I find it hard to imagine that there is a person in the country who would not agree that an undocumented individual charged with a serious crime - murder, rape, serious assault, etc - should be deported. The legal and technical aspects of the hand-over from sheriffs to ICE are less worrisome in such instances in the minds of most citizens because safety and security are pre-eminent to them. So where are the politicians to sort out the laws to resolve the issues?
18
The question that needs to be asked is how much MONEY does the federal government pay the sheriffs to house the individual once he or she has been released from the local jurisdictional hold. I bet the federal government pays the sheriff quite handsomely while the person is held in the local jail on a federal detainee while he or she waits for ICE to transport to the federal immigration detention center...
1
"The question that needs to be asked is how much MONEY does the federal government pay the sheriffs to house the individual once he or she has been released from the local jurisdictional hold.'
it's irrelevant. The person has to be detained somewhere. If not a physical federal jail then to a subcontracting sheriff. I would bet that it's cheaper since the federals aren't as careful with money as the local law enforcement.
Remember Arpaio's bologna sandwiches?
it's irrelevant. The person has to be detained somewhere. If not a physical federal jail then to a subcontracting sheriff. I would bet that it's cheaper since the federals aren't as careful with money as the local law enforcement.
Remember Arpaio's bologna sandwiches?
4
Two questions - one for each side.
First, when various local authorities (Sheriff Arpaio is the most well know example) tried to enforce immigration law, the pro-immigration groups were up in arms because only the Federal government has the right to enforce Federal law, it is not a matter for the local authorities to become involved in. Why, then, is it alright for local authorities to become involved in a Federal matter by declaring sanctuary cities?
Second, when a person is arrested, is he not immediately fingerprinted? And do the local authorities not routinely send these prints up the line to check for additional wants and warrants? Why, then, can the ICE personnel not be ready and waiting when the suspects are released? It seems to me to be somewhat inefficient if they need an additional 24 to 48 hours to be in place.
First, when various local authorities (Sheriff Arpaio is the most well know example) tried to enforce immigration law, the pro-immigration groups were up in arms because only the Federal government has the right to enforce Federal law, it is not a matter for the local authorities to become involved in. Why, then, is it alright for local authorities to become involved in a Federal matter by declaring sanctuary cities?
Second, when a person is arrested, is he not immediately fingerprinted? And do the local authorities not routinely send these prints up the line to check for additional wants and warrants? Why, then, can the ICE personnel not be ready and waiting when the suspects are released? It seems to me to be somewhat inefficient if they need an additional 24 to 48 hours to be in place.
6
It's pretty much impossible to know a person is to be released unless hes serving a sentence. Bail money might have finally shown up for instance.
ICE personnel may already be tied up on a number of busts and needs additional time to schedule a pick up. A local jail may be hours away from an ICE office too.
ICE personnel may already be tied up on a number of busts and needs additional time to schedule a pick up. A local jail may be hours away from an ICE office too.
4
Deporting illegal immigrants who have been arrested for crimes they have committed while in the U.S. - that's a good thing. Thank you to all of the cooperating law enforcement officials who are making this happen.
To all of the liberals, far-leftists, anarchists, pro-illegal immigration groups, anti-American groups, this is what the majority of Americans want.
To all of the liberals, far-leftists, anarchists, pro-illegal immigration groups, anti-American groups, this is what the majority of Americans want.
20
First they came for the immigrants, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not an immigrant...
If it is illegal to hold people past a certain amount of time, then all these ICE people are doing is putting lipstick on a pig - and it looks disgusting.
I have read too many articles about mistakes that are made when the intent of the law is not upheld - the rush to injustice, as it is. This is an enticement for more money for local forces, and it's not even legal bribery.
Because I was not an immigrant...
If it is illegal to hold people past a certain amount of time, then all these ICE people are doing is putting lipstick on a pig - and it looks disgusting.
I have read too many articles about mistakes that are made when the intent of the law is not upheld - the rush to injustice, as it is. This is an enticement for more money for local forces, and it's not even legal bribery.
2
MS, putting lipstick on a pig? Is that some mid-western saying?
4
No one is going after lawful immigrants. We welcome over a million every year of every race, creed and color from every corner of the globe. Illegal immigrants are another matter entirely. Calling illegal aliens (the legal term in our laws) "immigrants" is putting lipstick on a pig.
12
Does anyone understand how an illegal immigrant who is in the United States against the law and then commits another crimes has any rights?
Our Courts and some of the lawyers who practice there should also understand what the people of the United States want and they want all illegal immigrants to go home!
Our Courts and some of the lawyers who practice there should also understand what the people of the United States want and they want all illegal immigrants to go home!
25
Speak for yourself D Marks - I like justice and humanity in equal measure, and ALL of us are immigrants somewhere in our past.
Some of these people were brought here as kids; this IS their home. Some are being arrested by ICE by mistake. And finally - EVERYONE should be presumed innocent until found guilty. We don't need kangaroo courts
Some of these people were brought here as kids; this IS their home. Some are being arrested by ICE by mistake. And finally - EVERYONE should be presumed innocent until found guilty. We don't need kangaroo courts
4
MS - I agree that we do not need kangaroo courts, but these detainers simply give the government the chance to have the suspected illegal immigrants up before a court where they can have a chance to prove the guilt of the individual. They are not a presumption of guilt, but how many of the suspects, if given an appearance ticket on the way out of jail, do you think would show up for their court date?
When there is a valid risk that a suspect will not appear before the court, it is normal practice to hold them until trial. I see no reason why these suspects should get any different treatment.
When there is a valid risk that a suspect will not appear before the court, it is normal practice to hold them until trial. I see no reason why these suspects should get any different treatment.
2
MS, illegals arrested here are being arrested by the police, not ICE. ICE is deporting them and rightly so.
8
http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-farm-labor-guestworkers/http://www...
http://www.wbur.org/bostonomix/2017/06/23/seasonal-worker-visas-cape-cod
We are already paying a price, at the grocery store (and in other industries as well) for not having enough workers, and No, Americans are not willing to do the jobs. These articles are about people who would come here as guest workers, which is legal, but the administration isn't doing it's job to provide the visas. That highlights one of the biggest problems: it isn't about legality/ illegality of workers coming from other countries, it is about what those workers look like. So, if we want to tank the economy, again, yes let's get rid of everyone with brown skin who is willing to work to keep our economy humming.
I am sure that there will be a lot of negative comments to this, but rest assured that I have said my piece and your words will fall on deaf ears, since I am moving on to other topics.
By the way, my family came here in the late 1500's, un-vetted and took land from the true inhabitants, then helped to found this nation. I do not believe that I, or anyone else who is not American Indian have any right to moral outrage if people want to join the great American Experiment.
http://www.wbur.org/bostonomix/2017/06/23/seasonal-worker-visas-cape-cod
We are already paying a price, at the grocery store (and in other industries as well) for not having enough workers, and No, Americans are not willing to do the jobs. These articles are about people who would come here as guest workers, which is legal, but the administration isn't doing it's job to provide the visas. That highlights one of the biggest problems: it isn't about legality/ illegality of workers coming from other countries, it is about what those workers look like. So, if we want to tank the economy, again, yes let's get rid of everyone with brown skin who is willing to work to keep our economy humming.
I am sure that there will be a lot of negative comments to this, but rest assured that I have said my piece and your words will fall on deaf ears, since I am moving on to other topics.
By the way, my family came here in the late 1500's, un-vetted and took land from the true inhabitants, then helped to found this nation. I do not believe that I, or anyone else who is not American Indian have any right to moral outrage if people want to join the great American Experiment.
7
Are you a news organization?
Do facts matter?
There is no legal classification of an 'undocumented immigrant"
There are citizens, there are legal resident aliens and there are illegal aliens.
If someone is here illegally, they have committed a crime and can be put in federal prison for that crime for 6 months and then deported and lose the right to ever return.
If they committed criminal trespass on federal property, they would be put in prison. This is the same difference. Criminals need to pay the price for the crime.
Do facts matter?
There is no legal classification of an 'undocumented immigrant"
There are citizens, there are legal resident aliens and there are illegal aliens.
If someone is here illegally, they have committed a crime and can be put in federal prison for that crime for 6 months and then deported and lose the right to ever return.
If they committed criminal trespass on federal property, they would be put in prison. This is the same difference. Criminals need to pay the price for the crime.
17
Being in the US illegally is not a felony and should not be treated as such.
Arresting them and holding them in prison is a huge cost to taxpayers for no good reason. Most of the time people caught up in ICE stings are not a threat to anyone. More often they are productive members of society and business. Undocumented immigrants contribute greatly to our economy and are an essential part of the American work force. Please chase the real criminals. Most undocumented immigrants add to society and are not criminals.
Arresting them and holding them in prison is a huge cost to taxpayers for no good reason. Most of the time people caught up in ICE stings are not a threat to anyone. More often they are productive members of society and business. Undocumented immigrants contribute greatly to our economy and are an essential part of the American work force. Please chase the real criminals. Most undocumented immigrants add to society and are not criminals.
7
cjonsson - there is a good reason to hold them. They are accused of a crime and the odds are that if given a court date and let out the door, they would be unlikely to appear. If a suspect in any other crime is found to be unlikely to appear, he is held until trial. Why are these suspects granted special privilege?
9
cjonssson, Criminal illegals should be deported. Low wage illegal immigrants are a fiscal drain on Americans. They do not add to society. They receive welfare for their American born kids and for themselves with stolen and fake social security numbers, food stamps, free health care, free education for their kids (and with all the money spent on educating their kids hiring ESL teachers, special education teachers, speech teachers, counselors, etc. they have a high drop out rate) and then add the costs of their incarceration, and social services. They do not make up for this in any way. It is the middle class that has to pay for these people.
A few months ago, the NYT printed an article about illegal immigration with a statement by George Borjas, a Harvard professor, who "is a leading proponent of the argument that immigration produces substantial wage losses for native-born American workers..."
NYT article by Kirk Semple, "About 41 percent of all Mexicans between ages 16 and 19 in the city have dropped out of high school according to census data. No other major immigrant group has a dropout rate higher than 20 percent, and the overall rate for the city is less than 9 percent, the statistics show. ...the city may have a large Mexican underclass for years."
A few months ago, the NYT printed an article about illegal immigration with a statement by George Borjas, a Harvard professor, who "is a leading proponent of the argument that immigration produces substantial wage losses for native-born American workers..."
NYT article by Kirk Semple, "About 41 percent of all Mexicans between ages 16 and 19 in the city have dropped out of high school according to census data. No other major immigrant group has a dropout rate higher than 20 percent, and the overall rate for the city is less than 9 percent, the statistics show. ...the city may have a large Mexican underclass for years."
6
I don't really see how anyone can debate this law is good or bad, seems pretty straightforward.
If you are here illegally, you're breaking the law, when you break the law, you go to jail or in this case get deported.
It really is that simple and black-and-white, there's not many easy situation is left in the world, but this one is pretty easy.
You either have been granted permission to be in this country or you have not, how could it get any clearer?
If you are here illegally, you're breaking the law, when you break the law, you go to jail or in this case get deported.
It really is that simple and black-and-white, there's not many easy situation is left in the world, but this one is pretty easy.
You either have been granted permission to be in this country or you have not, how could it get any clearer?
20
I disagree.
The federal government is paying a local sheriff to hold a person past the time that the law & Constitution allows a person to be held. In normal life, this is called a BRIBE amd CORRUPTION.
Just because someone is SUSPECTED to be here illegally, does this mean it is okay to violate their legal rights?! How would you react if this same thing happened to you when you are on foreign soil?
The federal government is paying a local sheriff to hold a person past the time that the law & Constitution allows a person to be held. In normal life, this is called a BRIBE amd CORRUPTION.
Just because someone is SUSPECTED to be here illegally, does this mean it is okay to violate their legal rights?! How would you react if this same thing happened to you when you are on foreign soil?
7
It is not a bribe. Sheriffs are being appointed as fed agents and hence immigration laws apply immediately. Now we have to see Sheriff's contract if that is legal.
2
The Feds are paying the sheriff to hold people who are technically under arrest for a crime. The sheriff is just charging the feds room and board for them until they can pick them up.
Get arrested on foreign soil and see how well you are treated. Many hold you for a trial that doesn't occur for months. I used to go on runs to San Juan, PR to pick up Navy personnel being held in "La Princessa". They'd usually been beaten up by other prisoners and guards and robbed. They'd also be covered in fleas.
Get arrested on foreign soil and see how well you are treated. Many hold you for a trial that doesn't occur for months. I used to go on runs to San Juan, PR to pick up Navy personnel being held in "La Princessa". They'd usually been beaten up by other prisoners and guards and robbed. They'd also be covered in fleas.
4
Why not go one step farther and have the local law enforcement authorities take their prisoners to the federal detention facilities as soon as a detainer is received. In the case of those serving a sentence, federal law enforcement should be picking up the people they seek to arrest before the end of their terms and the rest of their sentence can be served in federal facilities.
13
The Trump administration is working with like-minded sheriffs from around the country on a plan to channel illegal aliens from local jails into federal detention, according to several sheriffs involved in the discussions.
1
Argue with this............I call it the cost of doing nothing:
"GAO estimates that costs to incarcerate criminal aliens in federal prisons and SCAAP reimbursements to states and localities ranged from about $1.5 billion
to $1.6 billion annually from fiscal years 2005 through 2009"
http://www.gao.gov/assets/320/316959.pdf
"GAO estimates that costs to incarcerate criminal aliens in federal prisons and SCAAP reimbursements to states and localities ranged from about $1.5 billion
to $1.6 billion annually from fiscal years 2005 through 2009"
http://www.gao.gov/assets/320/316959.pdf
8
Cheaper than the cost of re-rounding them up for deportation.
5
And to then deport them...but the lifetime of federal benefits from citizens costs far more.
Plus, we are a nation of laws.
Plus, we are a nation of laws.
10
You think they are cattle?
3
Honestly, some criminal illegal aliens (those who broke through porous border walls plus visa overstayers) do not submit themselves to documentation precisely because they already know that their criminal tendencies are not welcome anywhere!
The USA already has too much of its own home-grown sexual deviants (i.e. rapists, pedophiles), violent paranoid schizophrenics & other types of mentally ill w/ too easy access to weapons, sociopathic con artists committing white collar crime and romance scams, drug users & dealers w/ likely genetic predispositions to substance abuse, domestic abusers towards their partners and children, etc. to deal with.
Why should already manpower-strained, budget-strapped local authorities be forced to indefinitely house incorrigible, rehabilitation-resistant criminal illegal aliens?
Some complain about families with US citizens being torn apart &/or losing sole breadwinners; yet, is it really psychologically & economically healthy and sustainable for these blended US families and their communities' schools, workplaces, social svcs, etc. to be further burdened w/ maladaptive, unrepentant criminals?
We need to plug gaping holes in not only the physical border walls, but also in digital/biometric identification, through mandatory use of E-Verify by all employers, tight land/sea/air port of entry inspections, and giving a legalization path to non-criminal illegal aliens who are victims &/or witnesses to illegal alien crimes (abused partners/kids, etc.).
The USA already has too much of its own home-grown sexual deviants (i.e. rapists, pedophiles), violent paranoid schizophrenics & other types of mentally ill w/ too easy access to weapons, sociopathic con artists committing white collar crime and romance scams, drug users & dealers w/ likely genetic predispositions to substance abuse, domestic abusers towards their partners and children, etc. to deal with.
Why should already manpower-strained, budget-strapped local authorities be forced to indefinitely house incorrigible, rehabilitation-resistant criminal illegal aliens?
Some complain about families with US citizens being torn apart &/or losing sole breadwinners; yet, is it really psychologically & economically healthy and sustainable for these blended US families and their communities' schools, workplaces, social svcs, etc. to be further burdened w/ maladaptive, unrepentant criminals?
We need to plug gaping holes in not only the physical border walls, but also in digital/biometric identification, through mandatory use of E-Verify by all employers, tight land/sea/air port of entry inspections, and giving a legalization path to non-criminal illegal aliens who are victims &/or witnesses to illegal alien crimes (abused partners/kids, etc.).
7
They are being asked to detain illegal aliens for 48 hours, not indefinitely. And this appears to be a legal mechanism. Rather than detain them for48 hours, they immediately are transferred to federal custody, in situ, and the federal government pays the local jail to hold the detainees in federal custody. The local jail is not liable for any lawsuits, because the detainees are in federal custody, not local. Local jails routinely hold prisoners that are federal or state responsibility, so there's nothing unusual about it.
7
I remember when Arizona tried to secure its borders and the Obama AG, Eric Holder, sued the state.
We were all schooled as to who made the rules regarding enforcement of immigration law. The answer? The executive branch... immigration policy is a "federal issue, not a states issue"
The mainstream media pounded this point home.
Now that President Trump wants to enforce immigration laws, these same people (including the mainstream media, which leans left) are not coming up with the same answer to the question. Hypocrites and liars.
We were all schooled as to who made the rules regarding enforcement of immigration law. The answer? The executive branch... immigration policy is a "federal issue, not a states issue"
The mainstream media pounded this point home.
Now that President Trump wants to enforce immigration laws, these same people (including the mainstream media, which leans left) are not coming up with the same answer to the question. Hypocrites and liars.
33
It should be obvious that the key to effective immigration enforcement is coordinated border and interior effort.
15
It has been proven several time that the "detainers" will not hold water. Why does ICE continue to use them? It should be childs play for the Federal government, in the guise of ICE and ERO to issue a warrant in keeping with their "targeted removal" strategy.
1
They work in most of the country. It is only in a few very liberal jurisdictions that the judiciary has permitted lawsuits.
6
The Department of Justice has a new report that 41,554 inmates in federal prison are in the country illegally. That is more than 90% of the current population. These people need to be deported back to the countries of their origin.
24
But they dont want them back
2
"Of the 45,493 foreign-born inmates in the federal prison system made up of 188,658 inmates, the Justice Department said 3,939 are U.S. citizens." (The Hill, May 2017)
I don't know who taught you to calculate fractions and percentages, but if you think your figure is 90 percent of that inmate total you need a remedial course.
Further, you seem to assume every one of the 41,554 non-citizens in a federal prison arrived illegally, which is far from a logical conclusion.
I don't know who taught you to calculate fractions and percentages, but if you think your figure is 90 percent of that inmate total you need a remedial course.
Further, you seem to assume every one of the 41,554 non-citizens in a federal prison arrived illegally, which is far from a logical conclusion.
6
The 41,554 aliens, whether legal aliens or illegal aliens, are eligible for deportation.
5
The fact that progressives can't see their way to supporting the deportation of illegal immigrant criminals in jail proves who the real extremists are.
41
This citizen believes, wholeheartedly, that the most egregiously unresolved issue continues to be failure of previous administrations to make clear to 11 million or so illegal residents (and their would-be emulators everywhere) that “Bienvenido! Nuestro pais es tu pais” is not official U.S. policy.
It is reasonable to believe that goal can be reached if a president and Congress take steps needed to effect gradual exodus of illegal residents from the U.S., including the following:
(a) require all illegal residents to present themselves for registration and fingerprinting (as already required by law)
and temporary legal documentation for a period of, say, three years—long enough to prepare for required self-repatriation,
(b) extend e-Verify nationwide and mandate its use by employers (for checking the citizenship status of both present and would-be employees) and
(c) encourage cooperation of local police personnel with ICE in detecting and detaining undocumented aliens.--essential, because "local" is where
illegals are!!!
The current administration seems to be moving in the foregoing direction. Will the needed steps actually be taken? Time only will tell. And hope springs eternal. And reports such as the one here under consideration suggest such hope is not in vain!
It is reasonable to believe that goal can be reached if a president and Congress take steps needed to effect gradual exodus of illegal residents from the U.S., including the following:
(a) require all illegal residents to present themselves for registration and fingerprinting (as already required by law)
and temporary legal documentation for a period of, say, three years—long enough to prepare for required self-repatriation,
(b) extend e-Verify nationwide and mandate its use by employers (for checking the citizenship status of both present and would-be employees) and
(c) encourage cooperation of local police personnel with ICE in detecting and detaining undocumented aliens.--essential, because "local" is where
illegals are!!!
The current administration seems to be moving in the foregoing direction. Will the needed steps actually be taken? Time only will tell. And hope springs eternal. And reports such as the one here under consideration suggest such hope is not in vain!
20
It is not necessary for Congress to act or to grant a transition period. The law needs to be enforced as written.
3
If unauthorized foreign nationals are in our jails and prisons (at considerable taxpayer expense) then ICE should by all means visit these institutions and initiation repatriation procedures. Our nation is overburdened by illegal immigrants - people who sneer at our laws and hold legal immigrants in contempt. Deport them all!
37
I just read the article and noticed that PRESIDENT Trump is referred to "Mr" Trump while former president Obama is referred to by his previous title.
I've been seeing this, lately, on a lot of liberal sites.
I have news for you: Donald J. Trump IS YOUR PRESIDENT, and he deserves to be referred to by his title.
And you wander why people call you fake news!
I've been seeing this, lately, on a lot of liberal sites.
I have news for you: Donald J. Trump IS YOUR PRESIDENT, and he deserves to be referred to by his title.
And you wander why people call you fake news!
30
trump deserves NOTHING. He is a disgrace to the office; a liar, bully, misogynist, and totally incompetent. He has no humility or compassion and no moral compass.
I don't wonder why people like you call NYT "fake news"; it only has to do with trying to discredit through name-calling.
I don't wonder why people like you call NYT "fake news"; it only has to do with trying to discredit through name-calling.
2
For years the Feds let illegal immigrants languish in municipal facilities instead of taking custody of them. Naturally, localities don't want to be used as warehouses for ICE any more. It costs money. It incurs legal fees. ICE knows who is being held. If they're interested, they can go pick up a detainee themselves.
Illegal immigrants have violated Federal law. Its a Federal responsibility. The Feds need to uphold their end. They need to do their job - with Federal manpower - and Federal funding.
Illegal immigrants have violated Federal law. Its a Federal responsibility. The Feds need to uphold their end. They need to do their job - with Federal manpower - and Federal funding.
13
Whatever happened to common sense?
If an illegal (sorry to use the politically incorrect, but most accurate term) immigrant commits a serious crime, that person should be deported. I hold a green card. I am well aware of the consequences if I commit a crime. This is the single most important reason that I obey the law. I want to stay here.
I am all for immigration reform. The system we have now isn't fair. But it is, nonetheless, the law. Maybe there are extenuating circumstances in some cases. Fine. That's why we have courts and hearings. But if you steal or hurt someone and you're not here legally, sorry. Adios.
If an illegal (sorry to use the politically incorrect, but most accurate term) immigrant commits a serious crime, that person should be deported. I hold a green card. I am well aware of the consequences if I commit a crime. This is the single most important reason that I obey the law. I want to stay here.
I am all for immigration reform. The system we have now isn't fair. But it is, nonetheless, the law. Maybe there are extenuating circumstances in some cases. Fine. That's why we have courts and hearings. But if you steal or hurt someone and you're not here legally, sorry. Adios.
35
The legal term is illegal alien. You are a legal alien. If you are pursuing citizenship, you are a legal immigrant. There is no such thing as an illegal immigrant.
4
"The Ugly American" is getting uglier by the day.
We should improve our immigration laws to make it easier for people to come hear legally to work & contribute to the betterment of our nation of 'immigrants'. Establish a working guest worker program whereby low-skill workers can fill jobs many Americans don't want. They then pay taxes, contribute to earned benefit programs (SS, MEDICARE, etc...) and eventually become citizens. This would reduce illegal entries, deaths at the borders & allow us to better control numbers.
This country needs a steady influx of people both skilled & unskilled to undergurd our lower birth rates & growing aging population. In addition a diversity of people has proven to
energize innovative ideas & businesses. This positive outlook on immigration though is an anathema to those who only wish to demonize & criminalize 'other' human beings as if they were creatures from the black lagoon.
We should improve our immigration laws to make it easier for people to come hear legally to work & contribute to the betterment of our nation of 'immigrants'. Establish a working guest worker program whereby low-skill workers can fill jobs many Americans don't want. They then pay taxes, contribute to earned benefit programs (SS, MEDICARE, etc...) and eventually become citizens. This would reduce illegal entries, deaths at the borders & allow us to better control numbers.
This country needs a steady influx of people both skilled & unskilled to undergurd our lower birth rates & growing aging population. In addition a diversity of people has proven to
energize innovative ideas & businesses. This positive outlook on immigration though is an anathema to those who only wish to demonize & criminalize 'other' human beings as if they were creatures from the black lagoon.
12
All well and good perhaps but how do we deal with the illegals already here and with those in the future who still come here illegally?
5
Immigration is not a right! Come here Legally dont reward Illegal Immigration that cost the U.S $100 Billion a year! Amnesty will cost Trillions of dollars giving illegals access to more welfare. 70% of Illegal Aliens families receive 1 or more welfare programs burdening the tax payers.
Why should we allow illegal foreigners to drain U.S resources. Keeping them in the U.S will cost 6 x more then deporting them so deport them and use that money to help our Veterans, Seniors and Homeless Citizens
Mandatory E-Verify and cut off the welfare they will leave
Why should we allow illegal foreigners to drain U.S resources. Keeping them in the U.S will cost 6 x more then deporting them so deport them and use that money to help our Veterans, Seniors and Homeless Citizens
Mandatory E-Verify and cut off the welfare they will leave
18
What world are you living in, this is a fairytale situation you're describing, it will never hold up in the court of reality
2
Illegal migration destroyed LAUSD (schools) and much of LA's social medical services. And here’s a recent headline from nearby Orange County:
“50 days, 55 shootings: Gangs blamed for Santa Ana's most violent week”
It is great to see a POTUS upholding his duty … enforcing basic immigration law. We don’t need “reform” of immigration law (read: Amnesty), we just need enforcement of current law.
And I recognize that the wealthy want cheap labor and Liberals want social welfare-dependents (and Democratic Party voters!), but that’s turning America into a Third World country with pockets of wealth.
“50 days, 55 shootings: Gangs blamed for Santa Ana's most violent week”
It is great to see a POTUS upholding his duty … enforcing basic immigration law. We don’t need “reform” of immigration law (read: Amnesty), we just need enforcement of current law.
And I recognize that the wealthy want cheap labor and Liberals want social welfare-dependents (and Democratic Party voters!), but that’s turning America into a Third World country with pockets of wealth.
41
Its been decades since our laws have been enforced. It will take time.
It will take at least a generation to get America working again and to eliminate the welfare state.
It will take at least a generation to get America working again and to eliminate the welfare state.
8
Can someone explain to me why we have sheriffs? We don't live in feudal times, yet we give tremendous amounts of power to these semi-autonomous law enforcement agencies who are not tied to civic oversight the same way that local and state police are.
1
Most are indeed strongly tied to "civic oversight" for they are elected by the people of heir jurisdiction - who, if they aren't lazy or too partisan, can oust them.
4
They are the "local police" for most parts of counties that have not incorporated into cities. They are elected officials, as opposed to appointed city police commissioners. They frequently delegate their policing authority to city police forces.
1
Matt, Sheriffs are part of the law enforcement in this country. Law enforcement - it's a good thing.
1
What a concept! Deport criminal illegals who are already in custody before they can do further harm to an American citizen! 28% of those in prison are ILLEGAL ALIENS! And yet the left claims that illegals are more law abiding than citizens! Who of sound mind and not simply anti American/anti Constitution would be against such actions?
32
Hey Caitlin,
It's President Trump, to you. Even if you don't respect the man, you need to respect the office. and we all know that no one at the New Your times respects President Trump...
It's President Trump, to you. Even if you don't respect the man, you need to respect the office. and we all know that no one at the New Your times respects President Trump...
21
Brian M: So, you are telling the author that she needs to be "politically correct?" People still do have the First Amendment, and are allowed to express themselves how they want, not matter how much the president and his supporters would love to limit that right to themselves alone. Did you always refer to President Obama as President Obama?
3
"Under federal law, sheriffs cannot make immigration arrests because they are civil in nature, and sheriffs enforce criminal law."
That's the point. Undocumented people are not "illegal." At best, they are in violation of a civil, not a criminal, law. To which there are many "exceptions" regarding which reasonable people would agree, like Asylees, Refugees, battered spouses, children in dire circumstances - it's not a short list.
So it's hard to lump people into a category which those who like to appeal to our worst instincts refer to as "illegal."
Which means, the difference and the differentiation are both important.
Nobody wants anybody who does things which are illegal, anywhere, anytime, period. Well, except for for-profit prisons - which thrive on that sordid stuff.
Which means, we need to respect the distinction and the difference - if for no other reason than the simple fact that, when we don't protect everyone, at some points in time during eras of despotism, it's the only way to protect "ME."
In the meantime, the inability of ICE to get Sheriffs to go along has its foundation in good law and legal practice - things which, again, protect "ME."
That's the point. Undocumented people are not "illegal." At best, they are in violation of a civil, not a criminal, law. To which there are many "exceptions" regarding which reasonable people would agree, like Asylees, Refugees, battered spouses, children in dire circumstances - it's not a short list.
So it's hard to lump people into a category which those who like to appeal to our worst instincts refer to as "illegal."
Which means, the difference and the differentiation are both important.
Nobody wants anybody who does things which are illegal, anywhere, anytime, period. Well, except for for-profit prisons - which thrive on that sordid stuff.
Which means, we need to respect the distinction and the difference - if for no other reason than the simple fact that, when we don't protect everyone, at some points in time during eras of despotism, it's the only way to protect "ME."
In the meantime, the inability of ICE to get Sheriffs to go along has its foundation in good law and legal practice - things which, again, protect "ME."
13
Unauthorized aliens should be repatriated upon detection. They can make their claims for asylum in their own countries at a US embassy - not here. This is not their country and our laws are not up for negotiation.
10
In my opinion, the only important distinction is Legal or Illegal. Asylees, refugees and the rest should forfeit any opportunity to stay here once they commit a criminal act. This is an excellent, humane way for our nation to reduce it's ever-increasing prison population. Why are we housing these people at our own expense? Release these inmates and return them to their home country. Problem solved - no brainer.
9
While your civil versus criminal cite may be correct I believe that once deported or removed if said alien returns that is now a criminal offense. How many of these people do we read of who have been kicked out repeatedly and keep coming back!? That changes the equation and it's not all just minor civil offenses. (This doesn't even count things like identity theft, using false SSN's, etc,)
7
Would any of the multitude of liberals who read the failing New York Times please explain to me why they object to criminal illegal aliens being deported?
We are not talking about illegal aliens who have not broken any laws (besides the initial crime of entering America illegally....but set that aside for now).
We are talking about illegal aliens who are in JAIL! Who have been charged with or convicted of a crime....if there was any segment of illegal aliens that liberals would want to see deported, it should be this group. Because these illegal aliens are criminals - they are preying on innocent people - many of them immigrants - both legal and illegal....
But no. Liberals refuse to even acknowledge that deporting criminal illegal aliens makes us all safer.
All I can say is I pray that the people victimized by the criminal illegal aliens let out of jail in defiance of ICE detainers are liberal open borders supporters.
That would be Karma in all its glory....
We are not talking about illegal aliens who have not broken any laws (besides the initial crime of entering America illegally....but set that aside for now).
We are talking about illegal aliens who are in JAIL! Who have been charged with or convicted of a crime....if there was any segment of illegal aliens that liberals would want to see deported, it should be this group. Because these illegal aliens are criminals - they are preying on innocent people - many of them immigrants - both legal and illegal....
But no. Liberals refuse to even acknowledge that deporting criminal illegal aliens makes us all safer.
All I can say is I pray that the people victimized by the criminal illegal aliens let out of jail in defiance of ICE detainers are liberal open borders supporters.
That would be Karma in all its glory....
27
Hi. Liberal here. I have no problem with deporting criminal illegal immigrants, but I want law enforcement to do so in a way that's ethical and constitutionally sound. Spare us your strawman argument of liberals objecting to the deportation of criminals. And praying for people to be victimized? I guess Republicans have a different Jesus than the rest of us.
Your post seems based on several incorrect premises. 1: When an undocumented immigrant remains in the U.S., that's a violation of federal civil law, not criminal law.
2: just because anyone (citizen or alien, legal or not) is arrested does not make them actual criminals. Under American law, all suspects are innocent until proven guilty. I have no quarrel with your complaint about unrehabilitated aliens with convictions for serious and dangerous felonies on their records.
3: We are indeed talking about illegal aliens who have not broken any laws. That's because: A) as noted above, anyone arrested or charged with a crime is still innocent as a matter of law, until they've been convicted, and many are arrested on minor infractions, not serious violent charges; and B) ICE under Trump has not been deporting only the "bad hombres" like he promised during the campaign, but has instead gone after the low hanging fruit by deporting scores of people without criminal records, or those who've been leading law-abiding lives for many years after old convictions.
This article isn't even about the broad issues you've mentioned, but about ICE trying to get around the constitutional problems re: state police enforcing federal immigration law (that's a no-no), & holding people without a legally sufficient reason (same).
Immigrants, statistically, commit less crime than citizens, but praying for anyone, even those you disagree with, to be victimized is horrible. Have you no decency?
2: just because anyone (citizen or alien, legal or not) is arrested does not make them actual criminals. Under American law, all suspects are innocent until proven guilty. I have no quarrel with your complaint about unrehabilitated aliens with convictions for serious and dangerous felonies on their records.
3: We are indeed talking about illegal aliens who have not broken any laws. That's because: A) as noted above, anyone arrested or charged with a crime is still innocent as a matter of law, until they've been convicted, and many are arrested on minor infractions, not serious violent charges; and B) ICE under Trump has not been deporting only the "bad hombres" like he promised during the campaign, but has instead gone after the low hanging fruit by deporting scores of people without criminal records, or those who've been leading law-abiding lives for many years after old convictions.
This article isn't even about the broad issues you've mentioned, but about ICE trying to get around the constitutional problems re: state police enforcing federal immigration law (that's a no-no), & holding people without a legally sufficient reason (same).
Immigrants, statistically, commit less crime than citizens, but praying for anyone, even those you disagree with, to be victimized is horrible. Have you no decency?
1
Well stated. Do it if only to reduce the overpopulation in our prison system - which as it happens, is also a sore spot for liberals. Why are paying to house them? Maybe the money saved from releasing these criminals back to their home country can contribute to building the wall.
11
Many comments here show a lack of understanding of a core issue here. Once someone has served all conditions of a jail or prison sentence, there is no legal mechanism to continue holding that person in custody. Law enforcement doing so makes them liable for lawsuits, because it is AGAINST THE LAW. A hold request from ICE is not a legally enforceable order, it is simply a request.
13
Trump is in most ways a terrible president, but a busted clock is right twice a day. These crackdowns are reducing the flow of illegal immigrants across our borders. But we still badly need a national, mandatory E-Verify, which will prevent illegal immigrants--both border jumpers and visa overstayers--from getting jobs. We also badly need the Cotton-Perdue legislation that would cut legal immigration in half, because too much immigration is depressing the wages of American workers. And to my fellow Democrats: too much immigration is what put Trump in the White House. He became a contender only after he began running on the promise to crack down on immigration.
28
Laws that are not enforceable are foolish and dangerous. We have ample evidence that our current immigration statutes cannot reasonably be enforced. I know that many, including many elected officials, are reluctant to accept this reality, but unless we do, we will continue to waste time and money trying to enforce the current laws.
In addition, as we have learned in the equally foolish attempt to enforce our current drug laws, trying to enforce an unenforceable law readily undermines our civil rights. The courts have shredded the fourth amendment as they have tried to assist law enforcement in its doomed attempt to halt drug use.
In addition, as we have learned in the equally foolish attempt to enforce our current drug laws, trying to enforce an unenforceable law readily undermines our civil rights. The courts have shredded the fourth amendment as they have tried to assist law enforcement in its doomed attempt to halt drug use.
4
One can most assuredly make the argument that our current immigration laws can be reasonably enforced if only people would stop bending over backwards to thwart every single step of it, from claiming sanctuary nonsense to shielding aliens to clogging the courts with slow down tactics. Even here in the NYT comments it is evident that most people favor enforcing our immigration laws but the activist crowd and fickle politicians selectively play games with the laws.
17
Nonsense. Don't give up so easily. Of course nothing works if you don't put any effort into it - most people (except you maybe) already know that. Yet the laws can and are being enforced today with deportations up and border crossings apparently down. You'd call it off after only 7 months?? -Give it at least another 3-1/2 years to really see how it works. Perhaps your afraid the current efforts may highlight the law enforcement failures of the previous administration...
6
Law breakers are law breakers. Illegal is illegal. We should enforce our laws, or do away with them or change them......
45
The new proposal would simply empower more Sheriff Arpaios across the Southwest. See a Latino, arrest him or her regardless of any cause and turn them in to ICE. I would hope courts would quickly see this as nothing more than racial profiling and that there would be some severe penalties for wrongful arrest and detention.
8
Thank the heavens for men like Sheriff Arpaio's! While those like Will would excuse illegals from punishment simply because they had broken our laws already?!
17
Will, Sheriff Arpaio is an American hero. He had the courage to stand up for what is right and what is best for Americans and this country.
4
So this is life in Trumperica, where the Big Boss can make inconvenient court decisions go away by paying off his law-enforcement cronies. Of course sheriff is usually an elected office, so in theory we could vote out the ones on the take. But that also means that reform candidates will be opposed by the Boss's inexhaustible supply of dark money, deploying its armory of anonymous-PAC scare ads, fake news content mills, paid commenters (hi, Robert!) and phony-grassroots Astroturf organizations in support of those who cooperate. Ready for the multimillion-dollar campaign spend for your county sheriff's office? Well, here it comes!
5
The issue here is not about immigration policy. It's about the Fourth Amendment. Holding an inmate for an extra 48 hours is generally impermissible. Your sentence ends when it ends. Trump is reassuring the sheriffs that they will not be liable.. But he is likely violating the 4th Amendment anyway. Law enforcement is not allowed to violate the Constitution even if there may be a good reason.
14
But if custody officially transfers to ICE, even though the inmate is in physical custody of the sheriff (under contract), there is a window of time that ICE has to file charges or cut the prisoner loose. The counter restarts.
2
Unmentioned in this article are the times that ICE issued detainers for citizens and caused them to be held until they could prove their citizenship. These cases have resulted in expensive lawsuits for the localities involved.
7
Unmentioned in the above comment is the fact that there are very few cases where citizens have been the victim of ICE detainers, and in most of those cases, the claim of citizenship was tenuous, and the person in question was not culturally American because they grew up in a foreign country and could not even speak English.
Mistakes happen.
Mistakes happen.
7
I don’t care what reason is being used by the government to deport people who are in the country in violation of the law, as long as that reason is legal. Illegal aliens are violating the law and should be subject to the penalties of the law that they are violating; just like everybody else who violates the law.
45
If Trump and Sessions were serious about this, they'd be pushing for the only program that would be truly effective, employer sanctions. Attack the cause, not the symptoms.
But that would penalize white employers, and we can't have that.
But that would penalize white employers, and we can't have that.
54
About 25 years ago Border Patrol did most of the workplace enforcement, but that was gradually whittled away and no other agency picked it up. The institutional knowledge for that is probably gone now, someone's going to have to start from scratch on it.
4
Messrs. Trump and Sessions would love to go after employers who push for illegal migration or abuse legal immigration law, e.g., big tech companies, but every Democratic Party member and plenty GOP members would fight them.
2
If they weren't really serious about it, they wouldn't be fighting the left to remove them, would they?
6
Enforcing our immigration laws and securing our borders is just part of the much needed overhaul of what has been 50 years of the nearly uncontrolled, unplanned, unstudied, invasion of this country. Before we let any more people in, the longterm effects of this most fundamental change to the country needs to be studied. I believe a fair airing of the facts and numbers will show that not only should illegals be removed, but over all immigration numbers should come way down and birthright citizenship and chain migration should be ended. As the third most populous country on earth, we need to move past the emotional arguements and name calling on both sides of this debate and take a serious look as to what kind of country we want to have in the future. There is no more important determinant of that than the number of people in that country, which will be determined by immigration more than any other factor.
34
Al: do you know that without illegals, Idaho's agricultural industry would fall apart? US citizens refuse to work in the fields and processing plants not matter how much wages and benefits are raised. We found that out u=years ago in California when the illegals stayed away one year. who will tend your potatoes and who will work in the slaughter houses? Legal Idahoans won't.
2
Nonsense. The agriculture myth has been discredited over and over. Only 5% of illegal immigrants work in agriculture. And if they were as important as you say, I don't imagine many people would object to seasonal work permits for them. A work permit would make them 'legal' and 'documented' on a temporary basis - a win/win.
12
Legal Idahoans will if they are paid a decent wage.
2
I really doubt it will pass legal and constitutional muster in the long run, but I doubt that ICE cares. It took years to challenge Obama’s detainers. This will do a lot of damage, both to trust between immigrant communities and local law enforcement. as well as to immigrant communities themselves, in the short run. Plus, it will have to be challenged in dozens of jurisdictions and individual cases. It is essential to keep in mind that even though Obama, under tremendous grassroots pressure, eventually changed the enforcement priorities as to what to do with the information that was gathered through the S-Comm/AFIS database, the information continued to be gathered. Obama put the S-Comm fingerprint devices in every single county jail in the country, which is where ICE is now getting their info from. The idea expressed by Sheriff Bob Guiltier that “They are immediately in ICE custody. And what ICE does with them, that’s up to ICE. That’s not our business” is a legal fiction. It is like the argument made during the worst years of S-Comm incentivized racial profiling where the sheriff and ICE would pass the blame back and forth because ICE would say they didn’t conduct the initial arrest and the sheriff would say it was ICE’s fault people were deported. But thousands were deported after being detained for minor offenses like driving without a license.
7
I think most people think it is fine to deport people after catching them driving without a license, and especially those who've stolen SSNs.
18
If they are here illegally, then great - deport 100% of them. I could care less what it does to the "community" of illegal aliens in the country.
10
How does a detainer violate the 4th Amendment when a person is already in custody? Better yet, what does the 4th Amendment have to do with this at all. I would think the due process clause of the 5th Amendment would be more applicable. I can appreciate both sides of the argument for honoring detainers but it would be nice if those opposed to them would articulate a better solution rather than stomp their feet and leave the room. This problem isn't going away so pretending it doesn't exist is childish and unproductive.
13
They're not citizens, how do the amendments even pertain to them?
5
The detainer is an administrative warrant, not a criminal warrant, so courts have determined it has less power.
To me the solution is to set up a small team in each Field Office to turn these administrative warrants into criminal warrants and have a federal judge sign them.
Since most detainers now are based on fingerprint matches there is no reasonable doubt about the identity or alienage of the individual, so a federal criminal warrant should be easy to obtain. That warrant would then have the power of the old detainers and prevent people from bonding out or being smart.
To me the solution is to set up a small team in each Field Office to turn these administrative warrants into criminal warrants and have a federal judge sign them.
Since most detainers now are based on fingerprint matches there is no reasonable doubt about the identity or alienage of the individual, so a federal criminal warrant should be easy to obtain. That warrant would then have the power of the old detainers and prevent people from bonding out or being smart.
1
Such ignorance! The US Constitution applied to everyone who is in this country whether they are legal or illegal. read it sometine. Its a surprisingly short document.
2
I am a legal immigrant. By not mentioning that they are after illegal immigrants, it makes it look like they are after people like me as well. That is totally wrong. Whoever writes about immigration for the New York Times has to get his or her definitions straight. This is biased, false and misleading reporting.
Ice is after illegal aliens criminal or not who have broken our laws. They are finally doing their job. They shouldn't be handicapped in their efforts. These lawbreakers will finally get the message that it doesn't matter how long they have been here, they have broken our laws, they should be deported. End of the story.
Ice is after illegal aliens criminal or not who have broken our laws. They are finally doing their job. They shouldn't be handicapped in their efforts. These lawbreakers will finally get the message that it doesn't matter how long they have been here, they have broken our laws, they should be deported. End of the story.
62
I believe that the conflation of illegal aliens with immigrants by many of the main stream media outlets is intentional. You need look no farther than the reported crime statistics for your proof. When discussing or reporting illegal immigration crime, it is usually reported that “IMMIGRANTS” are less likely to commit a criminal act than the native born population. While the statement is true, it is also an intentionally misleading statement because illegal aliens are not LEGALLY defined as immigrants. There is no way that a population of people wholly made up of law violators is less likely than the native born population to violate the law.
22
Not end of story. There's broad support for enforcing immigration laws (yes even on the left) but the key distinction is whether the enforcement is done in a way that is legal and humane. It's easy to say ICE "shouldn't be handicapped in their efforts", but it should really give people pause when the "handicap" is the constitution of the United States.
20
C, one problem is that to many on the activist open border crowd, ANY enforcement of our immigration laws is inhumane, regardless of the conduct of the illegal immigrant. Thus adding "humane" is really a non-starter.
3
Wonderful. A soon to be marriage between federal and local law enforcement. Any historical precedent here. I can think of several from the 1930's both east and west of the Vistula River.
5
It's about time! Get rid of these lawbreakers. The Politicians won't do anything so thank you President Trump.
And sorry libs, I cut my own grass and cook my own food!
And sorry libs, I cut my own grass and cook my own food!
49
This forty year democrat says : "Go Trump!!" on this issue . The millions of illegal immigrants and the excessive number of legal immigrants are destroying the quality of life in the U.S.
55
Half with you. If we had secure borders, eVerify and no more illegal immigration, then we could pick and choose which immigrants to let in, and let in good ones we should.
4
What about the thousands of foreign-born physicians who provide medical services to underserved areas of the US, including, incidentally, rural Florida? Are these legal immigrants destroying the quality of life in the US? I would say quite the opposite.
3
How silly. They are like here legally! And they are likely not criminals. What an odd "argument."
Federal contortions "to circumvent local courts" that have jurisdiction over sheriffs: That sounds like a large red flag.
Certainly people guilty of certain crimes and who are in a nation without citizenship would not be permitted to remain in most nations. There should be a mechanism to deal with this that we would all consider legal.
Certainly people guilty of certain crimes and who are in a nation without citizenship would not be permitted to remain in most nations. There should be a mechanism to deal with this that we would all consider legal.
21
I am an Independent voter who support
kicking illegal criminals out of our
country. We all have a right to know
who is in our jails!
kicking illegal criminals out of our
country. We all have a right to know
who is in our jails!
35
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
4 th amendment prohibits detainers:: no judicial warrant precludes the detainer. Fishing for last names is against the probable cause clause. And holding people in jail beyond their allotted time is illegal.
Go home Trump. We have better things to spend our money on.
4 th amendment prohibits detainers:: no judicial warrant precludes the detainer. Fishing for last names is against the probable cause clause. And holding people in jail beyond their allotted time is illegal.
Go home Trump. We have better things to spend our money on.
13
Good! Deporting illegal aliens, who broke into the country illegally, shouldn't even be controversial. I don't care if they land in jail or not, show some respect for the law. Illegal is illegal, period. I couldn't care less about their circumstances. Deport every last one. If there is a need for cheap labor, pass a guest worker program that brings in fresh labor that comes in legally and respects the law.
59
Gather up the worst of the worst -- I'll transport and drop them off south of the border (they won't be making their way back, trust me)! USMC Vet / Ex-Pat Contractor Africa / Middle-East / Southeast Asia
17
Robert Mack, as the wife of a USMC veteran, I thank you for your offer.
1
Crazy to be supporting illegals in our jails. There used to be a joke that some Mexicans liked the jail; hot water, toilets and three meals a day. And something I've recently been informed of: racism in the prison system! I had no idea that jails are "segregated" as "Hispanics" do not like Blacks? Separate tables, separate bathrooms, huh? California a recent first hand report that maybe 75% of inmates were Mexican Americans, supposedly. I was told all functionally illiterate and they hate the Blacks who maybe are 10% of this County facility. I was astounded.
39
Riverside County, California. I do not know but someone told me the same in NYS and that the guards like it. Segregation?
4
Shockingly, in spite of the lefts proclamations, people will often self segregate. The criminal justice system is an extreme example of this. I guess, in prison, they don't find that "diversity makes them stronger".
6
We cherish our system because our elected representatives pass laws on our behalf and we expect all of us to obey these laws.
For heavens sake, our kids take a pledge of allegiance - with words " justice for all."
Sherrifs who refuse to follow immigration laws and not respond to lawful requests of the Federal Government are hardly delivering a "justice" to us the law abiding citizens.
After the crack epidemic and other issues, the Congress and the states toughened laws including "2 strikes and you are out".
Should not the Congress consider making violation of immigration laws including presence in the country a felony. It may not lead to more deportation but the laws on books cuurently will prohibit them from ever bevoming a legal resident.
It may be a better deterrant than all additional officers we may deploy.