Congratulations all the way from history to future. France did another historical moment for the Western civilization and democracy, enlightenment defeated darkness. Thanks France.
4
Politicos always want to keep their media pot boiling. Macron will do fine as a leader in a deeply divided country.
2
France always speaks from the heart. The negatives on Macon will be overcome through his head which has been proven to be thoughtful, evaluating, and realistic.
Great relief the French dodged the bullet on this one -- But Monsieur Macron still has his work cut out for him....
Immigration policy. EU policy. And the economy (stupid!)
Good Luck, France.
Immigration policy. EU policy. And the economy (stupid!)
Good Luck, France.
1
As noted, an interesting development, no main party candidates. The US election had on offer one candidate who could play to those frustrated by the "establishment", one so radically different and unpredictable that the competitor was constantly off-balance, struggling to get a coherent message assembled other than the "glass ceiling" breakage which was never going to appeal to white, middle class men, one who acted as though she "deserved" to be elected.
Makes me wonder if rather than anointing Hillary the DNC permitted a fair fight. Was Bernie so outside the mainstream that he presented a much more palatable alternative to Trump?
We shall never know but such mental acrobatics help keep my mind off the foolish mistake we now call President, in a way cathartic way.
I trust the French have chosen wisely, time will tell. Next the British election then Germany in the Autumn. The polls says Theresa's Tories will romp past the finish line but...
Frau Merkel's chances are another story. Pundits say the French election would determine the fate of the EU. Perhaps so but as the true power in the EU, Germany's election may be the true test, that said their population is one step above a big yawn in the land of the unexpected.
Makes me wonder if rather than anointing Hillary the DNC permitted a fair fight. Was Bernie so outside the mainstream that he presented a much more palatable alternative to Trump?
We shall never know but such mental acrobatics help keep my mind off the foolish mistake we now call President, in a way cathartic way.
I trust the French have chosen wisely, time will tell. Next the British election then Germany in the Autumn. The polls says Theresa's Tories will romp past the finish line but...
Frau Merkel's chances are another story. Pundits say the French election would determine the fate of the EU. Perhaps so but as the true power in the EU, Germany's election may be the true test, that said their population is one step above a big yawn in the land of the unexpected.
The French, and good for them, seems to have learned a quick lesson from across the pond what extreme xenophobia , extreme elitism, extreme ego and extreme lying can do. LePen presented a carbon copy of the one across the pond and, Vive le France, they did not like the original and less the copy.
3
Don't forget, the polls were just as accurate about today's election in France as they were in November in the USA. Macron 's pre-election polling was ">20%" which is what he is getting. Hillary's lead in November was 4%, which is what she got.
The only difference is that France has a true democracy, where each person gets one vote equal to any others. In our backward, or cockeyed system, only a very small portion of the voters - those who live in "swing" states, have a chance to make a difference.
Voting for Clinton in Idaho, or Trump in Massachusetts, is a waste of time.
George W. Bush and Donald J. Trump got to head our nation because of...we just don't learn!!
The only difference is that France has a true democracy, where each person gets one vote equal to any others. In our backward, or cockeyed system, only a very small portion of the voters - those who live in "swing" states, have a chance to make a difference.
Voting for Clinton in Idaho, or Trump in Massachusetts, is a waste of time.
George W. Bush and Donald J. Trump got to head our nation because of...we just don't learn!!
5
Kudos to the French voters. They did not succumb to ignorance, fake news and incompetence like the American electorate unfortunately did.
4
Lest we forget. The US popular vote in 2016: Clinton 65,844,610 (48.2%) Trump 62,979,636 (46.1%). The American electorate, as a whole, rejected Trump! Our system failed us (as it did in 2000).
5
Congrats to Macron! Sadly, centrists can never be pure enough for American progressives. They voted Nader and gave America GW Bush. Still having learned nothing they then voted Jill Stein and made Donald Trump president. Will they ever learn?
7
The hack by Russia is an attack on a NATO country, requiring a retaliatory response from NATO.
Part of that response should be broadcasting the truth about the apartment-bomber Putin to the Russian people, including the truth about the Russian army's invasion of the Ukraine and the war crimes, such as bombing hospitals and water supplies, in Syria by the Russian air force.
Part of that response should be broadcasting the truth about the apartment-bomber Putin to the Russian people, including the truth about the Russian army's invasion of the Ukraine and the war crimes, such as bombing hospitals and water supplies, in Syria by the Russian air force.
1
The Russians will continue to hack elections until someone makes them pay a price. Sadly, it will not come from the U.S. Perhaps this French gentleman will tell Putin to get out and stay out of European politics.
4
This french election has left many of us popeyed with cloudy issues. The smack from the hackman had little affect, but likely the far right will continue it's stakeout regardless. Probably lots of deep scrutiny ahead on the part of the established losing parties, no doubt they'll take things apart even down to the rocker panels this time. And the connection to the E.U will remain intact.
The French got their Donald Trump. Americans are too blinded by their ideological blinders to recognize that Le Pen is more like Hillary and Macron more like Trump than they realize.
2
I'm happy! This means that, finally, French criticism of German EU policy has to be taken seriously here in Germany, axis Paris-Berlin will be strengthened again, and accordingly EU will be reformed in the right direction.
This means more Europe, not less.
And vive la France!
This means more Europe, not less.
And vive la France!
2
Not so fast. Best wait up for German elections in September, and hope nothing happens that will send folks running to AfD and the NDP.
The claim this election result constitutes "a step into the unknown," is the most preposterous propaganda. The mere fact that, due exclusively to reasons of political marketing & public relations, this Davos Man was nominated as the functional equivalent of an independent, does not change the fact he was, until a few months ago, a leading member of the same party as President Hollande (whom he served as Finance Minister). He represents precisely the same ideological predispositions as Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Tony Blair, David Cameron, and Justin Trudeau. He's about the least unknown quantity one could imagine. He is a distillation of the desires and prejudices of the transnational ruling class that presently squats over the Western world.
2
Thank you for leading the world where we have failed.
3
Yeah, Alissa. From your erstwhile friend from Johns Hopkins days. You are the best.
NYT 'live' stats are wrong! Macron is currently 65.8 vs Le Pen 34.2. Really! Shades of November 2016.
Grâce à Dieu!!!
4
YAY! Glad Macron beat the fascist candidate.
5
Russia has inserted itself into German, US and now French elections.
There is no member of the US congress that I know of from either party or anyone in the IC that disputes that. (DJT does not count)
So when do we as a respectable, sovereign nation begin planning and imposing (more) sanctions, travel bans and other proactive measures against Russia.
In short, they broke international laws and everyone knows it. It is not in dispute.
When does a response from the US start? What is there to wait on?
Perhaps after the 2018 midterms the House can bring additional measures and proposals to go after Russia for what everyone knows they did.
I fully support a proportional response to the Russian tampering with the US democracy!
There is no member of the US congress that I know of from either party or anyone in the IC that disputes that. (DJT does not count)
So when do we as a respectable, sovereign nation begin planning and imposing (more) sanctions, travel bans and other proactive measures against Russia.
In short, they broke international laws and everyone knows it. It is not in dispute.
When does a response from the US start? What is there to wait on?
Perhaps after the 2018 midterms the House can bring additional measures and proposals to go after Russia for what everyone knows they did.
I fully support a proportional response to the Russian tampering with the US democracy!
10
Similarities remain unsettling.
She's just like Trump. The campaign wrapping itself around a white nationalism meant to fuel white resentment towards minorities.
Both ignore rules for themselves but have literal zero tolerance for everyone else. Both tied to the extreme far right fringe---and likely ultimately destructive to the country itself.
The two attract white supremacists. Both have public praise from former Grand Wizard Klan leader David Duke, and both praise and fawn over Vlad Putin.
She has millions in millions in loan from a Putin associate,was in Moscow this week, and Trump himself just spoke with Putin. His campaign staff being investigated for ties to Putin and Russia. His ties suspected.
Crowds await returns in the next hour.
She's just like Trump. The campaign wrapping itself around a white nationalism meant to fuel white resentment towards minorities.
Both ignore rules for themselves but have literal zero tolerance for everyone else. Both tied to the extreme far right fringe---and likely ultimately destructive to the country itself.
The two attract white supremacists. Both have public praise from former Grand Wizard Klan leader David Duke, and both praise and fawn over Vlad Putin.
She has millions in millions in loan from a Putin associate,was in Moscow this week, and Trump himself just spoke with Putin. His campaign staff being investigated for ties to Putin and Russia. His ties suspected.
Crowds await returns in the next hour.
4
'She said she planned on abstaining because she did not want to choose between “a racist party and a banker party.”'
It can always be worse: sometimes the rich racist 'wins'.
This is what politics have become - we no longer vote for the inspirational leader, we vote against the (more) repugnant candidate.
Some choice.
It can always be worse: sometimes the rich racist 'wins'.
This is what politics have become - we no longer vote for the inspirational leader, we vote against the (more) repugnant candidate.
Some choice.
3
Yes we did :)
7
One significant difference in the quartet of recent elections in Europe and here in the US, is that the popular vote determined the winner in England with Brexit, in Turkey for a constitutional change, and will again in France today for president. But as we know the US is plagued with an archaic quirk in its constitution that allowed a candidate for president with less popular votes to "win", and then initiate programs and policies that, not surprisingly, are not favored by a majority of the populace.
7
Done : 65 %
2
Exit polls show a solid win for Macron! Vive La France, Vive l'Europe!
8
Looks like the French have better memories of what happens when the 0.1% rules!
14
When will WikiLeaks release Donald Trump's tax returns?
When will they leak details of Vladimir Putin's offshore accounts holding billions looted from the Russian people?
When?
When will they leak details of Vladimir Putin's offshore accounts holding billions looted from the Russian people?
When?
15
Never. Move on. Resist (someone/thing else)!
5
Macron wins! Now it's safe for the French to go back to looking down on the Americans! ;-)
11
Just remember that the next time an invading army marches down your Champs Elysees...
Congratulations on your choice for President.
Congratulations on your choice for President.
2
Macron is not a centrist as the MSM pushes. He is a NWO supporter who worked for the Rothschild's. A fake centrist from the very beginning.
3
In my childhood (1970s / Germany) my Grandfather told me about the violent clashes in the streets of Berlin between the rising Nazi thugs and communist and socialist demonstrators and agitators. It seemed such a distant past and inconceivable notion, that a society could be thus divided that people would be ready to kill each other. I now understand that the basic peace and consensus of a democratic society is by no means guaranteed nor are its laws and values to be taken for granted.
5
Interesting...the coverage of the hacking, but not a word about the refusal of some French papers to cover Le Pen and her speeches. The overwhelming media support (including this paper) for Macron is no surprise - we saw the same thing in the US and the UK. Perhaps there will be a story on how the media wins elections?
4
Well there's enough of you Russian infiltrators to spread fake news that the establishment newspapers have the counter that. Of course you have your FOXNews. Enjoy!
3
This is a decision that ultimately lies in French hands, but one can only hope they've learned from our recent election about the dangers of foreign cyber interference, and the limitations of a populist candidate.
And fortunately for them, they have more than two political parties representing the interests of the People...and no Electoral College.
Bonne Chance!
And fortunately for them, they have more than two political parties representing the interests of the People...and no Electoral College.
Bonne Chance!
4
I hate to say it but a win for Macron today is likely a win for Le Pen tomorrow. I wish we'd understand that "pragmatic" centrism isn't - and never was - the answer.
2
No woman has ever successfully led a country based upon Christianity or the Abrahamic religions, Hillary Clinton included. Had Joan of Arc looked the Papal "infallibility doctrine" in the eye and aimed in the correct direction (at the Vatican and Holy Roman Empire laws that required disenfranchisment and disinheritance of women, some incorporated into EU treaty laws by French Catholic men, from DeGaulle (indirectly) to Delors (directly) to Giscard d'Estaing (directly)) instead of at the English constitutional laws that recognized women as holding fundamental rights and responsibilities equivalent to men, where would France be today?
France has never been led by an adult woman. Joan of Arc was a teenager who fought in the Hundred Years' War AGAINST the Lancastrian fundamental constitutional rights of sex equality - and the many adult women leaders in England, the same laws that would later support Charles Darwin and Francis "Christianity should never be taught to young children" Crick - and their scientific discoveries illustrating the vast harms of the Abrahamic religions but debunking Lamarkian nonsense.
The secularism in England is based in a "right of the child"; the secularism in France is based in a "right of the state". Very different things.
France has never been led by an adult woman. Joan of Arc was a teenager who fought in the Hundred Years' War AGAINST the Lancastrian fundamental constitutional rights of sex equality - and the many adult women leaders in England, the same laws that would later support Charles Darwin and Francis "Christianity should never be taught to young children" Crick - and their scientific discoveries illustrating the vast harms of the Abrahamic religions but debunking Lamarkian nonsense.
The secularism in England is based in a "right of the child"; the secularism in France is based in a "right of the state". Very different things.
3
The so-called progressive " Left " today has moved so far left that the people they now label as ' far right ' would have been considered middle of the road in the JFK era. Not that the NYT would acknowledge that.
It's terrible to learn that the French call fake news and email hacks the "Americanization" of French politics, given that these attacks in the U.S. originated with Russia. But here, cyberattacks were boosted by gullible reporting and also by operatives connected to Donald Trump, namely Alex Jones, Roger Stone, Sean Hannity, and others. Now white supremacists in the U.S. are trying to help French fascists. We don't need to use the euphemism "far right." Let's be real–both in the US and in France, the far right is a white nationalist, white supremacist movement.
9
Imagine a presidential ballot with one candidate from the Libertarian Party and one from the Green Party - no Democrats or Republicans. That's effectively what the French have accomplished in this election - an enviable achievement, and a shot across the bow for the deck chair pushers of our stagnant mainstream parties.
2
Clearly the EU has made itself resented. Globalization is the hobgoblin of fearful workers who now want to be protected from it. Anti immigration is a bastion for demagogues who find an angry populace that is seeking easy answers. Macron represents the disagreeable history of the EUs austerity and Germany's domination of the European economy. Le Pen runs again and again on the resentments and the bigotry of voters. At the end of the campaign she was trying to buff up her feminist credentials. Its unclear how much of an issue of being the first woman French president will be for Le Pen. White women in the US gave Trump a much better showing than the Hillary Clinton would care to think about. Macron seems the safe candidate. With the probable future miseries of the UK following Brexit the French would rather than deal with problems they know than launching off into a sea of unknown perhaps worse troubles.
After the Euro declines even further and the EU becomes politically more unstable, there will be a tidal wave of investments returning to the US shores- guaranteed.
5
The EU economy grew 2x faster than the US in Q1...
4
There could be a tidal wave of money hiding to the shores of Vanuatu.Guaranteed for few decades.
When all is said and done France is going to thank the USA for showing them the results of a bad presidential pick. We took one for the team, Europe will be saved by the Trump election, because Trump shows that along with the person elected comes the rest of the family, and the cronies, and the hanger-ons with dangerous ideas. that voting negatively-keeping out immigrants and building walls can never equal a positive. And Just as Trump is determined to destroy Health Care in America, you can bet Le pen will go after France's free health care and do all sorts of nasty things she never spoke about on the campaign trail.
Sure we are living through a never ending nightmare, but the red states may have just saved Europe at the price of their own country.
Sure we are living through a never ending nightmare, but the red states may have just saved Europe at the price of their own country.
6
The French have had the luxury of seeing what happens when Moscow's candidate wins a national election. So they know that while the front runner is not perfect, the other one is a complete disaster. Trump is even more unpopular in France than he is in this country. So unless there is vote tampering, Le Pan will not win.
7
Beth,
Did you just say that if Le Pen wins, it will be from tampering and not the people's will?
How in the world can you support this theory? Based on what?
Did you just say that if Le Pen wins, it will be from tampering and not the people's will?
How in the world can you support this theory? Based on what?
1
Beth!
How and what do you base your "vote tampering" theory on?
How and what do you base your "vote tampering" theory on?
2
I think she means mind anti-establishment infiltrators have been working at. And it worked for frump and worked with Brexit.
2
The global democratic process must accommodate the fact that it will be under constant assault. Russia, China, Turkey, Oil Goons, etc. All of our processes, research, planning, polling must now explicitly measure and analyze these causes and their effects.
5
The rise of Le Pen, Donald Trump, etc. is a 21st Century version of a peasant uprising with pitchforks. The rise of the 1%, those with high tech skills, the widening of the income, wealth gap, is not given the credence it deserves. The alt right, racists are not the main cause of this uprising; they are just an added component of it. The main causes are jobs being transferred to lower paid workers in Romania, Poland, etc, globalism, automation, French culture changing, ( remember farmers dumping potatoes in Paris in opposition to McDonalds' diluting French culture?) etc. And France, more than the USA, hold their culture very highly.
I travel for work to many states, and almost all of them look like all the others: McDonalds, Dunkin Donuts, Walmarts, all over, a sameness. I recently traveled to Japan: McDonalds, 7/11's all over. Japan, another country like France, which has deep respect for their culture, which they see being assailed.
Le Pen will lose because of her fathers history of deep antisemitism, racism. Trump didn't have this extreme view. Le pen, if she had a different father, name, would have easily have benefited from this "pitchfork" uprising.
I travel for work to many states, and almost all of them look like all the others: McDonalds, Dunkin Donuts, Walmarts, all over, a sameness. I recently traveled to Japan: McDonalds, 7/11's all over. Japan, another country like France, which has deep respect for their culture, which they see being assailed.
Le Pen will lose because of her fathers history of deep antisemitism, racism. Trump didn't have this extreme view. Le pen, if she had a different father, name, would have easily have benefited from this "pitchfork" uprising.
7
Has anyone actually taken a look at Macron? The story that asks the question: can a computer robo-profile simulation "Centrist" who was recently a Socialist who worked as a banker for Rothschild serve the interests of the human race? Is he an alien planted into our midst?
5
I just read a chilling article in The Guardian that explains the people behind all this election manipulation. Bannon, Thiel, Mercer - US based billionaires working in concert with democracy-destroyers around the world. Chilling is a very bland word. It points out exactly why I refuse to participate in social media - they are all controlled by the same world players.
Anyone who reads the article will immediately stop using social media like facebook, twitter, linked in and will stop downloading apps on their phones and/or computers. That is how they are controlling the message. They are all owned by these same manipulators.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/may/07/the-great-british-bre...
Anyone who reads the article will immediately stop using social media like facebook, twitter, linked in and will stop downloading apps on their phones and/or computers. That is how they are controlling the message. They are all owned by these same manipulators.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/may/07/the-great-british-bre...
6
Thank you for posting this link. It explains a lot.
the largest abstention by voters in second round since 1969 dit suffit! ha ha haaa!
1
See Le Pen can win!
20% has not voted as expected.
There is Macron's lead per the polls.
Qui Le Pen :)
20% has not voted as expected.
There is Macron's lead per the polls.
Qui Le Pen :)
How do we know all the obvious, traceable hacking and fake news dumps aren't just a screen for what's really being done: direct hacking of the computerized voting machines?
In the case of the U.S. election, all Putin would've had to do was flip 3 or 4 states (states where whites had previously voted for Obama, so the "flip" would be attributed to a repudiation of his administration) to lock in the electoral vote in Trump's favor, despite the minority popular vote going against him.
Why isn't a direct hack on the voting computers being investigated?
In the case of the U.S. election, all Putin would've had to do was flip 3 or 4 states (states where whites had previously voted for Obama, so the "flip" would be attributed to a repudiation of his administration) to lock in the electoral vote in Trump's favor, despite the minority popular vote going against him.
Why isn't a direct hack on the voting computers being investigated?
3
Reading the article "French voters express hope, anger and frustration," the comments of the French mirror many US voters. Hello, it's disgust that many cite. How can you ask a young leftist voter to support a banker or a demagogue? That is the choice? Same as we had with Clinton and Trump; Sanders voters were disgusted, and many have completely given up on our two party system. Even with more parties in France, there is no representation. They are on their 3rd election now of having to vote against Le Pen's party to maintain sanity, and the 'against' choice is always dreadful, never progressive. Macron will make it easier to fire people in hopes that makes it easier to hire people. France is automating as fast as we are. It's like putting a person with the flu outside in the winter in hopes that the virus will die before the patient does.
2
Sanders voters were part of the uninformed. His campaign was infiltrated by Russians and by Republicans. His campaign knew this early on and relayed it to Sanders. But Sanders benefited by the help of the Republicans, trump, and the infiltrators so he said nothing. His ego grew and grew.
Sanders and Trump had a lot in common. It was the Russians and the Republicans that cleverly tied Hillary to the banks.
Sanders and Trump had a lot in common. It was the Russians and the Republicans that cleverly tied Hillary to the banks.
2
Why should the French continue to put up with an undemocratic single-winner voting system then all their neighbours have become real democracies (except the UK)? For that matter, why does the USA, Candada, and the UK also persist in punishing themselves with oligarchies rather than democratically elected governing assemblies? It's time for the electorate to stand up for itself and demand fair elections rather than false choices and fake majorities.
10
It is interesting to see so many articles desperately trying to convince themselves that Macron is an unknown. He is a creature of the establishment who will continue the establishment policies. Why is this a step into the unknown? Just because he is a purer expression of the establishment than the 2 mainstream parties? It is almost like news media trying to convince us that Hillary Clinton would have been historically different.
1
But what do you exactly call "the establishment"? Mr Macron comes from a far poorer background than Mme Lepen, who inherited her father's name and political party, he became a top civil servant after going to SciencesPo - ENA, studying philosophy on the side, he entered the Inspection des Finances (top service of the french finance ministry), then he chose the private sector as an investment banker, and then came back to public service being chosen by Hollande to become finance minister. The french education system allows that: you can reach the top through school.
8
Who knew that the Russian Bear Czar Peter the Great wannabe President Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin cared so much about the outcome of foreign democratic elections in the 'liberty, equality and fraternity' of nation state French mythology?
The restless ghostly souls of Robespierre, Napoleon, Petain and De Gaulle know Putin's 'soul' and Putin knows theirs.
The restless ghostly souls of Robespierre, Napoleon, Petain and De Gaulle know Putin's 'soul' and Putin knows theirs.
2
As of 5 PM, Paris time, voter turnout lower than in any presidential election from 1981 to 2017
Non voters are largest single party : PRAF - Plus rien à faire, plus rien à foutre
Non voters are largest single party : PRAF - Plus rien à faire, plus rien à foutre
2
the there be at least an 85 per cent turn out with intent if this were for leaving the EU. and it would be a resounding ADIEU
1
Qui La France!
Le Pen can win.
Le Pen can win.
2
non, largest abstention since 1969
It is interesting to travel in Europe and see all the HUGE cathedrals and government buildings built by and dedicated to kings and church heads - particularly the catholic church. In France the Robber Baron palaces were turned into government and tourist buildings after the French Revolution when the people cut off the heads of royalty and the Robber Barons - including all the heirs down the line they could find - and eventually developed democracy.
Today the world faces the kind of wealth inequality that makes it ripe for people like The Con Don and Robber Barons to try to take over and control the rest of us. All that will stop them is action by the people starting with - but not ending with - voting. Democracy is not a spectator sport. Neither will WW3 be if we allow it to happen. Let's stop it now:
https://impeachdonaldtrumpnow.org/2017/04/28/la-city-council-committee-v...
Today the world faces the kind of wealth inequality that makes it ripe for people like The Con Don and Robber Barons to try to take over and control the rest of us. All that will stop them is action by the people starting with - but not ending with - voting. Democracy is not a spectator sport. Neither will WW3 be if we allow it to happen. Let's stop it now:
https://impeachdonaldtrumpnow.org/2017/04/28/la-city-council-committee-v...
8
I always look forward to Bastille Day. When the heirs of the Royalists clutch their necks in mute horror. Let them eat cake!? Indeed.
Impeach. Now
Impeach. Now
3
It takes authority to rule. It takes cooperation to govern. it's abot time that we get this.
1
Electing Marcon would be the equivalent of putting Tim Geithner into the US Presidency. HUGE mistake.
6
You really have to wonder if all this dissent against Marcon are Russian infiltrators?
1
If you've ever spent any time in Paris, you know that the French will continue on their current socio-economic path till the rats are on the table joining them for dinner. It seems they believe this guy Macron can stop the overdetermined--a collapse of their social-fiscal system.
Without German banks, France would be not much more than another Greece in the queue. The British were wise to keep their own currency, and still wiser to leave while they can.
Without German banks, France would be not much more than another Greece in the queue. The British were wise to keep their own currency, and still wiser to leave while they can.
7
France is a far richer country than Greece; 2,4 billion GDP vs 195 billion. Of course the public debt is high, still the financial markets are eager to lend money. Despite the many discourses that run here and there about its decline, France is still judged one of the most solid economy in the world.
The 1% cartel will ensure to elect Marcon to protect their European investments. If the Euro keeps declining as it has been, along with the bottoming out of the EU, it portends massive financial losses for them.
Bottom line is Marcon will advance but the aftermath or backlash may not be so pleasant among the electorate.
Hard times ahead for France and all of the EU either way.
Bottom line is Marcon will advance but the aftermath or backlash may not be so pleasant among the electorate.
Hard times ahead for France and all of the EU either way.
6
Not as bad as another election stolen by the racist right.
3
These Russian infiltrators use fake news against anyone who is establishment. Beware!
3
It's good news, if only that le Pen, and fascism, will lose. Thank goodness for that.
3
But I thought you said Hillary would win!
3
Yes, and she had a double digit lead as well.
The MSM is reading from the same script in France as they were in the U.S.
Qui la France!
Change!
Le Pen for 2017
The MSM is reading from the same script in France as they were in the U.S.
Qui la France!
Change!
Le Pen for 2017
Do you mean that because pollsters predicted a Clinton win, it follows that predictions of Trump's wrecking machine are also false? No comparison here, sir. Polls are wild guesses at outcomes while economic realities based on facts. For example, if 24 million people lose their health care support then Emergency Room care will increase and those of us still insured will pay higher premiums to handle the increase. If instead you think that insurers won't pick up that tab then we all will chip in to pay it by paying higher taxes. Only the wealthy will escape by paying less tax under the new Ryan TaxScam.
2
Mike Huckabee said today that Marine le Penn participation in the race is like "inviting a skunk to the dance". What's wrong with the French public?
Putin backs Le Pen and he backed Trump and before him Brexit.
It's worthwhile to examine this from Putin's true perspective. Both Le Pen and Trump are hostile to NATO. Le Pen backs Assad - and if the U.S. continues to court war with Iran, France will likely back Iran or stay neutral.
Putin's needs oil prices to bounce back up by at least a double to have enough cash flow to steal and deal enough crumbs to keep the Russian masses feeling like things are getting better.
But, oil is at $49PPB as of Friday's close, back down from OPEC's last attempt to cut production because due to fracking - OPEC doesn't control world markets unless it cuts production so steeply it hurts their members own cash flow worse than the cure.
Putin is now part of OPEC, which was kind of forced on him as the price of survival in a price war he lost to the Saudis for the European market.
So here is what Putin's objective is: to engineer a war between the US and Iran that engulfs the Middle East and sends oil prices skyrocketing by shutting down the traffic in the Gulf of Hormuz!
Only a complete idiot would do that.
Now you've got Trump's role in all this. And now you know what defines a "useful fool" to Vladimir Putin.
Le Pen will exert enough factional power to serve Putin's true objectives even if she fails in her quest for president.
It's worthwhile to examine this from Putin's true perspective. Both Le Pen and Trump are hostile to NATO. Le Pen backs Assad - and if the U.S. continues to court war with Iran, France will likely back Iran or stay neutral.
Putin's needs oil prices to bounce back up by at least a double to have enough cash flow to steal and deal enough crumbs to keep the Russian masses feeling like things are getting better.
But, oil is at $49PPB as of Friday's close, back down from OPEC's last attempt to cut production because due to fracking - OPEC doesn't control world markets unless it cuts production so steeply it hurts their members own cash flow worse than the cure.
Putin is now part of OPEC, which was kind of forced on him as the price of survival in a price war he lost to the Saudis for the European market.
So here is what Putin's objective is: to engineer a war between the US and Iran that engulfs the Middle East and sends oil prices skyrocketing by shutting down the traffic in the Gulf of Hormuz!
Only a complete idiot would do that.
Now you've got Trump's role in all this. And now you know what defines a "useful fool" to Vladimir Putin.
Le Pen will exert enough factional power to serve Putin's true objectives even if she fails in her quest for president.
3
Clear thinking is so refreshing these days.
The amount of coverage that the Times gives any French election expands exponentially as soon as there is a viable right-wing populist candidate in the mix.
6
The silence of our resident alien on this subject suggests he's offering shelter to suspicious persons, some of them foreign agents. This is grounds for impeachment hearings, accordion to Jefferson and Madison.
Do we have to wrap it in rap for it to be understood our president is steering this ship toward a dictatorchip?
Do we have to wrap it in rap for it to be understood our president is steering this ship toward a dictatorchip?
OMG, is Paul Ryan lyin' more than Trump these dayz or What What? He just told us we are better off with rich people getting more while more poor people pour into emergency rooms again, again.
1
Yep, that's what he has implied and he (along with The Donald) is relying on the Republican base believing what he says and ignoring simple facts. History shows that Reagan's 'trickle-down economics' didn't work and today's TrumpCare with Ryan's TaxScam will take us down that familiar path. We are truly bound by the rule that 'those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it'.
1
Abstaining from voting in La Belle France is as horrid an option as abstaining from voting for Hillary Clinton was in November 2016 in the U,S. Though Mrs. Clinton won 3,000,000 popular votes over her opponent, there was no whit of difference in the obsolete Electoral College which voted Trump into our 45th Presidency, more's the sorrow and pity. We who care about France and the European Union and England's BREXIT, are on tenter-hooks waiting for the returns of this seminal French election. Silence right now from over there. If Le Pen wins, catastrophe from the Extreme Right will reign. If Macron wins, there is hope for change and a new leader for the Quatrieme Republique. We on this side of the pond are hoping and praying for the news of EM's win, as we did for Barack Hussein Obama's wins in 2008 and 2016. As Obama said "Yes, We Can!" and "Si, Se Puede!", and Macron said "En Marche!" and we are hoping "Oui! Nous Pourrons!".
1
Liberal arguments against the electoral college would have credibility if they hadn't sprung up on November 9th.
3
Qui la France
Change!
Macron is a stooge, to be used and controlled by the elite.
LE pen loves France and wants to see it thrieve again.
CHANGE!
This is what we voted for in the US.
France God bless you and keep you safe.
Change!
Macron is a stooge, to be used and controlled by the elite.
LE pen loves France and wants to see it thrieve again.
CHANGE!
This is what we voted for in the US.
France God bless you and keep you safe.
1
the result, a foregone conclusion even before the first round with c.60-40 macron-le marine, has little consequence compared to the legislative elections in june where the old farts will line their pockets behind macronomics
Having been to France several times, I trust the good people of France are not as ignorant or dumb like many in America were to elect a clown like we did. Trump, Le Pen...same thing, evil and black hearted people.
1
Saying you've "been to France several times" (let me guess: to Paris?Provence?) and can therefore predict how the entire rest of the country and COUNTRYSIDE will vote, is like a frequent tourist to Manhattan thinking they could therefore predict how upstate NY and all the flyover states of the U.S. would vote.
1
When you fly to Paris, instead of taking a cab from Roissy to centre-ville, take the RER and you'll get to see what I call the Casbah of Paris - in this case the northeastern part of it - the suburbs full of Arabs and Africans who are anything but French. Many are on public assistance and involved in crime. They hustle for a living. It is there where ISIS recruits.
But forget about terrorists: The threat to France and Europe is the millions of migrants who do not wish to assimilate nor work. The flow in is never ending.
Marine Le Pen wants to stop that flow but even she is pretty resigned as for the millions already in: Trop tard pour ceux-la. The damage is done and if anybody wonders it was the terminally ineffective Hollande who brought the FN to the top, just as Obama brought Trump.
The dust that leads to the mud as they say.
Pseudo socialists can do, as pseudo democrats do as well, a great deal of harm.
Incidentally, one of the goals of Macron, who is certainly not an outsider but a pawn of la banque will be the destruction of French unions, using right to work legislation and other means. Adieu CGT.
But forget about terrorists: The threat to France and Europe is the millions of migrants who do not wish to assimilate nor work. The flow in is never ending.
Marine Le Pen wants to stop that flow but even she is pretty resigned as for the millions already in: Trop tard pour ceux-la. The damage is done and if anybody wonders it was the terminally ineffective Hollande who brought the FN to the top, just as Obama brought Trump.
The dust that leads to the mud as they say.
Pseudo socialists can do, as pseudo democrats do as well, a great deal of harm.
Incidentally, one of the goals of Macron, who is certainly not an outsider but a pawn of la banque will be the destruction of French unions, using right to work legislation and other means. Adieu CGT.
9
Mrs. Rubin seems rather lacking in substantial knowledge and critical understanding of the French ideological landscape in the country's political institutions. She's off the mark. She reports the French elections thinking that they resemble those of the United States.
4
This is done on purpose so as to spread propaganda.
Look at the picture at the top.
It show Macron only, with the title, France chooses a leader.
It smells so similar to Hillary.
Remember when thinking Trump had a chance was ridiculous, and not possible.
And N Y Times told us over and over to accept the coronation of Hillary as inevitable?
And was that true?
Not quite.
So, the same is true of La Pen.
She must have a chance or they wouldn't be pushing Macron as the already won Pres.
Look at the picture at the top.
It show Macron only, with the title, France chooses a leader.
It smells so similar to Hillary.
Remember when thinking Trump had a chance was ridiculous, and not possible.
And N Y Times told us over and over to accept the coronation of Hillary as inevitable?
And was that true?
Not quite.
So, the same is true of La Pen.
She must have a chance or they wouldn't be pushing Macron as the already won Pres.
2
Rarely if at all has been mentioned that both Macron and Le Pen are both like President Trump.
Macron has never held office like President Trump and Le Pen exemplifies that same passion as President Trump, which pundits who opposed both label them as "populists" rather than realists.
Macron has never held office like President Trump and Le Pen exemplifies that same passion as President Trump, which pundits who opposed both label them as "populists" rather than realists.
2
Appears to me that France's election mirrors what we went through just 6 months ago. LePen is Hillary, Macron is Donald. The latter wants to make changes to help the country out of its economic mire, and the former wants to maintain status quo.
Well, no. To the contrary. Ms LP is a far right candidate endorsed by DJT. Mr Macron is a centrist endorsed by President Obama.
Thank you for making a note of it.
Thank you for making a note of it.
@Justme: Necessary differences being observed, the two elections do resemble each other: Macron represents the "winners," wealthy liberal elites who have driven working classes from France's cities and depend on "immigres," as a cheap labor pool, and have shown little or no compassion for the "petits blancs," victims of globalization who are voting for Marine le Pen. Haves vs. have nots, or supporters of HRC v.lower middle class whites who have been gradually but ineluctably impoverished over the past 2 generations or so."Je doute fort" that Ms. Rubin has ever attended a "congres" of FN,(I have attended several) or has spoken to many "le Penistes," I have interviewed many who supported le Pen "pere" and adhere now to his daughter's "rassemblement," and gotten to know them in a way that BERKELEY "sociologue" has come to know and respect Tea Partiers in that parish in La. and wrote "Strangers in their own land," which won a Nobel Prize.Too bad. Readers would have enjoyed shoe leather investigative reporting on the most fervent partisans of the "far right," candidate as she has been portrayed, but which itself is an unfair way to describe her, since she is only defending a voting bloc which before FN and Poujade were "sans defense!"
Chuck you have that backwards.
Macron is the establishments tool.
LaPen is a strong leader who will create change!
Qui la France!
Macron is the establishments tool.
LaPen is a strong leader who will create change!
Qui la France!
2
Last night, I notices so many articles, which question whether either Marine Le Per or Emmanuel Macron could vote. Neith4r had an established Party to support them. But, the two candidates are as different as night and day. As an apparently intelligent man, who is a centrist, he has pledged to improve upon what he believes is worthwhile, within the government, and eliminate that which is outdated or wrong for today's France.
Le Pen, on the other hand, still an intelligent person, has vowed to make numerous changes, exiting both the E. U. and the Euro, and she appears to be cozying-up to Russia. Is Putin enticing he into his lair, as he did Donald Trump?
Marine Le Pen also seems to have a chip on her show; because, her father was shunned from National Leadership. She appears to be intent on continuing to fight his fight, making it her own, and standing-up for the Party, which appears to seek to de-Eurofy France.
This year's French Presidential Election has become the sideshow which it needs't have been. Russian President Vladimir Putin, as he stands on the sidelines, is anxious over where he can split one more major economy away from the E. U.--thus--without France and the U. K., the E. U. would be moving even loser to irrelevance.
Putin's goal: lift the sanctions as the Continent divides, enabling a stronger Russian economy, and that would allow it to devote more money to military expansion and aggressiveness!
https://thetruthoncommonsense.com
Le Pen, on the other hand, still an intelligent person, has vowed to make numerous changes, exiting both the E. U. and the Euro, and she appears to be cozying-up to Russia. Is Putin enticing he into his lair, as he did Donald Trump?
Marine Le Pen also seems to have a chip on her show; because, her father was shunned from National Leadership. She appears to be intent on continuing to fight his fight, making it her own, and standing-up for the Party, which appears to seek to de-Eurofy France.
This year's French Presidential Election has become the sideshow which it needs't have been. Russian President Vladimir Putin, as he stands on the sidelines, is anxious over where he can split one more major economy away from the E. U.--thus--without France and the U. K., the E. U. would be moving even loser to irrelevance.
Putin's goal: lift the sanctions as the Continent divides, enabling a stronger Russian economy, and that would allow it to devote more money to military expansion and aggressiveness!
https://thetruthoncommonsense.com
1
The fact that Progressives are in still in shock, should be promising for the most practical among us. If they eke out a farther political-existence today, they likely will believe their own press clippings, again. As they have in believing the opinion-polls they’ve manufactured. Those polls were designed to elicit, so that the results could be used as governing leverage. The proof that the designed elicits and reality are in stark contrast, lies (no pun) in the; US, UK, France, Germany, Netherlands, Austria, Hungary, Poland, Russia, etc.
Believe it or not: People really aren’t ready to live lives, that none have ever lived; ‘a step into the unknown’!
Believe it or not: People really aren’t ready to live lives, that none have ever lived; ‘a step into the unknown’!
1
All I can say is, Monsieur Macron you'd better keep those big and bright promises that all liberal-economy politicians offer to the working people or the next election will find a French Trump in power and then it will be too late.
2
The workers unions back La Pen. Historically, unuions vote Left in France.
This is the first time ever, where unions are voting Right.
Polls are not accurate. The US election proved that.
The workers of France won't wait until next election to save their jobs from EU neighbors.
This is the first time ever, where unions are voting Right.
Polls are not accurate. The US election proved that.
The workers of France won't wait until next election to save their jobs from EU neighbors.
1
I guess the leaks revealed Macron indeed hid his money from taxes in offshore accounts. Tax evasion on a large scale. Who can you trust?
4
It seems Brexit is a geographic reflection, doesn't apply to France. We will see today, unless it is raining, not a good sign for Macron, neither coherent to geography. Sky has its language, watch.
2
It has been raining, and Mr Macron should prevail by 60%. We do hope for more to send a message to the world: France is back as a leading country against the sad passion of hate.
1
May be it was the tears of joy. Congratulations all the way from history to future. France did a another historical moment for the Western civilization and democracy, enlightenment defeated darkness. Thanks France.
1
I'm glad they didn't pick the far right candidate like the US did, and they that had a decent alternative like the US did not.
Trump was able to co-opt the racist rage of American working class whites to take control of the US and turn the American political system into a business oligarchy after the Russian model.
The French believe they are more sophisticated than the Americans - let's hope this is true and keeps them from falling into the arms for a demagogue.
The French believe they are more sophisticated than the Americans - let's hope this is true and keeps them from falling into the arms for a demagogue.
2
San Francisco:
Let me translate for this West Coaster: Inside the bubble it's "racist rage". Outside the bubble, it's "economic rage."
Let me translate for this West Coaster: Inside the bubble it's "racist rage". Outside the bubble, it's "economic rage."
Should they fall into the safe arms of the establishments patsy, Macron?
1
I've read the French media did not reveal the contents of the hacking, so how was there a "jolt".
2
Internet searches.
We are in the 21st century.
We are in the 21st century.
1
I'm beginning to believe the largest effect of the Macron hacking was on the American conspiracy theorists who believe Putin and Trump are behind a global strategy to dominate.
They will certainly believe anything at this point. Best to not encourage them.
They will certainly believe anything at this point. Best to not encourage them.
1
How come there election is not held on Tuesdays when everyone works and nobody can make it to vote expect for some angry old minority?
I don't understand, but they certainly need to match the leader of the free world, right?
I don't understand, but they certainly need to match the leader of the free world, right?
France now learns what the US did. The left is substandard when it comes to cybersecurity. If they can't keep their dirty little secrets, how should we trust them to protect national secrets?
3
If only the French election had been Before the US election, then perhaps, there would have been a small chance that we might have learned something from France - and to handle saboteurs.
When will the west, including the US, finally confront Putin and tell him that he either stops his criminal acts, or he will be regarded as a war criminal and arrested if he ever steps foot in a western country?
Democracy is worth fighting for, and even taking the risk to die for. Sail an armada, a real one this time, into the Black Sea, composed of American, French, British, German, ships, and let him know his actions could lead to war.
Hugh Massengill, Eugene Oregon
Democracy is worth fighting for, and even taking the risk to die for. Sail an armada, a real one this time, into the Black Sea, composed of American, French, British, German, ships, and let him know his actions could lead to war.
Hugh Massengill, Eugene Oregon
1
You do realize that a war with Russia would be a nuclear war and not a conventional one?
1
I do, I am just wondering if Putin does. He seems to think he can mess with the US and our electoral process with impunity. Sooner or later, this behavior does lead to violence. Are we to wave our hands in the air in weakness and just let him manipulate elections in the West and install stooges as he did in Ukraine, and in the US?
Hugh
Hugh
The Western media has no difficulty in labelling Marine Le Pen's supporters as both xenophobic and racist.
What they won't discuss are the root causes for shaping these attitudes.
The French are not blind to the persecution that Christian minorities endure in Islamic countries and it is a contributing factor as to why France's apprehension of its growing Muslim population is on the rise.
These heightened tensions will only be abated when the West awakens to the realization that the plight of Muslims living in countries like France will improve only when Islamic countries guarantee similar rights and freedoms for their Christian minorities.
And shame on the West for ignoring this!
What they won't discuss are the root causes for shaping these attitudes.
The French are not blind to the persecution that Christian minorities endure in Islamic countries and it is a contributing factor as to why France's apprehension of its growing Muslim population is on the rise.
These heightened tensions will only be abated when the West awakens to the realization that the plight of Muslims living in countries like France will improve only when Islamic countries guarantee similar rights and freedoms for their Christian minorities.
And shame on the West for ignoring this!
5
Whoever wins there is something wrong when a socialist president is elected, socialists are supposed to put "the people" first, who is so bad from the people's viewpoint that he doesn't even bother to try and get reelected.
Macron is a candidate of the featureless corporate center. He is a tool of the banking elite and a person of youthful image rather than substance. He will bring no new solutions, and will undoubtedly soon become as unpopular as his predecessor Hollande (from whom he is nearly indistinguishable in a policy sense).
And it is absolutely imperative that he be elected today to stop LePen.
And it is absolutely imperative that he be elected today to stop LePen.
9
Absolutely not, Macron is NOT the candidate of the featureless corporate center.
The featureless corporate center does NOT unabashedly support marriage equality. Macron like Bernie Sanders is the ONLY French politician who did not equivocate until it was popular, like candidates of the featureless corporate center (let's say Hilary Clinton or her husband).
The featureless corporate center does NOT unequivocally support transition as fast as possible, to a clean renewable energy and bankrupting dirty fossil fuels (let's say like Hilary Clinton who equivocated on fracking or her husband who attempted to project US force to control central Asian oil).
The view of Macron is a candidate of the featureless corporate center is from the press of the myopic North American featureless corporate center such as from New New York Times. The New York Times slammed Bernie Sanders as a liar when he said 100% of the Republican Presidential Candidates were global climate deniers. Bernie was right the New York Times was wrong if one examines the actual policies proposed by 100% of the Republicans candidates rather than their doublespeak.
In many ways Bernie and Emmanuel are more similar than different.
The featureless corporate center does NOT unabashedly support marriage equality. Macron like Bernie Sanders is the ONLY French politician who did not equivocate until it was popular, like candidates of the featureless corporate center (let's say Hilary Clinton or her husband).
The featureless corporate center does NOT unequivocally support transition as fast as possible, to a clean renewable energy and bankrupting dirty fossil fuels (let's say like Hilary Clinton who equivocated on fracking or her husband who attempted to project US force to control central Asian oil).
The view of Macron is a candidate of the featureless corporate center is from the press of the myopic North American featureless corporate center such as from New New York Times. The New York Times slammed Bernie Sanders as a liar when he said 100% of the Republican Presidential Candidates were global climate deniers. Bernie was right the New York Times was wrong if one examines the actual policies proposed by 100% of the Republicans candidates rather than their doublespeak.
In many ways Bernie and Emmanuel are more similar than different.
One impression I take from France's election is the event occurs on a Sunday, which facilitates voting for a larger percentage of the electorate.
Meanwhile, in the U.S., our Presidential election occurs on a Tuesday, which is not a holiday, with polls opening at a variety of times. Polls close as early as 6am in some precincts in states straddling two time zones. There's no uniformity on a federal level, allowing some states to demand photo ID, residency for a particular period, and other criteria to suppress voter participation. The U.S., for all our boasts of being the world's leading democracy, has much to learn and examples to follow from other nations in this regard.
Meanwhile, in the U.S., our Presidential election occurs on a Tuesday, which is not a holiday, with polls opening at a variety of times. Polls close as early as 6am in some precincts in states straddling two time zones. There's no uniformity on a federal level, allowing some states to demand photo ID, residency for a particular period, and other criteria to suppress voter participation. The U.S., for all our boasts of being the world's leading democracy, has much to learn and examples to follow from other nations in this regard.
22
Yes, I wondered always why to vote on a Tuesday, instead of a day off like a Sunday (at least for the most people) and why only a choice between two main parties ? And mainly why is it not a direct universal ballot ?
You seem to forget that alternative forms of voting are widespread in the United States. For example, Oregon is entirely mail-in, and Washington almost entirely. In the East, many states have early voting. Absentee voting is also common.
1
State workers in Indiana get voting Tuesdays as holidays. You can imagine how much that might help the party in power.
1
With any hope at all and a small miracle Marine Le Pen will win and return France to normalcy. But if not, France will remain a non country, government by the EU in particular Germany. That is basically it.
9
I guess the view of reality from Kentucky is really foggy. Probably degenerates like Trump or La Pen appear as saviors.
While a small "miracle" allowed the loser by 3 million votes to become president in the US it is not happening in France.
While a small "miracle" allowed the loser by 3 million votes to become president in the US it is not happening in France.
1
This French election is taking an outsized role in western politics thanks to Brexit and the election of DJT. Will the west fall further into the far right, isolationist, self-destructive, racist politics that have been prevalent recently thanks, at least in part, to the collapse of the banking system in 2008. Or will the brakes be applied and some sense of centrism be able to capture the electorate? I'm rooting for the centrist view where the lessons of the past stay learned instead of having to relearn them.
7
"Centrism" is a meaningless lie. The goal is to take advantage and control the people. To enslave them, if you will, in the interests of the masters. The people are given the opportunity to endorse their enslavement by voting, and affirming their willingness to be enslaved. They lack the basic skills and education to be able to make competent political decisions. Evil must come but woe to those through whom it comes.
The International Mafia is behind all these "elections" and "new" candidates. Their talking head in America is The Con Don and their operatives are the Goldman Sachs boys and girls he has put in charge.
They will control whoever they can LIE, CHEAT, STEAL AND BUY the seat for, just as they do in Turkey, Syria, the Philippines and around the world. It's ALEC gone global. Let's hope the French people elect enough candidates from other parties to stop them.
Meantime, the first order of World business is to get rid of The Con Don and his Robber Baron party in America right now. Here's a start:
https://impeachdonaldtrumpnow.org/2017/04/28/la-city-council-committee-v...
They will control whoever they can LIE, CHEAT, STEAL AND BUY the seat for, just as they do in Turkey, Syria, the Philippines and around the world. It's ALEC gone global. Let's hope the French people elect enough candidates from other parties to stop them.
Meantime, the first order of World business is to get rid of The Con Don and his Robber Baron party in America right now. Here's a start:
https://impeachdonaldtrumpnow.org/2017/04/28/la-city-council-committee-v...
4
Those who still don't know who ALEC is might want to read up a the link bleow. They are a group of radical religionists and "free market" believers who have been buying up politicians they can control for 40+ years to try to destroy democracy in America and the world so The Robber Barons can set themselves up like the kings of 5th/15th centuries and women will "stay in their place" - behind burkas or home barefoot and pregnant with no rights.
Women of America will not go back to the 5th/15th centuries or 1950s. Blacks will not go back. Other minority groups will not go back. NOW is the time to take action and rid OUR governments of the despicable greedsters who have gotten control of it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Legislative_Exchange_Council
Women of America will not go back to the 5th/15th centuries or 1950s. Blacks will not go back. Other minority groups will not go back. NOW is the time to take action and rid OUR governments of the despicable greedsters who have gotten control of it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Legislative_Exchange_Council
3
The French are perfectly capable of digging their own hole in the ground. Since the Socialists are having a Hissy Fit, LePen and her party may win more seats in the French assembly than might be expected.
1
The crazy progressive conspiracy theories have now gone global. It's a worldwide "order" out to getcha! Better take cover!
3
It's true that if Macron wins big, it means that many voters just want anyone else but Marine Le Pen. We will only see how many French support Macron in the June parliamentary election. He wants change and reforms, in order to put the economy back on track. Indeed, the two elections will show whether France is reformable and whether there is appetite for enduring short-term pain.
7
J. Von Hettlingden: First, all elections, like the fluctuations of the "bourse,"r at heart emotionally driven. The poor and down and out in France, victims of globalism and of a country which has always been dominated by elites, will vote for Le Pen, and the "winners,"wealthy liberal elitists who have driven working class folks from the cities into dreary, gruesome HLM's "en banlieue ," so that they could take over, and prefer to employ "immigres" rather than "citoyens,"--its cheaper and makes them feel good inside--are in the catbird seat, and are taking no chances. They control the media, just as the Gaullists did beginning in late 1950's so that their message, and only their message gets through.Tune into RFI and you will see what I mean. France reformable?Disabuse urself of that illusion. Scratch reform from your list.JP Chevenement, whom I got to know well , having been his interpreter on several occasions, would always make fun of his colleagues by referring to them as "socialistes americains:" Bref, socialistes in name only.That says it all. Macron will defend the interests of his class at the expense of those who are at the bottom of the hill.
1
ALALEXANDER HARRISON:
Macron will defend the interests of his class at the expense of those who are at the bottom of the hill.
****
Say what you will about the US election and Americans, at least those at the bottom of the hill were able to make their voices heard.
Macron will defend the interests of his class at the expense of those who are at the bottom of the hill.
****
Say what you will about the US election and Americans, at least those at the bottom of the hill were able to make their voices heard.
1
Does Rubin know nothing of French politics? The French electorate has always been divided. That's how five candidates in round one were able to capture 90% of the vote. It's why de Gaulle created the two stage electoral process to force the French people to behave responsibly and avoid extremism. Macron is not an outsider. He's a classic representative of the very homogenous Grand Ecole French establishment. Rubin has been talking up Le Pen for months when in fact her chances of election were always negligible and now that it looks like Macron will win she's now switching to can he govern type baloney. France has a very centralized and dirigiste form of government run by a remarkably homogenous elite. This is not going to change.
19
Macron looks like he's going to win by a bigger margin than predicted. I'm sure Ms Rubin will find some big problem with this!
I don't see where the unknown would be.
Many French have now understood that their high systemic unemployment is linked to the 35-hour work week, too much protection against firing which discourages hiring, not enough job hour flexibility for e-commerce to thrive, too many people still retiring at 62, the list goes on.
It disproportionately affects the young and low educated and this creates tensions. Macron has been clear from the start that he will take unpopular decisions to modernise the labour market. There is also a growing consensus among Western European countries to tackle the problem of detached Eastern European workers outcompeting locals on wages.
I think France will be much better off in 6 years.
Many French have now understood that their high systemic unemployment is linked to the 35-hour work week, too much protection against firing which discourages hiring, not enough job hour flexibility for e-commerce to thrive, too many people still retiring at 62, the list goes on.
It disproportionately affects the young and low educated and this creates tensions. Macron has been clear from the start that he will take unpopular decisions to modernise the labour market. There is also a growing consensus among Western European countries to tackle the problem of detached Eastern European workers outcompeting locals on wages.
I think France will be much better off in 6 years.
4
As soon as they even mention such reforms, all the unions will go on strike.
1
Please at least remove the 35 hour week from your list, high unemployment rates in France well predate this 2002 law (as in, equally applicable to public and private sectors by that date). For the rest, I certainly hope France will be better off in 6 years after what I hope to be Mr. Macron's first term in office.
1
France has an election every 5 years, a change under President Chirac 12 years ago. Not 6.
Why can't we emulate the French by having election day on a Sunday, instead of a Tuesday work day?
15
republicans would never allow it. Work day elections, along with gerrymandering and Comey-type tactics are the only way they can win and they know it. Everyone knows it.
1
Perhaps European countries would emerge from the current era more intact if they stayed in the EU but closed their borders, turning their far-reaching union into more of a free trade deal between separate countries.
4
Closing borders is a modern concept. Really happened only in the 20 c.
Could the old political order be breaking up? In interesting thought. In the United States a similar thing has happened. The political alignment that has been in place since the time of JFK seems to be coming apart.
7
The French presidential electoral process is in much better shape than ours simply due to the fact that the winner is the candidate that gets the most votes. Herre in the US, we have to deal with an arcane, dysfunctional electoral college that lost its usefulness and purpose 150 years ago and which remains only because the Republican Party knows it is the only way they can win a presidential election going forward. Without the electoral college, we would have Hillary as President and not our Buffoon-in-Chief.
15
Liberals only complained about the EC after they lost.
1
Tommyboy, research that theory of popular vote.
How will low population states have a voice in our election?
Our founding fathers thought it out and came up with electorial college.
How would your way be fairer?
How will low population states have a voice in our election?
Our founding fathers thought it out and came up with electorial college.
How would your way be fairer?
LEH
I am appalled that you cite our founding fathers, given your avid desire to undo most of their core concepts.
But be that as it may, they created the electoral college when 90%+ of Americans lived on the farm or in deeply rural areas. Whatever their mechanism of choice, their desire was to see to it that Americans had fair opportunity to participate in their own government.
Now the situation is plainly reversed, with something like 87% of Americans living in cities or close in suburbs. And you, you founding father worshiper, are clinging to an illicit advantage based upon literal parsing of their words rather than their clearly stated and often repeated intent.
If you want to keep your electoral college, go right ahead, but apply as it was meant to be not how you, in your ignorance, wish it was.
I am appalled that you cite our founding fathers, given your avid desire to undo most of their core concepts.
But be that as it may, they created the electoral college when 90%+ of Americans lived on the farm or in deeply rural areas. Whatever their mechanism of choice, their desire was to see to it that Americans had fair opportunity to participate in their own government.
Now the situation is plainly reversed, with something like 87% of Americans living in cities or close in suburbs. And you, you founding father worshiper, are clinging to an illicit advantage based upon literal parsing of their words rather than their clearly stated and often repeated intent.
If you want to keep your electoral college, go right ahead, but apply as it was meant to be not how you, in your ignorance, wish it was.
Our paper of record should add its name to those who got lost in the pettiness of the 2016 election process for rather that giving serious focus to the state of the nation and the content of the electioneering it abandoned its role to join with other in bating Trump and adoring Clinton, neither one of which were offering much consideration to what could be done to deal with troubling times, domestic and foreign.
7
A large part of the elderly class is going to stay at home, rain or shine. The ones I have listened to, feel uncomfortable casting their choice for what they call 'a sad choice' and they have memories of WWII. They would have supported M. Fillon. It will be a first absentee for a friend who has voted these sixty years past.
It was a former boss of mine, once the U.S. Ambassador to France, who gave me a scold about the privilege I had in being able to have a voice. Emmanuel Macron gets hacked a little too close to the elections, making it fairly obvious that somebody has it in for him.
Chancellor Merkel and I would support him. Le Pen should have addressed first and foremost the high rate of unemployment and she blew it the other evening in the debate when she behaved like an Irish banshee. Call it ISIS, the State of Islam, Fascism, or Global Terrorism, it will take a concerted effort on the part of a United Europe to contain it.
Emmanuel Macron has some heavy backers behind him, seasoned, measured and reasoned who are not going on about 'Nationalism'. He has a strong woman standing beside him. There is a disparity in age? Perhaps America could see that not all men wander off with younger roses when the first have lost their bloom.
La Famille, La Patrie, Education, Employment, but above all, 'Ne Vous Laissez Pas Faire' with this late plot for an important date, vote if you are able and fit. It is not a sure win for either of these candidates and 'Marchons'.
It was a former boss of mine, once the U.S. Ambassador to France, who gave me a scold about the privilege I had in being able to have a voice. Emmanuel Macron gets hacked a little too close to the elections, making it fairly obvious that somebody has it in for him.
Chancellor Merkel and I would support him. Le Pen should have addressed first and foremost the high rate of unemployment and she blew it the other evening in the debate when she behaved like an Irish banshee. Call it ISIS, the State of Islam, Fascism, or Global Terrorism, it will take a concerted effort on the part of a United Europe to contain it.
Emmanuel Macron has some heavy backers behind him, seasoned, measured and reasoned who are not going on about 'Nationalism'. He has a strong woman standing beside him. There is a disparity in age? Perhaps America could see that not all men wander off with younger roses when the first have lost their bloom.
La Famille, La Patrie, Education, Employment, but above all, 'Ne Vous Laissez Pas Faire' with this late plot for an important date, vote if you are able and fit. It is not a sure win for either of these candidates and 'Marchons'.
7
"casting their choice for what they call 'a sad choice' and they have memories of WWII."
This is absurd. To cast Macron this way by invoking WW2 strikes me as a fabrication.
This is absurd. To cast Macron this way by invoking WW2 strikes me as a fabrication.
Be as it may, David Henry, call it the graveyards of the Past if you will, but the choice is theirs to remain at home and not vote at all. As for absurdity, perhaps it is time to revisit Ionesco.
I don't see how a hack of emails that for the most part no one in France has seen and unlike the Clinton and friends emails does not reveal a venal streak of self-dealing is going to make a 25 point swing in favor of Le Pen.
5
According to the Interior ministry, voter turnout is currently the same as in the 1st round of the Presidential election.
My family just voted in Paris 15th district (which voted traditionally to the right and republican). In the local election office we voted, turn out was heavy, there is 2-3x more voters than we witnessed in the 1st round. There was no line 2 weeks ago, but today there is a long line. Mr. Macron won Paris in the 1st round.
My family just voted in Paris 15th district (which voted traditionally to the right and republican). In the local election office we voted, turn out was heavy, there is 2-3x more voters than we witnessed in the 1st round. There was no line 2 weeks ago, but today there is a long line. Mr. Macron won Paris in the 1st round.
7
Sources tell me that French intelligence were on high alert leading up to the elections. When they noticed an outside source searching Macron's files, the intelligence agency planted false information into the files they were searching. The fake news was actually planted by the French intelligence services to mislead the hackers and beat them at their own game.
Anyway, the information that was released on Macron should have little effect on the election. Unlike the United States, France has a blackout policy on news leading up to the election and its unlikely French citizens were aware of the hacking .
Anyway, the information that was released on Macron should have little effect on the election. Unlike the United States, France has a blackout policy on news leading up to the election and its unlikely French citizens were aware of the hacking .
6
What sources?
1
Macron will win today and he will go to govern France by negotiating a majority for each issue, whether or not he can obtain an overall majority in the Parliamentary elections. This is the way it is done in Denmark, where proportional representation usually ensures that there are more than a dozen parties represented in parliament. That way a democratic consensus is reached on every issue, every week, instead of once every 4 years. In a rapidly changing world, it is the ONLY good way to run a democracy in peacetime. It would not work in wartime, when the government of the day must make fast decisions without debate, which is why proportional representation was not adopted in warlike nations.
13
By French laws, there is an election news black out from Friday midnight to Sunday 8pm when election results are officially known for the 1st time. With the exception of the web, the hack did not get any coverage on TV.
The debate on Wednesday May 3rd was determinant in making up a majority of voters' mind already.
The debate on Wednesday May 3rd was determinant in making up a majority of voters' mind already.
7
While I certainly believe this law is an excellent idea, and would benefit the US immensely, along with severe limitations on the duration of campaigns, it's naive to assume as absolute an effect as you suggest here.
Cross border/cross channel communications such as radio, television, and the internet dull the impact of such a blackout and, while they are clearly beneficial, cannot be said to eliminate the impact of dishonest and ill-intended communications.
In fact by denying any opportunity for response the effect may be the opposite.
Cross border/cross channel communications such as radio, television, and the internet dull the impact of such a blackout and, while they are clearly beneficial, cannot be said to eliminate the impact of dishonest and ill-intended communications.
In fact by denying any opportunity for response the effect may be the opposite.
1
As in the US, the French right wing knows that it can win elections only by cheating.
12
Who cheated Bernie? It wasn't the "right-wing"!
1
I am hopeful France will right the U.S. wrong. Macron will win in a landslide because of the hack, leaks & fake news and not in spite of them. While I am no fan of French politics, they have learned from the U.S. folly and France will reverse of the tide of the alt-right alliance (including Russia) worldwide
13
Hi,
Macron will not win because of those tricks, which will probably not affect voters from both sides. Any candidate facing Marine Le Pen would win because her side (Front National) has always been a love-it-or-hate-it thing, and it is still very unpopular. That being said, the Front National has been seducing more voters with each year since 2002 (when in a similar spot, Jean-Marie Le Pen only managed around 20%) and the 60% vs 40% result is the only fact to consider. We french are getting angry and paranoid, while we are losing ground in the globalization game: our economy is disappointing, education and more generally public service is deteriorating. We are pessimistic, we don't have a clue how to keep up with developing countries, and we need to make someone pay for this. Some rely heavily on foreigners and muslims, others on bankers and white collars. This election showed very little solidarity and cohesion. So don't bet much on us, dear americans.
Macron will not win because of those tricks, which will probably not affect voters from both sides. Any candidate facing Marine Le Pen would win because her side (Front National) has always been a love-it-or-hate-it thing, and it is still very unpopular. That being said, the Front National has been seducing more voters with each year since 2002 (when in a similar spot, Jean-Marie Le Pen only managed around 20%) and the 60% vs 40% result is the only fact to consider. We french are getting angry and paranoid, while we are losing ground in the globalization game: our economy is disappointing, education and more generally public service is deteriorating. We are pessimistic, we don't have a clue how to keep up with developing countries, and we need to make someone pay for this. Some rely heavily on foreigners and muslims, others on bankers and white collars. This election showed very little solidarity and cohesion. So don't bet much on us, dear americans.
4
I Absolutely agree!
Dear Joris,
I've always had a special place in my heart for France. As here in the US, things there are changing, and not for the better. On my last trip there I was assaulted (though not harmed) by two immigrants. This was very strange for me as I have always had really good experiences with immigrants from all countries in France. My sister lived in the 20th, and her neighbors were from all over the place. Most all were very nice, and had a strong love of France and French culture.
I sensed an underlying anger from the youngsters that accosted me in the street outside of the Opera at Bastille. This had never happened before.
I think France is facing a somewhat different situation than here in the US, where immigrant violence is rare. Much of the problem there is unemployment - these young immigrants can't find work, and that leads to them being opened up to extremism, depression. I believe that Macron is much more capable than Le Pen in addressing the underlying economic issues. I hope he is successful, and that your country eventually prospers.
I've always had a special place in my heart for France. As here in the US, things there are changing, and not for the better. On my last trip there I was assaulted (though not harmed) by two immigrants. This was very strange for me as I have always had really good experiences with immigrants from all countries in France. My sister lived in the 20th, and her neighbors were from all over the place. Most all were very nice, and had a strong love of France and French culture.
I sensed an underlying anger from the youngsters that accosted me in the street outside of the Opera at Bastille. This had never happened before.
I think France is facing a somewhat different situation than here in the US, where immigrant violence is rare. Much of the problem there is unemployment - these young immigrants can't find work, and that leads to them being opened up to extremism, depression. I believe that Macron is much more capable than Le Pen in addressing the underlying economic issues. I hope he is successful, and that your country eventually prospers.
Mr. Bussereau is not correct saying "We are changing into a four-party system that has never existed before in France in the Fifth Republic, and that does not exist elsewhere in large European countries,” Germany (considering it is a large European country) has a four party system since years (CDU, SPD, Die Grünen, die Linke) with the right Wing AFD possibly joining the parliament in September making it a five-party system. Depending if the liberals (FDP) may rejoin the parliament it might even be a six-party system.
8
And the Media has Macron wins... Just like they had Hillary winning.... Just like they had BRIXIT losing....
Globalism will lose because those who are orchestrating it refuse to deal with a simple reality: We prefer those who have some semblance of similarity with the way we live and what we believe. We will never have foisted upon us violence, misogyny, institutionalized hate, and murder. Globalism has brought all of those things into Western Civilization in institutionalized form
We will not have it.
Globalism will lose because those who are orchestrating it refuse to deal with a simple reality: We prefer those who have some semblance of similarity with the way we live and what we believe. We will never have foisted upon us violence, misogyny, institutionalized hate, and murder. Globalism has brought all of those things into Western Civilization in institutionalized form
We will not have it.
18
"have foisted upon us violence, misogyny, institutionalized hate, and murder. "
Gee we have all those things here in the US under the repugs and trump. Hate. Check
Mysogyny. Check
Institutionalized hate. Check
Murder. Check
(if u r a black person walking or driving)
We don't need to keep out the 'other'
We are them.
Gee we have all those things here in the US under the repugs and trump. Hate. Check
Mysogyny. Check
Institutionalized hate. Check
Murder. Check
(if u r a black person walking or driving)
We don't need to keep out the 'other'
We are them.
7
Globalism is one of those "bubble" issues. Very well liked within it where the benefits are felt by the wealthy but viewed suspiciously outside it where its effects have made life much more difficult.
In the bubble everyone outside is considered ignorant or racist, etc., for not sharing the insiders' enlightenment. Those outside the bubble responded to this attitude in the US by electing Trump. The French don't face quite the same choice, but there is definitely a backlash underway.
In the bubble everyone outside is considered ignorant or racist, etc., for not sharing the insiders' enlightenment. Those outside the bubble responded to this attitude in the US by electing Trump. The French don't face quite the same choice, but there is definitely a backlash underway.
5
Globalism is here to stay. The oligarchs are the ones who have orchestrated it since the 1980s. There is no turning back. If you think Donald Trump represents you then you're sadly mistaken. Look at the people in his cabinet. Many are former Goldman Sachs, a company that he beat up on during the election. The fact that England pulled out of the European Union spells more trouble in the future. It appears Scotland will vote to break away from the United Kingdom leaving only England, Wales and Northern Ireland. There is a video on Youtube that deals with globalization I suggest you watch. It's titled 'How the West Re-Colonized China.' You will see David Rockefeller in there who recently died at the ripe old age of 101. Oh and btw Trump and his daughter are still making their clothing line in China, Indonesia, Mexico, Bangladesh; I'm getting tired already writing so many countries. The list is long. And they never will bring those jobs back to America.
How do you consider a man that was in the government as Economy Leader for 2 years an outsider ? Le Pen seems to have been running for something her entire adult life as well.
Le Marche platform is a center of right ( wildly left in the U.S. ) and a socially progressive platform. It's leader is a young and charismatic go-getter with a love story background for the ages.
The other candidate wants to promote Fascism.
Hack all you want Russia, this time it will not matter. Clear and decisive victory for the people of France for a leader without previous corruption.
Le Marche platform is a center of right ( wildly left in the U.S. ) and a socially progressive platform. It's leader is a young and charismatic go-getter with a love story background for the ages.
The other candidate wants to promote Fascism.
Hack all you want Russia, this time it will not matter. Clear and decisive victory for the people of France for a leader without previous corruption.
34
This article does M Macron a disservice by saying that his victory will chiefly reflect French voter's oppsition to Mme Le Pen.
Macron's detailed program, with a budget to pay for it, and his embrace of traditional culture combined with a fresh, forward-thinking approach, won him the first round. M Fillon and his Républicain colleagues back Macron, as do the Socialists. He will be able to build a balanced coalition in Congress.
Fillon no more wants France to leave the EU than Macron. Their primary difference was security, police and prisons. Fillon really wanted to pump up the police force and number of prisons--American style.
As America knows--with the most police, prisons and violent crime in the world--more cops and prisons are not deterrents.
Macron wants to add 10,000 police, and work with all EU countries to strengthen EU borders. But, he believes prisons are universities of crime. He wants France do a better job with education. He wants to give vision to at-risk youths, career opportunities to young adults who have chosen a trade or artisan track, and incentivize companies to hire them.
Le Pen's solution for those who have lost work to lower paid workers from other EU countries is to leave the EU. Macron wants to level the playing field, via the EU, and keep France in the world's largest and richest trade bloc.
Those who fear and hate strangers and new ideas will vote for Le Pen. Those who embrace French culture and the 21st century, will vote for Macron
Macron's detailed program, with a budget to pay for it, and his embrace of traditional culture combined with a fresh, forward-thinking approach, won him the first round. M Fillon and his Républicain colleagues back Macron, as do the Socialists. He will be able to build a balanced coalition in Congress.
Fillon no more wants France to leave the EU than Macron. Their primary difference was security, police and prisons. Fillon really wanted to pump up the police force and number of prisons--American style.
As America knows--with the most police, prisons and violent crime in the world--more cops and prisons are not deterrents.
Macron wants to add 10,000 police, and work with all EU countries to strengthen EU borders. But, he believes prisons are universities of crime. He wants France do a better job with education. He wants to give vision to at-risk youths, career opportunities to young adults who have chosen a trade or artisan track, and incentivize companies to hire them.
Le Pen's solution for those who have lost work to lower paid workers from other EU countries is to leave the EU. Macron wants to level the playing field, via the EU, and keep France in the world's largest and richest trade bloc.
Those who fear and hate strangers and new ideas will vote for Le Pen. Those who embrace French culture and the 21st century, will vote for Macron
65
Those who resent being depicted as animals who loathe outsiders and anything progressive will vote for Le Pen. Cannot say I blame them.
2
A good approach, but you still believe that Le Pen has a program like Trump had. Populists do the best flowery campaigning program just to win. When this is done, they turn their back to the voters. Do you know Trump? Copy and paste the after winning destructive Populist program. Macron is not tested yet, you cab believe in his program so far.
1
Ms Le Pen does not want the Presidency. She has the same program than a dog on attack, nothing more. She can't hold the leash and bark at the same time. Ms Le Pen will never be President. Watch her niece - as France is for them a little family run hate-business.
This comment is so dim.. Lepen can never win the legislative elections in June and would have to govern with a left or right centrist government in Matignon. Things will go much smoother with 2 centrists politicians working together in case one does not a majority (most likely) in the future legislative elections of June. 20% Fillon has already said to vote for Macron. No one but 4% Dupont Aignon is saying to vote for Lepen. 9% socialist party is recommending Macron. There will stability regardless with a centrist government, none whatsoever with a far right government. Actually they most likely could not form a government with Lepen at Elysee
4
Thank you for not referring to the hack as MacronLeaks or MacronGate. A lot of newspapers fell for it and this was of course the intention, there was nothing of any interest in the documents. To be clear, "Leaks" imply a whistleblower and dubious actions hidden from the outside world, not at all the case here.
7
I was 24 when I saw the end of iron curtain, in 1990. I was so happy finally to see the end of pure and rough communism during my lifetime. My next aim was to attend at the end of pure and rough capitalism but no it has been worse than I could imagine. At the early 2000s I realized the dismantling of French industries and its unemployed persons' procession.
For me, it is fine, I have still got a job, but now I must send almost a third of my work to Bucharest in Romania, where my collegues speak an excellent French but who earn a quarter of what I earn. To have a job for how long still ?
After my work, I must come back to my home, an social housing well located on Lille Metropole, very pleasant to live but unfortunately, I had to face a drug trafficking which have returned my life and that of my neighbors wholly unbearable.
All that for summing up, me too I could have voted for Marine Le Pen and her disdemonized National Front. But I have prefered to abstain 14 days ago, unless I voted blank because the political offer didn't match me. Today, I am fed up to have to vote against somebody rather than for somebody. I lost the faith in French politic. For the fist time in my life, I have not voted in concrete manner for a Presidential election in France. I consider as a French citizen in distress. We are sunday morning and I am about to go to my poll station for voting and to slip again a ballot paper blank in the ballot box. I am fed up to elect a monarch for 5 years
For me, it is fine, I have still got a job, but now I must send almost a third of my work to Bucharest in Romania, where my collegues speak an excellent French but who earn a quarter of what I earn. To have a job for how long still ?
After my work, I must come back to my home, an social housing well located on Lille Metropole, very pleasant to live but unfortunately, I had to face a drug trafficking which have returned my life and that of my neighbors wholly unbearable.
All that for summing up, me too I could have voted for Marine Le Pen and her disdemonized National Front. But I have prefered to abstain 14 days ago, unless I voted blank because the political offer didn't match me. Today, I am fed up to have to vote against somebody rather than for somebody. I lost the faith in French politic. For the fist time in my life, I have not voted in concrete manner for a Presidential election in France. I consider as a French citizen in distress. We are sunday morning and I am about to go to my poll station for voting and to slip again a ballot paper blank in the ballot box. I am fed up to elect a monarch for 5 years
22
As I have said to acquaintances who plan to do as you do, a "vote blanc" is a vote pour LePen.
3
France has never been a free capitalist society. At least not in the last 50 yrs.
Jean - Michael - So Important for you to vote even if you don't care for one over the other. VOTE, even if you don't like that candadiate, but vote for the one you believe would l be the better representative and work for the French. And if you choose not to vote - then never, ever complain.
1
WOW goes to show you the Russians are hacking another election I really think the "black out" on TV & all forms of media from the politics the night before the final election is a great idea why can't we do the same.Now we need to hunt down those hackers!! The Trumpeter and "so called" president who helped Russia hack us by loving Putin and asking Putin on national TV to get Clinton's emails was a reality.
We should have known earlier when Kelly Ann Conway said "oh thats fake news" she must of know that Russia was doing this to our election how else would she come up with this saying on the media we now understand months later that this was a reality. They should investigate Conway and the whole Trump campaign people. They are dishonest!
We should have known earlier when Kelly Ann Conway said "oh thats fake news" she must of know that Russia was doing this to our election how else would she come up with this saying on the media we now understand months later that this was a reality. They should investigate Conway and the whole Trump campaign people. They are dishonest!
6
What we're looking at with Trump and Le Pen is the rise of the Putin Party. Call it what it is.
The Putin Party are thugs. Bullies. They hack elections. They make under the table deals. They spread disinformation. They lie.
The Putins want to establish a global oligarchy to control all the world's wealth.
Organizations like the GOP will look back on this period with horror when see how they've been manipulated to sell out our democracy.
The Putin Party are thugs. Bullies. They hack elections. They make under the table deals. They spread disinformation. They lie.
The Putins want to establish a global oligarchy to control all the world's wealth.
Organizations like the GOP will look back on this period with horror when see how they've been manipulated to sell out our democracy.
12
A growing number of French citizens, "the invisibles" - the unemployed and the working poor - are pushed to the extremes by a brutal capitalism. It is not the success of the centrist Macron that will save my country from the toxic far right or the demagogical far left, it is when companies like Whirlpool will stop relocate their factories from France to Poland in order to increase their profits. Globalization equals "relocation and impoverishment" for a large part of the French population, more and more people close to me make this assumption. The challenge of Macron will be to prove them wrong. And he won't be able to do it alone. Governments in Europe have to show "the invisibles" that they can exist and hope for a better life, not barely survive on minimum wage. I suspect that its the same challenge that the American society faces today. People are desperate, we have to listen to them even if their anger make them choose the wrong path.
9
Give me a break! "Les invisibles" have much better unemployment compensation than in the US. And that is in all European countries.
Might want to rethink that "wrong path" reference. Isn't it the current path that is wrong for them? The definition of "right" and "wrong" obviously needs some refinement.
These election surprises are messages sent that current thinking, and with it its ideas of "acceptable" and "unacceptable", need to be re-examined.
These election surprises are messages sent that current thinking, and with it its ideas of "acceptable" and "unacceptable", need to be re-examined.
2
I wish the NY Times and other mainstream corp. controlled media would tell us what was the information that was discovered - of course only those portions that were not related to Macron's personal life. All non-personal and politically related information about persons of influence should be released. Who discovers the information and how it is released are irrelevant to a true liberal democracy. Unless, you are the mainstream media or the corporations and the super-wealthy, you would welcome the liberal principles of the Enlightenment.
4
Exept that some of the documents leaked are faked. I do not think that Voltaire, Montesquieu, Jefferson, Paine, Franklin and all the other enlightened spirits of the 18th century thought that the role of the press as a defender of civil liberties should include the publication of faked e-mails and libel. And your remark about the super-wealthy is just absurd. Putin and Trump are both billionaires, none of the 11 french candidates is. Why don't your change your alias from Thomas Paine to Robert Welch?
2
@Hans - You should see some of the stuff they published in 18th-century newspapers. LIbellous falsehoods were their stock in trade, and every newspaper was fiercely partisan.
1
Thomas, please.
Are you really that gullible?
Who do you think' controls' FOX.
Who do you suppose 'controls' Rush, forces him into his embarrassing admissions and crocodile confessions of inappropriate commentary?
Here's a hint: they are global billionaires. They are economic elites concerned first and foremost with their personal fortunes and their family dynasties.
They are as fake as professional wrestling, and you seem to have hit the bait very hard...becoming a true fanboy of the corporations and the super-wealthy.
Use your head, man.
Are you really that gullible?
Who do you think' controls' FOX.
Who do you suppose 'controls' Rush, forces him into his embarrassing admissions and crocodile confessions of inappropriate commentary?
Here's a hint: they are global billionaires. They are economic elites concerned first and foremost with their personal fortunes and their family dynasties.
They are as fake as professional wrestling, and you seem to have hit the bait very hard...becoming a true fanboy of the corporations and the super-wealthy.
Use your head, man.
Whether many commentators of this article like it or not, Le Pen, winner or loser, by stirring the political landscape, will remain the key player of this election. The red flag of nazism, often cited by commentators hereunder, is an argument that has long lost its sting in France. Both socialists, conservatives and "the establishment" have never understood this fact. Until now, they have ignored how divided and frustrated french people are especially the so-called "popular" classes. Under "softie" Macron things will get even worse. As his predecessors Sarkozy and Hollande he will pay tribute to a hodge-podge of political, financial, labour and trade union, etc., special interests and the ensuing chaos will be worse than ever. Whilst admittedly the FN is not a viable alternative, the main culprit in France's decline is a political cast, socialists and conservatives, that lives in total oblivion and denial of the real problems of the country and has clung to power by the principle "you scratch my back, I scratch your back". The monarchist and totally anachronistic government structures are, on top of an insidious corruption, also another main cause of the sad state of affairs in France.
7
Sadly, for the first time, France used a primary election system. The right and the left held elections for a fee. 2 euros for the right and 1 euro for the left. These "elections" were run by the two parties with very odd results indeed. Corrupt Fillon on the right (LR party) and weak Socialist Hamon on the left. These two "winners" were hopeless candidates who have left the road open to fascist Le Pen and the young inexperienced banker Macron. It's a very sad state of affairs. No one likes Macron and he really shouldn't be where is right now. A large part of his 24% in the first runoff was from people like me who voted for him out of fear Le Pen. Her strength lies in recognizing and speaking up for the poor and marginalized in France. And if France had an electoral college system like the US, she would win. If Macron wins and tries to take apart labor agreement policies as he has promised, he will be in for a major revolt from the working class. His party "En Marche" he invented from nothing and his prime minister and government remain a mystery with talk of "private sector experts" taking roles. This makes a lot of people very uneasy from what we have seen of the billionaires surrounding Trump. So yes, Macron is a bitter pill to swallow, even with the impossible alternative that is Le Pen.
4
"No one likes Macron"
What allows you to say that? How many Frenchs do you know?
What allows you to say that? How many Frenchs do you know?
"On Our Way!" is a really poor translation of "En Marche!" "Let's Move!" is a much more accurate translation.
12
Onwards!
This article is fake news, and I will tell you why. First, to call Macron an outsider is false. He is a former government minister, and has received the quick endorsement of the Establishment, foreign and domestic. Second, Le Pen dissociated France from the Vichy regime, taking the (convenient) line that the true French government was Le Gaulle in London. Is that a 'far-right' anti-semitic thing to say? No, just a fudging of the truth, borne out of the shame of French collaboration with the Nazis. Le Gaulle himself used it. As for the hack, nothing so far? I heard all kinds of rumors, from Macron being gay etc... could be all lies, but that remains to be determined, and not a priorI either... so far WikiLeaks has a record of non-fake releases...
3
The article described the hacked material as consisting of mundane stuff.
Interestingly enough, that's what a lot of Clintonites and moderates said about the John Podesta e mails of Hillary Clinton. They said that it was mundane stuff, tales of catty political operatives complaining about each other and other unremarkable stuff.
However, they were just protecting Hillary. One of the e mails, for example, reported that at a meeting of bankers Hillary said that she was wholly supportive of open borders and untrammelled, unrestriced free trade. We have been told to hate the Wikileaks revelations because of alleged Russian instigation. While I don't like the idea of foreign governments tampering with our alleged democracy, I also think it's important to tell the truth and Wikileaks, far from being mundane, made it clear that Hillary was, in large measure, an apologist and advocate for the arrogant rich and that Bernie Sanders should have been the nominee.
I wonder if the hacked material on Macron similarly shows that he is an unrecontructed globalist, blithely unconcerned about the decimation of blue collar workers.
Interestingly enough, that's what a lot of Clintonites and moderates said about the John Podesta e mails of Hillary Clinton. They said that it was mundane stuff, tales of catty political operatives complaining about each other and other unremarkable stuff.
However, they were just protecting Hillary. One of the e mails, for example, reported that at a meeting of bankers Hillary said that she was wholly supportive of open borders and untrammelled, unrestriced free trade. We have been told to hate the Wikileaks revelations because of alleged Russian instigation. While I don't like the idea of foreign governments tampering with our alleged democracy, I also think it's important to tell the truth and Wikileaks, far from being mundane, made it clear that Hillary was, in large measure, an apologist and advocate for the arrogant rich and that Bernie Sanders should have been the nominee.
I wonder if the hacked material on Macron similarly shows that he is an unrecontructed globalist, blithely unconcerned about the decimation of blue collar workers.
9
Wikileaks is now a subsidiary of Russian Intelligence and Assange is Putin's willing tool.
To regard them any other way would necessarily require a willful suspension of disbelief.
To regard them any other way would necessarily require a willful suspension of disbelief.
7
Hillary also claimed the emails on her private server were mostly grandchildren and yoga mentions. While it's tempting to see Hillary's and Macron's situations as similar, they are not.
Hillary was a duplicitous politician who repeatedly lied about classified information on her emails to the American public. She was reviled by many for dragging down the country into her serial conflicts.
If Hillary's worse offense had been to be a globalist out of touch with the countryside, she, too, would have survived a few leaked emails and won. She lost because of who she was not because of anything someone else did.
Hillary was a duplicitous politician who repeatedly lied about classified information on her emails to the American public. She was reviled by many for dragging down the country into her serial conflicts.
If Hillary's worse offense had been to be a globalist out of touch with the countryside, she, too, would have survived a few leaked emails and won. She lost because of who she was not because of anything someone else did.
2
The article is very biased, notably by describing Macron only as a former banker, a simplistic label put on him by his opponents. Why does it not mention that he was also a former chief of staff of the Elysee and an economy minister??? Both of those jobs provide him a lot of good experience in understanding and running the country!
13
I totally agree with you.
1
I would ask M Macron that upon waking Monday morning he take a deep breath of the warm spring air, spend a few minutes listening to the birds chattering in the trees, think of his children and of all the children on his one and only planet and make a solemn vow to ban any nuance of hubris from his being.
Vivre la france? No, vivre notre écosystème et, oui, notre planète for which our species holds the keys.
It's not about today. It's about tomorrow.
Vivre la france? No, vivre notre écosystème et, oui, notre planète for which our species holds the keys.
It's not about today. It's about tomorrow.
4
Vive la France! vivre is the transitive verb. Get a dictionary!
1
Though Mr Macron does not have children, and yes, Vive la France standing against the dark forces of hate and rejection. ( vive! = long life!)
These hackers where stupid enough to ignore the French law, which bans any media meddling into the election process during the last two days before the end of the vote. Therefore they are more likely American then Russian. The hacking will have no influence on the election's outcome.
4
One key fact is that Twitter (to pick just one social media purveyor) is doing nothing, zero, zip, nada about the misuse of their platform in France. Indeed, what is bad for France is good for Twitter--the notoriety, the sensation, creates more use. In fact, this is what is viral about viral media.
The social media purveyors should not be rewarded for creating chaos. Freedom of speech is not absolute: you can't yell 'fire' in a crowded theatre; likewise, there should be limits to spreading disinformation in an election. Accordingly, both the EU and the US should adopt sanctions against these businesses who make money from creating chaos. A system of fines or time offline in the penalty box would get the attention of the owners, since it would mightily affect their stock prices and/or IPO potential. As matters stand now, Twitter profits from the disinformation and chaos it purveys.
The social media purveyors should not be rewarded for creating chaos. Freedom of speech is not absolute: you can't yell 'fire' in a crowded theatre; likewise, there should be limits to spreading disinformation in an election. Accordingly, both the EU and the US should adopt sanctions against these businesses who make money from creating chaos. A system of fines or time offline in the penalty box would get the attention of the owners, since it would mightily affect their stock prices and/or IPO potential. As matters stand now, Twitter profits from the disinformation and chaos it purveys.
3
To the left it is simple. Everyone who does not agree with their views is extreme right. Only moderating those leftish views is tolerated to the right parties and is not called fascism. Yet... Good old communism in the USSR, China, Norht-Korea, ... applied those same views and used words like 'counter revolutionary' and 'reactionists' against the right. Until they got the power. Then 'the goelag' and 'psychiatric institutions' were added.
4
Yes, the term "extreme right" is so misused today, now describing anyone with opposing viewpoints, that the term is meaningless. It is like the charges of "racism", "sexism", etc., used in US. Every republican gets accused of these charges at some point, but it's now half the country.
1
If apparent trailer, Marine Le Pen did win, and got a Leave not on the promised Referendum, a FRexit would be worse than there U. K. leaving, due go the added upheavil of a member of the Euro, the common currency, would bring. Additionally with the European Union's second and third largest member nations--by GDP, population and area--the GDP of the E. U. would drop by 30%. That might cause the relevance to the very existence of the trade pact to come into question.
Also, as nations leave the E. U. and begin to look for trading partners, you can believe that Vladimir Putin will be coming to visit. And one by one, he would peck away at the economic sanctions, which have kept his economy in a shambles. Also, as more nations might splinter away from the E. U., Putin's join would just get easier and easier.
https://thetruthoncommonsense.com
Also, as nations leave the E. U. and begin to look for trading partners, you can believe that Vladimir Putin will be coming to visit. And one by one, he would peck away at the economic sanctions, which have kept his economy in a shambles. Also, as more nations might splinter away from the E. U., Putin's join would just get easier and easier.
https://thetruthoncommonsense.com
1
It's the Russians! doesn't cut it anymore. Try Big Foot. It's just as wacky. Remember the Post had Hillary up by 8....
"4chan, an online message board favored by white nationalists"-made me laugh out loud. I guess this is like saying, "ny times, a newspaper favored by socialists.
5
France should've voted for Mélenchon, who even then was not so much an outsider. But they didn't so they, and we, ought to take what sliver of sanity we get: Macron, entrenched as he is, over the hideous Le Pen.
I'm not sure the two in the runoff (or even Mélenchon) are proper outsiders, though.
I'm not sure the two in the runoff (or even Mélenchon) are proper outsiders, though.
1
Mélanchon embraced not just leaving my the Eau, but leaving NATO as well He has stood by his principles and has refused to endorse Macron.
3
Sorry, but Prof Guenole needs to read up on his own country's history. His statement that this election represents the "Americanization" of French politics is outrageous and irresponsible not to mention profoundly ignorant given his presumable level of learning. None of this--the spying, the subterfuge, the xenophobia-- is unique to this moment in French history and certainly cannot be pinned on the US. Even a cursory glance at French political history dating back to the Middle Ages shows these things to be present: the Battle of Tours, the anti -Protestant massacres, the 1789 revolution, the Napoleanic era, their colonization of the Arabic world, the duplicity of the Vichy, etc etc. Each of these episodes contained elements and episodes of atrocity, anti-semitism, xenophobia, political intrigue and more. How can a man of Guenole's stature so readily fall back on these mechanistic anti-American tropes? Shameful. He and others in the French academy need to take greater responsibility.
3
France has a good system for their presidential runoff.
The candidate with the most votes wins.
Election Day is on Sunday.
44-hour media blackout before and during the presidential runoff.
I plan on celebrating Mr. Macron's resounding victory with a nice glass of red wine from France with dinner on Sunday night.
The big win will be the beginning of the end for the far right/populist movement. France will lead the way. Europe will surely take note. In addition, this win will energize the Resistance in the U.S. There will be no Monday morning tweet to congratulate Ms. Le Pen.
My french toast is going to taste just a little bit better on Monday morning.
Merci beaucoup.
The candidate with the most votes wins.
Election Day is on Sunday.
44-hour media blackout before and during the presidential runoff.
I plan on celebrating Mr. Macron's resounding victory with a nice glass of red wine from France with dinner on Sunday night.
The big win will be the beginning of the end for the far right/populist movement. France will lead the way. Europe will surely take note. In addition, this win will energize the Resistance in the U.S. There will be no Monday morning tweet to congratulate Ms. Le Pen.
My french toast is going to taste just a little bit better on Monday morning.
Merci beaucoup.
4
This article does not present all the facts about the two candidates. Neither one is an "outsider" in the sense of just coming in from nowhere. Le Pen is the heir to her father, Jean-Marie Le Pen ,who founded the extreme right-wing "Front National" over 40 years go; they are present in every election (not just presidential: city, regional, parliamentary, European Union Parliament); they whip up reactions based on fear and anger. Macron was Finance Minister in the outgoing Socialist government - this is the equivalent of "Secretary of the Treasury" in the US government (!!! - if that's an outsider, really, I'd like to know what being on the inside would be). It would be more accurate to say that neither one belongs to to the mainstream right-wing party (currently called "Les Républicains" - keep in mind that "La République" has a different sense for the French) or left-wing party (mainly the French Socialist Party). Another huge difference between the US and France: the US Left is the French (and European) Center Right... stop and think about that for a moment. The US is way, way, way to the right of most European politics. Another thing about Macron: he graduated from the ENA, where almost 100% of all French "upper level" politicians study. He is really and truly a mainstream civil servant, with experience, and final word: if he had been a banker at the BNP, nobody would be calling him "that banker". It's only because it was Rothschild. Let that also sink in.
6
Yes, neither has political experience but at least Macron appears to have a surfeit of common sense. His performance in the gruelling 2-hour debate was masterful and bodes well for France when (not if) he wins today. I expect a solid victory.
Fortunately, populist parties are getting creamed in Europe (Italy, Austria, Holland). I cannot envisage any European nation' doing what the U.S. did.
Fortunately, populist parties are getting creamed in Europe (Italy, Austria, Holland). I cannot envisage any European nation' doing what the U.S. did.
4
How can US citizens support the hacking effort? Do they support the alleged Russian hacking effort during our election here too? Are we witnessing new from of political solidarity in an internationalist far right movement? This had been the terrain of the left--the international worker's movement to make a revolution. Is it now the project of the populist right to make their revolution and fought with the new information technology? A sort of alt right conservatives (racists) of the world unite!?
3
The visual sense is the most acutely indelible and affecting. Television is spreading an epidemic of hatred and anger once relegated to small enclaves. Now world leaders are nurturing the hatred and anger in their followers to win power and the result is further spread of hatred and anger. Leaders are winning elections and assuming the mantels of power further spreading ill behavior as attacks occur and counterattacks. Evil has obscured the clouds of goodness and I see world war on the horizon if this spread of hostility continues. It's a simple statistical reality that the more people that are angered and succumb to hatred, the greater the possibility of conflict.
I sincerely hope that the French vote with their rational side thoughtfully, instead of with heightened rage and emotions. The later never ends well.
This world must stop reacting simplistically to terrorism. Stop allowing yourselves to be lowered to their primitive levels. Manage Terrorism. Don't make it a religion because that is just what they want to grow.
I sincerely hope that the French vote with their rational side thoughtfully, instead of with heightened rage and emotions. The later never ends well.
This world must stop reacting simplistically to terrorism. Stop allowing yourselves to be lowered to their primitive levels. Manage Terrorism. Don't make it a religion because that is just what they want to grow.
4
Are they trying to delegitimize Le Pen's presidency like the lunatic left are trying to do to Trump's in this country?
That proves Le Pen is the right choice.
That proves Le Pen is the right choice.
4
hilarious...liberals still worried about the actual hacking...not that it showed the primary was stolen from bernie and their vote didnt matter. thinking just the way cnn told you to. good lib. i bet with the media even more restricted in france no one even bothered to look at the corruption of macron. just do as your told and let us sell your heritage to the third world...trust me...it's what you want to do! peace and prosperity around like minded people is a thing of the past.
2
Did Trump participate in hacking of French election?
3
I don't know why there is any ambiguity in the press about the French election. It's very simple:
- If Macron wins everything will stay sane, ordered and good, even if he turns out to be an village idiot
- If LePen wins France is going to leave the EU, which will collapse the bloc, which in turn will prompt Russia to pick off each and every single member state (starting with Poland, after they completed their invasion of the Ukraine), one after another, until they have full control over all of Europe and can then use their puppet in the White House to obtain full world domination (together with their communist partners in China)
It's as simple as that.
- If Macron wins everything will stay sane, ordered and good, even if he turns out to be an village idiot
- If LePen wins France is going to leave the EU, which will collapse the bloc, which in turn will prompt Russia to pick off each and every single member state (starting with Poland, after they completed their invasion of the Ukraine), one after another, until they have full control over all of Europe and can then use their puppet in the White House to obtain full world domination (together with their communist partners in China)
It's as simple as that.
3
If your attitude is so unreasonable, so self-servingly alarmist, so self congratulatory, then Le Pen is probably the wiser choice, as France confronts deep economic and social problems, as well as (according to Macron), the extermination of French culture.
4
Let's hope the banker wins. Perhaps not Le Pen's intention but forcing the Macron choice is the only way the French will be compelled to face the reality of what lies ahead--social-fiscal collapse and even greater numbers of young people unemployed. Robespierre's Committee of Public Safety couldn't have written a better script for the French citizens who want what can't be had without great financial sacrifice--bourgeois to the end.
1
Neither candidate is worse than Hollande.
1
I think calling 4chan a white nationalist forum is a huge overstatement, it's mostly memes.
2
This is pure sensationalism. NYT, you can do better than that.
The French don't give a flying beret about "le ack".
The French don't give a flying beret about "le ack".
10
True Eric, it won't harm and shows how differently voters are affected by fake news. Her allusions to macron suspected tax evasion was devastating for her. Even what we called "faschosphere" was devastated.
2
The Time infuses all its political writings with heavy opinion. It is what passes for American journalism today. For some reason, American journalists have come to believe their opinions are what people seek instead of objective coverage.
Clearly the Russians at work again. I wonder if the Trump administration is lending a hand.
10
It is becoming clear that once again we face an international white racist conspiracy. The last time we did, 'eugenics' advocates in the USA helped Hitler into power, resulting in the devastation of WW II. Prescott Bush, father and grandfather to two presidents, aided in the financing of Hitler and the Nazis, and was 'busted' in 1942 for 'trading with the enemy'. 'Friend' me on Facebook to see the 'Bush-Nazi Timeline' in my 'Notes' section. We MUST learn the lessons of history for the sake of our humanity! If so-called "white nationalists (Nazis)" succeed in taking the elections of major western powers, this will rapidly become a world in which not many of us would wish to live, and in which tens of millions of us (or more) will die ignominious deaths. I say, Never Again! [But when Trump says it, quite frankly it sounds hollow to me.]
11
Trump and Vladimir Putin have both endorsed Le Pen. Apparently, Trump is still in cahoots with the Russians to influence the outcome of an election.
15
It was actually Obama who videotaped an endorsement of Macron, thereby interfering in the election just as he did prior to the Brexit referendum. Trump congratulated Le Pen on making it into the second round of voting, which may constitute an endorsement, but is nowhere near as egregious or hypocritical as Obama's conduct.
1
Le Pen and her National Front-zis dream of playing, 'Vichy Government' in Putin's rendition of early 1940s Germany.
11
The front page headline raises "doubts about whether either candidate can be effective."
This typifies the kind of false equivalency that brought us Donald Trump.
No doubt the fascist candidate would be much more "effective" than the non-fascist moderate. The trains would run on time, for example.
But politics is about more than "effectiveness." In a self-governing polity, it is ultimately about protecting democracy, with all its flaws.
Shame on the NY Times for contributing to the narrative that there is no difference between the candidates in France.
This typifies the kind of false equivalency that brought us Donald Trump.
No doubt the fascist candidate would be much more "effective" than the non-fascist moderate. The trains would run on time, for example.
But politics is about more than "effectiveness." In a self-governing polity, it is ultimately about protecting democracy, with all its flaws.
Shame on the NY Times for contributing to the narrative that there is no difference between the candidates in France.
48
It is a myth that the trains ran on time in Fascist Italy.
The myth came from an incident in which Mussolini was standing on the platform waiting for a train that was so very late that when it finally arrived he boarded the locomotive and attacked the engineer.
After that well publicized incident, the trains continued to be as awfully unreliable as always. The Fascists never achieved any improvements.
The same failure of authoritarian systems accounts for the utter failure and collapse of the USSR economy.
It is not just a myth, it is a dangerous falsehood to give credit for "trains running on time" as payoff for Fascist behavior. It never worked out that way, it is just an excuse.
The myth came from an incident in which Mussolini was standing on the platform waiting for a train that was so very late that when it finally arrived he boarded the locomotive and attacked the engineer.
After that well publicized incident, the trains continued to be as awfully unreliable as always. The Fascists never achieved any improvements.
The same failure of authoritarian systems accounts for the utter failure and collapse of the USSR economy.
It is not just a myth, it is a dangerous falsehood to give credit for "trains running on time" as payoff for Fascist behavior. It never worked out that way, it is just an excuse.
7
Macron, the socialist, is a moderate. Riiiiiiiiiiiiight.
Dear Dan,
To be effective the candidate should show a sharp diagnosis of the situation and clear strategy to turn the table. The debate clearly showed she had none of the two. not to mention her pathetic behaviors, 19 false statements on economy and social facts and personal attacks.
To be effective the candidate should show a sharp diagnosis of the situation and clear strategy to turn the table. The debate clearly showed she had none of the two. not to mention her pathetic behaviors, 19 false statements on economy and social facts and personal attacks.
5
I just hope folk learned a lesson from the U.S. about what can "win" if you don't get out and vote. FRANCE - DON'T BE US! VOTE.
76
Trump's silence on the hack is deafening.
71
@wj
re "Trump's silence on the hack is deafening"
That's because he knows exactly what's happening, and what he knows about what happened in the US before, but is covering up.
re "Trump's silence on the hack is deafening"
That's because he knows exactly what's happening, and what he knows about what happened in the US before, but is covering up.
10
He's an idiot. A self-serving, bigoted, white supremacist who can't see past his own nose. Trump has been coddled all his life by people who just suck up to him because he has money. These are the sorts of people who voted for him.
But French people are much more discerning than Americans. They will not be fooled.
But French people are much more discerning than Americans. They will not be fooled.
11
Funny. Remember the last time he mentioned the election? Heads were spinning. Now they're spinning in the opposite direction because he's not comment?
Macron is not just very smart, but young, talented and doesn't fit in some pre-built box others designed for him. He sounds like exactly what France needs - a new, liberally-oriented radical centrism, but one that supports, rather than undermines, the obvious role for France in the EU, in NATO and in global politics.
Voters in America did not have this choice in 2016, which more than anything, may explain the victory of the ignorant boor, sexual predator and racial opportunist last year. France has the ability to set the recent record right. It will be a powerful message not just in France, but in Germany too - as well as in the US.
Voters in America did not have this choice in 2016, which more than anything, may explain the victory of the ignorant boor, sexual predator and racial opportunist last year. France has the ability to set the recent record right. It will be a powerful message not just in France, but in Germany too - as well as in the US.
40
I agree with you about Macron, but disagree that voters in America did not have a choice to elect the most experienced and competent President in the history of the U.S., Hillary Clinton. But because of racism, sexism, xenophobia, bigotry and ignorance along with efforts of an over-zealous and partisan FBI Director to undermine Secretary Clinton and the interference of Putin to swing the election to Trump, who Putin feels he can manipulate and who is terrified of Clinton, we wound up with an infantile megalomaniac. If that occurs in France on the heels of Brexit, Europe could be on the brink of a Russian takeover.
26
I couldn't agree more. If you understand French there 2 long interviews of him by Mediapart on you tube. He is quite extraordinary. Smart, engaged and engagingly honest. France will hopefully be very lucky to have him.
10
Americans elected a competent man. The constant lies that Macron, a socialist, is centrist show your nature.
2
All pollsters are predicting that Macron will be the next president of France and once again an opportunity to have the first woman president of France will be lost. But there is always a possibility of a Trifecta of surprises. Brexit, Trump victory and Le Pen victory in a few hours. One way this could happen if the enthusiasm for Macron results in lower voter turn out while Le Pen voters turn out in full force. The modern day Joan of Arc of France, Marine Le Pen could well have her luckiest day of her life and the always dreaming Le Pen could become the first president of France if the French decide that it is unfair to blame Marine for the sins of her father Jean-Marie Le Pen.
10
While both Le Pen and Clinton are women, they are polar opposites politically and philosophically. Clinton would have triggered an American renaissance while Le Pen. if elected, will further the breakup of Europe and make it vulnerable once in fighting for its existence, this time against Russia. This would impact the U.S. by weakening our allies. We'd better pray that Macron is elected.
17
Disgusting comparison of degenerate Le Pen and heroic Joan of Arc.
6
Joan of Arc is a myth build by the catholic church during the second half of the 19th century. She was only declared a saint in 1920. You should have seen the debate between the two on last Wednesday: Marine Le Pen was just pathetic.
6
Mon dieu! "... planned on abstaining because she did not want to choose...."
Tres stupide!
Tres stupide!
"The tone of the race between the insurgents has shocked many for its raw anger and insolence.
Shocking for them, but business as usual for US.
Shocking for them, but business as usual for US.
14
The article fails to state that the aggressive tone of the debate was set by Marie Le Pen, a fact that all viewers agreed on (this is her tactic, also to compensate the fact that -unlike Macron- she came out very poorly on facts).
5
The French establishment, that is to say the one percent that really run things, must be worried that their man might actually loose in as much as they are playing the "Russia" card and suggesting the nefarious right are aligning with the evil empire to malign Sarkozy's stand in Macron. It would seem that American neocons, globalization benefiting only the upper classes and the invasion of Iraq leading too endless wars in the Middle East have done much more to damage life for Europeans in terms of costs in treasure, immigration issues, rising job insecurity and quality of life than anything Russia has done in decades. The world does not need to be dragged into a war with Russia by special interests that want to rule the world. Le Pen is a controversial canidate but her interests are certainly more aligned with the vast majority of the French people than Macrons' and whatever party he supposedly represents this week. His only real legislative efforts in politics have been attempts to crush labor and the undeniably good quality of life available to all French people as he promotes the "American" way that benefits only the wealthy. We already have government by Goldman Sachs destroying the middle class in America I hope France doesn't have government by Bank Rothschild at the end of this charade.
7
The "vast majority of the French people" want to see the breakup of Western Europe and become a satellite of Russia?
9
Russia's influence on French politics, economy and culture is close to zero. Its influence stopped right at the foot of the Berlin wall. The polarization of the political debate on "interior vs exterior" enemy, making the average French assimilate the EU to a prussian invader with a Euro bill between his teeth, the Euro playing the part of the Deutschmark, really is the new mask of an old french far right rhetoric, conveyed by Mme Le Pen. The French are temporarily deprived of their traditional alternative between the softer versions of the left vs right debate. Capital fact also to take into account: a new generation have risen and wiped out the old establishment. In this soft upheaval, Macron incarnates a kind a statu quo: the continuity of the core values that have led the French to leave in a prosperous and peaceful country for 80 years (Le Pen describes a country at chaos, but this is not the country I personally wake up every morning in). To that sense he's a far better candidate to the presidency, constitutionally understood as the keeper of the continuity of institutions, than Le Pen, who plays a useful cathartic scarecrow role in the political psyche, as her father did. Nevertheless, the most important elections will take place in june, as the parliament is definitely at the core of political power and influence.
3
Well that's a terrifying thought - that Le Pen's "interests are certainly more aligned with the vast majority of the French people". Do you really think the majority of French are xenophobic, fear-filled white supremacists? This is the National Front remember? A party whose choice to temporarily take over while Le Pen pretends she's not involved has already had to stand down for being caught out declaring the holocaust couldn't have happened because Zyklon B can't be used for massed killings! Let's not pretend Le Pen is anything but a monster.
2
You'll note that the right wing deflections trying to make it about Russian hacking or not Russian hacking. Or Wikileaks or not Wikileaks. That's a distraction. It's the hacking. And it doesn't matter if it is domestic or foreign - it is still a right wing group supporting right wing candidates.
It is another example of the win-at-any-cost lengths the right wing will go to fearing a fair election - feeling they can't win despite all the bragging. Fear and insecurity leads to cheating, For the right the end always justifies the means - as you tell from the gleeful comments in both races in regards to the hacking designed to hurt their "enemies".
It is another example of the win-at-any-cost lengths the right wing will go to fearing a fair election - feeling they can't win despite all the bragging. Fear and insecurity leads to cheating, For the right the end always justifies the means - as you tell from the gleeful comments in both races in regards to the hacking designed to hurt their "enemies".
14
It's an example of the win at all costs the "centrist", aka left wing, will go to win elections.
1
You are right Marie, and its worrying to have it interfering more and more in democratic elections
2
Vive la liberte!
Or not...
Or not...
Agreed. The French people will either choose Le Pen and Liberty, or far left Macron and a continued decline.
Glad you agree.
Glad you agree.
1
Yes but. Macron is a moderate. Le Pen is from a family of anti-semitic, anti-Muslim hatemongers. She is also.
Any attempt to paint them as similarly poorly qualified is crazy. One is them isn't seasoned. The other one is the same kind of crazy ultra right bigot as the man taking a sledge hammer to our democracy here in the U.S.
Pray the French make a more sensible choice.
Any attempt to paint them as similarly poorly qualified is crazy. One is them isn't seasoned. The other one is the same kind of crazy ultra right bigot as the man taking a sledge hammer to our democracy here in the U.S.
Pray the French make a more sensible choice.
48
Dear people of France, please choose the candidate that expresses the best of your country. Freedom of speech and expression, freedom of ideas and communication. Choose the *positive* path. Don't look back!
No prejudices. No limits!
Yes, you can!
No prejudices. No limits!
Yes, you can!
16
It's easy to think of the election of Macron as a 'happy outcome' but I don't see it that way. He's a young and inexperienced political insider, who has been heavily endorsed by the outgoing Hollande. More troubling, he is unlikely to stand up for France to Merkel and the EU bureaucrats and earned 4 million € brut as a banker prior to running for President, only to claim less than 200k € assets on his financial disclosure to run for President. Huh? So where did all that money go? Offshore?
I feel the French are being sold down the river on this ambitious huckster
Unfortunately, his opponent is extreme and brash so he will win the election by default. Pauvre France!
I feel the French are being sold down the river on this ambitious huckster
Unfortunately, his opponent is extreme and brash so he will win the election by default. Pauvre France!
14
Melinda you are right to expose the inappropriate promotion of Macron by the media and the pollsters. Macron is trying to win on the age old "lesser of the two evils" thinking but from what you rightly suggest he is a possibly a crook and definitely an insider who may not change France and provide a better future for France. If this election results in the first woman president of France, I don't think it will be so bad for France and prove that equality, liberty and fraternity is for all of France including women of France.
3
LePen summed up this election as follows: France will be led by a woman; either by me or by Mrs. Merkel." Probably an accurate observation.
6
Absolutely. This "choice" is the same lugubrious one being sold to voters globally: neoliberalism vs neofascism.
1
Hope that the French reject Le Pen, and that Macron moves left in an effort to govern.
I have no love for the bankers' agenda, but the rightist nationalism of Le Pen is far worse.
I have no love for the bankers' agenda, but the rightist nationalism of Le Pen is far worse.
92
Macron is already radically left. France has been governed by the left for a long time. The result has been disaster.
2
That means you love the bankers agenda and are simply deluding someone. Perhaps yourself.
So you want the French to continue loosing their country. Got it.
'For now, the French electorate seems more divided than at any time in recent memory.'
Sound familiar? This is about a globalist, open borders, pro-mass migration corporate, banker-friendly agenda that works only for the elites vs a nationalist, controlled border policy that supports the common French citizen and worker first and foremost.
Even though Macron is slated to win, it is interesting that he may not be able to govern effectively, as currently with 4%-approval-rated Hollande. This failed status quo, more of the same failed policy, will only help Le Pen garner greater support for the contest 5 years from now.
Sound familiar? This is about a globalist, open borders, pro-mass migration corporate, banker-friendly agenda that works only for the elites vs a nationalist, controlled border policy that supports the common French citizen and worker first and foremost.
Even though Macron is slated to win, it is interesting that he may not be able to govern effectively, as currently with 4%-approval-rated Hollande. This failed status quo, more of the same failed policy, will only help Le Pen garner greater support for the contest 5 years from now.
23
Globalization isn't harmful to the common person. It is how you have so many nice things for a price you could not otherwise afford. It is how poorer nations develop and pull themselves up. It is how universities gain a wider perspective. It's also inevitable.
Elites benefit either way (don't try and tell me Mr. Trump isn't doing a good job enriching himself with his nationalist mandate). Don't let them convince you otherwise.
Elites benefit either way (don't try and tell me Mr. Trump isn't doing a good job enriching himself with his nationalist mandate). Don't let them convince you otherwise.
14
"...a globalist, open borders, pro-mass migration corporate, banker-friendly agenda..."
You do realize, Philly, that these things do not go together, and that many of them, applied to Macron, are outright lies.
But it worked against Clinton so why not give it a try?
Just pile up negative sounding labels, make them sound even more negativer, present sober and intellectual news analysis of the pretend meanings you give these inaccurate terms, and then say them over, and over, and over, and over.
What's interesting is seeing those exact arguments, made during our campaign about Clinton, now in retrospect. For all your unknowing hate talk about the evils and dangers of "bankers and corporations", look who your champion has put in control of your country: Goldman Sachs and Exxon.
Just to make sure there is no mistaking his intentions, he limited or eliminated ethics and conflict of interest rules that may have given a hopeful person such as yourself reason to believe this might not be the nightmare it surely will end up becoming.
The one that really gets me is "open borders"; could you explain that, please, and offer an example? From reality, I mean.
You do realize, Philly, that these things do not go together, and that many of them, applied to Macron, are outright lies.
But it worked against Clinton so why not give it a try?
Just pile up negative sounding labels, make them sound even more negativer, present sober and intellectual news analysis of the pretend meanings you give these inaccurate terms, and then say them over, and over, and over, and over.
What's interesting is seeing those exact arguments, made during our campaign about Clinton, now in retrospect. For all your unknowing hate talk about the evils and dangers of "bankers and corporations", look who your champion has put in control of your country: Goldman Sachs and Exxon.
Just to make sure there is no mistaking his intentions, he limited or eliminated ethics and conflict of interest rules that may have given a hopeful person such as yourself reason to believe this might not be the nightmare it surely will end up becoming.
The one that really gets me is "open borders"; could you explain that, please, and offer an example? From reality, I mean.
4
@ Tom: I will assume you are much younger than I Tom, because your presumption you could not afford nice things without globalization is just not true. In the late forties, fifties and sixties there really was "a chicken in every pot", and the chicken as well as the Levis, Fords, Maytags and G.E. Appliances were all made in America by Americans taking home a single paycheck large enough to support a wife and family, today with both husband, wife and Or partners working their are lucky to scrape up the rent in urban areas except for the chosen few, as for the ones in rural areas and inner cities they are just portrayed lazy deplorables, ignored as much as possible; busy killing themselves or each other with or over drugs or a pair of two hundred dollar Nikes Made in China. Sorry Tom, unless you think a few clothing designers becoming billionaires and thousands of Chinese millionaires parking money in housing no longer affordable to average Americans is a good thing I fail to see the validity of your argument. As a matter of fact the latest issue of Mother Jones covers this very topic of the proliferation of visas for sale and empty houses in urban areas as homeless people huddle in doorways. You live in Chicago where I believe the fact that more young people kill each other annually than all the "terrorist" attacks in Europe combined proves my point. We need to take care of Americans, now!
4
Hopefull the French go with Le Pen. Why should the French tolerate being run over figuratively by the bureaucrats in Brussels and being run over literally by Muslim terrorists?
25
How in the world could you support a Holocaust denier? It's unspeakably horrible!
4
Le Pen does not deny the Holocaust. She denies French responsibility.
She uses the same excuse used by de Gaulle -- the Frenchmen who participated were German flunkies, not French at all. The real France and real Frenchmen were in the Resistance trying to help Jews and fight Germans.
Of course that is not really true, the Resistance was only a minority, and Vichy was the French state that helped in the Holocaust with enthusiasm, but the French simply can't think it.
That is not denying the Holocaust, it is the French fantasy of The Resistance and denial of Vichy.
She uses the same excuse used by de Gaulle -- the Frenchmen who participated were German flunkies, not French at all. The real France and real Frenchmen were in the Resistance trying to help Jews and fight Germans.
Of course that is not really true, the Resistance was only a minority, and Vichy was the French state that helped in the Holocaust with enthusiasm, but the French simply can't think it.
That is not denying the Holocaust, it is the French fantasy of The Resistance and denial of Vichy.
2
I wish that had happened when you white folks came to America and slaughtered American Indians. America is being tolerated by White settlers.
These two candidates could not be more different. One favors deportation of immigrants while the other favors integration of immigrants. One favors leaving the E.U. while the supports remaining France's membership in it. The election must turn on those issues and the personalities of Macron and Ms. Le Pen. How could hacking of e-mails that were not published and are said to be innocuous play a major role?
6
Well, if the leaked documents from Macron's campaign contains criminal aspects and Macron been president, will he stay Élysée Palace? No answer.
Then, why the leaks 48 hours before ballots? Answered.
Then, why Le Pen documents were not released either? Enough one released!
Sure, this will prove her affiliation with terrorists who carried out Macron leaks. Right? A little bit, but enormous shocking the world.
I'm sure, no body will hack Le Pen campaign and release any document related to her, just like Trump. Why? You answer.
Then, why the leaks 48 hours before ballots? Answered.
Then, why Le Pen documents were not released either? Enough one released!
Sure, this will prove her affiliation with terrorists who carried out Macron leaks. Right? A little bit, but enormous shocking the world.
I'm sure, no body will hack Le Pen campaign and release any document related to her, just like Trump. Why? You answer.
4
Perhaps...and this is really only a perhaps but it seems viable in this day and age...because it's better to keep the dirt on the right-wingers as ransom for their compliance, whereas the left-wingers emails only really show that they're human.
5
If, as predicted, Macron wins the presidency, it may turn out not so badly for the National Front for it is then likely nothing will change vis-a-vis the economy, trade, and immigration and conditions inFrance will continue to deteriorate. At the end of his term, it should be possible for Marine Le Pen or some other NF candidate to win the presidency of France outright in the first round or a run-off.
8
Macron smiles. Le Pen seems to be hostile.
Tomorrow's election will be an interesting statistical exercise to see which trait prevails.
Tomorrow's election will be an interesting statistical exercise to see which trait prevails.
3
I am scared tonight, afraid of a LePen victory. I am as angry at the left-wing voters in France who will abstain or cast blank ballots as I still am at those on the left in the U.S. who refused to vote for Clinton last November. But I believe in the stupidity of voters and so I am as scared that the French are as stupid as the Americans. Please, French voters, prove me wrong: part of me still wants to believe that no one in western Europe is as dumb as your average American.
56
Hello Richard: I am a dual citizen--American-French-- who voted for Macron and not only share your sentiments, but have expressed them using almost the exact same words! On va croiser les doights...2pm tomorrow we will know.
8
Reminder that 3 million more Americans voted for Clinton than Trump. Americans were right but were hamstrung by the Electoral College, which has outlived its usefulness. We really need to go to the National Popular Vote model, which can be done without a Constitutional amendment. If a majority of states officially reject the Electoral College through their respective state legislators an automatic shift to a popular vote model will be activated.
4
Agreed. The Electoral College is no longer needed as no one owns slaves, so there is no need to favor the slave states.
One vote, one person. Full Democracy. Total fairness.
One vote, one person. Full Democracy. Total fairness.
3
"“It’s a consequence of the social-economic impact of globalization,” Mr. Guénolé, the political scientist, said. “More and more people are feeling precarious.”
Far right and far left are outdated labels. The new division is between pro- and anti-globalization parties.
That division was behind Brexit and the election of Trump.
Economists advocated globalization with the now proven wrong claim that it had only negligible influence on the wages of those exposed to competition with low wage countries:
"The occasion was an op-ed piece I had written for the New York Times, in which I had pointed out that while wages and working conditions in the new export industries of the Third World ..are a big improvement over the "previous, less visible rural poverty." I guess I should have expected that this comment would generate letters along the lines of, "Well, if you lose your comfortable position as an American professor you can always find another job--as long as you are 12 years old and willing to work for 40 cents an hour."
Such moral outrage is common among the opponents of globalization--of the transfer of technology and capital from high-wage to low-wage countries and the resulting growth of labor-intensive Third World exports."
"Moral outrage" !! Mr. Krugman overlooked that 3rd world workers do not vote in US elections, but those thrown out of jobs do.
http://www.slate.com/articles/business/the_dismal_science/1997/03/in_pra...
Far right and far left are outdated labels. The new division is between pro- and anti-globalization parties.
That division was behind Brexit and the election of Trump.
Economists advocated globalization with the now proven wrong claim that it had only negligible influence on the wages of those exposed to competition with low wage countries:
"The occasion was an op-ed piece I had written for the New York Times, in which I had pointed out that while wages and working conditions in the new export industries of the Third World ..are a big improvement over the "previous, less visible rural poverty." I guess I should have expected that this comment would generate letters along the lines of, "Well, if you lose your comfortable position as an American professor you can always find another job--as long as you are 12 years old and willing to work for 40 cents an hour."
Such moral outrage is common among the opponents of globalization--of the transfer of technology and capital from high-wage to low-wage countries and the resulting growth of labor-intensive Third World exports."
"Moral outrage" !! Mr. Krugman overlooked that 3rd world workers do not vote in US elections, but those thrown out of jobs do.
http://www.slate.com/articles/business/the_dismal_science/1997/03/in_pra...
6
What I find surprising -- and disturbing -- is that few of the comments are willing to admit that Paris has been attacked several times the past three years and that hundreds have been killed or injured and this may be why the usual political order has been scrambled. There are probably going to be even more attacks in the future. It is naive to assume or expect the French voters will favor political correctness over personal safety and security.
17
Terrorism is a threat for everyone on earth. It's not the only thing (most) voters think about when they step in the booth.
10
Those attacks are surely affecting behavior, but only because of their sensational nature, not because they constitute a genuine threat to the personal safety of the French. The French are FOUR times less likely to be the victims of violent crime than Americans are. French people today are incredibly safe compared to the rest of the world and the rest of history. But spectacular terrorist acts in modern media culture enable politicians and media figures have everyone convinced they are surrounded by carnage.
9
France can protect itself without selling itself to Russia, which is what it will do if Le Pen is elected.
3
This article does M Macron a disservice by saying that his victory will chefly reflect French voter's oppsition to Mme Le Pen.
Macron's detailed program, with a budget to pay for it, and his embrace of traditional culture combined with a fresh, forward-thinking approach, won him the first round. M Fillon and his Républicain colleagues back Macron, as do the Socialists. He will be able to build a balanced coalition in Congress.
Fillon no more wants France to leave the EU than Macron. Their primary difference was security, police and prisons. Fillon really wanted to pump up the police force and number of prisons--American style.
As America knows--with the most police, prisons and violent crime in the world--more cops and prisons are not deterrents.
Macron wants to add 10,000 police, and work with all EU countries to strengthen EU borders. But, he believes prisons are universities of crime. He wants France do a better job with education. He wants to give vision to at-risk youths, career opportunities to young adults who have chosen a trade or artisan track, and incentivize companies to hire them.
Le Pen's solution for those who have lost work to lower paid workers from other EU countries is to leave the EU. Macron wants to level the playing field, via the EU, and keep France in the world's largest and richest trade bloc.
Those fear and hate strangers and new ideas will vote for Le Pen. Those who embrace French culture and the 21st century, will vote for Macron
Macron's detailed program, with a budget to pay for it, and his embrace of traditional culture combined with a fresh, forward-thinking approach, won him the first round. M Fillon and his Républicain colleagues back Macron, as do the Socialists. He will be able to build a balanced coalition in Congress.
Fillon no more wants France to leave the EU than Macron. Their primary difference was security, police and prisons. Fillon really wanted to pump up the police force and number of prisons--American style.
As America knows--with the most police, prisons and violent crime in the world--more cops and prisons are not deterrents.
Macron wants to add 10,000 police, and work with all EU countries to strengthen EU borders. But, he believes prisons are universities of crime. He wants France do a better job with education. He wants to give vision to at-risk youths, career opportunities to young adults who have chosen a trade or artisan track, and incentivize companies to hire them.
Le Pen's solution for those who have lost work to lower paid workers from other EU countries is to leave the EU. Macron wants to level the playing field, via the EU, and keep France in the world's largest and richest trade bloc.
Those fear and hate strangers and new ideas will vote for Le Pen. Those who embrace French culture and the 21st century, will vote for Macron
133
Bravo! Excellent commentaire!
8
Beautifully said.
5
Excellently put !
France will show that it is more civilized country than the US........and we KNEW that !
France will show that it is more civilized country than the US........and we KNEW that !
4
In all seriousness, even if the scenario of either candidate not being able to form parliamentary majority was an issue - it's not, as recent governments were formed by 'cohabitation' in France i.e. President of one party & PM of the opposition & a likewise for Assemblies - which candidate do you think would be more likely to form successful alliances within the Houses & pass his legislative agenda?
My money is on Macron & team. And the French are used to 'cohabitation'.
So it looks like political commentaries will really have to focus on the real issues affecting people during elections, like which candidate has a credible plan on addressing gaps in policy in healthcare, education, the economy, security, the role of the state in solving these problems rather than making the rich richer, how to safeguard law, order & our electoral processes more effectively, etc. & I could go on and on about each candidate's temperament.
'War is Peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength', Orwell wrote in 1949. If he were to write '1984' today, he would probably have his 'Goldstein' - the parrot of state propaganda - equate rigged elections with 'a tide of populism sweeping the west'.
Shame on us all for repeatedly failing to defend democracy by not learning from our past. Let's start by calling things out for what they are. Words are important. Orwell is right.
My money is on Macron & team. And the French are used to 'cohabitation'.
So it looks like political commentaries will really have to focus on the real issues affecting people during elections, like which candidate has a credible plan on addressing gaps in policy in healthcare, education, the economy, security, the role of the state in solving these problems rather than making the rich richer, how to safeguard law, order & our electoral processes more effectively, etc. & I could go on and on about each candidate's temperament.
'War is Peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength', Orwell wrote in 1949. If he were to write '1984' today, he would probably have his 'Goldstein' - the parrot of state propaganda - equate rigged elections with 'a tide of populism sweeping the west'.
Shame on us all for repeatedly failing to defend democracy by not learning from our past. Let's start by calling things out for what they are. Words are important. Orwell is right.
16
Democracy is threatened by people like this who threw our election to Trump and who are trying to influence the French election. We need an independent investigation of this problem. Why doesn't mr trump want the truth to come out?
44
Why doesn't Mr. Trump want the truth to come out? Because he is complicit!
8
Maybe The Times should do a story on the history of dirty tricks in politics and election campaigns. Are email hacks just the computer age version of campaign dirty tricks?
11
Yes indeed. Start with the election of 1800, Adams v. Jefferson. Check out Richard Nixon's campaigns for House and then Senate, paralleled with others on the right during that era. Then there was Watergate and, in 2004, the dirty work on John Kerry. The fake photo of him and Jane Fonda at an anti war rally was a minor classic. With the internet skullduggery is more fun than ever!
2
Sorry about a second two cents, but I left out the "fake news" smear pulled on Andrew Jackson's wife Rachel by the John Quincy Adams campaign. Bigamy was the charge based on dubious documents. Jackson still for a moment number of reasons, not least for Adams' unpopularity.
Naturally, I can not predict the outcome of tomorrow's French election, but I can predict that if the nationalist wave spreads from us and Britain to France that Europe will also fall to hatred and anger and there will be a world war.
14
NYT calling 4chan white nationalist? Lolz. It's a board for trolls, hackers, and anyone wanting attention.
3
Don't flatter yourself! Most people just want to get their view points across. More like people wanting to express their views and not mainstream media view points. You pick what you want out of the comments and get lots of better ways of expressing your views that are not the same as the writer of the article.
I'm genuinely on a crusade to save America and the world from itself! It's my hobby! :)))
I'm genuinely on a crusade to save America and the world from itself! It's my hobby! :)))
5
Whoever did that had no sense of timing, too little , too late. The French media won’t break the embargo. Besides there does not seem to be anything substantial to report. It is dangerous too, reading people’s mail and spreading false news to influence elections are criminal offenses under French law.
17
What a strange and newly troubled world we live in thanks to that very thing that brings this message your way: the internet. This medium has given persons heretofore on the "tin-foil hat" fringes, a platform and an international megaphone amplified in ways agitators from the past could only imagine.
This new access is now coupled to an alliance previously thought impossible except by fiction writers. The far-right and the ex-KGB chief in a sweaty embrace. Well, there was the Hitler-Stalin pact briefly, and Lenin took advantage of the Imperial German high command's benevolence, so perhaps some precedent. That we have a robust white racialist-nationalist crowd at all, is in no small part caused by the refusal of one of our parties to denounce them in no uncertain terms, and a President comfortable with the Breitbart crowd at his elbow in the White House influencing policy.
This new access is now coupled to an alliance previously thought impossible except by fiction writers. The far-right and the ex-KGB chief in a sweaty embrace. Well, there was the Hitler-Stalin pact briefly, and Lenin took advantage of the Imperial German high command's benevolence, so perhaps some precedent. That we have a robust white racialist-nationalist crowd at all, is in no small part caused by the refusal of one of our parties to denounce them in no uncertain terms, and a President comfortable with the Breitbart crowd at his elbow in the White House influencing policy.
21
To address the question: Macron will win, and the predictions of the Le Pen voters will come to fruition.
3
Russians obviously do not like Macron.
We did not have good options in our presidential election in the US. It seems French now have the same problem. But, I guess French are not gonna risk and vote for Le Pen. We do not hold the elites accountable for their actions in the US. This is why Trump can lie and face no consequences. I doubt France would be the same. If Le Pen would be elected and could not deliver what she promises, Her government would not survive that long.
We did not have good options in our presidential election in the US. It seems French now have the same problem. But, I guess French are not gonna risk and vote for Le Pen. We do not hold the elites accountable for their actions in the US. This is why Trump can lie and face no consequences. I doubt France would be the same. If Le Pen would be elected and could not deliver what she promises, Her government would not survive that long.
5
Why adopt the shorthand "former investment banker' for Macron? Why not "former minister of the economy"? You are playing into the hands of extremists on both sides. The media have a lot to answer for in their coverage of recent elections in the US, the UK and now France.
114
The media have a lot to answer for, yes, but the media answer only to their paymasters. In the U.S. it's the those Gore Vidal called "the owners." The same owners your bought politicians answer to.
1
While it is true that many of us know little about the machinations behind tomorrow's French election, we are discovering that Julian Assange and his Wiki Leaks project has become an unabashed ally of global right-wing authoritarianism.
Far from struggling on behalf of the objectively free flow of government secrets, it has thrown its weight behind demagogues and dictators. Assange is part of the propaganda machines of Vladimir Putin, Marine Le Pen and other assorted enemies of civil society on the rightmost fringes of international politics.
Far from struggling on behalf of the objectively free flow of government secrets, it has thrown its weight behind demagogues and dictators. Assange is part of the propaganda machines of Vladimir Putin, Marine Le Pen and other assorted enemies of civil society on the rightmost fringes of international politics.
27
There are suggestions that Americans have participated in spreading hack information or fake news. Regardless of who they supported, I support and demand an immediate expression of outrage from our Presidency and Congress and a promise to prosecute any Americans involved to the fullest extent of the law and to facilitate any extradition movements to the greatest extent possible. In addition, we should publicly reprimand and publish names of any American citizens who might cower under the shield of "free speech" in order to affect French elections.
Most Americans were outraged at the Russian participation in hacking our elections. Unless we decide that the Russian behavior was acceptable, we must condemn any of our own citizens attempts to sway the results of an election in the country of a very close ally and apologize profusely.
Most Americans were outraged at the Russian participation in hacking our elections. Unless we decide that the Russian behavior was acceptable, we must condemn any of our own citizens attempts to sway the results of an election in the country of a very close ally and apologize profusely.
17
How effective and influential will the candidate that has been backed by Russian banks be as president?
6
This guy Putin is a real ongoing problem.
Why doesn't somebody do something to neutralize him?
Why doesn't somebody do something to neutralize him?
17
I could care an investment banker is the left and Pen is the right. How can an investment banker be the left? now the left like what happened with Hillary is redefining the left. The left is the new mainstream and the right is the rebels. Have at it and lose with that.
3
Former politician Clinton was a militarist and an elitist, not a leftist. To say she redefined the left, I would agree, she bifurcated it right down the middle. The left was against her.
7
At this point, there is nothing "former" about Hillary Clinton. She is a left-of-center-moderate, an accomplished stateswoman who would have launched an American renaissance. And, yes, the radical left was against her and most anything reasonable and logical.
5
Ms. Clinton is formerly relevant. She needs to move on, and get out of the way for the next generation.
Marine Le Pen is no different than her father. A Holocaust denier and friend of Putin. England made a mistake and are now facing a much less influential country with Scotland staying with the EU and thus, separate from England, May and the rest of the fools. I sincerely hope France choses wisely and turns La Pen down.
21
French voters may not be so smart. After all, they did elect Hollande, and he was so bad he couldn't even run for reelection and his party has lost badly.
5
The statement that French culture is a thing of the past strikes me as a bit delusional. The French used to require programmers to avoid using "run" when writing applications, because English was simply not allowed. Try to eat a hamburger with your hands and the other patron stare (most French use a knife and fork to eat a burger). The tensions in France result from the ebbing of a distinctive French culture, and heavy resentment that the country is going to Hell due to globalization. It is a despair against real or imagined decline (too often real). But I salute the French for refusing to open their arms to the hate mongers, unlike their American cousins. The nation of Lafayette would appear to be, at least in this, stronger and greater, than the US.
14
Tom, I know a number of French people who would disagree with you about the hatemongers. Like many countries, France has a tragic history of opening its arms to hate, and more than a third of their voters this weekend are prepared to vote for Marine Le Pen. National Front politicians hold a lot of offices throughout the country. A runoff system and absence of an electoral college system help greatly as a barrier to an awful demagogic candidate like Le Pen or Trump. The American people as a whole did not open their arms to Donald Trump. Obsolete aspects of our voting system, including the role of money, corrupt our politics in horrible ways (though HRC outspent Trump last year.)
As for President Macron, I am to his left politically but I do wish him well. He and his ideas seem to be what France needs at this stage in its history. Whether he can gain enough parliamentary support to govern is a big question mark.
As for President Macron, I am to his left politically but I do wish him well. He and his ideas seem to be what France needs at this stage in its history. Whether he can gain enough parliamentary support to govern is a big question mark.
7
"Mr. Macron, a centrist who formed his own party, En Marche!, wants to push market and labor reforms to make France more competitive and deepen its ties to the European Union."
While he formed his own party, his program is very much the same as the promises that elected Sarkozy, called "the American" for the reforms he proposed to a more American style economy.
Sarkozy made little progress with those ideas, even with his party. Now Macron promises the same without the party to back him.
So the article's main question, could he do it if elected, seems to have been answered by Sarkozy -- no, it has been tried already with better prospects and got nowhere.
While he formed his own party, his program is very much the same as the promises that elected Sarkozy, called "the American" for the reforms he proposed to a more American style economy.
Sarkozy made little progress with those ideas, even with his party. Now Macron promises the same without the party to back him.
So the article's main question, could he do it if elected, seems to have been answered by Sarkozy -- no, it has been tried already with better prospects and got nowhere.
29
Unfettered globalization, which Macron supports, means that foreign oligarchs and investors get to own means of production all over the world, in other people's countries. How can you then expect that they will not want to control those countries' governments and influence their elections? They will, they certainly will.
Globalization threatens not only individual cultures/civilizations, but also democracy and sovereignty of the existing countries, including those in the West. And this is something that neo-liberals refuse to discuss, and would like to sweep under the rug. The people will not let their native cultures and countries go to pot, and will crush neo-liberalism. It's only a matter of time.
Globalization threatens not only individual cultures/civilizations, but also democracy and sovereignty of the existing countries, including those in the West. And this is something that neo-liberals refuse to discuss, and would like to sweep under the rug. The people will not let their native cultures and countries go to pot, and will crush neo-liberalism. It's only a matter of time.
20
so you support foriegn governments spreading false information about candidates? sounds treasonous regardless of what policies you support..
6
What are you talking about? Where did my posting indicate that I support foreign interests meddling into any country's politics and elections? I only pointed out that such meddling is practically inevitable when you allow foreign interests to own previously domestic corporations and large pieces of the country's economy or real estate. Suddenly what happens in your country is impacting some powerful foreigners' bottom lines, and they will not be just observers in the politics of the country where they own assets. It's a consequence of globalization that people don't think about when they jump on the globalization bandwagon.
12
Television is generating emotions of hatred and anger to make money because it is sensational news of the visual kind that is the most indelible and stimulating.
It created angry hateful leaders such as our own that in turn saw opportunity in making people angry and hateful.
Television news has billions of viewers throughout the world.
Nationalists are mentally threatened by the presence of others of different "Tribes" that are different from them. It is a natural instinct that is indicative of a yet to mature human species.
Modern transportation has made all societies open to mixing of all cultures and always will in the future. The nationalist movements are people of the past who can not accept change and look backwards to a more simple and comfortable life once lived. The future is multiculturalism. It is unavoidable. So is the hatred and anger.
I can only hope that the French, who know France, make a wise thoughtful decision. I have no horse in this race. I will be watching like everyone else. The outcome is a mystery to me that we will all learn together.
One day the world will be like New York City; a "Melting Pot" of diversity expansively multicultural and at peace.
It created angry hateful leaders such as our own that in turn saw opportunity in making people angry and hateful.
Television news has billions of viewers throughout the world.
Nationalists are mentally threatened by the presence of others of different "Tribes" that are different from them. It is a natural instinct that is indicative of a yet to mature human species.
Modern transportation has made all societies open to mixing of all cultures and always will in the future. The nationalist movements are people of the past who can not accept change and look backwards to a more simple and comfortable life once lived. The future is multiculturalism. It is unavoidable. So is the hatred and anger.
I can only hope that the French, who know France, make a wise thoughtful decision. I have no horse in this race. I will be watching like everyone else. The outcome is a mystery to me that we will all learn together.
One day the world will be like New York City; a "Melting Pot" of diversity expansively multicultural and at peace.
6
The long fingers of Putin trying to cross the ballot boxes as he successfully did in America using the misinformed electorate. if DJT had any sense of shame he wouldn't leave his palace.
7
For all the amateur detectives here who are convinced they know exactly who is behind the hacking, ask yourself this: Do you really think that the Russian government would have chosen an obscure 4chan message board to dump the info on instead of, say, Wikileaks?
10
believe nothing, trust no news source. If that's your point then you are helping the liers spread false information
5
@mpound
The only thing Putin is aiming for is breaking any alliance against him.
He needs division, and surely the one between France and Germany is an important one.
The only thing Putin is aiming for is breaking any alliance against him.
He needs division, and surely the one between France and Germany is an important one.
1
Isn't it time we acknowledge that technology, tech corporations, and their grandiose leaders have become an enemy?
They've turned themselves into active enemies of civil society, of meaningful communications, and of the false vision of the future they've been pedaling for thirty years.
They've made become liars and frauds, and rendered their technology and their products nearly useless, if not outright dangerous. They're arrogant and self-absorbed enough to fail to see it. Except the few, like Mr. Zuckerberg, who actively pursue this evil course with a boyish grin and an Eddie Haskell shrug.
Fake news, as the Right calls it, will be the death of civil society. Corps of hackers determined to ruin elections and subvert debate will kill open elections. Nations like Russia, with nothing to offer and no influence beyond the threats of its impotent leader, will rip other, better nations apart while swearing allegiance to truth and respect for the borders and traditions of others.
We have Zuckerberg boasting on one hand he can accomplish anything someone will pay him enough to attempt and on the other throwing up his hands and mumbling "Boy, that fake news and those lying Tweets are complicated, huh? Wish I could help out but, gee..."
The threat is real, and dangerous. Combined with liars and ideologues like Trump and Comey it has already upended our nation. We need the tech giants to fix this, or to pay for their turpitude. Perhaps more regulation would help.
They've turned themselves into active enemies of civil society, of meaningful communications, and of the false vision of the future they've been pedaling for thirty years.
They've made become liars and frauds, and rendered their technology and their products nearly useless, if not outright dangerous. They're arrogant and self-absorbed enough to fail to see it. Except the few, like Mr. Zuckerberg, who actively pursue this evil course with a boyish grin and an Eddie Haskell shrug.
Fake news, as the Right calls it, will be the death of civil society. Corps of hackers determined to ruin elections and subvert debate will kill open elections. Nations like Russia, with nothing to offer and no influence beyond the threats of its impotent leader, will rip other, better nations apart while swearing allegiance to truth and respect for the borders and traditions of others.
We have Zuckerberg boasting on one hand he can accomplish anything someone will pay him enough to attempt and on the other throwing up his hands and mumbling "Boy, that fake news and those lying Tweets are complicated, huh? Wish I could help out but, gee..."
The threat is real, and dangerous. Combined with liars and ideologues like Trump and Comey it has already upended our nation. We need the tech giants to fix this, or to pay for their turpitude. Perhaps more regulation would help.
If Le Pen wins, I'm cancelling my upcoming vacation trip in July to Quimper.
I'm already weary of the hard right nationalist party in control of the U.S.
I'm sick of these people and their "movement" both on a national and global scale.
I'm already weary of the hard right nationalist party in control of the U.S.
I'm sick of these people and their "movement" both on a national and global scale.
16
Keep your tickets ;-)
5
I apologize if my following comments seem rude, but since the future of Europe is at stake, I must be blunt: If you are a French voter and backed a candidate to the left of Mr. Macron in the first round, such as Jean-Luc Mélenchon, you are duty-bound to vote for Macron. An abstention is tantamount to voting for Le Pen since she would have needed to get another person's vote just to cancel out the one you decided not to cast at all.
I suggest that disaffected French citizens ask themselves:
Am I ready to passively stand aside and risk a Trump-style catastrophe in France? Would I rather spend every day for the next 5 years hearing about Le Pen or Macron? Would I rather be annoyed and disappointed by Macron or Le Pen? Does it *truly* not matter?
Another way to think about the consequences of abstention from voting- for emotional reasons- is to ask yourself: Are my own personal feelings and desire to avoid any sense of responsibility for what either candidate may do more important to me than the future of French society as a whole? If the opposite is true, you must vote for the opponent of whomever you think would be worse for France. Any other action is gravely irresponsible.
The abstention from voting by many supporters of self-proclaimed socialist Bernie Sanders was a major contributing factor in Trump's victory. If 66,000 more votes had been cast for Clinton- and distributed among the swing states exactly as she needed, Trump would not be president right now.
I suggest that disaffected French citizens ask themselves:
Am I ready to passively stand aside and risk a Trump-style catastrophe in France? Would I rather spend every day for the next 5 years hearing about Le Pen or Macron? Would I rather be annoyed and disappointed by Macron or Le Pen? Does it *truly* not matter?
Another way to think about the consequences of abstention from voting- for emotional reasons- is to ask yourself: Are my own personal feelings and desire to avoid any sense of responsibility for what either candidate may do more important to me than the future of French society as a whole? If the opposite is true, you must vote for the opponent of whomever you think would be worse for France. Any other action is gravely irresponsible.
The abstention from voting by many supporters of self-proclaimed socialist Bernie Sanders was a major contributing factor in Trump's victory. If 66,000 more votes had been cast for Clinton- and distributed among the swing states exactly as she needed, Trump would not be president right now.
97
Hopefully, France has a smaller percentage of fools than the US and will reject the Putinistic policies of Le Pen. The US is too far gone to help itself.
10
I was about to up-vote this comment until it slammed Bernie Sanders and his supporters.
Senator Sanders campaigned ardently for Secretary Clinton in the general election, and 80 % of Sanders' supporters voted for Secretary Clinton on November 8.
Had Clinton employed Sanders more heavily in the general election and aired the commercial that Sanders cut in her behalf, the outcome might have been different.
Senator Sanders campaigned ardently for Secretary Clinton in the general election, and 80 % of Sanders' supporters voted for Secretary Clinton on November 8.
Had Clinton employed Sanders more heavily in the general election and aired the commercial that Sanders cut in her behalf, the outcome might have been different.
4
Sorry, don't buy it. Yes, the French liberals should help form a firewall against Le Pen. NO, disaffected Bernie supporters did not throw the election for Trump.
Hillary did not campaign in the critical rust-belt states she lost because she, like most "Wall Street Democrats," took the blue collar voters for granted. Her basic message was, "I'll take HUGE sums for given a lunch hour talk on Wall Street, I won't tell you what I said, but you should vote for me because Trump is so awful."
But even though he is a complete phony, Trump spoke the language of the blue-collar workers. And he tapped into their anger and frustration. And Clinton did not. She blew it, and the country is pretty much done with her and the Republican-Lite, Wall Street wing of the Democratic Party.
There were other factors: Putin, Comey, and some Bernie dropouts affected the result. But until the Dems take a look at themselves and how they've abandoned their traditional blue-collar base, the will keep losing.
Hillary did not campaign in the critical rust-belt states she lost because she, like most "Wall Street Democrats," took the blue collar voters for granted. Her basic message was, "I'll take HUGE sums for given a lunch hour talk on Wall Street, I won't tell you what I said, but you should vote for me because Trump is so awful."
But even though he is a complete phony, Trump spoke the language of the blue-collar workers. And he tapped into their anger and frustration. And Clinton did not. She blew it, and the country is pretty much done with her and the Republican-Lite, Wall Street wing of the Democratic Party.
There were other factors: Putin, Comey, and some Bernie dropouts affected the result. But until the Dems take a look at themselves and how they've abandoned their traditional blue-collar base, the will keep losing.
Macron a centrist, ha ha !
Dear People of France,
Many in our country bought that it wouldn't be so bad and it is true I don't know how your electoral system works so you maybe relying on this, but all I can say they, the uber right can do enough damage in 100 days than thought possible. It will be different of course, remember you're dealing with Le Pen who has a brain, Trump not so much we find ourselves lucky in this sense. We are working feverishly to knock him and his acolytes to the wayside and it's rough. Take heed in my words, in many of our words. Macron you can work with Le Pen is like an abuser she'll just get worse.
Many in our country bought that it wouldn't be so bad and it is true I don't know how your electoral system works so you maybe relying on this, but all I can say they, the uber right can do enough damage in 100 days than thought possible. It will be different of course, remember you're dealing with Le Pen who has a brain, Trump not so much we find ourselves lucky in this sense. We are working feverishly to knock him and his acolytes to the wayside and it's rough. Take heed in my words, in many of our words. Macron you can work with Le Pen is like an abuser she'll just get worse.
14
Refreshing that the French media focuses on the news of the hack rather than detailing the gossip and treating the gossip as news.
227
Legally, they can't report on the contents of the hack until after the election.
3
Yes, our great journalists sat around reading the dumped emails and tittering about the contents. What a disgusting show by our media.
Ahem, New York Times.
Hit Russia where it hurts - in the wallet.
The accounts of the oligarchs enriched by Putin are undoubtedly known to Western intelligence agencies. Freeze them. Better yet, drain them. Must've been an accident. 400lb hacker in their basement. No idea how that could've happened.
A massive defunding of Putin's power base will have serious repercussions for him, but will leave the average Russian unaffected.
The accounts of the oligarchs enriched by Putin are undoubtedly known to Western intelligence agencies. Freeze them. Better yet, drain them. Must've been an accident. 400lb hacker in their basement. No idea how that could've happened.
A massive defunding of Putin's power base will have serious repercussions for him, but will leave the average Russian unaffected.
3
These two candidates may not represent the establishment, but what separates them is Le Pen’s intention to propagate odium. We see where that has brought us in America.
In difference to my daughter who studied in Grenoble and the people in France, I say, grandes citoyens français, rejeter tyrannie sous toutes ses formes. Restez forts et s’unissent!
In difference to my daughter who studied in Grenoble and the people in France, I say, grandes citoyens français, rejeter tyrannie sous toutes ses formes. Restez forts et s’unissent!
52
Ce sera fait.
1
Paul
Good luck to you, and I hope it is so.
Good luck to you, and I hope it is so.
1
For those who don't speak French that means "Get of the European Union now before it is too late."
I was in Paris last year. My second trip. I first went in 1996. The Paris I saw last year has become incredibly filthy and violent. A result of unchecked immigration I suppose over the last 20 years. I hope Marine Le Pen can get elected and get France working again.
21
That does not ring true to my experience in Paris. Which arrondissement (1-20) did you visit that was so "filthy and violent"? There may be an occasional side alley that is ill-attended, but rarely, and overall Paris is remarkably clean and elegant. And how do you presume that a piece of random litter anywhere was put there by an immigrant? And were you mugged? I doubt it.
57
Your comments seem extreme and misleading. My wife and I visit Paris two or three times a year and always stay in the 6th arrondissement near St Germain des Pres. it's a beautiful city.
16
There's an old saying in the mid-west about not being able to recognize good apple butter. Maybe you're familiar with it. That's you.
5
Ultimately the battle in France today is between those who believe civil society should be shaped by financial/commercial imperatives (Macron) and those who want it to be shaped by tradition, social solidarity and cultural identity (Le Pen.)
For Macron to say that there is no French culture is as astonishing as it is revealing. It will not go down well with many voters.
Most Americans are unfamiliar with the divide between liberalism and integralism (or what the Germans call gemeinschaft.) But that is what the campaign is really about. Alexis de Tocqueville discussed the divide in "Democracy in America" It is worth a read by anyone who wants to read past headlines and superficial op-eds
http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/DETOC/ch2_02.htm
For Macron to say that there is no French culture is as astonishing as it is revealing. It will not go down well with many voters.
Most Americans are unfamiliar with the divide between liberalism and integralism (or what the Germans call gemeinschaft.) But that is what the campaign is really about. Alexis de Tocqueville discussed the divide in "Democracy in America" It is worth a read by anyone who wants to read past headlines and superficial op-eds
http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/DETOC/ch2_02.htm
7
Ah, if only there were months to go before the election! Then the NYT could cover these "leaks" breathlessly every single day, driving up page views and insisting they had no idea they were supporting an organized effort to undermine one campaign at the expense of the other. It's like clockwork now: feed publishers like the NYT dirt--create even the impression of scandal, never mind the actual content of the hacked emails--and they can't help themselves. They take the bait every time...
52
No, we take the bait. We click on and read the foolish articles, and pay to do so. And some readers actually believe the "breathless" reportage... Who's dumber, the ones who peddle the sappy stories or the ones who pay to read them? Wait a minute... A second thought. The readers -- that'us -- may be poor innocents but the fabulists who purvey the "breathless breaking news," well, what are they?
3
Another article on the same subject by Mark Scott in today’s NY Times says: “American far-right activists on Saturday threw their weight behind a hacking attack”. If the American far-right is found to be actively and materially involved in French hacking, can they be declared terrorist by France? Can France ask for their extradition if the US and France have an extradition treaty? Of course, if Le Pen wins she will not ask for extradition, but if Macron wins would Trump oblige? Stay tuned. But do not let this event distract from the US investigation of Russian hacking and Trump team’s complicity in it. We must clean up the mess at home first because now the home grown far-right is learning from the Russians and getting ready for the 2018 mid-term election.
101
What does throwing their weight behind the hacking attack have to do with actually doing the hacking? Nothing. That news story was much ado about nothing.
1
Quote from the article:
"“There is no French culture — there is a diverse culture in France,” Mr. Macron said at a rally in Lyon."
He would not get my vote.
"“There is no French culture — there is a diverse culture in France,” Mr. Macron said at a rally in Lyon."
He would not get my vote.
37
yes that seems a little overstated
Macron is considerably more cultured, in the classical sense, than Hollande or Sarkozy. Despite his relative youth, he is actually reminiscent of a more erudite era, and very French indeed.
12
Nor will he get the vote of French men and women who want France to be French....
9
For pretty boy Macron to govern he'll need a majority in parliament.
His party isn't sufficiently anchored at the parliamentary-district level. The question is whether the coalition it'll be forming with moderate Socialists and with Centrists will be enough. It can also be that Conservatives, freed of their scandal-ridden candidate, make a comeback. And it can be that there is no majority at all, leading to a Spanish scenario.
No matter who wins on Sunday the election will resolve nothing and only set the stage for explosive social conflict.
The former Rothschild banker, who formulated Hollande’s bitterly unpopular economic policy and has called for a return to the draft in order to prepare an “era” of major wars, offers no alternative to Le Pen for working people, having endorsed Hollande’s state of emergency, which suspends basic democratic rights, as well as deep austerity and war planning.
It has been interesting, and predictable, that the main stream media has heralded the success of Macron as proof of the triumph of the centre, conveniently ignoring the fact that Macron managed to attract less than a quarter of the first round vote, and only managing to beat the maverick Melanchon by a surprisingly narrow 4%. This with the weight of the media squarely in his camp.
Rather than confirming the strength of centrism, it highlights its weakness; it is a repository for "anti-votes", rather than an inspiration.
The only certainty is that the 1% will will on Sunday.
As usual.
His party isn't sufficiently anchored at the parliamentary-district level. The question is whether the coalition it'll be forming with moderate Socialists and with Centrists will be enough. It can also be that Conservatives, freed of their scandal-ridden candidate, make a comeback. And it can be that there is no majority at all, leading to a Spanish scenario.
No matter who wins on Sunday the election will resolve nothing and only set the stage for explosive social conflict.
The former Rothschild banker, who formulated Hollande’s bitterly unpopular economic policy and has called for a return to the draft in order to prepare an “era” of major wars, offers no alternative to Le Pen for working people, having endorsed Hollande’s state of emergency, which suspends basic democratic rights, as well as deep austerity and war planning.
It has been interesting, and predictable, that the main stream media has heralded the success of Macron as proof of the triumph of the centre, conveniently ignoring the fact that Macron managed to attract less than a quarter of the first round vote, and only managing to beat the maverick Melanchon by a surprisingly narrow 4%. This with the weight of the media squarely in his camp.
Rather than confirming the strength of centrism, it highlights its weakness; it is a repository for "anti-votes", rather than an inspiration.
The only certainty is that the 1% will will on Sunday.
As usual.
25
None of this happens if there was no EU, who's only creation was for cheap labor at all costs.
18
How old were you in 1945 ?
2
If Le Pen's emails had been revealed, shouldn't we know the contents before the election? If something turns up after Macron's election, what will be the cost of protecting him?
4
You should not call Macron "a banker" since he spent less than 4 years of his 13 years as a banker since he got his latest university degree. You may just as well a philosopher (diploma from the very renowned ENS) or civil servant (2004-2008) or "minister of economy". Its the far right that wants to sick the label "banker" to Macron.
The program of the center right Alain Juppé or the center left Emmanuel Vals shows hardy any differences from what Macron proposes. If Macron will have no majority in Parliament, which is highly probable, Macron should be able to build a coalition without too much problems, just as most European countries do. I have reasonable hope that our french politicians will become more mature in this process and avoid France such immature personalities as Trump or Le Pen in 2022.
The program of the center right Alain Juppé or the center left Emmanuel Vals shows hardy any differences from what Macron proposes. If Macron will have no majority in Parliament, which is highly probable, Macron should be able to build a coalition without too much problems, just as most European countries do. I have reasonable hope that our french politicians will become more mature in this process and avoid France such immature personalities as Trump or Le Pen in 2022.
106
Pierre Paul: why was he paid a small fortune as such an inexperienced novice? You don't think there are strings attached or do you think Bank Rothschild likes passing out large amounts of money as party favors? He is a product of the one percent and will serve the one percent.
15
Putin is the new Kissinger. Get used to it. Little man dreams of restoring empire with borders on Germany, Iran, China and the U.S. where he's going to try for Alaska. Hopefully he'll ignore us down in Chile.
9
Again - nobody was hacked - they stupidly turned over their passwords. This is a very different event, than actually having someone defeat the security mechanism of your computer system. Their is nothing any computer system in the world can do, if the people using it are dumb enough to hand over their passwords to other people.
Whether in the USA or France, do you really want a group of people who aren't smart enough to hang on to their passwords, in charge of your nation?
Whether in the USA or France, do you really want a group of people who aren't smart enough to hang on to their passwords, in charge of your nation?
Excellent article!
The only utility I see in the hack for the far-right is to push Mélenchon voters away from the polls, which it may to some degree. But on balance, it seems like an ugly, doomed, and transparently anti-democratic way to close a campaign.
1
Variety is the spice of life. We have our own example of that aphorism. Le Pen is Trump of a different sex, Macron is the equivalent of Hillary Clinton. He will bring more stability than Le Pen.
3
It looks from here that the hacking is more of an event/big news per se than an actual threat to the candidate Macron. When hacking becomes an expected event at any election, it power is eroded but for the revelations it might unveil. As revelations are becoming expected and a mess to sort out, will they lose their power?
We brace for tomorrow: Madame Le Pen steep defeat is the only option.
We brace for tomorrow: Madame Le Pen steep defeat is the only option.
4
applause to the french media whom refused to publish the details of the hack.
264
Legally, they can't.
Ha ha, it's the law, the media couldn't publish anything under stiff penalty. Nothing to do with ethics or honor.
Its the law, they have no choice in the matter
Europe and the United States need to act, powerfully, quickly and effectively to preempt further destabilizing attacks on the sovereignty of western nations.
Whether or not it is proven that Russia was behind these fresh hacks - as is expected - western nations must find non-military but decisive means to dissuade Putin and his minions from continuing their insidious, spectacular cyber-warfare.
If not, the whole world will face an escalation of state-sponsored hacking, psy-ops, sabotage and malicious mischief that will make the cold war arms race look like a quaint historical footnote by comparison.
Whether or not it is proven that Russia was behind these fresh hacks - as is expected - western nations must find non-military but decisive means to dissuade Putin and his minions from continuing their insidious, spectacular cyber-warfare.
If not, the whole world will face an escalation of state-sponsored hacking, psy-ops, sabotage and malicious mischief that will make the cold war arms race look like a quaint historical footnote by comparison.
22
Alright. I just can't wait to see your reaction when China and Russia respond in kind.
1
I agree with your point. That is exactly why every head of state - including ours - needs to know that the cost will outweigh the benefits
1
Thus, I recommend incredibly strong economic sanctions rather than a cyber escalation.
1
Divide and conquer. That's why Putin and Trump favor Brexit and the dismantling of the EU, and why Trumps rhetoric seeks to divide the USA. Repeatedly Trump has cozied up to dictators while conveying hostility toward US allies. I hope its not too late.
70
Time to get off emails and computers
when running for office. Replace the stool pidgeons with carrier pidgeons.
when running for office. Replace the stool pidgeons with carrier pidgeons.
10
And why is there any reason to believe our elections were not hacked?
56
Because computer scientists, you know, the geeks that you most likely frown upon, found no credible evidence that it was found.
That, of course is a fact. If you choose to believe in an "alternative fact" (the kind that fits your narrative), then that is your prerogative.
That, of course is a fact. If you choose to believe in an "alternative fact" (the kind that fits your narrative), then that is your prerogative.
7
Nunya
If you choose to believe that by 'hacked' people are intending to say "exclusively nefarious computer programming with a demonstrable effect on any one individual vote" you are offering a fact-free analysis and a lie too boot.
The concern here is with the totality of an apparent effort to manipulate our election by way of leaked materials, fraudulent materials, baseless reports in the partisan news, and other means.
Direct exploitation of actual technical flaws is so small a concern as to be non-existent, as you very well know.
In this instance what your geeks have to offer is extraordinarily limit and not very relevant.
And where do you get the impression that anybody frowns upon 'the geeks'? That's so thirty years ago, dude.
If you choose to believe that by 'hacked' people are intending to say "exclusively nefarious computer programming with a demonstrable effect on any one individual vote" you are offering a fact-free analysis and a lie too boot.
The concern here is with the totality of an apparent effort to manipulate our election by way of leaked materials, fraudulent materials, baseless reports in the partisan news, and other means.
Direct exploitation of actual technical flaws is so small a concern as to be non-existent, as you very well know.
In this instance what your geeks have to offer is extraordinarily limit and not very relevant.
And where do you get the impression that anybody frowns upon 'the geeks'? That's so thirty years ago, dude.
1
Because there is not one iota of evidence that they were. This is excuse Number 17 why Hillary lost. Try excuse Number 6, which was Comey.
1
This is so horrible. But if Marcon was ahead by 20 percentage points, what on earth could get that many people to change their vote to polar-opposite Le Pen? (I ask hopefully) ...unless the voting system is rigged too.
5
It is critical that France Not Elect Frauline Le Pen and Germany elect
Frau Merkel or her Social Democratic party run 1,2 in the coming German elections this fall or 2,1. These 2 countries need to lead the West while the
Anglo-Saxons in USA & Britain wallow in bad decisions: Trump's narrow election with a minority of votes cast & a narrow British vote(4%) deciding
to leave the EU.
Russia is already fishing in central Europe and will take advantage of cultivating the countries of Eastern Europe & perhaps the depraved Italian & Greek electorates.
The Western Nations must win for the good of our grandchildren & children!
Frau Merkel or her Social Democratic party run 1,2 in the coming German elections this fall or 2,1. These 2 countries need to lead the West while the
Anglo-Saxons in USA & Britain wallow in bad decisions: Trump's narrow election with a minority of votes cast & a narrow British vote(4%) deciding
to leave the EU.
Russia is already fishing in central Europe and will take advantage of cultivating the countries of Eastern Europe & perhaps the depraved Italian & Greek electorates.
The Western Nations must win for the good of our grandchildren & children!
28
As usual Europe with some 450 million people in an area 1/3 the seize of the US is in turmoil. The UK must be so glad not to be there any more and Putin must be getting a kick out of his new found fake credit for having played a role in this. Whomever wins, be it Matron or Le Pen, will quickly change his/her perspectives and policies to be fully in line with Trump's perspectives - basically thus whatever US Congress and Senate dream up. Nothing new will show up except perhaps higher unemployment, lower wages, and long-term struggles with Middle Eastern (illegal) immigrants. And yes the EU will lump along and not be touched by Le Pen - she is not a fool (Trump's wall against Mexico is her dropping out of the EU - won't happen) .
4
Yeah. Kind of like "Trump can't win" and "Brexit will fail".
7
If she wins, I'm cancelling my vacation to the new 'vaterland'
26
Thousands of foreigners have cancelled their vacation to the US.
5
I would, too, Barry. I don't blame them.
1
Elections in the US, UK, and France hacked? Chinese and Russian money buying up real estate in major western cities and crowding out local populations? Immigrants in rich first world countries from former Eastern Bloc taking over and displacing indigenous organized criminals? Chinese firms buying up key strategic assets in English speaking countries? US government apparatchiks with uncomfortable ties with Russians (and Lord knows whom else, including our very own supremacists).
Hmm. Is this really happening? I mean really?
I often hear people with ties to third world countries point to the first world countries, and accuse them of meddling with elections and with the governance process. And, there is not an aberration in the third world that does not make the former colonialists tut tut ("bloody, savage natives!").
It has been fair to ask: why do citizens in the third world and third world governments allow such meddling and serve as the 'willingly exploited" and spend inordinate energies in crying, weeping?
Had hundreds of years of colonialism, exploitation, misery . . . taught us nothing?
Well, apparently it taught the erstwhile meddlers, occupiers, exploiters nothing as well!
Is Karma a female dog?
Kalidan
Hmm. Is this really happening? I mean really?
I often hear people with ties to third world countries point to the first world countries, and accuse them of meddling with elections and with the governance process. And, there is not an aberration in the third world that does not make the former colonialists tut tut ("bloody, savage natives!").
It has been fair to ask: why do citizens in the third world and third world governments allow such meddling and serve as the 'willingly exploited" and spend inordinate energies in crying, weeping?
Had hundreds of years of colonialism, exploitation, misery . . . taught us nothing?
Well, apparently it taught the erstwhile meddlers, occupiers, exploiters nothing as well!
Is Karma a female dog?
Kalidan
3
I hope that the French voters will show the combined forces of Putin and trump backers in the alt-right that they are not so stupid as to fall for this provocation. Putin, Le Pen, alt-right are so repugnant no amount of meddling should change that, on the contrary. I wish we had the same wisdom here when our elections were hacked. Cher amis francais, nous sommes tous avec vous domain. En marche!
150
I hope they choose to march on. Well said, Lt!
7
Apparently we have at least 63 million buffoons without the wisdom to protect themselves.
Unfortunately, too many American voters were stupid enough to fall for the lies and manipulation... to our great misfortune. Kudos to the French!
Meanwhile, Trump and Putin support Le Pen. We know that Putin wants to undermine democratic countries and institutions around the world. Trump has apparently never read a book about how extreme nationalism helped in causing two World Wars in the 20th century.
Don't be surprised if France rejects this ploy by hackers with ties to Putin to influence Sunday's vote in the same way they did to influence the American electorate.
Don't be surprised if France rejects this ploy by hackers with ties to Putin to influence Sunday's vote in the same way they did to influence the American electorate.
113
trump has never read a book...not to completion!
Trump has never read any book period, even his own, that he did NOT write!
1
Most likely in the near Future I would not be surprised that we find-out that this "hacked-information" was originally "fully-loaded" with tracing and destroying programming. Thus, the Hackers should just temporarily enjoy these "false gains, false winnings", because ultimately they are going to lose. Clearly they were too uneducated to realize that hacking-in was just too easy, and that they were allowed to do it, repeatedly. So, essentially, the Hackers took the bait.
9
'There is no French culture — there is a diverse culture in France,” Mr. Macron said at a rally in Lyon.'
I understand what he was trying to say but, wow, "There is no French culture..." is a really bad way to phrase it, if you want to win a French election.
I understand what he was trying to say but, wow, "There is no French culture..." is a really bad way to phrase it, if you want to win a French election.
16
Either he truly believes that or is pandering to "French" voters who do. That's globalism for ya. Destroy Western cultures, the nuclear family. Cultural Marxism in a nutshell.
5
I'd rather have Macron elected with his centrist/progressive platform needing to work it all out, than LePen's platform of racism and ethnocentrism.
Viva, la France!
Viva, la France!
211
"...whether either candidate, as an outsider, could really be effective as president is in doubt."
Yeah, insiders in France have done really well on that score. (The previous one is languishing at less than 10% favorability ratings in the polls when I last checked).
Yeah, insiders in France have done really well on that score. (The previous one is languishing at less than 10% favorability ratings in the polls when I last checked).
29
An excellent summary.
9
If Le Pen wins, it will mark the beginning of a new world order of Fascism. If she loses, we still have to deal with Trump.
273
@DDS:
If she wins, she still must fight organized labor, (the CGT, "Conseil General du Travail", General Council of Labor) and FO ("Force Ouvrier", Workers' Force, labor federations unlike anything in America, being proto-Communist; the French Socialist Party that will make for a very hostile National Assembly and Senate; the Judiciary; and deeply entrenched bureaucracies at almost every level of government. Just like Trump here.
But candidate Le Pen will probably lose for the same reason that Action Francais, Rexist splinter parties, Camelots du Roi, OAS, and Boulangism lost: too disruptive and bad for business and, therefore, too hard on the pocketbook. Too expensive to the commonwealth, in other words. The French middle-class loves its money, more than most people realize as anyone who has watched them argue over it in a brasserie or restaurant can attest. Whatever else the social turmoil unleashed by President de la Republic Le Pen becomes, it most certainly will be very bad for business; a fact never very far from voters' minds.
If she wins, she still must fight organized labor, (the CGT, "Conseil General du Travail", General Council of Labor) and FO ("Force Ouvrier", Workers' Force, labor federations unlike anything in America, being proto-Communist; the French Socialist Party that will make for a very hostile National Assembly and Senate; the Judiciary; and deeply entrenched bureaucracies at almost every level of government. Just like Trump here.
But candidate Le Pen will probably lose for the same reason that Action Francais, Rexist splinter parties, Camelots du Roi, OAS, and Boulangism lost: too disruptive and bad for business and, therefore, too hard on the pocketbook. Too expensive to the commonwealth, in other words. The French middle-class loves its money, more than most people realize as anyone who has watched them argue over it in a brasserie or restaurant can attest. Whatever else the social turmoil unleashed by President de la Republic Le Pen becomes, it most certainly will be very bad for business; a fact never very far from voters' minds.
4
Yes. WE must get The Con Don and his Robber Baron party out. Here's a place to start:
https://impeachdonaldtrumpnow.org/2017/04/28/la-city-council-committee-v...
https://impeachdonaldtrumpnow.org/2017/04/28/la-city-council-committee-v...
Come on, WikiLeaks announced a couple of days ago that they were releasing hacked Macron campaign emails, and the French did what the French do--and should do--they shrugged. And boosted his lead in the polls by 3%. These days it seems it's an honor to be hacked by WikiLeaks with its ties to Russia.
200
Very naive thinking. The US elections were hacked / influenced by the KGB and I do not think you will find a majority of Americans who have "shrugged."
18
That's really encouraging!
2
What's disturbing to me is that today I spoke with two young (late 20s) voters in the U.S. who cast their ballots for Green Party candidate Jill Stein and who expressed their admiration and respect for WikiLeaks. Myself, I would like to see Julian Assange kicked out of the Ecuadorian embassy in London and forced to stand trial for all his crimes, personal and otherwise.
These young Green Party voters seem like traitors to me, supporting fascism and the overthrow of our democracies in favor of. . . what? The kind of dictatorship and authoritarian rule of Putin, Erdogan, Duterte, Madero, Orban, Mugabe, et al.?
These young Green Party voters seem like traitors to me, supporting fascism and the overthrow of our democracies in favor of. . . what? The kind of dictatorship and authoritarian rule of Putin, Erdogan, Duterte, Madero, Orban, Mugabe, et al.?
4