China wants it all. "You want into our market? Hand over your trade secrets (the ones we haven't stolen), become a minority partner, and throw in your neatly folded underwear and necktie. We will use every possible exploitation, including your universities, to gain advantage and weaken you because we have the long term view. We will eventually out-Apple Apple, and everybody else, and sell you the same stuff for 2/3rd the cost." BUT.....after saying this.....I'm guilty of helping China fulfill their goals. Because American wages have stagnated so long, I do some shopping at Harbor Freight. (I pay $64 for an electric pole saw that costs $100 at Ace.) The one at Ace is made in China too but Harbor Freight is more direct. If Trump is our new nationalist President, how about we establish a chain of Costco sized stores called "Made In America"....everything is 100% American labor and materials. If your wages are low, buy something small. If you own a Harbor Freight franchise, go buy something big. This is probably the only way we can force American manufacturers to hire American. I read long ago that if the American building industry used just 5% more American made materials, it would create 220,000 jobs.
3
About time! Over the past thirty years, China has mainly prospered from hundreds of greedy American corporations and companies outsourcing jobs and technology in the name of ‘globalization’, in order to drive up their profits and bottom-line. The Chinese can thank these corporations [like Walmart] for their prosperity. People who are “amazed” at this phenomenon are simply being disingenuous.
2
Given the complexity of the situation, net gains in some areas is probably the best the can do.
It continues to amaze me that articles and comments about trade with China, Chinese trade policies, Chinese currency manipulation, etc., etc., never seem to emphasize what is really going on: tens of thousands of U.S. companies have chosen to base their manufacturing facilities in China. So, who will lose if this all starts to fall apart? I wonder how many of those U.S. companies, large and small, will find it easy to just leave China and go elsewhere or back to the U.S., incur the cost of such relocation, and end up with new production costs that are at least no higher than they were in China. Off-hand, I would say that the U.S. is at least as equally vulnerable as China might be to the economic disruptions that this would entail. [Not to mention larger issues like North Korea where it's clear that we need China as a vital ally, not some kind of imaginary adversary.]
What a bunch of cry babies. China is becoming more wealthy and more powerful than the U.S. Why, because they work harder, take education more seriously, and are better at business. That's how they are winning. Don't like it; too bad.
Yeah, and trillions in FDI doesn't hurt either. They don't work harder, just cheaper with no labor or environmental protections.
Please choose Spain or Canada.
Please choose Spain or Canada.
They don't work harder. But they do educate millions at US universities, and the universities of other Western nations. See the recent op-ed piece on the Chinese government influence at Australian universities. Many more are employed at US companies through the H1B visa program, where there is great potential for industrial espionage. It's been a one way street for a long time.
Does Trump really think he can take on Apple and Amazon, two of the main supporters of Chinese dictator Chairman Xi of the Central Committee of the Chinese Communist Party? Trump will really get an earful if he messes with I Phone users!
Trump administration is desperately trying to rally his base with this inquiry and the college admissions inquiry and at the same time desperately trying to divert attention from the Russian investigation.
Japan paid for its own aircraft carriers it used on December 7, 1941. The difference is today we pay for China's aircraft carriers, when we shop
1
There should be reciprocity. If China demands data stay in China, we should demand the same. If corporations must have a Chinese partner, then the same should apply to Chinese businesses here.
3
The need of course is always to negotiate what are considered problems with nations with which we have friendly relations. We have friendly relations with China and need to be diplomatic in working on considered trade problems with China. Being arbitrary is unnecessary and will be self-defeating.
China , friendly?
They constantly harass our naval aircraft and ships in international waters, have built artificial islands with missiles, radar and anti-aircraft batteries and have done absolutely nothing to prevent North Korea from developing nuclear missiles.
I think Americans should also look at very popular Chinese media outlets like Global Times to see what the Chinese think of us - many commenters there WANT a war with the US and want to restore China to its role as the "Middle Kingdom" , i.e., the country around which all other countries revolve. Their contempt for America and Americans is very obvious.
China is famous for stealing IP and other sensitive records - they stole records in 2015 from the OPM with sensitive data on 22 million Americans in US government jobs, and there are many other cases of Chinese hacking.
I wouldn't call this the acts of a friendly nation.
They constantly harass our naval aircraft and ships in international waters, have built artificial islands with missiles, radar and anti-aircraft batteries and have done absolutely nothing to prevent North Korea from developing nuclear missiles.
I think Americans should also look at very popular Chinese media outlets like Global Times to see what the Chinese think of us - many commenters there WANT a war with the US and want to restore China to its role as the "Middle Kingdom" , i.e., the country around which all other countries revolve. Their contempt for America and Americans is very obvious.
China is famous for stealing IP and other sensitive records - they stole records in 2015 from the OPM with sensitive data on 22 million Americans in US government jobs, and there are many other cases of Chinese hacking.
I wouldn't call this the acts of a friendly nation.
3
I am sure that there are trade practises that the US does not like, but this now smells like a retaliatory responce to China not helping the US with N. Korea.
The timing of this petulant president actions showed how bad this "smart man" really is at international politics.
His myopic view of the world and himself is going to cause the rest of us to pay heavily in the future.
But that aditude by the "president" is nothing new. In business, if he does something wrong, it's not his fault. Just let it fail, and bankrupt the business, and stick it to the bank.
Well america, we are now the bank.
The timing of this petulant president actions showed how bad this "smart man" really is at international politics.
His myopic view of the world and himself is going to cause the rest of us to pay heavily in the future.
But that aditude by the "president" is nothing new. In business, if he does something wrong, it's not his fault. Just let it fail, and bankrupt the business, and stick it to the bank.
Well america, we are now the bank.
1
And why should China not pay a price in an area that is vital to them--trade--for their refusal to put any real pressure on North Korea and their threats?
Furthermore, China has gotten a free ride from the attitudes of the global corporate masters, who are perfectly willing to sell out the USA if they can make more money using China. See: Apple / Foxconn.
Furthermore, China has gotten a free ride from the attitudes of the global corporate masters, who are perfectly willing to sell out the USA if they can make more money using China. See: Apple / Foxconn.
3
Trump likes to think he's the Godfather of politics. You know, make offers to others they can't refuse because he's "El Jefe", which is often confused -- understandably -- with El Hefty. Those corsets he wears (cinched to the hilt) probably account for a lot of his crankiness, but not nearly all of it. He's cranky because he don't git no respect, save from the sycophants that buzz about him like flies over an open trash can. They certainly won't buy him anything near another pro-Donald vote in Congress. Yet he soldiers on, Gen. MacArthur face and all. Look at him striding alongside Xi Jinping. OPne might get away with that grim visage if this were Halloween, but Xi Jinping looks a lot more self-confident and comfortable than does Mr. Grumpy to his Right.
This, too, shall end.
This, too, shall end.
1
The TPP (Trans Pacific Partnership) would have done more to protect US company IP in China and elsewhere than anything this lame administration can possibly do. But since it was negotiated by Mr. Obama, well, he's determined to get rid of it -- just like the Paris accord and the ACA.
4
There is no such thing as fair trade with China. They would never allow it.
3
China defending intellectual property. Don't make me laugh. I stole it. It's mine!
4
Blatant discrimination against non-Chinese is China's business practice, and practice makes perfect. A non-Chinese cannot buy property (of any kind imaginable) as big as a doll's handkerchief. An yet a Chinese in this regard has all the rights of any other US citizen. We had 4 years of CHANGE followed by 4 years of HOPE, but what we got was 8 years of nothing. Can we now have RECIPROCITY?
3
Don't forget, China had terrible experiences in the 19th century with British and American trade ( see opium war).
The US economy during those years did the same thing to European countries as China is doing to the US now.
If the US wants a trade policy that works, it needs to keep the historical context in mind.
The US economy during those years did the same thing to European countries as China is doing to the US now.
If the US wants a trade policy that works, it needs to keep the historical context in mind.
Les, You are correct; but, how many people have any understanding of action and reaction, or any knowledge of history. Britain and the U.S. have much to answer for, and China has not forgotten.
Yet another shining object to detract from the fact Russia installed him as President......
2
As China refuses to cooperate on North Korea, and indeed has abused the free trade process, it's time to consider the vast army of Chinese nationals who are getting free rides at America's top universities and tech companies.
There is nothing like reciprocity in this arrangement. Very few US tech students work or study in China, yet China is allowed to suck up every new technological advance for transfer to China via the abusive H1B visa program and academic appointments. There is no reason Trump should not crack down on this legion of foreign informants.
There is nothing like reciprocity in this arrangement. Very few US tech students work or study in China, yet China is allowed to suck up every new technological advance for transfer to China via the abusive H1B visa program and academic appointments. There is no reason Trump should not crack down on this legion of foreign informants.
2
Most Americans would agree with the premise, that USA and it's manufacturing outsourcing hurt our workers, and helped China build dazzling structures and cities.
The signing of the Russia bill, shows, Congress, if bi-partisan, can pull together tough punitive bills, that protect us and our workers.
China is the master currency manipulator, N.Korea & Pakistan defender, and anti-American in every forum.
Oh !! Their human rights record is not stellar either.
If Trump wants more victories like Russia sanction, China is a low hanging fruit with good potential for bi-partisan support.
The tougher the sanctions, more kudos from media.
The signing of the Russia bill, shows, Congress, if bi-partisan, can pull together tough punitive bills, that protect us and our workers.
China is the master currency manipulator, N.Korea & Pakistan defender, and anti-American in every forum.
Oh !! Their human rights record is not stellar either.
If Trump wants more victories like Russia sanction, China is a low hanging fruit with good potential for bi-partisan support.
The tougher the sanctions, more kudos from media.
2
Does this mean that Ivanka will stop importing her retail line of shoes and clothing from China?
1
“China thinks that the bilateral trade relation is governed by W.T.O. rules, not American domestic law,” Mr. He said.
Clever propaganda, but the reality is that Beijing cheats relentlessly on trade and only bothers with WTO rules when it suits them. The evidence underlying the accusations against China in this article are widely known and reported.
Americans are free to bash Trump, but all presidents since Clinton have let Beijing get away with a multi-trillion-dollar trade heist. Once you start to add in IP and other theft, it gets to be real money.
Clever propaganda, but the reality is that Beijing cheats relentlessly on trade and only bothers with WTO rules when it suits them. The evidence underlying the accusations against China in this article are widely known and reported.
Americans are free to bash Trump, but all presidents since Clinton have let Beijing get away with a multi-trillion-dollar trade heist. Once you start to add in IP and other theft, it gets to be real money.
3
Hmmm...investigate China, not Russia? Looks like a bit of distraction, using one of Trump's favorite straw dogs, even though he knows zip about China and business.
1
The price of a decade of cheap China-manufactured electronics is that eventually the Chinese figured out how to do more than just assembly. They now have the know-how to design and engineer the devices. This was forecast decades ago after we watched the Japanese go through the same cycle. Why is there surprise and consternation now?
1
China bashing and pointing fingers at them is camouflage for the real problem. The way to protect intellectual property is to manufacture products in
America. Then if foreign countries buy and copy the products we should take action.
Instead short term profits rule everything and cast common sense out the window. We minimize manufacturing risk by having Asian countries invest in the factories and human training and infrastructure and we license the technology to them. Now after they have taken all the business risk we have the temerity to whine when they want to increase their profits from the risks they have taken? In many cases, that practice has resulted in there being no competing factories in the US at all. Virtually all semiconductor manufacturing is done in Asia; no foundries exist in the US.
We have met the enemy and he is us.
To fix it? Build our own factories. Antagonizing China when we don't have the fundamental manufacturing base to replace their capabilities is contradictory and possibly economically destructive.
America. Then if foreign countries buy and copy the products we should take action.
Instead short term profits rule everything and cast common sense out the window. We minimize manufacturing risk by having Asian countries invest in the factories and human training and infrastructure and we license the technology to them. Now after they have taken all the business risk we have the temerity to whine when they want to increase their profits from the risks they have taken? In many cases, that practice has resulted in there being no competing factories in the US at all. Virtually all semiconductor manufacturing is done in Asia; no foundries exist in the US.
We have met the enemy and he is us.
To fix it? Build our own factories. Antagonizing China when we don't have the fundamental manufacturing base to replace their capabilities is contradictory and possibly economically destructive.
4
"The way to protect intellectual property is to manufacture products in
America. Then if foreign countries buy and copy the products we should take action."
I don't think you've been paying attention. Because that is exactly what happened. We had more plants in America, but China has been stealing IP for nearly the past 20 years. So you're saying we should do that all over again?
America. Then if foreign countries buy and copy the products we should take action."
I don't think you've been paying attention. Because that is exactly what happened. We had more plants in America, but China has been stealing IP for nearly the past 20 years. So you're saying we should do that all over again?
3
President Trump should give the Chinese a dose of their own medicine when it comes to the unfair trade practices they've been waging against us for the past few years. Remember, the Chinese rely on the US more than the US relies on China. With automation and technological advances, it's better if manufacturing returns to the US so we can be self sufficient. It would also help the environment and create jobs for Americans.
4
It's time we play hard ball with China on trade. They have been violating the rules of fair trade and stealing our trade secrets for years. Trade is one of the best way to pressure China to force North Korea to give up its nuclear missiles -- missiles China has helped North Korea get. We should also let China know that if they keep enabling their North Korean proxy to have nuclear missiles aimed American and our allies, South Korea and Japan, it would be unfair for us to deny those allies the right to build nuclear missiles that could hit both North Korea and China, itself.
Our intelligence agencies know China has helped North Korea develop nuclear and missile technology. The mobile missile launcher used in many of North Korea's recent missile launches were sold to them by China in violation of China's promises that it would not aid North Korea's missile program. So it's definitely time to play hard ball with China, because they have been playing hard ball with us on both trade and nuclear proliferation for years. They have transferred stolen U.S. nuclear technology to not only to North Korea, but also to Pakistan, and they have allowed Iranian nuclear scientist to travel through China to participate in North Korea's nuclear tests.
Michael Pillsbury, a leading expert on China, has a new book showing that China has a 70 year old plan to dominate earth by 2047, and they are on track to do just that. Unless we acts soon, America will have to submit to Chinese domination.
Our intelligence agencies know China has helped North Korea develop nuclear and missile technology. The mobile missile launcher used in many of North Korea's recent missile launches were sold to them by China in violation of China's promises that it would not aid North Korea's missile program. So it's definitely time to play hard ball with China, because they have been playing hard ball with us on both trade and nuclear proliferation for years. They have transferred stolen U.S. nuclear technology to not only to North Korea, but also to Pakistan, and they have allowed Iranian nuclear scientist to travel through China to participate in North Korea's nuclear tests.
Michael Pillsbury, a leading expert on China, has a new book showing that China has a 70 year old plan to dominate earth by 2047, and they are on track to do just that. Unless we acts soon, America will have to submit to Chinese domination.
4
We helped China by not participating the Trans Pacific Partnership.
China is China. Contrived trade disputes accomplish nothing. Companies operate there at their own risk. However China also needs the US market and US innovation. China's projected self-confidence belies an insecurity.
The US needs to invest in education and infrastructure which directly benefits all stakeholders. Bet on the ingenuity of the American people while making sure no one is left behind.
China is China. Contrived trade disputes accomplish nothing. Companies operate there at their own risk. However China also needs the US market and US innovation. China's projected self-confidence belies an insecurity.
The US needs to invest in education and infrastructure which directly benefits all stakeholders. Bet on the ingenuity of the American people while making sure no one is left behind.
5
Labor costs in China are about 1/20th of those in the US. US education will not change this. Protective tariffs are needed to prevent the offshoring of jobs from the US to exploit this cheap labor. TPP would exploit labor by effectively preventing China's workers from bargaining for higher wages.
1
"China’s export sector still contributes heavily to its economy growth despite Beijing’s efforts to diversify its economy, and China represents a lucrative market for American automakers, technology companies like Apple, farmers and many others."
I suppose Apple makes money in China (though they don't share country by country profitability in their quarterly reporting). There is absolutely no proof that any major foreign automaker makes money there. Conversely, they all seem to be itching to use China as an export base (witness Ford's recent announcement).
China has severely bent or broken WTO rules ever since it joined in 2001. The world looked the other way because they had their eyes on that sweet, huge potential market. Now, attitudes have changed quite a bit though you still have our craven tech companies like Apple, Microsoft, Oracle, etc. helping the Chinese government control its population.
Shame!
I suppose Apple makes money in China (though they don't share country by country profitability in their quarterly reporting). There is absolutely no proof that any major foreign automaker makes money there. Conversely, they all seem to be itching to use China as an export base (witness Ford's recent announcement).
China has severely bent or broken WTO rules ever since it joined in 2001. The world looked the other way because they had their eyes on that sweet, huge potential market. Now, attitudes have changed quite a bit though you still have our craven tech companies like Apple, Microsoft, Oracle, etc. helping the Chinese government control its population.
Shame!
5
No matter what, we cannot stop China's ambition. This is the reality. America better wake up. It is still not too late for us to put our acts together. I visited China for the first time in 1972 and I also visited Beijing and Shanghai last year. What a difference! The high speed trains and the tall buildings everywhere. Shocked me.
5
@mclean4
It's not so much about "stop(ping) China's ambition" as much as not rolling out the red carpet for it. Do we have to smooth the path for them?
No.
It's not so much about "stop(ping) China's ambition" as much as not rolling out the red carpet for it. Do we have to smooth the path for them?
No.
1
Some of us still remember the time when "everyone had better learn Japanese" because of their exponential rise then everything moved to China. Are we seeing the begining of another mass migration of cheaper labor? Probably so, it's the only way to stop China from being ever increasingly bellicose in Asia.
2
You can blame China for our economic problems, or our leaders who signed off on globalization, but the real culprits were American investors who demanded a bigger return and didn't care how they got it. American workers? Oh well.
15
@Carl
You are absolutely correct. You can't blame the Chinese to saying "yes" to trillions of $$ of FDI being thrust in their faces.
You are absolutely correct. You can't blame the Chinese to saying "yes" to trillions of $$ of FDI being thrust in their faces.
It seems as though The Donald's new-found friendship with President Xie ("a great guy") existed mostly in his own mind. No trade deals, no help on North Korea, not even an all-access pass to Beijing's Forbidden City. Why it's almost enough to get our feckless leader to close up his own Chinese sweat-shops and swear off his own importation of Chinese steel!
3
Made in china 1995. It was when standing in line at a Kmart that I first realized that just about 80 % of the goods I was buying and staring at me from the checkout kiosks, had a made in china sticker or made in Mexico. In five years the two will still dominate with a third party doing most of the retailing. Amazon. Maybe Jeff bezos could buy a health insurance company. Or maybe the big four could provide heath care credits as bonus points. Musk health care. More coffee, I'm still dreaming.
3
China sends more than 10 times to the US than Mexico does.
Mexico sends to the US what American corporations build there.
1
The west has given dozens of years worth of advanced technologies to China viva manufacturing with cheap labor. They have advanced their economic in the global position dramatically as a result. It is time we take charge of our own economic. Boycott Wal-Mart and buy locally made products.
4
By all means let's become more like Russia and China.
Lets do the same as the Chinese and set long term goals for our future industry. We too can subsidize these industries.
16
Consider it done - through bloated military contracts.
Tempting, but that's a tit-for-tat way to destroy value. Letting markets drive capital flows is optimal, but when the CCP set out to destroy your industries, markets aren't the solution.
Unfortunately, in the short run, Americans are going to pay because Beijing cheats.
Unfortunately, in the short run, Americans are going to pay because Beijing cheats.
China subidize ineffenient and grifting companies ran by party princelings while we subidize education for all. In China K-12 are all self funded with zero government transportation support. China's model are doom to fail, don't be fooled by their made up numbers and censorship behind the "great firewall" of China's other 80%, rural areas where more than 1 billion are under educated and without plumbing.
Isn’t it a bit hard to argue that it’s wrong for China to want to benefit from trade, given that this is Mr. Trump’s position (quoting from the LA times): “The president said he only seeks a level playing field for U.S. companies and workers, but ‘if the playing field was slanted a little bit toward us, I would accept that, also.’”
4
Benefiting from trade is one thing. China is certainly allowed to do that. Stealing intellectual property, among many other trade rule violations is another. Plus, China is still categorized as a developing country, which allows them an unfair advantage in many ways, including environmental and labor protections.
8
You have been so damaged by the humorless democrats that you don't get it when Trump makes a small joke. It's like the bourhaha over covfefe ("Breaking News! *WHAT DOES IT MEAN???"), which was just a harmless typo but had to be blown out of proportion to produce content to feed the 27x7 tv feed.
1
Perhaps Trump should have given President Xi a bigger piece of that famous cake & 2 scoops of ice cream. Trump is a buffoon. America , what have you done to yourself ? The world`s leaders are playing chess & Trump is playing Hungry ,Hungry Hippos.