As a transplant from Trump country, my observation is that CA is actually the "normal" America. At its best, America has been about working towards a better future. Californians drive a dynamic economy, welcome change and embrace immigration. When I'm here in CA, I feel promise that tomorrow will be better than today. When I go back to the so-called "real" America for business or family get-togethers, I'm blown away by the negative, blame-shifting attitudes that I consider very un-American.
41
From the party that believes in science:
"allowed parents to withhold gender on birth certificates" - By the way, there's no "gender" on the certificate, only "sex". Why not to be honest even about this? So, how many biological sexes are there for human species? Or is it possible now not to see a sex of a newborn? Or it simply that now we, as great scientists, discovered a new definition of human biological sex?
11
Hold it, hold it...... exhale. Smile and shift.
3
"...the ideologies and values at issue were reversed, as Democrat Southerners, under the banner of states’ rights, fought violently to uphold white supremacy."
There.
Fixed it for ya.
6
California is, and has been for a while, the index that best predicts the future of the USA.
Go California.
Down with trump, sessions, pruitt, zinke and their ilk.
22
In many ways California is progressive. I've been in the workforce since 1999 and most of my supervisors have been minorities and the majority of those were women. It's a great place to be around a lot of different types of people as love being outdoors... but it stops there.
Outside of tech and teaching, most jobs pay below the national average but with 2 and 3 times the cost of living.
My wife is a legal immigrant and it baffles us that the US takes in almost 1 million new immigrants a year, but somehow people in California feel that anyone is entitled to immigrate here. As an American, it's far more difficult to immigrate to another country than for others to immigrate here.
I'm independent, but the Democrats have ensured their long term domination by enabling illegal immigration, which in turn causes most Latinos to vote blue as most Latinos have empathy or at least enough that swings the state. 18,000,000 Latinos and if even only half of them voted, at 79% voting for Clinton, they account for the entire disparity between Trump and Clinton.
The Democrats have turned insane. Two registration increases in less than 8 months and a $.12 gas tax that increases to $.20 in 2019. Around $250M is spend subsidizing the tuition of illegal immigrants in the state.
Illegal immigrants under 19 get free healthcare. Illegal immigrants work on stolen or made up SSN's.... want to live in a home? you need to make $100k a year in the inland areas and $200k+ to live in LA, OC, or SD
15
4th gen. Californian. We have been a huge economic power since Jas. K. Polk was president. America, you are welcome; we are the bootstraps on which you tug.
20
“Conservative Southerners” resisted integration and civil rights in the 50’s and 60’s??
The South was a Democrat bastion in those days and white supremacist fascists like George Wallace, a Democrat, fought against integration, while condoning the existence of the Klan.
It was Southern Democrats who fought against civil rights to the very last gasp in congress, with Republicans struggling to pass the bills. LBJ got a sudden burst of realism and somehow got the credit for decades of GOP effort, quickly following up with welfare dependency legislation which he famously declared “will have those n——rs voting Democratic for 200 years!” (His words, not mine)
Looking for the source of damage to the social fabric? Thank a Democrat!
Taxes for all should be lower, and any deduction which is a lifestyle choice should be eliminated - want to live in Silicon Valley? Pay the price, or commute the distance - employers will soon spread out to reduce the costs to their employees.
7
Team California!
3
How would a seceded California defend itself?
3
Lol. Making taxes charitable controbutions...that makes them voluntary. You cannot compell someone to make a charitable contribution. Good luck trying to collect...lol...haha!
7
If Goldman Sachs came up with a tax avoidance scheme so blatantly illegal for their rich 1% clients liberals would go nuts, but when the scheme applies to them they cheer. Hypocrites!
9
About a year ago the NYT wrote about California's high housing costs.* Coastal California's real estate values are so overpriced only the super wealthy can afford to live there. Somehow I doubt this is the intention of all that idealism. Reality has a way of slapping utopian dreamers in the face.
*******
*https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/15/us/california-today-housing-costs.html
6
California, Oregon, Washington and Hawaii should form a new republic.
10
Sessions did not say he was going after the marijuana industry, he merely lifted the prohibition on enforcing federal marijuana laws in states which had legalized its use, which was put in place by his predecessor. It is absurd to think that the Attorney General of the United States will publicly state which laws he chooses not to enforce. Sessions did the right thing. Now it is up to the discretion of US Attorneys to decide which cases in their jurisdiction merit investigation. Given the number of truly serious and harmful crimes, I doubt many, if any, US Attorneys choose to prosecute the local "head shop."
3
Given that unpatriotic Californians think it’s their right to dodge taxes, it’s wise and prudent for the IRS to audit every California return. IRS funding should also be increased
4
California and other Blue states, together with justice-loving and enlightened people in Red states should not just wait for elections. They should fight and resist Trump and the Republican Party’s anti-democratic, anti-environment, irrational, anti-science and racist policies every day.
5
Since when is this California vs Trump? THIS IS CALIFORNIA VS AMERICA (and it has been for a very long time!)
10
I wonder how many Californians will decide not to donate to their favorite charity, i.e., the State. After all, charitable contributions are voluntary. I’m sure there will be unintended consequences, something the Left always fails to predict.
8
Let's please quit talking about left and right. We need a big fat dose of what is reasonable for current times. I am voting for what makes sense....rather who makes sense. I am voting for thinkers and decency. As far as the pot issue goes; Sessions, leave it alone; you make no sense.
6
The U.S. Census Bureau now publishes an annual poverty report titled the Supplemental Poverty Measure that takes regional cost of living into account. The most recent report shows that 16 percent of Americans lived below poverty level, but despite its large economy, California is by far the poorest state with 23.8% of its residents subsisting below poverty level. The 10 poorest states and the percentage of their residents living below poverty level are:
1. California: 23.8%
2. Nevada: 19.8%
3. Florida: 19.5%
4. Arizona 18.8%
5. Louisiana: 18.5%
6. Georgia: 18.2%
7. New York: 18.1%
8. Hawaii: 17.3%
9. Arkansas: 16.5%
10. Tennessee: 16.5%
The number are from Table 4 (Number and Percentage of People in Poverty by State Using 3-Year Averages) on page 13 of the Census Bureau report at https://www.census.gov/prod/2013pubs/p60-247.pdf
15
After, my home state, beautiful California is my favorite state. I once planned to live in San Diego, but the problems of living in California have cancelled that dream. High taxes, lack of affordable housing, overcrowded schools and hospitals due to high illegal immigration and sanctuary cities, constant traffic on highways due to overcrowding. Just like in NY.
The wealthy in CA live in gated communities and don't have to deal with any of this. These liberal celebrity hypocrites lecture to the rest of us from their mansions, tennis courts, pools and multi-millionaire lifestyles. They tell us how we should live, what we should think and what our opinions should be while they do as they please, contrary to what they preach. I hope 2017 is the year of the End of Celebrity Worship, but I doubt it.
In 2015, 34% of Cali's immigrants age 25 and older had not completed high school, compared with 8% of U.S. born Cali residents.
The middle class is leaving CA in droves. This is what happens when you welcome poor, uneducated, unskilled, non-English speaking illegal immigrants into this country, some who commit felons and other crimes. Eventually, the middle class gets tired of paying for all of this, especially when their wages haven't grown as they should have.
There are liberals, leftists and Antifa. And then there is the other half of the country.
11
I was born, grew up and was educated in California. It sadly has become the natural result of when leftism runs wild, like Venezuela. I won't go back or take my business back there.
Most folks in the non-nutty areas (outside of SF, an LA) are hard-working folks, but can no longer support the huge drain caused by illegal aliens, and oppressive taxes, overvalued houses, and lack of moral values.
Hard to believe, but most Californians don't want to sit around smoking dope and inventing the next bizarre and unnatural lifestyle (although many of those posted here).
Most don't think they are somehow more 'enlightened' than the other 49 states, most are not haters of American values like Hollywood.
But they must take back control of the state from the years of failed leftist politics, and no longer be held hostage to the oppressive taxes and failed government services. The loudest voices in California may be shrill and still the sore losers, but they don't represent the folks there that matter.
It's time for those folks to take the state back.
Will they??
13
One thing that the NYT failed to mention is that the state of California is BANRUPT. California is already at the beginning of a recession, just read some business journals. The rest of the country has no intention of bailing them out either. They made their bed now they can sleep in it. This is going to be fun to watch
9
Regarding one of your pictures with this article: Remember the outrage some years back when the right-wingers howled that Mr. Obama was "Not My President"?
So sad to see people who rightly condemned that attitude at the time... doing it themselves.
More and more these days I have reason recall the sage and clearly prescient words of Phil Ochs back in the 1960s: "Liberals are 10º to the left of center in good times but 10º to the right of center when it affects them personally."
https://emcphd.wordpress.com
13
Right-wingers NEVER behaved like this anti-Trump crowd. Today, the most vile things are openly said about our president. It's the worst it's ever been.
Trump critics have lowered the bar on political discourse and behavior, all the while believing it's only Trump who behaves this way. A bit too conveniently, they use Trump to justify their own vulgarity and nastiness.
13
Just to be clear about Trump. A wind farm three kilometers away from the coast adjacent to his golf course is a horror. All offshore drilling in the States is okay.
8
If people think cannabis should be legal, call your representative and get it removed from Schedule 1. It's a simple thing to do.
Complaining that the President is enforcing the law is ridiculous. If you don't like the law, get it changed.
5
Still a little leery of a state that voted for Arnold two times.
It's hard to hear them pontificate about a lying celebrity politician unless it's prefaced with an admission of guilt for past transgressions.
4
I like Mexican culture, I like Mexicans, in fact I love Mexicans. But in saying that and in understanding the Constitution, the words of John Adams and what makes a nation, I am left wondering what part of "illegal" liberals like Mr. Sturm and activist Mexicans do not understand. The war was over a long time ago, Aztlan, the mystical origin of the Aztec people is ironically chosen to represent the southwestern U.S. - the Aztecs lived nowhere near this area. Sure, Viva Mexico, but La Raza & MEChA are offensive, racist organizations and the U.S. is again asserting its sovereign rights. Get used to it. A long time ago, South Carolina began a secessionist movement. It didin't work out too well. Let's see who has the staying power, a bunch of grass-smoking, 'Moonbeam' fruits and nuts or patriotic Americans. Yes, I feel kind of sick as a U.S. citizen that most Americans don't seem to be patriotic and would turn our nation over to immigrants who share not the values of our founding.
12
Yes, CA is our frontier. Nobody should be able to deny freedom to people, nobody should be able to prevent adults from exercising their choices. Next should be battles for legalization polygamy and prostitution. Because no one can explain why same-sex marriage is ok, bur polygamous one is not. Why Uber drivers can make a living from use of their cars but people cannot make a living from themselves. But future is bright and victories are inevitable.
1
We the People are not that far apart ideologically. The media propagates lies and fabrications. I do not consider the leadership or lack of leadership on either side of the political club aisle, fellow citizens, as they began to sell We the People out in 1913, and I believe most of todays globalists are traitors like McCain, McConnell, Obama, Reid, Pelosi and many many others who should move to another part of the globe where they can more effectively do their so called important good work. The people of this country have since its inception been the most benevolent, giving and sacrificing society that has ever existed on the face of this planet we call earth and it sickens me to see what the media and our public serpents are doing to it. It's not just the Republicans, please open your eyes. They've played bad cop good cop for years. There are manny fake posters on the message boards. They are not really fellow U.S.Citizens and can easily be recognized by their one line insults that have nothing to do with debate and only to do with creating a hostile environment between so called liberals and so called conservatives who I prefer to call U.S.Citizens. Our differences are not that far apart but there are Globalist, Anarchist, and other forces in this country and outside of this country that would love to see our country collapse and that we also discard our Constitution and our freedoms protected under that document.
5
I agree with many that California should be allowed to secede. They are at a high level of civility than the US proper. Perhaps New England and Oregon Washington can join. What a lovely thought.
6
I don't see why "fellons" and "illegals" should be protected and given privileges. They have broken the law and there should be consequences. Just like you don't get away with robbing a bank or murdering someone or driving without a driver's license, you should not get away after entering a country without proper paperwork (visas), let alone be given privileges. It's unfair to the citizens and lawful internationals with legal statuses.
12
What other Americans are granted blanket amnesty from prosecution (aside from politicians, that is)? Just ask the incarcerated.
And before bankers are raised as an example, consider President Obama's Attorney General, Eric Holder, claimed he couldn't figure out how to prosecute them. His imagination failed him when it came to big Democratic donors.
5
Nixon, Reagan, 3 Strike Rule, Prop. 8, and a housing tax rule that has bankrupted public education...California is not as blue as it would seem.
1
The idea that local government officials who differ with this Trump stormtrooper should be arrested is emblematic of a police state. The way to settle the differences between Federal policy and State policy is in the Federal courts. Until there is an ultimate resolution on whether the Federal government can force State government to cooperate on the administrations hard line immigration policies Trump's stooge need to crawl back in the hole he came out of.
2
Something is rotten In the state of California. No one wants heavy handed federal intervention regarding legalized marijuana but there is no real threat. Drug laws are the province of the state; California is well within our Constitutional rights.
Legal marijuana has always been taxed but as a New Year’s gift to the people of San Francisco who use medical marijuana, local and state politicians increased the tax on weed from 4% to 23.5%. In other words, city and state politicians are now extorting an extra $20 of every $100 spent on legal marijuana. Happy 2018, everyone!
Now it makes sense why the state and local politicians try so hard to keep the focus on Jeff Sessions, the paper tiger with no power to touch CA marijuana laws. If they didn’t, there’s a good chance people would be paying closer attention to who is actually doing the stealing.
2
Under Obama, all states essentially became "sanctuaries." No federal crime, no detention. His immigration policies were unpopular and not just among republicans.
Californians believe they are "standing up" for something and to someone. This faux courage is particularly obvious when compared to real protest, as we're seeing in Iran. That's courage. Californians are just being, well, typical progressives.
10
Californians need to pay attention to the Trump show being staged at their expense. There will come a chance to fight back in November. Time to vote the Democratic ticket, because the Republicans have shown without a doubt their refusal to honor their oaths of office or put the United States ahead of partisan politics.
3
Federal law is supreme. It doesn't matter who the President is. States may not have to assist with the enforcement of federal law but they can't defy it.
California doesn't get to set its own immigration policy or preempt federal drug laws. People would be (and were) properly outraged if (when) similarly culturally distinctive but more conservative states started making noises about how they were going to defy the Federal government on various civil rights laws or gay rights or environmental orders.
California will lose in a confrontation with the Federal government. As well it should.
9
At at moment in history when I am utterly embarrased by what occupies the Office of the President, I am a proud to be a third generation Californian.
If Trumpler wants to say we are not a nation of immigrants, California with its wealth of resources, energy, and ideas will respond: Oh yes we are...always have been, always will be.
The time of Trumpler will pass...but America, a nation of immigrants will endure.
4
@jan: you fail to understand the difference between a legal immigrant and an illegal alien.
9
@Sherry Bebitch Jeffe of USC, "We are the frontier...beyond us there is nothing but ocean." Just want to say Aloha! From Hawaii!
4
How is forcing me to pay Californians’ taxes a states rights issue?
4
CA is taxing many of its citizens out of existence -- literally out of the state -- to support the illegal population. The open borders policy also enables criminals to enter the state, further putting citizens at risk. These are serious issues worthy of a "fight" and need to be addressed. To then lump weed into the mix of serious issues is beyond absurd and simply detracts from the serious issues. Trump is a genius? Well, OK Mr. Genius, do some research on how well legislation against alcohol worked during prohibition.
6
Maybe it's time to rethink the "united" part of "U.S.A.". Does California really need the other 49 states?
More broadly, should the "red" and the "blue" remain united? If, as is often mentioned, the "wealthy blue states" are propping up the "poor red states," why not save ourselves all these headaches and cut them off? Considering that a common refrain of the Right is the need to "stand on your own two feet," this would be a perfect "put up or shut up moment," but with a truly sublime permanence as the result.
2
do you really believe that blue states prop up red states? I tend to disagree. Take a corporation like Chase. Their main office is in New York and that means ALL transactions and profits that Chase makes throughout the entire country is taxed by New York and New York only. Now realize that most inter-state corp's are headquartered in blue states and there is the problem. If red states were allowed to tax the revenues made in their own state then the claim of who is supporting whom would be false
2
It is apparent that to avoid civil war something is going to have to be altered about your Federal election system. 1. Paper ballots like Canada. If a riding is too close there is a recount. If it is too close after that there is a judicial recount by a judge. 2. With population growth you add new members by a preset formula. Do not remove members from declining areas but add with growth. Probably your Senate should be expanded. 3. Eliminate your ELECTORAL COLLEGE which has given false results for 3 election resulting in the Iraq war which has destabilized the Middle East for all of history. The current one may do the same. The entire planet knows that the minute things start to look bad for the trump family of operatives it is highly likely he will start a war somewhere as it is obvious his enablers will not intervene. Their motto is: I'm all right Jack like a long ago British movie.
3
Last time I visited California, I stayed at a campground, because I like camping. The campground was not really a campground as most of us consider. It was a trailer park of old ratty RVs. Easily 80% of its occupants were full time occupants living off welfare payouts, all sharing a single short bed semi trailer for bathrooms and showers. I wanted to do some hiking, but that got put to rest real quick when I crested the first hill and found nothing but burnt out no longer existing forest for as far as the eye could see. My last trip to California was not a trip into diversity and innovation, it was a trip into poverty, despair and environmental devastation. The only real shopping was at a Walmart that was the trashiest Walmart I have ever seen, the restaurants were old and had not been updated in any way since the mid 70s. Southern California, was a sad place when I last visited three years ago.
7
I see the comments trolls are starting to trot out their fake “facts.” For the record:
CA does NOT receive 30% of welfare.
From 2017 report by the Tax Foundation https://taxfoundation.org/states-rely-most-federal-aid/
The top recipient of federal aid in FY 2014 was Mississippi, which relied on federal assistance for 40.9 percent of its revenue. Other states heavily reliant on federal assistance include Louisiana (40.1 percent), Tennessee (39.9 percent), Montana (39.1 percent), and Kentucky (38.5 percent). As we have previously noted, these states, and others that rely heavily on federal assistance, tend to have modest tax collections and a relatively large low-income population.
CA schools have steadily improved since their nadir under Gov Schwarzenegger and now rank about 50th percentile, thank you Jerry Brown.
CA runs a surplus every year, after years of red ink under republican governors, again thank you Jerry Brown.
CA has the highest cost of living and the most expensive real estate and housing shortages precisely because it is so desirable and so many people want to live here. Those grousing on this thread are welcome to pack up—about a zillion people want your apartment, so by all means, vacate.
7
It's not just California. Also distancing themselves from the dictates of the Federal Government are Washington and Oregon, with Idaho and Colorado a bit behind Nevada in following suit.
Yes, we're all aware of the millions of old white guys (full disclosure: I'm an old white guy) who desperately desire a return to the nation of their youth. (although their memories are curiously tainted by what they forget) but guess what?
Theirs is a shrinking demographic doomed to eventual irrelevance. There are far more of us who want our country to respect its own citizens, regardless of where they come from or what gender they claim or what religion they follow.
Either grow up, or grow old and die. Even America won't last forever. No nation ever has.
5
As political posturing,
California may be building popular "resistance" to Trump.
But, as a legal matter,
California is cruisin' for a bruisin'.
Federal law is supreme.
That was the bloody lesson of both the Civil War and the end of slavery in the 1860s
and the federal battle against Jim Crow in the Civil Rights era 100 years later.
It was also the lesson of the New Deal era on economic policy.
Immigration is clearly a matter of federal law.
California is wasting time, energy and money fighting Trump on immigration.
The federal income tax law is clearly a matter of federal law.
California will lose in the federal courts on its attempted end run.
On the environment, California would be foolish to waste its time, energy and money -- and those of its residents -- try to solve environmental hazards such as CO2 emissions which, by their nature, have effects that are far, far less localized than automotive emissions that caused smog in the 1950s. California might even rue the day it began its "resistance" to Trump if, for some reason, the federal government under Trump were to choose to pre-empt California state regulation of automotive emissions and repeal the exemption it granted to California 50 years ago to regulate automative emissions.
8
People want to blame the liberal policies for the California housing crisis. Fact is, California has been very prosperous and a ton of people want to live here because of what it has to offer. It has been a strain for housing infrastructure to absorb the influx of capitalist glory that seems to have cemented itself here since the advent of the internet in the late 90s. Here in in the Bay Area I see housing construction happening at a furious pace in many areas right now. Whether this will actually help or rather end up attracting more people remains to be seen.
3
I landed in San Francisco in 1980, bringing with me my Democrat liberal philosophy. I survived Pete Wilson, George Deukmejian, with their anti-immigrant, budget cutting agenda, and the "Arnold" for six years after the Democratic governor, Grey Davis was recalled.
Of course, CA has issues. Every state, as well as most people have issues. With a population pushing 40 million, we're like a rainbow; different colors, orientations, customs, and religions, and somehow we manage to get along fairly well.
CA will continue to be the leader in innovation, technology, we're working hard to make our public institutions better, and create a more equitable society. It's not easy, but we're trying.
5
Quite telling: the thought expressed by the student in San Diego to the effect that he was against the newer wall because he didn't want "Mexico" to think that said-wall was what America "was all about". No concern ever expressed about what benefits citizens of the U.S.A. That is why there is a chasm between opinions across parts of the country: one is of mostly-longtime residents, the other is of those parts filled with immigrants longing for the culture of the lands they abandoned.
4
If not for its incredible natural beauty and climate, California could not attract talent and survive. The entertainment industry built L.A.; the Navy made San Diego, the Central Valley dominates agriculture because of its climate, and Silicon Valley is the engine for all the wealth of N. Calif. It has not been state policies or any wisdom on the part of Calif, for example, that created Silicon Valley. The tech boom was mainly an off-shoot of Stanford, a private university. Berkeley deserves some of the credit, but it was mainly Stanford... its professors, grads, and its money... that created the environment which every nation in the world is trying to mimic. The point? Calif should be more humble about its success. This success was certainly not a product of govt policies, massive low skill immigration, govt subsidies to Tesla, a broken and bankrupting civil service system, etc.
10
With the Trump assault on states rights there is a real case building for massive civil disobedience in those marijuana legal states for now, with more states to follow in the future. When the federal government becomes the oppressor instead of the facilitator there may be no recourse but to draw a red line and mean it. Much of what the Trump administration is doing will undermine reasonable existing laws and policies and turn the country back in a 1950s mindset.
Already, some of the west coast states have joined with Canada in pursuing their own ideas of world trade in the globalization reality of the 4th industrial revolution. It is plain that more Trumpism is going to result in a situation where states must look after the interests of their citizens and after their own economies. There are not enough DOJ lawyers to make an impact in resisting states and civil disobedience has historical roots in America. Time to read Thoreau again and realize that Trump is the nightmare many did not see coming.
2
Actions like this will lead to Civil war. A Lawyers tongue lashing won't save you.
2
I’ve lived in the San Francisco Bay Area my whole life, so I don’t know what it’s like to live among people who aren’t mostly liberal. That said, in the days following the 2016 presidential election, my peers would jokingly throw around “Cal-exit”, referencing our huge relative economy and large population to make the argument we would be fine away from all the seemingly East coast-concentrated madness. However I would argue CA can serve much better as a leader in some aspects of social change if its residents have the mindset that we should help the country instead of leaving altogether.
3
California is the future. States rights' may be trumped by the Feds for the moment, but only for the moment. The only constant is change, and the next turn will be left.
4
This is the state of Reagan and Schwarzenegger. A sane conservative regime could easily lead the country without alienating California. 45, however, leads a minority fringe of self-interested radicals who can't even understand modern America, let alone represent it. During the Reagan era I read conservative authors for fresh insight. I don't even recognize the GOP now.
4
I do think it would be interesting if all these California Politicians
who are opposing enforcing Federal Laws were arrested and put
in Federal Detention over the weekend before making bail.
Then face fines for failing to follow the Law.
Then we will see what they truly believe.
6
The energy that we Americans spend on bickering with each other is energy that could be spent on tackling serious problems that we all face--no matter which state we call home.
That people still seek to come to the USA to escape persecution and poverty (as most of our ancestors did) is proof that we need to focus on the larger issue of global sustainability.
Air and water know no state and no nationality. If we turn on each other, we are all going to go down snarling and fighting.
If we work together to balance the eco-budget and use our astonishing brains to figure out how to improve conditions, then we have a chance at success.
United we stand. Divided we fall.
37
We welcome applications from the other 49. Must be bilingual and socially progressive
28
Only if "bilingual" means English plus one other
and the other one can be something other than Spanish.
So, not merely English plus Spanish.
Also,
English plus Chinese, OK.
English plus Russian, OK.
English plus Arabic, OK.
English plus French, OK.
English plus Hindi, OK.
English plus Japanese, OK.
English plus Portuguese, OK.
English plus Tagalog, OK.
English plus German, OK.
English plus Korean, OK.
English plus Indonesian, OK.
English plus Farsi, OK.
English plus Italian, OK.
etc.
Spanish and some other non-English only -- not OK.
1
Mr. trump - If you think you and your administration can intimidate Californians, you are greatly mistaken.
If you attempt to sell off our public lands and coastline to enrich your buddies, you will be met with very strong resistance.
35
And if you think America will pay your taxes you are greatly mistaken
3
living in California for 13 years has taught me that regardless of your level of education there is absolutely no guarantee of common sense e.g. in San Francisco being first on anything is the highest priority while a lack of proper garbage collection and homelessness aid go unresolved year after year
17
From the article, it seems that California is truly leading the way for America, as we play catch up to progressive thinking. However, I do believe that the way the state and federal government are handling it is quite childish. California legalizes pot, federal government works to make it illegal on a federal level. The way the two governments are handling the changes appear to be a game of one upping and should be taken more seriously, especially on the side of Trump’s administration.
8
The California legislature didn't legalize recreational pot in California, it was legalized by referendum, a 57% majority of California citizens voted for it. Most of our representatives weren't on board. It's not like we're being governed by leftist flakes, California voters are pushing politicians to the left. We're fed up. If the rest of the country wants to go backwards, we're going to fight all the way, and insist that our politicians fight along side us.
3
Once trump is safely in prison, California can rest easy.
34
There is only one America, but there is a corrupt, one-party state gov’t in California. The people are not partisan; we’re alarmed that self-serving politicians disregard our will, sacrifice our state’s prosperity, and put citizens at risk.
Sanctuary status was a spiteful decision enacted by politicians at the expense of the citizens, and without our consent. If it was in our interest, it would’ve been part of a referendum - but Kevin de Leon, Jerry Brown, et al knew citizens did not want it, so it was imposed on us, making everyone less safe and more poor. In 40 years, illegal immigration took California from being the richest state to one of the very poorest. The exorbitant taxes aren’t even used for our common benefit. The Oroville Dam crisis was caused by years of insufficient funding for maintenance yet billions are given annually to illegal aliens in housing, food, college tuition, etc. We want federal immigration laws enforced! I’d also like to see state officials investigated.
29
At the last census, Madison, California had a population of 503 people, and checking property for currently for sale in the area the range is from about $250,000 per acre to just under $5 million for about 300 acres, so evidently is valuable farmland and dependent on immigrant labor to harvest its crops. And California remains the richest single state in the nation despite your claim to the contrary.
2
California should "hold on tight." I agree with their stance on immigration and support their decision to act as a sanctuary state to all people, but challenging the U.S government might just be more than what they can handle. With a definitively anti-immigration president in office and the director of Immigration and Customs Enforcement saying that public officials should be arrested for supporting the sanctuary policy, California is going to be fighting the full force of the National Government. If California does win the upcoming "war", it would become a role model for other liberal states that want to take a stand against Trump's policies which are undermining the values that this country was built on.
14
As a blue Texan, California has always been my respite. I have loved its temperate climate as well as focus on the environment, healthy foods, and progressive thinking...all the things lacking in Texas. But my latest visit to CA revealed a state in distress. The highways were littered with trash and congestion, the prices exorbitant, water levels low, land stressed, highways broken, homelessness rampant, and wealth-poverty incongruence on full display. It made dirty Houston seem almost clean in contrast. And its environment certainly seemed to have reached its carrying capacity.
It pains me to say it, but California, you have a problem. Passing recreational marijuana laws, refusing to support or enforce reasonable immigration policies, and allowing unfettered development of wealthy enclaves seems to me short-term excess with no long-term, displined vision. Please correct course now. The west coast and east coast need to be role models and leaders. We need you to be a beacon on the hill, not a decaying mansion-cum-den of iniquity.
32
As a 40 year California resident and frequent traveler of the country, I beg to differ with the folks who seem to think somehow California is leading the way in anything other than highest taxes, most regulations, federal malfeasance and traffic jams. SIgned: One ecstatically happy 2017 Peoples Republic of Kalifornia escapee!
22
I live in California. High taxes, high cost electricity, water and services - and not enough of any. Ranks in the bottom 20% of all states in education, transport infrastructure, and water infrastructure is falling apart (check out the SacBee on the Oroville Dam). Sate and local debt, including under-funded pension systems for state employees total near a trillion dollars. But we've got recreational pot (ever hear of recreational whiskey), hi-speed rail projects from nowhere going to nowhere, healthcare and schooling for millions upon millions of illegals, net migration of trained, productive individuals to Texas and beyond every year to be replaced by free-loaders and yet more illegals. Get real folks, The Golden State has been in decline since Pete Wilson 20 years ago. Look what 16 years of two G=jerry Browns have wrought!
28
We must reform gerrymandering and the electoral college. As the GOP has sought to brazenly punish the highly educated and productive Blue States in their Tax Plan we must also move to cut our subsidy of backward Red States.
32
Love, love, love California. It took me five years to become a Californian, now Californians are the only people I get along with. It was considered a city/state in the 30's, nobody there is an outsider, you either get with it or get out. In other words, you become a Californian. I'm a diehard Californian and miss it horribly. However, Washington state is, at least part of it, is something like California and nothing is more important than getting that frog out of the "What House." Only California can do it.
29
If California wants to become a nation-state, it would have to be responsible for every wildfire, mudslide, flood, earthquake, multi-year drought etc. Gone would be everyone living on a hillside, hilltop, mountainside, in a canyon, etc. The endless water supply coming partially from the Colorado River would come at a much steeper import cost. The man-made green oases people created in the deserts and on the suburban streets of Southern California would need to be replaced with gravel, cactus and scrub. Not that I don’t agree with California politically, but let’s not forget that California is a creation of the US and owes its lifestyle to being part of the US.
14
Well, Deplorables, the US needs Califpornia and the rest of the west coast far more than we need them...remember....6th largest economy and basic bread basket.
25
If Gov. Brown travels outside of California, he may be arrested on various charges . Lincoln knew how to deal with sedition too. The "sanctuary state" bill is based on the exact same principles that South used back in the 1860s and it ended badly for the South. The last time a governor brazenly attempted to get away with these types of actions was when Alabama's George Wallace tried to prevent two black students from entering one of his state's universities back in 1963. It didn't work then, and this bill won't work now.
21
Ah, but the differences are that those folks sought to curtail and discriminate against certain groups of people; California seeks to defend them and be inclusive.
2
I fear New York is next in line to follow in California's footsteps as a state for welcoming felons and undocumented citizens. Our politicians, Bill DeBlasio and Andrew Cuomo, are as liberal as the ones in California and they are probably watching closely the results of their west coast counterpart. There would be a massive exodus from the city of those who could afford to leave and left behind would be the poor, illegals and felons. Who would then pay the high taxes to operate the city? I hope it does not come to this but I am not that optimistic that it will not happen.
17
They aren't undocumented citizens, they are illegal aliens consuming over 20 billion dollars a year confiscated from California taxpayers. We're sick of it and you will be too.
5
Interesting that California is invoking state's rights and secession. Here I was thinking that globalism was the wave of the future. Many of the commenters favoring secession boast about California's reputation as an innovator in technology and an economic engine for the rest of the country and the world, but, if their secessionist wishes came true, I think that one of the first things that would happen is that companies like Google would head for Texas. Silicon valley would become a ghost town, and California itself would become a rural nation of fruit-pickers and drugdealers on a par with a South American banana Republic. So by all means go your own way. You need the USA more than our great country needs you.
20
The conflict between California and Trump is little different from that between Texas and Obama. Back in 2015, The Times ran an op-ed related to Texas's suit against DACA. It argued that the states should not be able to use the courts, rather than the political process, to thwart the president’s policies. Now the Times is on the opposite side of this issue. Playing the political game this way is unprincipled. Taking one side of the federalism issue to support California and the opposite to oppose Texas is condescending to readers, and readers should hold the Times to a higher standard.
19
The Times' Editorial Board is as partisan as they come. It is now a foot soldier in every partisan battle. No real need to read its editorials, unless one is seeking confirmation. It is against every republican, especially presidential candidates; its level of shrill directly proportional to republican successes.
3
While CA did bring us Disney it’s a sad leader in many categories which include affordable housing for the working class, pension obligation, number of companies leaving the state for low/no tax states, i.e. TX, and of course the never ending Dem #1 talking point against the GOP, income disparity between the 1% and the 99% - no other state (possibly NY) resembles feudal Europe when it comes to the haves and have nots. Otherwise it’s a model to follow!
16
California always leads the nation with controversial propositions to defend state's rights in our great democracy. From Proposition 89 on campaign finance reform to Proposition 58 repealing a previous vote defunding bilingual education, progressives know the citizens in Cali stand up to fascism, bigotry, misogyny, and authoritarianism! New York and New Jersey proudly stand with you. Our children deserve a bright future wherein the talents and skills of all people count; rich and poor, gay or straight, white collar or blue collar, black, white or other to make America a true land of freedom and innovation. God bless California, Senator Kamala Harris, Senator Dianne Feinstein and Governor Jerry Brown!
24
SGC, California also passed Proposition 187, (also known as the Save Our State (SOS) law in 1994. Too bad it was overturned. California might not have the largest number of illegals in the country - 2.3 miilion, with 1.4 living in Southern California.
1
Not a fan of California's relaxed stance on illegal immigration. Latino gangs have taken advantage of these unenforced laws and have flourished in the state, expanding into the Southwest, South, and now even New England. With them, they have brought drugs that have made their way to those regions too, which have done much harm to poor communities. Those poor communities suffer now from the influx of illegal immigrants, which makes housing scarce. They have crammed into schools and hospitals, decreasing the quality of education and healthcare. Spanish is spoken everywhere, which alienates people.
The politicians' blatant, shameless pandering to Hispanic voters is extraordinary. For all of you Black, White and Asian Californians, expect your concerns to be addressed less and less in the next decades. It's inevitable. Being a minority is fine if you're wealthy and live in a gated community, but for everyone else? Well...it's not so good.
California is not the only state that does this, but it is one of America's largest and most important states, so it matters more than say North Dakota, Vermont, and Alabama. No offense to North Dakota, Vermont, and Alabama.
22
Guess we are lucky in New York. Sessions is on a mission to purge Long Island of its gangs, which have brought horrible carnage to its victims and communities.
2
Before they build the Wall, those self-describe "Christians" supporting Trump would do well to read Matthew 25:37-40 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? . . . 40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’
19
I’d gladly have to use a passport to travel anywhere in the US outside of California in exchange for keeping our federal tax dollars and the ability to control our borders.
10
Yeah California is voted to ban gay marriage. However politicians got their friends in the judicial system to overturn the will of the people. Golden State hypocrites.
7
CC: they voted not once, but TWICE to keep traditional marriage in California, but the social engineering COURTS overturned the WILL OF THE PEOPLE and the election process! and liberals CHEER THIS!
2
When Washington, Oregon and California form the new nation on the Pacific, don't forget to include Nevada. We are Californians, too.
13
No thanks. I live in NV now -- moved here to get away from California and all it stands for.
11
David, what will you call your new state consisting of California, Washington and Oregon - Old Hippietown or Young Hipsterville?
In my combined 46 years with the Air Force and Boeing, I have lived in a variety of states, and spent a lot of time in others. I was raised in western New York and retired near Seattle in Washington. As I retired weather officer, i would not choose to live in regions threaten by tornados or hurricanes or regions that are ultra cold or hot. I would also not choose to live in states with a history of extreme racism or dominated by wacko religion.
California is doing fine. Our problem regions are the Bible Belt which are averse to education, science or reason. Since learning is more and more a life long requirement, these regions will always live in the past. If you honestly believe the universe is les than ten thousand years old, you have missed the boat.
38
Back in the 1950s and 1960s it was out of control Democrats in the South that were rebelling against the lawful federal authorities. Now it is out of control Democrats in the West rebelling against lawful federal authorities. Not much has changed.
11
Those who think California is too left wing, or 'too crazy', can always try to change things at the ballot box, and they try, and fail repeatedly. Those of us who think California is BY FAR the best place to live in the US will stay put here and protect our fantastic lifestyle. If you live here and hate it, you are welcome to vote your preferences, continue whining, or just get the heck out and move to one of your beloved red states. I would suggest the latter!
34
Prop 8 comes to mind.
I don’t recall being surveyed by the NYT. ‘California Special Interests’ is far more accurate. I lost my voice as a US citizen due to decades of illegal immigration and amnesty. It is not the Russians who have 50 consulates in America, who demand that we legalize 12 million+ of their citizens, who demand that Russian be taught in our schools. It is not the Russian special interest groups demanding ‘sanctuary cities,’ it is not Russian-born ‘US’ representatives bringing corrupt thinking to our ‘rule of law’ founding principle. It is not the Russians sending out all those press releases that are pro DACA, pro-amnesty. We are not spending billions to feed, educate, and provide medical care to the Russians. No, our democracy, our elections, our citizenship has been diminished - not by the Russians- but by decades of southern-border, illegal immigration. When will there be a special council to investigate that?
17
One wag put it best in the LA Times a few years ago: "Mexico has taken over, not with the bayonet, with the bassinet."
18
Democrats are counting on angry identity groups to vote for them. First, they must rile them up. It wouldn't surprise me if this were all part of that strategy. The "morals" of the Democratic Party are related to power, not principle. Just look at the DNC's treatment of Sanders, and how democrats tried to make a Clinton the head of their party. Not a principle in sight.
Get used to it, now that there's a political advantage for democrats to engage in this type of behavior. Thank the democrats' divide-and-conquer identity politics.
3
Sun, I am with you 100%. Thank you for your article, perfectly said.
3
Traveling has helped me learn things about myself. One of the early puzzles for me was why I so strongly preferred London and Paris over, say, a beautiful city like Florence. It's been 10 years since I was in Florence and this may now be out of date. I felt more at home in London and Paris because of their wonderful diversity. I am a third generation Californian.
15
London and Paris are much bigger cities than Florence.
I'm not sure it's internally consistent to praise "wonderful diversity" when you seem unable to accept a city (Florence) which is different.
2
Eventually California must answer where its allegiance lies. To date it seems to indicate it is more loyal to itself and Mexico than the United States. Americans, sans Californians, will eventually wake up to this reality and question the ongoing value of abetting such corrosive intransigence. Their self centered interest is bad for the rest of the country. Sad.
16
David R., so true, but by the time they wake up this beautiful state will resemble a third world country. It's criminal.
2
Give California back to Mexico - where it belongs!
11
Or give Mexico to California. California is a much larger economy than Mexico.
9
Shader:
California is losing individuals, as well as small and large businesses. Its increased population stems from births and immigration. Unless its birthing entrepreneurs, it's in trouble.
2
And if we did that in 10 years California would be the basket case that Mexico is currently. And there would be illegal immigration from California to the US.
the demographics of CA show where the US is going generally, minority populations will drive politics and most probably everything else where massive voter suppression isn't in play. CA doesn't have to accede to rules that will turn it into a third world southern red state.
21
Thank you for recognizing California. Your article gives special attention to one candidate for the CA U.S. Senate race. Unfortunately, the one you chose is NOT the one who represents the "Resistance." the Trump administration has provided lots of low-hanging fruit for otherwise establishment politicians to rally against. Your chosen candidate for Senate is funded by the same corporate interests that support the radical right agenda. I invite you to research and report on a candidate who really represents the interests of the people: David Hildebrand. Like Bernie Sanders (for whose campaign he worked), David Hildebrand accepts No Corporate donations. He has been on the front lines in support of public campaign financing, labor, single payer Medicare for all, LGBTQ and women's rights, immigration justice, a living wage, banning fracking, getting us off of fossil fuels and developing green energy resources, Net Neutrality, and tuition-free higher education. The "California Resistance" is lead by candidates not beholden to corporate interests, rather representing the interests of the people.
8
Mark Hirshfeld, the last thing your state needs is Bernie Sanders. Brown has done enough damage to your beautiful state.
1
As a west cost resident I can tell you we get no respect nor give any to the East coast. We really should be another country. We don't need you nor you us. However, I do enjoy read the NY Times.
7
This is perhaps the most frightening group of comments I have ever read in the Times. If Trump is re-elected in 2020 it’s quite possible we’re looking at a serious sedition movement. I’m not sure there is an Abraham Lincoln in the wings....
12
The US is a bad deal for California. We pay for the red states, who could not innovate their way out of a paper bag. Their backwards policies and uneducated, unhealthy, obese, opioid-addicted populations are a drag on our progress. We get less representation in Washington than any other state, per capita. We are sick of paying your bills and embarrassed to be associated with you.
Let us go.
31
You haven't kept up. California used to be a massive "donor" state, sending much more money to Washington than it gets back. Today, they receive almost as much back as they send. That's what having a third of the state population on Medi-Cal/Medicaid will do. And, did you know that California, with 12% of the country's population, has around 30% of the welfare recipients. Thanks to being a sanctuary state, California is now getting its money's worth for its tax dollars sent off to Washington.
21
Totally fake facts, that 30% welfare figure is pure right wing fiction. Here are 2017 stats from the nonpartisan Tax Foundation:
The top recipient of federal aid in FY 2014 was Mississippi, which relied on federal assistance for 40.9 percent of its revenue. Other states heavily reliant on federal assistance include Louisiana (40.1 percent), Tennessee (39.9 percent), Montana (39.1 percent), and Kentucky (38.5 percent). As we have previously noted, these states, and others that rely heavily on federal assistance, tend to have modest tax collections and a relatively large low-income population.
https://taxfoundation.org/states-rely-most-federal-aid/
2
Let's see how well the rest of the nation can get along without Washington, Oregon and California! We are the generator of a majority of this country's income, and if we could include New York so much the better. If you in the "Rust Belt" think that a bozo like Trump can help you, when what you need is retraining as we are no longer in the Industrial Revolution but in the Technological Revolution, God help you, because that's all the help you are going to get!
26
It has been said that California is losing residents at an alarming rate to nearby less liberal states. Keep it up California and you will have a state filled with undocumented citizens and felons. You can also count the wealthy Hollywood liberal elites who hire bodyguards as your secluded neighbors. Is this what you want for your state? It certainly seems this way.
20
This is not a clash between California and 'the other America". it is a clash across the country between those Americans who respect the Constitution and what it stands for, and those citizens who adore the vulgar, dishonest racist Trump who sees himself as a dictator who can disregard the rule of law. It is a clear divide, not based on residence, but on common sense and an appreciation of the American values that many have fought and died for. These same values which are defiled every minute of every day by Trump and his Republican anti-patriots...you know the ones who stole the 2016 election with gratefully accepted Russian assistance. It is indeed a clash between the good and the evil, those trying to destroy our democracy.
59
Pretty funny. All those angry words used to describe Trump are also used to describe California's sanctuary policies and all progressive policies that flaunt the rule of law.
Tells you something about the two sides of this political battle.
2
Jefflz,
We had an election in 2016 to decide your good from evil, and thanks to millions of Americans the "good" won, while millions of others are still seeing their therapist. It is not their fault, they have believed the Clintons for many years despite the lies, corruption, and deep moral bankruptcy, etc. America dodged a bullet in November.
1
Either the Feds take control of a Rogue State or spins them off to become Upper Mexico. Time to either take it back or let it go. Also, the Feds should be supporting chopping the State into 3 manageable parts. It would have less influence in elections and the Conservatives would not have to live in the People's Republic of Kalifornia.
11
Sedition and high treason are the way of California. President Trump is well within his rights to send in the military and arrest the traitorous California leadership. Sherman’s march to the sea was a victory, so will be Mattis’ march to the Pacific!
5
I thought Republicans were so in favor of States’ rights...Mexico would love to incorporate the 6th largest economy world wide I suppose though...
5
California is the 6th largest economy in the world. It would do just fine on its own.
14
Trump or no Trump, a near majority of so-called Californians are not from this country.
8
Typical uninformed Trump enthusiasts may agree with Susan. However, the percentage of foreign born residents in California is 27%. A near majority? Only to immigrant-hating Trumpists..
12
Susan or no Susan, the figure is 27%... and what difference does that make?
3
Have you been here? I live here. Your comment doesn’t reflect reality.
8
proud to be from California, and happy to stand behind our elected officials.
25
Who cares about California anyway?
This country is better run by middle America folk who have common sense values.
13
Au contraire, Joe. The country is, and always has been, "better" run by leaders who represent all its citizens, from Pottstown to to Pasadena. Middle America is itself more diverse than you will apparently ever know.
11
Yeah, like in Kansas...
9
Great, so let us go!
We’re happy to stop paying your bills. We’ll take 30% of the US economy with us, along with the best workers, virtually all the patents and innovation of the past decade, and the 4 largest corporations in the world (about a third of the capital in the NY stock exchange).
Without CA, the US economy is about the size of France. Have fun as a third-rate backwater with a last-century coal-based economy and 19th-century social values. We’d love to stop paying for you.
24
Oregon and Washington are pushing back too. That is the whole west coast with some of the best thinking in the world in terms of educational, business, and social achievements. We will keep doing that until 20 when the US elects a POTUS and Congress that will repair the damage being done by the Administration of 45 and the GOP-led Congress.
27
Omg, can't us Blue States just secede already? Clearly, this is a permanent and irreconcilable gulf between us and the backwards, economically challenged, hopeless Red States.
27
My family arrived in California in the 1860s. From the earliest days of statehood, a century and a half ago, we have participated in the innovative, forward looking culture that pervades most of the state. It is an attitude that looks to the future. This is one reason why the state has long been a trend setter for the nation and the world. I now enjoy life in Colorado, which increasingly echoes some of the best trends in California. Meanwhile, President Trump and his staunchest supporters look to the past, a sure way to diminish the position of the nation in the world. In the end, the innovators will win out, while those people and places mired in the past will be left behind.
31
So now George Wallace and the dixiecrats are conservatives. More historical revisions.
8
Let's not use 'traditionally' to refer to what Republicans have been doing since they moved south in the 1960s and took over what was the southern Democratic position, eg. states' rights -- For most of the history of the Republic, it was Democrats who championed states' rights -- so beware of inaccurate adjectives.
2
Well, the GOP started talking State's Rights in the 1960s. That's 50 years. I think it's fair to say 50 years of something makes it a tradition.
6
The bloom is off the rose. California has massive homelessness. Great poverty and income disparity as it has become a haven for illegal immigrants. California has decriminalized numerous crimes, released convicts from prison and jail and encouraged a crime increase in many communities. Leftist ideology over common sense has taken root in Sacramento. Sadly, it is no example for the rest of the country other than to avoid its actions. Its much touted GDP is a function of its role as part of the USA, the ports of entry to the Pacific Rim, NASA, Federal R&D, the military, and agriculture sales to the rest of the US. Take away these and it would most likely look like Italy or some other leftist leaning nation with great weather and natural attributes living on debt and the kindness of strangers.
20
Wrong. CA is the engine that powers the entire US. But you are welcome to head East anytime to join your compatriots in backwards-thinking land. There are zillions of innovative, inclusive people eager to buy your home or rent your apartment. Please, head east!
9
Justin, your comment is right on!
4
If I had to pick one, I'd pick the side Trump is on. Hearing about what California is turning into isn't the future I want my kids growing up in. The fall of America would have devastating consequences.
18
California has 40 million Americans in the state. Said differently, 1 in every 8 Americans lives in California.
As mentioned in the article, California alone would be the world's 6th largest global economy.
The GDP of the state outperforms US GDP consistently because the state's environmental protection and diversity attracts a highly educated workforce and business clusters support commerce and innovation.
America has prospered from global immigration, as immigrants don't just take jobs they create jobs. Half of Fortune 500 companies were founded by first or second generation immigrants.
The world is converting to electric cars and developing renewable energies as it is a global imperative to all rational beings on Earth.
China, Canada, Japan, South Korea, the EU, Australia, California and most of the US, and the rest of the world have a firm grasp on reality.
Meanwhile, Putin seeks to export the anemic growth of Russia's kleptocracy to the US, working in concert with those lacking a shred of integrity or ethics.
Trump will be a test of the nation's resolve to withstand a foreign nation's intervention in its elections with an intent to destroy it from within.
29
The American progressive resistance to the bigotries, idiocies, and would-be tyrannies of Trump is welcome, brave, and long overdue. This is a man and administration that has no belief in science, truth, justice, democracy, or the rule of law. It is a bogus, illegitimate regime that all good Americans should be ashamed of--and resist as much as possible until this tinpot dictator and his minions are sent packing.
Not my president indeed, now or ever.
35
This grotesque new government is deceptively fortunate that there is a California to be its safety valve. California has only the Constitution.
19
California finally may be twigging to the fact hat it's not nice to call our president an "idiot".
Out of 53 CA U.S. representatives, only fifteen are Republicans, and both U.S. senators are Democrats. Trump isn't risking a lot of blowback on his payback.
Californians might remember when they travel abroad that their passports DON'T read "The People's Republic of California".
Since Trump obviously is trolling for amusing ideas, he might consider this one for fully funding "The Wall": impose a new federal income tax surcharge, but only on Southern Californians, say from San Francisco down, with some exceptions such as for the fifteen districts held by Republicans that lie in that geography. This way, he can claim that the wall really IS being paid for by Mexicans.
10
Sounds like you need to relax.
15
"And you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free."
And this most especially applies to Mr. Trump's gray matter, or lack of it, Mr. Luettgen.
16
"California, you have a problem." Inside the bubble, it's all good. In it, Hillary really "won" because she had more votes there.
As an astute LA Times columnist noted, "California is not a dream, it's a mirage." Progressives do have an ineluctable talent for seeing only what they want to see.
1
thus civil wars starteth
7
California should declare itself a religion, redefine state taxes as donations, and file a federal tax exemption.
19
The article refers to "2.3 million undocumented workers". Unfortunately, "undocumented worker" has come to be a "politically correct" euphemism, much like "right to life." Certainly some anti-abortion folks strongly believe in a right to life, but some don't. (Consider their divergent views on the death penalty.) What they accurately do have in common is that they are anti-abortion. Similarly, some people who come here illegally are undocumented workers, but some are not. Words are important and, unlike the language coming out of the likes of Trump, Fox, and their ilk, our words should be accurate.
The title of this article, "In Clash Between California and Trump, It’s One America Versus Another", is inappropriately divisive. Do we really need more polarization and echo chamber "reality" in this country? This is not Michael Harrington's "The Other America" but, rather, the stereotyping of one state as mutually exclusive with how one would characterize the rest of America. What's next, a House Un-American Activities Committee based on branding entire states, not individuals?
Be careful what you wish for, when it comes to States Rights. The article correctly notes the history of segregation as a States Rights issue (and cover). By adopting parallel Constitutional reasoning, California is effectively legitimating actions by other states to do many things Californians would strongly oppose, especially in regard to classes of people not protected by the Fifteenth Amendment.
12
That ever true statement made by Horace Greely over a hundred years ago, has stood the test of time and remains as true today as it did then: " GO WEST YOUNG MAN" .....
Our nation's best virtues remain vibrant and as self evident here as it did then. Thank you Horace Greely and, God Bless You.
9
You liberals are a hoot. There are more states following the Texas model than California. At least all the successful states. https://www.npr.org/2017/08/27/546391430/texas-becoming-a-magnet-for-con...
14
Even better, liberals are fleeing the high-tax blue states for the low-tax red states
1
Mississippi? Kansas?? The "successful states??
8
You are referring to the confederacy?
6
If extreme Republicans are successful in taxing the liberal coasts to death it is their homelands in the geographic center that will suffer the most. You guys should start working together with the Jerrys and Bernies or you will kill the goose that gives you the gold.
8
The liberal coasts imposed these high taxes on themselves, remember?
19
That's actually a funny comment. Reminds me of our Democratic governor in New York posturing as a great "defender" against Trump while he tries desperately to keep from New Yorkers know how much they are really paying in taxes.
2
Look towards something bigger here... America being such a big country will always have many Americans with differing views. However at the centre of every American's heart at which every other nations admire is the willingness to be united, and to be led by a President and presidential office who would unite them.
Clearly Trump is not that president. Especially not with his un-president like retorts at every individual or organisation that questioned his ability.
This is how I see this as a foreigner.
22
Let us be clear. California will comply with federal statutes. Arrest those who refuse to comply with the law of the land. I am hard right and see no compromise with a state that flaunts the law.
15
The government will have to arrest the entire state. We don't comply with laws that don't work for our state.
22
Change "flaunts" to "flouts" and I agree with you, Kent.
6
You clearly over emphasize your importance and influence. Many of us (the minority of productive Californians) do not disagree with federal law, but we do take issue with sanctuary for criminal aliens and laws that encourage the further drugging and dumbing down of our population.
3
You’d think Californians would be ashamed of putting their limitless greed on full display: we can buy whatever we want for ourselves and hand you the bill!
11
CA accounts for 12.5% of the federal revenue. #2 State is TX at just shy of 7%. Pretty sure Californians pay their fair share.
18
you must have confused CA with the republican tax bill that steals from the poor to give to the rich there larry. I do admit tho, nobody in their right mind would live in Chicago if they think they had a choice or thought about it for oh,a nanosecond. it surely is the northern HQ for both repub and dem corruption and social engineering rot.
9
Take a drive through Chicago. The horrific body counts are in a tiny section. Outside of that, in the rest of the city and outlying burbs, there really is a wonderful city. Leaving on a plane you might wonder where was all the 'rot' and degradation that plays out in the media?
Indeed, a tale of two cities.
3
I have lived in California for 53 years.
I have to sat that the views of the liberals that govern this state do not represent me. They do not represent millions of other Californians.
It is very indicative that businesses are leaving the state to go to Texas.
Mr. Trump is rude, and crass, but disregarding his bombast, I approve of the vast majority of the positions that he holds, and the actions he has taken.
23
It is sad that so many Americans consider it acceptable for the President to be a complete creep and brat as long as he makes policy choices in alignment with their political beliefs.
When did character become less important than professional expertise? I would vote for a high school dropout who demonstrated the skills necessary to be President over a person with a PhD who insulted and mistreated his staff and most everyone else.
Character should matter when we select leaders. In my opinion qualities like humility, kindness and a willingness to listen to and meet the needs of all Americans should matter when we vote. That such qualities were secondary to millions of Americans who voted for the man-child Trump says a lot about how dysfunctional we are as a nation.
If you would not invite a foul mouthed fool comfortable in his own ignorance to your own home for dinner why in the world would you vote for him to be President???
18
I’m not saying Trump is anything like slick willy, aka President Clinton, but it is ironic that Republicans think character and values don’t matter in 2017 and Democrats thought it didn’t matter in 1997.
Almost makes you think that people are just political sheep who blindly hate the other side...
3
Sticks and stones will break my bones.......
1
From my perspective in Pennsylvania, California takes our jobs, has a wildly unequal economy, and disrespects our President. Why don't they secede, and see if someone else will take them? I don't think they'd be missed.
16
I wish we could. It would be great to live in a positive country again.
15
You’ll miss our tax dollars. We won’t miss subsidizing you.
6
Hope, 30% of Americans receiving welfare are Californians, although you only make up 12% of the population. You are no longer the wealthy state you once were thanks to illegal immigration.
England and France have announced that they will no longer allow the sale of gasoline or diesel powered vehicles as of 2040, to take decisive action against air pollution. China is trying to lead the world in electric vehicles and is likely to follow the same timetable. India will surely do the same in both these population giants the population can't breathe some days. California should announce they are following the same timetable. They can simply announce that as of that date they will no longer register cars, trucks or buses with internal engines, that all must be zero emission vehicles. The biggest market for vehicles in the United States could in this way drag America kicking and screaming into the world of cleaner air via electrified vehicles. Governor Brown said he was thinking of this; what is he waiting for?
14
And then, where would all the electricity come from? Fracking in Nevada? Coal plants in Arizona?
6
Luckily there’s this big hot thing in the sky called the sun that emits energy. Heard they get quite a bit of sun in California.
15
Californians want to save the planet, so they should support the construction of nuclear power plants all over the state to power their electrified vehicles.
6
Although I support legalization, I am OK with Atty Gen Sessions giving the green light to enforcement of federal laws. Pot should be legalized by valid federal legislation, not by a laissez faire policy of a presidential administration declining to enforce existing laws -- as happened so often in the rogue Obama administration.
13
It actually started in the first Bush's administration. He didn't get us into Iraq and Afghanistan either. Republican Presidents did. Not every thing that you don't like is because of Obama.
6
I assume you feel the same way about enforcing federal laws against those who employ illegal immigrant labor? And feel that those laws be enforced with equally speedy and punitive legal actions?
9
I'm in my sixties and won't live long enough to see your vision of a national law to legalize pot with the GOP in charge. Sessions is a bigot who wants to keep the jails filled with black and brown people to placate his buddies who own private prisons and to disenfranchise their votes.
14
Calling state taxes charitable contributions will never fly with the IRS. If the law defining charitable organizations ans donations has any wiggle room they will remove it in a flash. I would love it if they just said "You can deduct as a charitable state taxes paid in excess of the amount required by state law", i.e. if failure to "donate" had no legal repercussions. That would end this charade in a flash.
6
Maybe not, but the IRS is so understaffed most people would get away with it.
2
"Calling state taxes charitable contributions will never fly with the IRS"
It worked in Arizona with tax payer payments for parochial schools:
https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/arizona/investigations/2015/07/26/p...
The only difference here is the scale.
California's solution to the $10,000 SALT limitation will work.
6
Interesting article.
Prior to the new tax bill such an arrangement would have been revenue neutral to the federal government. The tax credit could not exceed the state tax liability so at the federal level the taxpayer was deducting the same total amount regardless of how it was apportioned. Since it has changed now it will be very easy to require the taxpayer to subtract from the charitable donation the value of the state tax credit received.
Of course if you have a student in the school you have to deduct the value of the tuition.
There is NOTHING American about California. Their leadership, policies and laws would be more at home in countries like Venezuela, North Korea or Cuba. I really hope they are allowed to succeed..It would benefit the rest of teh country immensely.
13
DJ Trump couldn't have said it better. We've been "succeeding" for years.Thanks.
16
mja:
Trump is the president. That should tell you something about the California viewpoint. All California's vote couldn't prevent the country from selecting someone who disagrees with California on immigration.
Hilarious how Californians impose outrageously high taxes on themselves and then whine that they’re victims when they are expected to pay the high taxes they improved osed on themselves! Looks like they’re rejecting the high-tax blue state model
17
Brilliant analysis of the issues!
3
The so-called tax reform was the worst attack by one US region on another US region since the firing on Fort Sumter. The Republicans are not finished: now they are meddling with the census in a way that also harms blue states, which is to say most of the East and the West Coasts. If California is leading the way, New York and other blue states must rally to the same cause.
Californians can be maddeningly self-congratulatory, but in this struggle they are right. Blue states have a clear-eyed view of America's reality and America's future, while Republican radicals disregard most of the population and try desperately to hold back the clock. While we work to elect Democrats to Congress in 2018, we must also demand that the governments in Albany and other blue state capitals uphold the American values and American interests that the Republicans are are working to destroy.
19
Why should the rest of the country subsidize California’s spendthrift ways?
7
Smoking pot is NOT my value and I truly believe this is a first-world country with rich people who don’t know what to do with themselves issue. I am more concerned about people who think smoking pot is totally OK and reveal this message to kids. All those singers singing profanity, half-naked, tv shows idolizing idiots who are not the least concerned about the kind of example they set for young minds, teachers (me being one of them) dealing with an increasing number of kids with learning disabilities, probably, born to mothers who thought it was OK to smoke pot while being pregnant. When are you going to realize that there more important things to life then being able to smoke pot “legally?”
8
Actually, it works the other way around.
3
Hugh Jackman, an Australian, recently spoke at an Australian award ceremony and said he wanted to give props to the United States because our film industry is so open and accepting about people from other countries working in the U.S. film industry.
That's California. Big, diverse, tolerant California.
If our film industry was located in Alabama, it wouldn't be nothing.
15
And nothing is exactly what it is.
8
"Big, diverse, tolerant California."
But the "progressive" California film industry also enabled the predatory actions of Harvey Weinstein et al.
6
But, Interestingly, Hollywood does so very little of its actual work in California anymore. It chooses to film it works in low tax states with subsidies from the taxpayers in those states. Now that is an interesting turn dont you think?
5
There are many of us in California who believe that the leftist trend under Brown has gone too far. Unfettered illegal immigration, increased taxes to pay for social programs for illegals, trains to nowhere, failed education programs, increasingly bloated teachers' union and state government union pensions, silly housing, sexual harassment and education rules beloved only by the very extreme left. I think there's going to be a backlash. I'd prefer a Democrat to lead this, but a moderate Republican will do too.
18
Fun fact. Do you know how much Governor Brown spent on his last campaign for reelection?? How does ZERO sound. The people of California overwhelmingly support this man, and you'd be wise to acknowledge that fact.
17
Hope you enjoy paying those high taxes.I’m sure your public schools in Los Angeles are worth every penny.
5
There's still such a thing as a "moderate" Republican?
4
California is everything I love about America.
40
Honestly, I think the current administration seeks to damage blue states, California being only one of them, just perhaps the most visible.
I live a fairly conservative lifestyle. No pot smoking; however, I feel so at home here where more people are able to live diversely without harm to others. And thank goodness for my kid's and other families' peace of mind that our gun laws are strong. I love California.
33
This is real simple: pay your taxes!
5
Yes, it's terribly hurtful and so unfair to make blue states actually pay their high taxes. Gotta hand it to democrats. Love how their high blue state tax burdens have been twisted into a narrative about vindictive republicans.
2
If California wants to secede it should be vetted by county. Most of the middle to southern coast would end up being the Nation of California, with some inland areas. That means that most of water for SoCal would be renegotiated, perhaps with terms like Mexico ended up with. Water in the Red northern part of CA is a large portion of water for the rest of the state, which would also need to be renegotiated. The single largest source of energy is natural gas, most of which comes from out of state. I don’t follow state politics too closely but perhaps also up for grabs would be the agricultural areas, which have traditionally tended to be Red. That might also end up including a lot of transportation infrastructure.
Many companies would probably flee, not unlike what is happening in Catalonia, Spain. Obviously all military units and many companies providing sensitive technology would also leave or lose their contracts. There would probably be a sudden, mass migration of immigrants to the Nation of California, and an exodus of the middle class.
Sound like some sort of utopia?
9
"Sound like some sort of utopia?"
No, John, but all that intricate detail makes it sound a lot like you're awfully deep into your early morning dreams!
1
California is always about the future, always out front, always leading the way.
Bless you, California.
24
Trump and the Republican started this! The tax bill, Sessions' attack on legalized marijuana, cuts to Medicaid and on and on are full-frontal attacks on California and other Democratic states. Californians must protect themselves from being raped by the GOP. So, no tears for Trump here if Jerry Brown and the California legislature fights back.
And Republican Congresspeople in California had better do something to show that they care about the people of the State before the 2018 elections. Some in the Central Valley will be safe--since their constituents apparently don't care how badly they are treated by their own party--but anyone in Orange County or any urban area is going to be out on his or her ear after November.
11
I'm o.k. with legal pot, but Sessions isn't at fault here, federal law is. It is up to Congress to change the law, not the Attorney General du jour to decide which laws he feels like enforcing.
http://www.safeaccessnow.org/federal_marijuana_law
8
Greedy Californians started this by not paying their fair share of taxes!! The nation is grateful President Trump is righting this wrong!
6
The other day a NYT commentator in reply to my comment directed me interestingly to The Nullification Act of 1832 where South Caolina refused to pay tariffs to the Federal Government or secession. South Carolina won. With Trump at the helm, the Nullification Act of 1832 seems very pertinent to any number of roiling issues today.
9
Why are there two Dakotas or two Carolinas? Together, all four states have a total population of 16.5 million. In fact, you would have to add Arkansas (3 million) and Oklahoma (4 million), Mississippi (3 million), Alabama (4.8 million), Kentucky (4.4 million), Tennessee (6.72 million) to nearly equal California's projected 2017 population of 39.5 million people. What's more, these 10 states send nearly 20 deep red Senators to Washington. California sends two. Even more infuriating is that these residents "federal client" states depend on California revenue to help meet their budget goals, and they walk around with iPhones, watch HDTV on flat screens and drive low emission cars and post anti-California screeds on computers and tablets - all technologies created in California. Maybe if California stopped sending fresh fruit, nuts, wine, and vegetables to these places, things would feel more balanced.
21
I guess you haven’t heard that Texas and Florida also grow vegetables. And wine from France and Italy is much better.
4
California grows 25% of the nation's fruits and vegetables year round. Texas grows sugar cane and sorghum in the winter and Florida grows strawberries and citrus in the winter. And I think if the old Confederacy has your discerning palate, it was taught to them by Californians.
4
Hurrah for the great state of CA where people don't even need to know how many biological sexes there are for human species!
7
Who needs science if you live in such a great place?
3
If the state taxes become charitable contributions do they also become voluntary? What impact might that have on actual charitable contributions? Sounds like the “work around” may not work at all.
5
Of course it won’t work. It is a blatantly illegal tax avoidance scheme
7
I believe charitable contributions have to go to non-profits -but I guess California is so deep in the hole with unfounded liabilities they may qualify?
1
Here in NY, I wonder how we can join CA in secession.
23
Can MA join too, pls?
8
Washington state definitely wants in on the secession. Oregon too.
5
For as long as I can remember, the great rallying cry of the Republican Party has been to turn over power to the States. It's just incredible, and deeply disturbing to observe the heavy handed, clenched fist of this administration- in their desire and efforts to overrun State independence and rights now, for their own ideals relating to women's health rights, marijuana and environmental issues.
State rights? Only if they serve the grand moral high ground and capitalist zeal of our now 'Business State'.
The moral and ethical hypocrisy of the Trump administration, and the GOP- which has become a perverted mutation of the Republication of yesteryear, is so glaring, that it stands out to some of us, as a cancer on this land.
It is both sad and frightening as to how divided we've become and this article is another stark reminder as to just how crucial it is that we might find common ground and attempt to heal this gash, or further distance ourselves in what sometimes appear to becoming and 'irreconcilable difference'.
The next election cycle will no doubt carry the weight of our future upon it- like no elections I have ever been a part of.
18
Guess you must be one of the only people who didn't invest in this stock market, eh? Too bad, as you would have been allowed to keep a lot of that money now, too. I have a feeling the midterms are going to reward the Trump Economic Miracle quite well once the 89% of the people actually invested in this country start looking at the economic freedom they've been afforded.
6
You are mistaken in your assumption as my wife and I have substantial holdings in US equities. Without getting off track here, I'd just like to mention that as a result of the recent capital gains, we have increased our contributions to organizations that we feel might mitigate our perceived damages from the policies of this administration. Additionally, I feel the long term costs of some of the deregulation will likely far exceed the capital gains that have resulted from these recent advances in the stock market. Degradation of our natural resources cannot be repaired or replaced with money.
2
This is going to get uglier! Short of Civil War, which would be geographically untenable, I see bloodshed coming in the streets! Don’t forget over sixty million Americans love President Trump! No matter what! History is bunk! What Constitution?! Who needs to read it?! We’ve got Fox and Stephen Miller! Remember when our President spoke about firing that gun in the middle of Manhattan?! It will get to the point when he will be impeached! Then, even us folks who don’t have weapons, will become armed! Why? Do you think those over sixty million will stand for impeachment?! And that government, of the people, by the people, and for the people shall not perish from this earth?!
You want to bet?! Right, he’s making America Great again! He’s going to cause our Second Civil War, but it just won’t play out that way!!!
6
I'm in favor of a two-state solution.
10
A Nonresident Sport Fishing license costs $130.42 in California. I had thought about going there to fish. Nope. Fagetaboudit!
2
As an addendum, it could fairly be said that California is anti-nonresident. Texas only charges $60, which is still high, there should be a national fishing license for seniors like me on fixed incomes so we can afford to fish anywhere.
1
Are you willing to pay more in federal taxes to support California's sport fishing resources? The difference between resident and non-resident license is because we residents are paying the majority of the cost to provide recreational fishing. If you want the resident license move here and pay our taxes.
7
That's OK - the fish won't mind.
2
Perhaps this acrimony and defiance might help some people understand the politcal significance of States (as in "These United States").
As imagined by the founders, and manifest after more than two centuties of political and social history, the States can still be different and, beyond basic foundational, i.e. Constitutional law, people can find or create something closer to the legal environment they seek. If we have ANY remaining capacity to compromise and coexist, we need to embrace State difference.
To push things even further, significant State difference also implies weaker Federal power, at least for internal affairs. Don't like the Trump administration? Fine, let's agree to cut back on executive power. But be adult, and when the next president is someone you like, make sure she operates under the same constraints.
1
Could blue states, california and mutual fund companies create funds that exclude companies and government bonds outside blue states, blue cities and blue localities republicans dont care about us and we dont want to subsidize their white supremscists with our taxes or invest even a cent in them if we could help it. The red states dont pay enough taxes and the tax payer in california is paying for their schools and roads. California returns every federal dollar that it receives. Our taxes should go to blue areas, with a little for common areas like defense, federal government agencies and foeign aid.
9
You can say that USA has already seceded from California, they are so far to the left that there is no reconciliation, no redeeming value in their input as a nation.
6
It seems the blue states and the red states really do not want to be "United" anymore. So why don't we have a vote and all agree to split up? Then everyone would be happy. We need each other, but we could always work out agreements for the things we need, like we do with other countries.
I was born and raised in Southern California, it truly was the Golden State. Now with 100% democrat control it is barreling head long down the road of Detroit, Baltimore and now even Connecticut. Sooner or later Tech will understand what it costs it employees to live there and they will move. Just like Detroit.
It is a crying shame, but it is what the voters want. When they wake up, they may find themselves in Venezuela.
10
Steve K: at least we don't use the police and military to murder drug users like Duarte does.
3
On the other hand, Jeff, the Philippines isn't providing them with safe havens.
CA Income tax is 13% --- I am well aware some states have 0% -- but look at them! One problem is CA spends an estimated $6 billion dollars a year servicing, "undocumented illegal immigrants," and it's going to climb. There is a huge liberal myth that "undocumented immigrant workers" pay their fair share of taxes by shopping at Walmart and filling up their gas tanks... Completely untrue. They sent over $50 billion dollars "back home" through wire transfers and Mexico is the primary recipient of that money-- That's why Mexico is very contento flooding this country with more and more "undocumented immigrant workers." Scrap DACA and deport everyone!
13
And California expects us to pay for their gold-plated, 1%, Limousine lifestyle! Ain’t happening!
4
Would be great if the Federal Government stripped the border patrol and fences in Tijajuana and along the state's border with Mexico. If illegal aliens are so good, let them all come in and leech off what's left of its taxpayers.
1
@Larry- Just to bring you up to speed.. In California, Limousines are for losers-- It's Bentley or bust!
3
Maybe laws against bump stocks, silencers, scopes and other accessories making rifles and other guns more deadly in urban environments. Go CA.
4
Maybe enforcing our immigration laws and expelling illegal aliens would make California's urban areas safer. If you don't believe me, ask the parents of Kate Steinle.
2
Yes, this is working so well in Chicago. The parents of Kate Steinle were appalled at the way their daughter's death was used to rail against illegal aliens. Look it up.
2
The truth is that illegal immigrants have a lot lower crime rate that good old american gun owners. Ask the parents of the people in law Vegas or Sandy hook, or Atlanta or Roseburg, or all the other mass killings. Not one was done by an illegal alien.
6
Somewhere between the extreme positions of California and Trump is the middle ground that would be good for this whole country to strive for. I think a good part of America is sick of the polarized climate that we seem to have sunk into.
9
The federal government contributes to the Ca. in helping to underwrite the cost of the undocumented, thus putting money into the state economy.The feds pay up to 80% of many health and welfare programs, and a myriad of education and other programs.
In addition, the I.R.S. has been giving cash to the undocumented who do not earn enough to pay income taxes, under the Additional Child Tax Credit and the Earned Income Tax Credit. The Inspector General for the Treasury Department found that in the I.R.S. had paid $4.2 billion to the undocumented under the Child Tax Credit in the year 2010. These payments continue to be made.
In sum, Ca. gets a lot of money from the federal government to support the undocumented and their children. And the fed gives additional money directly to the undocumented.
In other ways, the undocumented have a negative impact on the state. There are many of them, and they have larger families than Americans. They displace citizens from jobs and affordable housing. They crowd the roads. "Rush-hour” traffic is now all day long. They crowd the schools. They have higher rates of teen pregnancy and school drop-outs. Ca. used to be known for having the best schools. Now the magazine Education Week ranks them 10th from the bottom in achievement.
Many of the undocumenteds' communities are crowded, dirty, and rife with violent gangs and drugs.
The undocumented bring federal money to the state, but they cost it in other ways.
9
And Big Government is paying for their bullet train to nowhere! That money could be going to curing childhood diseases or to Social Security
5
Maybe CA should secede, they could save the government big buck. I hear Jerry Brown spend upwards of 70 billion for services for these "undocumented" immigrants. Guess they misplaced those documents while crossing our borders illegally.
5
Hopefully that's all going to change with this Tax Reform and California taxpayers will have to cough up more to take care of their illegals flooding their schools, health systems etc. Maybe Liberal politicians should pay politically for their high state and local taxes. They've got away with it because of SALT deductions but now that's gone away. So cough up California.
5
Could California enact state environmental laws restricting new pipe lines on beaches?
2
On it's current path within a decade or so they will resemble the socialist neighbor to the south and will also be dumping toxic sewage into the Pacific.
6
And they’ll demand everyone except them pay for their mistakes
5
Untie. Sounds like you WISH that would happen.
California used to be a political battleground between left-wing vs. right-wingers, with the right especially muscular. That is until California took a lot/some of the political power away from the two political parties at primary time in 2012, and put it in the hands of the voters.
It is called the Top Two Candidate Open Primary system for statewide offices, and here are the basics (from the League of Women Voters):
All candidates for a given state or congressional office will be listed on a single Primary Election ballot.
Voters can vote for the candidate of their choice for these offices.
The top two candidates, as determined by the voters, will advance to the General Election in November.
It is more based on "may the best woman/man win" principle than who each political party (and its big funders) decide to put on the ballot.
https://cavotes.org/vote/how-vote/voting-primary-election
George Washington warned us about giving too much power to political parties (https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/01/washingtons-farewell-add...
Worth considering--unless you are crazy about our uncompromising, highly partisan, serve the special interests but get nothing done for the people party politics we currently put up with.
2
The founding fathers warned us about giving too much power to government, which is EXACTLY what the Democratic Party has forced down the throats of voters. the California Democratic Party nanny state enforces blue laws for its secular religion: transgender bathrooms, "civil rights" and preferences for the political identity group paying to get to the head of the line, cronyism and subsidies for the "politically correct" cause (global warming, shielding immigrants from Federal law, encouraging accommodation instead of assimilation with political Islam, homeless allowed to camp and break into cars in SF, etc.)
4
“ uncompromising, highly partisan, serve the special interests”- That describes California perfectly.
4
Ironically, the tax deal that the GOP just brokered is starting to look like it could backfire: In order to support their citizenry the blue states are looking at ways to shield them from what appears to be petty vengeance on those who did not vote for trump and his vulgarians. If that happens I am wondering if that will also mean fewer tax dollars going to Washington, and more staying in their home states. If that happens the red states are going to be more impoverished than they already are...
14
California sends more money to the Federal government than it receives. In many red states, the situation is exactly the reverse. California is home to the sixth largest economy in the world, larger than France. Sure, we pay taxes, but in return we get the UC system, modern infrastructure, an educated populace, and a dynamic business environment that is the envy of the world. Call us elitists if you will, but we live in the 21st Century, not the 20th or the 19th.
36
Modern infrastructure? Is there another California?
4
Well let's put it this way.. Whatever California's Public and Private Unions want to do- that's what Jerry Brown will do...
3
Folks, two days ago, January 5th, I took the Amtrak Pacific Surfliner up from LA to the San Luis Obispo area for a project we're working on, through many miles of exquisite, untouched coastline on a crystal clear, gorgeous, 70 degree or so day. Stayed in Pismo Beach where the waves were perfect, one after the other, and the surfers were having a ball. The beach was loaded with joggers and dog walkers, and kids having fun......Would you like to know why?? Why California? That's why.
29
geoff: California is a huge state with a magnificent coastline on the Pacific -- nobody denies that. It has gotten by its wonderful natural resources for a very long time now -- 150 years, at least.
But you were in a low population, low density and somewhat conservative part of the state -- North of LA, South of SF -- far from the big cities, gridlock on freeways, congestion, etc.
Tell me that same story when you are stuck in 8 lanes of gridlocked traffic in LA at rush hour.
Tell me that same story when you try to find something affordable to rent or purchase and you can't -- everything is 10x the cost elsewhere.
Tell me that story when you visit one of the many homeless encampments in LA or SF -- California has THE largest populations of homeless in the entire nation.
You can go to almost anyplace on earth and find pretty beaches and nice resorts but that does not tell you anything about the quality of life for ORDINARY PEOPLE outside of the gilded gates.
3
a great part of california’s economy is built on the backs of illegal immigrants which justifies its policy to provide sanctuary. also liberals dominate the coast and as you go inland most people are conservative.
7
The reason so much of our California economy relies on illegal workers is that we cannot get any Americans to do the jobs no matter how high the wages and benefits are. It the illegal stopped coming our agricultural and construction industries would disappear. About 8 years ago, the illegal farm workers stayed home and many farmers went into bankruptcy because no Americans would work the fields.
3
Jeff: that is a lefty myth and absolutely untrue.
There are no jobs Americans won't do.
I have relatives on both sides of my family who own farms in the Midwest, and employ no illegals (not many Mexicans up here on the Northern border!) and manage to raise crops, have dairy herds and produce corn without illegal aliens.
Amazing! so Americans CAN AND WILL do farm work -- only not in California????
BTW: only 1% of all illegals work in agriculture. Most illegals live in big cities and do the same jobs as working class Americans -- construction, trucking, food service, landscaping, etc.
3
Many Californians think Gov Moonbeam, our state "representatives", and the demo party in general are totally nuts. I hope the Feds push back and push back hard. If our state taxes become charitable contributions does this mean I do not have to contribute if I do not want to? If Ca. decides to to leave the Union then can we who support the State of Jefferson in Northern Ca. leave Ca.? Remember: there are about 12 million conservative here, more people than most states, but sadly there are about 15 million liberal wackos.
10
Kansas awaits you!
13
Best to divide up California. Now with recreational cannabis, you can be sure there will be more stoned drivers on our roads, killing and maiming people.
2
Yogi Berra famously said of a NY restaurant, "Nobody goes there any more. It's too crowded." I'm more than a little sick of reading all these supposed California people moaning about this, complaining about that and trashing whatever. Leave. My Kansas relatives moved out here to escape the travesty that's happened back there with education, healthcare, you name it. Go fill their spot on the KS roster. Or pick a state where you can proudly plant a confederate sticker on your bumper. Or where you can have your hunting license acceptable at your polling place. But not your student ID. Go. Now. We don't need you out here. That's why we pray for horrible weather every Rose Bowl so we don't get infested by folks like you trying to escape wherever you live now but whining once you get here.
22
Yes, Easterners think that all Californians came from other countries when the truth is that for the last 100 yeas most are from the Midwest and East Coast.
3
I thought you were seceding? Go, we don’t need you. No passports though.
2
Harsh words. Not sure they help us to sanely discuss this matter.
2
Pot smoking, Kate Steilne's illegal alien murderer acquitted, cap and trade + "clean energy" cronyism running up energy prices, $.27.8 state tax for gasoline, highest income tax rate in the country 13.3% for top bracket), billions for overpriced speed train and nothing for new dams in 40 years to address water shortages, minimum wage & workmen's compensation laws crushing small businesses....California Democrats, not my representatives.
15
Americans are not safe in California
9
Diving into the murky water of big big generalizations gets you nowhere. Americans are as safe in California as in any other state.
5
I've lived in CA for almost 30 years and couldn't disagree more with the commenters complaining about SB 54, the California Values Act (which some people mistakenly say makes CA a "sanctuary" state). The majority of Californians recognize that randomly deporting hard-working undocumented immigrants and splitting up families is inhumane. According to a recent Public Policy Institute of California survey, the majority of Californians say undocumented immigrants should be given a pathway to stay, including 93 percent of Democrats and 68 percent of Republicans. (http://www.ppic.org/wp-content/uploads/s_1217mbs.pdf. ) What this law does is prevent local law enforcement from working with ICE to deport and assist in mass deportations of undocumented immigrants who have not committed crimes. It also makes it harder for ICE to make arrests at court houses, schools and hospitals so that the undocumented can take their kids to school, go to the doctor, and report crimes with less fear of deportation. What this law does NOT do is protect criminals. It does not prevent local law enforcement from cooperating with ICE to deport undocumented immigrants who have committed a felony within the last 15 years. In fact, the CA Values Act protections do not apply to immigrants with convictions in categories of more than 600 felonies and misdemeanors.
California has its problems, but I am grateful to live in a state which affirms the humanity of all its residents.
35
I agree totally, especially with your last sentence. Frankly, I am more afraid of the ICE thugs who go after law abiding immigrants rather than the criminals because they are easier to apprehend while dropping their children at school or going to a low paying job to support their families.
They have no respect for human beings just the number they can indicate they deported.
9
There is everything you have to know about California liberals. Referring to people who've committed a federal crime entering the country as "law abiding immigrants".
8
Now legal immigrants, please don't bother about going through the immigration steps to come here legally. Just come in illegally and all will be well.
8
I hope that for their sake Califonians will learn to live a bit more frugal since the federal government is no longer subsidize their big shot lifestyle. The party is over. Thank you
6
Ignorance is bliss!
2
The Federal government subsidizes California? And this coming from a Tenneseean?? Talk about alternate reality!
14
I was under the impression that Ca received $.75 for each dollar it gave to the federal government. I think you might be thinking of many of the southern states.
6
We had Sherman’s march to the sea, now we need Mattis’ march to the Pacific!
4
Wonder how some people's sickness started, and whether it's contagious.
4
Ask Jerry Brown
1
California always does what's good for Californians! If California were to secede, it'll be our loss. No more billionaires and their high-tech innovative companies, no more almonds and pistachios, wineries, holidays in San Diego surfing in 72 degree weather, no more celebrities, no more red carpet strutting and now losing all chances of making marijuana legal. Imagine the jolt when our coffers don't get California's taxes, especially when the moocher Red States are made to pay $1 to get $1 back. How unfair to them!! Meanwhile California will spend all their high taxes on themselves. Win-win for California.
PS New York, take notes!
21
Won't happen. California was once fiscally responsible, and now that it won't be subsidized by the other states through Federal Tax deceptions, it will be again. We love it here, and we're not all idiots. We'll preserve our privileges, even if it means getting rid of the plantation like conditions for our illegals and the tenured minimalist conditions for our state bureaucrats.
1
You better watch who's going to mow our lawns, pick our lettuce, nanny our kids when you get all your wishes and get those illegals off the "plantation."
5
How horrible if Californians end up having to mow their own lawns, and take care of their own children. Actually, that will likely be good for the children.....
3
As much of the country looks at California like it's some fringe group of loosey goosey libreal waste land, so few people realize that despite our evil nature here, we do provide 1/5th of the income to the Federal government. That paves a lot of country roads across the county. And more important, we are just Americans' like the rest of the country, and we want the best for everyone. But let's not keep biting the hands that feed you.
21
They should be paying 2/5!
2
You do realize CA (yes a US state) is the fifth largest economy in the world. Maybe they should withhold their federal tax dollars from all of those whiny red states.
15
So, you want to freeload on California's money. What does that make you?
3
As a resident of Hawaii I'd like to correct Ms Jeffe. Beyond California is more than just ocean. Beyond California is Paradise.
14
CA may be a great state, but is not pulling its fair share in National Defense
13.3% of the Nations 18-24 year old, but enlists only 11.6%
Fly over country , the North East Central region, 21.3%
Data
https://www.scribd.com/doc/234387674/State-Enlistments#fullscreen&fr...
3
As a Californian and a former draft resister, as say bravo California youth! You're smarter than the kids who want to continue endless wars for the sake of neoliberalism.
8
So you went to Canada then? You mentioned you were a draft dodger.
1
Check your stats. The poorest states contribute the most recruits because those states have failed to create a thriving future for their young people. Sad. And next time you visit San Diego, take a drive around and check out some of our military bases: North Island Naval Air, Miramar, Coast Guard Air Station San Diego, Camp Pendleton, Naval Amphibious Coronado, Sub Base Point Loma, Space and Naval Warfare Systems Center Pacific, and I could go on, but you get the picture. Tourism and the military are the largest businesses in San Diego. We are all part of "National Defense" here.
6
Trump must be stopped by lawsuits immediately. The blue states are being targeted for not voting for him. This is obvious. We are being punished with higher taxes and Trump still hasn't shown his tax return. Hold the Democrats responsible for not suing Trump.
16
Phil, Is it fair that the rest of the low tax states are subsidizing highly taxed bloated bureaucratic states like California and New York?? Don't worry about lawsuits all of the liberal judges are quietly being replaced with Constitutional based judges that read the law as law and not creating policy from the bench. Democrats are toast almost everywhere their party has led America to almost ruin!
4
It’s a real easy online search to learn that California pays more in federal taxes than it gets back.
7
David, your argument is garbage. California ends up sending much more in tax dollars to the Feds than they receive back. Yes, we used to have a generous mortgage deduction, but even then we were sending much more in income taxes to Washington than we were receiving back. But I understand how much you want our money, and of course, we will oblige you as we are a generous state. As for "liberals" legislating from the bench, you are seeing a lot of conservative jurists doing their version of that now. Look at gun law decisions from the SCOTUS and anti-abortion decisions across the country. Apparently, everyone gets in on that game. And as for Dems "ruining" the country, they're amateurs compared to DT and Co.
9
I'm proud of how my State is responding to Trump. Resist!
27
Pay your fair share of taxes!
3
We pay more than out share.
3
The simple truth is the US needs California far more than California needs the
US. CA is the economic engine that drives this country and it has been for decades. The US, under Trump, is a failing nation while California thrives. Most of us would be happy going it alone.
24
The Trump Administration and Congressional leaders have declared war on the Blue States. California, New York are leading the battle to our country back.
11
Funny I think it's the rest of country trying to bring our great states of New York and California back into some form of economic sanity....the only thing going for NYC is Wall Street...if that goes away NYC is collapse! Alot of people leaving both states...just sad.
4
Actually the blue states declared war on Trump and Republicans. Remember you guys were burning cars, beating people on the streets, damaging property on election night and inaugural day? So like the Communist/Marxist nations the world over.
4
California is not alone, nor unique, in suffering abuses under the Trump agenda. South Carolina doesn't want oil and gas exploration, and Colorado does not want the DEA harassing its residents. Their Republican Senators, Goldfinch and Gardner, were clear that the "will of the people" in their states would not be abused. Let's go Congress, there is common ground here.
10
Within a few decades, California will mirror its neighbors to the south, namely Mexico, and Venezuela.
Good luck Californians.....
9
Time for you to move to a more Trump friendly state. Demographics are destiny. California has a bright future because of its diversity.
16
Time for a two-state solution......
Trumpland will be a petro theocracy in the Saudi model.
California and those ready to join the 21st century will comprise the other nation.
Our "democracy" is too flawed to function as a real democracy, so devolution into one or more sovereign nations is required.
9
Actually, when I go over to California it's like going back to the 20th Century...like 1970's when it was great. California is all about beach, laid back (because there are no jobs-worse unemployment in USA), worse infrastructure (just drive I-10 from Arizona and you'll see), old raggedy buildings. Also we are not a Democracy, we are a Constitutional Republic based on each state joining the Union with conditions.
1
It is not one America versus another. It is America versus the Socialist, Progressive, communist left. Democrats! Please move to a place that has already fully implemented your political views! Venezuela, Cuba, North Korea come immediately to mind!
11
Seems you’re the one who should be moving. As for me, I’ll look to emigrate to California upon its secession.
16
Or stay, where we're implementing the political views of the likes of Pinochet's Chile, Argentina under their generals, Saudi Arabia, Nicaraguan contras, Turkey.....
4
Bye! Hope you have lots of money for a house-or you can always live in your car, like many other Californians.
1
Since foreign aid to Pakistan is being drastically cut if not eliminated, foreign aid to California should also be eliminated
2
Be careful what you wish for. CA is one of 14 donor states that, even before the new tax law, pays far more in Federal taxes than federal benefits received. Considering the GOP’s lack of engaging the Democrats in the Senate and House of Representatives in 2017, that sounds like Taxation without representation. You might remember that issue arising before in our history, and the revolution it fueled.
And a final FYI, the vast majority of donor states are blue.
22
I wonder if the whole west coast should withdraw from the Evil Empire of the U. S. I would then hope to relocate in California from Trump's Ohio -- if travel to a foreign country were not forbidden. Known Californians visiting my state of Ohio might be detained by ICE, of course -- I guess they would be refugees and not on a safe list.
8
NYC would like to join you!
2
Martha, go live there for a year and get back to me on your thoughts about California....and the rest of the USA!
If you are wealthy, it’s probably a great place for you. No passports though.
I hope Me. De Leon is going to personally indemnify those Californian taxpayers who are assessed fines and interest for fraudulently claiming a charitable deduction for what is in economic reality a non- deductible state tax payment. Alas for all the schemers, federal tax law is based on economic reality and not transparently phony games.
6
Fines?? There should be prison for everyone who partakes in this blatantly illegal tax avoidance scheme
2
The ploy of making contributions to the government deductible for federal income tax doesn't even require legislation to be invalidated. If I make a $25 contribution to PBS and receive a $10 coffee mug in exchange, my charitable deduction is limited to $15, the difference between how much I gave and what I received in return.
If I donate $15,000 to a municipality and receive a waiver on $15,000 worth of property taxes, zero is deductible for federal income tax purposes.
6
Only the clinically insane think this idea isn’t anywhere near legal
3
Better run it by the stable genius in the WH.
8
I love the East Coast, where I'm from but I loathe the 'binary' way California, where I currently live, is portrayed in the NY Times; it's stuck in the 'fruits and nuts, 'stoner,' 'smog,' 'surf wars,' 'earthquake and fire' reporting mode and so are some of its readers. I'm sick of NYTimes leads with cannabis pics — Go pick on Colorado for a change. California has a governor I wish were President, the most progressive environmental legislation in the world, the most diverse and accepting population, the best ACA coverage as health insurance, a vibrant and innovative economy, first-rate state universities, virtually free community colleges — oh, and sublime weather and scenery. Of course there are issues to address. Isn't that true of all states?
32
right on! we are strong, diverse and we have a mature interest in fixing our problems!
15
I don't understand the constant hyperfocus on cannabis either. I've lived in California for 30 years, and sure, it's available, but it doesn't dominate our existence. Alcohol is still the substance of choice everywhere--most of the people I know are somewhere on a scale of "never" to "occasionally" when it comes to pot use, but drink almost daily.
7
I think you from the frying pan to the fire by switching Coasts, both are dysfunctional! Again, the world class universities are unaffordable for most Americans, so full of of children of rich foreign autocrats mainly Chinese those Americans that pay for their college...can't pay back their loans after college because they can't picture moving out of California where the jobs and affordable housing are to be found. ACA is about to go broke and the Universal Health will absolutely break California economy at $400 Billion which includes taking care of illegals.
2
No. It is America, as legitimately Constituted, vs. people who CALL themselves Americans, while despising all that IS America.
6
California owes reparations to Americans for the decades in which Californians rigged the system to avoid paying their fair share of taxes. It’s immoral how little they paid!!
6
"Fair share of taxes." Example please. We pay ridiculously more to the federal government than wherever you live right now. Unless it's one of the other Trump whipping states like NY or NJ. And we get ridiculously little back from the federal government in return. It galls me that much of what I pay in federal income tax is being wasted on you, while my family will probably never see a dime of what you send to Washington.
8
Well, just maybe this will be the end of the cynical, lying Republican Party in California. That would be worth something, wouldn't it? Then, on to New York. Republicans will never get quite all of the white bigots in the rest of the country either, so, maybe there's some hope in the long run, eh?
6
As the GOP often insists, states are venues for experimentation. What works in states, they insist, can often work for the rest of the country. Keeping that in mind, isn't it time for the GOP to acknowledge that California and New York have been successful "experiments," whereas places like Kansas, Wisconsin and Oklahoma have been dismal failures when it comes to innovation, diversity, education and quality of life?
19
Pay for your own experiments!
3
California schools, and NY schools are abysmal. Quality of life is fine if you are wealthy and can afford a home.
3
Several of the negative comments about CA seem to echo the statement of a friend of mine when she visited her son in SF: "Why would anyone want to live here? It's so crowded!"
Regarding the housing problem: The real problem is not that there are a few places, like SF and the whole Bay Area, that have too many people wanting to live there.
The real problem is that many people are rejecting the suburbs, but most cities in this country are not attracting enough people because they're boring, they’re ugly, they have insufficient or even nonexistent public transportation, they can't attract interesting jobs, they can't attract ANY jobs, they are car-centric and unwalkable, they have few or no cultural attractions.
Also because they are prejudiced against gay people, trans people, people of the wrong religion, people of no religion, people of the wrong color, intellectuals, and people of an open-minded political and cultural outlook.
Here’s how to fix the problem of homelessness in exciting, welcoming cities: make all the boring, narrow-minded cities more exciting and welcoming!
8
I don't think most people care about someone's sexuality in our day to day life. You are right about some things, but California is not addressing their roadblocks for developers to build affordable housing, and removing rent controls to make building housing profitable, which creates the housing everyone is looking for in very innovative ways...try going vertical more in expensive land etc....pods etc..
1
So your solution to Calofornia’s homelessness problem is to export your homeless to other states? How very liberal of you.
1
Having had the great HONOR of being able to visit extensively all 50 OF OUR GORGEOUS states over the course of my 72 years it is perhaps the state that has given me shelter for the past 40 years, California, that stands out as being not only the absolute most stunning by its diversifed ecosystems - from the redwoods and sequoias of the Sierra Nevada, to its' pristine coast line from Oregon to Mexico, the rolling highlands of its' Central Ciast to the Cascade Muntains and vinyards of Napa Valley and the manade splendors of San Francisco Bay and San Diego that have contributed to the unparalleled compasion and generosity of its citizens towards the migrants and less fortunate of the Great Depression that all helped to harvest its fruits. GOD BLESS LIBERALS WHO REFLECT THE VALUES OF OUR ONE GOD. EMPATHY.
37
Thanks for visiting, how long ago was this??? Because it's not how you describe, there's been some fires lately due to manmade situations. It can be a garden again unfortunately the Socialists are in charge now.
3
It's easy to see why the Republican Swamp in Washington wants to ruin California: They're jealous! ~ cause we have the richest and most beautiful landscapes and industries, and the most beautiful people, of all colors and stripes, who actually get along! We believe in Live & Let Live ~ and that obviously really irks all the racists, misogynists, and xenophobes, who want to build their Wall here, stop people from enjoying marijuana here, and now drill for oil off our coast. But we are almost 50 million strong, and we are not going to let any of these equally stupid things happen, ever!
24
39 Million, of which 20% are illegals and another 30% of that 39 Million are not involved in contributing anything to the economy either through employment or paying taxes. The landscapes are not being taken care of...there is trash everywhere due to homelessness and just plain abject poverty and ignorance. Silicon Valley is quietly leaving California, yet people there don't even see it, other basic industries are moving the bulk of their business to other states and keeping just an empty shell office to say they have a California presence. People there do, not "get along," I've seen quite a few traffic confrontations and rude people.
5
Mr. Laney, have you ever been outside of CA? I always think its funny when people pretend California is so terrible. Especially those who live in CA. Go to a red state and see how great it is. People get along very well and I have always found Californians to be the most friendly and polite in my travels and having lived there.
3
David: If California is so horrible, why not leave and go to one of the Red States. yyu will be much happier there. Poorer but happier.
3
The inevitable conclusion this is no longer the UNITED States of America, California's values differ dramatically to red states, we are far closer to Europe, Canada and Japan than we are to Arkansas, Montana etc.
Trumps vindictive nature dominates when it comes to California , the Tax Bill, w the Paris Accord, allowing off shore drilling putting our coast line at risk, the attack on legalized Pot , not an issue for Trump until it was legalized here.
California is not perfect, we are too bureaucratic, house prices , taxation too high.
However the opportunities are enormous , reservoirs of renewable energy which could be linked to the manufacture in this State of Solar equipment as an example.
California is a tourist paradise we can develop this focusing on drawing tourists from Asia , developing our own equivalent of a gambling paradise to rival Las Vegas.
We need an economic plan which can build a strong financial base to fund a universal health care which will attract industry which is over burdened by extremehealth care costs elsewhere.
We can ease our infrastructure problems by applying an environmental tax on all imports through our ports which use our roads etc to reach other States.
I could go on, of course the concept of the Pacific States of America is intriguing but very difficult but at least let's start by throwing out all federal politicians of either party who do not pledge to fight in Washington DC for our State
9
The Confederates in California need to realize the South lost
7
Yes...let's go the way of California...no English, no jobs, no law, no accountability, etc. But they have nice weather...except for the fires, the illegals, etc.
14
I taste sour grapes here!
4
If California is so terrible compared to where you live, why is that most of our immigration comes from East of the Rocky Mountains?
2
I guess it has escaped your notice that California, like most blue states, has an out migration problem, and only the flow from south of the border stems the population loss. How do you think that will work out in the long run?
1
Memo to California: pay your fair share of taxes!!
5
Memo to Larry; We pay more Federal taxes that we get back in Federal services. If you paid your fair share, my taxes wpould go down!
3
California must secede. The United States can pick up Puerto Rico so that the flag doesn't have to be changed.
9
Why on earth would Puerto Rico want to join the USA after the way the trump administration is treating them? Fifty percent of the people are still without power. Would they fare any better as a state?
Here's a far better idea. How about the rest of the blue states secede with California and form their own country and offer the people of Puerto Rico to join this new FREE country with a sane leader instead of some delusional wanna be dictator who belongs in a padded room so he can't harm himself or others? I, for one, am sick of my tax dollars to pay for a bunch of ingrates hellbent on destroying the country that I love. Let them wallow in their hatred, ignorance and fear. It's nothing less than what they deserve for putting such a dangerous imbecile in the position of the most powerful man in the world.
5
Puerto Rico was a disaster long before Trump became president. The Puerto Ricans are responsible.
3
No we need to let PR go, they really need to be their own nation, should have done that 50 years ago! Cal needs to be reapportioned, with the Sierras going to Nevada, Northern California merges with Oregon, Southern California merges with Arizona, maybe a strip of Central Coast up to SF as a separate state.
Immigration law is not made by states, it is a federal prerogative. And the Soviet Socialist Republic of California is not above the Constitution.
12
Californians have been able to retain the American Dream but they are also aware of the fragility of what they have enjoyed. It makes them smarter that Trump and those in the Republican Party like Ryan and McConnell who have wealth and power but don't really understand from what it is derived. California is a rich, naturally diverse, and vital state where people can do well if they try, but it is also one that is vulnerable to some very obvious limitations. The economy is enormously productive both because of location and because of the clear advantages of living, working, and doing business in the state. It lacks adequate watershed to support all the human activities and over it's history, the effects of man behaving according to craven selfishness have been obvious to everyone. The growth of industries, of land development, agriculture, irrigation and power system along with air pollution, catastrophic loss of natural wonders do to man's activities, the uncertainties about nature due to fire, flood, and earthquakes all have made Californians certain of human activities power and of humanities' ability to spoil good things.
6
“our pristine coastline.”, seriously? Stand at Imperial Beach and look toward Mexico and watch them ejecting sewage straight into the Pacific Ocean. There is nothing "pristine" about California.
11
Whoops. You must have missed the other 839 miles of our coastline out here during your recent California fact finding mission. And the redwoods. And the Sierras, And the deserts. And you live where? Texas? Glass houses, brother. Glass houses.
8
My thoughts exactly. But it doesn't surprise me that one poor Texan justifiably green with California-envy would extrapolate the entire state's environment based on one border stream bed in the farthest possible southwestern tip of the entire state (and nation). Their education system is pretty hobbled by a malaise of science phobia.
4
Is California annexing other states? Countries? The good old US of A has had its up and downs, and overall a great run. But that states' rights thing, so boffo in the 18th century, has worn out its welcome.
3
Wow, I never realized California-envy was such a big phenomena until reading some of the comments below. Folks, listen up. No one here in California is begging you to come here. In fact, please don't. We're the future, and you are the past. We'll do just fine without you. Governor Brown is an honored guest around the world, and Donald Trump has to proclaim he's a "stable genius". Good luck to you all.
41
All blue states need to secede or at least stop sending our tax dollars to the red states. That would be retribution for all the destructive Trump policies towards the blue states.
11
Blue states and the blue cities in red states are our economic engines. Their well educated tax payers support a social safety net and they pay for it. Low tax rural red states should pipe down or pay more taxes.
7
Note that marijuana is listed as a Schedule I drug by the Drug Enforcement Agency. Other Schedule I drugs include:
Heroin
LSD
Mescaline (Peyote)
MDMA (“ecstasy”)
GHB
Psilocybin
Methaqualone (Quaalude)
Khat (Cathinone)
Bath Salts (MDPV)
Equating marijuana with other more powerful drugs appears to be based on ideology rather than science.
19
Charity, is given as a choice, as there's nothing charitable in forced acquisition. I'd love to see California truly make their taxes charitable and then watch how many uncharitable Californians don't pay there "taxes."
7
If the 2 states solution was sabotaged by the Liar in Chief, maybe it could apply in America.
The no vision/retrograd America vs the progressive/oriented towards the future America. So easy to decide. Dump Trump!
7
I lived in Los Angeles in 1959. At the time I was but a boy and we had to leave because the smog was so bad my father suffered from nose bleeds. However, there was lots of open land and it was possible for even middle income people to own a nice home. The CA population was about 15 million.
In 1970, I declined a full scholarship to UCLA but the costs of an education there were $300 per semester. The population was about 20 million.
When my sister married and moved to LA in 1975, the family and I returned to be together. The air was much clearer then it had been and community college was practically free. Prices of houses had gone up, but they were still reachable. My sister and her husband bought a 3 bedroom condo in Santa Monica for $75,000.
Today the population of California is almost 40 million and the condo would cost at least $500,000.
The traffic density and the housing density is so great it is unbearable. The poverty rate is the highest of any state at almost 25% of the population. The cost of tuition at UCLA and board is now $33,000 per year for residents, for non residents it’s$60,000.
Watching California chewed up by miles upon miles of highway it dwarfs what the impact of offshore oil is. It’s poverty and population are greatly impacted by immigration.
CA is no model.
16
And your model state is???
7
The point is that if California I'd the future, it doesnt work
1
CA is over-populated. Maybe it will figure out what to do about it and show the rest of us.
As a native Californian three generations back I love this place. Now if it wasn't so expensive... I always think a big earthquake is good to get some people to flee because it's too crowded. When I go out to the rest of the U.S. I always breathe a sigh of relief to be back. We are the future. We are progressive. We are tolerant. The inner counties of CA don't really count because everyone's living on the coasts. Well they do because they're growing the food but they might as well be Kansas! This state is great. There's no way around it!
11
Susan, all California has to do is work with Federal Government to enforce illegal immigration. California is the future, it's a very scary one and something that should be fought with great vigor! Freedom, real individual freedom is the future, not Progressive slavery to a single government entity!
1
OK you Californians, stay stoned, ignore the obvious, hire illegals to do the heavy lifting and pay under the table. what could go wrong?
11
Your long coveted minimum wage job at the carwash will soon be available.
13
With no car to wash! California wants you to get rid of your car, just wait they are going to make you guys pay additional tax for every mile via a monitor hooked up to your car!
1
Geoff. Spoken like a true liberal. You're all for exploiting illegals to lower wages but can't believe the people displaced by those workers are upset.
1
we're moving ahead despite right wing negativity, fear, and hate. we can't wait.
the Confederacy may have captured D.C. and have strong support in the old CSA states, but coddling Russia while attacking the California Republic is utter foolishness.
28
Let's hope that prohibition ends soon all over the country! Congratulations to California for their HUGE step forward. Hopefully we will do the same in New Jersey with our new governor. The old one still believes that Cannabis is a gateway drug. Coffee is a gateway drug. Fast cars are a gateway drug. Liquor is a gateway drug. Let's stop trying to legislate this 5000 year old medicine!
17
California is in many ways a failed state and its state government unethical. Pension system totally unsustainable. Sanctuary state means it flouts and flaunts immigration law for votes and it is easy for non-citizens to vote, all you need is a driver's license and California provides that to non-citizens. California leads the nation in intolerance because it creates inequality by giving non-citizens benefits and rights equal to those who applied legally to enter the U.S. Using ethnicity for political advantage is corrupt. California is a corrupt state. Crime and homelessness are pervasive in California. Mainstream media has become a shill for democrats hiding corruption and incompetence by not reporting it, especially in California. Oro Dam disaster was another California failure. It is a state mired in failure.
22
I have the Golden Gate bridge to sell you...
2
The world's 6th largest economy surely speaks volumes of their failure. The entire country is corrupt and the red states are the most obvious except to their under educated electorate.
5
I can't stand Trump and wish he were not president, but allowing illegal aliens to stay in the US is wrong for a lot of reasons. I wish Democrats would see and admit this.
Legalizing pot has pros and cons but is not as big of a deal.
17
You'll be thrilled when you're paying four times as much for your fresh produce....if it's even available....
12
90% of all of the agricultural workers in California, which supplies the bulk of the nations fresh fruit and vegetables, are either Mexican or of Mexican decent......do you understand the dynamic of that at all??
11
If they can’t get their Napa Cab because no ‘Mericans wanted to work. (Tough work picking grapes by fingers. Not everyone wants to work that hard). Then and only then will they say what can we do about it.
1
Two problems with the article. Although the impressive size of California's economy is mentioned, the fact that it is growing and doing so in a way that respects the environment, people's health and cultural roots is not. Also not mentioned is the fact that Trumpism goes beyond Trump to a benighted but politically-important sector of the electorate. In fact, California and other west coast states have already created a chasm between their successful 21st-century economic and societal model and those whose policies are attempting to pull America back to a new dark age. Trump's demise will not smooth over the rift that has developed. The question seems to be: Will California declare a second republic and move on to a prosperous future or hang with with a federal government that views the Mississippi and West Virginia of the 1800's as its ideal?
18
Give them their independence. Then see how log they'll love those slices.
4
Cali will do better without the other 49 states than vice versa.
23
California is simply 1 State out of 50, not particularly special either. Being from there, I clearly see mess that left-wing politics has wrought.
They should read the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution, and prepare for less federal aid and more isolation from mainstream America.
Enjoy those high state taxes, the rest of us are no longer subsidizing you. If you want to take on the IRS with your charity scam, go for it!!
14
In that instance, perhaps California will stop contributing to the federal coffers and then we'll see how well Louisiana fares, a state that boasts hundreds of years of corrupt politics, the second worst education system in the U.S. and crushing poverty for a majority of it citizens.
17
California receives 78 cents on the dollar for every dollar it puts into the US Treasury. South Carolina receives $2.16 in federal funding for every dollar it puts into the US Treasury. now who's supporting who, my friend???
22
And what paradise are you living in now? Describe its wonders to us.
8
Interesting to note, in some of the comments here, that people who live in red states and have been glamoring for years about states rights, now turn on California for demanding the same thing. Shouldn't they be happy that California is now on the same side as them?
22
California must not forget the only precedent we have for this Constitutional crisis
of their own making. There will be no secession, only concession.
If it comes to this, remember these words:
"...that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain -- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth." AL
5
And in California, as in Illinois, those dead STILL vote.
6
Too many Californians have a messiah complex, believing they are saving people from poverty and corruption while caring little about the societal costs for legal residents. The increasing burden of poor, uneducated and often criminal illegals, who use more services than will ever pay for, has the State in a death spiral of increasing taxes and larger loans to balance the State budget. So go off and get high Californians as you need not worry about marijuana impairing your judgement.
11
How's that wind chill?
4
I am so thankful I live in California. Californian politicians are heroes. On the whole, California just "Works". At this point in time, I am much prouder of the California flag than the American flag. The White House and Congress represent an axis of evil to me. They are doing their best to make our country the opposite of "Great".
27
Dude, I don't know hold old you are or if you've traveled but California, does not "work," far from it, it's about "fail" Hang on it might not be bad thing to hit bottom then real solutions can come about...perhaps new partitions, Southern California will be absorbed by Arizona, New Mexico and Texas.
1
Bless you California.
25
As a Californian now, expatriated from New York, I am always amused by people talking about how “liberal” California is. It has the county’s most regressive tax system, it’s the largest exploiter of illegal immigrant labor, it’s public education system is third to last in the country, its prison system is run by private companies who have a financial interest in keeping the incarcerated indefinitely, and it has the highest level of income inequality in the country. With “California values” like this, it is no wonder that the state went all in for Hillary. If the democratic leaders in the state really want to actually earn the moral authority they falsely claim, they could start with a repeal of Prop. 13, which shifted the tax burden from the wealthy to the poor and middle classes. Mark Twain said that a man who can read but doesn’t has no advantage over the man who can’t. Similarly, Democratic legislators who know what democratic values are but refuse to fight for them have no advantage over Republicans. The fact is that while Trump has been very busy dismantling every regulation in the bureaucracy that might have a negative effect on big business, liberals have been effectively silenced and Democratic leaders in California and elsewhere have just let it all happen. All of the Trump/Russia noise that the media is fixated on, the wall, sexual politics etc. is an intentional distraction from the reality that Democratic leaders just aren’t doing their jobs.
19
The matters discussed here are pretty fringe. From a few thousand federal arrests for marijuana use, to gender listing on birth certificates, the legal conflicts between the feds are a long way from monumental matters. What jumps out at me on my frequent visits to the state are that Hispanics are not a minority in any way shape or form, the huge population of the state is diverse in every way, and California is more of a melting pot than most other states. The state has aggressive environmental laws and lots of badly polluted urban areas. It is attentive to water quality and conservation, largely because it has to be. And, as for income inequality, compare San Francisco to the Imperial Valley.
A few minor differences in state law don't capture the matter. While California is distinct, it's mostly about demographics, wealth distribution, and a huge and diverse population. It's got its share of marijuana smokers and undocumented workers. But so does everywhere else. Focusing o nrelatively minor legislative differences doesn't capture the matter. It's the people and the environment that make California different.
7
As a state and a state of mind, California may have many, many problems but it does have the world's sixth largest economy. It's also expensive, the weather is awesome, nowhere in America is there better food and the state does loathe Trumo.
The last point is perhaps the most important.
20
Dude, it's slipped to 7th and I imagine 8th by next year and biggest doesn't mean the best, just means there are too many people living there! Weather isn't as good as it use to be...especially with all the wildfires started by homeless people tons of smoke! Food??? California barely grows anything anymore like they use to, the seafood comes from Seattle or Mexico!
2
Dude,
It's the 6th largest. You can have your opinion but not your own facts.
It's the most populated state in America, Duh.
Weather is great.
California barely grows anything anymore?
Tell that to my wife's restaurant group that sources everything from the greater Bay Area.
Like I said at the drop you are entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.
5
Californians. You keep bragging that your economy is the 6th largest in the world. So what? China's is second. Why aren't you all clamoring to move there??! Because the environment is terrible, it's poverty stricken, workers are exploited and...wait for it, housing is far too expensive along with all its other problems. Welcome to your future. Idahos economy doesn't make the list, but it's full of people from california. Yes, especially liberals. Hmmm.
13
When red states like Texas defy the federal government, leftists cry "Traitor" and bring up the Civil War. When California does so, we get these supportive stories that shower praise on their "taking a stand". The hypocrisy never stops.
12
It's simply brazen lying from the left...and in the "news" area of the Times, too.
Simple as that.
how sad that it's come to this...
but take hope! Liars NEVER win.
NEVER
3
When lefties demand certain federal laws be enforced and others ignored - it’s common sense and standing on principle.
When righties demand certain federal laws be enforced and others ignored - it’s the end of the republic.
Vice verse is also true.
Both sides are illogical and hypocritical to the point nobody should take them seriously.
1
Never? But, Trump won, right? Or, maybe he didn't.
People in California sound just like people in the back waters of Mississippi with their claims of "state rights" and their insistence that their views of the world are all that matters. Identity politics vs. white supremacy. Sanctuary cities vs. voter IDs. Antifa vs. neo-Nazis. Both want the federal government out of their states. Both states have too many homeless people and too much poverty (the fact that California mixes its poverty with great wealth and huge income inequality doesn't make the poor any richer or give the homeless a roof over their heads).
13
1 in 10 Americans live in CA & it has the WORLD’s 6th largest economy - go ahead & come for us. We have Silicon Valley, Hollywood and a whole lot of the nation’s agriculture. Who needs whom?
10
9 in 10 Americans live outside California & the rest of the United States still has the world's largest economy. Remove the aerospace industry and the military installations from California, and see how California shrinks. If Trump could erect a wall between California and the rest of the United States, how many people would leave California and how many people would move to California before the wall is erected? California is home to the greatest income inequality in the United States, lots of rich people next to lots of poor people. And please keep Berkeley and Antifa.
9
Do you like your computer? Do you eat fresh fruits and vegetables? Do you watch television shows or movies? Friend, those didn't come out of Mississippi or Kansas, I can assure you?
8
Tony, at least by Gini coefficient, it looks like NY beats CA in terms of income inequality, with both red and blue states in the running for highest inequality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_Gini_coefficient
2
To the right that hates "liberal" California: the United States needs California more than California needs the United States.
19
And we will take it back.
The thing that is not made clear is that "Trump's America" is America. Cal Berkley did a survey (ya neve hear about this gem) on the subject of "sanctuary cities" and it showed Californians want California to obey the law. White black and brown they all come down in favor on non sanctuary pro law and order by a 70% margin. I'm afraid Trump is right once again Grey lady you are not reporting news u are trying to "form the narrative".......so it's fake.
13
And 93% of republicans also want gun control.
2
Only thing wrong with California is that Devin Nunes crackpot from the 22nd district. Get him out of there!
15
As a Californian, but first a proud American, I'm doing everything I can to counteract the vicious policies of Twitler and the Repugnants, who are unfortunately NOT a '90s grunge band. California has always been in the lead historically, moving forward toward tolerance and inclusivity. Progress isn't inevitable, as history and recent events clearly show, so constant vigilance and pushback are necessary.
11
Selling drugs to anyone who wants to get stoned isn’t “progress.”
Just the opposite.
8
RobertC
Can I assume that in your Louisiana no one sells alcohol to anyone who wants to "get drunk"?
3
Some of us think more access to drugs of any kind, by the most addicted population on earth (the u.s.) may not be a step in the right direction.
Go California, Go
The future of America lies with you.
Trump’s America is to go back in time. Wants to look like Alabama of the 50’s.
20
Trump has a house here in Beverly Hills but notice he is never here. Nor is he ever at his local golf course in Rancho Palos Verdes. This is because he has been soundly rejected here. So what does he do? Goes after California. Sad.
17
It’s worth reading NYT Upshot, Dec 23, 2017, ‘What Happens When Richest US Cities Turn To The World’. Targeting Regions of responsible for the future economic growth,
4
I continue to be amused that despite the GOP's frequent mockery of CALIFORNIA, Mitt Romney chose LA JOLLA as the site for his oceanfront estate, along with the car elevator for his foreign made Audi Q7 and the stable for Ann's tax-deductible horse .... instead of the coastline of some RED state like Florida or Georgia or South Carolina or North Carolina or Alabama or Mississippi or Texas.
11
Romney is Globalist - no different from Pelosi or Schumer.
5
It’s amusing that liberals who love big government now think states rights are more important.
13
either the state or federal governemt whichever protects citizens from wealthy authoritarians who would trample civil rights of the low we 90%.
7
Not this year or the next, but at some point the breakup of America is in the cards. Hopefully, peacefully!
I suspect it will take place after the supreme court becomes firmly in control of the left.
Rules of law, common values, and language is what holds the nation together and all are breaking down.
More and more laws and rules left to the bureaucracy and lower courts.
States ignoring federal laws and the federal government picking what laws to enforce or not.
I imagine three separate regions making up what is now the USA. It was a good ride while it lasted.
6
Cascadia! Bring it on!
1
California is so great we can't stop them from moving to Arizona. Jerry Brown is our number one economic job creator in our state. Uber, et al, were being given so many regulations by California, Arizona said 'bring it all here and do what you want.' We now stole autonomous driving cars from San Francisco.
When they're tired of being highly taxed, with property/auto taxes, sales tax. A lot of Californians I know are pretty sick of it, now with a new gas tax, too. California is a nice place to visit, but I'd never want to live there.
4
Don't all of us wish the disgruntled Cali's could be persuaded to stay home.
Washington, Oregon and Hawaii stand foursquare with California (and find great comfort in the kind words of our brethren in British Columbia).
Trump and his gang of mobsters can continue to make fools of themselves and diminish the United States in the eyes of the world. We don't have to play. Within the Constitution (10th Amendment: "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
We will see you in Court.
If Messrs. Trump and Sessions want to know how how those of us in the West feel about them and how deeply we respect them they should look to the West; "Yes, the moon is rising all along the Pacific Coast."
11
Well Said!
6
Does the moon really rise out of the Pacific?
These do.
1
Trump is simply using the pot issue to get the state of California on board with his immigration policies . He has everything to gain and nothing to lose in California . California has become fly over country for any Republican President . The population flight numbers should be alarming for any resident of California .
3
What did republicans arnold schwazznegger, pete wilson, ronald reagan, two bushes and now trump do about potholes in SF roads ? Nothing. Zilch. They make the ultrarich richer, the poor poorer and the middle class has stagnated. We have had a big recession and a wall street crash under each republican president. Trump has caused a conplete meltdown in DC
9
Trump should send in the feds and raid every pot shop and grow facility in the state. This has been done in the past and since marijuana is still outlawed under federal law, it can and should be done again. Put the fear into any person or entity that intends to invest in this industry and send Brown a strong message that he cannot usurp laws to push his progressive agenda. California already punishes good and celebrates evil and this would be a good way to change the trajectory of a plummeting socialist experiment.
2
Doesn't Colorado have the same laws in effect? And Colorado is collecting millions in taxes from marijuana sales. Maybe take a look at your own state before pointing a finger at ours.
17
California is making itself into Florida with their incredibly idiotic laws...Good luck!
3
JURY NULLIFICATION, in which a jury in effect nullifies a law that it believes is either immoral or wrongly applied to the defendant whose fate they are charged with deciding is an easy route to prevent Trump from overruling state laws on marijuana. It's a no-brainer.
4
California is the future, a progressive vision for a better more open world.
As a New Yorker I yearn to join you in resisting the constricted reactionary policies of Trump and the Republicans. We need to work together more than ever and defeat their policies and reform the Federal government to reflect progressive ideals!
7
This article contends that California's rebellion is the opposite of what happened when the Federal government enforced civil rights laws back in the 50s and 60s. Actually it's not that different. In both cases, it was/is Democrats defying the law of the land to protect their local preferences and proclivities. Yes, states have rights, but there are times and issues when Congress's decisions trump the willfulness of governors and legislators. This is one of them.
3
De Leon will be Feinstein 2.0 if he is elected to replace her. "More of the same" is not what we need, and perpetuating the California Democratic stronghold in its current form is unhealthy for America. Corporate Democrats are not our friends any more than Republicans are. Moreover, this flaccid media-hyped "resistance" we are (not) seeing is so peripheral as to be meaningless to most thinking people with an awareness of current global and local events. Where we need leaders to stand up to things like incessant US-backed foreign regime change pushing us into insolvency and massive erosion of our 4th amendment protections we instead get "Trump resistance" which mostly consists of paying lip service to challenging federal laws that were already on the books but have up to now gone unenforced. A big nothing-burger if there ever was one. Remember, California is the state where a Democrat shelved its public healthcare initiative despite having broad public support as well as a Democratic majority to supposedly push it through. This is not the Democratic party I recognize or support.
.
5
Exactly.
While we are on the subject of clashes between California and the Federal Government, why not explore getting rid of the Electoral College? After all, no state pays more in Federal taxes only to be shortchanged when it comes to the value of each and every citizen's vote in Presidential elections.
As to Trump avoiding a trip to California, I think it is fair to say he knows the "boo-birds" would be out in full force and, let's face it, his ego is incredibly fragile.
10
The title of this article, "In Clash Between California and Trump, It’s One America Versus Another", is inappropriately divisive. Do we really need more polarization and echo chamber "reality" in this country? This is not Michael Harrington's "The Other America" but, rather, the stereotyping of one state as mutually exclusive with how one would characterize the rest of America. What's next, a House Un-American Activities Committee based on branding entire states, not individuals?
Be careful what you wish for, when it comes to States Rights. The article correctly notes the history of segregation as a States Rights issue (and cover). By adopting parallel Constitutional reasoning, California is effectively legitimating actions by other states to do many things Californians would strongly oppose, especially in regard to classes of people not protected by the Fifteenth Amendment.
The article refers to "2.3 million undocumented workers". Unfortunately, "undocumented worker" has come to be a "politically correct" euphemism, much like "right to life." Certainly some anti-abortion folks strongly believe in a right to life, but some don't. (Consider their divergent views on the death penalty.) What they accurately do have in common is that they are anti-abortion. Similarly, some people who come here illegally are undocumented workers, but some are not. Words are important and, unlike the language coming out of the likes of Trump, Fox, and their ilk, our words should be accurate.
8
Having lived on the west coast my entire life I can say the California-Trump war applies equally to WA and OR. This coast has always leaned left, and since the 1970s it has shifted further left and now, especially in the metropolitan areas, is now ruled by a culture so extreme that dissent is dead. At times the coast feels like a cartoon version of a communist state.
Living there is exhausting because of the raw hatred towards Trump and can lead to, based on personal experience, being shunned, yelled at, and generally hated for simply having a different political perspective.
Because the west coast is stunningly beautiful, all this might be tolerable if the cities were still special, which they are not. Instead they are faux liberal utopias with high taxes, high housing costs, vast homelessness, failing infrastructure, miserable public schools, never ending protests and on occasion riots, rampant public drug use, and a smug moral self-righteousness that welds all this into a clinched fist if you see the world differently.
I left Seattle to find balance and moved to one of those hated fly-over states. Today I still have a stunning landscape, a diverse culture, where homes are affordable, and more. My quality of life has never been better and with my only regret is I didn't move ages ago.
Trump is not the cause, he is a symptom of a people that barely see themselves as American, they may need their own country. I for one will support building a wall to keep them there.
14
Your comment is right on -- I feel California has become a third world country filled with potheads and left extremists. The only truly livable city in CA that comes to mind is San Luis Obispo.
This battle is with the entire west coast from Canada to Mexico. Whether the policies are the environment, immigration, voting right, or progressive social values, the west coast citizens and state leaders are all largely in agreement. We are of such a large geographical area that we will be hard for the federale to corral. Our citizens and state officials are, have, and will resist!
5
What I don't get is why are these political hacks attacking one of the engines of growth for the country. Without New York and the West Coast the whole of the country suffers from a the economic activity that spills over to the rest of the states , as well as the revenue to pay programs that benefit the whole. You have one party trying to pull the country back to the 1950's and other trying to find a way forward into the new century. Your choice America.
7
It is the entire west coast with Oregon and Washington agreeing with California. This includes immigration issues and gun control. And several other states as well. It is not just California.
7
The states allow our nation to experiment with ideas and to see if they will work for the rest of the country. California isn't perfect but it is an economic powerhouse. Perhaps we should just live and let live.
8
Having once lived in California for a number of years I can attest that the state has many great qualities. The cultural diversity, innovation and progressive values are worthy of emulation by other states and even nations. With an economy larger than many other nation states the example California sets is one we should all consider even if we do not actually follow it.
And yet California faces some of the same major issues found elsewhere. The cost of living is often absurd, traffic is horrible in urban areas and the issue of water availability will likely worsen in future years.
As I followed the horrific wildfire season of 2017 in California I have felt a deep empathy for the many who have been harmed. The GOP and other countless idiots who deny climate change risk the lives of future generations with their abdication of serving their constituents by, gasp, actually *listening*. The impacts of climate change will not be felt equally. The California economy stands to lose a lot if the fire season of this past year becomes the new norm.
The damage wrought by the current self identified stable genius President may be with us for decades.
3
"...conservative Southerners, under the banner of states’ rights, fought violently to uphold white supremacy." It was DEMOCRATS!
2
@ScifiFan: Was there supposed to be something more to your statement- like a point? Or a point in time reference?
1
Sigh. Deflection isn't an effective argument, particularly when it's wildly inaccurate. Southern Democrats or "Dixiecrats" were the exact equivalent of conservative Republicans today before a party switch that took off largely in response to the liberal Democrat-led 1964's Civil Rights Act and was sealed with Nixon's Southern strategy.
1
Pretending that the Democratic Party of today is the same one that upheld segregation and bigotry pre-Nixon is disingenuous and silly. We are all aware of the Democratic Party's past and also aware that the white nationalists now have their base firmly planted in the Republican Party.
1
Trump. Sessions. Purdue. Melania. Pence. the whole lot of them.
They are 3000 miles away physically and 3 million miles away morally and spiritually.
The United States "government" is becoming more and more DISTANT each and every day. That, and more IRRELEVANT and more EXPENSIVE (new tax bill) and more DANGEROUS on the world stage.
Time to think OUTSIDE the red-white-and-blue BOX.
www.yesCalifornia.org
Think for yourself.
13
CA voted overwhelmingly against Trump for the 3P's of modern liberalism: progressivism, permissiveness, and promiscuity. Thank you.
8
California also provides a lot of cash to moocher states like yours. Don't insult the blue state hands that feed you unless you are willing to go it alone, Southern Boy.
7
Southern gibberish never influences the populace. Thank you.
5
@Jakes's Take
It worked in Alabama with the election of Doug Jones.
Dear lefties, Californians, open borders folks- please answer a basic question. How many people will it take to finally fill up California (or the country or world for that matter)? You are seeing every day what happens when you continue to stuff ever more people into the same area. You are the sixth largest economy in the world and a major energy producer, yet you import 1/2 your electricity and 2/3 of your oil and have 34% of this countries welfare recipients with 12% of the population. I know of no one in academics or anywhere else who thinks this is sustainable long term. I live in one of the only blue areas of Idaho that is over flowing with rich, liberal, educated excalifornians. None are planning on going back. After you get done calling me a racist, xenophobe etc, please answer the question. When are you/we full up? When do we have plenty? 100 million, 500 million, a billion? When?
11
@Al- Why are you telling us? There is an national interstate system and air space. Should we close our boarders to the rest of the Nation? Put out the word; everyone from Idaho- Stay home. How about helping to fix your own State? We're not self-haters here Al.
2
The Germans had a shorthand term for your argument: “Das Bot ist full” the boat is full. In the Thirties.
In answer to your question, what happens is you get the unparalleled economic powerhouse and unrivaled innovation engine that is California, plus a creative, diverse, beautiful, environmentally sustainable state that is literally the envy of the world. Hardworking immigrants have always been the engine that drives American. Only backwards cowards try to stop it and freeze time.
5
you seem to forget that many of the people in California are from other parts of the country, like the Midwest and northern Midwest. you're right, I am a former California and I won't move back until all those Democrats from the cold Midwest move back to the Midwest and give us our state back. But then you trumpists will be out of power in all of those States. so take the South and keep it. Lincoln should have let it go.
1
as a second generation New Englander family ,we used to think we would hope California would drop off into the ocean they are so wacky and weird. and now look,they may save us all.
10
Nobody wants to live in California, it is too crowded.
7
As opposed to New York? You're kidding, right?
1
As a Native Bronxite who moved to the Bay Area, I love California. Taxes may be high but I feel that I am getting value for my money. I think NYC services stink.
4
Reality check. You can take a big breath and relax. California gets 99 cents back for every dollar it gives the Feds, according to the California analysts office. Net contributor for sure, but not the abused saints some of these commenters are alleging.
4
Cherry-picked one year’s data. The avg is 70 cents on the dollar, over the past decade. Some years it’s as low as 60 cents.
In comparison, South Carolina gets $7 for every $1 they pay in fed taxes.
7
Just love seeing all the grey hair in the photo of the cannabis shop just getting on with living and let living. As I said recently in a comment to another article, after the rude awakening of 2016 and learning that the sick racist, sexist, homophobic, history of this nation is not only still alive but thriving, my love and patriotism for America has been destroyed. When I travel abroad, I don't even say I'm American now. I'm first a Californian. Thank goddess, I live here already or I would have followed my sister to Canada where she's ecstatically happy living among "normal", well-adjusted people who value their public health care.
26
We bought Canadian flag lapel pins to wear in Europe next month.
4
It's a huge relief to know the pot shops are able to cash social security checks.
We have more in common with Australians and Hawaiians and would do well to look to the west and a better tomorrow, rather than focus on the ongoing nightmare of yesterday's failed ideology and the corrupt, bankrupt politics to our east.
10
Your going to have to change your thoughts on open borders and immigration if you want to be like Australia. They have seen the down side of come one, come all and have largely closed their borders.
1
Go California!
10
I am a proud Californian opposed to literally everything Trump and his destructive and backwards administration say and do. Great article!
20
This left vs right battle doesn't work in framing our opposition to Trump. I easily out-conserv any so-called conservative. I'm pro life, but also a strongly feminist native Californian male. Im for secure borders but have nothing but love and admiration for all our southern neighbors.
What could be more conservative than wanting to preserve the beautiful land and climate we depend on for our existence? What bothers me about Trump is he behaves as if nature is under mans dominion; that nature has an economic value that can be extracted and exploited. Life is about so much more than business, and deals.
14
California has a new law making it a sanctuary state. This is a marked contrast to a referendum that voters passed by 59% in 1994 which would have ended the undocumented’s use of non-emergency health care, education, and other services. It would be interesting to learn what has changed over the 23 years.
2
As a Californian, I'm proud that we voted overwhelmingly against the Russian lap dog in Washington. I'm also glad that we are as far away as possible from an administration that is rushing full speed into the past. It was mentioned that the president hasn't visited California, well that's fine with me . . . stay away, please! Regarding the current clash between Washington and California, Republicans are always for state's rights, until they come across a state that doesn't agree with them.
16
I'm proud to be part of the Nation-State!I moved from Montana which has shown itself to cave to the Republican administration and conservatism in general. West coast is the Best coast!
7
I was a native Californian I left 38 years ago because all I could see was crazy people moving into the state. I think the reestablishment has finally taken hold in this state is just flat out crazy. Not a good place.
2
I wish it was possible to compartmentalize the country such that Trump supporters would live exclusively in one segment and be ruled by Trump as their president. The rest of us would live peacefully in another segment free from them. We would then build a high wall and prevent them from crossing over to our section.
7
One cannot have a properly functioning democracy if political subdivisions decide on their own not to obey federal laws. CA or any other state can pass any laws they wish provided they are not in conflict with the constitution and federal law. I could just imagine the outcry from CA residents if some other state would pass a law requiring all Hispanics to eat at a separate lunch counter from non-Hispanics. One of these legal disputes needs to work it's way up to SCOTUS so that some degree of sanity can be imposed upon CA and other state who may imagine themselves above the law.
6
AJ, expecting people to know history, be consistent, use language correctly, and understand Constitutional law clearly seems too much to ask, at least of Commenters. Hang in there, dude (or dudette). This, too, will pass.
To those who think this is the political and moral apocalypse of America, I simply suggest that they very quietly and very slowly walk past the Viet Nam Wall in Washington.
To those smug and self-righteous Californians who think they are better than other Americans, I simply suggest they travel across our country a few times at ground level, whether hitching, driving, or even taking Amtrak.
3
California is refusing to be ruled by idiots. California refuses to buckle under to stupid people to think that somehow a return to the late 1920s will better this country. thank God for California as it is. Someone needs to stand up to these idiots in Washington
7
You really believe the Constitution authorizes your sort of "separate but equal"(?) lunch counter? "Sad," to borrow a phrase from the Prez.
2
November 2018 will be the watershed. If the Dems don't come back strong in the House and Senate, either because of GOP success in gerrymandering and/or voter suppression or because too many states swallow the Kool-Aid of an incredibly cynical one-year tax break for the middle class and therefore stick with the GOP, it'll be the signal for Californians to get serious about secession.
I just hope they can somehow take along us like-minded folk in western Washington/Oregon (unfortunately the eastern halves of both states, though sparsely populated, are as deeply red as any you'll find in the old Confederacy--which would complicate secession for us considerably).
8
The perfect answer to Congress from California may be on the November 2018 ballot: closing the huge loophole for commercial property in Proposition 13. 40 years later, corporations and wealthy investors are underpaying California' schools and local governments by $11 billion. Amazingly, commercial property investors such as Donald Trump and Jared Kushner reaped the greatest gains of anyone from the tax bill.. Even right-wing blogger Joel Fox understands that the timing is perfect--40 years after Prop 13 began the period of reaction we've being living through, this will be a harbinger of the turnaround. Oh yeah, unlike for California's citizens, their property taxes will still be deductible.
4
As a lifelong Californian, I know California has problems, including housing, which has personally affected me. Sometimes I want to move, but every time I have tried, I come back. There is a deep spiritual understanding here that we are all in this together and that my happiness depends on yours, too. I hope we are the first state to institute single payer healthcare for everyone and we get rid of gasoline engines and ban all plastic containers and bags and innovate something compostable to take their place. There is a way to change everything for the better. All it takes is the belief it can be done, the diversity of people who have the minds and hearts to do it, and love for others, all of which exists in California.
12
I'm a native Californian, so count me biased towards my home state.
High housing costs are an issue, yet immigrants seem to manage, and there isn't a mass exodus, though it is a major reason they leave. The still continues to grow. The fix isn't obvious - some want unfettered development, others want more concentration of housing. Neither is an easy choice.
As for infrastructure (e.g bad roads) and increased gas taxes, chalk that up to the recession and CA's over dependance on state income taxes which fluctuate greatly with the state of the economy. When the recession hit, tax revenue plummeted and the state had to prioritize spending away from infrastructure to cover education, though education took a hit as well. Congress couldn't see fit to fund a large infrastructure bill during the recession to stimulate the economy, so roads suffered. The gas tax will help the state dig itself out of this decade long infrastructure hole. Hopefully it will be shared with the counties and cities so that they too can improve their roads and bridges.
The state is huge and diverse with all of the problems that come along with that. Taxes are high largely because of this. Though we have huge industries, they still aren't big enough to support the state government like gambling does for NV, or the oil industry does for TX and AK, so the cost falls to the people. Does the state waste money? You bet, but if you can make it here, you won't want to leave.
3
"Does the state waste money? You bet, but if you can make it here, you won't want to leave."
I'm a 2nd gen Californian and I left. Where I worked managers refused to interview engineers with families unless they first interviewed at a facility in WA as so many had moved to the site. At least some Californians honestly look at themselves, see below.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2017/08/10/hanson-is-california-finally-reac...
Illegal immigration over the last 30 years, the exodus of millions of middle-class Californians, and huge wealth concentrated in the L.A. basin and Silicon Valley have turned the state into a medieval manor of knights and peasants, with ever fewer in between.
The strapped middle class continues to flee bad schools, high taxes, rampant crime and poor state services. About one-third of the nation’s welfare recipients reside in California. Approximately one-fifth of the state lives below the poverty line. More than a quarter of Californians were not born in the United States.
Many of the state’s wealthiest residents support high taxes, no-growth green policies and subsidies for the poor. They do so because they reside in apartheid neighborhoods and have the material and political wherewithal to become exempt from the consequences of their own utopian bromides.
Less than 40 percent of California residents identify themselves as conservative. But red-county California represents some 75 percent of California’s geographical area.
2
California is not monolithic. There are still many who support the President. The Progressives benefit from the beauty of California but eventually it won't be enough.
4
Having lived in LA for years, It's quite obvious S Cal is it's own culture. It's been shifted and shaped by the enormous number of Hispanic immigrants who the liberal politicians cater to for their voting block. Politicians pandering for votes have changed the laws and continue to change the S Cal basin. Think about that. It's not been the middle class taxpayer demanding the change in culture. Also, having lived in the NYC, most of the upper and lower Midwest, it's obvious S Cal simply has been taken over by more liberal groups. HUGE taxes to support the non productive segments have Ca teetering on bankruptcy. At this point, CA is doomed. It's just a matter of time. Unless the borders are controlled better, the hastening of disaster will remain in full play.
8
wow. Things must be bad when the gated community types are calling for change.
Demographics are on California's side. This is where America is headed. Cry about it if you want, but it won't change a thing.
4
The demographics point to: crowding, poverty, resource depletion, lower wages, loss of open space and sky high housing costs. Like every other over populated place on earth.
5
In 1980, California was 27% Hispanic. 6 years later, Charles Schumer crafted an amnesty for undocumented workers and their families. This encouraged more people to move here illegally, on the bet that they, too, would eventually be granted amnesty. California is now 40% Hispanic, with more undocumented migrants than any other state, and more coming all of the time. The result is that California has a higher level of poverty than any other state.
According to The Public Policy Institute of California, 20% of Californians are living in poverty, and another 20% are having trouble paying for food, shelter, and other necessities.
In passing the “sanctuary state” law, California has made it clear that it welcomes the undocumented. It bars the police from asking about immigration status.
It will not matter if Trump succeeds in building his wall because smugglers have already begun to bring in illegal drugs and migrants by boat. Many smugglers use the same simple boats as Mexican fishermen. The boats have shallow drafts so they can be dragged up on shore. They depart from Baja California and discharge their passengers on some deserted beach up the coast near San Diego or further north.
The illegal migrants will easily blend right in with the rest of California’s Hispanic population, and will further increase the percentage living in poverty.
7
Sorry, but they don't blend in with any group. Most of them don't speak English and don't want to either. After generations pass, people are no longer immigrants. They become citizens. California is no doubt full of brown citizens and the illegals come here to help with the agriculture. Don't let others fool you into thinking illegals will take your livelihood away. That's hardly the case.
For the record, I'm with CA.
2
It's not just California - most Oregonians and Washingtonians are as antitrump.
2
Being anti trump doesn't necessarily mean pro California insanity.
1
In case anyone hasn't noticed, Trump and his staff have removed the "contact" link in the upper right corner of their web page and replaced it with "search". So if you want to get a word into the White House about anything, you first have to be an insider and probably get a number or address from your congresscritter. They don't WANT to hear from you, they don't care what you think and wish critics simply didn't have channels of imput to them, their allies and maybe politicians in general. If you are a parent asking for help with a son who's a prisoner of war someplace in the world, or have an unfair tax or housing situation, just shut up, the Donald knows best....
3
Can Travis County, Texas be annexed by California? Most of us here would feel more at home in their America than we do in Trump's America!
16
@Paul Smith: You gave me a chuckle; I am sure if Republicans felt they could they would redraw districts across state lines. Keep the faith Paul.
It's not complicated. Trump and his lickspittles hate California and the rest of blue America because we won't bend the knee to him. Authoritarianism only works if the majority at least tolerates it, and that will never happen out here, thank God.
34
While the Trump administration is rapidly descending into 24/7 personal attacks on the level of middle school social media, on the one hand, and attacking every little thing that makes America a good place to live (did you hear the one how Trump wants to pass a law enabling employers to take their employees tips for themselves?),on the other, California is finding constructive ways of making life better for its citizens. I'm with them.
27
You've got to give Jeff Sessions credit for being the most entertaining Attorney General in the nation's history. First, he just couldn't seem to remember meeting those pesky Russians, then he was found out. Then he just couldn't remember the conversations he had with those pesky Russians because, well, they weren't exactly expressions of your patriotism, are they, Jeff?
So the thing about Jeff's shiny, new marijuana initiative kind of loses its shine because of the fact that Jeff, and Jarad and Ivanka and Paul and Don, Jr. don't exactly have the credibility to trust them with the silverware, much less the country's secrets.
7
America is now like the old New Yorker cover. The map of America being NY and California. Inbetween is a blank space. So True and so Sad!
6
Well, I suppose California could sue the Trump administration in court, but if Federal law supercedes State law, and California ignores the court's decision can the federal government enforce the rule of law with the National Guard or troops?
1
Bring it.
CA contributes more men and women to the armed services than any other state. If it comes down to it, which side do you think they’d fight for? State over country.
1
What do you mean "if" federal law supersedes state law? Of course it does and always has. If push ever comes to shove defiant state officials can be arrested by US Marshalls and hauled in handcuffs before a federal magistrate.
4
Oh boy imagine the national guard trying to take pot away from peaceful citizens (including those who need medical marijuana). That's a PR disaster I hope Trump is foolish enough to put his foot into...
This is from those who believes in science:
"allowed parents to withhold gender on birth certificates".
There's no "gender" on the birth certificate, only "sex". Biological sex. Is it possible not to see biological sex of a newborn? Is there a new scientific definition of sex for human species?
7
Who cares? Why shouldn’t they? How does that effect you? In some cases, the benefit of the few out-way the benefit of the many.
Do you know any transgenders? It is a hard life, no one would choose.
Having empathy for LGBTQ people is one thing. Demanding that the entire culture be changed so that LGBTQ people can feel more included is quite another. Lasting cultural change always happens over a long period of time. Cultural change that is executed by fiat from the outside never lasts
4
@Cold Eye: Your arguments were also made against Black people. but-again- NO one is asking you or requiring you to change your sexual identity- are they? How long are you suggesting LGBTQ people wait for "cultural change"?
I think every state needs to have a viable yin and yang, i.e., two (or more) effective political parties. Without that there is no corrective when one party becomes too navel-gazing. We are seeing some symptoms of our home-state Democrats falling into this trap. On the Republican side, just look at what they've done to Kansas.
Republicans virtually disappeared as a political force in California as the consequence of two things: (1) a couple decades ago they pushed the xenophobic and anti-tax policies now being pushed by the Republicans nationally and the majority of the citizenry recoiled, and (2) California eliminated legislature-crafted district gerrymandering. Our districts are now drawn by the California Citizens Redistricting Commission consisting of five Democrats, five Republicans and four non-aligned members. These two factors have implications for many places elsewhere in the country.
Republicans will regain a presence in California when they develop positions that actually fit the aspirations and needs of Californians. Those positions will bear very little resemblance to the current positions of the national Republican Party and absolutely no resemblance whatsoever to anything associated with Trump.
25
A major problem of the Trump led Neo-Confederacy that is trying to rise up one last time is not just the rampant racism, but the willingness to dissolve the Union to benefit their personal greed.
This is a major problem FOR the Neo-Confederacy as well.
They cannot turn back time and expect everyone else to play along.
Republicans really should have listened to their 2012 Presidential Election Autopsy, but too bad for them their wealthy power brokers had no interest in sacrificing just a little to refashion the GOP under a kinder, more inclusive tent.
Instead they went the opposite direction with Trump.
5
The "creative" state tax gimmick will not work. Under federal tax law, the value of anything received by the taxpayer in exchange for his/her charitable donation, such as the dollar-for-dollar state tax credit in the proposed state law, must be used to reduce the deduction claimed for the donation. So the donation will have no value, and will produce no federal deduction.
5
The Federal Government needs California more than California needs the Federal Government. In two of three branches of the Federal Government, our votes count as much as 70 Times less than the votes in Republican states. We’re not quite at taxation without representation, but we’re pretty darned close.
25
I am of small town midwestern stock. I consider myself a moderate. I am willing to listen to just about anyones point of view. My time in the military put me in Rhode Island, Hawaii, San Diego, Spain, Sardinia, and a final tour on Washington State. I have had the privilege to serve in places that showed me a wide variety of the US and the world. I now live in western Washington State, the northern US anchor of the Left coast. There is a community here that starts up in northern British Columbia and extends to the Mexican boarder. The commonality of thought and sense of togetherness has fostered ideas that typically effect the rest of the country in a positive way. Look to us as medicine that initially may taste bad but brings you to health.
15
Nothing silly about talk of secession. The U.S. is sinking towards disintegration and we should plan for it, embrace it, and do our upmost to avoid the disastrous outcome of the last one. Why would California want to be oppressed by a country in which an Alabama general election voter shift of the same order as the Jones election wouldn't change the composition of its House delegation? You can't have a half democracy. The states that want a full one have to find their own way to creating one.
8
Rather than secede, Californians should do as we've always done, drag the nation (sometimes kicking and screaming) along behind us. With our economic and cultural clout, we can do it. Demographics are on our side; red America is dying of old age. We just need to be patient and keep going...
1
I too dwell on the idea of secession. California has the economic power and fair laws for protecting human rights and the environment. Trump and Session and ICE have punitive policies towards California politicians. This is intolerable.
I also wait with patience for the results of the midterm elections to provide ethical senators and representatives who will protect our democracy: (1) remove Trump from the presidency, (2) prevents foreign interference with our democratic election process, and (3) restores limits to campaign contributions so that common voters have influence over the decisions of congressional representatives.
By my measure who is a regular Jean Doe, California at this point would be my choice of State. Californians seem protected from the Federal onslaught thanks to their State Officials working hard for them. I would move there in a heartbeat even with it's fires, water problems and clogged roads. But I just cannot afford the real estate. I live in equally beautiful New York with a home paid for and all my family here. And I most certainly feel our State Officials will do the same for us New Yorkers. California and New York will be setting the standard, how to fight the Federal Government tyranny under Trump. And then the deluge will follow as one state after another follows this trend. Resolutions may become more important than elections!
11
New York does not provide a good governance model. I own a home in New York. I was an elected municipal official there. The unions have managed to establish a broken system in New York State where no one is accountable for the excessive cost of education, transportation or policing services or infrastructure construction and maintenance.
1
I am proud as a Californian that our state’s leaders are resisting many of the Administration’s harmful policies- especially with regard to the prejudicial tax bill, mean spirited immigration policies and dangerous, backward oil drilling proposals. But let’s be clear, we are not a utopia here in California. For most, it is quite the opposite. California’s failing public schools, failing infrastructure and out of reach housing costs have left many behind and has eroded quality of life and opportunity for many. California itself is now a state divided, though not politically but by class. There is a California for the wealthy where the children attend private schools and where families can afford the million dollar price tag for a modest home. Then there is the other California where, especially young people, teachers, service and retail workers struggle every day to survive and make ends meet in this high cost of living state. The struggle is evidenced by our enormous homeless population, driven by poverty as well as failure to provide services for addiction and mental illness. We are a beautiful state, a welcoming state but it is becoming increasingly difficult to afford to live here if you are not in the top 20% of income earners. Many who are able and who have ties in other states are fleeing to places more affordable and with better public schools. Soon California will be a state consisting of the very rich and the very poor. Or maybe we are already there.
3
Mexican immigration into the state has doubled in the last 40 years from making up 20% of the state’s population in 1980 to 40% today. If the trend continues over the next forty years, The population will be 80% of Mexican heritage. They will take care of the needs of The 20% who will be made up of the country’s 1% of wealthiest, who will elect another Trump, someone who can protect the status quo. Now THAT’S California values for you!
2
Apparently there is a lack of communication between California & White House. Elected officials representing California should have a direct link with the White House for negotiation and talk. I am surprised to see no such communication exists. Apparently, all the California politicians are busy with other things. Shame on them. This is not the wild West to see who can draw the fastest guns. This is the 21th century to see who can accomplish things for the country as a whole. California should be reasonable because you are not above all other states in the rest of the country.
1
There is one other important way that California is separating itself from Trumpland. California is forging ahead with the technologies and commercial applications of the future. This is driving Wall Street for the long term, Trump's tax cut is just short term stimulus. Trumpland is still waiting for the 1950s to return so they can be great again.
5
Trump has yet to visit Puerto Rico or even offer kinds words to the devastation its people are still suffering. He even seems to reflect the false assumption that Puerto Ricans are not US citizens.
Trump is clearly unfit to rule and he is not POTUS of all our people. He does not even pretend to represent all our citizens or majority public opinion on key issues.
I recently moved to northern Utah, and guess what? My lovely politically "conservative" state university town in the mountains is working hard for renewable energy (Utah has a serious air quality problem); teacher salaries were just raised; there is much love of and concern for the environment (tourism is a major source of our economy.
Our neighbors warned us that Utah's politicians are way out of touch with what the people want, and lots of Mormons here say they despise Trump and say he is the worst and most embarrassing president we have ever had.
My point is: If we pay attention, lots of states are ignoring Trump and GOP edicts, and quietly going about doing what needs to be done. The fossil fuel state of TX is leading the way in renewable energy https://www.npr.org/2017/03/07/519064002/texas-city-leads-the-way-on-ren....
Ideology and right-wing nonsense and propaganda are killing us. Let's be practical, ignore the right-wing ideology and propaganda, use common sense, and get together to fix what needs fixing. That used to be the American way.
14
Very well said!
Reading through a number of comments- some completely off-topic and rather inane. The California haters seem to joyfully disparage but cannot tout the success or greatness of their own state- why? If you dislike California so much, please stay home, but do not forget, very few are emulating your states. When California was merely a wilderness- Southern States had infrastructure (courtesy of Slave labor). California was the 31st State (really a territory) admitted into the Union and look at it now vs the previous 30? Yes California has bigger problems by volume because of its size- but certainly not Greater problems.
Someone- anyone- give me a *convincing* argument ( not rhetoric and catch phrases) to move to Mississippi, Oklahoma, Maryland, Virginia, Texas, Utah or anywhere else.
5
Better public schools ( California's' are among the most underfunded) and the ability to purchase a home. I'm a lifelong and proud Californian, but there are other beautiful and progressive places to live in this country, even in Mississippi, Alabama, Texas and Virginia. Sometimes as Californians we forget this.
5
A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, California had the best public education system, kindergarten through post-graduate, in the world. First came Gov. Reagan, next came Proposition 13 and the conservative, anti-intellectual era began...
2
The election of the present infantile present-hedonist to the US presidency leaves no doubt that the failure to make each individual's vote count equally in the election of the only public office with a national constituency is a fatal flaw.
13
Oh, California
Houses, food , childcare ,,, built on exploitation of cheap Mexican labor.
La La Land.
15
@Talesofgenji: And what about your own exploitative "foreign", Caribbean and Central American, Asian and Eastern European cheap labor force?
4
Before cheap Mexican labor there was cheap black labor, and all the while there were millions of whites working cheap too. Cheap Irish and Chinese labor built the railroads that brought people here. Historically, all infrastructure has been built on the backs of cheap labor.
All the Mexicans except for the descendants of those who lived here in 1849 came here voluntarily. They could have stayed home, but 'cheap' is relative: they thought they'd do better here than they did in Mexico, and mostly they were right.
There has never been a democracy or a Republic that was not built by by slaves. That said, just because other people are doing it, or the fact that it’s been going on a long time, doesn’t make it right. Especially for us, who have all the resources to understand the evil.
1
Thank not heaven, but we who voted, that we have Jerry Brown to lead this.
19
How much time will it take until Californians follow the Brexit example, i.e. consider segregation from USA?
9
Um, I think we’ve already gone there.
6
They will need to loosen gun laws not tighten them.
Strip away the shiny veneer of the coast and California is a mess. Crushing public pension obligations, sanctuary cities, unchecked illegal immigrants, and desperate poverty once you go 30 miles inland. Solve your own problems before you blame Trump for them.
21
@ Midwest Josh , So is Kansas(TOTALLY BANKRUPT) by Brownback's tax cutting and fake premise of the GOP's trickle down economics , California may well do better seceding since as Kansas goes so will the rest of the country. Those that have bought into this fable will find out in a few years , if not sooner. Just saying....
1
Exactly. The liberal elites, love diversity, open borders, and all the crowding, poverty, environmental damage, exploited workers it brings as long as they don't have to live with it.
2
@Midwest Josh: We're trying- we just wish everyone else would stay out-of-this. But- I digress- Michigan might just need our clean-water Expertise.
California no longer represents America. It represents Mexico and the whacky far left.
22
California was much happier with a president that had no experience and was a socialist that hated America. Now they have to deal with a President that has decades of experienced as an American businessman that loves America and it drives them crazy. The stock market is now at 25,000, Food stamps down by 2 million, unemployment 17 year low, illegal immigration down by 70%. All in one year.
14
This is what right-wingers actually believe.
11
@P.McGrath: Bankruptcy and Bank loans is a "wonderful" business model isn't it? Anyone who has to close a Casino... Let me try- but we're told not to feed trolls: That 25,000 Dow didn't happen from January 1- 31, 2017, but you already know this. Just keep thinking positive thoughts [sic].
2
I love these articles that pretend there is no diversity of thought here in California. We're not all socialists. I'm a libertarian. I voted for Trump. Several members of his cabinet come from here. I, and the pretty much the entire legal population here (we're a rich state, we invest a lot) have made a lot of money thanks to the Trump Economic Miracle We've also benefited the most from illegal aliens who tend to our parks, take care of our children, and harvest our crops. We've got kinds of a modern plantation out here. There are some of us who resent the hypocrisy of the limousine liberals who cash in on the regime, and whose only contact with illegals are their servants. And who pretend they like a centralized federal government while Trumps decentralizations works just fine for our smug existences.
13
Give me Cali over Trump any day. California is chill and zen. Trump is the opposite.
6
Although living in the Republic of Cambridge, MA is probably the next best thing if a bit cold, at times like these I wish I were back in California - if I could only afford it - and it says a lot that Cambridge is more affordable than San Francisco!
7
Jeff Sessions better watch out. While he was busy in the Senate helping to obstruct President Obama's agenda his own Sweet-Home-Alabama passed legislation in 2016 (HB-393) for industrial cultivation of Hemp along with passing what is know as "Len's Law" to decriminalize THC derivative in medicinal marijuana.
Alabama is still moving slowly toward passing recreational marijuana laws but it will be interesting when Alabama's wheat, corn and peanut farmers recognize the value in another "cash crop".
10
It is astonishing, given the Conservative agenda of New Federalism and States' sovereignty that AG Sessions would even raise these controversies and issue. Perhaps the real for contradicting a cornerstone piece of Conservative ideology, i.e., the legal paradigm of new federalism, is that tax dollars from legalized marijuana sales will redound to the States, and not federal government. This would fund the coffers of Liberal-oriented states and because of the GOP political strategy of controlling the federal government (macro) by winning Statewide elections and dominating State legislatures (micro), and thereby ensuring proper gerrymandering were possible, the RNC would be deprived of its base.
4
Californians brag about their state’s diversity, but California isn’t particularly diverse. According to the Census Bureau, California is 72.7% percent white compared to 76.9 percent for the United States; however, many states are more racially diverse than California. For example, Mississippi, which is only 59.3 percent white, is more racially diverse than California. California is racially diverse compared to states like New Hampshire, which is 91.8 percent white.
Californians boast of their states ethnic diversity, but California isn’t particularly ethnically diverse. It is 38.9% percent Hispanic American and rapidly growing more Hispanic due to immigration from Latin America. Its other ethnic groups, such as German Americans, Irish American, Italian Americans, Swedish American, French Americans, etc., are so small they are lumped into a catch-all demographic group called “non-Hispanic white as if they have no ethnicity.
https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/US/BZA010215
6
The only reason New York State isn’t as progressive as California is because eight Democratic State Senators Caucus with the Republicans giving them control in Albany. It’s a shame that most democratic Hillary voting people have no idea what that means. But just as many New Yorkers smoke pot as Californians, we just pay top dollar for it to the Mob instead of entrepreneurs and state taxes.
4
All is not lost. There is somewhere that American values are upheld. Hopefully Trump-ism will be a passing phenomenon.
7
As a reluctant resident of California, there has to be some sort of happy medium between the nutball left of California and the nutball right of Trumpism. For me, that's membership in the Libertarian Party. Fiscally conservative and socially liberal (shorthand for those who don't understand libertarianism). Since neither side will ever come to its senses, I will continue voting Libertarian.
4
This time we may have a much shorter overinvestment period and go almost directly to the financial crisis period. This could occur if disruptions to specific sectors precipitate a financial crisis. Eliminating the Obamacare individual mandate will cause there to be 13 million less people with health insurance. Uninsured people spend less on health care than those with insurance. Most studies indicate a 25% difference. Thus, fewer insured people will result in less spending on health care than would have been the case otherwise. Other than the direct impact on GDP from lower expenditures, there could be financial distress as some firms in the health care become unable to pay their debts.
There is now a significant possibility that disruptions to specific sectors in the economy could be more important than the pure macroeconomic impacts of the Republican tax bill. The risks of defaults stemming from weakness in the housing-related sectors exceeds that of healthcare. The homebuilders are correct in their complaints that most of the tax advantages of home ownership will be eliminated by the Republican tax bill. As the homebuilders point out, many more middle and low-income people will no longer itemize since the standard deduction has increased and other deductions will be reduced or eliminated. Additionally, a lower limit on mortgage interest deduction for new home purchases reduces tax advantages of home ownership..."
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134453
3
Manipulate and Divide and Conquer. Add in smoke screens and you have the perfect storm. It is happening right before our eyes.
2
So goes the nation, not so fast.
Cali is effectively a one Party state. We no longer debate opposing viewpoints. We compete to see how fast we can lurch left. So if the country is ready to compete for titles like, State with the most genders, State with the highest percentage of welfare recipients, State with the most unskilled workers, State with the highest cost of living, then maybe ya, we are still the trend-setter.
But if you are an American dinosaur and you still like all things Americana, e.g. hot rods, hunting/fishing, speaking your mind, an open forum for ideas, and the general freedom to do as you please, then you might want to wait and see if California survives this cliff-dive.
12
...State with the 6th largest economy in the world, between those of Britain and France. Sure. I can see how that does't work for you.
3
China's Economy is second. Who cares? Does that make you want to live there??!!
The "united states" hasn't existed for a long time, especially since the Civil War. That conflict both philosophically and politically has been simmering below the surface of the American experience since the war ended. In more modern times, you yourselves have sliced-and-diced yourselves into red & blue, liberal and conservative (extremes), rich and poor and you pulled yourselves so apart recently that, like Humpty Dumpty falling off the wall, nothing is going to put you back together again.
Face it, you're great at selling things (cheap) to each other and pretending to be "number 1," but you are quickly becoming nothing more than a fragmented group of isolated, economic zones. The rest of the world sees it but you don't.
Even CA, a state that embodies a lot of futuristic ideas, is an example of how unsustainable your way of life has become: too expensive and economically disparate.
I wish you all the best, but I'm afraid (as I've written before), you Americans are your own worst enemies!
6
Americans are DREAMers, too, and they, too, have a right to permanent, legal protection against yet another 15 to 20 million aliens illegally invading this country ten years down the road.
11
"A protest in Los Angeles against the election of President Trump in November 2016."
no need to protest. elections are every 2-4 years.
would it be ironic if mr. trump strengthened american democracy by motivating more people to vote next time and motivated US congress to become more assertive? make america great again.
3
It's just too bad that Reagan destroying the economy did not teach us a lesson, that Bush destroying the economy didn't teach us a lesson. How is it again that Trump destroying democracy will teach us a lesson? We're pretty dense you know.
3
Who knows maybe if the rest of the country stepped up and produced more that California needed the state might play along. But the way it is now the the goods, services, money and culture goes almost exclusively from west to east. Hence the west coast can and does largely ignore anything east of the Sierras.
1
"What had been a rhetorical battle between a liberal state and a conservative administration is now a full-fledged fight."
When it comes to immigration and a "sanctuary state" that "full-fledged fight" is not against Trump but against the Constitution of the United States. Be really proud of that fact resistors!
7
Using the constitution to defend this particular administration's actions is hypocrisy at its best.
2
Scotilla - What part of using the Constitution in my comment is hypocrisy? Is "sanctuary" constitutional in your opinion? Is violating the law by harboring those illegally within the United States hypocrisy, in your opinion?
1
I would love to see a West Coast compact - sorta like the old PAC 8. There are all sorts of policy areas we mostly agree on, and have the authority to implement a West Coast alternative. We've started to develop cross border carbon emission markets (you see Republicans- we really believe in the power of market forces). We should coordinate our response to Trump on immigration and marijuana enforcement. How about tax incentives for West Coast businesses coordinated across the 3 states?
Then, we invite Arizona, Nevada, Colorado and Hawaii to join the compact - sorta like the current PAC 12. If we have learned nothing else in the past 30 years, it is that Red States have been very disciplined in their march to power. We need to emulate their example. While they are busy little beavers restricting women's reproductive rights, we need to coordinate climate change and economic growth policies. We don't need to nurse our grudges like the nasty drunk at the end of the bar - too easy and self destructive. Organize, lobby, vote and resist!
9
The rhetorical battle between liberal and conservative no longer defines anything. The terminology is antiquated. Today the choice is progressive versus regressive.
15
@Rachel Hoffman: Very well put.
Perhaps it's time for the nation of California to become the sixth greatest economy.
6
Yep, California Is the Future. As the sixth largest economy in the world and a technological leader we are, and have for a long time, been highly connected economically, socially, and politically going back decades. Our state lead the way in both conservative and liberal and liberal periods, usually advancing major national political movements around fifteen years ahead of the nation as a whole. For an in-depth view of this phenomenon check out Peter Leyden’s series at https://medium.com/s/state-of-the-future
3
Calpers just reduced their projected rate of return for their portfolio from 7.5% to 7%.
The middle class is fleeing.
California will run out of OPM before nirvana is reached.
6
This is more than "One America Versus Another"!
It is the Republicans and that "stable genius" Trump trying to control America!
The states and cities have to fight tooth and nail against this petty, but dangerous tyrant!
12
We here in California are true Americans. We believe in the words written on the Statue of Liberty and in the US Constitution. Trump is anti-American because he does not beleive in either.
66
The Constitution's "Take Care" clause tasks presidents to "take care the laws be faithfully executed. Federal law prohibits the cultivation and sale of marijuana for recreational purposes. Federal law also calls for the deportation of unauthorized immigrants.
9
there are no words written on the Statue of Liberty.
2
The words on the Statue of Liberty plaque welcomed legal immigrants to Paris Island, the chief legal port of entry doing the mass immigration years of the late 1800s and early 1900s. It did not invite migrants to enter the country illegally.
2
So where are all the Silicon Valley tech moguls as Trump systematically attacks our Golden State?
California, the 6th largest economy in the entire world!
17
California and NY don't really matter at election time anymore, they are solidly blue, they could let every illegal vote in California and it would not make a difference electorally! I encourage California to succeed, they are a fifth of the representatives and two senators, remove them from the equation and the republicans would never loose the presidency again. I invite the honest people here reading this to look at the red blue map and tell me what it really represents! If California really wanted to see a change, they would split into two states vertically, coastal California and eastern California, and suddenly you would have another red state with two new senators and 25 new republican congressmen!
7
I hope CA succeeds as well, thanks! Since they contribute so much to the economy it is vital that they are successful. Doubt they would, could or should split the state like you describe. Does not seem that would be productive.
5
I support your wish for California to succeed! I’m not so sure about your other ideas.
5
The stories you read about California splitting into any number of states are all so silly. Sorry, but we're here to stay as one state, the strongest of the strong, part red but mostly as blue as the ocean, the best reflection of democracy in the nation. We will fight Trump every step of the way. No, you can't take away our cannabis. No, you will not drill for oil on our coastline. No, you will not take law-abiding immigrants off the street and jail them. And no -- you won't raid our taxes. Californians fight, not by seceding, but by building a firestorm of protest against the Trump administration and the white supremacists he represents.
5
The clash between California and several other sections of the country did not suddenly start with Trump. Trump is the manifestation of this accelerating schism and the Republicans are using it to it's full extend to push through an agenda that only largely serves themselves.
To bridge the gap, we have to dispell the myths of California as the promised land. There are plenty of issues with the state, just ask the droves of Californians that are moving to Texas. I am a liberal and progressive through and through yet 'sanctuary cities' is a symptom of the problem and very divisive; not the cure.
United we stand, divided we fall.
11
California could find out that attacking Trump/Sessions could be the wrong thing to do. They are in the upper level of the government of the whole United States, not one of the smaller areas called California.
The DC Swamp will strike back before long and California and others will have to run for the woods to hide.
3
If the Republicans don't like it, the solution is simple. Abolish the state-based federation system, and the antiquated electoral college that brought us this tyranny of minority, in favor of true federalism and popular vote. We the Californians will be happy to make that trade.
33
In the choice between a humane and welcoming California and a despotic and cruel Deplorable America, I will always choose California.
41
I have lived and am living in San Diego since 1978 ..read the L.A. Times every day....and all the comments on illegal immigration are for Enforcement of our laws and do not want California being a Scantuary State and Pro Trump on his stance on this issue...as for Legalization everyone is pro Legalization and Anti-Trump on that issue.
7
As a former Californian who deems Trump a malevolent ignoramus, I must say this "go it alone" meme emerging from California is very disturbing. Take the sanctuary movement, for instance. Yes, we should embrace immigrants -- but let's do it for ones who follow our immigration laws. Pot? Laws against marijuana use are misguided, but not all are necessarily unjust. I could go on, but I'll stop here. Now and post-Trump, I just hope we can strive for more "E pluribus unum."
9
If it were mostly criminals from Mexico that they were deporting, that would be one thing, but the truth is that republicans are not really serious about deportation. If they were, they could easily enact heavy fines on companies and individuals who hire undocumented workers, but they really don't want to get rid of cheap labor. It's just handy for them as a wedge issue. As for the marijuana issue, Washington has dealt with it quite well. It is well-regulated, illegal to drive under the influence, and taxed at 25%.
5
I vote for Califirnia's America.
32
You can pretty much have the "America" that aligns with Trump... to flush down the toilet of History.
11
That DT never visited the state, even after the disastrous wildfires of this last year speaks volumes to his narcissism. He is a man child with a mean streak, and California is his pet peeve. Fortunately, in spite of his ICE director and others in his administration, California is grown up enough (sorry east coasters, your distorted image of the state as Hollywood airheads doesn't fly here), has enough money and power, that we will take care of ourselves. We don't have to secede; we can just be ourselves and that will keep DT and his minions at bay.
15
Yeah, two Americas, OxyContin America hooked by legalized pushers of an artificial morphine that kills more people than cancer, and Pot America, which never killed a soul except in the mind of Jeff Sessions.
23
Check out this graphic "California Rising" that was created in response to the 2016 election: https://pocketperspectives.com/2017/02/22/california-rising-we-have-beco...
3
To those Californians whining about how we've gone too far left...perhaps you ought to consider moving to a deep south Republican state - see how you like living there. Don't want to? Didn't think so.
26
California has taken New York's place as the know-it-all capitol of America. Its politicians and cultural elitists believe that only they know what is best for the rest of us deplorables. Meanwhile, their state runs out of water on a regular basis, fires rampage unabated in communities that should never have been built in a semi-desert, their public education system is sub-standard at best, and if not for all the illegal immigrants working for next to nothing, their economy would collapse like a house of cards. You people need to get a grip and stop patting yourselves on the back at every opportunity. You are living in a bubble of your own invention.
19
Why don't you move to prosperous West-Virginia, Mississippi or Alabama, with their excellent education systems and universities and booming economies? They sure beat California on the economy, isn't it, and their housing is soo affordable... Oh wait - California is the 6th largest economy world-wide, and those states would totally revert to 3rd world country status without California federal tax money.... California has every reason to be proud of its success!
11
A "bubble of our own invention"? Indeed. This is the cradle of American inventiveness right now, and thanks to that, you can participate in the 21st century even if you don't like it, don't understand it, don't know where it came from, and lack the courtesy to say thank you or the savvy to invest. You're welcome, paul. And despite our sub-standard educations here in the Golden State, we're smart enough to write our own names with a capital letter.
5
Civil war with California? Sign me up to fight for California!! Maybe sign everyone in Minnesota up~
28
Th stark truth is that there is no "again", and there is no "back". The simpletons like the AG and the traitor in the WH cannot grasp the social reality of America in 2018. The South will NOT "rise again", no matter what old racists (and their naive kids) keep saying. The absurd concept of a wall having any effect on immigration is great for self aggrandizing speeches, but spending tax dollars on anything so ineffective is beyond wasteful.
Reread the Declaration of Independence, the Preamble to the Constitution, and, of course ALL the Amendments, especially the First, and you find the root cause of the resurgence of American values and ideals. "Promote the general welfare", "all are created equal", and "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" (not pleasure, happiness) are the words being given new focus.
The traitorous administration is attempting to undo what this country has been committed to promoting for its entire existence, and the inertia of our history will push aside even this fascist-tinged gang of spoilers. Truth will out.
20
Any comments regarding the use of city or county jails to detain immigration "violators"?
Some county jails have contracts to house ICE detainees. From time to time a scandal pops up where the sheriff diverts the funds.
Or a habeas corpus issue. Or a "missing person". Or a deportee who returns with a vendetta.
Problem Feds ran out of housing money, but still had travel money. Answer? Buy the "prisoner" a plane ticket. Which leads to the problem of the "criminal" recruiting others to fight the "evil satan".
As David Brooks says "ifo your mother says she loves you, as a good journalist, confirm that with a second source."
1
"Also this week, Mr. de León introduced legislation to limit the impact of the new tax bill on Californians by essentially allowing residents to pay their state taxes in the form of a charitable contribution, which could then be deducted when filing federal income tax."
This is stupid. Charitable contributions are voluntary. Nobody says you have to give anything to a charity. This is typical thinking of the hot heads that are running California. If these people want their own country, then by all means secede. They aren't going to change anything in Washington with this behavior. All they are going to do is bring down the wrath of the Federal Government. It's already begun with the tax bill and off-shore drilling. Next it will be ICE moving in. The breaking point is coming soon and it won't be pretty.
5
Well, Californian tax payers can voluntarily choose to give a charitable contribution that will be credited to their state taxes to lower their state taxes, or pay their mandatory state taxes as such, which are not deductible under the new tax bill. What would you choose, if you had the choice? Or do you say tax payers should not have that choice? What's voluntary about not having a choice?
6
Anything this administration tries to shove down California's throat will become an invaluable precedent for dragging the Trump states back into the 21st Century when this nightmare is over. Let that thought be the shot over his bow.
All we have to do is endure together, and keep doing the right thing.
8
I'm baffled by California. There's obviously a serious shortage in housing......yet they keep letting more and more immigrants in. California has some of the most forward thinking environmental regulations in the country.....yet sprawl is destroying the state's finest natural features.
You can't have it both ways. You'll never be able to protect the environment with too-many-people, nor can you provide adequate jobs, services and housing. There's only so many mice you can cram into a box before they start eating each other.
I do not say this as an immigrant-hater. In fact, I like immigrants. They tend to be friendly, polite, down-to-earth, hard-working. I'd gladly trade them for some of the arrogant, rude, entitled native-born here. But you don't get those kinds of trade-offs, and unfortunately, it comes down to numbers. Too-many-people is just too-many-people.
26
PC or not, The longterm numbers are not in California's or anywhere else on this planet side.
3
Let California lead the way. Please....
6
Oh its horrible, horrible out here in California, just horrible. Everyone who says so is right. The weather is awful, the people worse. The marijuana everyone is talking about, it doesn't work. The highway signs are all in Spanglish. Don't come. Save yourselves before it is too late. As for California's most endangered species, Republicans....Love it or leave it. (Just doing my part to address our affordable housing problem.)
28
It's the Trump backing states that have gone mad, not California. Trump has pushed a clearly racist agenda since taking office. He has also done everything he can to put the planet and future generations at risk. There are many reasons my home sate should do everything possible to resist this insane drive to the past by America's right wing. A man and a party that will not condemn Nazis and believes our solution of the planet is fine as long asa profits are high needs to be resisted.
20
Let CA succeed from the Union. The Bear Flag Republic would then be left to suffer the consequences of its own folly. They are so broke they will ask for Federal bailout money and as they owe billions will stick everyone else with their bills. Middle class whites with job skills and education are fleeing the State but are being replaced with 3rd world uneducated, unskilled poverty stricken peasants flooding the welfare office. It's only a matter of time before bankruptcy. Cut CA lose now before the hammer falls.
6
Federal bailout money? They pay more in federal taxes than they receive - seceding would make them succeed even more... The 6th largest economy in the world... CA wields the hammer, whether you like it or not.
8
Yeah, none of that is true. Also, it's "secede" not "succeed."
1
Anna. Cali pays 1cent more in fed taxes than they get back. Hardly a hammer. More like a feather.
It's time to break up the USA. That "united" part is growing silly. From NH, I say "Yay California!" 40 million people live there; they have a reason.
5
One need only to look at the happy faces on those customers (and the employees) to know that this is not the “scourge” Trump and Sessions want the red states to believe. I mean, seriously, look at those people! Not to mention, jobs, jobs, jobs. California, if you go, please take us with you!
10
This proud Californian eagerly awaits the collapse of the Republican party.
19
Silicon Valley and Seattle give me hope in these trying, embarrassing times that insult horses "Stable Genius" and babies "White House day care center".
7
It really is time to split the country. It’s not just the cultural divide, it’s economic sense.
The US is a really bad deal for California. For every dollar we pay in federal taxes, we get back 70 cents. For every dollar most red states pay, they get back $2 or more. You’re stealing from us, and we are sick of supporting your loser economies and loser populations of uneducated bigots who couldn’t innovate their way out of a paper bag.
We pay for your roads, your schools, your disability and unemployment, your disaster relief, your Medicare, your opioid addictions and heart disease and obesity. CA provides 50% of your food (which you probably fry). We contribute more men & women to the armed services than any other state.
What do we get back from the US? Outdated, last-century thinking, economically damaging immigration limits, an idiotic coal and oil based economy, climate change denial, hatred, racism, antiquated social laws. Such a deal!
And now they’ve devised a tax reform that raises only our taxes and cuts everyone else’s. No way. We won’t pay.
To top it off, it’s taxation without representation. The average red state citizen gets about 50x more representation in the Senate, about 1.5x more representation in the House, and about twice the presidential electoral college votes than a California citizen. My vote means nothing.
The Pacific States of America (CA-OR-WA-HI) have nothing in common with red America, and we are tired of paying your bills. Let us go.
82
Let New England go also.
2
@ Serena Fox,
I couldn't have said it better myself.
Hey Serena Fox, please speak for yourself only. I live in the Bay Area and I don’t agree with anything you’ve said here. I hope people across the country don’t get the idea that your views are representative of California in general.
California has long been overpopulated and under-resourced. Prop 13 has been a gift to the wealthy, and the government has subsidized the unions and liberal idiosyncratic initiatives with the nation's highest taxes. Exactly why should we worry if they secede? And for the record, charity is voluntary, taxes are not- it is a testament to the warped view of Californians that the two are conflated.
3
If California were to become i a separate nation, you all in Utah, ans in many "Res States" would lose a lot of federal funds. Utah gets more money from the Federal government than it pays. OTOH the opposite is true in California. When are you going to pay us back for your free ride?
2
Jeff. Cali gets 99 cents back for every dollar it pays in, your own state analysis says this. You're hardly holding up the whole nation.
1
California is leading the way to bankruptcy and ruin right behind Illinois. Wherever so-called liberals are in charge, they're driving things right into the ground.
10
Our pour bankrupt stat would be in the top ten nations in the world based on GNP if we were a separate nation. Look at the US map. When you compare the standard of living and the level of adequate healthcare and such, its the Red States that are at the bottom.
8
Tell that to Kansas!
4
In these dark times, when much of the country seems to have swooned for il Duce and his PFR, I'm depending on California and my local Bay Area governments to promote a society that is free and in line with my own values. Best of luck to friends and relatives in occupied territory.
14
What's taking progressive Democratic states like New York and New Jersey so long to legalize pot? They better move fast before Trump and Sessions stack the courts. I hope California wins all their cases against the destructive regressive White House and other blue states need to learn and follow California. I'm ashamed that New York and New Jersey are not fighting mad yet.
3
If California secedes, the Democrats will never again win a national election.
7
Which, of course, would not be our problem anymore.
Why would the Pacific States of America care? Why should California have to bear the sole responsibility to keep progressive policy ideas in the national dialogue? Phooey.
2
Who cares? The US would become a third-rate country with an economy the size of Mexico’s.
California is the engine and the wealth of this country. Take a look at the stock exchange. The five biggest corporations in the world: all Californian. That phone in your pocket? Californian technology. That computer in front of you? That cloud you depend on to do business? We own you, dude.
2
Not quite. the profits go to a few rich Californians. Chinese and other exploited 3rd world people make all those products. Those COMPANIES own all of us.
1
I was at Cash and Carry in WA recently when the Hispanic couple behind me had hominy in their cart. I got so excited. Are you making menudo I asked? No pesole they remarked. As a white female whose family was half Hispanic born on California's soil I couldn't help but fear for my brother, sister, cousins, etc who were born here but will be subjected to ICE questioning based on their looks. California is their home, their economy, theirs! Don't let anyone tread on that. Viva California!
5
It is a pity that California lawmakers aren't more focused on adequately funding the Univ. California system ensuring that tuition is affordable as well as focused on laws that help to make housing more affordable.
Ironically, some key marijuana research comes from that chronically underfunded UC system.
The NYTimes should have articles that marijuana, while less addictive than nicotine, is more addictive than alcohol. It should educate about the adverse health effects of marijuana smoke, including second-hand smoke.
2016: Barry and Glantz, both of UCSF (free download).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27676176
"Currently, regular heavy marijuana use is uncommon, and few users become lifetime marijuana smokers [13]. However, marijuana use is not without risk. The risk for developing marijuana dependence (25%) is lower than for nicotine addiction (67%) and higher than for alcohol dependence (16%) [14], but is still substantial, with rising numbers of marijuana users in high- income countries seeking treatment [15]. Reversing the historic pattern, in some places, marijuana has become a gateway to tobacco and nicotine addiction [15]."
2018: Glantz (UCSF): Marijuana, Secondhand Smoke, and Social Acceptability
"Misperceptions about the harms of marijuana use,5 including the lack of understanding of the harms associated with secondhand smoke, point to the importance of education and policies that focus public and public health attention on secondhand marijuana smoke."
5
What absolute nonsense people opine , still fighting the election. This is more about what Trump transformation is trying to accomplish , be afraid , very afraid because ultimately it does not bode for a good outcome and some will come to rue the day they cast that vote. The wolf isn't at the door but inside the house. United we stand.
5
"In Clash Between California and Trump, It’s One America Versus Another"
Au contraire. It's California (and, by extension, Oregon & Washington) against Trump & <40% of America. I like our positions, sensibilities and odds...
12
While California leads the nation in progress, the Trump administration prefers the regressive politics of solid red states such as Mississippi, Louisiana, and Oklahoma. Resist and vote!
9
It is a foreign country. A failing one, just a few more years and Cali will look more like Venezuela than any American state.
5
snuff. You are exactly right. California democrats need a large underclass, 47%, that will eagerly vote for (free) trinkets and baubles..and achieve permanent political power as Chavez / Maduro have done in Venezuela. The few Colombians I know who became citizens legally as with most legal immigrants ardently vote Republican.
2
"California" is here nothing much better than Trump. Californias tech evangelists are only interested in their - oh surprise - interests. Instead of thinking about better models for our society, they put IT and startup culture above everything. Of course some of their interests may tally with democratic principles, but others dont. For example, as in the article, California (in fact its companies) are pro-immigration. I, personally, (as an average graduate from an Ivy university) can not understand why most of those silicon vally and co. people are not able to think critical about themselves. When I asked a group of Accenture consultants whether they think that automation might kill most of todays jobs their answer was "No why should that be? It never happened during last century in the U.S. so why should it in the future?" 1. They neglect that U.S. is not representing all jobs in earth and 2. projecting from the past to the future is simply stupid. But thats how most people in tech think. They are not true scientists even though most of them may have a science background (MSc, BSc or even PhD). So coming back to Tump and California, I dont think California Elon Musk and their crazy tech visions are much better than an unempathic and idiotic billionäre governing the US. Its simply a conflict of interests of two egoistic parties. None of them is really improving anything than their personal interests.
3
The former, independent Republic of Vermont (twice!) is ready to stand with California in a new, progressive era!
Maybe we could call ourselves East California?
17
The sixth largest economy in the world, home of numerous world renowned educational institutions, high tech "ground zero" and the incubator for all new ideas for the past 75 years plus our largest state in population. Only a fool would attempt to destroy this great asset to our nation and the world. It looks like we have that fool!
7
It seems to me one very important voting block in California was often left out in these articles. Has NYT ever done any in depth reporting within the many Chinese enclaves in suburban California? Especially the more affluent neighborhoods with mega Asian malls and supermarkets and cafés where more recent immigrants and their offsprings hang out? Some of them vote while others are more consumed with the elections in Taiwan and the staggering wealth of Chinese princelings abroad. And amongst them Trump fans abound. So it’s not just two Californias, at least three I would say, and the third one is growing fast, with prevalent Republican or Trump values.
3
Simply put, here we have Trump's monotonous thinking crashing headlong into the State of California's hold on modernity.
2
Many of the negative comments about our beloved state are not really necessary. California has been a trend setter for years and usually the world follows. We can't help it. Everyone seems to think immigration is a big problem in the U.S. and don't ask California about it because they hoard illegal aliens. That's just not totally true. Immigrants provide laborers to do agricultural work that regular Joes in America refuse to do. Farmers don't complain about them and neither does anyone else. It's true, we are almost a half brown state, but we all love it.
10
CA right now mirrors the "third world utopia" that the left dreams about. A super wealthy and sheltered 1 percent, a massive underclass, and no middle class.
The recipe for political disaster in the very near future.
7
The Recipe for political disaster is the attitude of people like you who rely on false information to support your far right agenda. The Middle class in California id very healthy, thank you. It it is wealthier and better educated that the middle class in the Red States but this is the land of milk and honey. Ask yourself why the vast majority of immigration into California has been from the East Coast and Middle West instead of other countries.
5
Small farmers,contractors and everyone who follows and obeys laws are being severely undermined by cheaters who hire illegal labor..the same folks who tend to be republican. If public employees,trial lawyers and other occupations that tend to be democrat had their livelyhoods threatened by illegals, democrats would be clamoring for a border wall too.
Democrats are copying the Chavez / Maduro model for permanent political power which requires a large underclass in need of free public services. Compassion for these folks has nothing to do with it, it's all about political power.
When a prominent legislator, Kevin de Leon openly brags about helping relatives enter the US illegally, Venezuelan chaos is a likey out come.
7
Our local Republican Congressman is a multimillionaire rice farmer who gets government welfare in virtually free irrigation water, the right to pay his workers less that minimum wages and if the international price for rice drops, the Federal Government pays him money to keep his profits up.
3
In my experience most Latinos are very hard workers. They also perform labor a lot of Native born Americans look down upon.
3
This is a false story. All its features -- California's insistence on sanctuary status, the return to states' rights, legal marijuana, the characterization of liberal Democrats as leftists and on and on -- have occurred in other states, and earlier. Marijuana's legalization is just one of those. People tend to either hate it or love it, according to whether they're living here, and this division is all this article can rest on in its insistence that California is an outlier. What is less comforting is the reality that we have a Republican party that wants to build another Berlin Wall at our border, wants to renew oil drilling in the Pacific Ocean off the coast, so that people will walk on the oil clots in the sand and the birds will one by one die. If California is seen as the outlier the whole nation will suffer for hating this state and supporting the attack on its people and the environment.
10
Maybe Trump & Sessions can better spend time & resources going after big pharma, corrupt pill-pushing doctors, and Fentanyl smugglers who have made opioid overdose deaths one of the leading causes of death in our country instead of waging war against marijuana, which is not lethal & is not addicting (though it can be habituating, like gambling, skiing, computer gaming, and golf).
But the people who are involved in legal marijuana production & use not only tend not to be Trump voters, but they threaten the revenues of alcohol, tobacco, and big pharma, who pour many millions into GOP coffers to prevent marijuana from becoming a legal competitor.
Besides, keeping marijuana illegal gives them a weapon to use selectively against African-Americans & other minorities. It also fills the coffers of the DEA, corrupt judges, police, customs officials, and others with massive bribes.
6
Now back in California for nearly 4 years, after being away for 20, sometimes I pinch myself for having made the decision to return. All these comments are music to my ears. I agree with you guys; this is a great country! California, I mean.
But just to set things straight, although they're not stupid, and wisely refrain from broadcasting their views, a lot of people here hold the values of the GOP.
Everybody associates California with Hollywood, but you need to recall that this state's growth was built in large part on the backs of defense contractors. Here in Santa Barbara, a stone's throw from Vandenberg, you have all kinds of suppliers like Raytheon and such -- and if you sit at a bar in an old school steakhouse or rib joint, you will meet their employees. After a couple of drinks, these people will freely tell you that they vote Republican no matter what... meaning they voted for Trump. Republicans pay their salaries, no?
So it's not all that simple. Ryan Zinke hangs out here. Both Trump and Ted Cruz were in Montecito gathering funding during their campaigns. It's not just the red state-like Central Valley. Ask around. Spend some time in Orange County, now a more liberal spot than it once was, but still home to extreme right wing nut cases like Dana Rohrabacher. Fortunately all these types are somewhat older, 50 and up in large part.
So, maybe we're not exactly a "city on a hill" actually? Nonetheless, many of us are trying. Thanks for the group hug!
5
Oh how the California publicity machines moves on. The Golden State where it costs a fortune to live, where we flout the nations laws, where the jobs used to be, etc etc etc.
"But California’s diversity — 40 percent Latino, and with an estimated 2.3 million undocumented workers " [ and %39 white, and 20 % other]. White's are NOW a minority so get the stats right TIMES and will continue to be so as we are absorbed into Northern Mexico.
NOT EVERYONE who lives believes in the California lawlessness. In the end it will harm the residents in ways that perhaps haven't yet been imagined, if we haven't all gone to pot in the meantime. Timothy came here, Ram Dass came--who needs drumpf. We have gross income inequality and that is getting worse, but the TIMES always seems to paint over the "little"details. People in the other 49 states--STAY AWAY, this is NOT the GOLDEN state but one where we spend billions on trains to nowhere, we have taken our liberal stances to the point of being stupid about many things. This is a place where you can drive 120 miles round trip to be able to afford to live 60 miles from your job. We got Prop 13 so now we have to get tax money from selling pot to pay the bills. If you want to come to California, find a time machine and start with the '50s when it was a golden state. There are lots of flies on the meat but that doesn't mean its edible.
7
Here is what I hope happens as a testament of what this, undeniably ignorant, president can tout as an accomplishment - he single-handedly brings the people of the USA together to vote him and his enablers out of power and (eventually) office in 2018.
Don’t complain, don’t forget, don’t be deterred and VOTE!
5
Well if I ever go back to live in the USA it will be to CA where I was born then went to University. They are promoting human values, prosperity and health. I hope they fight strongly - that is what the USA should be about
6
We have to hope California wins this battle. Trump and the republicans are leading us to disaster while California is trying to lead us to a better world.
5
We shall defend our state (California), whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches (to stop offshore drilling), we shall fight on the landing grounds (to ward off ICE agents), we shall fight in the fields and in the streets (to uphold our right to enjoy marijuana), we shall fight in the hills (to prevent further encroachments on our environment); we shall never surrender.
7
I can barely wait the arrival of this stable genius arriving in the UK. Nor can millions of stable demonstraors.
3
The question is why other states are passive in the face of the reverse Robin Hood tax bill. How can anyone sit passively while the rich pick our pockets? It's not only inhumane but economic inequality destabilizes democracy.
I agree with sanctuary cities; if we can afford to support the parasitic billionaires, we can afford generosity to immigrants. There are criminals in all groups, but remember the immigrants, by definition, came in search of a better life.
It was Republican Governor Pete Wilson who turned California from purple to blue with his 1994 state proposition to deny immigrants emergency health care and public education. We showed our humanity then as we do now.
And oil exploitation? In the past 30 years we've had two bills to tax oil extraction in California. Big Oil defeated both bills. Other oil extracting states use taxes from oil drilling to maintain their roads, bridges. Not us; we raise taxes on the people instead. I trust and hope we will fight like crazy on this one.
For the above fights, I am extremely proud of my state.
3
Something that bothers me ..... It seems that a certain part of our citizenship seems to relish in another part of our citizenship being unhappy. That's not a healthy hobby.
2
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
I prefer this welcome sign to California: "The State that Kept its Sanity"
If it wasn't going to break off in a temblor and fall into the ocean, or burn down amid wildfires, or dry up amid drought and blow away, I would love to move to California. It starts with Gov. Jerry Brown, a people's hero who stands for rationality, civility and humane values -- you know, normal everyday stuff, expected of any normal U.S. president which has gone with this one. Everything Brown represents is equal and opposite to Trump.
Brown considers his state, in essence, a virtual signatory to the Paris climate accord, dumped by Trump. The progressive Brown is a true environmental steward (unlike rapacious DJT). He plugged a $26 billion budget deficit (Washington take a lesson). He allowed passage of a right-to-die law permitting prescription drugs be provided, while highly restricting who qualifies. And yes, there's the pot thing, to be expected of a maverick state (with that inane push back from D.C.).
I really wanna see the ICE man round up California politicians for their sanctuary policy, only I don't think they could then sue for false arrest. I wanna see Washington withhold billions from sanctuary locales, after which those 40 million state residents would explain how the tax money was already theirs. Let Sessions also proceed to unleash his G-men on pot dispensaries and brownie eaters. I wanna see Washington act on its threats and realize they're literally on a fool's errand.
4
Viva la Raza! Having lived most of my life in California, I witnessed the era of the Republican rule which reached its zenith with Saint Ronald. Under Reagan, the state lost one of the best Mental Health and Education systems in the Nation. At last, the Democrats have put down the Republicans and are moving the Golden State into a new era. Outstanding.
1
I am a 2nd generation Californian and I love my beautiful State. It's home. We are not some utopian land of the free though as this article represents. We have a serious homeless problem here in San Diego. Ride our trolley downtown and view the tent cities that are reminiscent of Hooverville. We are grappling with a Hep A outbreak that's beem declared an emergency. Affordable housing is non-existent. We are taxed at the highest levels on everything so I have no idea how we got here. The illegal immigrant population is treated like indentured servants. They have no workplace protections. Where is the American dream for them? They live in the shadows and in poverty. Yes there are two different Americas and California has chosen to throw its most vunerable in the trash, while our lawmakers cloak themselves in hypocrisy and do literally NOTHING but pass more legislation designed to elevate their non-existent moral superiority. Please actually come here, interview real people on the ground and than write honestly.
4
Trump and the Republicans have once more made the Conservatives' cardinal error. You can stand athwart history yelling stop until your hair goes Just For Men blond and your skin turns orange. But history doesn't stop. Energy doesn't stop. Societal change and improvement don't stop. Media don't stop. Progress doesn't stop. All you're left with is all Trump and the GOP offer: belligerent frightened martyrdom and rage. They're up against an irreversible overwhelming force because California in all its seething energy to push forward is--no accident--the mightiest economy in the United Stated. Yell all you like. Capitalism doesn't stop.
3
If one wants to know about Kevin Alexander Leon, look at his home district, the area surrounding downtown Los Angeles. Leon has absolutely NOTHING to do with the states economic engine, Silicon Valley.
26%+ of the people in his district (the second highest in the state) live in poverty, 10% higher than the state average. Let that sink in.
While hundreds of vacant buildings dot the district, thousands are sleeping in tents on the streets. Hepatitis A and tuberculosis run rampant, fueled by people urinating and defecating on the streets and fighting for fresh water supplies and other basic necessities. Leon is trying to take focus away from his inability to govern. Just look at his district.
8
Donald Trump and the GOP don't represent Washington or many parts of the country. He was given an electoral college victory because of some dim people in Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin. Many people agree that green energy is the future, immigrants are a benefit to the country, and Marijuana should not be criminalized, making them more like California. Additionally, while some in the old white south seem to support Trump, I don't think he supports them. It's more like he has an army of dupes. Try taking medicare and medicade away from the dupes and see what happens. They don't even really know what Trump and the GOP want to do.
6
As we dig out from the ash of California’s largest wildfire while simultaneously trying to barricade ourselves from possible-please God no!- mudslides it is truly heartening to read these comments extolling the virtues of California, its residents and governance. Thank you all and know we welcome you with open arms should you ever decide to head west because if there’s one thing for sure- we will rise from these ashes!
7
I can only wish that NY would be more aggressive against trump and his attempts as dismantling 300 years of progress. NYC should issue a proclamation making trump persona non grata. He should be banned from entry as a threat to all things decent. All of his holdings should have a additional NY tax imposed upon them for the burden they put on our citizens. The outside of trump tower should be lined with porta potties so as to make bathrooms more available in NYC. Or alternatively NYC should use eminent domain (which trump is a fan of) and just tear it down.
6
...And now we have a former Republican Congressman- Doug Ose who wants to be our next Governor; a union-hating Republican who champions Donald Trump and Jeff Session's call for building more prisons. This is a man who was given a county owned park in Sacramento a few years ago (private enterprise can do it better trope) but couldn't turn a profit (he's a developer) and also quite rich. He likes the Kansas "fiscal model." Anyone out there questioning why Californians fight so hard- this is one of the reasons.
6
Our state seems like a microcosm of what the US used to be before the GOP decided to emphasize racial, religious, and class politics. As Republicans here drove off the pier, many Californians abandoned the party.
Plus, there's our election system. We have a non-partisan redistricting panel that Republicans and Democrats both hate because it frustrates gerrymandering, and a primary system that helps reduce the likelihood of lunatic fringe candidates making it to the general election.
The big problem in the future? The leftward pull of northern California Democrats could spell real problems if the state wants to be seen as a model for the country.
1
Having lived in coastal California for more than forty years, I am consistently proud of our multi-cultural society. In Los Angeles alone, more than two hundred languages are spoken, and the non-Caucasian population continues to hold a slight majority. Governor Brown, Senators Feinstein and Harris, Mayor Garcetti, and the vast majority of Congress people are caring individuals who work hard on behalf of all of their constituents, and not just the wealthiest few. Like millions of other Californians, I am profoundly upset that the citizens of my state are being punished by the Trump administration for defying its agenda of evil. But we are a strong and fiercely motivated group, and we will prevail and continue to protest the current injustices playing out on the national stage.
6
As the Trump administration attacks blue states, especially California, New York, New Jersey and Connecticut, the east coast states should follow Califoria's lead, and fight back with every legal means at their disposal. There should be no quarter given to those in Washington who want to impose their will, with no regard to the consequences. These blue states should refuse to pay to the government more money than what they receive in return; money that is used to prop up southern red states finances. No more should this be allowed to continue. State rights need to be protected and expanded.
4
When I was a young, in the 80s, California and Texas were both looked at as sort of the weird cousins. They did their own thing, followed their own rules, and all the other states looked at them as , respectively, liberal hippies or angry cowboys. They still see us that way. The difference is that before, California and Texas were viewed as the slightly eccentric relative at the reunion. Fun to be around, but not east to understand. The differences were not only tolerated, they were celebrated.
Then came 24 hour cable news. In order to fill 24 hours, opinion began to replace actual news stories, and we were subjected to years of lobbying by people who wanted us to see each other as the enemy, because it suited their economic interests. Well it has worked. I no longer think of Texas as a cool place with interesting people who are a little weird but still nice. And I am sure Texans no longer think of California as somewhere where people are different but still fun to be with. We have been manipulated to hate each other without reservation, and it will result in another civil war unless we find a way to stem the tide. Our current President is doing everything he can to continue the fight, rather than heal the division. We have the government we deserve.
3
As someone who has lived here a long time I can attest that the reality of life in California's "Sanctuary Cities" and California in general is not very pretty.
Visiting downtown Los Angeles to see one of the museums or old buildings
can be a dismal experience, from navigating the trash-strewn freeway interchanges and streets, to walking on foot where one has to use his nose to avoid the many back alleys that the immigrant poor and homeless people use for open-air toilets.
The standard of living for working people has been declining for decades, due to the massive influx of poor immigrants and the loss of major industries such as aerospace manufacturing. The massive divide between haves and have nots is similar to Latin America.
The best thing that could happen to California is for a few million people to leave, there is just not enough clean air, water, housing and freeway space for all these people.
The idea of California seceding from the USA is especially absurd, with no ability or will to control it's borders, an independent California would soon just become part of Mexico.
4
If there is one redeeming aspect to this particular presidency, it might be that it rapidly and randomly flickered light upon (until now) dark areas within our nations central government, exposing and alarming the roaches as well as exposing their concealed hiding places and not so upstanding supporters. It also forced us to pause and consider just how vulnerable our system is. It showed us that the definition of "patriotism" can be molded and wielded as a manipulation tool to drive masses into supporting propositions that are completely "Un-American". It showed all of us, in no uncertain terms, that we (as a nation) are NOT invincible and can easily be driven into back-biting division. This nation of ours may be armed to the teeth militarily, but it can be taken down by simply arousing and wielding public distrust like a hammer. Think about this folks. How long have the Roy Moores, the Orin Hatches (and other ethically unqualified men and women in our nation) infested this system? How long has big money influenced and "trumped" high-road propositions that were intended to mold our nation into one of equal opportunity for its citizens? It also calls into question the Republican and Democrat institutionalized monopoly of our political system. This particular president has been so frick'n unpredictable and outrageous that he has unwittingly forced both the GOP and Democrat practices into the rightful exposure of unflinching public scrutiny.
1
AS a former CA teacher, I've seen what "beautiful diversity" does to education - which is our future. We were the best K-12 in the nation in the 1960s. Now we rank near the bottom and "diversity" means K-12 is 54% "Hispanic"/Mexican.
English language and poor students get $300 more yearly. Too bad most responders here are focused on the economy and the import of "cheap labor" while the future of native-born children has been destroyed. Most who grew up here have been forced out by huge cost of housing and private schools.
7
I have no problem with states rights and I live in Georgia... If California wanted to succeed, let them go. No problem... Of course we might have to charge an import tax on all those tech goods - but they would be able ally with China, that other bastion of freedom and democracy and I am sure the Chinese would be more than willing to post some troops on the California - USA border to protect their new ally. Good luck to `em.
3
Perhaps the good citizens of California and New York, the two most powerful economic engines in our country, should consider modeling their response to Trump after the President's own behavior. First, refuse to pay your federal taxes, or reveal your true income. Just indicate your finances are "under audit and no one is really interested in them" and also declare, "isn't it time the Deplorable States paid their fair share?" Second, "build that wall" and let Washington pay for it. I would be happy to show my passport upon entering the gates to your fair States. Succession should be used only as a last resort, for example, just after Trump pardons himself and runs for reelection.
6
Yes, I agree California is a different America from THE America. I prefer THE America, as do most clear thinking Americans. Most of all I support THE President. I support THE Trump. Thank you.
5
The implication that it's acceptable for governors or judges to usurp the sovereignty of the US for their personal political agenda is beyond outrageous. It's clearly against multiple existing laws and violates the Constitution. These anarchists have neither the legal standing nor the competence to do so. No doubt this will have to be resolved at the Supreme Court level, but the open borders crowd won't be happy.
5
CA vs USA - true. And it's been known for years that if you want to see what the US will look like in 10 years time under the guidance of leftist policies, just look at CA. Only difference is that the federal government rescues CA financially for their decisions and spending. No one will save the US from similar policy choices if they are allowed to be made.
3
I'm proud to have been born and raised in California. But make no mistake, we have our own deep history of short sighted despots. Reagan, famous for saying "If you’ve seen one redwood tree, you’ve seen them all.” helped launch the term 'tree-hugger' when citizens went out to physically protect our environment from the lumber industry.We have attracted the best and the worst, we have seen incredible grassroots leaders change history, Cesar Chavez. We have some of the last remaining strong labor unions, we have been a battleground on nearly every legal front, and because of that we have continued to stay current and grow. We learn from our mistakes and change again and again. Isn't that what our Constitution was intended to protect? If our current administration wants to attack California, they had better be prepared to get their smartest lawyers up to speed. We're ready, we've always been ready. Bring it on, we can't wait to educate the rest of the population for whom public discourse and local policy change are a foreign language. Let's practice some good old fashioned Democracy!
4
Here is a suggestion for the economic engine states like California, who are not proportionately represented in Congress because of the way the numbers of House representatives and Electoral College vote casters, and for the states which were targeted by the extremely unfair GOP new tax law:
Allow your state taxpayers to pay their federal taxes into a state managed escrow account. Then tell the federal government that tax payments to the federal government will be withheld until the interests of "blue", environmentally conscious, and economically productive states are adequately addressed and represented in Congress and by this administration. No taxation without adequate representation! Let us see how the net-taker "red" states feel when federal subsidies to those less productive states are reduced.
5
In jurisprudence, selective prosecution is a procedural defense in which defendants argues that they should not be held criminally liable for breaking the law, as the criminal justice system discriminated against them by choosing to prosecute. This defense is based upon the 14th Amendment, which guarantees American equal treatment under the law. If the Justice Departments does not enforce federal drug laws that prohibit the cultivation and sale of marijuana in California, it doubtful that it could continue to prosecute the cultivation and sale of marijuana in other states. Defendants would argue—with good cause—that it is unjust for the federal government to prosecute them for a crime it doesn’t prosecute in other states. So, Jeff Session is right to enforce the federal law against marijuana. The Justice Department is responsible for enforcing federal law and should do its job. It is up to Congress—not Jeff Sessions—to determine if cannabis should be taken off the controlled substance list.
4
When citizens feel their voices are no longer being heard and injustice is being ignored by an arrogant class of a privileged few they revolt. These were the root causes of rebellion in 1775 and 1790. After a generation of Republican attacks against Democracy and the arrival of their newfound Glorious Leader we are now finally feeling the hard blows that turn grievances into intolerable assaults on our liberties. But not all Americans feel this way. We face a 60-40 split in this country. Fortunately most progressives live on the West Coast, New England and New York, which make for clear geographic boundaries to form distinct regions that could operate as semi-autonomous political units. A devolution that surely “states rights” Republicans should embrace.
2
There are millions, literally millions, of Republicans in California. Yet, reading this story, the impression one gets is that the entire state thinks and is in lock step with Berkeley. The politicians clearly are. But the populace? Probably more split than people think..
10
There is no middle class in California cities. Poverty and homelessness are soaring, public schools are a disaster, and these trends are accelerating. One per centers wallow in self righteous sanctimony, but there is big trouble on the horizon.
2
As a 25-year voting resident of California I've seen significant political swings from Pete Wilson's anti-immigrant Prop 187 to the legalization of marijuana for recreational use. The state has, in my eyes, always moved to act upon its own issues, including environmental awareness to improve air quality and protect our coastlines. That the federal government is now specifically targeting California with legislation feels to me like nothing more than the Republican/Trump wing trying to punish the state. While at the same time using our economic success to pay for their tax cuts. I'd read comments from Republican legislators acknowledging this, with the justification that "They don't vote for us anyway". This not only infuriates me, but shows how tribal and juvenile this administration is. As for secession talk, any sane individual knows that's a nonstarter. I only hope we can maintain our leadership path. One of my New Year's resolutions is to speak with my wallet, and keep as much of my money in California as possible.
7
A country that makes a fetish of divided powers should not be surprised if the country divides its power structure. A country that rigs its electoral process to ensure political division should not be surprised if it divides politically. A country that does both should not be surprised if it divides geographically.
California needs the U.S. a lot less than the U.S. needs California.
2
Count Washington in, too. We are all in. Our governor is all in. Our senators are all in. We have reason and facts and decency on our side. For instance, the numbers tell us that the old drug war was an epic failure, which treated Americans unequally.
The tax-cut-for-the-rich bill was a unprecedented political attack on the blue states which are already providing billions in welfare to the red states. Mr. Trump can stay where he is. President Obama and Secretary Clinton are always welcome.
5
Thank god for California, which is living in and dealing with reality (diversity, immigration, climate change, technology, economy) as opposed to the Trump administration and its followers, who want to take us all backward decades or centuries.
Does California get everything right? Of course not. It is composed of flawed human beings, like every other place.
But here, there is a real and good faith attempt to progress toward a better and more modern life for ALL people, in stark contrast to the vindictive Trump administration, which openly desires to make life worse for any person or group who voted against him and the small-minded bigotry he represents.
California is the economic, environmental and cultural vanguard of this country, and in the long run it will prevail.
7
California produced Hoover, Nixon, and Reagan, and to a large degree painted a respectable face on the conservative movement in the country. Now it is neoliberalism instead of liberalism that is supported on the coasts and in urban areas across the country, but especially in California. Neoliberals are no different than conservatives when it comes extracting and concentrating wealth and dramatically increasing income and wealth inequality. It is so apparent in California that it is called 'liberal apartheid'. California has some of the most segregated schools in the country, the highest poverty rate when cost of living is considered, the highest levels in inequality, the most hate groups in the US and the number of homeless is driving the national rate. In spite of strict gun laws it also has the county with the largest number of firearm homicides in the US, with rates above the national average.
Conservatives played a brilliant shell game of talking values in order to be in a position to concentrate wealth, and neoliberals have used the same playbook. In this respect neither party is the 'good guy' in spite of what your party tells you as inequality has increased regardless of which party is running the government because both support policies that enable it.
2
The title of this article, "In Clash Between California and Trump, It’s One America Versus Another", is tendentiously divisive. Don't we have enough polarization and echo chamber "reality" in this country at present without using civil war type language? This is not Michael Harrington's "The Other America" but, rather, the characterization and stereotyping of one state as mutually exclusive with how one would properly characterize the rest of America. What's next, a H.U.A.C. (the former House Un-American Activities Committee) based on branding entire states rather than individuals?
5
Addendum - Today's Californians by and large also have a healthy respect for the environment and the planet. We're not willing to sell the beauty and natural riches of our state to put more in the bank accounts of the greedy.
We know that there are many in other places who'd dance if the big quake hit and California dropped into the ocean (an exaggeration even if the quake hit). We also know that thousands of those people are still coming to California every year.
It may no longer be the land of opportunity it once was, but bigger hearts and minds prevail in California, and the envy or attacks from the current administration or the rest of America is not going to change that.
4
This this is one of the clearest discussions I have seen of the reality that the ideological divide between right and left has become unbridgeable, especially when paired with the other Op-Ed about the “Museum of the Bible”. It’s not just about policy differences, it’s about fundamental differences in values, the basis of truth, and goals to be achieved. Neither side wants to live in the other side’s world. A split is inevitable. Perhaps California will lead the way. This New Yorker is rooting for them, and hoping our own leadership will take the tax bill as the assault it is meant to be, get out from under Wall Street’s boot heels, and show similar fight.
5
I’m an Oregonian, which stacks up in many regards to the politics of California. To a large extent, Oregonians also feel like strangers in this nation of Trump. They synergies between California, Oregon, and Washington dictate that we are, in fact, a differ t nation of ideals. Maybe the Republic of Cascadia is the answer.
2
The one thing that gives me hope is that California is usually the leader. Trends that ultimately affect the rest of the country often begin in California. It can be argued that modern conservatism, the uneasy marriage between the "values voters" and conservatives, began with Ronald Reagan, a native Californian. Hopefully, it will end with Trump and this country can try and get back on track. California will be well positioned to show the rest of the nation the road back.
4
"In Clash Between California and Trump, It’s One America Versus Another"
No it's not, it is the USA vs one rogue state, that believes it does not have to obey Federal Laws. It believes it is exempt for the laws that the rest of us have to follow.
What would the government do if California decided it was an IRS free state, no Federal taxes to it's citizens?
This state, and any other state, county or city, that disobeys Federal laws, need to be taken to task. It is within the governments jurisdiction to remove any of these officials that are derelict in their duties to follow the law.
3
The majority of Americans voted against the current resident of the White House. Probably more oppose him now. The majority of Americans are opposed to the current federal administration's policies mentioned in this article. California is an important part of that majority. If there is a hopeful, successful future for our country it lies with assertion and continued growth of that majority.
3
I suspect this isn’t just California, but every other community that stands for decency, using science and data to inform decisions, and treating others the way we would want to be treated.
4
I think California is more left-leaning than other states because California has bigger issues with inequality than most states. If you're making a middle-class salary in Georgia or Wyoming, you can probably afford the American Dream. You can still buy a decent house, a nice car, send your kids to reasonably good public schools, etc. in most red states.
That's not the case in California, at least not in the Bay Area, LA, or San Diego. If you don't already own property, the only way to buy a halfway decent house in a halfway decent school district is to come into a reasonably large (i.e., multiple millions of dollars) fortune.
It's also crowded. Privacy costs money. Avoiding lines costs money. Basic services cost money. Inequality stares you in the face every day in California.
So naturally, people might lean more leftward.
1
Be careful what you wish for, when it comes to States Rights versus Federal Rights. The article correctly notes the history of segregation as a States Rights issue (and cover). By adopting parallel Constitutional and jurisprudential reasoning, California is effectively legitimating actions by more conservative states to do many things Californians would strongly oppose, especially in regard to classes of people not protected by the Fifteenth Amendment.
The article refers to "2.3 million undocumented workers." Unfortunately, "undocumented worker" has come to be a "politically correct" euphemism, much like "right to life." Certainly some anti-abortion folks strongly believe in a right to life, but some don't. (Witness, for example, their divergent views on the death penalty.) What they do have in common, what is an accurate description, is that they are, in fact, anti-abortion. Similarly, some people who come here illegally are undocumented workers, but some are not. Words are important and, unlike the language coming out of the likes of President Trump, Fox non-News, and their ilk, our words should be accurate.
3
As a now-two-year resident of North Carolina and a cost-of-retirement refugee from California, I'm delighted to see them stand up to what's happening in Washington. Yes, California has probems, and some of them are large, but I never appreciated how much I had until I moved here. Be grateful, West Coasters, you are the light this country needs in these dark times.
4
It's real simple, if you don't like the Federal law then have your congressmen vote to overturn it. That's how our system works. Since the passage of the 14th amendment, Federal law supercedes state law. While I don't agree with that, that's how it is.
1
The Sun may go from East to West, but the future goes from West to East. Our rationality and diverse set of view allow us to accept the better ones. As the East worries about having enough fuel, all of my power for the household and two electric cars comes from my solar system on the roof.
I am so happy and proud to be a Californian! But for the past 27 years I have lived in rural northern California where the State of Jefferson movement -- secession from California -- has a stronghold. Its popularity waxes and wanes, and has been at a low point, at least in my region, since the big fires of the last few summers. Obviously, the disasters would have been a lot worse without the resources only a big rich state can summon. Now I fear the movement will pick up steam as rural counties are far more conservative that the more populous and wealthy coastal areas. I can't afford to move back to the Bay Area even if I wanted to.
Our founding fathers had an expansive geography and dispersed populations from which to form a government. So they devised a framework from which faraway states could resolve local issues in a coordinated yet self developed manner. This splitting of power between central and state governments is called Federalism despite that the original Federalist, Alexander Hamilton, had an inclination for central governance. As a century passed communication improved and businesses used it to grow large command and control hierarchies that government felt compelled to imitate when trying to solve the Great Depression. Big government really came into its own with its successful prosecution of World War II which gave an afterglow of goodness and effectiveness to which it rode to a zenith with the implementation of LBJ’s Great Society. Then came the reaction best expressed by Ronald Reagan in his 1980 election campaign as the scariest words in the English language: “I’m from government, I’m here to help.” By the new millennia many institutions with command and control structures were replaced by flat dispersed ones coming full circle to the condition our forefathers found and which now frays the bonds of the last holdout, our government in Washington.
As a native Californian with a seven year stay in Tucson before returning to raise our kids here I can offer insight about the Golden State.
As a right of center individual I can say I have never been represented by my state government.
Since Reagan it has been a steep slide downhill. The poorly maintained roads, train to literally nowhere, dams paid for by bonds but not built, two gas taxes in less than two years.
Unfettered immigration that has many city school districts with more than 90% Hispanic attendance. Most schools offer free breakfast and lunch for 90% plus of the student body.
Kids need to eat but where do we go from here?
We go broke because eventually the high taxes from the tech industry will relocate. When a computer scientist making $200k a year can't find a decent rental forward thinking companies will accomodate them by moving to less expensive areas.
California will drift to a Venezuela society. The legacy rich and Hollywood types will be comfortable in their gated estates while the lower class will clean their houses and work the local restaurants and hotels.
As long as the border is essentially open there is no hope for this state.
134
Your feet made a larger statement than your writing. I am glad you realized California is the place to raise your kids. It is a great state.
25
"Since Reagan it has been a steep slide downhill. The poorly maintained roads, "
Do you not recognize cause and effect?
Reagan is the reason our schools and roads went from excellent to mediocre.
Reagan is the reason for the homeless, since he closed our mental hospitals and threw then out on the street.
53
Mike, for decades the Republicans in the California Legislature have spent their time opposing and killing any bills that would improve all those things you are complaining about. Why is it that the Republicans always blame the Democrats but never do anything about the prob;ems thy blame on the Democrats. As to the Golden State drifting to a Venezuelan economy. If we were a separate nation our GNP that is continually growing, would put us in the top 10 nations in the world.
26
California could easily become its own country, and take with it the large amount of revenue it "donates" to red states in what they do not get back in federal taxes. A lot of change, in the United States, resulted from what was done in California. Legalized Cannabis is the latest, to force a national trend. While Colorado took this first step, it is different when a state of 40 million+ does it, over a state of about 6 million.
I would not be surprised that, those 14 GOP Congressional seats shift to Democrats. And a number of others, shifting the House away from GOP control. The Senate may be an easier switch. This, to control a White House, and political party, which are completely out of touch, are now rooted in scandal, encouraging white nationalism, attacking black and Hispanics, and sowed the seed for a new Great Recession, by passing their ill conceived tax law. California is the tip of he ice berg that si about to sink the GOP/Trump Titanic.
7
It is a clash of mostly politicians, one set that basically believe in the constitution and the private sector, the other who believes in themselves and the governments they control being in charge of everything.
4
And we are free to live wherever we choose to, ain't America great?
Where do "Citizens United", the Koch Brothers, and the dismantling of the EPA surface in your equation?
Your framing is quite simplistic. Citizens should be able to make sure their children will have clean air and water, leaving it up to the private sector is a recipe for disaster. The good men who wrote our Constitution could never have anticipated enormous corporations raping the environment for profit.
1
Good for California! I live in a blue state similarly “punished” by the administrations patent bias towards Democrats.
Trump said the night he won he planned to unite the countries. Like so many other promises left on the cutting room floor, this was, and continues to be laughable.
This is the first time in our history a tax bill has been designed to punish those who didn’t vote for this president.
If he wants a fight, he’s sure got one. Mr. President, we’ll meet you at the polls in November.
48
Our former president said he would unite the country but in his very first meeting with congressional Republicans declared “I won” and that he wouldn’t be considering their ideas since “elections have consequences”.
The ACA was the first social entitlement program in our history passed on a purely partisan basis. Our former president acknowledged the “shellacking” he took at the polls in the following election but then proceeded to ignore those results by legislating by “pen and phone”.
Trump remains a buffoon but I’m happy he and congressional Republicans have dismantled much of Obama’s policy legacy. The more the better. I’m happy to have the fight at the polls over the future of our country and am confident there will be wins and losses on both sides.
1
The Republican Congress' tax cut for the already wealthy, which Trump signed with his own large tax cut for himself, is being paid for by tax increases in blue states, that CA was the most prominent member, is an obvious attempt to punish the state. The fact that CA legalized pot, as an effort to reduce the strain on the criminal justice system of the state and to garner taxes for the state, is another area where ignorant social conservative types like Jeff Sessions want to further poke CA. Trump's bigoted attack on immigrants in CA, who perform a needed economic function, is yet another ignorant unnecessary attack on the state by the Trump Administration.
75
New York doesn't like Trump either....just sayin
108
Time for CA to become it’s own country
44
Without immigration, California is a net loser of population. The coastal elites live in a bubble.
18
California could lose some population and benefit. The fires North and South this year. Still next to no rain this season, always on watch for drought. Rampant homelessness and bumper to bumper congestion along freeways. California is overpopulated.
As are most states.
1
You owe us money. Send a check for our years of subsidizing your state.
1
First, I found it amusing that Sherry Bewitch Jeffe appropriated (stole?) a quote from the great Alan Ginsberg who first said “We are a coastal people. Beyond us, there’s nothing but ocean.” Second, it is known that California's economy is the 6th largest economy in the world: fortune.com/2016/06/17/california-france-6th-largest-economy/ So why is our "business" president avoiding the most powerful business state in the union? Personally I am sick of sending our taxes to Washington DC to distribute to the states peopled by the likes of those who voted for this miserable president. Time to leave the USA? https://yescalifornia.org
90
Once again, I have to point out that California receives $0.99 in federal expenditures for each $1.00 it sends to DC:
http://www.politifact.com/california/article/2017/feb/14/does-california...
With every vindictive move, with every embrace of racism, with every give back to the rich and indolent, with every greedy grab for more, with every attack on the poor and sick, with every move to cut health benefits, with every mentally unbalanced tweet..the resistance grows. It rows in California, it grows in New York, but not just there, it grows wherever decent people live, decent people who want to raise their children in the United States that they hold in their heart and in their memory, the United States that land of freedom and compassion for all. Its always darkest before the dawn..and a new dawn is coming. Long live the resistance, and long live all decent hard working, compassionate people wherever you live. The Beacon that was the United States will shine again, and will shine all the brighter now that we see what true darkness looks like.
114
to support any trump policy is to side with ignorance..... everything he does is either for the wealthy who are oblivious to the fact that they are soiling their own nest or his woefully ignorant followers. california, whether it likes it or not, is a laboratory for the future of the human race. we may not get everything right but we don't have the option of sticking ur heads in the sand...... we have real issues that need real solutions, not useless walls and bigotry.
55
Ignorance is not acknowledging sex type on a birth certificate.
As a 50 year California resident, I understand how the Berkeleyer-than-thou spirit of kumbaya inclusion can get pretty thick sometimes. It's part of socialization in a diverse community.
And California has not always been on the side of right. We passed some pretty dumb propositions -- like 13 and 187 -- and elected a cartoon character as governor. (Arnold has recovered since.)
But nothing in the last half-century prepared us for this ignorant autocrat or the fascist tactics of the Republican Party to deny truth, justice and the American way.
107
Bravo California!!! You tell him!!!
Best regards from another citizen of the Left Coast!
42
Trump's ideology: punish everyone who doesn't vote for him.
77
and hoodwink most of those who do.
2
... and all this time you thought the Zombie Apocalypse was just a media bonanza. California and other socialist states lead the way with horrible roads, Non-teaching schools, bloated government with overpaid public workers, elitist governors and mayors now adds several leading edge destructive forces. Sanctuary and super "rights" for for non citizens, illegal entrants and criminals and now another drug to enslave the public. The dead Weimar Republic leaders are planning on returning just to view the results.
11
So let us go!
If you hate us so much and we’re doing everything so badly, please, let us secede. We’d be delighted to stop paying your bills. Oh, and do you mind if we turn off your cell phone and shut down your computer and cloud account on the way out? You can go back to rotary phones and adding machines, That’s about your speed.
3
So Field Marshal Paul von Hindenburg, former president of the Weimar Republic, is coming back? Fascinating! Would love to ask him some questions.
I picture this so-called clash in this light:
The GOP, of which Trump is the latest reincarnation, is The Titanic.
California is The Queen Mary.
Guess which is still afloat? The other is sinking to a 12,000 foot grave.
16
Californians come to Las Vegas due to our very low tax structure. They want every conceivable social benefit there is. Nevadans want them to bring their money and gamble and dine at our fine restaurants. We do not like their arrogance and attitude. If you were a successful business person would you rather pay 13% state income tax in California or zero state income tax in Nevada. Come bring your California money but do not expect us to bring your arrogance. Frankly I will take a New Yorker any time of the day than a Californian.
13
I am a native NYer who now lives in CA. You have low taxes because nobody wants to live there. It is not arrogance it is reality.
3
I love this comment. California is the new, New York; full of opinionated leftists who want to force their politics and lifestyle on the rest of the nation.
Nevada is also able to gain significant state revenue from gambling tourists. Without that income, there’s no way your state of dirt farmers could afford roads.
3
2.3 mm (or more) illegal aliens
Unaffordable real estate prices
Unattainable and expensive university system (that is taking in as many as 40 percent out of state students)
Poor performing K-12 schools
Highest state and local states
Highest energy prices
Limited water resources
Predatory media and technology industries
Homeless everywhere
Is this a great state or what?!
21
"Predatory media"? What does that mean?.It's a strong media, one that goes for the truth. Are you a follower of Fox News? They're the propaganda arm of the GOP. News is not supposed to be partisan. It must be fair..
1
Off with all of the federal money.
6
We will be happy to keep the taxes we currently send to the Federal government and use them here.
2
Without California's federal taxes it would be you in Kansas, without federal money.
1
For those unhappy with Trump I felt the same way about Obama. But ask yourselves was it really worth loosing the election for the sake of Hillary* Clinton's ego? She should have been shown the door the day her private server was made public. The country could have had President Biden, O'Malley, Warren or Webb.
*The woman who became a multimillionaire by "working for women and children." The woman who when asked to chat with college kids puts her palm out and demands hundreds of thousands of dollars. The woman too arrogant to campaign in Mich, Penn, and Wisc. The country sure dodged a bullet with Hillary's loss.
15
No, the country ran into the line of fire with Hillary's loss. And she won the popular vote convincingly.
1
California style progressivism is like sugar. Too much sugar leads to diabetes, obesity, organ failure, and feeds cancer.
California's progressives have burdened taxpayers with a heavy load. The state's sanctuary status will attract more illegal immigrants who will need housing and medical care. Legislation such as Prop. 47, AB 109 have made criminality a viable career.
Californians need balance its legislature to save it from the extreme progressives that now rule the state.
13
Funny, the highest rates of the ailments you name, occur in Trump voting states... Californians on average, are a pretty healthy population... And yes, people in California will need housing and medical care, whether they are agricultural seasonal workers or CEO's. Throw the seasonal workers out, and you will pay twice as much for your Californian produce. Latin America would only be too happy to take over produce production when California's agriculture goes belly-up, and make the US pay for it...
1
So I live on the central coast ....you know the area that feeds you. Everyday I hear farmers say they do not have enough workers, fields are going unpicked.... Please just take a drive and look for yourself rather than parroting foxnews.
2
Sanctuary status doesn't attract 'illegal immigrants' - jobs and opportunities attract 'illegal immigrants'.
2
Nice headline...but it's nothing like "one America vs. another." Much more like America versus a malignant tumor that we're hoping will fall off and sink into the Pacific.
11
I can agree with all that the state of CA is doing with the exception of the sanctuary measures. This may come back to haunt them. The over population of CA is going to kill their golden goose. As is the pollution/traffic congestion.
You'd almost have to be half out of your mind to move there today.
11
California, the state that opened the doors to the future in every field of science, technology, and human development, is now held hostage by a backward nation whose views of reality are marked by ignorance and fanaticism. Unless California becomes an independent country, her extraordinary potential will shrivel and die on the vine.
World public opinion attributes to the United States the advancements made by California - from the atom bomb to the microprocessor to Twitter - not realizing that the United States is in fact nothing but ballast in the struggle for progress. Trump is not a singular event, Trump is the soul of the vast swaths of ignorant white rabble that, until now, were dragged into the XXI Century by the creative force of California and her people. But that force will become exhausted, and will eventually die - California will be replaced by China, France, and other nations where knowledge is respected and ignorance is not a matter of national pride. That will happen, unless Californians have the strength to fight back outside the voting booth.
60
"ignorance a matter of national pride..." So sadly true. How did the GOP pull that one off? Did it really only take Faux News?...boggles my mind.
And I hope New England joins California in fighting for independence.
President Trump and Congress highlight a glaring difference between California and other parts of America. As a 60 plus resident of the Midwest we look at California as an different place polar opposite of MI, OH. IL etc. different values, lifestyles. Now as a resident of Arizona many members of our community have left California rejecting the state, vowing never to return.
4
I would be happy to pay my taxes to the blue states only. At least the money will go into schools, roads, caring for the elderly and disabled and needs of the middle class and poor, besides not overspending on defense. America spends ten times more than any other country on defense with only a quagmire in afghanistan to show for it in results.
97
The money will go into roads? Have you seen the roads of SF ; they would make a third world country blush.
1
After trump is gone, California will still be the largest welfare state in the country, that imports much of its energy, with out of control crowding, housing prices and disappearing open space, clean air and water, a broken education system and on and on. Who will you blame everything on then?
13
@Al:After Trump is gone- California will still be the largest financial Contributor to states like yours who pay a fraction of what they receive in federal welfare. California's economy is the de facto "Second" America to a majority of other states.
2
The housing you are correct on. There are reasons. California needs to rescind its stupid property tax law that protects old white people who have lived here forever by forcing costs on to younger people and new people. That is one reason that building is slow here - people are reluctant to move because their taxes will be reassessed. Another reason is the environmental standards that must be met, which may seem silly to someone in Idaho, but in a heavily populated state, are vitally important to protect air and water quality. I dont know if you are old enough to remember what our country was like in the 70s. Acid rain from uncontrolled pollution in the industrial Ohio Valley. Toxic chemicals being dumped into the water in New England. And horrible, horrible smog California, that was actually life threatening. That is why we now have those standards. ANd finally, um, Education in Idaho ranks very close to the bottom of the pile. People who live in glass houses shouldnt throw stones. As for energy, you are way way off base. Currently California is the third largest producer of Oil in the country. Secondly we lead the country in sustainable renewable energies. California currently gets more than half its electric from solar and wind and is on track to be at 75% by 2025. There are so many jobs in wind and solar here that I dont understand why coal miners dont make a career switch.
1
Have you ever been to CA? We love it here, and your list of imagined ills sound like sour grapes to me. The only problem we have is being held back by backwards-thinking bigots who operate in a last-century economy. We’d like to move ahead in a 21st-century global economy with the rest of the world. We’re just asking to get out of the US.
1
This is less "one America versus another" - it's more the past (Trump) vs. the future, a desperate, destined-to-fail attempt to go backwards against the forces of progress.
38
California is the State of Harvey Weinstein, real estate out of reach for most Americans, and homeless populations that are larger than anywhere else. Who would want to live there?
16
Please spread this message to everyone you know. We’re quite happy here without you.
For the record, the majority of our homeless come from out of state. Our real estate — admittedly too pricey — is valued so highly because people desire to live here. And Weinstein’s a New Yorker.
1
not only are there already about 40 million who want to live in CA, even those on the right are daily lamenting the foreign "hordes" clamoring to sneak in.
we have our problems, some of them severe and some of them of our own making, as anyplace does.
but the overall sense of optimism and focus on a better tomorrow is what really sets California apart from parts of country mired in self pity and a sense of anomie because they haven't yet gotten over losing the Civil War.
2
Well everybody as you just pointed out because the majority of the homeless population is from other states. You should visit instead of listening to foxnewd
1
Democrats better get their act together and learn how to message, as Frank Bruni has begun to describe in two recent opinion pieces.
Terms like conservative, progressive, and liberal are meaningless today.
An example of correct messaging from Democrats could be this:
Democrats believe in real, competitive capitalism not the crony capitalism supported by Republicans. Democrats advocate much stronger enforcement of anti-trust laws to increase competition, as the great Republican president Teddy Roosevelt favored. Republicans have lost their way and are no longer the party of Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt and IKE.
I have at least 6 or 7 of these types of messaging prescriptions, but Dems just pay them lip service, and my calls to senators fall on deaf ears. So, I will send all of them to all 49 senators, Tom Perez, Keith Ellison and Nancy Pelosi.
29
I agree Under and tried really hard last year to connect with them. The way to fight Fox and friends is with intelligence, getting rid of useless concepts like liberal-conservative and promoting that which works.
Never forget that the "war on marijuana" isn't Sessions and Trump. The Centers for Disease Control and the Federal Drug Administration are not supporters either. The last I checked, the FDA does not recognize even a medical use for marijuana. Here's a link to a key page from the CDC website. Click on some of the links to see the Federal MEDICAL establishment's views on marijuana.
https://www.cdc.gov/marijuana/health-effects.htm
5
It’s pretty clear that when Republicans want something questionable, like voter suppression or vouchers for private schools, they love to trot out “states rights”.
But when it is something they oppose, like abortion access or medical marijuana, then suddenly they could give a rip about states rights.
They simply have a lockstep mentality towards their myopic agenda, and will march towards it no matter the pushback.
49
proud to be part of the Golden State, where the American values of fairness, inclusion and prosperity still are practiced. e plurabus unam!
34
Whenever the GOP is in power, the national deficit doesn't matter. Whenever the GOP is not in power, the national debt is a plague. The GOP, out of power, chants state's rights and is defiant against any democratic move. Now the GOP is in power so state's rights are not important and we should all kneel to their leader.
California is not the only state to stand against those who have no interest in the U.S. Constitution. Nevertheless all voters will be back in 2018.
23
This is all very disturbing because myself,being born and raised in California and an Angeleno,that is from Los Angeles the truth is very different than what politicians pretend. this New California has been manufactured straight out of Washington DC. by far left Socialist and globalist politicians. The voter base has been in the recent few decades built up intentionally by forced and rampant illegal immigration based on welfare and when it began in the 1980's ,most Californians were fighting rampant immigration and drug enforcement was quite prolific.So the idea that this new world was developed by some phony individual philosophy by new age Californios is a gigantic charade and a huge embarrassment to true individuals who have always made their lives there in the Golden state.
12
California may stand out, especially with its particularly diverse population, but it is hardly the only blue state to resist Trump's autocratic approach to government. Virtually every blue state, especially those with high property taxes, will work to help its citizens find a way to deduct their taxes under the new federal law. Meanwhile, many states, even in the South, are considering legalization of medical marijuana--and many have already done so.
Mr. Sessions and Mr. Trump may be afraid of legal immigrants, whom Mr. McCarthy paints as undesirable in his comments on "dealing with" chain migration, but they are not in sync with the country. Any country is stronger when families are strengthened, whether by immigration or other means.
It was not unusual over 100 years ago for a father/husband to emigrate, get himself established and then send for his wife and children. This country is better for that and will be better if we leave chain migration alone.
Mr. Trump wants to be a dictator, but the American people won't stand for it.
16
Wives and children are not considered part of the 'chain migration' in the proposal. And in your scenario, was the 'immigrant' her legally?
1
The United States takes in more immigrants every year than any other country. This is legal immigration, one million a year! The runaway media message pushing the propaganda that the United States is anti-immigration is completely absurd and a lie. The issue is Illegal Immigration. Breaking laws by coming here illegally is a problem, and that is what needs to be discussed.
4
New England is also at odds with the Trump regime, some of our states are suing his EPA over allowing more pollution from upwind power plants, our coasts and fishing industry may now be at risk from oil development, even more so as the regulations on that industry are relaxed to allow more carelessness. Our region is most affected by threats heating oil assistance to the poor and by possible Federal withdrawal of the cross-Hudson Gateway project that is our connection to the national rail network. And the tax law changes, marijuana threats, disparagement of science and higher education, and hostility to immigrants coming from DC are relatively harmful to this region.
There is a popular novel "Radio Free Vermont" a fable about a whimsical campaign for an independent Vermont (again!) Maybe there is a risk that some in CA, the Pacific states, and the northeast will actually start to take the idea of secession more seriously if the hostility to these regions continues to come from the Federal government, especially as I believe they contribute more to DC than they get back.
19
California, as with most states, has many of its own problems that voters and politicians alike - of both parties, have failed to face up to. Instead of leading the resistance, they should look inward and fix their own messes first.
7
The Federal Government outlaws marijuana yet burdens state and local governments with the vast majority of the costs and administration. All the while limiting the ability of local and tax to raise taxes though the limitations on local government tax deductibility so that the Federal Government can give the rich and corporations a tax cut. Only to the likes of Trump and Sessions does this make sense.
4
States don't enforce federal drug laws. The FBI and Drug Enforcement Agency enforce federal drug laws. Offenders are tried in federal courts and incarcerated in federal prisons.
2
Born in the northwest, lived and worked all over the country - East Coast, South, and now living in California. My work in sociolinguistics and communication has given me insight into just what it is that makes California an arch-enemy of Donald Trump (among his many arch-enemies).
While it is far from perfect or paradise, California is a champion of diversity. Old white men do not run this state. Sure we have plenty of them, retirees mostly, and we have history that's not always as great as we'd like it, but today's Californians are by and large open-minded with true respect for our beautifully diverse population. We also have a strong, hardy and proud pioneer ethic even so long after the first settlers.
It amazes me that so many in other parts of the country who shout "states rights!" condemn California for living it.
50
California isn’t particularly diverse. According to the Census Bureau, California is 72.7% percent white compared to 76.9 percent for the United States, but many states are more racially diverse. For example, Mississippi, which is 59.3 percent white, is more racially diverse than California.
California isn’t ethnically diverse. It is 38.9% percent Hispanic American and rapidly growing more Hispanic. German Americans, Irish American, Italian Americans, Swedish American, French Americans, etc. make up much smaller percent of California’s ethnic groups than they do of many other states.
https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/CA,US/PST045217
1
Only when they don't agree. Didn't hear much about 'states rights' when Obama was in DC. Didn't hear any California shouts for states rights when Arizonan's passed Prop 10.
1
Would like to see the stats on that 59.3 percent white in Mississippi...as you called out - German Amreicans, Irish American, etc. What are the percentages there. Your point is muddy.
And under the genius of our federal electoral system, California with its 40,000,000 population is assigned the same number of senators as Wyoming with its 585,000.
And if someone can explain to me how we ended up with two Dakotas and only one California, then I think I may finally understand the logic of the Electoral College.
What a system!
42
There’s a lot to be said for Californian liberalism, but there sure is a lot of hypocrisy as well. This includes the notorious Proposition 13, which served to keep property taxes low for existing residents of the state, while allowing them to rise to exorbitant levels for new comers, and regulations which severely limit the construction of new housing. Indeed, California liberals are leaders in the practice of nimbyism. The state is a strong believer in regulation, and the state’s taxes are some of the highest in the nation; so is the public debt. Many wish to move to California, at the same time many businesses and residents leave because they cannot afford to stay.
13
different time; different State
Prop 13's head honcho - Howard Jarvis - was a Republican. When 13 was passed, California still had Republican governance in its future.
2
The stupid property tax law was put in place to protect old white people i n the Reagan years. It needs to go. California has internal issues, like every state, but I have lived all over, and this is home. I will never leave again. The other thing CA needs to fix is its massive public service. Way too many people on the government payroll, imo. But all that pales when I remember the human suffering , massive poverty, and total lack of services we had when we lived in Arkansas and Louisiana.
1
This is the conflict between centralized Federal power and states’ rights, which is as old as our country. The founders of this nation generally favored states’ rights, as reflected in the 10th amendment of the Bill of Rights, “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”
Today, the balance has shifted more towards centralized authority of the Federal government.
It’s interesting to observe how this plays out on both sides of the political spectrum. Liberals tend to favor central authority when it comes to civil rights, a strong (perhaps excessive) Voting Rights Act, and the EPA, but reject Federal authority when it is overseen by a conservative chief executive as it is today. Conservatives are more likely to favor states’ rights across the board.
Personally, I favor states’ rights as a general rule; best to have 50 flavors of political ideology from which to choose, but with a common Constitution. This is a similar model to what the EU is trying to emulate, with mixed success.
California is endowed with many natural resources, and generally great weather. They are free to practice liberalism, but there must be limits. Immigration policy is the constitutional prerogative of the Federal government, and our elected President and Congress; California needs to accept and respect this. There will be new elections before long.
4
@Alex: What? Conservatives don't believe in states' rights across the board!
If they did, they would leave California and other states that have legalized marijuana alone. They would quit trying to get Roe v Wade overturned and leave immigration policies in place. They would quit trying to block states' efforts to legislate gun control. They would stop trying to shove radical, right-wing religious viewpoints down our throats, and they would quit attacking our public schools and other public institutions.
Conservatives only believe in states' rights if the ideology embraced by the states conforms to their notion of how everyone in the country should live. And they are apparently blind to their own hypocrisy when it comes to this issue.
The tyranny of the majority-
Natural resources not politics enables economic success-
The writer / editor should say more about the way the CA political structure falsely takes credit for the economic success of CA when the facts are otherwise. CA has an enormous head start of natural resources ( weather, ports, farmland, water, oceans, mountains ) that enable economic success that many other states lack. My belief is modern conservatives or liberals could create economic success with these resources.
The writer could also address that the urban centers essentially control the political structure in the state since there is no electoral college structure. All the representatives are determine based on population, essentially disenfranchising most of the smaller cities which have different needs from SF or LA. Naturally this leads to one party control which we all know is never a good thing in the long run since it inevitably leads to the tyranny of the majority.
A thoughtful opinion would say that CA has special political circumstances that rightly differ from the rest of the country. But it’s success is not a model for the rest of the country.
7
Seems from right here in California that the primary dispute with Trump's DC has been over climate change, is it real and can anything be done about it. California and Gov. Brown have lead, supporting science and common sense against the deniers. Compared to that argument, legal weed is not particularly important.
9
California is the driver of the entire US economy.
We rank as the sixth largest economy in the world, behind the US, China, Japan, Germany and the UK. The US Bureau Economic Analysis reported that California's GDP was $2.5 trillion in 2015.
We are the innovators in Silicon Valley, Hollywood, biotech, the country's largest agricultural producer and exporter. producing nearly two thirds of US
grown fruits and nuts and over a third of U.S. grown vegetables.
California is the dominant state when it comes to developing a clean-energy economy and promoting green technology.If California’s figures were counted as a nation, we are in the top five in the world in measures such as energy productivity, electricity from renewable sources and reductions in carbon intensity.
In terms of population, we have nearly 40 million people, with Texas coming in second at 28 million.
In other words, why would you want to punish California?
California subsidizes less developed red states. South Carolina, for example, despite its long history of opposition to the federal government, takes nearly $7.87 in federal spending for every dollar its citizens pay in federal taxes!
Here is a list of the top takers, which includes Wisconsin and Kentucky:
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/05/which-states-are-gi...
We understand why President Trump, Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan don't like us, but we're bigger and more forward-thinking than their small-mindedness.
California will prevail.
144
California is really a "break-even" state, receiving $0.99 in Federal expenditures for each $1.00 it sends to DC.
http://www.politifact.com/california/article/2017/feb/14/does-california...
2
Is that why you have a broken educational system, massive welfare state, tiny middle class, and enormous underclass?
CA is a tech bust away from becoming a third world style kleptocracy.
3
Trump is extremely vengeful.
He hates our powerful democratic state and wants to punish Californians because we defy his immigration orders and we voted for Hillary.
1
You go California! Keep the black hat Trump out of your movie.
37
Before the Civil War, federal law required states to allow and cooperate in the capture and recovery of run-away slaves. So the present conflict between the federal government and states over sanctuary cities is not unprecedented.
26
RE: LOS ANGELES — When drivers entered California recently from the borders with Arizona and Nevada, they were greeted with signs welcoming them to an “official sanctuary state” that is home to “felons” and “illegals.”
The NYT continues to show its bias by putting illegal in quotes as if it is not accurate. Illegal aliens are just that illegal. No matter the main steam media's attempt to candy coat with the term undocumented.
The leftist media is one Trump's best assets for reelection. Keep up the good work. Thanks!
17
Felons is also in quotes. Illegals is in quotes I assume because they are quoting the sign. simple as that. Correct use of quotation marks is not a sign of bias by "leftist media."
11
Why are you bias against "official sanctuary state" or "felons?" "There" are "several" reasons to "use" quotation "marks." I often use them for emphasis.
1
Your complaint against the New York Times shows your ignorance of the accepted practice in print materials used to indicate an exact quotation of the original source. No "bias" is being shown, no "attempt to candy coat". (You may wish to study the use of quotation marks in my sentence to further your education.)
The quotation marks in the Times' article that so annoy you indicate a knowledgeable writer, copy editor, and editor at work.
Although your last comments are probably sarcastic, I echo them -- in sincerity:
"Keep up the good work. Thanks!"
1
"We are all Californians!"
65
Good luck with that.
As a liberal transplant from Orange County to NYC, I wish these were the Californians on my facebook feed.
5
Want to join Canada ? :-D
14
@Michele Dorais: If California ever turns Blue- I'll keep my passport ready for an extended visit to Calgary or Montreal.
2
Yes, along with OR and WA.
6
The premise of the title and article is incorrect. This isn't a battle of "One America" v (another) America. This is a battle that *one* of the United States of America is willing and ready to fight against an interloper who seeks to destroy all of America's structures (economic, environmental, financial and civic). The only difference is- California is ready and willing to gird its proverbial loins and engage in a pitched battle.
We are one state of this union with the economic clout of an entire nation (sixth largest World Economy- growing from eighth in just two years) and it should do nothing less than protect itself from what is in essence a foreign adversary: The Donald Trump administration is an enemy to everything this nation stands for. Let there be no mistake. Tim Arango's use of Jeff Session's marijuana-mindset obsession to base a flimsy and idiotic premise for this NYT article- intentionally omits other state's legitimate concerns. Every state of this union needs to be concerned about this administration; every action impacts us all. That California is in the forefront of fighting back is just the nature of the beast.
Viewing Mr. Arango's bio- it reveals very thin credentials to take on such a weighty topic- and it shows.
43
Secede and provide your own sources of irrigation and drinking water as well as staff military forces all from within your own borders.
3
Without a sex on the birth certificate, I guess the stores here will be selling an aweful lot more yellow onesies as baby shower gifts for it. I love my place of birth as long as I don’t try to understand it.
1
Mr. deLeon woke up the day after the election feeling like a stranger in a foreign land. Now he knows what I've felt like in L.A. for the past 25 years with its unchecked illegal immigration and welfare statism. That Sacremento dumps foreign nationals on our streets from jail who have been dentified to have been drinking/drugging and driving, robbing, raping and molesting our children is a crime worthy of govt official's prosecution and imprisonment. I am currently deciding which Red State to move to by the end of this year. Hint: it will be one with the lowest rate of immigrants from California; where they quickly spread their insane liberal ideals of oppressive taxes, moral depravity and crony capitalism/communism.
11
Can I sent you a check to get out today Susan? Tiki torches for you and all of your new friends!
5
@Susan Los Angeles: I could have sworn I read every word you wrote on another anonymous cite. There are certainly other places in the U.S. where you and your views can find a complimentary home.
6
North Korea is lovely this time of year.
"parents to withhold gender on birth certificates" - is of course a lie. There's no "gender" on the certificate, only "sex". But writing the truth would sound silly even for democrats - a baby of unknown sex.
3
Please. Do not use the word "sex" when talking to Republicans. That is a forbidden word. They will pass a law against it.....
California alone is bigger than France, Trump alone is smaller than a clown. Nothing more to say.
98
California, we are with you.
42
No, we are not
3