I don’t care who this article is about. My favorite line; ‘the world is bigger than you, and it belongs to us too.”
Best sentiment to describe the state of our union. Sadly, a lot of old, white peeps don’t recognize themselves on the wrong side of history.
3
Progressives love to use the word "evolving" as if the world is supposed to be heading in a certain direction and if you don't agree, you are not "woke". Evolution doesn't work that way. You can keep saying "it's 2018, therefore we should be more blah blah blah" but none of it has anything to do with evolution. Time will tell what will survive and what won't, but just because you think we should be more "evolved" is completely meaningless in the greater context.
20
This is a tough one. Gervais was explicit multiple times in his Special about the rationale and message behind “havin’ a laugh” using the subject of race, sexuality, gender, even something as vile as rape. He has a point. Sometimes an artist -yes, grudgingly he’s an artist of performance whether you find him funny or not - can and should draw on what makes us uncomfortable. Humour, especially, is a lubricant to free up the ability to confront injustice and inequality. It’s no different than making unpalatable medicines with sugar so they go down easier. If you think Gervais is heaping scorn in the subjects of his jokes, you’re not getting them. That being said, Gervais doesn’t do much to reinforce his public insistence that he’s not a racist, bigoted homo/transphobe. He cares deeply for stray Cats and dogs. But he’s arrogant and self-centred and egotistical not unlike many performers who believe the adulation from their millions of twitter followers. I think people like Gervais need a stage. I don’t think he’s the dangerous boor some make him out to be. But frankly, he hasn’t managed to achieve anything like the intelligence and smartness of The Office. He sold it to the US, made a bundle and has played a characature of himself ever since. Louis C. K. ran circles around Gervais using crude imagery, because he made it about himself. Gervais is just mean spirited and haughty when he titters at the objects of his humour. So it’s not great wit or smartness.
5
Let's face it: The real problem with people like Ricky Gervais (or Anne Coulter for that matter) is not their disgusting potty mouths but their battered souls.
It's so easy now to be angry and cynical and hate with such passion; it's built into our DNA as a a fight or flight response. It's what we ALL do best.
At some point in the past 50 years or so, our society somehow got the hell kicked out of it (Vietnam? Watergate? Bill Clinton? 9/11? Iraq?The Great Recession? Bush43? Obama? Trump?) and look at the mess we're in.
We all look at other people (other races, other sexuality, other political viewpoints, other genders--you name it) and the first thought that usually comes into our collective brainpans is "how is this jerk gonna try to screw me?" And so it goes.
And please: people like Ricky and Anne exist and thrive because we all enable them. (Ricky might be a homophobic jerk---but he's SOOO funny at the Golden Globes. Or: Anne is such a disgusting knuckle-dragging xenophobic, but isn't she a hoot when she's making fun of Trump?) They are both symptoms of OUR fear and anger and distrust--and I'd bet they were BOTH kicked around a lot as kids. But weren't we all?
So: Where are mommy and daddy when we most need(ed) them?
Ricky and Anne don't know.And they'd like you to think they don't care, either...
2
Criticism of Gervais is not new—comics who challenge us often are. Lenny Bruce, Richard Pryor, Dick Gregory, and George Carlin come to mind immediately.
Gregory: Hell hath no fury like a liberal scorned.
Bruce: If Jesus had been killed twenty years ago, Catholic school children would be wearing little electric chairs around their necks instead of crosses.
Pryor: It’s been a struggle for me because I had a chance to be white and refused.
Carlin: Religion is just mind control.
Is Ms West bothered by Ricky’s slings and arrows? Why is targeting conservative nonsense from Trump or Santorum acceptable, but being acerbic with the left is not?
Some humor makes us outraged and uncomfortable—maybe that is its purpose. Surrounded by vacuous comedy from our major entertainment outlets, it is important to have a few humorists who may hold our feet to the fire and require us to think about issues we hold dear.
26
Tell me more about this “International Emergency”—Syrian Orphan
20
Lindy west hates anything that falls outside of her narrow definition of free speech. Liberals can act and do what they want but anything contrary is wrong.
She's an unhappy, finger pointing liberal not open to ideas that she doesn't create, just look at that picture of her scowl....
18
Ricky who?
2
Always punch up never punch down.
2
What a terribly biased article. While certainly entitled to her opinion I cant help but to think this character attack on Gervais is just another step on the ladder DOWN on the restriction of free thought.
Demonizing those who hold a different view than you, ESPECIALLY comedians is hilariously juvenile and thin skinned.
31
This author is a living, breathing example of the kind of person Gervais criticizes about in his special, namely observers of comedy who laugh until the issue they happen to care about becomes butt of the joke. Lindy West, nobody cares that you didn't think the special was funny, truly. In fact, I may just watch Gervais' special again and share the link on my social media pages in your honor. Comedy is meant to pervade areas of sensitivity, and your attempt to cordon off certain avenues of discourse just makes them that much more attractive for him and ultimately for the audience.
25
Thanks for the tip, I just subscribed to Ricky's Twitter feed.
20
Who knew the last Victorian Gentlemen would turn out to be a woman? A humourless one to boot.
16
Also humour is reactionary. It changes nothing
So transphobia is a “continuing international emergency”?
A condition which impacts 0.3 of the population (and by many accounts this is a somewhat inflated number) has taken on global emergency status - and to boot, many trans advocates have gone so far as to push anti-science claptrap to further their cause (for instance, their insistence that gender is a social construct).
I tend to find Gervais’s “have I offended you” shtick pretty tiresome, but I’m not surprised to see this kind of reaction emerge in response to the increasing shrillness of many so-called social justice warriors. Shrill and hyperbolic advocacy tends to yield obnoxious responses.
19
Ms. West, I can add nothing but admiration for your op-ed. Thank you.
2
Why oh why does the NYTs continue to publish this ignorant authors rantings? Ricky Gervais's point, which the author apparently completely missed, is that he purveys COMEDY. Comedy is by its very nature, edgy and politically incorrect. It is also part of first amendment protection. There is an old saying dating, I believe, back to the days when radio was the main out let for mass media. If you don't like what you hear, there is a little button on your device that allows you to turn it off. This author wants to turn it off for all of us and that is not only unconstitutional, but also unAmerican.
28
You missed the point of his intellectual satire. By saying the things thousands are saying or worse think he's exposing the riculouness of their rigid views.
My fellow liberals, and I'm way on the progressive left much to the consternation of my southern family, are joining that rigid thougt-sphere. Comedy has always been blatantly rasict, sexist, irreverant, blasphemous, etc...
Did you ever ask yourself why?
It can highlight what's wrong in our social bubbles. This includes the far right and the far left. Where they wrap around to meet each other in the circle of rigid thought.
Is Ricky Gervais dangerous? Listen to yourself. He's a comedian. People like Trump and especially people like Pence are the danger, they write laws. A liberal British comedian is going to be the catalyst for hate crimes against the LGBTQ community? A community I belong to by the way, I think not. Comedy is not policed by the same standard as regular society.
We need the Archie Bunkers in comedy, they are a mirror held up to reality so it can check itself.
Consider offensive comedy as the checks and balances for society as a whole. It shows a problem that needs fixing. A cringe worthy joke goes a long way to push change. You catch more social flaw flies with satire than articles like this, stop giving snowflake rice crispy squares to the right. They don't need the help and progressive Liberals, like myself, aren't painted with the same narrow brush you used here.
21
Lindy West, 24/7/365. I loved Ricky Gervais from his time doing both versions of the office, but as a middle-aged educated hetrosexual white guy privileged enough to be an artist and a farmer, I had missed the signs Ms. West so eloquently pointed out. I may be dumb, but I'm not stupid: I know which duck to follow.
2
This prompted my friends & me to watch "Humanity." We've all been ardent feminists & progressives for longer than Lindy West has been alive, & we all laughed our heads off.
It's too bad what Ricky Gervais was doing flew right over West's head. "Humanity" wasn't just a funny show - it was a comedy master class in which he deconstructed how & why jokes work or don't work, & explained where comedy springs from & why we humans need it.
A point Gervais made at the outset was that just prior to coming out as Caitlyn at age 65, driver Bruce Jenner rear-ended another vehicle in CA, causing a chain of collisions in which a woman named Kim Howe was killed. But amidst all the media acclaim for how "stunning & brave" Jenner's been for morphing from Bruce to Caitlyn, not one iota of concern for Howe was expressed by the establishment press & new-fangled "feminists" like West.
As a biological woman whose life was cut short due to the actions of a biological man, Howe just wasn't special enough. In West's "evolved" world, the women who most deserve sympathy & support are the ones born male who, like Jenner, have spent (more than 6!) decades benefiting from male privilege & garnering success & acclaim for manly pursuits.
Re Carson's "transphobic" claim: yes, many bio females do feel unsafe in women's shelters/spaces that now give entry to bio men claiming to be women (but who still have male arrogance, genitals & bullying ways). Women need those places to escape the violence of men.
21
I think Mr Gervais makes good points. The pendulum has swung from the right-wing uptightness of the Moral Majority to the left-wing uptightness of PC censorship. Comedians barely perform on college campuses anymore. Loosen up, "snowflakes"! There's a reason you're called that!
11
Men who scream “snowflake” at rape victims feel so wounded by even minor critiques that they have been re-litigating the same arguments about “offense” and “free speech” for decades.
Umm, who ever has called someone a "snowflake" for complaining of being raped? Is this really true? If so, you need to back it up.
9
Good. I don't care either. So go ahead and call me "grotesque" or "inhuman" but I am sick and tired of the constant whining of victimization and boo-hooing by this, that or the other oppressed group.
The reason why white men are on top of the food chain is that, over time, they beat up everyone else. If you want to be on top of the food chain, beat up those white men where it counts -- in smarts, ambition and lust for power. But stop trying to guilt and shame them into subservience because not only will that not work, in the end, it will spectacularly fail as POWER is what counts.
6
It takes keen perception and intelligence to be a comic. Whether or not Ricky Gervais is funny, well, that is a matter of taste. I would bet that Mr. Gervais understands the world as well as Ms. West. He certainly finds it more ridiculous than she does. Unfortunately, Ms. West displays that humorless, narcissistic self-righteousness which the Right deplores about the Left. I feel drawn more by the ideas and values on the Left, but its puritanical hyper-sensitivity only elicits more mockery. Deservedly so.
12
He's unkind.
......and that makes him unfunny and not interesting to me. It's easy to take pot shots. Ask any bully how much effort it takes to denigrate and insult. It requires much more emotional intelligence to capture the nuances that make life interesting and yes, funny.
Can't be done, you say? Humor is dark, nasty and predatory?
Once again, leave it to a woman to do it right way. Look no further than Ellen and her empire and then do the math.
1
Is this article intended as serious comment? Gervais doesn't hold those views: he's *satirizing* them, as a form of performance art. The right-wing persona is a character he plays. He's satirizing America. He even said so before the tour began.
13
Hmm should I worry about Jesse Watters or Ricky Gervais ...
Judging by the comments, the VAST majority disagree with you West.
Try again.
9
The guys is hilarious...
We should all be able to laugh at each other, quit being so uptight,
9
I’m sure Gervais thanks you for the free publicity.
11
And I think to myself once again “... and women wonder why they are not taken seriously”
7
This is the level of nonsense and polemics that I get more than enough of when I read the WSJ opinion section.
5
Ricky Gervais: best to simply ignore him and his 13 million "followers". Let them all disappear. It's better than the grim reaper and more fitting.
Jokes are either funny or they're not. Pete Davidson, who lost his father on 9/11, does 9/11 jokes. It's completely subjective. If the joke is genuinely coming from an attempt at humor and not a veiled jab at a defenseless target, give the comedian credit for effort. Ricky's new stuff isn't that funny. Let's move on.
You may disagree with Gervais, but he is right: Caitlyn (nee Bruce) Jenner is a man. That's simply a matter of fact. People cannot change their sex simply by changing their clothes, nor by "feeling" different, nor via plastic surgery. (Gender (i.e. masculinity / femininity) can be changed merely by behaving differently...but 'woman' and 'man' aren't gender terms.)
Some people, driven by politics and not logic (nor biology) have decided to pretend such change is possible. Which, if it stopped there, would be false and odd and a testament to the power of politically-motivated delusion...but perhaps not terribly harmful.
But, of course, it doesn't stop there. They shriek at those of us who refuse to pretend along with them...and they pretend that our recognition of plain fact is prejudice. (It isn't; I don't care how Jenner lives his life. I'm just not going to pretend that he's a woman.) More consequentially, the left wants us to admit men-pretending-to-be-women to women's restrooms, locker rooms, and sports, and to make them eligible for certain scholarships, presumably.
"Transphobia" isn't a "continuing national emergency"...though "transgenderism" is. It's a patent delusion, and, worse, it's being foisted onto the culture without real discussion--because dispassionate discussion of it is, of course, "transphobia." The left now inoculates its irrational social engineering projects from criticism by declaring all opposition--and even all discussion--to be prejudice.
12
A part of inclusivity of comfort and of belonging is the freedom to joke with and at the expense of those we count our peers. I haven't had the time yet to watch Ricky's latest special so I'm not trying to speculate as to the exact tone of his jokes, but I don't think it's inherently wrong to joke about... well... anything. As a white man, I'm not offended by Peter Griffin, Michael Scott, Ted Mosby, or any other depiction of bumbling idiotic white men, overly sincere sad boys, or nerdy white tech bros.
It's called mainstreaming. That's what happens when you're accepted and culturally relevant. Again, I'm not trying to excuse straight up hateful speech, but of sex, gender, and romance would be mostly melodrama, friction, and heartbreak if we couldn't ever joke about bad dates, struggles to find love, etc. And of course there's something inherently awkward and comedic about grown adults taking their first steps not only in a new gender and potentially romantic identity but perhaps even in a new body just as there was a lot of awkwardness for cisgendered people initially exploring their sexuality and romantic interests. THAT'S the commonality!
Although I'm a millenial, from what I understand about the past, we're only about 50 years removed from the LGBTQ community being so taboo it wasn't even really talked about openly. Breaking that taboo seems like a good thing to me.
3
Lindy West fulfills Gervais predictions of how his comedy would be misunderstood. It's all about sliding what he said into general categories.
Gervais is clear: his comedy is about specific details, specific people. He wants us to remember that categories define norms, not individuals.
Comedians make us laugh by exposing hypocrisy. Caitlyn Jenner's past, famous big-muscled decathlon self is appropriate fodder for comedy, because Jenner is a wealthy, distracting air-head. Gervais underscores again and again that mocking her is not mocking trans people. Indeed, that's really his main point. "See how I can attack this legitimate target, and watch how some people will think I'm attacking a group."
There are shades of gray, and priorities. Some campus activists go overboard, but pointing that out doesn't make one a white supremacist. West believes the most important issues are cultural, particularly those involving non-heterosexuals. Everyone has a complete right to love and be themselves. But that isn't the most pressing issue right now, as dictators return, Trump might press his button, and billions suffer from climate change. Gervais appreciates that one's priorities make one vulnerable. Because if your priorities seem misplaced, you stumble into hypocrisy, the exposing of which is funny.
5
Did not finish this article, stopped with the "international emergency", but will watch Gervais's Netflix show ASAP. Wish I had some popcorn for the comment section though.
13
His act is brilliant and profoundly compassionate. What a spectacular way to miss the joke!
8
Surely if he is provoking this kind of reaction he is doing something right.
7
Why even waste your time writing about this lame'o? He's old and his jokes are yarns. Time to go, Ricky. Boca Raton Adult Community needs a good emcee for the afternoon dinner set
1
Proud leftist here, and I think Ricky Gervais is hilarious.
And yes, "overzealous, 'politically correct' college activists are strangling academia." They are.
11
Curiously Ms West ignored the commentary by Gervais on animal cruelty in his stand up 'Humanity'. Unlike trans gender, food allergies and select groups within society beging assulted by stand up comedians, animals can't write themselves an opinion piece in the NYT defending their rights not to be skinned alive. I applaud Mr Gervais in using his celebrity to defend creatures that are constantly tortured and abused.
8
Lindy West takes two portions of Gervais’ special, his opening bit about transgender people and his life on Twitter, to point out how offensive it is to her. What about the other bits when he makes fun of himself and his family? Offensive to aging men and working class Brits??
5
One of the key elements of identity movements -- including those of Native Americans, African Americans, and Hispanics -- is the ability to name one's self and one's group rather than accept a name imposed by others. In that light, please stop calling me cisgender.
10
I don’t like Ricky Gervais as a general rule although he can be very funny but this article is over the top! Maybe the author should look up “Archie Bunker”.
4
Can't stand the guy. I wish he and his big mouth would stay on his side of the pond.
2
After reading this Op-Ed piece I went home and watched Ricky's stand up. I came back to write a comment about how refreshing it is to listen to irreverent, well-crafted humor instead of watching some sanitized sit-com or lame stand up by a comedian who is too afraid to invoke a negative Twitter response. One of Ricky's quotes from the act was "we can do both", we can be empathetic of a serious issue or illness and also find humor in it to help us deal with trying times in our lives. We turn to comedians to articulate those feelings for us and broaden our perspective. Once we give that up, we will become drones trapped in a bubble where all we hear are the echoes of yourselves and people who think the same.
12
Ricky Gervais’ comedy aside, the way the author of the article dismisses women’s uncomfortable-ness with relinquishing the privacy and dignity that sex segregated spaces provide is disappointing. Yes, we all love a cheap Ben Carson joke, but even a broken clock is right twice a day. The concerns of homeless women who often have experienced sexual and physical abuse at the hands of men is ignored in favor of a tiny group transgender people. Women deserve to have their fears and concerns heard, not brushed aside.
10
I watched his show and was entertained and enlightened. This is not a transphobic person in my opinion. I thought he was a compassionate man who often skewered all of us and himself. Whenever we enter these debates as to what we should or should not say I fear less discussion, not more. The world has shifted but it seems we are all so very precious about everything. Some things are just jokes. Some thinks are unfunny. Some things are cruel. But I enjoyed the exploration or Twitter fed hypocrisy or just human silliness in all of our so very serious earnestness. It is the role of the court jester to point fun at us, and that means you too. We live in an age of unprecedented possibilities and freedoms. We also live in an age of reaction. We all seem to want to cling on to principles in a time when there is a troubling absence of principled behaviour. In this clinging we can feel fear that we are not being listened to. We can rage that we aren't being listened to. I find it ironic that you'd write this after seeing his show.The world has always been changing. He is an observational comic making comments on contemporary issues, and trans issues are contemporary. So are nut allergies. (wasn't as big an issue when I was born). By choosing these topics he does what every comic tries to do--stay relevant and engage audiences. He made fun of addiction too. I'm a recovering addict. I laughed. America is still such a Puritan place, updated for today and the professionally offended.
11
I think Mr. Gervais is having his moment. He has become more popular than ever mining these strains and they will soon become tiresome and outdated without any effort from his part or ours. This essay is thought-provoking and well thought out, however, I don't see Mr. Gervais as irresponsible in his act. It's comedy, social commentary tilted just the right way to reflect a prism of emotions, shared and unshared, about our current situation in 2018. Is he over-doing it, yes. Is it making him a lot of money, yes. I think he is resonating, not with trans-phobia or evolution but the exhaustion many are feeling at the microscopic, content obsessed, issue-saturated, false end-times narrative we are living in. The world is evolving and we are sore with growing pains. In some ways we are growing too fast. Our emotional skeleton is growing to fast for our muscles to catch up, we are awkward and clumsy.
My eleven year son laughed and chortled one night that his trans-name is going to be Melissa. "That's cool" I said as I brought dinner to the table. "Yeah", he said "Melissa is a nice name". He was trying it out on me, just to hear it out loud, just to see how I might react. It was, obviously, a joke. But inside the joke was an acceptance of that possibility, of that very real option should he ever decide to make it. And his dad was totally fine with it.
2
I never watched "The Apprentice" nor have I heard/watched a Ricky Gervais performance. Where does that put me, and similar others, on the evolutionary road to enlightenment?
It puts you at the top of the trash bin and obviously feeling tres smug.
1
His brand of mean-spirited comedy isn't funny to me. Therefore, I no longer bother to watch his products. It's a choice. Do I feel superior for making that choice? Not really. Yet, I have to wonder at people who laugh at the oppressed and marginalized.
1
Basically a free ad for Gervais, an entity that we will never even acknowledge in our household in any way. In a world of over 8 billion people, one must learn to tolerate the things and phenomena beyond one's control and to ignore those offensive to one's sensibilities.
3
You think that Mr. Gervais doesn't understand the world? Please. Comedians with intellect understand it quite well, thank you. What you don't seem to understand is the role that they play and have always played in a progressive society. Like those who have come before him, Gervais takes a complicated topic and exaggerates it for comedic effect in an effort to point out the absurdities of life. Are you offended? Well, good, because you should be. That's the point, after all.
14
Ricky Gervais has publicly denounced bullfighting and other kinds of animal cruelty. For that alone I admire him. I know very little about his comedy or these other matters to which the author refers. In an era such as the present one, when there are so many monstrous people and movements, he is about the last person whom I would choose to condemn publicly for anything. Rather, he has my respect because he has spoken to us on behalf of those (abused animals) who cannot speak to us in a language that we understand.
11
I saw Gervais's Netflix special, and it seemed that his main theme is stand-up comics -- like other social critics -- should be permitted to discuss, make light of, eviscerate, or ridicule any topic. Nothing should be taboo. West is certainly entitled to differ, but we can't start asking social critics to censor themselves or for others to chose their topics for them just because we find the subject matter uncomfortable.
10
I find it highly amusing when the censorious left cites as its authority on the plight of a group a lobbying organization for that group. Again, we hear the canard about the transgender being hurt or killed because of their identity despite NO evidence linking the two items. Lindy West is everything that is wrong in our popular discourse. She needs to be fired and replaced with someone less defamatory.
30
1) There is not 'NO' evidence for a rise in transphobic violence. There is a rise in violence against transgender people (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/09/us/transgender-women-killed.html) and individual crimes were transphobic in nature (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/16/us/us-hate-crime-law-transgender-murd.... Although you can argue the details and the scope of the problem, the statement 'transphobic violence is real and on the rise' is both rational and has supporting evidence - it should certainly not be dismissed out of hand.
2) You claim the 'left' is censorious and yet your conclusion to this comment is that the columnist should be fired for defamation - despite there being no case for legal defamation in her article - and replaced with a less controversial writer. Is that not censorship? Or, at least, would that not be creating a 'safe space' in the NYT Opinions section where humour that belittles minorities and outgroups is protected from honest criticism?
Actually, the murder rate for white trans folks is lower than the murder rate for the general population - but the murder rate for black and Latina transwomen, in particular, is higher than for the general population (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28727530).
Reality is complicated. A statement like "Lindy West is everything that is wrong in our popular discourse" is simplistic and, frankly, childish. And calling for an op-ed columnist, of all people, to be fired because you disagree with her strikes me as a rather un-American thing to do.
2
Not fired, the knee-jerk firing squad mentality is also I problem, but yeah, it was difficult reading this essay to the end.
1
Lindy goes straight to the heart of the matter, and sings it: "The world is bigger than you, and it belongs to us too."
This might be the crux of the crux. Keep singing, Lindy! We need your clear, resonant voice!
15
The world 'belongs' to no one. You'll be gone, and soon (relatively), and in a century or so your influence will not be felt. Get over yourself. All Gervais is doing is the right thing: ignoring the alarmist nonsense that unless we all think and act and talk alike, and share the same concerns and adopt the same solutions, all is lost.
If Gervais upsets you or the writer of this piece, then just move on. Humor owes no apologies and deserves no restrictions. Everything is funny, to someone, somewhere, and that's okay. No one has the right to self-appoint themselves as the police force of social consciousness.
5
Best Line from Ricky Gervais:
"Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right..."
56
It is a comedians job to find humor in whatever the subject matter may be. If you don't like his subject matter then you simply don't watch it. Just because you may not find it funny doesn't mean someone else won't. Given his level of success I would say you are in the minority. But that is why this is called an "opinion" piece.
21
"He might find trans people silly." See and that's where you missed the entire point of his standup. You can joke about something that - in actuality - is not funny or itself a joke. In fact, the ability to distinguish between a joke about a bad act and the bad act itself is the epitome of intellectual evolution. And the idea that we can joke about other serious matters, but not transgenders is itself a form of prejudice. Many of us understand that transgenders are facing serious discrimination, but in one stroke you lump Gervais with all bigoted white men (apparently everyone who voted for Trump). Very progressive. Much of Gervais' humor is in light of itself, and many individuals like myself, can hear a joke that draws on a stereotype without accepting it as truth. Perhaps some people like you can't conceptualize that distinction, but Gervais shouldn't have to tailor his humor to the lowest common denominator, nor should he have to educate the masses. Transgender people face serious issues and should be treated equitably, Ricky Gervais' jokes were funny. Those aren't mutually exclusive, and thinking that doesn't make me primitive.
29
looks like someone didn't get it. there he is explaining the meaning of his joke, and some still don't get it.
17
I didn't realize Ricky Gervais had a Netflix special. He's hilarious! Thank you for letting me know, Lindy West!
26
Great column. I now know that voluntary self-castration which was once known as gender reassignment surgery is now gender confirmation surgery. Twenty years ago I had a brother who has since become my sister. It’s worked out well for her. As a man she was twice divorced. As a woman she’s happily married to another transgender person. It’s stable, and I much prefer her new partner to her previous wives. Occasionally she visits my father, another brother, and myself. She seems anxious to learn that we accept who she is. We do, but we have other things to think about. My father who is ninety-five has cancer throughout his body and has been given less than a year to live. Moreover, he had a bout with the flue that almost killed him and is now in a VA convalescent home. He has accepted his cancer diagnosis stoically but wants to regain his strength so he can return to his house. I read today in an interesting book that the media doesn’t tell us what to think. It does tell us what to think about. Now considering this transgender issue the Lindy West thinks is so important all I can say is: “Who cares?”
13
Nothing puts solipsistic whining more in perspective than end-of-life care.
2
Humanity is insanely funny.
14
Anybody who loves animals more than people, who has decided to leave most of his fortune to animal charities, who feels and cares for the innumerable non-human sentient beings that own the Earth as much as we do, and who understands the banality and triviality of self-centered human concerns, deserves my respect. More power to you, Mr. Gervais - keep on insulting as many humans as you wish.
23
@ Ajax, I fully agree with you. Thank you for your post.
2
I,m afraid that one day all jokes will have to go through a PC tribunal before airing.
21
Hope Ms. West hasn't seen the Gervais produced series "Life's Too Short". That would really set her off.
8
Couldn't care less if Gervais is offensive, because that's not his problem. His problem is that he is really, truly not funny. Laughs at his own lame material like a clueless guy at the water cooler. There are a lot of really funny comics out there - and Gervais is so not one of them.
5
Ricky Gervais is a very funny guy and I think much of his humor involves satirizing people exactly like you, so it's not surprising that you don't like him.
24
Artists are not social workers.
19
We love Ricky Gervais, equal opportunity offender and funny man. Come on Snowflakes, get over it!
18
The premise is incorrect. For the most part, the world is devolving.
4
If you are trans, you might want to skip Gervais (and Chappelle for that matter). That's a few less clicks on Netflix you'll like (I don't think you've missed much with Gervais) and life with gender dysmorphia too difficult to listen to someone making fun of you. On the other hand, Gervais is not responsible for trans people not finding a place to sleep. For that, West, best talk to your equally snowflake-y friends across the aisle - Evangelicals.
4
Lindy’s point is that entertainment is instrumental in normalizing and creating acceptance in society—do you remember when a gay kiss, or an interracial kiss, was taboo? It seems ridiculous now. But the point of many commenters is that Gervais wasn’t making fun of trans people, rather, he was making fun of the reaction to his joking about Caitlyn Jenner. Famous people, especially those who make a living from merely being famous, are never off limits. And I wonder if trans people never think anything about their situation is humorous. There would be lots of emotional turmoil for some people in this situation, but, well, genitalia have been the butt of jokes forever and they just are kind of funny and fascinating—beautiful, weird and ridiculous all at the same time—I guess that’s why we cover them up with pants, skirts, etc. Wouldn’t Jenner ever joke that, yeah, I didn’t want it, but when I had it, I was really hung? It just seems like human nature to joke about it. Trans acceptance is still sort of new at this point and people may have trouble navigating the whole “dead-naming” and pronoun minefield. Someone might be totally accepting and still get the proper etiquette wrong. It would go a long way to normalization if people didn’t attack others for simple mistakes. Honestly, what I found most offensive in that bit were the jokes about the car accident in which an actual real person died.
This columnist and her followers demonstrate why many comedians find it pointless to appear on college campuses any more.
And the inhabitants of that bubble are keen to turn the entire culture into a campus-style greenhouse.
Gervais and his colleagues pose a challenge to their airless moralism.
18
Wow this struck a nerve with the white, cis gendered readers.
Any of you whom accuse the author, Lindy West, of "not getting it" or being the recipient of Gervais's "punching up" are exactly the ignorant, entitled, and privileged audience his low brow humor is intended for.
I am an atheist, vegan, and animal rights advocate to whom Gervais can relate (he is not vegan but subscribes to the other two traits) and yet I can empathize with West's assertions.
Perhaps you naysayers should first become acquainted with the author's history. Then you will understand her perspective.
3
How many actual transgender people live in the US? The author makes it seem like it's millions living in shelters and under attack. I know one transgender person and she is doing well. She is financially secure and loved by many friends. If you don't like Ricky Gervais don't watch his show. Simple wasn't it!
2
Lindy West should tread gingerly. Lenny Bruce, George Carlin, and many others paved the highway for Ricky Gervais. Frankly, he's way down the road and she will need some good shoes to catch up.
11
If Ricky was mocking conservatives, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't hear a peep from Ms. West.
16
Why not go after Colbert? He certainly pushes the boundaries of decency - but it's okay if he agrees with you, right?
9
I love you, your writing, your message. I love that you are challenging cowardice and speaking for the persecuted. Thank you for your courage! Was a fan of Gervais but apparently haven't looked at his work close enough.
3
So he makes his (lucrative) living by offending everyone. That's *talent*? Aside from the poor reflection on what Western culture finds entertaining, if he weren't rich and famous he would be considered an anti-social creep who you wouldn't want to have access to a gun, or babysit your children.
3
Whenever someone responds to a joke by saying "it's a joke! Loosen up, man!" then it means that it wasn't a joke and it wasn't funny. In fact, it's a sign of extreme inferiority complex and supreme weakness.
A real joke, no matter who tells it or when, is naturally funny, e.g. did you hear about the restaurant on the moon? It is a great place but has no atmosphere.
5
Godfrey, sorry, I find your moon joke boring and unfunny.
Ricky Gervais, on the other hand, is hilarious. Different strokes!
3
The labored "writing" has nothing on RAPP, the Russian Association of Proletarian Writers, whose stated purposes was "to scourge and chastise" in the name of the Party." In an age of scary conformity -- see "cisgender" -- the writer is intolerant of Gervais speaking his mind. "Extras" was hilarious for that reason. Go Ricky, Go.
9
It's a tough job but somebody's gotta do it.
3
I wonder if he would care that I have no idea who he is, and I don't care.
2
I really enjoy these outrage -mongers. Thanks for column, Lindy West! It always interests me to see what other white, blonde, well-to-do first-worlders are upset about!
11
I had never heard of this Gervais before, but anyway, I think I'll just check him now.
Seems a bit funny, though.
This op-ed just proves the late Christopher Hitchens opinion: https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2007/01/hitchens200701
Miss you, Chris...
3
I always thought RG was funny and I've always had the vague impression of anti-semitism. I think it was from seeing him hosting an awards show once, the Oscars, the Emmys, one of them. Joking about the Holocaust or something around there and getting away with it, being um "edgy." Can't remember what he said but it gave me a feeling. Maybe he'll gradually morph into one of those people. Jon Voight. Roseanne. One of them. Hip or not. Tell you what. Want to find out? Track down his olde English dad and buy him a drink. Then you'll know.
"There is a thin line that separates laughter and pain, comedy and tragedy, humor and hurt." Erma Bombeck
Ms. West, Mr. G has not crossed the line as of this writing.
3
The crisis we're living through are those who are incapable of understanding the target of a joke. Gervais isn't making fun of transgenderism; he's making fun of backwards attitudes towards it, and the mental contortions and rationalizations that some will go through to place it in a box that they understand.
Standup comics' audiences for the most part understand that. If you don't, then don't listen/read/attend, but don't make yourself look silly by demonstrating that you don't get it.
9
He’s not funny. Period.
1
I'd love to be in the audience when Lindy West sits in the front row at a Gervais show.
5
Everything, EVERYTHING in life is open for exploitation through comedy. That includes trans people, the Holocaust, AIDS and kids with cancer. You know why? Because the best humor is that which makes us uncomfortable. It's also important to remember that humor is always at someone else's expense. You can't have great humor without someone being made uncomfortable.
4
Everything in life may be "open" for humor, but that doesn't mean it's automatically funny.
One of the rules of great comedy is this: it's funny to watch an old lady beat up a wrestler. It's not funny to watch a wrestler beat up an old lady. Think about it. Read Keith Johnstone's terrific analysis of status interactions in comedy. Yes. There are rules. There's stuff that works, and stuff that doesn't work. It's not funny. Not because it's politically incorrect, but because it's not funny.
I am sorry to go against the grain of the many commenters who find Gervais funny. I could not handle more than a few minutes of his Office debacle, which apparently was a big hit.
Maybe I am just one of those rare people who find him teeth-gratingly annoying, the same way I don't care for either the acting or comedic talents of Owen Wilson, Will Ferrell, Sarah Silverman and a few others.
I am not at all bothered if they don't care about what I think or say, the sentiment is reciprocated.
"Celebrityhood" gives people a platform to publicly say what they want and assume their opinion has more credence than the rest of us just because of the news coverage they get. It does not make them experts in every subject they expound on and expect to be taken seriously. Its best to ignore them, in my opinion.
3
I sense an opportunity for a new genre of TV/comedy show. Bloggers/writers/social commentators like Lindy sit on a panel at the front of the stage at a comedy show - perhaps at Ricky's next gig. The first panelist to break character and laugh is removed from the show, and so on. The last one remaining is the winner - at this point the comedian has a faceoff with this person in a 1 on 1 attempt to make them laugh.
The comedian tells 3 jokes of their choosing - if the panelist can survive all three without laughing then the show will donate a sum to a charity of their choosing (or something). If the comedian wins then they get a donation to their charity, etc.
The show will be called...
THE LAST LAUGH
3
Half the comments here could be summed up like this:
“The cultural critic I do like shouldn’t be subject to the criticism of the cultural critic I don’t like.”
Mr. Gervais’ defenders, like the comedian himself, doth protest too much, methinks.
(I like Gervais *and* West.)
Whenever comedy tries to appeal to mass audiences it becomes much less funny. That is why most Hollywood comedies are so lame. Ricky should continue to offend, even if it costs him a million dollar deal for a weak and wimpy Hollywood comedy movie.
3
In comedy writing, you are advised to "punch up" instead of "punching down." In other words, humor works best when it's aimed at the powerful, not the powerless. I think a lot of Ricky Gervais fans got wind of this piece and ran over here to defend their idol but he's punching down and it's not very funny or skillful.
3
This idea has been weaponized by the left, and now the best defense against criticism is to claim victimhood. That's one of the things that has made the left end of the political spectrum an even more pathetic wreck than the right end.
1
Gervais enjoys acting like a troll. He still comes up with a good zinger now and then, but mostly his act has gone terribly stale. He is an incredibly wealthy man, but he is also an angry and sad man. That combination has made him increasingly unfunny and difficult to watch. As he sniffs around for ever more ways to be ever more offensive, I expect to see him crash and burn in one way or another.
2
Wow, these comments....apparently it's fine for Gervais to express opinions but not for Ms. West. When he does it, it's "funny" and "challenging." When she does it, it's the death liberals, progressives, and freedom of expression. Pull yourself together, people, and knock off the hypocrisy.
5
Lighten up Lindy. Seems you have some issues with stereotype too.
"The Trump/Brexit era is a rich, famous, white, middle-aged man declaring the world to be in decline the moment he stops understanding it."
7
The best satirical and political comedy makes people squirm. Think Carlin. There is nothing sacred about the current navel-gazing movements that excuses them from biting satire. The problem is with people like West - no sense of humor and overt misandry.
5
Carlin was very funny and talented--this guy, not so much.
Ricky Gervais is hilarious!
He's an entertainer. If you don't like his shows, don't watch him. I don't care for the Kardashian Show, but you don't hear me angrily pontificating about their outfits.
7
He is a funny guy. Sorry he stepped on your toes. It's what he does.....
4
Ms West needs to stop taking herself so seriously. Does she even laugh?
9
I have always thought he was a rather crass comedian. I have never found him funny, just cruel.
3
Never thought Gervais was funny or insightful. Two traits the great stand up comedians should have. His approach has always been obvious and downright dumb. And the fact he laughs at his own jokes is beyond annoying. Evolution? I think we could do without this second rate tool.
3
I don't know why, but I supposed I thought the New York Times and its readers were better than to highlight and endorse repeated comments of, "I know a trans person in real life, seriously, trust me, and therefore I can speak with complete authority that this column using the word 'emergency' is more egregious than the statistics cited in that same paragraph."
The interesting thing about Gervais's hostile defensiveness to this sort of criticism (also reflected in multiple comments here) is the extent to which it presumes, even inflates, the moral superiority of the critic. It's not a bemusing attack from someone with wholly different values; it's the uncomfortable sting of a person you know has a point. Ricky Gervais agrees: it is bad to be transphobic. But it's worse to tell Ricky Gervais that he's a transphobe.
And how disappointing that instead of analyzing and critiquing that discomfort and that conflict like a real comedian and social critic, he just hunkers down into the safe assumption that the values he always valued are just objectively, inherently true.
1
I don’t think he was really making fun of trans people. I think he was making fun of people like the author. And it was funny.
6
Strident political correctness and enforced social sensitivity is basically the end of comedy. Thanks, Lindy.
7
Mr Gervais, like so many untalented, obnoxious "performers", simply needs to go away.
3
everything you write is special and imortant. don't stop.
4
Lenny Bruce redo?
Wow, commenters here are really defensive! Must have hit a nerve.
5
Free speech = offensive and inappropriate verbiage onstage. Deal with it. Signed, Staunch Liberal.
4
A sad review of a funny man by a totally humorless woman.
6
Yeah.... whatever... I found the latest special to be hilarious!
7
Reading her diatribe, it’s easy to see that world is coming to an end.
6
Gervais is a comedic genius. Period. Caitlyn Jenner is a terrible driver, so bad she killed someone. Period. Gervais was skewering a clueless celebrity and the culture that gives such celebrities a pass, not transgendered people. You missed the point. And because people like missed that point and attacked his comedy, he went for the jugular, to ensure you were offended further. Which you were. Your slavish attempts to prove you “get it” align you more with the people who really don’t get it - celebrity worshippers; you know the types who voted for a TV celebrity because they thought the character he played on TV was who he was in reality. Shallow intellect is a feature of both the right and left.
8
Wow, those white guys can't catch a break, can they.
Ricky is quite funny, and happens to be a great humanitarian.
7
so other than that, Mrs. Lincoln.....
2
I am someone on the left. I support many “left-wing” issues. I do not support however the left’s fascist attempt at dictating what should be appropriate in comedy and what isn’t. What’s next? Literature, art, opera?
10
What I find very revealing is that virtually all of the highly critical comments directed towards this column come from my fellow males---almost all of whom I strongly suspect are white and aging, like me.
Hey guys, why so sensitive? Can it really be true that a woman's opinion hurt your tender little feelings that much? I had no idea that my fellow Big, Tough, Rough, Strong and Brave football lovin', beer drinkin' steak eatin' ultra Manly MEN could act so much like the "whiny little precious snowflakes" they spend so much time ridiculing.
A few of you made references to "looking into the mirror" to understand Ricky's comedy. Not bad advice for you either. Take a good look into the nearest mirror and tell everyone who the real politically correct, censorship advocates and "precious darlings" truly are.
8
Gee, Lindy, Ricky Gervais' performing persona is that of a pathetic, self-obsessed, self-hating loudmouth. I'm pretty sure he's intentionally modelling a negative example of manhood. He fully expects us to laugh at him more than with him.
6
Sigh. Another lengthy piece by Lindy West explaining why an extraordinarily funny and trenchant social critic Ricky Gervais is neither funny nor trenchant. Between her and Nick Kristoff, fun times from the self-appointed arbiters of humor on the op-ed pages.
10
Out of all the problems in the world...what really bothers you and people like you, is that you still can't control what other people can or cannot say. Just like Conservatives trying to use "shame" as a way of preventing premarital sex, Neo-Liberals (Social Justice Warriors) want to use "shame" as a way to stop anyone else from saying anything THEY find offensive. If you don't like Ricky Gervais...Don't watch him. Here you are with an enormous platform on NYTimes...and this is what keeps you up at night? Get a life. Sorry I like freedom of speech, so you can write what you like...but your column offends me so I just won't read it again. See, isn't that simple?
7
Don't laugh and don't pay to see him. When has finger-wagging worked?
7
Lindy, for someone who clearly has done her research on Gervais' past work, it's a pity that you have so very, very clearly missed the point
8
If you stop at the laughable term "gender confirmation surgery"--as though surgery can confirm anything--you'll spare yourself a dreary, earnest read.
10
The world is devolving, and Ricky isn't. People wrapped up in the absurd power-trip that is #outrage culture are unable to see this, of course.
All one needs do is load up any bit of culture from even as few as 10 years ago to hear all kinds of examples of things that would never fly today. Not because it's genuinely wrong like Jim Crow era culture, but of self-righteous blowhards.
Example: I was watching a SNL sketch called "Hermonie Growth Spurt" from 2004. It wasn't particularly funny, but the joke was, Hermione had grown breasts over the summer, and the rest of the cast had over-the-top reactions to this. Juvenile, sure, but no harm done. Today? It's almost unimaginable that they would dare to air such a sketch. The shrieks of "sexism" "objectification" "male gaze" "rape culture" and the like would be deafening. Half-a-dozen think-pieces likening the writers of it to Weinstein would be written by nights end.
Progressives have produced the new puritans, always clutching their pearls over the next made-up slight. The evangelicals of the 80s and 90s would truly be envious of these new tactics. They call for the censorship of the very same things, just for different reasons;
Remove that scantily-clad video game character! Not because it's un-christian, but because, feminism.
Don't tell that joke! Not because it's profane, but because a minority person disliked it.
Don't enjoy that movie, not because it's satanist but because it doesn't have a strong __ character!
8
Another white male bashing article........
6
Trans people won't be helped by pretending they aren't trans. Gervais references Caitlyn Jenner's earlier "manliness" and her previous name to highlight the ridiculousness of pretending that she is not trans. As he points out, we all *know* that she was once male and once answered to Bruce. Pretending otherwise is silly. The butt of the joke is not Caitlyn or the "weirdness" of trans people. It is the very idea of being offended by the simple acknowledgement of her transition--in other words, the very attitude on display in this op-ed.
9
Ricky, go home.....
2
I don't know why this comment is a NYT pick, but has it occurred to you that he is in fact satirizing the very thing you think he is?
3
Lindy West should not be in the position of reviewing comedy, period. Full stop. If that is what she pulled out of Gervais special then she is unqualified and a bit dense.
4
Giving this space to Gervais is exactly what he wants and you gave it to him. What's that saying about getting press, even if it's negative, is good.
Free publicity.
In the past many comedians (and court jesters) have always been penalized.
It's part of their job so to speak. Don't like him, then move on.
1
I don't care if he's offensive. I watch a ton of stand-up and a lot of good comics can be described offensive. But Gervais is just not funny. He doesn't come across as a comedian, he just comes across as an angry old man ranting about the kids stepping on his lawn.
4
What amuses me here is the repeated use of "world" as in "the world is evolving, being trans is natural to young people and should be for everyone else". I counted 7 uses of the word. But does Lindy realize that her world is actually a tiny, tiny little part of the real world?
Another thing that Lindy doesn't realize is that the hate against trans people will not come from American white men, her favorite target. It will come from morally conservative women and men, a lot of them from all other the world and displaying a variety of skin colors, with white *not* being the major group.
16
Context is key and please watch the cited Ricky Gervais special before judging it. You will find he is not degrading trans people, but just making funny observations and jokes about some of them. But some people can't take jokes about anything...
17
Not that this means anything, but Lindy West wrote that her husband is a stand up comic. So I'm curious what he might think of Ricky Gervais, and why she did not mention where his sympathies lie.
4
So Gervais’s Netflix special is pretty much entirely about Ms. West. It’s fascinating to see how completely over her head it went. Wow.
The inability to understand the nuance and brilliance of much of Gervais’s comedy is the real “international emergency” here.
18
I know you may think you're using Gervais as an example of an insidious, ambient bigotry that is very real and very damaging. But he's a comedian and if you don't understand how that changes things I don't even know where to begin - other than to say that going after a comedian for being offensive is always a losing proposition. Always.
12
Aw, c'mon Lindy. Ricky Gervais is a comedic gift. When we lose our ability to simultaneously embrace equity and safety for trans people and the goldmine of comedic material in the person of Caitlin/Bruce (using women driver stereoytpes - "she KILLED somebody") wherein he tongue-in-cheek lobs offense at both the entire female gender and Caitlin Jenner's celebrity life, then we will lose more than I am willing to surrender. Gervais knows comedy is tragedy turned on its head - and reminds us of it always, beginning with The Office.
12
When I first heard- saw RG I thought he was good but he crosses the line to where he is actually cruel and cutting. I won’t watch anything involving him anymore. Like all bully’s his time will come when the tables are turned. He loves money- a lot of people buy into his nastiness- so he co tinges but at some point it will turn.
2
Superb column, Linda! I'm an aging and priviledged heterosexual white male with a substantial income who could not agree with you more strongly.
It's downright amusing to see so many expressions of "outrage" from readers who apparently don't think that well-educated, articulate female writers from the New York Times should have a right to express their opinion on the "comedy" of Ricky Gervais.
Who knew that these "big tough guys" who claim to be such strong defenders of the right to free speech would sound like such sensitive little "whiners" when someone disagrees with their own views about what is or isn't funny?
6
Yes, those white men. Why don't they wise up and shoulder the shame and culpability they so richly deserve for...Ricky Gervais.
2
Taking comedians seriously entirely misses the point. It's C-O-M-E-D-Y. Gervais plays an amplified, caricatured comic persona that says provocative things on hot-button topics that (because of their outrageousness) are intended to evoke either laughter or "otherwise" from the audience. That's the comedian's objective - to elicit a response. So the last thing one should do, is hold a comedian accountable for what they say, particularly whilst on stage,"in character". It's akin to holding an amusement park accountable for your nausea after a day on their roller coaster. What do you expect? You chose to ride... Think Steven Colbert's character on the "Colbert Report" or Gervais' character, David Brent on "The Office". What makes them funny is their obliviousness to their own obliviousness...
9
If the world is evolving why are we STILL seeing new "Star Wars" films even in 2018?
11
I am trying to understand the author's qualifications to criticize a rhetorical monologue. I am also trying to understand why critiques like this gain traction in the first place. Because, while authors like L West seem to miss the actual point of Gervais' comedy, she seems to fall straight in his lap when he laughs at the people who get offended by his discourse and jump at every occasion to scold him. It's pitiful.
12
Who goes to a standup show and leaves offended? Same premise here- I am certain that most people can by sympathetic to what Trans-Person is going through and still laugh at a joke about them- these things are not mutually exclusive. Lot of problems in the world- people trying to kill laughter is one that needs more coverage- please no more reviews from Lindy. And I don't even think Gervais is that funny- but I'm glad his fans think he is and they shouldn't have to feel bad about it
12
Curious invocation of evolution, which never seems to apply to matters of gender, intelligence, race,"equality", etc. Meanwhile, finding equivalency with Trump in everything is not criticism; it's lazy and boring. Retrograde comedy is an established art, e.g. Andrew Dice Clay, Don Rickles, Rodney Dangerfield, Daniel Tosh, etc. If it's not for you (say, because you can't find the irony, absurdity and satire it may contain) change the channel and get over it.
8
I'm watching it now, and the point is that people get offended and it's just a personal, emotional reaction, not a license to castigate. I think Ms. West may have missed that point. He clearly has fun at the expense of the offended, but the joke is on them, not trans people.
5
Ah, Lindy's back w her selectively literal interpretations, etch-a-sketch logic, and conveniently incomplete "facts." And still censuring writers and other artists. Thought police come from all over the political spectrum--but they tend to be earnest, humorless followers. Blah.
9
Welcome!! You're just now finding out that Ricky is a bit more David Brent than he'd have you believe? Ricky's defining trait has always been to obfuscate his native, hideous persona inside the facade of a persona, and his claim to fame is that people pay to enjoy themselves watching him degrade himself. He's a comedian by necessity, not choice!
1
Suggested renaming of his latest show: "Ricky Gervais: Minus Humanity"
Two words: Lenny Bruce. His comedy also was also considered inappropriate.
Three words: freedom of speech
6
I don't really know his work. I read the article because I have heard his name and was curious.
I am surprised that he is considered famous enough to rate this showcase. I honestly don't know anyone who cares what he says about anything.
1
I think he is a clever guy, but annoyingly arrogant, and not that funny.
Similarly stubborn to others who have gone on the defensive about the right to be offensive when they were challenged for slighting groups or people (Chelsea Handler, Daniel Tosh).
I find comedians like Jim Jefferies even more offensive and unapologetic, but at least what he says is both witty and sobering, at least for me.
I have appreciated much of what West has written for the Times, and I very much enjoyed her memoir.
But I dunno, I think the rabid insistence on 100% adherence to some silo-occupying sensitive elite is growing mighty tiring (hey, I'm a straight, white, native-English speaking male whose family owned slaves and coal mines, so I guess that means nothing I have to say matters, right?)
And actually, while I'm sure the majority of trans women are no threat at all, I actually can understand that cis-women in a homeless shelter might back at having a trans woman who projects a certain maleness as a bunkmate for the night.
Sorry I'm such a pig.
10
Wow, do you need to develop a sense of humor. I saw th special recently, and found Gervais’ jokes both funny and insightful: they pointed out the hypersensitivity of our current culture precisely by using subjects that cause us to react in knee jerk fashion. Lighten up—the world could use a bit more laughter.
10
The author of this piece escapes me and I've been a consumer of world comedy for 45-50 years.
I have yet to watch his most recent Netflix standup special but I certainly will and most likely enjoy it.
Gervais has become a bit smug and tiring since his rocket to fame but he did some brilliant work in The Office, Extras and HBO standup specials.
Most of his sitcom work and films since then have been mediocre or weak.
If Gervais is so offensive to the author of this article then she should simply not consume his art.
Hit him in his pocketbook.
Pretty simple and try and laugh every day.
It's pretty easy in today's world.
1
Humor has a miraculous power to transform a serious topic about which one might be offended into one that is immediately relatable and, more importantly, discussable.
Rather than demean the trans community, Gervais' routine promotes laughter. Someone who may have been offended by another's choice to transition may now find it amusing. Subjects that amuse no longer disgust.
As a gay man, I view anything that has the power to turn hatred into laughter. Better someone be amused by my sexuality than filled with hatred by the thought of it.
3
Ricky Gervais like the late Christopher Hitchens doesn’t subscribe to the usual pablum swallowed by the majority of the general public and good on him for it. We need more like him.
13
It's funny. I started to watch his special but didn't last very long. I found his humor lacking and his manner insulting. Good bye Ricky!
1
On the whole this opinion piece divides rather than unites. I say on the whole, not line for line. There are some valid critiques. But there is also the all-too-familiar snarky, morally superior, self-righteous dismissal of the other side's (and she sees in terms of sides, without question) points of view. Some of those points of view have merit, even if you don't like how the people espousing them look (white, middle-aged, male etc.). Yeah, Gervais' act as described here sounds ridiculous. But to pick on another point, no ma'am, there IS a serious problem with censorship coming from my fellow liberals, and there ARE cases here and there where it's valid to say "Oh get over yourself already, sheesh."
3
George Carlin, Lenny Bruce, Richard Pryor, Chris Rock, Joan Rivers? They were all funny, terribly funny. Ricky G has never made me laugh. Ever.
End of story.
1
It is very clear that the author has not watched Gervais' Humanity on Netflix. If she did, she would have heard Gervais explain his rationale for his humour as it relates to transgenderism. I don't agree with everything that Ricky Gervais believes but he his very funny and his performance made me laugh out loud. Which is the point.
4
I know transgender women who LOVE Ricky Gervais. Comedy isn’t for the thin-skinned. Some of the best comedians in the business go after everyone, every race, every religion, all political parties, and - lest anyone feel left out - sometimes refer to a particular area of an auditorium as having suspect thoughts or actions! We have to be able to laugh at ourselves. Especially now. It’s a survival skill. The world is so tops-turf you that sometimes comedy doesn’t seem funny. But keep on, keep on. Laugh!
The only comedians I have not enjoyed are ones that really believe in the cutting generalities they dish out for comedy. I love comedy but I once left a theater along with many others when it was clear the comedian was very clearly racist.
I would bet that Mr. Gervais does not harbor any ill-feelings toward the transgendered.
2
I think Lindy doesn't get Gervais' humor or maybe expects too much. He is a very savvy, intelligent and witty man who has an intellect often separate from his comedy. He has been mining things that make a lot of people uncomfortable but he is speaking his truth, not a role model.
I would recommend his film 'The Invention of Lying' if you want to peer into his world. Perhaps his comedy will make more sense. If not, too bad...
3
Wow, a thoughtful exploration. In George Carlin's later years, he became cranky and especially with global warming, should have tried a little harder to understand the science and the billions harmed, even in the short run.
In this case, Ms. West's reasonable argument (in my opinion) that Gervais should try a little harder to understand the world from someone else's point of view, someone who doesn't have 13 million twitter followers, doesn't have white skin, is not cisgender, doesn't speak English as a first language, might help Gervais avoid professional death or worse: one day exclusively doing gigs for casinos, men's rights conventions, white nationalist rallies and county fairs (watch out for tar pits!).
Well written and reasoned.
70
As a biological female, the kind who was born one and has lived their whole lives as one, I am offended by the attempted naturalization of trans men. There is a term I use - makeupface - that describes a man's belief that by putting on makeup and a dress, he understands women, that he can even call himself a woman. I'm a woman and I don't ever wear makeup or dresses, so why on earth is makeup and dresses so central to being called a "woman"? Women should not be reduced to that, so, sorry, but I'm on Gervais's side here. Just like blackface became outdated and offensive to black people, I'm hoping makeupface will eventually be understood as against women. Women don't have to embrace their own belittling, especially not under the misguided idea that that's more "evolved". Men will never stop trying to strip us of our dignity, but real women can at least stand up for ourselves and say no, makeup and a dress does not make you a woman.
28
"a man's belief that by putting on makeup and a dress, he understands women, that he can even call himself a woman." Well we don't have a problem, then, because that's not what trans people claim.
Thank you, DA, I love this. It's what I (haven't) been saying for years, but I've been thinking it. As a "biological male" I want to believe there is something more to being a woman (or a man) that can't be duplicated with a sharp knife and a box of chemicals. (I haven't been saying it because it would be considered to be ... what ... not what my fellow liberals would allow to be spoken.)
As for Gervais, I hesitate to agree with him on anything but if I do it's inadvertent and not an endorsement of his creepiness.
2
I find Ms. West to be shrill, lacking in nuance, and excessively confident in her sometimes blinkered world view. Mr. Gervais - same. They have more in common than she choses to recognize.
22
I suspect this comment would have more weight if it were about a woman and didn't include sexist wording like "shrill". Darn excessively confident women.
1
This misses Gervais's point entirely (and ignores his comments during the show which clearly shows his empathy for trans people and others who aren't middle-aged white men). The point is that it isn't a capital offense to call Caitlyn Jenner by the name Bruce when you are talking about the time when she won the MALE decathlon at the Olympics. What she felt inside, even then, has nothing to do with the fact that her name at the time was Bruce. He's not calling anyone a snowflake, he's just suggesting that having a sense of humor might not be the worst thing in the world.
30
Ricky Gervais is more evolved if you ask me. It is all about the spirit in which a joke is delivered, not merely the content. But on the content, having a sense of humour on a difficult thing shows intelligence.I could listen to him wax lyrical until the cows come home.
18
I'm a liberal-leaning woman - and absolutely loved his most recent special, Humanity! I found it fun, funny, irreverent, and thought-provoking.
26
Excellent article. So many white men of a certain age are seriously threatened by what many such men have defined as a world slipping away from their control. These men are dinosaurs, too focused on the changes to their social status they cannot see that the changes are actually not just good for society, but for them as well.
Maybe once they get over their shock and disbelief and adjust to the changes they'll get over themselves and appreciate the new freedoms these changes are bringing to them. Like how masculinity is growing to become more inclusive and complex--more realistic so as to allow men to be fully human rather than forced to behave, for example, as if they have no vulnerabilities, no emotions except anger. Imagine how freeing it must be for men to be enabled to be fully complex beings rather than some pretend being who is not allowed to truly human.
The whole world would be better off if stereotypical masculinity went the way of dinosaurs and the dodo bird, and all men were strong enough to stand up to outdated and dehumanizing gender norms and say "I am a real man, particularly when I do not behave in a strong or violent way."
Ricky needs to become more relevant and stop using Andrew Dice Clay-like material to make it appear he doesn't care--for if he really didn't care what people think, he wouldn't bother trying so hard to be objectionable and offensive. What is sad is that he doesn't even see how transparent he is.
3
Not to dispute the discrimination faced by trans community, but the target of Gervais humour is Jenner's celebrity, and the fact that Gervais was accused of "deadnaming" someone who was known as one of the most famous Olympians of our era. I understand that West wants to use his monologue as a hook to raise serious issues. The issue are worth talking about, but using Gervais celebrity as a way into an issue, is no more laudible than Gervais using Jenner's trans identity as a way to make comedy out of celebrities, and humourless activitists.
9
Yup, going to watch Gervais' Netflix special once again. It must be even better than I thought it was the first time.
28
The only "international emergency" Ricky Gervais or his audience should worry about when he's performing is if he isn't funny. So far, no emergency.
20
As I see it, the concern about creatures going extinct is not so much an attempt to reverse or slow down evolution, as a fear that humans, with their technology and commercial development of the earth, will end up harming the environment to all creatures' detriment, including ours. Also, it is sad to see humans end the existence of species just so a few can become wealthy or enjoy a sport.
2
Gervais is solid and, on the issues, usually on target in his own way.
There is a longstanding FEMINIST critique that calls into question transgenderism: without having grown up as a woman, with all that entails, transgender woman are not appropriately perceived as just women. It's not honest. Transitioning does not equal growing up as a woman. There's more to be said but, in the special, that's part of Gervais's point and it's a good one.
33
What would you say then about female to male transitioners? Should we apply the same logic to them?
I wasn't sure if I liked Ricky Gervais's comedy, but "Humanity" was great and it echoed a theme from Dave Chappelle's recent Netflix special and from Bill Maher almost every week. We have become soft little snow flakes that want people to go away forever if they offend us or don't champion our pet cause. If we keep this up Trump and others like him will continue to win, while we are busy being offended by people we generally agree with on a wide range of issues.
59
People keep saying that asking comedians to think about what they say is how Trump won. Is there any evidence to suggest this?
100 % agree.
1
Ricky made it perfectly clear in his Netflix special that he's not targeting the general subjects he lampoons, but various aspects, and for the most part was doing so in that performance in order to continue advocating for the unfettered freedom of speech.
Perhaps it was too nuanced for the easily offended.
44
I admit it: if you caught me in the right mood, I could find myself laughing at one of Gervais' jokes about trans people. Likewise, when I was a teenager in the early-mid 2000s, I used the word "gay" to describe things I found annoying and dislikable. We are not born knowing everything about how to be decent. But we are born with the capacity to learn. And learn we must.
11
Ricky Gervais is nothing more or less than a self-employed entrepreneur. I interpret everything he says as being in service to his professional career. So of course it's self-serving. Kind of structurally so.
Although I find him funny, I haven't seen the special and now probably won't.
2
About not watching his special: Reference source material in order to come to your own conclusion. That's the scientific and critical thinking approach.
I'm not saying Lindy West is wrong, not by any means. I haven't watched the special, either. However, we must not leave it to others to form our opinions.
Won't watch it because of this essay? Wow. Exactly what he is talking about. How could you decide that, based on someone else being offended? At least be offended for yourself.
2
It's true that comedy evolves over time based on the prevailing mores, but probably one of the worse ways to change those mores is to true to tell comics not to tell jokes because they offend people.
That's a good part of the reason comedy exists in the first place.
The best comedy usually targets the powers that be, but not always.
Usually, the bitterest, most acrid comedy attacks the self-proclaimed moralists, the arbiters of the correct and proper, the gate keepers of good taste.
31
I hope young people now will take a lesson from this, and, when it's their turn to grow old, caution themselves against a closing, ossifying mind. But sadly, every generation seems convinced - when their turn comes - that the progress it has witnessed in its time should be the last bit of progress their society needs.
14
I love Ricky Gervais.
The more offensive, the better!
51
Wow, most people condemning the article for being hysterical and hypersensitive are doing a better job of being that themselves. It’s a review of a comedy special, not a rejection of all comedy, or even of Gervais entirely. She makes a pretty funny point in the first two paragraphs about the irony of the loudest voices that seem obsessed with fighting back against “PC” culture, whatever that means to them. Like she said, he has a Netflix special, which is not exactly something anyone with a silenced voice could get.
10
Actually, it's not a review in the NYT....it's an OPINION piece, which means that others are weighing in with their opinions. It's true that Gervais isn't silence (and won't allow him to be) but many people self-silence, self-censor because your HOME ADDRESS gets put on the internet if you have an opinion other than what a certain group of people think you have a right to have. It's gotten weird.
2
I love Gervais, Eddie Izzard, George Carlin, Richard Pryor ... many more comedians .. like any art form I think its a calling .. but like any art .. its a personal thing. I can honestly say there were times in my life where some good stand up saved my life. But I would never say everyone likes this comedian or that one.. its totally subjective. I also don't think I would dictate what an artist should do, be or say. If I don't want to watch it. I don't turn it on or go to the show. Also, Gervais is not the only person to say - we just didn't die .. many scientists like Neil deGrasse Tyson explain we are but a blip on a cosmic map on the wrong side of the cosmos tracks.
12
He is correct about evolution, but the opinion author here misses an important point: Ricky Gervis survives in the media-ecosystem quite nicely because of traits that have assisted his survival, his success. Not sure what to call these traits, but it relates to having the ability to persist and not back down. Oh, and wit.
25
I have never heard of the Comedian in question here. But even the few quoted bits sound very funny indeed and I might check the guy out.
And to the point about giraffes & trans gender people, we might quote the great Kurt Tucholsky:
„What is satire allowed to say? Anything.“
33
This seems to confirm what the right says about politically correct orthodoxy. How people can become so narrow minded without being republicans is hard to explain.
45
I absolutely LOVED his special on Netflix - it was brilliant and I expected to hear some off colour comedy but he did it with such finesse. So sorry you missed out on his comedic abilities.
49
Gervais is funny because despite the outrageous things he says you KNOW that he cares, as you say, a very great deal. In marked contrast to the know-nothing in the White House who neither knows nor cares about anything.
But what makes Gervais even funnier is that he is bravely saying what many people think; That someone who wishes to invent their own personal pronoun is entitled to do so. However their inventiveness does not obligate us to become involve in their personal quest nor does it obligate us to provide them with a bathroom which is in concordance with whatever gender assignment they have chosen.
Some 'white, wealthy men who don't get it' do actually get it. We are fine with whatever 'identity' you choose. Be whoever you want to be.
And we may be willing to address you by your preferred pronoun. But only if we have any interest in addressing you at all.
45
He’s just not very funny. Dave Chappell is always very funny, and with a few accents and a few omissions would have me rolling on the floor sideways. Gervais lives in his head, Chappell lives in his bony, goofy skeleton with total innocence and no intellectual tweaking—always makes me a happier person. Gervais interrupts split second you have to laugh or not—and ties it up in knots. Intellectual humor can be fun, but the rhythm and timing are more important than subject matter. See the clip of John Cleese calling Jean-Paul Sartre, from a laundromat, dressed in council
Housing drag, speaking pidgin French, only to “bump into” Simone de Beauvoir” answering for him! Now THAT’S intellectual humor. Maybe Ricky needs to learn to laugh at himself first? Je ne sais pas!
11
Clearly some Ricky Gervais is needed. When laughing stops, thinking stops and dogma starts.
44
"What they’re actually reacting to is the message deep at the heart of the March for Our Lives, of Black Lives Matter, of the Women’s March: The world is bigger than you, and it belongs to us too."
That may be true for some. It's not true for me. What I'm reacting to, why I'm one of the "hand-wringers," and why Gervais's impatience with constant offense-taking resonates with me, are signs of the devolution of public discourse into nothing more or less than pitched battle among aggrieved identity groups on all sides.
This is depressing for many reasons. Truth doesn't matter in these squabbles. (The first casualty of war, etc.) The requirement of appealing to a wide audience with a compelling argument -- out the window. Groups supplant individuals as the unit of moral significance, and everything is assessed ad nauseam through the lens of group conflict. Trusty liberal democratic principles like free speech are recast in Marxist terms as mere instruments of oppression. Orwellian language police assault the dictionary and demand compliance. Orthodoxy, the enemy of reason, reigns in small, dark corners to which all scurry for safety. (Once again, this is true on all sides. The right has its own political correctness.)
Unfairness and injustice must be called out and remedied. That's what I take those movements to be trying to do. Set against, for example, unjustified police killings, insufficiently "evolved" comedy among friends strikes me as a ludicrous target.
28
While I can't address every one of Gervais's jokes, West might also err when she assumes that marginalized groups AS SUCH are the targets. Sanctimony and unquestionable assertions of righteousness are entirely fair targets for comedians. Ridiculing those who cause you discomfort is pat humor at best and, often, is plain bullying, but there are subtler, more legitimate, and funnier ways of getting at these issues.
1
I don’t pay much attention to Gervais, but West has a great and simple point. The fact that this humor is considered humor, or carries value, is a negative mark on our culture. Plus, it’s petty, self serving, and lame. I won’t be joining a chorus of defense for Gervais. I think it’s the same sorts of reactionary defense to basic human values that make our president so appealing to a vocal minority in this country.
Being accepting of a diverse and changing society requires mental energy. It’s just part of being human. Unfortunately many people aren’t up for the task, and instead choose to laugh about it.
46
Gervais' opinions are "a reactionary defense to basic human values?" Sounds like quite a stretch to me.
11
People said that about the Three Stooges, Mae West and the Marx Brothers. So what else is new?
7
I'm afraid either I'm dense or the writer isn't being clear. The whole point seems to be that Gervais doesn't care about annoying people with his admittedly frequently obnoxious observations, but the only "proof" she offers is that a Netflix special is built around them. But she doesn't explain whether, on the Netflix show, he's citing the provoking tweets because he's bothered by them, that he really doesn't care about them or to make fun of the tweeters.
14
I wish people would distinguish between "criticise" and "censor". The article criticises Gervais. It doesn't make any attempt to prevent him saying the things that it criticises. If he's going to make money out of saying things for shock value he can hardly complain that some people are shocked, nor does he need a lot of people to defend him from his critics with scandalised cries of "censorship".
9
When he's good, he's very, very good.
and when he's bad, he's .......not funny.
I watched, but was not amused. Yes, he's provocative and I get it that comedians will say anything to get a laugh, but if I don't laugh, what next?
1
Jeez, Linda, I watched the same Netflix special you did, and I thought it was hilarious. It's ironic that exactly the kind of navel gazing contortions to find offense that he highlights and makes fun of, are also a response to the show itself.
61
Ms. West seems to be charging Ricky Gervais with "punching down" at transgendered people. He is not. He is punching up at those oh-so-enlightened people like Ms. West, the new Puritans, who have the luxury of obsessing over race-gender-sexual orientation and making a living at scolding those not woke enough to recognize that transphobia is an "international crisis."
Gervais is mocking the Social Justice Warrior crowd that demands people of good will mouth their required platitudes no matter how absurd - such as the idea that biology plays no part in determining gender - so as to avoid demonization and excommunication from the realm of the Decent. He is making fun of the ridiculous rules currently imposed upon us, as much as Lenny Bruce ever did.
What Ms. West doesn't understand is that she isn't on the outside looking in. She and her fellow progressives are massively powerful and dominate our current social discourse. They make the rules. In many ways she is part of the "establishment." As such, they are the targets of comedians.
No, Ms. West. Gervais is not punching down. He is punching up, at you.
121
I agree. The fact that she suggests it is punching down shows what she really thinks of these people.
5
Ricky Gervais does what you might call postmodern meta-comedy: when he’s not simply making an observation, he makes jokes about things precisely because making a joke about them is funny. Hence politically incorrect jokes about “taboo” material. He says something ridiculous because the act of saying something ridiculous can itself be funny (“how far will he go?!”). The object of the ridicule is, in a way, beside the point. Some people enjoy this irony and some people don’t. But do recognize and acknowledge the irony in your criticism.
17
Lindy West-Ricky Gervais. Two sides of the same coin, or a match made in heaven.
2
Thank goodness for both Ricky Gervais and Lindy West for getting to say whatever they want. If words hurt, ignore them.
Maybe get your own Netflix show (but make it funny, please).
Maybe get your words published in the NYTimes app on my iPhone (again, funny helps).
Maybe move forward with your life and help those that are actually struggling and not by, y’know, writing words about them in my NYTimes app on my iPhone.
6
Never thought he was that funny, actually. I also find him to be a bit self congratulatory about having read a few books and being an atheist. Organized religion is a bit silly and making fun of it is really just attacking a paper tiger. The version of himself he played on Curb Your Enthusiasm hewed pretty closely to my perceptions of him. In addition, we live in a world where ideas have more and more power to wound, so I agree with this article's stance that his trans gender jokes are not harmless. In a land ruled by a reality TV star with real bodies piling up, you can no longer hide behind being a comedian.
2
What may be being missed here is that often acerbic humor will force us to look at the counterproductive nature of those dark views. Pushing a prejudice to a hilarious and ridiculous extreme will sometimes make us cringe at the overlap with our own sentiments. Gervais is like that. Very funny but borderline repulsive.
57
We should tolerate Mr Gervais' acts of intolerance. But toleration is not acceptance, and we should not accept his comedy that is about as timely as blackface at this point in time. We should also consider whether we should consider whether a company such as Netflix believes in the intolerance of Mr Gervais by promoting his hate filled comedy. (and yes, he has crossed that line. It is not "just comedy" it is attacks on the identities of very real people for very poor reasons).
Mr Gervais should not be welcome, the way many other harassers are, and make no bones about it. His tweets are harassing and he is an internet troll.
It isn't whether Mr Gervais is a comic or not. It is that his underlying message should be left in the sewer with Mr Gervais.
he is not even funny. just thinks he is.
no clue how he made it this far. must have a good agent.
4
Naah. He’s hysterically funny.
1
Not funny to YOU, perhaps, but what makes you the arbiter of everyone's taste? I reckon I wouldn't find some of your comedic favorites funny either. That's the way things work. I'm not sure why that's so difficult to understand.
1
I think the author is largely missing the point of Mr. Gervais's routine. It's comedy. It's jokes. Yes, it's "edgy," but that is his brand of comedy. I only watched it once, but my recollection is that he made it very clear exactly when he was making jokes and when, towards the end, he was making a serious point about the value and utility of comedy.
At one point, he repeatedly used "Bruce Jenner" to refer to Caitlyn Jenner after a lengthy explanation of why he was lambasted for referring to Ms. Jenner as Bruce at the Golden Globes. But in both cases, at the Golden Globes and in his Humanity routine, it was in the context of a joke. Jokes that wouldn't work without referring to Caitlyn as Bruce. Undoubtedly, many people didn't like the jokes, and were even offended by them. But they were jokes!
If all jokes that offended anyone were made illegal, we would pretty quickly become a society devoid of all but the most banal humor. And comedic legends like Lenny Bruce, George Carlin, Richard Pryor, and many, many others would never have been allowed to exist.
I don't believe that free markets are the answer to everything, but this is exactly the case where free markets work perfectly. If Ricky Gervais's humor doesn't make enough people laugh, he loses his audience and doesn't get paid to make the jokes he does. So let's allow the free market of public opinion work its magic.
12
Jenner is not exactly a friend to traners people. She is the trans equivalent of an "Uncle Tom" and doesn't deserve our respect or admiration. I'll wager that misguided decision to award her that prize for courage is one ESPN wishes it could reverse.
2
Wow! You got all that out of the Netflix show. I watched it, but I like his sense of humor. It’s ok if you don’t like his shows or his sense of humor, but I think you may be attributing too much power to Ricky Gervais.
I’m progressive and think you may want to lighten up a little. Just don’t watch shows that “might” offend you.
13
I'm not at all offended by his comedy. I'm just over his act. To me, he's more annoying than funny.
3
I don't think my earlier post made it online. At the time there was only one other comment which was someone who liked West's take on things. I didn't. At all. As a fat, older, bald, disabled gay man in Seattle where you learn people's pronouns before their names, I had such a cathartic reaction to Gervais' Network show. I laughed until I had tears rolling down my face. When it was over, I had a big sign and a big smile and I was ready to face the world again. Sometimes it seems like the very vocal and very punitive young voices of the Woke Generation are all that is out there. They are not.
Now that I've come back and read the comments, I feel that same sense that there are rational, common sense, decent and kind people who love to laugh at the absurdity that is life. I won't be around long enough to find out, but I sure hope that future generations will maintain being able to laugh at themselves. Life is ridiculous. So is sex. Gender. Race. All of it. Gervais' doesn't need me to state his message, but if we can find humor in the world and learn to laugh at ourselves and be kind to animals, things will be okay. It will all be okay. The Wests of the world will always want to wokesplain their world. But it isn't their world. It is our world. Some of us are going to enjoy life.
31
So what if Ricky Gervais isn't telling jokes that make centre-left, white, millennials chuckle? Who really cares--that is, beyond those centre-left, white, millennials?
16
So glad this came out. Had pretty much the same sentiments watching "Humanity." Trend I've seen with some white male comics lately is simply to create material reflecting on other's reflections of their older material. Nothing new just standing there saying "can you believe how they responded to my ableist, sexist, or racist joke!" without actually telling any new jokes...or evolving the material. Humanity can be skipped.
2
Just remember this is the same guy who hosted the Golden Globes, burned it down, and was asked to return again and again. I wonder if a trans person was this offended...?
1
He stopped being funny a long time ago --he was funnier when he was chubby.
2
this feels like a gross mischaracterization of what Mr. Gervais was really going after, which was the increasingly thin skin of people nowadays, specifically on Twitter and, now, clearly on the bylines of Times columnists.
21
Wow: you really missed the entire point he was making in his special (namely, that a joke is separable from the thing itself). Thankfully, Gervais doesn't care what you think.
10
Ricky Gervais is unfunny. He was unfunny in the UK; that he seems to have a US following is baffling. IMHO, his work is in bad taste, niche with a dollop of unpleasantness thrown in. All things said and done, he's seriously unfunny.
39
I absolutely agree--Ricky Gervais is not funny at all. There's no need to be unpleasant in comedy, no need to make fun of people. It's crass. Sarah Silverman is another unfunny person who thinks put-downs are funny.
There’s an uncomfortable anti-science tone in her comments about his “obsession” with evolution...
17
Dear Ms. West,
If Gervais elicits this kind of reaction from you, I can only imagine your article here once you spend some time on YouTube with Doug Stanhope.
Just sayin’.
6
No need to speculate. The author is an advocate for women, people of color, victims of body shaming, and the LGBTQI population. She is aware of Stanhope's misogynistic "humor".
Lindy West: Ricky Gervis is a relic from a past time.
Netflix: Ricky Gervis, here's 20 million dollars for a comedy special.
20
The two points are not mutually exclusive.
2
One thought to add: I didn't hear much outrage from alternative communities when Eddie Izzard was making Hitler jokes in drag. I thought it was one of his best stand-up performances actually. Apparently, Ricky Gervais is held to a higher standard though.
8
I think Izzard is in another class entirely. He was always funnier and smarter than Gervais.
7
The British do have a thing about class. That's part of what sets Izzard and Gervais together actually.
1
Summary of this piece:
"It's not funny to me, so therefore it's offensive."
38
You missed the point of his show...
22
Actually, you're wrong Lindy West. Ricky Gervais is an observational comedian making observations you don't agree with. It's not the responsibility of comedians to treat everyone with respect and show a love for all humankind and praise college kids for being progressive. It's their responsibility to be funny-- and sometimes that means making jokes at the expense of others-- and those others include people of all cultures, genders, races, religions, etc. Is it wrong to tell a joke about black people? Women? Jews? Kids today? Rape? The Holocaust? Of course not-- especially if it's just a joke and not a direct call to violence. And if a comedian makes a controversial joke, and people get offended-- THAT IS THEIR PROBLEM. If you don't like a joke, then don't laugh. The more people that don't laugh at a joke, the less likely those jokes will be told. If people do laugh at them-- well, then there must be some kernel of truth in there-- even if it's an uncomfortable/ugly truth. In this case, there is an obvious truth that there is an over-sensitivity coming from people on the left-- and you are showcasing it by writing this article. Hate to break it to you Lindy-- but going out of your way to disparage a respected liberal comedian because he's criticizing "snowflakes" is the most snowflaky thing you can do.
43
There is nothing funny about making fun of people--it's bully behavior except he gets paid an enormous sum to bully people.
Love Mr. Gervais. The two movies he made were jewels, as were his TV shows (I read he just sold “The Office” again, this time in India). No doubt he was paid an outrageous sum by Netflix for his latest comedy special. Good for him.
The author, Ms. West, needs to screen the movie “Defending Your Life”. I am willing to bet Ms. West would not be advanced from Judgment City further up the rungs of the universe. She is tiresome, at best.
Mr. Gervais recently came to the defense—along with a well-known Jewish comedian—of a Scottish man who, purely as a joke on his girlfriend, trained his girlfriend’s little Pug dog to give the Nazi salute on hearing offensive phrases. The man sent a video to a few of his friends, and, horror of horrors, one posted it publicly. The man was prosecuted by Scottish authorities; remember, there is no First Amendment in Europe. In the EU one lives at the whim of politicians, with few protections.
What has Ms. West done for the First Amendment lately, other than try to kill it?
17
No one knows what we are really afraid of but one thing is for sure; we all have very tender feelings. Admit it or not! Comics have been crude and rude for centuries - making all of us look like idiots. Perhaps when we start taking them seriously and give some thought to what it is they are really saying - we can start making a better world. The wise king often received his best messages from the joker!
6
Ricky's a comedian. If, like Ms West, you have little sense of humor then you won't like him.
18
Brendan James already wrote the exact same article last week in The Baffler, but way better.
4
Sublime self-parody from Ms. West, as always.
20
This piece was of particular interest to me and I've made several comments and replies. All were nuanced, free of hate, and free of invective or vulgarity. I'm sure I was one of the first to read this article and comment on it. The NYT has posted some of my later comments, even making one a nyt pick, but has not posted any comment of mine that directly confronted any of the trans orthodoxy put forth in this piece and generally, in this paper I love. My comments included links to respected sources (the MIT biology prof who mapped the Y chromosome and the WaPo) with information directly refuting claims assumed in this article or made in comments. Yet they have not appeared. Instead, my comments that don't directly counter trans orthodoxy have sometimes appeared twice, even appearing as a reply to a comment, under it, in place of my actual reply to that comment. I don't know if it's intentional, but seems the NYT editors can't bring themselves to print anything that is actual evidence of the nonsense that is trans orthodoxy. And by the way, I'm a liberal who marched with women, for our lives, against climate change, and against both Gulf wars.
8
The jokes were directed at Jenner, not trans people in general. She is famous, had her own reality show, has appeared on magazine covers, and is part of a family that seeks attention at every turn. I really think you completely missed the point, and that is Gervais' point. That people willfully miss the point for the luxury of being offended.
37
I'm a politically active gay man, and what he said about Jenner is pretty mild compared to what my lefty activist friends say about her!
I watched one of Gervais' stand-up specials on HBO. I was bored and did not laugh once
I have never found Gervais funny-he just throws insults around. If I want to see a comic insult people and do it with humor and finesse I'll watch the late great Don Rickles on YouTube.
1
Yes, Don Rickles was the master at finessing "insult" humor--he was funny but not obnoxious like Ricky Gervais.
the question gervais is asking is when we are accommodating and inclusive, is that enough, or are there some specific rules, not intended to help suffering, but placed as a gotcha challenge so that certain minorities can have their equality AND victim hood at the same time? Specifically he is asking if it is really trans phobic to pretend that before she was Caitlyn Jenner, that she was (or at least portrayed herself to be) a man named Bruce Jenner. And secondly, since she has been accepted as who she wants to be, does she somehow become off limits from jokes without branding the comedian an oppressor.
It isn't the call for acceptance he s making fun of, but rather the ongoing victimhood so many seem unwilling to let go.
16
Oh come on Lindy. I think this whole topic is beneath your skill level. You're our power-hitter, our clean-up chief!
You are indeed being hard on Gervais. And by the time you bracketed out his podcast about jellyfish and giraffes I knew you had missed the mark - or at least were using Gervais as the wrong trans-phobic signifier. His contributions are too substantial to lard him with this kind of thing.
We should not forget how Ricky finally liberated the world from laugh-track sitcom hell with his bell-weather show 'The Office', mining the awkward and the silent for all their pent-up comedic gold. And all you have to do is watch 'Extras' to understand fully (or even just to get a whiff of) this man's comedic genius.
Comedians hold a very special place in the ranks of humanity and I think the foundation of Gervais' comedy is keen, pointed and well thought-out.
19
I despise the guy. He's just awful.
But I rather have a comedian who says this stuff than a president who thinks it.
4
Policing the demeanor of entertainers seems beneath the pay grade of this newspaper's opinion page.
19
I think you don't know what comedy is. I'm really baffled by your article.
42
Is this Ricky guy worth a comment? Probably not. But his disgusting "comedy" does raise questions about Reed Hastings, the founder and CEO of Netflix, and why he would produce such work within his company.
By producing such vile shows along with his attacks on teachers, publicly elected school boards and his maniacal love for charter "schools," Hastings is giving us more than a glimpse of his true political leanings. And it's a pretty awful sight.
7
Do we really know what Ricky Gervais (or any other entertainer for that matter) thinks and believes? Or, do they just react to what the audience is clicking and viewing, and (perhaps even not fully aware of the process) adjusting their "acts" accordingly?
6
You're being "hard on Ricky Gervais"?! Look up 'sarcasm.' Carefully read the definition.
11
Time to get a sense of humor.. Or, write a critique of Richard Pryor and Eddie Murphy and see how far that gets you, that is when you stop laughing...I'm a big fan of Gervais because he is a huge defender of animals and tells the truth about animal abuse world wide. He's good egg with a sharp sense of humor.
28
Good Lord! Lindy West is so enraged she isn't really paying attention to what Ricky Gervais actually says. In so many words: "just because a joke is about a certain kind of people (e.g. transexuals), it doesn't mean it's AGAINST them". In fact, in Gervais' case, it never is. On the other hand, they are joke that are precisely against the Lindy West types. How deliciously ironic...
40
My very own (trans) daughter, currently a volunteer physician in a war-torn country and a veteran of similar relief operations with a foremost international medical NGOs is not a subscriber to The Times. but has asked me to convey her shame and disgust at your columnist's portrayal of transphobia as a "continuing international emergency".
Humour can indeed grate, but sanctimonious excess can be obscene.
395
If this is true, it’s the greatest comment I’ve read in the Times in a long while. Sanctimonious excess indeed.
38
Absolutely! Amen! As someone who grew up in a struggling third world country, these Western perceptions of what constitutes an "international emergency" are frankly insulting to the majority of people on this planet (who don't live in your cloistered safe environment with "first world problems"). Check your sanctimony at the door Ms West!
40
I couldn’t agree with you more. Does the author know humans in Flint still don’t have clean water or that many in PR are still without power or that mass shootings in the US are killing children? Has Lindy heard about the arms sales to Saudi Arabia and the bombing of Yemen? Now those are international emergencies!
26
Making a living through insult must be an edgy art form. I have not see this Gervais special but I am sure it is silly and childish in a naughty way. Cruelly sophomoric.
On the other hand, after the last grand prix, Abu Dhabi, is a serious F1 event for fans and could be an example of tremendous greed and waste as well as a showcase of automotive technology.
2
Comedy must be honest. People don't like the truth and simultaneously crave it.
People are silly.
I could care less whether Ricky Gervais is evolving. If he doesn't someone else will fill the void.
Speak your truth Ricky. Speak your truth everyone else. What other people think of you is none of your business.
7
The difference between Ricky Gervais and Dave Chappelle is that Chappelle is also irreverent and likes making people uncomfortable....but Dave Chappelle is funny.
1
Not a big fan of Gervais but I have watched the first 15 mins of his Humanity act. That was enough, thank you. I prefer another Brit standup, Milton Jones (see him on YouTube) and he is a Christian (like Gervais I am a devout atheist). However, after reading this critique I am warming to Gervais. The point she has missed is this. He is speaking to, by and large, progressive people who support Trans people, as he himself does (believe me, he does) and getting a rise from the PC crowd. As I said this is not my kind of humour at all. But is it legitimate? Absolutely yes. And his act is clever.
But 15 mins is enough.
4
The funny part of Caitlyn Jenner was the bad driving. I think Gervais is wonderful.
12
Laughed right through the show, but didn't enjoy it, if that makes any sense.
Really evil people are ascendant and flexing their muscles....so he chooses a transgender woman as a target, simply for being transgender. Isn't that 'punching down'? Is there anyone else more worthy of the attention?
1
It seemed more like he was ridiculing her for killing someone and being part of the attention-seeking celebrity culture that is the Kardashian TV show.
Was he punching down at some random transgender woman or was he ridiculing Jenner, a rich person who has been famous since the 70's?
1
Did you laugh at the parts of his program when he made fun of people of faith? people who believe the world is 6000 years old? people of average intelligence? people who don't believe in evolution? What about when he made fun of himself or his wife? Or people who have kids? or kids in general? You didn't mention any of these moments in your article, but they all happened in the show.
You picked and chose what you were offended by. I am sure that you laughed at the rest. Maybe we should all just be less offended, and laugh a bit more. Maybe we should all look at ourselves in the mirror and see how ridiculous we ALL are.
28
This is still a free country. He has the right to say what he wants. If you don't like, it don't watch.Get over yourself.
13
This is exactly why I adore Mr. Gervais, no apologies, no holds barred. Just pure honesty. Those who don't like him can always tune to something else.
12
I'm not sure if this was the point, but now I'm watching Ricky Gervais: Humanity on Netflix!
27
it's brilliant.
1
Humanity is great, saw it live last year in London. Gervais is a breath of fresh air
6
S-A-T-I-R-E. Of course it's offensive to some. Of course it's uncomfortable. It's supposed to be. If you want comedy to be "politically correct", he's certainally not who you want on your personal viewing list. Don't watch. It is your choice.
9
If Lindy West doesn't think something is funny, chances are that it is.
17
Oh God, he is one of the funniest comics
I have ever seen, Get over your smarmy self
Lindy West. You probably do not approve of
Mark Twain neither. Gervais brightens my world,
boy is it fun and good to laugh so hard. He reminds
me of Lenny Bruce who told the truth so
deliciously. I have loved all his shows. And
if you cannot see his big heart, then poor you!
25
There's no room for humor unless it's directed at the right people. Is that it?
39
There's no room for criticism unless it isn't directed at things you find funny. Is that it?
3
A comedian might be outrageous, yes, and still accepted, but not if he or she is also tedious and irritating. If the shoe fits...
1
The current Left has as much humor as the puritans.
31
Er, Mr Gervais is on the left.
3
Wanderer spot on comment and so true. imagine banning free speech at Berkeley? Do those students even get the irony or hypocrisy. Yes humor is always funny when it's directed squarely to the right but never to the left.
5
Why can’t I stop reading Lindy West? I don’t care for her opinions, and her use of language reminds me of a cross between Mike Tyson and what Orwell cautioned against in his essay on Politics and the English Language (“gerrymander an epidemic of bowdlerization”). Nevertheless, every time I see her articles published, I am compelled, like a nicotine addict taking one last drag before quitting, to click on her link. I suppose at least I am entertained. I harbor no hope or desire for her to improve or grow as a writer, but I do comfort myself with the knowledge that one day, when the current pop culture issues on which she relies fall by the wayside, someone better might take her place. Or not. Either way, it’s time for me to watch that Ricky Gervais special! There’s no such thing as bad publicity!
58
There is certainly a train wreck voyeurism that goes with reading a West piece.
13
Political correctness run amok. The extreme liberalism makes millions uncomfortable and hurts their feeling. Do radical progressives care about those people?
Lighten up, live and let live!
19
I can’t comment on Ricky Gervais but will say that I find it dismaying that a woman’s stance on transgender folk has been hitched to feminism and the progress of women and women’s issues at large. To me that feels like the ultimate manspreading and mansplaining. Transgender women (I hardly ever hear from trans men, wonder why) feels a lot like yet another man telling me how to live my life and how to be a “woman”, which feels an awful lot like “history”.
17
What is next? The Weight Watchers?
4
So really it comes down to this: Ricky has a sense of humor, and you don’t.
No question who gets invited to my next BBQ.
43
I'm quite offended by this tirade on Mr Gervais. I believe you should never say a bad thing about him, and I'm not amused. Acknowledge my deeply hurt feelings and please refrain from ever talking like this again .
45
I'm generally a fan of Ricky Gervais. Like Bill Maher, they are pretty uncompromising with their humor, and I do respect that for the most part - they are edgy and that can be important in our snowflakish world. The trans humor in the special was a little too over-the-top in the amount of it, but what Lindy doesn't get is that there is some discomfort with so much attention to trans this and that and an uncompromising opinion about anyone that is still taking it all in. I don't think at heart he was being discriminatory, but I think he was airing his discomfort and amusement at all the persnickety details about talking about transgender topics.
10
Ricky is hilarious....absolutely spot on, brilliantly hilarious. Makes Seinfeld look like a little old lady. Makes Larry David look like the kvetch that he is. He is in a league all of his won. He is mocking it all...
19
I'm not certain you watched the same special I watched. You briefly note Ricky's comment regarding "context" yet that was the focal point of his position. Just because a joke uses a transgender or any other "offensive" subject, doesn't mean the joke was making fun or light of that subject. As he aptly performed, they can be supportive and quite the opposite. I realize this is the opinion section, but at least fairly represent the material you are describing.
And if you can't take a joke...
16
Timely. I happened to watch Gervais just last night. LOVED his show. Yes, HE may not be afraid to speak but I have dinner parties with PLENTY of people who are terrified to say anything about transgender issues and how it affects them.
24
What does that even mean? People in Toronto are having PLENTY of dinner parties and afraid to talk about trans issues while attending them? What exactly are the trans issues affecting the people at those Toronto dinner parties?
1
I don't really buy the central conceit of this article, that Gervais and other comedians are targeting society's vulnerables like transgender people. After watching his show, it's obvious Gervais is making compelling observations about human nature, holding a mirror to the audience, as they say. And frankly, it seems to me, if you don't like what you see in the mirror....well.
38
Transphobia kills. I don't see how perpetuating it through "comedy" is compelling.
3
The comedian made fun of Ms Jenner for her bad driving (she killed someone), and her celebrity-seeking job, her wealth, and who happens to be transgender. It wasn't about picking on trans folks.
This is the reason many comedians will not perform at colleges anymore. He's being outrageous, he's saying the unsayable. Don't like it? Don't watch it. BTW, what comedians DO you like? I'd be very curious to find out.
26
Those of us who dislike Ricky's "comedy" aren't advocating for censorship, despite what his defenders with their all too delicate "feelings" would like everyone to believe. And last I heard, everyone has a right to criticize what they don't like.
Do you agree? Or would you advocate some legal silencing of Ricky's critics?
4
In sum: it's his shtick. Gross to some, hilarious to others and therefore pointless to criticize because it is art.
12
Actually, criticism of ANY art, or writing, or verbal utterance is far from "pointless." It's the very essence of free speech and expression in a free society.
If I call Ricky's work worthless, hateful, self-serving, mean-spirited tripe, that is my right. To equate my response to his pathetic "comedy" with censorship is either ignorant or disenguine, or both.
He has the right to say whatever he wants. And I have the right to say what I want about it. It's actually pretty simple. And please don't attempt to control what I say by whining about "political correctness." Understand?
1
Ricky Gervais is offensive- that's his shtick...and he's great at it! I saw his special- it's great.
If you don't like his humor, don't watch it...duh.
8
Gervais doesn't lampoon the weak or those who aren't "like him": he lampoons self-importance. He doesn't find all trans people objectionable: he finds Caitlyn Jenner's commoditizing her gender change funny. He doesn't lack sympathy for allergy sufferers; he makes fun of the allergy sufferer who expects the entire world to change themselves to accommodate his or her problem. He also has the fine British sense of silliness. If you find yourself getting offended by his humor, you might need to take a second look in the mirror. Is your self-importance or humorlessness showing?
84
Well-put.
2
“What they’re actually reacting to is the message deep at the heart of the March for Our Lives, of Black Lives Matter, of the Women’s March: The world is bigger than you, and it belongs to us too.”
How do you know that that is “what they’re actually reacting to”?
Some of the language setting up that statement also caught my eye: “similar sentiments from hand-wringers” (dismissive labeling); “pundits and politicians who insist that white men were so victimized by the “sensitivity” of marginalized people, they had no choice but to vote for Donald Trump” (I don’t know what Rush Limbaugh and Fox News have been saying but this is the first time I’ve seen that analysis of the 2016 election).
See Michelle Goldberg’s last two columns. She described monuments to the Civil War as “monuments to slavery and treason, most erected by white supremacists decades after the Civil War.” On the president: “Everyone knows Trump is a disloyal husband, so it’s no shock that he slept with [other women] while his wife ... was caring for their new baby.” This is strong hard hitting language in the service of her politics.
But it’s plainspoken descriptive language. No name calling, mind reading, or straw men arguments. The Civil War really was about slavery and white supremacy, notwithstanding a revisionist Southern narrative and an old fashioned political correctness.
I react one way when people use her approach and another way when they use yours. I don’t think I’m the only one who does.
5
You're creating a straw man and your logic is circular. I have not heard people who complain about the totalitarian left, including Gervais, scream "snowflake at rape victims." You simply don't like his shtick, call it "dangerous," and then throw a couple of hit piece anecdotes in near the end. I don't find his work particularly funny or enlightening, but this critique is weak. It reads as a college newspaper critique; a lot of platitudes but nothing of substance.
22
I watched Gervais's latest Netflix special last week, and it was brilliant, brave, and thoughtful. With regard to transgender identity or any number of issues, it is not even slightly regressive, oppressive, or conservative.
This whole column boils down to the author's surprise that Gervais speaks for himself, with clarity and compassion, not to mention with uproarious humor.
20
What a bizarre review.
Ricky Gervais is one of the few original and fearless stand-up comedians. His comedy is delitberately cringe-inducing, which any fan of Ricky's already knows.
If Ricky's comedy is a little too edgy for Ms. West, there are plenty of mediocre hacks that can provide her with the Safe Space Comedy she seems to be searching for.
Don't change Ricky! We love you just the way you are.
39
Stay tuned for Lindy’s husband’s new comedy special: Tiptoeing Through a Minefield for Jokes.”
30
I'm a huge fan of Gervais's earlier work. I loved The Office, Extras, his XFM radio show and podcast. And yet, I thought his latest standup special was absolute trash because, as the author states, its just him moaning about people being offended by him.
However, Lindy misses the entire point as to why it's a bad piece of comedy. The problem is that he spends an entire comedy special explaining why his previous jokes are funny and not that controversial with context, which is inherently an unfunny topic.
Ironically, Lindy seems like the exact person that makes what Gervais said about "being offensive" seem more poignant. Most liberals have recognized that these people screeching about offensive jokes are a small minority. Most understand that making a joke about trans people isn't necessarily meant to hurt or offend all trans people. Shock humor is alive and well. Plenty of good and honest people can laugh at a racist/sexist joke and understand that racism and sexism are bad.
Saying that "we have evolved" and can no longer find these kinds of jokes funny is just naive and reeks of elitism. I don't think this special was funny at all, but it's not because the jokes he was explaining weren't funny, it was because he was explaining them. Lindy conflates his poor performance with offensiveness no longer having a place in comedy. Gervais did a poor job, yes, but he is right: you can't just say your offended and make something go away or make people not laugh.
8
Lindy is obviously puzzled by an individual that can't be shut down via Twitter - I mean that is how the world has 'evolved' - right? Just a few unsubstantiated claims or accusations on Twitter and he should go away in Lindy's world?
Good comedy practitioners have always made the Lindy's of the world uncomfortable - from Carlin to the Man in the Moon to (heaven forbid) - Sarah Silverman.
Get over it and quit trying to shut down art that doesn't agree with your progressive agenda.
19
Ms. West, I empathize. I truly do. The difficulty is that sexual differences and the polite, empathetic discussion of them has become a bit of a slippery slope. Trans people ought not to be mocked, but what happens when a person - and it will happen - identifies (as you raise in your piece) as trans-species. I'm not being glib or mean. Do we have limits to cultural propriety? I'm as liberal as they come, but I am not going to relearn the English language to include "gender neutral" pronouns.
13
I think it's oftentimes too easy to always blame the right wing for minority problems, while ignoring issues within our own communities. As a member of the online atheist community, a lot of the comments Gervais, Bill Maher, and Richard Dawkins make are absolutely accurate. And a lot are moronic and way over the line, but we don't challenge them on it.
1
This article perfectly explains the outrage that people who are against the "PC" culture express. It's a fear of change, that the world around you is changing and there's nothing you can do about it, so you have to whine about the good old days. There's some comedians who critique change but at the same time understand and accept it, especially in a broader context, like Bill Burr for example. He mocks everything; how things used to be, how they are, etc. He mocks how things are changing, then argues for why we should accept the changes. It might seem convoluted, but it works. Gervais doesn't seem up to that kind of complex multi-leveled comedy, and his views have a paying audience, so he panders to that. I just choose not to watch him anymore.
6
This article may not explain the outrage, but it does present a perfect example of why so many of us dislike the PC "culture." Politically correct people are a humorless herd who care more about being accepted by others than being themselves.
3
The best 50 years of humanity was the High Baroque era in the late 17th and early 18th centuries after the end of the religious wars. Craftsmanship, art, music, beauty and intellectual enlightenment - the pursuit of civilization and civilized virtues were what defined "success." Gervais' 50 years is the triumph of consumer capitalism which spawned a shallow celebrity culture that has made an otherwise unremarkable and un-funny comic into a sensation. Gervais is a fake intellect. He regurgitates a few banalities symbolically associated with "smart people" while occasionally making off-color remarks to generate buzz for the sake of brand recognition.
1
Unless, of course, you were the women and brown people who were explicitly excluded from the pursuit of that civilization and those civilized virtues. Today I am an educated physician with multiple degrees, a leader in my community, a person of distinction. Back then, as a woman, I would not have been educated, and would have been considered my father and then husband's property, to do with whatever he pleased, not even a full person. Pardon me if I don't consider that a "successful" time that excluded over 50% of humanity from participating in those virtues you extol.
3
The status of women in the Baroque era looked nothing like your grotesque characterization. Women were not property, nor is it true that women were not educated. That kind of self-indulgent rhetoric is not the historical record.
Post-war consumer culture has meant that some women are now able to assume the role of exploiter. Whether that's progress remains to be seen. What it has also meant is a pervasive reaction among those women who are not so lucky to enjoy an expensive professional degree and be a "person of distinction."
Moreover, for much of the world's female population, modernism has brought destabilized communities, atomized families, environmental destruction, civil strife, forced migration, mass rape and wrenching poverty. It is easy for the comfortable of either sex, of any race or ethnicity, and of any age or sexuality to celebrate "achievement" - but can the women of the Central African Republic today? Alas, it is precisely the lavish, abundant lifestyles enjoyed by their western sisters that have destroyed the social fabric of their communities. So it really depends on your perspective, doesn't it?
Our consumer culture rewards the accumulation of things: be they cars, televisions but also degrees, distinction, reputation and leadership. Except that the latter are not ineffable values born of personal achievement and humility. Rather they are credentials bought from an educational retailer and social capital accumulated thru personal brand marketing.
Gary, in addition to Durham MD's perspective, you may consider that some would think the best years of humanity were the height of the Islamic Golden Age, or the height of the Han Dynasty, or countless other eras that "speak" to an individual. Certainly our current age is full of big problems but the opportunities emerging for lots of different types of people is a good thing.
Finally, I don't think Gervais sees himself as an "intellect" so calling him a fake one doesn't hold.
What don't people get about that stand-up special? It's meant to be as offensive as possible on the topics that cause the most offense at the moment. His point is about free speech, not the objects of his jokes (trans people, peanut-allergy suffers, rape victims, etc.)
13
Yes, and in doing so, he actively hurts scores of people.
2
He doesn’t hurt anybody who isn’t willingly accepting victim status. Nobody has to listen. Everybody has a handy off switch.
11
Sorry, but if you are "hurt" in any real way by the jokes of a standup comedian, on a Netflix special, then you live a charmed life wholly devoid of any meaningful problems, and are not in need of any sympathy.
This sums up my opinion perfectly. Ricky Gervais isn't offensive to me so much as bafflingly out-of-touch, the quintessential "Old Man Yells At Cloud." I don't think punching down is funny, no, but also I wonder why he seems so desperate to provoke and yet, so unimpressive at it? His twitter isn't DADAist art, stimulating discussion by flipping something on its head; it's the same cheap arguments I hear every day and honestly, it's boring.
10
A friend and I were just discussing Gervais this week. I’ve been of fan of his comedy for years but recently this theme of being outspoken against being offended comes across as insufferable. People risk their lives to speak up about what offends them. Racism, sexism and every other ism hurts real people. I’m not defending being a victim of every slight but Gervais attitude comes across as an attempt to negate the sentiment of any person who speaks up about him or herself. Very disappointing because I think overall he’s extremely progressive and open minded. And Lord knows we need more outspoken atheists! See what I did there!!
6
I guess I find it hard to care. If Ricky Gervais was the ring leader convincing the lemmings of the U.S. to hate trans people, then sure, but maybe we should clean our own house first.
You know, considering the leader of the free world and the most powerful man in our own government has made attacking the trans community part of his actual political platform? But yeah, let's focus on Ricky Gervais, shutting him up will definitely move the conversation forward.
Selective outrage is sooooo 2017, along with armchair patriots boycotting the NFL.
159
Why is that critiquing Ricky Gervais is somehow shutting him up?
Meanwhile, how is it that you think we build and reinforce norms? Through culture, of course. And so of course it is reasonable to critique the norms which someone like Ricky Gervais is reinforcing with his oh-so-edgy comedy.
4
"The World Is Evolving and Ricky Gervais Isn’t" No, we are most certainly not evolving. We are in a USA that is marching backward to the south in 1955. Therefore, by your logic, Gervais is spot on. Gross and crass and absurdly unjust is the way of things until Trump supporters are silent and out of power.
7
Ms. West,
Your humorlousness is astounding in its broad scope. Gervais' special on Netflix makes very clear what the source of his humor is, and why we laugh at it. He makes fun of people who do not think and speak clearly, who mistake words for ideas, and above all for those who are irredeemably shallow in their inability to understand the human psyche.
.
Dave Chappelle's recent work on Netflix talks about how he is increasingly unwilling to do stand-up because of the Lindy Wests of the world. He doesn't need the money, and he is reluctant to face their torrent of abuse. He, like Gervais, also makes jokes about trans-gendered people, and he, like Gervais, explain the difference between comedy and insult. But it's not good enough for you, Ms. West.
.
I, for one, would rather see 1000 SJWs like Ms. West silenced than lose either Gervais or Chappelle. Yes, they can be offensive to the easily offended. You have no right to not be offended in a democracy. Only the elite in a dictatorship can have the right to not be offended. Just what sort of world are you pushing for?
69
Pushing for kindness and human decency. There is no justifiable reason to spew invectives, even those veiled by comedy.
1
No one spewed any invectives, and that is the point.
Self-righteous people in our weird, supposedly progressive culture, just take mild satire, which any rational human can see is tongue-in-cheek, and slather it in hyperbole and melodrama until it turns into some gigantic injustice that they can fight against to live out their freedom fighter delusions with or virtue-signal to their group-think peers with.
And for what? Is anyone actually helped or saved by this nonsense? Is this making the world better for anyone? As far as I can tell, the only thing this insufferable behavior has ever delivered us, is Donald Trump.
2
I’ve never found him funny, never found him remotely likeable and so have never watched his “comedy”. I prefer wit. Next!
2
Don't really understand the point of this article. Is it to 'uncover' Gervais through the same standard arguments he makes fun of?
8
The circular nature of social media is exhausting to listen to - whether it be reporters referencing Tweets or a comedian complaining about a few negative Facebook comments in a sea of adoring fans. I saw the Gervais show and while some of it was funny, the constant referencing of social media comments seemed more like thin-skinned peevishness.
5
Gervais' 15 minutes ran out some time between his first Emmy, and the second, which he received in the same show as the first.
2
I've been raped. My grandchildren have food allergies. My niece/nephew is trans. Gervais is smart, truthful, and very funny.
403
Sorry to hear you've been sexually assaulted. I'm also sorry to hear about your grandchildren's allergies.
But I don't find this guy "funny" in the least. And I do wonder about people---usually aging white guys like myself---who think he's an absolute riot. What is going on inside of you anyway?
He has every right to say what he wants and you have every right to love his material. And I have every right to call it sickening and very unfunny.
So what is coming up next to feed the ravenous hunger for ever-increasing shock value and "anti-political correctness" of aging white guys and other Ricky fans? Holocaust "jokes"? "Funny" rapes? "Hilarious" slavery routines? "Side splitting Hiroshima stories? I guess we'll find out soon enough.
Meanwhile, those of us who don't equate REAL, genuinely funny comedy with anything Ricky and his fans apparently find so hysterical will keep on exercising our right to say what we want about it, whether anyone likes it or not.
13
Actually, I'm a hard core liberal. I just don't believe that we can get to what is compassionate through what is untrue. Mr.Gervais tells some uncomfortable truths. Also, I don't happen to be a man and I have stood, at some personal cost, against racism (real racism against people of color) all my life. That said, it has become a little too fashionable to criticize white people, especially older white people, rather harshly. I'm ashamed that so many people who look like me voted for Trump. I actively campaigned against him. But I do believe these excesses on the left drove many to that vote who would not otherwise have considered it. That's no excuse. But the left needs to check itself. Really.
9
Gervais giggles like a schoolgirl - one of the most annoying traits known to man. His sense of humor, excuse me - humour is that of an adolescent boy and his bro persona grating and juvenile. Skip!
2
His giggle alone makes me laugh - this shows that we're all different!!
Gervais seemed to be trying to make a point about humour and free speech, perhaps clumsily.
It would be interesting to hear your thoughts on other comedians observing the moment. Dave Chapelle built a whole set about how it was alright for him to minimise and joke about rape and domestic violence because he has suffered more.
This seems to be a more provocative claim than that people should have the right to hurt each other's feelings.
5
I read this article because I thought it was odd that it was an Opinion piece instead of a Review. It sounds like Gervais took the Jenner joke too far, at least in the author's opinion. To me it sounds like a Jenner joke, not a transgender joke. Jenner seems to invite more scrutiny, in my opinion. Marrying a woman--of fame, no less--is not the behavior of someone that feels uncomfortable as a man. And agreeing to participate in a reality television series does not strike me as the behavior of someone that minds being examined or followed with close scrutiny. Perhaps these are the Jenner specific points that would have been funnier than slipping into the subject of transgender people in general.
7
Men complain about "mouthy, shrill, nagging, bitter, grating, hectoring" women. The truth is, men often don't like to hear women point out injustices, mistakes or errors. Grown men don't want to hear women tell them what to do.
Men want to tell WOMEN what to do. Men want women to stay close and be obedient, or else shut up and go away (or die). Men can evolve past this primitive state (and a great many have), but some men never will.
It takes a lot of courage to be the kind of writer Lindy West is. She doesn't attempt to sugarcoat her observations, so she invites reflexive antagonism from the resentful. Fortunately for herself and us, Ms. West is an excellent thinker and writer.
Intelligent, principled people are honor-bound to listen to those who speak about injustice, and to endure the sometimes uncomfortable sensation of "trying on" the lived experiences of others. This is the way we help "bend the arc of the moral universe toward justice".
14
I agree that West is an excellent thinker and writer, but if I disagree with her points here do I automatically fall into the camp of "reflexive antagonism from the resentful"?
6
Now this is rich - interpreting disagreement with Lindy West's arguments as personal, gendered antagonism toward's Lindy West herself?
Is this some kind of trap? Can I merely disagree with your points here or does that mean that I'm also being reflexively antagonistic towards another woman who dares have an opinion?
12
I'm a man, and I hate telling women what to do. I love listening to what they have to say. I don't believe anyone should shut up or be obedient. Your mean generalizations about men simply aren't true. But hey, if you want to build a comedy routine around them, I have no problem with that and I would even come see your act.
3
I think we have to give broad leeway to humorists. If we can shut down joking about issues we hold dear, we really don't have free speech. And to say, 'but this speech is dangerous and risks the safety of people', is essentially what every dictator says of humorists who attack them.
I think people are killed in muslim countries for wanting equal rights as women and for being gay. I believe that supporting the oppressive patriarchal religions like Islam (or Christianity) support these oppressive regimes. Lindy West may think supporting women who want to wear a hijab is striking a blow for tolerance; I think it supporting oppression and endangering the hundreds of millions of women who live in oppressive religious societies. Unlike Lindy West, though, I am tolerant, and support her right to her "dangerous" position.
Playing the "someone is dying because of the position you support" card is the opening gambit in the push to outlaw free speech. It is dishonest. If she wants to argue that cis women are not threatened by trans women, then let her make that argument (perhaps to her trans exclusionary feminist friends), and stop yelling fire in a crowded theater. Gervais' comedy is not objectionable because it is threatening lives.
22
We have to give broad leeway to all.
Given that Ricky Gervais' style of humor is now well-established, anyone who goes to a theater or comedy club to see him and then complains that they found his act offensive or insensitive is being disingenuous. What did you expect, Bob Newhart? That's like going to a rock concert and complaining about the music being too loud. And if it bothers you that there is an audience for his style of humor, too bad. It's not all about you and what you happen to think is funny. There are some people who would never buy a ticket for a Blue Collar Comedy show or a black Kings of Comedy show, but that doesn't mean that either option shouldn't exist.
32
I support normal people and I am not attracted to deviants and freaks. There are plenty of doctors and social workers that make a good living off those who need special care. Most of us don't have the talent, time or inclination to intervene. "Humanity", as Gervais well knows, includes the entire fringe. Acceptance of the mix(s) beyond the normal requires a very big heart and bigger sense of humor. [This statement should not be taken as an endorsement or tolerance of any look, lifestyle, political orientation, or modus operandi.]
6
Oh please, enough with the he is going too far. That is the whole point of comedy, going too far and making people uncomfortable. Comedy is the release valve for the truth to come out. That's why the court jesters of yesteryear were around, to call out the liars, including the Kings.
As for the special on Netflix, it was hilarious, his delivery is impeccable.
46
Salutations. Hope this reply finds you well.
Ultimately progress is achieved when both sides agree. You are correct the world has changed. The problem now, although its the information age, we often listen to the hearsay before we listen to the original voice. The partisan gap now is so wide that the pendulum must swing so far that it has all devolved into a game of Chinese whispers—known as telephone in North America and its only getting worse. This is the dumpster fire that Gervais is in my opinion references.
Western culture has grown to what it is today because of freedom of speech. The ability to question ideas and weigh them against better or worse ideas is essential. Any other period or place in the world where the silencing of ideas is in effect. It inevitably leads the pendulum to swing to far in the same direction and atrocities soon follow.
Even dark humor, even what is considered "hate speech" is the normal interplay or push-back that happens when the social pendulum has gone too far. Unfortunately what no one has realized is the ONLY response to an idea is a better idea. At present the only response to critical ideas is public shaming, deplatforming, violence, targeted response to the person's employer or audience. It has not escaped me that your article does indeed do the very thing. But the good news is that is conversation that allows us to achieve the balance "Does it DO good versus does it feel good."
3
I really don't understand the point in criticizing comedians. They're not going to stop making offensive jokes, and audiences won't stop laughing at them. You will never change this. Okay, so you may not think a joke about starving kids in Africa is funny. Fair enough. But for every person who doesn't, there are ten people who do. That's just how it is, for better or for worse. And as Ms. West says herself, the world is evolving. Homosexuality continues to be decriminalized and accepted, if slowly at times. Transgender people continue to gain rights, if slowly at times. Women in Saudi Arabia can now drive and visit sports arenas. Poverty rates keep falling. Clearly, Mr. Gervais and other likeminded comedians are not halting the march of progress.
12
I saw the Netflix show. Some of it was real funny, but a good amount was tiresome. It was clear that Gervais was uncomfortable with criticism he received. Dangerous, no.
2
You lost me at International Emergency. Seriously?
Jenner is a target for being an enabler of fame for fame sake lately. Previously, as Mr. Gervais says, and I paraphrase, we cant just pretend that she wasn't Bruce Jenner, an international sports superstar. He is now a very high profile she and sitting on that fame perch, one is a recipient of analysis, critique, adoration and chagrin. Free speech allows and celebrates all of this, including Mr. Gervais.
48
Wow! What an unfair attack on a comedian with whom you disagree. This piece embodies why comics don't want to do colleges anymore - let alone the risks they take when they try out new material at comedy clubs. First - we can all agree - comedy isn't evergreen. Delirious is still incredible - and yet Eddie Murphy himself would leave some jokes out (and the rest of us can fast forward). But second - who appointed a certain segment of self described liberals - any more than I accept right wing bible thumpers as the judges and authorities on jokes and comics? Not long ago - this piece would have written by Ralph Reed talking about the assault on "family values" by "edgy" comics. Now from the left it's an assault on cultural decency. As a liberal, and an ally - it's all grown tiresome - and is in no way helpful to moving the issues and causes forward. You don't like Gervais - fine - keep on channel surfing.
65
It is reported that Netflix paid him 20 million dollars for his comedy special. That makes it pretty obvious that there are enough people out there who enjoy his brand of comedy.
10
This is all about context. If Mr. Gervais was not a performer, but say, running for public office, I might find him to be offensive. But, alas, he's just a comic. If you don't agree with his act, then by all means, just laugh him off...
128
Yes! AND criticize him too---which last I checked we have every right to do in a truly free society.
1
So Ms. West, what is it you want then? No more trans jokes? Are the jokes about children dying of peanut allergies ok? Or are all jokes that poke fun at vulnerable people off limits? That could get tricky pretty fast.... I've got a better idea, let's let comedians say whatever they want. Because Gervais's words are not the cause of anyone being kicked out of a homeless shelter. And that pesky little First Amendment, and the fact that we all respect your right to make as many offensive comments about men as you wish. Telling comedians what material they may or may not address is far more offensive and dangerous than anything Gervais has ever said.
34
Saw Gervais's special. I enjoy his voice. Read this column. I enjoy West's voice. The system seems to be working.
One observation, saying Gervais is transphobic because he picked on Caitlyn Jenner is like saying West dislikes comedy because she picked on Ricky Gervais.
52
I watched the special last night and found it hilarious. Perhaps the writer should revisit it as Ricky addressed most of her comments in a convincing manner.
5
Humor is a fabulous evolutionary filter. Absolutely no one automatically gets a pass. Everybody deserves to be mocked. It’s tough, but true. What separates the winners from the losers is the ability to take it and mock back.
6
So, so many comments about censorship!
I don't care whether you agree with West or Gervais or both or neither, but can we please agree that her response to his special is NOT censorship?
He had a say, then she had a say - that's called a public discourse, not censorship.
14
While not directly calling for censorship, this piece implies that Ricky's choice of words puts transgender people in physical danger. That's about as close to advocating censorship as you can get without actually advocating it.
8
I believe the author is confused. The decline that Gervais alludes to is the rise in illiberal attitudes and rise of new nationalism. He laments what he views as the accompanying reactionary left to these trends - I think for their sometimes myopia, but really the critique is pretty thin.
Gervais has never been a strong stand-up, and his blowhard attitude is an easy target. Worth discussing is the Netflix show 'Derek,' where Gervais plays an ostensibly intellectually disabled man caring for the elderly. I wonder why that discussion is missing here.
5
Can someone please let me know how to watch Gervais' comedy if I don't have Netflix? This article totally made me want to see it!
8
While some points made by Ms West are valid, worrying about twittering tirades on Caitlin Jenner (in these time of Trump) is a fools errand at best. Let me count some ways...
Caitlin (née Bruce) did in fact leave the site of a car accident in which the other motorist died. Her (at the time his) behavior was certainly improper. She was found to be more at fault. Ultimately Caitlin (née Bruce) apologized. Not sure about other charges or penalties faced, but rest assured had she not been wealthy those would have been worse.
Caitlin, I believe has been a Trump team supporter. As far as I'm concerned that alone ends the conversation about injustice to Ms Jenner.
Lastly, my empathy and sympathy goes out to other transgender individuals who suffer far worse fates than Caitlin Jenner, and lack her financial resources and high profile defenders.
PS - I've enjoyed and agreed with other columns by Ms West, but believe this tempest in a Twitter-pot isn't worthy of US -- when Republicans control congress. They ARE the real enemies of transgender folk. Not comics like Ricky Gervais.
15
I think Gervais is going full David Brent here. He's trolling because he can troll. He's testing the boundaries. Its funny? Not all the time but sometimes it lands pretty well. I think this is a very interesting time for comics, the landscape is changing so fast and its interesting to see how people like him are responding. He knows what he's doing, he's just being a bit of a provocateur. I was more disappointed by Chapelle falling behind than Gervais. Gervais' strong point isn't always his standup anyway. It was entertaining though and honestly, sometimes you need to laugh this stuff. Sometimes we are all thinking it and it just needs to be said. The problem lies in the fact of what people do with stereotypes: do acknowledge them as such, move on, and treat people with respect or do we harbor them and use them to mistreat and oppress? I don't think Gervais is in anyway advocating the latter, neither someone like Chapelle, so lets just stop being so delicate about the comedy and work to extend utmost respect to others.
61
Criticizing Gervais for not being woke enough is like criticizing Steph Curry for not scoring any touchdowns. It's not the job of the comedian to embody and express enlightened political philosophies; it's to be funny. The service and function of a comedian (and of humor) is to point out prevailing cultural absurdities, and they can be way more effective at this than say a pundit or a politician (Tina Fey did more to reveal the shortcomings of Sarah Palin than any pundit or politician ever could've). A key element of the comedian's effectiveness is that to them, nothing is sacred; they point their laser sharp wit in any and all directions, and anything that obstructs it must be jettisoned. Concern about offense really is poisonous to their process. A king may insist that 2+2=5 and use the power of the sword to enforce this, but it is the jester who can mock this absurdity and hopefully engender a little self awareness in His Royal Highness. A coterie of highly educated, privileged (mostly) white intellectuals can insist that gender is purely a social construct assigned at birth and has zero basis in biology, and that to feel otherwise is to be a transphobic knuckle-dragger...well let's just say there's lots of material there for the court jester. And the target of the jokes wouldn't be trans folks, but well off, famous, white female columnists who delight in shaming people and elevate transphobia to an international emergency...
301
brilliant analogy in your first line!
6
If Ricky Gervais is offending Lindy West then he's probably on the right track. The last thing we need right now is more "woke" politically correct comedians. Show me that you have something different in your bag of tricks. Truthfully I could go the rest of my life without hearing one more lame Trump joke, observation, or skit.
3
Don't like him?
Don't watch him.
Done.
I find him hilarious.
It's not a comic's job to pander to anyone's delicate sensibilities.
21
He likely cares about the issues you mention, just not that humor must only be kind and inclusive.
4
The first season off “The Office” was groundbreaking and hilarious. Since then however, I’ve never figured out why anyone thinks Ricky Gervais’ later work is funny. It reminds me of the last time I went to a comedy club. Exactly one of the comics was funny. The funny one was also the only one in a very long evening, who didn’t rely on offending some group to get laughs. Funny doesn’t have to be offensive.
2
You say that Gervais is not attuned to the evolution of “intelligence” in our society. Are you sure that the identity politics you’re implicitly referencing is an evolution of intelligence or of emotional sensitivity? I think the latter. And that’s his point in his act; what seems to be so pervasive now is intellectual regression, not evolution. That IS what political correctness is mostly about- reacting to something that triggers you emotionally rather than rationally.
I’m not sure you fully understand the irony in his act. He’s not an insensitive ape, he’s just, well, very intelligent, and is probably analyzing social issues through a rational lens, not an emotional one.
39
Fortunately or not, the market place gets to determine who is funny and, e.g., what is news. Gervais has an audience for his brand of humor; thus, attempts to censor it through opinion pieces like this will get no traction. Gervais wins this battle. No different with news: Fox News caters to the right (no alternatives). It has a huge audience; so its brand of right-based news succeeds. CNN is currently catering hate of Trump to its audience. Must be working, because they're still on the air. CNN must be making money from its brand of news. So, it, and like Fox, wins the battle because the market supports both. This is the way it should be. Let the market decide.
8
A few months ago I tried to watch a Seinfeld marathon but stopped after two episodes. Why, because I've evolved and no longer find the casual racism in some of the jokes funny. Comedians have a limited amount of time before society changes and their jokes are no longer relevant. Their job is to make fun of our prejudices and make us think.
Ricky Gervais makes no bones about the fact that his routines are meant to offend. Right now a certain segment of society finds it acceptable to discriminate against transpeople. Rather than refusing to acknowledge that fact Mr Gervais uses humor to highlight our prejudice.
There will come a point in the future where people watch his routine and ask themselves why this was so funny. We will reach a point where transpeople are accepted and integrated into society but we're not there yet. Making fun of Caitlin Jenner while offensive, is very relevant.
5
Love “Seinfeld”. Will always love “Seinfeld”. It still stands up. But I need to excuse myself from the conversation as I have an appointment to get my osteoderms done.
We’ve had enough of him but I support him doing whatever he wants.
6
She missed the point.
His jokes were disparaging, but gentle. Like Bob Hope teasing a President about his golf game.
The effect will be to normalize her situation.
12
What Gervais is doing here IS a part of "intellectual evolution". If there is such a thing. Evolution is a process of certain traits being tested. Some surviving the test and continuing on; others failing the test and falling away. If wide spread acceptance of "trans" as an identity can't survive the comedic conceit of a doctor and a male patient being "dudes" when talking about transitioning, then it should stay in the water, limbless.
Further, connecting homelessness in trans people with a comedy bit about trans people is a very dangerous idea. There are myriad reasons for the drop in overall income and education level of millennial white men compared with their predecessors. The sitcom comedy trope of the buffoonish white dad is not one of them. Projecting homelessness of trans people on a stand-up set is a smug non-solution to a complicated real problem.
12
Because comedy is about finding solutions to major social issues? Nope, it's about finding humor in often troubling things. Do you think the issues with "a few trans" is more or less significant than the daily bombings in the middle east of which the USA either does the deed, helps the deeds, or sells the weapons used in the deed. Or is Ricky supposed to solve global military adventurism too?
13
Ben Carson is absolutely correct.
What about the real women in homeless shelters who are uncomfortable when a MAN walks into her shelter? It is a shelter, like, a SAFE PLACE! From whom do MOST women in a shelter need protection? MEN!
Of course it makes them uncomfortable, almost like when MEN walk into ladies' bathrooms.
What is wrong with this country?
32
We used to be fans of Ricky Gervais... until his mockery started weighing more toward mean-spirited than amusing. There's nothing funny about intransigent, tone-deaf, mean-spirited jibes. Gervais uses railing against what he perceives as "PC" as permission to bully. Thank you for articulating our frustrations, Ms. West.
11
I'm sure he's fine you don't watch him anymore. He's got the wealth and age to not concern himself with appealing to your narrow vision of what's funny and what's not.
6
Lindy West skates over the primary point Ricky Gervais is making in her request that we all succumb to woke culture and think just like her; he argues that joking about a topic or people is not the same as having an opinion on that topic or person, and furthermore, that it is important that comedians in particular not face this constant and overwhelming edit from the woke generation because irreverence is just as important to democracy and humanity as tolerance and understanding of people who are different than us us. Jokes are not propositions; you can tell or laugh at a transgender joke and still fight for their right to have a spot at a shelter.
95
I'm so confused about where I fall on the evolutionary continuum. I've never seen a Gervais show. Never been tempted to and West's piece does nothing to move him from my personal "waste of time" bucket. The more I read of Lindy's work though, the closer she is to leaping into the same bucket.
- Paralyzed with existential angst in Greater Seattle
10
2 notes. Take them as you will:
1: It's not helpful to bridging the gap between the left/progressives and the mainstream/right/republican people to ignore the plainly obvious fact that the trans phenomenon and gender dysphoria are just strange. Especially for people living outside of the media/coastal bubble, trans issues are still really new and extremely niche; people everywhere have little experience or perspective in how to cope. Strange isn't a value judgement, it's a reaction: This is different; I don't know what to do with this; I'm uncomfortable. Surely at some point in your life you've tried a drink or a dish and at first bite you didn't really like it, but it grew on you. You need to give people the space to taste the second bite. By being so stringent to say that people who don't instantly and completely love the meal after one bite must be classless rubes (or hateful, or transphobic, etc), is akin to taking the plate away, throwing out the food, kicking the patron out and burning down the restaurant.
2: It's not a kindness to trans people (and other minority groups) to treat them like sacred cows about which any jokes or off color comments are grave sins. People make jokes at the expense of people they like and don't like all the time, but laughing about it is a path to understanding. Being able to laugh about and at yourself is and important part of life in general. By putting up this taboo, it isolates trans people even further in our culture.
113
Teasing about differences is a key trait in all humor. There's not much funny in a group of all like-minded people, but making fun of such people to other open-minded people is often funny.
You are right about trans people, which is a step beyond homosexuality, in which people pay surgeons and hormone providers to deny their natural bodies. It's the ultimate elective, cosmetic surgery.
13
I don't think I could have these points any more articulately. Perfectly said.
8
That so many people equate being mean with being funny speaks volumes about where we are as a society.
5
If pointing out differences and foibles is felt to be mean, then Ricky would not care for you to ever watch his stuff. That's the point of his "doesn't care," just like he won't care about this opinion piece that misses the point as usual for those with little humor in them.
2
Shakespeare was known to toss in acerbic barbs. I think we are going to be okay.
Ricky Gervais is one of the funniest and bravest comedians around. And might I add, one of the most humane. He targets hypocrisy wherever he sees it, on the right and the left, and his scathing observations of society do not spare himself either. The thought police on the left, exemplified by Lindy West, are becoming as irritating as those on the right.
224
Lots of good points here, however I think you missed one of the more important ones. His new special just isn't funny.
2
"Transphobia is not a pet issue of the hypersensitive but a continuing international emergency."
Continuing international emergency? Have you been watching the news? I think that sentence disproves itself - given all the genuine international emergencies going on, it is only the hypersensitive who could possibly put transphobia up there with climate change, erosion of the culture of democracy, civil war in Syria, etc.
112
It's too bad the author of this piece doesn't have veto power over what programs Netflix shows. I'd feel much safer if she did.
10
Sure, give an overly sensitive person censorship control can't go wrong.
4
Some of us would prefer to be intellectually engaged and challenged by ideas different from our own, rather than "safe".
3
I'm pretty sure that this is sarcasm guys.
5
I tried watching "Humanity" and when Gervais started talking about his tweets, I turned it off. Why? Because - right next to posting pictures of dinner - there is nothing so boring as people quoting their own tweets.
5
Good. Argue against Gervais. Explain why he's not funny. That's the point of free speech. The solution to offensive speech is more speech, counter arguments, rebuttals, not censorship. Censorship is the essence of fascism.
7
Just don't expect Ricky to care what you think.
The Netflix special is very funny and explores taboos while pushing the boundaries of "good taste". Critics deconstructing humor absent of an audience's reaction is a useless exercise in editorial.
13
I found the Netflix special exceptionally funny. Hilarious for the most part. My partner and I laughed out loud consistently throughout. When I watch or listen to any stand-up comedy, I do so hoping that it will be funny. I hope it will make me laugh at paradoxes, inanities, truths etc. That's the point of stand-up. I don't go into it with prescribed ideas of what the jokes should be about, or the sundry sensitivities that might be stepped on.
That's what opinion pieces are for - social or political commentary, arguments, positing of ideas and maybe the type of over the top hand-wringing we find in Lindy West's piece. Absurd. And a bit funny.
15
Thank you for a thought-provoking article. I just watched Humanity last weekend (and loved it).
Of course Ricky Gervais “cares”. There is always a strong message in his stand up comedy and TV shows, ranging from how fame should be a biproduct of excellence, rather than something hollow that people “want to be” (Extras), to the incredible insight that people who are different can offer the world (Derek).
As you admit, you are being hard on him, and I kind of understand how you’ve justified it in the article, but comparing him (and by extension all of us who have similar opinions) to Trump isn’t realistic.
His references to humanity being in a bad patch at the moment wasn’t related to the PC thugs that called him out for “dead naming”, it was a reference to people’s belief that opinions = facts.
He points out that he is from a poor community, as am I, where the murderers had killed most of the peadophiles”, which was a reference tto the horrible stuff that most kids brought up in a poor, urban area are exposed to. Homelessness and sexual abuse are not specific to trans people, they are common in society, and outrage over something as trivial as “dead naming” trivialises bigger issues like these.
13
Individuals and groups who are widely oppressed and abused do not make good comic foils. This is especially true of people who have historically had an extremely limited ability to come to their own defense. It is ok for comics to attack things like the hypocrisy that pervades many religious organizations. These are historically dominant groups and individuals that have more than sufficient means to make their own counter points. Transgender individuals have only now been recognized for being misunderstood and mistreated. Pick your targets better Ricky, don’t blow your credibility.
75
Thanks for telling comedians what is appropriate or not. Perhaps you can enlighten visual artists, musicians, and writers as well? We wouldn’t want to offend anyone.
13
Expressing an opinion is not a one way proposition for comedians, they do not get or even want immunity from criticism. Trying to censor or ban them is a whole other issue. Did I mention anything about censoring or banning anyone? Just like any artist or person, I will express whatever opinions I choose about whatever topic or person I elect to, thank you.
Unfortunately and sadly, the entire "this aint a white man's world movement" assumes that all white men are culpable and does exactly to white males that the movement purports to oppose. I am a white dude, and I understand white privilege, but I am not a white male who is in any position to oppress anyone. I am a teacher and I have no money, power, or prestige, especially, with regard to my profession, in the current social climate. It is offensive to assume that I am THE white man who has an equal hand in inequity.
18
I think that Gervais made fun of Jenner, specifically, and I'd be hard pressed to think of a more privileged individual. He wasn't punching down.
6
Well, the article wasn't about you, Cory, so I don't know why you should feel you personally are being attacked. Perhaps it is because you see your thoughts and beliefs reflected in Gervais' and you are transferring criticism of him onto yourself. Perhaps the truth that the color of your skin and your assumed gender gives you an advantage over other people is an uncomfortable thing to face.
The author had me, at first, with her overall message of not discriminating against a very vulnerably group of people.
But I watched the Netflix special and I don't think Gervais is attacking trans people the way she says. He repeatedly emphasizes that his jokes are not meant to be transphobic, but mainly to make fun of a huge reality tv star, Caitlyn Jenner.
I think she could make a stronger case for supporting trans people's rights by attacking some of the many, many overtly anti-trans people in our society, our president for one, rather than Gervais.
33
The Gervais Netflix special was decent, but not as funny as the recent Chappel ones. I'm so glad your article will have no influence on comedy. The PC police have a lot of legitimate evolutionary work to do, it doesn't extend to our comedians.
40
FYI - there is no PC police. There ARE people with informed opinions who will gravitate away from comedians that try to push jokes that just aren't funny.
3
Absent new issues of National Lampoon to peruse...irreverent/public elevation of these subjects, prejudices, taboos etc....is the most effect means to catalyze open debate/discussion...like...I don't know...your OP-ED. Naively appealing to the 'better angels' of John Q Public's nature and praying the public discourse will become more accepting/less repugnant ain't gonna work in an internet obsessed, increasingly polarized society.
1
Humor inevitably offends. Deal with it. Don’t like it? Don’t listen to that comic. Enjoy your passive-aggressive death-march of a life—have at it with my blessings!—but leave the rest of us alone, k?
Actually—*don’t* leave the rest of us alone, because these outbursts just beg to be satirized, ridiculed, and made fun of. West is building a career and brand, one apparently based on cultural regime-change, so she probably couldn’t care less that this kind of almost stereotypical PC-policing is pretty much the fig leaf Trumpers use to cover their well-deserved shame. Which is both tragic and funny—as if there’s a difference.
Those not wedded to finger-wagging and actually interested in the reality of comedy, at least part of which is to up to the current line (always shifting) and sometimes leap over it, even to the point of offense, and particularly Gervais’s comedy (which no one is required to *like* but all who opine are required to *understand*) will learn a lot from him, and all the others on this video—including the Focus of Evil in the Modern World, Louis CK, Jerry Seinfeld, and Chris Rock: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKY6BGcx37k
What are the chances that this will be posted now that the Focus of Evil in the Modern World, Louis CK, who, since he’s Evil, cannot possibly know a thing about comedy and should be hurled into the Outer Darkness to hand with Melkor, has been mentioned? We shall see; I have a feeling if you’re reading this, it probably went through.
26
Perhaps Gervais relies so much on controversy to cover for the fact that he stopped being funny a long time ago. His humor has always been based in cruel observation, acute discomfort with sincerity and shame. His atheism is laughably sophomoric and simple minded. He is a bully in the pulpit of celebrity.
3
Seriously? You seriously missed the point of everything he was saying. Seriously.
185
My antennae always get twitched when anyone tries to censor an artist, unless the artist is an outright racist, idiot, etc. (which Gervais clearly is not.) And Gervais' view that the regressive Left is trying to censor free speech is indeed absolutely true. The Far Left is completely open and unapologetic about not believing in free speech or in the right of the accused to defend himself (it's usually a him that the Left is attacking). Better for Ms. West to write a piece defending free speech, which used to be important to the Left.
119
Trans people are murdered by males who pick them up thinking that they're going to get something the trans person doesn't have. That's not an excuse for murder needless to say, but to conflate an insensitive comedian or anyone else who just happens to disagree with Lindy West with people who commit murder, or parents who throw teens out of their home and onto the street, is grossly offensive and intellectually false.
45
Heavy heavy emphasis on your points that someone's displeasing you by not being what you expected is no excuse for murder or for throwing a child out of their home, or doing any harm at all! That said, this tendency to blame and even conflate critical thinking and controversial speech with violence really does throw a wet towel on intellectual integrity and open mindedness - two things we're sorely in need of all around.
4
There are plenty of homophobic and offensive comedians out there, but I don't think of Ricky Gervais as one of them. Ricky's problem is that he has an unusually clear-eyed view on the human species and all the absurdities that go along with it. His comedy is provocative because it is rooted in his awareness of the fundamental silliness of who we all are as mere primates, white males included.
114
Chillax Karen. Comedy dares to tell some truths that are hard to swallow, and also makes fun of prejudices with dark comedy,
It seems that now that a lot of people doesn't understand dark comedy or can't make fun of anything without feeling guiltly.
11
Spot on.
This is precisely why Gilbert Gottfried can insult everyone and anyone in the most offensive of ways and be received with uproarious laughter: we know that he is telling jokes. Offstage, Mr. Gottfried is quiet, thoughtful, shy (!) doting father to his children.
Gervais, it would seem, is none of those things. He is a bitter, angry, seething, nasty human who thinks that he's funny.
3
I'm a white man who wasn't "victimized by the 'sensitivity' of marginalized people" and didn't vote for Trump. I support the causes mentioned in the piece, but ain't too happy with the leadership of the Women's March (Look up, oh "Linda Sarsour...Jews."). I don't yell "snowflake at rape victims because, well, THEY'RE RAPE VICTIMS.
All of that said the censorship on the Left - MY Left - can get out of control. When students stop the presence of reactionaries like Milo WhatsHisName ana Ann Coulter, I channel Bernie Sanders and ask "What are you afraid of...ideas?"
On the right, it was picketing movies like "The Last Temptation of Christ" (Christians)(meh!) and "The Passion of the Christ" (My fellow Hebrews)(infinitely better) and when picketers were asked what they didn't like about the movies, I got a universal "I didn't see it."
"All In the Family" and "Blazing Saddles" wouldn't come near actual release in today's environment. Nor could more than a handful of stand-ups from earlier times.
You don't like Ricky Gervais, don't watch him. I don't. I get what he's saying; he just doesn't make me laugh.
21
I saw Gervais's current comedy routine on Netflix. He's smart, he's funny, but offending people pointlessly is not a comedian's best use of that talent. If you're going to be offensive, do it to make a positive difference. Defending the right to be offensive for its own sake is puerile. Rise above it, Ricky. You have power. Use it wisely.
9
I saw Mr. Gervais' special on Netflix and wasn't offended in the least. Which parts made you feel uncomfortable?
2
Nowhere did I state or imply I personally was uncomfortable. But if I was parent to a child with peanut allergies, I might start sending Ricky photos and news articles about about what that looks like. To use his own word, he has become "spoiled."
We all want to be at the center of our own world. It's just a shame we seem to so frequently need to use race and gender to get there. White man, as a class, are not victimized in our society. White men, as individuals, are victimized all the time. Women, as a class, do not enjoy privilege in our society, yet there are many highly privileged women. Somehow, we can't seem to hold these truths in our mind at the same time, and it keeps us from decent levels of understanding and tolerance and reasonable levels of sensitivity.
6
The world is, indeed, changing. And it does belong to everyone.
What I think people have an issue with is the idea that white men oppose these changes. I think that is wrong.
Every social movement in this country has benefited from the support, sometimes massive, of white men. I don't meet white people that are opposed to equality and equal opportunity. Who are all these people? Where are they?
We are in a 'I want to be offended' period. We are in a period where people are painted as evil if they do not agree with the sentiment of the day 100%.
Every cop is a murderer. Every white man is privileged. Every white man hates minorities. Every white man hates women. Every white man hates LGBTQ. Every white man has stood in the face of progress and fought against it with all their might.
It is ridiculous. Gervais is a comedian. Like his jokes or not.
11
Last netflix special really not funny......just be funny.
1
Gervais has become so tedious. He and the rest of the "politically incorrect" white guy crowd don't want to admit that they're not victims or oppressed, they're just no longer culture's default setting. The truth is, their schtick is more stale than week-old bread. The rest of the world has moved on. They are ranting from what will become their ice floe.
11
So... ummm... was the stand-up special funny or not?
6
You may not be familiar with some strains of British humour, which are based on cruelty. I have often wondered how a civilized nation can regularly produce shows like "The Weakest Link" and comedians who make successful careers out of mocking anyone weak and vulnerable...
5
This is a comedic routine..let it go at that!!!
2
Your comment that "Transphobia is not a pet issue of the hypersensitive but a continuing international emergency" makes many of Mr. Gervais's points for him. Coincidentally, I watched the second half of this Netflix show this morning, and he was describing you to a T! He made a number of jokes that we're arguably offensive to ideas I care about - and I know to some extent, he believes some of the concepts underlying the joke - yet I took it for what it was: a joke. The left continues its plunge into a humorless fascism of ideas, perversely mirroring films of the real fascism of the right. Yet the anti male, borderline racist sentiments your column expressed could be exhibit A if, God forbid, the masses don't vote your way this November.
24
"Men who scream 'snowflake' at rape victims ..."
Really? Please cite actual instances. Or does the PC canon now decree that a "rape victim" is anyone who who chooses to think of herself as a rape victim even if she just has a case of buyer's remorse?
In the feminist war against men, truth is the first casualty.
18
What's missing from the left leaning think pieces I've read on Ricky Gervais is that Caitlin Jenner killed someone and got away with it. The poor woman's death was treated like an minor annoyance in Jenner's ascendency to pop cultural relevance.
I think that grates on Gervais more than the fact that she's transgender.
As for the rest of his act, I agree it's time for him to drop the mockery of transgender people.
10
I just saw his very uncomfortable interview with the late Gary Schandling in Jud Apatow's HBO movie about Schandling. These two were so different. Gary was so human and evolved as a human and a comedian. He was rightly offended by the ivasive childish and brutish antics of Gervais. Gervais had gained entry to Schandling's home to "surprise" and truly violate the latter's domain. It was disgusting as this British thug of a so called comic happens to be. How sad we are left with this guy and Schandling is gone.
1
I loathe Ricky Gervais, and apologise on behalf of my country for inflicting him on you (ditto Piers “Morgan” Moron).
For most of his career he has affected that particularly invidious area of satire that claims to shine a light on prejudice, by being prejudiced in front of a baying audience who laugh along at his stereotypes. The argument is that he is not mocking the disabled or the mentally ill, rather he is mocking people who mock the...etc etc.
Yet he seems to not notice that the audience are not laughing at his witty satire, rather they are laughing at the stereotypes he is wheeling out, ‘Ho ho ho, disabled people, ho ho ho” etc.
For another good example, look up Al Murray’s The Pub Landlord, where he makes fun of little Englanders in front of an audience of little Englanders laughing at jokes about the French and missing the point completely. Except Murray out of character is actually an intelligent man, whereas Gervais is the type of man who hides behind a bully, laughing at the victim.
4
I saw Gervais' Netflix show and thought it was one of the funniest things I've seen since Richard Pryor's off-color rants from the 1970s. To cite Steve Martin: Comedy is not pretty. It requires a target. Lighten up. Not everything is the Mueller investigation.
235
Sorry Linda, cosmopolitan NYT writers aren't the people who decide whether jokes "work." That would be the audience. If you find a comic's material unacceptable, on incompatible with your enlightened and modern worldview, then you can say you didn't find it funny. But you don't get to condemn his fans as luddites, or somehow laughing at jokes that "don't work."
There are plenty of unfunny subject matters that comedians use for their lampooning. Male comic: are women crazy or what? Woman comic: are men stupid or what? White comic: I'm hungrier than an Ethiopian! George Carlin has a joke about Daffy Duck raping Elmer Fudd. Unless you simply believe that no such subject should ever be joked about because of the effect it has on the perpetuation of bad ideas, then you're simply cherry picking the topic du jour to win righteousness points.
Funny enough, the world has in fact evolved over the years, and lots of negative ideas have been purged from the American public, despite the endless stream of dirty, filthy, hilarious comedy.
468
Sorry, Rick. But you've got it completely backwards. Linda DOES have the right to say anything she chooses about this guy's "comedy" AND the people who are his fans, whether she writes for the NY Times or not.
Or would you try to argue that somehow her opinions of Ricky's "fan base" should be censored or modified because they are "too politically correct" or that they might hurt the feelings of his most devoted fans?
10
He probably knows that Linda has that right. That doesn't mean that it would be wise for her to expect to be taken seriously if she exercises it.
3
Spot on, Lindy West, thank you. I think people like Gervais who bleat on and on about their abhorrence of PC know that this theme song plays well to the latest generation of mad men -- the redditors, pornhubbers, gamers, and erstwhile fans of Milo. The worst part of this wholly manufactured issue is that it divides the left. When anyone on the left calls out Gervais-type crowds for racist or misogynist speech, they immediately howl about censorship and lefty free-speech absolutists hurtle to their defense.
6
I am an unabashed leftist, and a fan of Gervais's although sometimes he makes me cringe. I certainly found some of the humor in this special a bit crass, particularly the chimpanzee bit. That said, Ms. West makes a number of logical missteps here. One, what does fascination with biological evolution have to do with intellectual evolution? those are two completely different things, for reasons so obvious I'm not even going to explicate them. It is not puzzling that one would be interested in one and not the other. Two, Ricky Gervais was not using this platform to show that he does not care about what his critics say. Rather, he was using this platform to explain the role that offending others plays in humor--a role that is in fact sometimes valuable, because it sparks debate and forces us to look at our prejudices and knee-jerk reactions. Also, he was explaining why a lot of people, particularly on the left, wrongly get offended about jokes that are actually crass ways of taking their side. I have to say, I think Ms. West really missed the mark in this piece, although I did appreciate the end, which marks a departure from many on the left and I think is a much better approach than demonizing those who are mostly on our side but occasionally say something a bit wrongheaded.
22
Your typically hysterical response to Gervais' brilliant Netflix special makes me even more respectful of his talent and willingness to go to the places that have now become mined because of all the "intellectually evolved" censors littering cultural discourse everywhere. After reading your smorgasbord of false equivalencies, I'm tempted to watch (and enjoy) "Humanity" one more time.
108
Just on the cis women not being "comfortable", there's a reason for that. Many women are homeless or in shelters because of male violence. It's not the time to ask them to be tolerant, and insist that they share bedrooms, bathrooms or other intimate spaces with biological males.
95
To figure this one out, I need evidence of transwomen sexually assaulting or harassing straight women in shelters. Someone who works so hard, at such huge cost, to be perceived as female seems like the last person to bother other women. But what I think sounds logical may not be how it looks on the ground. "55 percent report being harassed by homeless shelter residents and staff, and 29 percent have been turned away from shelters for being trans..." according to the organization cited in this article. Why are transwomen turned away and why do shelter staff harass them?
7
Thank you, Fenella, for speaking out about the true "international emergency," which is male violence against women.
19
You asked for evidence of transwomen sexually assaulting or harassing straight women in shelters. This Washington Post article isn't about shelters, specifically, but assaults by transwomen in women's spaces, generally. I hope it helps clear up the common lie that this doesn't happen. When it does, these people sue to get into women's prisons, the women in which, statistically, are likely victims of male predation, and are especially vulnerable in prison.
1
For me, Gervais is not funny. Can anything worse be said of a person making their living as a comic?
7
Well, no, but since he is doing fine with millions of fans and making a great living, I think Gervais will be okay.
10
I don't think he's funny either. He's just mean and crude. The beautiful thing is, we can choose not to watch him!
1
Gervais is right. Moralism breeds fascism. Collectivism suffocates freedom. Bravo, Netflix for standing up against censorship. The author that is keen to make everything fits her agenda is oblivious about the fact that the generation that she eagerly criticizes is the one that made the ever more tolerant western civilization possible. The work is not over, but we keep evolving. And freedom of speech is a necessary condition for that. More Isiah Berlin , Karl Poper for NYT readers, please....
20
He's not doing anything different from what he did on "The Office"!
He's playing a character.
This style of comedy can bring awareness to our prejudices! Of course, the haters are "gonna hate". He's not going to make anyone a hater.
But how does his comedy resonate with the rest of us?
I cringed at a scene in The Office where the Gervais character, referring to a co-worker of (maybe, I don't recall) East Asian extraction, said "Oh, you're the other one."
By which he meant "the other Asian guy"! SO OFFENSIVE, right?
But it made me consider how many times I myself had been treated like that. I'm a despised minority where I work, and people call me by the name of the only other person in the office who resembles me. I cringed at that The Office moment, but it made me SO much more careful about making that mistake about others, even in my thoughts.
11
When my son was in preschool, other parents repeatedly called him by the name of the only other Hispanic boy in the school. My son LOVES The Office precisely because it calls out people's foul and tiny minds and self-esteem preserving behaviors.
5
"There's nothing you shouldn't joke about. People get offended when they There's the difference between the target of a joke and the subject of a joke." - Ricky Gervais
a"There's nothing you shouldn't joke about. There's no subject you shouldn't joke about. It depends on the actual joke and the target, and people get offended when they mistake the subject of a joke with the actual target, and they're not necessarily the same. Some people are offended? Fine. Just because you're offended, it doesn't mean you're right. Some people are offended by equality. Your President---he's offended by equality. It doesn't mean he's right." - Ricky Gervais, the Late Show w/Stephen Colbert, January 17, 2018 (Verbatim. Clip on YouTube)
"I suppose if we couldn't laugh at things that don't make sense we couldn't react to a lot of life." - Hobbes, Calvin & Hobbes, Bill Watterson
"There are big problems in the world right now. Don't we have better things to worry about than a guy telling jokes that have absolutely no impact on our lives? Can't we just laugh at stuff anymore?" - Me
8
Bravo! Keep bringing the message: The Trump/Brexit era is a white man declaring the world to be in decline the moment he stops understanding it. True. Bigly.
4
It's interesting to me how people interpret pieces like this. It seems like readers see Lindy West set up against Ricky Gervais, and quickly pick a side, then just freestyle from there. I can't tell if they're purposefully ignoring the point of the article, or if they truly don't realize that they've missed it. Nowhere in the article does West recommend that Gervais should be silenced. She doesn't recommend that Twitter deactivate him, or that Netflix drop him. No one is saying, "Don't talk anymore, you might offend someone." I hear people like West saying things to effect of, "The world is changing, what used to be OK isn't always OK now. We are hearing new voices who couldn't speak up before, so let's be receptive to their critique." I would love to see more conservative-minded folks able to absorb this sentiment, without immediately becoming defensive. When someone tells you he/she is offended by your words, it doesn't mean that person hates free speech and wants you silenced. Additionally, if you pause and concede that the person may have a point, you're not automatically a bad person for what you said. A call-out is a signal to be a little self reflective, and consider that the other person may have a point you hadn't considered before. Generally, people with healthy self esteem can understand this- "Oops, I said something that might be offensive, but I'm an OK person, so I don't have to lash out and attack this other person to preserve my own sense of self-worth."
36
best response here. I love your description of how people take a side (when they don't need to) and then charge off in that direction (freestyle is a great way to name that!)
5
"I can't tell if they're purposefully ignoring the point of the article, or if they truly don't realize that they've missed it." That's exactly what people are saying about the author of the article, Liz. Have you seen the Netflix special in question? Because it seems as if you just 'picked a side and started freestyling'.
3
What Ms. West leaves out is the national emergency of these very same enlightened young people having epidemic levels of anxiety and depression. Surely there is a link between the attitude that every unhappy group has been wronged by society and thus deserves special protection and the lack of self worth evident in those who are increasingly losing their sense of self determination...
12
He's not that influential. He tells jokes. That means providing a little perspective, saying things for us we would not, reminding us the taboos are there. The major theme was Gervais' aging: the very difficulty evolving Lindy West condemns. He depicts himself as a chimpanzee shambling along hand-in-hand with his human woman.
I didn't like the stuff about Caitlyn Jenner either. It was way too much for my taste, but it will not harm trans people. It connects who there are to who they were, which is humanizing, not demonizing, and will endanger no one. In a normal social setting it isn't done. In a show we know going in is to be irreverent comedy, the rules are different. This was a suitable forum for resolving the dissonance of C. Jenner and the man on the Wheaties box. It exists.
Lindy West generally does gratifying, mind-saving work. This was worth either much less of her time, or more of it.
10
Ricky Gervais is brilliant!
111
Gervais's truly a Treasure -- one whom I hope we
never hafta bury. Thank you for co-opting (and revolutionizing) TeeVee, Sir Ricky! (too soon?) (Too bad.)
3
No, he isn't. See, you exercised your right of free speech and so did I. This is how it's supposed to work.
5
Context is key.It is the issue with this piece .The author lives in a bubble which may have moved on and therefore assumes culture has moved on too ,at the same rate and to the same degree.It has not.There is a very good reason for Gervais's popularity with millions of people around the world, including many Americans.He articulates what many think or observe.I watched "Humanity".He discussed Jenner in the context of the Golden Globes, having been attacked following his hosting of the show for "dead naming" Jenner by referring to the 58 years when he called himself Bruce.I learnt a new phrase,I am certain most readers will too.This is a perfect example of how some of us overreach and elicit a backlash to the detriment of the cause we wish to support.Advocating free speech unless we disagree or are offended ,in which case we need a safe place as a refuge.Or seeing every behavior as a potential"micro-aggression",another term most Americans remain unfamiliar with.Or conflating equality with sameness when it comes to the sexes.Change takes time and is held back by extremism at both ends.If you want to save animals, encourage people not to eat meat once a week, do not try to force more converts to vegetarianism.If you want to fight misogyny, acknowledge the role of women in objectifying themselves.If you want to support the LGBT community, do not go after 'dead naming" and bathrooms and if you want to get rid of Trump, do not conflate legal and illegal immigration.
15
I watched Humanity. Gervais is irreverent and entertaining. That's his bit. He wants to shock you. I'd rather listen to Gervais weigh in on the thinking behind his comedy than Ms. West, who rambles too much in her piece. Maybe she can contact Gervais and he can punch up her copy.
82
Ms West is very very funny. Did you read her book (title in the author bio)?
2
That he offends Lindsey West is an excellent sign he is doing outstanding work.
287
Haha. Except then I thought, but she is so easy to offend.
11
What about Lindy West, since she's the author?
5
Bravo to Ricky Gervais for refusing to water-down his comedy because of the demands of those like Ms. West who demand political correctness in everything, even comedy. She doesn't want "intellectual evolution"; she wants a world devoid of any ideas that threaten her. She mentions the movements - like BLM, or the women's march - that are particularly close to her heart as ones that should be 'off limits' to comedy. But I would suppose she would not object if comedians made fun of right-centered movements, like pro-life or pro-2nd Amendment movements. That's the problem with people like Ms. West wanting to decide for the rest of us who is proper target of a joke.
329
Guess what? There is nuance here. Is it non-"PC" to make jokes about "retards"? Why yes, it is. Does our society become lessened by an acceptance that jokes about "retards" are okay? Yes, again.
If your jokes are about those who don't fit in, and your target audience is basically those who do, then, well, so much for your courageous honesty as a comedian. Yeah, not so much.
6
"The Trump/Brexit era is a rich, famous, white, middle-aged man declaring the world to be in decline the moment he stops understanding it." You couldn't have put it better. All the hand-wringing, the sturm und drang, & from those who have the catbird seat is irritating (to say the least).
I'm around Gervais's age, but my job means I spend my professional day with teens and young adults. Some things are terrible right now, but that's always been true. Old Grumpy-Pants can have his latest special. The best show on earth is always the next generation.
7
You know you're in the throws of a power-grab when the word "cisgender" gets thrown into a conversation. An English word that dates only from the 1990s, it clearly seeks to place those NOT "cisgender" on an equal level with those who are, in an attempt to elevate a distinct class with its own interests from the rest of humanity and ITS interests. It’s so much more credible when attacking people to give them a label, which allows the attacker to avoid calling them “normal”.
I support people being who they are; and most efforts related to doing that don't bother me; but I do find entertaining this artifice of games employed by those who invent language to project power.
I have some sympathy for what Gervais, a VERY intelligent and nuanced guy, seeks to communicate with his often-outrageous commentary. It's not easy to be black in America, it's not easy to be Rohingya in Myanmar or Uyghur in China -- or conservative on Manhattan's Upper West Side. This mainly has to do with the human trait of suspicion of those who are rare in a population (although African Americans, at just over 12% of the population, and Hispanic Americans, at about 17%, might more credibly be outraged at their exclusion since they’re hardly “rare”). But trans individuals, as per the latest estimate, represent about 0.58% of the population.
Hence the artful use of language in a power game to elevate the profile of less than two million people otherwise invisible in a population of over 320 million.
34
Richard Luettgen, you write, "You know you're in the throws of a power-grab when the word 'cisgender' gets thrown into a conversation. An English word that dates only from the 1990s, it clearly seeks to place those NOT 'cisgender' on an equal level with those who are, in an attempt to elevate a distinct class with its own interests from the rest of humanity and ITS interests. It’s so much more credible when attacking people to give them a label, which allows the attacker to avoid calling them 'normal'."
I AM equal to you. We have the same rights. We both have bodily autonomy. We both have the right to seek treatment for any medical conditions we might have. I have a condition called gender dysphoria. This condition is treatable, and I want to treat it.
There is only one known effective treatment for gender dysphoria, and that is transition. Many people, including Ricky Gervais, find that treatment worthy of ridicule. We are mocked by comedians, banned from the military, and excluded from work and housing. These are the costs we face for simply wanting to treat our condition.
I have both the right to heal myself and the right to participate in society as your equal. I shouldn't have to choose one or the other. That I am able to exercise my rights, instead of suffering in silence, or living on the edge of society, is neither a power-grab nor an attack. It is simply our world, and our language, evolving past the societal norms that have held so many of us back.
9
The world changes. What I've seen in the last 60 years boggles the mind. And the pace is accelerating. Adapt, change, or die. Or even worst for a comic, become obsoleted and get left behind.
5
So coincidental this piece this morning - last night, my wife and I were surfing Netflix and happened upon this Ricky show. Didn't even start it - we looked at each other said in unison, "he's just not funny anymore - he's mean" - I agree Lindy, and think he's got some issues to evolve as well.
7
My simple test for humor: Are you punching down? Speaking truth to power is braver and funnier because it's dangerous. Picking on the weak or disadvantaged is best left to Trump and his bully brigade. I hope Ricky comes to understand because, at his best, he is wickedly funny. He should just try not to overdo the wicked.
9
the point RG is trying to make, which u seem and Lindy West seem to miss, is that we lose freedom when we give others the power to determine what jokes we tell, and, that jokes are not the equivalent of propositions but you are treating them as if they are. That category mistake leads to a kind of totalitarianism, and not to a more woke society. Telling him not to overdo it misses the point completely; he is there to overdo it, and its not wrong to do so if you like it or not, whether he is punching down or not. The last America I want to live in is one where you get to decide on what jokes I tell.
12
Lindy -
I will only speak for myself - but what I find scary about many of the current movements is the open, accepted and, indeed, encouraged hostility towards and discrimination against white men. Since the Jim Crow era, polite people have at least tried to hide their prejudices. But, at least with respect to white men, that is no longer necessary. Instead, it is perfectly acceptable to criticize someone as being just another "white guy" whose opinion should be discounted, to openly state that you are not going to hire any more white men for a particular job, to say that the board of directors must include at least X# of people who are anything except a white man, etc.
I have no problem competing against individuals based on merit. I also have no problem directing public resources to under-served schools and communities to try to level the playing field. But I have a major problem with the government, companies, and individuals making decisions based on race and gender.
Discrimination based on race and gender is - and should be - illegal, regardless of your "good" intentions.
26
"Giggling at the “weirdness” of trans people — presenting your spasms of discomfort as something relatable — makes it harder for trans people to find a safe place to sleep."
Is there a way you can really support this idea with evidence? I don't think it's a Ricky Gervais special that makes Ben Carson prejudice against homeless transgender people. I think it's Christianity (or his interpretation of it). I think we need to take more seriously the identification of factors that produce the conditions that we want to (and should) change, and take more seriously the burden of proof for making these kinds of arguments.
8
Is Ms West threatening to kill while men whose politics are ten seconds behind her? Reason will not die and shrill emotionalism (its an international emergency) will always annoy it.
4
There are two different types of people in this this world. People who speak more than they think and vice versa. The people who don't predominantly think are simply not self-aware. If this person isn't sensitive or in possession of a degenerative imagination they can only become narcissistic, and consequently, indifferent to their fellow human beings. The root of comedy lies in understanding tragedy and its effects on us. Quite simply, it's emotional intelligence. Anything in comedy unrelated to that is an ego trip fueled by tickling strangers.
Gervais is not against trans gender people. In fact, he's saying if they are treated just as equal as the rest of us, we can poke fun at them just as we poke fun at anyone. We shouldn't need to be super careful. The fact that we do means that they are not yet as equal.
22
To state the obvious: when something is funny, you laugh. We usually laugh when a comedian has the wit and courage to lampoon a fear or uncomfortable truth. The Caitlyn Jenner jokes; not so funny to me. So I change the channel.
2
I feel this analysis is vastly off the mark.
I think the entire subject of this particular special was to take issue with the author's brand of "evolving." I think Gervais argues (quite compellingly) that taking jokes/satire and transmogrifying them into hate speech/phobias is not exactly societal and linguistic "evolution."
To quote him, "People confuse the subject of the joke with the target of the joke, and they're very rarely the same."
We obviously need to become more welcoming/inclusive/open as a society, but punishing people with societal exile for thoughtcrimes is not the way to do it.
67
"It’s baffling that Gervais can have so much reverence for physical evolution and so little for intellectual evolution"
He has different values than you. That does not make him less "intellectually evolved". When you refer to transphobia as an "international emergency" that is your own opinion and nothing more. Those who don't feel that way are not lower on the evolutionary tree than you.
511
Counterpoint: yes it does, and yes they are.
23
I’m confused. The writer is attempting to save Mr Gervais’s career AND point out a general lack of caring and respect for transgender people AND rebut the media coverage of both.
There are many people and issues that use the media (TV Twitter etc) to advance their agendas. I have limited time and, frankly, interest in some of these so I am choosing the ones that affect me most. This does not qualify. But you and everyone else are welcome to choose.
2
Ricky Gervais' Netflx show was brilliant and funny. When you make claims that transphobia is "a continuing international emergency" somehow exacerbated by Mr. Gervais, you provide him with all the fuel his comedy needs.
One of the funniest parts was an aside, when Gervais pointed out how interesting it was to be criticized ("deadnaming") for referring to the fact that yes, Bruce Jenner was a big strong man for 58 years. We don't care that Bruce Jenner changed his gender to female and his name to Caitlyn. Whatever she wants, live and let live.
It is just very funny to be scolded at for mentioning this. It makes us laugh, like a naked Emperor might. The Emperor can choose to wear, not wear, whatever he wishes. The funny part is being asked to ignore it.
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Caitlyn Jenner didn’t “choose” to become female; she was a female her entire life. It just took her until the age of 58 to honor who she truly is by transitioning. Homophobes make the same mistake when they suggest gays choose their lifestyle because to acknowledge they were born that way would require them, according to the tenets of their religion (usually), to accept that gays were made in the image and likeness of God, like themselves.
5
I am as liberal as they come, but I, like you, see the emperor without his clothes. To pretend that Ms. Jenner has always been Ms. Jenner is a bizarre backbend to erase the Olympic successes that Ms. Jenner had back when she was Mr. Jenner. I have no qualms with the way anybody lives, and I will happily refer to her as Ms. Jenner, as she is now. But to ask me to pretend to have forgotten the first 50 years of this person's life is surreal.
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If Caitlyn was a female her entire life, what she transition from?
2
I haven't seen Gervais' special but I tend to give him a pass. He won me over long ago with his willingness to freely fly his atheism flag and his irreverence for hollywood's self-congratulatory form of righteousness. I don't know him personally, so can't say what's in his head or heart, but if he's a little unenlightened on this topic, I'm willing to show some tolerance in honor of his past works, which I almost always found clever and enlightened. He may not be doing LGBT folks any favors with his comments but I'm not sure he has a responsibility to adjust his art to meet others' expectations of cultural evolution.
At the same time, Lindy West has once again expressed her opinion as articulately and thoughtful as ever. I just think I disagree with her to some degree on this one.
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West is among the most lucid and relevant commentators in society today. Her laser insights are helping refocus public discourse on gender issues. The platform she's been provided means she can expose, challenge, and heighten these incredibly important topics.
"It is frightening, I assume, when you are accustomed to being not just a voice of authority in your field but the archetype of authority in your civilization, to be challenged and feel those challenges stick."
The Netflix special should be called, "Ricky Gervais: Scared"
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He hasn't been challenged with any good arguments, and that's because there really aren't any. You can't just claim someone is being proven wrong, and that they are scared. You have to give an example. Ricky is just laughing at how sensitive everyone is, and then you get triggered and he laughs, and you get triggered and he laughs, and then you claim he's scared. No.
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Comedians reflect the culture in which they grew up, as well as their experiences as a child and adolescent. Most comedians are painfully hurt people whom are trying to exorcise the demons in their past.
The power of the humor of Ricky Gervais, like that of many comics, comes from bewilderment and confusion. To me comics most reveal their inner pain whenever they make statements that seem to be lacking compassion for others.
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What a fabulous and thoughtful article. I appreciate Ms. West’s comments about how Ricky Gervais’s perspective is a common one. It is time for men who have experienced privilege to understand that the world is changing, and they need to be open to learning about other perspectives. This doesn’t mean compromising free speech, and indeed, a robust conversation is essential for all of us to learn from each other. But free speech needs to be accompanied by true listening, and that seems to be lacking from far too many people in these times.
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It was one of the worst articles I've ever seen on the front page. She lies about his character. Her title is completely misleading. He doesn't care who he offends, he'll offend anybody. She on the other hand has a bone to pick with his transgender bit. A very specific part of the act, so she cares, not him. Ricky isn't one of the ignorant privileged, he's one of the educated privileged. He also worked for his position. He's pro conversation, his critics are not. His critics do not listen to him. He would agree with you that not enough people are just listening and staying calm, but he would point out that this author is actually one of those people who is refusing to be intellectually honest.
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Well said, Jon. Hear, hear.
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Based on what I've heard various comedians say, comedians feel they are under pressure to be PC, and don't want to be. Their role, they say, is to hold up a mirror to society, and amplify back. Cho, Chappelle, Rock, and other comedians all talk about this. I happen to agree. t's important. If you don't let them talk--and you don't have to listen to them, aren't you denying them 1st Amendment rights and also negating voices important in a democratic discussion on any issue?
I watched Gervais' latest special as I've been a long time fan. The truth is, I didn't like most of it, not because it wasn't 'appropriate', but because it wasn't funny to me. Some of the material, like the Jenner bits, were just really, really old.
I've heard comedians like Dave Chappelle discuss race and not found that terribly funny either, but more because it made me think. Think out our society and my views and my role with that. That's a good thing, in my opinion.
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We cannot have free speech, or anything remotely like it, if we need to constantly be on pins and needles about what might offend someone else. Are we telepaths, then, who ought to know that you're recently divorced and therefore bad-marriage jokes might offend, or just had a miscarriage and so merely discussing maternal bliss will hurt? In general, the management of your feelings is entirely your responsibility. The brave new world that West appears to want is hostage to everyone's feelings. How can we speak seriously (or comically) about anything substantial--normalizing relations with Cuba, gender dysphoria, women in technology, men in nursing, the role of the State, etc etc etc etc--without offending somebody out there? If you don't like Gervais's Netflix special, it's up to you to watch something else, or switch off the tv and go for a walk.
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Dan D: We do have free speech, and Ms. Lindy West is engaged in a classic use of it -- namely the persuasive argument, hers based upon decency and humanity. Critique is far from destructive of free speech; critique is essential to it. Mr. Dan D, I read Ms. West's article with great interest, and find nothing in it that restricts the expressive rights of Mr. Gervais whatsoever. Indeed, Mr. Gervais might find much in Ms. West's critique to be constructive.
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Free speech is about the governments lack of ability to punish me for what I say.
This has nothing to do with what we are talking about here.
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The point, Dan, is that Gervais's boorishness can cause people who lack compassion and sensitivity even more than you do to harm transgender women. That is the sort of free speech that is like yelling fire in the proverbial crowded theater. There is a wide magnitude of difference between that and disagreeing about international relations or general topics not related to specific individuals like women in technology, etc. (etc.).
13
I found Gervais' most recent stand-up uncomfortable for many reasons but not for the reasons stated here. He certainly beat the Caitlyn Jenner joke to death but if you'll recall, he did actually make his point at one moment. Caitlyn Jenner was at one point in fact a man. This is objective truth. Scientifically determined and inarguably irrefutable despite any later gender metamorphosis. Gervais was perhaps crude and insensitive but he is correct.
We can recognize Caitlyn Jenner as a woman now. However, talking passed her former life is denying reality. This is a slippery slope to slide given our current political circumstance. If the trans-gender community has the right to deny objective truth, what right does anyone have to criticize climate change deniers or creationist theories of evolution? Restricting reality is a devil's bargain that we'll all lose.
Speaking of evolution, I find it odd that Lindy West would use this aspect of Gervais' interests to debase his comedy. His stand-up spent a lengthy amount of time describing the reasons he was unfit to procreate. He had already used evolution to debase himself. This is a point worth considering before dismissing the man to the ash heap of comedy. He is sometimes outrageous and offensive but the man is obviously painfully self-aware.
I imagine Gervais feels comfortable joking about transgender people because he closets his own insecurities in public.
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The "trans-gender community" (n.b., no hyphen needed!) of which you speak is not "denying objective truth", as you put it. The journey that trans people experience is explicit in the adjective "trans" which they use to describe themselves: it expresses a transition between two states of being. I don't know any trans people who deny (or even want to deny) the totality of their experience, which includes transitioning from one gender to another.
You and Gervais seem to be missing the point that harping on a trans person's former identity is not some kind of noble, funny, or necessary reminder of some sort of objective truth. It's emphasizing a former truth that is no longer valid.
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There is no such thing as "former truth".
3
"Jenner was at one point in fact a man. This is objective truth."
Doesn't a statement like this deny the reality of transgender individuals? Maybe there's actually a gender spectrum (as we now understand about sexuality) but the 'objective truth' you cite hasn't caught up yet in terms of quantifying that. In other words we just don't know enough yet about the subtleties of biology, genetics and endocrinology to explain the variety that exist among human beings.
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I have been surprised and baffled by the fact that so many ostensibly liberal or educated people, like Gervais, are fixated on the fetish of supposed left-wing censorship.
It's true that some young people can be overzealous. But why have a relatively few number of incidents been portrayed as a calamitous danger (after all, these are mostly debt-ridden students with little social power)? Especially when critics are almost always silent on the far more consequential silencing of dissent by powerful conservatives (university trustees, legislatures, donors)?
West offers a persuasive explanation.
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While I do agree that Gervais is taking it over the top and just saying these things for attention, there absolutely is a silencing of non liberal view points, just not to the extreme Gervais says. The majority of University Campuses routinely attempt to shut down conservative speakers. The majority of major news outlets(name one besides fox),magazines, and newspapers push for the liberal agenda regarding gun control and keep pushing forward common myths such as the wage gap or vilify police who killed in self defense
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The wage gap is a "myth"? And--as the poster implies--all police kill in "self defense"? The rest of the post simply repeats the myth that all liberals have an agenda (as if all conservatives don't). If there is a "silencing of non-liberal new points", why are the majority of Congresspersons so vehemently non-liberal?
13
please elaborate on the, "far more consequential silencing of dissent by powerful conservatives (university trustees, legislatures, donors)" because i am pretty sure you are full of it
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