I've never --- ever --- been unhappy about being gay, but reading the comments for this column has made me thankful for my orientation in ways I normally never think about.
85
Thanks NYT for publishing a piece about how awful (some) men are on Fathers Day. Perhaps on Mothers Day we can have a Modern Love piece about how awful it is that (some) women never initiate sex or relationships and the emotional toll the constant rejection has on a man.
32
It's not about you.
121
It's all about you, ML, isn't it?
180
For God's sake, get a grip. This piece has nothing to do with the good men we celebrate on Father's Day, or with good men in general. The crux of this piece was about how a woman was harassed by lowlife jerks who felt they had a right to bother her because of her bra size. The fact that the Times published the column on June 18, 2017 - Father's Day this calendar year - was not some sort of subtle dig at men, so please relax. Not all men are pigs, and not all women - and newspaper editors - think of them as such. Most of us are advanced enough to realize that the guys shouting lewd things from moving cars or lecherously leering at women walking down the street are not representative of the male gender, and that good men find them just as repulsive and obnoxious as the harassed women themselves do.
225
Get a reduction. You complain about something you can fix. It is a very common procedure.
22
Why does she have to change her body because jerks wont leave her alone?
Furthermore her breasts have absolutely nothing to do with it. Women with small breasts or no breasts still get harassed constantly.
This is victim blaming out of ignorance.
Furthermore her breasts have absolutely nothing to do with it. Women with small breasts or no breasts still get harassed constantly.
This is victim blaming out of ignorance.
432
Breast reduction surgery is not as simple and breezy as walking into the pharmacy and buying a box of tampax, Mary. It's neither easy nor affordable for many women to obtain. One of my relatives had it done, but she suffered for years before she was finally able to have the procedure. At 16, she was a DD cup and still growing; she was harassed mercilessly on the bus each day to and from school. Her parents looked into the surgery for her, but their insurance would not cover the costs as it was considered a "cosmetic procedure" because her breast size wasn't causing health problems at the time. They couldn't afford to pay for the surgery themselves, so she had to live with her large breasts - and unwelcome comments and general harassment - for awhile. Eventually, she became so large that the weight and size of her breasts caused her to develop back problems. Only then would the insurance pay for the surgery because it was classified as a medical, not a cosmetic, procedure.
Just because the procedure is common doesn't mean it's easy to obtain, and not all women and girls can "fix" the challenges posed by a large chest. Please show a little sympathy and compassion.
Just because the procedure is common doesn't mean it's easy to obtain, and not all women and girls can "fix" the challenges posed by a large chest. Please show a little sympathy and compassion.
217
Mary from St. Louis, you are suggesting the author surgically remove parts of her body as a 'fix' to a 'problem'?
The woman's body is not the problem here.
How could her body be the problem?
The woman's body is not the problem here.
How could her body be the problem?
313
So true. I remember all this when I lived in Manhattan in the 60's and 70's. Now that I'm 70, no one whistles anymore. Just look forward to that. Get a breast reduction now if your breasts bother you.
24
Years ago, when renovating a house, some of the subcontractors did not know me by sight. As I walked near they called out in the way HB describes, beckoning me and rating my body. I walked up to them, introduced my self as the person who pays the person who pays them. I warned that if I heard of one single passerby being verbally accosted by any of the workmen, I would fire the whole crew. And I promised to check with the neighbors daily. Problem solved. It felt so great to have the power in that situation for once.
531
I'll never forget the time a guy in the back of a pickup truck whistled at me, and I yelled, "In your dreams!" The look on his face was priceless.
94
I am grateful for the men who are sticking up for women here in the comments, and all of the upstanding men I know in person.
138
Great essay. Unfortunately it's timeless. I went through it in the 60s. Reading your piece was like deja vu.
100
I would wager most women can relate to this essay, and feel the fear all over again of so many unwanted advances, achieved or attempted gropes, insinuating comments and stares.
But why the NYT chose to put this column in the "Modern Love" category is stupefying.
But why the NYT chose to put this column in the "Modern Love" category is stupefying.
70
I think it's because she loves her body. She doesn't love the comments from men, but she loves how she used to feel about her body when she was a kid.
75
Cara, I would just add that she probably loves her body now. What she doesn't love is the reactions to it.
54
Beautiful essay. So true. Thank you for putting into words this feeling I have lived with since I can remember.
79
Way back in the Stone Age, 1970s. I was in the tenth grade, standing in front of the class, giving my little speech. I'd just been speaking for a minute or two. The English teacher, a man probably around 30 yrs. old, was at the back of the room. Suddenly, he asked in a loud voice: " Tell us, Phyliss, how long since you've actually seen your feet ??? ". Great hilarity, all around. I was mortified, blushed, but persisted. Today, THAT guy would be disciplined. Then, it was " joking around". Being funny. Well, it's NOT funny. Especially to younger women and GIRLS. If anyone said something like that to my granddaughters, there would be consequences. Physically. From ME.
Mind your own damn business. Or at least, keep your mouth shut.
Mind your own damn business. Or at least, keep your mouth shut.
235
I think a lot of women can identify with this regardless of breast size. I am practically flat chested and I had to listen to catcalls from men, to being touched and leaned against on the subway, and guys acting as if my body was public property. That was in the 70s when I was in my 20s. Now at 65, I get a lot more respect.
90
I have often wondered if some women's obsession with thinness isn't a masked desire to go back to those early childhood days of running around shirtless and feeling powerful, before coming of age and becoming a subject of the male gaze?
116
Nancy, you pose an interesting question. I have no answer except to observe that thin women are also subject to cat calls and feel in danger at times. Thin doesn't mean you have no breasts and are sexless.
48
The first piece of advice I would give Heather Burtman is to stop walking on the streets. Then, get a car and drive between work and your home. Park close to home and close to work. Simply put, it means not walking alone on the streets.
Next I would suggest wearing clothing that does not reveal your figure, especially when you are traveling back and forth to work or running errands. Conservative business attire is called for.
This should stop most of the catcalls and strangers addressing you.
I would then suggest moving to a better neighborhood. Hopefully you have a job, in which case you can ask male colleagues to escort you to your car. Any professional male would be happy to do this for you.
Lastly, I would suggest not responding to any men who address you on the street. Any response will only encourage them.
It is necessary for you to take very firm steps to stop all this harassment. In a nutshell I would strongly suggest aggressively removing yourself from the places where you get harassed.
One last idea. Carry pepper spray and spray it in the face of the next guy that harasses you.
Next I would suggest wearing clothing that does not reveal your figure, especially when you are traveling back and forth to work or running errands. Conservative business attire is called for.
This should stop most of the catcalls and strangers addressing you.
I would then suggest moving to a better neighborhood. Hopefully you have a job, in which case you can ask male colleagues to escort you to your car. Any professional male would be happy to do this for you.
Lastly, I would suggest not responding to any men who address you on the street. Any response will only encourage them.
It is necessary for you to take very firm steps to stop all this harassment. In a nutshell I would strongly suggest aggressively removing yourself from the places where you get harassed.
One last idea. Carry pepper spray and spray it in the face of the next guy that harasses you.
14
So she needs to completely remake her life? When it's the men who are the problem? Why don't men learn to keep their comments and hands to themselves?
It's not a question of a better neighborhood. Or wearing a burka. These comments happen in all neighborhoods, regardless how women dress.
Please stop telling the victim it's her fault.
It's not a question of a better neighborhood. Or wearing a burka. These comments happen in all neighborhoods, regardless how women dress.
Please stop telling the victim it's her fault.
204
Kindly meant advice I am sure, but missing the point altogether that women's bodies aren't the problem. The issue is the way far too many men consciously choose to respond to women. If these men thought of women as people whom they respected, they would not do any of the things which the author described.
Living in "a better neighborhood" and wearing conservative business attire doesn't protect a woman from these attitudes, which know no economic, occupational or social boundaries!
Living in "a better neighborhood" and wearing conservative business attire doesn't protect a woman from these attitudes, which know no economic, occupational or social boundaries!
140
> "Stop walking on the streets.."
Where might she find a teleportation device? A car might not be accessible nor an escort. What about walking from the parking lot to her home even if she had one.
> "Next I would suggest wearing clothing that does not reveal your figure..."
Women get harassed and even assaulted on the street no matter what they are wearing. From sun dresses, to pant suits, to parkas.
> "I would then suggest moving to a better neighborhood."
There is street harassment everywhere.
> "I would suggest not responding to any men who address you on the street."
This actually makes little difference in the end.
>"It is necessary for you to take very firm steps to stop all this harassment."
Overall you are victim blaming from a point of extreme ignorance. If there were things that made this stop, do you think any woman would put up with it?
Street harassment is a big problem, there is lots you can do to educate yourself on it. In fact there are youtube videos of a women wearing different things or trying different scenarios that are often suggested. You should see for yourself the difference that it makes.
Where might she find a teleportation device? A car might not be accessible nor an escort. What about walking from the parking lot to her home even if she had one.
> "Next I would suggest wearing clothing that does not reveal your figure..."
Women get harassed and even assaulted on the street no matter what they are wearing. From sun dresses, to pant suits, to parkas.
> "I would then suggest moving to a better neighborhood."
There is street harassment everywhere.
> "I would suggest not responding to any men who address you on the street."
This actually makes little difference in the end.
>"It is necessary for you to take very firm steps to stop all this harassment."
Overall you are victim blaming from a point of extreme ignorance. If there were things that made this stop, do you think any woman would put up with it?
Street harassment is a big problem, there is lots you can do to educate yourself on it. In fact there are youtube videos of a women wearing different things or trying different scenarios that are often suggested. You should see for yourself the difference that it makes.
146
I learned to walk with authority, look straight ahead, keep moving and do not acknowledge cat calls, hoots, and other examples of male vulgarity. I have been blessed with sizable breasts and earned my share of unwanted attention until I was at least 55. My body is, and has always been, mine. I have not allowed any of these inferior specimens of manhood to "get to" me. Their rude behavior is one of those things that goes along with living in cities. I've been groped a few times on streetcars, but have a way of chopping at a roving hand with my own hand, and saying quietly, "Are you going to get off this streetcar NOW or am I going to get loud?" I guess my tone was strict enough, so that this has always worked. The pawing men got off. I've been followed from the bus stop by cars more times than I can count - and was well over 50 the last time this happened. I let myself into the house, called 911 and "the man" was on my street within seconds. I barely remember some creep offering me a ride, to which I responded, "Get the hell out of here" and blasting on a police whistle. Other than being groped on crowded streetcars and on a San Francisco cable car, I have never been touched by any of these lowlifes. I come off as a person in charge. I have NEVER felt like "prey"! By the way, I rode the subways almost daily in Manhattan for 2 full summers - able to avoid rush hours - often alone -- and never had any problems. Maybe it helped that I carried a sharp-pointed umbrella.
38
This piece is more of an indictment of a society that allows the described behavior. Your response/defense against this behavior is a part of the indictment. You shouldn't have to do any of that.
74
I've read that the thing to do is to raise a subway groper's hand, and say, "Would someone please take a photo of this creep?"
26
So you seem to be saying that all the abuse hurled at you was OK, and and that if only all women were like you everything would be just fine, and that women should just get used to the idea that we exist for men to abuse. Or did I miss something...?
71
I remember, as a tween and young teen, feeling fear of men who catcalled and followed me in their cars as I walked down the sidewalk. It was that early childhood "stranger danger" sense, raised to the 10th power. Some time in my late teens, I realized I was in charge of my emotions, and I refused to play the prey animal to these moronic predators. I carried pepper spray and ignored the idiocy.
As a college student, I was once walking downtown to catch the Greyhound home. A man was coming towards me on the sidewalk. He was staring at me so hard, he tripped and nearly fell on his face. "See what you did to me?!" he screamed. "It's your fault!" I just kept on moving.
Take heart: There are men out there who don't engage in this behavior, and actively stand against it. I'm married to one. He loves and respects his mother and three older sisters. He has always been a protector and advocate for women in public spaces.
As a college student, I was once walking downtown to catch the Greyhound home. A man was coming towards me on the sidewalk. He was staring at me so hard, he tripped and nearly fell on his face. "See what you did to me?!" he screamed. "It's your fault!" I just kept on moving.
Take heart: There are men out there who don't engage in this behavior, and actively stand against it. I'm married to one. He loves and respects his mother and three older sisters. He has always been a protector and advocate for women in public spaces.
41
I agree with most of what you say but I still have difficulty with the idea that we somehow require "protectors and advocates" in order to feel safe in public spaces. I always think back to Golda Meir's comment, when the suggestion was made that there should be a curfew for girls and young women, that perhaps the curfew should be for the men, as they were the problem, not the women.
This problem will only end when little boys and little girls are taught from the moment they are born, that they can be strong, soft, beautiful, homely, smart, cool, foolish, confused, ambitious, adventurous, in fact all the human traits and characteristics without value or gender assignments.
This problem will only end when little boys and little girls are taught from the moment they are born, that they can be strong, soft, beautiful, homely, smart, cool, foolish, confused, ambitious, adventurous, in fact all the human traits and characteristics without value or gender assignments.
84
I was 12 years old at a baseball game with my family and siblings when I had my first taste of what was to be 25 years of feeling so ashamed of my body. I was an athletic happy girl who had no idea that my large breasts were to be such a source of embarrassment. But that 40 year old looking man with his group of 4 or 5 friends who looked at an innocent child and made pornographic comments forever change my life. Out of habit, I still never make eye contact with males, and sadly school my daughters on the unfair and dangerous world that men rule.
100
I sympathize with the authors experience of male ownership and objectification. I often felt silenced by catcalling myself so I started a project on Instagram-- @catcallsofnyc-- where I write catcalls on the sidewalk where they happened and then post them to Instagram. Through this I've found my voice on the issue. I've been surprised by how many men have responded with sympathetically.
52
In my experience, men don't know the content or context of the harmless-sounding "catcall." Perhaps they're picturing Archie and Jughead—"standing on the corner, watching all the girls go by," as the old song goes—with goofily dilating hearts for eyes. Or a nice guy (someone like you, reader) summoning his inner Cary Grant or Marlon Brando to compliment a strange woman so effectively that anything could happen—a one-night stand, a rom-com montage, maybe your very own "Vows" column lede.
Actually, street harassment ranges from the generically irritating ("Hey, beautiful," "How about a smile?" and so on)—from one man or a group, on crowded and empty streets, in daylight and at night—to explicit critiques ("complimentary" and insulting) of pieces of our body, to statements or threats of what they'd like to do to us, to the abruptly grabbed or grazed butt, breast, or crotch on the subway (or at the Met, which once happened to me in a crowded gallery). Some street harassment is loud and from a distance, as with a construction worker. Some is very quiet; a man will walk past you and lean in to say something that, believe me, would make Archie faint. Homeless men do it; junkies and drunks do it; teenagers and old men do it too.
In the aggregate, as years and decades pass, these expressions of proprietary lust don't form a haze of paeans to our inspiring beauty. They're scary and depressing, and that's why we don't like "catcalls."
Actually, street harassment ranges from the generically irritating ("Hey, beautiful," "How about a smile?" and so on)—from one man or a group, on crowded and empty streets, in daylight and at night—to explicit critiques ("complimentary" and insulting) of pieces of our body, to statements or threats of what they'd like to do to us, to the abruptly grabbed or grazed butt, breast, or crotch on the subway (or at the Met, which once happened to me in a crowded gallery). Some street harassment is loud and from a distance, as with a construction worker. Some is very quiet; a man will walk past you and lean in to say something that, believe me, would make Archie faint. Homeless men do it; junkies and drunks do it; teenagers and old men do it too.
In the aggregate, as years and decades pass, these expressions of proprietary lust don't form a haze of paeans to our inspiring beauty. They're scary and depressing, and that's why we don't like "catcalls."
121
This is really a complaint against biology. A well written complaint, though. If female deer could write they would certainly complain about those damn bucks. Also deer would go extinct.
I'm into my fifties now, and my hormones have started receding, which leaves me a little more able to have empathy for women. At this rate, my gender tribalism will fade out sometime in my eighties.
It's interesting to read replies saying "you don't get it." Isn't that exactly the point? When we are attracted to someone, there is a whole lot we don't get. The wolf whistlers are not listening to you. Entire portions of the mind are shushed. But with bucks and does, at least that only happens during part of the year.
I'm into my fifties now, and my hormones have started receding, which leaves me a little more able to have empathy for women. At this rate, my gender tribalism will fade out sometime in my eighties.
It's interesting to read replies saying "you don't get it." Isn't that exactly the point? When we are attracted to someone, there is a whole lot we don't get. The wolf whistlers are not listening to you. Entire portions of the mind are shushed. But with bucks and does, at least that only happens during part of the year.
4
Dear James Bach: the price for living in material comfort and civilization is allowing and even encouraging lots of so-called "urges" recede so as not to offend the other human beings with whom you share the world.
Perhaps you think you're being honest by admitting your hormones are receding, but the female species (or any other human) deserves a life free of harassment from "bucks". Shame on you for thinking mindlessness excuses the catcalling and assaults! And shame on the people in charge of rearing these despicable, hateful perpetrators of harassment.
Aren't you related to or know any girls or women, for God's sake?
Perhaps you think you're being honest by admitting your hormones are receding, but the female species (or any other human) deserves a life free of harassment from "bucks". Shame on you for thinking mindlessness excuses the catcalling and assaults! And shame on the people in charge of rearing these despicable, hateful perpetrators of harassment.
Aren't you related to or know any girls or women, for God's sake?
113
TL;DR: Boys Will Be Boys??
Pathetic.
Pathetic.
92
"Nature, Mr. Allnut, is what we are put in this world to rise above."
71
Heather Burtman is an extraordinary writer, and describes this phenomenon eloquently. Thank you, Ms. Burtman. I hope to read more of your work.
80
I wish there is photo of her, Author.
4
Author's point, made.
214
It's appalling that several of the male commenters here just don't get it. Catcalls, unwanted comments, creepy actions such as invading a woman's space are NOT - repeat NOT - "complimentary." And any touching by strangers is assault - period!
These are crude assertions of aggression, power, and attempts at intimidation.
NO woman appreciates this! If you're a man, and you do this, we think you're crude oafs - or predators - or just plain losers.
As many of the women writing here describe, I also began feeling like "prey" when I was about 11.
Growing up in NYC, I never felt shy about saying "leave me alone" or even screaming at the top of my lungs when I felt threatened. But that made it no less an ordeal to travel on the subway - or just walk down the street.
Now that I'm older, I enjoy the freedom to go wherever without attracting attention - at least, for the most part. In warm weather, without extra layers of clothes, I still get some stares at my body and pervy comments. (I think they don't bother to look at my face.) And occasionally, the unwanted attention or intense stare by a lone creep.
Men, if you're doing this, STOP IT! And if you still don't understand why, or you don't understand the difference between flirting and offensive or predatory behavior, re-read this article and the comments by women.
These are crude assertions of aggression, power, and attempts at intimidation.
NO woman appreciates this! If you're a man, and you do this, we think you're crude oafs - or predators - or just plain losers.
As many of the women writing here describe, I also began feeling like "prey" when I was about 11.
Growing up in NYC, I never felt shy about saying "leave me alone" or even screaming at the top of my lungs when I felt threatened. But that made it no less an ordeal to travel on the subway - or just walk down the street.
Now that I'm older, I enjoy the freedom to go wherever without attracting attention - at least, for the most part. In warm weather, without extra layers of clothes, I still get some stares at my body and pervy comments. (I think they don't bother to look at my face.) And occasionally, the unwanted attention or intense stare by a lone creep.
Men, if you're doing this, STOP IT! And if you still don't understand why, or you don't understand the difference between flirting and offensive or predatory behavior, re-read this article and the comments by women.
169
I would say we men touch women too little & too fearfully.
This past Friday I met a woman on a date in Kangnam. The way she got much closer to me than is usual, getting into my space, as we sat together was a clear sign of desire - for something. My failure was to touch her too little and too hesitantly, just making her if anything, uncomfortable.
She told me how she had told her employees she was going on a date tonight. They remarked how unusual that was, her taking a break from 15 hour days. Yet the evening ended with a pathetic "Nice to have met you." parting. Due in large part to my diffident respect for her space.
Then at a crossing near home I asked a blonde in denim shorts "Where are you from?" She was immediately talkative, indicating she was a Russian visiting a girl friend in Seoul. This woman too got in my space as we walked along, as if she wanted to be touched or held in some way. Her words too, right up to telling me "I'm a little bit drunk now."
Again it was only my delay and diffidence in running my hand up her arm and whispering in her ear would she like to come with me that made her draw away and say (without fear), "No. I must go."
The writer's problem seems to be a kind of "manphobia".; a manphobia that doesn't seem to the norm or a problem for women I encounter.
Both interactions could've been more positive and more what the women had in mind, but for my beta male cuck nervousness and fear of a possible adverse reaction to my touch (and words).
This past Friday I met a woman on a date in Kangnam. The way she got much closer to me than is usual, getting into my space, as we sat together was a clear sign of desire - for something. My failure was to touch her too little and too hesitantly, just making her if anything, uncomfortable.
She told me how she had told her employees she was going on a date tonight. They remarked how unusual that was, her taking a break from 15 hour days. Yet the evening ended with a pathetic "Nice to have met you." parting. Due in large part to my diffident respect for her space.
Then at a crossing near home I asked a blonde in denim shorts "Where are you from?" She was immediately talkative, indicating she was a Russian visiting a girl friend in Seoul. This woman too got in my space as we walked along, as if she wanted to be touched or held in some way. Her words too, right up to telling me "I'm a little bit drunk now."
Again it was only my delay and diffidence in running my hand up her arm and whispering in her ear would she like to come with me that made her draw away and say (without fear), "No. I must go."
The writer's problem seems to be a kind of "manphobia".; a manphobia that doesn't seem to the norm or a problem for women I encounter.
Both interactions could've been more positive and more what the women had in mind, but for my beta male cuck nervousness and fear of a possible adverse reaction to my touch (and words).
9
Cato's comment is a perfect example of what I mean - does not know the difference between consensual interactions between men and women - and the non-consensual harassment women are subject to every day of their lives from ages 10-12 to 60+.
Cato, your first example is a DATE - not a stranger on the street. Your second example is a woman who's drunk. (If either story is even real.)
Bothering a woman on the street is inappropriate - continuing to try to talk to her or follow her or make comments is HARASSMENT.
Touching a stranger uninvited is ASSAULT.
Cato, your first example is a DATE - not a stranger on the street. Your second example is a woman who's drunk. (If either story is even real.)
Bothering a woman on the street is inappropriate - continuing to try to talk to her or follow her or make comments is HARASSMENT.
Touching a stranger uninvited is ASSAULT.
145
Did you ever consider using words to express your interest in your date, and allow her to speak rather than send you imaginary signals?
94
I am now 49 and mostly invisible to these men. That is a relief. I remember being young and the discomfort of living in your own skin. I was an athlete, one of seven girls, voted most likely to succeed by my classmates, but out in the world I was a judged by the size of my breasts and the curve of my behind. As women we are taught to fear the aging process, but it has it's benefits.
120
It's the old saying: men worry women will laugh at them; women worry men will kill them.
267
The strange thing is, I've found suddenly that all of that ends once you reach a certain age. I used to have all of what Heather writes happen to her happen to me often - grabbing, yelling, whistling... even things I'm pretty sure I could have pressed charges on. It made me so angry. But now that I'm in my 50s, I realize no one has said a word to me, or even looked at me, for about 5 years. My body is back.
77
I came here to write the exact same thing. I think my move from NY to LA helped too; true to stereotype, I do way less walking.
But as a 20-something in NY, I was catcalled CONSTANTLY, in broad daylight, and it filled me with rage I've never experienced before or since.
Thank you for this beautiful, honest, defiant essay.
But as a 20-something in NY, I was catcalled CONSTANTLY, in broad daylight, and it filled me with rage I've never experienced before or since.
Thank you for this beautiful, honest, defiant essay.
67
I'm sorry to report that it doesn't end when you are no longer 24. People everywhere feel free to let you know how they feel about your body, and they think you will find this interesting. But I don't. I really, really, really don't. My body is mine, not yours.
52
Some women crave the attention, some fear it, depending on how they feel about their body at that given moment. And I'm talking about my wife.
3
No woman craves being regarded as nothing but a piece of meat. We're talking insults disguised as compliments. Ask your wife--I bet she'll tell you there's a big difference.
89
Why not let your wife speak for herself?
58
No woman wants a man to speak for her. Including your wife.
49
This is a beautiful essay, and perfectly captures this phenomenon. I wish I had read it when I was 16 and the world started to view my body in a way I wasn't ready to deal with yet.
My daughters are still little, still love being naked. I'm going to save this essay for them, for when they need it.
My daughters are still little, still love being naked. I'm going to save this essay for them, for when they need it.
66
The peril this woman is subjected to is terrifying to me. It is more and more difficult to find reasons to respect and consider men. I don't hate them - that would be self-defeating. But I don't respect them. And I'm afraid of all but a very few of them.
50
This is a great piece and an important topic. It’s unfortunate and enraging that we women have to endure this kind of thing, but to combat it, I highly recommend weight lifting. I’ve done it all my life, and I can tell you that there is nothing like the confidence you feel when you build muscle. Even though objectively, I know that an average man could take me down in a half a second (I’m a petite 54-year-old woman), the internal feeling of strength and toughness is something that I automatically project. It just commands respect. In my head, I’m like, ‘FEAR ME FOR I AM THE THUNDER GODDESS.” I realize that it’s possible that I’ve just been lucky, or that in fact, men don’t find me attractive enough to catcall and hit on and I’m just delusional about myself, but I do think that my general aura projects “TOUCH ME AND DIE,” and I attribute that in large part to my strength training regimen. It’s always reassuring to know that you can back up your car key strategy with some upper body force.
52
>men don’t find me attractive enough to catcall
Argh. This is not about attractiveness, but female vs. male power. It's sound advice, to prepare yourself physically for the onslaught of harassment that begins, often around puberty, but I believe this discussion is more salient when focused on the fact of the harassment, and not on how the victims can psyche themselves and thunder-goddess through it all.
This story is about young women as a commodity to men, and how these men like it that way. Even if you are in an overcoat and carrying a houseplant, if you are young or otherwise vulnerable (e.g., walking alone while female), you are a perfect target for harassment. It's about owning someone else, even for a moment. Preferably young and easy to intimidate, thus useful for the male need to leverage their entitlement, privilege—power—over a woman.
I suspect some of these men feel little power in other parts of their lives, so they steal it where they can.
Argh. This is not about attractiveness, but female vs. male power. It's sound advice, to prepare yourself physically for the onslaught of harassment that begins, often around puberty, but I believe this discussion is more salient when focused on the fact of the harassment, and not on how the victims can psyche themselves and thunder-goddess through it all.
This story is about young women as a commodity to men, and how these men like it that way. Even if you are in an overcoat and carrying a houseplant, if you are young or otherwise vulnerable (e.g., walking alone while female), you are a perfect target for harassment. It's about owning someone else, even for a moment. Preferably young and easy to intimidate, thus useful for the male need to leverage their entitlement, privilege—power—over a woman.
I suspect some of these men feel little power in other parts of their lives, so they steal it where they can.
58
This is something that men don't understand. All women have that moment when they were made to feel uncomfortable by a leering man for the first time. Men learn as boys that the behavior is perfectly acceptable. Ignore them and they label you as cold and see you as a challenge. Embrace the attention and you must be a slut. Women have to try to find the middle ground.
Wouldn't it be nice if men were taught to treat us with respect. But that's just a dream that will never happen. Instead we're made to feel ashamed of our bodies. When a woman is raped we focus on what she was wearing and if she's been drinking. Seldom is the man judged to be the barbarian that he is.
Thanks for so perfectly describing what it feels like to be a young woman with curves.
Wouldn't it be nice if men were taught to treat us with respect. But that's just a dream that will never happen. Instead we're made to feel ashamed of our bodies. When a woman is raped we focus on what she was wearing and if she's been drinking. Seldom is the man judged to be the barbarian that he is.
Thanks for so perfectly describing what it feels like to be a young woman with curves.
87
You will notice when you are 45 that the comments and the looks stop. It will be a relief. The breasts will still be there, but they won't notice them. It will be a relief.
We have such a long way to go in this country in teaching men how to behave around beautiful women. It is very sad that we have the man we have in the White House who thinks it's fine and dandy for him to grab women's private parts and barge into dressing rooms full of young women.
Thank you for your honest and well-written article. Only those who have been in your situation truly understand how awful it is. Be brave, like your mother said. Do not be polite. Be cold. Be aloof. And stay away from any man who even looks remotely suspicious. Cross the street and don't smile, ever.
We have such a long way to go in this country in teaching men how to behave around beautiful women. It is very sad that we have the man we have in the White House who thinks it's fine and dandy for him to grab women's private parts and barge into dressing rooms full of young women.
Thank you for your honest and well-written article. Only those who have been in your situation truly understand how awful it is. Be brave, like your mother said. Do not be polite. Be cold. Be aloof. And stay away from any man who even looks remotely suspicious. Cross the street and don't smile, ever.
58
I hope that women stay alert and aware, though, even when they are less harassed because of their youthful attractiveness. There are assailants that care nothing for those traits in particular who assault women because of opportunity alone. It really is, for such as they, about power, not sexual attraction. A case in my city a couple of weeks ago was of a woman who is 85 years old, raped by two teenage boys.
33
>We have such a long way to go in this country in teaching men how to behave around beautiful women.
This is part of the problem. It is important to understand that it's "women", minus the beautiful part. This happens to women, young and older, sans subjective "beauty." We must be very careful not to mistake the attention as a comment on beauty or physical attractiveness, as it supports the idiotic notion that this harassment is somehow complimentary, or directly related to hotness of the victim.
This is part of the problem. It is important to understand that it's "women", minus the beautiful part. This happens to women, young and older, sans subjective "beauty." We must be very careful not to mistake the attention as a comment on beauty or physical attractiveness, as it supports the idiotic notion that this harassment is somehow complimentary, or directly related to hotness of the victim.
44
The only benefit of age that I have detected here in my later years is that men do not hassle 66 year old women!
29
I have been catcalled and told to smile many times and each time I have cringed. I have also been approached by strangers (men and women) when off to a party and dressed up to tell me "you look beautiful - I hope you have a lovely evening wherever it is you're going". The former made me feel uncomfortable, threatened and angry; the latter made me smile. How do you know the difference? Instinct. When someone gives a genuine compliment it is felt by the recipient. When it is an obvious power play to make the other person feel small and powerless it is also obvious. Frankly it is all about intent and we as women definitely know what yours is.
70
Heather: You should check out any of the AANR approved family resorts located near where your live. You can enjoy yourself and your body with anybody you like and any body you have. It's a truly no-body-shaming environment.
3
This isn't about body shaming. It's about ogling. The fact that you made that mistake says something about how you processed the story. Think about it
68
Beautiful writing. This captures it perfectly.
29
When men comment, stare, notice me, I am pleased. I feel powerful. I smile confidently back, and I know I'm the one in control.
8
That kind of "I'm a stronger woman than the rest of you--and besides, men constantly commenting on our bodies is really flattery" oneupmanship doesn't address the issue here. What the author is writing about aren't compliments--it's entitlement and contempt towards women.
126
Ick.
46
Not all women share that feeling. Respect them & their feelings
25
I understand how hard this must be for you. As a man I often have similar experiences but women tend to be more subtle. As a surgeon I work at a number of different hospitals and I am exposed to a lot of different women regularly. Women will often ask if I am married or if I will take them somewhere or even just for a ride in one of my planes. They say things like "Oh, if I was 10 years younger...." or "Wow, your wife is one lucky woman" (maybe I shouldn't assume that it is a form of harassment, maybe they are referring to our frequent vacations or things that we have). Where does it end?
14
You don't get it.
55
You must be joking.
42
I do not think you can compare polite women being too forward. to a physcially large man in the street who you don't know what he'll do. Or the man in the car in this peice. This goes beyond a few annoying comments to fear for your safety.
72
I told the boys to look away. My body is not theirs, it is my own. I told my spouse it is my own and we lived side by side. I told my children my body is still my own and they hungered. And then Mother Nature came to tell me we are one and I could not refuse. In my wake boys, men, and children sought warmth from beyond and only then did I understand.
14
Uh, no. Your apparent idea that a woman is an edible to be devoured by others is absurd. The sharing of love is one thing, and choosing to love a spouse, lover, and children is in a woman's life when she goes in those directions. She is not a thing to resist, to be eaten anyway, and "then understand". The message of this article is addressed to men outside those relationships, as you know if you read it, and this kind of faux-romantic musing is not in the least apropos.
165
Broaden your circle? The "others" you speak of and reflected by the author lack...something. Their misplaced musing could be calmed by love if offered. If love received (broadly), fewer cat calls all around. Separately, it is silly to suggest these lines imply the devouring of anyone. Far too harsh a word...devour. It is true that we all return to the earth. And it is true that we are connected to all we see and touch as we pass through this life. Consider it a call to love more. It is in no way meant as you have characterized.
1
What on earth are you talking about?
71
I feel your pain and know where you are at. I have all these stories and more. At the age of 53 I had breast reduction surgery. At last I was free. I could enjoy my life on my terms, not be round shouldered, arms across my chest, wearing a sweater over a summer top when it was humid and hot, always aware of men and their attentions. Life is to be enjoyed , not ogled and made to feel you are somehow responsible for all the attention you get for something that has nothing what so ever to do with your worth. The nicest part was that I breastfed two beautiful babies who turned into beautiful young adults.....indeed they do serve a purpose. Wait, breastfeed and then if you want restructure your body if that is something YOU DESIRE. Lots of sunshine, love and happiness......
42
I had mine reduced at 25, best thing I did. same thing back problems etc.
19
Very impressive writing from one as young as 24. I am sad to learn that things are not better than when I was young.
106
I understand almost everything that you share in this essay.I was blessed because i didnot have much breast to show so i dont have the problem in which men get to see you as a piece of meat exactly but in any case when I was in the university I was rape by a man who share the class with me.It was so depressing and i was so scare because i was not living in my native country i barely knew people from here and I didnot said anything to the police besides he didnot rape me like normally a rapist do he went fast and try to sofocate me which i did.This guy is still at large and he is time bombing.
I hope life gets better for you as did my life.God bless you for sharing.
I hope life gets better for you as did my life.God bless you for sharing.
69
Roxana! I am so sorry you went through that, and still are. Please! find a therapist you can talk with about this who specializes in this issue, maybe also a therapy group. Needing therapy after a sexual assault is normal.
41
Roxana, I am so sorry this happened to you. That man was a despicable criminal. I hope it helps to know that someone, even a stranger, cares about you.
40
I was 10 years old with the body of a supermodel. That was my age when I first escaped rape. From 10 to 15 I was groped, had older men rub their erections on me on the bus, was called a teaser for looking good on basically any ill fitting clothes I'd wear. It stopped when I gained 40 lbs due to hormonal imbalance.
For me, the key to physical safety was to become unappealing. Beauty is overrated. It's a liability.
For me, the key to physical safety was to become unappealing. Beauty is overrated. It's a liability.
19
I remember men hounding me when I was wearing no makeup and baggy clothes. I remember men hounding me when it was 20 degrees out and I was stuffed into a parka. It had nothing to do with what I wore.
I remember being a start student in my school - until I became the first girl in the seventh grade to "develop." Unending sexual harassment. All the boys saw were my breasts. I ceased to exist as a person.
I remember being a start student in my school - until I became the first girl in the seventh grade to "develop." Unending sexual harassment. All the boys saw were my breasts. I ceased to exist as a person.
151
The first time I was catcalled was when I was walking across a farm field to take my dad his lunch in Indiana. Way out in the country. A carload of men/boys drove by honking & yelling at my developing 12-year-old body. My mom heard from the house, told me I needed "to be careful" as if it were my fault & never let me walk over to my dad again, I learned my body was powerful, distasteful, capable of making men act crassly in public. I completely understand this article. Most women do. Fifty years later, that event still makes me feel dirty and all I had done was develop breasts.
187
nature surprises us all - naked is fun when you're a kid - pity it becomes taboo when you're older - but there is hope - whole beaches in France - the Englischer Garten in Munich Bavaria - at least when I was there - perhaps before the Chinese tour groups with telephoto lenses.
boys are cute when they're tiny - they get bigger - their voice cracks - they get awkward and testosterone surges - they're driven with desire for those pretty girls - but paralysed with uncertainty - when they approach, girls titter and laugh, the boy turns tail - humiliated - or was that the girl's awkwardness ?
and so it goes - as it was, is now and ever shall be - world without end - amen.
boys are cute when they're tiny - they get bigger - their voice cracks - they get awkward and testosterone surges - they're driven with desire for those pretty girls - but paralysed with uncertainty - when they approach, girls titter and laugh, the boy turns tail - humiliated - or was that the girl's awkwardness ?
and so it goes - as it was, is now and ever shall be - world without end - amen.
9
The truth is, nude and topless sunbathing is declining in Europe, and not due to a sudden resurgence of modesty. The problem isn't Chinese tourists with telephoto lenses, it's jerks with cell-phone cameras 15 feet away. It's one thing to go nude with friends or in the anonymity of a nude beach. It is quite another thing to worry that your image will be on the Internet by the time you drive home.
44
Don't make this about breast size. It's got nothing to do with breast size. Whatever a woman or girl looks like or has a face like or breasts like or is thin or heavy or short or tall or blond or brunette or whatever race there will always be some man or boy who will harass you. I'm amazed at the number of people watching the Handmaid's Tale saying they don't get it.
99
Beautiful story. A keeper. But predation isn't confined only to sexual presentation. Neanderthals who violate women violate other men, too. It's just not a safe world out there. Being a nice, sweet person doesn't guarantee safety, security or dignified treatment. It's sad.
It should be possible for nice people to blow about through life like rose petals. The truth is that it's necessary to toughen up, to harden up. The most beautiful thing in the world is other people. The most dangerous thing in the world is other people. After a while expecting trouble becomes second nature. At least all that the predators want is your body, your money and your self respect. They wouldn't have a clue of what to do with your soul.
It should be possible for nice people to blow about through life like rose petals. The truth is that it's necessary to toughen up, to harden up. The most beautiful thing in the world is other people. The most dangerous thing in the world is other people. After a while expecting trouble becomes second nature. At least all that the predators want is your body, your money and your self respect. They wouldn't have a clue of what to do with your soul.
6
There are some of us that always felt our bodies were our own alright, but we never seemed to like them as we wanted. I wonder if that is troubling too, looking back on it.
My thighs were chubby. I had "friends" that called me "Fats" when tormenting hit the moment. I even had an orthopedic surgeon that told me (@115#) when I was a sophomore "if you don't watch your figure, no one else will!"
Seriously. I had fractured my femur from a terrible fall. I guess even doctors felt they had the right to say stuff like that in the day.
After dieting and losing weight as I got older (more than the 115# as an adult) people would comment how great I looked, having shed some pounds. It was almost insulting. Oh, how horrible I must have looked before?
Fact is, Heather, our bodies are our own. And they're no one else's darn business. How ignorant people are, making comments about someone else's body!
One thing though, maybe because I was teased, I feel I might be a kinder person. I have been a nurse for many years. I've taken care of people from all walks of lives, all ages, all ethnic groups, and yes people with every type of body. As a nurse, types of bodies, able or disabled, whatever size, large or small, we hope to be a pretty non judgemental group. I would say most of us sincerely just plain care.
And perhaps it helps us shrug off the jerks that think they have the right to judge and ridicule. We've got better things to do than listen.
Your essay is beautiful.
My thighs were chubby. I had "friends" that called me "Fats" when tormenting hit the moment. I even had an orthopedic surgeon that told me (@115#) when I was a sophomore "if you don't watch your figure, no one else will!"
Seriously. I had fractured my femur from a terrible fall. I guess even doctors felt they had the right to say stuff like that in the day.
After dieting and losing weight as I got older (more than the 115# as an adult) people would comment how great I looked, having shed some pounds. It was almost insulting. Oh, how horrible I must have looked before?
Fact is, Heather, our bodies are our own. And they're no one else's darn business. How ignorant people are, making comments about someone else's body!
One thing though, maybe because I was teased, I feel I might be a kinder person. I have been a nurse for many years. I've taken care of people from all walks of lives, all ages, all ethnic groups, and yes people with every type of body. As a nurse, types of bodies, able or disabled, whatever size, large or small, we hope to be a pretty non judgemental group. I would say most of us sincerely just plain care.
And perhaps it helps us shrug off the jerks that think they have the right to judge and ridicule. We've got better things to do than listen.
Your essay is beautiful.
56
Heather Burtman, I feel your pain and have lived it as well. Here's the good news, it's gets better as you get older. The bad news is that it will probably never completely go away.
I remember when I turned 30 and my first pregnancy was obvious to the world. That's when men on the street began to treat me with respect for the first time in my adult life. Their smile was not a come-on, they opened the door for me and oh my gosh, they were nice. It felt so good, I just had to laugh...
I'm now 61 and just a few days ago I got creeped on while working out at the YMCA during my aquatics aerobics class. The predator was on the far opposite side of the pool, but I swear I could feel it the second he looked over and decided to make the trek across the entire length of the pool to invade my space and chat me up. I was furious. What did I do? Smiled. Answered his stupid questions and tried not to let the fire in my gut consume me from the inside out.
It is nice to imagine that all the male predators in this life will come back in their next life as a donkey owned by large groups of women who will ride them hard every day of their very, very long life.
I remember when I turned 30 and my first pregnancy was obvious to the world. That's when men on the street began to treat me with respect for the first time in my adult life. Their smile was not a come-on, they opened the door for me and oh my gosh, they were nice. It felt so good, I just had to laugh...
I'm now 61 and just a few days ago I got creeped on while working out at the YMCA during my aquatics aerobics class. The predator was on the far opposite side of the pool, but I swear I could feel it the second he looked over and decided to make the trek across the entire length of the pool to invade my space and chat me up. I was furious. What did I do? Smiled. Answered his stupid questions and tried not to let the fire in my gut consume me from the inside out.
It is nice to imagine that all the male predators in this life will come back in their next life as a donkey owned by large groups of women who will ride them hard every day of their very, very long life.
77
Beth
:) you made me so smile!
There is another name for donkeys. JA. That fits the bill!
Yes, getting older does give us freedom in so many ways.
MIMA
:) you made me so smile!
There is another name for donkeys. JA. That fits the bill!
Yes, getting older does give us freedom in so many ways.
MIMA
13
The animal analogy is sad. Think about how most all domestic animals are treated exactly as commodities to be exploited.....pretty much the point of this piece about how a pretty young woman is made to feel.
15
I personally like girls who are witty and smart, and not so well endowed but shapely.
6
You don't get it, either.
95
This essay is not about what you find attractive.
69
Thank you for your essay which reminded me of how it used to be when I was 13 or so. Having big breasts at that age was and still is a nightmare. I remember sitting in class and the boys would try to "cop a feel" whenever they could. They would also try to get under my skirt. Back in those days pants were not permitted in school so it was always skirts or dresses. I hated my body then as a 13 y/o and don't feel much better about it now as a 66 y/o.
37
I was ten when the catcalling started. I hadn't even bought my first training bra, and had the face of a child. It didn't stop grown men from leaning out their car windows to tell me all the lewd things they wanted to do to me. I was so young I didn't even understand most of what they said.
The next year the groping started. First it was just the high-school boys on my school bus, trying to shove their hands down my shirt or into my pants. My breasts developed faster than the other girls, and middle school bullies used them to torment me. The teachers and administrators watched and did nothing. When I complained, they suggested it was my fault and that I should wear less revealing clothes. So I covered myself in oversized t-shirts and baggy jeans, but that was no obstacle to the boys who sought to snap my bra or pinch my nipples.
It's been more than two decades since then, and the harassment never stopped - not when I got married, not even at nine months pregnant. All I can do is raise my son to treat women as people rather than objects, and hope my daughter never feels the helpless hopelessness I've never escaped.
The next year the groping started. First it was just the high-school boys on my school bus, trying to shove their hands down my shirt or into my pants. My breasts developed faster than the other girls, and middle school bullies used them to torment me. The teachers and administrators watched and did nothing. When I complained, they suggested it was my fault and that I should wear less revealing clothes. So I covered myself in oversized t-shirts and baggy jeans, but that was no obstacle to the boys who sought to snap my bra or pinch my nipples.
It's been more than two decades since then, and the harassment never stopped - not when I got married, not even at nine months pregnant. All I can do is raise my son to treat women as people rather than objects, and hope my daughter never feels the helpless hopelessness I've never escaped.
102
Thank you for the comment about how you raise your son. I was one of three girls in the family and my only child is a daughter. I think it all begins with 'boys will be boys', providing an excuse for all sorts of behaviors. Teach your children well.
45
Beautiful written and yes sadly true. So many woman get relate to this. My good friend was in the same situation and had breast reduction surgery one summer. She didn't tell her boyfiriend. Didn't ask her friends what we thought. She made a decision and followed through. She went crazy at the Victoria Secret Bra sale later that summer. She became more confident. Insurance even paid for the surger. She hined in her new string bikinis. When my elderly Grandma heard the story. She said "I wish they had that when I was young" I am not saying to do this. God made each one of us special. Be strong! And continue to Love yourself!
14
Speaking for myself, it's difficult not to privately objectify the bodies of women whom I don't know, and equally hard to objectify those of whom I do.
I never accosted strangers in the street and it took no energy not to. But I've had to work at not staring, and it takes a tremendous amount of energy. There's an art to it, ways to eye people respectfully. I haven't mastered it but...keep trying.
It seems the issue is the harassment part. It's like any prejudice - it doesn't really matter to anyone else what our private thoughts and feelings are; it matters what we say and do. I think most men, in America anyway, consider males that speak disrespectfully to females in the ways described in this piece to be idiots.
Occasionally, I've been compelled to apologize on behalf of my gender to women in the street being humiliated by said idiots. Let me take this moment to extend the same apology to Heather Burtman.
I never accosted strangers in the street and it took no energy not to. But I've had to work at not staring, and it takes a tremendous amount of energy. There's an art to it, ways to eye people respectfully. I haven't mastered it but...keep trying.
It seems the issue is the harassment part. It's like any prejudice - it doesn't really matter to anyone else what our private thoughts and feelings are; it matters what we say and do. I think most men, in America anyway, consider males that speak disrespectfully to females in the ways described in this piece to be idiots.
Occasionally, I've been compelled to apologize on behalf of my gender to women in the street being humiliated by said idiots. Let me take this moment to extend the same apology to Heather Burtman.
58
A friend of mine, in a conversation following the Trump tape about grabbing women's private parts, told me how that happened to her when she was 21 in her first "serious" job. Between the second and third floor, she said, a man she didn't know in a suit and tie took the occasion to grab her between the legs, jabbing upward with fingers rigid. "He wanted to hurt me," she said, "his face was twisted with hate." She wanted it clear that.men doing this mean to hurt, shame, frighten and demoralize the woman they do it to. It struck me that here was a professional woman in her sixties, and she remembered every second even now. It angers me that when a woman looks at men, she must wonder if we'd do something like this if we had a chance because of sickos like that, and the president of my country, too. Galling, really.
117
Can we hear from women who feel that no one notices them, that they are invisible, that they do not exist., that they're totally unattractive.
15
Obviously, Gene, you don't get what this article is about. It's not about a woman being "attractive" or "unattractive" - it's about men who feel they have a right to comment on or harass any female any time - regardless of how the woman or girl feels.
74
Why do you want that?
31
Obviously you're not reading the comments - many women writing here have described the relief they have when they 'age out' of harassment.
31
This is what happens to a lot of women. Don't grab me when I'm shopping for shampoo at Target at 3PM. Don't follow me into the women's restroom. I used to yell at these animals. But these days I turn around and stare them down. I adopted this technique from watching how my dog puts other dogs in their place. Fearful dogs, they look away and leave. Every last one of them.
21
This states exactly what I went through in my 20s through my 30s- my body was not my body
My feature was my legs- the comments were endless from women and men - very similar to what you described
I am teaching my daughters to be strong willed but they will still face this intrusion/sexual harassment
I too remember being naked like you described- the freedom on a farm in CO when we would we would all be naked and there was no sex- we would set up the wood burning stove for a bath or run through the open fields or be in a creek
Stay strong- we women will take society away from the objectification of our girls
Thank you
My feature was my legs- the comments were endless from women and men - very similar to what you described
I am teaching my daughters to be strong willed but they will still face this intrusion/sexual harassment
I too remember being naked like you described- the freedom on a farm in CO when we would we would all be naked and there was no sex- we would set up the wood burning stove for a bath or run through the open fields or be in a creek
Stay strong- we women will take society away from the objectification of our girls
Thank you
24
I wish she had gone a little more into what's behind the men's behavior. No, it is not sex. It is all about power. It is about the ability to diminish. It is about intimidation. When a construction worker asks a woman passing by to smile, it is not because he wants to see her teeth. It is to control her.
There is no proper way to react. You cannot undo the damage. You can only keep walking. But the guy who harassed you always wins. If you smile, if you run away, if you respond. To be honest, it would be nice if you could just hit him and hurt him. That's how I felt as an engineer working in construction.
The most important thing is that woman not blame herself for the harassment. Not much different from rape, although far less serious, these actions hurt in so many ways. Women internalize the incessant intimidation and it changes them. There is no such thing as ignoring. That doesn't make it go away.
As long as men dominate in the workplace, in the home, in the country, this will go on.
There is no proper way to react. You cannot undo the damage. You can only keep walking. But the guy who harassed you always wins. If you smile, if you run away, if you respond. To be honest, it would be nice if you could just hit him and hurt him. That's how I felt as an engineer working in construction.
The most important thing is that woman not blame herself for the harassment. Not much different from rape, although far less serious, these actions hurt in so many ways. Women internalize the incessant intimidation and it changes them. There is no such thing as ignoring. That doesn't make it go away.
As long as men dominate in the workplace, in the home, in the country, this will go on.
84
I don't think that hitting a man for harassing a woman is the way to go. But speaking up, calling on him, educating him might work.
1
I had to take buses to work in l.a. for ten years. I had to develop a certain path,to avoid the yellers,those who tried to touch,those who got too close. If I felt safe enough, I would yell back while wallking,but never stopped. I never smiled, which really angered some men. Finally I got a job away from l.a., and carpool to work. Women should not have to tolerate this, and men should not be allowed tondo this to women.
53
It's not always about come-ons or catcalls. While I was walking across the street, two men threw me to the ground and took my handbag with its bounty of $5. I was young at the time, perhaps attractive, but these guys didn't care. Then there was the old man who, as I was slowly jogging up the street, hissed at me and opened his jacket to reveal a selection of knives. Was it a threat? He was probably a nutcase, no more than that. One night three young men came at me from different directions as I was standing in the street near my house. I ran and looked for a cop. The boys disappeared up the alley.
Old, young, pretty or not, we are all targets.
Old, young, pretty or not, we are all targets.
51
Ignorance begets ignorance. The jealous reaction of the bra-fitter, as much as the guy yelling from the car: the many who feel so needy, spew it upon on the few who appear to "have it all" ... and the former go get pregnant together. I too must apologize, not only for my past mistakes, but also for the ones I will likely make despite my struggles to do better. I write this only to say I believe this behavior exists because parents don't raise children to take responsibility for their own emotional maturity. They can't convey what they don't already know or have; in fact, they never realized it for themselves ... They were ignorant.
7
Your body doesn't belong to you anymore but it owns these male animals' emotional territory!
5
And your point is?
8
There are a lot of implicit assumptions you make in this piece for how men are to behave, but why not come out and explicitly state what you think your perfect world would look like?
Obviously, eliminating creepy stalkers and gropers is a given, this would include The Groper in Chief—which we would all be thankful for, however, would you really want to eliminate male desire, as it is today, in total?
I think this is a fair question because one of the solutions to this problem is to somehow train men at an early age to suppress their incessant and inexorable brain-stem impulses to look at beautiful women and have women be the aggressors in the male-female mating dynamic.
Think about it: men walking down the street eyes forward, never looking at you, not stalking you from behind, no more catcalling, no more groping on the dance floor. And if you think a man is attractive, you walk up to him in a public place, introduce yourself and see where it goes.
Obviously, eliminating creepy stalkers and gropers is a given, this would include The Groper in Chief—which we would all be thankful for, however, would you really want to eliminate male desire, as it is today, in total?
I think this is a fair question because one of the solutions to this problem is to somehow train men at an early age to suppress their incessant and inexorable brain-stem impulses to look at beautiful women and have women be the aggressors in the male-female mating dynamic.
Think about it: men walking down the street eyes forward, never looking at you, not stalking you from behind, no more catcalling, no more groping on the dance floor. And if you think a man is attractive, you walk up to him in a public place, introduce yourself and see where it goes.
9
This is a straw man argument, a fallacious one. It refuses to take honestly what's being said by the author here. Men don't have to keep their eyes forward, don't have to refuse to look at women--why would you think they do? What's being discussed here is men's yelling at women, touching women, pulling on women, including women they don't know at all. Looking at each other, speaking to each other, being civil--surely you are capable of those things now? Or is catcalling and stalking part of the world you don't want to give up for some reason?
52
It's not a straw man argument because a sexual advance is only defined as an unwanted sexual advance when one doesn't find the person desirable, if they are desirable it is a welcomed sexual advance. Since one doesn't know if they are desired until they make a move, it makes perfect sense that the type of behavior described in this article is as prevalent as it is, given how boorish men are, and therefore, one way to eliminate it is to get rid of all male sexual advances. Have the females do it. (Or you could get rid of men all together, or make them less boorish, but good luck with that.)
My point is: why do men have to be the ones to initiate sexual advances? If women did it most of these problems would go away. Is this not the raison d'être of the dating app Bumble?
My point is: why do men have to be the ones to initiate sexual advances? If women did it most of these problems would go away. Is this not the raison d'être of the dating app Bumble?
2
In pretty much every part of the world, women are objects. We are objectified, ogled, touched and grabbed against our will. Just imagine - 100 or so years ago, we were considered property.
I remember the first time a man stopped his car, backed it up, got out and walked up to me. He asked me to do something I hadn't even heard of, being 14. I somehow talked my way back to the street (he had backed me into someone's front yard), and ran all the way to the school bus stop. I told my mom about it when I got home that day. My normally sympathetic mother looked at me and shrugged. Shrugged! It was winter, and I had been wearing baggy pants and a thick coat - no one could claim I had been "asking for it." Years of weirdness followed - most outrageous to me was having guys plop down beside me in a movie theater, letting their fingers do the walking. Me: "Ummmm - Sherry? I think we need to move to different seats." Of course NOW I would shriek and punch him out. Call the manager, the police. Press charges.
Now I have a son. He has heard my stories and does not objectify, ogle, touch or grab. I am grateful for his thoughtful and kind spirit and I am grateful I survived being young in this culture.
I remember the first time a man stopped his car, backed it up, got out and walked up to me. He asked me to do something I hadn't even heard of, being 14. I somehow talked my way back to the street (he had backed me into someone's front yard), and ran all the way to the school bus stop. I told my mom about it when I got home that day. My normally sympathetic mother looked at me and shrugged. Shrugged! It was winter, and I had been wearing baggy pants and a thick coat - no one could claim I had been "asking for it." Years of weirdness followed - most outrageous to me was having guys plop down beside me in a movie theater, letting their fingers do the walking. Me: "Ummmm - Sherry? I think we need to move to different seats." Of course NOW I would shriek and punch him out. Call the manager, the police. Press charges.
Now I have a son. He has heard my stories and does not objectify, ogle, touch or grab. I am grateful for his thoughtful and kind spirit and I am grateful I survived being young in this culture.
55
I had similar experiences visiting Italy and Israel in the 1970s. Men are no different outside the US.
32
This sounds too much like a beautiful woman complaining about how nobody sees the real her beneath all the beauty. My advice, get over it! I have a friend who has a physical deformity which is visible to all. It's what people see first and what defines him to strangers. Now that's truly unfair.
Nobody is judged by their character, intelligence, or personality by passing strangers, but how the people you meet move beyond the first impression to the gold beneath identifies the keepers. Consider your 'problem' as a filter useful in eliminating losers.
Nobody is judged by their character, intelligence, or personality by passing strangers, but how the people you meet move beyond the first impression to the gold beneath identifies the keepers. Consider your 'problem' as a filter useful in eliminating losers.
9
This article isn't about "eliminating the losers", it is about feeling safe to move about the world. While I've never felt like my body belonged to anyone but me, I've spent the past 30 years since I hit puberty choosing alternate routes, crossing the street to avoid men, smiling and talking to absolutely awful male strangers to avoid the possibility of getting hurt; to being spit on and yelled at when I ignored a come on, being slapped on my bottom while at a stop light on my bicycle, being called nasty names when I don't want to dance with someone at a club, and so on. I feel extremely fortunate that I have never been the victim of a serious assault, and ache for women--and men--who have not been as fortunate. Despite these incidents, I do not consciously curtail my engagement with the world, but it is maddening to think about all of the energy I and most women waste on these--at this point--unconscious adjustments to our daily routines.
94
Did you even read the article? This isn't about how someone defines themselves or wants to be judged by others, but about the simple idea that no one should touch someone else without their permission, or that no stranger should ogle someone's body and make suggestive remarks, or follow someone down the street in a threatening way.
I'm thinking you've never had the experience of being afraid to walk down the street without being subject to verbal or physical harassment. This isn't about beauty - it's about basic human decency.
I'm thinking you've never had the experience of being afraid to walk down the street without being subject to verbal or physical harassment. This isn't about beauty - it's about basic human decency.
52
I'm sorry, xprintman, but your comment is disgusting and entirely misses the points of the essay. Whether or not a person is perceived by another to be "beautiful" does not give anyone the right to harass, assault, grab, insult, or judge that person. Far from being merely unwelcome and disrespectful advances, they are threatening and sometimes criminal acts that greatly diminish the victim's ability to lead a safe, unimpeded, and truly free life. Such acts cause more emotional and physical harm than you apparently realize. *Men* — not women — need to learn to "keep it in their pants."
46
There's a contradiction here. Have you ever surfed or strolled any of the sunny Southern California towns and beaches? You will encounter thousands of women of all ages dressed in mini thongs and often large indecipherable body tattoos. While I'm deeply concerned that ms burtman has been personally and offensively demeaned there appears to be a large group of women whom are comfortable with their bodies and themselves.
7
This essay has nothing to do with the way women are dressed. Catcalls and physical assaults happen regardless. Whether a woman is comfortable with her body and herself does not impact that she thinks being touched without her permission by some stranger on the street is wrong. There is also nothing in the essay that the author is not comfortable with her body or herself.
70
I was a teenager in the 70's, growing up in NYC. I wasn't beautiful just a teenage girl (Acup). I was grabbed on the subway, catcalled, followed and had a man expose himself. Walking down the street, I received unsolicited opinions on being to skinny, or not smiling when I got a "compliment". I had a friend who was well endowed, and for her the unwanted attention was relentless.
All this because we are women, and the men who who behaved this way felt they just could.
Thank you for this beautifully written story.
All this because we are women, and the men who who behaved this way felt they just could.
Thank you for this beautifully written story.
21
While checking out of a drugstore a few weeks ago, I spotted Cosmopolitan magazine. I'm a married woman, a senior. I knew it was primarily for young single women and I have granddaughters, so I added the magazine to my purchases. I sat down to read it when I got home. To my utter shock, there was an article "Make the First Date Hot"... it proceeded to explicitly advise young women on three different ways to give a guy oral sex. This was supposedly "empowering" the girls. Are women in danger? YOU BET THEY ARE. THEY'RE BEING CONNED BY OUR CULTURE.
55
Educating young people about sexual behavior - CONSENSUAL sexual behavior - can be an effective way to transmit information about boundaries and consent. (And seriously, Cosmo has had articles like that since it started publishing.)
14
No, it's not a compliment when you, a complete stranger, tell me that you like my body and reach out to touch me. I involuntarily smile because I want to get away without angering you; an angry man is a more aggressive man. Date raped in college long ago and, now, in my mid-50's still weaving away from roaming hands and ogling. Predatory young men become predatory old men. With my muscular 110 pound German Shepherd at my side, I can walk confidently knowing that no man will dare to approach me.
63
Problem is you're throwing out the baby with the bathwater. By projecting your fears onto ALL MEN, you also dissuade decent men from approaching you. It's your life, if you want to be alone, that's fine, but I hope you treat the people that are nice with some respect and don't let your dog attack everybody who looks at you.
Why, "dad", do you think that not handling, leering or sex-talking women's bodies whom you don't even know keeps you from decent friendship or love or contact with women? If this is what you think is necessary to that, it's you who will be alone. Nothing Diana said has anything to do with "all men". I don't find that hard to understand. Why do you?
31
Listen, Dad. Get off your high-horse and stop lecturing grown women. She's not "projecting" into "all men". Diana clearly stated that she's know her mid fifties, she likely knows that there are some reasonable men out there. You're trying to gaslight her. Gaslighting means to tell someone they're wrong by implying that they are crazy or are taking things to extremes unnecessarily--sound familiar? You're not concerned about her ending up be alone, and you're not worried about her letting her dog attack people. You don't like her tone. You don't like her saying no to interactions that aren't on her terms, and you want to feel self-righteous so that you can feel justified when you want to approach a woman. Because you want to feel that you are #notallmen, and a clear member of the Good Guy Club. No sympathy for your nonsense. You are part of the problem, Dad.
50
It is not men, generally, who do these things. It is some men. That's an important distinction. I am certain that to many women it seems that those who call out and say rude things and make sexually oriented comments represent all men at the time it happens.
Whether we approve of the concept or not, sexuality is still a matter of conquest, a matter of a male winning the cooperation of a female. To quote Donald Trump (sorry to bring him into this) "I can't believe what I'm getting," he wrote in regard to his involvement with super models. I suspect that men behaving badly in this way is an expression of powerlessness, of the male realizing that he has no chance for anything, not even a hello, with a passing woman but nonetheless wants to express some power over her. Intimidation and the momentary pleasure of an outward expression of male sexuality seem to be the goal.
As for the breast obsession of American males, how unfortunate. Generally, men have been conditioned to believe that breasts are some powerful symbol of sexuality instead of a way of feeding new born babies. Decades of photographic exposure and sexual propaganda have taken their toll. What other nation on planet earth has a restaurant chain dedicated to breasts?
Most men have never harassed women aside from the lingering, too long look. That doesn't make harassment easier, I know. Recently, however, the tables have been turned and men are often subjected to the direct, intrusive stare from women. Progress.
Whether we approve of the concept or not, sexuality is still a matter of conquest, a matter of a male winning the cooperation of a female. To quote Donald Trump (sorry to bring him into this) "I can't believe what I'm getting," he wrote in regard to his involvement with super models. I suspect that men behaving badly in this way is an expression of powerlessness, of the male realizing that he has no chance for anything, not even a hello, with a passing woman but nonetheless wants to express some power over her. Intimidation and the momentary pleasure of an outward expression of male sexuality seem to be the goal.
As for the breast obsession of American males, how unfortunate. Generally, men have been conditioned to believe that breasts are some powerful symbol of sexuality instead of a way of feeding new born babies. Decades of photographic exposure and sexual propaganda have taken their toll. What other nation on planet earth has a restaurant chain dedicated to breasts?
Most men have never harassed women aside from the lingering, too long look. That doesn't make harassment easier, I know. Recently, however, the tables have been turned and men are often subjected to the direct, intrusive stare from women. Progress.
11
M cup here. I remember that last shirtless day in the dirt vividly, when the neighbor boys informed me could no longer go shirtless. Being tackled and groped on the schoolbus. I'm nearly twice the author's age and it hasn't stopped yet
15
It doesn't matter if we have breasts or are flat, are curvy or thin, are fertile or sterile, are old or young. Many men see us as their playthings, their "Adam's Rib." Or perhaps it is that some men feel entitled to grab what they so wish (our recent election proved the futility of fighting that locker-room behavior).
I am blessed to be married to a man who is not predatory; yet he often dismisses what I say or what I produce. I've learned that it isn't his DNA - he was never acknowledged by his parents, who felt that a good man was a stoic worker who provided for his family. Had he been crude in his earlier teenaged years? Perhaps. I only met him as an adult and he'd long left boyish ways for finding his own way of being a true man.
We now have two teenaged sons who open doors for ladies, who are praised for modesty but also honesty and emotions and integrity. They need not misbehave to garner our attention. We have learned from our parents' mistakes though they haunt us. I am still fighting the loss of my personal voice, and struggling to overcome my inner critic who sounds a great deal like my mother. It is worthy to note that my mother, upon hearing that I was sexually pressured (assaulted?) at 14, stated that it was my fault because I should have known better. I wonder what she'd have thought of the harassment I endured from professors, clients, partners, colleagues. Sex should not be a weapon. I pray that someday we learn that.
I am blessed to be married to a man who is not predatory; yet he often dismisses what I say or what I produce. I've learned that it isn't his DNA - he was never acknowledged by his parents, who felt that a good man was a stoic worker who provided for his family. Had he been crude in his earlier teenaged years? Perhaps. I only met him as an adult and he'd long left boyish ways for finding his own way of being a true man.
We now have two teenaged sons who open doors for ladies, who are praised for modesty but also honesty and emotions and integrity. They need not misbehave to garner our attention. We have learned from our parents' mistakes though they haunt us. I am still fighting the loss of my personal voice, and struggling to overcome my inner critic who sounds a great deal like my mother. It is worthy to note that my mother, upon hearing that I was sexually pressured (assaulted?) at 14, stated that it was my fault because I should have known better. I wonder what she'd have thought of the harassment I endured from professors, clients, partners, colleagues. Sex should not be a weapon. I pray that someday we learn that.
25
In the 1970's in my public junior high school in the Bronx, girls figured out a way to navigate hallways and stairwells that posed a gauntlet of buttock and breast grabbing even though teachers tried to stand sentry during class change. A boy tried to rip off my shirt in a public stairwell while hundreds of students walked to their next class one day; my mom's semi-puritanical lessons to me about correct behavior were repressive but also provided a strong sense of self-autonomy about my body -- I went straight to the principal's office; the boy was suspended. On my college campus a construction worker on campus catcalled as I passed one day; immediately I walked to the registrar and filed a complaint. At work as a lawyer a male in a supervisory position acted inappropriately- I immediately took it to HR. But throughout in unprotected public and private spaces --from subways to fraternities- all without integrated structures for immediate reporting -- my female friends and I were ever-vigilant. I ended up as a public interest lawyer working for crime victims and DV victims and child abuse victims. As the mom of a son and daughter, I have tried to teach them both how to protect themselves and others. So far, so good, but I'm still ever-vigilant. Thanks for a beautiful and well-written essay that brought back so many memories and stiffened my resolve to keep moving forward proactively with education, advocacy, communication, as well as legal and legislative action.
64
Two things.
First, as biology designed things, our bodies are NOT our bodies, alone. Bearing children involves sharing one's body with another human being in the most intimate way possible. Ideally this is as the result of a conscious choice and decision, but regardless, your body is no longer your own. I know this isn't popular to say, but it's reality--it's the fate of being a (childbearing) woman.
Second, your body will return to being yours--a bit battered and worse the wear, but back to you--in 30 to 40 years or so. The leers and demands stop, the sense of agency returns.
Whether or not you think this is a good thing (I do) has to do with your attitude and perspectives, but be aware that your body becomes your own once again.
First, as biology designed things, our bodies are NOT our bodies, alone. Bearing children involves sharing one's body with another human being in the most intimate way possible. Ideally this is as the result of a conscious choice and decision, but regardless, your body is no longer your own. I know this isn't popular to say, but it's reality--it's the fate of being a (childbearing) woman.
Second, your body will return to being yours--a bit battered and worse the wear, but back to you--in 30 to 40 years or so. The leers and demands stop, the sense of agency returns.
Whether or not you think this is a good thing (I do) has to do with your attitude and perspectives, but be aware that your body becomes your own once again.
8
The catcalling misogyny is crude and needs to stop. However, saying "hi, what is your name??" is a courageous act for a man. Persistence is annoying but the only other option is a sad failure. We're biologically programmed to try our best to interact with a beautiful woman.
Although we're all very happy for the author that she was able to feel free splashing around in a pond a few summers ago, please just note that being a single man is difficult too and please don't be overly rough when immediately shutting him down.
Although we're all very happy for the author that she was able to feel free splashing around in a pond a few summers ago, please just note that being a single man is difficult too and please don't be overly rough when immediately shutting him down.
10
Women don't want to talk to or interact with strange men in public. That is not safe. If you want to meet women, join a group or activity and make friends first.
89
Catcalling, and strangers asking my name out in the street, are not attempts to "interact" with me - they're attempts to display dominance and control. The attitudes are aggressive and contemptuous, and often turn nasty and angry when I ignore them. Even worse if I say I want to be left alone.
Someone in a club or party striking up a friendly conversation and introducing himself before asking my name - that's interacting. Catching my eye first to gauge my interest before approaching - even better.
Do you understand the difference? Because apparently many of the male commenters here do not.
Someone in a club or party striking up a friendly conversation and introducing himself before asking my name - that's interacting. Catching my eye first to gauge my interest before approaching - even better.
Do you understand the difference? Because apparently many of the male commenters here do not.
122
Would you ask a random man walking down the street "Hey, dude, what's your name? Want to be friends? Let's grab a beer together. You'd be more handsome if you'd just smile, you know?"
Yeah. Didn't think so. Guess what - women don't view their commute to work or their trips to the grocery store as opportunities for the hookup of a lifetime. Try Tinder.
Yeah. Didn't think so. Guess what - women don't view their commute to work or their trips to the grocery store as opportunities for the hookup of a lifetime. Try Tinder.
82
A while back, I was shooting baskets at a local playground when a great looking young woman passed by, entering the kiddie section. “I wonder if she realizes that she was put on earth for me to look at,” I said to a fellow player.
Of course we did nothing to cause her discomfort. Still, shouldn’t she take pride in embodying much that great artists can only aspire to.
Of course we did nothing to cause her discomfort. Still, shouldn’t she take pride in embodying much that great artists can only aspire to.
5
This is exactly the kind of objectification that is so awful. "she was put on this earth for me to look at." So she has no purpose otherwise? No self-determination, no goals? And what about when she gets older and you don't think she's good-looking anymore -- does she have no purpose? You may not have said this comment to her, but sharing this attitude about a woman shows you have a limiting attitude toward all women.
37
Since when is her body your business--or display piece/property?
51
You are the kind of man who horrifies women. We are not put here for you. We are not put here for you to look at. Do you not see how incredibly creepy that statement is?
Do you have a daughter? How would you feel if some stranger commented on her body? How would you feel if someone said that about your mother? Is her body made for people to look at as well?
Just. No.
Do you have a daughter? How would you feel if some stranger commented on her body? How would you feel if someone said that about your mother? Is her body made for people to look at as well?
Just. No.
37
Never understood why they do this- another aspect of male privilege I suppose - at what age do they learn to do it, why do they think it is ok, do they ever learn to stop? the mansplaining, the interrupting, cat calls, ....what is wrong with them?!
39
wow, so powerfully written. I have 3 brothers and 2 sons and I am not sure that they have any clue how a woman truly feels out in the "open". iran on the beach topless as a child with my brothers; laughing and playing. and then it all changed. I have taught my boys what respect for women means ad nauseam but I can only pray it sunk in. It breaks my heart to think a male i know would behave this way but i know they might....
14
When I discuss gender differences in my classes, I ask who in the class ever experienced walking down a street and someone yelling at them 'smile!'. Only women's hands go up, and sometimes a gay man's as well. One time during one of these discussions a woman said that she barks at the man, and they retreat immediately. I thought that was a great reaction although I remember situations when it would have increased the danger.
The sad thing is, as the writer says, it does not matter how you are dressed, how old you are, or what you look like. If they like your looks, they say disgusting things, If they don't, they say other disgusting things.
That some comments here again try to devalue this female reality is sickening. I wish there was some way of making men actually *feel* what it feels like being assaulted like that, with words only or with physical action. To never feel safe. To always be vigilant. To never relax when in public. And to remember and be reminded forever: 35 years ago, I was on my bicycle, traveling by myself, a man on a small motorcycle yelled at me first as he drove by, then turned around and started following me. I got away by tricking him and then hid in a cornfield for an hour. He circled around looking for me but finally gave up. To this day, when I hear a motorcycle of that kind, the fear comes back.
The sad thing is, as the writer says, it does not matter how you are dressed, how old you are, or what you look like. If they like your looks, they say disgusting things, If they don't, they say other disgusting things.
That some comments here again try to devalue this female reality is sickening. I wish there was some way of making men actually *feel* what it feels like being assaulted like that, with words only or with physical action. To never feel safe. To always be vigilant. To never relax when in public. And to remember and be reminded forever: 35 years ago, I was on my bicycle, traveling by myself, a man on a small motorcycle yelled at me first as he drove by, then turned around and started following me. I got away by tricking him and then hid in a cornfield for an hour. He circled around looking for me but finally gave up. To this day, when I hear a motorcycle of that kind, the fear comes back.
19
An eloquent testimony that speaks not only of a woman's God-given right to navigate this world without having to overdress in a burlap burka, or under-impress by acting in a manner beneath her dignity, but to such things as fat-shaming, and the right of an unborn child to the life and integrity of her or her own body, even though it is, as of yet, not fully formed. No one--NO ONE!--has the right to diminish the warm innocence--or whatever remains of it--of just being...us. Some are smart. Some are beautiful. Some are wise. Some are not. But what we all are are God's children, and as such we have the right to live, walk, and exist in peace and safety.
13
In my early twenties I backpacked alone through dozens of different countries. The only one thing I was ever afraid of was men. Catcalling, leering and ogling all serve to remind women of one thing: we live in a patriarchy with the constant threat of being raped.
Now I am in my fifties and thankfully men on the street leave me alone. But a lifetime of the threat of male violence has made me the feminist I am today.
Now I am in my fifties and thankfully men on the street leave me alone. But a lifetime of the threat of male violence has made me the feminist I am today.
50
When I was 16, I walked home from a high school football game on a Saturday afternoon, I noticed a car following me. After passing me 3 times, I decided to take a short cut home. Biggest mistake of my life. After a few moments, I heard his car barreling down the dirt road, towards me. I froze. I turned around and said out loud "God help me". The man got out of his car and walked towards me. Suddenly another car came from behind this man so I ran in front of it, screaming that the man wanted to kill me. The driver, who was in his 40s with 2 small kids in the back seat, stopped his car. I was crying so he let me in & drove me home. He drove off before I could thank him. I ran to my mother & told her what happened. We filed a police report because I had memorized the license plate. The police said there wasn't much they could do because nothing really happened.
While nothing "physically" happened, I was never so afraid in my life. My oldest sister did not believe me because she said I was not pretty and could not believe "some guy" would try and pick me up. I felt in my heart that he intended serious harm, if not worse, based on the look he had on his face. That afternoon was a valuable lesson for me to stay smart, focused and not panic if ever caught in a similar situation.
To this day, a whistle, a look, even a smile from a stranger will put me into a minor panic for a moment. I appreciate your article, thought it brought back chilling memories.
55
Some men are dangerous. Most men are boorish oafs.
21
I agree with you Misty Morning. My gut told me this guy was dangerous, especially by the look in his eyes and the weird, serious look on his face. He meant to do harm. Many thanks for your comment.
16
Boorish comment.
1
This article is about so much more than just catcallers. If you think you are exempt from this as a man because you don't catcall, or if you naively think your catcalls are compliments, read it again.
This article is about respect and respect for women's bodies. The fear described here is more powerful than most every fear in a woman's life. I know for me it is. For a man to feel that he is entitled to a look, a comment, a conversation, a photo, your phone number, or your body is completely dehumanizing, objectifying, and terrible.
Every man should evaluate how he respects women in his life. The image at the end of this article is beautiful, but the fact that only a woman could feel ownership of her body in the absence of men means a lot of work needs to be done. Let us be comfortable, please, because this fear is crushing, every single day.
This article is about respect and respect for women's bodies. The fear described here is more powerful than most every fear in a woman's life. I know for me it is. For a man to feel that he is entitled to a look, a comment, a conversation, a photo, your phone number, or your body is completely dehumanizing, objectifying, and terrible.
Every man should evaluate how he respects women in his life. The image at the end of this article is beautiful, but the fact that only a woman could feel ownership of her body in the absence of men means a lot of work needs to be done. Let us be comfortable, please, because this fear is crushing, every single day.
40
Thank you. I relate. I'm crying right now at the poignancy and depth of your thruth as it is mine also. I hope for you to somehow experience soon another layer of our truth. Literally growing into "my body" again. Claiming it back. Loving it. Using it for its intended purposes. Becoming a mother to a daughter. It healed me but looking at her i can't help but fear "how long will it be her Body?" My job to teach her not to Smile!
14
I think it appropriate to say that much of this unwanted attention is about abuse of power. Making sexual remarks, or gestures, is every bit bullying as the school yard bully in an adult world. I am sorry we live in a society, perhaps world, that is indifferent to such abuse. Your choice to go for a walk anywhere, wearing what makes you comfortable, does not give others permission to assume they are free to invade your space, or endanger you. Recently while wearing a new shirt, a woman told me the shirt looked good on me. It was a nice feeling. I wish males could make the same observations without underlying threatening meaning. Actually, on reflection, I am sure there are males, perhaps many, who qualify as humans. Thank you for your story.
29
One of the worst experiences for a female is going through puberty and realizing that to males, you are now an object, not a person.
44
Yes, yes. When I was pregnant and looked like a delivery truck I passed by a man who said, "I wish I were the one who did that to you." Can anyone explain that mentality and how to stop it?
35
I am sad for you. What an awful experience.
15
The idea that men are at the mercy of sexual attraction to the point of having to exert unusual self-control to keep from yelling or otherwise assailing women they don't know is wrong. It's an excuse, and not a good one.. Women are subject to attacks to harm, maim, disfigure, or kill. And that is not about sex. Even in lesser harassment, it is about an in-group/out-group dynamic that teaches boys that they can (and perhaps should, or are expected to) dominate women. That has changed, but not as much as we'd like. Keeping "your" woman "in her place" is still very much part of many men's repertoire, and impressing other men with sexual exploits or molestation of women is common; just ask that famous man who so recently was famous for bragging to a younger man about it. If women heard the ways that men talk to each other about them, they might be shocked. Or maybe not. A woman is at greatest threat of murder from her own spouse of boyfriend. Imagine, gentlemen, if that were reversed. If when you left the house you had to wonder if your clothing might cause a woman to attack you, if having another beer might encourage a woman to attack you. It's about domination, about "proving" manhood to other males, about enjoying predation and the like at least as much a matter of sexual attraction per se. The pretense that it is not keeps us from addressing the truth, that we must give up the will to dominate that underlies this behavior.
45
Another New York Times article illuminated the plight of single parents raising children (mainly women) and the abundance of parents who simply walked away from their offspring (mainly men). These two articles should have been combined. For all women, whether Noble prize winners, fry cooks, corporation VPs or nurses, the overriding quality of their lives is their looks. Good sense of humor, great cook, even wonderful lover, none of it is as important as their face or figure in the heart of a man. Why do happily married men, who have been steady husbands and fathers, leave their wives for a twenty-year old? Because she's twenty years old(!) and has greater ease of continuing whatever physical appearance appeals to him. Sure all the other aspects help, but being a good cook is only foolproof if you're in front of a stove in an apron, high heels and nothing else, and he likes what he sees. Women will never be equal until we are appreciated as if all men were blind.
12
This is truly nauseating! I am ashamed that some men, any men could so crassly, crudely, so terribly illegally behave like this - ever. Do you like the way someone looks? Then you can glance, but not coldly stare. Much more than that is harassment or stalking. A grab or a pull... that's assault. It can get you a bullet in the chest.
This stuff is not hard to understand. Why do so many men find it rocket science?!
This stuff is not hard to understand. Why do so many men find it rocket science?!
22
Thank you for writing this. I came from a family of overweight and large-breasted women - yes, past size DD and short. I was the tallest in the family at 5'6", but I also was a DD. When I was 25, I had breast reduction surgery, which was one of the best choices I've ever made which reduced the size of my breasts to a C cup. Apparently, that was not good enough, because two years later I developed anorexia and starved myself down to 92 lbs. In therapy I learned that one reason was because I knew subconsciously a man would not be attracted to a Skelton. Recovering from this eating disorder took years and was one of the hardest things I've ever done but it was worth it.
I never had children, but I have a 9 year old niece and I'm encouraging my brother and ex-sister-in-law to raise and confident young woman who is proud and comfortable in her body.
Thank you again for writing such an important piece.
I never had children, but I have a 9 year old niece and I'm encouraging my brother and ex-sister-in-law to raise and confident young woman who is proud and comfortable in her body.
Thank you again for writing such an important piece.
17
Kudos on your recovery, and it sounds like your niece is lucky to have you. But as a woman who rarely pushes the scale past 100 (I come from a family of skinny women myself) I do think the whole "real women have curves/men like meat on your bones/All About That Bass" style thinking is poisonous and also needs to die. Besides, this skeleton has been catcalled since age 13, so trust me, it does not "protect" you.
16
What a painful business we women face when simply trying to get from one place to another as we stare straight ahead and pretend not to hear what men are calling out. I hope our schools are teaching children that harassing people is cruel.
17
Unfortunately, somewhere between the 7th and 8th grade - 7th grade for me - something happens to a boy's brain whereby he becomes mesmerized by women's bodies. We have no control over it. Most of us manage to shut up about it, however.
11
Yes.
3
Heather, thank you.
5
And yet 52% of white women voted for a man who boasted about sexually assaulting women. It's bad enough men behave like this. How are we to raise men to respect women if so many of their mothers give men a pass?
65
I, too, felt like prey for much of my teen and adult life, always afraid. In public, I ignored them all, never making eye contact, careful not to signal encouragement.
When I got (married and) pregnant, I awakened to a different world. Men I'd never noticed began to smile kindly and ask, "How far along are you?" and they'd mention their own children. Couples, too. Children provide a safe commonality through which to be friendly without seeming nosy. Women stopped feeling threatened. The creeps stopped coming on to me, and I realized that's what they were, creeps. Men with healthy self-esteem aren't aggressive; I just couldn't see them while avoiding the jerks.
When I got (married and) pregnant, I awakened to a different world. Men I'd never noticed began to smile kindly and ask, "How far along are you?" and they'd mention their own children. Couples, too. Children provide a safe commonality through which to be friendly without seeming nosy. Women stopped feeling threatened. The creeps stopped coming on to me, and I realized that's what they were, creeps. Men with healthy self-esteem aren't aggressive; I just couldn't see them while avoiding the jerks.
11
My 17 year old granddaughter, long wavy brunette hair, exotic hazel green eyes, dazzling smile and smart will be attending the university this fall. My advice isn't study hard to build a foundation for a career, No, it's always have your car keys ready.
22
That is not a good help. Neither is pepper spray or the like, although possibly better than nothing. Your granddaughter should be trained in some self-defense, including how to use whatever weapon she may have without having it taken from her by a much larger, more experienced assailant. Prevention is also key. I believe that all young women should be instructed in the basics (at least) of self-defense prior to leaving home.
14
This is the battle over our own bodies. In 1979, I was 9 years old & lived in southern Spain for a summer. While I was not even a woman yet, my freedom to wear Dove athletic shorts & strappy tanks was all the invitation the boys & men needed to grab at my body & pelvis continuously. I loved our friendly housekeeper who dressed in a matronly uniform while at work. In the evening she would ignore me when I would see her in the city square looking like a Spanish version of Olivia Newton-John at the end of Grease. Sandy won her man by leaving her teenage self behind & owning her sexuality as a woman. No Pink Ladies jacket required. I wonder if the housekeeper was worried her power would be misinterpreted if she was seen talking to me. In her own world perhaps she was a lofty Sofia Loren, proud & haughty. Not part of the free-loving Americans. I think of the women journalists who were assaulted during the Arab Spring or women in Germany on New Year's Eve and it reminds me of being a 1970's child from the States in a darkly conservative Spain. The freedom to move in public, wearing whatever clothes still doesn't exist. Our very being holds soft power & yet in being so invites this crushing sadism from those too weak to resist their own corruption. My own daughter, at 12, doesn't care about her appearance or whether her clothes are fashionable or trendy. For the most part I am thankful of this & hope she stays comfortable in herself & her choices for as long as possible.
4
Thank you for this beautiful article. Although I'm older now it really reasonated with me, reawakening that feeling of fear and anxiety.
7
Just so sad that a pretty woman gets attention. Should I weep for her? Half of this article seems an expression of neurosis half utter nonsense.
2
A shame you missed it. It's about the emotional violence of sexual harassment, not abut a pretty woman getting attention. Try reading the comments section.
40
When I was 16, I was walking home on a Saturday afternoon when I noticed a car following me. After passing me 3 times, I decided to take a short cut home. Biggest mistake of my life. After a few moments, I heard his car barreling down the dirt road, towards me. I froze. I turned around and said out loud "God help me". The man got out of his car and walked towards me. Suddenly another car came by so I ran to it, screaming that the man wanted to kill me. The driver, who was in his 40s with 2 small kids in the back seat, stopped his car. I was crying so hard, he let me in & drove me home. Before I could thank him, he drove away. I ran and told my mother what happened. A police report was filed because I had memorized the license plate. The police said there wasn't much they could do because nothing really happened. While nothing "physically" happened, I was never so afraid in my life. My oldest sister did not believe me because she said I was not pretty and could not believe "some guy" would try and pick me up. I felt in my heart that he intended serious harm, if not worse, based upon the look he had on his face. To this day, a whistle, a look, even a smile from a stranger will result in me suddenly having a minor panic attack from the incident so long ago.
17
I bet if the cops troubled themselves to run the plate, they would have found a repeat sexual predator or worse.
21
And the best and worst part of being old is that your body will be your body again.
1
When will we learn to raise boys into respectful men. This is a huge failure and Jim Harrison and Robert Bly were right. Thoughts are thoughts but putting impulses, disrespect and de-personalizig into action is failure. The reptilian brain can be over ridden.
15
Why is this not an op-ed piece? Filing it under "Style" once again trivializes women's issues. Men need to read this, and most men don't read the Style section.
63
Exactly. I notice many such pieces addressing serious issues of concern to women are relegated to the "style" section. Even worse, this is one is categorized as a "Modern Love" piece!?!
13
I am conflicted by the obvious truth of this very personal journey clearly shared by so many. I wont deny I wonder if women have seen me and wondered if I did "look" at some way that was wrong. But if this is the truth please, please don't say this is always and everywhere. That would be too much to bear to know we have not changed after all this time. It only confirms that ridiculous view about men and women that Islam and indeed Christianity have about sexuality.
3
It's not everywhere. Some men have learned how to give women quick, appreciative glances without seeming like a threat.
4
Anything to shake a girl's confidence, to dominate -- so she doesn't connect with her self, with community, so she does not thrive.
16
As a man that likes women, I don't whistle at them, when i look at them i look them in the eyes, I talk to them like fellow earthlings, that have opinions about the world they live on. I was taught better I guess, or maybe I listened to my parents a bit more than not. As a poet of sorts I use subtle things to romance my Lady, I have written her 100's of poems on my blog, so I choose my words slowly. I at times don't like to claim those other human males as members of the same species. I am a Christ follower, and can't see where men get off on their idea of superior levels, in that all mankind sinned. It doesn't say because Eve sinned, it says because Adam sinned, he after all was not a clueless dolt, but men tend toward being clueless dolts. Just make sure you program A I to respect you.
5
I so remember the summer my mother told me I had to wear a shirt. The summer before I was making mud pies and rolling in the grass, and now l must cover up, and be a "lady". The author made me cry with her experiences of assault by word and cowardly actions, with no provocation. I hope that society is evolving to spare my granddaughter, but much of what I see in our political climate does not reassure me.
5
Unbelievably beautiful essay about an awful phenomenon. For me, it started at 13. Over the years as I gained more and mor weight, i actually felt relief because it stopped these kinds of comments (though nothing is strong enough against patriarchal power and violence that you ever stop with the keys in the fist). But then my size just led to other comments, nasty, abusive remarks about being fat. I just went from one kind of humiliation to another. Message received: my body still doesn't belong to me.
26
Why is this in the Modern Love column? This is about violation, not love.
36
This is why the Times needs a public editor.
11
It breaks my heart at how this is true for every woman. Describes my experience exactly. Why is this such a universal truth?
11
Maybe there is good reason for the Hijab, niqab, burka - there are lots of different kinds of coverings worn by Muslim women all over the world.
3
Thank you ...... memories.
3
I have already shared this piece with much younger women who can't understand "feminism". I'm 67 years old and still encounter creeps like this all the time. They limit your life and your interactions with strangers. I've started acting out, as in "why are you commenting on my chest old man, you've got a pretty good set of your own".
The best part is when they tell you you should be flattered.
The best part is when they tell you you should be flattered.
30
Thank you.
1
To any man who reads this and thinks, "You'll miss the attention someday": No, we won't. Being treated like a piece of meat doesn't make a woman feel good.
44
One never gets over the fact that others think they deserve our bodies. And most of the men in congress are still trying to control our bodies. A staggeringly beautiful piece about what it means to be a woman.
25
This morning I attended a Tiny Homes show at our local fairgrounds. There were vendors of everything from homes to gutters and more. I was so sad to note that the busiest booth was one selling self-defense items for women - pretty pink and blue pepper spray bottles with special gloves to hold them when we walk or run and shiny tasers designed for smaller hands, among other "girly" colored gadgets to allow us to safely walk the streets and trails of our "civilized" country. It infuriates me that I have never, since early childhood, been able to go where I want to go, when I want to go, dressed how I want to dress, without being seen as an object for some crass man's sadistic pleasure - whether by his comments or his actions.
20
As a male I always cringe when I read these essays because it reflects so badly on my gender and because it makes me realize how life is made so unnecessarily nastier for 1/2 of the human race. I have these thoughts not because they were drilled into me by feminist family members or friends but simply due to the fact that I don't feel entitled to female affections, attentiveness or admiration just because I am a guy. My only explanation is that I don't think I was exposed to any sort of cultural upbringing that made this kind of attitude appear normal and acceptable. However I unfortunately have no clue how this viewpoint can be promulgated in a way that does not ensnare it within a cultural polarization that sneers at it as either male feminization or liberal soft-headedness that should be opposed with good old-fashioned male braggadocio. Finally, it does not help when many women adopt a "men will be men" fatalism like I saw after the Washington Post exposed Trump's lewd locker room bragging.
30
This has been my life experience as well. Tomorrow is my 48th birthday. No one does this to me anymore. I am invisible, for the most part, to men. I am a young-looking 48. But still, invisible. I am relieved to be this in most ways. But it brings with it the realization that women over a certain age are not seen as women anymore. i don't want to be sexually harassed when I grocery shop. But I also don't want to be invisible. I want to be treated with respect.
30
All human beings need respect!
10
I just turned 60 and I LOVE the fact that my body is invisible to strange men. Huge relief.
7
I'm past the age where I attract this kind of attention, but I'm not past the fear. I never will be.
33
Unfortunately, women of all ages are vulnerable to sexual assault.
18
This was a poignant and worthwhile read. It is unlikely that enough men read it, but even if only one did and sees the issue, that was worth the time and the ink.
I raised my two sons to be decent human beings, including calling out their friends who need calling out. I hope (and believe) that they do.
For another cultural viewpoint, I suggest reading the book 'La Seduction' by Elaine Sciolino, addressing the concept of male/female interaction in France. I lived in Paris when I was 19 in 1973, and that had a tremendous (and positive) influence on my dealings with random men in the US over the years. Men are no different and no better in France, but the framework is different.
Worth a read and some reflection.
Re 'aging out' and the relief reported by many in these comments...how sad that a woman would not want to feel beautiful and seductive and powerful in her skin, and would prefer to become invisibly sexless. I get it, I think, but how sad.
I raised my two sons to be decent human beings, including calling out their friends who need calling out. I hope (and believe) that they do.
For another cultural viewpoint, I suggest reading the book 'La Seduction' by Elaine Sciolino, addressing the concept of male/female interaction in France. I lived in Paris when I was 19 in 1973, and that had a tremendous (and positive) influence on my dealings with random men in the US over the years. Men are no different and no better in France, but the framework is different.
Worth a read and some reflection.
Re 'aging out' and the relief reported by many in these comments...how sad that a woman would not want to feel beautiful and seductive and powerful in her skin, and would prefer to become invisibly sexless. I get it, I think, but how sad.
15
So beautifully written. As a runner, I've dealt with this feeling and the aggressive behavior of men for twenty years. Thank you for describing what it's like to always be waiting for unpleasant, unwanted male attention.
25
One of the best things about getting older is that men no longer yell things from cars, make comments as they pass on the street, or follow in an attempt to do what? I've never known, because I've never called their bluff. And, I wasn't even especially pretty--just average looking, I would say. I can't imagine what the pretty girls go through. But, once I got mid-40s, it all just stopped. Now, at 64 I am invisible as I walk down the street. Men no longer see me at all. It is a relief to be able to live my life and have my body left alone, without comment. Why men believe it is ok to harass women on the street has always been a mystery to me.
47
Hormones are in the driver's seat for male behavior!
1
Harassment is not about desire. It usually starts when a woman is a child because she is less confident in her changing body, and continues indefinitely.
8
"Hormones are in the driver's seat for male behavior!"
And men accuse us women of having raging hormones!
Yet they entrust us with the care of children and the sick, even during "that time of month."
I'd like some man to try to justify this double standard.
And men accuse us women of having raging hormones!
Yet they entrust us with the care of children and the sick, even during "that time of month."
I'd like some man to try to justify this double standard.
14
I often wonder why men don't reprimand and correct other men when they see this behavior.
88
I think your question is well taken. In my own case, I do not see myself as a public scold who should go around policing the behavior of others unless there is some sort of clear, immediate threat. If I were walking close to a construction site and men were yelling out to women, I might say, "Knock it off!", but I wouldn't try to engage further with a group of men with steel pipes in their hands. (My impression is that workers at construction sites don't do this any more. They've been told by their bosses, I think.)
Once, I was walking when my daughter in an outlet store near Reading, Pa. and, if I recall correctly, my daughter was about eleven years old and a man was eyeing her up and down. I wanted to scream at him, "That's a child you are checking out, dude," but the moment, in a crowded location, passed and I said nothing. I should have spoken up.
In professional work situations, I don't reprimand other men for their conduct because I am focused on doing a job, having a business meeting or whatever needs to be done. I have witnessed things that were not proper, but they never crossed over into aggressive or ugly actions, mainly staring and comments to other men.
In any case, I think your question should provoke some thinking and further consideration in myself and other men. No decent male would want to see his wife or daughter subjected to such behavior by other men.
Once, I was walking when my daughter in an outlet store near Reading, Pa. and, if I recall correctly, my daughter was about eleven years old and a man was eyeing her up and down. I wanted to scream at him, "That's a child you are checking out, dude," but the moment, in a crowded location, passed and I said nothing. I should have spoken up.
In professional work situations, I don't reprimand other men for their conduct because I am focused on doing a job, having a business meeting or whatever needs to be done. I have witnessed things that were not proper, but they never crossed over into aggressive or ugly actions, mainly staring and comments to other men.
In any case, I think your question should provoke some thinking and further consideration in myself and other men. No decent male would want to see his wife or daughter subjected to such behavior by other men.
15
I do. Sometimes I question afterwards whether it's counterproductive because my inserting myself into the situation that way could imply that a woman is too weak to defend herself and therefore I might actually be disempowering her. But that misgiving hasn't stopped me, either. I'd be grateful for insight from others on the issue.
16
I certainly understand your reticence. But I'm disturbed to see how you couched it, "but they never crossed over into aggressive or ugly actions, mainly staring and comments to other men."
You, as a man, do not feel the danger that any woman would feel after hearing such comments. The line between words and action is thin and fragile, and we, as women, know this all too well.
You, as a man, do not feel the danger that any woman would feel after hearing such comments. The line between words and action is thin and fragile, and we, as women, know this all too well.
37
Years ago when I read the book "Reviving Ophelia" by Mary Pipher, I suddenly remembered how I went through a stage around age 12 or 13 when I had a persistent thought: "I wish I were 9." I never understood why until I read Pipher's brilliant book, which is subtitled "saving the selves of adolescent girls". I felt so strong, unfettered, and free to be me at age 9.
39
Let´s look at the two aspects of this problem in a reasonable way. The first aspect is the female attraction; the second aspect is man´s reaction to it. In an open society, female attraction is boundless, because women have the right to get dressed as they please. Now, the greater the female attraction gets, the more excited men become - this is a biological reaction. And here is the challenge: regardless of how attractive a woman is, regardless of how excited a man becomes because of it, the man has to be in control of his actions, he has to strengthen his character, so that he can bear his internal excitement and act in a civilized and decent way. So in the end, the problem is about weak men with a lack of character.
51
You might be surprised at how often this is not actually a matter of attraction, but a matter of hostility and domination. It is not a smile but a snarl that often comes with a "grab" or grope, not an appreciation of appeal but a threat of rape, if not worse. That needs to be understood here. I see the comments regarding "weak" men who do this, or their sorry psychological reasons; but the fact is that angry and hostile men want to do this kind of thing for various reasons. One case I know of was of a young woman attacked while jogging, and when the case came to trial, the man had been angry after an argument with his wife, and wanted to hurt a woman who didn't know him and would be unlikely to identify him later (fortunately he was mistaken about that last part).
38
I don't think the amount of attractiveness or what a woman is wearing has much to do with whether or not she is going to experience street harassment. I think men need glasses sometimes. I appreciate your points, at first it sounded like man-splaining. I wish I could come up with an example of something that is done to men that would be an equal experience.
13
Well, I wasn´t aware that my comment could have been considered as "man-splaining", I just wanted to develop a logical argument. And my point is that men who can´t control their internal desires have a lack of character and are therefore weak. These desires can be many things: sexual desires and excitement, anger, aggression, the need to perform power etc. To put it simply: the more a person can control the reaction to a certain stimulus, the stronger the character of this person is – and vice versa. So a man who harasses or attacks a woman because of his aggression or his need for power is just weak because of his lack of character.
8
No woman regards this as a sweet come-hither moment. It originates in male rage at our very existence.
In most groups of mammals, the males try to fend off other males they perceive as invading their turf. But homo (un-)sapiens males, through hostile words and gestures, attack females whom they perceive as being on "their" turf.
How did human men become so twisted?
In most groups of mammals, the males try to fend off other males they perceive as invading their turf. But homo (un-)sapiens males, through hostile words and gestures, attack females whom they perceive as being on "their" turf.
How did human men become so twisted?
30
You are on to something there by pointing out that, after all, humans are mammals.
2
Toxic masculinity and compulsive heterosexuality, the background music of our lives.
That doesn't mean every man acts this way, but the constant threat is there. It's a loss for women and men. Women are treated as if they do not belong to themselves, and men who engage this behavior may secure their position in a hierarchy of masculinity but they sacrifice the chance for healthy human connection. To anyone.
Very evocatively written.
That doesn't mean every man acts this way, but the constant threat is there. It's a loss for women and men. Women are treated as if they do not belong to themselves, and men who engage this behavior may secure their position in a hierarchy of masculinity but they sacrifice the chance for healthy human connection. To anyone.
Very evocatively written.
74
Thank you for your eloquence. This man does not need to see you to know that you are beautiful, for I speak not of your body, but your strength.
30
Decades ago, when I was 24, I didn't know that my "body was my body." And it would take a couple of more decades before I did. What's good about being 24 now is that many young women know this and have self-respect. I'm glad this article was published - thank you.
65
Beautifully written; heartfelt and honest, thank you. When I was growing up my mother, a feminist, made it clear to me that not only was that disgusting behavior you described completely unacceptable, it also was something that I - as a man - would have to do something about when I saw it and heard it. She expected me to be my brothers' keeper, and that is what I try to do, in my work and life. Thank you for your incredible piece.
127
This was beautiful and visceral writing. Thank you for your amazing words. I literally felt terrorized you. I always try to come back with a witty quip or a fiery glare- but I find that I'm always the one that gets worked up- the men- they seem to just move onto their next pretty prey...
30
This piece is so well written and SO important. I hope it helps many of my brethren walk in the steps of women and identify with their awful sense of being the property of others, objectified... prey to be conquered and consumed.
Words, let alone the kinds of nauseating manhandling the author describes, can have such a negative impact on women. My wife struggled for years with obesity triggered by the desire to deflect the kind of attention the author elucidates so compellingly; being very tall, athletic, and beautiful became such an emotional liability that she unconsciously harmed her health so as to short circuit the unrelenting objectifying comments, whether driven by a desire to dominate, possess, control, or even "honest" lust.
We have raised a daughter who, while not escaping this degrading kind of targeted behavior--mores the pity--has nonetheless been able to wade through the morass while maintaining her health. She's also been blessed with some male friends over the years who have also broken what seems at times to be a pattern that is hard-wired into the male mind and body.
Political correctness, which is, at its best just another name for compassionate common courtesy, as been one of the potent antidotes to the social and psychological poison Ms. Burtman so capably illuminates in this article. As an old sixties Lefty I'm saddened and angered that the right has had so much success turning "pc" into an epithet, as it has with "liberal" itself. Resist!
Words, let alone the kinds of nauseating manhandling the author describes, can have such a negative impact on women. My wife struggled for years with obesity triggered by the desire to deflect the kind of attention the author elucidates so compellingly; being very tall, athletic, and beautiful became such an emotional liability that she unconsciously harmed her health so as to short circuit the unrelenting objectifying comments, whether driven by a desire to dominate, possess, control, or even "honest" lust.
We have raised a daughter who, while not escaping this degrading kind of targeted behavior--mores the pity--has nonetheless been able to wade through the morass while maintaining her health. She's also been blessed with some male friends over the years who have also broken what seems at times to be a pattern that is hard-wired into the male mind and body.
Political correctness, which is, at its best just another name for compassionate common courtesy, as been one of the potent antidotes to the social and psychological poison Ms. Burtman so capably illuminates in this article. As an old sixties Lefty I'm saddened and angered that the right has had so much success turning "pc" into an epithet, as it has with "liberal" itself. Resist!
188
Powerful piece that conveys the feeling of violation and alienation, tinged with menace, that women sometimes feel when walking through this world.
93
What a fantastic piece. Beautiful. Brutally honest and real. Thanks for putting words to so many experiences I had been unable to process and had tried to forget.
97
16 - lucky! Started at 12/13 for me. One of the driving forces to leave the city I loved with preteen daughters before they experienced the same.
31
Brave, beautiful, and powerfully written.
50
I get angry to the point of almost-violence reading this and remembering.
100
A beautiful piece of writing. But please know that not all men are like that. And many men who do do that are driven not by lust or depravity, but by fear. Fear of being alone, fear of the power of women. Yes, women do have that power over men and men, in their weakness, feel terribly afraid, terribly alone, deeply abandoned.
This is not to say that those men are not dangerous; many are. Yet, still, there are men who live lives of raised consciousness, raised values, for whom a woman is not an object but a companion, a friend, love.
Women often complain about the myopia of men, their inability to understand women. But women can also be short-sighted in lumping in all men to that category of predator.
It's a dangerous, cruel world. But if we cannot find sense of things with each other then who have we become?
This is not to say that those men are not dangerous; many are. Yet, still, there are men who live lives of raised consciousness, raised values, for whom a woman is not an object but a companion, a friend, love.
Women often complain about the myopia of men, their inability to understand women. But women can also be short-sighted in lumping in all men to that category of predator.
It's a dangerous, cruel world. But if we cannot find sense of things with each other then who have we become?
35
A very thoughtful comment. Life has many shades, if we do not categorize and define.
10
This is perhaps one of the most thoughtful comments I have read on the Nytimes... Thank you for recognizing that some of us come from good intentions, and that men too are human beings that desire emotional connection.
11
This article did not at any time even hint that all men are like that.
152
The keys in the hand -- we all do it. We go for runs in the morning with those keys, walk home from the subway after work with those keys. It becomes part of life in your 20s: you take a step forward, you take a breath, you have those keys. And yes, let us all think about how we are raising our boys now to be sure that they appreciate just what their mothers and sisters had to endure.
144
My first thought when I bought a car that used a fob instead of a key was that my keyring no longer held my biggest "weapon" and I needed to make sure I had other keys on the ring. Just in case.
17
I can and do appreciate a beautiful person of either gender. To me the key is to do so without boorishness and with plenty of tact and discretion. It's never ok to make someone uncomfortable with words, gestures or overt glances.
So I believe it is possible to appreciate another's beauty without crossing those lines, the unfortunate part is that discretion and refinement are qualities not universally valued or taught.
So I believe it is possible to appreciate another's beauty without crossing those lines, the unfortunate part is that discretion and refinement are qualities not universally valued or taught.
35
The key is to keep your mouth shut. The stranger on the subway who tells me I'm beautiful and scampers out the car as the doors close behind - his words have value but my reply has none. It leaves me feeling like I have been transferred from my commute to a pageant with a panel of judges sitting before me. Why can't I leave my home without feeling like I am on display? That shouldn't be a big ask.
24
This is an important and beautifully written essay. I also wanted to mention the other side of this. Women who are deemed so unattractive that their presence is an affront are barked at and have insults yelled at them. The desire among some men to comment without invitation on women's physical appearance truly is about power and creating fear.
510
Good point. I had this happen to me on a business trip. I was checking into a hotel and had to walk by the hotel's bar. A group of men thought it was fun to bark at me.
11
Amy hits on on how deep the need some men have to control women. The objectification women experience is about control and power. It is not about sex.
What Any says here cannot be said often enough.
What Any says here cannot be said often enough.
17
I will never forget walking past the Public Library when I was about 20: If I wore something even mildly suggestive, I was subjected to cat calls. So, I dressed in fairly unattractive clothing and tried to avoid the stares and suggestive comments, because I too, had large breasts. But the most hurtful memory was when I was barked at: 40 years later, it still hurts. I don't know which was worse: cat calls or barks.
I know this: both were influential. The most positive result of this is that I always strive to look beyond the surface, and as I am getting older, I am thankful that I do not value my looks as my most important asset.
I know this: both were influential. The most positive result of this is that I always strive to look beyond the surface, and as I am getting older, I am thankful that I do not value my looks as my most important asset.
14
I remember when I was 12 and so strong and reveled in that strength, all of that is taken from us by both men and women, our mothers and fathers, teachers, people on the streets. As others have wrote, I have aged out but I still have a voice and will speak out against those who see only bodies, not persons.
104
Very beautiful piece.
45
Thank you for this eloquent essay about human women in today's world. When I was younger I frequently felt like I was prey even though I was smart and could have any kind of future I wanted. Men weren't interested in my mind or pretended to be so I would relax and trust they were interested in my whole person. I've been stalked several times, accosted about a hundred times, groped on public transportation including a plane. Sometimes I fought back with words, other times I just endured. I used to be brave - then I started to hide. It's exhausting to always be on your guard and sometimes it's not worth the effort. I'm aging out as well and it's a relief; but I miss the freedom of wearing clothes that fit well, walking with purpose and drive, empowered to live in this world as an equal citizen. Compared to other parts of the world - women are treated fairly well in the US; reading about girls prevented from receiving an education, forced into marriage and childbirth in their early teens, having their genitals mutilated, makes me think we have so far to go for any semblance of equality.
197
I learned at an early age to yell LEAVE ME ALONE!! and it was amazingly effective. Unfortunately I had to do it way too many times.
29
You are quite fortunate, Mary, that that worked for you.
13
Thank you for writing this and the NY Times for publishing it. In the 70s I adopted the so-called hippy style of dress with long loose skirts and blouses, which helped a little. In my 60s I still have an "attractive" body and still wear camouflaging clothing. It still helps a little.
I knew my key was a potential weapon of defense and clutched it recently, but not until I read this article did I realize the correct way to arm myself with it.
I can't run as fast and far as I used to.
And yes, I cried when I finished chemotherapy on November 2 only to learn a week later that I had not survived to see the first woman president, but instead to see a sexual predator president.
I knew my key was a potential weapon of defense and clutched it recently, but not until I read this article did I realize the correct way to arm myself with it.
I can't run as fast and far as I used to.
And yes, I cried when I finished chemotherapy on November 2 only to learn a week later that I had not survived to see the first woman president, but instead to see a sexual predator president.
426
Thank you for writing this...
57
Keys are not good weapons for self-defense, unfortunately. Some training in escapes, in weapons and their use is much more valuable for people of all ages, and places to learn are available widely. Some people I've spoken with seem to pull back as if facing this need makes the danger more real somehow--but there's no safety in avoidance of the truth.... I hope people reading this might take the step to prepare for whatever might occur...
8
Thank you so much for telling your story. I feel it is my story as well.
56
Thank you. Grace, strength and grit. Sharing with my daughter.
40
Thank you for so eloquently describing what myself and I think most other women feel at some point in their lives. A certain group of men these days think that it must be far easier now to be a woman than a man. They have no idea what it is to not only have to work that much harder for equal pay, but to also have to watch for assault, verbal or even physical, just when leaving the house.
147
Well said!
Beginning with college, I experienced exactly what this writer describes. I don't consider myself a "looker", but I received anonymous letters. After college while living in Carroll Gardens Brooklyn, I was followed home while walking home from the gym in Brooklyn Heights. I had to duck into the corner bodega to escape. Similarly, while traveling in Rome in August, my girlfriend and I ran up to An older Italian couple and asked in our broken Italian if they would walk us to our hotel. There was a carful of men stalking us, circling the block. The last time something like this happened was years ago, when I was 38 or so and rented a vacation house on Longboat Key FL. I was walking alone in the dark, just down the street, and I guy on a bike followed me. Luckily, after I hit 40, it all went away. It's terrifying to feel in danger of being raped. Although I never was raped, this behavior is not okay. Now 52, I am grateful to have aged out.
154
Not quite sure what it means when you say "aged out".
There is no agelimit to when one can become a rape / sexual assault victim.
I certainly am not breathing any sighs of relief yet..and still watch my steps and time when and where I move about daily life.
That vulnerability has never left ...ever since the first awareness of noticing men in groups, glancing towards me, a young teen then , grapping their own crotches , talking, hollering...and then my plain horror to realize they were talking about me.
The words creepy terror do not fully describe it.
Does age provide immunity of being subjected to creepy terror?
There is no agelimit to when one can become a rape / sexual assault victim.
I certainly am not breathing any sighs of relief yet..and still watch my steps and time when and where I move about daily life.
That vulnerability has never left ...ever since the first awareness of noticing men in groups, glancing towards me, a young teen then , grapping their own crotches , talking, hollering...and then my plain horror to realize they were talking about me.
The words creepy terror do not fully describe it.
Does age provide immunity of being subjected to creepy terror?
9
Fear is fear, but there are smaller daily fears that pass with the circumstance, with the day. And then there is the deeply embedded fear, the overarching, insidious one that stays rooted day after day, year after year. The "I'm not good enough" fear. The men you describe carry this fear, and strike out at women because of it.
Kudos and thanks to you for this brilliant article.
Kudos and thanks to you for this brilliant article.
44
Thank you for this beautiful writing. I read it while nursing my daughter to sleep and hoping beyond hope that i can protect her from ever experiencing this kind of fear.
70
I experienced so much of this as an attractive woman in my early twenties that I became afraid to go out of the house, and developed extreme depression. I remember I used to have to walk half a mile out of my way from an apartment to the supermarket (half a block away) just to avoid the men o the construction site nearby. I dreaded going out. All the time dealing with comments. I agree with this writer (and she put it so well!) that it was as though I no longer owned my own body.
As bad as things are now, they were even worse for women in the 70s and 80s, when men--all men--felt openly free to grope women, "pat" our bums, make incessant jokes and comments about our appearance. That was mainstream then; now, it is far more frowned upon (although it still goes on plenty, of course).
Some older women complain about feeling invisible. At the age of 53, no one at all ever looks at me. I can't tell you how happy that makes me. I can go anywhere, do anything, fear nothing and no one. I don't have to fend off men's constant approaches, keep my eyes down lest someone take accidental eye contact as an invitation, etc. The constant fear--and shame, for some reason--was always with me as a young woman.
As bad as things are now, they were even worse for women in the 70s and 80s, when men--all men--felt openly free to grope women, "pat" our bums, make incessant jokes and comments about our appearance. That was mainstream then; now, it is far more frowned upon (although it still goes on plenty, of course).
Some older women complain about feeling invisible. At the age of 53, no one at all ever looks at me. I can't tell you how happy that makes me. I can go anywhere, do anything, fear nothing and no one. I don't have to fend off men's constant approaches, keep my eyes down lest someone take accidental eye contact as an invitation, etc. The constant fear--and shame, for some reason--was always with me as a young woman.
319
Yes, the 70s were much worse. I was required to give my boss a hug every day. Everyone else just looked away. I needed the job. At least there are laws about that kind of thing now. I loved this essay...and I still hope for more change.
99
Oh my. And my story too.
I aged out but only professionally.
It still happens daily personally.
The judgement, the unwanted attention and the necessary vigilance are all still there.
I aged out but only professionally.
It still happens daily personally.
The judgement, the unwanted attention and the necessary vigilance are all still there.
12
"All men?" Certainly not!
4
I would like to see this beautiful essay discussed in a classroom with elementary-school aged boys, under the age of 10. Let's help them understand that they can nurture the precious trait of empathy, which so many of them still have at this age. Let's help them understand what it means to be a strong man of integrity, a mensch, and any other term that means the same.
272
This is one of the best essays I have ever read. Beautifully written. And, so painfully true. Imagine being fat and sexy. That is a never ending war of words.
I just want to live in my body without having to think about what someone else is thinking about my body.
I just want to live in my body without having to think about what someone else is thinking about my body.
188
Great essay. I hate to take it in a political direction but I think it's worth pointing out that in our culture we at least agree that it's up to the men to curb their impulses.
I'm assuming many Times readers would hypocritally sympathize with this essay while insisting we invite in certain cultures who choose to solve the problem by obligating women to cover themselves. And yes, I am judging. Our approach is better.
I'm assuming many Times readers would hypocritally sympathize with this essay while insisting we invite in certain cultures who choose to solve the problem by obligating women to cover themselves. And yes, I am judging. Our approach is better.
39
Sigh.
Did you learn anything -- anything at all -- from this essay about why women might WANT to cover themselves?
Or about why it's not your prerogative to decide that they shouldn't......because their bodies DO NOT BELONG TO YOU?
Did you learn anything -- anything at all -- from this essay about why women might WANT to cover themselves?
Or about why it's not your prerogative to decide that they shouldn't......because their bodies DO NOT BELONG TO YOU?
153
Max, our culture has not so much agreement as that. We still have, for example, public schools with unequal dress codes for girls and boys, predicated on the idea that it is girls' responsibility to avoid "distracting" boys.
38
Max, our Vice President has stated that he will not dine alone with women. He and others like him are putting the burden on women, because they as men fear that they cannot/will not control their impulses. Far be it from us to say as a society/culture/nation that we are in agreement here.
42
Yes. I started wearing loose clothes, and then gained 40 lbs, first 20, then 5, then another 5, then 10. Later I gained another 10 and another 10. They started ogling me when I was 11.
75
Beautiful.
26
Beautifully written yet so painful to read and relate to.
96
As an overweight female all my life I didn't know this existed. But as the mother of a beautiful daughter I have been a witness to this since she was 10 years old. Grown men would pause their glance on her. Now at 18 years old I know every walk down the street with her I see her ignoring the looks and occasional "compliments" in order to go about her day. This article describes it beautifully.
130
Take it from a woman who's been there, "pretty" is not nearly the inducement for involuntarily attracting most of these jerks. Breasts are the main attraction and the larger your breasts, the more of them are after you.
8
As I read this poignant essay, I could not get out of my mind the behavior of the man who is now our president.
545
Exactly!
4
And also the behavior of our president back when I was the age of this author
8
Thank you for this article.
35
A calm and poignant outline of this truth. Thank you
60
Thanks. I am unfortunately a "looker" - I do stare at attractive or unusual people at times, although when I find myself doing it I force myself to turn away and not obsess. Eye contact and/or the lack of eye contact can both be signals to stop. I apologize.
108
Recognizing and apologizing for being part of the problem are good first steps. Next would be to make yourself just stop it, and then school your family, friends, coworkers, etc when you see them doing this. It's not going to stop until men take responsibility for making it stop.
58
A confession. Maybe you should TRY not to. Just stop. Practice. Practice. Practice. Have a little respect.
10
This is beautifully written and achingly, sadly, true.
119