through the Republican primaries.
5
No offense, but who cares what Jesus would do? He was a sage from antiquity, who responded to the challenge of too many mouths to feed with a magic trick.
He was never elected, He never led a group of people that numbered more than what an Infantry squad has in it, and He mishandled his messaging and outreach program so poorly that the local authorities crucified him for it, literally. And He managed all of this before the ripe age of 33.
I'm pretty sure most American Conservatives who are practicing Christians are smart enough to realize that what Jesus would do isn't exactly sound state policy. Why do progressive Christians miss this?
5
What to expect from the House? Nothing of any substance, kick the can on down the road. Business as usual.
1
There are no native American members of Congress.
Therefore, NO member of Congress is a native American. We non-natives all came from somewhere that wasn't here. Why fight tooth and nail to stop immigration in its tracks?
Members of the GOP leadership are like bullies on a playground. There might be plenty of room for everyone to play, but the bullies would rather push them off than help them up.
2
DACA is going away just like the Dreamers. King Trump must appease his base in order to win his 2020 presidential bid.
3
The four tenets must be met: 1. Full border wall funding; 2. End all chain migration; 3. Eliminate lottery; Reduce legal immigration by at least 50%. Would prefer to eliminate all together.
30
I cannot agree that stopping legal is desirable. We need talented, well trained people.
3
I agree with you on the last three, but the wall is a stupid and expensive idea. If you can accomplish numbers 2, 3, and 4, the first would be almost unnecessary. Granting citizenship automatically to any child born in the USA, regardless of circumstance, is an outdated notion that unfortunately needs to be amended.
1
Looking at low-skill construction work in Alameda I see two distinct categories. Work that is done under tight control of government agencies seems to only employ workers who appear to be legal residents. Reconstruction on the old high school and sewer main replacement workers are in that category. Both those groups employ a small number of young Black men, a group that faces terrible unemployment. Roofers, painters and small home construction operations seem to hire almost exclusively Hispanic men who only communicate in Spanish.
We should help the 'Dreamers;' with a path to citizenship and a clear cut-off date. After the cut-off, no more dreamers admitted. (We said essentially the same thing in 1986, which clearly did not work then.)
Beyond that, we need to take care of our own low-wage workers, who are chronically underemployed and under paid. We must start using tougher penalties against employers who hire workers illegally. Legal workers will harvest our fruit and cut up our chickens, but it will be more expensive. We really should worry more about our own low-skill workers than those from a foreign country.
If we need to cut a check for five billion to spend on a wall to get this done, let's go ahead and spend it, and employ legal workers to build it.
21
I'm a dreamer. I'm dreaming of November. VOTE.
26
I assume you mean Republican?
2
The House is tilting at windmills. They are spending time on bills, which will not pass in the Senate.
A DACA bill will never pass on its own - too many issues that will polarize both parties. Any path to citizenship will look like Amnesty and won't pass unless there are more sweetners in the bill. Any path to citizenship would have to forbid that DACA can sponsor family members. The path would have to be long 10-15 years. DACA cannot be enlarged and should only include the current recipient - I have heard the number is about 700,000 and DACA itself would have to permanently end.
Trump will want his border wall, but I think with changes he wants to normal integration - end diversity visa, reduce legal immigration and instead of being Family based , it must be skilled based and thus end chain migration. I think he could be persuaded to sign it.
But without some sweetners for Trump Congress will never get an immigration bill passed, and those bills pending in the House are non-starters when it comes to the Senate.
11
I’m an American citizen and a parent. Under no circumstances should children be separated from their parents by the US government, period!
31
Your argument is separate to the one of immigration. Break the law with kids in tow and you would soon find out for yourself- so, horrible, yes, but not relevant.
6
And under no circumstances should a parent who, knowing his/her child WILL be separated from them should they illegally enter the country be considered a fit parent. As a parent, you might understand "child endangerment". Anyone trying to work this scam at the border is either willing to let their child get put into foster care--and guaranteeing a right to stay in the US--or is willing to take the risk and wait for US authorities to back down and let them get away with their ongoing swindle. Dumping children off at the border and taking a chance that they can call for you once they get a residence permit is the swindle being worked in Europe now by thousands of Afghan men claiming to be boys. It is little different than this. Dump the children you cannot or will not care for off on the US taxpayer, and hope for the best. These people KNOW the rules--if they continue their scam, the separation is THEIR fault, not the US Government's. That is life. , If you Californians want to continue to ruin your economy by shipping in welfare costs, we can direct all of these people to you.
20
America doesn’t send children to prison along with their parents when their parents are arrested and imprisoned. No civilized country would.
Migrant children whose parents are arrested and incarcerated for crossing the border illegally are treated similarly to U.S. children whose parents are arrested and incarcerated for other crimes.. The Homeland Security Act of 2002 requires the Homeland Security Department to transfer them to Department of Health and Human Services. The children remain under HHS custody for an average of 34 days. The overwhelming majority are released to sponsors who are family members while the remainder are placed in foster homes.
21
We do need new laws to address immigration.
However those laws should be based on facts and not this administration's fake news which spreads fear and hatred.
32
DACA is not the problem - it is a symptom. The problem is an insecure border. Patching up a symptom without curing the underlying problem is senseless.
37
The problem isn't an insecure border, it's violence and instability in Latin America (largely the result of 100 years of America imperialism) and absolutely no political will to hold the employers of undocumented immigrants responsible for their hiring practices. When the Republicans stand up and loudly demand eVerify everywhere, I'll believe they're committed to solving the immigration issue. Until then, it's just xenophobic rhetoric for their base while their backers count the money they save by hiring undocumented
18
If the borders were secure there would be no eVerify and violence in LA would be largely irrelevant to the average American.
If it was at all possible, Republicans would like the Dreamers to never be legalized by law, never rounded up and deported, forever in limbo. Democrats would call for action, Republicans could rant about the border wall, immigrants invading, MAGA and other rubbish. The GOP prefers national issues, from Dreamers to choice, deficits, Medicaid, climate change to never be solved, persistent bleeding national wounds, permanent crises to exploit. Issues with which they can harangue, incite and motivate their easily manipulated low information too often bigoted base. An efficient government of compromise and wise action is anathema to their campaign schemes and re-election.
6
Dems also benefit from mouthing off but never solving these issues. Same campaign donors, same results.
No immigration bill will pass without any guarantee of the border wall the president stubbornly insists on. It’s his signature campaign promise and is the most watched and anticipated piece of legislation by his base. With November only five months away he won’t back away from a promise that he knows is impractical and far-fetched.
He’s bartering the Dreamers’ future for political considerations. These “incredible kids” are hostages in a political stalemate. And they want American citizenship, not just amnesty, or the “A-word” which makes the Dreamers’ aspirations and hopes sound like an ugly slur too vulgar to properly talk about in polite company.
6
“...a sweet spot,” Mr. Speaker?
I haven’t heard you say anything—not one word—about the forced separation of parents from children at the Mexican-U.S. border. You’ve sat on your hands as the president that you’ve enabled—on this fraught issue as in so many others—to wreak havoc upon our foreign and domestic affairs.
“We can’t trust this president,” we’re the first words out of your mouth as House Speaker when you followed up John Boehner’s refusal to work with President Barack Obama on immigration. Now, today, you see a way, as a lame duck Speaker, to find “a sweet spot” to finally (I can’t stop laughing) end the scourge of this damning problem?
Why now, Mr. Speaker? Or have you depleted what moral capital you had in forging a “tax break” for the working classes under the guise of transferring the national wealth to the one percent?
Who in the House, knowing you are history, will hazard their re-election efforts on helping DACA kids, knowing you won’t be around in January? And you know full well that the Freedom Caucus will strip you bare if you advocate for brown-skinned people. It’s not your way, anyway; you see immigration as another “entitlement,” something attached to America’s safety net that you have taken a saw to since you were elected.
“Sweet spot,” sir? That’ll be the day! (Thanks, Buddy Holly and the Crickets).
21
The NYT word of the day, certainly with respect to Immigration, is 'showdown'. The truth is, go looking for a showdown and that's what you find, go looking for a resolution and who knows, you might just find what you're looking for.
Trump's pillars sounded fair, and quick and easy to implement also.
The best way to do this, so everyone makes their chip off the block, is to link the wall building to performance, like a CEO package. That would work very well, indeed Trump might even suggest it himself. Brick by brick, mile by mile against GDP performance, safety, wealth or whatever other measure you care to mention.
The resolution is in your hands- or a showdown, if that's your preference.
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Kevin McCarthy needs to spend more on his suits. He should do what I do: buy the best ready-made suits offered by Joseph Bank at their twice-a-year sales, where you can save up to 50% (sometimes a LOT more).
Never let it be suggested that readers can’t learn something actually USEFUL in the NYT forum. And, no, Joseph Bank doesn’t pay me anything to write that.
The primary arguments by Republican extremos, that awarding Dreamers a path to citizenship, far more immediate citizenship, is simply unfair to those who waited on line for years for a chance at U.S. citizenship, that they remain illegal aliens regardless of their tenure here, and that such a grant would incentivize others to illegally enter and stay here with their children in the hope of a similar outcome for those children even if the parents eventually were deported … aren’t compelling to me.
The MOST compelling arguments to me coming from the moderates are that these kids – even adults now who came as kids – bear no collective guilt for the actions of their parents, and that their identities are American by virtue of having been RAISED as Americans to adulthood or, for some, near-adulthood.
We can afford to be generous here, so long as we also close the borders to ALL entries that are NOT legal. I’m not in favor of granting citizenship BEFORE we’ve reliably closed the borders, but when we do I’m in favor of IMMEDIATE citizenship for Dreamers.
Ryan should endeavor to sell THAT “sweet spot” to his conference.
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What good is a Congress that can't even discuss proposals that most Americans want? The DACA community are unique and should be considered in a simple straight forward manner. These young people came as innocent children, have paid fees and passed background checks, most have jobs or are students in good standing. Our country would lose valuable members of our work force if they were forced to leave. Because they are unique, legislation giving them a path toward citizenship does not have to be seen as a capitulation to amnesty for all. The Republicans are in a real bind members like Representative Jeff Denham are desperate as they become less popular in their home districts by the hour. Even if it is for the wrong reasons (reelection politics) it is time to do the right thing.
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DACA community is not unique because its not a finite issue (the border remains porous and immigration laws unenforced) as we speak thousands of "new DACA" illegal immigrants are arriving creating the next generation of individuals who will also demand a legalized status. So its not a simple straight forward issue. We must recognize that we must take a hard line on illegal immigration because the next wave of DACA is
coming and we will be arguing this yet again as a nation.
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Americans are reluctant to support another amnesty for unauthorized immigrants because they know open border advocates will work to thwart efforts to curtail future illegal immigration. In 1986, we granted amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants based on promises that the federal government would stop future illegal immigration. But a tsunami of illegal immigrants quickly pushed the number of people in the country illegally to more than 11 million.
There is nothing wrong or immoral about insisting on a DACA compromise that is good for America as well as Dreamers. We should offer DACA enrollees citizenship as part of a legislative package that discourages future illegal immigration. This legislation should empower states, counties and cities to make it unlawful for unauthorized immigrants to reside within their jurisdictions. (Yes. This means a traffic cop could ask for proof of citizenship.) It should make E-Verify mandatory nationwide. And it should automatically deny asylum to migrants who enter the country unlawfully. In addition, we should reinterpret or, if necessary, amend the citizenship clause to grant birthright citizenship only to children born to U.S. parents.
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"Counties and cities to make it unlawful for unauthorized immigrants to reside within their jurisdictions." Insanely, blatantly unconstitutional.
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It would not be unconstitutional if Congress passed the necessary legislation. State and local police arrest bank robbers and kidnappers, which are sate crimes as well as federal crimes.
I'm sorry sir, but you do not speak for all Americans.
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…..There are no known major adverse impacts from DACA on native-born workers' employment, and most economists say that DACA benefits the U.S. economy…
So why not grant permanent residence? Pure political hype by the Republicans, all to gain votes. They introduced this poisonous rhetoric years ago about illegal immigration and have been fanning the flames ever since.
Now they’re stuck because a handful of their moderates are threatened with losing this November. It’s the only reason, get re-elected. Pretty sad bunch they are.
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The majority of Americans want a clean DACA bill!!! They unlike certain hardliners want to do what's right with thousands of children who will make great citizens. I applaud the moderate republicans who have finally realized they have a backbone and brought this up before the house. The Speaker has nothing to lose now, he has decided that the House is not for him. Pass the bill and see if the president has the spine to veto it!
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A lot of these "children" are in their mid to late 20's. Not children by any stretch of the imagination. Time for them to go back to the country of their birth and help that country
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"The majority of Americans want a clean DACA bill!!! " Are you sure about that?
The discharge signers and their allies including the media represent the elite consensus that favors the status quo: weak enforcement, amnesty, more illegal immigration. By rejecting the E-Verify and chain migration reforms that would benefit legal workers, discourage illegal immigration and lessen the likelihood of new amnesties, they are rejecting measures supported by 79% of voters (mandated E-Verify) and 64% of voters (reduction of immigration in general).
So who are the moderates here?
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NYC Dweller - These young people in their 20s were brought here as small children, they speak English and have no concept of any other country.
There are working, paying taxes etc. and we benefit from having them here.
There's nothing like fear to motive at least some House Republicans to do what the were elected to do--find a compromise and legislate. While such action is laudable, you can be sure that unless it includes a border wall and the other poison pill immigration restrictions proposed earlier by Donald Trump that he will veto it. This is just the latest example (and please don't forget gun regulation) of why a Democratic majority, perhaps even a veto-proof one, is the best way forward on immigration. In this sense, the coming mid-term elections is all about Trump and the need to provide a real "check and balance" on his claim to unlimited power.
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Deport all illegal immigrants and their children. Stop advocating for people who broke your own laws, Americans! There are proper ways to immigrate to the US legally. You don't just cross over the border. You cannot just enter the US without papers when you fly in from another country. You have to show you have valid visas and other papers to the immigration officer. Then, why don't the same standards apply to the land border?? I don't like Trump, but I agree with wholeheartedly with his immigration policies. Maybe the wall is necessary after all!
- Frustrated legal immigrant
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Democrats in Washington are out of touch on this issue.
Immigration -- especially illegal immigration in its all forms (babies, chain "multipliers") -- is one of the issues where leaders of the Democratic party seem willfully obtuse and obstinate -- and it's one that causes independent and many Democratic voters to vote Republican. I believe it's also a reason we are seeing the rise of conservative European populism and collapse of the social center-left.
America (and the world) has an immigration problem, a moral paradox, which is a humanitarian and health crisis, among myriad other problems.
Yes, it's unconscionable and immoral to separate children from their parents. That must end immediately. But it's also unacceptable and unsustainable to continue to allow illegal immigration and the current influx of legal immigration. A nation has an obligation to its citizens first.
The world is overpopulated. There is no end in sight to this madness. There must be better ways (but likely much more difficult and expensive) to address and manage world immigration problems than the current extremes of either authoritarianism or lawlessness.
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Legal immigration is not lawlessness. Republicans and others opposed to immigration in general frame the issue around illegal border crossing because that resonates with voters. The issues, however, should not be jumbled together and confused.
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