Russia is pretty much an economic basket case due to Putin. He has driven out millions of talented people to the USA Europe Australia and Israel. People afraid to live in a country where the leadership imprisons and kills people and of course these people can't wait to get their children out of Russia. Such a future they could have had but ego and greed by Putin and his like has made its economy on par with Mexico. 1.8 percent of world GDP versus USA 24.4 percent. So whatever trouble it causes is not from strength but weakness and of course the best strategy to isolate them till the government falls like the communist Soviet Union
6
As events unfold, let's take af fresh look at the changing roles of Sessions & Rosenstein. The notion that POTUS is furious with Sessions for his recusal, & with Rosenstein for appointing Mueller, is clear enough. But why did Rosenstein switch from an Administration supporter to an independent actor who brought in a Special Counsel? And why has Sessions remained remarkably passive, & disinclined to even hint at dispproval of his number two's actions? Could Sessions, an early & ardent ardent Trump supporter, not stomach the foothold that Putin has gained in the White House? Is it possible that Putin's overreach has deeply offended Sessions's sense of patriotism? While many Trump policies square with the A.G.'s ideas on governance, concessions to Putin and his cronies may have been a deal-breaker for him. This view explains Sessions' unwillingness to become involved in further efforts to block investigations. It is plausible that Sessions, abetted by colleagues, may have decided the benefits of Trump were not worth the candle. For his part, Rosenstein, appointed a U.S, Attorney by Bush 43, may have learned details on Russian involvement that prompted his change of heart on doing the bidding of the Trump Administration, In the President's eyes, the failure of Sessions to reign in Rosenstein, albeit surreptitiously, signaled silent assent. In future, the role of 'stellar wind' & similar programs may explain the reasons for Sessions' & Rosenstein's mysterious abouface.
3
Mr. Sanger,
The article assumes that Putin is concerned with bettering relations with the United States and thereby the West. Moscow is not motivated by "image" concerns and particularly not those of Moscow originating in America. Moscow is primarily concerned with the real and relative power and increasing their share in the world. Sanctions provide one type of inconvenience, but they provide another type of capital for Putin. Originating with the premise that the United States only seeks its own narrow national interests in the extant international order, Putin has convinced many that the only reason America imposes sanctions is to cripple the real potential of their country and humiliate its leadership. This messaging has a powerful impact on Russians, young and old. Unfortunately, this messaging, once only appealing to Russians, has seeped into consciousness of proper Europeans.
Trump's "America First" brand has provided Putin with the necessary validation to support Alexandr Dugin's structural analysis of the current international order. Trump's search for narrow nationalistic interests drives wedges between Europe and the U.S. Europe, now stripped of its' moral obligation to follow with American policy, is free to set policy that meets its own immediate needs - including energy security policy with Russia.
Putin's bet on Trump Backfired? The U.S. acts alone and is "paranoic" and "the West" is split. Putin Wins Bet w/Trump.
The article assumes that Putin is concerned with bettering relations with the United States and thereby the West. Moscow is not motivated by "image" concerns and particularly not those of Moscow originating in America. Moscow is primarily concerned with the real and relative power and increasing their share in the world. Sanctions provide one type of inconvenience, but they provide another type of capital for Putin. Originating with the premise that the United States only seeks its own narrow national interests in the extant international order, Putin has convinced many that the only reason America imposes sanctions is to cripple the real potential of their country and humiliate its leadership. This messaging has a powerful impact on Russians, young and old. Unfortunately, this messaging, once only appealing to Russians, has seeped into consciousness of proper Europeans.
Trump's "America First" brand has provided Putin with the necessary validation to support Alexandr Dugin's structural analysis of the current international order. Trump's search for narrow nationalistic interests drives wedges between Europe and the U.S. Europe, now stripped of its' moral obligation to follow with American policy, is free to set policy that meets its own immediate needs - including energy security policy with Russia.
Putin's bet on Trump Backfired? The U.S. acts alone and is "paranoic" and "the West" is split. Putin Wins Bet w/Trump.
It may be a tough proposition for the American liberals to accept but I believe Trump would have won anyway with or without the Russian meddling. It will do a world of good for the Americans to do some soul searching instead of mere denial to see where America really is now, how it got there and where it should go from here. Trump will be gone someday one way or another but the root causes of this insanity are likely to stay unless they are properly dealt with.
2
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for being thousands of miles away -- But make no mistake about it, Trump wouldn't have won the election without help from Russian meddling and the ELECTORAL COLLEGE. You can Google what that is.
As is, he lost the popular vote by around 3 MILLION.
Another thing.
The majority of Americans did enough "soul searching" by not wanting him in the White House to begin with.
As is, he lost the popular vote by around 3 MILLION.
Another thing.
The majority of Americans did enough "soul searching" by not wanting him in the White House to begin with.
6
Putin is not stupid. We can't count on that. He is a strategist. If one scenario doesn't succeed, he has other ideas. And unlike Trump he has experience, knowledgeable advisors, and doesn't waste his time with being the clown. He doesn't denegrate his agencies. He listens. Trump plays his role like a reality actor. We need a smarter leader.
4
And so the US has to layoff 755 embassy workers many of whom process visa applications for Russians wishing to visit the US. thus slowing the processing of such applications. Seems to me that the Russians may be shooting themselves in the foot on this.
I'm not even sure Putin seriously wanted Trump to win - it was such a long shot at best. The point of the interference was to sow chaos and enmity, to weaken the repute of America's system of democracy - maybe to cultivate some contacts on the bitter fringes. All very successful, even if Trump had lost. The Russians would certainly liked to have an embittered Trump screaming on his own TV show, with all his embittered, volatile and armed followers bouncing around out there. I can easily see Putin preferring a competent, predictable enemy like Clinton, to the wild loony he's trying to work with now. All the "Putin's puppet" analysis? I don't see it. Realistically, a puppet needs some discipline. Could have been Pence,maybe, he's got major self discipline. Not Trump.
Putin, our Democracy can and will withstand you.
2
Correction : A coalition of Democrats passed the sanctions bill ?
It passed with 49-51 in the Senate
and 418-3 in the House . That is decidedly bi - partisan .
It passed with 49-51 in the Senate
and 418-3 in the House . That is decidedly bi - partisan .
2
Congress needs to act for the sake of our institutions and the office of presidency. When will they?
3
Given Putin's egregious transgressions against his neighbors and against his own people as well as against us as Americans, we must retaliate as severely as possible without provoking armed conflict. Both Putin and Trump must get the message in no uncertain terms that a third-rate kleptocratic dictatorship must be taught its place and that Trump's perverse Russian romance will end NOW.
4
Maybe a spectacular failure re sanctions, but an amazing success in the chaos and dysfunction it has brought to our political system, civil society and our relationship with our allies. Like the 9/11 terrorist hijackers, I'm sure that Putin & Co. we're surprised and elated at the extent of their triumph. Certainly one of the most successful intelligence operations in history-installing your asset as ruler of your rival state, the most powerful in the world.
4
It appears Putin is now finding out what many millions of us in America already knew. You cannot take the presidential pretender at his word or believe he can deliver on any of his ever changing, misleading, and confusing promises. Welcome to our world.
2
The Russians interfered in our 2016 election and favored Trump. Their intent was to disrupt the American electorial process and later our government.
Do not be surprised when very damaging info comes out on Trump. This would be another win for the Russians and undermine all entire form of government.
Do not be surprised when very damaging info comes out on Trump. This would be another win for the Russians and undermine all entire form of government.
6
If the Russians cost Hillary her rightful place as President; and if the Russians calculated that a Trump presidency would be more incline to soften sanctions, then the Russian lost on both fronts. With a Trump presidency, the Russians see turmoil, chaos and frosty reception from both theRepublican and Democratic parties. Did not the Russians calculate that a chaotic Trump presidency only strengthen the resolve of the US constitution and the institutions that it gave birth to. Putin miscalculated that the President is not greater than the constitutional institutions and the forthcoming America's wrath directed toward Russia for its alleged meddling. In Trump, the Russians lost and gained nothing; regardless of the president's allegiance, no man or woman is greater than the constitution, a concept alien to the Putin authoritarian regime...
2
Maybe Putin should have looked up the word democracy, or maybe, at the least, read about how our government works, before he made alliances with the likes of Trump. Our president is not a dictator. What he may have thought Trump may be able to do for him is not going to come to be. Congress, even though it is run by Republicans, managed to do the right thing, for once, and overwhelmingly voted on the sanctions against Russia and Putin. There are some things not even Republicans will put up with.
3
I have read the Times virtually every day since 1984 and can still remember Mr. Sanger's superb reportage as Tokyo bureau chief. And I write now to say that this is the most important and lucid news analysis I have ever read in this paper. Tom Pitoniak, PhD
1
A lot of misfiring coming out the 2016 elections. Hmm...no matter how much people and groups try to control "things", is as much as they send things off into unpredictable directions. There is no precision in these political strikes. For either side.
Trump stopped US support for the rebel forces in Syria basically turning the country over to Al-Assad, Putin, and the Russians. In the Ukraine no one needed to help Putin after the German industrialists coerced Merkel into abandoning the Ukraine for Russian energy - that was under Obama but it was a European fight and they walked away. So Congress extends sanctions. Putin gets Syria and the Ukraine and we'll see how long the sanctions stand
What are you talking about? German industrialists didn't "coerce" Merkel into abandoning the Ukraine for Russian energy, under Obama or anyone else.
Please, get your facts straight.
Please, get your facts straight.
The USSR/Russia has been bent on the destruction of the USA for its entire existence. We must settle for nothing less that the death of Putin and the annihilation of Russia.
1
Backfires? Hardly. US is at its weakest and Russia is strongest since the times of Soviet Union. Russia effectively defeated US and their allies in Syria and held its own in Ukraine, having expanded its territory by annexing Crimea. Saying that Putin's alleged support for Trump's presidency "backfired" would imply that somehow Russia would be better off by letting Hilary Clinton become President, which is an absurd statement to make. So Trump did not remove some sanctions as Putin might have hoped. That is not a big deal for Putin and Russia. US elites must disabuse themselves of the thought that they grant other countries happiness or misery by congressional votes. They may do that for Honduras, though even that is now questionable, but not Russia.
3
People that work for and with Trump end up being fired, quitting, going broke and in general just being disappointed. Putin, ironically, is learning this lesson too.
1
Trump is a happy man because he is an uncomplicated man.
For him, the films "Hunt for Red October" or "Crimson Tide" are heartfelt (if boring) paeans to making a deal. The details? Who has time for that?
Trump probably thinks that the Vilnius Schoolmaster gave up the Red October because, as the film sardonically mentions at the end, of real estate opportunities in the Midwest and New England.
And in Crimson Tide, I deeply fear Trump's sentiment is that Gene Hackman's character gave up way too easily.
You know, this gives me an idea. After this is all over, in half a year or so, why not hire Trump as a through-the-looking-glass movie reviewer.
Give him big enough type size below the fold, he turns to butter, I hear.
For him, the films "Hunt for Red October" or "Crimson Tide" are heartfelt (if boring) paeans to making a deal. The details? Who has time for that?
Trump probably thinks that the Vilnius Schoolmaster gave up the Red October because, as the film sardonically mentions at the end, of real estate opportunities in the Midwest and New England.
And in Crimson Tide, I deeply fear Trump's sentiment is that Gene Hackman's character gave up way too easily.
You know, this gives me an idea. After this is all over, in half a year or so, why not hire Trump as a through-the-looking-glass movie reviewer.
Give him big enough type size below the fold, he turns to butter, I hear.
Which is why Trump is president. All this Trump Russia stuff could have been exposed before the election, but it's much more useful after Trump was selected as president.
"Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ...We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays.
They're in your head.
"Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ...We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of." Edward Bernays.
They're in your head.
Well, at least we had a few days in which both Putin and McConnell felt pushback from their cynical anti-democracy tactics and schemes.
2
Mr. Sanger, you've been had. I think Putin and Trump are snickering now. This is Russia's softball reaction (Russian nationals will be cut from the US Embassy staff, not even Americans!) to a thoroughly staged "strain" on relations between the two. Could this be a planned response to the Congressional sanctions bill with the intended outcome being to head off speculation of collusion at the pass? This would be child's play for these two.
1
and tying those small hands didn't take much rope neither! haha
3
"Putin Bet Trump Would Improve Ties. It’s Backfiring." -- Trump just outsourced ties and made them hang longer. I'll bet Putin doesn't even wear 44.01's haberdashery.
1
Except that it looks like Kelly could be just the one to help Vlad the Bad and Trump, too. The General will keep the White House shipshape and as long as 45 and family keep quiet, the brand will be safe and the country? Well, martial law will keep that under control, too.
1
Absolute nothing about real collusion with a foreign power by the Chair of the Democratic National Committee!
Learn the name Imran Awan well, folks. It's going to come down are your heads hard!
Learn the name Imran Awan well, folks. It's going to come down are your heads hard!
None of us know what intelligence leaks that Putin may have gotten from Trump though it's doubtful he remembers much of what he has been told.
China is the primary beneficiary from worsening relations between the United States and Russia. China is a far, far more dangerous enemy - Russia will never be strong enough to take on the United States one-on-one, let alone the US and the EU together. China, on the other hand, will be able to do just that, and they will be able to do it sooner than you all think.
It's a shame to see Americans losing sight of the big picture here, but that fault lies squarely with the US media, who are doing the bidding of certain business interests (gas, defense) with a short-term pecuniary interest in having the US and Russia at each other's throats. In the long-run, this will not help improve the US's strategic position vis-a-vis China. If China can count on Russia as a faithful ally there will be nothing to stop China from conquering Asia, and with it, the world.
Russia wants to be an independent power that is neither the lapdog of the Europeans or the Chinese. We should be attempting to help them be just that, rather than to drive them in the hands of our archenemy, China.
It's a shame to see Americans losing sight of the big picture here, but that fault lies squarely with the US media, who are doing the bidding of certain business interests (gas, defense) with a short-term pecuniary interest in having the US and Russia at each other's throats. In the long-run, this will not help improve the US's strategic position vis-a-vis China. If China can count on Russia as a faithful ally there will be nothing to stop China from conquering Asia, and with it, the world.
Russia wants to be an independent power that is neither the lapdog of the Europeans or the Chinese. We should be attempting to help them be just that, rather than to drive them in the hands of our archenemy, China.
2
What's with the assertion that "a year after the Russian effort to interfere in the American presidential election came to light". Where has anything come to light concerning electoral manipulation? Anything? Shame on the Times, and not for the first time.
2
If Putin is really the KGB trained expert media has made him out to be, from a psychological standpoint, he'd have known Trump would make a very pliable puppet. And he is. Putin knows more about Trump than the vast majority of our citizens.
Maybe Putin thought that Trump could issue unchecked edicts in this country like Putin does in Russia. At least Congress stepped up and just said no to the great deal maker.
Maybe Putin thought that Trump could issue unchecked edicts in this country like Putin does in Russia. At least Congress stepped up and just said no to the great deal maker.
1
I think it is a misconception that unless the Russian's hijacking of the US presidential elections produces some sort of very specific gain (lifting of sanctions, advantages in Syria or Ukraine or wherever) that hijacking should be considered a failure for Russia.
No!: the hijacking was a tremendous, unprecedented, sustained success for Russia for this one single reason -- it put a completely unhinged, incomptetent and corrupt creature right in the center of Russia's main adversary!
With that achieved, it is almost completely irrelevant what happens regarding issues such as sanctions etc., or whether Russia directly controls the creature they put into the White House.
What matters is that this unhinged, incomptetent and corrupt (and orange, for some reason) creature will continue to do grave harm to the US, on fundamental and structural levels, from the inside out, thus critically weakening Russia's main adversary in ways Russia could never have hoped to achieve when attacking from the outside.
At this point Putin can just lean back and gleefully watch the carnage unfold on a daily basis. It's like putting a monkey in the driver seat of a high-speed train, if you want the train to crash. Once the monkey is in, and the train is running, your work is done.
No!: the hijacking was a tremendous, unprecedented, sustained success for Russia for this one single reason -- it put a completely unhinged, incomptetent and corrupt creature right in the center of Russia's main adversary!
With that achieved, it is almost completely irrelevant what happens regarding issues such as sanctions etc., or whether Russia directly controls the creature they put into the White House.
What matters is that this unhinged, incomptetent and corrupt (and orange, for some reason) creature will continue to do grave harm to the US, on fundamental and structural levels, from the inside out, thus critically weakening Russia's main adversary in ways Russia could never have hoped to achieve when attacking from the outside.
At this point Putin can just lean back and gleefully watch the carnage unfold on a daily basis. It's like putting a monkey in the driver seat of a high-speed train, if you want the train to crash. Once the monkey is in, and the train is running, your work is done.
5
People keep referring to Russia's superpower status and former glory. What glory? It was rotting, its people were political prisoners of an oligarchic system under Communism and is now continuing to be one again, this time throw in the ultra conservative Orthodox church. Its population in the small cities and towns are withering away, as they did under Communism. Yes, they have a gazillion nuclear bombs but what else do they have but gold plated glitz covering the people being robbed blind by a handful of money men?
I don't think we are great shakes either, with our government riddled with greed and now with a clown as president. But so far, we have laws that are, thankfully, keeping us from a petty, tinpot dictator's whims, who while makes ridiculous pronouncements, is still somewhat reined in - so far.
Putin is a whole other story, compared to our fool. He consolidated his power with a sure KGB grasp of treachery. His subjects are subtly terrorized, something that is in their DNA from at least a thousand years of terror.
What will he do now with Trump? Stay tuned. The one thing Trump has in his favor is that he is the president of a country that is laundering Russia's ill-gotten gain and that's what Putin needs - now.
I think all the brouhaha is a show. There is too much money held by a few men and women to rock the boat now. Remember, Trump is the Little King of New York real estate, the oligarch's vault, and may be in the thrall of all those rich, rich Russians.
I don't think we are great shakes either, with our government riddled with greed and now with a clown as president. But so far, we have laws that are, thankfully, keeping us from a petty, tinpot dictator's whims, who while makes ridiculous pronouncements, is still somewhat reined in - so far.
Putin is a whole other story, compared to our fool. He consolidated his power with a sure KGB grasp of treachery. His subjects are subtly terrorized, something that is in their DNA from at least a thousand years of terror.
What will he do now with Trump? Stay tuned. The one thing Trump has in his favor is that he is the president of a country that is laundering Russia's ill-gotten gain and that's what Putin needs - now.
I think all the brouhaha is a show. There is too much money held by a few men and women to rock the boat now. Remember, Trump is the Little King of New York real estate, the oligarch's vault, and may be in the thrall of all those rich, rich Russians.
1
Hello,
Why do I write? No one will read the 600th comment. I don't mind talking to myself, I guess. I think Putin wanted to weaken America, he certainly succeeded at that. Confusion reigns, could our government organize a response to a Russian invasion of the Baltics? Or any other bit of adventurism? Our enemy is us, and we need thoughtful people to mitigate, not fix, our world in crisis.
Why do I write? No one will read the 600th comment. I don't mind talking to myself, I guess. I think Putin wanted to weaken America, he certainly succeeded at that. Confusion reigns, could our government organize a response to a Russian invasion of the Baltics? Or any other bit of adventurism? Our enemy is us, and we need thoughtful people to mitigate, not fix, our world in crisis.
4
I feel you, as a fellow New Englander, not easily bamboozled by NYC con men. Most of us attempt to make sense of what is. Sometimes there is no sense, no reality, only the theater of what is.
Many of us have been fighting slightly on social media, occasionally pleading for the unredeemable as an alternative (Scaramucci) merely because he made good entertainment. Once I made up my mind that this is a reality tv show, with an ending where a bellicose lout has his assets seized and is found guilty of conspiracy and conspiracy to launder money and other RICO charges.
We all have our dreams, we all have our hopes and opinions. I totally get it, we all right, in the hope someone feels the way we do, or agrees with our summation.
Many of us have been fighting slightly on social media, occasionally pleading for the unredeemable as an alternative (Scaramucci) merely because he made good entertainment. Once I made up my mind that this is a reality tv show, with an ending where a bellicose lout has his assets seized and is found guilty of conspiracy and conspiracy to launder money and other RICO charges.
We all have our dreams, we all have our hopes and opinions. I totally get it, we all right, in the hope someone feels the way we do, or agrees with our summation.
1
Sanctions are a good response. Based on Putin's reaction and petty attacks on our election they appear to be really eating at them.
1
You have it all wrong! Putin got exactly what he wanted and much much more--he got chaos at the highest level of our government. He got a USA much diminished in the eyes of allies and enemies alike. He got the undermining of democracy. What important matter did he not get--the return of a couple of Dachas???? David
3
The exchange of words and actions between US and Putin does not need a great deal of high level analysis. It only needs a read into Russian history-go back to the first Romanov.
Typical Russian speak; " we want a better relationship" Translation: "we want a free hand to do what we want in Europe and other countries".
We can ignore the fact that Trump is just a meaningless icon on the desktop of US history-for Russia, just a person to maneuver and use.
To improve the relationship it would take a President with Secretary of State to sit down with Putin and explain to Putin: " Well, comrade Vladimir Vladimirovich, we can be at least,not enemies, and here is the position of America and the position of President Trump in order to do that. Mr Trump now knows that Russia did interfere in the US election and is doing it to other countries-he(and we) demand that Russia desist immediately from such activities. Furthermore, Russia will pull back in Ukraine and in conjunction with Ukrainian government, establish a firm new border line. This border may include some of the territory in eastern Ukraine.There will be no more military action in that area. Additionally, Russia will remove all Russian troops from Belarus over a 6 month period.
That will be a beginning. This is a new beginning and we going to begin a new way of working with you. Over time, sanctions may be slowly removed or they may be greatly increased. It is up to Russia."
Typical Russian speak; " we want a better relationship" Translation: "we want a free hand to do what we want in Europe and other countries".
We can ignore the fact that Trump is just a meaningless icon on the desktop of US history-for Russia, just a person to maneuver and use.
To improve the relationship it would take a President with Secretary of State to sit down with Putin and explain to Putin: " Well, comrade Vladimir Vladimirovich, we can be at least,not enemies, and here is the position of America and the position of President Trump in order to do that. Mr Trump now knows that Russia did interfere in the US election and is doing it to other countries-he(and we) demand that Russia desist immediately from such activities. Furthermore, Russia will pull back in Ukraine and in conjunction with Ukrainian government, establish a firm new border line. This border may include some of the territory in eastern Ukraine.There will be no more military action in that area. Additionally, Russia will remove all Russian troops from Belarus over a 6 month period.
That will be a beginning. This is a new beginning and we going to begin a new way of working with you. Over time, sanctions may be slowly removed or they may be greatly increased. It is up to Russia."
Putin would greatly help US-Russian relations by openly admitting that he made a big mistake by interfering in our 2016 election. He could release the material on Donald J Trump that he was holding to control Trump, expose the Russian hackers, release all records of meetings of the Trump people with Russian agents and businessmen, tell the world why Donald won't release his tax returns, and give testimony under oath before Senate, House, and Mueller investigators.
Putin could apologize to Hillary Clinton and tell the world it was a big mistake made by some one else and that he is very sorry. Sigh!
Putin could apologize to Hillary Clinton and tell the world it was a big mistake made by some one else and that he is very sorry. Sigh!
2
Any intelligent American, that is, anyone who doesn't take the declarations of Presidental candidates at face value, knew during the campaign that in terms of foreign policy (as it's called) it wouldn't make any difference whatsoever who got into the White House, because the President doesn't give orders, he or (potentially) she follows them: the US has been in a state of perpetual warfare for 16 years and that's going to continue. The Neo-conmen outlined it all in their document Project for a New American Century (Sept 2000) and they've been calling the shots all this time.
Putin is also intelligent and, moreover, informed about these political realities. (He couldn't possibly not be.) There is no reason, therefore, that Russia would have wasted time and money getting Trump elected. That's a fantasy for which no evidence has been presented. (Who needs evidence when you have such a fantastic propaganda machine?) But repeating this lie over and over provides a platform for mounting any number of other accusations and insinuations. The richest line in this article is the comment on Russia's "aggressive modernization" of its military. The strategy of the US government's propaganda is to project onto its chosen enemies all its own aggressions and intentions, thereby always diverting attention away from what it's doing and planning, causing an ignorant populous to identify with the litany of self-righteous "goodness" that underlies the endless hypocritical accusations.
Putin is also intelligent and, moreover, informed about these political realities. (He couldn't possibly not be.) There is no reason, therefore, that Russia would have wasted time and money getting Trump elected. That's a fantasy for which no evidence has been presented. (Who needs evidence when you have such a fantastic propaganda machine?) But repeating this lie over and over provides a platform for mounting any number of other accusations and insinuations. The richest line in this article is the comment on Russia's "aggressive modernization" of its military. The strategy of the US government's propaganda is to project onto its chosen enemies all its own aggressions and intentions, thereby always diverting attention away from what it's doing and planning, causing an ignorant populous to identify with the litany of self-righteous "goodness" that underlies the endless hypocritical accusations.
2
Why in the world are there more than 755 diplomats in Russia? How many more are there? Gees I really wanted Hillary to win. She would have never been duped by Putin/ Russia. Good to see the Congress overriding trump before he interfered with sanctions.
1
If you think this is anywhere close to the cold war or that Russia is a superpower you shouldn't be speaking in the public forum because you have no facts. Russia is a regional power at best. It is a petrostate that has no real economy. It's nuclear arsenal is ageing and no where near the tremendous destructive capability of the U.S. and most interestingly they have no missile defense system which the U.S. has already deployed and would stop any retaliatory strike by the Russians.
Obama was correct in not confronting Russia directly because Putin's dictatorship will collapse soon enough like EVERY single dictatorship in HISTORY.
The Russians can't afford to maintain a constant level of nuclear preparedness, yes even with the $200 billion Putin stole.
This is a joke to even consider that Russia is anywhere near the raw power of the United States of America. The reason Russian used cyber weapons to install Donald is just clear evidence that they cant afford to confront the only real world super power left.
This is coming from someone who despises American exceptionalism but adores the founding fathers and their contribution to liberal democracy.
Obama was correct in not confronting Russia directly because Putin's dictatorship will collapse soon enough like EVERY single dictatorship in HISTORY.
The Russians can't afford to maintain a constant level of nuclear preparedness, yes even with the $200 billion Putin stole.
This is a joke to even consider that Russia is anywhere near the raw power of the United States of America. The reason Russian used cyber weapons to install Donald is just clear evidence that they cant afford to confront the only real world super power left.
This is coming from someone who despises American exceptionalism but adores the founding fathers and their contribution to liberal democracy.
According to "Rolf Mowatt-Larssen, who has served in a number of senior intelligence roles for the United States, including in Russia... 'We’ve been in a new Cold War for some time now. Any hope for a short-term improvement in relations is gone.'"
Russia may be a regional power, as commenter Commons says, but they're a former world power that was humiliated by its loss of prestige; they dream of regaining their glory in a restored Russian Empire; their leader is a former Soviet agent, a highly intelligent, well educated, and calculating man, unlike our Dervish-in-Chief; and then there's the "very aggressive modernization program they’re embarked on with their strategic nuclear capability" mentioned by James R. Clapper Jr., the former director of national intelligence and a veteran of the Cold War. Don't underestimate them.
Russia may be a regional power, as commenter Commons says, but they're a former world power that was humiliated by its loss of prestige; they dream of regaining their glory in a restored Russian Empire; their leader is a former Soviet agent, a highly intelligent, well educated, and calculating man, unlike our Dervish-in-Chief; and then there's the "very aggressive modernization program they’re embarked on with their strategic nuclear capability" mentioned by James R. Clapper Jr., the former director of national intelligence and a veteran of the Cold War. Don't underestimate them.
1
The sad fact of the matter is this.
There is a percentage of American's that applaud the Russians for getting their choice of elected officials into office. i.e Donald, Tillerson, Sessions and of course the SCOTUS.
So there you have it, a communist country not only meddled in, they contacted Republican Campaign officials during an election, leaked emails from the DNC party and yet the majority of Republicans not only endorsed it they voted for it.
Here's a quote from a true American Patriot!
"Russia, if you can find those 30,000 emails from Crooked Hillary you just might be rewarded" President Donald Trump 2016
And they voted for it!!
There is a percentage of American's that applaud the Russians for getting their choice of elected officials into office. i.e Donald, Tillerson, Sessions and of course the SCOTUS.
So there you have it, a communist country not only meddled in, they contacted Republican Campaign officials during an election, leaked emails from the DNC party and yet the majority of Republicans not only endorsed it they voted for it.
Here's a quote from a true American Patriot!
"Russia, if you can find those 30,000 emails from Crooked Hillary you just might be rewarded" President Donald Trump 2016
And they voted for it!!
1
Mr. Putin:
You have personally created this monster, and when it truly blows up Mr. Trump will realize he has been your puppet and he will turn his anger on you.
Most real politicians would avoid starting a nuclear war, but you picked the one egomaniac in the world who does not care if he destroys Washing and Moscow. You put into power a man who is totally reactionary and who has no sense of history or human decency.
Walk lightly, Mr. Putin. Russia has much to lose.
You have personally created this monster, and when it truly blows up Mr. Trump will realize he has been your puppet and he will turn his anger on you.
Most real politicians would avoid starting a nuclear war, but you picked the one egomaniac in the world who does not care if he destroys Washing and Moscow. You put into power a man who is totally reactionary and who has no sense of history or human decency.
Walk lightly, Mr. Putin. Russia has much to lose.
DT has never shown respect for the diplomatic team. The fact that Putin is sending a lot of them home, is probably not something that is going to hurt or upset DT. In fact, Putin may have done DT a favor because there will be less American diplomats there to "bring up" stuff about DT's Russian connections. I believe it's further staging by both Putin and DT. Now, what to do with the diplomats once they are back in the DT swamp, no one knows because diplomacy is not DTs strong suite. He just like reckless action.
1
The "tit-for-tat" in Putin's collaborations with Trump on attacking Hillary Clinton also doubtless involved the extensive Trump family business deals in Russia. The Mother of all conflicts of interest. After getting in bed with Trump, Putin is learning that he is the same old thief, conman, and liar that New Yorkers have always known he was.
2
Trump ran on a platform to increase fossil fuel production in the US. Hillary ran on a platform of continuing Obama's war on fossil fuels.
Russia is dependent on revenue from fossil fuels to fund its government. Russia expected Hillary to win, and their interference was intended to make it difficult for Hillary to govern, not to cost her the election, which was their worst case scenario.
The NYT narrative that the Russians wanted Trump is absurd. They knew Hillary was willing to sell out US interests in exchange for $1.3 million paid to her husband in speaking fees. They knew all along that Trump would drive a harder bargain.
Russia is dependent on revenue from fossil fuels to fund its government. Russia expected Hillary to win, and their interference was intended to make it difficult for Hillary to govern, not to cost her the election, which was their worst case scenario.
The NYT narrative that the Russians wanted Trump is absurd. They knew Hillary was willing to sell out US interests in exchange for $1.3 million paid to her husband in speaking fees. They knew all along that Trump would drive a harder bargain.
2
Putin, having orchestrated Bannon et al as Leninist/nihilists, is tickled to have Trump in the WH. Every day that goes by is interest on his small investment. Now with Kelly out of Homeland Security, I suspect that Putin will facilitate a breach. Putin will bring Trump's popularity up and down, and keep himself in the headlines, too. Ask yourself what Putin's end game might be? We're clearly still in the middle game.
1
Russia is Putin's company
And it's people his company
And it's people his company
1
You have got this totally wrong. I don't think this could have gone better for Putin if he had scripted this himself. Trump is isolated, the White House is in disarray, the US Congress is unable to conclude any major business, Putin is going to pull out our only eyes and ears from Russia, and the US is quickly falling from being a world leader to world clown. What could be better for Russia?
2
THE US OFFICIAL Strategy passed into last week, signed by an unwilling Trump, who didn't appreciate being dumped, but feared an override to his veto, places the power for US foreign policy clearly in the hands of the Congress. It is a sign of the gravity of the situation with Russia that the Congress has been able to set aside its two-tiered civil war--the GOPper against GOPper conflict that is killing off the elephants. And the unending conflict where the Democrats refuse to abandon the Constitution to submit to unleashing the tyranny of the GOPper ideological madness. The fact of the GOPpers is now in the a pincers grasp very much of its own making is lost only on them. I guess it's true that the snake that's swallowing its own tail really can't see what's going on at the other end of things. Tails, after all, don't have eyes, much less brains. Fortunately, Congress passed punitive sanctions that will pinch Russia's already weak economy. And severely constrict Putin's expansionist agenda, including his attempts to monopolize cyberspace, along with the free flow of information it provides. Knowledge is power. And Putin is farther from cutting down on the sharing of knowledge than he was before the sanctions were put in place. Effectively he is hamstrung.
1
This is really incoherent, Mister Smith.
Sanctions will hurt the Russian people, but will enhance the popularity of Putin.
2
Putin doesn't need improved relations with the USA.
He needs an enemy to sell to the Russian people.
He needs an enemy to sell to the Russian people.
1
I guess all that time and effort interfering in the U.S. Elections was wasted.
When all the facts are finally exposed about Putin's cooperation and involvement with aiding Trump and his campaign team a presidential victory, any chances of improving relations between the U.S. and Russia are doomed.
I really don't think that Putin had any strategy upon the US election. In his interviews he multiple times told that there is big difference between the candidates promises and what they will do if elected. Trump is hated by the all establishment and Russia happened be very convenient to keep him in a check.
Your post reminds me of what Putin said in his interview with, I believe, Le Figaro.
Paraphrasing: "The new president sits for the first time at his Oval Office desk and enjoys the moment. Then a knock on the door and enter a half dozen men with dark suits and briefcases. They sit down and tell him how it's done."
This is surely what happened to Obama as well.
Paraphrasing: "The new president sits for the first time at his Oval Office desk and enjoys the moment. Then a knock on the door and enter a half dozen men with dark suits and briefcases. They sit down and tell him how it's done."
This is surely what happened to Obama as well.
The article states that "Putin lost his bet." It was a lot more than a bet...it was an attempt to fix the outcome and likely had been agreed to by the Trump campaign (and it worked). If Trump had his way, the sanctions would be minimized until they could be removed; and Putin would have gotten what was promised. But the usually spineless Congress balked.
I would guess that Trump is now worried that if Putin gets angry enough, he'll start releasing the information he has about Trump and his family's financial dealings in Russia. That would serve Putin's purpose if he's looking for ways to disrupt the U.S. government.
I would guess that Trump is now worried that if Putin gets angry enough, he'll start releasing the information he has about Trump and his family's financial dealings in Russia. That would serve Putin's purpose if he's looking for ways to disrupt the U.S. government.
3
The article says Trump's hands were tied because the Congress voted to put sanctions into place.
Yes, his hands were tied figuratively. They should physically be tied behind his back when he is arrested for treason and sedition and led screaming and tweeting out of the Oval Office.
Yes, his hands were tied figuratively. They should physically be tied behind his back when he is arrested for treason and sedition and led screaming and tweeting out of the Oval Office.
3
Even the flags on the picture are looking at different directions.
1
The problem is freedom of speech suppressor Putin, regardless of who the Americans elected. Why do the Russian people let themselves be led around by the nose by authoritarian leaders all the time? Americans can at least change "leadership" every 4 years. We just need the intelligence to do it next time.
Putting "leadership" in quotation marks hits the bull's eye, Mister Shaw. Yes, Americans can kick out Tweedledee every four years and bring in Tweedledum, and not only that, they can bring back Tweedledee 4 years later. At least they can do that: yes, your use of "at least" was certainly to the point as well, because they can't do anything more, can they - not at least in the present circumstances of elite anarchy. And certainly a bit of intelligence is much needed in the populous to see what's going on. By the way, by what part of their bodies would you say the American people are being led around by their totalitarian leaders?
1
I never thought the Kremlin wanted Trump to win the election because he would make Putin's life easier. Two years ago the Russians and anyone else with common sense knew that Trump would be very bad for America.
1
I find the notion written by the NYT: "...that Donald J. Trump would treat Russia as Mr. Putin has longed to have it treated by the West. " very laughable.
The West would never treat Russia as a peer as long as Russia continues to behave as it has since the end of the Soviet era. Putin as "President" for life (regardless of title; suppression of opponents; rigging of election through control of the press, etc. ...
Nope the West wouldn't have it. (Donald Trump might ...)
Wonder why Trump hasn't Tweeted: "Fake Congress. Sad."
The West would never treat Russia as a peer as long as Russia continues to behave as it has since the end of the Soviet era. Putin as "President" for life (regardless of title; suppression of opponents; rigging of election through control of the press, etc. ...
Nope the West wouldn't have it. (Donald Trump might ...)
Wonder why Trump hasn't Tweeted: "Fake Congress. Sad."
1
Liberals are solid imperialists: Cold War, Drug War, War on Terror. We chose the Clown because the Liberal shrugged and smiled.
Denouncing Putin is hypocrisy. The CIA has spent trillions doing much worse world-wide. Obama's Libya and Bush's Iraq invasions are crimes dwarfing any pro-Trump internet funny business. Both were sold as “defense of human rights”. Wrong. Just controlling petroleum markets.
Treason is a decoy. Our clear and present danger is climate change. We are saddled with Trump because the two-party duopoly is owned by corporations determined to prevent the changes required to chart a new and sustainable course. Doing so is our only hope for survival.
As Trump delivered his July 19 Big Boss interview, cutoff of funds to covert operations against Syria were denounced as devious Kremlin plot. Nonsense. Trump is doing some good, maybe by accident. We must end all covert operations, close all 800 military bases, put our brains, money and work into carbon-free energy, global diplomacy, education, transportation, public health, housing, reforesting the earth. Otherwise we expire.
Trump is a charlatan, mountebank, demagogue, and 100% American—a home-built product of Tabloid-TV culture. Made in USA is stamped on his forehead. Don’t blame Russia. Blame the corporations whose only objective is profit at any cost and whose palace guard, the racketeers of the security complex (Intel/Military/Police) are globe-trotting merchants of death.
Denouncing Putin is hypocrisy. The CIA has spent trillions doing much worse world-wide. Obama's Libya and Bush's Iraq invasions are crimes dwarfing any pro-Trump internet funny business. Both were sold as “defense of human rights”. Wrong. Just controlling petroleum markets.
Treason is a decoy. Our clear and present danger is climate change. We are saddled with Trump because the two-party duopoly is owned by corporations determined to prevent the changes required to chart a new and sustainable course. Doing so is our only hope for survival.
As Trump delivered his July 19 Big Boss interview, cutoff of funds to covert operations against Syria were denounced as devious Kremlin plot. Nonsense. Trump is doing some good, maybe by accident. We must end all covert operations, close all 800 military bases, put our brains, money and work into carbon-free energy, global diplomacy, education, transportation, public health, housing, reforesting the earth. Otherwise we expire.
Trump is a charlatan, mountebank, demagogue, and 100% American—a home-built product of Tabloid-TV culture. Made in USA is stamped on his forehead. Don’t blame Russia. Blame the corporations whose only objective is profit at any cost and whose palace guard, the racketeers of the security complex (Intel/Military/Police) are globe-trotting merchants of death.
3
Well said! There's just one point where I think you're a little off the mark: carbon dioxide is not the villain, it's a straw man to keep attention away from the real chemical pollution that is poisoning the earth entire. And to understand "climate change" a little better, it would be good to learn about HAARP.
No backfire at all. If Clinton won, there wouldn't have been any easing of sanctions. In fact, sanctions may have increased. Trump was by far and still is the best outcome for Russia. Whether the sanctions are lifted or not, Trump has greatly diminished the US role in world affairs. That seems to be the more likely goal of the Putin administration. Lifting of sanctions would have only been an added bonus.
2
Putin seems to continually overlook the simple steps he could take to reduce, or even eliminate sanctions. Undoing his invasion of Crimea, and his support for the separatist movement he inspired and directs, would go a long way toward removing all sanctions. Not to mention that those actions would bring him into compliance with his treaty obligations.
Putin will never give up Crimea given the American backed coup in Ukraine and the neo-Nazis that were unleashed in the east of the country.
1
Too bad the promise many that an actual thaw was being approached has disintegrated. For a moment the thought of normalcy which has never existed between us seemed more than a dream. More distant at this point, but I want to think still possible.
The world is not big enough to continue the absurd posing to which we have been exposed by world leaders since the invention of the camera and much too small to ever consider using thermonuclear devices. Why our world leaders cannot or will not see this should tell all of us they are in the wrong chairs.
They must know the game of "chicken" has a way of bringing about tragedy to anyone who plays.
The world is not big enough to continue the absurd posing to which we have been exposed by world leaders since the invention of the camera and much too small to ever consider using thermonuclear devices. Why our world leaders cannot or will not see this should tell all of us they are in the wrong chairs.
They must know the game of "chicken" has a way of bringing about tragedy to anyone who plays.
I'm not sure I agree with the analysis.
For Putin, pursuing the removal of sanctions is the same as removing the sanctions ... at least in the eyes of his oligarch friends.
What he's long wanted was for us to self destruct long enough for him to increase his empire. Thus the recent expenditures in North Korea but also the numerous schemes he has in Ukraine that are also serving to enrich him.
He's playing chess; we're playing checkers.
For Putin, pursuing the removal of sanctions is the same as removing the sanctions ... at least in the eyes of his oligarch friends.
What he's long wanted was for us to self destruct long enough for him to increase his empire. Thus the recent expenditures in North Korea but also the numerous schemes he has in Ukraine that are also serving to enrich him.
He's playing chess; we're playing checkers.
This article reflects a fundamental misunderstanding of Putin's intentions. He was not seeking to improve relations with the US, but rather to destabilize the West. (Same reason he continues to support N Korea.)
Putin's goal of putting a friendlier POTUS in place was probably secondary to a goal of destabilizing his historic enemy and discrediting the entire democratic process of free elections. If enough misinformation and illicit activities influenced the outcome, then either victor (Trump or Clinton) could have had their credibility called into question. When someone in Putin's sphere of influence calls for more freedom and democracy, he can point to our situation and ask, "You want to be more like that?!?" That degradation of the beacon of free and open democracies to the larger world is the more serious long-term threat of this past election cycle.
1
President Trump would have improved relations except for the lawyer run and dominated U.S. Congress which desires to continue having Russia as enemy when Russia is acquiring new customers for its military hardware like Turkey, etc. We like President Trump because he is honest and has stated the invasion of Iraq was based on lies of CIA that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. Because of this we demand U.S. rebuild our Iraqi province with all underground utilities.
1
The comments are fascinating and helpful in understanding what has happened, but I still find this scary and would prefer diplomacy to sanctions.
1
Yes it is scary because it tends to make enemies not friends. Each country has its own problems and solutions.
Has anyone stopped to consider that Putin's strategy was in fact designed to ensure a Clinton win, but that his tactics backfired in a big way? Putin has always know that Mr. Trump was a wild card, which in a world of hair trigger massive throw weight translates into existential threat. Better the U.S. President you know hates you than the desperate one who manoeuvres himself against a domestic wall and lashes out at friend and foe just to avoid being pushed through it. Make no mistake; a Trump presidency is Putin's worst nightmare. The Putin stratagem-let's seed U.S. media with just enough "The Russians are attacking our electoral process." hearsay-came unwound with a totally unexpected-indeed zero probability offset-which was the Abedin computer disclosure made by "loose cannon" Comey.
For the first time in history, almost 50% (even Hitler didn't achieve those numbers in 1933) of a free electorate has put someone in office that they knew had limited people skills, but decided to roll the dice anyway. Perhaps unwittingly, they have labelled all Americans in the eyes of the Russians and the Chinese (and most significantly, their people) as the enemy. The days of hiding behind one's secret vote are over. The statistics tell the tale and we are all exposed because of it. Perhaps that's true democracy at last.
For the first time in history, almost 50% (even Hitler didn't achieve those numbers in 1933) of a free electorate has put someone in office that they knew had limited people skills, but decided to roll the dice anyway. Perhaps unwittingly, they have labelled all Americans in the eyes of the Russians and the Chinese (and most significantly, their people) as the enemy. The days of hiding behind one's secret vote are over. The statistics tell the tale and we are all exposed because of it. Perhaps that's true democracy at last.
3
All fake news and falsehoods, Charles. All of our intelligence agencies agree that the purpose of the Russian interference was to help Trump. Trump has done everything in his power to give Russia what it wants. As for the election, less than 50% of those who voted cast a vote for Trump. And only about 50% of the eligible voters did vote. He won the electoral college but got less votes than Clinton. Less than 25% of eligible voters voted for Trump. In any case, since when is Hitler the benchmark for a successful electoral victory?
Charles Spina wrote:
"Has anyone stopped to consider that Putin's strategy was in fact designed to ensure a Clinton win, but that his tactics backfired in a big way? ... Make no mistake; a Trump presidency is Putin's worst nightmare. ....For the first time in history, almost 50% ... of a free electorate has put someone in office that they knew had limited people skills, but decided to roll the dice anyway."
Charles wrote:
""
Charles Spina wrote:
"Has anyone stopped to consider that Putin's strategy was in fact designed to ensure a Clinton win, but that his tactics backfired in a big way? ... Make no mistake; a Trump presidency is Putin's worst nightmare. ....For the first time in history, almost 50% ... of a free electorate has put someone in office that they knew had limited people skills, but decided to roll the dice anyway."
Charles wrote:
""
2
We have a wonderful thing called 'checks and balances' in the USA. It goes toward safeguarding us from a megalomaniac (to some degree). Putin didn't understand the reigns this puts on a US president. 45 can't just do what he wants, when he wants it, unlike Putin. The real gift to Putin is having this nincompoop in the WH while things are heating up in NK.
2
While we wonder and Trump postures over his Russian connection we amp up the rhetoric of confrontation with Russia. We need to remember that Russia is more than their current czar like President. We also need to remember that both the Bush administration & the Clinton administration mishandled the transition of the Soviet Union to the Russian federation. Gorbachev gave us the perfect opportunity to guide the transition while our support for the often drunk Yeltsin & the rape of the Russian economy by powerful internal & external interests gave us Putin. That being said we need to confront the situation more intelligently & less bombastically. Sooner or later Trump will be gone but Russia with or without Putin will still be here. That doesn't mean I'm a Russian apologist, only that Trump is a distraction and a fool. Also one other concern in our dealings with Russia is the budget & staffing cuts at the State Department under Tillerson which is needed now more than ever in dealing with the complexities of an ever changing world, including Russia.
1
Speaking as a military veteran, I would prefer Putin for our president, and fill Trump's lying mouth with Gorilla Glue.
1
Six of one, half dozen of the other.
1
Putin has been lying in wait for someone like Trump to enter the political ring for many years. In fact, I would venture to speculate that Putin is the one who put the Presidential bug in Trump's ear long ago. He made such an easy mark. Make no mistake, Putin is not the loser here.
6
The Ruskies left enough "bread crumbs" as one Editorial writer and Russia expert stated. The Trump-Russia plot was meant to be discovered. Vlad-Rex played the Trumps like a fiddle and Americans will have to clean up the mess. America has been Russia's bread basket since the Cold war ended. A trillion dollars in fraud, goods and services and infra-structure attack fuels the Russian Government which is run like a crime syndicate. Medical fraud and attacks on insurance and healthcare figures in the hundreds of billions alone. Vlad would like to keep the gravy train going. Sanctions cripple this effort.
The three rules of running assets or informants undercover: Control, Control, Control. When you have lost control and assets/sources are liabilities, you tie them off or burn them up so they cant do more damage and move on. We Americans and the world are watching the pyre.
The three rules of running assets or informants undercover: Control, Control, Control. When you have lost control and assets/sources are liabilities, you tie them off or burn them up so they cant do more damage and move on. We Americans and the world are watching the pyre.
4
So offensive to say Democrats were only on board for the sanctions because they were mad about Putin's keeping Hilary out of office!! That is a totally cheap shot -- there is no evidence of it -- and it looks like a headline from Breitbart, Steve Bannon's faux-newspaper.
I'm pretty sure it was the Democrats during Obama's tenure who had the same attitude toward Russia as expressed presently. I'm pretty sure that the whole country, regardless of party understands what they are dealing with when they deal with Putin. Except Trump and his band of Putin sycophants, Flynn, Manafort, etc.
Let's stop casting everything the democrats do as some sort of "payback". The Democrats are not the Republicans and don't share their values or their methods.
I'm pretty sure it was the Democrats during Obama's tenure who had the same attitude toward Russia as expressed presently. I'm pretty sure that the whole country, regardless of party understands what they are dealing with when they deal with Putin. Except Trump and his band of Putin sycophants, Flynn, Manafort, etc.
Let's stop casting everything the democrats do as some sort of "payback". The Democrats are not the Republicans and don't share their values or their methods.
12
We wouldn't be in this mess if the people of this country didn't let Trump get away with not showing his taxes. If he indeed has no financial obligations to Russia then maybe I'd give him the benefit of the doubt in trying to work with Putin. But I don't know so I can't trust him. As for the disinformation campaign - that's on the American people for being lazy and stupid.
7
Mr. Mueller may well get access to Grifter-Boy's tax returns, but I'm betting that the worst they'll show is that he's a disgusting tax fraud, using somebody else's losses to avoid paying taxes for almost two decades. There may be some legitimate Russian income shown, but the real deals would be under the table, through offshore banks, either huge loans from Putin's mafia buddies propping up the shaky wealth that is his definition of "manhood," or actual criminal activity like money-laundering, or both. He's desperate to conceal the fact that he's not the 'manly man" his base thinks he is, that he's in fact a business failure and a tax cheat, and that he may well be more than a petty crook to boot. He's afraid Mueller will ferret out the sordid truth, and since he can't pardon himself, we may get to enjoy the delicious irony of locking him up. The treason part is probably unintentional, not about betraying his country--just about the money.
1
Don't worry there is still plenty of time for Trump to do Putin's bidding, after all they still have the golden shower tapes hanging over his head.
7
Mr. Putin, if it makes you feel any better, you're not the only one with a bad case of Buyer's Remorse.
7
Backfires? hardly. The chess game has just begun. After that silly RESET button of the democrats, what Putin has got to lose?
3
Love the Kennan reference!!
1
Just an awful, poorly written article. Mostly opinion and almost no news. Weak documentation from questionable sources. The author criticizes Russia, when as a propagandist that is exactly where he belongs!
1
Right. Putin's being suicidal as Mattis and McMaster negate his nukes with missile defense to Eastern Europe and Perry opens up the energy sector with more drilling and fracking, wrecking his oil sales to Europe. Idiotic argument.
1
Exactly.
The missile defense Obama refused to deploy and the energy sector he tried and failed to tamp down, both moves that benefited Putin.
The missile defense Obama refused to deploy and the energy sector he tried and failed to tamp down, both moves that benefited Putin.
While Putin no doubt fantasized about the lifting of the Magnitsky Act, I'm not sure if contributing to the humiliating defeat of his foe Hillary Clinton by an unstable ignoramus guaranteed to create division and chaos and turn Russia's historical adversary into a global laughing-stock while undermining liberal democracy worldwide quite counts as a "spectacular backfire".
2
I don't think you understand Bismarckian politics. Putin will be just fine.
4
Backfires hugely . . .
Let's call this like it is. This bill was devised to deflect attention away from the Russian hacking and all the people involved in collusion. It had a veto-proof majority so Trump didnt have to sign it. This is a WH con game.
4
It's all a vast conspiracy.
Every piece of evidence showing there is no conspiracy is really evidence of the conspiracy because the conspirators are conspiring to throw everyone off the scent.
Every piece of evidence showing there is no conspiracy is really evidence of the conspiracy because the conspirators are conspiring to throw everyone off the scent.
1
The real question now – after the tit-for-tat retaliation – is when does Putin release the kompromat on Trump? Putin’s not satisfied with a draw. He wants to win as badly as Trump, so if he does have dirt on Trump, he’s going to leak it sooner than later. We ain’t seen nothin’ yet!
4
Putin, as most of his Soviet predecessors, need an enemy. He only stands to gain from an us vs. them mentality.
The blame for the ongoing financial struggles, graft, and crackdown on opposition, in Putin's words, lands pleasantly on the United States. Further dissension only bolsters that message. Moreover, I am not convinced the sanctions do anything to the personal wealth or well-being of Putin or his ruling cronies.
The blame for the ongoing financial struggles, graft, and crackdown on opposition, in Putin's words, lands pleasantly on the United States. Further dissension only bolsters that message. Moreover, I am not convinced the sanctions do anything to the personal wealth or well-being of Putin or his ruling cronies.
1
Good, maybe Putin will put out some emails of trumps through wikileaks.
5
Maybe that's how to get Russia to stop meddling.
1
Since now Trump is too weak to do anything for Putin, the latter will will soon throw Trump under the bus.
Get ready for President Pence.
Get ready for President Pence.
4
Oh please. Putin thought that Trump would become "presidential?"
2
Putin NEVER wanted a Trump Presidency, he wanted Hillary in the White House so he could have an Obama clone to run over JUST LIKE he ran over Obama for eight years. The ONLY people to directly scrutinize the DNC server for the source of the alleged Russian hack are in the employ of the DNC. Crowdstrike, a cyber security firm whose owner has gifted $10 million to the Clinton Foundation and the max to the Clinton Campaign released it's "evidence" to our government intel folks , who based their October 2016 hacking report SOLEY on what Crowdstrike gave them, not on ANYTHING they actually determined internally, or saw themselves first hand. I, for one, DO NOT trust Crowdstrike to be honest, as experts in their field have claimed that Crowdstrike is loyal to the hands that feed them and have released questionable findings in other cases as well. If Russia did indeed interfere, it was to make Trump look bad because, in the words of James Comey " they made it so easy to find, it was as if they wanted us to know who it was!" If they wanted us to know, then they knew that it would look very bad to the public, turning them almost certainly toward Hillary. But the public was not fooled by them or Hillary's bogus claims of Trump's ties to Russia, and the total lack of proof seems to be leading in that direction. In my opinion Putin NEVER bet on Trump, but rather that Hillary would continue Obama's weak foreign policies which would work greatly to his advantage!!!
3
All falsehoods and conspiracy theories, Michael. In fact, your falsehoods are the same ones that we are seeing here from any number of other commenters. Something tells me you didn't come up with them on your own. Have you been watching Fox or reading Breitbart lately? Have the Russians been seeding the right wing fake news ecosystem again?
All of our intelligence agencies agree that the purpose of the Russian interference was to help Trump. The same agencies tell us it was the Russians who stole the DNC information. The public already knows quite a bit about Trump's significant ties to Russia, and the public knows only a fraction of what Mr. Mueller knows. Who is the president now, Michael? Is your president Secretary Clinton?
Do you believe what you are saying here? Do you know it is false but are posting it anyway, as a troll or for some other malicious purpose? Do you simply not care whether it is true or not? In other words, are you mainly motivated by the notion that anything your side does is fine no matter how unethical or malignant or destructive it is?
All of our intelligence agencies agree that the purpose of the Russian interference was to help Trump. The same agencies tell us it was the Russians who stole the DNC information. The public already knows quite a bit about Trump's significant ties to Russia, and the public knows only a fraction of what Mr. Mueller knows. Who is the president now, Michael? Is your president Secretary Clinton?
Do you believe what you are saying here? Do you know it is false but are posting it anyway, as a troll or for some other malicious purpose? Do you simply not care whether it is true or not? In other words, are you mainly motivated by the notion that anything your side does is fine no matter how unethical or malignant or destructive it is?
3
Putin bet the Trump would destroy trust in America abroad and create chaos at home. He won that bet beyond his wildest schemes.
Nothing consequential has happened because of US-Russia relations. Putin's allies in Congress are still in place; the Trump family remains as indebted as ever to Russia for laundering money to cover Trumps disastrous business over the last 15 years. Trump remain in place to pay Putin back, even as all of the witnesses to collusion on the Russian side have been removed from the scene - including the former Ambassador.
The elections are as fertile a place for mischief as ever for Putin- particularly with Trump enabling massive voter suppression, and spreading lies from the White House itself.
Nothing consequential has happened because of US-Russia relations. Putin's allies in Congress are still in place; the Trump family remains as indebted as ever to Russia for laundering money to cover Trumps disastrous business over the last 15 years. Trump remain in place to pay Putin back, even as all of the witnesses to collusion on the Russian side have been removed from the scene - including the former Ambassador.
The elections are as fertile a place for mischief as ever for Putin- particularly with Trump enabling massive voter suppression, and spreading lies from the White House itself.
1
It was said last year: interference in the US election was pretty much an act of war that the Soviets would never have tried. Putin and his Rich plutocratic oligarch friends - a private kleptocracy, really - finally got overly ambitious about who they could steal and fleece from...
All the mock outrage and surprise aside, Russia needs to own that Putin got caught with his hand in the cookie jar.
All the mock outrage and surprise aside, Russia needs to own that Putin got caught with his hand in the cookie jar.
2
The Game is not over yet. Putin didn't have one objective but several: All pieces are in play on the chess board. Putin with Trump's help are unilaterally dismantling the power of the Executive Branch. With each tweet and ad-libbed speech, Trump further bricks himself into a room by himself, tuned out by the American public. Both Trump and Putin have intentionally promoted chaos, rumors, and illegal activity to discredit our democracy and reduce our credibility on the world stage.
3
Mr. Sanger shouldn't think, that just because his memory is short, ours is as well.
The Russian government - just as any other, large and small, who had any dealings with the United States at any level - was interested in the outcome of the presidential election and yes, use its influence to shape the outcome, to make it more favourable to their interests.
The stickler in this whole Russia story is that back in the Summer of 2016 the likelihood of Trump becoming the Republican candidate, let alone President, was as far fetched a fantasy as seeing unicorns on 5th Avenue.
Nobody expected it to happen, not in the US political circles, not outside and certainly not in Moscow, or Tokyo, or Berlin. Even on election night every indication pointed towards a Clinton win (for goodness sake, the Democrats even rented the Jacob Javits centre with its glass ceiling for effect).
To assume, that the Russians - even if they wanted to interfere, invested everything they got into Trump, just because he wasn't Hillary is nonsense.
What if Rubio, or Perry, or Jeb Bush made it to the candidacy?
This is such an overblown bad fairy tale, it hurts.
The Russian government - just as any other, large and small, who had any dealings with the United States at any level - was interested in the outcome of the presidential election and yes, use its influence to shape the outcome, to make it more favourable to their interests.
The stickler in this whole Russia story is that back in the Summer of 2016 the likelihood of Trump becoming the Republican candidate, let alone President, was as far fetched a fantasy as seeing unicorns on 5th Avenue.
Nobody expected it to happen, not in the US political circles, not outside and certainly not in Moscow, or Tokyo, or Berlin. Even on election night every indication pointed towards a Clinton win (for goodness sake, the Democrats even rented the Jacob Javits centre with its glass ceiling for effect).
To assume, that the Russians - even if they wanted to interfere, invested everything they got into Trump, just because he wasn't Hillary is nonsense.
What if Rubio, or Perry, or Jeb Bush made it to the candidacy?
This is such an overblown bad fairy tale, it hurts.
1
Fake news, Waldo.
All of our intelligence agencies agree that the Russians interfered in order to help Mr. Trump. Who shall we believe, Waldo? Should we believe Mr. Putin who murders and imprisons his political opponents? Should we believe Mr. Trump who is, in his own words, the most honest president we have ever had? Or should we believe our own intelligence agencies? Moreover, your story line makes no sense. A Trump win was always within the margin of error. Surely there is at least one person in Russia who does understand statistics?
All of our intelligence agencies agree that the Russians interfered in order to help Mr. Trump. Who shall we believe, Waldo? Should we believe Mr. Putin who murders and imprisons his political opponents? Should we believe Mr. Trump who is, in his own words, the most honest president we have ever had? Or should we believe our own intelligence agencies? Moreover, your story line makes no sense. A Trump win was always within the margin of error. Surely there is at least one person in Russia who does understand statistics?
1
I thoroughly disagree with this analysis.
First, Putin has successfully intervened in an American election. Who knows what his hand will be in future elections?
Next, what better way for Trump-Putin to mislead their true relationship than to enact a disagreement?
I am surprised you accepted this face value.
First, Putin has successfully intervened in an American election. Who knows what his hand will be in future elections?
Next, what better way for Trump-Putin to mislead their true relationship than to enact a disagreement?
I am surprised you accepted this face value.
2
Russia is no longer a superpower,they have half the population they had 25 years ago,they do have nukes but so do Israel and Pakistan.
Do Israel & Pakistan have a fleet of submarines?
1
But Putin must surely be happy at the chaos Trump brings to the United States. Who needs Russian interference when you have Trump and his GOP happily engaging in voter suppression? Not to mention a right wing propaganda machine which is about as close to state run as you can currently get in the U.S. Endorsed by President Trump himself and used without conscience or embarrassment by GOP politicians to advance their power.
3
This is speculation based on a bunch of assumptions that can't be proved which lead to one man's opinion. An opinion I strongly disagree with. If we are a weaker country because of the dysfunction of the Trump administration and it benefits Russia you can't label this outcome as a failure. If it was a bet it was more like "Heads Putin Wins Tails We Lose"
2
I am not convinced anything is "backfiring." Every pro wrestling league needs a heel. Every melodrama needs a villain. Trump is doing yeoman work as Trump's heel/villain for the Russian audience, and Putin is returning the favor, making Trump the hero for the American audience.
1
Equally likely: Trump's bet on Putin.
1
With Trump's election Putin wins either way. Either Trump removes sanctions and makes deals with Russia or the US is in such utter disarray that it is no position to act as a strategic obstacle to Russia's larger plans. The one thing that was certain after Trump won the Presidency was the US's role in the world would significantly diminish. That can only help Putin. Putin won all that he wanted the minute Trump took office.
2
Thank you, Congress of both parties, for standing up to the Russians, who made a successful attack on our national election, on our very democracy.
Their victory is as devastating to our way of life as armed attack, for Putin has helped fashion a United States where citizens are divided and our president is weak and foolish, assuring - at least for the moment - the USA's diminished position on the world stage. But Congress has pushed back, in the name of all of us; thereby demonstrating the strength in our Separation of Powers, and of the United States of America.
Their victory is as devastating to our way of life as armed attack, for Putin has helped fashion a United States where citizens are divided and our president is weak and foolish, assuring - at least for the moment - the USA's diminished position on the world stage. But Congress has pushed back, in the name of all of us; thereby demonstrating the strength in our Separation of Powers, and of the United States of America.
2
Putin wanted to create chaos. He did. That was his goal. He won. We lost. Whatever he expected from President Trump was secondary. Creating chaos was his first objective.
2
Putin is stronger than ever, and the US is in chaotic free-fall. Sanctions will only increase the average Russian's distrust and dislike of the US, as they affect only working-class Russians, while having minimal effect on Putin and his oligarch buddies. How could that be considered diminished?
1
Putin is stronger than ever, and the US is in chaotic free-fall.
=======================
Putin and Russia are in a week position as the price of the only product they really export, oil, has fallen and continues to fall. The Russian military budget was cut by 25% last year because of it. US military spending will be going up as Trump rebuilds our forces.
You need to read more news. The stock market is at record highs. Consumer confidence is up. The economy grew 2.6% last quarter. Corporate profits for the first half of the year are the highest they've been since 2011.
The only thing in the US in chaotic free-fall is the Democratic party
=======================
Putin and Russia are in a week position as the price of the only product they really export, oil, has fallen and continues to fall. The Russian military budget was cut by 25% last year because of it. US military spending will be going up as Trump rebuilds our forces.
You need to read more news. The stock market is at record highs. Consumer confidence is up. The economy grew 2.6% last quarter. Corporate profits for the first half of the year are the highest they've been since 2011.
The only thing in the US in chaotic free-fall is the Democratic party
Donald Trump is appalling in so many, many ways but the most amazing thing about the collusion story is that there is no evidence that collusion occurred, either direct or circumstantial. That people believe things that are simply not so is truly disturbing.
1
Putin's bet on Trump has only somewhat backfired. This President has already done more than one thing to bolster Russian influence and Putin's power on the international scene, and he can do more without ever touching a sanction. In fact, a minuet around sanctions could easily cover less obvious activities that would play into Putin's hands. Trump, his family, and his cronies are at least guilty of tacit political collusion with Russia. It remains to be proven if he is guilty of something more explicit. Or not.
2
Who says that Putin was "betting" that if Trump won the election, Trump would treat Russia the way Putin wants Russia to be treated? In my opinion, David Sanger's analysis should be filed away in the NYTimes' "Way Off the Mark" cabinet along with its polls stating Clinton had a 90% chance of beating Trump.
Putin's aim for the past decade has been to destabilize Western unity as well as Western democracies by using a hybrid mix of soft power, and endeavor that has exceeded expectations as many in the Kremlin have openly stated.
In Trump, Putin saw an uniformed, erratic neophyte who showed no inclination to support the military and political alliances that have been the bedrock of Western unity since WWII, and for the most part, Trump has proved Putin right.
Putin wanted Trump in power to further destabilize the West, not for a reconciliation between the U.S. and Russia as Mr. Sanger surmises.
Putin's aim for the past decade has been to destabilize Western unity as well as Western democracies by using a hybrid mix of soft power, and endeavor that has exceeded expectations as many in the Kremlin have openly stated.
In Trump, Putin saw an uniformed, erratic neophyte who showed no inclination to support the military and political alliances that have been the bedrock of Western unity since WWII, and for the most part, Trump has proved Putin right.
Putin wanted Trump in power to further destabilize the West, not for a reconciliation between the U.S. and Russia as Mr. Sanger surmises.
Who says Putin was "betting" that Trump, if and when elected, would treat Russia the way Putin wanted Russia to be treated? In my opinion, David E. Sanger's analysis should be filed away in the NYTimes' "Way Off the Mark" cabinet along with its polls predicting Clinton had a 90% of beating Trump.
Putin's goal for a decade now has been to destabilize the U.S. and Western Europe, and in the process, raise Russia's stature on the the world stage. And by using a hybrid blueprint based on soft power, Putin has succeeded spectacularly.
In Trump, the Kremlin correctly saw an erratic, uninformed neophyte who showed no inclination to support Western political and military structures and alliances that have been the bedrock of Western unity since World War II. The subsequent instability in the West caused by Trump's presidency--something that has exceeded the Kremlin's expectations--is the reason why Putin wanted Trump in the White House, not for a reconciliation as Mr. Sanger surmises.
Putin's goal for a decade now has been to destabilize the U.S. and Western Europe, and in the process, raise Russia's stature on the the world stage. And by using a hybrid blueprint based on soft power, Putin has succeeded spectacularly.
In Trump, the Kremlin correctly saw an erratic, uninformed neophyte who showed no inclination to support Western political and military structures and alliances that have been the bedrock of Western unity since World War II. The subsequent instability in the West caused by Trump's presidency--something that has exceeded the Kremlin's expectations--is the reason why Putin wanted Trump in the White House, not for a reconciliation as Mr. Sanger surmises.
1
2017 Pew poll showing that only 20 percent of adults trust what they read from national news organizations like the NYT and WaPo. It was only a year ago that Republicans and Democrats agreed on the scope of the press’ influence, but 2017 now boasts a wider gap between the parties than ever before. While 77 percent of Republicans and 74 percent of Democrats thought that news criticism kept political leaders on track in 2016, now only about a third of Democrats say they really trust national news outlets, along with just 11 percent of Republicans, according to Pew.
Unsourced articles like this one based on "mind reading" of Putin's intentions are the reason
Why do you believe it has backfired? A lot is going on behind closed doors. Maybe everything public is just window dressing.
Sanctions may be a public relations problem for him, but sanctions don't really affect Putin personally. However, we are still stuck with Trump. And a Republican majority that still fails to act on important foreign policy issues. To name a few: Disruption of elections (which they were/are doing on their own); National debt issues; funding Science including full participation in Climate Change initiatives; 2-way trade with China where we don't fund N. Korea's nuclear ambitions; incentives and government funding for domestic sustainable economic growth that will keep our country strong; Diplomacy; etc..
The larger issue with Russia is how long can they get away with aggressive military action against their neighbors. Sanctions will help, but will more be required before the Russians get the message?
The larger issue with Russia is how long can they get away with aggressive military action against their neighbors. Sanctions will help, but will more be required before the Russians get the message?
Irregardless of our opinions on collusion, Putin got either what he wanted in full, or the next best thing. Chaos in our government weakens our country both at home and around the world. At home we have a government unable to govern. Around the world Russia and by extension Putin rushes in to fill the void of US leadership. Master tactician or not, Putin wins.
What is happening is not a good thing. Russia is one of the most power nations on earth. The fact that Russia is expelling 755 American diplomats is extraordinarily unfortunate, if you believe that diplomacy is a better option for settling disputes than military action between nuclear powers.
This article opens with the “observation: “a little more than a year after the Russian effort to interfere in the American presidential election came to light.” But what does the public really know? The Russians are accused of “stealing” truthful information about the workings of the DNC, and publicizing this information. Come on people, this is what the New York Times considers its mission. The Times often, and proudly, takes information it knows to have been illegally obtained, but believes to be truthful, and prints it. The CIA has itself done this sort of thing for decades. The only evidence the public has actually seen is a 25 page document prepared by US intelligence agencies that said nothing except “Trust us. We think the Russians did this. Maybe.”
The US sanctions are a consequence of media-fueled hyperbole and anger. I see great potential for harm and little prospect for benefit in the escalating brinksmanship with Mr. Putin. He is not a nice man and usually not our friend, but diplomacy is the best tool we have for dealing with him.
If the Russians deliberately hacked voting machines, that is an action of a whole different magnitude, which deserves a strong response.
This article opens with the “observation: “a little more than a year after the Russian effort to interfere in the American presidential election came to light.” But what does the public really know? The Russians are accused of “stealing” truthful information about the workings of the DNC, and publicizing this information. Come on people, this is what the New York Times considers its mission. The Times often, and proudly, takes information it knows to have been illegally obtained, but believes to be truthful, and prints it. The CIA has itself done this sort of thing for decades. The only evidence the public has actually seen is a 25 page document prepared by US intelligence agencies that said nothing except “Trust us. We think the Russians did this. Maybe.”
The US sanctions are a consequence of media-fueled hyperbole and anger. I see great potential for harm and little prospect for benefit in the escalating brinksmanship with Mr. Putin. He is not a nice man and usually not our friend, but diplomacy is the best tool we have for dealing with him.
If the Russians deliberately hacked voting machines, that is an action of a whole different magnitude, which deserves a strong response.
8
"The US sanctions are a consequence of media-fueled hyperbole and anger.."
No, they're not. You forgot the 17 agencies that have concluded unequivocally that Russia (at the behest of Putin) deliberately interfered with the 2016 election to benefit trump. Why would any patriotic American be ok with that? Why are you ok with that?
No, they're not. You forgot the 17 agencies that have concluded unequivocally that Russia (at the behest of Putin) deliberately interfered with the 2016 election to benefit trump. Why would any patriotic American be ok with that? Why are you ok with that?
2
With the privilege of being able to comment on the news with a paper like the NYT, also comes the downside - having to read mindless drivel like this from "no fact" people who mainline their opinions from Fox News. Open your mind to real facts, Alex from Indiana.
2
Nice try, Alexei.
1
There is no comparison between Russia and the USA even if Russia calls itself a Democracy.
Putin's wealth is reportedly over NZ$266 billion dollars and anyone that investigates State Fraud gets murdered. What does that tell you about Russia?
Putin's wealth is reportedly over NZ$266 billion dollars and anyone that investigates State Fraud gets murdered. What does that tell you about Russia?
10
Where is Putin's wealth? Yes, he has favorited his friends. Show me Putin's money!
1
'reportedly'
There are a lot of ways to interpret the bizarre mountain of circumstantial evidence that the Trump campaign got help from Russia.
The one I fear the most, is that the billionaires turned China into a non-democratic capitalist state in the early eighties, turned Russia into a non-democratic capitalist state in the early 1990s, and is now using those two bases to do the same thing to the United States now.
I have no problem keeping numerous possible explanations in my head at the same time, but all of the other possible explanations seem far preferable to that one, so that is the one I worry about, and therefore fight against, most.
The one I fear the most, is that the billionaires turned China into a non-democratic capitalist state in the early eighties, turned Russia into a non-democratic capitalist state in the early 1990s, and is now using those two bases to do the same thing to the United States now.
I have no problem keeping numerous possible explanations in my head at the same time, but all of the other possible explanations seem far preferable to that one, so that is the one I worry about, and therefore fight against, most.
3
Compared to the consequences Hillary would have rained down on their heads for their interference, this is nothing. Nothing at all.
7
Are you still clinging to that rationale after the past six months?
Russia must be held accountable for its transgressions against other countries and the U.S. Putin will probably never abandon his dream of resurrecting the Soviet Union, so he must be thwarted at every turn.
But, just as this country has done with other hostile regimes, notably Iran, it cannot abandon diplomacy to accomplish mutually agreeable goals, no matter how detestable the negotiating partner may be. Congress must be careful that it does not conflate its need to constrain Russia with the politics of resisting Mr. Trump. While I believe that the sanctions enacted by Congress were reasonable and necessary, I did detect a tinge of such conflation.
Trump's opponents must recognize the reality that it is Trump or his surrogates who will have the direct relationships with Russian officials. It is in our country's best interests to make constructive progress with those relationships now that the sanctions have established the rules.
If politics overrides national interests, we will be in a lose/lose situation, whereby any progress will be called capitulation, and lack of progress called incompetency. Such reflexive political reactions may create political satisfaction, but are harmful to our country. We must guard against them, or in our zeal to punish Mr. Trump, we punish ourselves.
But, just as this country has done with other hostile regimes, notably Iran, it cannot abandon diplomacy to accomplish mutually agreeable goals, no matter how detestable the negotiating partner may be. Congress must be careful that it does not conflate its need to constrain Russia with the politics of resisting Mr. Trump. While I believe that the sanctions enacted by Congress were reasonable and necessary, I did detect a tinge of such conflation.
Trump's opponents must recognize the reality that it is Trump or his surrogates who will have the direct relationships with Russian officials. It is in our country's best interests to make constructive progress with those relationships now that the sanctions have established the rules.
If politics overrides national interests, we will be in a lose/lose situation, whereby any progress will be called capitulation, and lack of progress called incompetency. Such reflexive political reactions may create political satisfaction, but are harmful to our country. We must guard against them, or in our zeal to punish Mr. Trump, we punish ourselves.
2
Vladimir Putin is like the dog that catches the car. "And then what do I do with it? Bite the tire as it rolls over me?"
Russia, descendant of the Czars. is a model for kleptocrats. Unlike the Soviet Union, it is not "A God That Failed", attractive to hordes of people around the globe until the scales fell from their eyes. So Putin doesn't have the luxury of waging an ideological struggle though he can play Trump against the Congress, if he wishes.
David Sanger's error, I think, a is in saying President Trump's "hands are now tied in dealing with Moscow, probably for years to come".
No President's hands are ever completely tied in foreign affairs. Witness the Iranian Nuclear Accord (JCPOA). It could never have gotten the required super-majority of the Senate for a treaty, because too many Senators, Democrats as well as Republicans would have wrongly opposed a JCPOA Treaty.. So President Obama did an Executive Agreement.
Because JCPOA is actually working Trump is trying to dragoon his security team into saying it isn't. If he gets them to buy into a lie, he will set us on course for war with Iran, without the approval of the American people, who don't want kith and kin dying in another feckless Middle East War.
Nothing can stop Trump from recognition on historical grounds, of Russia's claim to the Crimea or undermining European unity by continuing to enable the continent's neo fascist politicians. Or slime in NATO again.
Powerless, he ain't
Russia, descendant of the Czars. is a model for kleptocrats. Unlike the Soviet Union, it is not "A God That Failed", attractive to hordes of people around the globe until the scales fell from their eyes. So Putin doesn't have the luxury of waging an ideological struggle though he can play Trump against the Congress, if he wishes.
David Sanger's error, I think, a is in saying President Trump's "hands are now tied in dealing with Moscow, probably for years to come".
No President's hands are ever completely tied in foreign affairs. Witness the Iranian Nuclear Accord (JCPOA). It could never have gotten the required super-majority of the Senate for a treaty, because too many Senators, Democrats as well as Republicans would have wrongly opposed a JCPOA Treaty.. So President Obama did an Executive Agreement.
Because JCPOA is actually working Trump is trying to dragoon his security team into saying it isn't. If he gets them to buy into a lie, he will set us on course for war with Iran, without the approval of the American people, who don't want kith and kin dying in another feckless Middle East War.
Nothing can stop Trump from recognition on historical grounds, of Russia's claim to the Crimea or undermining European unity by continuing to enable the continent's neo fascist politicians. Or slime in NATO again.
Powerless, he ain't
Oh no!
Does this mean that the 1st annual "Moscow on the Potomac" Labor Day festival in D.C. will be cancelled?
I will certainly miss the Russian parade of Tanks, Missiles, and Military Hardware down Pennsylvania Avenue in front of thousands, no millions, cheering Trump/Putin fanatics.
Does this mean that the 1st annual "Moscow on the Potomac" Labor Day festival in D.C. will be cancelled?
I will certainly miss the Russian parade of Tanks, Missiles, and Military Hardware down Pennsylvania Avenue in front of thousands, no millions, cheering Trump/Putin fanatics.
3
it's as plain on the nose on your face.
there was no collusion.
no quid pro quo.
and the is article lists all the evidence
needed to prove there wasn't.
so far we have to admit that he isn't hitler or even hitlerian.
and that he isn't in collusion with the russkies.
now, we can start complaining about his ineptitude and
his policies.
pretty soon we'll finally get to the meat of the matter,
and only have the policies he has implemented to gripe about.
at that point, he'll be ready to start campaigning for re-election.
and his opponents will have only themselves to blame.
there was no collusion.
no quid pro quo.
and the is article lists all the evidence
needed to prove there wasn't.
so far we have to admit that he isn't hitler or even hitlerian.
and that he isn't in collusion with the russkies.
now, we can start complaining about his ineptitude and
his policies.
pretty soon we'll finally get to the meat of the matter,
and only have the policies he has implemented to gripe about.
at that point, he'll be ready to start campaigning for re-election.
and his opponents will have only themselves to blame.
5
I thought Texans were patriots. I was wrong.
Nope.
So you think Trump and co. hung out with the Russians because they're just so cuddly and so much fun to be with?
1
With these sanctions, we can be pretty certain that the upcoming Congressional elections will be tampered with. Tampering with a couple dozen small and critical House elections is relatively easy, so we will not likely yo know who rightfully controls the House, a matter of huge importance.
Initially, Trump made a few statements praising Putin. That was followed by speculative media accounts that the two were in bed together. Trump and Putin then started talking. although no one knows what they were talking about. The media speculated the discussions were criminal. And so Congress felt the need to impose excessive sanctions.
When we don't know whose elected in 2018, blame who you want. In first place, I'd put the media which exaggerated unconscionably to grab popular attention and get more viewers.
Initially, Trump made a few statements praising Putin. That was followed by speculative media accounts that the two were in bed together. Trump and Putin then started talking. although no one knows what they were talking about. The media speculated the discussions were criminal. And so Congress felt the need to impose excessive sanctions.
When we don't know whose elected in 2018, blame who you want. In first place, I'd put the media which exaggerated unconscionably to grab popular attention and get more viewers.
Putin wanted Americans to think of Russia as someone to be afraid of. He has achieved that and is now touting the backlash against Russia as a new reason to punish American interests around the world. American democracy may be strong enough to overcome the turmoil we are going through, but the brand of democracy has been weakened and authoritarians and elites will use the "lessons" of the American experience to inform anti-democratic measures. Most of all, Russians will thank their lucky stars that they have such a strong, competent leader to continue ruling them in perpetuity.
1
There are many Russians who oppose Putin and put themselves at risk if they speak out.
1
"President Vladimir V. Putin bet that Donald J. Trump, who had spoken fondly of Russia and its authoritarian leader for years, would treat his nation as Mr. Putin has longed to have it treated by the West."
How does the author know this? Should it be preceded by "I think", or "The collusion narrative says". Or is there actual evidence of what Putin "bet" and "longed" for.
Please include source when there is one. I would have guessed Putin would have wanted Hillary based on the Uranium 1 deal, Trump's desire to strengthen the military, and Trump's favorable treatment of fossil fuels which is a primary money maker for Russia.
How does the author know this? Should it be preceded by "I think", or "The collusion narrative says". Or is there actual evidence of what Putin "bet" and "longed" for.
Please include source when there is one. I would have guessed Putin would have wanted Hillary based on the Uranium 1 deal, Trump's desire to strengthen the military, and Trump's favorable treatment of fossil fuels which is a primary money maker for Russia.
1
U.S. intelligence agencies have proof that Trump was the man that Putin wanted in power. And the person Russia tried to discredit was Hillary Clinton. So I'm guessing that your guess that Putin would have wanted Hillary is based on what you hear from right wing propaganda outlets such as Fox and Hannity. I take your point that there is no proof in the NY Times article that Putin "has longed" to be treated in a certain way by the West. However, given the proof positive that Russia interfered in our November election to favor Trump, I would be looking more closely at the sources behind the Hillary/Uranium story and their veracity and motives.
Your comments are based on a lot of misinformation. Start with the uranium deal. While that happened under Hillary's watch, it was a multinational, corporate deal which she had very little to do with, and could not have blocked if she wanted to. You should investigate issues like this for yourself instead of just swallowing whatever right-wing media tells you and then drawing stupid conclusions based on propaganda.
There is no source unless Times reporters are mind readers
1
Trump is destroying our great country from within, and Putin is working on it from without. Trump and Putin have common ground as they both despise democracies. Both men have to be idiots as they did not factor in the reaction of the America people once informed that Putin cyber attacked our proudest freedom and is still working at it.
10
It looks like the Russian misinformation efforts are beginning to surge again. Is that impression correct? Even on this site, that seems to be the case. Has this new surge been spread by Fox and the like? Has it come originally from the same sources as the election fake news?
Examples of these fake news memes include:
"Trump's critics are hysterical Russia haters." (No--Trump's critics are simply the reasonable critics of the damage that Trump has wrought.)
"Congress hates Russia because they want to get re-elected." (No--Congress doesn't trust Trump to do the right thing.)
"The Russian and American people (read, Trump supporters) are in a war against the elites of which the American elites are no better than the Russian elites)." (Putin murders and imprisons political adversaries; destroyed the Russian free press; etc.)
"Russia is our bro (i.e., white and Christian). We should be hating China." (Enough said.)
"Putin favored Clinton, and took votes away from Trump." (No credible source agrees. The same old anti-Clinton propaganda.)
"Russia did not steal and release the information; a DNC leaker did it." (No credible source agrees. The new pizza-gate.)
"Obama started the new cold war; Trump is just trying to stop it." (The same old plan to destroy the Obama legacy no matter what it takes.)
Examples of these fake news memes include:
"Trump's critics are hysterical Russia haters." (No--Trump's critics are simply the reasonable critics of the damage that Trump has wrought.)
"Congress hates Russia because they want to get re-elected." (No--Congress doesn't trust Trump to do the right thing.)
"The Russian and American people (read, Trump supporters) are in a war against the elites of which the American elites are no better than the Russian elites)." (Putin murders and imprisons political adversaries; destroyed the Russian free press; etc.)
"Russia is our bro (i.e., white and Christian). We should be hating China." (Enough said.)
"Putin favored Clinton, and took votes away from Trump." (No credible source agrees. The same old anti-Clinton propaganda.)
"Russia did not steal and release the information; a DNC leaker did it." (No credible source agrees. The new pizza-gate.)
"Obama started the new cold war; Trump is just trying to stop it." (The same old plan to destroy the Obama legacy no matter what it takes.)
14
Thinking back more than a decade, I remember Bush saying that he looked Putin in the eye and saw a good man. Anybody else remember that?
9
Thinking back to 2009, Sec of State Hillary Clinton presented the Russian foreign minister with a ridiculous (and mislabeled in Russian) "reset button" because she and Obama wanted warm relations between our countries. Anyone else remember that?
I don't.
He is a very clever man. But he is not a good man. He was in my country last week and when the news about the Senate approving the sanctions came, he started whining about injustice done to his country. He was very convincing. Like deserved an Oscar. Mind you, I don't think it was what he really thought, but not a muscle betrayed that it was all a barefaced shameless lie. That he knew full well he had given the order to invade Ukraine and ... I don't even start about the passenger plane... No, it was all injustice, he was a victim to and his great country... This is how he is. Brought up by the FSB, all lies and deception. On your doorstep now. Rotten but clever.
Putin perhaps expected that a change at the top means a change everywhere, and that legacies do not exist in policy. Of course when you have your adversaries murdered, the legacy problem goes away, so we can understand him thinking it might work here too.
No such luck.
No such luck.
4
It is utterly nonsensical to think that Putin bet and worked against the queen of "overcharge", oops "reset". Kremlin was hoping to influence the elections, but to swing it for Hillary and the traditionally pro-Muskovy Demokrats, not Trump and GOP.
Once Trump was elected in spite of odds and, what limited, Kremlin meddling did happen, Putin hoped Trump, the quintessential deal maker, would be persuadable. But like all those dealing with the master, Putin received a smile, a pat on the back, and then was faced with the harsh Trumpian reality of "what's in it for me (America)?". Oh and now even the pathetically pro-Kremlin Demokrats talked themselves into a frenzy of "Russia hate" they can't see a way out of.
Just about as spectacular failure for Putin, as one that might've as well been designed in the halls of the centuries-old enemy that always imbues Kremlin with such a feeling of inferiority, the Polish government in Warsaw.
Once Trump was elected in spite of odds and, what limited, Kremlin meddling did happen, Putin hoped Trump, the quintessential deal maker, would be persuadable. But like all those dealing with the master, Putin received a smile, a pat on the back, and then was faced with the harsh Trumpian reality of "what's in it for me (America)?". Oh and now even the pathetically pro-Kremlin Demokrats talked themselves into a frenzy of "Russia hate" they can't see a way out of.
Just about as spectacular failure for Putin, as one that might've as well been designed in the halls of the centuries-old enemy that always imbues Kremlin with such a feeling of inferiority, the Polish government in Warsaw.
1
Wow, this is what I call a prime example of "pretzel logic"! How can someone who's "pathetically pro-Kremlin" talk himself into a "frenzy of Russia hate"?!!! Can you explain to me how that remarkable feat is accomplished? And there are no Demokrats in America. Lots of bad spellers though...
8
Putin wants destabilization of the administration.
Trump supplies that.
Clinton would not have in another Dem admin.
Putin wants someone manipulable.
Trump's narcissism and lack of experience supply that.
Clinton would not have, having 8 years as FLOTUS, 8 as Senator and 4 as State.
Trump supplies that.
Clinton would not have in another Dem admin.
Putin wants someone manipulable.
Trump's narcissism and lack of experience supply that.
Clinton would not have, having 8 years as FLOTUS, 8 as Senator and 4 as State.
9
Putin was betting that USA Russian relations was the only thing that would keep the Russians in line.
Russians understood the that their man in Kiev was overthrown by the USA and its allies. Russians understood that Russia was a paper tiger.
Putin understands his backing by the Russian people is precarious at best. Putin understands his disruption of American democracy is his only trump card.
Putin is playing his losing cards very well.
Russians understood the that their man in Kiev was overthrown by the USA and its allies. Russians understood that Russia was a paper tiger.
Putin understands his backing by the Russian people is precarious at best. Putin understands his disruption of American democracy is his only trump card.
Putin is playing his losing cards very well.
1
I hope you are correct.
1
The reporting continues to be that he will "reluctantly" sign the bill, but he has made no effort to do so. Is he trying to "pocket veto" it? Can he get away with that? Thanks in advance for the clarification!
1
While on the subject of Russia, how come Putin can seemingly take down critics out of his country but unable to control the rogue scientists that supposedly left a ussr in shambles and pedalled their toxic wares in n Korea. It seems logical to assume he sent them there to fight a proxy war with the west. All their designs are old school ussr.
Yeah, not only Russia's
For now maybe, but remember Putin has a spy in the WH in theory for the next four yrs...Trump...
4
Ridicules misreporting. Clinton's stupid loss to Trump has led to massive lying about Russia stealing the election for Trump. Putin is the straw man in all this. Whatever Sanger wants to say, which is perversely dishonest, the NYTs is ok with. The NYTs has created a fantasy world of Putin and Russia that the Congress has jumped on with absurd enthusiasm. Paul Krugman's silly rant after the election that the US now had the Putin/Trump regime. The Clinton charge that Trump was Putin's puppet. It goes on ad nauseum. Now we are told that Putin is the big loser.
9
They think we're stupid. It is quite obvious. If they ignore Wasserman Schultz, Imran Awan, Fusion GPS, etc. they do not exist. Who's stupid again? Was Awan selling secrets to the New York Times and the Washington Post? True or not, that's how it appears. What are you protecting? We'll find out. Probably best to let it all out now instead of as we approach the 2018 election.
1
Before we relax thinking that Putin's goals have been thwarted, just remember that he also wants to de-stabilize America by creating divisions, having people question long-standing institutions such as our electoral process, and sewing doubt about the legitimacy of things like the American press. Seems to me that Trump and his supporters -- including the efforts of Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan -- have been pretty successful so far.
6
I disagree with the headline. Mr. Sanger's premise is not correct. That is, President Putin hoped that Donald Trump would treat Russia with respect to a military global power. Too simplistic approach.
President Putin and his savvy advisory group identified a more interesting angle of Trump.
A mercurial real estate businessman turned politician with a tremendous potential to promote chaos and disrupt the American political establishment. In this respect, Putin/Russia is winning big time.
The former Soviet Union has lost the cold war of the 20th century. President Putin, however, is winning the internet/pshycological warfare of the 21st century.
President Putin and his savvy advisory group identified a more interesting angle of Trump.
A mercurial real estate businessman turned politician with a tremendous potential to promote chaos and disrupt the American political establishment. In this respect, Putin/Russia is winning big time.
The former Soviet Union has lost the cold war of the 20th century. President Putin, however, is winning the internet/pshycological warfare of the 21st century.
5
More sanctions against foreign countries and more enemies for the lawyer run and dominated U.S. Congress and government. Add Russia to the long list Iran, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, etc. etc. President Donald Trump has said the unjustified invasion of Iraq was based on lies of CIA that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. Because of this we are demanding U.S. rebuild our Iraqi province with all underground utilities.
3
"Because of this we are demanding US rebuild our Iraqi province with all underground utilities."
First question: Who is the "We" you are talking about???
Second question: Since when is an "Iraqi province" part of the Royal Kingdom of Greater Syria???
I can read a map and I haven't got a clue about what you mean.
I await your answer.
First question: Who is the "We" you are talking about???
Second question: Since when is an "Iraqi province" part of the Royal Kingdom of Greater Syria???
I can read a map and I haven't got a clue about what you mean.
I await your answer.
1
I think that he did not bet on Trump improving ties, rather he bet on Trump weakening the US; that be is playing out just as planned.....
3
When the US Congress slips back into Cold War mode, so does the senior US press, it seems.
It doesn't matter that much of the thinking behind the current reversion to Cold War thinking is both as accidentally and deliberately false as that which gave rise to Cold War I (we learned that the Soviets' actions were mainly defensive); too many in the US feel more comfortable with, and profit by, Russia and its leader as enemy, so the world is pitched back into yet another depressing period of misinformation, propaganda, anxiety and dangerous brinkmanship.
The US continued to surround Russia militarily long after the Soviet threat vanished, and has been waging economic warfare against Russia since it annexed Crimea to protect it's Black Sea fleet (with the approval of most Crimeans).
No one ever acknowledges that the US would react at least as strongly if a pro-Russia coup in Mexico City raised the possibility of Russian missile sites on the US border.
What undermines the US case is its monumental hypocrisy: the unprovoked invasion of Iraq, the deaths of hundreds of thousands and the destruction of a society was a far greater crime than Russia's bloodless annexation of Crimea, but who is there to attack the US economy with sanctions?
There was a time when "It's different when we do it, because we're on the side of right" had a grain of truth to it, but now it just looks like arrogance. This time, public opinion both inside and outside the US is far more skeptical.
It doesn't matter that much of the thinking behind the current reversion to Cold War thinking is both as accidentally and deliberately false as that which gave rise to Cold War I (we learned that the Soviets' actions were mainly defensive); too many in the US feel more comfortable with, and profit by, Russia and its leader as enemy, so the world is pitched back into yet another depressing period of misinformation, propaganda, anxiety and dangerous brinkmanship.
The US continued to surround Russia militarily long after the Soviet threat vanished, and has been waging economic warfare against Russia since it annexed Crimea to protect it's Black Sea fleet (with the approval of most Crimeans).
No one ever acknowledges that the US would react at least as strongly if a pro-Russia coup in Mexico City raised the possibility of Russian missile sites on the US border.
What undermines the US case is its monumental hypocrisy: the unprovoked invasion of Iraq, the deaths of hundreds of thousands and the destruction of a society was a far greater crime than Russia's bloodless annexation of Crimea, but who is there to attack the US economy with sanctions?
There was a time when "It's different when we do it, because we're on the side of right" had a grain of truth to it, but now it just looks like arrogance. This time, public opinion both inside and outside the US is far more skeptical.
6
Glad congress is staying focused on this issue , Putin thought he had a done deal when trump was elected . He thought all he had to do from hereon was appeal to trump's vanity , Lavrov reference to congress as Russiaphobic is very telling . Putin thought congress would be as big a pushover as trump. Congress needs to stay focused on Russian expansive tendencies as stated in this article. There is a lot evidence of Putin extending his tentacles to the former satellites ; his takeover of the Crimea was the start , if he cannot takeover by outright force he will and is doing it insidiously thru hacking and planting false news. He is shrewd enough to recognize that a portion of citizens are gullible enough to believe such nonsense.
2
Putin still got what he wanted - a far weaker America with Trump in power.
Trump's main concern from all this is probably worries over increased finance charges for his massive Russian debts.
Trump's main concern from all this is probably worries over increased finance charges for his massive Russian debts.
4
You think Putin cares about improving relations with the US??? Still pedaling the theme the Russians were only out to disadvantage Hilary -- as if they have never worked to influence our elections (as if they haven't been trying since 1917, come on).
You guys have lost your foreign policy verve and acumen. Keep drinking and pedaling the Kool Aid. Then wonder why your sales decline
You guys have lost your foreign policy verve and acumen. Keep drinking and pedaling the Kool Aid. Then wonder why your sales decline
Reading through history, it astounds me as to how often powerful men are completely ignorant. Is that their trick, that they dance through the minefield unaware, while the rest of the world gasps at their supposed skill and bravery? Putin probably thinks that the US President has Putin-like powers. Trump probably thought he could con his way to the moon and back. MacArthur thought China would never enter the war. Tojo thought he could attack Pearl Harbor and then negotiate. Hitler thought he could attack Russia AND The USA. Beauregard thought Yankees wouldn't/couldn't fight. Custer thought he was bulletproof. It's awful to think of the final tally whenever stupid meets power.
4
There are some very posts here including yours. Thanks for the history lesson. Some here believe only Bush the 2nd believed Saddam had WMDs...so did Russia, the UK, Canada, Australia, Israel and others all through their intelligence services. I am just pointing that out as an aside.
Does Put in get his money back, now, if Trump doesn't deliver?
2
I don't know -- why don't you take up the case for Putin.
Oh -- wait that won't work -- you'd have to actually provide evidence, wouldn't you?
Oh -- wait that won't work -- you'd have to actually provide evidence, wouldn't you?
1
"Trump’s hands are now tied in dealing with Moscow, for years to come"....for the sake of the planet, hoping for weeks to months at the most, meaning we're rid of him.
3
Trump's vision of a great relationship between the US and Russia resembles a corruptly arranged marriage between an untrusting abuser and a delusional victim, with Trump and Putin playing match makers for their own purposes.
To be close to Russia, the US is asked to distance itself from relations with parties that have common goals and aspirations (but are not friendly to the new suitor), becoming isolated and vulnerable as a result. Russia continues hostile behavior (military aggression on many fronts, diplomatic harassment, intelligence intimidation and incursions, threatening and attacking allies and their partners, destabilizing democracy, etc.) veiled behind a cognitively dissonant promise of a better relationship.
Meanwhile, Trump encourages the US to accommodate an abusive Russia by handing over secrets, dropping defenses, aligning with aggressions that defy our interests, and either inviting Russia into NATO or withdrawing from it. The promise is that if America just shows Russia enough love, someday it will change and love the US back.
The real goal of this manipulative matchmaking is to transfer America's wealth and power to Russia so that Trump and Putin can continue to put themselves above the law while running criminal schemes of self enrichment at the expense of their nations.
This is a classically imbalanced and destructive relationship. Congress is right to break it up. Putin, now scorned, shows his true colors as a retaliating abuser. Good riddance.
To be close to Russia, the US is asked to distance itself from relations with parties that have common goals and aspirations (but are not friendly to the new suitor), becoming isolated and vulnerable as a result. Russia continues hostile behavior (military aggression on many fronts, diplomatic harassment, intelligence intimidation and incursions, threatening and attacking allies and their partners, destabilizing democracy, etc.) veiled behind a cognitively dissonant promise of a better relationship.
Meanwhile, Trump encourages the US to accommodate an abusive Russia by handing over secrets, dropping defenses, aligning with aggressions that defy our interests, and either inviting Russia into NATO or withdrawing from it. The promise is that if America just shows Russia enough love, someday it will change and love the US back.
The real goal of this manipulative matchmaking is to transfer America's wealth and power to Russia so that Trump and Putin can continue to put themselves above the law while running criminal schemes of self enrichment at the expense of their nations.
This is a classically imbalanced and destructive relationship. Congress is right to break it up. Putin, now scorned, shows his true colors as a retaliating abuser. Good riddance.
4
I am sure this is just another stage of collusion and means nothing and that this posturing is essential for appearances sake, and nothing more.
Trump + Putin = Successful Money Laundering Bromance. Period.
Trump + Putin = Successful Money Laundering Bromance. Period.
3
So Mr. Putin hoped his complex program of stuff would pay off, and President Trump would become his groupie. And it almost worked, except that in a rare lucid moment the President realized that when he was presented with the sanctions package by Congress he had to sign it—because to do anything else would be to admit that all of Putin’s efforts had worked like a charm, and he had absolutely become a pawn of the Russians.
But now if Putin was clever he would say, “Hey, this has all been a big misunderstanding, we want to have a love affair with the U.S., and although of course we hate these sanctions and think they’re terribly unfair, we’re going to prove how wrong this is by resisting the temptation to respond in kind and instead we’re dialing up the love even higher.” Except he’s not quite smart enough to do that, so instead he reveals his true bullying self. He throws out the American diplomats because this will help Russia—how?—and all his treachery is down the drain. Plus we’re still awaiting the results of the Mueller report. Much as I dislike both Putin and President Trump, I don’t think this is good news. I survived one cold war (although I had a family member who didn’t, and was killed in the military in a Cold War-related incident), and I was hoping to avoid another. Guess not.
But now if Putin was clever he would say, “Hey, this has all been a big misunderstanding, we want to have a love affair with the U.S., and although of course we hate these sanctions and think they’re terribly unfair, we’re going to prove how wrong this is by resisting the temptation to respond in kind and instead we’re dialing up the love even higher.” Except he’s not quite smart enough to do that, so instead he reveals his true bullying self. He throws out the American diplomats because this will help Russia—how?—and all his treachery is down the drain. Plus we’re still awaiting the results of the Mueller report. Much as I dislike both Putin and President Trump, I don’t think this is good news. I survived one cold war (although I had a family member who didn’t, and was killed in the military in a Cold War-related incident), and I was hoping to avoid another. Guess not.
1
Well Putin and likely Trump too did their best to sabotage the 2016 election and they succeeded. I have never believed that Trump won. It was a fix.
But neither P or T seemed to realize that in the States we have a Congress that despises Putin and that they do have a say. Being a dictator Putin did not understand and being a would-be dictator Trump didn't understand that either. Fascists never do understand democracy even one as feeble as our present one.
But neither P or T seemed to realize that in the States we have a Congress that despises Putin and that they do have a say. Being a dictator Putin did not understand and being a would-be dictator Trump didn't understand that either. Fascists never do understand democracy even one as feeble as our present one.
2
I think Russia's bet is paying off, with interest.
10
Yep, Putin got a weaker, more dysfunctional USA by installing The Orange Man.
4
Excellent opinion by Mr. Sanger. Let me clarify my political stance. Trump is an anathema to me as I believe domestically and in foreign policy he has sown not unification but extremist right wing division. Worse he is woefully ignorant of the historicity of his foreign policy by tweet. He initially made some progressives at first think that perhaps his dabble as a Democrat years ago would ensure his policies might not be that bad. I was consummately wrong. Truly, his "policies" are much worse than I ever thought they would be.
Having said that the one thing I had hoped for was his softening of this nation's long held antiCommunist irrational fear of Russia during the cold war era. I thought reaching out to Russia, perhaps, would be a good thing until Russia's hacking of a US 2016 election allegedly with Trump's support if not help obviated even my remote thought that Trump would change US/Russian policy for the better.
As is true of Trump's entire campaign to secure the presidency Trump said what he did not to help mute the danger of US/Russian hostility but to help the number one person Trump cares about helping and that is Trump.
In the ensuing days we shall, I hope, see as Mueller unfolds the essence of the horrific Trump/Putin love affair. We will know the price we all have paid electing a true Manchurian candidate. Trump and we the American electorate have been Putinesque had and Putin too may rue the day he shook hands with the US liar in chief!
Having said that the one thing I had hoped for was his softening of this nation's long held antiCommunist irrational fear of Russia during the cold war era. I thought reaching out to Russia, perhaps, would be a good thing until Russia's hacking of a US 2016 election allegedly with Trump's support if not help obviated even my remote thought that Trump would change US/Russian policy for the better.
As is true of Trump's entire campaign to secure the presidency Trump said what he did not to help mute the danger of US/Russian hostility but to help the number one person Trump cares about helping and that is Trump.
In the ensuing days we shall, I hope, see as Mueller unfolds the essence of the horrific Trump/Putin love affair. We will know the price we all have paid electing a true Manchurian candidate. Trump and we the American electorate have been Putinesque had and Putin too may rue the day he shook hands with the US liar in chief!
2
That merely shows that Putin does not understand that the American president does not govern alone. (The current American president seems not to understand that either.)
That is not to say that Putin is not getting anything out of the Trump mispresidency. I agree with LBJr's comment that Russia gains whether relations thaw or not, as long as the United States has a caricature for president.
That is not to say that Putin is not getting anything out of the Trump mispresidency. I agree with LBJr's comment that Russia gains whether relations thaw or not, as long as the United States has a caricature for president.
9
I'm sure that the "expulsion of 750 diplomats" is the next KGB bluff & Putin with Trump just agreed & went underground on criminal cooperation.
1
These are Russian personal he is putting ou of work. The American diplomats are less than 300. So Putin disparages his own people. Causes them to suffer more. That is not surprising.
So pretty much, regardless of what happens, you're certain that Trump and Putin are conspiring together. Even as their is direct evidence to the contrary, you just know, unequivocally, that of course Trump and Putin are up to something no good. Who needs evidence when you are this certain?
Agreed. They want to lengthen the time Trump stays in office as much as possible. They need to pacify the Senate. Throw them off scent.
International relationships are going down the toilet with "The Great Negotiator", Donald J. Trump. Nuclear armed Russia and North Korea are acting nervous. What a surprise.
4
Don't buy this at all. The overall goals of Putin going back to 2014 were two-fold: to stop NATO and to undermine America's standing in the world. It was fairly apparent by the middle of 2014 that HRC would inevitably be the Dem nominee and in spite of conservatives back then going after her on Benghazi, the conservative line was to accuse Obama, through Hillary, of pushing the "reset button" on Russia - but from Putin's POV, his reaction was to do whatever he could to mount something akin to a "ABH" (Anyone But Hillary) campaign. The fact is that the Russian economy was in shambles based on its reliance on the export of oil and gas, mostly to Europe, to get the foreign capital to finance its macro economy, including money to pay Russian pensioners.
Comey's testimony was that the US intelligence community first became aware (some amount of proof) of general efforts to intefere in our electoral process dated back to early 2015. The specifics of utilizing Trump the Simpleton as a potential tool to be exploited in futherance of the 2 goals cited above are somewhat immaterial - Putin never expected Trump to win.
I'd say Putin's strategy hasn't backfired at all - in terms of what he wanted to accomplish, it's been a spectacular success.
Comey's testimony was that the US intelligence community first became aware (some amount of proof) of general efforts to intefere in our electoral process dated back to early 2015. The specifics of utilizing Trump the Simpleton as a potential tool to be exploited in futherance of the 2 goals cited above are somewhat immaterial - Putin never expected Trump to win.
I'd say Putin's strategy hasn't backfired at all - in terms of what he wanted to accomplish, it's been a spectacular success.
4
Where is the evidence for this statement:
"President Vladimir V. Putin bet . . . ."
We know what was done, in broad terms, but do we know the motivation? Perhaps general instability was all that was desired. In that regard, the Russians got exactly what they wanted.
We say, "A rising tide lifts all boats." Perhaps the Russians simply forgot the corollary, "a falling tide lowers all boats." Or . . . maybe they just don't care.
"President Vladimir V. Putin bet . . . ."
We know what was done, in broad terms, but do we know the motivation? Perhaps general instability was all that was desired. In that regard, the Russians got exactly what they wanted.
We say, "A rising tide lifts all boats." Perhaps the Russians simply forgot the corollary, "a falling tide lowers all boats." Or . . . maybe they just don't care.
3
That's assuming this was his goal. I suspect it was just to disrupt the United States' influence on a global scale. On that front, it's been a total operational success. I think it's safe to say that we are introspectively occupied and not functioning all that well at the moment. Reduced sanctions are probably considered a secondary goal.
2
Sanger repeatedly refers to the annexation of Crimea as the reason for sanctions. The Europeans are unfortunately dug in on this, basing their policy on a status quo pertaining after the Soviet transfer of Crimea to Ukraine. It would be helpful if the Times and others took a fresh look at this issue. In fact, the transfer of Crimea to Ukraine in the early 1950s was a matter of political and administrative expediency. There are no significant historic or cultural ties between the two. Crimea had been a Soviet and Russian imperial possession for some time and its Russification and integration into the respective empires was considerable. The claim that the Russian naval base in Crimea is a legitimate Russian security interest is true (well, as true as our claim to Guam, say). Harping on Crimea will not be helpful tactically and has little cultural, historical or economic basis. Far better to focus on the invasion and destabilization of Eastern Ukraine, which affects a true Ukrainian heartland, albeit a culturally contested one. We should acknowledge the Russian claim on Crimea but exert pressure for better treatment of Crimean Tartars, including a right to return for those exlied around the empire by successive Tsarist and Soviet governments.
3
Articles like this -- that guess the purpose of collusion -- are interesting, but possibly dangerous. While it seems obvious that there was collusion, we really don't yet know how long the collusion has been going on, or the entire extent of what they've been working together on.
I'm guessing this unholy partnership did not start in 2016. I'm guessing that money has as much to do with it as politics. Just guessing, of course.
I'm guessing this unholy partnership did not start in 2016. I'm guessing that money has as much to do with it as politics. Just guessing, of course.
Though not having traveled in Russia, observing Russians in foreign countries and reading about Russian society in the media, arguably one can come to a general conclusion. That conclusion suggests them as bullies and not too subtle about being bullies.
Putin, of course, reflects the Russian society in general as well. He has to if he is to remain in power.
By blatant hacking into DNC servers and other illegal activities, Russians thought that they could bully Americans. By compromising Trump - apparently, subject to be proven - they also thought that Trump would acquiesce in such meddling. However, they went wrong in thinking that Trump's acquiescence alone would make a difference.
It seems that they thought that JUST like Putin makes decisions in Russia, Trump would do the same in the US. Russia is a democracy only in name, it's a thuggish dictatorship. On the other hand, the US is a vibrant democracy, even with all its flaws.
So NYT is correct in stating that Putin may be a master tactician, he does not seem to be a strategist. A strategist wouldn't have overlooked the fact that Trump ALONE could not make all the decisions, particularly the sensitive ones related to Russia.
So Russians are back to the drawing board!!
Putin, of course, reflects the Russian society in general as well. He has to if he is to remain in power.
By blatant hacking into DNC servers and other illegal activities, Russians thought that they could bully Americans. By compromising Trump - apparently, subject to be proven - they also thought that Trump would acquiesce in such meddling. However, they went wrong in thinking that Trump's acquiescence alone would make a difference.
It seems that they thought that JUST like Putin makes decisions in Russia, Trump would do the same in the US. Russia is a democracy only in name, it's a thuggish dictatorship. On the other hand, the US is a vibrant democracy, even with all its flaws.
So NYT is correct in stating that Putin may be a master tactician, he does not seem to be a strategist. A strategist wouldn't have overlooked the fact that Trump ALONE could not make all the decisions, particularly the sensitive ones related to Russia.
So Russians are back to the drawing board!!
1
The need strikes me as having good relations with Russia and Congress in binding the policy of the President to sanctions has ensured the President will not be able to improve relations. This is a loss for all. Congress should not be taking foreign policy decisions away from the President.
This president lacks the brains to carry out any policy.
1
"Russians look at the chaos in the White House 'and see a level of unpredictability there, which makes them nervous.'"
We're all nervous.
Unpredictability is powerful in a negotiation because it diminishes the opponent's ability to anticipate. Craziness is a particularly potent form of unpredictability. We tend to steer clear of crazy people because we don't know whether they will act rationally. Unfortunately, nobody can steer clear of the president.
Trump isn't entirely unpredictable, though. In order of priority, he will do: (1) What is good for himself in the short run; (2) What is good for his family in the short run; and (3) Whatever undoes the legacy of Obama, who had the audacity both to be black and to roast Trump at the White House Correspondents Dinner in 2011. (Go watch it on YouTube.)
We're all nervous.
Unpredictability is powerful in a negotiation because it diminishes the opponent's ability to anticipate. Craziness is a particularly potent form of unpredictability. We tend to steer clear of crazy people because we don't know whether they will act rationally. Unfortunately, nobody can steer clear of the president.
Trump isn't entirely unpredictable, though. In order of priority, he will do: (1) What is good for himself in the short run; (2) What is good for his family in the short run; and (3) Whatever undoes the legacy of Obama, who had the audacity both to be black and to roast Trump at the White House Correspondents Dinner in 2011. (Go watch it on YouTube.)
3
Backfired?
Putin still has Trumps back, which is why Putin announced this "retaliation"
BEFORE Trump signs the bill. Putting the blame on Congress for its overwhelming action and inflating its effect- we do not have 755 US Personnel to throw out of Russia (very Trumpian move)-and keeps his hand firmly up his puppet's area of discomfort.
Putin still has Trumps back, which is why Putin announced this "retaliation"
BEFORE Trump signs the bill. Putting the blame on Congress for its overwhelming action and inflating its effect- we do not have 755 US Personnel to throw out of Russia (very Trumpian move)-and keeps his hand firmly up his puppet's area of discomfort.
1
Exactly. If you ever manage to impeach him and bring him to justice watch him jump into a plane bound for Moscow before you can say traitor!
As one of the NYT columnists said a couple of weeks ago, virtually everyone who's put his money on Trump has been in for a rude disappointment.
3
I bet on Trump and my stocks are soaring. Business is booming.
1
That has nothing to do with Trump.
2
The major irritant for Russia is the expansion of NATO into former east-bloc countries. This is the reason Putin put his foot down in the Ukraine and Crimea. Pushing Russia into a corner it cannot see any way out of is a dangerous game. In this respect Trump's attitude toward Russia (no matter its motivation) makes some sense. Furthermore Putin, in Syria, seems to be of the opinion that the world is better off with the dictator we know than the chaos that may follow his fall. This is a lesson the U.S. should have learned by now as we have made a total hash of Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya. Sometimes patience works better than the seemingly easy road of military intervention - Vietnam fell to the communists and the world didn't end. We don't seem to have any problem with the dictators we love: Saudi Arabia, China, the gulf states, Egypt among others; and in the past Pinochet, Noriega (for a time), Marcos, Trujillo, Batista, Franco etc..
I find a lot of the ranting about Russian interference a bit disingenuous. We have surreptitiously interfered in elections when it suited us - US 81 times since 1946. Russia 36 times (wikipedia). The 2016 U.S. presidential election was run fairly (Trump's claims of voter fraud to the contrary). It is the fault of the American electorate that they can't tell fake news from real news or a con-man from a president. We, and the electoral college, elected Trump. Blaming Russian interference is as much an indictment of Americans as it is of Putin.
I find a lot of the ranting about Russian interference a bit disingenuous. We have surreptitiously interfered in elections when it suited us - US 81 times since 1946. Russia 36 times (wikipedia). The 2016 U.S. presidential election was run fairly (Trump's claims of voter fraud to the contrary). It is the fault of the American electorate that they can't tell fake news from real news or a con-man from a president. We, and the electoral college, elected Trump. Blaming Russian interference is as much an indictment of Americans as it is of Putin.
6
Well said.
1
I hope we get rid of the Electoral College.
Putin is euphoric at the dysfunction of the U.S. government resulting from partisan politics.
To claim that Putin is so naive and such a dolt as to expect Trump to be his buddy is so silly that it is embarrassing to the U.S.
Who would believe a word Trump says?Certainly not Putin.
The conspiracy theory of an alliance of Putin and Trump destroys the credibility of anyone proposing it including Sanger.
This partisan tactic used to undermine President Trump has caused irreparable damage to the U.S.
To claim that Putin is so naive and such a dolt as to expect Trump to be his buddy is so silly that it is embarrassing to the U.S.
Who would believe a word Trump says?Certainly not Putin.
The conspiracy theory of an alliance of Putin and Trump destroys the credibility of anyone proposing it including Sanger.
This partisan tactic used to undermine President Trump has caused irreparable damage to the U.S.
1
Bill Browder's submission to the Senate Judiciary Committee Hearing about how Putin operates. A longish read but certainly real news rather than Trump's fake news.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/bill-browders-senate-judiciary-com...
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/bill-browders-senate-judiciary-com...
1
I believe the old mixed metaphor "Be careful what you wish for from one who would bite the hand that feeds it" applies here.
Maybe now Putin will release the "dirt" he has on Trump!!
1
Putin got a lesson in how our government works. Our Legislative Branch has put a check on The Executive by preventing a lifting of financial sanctions on Russia among other items. A veto by Trump will be overridden by the Legislature. That action will make him more suspect in the eyes of most Americans. Putin hates democratic governance for this reason. In his world, the less the public knows the better for him. Trump appears to think that way too.
Witness the oh so anemic White House Press Briefings.
On a different note. Why do I keep seeing Putin's face and finger prints all over the accelerated nuclear weapons program in the DPRK?
Witness the oh so anemic White House Press Briefings.
On a different note. Why do I keep seeing Putin's face and finger prints all over the accelerated nuclear weapons program in the DPRK?
1
Putin to Trump (at private meeting): "Just hunker down. Hire some generals in case you have to take over militarily and wait. I'll create some diversions. Remember what I have on you and do as you're told."
3
I wish I felt more assured. Putin's a wiley old KGB guy.
4
We have to remember that Putin is not Russia, just as Trump is not the US. We should strive to have good relationships with all countries. We've been at war in so many countries for so long, it has begun to feel normal. Remember how Peace feels before we forget entirely and slip into believing that war is inevitable.
7
In the long run, the world will be a better and safer place if Russia and the United States are friends, and cooperate with each other. This may take a few decades before that happens. Ot, it may happen sooner because of necessity. In the meantime, both sides need to stay vigilant but peaceful. We share a lot of art, music, dance, literature, culture, and religion with the Russians but not their politics. We share little with the Chinese except their cheaply produced consumer goods.
The real danger to the world peace is not Russia but China. China's manufacturing capacity and heft, because of short-sighted large scale export of technology by the West to China, is so much larger than that of any other country that, now, China is beginning to flex its muscles and behave like a fearless tiger. China’s veto power in the UN Security Council gives additional strength to the restless tiger. It is China that is following expansionist and hegemonic policies while the rest of the world, especially the U.S., sleeps. We should be far more worried about China than about Russia.
The real danger to the world peace is not Russia but China. China's manufacturing capacity and heft, because of short-sighted large scale export of technology by the West to China, is so much larger than that of any other country that, now, China is beginning to flex its muscles and behave like a fearless tiger. China’s veto power in the UN Security Council gives additional strength to the restless tiger. It is China that is following expansionist and hegemonic policies while the rest of the world, especially the U.S., sleeps. We should be far more worried about China than about Russia.
4
What Putin longs for most is high energy prices, particularly oil and natural gas, because this is what pays for Russian military interventions in Crimea and Syria.
Russia's economy relies greatly on its oil and natural reserves. It is no cooincidence that the Soviet Union collapsed at the same time the price of oil collapsed in the late 1980s. Russia's annexation of Crimea came after a period of oil above $100 per barrel. The higher the price of oil, the stronger Russia is.
Trump has supports the XL pipeline and reduced environmental regulations that will lead to more oil at a lower price. Clinton would have supported the opposite. To think that Putin would favor a candidate who would drive down energy prices over one who has taken steps to reduce them does not make sense. Putin intendend to only to weaken Clinton. He believed the polls predicting Trump would lose.
Russia's economy relies greatly on its oil and natural reserves. It is no cooincidence that the Soviet Union collapsed at the same time the price of oil collapsed in the late 1980s. Russia's annexation of Crimea came after a period of oil above $100 per barrel. The higher the price of oil, the stronger Russia is.
Trump has supports the XL pipeline and reduced environmental regulations that will lead to more oil at a lower price. Clinton would have supported the opposite. To think that Putin would favor a candidate who would drive down energy prices over one who has taken steps to reduce them does not make sense. Putin intendend to only to weaken Clinton. He believed the polls predicting Trump would lose.
3
Trump did lose the popular vote. Unfortunately, we have the Electoral College.
1
Russia had a chance during and after perestroika, a nation laden, no better yet rife with corruption was doomed to failure. Russia has really been a rogue nation since before 1917. The country never was able to throw off the yoke of oppression. Gorbachev gave the West a glimmer of hope but as he had to know he could not stay the course, that he would lose the control necessary to hold the old party ideologues and apparatchiks together. Yeltsin, did he really try? history says no, in the shadows lurked Putin building, quietly a base of support ready to seize really, control when Yeltsin abdicated. No coup necessary Russia had her new strongman. And he absolutely has encouraged the growth of the Russian oligarchs and with their "help" held power and enriched himself. Controlling the population centers and the media the Russian people and we are dealing with a Russian oligarchy that promotes, no indeed requires an "every man for himself" mentality. And most of this control was gained in the directionless scramble after Gorbachev. In Western Europe they must still fear the Bear and the USA is the great equalizer.
New sanctions are the prelude to Cold War.
Who benefits from a Cold War?
Follow the money.
Who benefits from a Cold War?
Follow the money.
5
Sanctions on EU-Russia gas pipelines are also to benefit US producers who want to export fracked gas to Europe. So, Cold War II will AGAIN bring massive pollution to the US homeland, as Cold War I did with nuclear production sites like Hanford and Rocky Flats spreading (still) nuclear waste pollution. And it looks like the EU will finally push back, as they should have long ago. Nice going Congress. Spread pollution in the homeland and alienate our allies. You people disgust me so much, I doubt I will bother voting for even the lessor of two evils again.
Fracked gas will increase air and water pollution, as is now known, maybe more earthquakes in other states, as OK has been experiencing. Yes, the profiteers will not mind making your environment unlivable as long as they can convince you we are keeping evil Russia away. And too many of you will cheer them on.
Fracked gas will increase air and water pollution, as is now known, maybe more earthquakes in other states, as OK has been experiencing. Yes, the profiteers will not mind making your environment unlivable as long as they can convince you we are keeping evil Russia away. And too many of you will cheer them on.
At this point I'd bet a nickel that Putin will release something fairly damaging about Trump to Wikileaks or, better yet, skip them and release it directly to the press. Trump can't deliver now so he's useless, not only to the US but to Russia (Putin) as well. Whether Putin or anyone else who bet on Trump likes it or not, the world does better when our leaders are competent.
3
A new law, signed by President Vladimir Putin, bans VPNs and other technology that lets users access websites anonymously. [TechCrunch] Now Bannon wants to regulate Google and Facebook like utilities. [The Intercept]
World-wide suppression.
World-wide suppression.
It is questionable whether Putin's bet on Trump's presidency backfired. If Russia helped Trump to win election (with Trump's knowledge of it), he still is very open to Russia's blackmail. We are in for a protracted ride ...
4
He's not alone. Millions of Americans bet on Trump hoping he'd "Make America Great Again," drain the swamp, provide affordable health care for all, etc., etc.
I don't think they can take all that winning.
I don't think they can take all that winning.
5
Perhaps Trump is happy about Putin's move. It serves to further diminish the Sate Department.
1
I haven't noticed any winning.
1
Putin wants a better relationship with The United States while he illegally takes over Crimea, attacks eastern Ukraine, supports Assad, supports North Korea, bribes his own oligarchs, poisons rivals, and tampers with our election process. For Putin to project disgust at our renewed sanctions could be the most profound from of global gaslighting. I have not been proud of our Congress in some time, but their recent action against Russia gives me some hope.
However, like an abusive spouse who tries to gaslight his/her partner but gets called out in the process, Putin could overreact to save face. So we should tread lightly, cautiously in our shaming -- especially the economic squeeze. The hope is that Putin is smart enough to know he is on a losing track, and needs to change his ways. It's a bit of a gamble, just as playing nice would have been. But, I don't think Putin adjusts when countries play nice for he just looks to exploit that. So, we are on the right track: Squeeze but don't crush, and offer outs and ways to evolve.
With Trump and Congress at odds over this, things could get messy. if they don't remain consistent and aligned in message. It's very important for Trump to get in line, back the sanctions, promote democracy, be clear.
However, like an abusive spouse who tries to gaslight his/her partner but gets called out in the process, Putin could overreact to save face. So we should tread lightly, cautiously in our shaming -- especially the economic squeeze. The hope is that Putin is smart enough to know he is on a losing track, and needs to change his ways. It's a bit of a gamble, just as playing nice would have been. But, I don't think Putin adjusts when countries play nice for he just looks to exploit that. So, we are on the right track: Squeeze but don't crush, and offer outs and ways to evolve.
With Trump and Congress at odds over this, things could get messy. if they don't remain consistent and aligned in message. It's very important for Trump to get in line, back the sanctions, promote democracy, be clear.
5
There are 2 takeaways:
1) Unintended consequences always come from meddling in other people's countries and elections, even when they are smaller and weaker nations, but especially when they are stronger and richer ones. Putin thought Trump would be easier to get what he wanted than Clinton, and he was right about that. But Putin never considered the bi-partisan fury, rage and indignation that the meddling would cause because he fundamentally doesn't understand America or American politics. How many nations have a continuous government that is older than the United States? The UK and Switzerland are the only two I know. Other nations may be older--but their current governments are all much, much younger with far less experience, history and precedent. Yet we are continuous going back to the Constitution, and the first election that installed George Washington as the first President. Donald Trump, as incompetent and destructive as he is, is the 45th in that line. Let's just hope he's not the last.
2) Trump betrays, disappoints and injures, everyone who ever gets close to him, does business with him, works for him, or lends him money. Even Putin can't imagine Trump's ability to turn on people totally and completely loyal to him, as he has turned on Jeff Sessions, Sean Spicer, and Reince Priebus. He's like the scorpion riding the frog across the stream in the fable. Mid-stream, the scorpion stings the frog killing them both, because he cannot help it, he's a scorpion.
1) Unintended consequences always come from meddling in other people's countries and elections, even when they are smaller and weaker nations, but especially when they are stronger and richer ones. Putin thought Trump would be easier to get what he wanted than Clinton, and he was right about that. But Putin never considered the bi-partisan fury, rage and indignation that the meddling would cause because he fundamentally doesn't understand America or American politics. How many nations have a continuous government that is older than the United States? The UK and Switzerland are the only two I know. Other nations may be older--but their current governments are all much, much younger with far less experience, history and precedent. Yet we are continuous going back to the Constitution, and the first election that installed George Washington as the first President. Donald Trump, as incompetent and destructive as he is, is the 45th in that line. Let's just hope he's not the last.
2) Trump betrays, disappoints and injures, everyone who ever gets close to him, does business with him, works for him, or lends him money. Even Putin can't imagine Trump's ability to turn on people totally and completely loyal to him, as he has turned on Jeff Sessions, Sean Spicer, and Reince Priebus. He's like the scorpion riding the frog across the stream in the fable. Mid-stream, the scorpion stings the frog killing them both, because he cannot help it, he's a scorpion.
4
I would argue that he's gained more than he has lost. The disarray in the WH, and the ineptitude of the GOP to govern, has led to the loss of power and influence at the world stage.
I'm not sure we will recover from this.
I'm not sure we will recover from this.
10
Thanks to the forefathers who created the 3 independent branches of government. Trump just can't do what he wants. Dictators like Putin will find out the hard way when dealing with the US.
51
The 3 branches are supposed to act independently in order to keep the country from becoming a dictatorship. The Congress isn't showing much sign that they have any interest in doing so.
They are, however, showing signs that they are the chicken that laid the golden egg for Mr Putin.
They are, however, showing signs that they are the chicken that laid the golden egg for Mr Putin.
1
I just read an article that said the GOP in Alabama is all over itself for Trump and hating on the 3 Republicans who actually stood up for their own constituents. Strange times.
1
I sure hope so. But remember you're dealing with a ruthless guy. I would not be one yota surprised if troublesome ( from Putins's point of view) senators, opposition politicians etc would start to be found dead. It's easy to pick them one by one. They're lonely. Where is the concerted effort to take Trump down? Mueller is next. You must unite! Give support to those who fight for democracy! No one can beat a united nation. I know. I'm a Finn.
Russia is more of a criminal enterprise than a nation. It's leaders don't care about international status--all they want is the ability to continue to loot the Russian people and their neighbors. And their not hesitant to kill anyone that protests.
The US, under Obama, was a major obstacle. By replacing him with someone who was not only sufficiently callow to believe that better relations are possible but was also complicit in the looting, Putin won a big victory.
Despite congressional efforts, our ability to address the Russian criminal state and to protect its neighbors is impeded. Congressional efforts (sanctions) are to be applauded, but it will be difficult for congress to rein in the Russians without help from the executive.
Call me a Russophobe if you like, but please follow that up with some actual analysis. When I look at Russia I don't see a liberal western democracy. I see a kleptocracy led by an autocrat that threatens its neighbors, kills its dissidents, and impoverishes its own people.
The notion that we might have better relations with such a state is repugnant.
The US, under Obama, was a major obstacle. By replacing him with someone who was not only sufficiently callow to believe that better relations are possible but was also complicit in the looting, Putin won a big victory.
Despite congressional efforts, our ability to address the Russian criminal state and to protect its neighbors is impeded. Congressional efforts (sanctions) are to be applauded, but it will be difficult for congress to rein in the Russians without help from the executive.
Call me a Russophobe if you like, but please follow that up with some actual analysis. When I look at Russia I don't see a liberal western democracy. I see a kleptocracy led by an autocrat that threatens its neighbors, kills its dissidents, and impoverishes its own people.
The notion that we might have better relations with such a state is repugnant.
6
Trump can't be trusted not to give away the farm- he showed a weird negligence to the fact that Russia was hacking our election. What president of any country acts like that?
He seemed to be oblivious to our actual history with Russia and greedy to tap the real estate market there. His refusal to be straight up with his own money matters with Russia was to blame for Congress going around him.
6
I would say the evidence is more suggestive that Putin simply wanted to sabotage Clinton and undermine the electoral process in general. It seems odd that one as Machiavellian as Putin would forget that instilling a madman in office results in lunacy, or that one who would betray his own for the sake of power would show any loyalty to his new master.
1
Backfires? Russia has always been reported as being the master in long-game planning. Trump is but a blip on a calendar like that. One thing for sure is that the US has lost credibility and standing on the world stage with Trump at the helm. Obama went a long way in trying to rebuild the bridges Bush Jnr. burnt and redefine foreign relations with an eye to the future. Trump is a destroyer tossing it all onto the pyre for instant gratification, and adding a whole lot more. Who does that benefit?
4
It's sort of puzzling to me that anyone would assume that Putin, who knows exactly the kind of self-inflated, incompetent wannabe Trump is and has a much clearer picture of how the American political system works than Trump could gain in a decade of intense study, would make any bets.
4
Putin and Clinton did not get along.
Putin chose to give support to the Trump campaign, who he judged to be venal and easily corruptible, probably due to previous deals with Trump Inc. His judgement was not wrong.
However, he misjudged Congress and he misjudged Trump.'s ability to deliver because, as an outsider, Trump is not an effective political leader nor a political deal maker. Trump is out of his element.
Russia still achieved some objectives: they helped prevent the election of Clinton. They also put a puppet in the White House, who through bad leadership is weakening the US worldwide influence. A weak US is a good thing for Putin and Russian expansion.
Putin chose to give support to the Trump campaign, who he judged to be venal and easily corruptible, probably due to previous deals with Trump Inc. His judgement was not wrong.
However, he misjudged Congress and he misjudged Trump.'s ability to deliver because, as an outsider, Trump is not an effective political leader nor a political deal maker. Trump is out of his element.
Russia still achieved some objectives: they helped prevent the election of Clinton. They also put a puppet in the White House, who through bad leadership is weakening the US worldwide influence. A weak US is a good thing for Putin and Russian expansion.
4
Putins bet on Trumps Presidency backfires. Imagine that.
Watch out Donald, don't sign it, you will be exposed.
If renewed sanctions were a slap at Russian interference -- for helping elect the President whose party may be holding him back on Russia but is giving him plenty of rope to destroy every vestige of goodwill and respect the US had in the world, not to mention every precious social service that citizens rely on and the very earth, itself -- they're also driving them into the arms of XiJinPing who's only too happy to welcome everyone we tick off. Can't we be crafty, too? Can't we counter Putin's interference without another ham-handed response that further weakens our standing in the world?
4
No, No. Absolutely not. Putin bet that Trump's election would create chaos and establish dysfunction. His wager has succeeded spectacularly.
4
Possibly the Russians just "hoped" relations would improve no matter who became president after Barack Obama. I find this hope perfectly reasonable.
3
You are mad that Obama wanted to protect our elections??
2
As you may know, obama held back that info, such as it was, on the assumption hillary would win.
lets not forget that Putin armed the terrorists in the Ukraine with the weapons to shoot down a passenger airplane killing all aboard
7
The big win for Putin isn't that the US will suddenly be an ally, but that with the chaos, incompetence, and incoherence coming out of the White House, the United States can no longer prevent Putin from dominating the world stage.
6
Donald must be nervous . He'll be lucky if the only shoes that drop are some videotapes and financial statements.
2
A game of tennis:
Trump: 15-0, the ball was in
Putin: Nyet, in is out, and I win the point 15-0 for me
Trump: OK, but do I still get to build my hotel in St. Petersburg?
Putin: What about the sanctions?
Trump: OK, I'll try to rescind the sanctions
Putin: OK, but now the game is 30- for me
Trump: What?
Morals of the story:
*Don't play games with the Russians - they don't play by the rules!
*American Capitalistka only know about money, not Diplomatika
Trump: 15-0, the ball was in
Putin: Nyet, in is out, and I win the point 15-0 for me
Trump: OK, but do I still get to build my hotel in St. Petersburg?
Putin: What about the sanctions?
Trump: OK, I'll try to rescind the sanctions
Putin: OK, but now the game is 30- for me
Trump: What?
Morals of the story:
*Don't play games with the Russians - they don't play by the rules!
*American Capitalistka only know about money, not Diplomatika
4
As Bill Maher said some time ago, "Remember the Cold War? Well, it is back. But one thing is different. In the old Cold War, the White House was on our side!"
23
'...the Russians “are trying to undermine Western democracy.” His boss has never uttered a similar phrase.' That's because his boss, the president, is also trying to undermine democracy in the US.
13
Trump has a soft spot for Russia. Why not?
Eric Trump, " Well, we don't rely on American banks. We have all the funding we need out of Russia." Robert Mueller will examine all streams of funding into the Trump business enterprise.
Most rational thinking Americans realize Russia interfered with our election. We have no soft spot for Russia. We had no issue with the Obama sanctions.
We have no issue with the expanded sanctions.
Time to let Putin know we are still very much engaged.
Eric Trump, " Well, we don't rely on American banks. We have all the funding we need out of Russia." Robert Mueller will examine all streams of funding into the Trump business enterprise.
Most rational thinking Americans realize Russia interfered with our election. We have no soft spot for Russia. We had no issue with the Obama sanctions.
We have no issue with the expanded sanctions.
Time to let Putin know we are still very much engaged.
9
"Most rational thinking Americans realize Russia interfered with our election. We have no soft spot for Russia. We had no issue with the Obama sanctions.
We have no issue with the expanded sanctions."
Way off base. While I do not doubt many countries, groups and individuals may attempt to infiltrate our security systems, this outsized focus on Russia is over the top. This is being used to weaken the Trump presidency by the powers that be. IMHO
We have no issue with the expanded sanctions."
Way off base. While I do not doubt many countries, groups and individuals may attempt to infiltrate our security systems, this outsized focus on Russia is over the top. This is being used to weaken the Trump presidency by the powers that be. IMHO
Totally disagree as well. Putin's interest in favoring Trump's election was to make sure a major rival would be grossly mismanaged for at least four years and thus neutralized to a great extent. All other considerations are of second order.
8
Yes, but of course.
while Putin's interest in the gross mismanagement of the the USA was certainly the goal of his meddling in support of Trump, the sanctions coming back are certainly unwelcome and overrode the fact of DT's ascendancy to office to a significant degree
Will the other shoe ,so to be speak, be allowed to drop,i.e, the calling in of the chits by Putin from Trump and other assorted Burrs for lack of product delivered? Is Twitter available in Russia?
2
Putin owes Euro banks. He's losing money due to the low price of a barrel of oil. He thought he could pull one over on us by nudging the orange thing in, too bad, we're not gonna take it.
7
Absurd headline. Putin wanted to create chaos in the US. He's succeeded spectacularly.
6
Chaos and Disarray
The United States is weaker under Trump than under any other imaginable person. Probably the Putin agenda was more an effort to sow conflict and partisanship as a way to put handcuffs on American effectiveness in the world.
We should doubt whether Putin has any preference for Trump OTHER than he is the dumbest and weakest choice for high office; Trump is venal and self-interested. This is what makes him so weak and manipulable.
The United States is weaker under Trump than under any other imaginable person. Probably the Putin agenda was more an effort to sow conflict and partisanship as a way to put handcuffs on American effectiveness in the world.
We should doubt whether Putin has any preference for Trump OTHER than he is the dumbest and weakest choice for high office; Trump is venal and self-interested. This is what makes him so weak and manipulable.
12
The United States is stronger under Trump. Businesses are booming, the economy is growing at a much faster rate than under Obama, and we are now the major player in providing energy to Europe. Putin always favored Hillary, that's why he donated to her. He just wanted to weaken her because he thought she was going to win, and he knew he would have leverage over her.
@Reasonable
"The United States is stronger under Trump."
Wrong.
If anything, the United States is more divided than ever under Trump.
And another thing -- You seem to forget that it was the Obama administration that pulled this country out of the Recession left to it by George 'W' Bush.
Try again.
"The United States is stronger under Trump."
Wrong.
If anything, the United States is more divided than ever under Trump.
And another thing -- You seem to forget that it was the Obama administration that pulled this country out of the Recession left to it by George 'W' Bush.
Try again.
If the assertion of collusion between Trump campaign and Russian by Democrats is suppose to hold true then any reasoning or assumption by anyone in the west that Putin wishes to improve ties with the US despite the newest round of sanctions logically does not make sense.
Cutting to the chase, will these sancations curtail any Democrats' demands for impeachment or will their rhetoric continue unabated?
Cutting to the chase, will these sancations curtail any Democrats' demands for impeachment or will their rhetoric continue unabated?
1
Disagree. Putin knew trump would be an incompetent leader.
6
Aaahhh...we know this bromance would hit the pavement at some point.
First, the misconception that Trump as a , Ahem, president, could pull all the chords for Putin's symphony. Not so. Forgot about the Constitution and the American people.
Second, this bravado could all be a ruse; maybe no one is that angry and it will (pat, pat on the knee) all be OK. (Wink, wink.) No one would have to know that the charade is just that. One question remains; should this get feisty, would Putin sell his friend out and subsequent documents, pictures, statements appear that would be incriminating to Donald? Is that what Donald is so scared of?
Along with investigating his tax returns, there may be more than money laundering. One can only hope.
Mr. Muller, we put our trust in you!!
First, the misconception that Trump as a , Ahem, president, could pull all the chords for Putin's symphony. Not so. Forgot about the Constitution and the American people.
Second, this bravado could all be a ruse; maybe no one is that angry and it will (pat, pat on the knee) all be OK. (Wink, wink.) No one would have to know that the charade is just that. One question remains; should this get feisty, would Putin sell his friend out and subsequent documents, pictures, statements appear that would be incriminating to Donald? Is that what Donald is so scared of?
Along with investigating his tax returns, there may be more than money laundering. One can only hope.
Mr. Muller, we put our trust in you!!
1
How would you know what Putin's goals were/are? Also Trump's. Also Pence's... etcetera. Putin and Trump and Pence are trashing their countries, while their bank accounts grow (at least temporarily). I don't think Putin cares about Russia. Positive Note: Not educated enough to get away with money laundering. ---- The USA should have voted for Hillary, simply because of saving taxpayer money. The USA was in no position to be able to "afford Trump/Pence" ... now Scaramucci etcetera.
2
Putin and his band of criminal followers have been extremely successful stealing from the Russian people over the past 17 years. But what good is being a criminal if you can't access the money you've stolen? Trump was supposed to fix this, but things are not going as planned. Once they unwind all of the trump family transactions involving dirty Russian money they won't have a business left. He probably won't have a positive net worth. And he sure as heck won't be President.
7
I didn't appreciate Trump's tweets that those of us opposed to his embrace of Russia are just foolish and stupid. Seems HE is helped by a double standard. The country went berserk when Clinton talked about deplorables, while Trump got away with calling an even greater number of Americans foolish and stupid!
4
I wonder... and feel strongly that this is preplanned. Can you hear that conversation, as nefarious as one could think. Trump: "I'll kick out all the Russian diplomats and do the sanction thing, and you, Putin, kick out all of our American diplomats from Russia and together we'll take care of business without all the interference." (some words may be too big for the Trump, but the message is the same). ... ok, and the conversation with the Munch guy the new WHCom director. "Make a lot of noise and get rid of Preibis" Don't you just think things are being orchestrated to look like something other than what is really going on? I may be paranoid but the way things are going, seems like we need to think four square instead of 2 square, if you get my meaning.
1
Aw, we've upset Putin. The Law of Unintended Consequences and a gross misreading of how things work here.
2
Totally disagree. By helping the United States elect a president that daily undermines the rule of law, Putin has won. The chaotic hole in Western solidarity that the Trump presidency has produced are a huge gain for all of the corrupt dictators around the world. America has lost the moral high ground, and it may take generations to regain it.
Sanctions were a small price to pay.
Sanctions were a small price to pay.
17
ITA, plus we seem to be forgetting that the Trump admin has an uncanny way of conducting "forgotten" meetings with the Putin regime. Trump, as potus, has the power to declassify any info he deems appropriate. The heck with Trump's vulnerability to flattery. With Putin's ability to blackmail, who knows what clever back channels are being used to obtain such info? Comey was right. "They'll be back". In fact, they probably have standing reservations at the feeding trough.
1
So a bunch of movers and shakers tried to acquire private ownership of Russia's oil fields and exploit these without returning any of the profit to Russia. Putin said no to this and is forever the enemy hereafter.
My heart goes out to the poor people of Russia for all the suffering they have had to endure, past and present. Maybe one day they'll enjoy the living standards they deserve from all their hard work and sacrifice. I hope they can be wise enough not to hate the ordinary people of the West for all this, but keep their rage confined towards our power elites. It's not our fault. We can't change the political agenda by how we vote anymore. The marginalisation of Donald Trump is proof of that.
My heart goes out to the poor people of Russia for all the suffering they have had to endure, past and present. Maybe one day they'll enjoy the living standards they deserve from all their hard work and sacrifice. I hope they can be wise enough not to hate the ordinary people of the West for all this, but keep their rage confined towards our power elites. It's not our fault. We can't change the political agenda by how we vote anymore. The marginalisation of Donald Trump is proof of that.
3
I reject the idea that Democrats blame Russia for Election loss. That's what Trump says. Not true. We lost because Hillary just can't connect with people. We hoped she could. She didn't.
9
How could Russia have "interfered in our democracy" when we don't have a democracy? As former Pres Carter said, we are an oligarchy.
At the Democrat primary last year, "super delegates" including some corporate lobbyists, had one vote each that were equal to thousands of votes of the lowly base. If that was not a repudiation of our democratic "one person, one vote" principle, I don't know what was. Blatant, corrupt, cheating and lying interference with "our democracy".
The Russia hack story was cooked up by Podesta and Clinton. The losers. Now to hear Democrats whining and ginning up fear about Russia, makes me repudiate them, forever. I left the pathetic cheating, lying DNC manipulated Democrats and although I will never vote Republican, I will never vote for a Democrat again unless they drastically reform. That includes Sen "Saint" Warren, who has jumped on the neocon warmonger McCain train, and is asserting that Russia will be the most important issue of 2018. I had regretted that she had not run as an Independent, but now I see that she is really a true Democrat. I will not make the mistake of voting for her again.
At the Democrat primary last year, "super delegates" including some corporate lobbyists, had one vote each that were equal to thousands of votes of the lowly base. If that was not a repudiation of our democratic "one person, one vote" principle, I don't know what was. Blatant, corrupt, cheating and lying interference with "our democracy".
The Russia hack story was cooked up by Podesta and Clinton. The losers. Now to hear Democrats whining and ginning up fear about Russia, makes me repudiate them, forever. I left the pathetic cheating, lying DNC manipulated Democrats and although I will never vote Republican, I will never vote for a Democrat again unless they drastically reform. That includes Sen "Saint" Warren, who has jumped on the neocon warmonger McCain train, and is asserting that Russia will be the most important issue of 2018. I had regretted that she had not run as an Independent, but now I see that she is really a true Democrat. I will not make the mistake of voting for her again.
7
Enjoy living in your tiny b. x reality. The rest of us will see the regime ousted or living in Russia or jail.
Independents are supposed to think - rationally. I suggest to change your handle.
What startling unanimity in comments--all (?) agreeing with a war-mongering 'analysis' riling up readers. Forget that there is strong new evidence that Russia did not hack the DNC emails but that someone within the DNC leaked them. Forget Russian 'meddling.' The election was won by Trump because the Dems had no constructive domestic policy. Trump promised jobs. Dems? And now? Not better healthcare, more jobs, relief from crippling student debt. Just non-stop Blame Putin!
7
"there is strong new evidence that Russia did not hack the DNC emails but that someone within the DNC leaked them."
Gee. I did a pretty thorough search on that and the most recent (valid) info I found was on FactCheck.org which, on 070617, stated:
"U.S. intelligence has named only Russia as the culprit. A Jan. 6 report based on the work of three intelligence agencies said Putin “ordered” a broad “influence campaign” to help elect Trump."
Then you said "Trump promised jobs. Dems? And now? Not better healthcare, more jobs, relief from crippling student debt." The only thing I can surmise from that is that you must have "selective info" skills.
Gee. I did a pretty thorough search on that and the most recent (valid) info I found was on FactCheck.org which, on 070617, stated:
"U.S. intelligence has named only Russia as the culprit. A Jan. 6 report based on the work of three intelligence agencies said Putin “ordered” a broad “influence campaign” to help elect Trump."
Then you said "Trump promised jobs. Dems? And now? Not better healthcare, more jobs, relief from crippling student debt." The only thing I can surmise from that is that you must have "selective info" skills.
not that anyone is reading this but this group is an extremely trustworthy source:
https://consortiumnews.com/2017/07/24/intel-vets-challenge-russia-hack-e...
and medicare-for-all anyone? no, not now, say dems.
https://consortiumnews.com/2017/07/24/intel-vets-challenge-russia-hack-e...
and medicare-for-all anyone? no, not now, say dems.
Citing Kennan’s essay is either ignorant or disingenuous. Since Sanger is an intelligent guy, I’m going with the latter.
It’s 2017, not 1947. Russia is not the Soviet Union in size, capability, or malevolence. Hostile Russian forces are not located within 100 miles of the heart of Germany, but about 1,000 miles. There is no Warsaw Pact on the horizon.
Yet, perhaps it is worth revisiting Kennan’s essay, if only to ask ourselves the difficult question of whose “expansive tendencies” now require “vigilant containment”.
It’s 2017, not 1947. Russia is not the Soviet Union in size, capability, or malevolence. Hostile Russian forces are not located within 100 miles of the heart of Germany, but about 1,000 miles. There is no Warsaw Pact on the horizon.
Yet, perhaps it is worth revisiting Kennan’s essay, if only to ask ourselves the difficult question of whose “expansive tendencies” now require “vigilant containment”.
4
Backfires Spectacularly?
International relations especially with a country like Russia is not a zero-sum game with one side wins and the other side has to lose. In fact, both the US and Russia as well as the world are losing because rising tension and reverting to Cold War mentality between the two most powerful nuclear powers is downright dangerous.
For many observers with a long view of history, it is worth nothing that Russian annexation of Crimea and meddling in Ukraine and asserting its influence in Syria and elsewhere (or for that matter Chinese behavior in Asia Pacific) are to be expected given the US policies and actions regarding NATO expansion and attempting to turn Ukraine into an American client state. For US officials, Russian actions in Ukraine and Crimea are contrary to American democratic values and international laws and therefore sanctions are justified. But this argument can also be turned on its head against the US based on American actions elsewhere in the world.
For concerned Americans and readers of this article, the question is what will this lead to? The US military is exhausted and extended after many years of involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan. Trump is impulsive and seems to give a freehand to the generals. China and Russia are cozying up economically and militarily. The EU is increasingly estrange from the US. What Americans need from their elected officials is somber and cooler heads and appreciation of history.
International relations especially with a country like Russia is not a zero-sum game with one side wins and the other side has to lose. In fact, both the US and Russia as well as the world are losing because rising tension and reverting to Cold War mentality between the two most powerful nuclear powers is downright dangerous.
For many observers with a long view of history, it is worth nothing that Russian annexation of Crimea and meddling in Ukraine and asserting its influence in Syria and elsewhere (or for that matter Chinese behavior in Asia Pacific) are to be expected given the US policies and actions regarding NATO expansion and attempting to turn Ukraine into an American client state. For US officials, Russian actions in Ukraine and Crimea are contrary to American democratic values and international laws and therefore sanctions are justified. But this argument can also be turned on its head against the US based on American actions elsewhere in the world.
For concerned Americans and readers of this article, the question is what will this lead to? The US military is exhausted and extended after many years of involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan. Trump is impulsive and seems to give a freehand to the generals. China and Russia are cozying up economically and militarily. The EU is increasingly estrange from the US. What Americans need from their elected officials is somber and cooler heads and appreciation of history.
4
What we need is a real President. What we need is a functioning Congress. We are so far from either that I'm not sure we even are a country anymore, but rather an empty shell that just keeps going because no one pulled the plug yet.
1
Putin is playing chess. trump is playing checkers.
7
I don't think Trump is capable of playing Tic Tac Toe.
1
I believe that, while this analysis is useful in discussing the return of a Cold War-style footing in US/Russian relations, this author and many other observers are underestimating Putin and reaching a faulty conclusion about his aims.
It is wrong-headed and a bit naive to believe that Putin thought that he would be able to install a full-on puppet in the White House who would do his bidding unquestioningly. It seems, rather, that Putin's aim was to destabilize and undermine the American political system, bring its legitimacy and ability to function into question and create an American government incapable of leading its allies in concerted action against Russian interests and actions. On these scores, Putin is three for three.
For so many Americans, including government officials, opinion makers and foreign policy experts, to buy in to the simplistic "Trump-as-Putin's-Stooge" reading is not only misguided. Doing so is dangerous and plays into Putin's hand.
It is wrong-headed and a bit naive to believe that Putin thought that he would be able to install a full-on puppet in the White House who would do his bidding unquestioningly. It seems, rather, that Putin's aim was to destabilize and undermine the American political system, bring its legitimacy and ability to function into question and create an American government incapable of leading its allies in concerted action against Russian interests and actions. On these scores, Putin is three for three.
For so many Americans, including government officials, opinion makers and foreign policy experts, to buy in to the simplistic "Trump-as-Putin's-Stooge" reading is not only misguided. Doing so is dangerous and plays into Putin's hand.
2
It's too bad the world's economy tanked just at the time the Soviet Union fell. It games people such as Putin the opportunity to blame the west for Russia's failure to achieve the prosperity many thought they would have after Communism. And blame the west is what helped propel Putin to power and what he continues to use to remain in power.
Unfortunately the Russian public is not allowed to understand that they and the west share a common enemy in radical Islam. It's just too bad we can't work together to help protect us all from it.
Unfortunately the Russian public is not allowed to understand that they and the west share a common enemy in radical Islam. It's just too bad we can't work together to help protect us all from it.
Trump tried to give Putin all he wanted but the investigation got in the way. Trump would never have signed these sanctions if it was not a veto-proof majority.
6
The restarting of the new cold war with Russia happened around 2014 under President Obama and was enhanced in 2015 with Russia interfering in our regime change operation in Syria. So I was in favor of Trump's message to have peace with Russia, a country it is to our advantage to have good relations. Therefore, I feel the actions of Congress increasing sanctions on Russia, Iran and even North Korea is not in the best interest of Americans and may be putting us all at risk, IMHO.
2
Putin has won and continues to win as the Trump administration is in complete disarray and disengaged from world events.
I believe this is playing out exactly as Putin had envisioned. He knew that Congress would eventually draw the line as they've done, but every day Trump brings more disruption internally which only helps Putin advance his own agenda both domestically and internationally.
I believe this is playing out exactly as Putin had envisioned. He knew that Congress would eventually draw the line as they've done, but every day Trump brings more disruption internally which only helps Putin advance his own agenda both domestically and internationally.
7
So there is another thing Trump and Putin have in common: They don't know how the U.S. government works.
4
"They don't know how the U.S. government works."
Maybe not, but Putin has the advantage of knowing more about it then Trump. Then again, Trump IS beating him at creating utter chaos for the (un)USA. In any case, they're both succeeding at doing their damage.
Maybe not, but Putin has the advantage of knowing more about it then Trump. Then again, Trump IS beating him at creating utter chaos for the (un)USA. In any case, they're both succeeding at doing their damage.
It seems congress breathes on having confrontation with Russia.If that is not there what else can they do to excite the people.Trump is right to build or patch up relations with the second most powerful country in the world next to US.hOW WILL CONFRONTATION WITH RUSSIA HELP SOLVE THE WORD PROBLEMS.
1
Putin interfered with our elections, possibly in collusion with individuals in the Trump campaign. We don't know the answer to the collusion issue yet, but as long as it is a possibility, Trump cannot be trusted in regard to Russia/US relations. Congress acted appropriately when Trump refused to punish Russia and, indeed, did all he could, and continues to do all he can to discredit investigations into the interference. That Trump is in place is the first big win for Putin not only because (I believe) Putin has a dossier full of damaging information about Trump and/or his family that can be used to extort Trump, but also because he knows that Trump is unhealthy mentally, Trump is unstable emotionally, and Trump pretty much destroys anyone who exists in his orb so that even if good people step in to try to help him, they will eventually lose all of their credibility. I expect more to come from Russia. I expect Trump to continue to bash our security and intelligence apparatus. I expect Trump to continue his assault on our voting rights. I expect the Republicans to continue to roll over (unless they lose the House in 2018, and if they do I am sure they will claim that they lost because there was so much fraud in the voting system). I'd say about the first five rounds have gone to Russia, with Trump cheering them on.
3
So far we really don't know what Putin did, anyone can hack computers including the USA, and they all do. We do have lots of propaganda, Trump is not the only liar. There are the WMD in Iraq and the Gulf of Ton kin and all the other lies. There has been no indication of Putin wanting to invade the Baltic States. He would not risk a nuclear war in Europe, neither would the Europeans. Would the US risk her own American cities?
Why demonize Putin, he was willing to work with western powers and he did? He has Russian interests to protect too.
The US is waging economic warfare against NK, Iran and Russia among others. The US has waged war in Korea leaving scorched earth behind, and has taken down an elected Iranian government putting the Shah in its place and is provoking Russia by moving NATO to the Russian borders. Don't forget the involvement of the Bush and Obama administration in the UKRAINE, ask Victoria Nuland. They installed a right-wing government in Kiev.
It is Trump's business and politics that just don't mix. We can't believe either side. Not to forget, this nation interferes in other nations elections all the time, it hacks other governments, including friendly governments too. It is called politics.
Why demonize Putin, he was willing to work with western powers and he did? He has Russian interests to protect too.
The US is waging economic warfare against NK, Iran and Russia among others. The US has waged war in Korea leaving scorched earth behind, and has taken down an elected Iranian government putting the Shah in its place and is provoking Russia by moving NATO to the Russian borders. Don't forget the involvement of the Bush and Obama administration in the UKRAINE, ask Victoria Nuland. They installed a right-wing government in Kiev.
It is Trump's business and politics that just don't mix. We can't believe either side. Not to forget, this nation interferes in other nations elections all the time, it hacks other governments, including friendly governments too. It is called politics.
2
Putin may have thought Trump would lift sanctions, but there is also a windfall in Trump for Putin. I think even Putin did not expect the chaos that has come to the US White House and government. Chaos and distraction in US government is good for Putin for several reasons. Firstly it takes the focus away from Russia as a bad actor. No one is lecturing Russia about democracy. But Trump also weakens NATO. Russia can then take more of a leadership role in the world: Russia may seem more "normal" on the world stage compared to US, visa vis international trade, climate change policies, etc.
2
Just like situations when organized criminal syndicates realize they can no longer extract or extort favorable policy decisions from persons who have been drawn into the web of loan sharking because they have such pathetic business credit risks, money laundering schemes, and nefarious lending practices involving shell corporations to hide transactions, Vladimir Putin - no stranger to strong-armed international self-enrichment - now perceives Donald Trump "politically weak" and realizes American lawmakers may be at an inflection point where push-back is occurring, our free press and media are ever-exposing the chaos and criminality within the Executive Branch, and a growing majority of Americans have sensed Donald Trump is a massive mistake, joke, totally incompetent, incapable of leadership, and nothing but a narcissist and megalomaniac, lacking the temperament to govern as POTUS.
All previous cultured quid-pro-quo promises of policies favorable to Russian interests (including US investment in oil and gas reserves) now have arrived at a decision node. Trump can no longer deliver on the promises he made in 2016 and prior years; Jared Kushner is in a similar spot. Putin and his team will now look for other stool pigeons in Senate and House of Representatives.
Donald Trump's (and inner circle of family ties to Russia) will now be exposed - Russia will have an insidious role through news leaks, various financial documents and transactions, and most salacious conduct.
All previous cultured quid-pro-quo promises of policies favorable to Russian interests (including US investment in oil and gas reserves) now have arrived at a decision node. Trump can no longer deliver on the promises he made in 2016 and prior years; Jared Kushner is in a similar spot. Putin and his team will now look for other stool pigeons in Senate and House of Representatives.
Donald Trump's (and inner circle of family ties to Russia) will now be exposed - Russia will have an insidious role through news leaks, various financial documents and transactions, and most salacious conduct.
4
I have very high regard for Mr.David Sanger but with due respect I beg to differ. Putin's investment is not in vain and he is a winner. 1) Putin got a puppet and weak American president. 2) Trump administration is destroying our education system and our future in jeopardy. 3) Trump is attacking our environment. 4) Our healthcare for poor and middle class people are under attack. 5) We have a chaotic and some time lunatic White House. 6) Our democracy is in ICU. 7) Our State Department is in weakest status what Putin is very happy about. 8) Our leadership role in the world is questionable because Trump likes isolationism .9) Our nation is extremely polarized and divided. 10) Racism is on the rise, KKK and hate groups are getting stronger, Muslims and Jews are under attack, civil rights are under assault, blacks and Hispanics are suffering, LGBT are out from military service. We have become a laughing stock in the world. Putin won , America lost.
9
As has been repeatedly reported in the NYT, the Russians' objective never was to throw the election or own Trump. It was to destabilize the American democratic process and citizens' trust in it. Aided by an ignorant president and his administration of plutocrats and fascists, they have succeeded beyond their wildest dreams - both domestically and internationally.
7
Russia's GDP is 1.3 trillion. That's half the GDP of CA. And somehow they are going to destroy the US. America's greatest enemy... get ready for this...America! "I've seen the enemy, he is us...". Just like imperial Rome, which was always at war to 'defend the Republic'. In reality the wars were fought to stuff pockets of the elites and also to capture slaves who would work for free. Unemployment rate in Rome was very very high. So when the barbarians attacked the army was spread too thin, elites were fighting among themselves and general populace completely disillusioned , there was no one to defend the Republic.
4
It is completely naive to think Putin and the Russians were excepting or even want better relations or a "pass" from the US. You really think they could care less about Hillary vs. Donald?
Their goal which they are accomplishing spectacularly is DESTABILIZATION.
A chaotic US government, run by amateurs gives Russia the upper hand in just about every scenario imaginable playing out on the world stage. To think they haven't gamed out the various potential responses by congress and the president is a woeful and dangerous underestimation of Russian Intelligence (in both meanings of the word).
Anyone who thinks the Russians aren't high fiving and toasting over the biggest and most success intel op, possibly in history, is just foolish.
Their goal which they are accomplishing spectacularly is DESTABILIZATION.
A chaotic US government, run by amateurs gives Russia the upper hand in just about every scenario imaginable playing out on the world stage. To think they haven't gamed out the various potential responses by congress and the president is a woeful and dangerous underestimation of Russian Intelligence (in both meanings of the word).
Anyone who thinks the Russians aren't high fiving and toasting over the biggest and most success intel op, possibly in history, is just foolish.
1
They had no way of knowing during those business transactions that he was an emotional child. His air of confidence is strong for short stints of time.
1
"They had no way of knowing during those business transactions that he was an emotional child"
The Russians are far from stupid and have had contact with the Trumps for years. Who easier then he, for them to manipulate? They undoubtedly know him more intimately then the average American does.
The Russians are far from stupid and have had contact with the Trumps for years. Who easier then he, for them to manipulate? They undoubtedly know him more intimately then the average American does.
Who would have thought. no honor among thieves ???
2
Putin bet he could help make America the laughing stock of the world. And he's winning that bet hands down.
1
Putin didn't wait for it. He got what he wanted and he wanted what he got.
America in disarray and now a flailing and failing country.
America in disarray and now a flailing and failing country.
2
Did Putin Tweet Donald that he "better hope there are no tapes"??
4
Now the upper hand is on the other foot.
2
Putin's goal was to destabilize his principal foe - the West.
With both Trump and Brexit that has been accomplished rather handily.
Putin is playing the long game.
Trump was and is just a useful chump along the way.
With both Trump and Brexit that has been accomplished rather handily.
Putin is playing the long game.
Trump was and is just a useful chump along the way.
3
If refusing to lift sanctions is all that our wounded, diminished democracy can manage to accomplish, the return of the cold war is warranted by Russia's red-hot attack on the 2016 presidential election, the effects of which have not yet been fully assessed. Everyone who sees Trump and Putin in the same photo frame knows that Putin is the alpha male and Trump is his fanboy and hand-picked inside man. Putin didn't get relief from sanctions, but he scored a huge victory, as all of the leaders of the Western world know, starting with Macron of France, who is stepping up to take the president's place on the world stage.
3
The relation between Putin and Trump and their calculus is moot, whatever they may be. The fact remains that sanctions hurt and they will not be lifted any time soon, they may even tighten. If Putin thought otherwise he may be a bigger fool that Trump. And he is still ignorant of the way the American government works.
3
Putin was afraid HRC would "sanctionize" and thereby marginalize Russia. Our incompetent POTUS has driven Congress to do that very job.
Every way you look at it Vlad, you lose.
That's not gloating. Comey's words were correct. They will be back.
Every way you look at it Vlad, you lose.
That's not gloating. Comey's words were correct. They will be back.
2
To
"Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit smoking.
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit drinking.
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit amphetamines!
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue!"
we can add
"Looks like I picked the wrong week to be Trump's friend."
"Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit smoking.
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit drinking.
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit amphetamines!
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue!"
we can add
"Looks like I picked the wrong week to be Trump's friend."
3
Trump envies Putin. He would like to be a ruthless, self-serving billionaire murdering dictator too. I bet he worships the ground Putin walks on & is so jealous that he can't also get away with anything he wants to, including having his enemies jailed or murdered. Trump wants to be Putin.
6
If Trump were a robot, we could say he's set on Malfunction.
As far as Putin goes, that's only guesswork. But for Trump, we have enough evidence: Not reliable. Likely to fail.
Time to pull the plug!
As far as Putin goes, that's only guesswork. But for Trump, we have enough evidence: Not reliable. Likely to fail.
Time to pull the plug!
4
We have a very weak president who is more concerned about increasing his wealth and power than he is about national security issues. Trump has been played like a used banjo by Putin. Trump has managed to divide the country and create total chaos within his administration. For this, trump will go down in history as the worst and most incompetent president in the history of the United States. He is our version of the Roman Emperor Caligula ...
6
I agree about Caligula. So who is Caligula's horse?
1
Scaramucci?
What is most disturbing to me is that senators like Lindsay Graham and Mitch McConnell would have the American people believe that Hillary Clinton was the coming of the anti-Christ just in order to consolidate power. So what did the GOP's unrelenting Hillary-bashing get us?
1. No tax returns to see where Trump's allegiances really lie.
2. Dirty business dealings like the sale of the Palm Beach house for $95 million to Dmitry Rybolovlev and junior's admission that a lot of their money comes from Russia.
3. A dossier whose contents, known to people like Sen. McCain, are coming to fruition http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article160622854.html
4. A country that is not working lead by a baby-man who can't think past 140 characters.
Thanks, GOP. What great patriots you are.
1. No tax returns to see where Trump's allegiances really lie.
2. Dirty business dealings like the sale of the Palm Beach house for $95 million to Dmitry Rybolovlev and junior's admission that a lot of their money comes from Russia.
3. A dossier whose contents, known to people like Sen. McCain, are coming to fruition http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article160622854.html
4. A country that is not working lead by a baby-man who can't think past 140 characters.
Thanks, GOP. What great patriots you are.
10
A fairly large number of Republicans though Obama was the anti-Christ...about 20%...that is a scary mind boggle in itself.
So, with Obama digging us out of the financial crisis, reducing unemployment, reducing the deficit and helping over 20 million people receive health insurance--all very transparently--he is still vilified by conservatives without any valid reasoning.
It will take Trump a couple more years, doing everything behind closed doors, to crash the economy if he gets his agenda done, but will still be praised by his conservative base and will certainly blame everyone else.
We won't progress long-term when too many don't feel the need to use critical thinking.
So, with Obama digging us out of the financial crisis, reducing unemployment, reducing the deficit and helping over 20 million people receive health insurance--all very transparently--he is still vilified by conservatives without any valid reasoning.
It will take Trump a couple more years, doing everything behind closed doors, to crash the economy if he gets his agenda done, but will still be praised by his conservative base and will certainly blame everyone else.
We won't progress long-term when too many don't feel the need to use critical thinking.
How did it backfire? The US is divided, confused and has no faith in its electoral system. You're the laughing stock of the developed world, isolated and alone.
Even a recent Pentagon study declares that the American Empire Is 'Collapsing' and it can't come soon enough.
https://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/pentagon-study-declares-ameri...
America needs a dose of reality.
US 'leadership' brought us unprovoked wars, illegal coups, regime changes, shock and awe, ultra-right wing or jihadi proxy armies, cluster bombs, depleted uranium, agent orange, CIA backed mujahideen, death squads, torture, assassinations, extraordinary renditions, black sites, Guantanamo, drone wars, big brother and the surveillance state, unfettered capitalism etc.
The US is the biggest and most 'exceptional' player when it comes to interfering in other countries' elections, so even if Russia did meddle in the 2016 elections by exposing the DNC's rigging of the primaries and letting voters know what a bunch of despicable bunch of liars and hypocrites run the supposed party of the working men and women, it is about time the US got a dose of their own medicine.
Hopefully the EU will have the backbone to retaliate against these idiotic sanctions.
Even though across the world, the US has continued, under ongoing neocon foreign policy influence, to regard itself as a hegemon, the facts speak otherwise.
Together with Brexit this whole Russia ruse will hopefully put an end to this delusion.
Even a recent Pentagon study declares that the American Empire Is 'Collapsing' and it can't come soon enough.
https://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/pentagon-study-declares-ameri...
America needs a dose of reality.
US 'leadership' brought us unprovoked wars, illegal coups, regime changes, shock and awe, ultra-right wing or jihadi proxy armies, cluster bombs, depleted uranium, agent orange, CIA backed mujahideen, death squads, torture, assassinations, extraordinary renditions, black sites, Guantanamo, drone wars, big brother and the surveillance state, unfettered capitalism etc.
The US is the biggest and most 'exceptional' player when it comes to interfering in other countries' elections, so even if Russia did meddle in the 2016 elections by exposing the DNC's rigging of the primaries and letting voters know what a bunch of despicable bunch of liars and hypocrites run the supposed party of the working men and women, it is about time the US got a dose of their own medicine.
Hopefully the EU will have the backbone to retaliate against these idiotic sanctions.
Even though across the world, the US has continued, under ongoing neocon foreign policy influence, to regard itself as a hegemon, the facts speak otherwise.
Together with Brexit this whole Russia ruse will hopefully put an end to this delusion.
4
Chris from Berlin , I suppose the russians are as pure as driven snow ? Not guilty at all but victims of U.S. aggression , think your rationale is rather skewed , not saying my country is perfect but keep in mind , today you were able to express your opinion in this forum which you would not be able to do in Russia , so lets keep our focus on the contents of this article .
1
@ sm
Your knowledge of Russia is obviously not first hand and you must have missed some of the commenters from Russia who have expressed their opinion in this very forum.
And - yes - this new escalation of tension is a direct result of American aggression towards Russia: expansion of Nato to Russia's borders, instigating a coup in Ukraine and installing an anti-semitic neo-fascist government there, etc. etc.
This whole Russia ruse was made up by HRC and John Podesta as an excuse for their loss to the Orange Ignoramus and the DNC hack was most likely an inside job
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/was_the_russian_hack_an_inside_job_2...
There will be a lot of crow eating once the truth comes out.
Your knowledge of Russia is obviously not first hand and you must have missed some of the commenters from Russia who have expressed their opinion in this very forum.
And - yes - this new escalation of tension is a direct result of American aggression towards Russia: expansion of Nato to Russia's borders, instigating a coup in Ukraine and installing an anti-semitic neo-fascist government there, etc. etc.
This whole Russia ruse was made up by HRC and John Podesta as an excuse for their loss to the Orange Ignoramus and the DNC hack was most likely an inside job
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/was_the_russian_hack_an_inside_job_2...
There will be a lot of crow eating once the truth comes out.
2
There surely will be a lot of crow eating , and you can send whatever links you like , however; I still maintain you view is skewed.
1
I too disagree with this analysis. Nothing Putin has done since the election has been reasonably calculated to improve relations: jets buzzing warships; deploying nukes; providing arms to the Taliban; antagonizing our intelligence community; releasing unflattering photographs; etc. Putin views us as an adversary in a zero-sum game and everything he has done works to diminish the stature of the United States.
Whatever Russian intelligence communicated to Trump is working. Have you ever seen a head of state fawn so much over another? Former Dep. Director of the CIA Mike Morrell stated his belief that Trump is an unwitting Russian agent. I agree. Remember the calls to dismantle NATO? The naive promise of a grand Russo-American alliance? What about the secret meetings with Russian intelligence? A Manchurian president, Siberian horse, unwitting Russian agent, call it what you will, but Trump's actions demonstrate an undeniable eagerness to Make Russia Great Again.
Whatever Russian intelligence communicated to Trump is working. Have you ever seen a head of state fawn so much over another? Former Dep. Director of the CIA Mike Morrell stated his belief that Trump is an unwitting Russian agent. I agree. Remember the calls to dismantle NATO? The naive promise of a grand Russo-American alliance? What about the secret meetings with Russian intelligence? A Manchurian president, Siberian horse, unwitting Russian agent, call it what you will, but Trump's actions demonstrate an undeniable eagerness to Make Russia Great Again.
2
Putin has achieved way more than "improved relations".
He has eroded American power and influence.
His intelligence operations has made that happen:
Battering HRC with stolen docs and using various media outlets to spread lies.
He hoped for a weakened President.
Then he dangled an incriminating meeting trapping Junior, Incitatus Kushner, and an inexperienced and unsophisticated Manafort.
HRC lost.
So now Putin has a mentally ill, incompetent,
and compromised man in the White House,
who has eroded American influence and power.
How is this "backfire". I'm sure there's a Russian baker who can make the best chocolate cake you've ever tasted.
He has eroded American power and influence.
His intelligence operations has made that happen:
Battering HRC with stolen docs and using various media outlets to spread lies.
He hoped for a weakened President.
Then he dangled an incriminating meeting trapping Junior, Incitatus Kushner, and an inexperienced and unsophisticated Manafort.
HRC lost.
So now Putin has a mentally ill, incompetent,
and compromised man in the White House,
who has eroded American influence and power.
How is this "backfire". I'm sure there's a Russian baker who can make the best chocolate cake you've ever tasted.
3
Trump's forbidding US press when Russian visitors beheld the Oval Office gave Putin the idea he had an in. Also meeting sneakily abroad may have given Vladmir the wrong impression.
He didn't realize Donald isn't the only individual in charge of the US. And finally those individuals, Congress, let Putin know.
Poor Donald. Maybe one of these days he'll catch on. But probably not.
He didn't realize Donald isn't the only individual in charge of the US. And finally those individuals, Congress, let Putin know.
Poor Donald. Maybe one of these days he'll catch on. But probably not.
2
If Trump gives Putin the impression that his hands are tied, he may be able to avoid having any kompromat being released, all the while placating our nation that he is in support of the sanctions.
1
There was no "glory" in the Soviet Union. For the US to accept Russia, Russia must hold free and open elections.
2
Everyone here expresses joy that, "...Mr. Trump’s hands are now tied in dealing with Moscow, probably for years to come." Great, so we've replaced Trump, who had a good relationship with Putin with what?
How will we manage our relations with Russia going forward, especially in a crisis, when we have a president whose "hands are tied"?
A deeply divided Congress? Urgent foreign policy negotiations by 535 House members and 100 senators? Congress has the power of oversight and consent for treaties and foreign policy, but how do 635 politicians manage a relationship?
I am not sure how putting Trump in a bind serves us well, especially since Russia is escalating hostilities when we already had sanctions in place.
How will we manage our relations with Russia going forward, especially in a crisis, when we have a president whose "hands are tied"?
A deeply divided Congress? Urgent foreign policy negotiations by 535 House members and 100 senators? Congress has the power of oversight and consent for treaties and foreign policy, but how do 635 politicians manage a relationship?
I am not sure how putting Trump in a bind serves us well, especially since Russia is escalating hostilities when we already had sanctions in place.
1
Are you realizing that "good relations" with Russia via Trump is ceding clean elections in America? It isnt speculation that they were in our business.
Nobody but Trump and his cult-like followers seems to be OK with that.
No. Putin was not seeking improved "ties." He was seeking, and expecting, to be "untied" from the sanctions and constraints that hamper his desire for empire.
2
"The new sanctions were passed by a coalition of Democrats who blame Mr. Putin for contributing to Hillary Clinton’s defeat and Republicans fearful that their president misunderstands who he is dealing with in Moscow."
Nobody thinks trump "misunderstands." Republicans are fearful that their president doesn't care about anything related to Russia except that he, his family and their wealth are protected and enriched. So sad that they are also more fearful for their own prospects than their concern for their country.
Nobody thinks trump "misunderstands." Republicans are fearful that their president doesn't care about anything related to Russia except that he, his family and their wealth are protected and enriched. So sad that they are also more fearful for their own prospects than their concern for their country.
The problem is more the United States than Russia, and how our broadcast media, desperate for a scoop while trying to appear fair-and-balanced, eagerly bought into Russia's hacking-and-propaganda campaign. As long as someone is buying the drugs, there will always be smugglers and dealers.
5
Yes, sanctions may dim slightly Russian and more directly Putin's fortunes. However, by helping install an authoritarian, paranoid and grossly incompetent leader who is beholden to him- Putin has significantly weakened NATO, jeopardized the American economy and SIGNIFICANTLY eroded US stature domestically and abroad. The US is no longer the "leader" of the free world- and its economic advantages will dwindle as it is no longer seen as politically stable. The real miscalculation may be that Putin thought Trump was sane enough to avoid nuclear confrontation. I don't believe he is.
4
He may not have nailed this small aspect of the mission but he has already succeeded in severely damaging America's democracy, internal stability and position in the global community. All that promises to get much worse for us and therefore better for him before DT is done with us. He is way better than us at playing the long game and this is a MUCH more valuable long term benefit than a few piddling sanctions. I would call that 'Mission Accomplished'.
We are in SERIOUS trouble here....
We are in SERIOUS trouble here....
3
Much of the injury to the U.S.'s standing in the world is self-inflicted. Trump may not have won the popular vote, and Russia played a role in the election outcome, but regular citizens haven't done enough to combat the gerrymandering and pandering to corporate interests that have turned our national legislative bodies into such a disgrace.
Sad but true.....
Does anyone really think Putin is worse off with Trump than he would have been with HRC? And then, there is the personal enjoyment Putin must get when he thinks of HRC holed up eating her own guts out because she lost to Trump--let me say that again, she lost to Trump.
Putin is in no worse position now in his relationship with the U.S. than he was with Obama? In fact, the friction with the U.S. does nothing more than help him maintain his approval ratings with his home audience. Putin will run next year, in 2018, for one more 6-year term, and he will get it. Putin has helped split Turkey off from NATO (did anyone read that Turkey has signed up to buy a Russian anti-aircraft missile system incompatible with NATO); he is helping Iran ascend to a position of dominance in the Middle East, with Iran soon to have a road directly to the Mediterranean Sea through Iraq (the U.S. gift to Iran), Syria and Lebanon; we have helped him by getting the Germans mad at us with our latest unilateral sanctions (without consulting the E.U.) for trying interfere with their decision-making process when it comes to energy policy related to another Russia to E.U. natural gas pipeline; he is more cozy than ever with the Chinese, who have their own successfully policy of bringing no-strings-attached infrastructure to the developing world, particularly in Africa; and, Russia and China watch as the U.S. thrashes about helplessly trying to figure out what to do about North Korea.
Putin is in no worse position now in his relationship with the U.S. than he was with Obama? In fact, the friction with the U.S. does nothing more than help him maintain his approval ratings with his home audience. Putin will run next year, in 2018, for one more 6-year term, and he will get it. Putin has helped split Turkey off from NATO (did anyone read that Turkey has signed up to buy a Russian anti-aircraft missile system incompatible with NATO); he is helping Iran ascend to a position of dominance in the Middle East, with Iran soon to have a road directly to the Mediterranean Sea through Iraq (the U.S. gift to Iran), Syria and Lebanon; we have helped him by getting the Germans mad at us with our latest unilateral sanctions (without consulting the E.U.) for trying interfere with their decision-making process when it comes to energy policy related to another Russia to E.U. natural gas pipeline; he is more cozy than ever with the Chinese, who have their own successfully policy of bringing no-strings-attached infrastructure to the developing world, particularly in Africa; and, Russia and China watch as the U.S. thrashes about helplessly trying to figure out what to do about North Korea.
2
This article makes me very nervous. Sounds like the investigation of the trump family and friends meeting with Russians will now be buried under the sanctions that Congress has forced Trump to make. Could it be that this is what trump wanted to take the heat off of him and his administration? I don't trust trump.
The investigation will not be buried. It's just going to take some time. Have faith that the truth will win out. Trust Mueller and his staff.
1
How can The Times possibly know what Putin hoped? Where is the support for this claim?
"President Vladimir V. Putin bet that Donald J. Trump, who had spoken fondly of Russia and its authoritarian leader for years, would treat his nation as Mr. Putin has longed to have it treated by the West"
"President Vladimir V. Putin bet that Donald J. Trump, who had spoken fondly of Russia and its authoritarian leader for years, would treat his nation as Mr. Putin has longed to have it treated by the West"
5
It's backfiring because of the views and actions of congress. If it were up to Trump those sanctions would not happen.
What Putin has accomplished:
-US leadership in the world has dramatically weakened
-US image in the world is severely damaged
-EU, as well China, have filled in the leadership role in world stage
-More trade deals have been done, without US participation
-Many talents in the world who can potentially land in the US are now explore other destinations, and some in the US have left
If you can undermine your rival to such extent, it's hard not to call it an utter success. This has been accomplished with the full support of GOP in the senate and congress.
-US leadership in the world has dramatically weakened
-US image in the world is severely damaged
-EU, as well China, have filled in the leadership role in world stage
-More trade deals have been done, without US participation
-Many talents in the world who can potentially land in the US are now explore other destinations, and some in the US have left
If you can undermine your rival to such extent, it's hard not to call it an utter success. This has been accomplished with the full support of GOP in the senate and congress.
2
Washington though lot feel is disconnected with US local politics is always connected with word politics. Washington is not only President but institutions lik Congress and Senate operate at certain level. That's the details difference between authoritarian and democratic rule. In Russia Putin might call all the shots but in US it's not just President ( assuming President is friendly to Moscow) there are others who govern.
You can put Putin’s influence of our election into a better perspective, when you think of the millions of us Americans who voted for Hillary Clinton regardless of Putin’s international-crime of espionage with further publishing the email that Russia collected because many of us thought Hillary would make a better President than Trump.
Maybe the American Public needs to look at our own part in further exploiting Hillary Clinton’s and the DNC’s espionage-emails or ask why more Democrats did not take to social media to defend Hillary more with the email allegations. Could some members of the DNC have simply been discussing who to better to send pledge cards to if Sanders won the Democratic Campaign when one DNC member wrote, ’…not my Southern Evangelist peeps’?
It may be that some Republicans were looking for a reason to rationalize voting for Trump and the sensationalized emails provided them a reason. However, if they were ‘looking’ for a reason to vote for Trump, maybe they would have found one anyway. Those Democrats who didn’t trust Hillary Clinton because of allegations in her past, may have also found the emails a reason not to support her.
Anybody, group, country or leader with access and ability can publish a candidate’s email if they are willing to take the legal consequences; and ‘count on’ the opposite political party or the leaning opposition in the candidate’s same party seeking out allegations amidst them all. Not much brains in that power, is there?
Maybe the American Public needs to look at our own part in further exploiting Hillary Clinton’s and the DNC’s espionage-emails or ask why more Democrats did not take to social media to defend Hillary more with the email allegations. Could some members of the DNC have simply been discussing who to better to send pledge cards to if Sanders won the Democratic Campaign when one DNC member wrote, ’…not my Southern Evangelist peeps’?
It may be that some Republicans were looking for a reason to rationalize voting for Trump and the sensationalized emails provided them a reason. However, if they were ‘looking’ for a reason to vote for Trump, maybe they would have found one anyway. Those Democrats who didn’t trust Hillary Clinton because of allegations in her past, may have also found the emails a reason not to support her.
Anybody, group, country or leader with access and ability can publish a candidate’s email if they are willing to take the legal consequences; and ‘count on’ the opposite political party or the leaning opposition in the candidate’s same party seeking out allegations amidst them all. Not much brains in that power, is there?
3
Putin and Trump have a quiet tête-à-tête with only a Russian translator, shortly thereafter Trump decides to pull support from Syrian rebel forces and Putin gets protection for Assad. John McCain was so angered that he wrote, “If these reports are true, the administration is playing right into the hands of Vladimir Putin. Making any concession to Russia, absent a broader strategy for Syria, is irresponsible and short-sighted.” I think Putin is getting everything he paid for.
2
I'm not an expert, but I reject the widespread idea that Putin sought to put Trump in the White House as a "friend". Putin has little hope for or interest in a friendly USA. He wants a much weaker one. He bet on Trump as someone who would weaken the US, by exacerbating divisions, weakening institutions, and disrupting alliances. If there is minor fallout in the form of sanctions, that would be made up many times over by the weakening of the US position in the world, and the divisions he will exploit between the US and Europe.
There are wins and losses on both sides. For Russia, the continuing sanctions are hurting long-term investment in untapped oil and gas fields in the Arctic and elsewhere. On the other hand, these sanctions imposed by the “evil and decadent West” are a convenient whipping boy Putin uses in state-controlled media to explain away whatever problems Russia has and enhance his own image as the defender of Russian honor and sovereignty.
The biggest loss for the US was Trump becoming president. Who can even begin to imagine the long-term consequences of that. These first six months have been exhausting and, frankly, unbelievable. In addition to Russian interference and probable collusion in the election, I believe Trump laundered Russian oligarch money to finance his real estate empire. Mueller’s investigation, I’m convinced, will eventually expose that and in the process reveal why Trump refuses to release his taxes. The biggest gain for the US is the emboldened Senate which is standing up to Trump’s threats and bluster and exercising their role of ‘advice and consent’ in a more assertive way.
On balance, Russia comes out way ahead in this exchange. They may not have achieved their immediate goal (the lifting of the sanctions), but they’ll attempt to thwart US interests at every turn and at some point release kompromat on Trump which will further damage US standing in the world.
The biggest loss for the US was Trump becoming president. Who can even begin to imagine the long-term consequences of that. These first six months have been exhausting and, frankly, unbelievable. In addition to Russian interference and probable collusion in the election, I believe Trump laundered Russian oligarch money to finance his real estate empire. Mueller’s investigation, I’m convinced, will eventually expose that and in the process reveal why Trump refuses to release his taxes. The biggest gain for the US is the emboldened Senate which is standing up to Trump’s threats and bluster and exercising their role of ‘advice and consent’ in a more assertive way.
On balance, Russia comes out way ahead in this exchange. They may not have achieved their immediate goal (the lifting of the sanctions), but they’ll attempt to thwart US interests at every turn and at some point release kompromat on Trump which will further damage US standing in the world.
1
U.S. institutions are in shambles, we're weakened abroad, NATO allies doubt us, and the republic itself has been destabilized. Are you sure this was a backfire?
1
What is so blithely referred to in foreign policy circles as an "incident" or "miscalculation" is far more dangerous than those bland words.
Situations and intractable positions can ratchet up into super power stare downs very quickly. It is not easy or possible to blink or appear to look weak in such moments and there lies the true danger.
Perhaps even more so with Trump who lacks experience in power politics and seems to be less stable than other presidents in recent times.
And, he may feel the need to stand tough with Russia to counter the perception that he is cozy with Putin.
These are ingredients for life-threatening consequences.
We'd better all draw back from bad trouble.
Situations and intractable positions can ratchet up into super power stare downs very quickly. It is not easy or possible to blink or appear to look weak in such moments and there lies the true danger.
Perhaps even more so with Trump who lacks experience in power politics and seems to be less stable than other presidents in recent times.
And, he may feel the need to stand tough with Russia to counter the perception that he is cozy with Putin.
These are ingredients for life-threatening consequences.
We'd better all draw back from bad trouble.
I think what Putin really wanted is for Russia to return to prominence on the international stage. He now has that as the US has no coherent foreign policy, which increases the influence of the Russians. Even more, it benefits China.
3
Putin didn't think of the American press, public and politics.
How do you know? It's easier for him to look tough and competent to Russians when America looks like a mess.
Discord with Russia may not play into Putin's hand but it sure lays into Trump's. The more Russia appears threatening and the world in turmoil the more people tend to look the other way at Trump's abuse of power in the name of national security.
2
Republicans have constantly touted the takedown of the former Soviet Union over the past decades...anyone thinking the distaste in Russia's pallet has diminished is not really thinking things out.
Trump has no idea what Putin's end game is and is too naïve to realize it is not something that will benefit the world or the US. Trump is losing the battle of wits--not surprising.
Trump has no idea what Putin's end game is and is too naïve to realize it is not something that will benefit the world or the US. Trump is losing the battle of wits--not surprising.
1
Russia is an adversary, and will always be, unless something really dramatic happens in that country. Putin must go and allow the country to change. There is too much power in the hands of this one man. Putin, is a KGB and will always be one. The man cannot be trusted. His main objective is to revive the country's former Soviet era status. Trying to achieve that goal by creating disarray and chaos inside and outside his own country.
For some unknown reason, Trump did not recognize Russia as an adversary. He has openly praised Putin. Even disparaging our former POTUS, preferring Putin to be a better leader. Trump has discredited our own intelligence services, and continues to doubt and not recognize the ongoing Russian probe. This has all been disturbing and worrisome.
The recent sanctions legislation initiated by Congress is the right thing to do. Whether Putin likes it or not, is a different matter. Members in the Congress showed that they knew Russia better than our own POTUS. Congress did their duty by displaying their 'Check' on the Executive Branch. It is now left for Trump to come to grips to educate himself, and clear his ignorance. Trump's loyalty and allegiance is to our country, and he reports to our people.
For some unknown reason, Trump did not recognize Russia as an adversary. He has openly praised Putin. Even disparaging our former POTUS, preferring Putin to be a better leader. Trump has discredited our own intelligence services, and continues to doubt and not recognize the ongoing Russian probe. This has all been disturbing and worrisome.
The recent sanctions legislation initiated by Congress is the right thing to do. Whether Putin likes it or not, is a different matter. Members in the Congress showed that they knew Russia better than our own POTUS. Congress did their duty by displaying their 'Check' on the Executive Branch. It is now left for Trump to come to grips to educate himself, and clear his ignorance. Trump's loyalty and allegiance is to our country, and he reports to our people.
2
If this author's instincts are correct, then it's a lose-lose for Putin and Trump. Because, while Putin comes away empty-handed or worse, Trump's hands are no cleaner -- either from our perspective or from Putin's. Vlad may yet do us all a favor (including himself) by coming clean. He is very smart, after all, which is more than we can say for So-Called. He's also the less untrustworthy of the two. Thanks again, Republicans.
Doesn't look as if trump is going to get that Moscow hotel deal.
1
I think Putin has a winning strategy. He wouldn't do this to any other president. He feels Trump wants to please him and will respond in ways favorable to Russia. Trump would, id Congress didn't stop him.
Define failure. The US and NATO in chaos? That's worth a mass.
4
With America in turmoil thus paralyzed for next 4-8 years. Russian interference has paid out handsomely.
For our foes, our loose cannon is better than a bad cannon.
For our foes, our loose cannon is better than a bad cannon.
3
The Russians know Trump. They know the kind of fool he is. Putin got exactly what he wanted: a chaos ridden, destabilized government at war with itself, a rebuke of Nato and our allies, and a cyber hand in our election. Damage done. Now, it's cat and mouse between Putin and Trump as Trump squirms, overruled by Congress, thankfully.
If it were left up to Trump alone, Russia would own us. I suspect there is an issue of money laundering that the Russians have over Mr. Trump but only time and an investigation will tell.
If it were left up to Trump alone, Russia would own us. I suspect there is an issue of money laundering that the Russians have over Mr. Trump but only time and an investigation will tell.
14
Unfortunately the net long term effect from these sanctions war on US will be grossly negative.
I doubt that Putin bet on anything. He knows trump could never have been "bet on", that he is changeable as the wind. Putin is shrewd enough to accept the good with the bad, that trump is not two, but many-faced.
2
Putin bought a cheap knockoff Rolex watch from a slick salesman on 5th Ave and now he's upset that it doesn't keep time? He's what we in NYC call a rube. Welcome to the cast of millions disappointed in a Trump enterprise. Consider it your first lesson at Trump University, where you pass by failing.
3
Making the world safe for democracy surely has wasted this country, and so many others. Why must we forever oppose Russia? Why must we, by ourselves, doing it all our way, police the world? If we must police the world-- and I do believe we must root out and kill every terrorist, starting with the nascent nuke nuts running the governments of North Korea and Iran; we have no choice-- then wouldn't it be so much better to have a strong Russia and China with us in this global pest extermination? We don't like their politics-- so what? Do we like our politics? At least Russia and China are forces of order in this chaotic, overpopulated world. Stop all this sanction nonsense. Stop worrying about regional hegemony on the other side of the globe. Start fighting entropy here at home. Start getting our own shop in order. Or continue to face-- and facilitate!-- mass extinction.
3
"Russia and China are forces of order" That's rich! Actually, we here in America value and support liberty and justice for all, not "order" (that usually comes from the barrel of a gun). But nice try, tovarich.
2
I ain't your tovarich, or anyone's. And I agree with everything else you wrote. Ultimately, "liberty and justice for all" is our romantic notion of the order imposed upon us from the barrel of a gun.
This should have occurred last winter when Obama took action. Why the wait? What was Russia told that made them believe this act wasn't necessary? Putin doesn't appear to be a betting man. Putin must have known with some certainty -- not just the empty words of a narcissistic charlatan -- that the compounds would be returned and sanctions would be lifted. That certainty would come from leverage.
Trumps isn't this loyal to his wife, family, or friends. There is something else driving this loyalty to Putin and Putin's initial belief that Trump would help him.
Trumps isn't this loyal to his wife, family, or friends. There is something else driving this loyalty to Putin and Putin's initial belief that Trump would help him.
1
It would appear that even genius X KGB agents have the same flaw that most of the rest of us have. We want to think that the person who addresses us is telling us the truth. I am sorry to say that in this new Trump era that fact of human nature can become a fatal flaw in ones character. With the trump clan in power it seems that if you actually believe what you are told then it is entirely your fault for believing. The liar is no longer at fault. Has becoming an accomplished liar turned into a positive thing in American business and politics?
There is absolutely no doubt something is happening here. Im certainly no saint but I really dont like the idea of a presidential spokesperson having the equivalent of raw sewage spewing out of his mouth when he addresses the public. Are we wrong to expect our leaders to at the least, be someone we can admire and look up to even if we may have differences with their opinions?
In reality Putin is just another victim of trumps lies, just like the American people. Propaganda and a unparallelled liar have put this nation in a very precarious position I can only hope we as a nation can pull ourselves out of.
There is absolutely no doubt something is happening here. Im certainly no saint but I really dont like the idea of a presidential spokesperson having the equivalent of raw sewage spewing out of his mouth when he addresses the public. Are we wrong to expect our leaders to at the least, be someone we can admire and look up to even if we may have differences with their opinions?
In reality Putin is just another victim of trumps lies, just like the American people. Propaganda and a unparallelled liar have put this nation in a very precarious position I can only hope we as a nation can pull ourselves out of.
2
The chaos and instability of the Trump administration is a boon for Vladimir Putin. I wouldn't surprised if they have something up their sleeve to really throw this administration into a downward spiral.
1
"Backfires" - perhaps because the GOP is FINALLY putting country over party! We shall see whether that is the case.
2
I'm not convinced the GOP is putting country over party. Take a finer look at what can be done to actually enforce the sanctions. I think this is a game of poker, as Gary Kasperoff might say (except the only one with the poker faces are Putin et al).
There is nothing great or inspiring about Russia. It is the world's equivalent of a gas station. It's GDP is pitiful and completely dependant on energy exports. Its day's are numbered in many respects.
In terms of leadership Putin's Russia is a scam, run by a few for their personal benefit. Whenever the Russian people get a whiff of how corrupt and how much money its Oligarchs are skimming off Putin starts a crisis to distract them (gee...who does that sound like...Donny perhaps). Putin's crisis always targets the same demographic, their hugely uneducated and unsophisticated population, and uses the same tact...nationalism, racism, and fear. Once again, Donny is using the exact same approach to the exact same base...as written in the Putin Playbook for Dictators
It took a while but Putin has started something...he is awakening American patriotism, i.e. country first, which has been sleeping under the warm cozy blanket of self-gratification for years.
Trump's base will be late to the show, if they ever do show up, but make no mistake...the compelling, visionary, and inspiring words of the Constitution and Bill of Rights will lift most Americans from their sleep. And when they do Putin's Russia will hear a united America answer back.
America's resolve for freedom and democracy is not so fragile. This is a lesson Putin will have to learn...again!
In terms of leadership Putin's Russia is a scam, run by a few for their personal benefit. Whenever the Russian people get a whiff of how corrupt and how much money its Oligarchs are skimming off Putin starts a crisis to distract them (gee...who does that sound like...Donny perhaps). Putin's crisis always targets the same demographic, their hugely uneducated and unsophisticated population, and uses the same tact...nationalism, racism, and fear. Once again, Donny is using the exact same approach to the exact same base...as written in the Putin Playbook for Dictators
It took a while but Putin has started something...he is awakening American patriotism, i.e. country first, which has been sleeping under the warm cozy blanket of self-gratification for years.
Trump's base will be late to the show, if they ever do show up, but make no mistake...the compelling, visionary, and inspiring words of the Constitution and Bill of Rights will lift most Americans from their sleep. And when they do Putin's Russia will hear a united America answer back.
America's resolve for freedom and democracy is not so fragile. This is a lesson Putin will have to learn...again!
3
It's backfiring far more than Putin or anyone else could have imagined: Now that Daffy Donald has control of the nuclear codes, it must be dawning on Putin that most of the weapons those codes control are actually aimed at Russia.
Now the world must hold its collective breath hoping that the macho impulses that drive those two adolescent miscreants does not push them into a tragic nuclear miscalculation.
Now the world must hold its collective breath hoping that the macho impulses that drive those two adolescent miscreants does not push them into a tragic nuclear miscalculation.
1
Putin forgot that in America presidents can't do everything unilaterally and thank goodness the brakes were put on.
75
Trump forgot it, too.
Trump NEVER knew it to begin with.
Putin knows this very well. He's not an idiot. Even the Russian duma can be troublesome at times. Trump is nothing but a traitor, don't doubt this for a second. They probably agreed on Trump putting on a show to be tough on Russia to please the Congress and the Senate. Then, when they have their guard down,he will start to apply the agenda. And there is an agenda, you can bet your life on it. Trump can't walk from this deal. Putin kills his enemies.
Watch out, or you're gonna be ruled by your new ruskie overlords. It's already happening. I'd hate to live in the world ruled by them and no counterbalance. I expected more of a resistance from you.
Watch out, or you're gonna be ruled by your new ruskie overlords. It's already happening. I'd hate to live in the world ruled by them and no counterbalance. I expected more of a resistance from you.
Like many Trump voters, Putin now appears to have buyer's regret.
5
I've never understood why Trump wanted better relations with Moscow. The only thing we need from Russia is to stop interfering in other nations' elections.
It would be nice if they would stop invading their neighbors and roughing up their own citizens, but we don't need these things from them.
They want the sanctions lifted, but offer nothing in return. Even the so called dealmaker-in-chief should see that's no deal at all.
It would be nice if they would stop invading their neighbors and roughing up their own citizens, but we don't need these things from them.
They want the sanctions lifted, but offer nothing in return. Even the so called dealmaker-in-chief should see that's no deal at all.
Putin forgot that despite being in the WH, Trumpet isn't the final word in a democracy. We still have a Congress and a Supreme Court and so far he hasn't bought off all of them.
"We still have a Congress and a Supreme Court ..."
"We" also have voters and the news media.
"We" also have voters and the news media.
Trump has not signed off on it yet. Such dramatic posturing from his friend, Putin.
I wonder if they discussed this reaction from Putin to distract and convince less savvy folks that he is upset with the sanctions.
Putin laughed a lot while approving the sanctions. He probably is more determined now to rig the heck out of the midterms to favor Trump.
Our democracy is in trouble America. Trump is a clueless Russian operative.
We have a most unenlightened, anti intellectual and allegedly corrupt thug Russian our country.
Bad bad times!!
I wonder if they discussed this reaction from Putin to distract and convince less savvy folks that he is upset with the sanctions.
Putin laughed a lot while approving the sanctions. He probably is more determined now to rig the heck out of the midterms to favor Trump.
Our democracy is in trouble America. Trump is a clueless Russian operative.
We have a most unenlightened, anti intellectual and allegedly corrupt thug Russian our country.
Bad bad times!!
Ahh, just a bump in the road for this bromance? The course of true love never did run smooth.
1
Putin only cares about remaining in power and stealing as much money as he can from the Russian people.
Maybe he'd like a little mini USSR back, make Russia great again. Maybe he'd just like to stick it to the US and the west in some mildly painful way.
But he doesn't give a bowl of borscht for Trump and any 'deals' they did will turn out to be for some paltry, Ivanka snake oil franchise in Smolensk.
Putin doesn't care about anything and Trump can't comprehend anything the least about international relations, so this sanctions story is unimportant and undramatic. Not the good reality TV which we've come to expect from this administration.
I mean, where was the swearing, the profanity-vulgarity laced diatribe when Putin threw out 700 American diplomats? Not dramatic. Highly overrated. Not even sad.
Maybe he'd like a little mini USSR back, make Russia great again. Maybe he'd just like to stick it to the US and the west in some mildly painful way.
But he doesn't give a bowl of borscht for Trump and any 'deals' they did will turn out to be for some paltry, Ivanka snake oil franchise in Smolensk.
Putin doesn't care about anything and Trump can't comprehend anything the least about international relations, so this sanctions story is unimportant and undramatic. Not the good reality TV which we've come to expect from this administration.
I mean, where was the swearing, the profanity-vulgarity laced diatribe when Putin threw out 700 American diplomats? Not dramatic. Highly overrated. Not even sad.
2
Seems to me, based on Trump's performance, that Putin's boy is dong exactly what Russia wanted him to do. Make us a laughingstock, remove us from world leadership, bet is to invest more in old outdated technology and less in new technology, greatly hamper our Federal Government's ability to perform it's duties, and last but not least, get Trump to make more money so he can better pay back his loans from Russia. I would imagine that Putin has never been happier.
3
For those who are claiming that congress passed the sanctions, not the president, they probably do not understand the president's signature is required to turn a bill into a law.
There are ample examples of unreasonable vetoes from none other than their beloved Obama (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jul/22/obama-vetoes-bill-cut-al.... Cherry on the top was this reasoning - "bill will immediately terminate salaries and all benefits to staffers carrying out the official duties of former presidents".
None of my liberal friends have been able to explain me what official duties of former presidents are.
There are ample examples of unreasonable vetoes from none other than their beloved Obama (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/jul/22/obama-vetoes-bill-cut-al.... Cherry on the top was this reasoning - "bill will immediately terminate salaries and all benefits to staffers carrying out the official duties of former presidents".
None of my liberal friends have been able to explain me what official duties of former presidents are.
"Beloved Obama" ? Yes,if you want to put it that way, though I think you're being extreme just to be nasty.
I would say Obama was (and still is) well-liked and highly respected worldwide. No-one could say that about Trump.
I would say Obama was (and still is) well-liked and highly respected worldwide. No-one could say that about Trump.
1
I do not see the Putin plan as a backfire. He has succeeded in pitting the President against 60% of the American public when it comes to Russia. If Putin's real plan was to disrupt and sow confusion, he has done just that. We have never been in a situation where there is now mistrust about elections, about competence in the WH, about support for treaties (NATO), actions to potentially weaken trade agreements and the European Union, etc. - all with a Russian connection behind it. He has successfully put Trump in a box, he either supports increased sanctions and proves once again that his word is useless when it comes to improving relationships, or he goes against Congress showing the world that the US government has a leadership crisis. It's a win/ win for Putin as Russia moves closer to China
4
Why do we keep saying the sanctions are about election hacking? More reasonably, this is about Russia standing up to our foreign policy moves. At least there is definitive proof that they are interfering with our Syria strategy. Evidence of election interference is weak at best.
Spaceeba, tovarich. But ALL our intelligence agencies agreed (and testified) that russia did, indeed, interfere with our election process, with the goal of getting the draft dodger elected.
1
Putin had multiple reasons for interfering with the election in favor of Trump. While he may not achieve all he wanted, he succeeded in weakening the US, driving a wedge between the US and it's allies, and still holds cards he can use to influence Trump. Is it possible that he is behind all the leaks that have put the Trump administration into disarray? Weakening Trump also serves Russia's interest.
3
It seems that Mr. Putin failed to appreciate that the United States still has a democratic form of government. Doesn't he know by now that, unlike in Russia, the United States Congress is not merely a rubber stamp for the president, and that the president does not control everything? Couldn't he figure out that we might not like a foreign country meddling in our affairs? It seems that Vladimir Putin is not adept at seeing others' points of view.
1
And right there, you have the textbook definition of an 'Autocrat'-- Looks a bit familiar to what we have here, doesn't it???
The current decline in US-Russia relations is the product of a failed business deal between Trump and Putin: Putin agreed to help Trump win the presidency in return for lifting sanctions against Russia, which have proved economically detrimental to Russian efforts to re-establish itself as a global super power.
In exchange for Putin's assistance, Trump agreed to show deference to Russia by destabilizing America's relationship(s) with it historic allies, while supporting right-wing nationalistic governments and would-be leaders (Erdogan, in Turkey; Duterte, in the Philippines; al Sisi, in Egypt; Le Pen, in France), and thereby creating an international geopolitical vacuum for Putin's Russia to fill.
With Trump's unspoken pledge to support the Republican majority's efforts to rip apart America's social safety net, Putin did indeed bet that Trump's personal admiration for Russia -- and its actions to help him win --
would go unnoticed. Neither Putin nor Trump counted on Congress -- or any other anti-Russian American patriot -- popping up to defend America's democratic virtue.
If in fact, the current state of play signals the beginning of a 'new Cold War', so be it. There are millions of us Americans who are not in debt to Russia (take that however one will), see Russia as our adversary, and do not favor Trump handing over our front door keys to the Russian Bear.
In exchange for Putin's assistance, Trump agreed to show deference to Russia by destabilizing America's relationship(s) with it historic allies, while supporting right-wing nationalistic governments and would-be leaders (Erdogan, in Turkey; Duterte, in the Philippines; al Sisi, in Egypt; Le Pen, in France), and thereby creating an international geopolitical vacuum for Putin's Russia to fill.
With Trump's unspoken pledge to support the Republican majority's efforts to rip apart America's social safety net, Putin did indeed bet that Trump's personal admiration for Russia -- and its actions to help him win --
would go unnoticed. Neither Putin nor Trump counted on Congress -- or any other anti-Russian American patriot -- popping up to defend America's democratic virtue.
If in fact, the current state of play signals the beginning of a 'new Cold War', so be it. There are millions of us Americans who are not in debt to Russia (take that however one will), see Russia as our adversary, and do not favor Trump handing over our front door keys to the Russian Bear.
3
That's the spirit!
It's been said Russian oligarchs still want to build a Nord Stream pipeline under the Baltic Sea, a pipeline that bypasses the Ukraine. I doubt if they'd withdraw from the Ukraine even if they got the additional / alternate pipeline.
I'm not sure where Congress is headed with the sanctions in this context.
I'm not sure where Congress is headed with the sanctions in this context.
You write: "Forty-eight hours later, Mr. Putin announced the huge reduction in diplomatic staffing. He said the order would take effect Sept. 1. That leaves time for haggling." Actually, Dave, it leaves time for the U.S. families to make last ditch efforts to secure schooling for the kids, not to mention housing, to wherever those families will be moved.
Russian "interference" in our election is presumed as fact. I have yet to see conclusive evidence. Looking over the comments I don't see a single one questioning any of the narrative or worrying about the impact of worsening relations with Russia. I realize we are all in anguish over the reality of "President Trump" but this sanctions bill is a huge mistake. Why do Democrats want to see a new cold war with Russia? If we cannot reduce military spending, end these wars, and get health care spending under control, I worry about the future of our country. Can we all please calm down and come to our senses?
1
Once again, here is someone who negates and/or ignores the testimony of ALL our intelligence agencies that putin did, indeed , authorize a deliberate campaign to affect our presidential election process. I doubt you could define your definition of "conclusive evidence", even in the face of hacked and released dem-only emails, fake stories about Hillary Clinton (child slaves out of a pizza shop??!?), etc.
And we can do ALL the things mentioned (reduce defense spending, fix health care and infrastructure, et al). What we're in opposition to is the LEADER of russia, his murderous, regime, his oppression of human rights, and his larcenous corruption. The russian people deserve better, not Stalin, Jr.
And we can do ALL the things mentioned (reduce defense spending, fix health care and infrastructure, et al). What we're in opposition to is the LEADER of russia, his murderous, regime, his oppression of human rights, and his larcenous corruption. The russian people deserve better, not Stalin, Jr.
2
What,come to our senses with Captain Chaos in "power"?
1
RE: "The new sanctions were passed by a coalition of Democrats who blame Mr. Putin for contributing to Hillary Clinton’s defeat and Republicans fearful that their president misunderstands who he is dealing with in Moscow."
Not just a "coalition of Democrats"! The House vote was 419-3, and the Senate vote was 98-2.
Not just a "coalition of Democrats"! The House vote was 419-3, and the Senate vote was 98-2.
4
Would not be so sure that we understand Putin's "Bet." The ways of the KGB/FSB are far more inscrutable than this analysis reports. Far more likely, and as has been suggested elsewhere, Putin's real game may have simply been to profoundly destabilize the US government, and in that he clearly has succeeded. Trump and his minions have clearly been "Trumped."
1
Let's not all hold our breath. Do we have to go through the hundreds of things Trump said he would do that he either hasn't done or forgot about? When the bill is signed in Trumpian fan fare like he has signed mostly do-nothing executive orders and weak legislation then we can declare victory. Until then, anything is possible.
Trump can still take the matter to the Supreme Court. He could also ignore Congress and lift sanctions on his own - there's no Constitutional crisis unless Congress wants to make it so.
As I see it, Putin had three goals in last year's presidential election. First, deny the presidency to Hilary Clinton, a known Russia hawk and longtime Putin nemesis. Second, do as much damage as possible to America's political and electoral institutions. And finally, to end Russian economic sanctions. So far, he's two for three on those "bets" -- a record that hardly supports this story's conclusions or headline.
1
How has Hillary been a hawk with regards to Russia?
Our intelligence agencies have predicted that the Russians will try again to interfere in our elections. What then? More sanctions?
55
Putin should be pretty pleased with himself. He has sewn the seeds of chaos in the US and indeed those seeds are flowering at the WH.
One way to combat Russian interference with our elections in future would be voter education. Candidates should be encouraging voters to read multiple sources, not just get news from Facebook or Fox news). Candidates themselves should be leaders that foster discussion on a broad range of current topics from multiple and diverse sources.
One way to combat Russian interference with our elections in future would be voter education. Candidates should be encouraging voters to read multiple sources, not just get news from Facebook or Fox news). Candidates themselves should be leaders that foster discussion on a broad range of current topics from multiple and diverse sources.
2
Russian involvement in our election of 2016 wouldn't even come close to President Bill Clinton's involvement in getting Boris Yeltsin elected during the Clinton years. No one interferes more in foreign elections than does the United States.
We need to tighten up our election process.
1
No doubt Putin should have been in a better position to get sanctions lifted with Trump as President. There may have even been a quid pro quo with Trump. But, if that's what Putin was after, he could make that happen now by pulling out of Ukraine and blaming the hacking on Russian freelancers. US intel could have easily traced hacking to Russia, but they would have no way of knowing if said hacking was state sponsored (without the Russians having been incredibly stupid). That said, like Trump, Putin is encumbered by his innate self. Hence, President Obama is redeemed again. Sanctions do apply pressure - serious pressure. They're not paper tigers. Now, add some great diplomacy on our side, and we can make great headway with Russia. Oh, never mind.
13
The only headline I want to read: TRUMP IMPEACHED.
64
Dear Vlad,
Want to be treated like a productive member, a team member of Western society? Then you may wish to drop being a thug and bully and play with the other children on the playground, nicely. Do not collude in their games, do not take over their countries and governments. Stop the bombing and the bullying. There's another great power in the world that could learn a lesson or two or three from your boorish thug-like behavior, and I hope your buddy Donnie is teaching America a lesson they will never forget. If they do not participate in their own elections and take them seriously, this mess is ours. And, if we keep starting wars we will never get out of, because we have the biggest, over-bloated, military machine in the world and puts America further into debt as our infrastructure crumbles. The world wants democracy, not theocracy, or fascism. So take your ball, Vlad, go home, take Donnie with you, come back when you wish to play by the world's terms, not yours, or your buddies the poor thieving oligarchs.
Sincerely,
EmmaLib
Want to be treated like a productive member, a team member of Western society? Then you may wish to drop being a thug and bully and play with the other children on the playground, nicely. Do not collude in their games, do not take over their countries and governments. Stop the bombing and the bullying. There's another great power in the world that could learn a lesson or two or three from your boorish thug-like behavior, and I hope your buddy Donnie is teaching America a lesson they will never forget. If they do not participate in their own elections and take them seriously, this mess is ours. And, if we keep starting wars we will never get out of, because we have the biggest, over-bloated, military machine in the world and puts America further into debt as our infrastructure crumbles. The world wants democracy, not theocracy, or fascism. So take your ball, Vlad, go home, take Donnie with you, come back when you wish to play by the world's terms, not yours, or your buddies the poor thieving oligarchs.
Sincerely,
EmmaLib
37
Let's not forget that "democracy" gave us Trump, just as it brought Hitler to power in Germany.
It is clear that the majority in congress believes there was Russian interference in our election and has taken the appropriate action. It shows that a majority of people in congress believe in the United States first. The Putin-Trump relationship should make every American at least uneasy. Maybe Trump's campaign slogan should have been Make Russia Great Again.
25
“and see a level of unpredictability there, which makes them nervous.”
And not only them, it makes us all nervous.
And not only them, it makes us all nervous.
17
A deterioration in U.S-Russia relations is never something to desire, but it has been inevitable in view of Putin's actions.
As has been often noted, Putin is good on tactics but bad on overall strategy. He accurately assessed that he was dealing with a patsy and buffoon in Trump, and planned his tactics accordingly. But he failed to account for how Congress, our intelligence agencies, our influential military and foreign policy establishments, and much of the general public might react to his interference with our elections, his misadventures in Ukraine and Syria, and his odd leverage over Trump. He thus fell far short on constructing an overall strategy for dealing with the United States.
He also failed to take account of the asymmetric nature of Russian-U.S. relations, in that we're in a far better position to impose the sanctions that really matter - harm to his economy and cronies - compared to what he can do to us. Russian limitations on U.S. embassy and consular staff are accordingly really just a fly swat compared to the economic sanctions enshrined in the sanctions bill that Congress passed.
The upshot, very unfortunately, might well be a new Cold War, with Congress leading the way. But that's the price he pays for trying to undermine our democracy and exercising some very worrisome influence on our president.
As has been often noted, Putin is good on tactics but bad on overall strategy. He accurately assessed that he was dealing with a patsy and buffoon in Trump, and planned his tactics accordingly. But he failed to account for how Congress, our intelligence agencies, our influential military and foreign policy establishments, and much of the general public might react to his interference with our elections, his misadventures in Ukraine and Syria, and his odd leverage over Trump. He thus fell far short on constructing an overall strategy for dealing with the United States.
He also failed to take account of the asymmetric nature of Russian-U.S. relations, in that we're in a far better position to impose the sanctions that really matter - harm to his economy and cronies - compared to what he can do to us. Russian limitations on U.S. embassy and consular staff are accordingly really just a fly swat compared to the economic sanctions enshrined in the sanctions bill that Congress passed.
The upshot, very unfortunately, might well be a new Cold War, with Congress leading the way. But that's the price he pays for trying to undermine our democracy and exercising some very worrisome influence on our president.
19
Now that Putin has come right out and said that he is so frustrated by the pace of changed American/Russian relations that he is expelling 755 Diplomats, Trump can no longer say that his presidency will give us the benefit of a friendlier dynamic with Russia. Whatever peculiar dealings happen(ed) between Trump’s camp and Putin is between them, not a boon for us.
11
Did Putin lose the bet? Even though Russia's actions were discovered, they didn't cause widespread outrage. In fact, 55% of Republicans believe that Russia didn't interfere in the election. The problem with the bet started with the discovery of the contacts between the Campaign and the Russians. It was then amplified by continuing new revelations and the Trump response to the investigation. So now, we're watching to see where the investigation will lead, but that doesn't mean Putin lost the bet. What if his bet was that he could create chaos in the US, its allies and undermine the legitimacy of the President? If that was his bet. He's already won.
9
Why did Trump/Pence say Russia wasn't involved but now say the sanctions are appropriate?
18
Both are proven habitual liars, that's why. Two rotten peas in pod.
Because they were voted on overwhelmingly by the peoples representatives in congress?
I don't think Putin thought electing Trump would improve diplomacy. I think he was hoping it would supply some entertainment and he is getting his wish.
6
Not sure that there is any backfiring. Speculating how the new US president might react or be a friend to Russia is less certain compared to the likely goals of ensuring a weak/inexperienced leader in the WH and plunging US politics into chaos and infighting. It seems that has been successful and probably helps Russia more than some unspecified, probably toothless sanctions that may never actually happen.
15
"If the sanctions overwhelmingly passed by Congress last week sent any message to Moscow, it was that Mr. Trump’s hands are now tied in dealing with Moscow, probably for years to come.” — Don’t hold your breath.
Trump has and is continuing to do things to aid and abet Moscow. 1) He publicly punched NATO in the nose, when it didn’t need to punched. 2) Trump withdrew America from the world Paris Climate Accords, and thus a) he weakens America’s leadership ability in the world, and also b) weakens our ability to take advantage of a 40 trillion dollar marketplace. c) Trump, as President, is betting on coal while the rest of the intelligent world bets on cleaner renewables and any resulting international patents. 3) Trump gave Syria to the Russia, and Qatar to Iran. 4) Not only has Trump weakened our environmental health at home, but he is spreading chaos in our government and our domestic policies.
Trump has and is continuing to do things to aid and abet Moscow. 1) He publicly punched NATO in the nose, when it didn’t need to punched. 2) Trump withdrew America from the world Paris Climate Accords, and thus a) he weakens America’s leadership ability in the world, and also b) weakens our ability to take advantage of a 40 trillion dollar marketplace. c) Trump, as President, is betting on coal while the rest of the intelligent world bets on cleaner renewables and any resulting international patents. 3) Trump gave Syria to the Russia, and Qatar to Iran. 4) Not only has Trump weakened our environmental health at home, but he is spreading chaos in our government and our domestic policies.
17
If Mr. Putin's goal is to weaken the U.S. world leadership position, drive a wedge between the U.S. and its traditional allies, and weaken opposition to Russia's expansionist plans, then I would say that his plan is succeeding in a spectacular fashion.
55
The fraud in the WH has been working alongside the russians to "undermine Western democracy", aided and abetted by Bannon. What we're seeing now is the hysteresis of a sluggish tripartite government, awakening to the alarms from our own "disrespected" intelligence agencies. If putin expected a loosening or elimination of sanctions, he clearly underestimated the power of an semi-democratic government that will respond to real threats.
We need to force Congress to push for a hardening of our election process digital infrastructure security. We need to LISTEN to our intelligence agencies, and, it would seem, we need to relegate the blathering noise from the WH, as regards russia, to the "infotainment" section of the media.
We need to force Congress to push for a hardening of our election process digital infrastructure security. We need to LISTEN to our intelligence agencies, and, it would seem, we need to relegate the blathering noise from the WH, as regards russia, to the "infotainment" section of the media.
13
A smoldering conflict with the US is exactly what Putin needs. People generally coalesce around their leader when under attack from outside. GWB certainly understood that well.
The sanctions are unlikely to achieve their stated goals. Russia is not going to give up Crimea or quit messing with Ukraine. There is too much history and nationalism there. The sanctions also seem to facilitate a closer alliance between Russia, Iran, and North Korea by grouping them together. None of these countries are all that strong by themselves. However, bound together they could "spectacularly backfire" not only on the US, but the entire world.
Dangerous and stupid games by all parties.
The sanctions are unlikely to achieve their stated goals. Russia is not going to give up Crimea or quit messing with Ukraine. There is too much history and nationalism there. The sanctions also seem to facilitate a closer alliance between Russia, Iran, and North Korea by grouping them together. None of these countries are all that strong by themselves. However, bound together they could "spectacularly backfire" not only on the US, but the entire world.
Dangerous and stupid games by all parties.
2
While we need to internationally exploit Putin, certain Russian Government institutions and part of their Intel for their part in their ways of teen-age-hacking/adult-espionage of our last U.S. Election, Trump is standing in our way.
I mean, Putin’s old Bob-Newhart-Show cover was first inferring that it was not any of his street-criminal Russian brothers named Darrell, or any of his other Intel-front brothers named Darrell, where Putin 'still thinks' that their victimization of the U.S. is that we cannot prove to the world which Russian brother it was ‘by name’. Then Putin stuck his I.D. out and said it could have been ‘one’ of his Russian brothers named Darrell only when Trump ‘also said’ that we could not prove it by name. (However, I will maintain, for the respect of my country, that Trump is a bit smarter than mamma-Putin-Darrell who named them all the same!)
I mean, Putin’s old Bob-Newhart-Show cover was first inferring that it was not any of his street-criminal Russian brothers named Darrell, or any of his other Intel-front brothers named Darrell, where Putin 'still thinks' that their victimization of the U.S. is that we cannot prove to the world which Russian brother it was ‘by name’. Then Putin stuck his I.D. out and said it could have been ‘one’ of his Russian brothers named Darrell only when Trump ‘also said’ that we could not prove it by name. (However, I will maintain, for the respect of my country, that Trump is a bit smarter than mamma-Putin-Darrell who named them all the same!)
Commentators wonder how Trump will respond if some external crisis occurs-- Or what about a "natural" event --earthquake ? Hurricane with flooding? Or cyber-damage to the power grid?
Predictably, any Trump response will escalate the self-made crisis he has already caused in Washington, across the country, and among U.S. allies.
It is some comfort for Americans to believe Trump will be impeached and convicted for flagrant violations of the Constitution, including emoluments from Russia; and our bedrock government employees will rise to the challenge of his removal.
They've had experience with dictators and meddlers like Putin.
Predictably, any Trump response will escalate the self-made crisis he has already caused in Washington, across the country, and among U.S. allies.
It is some comfort for Americans to believe Trump will be impeached and convicted for flagrant violations of the Constitution, including emoluments from Russia; and our bedrock government employees will rise to the challenge of his removal.
They've had experience with dictators and meddlers like Putin.
6
We have met the enemy, and he is Trump.
1
Just like Jim Comey would still have a job under President Hillary Clinton if he hadn't interfered in the election last October with his overblown concern about Hillary's emails on Anthony Weiner's laptop, Vladimir Putin would not face sanctions or the loss of his Russian compounds if he'd kept his nose out of the election. They both got their wish and got Trump elected and now they've paid the price.
Unfortunately all of the rest of us are paying every day as well.
Unfortunately all of the rest of us are paying every day as well.
14
Only you and yours.
I'm not convinced the Cold War ever really ended. Sure, the Soviet Union fell. However, I'd describe the evolution of modern Russia as an internal restructuring more than an actual break from the Soviet past. This is especially true once Putin came to power. In hindsight, the time of Gorbachev and Yeltsin looks more like a hiatus.
From the time of Bush forward, there is a steady ratcheting up of hostility towards the Western world. Bush left Putin unchecked on a lot of small things. Putin eventually escalated his actions into big things. I'd say the Cold War entered it's second phase as early as 2006 with the Ukraine gas cut-off if not before. I would certainly say the U.S. and Russia were back into it no later than 2008 with the invasion of Georgia.
This is the context in which Obama entered the White House. Things have only escalated since that time. I'll agree the rhetoric shifted significantly towards the end of the Obama administration but in reality he's been fighting with Russia since the beginning. Along comes Trump. Leaving possible ties to Russia aside, he still expects a normal transnational business relationship with an aggressive foreign regional power.
Earth to Trump: Diplomacy and business do not operate independently from one and another. You can't silo one and attack the other without consequences. This includes both NATO and the internet hack. Trump had an opportunity to mediate through involvement. Instead, he insulted the former and dismissed the later.
From the time of Bush forward, there is a steady ratcheting up of hostility towards the Western world. Bush left Putin unchecked on a lot of small things. Putin eventually escalated his actions into big things. I'd say the Cold War entered it's second phase as early as 2006 with the Ukraine gas cut-off if not before. I would certainly say the U.S. and Russia were back into it no later than 2008 with the invasion of Georgia.
This is the context in which Obama entered the White House. Things have only escalated since that time. I'll agree the rhetoric shifted significantly towards the end of the Obama administration but in reality he's been fighting with Russia since the beginning. Along comes Trump. Leaving possible ties to Russia aside, he still expects a normal transnational business relationship with an aggressive foreign regional power.
Earth to Trump: Diplomacy and business do not operate independently from one and another. You can't silo one and attack the other without consequences. This includes both NATO and the internet hack. Trump had an opportunity to mediate through involvement. Instead, he insulted the former and dismissed the later.
7
I haven't known David Sanger for being premature in his analyses. But here's one exception. We still don't know if Russia got its money's worth. We're still following the money, hampered as we are by Trump's guarding his tax returns, his drawing his very personal redline at his family's finances and his school yard bully style of strong arming staff to fire Mueller. What is he so afraid of that he'll act against all common sense and his political advisors?
And, as Putin and Trump are both corrupt oligarchs to their very core, Putin will always have an ally on our shores. Several prominent scholars/authors have written on the contagion of Russian style kleptocracy and how Trump provides fertile ground for infection, here in the US. I do wish the Times would run a series on what kleptocracy is and how to make sure we don't fall victim.
e tripod of shared federal power.
But I am encouraged that Congress remembered they are one of three c0-equal powers of our Federal government. So yes, Trump has now yet turned the Presidency into a dictatorship. May Congress continue to remember its responsibilities and may the Justice Department continue to hold Trump accountable to the People and may the Supreme Court not sell out to moneyed interests.
And, as Putin and Trump are both corrupt oligarchs to their very core, Putin will always have an ally on our shores. Several prominent scholars/authors have written on the contagion of Russian style kleptocracy and how Trump provides fertile ground for infection, here in the US. I do wish the Times would run a series on what kleptocracy is and how to make sure we don't fall victim.
e tripod of shared federal power.
But I am encouraged that Congress remembered they are one of three c0-equal powers of our Federal government. So yes, Trump has now yet turned the Presidency into a dictatorship. May Congress continue to remember its responsibilities and may the Justice Department continue to hold Trump accountable to the People and may the Supreme Court not sell out to moneyed interests.
4
It's not over yet. Not by a long shot. Vladimir Putin plays to win. And Americans who were lulled into the false hope that Russia is an ally and a friend, have a very rude awakening in store for them.
His dream is to restore Russia to its Soviet glory, and he'll stop at nothing to achieve it.
I've already lived through this in Germany, which was divided and surrounded before the Wall came down.
And for that very same reason I'm keeping my eyes on the upcoming elections there in September.
Americans would be wise to do the same.
It's not over yet here.
His dream is to restore Russia to its Soviet glory, and he'll stop at nothing to achieve it.
I've already lived through this in Germany, which was divided and surrounded before the Wall came down.
And for that very same reason I'm keeping my eyes on the upcoming elections there in September.
Americans would be wise to do the same.
It's not over yet here.
170
Was it in a dream that your ideas about Putin and his dreams were formulated?
@Nillissen
No. It was in REALITY --- Or, did you somehow miss that part about what I was saying?
No. It was in REALITY --- Or, did you somehow miss that part about what I was saying?
2
Let's not exaggerate Putin's strategic vision -yes, he's a ruthless KGB bureaucrat, but what has he accomplished lately? His country is strong in bluster, but on the skids in most ways. He's claimed an important role in Syria, of all places. Sort of like one of those guys who like to jump into a bar fight, when most people would rather walk by, looking for a nicer bar.
Putin's interview with Oliver Stone was revealing...he thought U.S. policy towards Russia would not change at all in a Trump administration, as opposed to Hillary as President. He is right, because he understands the real power running the United States, and it isn't Donald Trump. Anyone who has been paying attention to the leaks within the U.S. intelligence community, State Dept. and other government organs in an organized effort to remove the President would agree.
1
Putin bet that Trump would harm American power and prestige, which he has. Putin bet that Trump would sow chaos, which he has. Putin bet that Russia would be able to exploit chaos better than other nations, which it has. Putin is probably mildly perturbed about Trump not taking direct orders, but you can't win 'em all.
9
This monumental effort by the media to recreate the Cold War is socially reprehensible. Walter Lippmann would be rolling in his grave. Not only are we avoiding the actual, important issues of the day, but we may end up creating geopolitical conflicts were there were none. It's all about power and control (and ultimately money). I see this as the media's attempt to protect itself from the clear threat posed by the internet, which empowers the news consumer.
The Cold War is SO over. What is Russia without the Soviet Union - without even communism? This McCarthyism-reboot is getting ridiculous. Even at the height of the Cold War, the actual threat posed by Russia was greatly exaggerated (in effort to drive the expansion of our own military; that's why it's called an industrial "complex" - it reinforces itself.) Since Viet Nam, the evidence is clear that the only 'containment policy' needed for promoting peace and prosperity around the world is one against CAPITALISM. The domino effect actually was proven out. But it's capitalism that's pushing them over - just look at southeast Asia today. When NYT starts quoting George Keenan, their days must be numbered.
The Cold War is SO over. What is Russia without the Soviet Union - without even communism? This McCarthyism-reboot is getting ridiculous. Even at the height of the Cold War, the actual threat posed by Russia was greatly exaggerated (in effort to drive the expansion of our own military; that's why it's called an industrial "complex" - it reinforces itself.) Since Viet Nam, the evidence is clear that the only 'containment policy' needed for promoting peace and prosperity around the world is one against CAPITALISM. The domino effect actually was proven out. But it's capitalism that's pushing them over - just look at southeast Asia today. When NYT starts quoting George Keenan, their days must be numbered.
3
The conversation in Hamburg might have seemed friendly. But it was between a president who tweets his mind in an erratic and irresponsible manner, and another, who is a seasoned intelligence officer. And, contrary to what the author claims, Putin is a brilliant strategist, and certainly more aware and knowledgeable of world politics than his American counterpart.
The Kreml knows fully well how the American legislative bodies work. And the fact that Trump knows basically nothing about how the game is played, is only playing to the Russians’ hands. Obviously, it is not possible to forecast Washington’s every move, but thinking that, if Trump got elected, Putin was expecting some miraculous change in the Americans' hearts and minds and forget about the elections and Crimea, is extremely naïve. And sanctions set by Americans, though more or less troublesome for Russia, are not exactly a black swan to the Kreml.
For the sake of America’s standing in the world stage (which is declining every time Trump opens his mouth and says something crazy or tweets something mindboggling), Trump should be careful about how much chaos he wants to create. Despite the fact that things don’t always go smoothly in Washington, chaos and disorder are not in the interest of the U.S.
While Putin and the Kreml are playing chess, Trump and Washington seem to be debating the rules of checkers. In other words, it seems that it was Trump’s bets that have so far gone bad.
The Kreml knows fully well how the American legislative bodies work. And the fact that Trump knows basically nothing about how the game is played, is only playing to the Russians’ hands. Obviously, it is not possible to forecast Washington’s every move, but thinking that, if Trump got elected, Putin was expecting some miraculous change in the Americans' hearts and minds and forget about the elections and Crimea, is extremely naïve. And sanctions set by Americans, though more or less troublesome for Russia, are not exactly a black swan to the Kreml.
For the sake of America’s standing in the world stage (which is declining every time Trump opens his mouth and says something crazy or tweets something mindboggling), Trump should be careful about how much chaos he wants to create. Despite the fact that things don’t always go smoothly in Washington, chaos and disorder are not in the interest of the U.S.
While Putin and the Kreml are playing chess, Trump and Washington seem to be debating the rules of checkers. In other words, it seems that it was Trump’s bets that have so far gone bad.
2
To attribute anything definitive about these two conniving authoritarians is premature. All we've seen in the past year is duplicity and lying. I don't think anything significant can be ascribed to current actions. I hope our Congress honorably scratched their dubious plot. But the endgame is yet to be played out.
12
Honorably? Congress (the GOP)? Their endgame seems pretty decently established. That's why almost all of them appear treasonous. Whether it's all in the name of Russia or all in the name of a certifiable right-wing,
it doesn't matter.
it doesn't matter.
So the thinking goes that Putin needs the sanctions removed to revitalize the Russian economy which is a sore point to his popularity. Since Putin enjoys nearly 90% of the vote every time, why would he worry so much? Putin has manipulation of the ballot perfected in Russia.
Maybe the sanctions also hinder his and his fellow oligarchs ability to steal more.
Now that is something Trump would have in common with Putin - pure unabashed Greed. Did Trump's greed propel him into the murky waters of Russian money laundering? Did Putin watch this and file away for a rainy day?
Mueller will find out the Why of Trump's absolute fear of financial disclosure.
It does seem that Congress is in fact acknowledging that they suspect Trump of working on behalf of Putin wether by active choice or unwitting inclination.
If the other goal of Putin was to devalue and disrupt American democracy, Trump is full on in compliance. Trump's ego leads him to the authoritarian.
He has surrounded himself with people whose political agenda is similar to Putin's - Namely to bring back their country to rule by and for the true citizens, the purer who should lead the masses. Steve Bannon is in fact doing Putin's work by 'advising' Trump to take America back to White Christian Male rule.
Trump has no personal core ideology but goes along because his 'base' loves and votes for him.
Trump and his little cabal of anti-democratic agenda advisors are messing up our policy towards Russia.
Maybe the sanctions also hinder his and his fellow oligarchs ability to steal more.
Now that is something Trump would have in common with Putin - pure unabashed Greed. Did Trump's greed propel him into the murky waters of Russian money laundering? Did Putin watch this and file away for a rainy day?
Mueller will find out the Why of Trump's absolute fear of financial disclosure.
It does seem that Congress is in fact acknowledging that they suspect Trump of working on behalf of Putin wether by active choice or unwitting inclination.
If the other goal of Putin was to devalue and disrupt American democracy, Trump is full on in compliance. Trump's ego leads him to the authoritarian.
He has surrounded himself with people whose political agenda is similar to Putin's - Namely to bring back their country to rule by and for the true citizens, the purer who should lead the masses. Steve Bannon is in fact doing Putin's work by 'advising' Trump to take America back to White Christian Male rule.
Trump has no personal core ideology but goes along because his 'base' loves and votes for him.
Trump and his little cabal of anti-democratic agenda advisors are messing up our policy towards Russia.
2
Why can't people settle on a story? did putin want a harsh anti Russia president so he can rally the Russians against an American enemy to distract from economic problems as NYT op ed said Friday or is is it this putin hired trump to run for president to improve ties with when he was elected?
Brian, Don't confuse the times.
The entity to sanction is his money-laundering development empire, to say nothing of the ultimate Moscow hotel project.
2
Trump investor finds that his "bet has now backfired, spectacularly"? Get in line, Putin.
3
It comes as no surprise that "fear has replaced anger in dealing with the Russians." Fear has been a byword of the GOP for decades. It got us into wars, adversely impacted our economy (through hysteria over inflation), and helped elect scores of liars and scoundrels--including our current sitting president--into the highest offices of the land.
Expect more in our dealings with China, Iran and North Korea. Some of it perhaps even justified, given our current leadership.
Expect more in our dealings with China, Iran and North Korea. Some of it perhaps even justified, given our current leadership.
1
So Trump disappointed Putin. Welcome to the club Vladimir.
2
Meanwhile Trump minions and Putin have bots desperately packing these comment pages trying to convince people that more sanctions and taking away control from Putins best friend Trump is a bad idea. We are not buying this Putin/Trump and neither is Congress.
Tillerson did not have State staff go along on his trips or attend his private meetings while abroad. Plans to cut down Russian embassy staff mirror the hallowing out of the State Dept.
Coincidence?
Coincidence?
Congress killed two birds with one stone. Hurrah! Russia and, the Apprentice.
3
So now what are you going to do, Vlad? Your hand picked "president" isn't working out to well for you, huh? Better luck next time!
3
Putin's bet? It's not a bet on Trump so much as it is leverage over him. The only way to disprove that leverage is through the release of Trump's taxes.
3
Both Presidents Trump and Putin finally embrace each other and jointly with China try to improve the world, lift it up from economic collapse to new up level of living.
1
Weren't some of the North Korean missile systems derived from Russian designs? Russia may be more sinister even than seen here.
The Russian election interference was one of the most serious attacks on any democracy. That Trump and his people still do not acknowledge it is bizarre. Trump supporters also regard it as not real, but they also thought that President Obama was magically born in Kenya.
If Putin turns on Trump, will his potential blackmail materials be dumped on WikiLeaks or somewhere? Will he cut financial ties with Trump?
It could well be that the Mueller investigation is pressuring the Russian mobster oligarchs as much as the Trump cabal. The good news is that Sessions has expanded civil forfeiture seizures for suspected crimes. Those Trump condos might add a nice amount to the national treasury.
The Russian election interference was one of the most serious attacks on any democracy. That Trump and his people still do not acknowledge it is bizarre. Trump supporters also regard it as not real, but they also thought that President Obama was magically born in Kenya.
If Putin turns on Trump, will his potential blackmail materials be dumped on WikiLeaks or somewhere? Will he cut financial ties with Trump?
It could well be that the Mueller investigation is pressuring the Russian mobster oligarchs as much as the Trump cabal. The good news is that Sessions has expanded civil forfeiture seizures for suspected crimes. Those Trump condos might add a nice amount to the national treasury.
4
755 U.S. diplomats have been expelled by Russia. Over 300 are still in Russia. Why do we need over 1000 State Department employees in Russia, or any foreign country for that matter? The federal debt is over $20 trillion. With revelations like this, it is no wonder why.
58
As Putin knows, many of the 755 exist under the cover of State but work for the CIA and other agencies. These people provide us with a priceless understanding of Russia which is lost under Trump who has no clear understanding of diplomacy and intelligence. As someone who worked in Russia for the State Department, I can assure you that this is a worthwhile cost.
A majority of these employees are local Russians, and believe it or not, the State Department has legitimate and necessary things to do in Russia. There are American business interests to be represented, negotiations to be carried out (arms treaties and such), visas to be processed, and yes, even covert activities to be supported. You do know that the Atlantic and Pacific oceans are not sufficient protection for the US for many decades now, right?
2
More collusion between Trump and Putin to reduce the US national debt.
Putin does not bet on anything. If Trump gains upperhand and is more friendly with Russia, that's good for Putin; if the US is weakened by divisions inside the country and with allies, that's also good for Putin.
Russia probably spent a tiny amount of money and effort into whatever plot they conjured up but the ROI is huge!
Russia probably spent a tiny amount of money and effort into whatever plot they conjured up but the ROI is huge!
140
It's my understanding that the new sanctions were enacted by Senate initiative over the ardent objections of the president. The lesson to be learned from this is to leave diplomacy to diplomats, not to hotheaded Congressfolk
The president now has the unenviable task of mapping a road out of the tar pit that Congress has forced the U.S. into.
The president now has the unenviable task of mapping a road out of the tar pit that Congress has forced the U.S. into.
I'll take the opinion of 100, excuse me, 95 seasoned, experienced politicians over the impulses of one unqualified, ignorant hotheaded tweeter any day.
2
Good news amid all the havoc of President Trump's administration (the daily soap-opera we are witnessing this year), that Trump's hands will be tied for the foreseeable future by Congress's passing of sanctions against Russia. Vladimir Putin's Russia is no longer the Soviet Union, though Putin has extended his hegemony for the past 17 years. Splendid that the late Ambassador to Russia and Yugoslavia, George Kennan's brilliant Cold War Strategy - "patient, firm and vigilant containment - is being applied to today's Russia and her virtual Czar, Vladimir Putin.
2
I have said before that Putin's move to subvert the US Presidential election was like Japan attacking Pearl Harbor. It may take a while, but there will be a response, and it won't end well for Putin.
4
With Yeltsin Putin saw first hand the problems with a President who was badly perceived in the world. Comrade Trump is an even bigger buffoon. We now see what Putin saw in Trump.
2
Well, we showed them. They are not getting away with improved relations with Russia and reducing tensions. Nutz, full steam ahead I say. Let's show the Russians our true colors.
3
I doubt Putin ever thought Trump would be his hand puppet. Trump is too unstable, and US foreign policy has other players (Congress and the Pentagon) who have a role. Russia's experts would have seen that.
Putin already got what he wanted. A US government, and US electorate, in chaos, deeply unfocused, and unable to provide a united, coherent national will. The Russian spies and strategists were smart enough to know their involvement would never be undetected. They are counting on the detection.
And now with this diplomatic tit for tat, they can play the game of discombobulating the US government for many more months to come.
Putin already got what he wanted. A US government, and US electorate, in chaos, deeply unfocused, and unable to provide a united, coherent national will. The Russian spies and strategists were smart enough to know their involvement would never be undetected. They are counting on the detection.
And now with this diplomatic tit for tat, they can play the game of discombobulating the US government for many more months to come.
315
And there are spies and moles to be caught in our Intelligence Services including the FBI. Meanwhile, the public is not that well informed on Kaspersky, which most of us would say, is a ridiculous risk. Obviously Kaspersky is a risk, and computers infected with code. Then today I learned that the CIA outsourced a 600 million dollar server system,,, to Amazon. Frankly, Mr. Bezos is an oligarch. And that is a risk given all the intelligence servers will be using an server that Amazon outsourced to God knows where.
Absurd. Putin's goal was to defeat Clinton, destabilize democratic institutions, and weaken the United States in the world. He has succeeded. Trump was an unforeseen benefit of his efforts. Remember, Putin did not start his propaganda assaults on Clinton in 2016. Putin exerted himself shortly after his election in 2011. His goals to emasculate America and destroy the western alliance started right after the NATO alliance expanded.
Trump is America's Yeltsin with delusions of grand urge. He's a loudmouthed clown who's drunk on power but baffled about how Washington works, what democracy is, and any of the rules. He is dangerous, but primarily to himself and to America. Now that he has blundered his first 6 months, alienated normal America, and turned the Republican agenda into a catastrophe, his fantasies about playing golf with Putin are over. Putin got much more than he imagined possible because Trump is still the oaf in the White House.
Trump is America's Yeltsin with delusions of grand urge. He's a loudmouthed clown who's drunk on power but baffled about how Washington works, what democracy is, and any of the rules. He is dangerous, but primarily to himself and to America. Now that he has blundered his first 6 months, alienated normal America, and turned the Republican agenda into a catastrophe, his fantasies about playing golf with Putin are over. Putin got much more than he imagined possible because Trump is still the oaf in the White House.
11
The Trump card has backfired on Putin because there seems to be stupidity everywhere. How could he not foresee that our intelligence services would not figure out who hacked and released the info on Hillary and for what purpose, or that his top diplomats in our country would be electronically monitored at all times? It almost looks as if the original plan was to help Trump win knowing, like must of us did, that he was unstable and unfit and would create chaos...
128
Putin did no more than what countries normally do. If anything helped Hillary it was Comey. All nations use secret agents, like the CIA or formerly KGB agents as diplomats, nothing new with that, anyone can hack computers.
If all Putin managed to do was install a stupid president, that would be a victory for him.
The fact that Trump is driving a wedge between us and Europe is gravy.
The fact that Trump is driving a wedge between us and Europe is gravy.
They have tricked you into thinking Trump had something to do with the hacking, when instead it was Sanders supporters. The purpose was to make it more difficult for Hillary to govern, not to deny her the election.
How do the authors know that Putin bet that Trump would treat Russia the way Putin wanted it treated. Pure supposition. Do you have any written documents, tapes, anything to support that idea.
How about let's keep it simple. Putin didn't like HRC -- although he should have loved the entire Obama admin for rolling over and playing dead when he waltzed into Crimea and Ukraine and decided to play a bigger role in the ME. not a peep from the brilliant one or his acolytes.
So, given that Vlad had his way with Obama why would he particularly wish to have Trump in the WH as opposed to HRC, other than the fact he had disdain for Hillary? Cite sources please.
How about let's keep it simple. Putin didn't like HRC -- although he should have loved the entire Obama admin for rolling over and playing dead when he waltzed into Crimea and Ukraine and decided to play a bigger role in the ME. not a peep from the brilliant one or his acolytes.
So, given that Vlad had his way with Obama why would he particularly wish to have Trump in the WH as opposed to HRC, other than the fact he had disdain for Hillary? Cite sources please.
1
Russia's plan IS working. Russia didn't support Trump in the election, because they thought Trump would treat them as a superpower. Russia supported Trump because they knew his incompetence and immorality would destabilize the US, leaving Russia as the only superpower.
534
Even after Trump is gone we will still be a superpower to be reckoned with.. It will take far more then Trump to diminish that.
At least the bipartisan sanctions bill showed that when motivated both sides can work together.
Thats what we should be pushing both towards IMO.. Admittedly the GOP has farther to go to back there.
At least the bipartisan sanctions bill showed that when motivated both sides can work together.
Thats what we should be pushing both towards IMO.. Admittedly the GOP has farther to go to back there.
Thanks Susan. Your conclusion sounds a little crazy, but looking at what has happened in the last six months, you're spot on.
Putin was afraid HRC would "sanctionize" Russia. Our incompetent POTUS has driven Congress to do that very job.
Every way you look at it Vlad, you lose.
Putin was afraid HRC would "sanctionize" Russia. Our incompetent POTUS has driven Congress to do that very job.
Every way you look at it Vlad, you lose.
Umm, hello? China?
We have returned to the "Cold War" not because of the actions of our government, but because of the actions of a narcissistic "wannabe" dictator (no I'm not talking about President Trump). Putin's ego and misguided world view is the engine that is driving current tensions. His efforts must be countered and responded to. This is a simple policy that even Mr. Trump should be able to get right.
4
Putin is often cast as a mastermind, but he's really just a slightly above-average dictator. That's why his potentially great country is in such bad shape. Americans need to take heed: Bad leadership can ruin a country.
3
Oh, I don't know, I think it's working the way he intended.
7
I don't understand. What is it that you think Putin wanted?
1
Anarchy in the United States government does not benefit Putin in the long run, and sure does not give him what he wants out of the Trump (or any other) administration. We'll survive Trump and we'll get rid of him, one way or another, sooner or later; Putin more likely does not have the luxury of time. The oligarchs are getting restless. All his personal billions stolen from the Russian people over the years won't do him any good if he's dead, and he could very well be, sooner than anyone would expect. The Russian system is much closer to collapse than most of us are aware, but it's not rocket science to figure it out, or figure out why it's happening. America can, I'm betting, afford to play the long game here; Trump and Putin, especially, cannot.
Just to humiliate the United States.
Trump appears to destroy democracy.
Pence appears to save democracy.
The religious "right" will decide how our country based on "One nation etc." will form a theocracy.
Putin has nothing to do with this plan. Although Putin understands religion is one way to control the
population.
Fly Our Flag ! Even though it seems to be waving good-bye.
Pence appears to save democracy.
The religious "right" will decide how our country based on "One nation etc." will form a theocracy.
Putin has nothing to do with this plan. Although Putin understands religion is one way to control the
population.
Fly Our Flag ! Even though it seems to be waving good-bye.
3
The two last Time Person of the Year are equally unpredictable
We'd only need an unpredictable Chinese Leader, and an unpredictable leader in the UK, or in France, or in Germany
Thankfully, none of the other leaders are as mercurial as Putin and Trump, apart from the rogues (Dutertre, Kim, and their likes - are we really missing Gaddafi ? Or Ahmedinedjad ? )
Things are not SO bad after all
We'd only need an unpredictable Chinese Leader, and an unpredictable leader in the UK, or in France, or in Germany
Thankfully, none of the other leaders are as mercurial as Putin and Trump, apart from the rogues (Dutertre, Kim, and their likes - are we really missing Gaddafi ? Or Ahmedinedjad ? )
Things are not SO bad after all
I don't think a majority of Americans will stand for a theocracy. If they want a civil war, they'll get one. Religion in this world is going the way of the dinosaur, whether people want to face that truth or not. Don't be fooled by the bugaboos of the Christian and Islamic extremists.
Trump must really be dumb according to Putin. A man with very little to start is now the richest man in the world. Putin is estimated to have extracted over 200 billion from his taxpayers making him far richer than Bill Gates. Trump on the other hand has added very little to his dad's empire when it comes to real growth. Too bad Donald Trump, you could have taken real wealth to a new level if only you had asked Putin how to do it and then actually have done it. Just think when you compare the US economy to the Russian economy you could have become the first trillionaire on this planet.
1
Oh, Trump and family are busy enriching themselves at the expense of the American taxpayers and for sure, they're probably getting cuts from every penny the various Cabinet thieves are busy extracting through deals being cut to sell/development public lands and resources. If they could figure out a way to charge people for sunshine, they'd switch to a non-petroleum based energy model, you can bet your bibby on that. These people are thieves, grifters. Small of heart, soul and mind.
So does this mean no more Miss Universe pageant in Moscow?
7
Mr. Putin got what he wanted and now he's miffed at his buddy. Now Putin is learning first hand what the president's party and his supporters have discovered -- that his promises are worthless and nothing more than fool's gold. The Russian Bear got outfoxed by Brer Rabbit.
3
Nonsense. It's what we don't see, that matters. There are a million ways to favor a favorite, under the table. And a lifelong Conman, knows them all,
Right, Donald???
Right, Donald???
10
Show us the tax returns.
22
Then Putin is a horrible judge of human character, we should put that weakness to good use!
3
What makes you think we aren't - or didn't...
At least Putin seems to be putting the respect of his nation ahead of his own. Regaining superpower status for a nation supposedly benefits the entire nation's psyche. Banana republic pariahs have all the self-glory and absolute power they need right at home and could care less about their nation's image.
78
Nonsense. Putin is only interested in keeping his reign.
And feeding the Russian people some nationalist yarn, while silencing all opposition and showing off Russian military might is his way of doing it.
And feeding the Russian people some nationalist yarn, while silencing all opposition and showing off Russian military might is his way of doing it.
2
It is said that Putin is now worth $200 billion, all stolen from the country whose respect he puts ahead of his own.
"Banana Republic" pariahs have all the self-glory and absolute power they need right at home and could care less about their nation's image."
It sounds like you're describing Trump as much as Putin since Trump surely isn't helping to advance the US's image as a nation.
It sounds like you're describing Trump as much as Putin since Trump surely isn't helping to advance the US's image as a nation.
What's to keep Don from working with Russia through back channels? It seems that money talks and he would find others like Flynn, to do his bidding, which is to prop up his failing business empire. Until Republicans impeach, this criminal enterprise will continue.
7
Putin should have known better? Really? He makes mistakes too. He will continue to do so.l
And of course Mr. Trump will take credit for this.
2
I always believed that Putin would be more understanding of Trump than I have ever been. It is obvious to me that Trump is an unskilled thug, not a statesman. Now, by his actions and words, he has revealed that my evaluation is not far off-base.......
4
Putin is a gangster. Our relations with Russia should not be good as long as Russia is ruled by criminals.
5
This regime has lied about everything else, why would this be any different? Their goal is to take the heat off them and deflect
and pivot. Don't fall for it. And, there wasn't "meddling" in our elections - it's not. Russia, with the help of the traitors helping the GOP candidate, hacked us to the extent it has been appropriately called a cyber war. Don't lose track of this and fight back. We're under attack by the GOP and the Russians and whatever this moronic regime is called (they're not GOP - their loyalty is to themselves only).
and pivot. Don't fall for it. And, there wasn't "meddling" in our elections - it's not. Russia, with the help of the traitors helping the GOP candidate, hacked us to the extent it has been appropriately called a cyber war. Don't lose track of this and fight back. We're under attack by the GOP and the Russians and whatever this moronic regime is called (they're not GOP - their loyalty is to themselves only).
4
I posted this comment a few minutes ago but, as always, the NY Times dumped a bunch of comments on top of it. You, Good People, can decide what you think:
Here we go. The misinformation campaign - otherwise known as fake news - has started. Putin tricked The Con Don. The Con Don and his brood and International Mafia brethren are patsies. Victims. Unsuspecting dupes.
NO. Rachel Maddow (MSNBC 9 pm ET weeknights) warned us about this during her show Thursday night.
The Con Don and Putin both are BIG players in the International Mafia and they are about to get caught so it's time for a new "story" to try to throw us off. WE THE PEOPLE must stay focused and demand that The Con Don be prosecuted and removed from office, along with all the other International Mafia Top 1% Global Financial Elite Robber Baron/Radical religion Good Old Boys cabal, under RICO, The Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act - NOW.
They intend to destroy OUR lives. NO. WE will destroy their lives and claw back all the wealth and resources they have stolen since their hostile financial takeover started 40+ years ago.
This Must Not Stand in America. Not now. Not ever. WE THE PEOPLE can stop them together.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_Influenced_and_Corrupt_Organizat...
Here we go. The misinformation campaign - otherwise known as fake news - has started. Putin tricked The Con Don. The Con Don and his brood and International Mafia brethren are patsies. Victims. Unsuspecting dupes.
NO. Rachel Maddow (MSNBC 9 pm ET weeknights) warned us about this during her show Thursday night.
The Con Don and Putin both are BIG players in the International Mafia and they are about to get caught so it's time for a new "story" to try to throw us off. WE THE PEOPLE must stay focused and demand that The Con Don be prosecuted and removed from office, along with all the other International Mafia Top 1% Global Financial Elite Robber Baron/Radical religion Good Old Boys cabal, under RICO, The Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act - NOW.
They intend to destroy OUR lives. NO. WE will destroy their lives and claw back all the wealth and resources they have stolen since their hostile financial takeover started 40+ years ago.
This Must Not Stand in America. Not now. Not ever. WE THE PEOPLE can stop them together.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_Influenced_and_Corrupt_Organizat...
7
You make some good points, but I don't think the New York Times editors are deliberately misfiling your comments.
Very relieved that Congress has handcuffed Mr. Trump to keep him from giving away the American store for his personal advantage. They're aware that Trump isn't playing diplomacy, but rather Monopoly. He's never had hotels in Russia. It's all about the hotels on the Boardwalk.
7
Putin, with Trump, has validated much of the whataboutism that Putin grew up parroting and promoting. All any hard core Putinite needs to do to support their prince is point to Trump. His "retaliation" for sanctions are a trifle compared to the severity of the economic sanctions imposed by a still more or less unified West.
Is that all you've got Vladimir? He answers no, I still have Trump....
Is that all you've got Vladimir? He answers no, I still have Trump....
6
Trump keeps tying his own hands, through his own very public words and actions. His irresponsible speeches before the Boy Scouts and the Suffolk County Police reveal a speaker that does not even care to 'know his audience.' His speeches do not resemble any 'jokes' I have ever heard. Defenders that call every speech, 'just a joke,' need to ask themselves just when will the President of the U.S. start to get serious?
When someone lies and jokes all the time their credibility quickly dissolves. Meltdowns like the current White House debacle do not go on forever. Sometime after all credibility is lost, even close allies (Sessions, etc.) will abandon ship. I am so often reminded of grade school by this administration, 40 years after I attended. Playground taunting, bullying, indiscriminate use of foul language, and foot-in-mouth disease was rampant among the powerful in those days. Popular rich kids would still lose all their close friends, if they hurled enough insults and lacked common sense. Fortunately playground wars never involved ICBMs, though the use of kompromat was common. Eventually such rich kids were expelled or quietly transferred to private or military schools. After the expulsions our school became less threatening for the remaining students that wanted to learn something new.
When someone lies and jokes all the time their credibility quickly dissolves. Meltdowns like the current White House debacle do not go on forever. Sometime after all credibility is lost, even close allies (Sessions, etc.) will abandon ship. I am so often reminded of grade school by this administration, 40 years after I attended. Playground taunting, bullying, indiscriminate use of foul language, and foot-in-mouth disease was rampant among the powerful in those days. Popular rich kids would still lose all their close friends, if they hurled enough insults and lacked common sense. Fortunately playground wars never involved ICBMs, though the use of kompromat was common. Eventually such rich kids were expelled or quietly transferred to private or military schools. After the expulsions our school became less threatening for the remaining students that wanted to learn something new.
229
I guess I'm dating myself, but in the schools I went to, being able to beat up your opponents was much more useful than being rich. The rich kids either learned how to fight or kept their heads down.
>TH Willimas
"His irresponsible speeches before the Boy Scouts and the Suffolk County Police reveal a speaker that does not even care to 'know his audience.' "
Know his audience? Both were whooping and hollering on his every word. He was chastised only by the "elites' who run those organizations.
Classic Trump strategy and one that shows the basis and strength of his support.
"His irresponsible speeches before the Boy Scouts and the Suffolk County Police reveal a speaker that does not even care to 'know his audience.' "
Know his audience? Both were whooping and hollering on his every word. He was chastised only by the "elites' who run those organizations.
Classic Trump strategy and one that shows the basis and strength of his support.
Trump was transferred to a military school as an adolescent due to bad behavior. He has never grown up and needs another transfer back to private life.
1
Congress, the one that acts in a bipartisanship basis, finally got its act together with the sanctions bill. They came together to meet a common threat: Trump & Putin.
12
Backfires? I do not think so. Putin's plan is working like a charm. America has been permanently knocked off its perch. No one sees us as being top dog anymore.
My guess is that Putin will start to leak some really salacious junk soon, and Trump will react by engaging North Korea. That will spell the end of us (U.S.).
My guess is that Putin will start to leak some really salacious junk soon, and Trump will react by engaging North Korea. That will spell the end of us (U.S.).
11
Edward Snowden? Really? If it is the case, then listen to this baby boomer who was growing up during the height of the Cold War. If Trump engages North Korea, and the little man there wants to show how big, bad and important he is, it will spell the end of ALL of us. I thought Putin (Mr. KGB) was smarter than this. I suppose that coarse peasant like Nikita Khrushchev was the smart one. He knew there were no winners in the Nuclear Age
1
I am not a Putin lover, but at the same time - we needed to get knocked off our perch. We have drifted so far as a nation from the values we were founded on. We consider ourselves a democracy, even as we have spent the last 120 years propping up foreign dictators - often at the expense of democracy. While our own citizenry seems fairly oblivious to our authoritarianesque foreign policy, the rest of the world had been seeing it for some time, by and large.
1
Really? Well, Putin's plan may be working...for now. But that means nothing for the long run, especially since stealth is a major part of his game and he's been clocked.
Another thing.
This is STILL a Democracy. Don't be so quick to knock this country out of the game, either with, or without North Korea.
Another thing.
This is STILL a Democracy. Don't be so quick to knock this country out of the game, either with, or without North Korea.
1
Mr. Putin,
You deserve it, and we are laughing at you today. Bigly.
You deserve it, and we are laughing at you today. Bigly.
4
I wonder if Tillerson will quit now that the odds of his shoveling Russian money into Exxon have decreased significantly.
26
I think you've missed the point. Tillerson has cut back Exxon's activity in Russia--exactly in line with the company's retreat from huge megainvestments in difficult-to-exploit resources, due to fracking. Most of the major oil companies are following similar paths.
Well, President Trump, there goes your hoped for construction of a new string of hotels in Russia. Just when Putin was going to get his name on the yet to be built "Presidential Suites", dang...
7
I guess it's time to begin teaching grade-schoolers to take cover under their desks again.
Those who don't remember history (or, more likely, didn't read it in the first place,) are doomed to repeat it. Or, in this case, just doomed.
Those who don't remember history (or, more likely, didn't read it in the first place,) are doomed to repeat it. Or, in this case, just doomed.
1
There really isn't an "again". I remember those days, but that was in response to a potential attack by relatively low-power nukes. With today's multi-megaton weapons, there's no sense thinking furniture will offer any protection. MAD needs to be revisited, in a discussion about nuclear disarmament, not "modernizing" our nuclear arsenals.
1
Putin, and Trump for that matter, do not understand a fundamental truth about America: America's president serves at the pleasure of the American people. The American people are very angry at Putin and his henchmen for messing up our national election. Whoever that guy thinks he is, he is not someone Americans like, trust, or want to be like.
While Trump does think Putin is someone he likes, trusts and wants to be like, Trump also takes his orders from the American people. Trump does one thing well....he sticks his finger in the wind, and blows to the direction of the concerns of the American people. Trump has no core beliefs, no foundation, no bedrock principles upon which he will not budge....except perhaps one thing, protect Trump at all costs.
Regarding Putin, although Trump really does like the guy, Trump put his finger to the wind, saw that the winds of American citizens are almost uniformly against all things Putin and his henchmen, and acted accordingly, following in lock step with leadership provided by the American people. And thank the heavens for that...
While Trump does think Putin is someone he likes, trusts and wants to be like, Trump also takes his orders from the American people. Trump does one thing well....he sticks his finger in the wind, and blows to the direction of the concerns of the American people. Trump has no core beliefs, no foundation, no bedrock principles upon which he will not budge....except perhaps one thing, protect Trump at all costs.
Regarding Putin, although Trump really does like the guy, Trump put his finger to the wind, saw that the winds of American citizens are almost uniformly against all things Putin and his henchmen, and acted accordingly, following in lock step with leadership provided by the American people. And thank the heavens for that...
8
Saw Americans are uniformly against Putin and... acted accordingly? Huh? No - Trump saw his veto would be overridden and cowered. He's terrified Putin's leverage will reveal itself this week. Make no mistake - Trump is still protecting Trump.
2
The Congress of the United States by almost unanimous votes in both House and Senate has made it clear that Congress had rather destroy the President of the United States and to increase the risk of nuclear war than to avoid conflict with Russia by normalizing relations. The vote on the new sanctions makes it pointless for President Trump to veto the bill, because it passed both houses by far more than the two-thirds vote required to over-ride the president’s veto. The only thing Trump can achieve with a veto is to prove the false charge that he is in league with Vladimir Putin
The new sanctions bill forecloses the possibility of reducing the rising tensions between the two major nuclear powers. It also shows that whatever interest Congress has, if any, in reducing the threat of war and in avoiding a break with Europe over the sanctions, Congress has a much greater interest in continuing to collect campaign contributions from the powerful and rich military/security complex and in playing to the growing hatred of Russia that is encouraged by the US media.
More here:
(http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/07/28/new-russian-sanctions-bill-wa...
The new sanctions bill forecloses the possibility of reducing the rising tensions between the two major nuclear powers. It also shows that whatever interest Congress has, if any, in reducing the threat of war and in avoiding a break with Europe over the sanctions, Congress has a much greater interest in continuing to collect campaign contributions from the powerful and rich military/security complex and in playing to the growing hatred of Russia that is encouraged by the US media.
More here:
(http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/07/28/new-russian-sanctions-bill-wa...
1
Putin understands that Congress forced the vote on Trump, I feel sure, but I also feel sure that whatever Putin and Trump are hiding with regard to their previous relationship still will weigh in the balance. I don't believe for a minute that Putin and Trump never met before the Hamburg meetings.
3
usa999 wrote: "At a time when president Trump is under siege for suspected inappropriate, even illicit, dealings with Russia what could be more convenient than a manufactured tiff permitting him to argue he is not a pawn in Putin's hands?"
Cynical but unfortunately true. I certainly wouldn't attribute much crafty guile to Mr. Trump, but I would never underestimate Mr. Putin. There are times when his government's moves seems artfully shrewd.
Even if I had any confidence in Mr. Trump's concern for American interests and human welfare, the poor sop is clearly out matched in this arena.
Cynical but unfortunately true. I certainly wouldn't attribute much crafty guile to Mr. Trump, but I would never underestimate Mr. Putin. There are times when his government's moves seems artfully shrewd.
Even if I had any confidence in Mr. Trump's concern for American interests and human welfare, the poor sop is clearly out matched in this arena.
4
Russia still is the victor.
The US helped removed a Russia friendly regime right on their border in Ukraine.
They have fought fire with fire and showed the US what it's like to be meddled with and compromised.
They have the upper hand and what makes matters dangerous is that Trump still owes them.
The US helped removed a Russia friendly regime right on their border in Ukraine.
They have fought fire with fire and showed the US what it's like to be meddled with and compromised.
They have the upper hand and what makes matters dangerous is that Trump still owes them.
4
Russia referred to our "political schizophrenia" as the source of the problem. While we try to analyze Putin, we may want to reflect a bit on that description also. We've been making accusations without proof and jumping to conclusions and shouting about those conclusions without justification. There are some fine people investigating what and if something happened, and we have other work to do. The US looks as though it's on the verge of a collective nervous breakdown. If we don't curb that anxiety, worse times are ahead.
2
The intelligence agencies have plenty of proof. They issued their report on Russian interference back in January. You cannot hack invisibly without leaving a digital trail, and law enforcement and the intelligence agencies have a wealth of material and information to analyze. They reached their conclusions after a long investigation. The CIA became interested in Trump early in 2016 when so many Russians kept meeting with the Trump people. At that point the FBI took over. These are documented meetings, with tapes, witnesses, and other evidence.
1
Unfortunately, Russia is a nuclear power to be respected and feared as is the United States. Returning to the cold war only satisfies the many defence contractors who are still reeling from the end of the cold war. Our Congress would best serve the American people it supposedly represents by ending contributions from the most politically powerfull industries in the U.S. into their campaign funds. A new cold war is a dream for some very few and a potential nightmare for both the Russia and American people.
1
Whether we like them or not, Russia is a formidable country.
Let's make up.
They agree to spy less on us and not interfere with our internal affairs and we agree to cut back our spying on them, which we do more of than of than on just about any other country.
Let's make up.
They agree to spy less on us and not interfere with our internal affairs and we agree to cut back our spying on them, which we do more of than of than on just about any other country.
3
The Russian economy is only the size of Indiana's or a similar state. It is far smaller than that of California, for example. It is a long time since Russia was the Soviet Union. Putin wants to return to that time, but Russia is kind of a backwater now with leftover weapons.
1
There was no backfire, Things are going in accord with the clever cynical grand strategy of Putin.
Putin bet on electing Trump and sowing confusion and a lack of faith in the divided limited power American Constitutional republican form of government. Putin bet on Trump to sow dissension between America and it's Western European NATO/EU/EZ allies and it's Asian South Korean and Japanese allies. Putin bet on Trump focusing his Presidency on enhancing the personal and family profitable wealth of the House of Trump that is concealed in the Trump income tax returns and business records.
Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin's goal was and always has been to make Russia ethnic Slavic Kiev Rus Czar Ivan the Terrible and Czar Peter the Great great again. Russia is an aging shrinking nation of 143 million people with the ethnic Russian Orthodox majority having a below replacement level birth rate and shortened life expectancy. While surrounded by native and neighboring growing and youthful non-ethnic Russian Muslims. America has a nominal annual GDP that is 15x Russia. America annually spends 9x Russia on it's military. But Russia matters.
Putin bet on electing Trump and sowing confusion and a lack of faith in the divided limited power American Constitutional republican form of government. Putin bet on Trump to sow dissension between America and it's Western European NATO/EU/EZ allies and it's Asian South Korean and Japanese allies. Putin bet on Trump focusing his Presidency on enhancing the personal and family profitable wealth of the House of Trump that is concealed in the Trump income tax returns and business records.
Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin's goal was and always has been to make Russia ethnic Slavic Kiev Rus Czar Ivan the Terrible and Czar Peter the Great great again. Russia is an aging shrinking nation of 143 million people with the ethnic Russian Orthodox majority having a below replacement level birth rate and shortened life expectancy. While surrounded by native and neighboring growing and youthful non-ethnic Russian Muslims. America has a nominal annual GDP that is 15x Russia. America annually spends 9x Russia on it's military. But Russia matters.
4
President Trump has abdicated the United States' global leadership role.
US image has suffered around the globe under Trump.
The lack of a coherent foreign policy has resulted in degraded diplomatic relations worldwide.
Name any country that is not dismayed, and distraught.
Under Trump international relations with the rest of the world are more volatile.
It is that volatility, that may may make Putin’s recent actions actually create a more favorable international image for Russia.
US image has suffered around the globe under Trump.
The lack of a coherent foreign policy has resulted in degraded diplomatic relations worldwide.
Name any country that is not dismayed, and distraught.
Under Trump international relations with the rest of the world are more volatile.
It is that volatility, that may may make Putin’s recent actions actually create a more favorable international image for Russia.
3
It is too soon to make a call on what Putin has done. It may all have been done to help Trump.
3
Too soon? ALL our intelligence agencies have been CRYSTAL clear that russia engaged in a vast campaign, PERSONALLY authorized by putin, to disrupt our presidential election process, with the goal of getting the draft dodger elected.
They succeeded. "Soon" has come and gone.
They succeeded. "Soon" has come and gone.
1
This view of Putin and Trump seems shortsighted. It totally ignores the bigger picture. Putin does not see Trump as an ally. Putin is using Trump as a tool to create chaos. Our CIA has used this technique in other countries. The idea is to destroy any type of functioning government while instigating civil insurrection. The country's government is lost in itself trying to get some semblance of organization. Stuck trying to fix itself, the country cannot effectively meddle in world politics. Other countries are free to invade, test missiles, roam restricted areas, violate trade agreements, and carry out violations of international law.
Putin want Americans fighting each other and focused on Tweets rather than international events. Thankfully some semblance of order remains and our leaders were able to issue sanctions against Russia.
Putin want Americans fighting each other and focused on Tweets rather than international events. Thankfully some semblance of order remains and our leaders were able to issue sanctions against Russia.
4
Good ol' sanctions . . . I remember how well the sanctions against Iraq introduced by Bush and increased and continued by Clinton worked. When will we learn?
1
…and to think, that ‘both’ Putin and Trump thought that Congress would be the weaker next to the U.S. Presidency!
I hope this makes Congress realize their importance in our government as compared to the unimportance of their bickering.
I hope this makes Congress realize their importance in our government as compared to the unimportance of their bickering.
5
In another respect, Putin's support of the Trump campaign has succeeded beyond his wildest dreams, the sowing of chaos by Trump in our Democracy and the Western Alliance.
12
There is no comparison to Cold War for a good reason: last time USSR added territory to its borders was in the immediate aftermath of 1945, and it was hardly unilateral.
1
Russia is big. Roughly twice the size of the U.S.
But it’s population is less than half that of the U.S. and it’s GDP at 1.3 trillion is only 7 % of the U.S. (18.6 trillion).
Russia is not helpful. They are not a democracy. They lie, cheat, and intimidate. They can not be trusted.
Putin would like the rest of the world to respect Russia. But what is there about Russia to respect? Nuclear weapons? Yes, Russia has a tremendous amount of nuclear weapons. But with the promise of Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD), nuclear war is unwinnable and obsolete ...and they know it.
Russia seems to think that they can bully their way to respect. I suggest that they are irrelevant to the rest of the world. Or should be.
Isolate them economically and politically. It worked before.
But it’s population is less than half that of the U.S. and it’s GDP at 1.3 trillion is only 7 % of the U.S. (18.6 trillion).
Russia is not helpful. They are not a democracy. They lie, cheat, and intimidate. They can not be trusted.
Putin would like the rest of the world to respect Russia. But what is there about Russia to respect? Nuclear weapons? Yes, Russia has a tremendous amount of nuclear weapons. But with the promise of Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD), nuclear war is unwinnable and obsolete ...and they know it.
Russia seems to think that they can bully their way to respect. I suggest that they are irrelevant to the rest of the world. Or should be.
Isolate them economically and politically. It worked before.
10
"... and a large station of spies, some working under diplomatic cover."
Perhaps they are trying to influence elections in Russia like trying that Putin will not be re-elected next time around.
Perhaps they are trying to influence elections in Russia like trying that Putin will not be re-elected next time around.
2
Putin's bet was if Trump were president, it would ultimately weaken the country. The last time a Republican was president, the U.S. was dragged into two wars, and the economy tanked. This time....I mean, Donald Trump is in charge. How many bankruptcies has he been through already? His unpredictable behavior alone is distraction enough from the country working on any actual issue that would enable it to progress in any way.
11
I have to question the premise of this article - that Putin wanted to "improve ties to the US".
Putin's goal is to gain advantage over the US, pure and simple. If being friendly would take him closer to that goal, fine. If there are more economically and politically expedient ways of doing so, all the better.
It is grossly premature to say that Trump's hands are tied with respect to Russia. While Congress may have spoken with a single voice, it seems that Trump can hit bottom, then dig deeper. While the Russian sanctions are still in place, the US now finds itself with virtually no diplomatic cover in Russia, which will have a negative impact on the quality of intelligence it gathers, not to mention a decline in regional influence. This is a pyrrhic victory.
Just step back. Look at what Putin accomplished over the past 15 months. He successfully meddled in a US presidential election, a major feat in itself. The US now has a rogue, unqualified President alienated from Congress and the Senate, and under multiple investigations for his ties to Russia. The US has stepped back from Crimea, criticized its NATO allies, and softened it's stance towards Assad. The President, due to his many imbroglios, has weakened the US's ability to make clear decisions on foreign policy--not to mention the fact that, after 6 months in office, he has not been able to make a single legislative accomplishment.
Simply put, Putin has schooled Americans in information warfare.
Putin's goal is to gain advantage over the US, pure and simple. If being friendly would take him closer to that goal, fine. If there are more economically and politically expedient ways of doing so, all the better.
It is grossly premature to say that Trump's hands are tied with respect to Russia. While Congress may have spoken with a single voice, it seems that Trump can hit bottom, then dig deeper. While the Russian sanctions are still in place, the US now finds itself with virtually no diplomatic cover in Russia, which will have a negative impact on the quality of intelligence it gathers, not to mention a decline in regional influence. This is a pyrrhic victory.
Just step back. Look at what Putin accomplished over the past 15 months. He successfully meddled in a US presidential election, a major feat in itself. The US now has a rogue, unqualified President alienated from Congress and the Senate, and under multiple investigations for his ties to Russia. The US has stepped back from Crimea, criticized its NATO allies, and softened it's stance towards Assad. The President, due to his many imbroglios, has weakened the US's ability to make clear decisions on foreign policy--not to mention the fact that, after 6 months in office, he has not been able to make a single legislative accomplishment.
Simply put, Putin has schooled Americans in information warfare.
7
It's easier for you to say that Putin changed 'his' mind on Trump than for you to admit that it was likely Hillary they wished to advance and that her e-mails and failures were unrelated to Russia, but Russia's hijinx were focused on helping HER win (which she did win the popular vote, so it is said). Trump's little comments about Russia would not be enough for Putin to think it was going to change Russia's image or power. He obviously would see Trump as a very strong leader. Yet, despite their meddling, Trump won anyway through our Constitutional process. Anyone who had paid attention to what was actually going on in the country would have seen that Trump was going to win. But, the story here needs to continue to project the narrative that Russia 'bet' on the wrong person. Typical NYT reporting... no surprises here.
1
Amid the chaos of this presidency, we are witnessing the system of checks and balances at work. Congress and the Judiciary are effectively putting the breaks on the questionable policies of this administration.
Not to mention, the value of the free press!
Not to mention, the value of the free press!
7
Putin must now realize that Trump's long business ties with Russian interests will eventually end his presidency. But his hopes of ending the Magnitski Act to protect his own business interests overseas must be a source of constant grief for Putin now that the U.S. Congress voted to slap on additional sanctions.
2
Perhaps our Exxon-Mobil Secretary of State can diplomatically fix our relationship with Putin!
Putin runs a country that was made for economic sanctions. It has very little domestic moderate to high tech manufacturing, an unstable food supply, a dodgy and aged military, and gets by selling off it's dirt (ore, metal, oil, gas, coal, whatever). If we could wean Europe off of its natural gas, Putin wouldn't last a year with full-power sanctions.
And he knows all of this.
And he knows all of this.
2
This article may be correct, but sees the forest for the trees.
It seems more likely Russian efforts aiding right-wing populism are to foment political infighting at home and weaken post war liberal consensus in the West.
To that end, Russia has been wildly successful without firing a single shot. The new cold war is the information war.
It seems more likely Russian efforts aiding right-wing populism are to foment political infighting at home and weaken post war liberal consensus in the West.
To that end, Russia has been wildly successful without firing a single shot. The new cold war is the information war.
2
This article should be in the op-ed section, as it relies on quite a lot of speculation. We do not know why the Russians aided the Trump campaign, and I doubt the aim was so straightforward as to achieve relief from sanctions. Perhaps that was one hope, but I suspect the main goal was to undermine stability within the U.S., thus pushing us to the point where our international influence has waned considerably and we are so busy with infighting that we are rapidly losing our place as the primary superpower determining international affairs. This opens up opportunities for Russia to increase their own spheres of influence around the globe, which is worth much more than relief from U.S. sanctions.
2
A trillion dollars has left Russia since Putin came to power. Had to go somewhere. The Magnitsky Act made laundering that money exponentially more difficult for Putin and his pals. Follow the money. Putin has shown over and over again that money is his raison d'être. Power is just his means, and spheres of influence are so yesterday.
1
Russia is a has a much weaker hand to play now than the old Soviet Union. Not only is it much diminished geographically, but economically. The kelptocratic oligarchy of Vladimir Putin has little economic clout other than its oil and gas reserves, and those are much less valuable (with exceptions as noted with regard to Germany) as the world turns away from fossil fuels. The Cold war strategy initiated by George Kennan that became known as "detente" was ultimately successful in bringing about the economic collapse of the Soviet Union. A return to that policy with stepped up sanctions will have the same result. The essential ingredient is having steady hands in the Oval Office as well as the Kremlin. And, with the unstable, erratic hands of Donald Trump, there should be deep concern about how, or even if, a renewal of detente can succeed.
1
If a Cold War strategy is again the best approach to our relationship with Russia, then we should be even more concerned about deficiencies in the staffing and competence levels of our Trump-Tillerson era State Department.
5
Puty does not seem to have considered the law of unintended consequences. When you try to hard you might get the opposite of the desired effect.
1
Curious to see a deeper understanding of the banking relationships. Suspect his negotiation style of win-lose alienated most and led to Russia as a primary option in his business dealings. Thus the secrecy in records/tax filings and the strange support for Russia that undermines his ability to galvanize Republicans behind him.
Most news sources were telling us that Russia's objective in their election tampering was to weaken Hillary Clinton and the administration they expected to be confronting on the world stage. Clinton had already established a tough-on-Russia stance during her time as Secretary of State.
That Donald Trump won the election probably surprised Putin as much as it surprised Clinton - and almost everyone else. But Trump had expressed his admiration for the Russian leader, perhaps simply because some praise had flowed from Putin in Trump's direction or perhaps for reasons we may never fully understand.
It stands to reason that a bromance was expected and may well exist. But in our system of government, no one person - not even our President - has unbridled power. Congress saw the danger of weakness toward a Russian leader who had already annexed Crimea, posed an imminent threat to the rest of Ukraine, seized a powerful & cruel role in Syria, and meddled in our elections to an extent not previously practiced.
So the bully on the global stage has been met with resistance & real consequences from the United States government. Might there be a lesson here for everyone about bullying as a political tactic? It will take you only so far.
That Donald Trump won the election probably surprised Putin as much as it surprised Clinton - and almost everyone else. But Trump had expressed his admiration for the Russian leader, perhaps simply because some praise had flowed from Putin in Trump's direction or perhaps for reasons we may never fully understand.
It stands to reason that a bromance was expected and may well exist. But in our system of government, no one person - not even our President - has unbridled power. Congress saw the danger of weakness toward a Russian leader who had already annexed Crimea, posed an imminent threat to the rest of Ukraine, seized a powerful & cruel role in Syria, and meddled in our elections to an extent not previously practiced.
So the bully on the global stage has been met with resistance & real consequences from the United States government. Might there be a lesson here for everyone about bullying as a political tactic? It will take you only so far.
2
Backfired?
1)Russia's interference in the election has thrown the U.S. political system into complete turmoil, possibly fatal.
2)Who knows what national security secrets Trump and his gang have already given the Russians as the price of keeping power, since Trump is very much aware that Putin has the evidence to bring him down at any time he chooses.
3)Trump's actions and policies have weakened the United States itself, and diminished its influence in every region of the world.
1)Russia's interference in the election has thrown the U.S. political system into complete turmoil, possibly fatal.
2)Who knows what national security secrets Trump and his gang have already given the Russians as the price of keeping power, since Trump is very much aware that Putin has the evidence to bring him down at any time he chooses.
3)Trump's actions and policies have weakened the United States itself, and diminished its influence in every region of the world.
2
It is something of a generalization to say the bipartisan vote consists of a coalition of Democrats who blame President Putin for Hillary's defeat and Republicans who fear Trump misunderstands who he is dealing with in Moscow. Both are undoubtedly true but there are Republicans on record expressing concern about the meddling (next time Russia may work to elect a Democrat) and Democrats who are wary of Russia and think Trump misunderstands Putin. But clearly Putin miscalculated, perhaps thinking Trump would be as effective an autocrat as he is. But the US is not Russia. Progress in our relationship with Russia has always come when America deals from a position of American strength, not when Trump does his latter-day Neville Chamberlain and proffers American appeasement.
1
Perhaps the extra sanctions are due to the Anti-Russia hysteria created by politicians and media outlets like the New York Times, rather than the delusion that Trump was the Russian candidate. Nevertheless, Putin has proven himself to be quite a powerful man. He has managed to burrow the image of his threatening power into the brains of the “Trump Russia” set with great success . Can we please have some peace!
1
In all of this, Putin knows what exactly has transpired between his people and Trump's. So until Putin starts using that info, we have not even begun to see if Russia is actually 'reacting' to our actions instead of just playing out their own script.
Even Putin is discovering that Trump is 110% untrustworthy in a "relationship". Maybe Putin will get angry enough that he'll release those hotel videotapes and all the financial dealings; and end the farce of the Trump Presidency quickly-but-spectacularly.
You hear a lot of this "serves them right" rhetoric, but you have to consider the alternative. Rightly or wrongly, the Russians were convinced that a Clinton presidency would mean war with the US, a war the Russians were certain to lose. Compared to that existential threat, the sanctions, tough as they are, are not so bad, especially coming from a US whose international stature has been so much diminished by the Trump presidency. If Putin did help elect Trump, I doubt he has any regrets. He gets hit with sanctions, but we get 4 years of Trump. Who got the worst of that deal?
1
Putin's betting on Trump backfired? Really? Trump has been trying mightily to do deliver a virtual wish list of Putin's foreign policy objectives to him wherever he has had the power to do so. From publicly degrading and weakening our alliances with NATO and other pro-democracy countries to pulling out of and giving Russia a free hand in Syria to attacking and attempting to degrade and diminish American intelligence services he has surely delivered more than Putin could have dreamed possible.
Time will tell just how low into a gutter of sedition and treason Trump will go. If the first six months are any indication of his loyalty to Putin it will be very, very deep indeed.
Time will tell just how low into a gutter of sedition and treason Trump will go. If the first six months are any indication of his loyalty to Putin it will be very, very deep indeed.
1
I would love someone who knows way more than me to explain, why are strained relations with Moscow a bad thing? Russia is not a military or economic superpower. Russia has like one aircraft carrier with a bungee cord for a rocket launcher. Russia kills journalists who report the truth. Russia invaded Crimea and wants to take over Ukraine. Russia-backed fighters shot down a passenger airliner over Ukraine and killed 100s of people, with no repercussion. Russia hacked the DNC and actively tried to influence our voters to elect the candidate they preferred. The US has no influence over them, they act with impunity. Why do we want to be their friend? I support the sanctions and if Russia wants to toss out our diplomats, so be it. Don't they need us way more than we need them?
1
Putin and Russian have been punished for manipulating the 2016 Presidential election. Now it is Trump's turn along with his cabal of conspirators and collaborators. Trump will be impeached and he will be prosecuted. We are going to get to the bottom of this treasonous relationship and there is nothing that Trump can do about it but stall (i.e., hiring and firing investigators and prosecutors, and creating new distractions). If Trump thought that becoming President gave him the powers of a czar, then he was sadly mistaken.
If there is one constant in the universe, it's that American presidents badly mis-judge Russian leaders. They all think that what they believe helped get them to the White House, their charm and charisma, will win over their opponent.
They have no idea about the Russian mind, raised from childhood on depravation, struggle and suspicion. The dangerous ones mask it with a happy face, and once the mask falls off the disaster is revealed. Fortunately for us, Putin has never been good about consistently wearing his mask, which wasn't good to start with.
They have no idea about the Russian mind, raised from childhood on depravation, struggle and suspicion. The dangerous ones mask it with a happy face, and once the mask falls off the disaster is revealed. Fortunately for us, Putin has never been good about consistently wearing his mask, which wasn't good to start with.
1
What is not mentioned here is that before Trump, our strong economic and political bonds with NATO, Japan, South Korea, China, India, Israel, and many other countries made another cold war much less attractive to Russia. Now that we have distanced ourselves from many of these alliances, voiced opposition to economic globalism and hollowed out our formerly highly effective State Department, we are much more vulnerable to Russia's efforts to undermine the power of the US in the world. Simply put, Trump's arrogant populist diplomacy has made us weaker without producing anything of value.
1
ANYONE who bets on Trump, loses. Creditors, family, friends, Putin, voters (and their dependent non-voters). There is a trend here.
3
This recent move by Congress has proven, much to Putin's chagrin, that the U.S. still will not acknowledge Russia as a nation whose global importance and clout are equal to its own. Still, I fear that one realm in which Russia will be able to retaliate, and shore up its global influence, is in the Middle East. Amid the conflicts between the region's authoritarian leaders and tribal Islamist factions, Russia has shown itself, by some standards, to be a more consistent ally than we have. And while certain nations (e.g., Afghanistan) have plenty of reasons to hate Russia as much as the U.S., the leaders of others (such as Iran) probably see Putin as much closer to their ideal of leadership than we are. The fact that Russia remains a military force to be reckoned with, combined with the U.S.'s disastrous and disorganized Middle East record under Trump, could mean that America stands to lose even more ground in our fight against terrorism there.
Don't think for one second that the Russians had not considered these events in their calculations
Backfires only in the sense that Putin was too successful for his own good. His goal was to weaken the west, the EU and NATO. And for awhile he was riding high. Brexit was a gift and Trump's election was a surprise. But elections in Austria, the Netherlands and France put a halt to a nationalistic right wing takeover and Merkel's expected election in Germany buries that goal. The EU is stronger. NATO has survived and the west is quite prepared to ignore the US and go their own way. The loser in all this is the US. But don't expect Pres Trump to figure that out.
1
I am still waiting for it to be signed...
1
One thing that Mafia-like autocrats like is for a person who is bought to stay bought. So maybe Trump is in for some damaging revenge-leaks as the Mueller investigation continues.
Or maybe this is just more of the geopolitical carnival, and Trumputin still have some kind of deal, for example to let Russia take effective control of the rest of Ukraine in exchange for, say, Arctic oil or throwing the Assad family under the bus.
Or maybe this is just more of the geopolitical carnival, and Trumputin still have some kind of deal, for example to let Russia take effective control of the rest of Ukraine in exchange for, say, Arctic oil or throwing the Assad family under the bus.
The alleged Putin's bet itself seems to be a bet of the anti-Trump forces in the US. Putin could be actually responding now to expulsions of Russian diplomats by Presdent Obama !
How much of a threat is Putin expelling American/Russian Diplomats to ‘our’ nation as compared to the threat it poses to Russia’s own economically driven down nation with sanctions and Putin’s leadership skills? Part of it means that The U.S. can no longer work as well, diplomatically, with Putin’s criminally-insane Government of Russia, where we play a part in making their government ‘only appear’ as an equal on the International stage with the law-abiding United States Government?! I mean, imagine that!
Russians take a long view to history, while Americans are more near-sighted. I would not be so quick to draw conclusions about Russian strategy. American diplomacy tends to play checkers (tit-for-tat). Russian diplomacy may be more like chess.
1
Vladimir Putin is indeed an enemy of democracy. But I think you've failed to craft any coherent conclusion from the rest of the evidence you've presented.
For starters, Putin isn't playing tit-for-tat. He's the world's top authoritarian, having built his empire on the bones of Russian democracy, which he killed with his own hands. The idea that he's lashing out in a fit of insecurity is absurd.
The reason Putin supports Donald Trump is the very same so many of us are writhing in discomfort at his presidency. Mr. Trump is more than just a force for chaos, a deconstructionist, and a demagogue. He is a nails-on-a-chalkboard, primal scream of an alarm signal that something is desperately wrong in the United States. He is nothing less than a sign of weakness in our own democracy.
It's no wonder he can't wipe the smirk off his face. Our nation is wrapped in a state of desperate internal conflict from the Oval Office to the grocery store checkout line. Every headline pushes us deeper - more paranoid, more disaffected. Every exasperating run-in with a formerly reasonable neighbor makes us more certain that we are no longer Us.
All of this does tell a story, but it isn't a story about relations between the U.S. and Russia. It's the next chapter in the story of American democracy, and how it weathers adversity to come out stronger and ever more formidable, despite every effort of it's enemies.
For starters, Putin isn't playing tit-for-tat. He's the world's top authoritarian, having built his empire on the bones of Russian democracy, which he killed with his own hands. The idea that he's lashing out in a fit of insecurity is absurd.
The reason Putin supports Donald Trump is the very same so many of us are writhing in discomfort at his presidency. Mr. Trump is more than just a force for chaos, a deconstructionist, and a demagogue. He is a nails-on-a-chalkboard, primal scream of an alarm signal that something is desperately wrong in the United States. He is nothing less than a sign of weakness in our own democracy.
It's no wonder he can't wipe the smirk off his face. Our nation is wrapped in a state of desperate internal conflict from the Oval Office to the grocery store checkout line. Every headline pushes us deeper - more paranoid, more disaffected. Every exasperating run-in with a formerly reasonable neighbor makes us more certain that we are no longer Us.
All of this does tell a story, but it isn't a story about relations between the U.S. and Russia. It's the next chapter in the story of American democracy, and how it weathers adversity to come out stronger and ever more formidable, despite every effort of it's enemies.
1
Here we go. The misinformation campaign - otherwise known as fake news - has started. Putin tricked The Con Don. The Con Don and his brood and International Mafia brethren are patsies. Victims. Unsuspecting dupes.
NO. Rachel Maddow (MSNBC 9 pm ET weeknights) warned us about this during her show Thursday night.
The Con Don and Putin both are BIG players in the International Mafia and they are about to get caught so it's time for a new "story" to try to throw us off. WE THE PEOPLE must stay focused and demand that The Con Don be prosecuted and removed from office, along with all the other International Mafia Top 1% Global Financial Elite Robber Baron/Radical religion Good Old Boys cabal, under RICO, The Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act - NOW.
They intend to destroy OUR lives. NO. WE will destroy their lives and claw back all the wealth and resources they have stolen since their hostile financial takeover started 40+ years ago.
This Must Not Stand in America. Not now. Not ever. WE THE PEOPLE can stop them together.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_Influenced_and_Corrupt_Organizat...
NO. Rachel Maddow (MSNBC 9 pm ET weeknights) warned us about this during her show Thursday night.
The Con Don and Putin both are BIG players in the International Mafia and they are about to get caught so it's time for a new "story" to try to throw us off. WE THE PEOPLE must stay focused and demand that The Con Don be prosecuted and removed from office, along with all the other International Mafia Top 1% Global Financial Elite Robber Baron/Radical religion Good Old Boys cabal, under RICO, The Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act - NOW.
They intend to destroy OUR lives. NO. WE will destroy their lives and claw back all the wealth and resources they have stolen since their hostile financial takeover started 40+ years ago.
This Must Not Stand in America. Not now. Not ever. WE THE PEOPLE can stop them together.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_Influenced_and_Corrupt_Organizat...
5
I disagree with this analysis.
Russia gains status in the world in 2 ways. It earns more status or it diminishes the status of its greatest competitor. Putin and Russia have successfully lowered America's standing in the world.
TRUMP is a win-win. If TRUMP embraces Russia by lifting sanctions and trade deals, so much the better for Putin. Putin gets to be the deal maker of Russia. If TRUMP is a chaotic mess and Russia is seen as a pariah, so much the better for Putin. He gets to sit back and laugh at the reality show called, "The Apprentice: White House Edition." Putin gets to be the Big Man on the World Stage. The sanctions are just the price of pay-per-view.
Of course, we all assume that Putin has more in his bag of tricks and that he'll dole them out when the time feels right. So far, TRUMP himself is doing all the hard work of making chaos. Putin must be enjoying this immensely.
Russia gains status in the world in 2 ways. It earns more status or it diminishes the status of its greatest competitor. Putin and Russia have successfully lowered America's standing in the world.
TRUMP is a win-win. If TRUMP embraces Russia by lifting sanctions and trade deals, so much the better for Putin. Putin gets to be the deal maker of Russia. If TRUMP is a chaotic mess and Russia is seen as a pariah, so much the better for Putin. He gets to sit back and laugh at the reality show called, "The Apprentice: White House Edition." Putin gets to be the Big Man on the World Stage. The sanctions are just the price of pay-per-view.
Of course, we all assume that Putin has more in his bag of tricks and that he'll dole them out when the time feels right. So far, TRUMP himself is doing all the hard work of making chaos. Putin must be enjoying this immensely.
602
couldn't agree more. thanks for your comment.
Yup.
Nobody wins when the system becomes radically destabilized. We've been damaged by the last election. Trump will damage us further. But the main risk - a nuclear war, large or small - must be contained. And the only way to do that is the remove Trump from office, which means impeachment. Should we assume that Russia has kompromat on Trump dirty enough to force it?
The entire theory behind the Russia story was that it "interfered" with our democracy so Putin would have an advantage against a novice president in Putin's quest to achieve geopolitical success on the world stage makes absolutely no sense. Trump advocated a strong military buildup and an aggressive approach to increase the production of oil and natural gas that would result in much lower prices for these commodities, which are the life blood of Russia's economy. Both of these policies would significantly degrade Russia's relative power on the world stage. On the other hand, Clinton advocated continuing Obama's feckless policies which did not consider Russia to be a geopolitical foe (Obama notoriously chastised Romey that "the cold war was over" when Romey named Russia as the US's greatest threat in a presidential debate), degrading US's military power and curtailing fossil fuel production. Under Obama/Clinton, Russia annexed Crimea, invaded Ukraine and established a military presence in the Middle East for the first time in its history without any response from the Obama/Clinton administration. Why would Putin favor Trump over Clinton? It makes no sense.
4
Why would Putin favor Trump over Clinton? Because Putin wants to weaken the US, and having an incompetent fool as POTUS furthers that goal. There isn't any serious doubt about his support for Trump, and Russia's efforts to influence the campaign to Trump's advantage; if you don't agree with that you are either a Russian troll or a willing tool of Russian trolls.
8
You are just parroting Trump's own words on why Putin would prefer Hillary - which almost no-one buys except Trumpers! And it's Romney, not Romey! By saying the cold war was over, Obama was following the policy that Russia should be treated as diminished on the world stage, unlike during the Cold War when Russia (USSR) was on close to equal footing. What Trump has done is trash that approach by lowering the US's status and leadership, which automatically enhances Russia's, as well as casting doubt on the US commitment to ensuring NATO is fighting Putin at every step, further emboldening Russia. Russia will always seek to raise it's status so it's intervention in the election was its way of lowering ours, and it has worked by making us the laughingsotck of the rest of the world. Puitin is not worried about military and energy policy threatening him, only contiued US leadership.
3
You can't have it both ways. You criticize Obama's attitudes toward Russia as being too soft yet you defend a President who speaks affectionately about Putin. Trump denies any Russian meddling in our country's elections despite the informed opinions of every expert. It took an act of Congress to defy him and reinstate Obama's sanctions. Meanwhile, nearly everyone around the President took undisclosed meetings with the Russians and all you can say is but, but, Hillary...
Trump's actions regarding Russia and Putin are all about money - his own. He cares nothing for the global issues. We need to see Trump's financials and his indebtedness to Russian money. This is the real story.
Trump's actions regarding Russia and Putin are all about money - his own. He cares nothing for the global issues. We need to see Trump's financials and his indebtedness to Russian money. This is the real story.
9
Putin made a calculated gamble. I am not sure that I would make the "backfires spectacularly" call at this point in time.
While the sanctions look bad for Russia, more the people than the leadership, we will see how well enforced they are.
Putin may not have the "sure bet" in the White House, but he has succeeded in adding to divided doubt and mistrust in the USA of our institutions and elections. That looks like a win for Putin to me, and the game is still far from over.
While the sanctions look bad for Russia, more the people than the leadership, we will see how well enforced they are.
Putin may not have the "sure bet" in the White House, but he has succeeded in adding to divided doubt and mistrust in the USA of our institutions and elections. That looks like a win for Putin to me, and the game is still far from over.
34
you had me at "at this point in time."
1
This strikes me as a fundamental misreading of the Putin-Trump relationship. At a time when president Trump is under siege for suspected inappropriate, even illicit, dealings with Russia what could be more convenient than a manufactured tiff permitting him to argue he is not a pawn in Putin's hands? If these two guys are so chummy this friction would never happen. As it has happened it looks like they are not as chummy as critics claim. In addition attaching the Russian reaction to the sanctions voted by Congress enables President Trump to claim the expulsion of US personnel reflects excessive Congressional intrusion into foreign policy-making. In other words it is okay to sanction North Korea and Iran but including Russia in the mix had negative consequences. Bad Congress!
And this also provides a gentle reminder to Trump that while Putin is a great buddy he does have an assortment of clubs at his disposal.
Meanwhile, who is actually around to police the sanctions? Trump and Tillerson have been gutting the State Department, Putin has roiled the embassy staff, and Commerce is in the hands of someone formerly high in the Bank of Cyprus, an apparent channel for Russian money-laundering. In 6 months Putin has put serious strain on NATO and Western Europe, gained carte blanche in Syria, and damaged US standing around the world. Maybe the sanctions are slow to unravel but the game has always been far more than that and Putin is well-placed to win big in 2018 and 2020.
And this also provides a gentle reminder to Trump that while Putin is a great buddy he does have an assortment of clubs at his disposal.
Meanwhile, who is actually around to police the sanctions? Trump and Tillerson have been gutting the State Department, Putin has roiled the embassy staff, and Commerce is in the hands of someone formerly high in the Bank of Cyprus, an apparent channel for Russian money-laundering. In 6 months Putin has put serious strain on NATO and Western Europe, gained carte blanche in Syria, and damaged US standing around the world. Maybe the sanctions are slow to unravel but the game has always been far more than that and Putin is well-placed to win big in 2018 and 2020.
35
First, anyone using "USA" in his/her handle (in lower-case besides) is a Russian troll. So, let's get that out of the way.
Next, the "clubs" Putin has at his disposal are extremely limited. His allies are all manufactured or under siege. He is surrounded, literally, by enemy states. His oil and gas is worth less than he had hoped and his mineral commodities are currently in low demand. Syria? That's Afghanistan, spelled differently. Bank of Cyprus? That's a joke, right? I've seen mattresses with larger declared holdings.
Go away, Russian. I'm not impressed. Putin's days are numbered.
Next, the "clubs" Putin has at his disposal are extremely limited. His allies are all manufactured or under siege. He is surrounded, literally, by enemy states. His oil and gas is worth less than he had hoped and his mineral commodities are currently in low demand. Syria? That's Afghanistan, spelled differently. Bank of Cyprus? That's a joke, right? I've seen mattresses with larger declared holdings.
Go away, Russian. I'm not impressed. Putin's days are numbered.
2
The bromance between Putin and Trump has been one-sided! Trump thinks that appeasement will solve it - look up Neville Chamberlain vs. Hitler in 1938! Putin preferred Trump because he felt Trump was naive and thought it was a two-way friendship when Putin's KGB mindset will simply use the perceived bromance when it suits him.
1
Dear Vlad,
The difference between Russia and the US, is that as of today, there is still a true balance of powers.
No one person runs the US, even Trump. And you and/or your proxies interfered in our election, despite your denials.
If you continue to bust our chops, we will have no alternative other than to return the favor.
And there are a few hundred million of us who will not agree to change that, no matter what one person says, as our new legislation connotes.
Finally, since Russia is so great, why don't your oligarchs continue to invest their money and and live their lives there? We already have enough inequality here to fill our swamp here. We just want to share some of our wealth and inequality with you, too.
The difference between Russia and the US, is that as of today, there is still a true balance of powers.
No one person runs the US, even Trump. And you and/or your proxies interfered in our election, despite your denials.
If you continue to bust our chops, we will have no alternative other than to return the favor.
And there are a few hundred million of us who will not agree to change that, no matter what one person says, as our new legislation connotes.
Finally, since Russia is so great, why don't your oligarchs continue to invest their money and and live their lives there? We already have enough inequality here to fill our swamp here. We just want to share some of our wealth and inequality with you, too.
43
The oligarchs need to get their money out of Russia because as long as it stays there it isn't really money: it can be taken away from them whenever the gangsters who run the country feel like doing so. In the West their money is really money.
1
"...U.S. policy turns out to be in the hands of Russophobic forces that are pushing Washington toward confrontation..."
Oh, and that little invasion of Crimea, its annexation, and then screwing around with US Presidential elections.
Those little things.
Oh, and that little invasion of Crimea, its annexation, and then screwing around with US Presidential elections.
Those little things.
188
Crimeea actually used to be Russian territory that the Soviet Union attached to The Republic of Ukraine to Russify it (this happened well before Putin was born).
After the break of USSR, Russia wanted that territory back for strategic purposes. Btw, almost all former USSR republic were endowed with slivers of Russian regions to russify them, which makes situation complicated today. For instance, Russian Transnistria was attached to the Republic of Moldavia (which in turn had been stolen from Romania in 1940) and today all the conflicts are happening there, in Transnistria.
After the break of USSR, Russia wanted that territory back for strategic purposes. Btw, almost all former USSR republic were endowed with slivers of Russian regions to russify them, which makes situation complicated today. For instance, Russian Transnistria was attached to the Republic of Moldavia (which in turn had been stolen from Romania in 1940) and today all the conflicts are happening there, in Transnistria.
1
Putin is also a war criminal since he deliberately bombed civilian sites such as hospitals in Syria where 1/4 of the victims were children, as well as bombing humanitarian convoys. Once a KGB thug, always a KGB thug.
4
If you are going to give a history lesson, be complete and accurate: Russia, America, Britain, and China, signed a solemn agreement guaranteeing Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity -- in return for its voluntarily giving up the world's third-largest stockpile of nuclear weapons (inherited from Soviet times).
Putin broke this treaty and violated international law to become the first European power since the end of WW II to attack another European country and annex territory.
Putin broke this treaty and violated international law to become the first European power since the end of WW II to attack another European country and annex territory.
3
The rogue went rogue. But chaos and disruption in the West was the main goal, which DT brought, everywhere ... Paris Climate Accord, Syria, N. Korea, Trade Agreements and Congress.
94
All these articles presuming to know Vlad Putin's mind and motivation.
8
Hey, plenty of stuff is written every day by people who claim to know the mind of God, such as: do not eat pigs or shellfish.
It's never stopped anyone from speculating.
It's never stopped anyone from speculating.
3
"A little more than a year after the Russian effort to interfere in the American presidential election came to light, the diplomatic fallout — an unraveling of the relationship between Moscow and Washington on a scale not seen in decades — is taking its toll." I see that this still unproven allegation fabricated by US intelligence agencies has now achieved the status of established "fact" and has accomplished its purpose of placing fake news into the compliant mass media and the minds of a gullible and uniformed public and reigniting the cold war in the interests of the military industrial complex. Goebbels could not have done a better job. Mission accomplished.
9
"I see that this still unproven allegation fabricated by US intelligence agencies has now achieved the status of established "fact" and has accomplished its purpose of placing fake news into the compliant mass media and the minds of a gullible and uniformed public and reigniting the cold war in the interests of the military industrial complex."
You are exactly right except that you got it completely backwards.
The entire intelligence community would not have been investigating it for 2 years -- long before Trump -- if it were not a fact.
#2 -- the actual professional journalists are covering it as they should.
#3 -- the only gullible and brainwashed are those who get all their "information" from Fox, Drudge, Breitbart, Rushbo and Mark Levin.
You are exactly right except that you got it completely backwards.
The entire intelligence community would not have been investigating it for 2 years -- long before Trump -- if it were not a fact.
#2 -- the actual professional journalists are covering it as they should.
#3 -- the only gullible and brainwashed are those who get all their "information" from Fox, Drudge, Breitbart, Rushbo and Mark Levin.
6
I see the Russian campaign to undermine U.S. institutions such as its intelligence community and the press has had its effect on you.
6
Yes, backfires. But the blast is in the face of the American people.
We are the "Biggest Loser."
We are the "Biggest Loser."
46
We always are.
How could it be otherwise?
The rich and powerful ain't taking the hit. Never have, never will.
How could it be otherwise?
The rich and powerful ain't taking the hit. Never have, never will.
3
Vlad the latest to be near the trump and gets burned none the less. oh well. Vlad not like you had warning.
6
It wasn't Trump who called for sanctions. it was Congress. As a result Congress deserves to have its approval rating rise from 13% to 14%. come on, let's give credit where it's due.
93
Approval of US Congress is at 14 percent, but approval of the sanctions bill by the same US Congress, which effectively thwarts the Putin-Trump alliance, is supported by an overwhelming majority of Americans. That's a separate issue -- which you, in your disingenuous post, conveniently left out.
3
It doesn't sound like Old House is too popular.
I don't understand why the U.S. is so interested in Ukraine and Crimea. Those areas are outside of our sphere of influence and are of no strategic interest to the U.S. It is in our interest, however, to get along with Russia. This is not a fight worth having, so why are we pushing it so hard?
9
Because if we do nothing about the Ukraine, what happens when Putin then rolls into NATO countries who we are sworn to protect?
5
There are hundreds of nations leaving Russia alone to capture Ukrainian territory. It neither improves nor worsens their relationship. If we leave Russia alone, we gain just as much of an alliance with Russia as Uganda does.
Meanwhile, if we sanction powerful Russians (who really seem to be in love with assets on US soil. Why do they trust American assets over Russian assets I wonder?), then we look good on the international stage, and we look good to the people of Ukraine.
Meanwhile, if we sanction powerful Russians (who really seem to be in love with assets on US soil. Why do they trust American assets over Russian assets I wonder?), then we look good on the international stage, and we look good to the people of Ukraine.
3
The German Rhineland and Austria were both beyond our sphere of influence, but when Hitler annexed them it led to a little thing now known as World Warr II.
People who apologize for Putin and Co. seem to be saying that the world would be a much better place if the only everyone would stop picking on the Russians and let them recreate the Soviet Union, regardless of what the people in the affected regions might think.
People who apologize for Putin and Co. seem to be saying that the world would be a much better place if the only everyone would stop picking on the Russians and let them recreate the Soviet Union, regardless of what the people in the affected regions might think.
3
The key to all this is Trump's personal and family finances. One of his sons famously said that the Russians had lots of money in Trump's businesses. Paul Manifort owed $17 million to the Russians.
Trump has probably been laundering money for Putin and his friends for some time now, legitimizing stolen money in various real estate deals back and forth, with a pretty fee going to the Trumps.
This is why he wants to pardon everybody. Why make a statement that you can pardon everybody including yourself, if there is no crime to pardon? Trump thinks he has it all worked out. He will call it a witch hunt, then just sign his crazy signature on a piece of paper pardoning everybody.
At some point within a year, Congress is going to tell Trump, "you're fired".
Trump has probably been laundering money for Putin and his friends for some time now, legitimizing stolen money in various real estate deals back and forth, with a pretty fee going to the Trumps.
This is why he wants to pardon everybody. Why make a statement that you can pardon everybody including yourself, if there is no crime to pardon? Trump thinks he has it all worked out. He will call it a witch hunt, then just sign his crazy signature on a piece of paper pardoning everybody.
At some point within a year, Congress is going to tell Trump, "you're fired".
318
I hope you are right!
1
Then we will be stuck with Pence and the suffering will really begin.
"At some point within a year, Congress is going to tell Trump, "you're fired."
From your mouth to the Republicans' see-no-evil, speak-no-evil, hear-no-evil ears.
From your mouth to the Republicans' see-no-evil, speak-no-evil, hear-no-evil ears.
2
While there can be no doubt Putin is disappointed by Trump's impotence at removing USA sanctions, there must be absolutely no doubt that Putin is overjoyed at the Russian success in undermining confidence in the USA's systems of government. 'Fake news' , 'so-called judges' , threats to congress-persons by the POTUS, calls by POTUS to beat protesters and for police to 'not be so nice' to suspects.
USA should focus on these effects of Putin as the primary issue.
USA should focus on these effects of Putin as the primary issue.
137
USA sanctions, USA's systems of government, USA should -- all common tics of Russians keyboarding from St. Petersburg. This is thoroughly nonstandard usage in American English, as are your single quotation marks and other curiosities. Russian posters should learn to be more effective fake Americans from California.
3
You know, I was talking to some Russians in DC on business at the check out line in a store a few months ago. Their baskets were full of wine and snacks. They weren't annoyed by the wait the way most of the Americans were. And they were simply stunned by our compete assurance that in 4 years (or maybe 8 or possibly less depending on how the investigation goes) this particular president will be gone. Every American they had met had this same confidence. Electing one terrible president and then having him leave after a set amount of time, will demonstrate the superiority of our system of government to the Russian people better than anything else we could ever do.
4
Mr. Putin does not have to contend with "checks and balances" that are in the US system. The president, any president, is not all powerful.
Mr. Putin misjudged Mr. Trumps power; I think he also might have misjudged Mr. Trump's governance and governing skills. He would not be the only one.
Mr. Putin misjudged Mr. Trumps power; I think he also might have misjudged Mr. Trump's governance and governing skills. He would not be the only one.
24
It's often sad when infatuation fades and reality shines through.
6
I beg to differ.
Putin's efforts has been focused on disrupting our political process, and sowing doubts in the our ability to maintain democratic stability by showcasing how corrupt, weak, and chaotic our leader is.
Putin has all but demonstrated to the world that Trump admires Putin, that Trump is somehow inspired by Russia, and that our country is striving to be like Russia.
I think Putin has succeeded beyond his wildest expectations.
Putin's efforts has been focused on disrupting our political process, and sowing doubts in the our ability to maintain democratic stability by showcasing how corrupt, weak, and chaotic our leader is.
Putin has all but demonstrated to the world that Trump admires Putin, that Trump is somehow inspired by Russia, and that our country is striving to be like Russia.
I think Putin has succeeded beyond his wildest expectations.
80
Wolfegang you underestimate the resiliency of the American system of democracy. We held elections during one of the bloodiest and most divisive conflicts in our history. In the aftermath of the War between the States, all of our institutions emerged battered and bruised but still intact. I doubt that little Putin's behaviors will have a noticeable effect upon us.
2
The real risk with Russia isn't head-to-head military confrontation, it's war in cyberspace. Other than the nuclear threat, the U.S. hasn't felt threatened by Russia militarily. Europe has, hence NATO. But the U.S. has enjoyed physical isolation.
But in cyberspace, there is no isolation. Russia has more than enough computer scientists to create and deploy sophisticated cyber weapons, attacking our infrastructure, communications, and elections. And Russia is very fond of disguising their actions (see: Russian troops in Crimea wearing "non-Russian" uniforms.) In cyberspace, everything can be disguised. Cyberspace will be the next battleground with Russia.
But in cyberspace, there is no isolation. Russia has more than enough computer scientists to create and deploy sophisticated cyber weapons, attacking our infrastructure, communications, and elections. And Russia is very fond of disguising their actions (see: Russian troops in Crimea wearing "non-Russian" uniforms.) In cyberspace, everything can be disguised. Cyberspace will be the next battleground with Russia.
32
As Ken L points out, Europe (NATO) is well aware of the cyber threat from Russia, and they aren't sitting on their hands. http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_78170.htm
But I would suggest that just because we don't hear much about U.S. efforts in this regard, don't think for a minute that we are lagging behind. We've already seen how capable the NSA and U.S. other intelligence agencies are at winnowing out seemingly impossible-to-see/hear communications, and it's my belief that if we wanted to shut down Moscow's electric grid tonight we could do so. That means. of course, that they would try to shut down our systems too, and I'm not sure we could completely prevent that -- yet.
But I would suggest that just because we don't hear much about U.S. efforts in this regard, don't think for a minute that we are lagging behind. We've already seen how capable the NSA and U.S. other intelligence agencies are at winnowing out seemingly impossible-to-see/hear communications, and it's my belief that if we wanted to shut down Moscow's electric grid tonight we could do so. That means. of course, that they would try to shut down our systems too, and I'm not sure we could completely prevent that -- yet.
1
This is an excellently written and crafted analysis piece. These types of insights are precisely the reason we should value veteran journalists. If only we could expect the same from our politicians...
56
A house built on sand to be exact.
After Putin gives up on Trump we might learn the details of Trump's finances.
32
That won't be until trump is no longer president and even then he probably won't. It will just provide definitive evidence that trump is a Putin minion.
Yes, we will know that Putin has really given up on Trump when the Russians start leaking some of the many interesting things that they know about Trump.
2
The more history I study, the more it seems to me that even the shrewdest and most Machiavellian leaders -- folks like Putin -- can't control contingent events, unintended consequences, and enormously complex global systems.
History also teaches me that profoundly stupid and arrogant leaders who don't care how others see the world and their interests do even worse. Especially when they glory in creating chaos, and see the destruction of global systems as an end in itself.
History also teaches me that profoundly stupid and arrogant leaders who don't care how others see the world and their interests do even worse. Especially when they glory in creating chaos, and see the destruction of global systems as an end in itself.
25
So, now Putin has thrown down, kicked out half our embassy. And how will the Twit-in -chief respond? Ball is in his court. He can be a man or a mouse. I'm betting on mouse, and he can hire all the extras from Goodfellas he wants to spin it. Won't change a thing.
13
Putin is a little bit naive. America doesn't really need friends, it needs vassals. And since Russia will never bow, US will continue hitting the bear with a stick. Russophobia is so deeply seeded in the American government that there is no any chance to make a rational dialogue with them. Russia should forget about any illusions about friendship, and it must start taking this bulling very seriously. Its the point of time for the Russian government to take on drastic measures to protect its economy and interests.
1
It is often the case that bad actors accuse their targets of the behavior that they are using. What a perfect of description of Russia's actions.
6
Russophobia?
No, we Americans see Russia mistreating its own people and attempting to spread it's dictatorship to other countries.
No, we Americans see Russia mistreating its own people and attempting to spread it's dictatorship to other countries.
6
It's not Russophobia, it's gangsterphobia. Russia is a great nation with a sublime culture. It is being robbed and oppressed by its current "government".
6
As Putin continues to seep into our every day lives, I'm reminded of the ol' Bullwinkle cartoons with Natasha and Boris.
It's bad enough that Americans fell for Trump's sloppy nonsense, but now the egotistical leader of Russia has to confront the fact that he did not see the Trump Cavalcade of Clowns coming either. This is going to get so much sadder and harsher before the dust clears, but somehow I believe we will be better for having been forced to confront the absurd presidency of Donald Trump--it's right out of a cartoon, and it's only really getting started!
It's bad enough that Americans fell for Trump's sloppy nonsense, but now the egotistical leader of Russia has to confront the fact that he did not see the Trump Cavalcade of Clowns coming either. This is going to get so much sadder and harsher before the dust clears, but somehow I believe we will be better for having been forced to confront the absurd presidency of Donald Trump--it's right out of a cartoon, and it's only really getting started!
18
Maybe, just maybe if Russia stops thinking that it can have it's way in the USA by meddling in elections so that their Russian Agent wins, and that we are too stupid to not figure it out, then maybe we can have a real relationship. Russia rolled the dice and got their wish, but it will cost them big time and they will that it wasn't really worth the pain now.
7
It's good to see that Putin and Trump's nefarious plans are not going the way they hoped. Perhaps Putin will soon drop some dirt on Trump?
22
I doubt he will until Trump is no longer president. He can still use Trump.
1
By "improve relations" Trump means repeal or modification of the Magnitsky Act, the sanctions of which is hampering Putin and his crony kleptocrats from using their sequestered billions in the West. Repealing this act would in effect allow Russia to go ahead with its illegal actions in Ukraine and the Crimea (as well as Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania--now on the horizon) without repercussions.
Putin seems to have believed that Trump could control Congress, but his terrible behavior vis-a-vis Congress members has made it unlikely that he would get any but grudging cooperation from them.
Bad call, Vladimir! Trump is a lot weaker than you are,
Anything else, like the weakening of NATO would have been frosting on the cake.
Russia is a tinpot nation with an economy less than that of Texas. Putin has been leading Trump around by the nose like an ill-trained pig. But he does seemingly have the capacity for payback--Wikileaks. I fervently hope that all of Trump's financial dealings will now come pouring out, and that this will bring their house of ill-repute (and that of the Kushners) crashing to the ground.
Maybe Putin will have better luck with Pence.
Putin seems to have believed that Trump could control Congress, but his terrible behavior vis-a-vis Congress members has made it unlikely that he would get any but grudging cooperation from them.
Bad call, Vladimir! Trump is a lot weaker than you are,
Anything else, like the weakening of NATO would have been frosting on the cake.
Russia is a tinpot nation with an economy less than that of Texas. Putin has been leading Trump around by the nose like an ill-trained pig. But he does seemingly have the capacity for payback--Wikileaks. I fervently hope that all of Trump's financial dealings will now come pouring out, and that this will bring their house of ill-repute (and that of the Kushners) crashing to the ground.
Maybe Putin will have better luck with Pence.
24
I'm glad it backfired, the last thing I want is to get along with Russia. I grew up taking cover under my school desk during air raid drills and I want to keep living like that. It makes me feel young again. I hope the Democrats keep shoving so hard on this Russian thing that it backfires too.
5
Trump is not winning and that is bad for Putin. Right now Tantrum Donald is in the naughty corner throwing spats that are helping no one. Will Tantrum Donald start winning on his own merit? Doubtful because this job is over his head. Right now he is riding on high economic Obamawave that is already messing up.
7
Like thousands of Trump University students, Putin is an unhappy Trump customer.
39
One has to wonder what was said betwixt the Russian dictator and his eager but unripe American understudy at the G-20 summit. That secret, unreported (until much later) conversation probably had nothing at all to do with literary comparisons between War And Peace and, ah, Innocents Abroad.
It says here that Donald's BFF told him, much like Michael Corleone told Moe Greene: "I leave tomorrow. Think about a price."
It says here that Donald's BFF told him, much like Michael Corleone told Moe Greene: "I leave tomorrow. Think about a price."
144
Unless the goal was to undermine US credibility and show the world that the US government is a quagmire, in which case it worked spectacularly. Pro-Russian media can now credibly point to the US and say 'look, it's even worse over there' and maintain their political status-quo.
155
Rather than join Russia and N Korea in modernizing our nuclear weapons, we need to spend the money on effective ABM (Anti-ballistic missile) defense capability. The best solution to N Korea is to start shooting down their test missiles.
23
Good to know the Congress is running the United States....right into the ground.
27
The more interesting and ignored Russian interference was Putin's exploitation of the Republican Party, first in working to elect Bush, "friending him" and defeating Gore and Kerry who were far greater threats to his plans to restore the Russian Empire. Clinton /Gore had exploited Yeltsin and Kerry was set to finish the job of defanging Russia. Bush was just a kid who's dad was connected.
Obama's election and his actions to restore the economy of the world elevated America's stature above what it had been after WWII. Obama considered Putin a vicious evil dictator and provoked a number of tantrums from Putin that made his agenda transparent. Putin looked to Obama's vulnerabilities and found only race. But, here were the Republicans groveling in the dust. The Russian propaganda machine exploited every venue, radio, talking heads, tv and print to undermine Obama and had the full support of Republicans. Articles in the NY POST, National Enquirer, and in Obama's second term, the WSJ repeated the racist, anti Muslim stories in the Russian media, often literally. FOX, And Republican propagandists like Drudge, Limbaugh, and jones spun every bit of Russian psyops they were fed. How successful were they? They turned the beneficiaries of the ACA against the Black, Muslim, Socialist calling it Obamacare. Propaganda works when it uses prejudices that already exist, when it evokes fear, hatred, confusion. Republicans have unwittingly become colluders with Putin to defeat American ideals.
Obama's election and his actions to restore the economy of the world elevated America's stature above what it had been after WWII. Obama considered Putin a vicious evil dictator and provoked a number of tantrums from Putin that made his agenda transparent. Putin looked to Obama's vulnerabilities and found only race. But, here were the Republicans groveling in the dust. The Russian propaganda machine exploited every venue, radio, talking heads, tv and print to undermine Obama and had the full support of Republicans. Articles in the NY POST, National Enquirer, and in Obama's second term, the WSJ repeated the racist, anti Muslim stories in the Russian media, often literally. FOX, And Republican propagandists like Drudge, Limbaugh, and jones spun every bit of Russian psyops they were fed. How successful were they? They turned the beneficiaries of the ACA against the Black, Muslim, Socialist calling it Obamacare. Propaganda works when it uses prejudices that already exist, when it evokes fear, hatred, confusion. Republicans have unwittingly become colluders with Putin to defeat American ideals.
14
Stunning that rock-ribbed Republicans from solid conservative states like Kentucky are actually brainwashed enough to believe Trump-Russia is a great thing for this country.
18
You are so right. Racial hatred of Obama is something Putin and Trump share.
And it looks like you are correct about the GOP scooping up all the anti-Obama
propaganda. Maybe Putin latched onto Trump because of his Birther nonsense and knew a fellow traveller. Or because Trump was laundering his money.
And it looks like you are correct about the GOP scooping up all the anti-Obama
propaganda. Maybe Putin latched onto Trump because of his Birther nonsense and knew a fellow traveller. Or because Trump was laundering his money.
1
Russia helped trump win the election, perhaps with trump's knowledge and collusion. Because trump is such a putz and cannot keep his mouth shut, the Congress is going around him to keep and increase sanctions on Russia. In other words, trump cannot do the one thing Russia hired him for, i.e., ease sanctions and make it easier for Russia to do business with the United States.
All of which begs the question...will Russia retaliate back against trump with damaging, leaked information because trump failed and is worthless to them? Place your bets, place your bets...
All of which begs the question...will Russia retaliate back against trump with damaging, leaked information because trump failed and is worthless to them? Place your bets, place your bets...
441
Despite considerable evidence, I am not yet prepared to accept that this administration betrayed our country in the pursuit of power. However, if this is fact the case, I doubt that Russia would release damaging information about Mr. Trump because that would undermine their long term strategy of installing favorable candidates in Western governments. Russians are chess players and know how to bide their time.
2
Trump cheated russians as he usually does with his investors, nothing new here. But the dirt on Trump released by Russians will damadge them more then Trump and will just confirm the evil nature oftheir system and call for more sanctions. They have been caught in their own game, fun to watch tough.
1
One can only hope. All the dots are connecting. The facade of a Trump empire propped up with Russian Oligarch money explains a lot.
Evidence:
1) Refusal to release taxes
2) Secret meeting between Trump and his minions with Russians
3) Trumps bizarre bromance with Putin
Evidence:
1) Refusal to release taxes
2) Secret meeting between Trump and his minions with Russians
3) Trumps bizarre bromance with Putin
10
Elections have consequences. We are now in for four years of 2nd guessing the commander in chief. We are in uncharted waters, rule by seeing what the president wants and doing the opposite.
56
That's why the move to impeach the regime can't come soon enough. That's why the largest marches against this regime can't come soon enough. Trump is no president. He is a precedence.
10
Don't be too sure about this "Backfire." We do not yet understand what the deal was. An apparent conflict may be but cosmetic and only skin deep.
259
Could very well be the case, Trump let them off the hook in one money laundering case, maybe more have been stoppedat much earlier stages or maybe some other win-win schemes are delivering in obscurity....
4
Yes, Mr. Wofford. Rachel Maddow (MSNBC 9 pm ET weeknights) warned viewers about this fake news misinformation campaign on her show Thursday night. The International Mafia Top1% Global Financial Elite Robber Baron/Radical religion Good OId Boys Cabal is feeling the heat around the world so they're trying to sell us this bill of goods.
Do not be fooled - again.
Do not be fooled - again.
5
@Adams Wofford
I agree. I believe this to be political 'kabuki theater'.....we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg.
Putin is a chess player; Trump hasn't mastered tic-tac-toe.
NOT my president
I agree. I believe this to be political 'kabuki theater'.....we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg.
Putin is a chess player; Trump hasn't mastered tic-tac-toe.
NOT my president
5