The last time I saw my mother or father in law was on my wedding day. It became clear to me early on that I could never live up to the expectation they had of me as the first person of the youngest generation to ever marry into the family on both paternal and maternal sides.
I grew up in a home where independence and self-reliance were important values. My husband grew up in a home where everyone does what's best for "the family." (To the point where my inlaws told my husband at 18 that he was an embarrassment to his family for simply choosing to attend a university that wasn't "the family's" university.)
I wanted the inlaw relationship to work, even despite the fact that my husband's childhood stories of physical and emotional abuse made me angry. But my husband and I were always "disappointing" his family...for the most ridiculous reasons!
We would politely declining church (atheist) services but would agree to meet after lunch = guilt trips and tears.
We chose to sleep in a hotel instead of on the floor in my inlaw's crowded home during holiday events = we were labeled "anti-family."
We show up to a family event for 4 hours = literally tears that it wasn't 5.
Nothing we ever did was enough. Any time or effort we put forth with his parents was met with "not good enough."
And, despite the fact that my husband and I were making these decisions about how to spend our time or choose our values TOGETHER, I would be the only one to get all the blame.
36
Continued:
So, naturally I began to slowly distance myself to preserve my sanity. (I can't tell you how draining it is to constantly listen to grown parents literally cry that you don't love them enough despite reassuring them over and over that you do!)
The final rift came when my husband asked for space after our wedding day so that we could meet with a family therapist and sort out things on our own end. His father said a lot of disgusting things, blaming me for poisoning him.
I've told my husband and anyone else in his family who asks, HE can only make choices about his own family. I chose for myself to put distance. He decided to follow suit because it was clear they would never stop badmouthing his wife and trying to manipulate him into forcing me and him into a family role that we didn't want. We don't want/need their money. All we want to spend time together and have it actually APPRECIATED.
I find it ironic that they call us ungrateful when we were the ones giving them time and attention only for them to cry MORE MORE MORE.
They blame me, but this was a long time coming. When you add in a history of emotional and physical abuse and then add religious differences and values with zero room acceptance, well, I'm shocked that anyone is actually surprised at this outcome.
After being estranged for nearly 2 years, my husband asked his mom and dad to visit a therapist with him. They said no. Their way or the highway. I'll take the highway.
58
Just because someone shares your blood doesn’t mean they have a right to spill it. When family takes away much more than they give, when they continually find a fresh new hell of hurt to inflict, there is nothing that makes more sense than forsaking biology for a family of choice.
51
When a child is over burdened with raising younger siblings, its not uncommon for the affected child to reject a concept of having children. Is there anything that can be done to cause that effected child by others? I wish this story had talked about remedies.
12
I have been estranged from my sister for the last 8 years but we’ve had periods of estrangement our whole adult lives. She’s 13 years older than me and, to put it quite simply, she has always resented my late younger brother’s and my existence. The list of abuses and betrayals she has inflicted upon my brother and I would fill a book. From binding and gagging me and throwing me into a dark closet at age 4 to calling authorities in an attempt to get my disabled adult brother thrown out of his subsidized housing a few years before he died, her uncontrollable rage has always been part of our relationship. After being forced to get legal guardianship of my mother because my sister couldn’t accept the fact that my mother (and father) had given me power of attorney 7 years before they became ill, I finally decided in my 50s that I was DONE. Sadly I am also estranged from her children and their families, which is my only regret. But her shadow was always hovering over those relationships anyway so perhaps it was inevitable (she once asked me if I was trying to “steal” my niece because I gave her a sandwich she made the mistake of praising to my sister. My niece was 10.) Estrangement is a good thing in many cases.
30
Interesting how in almost every other aspect of society that abuse is defined by the victims - except when it comes to the parent/child relationship.
42
I'm seeing this 'estrangement' everywhere now, the kind of anomie historically experienced by displaced ethnic groups but on a national scale here since Trump took over. Divide and conquer. Sam Shepard, the playwright, examined the notion of family in depth. His comment on denying your own was that cutting off your own family, your ancestors, your history, denying that connection was a kind of suicide. These days, empathy and forgiveness is in short supply in America. Shrinks should incorporate that in their analyses more often.
16
I understand cutting yourself off from a parent/child when there's a history of abuse or truly bad behavior. I do not understand how children or parents completely cut family members out of their lives because of a rather trivial disagreement. Even a big disagreement.
It's heartbreaking and cruel.
29
I am estranged from my father for 3 years and my sister for a year. Everyone thinks I became estranged with my father because he sent me a Christmas card and an oh-by-the-way, Happy Birthday. But, I had long resented the abuse I suffered at the hands of my parents, his refusal to acknowledge my mother's alcoholism, for allowing his 2nd wife to separate us. I don't feel guilty about it at all. My sister has become a cold, self-involved person who has no empathy. She has stopped speaking to me, and I consider that we are permanently estranged. I don't feel bad about it either.
27
I can relate. I have cousins and aunts and uncles that I purposely distance myself from. Why? They all joined a strange cult. You can't talk to them in a normal fashion anymore, and it is so sad. Everything to them in this cult is spiritual, even having a bunch of red lights on your way to work one morning. Every time I saw them they would try to claim to hear messages from god.. (oh please!)... Usually though it was some bit of information they gleaned from other relatives then tried to spiritualize. They hated that I don't want kids (and still don't). Their children also have adopted the same beliefs as them. When you try to reason with them, or tell them they are in a very strange group/cult they refuse to listen and shut you down. Its impossible to see them and not be sad for their current state, or just annoyed. They consider anyone who doesn't think like them as "less than." How can I be friends with that? I also have an uncle (different side) and aunt who I haven't spoken to in 10 years. No one in my house in this case knows what we did to make them angry. They live about an 8 hour car drive away. We used to visit them once a year (us making the trip), and we asked them "hey can you guys come sometime." They came once to see us, then one more time but only because their one daughter was living nearby and they needed a pit stop. Still don't know why they are mad at us. Their kids are all a hot mess though, maybe that has something to do with it.
13
I’m 52 and the last time I saw my father was the sight of him blocking a blow from his abusive second wife after she attacked me. I was barefoot and braless and 16 years old. I ran for miles before I landed on the doorstep of a family who took me in until I left for college. I never spoke with my father again. People tell me I have to fix the breach because of this blood mythology. I say some relationships come to an end for a reason. I have my own family and my own children and I never want them exposed to that kind of abuse all for the sake of a blood connection. Nope.
74
It's telling that in the study that asked the parents about the estrangement, the parents say the children are choosing someone else, overreacting to "perceived wrongs" and have different values. Classic rationalization and minimizing. When they asked the children, it was abuse, betrayal and scapegoating. I think every parent whose child doesn't want to speak to them anymore knows exactly why. It didn't come out of nowhere and it didn't happen overnight.
In my own case it was 45 years of constantly trying to forgive and forget the behaviour of people who never apologized and never changed and hoping against hope it wouldn't happen again. I finally accepted that their abuse would always happen again and they would never change. I lost everyone and it's been really hard. But staying in a family where I am treated like a second class citizen no matter how hard I try to be good or to be lovable doesn't feel like an option anymore.
78
Not entirely true - My daughter cut me out of her and my precious granddaughters lives after my husband - her stepfather- committed suicide 2.5 yer ago. I am left without answers.
17
You act as though adult children can do no wrong. Hardly. I know a woman who, after years of enduring abuse from her husband, finally called the police and had him arrested. He reacted by committing suicide. Their daughter blamed her mother for her father's suicide and completely cut off contact with her mother. The woman has never seen her grandchildren. Rather than face the fact that her father was abusive, while acknowledging that she still loved him, and working through that, the daughter wanted to make it easy on herself by demonizing her mother. Sad.
32
Well said!!!...
13
The unpaid labor of creating home hurts all of our "home" relationships. With stagnant wages in America, more stress has been brought into the home. Siblings who steal inheritances should have been covered. So often, males think they have a right to female's relatives' money solely because they are male.
18
"So often, males think they have a right to female's relatives' money solely because they are male."
This is part of what happened to me, my brother literally used the term "primogeniture" with me as though we lived in the middle ages. But the emotional sickness that leads to the greed and theft is very deeply embedded in that male from the parents, and if family disfunction has never been dealt with it finally emerges or explodes when end of life issues must be navigated.
27
I believe that birth order is not the prime motivator for this type of greed and theft by one sibling against the other (or others) in family financial matters that need to be settled upon the death of those leaving behind money.
In my husbands family, two of his younger brothers were stealing the 'estate' blind while their mother was still alive. The will stated a four way spit. Four ways of zero, is zero. My husband was the executor and closed out the estate as personal belongings under $500.
For my husband, it was the not the money involved, but the anger that they would do this while the parent was alive, albeit totally in the throes of dementia. As in, who would steal from their mother?
Greed and theft seem to overrule moral compasses. Where does it come from? There could be a very lengthy, in dept article about that if someone at the Times takes that subject up.
My husband is finally settled that estrangement is the proper course. It really just brings more heartache as they try to 'justify' what they did. They will never understand, or maybe they do and choose to bury it, that it was never about the money. We have our own money, and get along just fine with what we have.
In the end, we would rather be us, who received zero, than them, who got it all. Moral compass intact. A value that money can't buy.
24
Nailed it. My life, in an article.
15
Same here. Both Adele's comment and the one following pretty much sums up my life story neatly and concisely. And let's not forget all the spineless extended relatives who wouldn't stand up for us or even believe us when we tried to explain this narcissistic nightmare to them. The evil abusers always seem to "win" and get all the support. They have everyone duped apparently.
31
This topic is so complex and very painful for many involved. Estrangement has other faces and causal factors besides those discussed here. Estrangement from a child or parent can and does happen as a results disfunctional marriages ending in bitter divorce. The horrific things (alleged) adults do to their former spouse with intent to damage their relationship with their child(ren) is, I believe, the ultimate betrayal. Projecting, placing blame, smear canpaigns, etc. are apart of intentional maligning of one parent to others includingand especially, the child witH no regard of the damage this does to their child (ren). This highly toxic dynamic appears to be much easier than looking in the mirror and doing the difficult work of owning one's part, committing to doing the reparation to move forward with the best interest of the child(ren). Hanging in there, reaching out with no responses, (for years), is unbearably painful. The hope, always, that one day the wounded child (adult) will challenge their old beliefs and make the courageous decision to be willing to re-connect with their estranged parent.
16
Some other thoughts. In the article, much responsibility for family estrangement is placed at the feet of the parents and little placed at the feet of substance abuse and/or toxic family members. Failure to communicate (blended families are prime culprits in this I think) allows resentments to fester (did Mr. Maack verbalize to his parents that he didn't want to be routinely stuck with younger siblings?) and family members can develop toxicity very easily. Sometimes all it takes is that perfect storm.
5
Mr. Maack was a child.The power dynamics between child and parent may prevent a child from voicing his wish to not be responsible for the kids. As eldest daughter in family with six kids, I had to rush home from school to get the latest babies from childcare (to save folks money),then haul the kids in double strollers to grocery store, then prepare family dinner for 8 daily until I left for college. And, not coincidentially, I think, mom finally left my dad when her servant/me left home.I loved the kids but hated not having a childhood. I also did all the ironing, on order, before permapress days: four bros and a dad needed six dress shirts apiece each week: five weekdays and church, so I ironed 25 white dtess shirts while keeping an eye on dinner prep. It never occurred to me to ask for relief:kids are dependent on parents for everything and abused kids, are often fearful. I sure was. I didn't disown my folks but I did move to another state so they could not go on using me. My dad, who got custody of one younger brother, was furious when I refused to go home every weekend from college to give my brother attention.when I visited mom, she always had some major project for me, like shampooing all the carpets or painting the entire house interior.
but I visited both my folks regularly until they died, believing it was right to give my daughter a family. When she turned 17, she disowned me and has not spoken to me since. 'she is now 35 and I have no idea why she dumped me.
36
@Daffodowndilly there are similar dynamics in my family. My mother is the oldest; 7 years older than her younger brother and 13 years older than her sister. This put her in a somewhat parental role in many ways for their whole lives. Nothing like what you seem to have experienced in terms if hard core work, but it definitely led to alot of role confusion and resentment on all sides. My mother always felt that she did so much for both her parents and the younger sybilings her whole life, which she truly did. Her parents, my grandparents lived next door to is since I was a kid and my mother was always complaining constantly about them, especially her mother, who she felt was excessively critical and negative all the time. My mother resented that she invested her parents money in real estate and worked hard at this, but her younger sister was always getting financial support from their parents and waiting tables 3 days anweek, but mostly partying, or going to school for the millionth time to learn to be a pastry chef or cosmotologist, etc. her younger sister, ironically, always resented her, because when my aunt was 9 or 10, my mother got married and moved across the country for graduate school, thus “abandoning” her, and she did look up to her as a surogate parent.
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3
@Dawn Growing up, it seems like every conversation I ever had with my mother was like a therapy session about how “her needs werent met” as a child, how no one appreciates her, no one respects her accomplishments, no one helps her. Now I am 44 and havent spoken to her in 3 years. Prior to that, I lived across the country and saw her maybe once a year, maybe called evey so often, each month or so. I’m not married, in fact, Like her, i struggled many years with taking on other people’s problems to the point of neglecting my own well being at times, including both my brothers, who I’ve also had periods of estrangment with and who I resent because I felt that I was left to take care of them when they were small while my mother continued to be entangled in other family relationships that were unhealthy.
My breaking point with my mother came as she tried to come across country and stay for a month at a time. She was so disrespectful and oblivious to my work demands and my friendships, so the following year, when she decided to come back I told her to visit my brother this time, not me, because I was too stressed out. She got angry, I got angry that she didnt care if she ruined my entire career. We havent spoken in 3 years. I know that part of the reason I can not explain to her how damaging her lack of boundaries is is due to the fact that she never cut the chord woth her mother and never stood up for herself when her family was hurtful. So i’m sympathetic, but have lost hope.
17
My father was an emotionally and physically abusive parent who had bi-polar disorder for which he refused treatment. My brother, who would fight back with his fists, first left home at 14. I stuck it out to 17, when I moved across the country for university. My father was arrested and convicted of assault of my mom and I from an incident when I was home from University.
A couple years later, my mother had the courage and support to leave my dad, especially after her boss told her he was worried she was going to die if she didn't. She and my brother moved far away.
My dad would call me, raging, in my dorm, at all hours of the night. Soon, I stopped answering. He'd try to visit and I would make excuses to keep it short. Soon, contact stopped.
One day he called and said he had an aggressive cancer. His treatment brought on severe psychosis. He would call me, desperate and scared. I decided to go to him. My uncle, my brother, who hadn't spoken to him for over 10 years, and I went back to the town where we grew up to help him, which included getting him committed. My father hated us for putting him in hospital. Those were some of the hardest days of my life.
My father passed away a little over a year later. I wouldn't say we were reconciled, but I spoke to him a few days before he died. Time has brought peace and forgiveness for him and for myself. Was it necessary to estrange myself from him for many years? Yes. Was it important to be there when he really needed me? Yes.
34
@Andrea
I can see how the end of life might bring reconciliation of some sort.
I have difficult parents who had a very acrimonious divorce. This created a great amount of unhappiness and stress for me. Additionally I experienced a long illness. This effected my physically, personally and financially. A few of my older relatives were supportive, but not my parents.
As it is now I just try to keep my life together. I really have no energy for negativity coming at me from my parents. My father in particular has been unessarily unkind to me on more occasions thanI can count and my mother is very difficult to be around at times.
I do feel that in the end I will support them as best as I can, just as you did, but in the meantime I basically keep my distance. That is the best I can do without going down with the ship. I find the gatherings stressful and enervating. They are not based in love, caring or reality. I can just barely take care of myself never mind put on a show for my parents. They are very out of touch with what my life has been like and don’t really seem to want to learn about it either. The rest of
my siblings do seem to care,
But the family is fractured and diffuse.
I feel like I am going through the motions - of something that has absolutely nothing to do with my reality. It is dissappointing to have a family like that, but I am doing my best to take care of myself.
This usually means keeping my distance, I am sad to say.
8
Following her graduation saw my daughter and her father (my ex-husband) leave me standing on the curb while they went off for a night of drinking. Although she periodically called me to take her to AA, she was never serious and eventually decided she couldn't maintain a relationship with someone, me, who wasn't an alcoholic. However, some excruciatingly cruel, manipulative years had to pass before I got the hint. All my children are functioning addicts I raised, to lose and what makes me so sad is that all I can feel is relief that I've lost the need to worry abut them.
12
As I read through your article, I could feel the ache of childhood abuse I suffered while with my family who by all accounts were a normal middle class family and from whom I've been estranged for almsot 35 years.
I have spent my life trying to understand what led me to the decision of no contact. I felt and thought about this daily to find a resolution.
There is no fault to assign as it was a decision that allowed me to heal from the trauma of childhood abuse. There are many books and forums these days for anyone to understand why children become estranged from their parents and in my case...my greater family as well, as the abusive behaviour infected the entire family.
My initial decision of no contact came a few weeks after I moved away from home. It was based on a feeling of calmness once I was away from the family drama and the thought that my parents had no interest in seeing me. (I am the middle child with 2 sisters)
The years have proven it to be a good decision as I now understand the depth and history of my family's abusive behaviour. That understanding has allowed me to heal and become the person I am today.
My personal opinion is that if a child makes the decsion of estrangement, there is a serious problem that needs to be acknowledged by the parents. Children just don't walk away from families.
58
@David Campbell
I agree. I relate to your comments which are very thoughtfully worded. Thank you.
13
My then wife, our two sons and I moved to Pittsburgh 6 years ago after her father had died and left her a house and money. We moved into the house that he had left her. We left our life in the southwest. My oldest son who was in high school had problems adjusting the the new school. He was bullied by both the boys and girl at school. We tried to help him adjust but it didnt work so my wife and I discussed moving back. She became understandingly upset. We moved back in 2011. I left a note for my younger son apologizing for what I felt was a mistaken move. Within a month of the move my wife filed papers to divorce me. My younger son stayed with her and the older with me. I made plans for my older son and myself to visit the younger boy. My now ex said it was not convenient. My son and I texted regularly and then came the bombshell. He accused me of several things none I felt to be serious, ( in one I chastised him for a derogatory remark he made toward a teamate on a soccer team I coached. He played on the team.) and told me at about 14 that he wanted no contact. I didnt put up a fight. I have always encouraged my son who resides here to visit his mom and brother which he does twice a year. My younger son has never visited me. Sadly he is now an adult and I am getting old. Proud od both sons as they have different talents. Resigned to fact at least I have one son who enjoys my company. Tomorrow I am getting a puppy.
24
enjoy the puppy! :) their unconditional love is to be treasure, indeed!
13
I'm sorry that there are no examples of a child estranged from parents where the fault lies primarily with the child (or is, rather, not the fault of the parents). My sister-in-law is estranged from her parents, and has been for several years, because she started dating a severely mentally ill man who convinced her that she didn't need her medication, either, and she became paranoid and delusional without it and cut both her parents off when another relative contacted CPS. I feel that this article, and perhaps the research itself, is skewed toward estrangement that is primarily the parents' fault. Not to say that any of the adult children quoted were wrong to cut off contact, but I would have liked to see another type of estrangement aside from the usual alcoholic/homophobic/abusive parent. It's not always the parents who are to blame.
30
I agree....this is what I was hoping for. I have an adult son that's been abusive to me for years, who I no longer talk to. There was a short period where I decided to be part of his life again, but it didn't last. Too many phone calls where I got cursed out and blamed for all the problems in his life. I never thought I could or would have to walk away from my own child, but there's just too much hurt and pain to do otherwise.
17
I was unaware of the phenomenon that occurred after the divorce of my husband: my oldest son divorced me as well. I didn't know that was a "thing", a possibility, until it happened to me. And it was many painful years before I began to understand what had happened -- that I was an ex-mother. My son and I no longer speak and I will not spend holidays with him -- after so many rejections, I could not bear the pretense of only Thanksgiving and Christmas. He only wanted that, really, to make himself feel better. Whenever I think of him, it is like a knife into my heart, and yet the reality of living without him is better than what it was with him. I never would have believed it could come to this when I held his infant form in my arms. My heart hurts. And yet I will carry on with still more peace than it was to know him from the age of 14 onward.
15
My mother had always been disruptive and unpredictable. My father and her divorced when I was 7 and in the late 70’s you always ended up with the mother. My mother was verbally abusive and also physically abusive. She remarried within two years and I was blessed with three new sisters and a stepbrother. The two eldest had already moved out and that left my twin brother and I and our stepfathers twin daughters. Unfortunately my wonderful new sisters became subject to my mother’s abuse. When they married the date she chose was my and my brothers 10th birthday. We never had a birthday again. That day was gone. We all scattered as soon as we were of age. I left at 16. As an adult I maintained a relationship. Then after the birth of my second child I was on the phone with my mother. She was up to her old ways and I sighed. She made a nasty comment on my silence and I said, very matter of fact- ‘I am done Mom. I can’t have a relationship with you anymore. I am sorry. I just can’t do it. You’re not a good person. You just aren’t. And for my well being I am just letting this go. I am letting you go.’’ I put down the phone and haven’t spoken to her since. That was 16 years ago. My sisters and my brothers are my greatest gift and I feel guilty everyday for how she treated them. She has no contact with any of us now. She makes attempts but through the only way she knows how - accusatory venomous accusations and threats. We bind together. We ignore her.
28
Thanks for this piece. I was raised by an emotionally and physically abusive father. My mom never left out of fear. She could do very little to protect me. It was my brother and I who got the brunt of it. It’s been odd and sad to see the outcome of the abuse. Vast differences in the way it has affected me as a woman vs my brother. I struggled and lacked self esteem & my brother over compensated with an aggressive edge. I didn’t understand the resentment towards my mother until later in life and have chosen to distance myself greatly from my father after my mom’s death. I wouldn’t consider myself estranged. The reality is that I keep a distance that enables me to live my life while maintaining some semblance of a relationship with him. He sometimes feels hurt, but he maintains a secretive lifestyle and appears to have no interest in “being” a grandfather. If he buys my kids a gift then he did his part, where I would prefer he build a relationship with them but I am not holding my breath. He continues with illbehaviors & has a million excuses. He is never wrong. My reasons for still maintaining some sort of relationship, he knows no better. My brother on the other struggles so much more & I feel for him. I have washed my hands of it. I don’t really know if I’m right or wrong in doing so but I feel in a better place for it. It’s sad but you either do away or you shut down expectations and emotions to try to hold on to something.
10
Over 34 years I've made about 68 obligatory trips by airplane to visit a family that rarely said thank you for all the Christmas gifts, the nearly new computers (when I downsized my business), or the dozens of long weekends doing house and yard work for our aging parents. The inevitable discussions on politics was like facing a firing squad. Then last summer I was asked by two siblings to not bring my longtime boyfriend to a wedding (we both went anyway because the couple said we should). Do I keep trying with this? Do I focus on the kinder (i.e., next generation) family members? When the last parent dies, am I done? Religion is their weapon, something that seems to have taken on a whole different interpretation than what I recall growing up.
16
@Russ Klettke I moved back to Chicago to care for my mom in her last years. My siblings, who were never loving toward me (one of the reasons I'd fled for the west coast when I was 21), were consistently unkind to me when I returned also. I did think I'd made decent connections with my adult nieces and nephews over the decade I was there. When my mom died, my sister wanted to disregard my mom's Will and screw the grandkids of their share; I wouldn't agree to that and so they all banded together and threatened to sue me. I am not in touch with anyone from my family anymore.
8
“Children begin by loving their parents; as they grow older they judge them; sometimes they forgive them.” Oscar Wilde. Migration and marriage was the preferred way to estrange for millennia. This isn't new if Wilde was commenting on it. You shouldn't ask people for things they don't have to give. In the end a parent/child relationship is just that, a relationship.
27
I would love to see a follow-up article on estrangements of siblings...
67
I'm in a similar situation. One of my parents has always had a big and difficult personality that loves to revel in chaos and drama. Growing up I found myself the target for their histrionics and, it wasn't entirely unfounded, but poorly handled on the part of said parent. I also thought their treatment was normal and typical of parents. As I grew up I realized that it was completely abnormal and that depression and anxiety we're rampant on this side of the family. Now this parent has become a fringe political fanatic that no one wants to be around any longer than they have to. Myself included. I only engage in one phone call a a week.
15
Are you me??? That parent is my dad.
8
They are so lucky that you are willing to still talk to them once a week.
14
When I see our unfortunate situation in our politics today, I also see it as an expansion of what has happened in our family lives. Someone is always to "blame." I had a very difficult relationship with my mother and always thought I'd make up for it with my own child. We are estranged though. I know she thinks of me as a bad mother. I will admit I worried too much. She got in a lot of trouble growing up and I bailed her out of many situations and now she resents me. She has a family now and I have grandchildren that she generally doesn't want me to have a relationship with. I know I made mistakes. We all do and no doubt my grandchildren will have issues with her. We're all human and fallible. The problem is lack of forgiveness and the insistence on being "right" IMO. If we can't get it together in our families, how can we get it together as a country?
22
The main myth I think we should be debunking is that of the sanctity of the family.This whole 'families are sacred', 'blood is thicker than water', 'what happens in the family stays in the family' mentality is what makes the family environment a breading ground for abuse.Society applies a completely different standard when judging family relationships.My mother has made a copy of my house keys behind my back, used it to get into my house without my permission and throw away things she did not approve of, steal things such as my diploma so I could not change my job, has gone to where I work to embaras me, has stalked my friends and my boyfriend and verbally attacked them.Those who I tell these things to are of course appaled, but when I bring up the possibility of estrangement, I always get the "you're being too harsh, she's just concerned, try to understand her, talk to her" speech.No one in their right mind would have this kind of reaction if the perpetrator would be anyone else in my life except a parent.It seems that by this mindset, parents cannot be considered abusers unless sexual or very real physical harm is involved(there are exceptions even to this).It should be simple: adult children have every right (and sometimes obligation if they want to form any kind of healthy relationship in life)to impose bounderies on their relationships with others, parents included.And to severe those ties when those bounderies are constantly overstepped.
45
Read the reddit group "raised by narcissists". You will find your familiars there.
13
I'm estranged from half of my family because they are religious fanatics. I've tried over the years but eventually I just gave up. It's far easier this way. I no longer have to be concerned about getting some insane phone call or letter going on about how the world is ending etc.
14
I'm one of six kids, and I have one brother who is estranged from the entire family. He's 11 years older than I am, and I think he was an alcoholic by the time I was in high school. Nobody really talked about it, so I didn't really understand what was going on. She stayed with him through recovery, latched on to his vulnerability, poisoned his mind against us, and isolated him from the rest of us. At every family gathering, she perceived some slight against her, e.g., she brought a cherry pie which didn't get completely eaten, therefore we all hate her. I'm not exaggerating. Over the years there were many, many accusations against my mother resulting in confrontations, always instigated by R. My mother is kind and gentle and was underserving of R's rants. They got married and never told anyone; the rest of us had normal, fun, family-filled weddings. A few years ago, my brother sent an email to all the siblings with an attachment that was a multi-page letter that he had printed and dropped at my parents' house. It was a scathing letter with all kinds of false accusations and anger over perceived slights from 25 years before. I had had enough of seeing this pain inflicted on my parents, so I replied that I never wanted to speak to him again. My sister piled on and said she never wanted to SEE him again, and they stopped showing up at family gatherings and moved away. And you know what? Holidays are SO MUCH BETTER NOW!!! Estrangement isn't always bad.
18
@Kristy
I was only here to read, but your story prompted me to create an account so I can respond.
You did not experience your parents the same way that your brother experienced your parents, especially considering the age difference. Even in healthy families, it takes conscious effort on the parents'part to treat all kids fairly and similarly. In dysfunctional and abusive homes, children are assigned roles, like scapegoat and golden child, I encourage you to google that. Im not saying this did or did not happen in your family, I'm saying its a possibility. Please do not expect your brother to perceive your parents through your eyes and your experiences. He has his truth. It may be painful to hear "bad things" about your parents, but he has his story.The fact he became an alcoholic proves nothing. It certainly doesn't make him a liar, and doesnt make your parents right. Childhood abuse could be the root of addiction, in some cases. If your parents scapegoated your brother, you are only magnifying his pain by denying his truth. It is not fair to treat him like a throwaway just because your parents set that situation up for you.
You don't know that his accusations are false. You know your mother as sweet and caring, that does not mean she was sweet and caring to your brother. People don't just sit around and make up lies about abuse, painful memories are difficult to share. I see that letter as a last ditch effort to salvage a broken family relationship.
26
My family was extremely dysfunctional. Alcoholic father commited suicide, enabling narcissistic mother. I never felt loved or valued. My sister was jealous of my relationship with my mother. My father abused my brother and I witnessed the beatings. My father sexually molested me at age 12. None of it was ever discussed. It was lonely and frightening for me. My siblings resented me for distancing myself from my mother when I left home at 23. They still do and continue to abuse me emotionally. My sister has been astranged from us for years for her own personal reasons which suits me fine. I know that my mother but her abuse has affected my self-esteem and ability to trust in relationships. Finally seeing the truth is helping to let go and is allowing me to make healthier choices for myself. My brother can be abusive with his demeaning comments which I have always forgiven but not without standing up for myself. He has always put my mother on a pedestal I think because he became her protector when my father abused her. I don’t think he’s ever really looked at the truth of his relationship with her. I no longer feel guilty about distancing myself from my family but it is the healthiest thing I can do for myself. Estrangement from continuing abusive family dynamics is the road to better health and a happier life. Very validating read.
20
My mothers jewish. Nuff said.
7
If 8 percent is the incidence rate, I would posit that 4% of parents and 4% of children are rotten people.
4
I don't think it's always just "rotten" people. I think some of it is untreated mental illness. For me it's better for my well-being and my family's well-being to stay out of contact from all the drama, but doing such is not a judgment on his worth as a human being. I hope some day that he gets the help he needs to heal and live a happier life.
10
I’ve been distancing myself from my entire family, immediate and extended, for several years. It came down to their bigotry and religious beliefs. And being told I didn’t deserve the same civil rights as the rest of the family because I married a woman. I feel no guilt for cutting ties. I don’t trust anyone in my family so why bother having a relationship with any of them? I moved across the country recently for unrelated reasons and I doubt that I will see anyone I’m related to again.
21
Are you demanding that they change their moral values to approve your choices? Can’t you just hang out with them without demanding their approval?
2
their "moral" values are immoral, bill. if it causes them to attack a person they could love fully then it doesnt have a connection with morality. after all the bible says dont think the jesus character comes with peace, but a sword and to pit family members against each other. that poisin is used often to justify bad behavior. no one should have to hide something like a spouse just to appease narrow minded people.
20
Who says they “attacked”? Note that we are only hearing one side of the story. I believe (as the Apostle Paul stated in Romans 1:26-27) that gay relationships are immoral. It doesn’t mean I can’t like you. I have had gay people work for me and we got along fine. They don’t bring up their gay lifestyle to me and I don’t comment on it. However, if I’m invited to your gay marriage, I will not come. Requiring people to approve of your gay relationship when they don’t is bullying.
3
This sums up my strained family dynamic perfectly. I have been estranged from my father since grade school, and am in the process of estranging myself from my mother and sister over some current family drama, but this has been building for quite some time and is finally coming to a head. The only reason why I've tolerated them/this dynamic for as long as I have is because 1) the societal pressure to respect and love your family, and 2) my sister has two young kids that I do not want to cut out of my life. I'm sure once my niece and nephew reach adulthood, I will have no reason to speak to my mom or sister ever again.
5
Interesting article. My mother was a princess type and emotionally abusive. As a child I used to seethe that I hated her and would never speak to her again once I was able to move out. However, though I didn't exactly forgive her, I kept up a relationship. "Healing" if you want to call it that, happened when she volunteered that she knew she had not treated me and my sister right. I'm an author of books for teens, so wrote a very well received novel based on our story. I published it with a major NY publisher after her death. Surprisingly, I never considered it catharsis, just an interesting story that readers might relate to. Most of my "fan" letters have been from adults. I'm now 75, and what happened all those years ago no longer matters.
11
Oh yes, it matters! Time is meaningless in that regard because the mind is not bound by time. We often disregard the powerful role symbolism plays in our emotional lives nor understand its use is obligatory. We cannot NOT use symbolism. All words are symbols. Children may not like the parent they have before them, in the moment, and may fantasize that their “real” family exists elsewhere; or they often conjure up the parent they’d rather have. The “wished for” parent co-exists with the actual one, in the mind. The yearning for the parent’s love and appreciation persists. This explains why some people grieve the death of a parent they often disparaged. The actual parent, who may have been cruel or unattached, will not be missed, but it is having to let go of the wished-for parent, that one will never arrive- that is what hurts. So, in the same consideration, one may achieve inner peace upon finding a way to love that person who never transitioned to the “wished-for” form; perhaps mental illness or some trauma from their own life’s path, would not allow it, but in forgiveness, you are no longer bound by resentment, anger, guilt or shame. You deliver yourSELF through forgiveness.
6
@F.E. Lane, M.D.
It is so misleading to preach forgiveness as panacea. You can shed guilt and shame through healing, and by recognizing that none of the abuse was your fault. You don't have to forgive to heal.
Research shows that pressuring victims of abuse into forgiveness can be re-traumatizing. Check your notes, M. D.!
12
Families are complicated. Humans are flawed. I’m a 71 year old mother and grandmother.
My husband never recovered from years of beatings at home and the Vietnam War. To say he made our life a living hell is putting it mildly. He treated our son as he was treated as a child! Our home was constantly in turmoil. I intervened In my sons beatings so I was also physically hurt. My husband was a high-functioning alcoholic and drug addict. No hard drugs! He always provided for us. I also worked outside the home. Our daughter is nearly 10 years younger than our son. She was a Princess. A spoiled child. A demanding attention and sometimes difficult child. Sarcasm was in her nature. Tantrums and demands were her specialty. She lacked for nothing! She was active in the school band, in church and sports. My husband and I supported her by attending her functions and cheering her on. We missed many extended family gatherings to follow her to band contest and trips.
Shortly after her graduation from high school she decided she hated her father. Her reasons were because he beat her brother and he beat me! She hates her father to this day. Vehemently! December of 2016 my husband had a complete melt down! He attempted to hurt me physically and yelled obscenities at me! Our daughter attempted to help me and she got the worst of the physical abuse.
She’s estranged from all of us and has cut off all communication. She has 2 children we can’t see. This is sad. It hurts me deeply.
6
Mary, it is not too late to leave your abuser. It sounds like maybe your daughter could help you. Please consider it. Consider counseling. Stay safe.
32
I want to say gently to you Mary that you are an enabler of abuse as well as abused. No matter how many band activities you cheer on, that does not change the trauma your daughter has experienced, and from what you've written it looks like she may be the healthiest in your family and thus must have no contact with the toxic rest of you.
Going to school activities only served to create a falst appearance of "normalcy" that SERVED the abuser and you, his enabler. No wonder your daughter saw through the charade and was sarcastic early in life, as you wrote.
I wish you peace and an ability to find some truth and healing even later in life. Your daughter has much more to forgive of you and your husband than vice versa - be glad you raised a girl that had the instincts to survive your family.
45
This isn't exactly news, but i'm glad it is out in the open.
8
Thete is nothing like a parents will or trust to cause estrangement of siblings when it is very unbalanced.
7
Where did the author even compile the myth list from? While I can certainly understand the need for someone to disconnect from abusive situations for safety I know an estranger is not always a victim.
I married into the family our "estranger" comes from and I tried to keep up with the relationship for my spouses sake. But truth be told the day we knew her estrangement was permenant was incredibly freeing for me. We didn't have to fear her behavior and didn't get to live with the nagging guilt of knowing she admitted to mentally abusing her husband out of boredom among other twisted behaviors. Not growing up with her I barely knew her before being cut off. Interestingly the same reasons she cited cutting off my partner were the same reason she cut off her husband's brother and family. She even would threaten to leave her husband and never let him see his kids.
So yeah. When mental illness is concerned, your myths aren't quite myths. But I'm no psychologist, can't diagnose what she's got (although I'm fully aware of the amateur diagnosis thanks) and I simply have one extreme anecdote.
But I will probably be one of the few commenters to admit I'm incredibly thankful to be estranged. We have friends who are like family and their children know us as their aunt and uncle so we didn't lose much. I'm just sorry for the pain her behavior causes family I love and value and now I keep my mouth shut now because reaching out got me in too much trouble.
8
Bad families cause mental illness. But, now that she's cut you loose, you won't see the happy, healthy life she'll live without you. Her behavior didn't "hurt" "family". It held you accountable, which gave her the gumption to leave you! Kudos to her! She's welcome in MY home anytime!
6
Bad families cause mental illness hu? That's insulting to half the commenters in this thread. You speak as of you have a personal connection to my anonymous situation friend. Many complex situations lead to mental illness. While genetics can predisposition someone to have a mental illness you can grow up in a loving home and still be diagnoses with a mental illness.
One of my closest friends has borderline personality disorder and loves her mother and grandmother with all her heart. They struggled prior to her diagnosis, but her "bad family" is hardly to blame for a condition out of her control. Bad families aren't the root of depression or anxiety. The human mind is very complex. Nature vs. Nurture aside.
Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. I'm more interested in the happy healthy life those around me live without her to be truthful. I hope you welcome all the estranged family members on this thread into your home as readily J. It's perfectly ok to let go of relationships that don't help us grow.
8
Sometimes mental illness can also have a genetic basis, so it may not be “caused” by the family. Mentally ill family members who refuse treatment and counseling can be toxic to the rest of the family.
9
My brother is estranged from me. It only takes one to be estranged. If my brother were to want to talk to me, I would engage him. I've attempted contact w/him many times, only to be rejected. My mother was a single parent of five when she met my father and had me. My father worked hard, provided for us all, and loved us all. My brother's father was a dead-beat who did not play a role in his life at all, despite running a successful business one town over. My mother spent years coddling my brother and making excuses for his poor behavior toward me (which has caused hard feelings between my mother and me). My mother continues to yield to his behavior because he's also estranged himself from my her whenever she disagreed w/him in the past. At 19, he impregnated his girlfriend of 2 years, dumped her and moved away, never supporting his child, nor calling, and only seeing her twice ages 3 and again at 8. He later married, and when his wife became pregnant abandoned both when their baby was 3. I have relationships with both mothers and children. In the past, I've reached out to my brother on behalf of his children, or at the request of his children, and he has lashed out at me for doing so. The last time I called him to tell him his 30 yr old daughter asked to be in touch with him, he told me never to call him and he hopes my father dies. Then, he told my mother, who also lashed out at me for making my brother angry. Family can be toxic. I should estrange from them for peace.
11
Wow. That's a tough situation. I just wanted to commend you for the interest you take in your nieces and/or nephews and their mothers. Just reading the little bit that you told, I feel for them and how they have been abandoned. It's good that you built relationships with them and can give them some kind of family connection.
11
My older has estranged herself from me. Not sure why. When she tires of that, she tries to turn her adult daughter against me. Thankfully. adult kids can see the truth. I will always love my nieces and nephews, no matter what my sibs do. :)
1
i'm so sorry.
1
I've been an estate planning attorney for nearly thirty years. I regularly encounter parents who are estranged from their children - sometimes by the parents' choice, sometimes by the child's choice. Two things struck me as I met these families over the years. First, it's much more common than I had realized. And second, they almost always think they are the only ones.
45
It was a relief and eye-opening for me to read this article. Not only that I could put a name to it, but I can also find comfort in the fact that I am not alone. Sometimes you can't speak about a parental abuse, but you are feeling unloved, unappreciated, unwanted since you can remember and you don't know what's wrong with you, it affects your self-esteem and your relationships. The story with my parents is complicated and I don't want to speak about it, But as others here have said, it is a painful process to realize your situation and to decide it's better for you to stay away...
22
If a parent houses, feeds, clothes a child, provides them with summer camp, orthodonture, vacations, birthday celebrations and a college education, it seems to me a bit ungrateful for an adult child to then choose estrangement unless there was severe abuse in the picture. Humans are flawed, families are complicated. But what about some appreciation for what parents themselves might have endured and for what they did for you in spite of their flaws? Who taught you to use a toilet, brush your teeth and cross the street? Who took care of you when you were sick, did your laundry, bought you shoes and checked your homework? How sharper than a serpent's tooth...
21
Nobody asked to be here. Don't become a parent if you're motivated by the future expectation of doteing gratitude. Moreover it's possible to hit all those checklist items and still be the source of deep pain and misery for your kids in adulthood. Appreciation for a parent's effort can co-exist with a healthier separation that is often no surprise to the parent, or shouldn't be if they have have any self awareness at all.
36
You can do all you recount above.........AND..........belittle every effort the child makes, every accomplishment undermined, every friend criticized, every one you love dismissed or insulted, every idea, opinion, fact ignored, etc etc etc. Heavy duty abuse? No, but decades and decades of just insult and dismissal can take a toll.
31
I have three theories as to where you are coming from, Deborah:
a) you have been fortunate enough in your life to have been shielded from emotional abuse from a parent (or perhaps anyone, for that matter)
b) you were emotionally abused by a parent and have conflicted feelings about this topic because you feel fiercely loyal to them and continue to be abused, constantly grappling with your choice to stay connected. You are probably a little angry at folks who have managed to break free, because you are not there yet
c) you are an emotionally abusive mother who thinks she is owed something from her nchild for bringing them into the world and spending money on them.
If it's 'a', good for you, but you could stand to have a little empathy;
If it's 'b', I have been there and feel your pain, appreciate your choice, and understand your internal struggle
If it's 'c', go jump in a lake
34
What about parents who have to make the awful choice to stay away because their child has a mental illness that they wont/can’t acknowledge and won’t/can’t receive therapy to help? No ability to resolve issues or escape from the constant accusations, denials, skewed reality etc. ...less common but extremely painful
14
The last time I spoke to my father was 2006 after barely surviving a devastating divorce. I wanted desperately to get out of Florida and return home to NY. He told me I could not rent a small apartment in his mother/daughter style Staten Island home in which he lived alone. In 2007 when my mother passed away he attempted to speak to me and I held up my hand to stop him. I didn't think he would appreciate being told God took the wrong parent.
13
Great article, and it's encouraging to see society begin to recognize that estrangements can be necessary.
A point I'd like to make: While I don't begrudge those who have superficial contact with a family member due to lifestyle or political incompatibilities, this is a very different circumstance from those of us who had to estrange our entire families due to years of ongoing abuse that was enabled and defended the rest of the family. I am in the latter category. Realizing that one must totally and permanently cut off one's entire family is emotionally and logistically traumatic, and one never completely gets over it. It can be disheartening to believe new acquaintances are in the same boat because they describe themselves as "estranged" from family, only to learn that this person speaks his or her father every few months and their main beef is over differing political party registrations, and remains close to most of the rest of his or her family. That's not estrangement, that's one low-contact relationship.
33
Hi Jiu, I really appreciate what you wrote here. I'm in the exact same situation. I endured a lifetime of severe psychological torture, which was enabled and defended. This adds major insult to injury. I was told that these things never happened. Totally gaslighted. Society frowns upon people who need to cut off contact from their family. Look at Deborah's heartless comment above. My family looked totally normal from the outside. No one believed what was going on. Since I was told from a young age that I imagined everything and that my "wiring" was off, I sometimes question it myself. It has wounded me deeply. And I'm in my 50s. My parents and brother are a united front against me. I'm The Scapegoat. And it is hard to free oneself. You nailed it with "emotionally and logistically traumatic." So few people understand, which compounds the loneliness. I also have come across so many people who are not truly estranged, as you say. I'm grateful to you for sharing your story.
27
thank you for sharing. it must be very difficult. i can't imagine. my brother won't get in touch with our family (he has undiagnosed mental illness) and it makes me sad. i have a couple of wonderful sibling relationships. i can't imagine life without them.
Jiu and Michelle,
Thank you both for your comments. Rarely is this a 'once in a family' thing. It's also generational. I first Estranged my mother when she blamed me for my older brother raping me. That was after my father estranged us all when he left my mom for his secretary. Now 30 years later my daughter has estranged me. I have gone through a lot in my life but this has been the worst. 4 plus years later and I am in a much better place mentally, emotionally and spiritually than ever before. Losing people you love while they are still alive is even harder than when they die because most of us have innate sense of 'hope'. I have some great friends who know and love me, a surrogate child and grand child now and a joyful full life. I will not allow anyone to ever hold me in bondage again! BTW, still estranged from 86 yr old mom who continued to torment me about the brother.
7
I question whether any article that cites primarily specific anecdotal evidence to dispel generalized "myths" actually does so.
"Estrangement Happens Suddenly" is supposedly debunked by noting how estrangement is a process of a relationship that "erodes over time." Okay, erosion happens over time. Actual estrangement resulting from that gradual erosion has either happened or it hasn't, pretty much the definition of "suddenly."
"Estrangement is Rare" is supposedly debunked by a study showing that a whopping 8 percent of British adults have cut off a family member. Perhaps we need a definition of "rare" before declaring something a "myth." 92 percent of adults have not experienced a disruption.
"Cumulative disrespect" isn't a clear reason for estrangement? One may not agree that any particular action is a sign of disrespect, but to disregard perceived disrespect as a valid reason for estrangement is ... well, disrespectful.
"Estrangement Happens on a Whim" is supposedly debunked by a small study of 26 people and one specific anecdote that paints the estranged party as a bit clueless in not even notifying any of his family that he had married? Not inviting them to a rushed civil wedding is understandable; but he doesn't even tell his family after the fact and doesn't think that's grounds for his family wanting nothing more to do with him? More than a little obtuse.
Here's a myth for you to bust: It takes two to make an estrangement.
9
Steve,
I totally agree. It’s dressed up with some technical language to give it a veneer of science. Sadly, these kinds of columns aren’t uncommon, and, going off of the volume and content of the responses, critical thinking is clearly in short supply.
6
I don't agree that it takes two, unless you think that one person not agreeing to put up with abuse means it takes two. I am not estranged from anyone in my family, but I know of a number of people who have chosen to disengage from family members who abused them. Were they complicit in being abused? I doubt it. Some people are mentally ill or have personality disorders and while it's hard, sometimes a person needs to disengage for their own sanity.
17
Touché in your astute observations. But here goes my myth buster, per your challenge: While it takes two, by definition, only one is required to “estrange.” The other can struggle against — or cede — to this action. But it always takes only one.
8
is anyone aware of the incidence of estrangement coming not from the child, but from the mother? Shortly after my father died, when I was in my mid-20's, my mother cut off all communication with me, refused to see me or my newly adopted children, etc. When people ask why, they are looking for what is was I might have done to cause this rupture, which seemed so unnatural. The fact is, even as a child my mother was emotionally very abusive toward me and once my father died, she didn't need to keep up the appearance of parenting. If anything, I was a compliant and obedient child trying desperately to earn her love. I believe the genesis of her hatred came from events i her own childhood, and I have gone on to have a healthy relationship with both my siblings and my immediate nuclear family, but needless to say this has caused tremendous emotional trauma.
22
God, I am so sorry.
8
You are a very strong person with a lot of insight . I am so sorry this happened to you, and very much appreciate your sharing your experience with us.
3
I'm so sorry that happened to you, Paula. My Mother is much the same. I wish her well, I truly do, despite the years of repeated emotional abuse. But it becomes too painful, eventually, to continually try to build healthy relationship with someone who has never been interested in having one of those w/ anyone. And once we become parents ourselves, we have the examples they've set to help us AVOID doing the same to our own kids. I think you're right - the seeds of our mothers' dysfunction were planted many years before you or I were conceived & so it has nothing at all to do w/ us. Our Moms were broken, and no infant or child can fix a broken adult. But we CAN use the heartbreaks of the past to guide us towards limiting as much of that dysfunction in our children's lives as possible. That's what I've tried to do (making plenty of mistakes along the way, yes - but they were all my own mistakes & not a rehash of anyone else's). Today I have a pretty great relationship w/ both my adult children, the kind I wish I could have had w/ my Mother. And that in itself brings some measure of healing. I think of it as my gift to her, my kids' emotional health & security being what she would have wanted for them IF she'd been raised to become a healthy person (instead of a broken mess who spreads her own pain far & wide). I hope you can find the same sense of peace and comfort. Sending hugs.
11
There are a huge number of estranged siblings as well. The day my father died, my oldest sister essentially cut me out of the family without any discussion or explanation. There had never been any kind of fight but I had tried several times over the years to explore our relationship. My friend wisely explained that “she is now CEO of the family and you’ve been fired.” It helped me to have this perspective and to understand that nothing I could do would change this result.
15
You are raising a good point. Estrangement is often between siblings, much more than between children and parents. And the rift often happens as parents lose grip over the family and someone takes over. I am so sorry this happened to you, it is a very painful experience. May you and your loved ones be happy.
12
I relate to what you describe. That’s a common multi-generational occurrence in my family too.
8
Wow.. Where to start. An outstanding article. My brother and I have had limited contact for the last 7 or 8 years, mainly because my view is that all he is doing is taking money from my parents and showing little gratitude. He and his wife have not spent an actual holiday with my parents in almost 30 years. It was leaving me and my now ex-wife the chore of making sure my parents would never be alone on holidays. For sure parents were never perfect. My dad made no excuses and said that work was always more important than family. That type of philosophy has caused a lot of damage in our family, most of which I'm only now starting to recover from. But none the less I do feel sense of Duty to be there for them. So naturally my resentment toward my brother is immense.
I realize that the main cause of much of this is my father. His conduct is not always admirable and sometimes it's downright damaging. But I do feel that sense of Duty that I not leave them alone. Although I know in some respects I should distance myself from them.
6
Check out The Enneagram, its the nine personality types and explains why personality types one feel a sense of obligation and duty
2
There are thousands of personality types. They cannot be narrowed down to nine.
2
Good for you having that fine sense of duty!
1
The article doesn't mention LGBT issues. Estrangement is something that many LGBT people face. A number of my family will have nothing to do with me. I'm confused, deceived, yet they have made no effort to ask me about being Trans. I am thankful for those who accept. One family member commented how much I looked like my mom. I don't know if they realized how powerful that was. There have been studies of the suicide rate of trans people. Trans youth face a 50% suicide rate. After transition, reports of being much happier are dismissed pointing to a still high suicide rate. In studies, estrangement is the major contributing factor after transition. I'm always open to those who want to understand being Trans. A slight understanding may be gained by looking at someone of the opposite sex, imagine seeing them in the mirror every day. Instead of a feminine face, you see a chiseled face. I am very thankful for those who don't need to understand. They see the inner peace of being myself. There are some who remain on the fringes. Not yet accepting, many due to faith issues. If they could see how much more vibrant my faith is now, I think it would astound them. Many LGBT people have been condemned. If you could see the effect of invited them to communion, you wouldn't doubt their love of God. I long for my children to call.
21
Agreed
Besides LGBT there are people with mental illness, autistics, drug and alcohol abusers and former abusers, occasionally artists or other people that families see as nonconforming.
And sometimes we just are not born into the people who are our families. Look for your family or tribe or whatever. I found a bunch of them in 12 step programs.
5
Ceri Anne - please read Mark Sichel's book 'Healing from Family Rifts'. It will really help you! It did help me!
1
I think the tragedy is that we haven't yet evolved a custom of relationship discussions to ease the way to discuss these topics. Too many lines are drawn in the sand without telling the other side what is wrong. Playing passive is also dysfunctional but we have all done it. More availability of the good family systems practises of psyhologists would spread the world and help us give our concerns and terms to family members.
All of us have sore points, reasonable and not, and we are all on the spectrum of understanding, from blockheads to empaths. Some are idiots, and some are a bit dense.
In the end, people feel better when they have stated their concerns and terms, even if it doesn't work out. The sooner the better, as time may soften hearts snd positions.
I'm really grateful for the input and opinions I read here. Thank you.
Perhaps I should provide an update on my autistic non-speaking grandson, receiving poor assistance and no language therapy. His mom sold the speaking program I bought him.
I checked with the children's lawyer who advised calling the children's aid, the sent a frindly email asking my son (the dad) to make the call to get his wife and son therapy from the agency, and said I would call within 2 wks, if he didn't.
I did what my conscience dictated - decided to get timely help for my grandson if his family failed to do No matter what they do, I can live with that.
5
My mother was a selfish narcissist who preferred my younger sister and expressed hate toward me throughout my childhood—telling me I made her life miserable, cursing at me and so forth. Because I saw her being relatively kind to my younger sister, I grew up believing I was a person unworthy of love. I have spent my life overcoming this.
I spent my teens and young adulthood trying to gain her approval. Nothing ever got better; in fact, her efforts to undermine and sabotage kept escalating, culminating, when I was 32, in her contacting Child Protective Services with false allegations about my treatment of my 4-year-old daughter.
Ten agonizing days later, after CPS visited my home and determined quite quickly that my daughter was happy and healthy, I changed my phone number and ceased all contact with my mother. It was the best thing I ever did, and marked the start of my journey to emotional health.
My mother subsequently turned on my sister because of my sister’s desire to have a relationship with me.
In 2009, my mother was diagnosed with a terminal illness. My sister, still allowing our mother to abuse her, wanted me to talk to her. I agreed to, for my sister.
My mother spent the first part of our first conversation in 20 years complaining about my sister. I ended up telling her, largely without emotion, what I thought of her behavior. Of course it made no difference, but I was glad I said it—evil thrives when others do nothing.
She died in 2010.
37
Thank you Cindy Allen for your comment. Many of your mothers dysfunctionalness I have also lived through with my mother who also passed away in 2005. I thought at the time I could finally have a normal father/daughter relationship. My father and myself did become much closer during this time up to his death in 2016. After my mother passed away my father continuously brought up to me that he loved both my younger sister and me equally and would equally leave his estate to both of us. When he passed away my sister said he did not have any money when he died. I hired an attorney and many thousands of dollars later found out that my father left his entire estate of $225,000.00 to my sister and lied to me about leaving it to us equally! I feel like all the old wounds have come back about not being loved by my mother and now my father. I am healing slowly but I sure wish my father would of told me honestly of his wishes when he passed so I could of asked him why he wanted this to be this way.
8
Cindy Allen- It sounds like we have the EXACT same narcissist / younger sibling favouriing/ calling Childrens Aid/ Mothers ! All those things listed above EXACTLY happened to me. I was 18 months older than my younger sibling, a brother, and I found out after I finished living in poverty for 5 years while I paid for my own BA degree that my mother (also she has Borderline Personality Disorder too, which is common in narcissists) not only paid for all my brothers university classes for 10 yrs (he kept failing) but also allowed him $500 a month spending money. I received not a penny. And yet somehow he racked up $50,000 in debt yet I paid off all my OSAP student loans the day before they were due, thanks to a heavy duty schedule of waitressing and saving and never spending a cent on myself rather than room and board and even then I was literally a starving student with no winter coat or gloves. But that still pales in comparison to her calling Childrens Aid totally lying. And then the lawsuit she decided to file against me and the new one that she is planning to file next week for grandparents visitation that she will LOSE. I hope you feel better knowing you certainly arent alone and you dont deserve this, Im glad you dont feel guilt to protecting yourself. I dont. Also I highly recommend an incredible book Toxic Parents ! Amazing. I have underlined most of the paragraphs as relating SPECIFICALLY to me and Im sure you would enjoy as well
2
Where to start ... given up for adoption into a highly dysfunctional and abusive adoptive family, by a mother who refused to acknowledge me until the day she died and a father who had more wives and children than I can even count ... I am very grateful for a positive connection with some of my half-siblings.
In retrospect, it was relatively easy to walk away from the abusive adoptive family. They made it clear from Day One I was a huge burden and disappointment to them in every respect. Harder to deal with is how the woman who gave birth to me turned away forever. Left this earth without wanting to see the daughter she birthed even once. And the wall of indifference I always hear in my father's voice.
So perhaps you'll understand when I say I've largely given up on them. Good older friends and mentors have filled the vacuum to a degree.
13
I was the scapegoat for my father's abuse from a young age. I left the house as soon as I was old enough. I remained estranged from him until his death. When I found out he had cancer, I wondered if I would have regrets when he passed about the estrangement, about the abuse. I went to the funeral, I heard the sermon. I am not a religious person, but during the sermon I realized that I could hand him over to God. And I had the most unusual feeling - for the first time in my entire life I felt safe.
27
I feel bad that I stay away except extremely superficially from my sister because she is an alcoholic. My stepfather was a violent and slobbery alcoholic and I swore I would not have that in my life when it was my choice. I feel bad for her but I want nothing to do with it. I never knew what I would come home to as a child. I keep in touch with rare emails , birthday and Christmas cards. That is the best I can do.
9
I am estranged to my elder sister, and by extension, my entire immediate family. The thing with my sister cannot be helped. It's like arguing against a hurricane. You can get mad all you want. Nothing is going to change. She will still be her same, self absorbed, megalomaniac- sociopath self. She has never been anything else. And the time to curb her nature has long since past. It is difficult to describe just how much the lack of her in my life feels so right, so healthy.
But my parents and one other sister are the tragedy. Necessary tragedy, but nonetheless. For them, it was how they decided to treat the two of us, our whole lives, including my estrangement to my sister, that was the nail in that coffin. And it is something I mourn, because it wasn't all bad (unlike my sister with whom the good memories can barely be counted in one hand) But the pressure and condemnation and complete gaslighting of my experiences with her, became too much to bear. My sister was always the favored child out of the four of us. And I was always the black sheep. which undoubtedly contributed to her self-importance. So when they started using any event to pressure me into talking or interacting with my sister, I tried to explain my grievances. When they were ignored, or downright shot down, i started realizing they were never going to consider my words. They only cared about the outcome: me deferring to everyone's wishes at the expense of my own.
18
Similar to my story. I have toxic siblings and father , one in particular but none of them can see me or acknowledge my truths. I am sad I can’t be around my mother in her old age because she is surrounded by them but I realize she contributed to and enabled this mess.
11
Not all adult children/siblings who choose no contact do so without taking personal responsibility. (They’re not as “heartless” as some here would choose to believe.) My sister is seriously mentally ill. She has been under compulsory psychiatric care more than once and I have good reason to believe that she suffers from Borderline Personality Disorder. Although, I haven’t been diagnosed with anything but depression, I know that I harbor an overwhelming amount of anger and resentment towards her and the abuse she’s heaped on the family for decades. Simply put, she and I don’t bring out the best in each other. And since my parents chose the track of utter denial, (leaving me to deal with my pain alone) I decided the best I’m able to offer is: don’t make things worse. And so I stay away so my anger doesn’t complicate things. To all of you who say that you have “no idea” why your family member is estranged: I respectfully submit that they probably tried to tell you for years.
45
For those adult children of abusive parents : please know that there are two levels of forgiveness. One forgives in a way that heals you . The second is a way that allows the abuser to be free of their guilt . The first way of forgiveness is essential, the second is earned and absolutely not required.
27
Never forgive someone who abuses you on purpose. That’s evil. I will never forgive my mother. And I’m totally at peace with that. I don’t need to forgive myself. I did nothing wrong
32
I firmly believe that children would naturally be inclined to cherish their parents if the parent(s) are healthy emotionally and mentally. It’s only when there is an unhealthy relationship that parent or child makes the agonizing decision to part ways. Those people saying “for no reason” there is definitely a reason!
26
You may not think that children disconnect from healthy relationships, but it happens. I have personally witnessed it within my own family and in a close friends' family. Both disconnectors are from extremely stable, humble, loving families whose many other children are happy and well-adjusted. In my experience, the disconnection is either due to extreme mental illness, selfishness and narcissism, or cult brainwashing. My point is, don't assume that because it hasn't happened to you that it won't happen. When it does, it will break your heart and there is absolutely nothing you can do but mourn the death of a family member who is still living. Have some compassion for the families who did nothing wrong.
11
When parents are unhealthy emotionally or mentally is when the adult children are needed the most. Would you have wanted to be abandoned at ur sickest in childhood by them??
Talking this out with your kids and being open minded may help. What you thought happened might be different that what your child remembers or remembers feeling . My daughter is 29 . In my mind she was a great kid and the best part of my life was being her mom. Now she seems to want to pull away completely(mostly from me) and that is so confusing for me and my husband . At Christmas of course it was worse. We ended up having a bit of a fight and she said she always felt like there was a lot f fighting in the house. Not a memory I have at all . What I do have to admit was that as the oldest child I relied on her often to help with my other daughter who was a more difficult child and I did sometimes gripe about my marriage (like upset if dad missed vacations due to work or failed to understand my feelings at times). This apparently gave her anxiety and she felt pressure to solve my problems, something I had no idea was going on. Adult kids have their own problems . Our reliance on them to deal with our lives isn't really fair , never was really .
14
Here is what I interpreted from your letter.
She said that you have fights all the time. You said you don't. Is her opinion invalid? What is "all the time?" By the way, what is a "bit of a fight?" You make it sound like something has to reach some critical level in order to be declared a fight. To my mind you either fight or you don't.
"As the as the oldest child I relied on her often to help with my other daughter."
So you made your child be a parent and do your job for you. Did she miss out on things because she was being a second parent?
"I did sometimes gripe about my marriage." "This apparently gave her anxiety and she felt pressure to solve my problems, something I had no idea was going on."
So you turned your child into a therapist. You burden a child with complex adult interpesonal issues that she has no idea how to fix short of agreeing to villify her father. Forcing a child to choose between mother and father.
I can guess that she has told you why she is pulling away, but you have dismissed her reasonings as not valid.
12
My mother and I survived a 55 year volatile relationship. Many times, following an insult or harsh, thoughtless comment i would cut off contact with her for months at a time. Always proceeded with a letter explaining my feelings and what i considered hurtful. We kept the door open, floating in and out of each others lives until she died last year. Gratefully, she and i were on good terms at the time and it made her death easier to mourn without added regrets. However, the long term effects and consequences include an on-going estrangement between my sister and I. Some things cannot be unbroken. The desire, the need to hold onto a relationship with my mother allowed me to forgive her time and time again. But I find I no longer have the patience or the desire to return to the insulting, hurtful behavior of a younger sister. While I miss my Mother, i confess, I do not miss the anxiety, the self doubt, the pain, the confusion that accompanied her unpredictable behavior and inconsistent affection. Survival requires self care. It is why i live out of state, away from all extended family. There are many times I regret being out of the family loop, but not enough to move back into a circle that includes a sister I will not abide.
9
I am 51 years old and I finally had to completely sever ties with my mother. I tried limiting contact but after my dad passed away I stayed with her to help get her settled and have her move to the area I live in. But it took about a week for the physical violence to start and the verbal attacks grew worse. I stayed for three months and finally had to escape in the middle of the night. I won't go back, I refuse contact with her now. It was the bravest thing I have ever done yet I still have moments of deep guilt and sadness. It is a blessing to find out that estrangement is not that uncommon.
25
Escaped from where? You moved in with someone who caused you physical violence? Ok that was a mistake. You mom sounds mentally ill. Eventually you may have to intervene or be there for the end. Protect yourself and remember she isn't well. If you aren't well, get help. She is still your mom and avoiding her all together will never make you feel fine. Being well yourself and dealing with her on a safe level will.
1
If you're 51, your mother would have likely been in her 70s. You didn't mention your family history, and there's no way of telling if your mother was that abusive (physical and verbal), and whether this is out of character for her, or not. But if this starts only now, or progressively gets worse, it could well be that your mother is suffering dementia.
Just a thought.
4
I'm reading some comments here from parents, talking about how terrible it is for them to have been rejected by their cruel children. I, too, was called cruel by both of my parents when I confronted them about childhood abuse and expressed a desire to detach from an emotionally unhealthy, vicious, traumatizing relationship. Do all of you hurt parents think it's an easy or simple decision for a child to separate from their parents? In all likelihood your children tormented themselves over their decision to cut ties. I know I did. People have their reasons, and while I decided to tell my parents why I was creating distance, not everyone does because of the response I received. Defensiveness. Refusal to admit wrongdoing even in cases of abuse. Being screamed at, cursed at, lied to. All responses I endured, and not something someone cutting off communication with their parents can necessarily handle. If you were the type of person who could handle honest confrontation and measured discussion, my guess is you wouldn't likely be in this position.
Point is, while you're busy letting the world know how cruel your child is in great detail, getting likes and strangers' compassion, you seem to have forgotten that they are your child, you are their parent, and in all likelihood you caused them so much pain they can't even talk to you about it. Rather than focus on making amends and helping them with that, you focus on your own pain. Maybe you aren't as innocent as you think you are.
57
Relationships are very complex especially that of parent child. People often lack the ability to perceive how their role or their actions contribute to misunderstandings and discord. No one is ever completely innocent in estrangement.
Try to be objective and forgiving and look at how we all can be complicit in family disfunction.
5
In a lot of ways, you are brave, in confronting the demons and deciding to tell your parents why you would stay away. Fact is, you would not have wanted to stay away if your parents have been loving and caring. And by bringing that up for discussions (of sorts), you know full well that you would in all likelihood encounter confrontation. (I rather doubt you expect your parents would just roll over, and offer full-on apology to you for all the perceived or genuine abuses you've been through.)
Honestly if I were in your shoe, I would just stay away, with no reasoning offered. It's easier, less hassle, less headache, and less of a need to explain myself (upon confrontation). Afterall they might not even care about my reasonings anyways.
10
Yes this so much. Sad your adult child isn't talking to you? Look in the mirror. If you are just going to complain but refuse to combat the source of the estrangement, I have no sympathy for you.
14
I just found this article via Facebook today. Unfortunately I have just recently joined the ranks of adult children estranged from their parents. For years my highly religious mother treated my lesbian sister horribly. Other things have happened and I just became fed up with my mother’s abusive behavior. I stopped speaking to her three months ago and have no plans to be in contact. It hurts, but I cannot tolerate her hurtful behavior toward others. She’s so self righteous that she is unwilling to see what she does and the harmful effects on our family.
15
Wishing peace and healing to all.
As an ‘adult child’ no longer in contact with parents, I share with those who have had to make this painful choice. I share the dismay, the doubts, the resignation. To the parents enduring this painful situation; I wish you deep healing.
To those who have posted something along the lines of “a person can never recover from child abuse” I would like to suggest the work of Melanie Tonia Evans. Her program charts a path to truly heal on the inside, and has saved the lives of thousands of people. Generally speaking we are not taught how to heal ourselves, how to meet our inner pain, heal it, and grow on the inside. Her program is accessible; it charts a path to within oneself. It consists of audio files on specific aspects of what is making an individual suffer, and helps you access and heal it. Titles of these audios for example; “Release The Immediate Pain And Feelings Of Loss”, and “Let Go Of The Fight To Win And Create Decency”. Her work is focused on healing, irrespective of what caused your pain in the first place. https://www.melanietoniaevans.com
To those estranged parents who post ‘warnings’ about not severing ties with them, as it ‘teaches’ your own offspring that they can do this to you one day, I say this; if my children ever deem that on balance my presence in their lives pains them more than it brings them solace and support - I hope they do have the courage to depart, to heal, and to find a life without constant anguish.
23
Amen sister. I wish the same for my children and have made the silent commitment to cooperate if they ever come to me trying to heal the wounds they suffered because I was hurt and in turmoil from my own childhood. They are in better shape than I was at their age, and I did a better job than my parents, but I know there were times that I didn't provide the love and support that I wanted to.
18
Thank you, Mary, for your caring comments and information. And thanks to everyone who offered information and resources.
I also suggest Laura Davis' book, "I Thought We'd Never Speak Again: the Road from Estrangement to Reconciliation; Shauna L. Smith, "Making Peace with your Adult Children," and Mark Sichel, "Healing from Family Rifts," as well as the website estrangedstories.com .
I have two brothers, both older than me - one by one year and the eldest by two years. The eldest broke off communications with our entire family over 25 years ago - and no one knows why except that maybe/probably alcohol and pride were involved. Then, less than five years ago, my next older brother decided to inform me that he did not approve of my values. Although I am admittedly far to the left of my brother - who is a "former" Marine and a career law enforcement officer; my "values" include being in a stable, loving marriage for 37+ years with a successful child of 27 years, multiple college degrees, and care-giver for our mother until she passed away. Like the article points out - this happened over time with the middle brother. We always had discussions about our political differences. However, I did not expect it would lead to estrangement as I enjoyed the banter. The estrangement from both brothers remains one of the biggest disappointments in my life. Having said that, at age 67 I am resigned to the outcome. I feel worse for my deceased mother who never got to reconcile with her "favorite son" and for our daughter who never got to know her relatives. So sad that lines are drawn in the sand...
15
Out of the blue, my older son has recently visited me with his partner, but despite my attempts to include my daughter and my younger son, they declined to participate. My daughter had suddenly told me a decade ago that she did not want me to come to her graduation, then recently to her wedding. My younger son has decided that he wants to live with his mother. Neither one will talk to me or give me ANY reason for their attitudes. In my daughter's case, I believe that she feels I gave my younger son more of me than she received. As for the boy still in high school, I believe it is a simple matter of convenience: he never did like the back and forth every week (it was originally a 5-3 nightmare recommended by our arbitrator). My daughter wrote a couple of e-mail replies that helped spook her younger sibling, again with no substance; neither did the boy bother to ask me to explain her attitude.
It is small consolation to know that other parents (and children) suffer from this treatment. What should have been a wonderful five years before he entered college after the divorce has become a nightmare. The boy has no idea how much he is hurting me and it looks as if this will continue for the next year and a half and perhaps beyond when he goes to college. In the meantime, everyone tells him how wonderful he is and, except for how he is treating me, I have to agree because I'm the one who raised him. Ironic.
I have used an alias to post this to avoid embarrassment.
4
There IS (the tiniest bit) of comfort in knowing you are not the only one whose child has rejected them but it really doesn't do anything to mitigate the awful pain of estrangement. The story is long and sad but the worst is this: I did not know why. Truly I do not. I blamed myself for a long time. Well, my son is 35 now and not a child. And without explanation he has also quit communication with other family members. I'm refusing now to shoulder the blame and recognize that he is choosing. And what he is choosing is to be cruel. And there is no resolution, no chance for reconciliation, because he refuses to communicate. Cruel sounds like such a dramatic word but, in this case, it is entirely appropriate.
4
@Pearce (Seattle) Not that this is any of my business, but since you posted it, here's my thoughts: It must be frustrating to not receive any explicit explanations as to why your children are avoiding contact with you. But it is telling that you state you have no idea why they are doing this, and that you insist that there is no good reason, or, in the case of your younger son, that it is just a matter of convenience. You seem to completely discount how difficult a divorce is for most 13-year olds, when you state "what should have been a wonderful five years ... after the divorce". You seem to be focused on your own pain in this matter, but there is almost certainly a great deal of pain involved on your children's part was well, that is at the root of all this.
18
I hope and trust that he will come around. Young adulthood is a heady, tulmultuous time. Virtual hug to you and I hope things bet better. Make sure to build a full, rich life for yourself... if he never comes around, you will find joy nonetheless. We can’t control others; we can only work on ourselves. Debra
5
I appreciate this article as it confirms my own family experience. At 69, I still look back at the separation between me and my parents and wonder if things could have been better. Violence and neglect forced me to sever ties 40 years ago and, while it saddens me, the separation was the only way for me to find any happiness.
I strongly believe that some type of required ‘child-rearing” education be mandatory for people wanting children.
14
I think children has a basic human right to access to their grandparents and the presents their grandparents wish to give them. No one should dare interfere with that lest they risk payback once those children grow up and take revenge by excommunicating their controlling parents for using them as pawns.
2
Uh-huh, so you're threatening the parents who didn't want you to interfere in their treatment of their disabled child, going behind their back trying to work with the school against the parents' wishes, with the idea that some day you'll alienate the child from *them*? Nice. And you wonder why maybe they're sort of keeping their distance from you lately.
6
Actually, my children will never have contact with my mother because she has shown that she will treat her grandchildren with the same disrespect and abuse that she has threated her children with. Her first and only overnight with my nephew, she bathed him so agressively that 5 years later he is still terrified of getting his head wet, when previously he had loved baths. She had temporary custody of a neice who still has nightmares from her time with her. So, no I will not regret my children know my mother when there's many more positive loving relationships they will know.
10
If you read the thread, those who cut off their parents, are often themselves cut off later by their own children.
Inadvertently, you teach your children that family can easily be cut out. Children don't see the abuse that motivated you, only the disconnect. I know, I kept my naricissistic borderline mother at bay and was even encouraged (wrongly) not to explain it.
It's a balance. I think one must get involved if horrific mistakes are being made that will cripple a child unnecessarily, even if it upsets the adult children. No regrets.
Thanks for this article. Based on the number of comments, it's hitting home for a lot of people. including me.
14
The presence of borderline personality disorders with narcissistic features leads to estrangement because the disordered person is typically a drama queen who demands excommunicating relatives as a means of continuing their pathology undeterred. "It's me or them" is a typical demand. Children are only pawns, hence their connections, possessions, wishes are all subsumed to the disordered personality, as long as the spouse plays along.
15
That could happen. But sometimes the person dishing out multiple "diagnoses" to his or her relatives needs to just take a look in the mirror. Dude, you're INTERFERING and you don't seem to get why that's a problem.
5
I have BPD and have a great relationship with my parents (both of them know and have helped me in my therapy). To say this is both ignorant and wrong. Yes, BPD has black and white thinking, but this attitude of 'drama queen' is hurtful. BPD is usually the cause of trauma and/or hereditary. Don't blame the diagnosis on someone being terrible or in this case, it seems like armchair diagnosis.
5
What a blessing you are to your parents that you are willing to attend therapy and that all of you are able to work as a team to live with BPD. Unfortunately, our adult daughter has declined the many attempts at therapy over the past 20 years, so my husband and I went on our own. We learned that her emotional manipulation of our grandchildren, and her siblings eventually required our needing to give up contact. We love and miss her and the grandchildren so much, but the verbal abuse was taking a toll on our health after so many years of trying. Our hope is that we will be able to re-connect with the grandkids, but we fear the window of change has closed on our daughter's self -acknowledgement of her behavior. Bravo to you KC )
5
The article was agonizingly close to home, very well written. paul
2
Perhaps estrangement is a natural progression of a changing society. A century or two ago, people couldn’t afford to separate themselves from their families. Reputation and family connection was needed if you wanted a job. If you were a woman, not even that was easily available. It’s a condition of modern times that we can move out and move on. And so we do. We have more freedom to be independent. In many ways, it’s no longer a necessity that we put up with people. And so we don’t. With the evolution of psychology, our expectations have changed: We now perceive a personal right to happiness. We now recognize what abuse is. We have individual legal protections. Estrangements from families seems one consequence. Maybe it’s not bad, just different.
28
Evolutionary. Really interesting perspective, and a departure from the many (also very interesting) pain-filled stories.
The job of any parent is to raise their child to be an independent adult. If that happens even at the expense of the parent-child relationship, the goal has been achieved. And a good generous parent will take joy in their child's success but will never claim that success as their own.
11
My father left his family at age 18 to join the service, and rarely associated with them in the decades afterward. His father had beat him, and derided him for stuttering for most of his youth, while his mother had thrown herself entirely into the care and adoration of his younger brother - so he was left to his own devices. He slogged along, getting various jobs, then acquiring a vivacious young wife with a mental illness that only manifested itself slowly, over ten years. He persevered and stuck it out, loyally believing himself bound to the family he created, rather than the one that created him.
He is now retired, with four successful children to assist him, but I wonder if he feels the estrangement from his original family more now that he is aging and unwell. Not that either of my paternal grandparents was pleasant or easy to be around from what I know of them. However, I notice that he feels more alone and a bit adrift, saying that we children "take after your mother's side" as though he is not really a part of "our" family...
5
After years of struggling I finally realized my mother was too toxic to be around. While normal with others she was delusional about her children and our roles in her life. We weren’t allowed independent thoughts or actions once adults Everything we did - EVERYTHING- was seen as a personal attack. The attacks were verbal psychological and sometimes physical. After dealing with suicidal thoughts I cut her off. When she died a few years later it was a relief
I notice that not one of the parents here whining about how cruel their children were to them, claim on acknowledge ANY responsibility for what happened. Their Narcissism and sense of entitlement is so ridiculous they see nothing wrong with any inhuman or remorseless actions towards their own children
I’m a parent myself and I wouldn’t dream of treating my children the way my mother treated me. They are their own people and part of my job is to teach them how to function when I’m gone. Not Parentify them to the point of immobility.
If you think the children are at fault here, think again. You aren’t getting the whole story
15
My husband was disowned by his mother for marrying me. (Her reasons? She didn't like my birth country, she didn't even know my name.) We got married anyways, and they were estranged for 15 years.
They eventually reconcile, but I choose to stay ahead from all of their family gatherings. As I see it, I have lived my life perfectly fine without having to deal with this mother-in-law, and I'd rather not inviting her in my life and let her boss me around.
She did try to reach out, but after some 15 years of no-contact, no-acknowledgement, it's too late for me. I did not stop my kids from going to their family functions to see their grandparents, that's as far as I'd go, in terms of "respect."
16
I estranged myself from my brother years ago. My brother had a serious drug problem that has ruined our family. He could not be trusted. I felt estrangement was the only choice and I'm so glad I did it. My brothers behavior was draining and he refused treatment which made my choice easy.
12
Despite what some therapist thinks should be the "final view" on the subject, change isn't always possible. A physically and sexually abusive father and a mentally ill mother who made me a parentified child were either not willing or not able to change. Sometimes you just need to protect yourself and have the best life you can outside of the family dynamic. Here's to you others who are making the best lives possible after living lives of chronic dysfunction.
32
My cousin is estranged from her mother and sister, now that her father is dead and her husband is dead; she lives in another state.
"I love that child so much," my now-retired former head of a social service agency aunt said. The other daughter is incredibly successful, as the world tends to count success.
It's true that my cousin has serious lifelong mental and emotional disabilities. Her mother refused to accept and fully recognize them. She tried her damnedest to manufacture a "normal" child--while telling the second daughter that she should be prepared to be responsible, lifelong, for her sister.
The parents were thrilled when my cousin got married. "We're so glad," my aunt told the in-laws, "that you'll be taking care of her now." The groom was also someone with serious emotional and mental disabilities--likely on the autism spectrum--which his family also failed to fully recognize and be prepared for. My cousin--that "loved" child--wanted daisies for her wedding bouquet. Her mother wouldn't let her have them because, you know, they weren't classy enough.
I tried, long-distance, to get help for my cousin; the twice-widowed mother-in-law, also active in charitable causes and with a daughter in social work, was overwhelmed by the challenges of dealing with a widowed daughter-in-law with very serious problems.
But adults not declared legally incompetent can't be compelled into anything.
But but but. She was set up to fail from the start. And she did.
1
As the youngest (age 42) of 4 children I have been estranged from my only brother for more year than I can remember, and have watched my siblings and parents perform their estrangement "dance" on and off for decades. As a result of this, I have always been confused by the phrase, "blood is thicker than water." This is certainly not a motto that my immediate family lives by, but will be interesting to watch when my parents come to pass.
6
Aaah, the old blood is thicker than water malarkey. So much manipulation in that little phrase.
Interestingly enough, it’s a contraction of the saying “ the blood of the covenant is thicker than the water in the womb”, which actually means the exact opposite...
Interestingly enough, it’s a contraction of the saying “ the blood of the covenant is thicker than the water in the womb”, which actually means the exact opposite...
1
I would just note that sometimes you can step back, rather than walk away, and minimize the guilt and questions. I spent caring for family members who routinely get themselves in legal, work and financial trouble. They’re mean and manipulative, to boot. My husband would ask why I had anything to do with them. But they ran hot/cold, and the warmer times gave me hope. Things never really got better, though, and I finally took my husband’s advice to walk away. I didn’t walk too far—I see them maybe 2-3 times a year, briefly and politely, and handle financial and medical paperwork for one. They get the help they want and I no longer have nightmares about untangling their snafus or wincing when the phone rings.
6
It was not until my father, from whom I was estranged well into adulthood, had been dead for 15 years that I recognized my role in our unfortunate alienation. It would take too long here to describe how I unveiled the resolution to forgive him. It was the most liberating episode of my 60 year old life.
Just last November,2017, after 38 years of separation from my son and only child, I made contact with him by hand written letter (found his address via internet)- pleading for my own forgiveness. Yes, history, left unattended, repeats itself. His response was beyond anything I can explain - an "unsayable" letter of redemption. We have only begun a tentative re-connection, so I will hold our privacy. For any interested I will happily (and privately) describe my ongoing trek through this intergenerational trauma-recognition process. It includes a significant re-framing of the phenomenon of trauma, with help from the writings of Dr. Bessel Van der Kolk, Dr. Stephen Porges and Brene Brown.
12
@Bill Israel I am very interested in hearing your story and how you found your way to understanding; I just found this article, so I don't know if you will see this response. If you do, please let me know how to contact you.
1
I really toyed with commenting on this article because it's such a personal topic. I fully agree with the people who commented that if you didn't grow up in a dysfunctional family, then it's difficult to understand those dynamics (and of course, every dysfunctional family has unique dynamics). I did grow up in a dysfunctional family, with an abusive father and a mother who protected, defended, and rationalized his behavior, and as soon as I was independent, I put some serious geographic distance between them and me. I've opted out of family trips, minimized phone contact, and I see them for at most 4 days at a stretch twice a year, because any more than that, and the patterns of abusive behavior begin to re-emerge.
Various combinations of parents, siblings, and I went to family therapy for 5 years, and my father always denied the physical and emotional abuse in the sessions, while my mother continued to play it down. After an incident where I nearly had to call the police, I thought long and hard and decided that semi-estrangement was the best path forward for my mental and physical well-being. I don't personally believe that sharing DNA is a good enough reason for me to continue to subject myself to an unsafe and stressful situation when no change is likely. I don't regret this decision at all, and I'm much happier and less stressed than my siblings who have maintained regular contact.
This makes me think of the poem "This Be the Verse" by Philip Larkin.
19
After trying for two decades as an adult to have a healthy relationship with my father, including going to therapy with him (he backed out after two sessions), I gave up nine years ago and have zero regrets. Somehow I married a loving man quite unlike my father and have three children after an unhappy childhood with a very controlling verbally abusive father. After seeing him behave towards his grandchildren as he did with me, I am unwilling to sacrifice the healthy and mostly happy family (two of three kids are now teenagers) my husband and I have been fortunate to create in order to have him in our lives. My husband feels the same. After reading many of the comments, there are a lot of other healthy people who had done the same for their own self preservation.
23
A perhaps final view on the subject. For years as a therapist I observed younger adults come into my office and complain about how their parents continued to treat them as they did when they lived at home and how much they disliked it. That session could be followed (and here is where my own "Ah-ha" moment came) by an older adult with grown children entering the office to complain about their children coming into the family home, tossing a jacket on the couch, a handbag on the dining table, and heading to the fridge almost before saying "hello". Parents and children both equally elicit the former pattern of behavior from one another based on shared experience.
If either of you - parents of adult children or adults visiting parents - wants the relationship to change, you have to stop speaking and reacting in the old way. How many of you toss your stuff on your friends' furniture and head to their cupboards? How many of you would respond as if your friend was a child if they did? You both need to behavior as adults seeing a dearly regarded friend if you wish to create that sort of relationship with each other as adults.
Kids, your parents grow and change just as you do. They are not the same younger people who raised you, just as you are not the same as you were when you were at home.
If you don't like the relationship, you have the power to change it. Abandoning the relationship does not change it. It allows it to fester in silence. Neither of you benefits from that.
31
Thank You for breaking the silence and speaking up on your experience. As parents we can only do our best to raise them while they are young. We can't force them to step up to the adult position or successfully differentiate, once they fit into adult sized clothing. that is their job. Success or failure in that department is on their shoulders not ours. And from my perspective, it certainly isn't helpful that there is a therapist around every corner they turn who is willing, ready and able to let their insurance companies pay them to indulge them in their delayed adolescence.
4
Sometimes, after years of failed efforts to change a destructive dynamic in a family relationship, it is necessary to leave it. We cannot control the behaviour of others. We cannot change the narcissistic and destructive behaviour of another. In my experience and observation, people do not choose to estrange from their families over such superficialities as you describe.
13
Nice, tidy "final word" wrap-up. Fine for families experiencing difficulties as children grow up and all members want a better relationship. Yes, we need to adjust behavior to new boundaries and realities.
But this response is laughably inadequate for family relationships where one or more parties are mentally ill, abusive, sociopathic, alcoholic, compulsive, domineering, or just plain mean. You can't renegotiate a relationship with someone who cannot or will not change bad behavior. (As in, "Don't call me when you're drunk and do not ever threaten me again.") Sometimes the safest relationship is an estranged one ... because continued contact only results in continued damage.
Sadly this illustrates how clueless many therapists are when it comes to seriously disturbed families; they recommend rational approaches for dealing with people steered entirely by destructive drives. Such recommendations are as useful as Laetrile for cancer patients. We abandon the relationship to get out of the torture pit, not to "fester," but to heal.
23
Not surprising given the toxicity of the nuclear family. Estrangement becomes much more difficult and less necessary if family connotes something broader and more inclusive than man/woman/offspring. In the confines of that tight little unit as in any other kind of confinement injury is amplified. If we were not so split apart from our multi-generational families, estrangement would be less likely because injury and toxicity can be mitigated. My grandfather and his brother were estranged from their father and each other. They had learned that parenting was bullying. My grandfather raised his sons on the East coast, my great-uncle raised his son Rob in California. My father was surrounded by family who provided him with alternative, nurturing demonstrations of decent if not perfect family life. Isolated from extended family, cousin Rob endured his father without the refuge of aunts uncles or cousins to cushion the psychological abuse. Rob turned to drugs and committed suicide at 40. My father is a wounded, terrible parent but if it were not for the buffer and love provided by extended family he would have ended up like his isolated cousin either dead or locked up in some institution. Without extended family I would be in worse shape. I wrestle with staying or walking away but duty and an unwillingness to give up keep me connected. I’ve learned to keep an emotional distance when necessary. For better or worse, I carry my family within me.
9
I would be interested to see a similar study on siblings. I have been estranged from my own brother for years . . . and plan to keep it that way.
14
I guess those researchers forgot to look at a child's sexual orientation as a reason for estrangement. True, society is more accepting, but in my social circle families of choice comprised men and women who had been disowned by their families for being queer. While not as common now, I believe that deserved a mention.
14
The research this article is based on involves very, very small samples of mostly mother's and daughters and is extremely slanted towards giving the false impression that certain myths have been or are being debunked. Of course they didn't choose to discuss the experience of the gay adult child who is suddenly cut off the moment the closet door opens, because once they tally those numbers the myth that any myths have or are being debunked will be debunked.
3
Repeating bad parenting patterns is a choice.
Wolves would have done a better job of raising me than my parents did. I married someone whose parents were even worse than mine. I had a dreadful emotionally-abusive marriage, worked full-time outside the home and had to rely on my own mother for a great deal of childcare.
I was stressed and exhausted all the time. But I had a wanted child and I wanted to be the mother he deserved to have, and I forced myself to be better than I ever dreamed I could be. It wasn't easy, and sometimes you're full of anger and you want to relieve it by saying mean hurtful things. But you don't have to say every awful thing you think. You can bite it back. You can be conscious every moment of what was done to you and why not to do it to your own kid.
There's no excuse--none--for not being a good parent unless you are so profoundly mentally ill that you ought to be committed. Everyone else--yeah, try harder.
25
I credit my own family estrangement to the trickle-down economics of bad parenting - my grandmother estranged from her family, then my mother from those relatives, nobody ever learning what a good family relationship looks like. My mother was overly critical, super controlling and seemed to take pleasure in humiliating and belittling me "for my own good." I was in my 30s before I realized she hated herself, so could never really love or accept me either. I vowed never to have kids of my own, lest the pattern repeat.
We are all such sad, fragile humans.
16
While the article was interesting, its greatest value for me was in the many honest, thoughtful responses it provoked. For those who did not grow up in a dysfunctional family, the pain and anger may be incomprehensible. Not surprising that someone cannot relate to turmoil, suffering, and confusion they have not experienced.
My father too lived through the horrors of WWII. My mother waited back home wondering every day whether her husband was alive or dead, captured or wounded. He came home in one piece on the outside, despite having been part of the fighting in the South Pacific, landing with the first waves of Marines on the islands we took over as the US forces fought their way towards Japan. How can I understand what they went through,
But I too suffered from the coldness and anger my parents battled with. Alcohol was an important medication for them and they and their friends used it liberally.
It was only in my early 50s that I came to see that they did truly love me, but their love was trapped inside of them for much of the time. I saw how I at times failed my children and could not express the love I felt for them. I have forgiven my parents, but it was a long time in coming. Today I do not believe the delay in understanding makes me a bad or immature person. It was very painful and confusing growing up in my family. There was much we could not say or understand. We all struggled.
Healing takes time, and it is messy. It is okay if some cannot understand that.
31
Renegator, thank you for sharing your harrowing psychological ordeal.
Manmade disaster comes in many different forms.
I'm glad you found the road to peace and wisdom.
9
It took until my brother made a comment about our mother never being happy before I could see what a weight her moods had been on us. That was at age 40. Before that I treated her as Saint Mom, who struggled to support us, living with a husband/my father who was subject to erratic mood swings (from appropriately serious or fun, to full of rage or verbally abusive - also a WWII vet). She was never the comforter, never offered praise or encouragement, and expected alliance with her opinions. Yet she always did her duty and beyond seeing that we were cared for physically.
When we cringe at our own failings - especially in how we act with children- forgiveness to parents is needed to pave the way to forgiveness for our own "sins." But we need to face the wretched specifics of their and our behaviors before we can forgive anything.
I respect what my mother did for us: now, like her, I do my duty, see that she is cared for, but absent that feeling of love which seems never to have been present.
Many readers have written of dramatic histories of abuse, but we all were not sexually exploited or beaten. Yet some of us survived hidden lonely lives within our families of origin, and struggled to open up, lovingly, as adults, in relationships that followed. In my own case, I think it will take my whole life to work it out. Perhaps there is nothing harder than learning the language of loving when it wasn't there in childhood.
14
This makes me sad. Not a very original or brilliant comment, but true. Sometimes estrangement is the only way to continue a relationship, even if the continuity consists of abandonment. I think of my father every day, but also accept that the only way to stay connected is through estrangement.
5
It is vey sad, but at least your conscious enough to acknowledge that the estrangement choice does not serve to disconnect you, but rather keeps you connected. It doesn't seem that many of the other pro estrangement commenters here are even conscious of that fact, nor have their therapists seemed to have let them in on the truth of the situation.
2
a very wise thought.
2
Our brother was abusive verbally every holiday to my sister and I - making fun of our dress, makeup, or partners. He found someone in marriage equally cruel (sadly a teacher to young children in elementary). One time boasting of leaving a child behind from a field trip. Now he and his wife have estranged his own kids with our parents (their grandparents). Our mother is distraught by this but my sister and I realize you can’t give compassion of which they have none. When our mother broke her foot- no call, no help from their son or daughter in law. On the circumference the veil is wealthy, successful community members- in reality a family of abusers who continue to neglect elders by estrangement. Ah, but now our parents let everyone who says they are so great— the real story of harm they’ve done.
8
We have five children and we are very close to four of them. The fifth child and her husband went through some very traumatic times and instead of reaching out to family, ended up closing ranks and shutting us out. Neither my daughter nor my husband are good at expressing feeling, so instead of the closeness they once had, they grew distant. It didn't help that my son-in-law is very passive aggressive and encouraged the estrangement (his comment was "I don't like being around your family because they are too happy"). The other issue is the fact that my daughter and son-in-law are very status oriented.; the biggest cars, most expensive hotels, and best house and school. My husband is the exact opposite. All of this grew into a final break that lasted several months. Fortunately fences were mended, but it will never be a close relationship. Too many differences and too much resentment on both sides. We have settled into a "polite stranger" relationship which works. For years I ached for the daughter I once had, but I am at the acceptance part of grief now and I am OK with what I have. No one said life would be easy.
20
Marriage partners play a huge role in influencing sudden emotional cut-offs and/or estrangements, especially those who have a family history of estrangement.
10
Oh jeez - the classic "blame the spouse." excuse. As though the abused can't think for themselves. And if they have indeed succumbed to a spouse or partner who is that controlling, it is because they have become comfortable with it. Hmm...I wonder why?
3
From my earliest memories my mother made it clear that I was an embarrassment, that she was ashamed of me and that she wished I had never been born. I knew exactly where I stood with her, so I had no expectations of ever being loved or even accepted by her. In early adulthood I had little contact with her, but we have kept in touch over the years and have even forged a non-confrontational cease-fire that allows us to spend holidays together. It's weird, I admit, but forgiveness is always the best policy, even if face-to-face interactions are not feasible.
12
Glassyeyed....you deserve a medal.
Your mother is damaged goods.
You have a great heart.
11
Thank you, Socrates, but she did her best. I was on the autism spectrum when no one knew what that was, so she had a lot to deal with I'm sure.
7
I understand the kind intention you have Socrates when you describe the mother as "damaged goods" but perhaps it would have been better to say emotionally damaged. "Damaged goods" is a phrase that was used not all that long ago to describe girls or women who had sexual experience outside of marriage. It was used, more often than not, by other women, and the effect was very harmful and very hurtful to the young women it was directed at.
4
My opinion is that many—certainly not all—cases of estrangement are based mostly on selfishness. We live in a very “me”-centered society.
A good friend of mine is estranged from his three siblings. His parents died several years ago and each sibling inherited at least a million dollars if not more. My friend said he would never see his siblings again and as far as I know he’s stuck to his word. I think it’s from petty jealousies and selfishness. His parents would be heartbroken.
My family has issues but they are family and I see that as important. It’s true we choose our friends and not our family but family ties are important.
5
Estrangement is not based solely on selfishness, jwwarren. Try telling someone with a mentally ill, emotionally and psychologically abusive and manipulative relative how important family ties are when they're trying to navigate a horror show day in and day out. I have a relative like this, and I've seen first hand just how devastating it is for the family while the cause of all the problems just keeps being mean and hateful without so much as blinking an eye. Kindness doesn't work. Understanding doesn't work. Support - financial and emotional - doesn't work because these sorts of people just sabotage all your efforts. Sometimes, in order to survive, estrangement is the only answer for family members who are being subjected to unrelenting abuse and chaos. Think it's still a selfish choice? Spend some time with my mentally unstable, manipulative relative, walk a mile in the shoes of her sister, who is trying to manage her care because there is literally no one else available to do so, and watch said sister get nothing but abuse in return. Then tell me, with a straight face, what a selfish choice estrangement is, and how it's based on nothing but petty jealousies.
18
@Lindsay K: to his credit, jwwarren did say " many—certainly not all".
1
Yes, I read that fist sentence too "My opinion is that many—certainly not all—cases of estrangement are based mostly on selfishness." And i agree...
Unless you've experienced a truly dysfunctional family, it's impossible to understand why a person would limit contact or not have it all. In my opinion it's literally a matter of survival. The constant effort to undermine your child's very being, even when they're grown, is a habit that some parents feel entitled to. The word "mother" and "father" contain so much weight, but when you've been emotionally abused, the words make your blood run cold.
51
You said it, very concisely.
9
I've been on both sides of this issue. My parents were abusive alcoholics and my mother died while I was in my 20s. My father had been in and out of our lives since the beginning, but when he was in, he beat me and my mother. I had no contact with him for 20 years, and I then reincorporated him into my life b/c he seemed to have overcome his demons, and I wanted my children to know their grandfather. When my kids were about 10 y/o, he abandoned us again. I watched history repeat itself.
On the other hand, my in-laws are narcissistic and controlling. I had to back away from them slowly because of their toxicity. We have a fragile peace.
When my sister and her husband were divorcing I interfered, after she had expressly asked me not to. So my fault & I accept that. My former BIL blamed me for the divorce (I think it was his cheating, but oh well). She bought it & eliminated me from her family, and my children from their cousins, for 5 years. No contact. That hurt, esp when I had to tell my children that they couldn't see their cousins, who they had previously been close to.
A few years ago my sister asked to re-establish contact. It was difficult as I had finally made my peace with the estrangement, but I went along. We have a fragile peace and the cousins have a relationship.
Our family has a habit of walking away from conflict (I think we invented ghosting). I work on breaking that cycle w/ successes & failures. I hope we model better behavior for our children.
10
"Our family has a habit of walking away from conflict (I think we invented ghosting). I work on breaking that cycle w/ successes & failures. I hope we model better behavior for our children." Nice! That's a growth mindset.
Sadly, ghosting is becoming quite a routine way of life. This next generation deserves as many parents and others as possible with the strength of character and courage of conviction to model better than this push to normalize estrangement that is fueling our cut off culture.
3
I'm weighing how to handle a sibling that I find highly aggressive, critical and demeaning. We both oversee caregiving to three other family members (2 elder parents and a sibling with disabilities). It's been a horrendous year and I've had to take the lead on many financial concerns e.g. selling their house (without a broker), renovating the apartment they moved from into assisted living and memory care and resolving a conflict with my dad's broker at JP Morgan who charged him over $90,000 in commissions this year for an account that earns less than that in income??? It's been stressful and I've given up my work and professional commitments. Now I attend all week to family affairs, then visit my parents, however, often the next day my sister yells at me for petty issues such not buying dad soda, painting their old apartment myself to save money, traveling to visit cousins. Such criticism is not new but is happening at a bad time. Yet my sister is very good with visiting our parents and at times very warm and loving. She has a history of alcohol use and it seems as though she is bipolar or irrational. At a time when I'm struggling to stabilize my parent’s finances, it's hard to handle her anger. I know it would upset my father for us not to be close but I have decided to distance myself to protect my own sanity. My husband and daughter are also distressed by how she treats me. I'm not sure I could fully sever ties even if it was healthier as many people depend on us.
10
It is very evident and quite instructive that alcohol is a familiar theme in these posts.
9
Forgiveness doesn't always include relationship. You can genuinely wish your parent well and still go on about your life because you know your only hope for a decent life is without the influence of the toxic/unloving parent. Families do not so much demand forgiveness as they demand overlooking the harm to begin with. It is very unusual for a seriously dysfunctional family's matriarchs or patriarchs to own up to the dysfunction or strive to change it; therefore, generations of family members often sacrifice their better selves to a system that doesn't serve them and never did. Great harm is done in that and we all have a right to say no to it eventually. Instead we can distance ourselves and wish the corrosive machine of the abusive family well, and try to cultivate health in our own lives as much as possible. We have every right to do that and often need to, though it isn't most people's first choice and is also very painful. And those who don't understand might try to remember that -- it's a really tough decision for most of us and we don't come to it lightly.
22
Thank you for your comment. I don't think I could have described my own situation as accurately as you have. By the way mine is/was the matriarchs systematic dysfunction.
2
In addition to the motive inherently suggested by the article's definition ("estrangement is defined as one or more relatives intentionally choosing to end contact because of an ongoing negative relationship"), there are other drivers of estrangement. Please consider also the situation when one parent falsely paints the other parent as "the problem" such that the children cut off the mislabeled parent; also a tyrannical partner may control a person to estrange his or her family to appease the tyrant. Both of these can be life-devestating yet the "accused" is not the perpetrator but rather the victim. Very parallel to the many false court convictions leading to innocent men and women held in prison. Often times, private truths are far different from public appearances.
5
This article couldn't have come at a better time . I was battling with the decisions I have taken recently , which I could foresee will slowly lead to estrangement ( I learnt this word is applicable to my situation after I read this article).
My decision to reduce my talks with them is not because My parents or my siblings are bad to me, they have never been, even now they are not.They love me.
My decision to do so, is because of last 7 years, my partner has been hurt beyond words, neglected at time of need my loved ones. My work takes me away from home quite often, and She is alone mentally with no words of compassion from them.
At the start of married life as I left for work, I had asked my Mother to talk to her often as how day was etc., ,quick came reply 'Why is there any wrong with her?' Bewildered I left for work.
Few years ago I took this case with my siblings (2 sisters) but it wasn't much of help as in their perspective aged parents cannot change their way of life .
I still continued being normal to them and try to patch things myself but there was no improvement, one day I realized I am normalizing their behavior of neglect towards the girl who walked in my life.
So recently I have been keeping quiet, talk/text for basic things. I could be seen as doing tit for tat, it isn't. this hurts .I just cannot normalise the hurt they cause to another human being. How long can I ignore the sadness that I know has been caused by my family who loves me.
4
Estrangement occurs over generations. Look closely and with an open mind.
6
I need to say this because many of us have chosen, over time, to become estranged due to years of false promises. The British organisation named in the article, Stand Alone, has a contact form on the website to which they send an automated email stating that they won't ever reply but you may register for a paid "Workshop" -months hence - for which you must pay in advance. (What on earth is a "workshop" on estrangement???) They offer only two support groups in the entire country, in cities far (by British standards) from the main population areas. It's comparable to nationally touting a service that only exists in for people in Omaha.
As many of us painfully chose to become estranged following years of false promises and being told we should be grateful for the undermining behaviour we've received, an organisation stating it offers support it cannot possibly offer because it has no staff, just feels very much more of the same.
How many of us who have chosen, for our own safety, to become estranged from members of our family, are acutely aware and intolerant in our lives of false promises from others and bend over backward to avoid behaving in that way to others...
The automated email I received in reply to their contact form says they will not reply at all and advised me to read their materials and register for a paid "workshop". Why invite personal communication to which they know they will not respond?
Why does this communication feel so familiar?
4
Sadly, estrangement is money maker. Hence, the push to normalize it.
I don't think their goal was "money-making." I think they just didn't think things through before going public with a website and a promise.
1
I don't even have to read the article to relate to an understand what it is saying. My personal journey to fallout was a long, lonely and depressing trip that lasted 30 years before I finally put it all together mentally had an epiphany.
Don't judge what you don't understand is a lesson taught in principal beginning in youth, and a lesson clearly ignored by most of society in practice.
13
My parents divorced 31 years ago & forced we six kids to “choose” which parent we’d side with. My five siblings chose my mom (my dad had had an affair which led to the divorce) & I chose my father, only because he lived close to me & my mother had been abusive to me my entire life. To this day, my siblings & I are estranged. We’ve missed weddings & funerals & births. Ironically, my father, in the midst of senility, wrote me out of his will & added the five who he’s not seen since 1986. The moral of the story? We have to chose to be happy with ourselves & the families we make for ourselves. Friends are important too. We have no control over our blood relatives & need to make peace with it in order to have a happy & healthy life.
11
Have again asked Mother to stop mentioning my money-loving brother because it makes me so angry I don't know what to do. "He always asks how you are," she says. I reply: "Yeah, he wants to know if I'm dead yet" (have stage 4 cancer).
8
I totally understand and support the decision to cut ties when parents are abusive, neglectful, lack respect for children and their significant others, or are narcissistic. I wonder, however, if the kids who distance themselves for lesser reasons understand that the behavior they are modeling to their children could come back on them later. If, for example, a child refuses to contact her/his parents, might his/her children do the same thing?
9
I've talked all this over with my kids. They understand how I feel about my mother and why. They feel the same way. The last time we all spent time with her, my eldest (then thirteen) said, "Gee, Mom, you grew up with THAT? You know, I kind of admire you." I don't know if there's a rule or guarantee, but I have tried always to answer questions, to tell them the truth, and when I decided not to see her the decision wasn't, from her point of view, an estrangement. Probably the reverse. I tell her what she wants to hear, understand her need for admiration, never left the kids alone with her, and now they can defend themselves. We are, so far, a close family.
http://www.thecriticalmom.blogspot.com
2
"On either side of the normalized dysfunction we run a serious risk of setting up relational patterns we may spend a lifetime struggling with and pass down to our children. If you are a part of a family who is estranged – whether you have been left, or you were the one who needed to leave – or whether you are just the bystander of intra-familial conflict, or even, all of the above – there is something to be learned. The first step is the one where we consider that estrangement might not be the end of a problem, but the potential beginning of new ones.
Things to ponder …
What if you knew that family estrangement had the potential to have deep, long lasting impact on the children in your family? Would that awareness change anything for you?" ~Fiona McColl
1
If you can divorce a spouse, why can't you "divorce" a toxic parent or sibling?
12
The Holidays, when your life choices are ridiculed and then shredded.
9
Sometimes people are estranged, just spit balling here, because a family member abused them sexually, physically or emotionally, and on top of this other family members may have done nothing eventhough they knew or should've known.
14
My sister cut me off a year ago. We have never been close, so I wasn't really surprised, but she knows the door to contacting me is open if she wants it. The best thing I did for myself was just not worry about it. She's my sister and I love her, but I'm not going to stress over her own choice. She'll contact me again or not, and if she doesn't, there's nothing to be done about it. I'm not going to keep trying, and I'm not going to let it discolor the rest of my life.
15
Abuse, betrayal, and poor parenting - My parents were all three and it has blunted my ability to connect with people. Some people just shouldn't be parents, but in the '50's this was not an acceptable truth. They were traumatized as children by their parents and it came out on us. I left home when I was 18 for parts unknown and would never have spoken to them again if I hadn't been picked up by the police for hitch-hiking and had to prove I was legal and not a runaway. We didn't communicate very much until I had my daughter, and then we started speaking again, but it was never easy. They continued to be manipulative and abusive. It pains me to say it but it was a relief when they died.
24
Allure....thank you for your candor and for sharing your truth.
6
Amen, sister!
Sometimes people just get sick of each other.
That includes family members.
I have a brother I haven't seen or spoken to in decades.
I don't miss him.
I rarely see my elderly mother.
She can't understand why, but then she thinks she was a great mother.
I don't agree.
All we can do is make ourselves happy.
No one else can do that for us.
It's better to cut ties and seek happiness.
16
Outsiders to any family system cannot know the particulars, the history, of that system. After working exclusively as a therapist that provided incest family treatment I know well the energy required to maintain a facade of normalcy and functionality to the outside world, and often that front extends to the extended family system, inlaws, and best friends. While some of the families we treated fit the chaotic popular stereotype of dysfunction (aka "the people of Walmart" FB posts), we also treated families who were the pillars of their community, well-connected, and headed by people in positions of respect and authority. It was most common in those families for the children who had been the targets of abuse to be identified as the "public" face of the problem - the rebel, the bad kid, etc. For some, maybe many, of the survivors I worked with cutting ties as an adult might be the most appropriate (but still painful) step. I have cousins on both sides of my family who chose estrangement due to their relationship with their father. In the case of one female cousin, I suspect sexual abuse was the root issue.
14
When the relationship is valued on the wealth one has and stretched based on the benefits one could receive, the genuine relationship would be traded at home as well as in the society. The real victims of the family fallout are the innocent children and to some extent the root cause is the ego clash of the parents and their in-laws .Leave the married to face the mundane challenge of their own,keep a distance,communicate, maintain a constant touch, pat on the back for living within the budget sans becoming a nuisance -fussbudget.
The route for serenity to prevent a family fallout is to embrace a quantum of spirituality. Quantum mechanics is easier to solve but to quell the quandary of one-to-one politics in a family in presence of the innocent children by the eaves drop and ear poisoning.
3
Failing health was mentioned in passing, but I think it is a root cause more frequently, especially in the form of mental health issues. I include functioning drug and alcohol abusers - but I noticed that as some people age, a form of dementia happens where events that happened as children or several decades earlier, are perceived as being bigger than they actually were.
Recently my older brother passed away suddenly at 72. We were not particularly close, but I tried to at least keep in touch for the sake of our 96 year old mother, who still worried about him. The year before his death, he cut off contact with her, accusing her of the most outrageous (nothing abusive or inappropriate) and utterly ridiculous, trivial things (example - that she charged him to do his laundry, something that would never have happened). At one point, he wondered if he was dreaming or did a certain event actually happened. The point being that the estrangement was likely the direct result of his failing health (he was over 300 lbs), and both physical and mental health issues.
And estrangements may not last a lifetime. The ones that do may be for the best, you don't get to choose your family, and you need to cut out toxic people and environments even if you share DNA. For my brother, one child was estranged for more than 30 years, now filled with regret, yet looking forward to being part of a big family that never forgot.
5
My grandmother and her 5 siblings, all of whom were born in the 1800's, blew up their relationships with each other when they were over 70 years old. They seemed to get along fine all of their lives until, late in life, they all got into arguments over childhood issues; early childhood issues. My great uncles fought over a sled that broke in childhood. They were all mad at the brother who had talked them into hooking school one day (one room school house). Of course, they were caught and got the old time consequences. Etc. I have never understood why, in the last years of their lives when they should have been drawing closer together, those childhood issues came forth and caused them all to become estranged. And they died never speaking to each other.
20
Thank you for sharing this story. It is a common (not universal) part of the dying process (which can take years) to push away and even estrange our loved ones. It is believed to be an unconscious strategy to ease the pain of parting by death. It can be very painful for those left behind and it is hard to understand. I think, like most of the other estrangements described here, it is rooted in reactionary coping mechanisms and a lack of communication skills. While mental illness, dementia (highly genetic and affecting most of the age group in your story), substance abuse, and depression are found in most estrangements, there are plenty of people who struggle with mental health who learn communication skills and manage well without complete estrangement. It does take two, however. I hope you can find peace by understanding their estrangement was likely caused by their overwhelming love for each other and inability to express it and say goodbye underneath the front of a petty argument. This may seem like nonsense, but please ask any experienced hospice nurse or clergy who regularly attends deaths. It may blow your mind how common this is.
4
To Midwife to the Soul; Thank you for your kind and comforting comments. I think your explanation is a large part of what happened. It's still sad. My great uncles were such fun for me. When they were in their sixties, they had a big, fun wrestling match at a family picnic. They built miraculous (i.e. dangerous) toys. My first flight was on some homemade airplane my great uncle built from scratch from old farm stuff. This being simpler times on the farm, there was none of this FAA licensing and inspections. Once, one of our dogs had a dozen puppies. They took these puppies to the local farm market, set up a stand, and gave the puppies to the many kids, making the kids promise to bring the puppies back in an hour. Then they got out of there, surplus puppy problem solved. So how did this fun family erupt into total estrangement when there really was no apparent reason. Does it indicate anything about my aging future with my brothers and sisters?
I'm guessing we'll be seeing many more of these stories as aging Boomer parents turn for support to adult children who struggled to raise children
3
Every generation struggles to raise children, in large part. Some have faced worse than now, in fact, and many Boomers are still helping their children while coping with aged parents' severe illnesses and dying. That's part of living in this world. It's gotten harder for many over the last 40 years, since the deaths of unions and benefits, for sure. But for many, many--it was always hard. That's not the key issue in breaking families, as far as I have seen. The key issues are of kindness and respect. When family members can treat each other at least as well as they'd treat strangers--and hopefully, better--such breakups are less common. We can even help each other in many ways. Being alone is not a panacea either, and your own children may well learn from you what to do when your own aging comes.
5
One of the positives for the boomers as I see it is that, although still painful, they are being kicked to the curb before they actually need their adult children's support, rather than being dumped in nursing homes once they have outlived their usefulness, as became the norm for the previous generation. The big question really is what the parents of the boomer's grandchildren are going to end up experiencing.
What a rich vein of pain to mine.
Would that we all had loving and supportive families.
But... I didn't see my father after I was 17, I was coerced into having a phone conversation with him when I was in my 30's, and within 3 sentences he became the critical, controlling, demeaning person I well remembered. I hung up.
I haven't talked to my sister in 15 years. As an anxious, critical, controlling single mother, I had supported her any way I could. But when her kids got old enough (20's), I could no longer cope with her arguing, put-downs, and paranoia.
She has a progressive, degenerative nerve disease. I think of her, hope that her kids can cope, but as an old lady now, I don't think there is anything I can do for her. If I was rich, I would give her money, that always pleased her, but that is not how things are.
At some point, there is revelation that the relationship you had with people when you were children is not the love you always hoped for, it never will be, and it is best to cut the cord.
41
I can relate very well to this !
3
My family was very demeaning to me. Adults and siblings always talked down at me and devalued everything I said or any interest, even if in a joking or "innocent" way. They said they were nice, nicer than I deserved, and implied that I all at fault, but after years I realized it is bully behavior made acceptable by the group and especially my father. They implied that I was retarded or mentally handicapped, but if they actually believed that they made no effort at any sort of special education, any consoling of any sort, helping for implied special needs as a child or adult, or even normal positive reinforcement in school or work. I became more depressed and stop communicating. So it should not be hard to understand, as I grew older I had no positives for continuing to put myself in situations to be bullied by relatives. The main act of the bully is to be patronizing, imply superiority, and pretend to be nice, so when I have the expected negative response they can pass the blame to me. President Trump uses the same tactic. Family members do not accidentally repeat the same "misunderstood" bully behaviors thousands of times, and these all add up over time... this is why people feel uncomfortable and stop communicating with parents or siblings.
60
I can relate and I have removed myself as well !
4
My father, a devout narcissist, did not trust my fiancee to toe his line. He bad-mouthed her to me behind my back and insist I not say anything about it, then told me I would have affairs (because he had many) and gave me an ultimatum: Him or her.
I chose her, of course. We're celebrating our 24th anniversary next month and revel in our close-knit and thoroughly sane family. But my father also demanded my mother and sister toe the line as well, and he goaded my sister to write poison pen letters to me, my wife and my in-laws.
Two years ago my father attempted a reconciliation (which I suspected had to do with his fear of aging but I gave him a chance anyway). He was on good behavior (for him) for a few meetings, but then devolved back to his baseline narcissism, asking if I ever had affairs, bad-mouthing my wife behind her back and insisting I not say anything, and trying to order me around. I ended it swiftly.
My mother died last week. The voicemail from my father: "The only thing she ever wanted was to meet her granddaughter, which never happened. I hope your family is happy." We are indeed happy. And my mother could have visited her granddaughter anytime by picking up a phone or just dropping by.
There's no secret to neutralizing a family narcissist: Ignoring him/her works every time.
102
Exactly. The only possible restorative response to severe personality disorder: withdrawal from system.
16
I am so sorry for you and your mom too for missing out on your children. I'm glad you have such a healthy perspective & family of your own.
1
My husband's father is also a narcissist. It is almost impossible for someone who has not seen how they work intimately to know how important it is to get away. And how they will never understand or acknowledge their behavior. More than a few of the comments here from people wondering why their kids have cut them off "for no reason" are likely narcisssists, endlessly making themselves the blameless victim of a situation they themselves have wrought.
7
After my husband divorced his ex-wife, she took every opportunity to lie about him to their son. My husband stayed quiet about the abuse he experienced -- abuse that forced him to leave his home and his son. He continued to make efforts to see his son, and helped support him through college, but after years of brainwashing, the (now adult) son chose sides and ended his relationship with his father. The mother won. The son lost. My husband will be fine no matter what.
22
It makes sense for you to see this in this way. But it's really hard for people outside a failed marriage, especially people later bonded with one or another spouse later, to decide who's "good" and who's "bad". Nearly impossible to see the issue through any eyes but those of the only one whose emotions and experiences you hear or share. The son may have seen parts of these matters that you wouldn't have, and apparently has what he considers reason for his difficult decision. Good, though, that there seems to have been a peaceful finish to the situation.
5
"We can pick and choose our friends and lovers. We can't pick and choose our family." This is what my Aunt told me when, as a teenager, I complained about my Mother. That sentiment has helped much through the years. Now in my mid-fifties, I love my Mother and we get along more than not. The article speaks mostly to parent-child estrangement, though my slow estrangement is with my two younger sisters. As a Non-Mom (I couldn't have children), my sister's, though they claim to love me, don't acknowledge or respect my suggestions regarding Anything family: activities, gatherings, conversational topics, etc. More oft than not, I'm told when and where to be if I'd like to see my nieces and nephew. My parents abdicate to their daughters, as expected of loving, eager Grandparents. Many friends think maybe jealousy is a factor. And their sibling rivalry for our parents attention, definitely plays a role. Trying to talk with either sister about my concerns falls upon defensive ears: so I no longer make attempts. Christmas dinner was yet again so unpleasant with one sister, that for my emotional well-being, I've realized I'll now only spend solo time with my aging parents and when they have the kids. In talks with other friends, it seems Sibling Estrangement is just as common as Parental Estrangement. We can pick and choose.....
31
I have a much elder brother who, due to complex circumstances, I've not met in person for almost 30 years. From the mid 90s, we'd chat online. However, a repetitive & escalating cycle emerged:
--relaxed conversations -> demanding questions about why our parents did certain things when we were kids -> ignoring my responses->namecalling->complaining to ailing & elderly parent about me ->refusing any communication for a minimum of a year.
I stopped trying after I realized this pattern would never end.
At the behest of a surviving parent, I notified him of the other's death abt 8 years ago. Within 2 messages, he was angry at me & both parents. He blocked my email address until this past spring when he wrote out of the blue.
His demand was for me to fly/drive across the US so my teen & his adult kids could meet. He doesn't even know my kid's name, nor has he ever sent photos of his over the past 20 years.
I thanked him for the invitation & politely declined.
Personal insults & threats of legal action was the response.
I have no regrets!
4
It's hard for some men to make any entreaty, and, maybe he cannot travel. It's too bad he was triggered into responsive anger, which must be frightening to experience.
I think everyone takes a larger view as life draws to a close.
After I purchased an iPad with ProLoquo2Go, the speaking program that's proved so helpful for severely autistic non-speaking children, for my 4-year-old grandson, and called his school and program to ensure they were using it to work with him (they didn't know he had an iPad), I was cut off from contact by my son, who is 43.
I've read that parents reject help for their disabled children for all kinds of reasons and many come around and regret it by the time is age 9 or so.
I'm prepared to tough it out and even taken them to court if it will help to get an order for proper treatment and instruction, but they are otherwise good parents, and their school is foolishly behind the times, and so encourages their lack of assistance to my grandson. They plan to offer my grandson iPad help when he is 7 - far too late in my view.
Therefore, even a court order may do little. Mom seems to be an unconscious sabateur (ie borderline with narcissistic features, although I cannot say for sure) and has put her faith in religion.
It's a dilemma.
6
My heart goes out to you, Em.
At 18 months, my grandson was a no eye contact, no speaking, no name recognition, "parallel playing", head banging, mindless raging, diagnosed autistic.
He got over it; it took about 10 years for the last apparent vestiges to disappear. I'd challenge any parent of an autistic child to recognize him as having been one.
I've read that some other autistics (usually, boys) have recovered; the reasons are unknown, and I'm not aware of any research being done in this area. I do know (rather, believe) that my daughter was the perfect mother for this boy. A stay-at-home mom, she home-schooled him and worked with him every day to (lovingly) demand his attention and interaction. She learned sign-language and started using it, but abandoned it when he started talking. (His vocabulary and articulation were several years behind his contemporaries, but eventually surpassed them (he's very bright and discerning).
The only notable "medical" procedures he had were maintaining a gluten/dairy-free diet and several blood chelations (the earliest of which showed astoundingly high levels of certain metals/minerals). I see the family often, and watched what seems like a miracle unfold relentlessly before my eyes.
None of us know what to make of it. I do feel intuitively that early behavioral "treatment", 24/7/365, at least contributed significantly. Maybe God did it, but he got a lot of help from mom (and dad).
I think his parents should have hope, and try hard.
6
So let me get this straight. The parents had a plan for how to educate their child, one which matches the school's plan, and you went behind their back to badger the school to do something different? And you think the correct response is to get a court order?
35
There is no dilemma here. If you expect to have any relationship with your son and his family in the future, you need to understand that how they raise their child is up to them, not you. Buying him expensive things that they do not think he should have, without their knowledge or permission, no matter how much you believe he needs them, is an absolutely surefire way to end your relationship with them entirely.
55
It strikes me that most of the comments here assume that other members of the family are almost entirely responsible for the break. I'm sure that that's true for some people, but I also think it's helpful to realize that we all remember things differently and we all contribute positively and negatively to relationships. Some comments leave me with the impression that the writer is perhaps jealous and angry about not getting as much attention as he/she/they needed in the family when young.
14
Very well put. Thanks for your insight.
3
Hanging onto childhood hurts well into adulthood is not a particularly a healthy or functional pastime.
9
Parents who belittle, shame, humiliate and scapegoat their children do not suddenly stop engaging in this emotional abuse when the children become adults. This undermining of their own child's self-image and self-confidence has affects far outside the family system, far beyond uncomfortable holiday meals and family gatherings. For my sisters and I, our father's inability to validate us, to accept us as individuals with our own needs and preferences, and something other than a reflection of himself, had a particular impact on our future relationships with men. We all maintain a relationship with him, largely I am afraid for our mother, and now in her memory. We do this not through pretending that the childhood hurts don't matter but out of sympathy and a refusal to simply make anyone of us responsible for his final years. We support each other in efforts, as adults, to ignore the hurtful, self-destructive behaviors, and reinforce those that create connection and positive regard. There is love, but it is an insecure one, and we feel an obligation as much as anything else, and we try to hope for a better relationship. Our efforts are simply not possible in every family. I have cousin who grew up with a similar dynamic with his father (my paternal uncle); mental illness (probably rooted in emotional and physical abuse) has resulted in a complete estrangement. I have often wondered if that would be the case for me were I born a male.
3
Nothing needs to last a lifetime. An accident of birth need not be a jail sentence.
67
Something not addressed in the article is when a damaged relative (my aunt, in this case) estranges herself from nearly the entire family because of the ways in which she herself is damaged. This is a woman, now in her mid-70s, who holds onto grudges from her youth as if they happened yesterday and who cut off my mother when she was dying of brain cancer (after I had re-connected them) by saying "I'll never talk to you again." She didn't. And though we were close when I was young and she was my mother's only remaining immediate family member, she refused multiple entreaties to connect around our grief. Though I know this is really about her (she is always angry at everyone) and not me, it still hurts. Even 16 years later.
9
Please realize that you cannot know what happened in the family between these two, long ago. My nieces and nephews have never reached out to learn the full dimensions of our family estrangement - they only know the self-serving stories their mothers told them.
20
"When families splinter, and members are cut off, secrets, half-truths and sentiment can fill their absence. Unless the questions are asked, and answered, the stories told and understood." ~Ian Rose
9
Thanks for your comment.
The family 'survivor' or two require a 'blame-the-victim narrative. That is why a person estranges from the group: to avoid scapegoat mobbing .
2
Anybody who is interested in this subject should google "Issendai" and then read her series on forums for estranged parents. There are a few commenters to this article who are absolutely typical examples.
12
Thank you for this - a wealth of information, and I had already figured out that one prolific commenter here is involved in something like that, but this is very very helpful.
7
Uly: Thanks for that great suggestion. Wonderful site and with many topics of interest, estrangement just one of them. Really appreciate finding it...
2
Hi Uly. I followed your suggestion and looked at the website. Some good points to be sure, but it is also, strangely, a kind of celebration of estrangement. Bitterness with a smile.
My mother was very toxic and although I made many efforts to bridge the gap, I mostly kept her away because of the terrible way I felt whenever she was around. In the end, I feel she had a difficult life without any modern help, in a time when children were not valued or respected, and she treated me accordingly.
Looking back, I wish I had said that to her, and tried harder as I, although limited emotionally when young, had a better education and therefore much better ability to articulate the situation, for bth of us. She wasn't all bad or all good. None of us is. We are all products of our time.
4
"New research [...] suggests that estrangement is not all that uncommon."
Well, duh.
13
Exactly!
5
At age twenty-six, I first became aware that I liked men just as much if not slightly more than women. When I made this clear to my parents, their reaction was horrific. I was so lucky that I didn't know about this when I was younger because they would have thrown me out into the street. My father died in 1990 without ever becoming reconciled to me. My mother, now 90, has come around a little bit, aware now of the tremendous damage she caused. Estrangement need not be permanent, but neither should you ever give up your love for someone or your own integrity just to avoid estrangement with a parent or sibling. I didn't and had a wonderful 29-year-long relationship because of that. I found I didn't need my parents and that was quite okay.
44
My sister and I have been estranged from my brother, his two sons (our nephews) and his second wife for over four years. Although preceding events probably and undoubtedly contributed to the estrangement, it was a totally manipulative and dishonest action my brother took that created the "final cutoff". Behind my sister's back, my brother coached her son to fabricate and pretend that he was going to attend a prestigious college from which he had earned and received a full academic scholarship. My sister had spent the past two months, helping my nephew prepare and pack-up to begin this new phase of his life. Two days before they were going to leave to move him to Michigan, my nephew threw all of his stuff in a car and ran off with some friends. He borrowed money from my brother and my sister-in-law at 8% interest to attend another university. Much of the dishonesty that was consciously created by my brother, sister-in-law the their two son's was devastating. Both my father, sister and I cut off all contact with my brother. I feel as if I will never be able to trust him again. We are just a year apart in age, and I find it mind-blowing that I had never realized how manipulative, narcissistic, conniving and dishonest he was. The irony is that my brother is an esteemed Professor who is heralded for his excellent communications with students. I worry that he is using many of his student to his own advantage. Frankly, it has been devastating.
12
Two lives !
Craziest story here.
I would be very curious to know how your nephew would tell the same story (but from his own perspective). Does HE think he was manipulated by his uncle? Does he think his uncle was helping nephew realize nephew's actual dream? Did nephew complete a degree at the other university? How is nephew's current relationship with his mother (your sister)? How would nephew explain or justify his own dishonesty?
My parents divorced when I was 4. About a year later, my dad moved to Alaska. As a kid, I would visit him in the summer, but he rarely called otherwise and often forgot Christmas or my birthday (he’s an alcoholic in complete denial).
While I was in high school, he said he would help with college tuition, but when I graduated he gave me a check for $500 and said, “This is all I have.” That really disappointed me up as I knew he had much more money than my mother and step-father. When my mother tried to collect $5000 in unpaid child support to help pay for college, he wrote to me and said, “Look what your mother is doing to me.” Never mind that he hardly ever paid the pitiful $25/week mandated by the courts and never helped with medical bills.
After he called me in college and attacked me for not calling him, I told him how I felt and that he really hurt my feelings with his attacks on my mom for money he owed. His reply was, “That’s the way the world works.” I didn’t talk to him for 3 years after that.
We reconnected at my grandmother’s funeral, but little has changed in the past 25 years. 11 years ago he married for the fourth time. I don’t really like talking with his wife as she is very bigoted but, of course, claims otherwise.
I haven’t talked with him in a year, don’t really miss it. I feel bad for my kids as they won’t really know their grandfather, but given what I went through in my relationship with him, they are probably better off.
51
Life becomes much easier if you treat all the damaged manipulative people in your life like intelligent dogs who can, eventually, be trained.
You must, of course, be a wise trainer.
There are rewards for good behavior, and discipline for bad. You needn't blame anyone for acting according to their natures. They are what they are. But you needn't encourage it by permitting it to continue.
When you refuse to engage in negative exchanges, they have the choice to behave better, or do without you.
You don't have to answer the phone, or the email, or accept the invitation, or brood over the exclusion. You can agree to meet on neutral territory, or not at all. You can ensure you always have an exit plan if a family get-together gets out of hand.
You can learn to say *no* calmly.
These people love the adrenaline rush of being in the midst of chaos and ramping it up.
Take the fuel away from the fire. It*s never as much fun if it seems as though they haven't been able to hurt or provoke you.
You*ll still feel what you feel, and that can be very painful. But you needn't show them your wounds; tend them in private.
And never give other relatives information that can then be shared with the people you*ve detached from, if you don't want it shared.
Think of everything as a project and not a minefield. You*ll be surprised at how much better you*ll feel.
63
Everything you say is very healthy and true and it all works just as well without the punishment/reward mindset.
3
And without the dog/trainer mindset.
3
No so sure it's an insult to think like someone training a dog: first - we train animals out of caring for our pets, and to make life easier on them and us. And we often take more time to consider how to reward a dog in some way it likes, than we do with people.
We are more concerned with the result, and do not waste time wondering about the dog's motives, or how to convince the dog that he's mistaken and we're right. We simply try to do what works. It makes for less stress.
It is not at all a bad approach with people.
2
Timely article!
Family estrangements are far from new, but to estrange oneself, or cope with the estrangement of a loved one, is excruciatingly painful.
I am one of those struggling to maintain a middle ground with family members who have behaved poorly for years. I do not want--nor do I think I can handle--full estrangement. But I am keenly aware of needing to protect myself more with them. As with all things in life, it seems choosing a middle path is much harder than an all or nothing approach.
Key to my learning (and it's taken a long time) to better handle the curve balls thrown by these people (which get wilder as the years pass) has been not so much my learning to understand them as my leaning to see myself, and my values and priorities, clearly.
To realizing how different I am from them, to appreciate those differences, and to let go of wanting connection with someone close genetically but so distant in other respects.
Easy to say. Very hard to do. I have literally been working for decades on these issues.
22
Break the destructive cycle that crosses generations. Each persons’ motivation is continuum of emotions smeared across their lives as they go through each stage of life. All of this is within the context of the society and social order one belongs to. Nevertheless, it would be useful to explain this to young people in such a way that helps them better understand what lies ahead. This is different than doing the thinking for them. The difference is withholding information as a means of power and control to hide a parent or teacher’s weaknesses and insecurities. Better to tell the truth and accept shortcomings as an elder and be open to the opportunity to learn from a younger person that has a new perspective.
5
I learned the truth about my father almost 10 years ago while he was on his death bed. I was encouraged to contact my 50 something estranged sister who lived close to me though we were both 1000 miles from our home state. Upon doing so and relaying to her his condition, she told me she had been molested by him as a teenager and that it had ultimately caused her estrangement from our family. When everything came out, she provided me with the names of 3 others who had been victims of his including a much older cousin who had kept her mouth shut for 50 years from her husband and family out of fear. After talking with the other victims, I became an advocate for my sister and this led to our family trying to sweep it under the rug. Both of my brothers did their best to destroy her credibility and ignored the facts of the other victims testimony. Our middle brother who is very manipulative was the ring leader and ultimately led the charge to ostracize my sister as well as myself. My mother sided in with them even though I talked at length with her about it and she had all the facts. She ultimately fell in with my brothers and I have not spoken to her since 2008. My mother's and brother's actions ultimately destroyed our family. I have moved on with my life without them. It ultimately showed me the evil in the world that exist when people you have known all your life can turn against the truth and are willing to destroy you for it.
76
I would argue that it was your father's actions that destroyed the family, and the rest of it is the fallout of his extremely destructive actions. It's still hard to swallow, though, that your brothers and mother weren't able to rise above it all.
3
I've lived long enough to learn that there is nothing worse than incest - it destroys families and lives like nothing else. It breaks up trust, causes shame and guilt in everyone connected to the abuser, and then creates physical and mental symptoms which can kill. And this observation is from someone who's seen even more substance abuse, has gone to a great many AlAnon meetings, and seen people die because of that illness.
I hope you see recovery among family members in your lifetime.
5
Thank you for this article. Estrangement is a choice laden with societal norms designed to make one feel guilt and doubts about that choice. One only needs to balance the feelings of peace and progress against the toxic, sometimes unspoken recrimination and attempts to shove you back into that spot in the web that disfunctional families depend on to know you’ve made that right choice.
20
I'm shocked to find anyone thinks this is uncommon. Not all people like all the people in their family. Not all kids can deal with their parents toxic behaviors. Every family I know has at least one estrangement.
23
The current trend toward familial estrangement puts me in mind of the once popular, now debunked fad for recovered memory from a few years back.
This article would have been far more balanced if it had considered the destructive effect of estrangement on the family members left behind. (Grandchildren deprived of contact with their grandparents, etc.)
I wouldn’t be as quick as the author of the article to assume all of those who have chosen estrangement from their family had the best of motivations. Reading between the lines, it seems there’s a reasonable case to be made for the idea that the current trend in estrangement is simply a logical extension of the modern trend toward selfishness and laziness in interpersonal relationships. After all, it’s a lot easier to cut yourself off from all contact with your family than it is to deal with the messy and often inconvenient interplay of emotions that come with being part of a family.
To paraphrase George Washington in “Hamilton”, “Estrangement is easy; living as part of a family is harder.”
19
David,
Dealing and working through difficult conversations with family or other is one thing, dealing with an abusive mother and/or family members with NPD is entirely different.
p.s. the GW quote is a bit much and has no place here in my opinion.
15
If you think it's easy, you've never had to go through it.
I finally distanced myself from my mother after years of alcoholism, emotional abuse, and manipulation - when it became clear she was trying to split up my marriage. It was the hardest thing I've ever done, but I am still happily married - and I'm not spending large parts of my emotional energy figuring out how to counter her manipulation. A therapist was also helpful - and necessary.
That didn't stop people saying, "But she's your *mother*." Giving birth/becoming a parent doesn't automatically heal mental illness, make someone a good person, or make someone a good parent.
37
You refer to the "current trend in estrangement". Since when is it a trend? Are you some sort of psychologist or sociologist with special research data you are privy to? Please do share. I doubt very much that you are in a special position to judge what qualifies as "the best of motivations" for family estrangement.
19
To think I am considering this. My mother and i fight constantly about children's safety. A few days ago she left my daughter with my sisters child and a 14 year old girl alone overnight to some other town. She leaves them and takes the 14 year old girls phone because she wants to take pictures. In an emergency what could the kids do or call? I drove 900km in a stretch to fetch them.
12
I first ran away from home at 10. Did so more in my teens. As a sophomore in high school, hitch hiked 1000 miles away with 50 cents in my pocket and hid out for six weeks. in my Sr year, had an apartment with a friend. Parents were not loyal to us five kids.
Then I married a woman whose family hated men. Five years in and I was suicidal. Left at five years and triggered in her the family spite. She was willing to eat the souls of our 2 kids to get back at me. Told them I didn’t love them and that’s why I didn’t see them. She kept them from me and when they did have contact, punished them for having a good time. Youngest daughter spent one night with me in her life. Wears her mothers hatred on her skin with ghoulish tattoos now. The older had my grandchild child that almost lived with me when she was between marriages (four) and then kept granddaughter away as second husband thought the child saw me as dad instead of him. The exes family men-hate is five generations old and is literally a Grapes of wrath story where the Okie father left to work in California and they never forgave him despite sending money. Cold people.
My dad died early in car wreck and mom farmed us out. Two siblings dead from family abandonment and the other three of us talk maybe once a year. It’s better that way.
6
Many people estranged from family have parents and/or siblings who refuse to accept the life choices of adults. Marrying someone of a different culture or faith, not marrying a life partner; having a same-sex partner; refusing to maintain the demanded silence about abuse or any other supposed family secret--and to outsiders, many of these relatives seem like fine people, and receive plenty of validation in their own communities. An Orthodox Jewish family declaring a child *dead* to them for marrying a Christian is going to be admired for the strength of their conviction by the people whose regard they value. Etc. etc.
Families have infinite ways of making wretched the lives of non-conforming family members.
And for all the stories below of parents whose wretched children only want money from them and who have sadly withdrawn themselves from their endlessly demanding offspring--I am sure there*s more to each one of these tales. Horribly self-centered kids weren't dropped into your nest by malevolent cuckoo birds.
And--one more time--plenty of brain miswiring, caused by poor pre-conception nutrition, is invisible but devastating to chances for a healthy adulthood. It can*t be fixed later, if it*s even ever diagnosed. Poor judgment and impulse control; an inability to learn from prior experience--you needn't have an obvious FAS/FAE child to have one damaged for life. Take childbearing seriously. It*s the most important project you*ll ever have in life.
23
***And for all the stories below of parents whose wretched children only want money from them and who have sadly withdrawn themselves from their endlessly demanding offspring***
My parents use money to keep me around. At first, when I accepted their offer, I would get the "and we paid all this money for...." routine later on. Thee days my mother has beg me to accept her offers.
Maybe all this gets interpreted to her friends that I just hang around for the money. And maybe I do.
But if you can't give me a kind word when I'm around, then what are you good for?
8
I have never denigrated my siblings’ professions. I have been sternly informed by my siblings that I am an incompetent, fraudulent, and overpaid MD. Actually, I have enjoyed a successful 24 year practice, and I would like to see my brother or sister try to keep up with me on the occasional 17 hour workday I may enjoy.
My father once labeled my wife an ‘unfit’ mother and my older son a ‘sociopath’. This particular son is now a sophomore in the honors college studying math, wishing to teach.
When I reported these facts years ago to my mother she asserted that I was making false accusations, and that I should stop being disruptive.
What to do? 15 years ago I moved my family and I 1800 miles away from that hostile orbit, and 9 years ago I imposed total silence. Certainly it is not the ideal solution, but I would not hesitate to repeat those actions. I am happy.
90
Bravo.
16
I decided years ago, that I had to stop my relationship with my sister. She was toxic, narcissistic and negative towards me. I had to decide whether I could go on living like this, I chose to live a life free from pain. I made the right decision.
41
What the article didn't mention as a possible contributing factor to parents 'estranging' from the adult child is when the in-laws take hold of everything, including the grandchildren and the man's parents are pushed out and made to feel like guests in their son's home. This has gone on for about 20 years and it has taken until now to sever 99% of contact with my son. I feel happier and much less stressed now. Sad that we don't have a Cleaver family but no longer feeling snubbed.
And yes, it is multi-generational. My son's oldest 2 children from his 1st marriage have cut the ties with their father as they resent the interference of the new wife and the in-laws and now don't want to see their dad. They have seen how we have been treated and my son's lack of respect for his parents has been passed on to his eldest 2.
16
It's impossible to make sense of the human tragedy - no matter what lens through which you view it- yet another ad (based on a true account, they say) shows "estrangement" - and estrangement, as many note here, echoes through time. Generations. Culture. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWF2JBb1bvM&index=10&list=PLvv2Y...
2
This article is a godsend for me. I am currently on the receiving end of a lot of pressure to restore a relationship with my ex-husband "for the sake of" my adult children who have chosen to also cut ties with him for very valid reasons. It is amazing how people who have no knowledge of the situation feel compelled to stress the importance of familial relationships that cause more harm than good. Also, it seems that a even a general understanding of cluster B personality disorders is lacking certainly in the general population but also in the mental health community - this puts many of us on the defensive when we choose estrangement as the imperative way of dealing with family relationships in which all roads lead to pain and insanity. I so appreciate this article.
47
If you think it*s bad here, you should experience life as part of one of those South Asian extended families where an individual*s own aspirations and choices are expected to be subordinate to the diktats of the most powerful elder relatives.
We can at least flee and build loving relationships with friends of our own choosing. People raised in South Asian families are terrified of the ostracism that*s held over their heads; the family is everything and the concept of genuine loving friendships that can more than substitute for the loss of blood relatives is completely--uh--foreign.
One is lucky anywhere to have loving family truly concerned about your wellbeing, rather than the imperative to keep up appearances.
25
Clearly this topic cuts in many directions: in Germany it even produced a grocery story commercial....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_B6wQMd2eI
8
In my family there is a pattern in which most of the daughters over two generations on one side are estranged. Nobody, of course, discusses anything other than we are all crazy. And liars.
6
The intergenerational legacies that family estrangements pass on seamlessly from one generation to the next get hugely ignored by those who's agenda is to try to normalize estrangement. It is a myth that any myths about estrangement have been or are being debunked.
6
Interesting comment. Are you familiar with Bert Hellinger's family constellations?
2
I thank nyt profusely for articles like these. It was exactly 8 years ago that I first read an article on toxic parents in the nyt. That article and the readers' comments made me realise that I was not alone, that my grandma was a narcissist, and that I had the option of no contact with them. This is unheard of in India, (it happens if course, but unheard coz nobody talks about it and prefers to desperately brush it under the carpet). That I could avoid my family was a radical idea and I was amazed that I could choose me and my sanity over their miserable need to emotionally abuse me. My mind was blown. Today life seems to have come a full circle, and this article is particularly necessary as my abusive grandma and aunt and passive mom are desperately trying to hoover me back in. I can definitely attest to some of the myths shattered here. My estrangement didn't happen overnight or on a whim. For all those talking about how we have 'throwaway culture', don't be so cynical coz you had a decent childhood. Despite my emotional abuse I looked at them as family, and I suspect it's the same with a lot of the other people here. It took a lot of *repeated* heartbreak to realise that they were never going to treat me well. If you're from a happy family you don't need this kind of external validation of your hurt, but people who grow up with abuse precisely do need reassurance that they are not the only ones and that it's not them that somethings wrong with, but their abusive family.
82
Bravo! Your last 3 sentences are very instructive.
7
Having been estranged from my adult son and daughter for almost 30 years, I found that my son's effort to renew the relationship was worse than if no effort was ever made. The estrangement began when my ex-husband decided to change our divorce agreement, which he drafted, that left his life-insurance proceeds to me. On his death bed, either he remembered that prison, or my daughter who was caring for him did, and he deduced to change it and leave the insurance proceeds to the 2 children. I was asked to sign a release, which I refused. Since that time, the children have been estranged. On a few occasions, I made brief contact, e.g. sending my daughter a 50th birthday present, and each of them wedding presents upon weddings to which I was not invited. A couple of year ago, my son sought to terminate the estrangement and we visited each other ad even took a trip abroad together. When he got into financial difficulties, buying a house without anticipating the high closing costs, I sent him a check for $20,000 to cover the expenses. And when he was out of work due to a physical injury, and was charging living expenses on his credit cards, I sent him a check for $10,000 to pay off his credit card debt. At one point he said he didn't want to talk about the past, and I said to him that I thought I was owed an explanation. In response, he and wrote a hateful letter, hoping that I would die alone "a miserable old lady."
There's no going back. Don't give them money.
16
When the researchers finally get around to adding in the data on those who find themselves suddenly estranged over financial issues, especially those relating to inheritances, the whole myth about estrangement's being the final straw of relationship conflicts that were years in the making will be busted.
5
To Anue Nue: Your comment offers a big generalization and simplification: if there were issues over inheritance and money, and it appeared that these issues triggered a sudden estrangement, you can be sure the estrangement was the final straw of years of underlying problems, because family members who have had reasonably healthy relationships do not, in one felt swoop, detach over money, period; what they do is come to some sort of compromise, or, if that's not possible, a cordial but distant stand-off, but NOT total estrangement.
15
Caitlin, are you an authority on estrangement? Or do have any professional experience with the estate settlement process from which you have drawn your matter of fact conclusions?
I read this article and it grabbed me. Sadly I can relate. It took me far too many years to learn that I was doing all the outreach and was like a silly little boy pining for the love and connection he would never get from a certain girl. One definition could be estrangement while the other could be mirroring how I have been received. So yes it does happen over time.
17
I wonder what caused the aberration of behavior (from that of parents in other societies) by parents of the generation who has had to estrange? What happened to the US? Were we inadvertently part of a sociological experiment?
5
In many ways this push to normalize estrangement and going no contact, rather than to name it what it is, a dysfunction of relationship and the silent treatment/ostracism, is very similar to the way the badly failed and now widely discredited social experiment known as the self-esteem movement, where narcissism was re-packaged and sold as self-esteem to an entire generation of human guinea pigs.
5
No one, least of all the victim/commenters here, is trying to "normalize" estrangement. In the last century, divorce was far harder to obtain, not least because of the shame involved, so people spent their lifetimes in miserable marriages. Now, with no-fault divorce available, people can have a second chance -- both at working on the marriage or leaving; and now that paternal, maternal, and sibling love is no longer considered sacrosanct, now that people are allowed to question what was in their mother's milk instead of just imbibing it mindlessly and subserviently for a lifetime, there's also a second chance for life. Hooray for articles like these.
28
Apparently you didn't read the research review. "Normalizing the dysfunctional relationship dynamics of estrangement is part of the agenda.
"Research focusing on estrangement can potentially untangle family myths from reality, transform how we think of family and what it should be (Allen & Moore, 2017; Eisenhandler, 1992; Scharp & Dorrance Hall, 2017), and raise awareness about and normalize the experience of estrangement (Agllias & Gray, 2013)."
2
More than the article, which was too brief to do the topic justice (although it's a start) reading the comments stirred up the pain of my estrangement from my brother. He was the golden child of my narcissistic mother who recently died. When her health deteriorated and she was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, he became psychologically destabilized and blamed me for her illness. His wife, who he has verbally abused and controlled for years, stood by him. While this was the "event" that caused my retreat, it was indeed the result of years of behavior that made me utterly confused about how to be in relationship with them and their two children. They showed little to no interest in me or my family, didn't call or email or share their lives with me, and never came to visit. During my visits there, they were distant, critical, and self-centered. It's both shocking and humbling to admit that it took me over 15 years to realize they have almost nothing to give. Now I keep my distance, deal with the grief and pain when it comes up, and do my best to focus on the love and support I have in my life from my husband, his family and our friends ... and many cats ; ).
37
When a psychologist heard the details about my family (and my husband’s family), he shook his head in astonishment. He’d never heard of two families so troubled. No doubt that was because his office was in a tony, affluent part of town. If he’d practiced in prisons or state hospitals, he would have heard stories like ours every day.
Finding friends has been a challenge. Do we befriend our peers? Or do we seek healthier, happier people and risk feeling like imposters? We chose the latter. We get our share of the former by watching horror films.
20
The tony, & affluent are not immune to crazy & abusive. They’re pretty good at hiding & rationalizing it.
29
Once I decided to cut off relations with a relative (my former in-laws, and later, my sister), I felt as though a huge cinder block had been removed from my chest. In both cases I knew I had made the right decision and I've never regretted not planning to ever see any of them again. My in-laws always hated me, and I think my marriage was my ex-husband's attempt to push back at their disapproval of his lifestyle. My sister and I were never close and she only contacted me about money; after she had a lawyer send a letter essentially to extort money from me, I sent a detailed rebuff and haven't heard from her since. The well ran dry. It's no emotional drain any more.
17
Siblings show their true colors when money or valuables are involved. It's shameful to see how my siblings acted after the death of my father. It's easier to wish them good luck from afar, but I don't need the grief and false love anymore. Good bye & good luck.
14
I would be interested in research showing whether the permanence of estrangement was studied. I eschewed contact with my brother for a decade because of his consistent verbal abuse and disrespect but when our father became ill we reconciled out of necessity and because we have very little family--neither of us is close to our sister and we have no cousins, etc. There's still something of an emotional distance and a lot of arguing but we love each other, even if we don't always like each other.
9
No studies of the permanence of estrangement were included in the research review of a few studies that include very small samples of mother/daughter estrangements that this article is based on, which is one of the reasons why no myths about estrangement have been or are being debunked.
1
What interests me about US forms of estrangement is partly that a degree of heroism in our society has been conferred on children who reject and repudiate their parents (mother especially). Seemingly, there's a noble -- but ultimately shortsighted -- sort of self-cannonization that seems to follow from early Freudian ideas of faulty parenting (mothering) as the route of all unhappiness. Normal development of adult independence has morphed into some defiant declaration of amputation or even exorcism. And note well how many of these stories report how easily siblings come to be included in the population-to-be-shunned. When did selfhood come to be best defined as angry isolation and alienation?
Finally, it never seems to dawn on people who are so very proud of banishing a "toxic" parent or relative from their lives that their children are watching and learning what is a common, acceptable way for offspring to behave. From personal experience, I can attest that the pattern replicates, generation after generation.
12
The facts that the children are basically mostly the innocent victims of family estrangement and that very similar patterns of family estrangement do indeed replicate generation after generation after generation, even sometimes skipping a generation or two only to rear it's ugly head again when and where it is least expected is certainly something those who wish to normalize family estrangement don't really want to mention. In fact the children who are being forced to grow up estranged through no choice of their own are very rarely even mentioned by the researchers.
3
I know of no one who views cutting ties with their mother or any family member as "heroic.' Where did you get this idea?
28
All children should learn that they don't have to tolerate abuse.
26
I suspect that its usually the father that looses out in these situations. In western societies its very easy and acceptable to dispose of Dad because he isn't important until its time to pay bills
7
I suspect you're projecting personal issues on to this debate.
20
This is NOT the case for all including in my dynamic. The father had (intially) an imbalance of power. And, the financial ability to keep it that way for years.
4
So interesting to come across this article just now, as my mom and I were talking about this just this past holiday weekend. My brother estranged himself from the family 27 years ago. It has caused my mom a great deal of pain, and because of that, me as well.
Another reader wrote a comment about familial patterns of estrangement, and I replied to the comment noting that I was curious if the article would address that when I began reading. I was disappointed that it was not, as that has been the case with my family (multigenerational estrangement): Parent(s) from child/children, child/children from Parent(s), child from family, and sibling from sibling.
Something else I noted was not addressed: Not included in the "three main causes": when a child estranges themselves from the family due to shame. For example as a result of homelessness, addiction and/or prison leading to shame, depression & anger.
7
Often the mental illness that can be a cause of or contributor to any of those circumstances simultaneously contributes to the estrangement, as well
3
I think shame is present in many of the comments if not in the article itself. It seems that people tend to focus on the behaviors rather than the feelings they generate. It can also be a more subtle thing and perhaps hard to identify or admit: people are often too ashamed to admit they are ashamed. I agree that it is another complicating factor that could probably merit discussion on it's own.
6
This very misleading article is based on a research review of a very limited number of studies conducted on very small samples of women only. No estrangement myths have or are being debunked by such incomplete data.
I have not spoken to three of my siblings for over 5 years, the other for 2.5 years. It basically is because of a simple matter of disrespect of me as an adult. Both my parents are deceased , and upon the death of my father the executors of his estate felt they had the power and control to become him, and not simply the executors of his estate. Also, upon my divorce they disregard both my requests and feelings not to invite my ex wife to family gatherings. I was promptly told they could invite whom and when they invited to their house. Rather then respect the feelings of a brother , they chose the ex sister inlaw. Yes , you can, enjoy , but I don't need people in my life who disrespect me and cause me stress. The estrangement problem happens as people become adults and family don't show them the same respect that they would give complete strangers. Fine by me, I'm more relaxed knowing I don't have to state my case to siblings who simply don't care or respect me. Adios.
23
I'm sure that more than a few fellow commenters here have experienced the fabulist relatives--worst of course when it*s a parent or sibling--who creates an alternative universe the details of which you might only find out by accident, and which serves as a very effective mechanism for estranging you from others.
Normal people would call them lies. Unfortunately, the liars are often absolutely convinced of their fictions.
And this is why it is absolutely true that an individual can be blamed for *not getting along with anyone* when everyone has been given a story that the victim can*t refute because he or she hasn't even heard all its details.
I will say it again. Genuinely caring and loving parents do not produce vile children. If you*re only getting the parents* sad, sad version, you ain*t getting the full story.
28
I disagree. Just as it's possible for vile parents to produce good children, it's possible for good parents to produce vile children.
31
"I will say it again"
Why stop there? Once every 50 comments should do the trick. Woudln't want anyone to miss out, would we?
4
Genuinely caring and loving parents do not produce vile children. If you*re only getting the parents* sad, sad version, you ain*t getting the full story.
Well, it can happen, due to mental illness or other stressors, but it's usually obvious when it does. One child estranged from his or her parents, well, reasonable people might disagree on who is more at fault. Several children estranged from the same set of parents looks a lot less like a thing and more like a pattern. And usually, this is the case - the parents have no relationship or only a distant relationship with their kids, or else they're fighting with ALL the kids all the time.
5
I have not read all the comments but they seem to focus on the difficult but necessary removal from family members who have been physically or psychologically abuse. Another common reason for estrangement is when one becomes a care giver for a sick or aging parent. It is astounding how many of us no longer speak to a sibling because they either refuse to help, or in my case, also be actively hurtful, making a hard job even more difficult (to put it mildly.) Certainly, there are many falling outs among siblings over parental money issues. But just as common, I think, is the disbelief and anger when siblings refuse to come together to care for an aging parent. In a small support group I was in of daughters (and why is it almost always the daughters?) whose moms were also in the same nursing home more than half no longer speak to a sibling. It's a sad state of affairs when this happens. However, at some point one realizes that the emotional toll is just too great, and the healthiest thing to do is nurture and appreciate the friends and family one does have.
34
Diane, I can so relate to this comment. My experience caring for my mother, who died last year, showed me the choices made by several brothers to completely distance themselves from her in her time of great need.
This experience taught me about how to rise to the occasion through sacrifice and how to try to put one’s values into practice. It was one of the most meaningful and traumatic experiences to be there for my mother, and now for my dad in his time of grief. I am lucky to have the opportunity to give back. My parents were well intentioned but they made many errors in child rearing.
My own growth as a human and my ability to come to terms with our family’s past was facilitated by remaining in contact with my parents. But it was never easy.
My brothers are very into partying and now their kids are also seeking to party. The held value of disrespecting my parents (their kids’ grandparents) has come full circle and my nephews are very angry at their parents (my brothers). I’m staying connected to my nephews but I realize that it’s important to keep any family politics separate from our interactions. Hopefully as the years go on, our home will continue to be a positive refuge in their lives.
One thing that I have noticed is that my two brothers tend to have a sexist view of women. If you are skinny and blonde and into partying, you are in the zone. I’m none of these things and hence, not of interest.
1
My Mothers, Mother was a toxic jealous person. She single handedly ruined every holiday and special occasion in our family's life. Even as small children my sisters and I recognized what a unloving and cruel person our Grandmother was. Growing up we throught that all kids hated their Grandmother.
When we got older we asked our loving Mother why would she expose us to such a mean horrible lady. Our Mothers response was that she was trying to give her Mom a second chance at being a better Grandparent then she was a parent. We replied that Grandma obviously failed miserably at her second chance and our Mom scared us by exposing us to wickedness. It was not worth it. My Mom was trying to avoid the guilt and shame of becoming estranged from her Mom and in the end deeply effected her daughters as a result.
37
NY Times, thank you for this. Can you please do a piece on sibling estrangement? I long to read readers' comments on that, and it is relevant to so many people I know.
39
This article barely scratched the surface, and I for one am not buying stories like those of Elizabeth Vagnoni (mentioned in related article) who says both of her sons became suddenly estranged from her over a comment she made on FB. I sincerely doubt that was the ONLY factor.
I’m in my 60’s and have come to the realization that my abusive childhood will never fully escape me; I am damaged to my foundation by a father with NPD and an enabling mother who failed to protect me from the terror of his abuse. Being the family scapegoat, my experience differs enormously from my only sibling who is five years younger and the beloved golden child.
Part of my problem was my gender; my misogynistic father held beliefs that women should not be educated and existed purely to wait on their husbands. He also thought of me as a delicate child, when in fact I am far stronger and more independent than my sibling will ever dream of being. Deciding to go “no contact” was the only rational decision for me since my father physically abused me when I was pregnant and I was terrified of losing my unborn baby. That was the final straw. I did not ask to be born, and I was not beholden to them just because we share DNA. My “family” are those I choose.
Good parents are not perfect. Good families do not have perfect lives. But it’s a far different thing when the family appears outwardly perfect, but what happens in the home is horrifying. Children do not bounce back from that. Period.
95
Yes. Same narrative in my life. I’m sorry for your experience in this regard. Terribly difficult.
12
Your sex, not your "gender". Did your dad ask how you "identify" before treating you as lesser than? Didn't think so.
2
If you intended your "correction" to be snarky and misplaced, you succeeded.
30
My parents died when I was in my early 20s, but now that I am in my early 70s, I have still never been in contact with their relatives. I don't really know why. My mother had an antagonistic relationship with her step-family, but my father seemed to be beloved by his siblings, judging from the one letter I received from them, to which I never replied.
7
If you are being routinely insulted, demeaned, used, ridiculed, humiliated, physically or sexually abused: End the relationship, if you are able. It took me many decades to understand that I did not have to endure forever, that I could quit. I do not regret my decision for a second, only that I did not do this sooner.
“They will change. They will stop.” No, they won’t. Protect yourself.
88
Self-preservation first! I crossed the Atlantic and left "them" to argue and fight among themselves.
19
You are 100% spot on. My wife is or was in the same situation. Only estrangement from family members who abused her helped. Bravo Zulu.
14
I was told that my great grandfather and great uncle died in a shootout. They shot each other.
My misogynistic father planned to disinherit his two daughters (one of us would get a used toaster, and the other a used blender) but then his son insisted my father split assets equally.
My husband’s sister refuses to speak to me. She has a mental spreadsheet of grievances that go back 40 years, to my wedding day. After I got cancer in 2001, she still refused to see me.
My husband and I are now in our 60s. We have each other, our three cats, no kids, lots of books and friends. Life is not bad on this little island of ours.
61
Books, cats, friends, and a good relationship are all worth their weight in gold, Quixotic Chick. The loss is solely your sister-in-law's. May you continue to have peace in the New Year.
4
I know this is many days after the article was published but I wanted to comment on how very helpful this article and the comments have been to me. The cycle of abuse, derision, bullying , name calling and narcissism that lead to estrangement does take years. I am now in my 60s. I started speaking out against the bad behavior, the demands, hurtful actions and words of 4 of my 5 siblings after both my parents had died, hoping that love would prevail. I refused to do as I was told , be who they told me to be and accept the abusiveness. I was even criticized repeatedly for earning a Ph.D. in neurobiology because it "changed" me. It is hard to accept that your family does not love or value you for who you are, especially since we are told over and again how important family relationships are to happiness. Families are supposed to give us a sense of belonging and self worth . I have many friends with healthy family relationships that provided important contrast. Finally I recognized how deeply mean and damaging these relationships were. No matter how much I wanted it to be different, it would never resolve so I distanced myself and decided give it to paper and file it away. I was not invited to an extended family gathering last summer which was very painful and the holidays are hard, but each year gets easier. It has been better for my happiness, self worth and self esteem to recognize those around me that do love me for the good and valuable person I am.
91
It wouldn't surprise me if estrangement were a pattern in some families--as it is in mine.
Paternal grandmother doesn't talk in progression to each of her daughters-in-law, sometimes for years at a stretch. Father doesn't talk to brother with "no gumption" who sweeps floors in local factory; then doesn't talk to gay brother; brothers don't talk with each other; nephews and nieces, live in the same town but meet only half a dozen times in their lives. Maternal grandfather and uncle explained away as larcenous villains; grandchildren not even aware of the existence of grandfather until they discover in his obituary that first, he was alive, and second, he lived only a couple of miles away. Everyone is too "different".
Two generations along, brothers don't talk to each other; sister-in-law doesn't talk to brother; nephew doesn't talk to father or mother. Family members get sick, and if they don't handle it in the proper way, all communication ends. Generation after generation, family members cut off, family gets smaller and smaller. Too different from each other.
Then I join the families of certain friends and find four generations gathered. Lawyer, mailman, retired homemaker, 60-year-old student, unemployed, businessperson, actor: all different, but with a difference: they are accepting of each other. And they are accepting of themselves.
41
I agree that this is learned behavior. My father didn't speak with his father for at least 10 years while I was growing up. When I turned 19, my mother and father then formally disowned me for normal teenage behavior (a relationship they didn't approve of). Later, they came crawling back, begging for a relationship but the damage was done and I now haven't said a word to them for over five years (best five years of my life). They've since cut off contact with my sister for similar behavior. My mother likes to claim that I am ostracizing and punishing them for perceived wrongs because I won't subject myself to her verbal abuse. Even if that were true, I wonder where I learned it from....
15
This describes my family of origin. Many ruptured relationships between siblings on my dad’s side, fights over inheritance down to fights over a misunderstanding in a single conversation.
Brothers and sisters not speaking for decades and passing the grudge down to the next generation. A brother goes back to his hometown for Thanksgiving and his siblings change the time and place to make sure they won’t see him.
Then I was cut off for several years. I found it to be very painful,... even though I saw it all around me for years before I had thought I might escape the same fate.
Now reconciled with the elders, I try to keep visits and conversations short and sweet. I try my best to offer unconditional love to my grown kid and his wife, one of my life goals is to work with all I have to give them a foundation of love that doesn’t waver.
22
Agreed. I was wondering if the article would address familial patterns of estrangement, as that has been my experience as well.
8
Here are a few things that may apply. I have a four-year break with my older son.
1) Sun Also Rises:
"How did you go bankrupt?"
"Two ways. Gradually, then suddenly."
2) Readers of Gen X advice columnist Carolyn Hax will be alert to spousal (psychological) abuse playing a role in estrangement. A key technique is for the abuser to minimize contact with family and friends.
3) Sorry to be anonymous but I don’t want to compromise him professionally. One of my (and his) college class's reunion efforts included a class poll in which FIVE percent said they NEVER saw their kids. I couldn't even say that since I do see my other son.
4) Boys. "Girls are harder to raise but they call home more." I think Moses brought that one down. A factor.
5) Money. Another factor, they say.
6) I got a brief flurry of emailing about two years in, with some pop psychology. The substance was wrong, but not in violation of any laws of physics. However I did have to say to myself, "This kid graduates Phi Beta Kappa from ______, makes a gazillion dollars in finance, and thinks that a 67-year old is going to change his personality?"
I mean bring on the Flat Earth Society! He deflected my suggestion that we meet with a therapist.
7) His mom and I split up in the “gradual” part of the timeline. He’s also bad to her.
8) Oh well. I still love him and enjoy wearing his hand-me-downs, can't wait to give him a hug. Hope I live long enough that his adult children will look me up. Life is funny.
13
This article hit me hard. I've been working through my experences as a child most of my life, I'm now 69 years old.
I was lucky to have found a good therapist in my 30's to help me find the tools needed to successfully learn how to navigate my emotional self and even thrive. My happiness and stable relationships are because of her guidance.
I learned to live with the reality of life and not try to live in the fantasy, and enjoy the clarity this approach gave me.
Life is truely easy when one choses to embrace universal truths and self examination.
19
It*s worth noting that every member of a family has a unique experience within that family. Your siblings didn't have *your* life. They had theirs.
And for everything you do know, there*s plenty you don't. Even when it*s been obvious that there was a favored child, you didn't experience the stress and conflicts a favored status conferred. You saw that wretched privilege from the outside.
Etc. etc.
I was estranged from my brother and only sibling for something like 35 years. We reconnected over a birthday dinner with my mother, where he met my child for the first time.
He was truly wonderful during my mother*s final illness and after her death.
In truth, we*ll never be more than cordial acquaintances now. You can*t regain lost years. But he and his partner have a very warm loving relationship, despite a considerable physical distance, with my now-adult son, and believe me that is worth everything and more.
We were each more than justified in what divided and separated us. Why should he have been any healthier or more reasonable or self-controlled than I was, earlier in our lives? We grew up in a horribly dysfunctional household. We are each terribly damaged and had very long individual roads to healthy and rewarding maturities.
He demonstrates caring and concern when it has been most needed, and that is a great gift that couldn't have been foreseen earlier. Don*t assume past is prologue.
35
More needs to be said about dangerous siblings. I have a much older brother who needs to hurt people. My turn came eventually with smoke bombs (designed to do lots of financial damage), monetary theft from our parents estate, attempts to get me fired, etc. It took serious effort to get a restraining order because "he was a sibling). And he had a Cornell B.S. and M.S. and an MBA from Columbia plus a fake business card. It can be hard to get "estranged".
You will not be surprised that he inherited the family gun, is four times divorced, emotionally abandon his five acknowledged children (two mothers), has sexually harassed former female employees and involved in numerous shady business dealings involving federal funds. He also voted for Trump and actually reminds me of Trump. What a surprise.
32
My late father reminds me of Trump. No doubt they have NPD, and there is no changing that.
19
The family member from whom I choose to be estranged makes Trump look like a rank amateur. The British support organisation referred to in the article, by the way, only exists in two English cities (not London). Counselling support services, particularly family counselling services in the UK are virtually non-existent. Whereas in the America,I understand that licenced counsellors must have earned at least a Master's Degree in Counselling Psychology, in the UK, one can, with no other qualifications, complete a 17-hour training course and be considered a "counsellor".
6
These stories are so sad. I miss my deceased father every day but I am estranged from my sister. I have tried to get in touch but she doesn’t respond and I don’t really care. I guess that idealized family doesn’t really exist too often.
21
By moving far away from San Diego in the early 70s I was able to build meaningful friendships that were closer than anything I ever felt in my family. In the 40 years I was away I built self-esteem and got an advanced degree and found meaningful work. My professors gave me encouragement and were interested in my ideas......things I never got at home. Sometimes moving far from the dysfunctional and destructive family ties is the only way to grow and have a normal life. I wouldn’t chose my family as friends, so why subject myself to them?
36
The opinion, based on the research noted in the publication, omits the underlying mental health issues at the core of estrangement. Also, laws, such as grandparents visitation law in Illinois, are archaic and exacerbate mental health for children involved in estranged relationships. This is a much broader topic that needs to be discussed. It is pervasive and affects people of all socioeconomic status.
10
This is a great article and really resonated with me. I'm estranged from one sister - she's mentally ill and convinced herself that I overdosed our mother with morphine while she was on home hospice.
Also estranged from one brother - a convicted felon - who wasn't speaking to our mother but engaged in deed fraud on her home a few weeks before her death. With family like this - who needs enemies.
My advice is to concentrate on the family and friends who love you. And don't look back. Wishing you all peace.
42
My personal situation is usually not written about....Seniors who have made the sad choice to no longer have contact with their Adult Child....Character DIsordered/Mentally Il ..not able to lead a responsible life.....Verbally abusive towards me; manipulating me for money...and stealing jewelry ....After years of avoiding the truth I finally told him I no longer wanted contact....And this time when he called from local jail to be bailed out I said NO
49
"We therefore know little about the estrangement of mothers, fathers, sons, and daughters who lack genetic relationships with one another or shared histories and childhoods (e.g., stepfamilies, adoptive families, families created by assisted reproduction). We also know little from the perspective of parents who have voluntarily or intentionally cut contact with a child, or of sons and daughters whose parents have intentionally or voluntarily cut contact with them.
There is also a lack of diversity in the estrangement literature in terms of gender, race, and ethnicity. The studies described in this review have mostly drawn on samples of women; we know little about fathers' or sons' experiences of estrangement. " http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jftr.12216/full
Journal bit of a book I am writing on going no contact:
"June 16- Fresh tears. I saw a narcissist mother healing video suggesting- start your morning every day saying 3 things you are proud of about yourself, 3 things you forgive yourself for and 3 things you are committed to.
At the forgiveness, what came to mind was forgiving my child self for not speaking out right when it happened, my young adult self for not speaking as I didn't have tools or support to heal, my mid life self for not speaking out because I didn't know it would do any good. Now it feels too late to speak to anyone, my brother as well. He's not capable of taking the information in without returning venality and hatred to me. I imagined my young self, that sweet little girl, and I wanted to hug her so bad. To help her because no one else did. I cast back and try to remember how she felt the rest of that day that started so shockingly, and I can't. I think I was confused because I wasn't sure how I got in the bed - why didn't I wake up, how I could have slept so deeply to be put in that position? and I wasn't sure my mother and grandmother weren't somehow a part of it, because they always put me in a bedroom alone with my father when we visited - why?
June 20 - I was so nervous before dialing, leaving just a little message of hello. They make me really nervous. Frightened. Emotionally afraid. Our little wars are measured by the holidays. Next up - My birthday. It will be up to them to snub me."
9
I have been estranged from dad since birth. Once he married his wife who had two girls from previous relationships, he further distances himself from me. When I was 12 and wanted to visit my Step mom, Step sisters and half sister, he told me, “Your not going to come here and mess up my family!” It hurt me to my core, but as my Dad, I never stopped loving him. As an adult, I continued to reach out to him and he rarely reciprocated bragging on his Step grandkids and never asking about his flesh and blood. I became very successful in my career with multiple degrees, but not once did he tell me he was proud of me. He died earlier this month and I attended his funeral, but I wish I hadn’t because the man they described wasn’t the man I knew. I will never understand how a man can neglect his flesh and blood and still hurt today because of his misguided and cruel choices.
34
I disagree with folks who 'blame' parenting . In my own case...I was certainly a "good enough mother"...no abuse...no alcohol/drugs....and so on . Character Disorders and Mental Illness are more 'nature" than "nurture.....
12
Have you sincerely asked your children why they have distanced themselves from you without excuses to fend off their reasons? It is difficult to hear negative remarks about ourselves, but necessary none the less.
24
The article mentions the influence a spouse can have, but doesn't elaborate on that. If your adult child is forced to choose between you and the spouse, there may not be anything you can do.
2
It might be true that there isn't anything a parent can do if an adult child is forced to choose between the parent and the spouse. But it is also true that any relationship that includes forcing one partner to cut-off contact with others is an abusive relationship. Sadly, many, many estrangements are the result of the influence of the partner, especially partners who either have a family history of estrangement or are domestic abusers.
2
No love was ever shown in my family. Father would pick on me, abusing me physically and humiliating as well, from childhood until I was twenty-one. Months before he died, he told me the circumstances of my birth, how he struck my mother in the belly while she was eight months pregnant with me. That's why I was born prematurely. And my younger sister was like him a lot. She even accused me of being at fault when, in junior high school (!), her teachers would say, "You're not as smart as your sister XX." Like it was my fault what they thought?!? Then like the petty woman she is, she stole small things from me. Such a nasty woman who seemed always to make it seem I was the problem one.
14
Oh, wow. This has touched so many people. Sorry for the gallows humor, but I thought that it was MY dad who put the "fun" into dysfunctional! Trust me I do not want to disrespect the pain anyone has felt, it is just that humor is how I deal with mine. Which is long and detailed, so needs more than NYT comment length (the removed bits involve a philandering paternal grandmother and her lesbian mother, which I could have met if it weren't for my dad's standard lie about relatives being dead).
Whenever we kids would ask our dad about his parents his reply was "they are dead." Period, nothing else. The day after our mother died my 18 year older brother got a call from a guy who claimed to be our grandfather. That was a surprise. It turned out my mother had said something to folks important to my grandparents (it cost my granddad an Army promotion), and they refused to have anything to do with us until after she died.
I learned this when I spent a few days with my dad's stepmother. Who kept calling me by my mother's name. That was awkward.
Long story vastly shortened: my mom's family hated my dad's family, and my dad's family hated theirs... and some of their own. Family secrets were just part of life. Using the genealogical tools at the local public library has peeled off a few fallacies.
I could be mad at my dad, but I have learned to let it go. Recent family dinner involved daughter-in-law and mother-in-law on their reasons to be with dads after divorce. Wow
9
This time of year I think more and more of all the folks in the world that do not have families to spend the holidays with, and then I realize how lucky they are....
29
I never met my biological grandma on my dad’s side after they stopped speaking 40 years ago.
She supposedly died in back country Montana at somepoint.
Should I be sad? Should I even care?
7
My parents moved to America and didn't have the chance to really see their parents before they died. I don't have much memories of grandparents. But my parents both had multiple siblings that lived around their parents and my parents had me and sister for company. I cannot abandon my parents and they can't do the same with me for financial reasons. I think if I get married, hopefully my future partner has closer ties to me and my parents than his (maybe her) parents. I'm too busy with my own family to care about the in-laws who may live far away. I think holidays family gatherings are silly traditions for people who don't see their family on regular bases. Many people are too busy with their immediate family and if adult children stops living with their parents, they stop becoming immediate family. Single family households really encourage people to cut off supports to kids are too old to live with parents. Many parents can only support the kids for 18 years and after that, kids are on their own. That kind of cultural pressure might encourage estrangement. I'm sure as parents age, they wouldn't be able to remember how many kids or grandkids they have when family gets too big.
7
I appreciated the depth and knowledge from the people who commented on this challenging and common story. As a psychotherapist of 35 years, I see family's dealing with the decision of "estrangement" from many sides. The underbelly is described precisely in many of the comments. In addition, I have noticed "estrangement" can repeat from one generation to another. Often, it is inevitable. Looking at ones small daughters, one might never imagine their dear child/children experiencing the pain of estrangement as adults, and it often happens. I saw a mother estrange her daughter from the paternal grandmother whom I also helped through the pain of her loss. The grandmother had made mistakes, nevertheless, in this case, did the crime deserve the punishment? I saw the grandchild 20 years later who was struggling with her own mother-in-law which was causing marital problems. I can share more than this story about how estrangement repeated.
13
I am sure you can share more about estrangement than this article has. This article is but a small glimpse into the world of estrangement. Anyone who has lived through estrangement could have debunked those myths, or better yet, who said that those were myths? people who live in a fantasy world?
The best part of this article has been the comments section; I have learned a lot about my own estrangement from my family.
18
And those, the stories of how estrangement repeats generation after generation, are the ones that really need to be told before anyone goes trying to normalize estrangement or claims to be debunking myths based on very limited and incomplete data.
1
The comment section has certainly served to debunk the entire article.
1
Joseph Schumpeter predicted over about 70 years ago the Estrangement was an inevitable outcome of market capitalism with a split between parent and child becoming common, because of the expected burden of having to care for the elderly. In the rising development of the 'gig' economy the child can expect to not do as well as the parent may have done economically – wonder how Schumpeter would handle that development?
12
Normal Family
A few years ago when we had an extended regional power outage we went to the local FEMA shelter to get hot coffee and breakfast. We were sitting at a table next to an eleven-year-old boy and his eight-year-old sister.
I heard the eight-year-old girl saying to the boy, "Why can't our family being normal like the other ones?"
The eleven-year-old boy replied,"They're all normal until you get to know them."
85
Thank you for writing about this difficult topic. I have chosen estrangement from my mother. It is difficult to talk about because so many people (who may have had more typical childhoods and/or parental relationships) find it hard to understand. This contributes to issues of doubt and guilt which are challenging for me to process, despite my knowing that estrangement is the only healthy choice for me and my family.
22
The reader comments are heart-rending, and more informative and meaningful than the article, itself.
- It helps to always think of "adults" as being children masquerading as adults, but still harboring fears, hurts, angers, etc., from their experiences, especially early in life. We're all like this, in varying degrees. The worst of us never develop enough "humanity" to get past or at least mitigate what made us abusive, mean-spirited, etc. It's much easier to tolerate an abusive child than an abusive (ersatz) adult.
- IMHO, the most important thing ever said in human history is Niebuhr's Serenity Prayer: "God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference." I prefer to leave God out of it, believing that it's each individual's moral (and pragmatic) duty to consciously strive to improve his/her serenity, courage and wisdom in daily decisions and behaviors. Do that for a lifetime, and you'll make noticeable progress before you die.
- I don't think that human relationships improve unless both sides legitimately make an effort to do so. Your Herculean efforts will fail if the other(s) simply can't/won't try to make it work, too. (They may desperately “need” to reject you, simply because they've achieved so little serenity, courage and wisdom themselves.)
In that case, walking away from them may be the only way for you to continue your life's quests-- painful though it will be.
52
That's providing one actually buys into the belief that adult sized others' actually have the power to interfere with one's life quest during adulthood than one's own personal fears, hurts, angers, etc., especially those carried forward from childhood.
From the heart wrenching comments here it would seem to me that rather than wasting more time trying to debunk myths about estrangement, or normalize it, a more productive endeavor would be to put in even a fraction of that effort to help people realize that being fully me doesn't at all depend on you being anyone other than you. Because that is the place where the pain originates from.
3
Your response helps me to go one level deeper regarding familial relationships-- so, thanks! Being "fully me" isn't nearly enough for me. I not only want to love and be loved; I want to want to love and be loved. That inevitably makes me vulnerable to my family members' weaknesses, as well as being fulfilled by their reciprocation of my love. So be it.
Since I'm white and 78, Malcolm X wasn't exactly my cup of tea, but he said something I'll never forget: "You're either part of the solution, or you're part of the problem." In every single dealing with my family, I TRY to ask myself whether what I'm about to say or do makes me part of THEIR solution, or part of THEIR problem. At the least, when I do this, I'll be guilt-free, regardless of their response. As it turns out, they behave the same way towards me. It's a small family-- 3 grown children; 7 grandchildren; 1 sister. I literally cannot imagine being estranged from any of them (so the reader's stories are not only depressing and painful, but somewhat alien to me).
If you try relentlessly to do your part right, and learn to GENUINELY forgive yourself for your failings, an awful lot of things, including relationships, will work out, because those who have the will and capacity will respond in kind. I believe that acquiring the "serenity to accept the things you cannot change" only comes AFTER you've demonstrated "the courage to change the things you can." Sadly, I'll go to my grave wishing I'd had a lot more courage.
8
Thinking of adults as overgrown children may be helpful, but it may also be helpful for parents to think of children as mini-adults: in other words, fully formed people with rights, fears, and inner lives. It seems easy for some parents to think of children as cheerful bots that merely respond to immediate inputs (cold, hunger). Parents can tend to nurse their own wounds and grievances while imagining their children are free of cares and beholden to obey. Parents should realize that children will remember how they are treated.
26
Like so many, my family is part of this story. I’d like to share my perspective, which I haven’t otherwise read here.
My sister abandoned my two siblings and me when our mom died a few years ago, literally yelling at me over our mom’s death bed because “she had enough”. Perhaps, we could have treated her more kindly at times, I don’t know. I have racked my brain trying to understand why she finds us so “toxic” when we otherwise successfully maintain positive, fulfilling relationships with so many others. Even though I don’t believe I did anything egregious to warrant her behavior, I tried to reach out to her on several occasions to apologize for hurting her, but all attempts were received with silence.
I’ve learned to live with this situation. Yet, it still saddens me. I’ve come to the conclusion that her actions probably had more to do with her than us. (At the same time, she ended other key relationships in her life, too.)
Certainly, I wouldn’t advise anyone to stay in a toxic/abusive relationship, but I feel like that forgiveness has taken a big backseat to individualism in our country. We are a throw away society, which is prone to throw away relationships rather than work on them. Just look at our high divorce rate. And, then there is the collateral damage that ensues because invariably there are other relationships that are negatively impacted, like our children who lost their cousins.
Thank you for listening and trying to understand how the “other side” can feel
38
Normalizing estrangement, which is in fact just by it's very definition a dysfunction of relationship, is about perpetuating our cut-off culture. No, estrangement is not normal, healthy, or at all productive in a positive sense, that is evidenced in the very fact that it causes deep and lingering pain. It is relationship dysfunction that keeps people in therapists offices though and so there is a certain financial value attached to this quest to normalize it.
8
Anue, I don't think what you're saying is helpful. Of course estrangement is not normal or healthy. Neither is child abuse, but we don't tell child abuse victims to stop complaining about child abuse because child abuse is not normal or healthy.
And yes, some therapists earn a living treating child abuse victims. What shall we do? Make them stop treating child abuse victims, because we can't have anyone gain financially from the fact that child abuse happens?
29
Exactly. And so, if one is estranged and life improves, it is the correct decision. Choose wellness.
9
Ultimately family dysfunction is a choice.
6
Exactly, and free choice always affords us the opportunity not to behave in a dysfunctional manner, even in the face of a dysfunctional situation.
2
But whose choice? There's more than one person in a family.
10
Um, not always. Not when mental illness is at play. Don’t know anyone who chooses mental illness.
22
When I, in my mid twenties, hung up on my mother yelling at me eighteen years ago I was effectively capping a childhood that I hated and couldn't wait to put behind me. The arrival of my first child and my determination not to repeat the mistakes of the past made estrangement a sanity saving approach.
It was only years later, once I had the distance, that I could start to really understand what was going on in the 1970s. It didn't excuse anything, but it allowed me to close the chapter and try to be vigilant about repeating mistakes.
Luckily for me I had support from the most wonderful woman, my wife, (who was the cause of the original fight with my mother).
K, if you are reading this, I love you always.
29
My isolation from my family was gradual at first. I moved across the country from them at about the time I had a therapist recommend cutting them out of my life; due to abuse I suffered from one family member, without any kindness or emotional support from the other family members. After five years, I began talking to my father again, but only on Christmas, Father's Day and his birthday. My family is all Mormon and when I decided to get baptized into a different religion, my priest suggested I invite my father to the baptism, citing the ten commandments. I had not seen him for years. I invited him. He left the baptism early and left me with a card stating that he did not love me anymore because I had left the Mormon church and joined a new religion. I was crushed. It took me a year or so to get over the pain of it. Recently, my grandfather passed away. I hesitated about whether to attend the funeral or not, but in the end decided to attend. I was met with hugs and tears and it was a sweet reunion. I now have my family as facebook friends, but that is it. We didn't completely open the door for new relationships with each other, but at least now we are civil. Even though they are still not in my life, it felt freeing to finally let go of the past pain and to be okay with no longer being a part of the family. Estrangement can be a tricky thing. While it does isolate, it can bring freedom to finally be yourself.
25
Your painful experience brings up an important factor in estrangement- religious belief, differing beliefs or lack of belief. Many faith groups demand shunning of children or siblings who are no longer part of the faith group.
Surely there are many mothers and others who follow these mandates with great sorrow. The church is basically saying that faith unity trumps blood unity. In my humble opinion, any church or group, from Amish to Scientologist, asks too much when it asks us to ignore our family ties.
10
Shunning and ostracism, the hallmarks of estrangement and no contact, have deep roots in religious traditions throughout history. Normalizing estrangement is essentially basically repeating history.
1
It's interesting to define avoiding someone who raped or beat you as "shunning" or "ostracism."
9
Good to see that abandonment/estrangement is being addressed and is brought to light that this is not that uncommon. I don't think this article touched on the profound loss and intense pain that this causes
18
Love is definitely overrated. Try respect and ethical/moral behaviour towards all?
Try do unto others. Try turn the other cheek. Try forget about it. Try patience. Try telling people certain behaviour is unacceptable (STARE - mutter.).
PS try to understand yourself, love/appreciate or best respect your self. Despite family, one is always alone. "Help" can be a travesty and end in disaster.
10
I had a mother-in-law who made me aware once I was married that I could never measure up to her need to possess her son forever. I had accolades from my profession, remembered her birthday, Christmas, helped make her income from her farm, etc. She made Christmas horrible for me and my daughter, one year presenting two children from my husband's former marriage volumes of expensive gifts while giving our daughter a box of ribbon candy when she was only seven years old. The best present I even gave myself was removing myself from that degradation. I felt totally at peace when I told my husband to go to her house for Christmas and make any excuse he wished for my daughter and me. He said she did not ask where I was. He didn't complain about my absence. He knew how mean and evil she was for no reason. I chalked it up to her background and stayed away. The only life we can save is ours first and then our children's lives. My daughter was eternally grateful even though she was good to her grandmother even as she died, sitting by her side for months as she deteriorated so that she wouldn't be alone. I am proud of my child; she turned out well because I didn't allow her to be subjected to the cruelty anymore. We owe our children removal from those who are emotionally unstable or who espouse hate and cruelty.
88
Pretty shallow article.... I expect BETTER from my NYT. This article uses one or two studies to throw "family estrangement" into the "mess" of society today. This issue is not news; nor is it new. People have become "estranged" from family throughout history--think Moses in the bible people.... Just my two cents. Relationships take work; life takes work. No one, except the charmed, live perfect lives.
11
I was quite surprised to see this very poorly done article in the NYT too. Sadly, most of the comments lead me to believe that a large majority of the readers haven't even read the underlying research review, which is grossly inaccurately reported on here.
4
I agree. I was excited about this article but it fell way short of my expectations. Quite frankly, it was weak. The comments indicate how relevant the topic is. Feels as if the author enjoyed the holidays and threw this article together in 20 minutes.
7
Anue, I believe people are more interested in the subject than what this specific article says. People are relieved that someone is talking about estrangement and that it is more common than we know. as several people have commented, it is quite taboo to talk about it with people who haven't experienced it so thsi comment section is certainly more enlightening than the article itself. Personally, I didn't learn anything from the article having lived through various estrangements.
10
I hope yesterday was rock bottom, as it involved two huge fights between myself and family, all in this small town in which I seem to be the only person who recognizes and calls hate speech what it is. I love my family and on many other levels we have good relationships, and sometimes I see honest growth, but other times it feels like three steps back, or just this wall of white hetero fragility. The whole family eye rolls me or calls me dismissive or "professor" as if this is all academics and not about real people. People I know and love from the places I have lived in the world and about whom I constantly hear stereotypes or blatant hate speech from my family. I'm on the verge of cutting off contact but how do you do that to your "little brother" (he's 31 and I'm 35), your mom and dad? But also, how do you confront injustice without ruining your family? Why is this all on me? why don't they learn or put the onus on themselves too? Am I too confrontational? Is there a proven way to approach these confrontations/conversations?
25
Seems like a simple solution, stop pushing your ideals on them, and ask them not to push their ideals on you so that you can all remain friends for life.
8
I disagree w BobE. Your ideals are good. The world is also your family. Push on.
13
You can't change other people, only yourself.
Apologies for the cliche ... but it's really true. They are not going to change because you scold them, anymore than it's going to rain because you insist that it should.
What you can do is re-frame the situation, if you don't want to be estranged.
You can't expect them to change for you, but you can ask them to avoid incendiary topics and language. But instead of loaded words like "hate speech," be plain: "That is neither true nor kind. Please stop, at least in my presence."
Ask yourself if there isn't a touch of moral superiority in your attitude, and if (consciously or unconsciously) the hate speech is their way of getting a rise out of you. Are you are feeding the dynamic?
And examine your own beliefs. Do they HAVE to change for you to love and tolerate them? For you to be able to stand their company? For you to believe you've had a positive effect on the world?
I have a family member who is a chronic liar. It used to be painful and humiliating to parse out what was or wasn't true. Now I start with the expectation that there's only a 50% chance she's telling the truth, and it's a waste of time to try to figure it out. A difficult reality to accept, but now it's much easier to deal with her, and I'm less scarred.
2
We need to get over this idea that all families are worthy of Norman Rockwell portraits. It's ridiculous. Families are much more complicated than the silly 1950s sitcoms would have us all think.
32
Wow. And I thought my family dynamics were rare.
15
The article focuses on children becoming estranged from their paremnts because of acts by the parents. I see that happening, but I also see a lot of parents deciding to become estranged from their children because of acts by the children that are difficult to fathom and accept. My conclusion, just because you are family doesn’t give you a free pass on showing mutual respect. That goes both ways and is true in developing any healthy relationship between family and friends.
30
The psychology profession is still very steeped in the myth that everything wrong with an adult child is the parents fault, mostly the mothers. So of course that is the place the very limited studies in this research review are mostly focused. I'm not even sure there are many researcher's in the psychology profession willing to tackle the reality of estrangement from abusive adult children.
2
"The psychology profession is still very steeped in the myth that everything wrong with an adult child is the parents fault, mostly the mothers." That is entirely incorrect; you are about 25 years out of date as to what "the psychology profession" as a whole believes nowdays. And please point us to the evidence in the studies reviewed that the authors were focused on blaming the mothers. If some of the studies point to estrangement resulting from mothers treating their children poorly, well, hold the presses, this is not exactly news that this can lead to estrangement when the child becomes an adult.
9
DW it would of been nice if you actually had read the full research review before commenting. In case you missed it the first time I pointed the link to the research review which this article is largely based upon here it goes again.
"The studies described in this review have mostly drawn on samples of women" http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jftr.12216/full
"We therefore know little about the estrangement of mothers, fathers, sons, and daughters who lack genetic relationships with one another or shared histories and childhoods (e.g., stepfamilies, adoptive families, families created by assisted reproduction). We also know little from the perspective of parents who have voluntarily or intentionally cut contact with a child, or of sons and daughters whose parents have intentionally or voluntarily cut contact with them.
There is also a lack of diversity in the estrangement literature in terms of gender, race, and ethnicity. The studies described in this review have mostly drawn on samples of women; we know little about fathers' or sons' experiences of estrangement. Findings relating to estrangement between mothers and their children might not be equivalent to that of fathers and their children, and sons might experience estrangement differently than daughters."
This time of year I remind myself that while blood may be thicker than water, honey is thicker than both. I’ve found the honeys of my life, both of blood and by choice, and I refuse to be shamed about it. Others comments used to sting, but now I see them as the kind of thing that a privileged and unempathetic person would say. If you have a family that is good to you, you have no idea.... NO IDEA how lucky you are.
25
You know you are right!!! ,However, is it with a sense of wrong or guilt in the background. Why is their no peace in our world? Why is there no understanding? Perhaps it starts with our personal lack of ability to forgive, to live and let live, to accept that we differ. It is a loss to all.
8
Relations are strained with my relatives who express so much fear, anger, even hate (yes they get their “news” from fox). Our conversations are careful avoidance of much of our interests and values. We are able to still have moments of humor and fun however. Just very exhausting having to be so wary of subjects.
28
We can always agree to disagree. (My opinons are my own, and I don't need validation from anyone.)
But having to walk on pins and needles with your family, you might as well not engage.
9
A common theme in my family was estrangement over money. The final and complete dissolution of the family came when mom died and the inheritance created more conflict. The relationships weren’t strong enough to withstand conflict. I blame my mother and father for not creating an atmosphere of communication, compromise, forgiveness and family cohesiveness. But then that kind of family cohesiveness was what happened in other families...not ours. I never had children for fear of carrying on the toxic nature of our family. But now that I am older I realize I could have had children and made it my purpose to create the kind of communication, love and family cohesiveness I never had. Too late now.
35
Don't feel too badly about you choice not to have children. I know far too many parents who did have children and succeeded wonderfully at improving on the future course of their family histories only to end up with adult children who ended up carrying on the legacies of generations past, rather than continuing on in improvement mode. Parenting is only a very small percentage of who an adult child actually becomes.
3
Wrong. While genes play a major role, of course, in who we become, parenting plays one that's just as important, especially if there's abuse, soul-murder, and consistent denigration. It's one thing to water a flower and watch it bloom, and quite another to withhold water, or pour on a toxic liquid.
7
Genes plus Environment, and "parenting" itself is only a very small percentage of environment in the scheme of things, especially given the fact that a large majority of children spend more awake time away from parents than they do with them right from infancy.
Thank you for this article and these comments. They are immensely helpful. To know that I am not alone, although not understood or connected to those who should be closest to me, is a great soother for the soul. I read this article on Christmas Day, which i am spending away from all family. Walking around lower Manhattan in its quietness I felt lonely but also peaceful. And grateful to not have the stress and anger that usually attend the holidays.
79
I feel you. I envy the peacefulness found and empathize with the loneliness. Merry Christmas.
21
Me too. I was also alone. And peaceful.
11
I appreciate the insights. I had an adult sibling that was emotionally unstable. I loved him, but not his tirades or the drama. Other immediate family members were engulfed in the hate agenda. In order to try to avoid major blow-ups, I just distanced. But I never totally cut contact. When things got rough, I'd just end the call or the visit. No regrets.
13
My father married a sweet, modest
woman whom he had dated for five
years during high school and college.
He was a handsome athlete. She was popular among her friends and
had several other suitors.
I have strong evidence that my
father was gay—he had a male “friend of the family” from 1967 until his death in 1994. He acquired this
friend after the death of my mother’s
mother, who was a strong and good
influence in the family. Our family
slowly crashed and burned as my
father’s attentions were drawn
elsewhere and my mother spiraled
into denial and depression. I found
my way into a very good life with
my husband of 32 years, though I
struggled for many years with
depression and substance abuse.
My father hated and feared women
and he made my mother’s life hell.
But she was twisted around in that
partnership until she no longer knew
how to live an honest life. Together
they made my younger sister into
the “home child”; she’s never had
a life of her own.
None of my siblings acknowledge the
truth about our father. But I’ve long
taken solace in books about families
like mine—Honor Moore’s “The Bishop’s Daughter”, Susan Berman’s
“Anonymous”, Alison Bechtel’s “Fun
Home”, and Susan Cheever’s “Home
before Dark”.
I separated myself from their lives
in the mid-eighties, though I tried to
help my sister. It never worked out.
I got help from an excellent family
therapist, who wanted me to reconcile with my family, but I felt
strongly that that path wasn’t right
for me.
37
This comments section is like group therapy, and very painful for me. My emotional experiences reading the comments -- putting me back where I was before I released them -- are pretty much confirming to me that my backing out of any relationship with my mother and sister is the best thing I could do for myself.
Reconstucting -- or constructing -- myself outside of those relationships, which were extremely demeaning for me and entertaining for them, is still hard work. But I don't feel anymore like I'm living with a wet finger in an electrical socket.
48
I am well aware of the type of circumstance so many commenters are talking about. I too have a close relative with a personality disorder who is "toxic"; even after many years of work, it is clear nothing will improve. On the other hand, my wife became totally disabled many years ago due to an injury that was entirely not her fault, and since that time she has not only been disabled but has lived in terrible physical pain. We also have an adult child who has some significant disabilities. In the end I had to give up my professional career in order to be a caregiver, as no one on either side of our families has been willing to help significantly, leaving us impoverished. As a matter of fact, my wife's family of origin cut off all contact with her (which continues through the present) when she was no longer able to accommodate their requests to "keep our troubles to ourselves". This rejection has probably been the most painful part of our experience, especially for my wife, who loved her family very much and thought they loved her. She has asked them why they have rejected her, and also suggested a number of times that they try to work out their problems, even with a therapist, but her family has basically said nothing except "we shouldnt have to respond to this - we shouldn't have to experience the stress".
Shouldn't there be some responsibility for others' feelings in a loving relationship? This experience is destroying us.
33
I think there is a difference between leaving a family relationship that is, over a long period of time, destructive and irreconcilable - and abandoning a family member in need. That distinction can be a very fine line when the family relationship is with a mentally ill family member.
I wouldn't call what you describe with your wife's family estrangement as much as abandonment.
What a challenging time for her. Peace to you both.
26
I can certainly understand that your situation is destroying you. Unfortunately, it is all too common. The heart break and hurt are immense when loved ones turn their backs on the sick and disabled. Have been there...and have realized the people who were there for me were often the folks who had their own health issues or were simply compassionate and caring people. And we supported each other when our families turned a blind eye. Health issues and disability often make one humble and more compassionate and empathetic. To have a healthy and sustainable society empathy and compassion need to be cultivated and something to aspire to rather than fame and fortune and more devices to stare into.
11
I have seen such abandonment taking place and only hope that in my own life I can put into practice greater awareness and acceptance. With every sick person and illness we can choose to remain connected and give comfort and compassionate care. It can mean so much to be present for those needing love and comfort. Sending out a prayer for all of us to become our best selves.
I'm fairly sure my mother has no idea we're estranged--she probably thinks we are closer, because I realized the best way to handle her was to agree with whatever she said and praise her. I live oceans away from her--she is old, and I, at sixty, am not young. I feel much better now that I've gotten over the notion, forced on me by a psychoanalyst, that my mother is someone I "have" to be close to. Trying to get close to her drove me nuts, made me very unhappy, and got in the way of relationships that mean everything to me now. Estrangement isn't always severance--I don't have to see her and I may still inherit something, so I'm nice to her over the phone and send her presents.
http://www.thecriicalmom.blogspot.com
13
If you don’t want her, you should not be taking an inheritance.
5
I can understand the inheritance carrot as being a payback for the unhappy and silent tolerance you have provided your mother.
To those who disagree that she should not hold out/sell out for the inheritance, I also understand that thought process. But maybe the inheritance is a lot of money that would insure this person's family security or education for her children or assistance for others. OR, it could be just a piece of furniture that belonged to a grandmother she loved very much.
9
One word: reparations.
9
This is a complex subject that becomes more painful to read and think about during this time of year of so-called happy family gatherings. I have so many unanswered questions about my family—unanswered because my parents are gone. I never understood what it was exactly that was wrong with us, why my father's parents and siblings never visited us. Why I never met my mother's aunts and cousins who lived 10 minutes away. Did we smell bad, were we thieves, did we have offensive political leanings? Unfortunately, my brothers and I all learned this behavior too, and the estrangement between us continues. For me, it became too painful to try and rectify the relationships and I decided to just concentrate on my life. But I have no family to speak of, other than my husband.
22
It is unfortunate that the treatment of the subject tends to assume the maturity of children involved in these situations. Yes, thank you for the quote above from King Lear, "“How sharper than a serpent’s tooth it is to have a thankless child.”
I have been in a situation with an elderly parent who was falsely accused behind his back based on false recovered memories. It took me 25 years to understand what I had done. I am sorry beyond words.
27
In all the comments that I've read so far, this one from SC stands out - a writer taking some responsibility for their part in the breakdown of communication.
During the unhappy periods of my youth, I looked for ways to explain my distress by blaming my parents. Though many people make a wise choice to separate from toxic families, that was not my situation. I had to learn to take responsibility for my own quirks and challenges. When I did, my perception of my parents changed. They aren't perfect. They are *people*. My distress about their failings came from my own fear that I would never be ok.
Some people separate from parents who are mentally ill, but some of us want distance because we ourselves are suffering from our own mental health challenges. We want to believe that our depression, anxiety or despair are someone's fault, or that perfect parents would have been able to save us from our suffering.
Thanks, SC, for speaking to something so very difficult: admitting the hurt that we cause.
6
Thank you both for having the courage to admit your truths in a comment section like this that seems almost completely dominated by those who seem to me very immaturely oblivious to any pain but their own.
2
"immaturely oblivious to any pain but their own." Ironically, I think that's the first time among your numerous comments here that you yourself have even mentioned anyone else's pain!
3
I'm very glad to have read this article. Finally, we admit that estranged families are not are. I think the problem is universal. I have a dysfunctional family in Hong Kong. My sister does not talk to my mother. No one in our family talks to my oldest brother. I don't talk to my brother No. 2 and vice versa. My aunts number 9 and number 11 in California don't talk to each other. The reasons are obviously complex. I think that a kind of "power struggle" is one reason behind such hostility.
26
Validation from a family setting. Most people are not equipped these days to OFFER it. Instead they seek it for themselves elsewhere.
This makes me shudder, and I do all I can make amends and stay in touch and forgive and accept forgiveness and also to be careful what I say and do. People have their preferences, their own ways of marrying and parenting. Hands off, but trying to balance with loving interest. It is a process.
10
FORGIVENESS will take that burden off your heart and make it lighter. Once I did it...I feel sooooo great. A hundred pounds lighter.
5
Parents who raised their children with genuine love and care do not have children who abuse or abandon them.
You get out what you put in.
My mother caused infinite hurt to me, yet her friends saw her as a wonderful woman. That she died after unspeakable suffering because of a series of medical mistakes and failures made it particularly difficult to come to terms with her death.
As a believer in God and a plane beyond this one, it has been helpful to me to realize that she knows the truth, in the cosmic and karmic sense, of what she couldn't see in life, and that there*s no need for me to hold onto bitterness. The past can*t be rectified, but who she is in eternity isn't who she was in life. The entire year after her death was dreadful for me, but by the time of its first anniversary, I had the strong feeling that she was at peace, and I could be too.
Any child--no matter how old--struggles to make any sense of a parent*s cruelties and failures. But you are responsible only for not continuing a legacy of pain and failure. You needn't strive to find answers where there can be none. You just need to keep yourself from acting wrongly towards anyone. Their interpretations or assumptions are not your responsibility.
49
I absolutely disagree that “parents who raised their children with genuine love and care do not have children who abuse or abandon them.” This notion is precisely why so many parents suffer in silence and can never admit to having an estranged child. After much research on this topic I am convinced that many adult children today are so self-centered that any relationship that doesn’t meet their immediate needs or invades their “boundaries” is easily abandoned. There are thousands of loving, devoted parents who are verbally abused by their adult children or given the complete silent treatment. Often the parents are given no reason for this cruelty and must suffer estrangement from children and grandchildren without ever knowing why. After a lifetime of dedication, love and sacrifice it’s unspeakably sad to face the end of life without your child. Please do not add to the pain, guilt and shame that estranged parents feel by blaming them for the cruel actions of their children.
6
Apparently from your comment, "Parents who raised their children with genuine love and care do not have children who abuse or abandon them",
you have never familiarized yourself with any of the research on identical twins raised in the same family by the same parents.
The belief that parenting is anything more than only a very small percentage of who an adult child actually ultimately chooses to become is the biggest myth of all that needs to finally be debunked in order for humans to begin to be able to stop passing on "a legacy of pain and failure."
1
I'm sorry, Julie, but in my lifetime*s experience, outsiders to a family can never know the truth of that purported *dedication, love and sacrifice.*
Monstrous uncaring children are not changelings. Something made them what they are.
My mother was perceived by friends and neighbors as a wonderful, loving, generous, caring person. People who *knew* her thought me to be, at times, a wretched ungrateful child of such a *good* mother. The truth was far different, and many adult children face what you in your comment hurl at them.
People rewrite history to excise what is too painful to look at. My mother would often talk about the wonderful relationship other mothers had with their daughters as though it was some baffling mystery that we had something else.
3
My mother is 93. My other siblings are still enmeshed with her and her toxicity. She's been a rabid anti-Semite since earliest childhood. She's caught up in the Fox News delusion, loves Hannity, etc. etc. She's an extreme rightwing Christian and still sends $20.00 a month to Pat Robertson. When she and the rest of my family voted for Trump, meaning she went against all the values she had taught me, I was done. I'm in touch with my two sisters, who are struggling but my gun nut brothers and their rightwing hostility is more than I can bear.
I will always love and respect her as my mother but I cannot endure being in relationship or take calls where she pours poison into the answering machine. All this has been instructive to me. I find joy in the moment, care for my loving, wonderful husband who has Parkinson's, take him to the PD gym 3-4 times a week. He's given me more unconditional love and joy than my mother. Life is good.
53
My situation is similar but different and I would love to have a group where we could share stories or see more articles that cover estrangement from this point of view (racism, homophobia, politics, etc).
15
Yes, this article is not the be-all end-all on this topic and the omission of substance and sexual abuse is glaring. Still! what a gift to de-bunk a few myths that create so much painful shame for those of us on either end of an estrangement. Thanks for writing and publishing. It's impossible to imagine how deeply one questions oneself when a sibling cuts off contact with or without explanation. The latter being worse. My dad lived long enough to overcome some of his narcissistic denial of his mix of cruelty and kindness. I do think we are all part ass, part angel and, if we recognize that, less estrangement is possible. But there is good judgment and relief in a therapeutic separation. God bless us all as we do the best we can to choose wisely and love well ...
20
I would have liked this article to mention Parental Alienation Syndrome (PAS) - an unfortunate and all too pervasive result of high-conflict divorces. It needs more public awareness. I am an alienated parent and have not seen my 19 and 22 year children - the true victims of PAS -- in nearly 4 years. For those readers who have been cut off from their children, this article is a helpful start to understanding the highly complex and disturbing dynamics at work here.
http://www.majorfamilyservices.com/parental-alienation-syndrome-pas-its-...
12
Steve is correct that parental alienation among children should have been mentioned as one of the causes of "estrangement" later in life. Of course, all the causes of estrangement are unfortunate and many of them are preventable or correctable.
9
Thank you so very much for posting this! It's the first I've heard of Parental Alienation Syndrome (PAS). My 29-year-old daughter has struggled with keeping her father and I in her life at the same time. I was a single mom since she was two, when her dad left to "find himself". For 15 years, she didn't want to see him much, for the most part, but the court order forced visitation. When I remarried when she was 15, her step-father was emotionally abusive to both of us, and my daughter has not forgiven me for getting us into such a toxic situation. I can't blame her. Now she mostly only sees her father. And it's heart breaking, and I take responsibility for not getting us out of such a toxic situation. I kept thinking it would get better with counseling with her step-dad. But it did not. And she moved out at 17.5 which is the best thing she could have done for herself. So at least she was able to make healthy choices for herself.
10
It's been 15 years since my younger sister cut off all communication with us after her father died. To this day, I have no idea why. She was always very money oriented and was angry that the estate left by my parents to us was split evenly in half and for some reason I guess she thought that she deserved more. She fought us in court for four years, and we finally had to give her money to make her stop. It saddens me that she took her son and two daughters out of our lives. I have continued to send the now-grown children birthday cards and holiday cards every year, with no response back. I can't imagine what terrible things she said about me, and everyone assures me I've done what I can. I have found this is not uncommon, however said that it is and how disappointed my parents would be that she did this. it is her choice, and perhaps someday she'll reach out. My friends and family say I am wasting postage and paper and breaking my own heart by continuing to send cards to her kids, but it's the least I can do. I suppose, as I've been told, if I stopped, they might think I had died and then try to contact my husband to see what they might've benefitted from my death. How cynical as that. I hope for better things to happen in the future.
16
After having my children I decided to remove myself from the lives of several siblings. Their incessant negativity and substance abuse and ugliness was something I wanted to spare my children from. I had had enough. Why subject my own children to the psycho-drama that my siblings thrived upon and tortured me with? Back away from those who may do more harm than good.
26
I do estrangement lite with my family. I minimise contact and information flows so that there is very little that they can torment me with. All this is on a continuum and simply relative. When I had more trust in my parents and family, I disclosed more info about myself...... only for it to be used against me. I used to introduce my family to my friends and accept people they introduced me to as friends. Some people that I had mentioned this to thought I was crazy. So some people naturally practice estrangement lite with their families. It's nothing new.
I stopped being so open with my family when i realised that my family was triangulating me with my social circles, actively using a couple of them to spy on me. Ever had a conversation repeated back to you verbatim?
I would ask them to stop-- as most therapists would suggest with that "open, honest" approach - and I would get rather profane responses along the lines of "we'll be friends with whomever the he!! we want......" So I tried.
I know they will never apologise to me. But their behavior and expectations towards me have changed in exactly the way I have wanted.
21
Peregrine: what a fabulous term "estrangement lite". I didn't realize that's precisely what I have practiced for many years and how well it has worked.
12
I was disappointed to see that this article focused exclusively on parent/child estrangement. I think of much more relevance today is the phenomenon of estrangement between other family entities, such as adult siblings. I am estranged from three siblings because they are racist and fascist and it all came to a head in their support of Donald Trump. Who I am is a function of my values and they violated my values egregiously and grotesquely. After a lifetime of trying to "understand" them, I concluded that I was giving aid and comfort to people who are perfectly OK with destroying America and the rule of law, all to indulge their racist, homophobic right wing tribalism. they became so toxic I was literally becoming sick with the effort to maintain relationships with them, and believe me, I am no "snowflake". I lopped them off like gangrenous limbs. Since I am the only one who tried to maintain relationships with all the other siblings, some of whom have not communicated to others in years, they paid a big price for their disgusting predilections. I told them I would reconsider if they apologized for their disgusting racist behavior (bertherism, etc.) I am not holding my breath. No adult is entitled to unlimited amounts of unconditional positive regard. When someone shows you who they really are, believe them. I did and acted on it. I am at peace with myself - they are not.
51
One thing I didn’t expect when I finally broke off contact with my father 22 years ago was how many relationships would be collateral damage. Formally cutting off contact was the best decision of my life - there was literally nothing positive in our relationship. But the number of friends and family who assumed that I was acting out of thoughtless immaturity and punished, ostracised me or tried to force reunions was heartbreaking, because I’d never expected them to force me to choose between my well-being and their good opinion. Had my father been a partner, they would never have condemned me to a situation so deeply toxic without even asking me what had caused me to break things off. So, it’s good to see some coverage of estrangement as an issue. And to friends/family of people who are estranged, please just be generous-spirited and thank your lucky stars if your parents are loving and kind.
62
Thank you for your comment, this hit home for me. This year marks 10 years since my estrangement from my father, and its hard for many people to understand without having to share deeply personal stories of abuse.
8
My mother died of alcoholism when she was forty-eight and I was fifteen. I was happy, as we all were out of our misery. I left home a year later, after years of alcohol-induced abuse by my father. I had no plans to return home, nor maintain any contact with him. But some years later, as he was dying, I did reconnect and we had the conversations we both needed.
I have usually had a civil relationship with my lone sibling, a sister six years older than I. She took good care of me when our parents were falling apart and I am very grateful for that. However, as adults we never discuss anything beyond the superficial. She's made up some story to tell her husband about how our mother died, and we've led very different lives. I feel quite estranged from her as she yaks on and on about nothing of substance, just to fill space and time. It's the body, now aged, of someone who's been present throughout my life, but completely unapproachable, distant, a relationship lacking any substance beyond a shared history that she is incapable of discussing. I feel invisible in her presence, her life a mystery to me, an impenetrable veneer. It was easier to watch my mother's death than it is to witness my sister's life. Our relationship dwindles on, without resolution, nothing more that some abstract genetic bond: not estrangement, but something worse.
35
I am sorry for all the losses in your life. May you be enveloped in love from those outside your family of origin.
27
Thank you Barbara. Indeed, my life has been filled with many great people whom I consider family. I'm also blessed with a wonderful life partner and two kids who love nothing more than to come home from college. My riches far exceed my losses.
3
When you're someone else's kid, you're never part of the family.
14
I dubbed my brothers and sisters-in-laws the Out Laws because they will never be good enough for my mother.
5
The following never ceases to amaze me:
A license is needed to catch a fish.
A license is needed to drive a car.
A license is needed to get married.
But any fool with working reproductive organs can have a child.
41
Yep, males do this all the time, don't they?
7
50% of pregnancies are unplanned. Best if we stop making babies in such huge numbers. "The population explosion is everyone's 'baby'.
8
Free vasectomies for men who don't want responsibility of children.
10
Thank you for this timely article. Judging from the comments, there's a lot more to be researched and said on this topic which is seminally relevant to every one of us and I hope to find additional future coverage in the NYT.
As one commenter's psychologist noted all children do love their parents but the converse does not necessarily follow. In the first case I think it's a condition of Nature and survival while the second is more complex. Some parents may not not know how to raise their children with love; even in the animal kingdom we find parents who literally eat their offspring.
Unfortunately estrangement does not always and completely resolve the situation. Many of us have internalized our parents and even their death doesn't sever all aspects of the bond or bondage. I don't know that we ever stop wishing for the love of our parents.
23
Ms. Louis – Your article’s justifications of separation from toxic parents sound reasonable. But what about loss of contact with a sibling because he is unbalanced? Mine took on our mother’s low self-esteem and speaks through her harshly judgmental, demeaning voice. He projected onto me his rejection of her (it’s safer), and his physician told him that if communication with me upset him, then just cease contact. I suggest you next address unjustified estrangement and the ensuing profound sadness one feels for this loss.
11
Yes, there is real loss and grief and we often grieve alone since frequently other people in our circle wouldn't understand.
6
Families are a hit and miss proposition. Blood kin notwithstanding, sometimes you just have to call it quits even if for the simple reason you don't want to put up with it anymore. On a similar note what's worse than no relationship? A BAD ONE. FIX IT OR WALK OUT OF IT.
26
The article skips the mention of the difference between estrangement and healthy individuation.
The term adult children is an oxymoron. Our children become adults. It’s a rough road when they do this and both the young adult and former parent need to find a new relationship. I believe the same is true for siblings. Siblings as children and as adults are completely different. They need to make that new relationship. I think all involved have some amount of grieving for the former relationship. In the absence of recognizing this change in the family dynamic, there is bound to be hurt and anger. I believe that could cause estrangement.
16
I have distanced myself from my parents even though the process took decades, and will continue to be a process. I grew up in a cult, was swapped between homes, abused in a boarding school, and when I was home everything was complete dysfunction and chaos. Cults enable people to be self-absorbed. Yes that sound like anathema to the idea that they should demonstrate total devotion to the cause or leader. But this total devotion requires cutting off a big part of oneself and one's capacity for empathy. Self-absorption becomes a very effective mechanism. Personality-wise, both my parents are sharp, combative people always looking for a conflict. Because of this I have never officially called our relationship estrangement, as it might ignite a major flame-war.
The moment before estrangement is such an uncomfortable barter. We know the hurt, but we mightn't be fully aware of the devastations of it. My therapist said to think of it as an empty well. Why do we keep going back to fill our cups when we have gone to it so many times and it has been dry? And then, once we gain awareness to this cycle, how do we find a full, fresh well? You love yourself, you nurture yourself and you do things for yourself that are soothing. For me, that's spending most holidays at home with just my partner, my pets, a lovely meal, a fun movie and a delicious pie.
22
I also grew up in a cult and am now estranged from my parents. You are not alone. I have found great comfort in letting go of traditional ideas of family in favor of “chosen family,” friends who love me unconditionally in a way that my family won’t or can’t.
11
I tell anyone who will listen that I have both an ex-wife AND an ex-daughter! Long story short-my ex-wife turned my daughter against me starting when my daughter was about 10 years old(she is now 31) by telling her I was not a "good provider" I worked for 32 years as a civil servant but obviously my salary was never enough to pay for all my daughter's college expenses plus continue to pay our mortgage and all the other ordinary and necessary living expenses. My ex-wife never worked full time and only paid for her and my daughter's personal expenses not for any of our living expenses! So my daughter told my wife that they did not need me because I could not be their "provider"! I was divorced in 2010 still paid for a substantial portion of my daughter's college tuition but she had to take out student loans like almost every other college student. Today she is a successful lawyer who earns over $100,000 per year but has not contacted me in over 10 years although I have reached out to her numerous times by phone,e-mail,etc to no avail. She and my ex-wife won't even give me their current addresses. Apparently they think I would harm them, nothing could be further from the truth! My daughter is obviously "punishing me for perceived wrongdoing"! The wrongdoing is that I was never. and still am not, a millionaire who was able to pay for all of her college and law school expenses. I have given up on trying to contact her and call her my ex-daughter. She knows where to find me!
14
I'm sad for you, PM, and I do understand. Author Pat Conroy experienced similar sorrow, but daughter reconciled not long before Pat's death.
11
This treatment of such an old circumstance, leaves out too many reasons and situations for estrangement. But the slant of the article is entirely on the fault of the family of origin, excluding individual genetics, individual choice. There is the Prodigal Son decision, but how about one who never makes it home; and of course Shakespeare’s observation, (Act 1, Scene 4, King Lear): "How sharper than a serpent's tooth it is to have a thankless child!" Not to mention drug users and adult onset mental illness. No home abuse is necessary for the outcome of an adult child who neglects to stay in contact with his or her parents.
18
I guess I don't get it. Unless the parent is or was abusive, why not just create boundaries, stay in touch, but don't hang out for long periods? My alcoholic dad put me through the wringer as an adult, but we're still friendly. I've stuck to my boundaries and he seems to get that. I'm so glad to have him in my life, and I know he's grateful to have me.
13
In some cases, like mine, every boundary created an argument from the parent that I no longer have contact with. For adults dealing with parents who have personality disorders, establishing & maintaining healthy boundaries is perceived as a declaration of deep personal insult instead of simply a statement of our own individuality. There's no logic in discussing/arguing with the parent. I am truly happy for you that you get to have your relationship with your dad.
28
That's how I reconnected to my alcoholic, abusive father before he died: as an accomplished adult, self-supporting since age sixteen, our meetings predicated on the strict condition that he not have had any drink in the previous twenty-four hours, and that he behave civilly. If he failed to meet any of these conditions, I'd leave.
Not everyone has such options.
11
I never post, but your comment struck such a nerve. That's great that you feel you can or want to have your father in your life, but that's you and your story. That's not everyone's story. You don't have to understand why people need more than just boundaries to be able to get on with their lives, but it's disappointing to hear what sounds like judgement in your post. If people feel like they can't have their parents/siblings/whoever in their lives, that is their decision. I can't imagine any of us who choose to be estranged do so with our eyes closed. It comes with pain and loss. But we must. Having part of society not judge this decision or question it will be a huge, and welcome step forward for those who didn't win the lottery growing up.
31
Like most things the apple or apples never fall too far from the parent trees. Most estrangement germinates through your parents who dictate whether or not you can have a close knit familial relationship or not so. Of course their are other dynamics that come into play, but the role your parents play cannot be ignored.
11
The bitterness and implacable feeling of being entitled to being aggrieved is one thing that can keep people unreconciled. My sister and brother made up after a fight and two months later seemingly unforgivable things were said. Old jealousies and resentments from childhood can rear their ugly heads. I love them both and will stay in relationship with both but we never speak of this entrenched chasm between them. Their adults, it's not up to me to judge or try to fix it. That would be meddling.
1
Some families become estranged due to religious reasons, that is, when one family member decides to abandon their faith as they may no longer believe in the tenets they once held sacred and dear. This happens most notably amongst Jehovah's Witnesses, Scientologists, Amish/Anabaptists, Baha'is. It is a rather painful practice but some "shunees" welcome this so they can distance themselves from a toxic, high control religious community
20
Scientology is a cult, in part defined as such because their practice is to forcibly keep family members from any association with any family member that quits the church. It should NEVER be confused with a religion of the book - it was a money making scheme devised by a science fiction writer, so please don't confuse it with a faith based religion.
5
Your omission of history of sexual abuse leading to estrangement is puzzling.
17
...then they might have to address male violence, and we mustn't talk about that.
2
"Your adult children are like strangers you meet on the street. You may develop a friendship with them, and you may not". Sage advice given to me years ago.
22
Blood is thicker than water. That is what we are taught to believe from an early age. So many people keep believing this and it can lead to an unhappy life where your blood relatives gets passes for bad behavior that you wouldn't accept from a friend or acquaintance. Where is the sense in that? Don't ever doubt your decision to become estranged from "Family". We don't get to choose our blood relatives and shouldn't ever feel guilty in choosing not be around someone that is toxic, or narcissistic or just plain rotten. Life is a beautiful thing. Choose happiness in all cases and live life for you! No apologies.
40
And then there's the, I suspect, very common estrangement today: families divided by the political situation. In my case, my completely abhorrent views of the president and all he represents, and the opposite view by many family members. His mocking of the disabled was enough for me and that seems like eons ago. For my brother and his family to let that and so much more just slide away has created in me a complete lack of respect for them. So, now we're estranged.
43
Me too. I have divested myself of a sister-in-law and her husband because Trumpism brought out their sexism and racism and greed and, frankly, stupidity. I miss them, sort of, but don't want to be around them. Did send a Christmas card.
30
Christopher Dickey, son of James, in his memoir: "Patience, forbearance, and forgiveness are the price of love within a family." And better we love the child/parent we have than yearn for the child/parent we wish we had. Certainly in extreme cases of substance abuse and violent behavior, a family member should not be allowed to disrupt a family gathering. But even here, a Christmas card, a birthday card, a phone message saying "I love you" or "We miss you" is warranted, in recognition of the family tie.
8
You mean a card like, "Hi, Dad -- Miss you raping me"? Hallmark was fresh out of those.
45
I have experience with this from two perspectives. As an ordained Lutheran pastor working in the parish for over 20 yrs I can tell you this "estrangement" is not uncommon, what is common is the simplistic, clique that father/mother, sister/brother relationships are overwhelmingly close, happy, and supportive. I've been with hundreds of families going through the family trauma of sickness, tragic accidents, and both timely and untimely deaths. Families are never, never, simple. Some fragment, some pull together, some can share their feelings, some can't. Some seem healthy until there is a mediator in the room who gives them a safe place for honesty, some use their rage at their parents to soldier through the crisis and some, when the parents are gone, displace their rage and hurt on a sibling. Some parents and siblings deserve rage. Even the most healthy families struggle not to deconstruct in a crisis. So I feel this report is based on a fallacy, that most families do not struggle with estrangement of some kind with some member at least in the midst of crisis, if not everyday.
We hurt each other, in big and little ways. We don't communicate honestly because we fear rejection, a slap, or a misunderstanding. We feel used, we use, we try to hold things together, we let things fall apart. And many parents have no skills, except what happened to them. Good lord, it's a wonder any of us stay connected.
75
So beautifully and wisely said, Sheri.
I believe we need so much help understanding our hurts, conflicts with family, and, as you put it poignantly, "many parents have no skills, except what happened to them." I wonder what the church offers to so many suffering souls?
And how do these realities affect your faith?
Thank you for your spot-on response to the article.
5
I wish there were a followup to figure out how to un-estrange. I have a family situation where two camps have drawn lines in the sand that neither will cross. The basis - I believe - is a power struggle, both sides believing that they are the victims and the other side is the 'bad guy'. Mediation might be helpful, but one group clearly refuses that option, so what happens next?
9
Chicagogirl13, I recommend two books, 'Getting to Yes With Yourself' and Arun Gandhi's 'The Gift of Anger'.
1
Maybe we should add parenting skills in the school curriculum. SAD
14
There is a Jewish traditional concept, “Mischbucha” that means one’s entire web of family relations, sometimes even including special non-related friends, who are “more like family than family.” In the Hispanic culture, where I worked as a civil servant for years, I saw the same process at work- families would socially adopt outsiders who had proven to be ,just by their human nature , “more like family than Family.”
I’vewitnessed this sort of Mischbucha in many groupings: in business environments, where a member of one department becomes accepted like a member of another department with which their job connects, but to the extent where they’re regarded as “Family.” While in the Army, forty years ago, I saw Mischbucha extend across and through many military families, and with especially rich and loving bonds that last for even generations.
Family has been culturally defined by and proven by blood, alone. This had satisfied the nature of much earlier tribal societies. In today’s and tomorrow’s world, especially living in a McLuhan-ish electronically meadiated Global Village, our “true,” if not biological Family can be one of our own choosing. In that world biological estrangement is not a tragedy- it’s therapy.
25
There's the term 'families of choice', people who will be there for us no matter what. I would have survived without the 'kindness of strangers' as Blance DuBois in "The Glass Menagerie" put it. My family taught me never to go to or rely on someone outside the family. I found just the reverse: kindness and loving concern. What a blessing.
11
Mishpocha. Not mischbucha. I’m just saying.
That is not what’s meant by that line in the play. At all.
Gosh. I hope the people who felt that you had to cut off from parents or siblings, get some therapy lest they repeat the toxic patterns they unwittingly learned in their childhoods. peace to all.
7
I did get therapy, and that’s what let me make the decision I didn’t need to continue a relationship with a narcissistic and abusive father. While I agree therapy can help people not repeat toxic patterns, part of that can be removing the toxic people from your life.
8
Definitely agree.
1
This article is woefully inadequate in summarizing the complexity of estrangement. The psychiatric literature provides multiple studies, opinions, perspectives, and professionals who have spent years of investigating this issue. It is so disappointing to read such an incomplete and thoughtless article in the NYTimes, especially at the height of the holiday season when so many estranged people are seeking comfort.
29
You are witnessing what Michael Crichton called the Gell-Mann Amnesia effect:
“Briefly stated, the Gell-Mann Amnesia effect works as follows. You open the newspaper to an article on some subject you know well...You read the article and see the journalist has absolutely no understanding of either the facts or the issues...In any case, you read with exasperation or amusement the multiple errors in a story-and then turn the page to national or international affairs, and read with renewed interest as if the rest of the newspaper was somehow more accurate about far-off Palestine than it was about the story you just read. You turn the page, and forget what you know.”
Anyone reading the news for information rather than entertainment is wasting their time.
10
Just because you disagree doesn't mean you get to dismiss the whole newspaper globally. The NYTimes and WaPo are lifelines for many of us as Trumpism turns our country toward a vile and inhuman form of 'governance. Speak for yourself only. These days we must get our news from many sources and winnow the truth out by discernment. But still our mainline newspapers are serving the nation well in a time of Fox and a despicable president who lies constantly.
25
Do you mean Michael Crichton the writer of "science fiction, thriller, and medical fiction genres?"
Where do you get your information?
5
It's the sense of betrayal that's the worst. You believe that because they're your parents they're there for you. You forgive them time and time again. And try harder to get a caring response that never comes. You're the over achiever that has never asked for anything but emotional support, and it's just too much to ask. People think you're crazy because on the surface you had everything you could possibly need growing up. But dig a little deeper and it's a veneer. There's no substance. Superficially everything appears as it should but really you're on a ledge and there's no one to help if you lose your balance for a second.
52
The title should be revised to add "among individuals of Western European descent". The myths might not be so for people from collectivistic cultures (ever heard of Latin America?).
8
I am first-born in the USA from collectivistic and extremely familistic cultures on both sides. The stories I could tell you of webs of estrangement going back decades and across generations....... These are not myths, these are matters of personal honor for which reconciliation is utterly out of the question.
12
Read about the blood feuds of Albania. Estrangement is not uniquely western.
6
Look at the situation when a family member is jealous of you and has it in for you no reason and just attacks you out of nowhere. How does one deal with these types of situations?
Also, facebook has been even admitted by some of its founders to tear societies apart. It's a shame when some family members use facebook to create divides and exacerbate them. There is the bible verse in Proverbs which says that God hates when persons try to spread division among brethren.
9
Forgive 'em. That's what Jesus said. Hard to do, yes. Doable? At this time not for me.
4
Jesus also said that nobody could follow him who didn't hate their own mother and father. Complex man, Jesus.
1
Our best of intentions to carry forward a relationship sometimes fails as the close relative does not respond positively.
A sense of anguish and helplessness follows.This results in an guilty feeling that all this effort for a harmonious relationship was a futile exercise in wasted time & effort.
Once the feeling of being unwanted sets in then that results in an gradual withdrawal which is Estrangement.
We carry life long feelings of Guilt,loneliness & dejection at the strange turn of events in our lives.
Probably,our souls do not vibe with theirs.
7
After one particularly awful Christmas, where I was publicly shunned (I had dared to remain single and follow a career) while my two siblings were presented with expensive gifts as rewards for following the traditional life pattern, I simply stopped visiting the family at Christmas. For 30 years. Not once did they ask why.
41
I had a great Christmas this year - the first since the estrangement a few years ago. It has crossed my mind - you know, those "holidays" of the past... dour, soulless events which often erupted into a very dark version of Seinfeld's "Festivus." ;) It's kind of nice not to have to pretend to like people who really aren't good people or fret about the obligation of spending time with those who raise your blood pressure. And by the way - any third party who judges me (or you, or anyone who has had to estrange) is not worth maintaining contact with either. It bothered me a little at first - the mass un-friending on Facebook by those who heard one side of the story, but I look at it this way: "Well, the weeding out took care of itself." Estranging from some families is a bit like leaving the "mean girls" clique and it's absolutely amazing to observe adults acting like petty bullying children, but that's ironically one of the reasons for leaving after all.
24
Seems you simply stood up for a better you. Sorry they were unable to see that
5
The older I get the more it seems life is all about avoiding the Mean Girls and their webs of toxicity. Still not always easy.
5
Our cultural myths about motherhood (that all women are nurturing, that mothering is instinctual, that all mothers are loving) are the bedrock on which the myths about estrangement rest. The culture puts the adult child who initiates a cut-off or goes "low contact" on trial. and labels him or her an ingrate, disrespectful, or impulsive. Over the the last decade, I have interviewed hundreds of women for two books and the decision to divorce an unloving or toxic parent usually takes many years, even decades. Estrangement is a last ditch effort to stop the pain of abusive or neglectful parental behavior and to reclaim the self damaged in childhood. That's the subject of my new book, DAUGHTER DETOX: RECOVERING FROM AN UNLOVING MOTHER AND RECLAIMING YOUR LIFE.
21
Might it not be more healthy and actually honest to teach your ADULT CHILDREN followers the fine art of differentiation so they can perhaps finally figure out how to step up to the adult position and claim their individuality, rather than wasting all those years ruminating on what they missed out on in childhood only to end up making a "last ditch effort" to preserve their perpetual adolescence?
"The goal of differentiation is to avoid emotional cut-off but also stay away from inappropriate emotional connection while remaining in acceptance in a group." ~Sarah Henderson
"Differentiation means being able to be a whole person in spite of what is going on for other people or what negative stimulus is experienced." ~Sarah Henderson
5
Anna, It may be valuable for you to assume that adults, who deal with a family situation that warrants cutting off contact, uncover their truth and try to deal with it as soon as they are able in adulthood. I find it interesting that you put all owness onto the adult child, and offer that that adult child may be the one doing all of the emotional work in the the relationship/s in their family.
Differentiation may work for some people, though I want to point out the powerful nature of family dynamics. For some, no contact is the only path to self-preservation. Trust me when I say, that once there is no-contact, it is painful, and I agree with Peg - so many people blame the adult child that it makes it nearly impossible to talk about outside of therapy.
12
No contact is painful because emotional cut-off is not a healthy or functional coping mechanism. Like it or not, no contact is a form of ostracism, and ostracism is known to cause deep and lasting pain in both the ostracized as well as the ostracizer, regardless of who is to blame. That's why trying to "normalize" it rather than honestly naming it for what it is - a dysfunction of relationship - isn't going to accomplish anything more than more of the same generation after generation. The fact that estrangement is very common does not make it normal or healthy.
But I do agree with you, the blame and shame game needs to be put to rest of both sides of the equation. The psychology profession has spent too many decades selling the myth that everything wrong with an adult child is the mothers fault. And society as a whole has spent far too much time believing the myth that parenting is anything more than a very small part of the equation of who an adult child actually ends up choosing to become. It is definitely finally time for us all to admit that certain different temperament/personality combinations have an almost impossible chance of reaching common ground, regardless of how closely they are related biologically, or which one is the parent or the child.
1
I grew up with emotionally distant parents who were strict, mean and domineering. As I got older, I kept increasingly separating myself emotionally until I felt nothing, which was fantastically cathartic. Although we live near one another, me and my wife see my parents maybe 3 times per year, for brief visits that consists of shallow niceties and surface talk. When I invited them to my wedding at the courthouse, which was about 30 miles from their home, my father responded, "We'll see if we can make it." A few days later, they were summarily disinvited.
My parents and my wife's parents have never met. I wouldn't put her parents through the discomfort. The funny thing is, my parents are so clueless and self-centered that they think they have a normal, close relationship with me.
I would never wish pain on others, but honestly it is comforting to know my circumstance is not unique.
34
Is there any data on parents that intentionally cut off communication with their child or children? I have witnessed this within my extended family where a mother used it as a weapon against her daughter when the mother's "secret" was uncovered revealing her to have been dishonest in the past. The child, in this case, had no desire to "shame" the mother and only wanted to have a discussion about why the mother did not feel comfortable sharing with the daughter information that was relatively mundane.
6
No there isn't any data on the situation you mention in the review of the literature this article claims has debunked certain so-called myths about estrangement. In fact, the data this particular author is depending on to lead the reader to jump to the conclusion that these so-called myths have been or are being debunked is severely limited and skewed. You can read the full research article for yourself below.
"We therefore know little about the estrangement of mothers, fathers, sons, and daughters who lack genetic relationships with one another or shared histories and childhoods (e.g., stepfamilies, adoptive families, families created by assisted reproduction). We also know little from the perspective of parents who have voluntarily or intentionally cut contact with a child, or of sons and daughters whose parents have intentionally or voluntarily cut contact with them.
There is also a lack of diversity in the estrangement literature in terms of gender, race, and ethnicity. The studies described in this review have mostly drawn on samples of women; we know little about fathers' or sons' experiences of estrangement." http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jftr.12216/full
4
I gave up trying to have a relationship with my immediate family. My mother passed in my early twenties and I have not spoken with my father in years. My mother, who passed when I was young, suffered from alcoholism when I was young and I always had to babysit. We were not close. In high school, I worked hard and went away to college. I wanted to be young and free from responsibilities that were not mine.
I haven’t spoken to my dad in years. I spent years seeking his approval trying to get him to like me. He got drunk and missed my wedding due to a hangover. When I earned my doctorate, he could not bring himself to say anything about my accomplishment. He said no one taught him how to be a father, but early on he made a decision not to get to know me as a daughter and a woman. I have moved on and am happy.
It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men." - Frederick Douglass
29
I'm 75 and have lived all my life in the shadow of 8 siblings (I'm the youngest). The only sense of estrangement I felt resulted primarily from remarks to me from relatives who were deliberately mean, critical and/or insulting. This fortunately was very, very rare, so apparently, after reading about the experiences of people in this article, I've been lucky. I still am on good terms with what is now a hugely extended family, some living miles apart, but I'm not in the least "estranged" from any of them. There are some friends however that I've recently deliberately shunned, and who have shunned me, because of their meanness or disdain, or because of their own presumably matching diagnosis regarding yours truly. My point is that with friends there are rarer opportunities to let bygones be bygones, because we are far less likely, as with families, to be brought together on such important occasions as holidays, weddings and funerals. Hence we won't be so easily "thrown together" and given the chance to practice civility and thereby possibly achieve some measure of reconciliation.
6
Reading comments from many people shows estrangement is very common.My husband's sister was estranged from him for many years.Every attempt to reconcile was futile.She had no desire to reconnect.In such a case what can be done ?It is best to move on,although future generations are affected.
2
It is important to note that the "research review" this article is supposedly reporting on is based on studies with very small samples of selective participants conducted mostly by researchers seeking to "normalize" family estrangement and therefore cannot even as a whole serve to debunk anything about estrangement.
9
I agree with Anue to a great extent, although I think it's good that someone is studying this. I just think that the study doesn't go far enough. What is the root cause of broken family dynamics? A lot of situations have narcissistic personality disorder and substance abuse (and perhaps both, frequently) as the root cause. Some people just don't mature beyond a certain point, but they can and do have children. When a parent chooses a favorite ('golden child'), he/she (or they) often also select a 'scapegoat.' The parent goads the chosen sibling(s) into being "flying monkeys" for them whenever a disagreement occurs. This accomplishes two things - one, it leaves the narcissistic parent "blameless" (by definition, narcissists cannot handle any form of criticism without rage) and secondly, it drives a wedge between the siblings so that the blame is deflected onto the scapegoat and there can be no collusion against the parent. It's often really subtle and masterfully done, and when the scapegoat tries to point out any problems or unfairness, he/she is often "gaslighted" ("You're imagining things!) and the well is already poisoned with the siblings and anyone else who has been made a flying monkey, so the scapegoat is cast in a role that he/she cannot escape without estrangement.
12
One of the best decisions I ever made was to distance myself from my family. I was able to find people who treated me properly and unfortunately, I had to start house cleaning at the source. They didn’t make the cut. My life is better for it. And fwiw - it’s been easy and I have no regrets whatsoever. They had years to act like decent people. They didn’t. Buhbye.
27
I have a similar experience. When my Mom passed, my sister was her usual, horrible self and I thiught why am I putting up with this. I cut her off and my life is so much easier without her. Only remembering her now because of the article.
10
There's a strong cultural belief that 'blood is thicker' than water; au contraire, once you leave home, you are free to choose your friends and the family members whom you wish to maintain contact. Guilt for walking away from toxic family members is a religious and human construct, i.e., destructive combination.
12
I'm an only child so estrangement isn't really an option for multiple reasons. My later life will be lonely enough. I'd rather go to therapy and preserve what I do have with my parents. That doesn't mean that everyone should take that path, but it's what works best for me.
13
I could have very easily have taken this route, but as an adult and a parent myself, I came to the slow realization that my parents were just doing the best they could. To me, accepting another person's humanity, to learn to love people where and as they are, is a true sign of maturity.
I know there are people who grapple with much worse than I did and can't get past it. I'm most sorry for those people. But I people who assign pop psyche labels for self justification, or people who blame their parents for everything... eh. They have a lot of looking in the mirror to do.
21
Blaming the 'victim', I see.
18
That’s pretty harsh! You don’t know what someone’s life is like, what they have been through. Don’t be so quick to judge!
24
Hi Katie, I have found the chance to forgive and move on to be a growth opportunity but also quite difficult. Right now I can see the need to focus on my own choices and to try and avoid what used to be called “taking someone else’s inventory.” Recently I have kept coming back to that phrase and it is one that has kept me centered on my own efforts instead of the soul-sapping process of feeling upset at the choices others make.
3
Sometimes parents repeat their own personal experience with their children. My Dad told me to leave after being expelled from the college and program he decided I should follow, "Son, I want you to have a life. Just don't have it here.", were his words to me. That was 1968. I enlisted in military after being declared 1A. I rarely went back or spoke with him because he was always angry with me while he lavished praise on my siblings. I learned later his Dad did the same to him after his first year of college. That was 1940. He enlisted before being drafted. He didn't go home until after his Dad died. I was never mentioned in his will.
13
All happy families are alike; each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way.
13
as said Tolstoy in Anna Karenina. That and this from King Lear are two of my favorite quotes about families: "Sharper than a serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child." Life is complex, and one best not make assumptions about anything.
3
Perhaps the researchers should cross reference narcissistic family dynamics, which certainly cause many estrangement situations. When a parent (or both) are narcissists, they are incapable of love or caring about anyone else's feelings, and they employ a whole slew of abusive behaviors including gaslighting, triangulating between the (adult) children, favoritizing a "golden child" and demonizing a "scapegoat", demeaning, ganging up, etc. To be the adult child of people who think and behave this way brings incredible unhappiness and can cause serious problems such as acute depression. For me, complete estrangement (and therapy) was the only solution for my own well being and that of my family (husband and children.)
29
So very true. When I was the first in the family to seek therapy, I was belittled by the entire family for being a self-centered "navel-gazer". They were not interested in my emotional state, but simply didn't want the toxic dynamic to be exposed.
19
Ravenna - there is a great YouTube channel called "Narcissism Survivor" that helped me a lot. It is a man named Tom who suffered very serious abuse as a child, and took a lot of time to really understand the narcissistic personality of his mother in order to interpret what happened to him and why. He is not a licensed therapist, but he understands this better than many mental health professionals do, IMO. I believe that his channel helped me more than my therapist did because I began to understand the behavior, label aspects of it and see the patterns. This allowed me to think about it more rationally instead of buying into the blame that was cast upon me. Nobody is perfect, but nobody deserves to be treated in this way...conditionally "loved" (but it's not really love - it's selfishness and becoming a donor for their "narcissistic supply." Do check out this channel if you have time and inclination.
5
Reading so many comments others have made, it seems that the NYT might consider a more in-depth piece on this topic. I don't think I've come across one before, Personally, I am interested because about 10-15 years back I decided to rid myself of all relationships-- a family member, a husband and a best friend-- that felt toxic. (Thankfully this did not involve my immediate family.) Maybe it was age and the realization that I want my time here to be happy, combined with more confidence. I'm not sure. I think that estrangement can be approached with some respect by communicating honestly about the reason for leaving, verbally or in writing. While the years I spent ending these relationships were so difficult, the decade since has been my happiest. I am also now very attuned to warning signs and careful about who I decide to I give my time.
13
My brother and his wife have decided to distance themselves from our parents. My father constantly tells me how this has broken his heart and none of us can figure out the root of this decision; besides blaming the wife of being controlling. They also gave two small children, my parents’ only grandchildren. As the youngest sister, without my own family, I felt responsible to try to remedy this but I cannot. After years of convincing all parties involved to go to group and family therapy, there’s no hope and it’s incredibly painful.
My strategy now is to try to get my parents to accept it and move forward but with all of their friends having relationships with their grandchildren, I don’t see how they’ll be able to move forward.
Our parents are not toxic, we had a trauma growing up and we were supported. I just don’t understand the matter of fact‘ness of this situation and how it feels like I’m watching a bad movie.
13
I don't think that any adult child who felt truly loved by their parents would ever estrange from them. Your parents have responsibility for this, but they probably also have a cover story or act as though they have no idea. Just because they weren't toxic to you does not mean that they weren't toxic to him.
25
What you think is just that...your thought. In my family, we were raised with lots of love and support. My brother for reasons best known to him followed his wife's lead (she is basically estranged from her entire family--her mother, her father, her step siblings, her aunts and uncles, her cousins...and caused many problems....she has been abusive to my mother, told my mother she longs for her death, etc.) And of course, has been pressuring my brother to sever ties for years. The way she treated my ex-wife, too, was abusive. Sometimes a person marries into a dysfunctional situation and that doesn't reflect on the person's birth family.
2
Many adult children who did and do feel truly loved by their parents do estrange from them for various reasons including religious, spouses/partners, mental illness, addiction and on and on and on... There are even some commenters to this article who describe this pheromone.
Stand Alone as mentioned in this article is a wonderful organization. It’s based in England but a great source for articles and support which for those of us dealing with estrangement need. Everyone’s story is unique to them but a common thread is feeling judged or the need to justify ( to others) an already painful situation when the inevitable response of perplexity vs understanding arises all too often. It’s somewhat comforting to know that the normalcy of estrangement is stepping out of the shadows.
7
One question some people take seriously is, 'Who am I?' So many were persuaded early on that they were were their mother's son. Works fine, possibly, up to a point. Many eventually leave parents and cleave to wife, more or less. Who honors their mother and father? Some blessed few? Those who can stand unreasonable pressure might; but they'd need a better identity than son or daughter. Is it possible, as many have argued in the past, that there is a larger self to face the curses and blessings with love not feigned? It might be worth considering.
2
For those of us packed off to boarding school when very young, estrangement was forced upon us when we had no choice in the matter.
As far as I am concerned, I was forced against my will to leave home when I was eight. Boarding school became the norm, interspersed with brief periods of leave. But even before that, a steady stream of elderly carers fulfilling the roles our parents ought to have been fulfilling meant that my sister and I had been pushed out of our natural orbits at a tender age.
My alienation from my parents, then, has been lifelong, beginning early. It's meant also that I had to become self-sufficient early on.
'I have my books
And my poetry to protect me
I am shielded in my armor
Hiding in my room
Safe within my womb
I touch no one and no one touches me
I am a rock
I am an island
And a rock feels no pain
And an island never cries.'
22
For some readers these comments will be a trauma trigger. For others this will validate the decision they made for estrangement or no contact. Others will judge out of ignorance. Just know for those readers that have suffered through the fear, shame, guilt for having the courage to just think about or to remain NO CONTACT that this is they way we honor ourselves so we can finally begin the healing process from our abusers. You are not alone!
Merry Christmas.
18
For me this article and the comments have been both a trauma trigger and validation. Lots of pivotal memories have been flooding back. While painful, this has also been good, because it has further served to reinforce my knowledge that proves to me how truly toxic my family is.
I’m certainly damaged, but psychologically healthy. I practice introspection. I’ve been through therapy. I’ve attempted over the years to get us all into therapy. But, they have never been willing to admit that they have problems, too. That’s narcissistic.
I’ve arrived at a point when nothing they can do will shock me. I’m able to manage my expectations of them, because I’m prepared to expect the worst.
It’s unfortunate that so many people who come from “normal” families can’t fathom why I might be estranged from mine. They think there must be something wrong with me. I’ve come to expect that, too.
This NY Times article certainly helps. Perhaps one day there will be a movement revealing abuse in families that is similar to the #MeToo movement that has pulled workplace harassment out of the shadows. There are lots of parallels. I’m ready.
I’ve got my armor on. They’ve slung their arrows, and I’m still here.
In the clearing stands a boxer
And a fighter by his trade
And he carries the reminder
Of every glove that’s laid him down
Or cut him ‘til he’s cried out
In his anger and his [pain]
I am leaving! I am leaving!
But the fighter still remains…
9
You may want to jot down some of these memories flooding back now for future use - it will be easier to deal with them on the therapeutic road forward without having to search and recall them.
best wishes to you and all of us.
2
Sometimes there is no other choice ... parents who are abusive, either physically or emotionallly ... send either me or my spouse into heavy emotional triggers of nightmare childhoods we were grateful to escape from ... not exposing our own children to that, thank you ...
6
I would like to highly recommend a book for readers who find that their estrangement as adults has deep roots in an abusive childhood...Pete Walker's Complex PTSD From Surviving to Thriving. Pete's book is an intricate road map to individuation. It has given me tools and understanding that I didn't get from any therapist. Seven months no contact. I'm F R E E !
5
It seems very strange that mental illness is not even mentioned in this article. A classic result of mental illness is estrangement from family and friends.
This was either a clear miss by the author or by the researchers.
21
It could be that estrangement from toxic and narcissistic family members is a sign of mental health. And when one unconsciously replicates the toxic family dynamic when choosing friends, estrangement from them is appropriate too.
12
Ask yourself the following: if he/she weren't my brother/sister/father/mother/son/daughter, would we be friends? Here you have it.
20
I have 5 siblings. Never speak to them. No animosity. Just no connection. My only relationship with them is biological Is there really anything wrong with that? I have plenty of friends. Just none of them are biologically related to me.
18
Sometimes separate peace is the best a family can muster. All the sugary Hallmark Christmas movies may beg to differ but it is not about absolute right or wrong. And it is not necessarily dyadic. It can be tribal factional. The ones who choose "you can't go home again" could be the traditional peacemakers but got tired and wary of peacemaking. Not only they got not results in their efforts, they could become the common targets, the innocent bystanders of warring factions. In situations like this, out of sight and out of mind is the possible world.
Sad but true
13
Sometimes things work differently: after witnessing the sheer toxicity of parents families I wished they had the strength to cut them off forever. It would have made life so much better and lighter. The burden of their constant damaging interference over decades has long lasting consequences and I can say it definitely had a terrible impact on the parents marriage and health. It's really never worth it...
10
We often need something from our relatives—support, interest, approval, praise, pride, understanding, love.
The day we realize we will never get what we so need from our family, either because they are incapable, too self-absorbed, too jealous, too petty, too negative, or just uncaring. Well. We begin to be able to let go.
94
Great comment
2
My son estranged himself from his father years ago in his youth for reasons that continued in the decade since, despite my endless attempts at paving a road to reconciliation, he has remained firmly in the estrangement state. While he has gotten over his disappointments in his father and moved on happily with his life, his father seems adamant on believing he had no part in the estrangement, most pointely the fact he had failed at all paternal duties and placed everyone else in his life ahead of his son (I do not exist in his father's life). It does go in line with the study that estrangement is rooted from deep repeated actions and not form any one incident.
But I will always make every effort possible to have a reconcilliation take place, despite the father's shortcomings and lack of willingness in acknowledging or amending his failings. It is what we as parents should do, to work on good outcomes for our children, and having family in one's life should generally be a positive thing, unless some member is unwilling to partake their position and responsibilities. Sadly at this point, the ball is where it had always been, in the father's court, but not played.
11
It’s unlikely that the father’s behavior is going to change at this point, so maybe the best outcome in this case is to honor your son’s decision and wishes to not have a relationship with his father. Those of us who are estranged from a parent generally don’t do so lightly or without careful thought. Why should one keep putting one’s self in a position where they could be hurt and where there is no evidence of change??
12
You are a good and devoted mother but I tell you from my own experience, you have to know when to hold ‘em and when to fold ‘em.
If they haven’t listened to your good advice by now, they never will. Or if they do it will be on their own timetable and not from your endless urging.
Let it go. Try to find peace another way.
2
Voting for Trump should about do it!
59
if your a stepford family...
3
"Their findings challenge the deeply held notion that family relationships can’t be dissolved ..."
Gee, whoever held this notion, whether deeply or shallowly: Someone who's never heard of divorce? Someone who's never heard of adoption? Someone who lives under a rock?
35
Ultimately, one must choose oneself.
41
Wasn’t it the great sage Hillel who said, If I am not for me, who is with me? And if not now, when?
(I hope I got that right; I’ve been quoting it that way for years)
Anyway. I find great comfort in that even if it’s a misquote.
You've got most of it. Here is what he actually said:
“If I am not for myself, who will be for me? If I am only for myself, what am I? And if not now, when?”
You left out the second part which actually changed the meaning.
1
This is a really good book that helped me recover from a NPD parent (we no longer talk) https://www.bookdepository.com/Children-Of-The-Self-Absorbed-Nina-W.-Bro...
8
I’m surprised this article didn’t address how utterly impossible it is to have a normal, loving relationship with a person who has a personality disorder. Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Borderline Personality Disorder—- just look up the descriptions and you realize these people make others’ lives miserable. There is no cure. Walking away from a selfish, narcissistic, abusive spouse is applauded, but walk away from a selfish, narcissistic, abusive adult child and people are horrified, and ask you things like, “can’t you just call them and make up?” Why is there so little common understanding of these conditions?
178
Or cutting off contact with a parent with one or multiple personality disorders. My mother is so toxic and abusive that it's difficult to keep a relationship with her even over 1000 miles away. My mother is a kindergarten teacher and no one would ever believe me about the horrid things she's said and done.
12
Trump has had a severe Narcissistic Personality Disorder from an early age; however, these people make very effective demagogues. We can "walk away" from him and his fawning sycophants by voting every single republican out of all political offices in 2018.
16
Or parent.
4
It’s obvious this is written by a younger adult. There are no quotes or perspective sought or offered from the parents of these adult children.
28
The article indicates that Mr. Maack's father was contacted. He declined to be interviewed, indicated he doesn't consider Mr. Maack his son, and insulted him.
4
No, the perspective of Mr. Maack's father was explicitly sought, and he declined (angrily). As to the age of the writer, based on her LinkedIn page, she's in her 40's.
8
That's not quite true. There is at least one father in this article who declined to be interviewed and just berated his son to the reporter via email.
It does go both ways. There is no shortage of arbitrary or self centered parents or adult children in the world. I think broken relationships happen when people lack communication skills, and the ability to talk through difficult disagreements with respect.
5
Before the birth of my son, I sought pre-emptive therapy in an attempt to avoid a relationship like that with my parents. My father had passed and my mother, in her 80s, enabled my older sister, and her childrens’ drug habits. After years of trying to help them I ran out of energy. The conclusion I reached through therapy was to cut off contact altogether-which was the best decision I could make for my own family. The decision came with all sorts of feelings of guilt and remorse-and probably accounts for this comment....
28
How long one puts up with abuse from parents or siblings (after leaving the nest) of course depends on the form of abuse and, perhaps, hopes of mitigation and/or maturation. The final straw for me took the form of a political rant, mixed with insults that would have led to the dueling ground in another era. Forgiveness isn't really an issue when someone makes clear, over years, that you're a whipping post for whatever problems they have. I realized that if I'd seen a good friend so assaulted, I would have stepped in and asked him, 'why do you put up with this? what can you ever get from this person other than further confirmation of his pathology?'
That was when I pulled the plug, with absolutely no regret. Almost twenty years now of blissful estrangement.
64
On another blog, I've read through a number of sad stories in which a disaffected daughter/son/daughter-in-law/brother/ex-spouse, etc. copes with the "NC" (no contact) or "gray rock" methods of estrangement. Some of the alleged abusers' behaviors are profoundly disturbing, and some are relatively mild but build up because the victims have no idea how to respond and eventually these extreme methods are called for. I find it sad that they did not avail themselves of therapy in which they may have learned how to handle the "toxic" folks in a more assertive way, to the benefit of all concerned. Often the estrangement backfires because the next generation craves contact with the cut-off grandparent, etc. and may use the estrangement technique against the former victim. True, not all such relationships can be repaired/managed, but it's worth a try.
9
You clearly have never had a parent with personality disorders. Assertiveness didn't work--I literally just left home one day and openly said I was leaving the abuse after a violent encounter and they never, ever admitted what I did. My mother is not upset I accused her of this but that I publically say so, which as a kindergarten teacher could ruin her reputation. I have limited contact due to 28 years of brainwashing but I know that nothing I will ever say will make her see because she is mentally incapable of being wrong.
14
I have many, many stories about my mother. But the last one in this article reminds me of my mother's wedding. She got married to my stepfather when I was 21. I knew when the huge, lavish ceremony was going to be. A couple of months earlier, I asked her when the civil wedding was going to be. (This was in France where the two have to be performed separately.) She said the civil wedding had occurred three months earlier in California. I was astonished she hadn't even told me. I asked why I wasn't invited. She answered without a shed of irony, "We only invited a few people very close to us."
36
Well, if that isn’t a sucker punch to the gut, I don’t know what is. Ouch!
When I was able to get away from my family I blossomed in life. Good people, not family, believed in me and I started to believe in myself.
Please do what’s best for you.
21
I'm so sorry.
7
Estrangement may have a precipitating event but as spoken and written words that follow often reveal, there are many smaller incidents (imagined or real) that have contributed. When the estrangement goes on for a many years it often happens that the reasons are forgotten but that cannot erase the hurt that has occurred.
One can beat oneself up trying to make amends but when the other party has decided to forego a relationship, there comes a point where one just has to accept that the estrangement is permanent. It is particularly difficult when one is estranged from one's parents as that also affects relationships with one's siblings. Holidays, family gatherings, special occasions, birthdays, and funerals become points of sadness and hearbreak until one can accept what has happened will not change. Only then is it possible to gp back and remember happier times without feelings of remorse. If there is any good to come from such a situation it is to not let such estrangement occur with the next generation.
10
My husband's mother is an evil woman. She literally wrote my husband a letter in which she told him that she didn't love him as much as she loved his youngest sister. What are we supposed to say to her? How are we supposed to ever interact with her after that act of emotional vandalism? Why are we supposed to respect someone who hates him merely because they happen to share a biological tie?
40
6 months ago when I twice e-mailed my brother to arrange a time we could catch up, he eventually responded that we've had a "difficult relationship" and wished to stop communication. I was enraged, responded that I felt punched in the stomach. We have not communicated since.
I have gone from rage to resignation. My brother was accurate that our relationship had problems, but I worked to maintain a connection. And it took "work."
I am now resigning myself to the fact that, whatever reasons prompted him ("difficult" does not explain it), he doesn't care to discuss it.
I find the challenge is to not take it personally, but instead as some problem he as he cannot cope with. And his gift is that I no longer have to "work" at it. I now feel very sad, but the anger is abating.
48
@Charles...very well put & u’re not alone. The question is how will you respond if your brother calls, say, in a crisis? Sometimes ppl need distance or connection for reasons that defy our standards & expectations for relationships. Not diminishing your experience, just reflecting on my own experience of what you describe.
3
Sounds to me like you're free, Charles!
10
I’m in exactly the same boat, with my sister, who used to be my best friend and closest confidant. It’s been about 5 years since I’ve spoken to her, and I still have very little idea why she won’t talk to me. At first, I alternated between pleading and raging for an explanation for her giving me the cold shoulder. Gradually I accepted that this is just the way it’s going to be. I’m about 90% of the way to total acceptance. The last 10% is hard specifically because I don’t have a reason that I can work to come to terms with. All I know is that she has also cut off all other family members and old friends, too; to that extent, it’s not personal, though it feels that way because we were SO close. I fear for her but I have no control.
4
I cut off contact with my sister after 9/11, initially because of her very anti-American political views. After years of hearing her constantly harping on about American foreign policy, I wasn't about to listen to her predictable reactions to that event, especially while they were still recovering the bodies. But our relationship had been strained for years, and in retrospect I have realized that the true underlying reason why I cut her out of my life is because of her failure to be emotionally supportive during the most painful experiences of my life. We had been very close siblings growing up (one year apart in age) with an abusive mother, but she abandoned our relationship during high school, leaving me to be a social outcast alone while she joined the popular crowd. Then when our father died, she left me to grieve, living alone with our abusive mother - without even a phone number to call her. It was the longstanding pain of having been emotionally abandoned during these extremely painful experiences that made me unable to trust her or rely on her for emotional support, and the trauma of 9/11 was just the trigger. But it wasn't until years later that I stopped speaking to her -years of trying to reconnect and get back the sister that I had suffered through a traumatic childhood with. Only recently after figuring all this out, have I begun the process of reconciling with her, with the knowledge that I will never rely on her for emotional support.
26
Mother and aunt love to talk on the phone and commiserate about their adult children not phoning, visiting, etc., never considering in the slightest their own roles in why this is so. They are two of the most miserable, closed-minded, narcissistic, and downright mean people you will ever meet. They can have each other. Life is too short to spend precious time with either of them.
72
I am estranged from my only living parent, my father. His wife is the reason for the estrangement. She is a vile woman who bullied her stepchildren and blatantly favored her biological children. What is worse is that our father allowed this woman to treat his children this way and still refuses to speak against her because of his antiquated religious views. His belief is that he married her, she is his wife so his children are stuck with his decision and the relationship. The result- his biological children are no longer in his life. I will not allow my children anywhere near his wife. I do not trust my father to protect them from her. Adult children have an obligation to protect their children from ending the cycle of abuse. The days of blindly being obligated to defend your parents is over.
90
Sadly, this situation is not uncommon.
3
I was glad to see mention of a second (or third) spouse coming between a parent and his or her biological children from a prior marriage, particularly in the parent’s later years when they become so dependent on their spouse that they cannot stand up for their own children. Maybe it’s weakness of character, maybe it’s helplessness; whatever the reason, it is extremely painful after years of a healthy relationship. I have to question whether I would visit my parent on their deathbed or go to their funeral after cutting myself off from the toxic criticisms I have endured since that spouse came into the picture. I try to embrace the freedom my choice of estrangement has given me. In a thousand years, I would never have believed things would end up like this.
2
Really?? You had to expose the personal foibles of Mr. Maack and humiliate him out-of-the-blue to millions? You have committed an offense.
8
That's not how newspapers typically work. My guess would be that Mr. Maack was offered the ooportunity to participate in the story. If he'd declined, the reporter would have looked for another person willing to talk on the record about their experiences.
28
We should assume the NYT secured the consent of the Maacks. They were not humiliated; they shared. It is helpful to others.
4
You can choose your friends. It not your family.
4
It is said that dogs are the family you get to choose. I’m not sure how true that is, since many dogs have chosen me more than I them. But they make great companions in life. I hate it wh4n vets and others refer to me as my dogs’ “mom” they are absolutely NOT children — but I do consider my furry buddies to be family.
10
Don't forget: they have to chose you too!
there's a good subreddit called "I was raised by narcissists"
13
The subreddit is worth a look, but depressing to see how many children are willing to cut off their parents forever because of a perceived slight. According to the children's own descriptions, the parents are not typically textbook narcissists but rather humans who made mistakes and may even have occasionally lost their temper. Some of the parents do sound toxic; others have merely overstepped by saying "I love you" to a child. (Anyone who uses "I" is a narcissist!) The group invariably recommends complete estrangement (NC = no contact) to everyone posting, no matter how trivial the complaint. Anyone who suggests that the issues are minor and reconciliation is possible is attacked by the pack.
It's a great place for anyone who wants support in cutting off a relationship or advice from self-appointed therapists who know what's best for everyone else.
14
I agree with Zamiatin. Some of the complaints are from the children of narcissists who are not aware that they’ve grown up as entitled as their parents.
13
The problem may be in your phrasing it as “cutting off a relationship.” With mentally ill, narcissist, seriously neurotic or hostile people - who may also happen to be your parents - there is actually no “relationship.” There is the appearance of one from the outside, but nothing of positive substance at the core. For the child (both in childhood and as an adult) that is the heart of the matter. Your parent cannot see you and have a real relationship with you. It is always about them. I found this article quite inadequate in talking about parent-child family relations and not taking into account the serious role of mental illness and the dysfunction of parental immaturity, narcissism, addiction, chronic rage, depression, and other destructive syndromes. It is heartbreaking whether the mentally damaged person is the parent or the child.
9
Is it just me, or does this article seem to end abruptly?
80
Not just you..smile
6
Yes
6
Yes and totally lacking in exploration. Still a worthy topic.
2
In my experience one of the greatest stress points is first child birth. I've lost track of how many male friends over the years have had major falling outs with family as the wife , perhaps naturally , favours her parents to babysit etc etc and husbands families are second in line causing a marriage or family kind of choice .. this exasperated if you have a sister who then has kids who obviously favours your parents and grandkid favouritism suddenly rears it's head ... it caused a huge strain in my relationship with both my sister and parents but time has healed as it often does .
11
A major reason for sibling-to-sibling estrangement that has been overlooked is money. Family members can fight like dogs over a Will that appears to be unfair, or has been manipulated. It tears people apart, and the deceased parent, or other relative, is no longer there to explain themselves. When my sisters's boyfriend manipulated my mother's Will so that she alone inherited a huge pension (contrary to my mother's stated desire over the previous 25 years), and my sister refused to even discuss it, I had a choice. Take legal action, or just cut off all contact. I chose the latter. Of course the decision was exacerbated by decades of sister's selfishness, and other behavior during settlement of the Estate. After 10 years of estrangement, I'd still be happy to resume contact-- if she gives me the 1/3 of the money I had coming. Life is too short to put up with toxic jerks, whether they're related or not.
44
Amen to this topic - needs MUCH more discussion. I think the manipulation of wills happens more frequently in families that already have toxic underlying issues, especially a narcissist who uses favoritism to control their children.
1
How about this one....it took me many, many years but I finally figured it out (duh). The reason I was psychologically tortured by my brother (7 years older) and my sister (9 years older) is that I was an oops! My mother got pregnant after make-up sex with my alcoholic and physically abusive father. I was born into chaos and was seen as a cipher to an emotionally starved women and her two children. Does it excuse the scapegoating? No. I'll cut them some slack though. They didn't have it very good either.
16
I loved my parents; that said, dead parents bring the gift of freedom from obligation to obnoxious family members. Don’t want to spend time with Trump voting aunt? Hug gross uncles? Don’t have to. Spending Christmas curled up with a book and tea.
76
the sweet solitude of a good book
and some (real) Mexican food
6
and real Mexican food
I am not estranged from my father, but I limit my interaction with him. He is a person who is self centered, thinks only about himself. His jealousy of his own children has been known by me for years, and the family is just acknowledging this. I am the gay son, but I went into the military, and I left the military with two honorable discharges. I went to school, and I obtained three degrees, became an assistant, tenured track professor, but my siblings have all either waited for what Dad would give them, or relegated their lives over to my father. Whatever Daddy says goes. I did not believe my life was his to command. I paid a price for this type of willfulness. My father has manipulated the relationship between my older brother and I. He has had us fighting each other. That is what my father does, and he has used my older brother against me, so to sabotage what I have tried to accomplish. I swore to myself that my older brother's children would not live with or suffer the consequences of my father their grandfather's selfishness. My older brother's children have a right to become better than me or even their father. Shouldn't a father or mother want to see their children do well? My father does not want this. He is a constant nag by combating people who he either does business with or works with. My father broke the heart of his own brother, and who died alone. Such abusive, narcissist are all too common today. Look at who occupies the oval office.
43
My mother once, in the midst of a bipolar storm, decided that all 3 of her kids were worthless and gave us all literal sacks of coal in lieu of presents. She still finds it funny 20 years on. She and my father argued near constantly as I grew up, and the continual refrain was "18 and out." So I left. Reap what you sow.
69
I was the difficult, demanding, "genius" child of two barely literate parents who fought constantly and blamed me for the discontent and told me also "18 and out," particularly because I was college bound and they didn't "believe" in a college education.
I was tossed out at 18, and then my mother tossed out my father, and took in recovering addicts because they appreciated her and I didn't. I was homeless while my bedroom was given to an addict. My father remarried twice, leaving his two young daughters homeless, paying for the children of girlfriends or wives, then he married a woman, a recovering alcoholic, who worked for a charity for emotionally disturbed young girls! When my mother died last year, she left her estate to a professional gambler because she didn't want her money going to school loans.
I married a wonderful guy, went to school (3 degrees between us), and am the only educated, non-addicted member of my family - the black sheep. The rest of my family is either homeless or jobless, mentally ill or substance addicted, while the absentee father is with a child abuse charity!
Suffice it to say, I haven't seen them in years.
2
The article is entirely non-judgmental about families/friends/relationships breaking-up (which it neutralizes and scienceizes with a new academic-sounding term, "estrangement"). Its author doesn't seem to know or care that from antiquity until recently it was believed, judgmentally, that families/friends/relationships breaking up were misfortunes, and that cultures which didn't think and act judgmentally were thought of as morally debased.
9
"Estrangement" is not a new word, and of course the article does certainly treat estrangements as misfortunes - in some cases, terrible tragedies. I think what you really mean to say is that the article suggests that estrangements are not always avoidable and sometimes they actually improve people's lives. That's a judgment, too.
13
The point I was trying to make was that a culture that puts no weight on one's moral obligations to one's family, friends, and other relationships is morally debased, and that the article describes such a culture.
2
Nonsense. The culture puts a tremendous amount of weight on moral obligations to family, which is exactly why cutting those ties, even when it's necessary, can be so agonizing and tragic.
13
I have read all 900 comments, because each one is a story, and a nugget of humanity, in both pain and triumph. I am struck by the number of comments that report family dysfunction coming to a boil after the election of Trump. It does not surprise me at all, but therein lies plenty of irony, as the self righteous, “family values” Christian Right has embraced and elected probably the least Christian person ever to hold the office. If that bizarre circumstance has caused family rifts, it seems oddly and sadly fitting. At some point, hypocrisy on such a scale is unforgivable.
112
Right on about the Orange Emperor. I can't imagine what Trump's family Christmas was like. Nor is it worth imagining. My gift for him would be a lump of his beloved coal. He has riven our family, but we're dealing with it - this year.
18
I find it difficult to be in the company of family members who voted for Trump. Since they all know that but for Obamacare, I would not currently have health insurance, I just can’t get past the fact that they support a person dedicated to ripping away that lifeline. Oh well, saves me money on Christmas presents at least!
12
So are you saying the election of Trump was a good thing or a bad thing for these families who needed to recognize that they could not get along. Their problems certainly existed before the election.
Forgive, but don’t forget.
14
Would seem better for one's own mental emotional health to forget but not forgive.
5
This article is good, but needs a wider scope. Following the death of my father, my siblings came after me with long knives and then a lawyer when I decided to protect my husband and children from their venom. In a three against one fight, I didn’t stand a chance. And the irony: I was the only one who stayed at my dad’s bedside during hospice—and they accused me of abusing my mother (who has Alzheimer’s) in the process. Toxicity in families knows no bounds nor depths. I went from a family of four children to being a single child...and though I still have unfettered access to Mom, I know they may try to stop me from seeing her. We were always strained and sniping in our childhood. Death (and impending death) gives me the full release I need from this ugliness.
30
Estrangement has been great for me. Without it I'd be forced to pretend that things are alright, that certain behaviours are acceptable to me, and that the relationship isn't damaging to me and, potentially, my children.
There is less stress, no cognitive dissonance, and I am more honest with myself.
There is science that people with close family relationships experience greater longevity. I do not believe this is the case with dysfunctional relationships. And if it is, life shouldn't be an endurance contest. The priority must be quality.
92
It’s not surprising to see people becoming estranged.
Look closer and find individuals who are trying to find themselves or someone who may be overwhelmed by the daily requirements of life.
They may find themselves without time or resources left to maintain relations with family.
Sadly many of the comments reflect a sense of entitlement.
A general question of why not me?
Why can’t I be on the receiving end of someone’s love and attention.
6
@Andrew from Santa Rosa, CA:
I do think I'm entitled to sanity. I spent my entire childhood as the victim of my mother's untreated mental illness. Years of emotional, physical, and sexual abuse...things that have made my therapist cringe. It was that awful. I'm lucky I'm alive and didn't kill myself through drugs or alcohol. I'm grateful that somehow I was resilient enough to make it through. Soon I'll be turning 45.
If you've never suffered the abuse and ongoing torture of parents with untreated mental illness, you cannot judge the choice of estrangement by survivors of such abuse. You should be championing survivors who have worked hard to salvage their souls and mental well-being. Not criticizing them.
62
To me, most of the comments are from people who are trying to avoid abuse. You cannot force someone to feel anything for you. But it is fair and decent to expect to be treated with, at least, the courtesy and respect you see being offered to strangers.
I would, of course, want a brother who loved me and had my back. But that was not in the cards. I accepted that. What I finally decided I would not accept was the cruel comments and rudeness.
My life is diminished by estrangement. But my mental health is much improved. And I have filled in the gaps with friends who actually like and value me.
Life is hard. Most of us try to do the best we can. Maybe you could judge a bit less.
22
I am so sorry that your childhood was a horror show Leah. I wish you continued peace and healing. Merry Christmas.
8
The article states, ‘Estrangement is a “continual process,” Dr. Scharp said. “In our culture, there’s a ton of guilt around not forgiving your family,” she explained. So “achieving distance is hard, but maintaining distance is harder.”‘
Guilt? This certainly has not been my experience. I’m the youngest in my immediate family. They all failed in how they cared for me. I turned out well in spite of them.
My advice to others? If your family is toxic, get away from them as fast as you can. Don’t look back. And, please don’t have any regrets.
The best thing I did for myself, for the sake of my sanity, was to get away from my family. It was only then that I found people who were supportive, and believed in my ability to succeed in life. The further I have been able to be from my family, spiritually, temporally and geographically, the healthier and happier I’ve become.
My family was absolutely sadistic, and the ones that are still alive still are. At their best, they’re selfish, judgmental, emotionally distant and uncaring. Most young children love their family naturally. But, when it isn’t returned, that love fades away and turns into confusion and pain. I no longer have any tolerance for people who conceal and lie and cheat without a second thought. That’s the environment I grew up in. Psychologically, they left me damaged for decades.
The sooner one can rid themselves of toxic family, the better.
67
Amen! I'm so glad you escaped.
7
The split between me & some sibs really happened when I was sole care giver - son in same city as our 92 year old father. I followed the Will and did what my Father wanted in caring for him over last year of his life after our Mother had passed. Nut there was much anger between sibs. Everyone had their expectations of how "it" should be.
It was a very difficult time. I imagine these situations split many "kids". I am now 60. I would be curious to read more about sibling estrangement.
It is sad to me how we hang on to & stay attached to anger. Through the Buddhist 4 Noble Truths and therapy it strikes me how we all can so often come up with our reasons/arguments to justify anger... and we hold on to these stories to justify our resentment, anger, and pain. Attachment to stories, anger, - all of it causes so much pain & suffering. Just let it go.
I have tried to let go of my own expectations of what family, closeness with siblings, life should be. But it is hard - hard letting go of how I/we wish or think it should be.
30
Estrangement runs through my husband’s family like eye color. It is very much rooted in racism, classism, and politics. My husband’s maternal grandmother orchestrated it and now his mother is at the helm. At her mother’s direction, my mother in law forced her husband to disown his entire family: they are Italian. She does not acknowledge her niece and her family: they are Mormon and have adopted children. It goes on. My husband has not cut all ties, but keeps his mother and his sister, who carries on the tradition, at arms length. We are all happier.
11
We quit Christmas about 25 years ago and it has been the best thing ever for this time of year; we did it after a particularly painful and annoying Christmas with my family. The first years were odd, but it became easier and easier and now we look forward to a quiet, peaceful time with no gifts and no annoying family. We just got back from serving dinner at the homeless shelter and found the thank you's we heard there more sincere than any we heard from our so-called families back in the day.
103
I love your comment. Thank you.
11
This article catalogues another staggering cost of mental illness and of people acting irresponsibly for that reason. I think that family is very important, and that the bonds one (ideally) forms at home are a central building block for strong adult relationships and societies. There is a reason "honor your father and mother" is one of the Ten Commandments--it is both a worthy goal and (at least sometimes) hard to do. It is important to acknowledge and appreciate, as this article does, the many for whom abuse makes family ties impossible or dangerous and to honor their pain, their journey, and their flourishing. But I don't question that a close loving family should remain a primary goal, or that family relations are inherently important. For the many suffering from abuse by family members, I am so sorry. It is so important for you to know you are not alone and that cutting back ties can increase happiness and provide sustaining alternatives. So much of what is bad in the world comes from mental illness, and as a society we give it such a low priority. We have to be on guard against becoming a society of atomized narcissists who value only money and power, who see our President as a role model for their personal conduct.
22
I'm a baby boomer from a dysfunctional family with a mother who didn't want daughters, only the 5th child who was the coveted son, yet even so she was mean to and resentful of all 5 kids; my dad was the buffer that saved us. In my 30s I told her no more and now that my sisters who bullied me as a child have morphed into her persona, I've said no more to them as well.
It's perfectly normal, healthy, and desirable for one to put a stop to an abusive relationship. That the abuser is a blood relative should not matter nor should it be the victim's responsibility to "fix" the abuser or endure the abuse to preserve a family relationship.
All healthy relationships need to be cultivated and nurtured with kindness and caring whether it's through friendship, family, or marriage but it's not always possible to make it work.
I can't change my childhood but I can manage my life today which includes saying no to bullies without guilt. IMHO, to label this as estrangement implies something negative on my part.
41
It's never too late to have a happy childhood. - AA
7
Thank you. Your insight sounds earned the hard way yet you offer it with grace and kindness.
5
As a funeral director of many years my clients are not the deceased but the families that are related to the them. Being in the unique position of sitting at a table with a “family” I’m always amazed at how family dynamics play out in peoples lives. Some families, and I’m not judging how they get to their particular situation, love each other dearly, hate each other dearly, are indifferent to each other or have such strong connections that I’m amazed. Usually the families that have divorced parents have divorced kids, usually people who have two parents who stayed together will have kids who are still together, throw some drug/alcohol issues, depression, stealing, or a cheating spouse in there and you have the perfect setting for someone to say when writing the obituary ,”yes we have a brother but he is not part of the family or yes mom has other children but I’m the only one who talks to her.” Estrangement is odd to me because I’m part of a loving family but if any of those huge life issues pops it’s ugly head into my life , I could see how it happens. It’s when love becomes hate, anger , and then indifference.
22
You do god's work. Thank you.
Well, bringing the wrong dessert -- that'll bust up a perfectly functional family every time.
32
Yes, the horror... the horror. One wrong dessert, and the stigma lasts a lifetime. LOL. They should criminalize "lack of sense of humor."
But remember, for some, it's the straw that breaks the camel's back- a lifetime of small insults can be death by a thousand cuts.
16
Catherine, all I can say is thank you. It does indeed take time, and involves pain that ultimately seems self-inflicted. Too much of growing up was projection of either being right or wrong, and precious little time was given reconciliation. Every attempt to convince myself of some convergence of orbits leaves me with this wretched notion that I’d known better but somehow failed them and myself.
4
When I was in therapy as a young adult - after a childhood spent with a neglectful and narcissistic father who made my mother and us children utterly miserable - the therapist suggested that I simply stop talking to my parents for a while.
It was a novel and shocking idea. However, it turned out to be a great suggestion. Once I stopped connecting myself to my parents, I was able to see myself as an independent person and became able to manage my own life as I saw fit.
My parents also went into therapy around the same time, and eventually, we were able to reconcile, because my father came to realize what a terrible husband and father he had been, and was man enough to own up to his own mistakes and apologize for them. I was able to forgive him, and so our story of estrangement has a happy ending.
I feel sorry for the folks who aren't strong enough to acknowledge their own failings and apologize for them, and for those who have yet to discover the power of forgiveness.
22
Your family had the advantage of therapy to reconcile. That’s wonderful. To say you feel sorry for folks who are not strong enough to acknowledge their own failings etc is beyond judgmental. To perhaps state that your wish that more folks could seek therapy to confront the deep reasons behind estrangement is more to the point. Therapy is not always possible for a myriad of reasons
6
As an only child, I was very close with my parents. After a series of strokes, my mother cut off all contact with one family member after another until it was my turn. My parents did not speak to me for six years until one day I got a phone call that she was dying and for me to come and say goodbye to her. I did go to the hospital and spent a few days with her before her transition. After that, my father and I did talk about that time and reconciled. A few years later, my maternal grandmother did the same thing to me again. This time she would not even see me while in the hospital during her final illness. So I've been estranged twice, both times with no idea why. I've been in therapy a few times about this. Went through the "what did I do wrong" second-guessing. My father died about a year ago and I am family-less. I will never understand what happened. It was never anything I wanted. I loved these people with all my heart and would do anything for them. No abuse, addiction. Just a mystery. I accept this but it's not something that will ever heal entirely.
30
I am so sorry. Life can be so inexplicable. I pray for your peace & fulfillment.
20
Consider that it may very well have been undiagnosed mental illness of those two that was the cause of this outcome. May you find peace.
4
The article is very good; it touched so many people who have responded with emotion. The one comment that I thought was more objective, bringing to our attention that nothing is ever one way, several replies accused the writer of not understanding. This happened to me as well within the context of the therapy room. I had a patient that was in psychotherapy for a long time and felt helped in many areas of his life, however, he justifiably remained alienated from his parents. On an occasion, I approached the subject from the perspective that nothing is ever one way, wanting to explore the subject. Unbeknown to me, the patient left that day upset and, the following week, he warned me that, if I ever broached the subject again, in the manner I did (i.e. what did he think was his contribution to the state of the parental alienation?), he would need to leave therapy.
This experience and other similar ones made me conclude that, not unlike some stages of Trauma, the subject of family estrangement remains foreclosed and is not subject to exploration. For the victim of trauma, the fault remains on the outside and there can be no possibility of ownership. However, without ownership, healing is improbable. Ownership does not need to be rational, most children and most victims of trauma are not responsible for their fate. But, experience shows that, in the absence of ownership, even if non-rational and non-justified, healing does not take place.
19
Yes, there is always a two-way street. I realized that my parents were personality disordered, and that what I thought was "normal" was far from it. I did try to close the gap, but could not. It simply wasn't possible. Cutting them off was the best gift I ever gave myself -- and my wife and kids. Next time you bring this up, may I suggest that you differentiate between the "victim mentality" and "you're not taking enough blame here," which sounds like the toxic parent, again refusing to hear their issue. I understand why this would trigger so many. The toxic parent denies the child's feelings their entire lives, so if they think YOU are, too, then you can't help them.
25
What you describe is sad, but also makes me wonder if you couldn't/shouldn't try some other way to navigate towards helping your client access his deeper emotions around family. He certainly can do that and come to the conclusion with you & himself that no, he is correct in his awareness. We agree he would grow in having the subject become less explosive for him. Currently he (& his therapy) is owned by his angry emotions.
Something else was going on that had to somehow be dealt with for growth and insight to be achieved. To have a patient "warn" a therapist to never broach a subject again, especially one that involved the simple possibility that reality includes alternative ways to look at memories and situations does not sound healthy.
3
I don't know about this. It sounds like 45th's crazy comment that there was blame on both sides when one side was murdering racists and the other was standing up for a more equal society. Sometimes, sadly, the blame is one-sided. Conflict and severe discord can be dictated by one very bad side.
23
Since I was about 16 I always told my mother I won’t be having children.
She estranged herself from me around the time of my wife and I’s 5th anniversary when it became clear she would not be becoming a grandmother.
My wife and I will be celebrating our 12th anniversary, child-free, February 2018.
33
That's YOUR decision, Isaac. Not hers. Good for you.
3
Death can be a healing influence. When the force requiring estrangement is removed, those left behind are free to forge new bonds and heal old wounds.
12
I and several of my friends have had less-than-ideal relationships with our respective siblings and our responses have varied from limiting contact, maintaining superficial ties, or cutting them off completely.
I have decided to cut off personal communication with my sibling, who would throw up vile insults, threaten to sue, actually yell at my personal contacts, anytime there were feelings of loss of control.
I could no longer take the hot and cold. When feeling well, the amount of generosity and support my sibling offered bordered on bizarre.
I acknowledge that I am no an innocent bystander, and I’ve certainly said and done regrettable things.
Only after entering into a marriage with a very secure and kind man, did I realize my sibling’s outbursts and actions were absolutely not okay.
We teach people how to treat us, and I finally said enough.
However, estrangement still affects me because unlike an ex-boyfriend or friend, it is impossible to completely cut off the relationship. My parents are still very involved in both of our lives, and it hurts them that we do not get along. It has been frustrating for them to always expect me to forgive and forget, but I think recent things my sibling did made them understand me more too.
9
We teach people how we want to be treated. Every Christmas i would make a point of going out and getting everybody thoughtful gifts or themed gift or out of the ordinary gifts at japan town or Chinatown. Only to find my gift was a 5 dollar gift certificate at the warehouse. ??? So one year, i bought a lot of gifts of EVERYTHING i wanted for Christmas and wrapped them and put them on under the tree carded to yours truly. "Whose that big gift for?" One of my siblings asked. "It's for me", I said as I opened it gleefully... Brought the point across. The point is who says that i have to play the last considered in my family. I'm tired of going away from Christmas feeling short-changed and non-considered. Look the gift doesn't have to be awe inspiring but at least some kind of sentiment behind it. Otherwise i give myself nachass...
Giving better gifts doesn't buy you love, but it sure an indicator of where you stand in peoples rankings. I faired really low. like i said I am responsible for making myself happy, so i make myself happy.
One more thing people grow up and become different people, so some of us will never see eye to eye or be in the same room with our siblings again. The gift giving disparity is just a symptom of a larger issue..which I am aware of, but you have to stand up for yourself in some way. or in all ways.
Bring on the rum! And have a happy, uncomplicated, untoxic, unstressed, unopinionated, unjudged Christmas to you all. Stand your ground.
22
Short of abuse, many of the reasons are simply a matter of ego. And one thing I've observed in my life is that familial estrangement can be learned behavior, passed from parents to children. If you model it to your child today, don't be surprised of your grown offsprings choose the same for you someday, or toward their siblings.
13
That's what bad parents say to manipulate their children to stick around.
13
Faith, the main reason people estrange is abuse. People do it precisely so they don't have to see their children learning that abuse is normal.
3
As I write, I'm sitting alone in my living room. It's Christmas Eve. I've got my newspaper, remote, seltzer, and tea. In jammies, on the couch. Best holiday ever.
That said, I'm home sick, and cannot join my parents and siblings in Maine, where they are sitting down to dinner and where I'd otherwise be.
Alone time by choice or circumstance is what you make of it. Alone time for other reasons at this time of year could be painful.
15
It is sad to read so many heartbreaking stories, that involve complexities and struggles of the highest order. Forgiveness and reconciliation are the true center of the Christian faith. On Christmas Eve I invite you to read the parable of ‘The Prodigal Son’ told by Jesus: the merciful understanding of a bereaved father toward both his one willfully ‘estranged’ son and another resentful but ‘loyal’ son is enlightening. Here’s the reference in Luke 15: 11-32. Seneca, a pagan Roman philosopher said it as clearly as any religious person: “forgiveness is divine”. Please consider picking up the phone or email and begin anew the work of mercy. Peace and healing unity among families, citizens and nations is my prayer for you, for us all. Please read it.
7
Your thought is very loving, but the sad experience for many is that picking up the phone ends in the same toxic poisonous outcome.
We cling to the idea that we should all have or somehow be able to create a Kodak moment.... letting go of that fantasy is often the healthiest thing we can do.
27
Sometimes forgiveness or reconciliation are impossible.
14
Forgiveness and healing and reconciliation are not the same thing. You can have one without the other and be perfectly fine.
4
Having grown up in a loving, supportive family, I was horrified by the way my husband’s family members treated him. Their narcissistic personalities led them to gossip, belittle, and preen — incessantly feeding their egos, often at his expense. Any response to their barbs, other than flattery or silence, was received as a personal insult.
When my husband finally said “enough” and told them to stop the attacks, they were outraged. They advised him to leave me and return to the family fold. Instead, he left the family.
As he likes to tell his patients, “It’s better to be FROM a dysfunctional family than IN one.”
78
Every family has a sort of pact with its members and if the parents are alcoholic or addicted to substances or even rage, there is often one kid who gets picked as the black sheep or scapegoat along with "smart one", "invisible one", etc. It is a kind of role assignment that can be so serious it can cost someone their life while letting everyone else off the hook for an entire system that is not healthy and there is no actual adult communication.
A family of choice in the meantime is a good substitute for learning how happy people respect and love each other and then if one is up for the challenge, one can reenter the fray with the tools not given the first time around. There are lots of people out there to care for.
18
The best day and the worst day of my life was the day I left my parents, got on the first plane I could back to New York. That day was both years in the making as well as an abrupt, visceral awareness that enough was enough, that I had to leave for my own survival.
It was years in the making, because I credit finally having the courage to walk away with the tiny step I'd taken almost 10 years before: to start trying to treat myself with the same compassion and humanity I would show anyone else. Slowly but inevitably, that led to the moment I looked into my mother's face and saw her clearly for the first time. She was never going to treat me with humanity. She does not know the meaning of the word.
I'm grateful for this article and would love to see more like it. We're hard-wired to want our parents' love and approval more than almost anything. Despite the massively better life I have now, despite knowing that I made the only possible decision, my heart still breaks a little each Christmas and birthday and mother's day.
I had reached a point with my parents where it was a clear choice between my sanity and having them in my life. After a quarter century of almost never ceasing to think about suicide, I recently realized that I haven't wanted to die since the day I got on that plane. I wake up these days eager for life.
Sometimes, horribly, there is no good choice. Sometimes the only thing you can do is try to save yourself. Thank you for telling our stories.
81
Thank you for your clarity and courage. There is insight and there is rationalization - you chose insight. That takes strength and wisdom and compassion. I dont know you, but you sound like a person who would be a rare friend.
5
I chose estrangement for the final 15 years of my mother's life (she died in Oct. 2014 at age 68). Before that point I tried to stay in touch with her, but her untreated mental illnesses, and the cruel and chaotic behavior that accompanied them, often put me in retreat mode for months at a time. Around the time I turned 30 I realized that a single phone call with her could trigger my symptoms (I live with PTSD) for several days, jeopardizing my job performance and my day-to-day routines. I knew this pattern was not sustainable. I loved my mother but I couldn't stay in touch with an unpredictable monster. My mother was a casualty of stigma and an inadequate mental health system, and she and our relationship were beyond repair.
I find it odd that the article doesn't mention 'mental illness.' I'm a survivor of multiple types of child abuse by multiple family members, and I know that no person is born into the world to wreak that kind of violence upon children. Only adults who are incapacitated by untreated mental illness, untreated addiction, and unsupported disability harm their children.
It is obvious that many of the parents mentioned in this article struggle with untreated depression, anxiety, personality disorders, and addiction. By not overtly mentioning this underlying problem, the New York Times inadvertently propagates the stigma that surrounds mental illness. Untreated mental illness is prevalent and is a strong contributor to estrangement.
39
I grew up with a mother who abused me constantly, physically and psychologically, told my siblings not to play with me, and insisted I'd end up in a mental institution. I worked through the hurt and rejection and now, decades later, have a good relationship with her, so much that my siblings now claim that I'm the preferred child!
I worked very hard to be a very different kind of mother to my children, always letting them know that I loved them and maybe too often putting them first. My first marriage ended in divorce when my children were young. The two sons from that marriage, now grown, abruptly cut me off as adults, no "years and decades, " no blowout. I'm still hurt and mystified, and no one who knows all of us can help me understand where I went wrong or what I can do to make amends.
I try to focus on my other children, but I miss my older sons so much and only hope one day they will find some value in having a relationship.
5
My foster family who had been my family for over 30 years cut off contact last year after the birth of my daughter. Her father and I are not together and I am raising her alone. This Xmas is the second Xmas not with them (just us). Although they couldn’t say it, it’s due to the circumstances of my daughter’s birth. They live in the Midwest and we are in NY.
Their capacity for coldness and meanness knows bounds and I am still reeling from it. I realized their pushing me out began 7 years ago after my grandmother (the matriarch) died and the oldest daughter assumed that role. Let me tell you, my grandmother would be furious if she knew what’s happened.
Period between Thanksgiving and New Year’s is very very difficult for those of us who were forced into estrangement.
15
After the rush of freedom and the fright of going forward without the family comes the difficulty of the inquiries from friends, relatives, and acquaintances. The shame at the failure to meet the prevailing myth. The fear of unwelcome offers to intervene. The impossibility of explanations. The blank incomprehension of some and disapproval of others. Eventually the fact of so many others estranged from parents or siblings comes into view. No one who doesn't live there knows what the inside of a particular family is like.
23
the article is very good and brings up a middle point of arrangement which I feel and my parents felt from my mother's side of the family and a long history of hands off distant relationships with cousins. I have lived outside the USA for 40 years but return frequently. But my closest relationships are with friends and my four adoptive foster children grown up now. The latter show devoted loved and kindness and loyalty to me whereas my blood relative cousins remain distant and aloof. We meet for dinner or lunch or telephone when I am in the USA annually. But I don't rely on them for anything
2
I arrived in my family at exactly the wrong moment and as a result, fell through the cracks. Physical needs were taken care of but there was emotional neglect that has ended up haunting me all of my days. I don't think I've ever really connected with anyone emotionally. Certainly not my parents. Approximated it, I think, a few times. Moved away then suddenly received the message that I wasn't contacting them enough. Estranged for a short while, reconnected, then was drawn back into their orbit. Now, with many decades under my belt, I can say that was one of the worst decisions I've made. A parent/child relationship is, at the end of the day, a relationship. People don't leave good ones. What I wanted and needed my parents didn't have to give.
11
thank you for opening up to us all here. Bless you, you have so much strength and tenderness. You'll be okay.
There is another kind of estrangement----In my case, after 25 years of watching out for my 3 old family members, Mother, Father and an Aunt, I find myself alone because they have all died. My husband died decades ago.
So being on your own does not mean that a person could not get along with their family. Health issues in small families can eventually create people who are on their own.
10
Reading this makes me realize that my “low contact” level that I keep with my parents might indeed actually be estrangement. Suffice it to say that I very much identify with the people mentioned and quoted in this article.
8
The article wouldn't be one to stick in a Hallmark Christmas card and comments illustrate that not everyone's experience belongs in a Rockwell painting. No one should have to suffer from family members' personality disorder, addiction, or evil. I am deeply sympathetic to all those here who had horrible childhoods with toxic family members. I am glad many of you have created a calmer, more loving adulthood and am heartened by the hope that your actions have created a healthier and happier experience for your children if you chose to have any. Best of wishes for the holiday and New Year.
27
"Family values." Whose family? Are they positive or negative values? So many questions, so much whitewashing. There's a difference between alone and lonely. Thank you for putting together this appropriate study of "real life" during this fantasy season.
8
I had 1 unsuccessful and 1 successful estrangement. First one: my parents/sibs were furious with me for asking for financial assistance due to serious medical difficulties during my mid 20s. No help there. So, I cut ties, founded a business, paid my medical bills, completed a BA, closed the business, and started doctoral studies.
7 years later, contact was sought. Apparently, I was now on the road to a PhD and "acceptable" as I was not in need anymore and would cast a positive light on the family (I was the first on all sides to go to college). I agreed but it was too late. I had thought a lot in the interim. I saw through the bullying, crafted lies, sneering comments -- the toxicity I had escaped was clear.
My second and final estrangement occurred due to nominally petty matters but was really calculated by sister and mother. My mother is a severely damaged individual with a tendency toward splitting and narcissism (a common thread here).
I left and looked back just once as I sought dual citizenship. I needed my father's drivers license and paid a trusted, or so I thought, friend attorney to request the proof. The attorney achieved the document but had been fed so many negative stories about me during the process that he literally had been turned into a suspicious enemy. My mother's final revenge was to remove a "friend" of 35 years. Yes, she is that "gifted" & angry.
I have a devoted spouse of 30 years, many dear friends, and I am a noted scholar. Happy, not angry
23
I do wonder how much of a role therapists play in this situation. How many therapists who have a patient discussing cutting off relationships suggests any other interventions or strategies? Also, I've seen plenty of articles in the popular press that suggest cutting off relatives as a viable answer to dealing with them. Relationships, like so much else, are expendable in our culture. We've had "quality time" hammered down our throats for at least the last couple of decades. Nothing must detract from that.
3
I have experience with therapy as do some friends of mine. My therapist has never encouraged cutting off familial relationships and has labored to offer suggestions and alternative plans. Therapists understand better than others the importance of family believe it or not and what life is like for people without family. People with an anti-therapy bent often think therapists are urging clients to blame everything on their parents and ditch them - it's just not true.
10
On the contrary, very often therapy can be immensely helpful. However, I know at least one person who, in hindsight, felt that their therapist didn't actively offer any suggestions or alternative plans to separation/divorce. I know another person who did blame everything on their parents and ditched them and then other family members, one at a time. Maybe it was just a coincidence that that person was in therapy at the time. This person did mention "recovered memories" which was popular at that time. I believe the concept has been discredited depending on how the memories are recovered. Some unskilled therapists have led clients to make false claims.
1
Since so few Americans have access to or the funds to maintain a therapeutic relationship, I doubt the profession has much influence on the statistics. As the former wife of a therapist, they are traibed not to influence the client, but to guide them in a self-determined path.
2
After everything else is forgotten, what remains is the grudge. Every opportunity to patch things up should be taken. However, sometimes it is not possible. Move on.
8
I'll guess that economic freedom drives estrangement in the same way that it enables divorce: in times past, families were forced by necessity to remain intact, if miserable, because estrangement would have meant economic isolation and, soon enough, destitution. Today, we don't need our families to survive. So, estrangement comes with a lower cost, and is therefore a viable option.
13
I spent quite a bit of time reading these comments last night. Not every estrangement is the result of a dramatic blowout argument. However, many of us know that the Norman Rockwell ideal of holiday family gatherings simply doesn't hold up in real life.
You internalize the bitterness, you put up with the tension, the unhappiness, and the heavy hand of obligation until you don't have to anymore. Then you move out, you move on, and you don't look back.
12
Happily in this club! The most glorious freedom liberation and peace severing ALL ties from a toxic sibling. Nothing could make me rekindle that nightmarish relationship. We're not married there's zero reason to "work things out." Just because someone is family doesn't mean you have to suffer the rest of your life. Take it from someone who endured for way too long. Life's too short to have someone always there trying to ruin it for you.
24
A Catholic mother who only had me because she had to and then walked away when I was 10. A 17 year old Catholic father who never wanted me. Love is an action and the simple action of not being emotionally there is my reason for being estranged from my sperm donor. As a late 30s nurse I look at families who spend thousands of dollars on opioid treatment centers, college, cars and when I needed 100$ for ACLS training he couldn't be bothered. My parents are now surrogates from my friends' families. My Uncle and Aunt are my parents. So much emotional support and encouragement from those we chose to have in our lives.
12
My experience with my family of origin is similar to these truthful tales of relationships disintegrating over time. Growing up with a special needs sibling, an abusive alcoholic father and a mother, who at best, was a malignant narcissist, created an unhealthy family dynamic. After finally discovering unconditional love in middle age with my second husband, I made a clear and conscious decision to disengage from my family because it was the healthiest path for me. I do not blame or condemn them because we all pay a price for toxic relationships. Whether one chooses to stay or leave is deeply personal and difficult decision. I made the right choice for me and have no regrets.
13
Sadly, this article underscores my own experience with my younger brother who grew up with a learning disability and ADD that made him angry, rebellious and unable to maintain a stable income. After our mom’s sudden death, during the settlement conference he threatened to kill me and our older brother. He was serious in that moment. I chose to stop communicating with him. 5 years later I tried to connect again, and he was decent enough as long as I was helping him with his latest money making plan. It fell apart, he blamed me and I decided I can’t be connected any more. My older brother wished him happy birthday in a text and through my brother’s son he threatened to kill him. I’ve decided enough is enough and have cut off all ties,sadly. But I know it’s the right decision.
8
Thank you for this piece; estrangement is often difficult to talk about. It’s nice to know I am estranged from my family, not disowned by them, and that I am not alone.
In 1971 I became pregnant outside of marriage. The baby’s father is African American; I am white. My family of origin gave me an ultimatum: “Abort or you are dead to us.” My son and I have been dead to them since that time. I went on to adopt two daughters of African Ancestry. My daughters also do not exist as far as my family of origin is concerned. The consequences of my decisions are that I have a lovely family and we have a good life. I wouldn’t change a thing.
In the past I explained my relationship with my family of origin by saying “they disowned me.” I am now going to use the term estranged: “My family estranged themselves from me over 45 years ago.” Or perhaps it sounds better to say “I have been estranged from my family for over 45 years.” Any thoughts?
11
We have different world views.
We grew apart.
I chose happiness.
Why explain, at all? You're
free to live your life the way
you choose.
3
Hard to believe that there was not a single mention of religious differences as the basis for estrangement.
5
Way to much emphasis is put on family relationships solely because you're related. So what?
I often find myself asking, if you wouldn't tolerate a friend treating you like that, why in God's name would you ever allow a relative to do so? You get what you tolerate!
233
This has been my thinking for years about ALL family relationships, especially son and daughter. If their character and personality is not tolerable, it doesn't matter if related. Nice to read someone else is beyond the socially constructed and cherished egotism of family.
7
Exactly! You wouldn't let a stranger on the street treat you that way, so your family gets a pass? i thought families were supposed to be BETTER than strangers and friends?
9
To many who have commented, you’ll see we’re not alone, although we all are.
64
Hmmmm.
I don't see Parental Alienation, produced in toxic custody/divorce matters in the "Bullets" of Estrangement here.
24
That's such a common and tragic issue, I think it deserves it's own study.
1
It is here in the comments though.
1
Facebooking is sometimes a culprit. A family member does something significant -- marriage, job change, moves OR maybe chooses a friend rather than a sibling as legal guardian designate for a child -- and then tells the world via social media BEFORE telling affected family.
Do what you think is right but don't be gutless and let your family find out third hand.
22
If ones family is reactionary, unreasonably overbearing and judgmental, why would one share anything with them that they’d be critical of? Put off that pain until later, and hope they never find out. If they do find out, the result will be the same.
4
I purposely estranged myself from my mother some 10 years ago. It did not take me too long to realise that the feeling was mutual. No, individually, we're both survivors and estrangement is not the most painful thing that can happen to a parent and his or her child. No, it's your so-called friend the one who happened to have enjoyed a great relationship with his mother and who insists that I must call my mother. Why? 'Because it's your mother!' Did I say 'so-called friend'? I meant 'ex friend'.
59
I agree people don't get it and can add to your guilt with their comments.
5
We moved away from my narcissistic father in law 5 years ago after working with and living very close to him for years. Like the article says there wasn't one thing - it was years of abuse and just plain crazy behavior and lots of counseling. Leaving was freeing but also has left collateral damage. People/family members not inside the relationship see him as the victim and we have lost other family relationships over this decision. What they don't know and we decline to say is that he is a womanizing self centered creepy predator with no moral compass. We share no values and although he seemed like a good grandpa from the outside, his values of money and sex were the driving forces in his life. It's sad because the kids don't understand and miss the fun grandpa who showered them with gifts and trips and they aren't old enough for us to tell them what he's really like, or we're unsure if we ever should. Now he tells everyone in our old town how we abandoned him and won't let him see the kids even though we have said he can see them anytime in a supervised setting. The problem with narcissists is they have a way of gas lighting you until you feel like you're the crazy ones. Distance and time has helped get clarity. I feel for everyone in this situation, the emotions can be really confusing especially around the holidays.
167
I understand 100%
5
“The problem with narcissists is they have a way of gas lighting you until you feel like you're the crazy ones.”
That about sums it up. I’ve been distancing myself from my dysfunctional family for years after putting up with emotional, mental and sometimes physical abuse (I won’t go into details but let’s just say the police got involved) and being told it was my fault that it happened. I recently stopped going home for the holidays and told my mother I’d be happy to return once they learned to act right (they love to use racial slurs and have screaming matches in front of my husband and me). She sent me texts telling me how selfish and mean I am and how they never did anything to me. Playing the victim is textbook narcissistic behavior. Too bad for her, I’m not falling for it anymore.
7
Normally, I take the adult child's side, but I have to ask: how is your FIL's sex life in any way any of your business? If you are shunning him for what he does in the bedroom, that is unfortunate. Also, if he values money, maybe that is a good reason not to be close to him, but to wholly cut him off?
I could be wrong, but it sounds like you are penalizing him for how he conducts parts of his life that should be none of your concern.
1
The irony of estrangement and reconciliation is the repercussions. In my husband's case, he became deeply depressed because he lost his soul to his completely dysfunctional family. I ended up caring for a 90+-year-old father with whom I had an ambivalent relationship. If we had been smart, we should have put a huge distance, literally, between us and our families. We didn't, and the mental health issues have eaten us up alive.
92
People who haven't experienced abuse, abandonment, betrayal, etc. on the part of a parent, don't understand and they base their judgment of us, who make a healthy choice, on their own experience. They can't imagine leaving their own loving parents, and somehow assume that all parents are like theirs. I find myself having to forgive people for not forgiving me. It's a little sad.
17
Has it occurred to anyone that the "family model" so frequently promoted by those who promote society wide things is useful to he uncontrolled capitalists whom have stolen our government from us? It is the same people who are constantly promoting family values and old fashioned this or that moralizing all over anyone who does not look like or think like they do while parading their families in front of us as if breeding itself makes them superior to the rest of us. The same people who cannot have a sensible conversation about sex or human rights unless they can impose their prejudices and proscriptions on it before anyone else speaks.
75
I am estranged from my 25 year old son. He has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder, and after several years of watching him detonate relationships with his mother, step father and all grandparents, I invited him to live with myself, mother in law, wife and two 8 year olds.
After several months of broken promises, disrespect to mother in law, wife and myself, and sharing inappropriate information with the kids, i asked him to leave. There was a specific moment when I confronted him about his behavior, and he hit me, that led to the estrangement.
The stress level in the house has returned to normal, but I remain concerned for my son's safety and health.
I have asked him to join me at counseling which he did. He used it as an opportunity to curse and tell me that I should be ashamed for kicking him out.
Tough times, but I'm sure I made the right call for everyone's benefit. Time will tell if our relationship can be mended.
161
It is normal and healthy to protect oneself from abuse and toxic behavior from another person. Please don't let yourself be tortured by guilt as the abuse is not acceptable just because it's your son. Barring incompetence, people suffering from substance abuse and mental illness still have responsibility for their actions towards others. Love and compassion, however well intended, cannot save your son from himself. good luck.
7
Shame on you and the 90 or so endorsers that none of you realize or own your role - that of abandonment - in your son’s issues. You abandoned him, possibly other children, and his mother to start over again and now have 2, 8 year olds to abuse and abandon. Shame in you.
4
Wow, it's impressive that you recognized him from his story. Apparently you know him. Otherwise... you don't. So it's all assumptions in your wings.
5
People do the best they are able to do. No one choses mental illness, addiction or other extreme behaviors. In every family there is a mixture of good and evil.
Focus on the good that came, not the dysfunction, and you will become a compassionate, mature adult.
57
Well said. It’s good to hear from reasonable people!
3
A mature, reasoned, empathetic comment. Perfect.
4
To Balynt: If you also don't focus on the dysfunction, you will never become a compassionate, mature adult, because in order to transcend your past, you must understand it first. Period.
10
The assumption in the article is that it is the child that has distanced from the parents. But there is a parent's perspective, too. When I found out my son had sexually abused his sister, I could not remain in contact with him. This is not just a "child" thing. Parents also have good reasons for distancing themselves from children.
86
Thank you for standing up to this. I’m estranged from my family because my mother let two of her boyfriends and my brother molest my sister and I and she sees nothing wrong with it. He’s actually her obvious favourite child.
9
Thank you for being one of the few family members of incest victims that takes the side of the victim and not the perpetrator. Sadly that is not the norm.
2
My ex-wife was never interested in cultivating a healthy marriage. We have three children. I divorced her after years of soul-searching, reasoning that I (A) would never want my children to live in a "marriage" like mine, and (B) I wanted to remarry so they could experience what a happy marriage is like before they flew the nest. My middle daughter, now 16, hasn't spoken to me in years and has ignored my attempts to have a relationship. During our last conversation a few years ago, she said she hated me, never wanted to see me again, did not consider me to be her father, and would only refer to me by my first name. She has been unbelievably nasty to me. Her mother encouraged this. I'm now very happily remarried, my other two children and I have a great relationship, and I gained a wonderful 16 year old step-daughter who adores me. I don't miss my estranged daughter. As awful as it sounds, I'm waiting for the day she asks something from me. Like money. At the moment, I plan to tell her to never contact me again under any circumstances. I don't need her, and she certainly doesn't need me. She will be 18 in the blink of an eye. I have resigned myself to her decision, and there is no turning back for me.
34
That's cold bro. I'm in a similar situation and your response hit me like a heart attack. I really have strong feelings about my nasty daughter too, but she's 16 and when I was 16 I wasn't the best either. Your daughter is still a young girl who probably feels a lot of ambivalent feeling about a lot things. Imagine when she does come to you for something and you are open, loving, and compassionate about both of your feelings, starting out with "Let's talk first,..." What if she had transformed herself into an angel and you miss out on that. I wish the best for you two : )
6
You might need to be the adult here. She is a child. Keep that door open. Maybe she sensed that you wouldn’t miss her, and that somehow, money might be a way you would control the relationship. See her thru college, financially, if you can, as much as you can.
4
I hope at some point you mature and find in your heart to try to imagine what your daughter has gone through. The comment about hoping she asks you for money, so you can say no, does not bode well. "She will be 18 in the blink of an eye. I have resigned myself to her decision, and there is no turning back for me." You are still the adult and still her father. If she "turns back," you will need to stretch a bit, and turn to meet her.
5
I’m the youngest of five. They are all domineering, critical and abusive people. I cut ties years ago, and have never regretted it. It’s unfortunate that it hurt my mother in her later years, but in truth she was part of the problem. I witness so many of my friends suffer the misfortune of unpleasant but supposedly obligatory family relationships. I wish everyone could liberate themselves, because life really is much better if one can just get over the Norman Rockwell imagery that assaults us during the holidays. Be of good cheer, my fellow travelers in life! Find faithful friends and pets, and be content.
183
Your comment resonated so well with my story. My decision to distance myself and to no longer play the role in my family was intentional and happened over time. Ultimately I moved away, 2000 miles away, and have built a network of support outside my family comprised of people who see me and accept me fully - a soul tribe, so to speak. The backlash and intense, overt shaming I experienced when I began to say "no," followed by the move, confirmed my decision that separation was necessary. I also feel so liberated. I have cut some very deep ties and in turn have come to see myself in a new light. Free.
3
Youngest of six here. I moved 25 years abo and live a very happy and fullfilling life with my wife and children. My wife and I both work hard to make our immediate family that we have the best possible.
1
I have noticed that since the election of a malignant narcissist to the presidency of the US, many friends who had accommodated their own malignantly narcissistic fathers through childhood and into adulthood, have now chosen to sever those damaging ties. Sometimes, it seems, we can only see our default acceptance of the unacceptable when it is highlighted through distance. Many members of my family recognized our pater familias (his misogyny, racism, homophobia, and profound cruelty) most clearly when his personality was evident in that other horrible man. I have heard the same from others who, as if waking from a fog, only recognized the breadth and depth of the ongoing cost to themselves, their siblings, spouses, and children just over a year ago. Sad as it may be to walk away, separation can save lives.
115
The current resident of the White House reminds me of my narcissistic abuser, my father, and the election gave me the strength to end all of the abuse and dysfunction, and walk away.
10
A truly important article and topic that should be written about more frequently, especially around the holidays. My family could be the poster child for family estrangement. In my case, my family left people out, bullied others, not to mention neglected and abused others. Much of it stems from undiagnosed mental illness. As a child, I was blind to it all; every last drop. As an adult, I cannot turn a blind eye. For all those who may similarly have suffered, I hold you in my thoughts and deepest prayers this Christmas. May you never feel alone.
119
This election and its consequences forced me to face the reality that I didn't even know some of the people to whom I'm related.
156
"This election and its consequences forced me to face the reality that I didn't even know some of the people to whom I'm related."
How shallow. People here are speaking of relatives as close as parents and siblings and how miserable they've been made, miserable enough to estrange themselves from them forever and you use their political leanings as an example for doing the same? You trivialize the subject!
8
Her comment trivializes nothing. The abuse other commenters describe is horrible and certainly necessitates estrangement. But abuse is not the only valid reason for estrangement. Discovering that your family endorses racism, sexual assault, general hatred of anyone foreign or different from themselves, and only cares about "getting theirs" is also a completely legitimate reason to remove them from your life.
13
I disagree. One can avoid discussions on politics or views on subjects and still relate to a person on the familial basis. I don't have to agree with a person completely on every issue to relate to them otherwise.
Putting up with those who abuse your good nature by borrowing and not paying back (stealing) is a good reason to stay away from them although if you don't allow them to do this to you they'll probably be the ones to drop you first.
1
Does no one else become estranged because of politics or religion? My younger sister has withdrawn from contact with me because I won't let her "save my soul" in what she considers the "end of days," and because I didn't vote for Donald Trump the way she did. If we could agree to disagree on such subjects, I would be willing to ignore and/or forgive all her efforts to "reform" me, but those are her life themes now in our old age. You would think a "saved" person wouldn't be so bitter, but she is.
125
There is another side to this coin. We are Christians and have endured pointed insult after pointed insult about our belief in the "sky fairy" And we catch in both directions because we can't stand Trump and think the 2nd Amendment should be repealed. Sometimes giving a little distance to relationships (he won't be president forever) helps.
5
Sorry for your loss. It is like she is in a cult.
5
Not Christian, but you can be my friend any day.
I've been estranged from my 94-year-old father for the better part of 20 years. He cut off from me first, and after a minor misunderstanding about something I'd written in an email. I apologized, but it wasn't enough. The history of our relationship was built on my groveling to gain his forgiveness. At the age of 47, I was beyond needing him. When my brother passed away a few years later, we had a brief period of reunification, but his belittling of me, my family, my accomplishments, and things that make me happy started up again within a year's time , and so I cut off contact with him. I've always said I would let him back in if he made the first move. It's the only way I can know he's changed. In 15 years, he has never made a single attempt. I'm at peace with the way things are. I expect him to die within the next few years, and I have no plans to attend his funeral. I love my dad, but he made it impossible for me to have a relationship with him.
72
The knowledge that your son won't attend your funeral is almost unbearable, almost more than living the actual fact of estrangement. That will be my fate. Of course, I will be dead and won't even know. But it's that knowledge that dying is a slow process and that during that process you realize you are passing into a permanent infinity of unresolvable estrangement, lying there knowing that it has finally come down to the ultimate, permanent rejection. That's what I think about. I devoted my life to my son. It's hard to believe that people can ignore a lifetime of love, support and devotion. But for some people it's apparently not too difficult. Nor does the transitory nature of life have any affect on people in their 40's. They live entirely in the moment and think it will last forever. Maybe when he's 70, he will decide there might have been a better way to handle it, but I won't be there for him to fix it. I apologized, expressed my desire to make things right, assured him of my love, attended counseling and never got any discussion of why this happened, what he wanted, or what he thought had happened. If there is a god, my advice world have been to work a little bit longer on human beings before issuing the finished product. Strangely, he managed to do a very good job with dogs.
4
Please, please go to the funeral.
Why? He won't know.
7
I had good family and relatives before coming to the USA from the former USSR. I had very difficult time living in the USSR and after its breakdown. My father was the only person who helped me to get to the US alive. It was the biggest warning sign about my family/relatives. And step by step, I cut off 2 step-sisters, mother, a step-brother, an aunt, 2 cousins, mother's cousins with their families. I am free now and enjoying life in America.
It was not easy to cut them off from my life and thanks to business opportunities here in the US that helped me create an independent life.
31
Good for you. And thank you for all you've done to make the US a better place.
2
Thanks for this article. Very timely. Sometimes it can be a relief to be cut off by an adult child, especially if they continue the criticism and disapproval that was the main theme of a failed marriage. As long as my daughter is happy, I am fine being cut off.
15
The way I see it in my life is "she learned from her father how to treat me."
1
This article may serve as a huge source of relief and comfort to many, like me, who never thought they would find themselves in the throes of a family estrangement. Mine is a sister. I wish the article had delved more into sibling estrangement. It has been a terrible source of anxiety, stress, and anger. She and I are from a family of 5 children, all born in rapid succession. Our parents retired to the deep south, and as we scattered across the country she and I ended up in the same general area. WHen my children were young she spent every holiday with us. She never married but had dramatic, volatile relationships that would end suddenly with horrible stories from her about her former partners. And her former bosses and co-workers as she lost job after job--very high level executive jobs, mind you, she is highly educated. Nothing was EVER her fault. EVER. It took years and years for the truth to finally come out, she is an addict and most definitely mentally ill, and rejects all responsibility for her actions. She tells more lies than a person can keep straight. She absolutely trashed my husband and me to the rest of the family. She binge drinks to the point of near death, has been injured, had numerous car accidents been arrested , caused property damage. Now she is 60, completely broke, with outstanding legal issues and a house that is being foreclosed. Realizing I couldn't be around her anymore was the beginning of my own recovery, emotionally.
87
I'm disappointed that there is no mention of the role mental illness plays in estrangement.
My sister is a textbook BPD and she made our utterly miserable. Yet, when she cut off from the family shortly after my father's death, my widowed mother was in despair over the additional loss.
My mother tried for decades to win her back, begging, crying and apologizing for things she had never done--anything to appease her.
But BPDs have their own version of reality in which they are completely innocent and everyone else is at fault.
People who claim to cut off from "toxic parents" may actually be the toxic ones themselves.
80
Estrangement has occurred within my own family, and your last line says it all. Thank you for this.
1
If find that siblings who are scapegoated by their parents end up with these kind of labels. When you can't see the abuse that's been heaped onto a person since childhood, their reaction to that abuse is going to seem insane. Thank your lucky stars you were the "good" kid.
4
Diagnosed by psychiatrists, not family members, as having borderline personality order.
And, no, she wasn't abused or scapegoat. BPD is a real mental disorder, Michelle. Maybe you should "thank your lucky stars" no one in your family has it.
9
There comes a time when you just know. One reader’s comment described it as moving towards the light. If you have finally figured out a relationship is toxic, be grateful you are intuitive enough to protect yourself and know when to move on.
I wish that for anyone. Move on! Whether it is toxic families or toxic marriages or toxic friendships. Trust yourself and find new souls with which to connect.
There is a load of pain,but also, so much joy.
107
Thanks for writing about estrangement. It is always comforting to hear about other dysfunctional families. I realized when I was a child that my emotional needs didn't register for my mother (if I'm not mistaken, she is a textbook narcissist). I tried to obtain 'motherly' behavior from her (affection, interest in my life) for years. In my twenties, I finally gave up on any hope that she could reciprocate emotionally in a way that 'worked' for me. It made more sense to treat her like a sick person from whom to expect nothing, and to look for emotional connection and fulfillment elsewhere. I still see her, but since she distorts information, misremembers, and makes everything about herself (and now more than ever since she has grown older), I tell her as little as possible. This protects me from the feelings of rage, abandonment, and disappointment that almost every interaction with her inevitably produced. It was one of the best decisions I ever made. Of course, she didn't even notice that anything had changed.
121
Justine, sounds very much like my situation. I love my mother but since the age of about 5 or 6, or for as long as I can remember, I've been expected to focus on her emotional needs rather than the other way around... I've had to be HER mother... so I've never had a maternal mother Who met my emotional needs as a child or teen. (My teen years were horrible! And I was so happy when I could finally flew off to college!)
And like you, I couldn't share much with my mom; she isn't particularly interested beyond the small talk. But you know what? In my 40's now, I've gotten over it. Not having my emotional needs met as a kid, having to be emotionally independent has made me resilient! Sort of like a weed. I have deep admiration for weeds. ;-)
9
Justine, I applaud you for figuring out in your 20s...I didn't until I was in my mid-40s after I did a search on my phone one night lying in bed...these two words "ignoring mother" ...that's when I finally got my answer to her horrible behavior.
5
Wow. Does that resonate.
More and more I hear from aging parents whose children/grandchildren are ‘so busy’ and seldom call or visit, causing hurtful though perhaps unintended estrangement. The time to appreciate someone who’s been there for the family for years is when they’re alive, not at a memorial service.
34
@Grandma: Believe me, there is plenty of the opposite behavior going on! In my family, my mother couldn't be bothered with her grandchildren, even though I & my siblings went out of our way NOT to let our own difficulties with our mother taint our children's relationships with her.
Despite everything, there came a time when Grandma couldn't be bothered to see her grandchildren - even when a family member offered to pick her up at her home to take her to events, and to bring her back to her home afterward.
Grandma missed birthdays, barbecues, soccer games, graduations, religious celebrations and all sorts of lovely occasions. She stopped calling, she stopped even sending a greeting card. She missed knowing some really wonderful grandkids! The loss was entirely hers. The grandchildren eventually realized (on their own) that Grandma was not interested in them.
4
My maternal grandmother was a soulmate. I always sat next to my "nana" at dinner, always in the kitchen as she cooked, we saw her and my "pop pop" every week. He, my aunt, her husband and their kids withheld affection. The contrast pushed me closer to Nana.
She passed suddenly when I was ten. I took off school to go with my mom, and at one point sat in "my" chair at the empty table. My aunt came in and did a double-take. Tears in her eyes anew, she said with a hug, "This must be hardest for you, you were always her favorite." I was stunned—I'd never thought of it that way. And she'd never said an unprompted word to me; our hugs were alohas not affection.
My grandfather came for dinner once a week after that and I got to know him as an individual but with adolescence, homework and extracurricular activities often saw me excuse myself.
My widowed paternal grandmother constantly fought with my dad—as did we all—and came to appreciate me when I stood up for her.
But they never invited me to do anything one on one like some friends' grandparents. It would've been easy to initiate with Nana but I felt the other two saw me as just one of the kids at Christmas, birthdays, big occasions.
Near the end of her life, my dad prodded me to visit his mom without him—one of the best things he ever did. I introduced her to a girlfriend and brought chocolate-covered strawberries one Mother's Day. I never saw her so relaxed and happy.
Wish I'd known sooner how special that'd be to us both.
3
Not sure where I found it, but therapist Tina Gilbertson has written a book that helped me a great deal: GUIDE FOR PARENTS OF ESTRANGED ADULT CHILDREN http://tinagilbertson.com/estrangement-guide-1/ For people who purchase the book she conducts a VERY helpful monthly phone discussion. Primarily the way it's helped me is simply to know I'm not alone (and evil!) with this problem. It's a difficult thing to shoulder especially when you have absolutely no idea this will ever happen to you. My story is long and involved, but I was very close to my kids when they were growing up. I've not seen or heard from them going on 8 years. After such closeness, it's crazy-making sometimes to wonder why this has happened. Like many of you I have an endless conversation with myself about what I could have done that was any worse than any parent I know. Someone says in the comments, "the hurt gets lighter, or more bearable with time." For me that's the best comment in this thread. Time really does heal, never completely, always a scar, but it does heal. Best of luck and comfort to all of you. Thanks for this article.
24
I've been estranged from my toxic parents and in-denial brother for nearly a decade. The toughest challenge has been dealing with other family members, friends, and even strangers who don't know exactly how to react. I can now stop feeling guilty for their awkwardness. Instead, on their behalf, I'll thank you for this incredibly insightful article.
85
G Todd,
The worst part are the people who insist that "family is everything" and judge you morally bankrupt for not having one or being estranged from your birth family. Experience has taught me to estrange myself from them too.
89
My two sisters were fully estranged for it seems over 10 years. It took the death of my own son (a young adult) for them to reconcile. They put aside their past grievances, as well as negative influence from a spouse (I dont like your sister) to re-connect. Which lasted about 3 months, when my younger sister dropped over from a heart attack. Life is short.
39
Thanks for this timely article.
One definition of insanity is doing the same thing again and again and expecting different results. Dealing with my siblings, especially my sister, was insane -- unpredictable, hurtful, sad. I used to say "a good month is a month when I don't hear from her." I still feel pangs upon occasion, then I remember how hard I tried to make things work. The past three years have been a whole lot easier; I honestly don't miss her one bit. The thought of 'getting in the ring' with someone who doesn't fight fair just because she's family would be insane.
I'm not crazy.
99
Yes, but you might be treated as the crazy one by siblings who want you to endure a "difficult" sibling's abuse rather than defend yourself because they want peace and quiet at any cost.
I'm the middle child of a large family, with an abusive big sister (BS) who never takes responsibility for her actions but sees herself as the victim, the "family scapegoat." The last time we met, she yelled at me, so I yelled back. She went crying to another sister about how I'd hurt her (not mentioning how she initiated the confrontation), so my other sister scolded me. What especially hurt is that my other sister took BS's story at face value and cut me off when I tried to defend myself. An abusive sibling will undermine healthy family relationships out of resentment or an effort to get pity. At this point, I'm just too old to deal with it. It's easier to simply walk away from all the siblings.
2
AS we all know, hind sight is 20-20. Oh gods, I wished I had it when I was 18, maybe younger. I would have left my family.
But I didn't, because I was terrified of the world. My family was terrifying enough. Everything, well most things, were tinged in fear.
Too, too, much fear in life. Far too much. And later its reaction—for me—rushes in: anger. We get angry when we realize that it was wrong to bathe in so very much fear, fear that strips our dignity. So much anger is sad to carry. It is poison.
Sit down. Realize that it may take months for an answer. It may take only a day. Find someone you can trust to talk to about these things. Then, if it is right, leave your family.
Leave them. And never come back.
Do right by yourself.
111
@Slipping Glimpser... if not already in the works, write a book. Clear, powerful, effective voice, yours... Well done.
13
It sounds like you weren’t given life skills as a young adult so don’t beat yourself up for not leaving at 18. One thing I’ve learned, as a survivor of an alcoholic abusive father, is to not fear life. Persevere and keep moving. Only you can teach yourself how to move forward and take care of yourself.
1
Lots of anger expressed here toward commenters' parents. Kinda surprised not to have heard more about schisms caused by the infamous family Will.
20
True but sometimes one's dignity (and mental health) is worth more than money.
15
Because those schisms existed before the death that triggered the reading of the will.
14
Don't even get me started. It's a saga. Wills. Unfairness. So unfair. All my fault. After 5 years I said, goodbye to trying. I feel 50 lbs lighter.
1
They say - To err is human. To forgive is divine.
If you have an abusive parent and are unprotected and one child is considered "the favorite" then there is a lot of baggage. No one wants to go through life with this baggage. BUT - a heart can be healed and it's always good to stitch up wounds for so many reasons.
Estranged for years from my mother and father, encouraged to stay in that pattern by an abusive spouse, it changed itself as I began to understand some of what drove them. One day I realized I'd left the baggage of what they'd done on a corner - it didn't just "happen" but happen it did.
Then Hurricane Sandy hit, my father was deceased, my mother abandoned by her favorite child (I was not that favorite - but the butt of the abuse). However, I brought her back to my home, nursed her back to health, found out that her favorite child had been massively stealing from her, tried to put her accounts, health, etc. in order. She told me things I did not know about my family history that stunned me, and informed me so much.
The Thanksgiving after Sandy we were together having dinner, just the two of us in a very nice restaurant. I asked her what were the things, as she looked back on her life, that she treasured most - her trips to foreign places, her many accomplishments in her "career". etc. She turned to me and said very simply "the thing I treasure most is having you as my child."
Words cannot explain how that made me feel. Whole.
128
This is a beautiful thing to share. Obviously you did the work it took to get to that place with your mother. You communicated and were willing to take a risk.
This article and many of the comments are so sad and disheartening. In my experience, real communication can transform our relationships. So much of what erodes relationships is things left unsaid, words and actions misinterpreted. Often we don’t simply have the courage to speak to that person directly and openly (not yelling and screaming and blaming, not passive aggressive communication). Listening. Making sure the other is heard. Being willing to be vulnerable. Putting aside the defensiveness. Being willing to accept responsibility for the things we’ve said and done. And being willing to own up to being a jerk, etc. This can clear the path for restoring relationships.
So often it’s the work we need to do on ourselves that has not been done that ruins our relationships with others. We think it’s everyone else. As the country song goes: wherever you go, there you are.
24
This is so completely true! Reading through the comments about all the horrible things people have done to each other that led eventually to estrangement from some or all of their family, I found it hard not to support many of these decisions to break off contact. The pain has indeed been deep and real. Yet such experiences also offer the opportunity to go beyond the “cure” of estrangement to the transformation of forgiveness and reconciliation. To do this is not easy, since it requires bravery to tap that much humility and self-reflection. But the rewards in personal growth and insight are enormous, and can lead to some surprising turns in these estranged relationships as well.
3
@Doug Mattingly: "Real communication" can only get you so far, because it DOES take two to tango, and if one party is immovable, then it's game-over.
I (and many other people commenting here) could write volumes on the sincere efforts we've made to hear and to be heard - the risks we have taken to be open & vulnerable in talking to other family members, in the hope that our vulnerability will open the door for a true dialogue. In many, many cases all of it is for naught.
I spent decades trying "to please" and bending over backwards to see what I could do to make things better. In the long run, I saw that the other family members has no intention of ever being different by one iota, and they told me that to my face, while mocking my efforts. I was called stupid, useless, and an embarrassment to the family.
Fortunately, in the long run I had enough insight (and enough therapy) to know that *I* was NOT the problem here. There are people who will not budge a millimeter in order to get closer or to make things better, and in these situations, no "restoration" is possible.
7
My solution to avoiding a future dysfunctional family, don’t marry and don’t have children.
67
How about an article entitled "the true cost of estrangement" or even "how to avoid estrangement"? It's one of the worst things that can happen to anyone and listing "myths" about it is a complete waste of time.
22
You are not "listening". The whole point here is that being estranged from ones family is not always the worst thing that can happen to a person. That is a myth. Sometimes we have to cut our losses, take stock of what is good in our life and also leave some things that hold us back and keep us occupied in a perpetual exercise in futility behind us. If you don't identify with this you are lucky. Try to have some empathy for those of us who do.
80
@Rachel: I accept that for YOU, estrangement is "one of the worst things that can happen to anyone" - but YOU must accept that for me and many hundreds of others commenting here, estrangement has been the BEST thing that has happened to us. We ALL would have preferred having an intact loving family, but that is not the reality!
90
I was estranged from my father for 10. I am estranged from my daughter for 1 and a half months. In both cases, had I tried to be a different person, less false-pride, less "I'm the father". and just taken things as they are, I would have avoided both situations. Now dad is in an assisted living facility and he appreciates my calls. Need to figure out what to do with my daughter, but my pride is getting in the way and she is Naaaasty.
1
Some families are just too horrible to endure, so cutting them off as soon as possible is the only reasonable option.
To the people who fail to understand this: congrats on winning the birth-lottery.
198
I'm disappointed that this article is written as if estrangement is caused only by parental abuse. I have an estranged sister whose cruelty was clear even as a small child--she would pull one leg off grasshoppers and laugh as they tried to hop away. When it came time to get professional help, she would not cooperate. I watched my poor mother swallow her pride and beg when my sister, as an adult, frequently threatened to cut off contact. It was almost a relief when she finally followed through. Tragically, she only did so after she had a daughter she could torment instead.
38
OMG. I feel horrified for you to have a sibling who started off torturing animals, insect or no. I feel for you and her child.
21
Joren Ander's point about choosing peace of mind over an unhealthy relationship borne out of DNA speaks volumes. Listen to the song "Praying" by Kesha. I wish my brother the very best, and pray he finds peace before he dies. But I choose peace of mind over DNA, especially when the DNA is destructive, unhealthy, replete with sociopathy.
64
Dr. Phil can’t fix this. My wife and I are both estranged from our children. Twenty years ago I threatened my ex wife ‘s boy friend with emasculation I didn’t shoot. My kids hate me. My 2nd wife’s kids hate her because of money. My x was cheated on by her new husband and they divorced after one year. My new wife and I are together almost 20 years. We’re happy. We’re retired, very secure financially but we miss not seeing our grandkids. The door here is always open but no one is interested save my son who meets us at Disney World. He’s a successful lawyer but still asks for money. I was a good father. My x told the kids tales from the crypt poisoning my daughter. Brand X still hates me because the divorce master awarded me her pension. She took money from our estate and disappeared it with her boy friend. My daughter believes I should return the money. I have millions and could but not after being cheated on for two years. So my daughter hates me. Too bad! I’m happy! Estrangement is normal and frequent. My wife and I take care of each other and continue to leave openings. We enjoy ourselves but miss the other grand kids. Some of my high school friends have had very similar experiences. We’ve made lives and new friends. Thank you god for being good to us. We are grateful for everything. Kids, we’re here! Come on down!
9
It sounds like a dominating stance of vengeance toward your ex-wife obstructs your relationship with your children and grandchildren. A wise person told me once, regarding a certain, justified anger, "drop it, move on." I did, and it was liberating.
25
None of us are free of struggle of some kind and this topic resonates for many. I am sure you mean well. Jay participates here as we all do - relating to the topic, sharing, not necessarily seeking advice.
2
Wow! You don't sound that happy.....is that happy to you?
3
It reminds me of the decision to no longer have contact with my father. One day when I was 34, it just hit me that I was the same age my father was when I was born. I realized that there is no way I could do any of the things he did that hurt me and my siblings so much. Never spoke to him again even when he was dying. Had absolutely no interest and no bad feelings about it at all. It took another 20 years to figure out what had happened and dump the rest of the family.
My family with the exception of my maternal grandmother basically abandoned me by the time I was 2 years old. By the time i was 4 I was in state custody at the behest of the maternal branch who wanted to hide what they had been doing to me. The whole family including my father prevented his mother from taking me in when she asked to have me instead of leaving me with the state. Seems almost funny to me now that the memories are bubbling up and I'm putting together the fact that both sides hated each other with passion and worked so hard to hide what they were doing to me they probably had no idea the other side was abusing me just as badly in different ways. One side planned to murder me in a staged accident so they could sue, the other wanted to infantilize me by cutting off all stimulation to make me forget something they feared I would blurt out to the wrong person. The state people who were "protecting" me abused me far worse than my family and more than most would believe. Mengele would have been at home.
12
So so sad to hear this. Yet in between the lines I sense a bright, thoughtful survivor. Good for you.
2
It is fascinating to read these comments as a glimpse into the thoughts of my sister. She has cut off all contact with her entire family.
Be cautious when you hear these one-sided stories of abuse and neglect. My sister is an alcoholic who would come to every family function drunk and abusive. When we finally got the courage to confront her addiction, she cut off all contact. We live in the same area and she has regaled people with truly horrific stories of how we’ve treated her. We’re abusive, cruel.
What’s sad is that I believe she truly believes the stories she tells herself. Addiction is a miserable, horrible disease.
50
Count your blessings. The unrecovered addict or alcoholic who cuts him or herself off from the family is doing the family a favor. I know this from the other side.
33
S., your story is mine. I have an older sister who is an alcoholic and in complete denial. Literally for years I covered for her as she lied to eveyrone in our family. She and I had the misfortune of living in the same city, hundreds (and in one case, thousands) of miles away from the rest of my family. She lied to them constantly about me and my husband, especially him, how mean we were, just awful awful stories. She lost job after job, was repeatedly hospitalized, would sign herself out and then binge again. Recently fortune smiled on me and she left this state for another hundreds of miles away, skipping out on legal and financial woes. I am not sorry.
8
If there is a benefit to the narrative, i.e. give me the kids, the money, your attention or other benefits always look for how the underlying truth might differ. If you get the feeling you are being controlled, manipulated or that the story just does not match up, those thoughts ARE worthy of further introspection. As for me, I do everything I can for others to experience safety from the narrative(s) when they are with me. Though it is a lonely road to walk I am sure it is the right one. The "others" did nothing to deserve the fallout. Amen, to further discussion of mental illness in the context of estrangement.
I've tried for 27 years to bend over backward to keep the peace in the family with my cliquish, petty sister and mother. They've excluded me and my family and my mother ignores my children.
I just turned 60 and have decided to let it go. I would love for things to be different but I can't change them.
I'm fortunate to have a husband and three lovely kids and some other relatives who rest me with love and respect.
Sometimes the healthiest thing is just to let go...and turn the page.
53
Thank you for this article! I no longer see or speak to my father and brother, my mother died some time ago. Family gatherings at the holidays used to feel like an obligation I couldn't get out of, and of course my friends all gather with their families at the holidays, so it seemed like the natural thing to do. I chose to cut off my father and brother primarily because they both view me as a disgusting liberal. Conversation with either of them means listening to Rush Limbaugh quotes. At first I felt badly about my decision, and envied my friends' good family relationships. But the more I thought about it I had to admit that my friends have good relations with their families because they are all nice people. My father and brother are nasty bigots - one of my brother's favorite things to say about people who disagree with him is "they should be lined up against a wall and shot". Why would anyone want to spend valuable time with people like that?
75
Marilyn;
I have -- or I should say used to have -- a best friend who morphed from a somewhat moderate Republican into a radical right wing Rush Limbaugh Republican. He hates liberals, Democrats, Obama, Hillary, etc.
I OTOH used to be a moderate Repub but over the years transitioned to an Independent who is fiscally conservative and socially progressive. My ex-best friend would go off on his Rush Limbaugh rants in person and through e-mails that made me bite my tongue many times.
Add all this to his arrogance (which in his case was false confidence that he used tried to try and hide his numerous insecurities) and many times would make plans with me only to fail to follow through. There was one final time that he flaked out on me that was the last straw.
I looked back on his extremist political views (which only served as a vehicle to express his intense hatred) and his callous behavior towards me and decided that this relationship , even though it was over 40 years, stretching back to high school, was no longer something I wanted to be a part of.
While I have not completely cut off all contact, there is definitely a lot more distance between us and I can see the day where we will have no contact at all. And while I am in some ways sad things have come to this, it is something that has been a long time in coming.
Not all relationships, even family as per this article, are meant to last until death do you part and this one with my long-time best friend is one of them.
14
Can’t you just agree to not talk politics?
Isn’t that the old rule: don’t talk politics and religion.
4
Thank you Flatlander!
I can't say I'm happy to be a estranged from other family members but I can say I'm happy not to be connected with them.
62
Yes. This. Sadly. But it’s a relief mingled with sadness.
18
Yes, I understand this inner conflict.
2
Children of abusive parents get a double whammy: They spend a lifetime of trying to recover from the abuse. Then when they finally cut off all ties to those parents, they are shamed by society for not being "good children".
200
Thank you SO much for writing this. People who did not grow up under abuse simply can not understand and often also perpetuate shame on others/friends who choose not to stay involved with people who abused them as children. I often ask them, would you spend holidays with someone who murdered your children? They don't understand, but childhood abuse murders your soul, which one then has to spend years re-building....anyone who grew up with abuse will understand....those who did not will either consciously or unconsciously hand out shame....e.g. "I'm so sorry your estranged....OR Are you visiting your parents for Christmas?" When you say no, those with seemingly perfect families (of course they often are not) will often seem silently judgmental. If you won the birth lottery and have a wonderful birth family, please understand not all of us did and try to understand why we don't pretend all is well....thank you!
41
I definitely get it. I am so tired of having to explain my estranged abusive family. When people ask me, "What are you doing for the holidays", I now reply simply with, "I'm an orphan", and it's an awkward enough response (not for me, but for the person asking) that they don't ask anymore. Works for me, especially cause I do feel very much like an orphan in the midst of it all.
5
Yup.
I am estranged from my entire family. My biological father and his family never had much contact with me. My mother was an angry drunk; my stepfather also drinks and lies, and I have to deal with the aftermath of his very poor financial decisions. My grandmother is emotionally manipulative and focused on herself. These people raised me. I was fed, educated, I had nice things when we could afford them. But they showed no respect, they berated me, hit me, mocked me and lied to me for convenience. They shamed me and then denied that anything bad ever happened to me. In fact, the family has always insisted that I should be grateful, because I have it so good with so many people "scarificing" for me. I am so happy I don't have to deal with them anymore.
37
HI Olga, lots of abusive parents live in denial, pretending their entire life things are "perfect"; thanks for commenting with your story!
13
Totally get the 'after all we've done for you' thing.
14
Thank you. It's always helpful to know I am not alone.
The best decision I've made in my 55 years was deciding to end the relationship with my abusive mother. It completed changed my life for me and those I love for the better.
32
I dumped my toxic and cruel mother 15 years ago and it was the most liberating act of my life. I've never looked back. Some of my siblings went along with her. I am fortunate in that I have three siblings I adore, a wonderful husband and a continent between us.
24
My reasons for choosing estrangement from my surviving mother are covered well in the article. My mother is a malignant narcissist and after my twin sisters suicide many things became clear to me about her illness. Always belittling and intentionally hurtful along with theft of my inheritance after my fathers death were just the tip of the iceberg. She always had a reason and justification for her behavior and for 55 years I never heard her apologize to anyone for anything. The choice of estrangement was the best of two bad choices. My only regret is not having done it sooner.
38
Duug;
Hear you loud and clear about having a mother who never apologizes for anything.
My late mother was one of those people who felt she was never wrong about anything and if there was a problem it was always caused by someone else, never her.
Getting her to try and understand reason was impossible so my wife and I quit trying. We distanced ourselves as much as possible from her and rarely saw her in person even though we lived close by.
I didn't like this relationship with my mom but the only alternative would have been complete estrangement.
10
This article misses a very significant cause of estrangement. That is, in the case of a divorce, one parent makes the child (directly or not so obviously) choose between parents. The victim parent is incessantly criticized, mocked, humiliated etc to alienate the child from the victim parent. It happens a lot but nobody wants to admit it.
32
My father claimed this. It was not true, no one turned me against him. They may have kept him away from me but he was never a father when he could be only a narcissist who saw his children as potential worshipers at the church of him.
10
This happened to me
The importance of familial relationships cannot be denied. Look up what happened to the Donner Party on their tragic journey to California. Single travelers with no familial connection to the rest of the group were first to die. The survivors were the families including a pregnant woman. It was that bond that saved them whether they liked each other or not.
2
If I'm ever in such a situation, I'll keep that in mind. In real life, however, there are people who are simply too toxic to be around.
54
Well, now you have me afraid to ever go on a group tour.
23
This is a survival story. How does this relate to the point?
2
I've had issues with my daughter for years but not exactly of my making .... as an abused wife, my ex undermined almost everything with money and gifts and family trips without me .... My 3 children lived with me on an assistant teacher's salary while their father was able to give the lease amount of child support because he paid for their parochial school. I wasn't able to financially compete and still cannot ..... sometimes estrangement is very complicated ..... two of my children are much closer to him because he is always ready with the money ..... they also accepted his view of me as a person and financial contributor, which was never very flattering ..... i don't want to be estranged from them, but sometimes i limit my own contact just to protect myself .... they still rant about all the things their father did for them when I couldn't and still hold it against me ..... who needs that? i love my kids beyond my life and would give anything to have them in my life and going forward in a healthy way ... but who needs all this drama about things I had no control over? it's quite well known that a parent who suffered spousal abuse runs the risk of one or more children continuing it on ..... and in many ways estrangement and financial humiliation is abuse ..... I've made peace with it and i am content with avoiding them as well ......
22
thanks so much. Your comment really speaks to me.
7
The children have been manipulated with the use of money; they, like their father, continue to abuse you; this is a very familiar occurrence. You are not alone with this.
1
An important test to see if estrangement was/is the right choice: if you had a boyfriend/girlfriend who treated you the way your relative treats you, would people close to you tell you to end that romantic relationship? Our culture has come a long way in demanding mutual respect and equality of our romantic partners, but we still need to let go of these archaic ideas that "people need to stick with their families no matter what," that "blood is thicker than water," and other clichés that smack of authoritarianism. Many people who think like this also believe that this requirement for unconditional love gives them a free pass to act according to how their whims carry them in the moment. Respect (which is not the same thing as submission) always needs to be mutual.
88
Yes! Society tells us that we're obligated because BLOOD. But if that doesn't come with respect and kindness, the blood is too thin.
20
This was my thought process in deciding to let go of a relationship with one of my siblings. I’d thought to myself if a friend and I were to have absolutely nothing in common - on top of that person being psychologically abusive - I would drop them like a hot potato. Best thing I ever did - proven by a very brief interaction after many years of estrangement - the ‘drama’ was still there and more intense than ever. I couldn’t estrange myself again fast enough!
10
It took cutting free from toxic family and being taken in by friends who called me family, only to find out they are also toxic, to cherish being alone. Freedom is sweet. Too many takers in the world.
17
Many retreat into solitude. It is a survival mechanism. Used to be referred to as being 'twice bitten'. I am highly intolerant of mean and or abusive and obnoxious/loud people. I don't like most people. Their headaches most often become yours. And they often don't reciprocate kindness. I see many that thrive upon dysfunction and their relationships often reflect that. Being nice and respectful are traits that are becoming harder to locate in others today.
Rudeness, lying and being mean or greedy are considered assets.
24
I understand and I know others who feel this way. Their experiences have taught them this, and a variety of circumstances are at play. This can be discouraging, and I always feel a special tug or bond for someone who shares this perspective. I want to say "No! Don't forget how many good people are out there!" But, disrespect and disregard are real and immense. Please take care.
1
Trump’s America?
1
In a family, you don't always find the same genes, my husband often reminds me. But, out of my 8 siblings I am fortunate to be able to enjoy most of them.
R. D. Laing, the famous psychiatrist, claimed, rightly so, that your family can drive you crazy.
One alcoholic sibling I have to love from afar because he never seems to know appropriate boundaries. I have to protect myself from him and wait for him to find sobriety and the clear thinking that might follow.
The narcissist sibling in our family is similar but I have no hope of change in him. It took many years to diagnose the problem, especially because prior to the current atmosphere of narcissists and sociopaths in our executive branch and corporate world, our society was not familiar with this pathology. Pre-Trump, I labeled this brother a sociopath, but now I see that he is more a narcissist. He really seems to mostly have eyes for the one in the mirror. He takes from anyone of us siblings, and he has, without thinking twice. He never contacts anyone unless he needs something from them. He can be cruel. In his own words, "I am not a nice person." So, without regret I must keep him at a distance and accept him for what he is.
Worse things could happen. I am lucky that the other six siblings are pretty nice people and I like them!
10
"Pre-Trump"! Yes.
You are too kind; he behavior sounds like sociopathy to me.
1
It got easier with time and distance to stop the charade.
29
Best overall comment ;)
8
I remember hearing this from a young man at my son’s graduation: “Growing up means that you come to realize that your family may not be your best friends.”
40
Great article. Experience this with my four daughters off and on. Sometimes I pull back out of fear of being hurt. I have been trying to put my finger on why this happens, as they sometimes distance themselves from each other. Love them to death and will keep working on my end. Thank you for this article.
5
One study pointed to maltreatment being an underlying reason for estrangements, in fact, the top three (although a small study): "abuse (everything from belittling to physical or sexual abuse), betrayal (keeping secrets or sabotaging them) and poor parenting (being overly critical, shaming children or making them scapegoats)."
Might it be that society's frowning upon estrangements is yet another way that abusers are protected and allowed to continue perpetrating abuse, and their victims must suffer twice? I believe it is yet another way our culture colluded with abusers.
We can change this. We can normalize estrangement.
33
Better that we not tolerate abuse and abusers. Why should abuse be 'normal?'
6
My heart ached when I read this article.in Japan, that fact is also exsist among many famiry.
26
Interesting. I think most people in the U.S. think Japanese families are perfect!
4
I respectfully don't think "most people" in America think any particular country or culture's families are perfect.
1
Speaking from experience East Asian society is perhaps better at estrangement!
I believe Richard Bach, the author, has it right when he says that the bond that links one to their true family is not one of blood, but of joy and respect in each other's lives....
17
Why should I drive hours and days to spend time among people who degrade and disregard me? I have a loving family I strove to create after surviving an abusive childhood. Call this estrangement if you will. Self-protection is more true. Neither my wife or daughter wants to visit any family. We have a good atmosphere at my house, no tension, violence, or personal degradation. Just quiet and palpable love.
52
Estrangement happened between my siblings after my parents died , especially after my mother's death she seemed to be the glue that kept us together. Once my dad passed it seemed there was constant conflict . Some aligned with others against the rest it was exhausting , petty , and sometimes ugly . Because I lived in NY and far away from them did not spare me , and somehow always got dragged in . I often felt a sense of relief to live far away although I loved them . I visited very infrequently because it always reared its ugly head . Too much conflict , accusations , and misconstruing of facts made for many hurt feelings . Have to say that my friends were my family , they were the ones who held my hand thru all the crisis' I may have experienced , Here's to family and friends because thru them you learn to be strong , grow and not get stuck repeating mistakes .
5
A song that comforts me when I’m pitying myself for being alone is, “Alone Again Naturally” sung by Gilbert O’Sullivan. You can find it on YouTube.
To many who have commented, you’ll see we’re not alone, although we all are.
6
It comforts you? Great song but maudlin as all get out.
My healthy and secure son had a normal life until he married, then he became codependent to a wife who could not separate from her mother and her alcoholic stepfather. The daughter in law eventually put a wedge between him and the rest of his family, since they lived in another state and her selfish nature only allowed her own family to have contact with them. When I tried to intervene and talk to my son after witnessing my daughter in law's abuse to my grandchildren over several years, he cut off contact completely. It has been a horrible separation from my son and especially my grandchildren. I tried to help my son recognize how his wife's anxiety disorder was impacting her children, but he was too far into self punishment and submissive to her dominance by that time to help himself. Sadly, it is the children of the dysfunctional adults who typically suffer the most emotional pain from family estrangements. I hope my grandchildren will remember this loving grandmother.
16
Your comment is another justification for the cultures that practice arranged marriage.
Wow. Just wow.
After reading these comments, I am very grateful this Christmas Eve for my big, loud, messy, outspoken, imperfect and loving family of Boston Irish Catholics. We have our differences and temporary silences, but I am seeing how very functional we actually are. The thought of ever being estranged from my young adult children is inconceivable to me.
I am so sorry for those who are alone through no fault of their own.
45
Hi Maureen,
Thanks for your comments; i would suggest congratulate us for breaking the cycle of abuse....the last thing those of us who decided to cut off ties want is pity....I want share we are actually courageous and blazing new trails for the people around us and our immediate family. People who cut off blood ties very often "make their own family from friends". Thank you for reading my reply.
38
Not to mess up Hallmark Card sales, but I think it was Sam
Shepherd who said in one of his plays something to the effect that families are the wellspring of human evil.
A confluence of events too many to enumerate resulted in a whole lot of people to whom I'm related not liking me. Let's just say not everybody is cut out to be a parent. And, what looks on paper like it should work, doesn't always. When things don't progress as predicted, everybody piles on. Let's just say I crawled out from under the hate-fest pile.
It's the cards I was dealt. On the bright side, I'm perfectly comfortable being alone. I know people who cannot be alone for an hour. They need constant attention. That fascinates me. I'm glad I'm not that needful.
14
It may have been Sam Shepherd, but it was more likely Sam Shepard.
5
Over the last 2 years or so, I have become completely disenchanted with my father. The disenchantment is now complete as it's dawned on me that he's a "loser" (harsh as it may sound). He has had no emotional or financial stability for most of my adult life (20+ years), in spite of me working non-stop to support them.
He got my sister married early after dropping her studies because girls are not supposed to work, whereas we two brothers have careers. With 2 failed marriages, no job and a child, I took the responsibility of my sister and my niece(sister's child). I also took take care of my father, his emotional issues and my (late) mother. I love my niece and am happy to take of her but words can't describe my anger, frustration and despair at my father's backwardness in not making my sister independent. He *did* take care of me for the first 20 years of my life but I have taken care of him and more for the last 20 years of my life. So we're even.
Can't write everything down. I don't want to meet him. He makes me very unhappy. Life is so short.
14
Thank you for this relatable article. I had bouts of estrangement with my mom based on another heinous man she married and his treatment of my maternal grandmother. My paternal grandmother, though, was a piece of cake. We were quite close until I matured and realized she was incredibly disingenuous. I grew tired of it and quit calling her and seeing her...I withdrew without making any fanfare about it. That incensed her to the point she tried to disparage me to members of our family...fortunately, they considered the source and called her on it. Blood is not thicker than water in my book...disingenuousness is a trait I cannot tolerate from anyone.
9
Its good to know you are not alone. My mother 'estranged' me the last 20 years of her life. We had it rough, my father committed suicide. She was never able to talk about or come to terms with it, an unjustified guilt trip. I divorced from a good woman and ended up with one not so good; my mother never liked her. As the story, our separating took time, many small incidents. I regretted it and suffered my own guilt trip; a few days before she died, she met her 19 year old grandson and I stayed with her till death. What a waste. I did try several times to no avail, still carry the feeling I did not do enough. She just did not know how to show love and I took a long time to learn, did a lot of work on myself with professional help.
Now I work hard on relationships, with my new wife and my son, brother, and nieces, its often me going towards them. Its worth it.
15
Thank you for sharing! Yes, go forward and enjoy making your family the love of your life!
It was good that you brought your 19 years old son to see his grandmother before her death. I gather you have a third wife now; best of happiness to you and your family; you have learned it.
Estrangement is often a tragedy spanning several generations and cuts particularly deep when mental illness is involved. As this article affirms, the perspectives of parents and children are so vastly dissimilar, and yet for many of us who are estranged, a history of trauma is at the root of the split.
I am estranged from my parents and have been for a large part of my life due to physical, sexual and emotional abuse in a broken fundamentalist family with a history of multigenerational trauma resulting in a complete splintering on both sides of the fence. Choosing estrangement restored my health and faith, led me to sobriety, and blessed me with a wonderful marriage, fulfilling career and family of my own.
We are only as sick as our secrets. Perhaps a #MeToo 2.0 version will finally shed light on the toxicity and violence present in so many families (and, by the way, this is a massive issue in Asia as well). There has thus far been no conversation about those of us who grew up with misogyny and sexual violence in our own homes, and I wonder how many others commenting have had to jump the family ship for this reason.
For those seeking help and support, three related resources you may wish to check out are the Reddit group, raisedbynarcissists; Al-Anon; and the excellent book, Boundaries, by Dr. Henry Cloud. Counseling is also a lifesaver!
27
There is no reason to remain in any negative relationship that causes stress and or anxiety. Families are complicated and there aren't enough physiatrists around to help sort it out.
16
Do you want to know a myth that is annoying? The fact that someone like me, who has had no relationship w/ my father for over 20 years, is sad, or feeling a loss. I do not have the desire to waste my energy on forgiveness. I have moved on with my life, and am happier w/out that toxic person attempting to exert his will over me. Once my mom is gone, I hope to cut the threadbare tie w/ my brother, as well.
22
I am estranged from my three adult children and one granddaughter due to whatever their mother (my ex-wife) has told them. As I can't think of anything I've ever done egregious enough to create such a fracture, I can only assume it was something awful. The irony is that as children, they were much closer to me than their mother. Eventually, post separation, pre-divorce, something was said with this result. That said, I am puzzled to find myself not particularly bothered by this, other than not getting to see the granddaughter at all.
7
Dr. Murray Bowen, an early leader in family theory and therapy, viewed emotional cutoff between parents and children as present to some degree in most families. In 1976 he wrote, "An average family situation in our society today is one in which people maintain a distant and formal relationship with the families of origin, returning home for duty visits at infrequent intervals." He continued, however, that "the more a nuclear family maintains some kind of viable emotional contact with the past generations, the more orderly and asymptomatic the life process in both generations."
7
I have a sibling who has been cut off by everyone in my immediate family. Of course we cannot diagnose her ourselves, but several professionals who have observed her behaviours, and literature we have read, indicate that she likely suffers from mental disorders called Borderline Personality Disorder and Narcissism. It has been all of our conclusions that she will persistently lie, that she will persistently cheat, and that she will persistently steal in order to get what she wants or for no other reason than to create chaos. For decades she purposefully drove wedges between family members based on outright lies until any contact with her became untenable. What I have learned from this experience is that the opposite of love is not anger or hatred, but rather indifference... because in time one just becomes so worn out from all of the toxicity. And, in deed, at this point the estrangement is truly very, very sad. I wonder how many family estrangements are due to the same or other definable mental disorders in the alienated family member.
27
Reading the comments on this article has me teary-eyed as I kick off my second Christmas estranged from my mother. I am warmed by the understanding and encouragement from the other commenters. The article itself sheds light on the complexity of estrangement, but it’s the comments that add the emotional side to it.
My mom would probably have you believe that I ‘chose’ my husband and friends ‘over’ her. It couldn’t be more different than that. I love my mom, but I don’t love her personality disorder. I don’t love that she feels such deep pain that she wants to bring others into that same black abyss. I suffered decades of emotional abuse, poor parenting, chaotic relationships, and an unpredictable home. I have chosen to live a life where I am loved unconditionally, where I am encouraged to succeed on my own terms, and where I have peaceful and fruitful relationships.
Unfortunately, this choice has led to no longer being in contact with my mother. It means that I only have a social média-level relationship with my extended family. It means I am de facto estranged from my brother, who has chosen to ‘keep the peace’ with our mother. The longer I am apart, the more I feel secure in who I am and sure that this was the right decision.
I hope everyone has the opportunity to cultivate a family of trust, acceptance, and love. It’s your right.
47
I am right there with you! Your comment could have written by me. Sending love. I get it. I so get it.
12
Totally true. I, myself, am estranged from one brother, one step-sister, and my stepfather. My brother is estranged from everyone but me. And that's only the tip of the iceberg...
7
Estranged can be a big positive, if you don't speak to family there is usually a reason. Being estranged for a decade now, can only wonder why I didn't cut ties sooner. You can't chose your family but you can certainly chose if you interact with them or not. Anyone that doesn't bring happiness and positive thoughts into your life should be avoid and discarded regardless if it is your family member, friend or co-worker.
18
I feel the same. I cut ties two years ago, my emotionally unavailable mother has been in a "codependent" relationship with my 55-year-old drug addicted sister for years. I only wish I'd cut contact sooner than this. I used to get physically ill on the days I had to make the "dutiful daughter" trips to my parents' home for the holidays and birthdays. It was agony.
3
As a young psychologist in a community hospital, I often received consultation requests to look into why families were not visiting their hospitalized mothers. The nursing staff would be sad and bewildered at these families' abandonments of their patients (fathers were a different story--I guess that seemed less of a mystery). It was always the same story--they deserved it. It takes an awful lot to get children to give up on their mothers. And an awful lot had happened. When grown children decide they've had enough, they have. The only exception I've seen is when divorced sociopathic parents embark on the systematic destruction of the parent child relationship against their ex's.
It's just a question of which of these stories will be true.
32
My mother is currently in assisted living about 100 miles away from me. My older sister placed her there after it was clear mom was no longer able to look after herself. The money for the facility is coming out of our mother's savings. The older sister moved 3,000 miles away two weeks after placing our mother in the facility. I live 100 miles away, and the younger sister (age 55) lives about 5 miles away from our mother. I haven't visited at all, my older sister hasn't visited, but the younger sister, who fleeced our mother out of probably tens of thousands of dollars for her drug habits, continues to see her. I cut the ties with this family two years ago, the verbal abuse from my two aggressive and overbearing sisters was too much and I simply stopped contact. I hated to do it to my mother, but she was so emotionally unavailable our entire lives that I really felt nothing for her for decades. She's been in a "codependent" relationship with my drug addict sister for years. I was pretty much playing the "dutiful daughter" by showing up for the family functions every year, sending the greeting cards and gifts, etc. My family was dead to me long before two years ago. I'm only sorry I didn't cut ties sooner.
4
I have been estranged from most of my immediate family for 20+ years. Best decision I ever made, my life is so much better. I used to think I was an awful person because I didn't feel love for my parents the way others did, now I realize that the feelings I had/have are natural reactions to being abused the way I was by parents and siblings.
20
My mother died when I was 20 and by the next year my dad had moved on to a relationship with a woman who intensely disliked me. The article says estrangement doesn’t happen on a whim, but for me it felt like I went from golden child to pariah in a flash. We were estranged for years, and this estrangement was an "open secret" I carried alone within my extended family. I was financially independent at 21, not eligible for financial aid because my father's income (of which I saw none) counted against me. (I made it through college, graduate school and law school because of friends, professors, mentors, and even random strangers who helped me.) For a long time, I blamed myself, but I’ve learned to forgive and even respect the 20-year-old me. Eventually, I created my own imperfectly perfect family with my husband and two stepsons. We’ve made it for 25 years. Family can be a beautiful thing, but the idea that blood family is everything, something we need to preserve at all cost, is a cruel, pernicious myth.
33
This article is god sent in general, and especially this time of year. As a psychologist and a person who has struggled with the same issue, it is very validating to see that others share the same predicament and as a result feel less alone. I find that many of us who have experienced either brief or long and final estrangement carry a deep pain, a sense of loss, a regret, a longing, a revisit of endless rationalizations and replay of incidents to justify the decision, a recurrent confusion of how could this be. It is a difficult decision to make and difficult to keep. The popular literature on relationships, marriage and family, and the concept of forgiveness, as well as all the societal and cultural taboos place such pressure, shame and guilt on so many of us, often propelling us to try yet one more time only to face disappointment and heart ache, and often further mistreatment. It is good to have support and validation from friends, partners, therapists and articles as this. Shame is a shadow that diminishes aspects of humanity that are real and valid. It is better to have the topic open and discussed. Thank you for sharing and be well.
27
well said!
Beautifully put and I am am psychotherapist and someone who is dealing with this issue. I particularly like your line about shame. I might use/quote it with my clients.
Thank you.
Great timing! I've read a couple of hundred comments and thought that I wouldn't comment..... until I remembered my own little problem that I have yet to deal with.
I recognize that many have taken a long walk - but THE LAW may not.
I speak of your will.
Make it, make it now, or you will find the law will hand out your assets to the very people you would least like to see receive your favorite painting. Or your car. Or house. Or your savings account. Or your cat.
I may be socially estranged - but I am still legally tied to the very people that I have had no contact with in 40 years.
The only way to circumvent that is a good will, detailed, specific, naming names, etc. Also remember that depending on what state you live in, there may be mandatory amounts that you MUST leave to certain relationships: A son, a daughter...otherwise that will can be legally contested.
I am not an attorney!
Find yourself a good one - just as I shall be doing on Dec 26!
The best to all of you!
46
REAL good advice. DO NOT WAIT!
9
I never married or had kids so my will always stipulated that my house will go to whoever is living of my three closest friends. The house will be sold and they can split up the proceeds. I'm leaving my other financial assets to a Communist party of which I've been a member for decades.
6
I grew up with a mother who was so mean and unpredictable that I couldn't wait to get away from my childhood home.
I shed a lot of tears in my childhood and early adult years - tears for the mother she could not be; tears for all the pain & humiliation she enthusiastically caused her children; tears for the loving mother I yearned for but did not have. When she died, I did not shed a tear. Her death was no loss to me.
29
You're not alone; I could've written this one.
3
My New Yorker desk calendar of cartoons presents the following for December 22.
(Picture of woman, husband and child boarding a cab): `We're going to see my family. There's an extra twenty in it for you if we never get there.'
Not uncommon at all. And in many cases healthy.
48
Love it.. Good one!!!
7
The breaking point for me was when my four siblings, mother, and other family members knowingly chose to abandon me on a barrier island that was under orders of mandatory evacuation prior to Superstorm Sandy. I had been treated badly all my life, as if I were Cinderella , but this was the last straw for me.
I had been left to watch the ocean climb my stairs, not knowing if I would be drowned. I was trapped all alone, with no power, no running water, no heat, no phone ,cell, internet, and no means of escape, due to drowned car. .
I did not speak with any family member for nearly four years, and had no intention of doing so ever again, when a friend died of a brain tumor, two days before my sister's birthday. I called my sister to wish her a Happy Birthday, fearful we would go to our graves without ever speaking.
Calling my sister was a terrible mistake. I opened Pandora's box and seem to be unable to close it again. I had told a friend that my family would somehow manage to spin it so that it was my fault such that every family member chose to abandon me on a a barrier island that was under orders of mandatory evacuation, and I just learned that my family has done exactly that. My sister claimed that my family had offered to take me in, and that I had declined. When I said that that was not true, she said that "Sandy was in the past."
I don't know how to re-establish the clean break that I need to have from these horrid people.
14
I wish for you the strength you need to get away from them. Their actions are unforgivable. I don’t know how you can ever feel safe around them. There’s a much better world waiting for you without them, a world in which you will find loving, caring people.
Get a tattoo, just a teensey-weensey one about a third of an inch in diameter of an empty circle. Get it on the back of the hand you use to dial phone numbers.
Then the next time you think to call anyone who isn't healthy for you study that empty circle until the urge to dial passes.
You did it once - you can do it again.
Sandy is not in the past: You're still living with it.
I would be, too.
3
I think of estrangement as being more of a boundary. I have a sister who has a lot of drama in her life. Being around so much drama is a challenge for me. It wears me out. The boundary I have put up to keep her out of my life has brought me peace. That is what I wish for her too. Peace. I would most definitely welcome her back into my life if she could get away from her drama.
15
It’s interesting to read the comments here. Count me among the estranged (unless circumstances force limited contact). My family causes pain. Always has. I’ve been condtioned to avoid interaction in the same way a lab rat learns that the peanut treat isn’t worth the zap she gets when she presses the lever. I tolerated a lot of zaps before backing away.
To make family relations even more complicated, I know that one of my siblings voted for Trump. I find that impossible to forgive.
When you come from a dysfunctional family it’s hard to hear the competitive bragging many people do about their own family “fabulosity” during the holidays. I'm talking about those co-workers and friends who go on and on about how spectacular their own clans are, and then — crinkling their brows — pointedly ask what sad, little, curmudgeonly you are going to do for Thanksgiving or Christmas. Most years my spouse and I take a trip around this time — just the two of us — to avoid the whole thing. We are a team of two.
23
For my wife and I, estrangement is a big dark cloud in our lives. Prior to us meeting and when we first got together we had fairly normal family interactions. We both worked for large companies, led nondescript lives and struggled during periods of layoff or job loss. Birthday's and holidays were spent together with "family" as well as many weekends throughout the year.
I took a leap of faith and started my own business. I worked it, and success came quickly. I paid off debt, we had savings. I leased a new truck. When we decided to have children we were comfortable enough so my wife so my wife didn't have to go back to work.
If I was to pick a point where the "family" wheels fell off it was around that point.
My mother: She started to become overly critical of my wife's parenting(by all means my wife is a great mom). She called child services 3 times with bogus claims of abuse. She called the humane society to report neglect of our dog. Needless to say out relationship has been at an impass for the last several years.
My aunt and uncle sided with my mother, so I don't speak with them either.
My dad: All of a sudden my dad is frequently asking how much money I'm making. He starts getting competitive with material possessions. I got to a point to where I had to lock my office when he came over because we found him rummaging through my paperwork.
With family like this who needs enemies.
25
I learned a long time ago that life is short and precious, and I have no time or desire to share my life with people who treat me badly.
Including my sister and her husband. Enough said.
18
If I remember correctly, it was Tolstoy who said unhappy families were all different. My paternal grandparents both passed away over 20 years ago. My dad & his brother, even though they were separated by seven years, were always close, until my dad married my stepmother, who brought a lot of divisive behaviors into the family. My uncle's wife has refused to have anything to do w/my stepmother for close to 20 years & has basically cut any ties w/my brother & me & our respective kids, & political differences are now sharply eroding my dad's & uncle's relationship. My maternal grandmother is nearly 97 & not in good health; my mom loathes her brother & his wife & is jealous of her sister, although currently the sisters are united in their near-hatred of my uncle & his wife. I'm pretty sure that once my grandmother passes away my mom & aunt will cut off my uncle & his wife entirely. My brother & I have four cousins on that side of the family—one from my aunt & three from my uncle—& I wonder what sort of relationships we'll all have...or be able to have after the dust settles. None of my parents are easy to deal w/& all have been emotionally abusive to me in the past, some for decades. I find it easier to see them only a couple of times a year, but I haven't cut off all contact as I wanted my daughter to have a relationship w/her grandparents, & fortunately they haven't treated her in an abusive manner. Had they done so, I would have had no problem cutting all ties w/them.
3
Sadly, my older brother has chosen to estrange himself from our mother, a widow in her mid 80's and from me. It happened about 10 years ago. I last saw him in over 5 years at a family wedding, but he didn't really talk to me or our mom. The reason for the estrangement seems to be that my sister-in-law felt my mother preferred my ex-wife over her (not true) and she eventually demanded my brother end his relationship with our mom and with me. My mother is so sweet and this estrangement has taken a huge toll on her (and on me as I am the sole "caretaker" as her health declines). What hurts more is that my extended family lives far away and my mother can no longer travel, so I will be alone (I am divorced--no children) with my mother again on Christmas, her favorite holiday.
I have tried to reach out, but he has defriended me on Facebook and blocks my calls. He also blocked my mother. She is devastated that he cut her off from his children--Xmas and birthday presents are rejected and sent back. My brother's daughter was just got married and neither my mother nor I were invited. I found out by seeing my cousin's pictures on Facebook. I haven't told my mother about this because the hurt would be too painful. Unless there were abuse, estrangement from elderly parents is not good, normal or moral. It is cruel. Still, if he were to call, I could easily reconcile and forgive. So would our mom.
14
Hi Xeno, I was in a similar situation with my mom before her death. It’s a very painful situation. My mom was cut to the core by her sons’ rejection of her. It would have been possible for them to fix what was broken, but they were unwilling to do so. All you can do is to sooth her by refocusing on your relationship. You cannot control the actions of others. But being there for your mom is a gift you give to her but also to yourself. Debra
Funny story:
My only sibling justified taking all the inheritance money by informing me, " As the younger child, you stayed home after I moved out, therefore it cost more to raise you!"
He charged me "retrograde rent." Just like a modern day Jane Austin novel.
17
My sister colluded with my brother, step-mother and father to disinherit me. Later she explained quite frankly that "money does funny things to people."
I'm happy to be happy and never see them again.
4
Perfect article for this time of year. The combination of empirical data, personal anecdotes, and reader comments validates the challenges with which many struggle...especially during the holidays.
Setting boundaries is essential for mental health.
Thank you.
14
Almost 6 years ago I chose to stop speaking to my father. His narcissism, rage, and neediness had already caused me to create distance between us- my mother leaving him, at age 60, gave me permission to finally and completely remove him from my life. These years without him have been more peaceful, wholesome, and loving than I could have anticipated.
When I tell someone about not speaking to my father for the first time, I generally experience a kind of disappointed surprise. Their eyes express a combination of pity and judgement, but mostly reveal the jolted expression of learning something unexpected about a person they thought they had pegged. I’ve thought about it a lot, and I think the surprise shows up mostly because of this: I’m nice. I'm nice!
The culture at large simply doesn't know what to make of someone (particularly a woman) who is both kind and estranged by choice from a parent. Society abounds with empathy for parents rejected by their offspring, but holds very little compassion for the survivors of toxic parenting who choose healthy independence over continuing dysfunctional family relationships.
Thank you to the NYTimes for this timely, important piece.
37
Whenever I tell people I haven't spoken to my brother in eight years, they always look woeful and empathetic and say, "Oh, I'm sorry." To which I reply, "Don't be. Finally ending things with him was one of the best and healthiest things I ever did. I'm safe without having to ever interact with him." Relatives always try to put their oars in and say with a fairy-tale kind of hopefulness, "Well, perhaps a reconciliation is in order!" To which I reply, "NO." They are less interested in understanding my reasons for keeping my distance from him and understanding the actual dynamics of our relationship than in crafting a vision of how they think family should be. I tell them to stay out of it and respect my wishes.
21
This matches my experience perfectly- thank you for sharing! The fantasy of what family *should be* so often wins out over the painful reality. Congrats on choosing health and your life over social expectation.
17
Thanks, BrooklynGal!
4
My oldest son cut off all ties with me three years ago. Neither he nor his mother (my former wife) give me any explanation for the sudden severing of the relationship. So all I was left with was a deep sadness for the wall of silence, my speculations as to why the rift occurred, and my ongoing quest to detach from the whole incident. Reading the other responses to this article have in many ways normalized my experience.
My theory is that the negative spin on who I am (many friends and relatives seem to take sides after a divorce), what I did (remarried) after the divorce 20 years ago, and the fact that my son is from the millennial generation who has always treated his parents as an ATM (his mother supports him financially to this day and I don't since he is 50 years old and employed) are my only explanations for the rift.
I am willing to take responsibility for my part in this broken relationship. However, I don't really know where to start since I honestly feel that none of the parental conditions for a relationship fracture reviewed in this article apply to me. Despite this, I have moved on to the best years in my life. Ah well!
6
Sometimes we might not ever know the reasons for a family fracture, and it is possible it has more to do with your son's emotional situation than any specific rift or behavior on your part. You get a lot of credit from me for wanting to understand it and work through it if your son were willing. It is also possible he will reach out to you in the future. I'm so sorry for your loss, and happy holidays.
1
We who are 50 are gen x!
2
A lot of hurt and abandonment issues in children come from the divorce itself, and not from anything told by one parent to the child. Even if you had every reason in the world to split from his mother, it causes deep-seated issues, that are not always expressed at the time, or even experienced consciously.
I moved overseas 13 years ago, after decades of feeling stigmatised as the late-arriving youngest (and only unplanned) child in our large family. The article focuses too much on parent/child relationships. In my case, older siblings developed a "story" around who I was that didn't fit my sense of self or my experiences, and this "story" also served their needs at the expense of mine.
I get along better with them via Facebook, and find peace in being able to live without the tensions inherent in living up to other's expectations.
6
How can we create a societal construct for working through estrangement? How do rituals like funerals and sitting shiva evolve? Several of my extended family members have become estranged--dad/aunt, sister/aunt, ex-husband/ex-father-in-law, cousin/other cousins--and the hardest aspect of estrangement that I've seen is not having any way to "officially" acknowledge and work through the finality of such a rift.
I saw in the article that there's a "charity" (does that mean support/advocacy group??) that supports estranged family members...but what about the family members of the estranged? The complete removal of someone from your life is akin to experiencing their death, but we have no prescribed way of handling it, which leads people to suffer these losses alone.
10
I expect my 84-year-old mother to die within the coming few years given her health status (Alzheimer dementia plus numerous other physical conditions that I know of). I really don't know how I feel about attending her funeral since I felt cast aside by her for decades and later learned it was likely because she was having a "codependent" relationship with my drug addicted sister. I wrote off the entire family two years ago. Since funerals to me are to share special moments with others about the person, I really would have nothing to offer there.
1
It’s worse than experiencing their death, b/c for me at least, there was no explanation why I was cut off. Death I can come to terms w/ as tragic as that is.
I was a loving, devoted, caring father. I did all but breast feed. I changed diapers, gave baths, read stories, & taught my kid to read. I paid for nursery school next to my job & took her there every day. Every week or so, I’d take her & her friends out for lunch by the nursery school. I’d look in on her, if not too busy, & would gently rub her back at nap time.
Later on, I never missed a parent-teacher conference. I helped her with homework & to get into gifted programs at school. I did her laundry, made her meals, bought her clothes, & paid for after school programs & summer camps.
I threw birthday parties for her each year. Then, she turned 13 & things changed. She got into the liquor cabinet, started smoking & acting up at school. She ditched her old friends & started hanging out w/ new ones. She rebelled & went to live w/ her mother at 15, completely cutting me off.
One of her friends said she quit school at 16 & moved to KY w/ a college drop out. I paid support to her mother for over a year & she’s not even living there. Judges make men pay. Not women.
She gets arrested 2xs & admits to shooting H since 15. I fly to KY 6xs to keep her out jail & get her into treatment, but she skips. That’s the last time we spoke. She’s 33 now, clean & has a kid w/ developmental issues. Didn’t even let me know I’m a granddad.
Totally agree. This article would have been better had it also addressed the collateral fallout for families of the estranged. Through estrangement, the “leaver” can cruelly victimize those left behind.
I once went home for the holidays during a time of regular psychotherapy for co-dependency.
'It felt different this year", I told the therapist.
"Can't stand some of them now?", he said. "You're seeing things a lot better."
14
My therapist during some of the more formidable years of family visits used to give me techniques to "handle" the get-togethers. A therapist I found three years ago was primarily responsible for my being able to cut ties completely from my family two years ago. Her sessions were absolutely eye opening.
3
I don't see much discussion here of estrangement based on religion, except one comment about scientology or other cults that actively encourage separation and disfellowshipment for heretical family members. My own family took a turn into fundamentalism of the most virulent sort back in the 70's. My sister and I, however, got a good liberal arts education at the college sponsored by the church and at other institutions, thereby learning how to think for ourselves, which has always been deeply resented by my parents.
I brought both of them down from Mass. to S.C. for late retirement when it became clear that they could no longer maintain the home they had lived in for over 50 years. I figured if they lived in a condo close to me, I could help them maintain some semblance of independence until they eventually passed. In my condo complex in Columbia, SC, there are a large number of elderly "waiting for God" who are happily ensconced in their apartments where they receive family and friends (not to mention meals on wheels!) and stay independent surrounded by love and memorabilia.
Unfortunately, the proximity has not improved our relationship. Dad, in particular, thinks he speaks for God and is waiting for a rapture that, alas, has yet to materialize on time. He is in rehab now after a stroke at 85, and thinks he needs to come home so that my mother, who is strong as a horse, can precede him in death. I am emotionally estranged, but still hanging in there with them.
7
I have for over 30 years now experienced the boundary I erected and have defended protecting me from contact with my sibling as both a blessing and a relief -- the exact opposite of the stress I experienced during the 25 years of contact prior to (with a nod to modern wordsmith Gwyneth Paltrow) the "conscious uncoupling."
I am grateful that I found the strength to terminate a family relationship that was toxic to me. I am equally grateful to have protected my children from exposure to a harmfully dysfunctional individual.
I wish my brother well, but from a safe distance. If he needed one, I would probably give him a kidney, in honor of my late mother. But I will never again give him access to me.
5
I’m not surprised there are so many who identify with this. Social media can make things more painful. I choose to be around people who love me and vice versa. Life is too short. After years of trying to reach out I finally understood that people are on their own paths. It’s hard to be separated from nephews and nephews, but when they are older they can make their own choices.
6
What an amazing thread. I'm moved by the many deeply personal statements, honesty, and especially the simple expressions of support by strangers for strangers.
29
I think a lot of things made sense when our lifespans were 40 years: marriage, children, career choices, family relationships. But we live so much longer now, and a lot of what we expected (marriage til death do us part, children living next door, friends forever,, same job for life) are unrealistic in an 80-year lifespan. Not all relationships are meant to last forever, and being forced to keep them going is like putting someone on life support and then wondering why they're not thriving.
I admire couples who stay together to the end, and families that appear to stay connected, but I've live long enough to know that for myself I'd much rather be happy and productive on my own terms than to be in unhealthy relationships merely out of habit or convenience.
We all change as we age, and expecting our family members to change the same way we do, well, that's not going to happen. A good friend once said, "Never make the mistake of thinking somebody you don't like, likes you."
Think about that for a moment. Maybe you worry about hurting their feelings by withdrawing from them, but if you consider the thought that they really don't like you either, well, you're doing everyone a favor by going your separate ways.
12
Estrangement was always an option on my table, but I struggle to avoid this option. My parents have deep differences among themselves and I have differences with them. In terms of habits, values, culture, perception. I can't live with people that carry big flaws through life and don't seem to wish for evolution. We can live with different levels of evolution, but it is hard to accept those who dont want to evolve. I care about them financially but living with them has a high emotional cost for me. One of the big historical flaws of our educational thinking is the rejection of economical independence for humans. Mammals give their descendence the ability to survive by their own means, but humans dont. One of the reasons we live in a violent world. Humans are not prepared to divide from parents, and when they do, they cant survive.
2
The research outlined in the article validates what I have found in my own life. Biology is not infallible. Genetic Roulette produces incompatibilities as well as harmonious combinations. Individual character traits can render relationship-without-self-betrayal impossible. In such cases, voluntary "estrangement" is often the only sane choice. Another salient feature of "distancing" is a general absence of common ground - no interests, no "values", no basic commonalities with which to connect. One can retain a neutral "pleasantness" with incompatible people in infrequent encounters but not in a constant round of family socialising. Ultimately, each person must choose a way of life that involves the minimum of self-betrayal because, in the end, no one is going to do the dying for us and all we have is our time and how we spend it. Time cannot be "saved"; it can only be spent and spending it with indifferent or hurtful people may not be something everyone is willing to do.
7
My grandfathers both died when I was an infant.
One grandmother was an alcoholic with no interest in knowing her grandchildren (or at least me). My last grandmother had severe Alzheimer's disease, and believed children existed for a good performance: to act innocent & saintly til death.
I've no interest in pretending to care about remaining family who constantly ask when I'll visit, when they've never bothered even once in my life.
I'm equally disgusted by others who demand more performance, more 'sanitliness'. Real family means not worrying about what's on my bookshelf (Carol Queen, currently) when they come to visit.
13
The article doesn't mention an important part of estrangement: answering well-meaning questions from others. Like, "Will you be with your family on the holidays?" Or the medical office, "Why don't you have a medical history?"
The comments seem to focus on the painful estrangements, where people are estranged because they've been abused or feel deeply hurt because relatives withdrew. Actually a lot of people just end family relationships because they feel there's nothing in common -- no shared values, no mutual respect, no supportiveness. E.g., everyone else in the family is married or deeply religious; when one family member becomes richer than others, there can be a lot of resentment and jealousy that can't be healed. When the family responds angrily to being estranged, they just reinforce the person's decision ("I hate you - why don't you come visit?").
My favorite example is from sa friend who said, "My mom left her family to joined the army. And when she got out she didn't see any reason to go back. She never talks about them and we never met them."
I suspect that's more typical than many people realize.
55
Yes. I grew up in a family which was much more highly educated than the rest and it caused a rift. I never saw my cousins or grandparents on one side after age 11. They are all very close which is very painful for me. Although, deep down, I know were really have very little in common.
4
Hi Catharine, I agree.
This estrangement is common among my acquaintances who left the Great Plains in the 1990s. We were often the first in our families to go to college - back when paying for it yourself was feasible. We delayed or opted out of parenthood and typically married later. We have had good or exceptional careers, with a few job or health bumps along the way.
Some of our loved ones, those who remained behind, fared well. However more typically, they had bad luck or made bad choices: early marriages, too many children, entrenched in misogynist households and embracing extreme religiosity, saw the quality of their education and healthcare decline, their wages stagnated and many lost their jobs, some turned to drugs and alcohol, most have credit card and auto debt. These choices and circumstances led to significantly different life experiences and led to estrangements and jealousy.
As I reflect over 1500 miles away from family this Christmas season, it’s best for everyone if us “elite, coastal sneauxflakes” and our loved ones from the same humble origins just exchange our “thoughts and prayers”.
14
I have long felt I was an oddity, having no idea this was a "thing". My 35 years of "divorce" from most of the family came after long denied incest was exposed, and the majority of family sought comfort in denial or trivializing the events. It wasn't easy but I raised a healthy son and created my own family of friends. I have far less baggage than most adults I know, and a wonderful life. No regrets!
207
Well done, Lar S !
40
I had the exact same experience. So much so I wrote a book about it... (Tree of Lives). There seems to be an Estrangement gene in my birth family. Very glad you prevailed!
3
Your comment mirrors my life's experience, as well. The betrayal of parents who enabled--then excused--a known sexual abuser was a painful experience, but cutting them out of my life and becoming a person recognized as a wise parent of a compassionate, centered now adult child and also as someone repeatedly provided the opportunity to healthfully mentor other young people (i.e., repeatedly and completely demolishing the abuse cycle) provided me with a loving antidote to the decades of pain wrought by my family of origin. There is happiness and joy on the other side when you escape an abusive family AND, even harder, compassionately forgive yourself for doing so . . . I am also grateful the counselor who helped me find this path decades ago.
3
This article made me want to hug my children (now adults) kiss my wife of 30 years, and remind them all that I love them. There are few things that I could imagine hurting more than not being able to share life with them.
Regularly, I speak with clients who for one reason or another have beem "disowned," or who have themselves disowned a parent or child. While most of them have come to terms with the decision to sever communication, all of them, no matter the number of years gone by, are saddened by the sense of loss. My wish for everyone, especially during the Holidays, is that they be shielded from abuse by others, and that they have a peaceful heart.
189
That's very caring of you. Some commenters here appear to be comfortable if not content with their estrangement. I applaud (if not admire) them for that but my personal experience with it within my small little family (that no longer exists) has affected my life tremendously and resulted in the loss of my brother's to suicide.
A major estranging factor in our lives was the fact that we were military dependents. We never lived anywhere longer than 3 years, spent the bulk of our time in West Germany and never got to know any extended family. When my parents divorced acrimoniously when we graduated from high school and would not speak to one another - or much to us either - estrangement would become our lifestyle.
Alienation and loneliness kills. Thanks again for your kind message during the holidays.
13
It won't look like estrangement if you've decided to only spend time with those who treat you lovingly and respectfully. It need not be an act of exclusion, rather an attraction toward peace and happiness. Put your energy where it seems worthwhile. Throw seeds into fertile ground where they will receive sun and water, not into the darkness of an abyss.
436
This was beautifully put and rings true for me.
8
Amen. I just had Christmas with friends who love, accept, and respect me, and I feel the same way about them. We had a wonderful time.
3
Although I realize there can be valid reasons, such as serious abuse, for needing to cut off contact from family members, an area that seems to have been completely missed by this article is when people are influenced by third parties to cut off contact, such as in cults or unethical therapists who impose their ideology on their clients. Anyone who has watched Leah Remini's program on Scientology can see flagrant examples of this. How much of this cutting off contact is due to manipulation from a third party that resulted in a decision that the individual would not have otherwise chosen? And of course, contagion on the internet can be very great. I don't think anyone would argue that families cannot be dissolved, as they obviously this does happens and that is not news to anyone, but does this result in a better quality of life? Again, this doesn't seem to have been something the research focused on. Just because it is not uncommon doesn't mean that this is beneficial, especially for some of the trivial reasons described here. People really need to think long and hard before doing something like this and make sure they haven't been unduly influenced by someone with an ideology and agenda of their own. Try to find a responsible mental health professional who will help them work things out, rather than ones who diagnoses family members from a distance as "narcissists" who they have never even met and encourage their clients to cut off contact.
23
For me, the article's point that family estrangement is not near as uncommon as we would like to think it is, provides an opportunity for those who are estranged to not feel so alone. The article also provides many factors of estrangement, as many of us may not realize how complex it can be.
Exactly, Monica. I thought the same thing as I read this article.
The number of cases of estrangement that have come about as the result of extreme pressure from a SIL or DIB is not insignificant and it's a form of spousal abuse.
This article simply was not on that topic. If you search the Internet, you will find many articles that address the topic that interests you.
1
Glad I found this article and reader comments. Now I can see that I wasn't alone.
Long story short, after a happy and secure childhood and young adulthood up until I got married, because of my mother's intense jealousy of my wife, we (my wife and I), while not estranged from my mother (and by default, unfortunately, my dad), we drastically cut back our contact with her even though we lived close by.
My mother did a lot of snarky little things and a couple of really nasty big things to my wife and I as an expression of her jealousy. While my wife and I discussed complete estrangement, that would have caused damage to other family relationships. So in the end my wife and I put up an emotional wall between us and my mom that never came down.
As this article said, my interaction with my mom was reduced to mainly small talk on the phone. We repeatedly declined invitations to get together with them and only saw them in person on Thanksgiving, Xmas day and one or two birthdays. Our in-person interactions with them were stiff and formal with no warmth at all.
Again, as the article stated, my mother did things to my wife and I to the point where I could no longer trust her.
When my mother passed away I had very mixed feelings. I was in a way sad to lose the mother who was a good mom to me growing up but I did not shead a tear for the woman who betrayed my trust and lied to me repeatedly as an adult.
78
Excellent article and excellent choice of topic. Well researched....thanks.
Estrangement between couples, friends, co-workers, family members, and other relationships occurs for a myriad of reasons - often through misunderstanding, through callousness, through disrespect. I've known few if any people who've not been estranged by someone or who've not estranged someone or more than one person in their lives. And the stress of the estrangement is felt by both parties too.
Why human beings haven't evolved to limit the occurrence of such stress escapes me...
14
"The stress of estrangement"? That phrase caught my attention. I guess it depends on the individual case.
I have for over 30 years now experienced the boundary I erected and have defended boundary protecting me from contact with my sibling as both a blessing and a relief -- the exact opposite of the stress I experienced during the 25 years of contact prior to (with a nod to modern wordsmith Gwyneth Paltrow) the "conscious uncoupling."
I am grateful that I found the strength to terminate a family relationship that was toxic to me. I am equally grateful to have protected my children from exposure to a harmfully dysfunctional individual.
I wish my brother well, but from a safe distance. If he needed one, I would probably give him a kidney, in honor of my late mother. But I will never again give him access to me.
3
Interesting to read this, and I very much appreciate hearing others' stories. I am estranged from my mother and two sisters. It's been excruciatingly painful. Although the break came after a specific event, it had been building for many years. My mother, though sometimes very loving, has always been emotionally abusive at times (and borderline alcoholic). I was too, when I was young. We loved each other once, I think, but the damage we did to each other chipped away at that love until there wasn't enough left.
I understand the abuse my mother suffered in her own childhood. Her violent, outright alcoholic father left her with a lot of anger toward men, which she took out on me. Even though that's unfair, seeing what's driven her has helped me forgive her.
Anyway, I know the estrangement is partly my fault, and I am sorry for my contribution. But here's the thing. My mother has yet to take an iota of responsibility for her side of it. She won't so much as entertain the possibility that she's done anything wrong. Which means she'll keep doing it (as indeed she did, the last time we saw each other). And I refuse to be treated that way, notwithstanding my own past transgressions. So there it stands.
It saddens me, though. I particularly miss my sisters, who have (very understandably) sided with her. I don't blame them at all, but I can't agree with them that the situation is entirely my fault. There are very much two sides to this story.
57
I am sorry for the pain you are going through. I have been in a similar situation and I know that estranged or not, unresolved issues eat away at our peace and continue the hurt. In my own case, my mother's illness and my daughter's obsession with knowing my birth family has put me in a position to end an 11-year estrangement. Not that the present is better, but I find that the distance allowed me to, in some ways, slowly accept that some things won't ever change. That in turn, makes this new reunion period less painful if only because of my lowered expectations.
I have no advice or recommendation or helpful tip, but I wanted to reach out and say I understand and I'm sorry about what you go through. I hope you find and hold onto your inner peace. If it hasn't already, it will surely come.
3
Why not send your sisters copies of this article and of your comment with a note asking them to consider having a relationship with you on whatever limited basis might be comfortable for them?
3
Coming from a happy family and having had a very happy childhood, my son met an unhappy woman who was estranged from her parents. Swiftly after the marriage, she made sure he was estranged from his family and friends.
37
Other people can certainly influence us, but they cannot program us as if we were robots. Your son has primary responsibility for his apparent decision to cut off his relationships with friends and family. If there is in fact blame to be assigned in this case, you are blaming the wrong target.
13
I urge you to keep the door open without too much pressure. In time, your son may walk back through it.
3
Katy, there seems to be more to this sad story.
5
Great article, for this time of year. Estrangement in the making is painful. The negative comments, the passive aggressive behaviors, the tears, the rejections, the unexplored misunderstandings can all succumb to fatigue from trying to keep the relationship going, to keep the connection. When the question arises - what do I have to lose by letting go of this family member - I know the end is near.
32
I couldn't agree more. The fatigue involved in maintaining a relationship with a passive aggressive and destructive person is numbing. And you never know when the next emotional outbursts will occur. That's what I'm dealing with right now -- I just wait on pins and needles for the next thing. But I'm learning from these comments on this article that I can begin to limit interactions, and I think that will help me cope.
This is a compelling article, but it is too limited. Siblings also estrange themselves form each other, usual after a parent dies .
70
Yes, and there can be power struggles over the narrative that the siblings use to describe the family history and individual roles after the parents are gone, as well as over material possessions and paperwork.
3
My mother was estranged from 2 of her 3 siblings. I never knew one uncle. Her mother died when they were young children. And her father died when they were teenagers. Her estrangement from her sister didn't solidify until they were in their 50s. My sisters and I don't know why. Thank goodness we are not estranged from each other.
I am estranged from one sibling, but waited until our parents were both dead before I broke off contact. She was nasty to me when I was small, and became an emotionally and financially needy nuisance when we got older. I wish her no harm, but life is too short to waste it on people who won't help themselves.
37
Sibling-sibling estrangement was not addressed in the article. All three siblings in my family (which includes me) are estranged from the oldest, our brother. I feel I have made a choice of surrounding myself with peace and happiness. I would physically get depressed when he said he'd be visiting. I hated having to return his phone calls. Now I don’t have to. Nor do I have to visit him. I decided his energy was just too negative to keep in my life.
4
When I drove across Jordan from Amman during the last Iraq war, I kept seeing houses formed from concrete with steel rebar sticking out of the top. What? They couldn't even bother to finish the house? They just wanted this ugly metal sticking out and don't care? No, the rebar is there because they are always anticipating adding an additional floor when their son or daughter gets married.
How to societies manage where three and four generations live together in the same house or right nearby? Do they drive each other into mental breakdowns? There must be some way of repressing tendencies and forgetting about anger. Forgiveness must be an important part of everyday life, otherwise it just wouldn't work.
Your parents and siblings think you are one thing and their remarks and actions tend to put you back in that hole continually. With our constant emphasis on accomplishment and individuality, family relations are a drag, a reminder of who you were when you were a small child, but not as you see yourself now. In fact, my older brother loves to bring up embarrassing things I said or did as a child of five or six, some of which formed the basis of suppressed resentment.
The fact is, many of our family members don't have our best interests at heart and don't even realize they would like to undermine us, given the chance. Most probably aren't conscious of their own motives. Why should we love to be around people who, at base, don't wish us well, even if they think they do?
103
I saw that rebar in Egypt and some in Latin America. Here in NYC I see a lot of Coop and rental buildings whose elevators go between floors without hitting the lobby as people take food and visit relatives on various floors. Many of Queens long time residents complain of audacious mini-mansions that are really just fancy expansions to accommodate a third or fourth generation.
I, however, am glad my brothers all went west with Michigan's Seventies black tag migration and I have mixed feelings about free long distance, Facebook and don't get me started on Skype. If I never hear again about meth, dropping out and double wides... it would be to soon. Thank God for globalised cities and fresh generations of strong families.
3
I got sick of running into a similar thing. Some of those family members would trigger feelings of deep shame when they would insist on bringing up events from my past. Things that may have seemed trivial to them were deeply hurtful to me.
10
In my case, it was the "oboe solo that never was" when at age 14, I froze up and was clearly experiencing a panic attack during an orchestra recital and couldn't play a note. My family just never got over how "hilarious" that was.
2
My parents separated when I was 10. When I was a teen and wanted no contact with my father due to what I now know is a personality disorder, everyone convinced me to stay in contact with him. “He is your father,” they all said.
I wish someone had given me the permission.
78
Real father (or motherhood) is earned rather than being automatically conveyed by biology. Please give yourself permission. You deserve it.
15
That is kind of you to say and I agree...that was that my story as a kid. Now, 51. No guilt. No looking back!!! (But it took a long time to get there.)
You can give yourself permission
to forgive others for not assisting
you. You were a child.
I am a mental health consultant in long term care. Yup, a whole bunch of estrangement goes on, although we usually only hear one side of that painful story.
27
I've been estranged from my family, starting 30 years ago with my sisters...and then my mother...and more recently more brother ( very close to my father until he died 25 years ago). Truth be told, I constructed a different family 40 years ago, built around the parents of my best friend...when I go "home" I go to my "new parents," not the biological version....
While I believe my biological family to be "bad people" it is I think more true that we are simply different...and to bind myself somehow to them given the realities of these differences strikes me as an absurd outcome. My teenage self understood this enough to ally/align myself with an entirely different - and welcoming - family. Happily, my relationship with my own children could not be richer or more loving, an outcome I could not imagine if I had followed the "biological imperative."
29
As a family business consultant, I deal with cut-offs and estrangements within families fairly often. Although anecdotal, I find that cut-offs tend to run in families - when there is one in the family history, others follow. I posit that a cut-off teaches the next-gen that when conflict strikes, family is disposable. This is a very dangerous value to leave as a legacy. Certainly some relationships are toxic and boundaries need to be considered. But, I advice that if you feel like you need to cut-off your parent or sibling, be aware of the unintended lesson that you will be teaching your own kids - that family is disposable when conflict strikes - and you may be increasing the odds that your child will cut you off one day. I wish the researcher gathered this type of data.
142
What makes you think any of us are having kids?
This article highlights Mr. Maack, and how his experience led him to not having kids. I'm also never having kids, for similar reasons. It would not surprise me at all if the rate of voluntary childlessness was much higher among people with out similar experiences.
4
I actually think it can be a healthy lesson for our children to learn; when someone betrays or abuses you, treats you consistently badly and with disrespect, you have the right to insist the relationship improve, and if it doesn't, to break it off.
We decrease the odds our children will in turn cut us off by treating them respectfully and caringly, and working hard with them to resolve conflicts and accept differences. Not by leading them to believe that family relationships cannot be dissolved.
14
What it teaches the next generation is that they are free to leave toxic relationships, a very valuable and healthy lesson indeed. Parents who are loving and supportive of their own children will have nothing to fear.
9
I am glad the New York Times ran this article today, but I am still more grateful for the thoughtful and eye-opening comments feed. I've been trying to distance myself from my father for 25 years. The reasons are myriad: physical abuse, misogyny, refusal to support my education, crazy incidents in which stepmother tried to frame me for theft and fantasized at the breakfast table about my being sexually abused. The part of it all that I have found hardest to bear, though, is listening to my father's hateful remarks about my brother and my brother's children. I'm not happy with this ending; bad as things were, I didn't think it would come to the point of breaking off contact; but I've reached a point at which I literally can't listen to another word. I hope our society will come to a recognition that breaking contact with a parent is seldom a light or impulsive decision, and the 51 studies mentioned in the article and the thoughtful comments on this feed are a step in the right direction.
104
Good luck, Rachel.
If you have to ditch dad, so be it - onward, brave soul !
34
When I was in my late thirties I tried to cut off contact with my (now deceased) mother — an emotionally abusive, soul-killing alcoholic. Although there were a couple of things she did and said around that time that pushed me over the brink, it happened that I had also reached a point in my life when I felt I had the right (and the need) to not be put down and hurt by another person. Unfortunately, my mother simply would not allow the estrangement. She wrote me angry letters and eventually forced me back into the fold. I gave in, up to a point, but after that I felt emotionally removed from her. Quite cold. I was always wary.
I’m not sure you can go back and undo this kind of hardening of heart once it takes hold. And I think it’s probably best not to try. We all need to protect ourselves from those who would damage us. If we cannot remove them from our lives entirely, at least we can put up a shield. That way, even if you have to be around them, they can’t get to you. The negativity becomes water off a duck’s back.
Until the end of her life my mother never admitted to having done anything wrong. Not the drinking, the abuse, the belittling. Damaging people rarely see themselves as such.
7
Estrangement (partial or total) can solve problems. Finally realizing at 28 that no matter what I did my parents were never going to be happy with me or show happiness at what I considered my successes, I decided it was best not to share my happiness with them. I didn't cut them off but minimalized communication in such a way that they never really knew what was going on in my life - I didn't share my feelings with them. I was still dutiful to them in all ways, which was what I think they wanted in their children, but being estranged by distance and controlled communication made my life easier - and maybe theirs? I don't think they ever noticed.
56
‘i don’t think they ever noticed’, yeah, same. It’s weird and sad.
John, you told my story. Thank you.
1
I can relate too. I was estranged at times and perfunctorily dutiful at other times, and only became involved in my parents' lives again in any meaningful way in their very old age. For many, many years I made dutiful calls and visited as rarely as possible - though there was also a period when my son was small when we saw them more regularly, as I wanted to encourage a normal relationship with his grandparents if possible, and they were, I must admit, good grandparents, at least in their eccentric way. But I had not felt any real connection to them on an emotional level in many decades, and often didn't tell them about significant things going on in my life because it didn't even occur to me to tell them - they wouldn't really have cared and rarely remembered what I said anyway, unless it was fodder for a political argument or some other bit of unpleasantness. I always envied people who had parents they could TALK to, let alone go to for advice. My parents were the last people on the planet I'd have asked for advice about anything. I always thought it would be nice to have a mother I could go shopping with, or have lunch with, but my mother wasn't like that. Simply put she only cared about her own problems, of which she had many, hence no time for any of mine. I dreaded seeing her. My father, in his old age loosened up and we did occasionally have some fun - for instance, we could go to the movies. There was no having any fun with my mother LOL ...
1
I became estranged from my only sibling a few years ago--abruptly, in middle age--when I discovered that he had looted our elderly parents' savings after they became mentally incapacitated. This shocking theft has been devastating in terms of the financial and other sacrifices my spouse and I have had to make in order to care for my parents. I am trying to fathom what my brother did and struggling to forgive, but for now I just don't want anything to do with him.
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I had a somewhat similar experience with some of my siblings. When presented with irrefutable facts, they have steadfastly refused to acknowledge wrongdoing. Some probably out of shame, others out of denial. I’d love to forgive and resume the relationships but can’t live in an alternate reality where there is tacit agreement that nothing happened and the truth doesn’t matter. Plus, this behavior was terribly disrespectful to and put our late parents at risk. My parents were kind people who loved us unconditionally. I took a principled stand. I feel the loss but can live with myself.
1
I became estranged from my only sibling in similar circumstances. Fortunately, the kind of theft you describe did not take place (but likely would have given the opportunity). I received no love or support of any kind, and a lot of flip retorts when I requested a little help like making phone calls, when I was seeing my mother and her husband through the end of their lives and their last illnesses. When only my mother was left and she wanted to sell her home to move and live closer to me my brother called me up and started yelling at me that I should force her to stay in her home and "let nature take its course." Her home had appreciated greatly in the 20 or 25 years they owned it, and I think my brother had been tracking its value from the other side of the continent and saw it as a way to solve some of his own financial problems. It was just so toxic I just said one day that I had to draw a line for my own sanity. And when asked on forms, like in dr. offices or hospitals, I say I have no relatives. It is sad and I do feel guilty about.
2
My own brother did similar things. I built a wall around him decades ago, and my life is better because that wall is in place.
I think forgiveness is overrated in cases where we have been systematically victimized and betrayed. The behavior your brother displayed is sociopathic and predatory toward both his parents and his sibling. That kind of person is dangerous to others.
My best advice to you: protect yourself and do not let him back in where he might do further harm one day, emotionally or otherwise. And forgive yourself for your decision as quickly as possible.
5
I’m not saying Mr. Maack didn’t have valid longstanding reasons for not inviting his family to his wedding or notifying them of it. But I think there must have been more to it than the article reveals. I mean if he didn’t want his father to disrupt the wedding, then don’t give him a part to play in it as his brother tried to do. Now if he thought his father would disrupt the wedding even without being given a specific part, then he was right not to invite them. But really it does seem like he wanted to breakaway even before the wedding. I’m sure he must have known how the family would react once they found out, and he was willing to live with that.
As for me, I’m not estranged from my family, but I don’t find large gatherings as fun as I used to. There’s no abuse or anything. But I’m the only one of my or the older generation to have never been married and not to have any children. Now even the generation after mine is all married and beginning to have children. I feel alone in the midst of them as all of them are involved with their spouses, children, or grandchildren. I’m the only one without any of these. My aloneness makes me sad. So while I love my family, I try to avoid large family parties.
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I agree with Sam Smith: there was more going on. I noticed that Mr. Maack didn't even inform his family about his marriage afterwards, since they found out from his Facebook page. That's fishy.
8
We're all alone, ultimately, Sam, in spite of all the diversions.
Be well.
31
Sam Smith;
Although I am married, my wife and I never had children (we are in our mid 60's).
I understand you feeling like the odd man out. My wife and I have become more distanced from our friends who have children because that is the primary focus of their lives (understandably) and we just can't relate because we haven't had the experience of child rearing.
What has happened instead is that we have developed closer bonds with quite a few friends who are also childless. Don't get me wrong -- I have nothing against children and have helped out a couple of friends with donating money for their childrens' college educations. I guess that maybe there is a twinge of regret on my part that I know I will go to my grave having never experienced being a parent.
1
Estrangement within families is sometimes a wise and safe course of action, both emotionally and physically. But the article and the comments run with it in a dangerous direction. Conflicts and difficulties within families are part of the deal and exiting the family to avoid these can end up either dissolving or damaging the family for generations to come. Something to be said for the rituals, no matter how boring or irritating that kept family together, a single main root in a complex quickly moving often disjointed society. In this increasingly bizarre society of strangers making love, drinking or drugging to avoid isolation, in which people have thousands of ‘friends’ most of whom they don’t know, who walk through the world with iPhones stuck in ears,talking out loud and suffering both strangeness and anonymity too often…delegitimizing a central and stabilizing pod of people, called family, is terrifying. There doesn’t seem to be any subsurface awareness of the pain and grief and loss to any member of the family or family to be which probably occurs more often than not. Look at the message boards about estrangement of grown children from parents and inhale the pain and hurt and guilt and sorrow and confusion. People get stuck! In decisions to abort familial relationships. There’s gotta be some better way to grapple with the problems of ANY family than ejection. Life is really short and replete with random deaths. Used to be DACA and now? Well, what does family matter?
15
Jay you sound like a thoughtful man with firm conservative values, and I mean that with ultimate respect. Giving up on important social institutions in a flippant or reckless manner can be destabiling. So can giving up on these institutions after a long thoughtful and sometimes tortured process. The latter you endorse, the former you don’t, I get it. What I don’t get is bringing up DACA. It’s not for me to decide if it is driven by the rule of law, population management or racism. But I am pretty sure the conservative principals behind it were not intended to erode “family values”. Perhaps your terror is misplaced.
5
Jay, I really appreciate these comments, you make a very important point. So little is stable and secure nowdays, and I understand your fear that undermining the family in turn undermines society. Giving up on family should always be a last resort. It's just that sometimes it really is the only option for self-preservation. No one should be expected to put up with abuse out of a notion that they're undermining societal values if they finally say "Enough" and some people's childhoods really were so rough that dissolving that bond is the right thing to do for sanity and living a productive life - also good conservative values, right?
4
Where is the family values in denying the dreamers and blaming the desire to maintain family connections by sponsoring relatives to follow oneself as a new American for relatively rare crimes. Of course we can look for skilled labor but family comes first and maintaining connections should be encouraged by federal policies. Canada is not perfect because they stress job skills over family.
The suddenness comes when one of the principals at long last gets the message—or misperceives a message—that estrangement is in the hand they've been dealt over the decades.
To push that metaphor, plenty of immediate families are simply playing different games with the same deck, often with changing rules, and have reached the point where one decides to stop guessing at and/or playing along with whatever game(s) the other persists at or alters.
Some do it because they deem it nonsensical to bog down would-be merry occasions, others because they find it antithetical to their identity.
We could get into the question of why one self-identifies as something so at odds with who their family believes themselves to be, or why one whose essential self isn't actually threatened by opening of minds and hearts to accept and understand—or at least periodically compromise—can't view differences with love.
Then there's the question of why one would perceive their own identity as immutably fixed yet see a parent or child's as a choice made out of ignorance or spite when the opposite is often the case.
Acculturation, addiction, sexuality, gender, zealotry, there are many profound intransigences. Yet the two basic pivots are control: the adult child's desire for self control and the parental instinct to instill particular qualities in the child; and responsibility: one's failure in the other's eyes to take responsibility for real or perceived harm in the past, present or future.
11
I grew up with an abusive mother and it took lots of therapy over time to (somewhat) heal from the emotional wounds she inflicted. I’ve found happiness as an adult in spite of her.
I’m in a healthy, nourishing marriage and it was only by creating distance from my mother over a long period of time that I was able to find enough balance inside myself to be able to connect in a healthy way with a partner.
Life is not a Disney movie. Sometimes it simply isn’t possible to smooth things over with a toxic parent and separation is necessary. There’s no reason to feel guilty about that.
A friend with a similar background to mine confided in me that she was relieved when her abusive parent died, and I appreciated her honesty.
54
My father gave me black eyes and otherwise tormented me for much of my life. He lived until 101. I would have been much happier if he had had a stroke the year I was born.
5
For me, familial genetics is overrated as the most destructive and poisonous people in my life were blood relatives. In a sense, though, I am the person that I am today because of them. I left home at age 18 rather than remaining in an environment of violence and mental illness, which means I quickly learned the importance of standing on my own two feet through hard work and steadfast determination. Then and still to this day, I endeavor to live a decent life of integrity and kindness because of what I witnessed growing up. (Yes, I fall short at times, but I don’t ever stop trying to lead a good life). I am blessed to have gotten through college and to, in fact, be a college professor, myself. More importantly, I have what I always wanted, a happy, mentally healthy family. Are my family members, genetic? No. Instead, I have an amazing 21-year-old daughter who came to me from an orphanage and incredible friends who have stood by me in good and bad times. We need to stop defining family by biology, but rather by the people who love us. As an unknown writer wrote, “Family isn't always blood. It's the people in your life who want you in theirs, the ones who accept you for who you are. The ones who would do anything to see you smile and who love you no matter what.”
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It’s not just people choosing to end their relationships because of drama. Many genuinely love each other, but are terrible at keeping in touch.
11
You make a good point. There are many awful stories of estrangement, but it is also sad to think that there are estrangements that were never intended to be estrangements! It's just that in some cases it gets difficult to get and keep in touch over the years.
1
Dysfunctional families are normal in America. So is estrangement. We've been estranged from 3 of our children almost 17 years. Two other children have been estranged for about 20 years, but one keeps in touch intermittently especially when money is needed he never fails to touch base.
I think that the basic reasons for estrangement in our family have two issues; Divorce and money. My 2nd wife and I are married for almost 18 years. I'm just 70 and she'll be 70 in April. The "kids" don't call, write, send cards, text or bother with us. We've declined to shell out money to these adult monsters. They also made it a point several years ago to let us know that they're unhappy because we're well off and they think we should spend less on ourselves. And we made it point to let them know that they won't inherit a dime. There will be real mourners at our funerals. If they even bother to come.
There is anger, mistrust, myths about bad behavior and resent about inheritance. There are 4 of 6 grandchildren that we've never seen. And two weddings that we were disinvited from.
My wife and I are generally happy. We have many friends, we attend social events and we travel around the world. Fortunately both of us are healthy too. We honestly don't know what the main cause of discontent is. When we were young we did as much as we could for our kids. Even when there was little money we made the sacrifices to take care of their welfare. They all went to college and graduate school. Nuts.
19
If you are genuinely interested in trying to understand what occurred, consider printing out your comment and taking it to a reputable, well-regarded family therapist. You could use it as a basis to start to unpack, with help, what happened here.
4
Jay - I'm wondering the best way to respectfully ask how it can be possible that 5 of your children (five!) - all of whom are highly educated - have chosen to estrange themselves from you and you're seemingly not able to make sense of any of it ~ to see yourselves only as victims?
8
You may not know what the cause is, but there is a cause.
You wrote :"We have declined to shell out out money to these adult
monsters."
That you view your children as "monsters" indicates that there is a problem on your end.
"We have made it clear to them that they won't inherit a dime."
8
Missed one.
A parent suffers from a variety of mental health issues, uses splitting against ones own children. So intense is this splitting that brothers and sisters are pitted against each other since early childhood. By the end of high school, they have no positive relationship with a brother or sister. Then that parent commits suicide when the kids are in young adulthood. Estrangement is complete.
27
Bingo.. my exact story
2