Get ready for another 70 years of conflict.
3
Clever move. In a single state with equal rights for its citizens, the Palestinians outnumber the Israelis and will win democratically what their struggle failed to achieve.
7
There are only two decent, legal, and reasonable outcomes to this situation. Either for Israel to retreat completely to its 1967 borders, or to embrace the one state solution with equal rights for all. It is a shame to the Western World that we are willing to tolerate the present illegal occupation. I fervently hope for the day when the EU ceases to trade with Israel (60% of Israel's trade is with EU), because this would force Israel to return to decency.
8
The "two-state solution" is an oxymoron.
There should be one state and it should be secular from the start.
Israel should rename itself (Canaan?) and explicitly avow itself as a secular state with a statement akin to our First Amendment:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; ..."
By doing so, that says to all the people who live there: "Welcome. This is your home. No one is a second-class citizen here."
Then prove it by electing a Palestinian as Prime Minister.
6
Ed: Do you really think Saudi Arabia would do that? How about some suggestions that promote peace instead of nonsense.
1
An objective analysis of their behavior and political positioning over the last few decades makes clear that the Palestinians are in no hurry for a state and quite likely do not want one. There is too much responsibility in managing a sovereign territory, and Palestinian leaders have demonstrated over the years that they are terrified of making decisions. More to the point, Abu Mazen, Saeb Erekat and others are able to maintain their positions and lifestyles with a victimization narrative that they have down pat. Mr. Trump's Jerusalem announcement changes nothing in the Palestinian calculus.
As for Saeb Erekat's threat to struggle for"equal rights": this is a chimera and he knows it. The Palestinians who live in the West Bank and Gaza are not citizens of Israel, thus they do not enjoy the same rights as Israelis do. Therefore, there can be no struggle for "equal rights" because they have none to begin with.
What passes for Palestinian "leadership" needs to wake up and accept reality. Israel is a permanent fixture; it will not be wiped out in stages.
Ironically, it was Ariel Sharon who built the wall that divides the area and renders effectively two distinct territories. Look at overhead imagery and you will see two distinct areas. In this sense, the Palestinians have their state; they just need to sit down and negotiate the details.
But they'd rather play victim. Pity.
7
What if, next week, Trump says he wants to put the US Embassy in East Jerusalem, in the Palestinian portion of the city? Would they see this as a positive gesture and way to build a bridge with both?
The hate - magnet chaos sewing President strikes again. His blundering arrogance is only matched by his need to create havoc. If we are lucky, he will become toast before he can blunder into starting WW-3 (if he hasn't already).
1
I don't see this move by Trump as anything worse than the mess already caused by both Israel and the Palestinians. The Palestinians, along with Jordan and Egypt, gambled and lost. The Israelis have been arrogant and borderline racist in their treatment of Palestine. But the fact is, might makes right, regardless of historical arguments of the "promised land", and the Israelis have long had the upper hand.
Ultimately this is going to end badly for Israel just as it did for South Africa. The numbers are against the Israelis, at least the Jewish segment of their population. Trump might have accelerated that outcome a bit but you cannot say his declaration will be causative.
2
Dialectic thought is the hallmark of intellect, empathic understanding and ultimately an approach that leads to a path of collaboration and the creation of deep creative solutions benefiting polarized sides engaged and entrenched in a conflict.
As an Israeli-American citizen, born in Athens Greece, a democrat, a woman who spent time in a Kibbutz, served in the Israeli Army, grew up with a Greek Orthodox father who was a refugee in east Jerusalem after the 48 war of Israel's independence and a Jewish mother who survived the holocaust, I am alarmed at the non dialectic media coverage of the events and of the discourse with regards to Trump's announcement.
Certainly Mr Trump lacks political or personal finesse, certainly he is a poor articulator, certainly he has agendas (as does every person in power), but to reduce the outcome of the deceleration and concentrate on the negative potentialities as if they are facts, particularly without providing historical context of any kind, without putting in perspective the UN's treatment of Israel, without addressing the evolution of the wars in the Middle East between Israel and other Arab countries and the Palestinian contribution to the failed peace initiatives, is jarring to me. A two state solution is a must, however the announcement is justified and necessary and sadly an outcome of 8 years of failed foreign police with Obama at the helm (for whom I incidentally voted).
I would encourage people to look and listen deeply...
7
So the two state solution wasn’t killed by the Palestinians when the my refused to accept an independent state in May 1948? And it wasn’t killed when in the 1960s when the Palestinian Liberation Organization declared the destruction of Israel as a core tenant of their charter? And it wasn’t killed the Arab nations threatened war in 1967 or launched an attack on Yom Kippur in 1973? And it wasn’t dead when two separate Israeli governments each offered Palestinians 95 percent of their demands?
The Palestinians, their leaders, and Arab friends have repeatedly made choices to deny themselves a state.
10
Netanyahu has never been in favor of a two state solution. He believes an independent (weak) Palestine state would shortly be taken over by Hamas, Hezbollah or Iran. Not to be permitted.
1
The US never was a honest broker in this dispute.
4
The US never was a honest broker in this dispute. Now is clearer than ever!
16
In a true democracy every citizen's vote counts-Palestian and Israel.
12
This is a moronic move.
7
The Palestinians had a two state solution in 1948, via the UN mandate. But they chose to go to war and lost. And they have been fighting this war ever since and losing, to the detriment of their people...70 years. And today we see continued violence. Israel has moved on to become a modern, democratic, pluralistic, successful state. While the Palestinians wallow in their victimhood and continue to pay subsidies to families of terror. Perhaps, Trump's actions (which have not excluded Palestinian claims to part of Jerusalem) will shock them into the reality and sit down and negotiate with Israel based on reality and the facts on the ground...but judging from their past actions this isn't likely. As the late & great Abba Eban once said, "Palestinians never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity."
28
so as a modern. democratic pluralistic, successful state---accept the Palestinians who live in the lands Israel rules as full citizens with voting rights and enhance the democracy and pluralism; there are already so many settlements and security sites that a viable independent Palestine is a pipe dream anyway
1
Nice to see a bit of courage and it's definitely time to pick a side. Subjectivity is as important as objectivity.
5
Who has America been fooling? Clearly not the Palestinians. The Jewish lobby is what it is. The revolving door of AIPAC et al, easing into diplomatic positions and senior posts has given us a never ending stream of neocons who carry Netanyahu's concerns and essentially are there to simply give lip service to the Palestinians while undermining the efforts of loyal Americans who truly want to be honest brokers to all concerned. Of course not Israelis are extremists like Netanyahu, just the ones in power both in Israel and America.
The fact is Israel as a nation receives more military aid than Iraq's or Afghanistan's combined military aid and not hand me downs; but the latest fighters and weapons technology while simultaneously advising and selling their own robust weapons to their largest customer, China. This is obviously an issue everyone wants to ignore. Trump is simply pulling back the very, very, very, thin veil of favoritism that has always confronted the Palestinians. Hopefully our forces in Korea won't confront a weapon designed by the United States, copied by Israel, sold to China, and loaned to North Korea. Nah, won't happen.
16
If murder of a state can be committed multiple times, the Palestinians are serial killers. They have been offered a state of their own 4 times. They have rejected it four times.
When Jordan occupied East Jerusalem for 20 years, they destryed 58 synagogues, desecrated Jewish cemeteries, expelled all Jews and banned Jews from ever entering their holy sites. There was no outcry then.
25,000,000 refugees were resettled after WWII within 5 years. The Palestinians have been whining for 70 years. Enough already. I think Trump is profoundly troublesome for so many reasons, but he finally got one right, and showed guts whrere past presidents of both parties were both cowardly and, in promising todo what Trump finally did, dishonest.
31
With its outragious demand to have majority of its citizen live in Israel - under their bogus claim of "right of Return", PLO is the main reason we have no peace yet.
.
Ever wondered why they insist on this clause? Here is why.
.
Ancient Palestine includes, todays Jordan, Gaza, West Bank and Israel.
Palestinians as part of the general public.
Jordan - 62%
Gaza - 100%
West Bank: 80%
Israel - 19%. (6.5m Jews & 2.1m Arab-Israelis who identify themselves as "Palestinian-citizens of Israel)
Estimated # of refugees - 5.6m to 6.2m
PLO & Hamas's incidious plan is to overhelm Jews with Palestinian majority. One Election, One Man, One Time. Then, use Israel's own democracy to destroy its democracy - on to "Sharia Law"
The question remains, if Palestinian leaders want their own state, & desire to live in peace with Israel - why do they insist mojority of their citizen live in Israel.
They call it "Phase Plan - 10 steps to eleiminate state of Israel".
18
A reality check and a bitter pill to swallow. No other way but to go back to the negotiating table, smartly that is. Israel is the proverbial 800lbs gorilla. Tehran is not coming to the rescue and Hamas is rotting.
6
Trump never had a two state solution in mind and neither did Jared. It is obvious Jared took care of his friend, Bibi.
19
Actually, this is something that Republican donors really wanted... https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/06/us/politics/trump-embassy-jerusalem-i.... I get the impression this has to do with money, plain and simple.
2
As if the Palestinians are seriously going to consider a peace with Israel that doesn't include the destruction of Israel. The Israelis are our allies and the only nation in the region that shares our values. The addicted to terrorism Palestinians are Israel's enemy and also our enemy.
27
Sure -- Israel shares 'our values' of intimidating an oppressed people further [what we did to the 'natives']. Drops bombs on innocents as we did in Japan and support in Yemen with 'our ally' Saudi Arabia.
Israel is a leech and an anchor around the US -
17
"Our" enemy?? Let's be honest and look at the fact that Israelis also aren't going to seriously consider peace with the Palestinians that doesn't include the destruction of Palestine...
And exactly THIS, is the reason why the U.S. should remain "neutral" ... even though it is still selling arms to everyone.
2
If anything, Trump has likely killed the One State solution, the one clearly inscribed in the Palestine National Charter, which they still live by. One which excludes Jews.
That "the partition of Palestine in 1947 and the establishment of the state of Israel are entirely illegal...." And that the ultimate goal is the " liberation of Palestine," in other words, One state. And that One state another stepping stone for all Arabs:
"The destiny of the Arab nation, and indeed Arab existence itself, depend upon the destiny of the Palestine cause. From this interdependence springs the Arab nation's pursuit of, and striving for, the liberation of Palestine. The people of Palestine play the role of the vanguard in the realization of this sacred (qawmi) goal." That the goal is for "Arab unity."
Do we really want another apartheid state in the Middle East? Any future Palestinian state will become one. in July, 2010, Abbas made it clear that he would not allow Jews to live in a Palestinian State. He stated, "I will never allow a single Israeli to live among us on Palestine's land."
And yet, the connection of Judaism and Christianity to Jerusalem are clear: The Old Testament refers to it 900 times, and the New Testament, 350 times. The Koran, not once.
22
What is their 'real' end game? To make Israel a pariah in the world. The zealots cannot see the forest from the trees.
12
There is no solution to the Israeli Palestinian conflict.
What we can expect is more of the same: cold wars alternating with hot wars for the foreseeable future.
7
There is not solution of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict due the fact that is seen as a land problem and not as the need from Arabs to have Israel as an scapegoat to hide their real problems
1
Trump thinks that he can con anybody into thinking as he wants because he's a shallow and inane person. This deal is finishing off all hope of a two state solution for the foreseeable future.
A two state solution requires very strong and trustworthy agreement between the Israelis and the Palestinians. Now Netanyahu wants a single Jewish state and he does not want a state full of adversaries right next to it, and he wants the expulsion of all Palestinian Arabs from Israel, entirely, so he is not a supporter of the two state solution. The Palestinians mostly would like Israel not to exist and they do not want to be in an unarmed state that can be crushed by a neighboring state with who they are adversaries. When they say that the U.S. action by Trump ends hope of a two state solution, they should be believed.
11
"he (Natanyahu) wants the expulsion of all Palestinian Arabs from Israel"
Sounds like our deportation of undocumented immigrants!
4
Casual Observer: does your personal fantasy about Israel deporting all Palestinian Arabs include all Arab Israelis who make up 20% of Israel, a population and have more rights and social mobility than any of their brethren in any neighboring Arab country?
It goes without saying, Israel contemplates no deportations or ethnic cleansing. That is what Jordan and Egypt did to the Jewish communities in the Old City, Judea, Samaria and Gaza in 1949. Israel is far better than that and the world knows it - including you.
17
Like that old saying goes - "you snooze - you lose".
Since 1947, Pals were offered their own state, no less than 6 times, all to no avail. They want it all & ended getting almost nothing.
Until & unless Arab & Muslims will respect Jews right as real indigents and accept them as integral part of the region - regrettably we will not see peace in the region anytime soon.
11
At least the last 4 Presidents for 30 years have promised campaigning to recognize simple reality, that Jerusalem is the Capital of Israel, and then showed what liars they are when they take office. They've caved to the LIE from the Palestinian's and their supporters that reality would doom the peace process. Well there has been no peace if caving to Palestinian LIES because the Palestinian's don't want peace. They want the complete destruction of Israel and genocide.
President Trump has kept his promise, and recognized simple realty. So the Palestinian's now say he's killed off the chances for peace and an agreement? Well what's new? When Presidents LIE and cave to the Palestinian's they've refused to make peace, and so this is no different. Yes, the Palestinian's will take to the streets, and burn some buildings and cars, almost all their own, and kill a few people, mostly themselves, and who cares? They do that at the drop of a hat. They teach their 4 and 5 year olds to hate and kill Jews in school. They don't want peace and pretending if we cave in to them that we'll get it is a proven failure.
What I remember most about Palestinians are the pictures and videos of them dancing and shouting in the streets for joy that their Muslim Brothers had just murdered 3000 people, mostly American, but also people from other countries including Muslim, and including babies. They were dancing for joy in the streets.
25
He thinks he’s the worlds king!
2
Netanyahu and Trump are the WORST things for Israel . The world community will not tolerate an apartheid state which only leaves Israel giving Palestinians citizenship and thus dissolving the whole idea behind a Jewish State . It won't be Jewish anymore .
Hubris hits once again . Arrogant fools - both of them .
As a Jew I am embarrassed and angry . What more can this man do to destabilize the world ?
22
To "embarrassed and angry" you need to add "ill-informed." Over 95% of Palestinians Arabs are rule by either the PA or Hamas as a direct result of the Oslo Accords. No apartheid now, in the offing or ever by Israel. Can the same be said of, for instance, Lebanon and its treatment of Palestinians?
16
Wake up!
1
If it's any consolation, Trump declared Washington DC the oligarchy's capitol and everything else a ghetto with his scroogey tax plan.
3
A secure, defensible Israel can't abide a fully sovereign Palestinian state in the West Bank. It makes Israel indefensible. Israel basically needs to control the Jordan Valley and the airspace over the whole of the current territory.
So there is no true two-state solution that can happen. The best the Palestinians can hope for is essentially local self-government in the West Bank.
Trump's move gets us a bit closer to that reality. The reality in which Israel gets way more of what it wants than the Palestinians. Maybe that is favoring the strong over the weak, but like it or not that's the reality.
10
Well, so much for Mr. Trump bringing back saying Merry Christmas. I have to admit, I never knew it went away or was banned. Looking at the news footage of Christmas trees in Jerulism, no lights just darkness and gloom during this normally festive time of year, says to me, he has just stopped that greating from be uttered during "The Holidays"!
1
There IS an independent Palestinian mini-state: Gaza.
The Arab world rejected an independent Palestinian state when the UN offered them one in 1947. They did so again with the Three No's of Khartoum in 1967. They did so when President Clinton negotiated a deal at Taba in 2001.
The Palestinians are the only independence movement in history to reject a state because of a boundary dispute.
15
One State Solution is the best option. Thirty to fifty years from now, the best and the brightest will have been systematically integrated with the West through emigration, the existing lands would have become drier and parched with no natural resources. The Arab lands that sympathized with Palestinian cause already cease to exist, or have lost out in one-sided and conveniently defined wars. Palestinians deserve to live in their homeland with equal status as the Jews; most importantly, the World has moved on and is tired of non-stop attention to the Middle East.
13
Good could come of this..
Donald Trump's unilateral decision to move the American Embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem may in fact be a blessing in disguise for the peace process. Firstly, and most importantly, his actions have permanently removed the United States from the peace process. In many ways this unburdens the United States, which hadn't been acting as an honest broker in years and allows for the international community to take up the slack.
Now the international community can contribute greatly to the peace process by formerly recognizing Palestine as a sovereign state along the 67 borders.
Donald Trump's abject hatred of Muslims just may have been put to good use for once.
5
it's one thing for Trump to bumble around his cabinet, cutting funding and regulations to benefit his friends and supporters, but quite another thing for him to ignorantly meddle in international politics.
What, in Donald's recent history, indicates any semblance of understanding of any important issue?
Dear World: Please ignore our president. We will fix it ASAP.
12
Right now, as has been true for over 40 years, there are basically 4 ways this can play out:
1. Israel disappears from the map. Americans, Israelis, and Jews worldwide would of course see this as unacceptable.
2. The occupied territories disappear from the map, and the people living there become Israeli citizens. Israelis and many Jews worldwide generally see this as unacceptable because there's a good chance this new state would elect an Arab government rather than a Jewish government.
3. Two-state solution, in which the territory in question is divided somehow between Israel and the newly created Palestinian state. This is acceptable to Fatah, left-wing Israeli parties, and left-wing Americans. It is unacceptable, however, to Hamas, right-wing Israeli parties including the ruling Likud Party, and right-wing Americans.
4. Apartheid and/or genocide of the Palestinians. This is unacceptable as a matter of international law, to the Palestinians (for obvious reasons), left-wing Israeli parties, and left-wing Americans. By all appearances, this is the goal of right-wing Israeli parties and right-wing Americans.
The only answer which is not monstrous is a two-state solution. Monsters on both sides are doing everything in their power to prevent a non-monstrous solution.
7
Option two is the only realistic solution. All the peoples on that piece of land living in a secular state with equal rights as citizens. Anything else at this stage is pure fantasy. The two-state solution is dead and Trump finally put it to rest when he recognized Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
5
Neve going to happen. Dream on,
2
The timing of the decision seems to have been random, as far as international affairs are concerned. However, I accept the proposition that recognizing Jerusalem as Israel's capital does not necessarily preclude a two-state solution, including one where Jerusalem, or at least the eastern part of it, is also the capital of a Palestinian state. The two peoples must find a way to share Jerusalem, much as they must find a way to share the territory of Israel-Palestine. Even as two separate states, they will remain interdependent in various ways. But the US needs to get serious about pressuring Israel to reign in its building of settlements in the occupied territories.
7
As does the President I believe whether the Israeli Muslim conflict results in ONE or TWO States is up to the Israel and the Muslims. Since the Seven Day War Jerusalem has been under nominal Muslim control administered by Israel. While Muslims are free to enter and pray at the Dome, Jews and Christians are largely denied the right to worship at the most holy of their shrines where Christ was Crucified and the Jewish Solomon's Temple was built over 1,000 years BEFORE the Muslim Dome, consider to be their THIRD most holy shrine. The closest Jews are allowed to the Temple Mount is the Wailing Wall, a fragment of the holy shrine.
Over 70 years of pursing the same diplomatic stratagem Israel's desire for peace and recognition have not materialized, despite giving land back after being attacked. Agreed to "cease fires" last minutes if that long and the Obama Administration's negotiation strategy was to break from neutrality, side with Terrorist infested governments and hold lengthy diatribes against Israel's leadership. It was high time for a change in paradigm and President Trump delivered it. The USA's foreign policy cannot and won't be dictated by the threats of terrorist organizations or their surrogates. "STRATEGIC PATIENCE" is neither an option nor a strategy.
11
This isn't news. Any literate person who's paid half a mind to world events at least once their lives will recognize Trump just affirmed his support for a perpetually occupied and divided city. I expect a major terrorist attack to come soon and that the perpetrators will use this as their justification. In my mind, when your job is to protect the safety of Americans, you don't go and unnecessarily provoke people who wish you harm. Osama bin Laden claimed the Israeli-Palestine issue as a major source for his actions many times throughout his life. People like him will act, then people like Trump will react, and all humanity will suffer for their lack of empathy, understanding, and respect for others.
10
Excuse me, but are you saying Israel can't be a democratic state and a Jewish state? You clearly say Israel will not extend equal rights to Palestinians living under its rule. Yet Israel refuses to agree to an equal independent sovereign Palestinian state aside it. So what must Palestinians do to live with the dignity of citizenship in their homeland? Convert to Judaism?
15
The Palestinians can rally all they want. The decision has been made and its final. Good for trump.
Israel is our ally, Palestine our enemy.
9
a despicable, immoral and inaccurate argument
10
What makes you think that? What have the Palestinians ever done to you?
2
"Palestine our enemy."
Why? Did they ever hurt us?
4
There can be no "peace" as long as one group of people seek a zero sum solution, the complete annihilation of the State of Israel. Therefore, the concept of a two state solution is moot.
11
Nor while the other side denies Palestinians even exist and seeks a Greater Israel with their land but not their people.
Of course neither side is united in these two opinions, but enough hold them to block peace.
A fake Peace Process that is all process, never meant to end, has obscured the underlying reality.
13
The one state solution is really what Palestinians have been seeking, quietly before and openly now. The so-called one state solution, allegedly secular. However, the vast majority of Palestinians are practicing Moslems and desire a state where sharia is enshrined as law. Depending upon their numbers, they could vote that in. In no way can Israel accede to this, especially if Gaza is included. Nobody could control the flow of arms; it would be a cataclysmic civil war costing millions. Plus, Hezbollah would get in by shooting deadly rockets galore, in support of a Palestinian take over. This is exactly the scenario they seek, why they've promoted BDS. The original 2 state demand was never envisioned as a final accord, which is why no Palestinian leader would sign such an agreement.
So, liberals would be happy to end the Jewish state, possibly suggesting refugee status for fleeing Jews who survive the invasion. The results: a failed Palestinian state, still dependent on international support. Be careful what you wish for.
10
The Palestinians were always a rather educated, Westernized group. They included a great many educated professionals, and were providers of those services to much of the more fundamentalist Muslim world around them. Other Muslims always resented that a bit.
They had never been oriented toward Sharia law. That is an anti-Muslim concern that really applies least to the Palestinians.
The two state idea was originally pushed by Israeli Jews, as a place to put Palestinians that was not in the Jewish state. The Palestinians finally accepted that idea after long resistance. Then, the Israelis no longer wanted to allow it.
They preferred to take the intended Palestine for themselves, without any idea of what to do instead with all those Palestinians. We see a widespread denial there even are any, as a "solution" of denying the problem exists. Well, it does.
The Palestinians never accepted any of the offers of a Palestine because none of those offers was acceptable, nor meant to be acceptable. A Swiss Cheese mess of separated closed neighborhoods, without most of the characteristics of a state, and with no economy but a low end service provider to Israel, that is not a state anyone would accept.
The American negotiators who were present have since written that they would never have accepted it, Israelis would never have accepted it, and nobody was surprised that the Palestinians would not -- frustrated they did not get away with it, but not surprised.
15
I suppose AIPAC would not be among "liberal(s) (who) would be happy to end the Jewish state"?
2
What a perverted lying view of history. The Palestinians finally accepted the two-state solution when they saw that their long-held dream of driving the Jews into the sea was getting them nowhere. The Clinton plan gave 97% of the West Bank to the Palestinian state, including East Jerusalem as its capital; how was this not "meant to be acceptable". How could this be anywhere near the lying fantasy you describe?
6
Trump has no plans for negotiations between the Israelis and the Palestinians. Kushner supposedly was looking at Middle East peace in his amateur hour activities. This is an end. East Jerusalem is going to be absorbed by Israel. Negotiations have no where to go. Apparently the Israelis are planning to keep the Palestinians under house arrest forever.
9
Israelis mean for the Palestinians to give up and go away. Many have expressed surprise that has not already happened. Why do they stay and put up with it?
6
Since the Oslo Accords, over 95% of Palestinian Arabs have been ruled by the PA and Hamas, so talk of a "one state solution" simply reveals the Arabs continuing disinterest in creating a State of their own when the goal has always been the negation of Jewish rights of self-determination in any part of their historical homeland.
Arab regard for Jerusalem stands in inverse proportion to their control over it. When Jordan held the land, Jerusalem was a backwater. It should be obvious that whichever city was the focus of millennial Jewish longing, that's what the Arabs would claim. It's about keeping things from the Jews rather than creating their own civil society.
As to safeguarding holy sites, again history is instructive. When the Ottomans were in control, Jewish religious rights were a matter of sufference. When Britain liberated Jerusalem, they generally gave into Arab threats of violence to the detriment of Jewish rights and in violation of their sacred trust as Mandatory power. When Jordan illegally seized the Old City of Jerusalem in 1949 and ethnically cleansed its Jewish population and then, in violation of their armistice obligations, barred Jews (not just Israelis) from all their holy sites, destroyed their synagogues and desecrated the Mount of Olives cemetery. The fact is that only since Israel liberated the Old City in 1967 have the religious rights of every group been respected - and, if anything, those of the Jews only have been restricted.
18
Starting all the way with Jimmy Carter we just passed the buck. Every single year we gave Israel some 5 billion, meanwhile Israel stole land from Gaza and the West Bank and no US President stopped it. To blame Trump now for showing reality is hypocritical.
9
Rudolf, Actually Jimmy Carter was pressing Israel on the 2 state solution, and squeezed a commitment from Israel, from which Israel reneged when Carter lost re-election. Thereafter, every political candidate feared the Israel lobby. As Shimon Peres said, the US has never said no to Israel.
5
I'm pretty sure Netanyahu killed off the two-state solution first. Trump was late to the party.
7
The thrust of this article is that Trump is enough of a deal-maker that eventually the Palestinians will come back to the table. What happens meanwhile? There is enough angry politics in the Arab world that any terrorist group can use this act as fodder, risking retaliations that once more would inflame both sides. So was this act strategically sound?
There is no table to come back to. If there were a table, it would be empty. The meal has been carved and served and cleaned up.
8
You seem to be ready to give up. I'm not.
As usual Trump stirred the pot and actually did nothing. His bottom belief is that when the waters are churned, opportunity floats to the top. But he seldom sticks to it long enough to see things through. It’s all about seeing himself as a mover & shaker - in the literal meaning of those words.
3
Any injuries or deaths due to this announcement are on Trumps hands
4
Really? No, they will rest on the terrorists’ hands.
5
Peace would be possible if Israel ends the occupation of the Palestinian land and go back to its borders.
Israel has highly sophisticated weapons thanks to the US taxpayers money. Palestinians can throw stones on Israelis soldiers. It is clear who would win this war. In addition, the US supports Israel only. - It was actually the reason behind the 9/11 attack and anti-American sentiments in the Middle East.
In short, Israel decides if there would be any two-state solution, or not. Israel does not agree with the two-state solution, it wants to expand further and take over the entire Palestinian lands.
8
That sentiment is older than the terror itself...
If it wasn't for Israel, 9/11 wont happen... Terrorists don't need excuse they are like criminal just need an opportunity...
And Palestinians had multiple opportunities to have a State of their own that was offered and was negotiated... they blew it all in vane hope that their Arab brothers will rise up against Israel and create great Palestine... It happened once in '67 and ended in... we all know how. Now 50 yrs later Palestinians still trying to undo that war and all they did is they lost two generations of people to a false hope that somehow someway Israel will just melt away... maybe after they blow up one more bus or launch another missile...
The responsibility was and is on the lack of leadership by Palestinian leadership who didn't have courage to step up to the plate in 1999-2000 and continue negotiations and there would've been State of Palestine right now... peacefully coexisting with Israel and the world... Well, doesn't seem to be anywhere near the reality...
And so, trump or no Trump... situation was brought to where it is by all of his predecessors on all sides
4
Islamic terrorism is neither an abstract, nor an independent entity. It is usually a violent, hence unjustified response to the unfair treatment of muslims.
The rest of your writings are just Israeli propaganda which has its credibility only among those who do not want to listen to the arguments of the other side.
When you see the entire Western world disagrees with the US on the Israeli-Palestinin issue, you should think why the US is the only country that repeat the Israeli nonsense about Palestinians.
Trump does what his predecessors did, i.e. succumb to Israel lobby and AIPAC.
By the way, KQED had a report on how Iran gained influence in Iraq on Dec 6th, and 7th. Also, Al Jazeera has some reports and documentaries.
Take a big risk and watch these things, worst case scenario, you are gonna learn something about the region which is vital to all of us in the US.
Good Luck!
3
As if he couldn’t make things any worse.
1
Israel has received more than $233 billion in U.S. foreign aid over the past six decades, along with multiple gifts of free U.S. surplus military equipment, which belies its claim to being an impartial honest broker in seekingan Israeli-Palestinian peace accord. Trump's Jerusalem announcement just makes our bias more blatant. With the exception of then Secretary of State James Baker, who openly complained that Israeli settlements in the occupied territories were the biggest obstacle to peace, successive U.S. administrations have done nothing to halt Israel's continued theft of Palestinian land. That in itself has killed all chances of a two-state solution. So Israel is left with a one-state solution, meaning it cannot remain a Jewish state. It will have to give the Palestinians equal sovereignty with the right to vote and own the land they live on. Anything less is apartheid.
14
He didn't help but this was killed off long before Trump.
9
“Southern Boy” blames the demise of the two-state solution on the decisions of Palestinian leaders, but regardless of which politicians are to blame, the millions of ordinary Palestinians are still humans deserving of equal rights. If the two-state solution is dead, then the only remaining democratic option is one state with equal rights. However, “Southern Boy” is, no doubt, against this too, because his real desire is for ethnic cleansing of the remaining Palestinians, not democracy. Other commenters, such as “Mr. Little,” admit this openly.
13
WEST Jerusalem has been and remains Israel's de facto capital since 1949. ALL of its important government offices, including the Knesset are in the western part, which has been internationally recognized since 1949 as part of Israel.
Israel's continuing use of WEST Jerusalem as its capital in no way eliminates the possibility of EAST Jerusalem becoming the capital of a future Palestinian state.
Statements to the contrary are not correct.
The Hamas insignia, visible at the top of its official website, shows ALL of Israel as belonging to the Palestinian state. Hamas, its supporters and other Palestinians, still harbor a hope for a unified Palestine, from river to sea. This was once explicit in the Hamas Covenant and the Fatah Constitution, which called for the elimination of Israel and the creation of a religious-based (not secular) Palestinian state. The clouding of the Jerusalem issue, by NOT differentiating between east and west, promotes this goal of a larger Palestine, with ALL of Jerusalem as its capital
Fatah and Hamas' official websites. Note insignia at top showing ALL of Israel as part of Palestine:
http://hamas.ps/en/
http://www.fatehfrc.plo.ps/en/index.php?p=home
Cross reference the image below with a Jerusalem street map to see that Israeli government offices are within the 1949 boundaries:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9d/Split_Jerusalem_map_...
7
"The Hamas insignia, visible at the top of its official website, shows ALL of Israel as belonging to the Palestinian state."
Yes, and plenty of Israeli maps show the West Bank as Israel. Many don't show the Green Line at all.
That is why the two sides need to make peace. It does not mean that is impossible, just that they need it. Seeing only the other side's assertions just digs deeper into conflict.
6
“Mr. Little” happily endorses (continued) ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians and used discredited myths to justify this crime against humanity. He claims the ethnic cleansing of millions of Palestinians is justified by the decision of a handful of leaders to reject a deal involving the return of part of the West Bank. Yet he would never say the ethnic cleansing of millions of Israelis would be justified by the decision of Israeli leaders to reject a deal involving the full return of the West Bank.
Now that Israel’s half-century effort to make a Palestinian state impossible has succeeded, the only option for those living without rights under Israeli rule is to demand equal rights. One man, one vote, just as in South Africa. Are these people not human? “Mr. Little” no doubt believes there’s no such thing as Palestinians, but then even if they’re actually Swedes or Bolivians, who knows, aren’t they still humans deserving of equal rights? On what basis does he deny equal rights to them?
9
Why does everyone insist on looking at this as an isolated incident? Its all a part of the same hate and fear incitement that any successful fascist has used to consolidate power. It works. What would a President Trump do with another 9/11 or Pearl Harbor? Do you even have to guess? And it would work. The majority of the country would line up behind the beloved leader saving us from the enemy. All he has to do is incite violence and then claim leadership in combating it. There is no thought there about the good of the country, let alone the world. Its all about his "winning".
2
The level of ignorance and incompetence embodied in Trump is beyond belief.
6
Finally a president is forcing the Palestinians to reckon with their lack of impetus to build a state, to negotiate IN GOOD FAITH or lose. The Jews who lived in the land well prior to even the Balfour letter began building the infrastructure
of a state because that's what they wanted. Meanwhile the other inhabitant of that land had no vision for a state of their own, content to be under the rule of the Ottomans or the British. It's about time the Palestinian leadership was handed their own heads on their false narrative. And perhaps the sheep of the people will wake up to the fact that Palestinian leadership is simply politically and morally bankrupt. Ha, that will never happen.
8
"to negotiate IN GOOD FAITH or lose"
Lose what? Their alternative is to be part of Israel, and it is Israel that does not want that.
4
There is another narrative. East Jerusalem was annexed by Israel, and declared to be part of its capital. That is against international law since 1945. Now Russia can claim the crimean pensinsula for themselves according to the precedent that US just helped set. And other countries can start doing the same.
In light of the thoughtless and pandering act djt just performed for Sam Addelson and the base, the Palestinians should declare Jerusalem as their capital as well.
1
They have. The question is the US position on that.
Never fear Herr Drumpf is here to ferment more violence in America and around the world. If you like peace and security Donald Trump is not for you. There was no reason for Trump to declare Jerusalem the capital of Israel other than to sow more chaos and discord and to satisfy the whims of radical billionaire Zionist Sheldon Adelson. Trump's grotesque buffoonery has become so antithetical to our national interests that I no longer recognize this Administration, this White House or this President as being American. Welcome to Trumpistan where everything you thought you knew about reality is upside down and backwards. If this continues much longer America is going to need a two state solution.
5
Palestinian behavior is responsible for no two state solution. Arafat started a terror war (mislabeled 2nd intifada) after refusing a State after a generous offer at Camp David, etc. in 2000. Abbas refused a similar one in 2008 & has incited terrorism ever since. Erekat is a bureaucrat who should not be elevated beyond that; the Holocaust denying Abbas who claims no Jewish connection to Jerusalem or the land of Israel, despite archeological evidence, is the only one who counts. And he delegitimizes Israel constantly in the UN and throughout the world and incites terrorism, rewarding the murderers, while getting the plaudits of anti-Semites in the Muslim word, European anti-Semites, and European leaders catering to their large Muslim populations. With 1.6 billion Muslims in 55 countries, the deck is stacked against tiny Israel with 6 millions Jews surrounded by 450 hostile Arabs, plus genocidal Iran. Any time the Palestinians really want peace, like Sadat did, Israel will provide it.
This is story that you also need to tell.
Get real
The Palestinians tried to starve the Jews out of Jerusalem in the 1948 war and when Jordanian aggression resulted in their capture of the Old City, they destroyed all the synagogues and prevented Jews form praying at the Western Wall. Israel's liberation of Jerusalem has opened it up to all religions. Jerusalem was never important to the Arabs until the Jews wanted it, but it is the center of Judaism and has been for 3000 years.
9
It was not "a generous offer at Camp David" unless you mean "as much as Israel will ever agree to."
4
Yeah. And if people say the Native Americans have the historical claim of America and you should get away from your house, what would you do?
The West was scared of the Jews (maybe still is, on some level). After the genocide of the Jews in Germany, they refused to accept some Jews who came for sanctuary. They didn’t want them to be incorporated in here. Instead, they agreed the Jews should go back and form their own community in Middle East, citing the Scriptures. Hence why the UN gave Palestine to them.
So what should the Palestines do? They’ve been sent away from their homes, becoming people without a country. Of course they resist it and feel angry. What if that happened to you? That’s when they said the Jews don’t belong there. Because before the UN resolution, they really didn’t.
The Jews, traumatized by what happened in Germany, and supported by the US and British, who wanted to preserve their interests, launched the 1967 war. And of course they won, with all the arms they got from US and British. And they keep building settlements, widening their territorial areas by grabbing the natives’ lands. It’s like what the Europeans had done to the Native Americans.
Intifada was mostly employed by throwing rocks to the Israeli soldiers. That’s ironic that it held such headlines, comparing rocks and guns. Google how discriminative the Israelis toward the Palestinian Arabs. It’s sad. And yet the world sees the Israelis as the just and moral ones.
4
The two-state solution has dragged along since 1978 and has gone nowhere. Time for a one-state solution.
4
Or no solution, just more of the same. The maximum an Israeli leader can give is less than the minimum a Palestinial leader can accept. And neither wants a one-state solution. The one-state proposition is just a threat to the two parties to keep them negotiating. Neither will accept it.
1
If the US can dispense with the fiction that Jerusalem is not the capital of Israel, the Palestinians are right to dispense with the fiction that there will be a two-state solution. The corpse of the two-state solution has been propped up for many years because it has been convenient not just to Israel and the US, but also to Palestinian Authority officials whose paychecks depend on it, to pretend that Israel would someday permit a viable Palestinian State. Israelis and Palestinians have been living under a single state for more than half a century. It is a Jim Crow sort of state that denies most of its Palestinian residents citizenship and gives the rest second-class citizenship. Other PA officials will drag their feet to preserve their paychecks, but Erekat is right — the fight now is for equal rights within a single state.
5
The reason that Israel is so intransigent is that it has had to pay no price for its intransigence. Relentless settlement building, constantly brutalizing and humiliating the Palestinians, all of this protected and sanctified and even funded by the USA. If Israel actually had a price to pay, it would be more circumspect in its actions and conduct. I have always been ambivalent about BDS, but I am starting to see that it is the best and maybe only way to attach a cost to Israeli actions. As for the Palestinians, the one-state solution may be the only option they have left, but it is also a non-starter. Putting both of these people in one state would be a recipe for fratricide. Of course, that leads to the obvious question of what does Israel think will happen now? It has left the Palestinians no options; it seems to feel that they simply have to accept permanent subjugation and disenfranchisement. Maybe it even hopes that, one day, it can drive them out of their homes and displace them for good. The day will come when Israelis can no longer run from the truth of their state: it was founded on the displacement and dispossession of another people and everything that has followed since is the consolidation of that theft by an occupying power. This simple and obvious truth is powerful. In the end, no amount of obfuscation will prevent that reality from coming clear. In the meantime, the Palestinians will suffer more despair, humiliation and brutality.
4
In all the discussion and argument, several things have been mostly overlooked:
1. The Palestinians would likely have had a functioning capital in East Jerusalem and a state on most of the West Bank now if they had accepted the Clinton Parameters. This is not to excuse or ignore Israel's policies and actions, but to simply point out that Palestinians are too often portrayed as lacking either the ability to impact anything or make choices, when the reality is otherwise. The scuttling of the Clinton Parameters, the refusal to publicly support the Kerry Plan and the actions of Hamas in Gaza were all choices and actions that have often done just as much create the current situation as the choices Israel has made and the actions it has taken.
2. Even today, the Palestinians could still seize the diplomatic initiative and high ground, put Netanyahu and his coalition on the defense and even help to force new elections in Israel by clearly accepting negotiations based on the Clinton Parameters. One would think that they would have wanted to move quickly to forestall further Israeli settlement construction and end the occupation, yet the reality seems to be otherwise. Why?
3. Whatever the timing and reason for his decision, nothing Trump did in any way changes or forecloses the creation of a Palestinian capital in East Jerusalem as part of a peace agreement.
7
Younger Palestinians on the ground, not their current political leaders, will choose opportunity, education, and civil rights; those three things will come only when Israel and Palestine converge in one, well-funded state. Sure, at first it will be an unequal and segregated society with Israel treating Palestinians as not full citizens, similar to the segregated South in the US. Over time, however, pressure from within its own society, especially from millions of Palestinian citizens/residents of Israel will push Israel to embrace the secular state, to wind down this dead end of a Jewish state with theocratic, extremist led politics. We are watching the inevitable. The young will simply not put up with trying to regain the land and lemon trees of their ancestors. They want opportunity. They want to advance themselves in a fair, modern society. Joining Israel is their best shot at that.
3
No, President Trump did not kill off a 2 state solution; the Palestinians who want nothing short of the destruction of Israel destroyed that a long time ago. President Trump is just moving forward, recognizing what should have been recognize a long time ago, Jerusalem as the legitimate capital of Israel. Thank you.
17
Leave it to Trump to create trouble around the world. (God, didn't he learn anything when he went to New York schools)??? If it is not with North Korea, or with countries over Climate Change, then it is with the Middle-East. Jerusalem is not his capital to determine to put his embassy. Its not hard to see Muslims getting upset over this. Jerusalem should have been declared an international state instead, belonging to no other country but to the people in Jerusalem. It would go a long way at settling issues in the Middle-east. But, perhaps "Bibi" Netanyahu knows how to tweak Trump into doing what he wants. Afterll, Trump isn't so smart.
3
Best to go for the one state, equal rights solution. Israel cannot deny Palestinians equal rights without being labeled an apartheid state. Israel doesn't want a separate Palestinian state, at least they can do is let them be citizens, many have roots in the area much longer than many Israelis.
9
These Palestinians will not go away and disappear. Better to recognize their legitimate rights instead of waiting and having more victims in either side.
10
The two state solution had been dead for a decade. Time for a one-state solution.
11
There is the state of Israel.....Belongs to the jews...If Arabs agree to serve in the army and protect israel...they are welcome but they will never do it so they MUSt leave...One can't have rights without duties
2
Not sure I understand why a Palestinian state can't exist without a capital in East Jerusalem. They have major cities in the West Bank that would be much easier for them to use for a capital - Ramallah, Jericho, Hebron..
10
And by the same token.
... Not sure I understand why Israel needs a capital in West Jerusalem. They have major cities in Israel that would be much easier for them to use for a capital - Tel-Aviv, Acre or Haifa.
3
Absolutely. Israel could also exist without Jerusalem. In fact it did, from 1948 to 1967. When Israel got a chance to declare independence on UN terms, they went with it immediately! They didn't posture, "but we simply can't do it without Jerusalem, so won't do it at all until we have Jerusalem as capital".
The premise that Palestinians can't form a state without Jerusalem, is wrong. They absolutely can. If they won't, out of stubbornness or whatever, it's their problem.
1
Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as the capital of Israel is at odds with the effort to defeat ISIS. This purely symbolic gesture, made to placate a ever-diminishing base, will become an important recruitment devise throughout the Arab world - and Trump doesn't really care. It's the base, stupid.
See:
RevolutionOfReason.com
TheRogueRevolutionist.com
6
Ahh, the old “recruitment tool” trope.
2
Once again Trump makes a gesture to appease those who financed his campaign while the reality is that no actually action will occur. A statement of bluster which will only divide. Israel is an apartheid state. Always has been, likely always will be. It's a shame that we support this apartheid yet have condemned others.
6
There is no two-state solution. This dead drum has been beaten for way too long. If Arabs put down their guns and rockets tomorrow, there would be peace. If Israelis did the same they would be overrun and wiped out.
11
Since the Palestinians were always for a one state solution (one without Israel and without Jews), what is the difference?
13
Palestinians rage against Israel. It's what they do. It's their cultural identity. They appreciate the provocation.
10
Your comments are racist and ignorant. I suggest that you visit the occupied Palestinian territories and listen to Palestinians first hand.
5
Why do the heathen rage?
1
The Israelis are so blinded by their greed and racism that they don’t see the train wreck coming their way. President Trump’s next move is to push for a single state and then the next US President will be pushing for equal rights.
7
The Palestinians killed off a two-state solution by rejecting it numerous times starting with 1948, when they were offered their own land in Israel but rather joined forces with other Arabs to try and 'drive the Jews into the sea.' At this, they failed spectacular despite odds in their favor. They have walked away from two deals this century, the second of which would have given them 97% of the West Bank. They elected leadership who perpetrate terrorism and whose stated goal is the destruction of the Jewish state. Furthermore, there was never any expectation on either side that the Jews would give up Jerusalem - at least their portion of it -so this is all sound and fury signifying nothing, fueled by hysteria and anti-semitism.
8
Ironically, a one-state solution is the only real solution (although I doubt this is any sort of coherent policy by Trump). With two states, someone will always be unhappy and want to change the borders, perhaps by violence.
With one state, all you need to do is have a secular, democratic government that treats everyone equally. So in theory, it would work. Problem is, getting it to work in practice.
6
A cynical move to please Israeli hardliners and their supporters within the Republican Party. I guess Trump figures this will swing a few more votes in his favor if it ever comes to impeachment. But otherwise, this is just needlessly stirring up trouble. In fact, why is the US continuing to stick its nose into this endless and pointless conflict?
4
As time passes and Israel with it settlement and expansion and aggressive conservative government, and Palestine with almost equal aggressiveness hold to it's demands, including about Jerusalem. I don't believe a two state settlement will ever happen. This will slowly cause the Palestinians as the gentleman here and civilized people elsewhere to push for a single state with equal Palestinian right. In the fullness of time, Israel will not be able to resist this push and the single state solution will slowly become the thing that end Israel as a Jewish state.
4
US foreign policy with Israel has been one of complicity for a long time. How do you send billions in aid directly to Israel and yet continue the chatter about a 2 state solution? Illegal settlements continued on and on whose purpose was for Israel to take all of the real estate. You can't have a 2 state solution with no land left for the Palestinians. I'm disgusted with Israel and the United States. Trump's pathetic announcement will not "blow over" as they are expecting it to, but it's about time the US/Israel complicity is on full display for all to see. The US has lost all credibility as a participating partner in any kind of peace talks, if any, not only between the Palestinians and Israel, but in the Middle East. We are moving further towards a large scale war in this region.
20
It is already one of the most densely populated regions on Earth, and competing ethnic groups continue to strive to control it by weight of numbers.
His apologists say pay no attention to what Trump says (i.e., tweets), focus on what he does. Exactly. He can say whatever he wants about a 2-state solution, but his credibility is so diminished that few will trust him, or allow the US to lead a peace process. The world is paying attention to both what he says and does, and it all adds up to ceding American influence to our enemies abroad and to plutocrats domestically.
8
Israel will keep changing facts on the ground with the US and its military as the ultimate backstop while weathering sporadic low level violence from Palestinians.
Nothing will change about this in the next several decades.
I get the sense that Israel has moved on from the Palestinian problem and are busy building their country into something that is at least good for its residents. The Arab world is burning and is consumed with its own conflicts. Israel is physically located there but is part of a worldwide archipelago of industrialized, first world nations. Too bad about the neighborhood.
5
Everybody seems to forget two salient facts: (1) Jerusalem is the capital of Israel and was always designated by the Israelis to be the capital even when it was divided before 1967. Apparently, Israel is the only country that cannot choose its own capital without world consensus. (2) The right to determine it's own capital and the scope of that capital was hard won in battle by the Israelis in 1967 and preserved in defense of attacks in 1973 and afterward. The Palestinians joined in the Arab attack in 1948 in an attempt to kill Israel at its inception, and has borne the consequences since that time.
Wars often determine boundary settlements between nations and the scope of their jurisdiction over others. For example, Germany lost World War II and suffered a huge loss of its territory as a result. Many countries have seen their borders changed due to wars, both offensive and defensive. Why is Israel singled out for different treatment?
I applaud President Trump for recognizing the obvious, that Jerusalem is in fact the capital of Israel and the USA should relocate its embassy there. We should not be cowed by the fact that the Palestinians behave badly as a result of this decision. Islamic terrorism is nothing new and will continue unabated regardless of this decision until the extremists are defeated.
11
When Israel was created in 1948 by the United Nations,civil rights of the Palestinians who had lived in that area for hundreds of years were ignored. That is why the UK abstained from voting because they believed that the process was unfair to the Palestinians. This mistake is still with us and has never been dealt with. After WWll the slogan was "Self-determination for all peoples in the way to world peace and prosperity". Unfortunately this has not entirely become a reality. Many have said that the Palestinians were welcome in the new State of Israel, conveniently forgetting the acts of Jewish terrorist groups such as Stern and Urgun which suggested otherwise. Some British Orthodox Jews said the United Nations cannot create Israel, only God can do that. So there you have it ! A mix of opinions which have never been reconciled.
4
Well, JAM, not changing borders by force is what the United Nations Charter is about. It's illegal.
3
Whatever one thinks about how peace should be achieved, the problem is that Trump has now helped set a precedent that occupying a city (East Jerusalem) and declaring it part of a country (as Israel did) is ok. It has been against international law since 1945. Now Russia can use the same precedent to defy the UN when it comes to the Crimean Peninsula. And other countries may follow.
As to the historical argument about Solomon's temple being built 1000 years before the muslim dome (ignoring the fact that King David occupied Jerusalem from another nation), that same argument would then allow Native Americans to reclaim most of the US. Or Italy reclaiming large chunks of Europe. Or Arab states reclaiming parts of Spain. Where do you draw the historical line? It should be drawn with current international law, and according to that, there is a problem with what Trump is doing.
Upside to the wars Trump will cause, in the Middle East and Korea? Here it is: When Trump gets the world blown up, it will no longer matter that he blew up America's safety net, its middle class, its reputation among nations, and its sense of morality and decency. That's the upside to Trump's personal brand of diplomacy in the Middle East and Korea.
3
This decision on Jerusalem, is all politics at home, and no diplomacy. Mr. Trump is appeasing various parties. On the domestic politics side, he wants to make the powerful Israeli lobby and the evangelicals happy. Outside, he is playing into the hands of people like Netanyahu, who never wants peace with the Palestinians, and the Saudi royal family.
During the election campaign, Mr. Trump assured his commitment towards a peace deal for the Israelis and the Palestinians. With his recent announcement to endorse Jerusalem as the future capital of Israel, places in doubt of the US position as an honest and impartial broker.
If Mr. Trump was ignorant of many issues surrounding Jerusalem and the region, he did not respect valuable counsel from experts, and words of caution coming to him from world leaders. Instead, as always, Mr. Trump proceeded with his unilateral decision.
Jerusalem is surrounded with a very age old history, going back thousands of years. Three major religions - Christians, Jews and Muslims have equal claims and revere Jerusalem. When such is the case, decisions on Jerusalem should benefit all parties.
The Middle East is already in turmoil. The origins of the problems in the region relate to religion, sectoral differences and beliefs, and culture. They are all not new, coming down from biblical times. It is best that the governments and the peoples in that part of the world are left to solve these problems.
3
Religion creates big problems wherever it is a factor, because it almost invariably introduces non-factual irrelevancies the become negotiating sticking points.
5
Israel either has to make a two state solution work for the Palestinians--even if they have to share Jerusalem--or stop the Apartheid and grant equal rights. Trump was right, doing the same old-same old won't work. Problem is, Trump can't think even a single move ahead, and has taken Israel down a dead-end toward a "solution" that's not viable. Now, matters are worse because any negotiation will be tainted with the idea that "what Americans really want is..."
6
Mr. Erekat is correct, the Palestinians should push for a single state, with full and equal rights to all Israelis. Of course the Israelis will never agree to such a proposition, but yet, by making this proposal, they will force the Israelis to choose between their lofty principles that they continually degrade in their current political situation, or whether they will reveal their true intentions, which is to never grant any type of type equal sovereignity to the Palestinians.
8
Israeli's and their supporters should be careful not to hitch their wagons to Trump's, he is not a popular President and is unlikely to be reelected because he is morally bankrupt. Whoever succeeds him as President will likely roll back much of what he has done including the US embassy move to Jerusalem. It was a bonehead idea, accomplishing nothing except to inflame a volatile situation and also it unites Israel's enemies behind a more radical opposition than what existed before. Trump's move undermined the peace process in the Middle East and Israel is left holding the bag. Some things cannot be forced. Lots of empires have occupied Jerusalem, the problem is whether or not they can hold onto it. Israel and the world need to share Jerusalem, in my opinion. It is too important to too many peoples for one country to control.
3
The two-state solution lives: Jordan for Palestinian Arabs, Israel for Palestinian Jews. Both were created from British Mandate Palestine. Israel's 20% non-Jewish citizens enjoy legal equality. Of Jordan's Jewish citizens, not a single one remains.
9
A lot of commenters act as if Trump dreamed up this whole idea of proclaiming Jerusalem the capitol of Israel (it always has been) and the idea of moving the embassy from Tel Aviv, totally ignoring the bipartisan law passed and reaffirmed by Congress in 1995 and 2016. Of course, had Obama done this exact same thing rather than continuing the waivers he would have been proclaimed by the same folks as a sage peacemaker engaged in a bold initiative.
7
The Palestinians have no one to blame but themselves. It's about time the US stopped putting up with their nonsense. Israel is a sovereign state and can locate its capital wherever it chooses. As it happens, the present capital is within the 1947 borders.
7
Yes, Trump has basically killed the two state solution by giving away the Palestinians' biggest piece of bargaining power, and getting nothing in return.
It is now fifty years that the territories have been occupied. Israel will let this go on another fifty years. It is time for the world to recognize that these territories are no longer occupied, but annexed, and that Palestinians are being treated as illegal immigrants in the land of their ancestors.
Ironically, the most likely way to achieve a two state solution is for Palestinians to reject it and fight
for equal rights in a Greater Israel. Israel fears that far more than Palestinians throwing rocks at tanks or lobbing pathetic missiles that always miss.
Palestinians need to realize that violence is no longer helping them. Israel has learned how to use it in their propaganda.
Palestinians must get the world to demand they be full citizens in Israel.
"He Says No, Palestinians Say Yes"
Isn't the former self-evident? Of course he says yes. Trump isn't likely to admit that he believes that he has worsened things, but that is in fact what he does at every opportunity. He is Bizzaro Obama.
The Palestinian "one state threat" has been bandied as a negotiation point for decades. Not sure where on the Moon that state will be, because here on Earth Israel is never going to relinquish its own sovereignty and no nation on Earth has the power to force it to do so. Anyone who is interested in eventually having peace break out will stop feeding the fantasies of the most militant among the Arabs who are being allowed to believe that Israel will magically disappear. And feeding these militant fantasies it undermines those Israelis, and there are fewer and fewer left, who have wanted peace as well, because there is nobody to talk to and the conversation is now owned, on both sides, by maniacs.
2
Whatever opinion one writes, many of the contents can be construed as a set of a priori conclusions, since, as everyone knows, there ain't no right or wrong answers, in geo-politics and military matters. There will be an argosy of views, expressed by the opinion, column and book writers, no matter how au courant. Trump may claim he is simply advancing an avant-garde solution to an inveterate problem, but no one is prepared to be the aw-shucks consumer of that particular piece of news.
Political pundits seem to be inclined towards a tedious path of striking a balance between the Israelis and the Palestinians, which, in all likelihood, can beset the peace lovers, one and all. Many blase blokes will see that someone might bilk someone else, in that process, as fraudulent schemes can stem from both the sides, potentially. In the end, one may likely face ''bubkes'', but the muslims all over the world seem, quite predictably, quite bushwhacked and betrayed.
If one were to expect comity in all theses endeavors, one has another think coming. Is this a craven attempt by Trump just to placate the Israelis and the Palestinians together, rather than leave it at the status quo ante level? Hard to say, but he sure as heck has created a maelstrom ,to reckon with.
4
Your jarring use of unusual words-though admirable to read-seems to convey your sense of pride in your vocabulary, rather than any conviction in expressing a cogent and pithy opinion of worth.
1
Trump made a unilateral decision, irrespective of consequences, intended and otherwise, simply because he could. Also, he creates another massive distraction so that his immoral tax cuts for the wealthy and his packing of the federal courts with inexperienced white male idealogues can get less attention.
1
You can blame global warning for the fires around Los Angeles but you can't blame the president for the conflagration that is about to engulf the ME.
After all, he made that decision only because his base expected it and Sheldon Adelson insisted on it.
I mean, what else could he do?
There will be no gifts to the Palestinians. A ticket to Jordan, Syria, Gaza, Saudi Arabia or Iraq, maybe. The two-state solution died when Arafat rejected the Clinton Plan, which was admittedly flawed, but they would have had their state. Having that, they could then have bargained for more. They have rejected the two-state offer repeatedly, again and again, and now it is gone. Trump’s recognition is the coroner’s certificate.
But then, what else could the Palestinians have done? if someone moves into your house, claiming it’s really THEIR house, do you say, sure! Take most of it! We’ll all move into the basement?
The Israelis are doing what is done in history, when a more powerful people require land. They simply take it from the people living there. Trump has merely affirmed the way of the world, the way America itself was built, and it must be said that Israel has done better by the Palestinians than we did by the natives here. Ask the Navaho.
Trump’s recognition is like a mercy killing. It ends to torture. Now the two-state solution is finally dead, the Palestinians can grieve the loss, and get on with life- equal rights in a single state, (which will never happen- Israel is not South Africa, it MUST be Jewish) or the quest for admission to other countries. It is terrible. It is cruel. We in America and in the rest of the world must now do everything we can, to help them find their way.
2
“We want an agreement that is a great deal for the Israelis and a great deal for the Palestinians,” Mr. Trump said.
Trump is also advertising the tax bills moving through Congress as "a great deal" for the American middle class. The guy is nothing but a scam artist.
1
"Israel would be unlikely to accede to equal rights, because granting a vote to millions of Palestinians would eventually lead to the end of Israel as a Jewish state."
That's true - and it's not fake news.
Sometimes diversity can go too far.
The peace process has been quite unsuccessful and will probably never bring a solution. Most Middle Eastern Arabs and their governments hate Jews and their state, and that seems extremely unlikely to change.
4
I would like to believe that Trump made his announcement as part of a grand strategic plan that would bring both sides together to negotiate a peaceful solution to the decades-old Palestinian-Israeli stalemate. Anyone reading that last sentence would believe I was delusional if I really believed what I wrote. Most believe the only reason Trump declared the U.S. intention to move the embassy building and stir up a hornets' nest was to appease his political base of hypocritical Evangelical Christians and Fundamentalist reactionary Jews with Eastern European ghetto mentalities, If Trump made his declaration simply for political purposes he should then be declared guilty of TREASON and immediately brought before the House on charges of attempting to destroy the reputation of the country around the world for self-serving political purposes. At the very least, the 25th Amendment should be enacted in view of his incompetence due to mental deficiency and delusional thinking. It is has been said that he made his pronouncement at the urging of V.P. Pence. If that is so, they should both be impeached and Speaker Ryan should immediately be installed in the Oval Office until a new POTUS can be elected in 2018. The longer Trump remains in office the more destruction he will accomplish.
Even if Trump means serious about brokering an "ultimate" deal between Israelis and Palestinians and purposely "avoided taking a position on the eventual borders or sovereignty of Jerusalem. And he called for status quo in the administration of the Jewish and Muslim holy sites in the Old City of Jerusalem," Palestinians and people across the world view his recognition of Jerusalem as the capital of Israel as treacherous, a betrayal of the Palestinians.
Under given circumstances, the Palestinians can't trust him anymore. They should carry on fighting for having East Jerusalem as the capital of their future state. But Trump could still backtrack on what he has said, as he has been doing all the time, saying he meant West Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
9
No...Not only has Trump downgraded the USA on the world scene....but by nullify all previous commitments and treaties...Trump is isolating the USA and turning the ROW and allies into enemies....The US has lost its reliability internationally
4
Palestinians killed off the two-state solution when Arafat walked away from the deal in 96'. If the Palestinians want a state of their own then Jerusalem will be a shared capital, period. Otherwise, just look forward to more Israeli settlements.
3
Nothing that has happened since 1948 has yet convinced the Palestinians to accept Israel as their permanent neighbor.
If and when they do move to make a final settlement with Israel, they will get their state, along with some form of a capital in Jerusalem.
The ball is in their court.
18
In the 1930's Jerusalem was 70% Arab, and the rest a mix of Jews and Christians. No one living outside the U.S. thinks the Palestinians were ever offered a fair deal in any negotiation. They were offered whatever Israel was willing to give, as though Israel had authority over Palestine, the land from which Israel was carved. At the creation of Israel, the American overseer Ralph Bunche said that he could not offer the Palestinians justice, but could offer them peace. The Palestinians should go for the one state solution, as the Israelis would be compelled to eventually offer them equality. It would probably take 3 generations. By then the region will have become even drier and people will emigrate. How much more salt can you throw back into the Mediterranean through desalinization.
29
In fact, the fight for territory is largely over water - you are right - and Israel will never give back the land it has taken by war.
Since I only recognize organized religion of any kind as the exercise of power of the rich over the poor, I would suggest that this is a cynical decision based on the need by the Trump administration for a terrorist attack here (they are intentionally provoking an attack) in the US so that the Trump administration can institute martial law, begin to jail its political enemies and stop the Mueller investigation. Also stop any future elections over public safety concerns and finally cement the fascist plutocratic vision they've had all along. Get ready, here it comes.
4
Mark my words people: This is Trump & Israel's 1st chess move. People often ask what did he get from Israel in exchange for his declaration? Nothing. But he got Saudi's approval in exchange to bomb Iran - by Israel. This is Israel's ultimate goal, distract its neighbors leading them self destruct, as Ben-Gurion often said. No Syria, No Iraq, No Egypt and next is No Iran. Pakistan is next. Israel wants survival, survival means no threat. No threat means no viable army should exist. This is most clever plan ever: war with Iran, pitting the Arabs vs Persians. Muslim vs Muslim. Bravo! Just sit and watch people!
1
This doesn't make any sense.
2
I don't understand why this is still a thing. Religion is made up and anachronistic; people are in conflict and killing each other over which imaginary friend they were raised to believe in.
6
DJT just killed any chance of a two-state solution, but the good news is that he had a stroke while doing it, hopefully things will be getting better shortly.
2
As much as hate Trump, I thinks it's okay to declare Jerusalem the official capital. Not doing so, is in essence allowing antisemitism to thrive internationally and with the the UN. Remember the eastern part of the city was captured 50 years ago during the 7 day war in 1967. So, 50 years of denying the reality that Jerusalem is not a sovereign city of Israel, is wishful thinking that peace will reign if Tel Aviv remains the capital . The Arabs states and the UN need to finally face reality, and I doubt Arabs will ever embrace Jews. Yes, there will be some temporary tension, however I don't think this decision is going to trigger WWIII.
5
Israel is so small, the size of New Jersey. Why can’t they buy the remaining land from the Palestinians for a reasonable price? At some point this is between Israel and its neighbors......
1
And what would you say if someone suggested as resolve that the Palestinians buy all Israel's land instead. Double standards.
1
The fact that He Who Shall Not Be Named refers to this as “the ultimate deal” demonstrates clearly the man’s profound lack of humanity. It’s not a real estate development project, it’s a humanitarian crisis that has plagued that part of the world and brought untold suffering and misery to millions of people for decades. What a black hole of leadership this man is.
1
Two state solution? In what world? There is no "real" peace process, so what Trump did simply moves forward a campaign promise as well as a decision by Congress and then Pres. Bill Clinton in 1995 to recognize Jerusalem as the capital. Amazing how the press (you NY Times) fails to mention that little tidbit and accentuates the negative.
4
The US has killed off every peace initiative since 1948, backing an expansionist Israel, arming her to the teeth, blocking UN action, covertly supporting Israeli development of nuclear weapons, attacking directly or through proxies Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, and Iran, undermining independent forces in Egypt, building settlements in illegally occupied lands using US cash, and aligning Saudi and Israeli interests with American ones. Like so much that Trump does, this recent act is little more than tearing off the fig leaf.
3
You answered the question in the title. You can't broker a deal between two parties if you are one of the parties. America is Israel now. Indistinguishable to Palestinians, Arabs, Humans with conscience, and yes, terrorists both home-grown and foreign.
Thanks for protecting America mr potus.
4
Whether some like it or not, no other entity in the world but the US has the clout with both sides, the power and the resources to bring about a deal. It won't be the EU, the UN or anyone else.
1
The word Israel appears in the bible 2431 times. It appears in the Koran 44 times, mostly in reference to the Jewish people, who are referred to in the Koran as the Children of Israel. The word Jerusalem appears in the Bible 801 times. In the Koran the word Jerusalem appears zero times.
Thus both the Bible and Koran spoke of Israel. The Bible speaks of Jerusalem but the Koran doesnt even mention Jerusalem. The Koran talks about Mecca and Medina but doesnt talk about Jerusalem. Jerusalem didnt matter to Islam. How can a mosque in Jerusalem be truly important to Islam if it was never mentioned in the Koran?
Neither the Bible or the Koran mention Palestine or Palestinians at all. But both the Koran and the Bible refer to Jews as the Children of Israel. The Koran acknowledges the Jews as the rightful inhabitants of Israel. It doesn’t mention a Palestinian people.
Palestine is a recent invention, and not a historical fact. Israel is a historical fact.
5
" Israel would be unlikely to accede to equal rights, because granting a vote to millions of Palestinians would eventually lead to the end of Israel as a Jewish state."
Why must the US prop up a secular government and help create this atrocious apartheid situation, smacking of the Jewish ghettos in Europe? Only a one state solution with equal rights for all will have any semblance of true justice. Time for the Israelis to share the land they stole with those they stole it from. The world is becoming a more diverse international community. Tribalism may be very out of fashion after Trump and Israel will not get the support it needs to sustain apartheid system.
2
The two-state solution was impossible. Israel has grabbed up so much of the land that two state is impossible.
A new map need to be drawn, and Israel must be forced by arms if necessary to stick to it. We have never made Israel obey any of the agreements. Somehow we felt that we must atone for the Holocaust by leting Israel do what it wants in the Middle East.
Israel only really understand force, and the West was afraid to use force to compel obedience. New boundaries must be drawn and Israel forded to stick to them even it if means tearing down some Jewish settlements, no matter how large.
24
Actually, Israel has "obeyed." Had the Arabs "obeyed" the original mandates and not rejected Israel's right to exist by attacking Israel perhaps this situation would be very different. You seem to conveniently forget actual history and facts.
1
"Somehow we felt that we must atone for the Holocaust by leting Israel do what it wants in the Middle East."
Good to know you are only anti-Israel, not anti-Semitic.
1
@judyweller
you seem to not be aware of history.
At the 1947 UN Partition vote, it was the Arabs who rejected the boundaries.
Jordan occupied the West Bank and Jerusalem.
In 1967, it was Egypt who closed the Straights of Tiran, an act of war, that led to the Six day War.
In 1973, it was Egypt and Syria who attacked Israel.
Israel grabbed land as the result of a defensive wars.
They did in fact give back land to Egypt and to Jordan, with their respective peace treaties.
As soon as the Palestinians can come to terms with the idea that the Israelis are not going away, perhaps the Palestinians will get their state too.
5
Yassir Arafat killed the two-state solution in 2000.
6
Don't forget that the right wing settlers put another nail in the coffin when they murdered Prime Minister Rabin. The two state solution is dead. Many Palestinians don't want it and most of the settlers don't want it. Also, it is important to always remember that half of the jews in Israel are from Arab countries
1
I'm not surprised to see the unquestioning pro-Israel comments here, myopic and full of blind, non-critical thinking propaganda as they are. I am, however, disheartened to see the continued hatred toward Palestinian people. Many of the commenters are one step above calling them ("them"...nice try, as they are us, friends, and we are them) savages or some such thing. That colonial mindset is strong. If you are unable to see a group of people as real, nuanced, or honest—human—it means you are part of the problem. There is one state now, folks, and it has a separate and unequal apartheid like situation. How can anyone defend a country and solution where only members of one religion enjoy full rights (and, frankly, the whiter ones of said religion at that). Kudos to the American and Israeli Jews who recognize the humanity of Palestinians, and the terrors of Zionism. It's all Palestine, people.
3
As much as I dislike Mr Trump, his actions were merely pouring more oil on a corpse. The fantasy of the Two State Solution was killed off by Yasir Arafat in 2000 and the Palestinians who have been doing nothing but following the tactic of demographic genocide ever since.
2
It looks like Bibi and Donnie are going for the apartheid model. One state. Permanently subjugated class of indigenous people. For a while it should work just fine.
It’s sad to see the United States of America falling to this level. Still, by tomorrow we’ll be on to something worse and it won’t feel so bad.
1
Nice job trump!!! Distraction that now kill people.
Mueller is still coming for you...
1
Trump isn't the enemy here, as Theresa May found out this week with the terrorist plot to stab her in her home, after deriding Trump for his anti-terror tweets last week. The enemy here is the rock throwers. The rock throwers send their children to school to teach them what? How to throw rocks...that's a fact. They're so filled with vitriol and hate the Jews so much that they will never agree to a peaceful solution. It doesn't matter what Trump or any other president does. Just a good excuse for a "day of rage".
Help yourself liberals, join them, because your hate for Trump is just as bad.
6
Yep, those dastardly rock throwing children. They ones who are met with automatic rifles and tanks...
2
Whatever opinion one writes, many of the contents can be construed as a set of a priori conclusions, since, as everyone knows, there ain't no right or wrong answers, in geo-politics and military matters. Laws will be enacted, and yet, there will be an argosy of views, expressed by the opinion, column and book writers, no matter how au courant the authors are. Trump may claim he is simply advancing an avant-garde solution to an inveterate problem, but no one is prepared to be the aw-shucks consumer of that particular piece of news.
Political pundits seem to be inclined towards analyzing this tedious path, laid by the powerful, of striking a balance between the Israelis and the Palestinians, which, in all likelihood, can beset some of the peace lovers. Many blase blokes will see that someone might bilk someone else, in that peace bargaining process, as fraudulent schemes can stem from both the sides, potentially. In the end, one may likely face ''bubkes'', but the muslims all over the world seem, quite predictably, bushwhacked, blindsided, and betrayed. Arab world and Pakistan are particularly exasperated.
If one were to expect comity in all theses endeavors, one has another think coming. Is this a craven attempt by Trump just to placate the Israelis and the Palestinians together, rather than leave it at the status quo ante level? Hard to say, but he sure as heck has created a maelstrom, to reckon with.
If you want to deal successfully with a difficult party, try to think like they do. Get inside their minds and try to figure out how to get them to do as you want. Trump is making a bold move which is calculated to impress the Palestinians by being so surprising and seemingly decisive in its nature without at the same time being a real action with irreversible consequences. It is in fact a gesture of respect for them because it gives them some space to move around in without feeling bulldozed. The same goes for the Israelis. He is showing that for the first time the US is determined to fulfill its role as oeacemaker. As limited and symbolic as it is, his action nonetheless gets the difficult peace process going again. He is at least showing that it can be done if all parties are willing to get off dead center.
2
Just to be clear, the Consulate General in Jerusalem is not a subsidiary post of the Embassy in Tel Aviv. The Embassy conducts relations with the Government of Israel; the Consulate deals with the Palestinian Authority (and provides consular services to residents of Jerusalem, the West Bank and Gaza). So it's not a simple question of changing the sign outside the Consulate's buildings. If that were done, where would the US locate its offices for contacts with the Palestinians? The implications would be significant. One Embassy for one state? A separate Consulate in East Jerusalem, implying that part of the city is in fact Palestinian? A Consulate in Ramallah, in effect denying Palestinians any possibility of a deal providing them a capital in East Jerusalem, something the Administration carefully avoided in its statement this week. As with everything in Jerusalem, there are no simple answers, only tough questions.
3
You have no idea what you are talking about. The Consulate serves all of Israel for certain applications, not just the West Bank that was occupied by Jordan for so long.
1
When Ariel Sharon was top dog, every US President started his tour of Israel with a helicopter ride over West Bank settlements, just so he could see how big the "facts on the ground" were. I doubt Sharon was the first to do this.
I and many others faulted Sharon for this, and faulted US Presidents for being swayed by the display. But let's face it: Those settlements ARE "facts on the ground," and they ARE big. Might makes right, and the Israelis have long had that might. All Trump has done is to acknowledge reality: There never will be a "Palestinian state."
Non-Palestinians (and Palestinians themselves) who support the Palestinian cause aren't going away. Their support for a never-to-be Palestinian state can be transformed into support for equal Palestinian rights within a single state. Indeed, Western guilt over abandoning the "two-state solution" can be exploited to create even greater support for equal rights within a single state.
Israelis would say, of course, that Palestinians ALREADY have equal rights in Israel, and they do have some. The discrimination is more subtle -- for example, blatant preferences in hiring for former members of the Israeli military (i.e. Jews). There's only so much a minority can do, but Palestinians are far behind minorities in this country, partly because their focus has been on something else for decades: getting their own state. If they abandon that futile objective and focus on greater rights within Israel, they'll succeed.
1
As with everything Trump, there is no underlying thought process. He knew only that the move would be provocative, so he did it. And now he will point to the protests of the Palestinians as proof that they are a hostile people.
1
My read on Mr. Trump's recognition of Jerusalem as the capital of Israel is different from some. If he can provoke Islamic militants into launching a second 9/11, he will be able to fire Mr. Mueller in the chaos that follows without any Congressional response. He may even, if necessary, be able to declare martial law -- which would then allow him to "drain the swamp" without any further procedural niceties. He wants to provoke the Muslim world. This is not an act of ignorance.
Without a state of their own the Palestinians are relegated to being an occupied people forever. And I can think of nobody less qualified to be making such an important decision on this than Donald Trump.
I'm surprised Erekat openly embraces a "one state solution," but he's merely acknowledging reality. The Palestinians were never going to get their own state, and a "one-state solution" beats what's there now: a "no-state solution."
1
Where are all the objections and protests (and violence) as UNESCO pushes to erase millennia of Jewish history in Jerusalem (and elsewhere)? Ah yes, then the sponsors are busy celebrating their victory.
7
Two state, schmu state. This land belonged to the Jews long before the Palestinians arrived there. Just because the Roman Empire flung the Jews to the four winds, and others took the opportunity to settle in Israel - the evicted Jews homeland, does not mean Israeli Jews must accept their claims to the land God gave them. Does anyone here read, and believe the bible? There is no valid argument on this subject. If the Palestinians have a legitimate claim to a piece of Israel, than they and all Muslims also have a claim on parts of Spain and most of southern Europe as well. Why don't Muslims go to these nations and protest for their portions of them? Maybe we are currently witnessing them preparing to do this very thing.
If simply dwelling in a region for a few hundred years affords squatters rights, then the Palestinians claims would be no less valid, and the Europeans better start planning to allot parts of their nations for displaced Muslims to call their own states. Oh, and quite seriously, all Native Americans should also begin to lay out their claims for most of the real estate in the continental United States, which was undeniably robbed from them as well. Happy Thanksgiving!
1
Totally irrelevant move, and futile.
The Palestinians know that the future is written - "hadha maktoub". The Israelis have the watch, but the Palestinians have the time.
Over 50% of Jewish Israelis already have a second, foreign passport. They know it too.
Hitler had a grand plan, too.
NOW is the time to stop The Con Don, Steve Bannon, Netanyahu, Erdogan, Putin, Duerte and their International Mafia Top 1% Global Financial Elite Robber Baron/ Radical religion Good Old Boys' Cabal, and their operatives, BEFORE they can start WW3.
OUR United States Military - paid for with OUR hard-earned taxpayer money - must refuse to fight in these International Mafia power wars. Nobody wins in war. Nobody.
3
Europeans have long history of grabbing the lands of other people. Israel is no exception and is the latest example. Same mentality as Spanish, English and French at the discovery of Americas and same mentality of Imperial Germany of 19th century. As Palestinians getting more and more educated it will be difficult to treat them as second hand citizens and ignore their rights, while the world is getting smaller and smaller.
20
Don't we all have a history of grabbing land? Americans, Europeans, Chinese, Osmans, Persians...The Palestinians are never going to give up the idea of their own state. And that is understandable. Unfotunately their wish is also being manipulated by some of the neighbours (Iran, Saudi Arabia) for their own geopolitics. Trumps action is meant to hurt Iran, and is silently accepted by Saudi Arabia. The situation will not be solved because nobody really wants it to be solved. That is was Trump still needs to find out....
Not just Europeans, and not just the Europeans you mention--your comment is not constructive. Personally, I believe a two-state solution within a single commonwealth could be a viable option. You divide the territory, but allow free movement and commerce across borders, promote cooperation building and maintaining infrastructure, and let Jerusalem be the capital of both, Israel and Palestine. Let's think of solutions rather than find blame.
Trump sent Jared Kushner over to Israel to offer Jerusalem to make a political statement. There is no reason for Israel to cooperate and no leverage to use, besides violence.
Trump is the most hated President in history. He won because the democrat and the republican votes were split. That has become obvious.
1
yeah well, the palestinian arabs really might not be interested in a two state solution, they might really want the israelis driven into the sea. so...maybe trump can do something maybe not. it's a mess. too bad they are so busy rioting they can't take care of their own problems. why don't these guys go to college, become researchers, turn their attention to something other than their victimization? and let's not forget that in most of the muslim world other faiths are marginally accepted if that...
3
Clearly you're not informed about what Israel has done. It's this kind of ignorance that put Trump in the White House.
1
Trump's move has simply exposed the charade of a peace process for what it was. There is no peace process and there hasn't been one for almost 20 years. And there are no prospects for a Palestinian state.
There is an occupation that is ironclad and an Israeli policy of gradual ethnic cleansing. This is official policy and frequently discussed in great detail in the Knesset and the Israeli press. It's only the American media that pretend that there was a peace process.
Netanyahu knows that a wholesale expulsion of Palestinians like the Turks did to the Armenian's would generate worldwide condemnation that not even US cover could contain. But gradual expulsion is working just fine.
No media cover a single bulldozed home or the denial of well drilling permits. But under IDF rules settlers can drill a well of any depth. Palestinians can only drill to six feet. You get the true picture from these details.
It is with considerable irony that one has to look back to German and American racial exclusion laws to see the depth and degree of subordination and control of Palestinians in what is now "Greater Israel".
The other example is more recent, it's South African apartheid. Israel is now in deed if not in name an official apartheid state.
6
Roger Cohen, in his opinion piece today, points out the truth: the "peace process is dead. But in reality there never was a peace process; it was always simply cover for the colonization project. The reporter on this article is wrong; there will now be a sea change.
The Palestinian cause will now shift to a civil rights struggle for political equality in the land. There is already very strong support for this option among Palestinians which is being held in check by the PA. The Quisling Abbas and his retinue can longer keep their status and perks by maintaining the fiction of a "two state solution." That myth is now a practical impossibility.
Israel will be able to maintain the apartheid system for quite a while, as South Africa did, but the younger generation, particularly in the US, now see through the charade and when the craven US politicians are finally forced to stop kowtowing to the Israel Lobby and the US removes its financial, military and diplomatic from the current regime in Israel, it will be game over. Just as in South Africa, cultural, diplomatic and most importantly, economic world pressure will ultimately force Israel to end the apartheid and grant full citizenship and political rights to all the people in the land. Netanyahu will succeed in killing the dream of a Jewish state.
3
What two-state solution?
Smart move by the Palestinians.
My suggestion is that they stick with it, and achieve equality in all things, similar to what occurs when any immigrant legally immigrates to any nation having reasonable policies governing such.
A lot to give up, but achieving legal residency far outweighs the naming value of a piece of real estate; after all Jerusalems' history is indelible in the memory of mankind, so great, let it be the Israeli capital.
Imagine removing the main reason for this decades long conflict; would throw one heck of a giant wrench in the American military industrial war machine of perpetual war in the middle-east.
Dearie, Dearie me, all that war profiteering, already banked by the warmongers, gone by the board.
Lovely !!!
1
Israel's illegal colonization of the occupied territories, including the illegally annexed West Jerusalem, has foreclosed on a viable two state solution. The only just and fair alternative now is a one state solution. The discriminatory idea that Israel is and must remain a "Jewish state", a state with a Jewish majority in power, will have to be discarded so that the disenfranchised non-Jewish Palestinians can have their rights restored as citizens of the combined state.
32
They almost had a one-state solution with Jordan, but then they went to war.
The Palestinians don't want a two-state solution and the Israelies don't want a single-state solution because in a single state with equal rights, the Palestinians would eventually vote the "Jewishness" out of the state, and it would become just another Arabic country with a lot of Jewish residents. If I had to guess, I'd say that those Palestinians who are willing to settle for a two-state solution will say that they reject it in order to get a better bargaining position.
1
The one-state solution may be a blessing in disguise: Jews and Arabs able to live wherever they choose; attend the same schools; work in the same offices and factories. To make the one-state choice work a little good-will is needed throughout the country and at the moment there is very little of that.
Jerusalem is a heritage site similar to Rome. Three major religions all treasure this city. Why not set it aside as a heritage site belonging to the world allowing a panel of equal representation under leadership of all three religions to ensure that the things that make it so holy are protected in perpuity.
As for the two state solution that's never going to happen if Israel refuses to vacate the settlements. Palestinians would always see themselves as being occupied.
Why not have a one state solution where everyone has equal rights. Israel has never been a Jewish state. This area has always been a melting pot. Zionist Jews are trying to force something that isn't natural and it's failed miserably.
How would we feel here if one religious group ruled over the rest of us and anyone who didn't belong to that religion was a second class citizen with no rights. We would hate it, we would fight back, and there would be no peace for anyone.
There may never be peace in Israel but we should try all options. A one state solution may very well be the best choice for everyone. Apartheid was immoral in South Africa and should be immoral in the holy land as well.
4
"Why not have a one state solution where everyone has equal rights."
Translation: Why not replace Israel with a single Palestinian state?
2
It’s time to face reality, that you can’t have a Jewish State & Democracy at the same time.The one state solution or federation of two States is the only solution.
Israel will a;ways be the home land of Jews throughout the world,and Israel’s constitution would confirm this fact, however,the Palestinians must be given equal rights such as Israeli Muslims, & Christians have now & absorbed into Israel.. It just makes good sense, geographically, & morally.
18
As ever, Trump is too ignorant to comprehend the gravity of his ill-considered actions.
Where were his babysitters on this one?
4
Plenty of Palestinians and Jews living together here in Los Angeles. I've never seen any rockets or riots. If they can do it here.. why can't they do it over there?
2
Why? Because the Jews in LA do not steal Palestinian Land and render the people there stateless, without basic political rights.
1
The Palestinians are not living behind a wall in an open air prison here and American Jews, particularly those of the younger generation, are not Zionists. They are against the occupation.
1
"particularly those of the younger generation, are not Zionist"
Well you can exclude Jared Kushner from that demographic model! Call him a statistical outlier I suppose...
Hamas, not Trump, killed off a two-state solution.
12
Both sides have there extremist views, but Israel is far beyond hamas in terms of reasonable, modern thought and practices. I'm picking sides. Why can't trump? This standoff needs a clear winner and be done with it.
1
Israel does not want two states, never has.
6
Some future deal can always carve off East Jerusalem for the Palestinians. In the mean time, Israel has gone about the business of providing security, food, education, healthcare, developing its economy and building free and open society. Israel has done all these things with remarkable success. The Palestinians? Nothing. Slaves and pawns to the elusive multi-generational, Nobel Prize generating "peace process". Enough, move on.
7
Why and how are they to build communities when Israelis control the wealth and resources and destroy Palestinian communities for their illegal settlements?
Trump continues to pander to his wealthy, Zionist, political contributors and his evangelical base that is waiting for the second coming in Jerusalem. The uber-rich and the uber-Christian will be rewarded by the self-perceived ubermensch that is occupying the oval office.
5
I thought he was a Nazi? It would seem the rhetoric contradicts itself.
2
This is all so predictable and so tiresome. Somehow decades upon decades of refusals to even talk with Israel, to continue to call for its destruction and eradication, support of terrorism, "outrage" at every imagined slight and failing - of everyone else, mind you, is today all the fault of Donald Trump for following a law passed and reaffirmed by the Congress in recognition of a simple reality.
Oh, but the "peace process", we're told. What peace process? The one that has produced nothing for years? The one that Abbas won't even attempt? The one the useless UN wastes resolution upon resolution upon, usually blaming Israel for everything, no matter what? Yes, but diplomacy!! What has that diplomacy wrought or achieved except cushy jobs for a small cadre of "experts" who can jet about the world in luxury from New York to Paris to Geneva, meeting over champagne and discussing "what to do next" (hint: nothing).
Some how Israel is the problem, no? Yet the Arab world can't even stand itself - look at Syria, Yemen, chaos in Egypt, civil wars in Lebanon, the mad mullahs in Iran trying to dominate and terrorize the region, soon perhaps with nuclear weapons. Muslims kill each other more than Israel ever has, generally based on nothing more that which sect they adhere to. Yet, Trump and Israel are to blame for it all so we need yet another "day of rage".
Spare us all!
13
It is exactly this kind of ignorance of the history of peace negotiations that have brought us to this moment. Perhaps getting educated about the level of detailed negotiations that have been happening, at the same time settlements have expanded, would help. The Palestine Papers (http://www.aljazeera.com/palestinepapers/) are thousands of leaked confidential documents that document the details of Israel-PA negotiations, including the PA's willingness to cede parts of East Jerusalem to get to peace. The American public's willful ignornace on this topic is how we got to this place and perhaps the Third Intifada.
1
Maybe I'm ignorant, maybe I'm not. But I am aware enough (and old enough) to know with absolute certainty that this has been going on and on and on - one failed negotiation, talk, strategy, initiative, whatever you choose to call it, after another. The proof, whatever the underlying cause (and, to be sure, there is more than one with more than enough blame and failure to go around) is that the situation has not changed with actual peace. Period.
And please, do not insult my intelligence by ignoring the other truth, that of the disarray that the Middle East is in, which is their own fault, with little to no recognition of human rights even for their own people, sectarianism, tribalism, warfare, territorial aims, etc. all separate and apart from the seemingly eternal quagmire of Israel.
Even if the Palestinian dream came true and Israel magically vanished from the face of the earth tomorrow, there still would not be peace in the region, for which they have no one else to blame but themselves. pretending otherwise is, as you write, "willful ignorance".
4
Trump has no love for the Jews. But he hates Arabs and Muslims more than anything else in the world, so, in a one-on-one between Jews and Muslims, Jews win. Trump is as shallow as they come. Forget nuance. It doesn't exist in Trump-world.
4
I suspect Netanyahu used Trump's inflated ego, contrarian attitude and shallow perspective on international events to persuade him to make the decision. The Jerusalem announcement, following Trump's "win" in the Supreme Court ruling letting his Muslim travel ban go forward, were both big middle fingers to Muslims. Way to go, so-called president. MAGAHHHHHH!
4
… Even the Russian Press reported back in April of this year that Putin/Russia recognized W Jerusalem as Cap of Israel. No “Intifada” or “Days of Rage” over that announcement (or reporting of it in any mainstream US/European press then or now).
www.rt.com/news/383777-israel-russia-capital-jerusalem
3
Who cares what Russia thinks they are not internationally respected and have a smaller economy than CA.
One state. And like communities all over the world I see communities of Palestinians all over the new and improved and expanded holy land of Israel. Look. The Palestinians lived under the brutal rule of the Ottomans for centuries. This is the best hope for Palestinians and their children and grandchildren. Give it 30 years, the life of a typical mortgage, and you’ll have them intermarrying.
1
Really? Have you visited behind the wall erected by Israel separating Israelis from Gazas open air prison? Maybe your perspective is why the wall is there in the first place??!
What Israeli politicians have to realize is that Trump is the last gasp of right-wing evangelical, Neo-Nazi, Neo-Confederate, Neo-Putin, KKK Christian Supremacists. Besides the fact that they are only using Israel as a pawn in their prophesies about Armageddon and the Rapture, their days are numbered as a political force.
The same forces that have made gay marriage legal, drive the black lives matter campaign and the metoo movement are going to make the Israeli treatment of Palestinians as second class others impossible.
There is a movement of movements (generally ignored by corporate media) sweeping the world. Young people are not going to let the old injustices stand.
If you don't want to lose control of what happens in Israel, my suggestion is to move toward a JUST settlement soon, before one is imposed on you by world public opinion.
Israel's reliance on Christian Supremacists is not going to work.
5
The Holocaust of the Palestinians will continue because just like European Jews in the 1930s, no one in the US (including Jews) nor in Christian Europe cares about the Palestinians who the British condemned to non-existence when they created Israel for the Jews. Today's East Jerusalem is yesterday's Warsaw Ghetto.
4
Trump is not in charge of any peace process between Israelis and Palestinians.
But Netanyahu is.
Trump announcement on Jerusalem has been dictated by Netanyahu.
The international community have no respect for Trump and he has the lowest approval rate in the US.
Nevertheless, recognition of Jerusalem as Israel's capital is a success for him, He will have the support of jews in the US, and this has been his only objective.
Schumer would never compromise Israel's wishes to serve the US interests. Trump has a clear understanding of that.
1
Did Netanyahu also tell the US Congress to pass the law requiring this back in 1995 and 2016? Or does that just get in the way of "Trump is always wrong"?
3
First - I don't think this is a new approach by Trump that some people suggest. The US foreign policy in the Middle East is basically in the hands of Israel lobby. Trump continues the same policy, he is just more aggressive to please AIPAC and the rest of Israel lobby.
Second - The unjustified US support for Israel's actions, led to US losing influence in the middle east and it has benefitted US adversaries in the region.
Third - Peace between Israelis and Palestinians is in the interest of the US. However, it would mean that Israel to end the occupation of the Palestinian lands. This is unacceptable for Israel.
Fourth - if you don't kneel to Israel, you would have no chance to become, or to remain US president. For Trump, it has never been about the peace, or US interests. He just wants to remain in power, and I believe he did a very smart move to achieve his goal.
Many people with Jewish identities have a real block about the implications of a one state solution: they tend to feel very strongly that Israel can't be democratic and Jewish if all the people within the internationally recognized boundaries of Israel, the West Bank and Gaza are reformed into one country.
Many such fears arise from too much familiarity with the American political system's version of democracy, and too little about how things can and are organized elsewhere. For example, a reformulated democratic Israel could be bi-national, giving differing sub-state rights to different populations, or even, to different parts of the country.
Think a little outside the box, already!
2
Great point. It worked for apartheid South Africa.
1
Some years ago, I made the same transition from my support for the two-state solution as Mr. Erekat gave voice to yesterday. My change of views occurred after a relative returned from about a year's time living in Ramallah and working in coordination with Save the Children. His views had also made that shift and influenced me.
Instead of a Palestinian state created from a fragment of Palestine, one continually shrunk by increasing Israeli encroachments into its territory, he had come to favor a single combined state: Jews and Palestinians living within a common border, and all citizens represented proportionally in single common parliament. At this time, I believe that such a nation is the most viable in the long run, even though the transition may be difficult.
Such a solution would indeed put an end to Israels' identity as the Jewish homeland. But it would not negate Israel's important and honorable history as a state created in the aftermath of the Holocaust as a refuge for a people who survived and outlasted a different kind of "solution".
2
If not really killed off the two-state solution his Jerusalem Trump card has certainly made it more complex and remote by unleashing the forces that would never allow peace another chance to strike roots in the region, nor any semblance of normalcy across the Israel-Palestine borders that are likely to witness new waves of violence now. Already in turmoil the Middle East has further been pushed to the embrace of Islamist terror and other destabilising forces by one stupid decision of Trump.
3
I love the fact with every Conservative comment bashing the Palestinians, they seem to have absolutely no knowledge that the Palestinians are the Christians. Thanks for being completely numb to facts folks.
3
Trump, a Nazi apologist and Muslim hater, has a lot of nerve meddling in this very sensitive area. Seriously deluded that he and Jared can "Make a Deal" and bring peace to the middle east. Nor does he care that his flippant pronunciations will create unrest and bloodshed, which he sits comfortably thousands of miles away surrounded by sycophants. Probably being egged on by his evangelical Christian base, who believe in a second coming of the messiah. But for him it is just another way to get attention and a distraction from the Russia investigation.
9
Of course the fact that a bi-partisan law enacted by Congress in 1995 and affirmed again last year 90-0 (note, that means Democrats and Republicans voted together FOR it) calling for just this precise action means nothing at all - nope it's all the fault of Trump! Had Obama not refused to do it (as had some of his predecessors) and made the same declaration no doubt you would have praised him for a "bold and brilliant move"!
8
I suggest that Robert Mueller III is not so easily distracted.
And Trump knows it. Hence his worrying demeanor and performance yesterday.
I lived in Kuwait some years ago when it was still a "free" country with free press etc.
A Kuwaiti owned a newspaper called "Arab Times." He was powerful enough that he could say many things and get away with it.
He published a famous editorial with several maps of shrinking size of Palestenian territory over the years - after many years of wars of liberation etc.
His point was that the PLO making all noise, fighting wars, waging terrorism etc. was always at the losing end - ever getting more marginalized.
The Palestenians have a habit of turning their friends into enemies.
Kuwaitis so hospitable to the Palestinians allowed them to become bosses, managers etc. What do the Palestenians do after Saddam invaded?
They sided with Saddam. Soon after we ejected him, the first thing liberated Kuwaitis did is deport Palestenians en masse. They are still forbidden.
Ditto in Jordan, Lebanon, Tunisia, even Iraq and the latest Egypt with Morsi.
So, Jerusalem loss if that's what it is - has been coming for a long time.
I applaud POTUS for implementing will of the Congress after so many years.
Finally, this Mr. Erakat being quoted here as a leader.
He has been getting hospital treatment in DC - no doubt at our expense. All of his children live in California.
None of these leaders are really interested in welfare of Palestinians except feathering their nests.
Its not for nothing that the Palestinians again end up losers.
Not that I am shedding tears.
19
Neil M,
Your comment reminds me of the Kurds. They appear to be strongly disliked by every country in which they live -- Turkey, Syria, Iraq, Iran. Some of those countries oppose a Kurdish state. Others could live with one -- as long as it's carved out of some other country's territory.
I'll confess that I sometimes wonder whether there's some good reason the Kurds are so strongly disliked in all countries where they live. They're the darlings of the Western elite, of course, and routinely described as fierce fighters who've earned the right to their own state, etc., etc., etc. But one does wonder why people who actually live in the same areas as the Kurds dislike them so much.
Trump has brilliantly changed the facts on the ground without at this point even taking so much as a shovel to it but only announcing his intentions to do so. If nothing else, he has lit a fire under the Palestinians because they must now realize that, if they don't come up with something themselves, the situation will change anyway but without their participation. In effect, the PLO will be rendering itself obsolete. The fact that the single state solution is now suddenly even being suggested shows that Trump's move is already having an effect. At the very least it is a constructive attempt on the part of the Palestinians to articulate their grievances and at last to begin looking for solutions to what has previously been irresolvable. Of course, at home Trump receives no support at all from his captious critics who will do anything to undermine him and would even gloat if he failed. They are his domestic "PLO" and even more obstructive.
4
There has never been a real peace process, only an endless game that has allowed Israel to continue to build settlements using US money. Even under Obama billions continued to flow. The fact that the article admits that Israel would never allow Palestinians equal civil rights is a testament to the true anti-democratic character of the state.
9
A single state is in no one's interest. It will just be years of endless conflict and civil war after civil war. The two state solution is the only path forward. Now let's have Trump recognize East Jerusalem as the capital of a future Palestinian state and his ill-conceived declaration may pay a dividend.
6
I doubt Trump knows much about the history of the peace process, or cares much, for that matter. He probably has no idea who is PLO, what is Hamas, or what the problem is with the Palestinians. Stanley Adelson and his wife wanted the embassy moved, they paid $83 million to get it moved, and it was moved. End of story. That's really all there is to it. If there are demonstrations and denunciations of the move, Trump is unconcerned. Stanley is happy.
11
Saeb Erekat, 26 years in the same job as a peacemaker and nothing to show for it.
Time to find a different line of work.
14
The same could be said of the US as peace-brokers. Nothing to show for it. Time to bow out.
2
I'm not one to usually defend Trump , but his troll-Tweet from last night actually makes a good point--Clinton, Bush, Obama have all made promises to move the US embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem. So really the only difference with Trump is that he actually went through with his promise. So what's worse? Politicians lying while campaigning, simply to indulge AIPAC, or a President who decides to carry out his ill-advised promise?
2
Actually carrying out the idiotic plan for crass political purposes, with no knowledge or concern about the consequences, and endangering thousands, if not millions of lives, including US citizens, is far worse.
Well, the so-called president offered a new "just say no" campaign as his solution for the opioid epidemic, so I'm sure he's reached his intellectual limit by suggesting both sides just "give peace a chance."
5
The hardliners on both sides are looking for a one-state solution.
1
I am a little confused didn't the Senate JUST approve this by a 90-0 vote? So why is doing what the Senate said he should do wrong?
A President that keeps his word, wow that's a shocker. Democrats would be able to have their cake and eat it too any more.
I feel the sad for them.
4
They re-affirmed it after passing the original law mandating this back in 1995 (which called for a move of the embassy no later than 1999).
4
"Peace for us means the destruction of Israel. We are preparing for an all-out war, a war which will last for generations." Yasser Arafat (1929 - 2004)
Insanity is doing the same thing ad nauseam and expecting a different outcome. 70 years of the same failed diplomacy demands a serious shift in paradigm.
13
Trump’s decision to recognize Jerusalem as Israel’s capital wasn’t unilateral. He acted with the advice and consent of Congress. Congress passed the Recognition of Jerusalem as the Capital of the State of Israel Act in 1999. The bill provided that the United States should recognize the sovereign status of an undivided Jerusalem as Israel's capital and transfer the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem from Tel Aviv by January 1, 2019. President Obama allowed the bill to pass into law without his signature.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/257
6
As long as the Israeli leadership defines Israel as a State of the Jewish people, a one-state approach will not be a viable or sustainable solution to the problem. In any event, the answer to the question in your headline is "No" regardless of the Palestinian response, largely because it isn't either the business or within the ability of the USA to "kill off" any solution one way or another. The solution will be what the Palestinian and the Israeli leaderships one of these days wake up to understand that which it needs to be; then they'll do it and the US can take it or leave it. The only thing Trump is killing is US influence in the region, making fruitless and counter-productive US policy concessions for nothing in return from either side. So much for the great "deal-maker". This is not about foreign policy; it's about shoring-up domestic support from the far right at a time when his administration is drowning in the new swamp.
12
The 2 states has long been dead, since 2000 to be precise. The periodic attempts to start negotiations ever since have just been a farce. The future is 1 country shared by 2 people. Trump's decision has just clarified this a little more.
16
Well, as for being determined by fact on the ground and in the view of most sophisticated Israeli commentators it might be more like 2008. But your further point about the vacuousness of 'negotiations' since 2000 is valid.
There has been no meaningful 'peace process' for well over a decade and folk should just stop using the phase. At best the 'peace process' has been an ideological cover for ongoing Israeli consolidation of Palestinian land.
4
You should have asked Netanyahu or the Haredim before writing this comment. Although the One State solution would be a democratic move, it will never happen.
The absurd idea of "this land is given to us by God" makes every practical solution obsolete. And this happens in the 1st century. Great.
1
Any clarification on equal rights or votes for everyone in your plan for "1 country shared by 2 people"? There are more Palestinians than Israeli Jews so at some point it is likely there will no longer be majority Jewish representation, it will be a Jewish State in name alone. Any thoughts on that one?
So now Erekat proposes a single state encompassing the former British Mandate. However, the original Mandate included land east of the Jordan River in what is now Jordan. Britain lopped off the eastern territory encompassing 80% of the Mandate and created "Transjordan" for their allies the Hashemites after the House of Saud defeated them in the battle for Arabia. If Erekat now wants a single state, he can look east.
4
Maybe it's time for the people who live in this region to have a long overdue conversation about living together as equals. Equal vote, equal civil rights, legal protections for personal civil rights, and equal obligations to serve their common society. The question of "who" gets to "have" Jerusalem for capital city is completely moot if the "who" is everyone. A single state solution will obviously require some significant societal changes and compromise but my guess is that the vast majority of Israeli and Palestinian people (i.e., people) are incredibly weary of this eternal state of conflict and pandering to extremist elements (on both sides) who use the conflict to fuel their relevancy.
8
A good idea, but since most of the Arab countries in the region do not even treat each other or their own peoples as equals, depending on sex, sect, origin or whatever, that idea seems doomed from the get go.
10
Well, now wouldn't that be a thing? An Israel that treats its Palestinian Arab citizens better than "Arab" countries. I'm no fan of this President for a lot of reasons but the people who live in Israel need to start thinking about things in a new way.
1
Israeli already treats its Palestinian Arab citizens better than "Arab" countries. They have done so for decades. The issue at hand regards how Israel treats non-citizens in the West Bank and Gaza, who are widely violent and hostile, and who have refused three recent peace offers that would have given them their own state. The idea that Israelis should / would want for some reason to incorporate this population into their own is so bizarre as to seem clearly disingenuous.
3
Putting personal politics aside, we all know it's become quite popular to decry President Trump as the crazy one. But as between the status of quo of refusing to recognize the capital city of a sovereign country for fear of offending others and the alternative of simply recognizing it as a matter of fact, who is being crazy. This may be the most sane and fact based declaration he has made as President. The sky is blue; one doesn't ignore that out of fear of offending red. Kudos to the President.
10
People have missed that trump didn't use the word "Eternal and undivided" while recognizing Jerusalem as Israeli capital and announcing the future embassy move. He also says that he prefers a solution that pleases both sides. A few other nations including, yes, Russia, have recognized West Jerusalem as Israeli capital. That puts a clear limit on any Israeli ambitions to monopolize claim over the Holy Land. If Trump, Israelis and Palestinians are serious, they could agree to have another US embassy in East Jerusalem as part of the Palestinian controlled/Governed territories, even with a de facto Israeli control over the entire city. And that can be a bargaining chip to start negotiations.
1
A two-state solution may have had a chance years ago. Successive Israeli governments’ actions as the continued expansion of settlements and security measures has made such a reality mute. What Palestinians require, self-determination, and what Israel is willing to accept, some local control, cannot be reconciled.
The problem now lies with what to do with millions of Palestinians living in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. The options are dismal. Israel will not grant citizenship to the Palestinians, that would threaten the very nature of the country (a Jewish State). Expelling them would also be problematic. From worldwide opprobrium to the very logistics of evicting a large number of Palestinians, there is the danger of where they would be placed. Egypt and Jordan would not take them in. Lebanon has a history of what negative effects Palestinian refugees entail. Syria is shattered and remains a battleground between pro- and anti-Iranian factions. The Gulf kingdoms would not open their doors either.
This leaves the Palestinians in the situation that they exist now—limbo.
The pretense of Jerusalem is gone. The two-state outcome may be next.
The predicament that remains impacts not just the Israelis and Palestinians, but holds repercussions for the entire Middle East. This conundrum is what will consume future governments, Near Eastern, European and American, for decades to come. Perhaps with no possible resolution.
3
The Palestinians have spent decades complaining that there are all these reasons why they can't make peace. End of the day, the problem is that there is no peace which leaves an Israeli state, whatever its borders, which the Palestinians have decided they can accept; there is no peace process which just doesn't lead to the next state of grievance. Until the Palestinians can end worrying about a greater Palestine that never existed and never will, all there is is a process where outsiders attempt to pressure Israel to make concessions which lead to nowhere--because all they demonstrate is that others will negotiate for the Palestinians; which has the benefit that no one ever needs to make any concessions to reality.
3
All the people in US including the government have a practice to live in democracy, rule of law for a long time, on the other hand many people living on middle east and in North Korea considers US as its main enemy and they are still at the hangover of war and aggressively thinking of counterattack and opportunity. So two state solution was something that was supposed to be untouched now.
But the US policy seems hostile on both of these front now. Which countries it is believing and depending to deal with North Korea( Nuclear armed country with mini hydrogen bomb) China and Russia! is not it surprising?
When were China and Russia close friends and ally of US?
What about Russian sanction, trade deficit with China, South China issue? Will they forget all these issues for the time being and run for the help because Trump appealed them to do so?
Another important point, If there is no dependable machinery to check and balance North Korean sanction what is guarantee that the country which is dying for US dollar ( as a consequence of strong sanction) will not sell these deadly weapon and technology in billions of dollar to the people who are ready to blow themselves?
Nothing has worked, despite the useless counsel of Europeans that today criticize Trump so assiduously; and MANY efforts by the U.S., to create a two-state solution. The closest they came was under Yasser Arafat, who may have been assassinated for his troubles by Hamas. The Palestinians are four states even among themselves -- the PLO, Hamas, the Israeli Palestinians and the hordes still living in resettlement camps outside of Palestine. No aligned interests among any of them. About as tribal as you get.
Trump, recognizing this, has tossed a wrench into the machinery of ineffectiveness and internecine faction. Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. But at least he's taking a shot.
27
Trump's at least taking a shot, you say, Richard? Yeah, and a monkey at a typewriter eventually spells a word. I guess this was a tactic that fit's the word limit on Twitter, so it was within Trump's mental capabilities. I'd just as soon go with the counsel of actual experts, who have engaged all the parties on the ground there and can cogitate more than 140 characters a day. Throwing wrenches into machinery rarely fixes the machine, and defeats the purpose and design of wrenches. Send in a true mechanic to wrench on the machinery properly, please ... not a petulant vandal.
They don't want peace so they blame anything and everything. Nothing that the president did prevents them from getting a portion of the city for their capital and following the proper idea if they ever become a peaceful country our embassy would be in their portion of the city. Make a deal now, it will only get worse for them as they continue to wait.
18
I do not agree. The US President cannot solve the issue, as is shown by the last 3 decades, but Trump just made a tense stalemate worst. Therefore, it is illogical to then blame them as being simply disagreeable people. And then to THREATEN them to make deal now or else.
@vulcanalex
Some should refrain from posting opinions of things they know little about, sir.
Had you any understanding of the history or politics in the region, or any basic knowledge of what *exactly* was "offered" to the Palestinians, your post would be quite different.
While I vehemently disagree with the tactics used by Hamas and the PLO, to offer them a non-contiguous state in exchange for 'peace' is a joke, and had you more understanding of the "offer" you'd likely agree.
1
Vulcanex, Im guessing youve never been there, and know no one from there, so you can insult them. Typical American armchair opinionating.
Having lived and loved there, I can assure you "they", those real humans that you cant identify, Palestinians, do want peace, but they want it with civil and human rights. Which Israel wants to deny them.
It would do Americans well to stop swallowing the hype from the pro-Israeli US press, the Israeli govt, as well as the Palestinian leadership, Hamas, etc - and listen to the people themselves.
1
The Problem was never the Capitol-CITY of Israel ... this is fact for thousends of years. The Problems are in the heads of those, who denie this as the centre of jewish culture and the place for the Bet haMikdasch (Temple). The reasons for this was a discussion over two thousend years ... know there is no reason for reasons anymore, because the whole world can see and is informed about: Who brings violence and disorder into Israel and who not. Those who are peaceful - also without being to be a Jew - will stay. The others will be brought OUT or have to die! WAIT how long the hate-parade can continue.
To the Problems of "Some Christians", I only can say: Stay Close to the City, the people and don´t believe in every lie, they are telling you. Shalom.
2
The "two-state solution" is a bad joke.
Israel won her independence in 1948. Many of her Arabs had fled. They got nothing for themselves and their descendants but an endless resentment based on the fairy tale that Palestine, where they had been for barely half a century, had been theirs forever and that the Jews, who began arriving 50 years earlier than them, had stolen it.
The 1978 Camp David meeting led to Israel returning the Sinai to Egypt in 1979 to bring peace. It brought no peace. The 1st Intifada, suicide bombers blowing up Israeli pizza parlors, began in 1987. The 1993 Oslo Accords led to Israel returning control of Gaza and the West Bank to the Palestinians in return for peace. Peace did not follow. The 2000 Camp David Summit saw Yasser Arafat agree to peaceful solution, then do nothing. The 2nd Intifada followed. US Secretary of State John Kerry’s 2013 peace talks failed.
A Washington Institute for Near East Policy survey in 2014 found over 60% of Palestinians say their goal is eliminating all the Israelis and talking all of Palestine. On their maps, Palestine is everything from the Jordan River to the sea, including the entire state of Israel.
How does President Trump’s recognition of what everyone has known since 1948, Jerusalem is the capital of Israel, make things any worse?
48
Put the country you are a citizen of, first.
Why didnt the original "founders" of Israel in the 40's, care about Jerusalem as the capital, but choose Tel Aviv instead? Why did they see the old city as backwards and a drag on their desires for a modern nation?
The lust for Jerusalem is only a few decades old.
@Diogenes
Israel didn't "win" Independence in 1948.
Territory was HANDED to them.
"For the first time in his 26 years as a peacemaker, the chief negotiator for the Palestinians did not agree."
What peace, exactly, has he been making for the past 26 years? Is that the peace fueled by racist propaganda in elementary schoolbooks? Is it the peace that leaves in its wake orphans when parents are murdered in the front seat of their car driving back from visiting family?
Perhaps someday we will see an ombudsman's article, "For the first time in 26 years, the New York Times publishes an article that fairly depicts both sides of any politically nuanced topic."
55
Just tell one side of the story. How many Palestinians children have been killed or jailed during that time? How many Palestinian children were made homeless so Jewish children could have a home?
27
For every Israeli killed, far more than 100 Palestinians are killed, according to the Israeli government.
You can make all the excuses you want, but Israel practices collective punishment, regularly killing many innocent people.
Israel has all of the power in this situation. It is time to wield that power responsibly, and stop terrorizing the Palestinian people.
You cannot have a Jewish state, democracy, and a permanent underclass without rights living without rights.
Israel must decide.
If you want a Jewish state and Democracy, then you must take some small chances with your security, and since your military is stronger than the Arab states, and you have the US in your side, it's a very small risk. You will have to give the Oregonians a real contiguous state, with control of its borders and water and him toss and highways.
If you want a Jewish State, with apartheid occupied territories under your thumb, you are not a democracy. Democracy means everyone has an equal say. Occupied territories and democracy are incompatible.
If you want democracy without giving up the occupied territories, you will have to annex those territories and make Palestinians full citizens. You will have to share your state with other religions, really other branches of the same religion.
I prefer the last solution. That is the way to peace, making Jerusalem not a generator of hate and violence around the world, but the center of love and leave and understanding.
7
How many Jewish children have died at the hands of so-called Palestinians during the same period of time? I don't hear of Jews running through the streets stabbing random Arabs, but the reverse has happened.
Regardless, the issue is how to solve the situation so everyone gets something they can live with. Pointing fingers does nothing.
2
There is no need to go back to biblical times to resolve land claims.
If the Arabs liked Jerusalem under international control, they should not have started the 1948 war, and the subsequent wars.
If the losers of wars they start are entitled to get back the land they lose, then the Christians should demand the return of Asia Minor and the Levant from their Moslem invaders.
Lastly, the Palestinians' belief that they can advocate as a core objective the extermination of Israel makes any consideration of their demands a nonstarter.
40
The christians? Thy didnt hold the Levant. And those that had some power there, aint your type of christian.
The reality is its Christians who made such a mess of the area over time. Outside invading Christians from the Med and Europe.
Its Muslim, not Moslem...showing your disdain for a broader perspective,
Pointless action on the part of a pointless president.
24
Trump is a political arsonist. He loves the excitement that he can unleash with a few words. And the flames…ohhh, yes….the flames.
34
Israel has been aggressively (and illegally) expanding their territory for some time now, simultaneously establishing apartheid measures that effectively killed a two-state solution. The land and towns are strategically partitioned to diminish Palestinian collaboration, resources and economic autonomy. Israel emerged as a nation-state because of Western intervention, the territorial lines were initially drawn by Western expansionists, and Israel's regional military dominance was generated by US support. It should come as no shock to anyone that the politically-supported solution to Jewish/Western expansion is apartheid: Think "Indian reservations", red-lining and Jim Crow, and voting right restrictions. Western states always seem to find a racial/ethnic method for controlling an indigenous population that falls outside their desired expression of dominance. It should also come as no surprise that the Trump administration would advance steps toward such purposes. Let it be a one-state solution, now that the Israelis have effectively stolen most that is of value: People of conscience should be focused on the radical apartheid practices of the Israeli government.
74
@jsvw14
Your comments are garden-variety left wing rhetoric (you didn't use the word "oppressed", but you hit "apartheid", "people of conscience", and "Jim Crow") but you offer no facts to back up your off-base opinions.
The Arab population of the Palestine Mandate, like the Jews, were given a state in the 1947 UN vote for partition.
The Jews took theirs and over 70 years, built up a high-tech paradise, with beautiful cities, good schools, with vast inventions and patents generated every year.
The Arabs took theirs, and tried to murder the Jews.
Then Jordan took over the West Bank and Jerusalem, did not allow Jews in at all, made a garbage dump out of the Jews' holiest site, then lost it all in 1967's war that the Arabs started.Jordan also forcibly divorced the Palestinians, because no king of Jordan wanted a group of such troublemakers; they were a threat to the kingdom.
So you demand justice for people who start wars, lose them, and then cry victimhood.
No serious student of history can buy into your viewpoint.
People who don't know better but who like your flavor of politics can buy into your ideas, but then again they may also buy a bridge in Brooklyn.
8
@vulcaalex
"Only idiots continue to do the same thing thinking that the outcome will be different...."
Like a 32% base that supports a man who knows nothing about the world or his job?
1
False equivalency. The comparison between Israel and South Africa is fatally flawed. It is a superficial and trite view that collapses and buries the realities of the histories, motives and goals of the people involved. In South Africa, black Africans wanted to join, participate in, and integrate into society. In Israel, Palestinians want to destroy Israel and kill, oppress and send Jews back into exile. In South Africa, the state was who was racist. In Israel, it is the Palestinians who are the haters. People of conscience cannot support a movement, whether it be the underdog or official state policy, whose main motive is hate and whose ultimate goal is oppression at best and genocide at worst.
3
Fascinating. It is hard to parse what is going on from the US where everything is seen through the lens of our politics. Don't we now have a one state situation: Israel with Palestinian apartheid? Intolerable, wherever the blame lies. Excellent gambit on the P.L.O.'s part. I am sure a two state solution looks better to most Israelis than allowing Palestinians to vote in Israeli elections. I hope some equitable end to this is in sight. We should not fail to support the coming negotiations out of hatred for President Trump.
10
You want two states? I'd say there's at least three; Israel, Jordan and Gaza. As the territories of Judea and Samaria(aka West Bank) were held by Jordan and lost when they attacked Israel in 1967, that land is no longer part of Jordan (and in fact Jordan has given up all claims to it). There is zero reason to establish a Palestinian state there and add a fourth country to the mix. The so-called Palestinians were residents of Jordan for the most part and never had a country, flag or other national identity.
Given the disaster that Gaza has been, used as a launching pad for missiles into Israel proper and the building of terrorist tunnels into Israel, why on earth would Israel ever want to replicate this mistake? Makes little sense to me.
And obviously Israel plans on continuing to be a Jewish country, the only one in the world. There are at least 50 or so Muslim countries in the world. Seems to me as if the best solution will be to encourage the emigration of "Palestinians" to other countries willing to take them in. Perhaps all of those who spend so much time and energy bashing Israel and loving the Palestinians could cough up some bucks to facilitate transfers. Of course no one paid Israel to take in all of the hundreds of thousands of Jews kicked out of Arab countries(nor the holocaust survivors from Europe) but I'm sure there are many people out there willing and able to pay to resettle Palestinians where they will surely be happier than they are now.
16
'Seems to me as if the best solution will be to encourage the emigration of "Palestinians" to other countries willing to take them in.'
Yeah so kick out those who have lived there for centuries so you can build a one religious theocracy based on ethnic religious grounds. Ignore the international l was and the UN that made the state of Israel a legal matter in the first place.
There is a word for what you support and that word is 'ethnic cleansing'. In one way you like Trump are honest. No pretense of legality or human decency. In that I think Trump is less wrong than right, he has shown the 'emperor' of the 'peace process' has no clothes and has not for a while.
Your bigotry is naked to the eye now. your just another rabid bigoted nationalist. Even African Jews and others are not 'Jewish enough'. Too dark right?? And free speech??
Who needs it. The West just gave up on that (see attacks on wikileaks for 'weaponized' TRUTHS which are now deemed bad things vs our moral lies (yes Hillary really was the 'perfect candidate' and Russia is to blame for EVERYTHING and who needs evidence when making accusations right?
You say you want 'to resettle Palestinians where they will surely be happier than they are now'. Which ironically proves my point. You know there lives are made miserable because of the bigotry they face in their daily but just don't care.
You don't see human beings just enemies, Just as the Nazis and kkk do. Not impressed!
2
Maybe instead of giving billions in aid to Israel the US should pay the Palestinians those billions to move?
2
You might have a problem finding any country (Arab or not) who wants them. Jordan couldn't stand them and kicked them out.
3
The two state solution was dead long before this pronouncement.
The displaced Arabs, shunned by Jordan, and a nuisance to Israel should study the Navajo Reservation to glean insight to what lies ahead for them.
9
Jerusalem is the capital of Israel. Trump did not invent that . Tel Aviv is their New York....not their Washington DC Palestinians can either accept that reality or continue to live in the seventh century. Native Americans had to adjust to a changing world as well.
16
"Native Americans had to adjust to a changing world as well."
That's what you call it? "Adjust to a changing world?"
They were "adjusted" all right.
West Jerusalem.
A great analogy, if what you wanted to prove was that both the Native Americans and Palestinians were/are brutally oppressed.
Trump played straight into the hands of Netanyahu who already announced in London that there will be no Two State solution.
America betrayed the Palestinians and Israel got what it always wanted: a free hand at least in the West Bank.
For a European it left the sour taste of the famous question: are the United States in the grip of Jerusalem. For sure, AIPAC will triumph.
80
Of course not, but doing the same things and expecting a different result is not what this administration is about. Not here or in any area, and when this president promises something mostly he does it.
4
The undivided Jerusalem that Bibi has long proclaimed has arrived. Light up the walls and celebrate! Winner takes all. Brothers together at last. Goodbye fiction of separate but equal. The United States of Israel is born. One state, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.
Finally, a richly deserved miracle in the holy land.
3
It is a little hard to take anything the Palestinians say all that seriously.
They have never made a peace proposal of their own, and have never counter-offered to any of the proposals by Ehud Barak, Ehud Olmert or Yitzchak Rabin (other than, "lets kill all the Jews").
The Palestinians simply have nothing to offer other than "no".
So why should we be surprised at their most recent reaction ?
For his part, Mr. Trump is simply telling the Palestinians the truth:
The Israelis are not going anywhere.
The world has changed, and those changes do not favor the Palestinians.
Saudi Arabia and Egypt are more aligned with Israel than with them.
The West does not need Arab oil as much as it once did.
Contrary to the beliefs held by most Americans, most Israelis would happily move out of almost all of the West Bank and give some neighborhoods of Jerusalem to the Palestinians if there was a way to guarantee a real peace.
But the Palestinians have never given any evidence that they would support a real peace.
There have been too many murders of Israeli children to trust Palestinians.
In the last 70 years, the Israelis have built a high-tech wonder of a country.
The Palestinians have wallowed in victimhood.
Americans love rooting for the underdog, but not every underdog is in the right.
46
They offer violence even when they do say YES.
6
Both Jewish and Palestinian extremists have contributed to this nightmare. A Jewish right-wing extremist murdered Yitzchak Rabin because he, like many Jewish extremists opposed the signing of the Oslo Accords – and therein lies the problem, the extremists on both sides chart the path with violence. Extremist right-wing Jews invade Palestinian lands by force and violence to build settlements with the blessing of the Israeli Government & religious leaders and a blind eye from the US. They claim the "land of Israel" includes the West Bank, Gaza, areas in Jordan, Lebanon, Syria and even to the Euphrates.
"In the last 70 years, the Israelis have built a high-tech wonder of a country."
Yes they have but not difficult when the US subsidizes them to the tune of billions of dollars while the Palestinians get next to nothing and can't develop their society or any business because their airspace, sea-space, borders, much of their land is controlled by Israel.
There are two sides, always. Most Palestinians and Israelis want peace, but as in all wars the extremists on both sides, even though far less in number, dictate/control using fear and threats of punishment, while opportunistic Governments & power players use it as cover for personal gain and ulterior motives. Forcing people to take sides on pain of suffering or death, become inured to other's pain, ignore truth & believe propaganda is an age-old tactic used in every society to control & maintain a status quo that benefits few.
2
I'm sorry, what's the body count on Israelis vs Palestinians? Which people have spent three generations in refugee camps?
Unmentioned by the Times and the EU, as they flutter their hands in mock horror, is the complete disinterest of the PA/PLO in any negotiation. And really, it's not that hard to discover. I mean look at the PA/PLO maps of the area. Does Israel even exist on them? In their school books, Haifa is listed as a Palestinian city and of course Jerusalem is not divided at all. There's no Jewish presence to worry about, kind of like when Jordan controlled the eastern half and Jews were not allowed to be there at all. Not mentioned is are the times when the PA/PLO turned down offers, which, by the way, included moving their capital to eastern Jerusalem. And let's not forget that silly rhyme the PA supporters yell out, how "Palestine will be free, from the River to the Sea." Meaning of course Israel will cease to exist completely. And the Jews there? Oh, not to worry, they will be floating away, or something.
35
Israel's keep saying that the Palestinians don't exist, that the land was empty when they got there, and that only they have a right to a land they ran from two thousand years ago.
How is that any better than what the Palestinians say?
3
I think his point is worth mentioning: I am NOT a fan of Donald Trump, to say the least, and frankly I’ll admit this issue doesn’t really stir any feelings for me. But he is not to blame for the inevitable violence, no matter how stupid or inflammatory his decision. It’s time for people on both sides of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict to disagree peacefully.
7
Hmm, Israel is a Jewish state. And yet, millions of Arabs live under Jewish control (Civil Administration - of the IDF). Something doesn't add up.
5
Trump doesn’t even know what is the 2 state solution. He just knows Sheldon Adelson and Bibi Netanyahu oppose it.
17
I'm sure that you're so much smarter than he is anyway.
Yes he did kill off any chance for a two state solution, and guaranteed continuing violence for another generation or more. And Israel loves it. We should never forget that creating the state of Israel saved a proud people at the expense of a proud people.
11
We need a two-state solution for America.
14
The mid-east is not in enough political turmoil. Now we have the man-child stirring it up some more. What's with these Republican presidents and their wars? Bush Jr. stirred up the Middle East with his wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. And the Taliban is still strong in both Afghanistan and Pakistan. Bush's actions gave birth to Isis and new hot pockets of war there. Trump plays dangerous word games with the unbalanced dictator in N. Korea. How scary is that with both able to start nuclear wars? Trump thinks we should use our nuclear arsenal and said so during the campaign. Trump sends his duplicitous son-in-law to make peace in the Israeli/Palestinian continuing war which is ludicrous. Trump stifles the State Dept. set up to negotiate in these conflicts which is so far off base. The world gets messier and we can't even stay friends with England. Thank Mr. Trump for this latest rash move and unfortunately more to come.
11
It is not up to anyone else but Israel to decide where it's capital is. It is their land that they developed into a thriving diverse society open to all. The same cannot be said about Palestine, where openness and diversity doesn't exist.
24
If we have no say on what Israel does, can we stop sending them billions of dollars every year?
3
There is only one constant in this story: Trump is (fill in the blank), and no one should pay any attention to him.
6
The two-state solution became impossible when the Israeli government made a Right hand turn. With the rush of building settlements and the Palestinian resolve that all settlements must go the stalemate became permanent. Sad to say that the chance existed for many years. But the Arab countries refused to make peace with Israel. The Left-of-center governments were more than willing. One question has always vexed me. How come during all those years before the 6 Day War the Palestinians didn't say, "Why is Jordan running our affairs? According to the U.N. we should have our own country?" But nary a whimper, just Arafat organizing raids trying to get the Israelis to go to war, so that the Arab nations would retaliate and wipe Israel off the map. That didn't work out too well.
2
Past performance indicates the two-state option was never a viable solution for the Palestinians, nor was it ever even seriously considered. Time to move on. However distasteful as it sounds - score one for Trump.
12
As much as I detest Trump and his tyranny, this latest atrocious act of subservience to an elite power base will force dialogue in and around the Middle East as long as the urge to descend into the tragic expedience of war is avoided. The killing of thousands cannot be justified based on mainly religious claims to real estate, so negotiation should be the only humane recourse, not that humanity has ever obstructed conflict. Is this then a brilliant and daring diplomatic act from the reality TV president? Hardly. Moreover, it is a wanton and dangerous manoeuvre designed to pander to arch conservatism both inside and outside Israel. Trump's mantra is to overturn as much order as possible in support of his cronies before his administration collapses. He could have just as easily recognised Palestinian claims to Jerusalem's significance, but the racist ideologue within him
precludes that.
The residual problem is that Palestinians are the poor man's Arab. Every other Arab nation clamours for Palestinian justice against Israeli oppression, but do precious little to ease the plight. These nations would rather oppose Israel at all cost than actually promote any solution, two state or not. The hapless victims are the boys and girls of Palestine who will suffer interminably for the ruthless realpolitik that defines their precarious existence.
3
I don't know about the two state solution but it finally killed off the joke of America being an objective mediator.
13
A one-state solution would be best outcome anyway. Look at the partition of India and the endless misery that has caused. Since Israel wants the territory it has to also take the people. And the Palestinians can't ever return to pre-1948. Both parties need to slowly recognize reality and learn to live together.
14
According to my recollections, the continent of India was divided among various Princes and other rulers with at least three religion, Buddhist, Hindu and Muslims. The Mughal Emperers ruled from about 1526-1857. The East India Company had great influence until the India Muntiny after which the British Government took over and pursued the "divide and rule" policy. Appoint a Hindu prince to rule over a Muslim Province and vise-versa. Division in 1948 came because Dr. Jinnah demanded a separate country for the Muslim people, many of whom fought on the Allied side in WWll where as , Gandhi, a pacifist, told the Hindu people not to join the Army. The Reason the Japanese did not invade India was due to the fact that the British, US and Kenyan armies fought bravely in horrible battles in N. Burma under General "Vinegar Joe" Stillwell and prevented the Japanese Army entering India. The division of the continent into Indian and Pakistan seem the only viable solution at the time.
The Palestinians have wanted a single state all along; this is just a pretext. They have repeatedly turned down a two-state solution, as they did, famously, at Camp David. They know that in a few decades they will outnumber the Jews so they can afford to wait it out. And once they have a single state, their idea of "civil rights" will be very much like that in almost all Muslim-majority states, whether Saudi Arabia or Pakistan - rights for only those who follow a certain type of Islam, and next to no rights for all others, especially non-Muslims, women and gay people.
14
Mr. Erekat is mostly correct, the two state solution is dead. Trump is too shallow to understand that. Equal rights is the issue for the future. The Israeli right has been advocating annexation of the West Bank, and granting increased rights to Arabs. That is the future, in my opinion. It's all very complicated and will require soul searching within Israel to face the contradiction between being a Jewish state and a Democratic state. Also required is soul searching by Palestinians, as whether a perpetual state of war is preferred to living in a stable environment, controlled by Isreali's in the short term but eventually leading to increased civil rights .
Trump's move is a step in the right direction, even though the timing is suspect, and his foreign policy team is in disarray, not to mention his Presidency.
4
so many claim that the Palestinians have rejected offers of statehood. Well, let's look and be honest about this claim. The offers given to them had serious limits on sovereignty of an independent state. Israel would control their airspace, keep the high ground on the West Bank and have the right to close roads in the W.B. If you are offered that as a "state," would you accept that? By any definition, that is not an offer of a state, it's more like an offer of colonialism.
13
So what was there counter offer? Amazing how they never made any, and simply responded with more violence? Why do people like you excuse such horrid behavior?
3
Unfortunately for the Palestinians, the US has really never been their advocate and Israel has only paid lip service to the idea of a just solution to their Palestinian problem. The whole idea of a 'peace process' has become a joke. What I want to know is this - where are all the progressive, liberal Israelis? We don't see them protesting Trump's move, which is quite an amazing Hanukah gift to his most ardent supporters, both within and outside of his administration, and within Israel itself. Bibi is dancing, while Israeli jets are bombing Gaza. Sadly, peace is further away than ever, it appears.
8
A fair two-state solution was viable in 1948 with the end of the British Mandate. All the negotiations since then have been one-sided in favor of Israel.
59
So please tell us what the negotiations before 1948 looked like? Were Jewish people even allowed to the negotiation tables? What did they look like only 4 years earlier?
2
If, stressing IF, negotiations have. been "one sided in favor of Israel", perhaps it's because Israel's friendly neighbors keep waging and losing wars. Israel remains one of the few countries that have given land back to those who wish its absolute destruction and eradication Jews.
4
Britain received the Mandate for Palestine after WWI with the breakup of the Ottoman Empire. Before that, Jews (Zionists, more precisely) were buying up land from absentee Ottoman landlords and evicting the Arab tenants who had been working the land for generations. Britain tried to limit the number of Jewish/Zionist immigrants to avoid Arab/Jewish conflicts, but without much luck.
Zionists had been planning on returning to Palestine and establishing a Jewish "homeland" since at least the late 1800's, and they methodically went about doing just that. It is also a historical fact that during WWII, Zionists made a deal with Hitler that any Jews expelled from Germany were to be sent to Palestine. Just Palestine. That is the background behind everything we see today. In hindsight, maybe the Palestinians should have accepted the original two-state solution, but they didn't. Would you have, if someone wanted to evict you from your land and give it to someone else? Is it so hard to understand the Palestinian mindset, then or now? Is it ever right for one group to assert their rights at the expense of another?
I hope the Palestinians give up their dreams of living in a country named Palestine. It is more important to have freedom, security and a hope for a peaceful future that a one state solution will provide. Israel is a democracy- one person, one vote- regardless of your religion.
8
Except the Israelis don't want the Palestinians to be equal citizens, because they are afraid they will vote in Palestinian politicians, and Israel will no longer be a Jewish state.
Personally, I thing trying to make a Jewish state based in a region that is holy to three branches beaches of the Judeo-Christian-Islamic religion is arrogant and crazy..
Learn to share.
2
Let's be realistic. West Bank Palestinians are never going to get a country, nor should they. From a practical point of view, the region is not large enough to support two states for two Peoples. Maybe at one time but no more. That ship has sailed.
That this was ever conceived of in 1948 was not realistic. You cannot viably fit 8.5 million people of the nation of Jews within 1948 boundaries.
The best the West Bank Palestinians can hope for is some sort of autonomy within greater Israel that would would be akin to what exists in Canada in regard to Quebec.
That said, you cannot take peoples property for no money and not expect 69 years of war. Palestinians who lost land or property as a result of the creation of the State of Israel should receive Just Compensation as under the legal Doctrine of Eminent Domain. Take the money and buy your old place back, bank it, or do what you want with it. The compensation money should come from UN sources because the UN created this problem in the first place to make recompense to Jews for what the Germans did. If the Germans had not done what they did there would probably be no State of Israel today, though Jews would have continued to live in the region as they had for millennium.
Gaza can and should be a state of its own. Israel and Egypt, former occupiers of Gaza, have no claim on Gaza. There is no good reason why the UN should not declare and recognize Gaza as an independent state immediately.
Gaza. There's your Palestinian state.
6
Although the blundering incompetence of the Trump administration has not helped, the Israeli settlements killed any possibility of a two state solution years ago. The relentless tide of fundamentalist Jewish settlers onto the land that would, under any two state solution, be Palestine, had made a Palestinian state a political impossibility for Israel.
It is not politically possible for Israel to remove 1,000,000 settlers -- they are there to stay, with thousands more arriving monthly.
That was, it is clear, always the plan on the right-- Keep "negotiating" while gradually taking over the land.
20
Not sure I understand why a Palestinian state can't exist without a capital in East Jerusalem. They have major cities in the West Bank that would be much easier for them to use for a capital - Ramallah, Jericho, Hebron.. Besides, there already are two states - Gaza is de-facto a state.
7
Why? Because they want go break chops.
1
Trump didn't kill off anything. He fulfilled a promise and stated what in Israel is already clear. If the Palestinian's want a state instead of to destroy the Jewish State it's doable.Just as Arabs are permitted to live as citizens in Israel Jews should be allowed to remain in whatever borders will be Palestine. President Trump acted similarly to President Truman who went against the wishes of his State dept when he recognized the State of Israel. It is a gamble that may possibly revive a peace process that has not gone anywhere for years. On the ground nothing has changed.
10
The fiction of a two state solution has been around for too many decades. If the parties involved had wanted a two state solution they could easily have worked it out by now.
22
Erekat believes in a two-state solution? That's laughable. If he did, the Palestinians would have accepted one of the many deals they have been offered and they'd have their state.
46
As obnoxious as Trump is, his Jerusalem stand doesn't change a thing. Palestineans don't want a "two state solution." They want Israel gone. Their way or the highway kind of thing.
48
As someone with an Israeli background, I have to say that he didn’t kill it...since this thing has been dead a long time ago and both sides never see eye to eye. What he did was make a dumb declaration in a time of relative calm, and I emphasize the word relative. What good is it to come out with this declaration over Jerusalem? It seems like his motivation in life is to just agitate people. I hope the Palestinians realize that this man is just a troll and no one will be following Trump’s lead...we really don’t need a third intifada.
156
Trump is a bomb thrower who delights in Death and Destruction. In civilized countries such people are incarcerated away from everyone else where they can do no harm.
1
This strikes me as a situation in which two siblings, John and Jane, are quarreling over a toy. Mother steps in and says, "I've decided the toy belongs to John, but he should let Jane play with it." In such a situation, Jane would be understandably miffed. Mr. Makovsky advises the Palestinians to come back to the table to hear the new "plan." But kind of plan would that be? The spoils have been allocated. But he is correct about one thing; Trump could change his mind. But the damage has been done. The trust is lost. The U.S. has relinquished yet another leadership role under this stupid, stupid president.
88
And the 'leadership role' of our past presidents has gotten us where in this matter?
7
This is the editorial by a prominent German newspaper addressing Trump's Jerusalem "strategy":
"And Trump? He is very satisfied. He not only loves conflict, he craves it. He fears bringing people together and conciliatory actions the way Dracula fears garlic and the Cross. Resentment and rage create his biosphere. The wounded and dead of the Middle East – the ones that have already died and the ones that will now die - are Trump’s life elixir. Dracula and the President live off the blood of others.”
It is a very telling comment about how this president is viewed in the rest of the world.
231
Conducting our affairs with an eye toward how we are 'viewed' by the rest of the world is shallow and dangerous reasoning. Prominent German newspapers can be just as wrong as prominent American ones - thank God the newspapers aren't in charge.
13
It's one comment. I'm sure in Israel they have very different comments about the President.
1
And they are right. People will die and peace will cease because Trump, to satisfy a base who couldn't even find Israel on a map, and deep down, are anti-Semitic, think it's important. They have no clue. Their concern for Israel is based in scriptures and has nothing to do with the democracy, Jewish homeland, or even their hatred for Muslims.
Death and destruction so Trump can boast at his rallies to the hardcore supporters who are 30% of the electorate. Truly horrifying
2
Palestinians had their chance. Progress!
19
A single state means the war to gain a separate home changes to a war to end Israeli apartheid. To end apartheid the Palestinians have to both challenge the world's sense of decency, and also the Israeli vision of Zionism, a totally Jewish state.
South Africa locked its black citizens behind concrete walls and onto Bantustans, with the threat of immediate death to all who had the temerity to see themselves as equals. It took a worldwide boycott to help white South Africans adopt a single state and democracy, and the courage to get that done, courage shown by both sides, was inspiring.
I am sorry my country, led by our Orange Pharaoh and his terrible family, are devoted to Israeli apartheid. The world itself is stronger for the struggle of the Palestinian people, though it mourns the deaths of those locked behind Israeli concrete and American policy. It is the struggle of the poor and the powerless to have their voices heard, their needs met, and their call to be equals in power to be allowed at the ballot box, and it is a universal struggle. It just is, whether in Mississippi or in Gaza.
Hugh Massengill, Eugene Oregon
160
You have a problem with a Jewish state but not Moslem states of which there are over 50? How many Jews live in Gaza btw? Might want to watch just who you are accusing of apartheid here.
12
What nonsense. The South African government was officially racist. The Israeli govt. does not have any bigotry against Palestinieans, they only wish to live in peace, and unfortunately have a real immediate threat of violence and death over their head of every single day. Israeli's have every single right to persevere their lives.
3
South Africa had Nelson Mandela. Israel has Netanyahu and ????. No chance of a South African solution with current leadership in both camps.
Palestinian Arabs are the death-knell of a two-state solution: They want the state of Israel obliterated, and every last Jew and Arab living in Israel dead. After all, they elected Hamas to be their leaders in Gaza, and elected the PA and Abbas to be their leader in the West Bank. Both are anti-Israel, and both have supported attacks, kidnappings, bombings, and killings of Israelis. They teach their children about the glories of martyrdom and the Paradise that awaits them if they kill Jews by suicide bomb.
It is this death-worship, the cult of the 7th-century tribal witch doctor, that has to be shattered, before Arabs can live lives worth living.
The woman in the photo with her high-heeled shoes, the sneakers of the chanting children, the baseball caps and jackets and bluejeans and plastic water bottles - none of these are the products of a death-cult. They are the products of a devotion to living life as human beings. They are not the products of a devotion to living life as slaves in submission to an invisible, nonexistent God.
30
It seems to me funny to use adjectives that convey a lack of civility as a way to justify ethnic exclusion.
3
It is what he wanted. Lying about it is just his way of thinking he is better than anyone.
15
That Israelis will never give the Palestinians the vote is like saying that the white South Africans would never abandon apartheid. It took a long time but it happened. Many Israelis are very secular. It is the religious minority that creates this major stumbling block. Perhaps they have forgotten the biblical prohibition about creating obstacles for the blind.
95
Why do we or anyone else in this world care anymore? This has been going on far, far too long. Leave them to kill each other off, if that is what they want to do. We can all find much more productive and good things to do. And in the process, maybe Trump will be eliminated by accident!
1
Perhaps Jewish Israelis want to live? Allowing an Arab majority would be a death sentence for Israeli Jews. How many Jews live in Moslem countries? Could a Jew even survive setting foot in Gaza?
8
@Stephen Kurtz
Arabs who are citizens of Israel have the vote in Israel.
There are Arab members of parliament and an Arab supreme court justice.
Arab residents of the West Bank are not citizens of Israel.
At the time of the 1947 Partition Plan vote, they were expected to become citizens of an Arab state that would live side by side with Israel, but of course we all know the Arabs attacked Israel, and Jordan conquered the West Bank.
So why didn't Jordan confer citizenship on the Palestinians while they were in control from 1948-1967 ?
If you have a complaint about Palestinian citizenship, go to Amman and complain.
6