I'm glad to hear Ukraine is not cooperating with Mueller's charade of an investigation. President Trump should reward the Ukrainian government with sophisticated weaponry for being a steadfast ally against a corrupt Washington prosecutor.
11
This comment shows an utter lack of comprehension of our legal system and our democracy.
31
Good thinking. Brilliant, actually. Maybe Trump can also give them a discount on some casinos. Maybe send some of our troops there to help him out. Whatever it takes to clear Trump.
Actually, what you are suggesting is the ultimate in collusion. Treason, actually. To let foreign policy be influenced by help to avoid prosecution would be a very serious crime. What Trump should do, if he were a legitimate president, would be to insist that the Ukraine NOT let its cooperation with Mueller be influenced by the weapons sale. Failing that, he should not send the weapons. That would be a principled stand. Not planning on it.
21
This comment receives a New York Times "pick" for what reason exactly: it's morbid irony?
22
Please tell me, how is selling missiles to Ukraine to blow up Russian tanks is helping Putin?
Ukraine does not want to get involved in a political witch hunt in the US and potentially hurt the relationship with the admin. If they do, it HELPS Russia because Ukraine would potentially no longer have the funds or weaponry to fight the Russian SpecOps and Russian backed separatist who invaded Ukraine, annexed Crimea (first forced border change in Europe since WWII), and shot down MH17 - all under Obama's leadership.
Give me a break NYT...
7
"first forced border change in Europe since WWII", we are talking Kosovo here, ain't we?
Selling missiles helps Trump by shutting down judicial cooperation with Ukraine. Did you not read the article?
Russia doesn't deploy tanks in Ukraine, it blows up Ukrainian tanks. Don't you know, Russia isn't in Ukraine! wink wink
Good lord, the innocence...
5
Please stop. If there was nothing to the charges, Ukraine could report that. They don't. Because Manaford's guilty of all charges. It's why Trump obstructed justice once again.
4
The article implies that there is something sinister about the actions of the Ukrainian government. In fact, it may be wise policy, with the best of intentions, for a weak country at a sensitive time to avoid becoming involved in the intense battles currently creating rifts and acrimony at the highest levels in the US government.
18
What's sinister is not in the Ukrainian government, which is just acting out of self-interest. It needs those weapons to keep fighting Russian-backed insurgents in Eastern Ukraine. Trump and his Republican-controlled Congress can put a stop to the shipment of those weapons unless Ukraine plays ball. Unsurprisingly, Ukraine plays ball.
What is sinister is the Trump administration using US foreign policy to protect itself.
15
Soooo, it's the investigation of, basically, treason that's to blame for "currently creating rifts and acrimony"?
Got it.
8
The NYTs has sunk to a new low. Their "indications and signs" campaign against Russia just will not go away. The NYTs seems to have lost its way. What used to be a great newspaper now promotes war and cold war.
2
We must find a way to hold self-interested and self-enriching Politicians and their staffers, from both parties, personally liable, responsible and accountable for the lies they have told US, their gross mismanagement of our county, our $21T and growing national debt (108% of GDP), and approximately 80T in future, unfunded liabilities jeopardizing our economic and national security, while benefiting themselves, their party, and special interest donors.
http://www.usdebtforum.com
13
We have a way: Vote them out of office.
2
"Both parties"?
1
Just want to point out that Obama refused to provide Ukraine with lethal aid, particularly Javelin antitank missiles, after Russia invaded Europe, even though Congress explicitly passed a law allowing for it.
In contrast, Trump has sent Ukraine hundreds of Javelin missiles to kill Russian soldiers. Javelins are uniquely effective against tanks and Ukraine had been begging for them because they attack from the top where armor is thinnest. Trump also sent US special forces to train Ukrainian soldiers in how to most effectively use the weapons to kill Russian soldiers.
Another example of where Trump has been much tougher than Obama on Russia in terms of actual action. Obama is great with talk, but when it comes to action like enforcing his own red line against Assad who gassed hundreds of children leaving them foaming and twitching in death, no action.
11
Obama was Republican (real Republican from when they weren't insane)and the majority of his decisions would have been right in line with what Republicans for decades supported. Trump is so much worse because he is undereducated, uninformed, and makes no efforts to use qualified advisors. Plus he either has dementia or he is simply not very intelligent. Believing otherwise against all evidence puts Americans at risk.
11
Funny, I missed the part of the article that commented on Trump's relative "toughness." I thought the article was about the way Trump's leverage over Ukraine is having the effect of hampering an investigation that is likely to be his undoing.
16
The Javelin contract isn't about "defense", it's about corruption.
Javelins surely allow for a large range of American and Ukrainian "commissions" paid for out of $600 million in US "aid". But Javelins are completely useless, because Russia doesn't have tanks in Ukraine. Russia isn't in Ukraine, remember?
The Ukrainian defense minister sold overpriced ambulances that don't work, to the Ukrainian army in a $100 million contract through his own company, for a 10% cut, allegedly. And funny enough, there weren't the resources to investigate that, either.
Just like ambulances for the troops, the deal looks great to uncritical fools. But it makes a lot of sense to anyone who's paying attention. The fact Trump gets a win here against Mueller is just a bonus to people who don't care about either the US and Ukraine.
Putin is proud of his protege!
12
Another concrete example of how Trump's undisclosed ties to foreign countries and businesses can subvert US law and foreign relations.
375
The greatest conspiracy in US political history continues. Instead of the senate forcing the Ukrainians to turn over or at least provide access to one of the primary conspirators in exchange for the missiles; they have allowed Trump to instead kill the Ukrainian cooperation with Mueller and allow kilimnik a primary operative to return to Mother Russia. How much more treason and obstruction will we see? How much more lack of oversight will there be by the remainder of the American government?
In this multidimensional chess game; the thinly vailed actions of nations to placate this coverup and block the truth is occurring through fear, bribery and messages sent in poison gas canisters and now export licenses. Manafort would rather take the 300 years than take the wrath which may reach his extended family. The influence over the republican platform delivered by Manafort and kilimnik is obvious and stark in it’s implications. How can we know anything that is really going on?
Is Putin using his prior tech providing influence in North Korea to prop up Trump now in his time of need in exchange for Trump running present and future interference? It is a crazy question? Maybe; but nothing is too far fetched and no paranoia too great at this point.
4
If Ukraine really wanted to please Trump, it could have cleared Manafort. By “refusing to cooperate” Ukraine signals that Manafort is guilty.
1
It really does sound all very mob-like. We'll sell you the missiles if you lay off our guy in your country currently under investigation...I can hear it now:
"I hope you can let this go...."
3
I guess Ukraine has to salvage whatever it can for the rape of its country by Manafort and others. I guess collusion, extortion, obstruction and money laundering is or you can expect from this White House. And of course thousands upon thousands of lies.
3
Want to bet some corrupt Ukrainian officer sells one to Putin before Christmas? Failing that, Putin will have someone steal one. You can bet money the Russians will have Javelin clones rolling off their assembly lines before 2021.
4
China has already made their own Jevelins using our diagrams and plans for it, as has happened dozens of times.
This is part of China's cyber war against us that our former ideologue president chose to ignore for eight years because he insisted the U.S.A. needed to be taken down a few notches, anyway.
So isn't this then collusion AND obstruction of justice?
I really need the justice system to work because I'm losing faith in our Government.
Many voters saw Trump as an experiment. That excitement has gone horribly wrong. It needs to be ended before the experiment that is our democracy comes to an end.
8
Jumping buck naked into a snakepit filled with writing anacondas, boas, vipers and pythons could be described as an "experiment," but other words more accurately describe such madness. As we Americans already know; we've done it.
2
This is another example of treason that begins in the White House.
5
Maybe Ukrainian officials merely want to avoid getting mixed up in American politics. Maybe they feel they don't have to do the bidding of an overzealous prosecutor who doesn't even know where his jurisdiction and mandate end. Maybe the Ukrainians realize that the world goes on and that Mueller's investigation is not the most important thing. Maybe they think he is an idiot.
1
Mr Mueller should play hardball with them and require them to cooperate with his investigation.
3
It's a smart realpolitik move by the Ukrainian government. US policy regarding foreign arms sales are only supposed to be dictated only by interests of global and national security. With decades, if not centuries, of autocratic rule, Ukrainians get the old rules don't apply to Trump. For Trump, there is no separation between his personal interests and his official role of President. There is no even the slightest hesitation of using the power of his office to punish his personal enemies, domestic or abroad.
By blocking Mueller, Ukrainians gain favor with Trump, who (with his Republican-controlled Congress) control the flow of weapons Ukrainians need to fight the Russian-backed insurgency in East Ukraine. They also get that if Trump is ousted in 2020, whoever replaces Trump will probably respect the norms of the Presidency enough to not punish them for it. Win-win for Ukraine. Win-win for Trump. Lose-lose for the American people.
4
Ukraine obviously wants to have its cake and eat it too -- that's why it's a no-go with the Mueller investigation.
Besides, Paul Manafort probably figures somewhere in this, so they aren't taking any chances, especially since Mr. Putin still has his eyes on the Crimean Peninsula and they will eventually need all the assistance in military fire power that they can get from the U.S.
There are no winners here.
2
This may be the one thing this betryed nation can use as a wedge to get their territory back. If I was running the place, I'd be using it.
Remember, they had nukes - then made the fatal mistake of trusting a U.S. Democrat president. The enire planet knows better than that, of course.
2
They had nukes. They couldn't launch them. Russia retained the electronic PALs.
Breaking the e-PALs was doable (est. 12–18 mos.). But the ICBMs were re-targetable only to the extreme Russian far east, the cruise missiles were disabled and not survivable anyway, and the tactical weapons gone.
In short, not a credible deterrent force. (Irradiate Korea and Japan to nuke the waters off Kamchatka ... for Crimea? The Donbass? Russia would overrun Kiev and the world would clap.)
Versus the cost: a) $2 bn to maintain (2.58% of the declining 1991 GDP), b) Western sanctions and isolation c) Beijing downrange and hostile.
Ukraine denuclearized. Cost-benefit, a defensibly rational choice. Belarus and Kazakhstan did the same.
Re-litigating this is reasonable (some have, and still think Ukraine did right). Calling it misplaced trust in a "Democrat president" is looking through the wrong end of a telescope.
3
You can bet the Russians will ensure a high-tech US missile placed in the Ukraine by Trump gets “lost” for detailed technical inspection.
Corruption cuts every which way in places like the Ukraine.
3
So Ukraine is suppressing information so that they can help Trump (Putin's puppet) stay in power so that Trump will sell Ukraine arms so that they can fight Putin's Russia???
4
So Trump is sending weapons to kill his bff Putin's soldiers. The Ukrainians better be careful of weapons malfunctions.
2
Oh, come now. The Maidan Square uprising was planned and financed by the CIA, executed under Obama and Hillary and they installed a puppet government that was so bad they had to chuck him out. Eventually, the chocolate candy producer Poroshenko was installed to sweeten the taste of pupettering. It was all part of the hate-Russia campaign to reinstall the Cold War.
And who do you think paid for the tanks, The dead broke Ukraine? Poroshenko? Of course not. We did.
The Ukraine administration is under full control of the U.S. administration and was from the day we chased the elected government out. If Manafort helped Yanukovych with his image to get elected or not is not the point here. That's how we elect everyone right here in the good old USA. Russia was the target.
We may have changed Presidents, but our mentally damaged leaders maintain the Deep State Mindset and horrific as it is, Trump's administration still operates on the same corrupt principles as his predecessors and their predecessors, for decades past. Swamp people.
Diogenes would throw his lamp away and fall down weeping today.
1
Hi, I live in Ukraine.
I struggled against Yanukovich regime on the streets. I fought against _russian_, SIC and russia-backed troops in the Donetsk region. And we (the majority of ukrainian people) despice and hate deceitful and cleptocratic Poroshenko (Valcman) government. The answer to puzzle is simple. Corrupted Poroshenko (Valcman) and his team don't need rule of law. They will not help to find the truth. It can shed light on their own spivvery. Some facts (if you interested deeper):
1. Porosh.'s Government NOT EQUAL ukrainian people.
2. Ukrainian people now have 2 big enemies: russian forces and antiukrainian corrupted government.
3. Escaped pres. Yanukovich was russian backed mafioso. Poroshenko worked in his gov and was co-creator of his pro-russian Party of Regions.
4. Pres. Poroshenko makes own multibillion business being state official for many years. Mossack Fonseca's top client Poroshenko proved by own deeds that he is a garantor of corruption in the country.
5. Ukr. people is very grateful to USA gov and americans for help and support. It's a good deed cos you help to stop russian neonazists' aggression worldwide.
6. Enough for now :)
Don't confuse gov. and people, please. We say big thanks to you and hope to demolish corrupted post-Soviet system.
I noticed many russian trolls here. They sow the lie. Be careful.
7
If Trump wasn't completely immoral he'd have no morals at all.
2
the missiles obviously bought their silence.
1
I wonder what your average political junkie in Ukraine has to say on this matter. They're probably not happy about this either, but then again, they do have to actively fight off a Russian invasion right now...
4
That's the kind of leverage you have when you are president of the United States. Trump, absurdly ignorant of government and how the presidency operates, and having surrounded himself with staff known for their extreme political views and not for their breadth of experience, is probably only finding out now what real power lies at his disposal.
1
When the next POTUS comes along, Ukraine may pay a price.
1
Yep. But Ukraine will have their missiles by then and Trump and the republicans in Congress don’t care about the damage this is causing.
So the question, "Did the Trump campaign conspire with the Russians and then obstruct justice to cover it up?" has added, "Did the Trump administration obstruct justice and conspire with the Russians to cover it up?"
The Republican Party has got to decide and decide soon whether to continue to commit treason by aiding and abetting these criminals and spies, or come clean and end this. And what Mark Meadows and his merry band of traitors are doing isn't convincing anyone they even pledge allegiance to this country, much less pledge to protect and defend the Constitution.
Take off those silly flag pins, you people put your country up for sale.
10
Another red flag. At least we know now that Ukraine is directly or indirectly involved in the scandal.
4
The snakes devour their own. In this particularly malevolent pit of writhing serpents, Russia is the biggest and nastiest python.
What a surprise.
1
Trump's actions in suppressing the Ukrainian government's cooperation in the Manafort and Russian conspiracy case is just another piece of evidence of his continuing culpability in conspiring with Russia to steal the office of the presidency of the United States. What a despicable treasonous rat Trump is.
5
The long, corrupt reach of the Trump administration is in full view here. Clearly this is more de facto evidence of Trump's blizzard of obstruction of justice. When, if ever, will the Republican Congress put Country before Party and exercise their Constitutional responsibilities? Regardless of your politics, every American who cares about our democracy needs to stand up and say "Enough"!
8
American citizens need to contact the Ukrainian embassy and tell them directly that we are watching and will remember what they are doing.
Trump will not be president forever. I think it's increasingly likely that he doesn't finish his first term. His odds of getting reelected are zero.
When sanity returns, the US will remember who stood up for the rule of law, and who didn't, when it mattered....
2
Ukraine is "hedging" against a change of regime in the US. Trump is pro-Russia, but the congress is not. Ukraine needs money and weaponry to fight the Russian insurgency today. They are walking a tightrope between what is today and what might happen tomorrow.
1
Shoving something into the dark has never solved a problem These crimes are not going to disappear, no matter how much some politicians want them to disappear. One day, someone will turn on the light.
3
Putin invaded the Ukraine in 2014 , reading Obama as a weak President who would do nothing about it.
Putin is a man who only understands force. Trump understands this and personally authorized the delivery of lethal weapons to the Ukraine. - that Obama refused
Of course it's payback. Politics IS a game of payback.
It is this for that, also called diplomacy.
3
Obama wasn't weak. He simply understood the rules of diplomacy better and opted not to drag this country into direct conflict with Russia over its invasion of the Ukraine.
Now we have Donald Trump and his war-hawk National Security Adviser, John Bolton in the mix, along with all the other Trump associates who might have questionable ties to the Ukranian or Russian governments as the Robert Mueller investigation has yet to swing into high-gear ...
So, 'You ain't seen nuthin' yet'.
1
Certainly a droll story, but I don't think Mr. Manafort will be money laudering his wardrobe anytime soon. And I get the shade this throws on our politics, which have morphed into something gangrenous, a pseudo race divide verging on religious war. I imagine Manafort in the interesting position of trusting the innocence of his conduct or hoping for pardon. And conduct leaves many clues, not all of them a secret ledger.
The Ukraine just cemented their reputation as an also-ran State in refusing to co-operate with a major investigation into domestic US political malfeasance. They also affirmed their puppet status with strings pulled by the Kremlin's puppeteers. I don't think that's a fanciful appraisal because the error they've made is that their relationship is with America and not with a disheveled, dysfunctional and deeply compromised Administration. Moscow must be getting desperate - also, the protester in the photo holding the placard 'You sold us to Russia' gets my tug of the forelock.
My tug too!
Our foreign policy is being driven by the need to protect a criminal enterprise.
2
They will regret this when Trump is no longer President. I would be very happy to hand Ukraine over to Putin again.
1
It's not your decision to make. They stood up and made a desperate and ultimately successful stand--bloodied but unbowed--when Obama and Merkel and the EU and numerous others were "expressing concern" when thousands of their citizens were killed and hundreds of thousands were turned into refugees.
2
Philip W - Every nation has the right to act in it's own best interests and Ukraine needs more sophisticated weapons to fight Russian aggression. Over 10,000 people have been killed in eastern Ukraine. Whilst diplomacy certainly reduced hostilities, Russians still occupy Ukrainian territory and fighting continues.
No collusion?
1
More evidence of our dying republic. A short time ago, this individual story would have been a scandal of Iran-Contra-like moment. An administration sells arms to a foreign government in exchange for help in obstructing an FBI investigation. But today, it barely makes the front page. It is just one in a daily series of outrages we have become numb to.
Sadly, our political system is ill-equipped to deal with an amoral administration willing to work through its international criminal network to achieve its ends. Congress no longer functions as a check on the executive branch and is willing to put partisan interests ahead of its institutional duties. Our only hope is in this increasingly beleaguered investigation and the unlikely prospect that the 2018 election isn't as rigged as the last one.
6
We should just generally stop selling arms to other countries anyways. It’s a really deplorable practice. But oh well, commerce.
2
Ukraine do you really think Trump will sell you defensive missiles that is suppose to protect you from the Russians?
He might sell you the missiles but Trump will sell the Russian the launch codes.
2
"...Viktor F. Yanukovych, the Russian-leaning Ukrainian president..."
"...whitewashing the politically motivated arrest and imprisonment of Mr. Yanukovych’s principal rival, Yulia V. Tymoshenko..."
Tymoshenko was arrested because she was unwilling to go along with Yanukovych's attempts to spoil relations with Russia to the extreme detriment of the Ukrainian people. Yanukovych was vying with Yushchenko for the title of American lapdog.
Tymoshenko was the "Russian-leaning" Prime Minister that was traveling back and forth to Moscow to try to salvage the sweetheart deal Gazprom had given Ukraine that would see them get below market gas and also billions in state revenue for transporting the gas via Ukrainian pipelines to the rest of Europe.
The Ukrainian state is essentially a puppet state of the US and Nato. Is it any wonder they aren't apt to bit the hand that feeds them?
"Oh, what a tangled web we leave when first we practice to deceive."
It is not that Ukraine is pro-Trump but rather totally confused what America is all about. How can you have the most powerful man in the world (yes Trump) constantly being harassed by some guy (yes, Mueller) who is getting paid by Trump. President Poroshenko keeps asking "Who's on first."
2
If Trump was all clean he and his cronies wouldn't go this far to obstruct the investigations. Its preposterous for Republicans to go to this length to enrich themselves and remain in power.
1
Isn't this collusion against a US government investigation by our own president?
1
It's pay back by the Ukraine that was left hanging in lethal limbo by the refusal of the Obama administration to deliver leather weapons to stop the advances of Putin's Russian "Volunteers" in her Eastern part. And politics is a game of reprocity
NY TImes readers may not like it, but Trump's policy vs Putin has been much tougher than Obama's when it comes down to the facts
-----
Read
http://foreignpolicy.com/2018/04/13/trumps-russia-policy-is-better-than-...
Trump’s Russia Policy Is Better Than Obama’s Was
.
By Daniel P. Vajdich | April 13, 2018, 10:32 AM
"If you strip away his ostensibly chummy personal relationship with Putin, Trump’s Russia policy has been drastically more assertive than that of his predecessor. In 14 months, here is what his administration has done:
Authorized lethal military aid to Ukraine. While former President Barack Obama’s administration continuously rejected lethal weapons exports after Russia’s invasion of
Ukraine in 2014,
Trump is said to have personally approved the policy. Whether he told his staff to downplay the decision is immaterial. In fact, Trump has gone even further, selling Javelin anti-tank missiles to Ukraine. These moves could fundamentally change the balance of power on the ground. To be sure, Moscow retains substantial military advantages, but U.S.-made Javelins in Ukrainian hands will reduce the Kremlin’s incentive for large-scale hostilities."
1
Another charge of Obstruction of Justice and Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice from Trump & his cohorts.
This is why Ukraine is in the position and shape she is...always with a hand out, on the take one way or another. Basically "bribed" into accepting US terms for resistance, in most cases, resistance from her own people. Its emblematic of how Crimea was lost, how the Donbas was lost, and how progress has been lost. Ukraine lost in '91, lost in '98, lost in '04, lost in '08, and headed to being lost in '18. Understand this: The "system" hasn't changed. Ukraine is still an oligarchy, and we have bad oligarchs, and worse oligarchs. That's it - pure and simple. Ukraine is on the path to continuing to be a vassal state - in this case to the Trump regime - in the past to the Russians. In all cases, not to herself.
Yet another remarkable example of divergent interests of the U.S. President and the U.S. Government.
1
The special counsel ought to be investigating whether pressure was applied by our administration to halt these investigations in return for weaponry. It certainly sounds suspicious.
13
“The State Department issued an export license for the missiles on Dec. 22, and on March 2 the Pentagon announced final approval for the sale of 210 Javelins and 35 launching units. The order to halt investigations into Mr. Manafort came in early April.” Then later in the article, “Ukraine announced on April 30 that it had received the missiles…” That sounds pretty cut and dried to me.
I found this just plain weird, “Ukrainian politicians, he said, concluded on their own that any help prosecuting Mr. Manafort could bring down Mr. Trump’s wrath.” Shouldn’t they be more fearful of Putin? Perhaps Trump’s Wrath isn’t as much a factor as is losing $600 million in aid and some really cool weapons.
“Ukrainian law enforcement allowed a potential witness to possible collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia to leave for Russia, putting him out of reach for questioning.” So now he is hiding out in Russia because he saw “something”. We know what happens to people like that.
“Mr. Horbatyuk reached out to Mr. Mueller’s office with a formal offer to cooperate by sharing evidence and leads.” He apparently sent a letter regarding this but received no reply from Meuller’s office. Was Mueller considering the source? Is this investigation not as solid as it appears?
“The cases were not closed, the prosecutor general’s office said in a statement, but the order blocked Mr. Horbatyuk from issuing subpoenas for evidence or interviewing witnesses.” Is this a foot in the door for later?
5
Sounds like another amazing coincidence where the Constitutional office of the president just happens to have influence over people who might have evidence against Trump the campaigner and possible conspiracist in Russia's cyberwar against Hillary in the 2016 election.
15
Outrageous. Call, email and otherwise inform the Ukrainian embassy and our congressional representatives that a government that blocks efforts to protect U.S. democracy, rule of law and national security should get no aid for its own democracy, rule of law and national security.
9
The Donald has found his element with the Eastern Block authoritarians. The rule of law means nothing to these people. They are all about money and power. Once TD is thrown out of office, it would not be surprising to find him moving his operation to a Putin protected province.
7
The power to make sovereign nations/witnesses shut up is clearly an immense help to Trump in this case. But it also shows how extensive the reach of a corrupt President can be. The damage being done to America by incidents like this is incalculable. Does no one in the GOP understand this?
19
it will take a generation maybe longer to recover from Trump.
Yet another reason to impeach trump. If Ukraine thought we would be able to hold trump accountable, there would be no hesitation on their part. They hesitate because they can’t count on us holding our own POTUS accountable. Sad and pathetic.
9
This is entirely and completely the work and responsibility of Donald Trump. Not Ukraine, not Mueller, not Putin, not Manafort not Pence, not Pompeo,
Trump has put forth a childish, and tragic plan to impede the investigation combined with a circular argument that Mueller's investigation should be halted because it is producing nothing.
Children do this, not the US President.
8
Trump is turning US into a China (as rampant corruption becomes commonplace), all while tearing down the rule of law. It's such a shame. Mark my words, he'll go down in history books in flame, even as he and his cronies amass their billions.
6
When a foreign country aligns itself with the president of the United States against a Justice Dept investigation something is truly very wrong. There is a lot to hide. There is a "there" there. How long before Trump starts signing up people at his crazed rallies to be "marshals?"
8
I know Ukraine. Seems likely this announcement is the public show, and meanwhile, they have funneled whatever Mueller needs to stiff Trump and his patron, Putin, under the table.
7
What does it mean that "we", meaning the US, are selling arms to Ukraine (and Saudi Arabia and others). "WE" the people and the government are not arms manufacturers and dealers. So, why is our president (and by default all of US citizens) a major salesman for the arms industry? I mean, who are "WE"?
6
This is the question that rarely get asked. Those who mention this publicly are obviously malcontents, the like of which this country can do very well without. "We" have been selling death in the form of weapons and ammo to all sorts of despots and criminal governments, as well as righteous allies, for longer than I (or anyone I know) have been alive. The term military-industrial complex of course refers to this dual role of arms broker and purportedly democratic government. Now that we have this brilliant stable genius at the top of the pyramid scheme that is referred to as the US government, one can reasonably expect an onrush of corruption and sleazy deals that will be resonating through this country for years to come. It has just begun.
1
So, now it's an international conspiracy. The GOP is destroying our country and the Republican leadership (McConnell and Ryan -- you are complicit!), and the Republican party is paying 20% of fundraising to cover Trump's legal fees! You are not upholding the Constitution of these United States.
8
There are potential obstruction of justice cases here, particularly if it comes to light that anyone in the Trump administration pressured Ukraine not to cooperate. Even absent that, some of the Ukrainian officials may be placing themselves in legal jeopardy.
11
That's just not true- you should try to know more than nothing
1
Trump isn’t going to be around forever. Why should the next administration support the Ukraine if, effectively, Ukraine sides with Russian mafia in hiding potential crimes?
23
Because Russia could walk in tomorrow. They are literally counting days at this point, not years.
1
I'm horrified that trump can threaten another country to keep them from cooperating with the Mueller investigation yet not surprised.To have such power given to such a totally corrupt man is appalling.His every move has a predictability to it..likewise the GOP who are allowing this maniac to destroy our country.McConnell becomes more power happy,like he's on some kind of drug,everyday.When will this end??
17
The Ukrainian Government officials are acting peculiarly.
It is obvious that they are covering up some sort of crime , otherwise the behavior would be of full cooperation.
This situation is short lived and it might turn against them , once a new majority will be in charge of the American government .
12
This is the swamp. It existed before Trump, but it's manifestly clear that he has no interest in draining it.
14
This is why the US needs a strong and professional Department of State. With a full staff who can sort this kind of thing out and prevent it from getting worse.
14
Query: What is the difference between rampant corruption in the current Ukrainian regime and the Trump regime?
Answer: The Ukrainians speak English with much thicker accents.
23
This is unethical for about a hundred different reasons.
9
The Javelin contract isn't about "defense", it's about corruption.
Javelins surely allow for a large range of American and Ukrainian "commissions" paid for out of $600 million in US "aid". But Javelins are completely useless, because Russia doesn't have tanks in Ukraine. Russia isn't in Ukraine, remember?
The Ukrainian defense minister sold overpriced ambulances that don't work, to the Ukrainian army in a $100 million contract through his own company, for a 10% cut, allegedly. And funny enough, there weren't the resources to investigate that, either.
Just like ambulances for the troops, the deal looks great to uncritical fools. But it makes a lot of sense to anyone who's paying attention. The fact Trump gets a win here against Mueller is just a bonus to people who don't care about either the US and Ukraine.
Putin is proud of his protege!
7
We live in interesting times. A handful of years after the annexation of Crimea, Ukraine has taken the side of the Russian regime.
16
That's easy to say from the remoteness of NY. Faced with a devil's bargain, Ukraine seems to have staked its immediate survival on the raw nuts and bolts of defense. How is that hard to see?
2
Another question from Mueller for trump...”did you inform the Ukrainian government that their purchase of these weapons system was contingent upon their non-cooperation with this investigation?”
48
So now Trump is even managing to obstruct justice in a foreign country by bribing its leaders with weapons. There's no end to his capacity for evil.
33
"But in Ukraine, where officials are wary of offending President Trump, four meandering cases that involve Mr. Manafort, Mr. Trump’s former campaign chairman, have been effectively frozen by Ukraine’s chief prosecutor."
Easy to forget that US regime change in 2020 lies ahead, not to mention boor emasculation in November of 2018.
17
More evidence of Trump corruption. This is getting more sordid by the moment. Let's ask how much pressure was put on the Ukrainians from the Trump administration to stop this cooperation.
Obstruction of justice, anyone? It sure looks that way.
32
This makes perfect sense. In the Ukraine they know how things work with a regime run by a Trump-style person.
30
It was reported several weeks ago that the missiles Ukraine was allowed to buy came with the requirement that Ukraine bury what it knows about Manafort.
It's just more obstruction from the Trump crime family.
27
It's no longer a question of how many impeachable offenses there have been found involving Trump, it's just a matter of how long the list will be. With every week that goes by, we learn of even more seedier and corrupt activities linked to the Trump, his campaign and associates. The upcoming trial of Manafort is going to air some very dirty laundry for everyone connected. Let's finally get to the bottom of this Siberian swamp.
11
Lets get this dangerous man our of power! Why do we let him, day after day, destroy America? Fop what? For fear of his wrath? He will be very emasculated in prison cells
4
The Mueller team does not need Ukraine's cooperation to trace the money trail, and they may prefer to operate independently to avoid any potential accusations that they are cooperating with foreign government entities.
11
how do you know what mueller might need when tracing money in a foreign country?
One can hope.
To summarize: Trump is buying Ukraine's silence with Javelin missiles.
Yes, it's a bit of a far-fetched conspiracy theory, I admit. But is it more far-fetched than the Obama birther conspiracy or Ted Cruz's father hanging out with Oswald?
12
So Ukraine is betting trump wins and United States (aka western institutions) loses.
3
Ukraine needs to do what is best for them. These investigations ultimately have no timeline.
2
My son is a USMC Javelin gunner (MOS 0352) and he reports that the US military is phasing this system out. The missiles run about $70,000 each but used properly, they can kill any tank fielded. The new replacements are simpler, cheaper, not quite as effective perhaps and probably more dangerous for the gunner.
3
Being a retired Army CSM , Ukraine has Recieved ( Clandestinely ) Plenty of Weapons from Poland and Germany and other European Members of the NATO Alliance to Bloody the nose of any Russian Advance , and Mr Putin knows it and he can't afford it , he's already tied down in his Mess he help created in Syria .
He knows he's Lost , The Soviet Union is no more and he has a Weak hand to play !
2
Great news! The Donald's best buddies with The Ukraine. He's got what Steve martin called "a getaway car"! Lucky guy! He can threaten to blow up the US at midnight, too, just like Steve. Remember? "Unless, of course," went that classic riff of his, "I get my three demands. A hundred thousand in cash, getaway car and I want the letter M stricken from the English language. See," said Steve, "you have to make one crazy demand, that way, if you get caught, you can plead insanity. Ha.... Getaway car..."
Is our country now being run by underground criminals under the auspices of a deranged leader? Everything this president accuses the Justice Department of, he appears to be guilty of in order to maintain the secrecy he needs. Talk about a deep state!
11
Why shouldn't Ukraine behave like other American 'allies' such as Egypt, Israel, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey while putting it's interests and values first?
4
Ukraine government has an obligation to act in the interest of its citizens. If I was fighting a war with Russia I might be more concerned about getting weapons than helping a foreign government with a corruption case. Also, It’s likely Eastern Europeans have a more relaxed attitude towards corruption than Americans.
5
It's of course quite possible that Ukraine, acting in its own self-interest, stopped cooperating with the Mueller probe as a way of reversing the Trump administration position on sending defensive arms to Ukraine. Going beyond that to say that Trump or members of his team actually brokered a trade of no cooperation with Mueller for military aid would, however, require a lot more proof. Personally, I don't think it likely, primarily because any such deal could not be kept secret for long in the leak-prone Trump administration, and would add yet another count of obstruction of justice to the Trump impeachment dossier, as well as one count of colluding with Ukraine to let Russian intelligence personnel flee back to Moscow. In addition, Ukrainians are better negotiators than this. They will deal with corrupt leaders, but they won't sell themselves cheaply. If someone representing Trump made such a proposal, Ukrainians would realize immediately that they had Trump over a barrel, and wouldn't agree to a deal where all they got was some anti-tank weaponry. In typical Ukrainian style, they would have demanded A-10 Warthogs, Abrams Tanks, Bradley fighting vehicles, and a few billion dollars in numbered accounts, and then groused about what a bad deal they got for years afterward. Maybe Ukrainian negotiating behavior has changed over the past decade, but if not, a Trump deal with Poroshenko on such bad terms does not sound plausible. Now, let the leakers prove me wrong.
3
the Ukranian government wouldn't even necessarily have to engineer any kind of deal, just make a decision they see as in their own interest, as governments do.
or...
Manafort, who has dirt on lots of top Ukrainians, has slipped into blackmail mode and caused individuals to make decisions he sees as in his own, selfish interest.
ultimately, the why makes a difference only to the individuals involved.
So, if members of the Trump administration encouraged this: obstruction?
2
If the republican majority in the U.S. congress cared about the rule of law, they would persuade Ukraine to cooperate with the Mueller investigation instead of gleefully watching Ukraine openly and notoriously protect the crook in the White House. What kind of legitimate government abandons its legal proceedings in response to this kind of blackmail? Maybe Democrats need to make it clear to Ukraine that future U.S. military support for Ukraine (starting January 20, 2019) depends on Ukraine not interfering with the rule of law. Congress must demand they restart the investigations and provide the relevant records to Mueller in response to his lawful subpoenas or face serious consequences for their obstruction of justice.
6
Wheels within wheels, people.
Elliot Broidy, whom Michael Cohen represented in hushing up Broidy's affair with a Playboy bunny, was just named as the target of an investigation in Ukraine into his "political advocacy" on behalf of a now sanctioned Russian bank, VTB.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2018/03/trump-donor-ukraine-criminal-prob...
Has the traitor in the White House shut down that investigation too? CREW is already on to this and I would expect we will hear more from them on this angle soon.
5
That the Ukrainian government would freeze assistance with Special Counsel Robert Mueller to prevent a Trump Twitter attack and the wrath of his petty, vengeful vindictiveness is appalling.
With “friends” like this, who needs enemies?
2
Ah, poor, poor Ukraine. I wonder which Trump cabinet member engineered this quid pro quo. Alas, it will not end well for Poroshenko.
2
HERE COMES THE MUELLER FIRING. LETS TAKE A BET.
Ty Cobb, Esq. just happened to want to retire in the middle of representing the President of the United States. Right. Just like Micheal Flynn retired, General H.R. McMaster, Ph.D. retired, Rex Tillerson retired, etc., so many people seem to retire around Trump.
2
some want to retire.
others just want to curl up and die.
lay down with dogs, get up with fleas.
You have to praise Trump, tell him how great he is, and agree to buy something ... at least you have to buy a MAGA Trump hat. Now if you agree to buy weapons that you intend to defend yourself against Russia, well, don't expect the highest quality because Putin won't put up with that. Its kinda like Putin's offer of weapons to Syria . . . you don't get the best unless you pay the best. So the first round of weapons is to clear out America's old stockpile ... then after it fails to accomplish what you need, come back with more Millions of Dollars... and, offer up a building site for a Trump Tower Ukraine.
1
Clear case of obstruction by Ukraine. Add them to your list Mr. Mueller.
3
Another avenue for Mueller to nail Trump - OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE. Use of American policy for personal gains (suppressing evidence of foreign involvement) is probably a treasonous event. HOW SWEET! The Dotard just keeps shooting himself in the foot. No more toes left - he's going down!
6
Ukranian "leaders" had better worry about offending WE THE PEOPLE and forget The Con Don.
Like all good mafia men I'm sure The Con Don and his Robber Baron brethren threatened Ukranian leaders. They had better cooperate with Special Prosecutor Mueller or they will have 99% of us to contend with after 2018 and 2020 elections.
WE THE PEOPLE will not stand by while The Con Don, Netanyahu, Putin, Erdogan and all the other democracy-destroyers try to start WW3.
Not now. Not ever.
15
no njglea,
so, you were on the front lines arguing for support (military and financial) for the fledgling democracy in ukraine and ukraine's "we the people" who were braving bullets and cold to build a democracy or was that "not your concern" then and you're just another blowhard with petty partisan concerns and a massively inflated sense of self-importance now?
if you didn't support ukraine's legitimate struggle against russian tyranny then and now and don't fully support US support for Ukraine's very real democratic aspirations now, then really you need to get off that soapbox.
1
James, you may be interested that not all of us are on your very pure pursuit of "democracy". See Bismark's view of the Balkens.
That said, your post, while a valid opinion in itself, has little to do with the content of njglea's post.
Ukraine,
You would get a much better deal if you told the truth about Trump, who at any moment could have his chits called in by Putin, who will then roll right over you, new weapons or no new weapons. What you need is a Unites States in partnership with a strong NATO, both aware of exactly who Putin is, to protect you for the long run.
20
the trump regime taints everything it touches. A small thing, but if FIFA has any sense it won't touch the North America World Cup bid with a ten foot pole, after trump's implied threat that there would be a cost to rejecting it. Too bad that Canada and Mexico got involved in the joint bid
24
Just more evidence that in electing Trump we have put members of an international criminal gang in charge of our country.
104
in the last 6 months, this guy Constantine Kilimnik has been accused of "having ties to Russian intelligence" literally hundreds of times in the US media without a single detail ever having been offered... yeah Kilimnik graduated from a Soviet/Russian military academy like 25 years ago, but you can't continue to offer that up as definitive proof (by itself) that he's a Russian agent. Everything I've read about Kilimnik suggests that he is a political hustler who is just out to make money - there are a ton of guys like that in Kiev. Manafort's lobbying activities obviously violated US law but if you are relying on Kilimnik as the main Russian connection, it looks pretty tough to prove the collusion strand through Manafort (consider the possibility that Trump-Russia collusion might have occurred somewhere else, for example via Michael Cohen). Maybe the case inside the investigation is stronger, but from what is known publicly, it doesn't look very convincing.
Besides his body guard raiding his doctor's office for his medical records without a release or HIPPA guidelines, this is another example of the mob-like behavior of this president committing conspiracy against the US.
46
The NY Times skips the part where Ukrainian "street protesters" were paid by the US State Department, CIA and NED and included neo-nazis who led the violence. No comment from the Times on how the US government bribes foreign governments, not just Ukraine, to do its bidding. In this case Trump is just continuing the bribery begun by the Obama and previous administrations. I look forward to a time when the Times tells the whole truth, not just that which supports its ideological agenda; the time when the Times becomes a guardian of truth, not just a promoter of whichever foreign government the US decides to overthrow because it is too independent.
4
I’m in Ukraine and was here during Maidan. What you are saying is a Russian lie.
6
It is not clear from the article that the Trump administration conditioned the missile sales on a halt of Ukraine's Manafort investigations or the release to Russia of Kilimnik, but it wouldn't surprise me if the administration did so.
Even if not, the idea that the process of justice in another nation can be halted by fear of Trump's reaction is absolutely chilling.
54
This is tantamount to an individual pleading the Fifth, which -- let's face it -- people only do when they're guilty. Had there been no wrongdoing, no subsequent communication/threats from Trump's goons, Ukraine would have no reason not to cooperate. But why am I commenting? All of this is obvious to anyone with a third-grade education.
21
How absolutely convenient, the Ukranian government isn't assisting Mueller's investigation and backed it up with an admission that this wasn't coerced by the Trump administration. Wonder if any Ukrainian government officials have their money in the Bank of Cyprus that our Sec. of Commerce was Vice Chairman.
19
Right on. This smells not just of fear of Trump tweets (a force not to be underestimated), but of legal vulnerability. I'm guessing the corruption extends to the prosecutors' offices also.
1
Fascinating. The timing is such that I can see Mueller inquiries into whether a quid pro quo arrangement was ever floated by US officials -- you get missiles if you help us shield the president from attack. if so, that is an abuse of power that would result in an impeachable offense by someone (the president if he directed it, or any subordinates who came up with that bright idea).
17
How about we halt the sale of the missiles to the Ukraine unless they cooperate with our special counsel?
30
Putin must be mocking Trump right now.
Likely he has been pulling Ukraine's strings from the get-go, or he's about to gain the chance to seize that country back into his control so he can "make Russia great again."
A final straw might be when Putin seizes all Trump holdings, on grounds of "corruption", once America dumps Trump.
4
Just another hurdle that Muller's team needs to overcome; this sitting President will do anything he can to obstruct the investigation - including using pressure on foreign powers to prevent cooperation with the investigation. Trump will face no consequences from this because, as with anything else he does, the GOP Congress will do nothing.
No surprises here, folks
16
Mueller can’t overcome the force of the military industrial complex. Must sell missiles and place troops everywhere on the planet. Everything else is irrelevant.
4
This is really going down to the levels of dictators in far away countries doing questionable deals with little regard for the voters or the rule of law. Has the US foreign policy really gone down to such levels?
7
So, who put the squeeze on Ukraine between March 2 & early April?
Bet every intel agency in Europe knows...and, the CIA & NSA, too.
10
My only guess, the Ukrainians. who made this decision, are not familiar with the expression, "Wow, that backfired", it's not about anything automotive, it's used in political speak, so in that context, it may present difficulty in translation. Soon they'll learn.
2
Even at this point in this short presidency Trump surprises nobody. And therein lies the problem. What is a surprise is how brazen and successful the Trump presidency has become. We are becoming desensitized to his bold attacks on political norms and democratic institutions. We are therefore at risk of reaching an inflection point in our national politics thanks to a desensitized public. Let us all please be doubly on guard, lest we numbly let it all go down the toilet.
18
A large percentage of occupants of the US (I hesitate to call them "citizens", which implies some level of obligation) don't want a constitutional republic; they want a king- someone who is blatantly above the law; a boss, a strongman, unencumbered by rules and laws. They want a boss who can beat up other bosses (the "my dad can beat up your dad" mentality), not a captain who can guide the ship of state through treacherous waters. How long the Republic can survive given the ignorance and incompetence of so many of its citizens is an open question. As Lincoln said, a nation divided can't stand.
There will always be people like Trump around. It is the people who against all evidence and reason continue to support him who are my major worry.
4
Not surprising, I think.
But interesting for what it says about how other countries view the operation of American politics. Avoid offending the one man at all costs. Congress is not in the picture since the GOP as a whole is on board with Trump, despite the few prominent defections. Even the Ukraine knows this . . .
5
Certainly makes it clear the KORRUPT governments work well with KORRUPT governments, and it also says that Manafort is very likely guilty of all the charges specified. Why else do you halt an investigation when someone claims to be innocent. You would wish to help them establish their innocence and not thwart any forthcoming proof.
4
Why does everyone involved in Tramp's "swamp" act like they have something to hide?
9
VOTE November 6, 2018. It's the only way we will get this corruption under control. And Ukraine, trump won't be Pres in 2020 and we will rember.
11
Collusion initiated by a President. Another thing for Mueller to investigate.
1
I suspect that Mr. Mueller has all that he needs from the Ukraine on Mr. Manafort and his efforts to assist Russia in the 2016 elections. And now the Special Prosecutor has another avenue to explore about Trump's obstruction of Justice. This provision of weapons and cut-off by Ukraine of assistance in this investigation almost certainly has ties back to this Administration. The Art of the Self-Serving Deal.
13
So this is how Trump gets tough on Russia. Offers missiles to Ukraine in exchange for squelching the Russia election interference investigations.
33
The latest item to add to the list of obstruction and collusion.
29
So we sell anti-tank weapons to shoot at tanks which could presumably only come to Ukraine from Russia? I can really see the love between Trump and Putin, for sure. Wait, don't tell me Finland is getting militaristic. How does one wage war from a hot tub anyway?
4
No, obstruction of justice via bribery & tampering
1
This is frightening. The corruption and obstruction of Team Trump are spreading to all parts of the globe...
32
Sure using same playbook to deal with local planning boards etc. in real estate business
1
This could end up back firing against a fragile Ukrainian government, if the people perceive them backing down in a Russian investigation. Ukrainians are already weary from the years of having a Russian puppet president who raped the nation. In their eyes Trump is America's Yanukoych. They're living with constant threat from Russia backed separatists.
Additionally, the current government is anxious to become a full NATO member, Poroshenko was elated to announce Ukraine making it onto the shortlist for membership. All great except Trump hates NATO would see the United States play a diminished role, which would make Russia very happy.
If Ukraine was savvy they would appeal to Germany and France as a replacement for US aid until the Pro-Putin Trump administration is done with.
7
Poroskanko made it to the short-skirt list--that's about all he gets.
Trump is the real candy man! Except for America's low income working class and poor, and future generations. Who will be crushed with the GOP's exploding deficits from tax cuts on their rich donors, and confronted with the crisis of rapid climate change.
9
Again, for an Administration that vehemently professes innocence ("No collusion, witch hunt, witch hunt!) they sure as heck act as if guilty!
24
Arming the "not so bad" guys is good business for managing covert machinations but how does one choose "not so bad" from the "truly bad"? So easy to meddle in other countries affairs from thousands of miles and an ocean away.
3
It's an easy distinction, for the architects of American foreign policy: the not-so-bad guys are the enemies of our designated enemies.
The above is true regardless of how very bad the not-so-bads might be. In the case of the U.S.-sponsored coup that ultimately resulted in Poroshenko's ascendancy, the not-so-bads were fronted by real, live, genuine neo-Nazis.
BBC Newsnight, February 2014: Neo-Nazi Threat in New Ukraine -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SBo0akeDMY
Trump is now being blackmailed, or compromised, by Ukraine. They are telling him that either you give us the arms we need or else we will cooperate with Mueller and give him all the evidence he needs to ruin your presidency.
That's what a compromised presidency looks like.
111
The idea that President Trump is compromised is absurd. If the Russian Federation, or President Vladimir Putin had any incriminating evidence against President Trump it is highly likely that they would have already released it. The 'election meddling' is an ineffective way to impact the turnout of an election, especially when you consider the fact that Hiliary Clinton won the popular vote, however, she lost the Electoral vote which is the only vote that actually means anything. The only impact 'election meddling' would have on our democratic processes and institutions is from further division and 'doubt' in our election process... Furthermore, Ukraine is playing it smart. Ukraine (after the protests) has taken a strong anti-Russian stance. So why would the current Ukrainian government look to severe ties with the strongest Western ally it has? Especially one that has the capacity to provide it with the weaponry it needs to discourage further Russian aggression.
3
I doubt the Ukraine would have the temerity to do that. But other, less supplicant countries sure might.
1
I doubt that the Russians who have "already released" any incriminating evidence they have on DJT, especially if he is still "reading from their script". The time to release any info(last resort) would be when DJT was no longer "useful" to the Russian Federation. So "The idea that President Trump is compromised is absurd" IS ANYTHING BUT!
2
So now we have the State Department and the Pentagon involved in what could be viewed as collusion and blackmail. What a country!
27
After reading this article I feel that our democracy is being taken away from us by Trump. Ukraine is openly admitting that it won't pursue criminal wrong doing by the previous Russian backed government because it fears Trump will withhold military aid needed to protect Ukraine against Russian military aggression. How can Trump have such unilateral authority?
21
Congress is equally complicit.
3
If this isn't treason, it's certainly in the ballpark. Trump's foreign policy is now hostage in service of his criminal defense. This just might be one of his worst crimes yet and we're barely one year into his "presidency". If Americans were not suspicious of Trump's behavior before, this should open a lot more eyes.
31
Hiss supporters eyes were obviously closed when they voted! I wouldn't hold my breath that they will (or want to ) open them any time soon.
2
How are the Ukrainians committing treason in the US?
1
So the Ukraine investigations were halted by a prosecutor described as anti-corruption? Doesn't sound very anti-corruption to me.
4
Then republican mafia won’t be in power forever. If Ukraine is considering its future, it would do well to consider those that have it, and the U.S., best interest in mind.
9
It certainly IS a Republican Mafia, and everyone involved should be tried by the RICO law. And the Ukraine should now be punished too.
2
This is the most compelling evidence yet that the Trump administration is obstructing justice. (In fact, I was not sure the facts were going to go beyond appalling to impeachable.) Trump's allowance of Putin's long and dangerous fingers into our politics and administration was also terrible, but this use of military sales to obstruct the Manafort investigation is a new level.
If Republicans in Congress do not rise up to defend the autonomy of their branch of government as a check and balance on this president, as well as to defend the nation from these intrusions from foreign pressures, they will lose any remaining reason to exist as a party.
101
Unfortunately, Congress has resigned any responsibility for governing: they left it all to Trump.
Canada has the world’s best relations with Ukraine. A dem group should lean on Trudeau and Freeland to talk some sense into them. We thought Ukraine was trying to join the west, not extort it.
9
Such cynical dealings are nothing new in US politics. What is new is the level of open corruption and hypocrisy.
Politicians and the dark money behind them at least used to be smart enough to attempt to cover their tracks.
We can only hope that the attention span of those American voters who love their country lasts long enough to vote in a Congress that puts country above party before it's too late.
9
At this point, the Trump administration is really laying the smack down on anyone and everyone.
Every time the Trump administration pressures outside contacts to cease cooperation with the Mueller investigation, or pressures outside contacts to do things to "help" American interests (whether the FIFA Cup or steel tariffs), it's not really benefiting the United States.
Tying this missile deal to Mueller now creates a bit of a win condition for Vladimir Putin where none before existed (either there are no new missiles in Ukraine, or a huge tap of information to the Mueller investigation is shut off). Trying to bully poorer countries by threatening to pull their aid over a sports tournament makes Russia look better. The steel and aluminium tariffs annoy America's allies and isolate her, putting Russia in a better trading position.
I wonder what sort of pressures the Trump Administration placed to get all of those articles placed the day after the WHCD apologizing for Michelle Wolf?
Every time the Trump administration does these things, think. What is the effect in the United States? What is the effect on that particular person/industry? What is the global effect? What is the effect on Russia? And you'll have your answer of why the Trump administration acts and who they are still acting for.
3
Whoever set up the Ukrainian non-cooperation has obstructed justice. We will find out!
PROSECUTE RUSSIAGATE!
As for the Ukrainian government's decision, it is extremely short-sighted. Trump won't be around much longer.
3
This might be an opportunity for Secretary of Defense Mattis to step up and advise the Ukrainians that their cooperation with the Mueller investigation is a condition of getting the missiles they want.
9
To quote one of my favorite movies: inconceivable!
1
Mueller does not need Ukraine's assistance. There are two points that Mueller needs to prove that Manafort sought Russian assistance (possibly indirectly through Ukrainian intermediaries) to help the Trump campaign OR to get favorable business deals for the Trump organization in exchange for political favors for the Russian Federation (example: no lethal arms for Ukraine, lifting of sanctions, etc...). He must also prove that Trump was fully aware of Manafort's activities withe the Russians and/or Ukrainians. This would be enough to prove 'conspiracy' - a.k.a. 'collusion'. Manafort will eventually 'turn' and provide Mueller with the evidence he needs.
4
Ukrainians wary and afraid of Trump? They are already in boiling water thanks to the greedy, corrupt Trump's stooge Paul Manafort their liaison, who is singing away like the the old lady. Ukrainians have dug their own grave. There goes their dream of joining the European Union because Putin is all armed and waiting in west Ukraine to walk in and annex their whole country.
2
Correction to the above comment. It is Russian held East Ukraine.
Trump's tweets are infecting the legal processes of America's allies. Does this not terrify anyone living in a democratic society?
13
“In every possible way, we will avoid irritating the top American officials,” Mr. Ariev said in an interview. “We shouldn’t spoil relations with the administration.”
Um... do you mean the administration that is going down in flames, is hated by a significant majority of Americans, and whose party is likely to lose all control of congress in just a few months? Bad, bad move. Everyone who who makes a devil's bargain with Trump pays a terrible price and gets nothing out of the deal. Wise up Ukraine.
13
Unsurprisingly, the obvious Russian trolls are already here.
Pity poor Ukraine. Its masses actually want transparent, accountable government and democracy and uncorrupt leaders. They take to the streets and brave bullets and cold to voice their views. And their reward? Little to no support from the west - basically not even one percent of one percent that we have thrown into unreceptive and futile desert quagmires. And this then opens the door for invasion and torment from neo-Fascist Russia that continues, murderously, to this day.
So who can blame Ukraine, battered and bleeding, for today's announcement? Lest we forget that trump the candidate basically threw Ukraine under the bus. Ukraine needs help - not bundles of money - but structural and ethnical guidance and backup. Ukraine has all the ingredients for being the Marshall plan of our generation - modest investments yielding a collosal rebuke to Putin the murderer and thug.
Russia has long made propaganda hay out of nonexistant "NATO in Ukraine." Let's make their fantasies a reality - support Ukraine, let them build, and give them a path to NATO and EU membership. What a wonderful opportunity to show the triumph of democratic civilization and humanity over Russian opportunism, cynicism, and endless lies.
76
Yes, yes, I completely agree with your observation that the Russian trolls are out in force. They are becoming easier to spot, I think: (1) superficial comments, sort of like Fox talking points; (2) utter lack of comprehension of the U.S. legal system and its place in a democracy; (3) comfort with Trump's authoritarian actions and talk; and (4) often a reference to Hillary or Obama - as a means to encourage divisiveness among us.
5
Unfortunately that ship has sailed.
NATO? You jest. NATO is a mutual defence pact amongst nations who bring resources to the table. I understand the US likes to see it as a geological stick to poke the Russian bear in the eye, but I'm not certain many of its allies and partners would view Ukraine as an asset towards NATO's official goals.
EU? We've got enough basket cases as it is. Ukraine's $60+ billion national debt is as good as in default and Ukraine would suck all the development financing out of the rest of EU.
If it was just about money, maybe the game would be worth it to stabilise Ukraine. But that kind of drain on the EU already creates internal political stresses within EU nations in the form of populist movements as well as between nations.
And tell me James, what happens when Russia calls the bluff and rolls over western Ukraine and parks 150,000 troops on Poland's border? Ya think the EU NATO members want to find out if the US will hold up its end of the NATO pact, any more than it honoured the Budapest memorandum that was supposed to protect Ukraine after it gave up its nuclear weapons?
No one trusts the US anymore, allies and foes alike.
I think they voted for Poroshenko.
The missiles and $600 million in aid from the U.S likely came from your Social Security Trust Fund and from money the U.S. borrowed from the likes of China, Russia and tax havens. It’s $600 million the U.S. does not, and will not have, and you as taxpayers will be forced to pay it back, with interest. Our Elected Politicians know this! Americans must remember this when their Social Security is automatically cut 20% to 25% in a few years!
We must find a way to hold self-interested and self-enriching Politicians and their staffers, past and present, from both parties, personally liable, responsible and accountable for the lies they have told US, their gross mismanagement of our county, our $21T and growing national debt (108% of GDP), and approximately 80T in future, unfunded liabilities jeopardizing our economic and national security, while benefiting themselves, their party, and special interest donors.
http://www.usdebtforum.com
3
The question will be if Trump promised aid under the condition that they obstruct the investigation.
15
Here's some background information:
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's support of the Ukraine’s signing of an agreement with the European Union as opposed to Putin's strong-arming the Ukraine into joining his Eurasian Economic Union, which Clinton had called an attempt to “re-Sovietize” areas of the former Soviet Union, is at the root of Putin's "pay back" when he authorized the hacking of the DNC server, release of the emails it stole, and authorized the use of the Internet to spread lies and disinformation about Clinton while overtly supporting Trump's campaign to harass and smear Clinton and Obama.
Any problems the U.S. has with the Ukraine today is driven by strong man Putin.
And, on another subject, James Comey knew all of this Clinton/Putin history, so why did he decide to further smear Clinton and stay quiet about Trump?
He has never answered that question. However, it is past time that he did.
106
Lest we forget that Hiliary Clinton won the popular vote and still lost the presidency. Electorates elected the president, not the majority. These very electorates were not impacted by the 'election meddling,' in fact, the election meddling is to simply create and fester doubt within our electoral process which it accomplished (look at yourselves). So, our own democratic institutions elected Trump, you need to look no further than at home.
2
Alabama, you're right: it's a big stinky mess. However, Comey is not at fault and has answered all forthrightly and reflects well on American institutions that remain standing despite an avalanche of squalor. Clinton kept Aberdeen on payroll and in top campaign post knowing her husband, Mr. Weiner, was a loose canon so to speak. Ridiculous Weiner brought this on, along with Mr. Clinton's ill-advised saunter onto Ms. Lynch's plan. Those two moves cost Hillary and the country dearly. Mr. Comey did the right thing in a unparalleled pinch. Hillary's men destroyed her. Too bad for the rest of us.
8
Comey has addressed the issue you raise in a couple interviews I've heard where the interviewer asked about it. However, his answers sure left a lot to be desired.
1
Remember, Ukraine is nothing but Russia, except smaller. But still big. The difference between the two conceptually amounts to what the difference is between the Roman Catholic Church and the Church of England. It is less than the difference between England and Canada, but not as big as the difference between Alabama and Massachusetts. Why Massachusetts? Because I wanted to see if I, a Canadian, could type it flawlessly without the aid of a spellchecker. (I did. So I don't have a spell-checkered past.)
It is well-worth reading the history of the Ukraine, from an independent, non-Ukrainian perspective. I won't print a spoiler here.
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Whatever common "sameness" Russia and Ukraine share, Russia agreed to the present borders and Ukraine's sovereignty back in 1994.
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And agreed to give up its nuclear weapons in return for its borders being respected. Interestingly after the last shipment of enriched nuclear fuel was shipped to Russia, Russia invaded.
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True. You are absolutely right, trblmkr. I am only trying to point at the similarness of culture, spirit, and attitude of the two nations: Russians and Ukranians. Maybe their politics follow suit as well?
Perhaps the only contention that separates them is language, and the fact they have become sovereign neighbours. In Europe it is an age-old tradition between nation states and countries, to hate your neighbours, and love your neighbours' neighbours, which are not your immediate neighbours.
Manafort, Trump or other surrogates of Trump probably didn't have to call Ukranian officials to get them to reverse their offer to cooperate with Mueller. The statement in the article is probably accurate that "Ukrainian politicians, he said, concluded on their own that any help prosecuting Mr. Manafort could bring down Mr. Trump’s wrath."
The chilling effect of Trump's wrath on a corrupt government had the effect Trump intended. Fortunately our intelligence agencies, our judiciary and our press have not buckled under all of the statements Trump has made to undermine all of the statements Trump has made to undermine them.
Imagine how much more quickly this investigation would have been concluded if Trump had cooperated and if Republican congressional representatives had not colluded with Trump in the cover-up that continues.
Now Congressmen like Mark Meadows are even trying to impeach (not Trump) but Rod Rosenstein - for doing his job. I think Meadows and his colleagues will regret that.
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bizzare, isn't it?
But regret being stupid, or completely ignorant about how the government is run? ADA's can't be "IMPEACHED."
Assisting the Trump administration in their attempts to obstruct justice by thwarting a criminal investigation is not something I would admit to. These Ukrainian officials are idiots and they're asking for trouble.
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Agree about Meadows. Same applies to Ukraine. Trump will be gone eventually and Ukraine will still hold the stink of its association with Manafort and Trump. Given a choice, companies , NGO's, tourists and official international bodies will go somewhere else. Skad Arps hopes it will just blow over but it's smeared too just like McKinsey when its Chairman was convicted and jailed for insider trading.
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This is a great example of how our country is being perceived as more of a banana republic than a nation of principals and laws.
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Once again, the definition of Banana Republic.
A banana republic refers to certain Central American nations whose entire economy depended upon one cash crop; bananas, and whose militaray-backed dictatorship ceded significant power and control to the company that owned the banana plantations and ensured the safety of the banana crop.
The United States, for all it's foibles and contradictions, and it's present mockery of a President, is not close to any banana republic. The US economy is and will always be widely diversified.
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I guess old Trump's ego is being inflated again by strong arming a small eastern European country -another example of the hoodlum we have in the WH
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The unwillingness of the Ukraine to cooperate with the Mueller investigation should truly horrify any decent American. We have a Regime that is so corrupt and willing to destroy the "rule of law" with their lies and coverups that they are willing to destroy our credibility with world just to protect themselves.
Our democracy is in trouble. All decent and Patriotic Americans must vote out the Republican's in November so we can protect our Nation from this corrupt Trump Regime.
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Add it to the obstruction charges.
At some point there will not be enough paper in the DC metro area to print the list of criminal and impeachable offenses the don of the trump crime syndicate has committed.
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So much hiding, lying and obstruction in so much places! OMG, don't look here, Mr. Mueller!
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"We shouldn’t spoil relations with the administration." But you've now spoiled relations with over half of the US population. Ukraine has also played directly into Putin's hands by facilitating Trump's obstruction while also simultaneously confirming by inference that there is substance to the investigation that is worth covering up, and possibly producing further charges in the future. I had sympathy for Ukraine's plight with Russia; now I don't. By distancing themselves from the rule of law and helping undermine Western democracy to facilitate a small arms sale, they have proven they belong in the former Soviet sphere after all rather than aligned with the West.
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My guess is that the small arms deal is not the end of the matter. The Ukraine can resurrect these proceedings at any time. I am sure further deals are in the pipeline to prevent that from happening.
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Ukraine delivered key evidence of Manafort's financials to the special prosecutor which directly led to charges. This is a strategic move, not a cover up. The case is delayed, much like Flynn's sentencing. It has not been closed. You had sympathy for Ukraine's plight and now because of this do not? Then you have no understanding of that plight to begin with. If we had put tanks in Crimea and Donbass in 2014, there would have been no interference in our election, nor a need for a special council because Trump would not be president. Ukraine is not a pawn in your partisan goals. Their problem is the problem of all rule of law abiding nations. They are BUYING arms not selling them and in no way does this undermine Western democracy. That's Russia's business.
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Who are we to lecture Ukraine? Ukraine’s government has one essential job — to do what best serves Ukraine....
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The ONLY solution - get to the polls and boycott the GOP.
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The GOP's campaign will be that the democrats will take away "your president" if you elect them - as if that was a bad thing!
This is clearly a textbook example of "deep state" institutional corruption that Trump's conduct and example have bred. The person at the very top impacts people and organizations in nefarious direct and indirect ways. This indirect corrupt influence to protect an ethically-challenged POTUS may very well endanger the freedom of millions of people in eastern Europe. Sad.
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You have to hand it to the trump criminal gang -- they are offering "protection" in the form of missiles in exchange for protection in the form of collusion to prevent an investigation into US domestic crimes and treason. I'm sure once trump and the gang is gone, they will very willingly "help".
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This makes the Trump gang look even more guilty. That the Ukraine is afraid of cooperating with the Mueller investigation just shows that there IS information that would harm Trump and it needs to stay hidden. You don't want to upset the mob. They will remove any protection that they are providing you.
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You are absolutely correct because if he was innocent, they would do everything in their power to prove it so they could remain on his good side and he could get the "witch hunt" behind him. LOL
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The corrupt political brotherhood bands together. Lock up Volodymyr Ariev as soon as Trump goes down. We need to rid ourselves of this kind of pestilence.
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I see. David Sakvarelidze believes there wasn't any quid pro quo. However, Ukrainian officials are terrified Trump will withdraw US support for the beleaguered state effectively dooming them all. I have to agree. Trump's actions qualify as rank intimidation more than quid pro quo. Evidence for potential obstruction of justice has suddenly become international. How interesting.
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Let them know a democratic congress wont be so understanding.
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Congress needs to pass a law blocking the sale until the Ukraine starts co-operating.
Trump is not king.
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The real issue is this: your ignorant of U.S. laws and the powers vested to each branch of the U.S. government. For your reference: http://www.dsca.mil/resources/arms-sales-congressional-review-process
Your comment is ironic. From your link:
"Congress, however, is free to pass legislation to block or modify an arms sale at any time up to the point of delivery of the items involved."
"Congress needs to pass a law blocking the sale until the Ukraine starts co-operating."
This is why NOVEMBER 6th, 2018 may be the most pivotable date in the last 100 years.
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CIA and FBI will need to investigate whether any quid pro quo was communicated by State, DoD, or administration official. Ostensibly Ukraine non-cooperation would affect the ongoing DoJ investigation. The five sisters should not wait for the current administration to start digging.
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When does the GOP stop being complicit in Trump's attack on the USA? When do the Republicans finally take the side of the people, to protect our constitution and to push back against tyranny? There is little doubt that Ukraine going dark is on the co-orders of Russia and the White House. This is treason folks... plain and simple. Get woke.
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Remarkable comments here by presumed Americans: “Ukraine, please us, not the guy we elected!”
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We didn't "elect" Trump; Clinton won 3 million more votes, and Trump stole the Electoral College because Russia interfered in key swing states.
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more obstruction by trump! lock him up!
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Someone please tell Ukraine that Trump is not a king.
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Quelle surprise. Trump and his administration obliquely or directly obstructing justice in other countries.
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And at taxpayer expense.
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They are selling the weapons, i.e. making money...
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Ukraine would be well advised to remember Trump will not be president of the United States forever.
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...or even for very much longer.
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Ukraine remembers that it used to be part of the Soviet Union and that Russian President Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin does not fight by twitter and speech. Russia will be near Ukraine forever and Putin will be President of Russia until 2024.
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The Ukraine is probably also aware by now that the United States is incapable of long-term planning and only does what's in its best short-term interest.
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Ukraine - Trump is short-lived. We will not forget your lack of cooperation.
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An honest administration with nothing to hide would want to permit any legitimate investigation to go forward that could possibly shed light on the illicit, possibly treasonous, activities of one of its citizens.
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There is nothing honest about this investigation. Remember McCabe, Strzok, Page, et al. All liars.
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So now obstruction is being outsourced.
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maybe not. trump probably offered them a deal they couldn't refuse.
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