Words hurt?
As a millennial raised by a baby boomer- I found this a really nicely intergenerational puzzle- all the way from Hepburn to the solo careers of One Direction. Often I must rely on my older knowledge base for crosswords, and it's fun to mix it up. Only trip-ups for me was NOTORIOUSBIG before his other alias BIGGIESMALLS and I had no idea FANDUEL existed before this. (For those who dislike rap references as too current, I would note that all of Biggie's music is now at least 20 years old.) Great puzzle Paolo!
To whoever it was who said I must not like Jeopardy, my answer would be: If the categories were only things like Famous Rock Groups and '80s TV Shows and Number 1 Song Hits, I'd never watch the damn thing. I even snooze through Business and Industry, since I mute all commercials and mostly don't know one company or product from another. Fortunately, there's also Poetry and Word Origins and Psychology and Potent Potables and Scientists and Famous Quotes. So there's plenty there that I do like, and that keeps me watching. But none of that has much to do with crossword puzzles -- at least not for me. I go to Jeopardy precisely to see how much trivia I know and I tackle crosswords to "puzzle" things out, not to fill in random names and products that I either know or don't.
Nor is it a generational thing. Load up your puzzle with utterly forgettable songs and TV stars and products from the 1950s & 60s, and I'll howl just as loudly. I don't want a trivia-fest from any era, even my own.
I've read the arguments that you need these pop culture references to attract a younger puzzle-solving audience. I think that's an insult to younger people. We older solvers take pride in our knowledge of Plato and Shakespeare, of Copernicus and Einstein, of Cezanne and Picasso. And yet we expect younger people to find a puzzle "staid" or "dated" or boring if it's not about rappers and TV stars and Internet slang? Isn't that a bit...condescending?
Nor is it a generational thing. Load up your puzzle with utterly forgettable songs and TV stars and products from the 1950s & 60s, and I'll howl just as loudly. I don't want a trivia-fest from any era, even my own.
I've read the arguments that you need these pop culture references to attract a younger puzzle-solving audience. I think that's an insult to younger people. We older solvers take pride in our knowledge of Plato and Shakespeare, of Copernicus and Einstein, of Cezanne and Picasso. And yet we expect younger people to find a puzzle "staid" or "dated" or boring if it's not about rappers and TV stars and Internet slang? Isn't that a bit...condescending?
As Deb and other have said many times, our wheelhouses can be vastly different. Yesterday's was a toughie for me and there were lots of comments on it being breezy for a Thursday. Now today I solved this one in a quarter of the time of a typical Friday. Since we're doing the age thing - I'm 38. Today's was just right up my alley.
2
I finished the puzzle, and I'm 72. Must admit I got a lot of it from the cross fill. But I learned about Biggie Smalls!
5
Elaine's response to the controversy is, "I knew all those artists and I'm 73 years old."
My bae is so gucci.
My bae is so gucci.
6
I'm interested in all the people here who think you need scads and scads of pop culture references -- rappers and TV show characters and current textspeak, and the like -- to attract the younger audience needed to keep the crossword tradition alive. And yet, we older solvers take pride in our knowledge of Shakespeare and Plato, of Cezanne and Picasso, of Copernicus and Pavlov, of Spanish and French if we know it. Why do we assume that younger solvers by definition are so shallow? So badly educated? That they would regard a puzzle lacking references to the latest #1 hit or the hottest reality TV star to be "staid" or "dated"? I find such assumptions condescending. I'd like to believe that there are plenty of young people with a wide breadth of knowledge and an interest in subjects that go well beyond pop culture.
4
Hi Nancy,
Perhaps I was a little harsh in my response to your post earlier, especially with respect to use of terms like "staid" (or should that be "stain"?). Maybe a different perspective.
Shakespeare was pop culture in his days. If crosswords were around then, we may have similar complaints about his works, preferring more learned knowledge back in those days, of say, the Greek philosophers such as Socrates and Plato.
Older people accumulate knowledge through time. Younger people have had less time. It doesn't mean a 7-year old couldn't know about Socrates or Copernicus. It simply means that they have had plenty to learn what with the adding and subtracting and a burgeoning vocabulary to maintain. It is knowledge they don't yet need (or perhaps ever need). They see stuff on TV, stuff that's easy to absorb because it's what their friends talk about. We haven't gotten around to teaching them all about the long-dead people yet. Young people are shallow simply because of their age.
By the same token, because our time and memory is somewhat limited, we don't know all of the significant people and events (and quite frankly, by whose opinion and measure are they significant?). Some information and knowledge fall by the way side because there isn't current interest to keep it up.
I don't see why pop culture shouldn't be in the puzzles simply because some regard them as shallow, and that ancient philosophers shouldn't be because some consider them staid.
Perhaps I was a little harsh in my response to your post earlier, especially with respect to use of terms like "staid" (or should that be "stain"?). Maybe a different perspective.
Shakespeare was pop culture in his days. If crosswords were around then, we may have similar complaints about his works, preferring more learned knowledge back in those days, of say, the Greek philosophers such as Socrates and Plato.
Older people accumulate knowledge through time. Younger people have had less time. It doesn't mean a 7-year old couldn't know about Socrates or Copernicus. It simply means that they have had plenty to learn what with the adding and subtracting and a burgeoning vocabulary to maintain. It is knowledge they don't yet need (or perhaps ever need). They see stuff on TV, stuff that's easy to absorb because it's what their friends talk about. We haven't gotten around to teaching them all about the long-dead people yet. Young people are shallow simply because of their age.
By the same token, because our time and memory is somewhat limited, we don't know all of the significant people and events (and quite frankly, by whose opinion and measure are they significant?). Some information and knowledge fall by the way side because there isn't current interest to keep it up.
I don't see why pop culture shouldn't be in the puzzles simply because some regard them as shallow, and that ancient philosophers shouldn't be because some consider them staid.
2
Is anyone really saying that? I think the point is that having *some* current pop culture references--in addition to all the older pop culture references--is a good idea. I highly doubt anyone here is actually recommending a truly dumbed-down approach.
5
"Shakespeare was pop culture in his days."
True, but now he is pop culture that has withstood over four centuries of time — there's a difference.
True, but now he is pop culture that has withstood over four centuries of time — there's a difference.
OT: Mark your calendars!
Tomorrow is Mai Xiang's 19th birthday.
Also, the pandas have had a good summer, and soon it will be time to start monitoring Mai Xiang's hormone levels and watching for a possible pregnancy.
http://tinyurl.com/ycx4537w
Tomorrow is Mai Xiang's 19th birthday.
Also, the pandas have had a good summer, and soon it will be time to start monitoring Mai Xiang's hormone levels and watching for a possible pregnancy.
http://tinyurl.com/ycx4537w
1
Congratulations to Paolo on a fine, fine puzzle. It is wonderful to have new, recent words and phrases included to keep us on our toes.
4
Enjoyed the solve. Good puzzle. TISSUE before MINUTE before MOMENT. Liked seeing MALE GAZE, a termI hadn't heard that was hard to guess, which made CANAPE begin life as CANOLI (sp!) and BIP as BIL (twin antics, anyone?). Nice to see I NEED A MOMENT, NO MEANS NO, the GALOP, and ENSEAL, the too-often overlooked past participle LAIN. Probably more popular culture than I'd choose, and I'm not that into meta clues like 32 across or 12 down.
Also, a genuine question: Why does the 29 across clue "Sorry to say ..." — which includes the quotes — (SADLY) need to put the phrase "Sorry to say" in context — rather than just being "Sorry to say" (without quotes)?
Also, a genuine question: Why does the 29 across clue "Sorry to say ..." — which includes the quotes — (SADLY) need to put the phrase "Sorry to say" in context — rather than just being "Sorry to say" (without quotes)?
Because the clue is telling you that the answer is a phrase you could say instead of, "Sorry to say."
Kristin — Sure, but isn't that also true of any clue that's just a definition?
It's not just a definition here; it has to be in relation to a bit of speech. Without the quotes, the answer could simply be SAD.
Wow, that was work! I am many decades past being a TEEN (and I'm very glad of that), so a lot of this was out of my wheelhouse. In fact, Paolo's list of favorites in his Notes pretty much coincides with my list of difficulties.
I've heard of BIGGIE SMALLS, but the clue was no help and I needed several letters to see the pattern. I did (somehow) know METALHEAD.
[DraftKings] and FANDUEL have been in the news recently (I forget why), and I recognized the former in the clue as having something to do with fantasy sports (which I'll never understand), but I needed everthing except the F and the L to dredge up FANDUEL.
Wanted I NEED A TISSUE, then debated MINUTE and MOMENT until "ADAM'S RIB" gave me the second M. I thought there was an old dance called the gavotte and wondered about an alternate spelling. Certainly didn't know GARTH, or anything else about "Wayne's World."
"LES MIZ" was a gimme, but 16A flummoxed me, and I'm pretty good at show tunes. A post-solve Google offered only some song I've never heard of in a clip that looked like a computer game. What show are we talking about?
Know IDRIS ELBA only from XWPs, but I think I've heard of "JANE the Virgin." Knew JONZE by name, but not by clue.
ZAYN and NAENAE were complete mysteries and needed all the crosses and contributed to my finishing with an error: I had DING instead of DANG. (Note that I got D'BACK! Eventually.)
Didn't fall in the ERIE CANAL, but loved the clue.
Thanks to all. Stay cool!
I've heard of BIGGIE SMALLS, but the clue was no help and I needed several letters to see the pattern. I did (somehow) know METALHEAD.
[DraftKings] and FANDUEL have been in the news recently (I forget why), and I recognized the former in the clue as having something to do with fantasy sports (which I'll never understand), but I needed everthing except the F and the L to dredge up FANDUEL.
Wanted I NEED A TISSUE, then debated MINUTE and MOMENT until "ADAM'S RIB" gave me the second M. I thought there was an old dance called the gavotte and wondered about an alternate spelling. Certainly didn't know GARTH, or anything else about "Wayne's World."
"LES MIZ" was a gimme, but 16A flummoxed me, and I'm pretty good at show tunes. A post-solve Google offered only some song I've never heard of in a clip that looked like a computer game. What show are we talking about?
Know IDRIS ELBA only from XWPs, but I think I've heard of "JANE the Virgin." Knew JONZE by name, but not by clue.
ZAYN and NAENAE were complete mysteries and needed all the crosses and contributed to my finishing with an error: I had DING instead of DANG. (Note that I got D'BACK! Eventually.)
Didn't fall in the ERIE CANAL, but loved the clue.
Thanks to all. Stay cool!
3
Deady, that is from sound of music. Good night, farewell, etc. One of the kids sings adieu to you and you and you. Trust me. Daughter's first show. Age 8. Gretl. "The sun has gone to bed and so must I. So long ...
"Sound of Music" Final scene as they escape from the theatre.
I know DL well enough to know that that explains it.
Sound of Music is not a favorite of hers.
Sound of Music is not a favorite of hers.
After my comment yesterday on spelled-out letters, I feel like 46D was trolling me. (And for those keeping score regarding this polarizing puzzle: I enjoyed it a lot and found it easy for a Friday, and I'm a GenXer.)
2
Here's an idea: if you can't construct a difficult crossword without resorting to proper nouns and trivia, find something else to do.
1
Deb, don't fret--you too may someday learn to teleport!
2
I can only hope, cmpltnst.
1
I don't think it is any coincidence that this was my first Friday solve, as I am a relatively new to solving and - from what I gather - much younger than most solvers (born early 1990s).
This was an incredibly fun and cleaver puzzle, and I'm excited when I'm able to put my personal experiences as a young person to use in the NYT puzzles. As Paolo alluded to in his notes, I'm at an enormous disadvantage for having missed out on 40+ years of personal experience that other solvers have. More often than not I will resort to Google and use it as a learning opportunity for my general knowledge base as well as for future (or retroactive) solving.
Generally I think it will be advantageous for puzzles to continue to be progressive and inclusive by engaging younger solvers in references from their own cultural circles and experiences. I've noticed these puzzles ask solvers to stretch their comfort level and delve in to topics that may normally be unfamiliar. As a curious person I value these challenges and think they enhance the solving experience.
This was an incredibly fun and cleaver puzzle, and I'm excited when I'm able to put my personal experiences as a young person to use in the NYT puzzles. As Paolo alluded to in his notes, I'm at an enormous disadvantage for having missed out on 40+ years of personal experience that other solvers have. More often than not I will resort to Google and use it as a learning opportunity for my general knowledge base as well as for future (or retroactive) solving.
Generally I think it will be advantageous for puzzles to continue to be progressive and inclusive by engaging younger solvers in references from their own cultural circles and experiences. I've noticed these puzzles ask solvers to stretch their comfort level and delve in to topics that may normally be unfamiliar. As a curious person I value these challenges and think they enhance the solving experience.
19
Well said, Zach. Welcome to Wordplay!
1
What Deb said.
And ... I don't think we know the age group(s) for "most solvers." The commenters on Wordplay represent only a small portion of the people who do the puzzle every day.
And ... I don't think we know the age group(s) for "most solvers." The commenters on Wordplay represent only a small portion of the people who do the puzzle every day.
3
I knew galop was an old dance, and what it called to my mind was a little song we learned in school about old dances. Galop isn't one of them, but here:
There are dances grave and stately
Minuet and Saraband
And we dance them most sedately
Pointed toe and uplifted hand.
And the Polonaise
We may justly praise
Habanera, bolero, mazurka gay
But for us the best
Over all the rest
Is the dance that they call the Borré
I couldn't find the melody on line - I can sing it but can't convey it here. Maybe somebody else can?
5
VIv — there was definitely a dance called the "bourrée, often the name of a piece of music as well with presumably the same beat." But I'll leave it to David C. to say more.
1
Thank goodness for Google is all I can say. And thanks to Rick and Paul for two horribly delightful puns.
3
So, like the grid says, TRIVIA, which don't bother me none, especially the pop music kind. But there is a lot of it, although it's spread over several decades. Didn't finish in a JIFF, but about average for a Friday. I did especially like the ERIECANAL clue.
I go to the movies a lot. Is there a website that issues MALEGAZE trigger warnings? I know there's one for shaky-cam direction. I don't check that one either.
This selection seems appropriate today: German rock group Fury in the Slaughterhouse broke through in 1993 with "Every Generation Got Its Own DISEASE." It's older than our constructor, but seems like just yesterday to me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qnz1RhXhbE
I go to the movies a lot. Is there a website that issues MALEGAZE trigger warnings? I know there's one for shaky-cam direction. I don't check that one either.
This selection seems appropriate today: German rock group Fury in the Slaughterhouse broke through in 1993 with "Every Generation Got Its Own DISEASE." It's older than our constructor, but seems like just yesterday to me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qnz1RhXhbE
2
I haven't been to a movie in a movie house for years, Jimbo, but I'm glad to hear there's a way to get a shaky-camera warning. Needed: warnings about overly loud sound, fast cuts, flashing lights ...
Never mind. I'll just stay home.
Never mind. I'll just stay home.
2
Deadline, that's for sure. I stopped going to theaters when the sound level got to be too much to bear. I guess the volume increase has to do with improvements in surround-sound, which should be a good thing, but for me it is migraine inducing. Ditto flashing lights. Shaky cam always looks too first-year-film-school to me, so it is simply annoying.
1
Hi, everyone. I made my unhappiness with this puzzle loud and clear over on the Rexblog, but now I've come here because I suspect that this is the blog that Will S. visits regularly. Will, there's not much point in taking Paolo to task: He's a TEEN and he may not know any better. He may think that the shallow, ephemeral pop culture TRIVIA jammed cheek-to-jowl into this puzzle is the simply the most fascinating, the most important, the most earth-shattering info that anyone could possibly know or learn. But you know better. Isn't there enough dumbing down in American culture today? Evidently, there's an incredible percentage of young people who can't even identify the century in which the Civil War took place, but they can name every rapper, every peculiarly-named band, every TV actor and series and character, every Internet abbreviation and acronym. Should the NYT be encouraging this? Please give us back puzzles that are intellectually worthy of the venerable newspaper in which they appear. Thank you.
4
And you kids get off of my lawn!
18
Nancy, I have to say I mostly disagree with the sentiment you are expressing here. One person's dumbing down is another person's horizon broadening. Catering only to established culture and history while not giving ephemeral (potentially) popular culture trivia a chance to reach a general broad audience and see the light of day...well, it makes the puzzle staid and uninteresting. More importantly, it may keep the younger generations of solvers away. By interleaving both old established knowledge with popular culture, Will is keeping it fresh and interesting while educating the young about old stuff.
I like the NY Times puzzle because I often learn things, both old/staid/established/classic and new/fresh/obscure, etc. I'm not a classical music/literature/opera aficionado, but when puzzles including those elements show up, I learn something and I move on.
Just like language and the dictionary, the language and culture is constantly evolving. For instance, Homer Simpson's favorite utterance, DOH! is popular culture trivia, but has now been ingrained into the culture and has staying power. Will must constantly need to strive for a balance of those that may be too new/obscure that may not stick around with those things that are so old that most people wouldn't know what they are.
I do the puzzle and come here to the blog to learn and to have a good time and not take things too seriously. Intellectual worthiness may be overrated.
I like the NY Times puzzle because I often learn things, both old/staid/established/classic and new/fresh/obscure, etc. I'm not a classical music/literature/opera aficionado, but when puzzles including those elements show up, I learn something and I move on.
Just like language and the dictionary, the language and culture is constantly evolving. For instance, Homer Simpson's favorite utterance, DOH! is popular culture trivia, but has now been ingrained into the culture and has staying power. Will must constantly need to strive for a balance of those that may be too new/obscure that may not stick around with those things that are so old that most people wouldn't know what they are.
I do the puzzle and come here to the blog to learn and to have a good time and not take things too seriously. Intellectual worthiness may be overrated.
14
The other way of looking at it is - this kid debuted a bunch of crossword clues today! According to Deb,
BIGGIESMALLS
INEEDAMOMENT
NOMEANSNO
MALEGAZE
METALHEAD
all made their NYT debuts today. And I suspect FANDUEL did too, and NAENAE.
BIGGIESMALLS
INEEDAMOMENT
NOMEANSNO
MALEGAZE
METALHEAD
all made their NYT debuts today. And I suspect FANDUEL did too, and NAENAE.
5
I like the comment here which mentions BIGGIESMALLS as a popular shelter-pup name.
Our pup is named Finn McCool, who was a small Irish giant. He is also a small giant, the name suits him, as Biggie Smalls also would.
I knew who Biggie was because I used to teach High School, and the number 1 timewasting argument was "Biggie or Jay-Z?"
My one problem was the Natick at LAIN/LAID+ZAYN/ZAID. Until I looked at this blog I didn't even know I had it wrong: the paper version doesn't have the fanfare feature, although it is superior in every other way.
I'm 56, FWIW.
Our pup is named Finn McCool, who was a small Irish giant. He is also a small giant, the name suits him, as Biggie Smalls also would.
I knew who Biggie was because I used to teach High School, and the number 1 timewasting argument was "Biggie or Jay-Z?"
My one problem was the Natick at LAIN/LAID+ZAYN/ZAID. Until I looked at this blog I didn't even know I had it wrong: the paper version doesn't have the fanfare feature, although it is superior in every other way.
I'm 56, FWIW.
4
Laughing at"BIggie or Jay-Z?". Four decades ago it was "Paul or George?".
5
Well, I liked it. Had a very slow start but still ended up finishing below my average time.
I'm glad to see contemporary pop culture in the crossword. I may not know them (though even I have heard of Biggie Smalls), but I had never heard of lots of things before seeing them in the puzzles. As long as the "never heard of it" number remains small in each puzzle, it's a great way to be introduced to new things, especially when Deb and other commenters drop in links and other bits of trivia. I've learned a lot from many of you.
The key is to keep the clues balanced. My weakest area is sports, and its so frustrating to have a puzzle with half a dozen sports clues I can't even guess at. But a puzzle that has a few sports, along with pop culture old and new, history, geography, literature, arts, and wordplay gives me something I can both enjoy and learn from. Yay!
I'm glad to see contemporary pop culture in the crossword. I may not know them (though even I have heard of Biggie Smalls), but I had never heard of lots of things before seeing them in the puzzles. As long as the "never heard of it" number remains small in each puzzle, it's a great way to be introduced to new things, especially when Deb and other commenters drop in links and other bits of trivia. I've learned a lot from many of you.
The key is to keep the clues balanced. My weakest area is sports, and its so frustrating to have a puzzle with half a dozen sports clues I can't even guess at. But a puzzle that has a few sports, along with pop culture old and new, history, geography, literature, arts, and wordplay gives me something I can both enjoy and learn from. Yay!
10
I liked this precisely because of the currency of fill. I'm 68 and had no problem with anything. I'm not a constructor, but the rap world would seem to be ripe crossword pickings what with quirky spellings, punctuation, and onomatopoeiac shenanigans.
Though it was pretty quick for a Friday.
Though it was pretty quick for a Friday.
10
I'm a little older than you and did have problems with the pop culture, though I finished unassisted. I believe the ideal solver of this puzzle can see "Pillowtalk" in a clue and not think of Doris Day.
3
Not think of Doris Day?
Heck, I remember Doris Day before she was a virgin.
Heck, I remember Doris Day before she was a virgin.
I expected some grumbling on this one, but was not prepared for the generation gap that has opened in today's comments. I would like to be around in fifty years to see if the rap artists and such are appearing in puzzles with the same frequency that Hepburn-Tracey, Mozart, or Victor Hugo do now.
3
Or the Beatles!
I, too, am taken aback by the more vehement comments here. I didn't like seeing the fill BAE so much, several puzzles ago, because I thought it was too much of a slang word. But pop culture is a valid subject, and a current dance move (BAEBAE) a valid fill. Performers are always good subjects for a crossword. So what's the BEEF?
I, too, am taken aback by the more vehement comments here. I didn't like seeing the fill BAE so much, several puzzles ago, because I thought it was too much of a slang word. But pop culture is a valid subject, and a current dance move (BAEBAE) a valid fill. Performers are always good subjects for a crossword. So what's the BEEF?
1
Well, this was definitely not my fastest Friday. In fact I had to step away, read the morning paper and have a second cup of coffee before coming back to finish in the north west. I wanted consultants to be RETD and loved the mislead for ERIECANAL. As for unknowns like NAENAE and FANDUEL, they add to the challenge and I have no objection to their inclusion. Like others I had ALBA before BIEL and figured BIGGIESMALL through the crosses. Language evolves continuously and crossword puzzles need to do so as well in order to remain relevant.
4
My first thought at 12D was stolen by Deb, that is, thanks for rubbing it in Paolo! I will probably not say this as eloquently as others, but I (and I might speak for others) love to do the NYT crossword regardless of how many answers we are familiar with, in fact, the less I know (and more I learn) the better. The fun is sussing from things we do know, like word origins and prefixes and other languages and TRIVIA living in the cobwebs of my mind's attic. Not to mention the help we get from the surrounding fill. No complaints here about topics foreign to me.
I started with I NEED A 'tissue' before I switched to 'minute' before finally seeing ADAMS RIB and making use of the M.
Finally, Deb, apropos use of "verklempt" in a puzzle with a Mike Myers clue. My favorite MM character is Linda Richman who was famously verklempt on Coffee Talk. Now, please discuss this among yourselves.
I started with I NEED A 'tissue' before I switched to 'minute' before finally seeing ADAMS RIB and making use of the M.
Finally, Deb, apropos use of "verklempt" in a puzzle with a Mike Myers clue. My favorite MM character is Linda Richman who was famously verklempt on Coffee Talk. Now, please discuss this among yourselves.
8
Never could come up with the Natick-y crossing of Director Spike (Jones) and the MALE GA-E (gate? gage? gape?) so I just gave up. Then the iPad wouldn't connect with the internet/wireless network. Then I decided I didn't care what the criticism was or how Spike spells his @#$%^&*!! name. It's too darned hot, humid, and miserable to spend time on this. Just say NAE NAE.
Take care in these sweltering temps, folks. (Heat deaths, alas, are a real thing.)
Take care in these sweltering temps, folks. (Heat deaths, alas, are a real thing.)
3
And remember that the elderly are particularly susceptible to heat-related health problems, and death. So if you're elderly, take care. If you're not, check on your friends/relatives who are.
And don't forget your pets. Don't leave them outdoors in the heat, and be sure to give them plenty of water.
And don't forget your pets. Don't leave them outdoors in the heat, and be sure to give them plenty of water.
2
There was a lot to like about this puzzle, and a lot for this old geezer to dislike. On balance, I have to confess I enjoyed working on this one. Nice work, Paolo.
4
Although I didn't finish in a JIFF, I very much enjoyed this puzzle. It took me a minute to dredge up GARTH from my memory, and I had no idea I knew BIGGIESMALLS; Mo Money may result in Mo Problems, but no money certainly does not yield no problems.
2
After filling out all the squares this morning (remarkably, because when I began late last night, success on this puzzle seemed unlikely), I got the dreaded "not quite right" message. I NEED(ed) A MOMENT to figure out that where I had put in LAID for "reclined," I needed LAIN instead. Never having heatd of ZAYN before this, I was glad to see the "congratulations" message appear. Kudos to the TEEN puzzle-maker; this was a good challenge.
2
Me too, LAID. Also LES MIS, but that was silly. So finished with 2 errors, but after despairing that I wouldn't even fill it all in I was happy enough... As someone who recently became eligible for Medicare I do find myself grumbling about rappers and whatnot, but before Will took over I grumbled about Latin words and opera TRIVIA. It's much better now! If only I'd had the foresight to procreate, I might have a better handle on the pop culture of generations post-Baby Boom. Not to mention, somebody to be a burden to... LATER!
1
I've seen the LAIN/laid comment from several posters now, and I can't keep quiet any longer.
Grammatically, only LAIN works with the clue.
The common misuse of the terms always rattles my poor tired brain. http://www.writersdigest.com/online-editor/lay-vs-lie
Grammatically, only LAIN works with the clue.
The common misuse of the terms always rattles my poor tired brain. http://www.writersdigest.com/online-editor/lay-vs-lie
3
ARM before AIM, HANKIE and SECOND were needed before MOMENT. BON before BEL, but then liked the consecutive BEL BIEL.
How does a TEEN know about ADAMSRIB?
Is REMY getting to be a too frequent visitor?
How does a TEEN know about ADAMSRIB?
Is REMY getting to be a too frequent visitor?
Well here I sit, casting my MALE GAZE upon an IN A BIND Friday puzzler. I think I'm going to cry; I NEED A MOMEMT...There that's better, big boys don't cry. 10cc concurs on their signature ballad, "I'm Not In Love."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1o6f6sqU34
I was doing the dougie until one of the CUTUPS at the sock hop cut in and showed me the NAE NAE steps...What's a can a peas?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aP4hzWFeHbI
Hull before KEEL, arm/AIM and Zona/BAJA were some potholes I managed to skirt with strike overs. Today's epic fail usurped all the confidence I had built up from yesterday's solve. Throw in Wednesday's success and it adds up to 2 out of three; better than Don Mattingly, right?
Later And ADIEU,
Bru
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1o6f6sqU34
I was doing the dougie until one of the CUTUPS at the sock hop cut in and showed me the NAE NAE steps...What's a can a peas?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aP4hzWFeHbI
Hull before KEEL, arm/AIM and Zona/BAJA were some potholes I managed to skirt with strike overs. Today's epic fail usurped all the confidence I had built up from yesterday's solve. Throw in Wednesday's success and it adds up to 2 out of three; better than Don Mattingly, right?
Later And ADIEU,
Bru
4
Humblebrag alert! I am in my fifties and not a single entry was outside my knowledge base. Radio listening and websurfing (NYT site included) provides one with a remarkable database of dryer lint that sticks to the brain.
Actual brag alert! This was easy for a Friday; finished it in under 14 minutes, whereas I normally take around 25 on average.
Now, back to waiting for a puzzle with a King Crimson reference.
Actual brag alert! This was easy for a Friday; finished it in under 14 minutes, whereas I normally take around 25 on average.
Now, back to waiting for a puzzle with a King Crimson reference.
5
I can't say I disliked this puzzle, but I'm concerned by the effort to cram in too much post-millennial trivia in one puzzle. Here's the thing: There's such a thing as being "crossworthy." That means that a person, a phrase, a concept has to have caught on and gotten enough recognition and/or usage across most age groups to be well-known. In the case of singers, that might include a Sinatra, a Springsteen, a Beyonce, a Swift. They might all have different fan bases.
While Taylor Swift may have caught on with pre-teens at the beginning of this decade, and these then-tweens are still only in their late 20s, she has made a significant impact on popular music, and her name is "crossworthy" insomuch as her fans' parents and even grandparents have probably heard of her for one reason of another (one of which may be that they actually like her music, as is the case with this 61-year-old.) But ZAYN Malik can't make the same boast. He's a former member of a group from the same era with comparatively lesser appeal, and as a solo artist, he is quite unproven.
Because of its relative newness, the trivia of the youngest generation is less likely to have the "crossworthiness" of that of even the next-oldest generation. Will ZAYN be suitable for the anthology of puzzles that will be sold at Barnes & Noble in 20 years?
The same could be said for NAE NAE.
If you're 16, your mileage will almost definitely vary.
While Taylor Swift may have caught on with pre-teens at the beginning of this decade, and these then-tweens are still only in their late 20s, she has made a significant impact on popular music, and her name is "crossworthy" insomuch as her fans' parents and even grandparents have probably heard of her for one reason of another (one of which may be that they actually like her music, as is the case with this 61-year-old.) But ZAYN Malik can't make the same boast. He's a former member of a group from the same era with comparatively lesser appeal, and as a solo artist, he is quite unproven.
Because of its relative newness, the trivia of the youngest generation is less likely to have the "crossworthiness" of that of even the next-oldest generation. Will ZAYN be suitable for the anthology of puzzles that will be sold at Barnes & Noble in 20 years?
The same could be said for NAE NAE.
If you're 16, your mileage will almost definitely vary.
6
One Direction had four straight albums reach number one on the Billboard charts. They had the highest-earning concert tour of 2014 and by many estimates were among the highest earning celebrities that year. ZAYN Malik's departure from the group was pretty big news, and "Pillowtalk," the solo single referenced in this puzzle, is a #1 hit in its own right. I'm no One Direction superfan, but to say without any hesitation that they have "comparatively less appeal" than Taylor Swift is questionable at best.
A great thing about this puzzle is that the modern references Paolo makes are in fact likely to be crossworthy 20 years from now. Certainly more crossworthy than ILONA Massey, who appeared in Thursday's puzzle. The NAENAE had several years in the spotlight as a notable dance craze. IDRISELBA is one of the world's most marketable film stars. Spike JONZE has seen several of his movies earn Oscar nominations. Etc.
The way you feel right now as a 61-year-old is the way I feel many other days as a 26-year-old. Not knowing pop culture references sucks. Not knowing two of them that cross each other is even worse. But that doesn't mean those references don't belong in the puzzle. It just means you don't know them -- at least not yet.
A great thing about this puzzle is that the modern references Paolo makes are in fact likely to be crossworthy 20 years from now. Certainly more crossworthy than ILONA Massey, who appeared in Thursday's puzzle. The NAENAE had several years in the spotlight as a notable dance craze. IDRISELBA is one of the world's most marketable film stars. Spike JONZE has seen several of his movies earn Oscar nominations. Etc.
The way you feel right now as a 61-year-old is the way I feel many other days as a 26-year-old. Not knowing pop culture references sucks. Not knowing two of them that cross each other is even worse. But that doesn't mean those references don't belong in the puzzle. It just means you don't know them -- at least not yet.
13
Well stated, Sam. I agree with you.
1
TEEN was a really poor clue, as there's no way to know this without first reading Deb's spoiler-filled commentary, which I do religiously after my triumph or defeat. He or she could have been a POLE or a GEEK for all we could know.
My antipathy to rapper clues isn't just that I'm out of touch (though I am). It's that I find the rap culture of glorification of violence and denigration of women repellent. An art form in which the participants routinely murder each other isn't something I'm interested in.
Loved the ERIECANAL trick. Hated ELL, as I do all of its ilk. Fine with a feminist theme, even a hidden one, but I have a question for women: Does disdain for the MALEGAZE extend to male gays? Or perusal of one's inbox?
My antipathy to rapper clues isn't just that I'm out of touch (though I am). It's that I find the rap culture of glorification of violence and denigration of women repellent. An art form in which the participants routinely murder each other isn't something I'm interested in.
Loved the ERIECANAL trick. Hated ELL, as I do all of its ilk. Fine with a feminist theme, even a hidden one, but I have a question for women: Does disdain for the MALEGAZE extend to male gays? Or perusal of one's inbox?
2
As opposed to the denigration of women in rock music? And glorification of violence is James Bond movies? Pulp Fiction shows up in crosswords regularly. So does Idi Amin. If you think all rap is violent and misogynistic, you are woefully misinformed. If you think the rest of popular culture is not - really?
11
I thought this was surprisingly easybreezy for a Friday, and as Deb always reminds us, crossword solving is always dependent on how a particular puzzle intersects with the solver's wheelhouse. And there's this:
I've read comments here from people who objected to BIGGIESMALLS and NAENAE. Maybe I'm just cranky, but those things are as much a part of contemporary culture knowledge as Elvis and The Twist would have been to a previous generation. And for the record, I'm not a millennial, but on the old end of GenX.
I've read comments here from people who objected to BIGGIESMALLS and NAENAE. Maybe I'm just cranky, but those things are as much a part of contemporary culture knowledge as Elvis and The Twist would have been to a previous generation. And for the record, I'm not a millennial, but on the old end of GenX.
6
I would say that you're definitely not cranky. You're open-minded.
Here's the thing, for those who believe that they understand the audience for this crossword: While standards remain in effect (I know I'm going to eventually regret saying that), the audience for The New York Times Crossword is not and should not be a static thing. It's constantly changing, with younger people coming in all the time. And that's a wonderful thing IMO, because we need this pastime of ours to last after we're gone. It would be such a shame if it died a slow death because it was deemed irrelevant by those who come after us.
And as I said in the column, the vast majority of entries on any given day are readily accessible. If there are a few that you want to grumble about just because YOU didn't know them, that's fine by me. But at least acknowledge your own limitations, much the way your parents had to when you discovered something in pop culture that they deemed shocking or outside their wheelhouse. Because it's the exact same thing. Times change, but people don't.
Here's the thing, for those who believe that they understand the audience for this crossword: While standards remain in effect (I know I'm going to eventually regret saying that), the audience for The New York Times Crossword is not and should not be a static thing. It's constantly changing, with younger people coming in all the time. And that's a wonderful thing IMO, because we need this pastime of ours to last after we're gone. It would be such a shame if it died a slow death because it was deemed irrelevant by those who come after us.
And as I said in the column, the vast majority of entries on any given day are readily accessible. If there are a few that you want to grumble about just because YOU didn't know them, that's fine by me. But at least acknowledge your own limitations, much the way your parents had to when you discovered something in pop culture that they deemed shocking or outside their wheelhouse. Because it's the exact same thing. Times change, but people don't.
9
"Times change..."
and the Times changes with them.
I agree, Deb. But some of us older solvers are perfectly happy with our old-fashioned or offbeat interests, and those are valid choices. I don't HAVE to listen to the newest music if it doesn't happen to engage my interest. I don't HAVE to watch the latest films and TV series. And while it's always good to know who's who and what's what these days so as to expand the wheelhouse, the fact that I'm not an active participant in newer genres will inevitably limit my wheelhouse to what's comfortable and engaging to me directly. In my case, that usually means to what's old and well worn and comfy. But that's on me. Wheelhouse limits are always a matter of individual interest. So enjoy the new, and by all means include the new in puzzles. I just hope you'll keep the crossings kind (as was the case today).
(I tell you...five miles on foot, in the snow...uphill...both ways!)
and the Times changes with them.
I agree, Deb. But some of us older solvers are perfectly happy with our old-fashioned or offbeat interests, and those are valid choices. I don't HAVE to listen to the newest music if it doesn't happen to engage my interest. I don't HAVE to watch the latest films and TV series. And while it's always good to know who's who and what's what these days so as to expand the wheelhouse, the fact that I'm not an active participant in newer genres will inevitably limit my wheelhouse to what's comfortable and engaging to me directly. In my case, that usually means to what's old and well worn and comfy. But that's on me. Wheelhouse limits are always a matter of individual interest. So enjoy the new, and by all means include the new in puzzles. I just hope you'll keep the crossings kind (as was the case today).
(I tell you...five miles on foot, in the snow...uphill...both ways!)
6
Agreed, Alan. And I think you said it well: include the new, but don't forget the rest. Which I believe can be said about this puzzle ALMOST as much as any that Will and Joel run.
All we ask is that you be as good a sport about it as the younger generations are when they get stuck on things that they don't know. Because the puzzles are still tilted very much in your favor.
All we ask is that you be as good a sport about it as the younger generations are when they get stuck on things that they don't know. Because the puzzles are still tilted very much in your favor.
2
Nice puzzle. Really liked "waterway started in Rome" and "they may be wished for at fountains."
Didn't know Biggie Smalls did "Mo Money Mo Problems," but I know the name Biggie Smalls, and with enough crosses got that (although the state bordering California was a nice, tricky, twice wrong entry for me).
Didn't know Biggie Smalls did "Mo Money Mo Problems," but I know the name Biggie Smalls, and with enough crosses got that (although the state bordering California was a nice, tricky, twice wrong entry for me).
2
Mr. Pasco, you're right in assuming that I'm not a fan of Biggie Smalls, but that's primarily because I AM a fan of Tupac. If you want to talk about that, I'll be outside.*
Contentious notes aside, when I first read through the clues I almost decided not to do this one. And then I managed to finish it with just two failed checks and one incredibly dim-witted moment involving square 5. Actually turned out to be fairly enjoyable. A number of things I didn't know from the clues (including Mr. Smalls), but at least knew they were things.
OT regarding 53d. There's a possibility that I might be taking a trip with #3 son in early September, visiting a few national parks out west: Grand Canyon, Death Valley and Yellowstone mostly. Still waiting to find out if he's game (get it?). Took the same trip about a dozen years ago with my youngest son. We saw a few ELK one evening at Grand Canyon, and then were excited to see some during the day at Yellowstone and took several pictures. But by the second day we realized the place was just hip deep in ELK and were constantly joking about it after a while. Then we got to another park (Grand Teton, IIRC), and on our drive in we saw a herd of about 300 or so in a valley and just cracked up.
So you could say that we had a very ELKy summer. (rim-shot).
* I am actually using the 15 letter title of a Tupac recording as one of the seed entries in my first serious attempt to construct a puzzle.
Contentious notes aside, when I first read through the clues I almost decided not to do this one. And then I managed to finish it with just two failed checks and one incredibly dim-witted moment involving square 5. Actually turned out to be fairly enjoyable. A number of things I didn't know from the clues (including Mr. Smalls), but at least knew they were things.
OT regarding 53d. There's a possibility that I might be taking a trip with #3 son in early September, visiting a few national parks out west: Grand Canyon, Death Valley and Yellowstone mostly. Still waiting to find out if he's game (get it?). Took the same trip about a dozen years ago with my youngest son. We saw a few ELK one evening at Grand Canyon, and then were excited to see some during the day at Yellowstone and took several pictures. But by the second day we realized the place was just hip deep in ELK and were constantly joking about it after a while. Then we got to another park (Grand Teton, IIRC), and on our drive in we saw a herd of about 300 or so in a valley and just cracked up.
So you could say that we had a very ELKy summer. (rim-shot).
* I am actually using the 15 letter title of a Tupac recording as one of the seed entries in my first serious attempt to construct a puzzle.
7
I can't wait to solve it, RiA.
2
Well, you could have gone to the beach every January and had Shelley Winters.
4
Funny about the elk (good pun, too). My husband and I were in a Jackson Hole, driving around near the edge of Yellowstone, and noticed loads of people stopping their cars, hopping out to go see something exciting. So, what the heck, we joined the mob. And there at the edge of the forest we saw...coyotes. We felt very foolish.
1
Fantastic clue for FLOATS and some lovely answers: CUTUPS, ANIMIST, CANAPE. But what jumped out in this puzzle for me was what resides in my head that I had no idea was there: FANDUEL! NAENAE! BIGGIESMALLS! ADAMSRIB! IDRISELBA! ALAMEDA! METALHEAD! GALOP! How did they get there? How did they get to where they could pop up in my brain with just one or two letters in their grid space?
I never asked for it when I was younger, I never expected it to happen, but as I've gotten older, I realize that I've become a can't-deny-it drivel magnet.
I never asked for it when I was younger, I never expected it to happen, but as I've gotten older, I realize that I've become a can't-deny-it drivel magnet.
5
Me, too! Me, too!
3
Lewis, I call my brain an attic filled with junk, and it really helps with puzzles like this. I've never listened to BIGGIE SMALLS or done the NAE NAE, but I know he/they exist/s. Likewise, I've never danced a GALOP, although I did listen to a recording of Peer GYNT a lot when I was a kid (it was one of the few records--78s, I think--a relative had). If you give me enough time, I remember that New York has cities named ROME (and Utica, and Ithaca, etc etc). It was part of what I enjoyed about being a reference librarian--I never knew what someone would ask about next, so I had to be aware of a little bit of everything.
2
Pretty much the same here, with ADAMSRIB and BIGGIESMALLS truly surprising me (but not TRVIA).
1
I enjoyed this puzzle although I didn't expect to. I think that the reason I liked it was that there was a good balance between pop culture and more accessible clues. Whoever was responsible for this balance did a good job.
Kudos to Mr. Pasco notwithstanding his rant. It was a clever puzzle.
One observation however. Solvers don't complain about "trivia"; "trivia" makes up the bread and butter of crosswords. Solvers complain about arcane clues that are outside the wheelhouse of the average NYT reader. BIGGIE SMALLS is a classic example. I'm sure he warms Mr. Pasco's heart and ears but I don't have the slightest idea who he is and I am sure that I am not that much of an endangered minority among NYT readers. The puzzle worked because of the vertical clues that were accessible, and a bit of guesswork.
In a nutshell, I'm happy Mr. Pasco is a clever teenager but he should give up his mission to proselytize the cultural ethos of those in the 13-19 niche and set his sights on a broader cultural framework. even if that includes a few opera singers and old athletes. Once he reaches his ripe old thirties he'll be glad he opened his mind somewhat.
Kudos to Mr. Pasco notwithstanding his rant. It was a clever puzzle.
One observation however. Solvers don't complain about "trivia"; "trivia" makes up the bread and butter of crosswords. Solvers complain about arcane clues that are outside the wheelhouse of the average NYT reader. BIGGIE SMALLS is a classic example. I'm sure he warms Mr. Pasco's heart and ears but I don't have the slightest idea who he is and I am sure that I am not that much of an endangered minority among NYT readers. The puzzle worked because of the vertical clues that were accessible, and a bit of guesswork.
In a nutshell, I'm happy Mr. Pasco is a clever teenager but he should give up his mission to proselytize the cultural ethos of those in the 13-19 niche and set his sights on a broader cultural framework. even if that includes a few opera singers and old athletes. Once he reaches his ripe old thirties he'll be glad he opened his mind somewhat.
1
I think he might argue the same points about you, William. That's the point.
But I'm glad you enjoyed the puzzle.
But I'm glad you enjoyed the puzzle.
12
The measure of intelligence is the ability to change...said Einstein.
3
Biggie Smalls is as important to his brand of music (which is an art form, if not to everyone's taste) as many important opera singers are to theirs.
If Mr Pasco should learn about those (and who says he doesn't know?), or about athletes, maybe you should broaden your knowledge and learn about Mr Smalls.
For the record, I'm in my 50s, one doesn't need to be 13-19 to know such things.
If Mr Pasco should learn about those (and who says he doesn't know?), or about athletes, maybe you should broaden your knowledge and learn about Mr Smalls.
For the record, I'm in my 50s, one doesn't need to be 13-19 to know such things.
3
There were loads of things I didn't know today, but mentioning that doesn't mean I hated it or think those things shouldn't be in a puzzle. Actually even when I was young I was pretty useless at remembering or recognizing various singers. So I don't NEED A MOMENT to weep over today's puzzle. As Brits say "mustn't grumble".
Although I did grumble when after looking up the Mo money rapper and happily entered Notorious BIG, it turned out to be wrong.
Maybe I'll sip some REMY Martin cognac whilst watching ADAMS RIB.
BTW, Deb, you do realize that you are a kid to quite a few of us in wordplay.
Although I did grumble when after looking up the Mo money rapper and happily entered Notorious BIG, it turned out to be wrong.
Maybe I'll sip some REMY Martin cognac whilst watching ADAMS RIB.
BTW, Deb, you do realize that you are a kid to quite a few of us in wordplay.
5
Hi Sue,
You are so kind. With my baby leaving for college this summer, I don't feel like a kid. But I appreciate the perspective.
You are so kind. With my baby leaving for college this summer, I don't feel like a kid. But I appreciate the perspective.
2
This was tough. I solved S to N, catching on early to BIGGIESMALLS, METALHEAD and IDRISELBA (ooh...GIVEMEAMINUTE...so, so handsome!), and BAJA. The SW filled in a JIFF, then SE. Things slowed down considerably as I moved up the grid. I was stumped for a while by the "Roman" waterway. Good clue, that.
I may be old, but I do know my rappers and pop singers! (Biggie Smalls, by the way, is a very popular name for small-but-mighty dogs that come into rescue with no given moniker.) I know my BAEBAE from my whip, too. It might not be a pretty sight, given my age, but I do like to dance. You see those older, white ladies in the dance video? Those are my people. (Awesome video. I love seeing people dancing joyfully!)
FANDUEL, on the other hand, is new to me, even though I remember seeing DraftKings in the news.
I am not rattled by the "handful of entries" mentioned. On the contrary, kudos on alluding to awareness, consent and respect. "'TIL it Happens to You" is a moving song. NOMEANSNO.
About the MALEGAZE, a few decades ago some construction workers were calling out numbers and judgements (she's a 3, that one's a 9, etc.) at women who passed by during the lunch hour -- every weekday, for weeks. One day one launched a criticism at me. I reeled around, got in his face, and told him to say it to me directly. He couldn't do it. He almost broke into tears, and then he apologized. Two women came over and thanked me profusely because they had to walk by there every day. Words HURT.
I may be old, but I do know my rappers and pop singers! (Biggie Smalls, by the way, is a very popular name for small-but-mighty dogs that come into rescue with no given moniker.) I know my BAEBAE from my whip, too. It might not be a pretty sight, given my age, but I do like to dance. You see those older, white ladies in the dance video? Those are my people. (Awesome video. I love seeing people dancing joyfully!)
FANDUEL, on the other hand, is new to me, even though I remember seeing DraftKings in the news.
I am not rattled by the "handful of entries" mentioned. On the contrary, kudos on alluding to awareness, consent and respect. "'TIL it Happens to You" is a moving song. NOMEANSNO.
About the MALEGAZE, a few decades ago some construction workers were calling out numbers and judgements (she's a 3, that one's a 9, etc.) at women who passed by during the lunch hour -- every weekday, for weeks. One day one launched a criticism at me. I reeled around, got in his face, and told him to say it to me directly. He couldn't do it. He almost broke into tears, and then he apologized. Two women came over and thanked me profusely because they had to walk by there every day. Words HURT.
16
Well said. I love crosswords where I learn something new. We are part of this world, all of it.
1
I'm not a millennial (GenX represent!) but I keep in touch with pop culture and current events so most of those are usually "gimmes" for me. I'm not necessarily a fan of things like NAENAE but I know they exist. On the flipside, I also love clues about history, classical music, and obscure vocabulary. It's good to be well rounded. I don't see the point in being a "knowledge snob" - I think knowing trivia and cultural references, from whatever era, is important, especially for crossword solvers.
P.S. I didn't get ZAYN at first because I didn't know he was one-named... I'm familiar with Zayn Malik who used to be in One Direction and I assume it's the same person. Wasn't aware he dropped his last name as a solo artist.
P.S. I didn't get ZAYN at first because I didn't know he was one-named... I'm familiar with Zayn Malik who used to be in One Direction and I assume it's the same person. Wasn't aware he dropped his last name as a solo artist.
3
This: "It's good to be well rounded. I don't see the point in being a "knowledge snob" - I think knowing trivia and cultural references, from whatever era, is important, especially for crossword solvers."
5
You want to know a lot about a little and a little about a lot, and refrain from bragging about either category.
1
and Elke
DANG-- I NEEDed A MOMENT and then some to get a toehold. Fortunately, ELK (ahem), BIP , ELLS, REMY (again) etc. got me going.
The ERIE CANAL had been in the news recently, it was the 200th anniversary of the start of construction of what was also called "Clinton's Folly" .
This Gray Haired Old Lady (? female geezer ) was glad to see that the TEEN puzzle constructor included Peer GYNT- written by Grieg ca. 140 yrs. ago. Will today's rap artists be remembered in a 140 yrs. ?
Am making a reference list of certain names.
Maybe a dram of REMY will bring on those REMS.
DANG-- I NEEDed A MOMENT and then some to get a toehold. Fortunately, ELK (ahem), BIP , ELLS, REMY (again) etc. got me going.
The ERIE CANAL had been in the news recently, it was the 200th anniversary of the start of construction of what was also called "Clinton's Folly" .
This Gray Haired Old Lady (? female geezer ) was glad to see that the TEEN puzzle constructor included Peer GYNT- written by Grieg ca. 140 yrs. ago. Will today's rap artists be remembered in a 140 yrs. ?
Am making a reference list of certain names.
Maybe a dram of REMY will bring on those REMS.
3
Friday puzzles often leave me humbled by all the things I don't know. Today's was no exception and I doubt I'll remember all the newbies the next time they show up.
One thing I love though, is that when I've filled all the squares but no music ensues, I check out Deb's remarks. When the music still doesn't blare forth, I start to read my fellow bloggers' letters. Usually one of you will mention the word I have gotten wrong and then, ta da. Today it was you, Robert, with the mention of BIP. I had PIP and knew it didn't sound quite right but I'm not sure I would have remembered it even if I'd done the alphabet job.
Surprised by REMY twice in one week.
One thing I love though, is that when I've filled all the squares but no music ensues, I check out Deb's remarks. When the music still doesn't blare forth, I start to read my fellow bloggers' letters. Usually one of you will mention the word I have gotten wrong and then, ta da. Today it was you, Robert, with the mention of BIP. I had PIP and knew it didn't sound quite right but I'm not sure I would have remembered it even if I'd done the alphabet job.
Surprised by REMY twice in one week.
2
I liked the puzzle well enough - today was a long day and I looked forward to doing the puzzle. It was definitely a challenge, I had at least 15 passes through it.
What I liked:
The long entries - especially because they are often phrases and not single words, which makes it harder for me -
ERIECANAL, NOMEANSNO, INEEDAMOMENT, BIGGIESMALLS, METALHEADS, IDRISELBA (between him and Jessica Alba, whom I had first for 31A, I could never remember which was who's last name), IDOLATRY, MALEGAZE, ADAMSRIB.
Also liked FANDUEL, though that was probably a bit out of some people's wheelhouse. However, I'm an NPR listener, and FANDUEL and DraftKing have been in the news more than a dozen times over the last few years, most recently this week because they called off their attempted merger because it was unlikely the government would approve a merger between the two major players that would create a company with more than 90% market share.
#TIL about - GALOP, NAENAE (didn't we just have it in another puzzle very recently?), ALAMEDA, ZAYN, BIP (I think I saw that in another puzzle one time).
Didn't like -
12D - not being a spoilsport, but this one was very meta - who would know that the constructor of this particular puzzle is a TEEN? I think that's a lot to ask of those who are not dedicated to the NYT XWDs.
32A - TRIVIA - again, a bit meta.
44A - ENSEAL...
For 3D I had ARM until it became clear ERRE CANAL was wrong and what the obvious correct answer was.
What I liked:
The long entries - especially because they are often phrases and not single words, which makes it harder for me -
ERIECANAL, NOMEANSNO, INEEDAMOMENT, BIGGIESMALLS, METALHEADS, IDRISELBA (between him and Jessica Alba, whom I had first for 31A, I could never remember which was who's last name), IDOLATRY, MALEGAZE, ADAMSRIB.
Also liked FANDUEL, though that was probably a bit out of some people's wheelhouse. However, I'm an NPR listener, and FANDUEL and DraftKing have been in the news more than a dozen times over the last few years, most recently this week because they called off their attempted merger because it was unlikely the government would approve a merger between the two major players that would create a company with more than 90% market share.
#TIL about - GALOP, NAENAE (didn't we just have it in another puzzle very recently?), ALAMEDA, ZAYN, BIP (I think I saw that in another puzzle one time).
Didn't like -
12D - not being a spoilsport, but this one was very meta - who would know that the constructor of this particular puzzle is a TEEN? I think that's a lot to ask of those who are not dedicated to the NYT XWDs.
32A - TRIVIA - again, a bit meta.
44A - ENSEAL...
For 3D I had ARM until it became clear ERRE CANAL was wrong and what the obvious correct answer was.
1
5
and Elke
David C. - DANG ; now I have a brainworm of the CANe CANape....
David C. - DANG ; now I have a brainworm of the CANe CANape....
What movie (comedy) was that used in? I have a picture of Danny Kaye in my head. Probably wrong.
"Ice Age", "Jack Benny Show" and many, many cartoons used the Kabalevsky Comedians' Galop.
There are many familiar Galops I could have cued up - starting with the "Can Can" (Infernal Galop)--
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okQRnHvw3is
(listen past the introduction to get to the galop itself)
There are many familiar Galops I could have cued up - starting with the "Can Can" (Infernal Galop)--
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okQRnHvw3is
(listen past the introduction to get to the galop itself)
1
I didn't mind the clues for younger solvers, but my teenage children would like to mention that although they are familiar with ZAYN and NAE NAE, they have no love for these things.
Incidentally, you can watch me whip, but please don't watch me NAE NAE.
Incidentally, you can watch me whip, but please don't watch me NAE NAE.
2
Didn't care for this one. I found it inelegant, with nothing particularly interesting or clever. I could not care less if the constructors are teens or octogenarians, male or female, conservative or liberal, just give me a good puzzle. This is, at best, a solid JV team entry, but it's not quite ready for varsity Friday.
1
I'm the mother of a millennial so I often know some of the newer words and phrases included in recent puzzles. However, I look to the NYT puzzles to test my vocabulary, knowledge of foreign phrases, history, and geography, and my ability to interpret, correctly, difficult clueing.
That I know idiocies such as "life hack", "male gaze" "nae nae"and other nouveau expressions doesn't mean I want to see them in what's supposed to be the gold standard of crosswords.
Your determined efforts to be hip and "woke" are off-putting.
That I know idiocies such as "life hack", "male gaze" "nae nae"and other nouveau expressions doesn't mean I want to see them in what's supposed to be the gold standard of crosswords.
Your determined efforts to be hip and "woke" are off-putting.
7
MALEGAZE is hardly a "nouveau expression", JG. It goes back to the early days of feminism, in the 1970s. Not to be grouped in your list of "idiocies."
I'm not sure what offends you so much about NAENAE. Would you be upset if a puzzle included clues for the TWIST, the MASHEDPOTATO? How about MOONWALKING or the CHARLESTON? Dance styles change. Where should the line be drawn?
I'm not sure what offends you so much about NAENAE. Would you be upset if a puzzle included clues for the TWIST, the MASHEDPOTATO? How about MOONWALKING or the CHARLESTON? Dance styles change. Where should the line be drawn?
10
hey Paolo--nice work. It was fresh and stimulating to see so many terms and cultural references that would come from a young person's perspective. Those didn't throw me--"galop" did! Thanks for the learning on that one. Looking forward to your next one.
3
Forgot to mention in my CiC that I really liked seeing MALE GAZE.
I haven't heard the term in a long time, but the fact of men's attitudes being the default hasn't changed that much.
I haven't heard the term in a long time, but the fact of men's attitudes being the default hasn't changed that much.
I can't believe METALHEAD is just making its debut today, INEEDAMOMENT to let that sink in. I love the Mike Myers references and the Michael Myers one as well. I could go on for a while about how much I enjoyed this solve, but I've got a tight SKED tomorrow and I need to get some REMS. This was a fun and fresh puzzle. Well done Mr. Pasco.
2
Blecch, after reading the article I almost skipped it. But I'm too vain to lose my streak :\
3
:-O You read the column and get the answers before you do the puzzle???
9
Several commenters seem to indicate the variety of approaches - some read the column first, others when stumped, others only after getting the "oops, almost--" message, and others (like me) only after getting the happy music / happy pencil. Lately, I visit xwordinfo between finishing the puzzle and reading Deb, since they always have the full version of the constructor's notes.
I have found today's comments very illuminating on this point and on the range of opinions expressed. Thanks to Paolo for playing the "agent provocateur" so successfully.
I have found today's comments very illuminating on this point and on the range of opinions expressed. Thanks to Paolo for playing the "agent provocateur" so successfully.
2
Hi David,
I'm not sure what you mean by the full version of the constructor's notes. I run what constructors send me. They might be slightly different between here and XWI, but I don't remove anything, unless it's offensive. Other than that, I only edit for Times style.
I'm not sure what you mean by the full version of the constructor's notes. I run what constructors send me. They might be slightly different between here and XWI, but I don't remove anything, unless it's offensive. Other than that, I only edit for Times style.
2
Loved seeing METALHEAD in this puzzle. The fact that it was right next to BIGGIE SMALLS made me giggle (well, I had NOTORIOUS BIG at first, but it's the same dude).
I'm not sure whether this is my fastest Friday solve, but it felt like it could have been. And it was fun. :)
I'm not sure whether this is my fastest Friday solve, but it felt like it could have been. And it was fun. :)
1
This is not a good puzzle. Too many proper nouns. New or old doesn't matter. And the blurb on it is tiresome PC drivel.
8
I enjoyed it AND I learned things. I struggled but it didn't feel hopeless or unfun. Thanks for a good puzzle.
3
As a younger solver, I want to express how excited I was to see a puzzle filled with the references of my generation. Ended up with far and away my fastest Friday time ever.
And unlike Deb, FANDUEL was the very first answer I slotted in.
And unlike Deb, FANDUEL was the very first answer I slotted in.
15
Yes! I appreciate the clues about people (or sayings, or things) that I know about. Far too often there are clues referencing popular culture of past decades, which may bring on bouts of nostalgia for many, but leave younger generations in the cold. It's nice to have some balance once in a while.
I particularly loved METAL HEAD, NAE NAE and ZAYN. This was an unusually smooth-sailing Friday puzzle for me.
I particularly loved METAL HEAD, NAE NAE and ZAYN. This was an unusually smooth-sailing Friday puzzle for me.
8
And like Sam, also my fastest Friday time ever, by a large margin.
4
Hey Sam,
Just goes to show you: we all have different wheelhouses. I'm not a fantasy sports person or someone who bets, so it went over my head.
Just goes to show you: we all have different wheelhouses. I'm not a fantasy sports person or someone who bets, so it went over my head.
Definitely a wheelhouse challenge for this old geezer, but the crossings were gettable. I guessed my way through large swaths of it, but only had to fix one typo to turn an "Almost done" into "Complete." So I'd rate it as fair game for Friday. But it still left me feeling like a geezer.
6
My father was born in Rome, NY. So the ERIE CANAL popped right up. His family owned and operated tugboats on the canal down to NYC. I saw one once while seeing a friend off on a cruise and it had my name on it!! Big surprise.
7
Definitely a different vibe than most puzzles! I enjoyed it, which may just be a way of saying that I managed to finish it. I'd never heard of DraftKings or FANDUEL, but it filled in easily. I ran through my short repertoire of one-named 4-letter singers without thinking of ZAYN, but he also filled in easily from the crosses. I fell for the Rome misdirect and had ARM instead of AIM at first. Couldn't remember Marcel Marceau's character--MIP? MEP?--and tried ALBA before BIEL but got there eventually. Yes, there was a lot of TRIVIA but it was fun. Plenty of new stuff, but there were also some things for us olds--ADAM'S RIB, Peer GYNT. I like mixing it up with a new slant on things.
6