Rep. Frederica Wilson should not be facing personal attacks by the President and General Kelly. If the wife of the slain soldier felt hurt by what the
president said, then Trump and Kelly should appreciate knowing about it and take steps to say something more comforting in the future. I think Democrats in both the House and Senate should join in a statement of support for Rep. Wilson. How dare General Kelly say she’s from a long tradition of empty barrels making the most noise, and accuse her of doing something she didn’t do. This strong woman is a true leader who founded the 5000 Role Models of Excellence Project, which mentors African-American boys and young men. She personally knew Sgt. La David T. Johnson and obviously really cared about him and his family. Shame on this administration.
106
" At another, he described the United States as a place that regularly breaches the sacred trusts that had once underpinned a polite society."
Have you met your boss?
65
It would really be nice if Trump and his cabinet of dunces would stop criticizing Gold Star families who don't agree with them. It's shameful and disgusting. Yes General Kelly, we thought this part was sacred too. In fact, most of us thought the entire presidency was sacred. So much for yesteryear.
58
Know what else should be sacred, Gen. Kelly? Telling the truth. You lied about Rep. Wilson. Apologize.
87
After listening to the latest botched up flap about the FBI building in Florida, I must say, Gen. Kelly has become guilty by association with the world’s most famous crooke !
46
I and scores of friends do understand what it means to walk through Arlington seeking reassurance in a world gone mad. My parents rest there. Lately we ask ourselves how on earth our country should have been taken over so very thoroughly by people who defend a man who lies every single day, who brags about himself every day, who has spent a lifetime grabbing women’s private parts, behaving like a cad to every person who has the temerity not to worship him, ruining small businessmen, and shaming his country. Up until now, I did hope Kelly supported something other than this man. No one can walk among the stones of Arlington and believe those there died for a just country and still support a man who holds nothing sacred except for his own draft-dodging, women-debasing opportunistic self.
113
Imagine if President Obama had called John Kelly's wife and told her that her son "knew what he signed up for".
Once you do that, you can see how truly appalling John Kelly's attack on Myeshia Johnson and Congresswoman Wilson truly is.
54
I thought that Patton had it right. You don't want to die in the service of your country. You want the other guy to die for his.
Sorry, I don't buy the defense of Trump by Kelly. Look at all of Kelly's words. Some of them are aimed right at Trump's all too common disgusting childish statements. Kelly has warned Trump in his comments with out making a threat.
23
The opportunist politician started all of this. These people are so imbued with hate, it is disgusting and very annoying. Let's have more respect and that includes the president.
12
I am frightened at seeing one of the key people closest to Trump succumbing to his corrupt and immoral ways. I believe Kelly is over his head on the issue of respect denied to gold star families by President Trump. It is all very ironic. With Trump, absolutely no one and nothing of real importance matters.
We are at a precarious point in our Democracy's history.
50
People who orbit Trump are bound to lose self-respect and integrity. Did they know what they signed up for? We are in trouble when the nation has to rely upon three trusted generals to manage President and keep us safe. This is directly opposed to what our Founders envisioned, and it is dangerous.
40
Imagine if Trump just did what any normal person would do (1) not lie about past presidents' actions when asked about his and (2) say about the phone call something like: "I am so sorry if Mrs. Johnson felt my words were Inappropriate. It was certainly not my intention. I meant to show that her husband is a hero, and we are awed by his sacrifice. If I failed in communicating that message let me be clear today. La David Johnson will never be forgotten." A little humility and sincerity go a long way. There is not need for Gen. Kelly to debase himself defending a man like Trump while lamenting the loss of good old fashioned values that Trump has never demonstrated in his 71 years.
69
Who is Kelly to determine for someone else who is to be in or outside of someone's inner circle of sharing their grief? If only to cover up his buddy, the Trump, the president caught in a lie! If Kelly wants to pull his son death into the mix to cover up Trumps callousness shame on him!
39
I have nothing but respect for our military and the lives sacrificed to keep America and Americans free. The loss of a son is a profound grief that Major Kelly feels daily and I am sorry about that.
But, here are the facts Major Kelly. You are supporting a coward who dodged the draft 6 times during the Vietnam War because he could thanks to family money. You are standing up for a man who tweets nuclear threats from his private golf course to North Korea placing hundreds of millions of lives in danger just to stroke his own sagging aging ego. You are standing up for a man, a moral and physical coward no less, who made fun of and ridiculed Senator McCain, one of your own, who suffered as a prisoner of war. You are standing up for a man who has no empathy or feelings for others and cannot even fake them even though he is a pathological liar and actor upon the stage of Trump.
You think you are doing your duty by being a Trump babysitter, but you need to do your duty to the country you love so much and place it above military containment of the greatest danger America has faced to date, Trump.
67
Kelly is not a politician, for me he made a fool out of himself.
32
Seems clear to me that Kelly’s diatribe from yesterday has set off a FIRESTORM of huge proportions.
He may never live this down. Not sure he deserves to live this down.
38
Kelly's credibility is gone with the wind.
A video of Rep. Frederica Wilson’s (D-FL) speech at a 2015 FBI building dedication ceremony, taken by the Sun Sentinel newspaper and resurfaced on Friday, shows that the congresswoman did not brag about securing the funding for the building as White House Chief of Staff John Kelly claimed she had.
59
Gen. Kelly’s narration of the loss of his son in combat, in Afghanistan, is touching. But he besmirched the powerful message he was trying to convey by attacking the person but for whom the world wouldn't have heard this powerful message directly from him.
Gen. Kelly may please note that the person, Florida Congresswoman Frederica S. Wilson, did not “listen in” secretly on the conversation between President Trump and Myesha Johnson, the wife of the fallen soldier, Sgt. La David T. Johnson. She is a family friend of the Johnsons' and happened to be in a car with Ms. Johnson, when the president called her to convey his condolences on her husband’s death. Whose fault is it that the president mangled his message? He told Ms. Johnson that her husband “knew what he signed up for.” Ms. Johnson also told Ms. Wilson that the president “didn’t even know his [her husband’s] name. He kept calling him, ‘Your guy’“.
Mr. Trump got furious that the Congresswoman made the incident public. He said she “gave a total lie on [the] content” of his conversation with Ms. Johnson.
If that was the case, why did Gen. Kelly spend 18 minutes the next day, explaining in a belabored way what led to Mr. Trump’s saying what he said to the fallen soldier’s wife?
John F. Kelly has always conducted himself as an honorable Marine general. For once he stooped to the level of carrying water for his lying boss.
44
Having watched this press conference in its entirety, what the heck is Michael D. Shear writing about?
"In a public relations mission that was part emotional catharsis and part political attack..." Political attack? WH Chief of Staff Gen. Kelly didn't mention anyone by name - so no one was attacked.
Gen. Kelly was the only adult in the room - lecturing/advising the press about a very difficult responsibility, it's process and delivery. Gen. Kelly's address wasn't a PR move - in fact, America is lucky to have a man like Gen Kelly take the time to address this delicate situation.
Rep. Wilson was out of her lane, she has no idea how this delicate process is handled/delivered and should of simply kept her mouth shut. Rep Wilson is the fool in this tragedy.
Lastly, 2008 was not "one of the bloodiest years" in the Iraq War. In fact, by '08 the tide had turned and death tolls were at their lowest point in the war.
6
Kelly is a bald-faced political hack, just like his boss. He should be ashamed to drape himself in dead soldiers and military symbols when he attacks a Congresswoman for telling the truth. I'm tired of hearing how special Kelly is - he deserves no more respect and trust than his boss.
20
Women were "sacred"? And so was "life" and religion? The lady doth protest too much, methinks.
13
John Kelly, sadly, is defending and "explaining" a world class manipulator. John Kelly reminds me of the victims of Harvey Weinstein; John Kelly falls victim to the "con." He struggles to keep his composure, and seems more than a little coerced.
I pity John Kelly. he has suffered enough, and Comrade Trump forced him out on the global stage to paint a portrait of a leader who does not exist. My God, Comrade Trump has ZERO decency. He is using John Kelly for his own glorification.
It is very painful to witness, and hear such degradation of a man whose son sacrificed his life for freedom & truth. Neither of which is on Comrade trump's agenda. Trump is making a mockery of John Kelly.
My condolences to you, General John Kelly.
17
Trump is a fragmenter, a disintegrator.
There is no actual 'we' with Trump. If he's a 'we' thing, a community thing, a shared interest thing, a higher calling thing, he's working you.
When you call the family of a fallen soldier, you have to appeal to shared higher calling. You don't say to the parents, "Tough, you lost."
Kelly doesn't realize Trump is THAT self centered. He does not get the implication of Trump not having a board. Trump answers to no higher calling, no greater good.
6
General Kelly made this statement about what Congresswoman Wilson said at a 2015 dedication ceremony for a new FBI building:
“A congresswoman stood up, and in the long tradition of empty barrels making the most noise, stood up there and all of that and talked about how she was instrumental in getting the funding for that building, and how she took care of her constituents because she got the money. And she sat down, and we were stunned. Stunned that she had done it. Even for someone that is that empty a barrel, we were stunned."
Now that certainly sounds like the standard spiel from a groveling political hack. Party affiliation is not relevant for that characterization.
A Florida paper dug up the transcript and video of what she actually said:
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/fl-reg-wilson-kelly-tape-of-sp...
General Kelly made a gratuitously false attack dog accusation. Ms. Wilson did not take credit for the funding, which was done before she was even elected to Congress, but she mentioned that she along with other members of the Florida delegation were instrumental in having the building named for two slain FBI agents.
Notwithstanding the video evidence, the White House stands behind General Kelly's version including his reference to Ms. Wilson as an "empty barrel"
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/wilson-says-kelly-lied-us...
39
A note to all of you human beings out there. You should remind yourself that Donald Trump is also a human being. Who of us could do his job without jumping off a cliff? You call a widow to console her and instead of being consoled, she takes offense. When he is trying to do the right thing, he should get help and support, not an unending flow of abuse.
8
"EMPTY BARRELL"
Did Sarah H. Sanders just call Donald J. Trump an empty barrell?
Check this out: "Video of the speech obtained by South Florida's Sun-Sentinel shows Wilson never mentioned the building's funding but did recount her efforts to name the building after two special agents who had been killed.
Press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said: "If you're able to make a sacred act like honoring American heroes about yourself, you're an empty barrel."
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/white-house-defends-kellys-defen...
What is Donald J. Trump hiding? He still hasn't revealed to the American public his tax returns. Not even the 2016 tax returns have been made public and we, the American people, defenders of truth, justice, etc., are just accepting this unpatriotic behavior? I won't stand for this and would like to see D.J.T. on his knees for what he's done to the standing of the USA in the world and at home.
18
Jim Kelly just lost his credibility with me. Trump was wrong - The whole thing was a mess. I will side with a grieving widow and the Black lady every time
28
Really, General Kelly? You thought you could get away with misrepresenting what Congresswoman Wilson said at the opening of the FBI's South Florida office in the era of Google? In case you had forgotten, here it is.
Given America's current political climate, this is unlikely to change anything. I have one request, though. You may hate the congresswoman, but at least refer to her properly. She has a name and it is not "Empty Barrel."
27
So much for Kelly being one of three pillars standing between the United States and chaos. If he is still so upset that a politician was...political, he's in the wrong business. And maybe he'll understand someday why so many of us are offended that his boss, a serial liar and disrespecter of women is...lying and disrespecting women from the White House.
And as a woman who grew up during the 50s and 60s, I have to say that I never felt then that any man other than my father thought I was "sacred"--certainly not the members of the armed forces who assault and rape their own comrades in arms, only to have their superior officers cover it up or excuse it.
33
The congresswoman is a side show, a distraction. General Kelly, did you coach the President to not even bother to learn the name of the soldier who died? His wife's name? I find it hard to believe that you would council the President that when offering comfort to a widow, it is ok for him to not even be bothered to learn the names of the person's involved. I am offended sir that you are are taking a hit for a President who hasn't earned it, and doesn't deserve it.
19
Just read a transcript of the lively speech the Congresswomen gave that Kelly trashed. Not only did he lie about what she said ( she never said anything about getting money) but he neglected to mention that she talked only about how congress was able to act unusually quickly to honor the fallen agents because they had such high regard for the FBI. She talked not only about how she worked to have the building named after the agents but also Republicans John Boehner and Marco important role in getting this done. Most of her speech simply praised and eulogized the agents.
39
Well, that's the end of any respect for Mr. Kelly. So "traumatized" by this media event that he had to take a cemetery walk? If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you.
21
Folks on the left celebrate those who" speak truth to power". General Kelly did much more, speaking truth to contemporary leftist ideology.
2
For a really powerful response to Kelly's defense of Trump, read this article from Masha Gessen of the New Yorker: https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/john-kelly-and-the-language-of-...
7
Another highly publicized 'wedge issue du jour'.
Brought to you by Trump & Co.
Keep getting distracted everyone from the real, other, more important issues.
Like oh I don't let's just say for right now, health care!
6
Just viewed CNN video replay of Congresswoman describing her helping fast-track naming process for FBI building. No mention of securing funding which had been appropriated before she was even elected to Congress. Kelly lied. He's the only "empty barrel" here.
36
Soon we will know the real reason for this entire unfortunate tragic episode- it is a diversion designed to delay talk about why this attack happened in Niger. It all has to do with Chad being added to the list of countries on the new "travel ban" list- the Chadian army has been a valuable ally in anti ISIS efforts in Africa, & when Chad was added to the list, they withdrew their troops from Niger, resulting in an increase in the strength of ISIS militants there. The administration will cover this up for as long as possible- Benghazi, anyone?
21
If one wanted to see disrespect for military families and women in general, one needn't look far. It's right there affirmed in General Kelly's no doubt heart-felt warrior's credo:
"And when he died [...] he was surrounded by the best men on this Earth: his friends. [...] And he was where he wanted to be, exactly where he wanted to be, with exactly the people he wanted to be with when his life was taken."
In other words, not with his wife and children and family. Not with his community, not with his church. They are not the "best." They are not the chosen. They are not with whom, one surmises, a real man wants to be when he dies, under Kelly's still all-masculine military articles of faith.
And Kelly is shocked and outraged that civilian women - the pregnant wife, the aunt who raised this boy to be a man, and their friend, witness and elected Representative Congresswoman Wilson - might have some other perspective than the glorification of war as man's highest calling and the comradeship of arms as greater and more sacred than any other human bond.
We have civilian command of the military for a reason. Kelly's is a flagrant, inexcusable usurpation of the proper moral authority of our President Command-in-Chief, made possible because the position has been effectively vacated by Donald Trump.
33
I work in Rep. Wilson's district, and it doesn't surprise me that she was with Sgt Johnson's family at that time, since he had been in the 5000 Role Models of Excellence program. I have seen her many times at the county hospital, at local events to help people affected by hurricane Irma, and out and about in the community. She is a former school principal and very involved in the lives of her constituents, many of whom are low income and from historically disadvantaged communities.
My father's ashes are interred at Arlington, and I certainly appreciate Mr. Kelly's loss. I also appreciate that he is performing a public service by standing between our demented narcissist "president" and the nuclear codes. But his criticism of the congresswoman - and blatant lies about her - are abominable.
52
Don't people remember how Donald Trump treated the Khan family, the Gold Star Muslim family of a slain US soldier? He had no regrets about insulting them in public during the run up to the election. Trump has not changed one bit since then. He only continues to shock and horrify this country and the world with his total lack of empathy and unfitness for public office. This man is a psychopath, and this administration's complicity is shameful and unforgivable.
22
Gen. Kelly should stop being a shill for Trump. He demeans himself every time he does so.
Trump drags everybody around him to the gutter. Kelly is halfway there.
22
What a surprise. Kelly is a good soldier.
4
I believe the Congresswoman was also upset as during the call Trump mispronounced Niger
2
And now there is proof that MR. KELLY LIED.
The Sun Sentinel has the video of the entire 9 minute spoech.
Pathetic.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/fl-reg-wilson-kelly-tape-of-sp...
20
“I was not even in Congress in 2009 when the money for the building was secured.”
Attention! This just in:
Kelly has not only drunk Traitor Trump's Kool-Aid, he lies like him as well. So much for him being a "moderating influence." Go home, John.
25
Sad to see former general Kelly put forward such an obviously foolish argument in defence of President Trump's call to the widow of Sgt. Johnson. Kelly must surely know that what one serving officer says to another in private about battlefield deaths is altogether inappropriate in a conversation between a President and a grieving widow. I assume Kelly recognises that the country is better off if he stays in his position as chief of staff, even if the cost is a dent to his own reputation.
10
So much for Kelly being the adult in the room.
Congratulations for joining the circus, Mr. Kelly - your juggling abilities will be put to good use.
23
I thought Kelly was one of those military types standing between us and chaos (ie: Trump)??
That's not what I heard in his press conference the other day much less his comments about this. I'm personally disgusted.
Kelly's absurd social comments aside, his notions that only the military suffers losses requiring professional intervention is utter nonsense. I spent 6 months in residency training at St. Jude and would suggest if he thinks only the military suffers tragedy with professionals consoling families - he should get out more.
I was frankly disgusted. Chaos appears imminent.
37
Everyone in combat has the experience of a fellow soldier you’ve become very close to saying to you, “If I die, would you…?” You well might’ve asked the same of him. Maybe you never gave him a firm answer yes or no, because you thought there would be more time. But then one day, there wasn’t. His request now must be understood as a promise you must keep to him—even if it takes the rest of your life to fulfill it. These are bonds that don’t end with death, because they can’t be broken, even by death.
3
Mr. Kelly is burning his political capital. Unfortunate. Now we know why he was retired during the last Administration. You can’t have a General responsible for the lives of US soldiers who makes things up. Whether it is from grief or political calculation.
27
The worst thing about this sorry mess is that President Trump waited twelve days before acknowledging the deaths of these 4 green berets. Then, probably realizing that this had been a mistake, he plunged himself into a sinkhole by falsely accusing Barack Obama and George W. Bush and other presidents of not reaching out to the parents of the fallen. The next mistake was telling the young pregnant widow of Sgt. La David Terrence Johnson that "he knew what he had signed up for."
I respect Mr. Kelly, but I do not know how he fits into this imbroglio which was created by President Trump and why he feels compelled to defend him.
I don't see how lashing out at Congresswoman Wilson or Mrs. Johnson and her mother is any help in this matter especially since it happened due to the lack of empathy on the President's part.
23
I just viewed a video of Rep. Wilson's speech at the dedication of the FBI building in 2015. He recounted the Wilson's speech with absolute certainty. Kelly is a liar. She said her actions and the actions of both R's and D's cut through the red tape to get the naming of the building done. Kelly owes her an apology.
35
Kelly has now directly lied about what Congresswoman Wilson said at the dedication ceremony for a new building honoring FBI agents who died. He claimed that she "bragged" she got the funding for the building from Obama. A video of her speech has now surfaced and belies every single lie Kelly told about her.
So Kelly has joined the Big Lie Factory (aka The Oval Office) and hopes to dilute the seriousness of Trump's missteps by pretending those who tell the truth are 'the liars.' Shame on him--even though he's now "doubling down" on his big lies about Wilson.
27
What a way to draw a line in the sand General Kelly! Exactly what Trump was looking for in my opinion. Us or them. Military and administration or those bottom feeders. People who wouldn’t ever understand and those that completely do. Polarize, polarize, polarize.
It is my thought that maybe these military hero generals might want, for the sake of unity in this country, to find a better retirement plan than working in the CIVILIAN government positions in which they now preside. Because really, if we’ll never understand, why would you want to waste your retirement years trying to explain it to “us.”
I think our country needs to give a thought as to why Mr. Trump and his lackeys wanted military generals surrounding them in the first place? Hum?
16
Kelly used the cover of his emotions regarding his son from which to fire shots at a black Congresswoman. "An empty barrel," he called her. That's one of the worst personal slurs of this whole sordid Trump-as-President affair. How dare a representative of the White House speak like that in public, denigrating a member of Congress? Yet people's emotions were diverted to sympathy for Kelly. Lawrence O'Donnell's impassioned, incisive analysis of this issue on MSNBC has won the day. Heroes don't always come in military uniform.
26
"Stunned" (3 times) huh? Presidential advisor Stephen Miller talks that way (see Miller chastisement of CNN reporter Jim Acosta) but I certainly didn't expect that sort of baloney from Kelly. After all, how can anyone who works in the constant presence of Donald Trump ever be honestly 'stunned' or 'shocked' by anything said by anyone anymore. Kelly has been the one member of Trump's cabinet for whom I've felt at least some degree of trust. Now that's gone. Sad!
22
Kelly isn't fooling me. This was just another level-up on the faux patriotism of the Trump administration.
By starting out with a general description of what happens when a soldier dies, Kelly created an atmosphere of reverence that then allowed him to segue into the political screed that made up the latter portion of his comments without a worry that anyone in the room would challenge him. And the lack of challenge created an impression that everything he said was truthful.
He was able to misrepresent the reason that the Congresswoman was present for the phone conversation and berate her as though her entire purpose for being there was to spy on Trump. Meanwhile, if you read between the lines of his statement, what she said was entirely accurate.
First the flag becomes a religious relic and now military generals are held up as exalted saints whom nobody dares to confront to their face. Somebody in the press needs to take this guy on and reveal him as the fraud that he is. I'm sorry that he lost his son but that doesn't provide him with a permanent license to lie and obfuscate.
23
So, Donald Trump makes a very sympathetic call to the family of a white fallen serviceman, calling him a hero (reported in the Washington Post today). For a black serviceman, it's "He knew what he was getting into," after he was left behind by the others during the deadly ambush. Of course, Congresswoman Wilson could not have listened in on the telephone conversation without the family's invitation. The White House made it sound as though she had illicitly wiretapped the conversation.
In the Trump Administration, people with brown skin are definitely second class citizens. John Kelly's racially charged remarks may emanate from his own innate and concealed racism and not from any desire to accommodate Donald Trump.
22
I find it appalling that so many here have posted critiques of President Trump, yet fail to condemn the vile behavior of a woman whose actions were so obviously staged for political gain. The lack of her being publicly ostracized, here in this forum, is only slightly less odious than her transparent attempts of self glorification. No one need question the waning approval of Congress, when members like Frederica Wilson debase that institution, and the body politic as a whole. I find it improbable that Florida's 24th congressional district could not find better representation, than this poor excuse of a human being.
2
" transparent attempts of self glorification.'
Hummm. There seems to be a lot of that going on these days.
3
I have been having a difficult time keeping up with this story because it has become so confusing. It also crosses into emotional territory for me since I grew up in the military. My dad is a retired Major who earned his Purple Heart and my step mom a retired Captain. It is true that we all know "what they signed up for", but we also rely on the decisions of commanders to protect our troops. We most of all expect our President, the Commander in Chief, to understand this sacred trust, which is why the President's words were so stunning to so many, myself included.
What confuses me is General Kelly's role in this story. I almost cannot process what he is saying. And according to reports, he lied about Congresswoman Frederica S. Wilson's words and actions. Why would he do this? To protect the President, it seems, but it also seems like something else is going on here. Guilt? Guilt for what? How the operation went down?
19
General Kelly reminisced about the 50's when women were sacred but he didn't seem to care about the grieving wife of the Mr. Johnson. Was she not sacred while grieving or did color cloud his story.
22
General Kelly thoroughly disgraced himself and the memory of his son in a gratuitous, cynical manner and squandered what could have been an opportunity to show grace and humility on behalf of the president and himself.
He decried the erosion of values and in particular the loss of respect for women in today's society, clearly referencing that Hollywood guy who shall remain nameless. Little did I know that he was referencing himself among the disrespecters. I was stunned, stunned, when he called Congresswoman Wilson an "empty barrel" not once, but twice.
They missed an opportunity. The president could have called, not to apologize, but the clarify and acknowledge a misunderstand. Clarifying that the phrase "he knew what he was getting into" was in the sense that he volunteered for military service and more specifically a Special Forces unit, units which often assume dangerous, high-risk assignments. He knew the risks and still volunteered to serve his country. La David and his fallen comrades were indeed brave, courageous men and all deserve the highest honor and respect. We are grateful for his service and sorry for your loss. (The End) His remarks could have accidentally leaked. And President Trump winds up a hero, instead of a goat. Couldn't Sarah Huckabee have written something like this?
6
John Kennedy said" Too often we... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."
Let's not forget that this man lost his life in the service of his country. He should be honored and remembered by us all.
7
Imagine a member of Congress, overhearing that call which was not for her consumption, asking the wife if she could help her digest an imperfectly worded message delivered with the best of intentions. And then kept that conversation private as well...who is really dividing this nation?
2
Trump started this mess and as of yesterday (day 4) was continuing to tweet negative messages. He is like a toddler throwing a never ending tantrum.
12
There's nothing much to expect from the President when it comes to sympathy. Or should the people be more realistic that he is not what they expect him to be. He speaks out his mind loundly and for the most part without tact, that will get him into trouble. But perhaps and for argument's sake giving him the benefit of the doubt that he did not mean any harm when he passed his condolences to the wife of Sgt. Johnson. When everything else is being politicized these days it's easy to take connotations from his statements, tweets or small talk. But instead of constantly giving him the spotlight why not turn the emphaty to the families of the fallen.
General Kelly's sentiments were fitting and noble, especially when delivered by a fellow soldier. They were just lost in translation. But throwing grieving family members and an elected congresswoman under the bus for their very human reactions only added insult to injury, and was beneath him. Et tu, General?
17
Kelly has trashed the important historic tradition of avoid political pontificating by former and present Commandants of the United States Marine Corps. In his amazingly ill-advised statement, he did confirm that Trump could have said that the soldier knew what he enlisted for. He had no idea, despite it being in print widely, that the Congresswoman was in a car with the family on a speakerphone when the President called. How did he miss that? His false recollection of what the Congresswoman said at the dedication of the building shows his either his racism or his gynophobia or both. My father and my two uncles were in the USMC and fought on Tarawa, Okinawa and Guadalcanal. I served. Commandant Kelly has insulted us and the entire Marine Corps.
19
Instead of explaining the mess created by the president, General Kelly and the White House went into the attack mode to smear and discredit the messenger.
General Kelly has officially taken a dip into the the White House swamp.
19
" ... evidence of a broader decline in the values of an American society that no longer treats women, religion, “life” or Gold Star families as sacred." How ironic and said Kelly said that in defending a president who has grossly described groping women and who so cruelly assailed the Gold Star Khan family last year. Hoped Kelly would be a good influence in the White House but now looks like another Trump lap-dog lackey.
15
I am wondering how Chief of Staff Kelly could have allowed himself to serve a person of such demonstrably low character.
19
Those who support liars make liars of themselves. Those who use ad hominem attacks reveal the weakness of their own position. How sad that General Kelly chooses to destroy his own integrity by defending falsehoods and employing personal attacks. "Empty barrel"? That is you, General.
21
It never ceases to amaze me to what depths people will sink to and jeopardize their own integrity in the name of either self preservation or "Taking one for the team". John Kelly has lost any respect that I may have had for him and he should be ashamed and feel really smarmy for allowing an imbecilic pig like Donald Trump to politicize the death of his son and marginalize his ( I assume , but from his actions, I'm not so sure) ensuing grief..thank god he's not my dad.
11
Based on Gen. Kelly's remarks - "Mr. Trump was merely trying to express what Mr. Kelly had discussed with the president before the phone call — that soldiers like Sergeant Johnson were doing what they loved, and what they had chosen to do, when they were killed serving the country." - I am convinced that trump attempted to convey those same sentiments to Mrs. Johnson, and failed miserably because he lacks the empathy, the refinement, the humanity to do so.
trump knows nothing of what motivates our service members to sacrifice their time, and their lives, to serve our country, because he only serves himself. He is incapable of commiserating with the families of the fallen, because he only cares about himself.
There have been other times over the past few months, when he repeated things he was told in meetings because he just doesn't know what he's talking about and needs to sound like he does. His ignorance is a danger and an embarrassment.
14
What was abundantly clear yesterday during John Kelly's rant was his disrespect for military families and women, and his willingness to unabashedly lie to protect this president.
14
“He can’t just go on TV and lie on me,” Ms. Wilson said on CNN, referring to John F. Kelly, the White House chief of staff. “I was not even in Congress in 2009 when the money for the building was secured.”
Sure he can, he is working for the Trump government.
14
That Kelly, eloquent as he is, sort of bailed out Trump begs some questions as to why he (Kelly) where he is.
Is he staying on as CoS because he feels that to leave would leave the presidency itself in total disarray because the person occupying oval office, along with his staff, is totally inept in a hundred ways?
Or, is the general staying because of blind loyalty to a man who is, in every way, the opposite of the values Marines prize most?
(Hint: He would have been far better off leaving his being "stunned" comments alone. He showed a hole card on that one.)
6
Any other feeling human would have gotten back on the phone, called the mourning widow and apologized for any insensitivity or misunderstanding that occurred in the first call. Kelly made matters worse when he made the Congresswoman out to be the bad one. She is not. Trump is the most rotten apple in the barrel.
14
Politics smear about fallen soldier is disgusting and unacceptable. If you don't like Trump just say so because you wont like whatever he says. Do not bring politics where it has no place.
1
I had never heard of this congresswoman until a few days ago. I do not know her reputation for truth or for lying. However, I do know that Mr. Trump lies constantly, so I tend to believe the person whom I don't know, against a known commodity like Donald Trump's lies. As the old saying goes, how do you know Donald Trump is lying? His lips are moving.
10
And another White House lackey attempts to manipulate reality in order to please the presidunce. Trump's call was heard by at least three people, and his empathy free, hollow words are on par with his emotional maturity level. His lie that he has proof he didn't say those words will never be revealed, and he will continue to demonstrate his breathtaking incompetence and narcissism.
7
No, Kelly confirmed Trump lied when he denied saying what Wilson claimed he did. The words Trump used were the same Dunford used with Kelly when his son died. But what neither old man is considering is that words that would comfort a general whose son died are not the same words that would comfort a 24 yr old civilian widow. And if what you said brings pain, not comfort, an apology is called for, with a repeat of "I'm sorry for ypur loss".
5
The anti-Trump forces (media-dems-celebrities) "jumped the shark" on this one and handed their mortal enemy a win.
2
Not from where many of us sit. But you think you know better by stating your opinion as fact. Are you related to Mr. Trump?
5
Another disturbing example of why this person must be impeached. Democracy & dignity die every day at the hands of this disaster of a person .
5
This has been a reoccurring pattern throughout all of Trump's life, long since before the election as POTUS. Specifically, Trump creates chaos and commits mistakes (egregious, stupid, profound blunders) and then refuses to be held accountable for those actions and in the vein of a narcissist and pathological liar, Trump sends out other individuals to clean up the mess he created. Not the first time, America, you've seen this in a mere 10 months of POTUS 45.
It's broadly called "Accountability". John Kelly knows this core personality trait and he has lived that his military and private life. Donald Trump has NOT once ever embraced ACCOUNTABILITY as a core characteristic.
John Kelly possesses a characteristic Trump never had: Empathy. Listen to words spoken by Kelly how he was advised on his son's death. Contrast with Trump's comments. At least, Trump is "tone deaf" and "inexperienced", but as POTUS you don't get a "pass" for learning on the job. Trump is consistent - he has been lacking empathy his whole life; a trait associated with narcissism.
John Kelly understands when he is given an order, his military career required that order be executed to the best of his ability. Rather than trump having the COURAGE to face those reporters. I honestly wonder how John Kelly must feel knowing his boss has not told the truth about contacting families of fallen service personnel. At what point John Kelly do you stop shilling for POTUS Trump's conduct, compromising your integrity?
4
I actually agree with General Kelly on one thing. I, too, thought the Congresswoman listening in on the call and then reporting on it publicly was inappropriate.
General Kelly specifically, however, said he was "stunned" by it. My question for the Chief of Staff is, have you not been equally stunned many mornings by the tweets from our President that state obvious, known lies? Did you feel stunned by the way Mr. Trump insulted John McCain's service, or how he made fun of a disabled journalist, or maligned the integrity of a Latino judge?
Lastly, as a decorated veteran who lost his son in combat, were you stunned when, in response to a question about Putin being a murderous thug, our Commander in Chief replied, "what you think we don't kill people?"
I respect your service General. But you cannot take the high moral ground while you defend a man who so disgraces this country on a daily basis.
12
Kelly will still be thrown under the bus, when it's convenient for his boss, no matter how much he panders, skills, or covers up for him.
6
Here is a chance to listen to President Trump directly, in his own words, unfiltered by the press or his allies or enemies.
This tape was released by a Gold Star widow.
http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/20/gold-star-widow-releases-trumps-call-a...
Draw your own conclusions.
2
To be able to console someone at a time of such great loss, is rare art. And so no one need be surprised if Trump wasn't able to rise to this occasion.
I am happy to concede General Kelly's point...Trump tried his best to console, and it should have been left at that.
That said, Trump continues to "poison the water" with comments of the ilk "I am better at consoling than any other president...and other presidents, with special stress on Obama, didn't even make my kind of effort."
If you want to address a situation even handedly, you can't start keeping score arbitrarily in the middle of the game. Feel like General Kelly is guilty of doing this here....
On a larger canvass, I do wish we learn that all of us learn to ignore noise and keep our eyes on the prize...getting upset over kneeling in NFL or over forms of speech on campuses, these are trinkets that distract us from the real discourse. But its more fun to rally around these, and round and round the bush we go.
6
As I listened to Mr. Kelly's press briefing I was moved by his words & tone describing all our fallen soldiers & the sacrifice of his own soldier son. I thank him and all who serve & grateful for these courageous souls.
It sounded like somebody in this administration was an adult...
But, when Mr. Kelly veered across the line & criticized the congresswoman (without knowing all the facts & backstory) it only sounded like he was channeling trump..and that is always heading for a crash. Trump is not fit for the office of U.S. President..he should not be allowed to use & abuse this power & anyone who is defending this untrustworthy, inept, narcissistic liar will have to explain in the end..WHY? Trump only serves himself & his "brand"..he has never been a public servant, he doesn't know any sacrifice or suffering..he cannot relate. We can't forget what he said about the gold star Khan family or that self-centered speech he gave in front of a sacred wall of all the dead CIA officers or any of the horrible things he has blathered about ("death & life are in the power of the tongue"). Something is seriously wrong with this man & he should be "fired"..who will defend us from him? I really wonder.
5
You seriously haven't updated this story to reveal there's video which directly contradicts Kelly's "empty barrel" attack on Wilson?
If, as you quote Peggy Noonan saying: "Its great power was you knew he was telling the truth, and in all specifics,” then your report of his remarks has an enormous problem.
Gen Kelly made a very strong attack on Rep Wilson's credibility and motivations, based on his own first-person witness. He claimed he was present when she delivered a speech that was so offensive and self-aggrandizing it left everyone stunned. Others talked about service & sacrifice, but all she talked about was herself and how she got money. Everyone was appalled and shocked.
Watch the speech. Tell me if it squares with his characterization of it. Whatever Kelly's explanation for his wildly incorrect (yet very vivid and detailed) recollection of this event, the tape doesn't lie.
I understand you were emotionally moved by a father's pain, and by his invocations of respect for those who have served.
But facts matter more than your feelings in the moment. If his testimony was powerful because "he was telling the truth," then it's a huge problem when you find out his self-offered evidence for why Rep Wilson is not credible (she's self-aggrandizing) was itself spectacularly, shockingly false.
13
I love how the Times says, in a different article, that Kelly's "recollection was wrong" of Congresswoman Wilson's remarks about the FBI building. I don't know why you're giving this guy the benefit of the doubt when he has no problem going out there and defending the Liar In Chief. Tell it how it is: he lied, just like his boss lied, for the same crass, self-serving reasons.
One would like to think that a former general would be above this kind of thing, but then one reflects on how the US military has operated over the last twenty years. Kelly's lie isn't an anomaly. It's how they do business. I'm sure they'll find those WMD any day now.
11
As Kelly listened in on Trump's calls to grieving widows, he grew oh so outraged to learn that someone else was also listening in on Trump's calls to grieving widows.
12
Kelly calling out a time "when women were sacred"
And then chooses to pile on a grieving pregnant widow. You can't go lower than that.
14
Gen. Kelly will not take questions from non -Gold Star Related persons. Does he answer the questions of draft-dodging presidents? He is serving one. Does he still hold women sacred? His president confesses to a delight in grabbing women in their private parts. By lamenting lack of religion, is he praising all religions? Is it legitimate to believe in God and practice a virtuous life, or is religion as practiced by predatory pederasts and televangelists, and as practiced by those who laud religion but secretly or even publicly sin all the time? Does Kelly believe that constant bragging, constant venom, constant lies are defensible traits of gentlemen, even if they were never officers? I am puzzling over Kelly saying our country does not respect “life.” Does this mean needless, aimless, pointless and gormless wars, killing young men like his son and Chance are abominations? Does it mean that our majority good police force should police itself in disciplining those rotten apples in its ranks who kill at will and with impunity? What is this Gen. Kelly, the self-confessed knowledgable one-per-center, who is feeling sorry for all of us not quite him, actually defending? Not principle, honor, or all virtues. His own narrow set of virtues perhaps. And, of course, trump.
10
Ugh. General Kelly is scolding the American people for lacking respect for our troops? He should be saving that lecture for his boss.
That said, though, if that's the last word on this whole sordid affair, that is fine by me. Democrats and Republicans have enough political footballs to kick around these days. Gold Star families shouldn't be one of them.
1
Trump, if he had any grace whatsoever, could have ended this whole mess with a simple apology and anything that resembled a heartfelt condolence for Mrs. Johnson's loss. Instead, Trump dragged Kelly's son into a witless battle between himself and someone who has just lost a loved one. It is Trump who is using Kelly's son as a political football. The "politicization" Kelly complains of lies squarely in Trump's artless, heartless lap.
6
"Trump's generals", or Trump's garbage men whose job it seems is to clean up after their boss. If the generals are such brilliant military tacticians, why are they working for Trump? Why are they defending him?
The most important question is who decided that Chad, a country that works with the US military to fight terrorism in that region of Africa, be put on the travel ban list?
So what should Congressman Wilson tell the family: their loved one died
because Chad's military support and intelligence was withdrawn from Niger because the DHS put Chad on Trump's terrorism list? or because Chad didn't submit the proper paperwork to the DHS and therefore got on the list.
5
"”It stuns me that a member of Congress listened in on the phone call. I thought at least that's sacred.”
"Frederica Wilson was one of several people in a limousine when the call came through and the phone was on speaker."
8
Sadly, General Kelly lied about Congresswoman Wilson's comments. Compare his recollection with video of her 2015 speech:
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/fl-reg-wilson-kelly-tape-of-sp...
“That’s what the president tried to say to four families,” Mr. Kelly said. He later appeared to attack Ms. Wilson by noting that, during an emotional 2015 ceremony, a congresswoman had crassly claimed political credit for getting funding for an F.B.I. building in Miami that was named for fallen agents. Ms. Wilson’s congressional district includes parts of Miami.
“And we were stunned — stunned that she’d done it,” Mr. Kelly recalled, though he did not name Ms. Wilson. “Even for someone that is that empty a barrel, we were stunned.”
5
Trump and Kelly should contact Hallmark greeting card company to suggest a new line of sympathy cards directed at fallen vets. Here's a sample:
Cover: So sorry for your loss
Inside: But he/she knew what they signed up for.
Of course, this would be a stretch for trump seeing as he doesn't compute the word "sympathy".
3
General Kelly is one of those privileged white males who happens to be of Irish background. I was an older adolescent during the desegregation of Boston public schools. I knew how racist the city of Boston was then, and still is to a degree. I've never forgotten the hateful and racist comments and the face snarls I saw on TV from Irish Bostonians, who themselves suffered from great prejudice. Stunned at the reactions of many people as a result of his-General Kelly's--treatment of Representative Wilson who had every right to be where she was--supporting the grieving widow--he showed his nasty colors and where he stands racially. He is out of touch with the people of this country who feel black lives have never mattered in this country the way they should. What he should have done as Trump's chief of staff is fix his fury on on Trump and shame him for his despicable comments and lack of compassion for a woman who lost a loved one--a soldier fighting in Niger, lying about making those comments and insisting that Trump apologize to the soldier's widow. General Kelly should go one step further and apologize to Representative Wilson. How dare he place any blame on her shoulders! General Kelly: You made and Trump made it political. Not anyone else.
I'm sorry for the loss of General Kelly's beloved son and soldier, but where his compassion?
6
Perhaps the Obamas felt a phone call would have been inadequate in Kelly's case, so instead they took the time and effort to recognize the family's loss by hosting the gathering. For Kelly to fail to mention that event when stating he did not get a call is just an unconscionable act of bad faith.
3
God bless, General Kelly. May time assuage the anguish of your loss.
As to the MSM and the Congresswoman,
Sometimes, we wish you would just say, “thank you”, and go on your way.
3
Thanks to the sun sentinel finding video of rep Wilton's 2015 remarks, it is clear general Kelly slandered her. Why should he be thanked for attacking a woman who has done a lot more good than this president ever has?
11
Who is “we”?
4
This is upsetting, to be sure, and like Gen. Kelly, I hate to see the deaths of our military turned into political fodder. I think maybe Mr. Trump is the one who is doing this, or at least, who started this imbroglio. But what is worse for me is the uneasy feeling that this administration is hiding a more important issue: Why did we lose those young men? I hope there is a credible investigation soon.
5
Mr. Trump made a clumsy effort to reach out to the widow of one of the soldiers killed in Niger. The widow, who had her Representative listen in on the call, took offense at the President's statement that the soldier "knew what he was getting in for," or words to that effect, when he enlisted.
An empathetic person might have expressed regret that his words were construed as offensive and promised to try to do better in the future with this difficult task. But Mr. Trump is not an empathetic person. Instead, he took the opportunity to once again criticize his predecessor and, in the process, dragged his own chief of staff's murdered son into the situation.
It's a sad fact that Mr. Trump has no sense of decency and is unfit to handle such a sensitive situation. Remedial training might help someone who acknowledges his own shortcomings, but Mr. Trump is not such a person.
2
Trump isn't capable of empathy. Kelly tried to dissuade him from calling.
Kelly knows the pain of having a son die in combat. That's tempered by his belief in the idea of sacrifice for a noble martial cause. He knows nothing about how wives feel, how women feel when their husbands die and they're pregnant with their third child. Do they want to hear that their husband died "exactly where he wanted to be with exactly the people he wanted to be with when his life was taken, surrounded by the people he wanted to be with"?
No. Wouldn't he have wanted, as he lay dying, to be with her and their children?
Kelly mentioned a fantastical time when women were "honored," yet he proposed taking young immigrant children away from their mothers if they crossed the border illegally. Heartless. It's interesting how he said he pitied those who'd never served in the military and felt the joy of being a part of something larger and noble. But that's possible to do and feel in other arenas, and it's something that the despicable man he's defending has never even gotten close to.
5
I respect Kelly for both his service and his loss. And some of what he said yesterday was noble and worthy. That ended when he made it a political rant and became Trump's attack dog. He has lost some of my respect and as time goes on, I really have to question his nobility and integrity by working for Trump.
7
There's a difference between what Kelly said to Trump and what Trump said to Myeshia Johnson. When speaking to Trump, Kelly was the father of a soldier killed in he line of duty. When Trump spoke to Ms Johnson, he is a draft doger speaking to someone whose husband was killed in the line of duty.
7
Here we are again in a "Trump Loop." An events occurs, Trump makes a ham-fisted and inelegant reaction/statement, the people who want to resist him are triggered and react in rage and political posturing, his defenders come in to "interpret" what Trump meant and accuse the resisters of over-reacting and seeking a political smear, the media pumps it up for ratings and advertising sales (also known as eyeballs on the screen). The country ends up more polarized and we get nowhere.
How do we stop doing this? I am sick and tired of it. Is this the next three years? This is not serving the country and weakening us as a nation.
I have always been told that it does not matter, really, what your intention is in communicating with someone else. How your communication is PERCEIVED is what matters. This is a basic tenet of office communication-- most professionals understand this. It does not matter if Trump said he was not disrespectful. It was perceived as a slight.
We give Trump so little benefit of the doubt, now, that we believe his intent was to be callous. Probably not so. But he has to understand that every word matters, and that he HAS to think about what we really hear.
"He said Mr. Trump was merely trying to express what Mr. Kelly had discussed with the president before the phone call — that soldiers like Sergeant Johnson were doing what they loved, and what they had chosen to do"
This is a completely straightforward, truthful statement by the Chief of Staff. However, what General Kelly failed to realize is that a narcissist with no feelings for others does not have the emotional intelligence to empathetically relay this message to a grieving family. Like a struggling student who regurgitates crib notes out of context, the President clearly displayed his lack of understanding of the situation.
2
Kelley: "And he was where he wanted to be, exactly where he wanted to be, with exactly the people he wanted to be with when his life was taken."
I do not think there is a soldier who would desire to be in situation where their life will be taken. I think it's safe to say they all want to go home to their families. It's hard to defend the indefensible.
7
Given Mr. Kelly was acting as apologist for a draft-dodger who faked injuries to avoid military service during the Viet Nam war. his assertion "...here’s nothing in our country anymore that seems to suggest that selfless service to the nation is not only appropriate but required" is particularly ironic.
And please don't try to tell me Trump is serving his country now. He's done more harm to the nation in the last two years than anyone who has occupied the White House in the last century.
11
Someone has to step out of the fray and take higher ground. It is unfortunate that General Kelly got involved with personal attacks. How can anyone defend a president who habitually mocks others? Who aggressively finds fault with anyone but himself? President Trump created the negative expectations for his behavior.
President Obama would never have let this happen. Great leaders have faith in decency and our potential to rise above.
6
An "emotional catharsis"? More like an emotional tragedy for those on the receiving end of this tirade. I am sorry for his loss but his remarks were self-serving, untrue and disrespectful towards Re. Wilson. First, the military does not own the market on how to react to a death. Loss is loss, grief is grief and an artless and insensitive remark is just that no matter the circumstances. President Trump was not "bravely" making that phone call, he was pushed to do so because of his own bluster. Second, the "empty barrel" is the person for whom Mr. Kelly works. Rep. Wilson had a personal connection to the soldier and his family and had every right to be grieving with them. Third, his assertions about Rep. Wilson's remarks in 2015 are not true. She was not in Congress when the building was funded. Here is the video of the speech to which Mr. Kelly was referring. He either miss-remembered or lied. http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/fl-reg-wilson-kelly-tape-of-sp...
Mr. Kelly's attack on Rep. Wilson epitomizes the loss of the "scared" place women, especially black women, have lost or more aptly, have never had.
11
Her comments are deplorable and she is NOT worthy of the office which she holds. She's a disgrace to society and has the audacity to act giddy over the rock star statement! She owes Trump and a huge apology as well as Kelly as well. She disgusts me and others who unfortunately do not admit to it.
1
With all due respect, Mr. Kelly, your assertion "most of you as Americans don’t know them" is absolutely wrong. Most of us know young soldiers, families of soldiers, kids who are going to sign up. They are our neighbors, they are second cousins or the skinny teenager who morphed into a six-foot Marine.
15
A parent losing a child, as John Kelly did, and a woman losing a husband, as Myeshia Johnson did, are both tragic. Kelly's attempt to defend the president was lacking in certain connections. Wasn't Trump the one who started all this by impugning previous presidents and their failure to call slain members of the military? Kelly goes on to say that when he was growing up "women were sacred." What about Trump's behavior toward women? Hardly sacred. And the implied criticism of of Khizr Khan's speech at the Democratic convention? How does bringing that up help the discussion? And what does Kelly think of Trump insulting Vietnam veteran Senator John McCain? As much as I have sympathy for Kelly's loss, I think he made a mistake jumping into this feud.
9
Mr. Kelly accused Ms. Wilson — who was in a car with Ms. Johnson when Mr. Trump called and is a longtime family friend — of being a publicity-seeking opportunist. He said that the congresswoman’s willingness to breach the confidentiality of Mr. Trump’s words is evidence of a broader decline in the values of an American society that no longer treats women, religion, “life” or Gold Star families as sacred
He does know who he works for, doesn’t he?
15
Mr. Trump was entirely right about Ms. Wilson.
1
" Mr. Kelly said that he was “sorry” that most Americans are unfamiliar with the young people who fight in the military on behalf of a country that, in his view, takes them for granted."
I would say that it's not Americans who take them for granted, but our warring Nation that takes our young people for granted in sending them into wars created by the US with no end in sight.
I am sorry for John Kelly's loss and understand his grief and anger, but if he were truly honest with himself, he would say our whole Nation is responsible for the disrespect of our young people who sign up with the military, especially the Military, Industrial Complex but also the rest of us who are complicit with America's ignorant and disastrous foreign policies, wars & coups. And now the wars are coming home to America!
6
Because John Kelly suggested the language Trump used in his hesitant call to Mrs. Johnson, it's not unreasonable to assume Trump holds Kelly responsible for the negative reactions to it. So, Kelly had to make things right for his boss.
The way he chose, to denigrate Representative Wilson's character, was, at least, a missed opportunity. He could have chosen, in taking responsibility for suggesting the language, to issue an apology to the family and the congresswoman for offering language that could have been heard as insensitive to the family, even though it was not intended to be so.
There is, however, no doubt in my mind that this approach would have been considered as a sign of weakness by Trump.
7
"He said that the congresswoman’s willingness to breach the confidentiality of Mr. Trump’s words is evidence of a broader decline in the values of an American society that no longer treats women, religion, “life” or Gold Star families as sacred."
Well he pretty much ticked off each failure this president's behavior has demonstrated.
8
Kelly owes Representative Wilson an apology. I watched the video of her remarks. She did not claim credit for securing the funding. She rightfully described the rush on naming the building after the two slain agents and recognized all the law enforcement officers and agents present at the ceremony. She was respectful and appreciative. Something Donald Trump and others could learn to emulate.
19
Yes, exactly. I didn't find any grandstanding in her speech. It was actually very well done. I'm saddened to hear Gen Kelly's impression of it.
5
I believe the initial questions asked by reporters at that press conference had to do more with Trump's not issuing a statement about what those troops were doing in Niger in the first place, rather than why he had not issued a statement of condolence to the families. Rachel Maddow as usual connected the dots last night in a very enlightening and eye-opening story. I, for one, would like to see some in-depth reporting from the New York Times focusing on this angle.
9
As a historian, I had the opportunity a little more than a decade ago to conduct oral histories with service men and women stationed in Iraq and Afghanistan--and subsequently to curate museum exhibits at a national monument in Washington, DC, around their experiences and around the lives of the fallen.
It was a profound privilege. Two take-aways stand out at this moment.
First, many personnel didn't really know "what they'd signed up for." The youngest among them had joined the armed forces for varied reasons from service to the country to self-betterment, income and educational opportunities. The reality of war was distant and seemed unreal.
Second, the families of the fallen were frequently isolated. We think of the military as a large organization, but in fact, fewer than one percent of the population belongs to that elite group.
When service men and women died, their families were often the only people in their communities to experience that kind of loss, and that isolation was particularly difficult in political environments hostile to the war itself.
My organization invited the families of the fallen to the opening of the exhibit honoring those who had died. Again and again, we heard of their loneliness in their grief. They bonded in their shared loss.
These families have made the ultimate sacrifice--that's not hyperbole. They are not notches in the belt of a narcissistic politician. They should not have to demand the respect and honor they have earned.
10
I believe the words " empty barrel' targeted at Congresswoman Wilson by John Kelley says it all. I am now more concerned than ever about what is really going on in the White House. More leaks ever than ever. The increasingly rampant dysfunctionality, The disorganization. The political infighting. The inability or unwillingness to curtail the tsunami of lie after lie. The true story of what is going on in Niger and what happened to our four brave soldiers. Most of all the inability to show any kind of compassion, empathy, and respect to the family of Sgt. La David Terrence Johnson.
It was during the Vietnam war when I inadvertently became the bearer the worst news a mother can hear. Two soldiers knocked at my door looking for my friend who was at work. They had trouble finding her. I heard her in the front hallway returning from work I told her two young military men were looking for her. She knew instantly that her son was dead. He was a 20-year-old paratrooper killed on his first day in Vietnam. Her oldest child and only son. She was inconsolable. I can still hear her heart-rending cries and her repetitive motions scrubbing the kitchen floor for hours each day. She turned her agony into a cause and became a Gold Star Mother Against the War. Other than the death of my own son, it was one of the worst experiences in my life. Never to be forgotten.
11
I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but in his press conference, Mr. Kelly stated that President Obama did not call him or his wife after his son was killed in action. He left the audience with the impression that President Obama did not acknowledge the loss. What Mr. Kelly did NOT state was that President and Mrs. Obama hosted a breakfast for Mr. Kelly's family as well as several others for the sole reason of consoling them for their losses. So, a call was not made but he and his family were not ignored after their loss.
13
Correct. Mr. Kelly's implications in this regard were not altogether truthful.
4
The really sad thing about this entire incident is that General Kelly has apparently lost his honor and honesty. He has been in this White House long enough to have become infected by its lying atmosphere. Whatever this draft-dodging President said, however unintentional his remarks may have been, the whole situation could have been defused by him simply saying, "I'm sorry, ma'am, I meant no offense." There was no need for this former Marine Corps General to defend the indefensible.
10
The military follows orders and I don't think question whether they are right or wrong. At the helm is the commander in chief. The military would be obeying whoever got themselves into office. When I think of generals and Trump I feel very worried, resigned or not. America is about questioning authority not blind obedience. That is the meaning of In God We Trust. We don't follow leaders blindly. We look to our conscience. Tom Paine writes about it in Common Sense. Founders were worried about presidential power. Mr. Kelly can say what he wants, but I will think for myself.
Immediately Trump is off on a new scent: the rise in crime numbers in the UK. He associates it with Islamic Terrorism. Wrong, of course. The increase in numbers are from different ways of reporting crime and are for England and Wales only. It is not tied up with Islamic Terrorism.
I hear the sound of hounds baying in the distance.
4
I'm extremely disappointed in John Kelly. I'm sure he was a fine general in the Marine Corps, but his decision to serve and defend Donald Trump was a bad one. This stunning defense of Trump now only serves to further lessen my opinion of Kelly.
6
General Kelley demeaned himself, which seems to happen to each and every person associated with Trump.
6
The case of Sgt. Johnson was outside the norm from the beginning, since he was separated from his unit and his body left behind. No doubt we will get some explanation for that, but it is not what anyone signs up for.
Wonkette enlightened me that Kelly allowed himself to be used. The speech reminds me of Colin Powell at the UN. In both instances, the best course would have been to say no, it would be better if I did not speak. Instead he attacked a Congresswoman who was doing her job.
7
And we now know due to the new reporting today that Kelly lied with impunity at that press conference. Ms. Wilson never said those things he accused her of at the FBI building dedication. I listened to her entire speech, she never talked about all the money she had raised. He lied, he lies just like his boss. These are very unnerving times we're living in. I hope the follow-up story gets a lot more attention. We need to wake up because if we're not vigilant we may find that the US has become a military dictatorship.
11
Yes. Mr. Kelly misrepresented the facts in a manner that was particularly demeaning.
4
Everything Trump touches turns into dross. He has used General Kelly's loss and, until now, private grief to deflect criticism for his tone deaf conversation with Ms. Johnson. Anyone who comes into his orbit is eventually tarnished and lessened. It is sad to see General Kelly bemoan the loss of sacred values in defense of a man who is the poster boy for profaning those very values.
6
I was deeply saddened to see General Kelly put in a position of having to defend Mr. Trump. An honorable man telling us what the president was "trying" to say.
We've seen this over and over again. Throughout Trump's political career, his defenders have "tried" to explain what Mr. Trump was "trying" to say; "tried" to convince us that yes, he's inarticulate but his heart and head are in the right place. I believe that one congressman said something like, "he's not a polished speaker."
Indeed.
Words Matter. Our thought process is expressed in language. The language we use reveals our interests, our motives, our capabilities. Our actions either confirm or belie our words.
Mr. Trump's normal speech pattern is confusing, self-aggrandizing, punishing, deceptive, frenetic, boggling, disconnected. It reveals a confused, self-aggrandized, punishing, deceitful, frenetic, boggled, disconnected mind. His actions confirm his words. Even when he is "trying" to do the right thing, his words expose his self-involvement, his lack of empathy, his pathological need to be right - always right.
"Trying" to tell us what the president meant is useless. His own words and actions reveal his soul. And we grieve for our country.
5
This is Kelly walking a tie rope. On one had, he must satisfy a small-minded, self-centered man who seeks glory for only self-gratification, e.g., by going after Wilson. On the other hand, Kelly must demonstrate that he is fair minded, e.g., by distancing himself from any attack leveled against previous presidents whose focus was mostly on consoling the Gold-Star families.
Trump should stay away from consoling people. That requires empathy.
3
This simply is a dispute that should not have happened and a debate that should not be had.
2
Kelly tells Trump Obama didn't call him, and explains its not always done, and advises Trump against doing so. Upon hearing that this was an opportunity to do something Obama didn't do, and then brag about it, Trump ignores Kelly's advice. Predictably, Trump with 6th grade language skills and no trace of empathy botches the call, comes across as disrespectful, then blames the witnesses. Kelly's claim that Trump 'meant well' is disingenuous or deluded, and doubling down on Frederica Wilson and being proved wrong about it surely marks his transition from respected General to just another politician.
6
Much ado about nothing.
This at best political posturing, at worse a circus for the masses.
A better question is whether this death was necessary. There has to be reassurance that it was or all condolences are for naught.
is there any doubt that if Congresswoman Wilson was a "White Congressman" that he would not criticize or call him a "empty barrel"? Nor would Trump so blatantly lie that he didn't say "he knew what he signed up for".
Kelly told Trump the story of his friend saying those words on the death of his son. But in that context, the friend was consoling Kelly who might have questioned his own input into his son's decisions. Trump, who does not like to take responsibility when things go wrong, used the words to absolve himself from blame. thus the misunderstanding on how that would affect a Gold star wife hearing it. The lies that followed can not be accepted, and the distortions of Kelly about the FBI ceremony involving Congresswoman Wilson need to be apologized for. Racism is at the bottom of of Kelly's problems with this matter, his record in Guantanamo, and his actions against immigrants from Muslim countries.
5
It is incredible to read the attacks by the NYT readers on General Kelly, a Gold Star father and one of a very few four star general from the Marine Corps in this country's history. I guess only Gold Star fathers from Pakistan who appear at the Democratic convention to attack Mr. Trump are worthy of adulation and respect. If there is a difference in the versions of what took place during the conversation that both General Kelly and the Congresswoman witnessed, who would ever defer to the nutty Congresswoman who wears stupid hats and has never accomplished anything during her sorry life other than being a member of the vilified and hated political class as opposed to a Gold Star four star General who has served our country his entire life? NYT subscribers I assume.
2
She has a name: Frederica Wilson. Ms. Wilson was a teacher and the principal of a school attended by Sgt. Johnson's father. She began a highly respected mentoring program for at risk youth in 1993, well before she ever ran for political office. Sgt. Johnson and both his brothers participated in that program, and she is a long time friend of the Johnson family. I don't know that I would have said anything about the phone all, but to say that she has done nothing worthwhile in her life seems to suggest that the only thing worth doing is military service. In which case, the president is an abject failure.
2
None of us have to defer to anybody. Each of us can watch the video of the event ourselves. It can be found on the Sun-Sentinel newspaper web site. Congresswoman Wilson simply did not say what Mr. Kelly said she said.
4
Luckily we have video proving General Kelly lied. Just because he is a gold star 4 star General doesn't give him a pass for lying.
2
Remember when President Obama's national security adviser, Susan Rice, said that Bowe Bergdahl "served the United States with honor and distinction" And when Susan Rice went on 5 Sunday talk shows in which she blamed a video for Benghazi? Thank you for ensuring 2 terms for Trump! Keep it up and run Hillary run...from the real Russian collusion. Just wait, it's going to get real interesting, real soon.
3
Tell me again when it was that women were looked upon with great honor? I'd really like to read a book about that.
11
Fervent defense my eye. Kelley laid out Wilson and made her appear as exactly what she is. Un-American and a liar.
Also, there is no reason that anyone should be listening in on the President’s calls.
This is scandalous from both perspectives.
1
Educate yourself. She knew this young man. She mentored him when he was young. She was in the limo with his family. When the call came in, it was put on speakerphone.
That was entirely within the right of Mrs. Johnson to do. The call was supposed to be to offered to console her. That "her" extends to anyone that she wants to have hear it. Including Sargent Johnson's mother, and any other family or family friend. Which the Congresswoman happened to be.
7
Kelly makes a mockery of the meaning of the words "sacred" and "bravery". And to use the belittling term"empty barrel" to humiliate.
He and trump deserve to be on the same team, two vile peas in a pod!
And if we don't start mobilizing for the next elections, we are as much to blame ourselves.
5
The NY Times reports today that Mr. Kelly referred to Congresswoman Wilson as "that empty a barrel," and claims she took credit for the funding for a building that went up before she was elected. Wilson said Kelly is not telling the truth. A Sun-Sentinel article, with a link to the video of the building's ribbon-cutting event, proves that Wilson is correct.
Personal and demeaning insults. Taking credit where no credit is due. Sloppy falsehoods. Unfair and aggressive ad hominem attacks on women and minorities. Where have we seen that before?
15
Donald J. Trump makes errors as soon as he opens his mouth. I wish retired General John F. Kelley would have gotten his facts straight before making erroneous statements about an American congress persons.
19
While Mr. Kelley certainly has his opinion, I disagree entirely about the place he believes women have in our society today.
They are much more honored here now than they were 50 years ago because they have earned that respect for themselves, and largely through their own efforts. As a white middle aged man, I am happy to see that come to pass in my lifetime.
As far as religion goes, we are all very much better without it having pride of place.
15
As I understand the facts, the President's call was made while the widow was on the way to pick up Sergeant Johnson's remains. I would have thought that the White House would have coordinated with the family to determine a better time for the President to make the call. After all, they had close to two weeks to arrange. I would also have thought that the staff would have outlined some appropriate comments for the President to use during the call. Referring to an army sergeant (and a professional in the Special Forces, at that) as "your guy" is not appropriate in its informality. "Sergeant Johnson" or "your husband" are the terms the President should have used. Also, "he knew what he was signing up for" can be interpreted as blaming the soldier for his death. While I understand what the President was perhaps trying to express, he botched it. Kelly should keep in mind, in most cases, people don't lose their reputation. They give it away.
28
I am so puzzled by Gen Kelly's being 'stunned' and speaking out on Trump's behalf BEFORE confirming FOR HIMSELF exactly what Mrs. Johnson and the congresswoman actually heard. First, the congresswoman was asked by the family to listen to the phone call. She did not 'secretly listen to a private call' as Trump would have us believe. Second, Kelly shared how he was notified of his own son's death by his good friend and fellow warrior which included language that may have seemed appropriate between veterans, but quite harsh and unfeeling to a civilian -- especially when articulated by Trump who shows no evidence of delicacy or sensitivity of any kind. Kelly's remarks now confirm in my opinion that he is completely co-opted by the Trump swamp. It is very sad
26
Kelly, who is not elected, went after a duly elected member of Congress. Kelly was inaccurate in his appraisal of what had happened in the past involving that duly elected member of Congress. Those are the facts in a fact-starved administration. He was wrong. Period. He can either apologize, or he can resign.
30
Is anyone shocked or surprised by the President's statements? No.
Are we disappointed by John Kelly's statements? Absolutely.
We should not be shocked or surprised when the President goes even lower than this, it will happen.
14
Seems that Gen. Kelly saved the day by changing the focus. Amazing display of who is the real POTUS and who is the show. Just a question though: What happens in the marines when a subordinate proves far more able at commanding the situation? Is Gen. Kelly another Gen. Alexander Haig?
3
Dear General Kelly,
I can not imagine the grief and sorrow a parent feels losing a child or the wife that loses a husband--especially when carrying a child.
I too am sorry that this has become horribly politicized but this started at the Republican convention and has continued during our loser president's term of office. His meanness,pettiness, and continual dishonesty only brings dishonor on everything he attempts to do. His "generals" can not defend him because if he had followed your suggestions and failed to condole a widow and her grieving family he should have apologized. Instead in his loser ways he lied and doubled down. Sad.
11
General Kelly is clearly a patriot but he continues to demean himself and diminish his reputation by his association with Trump. The behavior he so passionately condemned is practiced by his boss every single day. Indeed, it is at the core of Trump's person. How does he not see this?
20
I feel admiration for Kelly and his speech was powerful, but not for his defense of a man he knows to be totally unfit for the office. Do those who defend trump, and who have to explain what he says, not see him as the rest of the world does? Why do we need multiple people to translate trumpspeak? If he doesn't mean what he says, then surely he should not say it - and give the world a rest.
5
If there was ever a time to go high when they go low, this is it. Servicemen died. Their families are grieving.
Yes, he started it. Yes, it's maddening. And yes, I find him despicable. But continuing to beat this into the ground does not help the families of those soldiers. Here is what I want to say:
My sincerest condolences to these families. If you received a call and were even a little bit comforted, I am grateful. If you are still waiting for a call, I hope it comes. And if you receive a call and hang up or don't answer, I'm with you, too.
My deepest sympathies go out to you. I wish there were words that could help but alas, I suspect there are not. And I hope my words did not add to your pain.
Most sincerely,
A fellow American
5
Trump has called Kelly and the others "my generals" for so long they've come to see themselves that way. They used to defend the country; now they just defend Trump.
14
Certainly ironic to hear an employee of Trump use the word "stunned" so many times in describing other people's behavior. Rich . . .
23
"General Kelly has sold out."
Not that I saw (and I watched the video of his press conference, very carefully).
Kelly said that Congresswoman Wilson gave a brief speech at the dedication of a new FBI building in Miami, named after two FBI agents who'd been killed on the job several decades earlier. He said Wilson spend most of her speech taking credit for having been indispensable in obtaining the financing for the building.
Wilson replied that Kelley was a "liar" because she hadn't even been in Congress when the funding was secured (I believe she was a Florida state legislator at the time). But three things struck me:
1. Kelly never said Wilson was a Congresswoman at the time -- he said only that she'd taken credit for being indispensable in securing the financing to build the new FBI building.
2. Wilson never actually denied saying what Kelly claimed she'd said. Instead, she "denied" something he'd never even said: that she was a Congresswoman when the funding was secured. Kelly never said she was (see #1 above).
3. By all accounts, Kelly and Wilson were not the only dignitaries present that day. For example, Jim Comey was there, and so was Debbie Wasserman Schultz. Surely one of those other dignitaries must have some recollection of what Wilson said that day. Why hasn't any of them shared that with us?
2
Watch the video. Rep. Wilson turns out to be a much more reliable fact witness than Gen. Kelly. In his apparent zeal to attack Rep. Wilson, he lied about her.
Gen. Kelly should apologize.
5
to MyThreeCents: there is a record of Ms. Wilson's speech - so whether or not she took credit "for being indispensable in securing the financing to build the new FBI building." can be checked -
" ... a video of her speech at the ceremony showed that Mr. Kelly’s recollection was wrong. She did not take credit for securing the money ..."
this from today's NYT in: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/20/us/politics/trump-kelly-congresswoman...?
3
It is very Obvious Kelly was Cleaning up Mr Trumps Mess, Truth from all indications shows we should respect our fallen heros that applies to Mr Trump. Kelly went way overboard when his speech became antagonist towards Congress Woman Wilson, who at the least was there to support a Goldstar Family in the worst of times, that alone is worth commending, she does not have to be there, but she was which is a fundamental human thing to do. It is also very Obvious Mr Trump said what she reported. Kelly's presentation of the account clearly shows a lack of understanding on the part of Mr Trump, how the way a message is delivered is what made it an issue. In view and from all evidence we have so far about Mr Trump, the issue with the his call has more to do with the Callousness with which he said it, rather than with the message itself. Offcourse everyobe who has family member in active duty knows what they have signed up for. Do we really need to remind them of it when they have just lost a love one.
4
Everyone seems to be missing reason that the Congresswoman ( a close friend of LaDavid Johnson and his family) were so upset. The clumsy statement that "he knew what he was signing up for" was not the reason they felt disrespected. What hurt was that the President never mentioned the young man's name. HE HAD A NAME: LA DAVID JOHNSON, but Trump referred to him only as "your guy." And to add insult to injury, in his follow-up tweets and statements he couldn't bring himself to call Mrs. Johnson by her name "Mrs. Johnson" or even refer to her as "the widow." No for him she was, like her husband, anonymous "the woman." That's what hurt. General Kelly made things worse by allowing Trump to hide behind the General's own status as a Gold Star Father and by failing to understand that words from a fellow officer to a grief stricken father are not necessary appropriate for a grieving widow. And his attack on Congresswoman Wilson is inexcusable. Obviously he didn't bother to find out her relationship with the family or take into consideration that the call was heard ON SPEAKER PHONE, not overheard while she and the family were on the way to meet La David Johnson's burial remains. Congressowman's emotional response is defensible, the President's and General Kelly's reaction to it is not.
18
My dear wife felt strongly about this and here is her comment: Hearing General Kelly defend Mr. Trump's call to Mrs. Myeshia Johnson, whose husband, U.S. Army Sgt. La David Johnson, was killed along with three other U.S. Army personnel in Niger recently, I was appalled. First of all, the call was made as Mrs. Johnson, her family, and U.S. Rep. Frederica Wilson, D-FL, were on their way to meet his body at a Miami airport. Why did no one in the Whitehouse find out when Mrs. Johnson would be at home and able to take the call in a less stressful setting for her. Second, Rep. Wilson could not help but hear the conversation in the car if it was put on speaker phone. Third, why didn't Mr. Trump have a script prepared to read that was sympathetic and honoring of Mrs. Johnson's husband's and now her sacrifice. Apparently, he winged it and didn't call her by name, didn't use her husband's name, called him her "guy", not her husband, and used insensitive phrases like "he knew what he was getting into" which she didn't need to hear in the midst of her grief. Mr Trump has absolutely no empathy for his fellow human beings. The loss of his older brother years ago doesn't seem to have made him sensitive to other people's pain.
16
Maybe when General Kelly stated
“Women were sacred, looked upon with great honor. That’s obviously not the case anymore as we see from recent cases. Life, the dignity of life, is sacred. That’s gone. Religion, that seems to be gone as well. Gold Star families, I think that left in the convention over the summer.”
PERHAPS, He was really sending a message to the Public where he stood; sort of like when Vietnam POWs would send secret messages by blinking the word "tortured" in morse code. Because even though I am Conservative, I know that HRC never openly or loudly maligned those attributes.
4
As a Vietnam veteran, I was disappointed in Gen. Kelly's second half of his press conference. The first half was where he should have stopped. Regarding signing up for something knowing service members were going to maybe face death - it reminds me of a friend who died in an air show accident who said before the accident - if I ever die don't say I died doing what I love doing because I wouldn't love to crash. I doubt most of the people in the military think they might die or think they would love to die.
11
I agree that perhaps the Presidents comments were inarticulate. But, making them political was worse. Rep Wilson should be ashamed, and the comments by Mr. Kelly were needed, both to remind us as citizens of the sacrifices our young men and women in the services make on our behalf and two, that there are times when politics should be set aside and we should support our nation as one. The latter point should have been reinforced in the opinion pages of our papers, especially the NYT.
I'm waiting....
4
Sorry, Trump made this political. Trump also had no decency to even learn the name of the brave man whose body the women including Rep. Wilson were waiting for. Trump could have apologized but no he LIED and said he did not make the insensitive comments that Kelly now says he did!
And why did Kelly lie about Wilson claiming she got the funding for the FBI building - she's on the record at the ceremony as saying she got them to NAME THE BUILDING after the FBI service men who died.
2
Trump made the issue political before the phone call to Ms. Johnson was even made when he he suggested to the reporter asking if he had called that Obama had not made such calls. Trump made the phone call to Ms. Johnson after
the reporter asked the question and his response about Obama and past
presidents was criticized in the media.
2
Well, this has turned into a battle between Congresswoman Wilson, who calls John Kelly a "liar" but doesn't actually deny saying what he claims she said, and Kelly, who claims she said what he claims she said. What about the several other prominent people who were at that ceremony (Jim Comey, for example, or Debbie Wasserman Schultz)? Do they remember it happening as Kelly claims? Why have none of them weighed in with their recollections of the event?
Both the Miami Herald and the South Florida Sun-Sentinel have backed up Wilson's version. The Sun-Sentinel has video of her speech, in which she never mentions funding for the building, altho she does refer to her efforts to have the building named after two FBI agents who died in the line of duty.
I don't whether Kelly relied on a faulty memory or was given inaccurate information or just plain lied. And the empty-barrel metaphor is insulting and totally uncalled for. He owes Wilson an apology. And so does Trump.
I won't hold my breath.
2
Of course. Both Kelly and Trump are relying on the well-worn practice of men using harsh language and loud voices, regardless of the facts, to silence women. Thankfully, Rep. Wilson is not following that script. I hope she will continue to stand tall in the face of their outright disrespect. I agree that neither will apologize.
1
to MyThreeCents: another article in today's paper reports on Ms Wilson's speech, which was filmed, and the video does NOT "remember it happening as Kelly claims" -
" ... a video of her speech at the ceremony showed that Mr. Kelly’s recollection was wrong. She did not take credit for securing the money ..."
see https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/20/us/politics/trump-kelly-congresswoman...?
2
Look, I’ve read several reports on this and here’s what I’ve concluded. You have an above reproach former Marine General trying to describe to a President how to communicate with an aggrieved family, a President who is the worst Presidential communicator in modern times and a man whose illegitimate boasting forced his hand in making these calls in the first place. General Kelly is engaged in a Sisyphean mission, one that can never be fully completed; he’ll never get Donald Trump to the top of the hill. Like most things our President expresses, he bungles it; after all, a person that needs to make most tragedies all about himself when he personally has probably confronted few if any real tragedies in his life beyond the situation he now finds himself in, and who lets face it, is the ultimate narcissist, is not the best person to be making these kinds of calls in the first place. Representative Wilson has a long history with this family. Is she politically motivated; perhaps. Would the family have had her there if they didn’t have a familial relationship with her and wanted her there; probably not. Our national reality needs to be met with the kind of optimism displayed by former Presidents Bush and Obama…we are nearing the one-year mark, only three to go…if only we can make it that far.
1
The fact that these, what should be minor, incidents happen continuously then become major above the fold dramas maybe have another reason altogether. Trump is a master of diversion and deflection. Meantime they pull off another egregious theft by GOP. This time it's the lies about tax cuts for the 1%.
Of course, it has another benefit in which it riles up the angry base and gives Fox and fiends another Trump talking point. Which he loves.
3
It is shameful that this congresswoman would go public about a private telephone conversation to use as a political ploy to get her name in the paper and criticize Trump. Especially when she took a segment of what he said and used it out of context. It was none of her business. There are plenty of other things to criticize Trump about, you don’t need to drag the grieving family of a slain Soldier into it.
4
Because what Trump did was cruel - call a brave soldier's pregnant wife and mother as they are sitting waiting to get his body at the airport and say he knew this could happen - nice touch! And not even remember the soldier's name. Wilson was very right to make this public, especially after TRump went blathering how he was better than previous presidents with consoling grieving Gold Star families.
2
Bless you General Kelly for showing what true leadership looks like, and reminding all of us that respect for core values does matter.
It is wrong to politicize the pain of families who have lost a loved one in war. And wrong to dis-respect the fallen soldiers service.
It is unfortunate that your boss, Trump was incapable of making a humane statement of concern, compassion and condolence to Sgt. Johnson's widow. It is unfortunate that he did not take your advice and simply not make the call.
Sadly, as you helped make clear, Trump is simply unqualified, and incapable of performing his duties.
Thank you John Kelly for sharing your wisdom, and standing there in the white house in the face of what you know is incompetence and doing what you can to protect our realm. Your service to the nation is impressive.
When will our leaders have the courage, as you have shown, to state the truth, Trump needs to leave office. He has nothing helpful to offer America.
4
I am stunned, which is the word used by General Kelly, that he will come out to justify the actions of a vile president. This is the man that brought his son into the political realm, this is the man that was uncaring when speaking to the widow of a soldier that died and whose remains were not retrieved for 48 hours.
I really didn't need a tutorial on what happens when a soldier dies. I believe his naked description reopened wounds in thousands of gold star families. I was stunned, there goes that word again, when he brought up the lack of respect fro women, religion or life when he is making excuses for a man that has disrespected all of them very publicly and without any shame.
I am ashamed that he attacked Representative Frederica S. Wilson for telling the truth and for being present when the call was made. She is a friend of the family and she has every right to be there. Is the General aware that the soldier's mother has come out publicly to corroborate everything Rep. Wilson said?
If he is so aggrieved by what has happened maybe he should consider why he chooses to remain in service of a man that does not care about anything or anyone except himself and his ego.
5
The only person that keeps creating problems is donald trump. He needs to step down and the sooner the better...
5
John Kelly has just completely sold out himself and the memory of his son by politicizing that death in support of Trump. Was Kelly in on the call made by Trump? How does he know what Trump said since Trump has not revealed that? Surely Kelly knows that Trump is a serial liar. Trump lacks empathy, and it is easy to understand his misspeaking and causing hurt.
Of course, the pain that Kelly bears from having lost his son is profound, and any person of kindness can respect that. These recent deaths in Niger may very well have triggered that pain and caused him to lose his customary, admirable stoicism. Nevertheless, Kelly drove himself off the rails yesterday. He did not know that Representative Wilson was personally close to the Johnson family who no doubt was invited to listen in as the phone was on speaker. Further, the blame for Kelly's argument that nothing is sacred anymore may be laid squarely at Trump's feet. He has singularly disrespected decency and demeaned the government, the White House, and the presidency every time he tweets or opens his mouth.
Kelly made an extraordinarily personal and eloquent speech, but it was wrong. If many people are hoping that Kelly is a bulwark against Trump's chaotic and impulsive behavior, we now know that is a false hope. Kelly is a lifetime soldier, and it is clear that he will not breach the chain of command. He is not one who will protect us from Trump.
5
Absolutely sickening to watch Kelly debase and dishonor himself in defense of the indefensible - Mr Trump's repeated and despicable treatment of our military heroes cannot be allowed to continue. Me Kelly has absolutely no direct knowledge of what was said on that call, and so he has no business refuting what others, who were on the call, have already acknowledged as true - that Mr Trump was disrespectful and could not remember the soldier's name, or the widow's and then to attacked the grieving family afterward. Has Mr Kelly now shame or honor left?
5
I'd like to see the New York Times editorial board parse the words of Mr. Kelly's lying lips. General Kelly lied through his teeth and had the nerve to get huffy: "The Congresswoman eavesdropped on the conversation" between Trump and Mrs. Johnson. He accused the Congresswoman from Florida of politicizing the situation even though she is a decades long friend of Sgt. John- part of a group she started for individuals interested in military careers and a principal at the school where his dad attended.
If General Kelly actually believes he has now found favor in the dim eyes of his boss- he is not as savvy as his persona conveys. Donald Trump expects people to lie for him; that's their job. There will be no gratitude. Kelly has now proven to Trump he is as disposable as the rest of the President's neophytes/lackeys.
4
Your headline on your other story says that The Congresswoman “accuses” Kelly of lying. However your story says she was correct.” A video of her speech at the ceremony showed that Mr. Kelly’s recollection was wrong. Ms. Wilson did not take credit for securing the funds for the new building. She did spend about two minutes of her approximately nine-minute speech speaking about the legislative effort she had led to name the building after two F.B.I. agents who died in a shootout in 1986.”
The headline should indicate this was more than an “ Accusation”
17
General Kelly's impassioned defense of the President appeared genuine and sincere. However am I the only one confused when he said Sgt. Johnson gave his life during war. When did we go to war in Niger? Except for NY Times readers, It's a safe bet that most Americans don't know what it is much less where it is. I'll take another bet that Trump didn't know we had troops there and what they were doing before this story broke.
17
It is an impossibly difficult task for the most empathic, articulate among us to find the right words for this kind of communication. It's sobering to think that the last voice I'd want to hear words of consolation from is this tone deaf, morally bereft leader of the free world.
29
"impossibly difficult task for the most empathic, articulate among us to find the right words "
Please, no other president failed in this task. NONE. Is it that hard to express empathy? Only if you feel none.
1
Context is everything. When a close friend or relative makes a remark like ‘he knew what he signed up for,’ there’s a depth of feeling there. When a stranger, even a President, makes this remark it is out of context and sounds crude.
There are so many sad parts to this sorry story:
— the death of the soldier, the resulting family loss,
— the fact that Trump felt compelled to make the call because of his mention of Obama, making this a political issue,
— this President’s continuing demonstration of his lack of compassion,
— the sight of a decent man defending an indecent one.
22
In my opinion, Ms. Wilson should resign for behavior unbecoming of a member of Congress.
12
Why, because she told the truth about what she witnessed and heard? Even Gen. Kelly did not deny the President's words--he finessed them and tried to explain the nearly illiterate Trump's lack of facility with both language and gestures of empathy and compassion. And then he deflected with the "once upon a time when women were sacred" nonsense--while serving Trump and the Republicans' anti-woman policies and legislation. There is so much hoohaw going on here that my head whirls. And I simply cannot understand how an honorable man like Gen. Kelly can stand the company that he is keeping and serving. Incomprehensible.
6
She was a close friend of the Johnsons. After 12 days of silence from the WH, why wouldn't she be there? At least she, as their duly elected congresswoman was there for consolation for the mother she knew well as a friend.
5
That is very amusing, in light of a congress that has had the likes of Steve King, Todd Akin, Louis Gohmert, and Michael Grimm. We won't even go into the stellar "family values" senators, who have been caught with other women and the one with the "wide stance", who never even thought of resigning.
I was thinking more along the lines of a President resigning for conduct unbecoming of a human being.
6
Hopefully General Kelly will eventually get that he, a high military officer who has served his country and lost a son when the son was serving his country, can speak with a different voice than Trump, who evaded serving and has lost no close family members, nor even had any close family members that we know of who served in the military.
13
"I'm sorry for your loss" is not the Gettysburg Address. This debacle is unimaginable.
26
Thank you! With this simple reminder of what every etiquette expert in the country would have advised, you have blown a tank-sized hole through Kelly's convoluted excuse.
2
I didn't have a clue what I signed up for. After the military owned me, I had no choice where I was stationed or sent. I joined to get out of the ghetto and for the GI Bill. I enlisted in the '80s and *never* expected we would go to war after Vietnam.
And then there was the GWOT Part One.
So, yeah. I knew that I *might* die, but I didn't *expect* to die. I also didn't expect to be raped, but those are stories for another day.
The military *owns* you. It's the worst parent an 18-year-old could have.
27
Thank you for writing this.
1
I have so much more respect for Gen. Kelly than I do for Trump but I have to disagree with him in his criticism of the contents of this phone call being released. Trump began this fiasco when he criticized Obama and Bush for not contacting families of slain soldiers. I do believe Trump intended to criticize Obama because that's all he has done as President. Obama did call some families just as Trump said he calls some when "it's appropriate". Perhaps the Congresswoman shouldn't have released the contents. I'm no fan of hers but she was in the car when the President called and heard the comments and saw firsthand how it made this widow feel. I actually don't think Trump intended to offend the woman. It's just another example of how this man has no clue how to act with empathy towards grieving Americans.
Compare Lincoln and Trump: Lincoln: "I pray that our heavenly father may assuage the anguish of your bereavement and leave only the cherished memory of the loved and lost, and the solemn pride that must be yours to have laid so costly a sacrifice upon the altar of freedom." Trump: "He knew what he signed up for." Yup, I'm sorry Mr. Trump....you are no Abraham Lincoln.
22
There is no doubt in my mind that this congresswoman should have said nothing about what she heard in the car that day while President Trump was speaking to the young and grieving widow in reference to her loss of her husband and what he signed up for in the military. what I am dumbstruck over is why these men were left so vulnerable and why they left their dead comrade behind...only to be found 48 hours later...that is unacceptable for the United States military and we need all the answers that led up to this tragic assault.Our country needs to have honesty from our President and anyone in his cabinet and even beyond that.
8
"There is no doubt in my mind that this congresswoman should have said nothing about what she heard in the car that day while President Trump was speaking ...."
As if that's the issue.
5
I personally found that Mr. Kelley displayed a disrespecful for the American people. And, that disrecpectful tone was offered in defense of a braggert whose conduct belies Mr. Kelley's plea for the return to a time when all things "american" were respected.
Plus, I am shocked by the failure of the "paper of record" to comment on his placing conditions on those allowed to ask questions.
I certaintly offer condolences to the Gold Star families, but Mr. Kelley is now an official in a civilian government who shows no actual respect for that instutuion by suggesting that American citizens who have not served in the Army, Navy or Marines do not have a right to question what "the good american" do in our name, with authority granted by all of us. I found it in general a sadly regretful performance.
24
"Mr. Kelly did not explain his critique or say whether he was referring to Khizr Khan, the Gold Star father who embraced politics by speaking on behalf of Hillary Clinton last year at the Democratic National Convention.
Nor did he acknowledge the irony in his comments. Many people accused Mr. Trump of failing to respect Gold Star families by attacking Mr. Khan."
Thank you for this reference. It was a striking and ambiguous moment in Kelly's speech and I haven't seen it referred to in other reports.
10
It's not so much the actual words that Trump spoke but the way that he said them. Phrasing, emphasis, pace... all carry emotion. The phrase, "he knew what he signed up for," out of context can be taken many ways. And there are only two people who are privy to all the context. Had I said this to a grieving friend and later found out that my words were misinterpreted by her, I would immediately call again to reassure her of my heartfelt intent. Her comfort, not my own, is of importance. I would not address the issue on twitter, I would not send an email, and I'd not speak to the press about it. The issue is between me and her and I'd do all that I could to ease her pain.
Of course, Trump did nothing like this. He did as he always does, he hits back no matter the context. And that is what makes me angry. That aspect of his character is infuriating to see in the president of our country. I want him to just go away. He has to. Because he can't change and he won't even try.
10
President Trump should stick to writing letters to the families of fallen soldiers. And I recommend that he have someone else write them.
14
All I can think is that John Kelly has had no way to control the President and so he vented his frustration on Representative Wilson. Other Presidents have made condolence calls and arranged condolence meetings that were not sacredly private. They didn't have to be. Those Presidents knew how to express compassion and comfort.
15
I appreciate the service of all who elect to serve our nation in the military. But as our military is all volunteer, there is a disconnect between those who serve and those do not, and there is also greater willingness on the part of politicians to recommend military action and dispatch troops as the answer to complicated problems. I recommend returning to mandatory military service, i.e., the draft. If you are interested in gauging the genuine interest of the nation to engage in military action, get everyone's skin in the game. My guess? You'll find this nation has no appetite for war if everyone has a chance of dieing.
6
I come from a military family. My father rose to the highest rank an enlisted soldier can achieve. My brother and all of my uncles served in the military, including in Vietnam. And I have friends whose sons are currently serving.
I am heartened that so many commentators here are not intimidated by Kelly's military service, which the media largely seems to be. There were so many things truly awful about Kelly's performance, as many here have noted, but also disturbing was his seeming disdain of civilians and implication that those in the military are somehow better and love their country more than those who are not. Sure my relatives love their country, but no more so than those who did not enter the military. There are many reasons people enter the military, including adventure, a chance to travel, lack of other opportunities, and what used to be a rung into the middle class. And my relatives who became teachers performed just as valuable as service as my relatives in the military.
The irony is that many enlisted men I knew resented generals and other military higher-ups for their political gamesmanship and sacrifice of their grunts' best interest to further their own career ambitions. So spare us the lecture, General, because what I saw you doing was putting your indefensible boss and your career ahead of the grieving Johnson family.
65
Brava!
2
General Kelly expresses the sentiments of any distraught parent, but his words smack of those used in identity politics. "You can't understand because you are not me". Not only is this dangerous, but he also seems to think that his son's death, awful as it was, is justified to preserve "our" freedom. The information I have seen would support that no "war" since WWII has been was justified to protect "our" freedoms, much as those soldiers would like to believe. To glorify war to justify a son's death, is in itself, insanity. However, I would expect nothing else from a marine general whose entire identity is built upon a love of war, even though he expresses the opposite. We now live in a world where the line between we and them has dissolved and war should be less and less necessary.
11
Donald Trump opened up his conduct to attacks when he accused previous presidents of not condoling with families of American service personnel killed in combat, in contrast, supposedly and falsely, with himself. The question posed to him was why he had not commented on the loss of four special forces operatives in Niger. He did not answer the question. When he did speak on the phone eventually, his comment was open to misinterpretation no matter his intention - that La David Johnson knew what he was signing up for when he enlisted. The widow and mother at the other end of the phone were distressed, as Rep. Wilson reported and the mother confirmed. The right thing to do was simply to say that Trump was sorry for unintentionally causing any additional suffering, and he did respect the sacrifice of this life. Instead, he started lying about whether he had actually said what the women had heard; attacked Rep. Wilson; brought in Kelly to attack her on false grounds after a sentimental appeal to the sacredness and horror of losses in combat and a reference to the loss of his son. He implied also that in the 2016 campaign Mr. Khan had misspoken in declaring that the example of his son, a Muslim who had died in Iraq, should teach Trump to understand better the Constitutional protection of the right to freedom of religion. John Kelly is doing the USA no service by covering up for Donald Trump or attacking others.
18
I'm sure that Donald Trump is puzzled by all the fuss; he likely can't understand how some heartfelt words spoken to Mr. Kelly by a fellow soldier wouldn't be the right words for him to use with Myeshia Johnson.
The difficulty is the word "heartfelt". Some people don't have empathy. It can't be taught, and can't be simulated very well.
5
It was predictable, and very understandable that retired General Kelly would respond as he did to the criticism of Trump’s call to the widow of slain Sargent La David Johnson. After all, Kelly was a military man his entire adulthood, and that reflects his passion and dedication to all things military. However, what Kelly lacks is the understanding that non-military people such as the widow of Sargent Johnson may not be as commited to the service as he is. At the time of Trump’s call to Mrs. Johnson all she knew and cared about was her dead husband. I doubt very much she was feeling pride in his sacrifice, nor believing the cause was worth his life. Trump’s words clearly showed his utter cluelessness regarding the shock, pain, suffering, and grief families of slain soldiers feel. His call was merely another self serving political act, and as often the case, this one blew up in his face. Trump will learn nothing from this experience. Hopefully Kellly will.
12
This is a yet another reminder why our military is constitutionally subservient to elected civilians (though hopefully sane, intelligent ones) and why there should not be a waiver for the five-year-out rule for military members who want to serve in the executive branch. And if anyone thinks a General, a former CINC of one of our joint commands, is not political, they're seriously mistaken. I think Gen. Kelly quite likes his influential position in the White House, given his public disagreements, and what appears to be an axe to grind, with his former Commander-in-Chief, Obama, regarding closing Gitmo and allowing ("sacred") women the opportunity to serve in billets like Special Forces.
18
Oh, thank you for explaining. Kelly's comment about women no longer being sacred confused me. All it made me think of was Trump's very public history of abusing women, and I couldn't imagine why Kelly would mix that into this elaborate effort to excuse and cover for Trump.
1
Gen. Kelly seems to have forgotten that not all of the families of KIAs are military families and thus are not accustomed to the jargon that they use.
6
Very nice of the Times NOT to report on the video released by Natasha De Alencar, where she recorded her call with Trump after her husband was killed.
Trump was an absolute class act in doing something that was tough and wasn't required by custom or tradition. Listen and judge for yourself. Elsewhere though because the Times refuses to report on it although every other outlet has.
Of course, libs will say that maybe Trump was nice in that call but was super mean in the other call. Very believable.
2
But Kelly will attack Natasha De Alencar for putting it on speaker phone, right?
Kelly seems more than willing to attack any Gold Star family that isn't in the bag for Trump the way that he is.
3
Sorry not good enough- was her released video also characterized as too sacred for any ears but hers as Gen Kelly accused Wilson of even though she too was in the car with the widow?
Did the class act include actually saying the deceased’s name or just calling him “your guy”??
3
Kelly is the right choice as chief of staff for Trump. They have at least a couple of awful flaws in common.
7
When will the House Select Committee investigate the death of four American soldiers killed in an October 4 ambush in Niger.
As with the Benghazi investigation, the American people have the right know who gave the orders to send American soldiers to Niger, and what was their mission. Was it a matter of National Security? If so, explain. If not, then for what purpose.
However, don’t expect an investigation. The republican politburo will quash any attempt to make Trump and them look bad on any issue.
8
Mansplaining, GenGensplaining, using his son's death for political gain, Kelly is guilty of all of it. He seems to have fallen under Trump's spell or come to believe that he has a loyalty to the CinC that exceeds his duty to the nation.
16
The actions of this FL congresswoman and others like her are exactly what is wrong with the Democratic party. Shooting from the hip so to speak on a sensitive issue might work in appealing to Trump's angry base but is quite distasteful to the majority of Dems.
2
As you can see from the comments, even Republicans found Kelly's comments distasteful. Especially his claim that mothers of slain soldiers just LOVE to hear the comment "he knew what he signed up for". I have no doubt had President Obama called John Kelly's wife and told her that her son "knew what he signed up for", you would have been as offended as nearly all Americans are today.
2
I suspect that what really 'irritates' Kelly and trump was that they had no idea Wilson was in the car.
But, why wouldn't she be?
He was her friend.
Who's the loser here?
Kelly.
Last night on Lawrence O'Donnell, MSNBC, that matter of "sacred" became scotched earth. Lawrence explained exactly who Kelly was and where he came from. Kelly is a racist, a sexist, and one of those men that talk "honor" simply to shut people up.
The nastiest part of this is that Kelly stated that receiving phone calls from his son's friends was the greatest balm.
Well, Kelly - that's exactly what Wilson was doing in that car - she was a friend, a real, live, honest to gaud FRIEND giving solace.
That you besmirched that shows that you've been hanging around trump too long.
You are compromised.
Get out of the swamp now, for you are in the Big Muddy up to your neck and you'd better stop pushing on.
Kelly: Biggest Loser.
13
...is it me or is this finger-wagging speech misdirected to the media and the public? Everything sacred this man says has broken down in society has been explicitly destroyed by the president he is serving. Honoring women? check. Perversion of religion? check. A flamboyant misunderstanding of military service? check. Dignity of life? check times a million.
Reading his words is mind-boggling. This shouldn't be considered a "defense of Trump," it should be a lecture TO Trump.
As for his judgement of Rep Wilson, actually I'm going to stop here because this entire scenario is absolutely preposterous.
8
This was Mr. Kelly's main point:
The fact that a Congressperson politicized the call the President made to the next of kin of a fallen soldier is an absolute disgrace.
And I can't say I disagree with him. Mr. Kelly seems like an honorable man who would make a good President. And this Congressperson appears to be not among our nation's best 1%.
4
Baloney.
Kelly was perfectly happy ignoring that Wilson was A PERSONAL FRIEND.
Kelly is a swampie, playing politics.
He's that other kind of 1%er - just the type that wants 50% of every tax dollar to run his military/industrial complex.
No honor here.
3
Gen Kelly can now be added to the list of Trump's 'say something sweet about me' list. Why would he speak for the president when Sara is doing such an impressive dirty work job? Another hostage situation? Stockholm syndrome?
This man who once had such dignity criticizes Ms Wilson! What drug did he take before he appeared in public to speak about his private life AND give three cheers for his Boss?
3
This is beyond the pale. Imagine being the mother of a son who just died in action serving his country. As if that terrible memory weren't enough, she now carries the weight of knowledge that her President needed to consult with a General to know how to express his condolences & that by doing so, he dragged into her grief the additional conflict of the General's loss of his son (a conflict because the General wished to keep his son out of the news)! Add to that, her President blamed his 12 day silence on the fact that previous Presidents - Obama in particular - "did not make calls". Which was a lie, of course.
Whatever Kelly says now about the words Trump was meant to say, we all know Trump is unable to mean them & therefore, his tone & awkwardness with feelings & words, other than anger, is what would have been conveyed.
This is Communications 101. Trump did not take that class & no-one should be surprised. Relying on a General's words whose job all his life has been to send soldiers to their deaths & whose own son died in battle is inappropriate in the extreme on so many levels. Beyond the pale in ugliness & juice for US enemies.
5
This misplaced outrage about phone calls to families of fallen service members is disturbing and misses the whole point about this unnecessary loss of American life.
Where is the outrage about these insane and useless wars we have been involved in since 9/11. Don't just mourn for our lost soldiers, sailors and airmen; stop sending them to fight in the middle of hopeless civil wars started by religious fanatics.
4
Once again Trump has pulled off playing the victim. He cannot form a coherent thoughtful sentence extemporaneously but he refuses to acknowledge it. People should just understand what he's thinking when he speaks. And his feelings are more important than the grieving widow and family. He cries "Poor me, mean people are picking on me" when he's caught being his true self, a sociopathic bully.
6
Does anyone who has seen how Trump works believe Gen. Kelly? I think not. Trump surrounds himself with people who are willing to sacrifice their morals to defend the most immoral president in history. Shame on Gen. Kelly, he has sullied his reputation by standing with Trump. We all have read how he is unhappy in this job. Well he is like every other republican who are afraid to stand up the crazy man in the white house.
8
I'll take Kelly's words over this Congress "creature" any day.
It's a slam dunk.
5
That is not the choice here.
Trump and Kelly both lied about Wilson, a family friend. Epic Fail.
2
Here is the Dedication Ceremony video of the Congress woman remarks. She is correct to call out Kelly. "Someone" in the White House set up Kelly by providing false information and, independently, since Kelly was at the same ceremony then he failed to challenge the false information provided to him. He lied for the "president"
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/fl-reg-wilson-kelly-tape-of-sp...
4
Surviving the Trump Disaster - Rule Number 113:
If Trump is in a factual dispute with ANYONE, always assume Trump is the liar. Historical data indicates that you'll be correct 100% of the time.
5
Let's end the practice of presidential calls to the family of the dead. Do they really comfort?
A signed form letter is quite enough.
The last thing I'd want to hear is the sneering and mocking voice of an uncaring man like Trump. I'd rather be water-boarded.
4
While it may comfort a career military man to be told that your son died doing what he loved in the company of the best people in the world that is not what you say to a 24 year old pregnant mother of two who just lost her husband and her children's father. She probably wants to think the place he most wanted to be was back home with her and his children. If you have never lost someone and had someone say something insensitive to you, lucky you. Most of us have. No one else gets to decide whether the person meant well or didn't mean it the way it came out. What matters to you is that it added to your pain. And when a career military man who is chief of staff of the President of the United States verbally attacks and lies about a U.S. Congresswoman (not to mention the family of a dead soldier) resulting in her receiving death threats I hope you all are paying attention because that means our country just took another step on the road to fascism. And if you are just glad to see your president and his staff attack a Democratic Congresswoman who also happens to be African American then please tell me who is politicizing this incident. Any decent person would have just offered an apology to the family that his words were misinterpreted. Kelly has just shown that, like everyone else who joins this administration, he is no better than the sorry excuse for a human being he is defending.
7
I have great respect for Kelly, but why is he defending words the president has,denied that he said? Does this mean that POTUS is indeed a liar?
3
General Kelly drank the Kool-aid. He is now officially a sycophant.
Congresswoman Wilson is an old an trusted friend of Mr. Johnson's family
and was invited, along with his mother/aunt to hear the "words of condolence"
from the President of the United States......Talking about women as if they were
sacred is not something you want to do if you're a spokesperson for
the trump administration......too ludicrous for commentary. Women expect and demand equality. Ask our warriors at West Point or at the Air Force Academy in
Colorado or the Navy about their spotless records concerning
the "Sacred" among them.
8
Thanks for your service John F. Kelly, but as they say the fish rots from the head.
Why would you lie for this president?
Congresswoman Wilson DID NOT say what you claimed in your video defense of Donald Trump.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/fl-reg-wilson-kelly-tape-of-sp...
19
This man has forgotten his true mission.
28
How interesting that Kelly's statement could just as easily be interpreted as a rebuke of Trump since much of the loss of dignity in discourse has come from his boss. “Women were sacred, looked upon with great honor. That’s obviously not the case anymore as we see from recent cases. Life, the dignity of life, is sacred. That’s gone. Religion, that seems to be gone as well. Gold Star families, I think that left in the convention over the summer.”
14
Not to mention the fact that this president got out of serving his country is the most questionable way. Does he feel sorry for the president? “We don’t look down upon those of you who haven’t served,” Mr. Kelly said before concluding his remarks. “In fact, in a way, we’re a little bit sorry because you’ll never have experienced the wonderful joy you get in your heart when you do the kind of things our servicemen and women do. Not for any other reason than they love this country.”
Nothing surprising about Trump behaviour, as we all know or should know by now that he has been spared most of the moral and ethical norms and minimum standards of behaviour rest of us take for granted. What I do not understand is why is this congresswoman in the middle of this? Was this not a private call and a very private affair?
Why was Kelly et al in the room when trump made the call?
The spouse was in the car with others which inc the congresswoman and the call was heard over the speaker.
2
She was a friend of the family--invited--and in the car. Read the details.
3
The Congresswoman had known the young man who died since he was in elementary school. She had mentored him. She was in a vehicle with the family when they took the call on speakerphone and when they expressed their distress after the call.
2
With all of everybody's complaints that General Kelly is a party hack trump loyalist who should have cut down the President yesterday instead of the Congresswoman or that he should quit and not associate with the administration; I would like to clearly state that I would rather General John Kelly is on the inside instead of the outside for this administration. With any potential flaws/faults of his, my money is squarely on General John Kelly saving this country from its current president.
2
When I read the story, I could see that Mr. Kelly criticized the Congresswoman and spoke of his own pain but I did not find any reasonable defense of what Mr. Trump did. To say that the president "tried to say" something different or more tactful, more sympathetic does not excuse the heartless words that the president actually used. Mr. Kelly should keep Mr. Trump on a very short leash because Mr. Trump's words are offensive and ill-chosen and deserve criticism.
14
And Kelly failed to address the fact that the so-called president lied about what he said. Surely that deserves criticism, too.
General Kelly spoke like a true marine, and seems to have been the source of Trump's heartless remarks. What might sound right when spoken to another warrior, is no consolation to a grieving widow.
9
With all due respect to General Kelly why is he defending Trump for something Trump himself says he did not say? Trump can't have it both ways.
21
Let me see if I've got this straight. Trump calls the family of Sgt. La David T. Johnson and a friend of the family who happens to be a Congresswoman is present. Trump says something to the effect of "he knew what he signed up for" and also didn't seem to know his name, which upset the widow and mother of the slain soldier. Trump calls the congresswoman a liar and, by association, the mother as well because she publicly confirmed what Trump had said. Chief of Staff John Kelly also confirms that this is what Trump said. After Kelly's press conference, Trump AGAIN calls Congresswoman Wilson a liar tweeting she "gave a total lie on content!" Mr. Kelly laments that nothing is sacred anymore in this country and defends Trump, who he very well knows is lying, and has continued to lie about what he said. Isn't telling the truth sacred?
Trump, who is incapable of admitting any sort of error or performing even the smallest act of contrition, had to send out Kelly to slam the truth-telling Congresswoman instead of simply calling the widow back and privately telling her he was sorry if his words had come across badly but he really just wanted to express his gratitude for her husband's sacrifice and his sympathy. While Kelly is certainly a sympathetic figure in the case of the loss of his son and his experience with fallen soldiers, there is no honor in defending a known liar.
26
THIS IS ANOTHER DISTRACTION designed specifically to take attention away from the proposed tax give-away in the new budget.
As despicable, callous, and uncouth as Trump is, lets focus on the budget.
10
jail the "his generals" too when the investigation is complete. they are enablers of this mistake.
3
It goes without saying that General Kelly and his wife and family suffered an unimaginable loss, as have all those families whose children lost their lives in similar fashion. On the other hand, Kelly is sullying his reputation trying to defend the malignant narcissist and liar in chief who, if the shoe were on the other foot, would not hesitate to throw the general under the first bus that comes along.
14
At risking his own reputation, John Kelly has defended a person who lies, insults, bullies, etc. To bring his own painful experience of his son into this is shocking.
America had such great hopes of John Kelly bringing some honor back to the White House. This will not happen.
16
This whole debacle is the antithesis of decorum and common decency. Kelly used his own son's death to defend Trump.
19
I know we live in a post irony age, but seriously , calling out Representative Wilson as a publicity hound while defending a man who spoke about his inauguration crowd size at the CIA Wall of Remembrance made my head explode.
32
The NY Times headline writers need to be fired.
In today's follow up article about Congresswoman Wilson's response, the NY Times headline SHOULD read "Congresswoman Calls Out Kelly's Lies During Press Conference".
Instead the NY Times headline reads: "Congresswoman ACCUSES Kelly of Lying, Escalating Dispute Over Trump’s Condolence Call"
The facts that Kelly was speaking untruths are not in dispute. Why a headline implying that Kelly might be telling the truth when he intentionally smeared the Congresswoman using facts that have absolutely been proven to be untrue?
13
Gen. Kelly has been used. What ever convinced him to use the death of his own son in defense of Trump? He must be convinced he’s our last lined of defense between Trump and war with North Korea to sell his honor so cheaply.
11
None of this would've happened (turned out this way) if Trump wasn't lying and deflecting.
Maybe the Congresswoman is as bad as Kelly and others have stated but it doesn't look like she's the Liar in this mess? And where I'm from and how I was (fortunately) raised, MANY issues and problems are rooted in lies and fortified by Liars.
I can't say the same for the POTUS, not without lying to myself.
11
Mr. Kelly, how tragic that you must politicize your son's death in order to defend Donald! Why do you feel you have to? To defend Donald, while subtly criticizing his predecessors is more than dysfunctional it's pathetic!
We know whom Donald is, a crass, mean, manipulative bully. And nothing you can say will change the fact that Donald showed no compassion towards the young Mrs. Johnson!
But we already knew how he felt about Military Heroes! He ridiculed Sen. John McCain, saying he was "no hero, I like those that don't get captured!" And then Donald bullied a Gold Star family! Donald doesn't have an ounce of compassion in him! And you, John Kelly have lost my respect for coming to the defense of an indefensible man!
17
Gen. Kelly proves brass can tarnish too!
That became crystal clear when he feigned shock and horror that the congresswoman "listened in" on a SPEAKERphone and totally omitted the Gold Star mom's corroboration! The general, like his boss, willingly wallowed in deceptive spin with that glaring omission.
Now America must reckon with the reality that maybe this guy ISN'T going to save us from the monster....instead, he's been zombied by it!
18
General Kelly has sold out. He is now just another Trump minion who will publicly lie and/or obfuscate for his boss. I had hopes that Kelly would stand up for his son and our nation, but he didn't. He used his own son's death as a prop just as much as Trump did. Kelly has jumped into the sewer.
15
First off I would never question Kelly's experience of losing his son. Nor his description of what happens to bodies of dead soldiers. Of course that is chilling and deserves deepest sympathy. These words coming from him do make more sense as he has lived through it and served. Trump has never served anyone but his own good his entire life. He can't form sentences and doesn't appear to feel empathy so phone calls are probably not the best idea for him in general...
However, Kelly lost me as soon as he got off topic. Talking about how sacred things were back in the day when he grew up, women were looked up to and religion was sacred.
REALLY???
You are referencing to Weinstein when you are working for the 'groper in chief' who himself has made a life out of exploiting women and on tape bragged about being able to assault women because he was a Star. You talk about looking up to women and proceed to call one an "empty barrel".
You speak about times when 'religion was sacred'. What you mean is christianity, correct? Because it's certainly not Islam in this regime. Thank goodness that Trump also proclaimed we are going to bring Christmas back.
Let's not forget about another reason why many young kids join the military. It isn't solely to serve the country. In a lot of instances it's because they don't see another future for themselves and their families. Free education might help with that...
17
It's very simple. President don't usually make such calls. Most just send letters. These calls are tough and emotionally draining, and not something that anyone would look forward to doing.
The fact that Trump makes these calls at all, when they are not required by custom or tradition should tell us everything we need to know about his heart.
All this nonsense stirred up by a partisan congresswoman and the fake news is shameful.
2
Trump made the condolence phone calls AFTER, not before, he bragged about having made the phone calls. That fact most definitely tells me everything I need to know about his heart.
2
Go back to the facts. Trump bragged that only he called the next of kin of our soldiers - without a shred of fact or decency. He got called on it even by the ex-presidents for lying about their service.
Trump deserves to be dressed down.
1
Short and simply stated. Let the truth be told. The congresswoman instigates and devises evil, thus causing division among us, and should be removed from office. Listening in on conversations is the epotomy of just how low one can get!
Very sad situation, started by 45's refusal to answer a legitimate question on Niger. He had not mentioned these dead soldiers in the 2 weeks since their deaths, or explained why we are in Niger. Then he turned the answer to an attack on President Obama. Gen Kelly should have said "no" to making excuses for our empathically challenged and ignorant president. Kelly did not deny it was said as reported, rather attacked the messenger. Not his highest moment.
12
If you listen carefully, Kelly opines in his dark speech that this country is no longer worth dying form and that gold families are no longer respected. Not ringing endorsement for the administration he serves. More like a coded SOS.
6
General Kelly accuses the congresswoman of politicising the death of a slain soldier, but is fine with Trump invoking the death of his son to slander president Obama?
13
This incident will not be going away any time soon. The transcript of the dedication ceremony for the FBI Miramar Building supports the Congress woman. Kelly was provided information from the White House that was false and repeated it (despite his presence at the ceremony). Too bad for the credibility of Kelly.
There is an old Southern saying that applies: "You can't waller with Pigs and not smell"
9
Any general that stands with Trump is a traitor. Do I need list the names of Confederate generals who statues are being taken down today?
6
Trump has now brought the Dark Ages upon the US. It is sad, he is bringing down people like Kelly to his level of idiocy.
It is clear that Trump lied. Everyone knows that Trump is a serial liar and he lies, all the time. What is sad is that is that Trump has bullied Kelly into submission so that Kelly will defend him.
Yet again the Trump White House is the pot calling the kettle black and obfuscating the facts. Calling the Congresswoman a publicity seeking opportunist is exactly what Trump and his whole family are. We still do not know why the soldiers were in Niger.
Trump does not care about human life, he has no emotions, and all he does is bully those around him into submission. This is why I wake up everyday except for the weekends and wonder what horrible thing has Trump done now, has he started a war somewhere? The weekends are the only safe time when it comes to Trump because he is playing golf.
We are in the dark ages. Unless there is a groundswell in the GOP rallying around McCain, Collins and the moderates, the world will be plunged back into the dark ages. If Trump can put a leash on Kelly where Kelly is defending him so rabidly, who knows what darkness Trump will bring to this country.
5
I don't buy Kelly's defense of the president as set up by the president. The lady insulted was black and Trump
Is a white supremacist who undoubtedly talks down to blacks. I believe the poor woman who complained. Besides we all know how Trump talks to people. He even mistreats friends like his nasty AG Sessions. Kelly should not have defended Trump. I think less of him for it.
5
Golly! I gets to be SACRED! Guess that will make my minimum wage job and lack of help with birth control bearable. Thankee, General Kelly. It makes me all warm and fuzzy inside to know that I am a vessel of sacredness. So does that mean you, yourself, don't grope women like the man you serve?
7
Who knows ?
There is always the guilt by association !
General Kelly is just another power hungry Lap dog for the unqualified President. So sad the Nation has fallen so far and we look in decline.
5
I appears that Kelly, with whom rested our hopes of keeping the evil of Trump from boiling over, is willing to even sell his soul to appease the narcissism of DJT. Really a shame. I am also tired of everyone else in this administration having to "explain" and defend why Trump's very words and actions are not to be judged as to who he is. Trump is Trump...a bully, a boor, and a disgrace to the Oval Office.
4
What Trump would say at a funeral " well you know you started dying the day you were born. You knew this was part of being human"
3
Gen. Kelly obviously backed up the so-called commander-in-chief regarding the phone call to the Gold Star family because Kelly knew that if he contradicted the bumbling, inconsiderate draft dodger he would have been fired immediately and so wouldn't be able to break Trump's arms when he tried to launch nukes at North Korea.
1
The headline to this article should be: "Good soldier" Kelly uses lies to defend Trump
3
Did #45 even know Sargent Johnson's name or does he address all Soldier's as "your guy". What has happened to the office of POTUSA?
Where is:
"walk softly, but carry a big stick""
"the buck stops here"
"beware of the military-industrial complex"
1
Who needs somebody to explain what a 'Dope' said or meant?
1
Sorry, I listened to a right wing extremist who wrung his hands over the end of pre-feminist control of women and the loss of what he thinks is owed to his religion. We keep treating Kelly as a"brave man of integrity". He is a collaborator who used the death of his won son to render support for his ruler so he can attack a black family. I don't see anything but a hack. Maybe we would go back to Bannon.
5
Trump politicized Kelly's own dead son ...
Now Kelly jumped into the fray, policized the death of another solder and his own son.
3
Our liar-in-chief, trump, is truly the empty barrel. How sad now Kelly defends trump's racism. I am stunned, horrified, daily at this administration's blatant deceit and its pretense.
7
Either Kelly has drank the Kool-Aid (and I don't believe that for a second), or he wants to remain in place no matter what (someone has to jump POTUS if he goes for the suitcase).
2
mr trump started this idiocy by comparing his actions with his predecessors. It is an ongoing fault of his that repeatedly causes problems for him, the us government and the american people. But Gen Kelly is also correct that the congresswoman was using the death of a soldier ( with his widows apparent approval) to score political points. that is the danger of Trump, that he brings all of us down to his level. So shame on Trump, shame on Congresswoman Wilson, and shame on those who think this type of presidential behavior is worth it in order to advance their political agenda.
1
WOW, JUST WOW,,, Read the transcript, it is disgusting you are title this article that way. He was OBVIOUSLY talking about another congresswoman he saw politicize something that he did not want to name. Transcripts don't lie.. He said and A CONGRESSWOMEN. Referring to someone else not Wilson.
Now we see how Wilson distorts context and meanings of words, he DI NOT the congresswoman.
1
The first half of a 14 minute speech he was General Kelly. From the stunned and empty barrel comments he descended to political hack Kelly.
3
Although Kelly represents a man I do not think should be president, I think he was most eloquent when he spoke about our men in uniform. I felt truly he spoke the truth to us all about the sad loss of life by those who gave their last full measure for this country. I am glad we have men like Kelly in our armed forces.
4
Kelly said yesterday that he attended the Miami ceremony at which Congresswoman Wilson took credit for obtaining the financing to build the center being dedicated that day. She replied by saying that she wasn't even in Congress when the funding was secured. She didn't say, however, that Kelly was incorrect, and he never said she was in Congress -- or that she'd claimed to have been in Congress -- when the funding was secured.
Does Wilson's failure to deny what Kelly said mean that Kelly was telling the truth? Not necessarily, but I'd sure deny having said something I'd never said.
Why quibble, though? Maybe there's a transcript of that Miami ceremony. Or at least there were other prominent attendees there who probably remember it. Why haven't they weighed in?
2
She actually did say that Kelly was correct is his characterization of her speech at the dedication of the FBI Building. Kelly did not even know the names of the agents. He identified one as agent Duke, when his real name is Dove. Also, don't you think that Fox News would have been ALL OVER any story of a black woman Congressperson making a self-aggrandizing speech as Kelly has claimed? Kelly just lost all credibility.
2
I meant to say that the Congresswoman said Kelly was INCORreCT.
What a president might say to a general who has lost his son and what he might say to a widow who has lost her husband are two very different things.
But, if Mr. Trump said nothing wrong, why does Mr. Kelly need to defend him? If he didn't say what the Johnson family related, why is he mentioning it as a response he gave to Mr. Trump.
The proper statement is along the lines of "I'm very sorry for the loss of (insert name and rank). I am very grateful for his service and his sacrifice." Is that so hard? Apparently it is for a man who is tone-deaf to emotion.
7
General Kelly reacted emotionally, quite understandably. Congresswoman Wilson also reacted emotionally, quite understandably. Neither should have spoken out, though Kelly's speech was more inappropriate in my opinion because he lashed out at the Congresswoman when he obviously did not have the facts about her involvement with the family. She did not "listen in" - she was in the car when the call came in and was put on speaker. Everyone in the car heard what the President said. She was a longtime family friend - she was not there because she is a Congresswoman. She was personally feeling the loss as well. Kelly needs to apologize to her and acknowledge that.
General Kelly said that he told Trump not to make the call. But Trump did. He told Trump what his good friend and fellow general had told him when his son died...which he understood because both men were military men. Trump could not have the same level of understanding, and he could not convey it in the same way...and obviously didn't. Trump should have simply released a statement apologizing for the way his words came across and reiterating how we honor Mr. Johnson's and his family's sacrifice for the country. That would have ended the whole thing. Kelly just made it worse.
But now we need to stop talking about it and hope against hope that this has been a lesson learned. This is not helping the family or honoring Gold Star families, including General Kelly's, one iota.
4
In a contest of truthfulness, Trump will lose every time, because he has no credibility. His first public utterance about the inauguration was a lie, and he has never stopped.
9
The wheel spins. Now Kelly is telling us what the dotard was trying to say, not what he said. By calling the congresswoman "publicity-seeking opportunist", Kelly projects the personality of his boss onto her. And by focussing on the loss of his son rather than the incident at hand, the audience is left emotionally confused.
Ironically, Mr. Trump's callous words were never have been more accurate than had they been directed to the General about his own lost son.
8
Had Gen. Kelly stuck only to the first half of his press conference about his personal experience, he would have given this ongoing controversy the appropriate closure and ended the debacle. Instead, he escalated this latest Trump controversy by engaging in infectious name-calling and criticized the congresswoman's previous involvement with a local FBI project. Geez, is there any adult left in the WH? Frightening given all the concern for the nuclear football!
8
This whole episode is so disrepectful to the memory of this fallen soldier. I'm so sorry for this poor widow's loss. And I am outraged that this is being used as a political opportunity by Congresswoman Wilson.
2
When I read these comments - I thank God everyday for Donald J. Trump. Just like the flag controversy the radical left has gone over edge of decency and ensures DJT two terms. Thank you for showing why, again, we voted for Trump.
4
Are you referring to the FACT that Trump lied yesterday about what he said to the widow?
3
The value that Mr. Kelly didn't mention as a "sacred value" lost in this country was truth.That he works for and defends a man who can't tell the truth about anything speaks the loudest.It is shameful that Mr Kelly uses the tragic death of his son in this way.He criticizes the Khan family for politicizing their sons death and then goes out and does the same thing..I have lost much of the respect I once had for the ex-general. I'm not so sure having a wall of generals around Trump is going to turn out to be a good thing for the country.
10
I was in the Air Force during Vietnam for four years. I didn't always agree with the Chain of Command, including our country's participation in the Vietnam war. BUT I ALWAYS obeyed the commands given to me whether I like it or not.
For Kelly to say this soldier was where he wanted to be doing what he wanted to do is ridiculous. Sure, he MAY have thought that, but I doubt he was ready to die in a ill conceived mission - a mission planned by someone in command. These soldiers were obeying commands and not necessarily enjoying it. Kelly's military history and his command level would make him think like that, but in reality little few of us enjoy going out and being shot at or shooting and killing another human being. Kelly needs to get his brain out of the military and start mingling with civilians more - then he might understand how his advice to Donald was WAY OFF BASE.
12
With all due respect for General Kelly, his career, his sacrifices, the loss of his son and his service to our country, I can only wonder why is stunned that a member of Congress, a friend of the fallen soldier's family, would listen in on that conversation between the President and the fallen soldier's widow. Is he equally stunned by the President's reactions yesterday in stirring up the hornets nest? Is he stunned by President Trump's words regarding sexually assaulting women or attacking the Gold Star Khan family during the campaign? Is he stunned, being a military man, by the danger of nuclear war that grows closer everyday as a result of Trump's tweet war with Kim Jong Un?
Being a faithful apologist for our President, who has disgraced the office of the Presidency and our place in the world absolutely stuns me as does the silence of the GOP majorities in the Congress.
10
I have to admit that I'm pretty disappointed in General Kelly right now. How could he possibly stand up there and criticize the Congresswoman for being an example of "a broader decline in the values of an American society that no longer treats women, "life", or Gold Star families as sacred." Are you KIDDING me? Maybe this whole situation has been blown out of proportion. Maybe Trump didn't say exactly what the Congresswoman said. Or maybe he did, but what he meant to convey was what Kelly really insisted Trump was trying to say. But to say that the Congresswoman represents a decline of American values when THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES berated a Gold Star family for his own political gain?? When THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES feels entitled to sexually abuse and demean women? I really expected the General to be a more reasonable and rational person. Instead, he is playing right into Trump's hands by trying to normalize him and depict the "rest of us" as crazy and immoral.
10
Odd. Congresswoman Wilson insists that Kelly lied about what she said at the Miami ceremony, but she cited something he never actually said. He never said that she'd claimed to have been in Congress when the funding was secured for the building -- just that she'd claimed credit for securing the funding (for a building named after two FBI agents who'd been killed decades earlier).
If someone claimed I'd said something that I hadn't said, I'd unequivocally deny that I'd said it, and wouldn't call my accuser a "liar" unless I were prepared to deny saying what he claimed I'd said.
It's odd that Congresswoman Wilson calls Kelly a liar but doesn't deny saying what he claims she said.
1
Wow, now General Kelly is getting taken to the woodshed because the left doesn't like what he says. Typical but not suprising as the left only looks for the negatives and how they can spin any comments to be negative. One sound bite doesn't convey the tone of the whole conversation.
I hope the Times posts the video that is on other news outlets of a call Pres Trump made to another Gold Star wife earlier this year - it is a touching call and i believe represents how Pres Trump talks to these widows and their families and the compassion he tries to convey. But i am sure there will be a couple words that are pulled out of the 3 minute long conversation to try to make Trump look bad.
2
Trump needs no editing to look bad, he's got that covered literally and figuratively.
4
Calling the dead by their proper name to their next of kin is part of Trump’s job. Not “your guy”. I don’t think anyone would be comforted by that.
Reuters and AP (what about the NYT?) are investigating why American troops are in Niger. This is trump's Benghazi. He and his administration are covering up what's going on and why. OK, NYT go after trump on this. And, Congress, where are the hearings and investigations?
We know that trump and Kelly are two racist birds of a feather, but don't let them get away with covering up their nightmare foreign policy in Africa.
24
"It stuns me.... absolutely stuns me..."
How could anyone serving on this shameless administrative disaster be stunned by anything? Who is Kelly trying to fool? Trump's ever shrinking basket of America hating deplorables?
30
Kelly certainly didn't seem to care when Trump attacked the Gold Star Khan family, or American POWs such as Sen. McCain, or his other terrible comments.
This is a pattern with Trump. It is especially low level for Kelly to attack a congresswoman in such a bitter way. It is Trump who is at fault. Any phone call arranged should have been done at a better time, not during a trip to retrieve the body of the dead hero, not in a car on a speaker phone where the children and other family members and family friend were present. Trump was not speaking privately on his end. How many of his enablers listened in on this so-called "sacred moment" when the man who avoided Vietnam due to bone spurts showed disrespect to the memory of the fallen who knew what he was getting into.
Kelly's overresponse is meaningful, as his attack on a black congresswoman. I don't know if there is guilt underneath that he works for a disgusting president or as I even more suspect, he shares Trump's racism, sexism, and total contempt for all other Americans who don't fall within his limited respect range. (Certainly no respect for women were shown in Trump's conversation or Kelly's overstated response.) Deplorable and contemptible.
5
On a much broader level, for those concerned with the creeping authoritarianism in American government and society, yesterday's spectacle was horrifying: a career military officer standing on a civilian podium in the civilian White House, condescendingly lecturing civilians on the proper way to show deference to the professional military culture.
His proper comments regarding expression of condolences were then followed up by a bizarre and completely out-of-place rant on the decline of civilian American social values, reflecting the insularity of the professional military class from the broader civilian world.
The hallmark of constitutional democracy is that the military operates under the control and policy guidance of elected civilians. This is what distinguishes a liberal democracy from a military junta or dictatorship. There was no standing professional army or officer class at the time of our founding.
It is clear that President Trump is in awe of the military uniform and has completely delegated all national security and military matters to the professional military class (while at the same time gutting the civilian diplomatic corps).
In so doing, he is abdicating the civilian oversight and control powers vested in him by the Constitution. Again, this is is a frightening prospect. Whatever the integrity of our professional military class, they are not supposed to be dictating national security and foreign policy, which is the proper province of elected civilians.
35
I couldn't agree more. The "separation of powers" in the US was designed to protect democracy from military rule. Military authorities have successfully crossed the line into civilian governance before, as in President Eisenhower, etc. But very few would have Eisenhower's capacities — a man canny enough to leave the White House warning the American public about the "military-industrial complex". The military minds should be in the Pentagon, not the White House. I don't think it has settled in yet, for many people, just how out of place and savage Kelly's attack on Congresswoman Wilson was, as he cloaked himself in the protection of recounting his son's death. Now she has both Trump and Kelly attacking her. It's one of the ugliest things I've seen in this government.
2
Trump says he has "proof" that he didn't say what Congresswoman Wilson claims he said. The only "proof" that I'd find persuasive would be a tape of the call. Ordinarily I'd oppose turning the death of a soldier into a public event, but the soldier's wife, mother and Congresswoman have already chosen to do that. So Trump should release the tape, or else say what other form of "proof" he has. If there is no tape, he should say so. If his "proof" is nothing more than the word of some assistant who claims to have overheard the phone call, I won't be terribly impressed. It will just remain what it is now: A "he said/she said" case.
4
Actually, if you (encompass) listened to the General's speech, it would make a "She(s) Said, POTUS Lied" Case.
MarkAntney,
I did listen to the General's "speech," and I didn't hear that. (Don't you just hate it when you suggest someone look at an actual source and then you find out they did?)
Hearing and "Encompassing" aren't synonymous.
I had thought that Kelly was a restraint on the recklessness of the Trump Presidency. Now I see that some aspects of Kelly may enable or at least support the president. Last night on MSNBC, Lawrence O'Donnell did a fantastic job in analyzing Kelly's speech. He noted that Kelly attacked Congresswoman Wilson as an empty barrel, while never mentioning her name. He also noted that Kelly grew up in a segregated Boston area where racism was rampant. O'Donnell recalled the way in which Boston whites fought against public school integration through the 1970's. I might also add that the Boston Red Sox were the last team in baseball to integrate. I think it is very possible that Kelly shares the same racist views as does Trump. And was it necessary for him to insert his religious views by referring to the dignity of life? Although some aspects of his speech were admirable, when he attacked Congresswomen Wilson, from his position of power, he was the empty barrel.
31
I totally agree with this. Kelly had me on his side as a voice of reason and restraint in this disaster of an administration. But determining that Rep. Wilson was an empty barrel was politicizing this incident; he had to have known that she is a close family member and former mentor to Sgt. Johnson. She was invited to be present. Attacking her is the same as attacking the family. And after being dragged into this debacle earlier this week when Trump encouraged the press to ask Kelly about his son's death, I had hoped Kelly would rise above this. His grave and commendable speech deteriorated rapidly. He needs to take another stroll in Arlington to consider the added harm he has done to those who love and mourn the loss of Sgt. Johnson.
4
So much to unpack here, so much going on - which perhaps was Trump's intention, as always, to obfuscate the important issues which grind along as poor Kelly ends up in front of a podium discussing something he shouldn't have to, and never wanted to. Trump started it all by slyly invoking Kelly in that disgusting comment. Then, true to form, comes the congresswoman and her inappropriate rendering of a private call - and the steamroller blizzard of media began. Same old. It only gets worse and stupider. We have panels of experts on the talk shows discussing snippets of a phone conversation that of course can be read multiple ways - I cannot believe this is happening. Roger Cohen: I refuse to shrug.
2
John Kelly and Myeshia Johnson are the only two people in this particular event who can truly know and fully identify what it feels like to lose a son in battle.
There are three people who have political agendas in what has turned into a quite the ugly ordeal: President Trump, John Kelly, and FL State Representative Wilson.
I highly doubt this would be the first time more than one person listened to a personal call from the President while he was calling a private citizen after such a tragedy.
Representative Johnson's agenda was ugly, but (in my opinion) quite necessary, considering what the President said. Although I assume he had good intentions, some of what he said was rude and quite insensitive. Whether or not her son "knew what he signed up for" is a not for anyone to tell a parent who has just lost a child; especially after (incredibly) referring to him as "your guy" three times. This means one of two things: either President Trump did not know his name, or (worse), he refused to say it. Then, he compounds the situation by lying about what was said; then having the White House spokesperson later retract his lie This is something we have seen him do time and again, ad infinitum. It is truly a signature behavior of his. He tells a lie or something regrettable, then has an underling "correct" it later.
As far as John Kelly, I believe he was speaking from the heart, after losing his own son in battle. Regrettably, he then defended the President, which is his job.
5
This whole thing is disgusting. Bottom line is, as always, DT stirred this up when he was asked questions about the soldiers that were killed, had to bring Obama into it, and then try to "one-up" Obama by calling the widow. This is yet one more example of DT creating chaos, and then forcing someone else to go out and mop up. John Kelly is an honorable man who will no doubt be tarnished before his tenure with DT is done. How sad is it that we have a president that literally needs to be "contained", like a hostile foreign power, to protect the country from his worst impulses. I am deeply worried about our country and the damage this president will do, and has already done.
10
As a black woman who wrote to 15+ first cousins in Vietnam which I disagreed with. Gen. Kelly mentioned declared war. There are none. Congress declares war and last time I looked they haven't, yet.
My problem with this whole thing is the dehumanizing of all parties including out Gold Star Hero. He. She. The lady. The woman. They have names and no one including Kelly acknowledge that. NO ONE, yesterday during intermittent speeches, reports news stories, you name it. The president said, the woman. the lady. They ARE Sgt. LaDavid and Mrs. Johnson. Representative Wilson. NOT the congresswoman. Considering she was there most of his life as a mentor, she had EVERY right to be there and if she heard a conversation on a speaker, so what.
Another thing. Missing for 48 hours. found by the French and Africans when our troops said they could not find him even though he wore a homing device that sent signals 48 hours until found? Something is not right here...this is their Benghazi for real and not made up as republicans tried to do for years and millions of dollars and found nothing. May be nothing here but 12 days of silence? 48 hours missing? I'm not in Denmark but there is something rotten going on.
23
Unfortunately for John Kelly, instead of being remembered for the sacrifice he and his family made and the pain they have endured on behalf of our nation, he will now be remembered as a fool or worse. Very sad indeed!
17
Kelly has ended a fine military career by demeaning himself in defending the indefensible.
18
Gen. Kelly may have delivered a fervent defense of Racist 45 but it was a political response none the less. And lest we forget, this was all started by Racist 45 HIMSELF who disparaged past presidents, notably Mr. Obama, and then flippantly spoke to Mrs Johnson of her husbands death. Gen. Kelly has not only made an even greater mockery of Racist 45’s intent but has shown contempt for his own sons death through his own ambitious demagoguery.
10
Why was the opinion of the mother of slain soldier, Sgt. La David T. Johnson, Cowanda Jones-Johnson, mentioned neither by Kelly or by the NYT in its coverage of his speech?
She told The Washington Post that she was present during the call from the White House on Tuesday to Johnson’s widow, Myeshia Johnson. She also stood by an account of the call from Rep. Frederica S. Wilson (D-Fla.) that Trump told Myeshia Johnson that her husband “must have known what he signed up for.”
“President Trump did disrespect my son and my daughter and also me and my husband,” Jones-Johnson said.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/10/18/totally-...
1
General Kelly, a man whom, I for one, counted on being a sane influence in a chaotic White House, seems to have been infected by the rampant disease of lying which has permeated the Oval Office lately. Unless, of course, lying has become the official strategy of the Trump presidency.
First: the family in question has a right to invite anyone they choose to listen in on a phone call. And a speaker phone on in the confines of a limousine is difficult to ignore.
Second: it was his own charge ,Mr. Trump, who brought up his son. It was also Mr. Trump who lied about the content of the coversation.
Please General Kelly, don't succumb to, and be part of, the degradation that Trump's presidency has inflicted on this nation--and the entire world.
15
And lost in the dustup is the truth, corroborated by Gen. Kelly himself, that a woman lost her husband, a mother her son, and in his role as consoler in chief in that moment, Trump could not summon the empathy to speak with ANY sensitivity. Respectfully, General Kelly, and in full recognition and sorrow for your own loss, Myesha Johnson is NOT a soldier. She did not sign up to lose a husband, a father for her child. "What he meant" is unutterably insufficient. And for you to conjure the word 'sacred' and engage in emotional one upsmanship is a depressing display of calculated deflection.
2
Too late.
"Please General Kelly, don't succumb to,..."
3
There is a major error in both Trump's and Kelly's account of the circumstances. Both have said that the Congresswoman "listened in on a private call," which is totally inaccurate, as she was sitting in a car with the family and heard Trump's message on speakerphone!
13
If those in the car were wrong for listening in on the speaker phone why were Kelly and those in the room at the other end?
The president has the right to invite whomever he wants into the room when he makes such a call.
The parents or spouse can certainly do the same as far as who listens
Not a good day for former Sgt Kelly.
2
Kelly's behavior indicates that he is becoming more like Trump's collection of enabling advisors, a chaos of bad characters making up the cast of an out of control fake presidential administration. That is what happens when you try to manage an addict and his enablers instead of intervening in his awful demise and dangers by directly confronting him. Kelly, as others already are, is becoming nothing more than a contender for enabler in chief of a psychotic who is addicted to toxic narcissism. You see before you a Kelly becoming more like a Stephen Miller Bannon than a source of correction-excepting, of course his knowing words about his own grief about his son's death. That tormented admixture of grief and bigotry- attacking a black woman-shows you what is happening. He is a text book case of what happens when you try to half-measure an intervention with a complete narcissist addict. You become another of Trump's victims. Kelly in reality is diminishing himself and others who are not aware enough to see what is happening. Stretching out and intervention over days, weeks and months leads to a swirly mixture of crazy behaviors, arguments and pronouncements from all who are directly involved. It will, alas, become even worse. The situation has more than enough generals who are ineffective in their current capacities. If the situation continues on as it is now, things will get worse than you might want to imagine.
13
General Kelly's words about how we as a nation have lost our connection with our military are powerful and true and warrant further national reflection. His experience as the parent of a slain soldier demands empathy and compassion. And this story overall, this he-sad, she-said shouting match over who did what and who's more graceful with Gold Star families, is a distraction from the real damage Trump and his enablers in Congress are doing.
2
It is past time to create a new, Cabinet lovel, Department of Empathy to advise our President on sensitive public matters.
Austin Brewin, M.D.
Berkeley, CA
7
Kelly is becoming a politician. Show me one you can trust. He said he was so upset, he had to go walk amongst the finest men to ever serve for a good hour and a half, at Arlington Cemetary. What a line, I think he could have left that bit out. I don't know, I served in the military, honorably for eight years but I think this was one big publicity stunt. Kelly might have told Trump what to say but that does not mean, he (Trump) delivered the message correctly. Everyone knows Trump has a problem articulating things. Kelly is mad Wilson listened in on the call but what was she supposed to do, jump out of the vehicle. Kelly might not have known that the Congresswoman knew Sgt Johnson and his family for years. He was involved in one of her programs, Role Model program if I am not mistaken. I understand Kelly lost his son and Mrs. Johnson lost her husband. She received a call from the president and we can only imagine how that call went. Sometimes things get lost in translation and I bet it did. Trump said a few days ago, he never said some of the comments attributed to him in the first place but Kelly said he did say it but not that way. So I am more likely to believe Congresswoman Wilson and Sgt Johnson's wife. I understand some people are just blinded by Kelly's status as a former General and Gold Star family, which the latter, I know he would not care to be. I think he is trying to clean up Trump's mess and is using the military in the process.
12
It must have been incredibly demeaning for General Kelly have to go on national TV in defense of 45. I guess he justifies this to himself my thinking he's doing this for the sake of the country. Maybe that's true. But surely he knows as well or better than anybody that 45's behavior is indefensible and dangerous. So effectively, he's just another enabler of 45. Sooner or later, 45 will turn on him, too.
9
He could have refused. He sold out.
1
I'm waiting for John Kelly to address Trump's treatment of a Gold Star family during the campaign, and for John Kelly to address Trump's deferments during Vietnam, and for John Kelly to address Trump's lies re: Obama's contact with the families of service members who died, and for John Keltly to address Trump's promise to send $25K to the father of a service person who died, only to not follow through on it, until it was brought up in an interview. Still waiting. What a shameful performance.
16
Kelly's advice to Trump not at call at all was probably the best idea. Trump has neither the empathy or eloquence to pull this off. The fact that he needed to ask precisely what he should say should have been his first clue not to attempt the call. I suspect Trump's ego and desire to try to prove himself superior to President Obama made him ignore Kelly's advice. Finally, this type of call is not a one size fits all. I am quite sure that not all people who enlist "know what they are getting into". They quite possibly had no others options open to them other than the military.
5
This is just another attempt by Trump to deflect from the actual issue. Why were these soldiers not properly protected or armed in a dangerous position? What happened to the soldier's body for days? If Dems win either House or Senate, this will be the next Benghazi, only bigger.
7
While I believe this entire episode has received far more press coverage than it deserves, I view General Kelly's criticisms of Congresswoman Wilson as troubling.
Taken together, they point to Trump using Kelly to engage in unnecessary and possibly false political attacks. Kelly's comments create an overall impression that Kelly has become, as Trump's Chief of Staff, another Trump apologist and sycophant.
Kelly brought up gratuitously the alleged remarks made by Congresswoman Wilson at the dedication of an FBI office building in 2015. The Miami Herald published a story earlier today that Kelly "got his facts wrong" when making that gratuitous attack.
http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/national-politics/ar...
He claimed that Ms. Wilson was a bad person for secretly listening to the conversation when the call was on a speaker phone and the congresswoman was in the same car as the soldier's wife when Trump elected to make the call.
Kelly accused Wilson of being a political opportunist by tweeting about that call. Maybe there is some truth in that accusation, but does Kelly know when he made that remark whether or not the family requested Wilson to respond.
Kelly put the most benign twist possible on Trump's criticism of Obama about his contacts with the families of fallen soldiers. He did not mean to do it. Really? Give me a break.
Kelly gave Trump the phrase "he knew what he signed up for" and Trump still denies saying it.
9
Then it stuns me Kelly would be listening in and even more stunning he would get his facts wrong about the Congresswoman and perpetuate this politicisation of a private matter. Trump has lost any hope of credibility a long time ago with his constant lies and vacant boasting.
5
General Kelly served our country defending our freedom and he is also a Gold Star Father as he lost his son in Afghanistan fighting for us. I salute him. But yesterday he was a Trump cabinet member , a political heck defending his boss shamelessly. He was contradicting his boss and insulting the Florida congresswoman Ms.Wilson, an African-American woman who sacrificed a lot. We had great expectation from General Kelly that he would change the environment of White House. But he did nothing different than the previous chief of staff Reince Priebus except removing Bannon from White House. I know Mr.Kelly has tough job and defending his boss is a part of his job but not shamelessly. Trump loves to be praised, applauded, appreciated, flattered and buttered and he demands all these flattery from his cabinet members.
9
Kelly made the congresswoman and "progressive" journalists look small, but they are just too full of themselves to realize it. No one would argue that Trump is eloquent, but it is only small minded "progressives" who would twist his words the way they have been twisted.
2
General Kelly made himself seem small by applying the same diversionary rhetoric to how The congresswoman overheard Donald Trump's comments. When people receive congratulatory or condolence calls from celebrities especially the POTUS, they will turn on the speaker phone to allow nearby friends or family (on the room) to hear. The congresswoman because of her past relationship with SSgt Johnson was part of that extended and was with the family when Donald Trump called.
General Kelly's following remarks seem to reveal that he has never heard Donald Trump's videotaped confession of being a sexual predator to Billy Bush, since General Kelly emphasized his digust with that treatment of women.
You will continue to deny the truth as does General Kelly that you are defending a small petty man with no reqard for the man whose family he was calling. A man who can not make it thru a 12 hour period without lying to make his self image more grandiose.
2
Thank you for illustrating my small minded "progressive" observation.
Today we find out just how far Trump has changed Kelly, rather than Kelly controlling Trump: Kelly did the Trump thing by lying about Congresswoman Wilson. He said he was stunned that "this woman" claimed credit for funding the FBI building, which never happened, as the NYTimes reported.
"Ms. Wilson said she had pushed for naming the building after two fallen F.B.I. agents but never took credit for obtaining the funding to build it. The money was secured before she was elected to Congress in 2010, she said."
Why did Kelly find it important to bring up a completely tangential matter, which he clearly got wrong? Because he was "counterpunching" like Trump does, distracting from what happened and changing the subject to his attacks on the messenger.
And as when Trump does it, it works for the Trump base, who don't want anything better than to see a military man show his allegiance by debasing himself with personal, false attacks (against a black democrat woman congressman, for extra points) no matter what the subject.
6
RE: Trump’s condolence call to the widow of Sergeant Johnson. John Kelly defended Trump’s remark, “He knew what he signed up for” by discussing a conversation Kelly had with his Casualty Officer after Kelly’s son was killed in action. The Casualty Officer said to Kelly, “He knew what he was getting into when he joined the Marines.” When soldiers speak with each other this is the kind of discussion that is held. When a draft dodger uses that language to the widow of a slain soldier all he’s doing is bolstering his wanna be status. Kelly knows this and should not have used this as an excuse for Trump. It’s one thing to be awkward in that situation but it is an entirely different thing to presume that language appropriate between peers can be appropriated and used to console a widow. Kelly should be ashamed of himself. De Opresso Liber.
5
So, the insensitive words used by Trump were fed to him by Kelly. And they were also insensitive coming out of Kelly's mouth. I wouldn't expect a career military person to understand or empathize with the pain of a mother whose son was just lost in service, even though his own son was lost, especially when his attitude is that he knew what he signed up for (referring to the killed soldier).
These people are devoid of human emotions!
3
Only taking a question from a journalist with a Gold Star connection sounds like TV stuff. Maybe Trump’s little touch.
I wonder what Kelly tells himself about his boss’s mythical bone spurs- the ones that allowed someone else’s son to go to Viet Nam in his stead. Are they sacred?
It’s a complicated web you have going there in the WH.
5
Yes this is a political stunt.
A Congresswoman listening to a call from the President to the mother of a soldier who died in combat. To see if she can find a few words and twist them to make the president look bad.
How low can she go?
As Gen. Kelly, who lost his son in combat points out, "He knew what he signed up for.. but it hurts anyway." Indicates that she had a loss that hurts, but he died with honor.
For Wilson and the others to circle like vultures waiting to pounce on a snippets of conversations (that she isn't a part of) to find words she can use to disparage the president is really low.
Now here comes an amazing double standard. She seems to have no problem with Al Sharpton and some of the things that he has said are truly reprehensible. What's at play here?
2
General Kelly says he told Trump what a fellow officer said to him, one military professional to another, when the General's son had been killed in action. As career officers, they both "know what we signed up for"--it's a stock phrase in their discourse, and they both have their own skin in that game.
Then Trump apparently took that line, almost verbatim, and repeated it to the bereaved mother, Mrs. Johnson--one civilian to another. If Trump meant well, he failed abjectly to hear the tone that would result when a civilian says this to another civilian. The two contexts are so different that the same words suggest an entirely different stance on the part of the speaker toward the person addressed. In civilian contexts, it amounts to something like blame, suggesting "Don't complain/feel bad/worry, he knew what he signed up for." Civilians usually don't claim to know what a recruit had in mind when he signed up--least of all when he's been KIA--because we don't have the requisite skin in the game. Trump seems to have assumed that he has skin in this game, when he doesn't. (Big surprise, that.)
Kelly's "this woman" reference signals his stance on this all too clearly--with his boss and against the mother who lost her son in service to our nation. We're finding out who Kelly is. We KNOW what kind of man Trump is.
6
I agree with all who see that once again, Trump has blundered into showing his shocking lack of empathy and General Kelly doesn't get it either, But there's always some diversion from the real issue: what happened that caused th death of the four soldiers in Niger?
6
I hope General Kelly is aware of what he's signed up for.
4
Mr Kelly has probably been a good American military man. I am sorry he lost his son in war. That said, he espouses a vision of war first, last and forever.
His regret that "sacred" things are gone (respect for women, religion,etc) shows a very skewed vision of the second half of the twentieth century. The very skewed version that is espoused by many old white men. From their position the world may have ben perfect, but for women and minorities it was far different.
War is a horrendous thing. Most Americans only see it safely in their living room thru a news camera. The war monger in chief is itching to push the nuclear bomb buttons. Mr. Kelly does not seem to be the man to deter him.
4
It's only a matter of time before anyone who works with Trump will sink to their level. Maybe they had it in them in the first place, maybe not. No matter. Everyone gets the stink on them. You just dropped a lot of pegs, Gen. Kelly, sharing a moment you kept private for years just to try to help our national disgrace of a President.
5
And just who has doneso much to degrade the very standards and conduct Kelly says he so misses?
Re: Respect and conduct of men toward women; ...Trump
Re: Dignity in general;...Ttump
Re: Disrespect of Gold Star Families;...Trump
Re: Religious respect, whatever that means;...Trump
Re: Dignity & Respect in general;...Trump
To General Kelly, this Vietnam Vet says:...
Trump is the problem; not the press, not the Congresswoman, not the Congress, not the Democrats or anyone else. He is the Draft dodging liar and vile person he always has been.
As Kelly said about those killed in combat, including his son: They knew that possibility when they signed up to serve.
Kelly knew what Trump was when he signed up as his Chief of Staff. He should not be stunned when things go so badly as it has in this case. It comes with the territory, Trump terrotiry and it is gross. He needs to get used to it or leave. There will be plenty more ugly messes to clean up until Trump leaves the White House.
That's just the way Trump is, Kelly or no Kelly.
4
Jelly is one passive aggressive dude. Just like his boss. He also fails to acknowledge the irony of defending his boss, a major transgressor of the things Kelly holds so sacred. Before you accuse others, Kelly take a long look in the mirror.
5
It looks like Kelly has a touch of Stockholm Syndrome. It's time for him to resign.
7
Kelly should understand that the most important people in this story are Sgt. La David T. Johnson's mother and widow. That is based on his personal history. What he also should understand just as an adult male is that he shouldn't verbally attack a 75 year old woman. And since the sergeant and his family are black, as is the congresswoman, Kelly really should have exercised better judgment.
What Trump said is not in dispute. What he meant IS in dispute. White, male John Kelly doesn't get to tell or explain to a bunch of black people what Trump meant. The sergeant's family all are adults...they can make up their own minds.
4
Further, while I'm sure Trump is pleased by today's headlines that Kelly "rips," "blasts" and "slams" the congresswoman and that Kelly "rallied to Trump's defense," the simple truth is that Trump didn't remember the sergeant's name and everything after his flub is in the same blustering bullying style he perfected as a huckster...sorry, real estate developer.
General Kelly professes outrage that Rep. Wilson was present when Mrs. Johnson took the call (on speaker phone), but it was Mrs. Johnson's right to have whomever she wanted with her, including Rep. Wilson, who is apparently a long time family friend.
Really, Kelly was outraged by the fact that Trump wasn't given the benefit of the doubt.
However, Trump long ago forfeited the right to be given the benefit of the doubt.
Given Trump's relentless lies and criticism of Obama, we have every right to view Trump's (inaccurate) comments as politicizing this. Given his conduct toward the Gold Star Khan family during the campaign, and his past reprehensible comments about Senator McCain as a POW, we have every right to view Trump with a critical eye.
Even if Trump sincerely tried to comfort the grieving Mrs. Johnson, when the family spokesperson shared Mrs. Johnson's unhappiness at his approach, he should have simply said, "I am sorry, and please accept my condolences for your loss, and our nation's gratitude for your sacrifice."
Instead the Commander in Chief continued to tweet and politicize this, while the Johnson family -- and indeed the Kelly family -- continues to mourn the ultimate sacrifice.
18
There is something Kelly needs to remind himself. He is no longer in the military. Therefore, his speech, while initially eloquent, has NO bearing on the fact that HE chose to become a Trump White House advisor. Sorry but he can't have it both ways. That is, unless he Mattis and McMaster are now "Trump's Army" paid for by our tax dollars to do Trump's bidding.
Kelly listened in on Trump's call but he has the gall to say the Congresswoman didn't have the same right? Maybe in the military double standards have a purpose.
Kelly is no longer in the military. He is as much in politics as the Congresswoman. It's time these men who sidled up to Trump realize they will get NO sympathy for their wrongheaded decision to become a Trump advisor.
Kelly needs to stop thinking like a general and start thinking like what HE chose to be: a political aide to the worst White House Occupant ever.
Both GWB and Obama just yesterday took Trump down. Will Kelly tell his former commander-in-chief not to criticize Trump too?
It appears now Kelly has suffered from the well known Trump Rage Symptoms that cause mind altering changes to common decency and common sense.
17
We must all consider the source of this latest diversion from why these four soldiers were in Niger without appropriate cover or back up (typically provided by Chad soldiers) and why Chad had pulled out of Niger and it’s protection, as our ally, just days before. If this is about covering up the White House and State Dept.’s mismanagement of immigration policies and procedures resulting in an important ally withdrawing their support following a grave insult (recent placement of Chad [again a US ally] on the list of ISIS terrorist states) then we know why the 45th’s is diverting, distracting and lieing about what he said to a widow. It remains the same reason every time: it’s because he’s too callous and incompetent to lead, engage in right action or to demonstrate compassion.
15
The good general doesnt get many opportunities to speak out publically in support of his boss. He has to ride this one for all its worth.
3
I am sorry that General Kelly lost his son. This incident must have brought back the pain afresh. However, I have less respect for him after this speech. He insulted the Congresswoman in a very personal way.
Trump should have said that he was sorry for expressing himself inarticulately and said that he meant no disrespect. But, of course, as usual, he took the low road. Kelly also took the low road when he insulted the Congresswoman.
14
OK, so Trump's denied saying what Rep Wilson said he said. Gen Kelly has explained what Trump meant. Kelly even shared info re. his son, which he has always avoided, and reprimanded Wilson for eavesdropping. Additionally, in defending Trump. Kelly erroneously misstated something Wilson said at an earlier event. Imo, this is just the new "normal". Trump's doing his usual thing; lying. Kelly's doing Trump's aides usual thing; attempting to spin what Trump meant by "translating" it"and proving his loyalty to Trump by lying and selling his soul in the process. This time, all at the expense of exploiting a beloved young husband and father whose destiny was to be a fallen soldier. snfh
11
Kelly still doesn't know understand the man he's working for, and as long as he defends Trump and seems oblivious to his flaws, he risks falling into the swamp of this administration. Kelly is an honorable man and no doubt a hero, as was his son. But he is also a man who said: "When I was a kid growing up, a lot of things were sacred in our country. Women were sacred, looked upon with great honor. That’s obviously not the case anymore as we see from recent cases."
Which recent cases is he referring to? Isn't one of them Trump? And when General Kelly was growing up. women were not sacred, they were literally owned by men and usually not allowed to enter professions, work outside the home in jobs that were not menial, and were treated as children. Hardly sacred. Unmarried women had great difficulty supporting themselves. Domestic abuse was hidden and was usually not believed anyway. Rape?
Of course there was no such thing,, was there? General Kelly, that myth died a long time ago. Don't try to bring it back.
Trump's Cabinet is certainly reminiscent of the 1950s, but that is one of the worst things about them. I guess he really was a kid then, so he believed the myths. But why does he still believe them? In that sense, Kelly seems rather surrealistic.
12
I appreciated every word spoken by Gen. Kellly, When I stated to my husband, a retired Army Colonel that a "portion" of the statement Trump said was "He knew what he signed up for" his response was, "He did" You see, valiant soldiers aren't political. They are practical, non-nonsense men and women who love their country, attack a challenge and promote our country's safety. Oh, how I wish we could find more than a couple of those patriots in the leadership of this country on either side of the aisle. Furthermore, as to the hateful Congresswomen, show even an iota of dignity and class. Losing one's son or daughter is not about race and hatred.
2
Do patriots dodge the draft with bone spurs?
5
...what in the world? Nobody mentioned race at all. That's something *you're* thinking about. And I wonder why.
6
But the point is that this soldier's family felt disrespected at Trump's insensitive words. They were not the first.
7
I watched the whole speech General Kelly delivered it was profound and gut wrenching. If you have any feelings towards your fellow man when they lose a child or a spouse you will be in tears near the end of his delivery. It was from a general's point of view, then it was from a father's point of view and the point of view of anyone who has lost a loved one in the service of our country. The media has tried to distort the president's call to this grieving wife, making his seem unfeeling and uncaring. The general explained the statement that seems to light up the mainstream media because those were the words he received from an officer and his friend. The general wasn't offended or ashamed and as he said no words can take away the pain of loss, soothe the pain of the family member in their lowest of times. The congresswoman and the mainstream media have sunk to the lowest of lows by exploiting the president's private and personal phone call to this widow. How sad that our country has dipped to this level. Is nothing sacred with the media?
1
I respect General Kelly’s courage, his dedication to serving his country, and his devotion to the men and women of the military.
But his statement laid bare so many of the illusions that Americans labor under, and the willful ignorance that feeds those illusions.
Since when have we held life, women, and religion sacred? Since when has the military done so? Never.
For all that we rely on the military to defend our country, often at great personal sacrifice, it is not an organization that holds life sacred. It trains men and women to kill in our name. And they do.
It is not an organization that holds women sacred. It supports a systemic culture of rampant sexual assault, including rape, enabled by its chain of command.
Is it an organization that holds religion sacred, if that religion is any other than Christian?
General Kelly helps a political party that has a love affair with weapons that kill people, refuses to respect equal rights and freedom of choice for women, and supports discriminating against Muslims. He works for and defends a president who assaults women, scapegoats immigrants and Muslims, and displays no hint that he holds anything sacred, including life.
I share General Kelly’s revulsion for the politicization of a Gold Star family’s pain at losing a child. If only General Kelly would be honest with himself and the country with regards to where a large portion of that politicization came from - our current Commander-in-Chief.
11
For a 67-year-old battle-hardened leader, General Kelly is stunned an awful lot. I am saddened for his loss. I am both impressed by and appalled at his ease with manipulation--swinging from his touching description of the return of remains to his praise of soldiers to his racist-tinged rebuke of "empty barrel" Rep. Wilson; from making it clear that no one "has" to be a soldier, they volunteer, to refusing to take questions from reporters who don't personally know Gold Star families. Wow. He is either lying to himself or he has sold his soul. The Few. The Shamed. The Marines.
18
If General Kelly truly believes the sanctity of life and religion is gone from this country, he should take a walk on a "liberal" NYC campus and see all the Catholics, Protestants, Muslims, Jews, and numerous other students, faculty, and community members of almost countless cultural backgrounds endeavoring to live with great respect for the sanctity of understanding, love, and social responsibility. Though the scoring of personal points with the politicization of a matter of reverence is an action which can be understandingly reviled, it is hard to understand how he chooses to politically express his outrage over the corrupting influences at the heart of our current polarization - greed, racism, and selfishness.
6
The conversation should really be about why were we there in the first place, and why did we continue operating in the region after Chadian special forces were withdrawn in response to Trump's latest attempt at a Muslim ban which itself was a response to Chad fining Exxon which Tillerson is connected to.
But go on and make it about yet another string of poorly chosen words from the president's mouth. That's exactly what he is hoping you will do to divert you from why this ambush happened in the first place.
9
Trump's behavior is indefensible.
It's astounding how many men and women in his administration (not to mention many Republican lawmakers) feel compelled to try to defend his behavior -- with carefully chosen words, or bluster ... or (worse) with silence.
None succeed, however. Because Trump's behavior is indefensible.
13
It's Trump's inability to empathize with anyone and having a vocabulary and speech pattern at an elementary school level. If he had used Kelly's words “was doing exactly what he wanted to do when he was killed" maybe the reaction would have been different. But referring to Sgt. Johnson as "your guy" who "“knew what he signed up for” just show's Trump doesn't or can't actually care about anyone else.
5
Day after day, like some never-ending toxic landslide, the awfulness falls on our heads. Trumps' lies, his spite, his utter dearth of empathy, his lack of intellectual capacity, his announcement that he's going to "bring back coal," insults hurled at our allies and the intelligence community, paper towels tossed at the desperate people of Puerto Rico, demands to boycott the NFL. Meanwhile we still have no ambassador to South Korea.
I am a Democrat, but I would be OK with any one of countless Republicans in 2020 instead of Donald Trump, if (please God no) he stays in office that long. Anyone with an actual "good brain," normal human emotions, and the ability to think before he/she speaks or tweets.
9
So well stated. Thank you!
I am an progressive independent, I will work for Kasich to oppose Trump in a primary if the Dems can't muster up a young dynamic powerful progressive candidate...which is looking highly unlikely.
It’s likely this issue would no longer be in the news if Trump had let Frederick Wilson’s comments blow in the wind. He’s not capable of that, and had to
tweet his venom.
It’s a shame that John Kelly got caught up in this . His boss is certainly as much to blame as Wilson.
1
Why was chief of staff, John F. Kelly out in front of the press core to explain President Trump's behaviour? I'd bet you it was because Mr. Trump's, was throwing a hissy fit in the Oval office.
Its impossible to easy drop on cell phone conversation when it's on speaker phone. First Trump said, the conversation Rep. Wilson heard between he and Mrs. Johnson family didn't happen, he had tapes to prove it. Now Mr. Kelly claims Mr. Trumps words were misunderstood. How can you misunderstand a conversation that your boss said never took place? Chief of Staff Kelly turns the tables and blames Rep. Wilson for all of this?
Rep. Wilson said, that Mr. Kelly stood at that podium and lied. How many more times is Mr. Kelly going to be wheeled out in an attempt placate Trump's bruised ego and flip his lies? At some point Mr. Kelly some people are going to surmise, birds of a feather.....
11
Blaming Ms Wilson ....
"Dodge and Deflect" tactic...#2 in GOP Rule Book.
"Deny, Deny, Deny" of course is #1.
Trump lies and his staff covers up the lie. Trump changes his story from day to day and hour to hour and his staff is left to repair the damage. Meanwhile Fox News and Limbaugh use convoluted logic to justify it.
Have we not seen this from day 1 of his campaign?
Perhaps, we're the ones who aren't too bright as we expect something different from a president who is never going to change.
2
Let me begin by saying that as a member of a military family that includes a West Point graduate as well as a 32 year career army officer, I honor the service and sacrifice of anyone willing to serve. However, I am just as appalled by General Kelly’s words as I was by Trump’s.
How dare he insult the congresswoman who was helping and grieving with this family. She had known this family since Sgt. Johnson was a boy. Had I heard 45’s comments, I would be upset as well. We all know 45 is missing a sensitivity chip.
General Kelly exacerbated the situation IMO by insulting the congressswoman, a BLACK CONGRESSWOMAN, and basically telling her to “stay in her place”. I no longer have any respect for General Kelly. He let 45 throw him under the bus earlier this week by bringing his son into this mess. He should direct his ire at 45 — not the congresswoman. After his performance yesterday in the briefing room, he is sitting on the same bench as Sean Spicer.
The fact that Trump is a five time draft dodger and said that his Vietnam was not getting VD in the 70s and 80s, is disgraceful. I am tired of members of his administration having to come to the podium to explain “what he meant to say was....”. The bar is now set so low that an ant can’t make it under it.
12
Kelly had been doing an admirable job keeping his nose clean. Yesterday he seemed to finally lose his footing and hit a tripwire.
14
I commend General Kelly for his thoughtful and sincere comments. His family has given the ultimate sacrifice. I believe the congress woman responded to the grief of dear friends. The problem is that Mr. Trump feels the childish need to make everything a completion. When asked about these tragic deaths, he should have acknowledged the bravery of our armed forces. Instead he must make it about himself. “I did this and the other guys didn’t “ General Kelly cannot fix what is broken about Mr. Trump.
Rosemary Rappa
6
It is only fitting that General Kelly's comments are brimming with cognitive dissonance. One would expect no less from the man handling Trump's day-to-day affairs.
11
Kelly hit many of the right notes in his defense of Trump. But what he doesn't seem to get, or won't acknowledge, is that the exact same words, spoken in different tones, by different people and at different times, can have profoundly different effects. If my son or daughter passed away in military action and Kelly were to call and try to console me, I am sure I would take his words seriously. But who can take Trump seriously, especially when it comes to the matter of sacrifice? Here is someone who has sacrificed exactly nothing in life and still managed to become President. I can't imagine being on the other end of his efforts to offer sympathy or support. His words are like paper towels for the drowned and dying.
9
Just because someone tells the difficult and literal truth, does not mean that their opinions are correct. Especially when they do so in order to silence criticism of an unrelated issue. If Myeshia Johnson had asked him to speak, that would be one thing. This is just condescending paternalism.
8
It's important to remember that in addition to the insensitivity of Trump's statement about knowing "what he signed up for", he then compounded it by referring to Sgt. La David T. Johnson, not by name, but instead as "your guy" in his call to his widow, He continued on this track afterwards by referring to Myeshia Johnson, again not by name, but as "the woman" . . . "the wife" when defending his actions. To call Mrs. Johnson and express condolences about "your guy" is not normal.
11
Kelly hides behind the uniform and fruit salad he once wore and his son’s death. He is a hypocrite. His wife, the mother of that son, must be horrified by this awful misuse of her son’s memory. He died to shield Trump from his own lies and incompetence? Newsflash, general: the military in this country is subservient to the civilians, and for good reason; the First Amendment protects the press no matter how much you might like President Bone Spurs to slash it with a ceremonial sword. When I hear Kelly now, I will picture Burt Lancaster as the chilling General James Scott. Kelly has debased himself and the military. He has not denied or disproven that Trump lied, he has at best grossly misrepresented Congresswoman Wilson, and he has insulted every civilian in the country. He clearly has no real understanding of the Honor Code...or does that apply only to the Army? Were he not retired he should be cashiered. Disgusting.
11
My biggest concern is the contempt that General Kelly shows for members of Congress and civilians in general. We don't need another Westmoreland in the White House controlling access and information to the president.
9
John Kelly effectively shut down the issue yesterday afternoon and President Trump, just as effectively, reopened the issue several hours later. If I was John Kelly, I would be going crazy with that degree of undermining.
3
So, three things really stand out about this for me.
One is the awful mythologizing of dead soldiers. Do those who joined to get a job or benefits never get killed? Nahh; somehow, dying for dubious causes is an instant qualifier for sainthood. Maybe because it helps quiet discussion of whether their lives were wasted.
Another: Kelly laments, like a true curmudgeon, that nothing is sacred any more. On his list of laments: "Gold Star families, I think that left in the convention over the summer." So is Kelly criticizing Khizr Khan for calling out Trump? I don't guess he's criticizing Trump for attacking Khan (though in a sane world he would have), but either way, it was bizarre: in the midst of a speech premised on the sacredness and honorability of Gold Star families and given to stand up for his boss, Kelly betrays one or both. Or maybe he's just suggesting that Gold Star families should be like the gravestones at Arlington: seen but not heard; respected as long as they just sit there.
The third is that Kelly was supposed to be one of "the grownups in the room," helping contain and manage Trump. An anomaly in the Trump Administration: someone actually well qualified and, unlike De Vos and so many others, not ideologically opposed to the duties of his position. But here he might as well just say over and over, "I've drunk the Kool-Aid." He reminds me of Colin Powell making that war pitch to the UN despite knowing he was spewing lies.
15
You raise a point of ultimate irony: If Kelly is implying that it was wrong for the Khans for talking about their own son's death during a political convention, why is it okay for Kelly to talk about his own son's death in the course of defending Trump's inability to carry out even the most basic responsibilities of the CIC? It's double standards through and through.
2
General Kelly should be more concerned about the fact that this Niger incident is far worse than Benghazi in terms of the failure of American intelligence, military response and back-up support for the soldiers on this operation. Representative Gowdy needs to schedule Congressional hearings to uncover the associated failures of the Department of Defense and Secretary Mattis.
13
I'm sure General "Empty Barrel" Kelly has done his level best at elevating the discourse.
Which is to say he jumped into Trump's 10 foot hole and kept digging...
12
Lawrence O'Donnell on MSNBC delivered the strongest rejoinder to General Kelly's self-righteous attack on congresswoman, Frederica S. Wilson. He noted Kelly's Catholic upbringing in Boston. O'Donnell knew the neighborhood and Kelly's parish. He knew that some of the wives there were often mercilessly beaten by their drunk husbands. The women were clearly not cherished as Kelley stated. O'Donnell provided a short biography of the congresswoman, formally an elementary school teacher and school principal. There is much about her to admire. She is clearly not the 'empty barrel' that Kelly called her several times. Was there an air of arrogance as well as racism in Kelly's defense of Trump? His final claim was that Trump was brave to call the grieving families of our soldiers killed in Niger. Kelly had suggested to Trump that he make those calls. I wonder why he did that. At least, it would have saved the Johnson family additional heartbreak.
14
What really bothers me about this is that the Trump administration seems to imply that the family of Sgt. Johnson is wrong to be offended by his inept comments. Their feelings count, and should not be dismissed.
17
Kelly calls Congresswoman an "empty barrel" and in the same breath bemoans how we no longer respect women?Kelly should have quit after his initial statement..in continuing he proved that Trump in fact DID say "that he knew what he'd signed up for" and that trump is lying per usual.Why did trump send troops to Niger when he knew Chad was no longer protecting Niger["cause they'd been put on the "no immigration list"to USA]Why did trump hire betsy deVoss' family company,Blackwater, to find our men?Why has russia signed a new oil deal with Niger…were our men there to protect that deal?This is better than Benghazi.
14
What a sad and degrading way for everyone to treat one another. Who could expect more from these people whose only role obviously is to defend themselves and keep their jobs.
1
Too little, too late, General Kelly. 45 has shown himself to be a liar, to be thin-skinned, and to not hesitate to lash out at anyone who dares contradict him.
6
Kelly conveniently forgets Trump politicized the calls to the 'fallen' families, just two days before. Forgives Trump's lies about the conversation. Then attacks 'this woman' a black congresswoman for accurately reporting the insensitive words of the call. I think Kelly stoked all the bigotry this WH loves to do over and over again.
12
Why would Kelly spend his reputation defending someone who insults Gold Star Families?
9
Not to mention John McCain's service.“He’s not a war hero,” Trump said, adding “I like people that weren’t captured.” And let's not forgot the entire disgusting Republican attack on John Kerry's service.
How dare these people try to claim the high road. Trump, the draft dodger, has no right to comment on anyone's service.
It is clear that the same words that honor and comfort in one context, can be understood as insulting disrespect in a different context. The situation has elements of a tragic opera. The responsible path is to seek understanding and to apologize if insult taken when none was intended. Not to cast blame or argue about whose outrage is more genuine.
13
Kelly is becoming Deflector in Chief. His political reputation will come to be in tatters.
And, he misunderstood or was clueless in his attack on the Congressperson, who clearly wasn't eavesdropping and knew the family of the slain soldier.
3
What is going on is a clash of values. If you say to Kelly that his son was doing what he was meant to do it makes sense to him he is a military man: for the rest of us such a statement sounds offensive and painful we just want sympathy not glory. I suspect that what Kelly said was not something Trump would understand either, no one in his family has military values.
12
I was with Chief of Staff Kelly until he attacked Congresswoman Wilson. He called her an 'empty barrel'. He was stunned she listened in on the phone call. The idea that Wilson was there as a close family friend appears to never have dawned on him.... or the administration did not do their homework and inform him. He may have been an excellent military commander. And his personal loss is real and not many people can truly understand what it is to be a Gold Star family. But he lost me when he picked a fight with Wilson and inferred that Mrs Johnson's decision to let Wilson hear the call was wrong or broke something 'sacred'. How dare he judge her. And now his comments about Wilson have given Trump new life to his tweets attacking Wilson. Again.
43
It is disgraceful. Kelly is attacking a witness who testified on Trump's heartlessness.
This was not a sacred moment: it was a sacrilegious moment. The commander in chief offended a grieving widow and mother through his crass remarks about "your guy" who knew what he was signing up for. Kelly tries to shift the blame from his boss to a congresswoman who was there as a valued family friend and support.
Would Kelly's wife have appreciated it if a president had called her up on her way to retrieve her son's body, and called him "your guy" with no reference to his name, and said Kelly's son knew what he was signing up for but he guessed it hurt anyway.
If this is what Kelly regards as consolation, then God help his former soldiers and their families.
Disgraceful.
10
"3. General Kelly mentioned "war"..although, I totally agree with the term, the US has not declared war on anyone, including the Taliban."
We could have formally declared war on the Califate
Lest you forget, the Taliban declared war on Americans and all they believe in. And their Iranian allies chant "Death to America" And have carried out as many attacks on US soil as they can muster. You beleive we should have ignored the 3,000 Americans they killed on 9/11?
2
President Trump is not good at making such phone calls. In future he should not do so or, if he does, stick to a clearly defined script. Part of what.General Kelly said is that a presidential phone call is not rearlly consoling anyway. To speak to a grieving war widow is to risk an angry mailstrum no matter what you say.
6
Another soul sacrificed on the altar of Trump. Everyone who comes into contact with this man is diminished and denigrated by the experience— exhibit one: every person in the United States.
27
I have deep sympathy for Gen. Kelly over the loss of his son. No parent should outlive a child and when a child predeceases a parent, it is a loss of overwhelming magnitude. I've heard it said that the pain never really diminishes; rather, the bereaved parent learns to live with it. I wish the general much peace as he grapples, day in and day out, with the loss of his child.
That being said, I wish Gen. Kelly had taken his remarks in another direction. I know that his job is to work for and with the president and his interests, but I fail to see why the general, who has worked so hard to establish a distinguished career, should defend a man who would just as soon throw him under the bus as anyone else. To equate Rep. Wilson's remarks with "a broader decline in the values of an American society that no longer treats women, religion, 'life' or Gold Star families as sacred" is bizarre, particularly given whom the general works for these days. The man in the Oval Office has made it completely clear that he doesn't respect women, Gold Star families or prisoners of war (the Khans, Sen. John McCain), religion (the Muslims seem to be a particular target of ire), or life in general, considering that we've pulled out of the Paris Accord and Trump is trying his best to take out the ACA. If the general is bemoaning the deterioration of values and respect for others, he needs look no further than the Oval Office to see where some of that is coming from.
34
When I heard what Pres. Trump said, it occurred to me that delivered differently, those words could be part of a sympathetic call. I am glad to hear that Kelly tried to say the right thing but Pres. Trump was too clumsy to complete the mission. Some people like to think that Trump is always evil but sometimes he just isn't good at what he has to do as President.
3
For general kelly to bemoan the decline in American values and the vanishing of respect in public discourse...in the course of defending Trump adds irony to his eloquence
24
And while all this ado is going on the GOP continues to come closer to enacting the "biggest tax cut in the history of the country" FOR THE RICH.
17
Putting aside the obvious sympathy for his loss. His requirement that anyone who asked him a question had to know a Goldstar family. I hope when he asks questions of someone if they have a qualifier he should then feel his questions are irrelevant.
For someone who stands up for the men and women in the Military, does he really feel Donald Trump dignifies the office of the president and is mentally capable of sending these men and women into harms way. If he does then I question the credibility of the General.
11
I grant that Trump's comment to the grieving young widow, being ambiguous in isolation, is subject to contradictory interpretations, either supportive or dismissive. But the nation has terrible problems at home and abroad, and Trumps location daily of some distraction engendered variously by his stupidity or epical blundering are taking a terrible toll on the nation life and prospects.
4
one commentator said it all in one sentence today: "The fact that he visited the dead to console himself rather than consoling the survivors speaks volumes."
15
Kelly as a member of the military has taken an oath to the"commander in chief" to follow his orders. He has given the most impassioned defense of Trump I've ever read and I am deeply saddened by it.
Where is the integrity of this appointed chief of staff,to not only defend the indefensible but attack a congress woman who was present and dared to speak
"Truth to power"by repeating Trumps ignorant comments to a gold star
Mother.
Kelly oath is to follow orders of the president in military situations not
Defend Trumps ignorance and cruelty,under The guise of condolence.
13
As I add my 2¢ to the 3,000+ comments here I know that I'm am just screaming into the abyss, but sometimes that's all you can do.
While I am about the last person to defend Trump and was initially "stunned" by his comment to Mrs. Johnson my main thought was, 'why did anyone let him call?' I figured he meant something along the lines of what Kelly had said, but it's Tump. You know he's not going to be able to get the words out right. But because it's Trump rather than responding to the initial outrage with something along the lines of, "Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. That didn't come out right. What I was trying to say was...If my words caused you any additional pain I am truly sorry." Instead he folds his arms across his chest and lies. Again. Even after Kelly defends Trump's words, Trump still denies saying them. Of course the lies on this topic began days earlier when rather than answering a question about Niger he attacks former Presidents' actions. He claims that he calls. Not just that he will, but that as a past practice he has. Kelly said in his speech that he had just explained the entire practice to Trump 3 days earlier. But the funniest part of all this is the way Kelly describes Rep Wilson at the FBI office dedication. Sounds exactly like what Trump would have done. Sort of like trying to use military deaths to boost himself up and make others sound lesser.
Oh, and I'm pretty sure the original question that started all this still hasn't been answered.
14
Trump is a grown up man, with an advanced degree in business and years of experience with communication and talking. If he actually cared about the death of an American Soldier, he would have taken the time to learn the soldier's name (La David Johnson) before calling his widow (Myeshia Johnson), and he would have thought about what to say other than "he knew what he signed up for". But he does not care. He never served, and he thinks of anyone who is not a billionaire as a looser. For all his talk about honoring veterans and the flag, he just doesn't care for the people of this country. I don't think you're screaming into an abyss, but I do think you are giving the benefit of the doubt to someone who simply doesn't deserve it.
1
MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell quite effectively took apart General Kel and his criticisms embodied in "Empty Barrel" slander.
10
Don't take a call from President Trump. You risk being dragged into a political nightmare. Disconnect your phone.
15
David Henry: Perfect! It's great advice. Thanks for giving me my laugh of the day. I couldn't help enjoying the image: the phones ringing & ringing, no one taking the guy's calls, him depressed because he has no one to insult. Poetic Justice.
1
Trump calls Congresswoman Wilson "whacky" - code for just one more hysterical woman. A CNN commentator says that Congresswoman Wilson should "shut up", bringing back memories of Elizabeth Warren, Mitch McConnell, "she persisted", and Kamala Harris. General Kelly insults Congresswoman Wilson and tries to dig up dirt on her that turns out to be factually incorrect.
Stop attacking the messenger and stop attacking women.
I truly honor General Kelly's service and his son's service. I am so sorry for his loss and as a parent I can't imagine the pain of burying a child. However, yesterday my view of General Kelly was diminished. Why is it so hard for him to understand that the "he knew what he was getting into" line might not be universally welcome? Is he missing a sensitivity gene? Trump didn't know Sergeant Johnson so how would he have any knowledge of Sergeant Johnson's state of mind? Trump didn't know Myesha Johnson so why would he think it was ok to make a statement to her at such a grief-stricken moment about what her husband knew or didn't know?
General Kelly's comments yesterday were also sexist. He said women used to be held sacred. To my ears that is code for "barefoot and pregnant" in the kitchen. As a woman I do not want to be held sacred - I want equality of opportunity and I want to be treated with the same respect men afford one another.
23
Excellent reply. General Kelly, please take notice and redeem yourself.
1
I was very disappointed in Kelly's reaction. It showed who he really is. Of course I respect him for his service and his tragic loss. But everything else rings false. To call the Congresswoman an empty vessel while working for and defending the biggest empty vessel there is? That was disgraceful. And his "good old days" "when women were respected". Give me a break. This whole hullabaloo which Kelly seems to find stunning is all the making of his boss.
25
It strikes me as interesting that, of the four soldiers killed in Niger whose families received condolence calls from Trump, only one family appears to have gotten a call that was — to anyone with an ounce of sensitivity — shockingly cruel and disrespectful: the African-American family.
It strikes me as equally interesting that Gen. Kelly made an attack on Rep. Wilson, an African-American female, that was vicious and unwarranted to a degree that, to me, it betrays an underlying racism, probably on top of misogyny.
Has anyone compiled a list of soldiers fallen during Trump's administration, a list including who was and was not called and their race?
11
Yet another person more capable of being presidential.
I’ve been waiting for Kelly to show his true colors. He certainly did. And I’m scared. He used his son’s death to protect his mean spirited boss and to attack a well meaning Congresswoman. Sad.
19
I am so disappointed in General Kelly. He's lowering himself. He cannot possibly be okay with the way Trump casually used his son's death solely for the purpose of taking a shot at the object of his obsession: Obama.
13
Please, please. Stop the political theater.
The media is complicit along with an irrational president in tearing us apart.
This warrior was brave and gallant but the media prefers political theater to honoring him and his brothers in arms.
shameful
Semper Fi
The big picture is this: what are soldiers doing in Niger, why are their soldiers in Libya? Why are Americans all over the world, why?We are the new Rome, the current Evil Empire. Hundreds of bases, secret and not so secret---why???
5
On October 4, when this president was aware that the nation had lost four soldiers in combat, he said nothing. Instead he tweeted about Tillerson not calling him a moron and fake news. Priorities. It's all about how he has been victimized, and so it continues.
6
This is beyond ridiculous. Trump started this and now he’s the victim? He never reached out until after a reporter asked about it, lied about contacting all families, and - again - tried to bolster his own image by pointing to what he sees as faults in Obama and Bush. I feel sorry for Kelly that he’s been drawn into this. He won’t be the only person who has tied his reputation to this sinking ship who will be hurt. But what he’s saying is that Trump used Kelly’s words. The world knows Trump doesn’t have an original thought in his head. The idea that saying a serviceman knew what he signed up for makes sense when one career military officer speaks to another but it’s really offensive when it comes from the Commander in Chief who then had the audacity to call a Gold Star wife a liar. Trump works part time, financially benefits from being president, hasn’t a clue what to do, is uncouth and unmannered. Really, he’s just got to go.
6
I have to say it again: "Donald Trump's tongue is faster than his brain." This is why he always speaks without consideration or insensitive towards fellow Americans. Moreover, by sending US$25,000.00 to a soldier's family, who was killed by terrorists abroad is not a way to show sensitivity.
3
V. Latoche: Promising to send $25,000 is insensitive. Then not actually sending it is appalling. Guy has no sense of appropriateness. Guy has no sense of ethics. Guy seems incapable of normal emotions. Needs a medical intervention, now.
Never forget that the one who politicized this whole thing was Donald Trump, when he lied through his teeth about President Obama never calling families of the fallen. You reap what you sow, Donny.
11
Dear General Kelly,
Why are you not stunned by the empty barrel who is your boss?
Or do you reserve that label to insult women of color? Is this how you want to be remembered?
23
Nice try Kell, but you are merely putting lipstick on a pig, and it's not attractive.
12
Does anyone really want to say Kelly would use his son's death in combat to serve Trump He is not that kind of person. Hie talked about his son but also those soldiers in Arlington who died under his command. Do you think he was just being a pawn. Why was that congressman even there listening. Why did the congress wonan, after hearing Comey talk about the fallen agents who died in a gun battle with drug dealers, stand up and brag about how she had called up Obama and gotten the money for a new building. Politics, not concern for those fallen in Miami or Afghanistan, was the motivation. Kelly exposed the callousness of the Congress Woman who cared about TV time more than the grief of a widow. That type of exploitation is horrible and we can understand Kelly going to Arlington Cemetery, a place she had probably never stepped foot in.
3
"Why was that congressman even there listening. Why did the congress wonan, after hearing Comey talk about the fallen agents who died in a gun battle with drug dealers, stand up and brag about how she had called up Obama and gotten the money for a new building."
Because apparently she didn't. The funds were allocated years before she was elected. Her role was to make sure it was named for fallen FBI agents, a clear act of respect for people who die serving their country in law enforcement. It is being reported that General Kelly may have misremembered this event.
3
The congresswoman was a guest of the family, and present with them.
1
If her intention was to have the building named after the agents, that was all she had to say. But her bragging about how she got Obama to give the money reveals her real intention of getting sound bites and TV time and not honoring the fallen.
Mr. Kelly absolutely lost ALL his credibility by making the following statement while continuing to work for Trump -- "“Women were sacred, looked upon with great honor. That’s obviously not the case anymore as we see from recent cases."
16
As a former Marine I can state we all knew what might happen while we were in uniform and we accepted the risk when we signed up. However, we never used those words with our families as they would not understand the point of view of active military and they would be very upset. While those in the military understand and accept the risks, it is a callous mistake to use those words when speaking with the family of those that were killed. May all our fallen warriors rest in peace.
49
Kelly has remained silent after each and every one of President Trump's egregious words and actions, his campaign against the middle class and the poor, his support of a health care plan that would leaves millions of Americans vulnerable and in pain, his decimation of our foreign policy and of our reputation as the shining beacon on the hill around the world, his determination to wall off another country and deny innocent child immigrants peace, and the panoply of his repeated - bizarre - mean - deranged - insulting tweets that are a surreal way to inform policy or conduct the office of the Presidency.
Not one of these things inspired a walk at Arlington to reassess his complicity in this, his support of this President - and moved him to make a heartfelt address to the country he professes to love above all?
14
How is the congresswoman an 'empty barrel' that 'makes noise'? What does that mean?
Will a Gold Star family member understand? "The mother" and "the wife" say they don't.
Trump doesn't understand.
Gen. Kelly tries to explain, but the fog of war confuses and tears asunder. Peace is the answer that works. It brings finality and resolution to the suffering and the anguish.
5
General Kelly is, as Charles Blow said, dangerous. His comments only seek to gloss over Trump's erratic behavior and ignored that Trump started this entire mess by saying he, and only he, was thoughtful enough to call the relatives of soldiers killed in combat. Kelly does not take into account the feelings of the widow of Sgt. Johnson. Representative Wilson had every reason to speak out about a phone call that was poorly done, due to the fact that Trump has no empathy. Trump only want to one up the Presidents who came before him. Mr. Kelly owes Sgt. Wilson's family an apology because he did not stop Trump from making his phone call.
11
General Kelly was addressing the behavior of the Congresswoman. Why was she listening to the conversation. Good question.
3
The congress member was present, in the car, with the berieved, as her friend.
Good enough?
Why was Kelly listening? And considering he heard the call, why did he attack the congress member when it was Trump who lied about the call?
Now that's a good question and my answer is that he is, in his own words, an "empty barrel".
5
That's what friends do.
4
Can you folks get the facts from somewhere other than Fox? Why was the Congresswoman listening? BECAUSE SHE WAS INVITED BY THE FAMILY TO BE WITH THEM WHEN THE PRESIDENT CALLED. Congresswoman Wilson has been a close friend of the family for a long time.
6
finally! it's so nice to hear words of truth that are non-partisan and non-political.
and i'm glad he called out that Congresswoman Wilson who tried to take grass advantage of a solemn phone call. she really is an empty barrel.
1
Fox News quoted John Kelly stating that Trump expressed his condolences “in the best way that he could”.
Years ago I asked my eight year old son’s psychologist how to respond when he repeatedly questioned me, at his mother’s urging, why I said to her (and I had never done so to her or to my son. Though, interestingly she was diagnosed with a narcissistic character disorder by a psychiatrist) that she was a “horrible mother”. The psychologist suggested that I reply “she is the best mother she can be”.
The parallels are interesting and allow me to remain comfortable in my belief that Trump is not the person to expect to see decency, sensitivity, understanding, sympathy, let alone an inkling of empathy.
3
Innocent and brave young men willingly give their lives to save our Nation from the violence of war on our shores and in our neighborhoods. Their deaths are emblematic of our finest moments on earth. Their sacrifice preserves our democracy. Devoted to one another they save our families and communities. They isolate us from the brutality of a savage world lost in unending turmoil precipitated by the self interest of tyrannical leaders mad with power in search of self enhancement. Does it not then follow that our leaders must also be men and women of honor and decency devoted to democratic principles voiced in our Pledge of Allegiance? Are we not "One Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all"? Yet, our President disgraces us in every moment. He endangers our Nation with his reckless and self centered conduct. He does violence to our most fundamental principles. Yet, our sons and daughters still risk their lives and die in battles that should never be fought were a more stable and collaborative and peace seeking president were in office. The tragedy is that our sons and daughters die to save him but not us. That is a travesty of immeasurable consequence. We should rage against this man who dishonors our Nation and degrades the families of those who have died for all of us. These honored four should not have given their lives in vane. When next we vote let us honor them by selecting a president who deserves the sacrifice of their lives.
5
If T did not have such a reputation for bad manners, this might have had a different outcome.
As long as the president is a republican the outcome would have been the same.
Please. The entire reason this sensitive, solemn matter is in the press now is because President Trump chose to brag about his actions and simultaneously falsely denigrate the actions of President Obama and other past presidents. It was entirely inappropriate for him to bring it up and then to drag Mr. Kelly into it. Mr. Kelly looked like a fool defending Mr. Trump for doing this. The real issue we should be discussing is what happened in Niger that led to these tragic losses and how can we prevent it in the future. The Trump administration needs to get back to work on the real issues -- but they prefer to swirl up controversy to mask those matters.
8
Well, Kelly has his nerve - but certainly no longer my respect. Any blame in this sordid mess belongs squarely on Trump. Kelly's crocodile tears belie the fact that it was Trump who politicized the issue when he attacked Bush, Obama and other presidents for not being responsive. It was Bush who dragged Kelly into the spotlight, by citing his situation publicly. Kelly complains that Wilson (and others) listened in (in fact, by all descriptions, they were unavoidably present when the call came, certainly not eavesdropping) while Trump appears to have assembled a roomful of people to listen as he called - a pure PR stunt. Not unexpectedly, Kelly is nothing more than another Trump lapdog. A pity.
10
Did Mr. Kelly's son have a wife? Wouldn't a president call a wife rather than the parents? Maybe Obama did call...
6
My respect for Kelly just dropped to zero
14
What really appalls me about the situation is not the phone call per se (although not knowing the name of the soldier is abhorrent), it is that then Trump casually threw Kelly's grief under the bus to provide cover for his idiotic statements. What Kelly said is right to a degree, but he ignored the elephant in the room that the president seems to have no respect for the fallen because he will weaponize them if necessary.
2
We are sorry Mrs. Johnson.
8
And thank you, Mrs. Johnson, for his service.
I am not a fan of the way President Trump conducts his speech. His policies aside, he very clearly lacks the ability to unify with his words. That is really something for him to consider and hopefully improve upon as he finishes out his term. And yes, I hope he does learn to improve his speech, because ultimately that will be good for the American public. I would rather see him learn from his mistakes and do some good for the country than blunder his way through the rest of the term.
Now where it concerns this story: while this may not have been the most eloquent Gold Star phone call that a president has ever made, I have no doubt that Trump did so with honorable intentions. That lies in stark contrast to Congresswoman Wilson. It has become painfully obvious that she was sharpening her knives while listening to that call. I do not believe that General Kelly, a Gold Star father himself, would have defended Trump so vehemently if Trump's call had been ill-intentioned.
What's more, I don't think things like this are going to help the Democratic party. I think the Republican base will side with the Republicans, the Democratic base will side with the Democrats, and the 20% swing voters will see through the politics and look at the base intentions. In this particular case, I don't think this helps the Democrats.
5
I disagree. I think Trump’s words were offensive. The more important point is that this was not out of character for him. If he had generally shown himself to be a caring person over the years, this could be excused as a minor slip of the tongue. But in fact it is in keeping with his brutish behavior. He is not fit to be president, in many different ways. I am ashamed to have him representing me in the world.
2
Trump didn't even know the name of Sgt. Johnson, even the next day.
DID NOT KNOW HIS NAME.
So no, it wasn't good intentions. He did it because he felt he was pressured into, and Johnson was black. So the disrespect was intentional.
1
"I would rather see him learn from his mistakes and do some good for the country than blunder his way through the rest of the term."
Those aren't the only two choices. Congress could do its job, shorten that term, and clear the way for competent leadership.
1
Don't rail on Kelly for defending Trump; that is his job, and he will surely be thrown a bone for it.
Rather, rail on him for having extremely poor judgment when he accepted the job in the first place. What a way to be remembered -- first violinist in an orchestra of incompetents conducted by the village idiot.
16
Not this; there are far too many substantive issues on the table to tackle from foreign policy to healthcare to taxes to climate control to Dreamers to police reform to the Supreme Court Justices to trade policies to nuclear arsenal to gun control to even give this a second thought, let alone ink in the media.
2
Not sure if you are referring to Kelly coming out and saying what he did, or the press covering it. If the former, I agree with you.
1
Gen. John Kelly diminished himself by engaging in the same distasteful, denigrating behavior of his boss in referring to Congresswoman Frederica S. Wilson, an "empty barrel" and saying he was "stunned" that she somehow violated a "sacred trust" by doing what he was doing--listening in on the call his boss made to Myeshia Johnson whose husband Sgt. La David Johnson had been killed in Niger almost two weeks earlier. At that moment, Rep. Wilson was doing just what Gen. Kelly had earlier praised--offering condolences and compassionate support to a family who lost a loved whom she knew personally. I, too, am "stunned" and angry to see Gen. Kelly engage in "the politics of personal destruction" that have torn at the very fabric of the country in the hands his Commander-in-Chief. Sadly, it was he that demonstrated the very truth that "society no longer treats women," especially women of color, or the families of the fallen as "sacred."
26
Kelly was upset that a Congress member would listen in on the conversation. I on the other hand am upset by the fact that we have a liar in the White House that prompts a widow to need to have others listen in as veracity witnesses.
28
"I am sorry for any additional pain that Ms. Johnson - and in fact anybody whose loved one was taken from them while serving our country - is feeling now. I want to take responsibility for the present situation and I ask everyone to join me now in toning down the rhetoric and keeping in mind what's most important here: the recognition that our beloved service members voluntarily take the greatest possible risks on our behalf. The understanding that some of them make the ultimate sacrifice in order to protect our safety and our freedom. And the deep and continuing gratitude that we feel. If I allowed the focus to shift away from those fundamental truths then I'm sorry."
If this president can't handle a leadership situation concerning military personnel who are killed in action, how can he be expected to handle... any leadership situation?
5
This is a sad episode that didn't have to happen had Trump answered the initial question from CNN with a tribute to the fallen soldiers and say that the Pentagon is investigating the circumstances of the ambush.
Instead, he implies that he does more than his predecessors in honoring the fallen, with "tough" calls to everyone, and that he wrote and had sent, or was sending or will be sending letters to the families of the soldiers that died in Niger.
Then he brings in General Kelly personal loss, and to catch up on his lie about calling the families of the soldiers, he calls them.
The fact that he called the window of Sgt. Johnson while she was on the way to receive his body was in itself insensitive and likely based on his need to fix his lie before the next news cycle, not to show his respect. When it was clear the call wasn't received as Trump may have intended, instead of saying that wasn't his intention, he attacks the messenger as lying and political.
From Kelly's press conference, it appears that Trump did say what was reported. Trump apparently took the words that Kelly's best friend, a fellow general and someone who intimately knew Kelly's son, said to him in comfort, and then used it like the line in a script to say to Ms. Johnson, about her husband that he did not know (or possibly even remember his name). Clearly it was not well received, and General Kelly had to try to clean things up. Kelly's anger should be directed at Trump and not Rep. Wilson.
13
Did Kelly spend even 3 seconds imagining the pain his Donald Defense brought this widow?
Talking about how bodies are prepared was crazy.
Choosing this time to dredge up his old grudge against Wilson who is a family friend and who mentored the young man who was killed was also inappropriate. To imply her motivations were other than to tell the public what this widow said about feeling disrespected shows a tone deaf feature of Kelly himself. To imply some sort of eavesdropping on a speakerphone call he was also in on is some ugly stuff.
He ended up as did Trump, talking about themselves and not the widow. AGAIN.
21
How many more folks will have to share their personal Grief with the public because Trump Lied Again?
The Over/Under is Over/THE Over in Vegas.
5
I am a 70 year old combat Veteran of the United States Army. Even in the darkest days of the Vietnam War, along with our unceremonious return from that conflict, have I ever witnessed such a despicable episode in our Nation's history.
When the so called Leaders of our Country, the very people who sent these young people to fight & die in our defense, can't even take a moment to honor the sacrifice of a fallen hero without sinking into the political gutter.......Then you know that this Nation is in very serious trouble.
Do these people have no shame?..............Is there anything left that is Sacred?
9
I am beyond sick and tired of hearing all of the Trump handlers having to "explain" what he meant. Is Trump incapable of explaining himself? Why does he always need what he said interpreted by other people? I'd say it's pretty clear that Trump either doesn't know what he's talking about, so he stutters and stammers and deflects to someone or something else, or he's very clear in his message and sticks to it like glue even though most of the time it's fabrication. John Kelly, with all due respect for your service and loss of your son, you let yourself be thrown under the Trump bus like everyone who works for this slimy swamp creature and have tainted your legacy by doing so.
13
This is a typical Trump administration response from their worn out, pathetic playbook. They are trying to change the subject from the unnecessarily CRUEL and MERCILESS comments Trump made to a newly GRIEVING, PREGNANT, WIDOW. Period. At a time when the a president is supposed to be offering COMFORT and COMPASSION, his response is to stick a knife in her wounds by saying your husband knew the risks and basically, asked for it. Yeah Trump, he knew the risks. All soldiers know the risks. It is supposed to GO WITHOUT SAYING.
7
Kelly owns Representative Wilson a big time, public apology. Or, like his master, is he incapable of doing such? True integrity, General, is the capacity to admit that one has erred.
27
I despise Trump. But what I hear is no one giving him the benefit of the doubt for trying to do the right thing. I think he tried. Kelly though revealed more about himself than one thinks, and it is not good. He did not call out the Congresswoman by name. He said that women were revered in the 1950's. Really???? You mean the black women who had to sit on the back of busses to clean whites houses were revered? You mean the Irish Catholic women who got hit on Friday and told by the Priest on Sunday it was part of God's will were revered? Really Gen Kelly? They were revered? The women who were sexually harassed as a routine matter were revered? Maybe we should kick women out of the Armed Services to get back there Gen. Kelly, is that what you think? Really Gen Kelly? Really? America waits for you answer...
22
You know why?
Because instead of owning up/explaining himself (why he didn't, I'll never know???) he chose to lie on the Widow, Congresswoman,...
Which is why the General later gets involved and did you notice he didn't dispute their version of events.
This is all because Trump Lied vs explaining himself.
2
Were the Congresswoman's remarks really so upsetting that they required a full hour and a half walk through Arlington cemetery to get over? Time to put the big boy pants on, General. Didn't you know what you signed up for to be chief of staff?
31
I thought Kelly's remarks were very eloquent, and some of the media commentary about what the general said were arrant chutzpah. (I think if I'd have been the present --- heaven forbid, I'd have rephrased what Kelly said Gen. Dunsford told him when Kelly's son was killed. It's one thing to tell a fellow soldier "he knew what he signed up for," and quite another to say the same thing to a Gold Star wife.)
2
My son serves. If the unthinkable happened and someone said "he knew what he signed up for", I'd punch them in the face. There's no comfort in that statement. It sounds dismissive and lacking in empathy.
17
Isn't Trump the guy who's on record for attacking another Gold Star family in the summer of 2016?
22
"...fervent defence of President Trump"? This author doesn't understand what took place during General Kelly's remarks yesterday. The General cut the author and his fellows down. He put the domestic enemies on notice that your hatefulness will not go unanswered as in the past. There is no defense here...what you are witnessing is the long awaited offence against you who seek to destroy this Nation.
1
I am stunned by Gen. Kelly's sexist and racist remarks to Congresswoman Wilson during yesterday's performance. Not only did he not address her by name, but he made a derogatory comment 'empty barrel' which really should have been addressed to his boss. As far as women being sacred, apparently you have to be white to get that kind of treatment from Kelly, because he showed absolutely no respect to Congresswoman Wilson. Why isn't the press all over this?
29
Hey America you are a corporate, industrial weapons manufacturer complex with a war/police economy. The rest of us see through your hypocritical military duty, patriotic parading about. Admit it America you signed up long ago for your over the top, never ending military addiction.
4
Being a decorated General means you have served your country admirable.
However, it does not make you an admirable man. Nor an honorable one.
General Flynn, another Trump sycophant, is under investigation for his dishonorable behavior. It is clear from John Kelly's rabid "defense" of Trump's indefensible lies about what he said and how other Presidents behaved that he has much in common with General Flynn.
And this hagiographic piece which leaves out how dishonest Kelly's comments were AND adds insult to injury by letting right wing apologist Peggy Noonan "put it all in perspective"?? What an embarrassment for the NY Times for even running this story.
14
Kelly is just another apologist for Trump. I thought his attack on the Congressman was WRONG and mean!
17
Mr Kelly's defense of DJT does not erase the facts of the matter: the only reason that this story rose to headlines is because Trump(not the congresswomen) tried to turn his phone calls into a political win for himself. And once again we see the man for who he is: a self promoting clod, incapable of empathy, who tries to turn any event into a chance to make himself look better than his predecessor or his critics. Maybe Kelly should make the phone calls from now on. Maybe Trump can have someone write a letter on his behalf. Providing solace is not in him. These families are much too grief-stricken to have to endure being used by Trump to grab a headline. Pathetic man.
8
Gen Kelly I'm sorry for your loss but as a mother of an active duty US Marine, your words have no comfort to me . I suspect you have drank way too much Koolaid & are detached from reality. What you should have said is that the family deserve our respect and sympathy from all sides. Full stop. I'm sorry that you allowed your dignity to be besmirched by association with DJT & your continued attacks on Sgt Johnson's friends and family They loved him dearly including Congresswoman Wilson who by the way along with the wife and mother have names.
19
Hang on, Kelly. Are you going in on the Dems for hosting a Gold Star family at the convention and giving your boss a pass for what he did to that family? Is that your implication?
I know my comment won't clear if I use expletives, so you can read between the lines here: are you kidding me?
And jog on with the whole "people who have served don't look down on people do haven't" -- strangely, that remark suggests you know zero servicemembers. And you aren't on social media.
7
SHAME ON YOU, Gen. Kelly! How dare you judge the reaction of women who loved the young man who died in the Niger ambush!! They were in a car, going to the airport to receive the body of La David Johnson when Trump called with his cold message and they took it for what it was... not warm and heartfelt, surely!!! I am tired of old white men judging women, any women, for their reaction to the words of said men... judging from on high! If Gen. Kelly truly cared, he would have asked Trump to call the widow again and apologize for his inadequacy and to beg her forgiveness. But he knew that would never happen, so he blustered his way through an explanation. You are finished in my book, Kelly, gone over to the very dark side, and you have only yourself and your white, male privilege to blame!!!
18
I imagine that Kelly had to walk through the graves, it's quiet there, no one to tell him that he's drunk the Kool-Aid. I no longer have any respect for Kelly when he allows himself to be used to defend a crass, lying, woman abuser, even attacking a member of congress with a racist slur.
Probably he can't sleep at night anymore, or he's become as delusional as Trump. This is sad, that Trump drags down everyone in contact with him into the filth.
5
There is an old saying, as appropriate now as ever: "walk a mile in his shoes".........................
1
The Miami Herald is reporting that Kelly's attack on Wilson's speech at the dedication of the FBI building in Miami is not accurate. Funding for the building was approved before she came to Congress; all she claimed credit for (and not during her speech then but at other times) was for shepherding the naming of the building for two FBI agents who died in the line.
Kelly's statement was undeniably powerful and moving. But when he moved from his personal experience to a partisan attack that was not even accurate, he damaged his own credibility and reputation.
HIs nostalgia for a time when women and religion were "sacred" shows how completely he belongs in Trump's administration. Women were never sacred; they were stifled, controlled, manipulated, and kept in their place. I wonder how many women felt sacred in the 1950s. Harvey Weinstein's defense is that he grew up at a time when chasing the secretary around the desk was a joke, not a felony.
And it might have been nice for the NYT to update its article to take note of the fact that Kelly's description of the ceremony has been challenged.
23
It is impressive to me how General Kelly has chosen to help the disabled man he works for. Mr Trump lacks some basic human qualities of empathy and sensitivity exemplified by his frequent utterances requiring rehabilitation and reconstruction. Trump's narcissistic world view prevent him from smoothly addressing issues affecting others, including the people he supposedly serves. The verbal fusillades to even those on the same team add to the impression that Trump is crazy, yet he is simply disabled. General Kelly is the perfect nursing home healthcare assistant for the poor man.
7
Heartwarming to read a response from a compassionate, seemingly non-partisan Times reader. As 100% anti-Trump as I am, I was still shocked by the media's rabid an instantaneous attack on Kelly. As a psychologist, I watched the video 5 times in an effort to get a sense of where Kelly might have been coming from. It sounds as though he was either misinformed or misunderstood the setting in which the congresswoman heard the recording. It also sounds as though Kelly had offered Trump his own memory of what had been most helpful to him after the lost of his son. Then Trump, a tonedeaf man with no depth of feeling, delivered his own callous version of what he *thought* Kelly had said. Sad for the widow and sad for Kelly.
1
I'm so tired of Trump's staff having to babysit, cover up and making excuses for our President. This is intolerable. He has made one too many verbal mistakes on our military serviceman.
11
Why after six years of remaining quiet about the lose of his son, did Kelly feel compelled to talk about it in ways that trump could only dream of being able to do. I think that all Americans feel the pain of family members who have lost a loved one, especially during battle with an enemy that doesn't share our values. Again, my question to Gen. Kelly remains, why now? Did trump ask you to defend him?
6
1.Once again, a man telling a woman was she is allowed to say. "He said that the congresswoman’s willingness to breach the confidentiality of Mr. Trump’s words is evidence of a broader decline in the values of an American society that no longer treats women, religion, “life” or Gold Star families as sacred." General Kelly: It is only by women speaking out that society learns that we are treated as far from "sacred" which I guess you thought was the case because you didn't know how women are actually treated.
18
It was Trump who started this political fight with his talk of Obama and other Presidents, and then he brings Kelly into it with the mention of his son. Beyond me why he defended Trump who turned this into a political issue.
11
While I think that Representative Wilson's interviews are at times more inflammatory to the emotions of Sgt. Johnson's family, and she veers widely off topic frequently with her political agenda, it is sad to see General Kelly reduced to the name calling gutter level of trump when he calls her "an empty barrel". So much for the respect for women he talked about.
12
There is a world of difference between 'he did what he wanted to do' and 'he knew what he signed up for.' I guess Kelly has descended to Trump's semantic level and his verging on similar distortions of fact and interpretation. Looks like the "grownups" are heading into their second childhood.
8
So here we see the public evidence of General Kelly's shared authoritarian personality with the President.
A longing to return to an imagined age of American society and "sacred" values.
A resentment of those who have not served in the military and a disdain for differing opinions.
And this is the man we are counting on to keep the President in check?
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
8
People need to please learn to let go of their anger towards the President. When you are angry at someone (clearly Ms. Wilson is far from a Trump fan), you can interpret even the most well-meaning words through that lens of anger. The president is only benefiting from all of this he-said, she-said about what HE said. Every day people are bickering about what Trump says or tweets, he grows stronger, not weaker. These bandwagons of indignation that people keep jumping on are all leading directly to a Trump 2020 re-election. There is nothing he fears more than being ignored - ignore him and he will go away. Keep lending his words weight and credence and giving them more publicity and public debate, and he will be with us until 2024.
4
Your comment has merit but it's a lot more accurate to have it as a "He LIEs, She Said" context.
Because that's exactly what happened or the General wouldn't of gotten involved and attempting to demean her.
To his credit, (at least) he didn't claim she lied.
1
Kelly is nothing more than an over-paid Hessian (paid mercenary). Remember Trump's offer of 50 billion over the budget the military asked for? Kelly is bought and paid for...Kelly and the other so-called generals are now officially part of Trump's military junta. We are rapidly becoming worse than Turkey...Kelly's condemnation of any rightful criticism of Trump is frightening...
4
Looks to me like race and gender are part of the reflexive reactions of both trump and kelly. "that woman", "that wife", "that guy" - the omission of formal names by both of them just twists the knife deeper. No one says "that woman" unless it is in a derogatory sense.
And throwing shade on friends and family at such a time? Despicable. Kelly is damaging his own good name by defending trump's non-existent one.
11
General Kelly has my sympathy. He's trying to defend an indefensible action by his boss, and he can't resign as he's trying to contain a psychotic from doing more damage to the country. He did condemn Trump indirectly by quoting sanctity of women, traditional values, and gold families. The commentaries condemning General Kelly neglected to condemn American voters for electing Trump and what would Trump do after General Kelly is gone.
6
Congresswoman Wilson’s comments do nothing helpful. They embolden and draw in more Trump supporters. Why does a member of Congress find it necessary to be far more hateful in her comments than Trump has ever been. Keep this type rhetoric up and the democrats will we toast.
4
I agree with my mother on this one, "I'd rather live alone with the truth, than around a bunch of Liars."
Trump lied, no more, no less. Until he lies again, which will be very soon.
1
I agree. Most of yesterday on CNN was damage control... but by the news media trying to help themselves through this mess that they created.
They did a poor and insincere job of it.
After Kelly’s statement someone with some class and dignity at any or all of these networks should have said, “We’ll be right back.” And then they should have cleared the studio of everyone who was set to politically rumble over the freshly dead bodies of American soldiers and moved on to something like taxes, infrastructure, Trump’s disasterous appointments, etc.
Anything but this.
But that’s not what happened. And as evidenced by the unforgiving tone of the commenters here, too many relish at all costs the opportunity to bash this eminently bashable administration no matter who gets dragged into the mud.
2
I understand and sympathize with John Kelly and his feeling that the situation of contacting a parent whose son made the ultimate sacrifice for his country should be dealt with in privacy and respect and not turned into a political football. It should also be apparent by now that our President has no tact or ability to empathize with people going through emotional distress. His weak attempts only starkly highlight this inability to connect at an emotional level. You see him throwing paper towels at the attendees of his visit to PR as if it was a 50's game show when what the people really needed was assurances that their needs were recognized and help was coming. He popularized the term "you're fired" without the slightest hint that a person who is fired is often devastated and has their world turned upside down. I do not like this president and disagree with almost everything he stands for. In this case I revert back to a Murphy's law " Never try to teach a pig to sing, all it does is waste your time and it annoys the pig.
5
The Washington Examiner reported that Representative Wilson said that General Kelly’s use of the term “empty barrel” to describe her critisicism of President Trump was racist.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/frederica-wilson-john-kelly-calling-me...
According to physics, an empty vessel, the empty barrel, if you will, makes a louder noise when struck as there is more room for the sound to reverberate. Striking the barrel with water results in a muffled sound that dies almost immediately. The same can be said about people who make a lot of noise and bluster by offering their opinions without knowledge, whereas scholarly and informed people offer opinions and ideas based on knowledge.
I see nothing racist in this definition of an “empty barrel.” I support General Kelly. I support the President. I support Trump. Thank you.
2
What is racist is General Kelly calling a black woman an "empty barrel" and saying in the same speech that women are sacred. Clearly he believes that only white women are sacred. I am positive he and Trump tossed around the n-word in their private discussions. It is only a matter of time before Trump feels emboldened to attack black Americans with racial slurs publicly.
3
So I guess in Kelley's mind the Khan family was supposed to just listen to Trump's Islamophobic political rhetoric and keep their mouth shut on how direspectiful it is to the memory of their son, who died in service of the country. The only good gold star family is one who submits to being used as a campaign prop by Trump. I am very disappointed in that attitude. I can't even begin to address the myth that people used to respect women, Does he think women his age don't have memories or is he just clueless about the harrassment and sexual assault that happened back in his gold old days?
12
How hard can it be to show honer, respect, empathy and compassion to a Gold Star Family? Congresswoman Wilson was there for these people. The executive branch was not both in words and actions.
I believe these horrible political stunts are the way Trump has always conducted business. Cause chaos and spin reality until whatever deal is on the table works out to his advantage.
At the same time this insanity is being perpetrated on us the robber barons in the GOP are again stealing the nations prosperity from those who worked for it and giving it to those who don't.
This is a shame.
4
This says it all: “Nor did he acknowledge the irony in his comments. Many people accused Mr. Trump of failing to respect Gold Star families by attacking Mr. Khan. And Mr. Trump’s behavior toward women in an “Access Hollywood” tape was seen by many as a failure to respect women.”
Although you could change “irony” to “hypocrisy.”
8
I am so sorry for you lost and my prayers are with you and your family! How hard would it have been for trump to simply say that? To set down with the president and other families who have lost love ones in battle is a lot more personal than a letter or phone call. You should be ashamed Kelly! The congress woman was there because she knew the family and they ask her to come. I am sure the widow thought that the call was going to be supportive. It is time for trump and his cast of clowns to leave including pence.
5
We Americans need to come together and insist that Trimp be removed from office.
Right, left or center, it’s our patriotic duty.
4
Media appears to be giving Kelly a pass on the slanderous things he said about a congresswoman yesterday in his all-out speech to protect his boss. I do not want to hear anymore clap-trap about Kelly being one of the good guys--he's not. Kelly is owned body and soul by Trump and that's totally, blatantly obvious after yesterday's performance. I am disgusted with some of the usual media apologists who are giving both Trump and Kelly a pass. And now we need to know why we are in Niger. What happened in Niger that cost four soldiers their lives including one who was left alive on the battlefield. And what does Chad have to do with all of this and how may Trump Administration incompetence have to do with all of this. Kelly answered none of those questions questions yesterday. Neither did Mattes. Sounds like House hearings time to me...
16
This was not Kelly's best moment. As I listened to his remarks -- what he said and what he neglected to say -- I began to wonder whether he is pondering his future. Is his job as chief of staff in this administration consonant with his vision of America and with his values?
2
The one thing that surprises me is that Gen. Kelly would be stunned by the fact that the widow put the president on speaker phone when the call came through.
I think that most people that received a call from the president, if they were with company, would put the president on speaker phone so that all could hear it, after all how many times in your life do you get a call from the president?
11
Also not said was that there were other grieving relatives in the car who might have wanted to hear words of comfort. As if.
2
Takeaway: Rep. Wilson was essentially accurate in her quote of the President's remarks. Trump's lines were written by Kelly in a soldier-to-soldier fashion. Trump delivered the lines clumsily. They were inappropriate lines spoken, puppet-like, by a President who doesn't have a clue how to console.
12
As the daughter of a career military officer and spouse of a career military officer, I understood the apolitical nature of their service. Chief of Staff Kelly implied this extends to Gold Star families.
What this really means is General Kelly would prefer Gold Star families to never speak publicly about their grief and sorrow, to accept the elevated status imposed upon the dead by the living that their loved ones died doing what they signed up to do. This is blaming the victims in a good way and may diminish the grief of some. The dead cannot speak to validate such status..
General Kelly suggested strongly Americans cannot understand sacred sacrifice and recommended a movie. While some may find this effective at enhancing their understanding, individual Gold Star families telling their stories is much more effective in my view. The evidence presented by General Kelly indicated the president he defends had to ask how to respond, had to ask what to say. It was obvious the president did not understand and readily embraced the justification of blaming the victim and, afterward, a congresswoman, accusing her of fabricating the conversation when General Kelly’s comments suggested otherwise. Kelly blames the congresswoman for politicizing the sacred sacrifice when it was his boss who bears responsibility lying and for demeaning a Gold Star family in 2016.
In my view, Chief of Staff Kelly is coping with his own grief by an overblown sense of duty to a clueless president.
13
An apology and explanation from Trump would have diffused the situation. But no. Instead he lashed out and tried blaming others, as per usual. He said the widow and congresswoman were lying, lied about Obama and other presidents.
And Kelly. While I'm very sorry for his loss, his experience with loss and condolences doesn't mean others will experience and feel the same. Ugh.
8
While there may be "no perfect way to make that phone call" there is a perfectly wrong way to make it. After the Texas shooting Trump stated "It's impossible to imagine the grief of those who lost a loved one." Actually, no, it's not impossible to imagine. Mr. Trump simply lacks the capacity for empathy as a symptom of his malignant narcissism. Telling a grieving mother "He knew what he signed up for" is beyond crass. It's mechanical and lacks humanity.
7
Does the White House Chief of Staff normally hold press conferences? How many has General Kelly held before this one?
Although I have great respect for a family that has lost someone to military service, this press conference was obviously scripted. The emotion from General Kelly was real - how could it not be when reading that script when he lost his own son. But I doubt he wrote those words, and the timing was obvious after Trump's latest prevarications.
As far as Mr. Kelly being "stunned" that a member of Congress would "listen in on that conversation" - Congresswoman Wilson was obviously WITH THE FAMILY when the call came. If it was put on speakerphone so all would hear it was not the Congresswoman's decision.
Mr. Kelly, I am sorry you lost your son. You know by now what YOU have gotten yourself into working for Trump. I am extremely disappointed that you allow yourself to be used by this despotic juvenile.
13
Maybe the excuse is they/you can't Stop Trump from Lying so willingly and foolishly? But that is the Genesis of many of these incidents.
Trump CHOOSING to lie (or deflect) rather than actually explaining or taking responsibility.
Such Folks Usually:
1st-6th Grade, you're sent to the back of class with your desk facing the wall.
7th-9th Grade, Principal's Office.
10th-12th Grade, All the Students and even Teachers just hope and Pray on the 1st Day of School that person isn't in their class.
6
One general speaking to another (even about the death of a military person's son) is absolutely NOT the same thing as a POTUS speaking to a widow or other family member.. How could General Kelly think it appropriate to "mansplain" - using the same language and terminology as would be used between two military personnel - to a wife, parent, son, daughter, etc who has lost a loved one while serving this country? Tone deaf - the entire White House is tone deaf.
7
I respectfully disagree with John Kelly, it was Donald Trump who made this a political issue and not the congresswoman.
All of this was started by Donald Trump responding to the questions of why he had not commented or talked about the 4 Special Forces Green Berets killed on Oct. 4, and in his attempt to elevate himself, he smeared and belittled his predecessors in office.
I also think what was lost in John Kelly's mentioning the Congresswoman, is that from what I've read she was a close family friend, had known the family and knew the dead soldier from childhood, and was asked to accompany them by the family.
I think again Donald Trump who has been smearing the Congresswoman on twitter, is showing his pathetic smallness; and John Kelly didn't really understand her family involvement. When you listen to her talk about the boy she mentored and watched grow up into a man, it's hard to come away with the thought that this was a calculated exploitation of this tragedy.
Again, this is another low moment in Donald Trump's attempt to elevate himself as the most effective and involved Commander in Chief, instead we the most incompetent Commander in Chief who needs his ineptitude to be cleaned up by decent men.
Let's just hope this Dope doesn't bankrupt the country or bring us into a war with North Korea, to again move the target away from his incompetence.
13
For all of you who say, Let's move on, tell us exactly where we are moving on to?
More lies? More perfidy? more self-dealing?
16
Keneral Jelly’s tell is his claim that an empty barrel took credit for the $20 Million new FBI building in the Miami area. Jelly, the building holds over 1,000 people and is almost 400,000 sq feet in size. That would be quite a good deal. Actually, the building cost $195 Million to build. Funds for it were allocated in 2010, 5 years before Frederika Wilson took office. James Comey praised Wilson because in 4 weeks she was able to get the government to name the building for 2 FBI agents killed in the line of duty in 1986. That is what she got credit for, not for finding funds to construct the building. Only one conclusion is possible; Jelly’s recollection of the events are off because HE WAS NOT THERE. So, his “fit of patriotic rage” was scripted, incompetently so, most likely by Stephen “Stevie Wonder” Miller.
8
The late psychiatrist and author M. Scott Peck, in his book People of the Lie, observed that the lie is the root of human evil. The Liar-in-Chief confirms that observation with every lie he tells, spreading chaos and hurting others as he goes. Dr. Peck also wrote that those who are too close to that evil become corrupted themselves. We're not talking about literal possession by demons or capture of souls, but human evil exists, the corruption is real and obvious to those who have not been taken in by the lies, and one has to wonder if GEN Kelly has gotten too close...
7
General Kelly has sacrificed for his country. Sadly, one of his sons paid the ultimate sacrifice. As a citizen with brothers, a departed father and departed uncles who served in the military, I respect the military, and those that serve our country.
What perplexes me is why the General made hostile statements about the Congresswoman that were only part of the story.
Did anyone take the time to explain to the General that trump's call to the grieving widow was received by her, and it was on speakerphone, and,that the Congresswoman was present with the widow and her family?
Or, that the Congresswoman had a personal relationship with the fallen soldier and his family?
Is this a 'ready, fire, aim' group of imbeciles?
This is the same General Kelly who stated on a previous Sunday morning talk show, (if memory serves, Meet the Press), that he saw nothing wrong with Jared Kushner calling the kremlin to establish a ' back channel' to communicate with the kremlin to avoid the calls being detected by the USA.
Sound judgement?
Again, John Kelly has sacrificed; no one doubts that.
Perhaps the good General should do himself and the nation a favor and step quietly away from the maelstrom that is the trump presidency.
9
Once again the nation is distracted by a controversy of the dotard's making, launched by his obsession to throw-Obama-under-the-bus at all costs, while health care remains in the ICU and a stealth tax plan whose implications to his own still clandestine fortune slithers forward. It'd be sleight of hand were he sane...
4
With regards to Congresswoman Fredrica Wilson's actions, Trump brought this on himself. He attacked President Obama when he told reporters, "ask John Kelly if Obama called him when his son died". He continued by saying that GW Bush also did not call the families of slain soldiers.
Enough is enough. This man has built his political career with lies about Barack Obama. I believe Congresswoman Wilson was saying, "Enough with your lies!" It unfortunately dragged the wife and mother of the slain soldier. But Trump and his staff have to expect that people are tired of his lies and they will react the way Congresswoman Wilson did.
6
I am not condoning T for all the ridiculous things he says and tweets. However, in this case, the attack by the congresswoman seems premeditated. She knew T was going to call and had a plan to spin it negatively no matter what he said. Democrats, please get rid of this phony outrage. Remember the story of the boy who cried wolf.
3
Why anyone in the white house would let moronic 45 make those calls without following a script is beyond me. Despite General Kelly's heartbreaking attempt at an explanation, the fact is we have a sociopath for a president who is incapable of displaying anything close to normal human emotions. Let's put aside the 'he knew what he signed up for' misquote. Calling him 'your guy,' and not addressing her husband by name was just as insensitive.
3
Sad to see someone so competent and sympathetic have to defend someone who is clearly not so competent or sympathetic...
1
He threw his competency and sympathy right out the window last night.
The deference being shown to General Kelly by the right stands in stark contrast to their treatment of war hero John Kerry when he ran for president. Sorry folks, that election pulled you off the pro-veteran high ground forever. And remember, you all voted for a man in 2016 who ridiculed American POWs and declared that he preferred heroes who hadn't been captured. Your faux reverence for American servicemen will never fool anyone again.
9
Kelly has crossed the Rubicon, from revered general to political hack.
10
Gen. Kelly was sent out by Trump to clean up the mess Trump made of a condolence call.
Trump made a mess of the call because he is lousy at expressing sympathy and because Gen. Kelly told Trump what to say. Kelly’s advice was botched because Kelly didn’t appreciate that what words of condolence worked for him, a career military man, might be wrong for a young widow.
Trump compounded the error, as he usually does, by asserting that Rep. Wilson lied about what he said. Kelly affirmed Wilson’s version.
Kelly compounded his error by falsely accusing Rep. Wilson of attention-getting in the naming of a building. And he didn’t understand that the family of the fallen soldier had been close to the Congresswoman.
SNAFU complete.
And, of course, left unaddressed is why those 4 soldiers were killed in an ambush in Niger. Was it, as some have suggested, the result of including neighboring Chad in the the travel ban - the country with a professional military that had been operating alongside our soldiers in Niger?
This is so typical of this Administration. Unforced errors covered up by flat out lies and then disgraceful personal attacks.
10
Either on his own initiative or with a nudge from Trump, General Kelly engaged in an act of political damage control, which is a Political act with a capital P. He claimed responsibility and sought to explain what Trump meant by the phrase, " he knew what he signed up for." Kelly's use of the phrase comes from a shared military context honoring a young person who knowingly took up a risk on behalf of his country. This is not a context experienced by Trump and it is not the context of a mother not in the military tradition mourning the death of her son. Then Kelly went on to disparage a member of Congress implying she had intruded upon the phone call from Trump to the bereaved mother. In fact the Congresswoman was a friend of the mother present in the car where the phone call was heard by all. It is to be noted that the scapegoat here becomes a black female member of Congress who is a Democrat and a critic of Trump. Such scapegoating always plays well with the Trump base. We need General Kelly desperately at this time, but he did not handle this situation well, and he certainly was not "above" politics.
19
This is beyond pathetic. Trump failed to address the death of four Navy Seals for twelve days. A reporter asked him why in the rose garden. He chose to attack his predecessors in his unpresidential response. Trump asks his COS Kelly for advice and Kelly suggests words to use based on his personal experience after losing his son. Trump screws it up during the phone call to the soldier's widow as he has done with everything else. A congresswoman and the deceased soldier's family calls him out on it. Rather than apologize for miscommunication and try to make it right, he viciously attacks again and again. Surprisingly, COS Kelly chose to publicly defend Trump and continue the politicization of his own son's death. Trump follows up with MORE tweets attacking those involved who are dealing with tremendous grief. Why does Trump always treat those of a different skin color with such callousness? And why would General Kelly defend such a dishonorable man? Will we learn the absolute truth about why the Seals were in Niger and what mistakes, if any, were made? When will this tragic era of American politics end?
My sincerest condolences to the families of our brave soldiers who sacrificed everything to defend our freedom. Its become a never ending fight at home and abroad.
16
Michael D. Shear, an excellent stenographer. Apparently Shear didn't bother to investigate his story. Kelly lied about Wilson. Today's NY Times.
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One of the more important stories during the last couple days -- rather than the spectacle of John Kelly acting once again as the President's human shield:
Trump personally interviewed US Attorney candidates for the Second District of NY, the one he fired Preet Bharara from. The jurisdiction is currently investigating Trump's business connections.
One of the candidates (Geoffrey Berman) works at the same law firm as Rudy Giuliani, the other (Ed McNally) works at the firm headed by Marc Kasowitz, Trump's longtime personal attorney.
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I don't think Donald Trump is competent to interview anyone for any job!
The conversation was recorded ... the conflict is rooted in "race" .. many blacks hate Trump but have no reason why..... an extended on screen interview with the Congresswoman is in high order ...
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That would bring more shame to Kelly, if that interview were to take place. The Chief of Staff did not take the time to find out that "the Congresswoman" is also a citizen who has contributed more to her community than most.
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You believe that's why Trump Lied on them?
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Cutting right to the chase, as a 30 year Navy veteran, I completely got what General Dunford said to General Kelly. That said, what two Marine Generals, who happen to be best friends, can say to each other at a time of a grievous loss, is not necessarily something that ANY President, let alone one with no demonstrated ability to show empathy, could say and have a similar impact.
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John Kelly, the man everyone looks to for leadership, stability and adherence to the Constitution, is the same guy who turned to the president at a ceremony in Annapolis and remarked, "You can use that sword on the press." It was a joke; but it was a joke a toady would make, a toady who doesn't understand the importance of the 1st Amendment. When yesterday, Kelly said women used to be held in sacred esteem "but recent events have shown that's no longer the case," he demonstrated deep naivety, as if exploitation of women in Hollywood is a recent phenomenon. That he attacked a sitting Congresswomen for listening in on a call to the president, when he was listening in on the same call is bizarre. That he repeatedly called this Congresswoman with a history of personal and civic accomplishment an "empty barrel" reflects his own lack of character. And if high rank presupposes good character, I refer you to Mike Flynn.
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Telling a four-star General that his son, from a career military family, knew what he was getting into and died where he wanted to be is very different from telling the wife of a man with two children, who was in the military to make a better life for his family, the same thing. The General is showing his privilege when he defends Trump's words. When he says "there's no reason to enlist," he's showing just how out of touch this career military man is when it comes to the enlisted soldiers below him. No reasons? How about trying to get an education without the crippling debt that comes to the working class? How about trying to bring your family out of poverty, and you see the military as the only recourse? How about trying to escape an abusive family and you see no alternatives? How about a judge offering you leniency if you enlist? Many see few options but the military. And don't get me started on criticizing a black Congresswoman for "eavesdropping" who was in the Limo because the family view her as an extended member of the family, who mentored this young man and likely encouraged him to see the military as an option to achieve his dreams. That Congresswoman KNEW La David. The President and General Kelly obviously did not.
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People! We need to pull ourselves together and regain some dignity, decorum and decency. Trump was doing his best to offer condolences, clearly coached by Kelly. The well-meaning comment morphed into something clumsy and was received badly by a grief stricken widow. We feel heartbroken for this woman who lost her husband. We owe her a debt of gratitude that can never be repaid. But. To feast upon this moment of Trump-tackiness is adding more disrespect to the loss. We are focusing on that instead of the loss off the four soldiers? Not to mention it was a private conversation. Not to mention who hasn't stumbled during a moment like this? There are so, so many Trump moments that we should and do ridicule and call out. But this moment is not one of them. I am embarrassed and ashamed for our country right now. Typically it is Trump making me feel that way. We are turning mean and vindictive. I loved Michelle Obama's encouragement: "When they go low, we go high!" Can we go back to that?
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SO you are saying in effect Kellly "went low". Nuff said.
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Stop victim blaming. It is normal to express outrage at yet another of trump's repeated, unacceptable disrespect to private citizens who have sacrificed everything. No one else to blame than Trump, and Kelly, his comrade in disrespect. Give advice to Trump if you wish , but spare us the rest.
Trump dissed the mother and the mother's friend, the congress member, on twitter . Or did you just forget that?
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Kelly seems to see himself as chief of staff for, and elevated by, the military graveyard. From that pedestal he ignores the feedback of a widow and her mother, but vaguely berates a Congressman, a convention, another Gold Star family, even everything in America, 'aiding' his case with empty implication and some wacky facts.
Why doesn't he speak out in the name of all the Puerto Ricans who gave their lives for the freedom that America at times sincerely strives, in other instances insincerely pretends to protect, patriots who now see paper towels mockingly thrown over their graves? Why the selective indignation in the name of selective fallen? Puerto Ricans who sacrificed the best among them did not know they encouraged their most precious sons to sign up to be thanked for nothing in return, but to see the Koch Bro and coal plutocratic ceo profits and golf get valued over the lives they gave for the future of America, including of course their relatives, excelling and serving in other ways than by ultimate sacrifice brought for America´s future and for the simple human right of freedom from devastation here, now.
With this chief of staff we're all left chief of baffled for the sheer mischief that's perpetrated, egged on, enabled and legitimated.
Knee takers strive to restore the dignity of life and it would be nice if the constitution, voting rights, truth and popular majorities became sacred again too.
If you, reader, are black or woman, I advance-award you a Gold Star.
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I thought that General Kelly was brought in to control Trump. From recent statements by Kelly, it seems Trump is definitely controlling him.
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Trump is not the person you pick to deliver an empathetic message. However, now that he has a witness of some credibility it is clear that the words might have landed on the recipient and Rep. Wilson as insensitive, but the intent was not to do so. Intent is key here.
I can use the words "he knew what he signed up for" in a paragraph that would be an ultimate tribute to Sgt. Wilson. But you have to be very artful in saying this to the person involved. We do not have the entire utterance by the President to make a clear evaluation. It could have landed badly, and it apparently did.
I remember being hospitalized in total paralysis and the prognosis was that I would be kept for no less than one year before I could recover. Several friends and relatives uttered a phrase to me that was infuriating. I warn you readers never to say these four words to anyone in distress. Never say: "It could be worse." Lying in bed with a tube in my throat to breath, I can assure you it was no consolation to me.
As for Trump, who is generally uncouth, he comes out the winner on this one based on intent alone.
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Intent on Lying on a widow afterwards, noted.
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General Kelly not only gave a heart-felt defense of President Trump but also gave a lesson to the country about military service to the country. General Kelly is the best man in the country. He stands for old fashioned but still great values of self-sacrificing service to the country and personal decency. It is a pity that the New York Times and so many readers of the New York Times just don't get it.
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He also confirmed Trump Lied, which isn't surprising.
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The veneer of respectability that the media and others had cloaked Kelly in was ripped off by Kelly himself yesterday. He showed himself to be a craven, racist, misogynistic individual just like his boss. We get it loud and clear.
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General Kelly has got to feel some ambivalence about his new duty of coming to the defense of Donald Trump. I can just imagine the General's soliloquy
Talk about a study in contrasts: Here is one man, General Kelly, through years of service, who has shown loyalty to and made great sacrifices for U.S. military personnel, defending another man, who is a well documented serial liar, that claimed to have a bone spur to avoid the draft during the Vietnam Conflict and went on to brag about not getting any STDs during the era.
Such contracting characters could have inspired Shakespeare to pen another tragedy.
Meanwhile murky details are slowly surfacing about the circumstances surrounding the ambush of the 4 soldiers and the recovery of their bodies in Niger.
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The Samurai considered it an honour to die in battle. These men are professional soldiers, death is always near, that is the nature of the beast. Of course, everyone wants to get home safely but ultimately your job is to go out there and engage the enemy. All that training, blood, sweat and tears --
that's what its for. I think we could take a leaf out of the Japanese playbook. They understood the warrior's purpose better than anyone. When you go into battle, fight like you're already dead. All this wailing and gnashing of teeth and self-flagellation when soldiers get killed in battle is just uncalled for and unseemly. Soldiers die young, it's just a fact.
I am conflicted about criticizing General Kelly.
After all, he lost a son while serving in the military.
Sgt Johnson's wife of course lost a husband, his kids their father.
Earlier in the week via the White House we were told repeatedly Kelly was recticent about speaking of his son's death. He did not want it become a political issue.
On Thursday however, he steps to the microphone and does just that. Instead of simply expressing empathy for Sgt Johnson's widow and parents, his words effectively called Representative Wilson a liar.
He was ill informed though as he stated he stated he didn't know how she could have heard a private conversation when from the beginning, Representative Wilson stated Trump's call had been placed on speaker phone.
Kelly should have stayed silent.
In hid view, Representative Wilson was all wrong but not a sentence criticizng Trump.
As many castigated Trump for not calling the families of those killed in Niger, under pressure he did so. But in doing so, he and Kelly effectively added insult to loss.
America, it's obvious Trump lacks the intelligence, posture and temperament to lead the country. When we demand that he act presidential, he cannot, for we are calling for skills he doesn't have.
As a result, America just seems worse
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General Kelly: You have morphed into Sarah Huckabee Sanders. The resemblance is uncanny.
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“I thought at least that was sacred,” Mr. Kelly said, expressing dismay at other aspects of society that were no longer sacred, including women, religion and Gold Star families.
Soooo...like when your boss attacked Mrs Khan then? Trump hit your sacred trifecta going after her. Where's your outrage over that?
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Did Sgt. Johnson die with his best friends? Or, was he alone when he was found alone two days later? Where is the truth and the important information, Kelly?
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Right. What about the recently-discovered fourth body of a soldier? Why were these soldiers in Niger? We need answers.
1
General Kelly should've opened his (heartfelt I believe) Remarks with:
"My Boss LIED and here's why,..."
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I am curious what the price Mr. Kelly received for his soul was. I used to have a modicum of respect for him - no more. For your informaiton, the Congresswoman had every right to be present for and listen to the telephone conversation - you have no right to criticize her. And your lord and master's words speak for themselves - they are not , nor should they be, open to "interpretation" - I believe that your son is ashamed of you.
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Interesting that after Kelly finished speaking about what happens with the body of a person killed in combat, he moved on to denigrating a black female Congresswoman from Miami who was a mentor and lifelong friend of Sgt. Johnson and his family. Kelly went so far as to not use her name and to call her an "empty barrel." Is this an example of a "leader" or is this the example of a toady for an actual "empty barrel" named Trump who took it upon himself to demean a black woman for calling out the racist president for his appallingly insensitive and offensive remarks to his widow who was in the car headed to Miami International to meet her husband's casket.
Kelly is a disgrace and should be ashamed of himself for his hateful remarks toward the Congresswoman Frederica Wilson.
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None of this would have happen if we had an adult as President instead of a petulant child as President.
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Using his dead son to defend Trump is about as low as one can get. Kelly has destroyed all credibility and disgraced himself.
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General Kelly, the hypocrisy of your outrage is stunning... you bemoan the decline of respect and civility related to women and Gold Star families - look at your boss. The demeaning of women (epitomized in the disgusting Access Hollywood tape) and the disparaging remarks about Khzir Kahn's family, not to mention the offensive comments to John McCain about being a POW obviously didn't offend you enough to refuse a role in Trump's administration, let alone taking the position of Chief of Staff. You have no credible or moral leg to stand on.
Maybe you should have brought your boss with you on your contemplative stroll through Arlington.
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