Trump is all for vetting at the border [though he ignores the fact that it is going on] but he is furious at the vetting being done by Mueller et al. about events leading up to Trump's migration into the White House. He fears that Mueller is unbuilding the wall Trump has built between what he says and the truth.
2
We already have enough people in the country and don't need more immigrants. They need to fix the problems in their own country. I'm sure many around the world would like to come live in the U.S. but we can't realistically take them all. We're already the 3rd most populous nation in the world.
8
Unfortunately, the blowhard with the megaphone is the one who will be heard. Oh, and just how is the frump's mother-in-law with the special pass doing?????
2
This is all a sham. Talk to any recent immigrants to our country and they will tell you this is all about jobs and that the asylum angle is just a ruse. Sure there are areas in the countries in question that have gangs and violence but so does Chicago and San Francisco. We are being had folks. Have any of you who are pleading for these people been to Central America or ever talked to a recent immigrant? The other aspect of this is that politicians hope to quickly be bolstering voter rolls as soon as the next presidential election and the law can be changed to allow all residents, illegal or legal to vote.....
8
If Trump really wanted a wall, he would have signed the comprehensive immigration reform bill that Congress recently proposed to him, and that contained massive increasing of border security spending, a FULL funding of the wall, and his own DACA proposal.
Instead, he refused.
So why is he whining today about insufficient border personnel and the absence of a wall?
The buck stops with him. All he had to do to solve this problem was to sign the bill.
So there will be NO wall, and no immigration reform under Trump. And as this op-ed remembers, that simply means that the government will continue to enforce current, existing immigration law, also for the 200 people now at our borders and legally applying for asylum.
The only reason why Trump refused to do anything about immigration is because he's hoping that his voters will ignore that he had the chance to fully achieve his campaign promise on this issue, and that by not solving anything he can continue to campaign as he did before he was elected, which is then supposed to ... elect him once again.
MOCPE.
Most corrupt president ever.
1
With China taking over Asia and Russia on the offensive in Europe and the Middle East, the US should focus on opening a new chapter in the Americas by furthering integration on the continent. The US could work to create an open borders agreement based on the EU and require member countries to submit to common laws, education (hopefully agree to have everyone learn English with English the official language of government and business), and law enforcement. This would help the citizens of all countries, allow the US to stop the drug and slave trade throughout the continent, and improve the prospects for all nations, including the US.
1
Amazing, watching brand new state of the arts buses loaded with "migrants" headed for the US border for asylum.
Beautiful, colorfully coordinated tents and supplies for all these "stateless" people.
Who is funding this caravan, the Russians?
10
"First, the caravan is hardly an anarchic and lawless endeavor.
The biggest "anarchic and lawless endeavor" threatening this country is not the coming from the caravan; it is coming from the Trump administration and its incompetent government-destroying cabinet, its spineless destructive GOP and Freedom Caucus enablers, its wealthy "hate government" donors, and its angry, deluded base.
6
It is entirely fitting that Donald Trump is apparently utterly terrified of less than 200 mostly women and children legally seeking asylum in the US.
The Donald is apparently deathly afraid of nearly everything, from paper towels to non-junk food to a few abused women and children.
Of course, the National Guard troops have precisely zero value, as the asylum seekers are looking to turn themselves in, are unarmed, and carry no drugs. The National Guardsmen can't process those seeking border bureaucrats to surrender to, so their presence their mostly just consumes space and oxygen.
3
The truth staring us in the face about "the caravan" is that this in just a more public and theatrical version of foreigners for decades routinely endangering the lives of their children, using them as hostages for ransom of admittance and a green card, in order to invade the United States against the will of the democratic majority of American citizens. All these parents who either bring, or send their children to cross the border alone ought to be arrested and jailed for child abuse in the worst Devil's Island like prison we can devise. And then their children put up for adoption or raised in government facilities funded by the industries in the USA that lure the parents into the US in order to us them as slave labor, and confiscations of the billions that the corrupt Latin American oligarchies have in US banks.
16
FYI: the majority in this country voted for strict immigration and asylum laws long ago already.
So of course bringing your family to the US border to ask for asylum isn't illegal or criminal. And sending most of them back isn't illegal either.
4
I am just astonished at the level of bigotry, spitting hatred, hard-hearted revulsion, suspicion, and every other negative feeling that a human being can express toward a stranger in need, so emotionally expressed in these comments. I have worked with SE Asian refugees in Thailand and Ivoirian refugees in Ghana. People do not flee their homes into an unknown future with a gaggle of sick/starving/injured/molested children for the fun of it. They stay until they are absolutely sure there is no other option, and then they grab what they can carry, if they still have anything, and run.
Two Cambodian refugees I helped were the salutatorian and valedictorian of their high school classes, who became a social worker and a civil engineer. The rest of their siblings became a physician, a donut shop franchisee, another social worker, a kindergarten teacher, and a restaurant inspector for the city board of health where he lives. They are all married, pay taxes, own their homes, and some of them have kids starting college. It is my experience that many refugee families are educated people, often the targets of social or political reprisals (read: assassination). They bring a strong work ethic and a hunger for education (which has often been denied them in their home countries for social/political reasons). They work back-breaking menial jobs while taking English classes to mainstream themselves. They know this is their one chance and they take it seriously.
4
Don't forget that it was that paragon of liberalism, Jerry Brown, who didn't want to admit Vietnamese refugees during his first tenure as California governor.
3
Why don't they head south to Panama? Sure is a lot closer.
15
Many immigrants from the south come here to harvest crops. A farmer said on NPR this morning that he's starting to have trouble getting the people he needs to do that harvesting. As a solution, he's thinking of moving his farm to Mexico. Is that what the Trump administration wants? We need new, comprehensive immigration legislation, the kind the Republicans refused to work on under Obama, as they refused to do ANYTHING constructive under Obama. Republicans and this administration don't have a leg to stand on.
5
Taking political advantage of the plight of 200 defenseless people underscores the moral direction of our president.
6
"an opportunity to fan the flames of bigotry."
2
It seems that we, in the USA have created this monster problem.
In the 80's President Reagan, with his illegal Iran/Contra support of the repressive regimes of Nicaragua, Guatemala and El Salvador, enabled the repressive atmosphere that started creating refugees to the US, including children.
Some of the young men as they grew up couldn't find jobs and joined gangs in the US, were arrested and sent back to those countries from which they came when they were young children. With no connections left in country, they joined together with other deported gang members and formed the violent gangs that are causing all of the issues down there that the Caravan people are trying to escape.
As with the challenges on the Mid East, this was caused by the unintended consequences of our misguided former policies. It is, therefore, our responsibility to address it.
4
The comments here seem to all be in favor of having a fairly open border. If that is the case why is there no interest in simply annexing the failed states to the south of the US down to the Panama Canal? That way the corrupt governments and oligarchs, who all have lily pads in the US anyway, can be swept away and these countries can be made states of the US. They would welcome social security and the benefits of US law. The lands could be developed. Spanish is the lingua franca for California and Texas already. There is no cultural barrier. Birth control could be introduced. Violence against women could be reduced with the US legal system. If the US does not get the benefit of the natural resources and land why should the US citizenry pay to support the population excess that these countries are exporting? Then they should be forced to stay in their own countries and with the loss of the decompression and transfer payments you can be sure there would be violent revolution just as in France or the US several hundred years ago. I say let all central Americans and Mexicans be part of the US. But let the US have the resources to develop so they can be supported.
8
All immigration debate - asylum or otherwise, should start with a fundamental question: why do you want to keep people out of this country?
Obviously the administrative side of undocumented immigration is a challenge. The same could be said of vehicles registered in the owner's previous state, or voting registrations with addresses that are out of date, or ciuntless other administrative issues that are both unquestionably problematic for their respective agencies and generally not politically explosive.
Beyond the administrative problem, immigration - properly documented or not - is a net positive on both economic and public safety grounds. So why do you care so much more about that than the countless other administrative problems our government faces?
"The vetting of the caravan, in fact, shows that the immigration laws are quite strict, and that they work. That Mr. Trump says otherwise shows he sees not a group of fearful people fleeing from terror to freedom, but an opportunity to fan the flames of bigotry."
It also shows how absolutely ignorant Trump is of the applicable laws and processes for immigration and asylum, not just by our system, but international treaties.
2
Fact is 80% do not attend their court dates. That is a statistic the editors call a success. Do you understand why many readers think you are out of touch with reality?
23
Please cite the source of that 80% figure. Thanks.
4
Can the NY Times investigate the history of US involvement in Central America? How about current involvement in Honduras?
Has US support for the powerful against the powerless had any impact on present-day issues?
Thank you.
3
It is not bigotry to refuse to let every person from Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador move here.
19
Sally, as not everyone is allowed, your point is invalid. The bigotry the article refers to is the bigotry of misleading Americans about who these people are, why they are coming here and what are laws actually provide. Trump is trying to make people be scared of the "other" so as to generate resentment for his own political benefit. It is outrageous and the hallmark of a small man not a leader. He omits the fact that only those who meet the high standard can qualify for asylum.
2
We have seen this before:
"The US (and other countries in the Western Hemisphere) could have saved thousands of Jews from the Nazis. They didn't. At one point, the US literally turned away a ship of 900 German Jews. Shortly afterward, it rejected a proposal to allow 20,000 Jewish children to come to the US for safety."
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/1/27/14412082/refugees-hist...
2
It is easy to have empathy for the folks in the caravan. This does not change the fact that we need a reasoned discussion on immigration. How many, from where, does the lottery make sense, is our chain migration system which favors Asians and Mexicans logical, given the Southwest’s water issues, can they stay there? And many other issues. We fight the immigration battle based on emotion, not based on what is right for the country. It is time to act hash this out.
15
Another tree duly noted. The forest is the story, however, and we're watching it accelerate towards a climax: the GOP has committed explicitly to opposing the very idea of fact.
This is treason. It strikes at the foundation of our democracy. Our nation is founded on the fact of fact, on the idea that some observable realities achieve the status of irrefutable self-evidence. No matter how divided we seem to be over the questions of the moment these realities are the bedrock of our society. Self-evidence is what makes equal justice possible. It underlies scientific progress. It's the engine of capitalism.
The Times is a daily mosaic of examples from all sectors and every state: immigration, science, law, business. Put them all together and the suicidal aim of the GOP is plain: they want alternative facts, determined not by empirical proof but by their own faith; and they demand the right to impose that on others.
They seek cut-outs and exclusions from reality. They want to dwell in a fantasy while they attack and exploit the society that guarantees them safety, clean water, freedom from epidemics, rescue from acts of their vengeful God, and jobs provided by the science and engineering that their thinking could never have engendered.
Everything they do towards that end is failing. It has to fail. It's not just this caravan or his sleazy conduct or his taxes that Trump and his doomed party won't acknowledge. It's the lie they live by.
3
The truth the NYT doesn't report about immigration.
Before the 1996 election, Bill Clinton and Al Gore concocted a plan to naturalize 1M immigrants with the expectation that they would thereby vote Democrat and shove Bill & Al into a second term. The plan included forcing the INS to reduce its background checks, including the processing of fingerprints and checking for criminal backgrounds.
Check "Sellout" by David Schippers, who documented the illegal activities leading to the impeachment of Wild Bill Clinton. Then think about whether the NYT has your best interests in mind regarding immigration.
15
Why is the right wing always on about "your best interests?" Didn't any of you go to Sunday school (or Kindergarten) and learn to consider others first? To share when you have more than enough? To care first and question later? The NYT is not obligated (and thank god it doesn't) to consider "your" best interests. Its obligation is to report truth.
1
It is true, our asylum laws are clear.
I am not against immigration.
But truthfully, when the asylum seekers are released and have to pursue their cases in our immigration system, knowing that they may get rejected, the asylum applicants go underground and become one of the thousands of undocumented immigrants living amongst us.
This is the unwritten follow-up to the asylum application process.
It's not a value statement. It is a statement of fact.
16
The unfettered migration, immigration or whatever, of both illegal and legal people into our nation is an intentional continuation of the 'colonization' of our nation by the 1%.
Lowering our living standards, jobs, wages and overall quality of life. We must now accept this or perish. This is exactly what the 1% want. To colonize the US is to reduce us to less than, in all ways similar to that of third world countries. It is also called the 'Brazilification' of America. We're almost there. yay
16
Melania Trump's parents and sister are living here and are getting around all the rules to get citizenship. How does that work? Melania herself came on a visa for people with extraordinary abilities. Who did Trump pay off to get that accomplished so he could marry her?
1
Where will these caravan people all live? There are 1,000's of homeless individuals, including American families, on wait lists in San Diego alone. Do the caravan people not only get to jump the queue for entering the country but for housing as well?
We have a homeless crisis going on in our nation, if you haven't noticed. California's is one of the most dire. But by all means keep piling on more impoverished illegal immigrants. Like our municipalities can afford it, as well as schooling, busing, special ed/ ESL classes, medical care/ER visits, et al.
Our crowded roadways and transportation systems are maxed out too.
17
Plus, their children will be privileged above yours when it comes time for college admissions and job hirings.
Why? Because they "overcame" unlike the rest of us who played by the rules and worked to overcome.
The 1percent prefers to pick the winners and losers of American society instead of playing by the rules and letting the best on the merits win. Imagine if sports were like this, and we gave extra points for hard-luck stories...
13
LM: then why do Californian still vote for democrats and sanctuary cities? You reap what you sow.
7
Hopefully in the homes of open borders enthusiasts.
8
There are two groups of truly fearful people here: the asylum seekers who have a legitimate fear for the lives and well-being of themselves and their families, and the Trump worshipers who tremble because their vermillion leader commands them to. In the short term, the best thing the Trumpistas could do is to calm the heck down. For the long term, the US would do well to make the Western Hemisphere safer and more prosperous.
2
Wagon Train! How many of us remember that television show of the 1950s, about the heroic Americans who drove caravans across the West, straight into the lands belonging to the original peoples of the continent. From the middle of the nineteenth and even into the twentieth, thousands of European Americans ― maybe as many as 500,000 ― traveled westward in these caravans. Some stopped along the way to settle, but mostly they wanted to reach the riches of the gold country, to improve their economic conditions. You can bet any number of criminals and fugitives were among them. They didn't even request asylum. These Emigrant Trails even had names: Mormon, Oregon, California and Santa Fe Trails, for instance. The military built forts along the trails to help and protect emigrants who were a miserable lot ― poor, desperate, malnourished, dirty and diseased. The caravans ignored boundaries of native territories, and the government eventually confiscated native lands to turn over the motley colonists. Americans gave the trails and the migrations a fancy term, Manifest Destiny, which meant their God-given right to cross the continent and not let anyone or anything stand in their way. For the most part, the Indians left the caravans alone, realizing only too late the tragedy the hordes of migrants would bring to them.
I don't expect the American voters will make the same mistakes the Indians did.
That's why immigration is such an important national voting issue. When the Courts and common sense fail, the voters will be represented.
9
If a person is threatened by violence from criminals in their neighborhood this does not make the whole country in which they live unsafe for them. Instead of moving to another country they can just as easily move to another city. This is a question that immigration officers at the border should be asking of those people.
14
"The vetting of the caravan, in fact, shows that the immigration laws are quite strict, and that they work". Did it not occur to whoever autored this piece that the reason that the "immigration laws are quite strict, and that they work" is due purely to the fact that the immigration policy in this case here is being set and directed from the executive branch of which Trump is in charge of.
In fact it is inconceivable that under the Obama administration out of hundreds who approached the border wanting to claim asylum, only eight migrants — three mothers with four children and an 18-year-old man — were allowed to apply for asylum. And the only reason it has been so limited is because Trump called out this caravan, who believed it had carte blanche to enter the US, way before it arrived at the border.
In addition the claim made here that "under international treaties" the US is required to allow members of this caravan inside the country to apply for asylum is not at all accurate. And this is because these people are currently in Mexico, which under the law is the 1st safe country they arrived in, and so the obligation to allow people to apply for asylum lies with that 1st country.
This is especially true in this case where the overwhelming majority of those seeking safety from the countries they left have found safety in Mexico. So there is no basis to a claim by a few individuals that for some reason they can only find asylum in the US.
17
Given an opportunity almost all third world would migrate to USA. They will use whatever pretext for that. For people who organize these migration caravans, it is a profitable business and these desperate people will do anything to come to USA. But people of this country must understand certain basic facts. People who are coming to this country are bringing with them their culture, political and economic ideologies ad religious beliefs. These people because of their political, economic, cultural and religious beliefs made their societies miserable and will make this country also miserable if uncontrolled immigration is allowed. If you do not want that to happen, please make sure to control immigration. Elites at NY Times do not understand what is really happening.
19
So wait... let me make sure I understand this...
These people are fleeing countries where there is no rule of law, where democratic principles are trampled, and free speech is virtually non-existent. Their "beliefs", therefore, include the right to free speech, the right to be tried fairly in a court of law, the right to confront their accusers, and the right (in essence) to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."
And you're saying that these beliefs are a bad thing? That they "made their societies miserable" because of said beliefs?
Very curious statement to make...
2
We are saying there is no right for all of them to move here.
1
Something I have not seen explained in news about the caravan is why do they go to Tijuana? Coming from the Guatemala border it is twice as far, another 1500 miles, as Matamoros on the Texas border and means crossing a nasty desert. Do they feel they will be more welcome in California? If they request asylum it is federal immigration one place or the other.
18
What i find frustratingly absent from all this discussion is: What exactly is the international community doing about the violence which has gripped those 3 nations (Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador)? How come the marines haven't landed there yet?
9
Melania Trump's parents, in their 60's, have applied for and will likely receive US citizenship, even though they have never lived here, simply because they are her parents. This "chain" migration is fine with Trump, another one of his dirty little secrets. What do you think he promised Homeland Security for this gift, or did they do it just so they could ask him for something? What about the 1,500 children seized by ICE that they now can't find? And as to refugees, although we're happy to bomb Syria, we admitted only 11 Syrian refugees so far this year. Exceptions for Trump, cruelty for the rest.
4
The parents of Melania Trump, and their are just 2 of them - not 1+million every per year, are both well- educated and had careers. For that matter, so did Melania, who studied architecture in college before becoming a model.
7
While this editorial draws readers’ attention to those members of the Caravan who are requesting asylum, the organizers of the Caravan knew from the start that the Caravan was attracting many who would be trying to cross our border undetected. Buzzfeed reporter Adolpho Flores traveled with the Caravan. In a 3/30/18 article titled "A Huge Caravan Of Central Americans Is Headed For The US, And No One In Mexico Dares To Stop Them",
he wrote that organizers estimated that approximately two-thirds of the 1,200 migrants were “…planning to cross into the United States undetected or for asking for some type of protection like asylum.
As they walk, the migrants chant, "“we aren't immigrants, we're international workers” and “the people united will never be defeated.”
Where are all of the people who planned to cross Mexico to enter the U.S. undetected? Have they followed the organizers’ original plan to separate from the main Caravan, as it approached the border, to cross into our country illegally? Who is funding this Caravan, and others like it, that organize foreigners to move here illegally?
19
What I do not understand about this process, either at our borders or those attempting to enter European nations, is that they have left their dangerous home countries and have entered safe countries, such as Mexico. When they then arrive at our door, it seems to me that they are no longer in danger and that they are now simply 'shopping' for the best deal rather than still frightened for their lives. I dont blame them, who wouldnt do the same for their families, but denying people asylum in those instances merely means they would stay in Mexico, but not return to their dangerous homes.
20
During the campaign, Donald Trump told a reporter that while he felt sympathy for the plight of the unemployed coal miners, he (Trump) would never have stayed in a situation of poverty had he been born into a family of coal miners. Somehow he would have lifted himself out of it, he claimed. This line never got the publicity I felt it deserved. I wonder if Trump feels the same way about the migrants from the poor and violence-prone villages of Mexico and Central America. If he'd been born there, would he "somehow" have lifted himself from the situation?
1
Ask his grandfather, who came from Germany.
More than 130 years ago...LEGALLY.
1
The millions more that we accept annually into our country equals more environmental degradation and overcrowding of our schools, roads, hospitals, housing. How is this a good thing?
We are turning into the countries these people are running from.
I don't recognize our nation anymore. What a cluster of unfettered humanity. Too many people in the world today.
17
Come on, even the Dumbster knows that the "caravan" is nothing special. But he also knows that it serves as a symbol and he can exploit it to lie to his followers and use it to whip them up into a hysterical frenzy. He also knows they will not investigate it themselves and take his and their favorite right wing entertainers word for it that it is a "danger." His supporters are simply too invested in believing his lies to do anything else.
2
This is not the 19th Century or the 20th and we do not need unlimited immigration. I would like to see the Times and other thought leaders/organizers discuss honestly what they think the proper population is for the United States--otherwise it is all cheap sentimentality.
25
Here's one of the problems, Editorial Board.
Not one of Trump's cult followers will read this piece or consider the facts contained therein. Not one of them will know that of the thousands mentioned by their great leader, only a few hundred showed up, legally, within established international norms. Not one of them will acknowledge the reality of the danger these refugees face in their home countries. Not one of them will acknowledge the role that Mexico plays in accepting many of these refugees. And not one of them has a shred of integrity or decency to acknowledge or admit any of this. They are the very definition of deplorables.
6
Americans should ponder the treatment of their fellow citizens -- aviators and mariners, as well as business people and students -- when traveling abroad. When governments turn on their own laws and enactments no one is safe. We must not think that even a deranged president will loose the bonds of our country's immense military to protect and defend Americans trapped abroad. Foreign countries -- including friendly neutrals -- will not abide our failures to make good on our international promises. American soldies, sailors, airmen, and Marines have paid in blood to put these standards in place for the benefit of us all. Our military is not there to vindicate the political agenda of an embattled president and his cronies.
2
Why does the editorial simply omit the report of caravan participants illegally crossing the border a few miles away from the port of entry. Where the participants encouraged to break the law by activists? Where they not eligible for asylum and perhaps terrorists covertly embedded with the caravan?
19
Tump's bigoted, mean-spirited attitude towards immigrants and those seeking asylum make me ashamed for my country. We no longer deserve that beautiful, majestic lady who stands at the entrance to NY harbor telling the wrold---"give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free....." I cry for the fearful and brutish country we have become and hope we can salvage and recover our dignity, sanity, and decency. Vote these people out. Please.
1
Not long ago when the countries of Europe were faced by a single summer in which they had masses of immigrants and asylum seekers they paid Turkey close to a billion dollars so that it would see to it these masses would no longer come knocking at their doors. Is the rest of the western world bigoted and mean spirited towards those people, or do they simply want their countries for themselves.
However as opposed to western Europe, the US is subjected to those masses year after year in an unrelenting push of economic migrants towards our borders.
14
By all means, let's completely open up our borders for asylum to entire nations who may need to come. What's another billion or two people arriving upon our shores?
22
Beyond being a bit curious as to how how one gets from two or three hundred to, "a billion," could you maybe point out just where the "shores," are at this border crossing?
1
Most of Latin America would like to live here.
1
We have a "president" that can't take care of his own problems. He should be a little more "Christian" and help people fleeing violence.
The closing line of this piece was perfect. Because it called Trump what he is: a bigot.
Leave a crime infested, overpopulated, dangerous country and come and live in our crime infested, overpopulated, dangerous cities. 6 of one, half dozen of the other.
14
A little context from the Editorial Board would really help here by addressing America's fundamental role in the destabilization of the Northern Triangle countries these people are fleeing.
2
That 18-year-old (teenage) man in the first group of 8 was very likely under threat back home of severe torture by a drug gang for not joining or otherwise paying fealty.
Perhaps Trump would like to watch one of those torture sessions? They are real. Taking advantage of desperate fear to fan the flames of bigotry is a Trump specialty.
He needs an education in reality
I don't know how others feel about it, but the only thing I want to know about Trump is how he comes his hair. Does that long, long fold-over come from the side. the top, or both?
1
Clearly the developing world has a long way to go when it comes to embracing family planning and sustainable population growth. However, we are under no obligation to function as their safety valve.
16
Not much new about Trump using every opportunity to inflame his base. Actually, not all of his base, but the part that responds the loudest.
1
What Caravan?
Seriously...I watched for a month while Don Lemon and his sycophants on CNN mocked and ridiculed Trump for his made up fantasies about some caravan heading toward the border, which didn’t actually exist according to CNN.
And now you know why Trump won. Conjecture News Network....always wrong.
20
The strongest, richest country in the world is afraid of women and children. Twelve hundred people with holes in their shoes and dreams of a life without fear have caused the US government to send the national guard to the border. Think about it.
4
A bloated, repulsive demagogue’s appeals to racism and xenophobia are only acceptable to racists and xenophobes. These are our fellow Americans. Tune in to the next Trump neo-Nazi rally and weep.
1
This same nyts page has an article about kids protesting violence and shootings at their HS here in the u.s. Perhaps we should make the u.s. safe for its residents before importing even more people supposedly fleeing the same thing from Central America. Or should they leave the country and come to the border seeking asylum? Maybe the democrats would pay attention then?
20
Aside from the fear mongering by Trump validating his wall, and the political story that is using this group of people to advance power, there is the issue of human rights. First of all, these people are hardly terrorists, tho I do support a vetting process ... we have one in place. But how could we, as a supposedly "Christian" country that supports human rights not abide by international mores but instead keep these people outside, in the elements, for 4 days? Ah yes, photo-ops.
Could we not have put up a temporary "holding site" with tents or trailers? Could we not have supplied food, water and toilet facilities? We knew they were coming and how many from the daily attention that was put on their progress...why didn't we have the personnel to process their applications for asylum when they reached our border? Isn't that why we called upon the National Guard? We had a crisis? I shouldn't be surprised...look how well we did with Puerto Rico. Shame on us!
Few of us have faced the instability that these people left behind. For the few that will probably be allowed to enter (a "terror("?) force of less than 200), they have chosen perhaps the lesser evil. Every American who supports Trump's ego, the GOP blinded by power, and the bigotry and racism directed toward these people should be ashamed of themselves. We are sinking further and further into the slime that is the dark side of humanity that has existed in this world that we used to call human rights violations.
3
Trump is a conman.
Show us your taxes.
2
More than 75% of asylum claims are bogus, as reported in this Opinion piece. The legal process that reveals this large level of fraud can take years, as reported in this Opinion piece. The authors do not report on the no-shows who simply melt into the USA's Hispanic population. The authors do not mention that women asylum seekers have babies just about as often as biologically possible while waiting in order to seek to remain in the USA with their citizen children.
26
Perhaps the fact that the Trump government is working hard to make birth control not available might have something to do with birth rates. Speaking of which, do you have any facts to back up the assertion?
3
More Trump hyperbole, wanton distortion, and blatantly intentional misrepresentation — his signature stock and trade. This president has weaponized the Bully Pulpit.
No change, no reformation, no transformation is remotely likely — yet we fein incredulity again and again as though this deceitful effrontery might miraculously resolve itself; as though the gravitas of the Oval Office might somehow exorcise the demon.
As for American immigration law, policy, procedure, enforcement and due process, it is a long standing and disgraceful morass which the Congress owns and perpetuates more than any other branch of the federal government.
2
I guess many of the comments are trolls. Our enemies want to harm the populace of the United States by telling us that we are in danger and that we are being overwhelmed by foreigners. Excepting the native American Indians, of course, we are all here for various reasons such as independence, freedom, fleeing from oppressive regimes and so on and therefore we are all the enemies of the Indians. Our country has been well rewarded by taking people in who are looking for a better place to live and who have the gumption to try for that goal. Keep them coming please so we don't become insular, rigid and always suspicious of the unknown. Be very wary of people stoking your fears to give them power.
4
Trump also falsely claimed that Democrats are responsible for the changes in immigration laws that allow people from the caravan to flood into this country. He mentions nothing about international law treaties and our own laws. Even if migrants pass the first stage of the asylum interview process there is still no guarantee they will be granted asylum as statistics show more than 75% who make it to court are rejected. So basically this careless talk is to instill fear and generate hostility against immigrants who are already here. And a means of having his base show up at the polls to maintain Republican control of at least the House.
The United States started granting political asylum under George Washington during the Genet affair.
It is a core expression of American values to grant safe harbor to those who face oppression and danger in the place they are fleeing.
As with so many things, modern conservatism as a while and the trump administration in particular has abandoned core American values
1
The U.S. has been arguing over how to limit immigration into America ever since the 1790. Some decades went better than others. There was massive resistance to open door immigration after the civil war, which really has not abated over the past 150 years. The most prosperous generation of Americans was born between 1930-1945, when federal immigration laws finally slowed the geyser of immigration down to a trickle. The Lucky Few (The Silent Generation) came of age at the end of WWII and were courted by colleges who had spaces to fill and employers with endless job opportunities. They also were the generation that began the civil rights, women's rights and gay rights revolutions. There's a lot to be said for nurturing one's own citizenry instead of becoming a fetid, ungovernable and massively divided global carnival.
6
~ 3 billion people live on less than 10$/day on this planet. Shall we take them all in? Moving every unhappy person to the west will serve no purpose other than to turn the west into another 3rd world area. The time of just moving people around as a solution to the worlds problems is long past. Help them solve their problems at home, yes, starting with birth control. Transferring the endless supply of people from the parts of the world that will always have an endless supply if they don't change their ways, will solve nothing. The refugee laws are clearly being manipulated by lawyers and the open borders crowd and need to be revised.
29
Didn't the republicans make it unlawful for American support of foreign countries w birth control and women's health issues?
1
We are already a 2nd world country and rapidly becoming a third world one. In many parts of our country we are already there. We will be the richest third world nation on the planet. yay
14
That would be Vatican Inc., mostly, the same criminal network destroying U.S. laws and women's lives. See: Iowa's punitive and nearly 99.9% restrictive abortion law passed this week.
AND just why are these Central American nations so dangerous?
The US has for decades used; bombers, force, mercenaries to overthrow elected governments and put in place brutal dictators. With full support and training from the US, these dictators hire bands of marauding 'death squads' that kill, torture, maim and rape the population at will, for any reason, indiscriminately to terrorize the people into absolute submission.
1
We overthrew Japan and Germany too and much more violently - why are they not sending us millions of refugees?
18
All these folks have been portrayed as drug dealers and rapists The ones shown at the asylum seeking camp sure look criminal. So here's the question for all you Hispanic haters out there. What would you do? You are sitting in your "lovely" home back in El Salvador, watching Fox and Friends , I'm sure. Crime and murder are a huge problem. So you rub your chin and wonder should I stay here and hope for the best or should I leave everything behind, and walk 1200 miles, jump trains, stay in shelters, and take my chances to be one of the very few to get into the U.S.? With my children, elderly parents, and just a handful of possessions and the clothes on my back. So I can get into America, sell drugs,and rape their women? I'm sure that's exactly what they are thinking. Would you give up everything to give your family a highly unlikely chance at survival? Yeah, you would. What you need to recognize is that they need your compassion and your help. You would want nothing less for yourself if you were in their shoes. But then again when you look at people in their shoes as vermin, Trump and your reaction makes perfect sense. You know opening your Christian hearts. To no one but people like yourself.
2
They are asylum shoppers. If they truly wanted asylum they should apply in Mexico - the first safe country they come to. The fact that they continue to the US borders shows they are asylum shopper and should be deported if they enter the US.
20
I would recommend "The Editorial Board" visit Texas. Half the state has become an "asylum" infected by "seekers". The problem is there is huge lack of assimilaiton. And it is eroding the work that the Americans of hundreds of years of ago contributed. So sad.
31
Go look up the Mexican American war of 1846.
We took what was then Mexico north of the Rio Grande.
Maybe they are just coming to take the land back :-)
Live by the sword, die by the sword?
As a resident of Texas, I could not possibly disagree more. My city is one of the most immigrant-dense cities in the country (if not the world), and it certainly benefits wildly from that, both culturally and economically. I've also been to the parts of Texas that are not "infected" - you can keep your "assimilation," thanks.
2
These so called asylum seekers are frauds. They have been coached as what to say to get asylum. They could have asked for asylum in Mexico, the first country they entered, but Mexico doesn’t offer welfare, food stamps, section 8 housing... Which these illegals are not entitled to until they use stolen social security numbers and then drop their anchor babies.
33
One must pay for education in Mexico too. Books, uniforms and tuition are not free.
8
Trump "roared on Twitter"? I must be missing something here.
2
Don't worry; you're not missing much.
2
These "failed states" will never improve if the US is always the escape valve. Moreover, when our asylum system was established it never imagined hundreds of thousands of people demanding asylum. Sorry, but the numbers are just too big now...too many people.
Dear Democrats, please understand that Trump won largely because his supporters are just sick and tired of our borders being overrun. Trump was a high price to pay for our broken immigration system that, at least to the Trump voters, favors immigrants (legal, illegal, refugees, whatever) over screwed over American citizens.
29
"Most chose to remain in Mexico"
Why is this a _choice_?
If the the asylum-seekers are truly desperate, i.e. in fear for their lives, then why do not _all_ the asylum-seekers choose to remain in the safe and welcoming neighbor country of Mexico?
Around the world, there are tens of millions of people in fear for their lives due to violent living conditions in their native countries.
Why does it fall to America - rather than to the many wealthy countries (such as Mexico) that are local / adjacent to the country of origin for asylum-seekers - to help these people?
Could it be that part of the reason for spurning a certain, and generous, offer of asylum from a country such as Mexico in favor of an infinitely more uncertain non-offer from the US is the simple wish to trade up, and possibly reap a windfall?
In other words, have the Times writers, in their desperate search for the illegal-alien sob story du jour, have ignored the crass opportunism and cynicism at the heart of this transparent arbitrate maneuver by the asylum-seekers?
Fooled again.
When will the Tomes writers and editors stop letting themselves be played for morons?
27
The real problem with our immigration system lies in its courts. Most people have to wait years for a hearing and are shafted by an utter lack of fair legal representation when they are finally brought before an overworked judge.
Our immigration laws themselves may be considerably fair, but we certainly need to take a second look at how they are implemented to make the system more efficient and more just.
1
The world is not owed the right to move here.
8
Of course, the Left elites could encourage reform in these Central American countries rather than abet hordes of unhappy illegals to flood our border.
But that would reduce the number of future Democrat voters and raise the cost of nanny service.
Let's stop pretending why the Left supports open borders and illegal aliens.
25
The right could do the same thing.
Do the Times editors read their own newspaper? The article detailing the circumstances of several of the members of the "Caravan" made it clear that the people do NOT qualify for refugee status. Fleeing an abusive husband I can apply for French citizenship? Fleeing street gangs (on Long Island perhaps or in Liberty Park Miami, FL -- detailed in today's paper, I can migrate to Australia (they do NOT let refugees in-- or unwillingly). The rules are quite clear.
Better that the Editorial Board worry about monopolies,mega-corporations, and Wall Street and how their policies ruin people's lives everywhere (aka cheap labor) and the pressing population problem that can only lead to more refugees seeking a better life... which is different from asylum.
24
Past American presidents dealt with the chaos and terror of central America with what was called, "a police action." But there really wasn't much chaos and terror back then. There was more like a threat to an entrenched American backed monopoly. (Think of a friendlier version of Big Pharma).
Now that actual monsters roam the isthmus our so-called leaders can't seem to get their act together. Should they invite the gang-bangers to partake of an idealism that they have little more than contempt for? (Pelosi). Should they burn our taxes on a wall that will stop no one? (Trump).
Morons all!
1
There s an very old Sanskrut saying: Bramha is the truth, warld is false (Fake). In Trump worl, TRUMP is the truth, others are fakenews. Hmm. We have a new religion to replace Christianiiy and it is cad TRUMPISM an its followers clam to be preaching. Christ will be ashamed and wondering "ot in my name, p;ease".
Interesting and informative article. But the headline is inaccurate. Trump doesn't give a rats patootie if we learn the truth. Trump doesn't know or care about truth, and apparently neither do his supporters.
3
I suggest the Times doesn't know the truth as well.
It isn't known if any of these people are seeking asylum or are coming to the USA for other reasons until they are interviewed and they have to make their case.
Trump takes advantage of this to make people support his position.
The Times takes advantage of this to make people be against Trump.
After all is said and done you should see that all of this is about politics and that the truth is the last thing that people care about on either side.
2
Well said.
We pluribus unum, see asylum-seekers from central-America's triangle of terror (El Salvador, Honduras, Guatemala) reaching our country, while our president - roaring in his demented tweets, sees "rapists and criminals!". "Bad hombres"! "The caravan's coming!" How can we deny refugees from anywhere the procedures to asylum in our blessed country? No matter who is our President. a brick and mortar wall or just miles of razor-sharp concertina-wire won't keep people from seeking freedom and liberty.
2
Good piece by The Editorial Board.
But even after this column and multiple more detailing the racist and criminal abominations of the Trump administration, why will they not call for his removal?
1
He took the position he has when he ran for office and got elected based on those positions.
He is only doing what he said he would.
You can't remove him from office no matter how you think he is wrong when he is only doing what he said he would.
The USA the last time I looked has a government that is chosen after a election is held and based on those results as written in your Constitution Trump is now the President of the USA.
People like you like to mention the rule of law.
It is because of the rule of law that he is your President
and to demand his removal is against that rule of law.
Either you believe in the rule of law or you don't.
You can't use it when it serves your purpose and ignore it was it doesn't.
10
The comments on this thread make me ashamed of my country. Who taught so many of you to hate so much?
2
Americans do not want a third-world nation here in the U.S. We cannot afford/absorb 200 Central Americans who will chain migrate to thousands. We need educated people and skilled people. We need vaccinated people. No other country in the world puts up with this nonsense. Let them seek their fake asylum in Mexico. They stopped their first and Spanish is the primary language. These people want our benefits pure and simple. Don't be so naive/stupid.
20
Instead of focusing on asylum seekers, why doesn't the NYT focus instead on the chronic issues faced by almost all of the states south of the border?
In addition, the Statue of Liberty does not hold a policy document in her hands.
15
The Truth the New York Times Doesn't Want You To Know About Illegal Immigration:
The vast majority of these people are economic immigrants not fleeing terror from shabby teenage gangs but scrambling for a piece of a richer country than the one they were unfortunate enough to be born into.
American taxpayers are already supplying food stamps, schools, emergency room care and social services for many of the 13 million illegal immigrants already here.
The economic costs of subsidizing illegal immigrants are estimated by the government at $150 billion a year -- that's more than we spend on any task performed by the federal government other than national defense; more than we spend building roads or looking for cures for diseases or reviving our space aspirations or anything else.
So, continue to buy the New York Times' fantasy version of the world at the peril of the United States you are leaving for your children. I'm no Trump supporter, didn't vote for him and never would. But if someone doesn't stand up for the idea that we are a sovereign nation with the right to protect ourselves from illegal and unwanted immigrants, it won't stop until we're like the places they are fleeing.
24
If only #45's immigrating ancestors had stayed in Germany! It's obvious that Trump's family was never vetted properly. Nor was he himself ever groomed for his present occupation.
2
Let's take Mexican approach. The "organized sponsored-caravan" should continue on to Canada.
24
Just google Vacation in Honduras and you will see it is a tourist destination and they are fleeing is the lack of welfare and higher pay and all the other benefits they will get from the taxpayers here, along with the Democratic Partys blessing in exchange for their Vote, its a crime against the American people Bottom line!
22
So was Germany before the second world war.
1
Weren’t we complicit in creating the “northern triangle”?
3
I grew up on Long Island. I was one of the safest and nicest places to live in the United States. It is now being overrun by MS13 and other violent Central American gangs. Don't tell me that the system works. There is no denying the fact that we are importing the violence that these people are fleeing.
27
If these "asylum seekers" voted Republican (of course non-citizens aren't supposed to vote) , the NYT Editorial Board would be singing a different tune.
17
Sweden, be prepared for my asylum claim. I'm transgender and sometimes I feel unsafe in America. I dont have anything to prove it, but there are gangs of people out to rape and kill me. Just look at the stats! Even though it's still less likely than being hit by lightening, transgender women are dying by homicide at a faster rate than other people in America.
I want a house and medical care and therapy and language classes and job training and a stipend to spend while all my paperwork processes and I have a cousin who is gay and I'd like you to ship him here and I also have a mom and a dad and three siblings and they have wives and husbands and kids. In fact, I'll put together a list of 20 family members that I need to live with me and if you could fly them all out and give them the same benefits that would be great.
Oh and I do plan on only flying my American flag and please print all your forms and street signs in English for me if they aren't already. I also want a chance to speak to your people through protest to tell them how much they have oppressed me in Sweden and how I wish I could return to MY country but it's too violent.
Finally, I plan on sending 90% of my wages back to America and I won't actually ever be speaking Swedish even though I took the class because I have the right to retain my culture. I plan on living only around other transgender American refugees. I will also only hire other trans Americand and spend money on trans American stores. Thanks!
26
Great comment, thank you.
8
You don't have to go to Sweden.
You don't even have to leave your country.
Move to the land where the Times call home.
Move to New York City.
2
Or DC, Atlanta, Denver, Chicago, Dallas, along with all of Florida, Texas, California, Nevada, Arizona, New Mexico, much of Oklahoma, Kansas, Oregon, Washington, Idaho.
Do we really care if our huge country with a population of about 350 million takes in about 200 Latin American refugees and asylum seekers, mostly kids, who just walked about 3,000 miles to get here? People who would do this? These are probably people that you want.
Have a heart.
3
Half of the population of Honduras would move here if we let them. Where do you draw the line?
22
By some estimates 25% of the population of El Salvador has moved here already. Polls in Mexico show 30% (of 120 million) would come her now if allowed. Make no mistake, this is an invasion.
12
Tell me where can I see the information you are so wise to give us.
And why is Mexico not taking them? It's outside the "'northern triangle' of Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador, one of the most violent regions in the world." Notice how the Times ignores the question that the only thing transit Mexico does it point the way al norte to the Yanqui Estados Unidos.
19
Trump is not driven by "hysteria" but by testeria. He is testerical.
Testosterone: a good idea gone bad.
Really? Is there ANY truth trump wants you to know about?
1
Yes, Central America is a violent, horrible place. But I don’t want that violence here, and it’s frankly not our problem. All of these people should be denied entry Immediately. If a law change is necessary, so be it.
24
These unaccompanied minors who are fleeing violence make it to the US than joined the MS13 gang because MS13 can somehow pull their strings from miles away.
17
White House Occupant's views : Distortion of facts bordering on hate speech. Nothing new from 45. Just another failed "business" . Can't we move on with being America again ?
1
Why refugees fleeing violence and struggling economy in Venezuela, would take the risk to cross multiple countries and apply for asylum and safety in U.S., instead of crossing a border and apply for asylum in Brazil?
Is it related to this story https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/28/world/americas/venezuela-brazil-migra... ?
8
Donald Trump's anti-immigrant hysteria has created a sordid and sad spectacle not seen since the St, Vincent carrying Jews fleeing Hitler's death camps was turned away fro our shores. I'm glad that at least a few refugees may be granted asylum, but I wish we could adhere to Emma Lazarus' words emblazoned on the Statue of Liberty,
“Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”
The lamp of freedom deserves and open door not a prison wall.
3
It's obvious this is a organized political movement to coach people on what to say and do in order to gain access to the US, no different than Chinese individuals organizing trips for foreign women to give birth in the US to a US citizen. Accusations of racism xenophobia by some leftist commentators aside these folks are gaming our antiquated immigration refugee rules with help from leftists wanting to change the political balance in their favor...just as Hugo Chavez did to gain permanent political power with importing very poor needy people who will always vote for the free things... Democrats offer.
21
“That Mr. Trump says otherwise shows he sees not a group of fearful people fleeing from terror to freedom, but an opportunity to fan the flames of bigotry.”
Stop the presses! This news just in! Donald Trump is a bigot! Who knew!!
The one thing about Trump that cannot be denied is that he understands that self-interest almost always increases more and more when push comes to shove ... and evermore so as the back and forth escalates in intensity. In fact, he prides himself on this to warn that he’s a “tough customer,” not to be “messed” with. And the tacit justification for this is the natural right of “self defense.” But in Trump’s case the problem is that he exploits this self-defense right in the politics of fear in order to ground his goal of being not merely leader, but, seemingly, messianic monarch. I don’t know the guy personally, but from his public behavior it seems Trump’s life is one lie after another for gaining this end. That is the truth of Trump on display. Why? has to be complicated. What I truly cannot understand is why anyone cherishing this country would put their in him, especially ... especially ... at this point. As regards Trump’s take on the “caravan:” Just another lie to generate fear, as he persists in trying to become acceptable. And should he actually become successful in his efforts on this account, I can see it now: At a celebratory rally, his leading his crowd of followers in a rousing round of “Amazing Grace.”
My first thought after seeing the initial reports of this caravan on the news was.... this caravan looks way too organized. So with a little research, I googled “ who is funding the immigration caravan?” Surprise....American and Mexican organizations are funding them! NYT and other news agencies need to do a some reporting on these groups and their real motives. It’s an eye opener. The caravans need to be stopped and these folks need to get in line like everyone else.
20
Can we trade the 1,200 people in the Caravan for Trump?
2
"It is a group of desperate people fleeing, in accordance with internationally accepted rules, the very real horrors of the “northern triangle” of Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador, one of the most violent regions in the world."
It is not news that terrible conditions exist there nor is it news that the US, lacking foresight is doing nothing about it that's having any effect.
Wonder why?
2
A better question is why didn't these people "flee" south to Ecuador or Colombia or Brazil?
13
What exactly are they fleeing if they are in Mexico?
13
The streets are paved with gold here, haven't you heard? These immigrants are the last believers in the myth of America as the land of opportunity for all. We should welcome them in the hope that their belief inspires us to reinvent that dream.
1
Bigotry indeed! Trump is a consummate demagogue, lying to his base, exaggerating the case of desperate refugees as dangerous 'illegals' (even when outside of the U.S., seeking asylum 'legally'?). These United States are a country of immigrants, where the vast majority do contribute mightily to it's progress and solidarity; just a few that are racists and xenophobes and sexual abusers 'a la Trump'. What an irony, Trump being a crook, assumes all others are of his condition. This is cruelty 'gratis', which ought to be condemned by all those with a sense of compassion, if not justice, in their heart. International treaties used to be welcome, so to protect those being persecuted by evil forces. With the current administration, any humanitarian feelings have flown out the window, and refugees are treated as criminals. Can't we see that the problem is an ugly American in the White House, whose megalomania makes him blind and deaf to the suffering of others?
Trump is the answer to all the spineless suckers Who came before him. From being tough to China,NK and to protecting our borders, it is Trump who is doing something meaningful.
Economically these refugees will be a huge burden on our society. While the mom will do menial work, the three kids will go to local school, they will get Medicaid or use ER and be a huge taker on our resources.
Be compassionate, but not stupid.
17
Americans, thousands of whom are dying in military uniforms in God-forsaken deserts in the Middle East attempting to impose democracy on tribal societies, cannot solve the world's problems with our awesome military. Likewise we cannot solve Central American problems by opening the spigot for any and all who feel in any way threatened in their jungle homeland. They need to solve their problems at home, not bring them here.
17
Trump has taken these poor people and turned them into a photo op supported by his lies to get cheers from his base. I am so ashamed to say this man is American let along president!!!
2
Trump is a vicious bigot who further degrades the US each day that he is in office. He was granted 1460 days in his four year term. What will be left of this country whenever this madness finally ends?
Nice try NYT.
I'm not buying it, you can't spin this into making it a great idea for us to accept Caravan after Caravan of illegals into our country.
Our laws are there to be enforced. Keep them out.
18
And once again, the NYT fails to differentiate between legal immigrants and those who aren’t. Good job.
16
Our country’s asylum laws need to be changed. Asylum seekers should have to appply for asylum in their own country.
14
I believe our President doesn’t know the truth about this matter and like most things, he doesn’t want to learn the truth, especially when it works so much better to make stuff up.
Is this better than he is a bigot and a racist? Or he’s both - an ignorant man AND a bigot.
American citizens refuse to be wage slaves so our 'leaders' allow the wealthy to import people who will.
9
@WillT26, It is the continuation of the 'colonization' of the US by the 1%.
4
Who arranged for the train through Mexico? I suspect there is much more to the story that the NY Times may not want us to know.
16
Was Krugman involved in writing this?
Like him, this op-ed twisted facts/ laws to fit a narrative.
I fully agree that Trump is fanning hatred but because of such outlandish views, folks get attracted to the Trump message.
None of the op-ed writers get hurt because of unchecked illegal, low education immigration. These folks don't crowd pristine, upscale towns, don't bog down school systems, don't compete for the same jobs as the well-off and thus no direct impact to the inhabitants of such towns.
So much easy to sit in your "ivory towers" and show sympathy.
I remember an op-ed written by Bono in these pages not too long ago. You all should shut up and look at your hypocrisy.
13
When your life and that of your families are threatened you would do anything you can to protect them and yourself.
These Immigration laws that we have in place are working.
It sounds pretty racist of Donald J and the rest of those Republicans seeking to destroy a chance of freedom from those asylum seekers.
I bet if they all were from Norway, they would be let in in a minute.
1
"Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free." This is the quote on a plaque on the Statue of Liberty.
Trump and his bigotry make a mockery of this symbol of liberty and freedom that has defined this diverse country for many decades. We need to take our country back to what it was before this charlatan took office.
2
And that's all it is. A cheesy poem on a statue from a time when the u.s. had 1/5 th the number of people it does now. It was never meant and has never been law or have legal weight.
17
Denigrating the high ideals of the past only illuminates the moral bankruptcy of the present. France's gift of appreciation and the symbolism of Lady Liberty should be front and center in every citizen's contemplation of how this country will address the challenges of a rapidly changing global economy. Otherwise, we might as well replace her with a Facebook icon, donated by corporate sponsors. And then embrace our essential "cheesiness" of national character.
A hundred year old poem, placed on a plaque is not our immigration policy for the 21st century.
9
While massive immigration of any nature or quality benefits selfish interests of capilat owning ruling elites and corporations (while ordinary Americans pay for it in mumerous ways) it is also important to note that the vast majority of immigrants are Hispanics and they in great majority vote Democrats.
So, support to masssive immigration in NYT makes sense.
10
The real issue: "Organizers and lawyers told about 200, mostly children, that they had a chance to gain asylum after applying at the San Ysidro crossing into San Diego."
Central and South America have a seemingly endless supply of those seeking to escape the politics of violence.
Nonetheless, the most important message: Granting asylum to one or all won't solve the endemic instability of these countries, but it will further the Neo-Marxist need to reconstitute the social structure of American society. The key to the DNC Politburo thesis that Hillary ran with and lost.
And that is all the understanding that is needed to say, No.
9
Trump’s fear tactics - just another pack of lies. Mexico cares more about the asylum seekers than the US by feeding them and trying to make them comfortable while waiting for their application for asylum. Their desperation is evident -better Trump’s hostility than death at home. Maybe Trump should turn his Tweet cannon on the governments of Central America to stop the slaughter in their countries - then people would not want to leave.
5
If Mexico cares about the asylum seekers, they could demonstrate it much more effectively by offering them all asylum in Mexico.
56
I believe they have.
Explain to me, because I am curious, why we believe that Mexico should just grant "blanket asylum". Why do you feel that Mexico doesn't have the right, same as the US does, to vet those who apply for asylum?
The caravan of assylum seekers are trying to enter the US in order to escape the effects of the US War on Drugs in their own country. The gangs in Central America, and Mexico, and elsewhere in South America, are empowered by the lucrative trade in illegal drugs all headed for the US drug market.
Our 50+year old War on Drugs has utterly failed at its stated goal of reducing drug use and addiction, while being very successful at its unstated goal of incarcerating black men, militarizing domestic law enforcement, and destabilizing and distracting Latin American societies.
The War on Drugs creates ten times more misery on innocent people than the drugs by themselves could ever do.
3
Refugee here. Came in 1991 with the family from a former Soviet republic after an ethnic conflict. We had to flee to Moscow and waited there for the vetting. Took about 2 years and the US was the only country that accepted us (it was a International Rescue Committee that helped us to set up). I am fiercely loyal to this country. The first order of things for my parents upon our arrival was to make sure we got education. I am a CPA and have been paying taxes, although this will never repay what I got - a second chance.
My point is that what would these people have done if there were an ocean between them and the US? Violence does not qualify - it is when the targets of the violence are an ethnicity or religion. An please stop bringing up the Holocaust. Educate yourselves. Infants and elders, women and men gassed and burned - never again. Do not touch this.
5
Maybe we could set up a Reality Contest:
Who is the Biggest Victim? Potential immigrants to this country could compete to see who had the saddest story of them all... The American people could then vote if we want to accept Soviet refugees of ethnic conflicts of certain religions or poorer Central American refugees facing violence in their homelands too.
Sob stories, and what the newcomers hope to achieve when they are granted entry, are encouraged.
7
Staged theater.
Why every year "around Easter"?
No "persecution" during the rest of the year?
Really?
Is that "credible"?
Hardly.
Why the USA?
Why not Mexico?
Oh I see --
The NYT claims that most stay in Mexico.
Sure --- just like all the Mexicans who stay there.
Why not Nicaragua?
Why not Costa Rica?
Why not Panama?
Why not Colombia?
Why not Ecuador?
All just as close as the USA.
Oh, I see --
those places are also ...
what was the word Trump would use?
Why San Diego?
Why not Laredo?
Why not El Paso?
Why not Brownsville?
-- much closer than San Diego.
"Credible fear"??
of "persecution"??
From criminal gangs??
How did that sneak into the asylum regime?
The common understanding of asylum
is asylum from political and religious persecution --
not from criminal gangs.
Presentation of asylum claims at the border?
Why not at American consulates in Mexico?
The obvious answer to all these questions--
the asylum regime is just another immigration loophole,
and, when piled onto all the other loopholes,
the result is massive immigration.
The asylum loophole needs to be tightened big time,
along with all the other loopholes.
If that means changing the law, then let's change it.
If that means changing treaties, then let's change them,
and if the other treaty signatories will not agree,
then we can renounce the treaties altogether.
Every treaty we make has a renunciation clause.
Nothing wrong with threatening renunciation
in order to get sensible changes.
15
I've just read many of the comments. The biggest threat to the US is not from this caravan but from Trump himself.
2
All too many Americans live in ivory silos where they have created barriers to recognizing the violence and fear under which immigrants have been forced to live until they flee their homelands.
When Trumpian fascists take over and create intolerable living conditions after they have destroyed the economy, do the rest of us want to face a 30 foot tall wall at the Canadian and Mexican borders where we wish to flee to escape?
Ridiculous? Then step out of your silos and ask just exactly how governments in Syria and Central America have degenerated to create the terrifying existence their populations live in. That is the real world that reflects much of the historical immigration to the USA, and could fall on us if we don't make sure that our government is one of compassion for the people and not racism for the rich.
3
All too many Americans live in ivory silos...
---------
Speak for yourself, Cerritos.
Plenty of ethnic Americans with white skin (who don't identify as "white people") work in their communities to create better conditions for their children. We simply cannot continue to absorb via immigration loopholes all of the poor people in the world who want to resettle here.
Setting fair immigration standards is the Congress' job under the law. Lawbreakers like Jose Vargas should not be rewarded for travelling here with illegal papers, trying to break the system.
PS. We don't live in silos. That's where we store the grains that feed the nation... and the world. Where will you be when our silos are packed with the poor people of the world who have no other place to live, and seemingly no other way to care for their women and children then to ship them North and hope for the best charity help that will never run out?
10
Asylum should be sought first in Mexico. If Mexico rejects an asylum claim, why should the US accept it? So, all (not most) of these refugees should find a new life in Mexico, where they will be closer to the relatives they've left behind, and also be relieved of having to learn a new language. Mexico will be proud to have them. Que viva Mexico!
11
Thank you NYT for the clear explanation of the caravan/asylum issue.
1
They are absolutely not “a group of fearful people fleeing from terror to freedom”. They walk right past Belize, which I have heard is very nice. They could travel South, and go to nice places such as Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Panama, and beyond. They don’t stop in Mexico, where there is a warm. welcoming government that understands Spanish and can protect them.
The truth that the NYTimes doesn’t want you to know is that the group in the caravan is just a mob of opportunists trying to take advantage of our country.
18
They would not be welcome with open arms and free stuff in any other Latin American country.
8
As JK Rowling said about Trump "what a little little man" .
Many of the problems creating the "caravan" have to do with the criminal policies of our government including the CIA and the result of climate change, environmental degradation (thanks to the big US banana companies).
I have run out of words printable and otherwise to describe my disgust of this despicable excuse for a human being.
1
Clean up your spare bedroom, and open your own home in Rhode Island to shelter a needy family?
The US government cannot provide the same level of charity help that private citizens and organized religions can. Stop cursing the darkness, and start lighting some candles of your own, well-meaning folks...
If not you, who?
If not now, when?
9
The author misunderstands the law on asylum. The person seeking asylum must stop at the first country where there is safety. Instead we have this caravan of people whose real goal is economic. That's why they've passed Mexico by and traveled 1000 miles to the US border.
They belong to Mexico. Let them stay there.
15
The Editorial Board of the NY Times could set an example - by allowing an unlimited number of people to sit on the Editorial Board, suspending its qualitative standards for choosing members. This would be much more "fair" and would provide a broader spectrum of opinions, albeit not always well-written. A cross-country caravan could be organized to pick up potential writers in every town and the caravan could arrive at the offices of the NY Times, demanding to be allowed into the building and to be given keys.
18
I would wager that few of your hypothetical editorial writing aspirants would be fleeing for their lives. You offer a foolish non sequitur.
I think many of the NYT staff will have relocated abroad by the time the Caravan affects them...
3
If President Trump had any clue, or even the slightest curiosity, or even basic knowledge of his hometown, he would know that the resplendent Statue of Liberty in New York Harbor proudly proclaims, “Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.”
President Trump chooses to ignore the truth about the migrant caravan because it serves a political purpose, which is not only “an opportunity to fan the flames of bigotry,” but also a chance to keep his base fired up on the prospect of a border wall that might and should never see the light of day.
1
Give 1200 people asylum. 2019 give 5,000 people asylum. 2020 give 20,000 people asylum. 2021 give 300,000 people asylum. 2022 give 1,000,000 people asylum.
Next the taxpayers will pay for cruise ships to stop at ports and fill to the brim with asylum seeker.
The military can airlift asylum seekers here 24/7.
And in 2023 there will then be 5,000,000 asylum seekers waiting to be processed and given housing vouchers and food stamps and language classes and Medicaid.
I'm not sure just accepting asylum seekers here as some sort of super compassion will end well. For example, what happens when enough Hondurans arrive that MS-13 crops up here and negates the safety they were supposedly fleeing from? Oh wait.....
15
Thank you for that detailed scientific analysis of how this all works. I’m confident your views on climate change are steeped in similar scientific methodology.
“The vetting of the caravan, in fact, shows that the immigration laws are quite strict,...”
I prefer my immigrants to be vetted by those other than Liberal immigrant herders, thanks.
That this caravan foolishness is expected to endear illegal aliens to Americans is a stretch.
Democrats seem more focused on helping illegal immigrants evade our immigration laws than respect them.
14
The same gangs are already here. They aren’t escaping anything. They are coming to pick the pocket of American taxpayers, coached by lawyers to tell their weepy tale. Not buying it.
13
Ah, so they are liars. But Donald Trump speaks the truth.
Yes, of course.
An excellent companion piece to this article is NPR's recent interview with historian Jon Meecham. In this, Meecham points out that Trump's rhetoric about building a great wall against immigrants was lifted directly from a 1920s speech in Kansas City by Klan member Clifford Walker.
Trump doesn't know our own country's laws, blatantly lies, and continues to parrot back decades old bigotry.
https://www.npr.org/2018/05/02/607704116/soul-of-america-makes-sense-of-...
3
So we should just do away completely with immigration laws and border protections because some people want to keep some people out for racist reasons? We have the most generous immigration laws and porous borders on earth. By any measure we have don't our part. At 325 million plus, we need to rethink, as almost every other country on earth is doing, our ability to absorb the millions who want to come here.
8
Trump: “The migrant ‘caravan’ that is openly defying our border shows how weak & ineffective U.S. immigration laws are.”
A lie since "Under international treaties and its own laws, the United States is obliged to allow foreigners inside the country or at its ports of entry to apply for asylum."
Will Trump order military strikes on the the children and mothers of the caravan: cruise missiles, tactical nuclear weapons?
2
Will Trump order military strikes on the the children and mothers of the caravan: cruise missiles, tactical nuclear weapons?
---------
Naw, you're thinking more of former President Obama, who never met a secret war that he couldn't support...
5
...along with Big Banking CEO buddies and repeat felon ex-cons.
These people aren't really having any problem with their home countries, but have been recruited by an American group following Democratic Party needs for an ongoing supply of dependent immigrants.
I have looked at a bunch of stories about the caravan but NO ONE in the progressive media dares mention Pueblo Sin Fronteras.
Were these people fleeing anything, they'd have ditched everything about their home country in a heartbeat.
But insatead, these people are acting like invaders, actually flying the Honduran flag. They know how to take something for nothing, but they have no intentions onr building up the U.S. or becoming part of our culture. In twenty years, it will be their kids carrying out crimes for gangs.
13
One must assume that the compensation someone receives for spreading scurrilous untruths is enough to overwhelm any residual sense of decency they possess. Then again, maybe they just harbor I’ll will for “others,” so they willingly do so. Either way, they’re wrong.
How can I help the people of the caravan?
A few facts:
• Donald Trump's grandfather immigrated to the US in 1885 and worked initially as a barber.
• Mike Pence's grandfather emigrated from Ireland through Ellis Island and became a bus driver.
• Mark Rubio's maternal grandfather initially immigrated legally to the U.S. in 1956, but returned to Cuba to find work in 1959. When he returned to the U.S. in 1962 without a visa, he was detained as an undocumented immigrant, and an immigration judge ordered him to be deported. The immigration officials had a "change of heart" later the same day and the decision was reversed. (Was that because he was highly skilled?)
• Steve Miller's mother's family immigrated to the United States in the early 1900s from Belarus escaping the anti-Jewish pogroms in the Russian Empire. His great-grandmother only spoke Yiddish when she arrived.
• Reince Priebus' mother was born in Khartoum, Sudan, to parents originally from Mytilene, Lesbos.
• Jared Kushner's paternal grandparents were Holocaust survivors who came to the U.S. in 1949 from Belarus.
Excluding immigrants because they don't immediately contribute to the profits of large corporations makes sense only to someone who values short term profit over all else. And for some people, it's grossly hypocritical.
193
So what? I am 2nd generation American (Irish and British). Both my grandmothers and grandfathers came to the USA with family sponsors and who paid their way and got them jobs as they were employable. Today is not the 1880's, America needs skilled workers not the untrained poor
22
Immigration laws like laws regarding everything have to evolve. We are not an empty country anymore. We used to have no pollution laws either. Shall we scrap them and go back to the 1880s for that as well? How about child labor laws? The old anything goes work for that too?
14
No, we need both.
The hysteria of the Trump administration is creating chaos all over the world. How many years will it take to undo the damage of a president with narcissistic personality disorder? How long will the selling and buying of hate continue after he is long gone. Can we? Will we, as a nation recover? Can we rebuild and make us stronger? The damage runs deep. When we lose our compassion and empathy for our fellow human beings, we lose our nation. We are better than this MR Trump. We are American citizens who care.
3
Speaking of desperation, we desperately need comprehensive immigration legislation to deal with the serious issues we face. The Republicans refused to consider it under Obama, preferring to demagogue the issue and obstruct any progress by his administration, to the detriment of the country. Now that they control every branch of government, Americans are still getting nothing from this worthless leadership.
Republican owners of companies have benefited for a long time from illegal immigrants willing to do the work Americans won't, and at a fraction of the cost. What are they going to do now? This is the GOP's dirty little secret. There is no legal solution on the horizon from this crowd.
I'm also surprised that there is little or no discussion of what can be done to help get Central America back on track. We are spending hundreds of billions in the Middle East to little avail; I'm not interested in adding to that insanity but why aren't we even talking about sensible measures?
96
Good point regarding Central America...especially since the U.S. provided billions in military support during the cold war to support dictatorships who murdered their citizens, lacked transparency, and violated human rights.
We have culpability in the result of those decisions.
Now the foreign policy focus is shifting back to primarily military support, versus a more holistic approach. It didn't work before, not sure why we're going to do it again.
9
I agree we need comprehensive bipartisan immigration reform. The sticking point is amnesty: do we allow an illegal (or as some say, an undocumented) immigrant to have a path to citizenship, or not? This is a very complex issue and depends on the status of the immigrant and not just whether he/she is undocumented. For example, most might agree that the DACA kids should have a path to citizenship of some kind or another. But, we might not agree that their parents should have that path or even a harder one since they intentionally came here in violation of our laws.
2
The United Nations Refugee Agency has over 140 individual states and nations as signatories (including the USA) to a 1951 treaty governing the treatment of AND the definition of 'refugee’:
"A refugee is someone who is unable or unwilling to return to their country of origin owing to a well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group, or political opinion."
A migrant, according to Merriam Webster's dictionary, is "…a person who moves regularly in order to find work especially in harvesting crops."
While those trying to come to the US from Central America almost certainly want jobs to support their families, the primary impetus for coming here is to escape extreme, out-of-control violence in their home countries, and referring to these poor people as 'migrants' lessens their suffering and diminishes their terrible situation. Because in our gilded age of Trump, ‘migrant’ equates to rapists, drug-dealers and criminals.
Please understand the difference. These poor people are NOT migrant workers following the crops. They are families who’ve been driven out of their country and I’m sure there are many in America who can sympathize.
4
This editorial does not report what percentage of the 2/3 of asylum-seekers who are rejected in the US remain here illegally. I would guess that many do stay, but we don't have those facts.
8
When we have a president who seizes every possible "opportunity to fan the flames of bigotry," facts no longer matter. The only thing that matters is the size of the whopper that the base is prepared to accept without question, and there seems to be no size limit for Trump's base.
4
I'm sure that our asylum laws can use some review and probably better funding. But to give Trump and his minions any credibility in this is astounding.
1
While the US is obliged to allow anyone in the country or at its ports to apply for asylum, it is not obliged to let everyone doing so to stay in the country or to be allowed in freely. Immigration law and the UN Convention on Refugees are both clear on that point, especially when the application is being made in a third country (Mexico in this case).
The article is mendacious in concealing this point.
2
I am not looking to agree with Trump but we can't take in all the immigrants from all of the failed states in the world. We need a humane set of immigration laws that are uniformly enforced. They call it the rule of law.
6
Maybe one of those in the Caravan can take over as trump's attorney.
God knows he needs the help.
2
Why not spend more time exposing "[h]is allies [who] picked up the cry, warning of an invasion of illegal immigrants exploited by left-wing activists." Sure, Trump has a core who cling to his every hysteric rant. But it's the "allies" who amplify, magnify, and repeat his lies and distortions, making them more potent than they would be alone. These people are so good at planting liars on legitimate national and local news programs to "balance" coverage. Why aren't more realists/truthtellers being interviewed on FOX et. al.? And if not, why isn't there more objection to that?
2
This is why I subscribe to the New York Times! Good opinion! Thanks for saying what NEEDS to be said!
3
Of course Trump's rhetoric about the caravan is directed at his base and meant to rile them up. What Trump says about the caravan are lies, not unlike the same rhetoric spoken by conservatives at the beginning of the 20th century when immigration from eastern Europe was at it's peak.
Apparently a political tried and true method for distraction is to use racist rhetoric which appeals to the white American worker and verifies in their mind that immigrants are stealing their jobs and culture. I also believe that Trump is very aware of what he is doing which makes his behavior all the more despicable. In this way, I would say that Trump is directly responsible for the death of Heather Heyer in Charlottsville last august.
1
To show that the laws work, why not research how many migrants actually show up for their up for their immigration hearings? The issue as I understand it is, that many claim asylum in hopes that they will be allowed to enter the country while their case is pending, and then they will disappear into the midst of the literally millions of other illegal immigrants in the country.
Additionally, the fleeing persecution angle would be more sympathetic if they were coming directly to the United States from a country bordering the United States. As it is (and as the article noted), they're already in a safe country in Mexico. This makes them economic migrants trying to use asylum claims. Additionally, the failure of multiple administrations to properly secure the border and vet the people entering the country has let gangs like MS-13 (you know the ones they're supposedly fleeing) set up strongholds throughout the US where they continue to terrorize both native populations and migrant groups.
Let's also correct the notion that the "northern triangle" is a "violent region." The trees and the ground aren't attacking people. What you really meant to write NYT, is the people of the Northern Triangle are some of the most violent in the world, which is why we need to be extremely careful vetting who we let in from that region particularly given the lack of strong documentation available due to the political instability of those countries.
5
Trumps “Caravan” from Puerto Rico is much more effective and there no doubt its for financial benefit and he’s done little to stop it.
What part of breaking the law is misunderstood?
We have a big problem here in the USA!
6
Do schools teach U.S. Civics anymore? Based upon many comments here I think not. It appears to be greatly needed. Perhaps local summer education programs could offer a civics class along with pottery throwing and basket weaving. It’s evident some remedial education is in order.
Mr.Trump wants everyone to be afraid of immigrants.He works his base into a lather about a handful of woman and children who are fleeing lawlessness in their home country.They are being vetted and are not simply walking across the border.Their situation is pitiful and they should not be demonized.Why is it that the United States is so unconcerned about the criminal gangs who are terrorizing citizens in Central America.We are a member of OAS and before have been involved in Central America.
1
pueblas sin fronteras means people without borders. this is the group that sponsors the caravan. Do we say no borders, any and all are welcome? not true of us or any other nation. I loathe Trump’s racism, I totally support the Dreamers but is not US responsibility to take all economic migrants. people seeking relief from crime in their nations make me very sad, but asylum is not about crime but persecution. Aid to help these crime ridden countries, yes. absorb everyone here, not possible.
5
If these people are fleeing horror and violence, why not stay in Mexico? Why are there helpers along the way to help game the system? How many immigrants from all over the world should the American citizen be required to absorb and pay for? How much federal funding is supporting these immigrant “helpers?” Americans want answers to these questions before the floodgates open.
6
It has been clear for some time that Trump delights in appealing to what has historically been called the "mob". They are the people who can be egged on to commit violent and mindless crimes because they are violent and mindless; ruled primarily by their limbic brains. Their fears are played upon and then used by those in power to foment chaos and destruction. It wasn't called The Terror in the French Revolution for nothing.
And, yet, asylum still exists under Trump's so-called "Muslim" ban. Trump and Session are right to respond to a group that believes it is entitled to enter our country. That sense of entitlement has been encouraged by politicians seeking to use illegal immigrants as pawns in their political war. Safe to say it has backfired.
3
If the people in this "caravan" are truly looking for asylum then they should stay in Mexico where their asylum request has already been granted. Instead they want to cut in line ahead of all the legal immigrants, so we know that their true motivation is not asylum but economic.
6
I believe Trump will set an all time record for any U.S. president's payments to lawyers - and maybe for any president in the history of the world.
These so called asylum seekers have been coached as what to say to gain asylum here in the US, the land of plenty, plenty of government benefits. This country that cares more about illegals than its own poor who include Vets and the homeless.
They should take their Honduran flags, return to Honduras and demand that their government improve their lives.
I thank them because they have just helped to get Trump re-elected in 2020.
7
Paranoia about children whose parents flee terrible conditions to protect them reflects the basic lack of empathy and American values of the president. This is the common immigrant story. May these children and families find refuge. I am deeply ashamed of the Trump world's bigotry and cruelty, especially towards vulnerable and innocent immigrant children.
It is an outrage that Trump has a prominent member of the hate group FAIR as an official in his administration, and that FAIR has access and influence within the White House. But hate groups and the Trump White House share white supremacist viewpoints.
2
Does the very fundamental role of a state to protect its borders mean anything to the author and all those in favor of "uncocumented", i.e. illegals trying to enter w/o proper permission have any respect for the law?
Then: Since Honduras and other Cerntral American countries have been occupying top spots global ranking of countries in violance, including murder rates ... should we accept anyone who says "I don't feel safe there"?
Violence in those countries manifets itself in never-ending gang wars (which, in many thousands say of Salvadoreans, has been already brought to our country, towns and communities ... leaading to violent criminality upsurge and loss of traditional public and personal safety among millions of Americans, including school children and women, from California to Long Island, NY).
Massive illegal and "regulated" immigration above all serves selfish interest of capital-owning elites and corporations, because it not only maxing out profits on their caiptal by lower cost (underground illegal or legal) labor but - increasingly - represents new millions of consumers. And with chronic unemployment and underemployment, coming robotization, these millions of immigrants are more and more valuable as new consumers of all that overproduction.
As locals can't consume more and borrow more (and some Americans "smartly", not wanting to leave too big "carbon footprint" have fewer children) elites see replacement and expansion of consumers as (selfish) priority.
5
Classic Trump - in pandering to his feckless, ill-informed base he employs, as is his modus operandi, subtle innuendos and non sequiturs to fan the flames of fear, bigotry and apprehension. Not the truth and not even the acceptable Trump hyperbole, the "We'll see, could happen, just saying..." only serve to leave the bigoted and the "Make America Great Again" crowd with enough erroneous information to once again agree with POTUS, never allowing for what the real truth and reality is - desperate decent innocent victims fleeing for their lives and eager to go through a proper vetting process
58
" .. Classic Trump - in pandering to his feckless, ill-informed base .."
Thanks for repeating HRC's 2016 stump speech. Please keep repeating it, and permanently make the Democrats, a minor party. Yup-per!!
2
I have worked with refugees and immigrants for some 25 years but I do not understand this article not even referencing the international law that relates to these people's dilemma:
http://www.refworld.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/rwmain/opendocpdf.pdf?reldoc=y...
How could Mexico not be the country of first asylum in this case?
Under the law the US obviously has obligations to Mexico here, but that does not include being the country of first asylum. The refugees can go through the normal application process and vetting but what is the caravan about?
9
The truth does not fit the NYT agenda.
5
Here are a few facts that I gleaned from this editorial (which the Editorial Board probably did not intend to highlight):
1. Three out of four “asylum seekers” have no basis for seeking asylum and get rejected, and this occurs despite widespread knowledge among prospective immigrants about how to game the system. The overwhelming majority of people at our border are attempting to exploit our country's generous asylum system.
2. Many “asylum seekers” either cannot or do not stay in Mexico once they have crossed into that country from Central America. Why not? Once they are in Mexico, they are no longer exposed to the threats that would be the basis for any application for asylum. One of the following must be true. Either the Mexican government is refusing to honor international law regarding asylum or the Central Americans crossing into their country have no basis for asylum or the Mexicans are treating them so inhumanely that the Central Americans feel driven to move on.
3. Central American migrants having reached Mexico and having escaped the terrors and deprivations of their own countries are still willing to travel hundreds of miles more and endure untold hardships in order to reach the United States. This must mean that the United States, even under the Trump Administration, offers much better treatment of migrants than Mexico does.
20
Do you read these editorials before you publish? First, just because something is done all the time doesn't make it right or smart. Yes, we do have immigration laws. And for a long time, our laws were blown off. Nobody mentions that people seeking freedom from violence can and should apply when they reach the first safe country. Why is no one seeking asylum in Mexico? Why did no one apply through legal channels? Why should we as a nation, and you as a paper, say we are a nation of laws but not expect to apply these laws to people who want to breach our borders? Further, your coverage is manipulative. Yes we feel sympathy for people who say they fear violence but to disregard so many aspects and only play on emotions is not doing anyone justice. I did not vote for Trump, but even I can see that you folks don't give him an inch. People are tired of illegal immigration, and the laws need to be reformed as well. Immigration by emotion and manipulation never works.
14
The question is no border or border.Once you are in Mexico your life is as safe as the average Mexican's.
I believe in immigration and as an immigrant myself I know first hand how we make US better, but it is our right and obligation to have an orderly system in which we select who and when should be allowed to come here.
The caravan is coached by "advocates" on how to manipulate the system.This is the wrong thing to do.
12
The simple fact that should be evident to everyone by now is that the current president of the U.S. has absolutely no regard for the truth. It does not serve his purposes and is, therefore, expendable.
2
We don't have room to consider immigration from people fleeing horror, but we also have no policy that would stabilize the region and reduce the horror.
The people who flee are preferred to be invisible - if we can't see them they don't exist. They are merely part of the globe's unlucky surplus people who got the short straw or the paper marked with the black dot. Too bad, folks, you won Shirley Jackson's lottery.
I don't pretend to have a great solution, because we cannot take a huge volume of migrants anymore than Europe can from the vast numbers of people displaced by war, famine, violence and lawlessness, drought or other vast human misery. But I do know we cannot pretend we don't see them, or that they are humans, and deserve our compassion.
2
The asylum application process should take only a few weeks, but it often take years because we permit applicants to appeal decisions made by USCIS asylum officers to immigration judges. Asylum seekers whose applicants are denied are given a Form 1-862 (Notifications to Appear) at hearings set months or even years into the future. Migrants refer to the forms as “permisos” because they permit them to reside in the United States until the day of their hearing. They know no one will look for them if they fail to appear. The immigration backlog now approaches one million cases.
Neither the UN Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees nor international law proscribe how nations are to determine whether an individual meets the definition of a refugee. Each nation establishes its own asylum process. The United States is not obligated by international law to give asylum seekers the right to appeal decisions made by USCIS asylum officers. We should change U.S. laws to make asylum officials’ decisions final.
5
The fact that they came through Mexico first makes these claims absurd. People claiming asylum or refugee status don't get to travel in caravans to go country shopping. They prefer the US to Mexico because of our more liberal policies on refugees and being a far wealthier nation. Which shows them to primarily be economic refugees who are not entitled to special status under the law.
12
My grandparents came through Ellis Island -- legally -- to seek freedom and a better life, so I totally empathize with anyone wishing to come here. However, they need to come in legally and not by climbing a wall, crossing a river or gaming the system through asylum and jumping the line ahead of the many others who have been waiting a long time. This belief does not make me a xenophobe, racist or bigot.
The fact is we are in dire need of more people as there is a worsening labor shortage here, so I welcome any new arrivals with open arms. Come on in (legally), pay taxes and make the best of your life in this great country like my family did. The choke point is the government's inefficiency in processing applicants. That's not on Trump, it's on us for voting for politicians who never fixed this problem in any realistic way when they had the chance.
7
When your grandparents came, there were no restrictions on immigration as there are now. As you may have noticed, there are no immigrants gloriously landing on Ellis Island today, and disembarking with legal status in hand. Had your grandparents come to the US with the current immigration laws, essentially their only avenues would have been as highly skilled labor (an expensive and very competitive process) or if they had close US citizen family members (spouse, adult child, etc.). Those of us whose family came during that time were lucky--but not somehow morally superior law abiders.
Labor shortage? If so, perhaps it’s because we have too many members of our society who prefer not to work... Free stuff does that to people...
5
Trump's response to this sensational conflict is truly beyond understanding.
We can not depend upon the UN. What really are their options in this case?
Honduras, San Salvador and Guatemala are our neighbors- here in our zone of influence- under the supposed umbrella of the Monroe Doctrine, fellow members of the OAS.
If we must spend money- which thanks to our tax cutting Republicans we now have much less of- then lets spend it on our street.
If we are really concerned about immigration then we must do something about the horrible conditions in this "northern triangle" as you call it.
Since when do we slam the door in our neighbors face?
We finance the largest military in the world with our deficit spending- bigger than all the other top ten industrialized nations of the world combined- and cannot see the wisdom in confronting this drug-gang lawlessness
that is destabilizing our neighborhood?
It is this failed, hyped-up drug war and our own consumption, which is causing this stream of refugees to flee the very violence it has caused.
We must look to the future and invest in helping our neighbors improve the security and living conditions in their respective countries.
If these desperate people could make a basic living without having to fear these drug-mafias which act with autonomy within their own corrupt governments, they would rather stay home.
Why not help to make that possible?
After all, it's a tough trip but they can walk here.
Afghans don't have that option.
2
The difficulty is that the conditions the migrants say they are fleeing are endemic to Central America (most of the third world really) and there is little prospect of deporting any of them. Thus, letting them in lets a thousand caravans blossom.
5
The editorial’s premise is that economic resettlement is necessitated by the direst of circumstances beyond the refugees’ control! However, in MN, Catholic Charities has suspended its refugee aid programs because it is focusing its resources on the lives of needful people already here. Many of these prople are natives whose marginalization (due to racism and oppressive systems) should be addressed before turning our largesse to the open, grabbing hands of people who may never truly adjust to realities of life here (beyond an over-idealized, stubnorn ‘dream’). To whom do we owe the greater obligation and deeper thanks than by bettering the outcomes of our own racially- and exinomically-marginalized American citizens! We can’t continue to arrempt to assuage our national guilt by taking in outsiders at the expense of our own deserving and underserved!
8
in reading a lot of comments here, one thing is clear: Americans are confused and uneducated about our immigration laws and procedures. We need more education in this regard so that when politicians begin to plead their cases about immigration, the common voter will have enough information to form an educated opinion.
We have let our country down by not having a solid civics education in our schools. We can't come to agreement on immigration in this country because we don't understand the rules and methods we use to allow people to become citizens!
12
A big problem is progressives rely on emotions. If it feels bad, we shouldn't do it. This is not really a rational basis for policy. Learning about our laws is a good way to get everyone on the same page. That's where the debate should be occurring, not in the realm of emotions and hyperbole.
5
Since I lives in a city that has many immigrants, I am familiar with the trials of some who wish to stay here. So a contractor's helper may have his tale of endless hearings before immigration, or of the disappointment of finding out that a relative cannot stay in the US.
Net immigrations along the border has peaked. And many who come to stay come by airplane as tourists and overstay.
Yet the right wing press and key politicians panic a segment of the voting public, such that white retirees in suburban NJ think that the president is "keeping us safe". The folks who need to read this won't.
3
I'm not persuaded. Someone has to go to lots of court hearings, someone else can't stay? Immigrating is hard, maybe he doesn't have a good claim and is trying to stay on thin grounds. Not everyone can come or stay here, that's as it should be.
"Net immigrations along the border has peaked." So? Thousands of people still cross illegally every year, added to the millions who are already here, on top of those abusing the asylum system.
"And many who come to stay come by airplane as tourists and overstay."
Yes, people like me who are concerned about immigration also want a visa enforcement system and workplace e-verify.
You seem to think that those white retirees are the ignorant ones but your own argument doesn't hold together. And this article, as many have pointed out in the comments, omits key facts such as: many asylum seekers don't show up for hearings but just stay illegally, and the law requires that they apply in the first safe country they come to, i.e. Mexico. I think you are the one with some reading to do.
6
Fearing for their lives - they passed through how many countries that could have provided safe haven? This sounds exactly like venue-shopping which is a violation of the spirit and substance of the refugee law.
22
Please read the article: of the original 1200 people, which during the trek swelled to 2000, only some 300 arrived at the border and 2/3rds of them, or 200, were advised by their organizers to attempt to ask for asylum in the US. To make it easier for you, about 83% of those making the journey took safe haven in the countries they passed.
That is not really an argument - there is no reason why 100% of them should have requested asylum elsewhere in the first available safe country. To make it easier for you, laws are not designed to be enforced 83% of the time - they are binary.
Caravans like this are streaming across the Middle East and floating across the Mediterranean into Europe (a humanitarian catastrophe) while, similarly, the movement from the south (places we have neglected for decades) into this country has been occurring for years. The answer, ultimately, is to fix the places they are coming from. This, I suspect, would be a tall order since we can't even fix the places in this country where many of these people may end up. The sooner we realize bullets, bombs, and drones are much to blame for this disaster, the sooner we might be on a path to some meaningful solutions. As we are the worlds greatest exporter of arms, I'm not holding my breath.
8
I say to all those who want to keep hard-working immigrants out of the country: we need them. We need them to work legally and to pay the FICA tax. This tax funds Social Security and Medicare .
4
@Valerie Elverton Dixon, and others promulgating the "we need their labor": three women with 4 (young?) children and one 18 year old man. How many of them will be working and paying FICA? As for assimilating in CA, they will assimilate into the sizeable Spanish-speaking enclaves, not into mainstream US life.
9
You don’t need a desperate working class vulnerable to your middle-class lifestyles labor demands, with little chance to displace you as their patron on the socio-economic-political hierarchy. Study after study has shown that as soon as the immigrant or lower class on a status hierarchy starts to move into independent status threatening the jobs of the middle class professionals above them, your generosity to them changes to hostility.
Stop the crocodile tears for the Central Americans.
Note that Mexico their neighboring country does not share your sympathies for the caravan asylums seekers to let them claim asylum there.
One must ask: Does Mexico know something we don’t know about them? Why doesn’t Mexico grant them asylum? Why can’t the Organization of American States intervene militiarily to restore the rule of law in the Central American countries?
5
Tell that to the employers.
2
To say that our asylum laws are "working" is a stretch, given that many people must wait years for a decision on whether they'll be granted admission to the US. This begs the question: where are they staying during this time, in detention centers?
Also, the same article cited by the Times also notes that "without representation, the deck is stacked against an asylum seeker. Statistically, only one out of every ten win their case. With representation, nearly half are successful." This points to the possibility that a significant part of the process involves lawyers knowing how to game the system. The article also states that the outcome often depends on which judge decides, with some deciding overwhelmingly for and others overwhelmingly against, entry. This implies that the process is political, not legal.
It needs to be acknowledged that the system is broken. There's no question that a majority of those coming north are doing so for jobs (which is fine - people need to eat). We need to have an honest discussion about the problem, (basically, should we grant significantly more visas to Mexicans and Central Americans?) which means the Democratic party needs to stop treating this as strictly a "get the latin vote" issue and, once in the majority, seriously address immigration reform.
10
How can asylum law be working if we have almost a million deportation orders being ignored and a 60-80% no show rate at court hearings?
The system 'works' to let people in but it fails miserably when people who have had due process are denied and ordered to leave.
20
Welcome to the NYT world. Laws mean nothing if they can be used promote their agenda. Russia! Russsia! Russia!
5
Trump needs to work within the confines of law. Something that he hasn't bothered to do much in the past. But wait. Asylum-seekers have to be sequestered in US territory while their pleas are being heard. Why not Puerto Rico, which has plenty of room for these Spanish-speakers, thanks to inadequate federal assistance resulting in a growing flow of its citizens to the US mainland?
4
We are discussing a few hundred people seeking asylum, not hundreds of thousands. It's pretty glib to suggest relocating them to Puerto Rico which has next to no services, including consistent electricity, food shortages, little housing and few operating schools, no jobs, is bankrupt and has lost 100,000 people due to those circumstances. Sending migrants there would be an added burden the PR govt. has no resources for.
These migrants have family or community in CA which has a large Central American population and should be relatively easily integrated into life there where jobs are plentiful.
We are the United States, the beacon of Freedom to the world. Let's not loose track of that or of our humanity.
3
"These migrants have family or community in CA which has a large Central American population and should be relatively easily integrated into life there where jobs are plentiful."
Yes and I'm sure those relatives came here legally right? We are not the nations innkeeper, local jurisdictions are running on fumes to take care of these so called asylum seekers. Schools are overflowing and the taxpayer again gets to foot the bill. Lovely system we have.
This situation has many complexities -- but what troubles me most is Trump's fear talk "getting more dangerous - the caravan is coming" -- these words demonstrate ignorance not something one would expect from a world leader.
10
More than ignorance, Trump's exhortations demonstrate callous attempts to manipulate his hater base.
1
There's pathos here, but at the end of the day, this is not the United States' burden. Time for the countries of Central America to start coming to terms with their own chronic, structural problems.
35
What happens to these people until these countries put their own houses in order. Our country was built on people fleeing persecution. Not only can we absorb more immigrants, we need them. The first generation of immigrants fill the jobs that native Americans don't want -- they care for our children, our parents and grand parents; they tend to our yards, harvest our crops, build our houses.
The people who make this trek are the heartiest of souls, not the detritus that Trump makes them out to be. Can you image the gumption it takes to pull up stakes to travel thousands of miles to an uncertain fate?
50
I believe that most immigrants will become excellent citizens and help the U. S. to deal with it's own chronic, structural problems. That's the way it is with the Dreamers. That's the way it's always been for immigrants coming to this country throughout its history.
21
------"The first generation of immigrants fill the jobs that native Americans don't want"
No no no. Americans want and need those jobs, but don't want to settle for the pittance of pay, so the immigrants do them for less than native Americans would.
"What would I do if I were in their position?" That is the first question I ask when thinking about immigration. There is little doubt in my mind that if DJT and his many of his followers were living in Honduras, facing violence, poverty, etc., that they would indeed join a caravan in hopes of a better life.
Let us remember that except by luck of birth place we could be in the same situation and respond with compassion and understanding.
50
It's fine to put yourself in the other person's shoes to understand their motivation but we must not forget that we have a legitimate right and a duty to consider our own point of view, our own needs and the needs of this country. Americans are not somehow floating godlike above the fray. We have a stake in how this rush to our borders is managed and although it may not be as immediately urgent as it is for the individual migrants it's just as personal and meaningful for our future.
3
Trump and his follower-voters are determined to destroy any "luck of birth place" when it comes to the Untied States of America: "Sweet Land of Liberty" turned to sour grapes.
Our government's Transportation Security Administration guarantees a cockamamie process for routine travel ~ imagine the odds in fleeing for your life . . .
I am curious if the alleged violence against these women and children just started in the nice-weather months. Seems odd that they would not flee for their lives when it was less convenient to travel.
I also wonder if America is truly the first "safe place" these women and children found in all of their miles of travel after their escaped their dangerous situations. Seems like surely there were charitable places closer to home that could have met their daily needs other than trekking all the way to America for sanctuary.
Perahps it is not really about escaping danger and finding safe shelter, but there is more to why these people prefer to come to America? There is a line, that law-abiding immigrants are waiting in. Let's make sure that all want--to-be Americans are processed fairly, and that the mainstream media doesn't get to pick their preferred victims to cut the line?
35
Did you read this article? It describes exactly the things you are wishing for, explaining that a fair processing is already happening and working effectively. Half the people travelling through Mexico don't even try to make it to the border with the USA, settling in Mexico instead. I know this may surprise you but not everyone wants to live in the USA. It might be that some of the ones that do choose to try to be accepted into the USA (Central Americans are also Americans so I won't use the term 'America' exclusively to describe US citizens) might be doing so because they have relatives living there or know people who can help them. If you were fleeing your country you would choose a host country for a variety of reasons.
48
Midway, you twist this article really hard to find something to pick on. How did you get your conclusions? These asylum seekers ARE waiting in line, literally. They, too, hope for fair processing!
There are 'charitable places' that many stopped at before the remainder reached the U.S. border. Stop acting as if something nefarious is happening.
i am so very glad I do not see the world through the lens you see it through.
While asylum laws are an important aspect of immigration law, this caravan really stretches the credulity of what the law is and who it is intended to be applied to.
Traveling over a thousand miles through a country (Note: a country that millions of Americans vacation in, so not exactly unsafe) that already has given the asylum seekers a safe haven from the dangers of "persecution" in their own home country, only to squat at the border of the next country and demand entry is an insult, quite frankly. I'm sure the Democrats are salivating at using this as a campaign issue, as opposed to real issues such as single payer healthcare, $15 minimum wage, and ending the wars-issues they avoid mentioning like the plague- but, I have to agree with the Republicans on this one. Our borders are a joke and constantly abused, and this caravan of "asylum" seekers is a perfect example.
39
They are not 'demanding entry'. Where did you get that from? They come with hope, that's all. And, they may have very good reasons for choosing to try to be accepted into the USA, like relatives or people they know that could help them, giving them a better chance of survival than in Mexico. I suspect the only way they'd ever get to live in a vacation spot in Mexico is by cleaning the hotel rooms of US citizens on holiday.
2
"Note: a country that millions of Americans vacation in, so not exactly unsafe."
Why, you're absolutely right. Why would anyone come here to work for a better, safer life in the US when they could simply live in an all-inclusive on the Riviera Maya. Obviously some nefarious left-wing stuff going on here.
1
Mexico is not safe for people without connections and/or money. Tourists who stay in resorts are usually safe--though not always--but outside such protected areas it's a different story. Vast areas are dominated by narco-trafficers, and the police are famously corrupt. While you may not like people trying to escape violence, they are hardly "insulting" us. They just want to live! Moreover, US policy toward Latin America is at least partly to blame for the disaster it is becoming. It's a huge mess, and we cannot absorb everyone, but neither should we demonize the innocent folks who are fleeing.
Why is the United Nations always ...and this point can't be emphasized enough...always missing in action when there's a humanitarian crisis? The United Nations has sat idly for months while this terrible situation has metastasized. Unforgivable. They have no plan, no ideas, no solution. And this isn't the first time this has happened in this organization's very checkered history. Obviously we can no longer trust the UN with any humanitarian crisis. We and we alone are expected to solve this problem. Here's an idea. Take $50 million from the UN budget, build temporary housing for the caravan. Send some pointless bureaucrats....of which they're many in the UN... back to their host countries where they can shuffle papers until there's ice on the equator. That will be money well spent.
25
To say that the UN is missing is ridiculous. Europe has single handedly taken millions of Syrian refugees escaping their civil war and ISIS and African refugees escaping Boko Haram.
The US was missing over the last 4 years as people waited in camps to emigrate to other places in the world. Germany, Greece, Spain and Italy were inundated to the point of begging other countries to help. We didn’t answer their cries.
We deal with Central Americans who are running for their lives because of threats from gangs and drug dealers. Most stay in Mexico, but Mexico is poorer and doesn’t have the infrastructure we do. Some try to make it here. Most don’t.
1
Currently, off the top of my head, the United Nations is dealing with:
- Potential catastrophic flooding and disease in a 700,000 person refugee camp in Bangladesh;
- Supporting millions of impoverished Palestinian refugees in Jordan, Palestine, and Lebanon;
- Supporting humanitarian relief in Yemen;
- Peacekeeping in Cyprus, Lebanon, and multiple African countries, to name a few;
- Implementing plans valued at a total of $7.5 billion USD to provide humanitarian support in Syria;
- And it just announced a plan to rid the continent of Africa, with over a billion people, of Yellow Fever epidemics in the next eight years.
Two hundred refugees applying for asylum on the US border isn't a crisis, it a routine occurrence which the United States - wealthiest nation in the world - has the ability to cope with.
Also bureaucrats have faces. Generally speaking, all humans have faces. Many of them do their jobs out of a genuine desire to contribute to the aforementioned efforts, which is laudable. Some are corrupt and incompetent, which is human.
When the UN was designed and it's rules and regulations-it's "democratic system" concocted-the US was fighting Germany and Japan , both of which were run by cruel and mad dictatorships which practiced mass murder of their opponents and enemies-Americans were interned and many soldiers forced to work as slave laborers in German rocket factories-in Japan, any and all allied Soldiers were expected to work as slaves and were tortured and starved routinely. Since the USSR was our "ally" then, they were given a special "veto" as well as extra votes for each SSR-so the Soviets had 20 odd votes and a veto on any law or regulation at the new UN-all by 1943.
Hence,Russian dictatorships, have taken advantage of this and have always ensured the UN cannot and doesn't work.
It is all they can do as they stink at everything but stealing and making poor man's wars. The Soviets /Russians are less efficient then the Chinese-permanent criminals-but were lucky, once and had the US riddled with their agents.
1
"Openly defying our border" is an insult to the state department who vets them and we now can hope will be restaffed up to vet as many of some of the most unfortunate refugees in the world. Thank you Mr Sessions for sending more attorneys and advisors. But especially because you did the right thing in the face of one who shows utter contempt for those who need the most help.
21
Asylum seekers are not allowed to cherry-pick their countries of refuge. They are supposed to request asylum in any country they pass through. Mexico has, as stated, allowed many in the original caravan to remain in that country. So what is the claim of those who rejected Mexico and instead presented themselves at the US border? At that point they are economic refugees, not valid asylum seekers.
84
No, they aren't, that is incorrect.
Any country who is a signatory of the 1951 Convention on Refugees is obligated to consider applications for asylum. There is no stipulation in international law (nor American law) that you must apply for refugee status in the first country you reach.
Until 2016 the first country principle was enshrined in EU law (EU law does not apply to the US), but it was abolished because it was recognised that this put the financial and logistical burden of admitting and processing millions of refugees unfairly on the poorer southern European states.
People rightly or wrongly view the United States as a country which offers safety, security, and a life free of violence. It is their legal right under international law to apply for asylum there if they so choose, and it is a legal and treaty obligation of the US to consider their applications.
48
CV: They can pick their country of asylum but they have a very weak case in the court of public opinion. In the end, Americans get to decide through their elections how asylum seekers will be adjudicated. It is not for any international body to decide.
Like eg the Irish were economic refugees in the past...
Thank you for this editorial. It's important to clarify who these people are, what their plight is, and the fact that they represent no threat to us. I'm an American who visited Honduras and adopted an infant there 30 years ago. At that time it was perfectly clear that poverty, racism, and classism made life terribly hard for the majority of people. Nevertheless, during our stay we were treated with great respect and kindness by everyone we met. Now Hondurans and other Central Americans suffer the additional scourge of rampant gang-related violence, which is caused, much evidence indicates, by North America's appetite for drugs. It's time for Americans to start to be aware of how we are all connected, and to start to consider, at least, the idea of accepting responsibility for our actions and more simply, responsibility for the welfare of our neighbors in this hemisphere.
142
The comment sections are often as important as the article. They add depth to the piece and broaden our understanding and view of the plight of these immigrants. What Trump continues to blatantly ignore is our country is founded on immigrants fleeing from a plethora of reasons. This country grew greatness from the vision of our past generations. All of us that take pen to this article, I would dare say, have grandparents who immigrated here. I know I am thankful for Russian grandparents who sought a better life in the United States. Blessings to all those pour souls, and the people that are helping them leave oppression.
61
Both my grandfathers were immigrants, but the country was very different then, much more empty. These migrants are coming to a country already struggling to deal with a huge population. The highways are far more crowded than they were thirty years ago. That was then; this is now. Time to call "time's up" on chaotic migration.
3
Thank you. I also visited Honduras and stayed with a family in Tegucigulpa slum for a week learning about urban poverty. I was warmly welcomed as they shared their home and lives with me.
A good history lesson for us in the North would not be amiss as we consider the US's historical impact on Central America....
17
As a country and as a people we need to recognize that life in large portion is random. We are not entitled and should not act as though we are by denying the unfortunate peoples of the world our genuine compassion.
54
Until the heroin and meth smuggling ends I will protect my family, not theirs.
4
We can be compassionate, as long as they stay on the other side of the border.
2
The countries of the so-called Northern Triangle of Honduras, El Salvador and Guatemala are outsourcing, as a matter of public policy and initiative, their poverty to the United States.
Remittances from illegal workers in the US back to the Northern Triangle amounts to 17% of the GDP of El Salvador, 11% for Guatemala and 18% for Honduras.
Mexico does the same thing, again, as an activity supported by the government as a matter of public policy.
There are many, billions in fact, people who fit the nonsensical criteria set forth here as being valid for claiming refugee status. The US is not big enough to take the whole world in.
80
Perhaps we can't take the whole world in, and this is worthy of consideration, but we must consider with some humility how most of us came to become so-called "Americans." Starting in 1492 the millions of colonists/immigrants who came from Europe came here as trespassers. From the perspective of natives, those whose families had lived here for millennia, this continent was not big enough to take in all of us disease-ridden Europeans who quickly proved ourselves completely unable to live up to negotiated treaties, unable, essentially, to be truthful.
92
@Paul Dobbs: according to your logic, then, American citizens should look at this caravan as hostile invaders, just as Indians should've viewed European settlers back in 1492 (and probably did).
To “Save the Farm”, you parade a farrago of lies purely to stoke fear. The UNHCR states that there are 65.6 million displaced people and 22.5 million refugees in the world currently. This is orders of magnitude away from the “billions” you claim. Obviously, all cannot be helped by one country, but excuses seem very thin when one looks at the appalling situation in Syria, where the US is waging war, but is only prepared to accept eleven refugees so far this year.
A huge number of poorer countries rely to some extent on remittances from their citizens living and working overseas, in fact this makes up well over $500 billion of the global economy. Around half of the El Savadorans living in the US are legal migrants, and those eligible for DACA (or who should be) fall amongst the other half. There is nothing wrong with these people sending money back to El Salvador; as a fraction of the US budget the total amount is truly minuscule.
2
So if we give this caravan asylum we'll no doubt have to give every caravan asylum. There has to be limits - HARD limits.
72
If you read the article it says they come about once a year. That's on average 4 humans a day. In Sweden we have far more peole coming in and we are tiny compared to US, Still the country is functioning fairly well and a lot of immigrants are working in the service sector for the benefit of the nation.
5
We need to protect our families. They wouldn't be in this situation if they had the courage to confront the cartels..
2
And why wouldn't we want to this? The US is a very big country with room and constant need of new minds and bodies. Tiny Germany took in almost a million, and despite what you here, it is going very well. Those people have the chance to live a safer place. Why would you want to deny that to anyone?
1
Thank you NYT Times for these words!!! I have met and spoken with migrants fleeing Central America on the streets of Oaxaca. I am 41 and they were almost all young enough to be my children. As I looked into the eyes of a young mother with her infant child, I can tell you that there is a courage beyond words that leads one to make this highly dangerous journey through Mexico. We as a nation must stand up to bigotry now more than ever before.Our integrity and survival as a nation depends upon it.
66
Actually, the truth is rather that the asylum process is a tremendous scam, grossly abused in the entire West - in the US, Canada, Australia, Israel, and especially Europe.
Very few of the applicants meet the definition of a persecuted minority (ethnic, religious, social group or political group). Most claimants will therefore eventually be rejected, but they will most likely not face deportation, there is so little enforcement.
Once the claimants reach the west, the west is stuck with them, and especially in Europe, the claimants will be wards of the state, for a very long time.
Most people know a scam when they see one, and this is one of the biggest scams that the West faces.
A humane solution would be that governments of migrant-exporting countries make their own countries liveable, and provide opportunities for their people at home. Why not try to replicate the conditions in the US to Honduras and Nigeria, etc, instead of moving their population to the US and the EU?!
This stampede on foot and boat from the developed world to the West such as the US and Europe is not sustainable. If something is not done, the law of equilibrium will eventually set in, and the West will be no better than these migrant-exporting countries. This is already happening, e.g. the foothold in the US of the violent MS-13 gang.
85
You're right. We need to legalize drugs here to end the cartels and drug gangs in Mexico and Central America. But I don't think you would agree with that solution.
1
Philly,
You say these asylum seekers are perpetrating a scam? I say it's not nearly as much a scam as when the Pilgrims told the Wampanoag that they came in Peace. That was the biggest scam that the West ever faced. No one is advocating Trump's asinine accusation of "Open Borders." I, for one, am advocating merely some humility. The real challenge is for us to face these needy people and this difficult problem honestly. That means we do so a nation that remembers we stole our land, murdered or starved the vast majority of those who were living on that land, and built, for a century, our economy on the backs of slaves.
3
You are absolutely correct, but the corporates / Fortune 500 make too much money using the migrants as cheap labor, and the dems buying their votes with welfare, are benefitting so much from this mass influx that unless the american public initiates an uprising/massive civil war to stop it, it will continue until there is no country left.
My hope is that the uprising begins very soon, and all illegals and birthright citizens of the last 25 years are deported, with the lunatic birthright citizenship mis-reading of the 14th amendment repaired.
9
I can't stop thinking about these Central Americans fleeing oppression. Before and during WWII we turned away millions of Jews and others fleeing Nazi oppression and sure death with the assumption that things were not as bad where they came from or that they would be a burden on the US or a host of other reasons to ease our collective consciences.
When people leave their homes and travel long distances to get to our border for safety. We need to look long and hard at their situations for to them being turned away might mean possible death and persecution. It is easy to wipe away from with an easy justification the suffering of others, but it also demeans us as a country to do so. There but for the powers that be in the universe go I.
61
I wish I could stop thinking about them. Send them back and they can get in line.
1
Drug wars cause bystanders and those at risk to flee their homes to seek a safer place for themselves and their families.
Drugs finance weapons purchases and violence.
Americans who buy and use drugs cause these problems.
32
No. Drug laws that didn't make much sense when the Democratic Congress enacted them in 1970 and make less today are the problem. If marijuana cost no more than any other dried herb, there would be a lot less violence.
2
"Americans who buy and use drugs cause these problems."
No, the totally failed war on drugs caused and continues to cause this problem. Drugs have been around for centuries why only after the war on drugs did they become the global catastrophe they are now?
1
These caravans are not a new phenomena. The sensationalized overblown hype out of the White House is new. Each year asylum seekers arrive and very few applicants are granted asylum.
We already have very strict Immigration laws. If you don’t believe me go to the Immigration and Naturalization Services website, it falls under the Department of Homeland Security.
Stop getting information from Fox & Friends, et.al. and trump tweets. I guarantee they’re full of erroneous information meant to inflame and divide the American people.
41
It sounds a bit (a lot?) elitist and undemocratic call "stop information from Fox & Friends and Trump tweets".
The fact that this country allowed some 12,000,000 illegals in and is "not able" to locate them (not to mention extradite those who don't qualify to be here) tells you that something is not as it is being presented.
The selfish capital owning ruling elites + corporations have a persistent, long-term interest in massive immigration of any nature and quality. Thus, for decades, any bona fide interest among legislators and the system to protect borders (i.e. primarily function of any state) and locate illegals are not real.
Elites + corporations welcome massive immigration not just for getting new, cheap, or underground labor but - increasingly - as new consumers, especially if immigrants have large families and high fertility rates.
It is especially so as Americans can't consume more, being alteday obeze, maxing out their credit cards and credit kept with low interest rates.
Ruling elites profit while the cost is in numerous ways paid by ordinary Americans.
2
Refugee,
My parents were legal immigrants. They became US citizens as soon as they were eligible. They also arrived with little but the willingness to work hard. Within in a few years they bought the cheapest house in what was then a solid middle class town. It's now an upscale upper middle class to rich town you would probably call elitist. The opportunity they were given was because of their white European roots.
Neither finished the equivalent of junior high. They had to drop out of school and work to help support their parents and younger siblings. My father was 15 when he left home from what is now the Republic of Ireland (since WWII) to work in Northern Ireland. He and the farmer he worked for were both nearly lynched. Why? Because my father was Roman Catholic and the farmer he worked for was Protestant. The local Orangemen didn't like that. That farmer gave him the cash he had and got him over the border to the south.
My father found Fox "News" entertaining but hardly serious journalism. He was self educated and could hold his own with formally educated individuals. A friend's father with multiple degrees called him one of the most intelligent men he knew.
Neither of my parents would deny anyone the same opportunity they were given. If you are truly a refugee why do you?
I was the first to go to college.
If this is what you mean by elitist then so be it.
1
If the people in the caravan were truly seeking asylum they would ask in Mexico, or take the vastly shorter trip to Costa Rica or Panama, which are both safe and much closer and easier to access.
But of course, that is not what they are doing. They are trying to skip the immigration line and find better work in the U.S., and for many, to rejoin relatives already there illegally. As the editorial admits, the vast majority will be found to not have credible claims.
But, of course, by the time the overwhelmed courts reach a decision, the people will have melted into the U.S., and will not be deported.
This is not about asylum. It's about using poor people who are being rational to make political points and grow a future Democratic base. It's about trashing the U.S. immigration system and telling the population that wants more control that (again, of course) they are racist for not wanting hundreds of thousands of poor, uneducated people to skip the line (where millions of other poor, uneducated people wait, who are at least trying to do it legally.)
I work in EL Salvador. I completely understand why people would look for a better life for their children. But the people in the caravan are exploiting U.S. law, and being cheered by people like this Editorial Board, who appear to know little and care less about the realities, and simply want to bash those who see the caravan for what it is, not what some media smart people say it is.
This is how you get Trump in 2020.
104
And if the migrants do not get asylum in the US, the word is out that they can just walk into Canada and claim asylum there. At the moment 20 month wait for hearing and if not successful appeals to follow. Free housing, healthcare (dental etc), access to schools, work permits. What is there to lose? Nothing, if not successful just go under the radar in one of the sanctuary cities - Toronto is at the top of the list. All this provided by a government that is excessively frugal with its own citizens.
32
"This is how you get Trump in 2020."
Progressives pursuing their agenda. You cannot blame them. It's still a free country of individuals with widely differing viewpoints.
You also cannot blame Americans for rejecting certain progressive ideals, as is clearly the case when it comes to illegal immigration. Simply put, no one is "entitled" to be here.
10
So, who's a bigger idiot, Trump or his opponents?
2
Trump shouldn’t be demonizing the Central American victims in the caravan – among other reasons because they’re not illegal aliens. They’re people applying for asylum, not crawling under barbed wire and making a run for it across California highways.
There are MANY illegal aliens, and Trump should focus on them. He unnecessarily gives ammunition to the fans of borderless existence, the protectors of limitless illegal “immigration” who live in our sanctuary cities.
16
Richard, their asylum claims are fraudulent. They have been coached as what to say to get asylum. They are economic illegals, nothing more.
4
Olivia:
I don't doubt that some are. But it remains that their failed societies ARE murderous, and the claims of many of them probably are legitimate.
It doesn't help those who fight against invasions of illegal aliens to demonize ALL who come here in desperation.
Richard Luettgen, so “the claims of many of them probably are legitimate.” You know that - how? Well, I figured you’d have to be a credulous sort to so often defend Trump.
Stunning how many posters do not know the laws and rules of their own government's asylum program. Some of these refugees did apply for asylum in Mexico, others preferred to apply to the U.S. knowing full well that they will be treated harshly, but are willing to take that chance for a new life in America.
Our Immigration laws are explicitly written out. It is not a crime to cross the border, turn yourself in and apply for asylum. They are breaking no law, but are exercising what our Immigration Laws state they can do. This is America. Immigration advocates are "not pushing would-be immigrants to go the asylum route," as one poster stated. Asylum is a known, legal avenue and has been for decades. Desperate people do desperate things. As this article states the majority of those seeking refuge are not accepted.
56
Entering a country (any country) w/o proper permsiion is a crime, violation of a law.
Then, when anyone escaping due to supposed concerns specified in Geneva Convention on Refugees, one should STOP at the first country where s/he is free of supposed danger s/he is supposedly running from and there - and only there - apply for asylum .... and wait there for resolution.
Unless coming by a boat on Atlantic, Gulf, or Pacific coats, no one can apply for asylum on the US territory as one would need to go first trough Mexico or Canada.
Above all: To be real, one has to acknowlege that massive immigration (of any quality and nature) serves mainly selfish interest of capital-owning ruling elites whom our govermnent serves above all.
In search for maxing up profits, elites and corporations not only seek new cheap (or underground) labor but - increasinly - new consumers as overproduction is a problem and obeze Americans (and Europeans) can't consume more even with expanded credit and low interest rates.
Then, as American have fewer kids (some trying not to leave too big "carbon footprint) large immigrant families with higher fertility rates are irresistible ways for boosting corporate and capital yileds. Elites win while common Americans pay, in numerous ways.
5
IF they only wanted to get out of Hunduras or Guatemala, wouldn't they have stopped as soon as they were in Mexico?
The U.S. already accepts overa million new immigrants a year and has taken in more than any other country for decades.
3
Explain why these asylum seekers don't seek refuge in Mexico. Are they not safe there?
We all know the answer--they are not looking for temporary reprieve from danger but a back door to permanent settlement in the U.S.
Sure, I'd do the same thing, but can't say it's not at the expense of the well being of the U.S. On the assumption that the U.S. has a fixed capacity for immigration (I know some open borders liberals would disagree with that), every one of these immigrants takes a spot from a potential immigrant with a degree in mechanical engineering or a doctor or entrepreneur with sufficient savings to provide for his or her own family without depending on government assistance--you know, the types of immigrants waiting in a line a million deep who we could pluck from at our choice instead of giving into a free-for-all at the border.
54
But no, that's precisely the point. The well qualified immigrants of whom you speak - assuming you mean those coming in lawfully - enter the US on H or O visas, which have their own quotas, with the legal right to work. The potential asylum seekers will go straight into ICE custody while their cases are heard, and aren't taking any of these places.
Your breezy 'oh I'd do the same thing' makes me suspect you have no understanding of or sympathy for the desperate situations that the people in the caravans are feeling.
Of course you are right. The geneva Convention on Refugees clearly requires that wannabe asylum applicant STOPS at the very first country he is safe from supposed danger and there - and only there - applyies for and WAITS for application resolution.
One of the absolutely primary role of a state is protect its borders and it is telling that all those lioberals and supporters of acceptance of illegal immigration have such "black out" in their respect for rule of law.
Most importantly: Those who support illegal or massive immigration, i.e. mostly liberals, do not realize that they are playing into selfish interest of the ruling elites and corporations who see immigration, massive immigration of any nature and quality, as irrsitible tool to max out their profits.
Then, increasinly, these illegals or legals are seen by them not as extra cheap new labor (as chronic US unemployment and undereployment plsu robotization do not call for new laborers) but as much needed new consumers of all that overproduction.
The elites and corporation profit and majority of Americans pays for that.
1
This person did not read the article nor does he or she know what they're talking about. But at least admitted that "Sure, I'd do the same thing." Amazing display, this.
It is obvious that the mass migration advocates are changing tact - they were losing the open borders and illegal (or euphemistically referred to as undocumented) immigration argument, so they are now pushing would-be immigrants to go the asylum route, and are arguing that it is perfectly legal to claim asylum. Never mind that asylum claims should be registered in the first safe haven country reached and not the desired country, such as the US. Also, add a layer of legal advisers to coach them with their prepared scripts that they will recite to the asylum officers.
This caravan is being orchestrated. By George Soros, perhaps?
There was a time when immigration was mostly legal, controlled and orderly. And asylum claimants were mostly legitimate, such as the rare political dissident from the former USSR. Would-be immigrants do not have an inalienable right to migrate. Leaders in their own countries should get their acts together and make life tolerable for their citizens, instead of dragging down the West.
50
This caravan is being manipulated by an NGO based in San Diego called Pueblos Sin Fronteras. And yes, these people would be delighted to escort millions of illegal migrants into the country no matter how expensive this is for US taxpayers, no matter how badly this stresses education systems, no matter how dangerous the people who they bring in COULD be to American citizens, no matter how much welfare payments these people will need, no matter how many SSN and false IDS this cohort will use, no matter...You get the idea. Clueless, fanatical liberals willing to do anything to punish white america for the sins they are accused of. No, there is nothing rational about this. Shut up and pay your taxes. You deserve this. They deserve this. That is the attitude.
5
Soros? Really?
1
Immigration law specifically incorporates criteria as to how the US should benefit from new arrivals, NOT just the benefits accruing to those wishing to enter. Language that is part of the Immigration Act of 1882 allows the US to deny entry to those likely to become "public charges." Other countries have similar criteria.
Has anyone evaluated those in the caravan to determine whether they could be self-supporting and contribute to the society they wish to enter? Or does claiming refugee status make such considerations moot?
jasper
32
Prior to the immigration reforms in the 60's migration between northern, central, and southern America was normal and legal. Those who came to this country worked hard and became part of the multicultural fabric that makes up our country. These people do the backbreaking work that native born Americans don't do which is why Trump recently promised farmers he would make sure they still have their migrant workers despite his immigration crackdown. We need to show some compassion and ask ourselves how we would wish to be treated if the US became overrun by violence and we were forced to flee.
32
Finally, a comment that speaks with compassion and addresses the violence that these people, mostly women and children are escaping.
Thank you.
The problem is that many asylum seekers simply disappear into the shadows and never actually go to court appearance where they would likely lose.
One way to solve the problem would be to build a consolidated asylum processing center on or near Amaknak Island, Alaska.
All asylum seekers would be housed there in simple, but safe, barrack-style housing and provided plain, sufficiently nutritious meals, basic medical care, and basic education services. Phone access might be pretty limited. The weather is comparatively balmy at 30-50 degrees Fahrenheit, though foggy much of the time.
Despite the primitive conditions, however, the asylum seekers would certainly be happy there. After all, life in their home countries is terrible.
Asylum hearings could be conducted remotely via Skype. Anyone whose asylum claim is accepted, would be transported to the West Coast and released. Anyone whose claim is denied would only be a mile or so from an airport or harbor for transportation back to their home country.
My guess is that asylum claims would drop immediately by 50% or more.
34
Sent to Alaska! The new Ellis island perhaps.
the high rate of rejections for asylum suggests many have a predominately economic motive but could also involve many who were overwhelmed by the process and failed to adequately articulate their case.
so what if they come to work there's plenty of work they could do and aren't harming anybody for the most part.
trump can't be trusted on this issue as he will twist and distort and engage in hyperbolic rhetoric to sellhis wall.
19
Low wage workers certainly do a lot of harm to Americans who would otherwise have the positions--with higher wages and better working conditions. How can you be so insensitive to the plight of poor Americans? The average cost of government is over $20,000 a year per resident--adult or child. Low income immigrants place an enormous financial burden on America.
34
There is precisely 0 reason to accept ANY of these folks. If they’re fearful in one section of El Salvador, move to another section. If that’s not good enough, try Costa Rica or Belize. Or Mexico. Better still, if your country merits DT’s asserted description thereof, stay and fight to make it better. If the sons of your neighbors are making life unbearable for you there, SOMEONE has go to stand up to them. If it’s not going to be you, who will it be?
Like all leftists, you can’t resist the change of “bigotry”, because that’s how you see the world. When everything is about “race” (extremely broadly defined), “bigotry” will be everywhere, even it it’s only in your fever imagination.
Our immigration policy should be simple: does admitting a particular immigrant benefit the US?
Not one of these people qualifies, and to the extent that things were bad in wherever they’re from, they're perfectly safe in Mexico. We don’t need them and should not admit them.
68
That’s very Christian. Only help others that can help you. Which Gospel was that in?
1
Michael,
And when did your ancestors enter America? What brought them here? When did they arrive? Or perhaps your lineage is Native American, if so, you can make a valid argument against admitting asylum seekers.
1
I have yet to hear a legitimate argument for limiting immigration from Central America. We should allow all who are fleeing violence to come here. There is no ethical or economic argument against this. The only reason to restrict immigration as severely as we do is racism. Those claiming otherwise are, without exception, lying.
We need to stop allowing xenophobia and ignorance control the debate. We need to follow our democratic values, and for those of you who are Christian, your religious values.
113
The US currently cannot afford to meet the financial needs of its own deserving citizens: the poor, disabled, elderly, veterans and others.
Therefore the US could not possibly afford to admit all of the millions of migrants, immigrants, illegal aliens, refugees and others who would love to come to this country.
The economic arguments against open borders are overwhelming.
11
@Edward Allen: What we really need to do is stop specious, malevolent accusations of racism (from the likes of Edward Allen) from controlling the debate.
12
How will we pay for the education, medical care & other welfare benefits for these illegal immigrants??
The Federal Budget deficit is huge and state fiscal conditions are horrible.
Please explain how we can pay for this Eddy!
10
The claim that the US is obliged to take in refugees is not true. There is clear evidence of Leftist organizers recruiting people to migrate to the border and then attorneys paid by Leftist groups who coach them on how to answer questions related to being granted asylum.
In light of this political charade, it makes the asylum process into a joke and the Left lays the ground work to turn away people who truly seek to escape persecution in foreign countries.
Since the caravans are politically motivated, the US has every right to turn them away and the licenses of the lawyers paid by Leftist groups to get them in should also be revoked.
61
I wish to enlighten you, AZRandFan. This is not a leftist plot. This is not a political charade. If you took the time to read and understand the Immigration Laws and Rules you would know that asylum is a lawful way to apply for refuge. It is on the books. It is written in black and white. It is part of our system. Not all who apply are accepted. Those who do apply are scrutinized, investigated, and documents are perused. Your post is completely without merit.
Name the leftist groups. Give us their titles, organizational locations, board of directors, etc, so that we too may become enlightened by your wisdom and experience.
Please cite this "clear evidence" (love that phrase).
Regarding the wall. As I've mentioned before on many occasions and I'll say it one more time in the hopes that it gets the exposure and distribution it deserves
There is only one, repeat ONE reason for Trump's obsession with the wall. When, and if, it ever really comes to be built, it will for all time after that, be known as TRUMP'S WALL. And THAT is why he will do everything in his power to get it built. It is the ultimate tribute to his narcissism and insecurity.
Trust me on this.
33
Send your poor and huddled masses. America used to be a refuge for those fleeing persecution. It is tragic that we are stereotyping immigrants as criminals.
These people are risking everything to come to America because they love our country, not because they're "rapists." Fidel Castro didn't send them from his prisons, they came voluntarily seeking safety.
Our laws are working, and that is sad. If I were in their shoes, I would pray that someone would be more sympathetic than we are and allow more than 25% of asylum seekers to pursue a new life safe from violence.
26
Pursue a new life? Yes but would your welcome be so enthusiastic if you could no longer find accommodation or schools did not have places to accept your children?
4
james
which asylum seekers are telling the truth?
3
Let's see:
I am a prisoner in Castro's Cuba. If he lets me out would I
a: Want to stay in Cuba
or
b: Go to the US.
Gee, I need to think about that for a while.
1
More misdirection on this issue.
The problem is that large numbers of asylum seekers never show up for their court dates, often not even filing formal asylum claims. They simply blend into the U.S. underground economy, knowing that eventually the liberal Democrats and Koch Brother Republicans will come to their rescue and grant them citizenship.
A great, though cynical, new business idea would be “Caravan Tours”. People from anywhere in the world would pay for a one-way ticket to Mexico City, a two-day seminar on how to present a “credible fear” claim, and then a tour bus ride to a border crossing. According to the law at this point, the U.S. is required to let them in, where they can go to the back of a 750,000 person line for asylum hearings, guaranteeing them several years of legal residency to get established before going underground.
44
One problem is the allegedly frivolous cases brought to delay the final decision in asylum hearings. The backlog is extensive.
1
And John, to add to the absurdity, there is no evidence supporting the asylum claims other than the well-practiced words of the asylum seekers themselves.
Trump has been called a bigot and racist, and I believe he is. He is also a hate monger. He has put more energy into ostracizing these “caravan” people, and their “liberal” supporters, than he has working with Congress to refine the current system - which as the article points out, works pretty well.
As a hate monger in, he uses language that would have us believe there are hundreds of thousands of migrants all across our southern border, and that they are ALL rapists, murderers, thieves, gang members, terrorists, and on and on.
This resonates with his “base”, but Trump and the GOP are going to need more than this base to stand a fighting chance in the November mid-terms. Trump’s problem is that he’s not growing his base, just playing to their fears. He has never made an effort to move beyond this base. That’s causally a good thing. He only fawns over people who adore him.
The Dems may be better off staying silent on this. We have an immigration system that works (although it MUST be enforced). The Dems can move on to other things that will solidify and grow their base, and most important, get them out to vote in November.
That’s hard work, and there is no time to lose. Drop “A Better Deal”, lame from the start, come up with three or four talking points, real pain points for most Americans, and drive the strategy from the grassroots (local) up. And make it crystal clear that Nancy Pelosi will be gone.
That’s a potentially winning strategy.
Trump can hate on.
8
Goodness, we only pay attention border when something the press or, in this case, the president shine a distorted light on this extraordinarily complex region.
US asylum and refugee policy is among the strictest of any country receiving immigrants. Few are actually accepted.
Most of the Central American immigrants currently awaiting processing do not want to leave their homes but are forced to make the trek by extreme violence caused by gangs, drug traffickers and sometimes government entities. Many though will not be able to prove it. Yes, there are some stragglers in the group but most genuinely cannot return to Central America.
Some find refuge along the route in Mexico, perhaps working without documents somewhere along the route. Violence and underdevelopment outside the largest cities make that difficult but some will try.
The US needs grounded comprehensive immigration policy but it will never be effective if larger forces in Mexico and Central America not not somehow part of the equation. An important part of the process is acknowledging the dilemma presented by asylum seekers knocking at the US southern border.
Whatever happens, I wish Central American asylum seekers well. The vast majority simply need a safe place to live and work.
9
Of the first 29 comments posted, most didn't get the point of the article. It's not to discuss the pros and cons of our immigration policy. It's that Donald Trump is using the caravan to scare Americans. It's 200 people at the border and so far 8 have been granted the right to have the asylum process start. Only to start. 75% of those never get it. So, 2 people, so far, have a chance to get in. Scary. Here's something scary: In 2016, a foreign power messed with our election and our government is unconcerned. That's scary.
54
Or one can say this admin is shining light on how badly broken our immigration system is while the previous admins were sweeping everything under the rug. TPS was passed in 2001 for 18 months and no one ever bothered to end it for 18 long years. There might have been many caravans before that were never tracked. Maybe this caravan showed up as 200 because of the visibility.
No one knows how many illegal immigrants are in this country. Just asking a question of Are you a citizen in the census is of course not acceptable. How dare a country ask that question. Similarly all dreamers are either cancer researchers, brave military or Nobel prize winners. DACA was 600k. All of a sudden in negotiations it became 1.8Miliion.
Our immigration system is a like a bucket leaking water faster than you can plug the leaks. There is no control. Any proposal to increase funding for immigration costs so cases can be ruled on quickly is of course opposed.
Illegal immigration beneficiaries such as activist groups, lawyers and politicians and media have placed the interests of illegal immigrants over citizens at this point. Elections will continue to deliver surprises till sanity prevails.
30
I have been concerned about illegal immigration for at least a decade, long before Trump came on the scene. I have been frustrated writing to all my Representatives asking them to do something. None did. Trump is the first to actually do something. Sure, people wanting open borders call him heartless, but I do not agree. He is protecting the American people from a problem that is way out of hand. My concern about this caravan is that they will enter the US and be set free to blend into the shadows and become more illegal immigrants, needing fake documents or welfare to survive. We can't take everyone. There must be a limit.
14
Just to repeat, this article is about fear mongering. If you are cool w/ a government that fear mongers, then you are happy. Til it mongers on something or someone that is dear to you. And they always do. Always.
Central American countries own four of the five highest murder rates in the world. What could go wrong with letting their entire populations in the U.S.?
And it’s not like Southern California is crowded or doesn’t have enough water or housing.
If there’s one thing we could really use are way more uneducated, unskilled, and impverished people who need free housing, food and medical care.
At least we have the moral high ground over the Canadians, Aussies, and Kiwis, who are so much more discriminating about who they let in.
54
Perhaps instead of your first, misleading question (no one lets in "entire populations" of Central American countries -- take a breath, friend -- you should ask these: how did those countries get that way (if, indeed, those stats are true)? And then, if those countries are, in fact, that dangerous, wouldn't it be humane to vet and eventually admit a couple hundred people who felt their situation dire enough to WALK from Honduras to California?
I know you are being sarcastic, but the Aussies and Kiwis are really MORE discriminating.
To use the plight of suffering people for your own selfish, political purposes as Trump does is clearly inhumane. But Trump knows the latent fears of his listeners and fans that fear into hatred and bigotry. He pretends to be protecting the interests of Americans, but knows that this is his ticket to his own political aggrandizement. His base believes that immigrants are the source of all their problems because they need a scapegoat and scapegoats have been around at least since the Old Testament as they serve a basic human need. These are not women and children escaping dire situations, but symbols of American discontent.
What does it mean to be an American? Is it to be open hearted and accepting of others in dire need or is it the Trumpian vision of me first no matter who it hurts?
12
Not much new here - more fake news from the fake CIC
Asylum is a lengthy, cumbersome process. These people chose to abide by OUR laws, rather than simply cross the border illegally.
I commend them, and wish them peace and success.
21
Our immigration laws are a joke.
Each of these applications costs tens of thousands of dollars. And most are, ultimately, declined. Why? Because fear of crime is not a valid reason for asylum. Being a domestic abuse victim is not a valid reason for asylum.
Where does the money for all these processes come from? Well the money comes out of the mouths of hungry citizens. It comes from housing programs meant to help our veterans.
The money comes from community clinics. It comes from our school systems.
I understand why the Editorial Board misses these facts. The Editorial Board members have an easy life. They earn a great deal of money. Their children eat every night and go to private schools. They have healthcare. They can afford rising housing prices.
Editorial Board: you are the 1%. Have you ever considered the rest of us?
84
Actually, I was thinking you may have a good point until I got to your statement about where the money comes from - that it, "...comes out of the mouths of hungry citizens. It comes from housing programs meant to help our veterans. The money comes from community clinics. It comes from our school systems." Actually, the current administration and the GOP want to take away that money anyway. They believe that U.S. citizens in need of food or health care or housing supports are just as much, "scammers," as some here have said the migrants are. So try again - please do help us that have not committed to either pole position in this debate figure it out.
“Asylum may be granted to people who ... are unable or unwilling to return to their home country because of persecution or a well-founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion.”
We are not talking about economic refugees - those who simply want a better way of life. We are talking about people seeking asylum - a legal term of art - within our borders. Asylum seekers must meet a very high standard of proof in asserting that they may not safely return home because of persecution based on their ethnic background, religion, or political views. We are talking about people who are fleeing for their very lives. This has nothing to do with "protecting our borders". The people in these caravans are some of the most vulnerable people on the planet, and yet they are demonized.
Trump's "immigration policy" is all about race - and only race. The people who seek asylum in this country come from some of the most vulnerable minorities in the world. They are not "hordes" overrunning our borders. Let's speak plainly here. Trump voters do not want to see any more people of color in this country, and most asylum seekers are people of color. If the people in these caravans were Irish, they'd be welcomed with open arms. And so Trump continues to pander to these racists, all in the name of "protecting our borders." This policy is about race.That's all his voters care about. That's all they've ever cared about.
16
Simply untrue and inflammatory. I voted for Trump and I don't care what race people are. We are all the human race. But we can't go on with millions - and we just don't know how many millions - living in the shadows in our nation. I agree we should help in some way, but not to the point of bringing everyone here. I am not heartless because I lock my door every night, it is because I want to protect the people in my house.
4
Perhaps you should read your own quotation. Please show where fleeing gang violence (assuming it is true) appears on the list of conditions under which asylum may be requested.
1
No Lukas Parkes, we are not “talking about people who are fleeing for their very lives.”
We are talking about people who SAY they are fleeing for their very lives.
If people can travel through multiple countries before requesting asylum and are seeking maximum safety and minimum violence, why not offer plane tickets to Canada from Tijuana? Justin Trudeau said in 2017 that Canada will accept and welcome folks who have been rejected by the U.S. Canada is safer and less violent than the U.S. Would you rather live in Baltimore or Toronto? Detroit or Vancouver?
37
This entire event is an affront to the country.
23
I'm all in favor of granting asylum to citizens of other countries who have no other alternatve but to come here to escape inhuman conditions. Certainly, let's help them.
But we also have many US citizens living in city ghetto situations in our urban areas where gang members roam freely subjecting law abiding mothers and children to lives of daily fear. We need an ongoing aggressive program to grant asylum to our own citizens. Let's take these gang victimized people away from that horror. Let's give them opportunities like we provide hurricane victims to find new places to live and work and attend school safely.
We have vast rural areas that would be ideal for development to accommodate these people in need. Leaving them abandoned in gang ruled city areas is truly a travesty.
9
By this logic the entire populations of Syria, Afghanistan, Somalia could make asylum claims.
Why not?
Those places are certainly more violent than any Central American nation.
49
The media is partly responsible for such a disastrous president who doesn’t believe that asylum seekers deserve a chance to make their case.
NYT: $2 Billion Worth of Free Media for Donald Trump https://tinyurl.com/z9jkzcn
But what’s truly astonishing is that the public has no way of knowing if Trump or other candidates have been legitimately elected. The vote-counting process has been outsourced to a handful of private companies that count our votes in secret with no oversight. Computer security experts have been telling us for years that electronic voting machines are vulnerable to hacking and insider manipulation. Our votes must be counted in public on election night with observers present. That’s what other democracies do.
NYT: Computer Voting Is Open to Easy Fraud, Experts Say https://tinyurl.com/ycanp24r
Hacking Democracy - The Hack https://tinyurl.com/y7c9oopu
The full-length Emmy nominated HBO documentary is available on YouTube.
A must-read on computerized voting: https://tinyurl.com/y9xx63f6
“In 2005, the non-partisan Commission on Federal Election Reform, chaired by Jimmy Carter and James Baker, stated unequivocally that the greatest threats to secure voting are insiders with direct access to the machines. ‘There is no reason to trust insiders in the election industry any more than in other industries.’”
“The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything." - Joseph Stalin
This is one helluva stupid risk to take.
15
The challenge for the democrats and boon for the republicans (which will lead to indefinite electoral victories) is that the progressive wing has become unreasonable on border control.
Every economic migrant can come up with the appropriate story to claim asylum status, moreover, the use of children as a key to entry is common knowledge among the migrants, as they know they can easily play on the heartstrings of the left and loopholes in system.
Accordingly, what exactly is the policy of the democrats on immigration, if not open borders? Their policies essentially let anyone who wants entry in, and once they get in, they dont want to deport anyone. Moreover, can democrats answer why illegal immigrants should gain favored status over legal immigrants who put in years of applications and money. Should we just disassemble the legal immigration status and let everyone in?
Finally, there is significant naivete that all migrants are saints (luckily gaining the name of dreamers), while most are gaming the system for economic reasons. The reason there is a silent revolt among many democrats and independents is that our property, state, and federal taxes are raised for their free k-12 education and free er care, while many of us struggle to pay for schooling and healthcare.
The democrats get what they deserve when they put the needs of the illegal immigrants over the tax paying US citizens. They will continue to lose elections in perpetuity, even to conmen like Trump.
86
Blending fact and fiction to make his case. I'd like to believe that the administration is not just pandering in order to raise money and votes from this folks who for their own reasons want to support the President while dodging history and today's reality.
7
Americans do not favor progressive policies on immigration. Obama had to deliver to Hispanics because of his election promises. It will be interesting to see how democrats address this situation going forward. A tightrope walk, to be sure.
7
The left echo chamber is unbreakable and alienating moderates, and many who want to support democratic policies. Accusing anyone who doesn't agree with progressive views as racist or fearmongering is intellectually lazy.
If the question is one of asylum, why don’t these oppressed masses apply for political amnesty in say, Mexico? Let’s at least be honest and admit that for the most part these are seeking economic asylum and that is why they want to come here.
We need to reform our immigration policies to make it easier for properly vetted people to enter the country legally. We need these folks going forward so why don’t we come up with a fair, rational, solution?
35
If you actually read the article, it states that most of the migrants do seek asylum in Mexico. A small number try for asylum in the US; most are rejected. Asylum laws are strict, are enforced, and are working.
252
It is understood that asylum seekers can seek asylum from the country of their choice. In practical terms, Mexico also has problems and it makes sense for people to seek asylum from the US. A similar dynamic is in play in Greece, which has absorbed huge numbers of Syrian refugees without the capacity to absorb them, and many would try to move on to other countries if possible.
On reforming and easing up legal immigration, what many US-born do not fully understand is that, at present, immigration is a lengthy and expensive procedure under the best of circumstances. And it is getting harder, because the Trump administration is strongly anti-immigrant in general, and is restricting many legal immigration avenues.
If they applying for asylum, they should do so in Mexico, ie, the first country they arrive in. As soon as ther chose to continue north, they become migrants. We should not waste money with the asylum process for people who cannot be asylum seekers.
Of course, we can not expect of the NYT editorial board to shed any meaningful discussion on the topic of illegal immigration. People who travel thousands of miles through safe countries just to get to the US where they do not even speak the language, are not really looking for asylum. Otherwise they would stay in safe places closer to home where asylum is readily available.
97
Mexico is an amazing country, but far from a safe one. And who are we to deny them the right to look for opportunities where they are more likely to find them ? Leaving their homes and families is the most difficult choice one can make. We are just lucky to be on this side of the border.
52
gihorst is incredibly ignorant of the horrible violence perpetrated in the homelands of the asylum-seekers, much of it the result of U.S. intervention and our "War on Drugs", and in much of Mexico.
46
gihorst says: "People who travel thousands of miles through safe countries just to get to the US where they do not even speak the language, are not really looking for asylum."
This line describes how my Armenian grandparents arrived here. My Irish ancestors, too.
Isn't this pretty much how we all got here? Except for Native Americans and African Americans descendent from slaves?
28
Our immigration policy does not exist to solve the problems of the millions of people who live in dysfunctional countries. It exists, or should exist, to make the U.S. a stronger, more prosperous nation.
These people should seek asylum in the prosperous nation of Mexico. Of course, Mexico would prefer to encourage these people to move through their country to our borders.
So, what is this story? This is more "fake news." The "caravan" is unimportant.
48
I completely agree, MFW. My grandparents should never have been allowed into the U.S. to solve the problems of Russian Jews who were beaten, murdered, restricted, forced to live in poverty (like most Russians of the day but more dangerously). And as for those worthless Italian poor, they should have stayed in their huts. And the Irish! OMG, the Irish! Why did the U.S. have to solve their problem of starvation? It was up to England to do that. We should have sent the million or more back to starve in Ireland, where they belonged.
And that reminds me of those miserable "Pilgrims" who only came here to solve religious difficulties they could better have solved at home in England and Scotland, instead of stealing land from and later murdering Americans.
302
I couldn’t have agreed more. Tried to recommend more than once but that doesn’t work. America is the country we are because of the melting pot we were taught we were in school. There have always been those who demonized immigrants because they might change the status quo. This is just more of the same.
10
Gee Thomas: What a devastating response. And your analogy is perfect! Except that the immigrants you describe arrived legally, within our immigration policies. And were wanted, because 100 years ago we a country the fraction of our current size and desperate for workers. My point remains the same: immigration policies are for the United States and its welfare, not for the welfare of those who simply wish to come here. What other nation allows an open borders policy?
1
Desperate individuals looking for a safe haven. We should be proud they have chosen the United States of America as that place to bring their women and children. But no, our President lies to the American people and casts them as criminals and worse.
This man Trump is the most irresponsible President in the history of this Republic.
224
Trump is the most irresponsible President in the history of the US - not much doubt about that. But that fact does not nullify the concerns US citizens have of being swarmed and swamped by the world billions of needy.
14
Trump is a great president. These people are seeking economic handouts that are available in the US and not Mexico. That is why they don't seek asylum in Mexico. Also, they pay money to the organizers of the caravan to help them with the trip and to coach them on talking with CBP.
This is all a scam against the American people and Trump is the only one trying to put a stop to it. Others are trying to use our tax dollars to support these people who should work to stay in their own countries and solve their problems.
6
Cherrylog754
How many thousands of refugees would you like to see enter the U.S?
3
Many Central Americans travel in caravans strictly for protection against "coyotes", human predators who plan to profit at the expense of these poor travelers. Coyotes charge exorbitant amounts of money to guide caravan travelers to the US, money that they ill afford for "help" to the promised land. Coyotes also use the threat of violence and rape as weapons of intimidation. These "guides" are dangerous to caravan travelers but to these desperate people, seeking asylum in America is better than the violence and bloodshed in their homelands.
23
The real asylum law I want to see in action is Donald taking a very long vacation in a secured facility. Just saying.
268
The article states those traveling "...are generally accompanied on their trek by organizers who lay out their options." And "Organizers and lawyers told about 200, mostly children, that they had a chance to gain asylum...."
Lots of questions here, not looked into by the NYT. Who are the "organizers," and who pays them? Who are the lawyers, and who pays them? Who pays for the shiny new buses, not pictured in the mainstream media, that transport the "migrants"? Who pays for the new clothes that virtually all of the "migrants" are wearing? Don't the lawyers and organizers teach the migrants how to respond to questions from immigration authorities in order to game the system? The article misleadingly uses the phrase "mostly children," whereas photos of the group show a vast majority of adults.
I do not mean to suggest that some of the "migrants" are not legitimately seeking asylum in the US. However, it is clear that some people, or some organizations, with very deep pockets are organizing and paying for this effort.
Why hasn't the NYT used its investigative prowess to reveal what individuals and organizations are behind this effort to promote open borders? If organizers and lawyers were allowed to accompany the migrants, why not a reporter from the NYT? And what about the several caravan members who sneaked into the US illegally and were arrested? Surely there were some missed Pulitzer Prize opportunities here.
7
phyliss dalmation
Just Saying?? It sounds rather treasonous to me.
1
These caravans must be stopped. Our immigration policies are in place to help America not people from dysfunctional countries. This is all a scam and the American people are expected to pay for it.
7
The Board doesn't tell the whole story. A Buzzfeed reporter accompanied the caravan and, according to Mother Jones, "the Buzzfeed reporter reports that the group will march to the US border where roughly two-thirds of the participants will either seek asylum in the US or try to cross the border illegally. Others in the group are traveling to other parts of Mexico."
Bona fide refugees should be admitted, Illegals should not. A caravan of both is obviously deceptive. It's not the worst thing in the world. But it should be reported as part of the news that's fit to print. Maybe part of the story is enough for you. I like to know what's really going on.
37
Seventy five percent of the applicants for asylum ill be turned down. they will then become illegal aliens and refuse to go home.
The pro-illegal immigration advocates are coaching them what to say in order to pass the "creditable threat" threshold.
63
They are separating families and interviewing them individually. No matter how well "coached" they are if their stories don't jive they won't be admitted.
No one is pro-illegal immigration. We are pro sincerely conducted interviews of asylum seekers. The stories of how Sessions Justice Department is conducting interviews or lying that they're at capacity is illegal.
Considering how the Trump administration is behaving, Americans in the Democratic Party may be the next group of asylum seekers outside the US from an ever increasing hostile environment fueled by Trump's veiled threats.
What has become of our country? The meanness is unbelievable! My ancestors: Irish looking for jobs as maids and laborers would never be allowed under this system today. I'm here because I was able to get an education and become an American.
166
Your ancestors came to this country at a different time.
In the year 1800 there were 5.3 million people in the United States.
In 1850 there were 23 million. In 1900 there were 76 million.
In 1980 there were 236.5 million. In 2000 there were 291 million. Today there are 326 million people.
The trend is disturbing. This country no longer needs 19th century immigration policies.
44
Great post. I don't know why others don't feel the same. Perhaps they have forgotten America's true roots?
16
What was the US population then and what is it now? Big difference between then and now.
23
The disinformation campaign to sweep under the rug the extent and the impact of illegal immigration comtinues by vested interests who are immigration activists, lawyers and politicians and main stream media who have elevated the cause of illegal immigrants above the welfare of citizens as they benefit from more illegal immigration.
When this caravan was pointed out, everyone said this was just a marhc to raise awareness and it ends in Mexico City. So all of a sudden caravan shows up at the border and am sure the rest of the caravan have already crossed over illegally.
Catch and release means folks who are released will never show up to the hearing because they know no one will enforce the laws. Children are not detained and released to family members which is another loop hole. Bottom line is there is no border control. When funding is asked to hire more immigration judges to reduce the time to resolve, again it is blocked.
While we should have a humane and compassionate immigration policy we can’t be gullible and naive. No modern country can care for its citizens’ welfare without knowing who is residing in its borders.
40
Matt, you missed the fact that "everyone" didn't say that. In fact, most of the caravan has remained in Mexico. The purpose of the caravan was not to raise awareness but to keep migrants fleeing terror safe on their flight.
11
There are eight billion humans on Earth and six and a half live in undesirable countries. If more of these people can enter the advanced economies, we will be overwhelmed by a flood of unskilled, uneducated people claiming asylum. Legal and illegal immigration has already destroyed the wages and working conditions of our blue collar citizens. Don't be a dupe for the globalist plutocrats that want masses of desperate workers in the U.S. willing to take any job at slave wages.
68
I think that already happened during the second wave of immigration when the "swarthies" and the Jews and the Slavs showed up to work in the steel and textile industries. Greeks, Italians, Irish, Eastern European Jews, and all manner of Slavs.
My grandfather was one.
4
We have tens of millions of citizens that barely have the skills to make a living. Why should we import more unskilled humans just so the one percent can have cheap nannies and landscapers ? Chauncey, think about this. When autonomous truck driving becomes a reality, three million drivers, citizens, will be out of work. Should they have to compete for work with millions of unskilled immigrants ?
7
It is a way or form of the colonization of America by the 1%.
3
The president, by using the bellows of fear to keep the fires of racism going, is merely following up on what was his signature campaign promise as a candidate.
His equally miserly sycophant, Attorney General, Jefferson Davis Beauregard Sessions III, aids the president who despises him by dispatching fresh legal reinforcements to the border to turn back the desperate applicants. The AG is also empties the bullets in his boss's pistols by suing sanctuary cities. That is another matter but it is entirely in keeping with the xenophobia that gave birth to a candidacy that was as un-American as it was possible to be and, subsequently, a presidency that is every bit as menacing to brown people from beyond our borders.
There is no easy way out of this immigration fix. Congress, were it not so partisan, nor so driven by the xenophobia that is the chief hallmark of this administration of despair, might have persuaded itself that trying to solve (or at least address) this knotty tangle. Oh; I forgot. Their donors and shadowy billionaires needed a tax break. Sorry.
The Republican Party, were it peopled by those to whom Jesus Christ is truly their savior, might have paused to give a thought to the desperate Samaritans who crowd our borders. It isn't possible to provide for all of them, but some show of compassion might have salved the wounds of those who thirst for something better than what they had.
Who in America is not descended from immigrants? Including Trump and Sessions?
88
Soxared
How many illegal immigrants would you like to see enter this country? How many refugees would you like to see enter this country, who may or may not be suffering in their own countries?
7
''Who in America is not descended from immigrants?''
Our First Nations, aka American Indians, of course. Just for starters, honoured all the various treaties? Preserved their rights?
3
Ah yes the two favorite "Trigger words" of the open border people, "Racism" and "Xenophobia". God forbid the word Illegal is ever linked to immigration. Illegal aliens are either Undocumented or Unauthorized, or even better immigrants.
ICE has deported people to England, Germany, Poland, Ireland. I guess this is a form of "racism".
Just how many hundreds of millions refugees should we be admitting every year? How many will you have taken into your home? How much more do you want to pay in taxes to pay for these people?
I am sure since I disagree with your position I am a Racist Xenophobe.
8
Why we cannot embrace refugees is beyond me. The words of a poet enshrined on the Statue of Liberty tell us: "Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!" This is our heritage as citizens of the USA. We must do more for refugees. They will make us stronger. Closing the door in their face, makes us weaker and despotic.
60
A poem on base supporting a statue given to us by France to celebrate our friendship should not form the basis of our immigration policy. An immigration policy should reflect what is best for our citizens.
At one time the United States was a vast wilderness where people would come and succeed or fail on their own. That country has long been changed to a nation of 327 million people, the third most populated nation in the world.
26
The US cannot currently afford to meet the needs of its own citizens: the poor, disabled, chronically ill, veterans, homeless, et al.
It is therefore economically impossible for the US to take in all the millions of people who would like to leave their countries and come to ours.
9
As of December 2015, the number of refugees, asylum-seekers and internally displaced people around the world is over 65 million, according to The United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees.
If you come for economic reasons, you have 65 million ahead of you who need a home because they are persecuted based on race and/or religion.
Shouldn't we let all 65 million come to the US?
7
So the head of the state as well as the head of the government, Mr. Trump, instead of enforcing the rule of law and collaborating to change the law wherever needed, starts assailing the laws that he has been elected to enforce. Therefore, it is clear that Mr. Trump doesn't want a solution, he wants to a problem or he wants to create a problem, where there may be none in order to raise the banner of bigotry and intimidate people to join him. This is how fascism works.
42
Trump tried to solve the immigration issue Obama caused and the Democrats obstructed everything. Illegals must all be deported as we just don't have the resources to fixed our infrastructure AND support all the worlds poor!
12
"Mr. Trump, instead of enforcing the rule of law and collaborating to change the law wherever needed, starts assailing the laws that he has been elected to enforce."
One can easily say the exact same thing about Mr. Obama's lack of enforcement of our current immigration laws.
5
“Asylum may be granted to people who are already in the United States and are unable or unwilling to return to their home country because of persecution or a well-founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion.”
Exactly how do these Central Americans meet the criteria for asylum in the US?
Is the US expected to host anyone in Guatemala, Honduras and El Salvador that wants to leave their country for a better life in the US?
37
Is a death threat on a family member by a Honduran gang adequate to meet asylum criteria? I submit that it is.
Has anyone mentioned that US policy toward Latin America over many decades ("making it safe for US investment" by supporting brutal right-wing dictatorships) has been a factor in the development of the violent chaos these people are fleeing?
244
Exactly, no one wants to look at the US complicity in creating the violence and lawlessness. Along with the demand for drugs.
23
What have we done?? We ended WWII, rebuilt Germany, Japan. In 1945 we were the most respected country on earth and no enemies. Now we have several. And some have bombs 10 times more powerful than what fell on Japan then. Ike was so right about the 1% - the military industrial complex. And Trump is right, the system is rigged by the 1%
7
Right you are. We just did it again in Honduras by making sure we installed our guy as President, not the one the people of Honduras elected.
8
For an article that purports to tell the truth about seeking asylum, it sure is highly misleading. It fails to even gloss over the core elements required for a successful asylum application. The second of three prongs that need to be satisfied is this one: the applicant must prove that he or she would be persecuted on account of one of five protected grounds: race, religion, nationality, political opinion, or social group. People fleeing dangerous gangs in a violent country such as Honduras or Guatemala simply aren’t being persecuted on one (or more) of the protected categories. The migrants know this (and have been advised on this extensively by open borders advocates such as Pueblos sin Fronteras), so the tactic is to then just remain in the United States pending a determination on their credible fear application. As the article points out, this takes a while and when the date for the hearing ultimately arrives, the migrant simply does not show at the hearing. Supporting immigration scams isn’t a winning position for the left to take and omitting key details makes people even more suspicions of what the Democrats are trying to accomplish.
97
At least while the determination is pending, they haven't been killed. A few more months of life is perhaps worth the trip.
24
How do you know they won't be killed? Requesting asylum and then getting released pending their hearing does not guarantee that they won't be killed. Crime exists in the US also.
4
Yes Don L., an editorial which gives stats showing that most applicants are rejected, without admitting that most rejected applicants stay here anyway, is intentionally deceptive. In the old days, the NYT was more honest.
5
The problem isn't that the process doesn't work. It mostly does and there are tons of people with outstanding deportation orders that show that (there is of course the issue it we can't possibly validate all or even most of the claims made). The issue is that lots of people that have no claim to asylum at all are coming and have been coming for decades for economic reasons. Yes we do need to put more resources into processing these claims but when the rejection rate was around 80% for the "northern triangle" and 90% for Mexico even during the Obama years it is clear many are simply deciding to try their luck at gaming the system and wasting tons of our resources in the process.
43
I've spent time in Guatemala and Honduras and I have no doubt that some people indeed face threats of violence. They also fear that if they move to other parts of their countries they will be pursued.
I do however want to clarify one point. Central America is not the highly dangerous place that most Americans imagine. The problem for asylum seekers is that they have the misfortune to live in places that see a great deal of criminal activity. They have reason to be afraid for themselves and their families. However, there are many, many places in Central American that are not dangerous. And the vast majority of people are wonderful. I have traveled off the beaten track in Guatemala and Honduras and never experienced the slightest problem. That being said there are places... such are those from which asylum seekers come... where I wouldn't go. The same applies to Mexico. The large majority of the country is safe. Colombia is, despite American misconceptions, even safer.
47
Many 1,000's of retired Americans and Canadians are moving full time to live in Central American countries, so it can't be all that bad.
34
The most beautiful, kind souls I’ve ever met have been from Central America!
13
The caravan people fleeing their home countries to seek safety have found it in Mexico. They are safe.
The editorial provides no reason why these same people need to cross the US border in circumvention of routine immigration status.
It appears that they may be coming to America as an economic preference, in which case they need to take a ticket and wait in the same line as everyone else.
As a Trump supporter, I would like to thank the NYT editorial board for their support and efforts on behalf of our president and his party in the coming mid-term elections. We wouldn’t be able to fend off the expected blue wave without media efforts such as this editorial.
79
They can't get free Obama phones in Mexico, Francis, along with American taxpayers picking up the costs of their kids' health care, housing, food and education.
9
Legit argument sort of. Safe in Mexico though? Man you could not pay me to go there.
2
1. Those are not "Obama phones," Mookie. The overall program was started during the Reagan administration. And it does not provide free phones -- the cellular carriers may opt to do that. Nor does taxpayer money fund this program of discounts on service -- it is funded out of fees levied on the carriers.
2. As for taxpayers picking up costs for needy children's health care, housing, food and education, all other advanced countries do that as a matter of course. But of course, they do not have to fund the world's army and navy.
How about we if fix the laws and attitudes that make the immigrants who are already here virtual slaves? The immigrants who are in our country have no path to citizenship, the laws that they are governed by are either ignored or in such a state of flux that none of them know if they have protections or not. As a result, many do not access services we take for granted. Things like healthcare, assistance for mothers, the ability to report unsafe working conditions or wage theft or crimes committed against them. Interaction with the authorities is to be avoided at all costs.
We now have a caste system as rigid as anything in the world. There are citizens with all the rights and privileges enumerated in constitution and laws. Then there are the immigrants who cook our food, mow our lawns, watch our kids, build our buildings, work in our universities labs, who have no protections and are regularly abused.
Slavery did not end with the civil war, it is going on right here, right now. WE are the masters, WE are the slave owners, WE allow this to continue.
52
Agreed.
Fixing laws requires electing people who understand what's going on and will do so. The so-called president is universally clueless and his enablers either are too or know better but push the "Caravan of Murderers and Rapists" narrative anyway. These enablers are easy to identify, they go by the name "Republicans".
VOTE out the Republicans in November! (and the June primaries).
34
Immigrants are not here as virtual slaves. Immigrants have applied and been accepted to come to this country to assimilate and eventually become citizens,
Immigrants have a well defined path to citizenship.
ILLEGAL immigrants should have NO path to citizenship, they knowingly broke the laws to enter or overstay their visas. Illegal immigrants are not virtual slaves. NOTHING prevents them from going back to their home countries.
It is disingenuous to blur the sharp distinction between legal and illegal immigration.
21
"...services we take for granted. Things like healthcare..."
You can take healthcare for granted? That's nice for you, dear. Many, many Americans can't.
6
Unfortunately this does not get at the root cause of the violence in these countries. The solution is not to empty these countries of their citizens and transplant them here. We have an obligation to seek a remedy to the cause of the violence and put into action a plan to curtail it with the cooperation of those countries.
104
STEVE
Why does the U.S. have an "obligation to seek a remedy to the cause of the violence."
14
Sarah, because it is Americans who buy the drugs that the gangs in Central American countries sell to finance their enterprises. Oh, those gangs also buy the vast majority of their weapons from US sources.
The extent of US citizens' ignorance of the effect their country has on the rest of the world is a constant source of amazement to people who live outside the US. The drug wars would stop tomorrow if personal drug use was made legal in the US - and why not, the demand is there, let adults do what they want - but I guess Sessions must have reasons not to want that to happen.