The far right wants criticism to be silenced by their use of "First Amendment rights" as a cover over the face of intolerance of every kind: racism, homophobia, anti-semitism, xenophobia, sexism, etc.
Where they once held up a burning cross, they now hold up the Bill of Rights. The new hood of the racists is "Free Speech".
To violate and dishonor both the Cross and the Constitution- quite an accomplishment.
Where they once held up a burning cross, they now hold up the Bill of Rights. The new hood of the racists is "Free Speech".
To violate and dishonor both the Cross and the Constitution- quite an accomplishment.
4
THE SEEDS OF WORLD WAR III
The world is at a tipping point as it has failed to address the root causes of the worldwide conflicts which manifest as domestic and foreign terrorism; causes whose nature is unrelenting discrimination, at home and abroad, against the hungry, the poor, the uneducated and politically disenfranchised masses in search of work, self improvement, and opportunities for survival. This, in the context of increasing anthropogenic climate disruption, with the U.S. leaving the Paris Climate Accord, and unconscionable inequality between the extremely wealthy and the extremely poor, with 0.1% of the U.S. population amassing and controlling as much wealth as the bottom 90% of the population, including productive assets, with the top 1% garnering for themselves some 23% of the country’s national income and some 60% of its growth according to Investopedia; people whose inept corporate management, governance, and global leadership has led to the sorry state of affairs where 8 people own as much wealth as 50% of the world’s population, with longstanding stagnant wages.
https://www.academia.edu/23094646/OFA_At_the_Brink_of_Recovery_or_Confla...
The world is at a tipping point as it has failed to address the root causes of the worldwide conflicts which manifest as domestic and foreign terrorism; causes whose nature is unrelenting discrimination, at home and abroad, against the hungry, the poor, the uneducated and politically disenfranchised masses in search of work, self improvement, and opportunities for survival. This, in the context of increasing anthropogenic climate disruption, with the U.S. leaving the Paris Climate Accord, and unconscionable inequality between the extremely wealthy and the extremely poor, with 0.1% of the U.S. population amassing and controlling as much wealth as the bottom 90% of the population, including productive assets, with the top 1% garnering for themselves some 23% of the country’s national income and some 60% of its growth according to Investopedia; people whose inept corporate management, governance, and global leadership has led to the sorry state of affairs where 8 people own as much wealth as 50% of the world’s population, with longstanding stagnant wages.
https://www.academia.edu/23094646/OFA_At_the_Brink_of_Recovery_or_Confla...
4
A sad time when supporting Free Speech you are attacked as Trash. A lifetime member of the ACLU, I have seen versions of this battle many times. It’s a hard concept when what is being said you do not want to hear, but that is its core concept.
Now with the right-wing militias coming armed with combat assault weapons their right to that right is ‘debatable’?
Two changes needed: upgraded police intervention in crowd control by separating conflicting parties; but also judicial guidance on viewing weapons as themselves the equivalent of “shouting fire” in a crowed space. It can not be allowed; no constitutional protection was ever conceived by the authors of the Second Amendment for intimidation.
Now with the right-wing militias coming armed with combat assault weapons their right to that right is ‘debatable’?
Two changes needed: upgraded police intervention in crowd control by separating conflicting parties; but also judicial guidance on viewing weapons as themselves the equivalent of “shouting fire” in a crowed space. It can not be allowed; no constitutional protection was ever conceived by the authors of the Second Amendment for intimidation.
2
Let's be clear about something:
This isn't about speech. When an armed militia shows up in Charlottesville, carrying swastikas and shouting for the extermination or expulsion of Jews and minorities, carrying bottles of urine to throw at the townspeople, and engaging in violent altercations, then mowing down people with their cars, killing one....that's not speech, that's provocation, that's hate, that's terrorism, that's trampling on other people's' basic invaluable rights. And the Constitution does not protect it. It is well known that there are sensible limits to what is considered "free speech". The nazis and KKK have consistently crossed them
When the alt right stop inviting nazis and militiamen to their "rallies", drop the threats and hate speech, and start acting like responsible adults, then we can talk about free speech and have a civil, informed debate
This isn't about speech. When an armed militia shows up in Charlottesville, carrying swastikas and shouting for the extermination or expulsion of Jews and minorities, carrying bottles of urine to throw at the townspeople, and engaging in violent altercations, then mowing down people with their cars, killing one....that's not speech, that's provocation, that's hate, that's terrorism, that's trampling on other people's' basic invaluable rights. And the Constitution does not protect it. It is well known that there are sensible limits to what is considered "free speech". The nazis and KKK have consistently crossed them
When the alt right stop inviting nazis and militiamen to their "rallies", drop the threats and hate speech, and start acting like responsible adults, then we can talk about free speech and have a civil, informed debate
7
"but you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides." - Trump
Can Trump or anyone else pick out the "very fine people" who were at the University Of Virginia march on that Friday? You know the march where they were chanting "Jews will not replace us". Maybe it's just me but if I'm a very fine person, I'm not walking next to people who are saying that chant.
Can Trump or anyone else pick out the "very fine people" who were at the University Of Virginia march on that Friday? You know the march where they were chanting "Jews will not replace us". Maybe it's just me but if I'm a very fine person, I'm not walking next to people who are saying that chant.
7
The difference between Germany in the 1930s and the US today:
here people demonstrate against hate, principled people of power resign from the President's economic panels and panels for the arts.
I am very grateful for this. You are doing this for our children's future.
Thank you.
here people demonstrate against hate, principled people of power resign from the President's economic panels and panels for the arts.
I am very grateful for this. You are doing this for our children's future.
Thank you.
6
Thanks to all who marched against racism and bigotry. However, marches won't change things; showing up at the ballot box will. The Democrats, Independents and, yes, even Republicans need to put forward candidates who see their roles as a public service to benefit all Americans.
6
I wish the Donald would hire a bunch of Democrats so I could get a decent nights sleep again. And stop calling Hillary names.
2
Trump said "Our country will soon come together as one!”
This is indicative that Trump has no comprehension of the magnitude of racial bigotry and strife in our country!
This is indicative that Trump has no comprehension of the magnitude of racial bigotry and strife in our country!
6
I'm glad that people turn out to confront the white supremacists, if that is what they are, but we are a poor country, getting poorer every day, and in poor countries people do fight each other! The real enemy is the big money that keeps people down, won't even pay a living wage or support education and healthcare for all. Until we defeat THEM, everything will get worse, and people will fight each other. marthastephens.wordpress.com
2
The left (and many commenters) are now calling the Free Speech demonstrators Nazi's and KKK members. That is facism.
4
Actually, just last week, Trump and the alt-right were calling the protestors "anti-fascist". Time to get your terminology straight: are decent people who stand up to racism and hate now called fascist or anti-fascist? Personally, I call them patriots.
8
Events like these give me hope in humanity.
Not to sound racist but after Trump victory part of me started to believe white people were inherently racist and power hungry.
This weekend proves I was just overwhelmed by the horror of the Alt-Right.
Thank you to all who attended.
I am happy to be wrong.
Not to sound racist but after Trump victory part of me started to believe white people were inherently racist and power hungry.
This weekend proves I was just overwhelmed by the horror of the Alt-Right.
Thank you to all who attended.
I am happy to be wrong.
8
While judging the reactions of Trump to the rallies and marches it perhaps might help if we remember that were it not for the wide gaze of the media, he would don a hood. His abhorrence for non-Caucasian, non Christian immigrants stems from a fundamental place - from deep inside. His hatred of Obama stems from a fundamental place - deep inside. To the extent that his supporters and party members choose to ignore such hideousness, they implicitly wear one too. And there in lies the true danger that we face. It is not just the visible hate of the KKK and neo-Nazis but of those that we do not directly see.
9
Thank you Boston for showing America and the world what our president was too much a coward to show: that white supremacy, the KKK, and neo-nazis have no place in civilized society. Only in actions by the people, not sorry leaders, can these racist, hate groups be defeated and sent to the dustbin of history where they belong. Thanks, Boston!
11
The free speech people do live in the US and can speak as they wish, but that doesn't mean anyone will accept their lame and weak beliefs. This is what they are really whining about when they say their free speech is limited. When they speak most people think "Hey, this is a stupid Nazi, or a racist KKK guy". They should just accept the wink and a nod racism of Jeff Sessions and the GOP. The war on drugs is coming back to target minority communities and voter suppression will target the poor. The racists should be happy that even if they get ridiculed for their insane beliefs, their policies are being applied.
5
How can you become so insecure that you start to fear all Jews, all Muslims, all African-Americans, all Mexicans etc. alike?
You have to be brainwashed by false ideologies, of course, but then the question becomes: how can you become a victim to those ideologies?
I only see one answer to that question: self-hate. Goebbels famously wrote in his 1923-1933 diary that he often dreamed about being persecuted by a Jewish rabbi, who yelled "hate!" at him, and he yelled the same word back at the rabbi. All while running away as fast as he could, he nevertheless managed to stay a few steps in front of him, and he wondered whether that meant that in real life too, he would be able to escape from "the Jew".
The persecution and murdering of Jews has unfortunately already started in the Middle Ages, in Europe, and there too, it's the abbots and clergy with the most self-hatred (and who often are most struggling with their own sexuality) that become the most vocal advocates for the systematic killing of Jews. Already in the Middle Ages, Christians try to reassure themselves by claiming that they are "superior" and trying to really believe that idea through the elimination of those who seem to be different (whether through expulsion or outright murder).
We cannot just remember how factually false these ideologies are. If we really want to get rid of them, we also need to focus on finding a way to help those people hate themselves less, because that's the only path to hating others less.
You have to be brainwashed by false ideologies, of course, but then the question becomes: how can you become a victim to those ideologies?
I only see one answer to that question: self-hate. Goebbels famously wrote in his 1923-1933 diary that he often dreamed about being persecuted by a Jewish rabbi, who yelled "hate!" at him, and he yelled the same word back at the rabbi. All while running away as fast as he could, he nevertheless managed to stay a few steps in front of him, and he wondered whether that meant that in real life too, he would be able to escape from "the Jew".
The persecution and murdering of Jews has unfortunately already started in the Middle Ages, in Europe, and there too, it's the abbots and clergy with the most self-hatred (and who often are most struggling with their own sexuality) that become the most vocal advocates for the systematic killing of Jews. Already in the Middle Ages, Christians try to reassure themselves by claiming that they are "superior" and trying to really believe that idea through the elimination of those who seem to be different (whether through expulsion or outright murder).
We cannot just remember how factually false these ideologies are. If we really want to get rid of them, we also need to focus on finding a way to help those people hate themselves less, because that's the only path to hating others less.
3
Lying lip service from Satan.
2
Wow, the white supremacists went from all that in-your-face chanting, intimidating and sloganeering in Charlottesville to whining about how their "free speech" was somehow shut down in Boston yesterday simply because they were vastly outnumbered by counter-protestors who exposed them as the outliers they are, who have no acceptable role in American society.
13
The only reason he tweeted his faint praise (and initially he spelled "heal" as "heel" before the tweet was taken down and posted again with the correct spelling) is because he's losing money: for the past several days organizations have announced that they're not holding their big expensive fund-raisers and other events at Mar-a-Lago to protest his statements earlier in the week equating neo-Nazis and the Klan with counter-protestors and suggesting that some Nazis are "good people." That's the ONLY reason: money. All he cares about his the almighty dollar, he even said during his campaign that he'd make a lot of money off of being president. The man is repugnant beyond belief.
11
What does Trump mean when he says, "our country will soon come together as one" while at the same time he's working as hard as he can to exclude Hispanics and Muslims. Does he mean we will all soon be white anglo-Protestants? and what happens to those who don't fit that mold???????????
2
Now enough people have risen to speak and stand against white supremacy and Nazism. Now we know who the majority of Americans are. Now it's OK to let that tiny minority of hateful people have their rallies and speeches with little or no notice because that's all they deserve. They were a fringe before Charlottesville and they will always be a fringe. Now if the news media will just do the same.
4
Is this clown real ?
NOT
NOT
1
Don't count on this 71 year-old narcissist changing his stripes, after barely one week. He'll be back to his old ways on Monday morning.
https://thetruthoncommonsense.com
https://thetruthoncommonsense.com
1
What the KKK and White Supremacists don't get, is that the free speech is about the exchange of ideas, i.e. dueling with the weapon located between your ears. It is not about making threats with the weapon clenched in your hand , or slung over your shoulder.
9
Tolerance of intolerance is not the exercise of it, it's the end of it.
Racism isn't just a "difference of opinion". And those that practice it, such as Trump, should not be tolerated, instead, they should be thrown in jail.
Racism isn't just a "difference of opinion". And those that practice it, such as Trump, should not be tolerated, instead, they should be thrown in jail.
7
One way to exhibit intolerance is to attempt to de-legitimize anyone who doesn't agree with you by labeling them racist. Our "progressives" use that tactic all the time.
4
I'm not de-legitimizing anyone who doesn't agree with me, I'm de-legitimizing racists - A term that is only "nebulous" to their apologists.
Yours is a false equivalence defense of the indefensible.
Yours is a false equivalence defense of the indefensible.
2
Thank you Boston for showing America and the world what our president was too much a coward to show: that white supremacy and neo nazis have no place in this decent civilized society.
8
The politics behind the recent demonstrations are based on the belief of Democrats that Trump and his ilk are not entitled to rule the country. The Democrats have not accepted their loss in the election and are attacking Trump's legitimacy based on his politics. The system protects a President's right to rule as long as he does not commit a crime. Democrats have chosen not to follow the system and to do what they can to undermine Trump's legitimacy. Aggressive efforts of this sort are legal but virtually unprecedented. The Democrats are allowed to scheme to undermine Trump but it's not the way the game is supposed to be played.
1
A president does not "rule" they govern. The difference is a subject is ruled, a citizen is governed.
9
Clearly you were in a coma during Obama's presidency if you think the resistance to Trump is unprecedented. "Recent" demonstrations were due to Trump's apparent (putting the kindest spin on it) support for racist neo-nazis. It isn't a game.
9
So tired of you Trumpists saying Democrats can't get over losing the election. Do try to stop beating like a goat. There wasn't this kind of reaction to previous Republican governments. Trump is APPALLING. Your country has, sadly, become a laughing stock because of his idiocy. He is enabling racists and white supremacists. He has zero understanding of policy; his mantra, like a petulant child, is to dismantle everything Obama did, even to the detriment of millions of Americans (including the ones who voted for him) He is endangering the world because of his extreme narcissism and lack of intelligence. Republicans are cravenly suppporting him. They used to be a party of conscience - no longer. These are facts, not "alternative facts." Trump will be judged, rightly, by history as the worst president you've ever had. I just hope he leaves before he destroys all that is good and truly great about America.
1
Here in Portland it's well known that antifa is a violent group. They destroy property and beat up on people if they can. I wasn't in VA to watch the protest and how the black cloaked kids acted there, but in general the statement that there's blame on both sides is true. That people don't like to hear the truth is a problem.
6
Even if you aren't lying about the antifa in Portland you still don't understand that violence against Nazis is not violence. It is defense. Defense of the morals of this country, defense of right are no more violent acts than the British fighting off the Nazis. By your argument Hitler did nothing wrong.
4
Video of Antifa's antics in the streets of Portland are readily available for viewing. But if "violence is not violence" as long as it's against your chosen group, is violence actually violence when it's smashing store windows, cars and the heads of people on Portland's streets. There's never one side that's clean of guilt. Both sides are dirty players.
1
Boy, Max, you slid right down that slippery slope. No violence is acceptable between citizens on the street. If the neo nazis, white supremacists and kkk want to bring arms to their rebellious protest, I have no issue answering them with the Army of the Union. Go for it, put down the insurrection. But antifa, and any other tolerance warrior citizen that wants to answer armed white nationalists with armed resistance, gets no support from me.
2
My dog carries her own leash in her mouth Mr. Trump. Perhaps you'd like to have that "heel" conversation with her?
3
I am sure many Whites of good will are looking at the monuments issue and shaking their heads in disbelief. How is it, these Whites may be asking, that Blacks are preoccupied with monuments, while those who purport to speak for Blacks, repeat at every opportunity, the litany of pathologies that are doing serious harm to the Black community?
But I would suggest that it is highly likely that only a tiny fraction of Blacks are being consumed by the monuments issue. On what am I basing this?
I cannot recall ever hearing of incidents until now, in which Blacks were accused of defacing confederate monuments. If anger directed at these monuments were common in the Black community, then defacing monuments should have been frequent occurrences.
But I would suggest that it is highly likely that only a tiny fraction of Blacks are being consumed by the monuments issue. On what am I basing this?
I cannot recall ever hearing of incidents until now, in which Blacks were accused of defacing confederate monuments. If anger directed at these monuments were common in the Black community, then defacing monuments should have been frequent occurrences.
3
My guess is you don't actually know any "Blacks".
5
EmUnwired:
Sorry about the recent terror visited upon your city. I was on La Rambla in early July.
I know Blacks, and I have spoken to some, and not one is as committed to removing monuments as news coverage would have us believe.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Sorry about the recent terror visited upon your city. I was on La Rambla in early July.
I know Blacks, and I have spoken to some, and not one is as committed to removing monuments as news coverage would have us believe.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
White supremacists are a tiny fringe group. Protesting against them treats the lunatic fringe as i they had substantial political power. We have gotten all worked up about pretty much nothing at all. Do you know anyone who is sane, and wears Swastikas and chants against Jews and blacks? Neither do I.
12
An extension of this point: would anyone even know that there were Nazis in the US if antifa didn't counter-protest them? The media wants crowds and conflict. The friction caused by the counter protesters is the main source of the Nazi momentum.
1
Yes, we would. There have been neo nazis, kkk, and white supremacist groups, and the Southern Poverty Law Center, since long before antifa.
4
Who cares what Trump tweets.
9
President Trump tweeted "It was the "smallest" crowd of any time"! Coming tomorrow AM @ 7 AM.
I'm a liberal to most people, not liberal on everything, but liberal on most. I also believe in honesty and fairness. To that end I took the time to pull up transcripts of President Trumps Charlottesville statements. How many of you have done this? After reading the transcripts several times I can find nothing that he said out of line and certainly not what the media has been reporting that apparently most of you are using to damn him. I think you and the media including the NYT, Washington Post, CNN, etc. hate Trump so much that you either can't read English clearly or are purposely distorting what he said. Again, I am as liberal as most of you who write here, but I am also honest and fair as you should try to be.
7
I think it is obvious that they are distorting what he said to support a false narrative..
5
I watched it live. I heard trump equivocate and give his support to neo-nazis and white supremacists. I am a Republican.
11
@ tomjoad,
Perhaps you could provide a quote where Trump gave his "support to neo-nazis and white supremacists"? Can't? Didn't think so.
Perhaps you could provide a quote where Trump gave his "support to neo-nazis and white supremacists"? Can't? Didn't think so.
2
I applaud the demonstrations, but I wonder why I keep seeing shirts and signs sponsored by socialists, communists, and Spartacists. It's not just the extreme left that hates fascists and the KKK. Let's see more emblems of the Democratic Party—and, yes, the GOP. Let's make it clear that nearly the entire spectrum of Americans despises racist hate groups, and let's make it impossible for these demonstrations to be dismissed as "alt-left" by Trump's apologists.
1
i was at the event yesterday. i did not see any shirts as described, not to doubt what you witnessed but i just did not see that.
4
Did the president have a stroke? He seems completely oblivious to what is happening in this country.
What a disaster he is!
What a disaster he is!
7
Why bother mentioning anything Trump says?
I normally give people the benefit of the doubt, but he has proven himself to be irrelevant to any situation requiring intelligent thought.
Unless he resigns or is let go, he is not newsworthy-
just a duck quacking into the wind.
I normally give people the benefit of the doubt, but he has proven himself to be irrelevant to any situation requiring intelligent thought.
Unless he resigns or is let go, he is not newsworthy-
just a duck quacking into the wind.
7
Exactly. he is joke. Mitt Romney called it correctly on Trump. No one listened.
8
I marched with the tens of thousands but there were very few on the other side to be found. I don't what credit anyone deserves but Boston is not a place where such rallies in support of hate will have any significance.
5
Say what you want.....but be prepared to accept the consequences.
2
Somebody must have taken away Trump's twitter handle, but not to worry, normal services would resume within 24hrs.
8
It's sounded like bigger hands than he has!
4
"Our country will soon come together as one!" Yet another strange, unsupported claim made by someone who seeks to take credit for something without having done anything to help make it possible.
7
This is not about republicans vs democrats. Both parties systemically discriminate. This is about love vs hate. Right vs wrong. I have never seen anything resembling love from Donald Trump. The only politician that can heal this country is Bernie Sanders, who remains the most popular politician today.
6
I love Samders, but I'm wary of any claims that "only so and so can fix this."
7
Sanders was such a poor loser it was embarrassing. He was more ego than anything else. Hillary had everything written down exactly how she planned to do it. Sanders like trump had wild promises with no way to get them done. When asked by Chris Matthews how we plan to do the things he was touting he said, and I'll imitating his voice " they'll be thousands of thousands of people in the streets". And I thought no wonder he's never got anything done in 30 years in the Senate. He's just like trump, delusions of grandeur.
And I know why he didn't show his taxes. He's a millionaire and he wants to pretend he's some kind of mother Theresa.
Bernie Sanders is a grin faced 70s Trot who were all complainers. Hillary was A the person that got things done.
That's why the Republicans supported Bernie in the primaries.That's why the Russian infiltrators helped Bernie against Hillary along with every Republican out there. Republicans were scared of Hillary, they don't give Bernie a second thought. It's only the no information neo-progressive's that were fooled by this dumb old man.
.
And I know why he didn't show his taxes. He's a millionaire and he wants to pretend he's some kind of mother Theresa.
Bernie Sanders is a grin faced 70s Trot who were all complainers. Hillary was A the person that got things done.
That's why the Republicans supported Bernie in the primaries.That's why the Russian infiltrators helped Bernie against Hillary along with every Republican out there. Republicans were scared of Hillary, they don't give Bernie a second thought. It's only the no information neo-progressive's that were fooled by this dumb old man.
.
3
"Healing" will not take place by just being allowed the privilege to protest. Healing will take place when the zenophopia and racism that triggered the protest is clearly rejected by the government and by the people.
6
Looks like the same Orwellian left as usual. They get to decide "hate speech"? That's perverse on the face of it. It's the left whose hatred is far more relevant then a defunct German centric party or a defeated 19th century war participant.
Socialists are the force of fascism today. NYT leads all delusion to the contrary.
Socialists are the force of fascism today. NYT leads all delusion to the contrary.
5
I was at the "free speech" protest. Stop trying the orwellian trick of calling hate speech - free speech. This is not a "Brave New World" of Trump and his minions. Fifty or so people, huddled in a gazebo, had their chance to free speech; however, 40,000 others also had a chance to free speech, and they they spoke with one voice.
2
The counter-protesters are the White Supremacists. Notice that most of them are white and young. Coddled and catered to all their lives by their parents, now they are against free speech! These 20 and 30-somethings know little or nothing about history. They need jobs and meaningful hobbies such as reading classic literature, studying a modern language or perhaps ancient Greek and Latin, and Philosophy. How about volunteering at an animal shelter? Why don't they protest animal cruelty/factory farms?
They need to travel and see the poverty and horror in the world where most people have few rights and are very poor. Don't they know why so many people around the world dream of going to the U.S.? We have FREEDOM! Because their main hobby is staring at their smartphones, they are bored and thought they would join their friends and add a little excitement to their lives. It's stupid, it's silly, it's sad.
They need to travel and see the poverty and horror in the world where most people have few rights and are very poor. Don't they know why so many people around the world dream of going to the U.S.? We have FREEDOM! Because their main hobby is staring at their smartphones, they are bored and thought they would join their friends and add a little excitement to their lives. It's stupid, it's silly, it's sad.
7
I forgot to mention another very enjoyable and challenging hobby for them -- studying a musical instrument. And how about putting down the cellphones and getting involved in environmental issues or just enjoying nature, preserving wildlife habitat and not being so human-centric. And the NY Times, so into Diversity Politics never seems to have articles about Speciescism.
3
And that America is how it's done.
Well done Boston!
Well done Boston!
7
Much of what passes for racial and ethnic prejudice is actually class prejudice. Reducing income inequality would reduce racial and ethnic prejudice. But America won’t buy into race-based policies designed to benefit minorities because there are more poor white Americans than poor African Americans and poor Latino Americans. The U.S. Census Bureau’s most recent poverty estimates shows that 19 million white Americans, 13 million Latino Americans, 11 million black Americans and 2 million Asians Americans live below poverty level. We need race-neutral economic policies designed to lift all poor Americans out of poverty. Bernie Sanders is the only one who got this right in 2016.
4
Do people really want the federal government, i.e., the Trump administration, to decide who has and doesn't have the right to free speech and assembly?
3
I love this headline of The Times: "…Trump offers a Measure of Praise."
It's nice to write a headline like this, but we know Trump is a racist who clearly likes white supremacists, he grew up in this line of thinking: His father was part of the Ku Klux Klan. 45 is a Neo-Nazi himself.
Funny that at a casual conversation at a bar here in Manhattan about yesterday's protest, friends of mine concluded that Reince Priebus must have taken 45's cell phone from him and yelled: "Gimme that damn phone, I must tweet this!" (Wait a moment, something doesn't seem right about what I just wrote. It seems that the White House has a new Chief of Staff.)
Pause for a Google search.
Oops! I beg your pardon, the current Chief of Staff is John F. Kelly. Good thing that Google can still keep track of the people who work with 45.
It's nice to write a headline like this, but we know Trump is a racist who clearly likes white supremacists, he grew up in this line of thinking: His father was part of the Ku Klux Klan. 45 is a Neo-Nazi himself.
Funny that at a casual conversation at a bar here in Manhattan about yesterday's protest, friends of mine concluded that Reince Priebus must have taken 45's cell phone from him and yelled: "Gimme that damn phone, I must tweet this!" (Wait a moment, something doesn't seem right about what I just wrote. It seems that the White House has a new Chief of Staff.)
Pause for a Google search.
Oops! I beg your pardon, the current Chief of Staff is John F. Kelly. Good thing that Google can still keep track of the people who work with 45.
5
Trump is toast. He will be the last person on our planet to realize it.
11
The beliefs are not the big issue. The problem is that we have people trying to dictate to other people what they can think and say by using intimidation or violence.
Everyone should oppose this unless we decide to change our constitution.
Everyone should oppose this unless we decide to change our constitution.
5
Well yes if they think they can be a Nazi, we will be there to tell them, not in my house.
9
They have the right to be anything they want as long as they don't break the law which is the whole point.
4
You're not making a case, just streaming under-fed cliches...
Who didnt get to speak? Nazis? Were they too overwhelmed by the opposition,they thought better of it?
You do know that the Constitution doesn't protect you/others from being shouted down, right? That the Constitution doesn't guarantee you/others an audience, much less a cooperative one.
You can say what you want, but you can also be legally shouted down. There is no guarantee of etiquette.
How exactly do YOU propose the public deal with White supremacists, and neo-Nazis? Coffee and cake?
Who didnt get to speak? Nazis? Were they too overwhelmed by the opposition,they thought better of it?
You do know that the Constitution doesn't protect you/others from being shouted down, right? That the Constitution doesn't guarantee you/others an audience, much less a cooperative one.
You can say what you want, but you can also be legally shouted down. There is no guarantee of etiquette.
How exactly do YOU propose the public deal with White supremacists, and neo-Nazis? Coffee and cake?
12
Mr. Staley is incorrect. Yesterday's "rally" demonstrated that everyone is free to speak in this nation. And that means everyone. So, when he and his minions show up to speak, the rest of us are also free to show up and speak. If by freedom of speech, he's suggesting that he has the right to silence those who don't agree with his views, he has perverted the meaning of freedom of speech. Just as he was given the right to speak, at not inconsiderable expense to the city of Boston, so are the counter demonstrators free to speak -- even at the same forum. If he wishes an exclusive right to speak, he'll need to rent a private venue, at his own expense, and invite only his supporters. You know, like the snakeoil salesman in chief does.
14
The communists were considerably worse than nazis. An older friend of mine grew up in communist dominated Poland, I was shocked to find he hated the communists much more than the nazis. He said that the nazis just kill you, the communists take your soul.
4
Two true and dire weaknesses of our 3 Houses of government rule as it relates to removing a failed president from office are as follows...............One, in the case of Trump as a failed president, the people empowered to remove him from office are those who may have the same selfish failings as he does and thus refuse to act. The second dire weakness is that those empowered to remove him may be more concerned with losing their power and jobs than they are about doing the best thing for America. As a result, in our government, nothing can be done about Trump's removal unless the above who are entrusted to guard our Republic against tyranny and treason and inhumanity will join together and remove Trump for the common good. They so far refuse to do so and the rest of Washington and America itself are powerless to force them to act. A terrible flaw in our system, yes, but it may be better in the long run for America that this crippling weakness has been exposed so that efforts may begin to change the system to never again allow what is now happening to the presidency.
2
I personally think the Republicans on the hill have no clue how the majority of Americans feel. By there total in action on calling Trump out on his many many many moral dilemmas
4
Seminal photography by Times shooter Hilary Swift. The shot with the two guys wearing the "Make America Great Again" hats should garner a Pulitzer.
2
I rather like Dumbledore (or maybe it's Thorin Oakenshield) in Boston Police riot gear.....
1
The First Amendment says
"Congress shall make no law ... abridging the freedom of speech or of the press or the right of the people to PEACEABLY [my cap] to assemble"
The Supreme Court has ruled the 14th amendment made the 1st amendment binding on the states.
I am not a lawyer but it seems nazi's and KKK can march and spew out whatever filth they want.
But carrying guns is not speech. Speech is done with one's mouth.
Carrying guns is conduct.
Carrying guns or other arms is not PEACEABLE assembly.
The Heller / McDonald decisions upheld gun ownership in the HOME but allowed restrictions on guns in PUBLIC.
Note when Reagan was Governor of California in 1967 he signed the Mulford Act mandating 5 years in the clink for anyone carrying a loaded gun in public Mulford was passed in response to the Black Panthers marching thru the California State Capitol building with loaded rifles.
"Congress shall make no law ... abridging the freedom of speech or of the press or the right of the people to PEACEABLY [my cap] to assemble"
The Supreme Court has ruled the 14th amendment made the 1st amendment binding on the states.
I am not a lawyer but it seems nazi's and KKK can march and spew out whatever filth they want.
But carrying guns is not speech. Speech is done with one's mouth.
Carrying guns is conduct.
Carrying guns or other arms is not PEACEABLE assembly.
The Heller / McDonald decisions upheld gun ownership in the HOME but allowed restrictions on guns in PUBLIC.
Note when Reagan was Governor of California in 1967 he signed the Mulford Act mandating 5 years in the clink for anyone carrying a loaded gun in public Mulford was passed in response to the Black Panthers marching thru the California State Capitol building with loaded rifles.
8
The videos show the protesters carrying rifles did not assault anyone and that none of the counter-protesters assaulted them. The rifles made the space occupied by the armed protester an island of peace in a sea of violence. The deadly weapon was a Dodge Charger.
The New Black Panther routinely show up armed to the teeth at Texas protests and demonstrations.
The New Black Panther routinely show up armed to the teeth at Texas protests and demonstrations.
Whether or not the KKK / Nazi marchers fired their rifles is not relevant.
Openly displaying them meant their demonstration was not a peaceable assembly.
California's Mulford Act did not address firing a gun in public but possessing a loaded gun in public.
Openly displaying them meant their demonstration was not a peaceable assembly.
California's Mulford Act did not address firing a gun in public but possessing a loaded gun in public.
11
I guess it also means that it applies to antifa who also show up with 'assault rifles'. The don't like the KKK or Nazis but also don't like police, 'capitalists' which appears to include store owners, and the government.
What people are allowed to carry in marches will be up to the agencies granting the permits.
What people are allowed to carry in marches will be up to the agencies granting the permits.
1
It's heartwarming to see so many people congregating to express themselves peacefully. I tip my hat to all of those who made an effort to gather and show our nation, and the world, that there are lots of Americans who want all of us to feel welcome.
Thank you to all who marched and to the police who were supportive.
Thank you to all who marched and to the police who were supportive.
5
Boston has a long history of racial issues. I'm happy to see a showing of peaceful demonstrators this weekend. Still, I'm trying to wrap my mind around whether or not those who condone Trump, despite his support of Nazi's and Raciasts, can be absolved of any guilt. As the Red Sox ownership acts to change the name of Yawkey Way and to address the clubs complicated past, should we not be questioning why the Patriots quarterback, coach and owner golf with and buddy up to Trump. Do they stand for only for the rich getting richer, equality for minorities be damned ? But, I'm a liberal that supports Colin Kapernick who's denied a job because he dares to protest against this stuff.
3
George Orwell was right. Intolerance, newspseak, and single-sidedness reign.
The intolerant left will tolerate nothing but one viewpoint.
For you Times reporters and other illiterates: "Newspeak is the language of Oceania, a fictional totalitarian state ruled by the Party, who created the language to meet the ideological requirements of English Socialism (ingsoc). In George Orwell's world of Nineteen Eighty-Four, Newspeak is a controlled language, of restricted grammar and limited vocabulary, a linguistic design meant to limit the freedom of thought—personal identity, self-expression, free will—that ideologically threatens the régime of Big Brother and the Party, who thus criminalised such concepts as thoughtcrime, contradictions of Ingsoc orthodoxy"
Sound familiar. Look in the mirror, kids.
The intolerant left will tolerate nothing but one viewpoint.
For you Times reporters and other illiterates: "Newspeak is the language of Oceania, a fictional totalitarian state ruled by the Party, who created the language to meet the ideological requirements of English Socialism (ingsoc). In George Orwell's world of Nineteen Eighty-Four, Newspeak is a controlled language, of restricted grammar and limited vocabulary, a linguistic design meant to limit the freedom of thought—personal identity, self-expression, free will—that ideologically threatens the régime of Big Brother and the Party, who thus criminalised such concepts as thoughtcrime, contradictions of Ingsoc orthodoxy"
Sound familiar. Look in the mirror, kids.
5
Ahh, the "intolerant left" argument. What is your take on the "intolerant right"?
9
The intolerant left huh? It has been my experience that the intolerant left are the most tolerant between the parties. How can you think Republicans are tolerant when they have no tolerance for ideas other than their own. They continually want to bring religion into our government, they continually want to abolish personal rights, they continually want to tell us what to say and think. They also try to gerrymander their way into office continually. I don't call that tolerant I call it wanting to abolish democracy. As an independent I can swing one way or the other. I personally feel like we should be voting for the person not the party. That may not sit well with either party but that's the way it's supposed to be. Country before party
8
Country before party would be a novel idea provided it is practiced by both parties. However, that idea would not be tolerated by the extremists in either party, you know, the intolerant left and equally intolerant right.
Free speech is free speech, no matter how ugly. It is not right to drown out free speech just because you or 40,000 others do not agree with the handful of people who have very radical and not mainstream ideas/comments.
3
Wait, what? You would deny these 40,000 people, who showed up to protest bigotry and hate, their right to free speech?
12
Ann,
The First Amendment only prohibits actions by the government, and even then there are exceptions. The 40,000 has as much a right to "drown out" hate speech as these despicable racists have to make the hate speech. Ignorance should never be tolerated. Shame on you for defending it, Ann.
The First Amendment only prohibits actions by the government, and even then there are exceptions. The 40,000 has as much a right to "drown out" hate speech as these despicable racists have to make the hate speech. Ignorance should never be tolerated. Shame on you for defending it, Ann.
2
Ref:"...to applaud the many protestors in Boston who are speaking out against bigotry and hate. Our country will soon come together as one!...”
Is the Donald emerging from his shell of upbringing bigotry by seeing for the first time the consequences of his actions on other people. Could he evolve into a nice sensible person with a little (OK a lot) of encouragement now that Bannon has gone...?
Perhaps. But perhaps his fake news focus meant that the 'many protestors' in the quote above referred to Bannon's supporters on the bandstand.
I guess time will tell.
Is the Donald emerging from his shell of upbringing bigotry by seeing for the first time the consequences of his actions on other people. Could he evolve into a nice sensible person with a little (OK a lot) of encouragement now that Bannon has gone...?
Perhaps. But perhaps his fake news focus meant that the 'many protestors' in the quote above referred to Bannon's supporters on the bandstand.
I guess time will tell.
A leopard can't change its spots and I don't believe Trump's bigotry will change either.
7
There are reports of White Supremacist and BLM folks smoking pot together, this could be the key to Peace, just like it was in the 60s. Even the worst haters drop their masks when they partake of the healing herb .......
1
Some interesting facts. While polls found widespread disgust with white supremacists, NPR & PBS found that 27% of adults believe Confederate monuments "should be removed because they are offensive." About two out of three white & Latino respondents said they should remain, as did 44% of black respondents. A recent Monmouth University poll found that, of the current 41% of Americans who approve of the job he is doing, 61% say they cannot see Mr. Trump doing anything that would make them disapprove of him. Even those with reservations, they would still vote for Mr. Trump. They wants his party to hold the reins and steer policy, and if Mr. Trump is the only route to that, they will take it.
Andrew Young, a Democrat, civil rights leader and former U.N. ambassador, warned this week that the monuments are "a distraction." He told reporters in Atlanta it is "too costly to refight the Civil War." Boyd Brown a former DNC member says Democrats have to talk about a lack of jobs and education in poor districts, and not become obsessed with opposing Confederate monuments. Steve Bannon wants Dems to talk about racism every day. He says if the left is focused on race and identity, and we go with economic nationalism, we can crush them.” My take away Bannon is right. Evidence from the last election suggests that Trump's views on race won't bring him down. “Don't vote for the racist candidate” is not a very effective pitch if the candidate's target voters believe he isn't racist.
Andrew Young, a Democrat, civil rights leader and former U.N. ambassador, warned this week that the monuments are "a distraction." He told reporters in Atlanta it is "too costly to refight the Civil War." Boyd Brown a former DNC member says Democrats have to talk about a lack of jobs and education in poor districts, and not become obsessed with opposing Confederate monuments. Steve Bannon wants Dems to talk about racism every day. He says if the left is focused on race and identity, and we go with economic nationalism, we can crush them.” My take away Bannon is right. Evidence from the last election suggests that Trump's views on race won't bring him down. “Don't vote for the racist candidate” is not a very effective pitch if the candidate's target voters believe he isn't racist.
2
The irony of the White Supremacists and Nazi protesters: Who do they think has been in power since the founding of this nation: White Men. Who controls the financial markets in this nation: White Men. Who controls where they live and work: White Men; In short- every aspect of American Society Yet- they are insecure and frightening about their futures; futures controlled by men who look exactly like them. Donald Trump may get his wish; now that everyone (it seems)in America is insecure and frightened about our futures; we may all be "Stronger than ever before"; Without him.
4
look at all that pathetic hate in the eyes of everyone there for the 2 normal guys wearing Trump hats, this is being a liberal is all about, hate those with opinions other than yours and make snap judgements about a person because they wear a hat supporting the president of the united states
6
Perhaps it is representative of the hate shown to President Obama that is being shown to the current "president".
Is hate right regardless of who is in the office? No, it isn't. However, the current "president" stoked the fires of hate for 18 months while campaigning and has never stopped since.
I don't hate Trump or his supporters. It is more disgust at Trump, and his hate filled supporters.
Remember the catcalls Trump initiated, the violence toward those at his pep rallies that were not Trumpers, the mocking of a person with disabilities, a Gold Star family and Senator McCain.
No, this not peculiar to "liberals" by any stretch.
Is hate right regardless of who is in the office? No, it isn't. However, the current "president" stoked the fires of hate for 18 months while campaigning and has never stopped since.
I don't hate Trump or his supporters. It is more disgust at Trump, and his hate filled supporters.
Remember the catcalls Trump initiated, the violence toward those at his pep rallies that were not Trumpers, the mocking of a person with disabilities, a Gold Star family and Senator McCain.
No, this not peculiar to "liberals" by any stretch.
8
Apparently these demonstrators don't believe in free speech or the constitution. They are willing to use whatever means necessary including violence against those with opposing viewpoints and beliefs.
It's the reason for the violence in Charlottesville.
It's the reason for the violence in Charlottesville.
2
Sort of gives lie to the idea that white supremacists exist in large numbers in this country, contrary to the narrative that the NTY has been pushing for the last week.
5
I think the narrative that the New York Times has been pushing is that how many Republicans do not speak up about these groups. And how the president that they voted for brought these groups into their party, and use their hatred to further his agenda and there's. How they remained so silent about their big boy who told lies about President Obama.
That might not make them white supremacist but that does make them enabler's.
That might not make them white supremacist but that does make them enabler's.
11
Please. Obama brought the communists into his party, CPUSA provided Obama with full throated support. I never saw Obama speak out against them.
1
What a difference a protest-- without assault rifle bearing- gas mask wearing; sun-glass covering Confederate Flag waving - battle fatigue wearing- Nazi Salute making agitating and intimidating Cowards make: No Rifles to hide behind makes the Faux Valor disappear.
12
Free Speech must not be compared with ARMED and physically aggressive Hate Speech.
We cannot allow armed groups to incite violence in the name of freedom. Thank you to Commisioner Evans and the BPD. Your exemplary leadership again shines through, keeping citizens safe under challenging circumstances.
We cannot allow armed groups to incite violence in the name of freedom. Thank you to Commisioner Evans and the BPD. Your exemplary leadership again shines through, keeping citizens safe under challenging circumstances.
10
That thousands from the American Left felt enraged over a rally in favor of free speech says volumes about the American Left -- absolutely none of it good.
7
There was never a planned rally in favor of free speech. That was just a name the proponents gave it to make it seem legit.
6
Exactly. Free speech is not a particularly right wing value - in this case the rally was explicitly right wing political. It would have been kind of ironic if the organizers had made it a real free speech rally - but this was just an attempted follow up to Charlottesville.
4
Perhaps if those "lefties" had shown up to their march with tiki torches what would the reaction be then? Given that not much outcry from the conservative side of the equation it would have been acceptable.
1
When the argument is white supremacy, Nazi, and the alt right, the conversation is over immediately. But should we burn the bridge of redemption? Can some of these people be saved and must we save as many of them as we can? Are many of them are just uninformed and need a righteous path forward. Does dehumanizing them cut them out of the conversation and seal their fate?
Donald Trump has brought this out in many of them. He must be removed from office and face the charges that will come down.
It is our duty to make an example of Donald Trump. He belongs in a museum.
Donald Trump has brought this out in many of them. He must be removed from office and face the charges that will come down.
It is our duty to make an example of Donald Trump. He belongs in a museum.
2
Is it possible that the label "nazi" can be falsely applied to shut down dissent? Perhaps the right should begin labeling all "progressives" as Marxist fascists who desire to enslave the nation.
2
Sure they can redeem themselves - they could have looked at the tens of thousands rallying to oppose their small-minded and hateful creeds, and asked themselves: could those people be right? Could we be wrong? They would be welcomed to normality. Where, truth be told, there are still a lot of serious problems beyond the stupidity of the "alt-right".
1
First, 'anti-fascism' doesn't exist. As evidenced by our actions throughout history, our entire country is anti-fascist. We, as a culture and nation, do not tolerate persecution of people because they are 'other'--it is the principle on which our country was founded. It is also why our country is having such a difficult and rancorous time. The election of 45 and his hate and anti-fact/anti-evidence rhetoric have allowed groups that promote intolerance and persecution to flourish and be emboldened. (I am by no means saying these groups have not been present for the entire history of our country, however). Anti-fascism is not real; what is and always has been real is that we will not stand for intolerance and persecution. This is not a left vs. right, democrat vs. republican, or academic issue. First amendment rights do not apply to intolerance and persecution. Any movement that preaches intolerance and persecution must be outside the law (see Karl Popper).
1
Many valid reasons exist not to remove confederate statues. You should never try to erase history, especially history that flies in the face of humanity. If people remove confederate statues, pretty soon nobody will understand the issues. That would be a tragedy as severe as the war itself.
Consider removing all references and all museums that are about the Holocaust, to the Nazis, to concentration camps. The millions who had lost their lives, those who were imprisoned but survived during the Holocaust, and all descendants of the Holocaust would be wronged -- again.
You can't erase history. Not only is that a wrong as severe as the original wrong, but you can't erase history.
Consider removing all references and all museums that are about the Holocaust, to the Nazis, to concentration camps. The millions who had lost their lives, those who were imprisoned but survived during the Holocaust, and all descendants of the Holocaust would be wronged -- again.
You can't erase history. Not only is that a wrong as severe as the original wrong, but you can't erase history.
2
The move to remove confederate statues is meant to inflame racial tensions, nothing more.
1
There are no Nazi statues in Germany. To even say the words heil Hitler can get you jailed. And nobody tries to erase the memory of what they did. It is preserve to show mankind evil that existed so that it may not be repeated.
Confederate statues were put up by Jim Crow politicians to intimidate black people. To waive their confederate flag as if it was a symbol of redeemable value. But they and it, represents traitors and treason against the United States of America.
Take them all down and put them where they belong in museums to tell the story of who they really were.
Confederate statues were put up by Jim Crow politicians to intimidate black people. To waive their confederate flag as if it was a symbol of redeemable value. But they and it, represents traitors and treason against the United States of America.
Take them all down and put them where they belong in museums to tell the story of who they really were.
10
The move to prevent the removal of confederate statues is meant to inflame racial tensions, nothing more.
3
"Trump Offers a Measure of Praise"
"It was an abrupt shift in tone."
I hope people have learned, like I have, not to give President Trump the benefit of the doubt anymore. I gave him the benefit of the doubt when he took office. But he's proven he doesn't deserve to be given that; look at two other tweets from Aug. 18 (in addition to the crazy Pershing one):
"The Obstructionist Democrats make Security for our country very difficult. They use the courts and associated delay at all times. Must stop!"
"Radical Islamic Terrorism must be stopped by whatever means necessary! The courts must give us back our protective rights. Have to be tough!"
You see the theme there? The U.S. President going after the U.S. courts. It's unacceptable - but now we accept it and ignore it. Stop giving him the benefit of the doubt. He's not going to change. If the media needs a reminder of that, check out his Aug 19. tweet:
"Steve Bannon will be a tough and smart new voice at @BreitbartNews...maybe even better than ever before. Fake News needs the competition!"
"It was an abrupt shift in tone."
I hope people have learned, like I have, not to give President Trump the benefit of the doubt anymore. I gave him the benefit of the doubt when he took office. But he's proven he doesn't deserve to be given that; look at two other tweets from Aug. 18 (in addition to the crazy Pershing one):
"The Obstructionist Democrats make Security for our country very difficult. They use the courts and associated delay at all times. Must stop!"
"Radical Islamic Terrorism must be stopped by whatever means necessary! The courts must give us back our protective rights. Have to be tough!"
You see the theme there? The U.S. President going after the U.S. courts. It's unacceptable - but now we accept it and ignore it. Stop giving him the benefit of the doubt. He's not going to change. If the media needs a reminder of that, check out his Aug 19. tweet:
"Steve Bannon will be a tough and smart new voice at @BreitbartNews...maybe even better than ever before. Fake News needs the competition!"
9
Erika, thanks for this post. I missed these in the maelstrom of tweets.
2
How do you control racist generated street violence ?
That's right, a large and coordinated police presence to isolate the white supremacists from the inevitably much larger counter demonstrations. That disappoints the racists, and maybe even the small minority of counter demonstraters who want to bust some heads. But its good social policy.
That's right, a large and coordinated police presence to isolate the white supremacists from the inevitably much larger counter demonstrations. That disappoints the racists, and maybe even the small minority of counter demonstraters who want to bust some heads. But its good social policy.
5
Keep talking, Donald. Every day, in every way, you show us all EXACTLY what you meant with "I'm like...really smart". Please Proceed.
2
American history shows we as a country we have ebbs and flows politically, socially and vast periods where folks simply get so damn tired of all the fighting and just wander off back to communities where sanity returns and positive changes occur.
The question that needs to be answered is are all the deaths, destruction of property, and vile words and actions on any side of the argument worth it all? I think what my ancestors did in fighting for independence from Britain was worth it. I think fighting for the right of blacks to be free people was worth it.
And I think fighting for the right of women to vote was worth it. And I think fighting to end the Viet Nam war, fighting to establish fair housing, desegregation, equal access to the disabled was worth it.
People toss around the word 'freedom' but the hard fact is freedom has NEVER been free. Never handed to anyone in a peaceful way. Freedom has resulted because good people got injured or died so that YOU and I can have the benefits we have!
The question that needs to be answered is are all the deaths, destruction of property, and vile words and actions on any side of the argument worth it all? I think what my ancestors did in fighting for independence from Britain was worth it. I think fighting for the right of blacks to be free people was worth it.
And I think fighting for the right of women to vote was worth it. And I think fighting to end the Viet Nam war, fighting to establish fair housing, desegregation, equal access to the disabled was worth it.
People toss around the word 'freedom' but the hard fact is freedom has NEVER been free. Never handed to anyone in a peaceful way. Freedom has resulted because good people got injured or died so that YOU and I can have the benefits we have!
3
Donald Trump first condemned as being against the police, but after the Mayor of Boston and Boston Police commissioner tweeted out praise for the protesters of against hate, only then did Trump change his tune.
Trump is still what he was, the spokesperson for the White Supremacist and their man in the Whitehouse.
Trump is still what he was, the spokesperson for the White Supremacist and their man in the Whitehouse.
2
A rough draft opinion on the roots of the national controversy about confederate heroes and their public monuments, perhaps even a little daft:
https://www.academia.edu/34269176/Facebook_-_Regarding_the_roots_of_the_...
https://www.academia.edu/34269176/Facebook_-_Regarding_the_roots_of_the_...
We are lucky that Donald Trump is such a stupid out of control lunatic. Can you imagine if he was sly, and intelligent with the same motives? Republicans don't care that he's a racist fascist white supremists. But they hate it when he blurts it out shows his true colors. That gets in the way of their objectives. The Republican Party is morally bankrupt and should be disbanded.
9
You know how righteous this must make the left feel since they are against hate. No one else on earth is against hate except self righteous liberals. They are also against hotdogs, apple pie, motherhood and the American flag...it just feels good and nobody else can share that feeling...!
6
"No one else on earth is against hate except self righteous liberals."
Woah, comrade! Speak for yourself!
Woah, comrade! Speak for yourself!
6
I remember a national TV talk show from about twenty years ago talking about the neo-nazis that are out there, and oh boy, you know, they are out there! And in their tiny numbers, they do their thing, and talk their awful talk, but where does it go? No incidents worthy of news for twenty years. Because their numbers are still tiny, they have no power, just awful talk.
And it would have stayed this way for another twenty years. With no attention being paid to them, they are just a little slime under the rocks.
So all this attention really is a bit ridiculous. Tiny slime that everyone imagines is a big monster that we have to get out in the streets and defeat! The real possibility here is that all the hysteria just strengthens them.
And I voted for Hillary, ok? I lean left in politics, but I'm not dogmatic or hysterical. I like observing mistakes the left makes, and why we are likely to have Trump-eight-years if people don't relax a bit.
And it would have stayed this way for another twenty years. With no attention being paid to them, they are just a little slime under the rocks.
So all this attention really is a bit ridiculous. Tiny slime that everyone imagines is a big monster that we have to get out in the streets and defeat! The real possibility here is that all the hysteria just strengthens them.
And I voted for Hillary, ok? I lean left in politics, but I'm not dogmatic or hysterical. I like observing mistakes the left makes, and why we are likely to have Trump-eight-years if people don't relax a bit.
5
A handful of Fascist wannabes and 40,000 patriots demonstrating that Fascism has no place in a democracy. Way to go, Bostonians!
12
For those of you who ask how can these white nationalist be a threat there are so few of them. Please check the facts. There have been more attacks from far right(white nationals, KKK) than from the Islamic terrorists.
I believe in freedom of speech even from hate filled people like that because the only way you can fight it is when it is out in the open. Sunshine is the best disinfectant.
I believe in freedom of speech even from hate filled people like that because the only way you can fight it is when it is out in the open. Sunshine is the best disinfectant.
8
American communists against freedom of speech. How did we know the Liberal Storm Troopers would show up again to agitate at another peaceful march.
1
OK, we're moved on from racism to Russia to confederacy and now to white supremacists. I'm wondering what progressive fascists have left in their playbook. What kind of mindless robots show up to protest free speech?
4
What kind of faux naif pretends those aren't American Nazis and white supremacists hiding behind the words "free speech"?
8
Neal, you lost him!
3
The 40,000 were merely exercising their right to free speech. The 1st Amendment restricts the government from restraining free speech but it does not guarantee that your audience has to listen or prevent them from exercising their free speech rights.
Trump`s grotesque gesture of praise should be rejected as sheer hypocrisy by all who participated in that event. Trump was elected by bigots an racists because he is a bigot and a racist. The fact that bigots and racists are half the overall population of this country doesn`t change the fact that they are bigots and racists.
But Trump is more than just a run-off-the-mill bigot and racist. He is a dangerous, utterly immoral megalomaniac with infinite capacity for harm. It is high time for everyone to use the right words here. The era of tiptoeing around the truth is over. The European Press is getting the words right, let`s hope the US Press catches up.
But Trump is more than just a run-off-the-mill bigot and racist. He is a dangerous, utterly immoral megalomaniac with infinite capacity for harm. It is high time for everyone to use the right words here. The era of tiptoeing around the truth is over. The European Press is getting the words right, let`s hope the US Press catches up.
2
I am not a Trump voter, but I believe that it is essential that any opinion can safely be expressed. That means that any opinion I vehemently disagree with, and that I find offensive. It is dangerous indeed, to demand that certain opinions NOT be allowed expression, and this represents the real unraveling of our democracy. Certainly, there are many other trends that threaten our country: voter suppression, gerrymandering, the intimidation of minorities....to name a few. But free apeach is one of the cornerstones of our country, and this cannot be allowed to be eroded.
2
These people don't want free speech. They want a white Christian America. Speech only enters the picture when their friends and neighbors beg them, "Please stop all this Nazi and white supremacist talk; it's unpatriotic and frankly disgusting."
4
The FBI and Department of Homeland Security recently issued a joint bulletin titled “White Supremacist Extremism Poses Persistent Threat of Lethal Violence.” The bulletin listed murders committed by white supremacist from 2000 through 2016. It attributed 49 murders to white supremacists over the 17 year period, or about 3 murders per year. (Only 23 of the 49 victims were members of racial or ethnic minorities.) According to the FBI Uniform Crime Report, the United States has about 15,600 murders a year. Over a 17-year period, the number of murder would add up to about 266,900. So, white supremacist commit about 0.02 percent of murders, but nearly half of these murders have nothing to do with white supremacy. A disproportionate number of white supremacists joined groups like the Aryan Brotherhood while in prison. Many of their victims are police officers attempting to arrest them for narcotics or armed robbery. White supremacists may be persistent, but they are not nearly as dangerous as people who text and drive.
1
Lying with numbers is a venerable tradition of American conservatism.
3
The joint FBI/Homeland Security bulletin was released under the Obama administration.
The fact that the FBI and Homeland Security considered it enough of a threat indicates that they consider it at least as important as texting and driving. Not counting 9/11, Islamists have killed fewer people but I doubt you'll be making that comparison for them.
I'm ready to see the GOP, when they return from recess. actually DO something besides tweeting to show that are are truly serious about Trumps racism and censure him before he does any more harm to our country.
4
This guy knows no shame. Now he's going to take credit for "bringing people together." That it was his plan all along. That it was his purposefully spoken words on Tuesday that triggered these positive actions.
Its truly astounding how clueless and self-aggrandizing one man can be. Now he likely believes he's exempt from apology (which he already does, but now its made doctrine) and wholly exempt from doing the right and moral thing the next time. Namely to directly and with real feeling, stand against White Supremacists.
I'm not one to say this...but god help us...any god. Tree god, swan god, just help us!
Its truly astounding how clueless and self-aggrandizing one man can be. Now he likely believes he's exempt from apology (which he already does, but now its made doctrine) and wholly exempt from doing the right and moral thing the next time. Namely to directly and with real feeling, stand against White Supremacists.
I'm not one to say this...but god help us...any god. Tree god, swan god, just help us!
6
America is a kind nation where all;white,brown and black and others can live together. Majority of us support this blend. The only few who are trying to create this trouble should be made known that not to disturb the greatness of this nation to absorb all. Pride of living in this nation should overtake everything.
1
The demonstrators in Charlottesville weren't fighting with themselves. Violence only erupted when others attempted to take away their freedom of speech and had a permit.
Boston was another example of individuals trying to deny freedom of speech to those who they disagree with.
Boston was another example of individuals trying to deny freedom of speech to those who they disagree with.
5
Don, huh? Care to elaborate...cause you made no sense.
Peace speech outdoing hate speech in Boston is not a denial of rights, its the showing of better speech. That peace and tolerance and acceptance of others,not denigrating them and wanting them removed from the nation is our only way forward.
What you saw in Boston is passive resistance to hate doctrines. Overwhelm the hate with peace.
Peace speech outdoing hate speech in Boston is not a denial of rights, its the showing of better speech. That peace and tolerance and acceptance of others,not denigrating them and wanting them removed from the nation is our only way forward.
What you saw in Boston is passive resistance to hate doctrines. Overwhelm the hate with peace.
5
The First Amendment guarantees that the U.S. government will not interfere with your freedom of speech. Got that? Now concentrate: I and a million of my closest friends are not agents of the U.S. government and can complain about your hateful, anti-American speech in any way we choose.
6
Neal. You can complain all you want and peacefully demonstrate. I imagine you would have a big problem if others tried to prevent you from doing that. They believe they are right and so do you.
1
I despise the white supremacists who believe their supposedly pure blood entitles them to a land that never belonged to them in the first place, and I despise Trump for enabling them. I've been appalled by the number of forum comments that justify both by saying BLM groups are just as bad, if not worse.
But then I noticed a pattern. The majority of black people interviewed during/after the Charlottesville and Boston events, as well as many who identified themselves as black on forums spoke of racism in one narrowly defined term - racism is prejudice against blacks. I looked at videos and photos from those events. The signs black people held overwhelmingly displayed "Black Lives Matter." Black lives, not all lives.
BLM proponents do not stand in solidarity with other minorities, of which I am one. The vast majority of racial slurs said to me have been from blacks. And it's true that significant violence and destruction committed by BLM factions have been far less criticized.
The reality is that white supremacists and black supremacists -- and any other hate group -- care only of themselves. They all discriminate against and antagonize those who don't fit their definition of purity.
The Charlottesville rally and Trump's tacit support have worryingly emboldened white supremacists. But let's not kid ourselves into thinking they are the only hate group that's a problem. The penalties we impose on one should be imposed on the others -- this picking and choosing is ridiculous.
But then I noticed a pattern. The majority of black people interviewed during/after the Charlottesville and Boston events, as well as many who identified themselves as black on forums spoke of racism in one narrowly defined term - racism is prejudice against blacks. I looked at videos and photos from those events. The signs black people held overwhelmingly displayed "Black Lives Matter." Black lives, not all lives.
BLM proponents do not stand in solidarity with other minorities, of which I am one. The vast majority of racial slurs said to me have been from blacks. And it's true that significant violence and destruction committed by BLM factions have been far less criticized.
The reality is that white supremacists and black supremacists -- and any other hate group -- care only of themselves. They all discriminate against and antagonize those who don't fit their definition of purity.
The Charlottesville rally and Trump's tacit support have worryingly emboldened white supremacists. But let's not kid ourselves into thinking they are the only hate group that's a problem. The penalties we impose on one should be imposed on the others -- this picking and choosing is ridiculous.
1
BLM doesn't mean that other lives don't matter. That is a typical bit of demagoguery against BLM. As I read once--"Our call is not “Black lives matter” because we want to exclude White people or the experiences of other people of color, but because Black people’s history and our present require of us that we affirm our worth. "
"The vast majority of racial slurs said to me have been from black"
Sure they have.
"The vast majority of racial slurs said to me have been from black"
Sure they have.
Way to go Boston. Overwhelming numbers of peaceful people against hate and racism makes the best possible statement.
5
There is no such thing as free speech anymore in this country. Only PC leftist speech, revisionist, and lies are allowed.
3
I would hope you see the irony in your post.
4
And yet here you are. And over there, Fox News. Sinclair Broadcasting is about to try to outdo them in spreading right wing propaganda disguised as news. Rush Limbaugh is still on the air. So is Alex Jones. Breitbart and the Daily Stormer continue to publish. The federal government and most of the states are under the control of extremely conservative Republicans. Donald Trump remains unindicted.
I'm sorry, Peahi, but I've forgotten what you were complaining about.
I'm sorry, Peahi, but I've forgotten what you were complaining about.
6
Trump’s lukewarm damning by faint praise “applause for protesters” seems (again) a scripted and insincere diversion from the much more telling and serious touchstone of his real feelings with his earlier, “…many anti-police agitators in Boston.” It is surprising that this comment has not drawn the criticism it deserves.
On a personal level, this statement again demonstrates a paranoid personality that anyone who disagrees with him or confronts his ideology is simply an agitator and enemy and a threat to be disregarded or disposed of. On a larger level of government control, anyone who disagrees with HIM is an enemy of the state. With this “us/them” ideology, how long before we move from caustic comments to actual physical coercion of civilian disagreement in a true Police State.
On a personal level, this statement again demonstrates a paranoid personality that anyone who disagrees with him or confronts his ideology is simply an agitator and enemy and a threat to be disregarded or disposed of. On a larger level of government control, anyone who disagrees with HIM is an enemy of the state. With this “us/them” ideology, how long before we move from caustic comments to actual physical coercion of civilian disagreement in a true Police State.
4
It would really help if all the media covered demonstrations in a different way. Instead of photographing marchers (and focusing on the most extreme signs) and highlighting the occasional clashes (which occur on the fringes of many public events, not just demonstrations), try this:
Interview a randomly selected group of demonstrators. Ask them what their key points are. In other words, find out what the content of the protest is.
For most people, especially TV viewers, protests are all about chaos. This does not further the national discussions we need.
Interview a randomly selected group of demonstrators. Ask them what their key points are. In other words, find out what the content of the protest is.
For most people, especially TV viewers, protests are all about chaos. This does not further the national discussions we need.
3
It furthers the national discussion but doesn't further the news media's interest in fanning controversy to increase ratings.
You may have missed a long running video by an amateur who did exactly that. It was linked to by WikiLeaks on Twitter. She was right there when the car crashed into two other cars, but that was near the end of the video. She was moving about, sometimes running, to various locations, asking people their views of what was happening. She documented violence by both sides. Her video alone put all of our major networks to shame and exposed their blatant lies. Perhaps that is why WikiLeaks posted it.
Philip Greider, are you trying to say the media is PAYING Donald Trump to act like a psychotic chimpanzee in order to increase their audience? Don't blame they messenger.
1
They gathered in Boston because of the temperature. They should have a protest march down here in Louisiana. All of those black hooded antifa activist rioters will be dropping like flies. White reigns supreme down heah. It's even quite ordinary to wear all white at funerals.
Well I think that it's intolerable that the self rightous troublemaking protestors won't take some responsibility for the Charlottsville riots. No smoke without fire. We will not tolerate liberal facists telling us what to think and say! More intolerable propaganda from the university educated protestors.
2
You seem to be equating a university education with fascism. Therefore, according to you, if one doesn't have a college education one is more likely to be blameless.I also wouldn't worry about a decline in tourism- there are plenty of battlefields and mansions. And many of the southern states are already the poorest in the country. Perhaps if they opened their minds to more inclusive ideas they'd be doing better.
6
First, 'anti-fascism' doesn't exist. As evidenced by our actions throughout history, our entire country is anti-fascist. We, as a culture and nation, do not tolerate persecution of people because they are 'other'--it is the principle on which our country was founded. It is also why our country is having such a difficult time. The election of 45 and his hate and anti-fact/anti-evidence rhetoric have allowed groups that promote intolerance and persecution to flourish and be emboldened. (I am by no means saying these groups have not been present for the entire history of our country, however). Anti-fascism is not real; what is and always has been real is that we will not stand for intolerance and persecution. This is not a left vs. right, democrat vs. republican, or academic issue. First amendment rights do not apply to intolerance and persecution. Any movement that preaches intolerance and persecution must be outside the law (see Karl Popper).
2
Who is the "We" in the "We will not tolerate liberal fascists"?....Right wing fascists?
About "university educated protesters": Education teaches people to critically think, so it may be a factor in the rejection of knee jerk ultra right wing racist fascists spouting their poison about white supremacy being due larger brains, etc. (listen to some of the chats of the "free speech" protesters.) Blaming liberal distain for racists upon university education is as unfair as elite blaming of all Trump voters as being uneducated "intolerables." Abhorrence and standing against hateful racism is a symptom of character and humanity not education.
About "university educated protesters": Education teaches people to critically think, so it may be a factor in the rejection of knee jerk ultra right wing racist fascists spouting their poison about white supremacy being due larger brains, etc. (listen to some of the chats of the "free speech" protesters.) Blaming liberal distain for racists upon university education is as unfair as elite blaming of all Trump voters as being uneducated "intolerables." Abhorrence and standing against hateful racism is a symptom of character and humanity not education.
1
Protesting is not enough.
Pressure needs to be put on elected officials to treat Neo-Nazism, white supremacy, anti-Semitism and racial hatred just like their moral equivalent, child pornography.
Pressure needs to be put on elected officials to treat Neo-Nazism, white supremacy, anti-Semitism and racial hatred just like their moral equivalent, child pornography.
3
How hard is it to say, "I hate Nazis"?
7
I know a ton a Trump supporters but no white supremacists. In fact most have grandparents and parents that fought in WWII and defeated Nazi Germany. So if we are trying to equate white supremacy with support for the President, that is not a circle that can be squared.
5
If it's true that Trump and his voters do not support neo-nazis and the KKK, then why have they conspicuously refused to condemn them, or their repugnant racist ideology, or even their violent, murderous, tactics? Why is it so hard for them to just say unequivocally that Naziism has no place in America?
5
I still wonder why no monuments to the Confederacy were taken down during 8 years of the Obama administration?
1
President Obama wouldn't have gotten the support from rich republican friends to do this. Or any political support for that matter. Besides he was trying to rebuild this country financially, and still fight republicans to get healthcare done. He didn't try to be ego maniac troublemaker. Too busy fighting republicans to get much of anything passed. Shame could have done even more great things.
With all the anger here, perhaps we can learn something from the heart-rendering words of Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, commander of the Ottoman forces at the Dardenelles during the first world war- speaking, to former enemies.
‘Those heroes that shed their blood and lost their lives ... You are now lying in the soil of a friendly country. Therefore rest in peace. There is no difference between the Johnnies and the Mehmets to us where they lie side by side here in this country of ours ... You, the mothers who sent their sons from faraway countries, wipe away your tears; your sons are now lying in our bosom and are in peace. After having lost their lives on this land they have become our sons as well.”
‘Those heroes that shed their blood and lost their lives ... You are now lying in the soil of a friendly country. Therefore rest in peace. There is no difference between the Johnnies and the Mehmets to us where they lie side by side here in this country of ours ... You, the mothers who sent their sons from faraway countries, wipe away your tears; your sons are now lying in our bosom and are in peace. After having lost their lives on this land they have become our sons as well.”
3
If only Turkey still had great leaders like that. Or we still had great leaders like Lincoln, Roosevelt or Washington.
1
Ignorance is bliss and I think it is intolerable that the tourism industry in those States that have those statues and monuments will see a downturn in tourism. Do a web search of these words: civil war tours usa
1
Hello! This is 2017 and Civil War Tours are part and parcel of the USA tourism industry. Civil War enthusiasts go to the USA to visit these statues. All the ignorant protestors won't be around when those tour operators and other businesses that profit from tourists in their area, end up bankrupt and unemployed. No! The protestors would've moved onto some other pet hate to protest about. Protesting doesn't take much effort but building up a tourism business does.
1
Even if some statues, erected to intimidate the black population, are removed, tourists can still visit these national parks. The entrepreneurial tour operators can adapt...that is what entrepreneurs do. https://www.nps.gov/cwindepth/cwparks.html and https://www.nps.gov/civilwar/relatedparks.htm
Tourism is down because people don't like Nazis. None of my European friends and family will visit this country as long as trump is president. Nazism is not good for businesses.
4
That's so wrong saying they were put there to intimidate. I disagree with that as if you get rid of all your history then you are condemned to relive that history because how are the younger generation going to learn from history. In New Zealand we embrace statues of maori warriors as part of our history. There are even new statues being commissioned as we speak. Do a web search: statues of Maori warriors in nz
"Yascha Mounk, a political scientist at Harvard University who writes about democracy, said partisanship in the United States today is dangerously deep.
“It’s now at a stage where a lot of Americans have such a loyalty to their political tribe that they are willing to go along with deeply undemocratic behavior,” he said. “If their guy says, ‘I think we should push back the election for a few years because of a possible terrorist attack,’ I fear that a significant part of the population would go along with it.” ' New York Times, 08/20/17
“It’s now at a stage where a lot of Americans have such a loyalty to their political tribe that they are willing to go along with deeply undemocratic behavior,” he said. “If their guy says, ‘I think we should push back the election for a few years because of a possible terrorist attack,’ I fear that a significant part of the population would go along with it.” ' New York Times, 08/20/17
Make your statement of protest against free speech. That tells the majority of us all we need to know about you guys.
3
The US does not stand for intolerance and persecution. This is not a left vs. right, democrat vs. republican, or academic issue. First amendment rights do not apply to intolerance and persecution. Any movement that preaches intolerance and persecution must be outside the law (see Karl Popper).
Thanks Boston. Thanks Boston P.D.
Let our divisiveness be found at Fenway when the Sox play the Yankees and we can boo and applaud over a hot dog and beer and when the game is over, we can smile at one another and be thankful America belongs to us all.
Let our divisiveness be found at Fenway when the Sox play the Yankees and we can boo and applaud over a hot dog and beer and when the game is over, we can smile at one another and be thankful America belongs to us all.
3
Imagine if Trump supporters were found fighting cops, throwing urine at police, even just a small few. Imagine how different this same article would've been re-imagined by the Times. Do you think the Times would be calling them "boisterous"? That's how you know what's fake news, what's biased journalism and what's not.
4
I attended the Boston counter-protest, which was motivated by the “Free Speech” rally keynotes, who were outsiders and associated with white supremacy, such as August Invictus, Gavin McInnes, and Joe Biggs. The Springfield KKK indicated that they planned on attending. We gathered to affirm Boston’s commitment to and value of her diverse population.
After Charlottesville, the “Free Speech” organizers dis-invited the more extreme speakers, or they opted not to attend when Mayor Walsh defined the terms for the rally and counter-protest: (1) maintain a barricade between the rally attendees and counter-protestors, (2) ban sticks, bats, and other objects that can be used as weapons; and (3) enact a zero-tolerance policy toward violence from anyone. Boston police did a fantastic job; they were friendly and firm.
The citizens of greater Boston have confidence in the police and city due to their experience with large crowds (e.g., yearly Boston Marathon, two world series winning parades) and challenging situations (the Boston Marathon bombing). Thus, Bostonians came with good cheer to support our fellow citizens and protest against hate and intolerance. In contrast, Charlottesville had no such experience.
A few who attended were itching for trouble. They were ignored by the crowds, and handled by the police. Hence, no escalation of violence. It was an amazing day. So proud of Boston!
After Charlottesville, the “Free Speech” organizers dis-invited the more extreme speakers, or they opted not to attend when Mayor Walsh defined the terms for the rally and counter-protest: (1) maintain a barricade between the rally attendees and counter-protestors, (2) ban sticks, bats, and other objects that can be used as weapons; and (3) enact a zero-tolerance policy toward violence from anyone. Boston police did a fantastic job; they were friendly and firm.
The citizens of greater Boston have confidence in the police and city due to their experience with large crowds (e.g., yearly Boston Marathon, two world series winning parades) and challenging situations (the Boston Marathon bombing). Thus, Bostonians came with good cheer to support our fellow citizens and protest against hate and intolerance. In contrast, Charlottesville had no such experience.
A few who attended were itching for trouble. They were ignored by the crowds, and handled by the police. Hence, no escalation of violence. It was an amazing day. So proud of Boston!
53
Schizophrenic tweets from the President yesterday.
But the message was intentionally muddled, all calculated. Regardless of what Trump types into his phone, the entire world saw the spirit and contents of Trump's heart last Tuesday. His tiny heart that holds empathy for the hate groups that supprt him. Support that he carefully cultivated from the birther days though Election Day.
Turns out Bannon wasn't pulling the strings, our President isn't just a racial provocateur, our President is a nazi sympathizer and a racist.
But the message was intentionally muddled, all calculated. Regardless of what Trump types into his phone, the entire world saw the spirit and contents of Trump's heart last Tuesday. His tiny heart that holds empathy for the hate groups that supprt him. Support that he carefully cultivated from the birther days though Election Day.
Turns out Bannon wasn't pulling the strings, our President isn't just a racial provocateur, our President is a nazi sympathizer and a racist.
13
Thank goodness for clear minds and peaceful marchers in Boston. They showed the nation and also white supremacists, KKK members, and neo-Nazis how to demonstrate peacefully without intimidation or hate. This is a protest of which all Americans should be proud!
8
The Charlottesville tragedy was 100% avoidable had the police done their duty. The police is not supposed to be just a monitor in such situations but an active participant in preventing violence.
4
Does it matter that both sides actually were to blame for the violence in Charlottesville, or is it more important to be able to use the issue to bash Trump as a Nazi?
2
The election of 45 and his hate and anti-fact/anti-evidence rhetoric have allowed groups that promote intolerance and persecution to flourish and be emboldened. (I am by no means saying these groups have not been present for the entire history of our country, however). Our country does not stand for intolerance and persecution. This is not a left vs. right, democrat vs. republican, or academic issue. First amendment rights do not apply to intolerance and persecution. Any movement that preaches intolerance and persecution must be outside the law (see Karl Popper).
2
Nazis are not the same as those who protest Nazis. Only in America are Nazis given support.
1
Those who protest and riot are the weak and the troubled ones who drag America down and hold back America from developing. The welfare collectors and the leftist weak whites are sad and could be eliminated and never missed.
America has too many freeloaders and hangers of street corners infecting the inner cities with decay and rot and crime and drugs. America needs a severe ethnic cleansing.
America has too many freeloaders and hangers of street corners infecting the inner cities with decay and rot and crime and drugs. America needs a severe ethnic cleansing.
2
You just used the public NYT comments section to advocate the "elimination" of the weak and to call for "ethnic cleansing". Don't ever let me hear anymore whining from neo-nazis and alt-right, or their apologists, that somehow their views and "free speech rights" are being silenced.
15
First amendment rights do not apply to intolerance and persecution. Any movement that preaches intolerance and persecution must be outside the law (see Karl Popper).
If I were in Boston, I would want to show my support for free speech AND my opposition to Nazism and racism. It's a pity that those positions are being seen as those of opposite "sides".
6
The real culprit here is above the fray and behind the scenes funding the war and fanning the flames between different political, economic and racial groups. People such as billionaire and Nazi sympathizer George Soros who has done this in Great Britain and many countries profiting from the turmoil. Soros stated, "I am basically there to make money. I cannot and do not look at the social consequences of what I do." Soros is doing this in America right now. Its the old divide and conquer strategy. Stop Soros and the fires die without funding for the fuel. We are better off without him.
2
This is simply lies.
"We Will Not Tolerate The Intolerable"
Communists also believe in freedom of speech and beliefs providing you agree with their doctrine. It would be interesting to see a profile of the these demonstrators.
Communists also believe in freedom of speech and beliefs providing you agree with their doctrine. It would be interesting to see a profile of the these demonstrators.
4
How can you "profile" 40,000 citizens who took time on their day off to protest hate ?
They are regular people from all walks of life.
Listen to yourself.
They are regular people from all walks of life.
Listen to yourself.
4
Many seem to be supporting the notion that if you don't stand with the 'nots' then you are a Nazi / white supremacists. Such notions are why we have a Constitution as a majority does not make one right. There are at least three topics to consider in these recent events; the existence of reprehensible groups like the KKK and Nazis, the 1st Amendment right to freedom of speech, and direct confrontation. No matter how distasteful a group may be they still have a right to freedom of speech, something that is not only being overlooked but is being questioned. In addition it is becoming acceptable to provoke violence and to support those who do so. Now we have groups traveling across the country to specifically engage in street violence, groups who not only view white supremacists as the enemy but also the police, capitalists / store owners, the government, etc.
What is lost on most people is that although the KKK and Nazis are ready examples of racism they are relatively small in number and as a result have little impact on policy and social affairs. The confrontation is what provides them with undue significance. The evidence of racism in the US is hidden in plain sight. As an example Boston is one of the most segregated cities in the country, in residential areas as well as schools, with depressed economic opportunity for Blacks and others, and has been for decades. Across the country this affects millions and is supported by tens of millions.
What is lost on most people is that although the KKK and Nazis are ready examples of racism they are relatively small in number and as a result have little impact on policy and social affairs. The confrontation is what provides them with undue significance. The evidence of racism in the US is hidden in plain sight. As an example Boston is one of the most segregated cities in the country, in residential areas as well as schools, with depressed economic opportunity for Blacks and others, and has been for decades. Across the country this affects millions and is supported by tens of millions.
3
These hate groups are coming out of the woodwork since Trumps election.
1
The Boston rally was not planned by white supremacists or Nazis, it should say that in this article. Who did attend was the black shirts with the black face masks. Boston needs to tell those people they are not welcome, they were the cause of the problems after the rally, endangering the "good people from both sides" that attended.
3
In Russia is freedom of speech. In America, there is freedom after speech.” Yakov Smirnoff
Geez, Trump just declared that whenever free speech contradicts the ideas of the superior numbers of a liberal mob, that mob is morally obligated to silence that speech. No need to differentiate intolerant actions from intolerant ideas with the antiquated notions of mutual enlightenment derived from conversationally resolving the errors of intolerance with free speech…just shout down whoever disagrees with whatever fantasies du jour pass for liberal thought, as “intolerance.”
That way liberals get what they want… the total conformity of human action compelled into mob preferred obedience by the intolerant physical persecution of verbal disagreement. That is, of course, the essence of totalitarianism, whether it spews from antifa or the KKK. The only difference between these imaginary opponents is the numerical superiority of the liberal mob over the equally intolerant rest.
That way liberals get what they want… the total conformity of human action compelled into mob preferred obedience by the intolerant physical persecution of verbal disagreement. That is, of course, the essence of totalitarianism, whether it spews from antifa or the KKK. The only difference between these imaginary opponents is the numerical superiority of the liberal mob over the equally intolerant rest.
2
The 40,000 had as much right to free speech as the 40 in the gazebo. This was not a private venue but a public park. Please try and understand, the 1st Amendment only prevents the government from restricting free speech, not the negative reception from the crowd.
Here in LA last year an irate Dodger fan killed a SF Giant fan in the parking lot at Dodger stadium after the game. I'm amazed we still allow baseball to be played in this country.
1
I note the article mentioned a Texas demonstration in the city of Dallas where multiple police officers had been tragically murdered earlier last year. Some people carrying military style weaponry were in evidence claiming to be neutral security volunteers.
Given the poisonous polarity of our current politics and tribalism, you will excuse me if I find the claim of neutrality suspect. Local and state law enforcement provide, or need to provide, security and safety. That is what our tax dollars purchase and that is what persons exercising free speech rights on any side of politics fully expect. Armed civilians can only create fear and anxiety and make the police job more difficult.
Given the poisonous polarity of our current politics and tribalism, you will excuse me if I find the claim of neutrality suspect. Local and state law enforcement provide, or need to provide, security and safety. That is what our tax dollars purchase and that is what persons exercising free speech rights on any side of politics fully expect. Armed civilians can only create fear and anxiety and make the police job more difficult.
8
Rest assured that if the Texas Elite III% did more than just walk around with arms on display, that other Texans would put them in their place.
1
These demonstrators are trying to impose their beliefs on others and limit their rights of free speech. They are a threat to our democracy. The violence in Charlottesville errupted for this very reason.
1
And vice versa.
I am on the left but the removal of these monuments is wrong. People trying to revise history is wrong. To take historical personages and judge them by current standards is wrong. I heard a woman on CNN named Angela Rye say that she wants the monuments to Washington and Jefferson removed because they were slave owners and she is wrong.
2
Take these statues out of public spaces and put them in a museum and in the correct historical context. Problem solved.
11
There is a difference between remembrance of history and reverence of history. See New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu's speech on the removal of Confederate statues.
1
The Big Cheese always says what he really means first. It will be important in the time he remains in office to consider the later statements to be revisions that result from internal White House and RNC pressure. He is what his first words and actions represent. There is no "pivot"; only carefully worded damage control.
8
When I read about the courageous people who put down their phones, tablets, computers, remotes and.... to protest, I feel a sense a pride in a way that I haven't since that awful bigot took up residence in the Oval Office. It's sad that it took the death of a young woman to galvanize the good people of this nation to action and to further expose Trump for the phony / liar he truly is.
8
The POTUS is not a bigot. Where did this thought and belief come from Post- November 8, 2016?
1
Where did the thought and belief that Trump is a bigot come from? Oh, I dunno... maybe...
— He attacked Muslim Gold Star Parents
— He claimed an American-born judge was biased because "He's a Mexican."
— Trump Management Corp. was sued - twice - by the federal government for racial discrimination due to not renting units to African-American appicants
— According to a book written in 1991 by John O'Donnell (a former president of Trump Plaza and Hotel), Trump said this about a black Trump employee: "I think the guy is lazy... and it's probably not his fault because laziness is a trait in blacks. It really is, I believe that. It’s not anything they can control.”
— He was a major proponent of the 'birther' movement, continuing to perpetuate that myth long after everyone else disowned it as being false.
— He encouraged mob justice against the 'Central Park Five,' and continued to proclaim the guilt of the five men, even after they had been cleared and exonerated due to DNA evidence.
— Claimed Mexicans were 'rapists'
— Instituted a self-proclaimed 'Muslim Ban,' — barring entry of persons from 7 Muslim-majority countries — none of which have ever perpetrated a terrorist attack on U.S. soil
And don't even get me started on women, the disabled, war heroes, asians, etc...
— He attacked Muslim Gold Star Parents
— He claimed an American-born judge was biased because "He's a Mexican."
— Trump Management Corp. was sued - twice - by the federal government for racial discrimination due to not renting units to African-American appicants
— According to a book written in 1991 by John O'Donnell (a former president of Trump Plaza and Hotel), Trump said this about a black Trump employee: "I think the guy is lazy... and it's probably not his fault because laziness is a trait in blacks. It really is, I believe that. It’s not anything they can control.”
— He was a major proponent of the 'birther' movement, continuing to perpetuate that myth long after everyone else disowned it as being false.
— He encouraged mob justice against the 'Central Park Five,' and continued to proclaim the guilt of the five men, even after they had been cleared and exonerated due to DNA evidence.
— Claimed Mexicans were 'rapists'
— Instituted a self-proclaimed 'Muslim Ban,' — barring entry of persons from 7 Muslim-majority countries — none of which have ever perpetrated a terrorist attack on U.S. soil
And don't even get me started on women, the disabled, war heroes, asians, etc...
1
Apparently freedom of speech to these demonstrators only applies to people who do, say and believe what they do. Otherwise they are capable of the same violence and hatred that they are supposedly condemning.
The violence in Charlottesville erupted for this very reason.
The violence in Charlottesville erupted for this very reason.
1
these reporters have a big problem with consistency in using names for the different sides. Makes this article pretty uninformative or maybe seriously misinforming.
1
Not interested in his tweets. We are not juveniles. Let's see him live and make the commendable accolade so I can look him in the eye and sense the sincerity in tone. His Saturday live statement had the "right" things as well but was clearly scripted and not from the heart. He has always been a charlatan on the subject. No thanks.
4
It's much too late for Trump to walk back his racist comments and obvious support of the white power and Nazi elements in this country. The president's mouth is much like a computer: garbage in, garbage out. He has set in stone his place in history and he can't alter that assessment. At present, along with many Americans, I am deeply concerned that he controls the nation's nuclear arsenal.
5
Socialists and communists d/b/a Democrats criminally attack and/or defame as racist, fascist ALL of their political opponents engaged in free speech/assembly and then argue free speech/assembly rights of their political opponents must be infringed to avoid Democrat attacks.
2
This is not a left vs. right, democrat vs. republican, or academic issue. First amendment rights do not apply to intolerance and persecution. Any movement that preaches intolerance and persecution must be outside the law (see Karl Popper).
You should have led with his first nasty tweet where he called the protests "anti-police agitators." Someone clearly took hold of his phone later in the day...someone with a dictionary or who knew how to spell "heal" has opposed to spelling it "heel" twice....
The man has made it clear what "side" he is on.
The man has made it clear what "side" he is on.
6
You can't be a white supremist in this country. People will come out and oppose you, and since you preach violence they will get violent too. We've seen that movie before and we don't want to see it again.
3
Does anybody know any neonazi/white supremacists? In all my years of being a white guy, I have never met one.
4
Yes.
I know a large number of white supremacists.
I grew up in the Deep South and heard and saw them in action.
I know a large number of white supremacists.
I grew up in the Deep South and heard and saw them in action.
8
Mark it's hard to believe that you don't know any Trump supporters?
7
Many of us predicted that a Trump presidency would awaken an apathetic public and energize dissent all across the land. We were mocked by the Clinton supporters, mocked and denounced as sexists and haters.
Still waiting for the apologies...
https://emcphd.wordpress.com
Still waiting for the apologies...
https://emcphd.wordpress.com
3
I supported (and voted) for Hillary Clinton — not only because I thought she was smart, capable, and had good ideas, but also because I knew that Trump was a racist, misogynistic, amoral, ignorant, narcissistic, sociopathic buffoon. Trust me, most Hillary supporters knew EXACTLY what Trump is. Much more it seems than some of Berners and most of the followers of Jill Stein, whose basic mantra was 'There's no difference between them... if anything Hillary's worse."
I place much of the blame for the Trump presidency at the feet of those who rejected the better candidate because she wasn't the perfect candidate. You gave us Trump because either your 'moral superiority,' your apathy or your inactive ignorance allowed him to squeak through a electoral win.
I'm still waiting for MY apology.
I place much of the blame for the Trump presidency at the feet of those who rejected the better candidate because she wasn't the perfect candidate. You gave us Trump because either your 'moral superiority,' your apathy or your inactive ignorance allowed him to squeak through a electoral win.
I'm still waiting for MY apology.
1
I wonder how much longer it will take before our Jewish friends will not want to hear the term "NAZI" anymore. I am already there. Enough.
2
Let's find all the hateful people and stone them to show what good, tolerant people WE are.
1
Congratulations to the counter-protesters who came out in their many thousands. Thanks also to the the police, especially in Boston, whose presence assured safety. I remember studying the rise of the Nazi Brown Shirts in Germany. They could attack people and destroy property because the police stood silently and let them do so.
5
I wonder if that middle aged woman got her American flag back from the counter-protester who absconded with it?
You and your 100 followers are free to speak about whatever you want. If you want to talk in a public place, then me and my 40,000 friends are free to stand next to you and speak about what we want.
That's free speech. There is not requirement that we listen to you.
That's free speech. There is not requirement that we listen to you.
17
Amen, Patricia! Thank you.
2
So, this only confirms, much ado about nothing.
The same people who scoff at those "cowards" getting "hysterical" and "all worked up" about a few thousand mass murders by Islamists, telling them "get used to it, that,s the price of diversity, no big deal", are now getting all hysterical and "all worked up", to the point of getting violent themselves, over a tiny, disorganized and powerless movement, who at most, say and write nasty things, or at most commit "violent incidents" that aren't serious enough to even qualify as terrorism...
It's the difference between dozens of premeditated attacks against hundreds of innocent strangers going about their business on the streets and in the bars and concert venues of their cities, and a single young man running his car into a crowd of people attacking his friends in the heat of a violent confrontation...
The same people who scoff at those "cowards" getting "hysterical" and "all worked up" about a few thousand mass murders by Islamists, telling them "get used to it, that,s the price of diversity, no big deal", are now getting all hysterical and "all worked up", to the point of getting violent themselves, over a tiny, disorganized and powerless movement, who at most, say and write nasty things, or at most commit "violent incidents" that aren't serious enough to even qualify as terrorism...
It's the difference between dozens of premeditated attacks against hundreds of innocent strangers going about their business on the streets and in the bars and concert venues of their cities, and a single young man running his car into a crowd of people attacking his friends in the heat of a violent confrontation...
2
protesting racism intolerance, bigotry is not much ado about nothing
6
There were no attacks on the street where that young man ran down all those people. Trying to justify that action is insulting to sane people "on many sides" Literally no one is justifying that behavior. You may be the first.
6
Mixed feelings - LOVE the counter to hatred and the peaceful march in Boston. But we need dialogue - we need open dialogue. It seems there's some misunderstanding between the groups - one group saying these counter-protests are just anti-trump or others saying "I'm not a Nazi - I just march with them." I think there needs to be some deconstruction and a face on to 'what is racism' and 'what is intolerance?' There seems to be a faction of angry white men (and some women) on both sides - there is where things need to be addressed. Extremism is a result of a restless and alienated youth - that's who ISIS targets.
2
Wiggz's comment that he saw the rally in Dallas as anti-Trump and not pro-human rights is indicative of the refusal of certain sectors of our society to give up on their bad decision, and to say: Sorry, I was wrong.
Trump "shifted his tone."
Not good enough.
We need a president with a steady hand and firm convictions that advocate for fairness and equality.
Trump can't be gone soon enough.
Not good enough.
We need a president with a steady hand and firm convictions that advocate for fairness and equality.
Trump can't be gone soon enough.
3
Please look up what Robert E. Lee said about monuments of this type.
People can make mistakes part of being a human being. If they reject the hate and the white supremacist beliefs and if they need to make amend that does change things
It is claimed that Harry Truman said he had almost joined the KKK as a young man but as President he was so horrified by the treatment of "colored" soldiers that that was what pushed him to integrate the services.
People can make mistakes part of being a human being. If they reject the hate and the white supremacist beliefs and if they need to make amend that does change things
It is claimed that Harry Truman said he had almost joined the KKK as a young man but as President he was so horrified by the treatment of "colored" soldiers that that was what pushed him to integrate the services.
1
I'm grateful that the rallies were mostly peaceful. I cannot even fathom carrying bottles of urine to throw at police. Such people want violence.
Me, I want peace free from the threats of the kkk, other white supremacists, neo-nazis and the like. They are a boil on the surface of this nation, looking to capitalize on Mr. Trump's ill behavior and threatening and insulting words.
Me, I want peace free from the threats of the kkk, other white supremacists, neo-nazis and the like. They are a boil on the surface of this nation, looking to capitalize on Mr. Trump's ill behavior and threatening and insulting words.
11
To amplify several comments, there is a bizarre idea abroad in this country that freedom of speech means freedom from contradiction.
14
Interestingly, the Left makes places greater importance about Trump's timing than about the ideas of the demonstrators. Notice how they avoid discussing the problems with our economy as if our economic problems are some very minor issue. If you're a conservative you're aware of our economic problems. If you ask a Progressive Liberal, who stupidly follows the Left without any critical thought then I expect you'll continue to hate Trump.
5
Don't generalize about everyone on the Left, Thomas.
You're way off base to do so.
Also, the Progressives who supported Senator Bernie Sanders were focused, as he is, on the economy of the nation.
It pays to do research.
You're way off base to do so.
Also, the Progressives who supported Senator Bernie Sanders were focused, as he is, on the economy of the nation.
It pays to do research.
2
We were very aware of our economic problems under George W Bush, who took a healthy economy and budget surplus and messed it up. That left President Obama to clean up the mess. No, we're not fully recovered, but Trump's ideas- and the Republican Cingress- would mess us up again.
3
It should be noted the so-called president also said: "Looks like many anti-police agitators in Boston." Schizophrenic? This constantly raises the question which tweets are actually from the so-called president, and which are from his marketing people.
6
Keith, Interesting that you can make a medical diagnosis from seven words in a tweet... Where did you get this superhuman skill? Perhaps you can put it to better use by diagnosing why Liberals are so easily programed by Alt-Left to hate everyone who does not want a Socialist state, and why so many "White Extremist" think that the Conservatives do not equate them to the "Alt-Right" - if you put your superhuman skills to this, rather than slamming the duly elected President because you want to keep your ObamaPhone.
Pilot, I didn't make a medical diagnosis. You overlooked the question mark. Spend more time, next time.
1
As gleaming of praise this article gives to the counter protesters who were by all accounts there illegally and given the number of arrests were not that peaceful. The author failed to produce any fact that the the original rally members were in fact actually white supremacists or Nazis. The only thing I gathered from the article was the author mockingly putting free speech in quotations but not supplying any evidence to the contrary. If that is true and the the original rally was actually about the silencing of free speech then one can only gather that the protesters were either wrong or at the wrong event or the protesters and the author of this article are against free speech. These are scary times we live in. Knee jerk reactions to complex problems by over emotional people can only lead to a bad place.
6
That last sentence is a perfect description of your president.
6
To quote Winston Churchill:
"we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender"
Trump and the Republicans are the worst for the United States and her people.
What the people who are not for Trump and the Republicans have to do is make the Nation aware, that the fight against the aforementioned is a constant struggle to rid the country of this evil group!
Sadly, many of us were duped by what we thought would be a replacement for Clinton. For all of her foibles, she appears to be an angel compared to the devil brought out by the Republicans!
"we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender"
Trump and the Republicans are the worst for the United States and her people.
What the people who are not for Trump and the Republicans have to do is make the Nation aware, that the fight against the aforementioned is a constant struggle to rid the country of this evil group!
Sadly, many of us were duped by what we thought would be a replacement for Clinton. For all of her foibles, she appears to be an angel compared to the devil brought out by the Republicans!
6
She was the only qualified candidate. As President Obama said the most qualified ever. Thanks Bernie, for nothing.
8
Marching against free speech at a free speech rally that made it clear there were no hate groups involved.
4
The people were protesting naziism, racism and hate, not free speech. Indeed, they used their free speech rights to peacefully do so.
6
It appears that free speech is fine as long as the protestors agree with it.
It appears that removing monuments and statues of some Americans is fine as long as the protestors disagree with their views and actions.
It appears that the ACLU is for protecting civil liberties unless it's for people they disagree with.
It appears that, if a company does not agree with someone's politics, it can ban its sites, exclude it from its search engines - in effect, denying it the free press.
It appears that companies can fire people whose politics it doesn't agree with.
This smells so much of things that happened nearly 100 years ago in Europe.
It looks so much like what was fought for in the civil rights era.
What is going wrong with us?
And, just in case, the typical NYT poster responds in the usual manner - attacking the messenger - I am neither black nor white, not religious, and am highly educated.
It appears that removing monuments and statues of some Americans is fine as long as the protestors disagree with their views and actions.
It appears that the ACLU is for protecting civil liberties unless it's for people they disagree with.
It appears that, if a company does not agree with someone's politics, it can ban its sites, exclude it from its search engines - in effect, denying it the free press.
It appears that companies can fire people whose politics it doesn't agree with.
This smells so much of things that happened nearly 100 years ago in Europe.
It looks so much like what was fought for in the civil rights era.
What is going wrong with us?
And, just in case, the typical NYT poster responds in the usual manner - attacking the messenger - I am neither black nor white, not religious, and am highly educated.
5
Actually Chris, the ACLU helped the neo-nazis and white supremacists get their permit for Charlottesville. Check it out.
6
Chris - PRAVDA ! My wife grew up in the CCCP and is shocked these liberals are so blinded by history... and current events in the Socialist Utopia of Venezuela.
1
Yes people protesting white supremacy are right. End of story.
6
I was on the Boston Common yesterday and I'd like to share a few observations.
1) The police did a fantastic job. They merged with the crowd, were respectful, and demonstrated truly admirable restraint when moving in to de-escalate tense situations. Many people thanked them afterwards.
2) Most people there were expecting alt-right violence, and they were willing to put their bodies on the line to protest this violence. It was another proud episode in Boston's long history of resisting such forces.
3) I witnessed one violent episode where a Trump supporter sprayed mace. He was thrown to the ground, but the violence ended there. The crowd escorted him off the Common, while it shouted "No violence!" and "We are not the problem!"
4) Many in the crowd wanted to hear what the "free speech" speakers had to say. But no one could hear them because the organizers forgot to bring a sound system.
5) Several of the organizers were too cowardly to even show up, including alt-right twinky Gavin McInnes, and Kyle Chapman, who apparently prefers situations where it is safe to beat up women a third of his weight. Nothing highlights the bright yellow streak running down the back of their movement more than this.
1) The police did a fantastic job. They merged with the crowd, were respectful, and demonstrated truly admirable restraint when moving in to de-escalate tense situations. Many people thanked them afterwards.
2) Most people there were expecting alt-right violence, and they were willing to put their bodies on the line to protest this violence. It was another proud episode in Boston's long history of resisting such forces.
3) I witnessed one violent episode where a Trump supporter sprayed mace. He was thrown to the ground, but the violence ended there. The crowd escorted him off the Common, while it shouted "No violence!" and "We are not the problem!"
4) Many in the crowd wanted to hear what the "free speech" speakers had to say. But no one could hear them because the organizers forgot to bring a sound system.
5) Several of the organizers were too cowardly to even show up, including alt-right twinky Gavin McInnes, and Kyle Chapman, who apparently prefers situations where it is safe to beat up women a third of his weight. Nothing highlights the bright yellow streak running down the back of their movement more than this.
102
Regarding # 3, how do you know who the mace user was associated with at the Commons?
3 years, 5 months left to go on this nightmare presidency.
I've marched in anti-Vietnam, pro-choice, pro LGBT and take-back-the-night rallies and gatherings, to name a few. Now we march against Unite the Right.
While trump legitimized the Alt-Right, the Nation and Europe have clearly demonstrated their will. Our voices are once again on the right side of history. We were then and we are now.
For me, what makes it different today is that we have Open Carry laws that enable Alt-Right armed militia to freely and legally walk in support of and protect their Alt-right to speak their blasphemy. This is a dangerous time. When the AntiFa start to arm and walk in support of those of us against the Right, I have no doubt that bullets will start flying and innocent will start dying.
We are in a delicate balance. What the Nation needs is a president who will speak against wrongs and give the Nation a vision for a peaceful future, free of ethnocentrism, supporting our founding diversity.
That is currently not the man who is occupying the role of president.
I've marched in anti-Vietnam, pro-choice, pro LGBT and take-back-the-night rallies and gatherings, to name a few. Now we march against Unite the Right.
While trump legitimized the Alt-Right, the Nation and Europe have clearly demonstrated their will. Our voices are once again on the right side of history. We were then and we are now.
For me, what makes it different today is that we have Open Carry laws that enable Alt-Right armed militia to freely and legally walk in support of and protect their Alt-right to speak their blasphemy. This is a dangerous time. When the AntiFa start to arm and walk in support of those of us against the Right, I have no doubt that bullets will start flying and innocent will start dying.
We are in a delicate balance. What the Nation needs is a president who will speak against wrongs and give the Nation a vision for a peaceful future, free of ethnocentrism, supporting our founding diversity.
That is currently not the man who is occupying the role of president.
11
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Voltaire (Attribution by Evelyn Beatrice Hall.)
Any movement that preaches intolerance and persecution must be outside the law (see Karl Popper).
I think someone has taken control of Trump's Twitter account.
2
Speaking of flags...
I just watched video footage of a middle aged woman at the Boston protests being dragged and knocked down by black-clad, masked "counter protesters".
The woman was holding up an American flag. A column of "counter protesters" marched by the woman, and one of them grabbed the flag from the woman's hand, and then dragged her to the ground with it.
Strangely...I don't see any mention of this on the front page of NYT. Why is this?
If the circumstances were different, and a "white nationalist" assaulted a "counter protester" (imagine if the "counter protester" was a minority!), it would be splashed across the NYT web site and the subject of several stories/opinion pieces.
Just more slanted coverage, and proof positive that this paper is 100% in the corner of the "counter protesters", who are a grab bag of radical anarchists, instigators, and fascists (ironic for an organization nominally against fascism).
I just watched video footage of a middle aged woman at the Boston protests being dragged and knocked down by black-clad, masked "counter protesters".
The woman was holding up an American flag. A column of "counter protesters" marched by the woman, and one of them grabbed the flag from the woman's hand, and then dragged her to the ground with it.
Strangely...I don't see any mention of this on the front page of NYT. Why is this?
If the circumstances were different, and a "white nationalist" assaulted a "counter protester" (imagine if the "counter protester" was a minority!), it would be splashed across the NYT web site and the subject of several stories/opinion pieces.
Just more slanted coverage, and proof positive that this paper is 100% in the corner of the "counter protesters", who are a grab bag of radical anarchists, instigators, and fascists (ironic for an organization nominally against fascism).
7
@ Mike S. CT - Slow down and first tell us exactly what video you saw. If it is a video available at YouTube or a newspaper give us the URL and tell us exactly the point in the video at which you saw this.
Can the woman be identified? The masked man presumable cannot be identified. A basic legal condition at all such demonstrations should be that any masked individual can be arrested.
Assertions are not helpful. Neither are wild generalizations. Your two final paragraphs consist entirely of such and therefore remove you from consideration as a reliable observer.
If you gave accurate information it might have been possible to connect the masked man to an organization. That man could easily have been a member of the White Supremacy gang or a member of anti-Fa or similar. He cannot have been in any way a representative member of the 1000s who marched peacefully.
Can the woman be identified? The masked man presumable cannot be identified. A basic legal condition at all such demonstrations should be that any masked individual can be arrested.
Assertions are not helpful. Neither are wild generalizations. Your two final paragraphs consist entirely of such and therefore remove you from consideration as a reliable observer.
If you gave accurate information it might have been possible to connect the masked man to an organization. That man could easily have been a member of the White Supremacy gang or a member of anti-Fa or similar. He cannot have been in any way a representative member of the 1000s who marched peacefully.
1
Can we check to see if it was legit and not doctored. Where's your source?
2
I notice you don't provide a link. Makes one doubt the veracity of your story.
2
Of course I watch the 6.30 pm news now. A lot is happening, people hitting each other, opposing principals on every subject, our President constantly figuring out how he can stay on first, whatever. But then my interest suddenly evaporates when advertising takes over like what pills to pop, what hotel to stay in, what car to buy or what ever. Every single day we are reminded that the recent problems are a gift to the TV Stations. They must be making a fortune suddenly. Their taxes should be raised.
1
Trump applauding the protesters out in the street...against 'racism'? Is he trying to pretend to feel something towards 'others'? It likely represents a contradiction in terms, an oxymoron if there ever was one. Trump's narcissism is a medical condition that deters the 'patient' from acknowledging 'the other', let alone stop his bigotry. He is likely trying to save his sore behind, before it's too late (and it is too late).
3
The POTUS is not a racist or anti-Semite. Stop the propaganda of the narrow minded Far Left. Manfred Marcus with that said, "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Voltaire (Attribution by Evelyn Beatrice Hall.)
manfred - are you actually a Bolivian, or just there to partake in their fine "marching dust" ? Easy for a person in another hemisphere to be critical of our President. Tell us, where did you get your Medical degree, and with Board of Psychiatry certified your credentials ? In the USA, competent medical staff do not offer a diagnosis without at least examining the Patient. Maybe in Bolivia, things are different in Medicine as well.
1
Trump - too little, too late.
2
Trump on point there are good people on both sides and there are violent bad people on both sides. Most people want to keep the Confederate statues but the instigating pro violent media wants to promote hate and violence and ignore the fact most people want to keep the statues.
A majority of Americans polled in an NPR/PBS News Hours/Marist poll believe that statues of honoring leaders of the Confederacy should remain as a historical symbol.
Of the 1,125 adults surveyed, 62% believe they should remain, 27% believe they should be removed because they are offensive and 11% are unsure.
A majority of Americans polled in an NPR/PBS News Hours/Marist poll believe that statues of honoring leaders of the Confederacy should remain as a historical symbol.
Of the 1,125 adults surveyed, 62% believe they should remain, 27% believe they should be removed because they are offensive and 11% are unsure.
2
Diane - Please share your wisdom with us, rather than just complain. What would YOU do ? Details please.
1
There is a difference between remembrance of history and reverence of history. See New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu's speech addressing the removal of Confederate statues.
2
Boston Strong! Boston did all America proud.
6
Freedom of speech: OKAY.
Moral equivalence: NOT OKAY.
Violence: NOT OKAY.
Threats of violence (weapons): NOT OKAY.
Moral equivalence: NOT OKAY.
Violence: NOT OKAY.
Threats of violence (weapons): NOT OKAY.
2
Antifa and BLM have been coming to every conservative rally with violence so much so that other groups are prepared and the police in these communities are instructed stand down.
3
"I just watched video footage of a middle aged woman at the Boston protests being dragged and knocked down by black-clad, masked "counter protesters".
The woman was holding up an American flag. A column of "counter protesters" marched by the woman, and one of them grabbed the flag from the woman's hand, and then dragged her to the ground with it."
The woman was holding up an American flag. A column of "counter protesters" marched by the woman, and one of them grabbed the flag from the woman's hand, and then dragged her to the ground with it."
So...
"But elsewhere in the country, officials were moving to defuse anger that surrounded the revived debate about Confederate monuments."
What "debate" would that be? We have a congress that is supposed to represent the people of this country who, according to a poll taken by NPR do not favor the removal of these Confederate monuments by 73%, and the poll showed even 44% of African Americans (and also an equal number of Democrats) did not favor their removal, either. In fact, only 47% of Democrats favored the removal of these Confederate monuments, not even a majority there. The fact is, according to the NPR poll, only 27% of Americans favor the removal of these monuments. There has never been any national "debate" about it, and a vocal minority of Americans is simply riding roughshod over the majority and bullying the majority because our own representatives in congress are afraid to say anything for fear of being denounced, if they say anything about it, as racists and supremacists by publications like the NYT, even though this whole monument removal scheme is clearly meant to inflame race relations, insult, demean, and denounce the South as their detractors stand around and gloat about their defeat and humiliation, further inflaming racial tensions. It has nothing to do with what happened 150 years ago, but then, there has never been any "debate" about this. Just grandstanding, insults, and intimidation by the minority who favor removal.
"But elsewhere in the country, officials were moving to defuse anger that surrounded the revived debate about Confederate monuments."
What "debate" would that be? We have a congress that is supposed to represent the people of this country who, according to a poll taken by NPR do not favor the removal of these Confederate monuments by 73%, and the poll showed even 44% of African Americans (and also an equal number of Democrats) did not favor their removal, either. In fact, only 47% of Democrats favored the removal of these Confederate monuments, not even a majority there. The fact is, according to the NPR poll, only 27% of Americans favor the removal of these monuments. There has never been any national "debate" about it, and a vocal minority of Americans is simply riding roughshod over the majority and bullying the majority because our own representatives in congress are afraid to say anything for fear of being denounced, if they say anything about it, as racists and supremacists by publications like the NYT, even though this whole monument removal scheme is clearly meant to inflame race relations, insult, demean, and denounce the South as their detractors stand around and gloat about their defeat and humiliation, further inflaming racial tensions. It has nothing to do with what happened 150 years ago, but then, there has never been any "debate" about this. Just grandstanding, insults, and intimidation by the minority who favor removal.
19
RichD:
As I read your comments, I am reminded of people who used to insist that the earth was the center of the universe--and just how wrong they were.
The polls you cite, those concerning the statues, do not deal with the nuance of statue removal to spaces aimed at educating a large and ignorant swath of the nation about the Confederate Lost Cause: http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2001/04/12/southern-comfort/ . Just because statues are removed from an existing space does not mean they need to be destroyed, or that they cannot perform a more honest and thoughtful educational purpose.
Your comments do not reflect the marching of belligerent, bigoted thugs armed with military-style weapons and torches reminiscent of the Klan, through Charlottesville, a peaceful university community. You ignore the dominant ideologies of those thugs, who also do not care much about statues, but rather about their preferred ethnic cullings.
You are guilty of the wilful ignorance that is being opposed.
As I read your comments, I am reminded of people who used to insist that the earth was the center of the universe--and just how wrong they were.
The polls you cite, those concerning the statues, do not deal with the nuance of statue removal to spaces aimed at educating a large and ignorant swath of the nation about the Confederate Lost Cause: http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2001/04/12/southern-comfort/ . Just because statues are removed from an existing space does not mean they need to be destroyed, or that they cannot perform a more honest and thoughtful educational purpose.
Your comments do not reflect the marching of belligerent, bigoted thugs armed with military-style weapons and torches reminiscent of the Klan, through Charlottesville, a peaceful university community. You ignore the dominant ideologies of those thugs, who also do not care much about statues, but rather about their preferred ethnic cullings.
You are guilty of the wilful ignorance that is being opposed.
6
Ahhhhh ... RichD ... you managed to find your daily fix of victimization in the removal of statues that were built by bigots to protest advances in civil rights and voting rights and human rights. We libruls are happy to provide that service for you. Enjoy!
4
Nah. The statues in question were being removed by the communities in which they were erected based on decisions made by the communities themselves. It is white supremacists and the right -including many out of towners--who are stirring the pot and promoting the false concept of a "monument removal scheme." This creates a mighty good distraction for the rich to continue to pillage the country through relaxed labor and environmental standards and God knows what relaxed financial protections. We should all try not to take our eyes off the ball.
4
The very notion that white supremacy with its 25,000 or so adherents (in country of 330M) is ridiculous. The NYTImes and liberal media, which largely ignores the real existential and ideological threats posed by the 20% of muslins worldwide who admit to supporting radial Islam, in other words a REAL supremacist threat, continue to fan the flames of a puny controversy, one which would not exist without the generous support of and inaccurate and hysterical news coverage.
This fake news story is now become agitprop used as another club to bash a president Trump--who has this issue EXACTLY RIGHT. The majority of intelligent Americans ( of all levels of education and social status) can see this. The average liberal looney cannot.
Those protesting the removal of General Lee's statue in Charlottesville we're definitely not all white supremacists or neo-nazis. When my wife told me that they were gathering in Charlottesville to protest the removal of the confederate statue I immediately said that any sane person should be in Charlottesville doing the same.
This is NOT a white supremacists issue but an issue of protecting our own history and its remembrance from the blind and destructive force of political correctness, a force that stands completely uncriticized by the leftist mainstream media. You should all be profoundly ashamed for the senseless destruction of our national monuments.
This fake news story is now become agitprop used as another club to bash a president Trump--who has this issue EXACTLY RIGHT. The majority of intelligent Americans ( of all levels of education and social status) can see this. The average liberal looney cannot.
Those protesting the removal of General Lee's statue in Charlottesville we're definitely not all white supremacists or neo-nazis. When my wife told me that they were gathering in Charlottesville to protest the removal of the confederate statue I immediately said that any sane person should be in Charlottesville doing the same.
This is NOT a white supremacists issue but an issue of protecting our own history and its remembrance from the blind and destructive force of political correctness, a force that stands completely uncriticized by the leftist mainstream media. You should all be profoundly ashamed for the senseless destruction of our national monuments.
3
There is a difference between remembrance of history and reverence of history. See New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu's speech on the removal of Confederate statues.
4
I'm curious about commenters who blame the alt right on Trump, who say he stands for hate & discrimination, that he is in or openly supports the KKK /Nazis, he's racist, etc. --- what evidence do you have?
Are you the same commentariat who are certain Trump colluded with Russia, is Putin's puppet & other fact less conspiracy theories?
Other than hating Trump because he isn't progressive -- what policies do you disagree with? You realize elections have consequences and conservatives opposed Obama based on his policies, not his race. And by extension they opposed HRC -- plus she was a horrible candidate.
White supremacy, slavery, Jim Crow, racism, Nazism are all deplorable...that lunatic fringe has a right to free speech. And you know it is a fringe, a very small fringe.
And for those claiming that the fringe is growing or is suddenly emboldened by Trump -- where is your proof?
And I hope you realize that as deplorable as white supremacists are, that the greater threat to democracy is the violent suppression of free speech by groups such as antifa, and the deliberate calls for violence against police by BLM -- and the deliberate attempt by the entire progressive left to undermine and discredit Trump's presidency and disenfranchise those who voted for him.
White supremacist = fringe group. The progressive left and its violent suppression of speech, their disruption of the democratic process unfortunately is not a fringe group but a serious threat.
Are you the same commentariat who are certain Trump colluded with Russia, is Putin's puppet & other fact less conspiracy theories?
Other than hating Trump because he isn't progressive -- what policies do you disagree with? You realize elections have consequences and conservatives opposed Obama based on his policies, not his race. And by extension they opposed HRC -- plus she was a horrible candidate.
White supremacy, slavery, Jim Crow, racism, Nazism are all deplorable...that lunatic fringe has a right to free speech. And you know it is a fringe, a very small fringe.
And for those claiming that the fringe is growing or is suddenly emboldened by Trump -- where is your proof?
And I hope you realize that as deplorable as white supremacists are, that the greater threat to democracy is the violent suppression of free speech by groups such as antifa, and the deliberate calls for violence against police by BLM -- and the deliberate attempt by the entire progressive left to undermine and discredit Trump's presidency and disenfranchise those who voted for him.
White supremacist = fringe group. The progressive left and its violent suppression of speech, their disruption of the democratic process unfortunately is not a fringe group but a serious threat.
5
There were no White Supremacists in Boston, this was a free speech rally by a few conservatives. Looks like he organizers told thousands of people something that was a total lie. There is no free speech any where in the US unless it is the liberals speaking.
This is dangerous for the country. The left wing media have gone nuts now and indoctrinated many people with things that are not true.
Most of us older folks lost a parent or uncle in WWII and think the anything to do with Nazis is abhorrent.
There were no conservatives in Charlotte but there were two groups of people with very bad intentions and an innocent life was lost.
Wolf Blitzer actually said yesterday that he thought Barcelona might be a copy cat attack inspired by Charlotte!
You decide who is unhinged.
This is dangerous for the country. The left wing media have gone nuts now and indoctrinated many people with things that are not true.
Most of us older folks lost a parent or uncle in WWII and think the anything to do with Nazis is abhorrent.
There were no conservatives in Charlotte but there were two groups of people with very bad intentions and an innocent life was lost.
Wolf Blitzer actually said yesterday that he thought Barcelona might be a copy cat attack inspired by Charlotte!
You decide who is unhinged.
6
The harsh message that was screamed from every reporter, every entertainer, every Democrat in existence -- "The 'White Supremacists' and "Nazi's' are taking over the country as well as supporting a murderer with a car. And their leader is the hated President.
It turns out the "alt right" jerks are just wannabes that give Democrat Ward Bosses the opportunity to gather great numbers of their base. Hence an aptly named "Free Speech" crew that were not allowed their First Amendment rights by a huge bunch of activist-led protesters.
And the message about the Americans silenced here and elsewhere is "They deserve it!" - Because free speech is only allowed if it is MY free speech.
It turns out the "alt right" jerks are just wannabes that give Democrat Ward Bosses the opportunity to gather great numbers of their base. Hence an aptly named "Free Speech" crew that were not allowed their First Amendment rights by a huge bunch of activist-led protesters.
And the message about the Americans silenced here and elsewhere is "They deserve it!" - Because free speech is only allowed if it is MY free speech.
4
When do these Red Guards tear down the statue of noted racist FDR in DC for his internment of Japanese-Americans? Or do racist Democrats get a pass?
5
would not surprise me if Trump took credit for the people protesting AGAINST the white supremacists -- he's done that type of doublespeak before, when he sees how big the crowd is, where the flow is going and when it can benefit him.
4
People in this country are under the delusion that we have free speech. The FCC censors our media. George Carlin's bit "Seven Words You Can't Say On Television" was no longer aired on radio after someone complained about it. The case went to the Supreme Court and the Court ruled in favor of the FCC. We do not have free speech in America.
Two comments:
1. Mores have changed. Carlin's bit was brilliant, but you hear those seven words on TV all the time now... for better or worse.
2. More to the point: This is not really what freedom of speech is about. To paraphrase Yakov Smirnoff: "In Russia we have freedom of speech. You can say anything you like ... once!"
1. Mores have changed. Carlin's bit was brilliant, but you hear those seven words on TV all the time now... for better or worse.
2. More to the point: This is not really what freedom of speech is about. To paraphrase Yakov Smirnoff: "In Russia we have freedom of speech. You can say anything you like ... once!"
1
Thousands of demonstrators poured into the nation's streets and parks on Saturday to denounce white supremacy and end Freedom of Speech.
1
This is not about freedom of speech. It's about denouncing hatred, racism, and bigotry. Saying this is about free speech, is like the southerners saying the Civil War was about states rights. It was about keeping their slaves.
6
Sadly, for you and America, you miss the point.
1
When, in the history of the United States, have the statements and actions of a president invoked nearly continuous demonstrations and social unrest beginning with his election? This administration has grossly insulted our neighbors and allies, exhibited contempt for the health and well being of U.S. citizens by attempting to revoke health insurance as well as environmental protections, and induced fear in the world population through its thinly veiled threats of nuclear exchange with North Korea. We are only eight months into a regime that requires far too much effort just to maintain a veneer of sanity. How long will the legislative branch of our government continue to find this tolerable?
3
Richard Nixon..The Vietnam war..early 70's...twas quite a time.
1
lying at the center of all this upheaval - a duffer-in-chief who promotes hate groups.
stop dancing around the primary cause of the problem and FIRE HIM.
stop dancing around the primary cause of the problem and FIRE HIM.
2
To demonstrate his opposition to White Supremacy, Donald Trump should sign an executive order to rename any road, bridge, highway or any other government-funded entity which is currently named after any white racist. First to go will be scores of such places currently named for Robert Byrd, the longtime Democrat Senator and high-ranking KKK leader.
1
If there's anything at which this this country is expert, it's missing the point. And of course that includes politicians of all stripes . . . as a matter of fact, some of them should be wearing stripes.
1
I don't for one moment believe Trump composed the positive tweet. Only his most hard core supporters would believe that....and most of them disagree with what it said.
I am incredulous that this fake president governs by "tweet" and even more incredulous that now the tweets are fake.
I am incredulous that this fake president governs by "tweet" and even more incredulous that now the tweets are fake.
3
The caption of the second last photo in the article reads "Demonstrators during the rally at Boston Common".
There are 2 maybe 3 demonstrators in the photo surrounding by at least 40 members presumably of the media.
The media's fascination with this is a problem perhaps larger than the actual issues we Americans actually face on a day to day basis.
There are 2 maybe 3 demonstrators in the photo surrounding by at least 40 members presumably of the media.
The media's fascination with this is a problem perhaps larger than the actual issues we Americans actually face on a day to day basis.
4
“They can call it an anti-white-supremacist rally all they want,” he said. “I don’t believe it is. I think it’s an anti-Trump rally. And that’s why I’m here. I’m a Trump supporter, and I’m not a white supremacist at all.”
This is a distinction without meaning. If you are at a rally of white supremacists to support Trump, you are still at a rally of white supremacists. Talking about what you project upon those who oppose white supremacy as if that were the topic does not change this fact though it does serve to create yet another misleading dissociative dialogue to be used by the willfully ignorant to justify support for it.
This is a distinction without meaning. If you are at a rally of white supremacists to support Trump, you are still at a rally of white supremacists. Talking about what you project upon those who oppose white supremacy as if that were the topic does not change this fact though it does serve to create yet another misleading dissociative dialogue to be used by the willfully ignorant to justify support for it.
6
Those who throw rocks - or anything- at the police should be tried and if convicted sentenced to the fullest extent of the law. The police are given the dangerous task of trying to maintain safety if not civility in these rancorous times.
4
Agree.
1
Hopefully, the preparedness of the Boston police will provide tactical information for other cities facing protests. I do have one comment about something I heard on CNN. A Black activist leader was disparaging White marchers and complaining about White people moving into Black areas (there is a problem when rents rise, but this was not his main point). I know he does not represent a majority of Black people, but when CNN features such talk, it is picked up by Supremacists as a talking point. In addition, if we want integration, White people who move into segregated Black neighborhoods, even if it is for low rents, should not be disparaged. This man's anger should be replaced with efforts to join with people of different race to try to find a solution to rising rents for the neighborhoods poorer people. Integration has to work both ways.
Kudos to those of all races and ethnicities who marched in solidarity against White Supremacists and to the Boston Police Department.
Kudos to those of all races and ethnicities who marched in solidarity against White Supremacists and to the Boston Police Department.
4
Trump didn't write the words released as his comments it's pretty obvious. It's too coherent.
2
Tearing down historical monuments is the same thing as burning books. Gee, Who would do that?
3
See New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu's speech on removing Confederate statues.
1
Although, I despise the Alt-right, Neo-Nazis, the KKK and other bigots, our Constitution gives them the right to have public demonstrations. I am not happy that the other side refused to allow them to speak. Preventing someone from publicly speaking in support of their political position even if the majority opposed is un-American. Yes, have opposing demonstration, make it plain that you oppose their position but let them have their say. If the anti-fascism demonstrators had been outnumbered and shouted down. they would be furious. The right to speak out in public even if the speech is unpopular is fundamental to American liberties.
40
look at all the videos, they were protected and could speak, they left early because they are scared bullies
and very few showed up
and their big speakers didn't even come...funny how that works when the response is big crowds against you!
and very few showed up
and their big speakers didn't even come...funny how that works when the response is big crowds against you!
4
I agree strongly that they have the right to speak - but I'm confused as to why you and several commentators seem to think the rally members were prevented from speaking in Boston. Granted their audience was small, but they were not only allowed to speak, they had a huge police force protecting them to do so.
6
When in doubt? Look to the ACLU and the Supreme Court for guidance on Free Speech. I'm happy to see NYT taking solid advice from Ronald R Reagan "teeming with people of all kinds!!!" Solid American and statesman! Good for you NYT!
1
Looks like the news people out number the marchers.
1
If we didn't have an idiot-in-chief, none of this would be happening. On the other hand, so far it's been great to see how appropriate our nation is reacting to one more of 45's lunacies as he stands for hate and discrimination. Our readiness is impressive. (Pardon my choice of vocabulary, offense intended.)
3
Ok, so how do you explain all of the extremely violent protests that started in 2008 and lasted through 2017? You all know who us responsible for those events, right? He is very likely to be responsible for all of the violent protests we are seeing now (antifa, etc). Anarchists are sneaky and very deceitful!
1
If the two individuals wearing the MAGA hats attended the "Free Speech" rally, which included the white supremacists and Neo-Nazis, that speaks volumes but sadly Trump will not listen. His rhetoric emboldened those despicable folks.
1
What if the Nazis, et. al. gave a rally and no one came?
What if there was no one there but themselves and the newspapers gave it back page coverage?
I think the best counter protest is to totally ignore them.
What if there was no one there but themselves and the newspapers gave it back page coverage?
I think the best counter protest is to totally ignore them.
2
Or do as they do in, I believe it was, Finland. Show up wearing clown clothes and use ridicule.
3
Yes, that is exactly what I've been saying. These so called "counterprotestors "are out there trying to destroy America under the guise of something else. Watch out people. If the "counterprotestors " hold a rally and they get attacked for it, then is that ok, too?
1
America has a lot of work to do... It is remarkable that protests against racism, white nationalists, and Nazi's is necessary in 2017. The last of those who bore witness to WW2 are now almost all dead, and their children are long into retirement. To read wisdom on how or why history repeats itself is one thing: to grow older, stay informed, and watch history repeat itself is even more remarkable.
Follow the money. Fund American primary education equally, everywhere. A quality public education should not depend on the wealth of your zip code. America can not afford to write off the discovery of beautiful minds, or the silent consent to the festering of ignorance.
Follow the money. Fund American primary education equally, everywhere. A quality public education should not depend on the wealth of your zip code. America can not afford to write off the discovery of beautiful minds, or the silent consent to the festering of ignorance.
3
" heal". The original post. Must be related to the bone Spurs.
2
Unfortunately, nobody puts much measure into Trumps praise. We know what he is now, a racist, supporter of kkk, and white supremacists. His praise means nothing. In fact, we are not sure which side he is praising.
2
Trump tweeted: "Sometimes you need protest in order to heel [sic], & we will heel [sic], & be stronger than ever before!”
Hillary has been known to say: "We need to bring them to heel."
I don't know who—if anyone—is right.
Hillary has been known to say: "We need to bring them to heel."
I don't know who—if anyone—is right.
Way to go, Boston, you've done us proud. Non violence is the key to winning, as MLK showed us back in the '60's. Don't let hotheads derail your issues. Your overwhelming numbers speak loud and clear to the White House, and clear around the globe. So, let the heeling begin.
Er, ah, ... I mean healing.
Er, ah, ... I mean healing.
2
Maybe it time to tear down all statues that offend anybody.
2
To 'offend' someone is not the same as to 'own' someone. We are not talking about something 'offensive'--we are talking about a whole country's economy built on the owning and enslaving of others.
1
Imagine, I am so old I remember a Boston Common, perhaps only as a child might, where one simply made way for ducklings, not for followers of Hitler and his ilk. All praise for the 1000s who turned out to put the haters in proper numerical perspective.
And yet something was lost by not having the haters speak if only to be heard by themselves. The true nature of these people is only revealed when their foul thoughts are spoken and recorded, then heard and seen. We learned this at the University of Virginia and even more dramatically in the video the link to which the Times What We Are Reading sent me to on 8/18 @ https://youtube/P54sP0Nlngg
Perhaps a few of them protected by police should have been given headphones in which only they could hear their own words believing they were being heard by the peace-loving Bostonians but simply being recorded for yet another revealing video. Nothing is so telling as seeing a hater spouting his particular form of insanity, except perhaps Trump tweeting.
All praise for the state of preparation reached by the Boston police and again, for each individual who peacefully demonstrated.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Dual citizen US SE born in Attleboro, MA not so far from Boston
And yet something was lost by not having the haters speak if only to be heard by themselves. The true nature of these people is only revealed when their foul thoughts are spoken and recorded, then heard and seen. We learned this at the University of Virginia and even more dramatically in the video the link to which the Times What We Are Reading sent me to on 8/18 @ https://youtube/P54sP0Nlngg
Perhaps a few of them protected by police should have been given headphones in which only they could hear their own words believing they were being heard by the peace-loving Bostonians but simply being recorded for yet another revealing video. Nothing is so telling as seeing a hater spouting his particular form of insanity, except perhaps Trump tweeting.
All praise for the state of preparation reached by the Boston police and again, for each individual who peacefully demonstrated.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Dual citizen US SE born in Attleboro, MA not so far from Boston
It's important for counter demonstrators to disavow the violence prone among them. They serve two unhealthy purposes...they make violence an acceptable form of dissent and they give the Nazis, KKK, and white nationalists an excuse to make their own brands of violence moral equivalence! They may not be many but they attract much too large attention when the stories of counterdemonstrations are written.
Free speech? People with Nazi swastikas are marching in the streets of America. The United States lost of 400,000 US soldiers during WWII. Over 50 million civilians died during WWII. All of this, thanks to the Nazis.
If some caucasians want the rest of us to listen to something they have to say, the very first thing they should is distance themselves from Nazis. The moment you start waving swastikas around or marching with people who are waving swastikas around, you completely undermine anything you have to say.
My goodness, we are still hunting down war criminals from that era. I would think that anyone wearing or waving a swastika could be charged with providing support to terrorists.
If some caucasians want the rest of us to listen to something they have to say, the very first thing they should is distance themselves from Nazis. The moment you start waving swastikas around or marching with people who are waving swastikas around, you completely undermine anything you have to say.
My goodness, we are still hunting down war criminals from that era. I would think that anyone wearing or waving a swastika could be charged with providing support to terrorists.
4
left is doomed .free speech rally is great.arrest those 40000 riotors
Who's the officer, 2nd on the left in the last photograph. Doesn't he look a little old to be in riot gear with a club in his hands? Just saying.
1
I thought exactly the same thing! But he did look like a tough little old dude, sort of a Lord of the Rings air about him.
3
Donny - Too little too late and clearly coached by one of your marketing monkeys, you fool of a man.
2
I'm sure someone else wrote those tweets for Trump regarding the Boston demonstration. They were written in complete sentences and expressed an opinion that Trump had clearly rebuked at his infamous press conference where he expressed support for the "fine" nazis who rioted in Charlottesville. Nobody can un ring that bell!
2
"....you can't fool all the people all the time." --- A. Lincoln
Proud today to have been a Bostonian for 40 years. Many thanks to all the people who turned out to defeat hatred and racism. You are all heroes.
Proud today to have been a Bostonian for 40 years. Many thanks to all the people who turned out to defeat hatred and racism. You are all heroes.
Why is the Communist Party illegal, but not the KKK or American Nazi or Neo-Nazi movements?
4
I don't think Donald Trump really believes anything. He is a kind of protectionist and isolationist, true, but so are many progressives, which is why some socialists kind of, sort of preferred him to Clinton (the "neoliberal war hawk"). He's surely a bigot, but he can be coaxed into pretending not to be. Progressives should start wearing Make America Great Again hats and proclaiming their affection for Trump. Considering he seems to love anyone who loves him, maybe he'll become a "progressive." Since everything he does is pretense and self-glorification, why can't he pretend to be a liberal? He's a child. Say nice things about him, and he'll like you. Take Congress in 2018, work with this new, "progressive" Donald Trump and -- voilà! -- problems solved. Trump 2020!
And if Donald Trump becomes a "progressive," I'm sure many of his mindless followers will become "progressives" too, since they'll literally do anything he wants them to. He's leading a personality cult. Change the leader, change the cult, change American politics. So instead of protesting his idiocy, progressives should henceforth tweet adoring things about him. Flatter him; wear his apparel. He'll be a "progressive" before too long. As for the "neo-Nazis" in the streets, these are mostly morons who want attention. Implore the President to denounce them and change his ways: "We know you're not a bad man, sir. Help us out. ... Oh, you're wonderful, Mr. Trump! I've really changed my mind about you."
And if Donald Trump becomes a "progressive," I'm sure many of his mindless followers will become "progressives" too, since they'll literally do anything he wants them to. He's leading a personality cult. Change the leader, change the cult, change American politics. So instead of protesting his idiocy, progressives should henceforth tweet adoring things about him. Flatter him; wear his apparel. He'll be a "progressive" before too long. As for the "neo-Nazis" in the streets, these are mostly morons who want attention. Implore the President to denounce them and change his ways: "We know you're not a bad man, sir. Help us out. ... Oh, you're wonderful, Mr. Trump! I've really changed my mind about you."
2
Hey Donald, oh Donald? Do you read anything in the New York Times or is the vocabulary too difficult.... Well --spare me your accolades to the peaceful demonstrators. You've said and done far too much many years ago in fact when you and your father woudn't rent to black families. I haven't forgotten any of it, and certianly won't now. Yes, you're amazing, you're an amazingly BAD businessman who doesn't pay his bills and you are through and through a white supremacist misogynist racist bigot at heart and soul. If you think you can back track your behavior and fool anyone, think again. And what's the latest on the Russian hacking of the rigged election that got you elected... I'm still waiting for those results.
Steve Bannon called the Nazi and white supremacist demonstrators "clowns." And they are. But they were useful clowns, weren't they, Mr. Bannon. You and Trump got them to pull a voting lever for you. That's all that was needed, wasn't it? And now you're back at Breitbart to foment more faux-anger in another group of malinformed, gullible clowns, on the way to the 2018 elections. Weaponizing ignorance is an easy thing to do. Too bad your career isn't devoted to weaponizing intelligence, kind-heartedness, generosity, and love.
2
Trump just can't help himself.
The one who just stood before TV camera's the other day proclaiming that he never makes a 'statement' until he has all the facts (his excuse for not coming out immediately and denouncing the Neo-Nazi, White Supremacists in Charlottesvile). What a crock !!
And, yet, here again we read an 'instant tweet' from him denouncing the anti-police protesters in Boston. Only to follow up (after he was forced fed the facts) with another empty tweet proudly supporting the peaceful, non-violent protesters who were hugging and exchanging high-fives with the Boston Police Dept. What a hypocrite !!
At this point, I can only offer this advice to Trump: Every citizen in this country has 'rights'. Among them are the Miranda Rights of which you should justly note: You have the right to remain silent !.....please do.
The one who just stood before TV camera's the other day proclaiming that he never makes a 'statement' until he has all the facts (his excuse for not coming out immediately and denouncing the Neo-Nazi, White Supremacists in Charlottesvile). What a crock !!
And, yet, here again we read an 'instant tweet' from him denouncing the anti-police protesters in Boston. Only to follow up (after he was forced fed the facts) with another empty tweet proudly supporting the peaceful, non-violent protesters who were hugging and exchanging high-fives with the Boston Police Dept. What a hypocrite !!
At this point, I can only offer this advice to Trump: Every citizen in this country has 'rights'. Among them are the Miranda Rights of which you should justly note: You have the right to remain silent !.....please do.
Tens of thousands of "anti facists" shout down, berate, threaten and intimidate a handful of kids who dared to speak out about how free speech and independent though is under grave threat by Democrats, academics and other radical leftists. Point made.
17
I didn't hear the kids protesting for free speech and independent thought. I heard kids declaring "the Jews will not replace us" while wearing riot gear and carrying weapons. We protected and continued to protect those kids' right to assemble, they got their police protected spaces to protest this weekend. But those Democrats, academics, and leftists you despise also have a right to free speech. Your right to free speech does not mean you can say whatever you want and no one is allowed to respond. And of a lot more people respond negatively to you, your right to free speech has not been impinged, it means your views are unpopular.
8
No one is keeping them from saying what's on their mind. Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from the consequences of what has been said. If you're want to voice an unpopular point of view, go for it. You won't be arrested or killed, but you can't force everyone to agree with you.
5
You can imagine all you want, but you don't have a clue what the so-called "free speech" people would have said because they ended up not saying anything.
Why? They forgot to bring a sound system.
Why? They forgot to bring a sound system.
3
By now, it really is impossible to say, as "Mr. Wiggz" is quoted saying, that you support Trump yet you don't support white supremacy. You have to take a side, and by failing to do so emphatically, and drawing no distinction between those who oppose white supremacy and those who support it, Trump has done so. If you side with Trump, you side with bigotry.
3
"... as Matt Staley, interjected to ask if those demonstrating in support of free speech were not Americans, too."
I assume that he is referring to the white supremacists. If so, then NO! They are not Americans. They are traitors to our once-great country. They spew hate and anti-everybody that doesn't look, think or believe as they do.
Our country can be great again. Just get rid of trump and his anti-American speeches.
Make America Great Again--DUMP TRUMP.
I assume that he is referring to the white supremacists. If so, then NO! They are not Americans. They are traitors to our once-great country. They spew hate and anti-everybody that doesn't look, think or believe as they do.
Our country can be great again. Just get rid of trump and his anti-American speeches.
Make America Great Again--DUMP TRUMP.
2
Thank you all for marching and protesting against a ideology, that is born out of frustration, distraught and unability to outthink the sheer arrogance of such a dead end body of thought. We must stand up against Nazis and supremacy, as long as we still can, because with a President like this and his many followers, the question comes up, how long will you be able to march and protest? It is frightening to observe.
5
Mr. Trump tweets: "Our country will soon come together as one!.. Our great country has been divided for decades. Sometimes you need protest in order to heal, & we will heal, & be stronger than ever before!”
I have two observations:
1. The good news is that with the departure of Mr. Bannon, there is now someone in the White House who is giving Mr. Trump instructions on how use spin and media manipulation to turn a political liability into an asset.
2. The bad news is that the American people, who in the age of the internet, social media, instant communications and smartphone apps have an attention span just a tad longer than than of a gnat, will soon forget that Mr. Trump referred to the many "fine people" among the Neo-Nazis and white supremacists at Charlottesville.
I have two observations:
1. The good news is that with the departure of Mr. Bannon, there is now someone in the White House who is giving Mr. Trump instructions on how use spin and media manipulation to turn a political liability into an asset.
2. The bad news is that the American people, who in the age of the internet, social media, instant communications and smartphone apps have an attention span just a tad longer than than of a gnat, will soon forget that Mr. Trump referred to the many "fine people" among the Neo-Nazis and white supremacists at Charlottesville.
4
America is for free speech. It is one of the most cherished values of Americans.
The problem becomes whether you have the right to shout fire in a crowded theatre or whether you have the right to threaten others.
Your rights may extend to swinging your fists to where they almost touch the nose of your opponent but expect your opponent to suspect that you will actually hit them and react accordingly.
With regards to the Nazis and the KKK, we can respect their right to free speech but we look at them in the context of their histories.
The Nazis were responsible for starting WW2 and carrying on the holocaust. The KKK were responsible for lynchings and ethnic intimidation in enforcing white societal rules.
When the Nazis and KKK start to speak out, their speech can automatically be viewed through this context
The problem becomes whether you have the right to shout fire in a crowded theatre or whether you have the right to threaten others.
Your rights may extend to swinging your fists to where they almost touch the nose of your opponent but expect your opponent to suspect that you will actually hit them and react accordingly.
With regards to the Nazis and the KKK, we can respect their right to free speech but we look at them in the context of their histories.
The Nazis were responsible for starting WW2 and carrying on the holocaust. The KKK were responsible for lynchings and ethnic intimidation in enforcing white societal rules.
When the Nazis and KKK start to speak out, their speech can automatically be viewed through this context
1
When you mentioned "swinging your fists" you were referring to the "counterprotestors", right? Senseable and intelligent people who have seen the videos know that the REAL violent people are the "antifa and other so called "counterprotestors " such as the murderer of the five police officers in Dallas . The lone wolf who hit people with his car in Charlottesville was just a crazed fool. The media keeps perpetuating the idea that he was part of the actual protest.
2
Based on my experience in peace and social justice movements in the 1960s & early 1970s, the jerks throwing rocks and bottles of urine may have been right-wing provocateurs, masquerading as anti-racists. Be sure that Fox news will play up their antics.
6
Liberals are always innocents, aren't they, Marc? At least, my experience in peace and social justice movements in the 60s bear out that indisputable fact.
1
Trump has changed his tone? More likely, he ceded his phone to Gen Kelly. Let's have reporters bombard him with one question: "Are you sorry for what you said, equating the Charlottesville bigots with those who protested against them? Are you sorry, Mr President?"
4
Just had CNN on and one of the talking heads said she talked to two Republicans in Congress and one of them said "Trump is a crazy narcissist" while the other "nodded vigorously in agreement." Will one of those spineless Republicans go on record and just say it?????!!!
8
I'm very heartened to see the strong turnout in Boston. The tragedy in Charlottesville has awakened many of us, including me, to more active protest against the hate spewed by the alt right, neo nazis and white supremists. Let's keep being a visible protest to these hate mongers. As for Mr. Trump, he showed his true self in his first tweets and news conference after Charlottesville and nothing, absolutely nothing, he says now will change that.
5
Why would anyone still pay attention to what Trump says when we know he'd say the exact opposite the nex day?
7
The real question is how is it the people who voted for him, voted for him, when this fact about him has been glaringly clear for more than 30 years.
1
Ultimately the U.S. Constitution will be under attack as a racist document written by slave owners. If the far left ever comes to power, you can bet the first item on the agenda will be a new Constitutional convention from which the country that emerges will be unrecognizable. Among its provisions, abolition of the electoral college, revision of the first amendment to limit free speech rights and to extend the concept of "safe spaces" to everyone everywhere, abolition of the tax exemption for religion, the expansion of the 14th amendment to give special protection to gays and transgendered, as well as to illegal immigrants, expansion of free trade zones to allow for unlimited globalism, and last but not least abolition of the two-term limit on the Presidency so that the way may be prepared for the Holy One to return to office as President-for-life.
1
Sorry Charlie, Your diversionary attempt to rewrite what the people are actually protesting is not working. Even Trumpo has changed his tune. The celebration of the Confederacy is not what the monuments were about they were created 40 or more years after the war when most of the soldiers were dead for the purpose of promoting racism and Jim Crow not to honor the dishonorable traitors who sought to defend the avarice they fed with free labor. The sick system of mental abuse rape and torture that maintained that free labor pool aint a bad reason to eschew the traitors either.
To this day one of the most common crimes Americans face in their daily lives is wage theft.
To this day one of the most common crimes Americans face in their daily lives is wage theft.
2
This particular bleeding heart liberal would vigorously oppose all but one of your list (14th amendment) - and I doubt I'm alone. I am far more fearful that if anyone sought to abolish presidential term limits, it would be Trump.
You're proving my point. Thank you.
1
Since Trump can't speak in complete sentences and can't hold a thought in his muddled brain for more than 2 minutes and lies continuously, why should we pay attention to anything that comes out of his mouth? Just another contradiction. And hooray for the marchers against hate.
2
Trump's tweet on counter protestors with 'heel' instead of 'heal' was no.accudent, it was intentional.
What a bunch of suckers in the news media who think he just made a spelling mistake - twice in the same tweet.
This man is not just horrible, he is deranged.
What a bunch of suckers in the news media who think he just made a spelling mistake - twice in the same tweet.
This man is not just horrible, he is deranged.
1
There have 'always' been bullies, racists, frauds and flim flam artists. Hate mongering, nativism and xenophobia have been part and parcel of the political 'dark arts' since the dawn of politics.
What Trump doesn't 'get' is that this is not a justification for injustice, racism, kleptocracy or autocracy. "Words" are not "just words," as he tried to justify his Billy Bush tapes and inviting Russia to come tamper with our democracy ("Russia if you're listening . . . ").
The most insulting thing about Trump is that he has proudly pronounced his most poisonous thoughts on the public stage ("Blacks, what have you got to lose?" "Jews, I want them counting my money in my casinos and doing my tax returns." "I'm a celebrity . . .they [women] let me do what I want."). Then, in his defense, he has baldly denied that he ever said such things.
You can't "Gaslight" a nation. His public pronouncements and behavior have demonstrated time and again that he is 'royally unfit' for the job of President of a Democracy.
Impeach Trump NOW!
What Trump doesn't 'get' is that this is not a justification for injustice, racism, kleptocracy or autocracy. "Words" are not "just words," as he tried to justify his Billy Bush tapes and inviting Russia to come tamper with our democracy ("Russia if you're listening . . . ").
The most insulting thing about Trump is that he has proudly pronounced his most poisonous thoughts on the public stage ("Blacks, what have you got to lose?" "Jews, I want them counting my money in my casinos and doing my tax returns." "I'm a celebrity . . .they [women] let me do what I want."). Then, in his defense, he has baldly denied that he ever said such things.
You can't "Gaslight" a nation. His public pronouncements and behavior have demonstrated time and again that he is 'royally unfit' for the job of President of a Democracy.
Impeach Trump NOW!
7
Ivanka, Jared and other WH aides forced Trump to issue the "measure of praise" tweet to give the appearance he is a decent human being.
Trump is seething at being told what to do.
At the upcoming Phoenix rally or the next speech/press conference, the real Trump will again tell the world he supports his fellow white supremacists, racists, Confederates, and other hate groups.
10,9,8,7........
Trump is seething at being told what to do.
At the upcoming Phoenix rally or the next speech/press conference, the real Trump will again tell the world he supports his fellow white supremacists, racists, Confederates, and other hate groups.
10,9,8,7........
2
Along with a possible Presidential pardon of Former Sherrif and lawlesss renegade Joe Arpaio; whose legendary displays of hate & bigotry have terrorized the state of AZ for YEARS.
1
Never once has Trump tweeted or spoke of his sadness for the needless death of Heather Heyer, a violent act by a Neo-Nazi demonstrator.
Trump needs to condemn that attack as an act of domestic terrorism.
Trump needs to condemn that attack as an act of domestic terrorism.
Anyone who marches in a procession with even one swastika flag cannot by any means of the imagination be classified as a "good person".
6
It's worth pointing out the number of counter-protests that took place in the South as well, including Durham where a Confederate statue was taken down by protesters. The narrative that all white Southerners are inherently racist is another problem this country must face. As a white transplant from New England, I can tell you that the South does not hold a monopoly on bigotry.
4
I think the "free speech" advocates are conflating the freedom to speak what they think to their friends and shouting with a microphone to the whole neighborhood. Some of these "free speechers" think they have the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theater.
1
The topic of the first amendment rights to free speech constantly comes up in response to these Alt-Right demonstrations so lets be clear.
Time and time again we have seen that these groups represent and espouse fear, hate, racism, and violence under some bizarre delusion of White Superiority. Looking at the way they dress, their chants, their signs or a look at their web pages makes this very clear. Most times they leave a trail of devastation in their wake.
Thus, I believe that these groups should never be allowed permits to demonstrate. This has nothing to do with Freedom of Speech and all to do with the safety of all Americans.
Time and time again we have seen that these groups represent and espouse fear, hate, racism, and violence under some bizarre delusion of White Superiority. Looking at the way they dress, their chants, their signs or a look at their web pages makes this very clear. Most times they leave a trail of devastation in their wake.
Thus, I believe that these groups should never be allowed permits to demonstrate. This has nothing to do with Freedom of Speech and all to do with the safety of all Americans.
1
I was on the DC Mall yesterday. No protesters; just the usual August out-of-town tourists.
Please...no one believes for one moment that Trump's second "unifying" tweet was sincere, or even typed by him. His tweet about "many anti-police protesters," THAT was the real Trump. It enraged & empowered a small group to become abusive toward the men and women of the BPD. that stupid tweet endangered those officers. Thankfully, Commissioner Evans is a fine man, and our BPD is one of best-trained and most professional, so cooler heads prevailed and the peace was maintained.
2
Chameleonlike, Trump flip flops on the white supremacy issue. Following the Charlottesville events, he blamed both sides, then (under pressure) modified his statement, and then came out even more strongly in favor of white racism. Following the Boston events, he labeled the anti-racist group as anti-police. Today, however, everything is all good. Trump acts as if "Everyone who belongs to the truth listens to my voice.” Well, in response to his statements, I'll be like Pontius Pilate when I ask him "What is [your] truth?”
1
Heather Heyer didn't "die amid clashes between white nationalists and counterprotesters". She was murdered while on a peaceful march by a neo-Nazi.
5
Rejoicing in the peaceful counterprotest in Boston, but there was a huge difference with Charlottesville: Virginia laws allowed the white supremacists to be armed to the teeth, and they were.
1
Looks like the "Occupy Wall Street" crowds have found new inspiration, throwing rock and urine and protesting free speech assemblies.
Perhaps they should be call "Occupy All Tweets"...
Perhaps they should be call "Occupy All Tweets"...
1
'Free speech' my Aunt Mildred!
1 person, speaking, marching = free speech
1 person 1 weapon = intimidation
Flaming tiki torches are weapons, too. Psychologically, because they invoke the aura of lynchings (as I'm sure they were meant to do.). And actually, because at any moment the could set a building - or a perso - afire.
1 person, speaking, marching = free speech
1 person 1 weapon = intimidation
Flaming tiki torches are weapons, too. Psychologically, because they invoke the aura of lynchings (as I'm sure they were meant to do.). And actually, because at any moment the could set a building - or a perso - afire.
4
Soon the accidental minority president will take credit for bringing us together.
1
I couldn’t help but think, looking at the photo of a crowd surrounding the two lone MAGA-cap-wearing “free speech” advocates, that “Hey buddy, look at those other people surrounding you. They ARE America.”
1
So proud of Boston, but the comparison to Charlottesville isn't fair. Boston is so much bigger, has wide public streets (at least some of them), a bigger police force, and most importantly, Massachusetts hasn't given in to the NRA open carry insanity. The policemen in VA were facing a lot of hardened nutcase militia types with high grade weapons. I wouldn't have wanted to be in their shoes, but that's why I'm so glad NOT to live in a Red state.
6
But giving praise to the protesters is going to be a conundrum for the facistas to ruminate for about five minutes… Because it goes way over their heads
"a house divided against itself cannot stand'
SNIP: (( “All of us here, in many ways, are true patriots because, in spite of that noise out there, we’re here to stand up for something very fundamental, which is called free speech,” Shiva Ayyadurai, an entrepreneur who is running a long-shot Republican Senate campaign, told the rallygoers, ))
Maybe Mr. Ayyadurai should be more explicit in who he thinks should be entitled to free speech. Which groups expressing their beliefs have a right to free speech and which ones don't
Maybe Mr. Ayyadurai should be more explicit in who he thinks should be entitled to free speech. Which groups expressing their beliefs have a right to free speech and which ones don't
1
Everyone in America have the same Constitutional right to fee speech. What is the difference between Neo-Nazis who what to prevent the Left from speaking and the Left which want to prevent the Neo-Nazis from speaking. Both sides want to reserve the First Amendment to themselves.
2
Just call it what it is, a "hate speech rally".
2
Free speech does not include the right to yell Fire in a crowded theater, nor to talk about killing other people which these Nazi's routinely do. Also if you are speaking out but are outnumbered 300 to 1 and no on can hear you, you had your chance to speak, maybe you should rethink the message.
1
Correct- imploring someone to murder is equivalent to yelling fire!
Declaration of Independence:
“He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us…”
King George then, President Trump today.
“He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us…”
King George then, President Trump today.
2
I picture a situation in which the haters hold a march down empty city streets , because all those who protest them are meeting in another venue across town. That venue is overflowing with people who are there to speak on the side of inclusion. Why give the haters the publicity they want by going to their events and shouting at them? Stay home or make the counter protest so large, peaceful and meaningful it becomes the bigger story in the media.
3
To 45:
Good and moral people respond to hatred and bigotry in a good and moral way. They neither seek nor care about your approval.
Good and moral people respond to hatred and bigotry in a good and moral way. They neither seek nor care about your approval.
6
Trump is probably a Nazi and KKK, and definitely a white supremacist. He sympathized with those groups after Charlottesville, and it is truly his position to support hate and white supremacy.
Unfortunately,the Nazis have control of our government and most police forces in our country. Due to this control, we can not believe anything the government or the police state as facts. They are all too happy to attack people then arrest them for being the instigators.
The police also look the other way when citizens are attacked by the hate groups. There have been no arrests related to attack s by white supremacist in Charlottesville although the attacks were documented.
We, the people, need to resist but also recognize the enemy.
Unfortunately,the Nazis have control of our government and most police forces in our country. Due to this control, we can not believe anything the government or the police state as facts. They are all too happy to attack people then arrest them for being the instigators.
The police also look the other way when citizens are attacked by the hate groups. There have been no arrests related to attack s by white supremacist in Charlottesville although the attacks were documented.
We, the people, need to resist but also recognize the enemy.
The white supremacists, etc. are mostly hooligans, but thankfully they are a minority. The scary part is how many Socialists/Communist groups showed up to protest of free speech!
3
I hope everyone who marched votes in the coming elections. The world is run by those who show up-every day.
5
Boston, you have proudly and courageously shown the world the values and beliefs which truly represent the majority of Americans. What follows your lead will, I believe, sooner than later unite all the peoples of this planet in freedom. Thank you Boston.
1
To say there is blame on both sides used to be banal observation. Now it is forbidden.
5
Boston is the heart of America!!!
I can't wait to see the next march on Washington.
Peaceful, exuberant, unifying.
Peaceful, exuberant, unifying.
Trump's slightly sane comments are as sincere as his phony gold-plated life. He, and the entire GOP, need to be destroyed, period.
1
Trump's initial gut tweet - labeling the anti-nazi demonstrators as "anti-police" - is hurriedly smoothed over by handlers trying to avoid another tweet-in-mouth fiasco. Sorry, too late - for most, anyway.
1
"Our country will soon come together as one!”
Is he predicting impeachment?
Is he predicting impeachment?
1
As one commentator wrote, when Trump said "what has you got to lose?" Well, I believe a conscience, the mindset to define right from wrong, a moral compass, simple human decency, and integrity are a lot to lose!
1
It was my understanding that this was a conservative free speech rally and that these people repudiated white supremacists, neo-Nazis and the KKK. There were no Nazi flags, swatzika symbols or any other racist signs on their person. They were exercising their first amendment rights of free speech. This is still allowed in America is it not? They were peaceful and had received a permit to assemble peacefully which they did. There were no arrests among these conservative rally attendees in Boston.
2
Retire, Don. It's the right thing to do. Blame the media, blame North Korea, blame Putin. Whatever. Just retire and give us our country and our planet back. You are not fit to serve. And every day that you hang in there is another day of lost opportunity for America and the fragile little experiment we call democracy.
1
300 "Free Speech" protesters are what's left of the radical right after the Neo-Nazi's, KKK, white supremacists, and haters decide to stay home. The size of the protest demonstrates how important those groups are to the "alt-right" that it is nothing when they don't show up.
Oh, and calling it a "Free Speech" Rally is like calling the Republican tax cut for the wealthy a "healthcare" plan.
Oh, and calling it a "Free Speech" Rally is like calling the Republican tax cut for the wealthy a "healthcare" plan.
2
Those of us who speak out and demonstrate against you Trump are not looking for any measure of praise from you. Just keep it, we're never going to fall for your con or faux-flattery, we know who you are and what you are capable of. We are not going to miraculously become swooning members of your fan-base because for a microsecond you may say something that isn't totally repulsive, because we know what always comes next.
2
The "heckler's veto" is being used to shut down constitutionally protected political speech.
I think the Times should call it what it is: a mob shouting down unpopular opinion.
I think the Times should call it what it is: a mob shouting down unpopular opinion.
4
We have a president who is instigating hate and making an already bad situation worse. Where are the GOP representatives, all we have heard from are CEO from major company's. Probably because they don't want to lose money supporting the hater in chief.
1
The Democrat Logic explained in answering 'Why are Fire Trucks Red ?'
Because they have eight wheels and four people on them, and four plus eight makes twelve, and there are twelve inches in a foot, and one foot is a ruler, and Queen Elizabeth was a ruler, and Queen Elizabeth was also a ship, and the ship sailed the seas, and there were fish in the seas, and fish have fins, and the Finns fought the Russians, and the Russians are red, and fire trucks are always “Russian" around, so that's why fire trucks are red!
Because they have eight wheels and four people on them, and four plus eight makes twelve, and there are twelve inches in a foot, and one foot is a ruler, and Queen Elizabeth was a ruler, and Queen Elizabeth was also a ship, and the ship sailed the seas, and there were fish in the seas, and fish have fins, and the Finns fought the Russians, and the Russians are red, and fire trucks are always “Russian" around, so that's why fire trucks are red!
I live in Boston and am a liberal Democrat. The Free Speech Rally should have been able to be held without being intimidated by tens of thousands of counter-protesters. It was just wrong the Free Speech Rally had to end early and was so isolated that they could not speak to the public if they wanted to. Free speech is the right of every single American, including all the groups that I personally don't agree with - Libertarians, Evangelicals, and Nazi's.
5
I agree to a point. When your speech includes threats to kill and saying that your group was justified in running over and killing a young woman, you have gone past "free speech". Have you heard Christopher Cantwell talk?
1
This comment this comment will show whether or not NYT supports free speech. I suspect they won't publish it because it doesn't have a left wing bias. Simply put, political speech is what the Constitution intended to protect. Especially extreme fringe hateful speech.
1
We should support free speech. It's the very first amendment to the U.S. Constitution which allows us to speak. But you have to speak or peacefully demonstrate to get the benefits of the amendment.
Threatening violence or delivering violence -- driving cars into demonstrations, threatening to shoot people, etc. -- is not a form of speech.
Threatening violence or delivering violence -- driving cars into demonstrations, threatening to shoot people, etc. -- is not a form of speech.
5
Once again the Left demands that others be everything they themselves are not. With their every action they make me glad and proud to have voted for Donald Trump.
1
Thank God. America is still safe. One man cannot tarnish our principles and beliefs. He can only tarnish his own.
1
People have a right to free speech. They can say what they believe openly. However, they are not protected from the consequences of what they say. They can state openly that you believe. They can say this country should be a white, Christian country only and that everyone else is subhuman, implying extermination, but in the end, they can and should expect ridicule, public outrage, and disdain. This is not the 19th or 20th century and society has evolved even if some people have not.
5
Every Action has an Equal and Opposite Reaction.
It seems that some people are confused the right to free speech and the right of others to response to their opinions. What is reasonable to expect when you exercise your right to say something unpleasant or even offensive in a space shared by others?
The right to free speech is healthier than ever. Groups of people who had been oppressed and felt voiceless feel free to speak up for themselves and others. In the past, the socially marginalized would suffer in silence. The right to free speech was exercised by mostly one group of people who felt free to intimidate using words in everyday situations at work, home, sidewalk, classroom, restaurants, buses so on and so forth.
The right to free speech doesn't flow one way. Everyone is entitled to speak his/her mind in America. People are not fighting for the right to free speech. It is the entitlement of not experiencing the reactions from the targets of hurtful and offensive speeches that is what people felt they had lost.
Trump encouraged his supporters to use violence to shut down protesters at one of his rally. No one complained about violation of right to free speech. That is the part of good old America that Trump promised to bring back and precisely the real fight.
It seems that some people are confused the right to free speech and the right of others to response to their opinions. What is reasonable to expect when you exercise your right to say something unpleasant or even offensive in a space shared by others?
The right to free speech is healthier than ever. Groups of people who had been oppressed and felt voiceless feel free to speak up for themselves and others. In the past, the socially marginalized would suffer in silence. The right to free speech was exercised by mostly one group of people who felt free to intimidate using words in everyday situations at work, home, sidewalk, classroom, restaurants, buses so on and so forth.
The right to free speech doesn't flow one way. Everyone is entitled to speak his/her mind in America. People are not fighting for the right to free speech. It is the entitlement of not experiencing the reactions from the targets of hurtful and offensive speeches that is what people felt they had lost.
Trump encouraged his supporters to use violence to shut down protesters at one of his rally. No one complained about violation of right to free speech. That is the part of good old America that Trump promised to bring back and precisely the real fight.
1
Trump tweeted Saturday that he wanted “to applaud the many protestors in Boston who are speaking out against bigotry and hate. Our country will soon come together as one!” Showing a lack of understanding, Trump doesn't realize that included in the protest, the protesters are protesting him.
2
Trump is a character. He tweets like a recalcitrant 8 year old, trying to pivot away from his dishonorable posture:
“Our great country has been divided for decades. Sometimes you need protest in order to heal, & we will heal, & be stronger than ever before!”
Trump's tweet does not redress his vile nature. Trump *exploited* division in order to get elected.
“Our great country has been divided for decades. Sometimes you need protest in order to heal, & we will heal, & be stronger than ever before!”
Trump's tweet does not redress his vile nature. Trump *exploited* division in order to get elected.
1
Most cultures are much older than the U.S. At 300 years old, it is a young teenager at best in a humanity with cultures that reach back 7000+ years.
When you walk through the cities In Europe, Asia and the Middle East, do you notice any of the sculptures, murals and other cultural works around you? Probably not. And, even if you did, you wouldn't even know what they were of or about what. Why? Because time has long past that gave meaning to these works.
I am going to posit a thought: if no one had pointed out the sculptures of the Confederacy, over time, they would have faded into obscurity as well. Meaning all of the negative history of the U.S. slavery will have faded over time as society moved onto something better.
The conflicts recently actually did not do anything wonderful. It reanimated things that should over time faded away and would have been forgotten not because that past found acceptance but because it was no longer relevant to our modern world.
When you walk through the cities In Europe, Asia and the Middle East, do you notice any of the sculptures, murals and other cultural works around you? Probably not. And, even if you did, you wouldn't even know what they were of or about what. Why? Because time has long past that gave meaning to these works.
I am going to posit a thought: if no one had pointed out the sculptures of the Confederacy, over time, they would have faded into obscurity as well. Meaning all of the negative history of the U.S. slavery will have faded over time as society moved onto something better.
The conflicts recently actually did not do anything wonderful. It reanimated things that should over time faded away and would have been forgotten not because that past found acceptance but because it was no longer relevant to our modern world.
Wonderful! This is how you heal a nation and enable it to rise to the challenges it faces. I am deeply moved and overjoyed.
2
I'm surprised that no one has asked Robert E Lee what he thought about statues to him and the Confederacy and slavery itself.
In a letter to the NYTimes in 1858 he does.
Fascinating and can easily be found online.
I found it looking up "Robert E Lee slave owner".
Absolutely fascinating and timely.
Really surprised no one has mentioned.
In a letter to the NYTimes in 1858 he does.
Fascinating and can easily be found online.
I found it looking up "Robert E Lee slave owner".
Absolutely fascinating and timely.
Really surprised no one has mentioned.
1
I love these characters who dress in army getup, haul around semi-automatic weapons and claim they are not there for either side but just to "keep the peace." Who died and elected you characters kings? And who do you think believes your lies?
I was in Tuscon Arizona and pleased to see a peaceful pro-black lives matter and peace and love march last weekend. People all over the country are calling out these double-speakers and standing for real equality among Americans. I don't care what Trump says now - he's already spoken what he really believes, and it's white supremacy he stands for. It's time for him to apologize and change his ways, but I won't hold my breath.
I was in Tuscon Arizona and pleased to see a peaceful pro-black lives matter and peace and love march last weekend. People all over the country are calling out these double-speakers and standing for real equality among Americans. I don't care what Trump says now - he's already spoken what he really believes, and it's white supremacy he stands for. It's time for him to apologize and change his ways, but I won't hold my breath.
2
The New York Times seems to be bending over backwards to find ways to put a positive spin on the President, often to the point of being misleading
This article's headline ignores on Trumps original and most likely heartfelt tweet condemning the 40,000 anti-White Supremacy march as "anti-police". Focusing on his later walk back of the original tweets and failing to accurately describe the nature of both protests is misleading and frankly stunning.
The Times is too good a paper to chalk this up to careless writing and editing. The intent was to find--or imply--something positive about Trump. Even after reading the whole article it is unclear exactly what views each group of protestors represented as well as the timing and emphasis of the President' reactions.
With the President and a growing group of Americans twisting their words to justify hatred and bigotry, it is mandatory that influential papers like the Times deliver unflinchingly accurate reports, even if they are largely critical of the President. This is. Or the first time the Times has equivocated in seeming defense of the indefensible.
Trump must be called out and his bigotry and ignorance made clear, whenever it occurs. At the very least present the facts clear.y and correctly so, the readers can judge for themselves. Anything less is both a journalistic failure and a disservice to our very tenuous future.
This article's headline ignores on Trumps original and most likely heartfelt tweet condemning the 40,000 anti-White Supremacy march as "anti-police". Focusing on his later walk back of the original tweets and failing to accurately describe the nature of both protests is misleading and frankly stunning.
The Times is too good a paper to chalk this up to careless writing and editing. The intent was to find--or imply--something positive about Trump. Even after reading the whole article it is unclear exactly what views each group of protestors represented as well as the timing and emphasis of the President' reactions.
With the President and a growing group of Americans twisting their words to justify hatred and bigotry, it is mandatory that influential papers like the Times deliver unflinchingly accurate reports, even if they are largely critical of the President. This is. Or the first time the Times has equivocated in seeming defense of the indefensible.
Trump must be called out and his bigotry and ignorance made clear, whenever it occurs. At the very least present the facts clear.y and correctly so, the readers can judge for themselves. Anything less is both a journalistic failure and a disservice to our very tenuous future.
7
I wondered why Mr. Trump's response made it into the headline at all. I know he's he president and his words require coverage, but another Trump tweet was among the least significant aspects of the story. Yet a tweet indicating an apparent "shift in tone" put Trump in the story by paragraph 4. The White House may be as "chaotic" as many claim, but they seem to know how to manipulate the news when it suits them.
1
Trump cannot "reset" his presidency or his legacy. No tweet, statement, remark can make up for what he has done to this country.
22
And the GOP OWN HIM and his hate.
3
From the news account. am I reading this right?, the marchers were for free speech, whereas the counter demonstrators were socialist, from the left and doesn't agree with free speech? This kind-of-makes-sense. The progressive wing of the DEM Party floated out a congressional bill to have Congress limit free speech, during Obama's 8 years. Luckily, the REP Party stopped it. Just think if the DEM Party held Legislative and Executive branches in government, what your free speech privileges would look like. The DEM Party has been taken over by socialist and free-willing people who wants to steer you and make you conform to their views - sounds very much like Venezuela ... and we know how that is working?
7
Did you actually read the article you claim to be commenting on? You claim that the report states "the counter demonstrators were socialist, from the left and doesn't (sic) agree with free speech? There's not a mention of socialists in the article. The only claims that the demonstrators disagree with free speech come from their opponents. Even Trump switched from his reflexive condemnation of the protestors to wanting "to applaud the many protestors in Boston who are speaking out against bigotry and hate."
3
NeoNazis and White Supremacists rebrand themselves just lie they came out with the whole alt-right term, they were calling this a free speech rally. The first amendment doesn't protect hate and violence. They wanted to spread hate vitriol and incite violence. That was and is the issue. Don't veer from the problem here.
6
What are you talking about? The "free speech" protesters had their rally - in favor of deeply un-American ideas. The other protesters had their rally - in favor of inclusion.
1
People that claim to be White Nationalists can voluntarily chain themselves to the past when life goes on for the rest of us. This obsession people have and flaunt "proudly" is a curse. To appear tall, one can stand on a rock or a tree stump or dig a tench around oneself. This narrow view of what's important only diminishes the disciple. Too bad!
My native land, the Holy Land of the East from where great ideas and religions flowed, invented the Caste System. There are four main castes. This flat pie-chart based on vocation and occupation, was turned in to a pyramid, with a vertical hierarchy. Those that din't fall in neatly in this pyramidal hierarchy, were the fifth caste or the Untouchables. How laughable!
The whites, including the English, French and Portuguese, were considered untouchable in grandparent's time. If my dad, a government physician, shook hands at work with the his (CMO) Chief Medical Officer a "cow-eating" white
man, my grandmother would let him in the house, only after he was cleansed with a bucket of holy water poured on him still in a suit and tie!
Likewise, I had witnessed the CMO dipping his hand in the washbasin, after shaking my dad's hand. "How silly" was my thought!
During Hindu Holidays, my mom wouldn't cook Carrots, beets, cabbage or cauliflower; known as English Vegetables, since cooked food would first be offered to God, and God wouldn't recognize them! So white supremacists, enjoy the march! I always knew you're equal to me!
My native land, the Holy Land of the East from where great ideas and religions flowed, invented the Caste System. There are four main castes. This flat pie-chart based on vocation and occupation, was turned in to a pyramid, with a vertical hierarchy. Those that din't fall in neatly in this pyramidal hierarchy, were the fifth caste or the Untouchables. How laughable!
The whites, including the English, French and Portuguese, were considered untouchable in grandparent's time. If my dad, a government physician, shook hands at work with the his (CMO) Chief Medical Officer a "cow-eating" white
man, my grandmother would let him in the house, only after he was cleansed with a bucket of holy water poured on him still in a suit and tie!
Likewise, I had witnessed the CMO dipping his hand in the washbasin, after shaking my dad's hand. "How silly" was my thought!
During Hindu Holidays, my mom wouldn't cook Carrots, beets, cabbage or cauliflower; known as English Vegetables, since cooked food would first be offered to God, and God wouldn't recognize them! So white supremacists, enjoy the march! I always knew you're equal to me!
5
Krishna - I get your point, but do not demean yourself by saying white supremacists are equal to you. From your thoughts, clearly they aren't equal to your little toe.
There werent any supremacists at this march, way to fall for the rhetoric though
"Our country will soon come together as one!”
An indication Trump is resigning?
An indication Trump is resigning?
10
The president changed his tone? Wait a couple hours. He'll change it back.
15
Boston authorities showed us how to handle demonstrations.
They kept the two sides clearly separated, giving both a chance to exercise their constitutional rights.
They deserve credit for --- doing their job.
Had the authorities in Charlottsville exhibited half the foresight and discipline Boston did, the atrocity there would not have happened.When neo-Nazis marched in Skokie, the ACLU stood up for their right to do so, and the event attracted a few dozen marchers and thousands of onlookers: No violence.
Neo-Nazi thinking is alive, throughout the world. Regrettable, despicable even. But anyone thinking it can be eradicated by either governmental edicts or by beating up the marchers is not living in the United States.
How about this novel idea: Educating people to think critically about every political idea, including the ones they hold near and dear?
They kept the two sides clearly separated, giving both a chance to exercise their constitutional rights.
They deserve credit for --- doing their job.
Had the authorities in Charlottsville exhibited half the foresight and discipline Boston did, the atrocity there would not have happened.When neo-Nazis marched in Skokie, the ACLU stood up for their right to do so, and the event attracted a few dozen marchers and thousands of onlookers: No violence.
Neo-Nazi thinking is alive, throughout the world. Regrettable, despicable even. But anyone thinking it can be eradicated by either governmental edicts or by beating up the marchers is not living in the United States.
How about this novel idea: Educating people to think critically about every political idea, including the ones they hold near and dear?
13
Your reporters neglected to mention that Trump tweeted, "Looks like many anti-police agitators in Boston," two hours before adding his mildly conciliatory tweets. It's important to include the full story with this man. (Also, he initially spelled "heal" as "heel." You might have included that bit of information for comic relief.)
18
oops! Your reporters did mention the stupid Trump tweet that I thought had been overlooked.
Let's be clear. Trump's initial tweet referred to the peaceful anti-fascist protesters as anti-police agitators. It was 25 minutes later that he tweeted about healing, probably after strong advice from General Kelly. Trump cannot walk back his true feelings. Plain and simple, he is a racist, a bigot and a fascist.
23
I agree. His initial impulse and hope is to follow his rah-rah campaign rhetoric.
1
And I thought it was that only lawyers could talk out of both sides of their mouth
2
Is anyone fooled by Trumps latest Tweets?.
How dumb and gullible would you have to be?.
How dumb and gullible would you have to be?.
6
Let's face it. Any day, Trump will contradict his 'healing' tweets. Actually, I'm wondering if Gen Kelly got a hold of Trump's phone to tweet about healing w/o Trump's knowledge.
5
Does anybody believe anything Mr. Trump has to say?
6
Thanks to a massive effort by the Boston Police Department two groups of Americans, both exercising their freedoms of speech and assembly, were kept apart and peace was maintained.
With the glaring exception of those who "pelted officers with rocks...and threw bottles of urine at officers."
With the glaring exception of those who "pelted officers with rocks...and threw bottles of urine at officers."
6
All good and well feel good intention. Now when they are going to tear down so called White supremacy Institutional racism? I can bet most that march there will go back to their offices compromising of 98% White colleagues. Everybody seem to be picking on the low hanging fruit. Nice gesture but....don't change nothing for non Whites.
Economic racism may break my bones but but words will never hurt me
Economic racism may break my bones but but words will never hurt me
1
No question Nazism is evil.I wonder how many of these anti free speech protestors realize the other entity who wears the title of biggest mass murderers in history also began with demonstrations suppressing free speech and soon escalated to violence, all in support of unity for the greater good. That would be the Communists. It's noteworthy how many young people unknowingly espoused their anti capitalist principles in the last election.
4
You know all of the counter protestors are going to go home feeling good about themselves. They went to Boston, confronted Racism and then went back to their lives made possible by white privilege and slept well "knowing" they did the right thing. Make no mistake about it folks - your and, more importantly, your children's white privilege is next to go.
As it should.
1
The good in this nation — the freedoms, the innovations, the harmonies, the decency — were made possible by people of all races pulling together and respecting each other *despite* the prejudices of so-called "white privilege," not because of those prejudices. Remember that whole "melting pot" thing?
It is important that people throughout the United States step up to condemn white supremacists, as has happened in Boston. It is not a "Southern" problem as many previous articles have stated. My family lived in southeast Pennsylvania, north of Philadelphia, for a few years starting in 2000. To our horror, there was a KKK "mountain" near where we lived that served as a base of their membership. It is also not just a black or Jewish or non-white immigrant problem. My grandfather was a Catholic high school principal in Wisconsin, and the Klan burned crosses on his front lawn because of his religion. He was brave enough to grab a baseball bat and chase them away.
11
This really would be a non issue if we had a clearer division between what is free speech, and what is anti-American insurgency. We have spent over 50 years to try to subvert racism, and the explosion of white supremism, neo-nazi's and other groups has bubbled up to the surface, given a voice largely by the outrageous behavior of Trump. I heard much this weekend about free speech for these guys. Sorry, but this is America and these groups are contrary to the values we claim to have. For those who don't think they are dangerous, you need to look at Germany in the 1930s. The Third Reich did not spring out from under a rock fully formed. It grew from the exact source we are now seeing gain validation here. I believe in free speech. I will actually listen to anyone's point of view and believe that they have a right to say it. But I do not believe that we should give credence (or permits for rallies) to these groups who divide us, represent hateful bigotry and want to "get rid of" anyone who isn't white. We don't have a clorox nation....we are a cloak of many colors woven by a couple centuries of immigration. It makes us stronger and richer, and we need to protect it. Free speech...yes. Hate speech from armed marchers...definitely not.
5
The Texas Elite III%? What an abuse of the 2nd Amendment. What were they going to do shoot counter-protestors and/or shoot the police. Why were they not asked to disperse by the Dallas police for their safety and the safety of everyone else. Vigilantism is a dangerous answer to what is attempting to destroy our country and not thanks to Trump.
3
Boston had thousands and thousands of protesters. The ideas the different sides had were just as intense. But no one was hurt, no one died, and no one, so far as I have read about, was arrested. What Boston also had was a government ad police force that put into action a program that allowed the different sides to go there with out violence. Charlottesville on the other hand, let a far smaller crowd become violent. Some reports were the police "hung back' until things were out of hand.. The mayor tries to blame Trump and guns. But the responsibility to keep the two sides apart and prevent violence was his and the police's. They failed and the consequences were tragic. We have always had people who put out repugnant beliefs. Like those who protest at the burial of soldiers who died in combat. In 2011, the Supreme Court ruled the speech and picketing of funerals were protected under the First Amendment. Like everyone in the U.S., groups have a right of assembly and free speech. They will get permits. There will be protests against them. The government's responsibility is to protect the two sides from becoming physically violent. That is what Boston did and what Charlottesville did not. One NYT editorial said the Neo Nazies in Charletsville may paint themselves as victems to draw members. I doubt they will get a lot of new members after Boston
4
I am so glad it was a good march with amazingly few problems. I hope they all are.
If the counter protesters REALLY want to irk Trumo and his followers, they must continue to protest with nonviolent marches.
It will scare him and the Republican Party to death. It may even force their hands.
MLK and Gandhi got it right.
It's a big goal to try to achieve with so many people. I heard one group chanting "do not engage."
My hat is off to them.
If the counter protesters REALLY want to irk Trumo and his followers, they must continue to protest with nonviolent marches.
It will scare him and the Republican Party to death. It may even force their hands.
MLK and Gandhi got it right.
It's a big goal to try to achieve with so many people. I heard one group chanting "do not engage."
My hat is off to them.
8
So proud to be from Massachusetts.Thank you all that came to Boston yesterday, to show the world, the heart and soul of our country.
3
First, I give credit to the Boston Police and authorities and how they handled the situation. First, they recognized the "free speech" participants had a right to gather, and a right to safety. The limited number of "free speech" participants got to exercise their rights and were protected from a belligerent mob more than 100 times their size. The groups were kept separated, violence between the groups was avoided, and order maintained.
Second, I find it troubling that we have dissolved to a mob mentality where people are now counter-protested not based on what they actually say, but based upon what it is thought they may say. Intimidation of people you disagree with is an echo of what happened in the Civil Rights era, when organizers and participants were subject to intimidation and violence.
And it does not matter that you think you are right and the group you are counter-protesting is obviously wrong. Lynch mobs thought the same way.
As for the destruction of symbols, during the French Revolution mobs descended on St Denis Church destroying the tomb memorials to generations of French Royalty. Some were preserved at the urging or historians, arguing that some must be preserved to remember the excesses of the Monarchy.
Bones of generations of monarchs were removed by the mob and dumped in a nearby river. That is why there is no Louis XIV tomb.
Now, over two hundred years later, I think we recognize that the loss of that tomb art was not a good thing.
Second, I find it troubling that we have dissolved to a mob mentality where people are now counter-protested not based on what they actually say, but based upon what it is thought they may say. Intimidation of people you disagree with is an echo of what happened in the Civil Rights era, when organizers and participants were subject to intimidation and violence.
And it does not matter that you think you are right and the group you are counter-protesting is obviously wrong. Lynch mobs thought the same way.
As for the destruction of symbols, during the French Revolution mobs descended on St Denis Church destroying the tomb memorials to generations of French Royalty. Some were preserved at the urging or historians, arguing that some must be preserved to remember the excesses of the Monarchy.
Bones of generations of monarchs were removed by the mob and dumped in a nearby river. That is why there is no Louis XIV tomb.
Now, over two hundred years later, I think we recognize that the loss of that tomb art was not a good thing.
9
The purpose of Trump's tweet was to to say the rise in white supremacists pre-dates his presidency. " it's always been like that". Pathetic. Once again he only thinks of himself and his legacy.
10
Yes. It was all about not being willing to take on any of the responsibility.
It could be worse. He could have mentioned that his inauguration crowd size was bigger.
It could be worse. He could have mentioned that his inauguration crowd size was bigger.
1
What legacy can he have?
Free speech must be for all. People will say hateful things. People will raise their kids to be bigots or kids will be radicalized by peers (be it white supremacists, gangs, religious extremists, or some other microcosm ...) partly because they feel marginalized but the reasons go deeper.
In the end, I have to believe those who are truly moral on all sides, those who truly respect the right for all to have different political perspectives (not the right to extremism) will prevail and denounce hate. We must speak out against hate on all sides- everytime it happens. That's what Trump, (ineloquently) was saying. His predecessors (on both sides of the aisle) couldn't even call those 2 terrorists in California terroists. Why? We should not be afraid to offend extremists.
And that seems to be what many people are upset about. It doesn't make one a rascist or fascist.
In the end, I have to believe those who are truly moral on all sides, those who truly respect the right for all to have different political perspectives (not the right to extremism) will prevail and denounce hate. We must speak out against hate on all sides- everytime it happens. That's what Trump, (ineloquently) was saying. His predecessors (on both sides of the aisle) couldn't even call those 2 terrorists in California terroists. Why? We should not be afraid to offend extremists.
And that seems to be what many people are upset about. It doesn't make one a rascist or fascist.
6
Free Speech? Free speech for who? The new Leftie Fascists? The demographics of the country are changing. Of those communities that are removing their history, statues, what makes them different from the TALIBAN ? The Confederates lost but are you going to destroy those icons that serve as a reminder, a part of history, as to why there was a Civil War? Today's kids can't even name three of the most recent presidents. Again, I ask- what makes these fools different from the TALIBAN ?
5
Smitel: For EVERYONE, that's who. For people you disagree with, and people you ardently support. For stupid people, mean people, cowardly people... and for brave, moral, and good people.
As for "what makes these fools different from the Taliban"? No guns.
As for "what makes these fools different from the Taliban"? No guns.
1
Trump held up his index finger to see which way the wind was blowing. He discovered it was coming from a different direction than he thought so he changed his speech and praised the counter demonstrators. The man has no core values, is without a moral center and is a disgusting human being. History will paint those in Congress that continue to support him with a treasonous brush. This sorry excuse of a man Trump must leave the Presidency NOW!
14
Just what I was thinking but you said it so much better than I could.
I'm not sure it was the "index finger".
1
The moral opprobrium of Donald Trump for not speaking against white supremacy is well justified. What I'm not seeing in the NY Times or other journalistic venue is a more complete factual and moral analysis of the events. This includes: 1) contents of consciousness, such as ideas, thoughts, feelings / emotions, and beliefs are not themselves products to be subjugated to approval by the state, as in Orwellian novels. Only actions count. 2) One individual, a 20-year-old apparent thug, caused the death of Heather Heyer. Conflating the responsibility for her death over all the white supremacy protesters is irresponsible. 3) The First Amendment does not exist to protect the speech that we like; its purpose is explicitly to protect the speech that we dislike and even despise (as with this case). We need to ensure that our outrage does not touch on this very basic freedom. 4) The clash of ideas and values should not be erased from public discourse; however, the initiation of violence crosses a moral red line that should not be tolerated, regardless of the views of the actor.
Summary: the homicidal driver is one individual; celebrate the First Amendment; do not commit violence, except in self-defense; demand moral leadership from government.
Summary: the homicidal driver is one individual; celebrate the First Amendment; do not commit violence, except in self-defense; demand moral leadership from government.
4
Joel Sanders: Great in theory. But surely you have to use reason & apply theory in practical, workable, & human terms. In other words, use commonsense. The concept of free speech assumes some intelligence & a moral sense & a sense of responsibility. Freedom of speech does not give one the right to lie, slander another's goodname, or insult another, let alone preach hatred or threaten another's life. In other words, you have the right to speak AND you have no right to hate speech. A right assumes a responsibility to interpret the parameters of that right in an intelligent & moral & ethical way. You may have the right to "bear arms," for example (a strange "right"!), but surely you don't have the right to carry weapons everywhere & shoot people up at will, surely commonsense should have some say. In ethical & moral terms, "free speech" does not mean the irresponsibility of hate speech.
1
Thank you for the long and thoughtful response. I must disagree with you about the freedom to make speech that is offensive / disgusting, with the exception that threats of violence are certainly not protected. The slippery slope of your argument is that one can end up with hearing only the speech approved by the state (i.e. those actors in the state sector who decide what values may be advocated). This is exactly what the US Framers feared.
Joel Sanders: I didn't say anything about "offensive," for the reason that "offensive" is a value judgement & what's considered "offensive" is often defined by social mores of the time! Agree with your caution about slippery slope. But I'm not talking merely offensive, I'm saying speech which threatens in any way: another's dignity (as in racist or sexist remarks), another's reputation (slander, which is illegal anyway), another's right to peaceful enjoyment, another's person, or another's life. I agree it's not cut-and-dried, one has to be careful. But from my perspective, I often hear Americans trying to defend "free speech" & they seem to be saying ANYTHING goes! It cannot. Or we'd have even more hatred & violence, we'd have total chaos! Thanks for the discussion.
Does he (Trump) even know why people are protesting?
6
This might sound paranoid, but I read Trump's backpedaling comments as code for his supporters, who think the biggest problem in this country is that the "lamestream media" are "bigoted against"/"hate" conservative opinions and policies.
The comments, back and forth, about the sincerity of the subsequent tweets is silly. Even if he composed them, Trump is to be judged by actions, not words. His justice department is eviscerating LGBTQ rights. He is presiding over the return of racist drug laws and mass incarceration of young black men. He is pressing to make education and health care privatized privileges rather than universal rights. He is consorting with public bigots like Bannon (despite his "resignation") and Stephen Miller. His father marched with the Klan. He has been sued for racial discrimination in real estate. He is an self-admitted sexual assaulter. I could go on.
Even if he tweets a lovely sonnet, he is a proven pig.
Even if he tweets a lovely sonnet, he is a proven pig.
12
Has anyone wondered how these spontaneous demonstrators come up with such elaborate posters?
3
That's the best you can come up with??
That's weak.
We knew the "free speech" people were coming by Wednesday. So there as plenty of time to come up with clever posters!
I'm still waiting for my money though for going to the counter protest
.
That's weak.
We knew the "free speech" people were coming by Wednesday. So there as plenty of time to come up with clever posters!
I'm still waiting for my money though for going to the counter protest
.
5
Pieces of poster board, fabric with stick on letters? Nothing elaborate about that.
2
Seriously??? That's the easiest part! All kinds of sign shops, franchises & stand alone businesses can do large scale banners & signs, digitally, within hours.
1
DT is trying to spin the outrage at him. Don't fall for it America. A zebra doesn't loose it's stripes.
4
Words matter. The fake president's real feelings were clear in his words last week. His praise for the protesters now rings as fake as his presidency. Hate mongering was OK with him all during his campaign as he exhorted his followers to violence on numerous occasions. His supporters know that and everyone who opposes him knows that. The damage has been done and his earlier encouragement and apologies for the thugs he has aligned himself with have emboldened more hate. The fake president should resign.
7
Does anyone here think that not every expression of support for free speech is an endorsement of the KKK and neo-Nazis? Voltaire is credited to have said "I disapprove with what you say but will defend to the death your right to say it." I am sickened by the President's response to Charlottesville but I am also becoming increasingly nervous that we will suppress all dissenting thought under the guise of opposing racism. The organizers of the Free Speech Rally appear to have gone to great pains to distance themselves from the racists and the bigots. But they were shouted down because the political environment allowed us to shout them down. Is this what tyranny of the left looks like?
9
It is not "tyranny of the left". It is people with opposing views also exercising their First Amendment rights. Apparently you believe that only one group can express its opinions and that a larger, peaceful group cannot express its abhorrence of those opinions.
Just as at the voting booth where you can vote for whom you believe is tbe best candidage with views that most closely match your own, others can simultaneously vote for a candidate with totally opposing views. It's part of what makes America great.
Just as at the voting booth where you can vote for whom you believe is tbe best candidage with views that most closely match your own, others can simultaneously vote for a candidate with totally opposing views. It's part of what makes America great.
1
A triviality in terms of what is going on in the country:
I would like the writer(s) to be more consistent in their use of terms 'demonstrators', 'demonstrations'. It's difficult to follow reporting when the same terms are used to indicate groups of people with opposing views.
I would like the writer(s) to be more consistent in their use of terms 'demonstrators', 'demonstrations'. It's difficult to follow reporting when the same terms are used to indicate groups of people with opposing views.
3
There must be a massive march across America, millions in the streets, all demanding that Trump resign. He is destroying our country. He has to go. The only way to get him to go is a massive show of force against him and his policies.
10
JImFaye -- what is it that Trump has done that so annoys you? From the op ed writers to the so called journalists of the Times to the commentariat - I have not yet read a solid indictment of Trump for anything he has done. It is simply from the left because they didn't win and because at a personal level they don't like Trump.
So, exactly what is it?
Trump didn't collude with the Russians.
His firing of Comey was perfectly deserved and legitimate.
His backing out of the PA was the correct thing to do. It was a worthless agreement that would do nothing except cost us money.
The disorder in the WH is not atypical of many new administrations. And the only reason people say there is disorder is because the mindless biased leftist MSM tells us so.
Controlling our borders is legal and smart.
Getting NATO members to pay their fair share is something that makes perfect sense as NATO is an organization primarily designed to protect Europe.
Reducing and simplifying taxes will stimulate the economy.
Building infrastructure is critical.
Job growth in America is important for all of us.
The ACA has been a disaster and doesn't focus on the correct issue -- health care costs. But that's even Trump's issue. The Republicans have campaigned on that for 7 years.
And Trump is correct -- there is violence on both sides as the events of yesterday showed. Antifa and BLM are only interested in spreading hate and in shutting up their opponents.
So, exactly what is it?
Trump didn't collude with the Russians.
His firing of Comey was perfectly deserved and legitimate.
His backing out of the PA was the correct thing to do. It was a worthless agreement that would do nothing except cost us money.
The disorder in the WH is not atypical of many new administrations. And the only reason people say there is disorder is because the mindless biased leftist MSM tells us so.
Controlling our borders is legal and smart.
Getting NATO members to pay their fair share is something that makes perfect sense as NATO is an organization primarily designed to protect Europe.
Reducing and simplifying taxes will stimulate the economy.
Building infrastructure is critical.
Job growth in America is important for all of us.
The ACA has been a disaster and doesn't focus on the correct issue -- health care costs. But that's even Trump's issue. The Republicans have campaigned on that for 7 years.
And Trump is correct -- there is violence on both sides as the events of yesterday showed. Antifa and BLM are only interested in spreading hate and in shutting up their opponents.
6
jimfaye: It's ALREADY happening! People ARE marching in the streets! Everyone understands the marches are saying: You are hurting our children, you are making innocent people suffer, you are destroying our great country, you have to go! It's happening! (Get out there yourself! Don't wait for others to do it for you!)
2
The demonstraions and marches yesterday were positive and meaningful, but these activities must translate into votes in 2018 and 2020. While Trump "struts and frets", his minions are quietly working to reduce environmental, economic, and educational regulations for the benefit of Trump's billionaire constituency. Republicans in state legislatures work tirelessly to gerrymander districts and reduce minority voter participation. The republican governor of Kentucky attributed the violence in Virginia to "a lack of Bibles in public schools." Even if Trump is removed from office, his agenda will continue and will take years of concerted effort to remedy.
13
As I look at both side of these protests from afar, I see one side being equated with Fascism and the other side openly espousing Socialism. Didn't we learn our lesson that Hitler and Stalin were cruel, totalitarian leaders who executed millions of their own people? Let's not lose sight of the far edges of these movements, we should trust the "antifa" movement no further than the "alt-right" movement.
5
Rob J -- I agree but would state it more strongly. The far right -- White supremacists, neo Nazis -- are truly fringe despite the attempt of the leftist media to paint them as a threat and Trump as their champion.
But the alt.left of Antifa and BLM are not so fringe and represent the thinking of a large swath of the progressive movement. I'm not saying all progressives support violence, but a lot of progressives support suppressing speech they disagree with as we have seen on campus after campus.
So what's the bigger threat to democracy -- a fringe hate group or a a fringe hate group that is actively attacking one of the foundations of our democracy and whose attack is widely supported by many on the left?
But the alt.left of Antifa and BLM are not so fringe and represent the thinking of a large swath of the progressive movement. I'm not saying all progressives support violence, but a lot of progressives support suppressing speech they disagree with as we have seen on campus after campus.
So what's the bigger threat to democracy -- a fringe hate group or a a fringe hate group that is actively attacking one of the foundations of our democracy and whose attack is widely supported by many on the left?
1
Glad to see non-violent protest. This ius what America is about.
8
Although you mention her name near the end of your piece, I would have preferred you to put a name on "after a 32-year-old woman died amid clashes between white nationalists and counterprotesters in Charlottesville, Va." as in, "The demonstrations — which drew 40,000 people in Boston alone, according to police estimates — came one week after Heather Heyer, a 32-year-old woman, died amid clashes between white nationalists and counterprotesters in Charlottesville, Va." As naming is becoming important in our political dialogue--Radical Islamic Extremists, Domestic Terrorists, Neo-Nazis--let's not to forget to name Heather. The majority of stores on the pedestrian mall in downtown Charlottesville, one block of the site of Heather's murder, have purple "Heather" signs in their window.
9
Go Boston.
Love,
New York.
Love,
New York.
10
There were many commentators who said people opposed to the white supremacists protests should just not go and counter protest. Silence and inaction are not an option. Good hearted people must show up, stand up, and speak up against white supremacists. Way to go Boston; 40,000 strong.
8
Thank you to the people of Boston, their officials and law enforcement. Coupled with this week's wonderful demonstration in Charlottesville, it's vital to remind the world, and ourselves, who we really are.
7
Yes, just look at the first photo - police said: No Signs on Sticks. Why those people are there?
1
Perhaps that is as far as they got with those signs and sticks? It is a still photo. The Boston police did a magnificent job.
1
I knew he would Make America Great Again.
When was the last time a Republican President, or even a Democratic President, brought out such crowds of Progressives, Liberals, and Conservatives, all concerned about preserving our Democracy and Justice?
At this rate, by 2018 serious Progressives, serious Conservatives, African-Americans, Caucasian-Americans, Hispanic-Americans,... Christian-Americans, Jewish Americans, Moslem-Americans, Hindu-Americans,... Young- Americans, Senior- Americans,... Female-Americans, Male Americans, Trans-Americans,... American Americans all,
will finally all reach out to each other, will finally all talk together and find our way together, hand-in-hand, to turn President Trump's words and actions around one-hundred-and-eighty degrees into the Great America WE want to live in.
President Donald J. Trump has given a truly golden opportunity to all of us, all Americans who want to stand up, together, with the whole World watching, and start to "live out the true meaning of our creed."
Pence wouldn't, Pence couldn't bring us all together.
The Donald was apparently right all along: He IS the only one who can do this for us.
Viva el Presidente Trump!
When was the last time a Republican President, or even a Democratic President, brought out such crowds of Progressives, Liberals, and Conservatives, all concerned about preserving our Democracy and Justice?
At this rate, by 2018 serious Progressives, serious Conservatives, African-Americans, Caucasian-Americans, Hispanic-Americans,... Christian-Americans, Jewish Americans, Moslem-Americans, Hindu-Americans,... Young- Americans, Senior- Americans,... Female-Americans, Male Americans, Trans-Americans,... American Americans all,
will finally all reach out to each other, will finally all talk together and find our way together, hand-in-hand, to turn President Trump's words and actions around one-hundred-and-eighty degrees into the Great America WE want to live in.
President Donald J. Trump has given a truly golden opportunity to all of us, all Americans who want to stand up, together, with the whole World watching, and start to "live out the true meaning of our creed."
Pence wouldn't, Pence couldn't bring us all together.
The Donald was apparently right all along: He IS the only one who can do this for us.
Viva el Presidente Trump!
1
Irony isn't worth Heather's life, though...
Two policemen died protecting the public at the demonstration that sadly took a protester's life due to a hateful act of violence. Six policemen were shot yesterday , several suspected to be assassinations, two dead yet the media hardly notices because of political agendas in their news reporting. I write this because I lost a cousin ..a policeman..on 9/11 and I want the world to know that many of us notice. Thank You.
2
The plain and simple is that Robert E. Lee was a traitor. He received his military education at the expense of U.S. taxpayers at West Point, then became a turncoat who led a military force that took up arms against the United States of America. If that isn't treason, what is? By any reasonable standard, he and other Confederate leaders ought to have been executed by a firing squad; only Abraham Lincoln's wish to reunite the nation prevented this. Lee's asinine decision to side with the Confederacy resulted in the loss of more American lives than any other decision in U.S. history. Had Lee instead been a patriot who served his country, the Civil War might have been relatively brief, given Lee's ability as a general. Where else in the world do they erect statues of traitors?
9
Trump's "praise" will be contradicted tomorrow if not sooner.
4
Not content to virtue signal using only their fossil fueled, Capitalism devised smartphones from their mom's basement any longer, thousands of brave Bostonians poured into Boston Common to bravely confront thousands of other brave people who were equally virtuous.
Meanwhile, a couple of dozen sick twisted freaks met across the way to rally in favor of 'free speech'. There is no virtue to be found in any one of them. This fact is beyond challenge or dispute, because the virtuous throngs have a monopoly on all that is good and true.
The freaks soon dispersed, leaving the virtuous throng to exult in their own love of themselves and their virtue, which can only be matched by their righteous indignation and contempt for Donald Trump which burns with the fury of a thousand suns, virtuosly.
Meanwhile, a couple of dozen sick twisted freaks met across the way to rally in favor of 'free speech'. There is no virtue to be found in any one of them. This fact is beyond challenge or dispute, because the virtuous throngs have a monopoly on all that is good and true.
The freaks soon dispersed, leaving the virtuous throng to exult in their own love of themselves and their virtue, which can only be matched by their righteous indignation and contempt for Donald Trump which burns with the fury of a thousand suns, virtuosly.
I saw a picture of a Trump supporter being hit with a full bottle of water. "Largely peaceful" my foot. I guess we all have different standards, and when the George Soros rent-a-mobs throw fewer than 100 projectiles it is "peaceful".
3
You saw one person doing this. Thousands more were not. You, like Trump, want to focus on a grain of sand in a desert.
I heard people chanting "do not engage" to fellow counter protesters to help them remember it was to be nonviolent.
These people are heroes.
I heard people chanting "do not engage" to fellow counter protesters to help them remember it was to be nonviolent.
These people are heroes.
4
Fewer than 100/40,000, or 0.25%? Yeah, I would consider that "largely peaceful". You'd have a better chance of winning a small lottery sum than witnessing violence there.
2
Trump is alway quick to play the "anti-police agitators/gang" card.
I feel like he may even want this so he can play tough guy and also spew campaign style rhetoric about our great law enforcement and military.
It would also help justify his awful press conference earlier in the week.
We are in a dangerous place because of his viewpoints and tactics.
I feel like he may even want this so he can play tough guy and also spew campaign style rhetoric about our great law enforcement and military.
It would also help justify his awful press conference earlier in the week.
We are in a dangerous place because of his viewpoints and tactics.
3
This is really a very dicey issue. Our guaranteed right of free speech is unlimited by the Bill or Rights and Constitution. There are a few Supreme Court decisions that place some limits on this freedom of speech. Mostly, these are that free speech does not cover such things as standing in a movie theater and yelling fire when there is no fire. The limits are common sense limits that generally involve safety of others.
Should ideology be limited? If so, where does one start limiting and where does one stop? I do not support the right or the left, I am a middle of the road democracy supporting American. I wore this country's uniform so that people would maintain the freedoms of the Constitution and Bill of Rights. I believe that everyone has the right to free speech and also the right to move out of hearing distance and not hear free speech that offends them.
If we limit the hate speech of the right because it is offensive to many, what do we do about the speech on the left that also is offensive to many? This angst over speech is a two edged sword and cuts both ways.
One thing I believe we should do is to pass a Federal law and require law enforcement at all levels to enforce it. That law being that at demonstrations or protes no weapons may be carried , no mask or helmets can be worn, any one throwing a punch is to be arrested, and any counter protest conducted within 5 miles of a authorized protest is a felony.
Should ideology be limited? If so, where does one start limiting and where does one stop? I do not support the right or the left, I am a middle of the road democracy supporting American. I wore this country's uniform so that people would maintain the freedoms of the Constitution and Bill of Rights. I believe that everyone has the right to free speech and also the right to move out of hearing distance and not hear free speech that offends them.
If we limit the hate speech of the right because it is offensive to many, what do we do about the speech on the left that also is offensive to many? This angst over speech is a two edged sword and cuts both ways.
One thing I believe we should do is to pass a Federal law and require law enforcement at all levels to enforce it. That law being that at demonstrations or protes no weapons may be carried , no mask or helmets can be worn, any one throwing a punch is to be arrested, and any counter protest conducted within 5 miles of a authorized protest is a felony.
34
I think you are getting two separate issues entangled with each other. We have a right to free speech per the constitution. You can say what you want and the government will not silence or arrest you for those words. BUT free speech doesn't happen in a vacuum, and if you decide to speak publicly about topics a majority of citizen find repugnant, it should be no surprise when you get a very large group protesting your message. Opposing the content of free speech is ALSO free speech. So, I guess the best idea if you have unpopular ideas and bristle at being confronted for them, is to rent out a little barn and do an email invite to people who are like minded. The US has a consensus of anti-nazi believers in equality. There is no main street that will sit silent as hate parades down its street. That's public discourse. If the government enacted a law banning counter-arguments, THAT would be limiting freedom of speech.
10
Unfortunately some of the "free speech" on the right is more an incitement to violence than simply the right to speak one's mind and therein lies the problem. Too many alt-rigjhts do nor understand the difference.
2
mjbr
I agree with you until your last statement. Counter protest within the vicinity of a protest needs to be protected. There is no freedom of speech if counter protestors are so far away that their voices cannot be heard. This cuts both ways, for those we agree with and those we disagree with. There is a difference between coming armed for battle or to intimidate and peaceful vocal protest.
I agree with you until your last statement. Counter protest within the vicinity of a protest needs to be protected. There is no freedom of speech if counter protestors are so far away that their voices cannot be heard. This cuts both ways, for those we agree with and those we disagree with. There is a difference between coming armed for battle or to intimidate and peaceful vocal protest.
3
There's a whale of a difference between 'exercising' free speech and 'abusing' free speech...vociferously promoting hate, bigotry and racism is abusing free speech and, if not legally, is morally reprehensible.
4
The events in Boston underscore the difference when the police department is also engaged with the community. I detected none of that in footage and accounts of the event in Charlottesville.
In fact, I was appalled that the police in Charlottesville did not adhere to any normal protocols. It made me wonder if the good old southern boy network was at work and there had been a wink wink agreement between some in the police and the organizers?
I marched in the Boston Womens March this year. We had a long list of rules to follow. No backpacks, sticks, etc. an overwhelming number of people showed up for a peaceful day of protest and unity. The police force was outstanding. Not so in Charlottesville.
We love Commissioner Evans and his police force. We are proud the counter protester March was led by Mayor Walsh.
Thank you Boston!
In fact, I was appalled that the police in Charlottesville did not adhere to any normal protocols. It made me wonder if the good old southern boy network was at work and there had been a wink wink agreement between some in the police and the organizers?
I marched in the Boston Womens March this year. We had a long list of rules to follow. No backpacks, sticks, etc. an overwhelming number of people showed up for a peaceful day of protest and unity. The police force was outstanding. Not so in Charlottesville.
We love Commissioner Evans and his police force. We are proud the counter protester March was led by Mayor Walsh.
Thank you Boston!
8
What's this nonsense about fascists suddenly being "free speech protesters"?
This seems to have come out of the blue since last Saturday. Let's not let them usurp the language of human rights and the Constitution.
We ALL have free speech. And if there are 10X as many of us at the "free speech protest" as them, guess who is going to be heard.
We must not allow ourselves to be considered as "counter-protesters" at "free speech protests". No, we are there to support free speech and exercise it ourselves.
This seems to have come out of the blue since last Saturday. Let's not let them usurp the language of human rights and the Constitution.
We ALL have free speech. And if there are 10X as many of us at the "free speech protest" as them, guess who is going to be heard.
We must not allow ourselves to be considered as "counter-protesters" at "free speech protests". No, we are there to support free speech and exercise it ourselves.
5
The tweets from Trump should be ignored or at minimum, not taken seriously at all. They're notable only because they originate from the President of the U.S. No substance, no consistency, really, nothing there.
3
I think its fair to say that Donald Trump is correct in saying that " Our country will soon come together as one!." But not necessarily as he would have us believe. There is still the small matter of Robert Mueller's investigation into Republican collusion with Russia to cheat the 2016 presidential election.
3
Boston was clear that no guns would be allowed. What scares me most is private citizens with assault rifles "keeping the peace". The potential for mass violence is huge. Even without a shot fired, the intimidation and bullying intent are clear. Do we need to have a mass killing before we remove military weapons from public display at public gatherings with the potential for violence?
11
Free speech in this country has degenerated. Should hateful speech whose only purpose is to denigrate and incite others to violence against another group of individuals for simply being of a different race, gender or religion be banned? Absolutely. Already the president ( and other elected government officials) are elevated above the laws of the land. If some threaten violence against these officials, that someone will find themselves investigated by the Secret Service and may even be prosecuted if the threat is considered valid. However, our president can insult, denigrate and dehumanize classes of individuals, directly or by innuendo, ie. " the "second amendment people can take care of the problem" and he can go merrily on his way. That is hypocrisy to the nth. degree.
I don't believe people have the right to publish manuals on how to make bombs, weapons or other things that are used only to cause great harm to a person or their property. The 1st amendment should not be an absolute right, and other democracies in the world, who don't have such a constitutional amendment are doing fine. In addition, some restrict the amount of time and money that can be spent in campaigns without any adverse effects.
I wish Americans would come out by the thousands every time a State enacts laws enacted to suppress the right to vote; they don't, some because of apathy, others because of racism and xenophobia. These laws are a greater threat to our democracy.
I don't believe people have the right to publish manuals on how to make bombs, weapons or other things that are used only to cause great harm to a person or their property. The 1st amendment should not be an absolute right, and other democracies in the world, who don't have such a constitutional amendment are doing fine. In addition, some restrict the amount of time and money that can be spent in campaigns without any adverse effects.
I wish Americans would come out by the thousands every time a State enacts laws enacted to suppress the right to vote; they don't, some because of apathy, others because of racism and xenophobia. These laws are a greater threat to our democracy.
1
It no longer matters what Trump tweets. I was at the Eclipse Hate rally last night in Portland. Trump has been eclipsed by goodness and decency by the nation. I'm very proud of our country today. Trump has only made me ashamed.
3
Political violence, threats and intimidation are unacceptable and NOT protected by our Constitution. Law enforcement must never align with specific political groups, American law is designed nover to do that. The Political Left has lost its way. 1984 was a WARNING not an instruction manual!
One thing that has not been widely reported about the protests in Boston yesterday: the police and mayor made it clear for several days in advance, that no weapons, bats, clubs, etc. would be allowed on the Common, and that bags and backpacks would be checked. Is this one of the reasons so few attended the right-wing rally? It certainly didn't hinder the tens of thousands of counter-protesters!
7
A thousand to one. That's how outnumbered the alt-right demonstrators were at their rally in Boston today. One thousand people speaking out against hate for every person misusing the First Amendment to spread bigotry. Thank you, Boston. Thank you also to the other cities where a similar pattern was repeated today. THIS is what will make America TRULY great again.
4
Matt Staley doesn't seem to understand that both sides got to speak, but one side resonated much more with the local population.
5
Watching these amazing, brave, wonderful people marching together with such solidarity and hope and good will in their hearts makes me so proud to be American.
2
We are free to speak our minds, with certain exceptions such as incitement to violence, but that does not confer a right to have one's views broadcast beyond the reach of one's own voice or pen. No one is guaranteed the right to have their words rebroadcast by others, including the commercial media. Thus the media bear a great responsibility to show good judgment and a concern for the community in their selection of what to broadcast, distribute or otherwise publicize.
1
"Make America great again" is a slogan with innuendo colored by who uses the term. In generic terms, it evokes the notion that the best, civilized, and graciousness character of the nation be resurrected. From the Alt-right, it seems to mean the reappearance of white-supremacy. From the liberals, it may mean more availability of abortions, more welfare, and a single payer system with massively higher taxes on the nebulous rich. From those focused on jobs, it may mean the return of all sorts of manufacturing jobs, now being done by menial labor in 3rd world nations, rather ignorant of how robots are taking over things like building parts for iPhones as well as cars, televisions, etc.
Free speech, of course, includes whichever of the above a group wishes to promote, even if their bent is racist. Is it better to ignore 30 people in a Boston gazebo or a 100 people with torches in Charlottesville? Or, is it better to shout them down, challenging their free speech rights and provoking eruptive personalities?
The broad middle by definition espouses none of the extremes but sees progress as not the "again" in "make America great, again" but sees America staying great with innovative creativity and balance in our graciousness to both our own and those who need to come to our shores to start a new life. And, our middle ground should continue to do what we can to lift up our own less capable, less educated, less disciplined, and unavoidably unemployed.
Free speech, of course, includes whichever of the above a group wishes to promote, even if their bent is racist. Is it better to ignore 30 people in a Boston gazebo or a 100 people with torches in Charlottesville? Or, is it better to shout them down, challenging their free speech rights and provoking eruptive personalities?
The broad middle by definition espouses none of the extremes but sees progress as not the "again" in "make America great, again" but sees America staying great with innovative creativity and balance in our graciousness to both our own and those who need to come to our shores to start a new life. And, our middle ground should continue to do what we can to lift up our own less capable, less educated, less disciplined, and unavoidably unemployed.
1
DT chimed in with a tweet that is out of synch with most of his statements. He is a liar, a term he uses on a far ranging group of people. He has been disconnected from reality for most of his life. Now he is our president.
One more thing: He is not a Republican but he will destroy the party if more people in power don't stand up to him. How did we get here?
One more thing: He is not a Republican but he will destroy the party if more people in power don't stand up to him. How did we get here?
2
I just want to add that the rally people DID talk. Maybe not as they planned, but when we marchers reached the common and filled the space. They broke up and then I encountered one talking, surrounded by 50 or so people who were listening, and calmly asking genuine questions about his beliefs.
It was impressive. Racists having to stand up in person, not behind a computer, and actually speak about what it is that drives them to think this way.
It was impressive. Racists having to stand up in person, not behind a computer, and actually speak about what it is that drives them to think this way.
7
Donald Trump needs to just be quiet. He doesn't know what he is talking about most of the time. Worse, when he "studies the facts", it's worse than when he just reads his own fake news outlets. He just makes noise and stirs up trouble. We already know all we need to know about him. There's nothing there, there, nothing to believe in, nothing to hope on, nothing to respect or admire. He's a big mistake.
3
However well demonstrations and counters thereto may be said to have gone across the country today, in regard to peacefully exercising 2nd amendment rights and declaring belief for and against white supremacy, neo-Nazism et al., it appears foolhardy to draw any conclusions about the feeling and mood of the country on these and related matters.
Likewise it seems foolhardy to do so because of the general reaction of business leaders, the military and fellow Republicans against PT's statements this past Tuesday that both sides were at fault in causing the violent incidents in Charlottsville last weekend, including most notably the death of Ms Heyer.
There are at least two reasons to withhold judgment. One is Mr Bannon's departure from the administration in that it frees him up to again exercise what have been described by some in the press as his formidable powers as a propagandist, to further the cause of white nationalism and to enhance the platform which Mr B acknowledges having given the alt-right before joining then-candidate Trump's team a year ago.
The second reason is that no one at this moment knows the disposition, feelings, judgments or opinions on these issues of the 63+ million who - not 10 months ago - voted for him to be president. Neither are these things known as to Trump supporters who did not vote. It would be rash to assume that accumulating and analyzing this information can be done quickly. IMO we'll be on tenterhooks for a good while.
Likewise it seems foolhardy to do so because of the general reaction of business leaders, the military and fellow Republicans against PT's statements this past Tuesday that both sides were at fault in causing the violent incidents in Charlottsville last weekend, including most notably the death of Ms Heyer.
There are at least two reasons to withhold judgment. One is Mr Bannon's departure from the administration in that it frees him up to again exercise what have been described by some in the press as his formidable powers as a propagandist, to further the cause of white nationalism and to enhance the platform which Mr B acknowledges having given the alt-right before joining then-candidate Trump's team a year ago.
The second reason is that no one at this moment knows the disposition, feelings, judgments or opinions on these issues of the 63+ million who - not 10 months ago - voted for him to be president. Neither are these things known as to Trump supporters who did not vote. It would be rash to assume that accumulating and analyzing this information can be done quickly. IMO we'll be on tenterhooks for a good while.
1
Disunity in a country creates instability, a drain of resources and manpower in trying to renew peace, a drop in morale and productivity, lack of focus and awareness of external threats. Our country has used these tactics to weaken rival and competitor countries, by instigating fear and mistrust within them and causing people to turn on each other. They are defenseless when they are attacking each other.
Anyone that wishes us harm now, need not lift a finger. We are doing it to ourselves.
We condemn those we see as terrorists or hostile foreign powers while we do the work for them. The true enemy is within. The greatest threat to us is ourselves.
When will we learn from a lesson that has been repeated so many times throughout history?
United we Stand, Divided We Fall.
Anyone that wishes us harm now, need not lift a finger. We are doing it to ourselves.
We condemn those we see as terrorists or hostile foreign powers while we do the work for them. The true enemy is within. The greatest threat to us is ourselves.
When will we learn from a lesson that has been repeated so many times throughout history?
United we Stand, Divided We Fall.
Well done, Mr. President, on approving the true values that make America great. Don't back the losers - people who fear they can't compete on a level playing field.
What the "Freedom of Speech" gatherers fail to realize is that the huge crowds around them in Boston were there exercising their own right to free speech. Monuments are not history, they are artworks. Artworks get moved and replaced. What people fail to realize is that this is nothing new. Throughout history, monuments to people and events have been toppled, have been moved, and have been replaced. From King Tut's mummy to The Elgin marbles. to Cleopatra's needle to statues of Lenin, Napoleon, and even Maine's labor murals..when history changes, sometimes, so do its monuments.
2
Its important to note that the overwhelming show of support for diversity and inclusion was in Boston a bastion of the "intellectual elite". I don't think the numbers would be so lopsided in favor of tolerance over fear and hate in the the middle of the country. Don't be fooled int to thinking that the numbers witnessed in Boston represent the country. This would never happen in Texas, Mississippi, Alabama, Idaho, etc... where ignorance and hate prevail over education and understanding. These are generalizations to be sure, but they are generally true.
1
Surely there is a way to remember US history without resorting to the tearing down of statues. Statues are symbolic and a reminder of our past. How we interpret that symbolism is what's dividing many. Do we tear down all Holocaust symbolic reminders? We should discard things that presently promote and advance hatred and racism. Those statues aren't speaking and
shouting hatred and racism from the rooftops. It's only the people behind them that are speaking and advancing whatever their cause 150 years later.
shouting hatred and racism from the rooftops. It's only the people behind them that are speaking and advancing whatever their cause 150 years later.
1
As a Yankees fan, I have to admit that Boston hit this one out of the park!
4
I'm so glad, that there was no violence. Perhaps the more professional law enforcement strategy by the Boston Police had something to do with the peaceful outcome.
People in the USA can walk around carrying high powered rifles? What?! No wonder I keep hearing people from other countries say they are afraid to travel to the US.
5
Some more winning here. I take it that the marchers were out to send a message directly to President Trump. If he hadn't made that 'many sides' statement, the turnout would probably have been less?
Say what you like, but I was thrilled to see Mr. Trump change tack with his tweets. It could be just the low bar I had set on his response. Perhaps something like "Both sides NOT to blame this time!! Blame on neither side! Good!!
First was the usual dog whistle to the faithful - the protestors were 'anti-police', it seems. Then I guess he takes a look at the widespread covfefe of the protest on TV, the size of the crowd, and wham! The first amendment rallyists somehow find themselves under the wheels of a Washington bus in the middle of Boston.
I would have loved to see the expression on Mr. Ayyadurai's face when he read Mr. Trump's tweet -
however insincere - praising the demonstrators. A friendly word of advice for him, since he is planning some long shot contest on the Republican ticket. Don't. Your president doesn't like losers.
Say what you like, but I was thrilled to see Mr. Trump change tack with his tweets. It could be just the low bar I had set on his response. Perhaps something like "Both sides NOT to blame this time!! Blame on neither side! Good!!
First was the usual dog whistle to the faithful - the protestors were 'anti-police', it seems. Then I guess he takes a look at the widespread covfefe of the protest on TV, the size of the crowd, and wham! The first amendment rallyists somehow find themselves under the wheels of a Washington bus in the middle of Boston.
I would have loved to see the expression on Mr. Ayyadurai's face when he read Mr. Trump's tweet -
however insincere - praising the demonstrators. A friendly word of advice for him, since he is planning some long shot contest on the Republican ticket. Don't. Your president doesn't like losers.
2
I went to college in Cambridge during the Louise Day Hicks years. I never thought parts of the city would ever be accepting of people from Roxbury. Reading the newspapers in those days left a bad taste in my mouth. But I was heartened to see the entire city represented yesterday in the counter march, and the fact that it began at Reggie Lewis Center. What changed the Red Sox, what changed the people of South Boston all those years ago? Acceptance of "the other" can happen, but the roots lie in fear, and that is what we must push for....erasing the fear of the unknown by making it knowable. Proud of the restraint I saw among the Boston Police yesterday. Good on them!
5
The battle here seems to be over what form of free speech is acceptable.
We say nothing when vile, misogynistic, and violent language is riddled through rap lyrics. Although I do wonder their influence on Black family formation and the treatment of women. Where is Al Sharpton?
We say nothing when violent, antisocial messages are the things on which Hollywood movie plots are based. And we think the Second Amendment is our only problem? Tally gun deaths versus box office receipts.
We say nothing when people publish degrading magazines like Hustler, Playboy, Playgirl and others under the protection of free speech. Where are the feminists? Are we okay dehumanizing and objectifying people?
We sit back and look at large corporations and entities pour millions of dollars into political campaigns, under the protection of free speech, resulting in 80% of a race's financing coming from outside the district contested. How many corporate PACs really represent those forced to contribute?
We have a very subjective and slippery grasp of what is and is not free speech. It is temporary and evolving, and we eventually accept things tomorrow that are abhorrent to us today.
If we are to talk about free speech, we must recognize that our ability to relativize most things makes all things less permanent and changeable.
We say nothing when vile, misogynistic, and violent language is riddled through rap lyrics. Although I do wonder their influence on Black family formation and the treatment of women. Where is Al Sharpton?
We say nothing when violent, antisocial messages are the things on which Hollywood movie plots are based. And we think the Second Amendment is our only problem? Tally gun deaths versus box office receipts.
We say nothing when people publish degrading magazines like Hustler, Playboy, Playgirl and others under the protection of free speech. Where are the feminists? Are we okay dehumanizing and objectifying people?
We sit back and look at large corporations and entities pour millions of dollars into political campaigns, under the protection of free speech, resulting in 80% of a race's financing coming from outside the district contested. How many corporate PACs really represent those forced to contribute?
We have a very subjective and slippery grasp of what is and is not free speech. It is temporary and evolving, and we eventually accept things tomorrow that are abhorrent to us today.
If we are to talk about free speech, we must recognize that our ability to relativize most things makes all things less permanent and changeable.
2
"“I think it’s awful that people can’t speak out to express opinions,” Mr. Staley said."
Dear Mr. Staley,
Kiling and injuring people with a car is not "free speech". It is violence. Do not be confused by a reality tv star masquerading as president who creates false equivalences.
Dear Mr. Staley,
Kiling and injuring people with a car is not "free speech". It is violence. Do not be confused by a reality tv star masquerading as president who creates false equivalences.
5
Free speech, whether liked or not, is still free speech. You try to silence that, well then you agree to becoming a dictatorship state. These anti free speech protesters will soon learn from there mistakes. Whether by voice, fist, or bullet. Our constitution will always stand. If you don't stand for it, then you will die by it.
2
How nice. He posted the words that were written for him. Give him a day or two and he will reveal his real thoughts, and they will be as negative and divisive as they always are.
2
I'm pretty unnerved by the nature of the Boston protest, and the way public perception of it has been shaped by this kind of reporting.
The rally was absolutely NOT a white supremacy gathering. The theme was freedom of speech, so the organizers let an alt-right speaker be on the roster. The first speaker was an older hippie lady who leads "The Healing Church" and conducts prayer ceremonies with marijuana. She began the rally by reading the Bill of Rights and leading a moment of silence to honor Heather Heyer, the woman murdered in Charlottesville.
It's frankly bizarre to see quotes like "he was pleased to see the early end of the free speech rally amid the large number of counter-protesters." Do I need to point out why? Okay! Freedom of speech is part of the First Amendment, the very thing that lets us gather in groups and protest stuff! I understand clinging to the narrative that 40,000 people drove away the same kind of violent hate-mongers who were in Virginia. That's an uplifting idea, and obviously those who showed up were responding to what happened last week. But blending the actual purpose of Boston's rally with the fervent quotes and imagery of the protest... that makes for a really uncomfortable message.
Isn't it ultimately a better feeling to know that the people rallying in Boston were not, in fact, violent white supremacists? We should be encouraged by that, not so disappointed that we bury the lede.
The rally was absolutely NOT a white supremacy gathering. The theme was freedom of speech, so the organizers let an alt-right speaker be on the roster. The first speaker was an older hippie lady who leads "The Healing Church" and conducts prayer ceremonies with marijuana. She began the rally by reading the Bill of Rights and leading a moment of silence to honor Heather Heyer, the woman murdered in Charlottesville.
It's frankly bizarre to see quotes like "he was pleased to see the early end of the free speech rally amid the large number of counter-protesters." Do I need to point out why? Okay! Freedom of speech is part of the First Amendment, the very thing that lets us gather in groups and protest stuff! I understand clinging to the narrative that 40,000 people drove away the same kind of violent hate-mongers who were in Virginia. That's an uplifting idea, and obviously those who showed up were responding to what happened last week. But blending the actual purpose of Boston's rally with the fervent quotes and imagery of the protest... that makes for a really uncomfortable message.
Isn't it ultimately a better feeling to know that the people rallying in Boston were not, in fact, violent white supremacists? We should be encouraged by that, not so disappointed that we bury the lede.
2
I am speechless.
No, not quite.
Who does Trump think is going to believe him?
No, not quite.
Who does Trump think is going to believe him?
“I think it’s awful that people can’t speak out to express opinions,” Mr. Staley [one of those who attended the "free speech" rally in Boston] said. What did he think people we doing at his rally? Who stopped them? Nobody.
1
Listen hard to what they are saying and make no mistake: alt-right ‘free speech’ rallies are focused on one particular kind of speech: hate speech. This is the most self-serving kind of speech. It takes away more freedom than it provides. Its great lie is that words cannot be powerful enough to serve as a cage of intimidation. It stifles the love and dreams of its victims. We know what words can do. They literally change neural maps in our brains. Since the beginning of humanity, we’ve chosen them as placeholders for feelings, ideas, and intentions that unite and divide us. They can liberate us. They can change our lives. Words are power. Listen hard.
1
As an American born in 1944 at the end of WWII, my entire life has been one war after another. Now after living 14 years as an expatriate, America has devolved into a Trump led debacle with Americans at each others throats.
The unified culture in France is a refreshing change from the hate mongering in the United States. Is America worth all the trouble? Not for this expatriate.
For those of you who decide to stay and fight it out, I wish you the best of luck. For those who want to save what's left of their lives, I encourage you to explore another country!
The unified culture in France is a refreshing change from the hate mongering in the United States. Is America worth all the trouble? Not for this expatriate.
For those of you who decide to stay and fight it out, I wish you the best of luck. For those who want to save what's left of their lives, I encourage you to explore another country!
2
The message to the hate groups today is you are vastly outnumbered by the majority of the country who wants to address real problems productive, decent people are facing. How we came to have the likes of the wishy-washy putrid ideas of a Donald Trump, who really doesn't actually quite seem to know what he stands for, is probably the big dose of reality this country needs to reassert the principles we share that made us the best place for a long, long time. Maybe this is the purge we all need. Let's purge hatred and bigotry from our ranks and join together for the good of the country. And that means our politicians as well who seem to have lost complete touch with their constituents and are now engaged in fund raising for their next campaigns as soon as they enter office and align themselves with those who will line their pockets while in office and after. Time to take out the trash all across the board.
2
"This city has a history of fighting back against oppression ..." said a 21-year-old protester who identified himself only as “Frosty” and wore an American flag to obscure much of his face.
At the tender age of 21, "Frosty" doesn't remember, the riots in Boston protesting busing to integrate the public schools in the 1970s. Boston does not, in fact, have a perfect record of standing strong against racism, but it certainly rose to the occasion today.
At the tender age of 21, "Frosty" doesn't remember, the riots in Boston protesting busing to integrate the public schools in the 1970s. Boston does not, in fact, have a perfect record of standing strong against racism, but it certainly rose to the occasion today.
2
Trump sad to say has no moral authority to praise anyone who came out in mass to reject his anti civilization beliefs, or what he calls free speech.
What he has done so far is given hate groups a platform to try and divide our country and those hate groups are the first to applaud him for that.
When November comes remember the silence of most of Republican Senators and House members as they are as complicit and show no courage, unlike the Americans who protested today.
What he has done so far is given hate groups a platform to try and divide our country and those hate groups are the first to applaud him for that.
When November comes remember the silence of most of Republican Senators and House members as they are as complicit and show no courage, unlike the Americans who protested today.
1
One is tired of reading the reports on what Trump said privately, in public, or twitted. Nothing that he says, has any value.
But the latest confrontations are all about the monuments of Civil War or War between the States, as some call it. Well, if the Christian country USA had adopted the prohibition by the orthodox Judaism and Islam of two-dimensional (paintings) and three-dimensional (statues) images, the issue would not have arisen, as we see it now on the streets. Undoubtedly, there would have been other causes for clashes between the extreme left and extreme right, but they would not have been about the statues of the CSA politicians and generals.
But the latest confrontations are all about the monuments of Civil War or War between the States, as some call it. Well, if the Christian country USA had adopted the prohibition by the orthodox Judaism and Islam of two-dimensional (paintings) and three-dimensional (statues) images, the issue would not have arisen, as we see it now on the streets. Undoubtedly, there would have been other causes for clashes between the extreme left and extreme right, but they would not have been about the statues of the CSA politicians and generals.
What a joke, extreme left. There were Nazi's a d there were everyday good, brave citizens. Period.
1
This native New Yorker doffs his cap to the good people of Boston, and the police officers who kept the peace there Saturday. Well done, everyone. Encouraging to see the example set that hate speech will be met by stronger speech for equality. I'm so glad that there was no violence- this is what peaceful protest looks like. Thank you, Boston.
2
Hats off to all the people who marched in the Boston rally. It makes me proud to live in the Boston area. Most people I know were at the rally, but I couldn't go because of mobility issues.
3
Trump offers a measure of praise. And what entirely to contrary will he say in the next breath? At this point who can possibly care what Trump says? I very much resent the fact that news organizations go on and on quoting him from moment to moment. Again I ask--Who cares what Trump says? Let's just keep our focus on what he does and doesn't DO.
1
I sincerely hope that all of those people who show up at these rallies and comment on Facebook and document their disgust show up and vote on the next Election Day and every single one after that. Our complacency has brought us the Trump government. We must vote in every election and fully participate at the local and state level to clean this mess up.
6
Yes, especially since the Republican Russia collaboration to fix outcomes.
1
As someone who has participated this summer in peaceful demonstrations advocating the removal of a Confederate monument (the statue in Travis Park in San Antonio), I do not need or want Trump's approval. But I am appalled by reports of protesters throwing rocks and urine at police officers. As all of the coverage of Saturday's events make clear, the police planned carefully, showed up in appropriate numbers and acted professionally to minimize violence and keep everyone safe. They deserve respect and maybe even gratitude for making it possible for Americans to resist without risking their lives.
1
America is living unfamiliar and untested times. The confrontation between the narrow radical Trump constituency and the majority of Americans is gaining momentum.
A new dimension of the political crisis has been added i.e., the conflict is moving rapidly to the streets of America. The experience in many parts of the world is who controls the streets wins the fight. This raises a distressing question.
Can the fate of the Trump's administration be decided in the streets of America?
A new dimension of the political crisis has been added i.e., the conflict is moving rapidly to the streets of America. The experience in many parts of the world is who controls the streets wins the fight. This raises a distressing question.
Can the fate of the Trump's administration be decided in the streets of America?
1
Proud to live in and to be active in Massachusetts politics and communities. White allies are coming out in droves here and around the country. While airing racism overtly is painful, it has provided us with an opportunity to address it with depth and ownership as a country. We can move forward with justice and love. It will continue to be messy, and we cannot be complicit with the madness of white supremacy. But our hearts are emboldened. We will prevail.
48
"There have been some confrontations involving counterprotesters, including a group that grabbed an American flag out of an elderly woman's hands, causing her to stumble and fall to the ground." ABC News August 20, 2017
1
Trump's mild response to USA's neo-Nazi's I suspect crossed a new line for many average Americans. Racism is plenty bad enough, but anti-Semitism affects even more Americans. Hence these wider and visible protests. Trump needs to go.
11
There is no difference. Hate is hate. He was playing to his base. If they come for one, then they will come for the other. He Needs to disassociate himself from his base and that ain't going to happen. His time is up.
1
That the Boston demonstration remained remained without substantial incidents that occurred, may have been due to the size and sophistication of law enforcement in a major and larger jurisdiction, as opposed to a smaller jurisdiction, with less sophistication and manpower to contain violent outbreaks.
5
No, Boston rallies behind its values and its police. This article did not mention that the police and the crowd were chanting"Boston Strong" together at one point.
1
I took a lot more comfort and hope from the comment of the Boston Police Commissioner who clearly and loudly praised "99.9%" of the counter-protestors and his force, and understands what's at risk, than from the fake President without values or ethics.
26
@cheryl
Let's keep in perspective that 0.1% of the counter-protesters and 100% of the offensive protesters are approximately the same number of people.
This country is now being dominated by the fringes, aided and abetted by a media that sees eyeballs, advertisements, clicks, and ratings as more important than quality journalism, probing reporting, and deep introspection.
We are all participants in a voyeuristic carnival for money. Just the fact that we are responding to this article is evidence of the problem.
Let's keep in perspective that 0.1% of the counter-protesters and 100% of the offensive protesters are approximately the same number of people.
This country is now being dominated by the fringes, aided and abetted by a media that sees eyeballs, advertisements, clicks, and ratings as more important than quality journalism, probing reporting, and deep introspection.
We are all participants in a voyeuristic carnival for money. Just the fact that we are responding to this article is evidence of the problem.
1
I'm so glad that over 40000 counter demostrators in Boston showed a couple of dozen white supremasists which end's up. About time right minded people showed trump's bigots what is it for which our country stands.
82
The couple of dozen people were not white supremacists. All those "counter protesters" and no protest to counter.
1
Because one is a republican, independent or Trump supporter does not make them a bigot. That's akin to saying all Democrats are communits or violent Antifa members. One's ideology and reason for supporting Trump whether it's simply because one does not support Hillary or for more complex reasons does not mean one confines rascism. Everything is not black and white -- pun intended!
2
Enforcement Act of 1870 Sec. 6.
"And be it further enacted, That if two or more persons shall band or conspire together, ..., with intent to violate any provision of this act, or to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any citizen with intent to prevent or hinder his free exercise and enjoyment of any right or privilege granted or secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having exercised the same, such persons shall be held guilty of felony, and, on conviction thereof, shall be fined or imprisoned, or both, at the discretion of the court,—the fine not to exceed five thousand dollars, and the imprisonment not to exceed ten years,—and shall, moreover, be thereafter ineligible to, and disabled from holding, any office or place of honor, profit, or trust created by the Constitution or laws of the United States."
The Acts are lengthy, repetitive and very very thorough. The mains points are:
THE ARMY is authorized to enforce these laws, Posse Comitatus notwithstanding.
Habeas Corpus can be suspended by the President with 150 year old Congressional approval.
The specified penalty is the same as that specified in the 14th for Rebellion against the U.S. Constitution.
It is no less than a declaration of civil war against any who commit an overt act in support of the Klan.
Why no enforcement of the Enforcement acts?
"And be it further enacted, That if two or more persons shall band or conspire together, ..., with intent to violate any provision of this act, or to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any citizen with intent to prevent or hinder his free exercise and enjoyment of any right or privilege granted or secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having exercised the same, such persons shall be held guilty of felony, and, on conviction thereof, shall be fined or imprisoned, or both, at the discretion of the court,—the fine not to exceed five thousand dollars, and the imprisonment not to exceed ten years,—and shall, moreover, be thereafter ineligible to, and disabled from holding, any office or place of honor, profit, or trust created by the Constitution or laws of the United States."
The Acts are lengthy, repetitive and very very thorough. The mains points are:
THE ARMY is authorized to enforce these laws, Posse Comitatus notwithstanding.
Habeas Corpus can be suspended by the President with 150 year old Congressional approval.
The specified penalty is the same as that specified in the 14th for Rebellion against the U.S. Constitution.
It is no less than a declaration of civil war against any who commit an overt act in support of the Klan.
Why no enforcement of the Enforcement acts?
15
"Why no enforcement of the Enforcement acts?"
Good question. Maybe we should start with the governor of Virginia and the Mayor of Charlottesville since there is every indication that they acted (in defiance of a federal court order) to deny the 1st Amendment protected rights of those attempting to rally in protest of the removal of the Robert E. Lee statue.
Maybe we could then go after those connected with the Democratic Party who are on record as being actively involved in efforts to foment violence at Trump campaign events:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IuJGHuIkzY
Actions like this would appear to be just the sort of thing you're talking about, correct?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsfB8YKm5VI
Good question. Maybe we should start with the governor of Virginia and the Mayor of Charlottesville since there is every indication that they acted (in defiance of a federal court order) to deny the 1st Amendment protected rights of those attempting to rally in protest of the removal of the Robert E. Lee statue.
Maybe we could then go after those connected with the Democratic Party who are on record as being actively involved in efforts to foment violence at Trump campaign events:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IuJGHuIkzY
Actions like this would appear to be just the sort of thing you're talking about, correct?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsfB8YKm5VI
Relax and straighten your tricorn, Kurtis. Antifas do get arrested--they are well aware they're breaking the law and take that risk. However, I'd rather them do that now and scare fascists away, than fascists gradually come to power and "enforce" their vision on the rest of us. Believe me, it doesn't include free speech.
#itsgoingdown
#itsgoingdown
"Free Speech" - we've enshrined it with our 1st Amendment. We are proud of it, we insist on it.
We are all free to speak, but what to do if our speech full of falsehood and unwillingness to accommodate verifiable facts? As humans we have an amazing appetite for fictions - what if we love our fictions so much that they overpower our natural instinct to test and verify and swallow them whole?
What if we then go out to broadcast these fascinatingly false fictions in a rally branded "Free Speech Rally"? Are we free to broadcast falsehoods? Yes we are, but I'm thankful to the thousands who protested and cut the lying short.
Those who are angry about spreading lies can just go home and cry, and then grow up.
We are all free to speak, but what to do if our speech full of falsehood and unwillingness to accommodate verifiable facts? As humans we have an amazing appetite for fictions - what if we love our fictions so much that they overpower our natural instinct to test and verify and swallow them whole?
What if we then go out to broadcast these fascinatingly false fictions in a rally branded "Free Speech Rally"? Are we free to broadcast falsehoods? Yes we are, but I'm thankful to the thousands who protested and cut the lying short.
Those who are angry about spreading lies can just go home and cry, and then grow up.
30
Sounds like preaching to the choir : because you're implying people , Other than you, will be reading about these counter- protests (and can even read or spell… Not just tweet everything )
Liars are yelling FIRE falsel y. Rhus NOT peotected by freedom of speech. (fire lie is falsely proclaiming that Americans are Exterminating all white people. That white people are becoming a minority in this country. This is all false propaganda. And instead of fearing a diverse Nation they should embrace it and remember what non-white American created the technology for their smartphones and their cars and for splitting the atom and creating peanut butter and audio and visual Technologies? Is diverse immigrants that were embraced in the long run by all Americans. If you become an American citizen it doesn't matter what race color creed you are an American and even if I'm not under citizen yet you pay sales tax and provide America with wealth to pave our roads pay our police and fire departments Etc.)
I am pleased to say my wife, Charlotte, and I were at a peace rally Thursday night outside a church on North Avenue. Clergy spoke, so did New Rochelle Mayor Noam Bramson, we lit candles, sang civil rights songs and stood together as one people, which we are.
60
Yay. Thank you !
2
a dollar short and a day late.
7
*decades late*
Where was everyone when I grew up with this?
Perhaps, it is "Cool, sick?"
Where was everyone when I grew up with this?
Perhaps, it is "Cool, sick?"
Never thought we'd see brown shirts again, certainly never in America. Democracy is dying. The anarchists are winning, and "we the people" are losing. None of this is going to end well. America is over and done and it really has nothing to do with color. It has to do with ethics, morals and attitudes.
13
What you have posted is true. However, what else would you expect from a country run by Oligarchs ? Where is Democracy in the USA ?
I am a Canadian, and it isn't much better in Canada. The Canadian elite ensure that our Government supports the Imperialistic USA and their never ending wars!
I applaud the thousands in the USA who marched for free speech. Now we all have to agree to fight for true Democracy ! Kick out the Oligarchs !
I am a Canadian, and it isn't much better in Canada. The Canadian elite ensure that our Government supports the Imperialistic USA and their never ending wars!
I applaud the thousands in the USA who marched for free speech. Now we all have to agree to fight for true Democracy ! Kick out the Oligarchs !
Democracy has survived worse, and American democracy will survive. It's amazing how fast you fold! "Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty", remember? We are having a 'bad day' for a time, but if you're not willing to stand up for America's 'ethics, morals and attitudes', what do you stand for?
3
Very well put.
1
The spectacle of Mr. Shiva Ayyadurai, a man of Indian descent, speaking through a bullhorn, siding with the group which represents white supremacists, Nazis, and KKK seemed rather surreal to me. If he is not careful, he may be the very person likely to be attacked and pounced upon by the group he was supporting. What an irony!
What is free speech? Speech must be respectful and free of hateful, racist, and sexist remarks. If those niceties are observed, speech is already free. Nothing more is needed. If speech includes offending others, or encouraging discord in community relations, then it does not qualify for free speech. If it extols bigotry and provokes violence, it is not free speech.
The first Amendment guarantees freedom of expression. it does not define the limits of freedom. It leaves those limits to be defined by the good sense of the citizen. Hateful speech does not qualify for free speech.
What is free speech? Speech must be respectful and free of hateful, racist, and sexist remarks. If those niceties are observed, speech is already free. Nothing more is needed. If speech includes offending others, or encouraging discord in community relations, then it does not qualify for free speech. If it extols bigotry and provokes violence, it is not free speech.
The first Amendment guarantees freedom of expression. it does not define the limits of freedom. It leaves those limits to be defined by the good sense of the citizen. Hateful speech does not qualify for free speech.
27
Hate mongering is abominable. Hate crimes can be prosecuted. But what you must have is the crime. Evidence of hate alone is not prosecutable.
"Offensive to others" is a ridiculously broad category, and there is no requirement for us to be respectful to others - otherwise every criticism of the government or elected figures could be prosecuted. The marches that took place Saturday could be shut down. Respect others' civil rights, yes; respect our own Constitution and Bill of Rights, yes.
Defining some of those categories requires the wisdom of Solomon, or - in real life - the rigidity of a dictatorship or the controls of a police state. They do not allow anyone to "encourage discord in community relations." And -At times of war, speech in this country has been controlled.
Some of the more crazy shutdowns of speech on a few campuses have also been about the elevation of personal feelings (sometimes based on yet other feelings, not knowledge, of the assumed beliefs of a speaker) over rational discussions.
There is no argument FOR hate speech - but beware of authorizing the government to override the 1st Amendment and make the decisions as to what speech is dangerous.
"Offensive to others" is a ridiculously broad category, and there is no requirement for us to be respectful to others - otherwise every criticism of the government or elected figures could be prosecuted. The marches that took place Saturday could be shut down. Respect others' civil rights, yes; respect our own Constitution and Bill of Rights, yes.
Defining some of those categories requires the wisdom of Solomon, or - in real life - the rigidity of a dictatorship or the controls of a police state. They do not allow anyone to "encourage discord in community relations." And -At times of war, speech in this country has been controlled.
Some of the more crazy shutdowns of speech on a few campuses have also been about the elevation of personal feelings (sometimes based on yet other feelings, not knowledge, of the assumed beliefs of a speaker) over rational discussions.
There is no argument FOR hate speech - but beware of authorizing the government to override the 1st Amendment and make the decisions as to what speech is dangerous.
6
The First Amendment guarantees freedom of political SPEECH. Using the term"expression" extends the guarantee to more than the First Amendment specifies, as it can apply to ACTIONS. Actions are not guaranteed if they are detrimental to the public good. Throwing a brick through the White House window is not sanctioned by the First Amendment, symbolic though the action may be. The same can be said of confrontational demonstrations and counter-demonstrations when their purpose is to intimidate.
\
\
Speech acceptable to the majority requires no protection. The 1st Amendment protects minority speech, yes even offensive speech. Otherwise the Amendment has no point.
Weak Donald got a whiff of American strength today.
58
Weak Donald did not get a whiff of strength, he just has new handlers. Trump stands for nothing. He is a puppet.
1
The question was what is doing the FBI Agency and control this violet crime against humanity ?
2
I know, right!? They were out there hunting down the fuchsia and mauve crime instead!
Sorry, Donald, we don't believe you. Stop lying. You have showed us who you are and nothing will change that.
58
Some day soon, someone will have the courage to repeat these words and act on them.
“My fellow Americans, our long national nightmare is over.”
Following that, Ford alluded to another famous political quote.
“Our Constitution works.” he said. “Our great Republic is a government of laws and not of men. Here the people rule.”
The phrase “a government of laws, and not of men” reflects a political idea that dates back as far as the ancient Greeks.
But it was enshrined in quotation history by John Adams in one of his Novanglus letters, published in the Boston Gazette in 1774.
“My fellow Americans, our long national nightmare is over.”
Following that, Ford alluded to another famous political quote.
“Our Constitution works.” he said. “Our great Republic is a government of laws and not of men. Here the people rule.”
The phrase “a government of laws, and not of men” reflects a political idea that dates back as far as the ancient Greeks.
But it was enshrined in quotation history by John Adams in one of his Novanglus letters, published in the Boston Gazette in 1774.
25
Pence has to go, too, he's 100% complicit and knew everything.
2
"freedom caucus", "tea party", "free speech demonstration"
All code for fascism, racism, and white supremacy. The counter protesters give me hope.
All code for fascism, racism, and white supremacy. The counter protesters give me hope.
83
Yes, this is a problem: innocent lexical material covering for vicious thoughts. Beyond the quotation attributed to Shiva Ayyadurai in the article, I don't know what the ralliers were calling for. From way over here, I've been able to hear and see what the Unite the Right people were speaking about. If you're going to fight for the right of free speech, then you have to be like the ACLU. You have no reason to talk about immigrants, African-Americans, Robert E. Lee, or brandish swastikas. Once you do that, you are presenting a political message, not reiterating a constitutional principle. You could be for the freedom of those who agree with you and oppose it for those who don't. That is why those who advocate banning what they call hate speech are on shaky ground, starting with the question of who decides what hate speech is. That is why our courts have generally supported expansive free speech rights. If you are going to fight for free speech and insist on mentioning groups within our American society, then you must announce that you are just as much for the freedoms afforded Black Lives Matter, Occupy Wall Street, to mention two, as you are for the protections afforded Unite the Right. Unite the Right was not doing that and I suspect that speakers in Boston today were not motivated by the rights of Black Lives Matter along with their own. Can anyone shed more light on the question of whether they were advocating everyone's right to free speech or only their own?
there are only two sides: decent human beings, and nazis / white supremacists. it really is that simple.
373
Wrong. It's never that simple. That's what's wrong with Trump and any so called "Leader". We are diverse, fickle, malleable. Who can honestly say, "I can make the multitude happy!"? That's the problem. Pride. Hubris. If humanity sadly, still requires a leader, that leader must be reluctant to lead, as a necessary prerequisite to acceptance as a leader by the masses. Otherwise all are doomed to repeat the past.
What makes you think the rest are decent???
actually, at this rally, it was a bunch of people protesting a bunch of libertarians who openly said that no supremacists were allowed at the rally. you all where just labeling people as nazis so you had a reason to rally.
Trump can not wash himself clean with a nicer tweet - it is impossible to believe him now because he is an opportunist and he has been told what to say.
He revealed his true feelings and beliefs last week - twice.
He lies every chance he gets. He is lying today.
Our country will come together and heal but there will still be groups of haters = white supremacists, neo-Nazi's, Racists, misogynists, and Trump has shown his allegiance to these groups and wants their support. He is one of them.
We will come together in spite of him and without him and without these vile groups. They will slink back into the underground again--- with trump.
He revealed his true feelings and beliefs last week - twice.
He lies every chance he gets. He is lying today.
Our country will come together and heal but there will still be groups of haters = white supremacists, neo-Nazi's, Racists, misogynists, and Trump has shown his allegiance to these groups and wants their support. He is one of them.
We will come together in spite of him and without him and without these vile groups. They will slink back into the underground again--- with trump.
57
He will always prefer crowds. He has no preference, except for center stage. 1000:1 would be a no brainer for him.
11
I think when the neo-Nazis/white supremacists/alt-right characterize their activities as the promotion of 'free speech,' you need to put 'free speech' in quotation marks. It reminds me of Stanley Kubrick putting 'Peace is Our Profession' in the frame with Gen. Jack Ripper. As Murkin Muffley famously said, "There's nothing to figure out...this man is obviously a psychotic."
There seems to be some kind of mass psychosis going on amongst some of our fellow citizens with them looking to Dr. Trump for the cure. Unfortunately, he is administering the wrong medicine and it’s making the patients worse.
There seems to be some kind of mass psychosis going on amongst some of our fellow citizens with them looking to Dr. Trump for the cure. Unfortunately, he is administering the wrong medicine and it’s making the patients worse.
34
Fantastic comment, resonates completely.
Frustration. Moral panic. That's what it is. Hillary called them deplorable. Perhaps they are, makes no difference. He won because many were tired of the same old game... Right or Left. Black or White. Liberal or Conservative. I don't know about the rest of you but I don't want to be limited to only 2 choices of clothing, automobiles, housing or food. Wake up humans! He won because we've all accepted the leadership/control dupe. To those who are prepared to think for themselves, we salute you. Step into the light!
It is freaky funny/ironic that these Alt-Right and Republicans set up these supposedly "Free Speech" rallies with all of their gerrymandering and vote suppression for decades.
63
Nothing is more certain that that there will be [constricting} order over Mankind, followed by disorder in the service of those who feel repressed by the previous order.
No nation understands this principle better than America.
The idea of continual revolution was invented in America, and remains our foundation.
Embrace change, adapt to change, and advance with change. And don't leave anybody too far behind.
No nation understands this principle better than America.
The idea of continual revolution was invented in America, and remains our foundation.
Embrace change, adapt to change, and advance with change. And don't leave anybody too far behind.
5
It is interesting you can say that, Wolf, without mentioning which side you are on.
7
why would the side matter, kurtis? are you the type who will only agree with people of similar political beliefs?
Whatever it takes to close the deal... right Donald? Keep trying to salvage. Just makes your political, social and business burial plot that much deeper. Enjoy the remainder of your relevance.
17
Let me get this straight so I can understand. Who protests a freedom of speech rally?
15
Those who recognize that it is a sick euphemism for hate and racism. Hope that helps.
22
Let me get this straight. When White Supremacists call themselves "Freedom of Speech" it's not OK for people to show up 100:1 to say they think actions speak louder than words?
46
Hate speech does not advance freedom
35
"The free speech rally, which had been scheduled to run from noon until 2 p.m., concluded by about 12:50 p.m. " -- The Times is certainly smart enough to come up with a better description than "free speech" for rally held by sympathizers of white supremacy and Nazism.
20
So do we have a bipolar president or what? Who is this guy? One of these days he'll have to make an actual important decision that only a president can make. Which Trump will make the call?
19
Not bipolar. Sick.
His tweet with 'heel' instead of 'heal' was no spelling mistake. It was a sick joke.
The man is sick in his soul.
His tweet with 'heel' instead of 'heal' was no spelling mistake. It was a sick joke.
The man is sick in his soul.
The Republican Party owns this trump disaster 100%
A Donald substitute wrote the " nice " version.
Good job TODAY, General Kelly. Hazardous duty pay???
Good job TODAY, General Kelly. Hazardous duty pay???
38
Phyliss! Omg lol
I just read the article and posted same sentiment.
Yes every time a lucid and coherent tweet shows up these days it would have kelly behind.
Yet he still has the codes for the nuclear football in the brief case that travel with a soldier whereever trump is located.
He has this from power given in the 2001 war powers act.
We need some comments to bring awareness to congresses ineptitude about taking that power back.
Same act was implemented in ww2. Korea and viet nam.
I just read the article and posted same sentiment.
Yes every time a lucid and coherent tweet shows up these days it would have kelly behind.
Yet he still has the codes for the nuclear football in the brief case that travel with a soldier whereever trump is located.
He has this from power given in the 2001 war powers act.
We need some comments to bring awareness to congresses ineptitude about taking that power back.
Same act was implemented in ww2. Korea and viet nam.
1
DJT say's " Our country will soon come together as one!”
Really? Come together to undermine the environment, people's health care, to allow wall street and corporate America run roughshod over the common citizen? To make sure Carl Icahn makes another $500 mill in back room deals? To make sure we can't access the courts through forced arbitration agreements? To spew hate to those who are not worthy in his eyes? To rally behind the likes of the gutless, Price, Pruitt, Pence, Ryan, McConnell et el?
No way!
Really? Come together to undermine the environment, people's health care, to allow wall street and corporate America run roughshod over the common citizen? To make sure Carl Icahn makes another $500 mill in back room deals? To make sure we can't access the courts through forced arbitration agreements? To spew hate to those who are not worthy in his eyes? To rally behind the likes of the gutless, Price, Pruitt, Pence, Ryan, McConnell et el?
No way!
78
Trump's having stated that he wanted to "applaud the many protesters in Boston who are speaking out against bigotry and hate" is meaningless &does not make up for his having stated that "there was blame on both sides"
in Charlottesville.
I suppose it would be too much to ask of Trump to realize that the protesters
are speaking out against bigotry and hate in response to his own failure to do so.
Statements such as " Our country will soon come together as one" & "We will heal & be stronger than ever before " are meaningless.
Our country isn't going to come together ,or heal when we have a President who believes that both sides are responsible when White Supremacists carried torches ,and yelled out "Replace the Jews". ,etc , Ku-Klux-Klan style.
in Charlottesville.
I suppose it would be too much to ask of Trump to realize that the protesters
are speaking out against bigotry and hate in response to his own failure to do so.
Statements such as " Our country will soon come together as one" & "We will heal & be stronger than ever before " are meaningless.
Our country isn't going to come together ,or heal when we have a President who believes that both sides are responsible when White Supremacists carried torches ,and yelled out "Replace the Jews". ,etc , Ku-Klux-Klan style.
59
Kelly wrote the more normal sounding tweets
Its one of his bbysitting jobs.
Doesnt change anything.
Like the kid crying wolf ... we will never fall for his " good behavior"
Fake all the way and a criminal still in office.
Its one of his bbysitting jobs.
Doesnt change anything.
Like the kid crying wolf ... we will never fall for his " good behavior"
Fake all the way and a criminal still in office.
Mr Trump,
As an approximate age mate who was in the enormous crowd of counter-demonstrators this afternoon, I say ,"Keep you rapplause and congratulations. Your remarks and your deportment on Tuesday evening and your first comments on today's rally amply demonstrate that you lack the desire, the intellectual capacity , or the moral authority to unite the nation. We are moving on without you.
As an approximate age mate who was in the enormous crowd of counter-demonstrators this afternoon, I say ,"Keep you rapplause and congratulations. Your remarks and your deportment on Tuesday evening and your first comments on today's rally amply demonstrate that you lack the desire, the intellectual capacity , or the moral authority to unite the nation. We are moving on without you.
87
"how dare he condemn violence on tuesday, then celebrate unity against violence on saturday!?!"
Racist boots have been crushing their victim's faces to the ground for decades. Never forget that out of "fairness" last Tuesday Trump thought it equally important to consider whether those same faces did any damage to those "fine people's" boots when assigning blame.
20
This twitter whiplash he demonstrates is unhealthy. Complaining in one breath then applauding in the next? He's unstable.
Trump fans/voters, this is your fault.
The difference between the Pepe losers and the counter protesters today was reminiscent of the paltry Trump inauguration crowds vs. Obama's. Absolutely hilarious. I love seeing them/him humiliated.
Trump fans/voters, this is your fault.
The difference between the Pepe losers and the counter protesters today was reminiscent of the paltry Trump inauguration crowds vs. Obama's. Absolutely hilarious. I love seeing them/him humiliated.
34
Rondre Brooks, 36, who said he had traveled from Detroit for the counterdemonstration, said he was pleased to see the early end of the free speech rally amid the large number of counterprotesters. “It’s a very good look for America as a whole,” he said.
I think this about sums up the current situation. When thousands of counter protesters feel it is appropriate to protest a free speech rally without even being able to point to a single element of white supremacy being discussed, this indicates that the left wing does NOT want to support freedom of speech, freedom of thought, or anything and anyone who disagrees with their agenda.
I think this about sums up the current situation. When thousands of counter protesters feel it is appropriate to protest a free speech rally without even being able to point to a single element of white supremacy being discussed, this indicates that the left wing does NOT want to support freedom of speech, freedom of thought, or anything and anyone who disagrees with their agenda.
7
As my mother always said, you don't have to stick your head in the toilet to know what's there. We know what hate looks and sounds like. My father and many of my friends fathers fought a war to get rid of these evil people. Never again. Oh, and you have the freedom of speech... but no one has to listen. And we won't. You have nothing we want to hear.
147
"free speech" is code for Nazism and white supremacy. You are fooling no one.
50
Joel get an education and read all those pre and post war dystopian novels.
The folks there to demo free speech were racists and bigots usurping a high ideal and a good law that isnt understood these days.
The folks there to demo free speech were racists and bigots usurping a high ideal and a good law that isnt understood these days.
6
Thank you to all who marched in Boston today to underscore the bottom line...America does not hold with sectors or individuals who support white supremacy.
Thank you to the Boston Police Department for doing an excellent job of keeping everyone safe.
This Tuesday, that guy who parked himself in our White House is planning to descend on Phoenix AZ to stage one of his rallies after he was politely asked by Mayor Greg Stanton to postpone until a better atmosphere for such an event prevailed.
Word came that the rally will proceed.
"I am disappointed that President Trump has chosen to hold a campaign rally as our nation is still healing from the tragic events in Charlottesville," Stanton said in a statement Wednesday. "If President Trump is coming to Phoenix to announce a pardon for former Sheriff Joe Arpaio, then it will be clear that his true intent is to enflame tensions and further divide our nation."
Stanton bluntly said, "It is my hope that more sound judgment prevails and that he delays his visit."
You can guess how that was received, given that sound judgment hasn't been at play for the past 8 months. He's on a mission to humiliate Sen. Flake and anyone else who comes into his mind, such as it is.
Thank you to the Boston Police Department for doing an excellent job of keeping everyone safe.
This Tuesday, that guy who parked himself in our White House is planning to descend on Phoenix AZ to stage one of his rallies after he was politely asked by Mayor Greg Stanton to postpone until a better atmosphere for such an event prevailed.
Word came that the rally will proceed.
"I am disappointed that President Trump has chosen to hold a campaign rally as our nation is still healing from the tragic events in Charlottesville," Stanton said in a statement Wednesday. "If President Trump is coming to Phoenix to announce a pardon for former Sheriff Joe Arpaio, then it will be clear that his true intent is to enflame tensions and further divide our nation."
Stanton bluntly said, "It is my hope that more sound judgment prevails and that he delays his visit."
You can guess how that was received, given that sound judgment hasn't been at play for the past 8 months. He's on a mission to humiliate Sen. Flake and anyone else who comes into his mind, such as it is.
72
Kelly and the generals should work with congress quickly to prevent his visits and rallys from this point further.
We can stop a rogue , seditious , treasoness leader of the " free world " from demoralizing " we the people " any longer. "
If it takes a military coup or our CIA to curtail this mental giant than we want our govwrnment to stop these rallys.
We can stop a rogue , seditious , treasoness leader of the " free world " from demoralizing " we the people " any longer. "
If it takes a military coup or our CIA to curtail this mental giant than we want our govwrnment to stop these rallys.
The folks in Boston can claim they walked and talked for freedom of speech but in the end, they would shut down the "alt-right" in a heartbeat. Not really what we think of as free speech is it? Liberals cannot stand a conservative point of view. Kumbaya all everyone!
9
Hate speech is not free speech. The counter-protesters shut down the "free" speech of hate. Hey, the neo-Nazis were free to show up. But there are more people of good will than people of evil, and this should give all of us hope. -- thegamesmenplay.com
10
So, you would support Hitler if he came to speak? There are some things that shouldn't happen .... There is no room for Nazis ever. They are not about free speech .... they are about deceit and death. And, some fools are taken in by them .... like their saying it is all about their right to "Free Speech"
14
The people of Boston didn't shut down the alt-right. No one's freedom of speech was violated. Don't project fascist fantasies onto other people.
The "alt-right" isn't conservative, it's right-wing extremist.
The "alt-right" isn't conservative, it's right-wing extremist.
36
Several dozens on the side of white supremacy and 40,000 thousand on the side of tolerance and inclusion. I guess America has spoken clearly. Trump crossed an inviolable boundary.
He showed again he is unfit and unprepared for the task of running the Oval Office. A simple resignation will suffice and he can return to being his disgusting self again. Sometimes, getting fired is the best option.
He showed again he is unfit and unprepared for the task of running the Oval Office. A simple resignation will suffice and he can return to being his disgusting self again. Sometimes, getting fired is the best option.
59
Condescend much Trump? We will stop the protests when you are gone form the White House.
35
I think there were more counterprotesters in Boston than were people at Trump's inauguration. ; )
99
Word.
9
Keep the protests going all the way to the White House
53
After all the infuriating things that Trump has done over the years, I'm a little surprised to feel this infuriated about the so-called president's newfound, politically-motivated morality.
Trump says this not because he believes it, or because he should, but because he is trying to set himself up as the Great Unifier, as if all the hate, ignorance, lies, tone deafness and immorality that spews from his mouth and fingers was calculated to this end.
Worst. President. Ever!
Trump says this not because he believes it, or because he should, but because he is trying to set himself up as the Great Unifier, as if all the hate, ignorance, lies, tone deafness and immorality that spews from his mouth and fingers was calculated to this end.
Worst. President. Ever!
79
"Matt Staley, interjected to ask if those demonstrating in support of free speech were not Americans, too. “I think it’s awful that people can’t speak out to express opinions,” Mr. Staley said."
What is he talking about? They can speak out. They had the government (which most of them seem to hate) protecting their ability to do so. They should just expect a spoken response. That's how the marketplace of ideas is supposed to work. Is he saying that the counter-protestors should have had their voices shut down? I think that a large contingent of the right wing doesn't understand how constitutionally protected free speech works.
I'm proud of my hometown. We've come a long way since 1974.
What is he talking about? They can speak out. They had the government (which most of them seem to hate) protecting their ability to do so. They should just expect a spoken response. That's how the marketplace of ideas is supposed to work. Is he saying that the counter-protestors should have had their voices shut down? I think that a large contingent of the right wing doesn't understand how constitutionally protected free speech works.
I'm proud of my hometown. We've come a long way since 1974.
399
Yes, what was he talking about? As fellow Americans we should support everyone's constitutional right to express themselves. We should speak out loudly if the GOVERNMENT tries to infringe upon anyone's rights of free speech and assembly without a just (mainly a safety minded one) cause. Yet, as for us, the people who find their speech hateful, we have that right, too... and unlike the government, we are not constrained by the constitution on this matter. We can try our best to drown out their voices and their is nothing they can do about it.
2
They were given a platform and the finest police protection in the land. They think freedom of speech means no one may object and that they must be given TV time and newspaper coverage. Moreover, I doubt they gave stirring speeches about the First Amendment. They could equally as meaninglessly had a Right to Trial by Jury rally, as if they'd been cheated out of that. The rally was meant to present opposition to the lie they concocted about their lack of freedom of speech.
3
Maybe Matt Staley and is supposed "free speech" supporters ought to get a lesson from their libertarian philosopher Ayn Rand. She was very clear in her view that the right to free speech does not have a corollary right to be listened to. If your message is unpopular, then being drowned out by the opposition is your fate. You don't get a right to force others to listen or agree.
"Freedom of speech means freedom from interference, suppression or punitive action by the government—and nothing else. It does not mean the right to demand the financial support or the material means to express your views at the expense of other men who may not wish to support you. Freedom of speech includes the freedom not to agree, not to listen and not to support one’s own antagonists. A “right” does not include the material implementation of that right by other men; it includes only the freedom to earn that implementation by one’s own effort. Private citizens cannot use physical force or coercion; they cannot censor or suppress anyone’s views or publications. Only the government can do so. And censorship is a concept that pertains only to governmental action." -- Ann Rand
"Freedom of speech means freedom from interference, suppression or punitive action by the government—and nothing else. It does not mean the right to demand the financial support or the material means to express your views at the expense of other men who may not wish to support you. Freedom of speech includes the freedom not to agree, not to listen and not to support one’s own antagonists. A “right” does not include the material implementation of that right by other men; it includes only the freedom to earn that implementation by one’s own effort. Private citizens cannot use physical force or coercion; they cannot censor or suppress anyone’s views or publications. Only the government can do so. And censorship is a concept that pertains only to governmental action." -- Ann Rand
What were the counter protesters protesting?
Free speech seems to have been the only item on the agenda.
It is sad when the establishment condones this kind of hyper-defensive (to the point of being offensive) behavior.
Free speech seems to have been the only item on the agenda.
It is sad when the establishment condones this kind of hyper-defensive (to the point of being offensive) behavior.
6
They were protesting Nazism and white supremacists, NOT free speech.
95
The original list of speakers included at least one very controversial, extreme right-winger.
20
There are more attendees at this protest than the number of guests at Trump's inauguration!
36
yes, ignorant children who treat this as a drunken party where they can spew their own hate at a political system they seem to know little about! I bet if you were to ask these people some basic political questions, the majority would get it wrong!
Free speech works both ways. America has worked it's way to become the greatest country the world has ever known! And that is because we don't stop others from having their own ideas, their own speech....no matter how wrong the majority (or minority) thinks those ideas are, or how infuriated it makes them!
I personally thank god I am in a country where everyone can have their own opinion about anything and not get put in prison for it! Seems to me the left wants to celebrate free speech just as long as those they disagree with don't have it also!
Free speech works both ways. America has worked it's way to become the greatest country the world has ever known! And that is because we don't stop others from having their own ideas, their own speech....no matter how wrong the majority (or minority) thinks those ideas are, or how infuriated it makes them!
I personally thank god I am in a country where everyone can have their own opinion about anything and not get put in prison for it! Seems to me the left wants to celebrate free speech just as long as those they disagree with don't have it also!
5
Well, you had it right there for a minute. Yes, we live in a great country where everyone can have their own opinion and not get put in prison for it. Which is exactly what the First Amendment (the "free speech" one) gives you - the right to speak your mind without being put in jail for it. No one was put in jail today for speaking their mind. The rally people were free to speak their mind and the marchers were free to speak theirs. There is no guarantee that when you speak your mind, everyone will just quietly stand by and let you say what you want.
18
Seeing that Massachusetts has the highest educational level of its adult population and also the best schools in the country I am sure that any random protester would kick your backside in answering political questions. The protesters that were interviewed by the media were amazingly articulate and were like day and night in comparison to the Trump supporters who are interviewed.
5
Some commenters need to learn, the only way we all have freedom of speech and freedom of assembly, is if we protect the freedom of speech and freedom of assembly of people we find objectionable. Trying to expunge history is a Fool's errand. Defacing and destroying monuments, reminds me of the Sunni and the Shia destroying one another's monuments. It is a very slippery slope to slide down. Destroying history, is a very unproductive thing to do for the United States as a whole. The constant carping about Trump is becoming old. If the DNC hadn't robbed Bernie Sanders and he had a backbone. Bernie might be president.
16
The Nazis and white supremacists have First Amendment freedom of speech, not to be squelched by the GOVERNMENT. Their fellow citizens are under no such limitation, and are just as entitled to shout down the alt-right misanthropes. It's "freedom of speech," not "freedom from consequences."
20
"destroying history?"
What a load of codswallop.
The attempt to change history was done by the memorialists who tried to lord these traitorous figures over innumerable public squares as if they had won.
They're racist in nature and now everyone's finally figuring it out. Time to wake up.
What a load of codswallop.
The attempt to change history was done by the memorialists who tried to lord these traitorous figures over innumerable public squares as if they had won.
They're racist in nature and now everyone's finally figuring it out. Time to wake up.
43
Would you be in favor of Germany having statues of Hitler?
19
I love my city.
33
@Scott, 'This land is my land, this land is your land..'
Nope. You come to Boston, you can speak, I can speak. I can travel this land as well and speak freely. Am I right?
Nope. You come to Boston, you can speak, I can speak. I can travel this land as well and speak freely. Am I right?
As you should also.
2
Maybe, just maybe, the horror of last Saturday will propel the best of America to stand strong and proud and overwhelmingly diminish the evil of white supremacy
310
Diminish all racial supremacists and collectivist political ideology's that lead to nothing but blood shed and terror.
2
Can we extend the protest next time- Washington D.C. and refuse to leave.
19
We should have a week of national protest to remove this administration
Work stoppage and everyone participate.
Then we will be killed or listened to by congress.
And an emerg. Election and elimination legally of the electoral college will occur.
My dream these days.
Work stoppage and everyone participate.
Then we will be killed or listened to by congress.
And an emerg. Election and elimination legally of the electoral college will occur.
My dream these days.
These spectacles are exactly what Putin wanted when he supported Trump. Donald is worse than useless in bringing the country together, and that's no coincidence. Unfortunately, Putin wants much more harm done to our country and will meddle whenever and wherever he thinks he can get away with it.
What's good is how little traction the right wing hate groups seem to have. Although media exposure amplifies their message and apparent importance, their numbers are small and public figures across the political spectrum, except Trump of course, roundly condemn them.
These 'free speech' publicity stunts (read freedom to spout hatred and bigotry of all types) are likely to continue, but it's best if peacefulness is strenuously enforced and public condemnations continue. It's also important to remember they hate being mocked and they hate seeing the vast majority of people reject their messages.
Concrete positive efforts should be directed against hate and towards inclusion. And, most of all, there needs to be widespread rebukes of President Trump followed by whatever efforts will quickly remove him from office. The cancer injected into our body politic by Putin needs to be extirpated, and the Russians need to be taught never to interfere in our democracy again.
What's good is how little traction the right wing hate groups seem to have. Although media exposure amplifies their message and apparent importance, their numbers are small and public figures across the political spectrum, except Trump of course, roundly condemn them.
These 'free speech' publicity stunts (read freedom to spout hatred and bigotry of all types) are likely to continue, but it's best if peacefulness is strenuously enforced and public condemnations continue. It's also important to remember they hate being mocked and they hate seeing the vast majority of people reject their messages.
Concrete positive efforts should be directed against hate and towards inclusion. And, most of all, there needs to be widespread rebukes of President Trump followed by whatever efforts will quickly remove him from office. The cancer injected into our body politic by Putin needs to be extirpated, and the Russians need to be taught never to interfere in our democracy again.
25
Two things:
1) The "protest" was not a "Free Speech Rally". It was originally intended as a hate speech event; several well known white supremacists (three of which where among the speakers listed for the Charlottesville Neo-Nazi rally) were part of the original list of speakers. At least three of the white supremacists cancelled in the wake of Charlottesville, leaving a less noxious roster of speakers. But it was always a White Power rally.
2) This was, first and foremost, and ANTI-TRUMP rally. It is Trump's demonstrated racism that was the motivating force for probably 39,500 of the 40,000 protesters in Boston.
1) The "protest" was not a "Free Speech Rally". It was originally intended as a hate speech event; several well known white supremacists (three of which where among the speakers listed for the Charlottesville Neo-Nazi rally) were part of the original list of speakers. At least three of the white supremacists cancelled in the wake of Charlottesville, leaving a less noxious roster of speakers. But it was always a White Power rally.
2) This was, first and foremost, and ANTI-TRUMP rally. It is Trump's demonstrated racism that was the motivating force for probably 39,500 of the 40,000 protesters in Boston.
167
"Hate Speech" is just free speech you dislike. It's not a hard concept to grasp.
Freedom of Speech protects the speech you don't like. If it only protected what you found agreeable then it wouldn't need protecting.
Logic. Get some.
Freedom of Speech protects the speech you don't like. If it only protected what you found agreeable then it wouldn't need protecting.
Logic. Get some.
8
@Scott
No, "hate speech" is exactly that--it is speech the content of which is based on racism, bigotry, etc. It is protected by the First Amendment but that doesn't change the vile substance of it.
Mr. Lukasiak's comment never stated that it wasn't protected. He simply, and correctly, pointed out that calling this a "free-speech" rally is a misrepresentation.
Your response is a non-sequitur and shows that you have more need to get logic than he does.
No, "hate speech" is exactly that--it is speech the content of which is based on racism, bigotry, etc. It is protected by the First Amendment but that doesn't change the vile substance of it.
Mr. Lukasiak's comment never stated that it wasn't protected. He simply, and correctly, pointed out that calling this a "free-speech" rally is a misrepresentation.
Your response is a non-sequitur and shows that you have more need to get logic than he does.
6
No, Scott - Hate speech is a line of torchbearers screaming "Jews will not replace us" marching through the streets.
2
Trump's inauthenticity and incompetence is revealed once again when he Tweets:
"Our country will soon come together as one!"
Populist Sessions said this same thing "We're gonna look into this and get right on it"
It's delusional to pursue 'come together as one' that's the message OF the fascist right.
What WE celebrate in the United States IS diversity - that we're all different, that we seek and find dignity in every human being.
Trump is selling a delusional ideology here.
It's REAL scary this man ever stepped foot into the White House, the damage done is potentially irreparable in any global context.
Some may think Europe is laughing at the United States, Germany knows very well this isn't anything to laugh at.
"Our country will soon come together as one!"
Populist Sessions said this same thing "We're gonna look into this and get right on it"
It's delusional to pursue 'come together as one' that's the message OF the fascist right.
What WE celebrate in the United States IS diversity - that we're all different, that we seek and find dignity in every human being.
Trump is selling a delusional ideology here.
It's REAL scary this man ever stepped foot into the White House, the damage done is potentially irreparable in any global context.
Some may think Europe is laughing at the United States, Germany knows very well this isn't anything to laugh at.
40
300 protestors vs 40,000 counterprotestors. Wow! I haven't seen such drastic difference in crowd size since they compared Presidents Trump's and Obama's inaugurations.
289
Sad!
7
I don't even think it was 300 people at that rally. From the TV coverage, it looked more like 30 or 40 on that bandstand. They weren't even crowded together.
1
No, 30 protestors, or fewer, according to the Boston Police Department.
1
Ah, I could have told the alt-righters that Boston wasn't their kind of town. A city that went through the Boston massacre and continued to rebel anyway has never been easily intimidated. After the Boston Marathon bombing, people ran back into the crowd to tend to the wounded, not away from it. They don't strut like the Texans, but they don't need to. They are made of stronger stuff.
Well done, Boston!
Well done, Boston!
219
As a former Texas state senator, I
Salute Boston, and its 240 years of standing strong. Well done!
Salute Boston, and its 240 years of standing strong. Well done!
35
Why did you feel compelled to put down Texans or to state that Bostonians
are "made of stronger stuff"? ! In doing so, you are espousing & endorsing the mentality that one group is superior to another, just as the white supremacists have.
are "made of stronger stuff"? ! In doing so, you are espousing & endorsing the mentality that one group is superior to another, just as the white supremacists have.
4
I am from Boston and love this city but I do not know why you brought Texas into your comment. I also love Texas and think the people are great. Maybe it is because I had relatives there and always had a wonderful time when I visited.
1
I am truly grateful to the counter protesters. I am grateful to the Boston police.
But only a dozens showing up to a hate rally in Boston is a bit suspicious.
Where were the others? What are they doing? Are they, I shudder to think, planning their next outrage, while sulking and feeding off the nourishment from Fox, the president, the republican party elected officials, and their hate churches? I do not under-estimate the money they have raised after Charlottesville.
If a small town in Arkansas can get 50 people demanding the presence of Jim Crow era statutes designed to intimidate people, then there are a lot of them hiding in the deep crevasses of America. And that includes Boston.
Today was muddled because everyone will declare victory. And my guard is still up. I am not inferring that Charlottesville was an anomaly or an outlier.
But only a dozens showing up to a hate rally in Boston is a bit suspicious.
Where were the others? What are they doing? Are they, I shudder to think, planning their next outrage, while sulking and feeding off the nourishment from Fox, the president, the republican party elected officials, and their hate churches? I do not under-estimate the money they have raised after Charlottesville.
If a small town in Arkansas can get 50 people demanding the presence of Jim Crow era statutes designed to intimidate people, then there are a lot of them hiding in the deep crevasses of America. And that includes Boston.
Today was muddled because everyone will declare victory. And my guard is still up. I am not inferring that Charlottesville was an anomaly or an outlier.
15
It may be that the president is doing a better job of bringing people together than he gets credit for.
17
True. In the past week we've had Bernie Sanders, Orrin Hatch, Kevin Durant, the US Conference of Mayors, Campbell's Soup, and the Marines, speaking out on the same side of an issue... to name a few.
1
mr trump, you can't sit with us.
14
Stormtroopers always have a calming effect on protestors?
2
Violence appears to be perpetrated by the "right" - African American churches bombed, Swastikas spray-painted on synagogues, gravestones knocked over in Jewish cemeteries, and rocks thrown through synagogue windows. Why is it that these people support the Republican Party? What is it about the Republican Party that draws all of the haters? They ought to do some serious thinking about this and their refusal to do so makes them more and more like Trump every day. A few Republicans speak up here and there but they have yet to take any real steps to curb this monster and his monstrous supporters. What if they were to do so and in so doing, lost their seats in Congress? At least they would be taking a moral stand and I, for one, would admire them for it.
50
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/19/republican-party-w...
A link on how the Republican Party does the bidding of white supremacists
A link on how the Republican Party does the bidding of white supremacists
6
I thought it was unconstitutional to use the military domestically. So the militarization of local enforcement is very troubling.
1
it's been going on for a long time and could present serious problems in the future. All that extra military equipment manufactured by the military/industrial complex has to be used somehow.
1
Thank George W. Bush.
3
I would fully support demilitarizing the police once we demilitarize the civilians. No private citizen needs an AK-anything.
1
One. or time, Boston police show how it's supposed to be done. Boston Strong.
12
Boston Strong!
17
Trump never had it so hasn't lost it.
3
We don't need the Texas Elite III to provide security. We don't need amateurs taking it upon themselves to play cops. Dallas has a real police force to do that. It is just an excuse to be ready for a fight.
23
"Duke University announced early Saturday that it had removed a recently vandalized statue of Gen. Robert E. Lee from the entrance to its campus chapel in Durham, N.C."
The removal or the Confederacy General's statue has created a space disturbing the balance in the chapel's design. I can think of no better replacement statue than that of Julian Abele, the brilliant architect who designed the chapel. He also designed most of Duke University's campus. Abele was the first African American to graduate from the University of Pennsylvania with a degree in architecture.
Duke university's architect was not widely known, until there was a protest by Duke students in front of the university's winsome stone chapel, infuriated by the school's investments in South Africa. Julian Abele's great-grandniece was a sophomore at the college in Durham, North Carolina. Knowing that her relative had designed the institution's neo-Gothic chapel, Susan Cook wrote into the student newspaper contending that Abele would have supported the divestment rally in front of his beautiful chapel.
It is high time for Abele to be memorialized in the chapel he designed.
In 1942, when the long-practicing architect finally gained entry to the American Institute of Architects, the director of Philadelphia's Museum of Art, a building which Abele also designed, called him "one of the most sensitive designers anywhere in America", not just the first African American architect to graduate from Penn.
The removal or the Confederacy General's statue has created a space disturbing the balance in the chapel's design. I can think of no better replacement statue than that of Julian Abele, the brilliant architect who designed the chapel. He also designed most of Duke University's campus. Abele was the first African American to graduate from the University of Pennsylvania with a degree in architecture.
Duke university's architect was not widely known, until there was a protest by Duke students in front of the university's winsome stone chapel, infuriated by the school's investments in South Africa. Julian Abele's great-grandniece was a sophomore at the college in Durham, North Carolina. Knowing that her relative had designed the institution's neo-Gothic chapel, Susan Cook wrote into the student newspaper contending that Abele would have supported the divestment rally in front of his beautiful chapel.
It is high time for Abele to be memorialized in the chapel he designed.
In 1942, when the long-practicing architect finally gained entry to the American Institute of Architects, the director of Philadelphia's Museum of Art, a building which Abele also designed, called him "one of the most sensitive designers anywhere in America", not just the first African American architect to graduate from Penn.
178
Charles Darwin would be a better choice.
6
Ok... then just to keep it all about equality and non racism every architect that ever designed a bridge, building, bicycle path, etc etc needs a statue of him/ her placed at the project
6
Maybe we should be careful about putting statues and monuments up in the first place as all people are sinners and have flaws. Should we now look into the charges that Marin Luther King was a womanizer and change all of the roads named after him. Why is their a Pena blvd in Denver named after the transportation secretary. I could go on and on.
3
Don Trump's comment that the protestors were "anti-cop" indicates just how inclined to police power and how he opposes civil liberties. Look at the history of police in society; for many decades the police were widely admired and supported by the public, even glorified repeatedly in a series of police TV shows and movies that had everyone in the public calling the police to complain about each other, even for ridiculous and frivolous reasons. Then the police, emboldened by many avenues of support became something of an empire that has recently been preying on the public and immediately using excessive force and unconstitutional repressive policing. It really isn't that the public is "anti-cop" as Trump says as much as the police empire has been a symbolic occupying force contrary to our principles of freedom, civil liberties, and constitutional conduct. They are preying on a society that now recognizes that. So Trump is wrong. The cops need to be pro freedom and civil rights and restrain their unconstitutional actions and empire building. The cops ask legislatures for new laws against conduct they don't like, and laws are passed robbing us further of our freedom.
I don't hate cops. I loved them for decades. They abused me, Now I criticize them in an effort to change their conduct.
Trump is wrong, Freedom is right.
I don't hate cops. I loved them for decades. They abused me, Now I criticize them in an effort to change their conduct.
Trump is wrong, Freedom is right.
23
Freedom is 40K shouting down 300, right?
3
Back Up, I think it was more like 40K shouting down 50, but yes everyone there was free and those who didn't attend were free to attend or not.
Some have said the "Free Speech" attendees numbers were small because the prohibition on weapons. I don't by that. I think it was the realization of the "internet Nazi trolls" that being a Nazi troll in the real world carries real world consequences that they don't want to face. They are now (or should be) reconsidering their "support" for hate groups and realizing that supporting them is very different from supporting the local sports team.
Some have said the "Free Speech" attendees numbers were small because the prohibition on weapons. I don't by that. I think it was the realization of the "internet Nazi trolls" that being a Nazi troll in the real world carries real world consequences that they don't want to face. They are now (or should be) reconsidering their "support" for hate groups and realizing that supporting them is very different from supporting the local sports team.
1
Sorry Back Up, the small crowds of facists just get a 1st Amendment right to spew their venom. They don't get any additional right to squelch the 1st Amendment rights of the majority of Americans who would speak out and oppose them.
6
Lets not kid ourselves here, Trumps "healing" words is all about money. Within days of his outrageous comments sympathizing with Nazi's, KKK, and white supremacists, 9 out of 16 major gala's at Mar-a-Lago have been canceled. Money is the only thing that motivates him ( more important than his base!) and so he is now frantically back-pedaling. You're not fooling anyone Donny.
233
I nominate this for a Times Pick.
7
Kudos to Hilary Swift on her remarkable photographs. The one in the crosswalk, with an almost-theatrical backdrop of single-point perspective buildings receding into the distance behind the dramatis personae in the foreground, is especially noteworthy. Full marks.
16
"Demonstrations were boisterous but broadly peaceful . . "
Just watched ABC News. What they showed was far from peaceful. 27 counterprotesters were arrested, at last count. For being too peaceful, I guess.
Just watched ABC News. What they showed was far from peaceful. 27 counterprotesters were arrested, at last count. For being too peaceful, I guess.
8
I think when an event has over 40,000 people, that is extremely peaceful. There is more violence at a Frat party. Sorry, dear. We know how to behave in MA
96
I was there. This disturbance at the end of the march was tiny. 99.99 % of the march and the protest was completely peaceful. Every movement, on the left or the right, attracts a fringe element that cannot be completely controlled. Those people's actions do not speak for the vast majority of the counter-protesters.
77
You must remember the "counterprotesters", what exactly does that mean, are on the side of truth and virtue. Violence in pursuit of these goals is not only justified it is glorified.
As a conservative I am neither a racist or a fascist but to hear the commentary on ABC, CNN et.al., I fit their narrative.
Good luck with "healing".
As a conservative I am neither a racist or a fascist but to hear the commentary on ABC, CNN et.al., I fit their narrative.
Good luck with "healing".
2
Trump showed his true colors on Tuesday. His tweets are hollow. Great job people of Boston and those who traveled there to show the country and world that white supremacy will not be tolerated.
362
Mr. Trump's tweets were honest - there was blame on both sides. You may find the 'supremacist' groups to be repugnant but they still have the right to gather and protest, and they had a permit to do so. The Leftists showed up without a permit to cause nothing but trouble, and the police for some odd reason were told not to try and keep peace. Who was behind that?
Perhaps the solution is to name all the white groups 'White Lives Matter'. At least they are not yelling for 'dead cops now, pigs in a blanket'.
Perhaps the solution is to name all the white groups 'White Lives Matter'. At least they are not yelling for 'dead cops now, pigs in a blanket'.
White Supremacists? You do know the groups had a mix of ethnicities and signs saying "Black Lives DO Matter", right? BUT they had a conservative message, so they were shut down by the Left's political machine.
The tweets only matter when they fit in with your agenda, you mean.
So now guess free speech is only available if your group that is protesting is larger or as large as a counter protesting group. This is completely un-American an unconstitutional. Speech should be allowed and protected as long as those speaking don't use violence, or use fighting words and as long as they comply with time and place restrictions. Free speech isn't about just allowing ideas that you agree with to be expressed publicly. In the Village of Skokie case, the ACLU defended the rights of Nazis to march in Skokie. This isn't because the ACLU agreed with the viewpoints of the protesters. This was because they believed that free speech should be protected no matter who is protesting. The idea of "hate speech" is nowhere found in the Constitution and is only used to stifle speech one side doesn't like. All you need to do is call someone "racist" or "fascist" or in the old days a "commie" and this can then be used to abridge free speech rights. This is completely antithetical to the Constitution and our government. We do not make policy in the streets. The counter-protesters also have rights. However, the question is why these counter-protesters need to march at the same time and same day as those they disagree with. The police need to protect free speech and allowing these large crowds to assemble on the same day is not smart. All it does is shut down speech, which is exactly what happened today.
12
You get the right to free speech and the people who were rallying could have spoken longer if they wanted to. You don't get the right to necessarily have anyone listen to you. (Presumably they could have had loudspeakers if they wanted to be heard.) I agree with your argument about letting even fascists speak -- but don't see how your first sentence describes what happened in Boston. No one took away the rights of that little band of white supremacists, Trump supporters or whatever they were -- they just couldn't draw enough people who wanted to listen to their garbage.
42
The rights of the Free Speech folks were very much protected, even though their numbers were small. They were given a huge open area in which to meet, to allow for their marchers and to keep their opponents away. They police gave them a secure escort when they left and in two cases that I saw, counter protesters actually helped individuals to get into the Free Speech rally when they wanted to because, as one guy said after helping, "The guy may be an idiot but he's an American like me and has the right to Free Speech." Even in the midst of counter protesting they still upheld the rights of other Americans they disagreed with. So proud of Boston.
492
You're wrong. Us counter-protestors simply countered their speech with our speech. It's not our fault that only 24 people or so were willing to publicly stand up for racism and lacked a PA system and that 30,000 or so people were speaking loudly against racism. The protest was by and large peaceful. In fact, there were a few white nationalists who made their way through the crowd and tried assaulting people, they were promptly arrested and escorted out of the rally. What happened today was a triumph for free speech in the U.S.
55
My beloved hometown of Bosfon did not embarrass the nation by becoming violent during the free speech rally and counter protest. They all behaved themselves and showed that quiet protests on both sides are possible. Thank you Boston police for keeping the peace. You make be proud to be a Bostonian.
33
No, 30 leftist counterprotestors were arrested for trying to violate the free speech rights of the free speech people. What fantasy world do you live in?
5
Around 30 - it was actually less than that - out of a crowd of about 30,000!
7
The people at the rally were given an area in which to hold the rally and they were given police protection to enforce their right to be there. The police arrested people who tried to break through the lines. Sounds like their free speech rights were protected to me.
6
There are many reasons why I love Boston, my adopted home town. This is one of them. Even though my icon shows Miss Liberty crying, I now believe that liberty will live, and proudly so. We can surmount hatred and bigotry. We will surmount hatred and bigotry. I believe this movement is the foundation for a resurgent movement toward understanding.
355
There will never be better understanding. That would utterly destroy the Jesse Jacksons and Al Sharptons of the world because they would be out of a job. Same with lawyers for the Civil Rights and EEOC departments. These protesters are mostly paid to be there and start trouble, just as they did in the south in the '60's. This time around they are trying to nullify a presidential election and our history is being destroyed because someone (his name starts with an O) wants to destroy the US and so far he's doing a great job. Once they take down all the historical monuments, they will go after the constitution. Hang on for the ride.
40,000 people shouting down a couple of dozen people advocating Free Speech is something to be proud of? Really? I watched all the available videos on Youtube from all the major news networks and others and saw no signs of KKK, Nazis, or White Supremacists/Nationalists. All I saw was several Trump supporters being attacked and spat upon. That is nothing to be proud of.
Bostonians would do well to remember the busing fiasco of 40 years ago, and the racial, ethnic, and religious segregration that exists to this day.
Donald Trump is very easy to understand. His first thoughts (i.e. tweets) are what he really feels. So, when he wrote about 'anti-police agitators', that was what he actually meant.
His SECOND, dictated tweet originally appeared as follows:
“Our great country has been divided for decades. Sometimes you need protest in order to heel, & we will heel, & be stronger than ever before!”
Later, someone with an IQ above freezing corrected 'heel' to 'heal'.
NOT my president
His SECOND, dictated tweet originally appeared as follows:
“Our great country has been divided for decades. Sometimes you need protest in order to heel, & we will heel, & be stronger than ever before!”
Later, someone with an IQ above freezing corrected 'heel' to 'heal'.
NOT my president
224
Nor mine. Good post.
I think Steve Miller wrote the first tweet and that the "heel" was no accident.
Sad.
Sad.
1
You live here so he is. Sorry. Unless you go somewhere else he is your president.
“All of us here, in many ways, are true patriots because, in spite of that noise out there, we’re here to stand up for something very fundamental, which is called free speech,” Shiva Ayyadurai, an entrepreneur who is running a long-shot Republican campaign for Senate, told the rallygoers, according to a video posted on YouTube.
That "noise out there" IS the sound of free speech. Duh!
That "noise out there" IS the sound of free speech. Duh!
28
Free speech that leads to the persecution and execution of anyone is another name for bigotry and hate. White supremacists and Nazis do not have the right to do anything other than walk the plank into oblivion.
So greatful to live in a state like Massachusetts!
So greatful to live in a state like Massachusetts!
10
I don't believe a word the man says. Why should I?
39
This is all a reality TV show to trump...he wants to remain the center of attention no matter what...that is why he was "liberated" after his rant of a press conference last week...you can take the boy out of the reality TV show, but you can't take the reality TV out of the boy. No matter who is advising him we will continue to see this pathetic and dangerous behaviour from him.
44
He might just find himself alone...but we do need a few generals around to hold the place together.
3
One photo shows decidedly older men serving as riot police officers in Boston, even a white bearded grandpa! Could this be a reason why the police was so effective in preserving the peace? ML, who marched yesterday, writes "the Boston police deserve a lot of credit." Much rather these older men than cops who are ex-Iraq or Afghanistan veterans suffering from PTSD and are prone to overreact to the slightest provocation.
17
Joe
The Boston Police Department schedules these details as overtime work in many cases, so the guys with the most seniority get first dibs on the assignment. Those tend to be the older guys.
But you make a good point.
The Boston Police Department schedules these details as overtime work in many cases, so the guys with the most seniority get first dibs on the assignment. Those tend to be the older guys.
But you make a good point.
5
Free speech is all about promoting POSITIVE ideas and concepts, it is NOT about spewing hate and violence....kudos to the many souls standing up to say just that today in Boston....
35
Why do most of the demonstrators look like white, middle-class college students?
1
Wrong. You don't understand the Constitution or the 1st Amendement. Free speech is free speech, irrespective of the content. Our protection of free speech - even hateful speech - is what separates America from the rest of the world and makes us great.
6
Its not the speech....its the violent actions and fear the hate speech is attempting to promote....same as yelling "FIRE" in a crowded theater....
6
Freedom of speech march? Any bombastic twit has many megaphones, with social media as it is today. The notion that one must march to defend dwindling access to speech is complete hogwash. Call these so-called freedom marchers what they are - fools committed to their own failure. Learn to thrive outside your own comfort zone and you'll succeed. Retreat to your fear zone and you'll fail.
11
Hooray for Boston Strong! One continuing, niggling question i retain, however: There are "rallies" and there are "protests" and there are "counter-protests." If i hold a rally or participate in one, and if some others come along to protest what i am rallying about, those ppl are "protesters", right? And then some of the folks who are rallying alongside me become upset or some such, and they protest against the protesters... these folks are on my side, in a sense, and they are "counter-protesters", right? Protesting against those protesting against the rally??? Soooo.... when these articles that i see in the newspaper mention that there are "counter-protesters", then these "counter-protesters" are in fact on the same side as were the original rally organizers...
Thank you for keeping it clear who is who.
Thank you for keeping it clear who is who.
3
Thank you beautiful people of Boston.
150
It was unfortunate that some counter protesters resorted to throwing bottles, objects and physical confrontations.
Imagine 40,000 people singing We Shall Not Be Moved along the entire route. Imagine a city that turns completely silent, devoid of spectators, with shop fronts closed when the Fascist Racists come marching by, then to be greeted by legal gathering of an overwhelming number of peaceful Civil Rights Movement "singers".
Let the fools spout their hateful words while thousands of voices soar to heaven with the words of We Shall Overcome.
Imagine 40,000 people singing We Shall Not Be Moved along the entire route. Imagine a city that turns completely silent, devoid of spectators, with shop fronts closed when the Fascist Racists come marching by, then to be greeted by legal gathering of an overwhelming number of peaceful Civil Rights Movement "singers".
Let the fools spout their hateful words while thousands of voices soar to heaven with the words of We Shall Overcome.
69
We did sing "We shall overcome" while marching in Boston today. And we sang "This Land is Your Land" and "Never Turning Back." There was a honk band that played, tubas, kids, people dancing, trying to be joyful and unifying in the face of hatred. As I noted in an earlier comment, there were people who behaved badly, and throwing bottles and rocks at a police force keeping the peace is wrong, no two ways about it. Early in the march we ran into the police commissioner in Roxbury, who spoke with and posed for a couple of photos with marchers. That was the mood the vast majority of the march -- cooperation, tolerance, hope. There is more bad behavior and arrests in Boston after one of our sports teams wins a major game. You can't control every person in a crowd of 40,000. I also just have to say -- it struck me today that the people we call "the greatest generation" -- my grandparents -- were antifascists who fought the Nazis. Being against Nazis and white supremacists has never been "left" or "liberal" in this country. It's been unquestioned. When did that change? Today in Boston, we said, that hasn't changed.
754
I applaud all those who came out to protest hate speech and intolerance. Unfortunately, out of 40,000 people there will be those who identify themselves as anarchists and they are there to disrupt -- throwing bottles at the police and creating havoc. Their agenda is not the agenda of peaceful marchers. We need to stand against them as well as those who spout hateful rhetoric.
41
Regarding the "greatest generation being anti-fascists who fought the Nazis" :
Those who fought in WWII were drafted .This country did not enter WWII in order to fight the Nazis, or fascism,and kept it's doors firmly shut to those who sought to flee persecution and death at the hands of the Nazis,to the extent that the U.S.
doomed the passengers on the St. Louis to death by sending the Jewish refugees who were attempted to flee Hitler,right back to Hitler,dooming the passengers on board to their deaths in the crematoria. The United States refused to bomb the train tracks over which the cattle cars transported Jews to the death camps.
"Being against Nazis" has not been "unquestioned" as you have stated. This country entered WWII because Japan attacked on Pearl Harbor, not
to fight fascism.Our government's policy was one of Isolationism at the time.
Those who fought in WWII were drafted .This country did not enter WWII in order to fight the Nazis, or fascism,and kept it's doors firmly shut to those who sought to flee persecution and death at the hands of the Nazis,to the extent that the U.S.
doomed the passengers on the St. Louis to death by sending the Jewish refugees who were attempted to flee Hitler,right back to Hitler,dooming the passengers on board to their deaths in the crematoria. The United States refused to bomb the train tracks over which the cattle cars transported Jews to the death camps.
"Being against Nazis" has not been "unquestioned" as you have stated. This country entered WWII because Japan attacked on Pearl Harbor, not
to fight fascism.Our government's policy was one of Isolationism at the time.
20
Donald is showing us the answer to the question "What have you got to lose?" While Donald directed this largely at the great, great grandchildren of slaves his words actually apply to us all. Now he is showing us through word and action what we have to lose as he tries to take important things away; protections for clean air, clean water, health care, funding for public schools, the right to choose, infrastructure and so on. I am heartened to see the education he is giving us is getting people riled up and moving to action.
659
So, it's not about the disgusting KKK and the new-Nazis, but about liberals being upset about their political agenda? I agree with your stance on these groups, but this comment shows your still upset with the election results. You need to blame the DNC for this because Bernie had a better chance to beat Trump than Hillary.
5
You know Bernie Sanders was not a Democrat, right? Why would you expect the Democratic party, which Hillary Clinton has supported for many years with fund raising and action be obliged to support Bernie Sanders who only became a Democrat out of convenience. I agree with many of Sanders views but if he'd had any integrity he would have declared himself a Democrat long ago. If he was unwilling to do that he should have run as an independent.
19
I am suggesting that the Trump nightmare is resulting in a lot of people who were apathetic or misinformed about the things at stake are being woken up. I am not sure how you got from there to rearguing the Bernie vs. Hillary contest.
6
ivanka or John Kelly wrote those nicer tweets! We aren't idiots.
120
They had to keep the so-called president tied up in the White House basement until the fake tweet was safely released to the world.
I bet Trump sent those tweets as a precursor to taking credit for the success of the counter protesters.
7
Bravo, Boston, bravo!
67
"But they also contended with several men and women who, armed with high-powered rifles and dressed in military fatigues, assembled near the rally site here (in Dallas). A representative of the group, called the Texas Elite III%, said they planned to provide security at the rally..."
And that, in two sentences, so clearly illustrates what is so very very wrong with your country. This is behaviour I expect in a poverty stricken African dictatorship. In the rest of the western world, they would have been arrested.
Is this what your constitution stands for?
And that, in two sentences, so clearly illustrates what is so very very wrong with your country. This is behaviour I expect in a poverty stricken African dictatorship. In the rest of the western world, they would have been arrested.
Is this what your constitution stands for?
349
No, Flossy, our constitution doesn't condone this.
For more than forty years, ever since we tried to remake society by assisting the poor with education, health, and equality, a few wealthy people have been paying the worst element among us to say that reaching out and helping others, especially those with more melanin in their skin, was an attack on white people. Guns were promoted since the gun manufacturers saw a chance to sell more weapons, and one race baiter in particular, Ronald Reagan, overreacted when a small number of black people started to carry guns in public in the 1960s.
Turns out carrying guns in public is bad idea in this country only if one is a color other than white.
My personal opinion is that people who feel safe when clutching their guns or parading with their guns or threatening others with their guns are insane so I don't shop in stores where open carry of guns is allowed. I avoid those places and I'm staying away from tourist attractions like the Olympic National Forest and Gifford Pinchot National Forest since this spring when I could hear constant gunfire over the Memorial Day Holiday.
Unfortunately, these people aren't going away anytime soon and Trump only inflames their sickness. So just like the coal company owners in Australia dredging areas on the Great Barrier Reef so ships can deliver more coal to China money makes its own reasons, or as I learned in high school, "might makes right".
For more than forty years, ever since we tried to remake society by assisting the poor with education, health, and equality, a few wealthy people have been paying the worst element among us to say that reaching out and helping others, especially those with more melanin in their skin, was an attack on white people. Guns were promoted since the gun manufacturers saw a chance to sell more weapons, and one race baiter in particular, Ronald Reagan, overreacted when a small number of black people started to carry guns in public in the 1960s.
Turns out carrying guns in public is bad idea in this country only if one is a color other than white.
My personal opinion is that people who feel safe when clutching their guns or parading with their guns or threatening others with their guns are insane so I don't shop in stores where open carry of guns is allowed. I avoid those places and I'm staying away from tourist attractions like the Olympic National Forest and Gifford Pinchot National Forest since this spring when I could hear constant gunfire over the Memorial Day Holiday.
Unfortunately, these people aren't going away anytime soon and Trump only inflames their sickness. So just like the coal company owners in Australia dredging areas on the Great Barrier Reef so ships can deliver more coal to China money makes its own reasons, or as I learned in high school, "might makes right".
3
Unfortunately the second amendment and the right to open carry in Texas are not going to change now, and lead to this men carry rifles to protest. It s almost like taking all,the refugees from Pakistan in Australia and putting them on a tiny island in prison. Sounds like country has problems too.
Boston!
I - AM - SO - PROUD - OF - YOU.
I - AM - SO - PROUD - OF - YOU.
144
"Yascha Mounk, a political scientist at Harvard University who writes about democracy, said partisanship in the United States today is dangerously deep.
“It’s now at a stage where a lot of Americans have such a loyalty to their political tribe that they are willing to go along with deeply undemocratic behavior,” he said. “If their guy says, ‘I think we should push back the election for a few years because of a possible terrorist attack,’ I fear that a significant part of the population would go along with it.” ' New York Times, 08/20/17
“It’s now at a stage where a lot of Americans have such a loyalty to their political tribe that they are willing to go along with deeply undemocratic behavior,” he said. “If their guy says, ‘I think we should push back the election for a few years because of a possible terrorist attack,’ I fear that a significant part of the population would go along with it.” ' New York Times, 08/20/17
Love trumps hate once more.
There is hope for this country, after all.
There is hope for this country, after all.
83
Let's switch to
" country divided for decades, and now I am going to heal that, more together than ever, watch me"
Look what I started today....the healing....Bajahahaha.....
"Sometimes you need protest in order to heal...."
Mr. President you want healing.......resign ....and don't touch your Twitter for 150 days....
" country divided for decades, and now I am going to heal that, more together than ever, watch me"
Look what I started today....the healing....Bajahahaha.....
"Sometimes you need protest in order to heal...."
Mr. President you want healing.......resign ....and don't touch your Twitter for 150 days....
27
Ivanka must have taken over his Twitter feed. Her children are Jewish. It's not just a national crisis. It's a family crisis. If it were me, there'd be no more Grandpa Time until he admitted he was wrong in public and apologized. Tell the kids that Grandpa said something really bad and Mommy put him on a time out.
223
I do not understand this comment. What was said by Grandpa? I would only ask for a fair appraisal of any situation from the election to right now. The only institution/individuals I have any faith in are the ACLU. Progressives have become a Fifth Column in this country working to under mind from within. Go back to your Orwellian novels: Animal Farm + 1984. The Progressives are turning away the independent moderate.
If you have Jewish grandchildren then it should not ever even come CLOSE to crossing your mind to say that there are "many sides" when it comes to Nazis.
If Grandpa thinks that way, then Grandpa needs to be kept away from those children.
If Grandpa thinks that way, then Grandpa needs to be kept away from those children.
10
I wonder if the grandchildren and he really care that much about spending time together. He doesn't seem so much like a loving, fun grendpa.
1
Wonderful to see so many courageous people protesting against a free speech demonstration. I couldn't join, so thank you for giving me this opportunity to virtuously shout: Down with free speech!
11
So tragic, Trump's deplorables just don't get it. Hate speech, intended to incite violence, is not protected by the constitution. Besides, yes, it takes courageous people to stand up to those happy trigger, second amendment KKK and Neo Nazi thugs.
18
The original rally participants were not deprived of their right to speak. They could have spoken freely with the counter protesters kept 300' away.
20
Hate speech is protected by the Constitution, but calling this a "free speech" demonstration is ludicrous. The alt-right wasn't out to protect "free speech" but to try to normalize their bigotry. The counter-protesters (who outnumbered the racists by a few orders of magnitude) were out there to oppose the substance of that bigotry. Saying that they were protesting against free speech is a factually untenable position.
13
what more do white nationalist want? when i look at the federal, state and local government i see mostly white people.
21
philip, they're mad at those white people for being too nice to the non-white people. By trying to provide access to affordable healthcare to everyone they're traitors to the master race, you see?
2
Simple solution: keep the statues, but mandate they have an attached plaque which states that the depicted "hero" was a traitor to his country who fought to ensure the enslavement, torture, rape and murder of fellow Americans due to their skin color.
56
Yeah, or just "Participation Award: American Civil War"
2
No, statutes of traitors will never have a proper place in any government/public location.
4
If both tweets belong to @realDonald jTrump, it is evidence the man jumps to conclusions which he cannot support, and that he is unstable.
18
See what happens in a no-carry gun state and a permit that forbids any weapon? Nazi cowards can’t hide behind their guns and tiki torches to menace and bully. Well done, Boston. You drove them out with the strength of your community and your super intellectual powers. Wicked smaht! Boston Strong!
792
This is a great point and one I hadn't thought of. Thanks, Angela.
12
Best response of all...
6
So, how many shots were fired by those guns in Virginia?
Donald Trump is breathtakingly hypocritical with his "healing" tweet. But why should we expect more at this low point?
Let's wait until the rally in Phoenix on Tuesday and see just how serious he is about healing as he uses the bully pulpit again to inflame and incite.
Good to know that most of the events today were peaceful and that the white supremacists were held in line. All is not lost.
Let's wait until the rally in Phoenix on Tuesday and see just how serious he is about healing as he uses the bully pulpit again to inflame and incite.
Good to know that most of the events today were peaceful and that the white supremacists were held in line. All is not lost.
478
"bully pulpit again to inflame and incite" - please give exact quote where Pres. Trump did exactly that. And no, not taking sides against Neo-Nazi's isn't one of them.
4
he has literally kept the same stance this entire time...
and there werent any "white supremacists" it was a bunch of libertarians. and by "bunch" i mean like 20. their permit was only for 50 i think, but the protesters blocked the entrance...
and there werent any "white supremacists" it was a bunch of libertarians. and by "bunch" i mean like 20. their permit was only for 50 i think, but the protesters blocked the entrance...
Trump is not so much a hypocrite is that he blows with the wind, any wind.
1
There are offensive versus defensive militias in every neighborhood of the World. In America, Federalism versus State's Rights remains a central issue.
The fallback plan to the ability of States, within the "United States" tp defend themselves remains a central issue among Governors of States, though the US Federal Government dismisses such worries.
In the Middle East, this fallback has already occurred - federalism has already failed across the ME in favor of inter-sectarian Wars.
The tear towards sectarian conflicts as the dominant political conflict in America is following the ME model - and threatening Federalism in the US which has already torn apart ME nations that were under single Federalist Rules (One Law) across cultures, languages, industries, religions and historical peoples.
The fallback plan to the ability of States, within the "United States" tp defend themselves remains a central issue among Governors of States, though the US Federal Government dismisses such worries.
In the Middle East, this fallback has already occurred - federalism has already failed across the ME in favor of inter-sectarian Wars.
The tear towards sectarian conflicts as the dominant political conflict in America is following the ME model - and threatening Federalism in the US which has already torn apart ME nations that were under single Federalist Rules (One Law) across cultures, languages, industries, religions and historical peoples.
2
Um, no?
You are trying way too hard, dude. Also, you are wrong.
You are trying way too hard, dude. Also, you are wrong.
28
Your historic ignorance is showing. The problems in the middle East are in many instances due to the British Colonial rule that divided countries up in no reasonable consideration of tribes and their affiliations. There was no such thing as "federalism" in the Middle East.
30
Sorry, Mr. Trump, this country will NEVER come together so long as you are in the White House.
Please resign NOW. It's the right (and righteous) thing to do. And so much faster than your coming impeachment. I can't believe that any of this is fun for you.
Recent cartoon n the NEW YORKER: Wife to husband, "Remember how nice America was before it was great?"
Please resign NOW. It's the right (and righteous) thing to do. And so much faster than your coming impeachment. I can't believe that any of this is fun for you.
Recent cartoon n the NEW YORKER: Wife to husband, "Remember how nice America was before it was great?"
479
The country will never come together until people like you honestly accept you lost the election for a reason.
4
I might disagree on one key count: we may find ourselves embracing in our common rejection of Trump and what he stands for, and that would be both a wonderful learning moment (to paraphrase a much better President), and a much-needed catharsis.
5
Yeah, the "reason" was the Electoral College. Hillary Clinton won the election by nearly three million votes.
15
You can't have it both ways, donnie boy. Who really sent your tweet about the country healing and coming together as one?
102
I marched in Boston today with tens of thousands of other people of all ages for 3 hours from the Roxbury neighborhood to the Boston Common and I didn't see a single incidence of violence. It's important to note that there will always be people on the fringes causing problems, but everyone I witnessed personally today was there to make a statement against hatred and intolerance in our community. Fewer people got arrested at the protests today than do at rock concerts and sporting events, so both the crowds and the Boston police deserve a lot of credit. There are disagreements about tactics -- many say stay home and don't give the white supremacists attention. But I was glad that today so many of us showed up to be witnesses for tolerance and peace. My black, Jewish, and Latino neighbors can't ignore the hate, so neither can I.
1115
Dear ML, A great Comment! Go Patriots! The cradle of Liberty, or one of the cradles of Liberty can be proud. We all gotta be from somewhere and wherever all of us Caucasians, African-Americans, Jews and Latinos, et. al. are from, we are all Americans. This does not mean we are all "America-firsters" or that we all should think as America-firsters. But for now, the Bostons and Charlottesvilles and Portlands are all part of our present homeland -- America.
We cannot be tunnel blind to the rest of the world. That is what brought us 9/11. What 2017 is teaching us is that we need to think about our identity, our self-identity, who we are as individuals and as a some kind of a common society and civilization. Change is always happening and we need to realize that and think about that more than ever. We cannot deny, hide, shield, lie about or cover our history. It is what it is. A lot of the Confederate Generals and Officers were Americans (West Pointers) before they were Confederates. The truth of history must not be removed, taken down, hidden away. In some cases, appropriate venues can be used to display all kinds of American history as necessary.
We cannot be tunnel blind to the rest of the world. That is what brought us 9/11. What 2017 is teaching us is that we need to think about our identity, our self-identity, who we are as individuals and as a some kind of a common society and civilization. Change is always happening and we need to realize that and think about that more than ever. We cannot deny, hide, shield, lie about or cover our history. It is what it is. A lot of the Confederate Generals and Officers were Americans (West Pointers) before they were Confederates. The truth of history must not be removed, taken down, hidden away. In some cases, appropriate venues can be used to display all kinds of American history as necessary.
10
From a late middle aged, white Southern man who grew up during the Civil Rights movement, Thank You for standing for what is right. I only wish I could have been there.
19
I grew up in Boston and now one of my daughters lives there and marched as well. ML to say I am bursting with pride is an understatement. Your voices of intolorance were heard loud and clear. You and each and every human beinbg that peacfully march are truly the voice of the people and will contiune to echo for a very long time. Thank you ML , Bravo
11
I do not believe the president tweeted this.
160
I don't either, as it was written in readable English by what seems to be someone who graduated middle school.
45
Being inconsistent and unpredictable was how Stalin kept the Soviet people at bay. He spared some, condemned some. But not so that anyone could predict which category they were going to fall into.
12
Whoever tweeted it first sent the message as "heeling" -twice- before it was finally spelled correctly. Somebody's passing 8-year-old? Or is the Don still hoping America will heel. Woof.
16
Whew! I am so glad to know this will happen soon. I was really worried that we were a divided nation, ya know, on account of with the Republican machine and KlaNazis on one side and darn near everybody else on the other...but not so much after today in Boston because “Our great country has been divided for decades. Sometimes you need protest in order to heal, & we will heal, & be stronger than ever before!”
Yes, isn't this awesome?! We sometimes just need protest and then we will come together because for positively DECADES we've had this teensy problem. How many decades are five centuries anyway? My word, where does the time go!