It's important to bear in mind the extent to which racism plays a role in the anti-immigrant rage of Trump and his supporters. When speaking of Mexican immigrants, Trump said to his followers "they're not like you... they're not like you... they're rapists." That, my friends, is textbook racist Demagoguery.
4
Mexico has immigration laws. Are they racist? Do Mexicans welcome large numbers of unskilled migrants to their nation? Why should we?
FYI, I hate Trump. But I'm not overly fond of the racism of the Latino lobby either.
FYI, I hate Trump. But I'm not overly fond of the racism of the Latino lobby either.
6
Why do you only address Mexico in this? LOL there are other Latin American countries.
1
Are we going to live according to the standards of Mexico now? Do you also want to follow their laws on drugs and guns? Why do you want to follow their laws on immigration?
1
There is a much better fix for minors who came into the US illegally when they were young. For those who are going into college, they should be treated like international students and if they get accepted, be issued a F-1 visa (i.e., student visa) that allows them to be legally here in the U.S., get a social security number, they're still ineligible for federal student aid, and they're allowed to work. Most importantly, it puts them on a path of legality. Once they graduate, they can use OPT to get a job legally in the US and hopefully find a US company to sponsor them with a H-1B visa where they can legally stay and work in the US (and pay taxes). This would put them on a path of legality for being here in the US.
4
Our colleges ought to give these students F1 student visas like all foreign students, and have them pay international tuition fee. That's one way to legitimize their status here.
8
Nope. They'd still be foreigners. It's what they are. They are not owed any other status because their parents voluntarily broke our laws.
3
I am acquainted with a doctor and his wife who have volunteered in Mexican orphanages. They decided to adopt an adolescent from an orphanage. He had fixable medical problems which were being left to fester. They brought him home, where some expensive medical treatment fixed his problems. His new family and their school district also put in a lot of time to teach him English, and to help him academically.
The last time I saw the couple, their adopted son had graduated from high school and had begun classes at the local community college, but they were angry with him over his recent revelation that he was actually 3 years older than they had been told.
Maybe the orphanage and the Mexican government had lowered his age to make it more likely Americans would adopt him. This suggests Mexico is willing to alter birth certificates. Perhaps a small bribe makes this process all the easier.
President Obama decided that people, who came here, illegally, before they turned age 16, would not be deported and would be given work permits. People, who are now as old as 34, can still apply. I wonder if the Mexican authorities feel, it is in their interest, to alter birth certificates for their citizens who were 16 or older, when they moved to the U.S. Since many Mexicans have dropped out of school by age 12, many of them of them did not re-enroll in school when they arrive here. They would not have told their age to any government entity.
The last time I saw the couple, their adopted son had graduated from high school and had begun classes at the local community college, but they were angry with him over his recent revelation that he was actually 3 years older than they had been told.
Maybe the orphanage and the Mexican government had lowered his age to make it more likely Americans would adopt him. This suggests Mexico is willing to alter birth certificates. Perhaps a small bribe makes this process all the easier.
President Obama decided that people, who came here, illegally, before they turned age 16, would not be deported and would be given work permits. People, who are now as old as 34, can still apply. I wonder if the Mexican authorities feel, it is in their interest, to alter birth certificates for their citizens who were 16 or older, when they moved to the U.S. Since many Mexicans have dropped out of school by age 12, many of them of them did not re-enroll in school when they arrive here. They would not have told their age to any government entity.
3
According to an article titled "Understanding DACA’s Education Requirement by Patrick Taurel”published on the the American Immigration Council’s website on 11/18/13, an illegal immigrant does NOT need a high school diploma to qualify for DACA. It says an estimated 400,000 people who did not finish high school can apply for DACA just by enrolling in a GED or similar program.
3
We have a lot of international students here in Pullman and they're great. The come here, study hard, acquire skills, and then go back to their home countries and contribute there. I think the illegal alien students should be allowed to complete the educations before having to leave the US.
While still here they can try to get work visas. The students from India and China and Brazil do that here. Some of them get visas but most don't.
Earth to illegal aliens: You have no right to be in this country. You have no right to be in this country, no matter how or with whom you came.
While still here they can try to get work visas. The students from India and China and Brazil do that here. Some of them get visas but most don't.
Earth to illegal aliens: You have no right to be in this country. You have no right to be in this country, no matter how or with whom you came.
9
It was not their choice to come to the US. Their parents brought them here. Since they were raised here, this is their home. They belong here. I spent all my life in the US, this is my home and no one can ever take away that feeling. Putting myself in their situation, I would be devastated if I was forced to move to another country just because I wasn't born here. Why do you have to use the term "illegal aliens"? It is a term that is used to purposely belittle the existence of a human being. There are terms that can be used to respectfully address the status such as undocumented student.
1
JR,
It wasn't our choice either. It's not our problem either. Taking advantage of American generosity only means we should be stop letting ourselves be played for fools.
It wasn't our choice either. It's not our problem either. Taking advantage of American generosity only means we should be stop letting ourselves be played for fools.
4
I could make an argument that the biggest strength of our American democracy is due to the millions of people who arrived here, whether voluntarily or not, and worked to build this nation. Our politicians and laws have been inconsistent with democracy since the very beginning, but the people haven't.
1
I don't appreciate the urban condescension of the opening paragraph. Do people begin an article on New York City pointing out the noxious traffic fumes? As a fifth-generation Valley-dweller I would say that the olfactory signature of the Central Valley might be the sweet scent of almond blossoms in the spring or the redolent tomatoes under the summer sun. That said, I appreciate the effort UC Merced is making to give the children and grandchildren of those who have long laboured for better lives for their progeny opportunities at higher education.
9
Each day of this new administration seems worst than the previous. Sometimes it seems the only sanity is in my home state. I have never been prouder to be a Californian and part of the UC family.
8
I've heard a lot about how PC and the liberal media have driven people further right.
Well, when I read the views of the anti-immigrant alt-right, it pushes me further to the left.
I'll think of you when I donate to La Raza. I wouldn't have done it if not for people like you.
Well, when I read the views of the anti-immigrant alt-right, it pushes me further to the left.
I'll think of you when I donate to La Raza. I wouldn't have done it if not for people like you.
8
California,
12 percent of US population, 13 percent of US output. Sixth largest world economy.
Those illegals out produce those Deep South confederates by miles.
12 percent of US population, 13 percent of US output. Sixth largest world economy.
Those illegals out produce those Deep South confederates by miles.
11
Complete rubbish. American southerners are much more productive than illegal aliens.
The American-born Californians and the legal immigrants are the ones driving the productivity in CA.
The American-born Californians and the legal immigrants are the ones driving the productivity in CA.
9
Using "safe space" and "dreamers" seems like you're trying to attract the alt-right hordes. These are some of their trigger words.
1
I am a transplanted Californian; being born and raised in New Mexico. I came to Cali while as a Navy sailor. I've been here 47 years now and I HAVE NEVER BEEN PROUDER OF MY STATE! CALI ROCKS!
9
I think it would make sense to let these people graduate and become productive members of our society, given how much we, as taxpayers, have already invested in their health and education (k-12). This should come with a condition that they must obtain a "useful" degree and not another political science, sociology, theater, etc major. These degrees do not put food on the table unless you have family money, which these young adults do not. In this article, only one young man is studying engineering. If they rely on US taxpayer's money to educate them, they must be educated in something that would guarantee a gainful employment.
7
That will only encourage more to move here. Most such people are not people we need here.
8
As a low income, first generation in my family to graduate from college I was proud of my parents for not only working hard, but obeying the laws of our country. By the way, we are white. The parents of these children broke immigration laws and put these children in a terrible predicament so the parents are far from heroes in my book. And as for the excuse that these kids deserve in state tuition because their parents pay taxes please note the majority of the students come from families making less than $25,000 per year. They probably pay no taxes!
17
They pay sales tax on everything they buy and property tax through their rent, if nothing else.
5
Ben,
They earn very little and pay even less in taxes. Much of their income goes back to Mexico. They are net burdens on the middle class.
They earn very little and pay even less in taxes. Much of their income goes back to Mexico. They are net burdens on the middle class.
7
Yes on the rent but California doesn't charge tax for groceries.
Being an American is rapidly becoming something to be embarrassed about and devalued in favor of the 'undocumented' and immigrants. One might call it 'American privilege' to create a sense that America really belongs to the world and the world can dictate American policy.
17
No matter how "effective" it may be, I find the idea of segregating poor people vaguely elitist and disgusting. It just isn't right on multiple levels.
1
I was a low-income, first-generation college student. Unlike virtually every single such student profiled in this paper, I was a non-Hispanic white. Surely, I cannot be the only poor, first generation college student who fell into that demographic in the last 50 years, but you wouldn't guess it reading this paper.
Does it occur to the Times that the focus of "first generation" programs on minority communities may be one of the reasons that the children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren of coal miners and factory workers were left so disenfranchised that they helped elect a total incompetent to the presidency of the United States? That if there were more outreach in Appalachia and the Rust Belt, there might be more educated people who could fill the jobs that go open because people don't have the education or training for them?
There are poor white kids in America who would benefit from these programs. Articles like this make it so easy for Bannon and his minions to make their case.
Does it occur to the Times that the focus of "first generation" programs on minority communities may be one of the reasons that the children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren of coal miners and factory workers were left so disenfranchised that they helped elect a total incompetent to the presidency of the United States? That if there were more outreach in Appalachia and the Rust Belt, there might be more educated people who could fill the jobs that go open because people don't have the education or training for them?
There are poor white kids in America who would benefit from these programs. Articles like this make it so easy for Bannon and his minions to make their case.
34
JM,,Some in this country look for votes not for solutions.
All about power.
Trump went to those poor parts of our country to offer solutions and oh by the way votes were a by product.
All about power.
Trump went to those poor parts of our country to offer solutions and oh by the way votes were a by product.
2
They are white. Therefore they don't matter to the elites of the Democratic party.
9
I understand the frustration. But there are so many programs out there that are geared towards first-generation and low income without even mentioning race. When I was applying to scholarships, there were a ton that did not even mention race. People just have to do their research.
2
I know for a fact a number of these kids at UCSB are entitled brats who spend their time whining and protesting vs. showing gratitude for being given an education provided for by the taxpayers of California. Their wonderful skills will be put to far more effective use in their own countries, particularly those who want to be politicians.
15
Since it's the parent(s) of these youngsters who decided to take up illegal residence in the US, then going on to flout & break other laws (by driving without licenses or insurance, lying to get benefits such as the free surgeries in this article, evading taxes) the parents should bear the consequences. Consequence #1 should be that they leave the US pronto. Young-adult DACA beneficiaries whose parents self-deport at their own expense then, & only then, could be given a path to legal residency & citizenship. If the parents refuse to leave, no chance of green cards or citizenship for their "undocumented" progeny.
I know this sounds Draconian, but so far I've not heard any solution to this problem that doesn't end up rewarding illegal immigrants for being illegal, & doesn't encourage more illegal immigration down the line.
Also, in the many stories extolling the virtues of DACA beneficiaries in the press, the young people never express the slightest awareness that their parents are the ones who put them in an untenable legal situation in the first place. These young people seem to have no problem being critical of the US for having borders & immigration laws not to their liking; but they are completely uncritical of the people responsible for creating the situation they now find themselves in. To the contrary, many DACA beneficiaries see their parents as heroes & are hostile to the US:
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/opinion/commentary/sdut-ruben-navarr...
I know this sounds Draconian, but so far I've not heard any solution to this problem that doesn't end up rewarding illegal immigrants for being illegal, & doesn't encourage more illegal immigration down the line.
Also, in the many stories extolling the virtues of DACA beneficiaries in the press, the young people never express the slightest awareness that their parents are the ones who put them in an untenable legal situation in the first place. These young people seem to have no problem being critical of the US for having borders & immigration laws not to their liking; but they are completely uncritical of the people responsible for creating the situation they now find themselves in. To the contrary, many DACA beneficiaries see their parents as heroes & are hostile to the US:
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/opinion/commentary/sdut-ruben-navarr...
16
Wait a generation and see what these DACA students have to say when their american born citizen children cannot get into the UC system because their place is taken by an illegal immigrant dreamer.
5
Immigrants are welcome if they follow the laws and rules. The laws can't be optional for some and not others. Don't the students interviewed here see that they want the rules that others have to follow, tossed out for them.
Most citizens are not without empathy and compassion, but where do you draw the line. No matter where you draw it, if some benefit and others don't it's unfair. And not much in this world is fair. Clearly as a nation we don't have the resources to let anyone walk in and demand citizenship. Which in effect seems to be what many want.
The world is full of people going through very hard times, but we can't take care of the poor and unemployed (here legally) in our own country.
We should help and accept those immigrants we reasonably can, but they have to go through the required process. The only sensible way. And these illegal students should have and express a little humility and gratitude, for all the taxpayers have provided them.
Most citizens are not without empathy and compassion, but where do you draw the line. No matter where you draw it, if some benefit and others don't it's unfair. And not much in this world is fair. Clearly as a nation we don't have the resources to let anyone walk in and demand citizenship. Which in effect seems to be what many want.
The world is full of people going through very hard times, but we can't take care of the poor and unemployed (here legally) in our own country.
We should help and accept those immigrants we reasonably can, but they have to go through the required process. The only sensible way. And these illegal students should have and express a little humility and gratitude, for all the taxpayers have provided them.
23
As a community college instructor in California, I will serve all and any students that want an education. Denying any single individual an education based on culture, race, religion, or documentation status, goes against the basic principles of a maturing and evolving democracy. States must protect the rights of all people within their borders, not just some. Otherwise, the notion of democracy has to be sacrificed for some other term and practice.
7
What about the rights of legal American citizens and California residents whose families paid their California taxes but they cannot get into the UC system because their spot is filled by an illegal immigrant? How is that fair? Why should they have to take loans to pay out of state tuition when they are forced to go to the universities of states not their own?
7
There are lots of "American citizens" who can't get into UC. And lots of foreign students and out of state students are studying at UC. Lots of Californians whose families pay CA taxes but can't get in because they don't qualify. Also you probably don't realize how little state support goes to UC these days anyway. There are many other opportunities in CA for education, including the large network of community colleges and the California State University system which is different from UC. The number of undocumented students at UC is probably a lot smaller than the number of out of state students.
1
Millions of young Americans owe thousands of dollar in student loan. Yet all these illegal immigrants are getting free education.
Good job nytimes publishing publishing articles like this (sarcasm) , you are helping Trump more than you know it.
Good job nytimes publishing publishing articles like this (sarcasm) , you are helping Trump more than you know it.
24
Grrrr. They are getting in-state tuition. Did you read the article? These young people are a tremendous asset to California- they are bright, serious, and driven to achieve. They are the people who will solve some of our biggest problems. Proud of them, proud to be 6th generation Californian, Go Bears!
5
And what happens to to the "dreams" of the fully qualified American citizens and legal residents of California who cannot get into the UC system because those spots are filled by illegal aliens getting instate tuition and possibly scholarships? Those legal Americans have to go to private schools and out of state colleges where they pay private school or OUT OF STATE tuition instead of being educated where they were raised and their parents paid taxes and where they are truly deserving of in state tuition and an education in their home state..
7
LOL I swear people think that undocumented students have it easy. NO THEY DONT. Students get admitted based on SAT scores, ACT scores, high school grades, extracurriculars, and personal statement. If a student does not get accepted, it means that they were not qualified enough and the school did not want them. Are you sure undocumented students are stealing spots? Because it seems to me that they earned them based on their applications that got them into the best universities. I am a legal resident of CA and I did not get into my top choice UC but I am not blaming undocumented students for taking a spot that never belong to me. I know if I would have done more for my application I probably could have a better shot.
3
How can any American not love California?!?!
Getting ready to protect its residents from an abusive federal government, leading the nation in everything from auto emissions, consumer safety and financial regulations, it embodies so much of the very best of our country.
We may not all be Californians, but I'm sure as hell glad it's there.
Getting ready to protect its residents from an abusive federal government, leading the nation in everything from auto emissions, consumer safety and financial regulations, it embodies so much of the very best of our country.
We may not all be Californians, but I'm sure as hell glad it's there.
16
As of 1:00 PM CDT, I read all the comments on this article.
What would make the United States, the native land of generations of my ancestors and my own, into paradise on earth would be for all of the Dreamers (such as those featured in this article) to be made citizens and for the greater part of the commenters to get their ugly selves somewhere. And when they leave, they should take the immigrant trash with them. Hey, immigrant trash from bygone generations begat the citizen trash that wrote the despicable, bigoted comments herein.
The NYT now publishes comments like those found on Yahoo and its online versions of supermarket checkout line publications
What would make the United States, the native land of generations of my ancestors and my own, into paradise on earth would be for all of the Dreamers (such as those featured in this article) to be made citizens and for the greater part of the commenters to get their ugly selves somewhere. And when they leave, they should take the immigrant trash with them. Hey, immigrant trash from bygone generations begat the citizen trash that wrote the despicable, bigoted comments herein.
The NYT now publishes comments like those found on Yahoo and its online versions of supermarket checkout line publications
5
Because people are fed up and have a different opinion than yours its "trash?" How very liberal of you to think that only your opinion is the right one.
17
This is why you have Trump. Because you believe that anyone who doesn't agree with you is a terrible person. Every other nation has immigration laws. We should be no different. Let Mexicans fix up Mexico.
13
David it's called freedom of speech wherein everyone is entitled to say as they please. Hint, don't read comments that mind offend you.
5
The U.S has one of the most friendly immigration laws in the World. In Europe or most countries in the world, These people would not be able to apply for college in the first place. Here in the U.S, not only can they apply for college, they get college aids, etc...
Instead of complaining, they should consider themselves happy. Even the so called "Socialist European countries " like France, Germany don't give illegals the right to education.
Instead of complaining, they should consider themselves happy. Even the so called "Socialist European countries " like France, Germany don't give illegals the right to education.
20
Yes, let's spend taxpayer money on illegals (and encourage more to come), while entire Midwest communities are imploding. The NYTimes is definitely treating Americans as the enemy nowadays.
25
Hey, they fought for their voices to heard and people got together and advocated for these students. I never once heard of the midwest having trouble. They need to speak up to their state can do something about it.
My neighbor's spending 50k a year to send her daughter to college. But don't worry Mexicans. I'm sure she'll be happy to spend another 50k of her own hard earned money so you that undocumented saints can have one as well!
Enough already with the absurd resentments all these Mexicans have about this nation. They were not invited here. They know this. They can go home. It is not our responsibility to provide anything for them.
Enough already with the absurd resentments all these Mexicans have about this nation. They were not invited here. They know this. They can go home. It is not our responsibility to provide anything for them.
26
Hey, cat in the hat, you are obviously not aware that Mexico is not the only country that immigrants come from. I suggest not to use Mexicans to describe all undocumented people unless you are trying to hint at your racism. Let me tell you something about universities. Undocumented students worked hard in order to get into these schools that give out the best financial aid. So if you want your kids to get the best financial aid, work hard in school to get accepted to universities that give out best financial aid and work hard to get scholarships so that you don't have to be in debt.
2
These kids wouldn't feel so anxious if they went home. They notion that you get to be an American if you parents willfully broke our laws is leftist fantasy. If we said no, you don't get to say yes. Americans like myself are sick of being told that our country exists largely to make the lives of the Mexican underclass easier.
16
I am a big time Bernie supporter and donor and thats said it all on most my political leaning. I am all for regulated immigration, we waited 10 years for a family immigration visa to the USA. But we need to enforce our border, many billions of humans want to live in the USA, this type reporting only incites backlashes. And in many articles NYTimes ran before, many of these families have many children, we make very good money, and we can only afford 2.
37
Their safe space is their own country not ours.
26
This IS their country. These students were raised and educated in the U.S. That's the whole impetus of DACA.
6
Unless you're here legally it isn't. I don't get to make Mexico's laws and Mexicans don't get to make mine.
6
@California Writer: contrary to your statement, that is NOT the definition of citizenship here or anywhere else.
Many of these kids came here as TEENAGERS; Spanish is their first language. And their native homelands NEED smart, motivated workers and students.
Many of these kids came here as TEENAGERS; Spanish is their first language. And their native homelands NEED smart, motivated workers and students.
8
Illegal immigration is a supply and demand problem. We can fix this by simply fining employers who hire undocumented workers. I mow my own lawn. Do you? If not, you're on the demand side of the equation, so don't complain.
14
I've heard that over half the farmworkers in the US are undocumented. What will happen if only half of the food gets into the grocery store?
3
I am amazed at the number of people who claim to be liberal then cite the fact that produce will not be cheap or be picked if there are not illegal immigrants to pick it. It seems to be okay for illegals to be paid slave wages for extremely hard work even if many of the farms are owned by corporations with well paid executives. The same argument could have been used by slave owners about cotton.
5
Kill welfare, and inner city populations are enough to support all farms in the country.
3
Also, remember that the young CITIZEN from Kansas, illinois or wherever in US has to pay out of state tuition for a UC school which is now very expensive, while these ILLEGALS get the breaks (ie admission, financial aid, safe spaces (eye roll)). Something very wrong with this picture.
45
They are Californians. Many of us are from somewhere else. Even if they are undocumented, they and their parents paid taxes in California to support our universities and colleges. California has made a decision that these immigrant student's contribution will vastly outweigh the cost of their education. This is clearly justified. Citizen's from Kansas didn't pay California taxes and will probably go back to Kansas. I think they should stay in Kansas and provide more room for Californians at our universities, and but if they want to come here expensive out of state tuition is make sense.
9
Lisa of Oakland CA wrote:
"California has made a decision that these immigrant student's contribution will vastly outweigh the cost of their education."
That cost will go up dramatically once Federal funds are withheld from more and more California municipalities. I will happily see those funds redirected to turn Appalachia into Switzerland or create an underground MagLev train between NY and Chicago, and at the same time watch Californians and their beloved illegal aliens scramble over their crumbling infrastructure.
Perhaps California should recalculate the costs.
"California has made a decision that these immigrant student's contribution will vastly outweigh the cost of their education."
That cost will go up dramatically once Federal funds are withheld from more and more California municipalities. I will happily see those funds redirected to turn Appalachia into Switzerland or create an underground MagLev train between NY and Chicago, and at the same time watch Californians and their beloved illegal aliens scramble over their crumbling infrastructure.
Perhaps California should recalculate the costs.
11
Lisa, the education system gets huge amounts of money from the Federal government. So, yes citizens of other states do pay into the California education system.
11
The two sides on the illegal immigration issue should compromise. Americans are reluctant to support another amnesty for illegal immigrants because they know open border advocates will work to thwart efforts to curtail future illegal immigration. In 1986, we granted amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants based on promises that the federal government would stop future illegal immigration. But a tsunami of illegal immigrants quickly pushed the number of people in the country illegally to more than 11 million. Before granting another amnesty, we should take measures to stop future illegal immigration. We should empowers states, counties and cities to make it unlawful for unauthorized immigrants to reside within their jurisdictions. We should make E-Verify mandatory nationwide. We should amend or reinterpret the citizenship clause to grant birthright citizenship only to children born to U.S. parents. We should automatically deny asylum to migrants who enter the country unlawfully. (Asylum-seekers should apply for asylum at U.S. embassies in their home countries or at legal ports of entry.) Once these measures are in place, we should grant citizenship to those enrolled in the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program and permanent legal status to illegal immigrants who have established families in America.
13
That would be a great compromise, unfortunately the powers that be like cheap scared labor, and liberals believe that the world should be borderless and we should all love each other, criminals, jihadis and all, and conservatives believe it's more important to punish anyone they can catch than it is to make individual wise decisions.
4
Completely false characterization of liberals.
- We do not believe the world should be borderless
- All should love eachother...ideally yes that would be nice, though not likely
Conservatives definitely love cheap labor and focus on punishment instead of common sense reform.
- We do not believe the world should be borderless
- All should love eachother...ideally yes that would be nice, though not likely
Conservatives definitely love cheap labor and focus on punishment instead of common sense reform.
5
Amnesty is not common sense.
3
To coddle the children of people who came to the U.S. illegally simply encourages more illegal immigration. The UC system is dedicating resources to illegal aliens that should be given to native Californians. If these kids are as studious and ethical and positive as the NYT portrays them, then they need to go back to their country and make it liveable. Mexico is a hell-hole controlled by drug cartels and it is in need of young people who have lived in a functional country and can try to reproduce what they have experienced. It is not the job of the U.S. to handle the overflow of every dysfunctional country in the world.
55
Your assertion of incentives is belain by the fact that since UC-Merced opened (and since 2005), there is a net-negative migration from Mexico, the country you cite. We do not remove educational opportunities from the children of people who commit any crime because the children are not culpable for their parents' actions. Many of these scholars have tenuous ties to their home countries, having not grown up there or been immersed in those countries' cultures. They, in fact, give every sign of being current and future assets to the community they are in and the communities in which they grew up. I am quite content to have my tax dollars support them and other young people in the UC system.
1
According to a recent DHS report the number of unaccompanied alien children (UACs) coming across the border has doubled and the number of family units has tripled in fiscal year 2016 compared to the same time frame in fiscal year 2015.
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-border-patrol-migrants-20160424-stor...
Border Patrol sees increase in number of migrants being detained at Mexico border
"The number of family members caught crossing illegally has nearly tripled compared with this time last year, and the number of unaccompanied children has almost doubled, the figures show."
http://www.cbp.gov/site-page/southwest-border-unaccompanied-alien-childr...
"The number of unaccompanied alien children (0-17 years old) that were apprehend between October 1- January 31 has doubled from 10,105 in 2015 to 20,455 in 2016. The number of family units apprehended in the same time period has almost tripled from 9,090 in 2015 to 24,616 in 2016."
http://www.santacruzsentinel.com/social-affairs/20151125/thousands-of-un...
Thousands of unaccompanied children crossed US-Mexico border in October
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-border-patrol-migrants-20160424-stor...
Border Patrol sees increase in number of migrants being detained at Mexico border
"The number of family members caught crossing illegally has nearly tripled compared with this time last year, and the number of unaccompanied children has almost doubled, the figures show."
http://www.cbp.gov/site-page/southwest-border-unaccompanied-alien-childr...
"The number of unaccompanied alien children (0-17 years old) that were apprehend between October 1- January 31 has doubled from 10,105 in 2015 to 20,455 in 2016. The number of family units apprehended in the same time period has almost tripled from 9,090 in 2015 to 24,616 in 2016."
http://www.santacruzsentinel.com/social-affairs/20151125/thousands-of-un...
Thousands of unaccompanied children crossed US-Mexico border in October
11
http://www.msnbc.com/andrea-mitchell-reports/watch/backlash-grows-over-t...
"The former ambassador stated,” If you were to deport the 30 million undocumented immigrants in the United States that’s going to cost you about 130 billion dollars.”
That's $4333 each. So when you count up the $1500 each per year in food stamps plus the $4000 each per year sent out of the country, that's already a net savings to the economy right there.
http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/latino/edgard-portela/2016/02/25/fiesta...
Fiesta for New ‘Wave’ of Mexican Immigrants on Univision
http://www.mrctv.org/videos/fiesta-new-wave-mexican-immigrants-univision
"Despite official statistics showing immigration from Mexico is down in recent years, Univision has found an apparent exception in the case of immigrants from the Mexican state of Puebla.
ORLANDO SEGURA, UNIVISION: During the last 30 years three migrant waves of Pueblans to New York have existed. The first was in the 80’s, benefitting from the amnesty of Ronald Reagan. The second, during the economic boom of the presidency of Bill Clinton. The third, we are living through right now."
"The former ambassador stated,” If you were to deport the 30 million undocumented immigrants in the United States that’s going to cost you about 130 billion dollars.”
That's $4333 each. So when you count up the $1500 each per year in food stamps plus the $4000 each per year sent out of the country, that's already a net savings to the economy right there.
http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/latino/edgard-portela/2016/02/25/fiesta...
Fiesta for New ‘Wave’ of Mexican Immigrants on Univision
http://www.mrctv.org/videos/fiesta-new-wave-mexican-immigrants-univision
"Despite official statistics showing immigration from Mexico is down in recent years, Univision has found an apparent exception in the case of immigrants from the Mexican state of Puebla.
ORLANDO SEGURA, UNIVISION: During the last 30 years three migrant waves of Pueblans to New York have existed. The first was in the 80’s, benefitting from the amnesty of Ronald Reagan. The second, during the economic boom of the presidency of Bill Clinton. The third, we are living through right now."
8
To all those objecting that we need to support American citizens INSTEAD of "Dreamers": obviously, we need to do both. There are many first-generation students at American universities who deserve all the support we can give them. But Dreamers also face the nightmarish possibility of being rounded-up and deported. I applaud the policies of California and New York, which offer them support and protection.
4
Sending Mexicans home is their problem not ours. We owe them nothing. Just because their parents willfully ignored our laws does not give them the right to stay here.
14
Deport the illegal alien parents and the children that they dragged into their ill-considered scheme to trespass into our country, flout our laws, and steal services intended for American citizens and those lawfully present in our country. The parents will learn nothing from being deported -- especially when illegal alien advocates tell them that THEY are the victims -- but their children will learn a valuable life lesson: cheaters never prosper.
You want a safe space? Build it in the illegal aliens' home countries and send them to it.
You want a safe space? Build it in the illegal aliens' home countries and send them to it.
36
Great plan -- then who's going to do all the hotel cleaning, restaurant & construction work, fruit & vegetable picking, poultry & meat packing? Have fun paying triple for your almost food products!
Oh, wait, maybe the Rust Belters will move to the agriculture & meat packing areas & do the work for minimum wage -- without complaint. Ya, right!
Oh, wait, maybe the Rust Belters will move to the agriculture & meat packing areas & do the work for minimum wage -- without complaint. Ya, right!
1
Lee.. So pay $50,000 to hotel maids. Who cares? It'll cost more. get over it
1
Aren't there things like student visas? Having had hundreds of friends that have dealt with this, I understand that it's a fairly routine process. Universities even have counselors that help with this.
Of course, there are usually two provisions: You have to apply for it from your home country, and usually you have to go back to your home country, I believe for at least two years.
Consequently, I am very confused how any university student can be undocumented. It's really NOT their undocumented status that presents a barrier to an education, but rather their unwillingness to accept the legal restrictions on the visa program that would allow them to proceed.
Considering that the overwhelming majority of foreign students and immigrants are able to follow simple rules, I have not found an overwhelming amount of sympathy for the problems of people like this.
Of course, there are usually two provisions: You have to apply for it from your home country, and usually you have to go back to your home country, I believe for at least two years.
Consequently, I am very confused how any university student can be undocumented. It's really NOT their undocumented status that presents a barrier to an education, but rather their unwillingness to accept the legal restrictions on the visa program that would allow them to proceed.
Considering that the overwhelming majority of foreign students and immigrants are able to follow simple rules, I have not found an overwhelming amount of sympathy for the problems of people like this.
34
Sure they could get student visas, especially since every illegal kid is apparently a straight-A genius...but then they'd have to PAY.
And they want a college education for FREE, while our children have borrow tens of thousands of dollars -- if they can even get in -- ALL the benefits and freebies going to illegal alien CRIMINALS...
And they want a college education for FREE, while our children have borrow tens of thousands of dollars -- if they can even get in -- ALL the benefits and freebies going to illegal alien CRIMINALS...
35
How many US citizens are being denied admission to the University of California system because of these illegal alien DACA recipients? How many US citizens will lose out in the job market when the DACA recipients graduate?
Having said that, it's hard to be critical of the DACA recipients because they were brought here illegally.
Nonetheless, I'm sick to death of the NYT's one-sided coverage of immigration. This one-sided coverage on the part of the liberal establishment (and I'm a liberal Democrat who voted for Sanders in the primary and for Clinton in the general, and I'm absolutely appalled by Trump) is part of the reason that Trump won the election. The NYT is a major part of the problem.
Having said that, it's hard to be critical of the DACA recipients because they were brought here illegally.
Nonetheless, I'm sick to death of the NYT's one-sided coverage of immigration. This one-sided coverage on the part of the liberal establishment (and I'm a liberal Democrat who voted for Sanders in the primary and for Clinton in the general, and I'm absolutely appalled by Trump) is part of the reason that Trump won the election. The NYT is a major part of the problem.
74
NY Times one sided reporting is destroying their reputation and the Democratic party. Keep up the good work.
9
I have used this before for a previous comment but I think it yet again applies to this situation. Undocumented students worked hard in order to get into these schools that give out the best financial aid. So if you want your kids to get the best financial aid, work hard in school to get accepted to the top universities that give out best financial aid and work hard to get scholarships so that you don't have to be in debt. DACA recipients do not take jobs from US citizens because most companies ask for proof of legal residency.
"Rosalba Zavaleta, Aurora Fabian’s roommate in 351C, is confident that whatever happens with DACA, she will be fine; her concern is for her sister Faviola, who grew up with juvenile arthritis, unable to walk. The disease, with which she still struggles, was the impetus for the family’s journey from Mexico. A state program for low-income children with severe medical conditions paid for her surgeries."
Immigration laws are meant to protect public resources for the benefit of citizens and legal aliens. That public resources are freely given out to those who break our immigration laws specifically to get at those public resources is flat out wrong and tantamount to theft. We as a society cannot be so generous to illegal aliens when there are so many of our fellow citizens whom are without. Just look at the homeless crisis in LA.
The election of Trump is in part a reaction to this fundamental unfairness. We must vigorously enforce our immigration laws to benefit our own. Let Mexico take care of its own.
Immigration laws are meant to protect public resources for the benefit of citizens and legal aliens. That public resources are freely given out to those who break our immigration laws specifically to get at those public resources is flat out wrong and tantamount to theft. We as a society cannot be so generous to illegal aliens when there are so many of our fellow citizens whom are without. Just look at the homeless crisis in LA.
The election of Trump is in part a reaction to this fundamental unfairness. We must vigorously enforce our immigration laws to benefit our own. Let Mexico take care of its own.
53
Is this what to expect from DREAMers?:
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/opinion/commentary/sdut-ruben-navarr...
Ruben Navarrette: One Dreamer’s missed lesson in good character
These "DREAM Centers" are unconstitutional as in "Separate But Equal." No other student, US Citizen, US Vet can access this facility or use its counselors while Illegal Aliens who are not students can.
Illegal Alien advocates claim that the crimes Illegal Aliens commit are
only civil. Thus, our government and our leaders are not obligated to
provide funding for a legal fund. If they do so, then, again, they are
providing services to Illegal Aliens that are not provided to our
citizens. This money should be used where it is needed desperately by
our Vets and homeless citizens. This is especially true in California with the highest rate of poverty and one of the highest rates of homelessness, especially for US Vets. This year California is facing a budget deficit of almost $2 Billion, not counting the unfunded public pension commitment of hundreds of $Billions.
I ask, "Who is the priority here?" It certainly doesn't seem to be US Citizens.
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/opinion/commentary/sdut-ruben-navarr...
Ruben Navarrette: One Dreamer’s missed lesson in good character
These "DREAM Centers" are unconstitutional as in "Separate But Equal." No other student, US Citizen, US Vet can access this facility or use its counselors while Illegal Aliens who are not students can.
Illegal Alien advocates claim that the crimes Illegal Aliens commit are
only civil. Thus, our government and our leaders are not obligated to
provide funding for a legal fund. If they do so, then, again, they are
providing services to Illegal Aliens that are not provided to our
citizens. This money should be used where it is needed desperately by
our Vets and homeless citizens. This is especially true in California with the highest rate of poverty and one of the highest rates of homelessness, especially for US Vets. This year California is facing a budget deficit of almost $2 Billion, not counting the unfunded public pension commitment of hundreds of $Billions.
I ask, "Who is the priority here?" It certainly doesn't seem to be US Citizens.
43
I live in California and am proud of what we do to support our DACA residents. These young men and women work incredibly hard to achieve what many of us are simply given because of our birthright. I am glad we are doing this and hope we continue to fight for those who need our help. What impresses me the most within my community is the incredible work ethic my friends and neighbors have. I only hope the Trump administration doesn't destroy these dreamers chances to contribute to a home they love and belong in. What a moving and inspirational story! Thanks.
10
You may be proud but harboring these people encourages more illegals to come over and have kids. Pride goes before a fall.
29
Except illegal immigration is at a 40+ year low. Best to know the facts.
4
s Outmigrations of liberals to Canada don't count /s
4
"Dreamers" Being a member of the declining middle class on Long Island who have to figure out how to pay the bills while paying for the education and healthcare for the people who come here illegally.
53
But you're OK with corporate welfare and supporting the white people on public assistance in middle America right?
DR.
I'm not okay with supporting the Mexican elites who refuse to support their own people. Why can't they pay for the education of the people in this article?
I'm not okay with supporting the Mexican elites who refuse to support their own people. Why can't they pay for the education of the people in this article?
8
Cat in the hat, I like that idea and I am not being sarcastic. Great point!
An eponym gives its name to something.
If the music festival were truly eponymous then the Coachella Valley would have been named after the festival and not vice versa.
If the music festival were truly eponymous then the Coachella Valley would have been named after the festival and not vice versa.
3
What the NY Times writers are really worried about is that there will no one to care for their children, mow their lawns, serve and cook their meals, etc, etc, if there were no illegal immigrants! OR, horror of horrors, they might have pay more to support high enough salaries to attract Americans to take those positions! There are no jobs so bad Americans won't take them, if the wages are high enough. See sewer workers as an example!
48
Really??? Who do you think works in all the hospitality industries (hotel maintenance, cleaning rooms, laundry), restaurant kitchens, fruit & vegetable picking, meat packing & manual construction labor?? Without complaint & for often less than minimum wages!
No whining Americans seem interested in those jobs. Are YOU willing to pay maybe triple for everything??
No whining Americans seem interested in those jobs. Are YOU willing to pay maybe triple for everything??
3
The U.S. currently has eleven non immigrant guest worker visa programs.
http://travel.state.gov/content/visas/english/employment/temporary.html
There is no cap on the number of workers allowed into the U.S. under the H-2A temporary agricultural guest worker visa program.
http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/263529-funding-deal-hits-backlash-ove...
"The provision could more than triple the number of H-2B visas for foreign workers seeking jobs at hotels, theme parks, ski resorts, golf courses, landscaping businesses, restaurants and bars. The move is intended to boost the supply of non-agricultural seasonal workers."
http://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Resources/Resources%20for...
http://travel.state.gov/content/visas/english/employment/temporary.html
There is no cap on the number of workers allowed into the U.S. under the H-2A temporary agricultural guest worker visa program.
http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/263529-funding-deal-hits-backlash-ove...
"The provision could more than triple the number of H-2B visas for foreign workers seeking jobs at hotels, theme parks, ski resorts, golf courses, landscaping businesses, restaurants and bars. The move is intended to boost the supply of non-agricultural seasonal workers."
http://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/USCIS/Resources/Resources%20for...
3
Alabama had to bite the bullet and hire LEGAL Immigrants for its AG Industry:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2012-09-24/africans-relocate-to-a...
Africans Relocate to Alabama to Fill Jobs After Immigration Law
"East Coast began calling Atlanta refugee agencies several months ago looking for legal immigrants to come to Alabama for a year, said Mbanfu, refugee employment director for Lutheran Services in Atlanta. He said the company would have taken as many refugees as he could refer. The agency connected East Coast with refugees who had been in the country three to five years, he said."
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money/workplace/2009-09-13-plants_N.htm
Immigration raids yield jobs for legal workers
'When federal agents descended on six meatpacking plants owned by Swift & Co. in December 2006, they rounded up nearly 1,300 suspected illegal immigrants that made up about 10% of the labor force at the plants.
But the raids by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents did not cripple the company or the plants. In fact, they were back up and running at full staff within months by replacing those removed with a significant number of native-born Americans, according to a report by the Center for Immigration Studies (CIS).
"Whenever there's an immigration raid, you find white, black and legal immigrant labor lining up to do those jobs that Americans will supposedly not do," said Swain, who teaches law and political science."
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2012-09-24/africans-relocate-to-a...
Africans Relocate to Alabama to Fill Jobs After Immigration Law
"East Coast began calling Atlanta refugee agencies several months ago looking for legal immigrants to come to Alabama for a year, said Mbanfu, refugee employment director for Lutheran Services in Atlanta. He said the company would have taken as many refugees as he could refer. The agency connected East Coast with refugees who had been in the country three to five years, he said."
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money/workplace/2009-09-13-plants_N.htm
Immigration raids yield jobs for legal workers
'When federal agents descended on six meatpacking plants owned by Swift & Co. in December 2006, they rounded up nearly 1,300 suspected illegal immigrants that made up about 10% of the labor force at the plants.
But the raids by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents did not cripple the company or the plants. In fact, they were back up and running at full staff within months by replacing those removed with a significant number of native-born Americans, according to a report by the Center for Immigration Studies (CIS).
"Whenever there's an immigration raid, you find white, black and legal immigrant labor lining up to do those jobs that Americans will supposedly not do," said Swain, who teaches law and political science."
8
undocumented = illegal why can't everyone see this? the left wingers need to stop saying undocumented - truly insane
60
illegal is an adjective to describe someone right? Well, a human can not be illegal but their actions can. So what they did is illegal but they are not illegals. Undocumented is a respectful way to address someone's residency. Overweight= fat. What do you want people to call you?
Your on a lifeboat and there is room for one more...would you choose the illegal alien or a citizen of your country? did you pause for that answer??
30
Leonardo Di Caprio. Sorry, what was the question?
3
It depends, if the person here illegally was one of these kids, hard working, good family values etc. and the American citizen was a right winger spewing hatred and ignorance, it's a no brainer, I'll take the hard working decent person every time.
3
If you don't like Americans. Then go to Mexico
I really am disappointed by many of the comments\commentators.
What is a dreamer? ; a child.
So let me get this straight. Just because that child is of brown, black or other than white complexion ( maybe even white too ), but does not have certain papers, that they must now live in fear?
If harm comes to them, then that is ok, because they are other ?
Really ?
What is a dreamer? ; a child.
So let me get this straight. Just because that child is of brown, black or other than white complexion ( maybe even white too ), but does not have certain papers, that they must now live in fear?
If harm comes to them, then that is ok, because they are other ?
Really ?
19
When you violate a law the intents is you should be apprehensiveness. The intents is that concern for everyone. Those who don't break the laws shouldn't be cadenced. We don't, or shouldn't, different enforcement based on color, religion, sexual orientation, etc.
11
So foreigners can make our immigration laws just as long they bring a child with them? What other laws are they are allowed to dictate?
13
It is disappointing. I keep wondering how many of these people would send Anne Frank and her family off to be killed. I don't like the probably answer to that question.
It's a shame that these students who want an education and a better life for themselves and their families have to contend with their illegal status. These are the type of people we need in our great nation; those who understand real life problems and doing what it takes to overcome adversity and better themselves. They most often are not the transgressors who came into our country illegally, many are here through the wrongful acts of their parents or guardians which makes their situation even more tenuous. Combine all that with the absence of a clear path to US citizenship and it is a limbo that no one wants to be caught up in. The answer lies within the United States Congress who's responsibility it is to develop and pass legislation necessary to clear the way for their citizenship.
9
There IS a clear path to US citizenship.
MILLIONS have done this legally, including probably your grandparents or ancestors.
We take in more than a million LEGAL immigrants EVERY YEAR.
Ask any of these legal immigrants about "how hard it is".
These "dreamers" cheated and stole something that is not theirs!
They need to GO HOME and then apply for student visas....LIKE EVERYONE ELSE!
MILLIONS have done this legally, including probably your grandparents or ancestors.
We take in more than a million LEGAL immigrants EVERY YEAR.
Ask any of these legal immigrants about "how hard it is".
These "dreamers" cheated and stole something that is not theirs!
They need to GO HOME and then apply for student visas....LIKE EVERYONE ELSE!
9
Very irresponsible of the reporter to pass along unchallenged two of these students' characterizations of what might happen to them in Mexico, a middle-income country with many fine universities.
54
Reference to Cambodians does not seem to make sense. The author needs to clarify if the are in fact a significant number of illegal-immigrant Cambodian students in the US.
22
Even though I am Trump supporter, I know we have to allow these young people the chance to excel, we will need talented young people to help America to excel. Their parents have broken the law, but they have been raised and educated here in America, America loses if these people are denied their chance at success.
12
Neil--If you're a Trump supporter and you really do believe what you have written, you have a moral obligation (these people are hurting!) to get on the phone toute de suite and call the WH and tell him (them) what you believe. I think Trump actually thinks that ALL of his base are the crypto-facscists that he, in fact, is. I still don't believe that: a few of my family and some of my colleagues are Trump supporters who are seeing the really deviish delight he is taking in upending the status quo and finding it unnerving.
I sense that up to half of Trumpnation are decent people. They have a heart (and a mind...) that has been twisted by, among others, Fox News: an ideology of hate, of denial and defeat, and from that anger all they seek in their governance is to punish.
Contact the Federal government and let your voice be heard!
I sense that up to half of Trumpnation are decent people. They have a heart (and a mind...) that has been twisted by, among others, Fox News: an ideology of hate, of denial and defeat, and from that anger all they seek in their governance is to punish.
Contact the Federal government and let your voice be heard!
5
I'm confused. From all the articles I have read in the NYT's of late, all of California is a "Safe Space".
35
And Trump is making all of the world into a "Danger Space"
I didn't even read this article. What does the word "dreamers" mean? I hate how that word is used to mean "what's a high paying job." I trade stocks so I can be rich enough to own a home in the Hamptons, but nobody calls me a "dreamer." They call me a greedy capitalist pig. It's NOT like tons of people are coming to America to major in Nietzsche or Wordsworth at college. People want the economic opportunities that the US affords. Okay. Fair enough. But then America needs to be economically strong enough to remain a place were people can earn a lot of money.
When I look at the world, I don't see diversity. I see a lot of people of all ethic backgrounds who want a Mercedes and a Tom Ford suit.
When I look at the world, I don't see diversity. I see a lot of people of all ethic backgrounds who want a Mercedes and a Tom Ford suit.
26
You have a truly warped view of the world. Most of the people I know want a decent home, enough to eat and leisure time to spend with the people they love.
3
Eh...not everyone wants a mercedes and a tom ford suit. most just want economic security for themselves and their families
5
Some of us would prefer not to have to provide for Mexico's families.
1
I admire these kids and their drive to make something of themselves, but that doesn't change the fact that they are illegal and stealing the American dream from someone else in California who is likely as needy, but here legally. Put that drive towards becoming a citizen, then you can sponsor your siblings and other family and so you don't need to fear for them being deported as one young lady said. These kids are the kinds of people who we want as citizens, driven and hard-working, but help them become citizens, then they can realize the American dream.
34
California has 113 Community Colleges, 23 California State Universities and 10 campuses of the University of California, not to mention more than 70 plus private higher education institutions. No one is stealing the American dream to no one in California. Instead, dreamers may be challenging many of who feel entitled just because they are citizens of this great nation.
2
Let's protect people who came here by breaking the law and ignore the plight of true American citizens. The Times and their ilk have their priorities skewed just a bit.
77
Why not help them all and not help bankers and financiers to walk away with all the money?
3
They came her as children, they had no choice in whether or not they came. Have you no compassion.
1
Nicole,
Why does compassion always consist of letting more Mexicans move here? Mexicans need to stop arguing they can use their children to circumvent our immigration laws. The kids will survive if they go home. It's neither our problem nor our fault the mother and father brought this on their children.
Why does compassion always consist of letting more Mexicans move here? Mexicans need to stop arguing they can use their children to circumvent our immigration laws. The kids will survive if they go home. It's neither our problem nor our fault the mother and father brought this on their children.
4
Once again the Times finds a crop of illegal immigrants whose stories would be classic American success stories if they came here legally. These are not representative illegal immigrants, most of whom are barely literate in an age where we need fewer strong backs and more strong minds. We still need to assert some control over our borders. If we had done so 30 years ago, we wouldn't have people in this position of having grown up here as illegal immigrants. If we controlled our borders, we could let in 11M more people legally, from all over the world, of our choice, all of whom could be stellar US citizens. So tired of the Times pushing this useless agenda against all reason.
96
We assert quite a lot of control over our borders right now, as I write this, yet they still get here.
And when they're here they are hired for jobs that many Americans don't want. They are not turned in, turned around, and sent back. They are cheap labor and big American business likes that.
If we deny these folks space among us, you say we could choose who comes into our country-- "stellar... citizens." Who would we choose? And who would get to choose them? Would they be likely Trump voters? Or would they be Hispanics of every sort who tend to side with left-of-center candidates? And who gets to choose those "strong minds"?
Do a little research. Answer the question: How many past immigrants to the United States [my mother is among them] were literate? Ask yourself the next question: How many of these strong-backed illiterates (often unfed, unwashed, scared and forsaken) later became hard-working Americans who abide by--indeed worship--the Constitution BECAUSE it gave them succor?
And when they're here they are hired for jobs that many Americans don't want. They are not turned in, turned around, and sent back. They are cheap labor and big American business likes that.
If we deny these folks space among us, you say we could choose who comes into our country-- "stellar... citizens." Who would we choose? And who would get to choose them? Would they be likely Trump voters? Or would they be Hispanics of every sort who tend to side with left-of-center candidates? And who gets to choose those "strong minds"?
Do a little research. Answer the question: How many past immigrants to the United States [my mother is among them] were literate? Ask yourself the next question: How many of these strong-backed illiterates (often unfed, unwashed, scared and forsaken) later became hard-working Americans who abide by--indeed worship--the Constitution BECAUSE it gave them succor?
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/9/20-pct-illegals-caught-bo...
Agents say just 40 percent of U.S.-Mexico border under control
20 percent of illegals caught at border have criminal records
"Less than half of the U.S.-Mexico border is under “operational control,” and one out of every five illegal immigrants caught there has a criminal record, the chief of Border Patrol agents’ labor union told Congress Wednesday when detailing violence that increasingly spills over the international boundary."
Agents say just 40 percent of U.S.-Mexico border under control
20 percent of illegals caught at border have criminal records
"Less than half of the U.S.-Mexico border is under “operational control,” and one out of every five illegal immigrants caught there has a criminal record, the chief of Border Patrol agents’ labor union told Congress Wednesday when detailing violence that increasingly spills over the international boundary."
2
They and their parents should go back to their home countries and make things better there.
If they want to enter the USA legally, they should follow the law, go home, and get in line.
Most Americans don't want to pay taxes, but do so. They should not be above legal Americans. How "fair" is that?
If they want to enter the USA legally, they should follow the law, go home, and get in line.
Most Americans don't want to pay taxes, but do so. They should not be above legal Americans. How "fair" is that?
2
Way to cherry pick your stories, NYT. And this is nice, after all, keeping about 350 dreamers safe and warm and not addressing the 10 million or so "undocumenteds" who have snuck in since 1986.
You either have a law, or you don't. Your either enforce it, or you don't. There is no "reform" in the offing. That was done in 1986 and, apparently, it didn't work. All the "reform" that some are crying out for would be exactly what was done in 1986, so the merry-go-round will simply start another turn. A 30 year amnesty cycle? If that's what the people want...except it isn't.
You either have a law, or you don't. Your either enforce it, or you don't. There is no "reform" in the offing. That was done in 1986 and, apparently, it didn't work. All the "reform" that some are crying out for would be exactly what was done in 1986, so the merry-go-round will simply start another turn. A 30 year amnesty cycle? If that's what the people want...except it isn't.
70
These young people would probably be better US Citizens and contribute more to our economy than many people who get to to be US Citizens by being born here. Why not use a meritocracy and ship out those who take what they have as an entitlement?
4
Yeah, you know it doesn't work that way. Americans vote, not the 'best' Americans are the only ones allowed to vote.
There is no reason not to process people case by case. Illegal immigrants who serve in our armed forces, who provide a special skill in harvesting crops or Reimann geometries or whatever it is we think we need, we can get them legal status. Illegal immigrants who don't offer anything special, who take jobs Americans would do at a decent rate of pay or people who commit crimes or are affiliated with gangs must go.
There is no reason not to process people case by case. Illegal immigrants who serve in our armed forces, who provide a special skill in harvesting crops or Reimann geometries or whatever it is we think we need, we can get them legal status. Illegal immigrants who don't offer anything special, who take jobs Americans would do at a decent rate of pay or people who commit crimes or are affiliated with gangs must go.
12
Daedalus -- I applaud your icon; the Old Grey Whistle Test is a testament today to the great music of (for me) the 1970s. Take a look on YouTube at Edgar Winter's performance of "Frankenstein" (if you haven't already).
You bring up the "We have a law: Follow the law" argument. It's an old one. Nancy Reagan's "Just Say No" was a version of it. If applied we would be in ruins ("we" = the nation). Laws guide us. They don't hobble us morally/ethically. And they shouldn't.
I have no problem with the laws that govern immigration; we've had good laws, fair for the most part, that regulate immigration for many, many decades.
One of them states: Thou shalt not hire a person who has entered the country illegally. That's all of us on that one. Big business in California are guilty of that one. Have you spoken to the agri-business conglomerates in the San Joaquin Valley about your concern?
If you apply the logic of your fundamental argument to everything it becomes a litmus test, a very raw and unforgiving one. Do you always follow the law? Really? Are laws, for you, a guiding light in all that you do? Really? Don't think about this; feel it, sense it.
Will you pass the purity test?
Unless we're indiginous to these lands, all of us are immigrants and many of us got here by hook or by crook. Now, we are Americans.
You bring up the "We have a law: Follow the law" argument. It's an old one. Nancy Reagan's "Just Say No" was a version of it. If applied we would be in ruins ("we" = the nation). Laws guide us. They don't hobble us morally/ethically. And they shouldn't.
I have no problem with the laws that govern immigration; we've had good laws, fair for the most part, that regulate immigration for many, many decades.
One of them states: Thou shalt not hire a person who has entered the country illegally. That's all of us on that one. Big business in California are guilty of that one. Have you spoken to the agri-business conglomerates in the San Joaquin Valley about your concern?
If you apply the logic of your fundamental argument to everything it becomes a litmus test, a very raw and unforgiving one. Do you always follow the law? Really? Are laws, for you, a guiding light in all that you do? Really? Don't think about this; feel it, sense it.
Will you pass the purity test?
Unless we're indiginous to these lands, all of us are immigrants and many of us got here by hook or by crook. Now, we are Americans.
2
I would think that we would jump at the chance to have resourceful and ambitious young people such as these join our country. I am amazed at their perseverance. This is not just about democratic voters - there are, and will continue to be, plenty of them - this is about giving those who have proven they they are worthy a chance at a good life.
9
There is something very sad about reading this article in conjunction with the article on Chinese students whose parents pay up to $40 000 in consultancy fees so there children can attend US high schools and presumably a US college. On the one hand, children of immense privilege, whose parents can pay their way every step of the way, and on the other, children of struggling families who want to better themselves. The US needs ambituous young people like this. I hope DACA will remain in place.
12
The difference is, the Chinese student pays for the cost, China and Mexico's income per capita is more or less the same, dont assume those Chinese parents are rich, most likely the Chinese parents are spending whatever they save on their ONLY child's education ( due to one child policy),
5
That's right. Some Chinese students are supported by large groups of childless uncles and aunts, and grandparents.
End DACA today. Support legal Americans.
End DACA today. Support legal Americans.
2
The NYT constantly stuffs its pages with heartbreak stories of wonderful, talented suffering illegal immigrants who just were not lucky enough to have been born in the USA. About 7 billion plus people were not born in the USA. I guess they are all entitled to come and stay too, and avail themselves of all the benefits our forefathers established. It's like crashing a party you weren't invited to. Sorry, but they weren't invited.
65
Not "invited"? Was any immigrant ever "invited"? Who "invited" the Pilgrims to Plymouth Rock? Who "invited" John Smith to Virginia?
DACA applies to people brought here as children, when they had no choice in the matter. The children did nothing wrong. Your position is like saying that the toddler in the back seat should be charged with manslaughter if his mother drives drunk.
politicsbyeccehomo.wordpress.com
DACA applies to people brought here as children, when they had no choice in the matter. The children did nothing wrong. Your position is like saying that the toddler in the back seat should be charged with manslaughter if his mother drives drunk.
politicsbyeccehomo.wordpress.com
2
Yes, every one of these kids had a difficult life and they have done an unbelievable job in getting to where they are. And it is unfortunate that their parents have chosen to sneak them into a country illegally. It is also unfortunate that they are not using these wonderful skill, talents and gifts to make their own country better. But they are here illegally. They are spending the tax dollars of millions of Americans to pursue their dream. Going forward they are going to take the jobs of millions of other Americans who were not so lucky to go to college.
Bill Clinton - 1995 SOTU "All Americans, not only in the states most heavily affected but in every place in this country, are rightly disturbed by the large numbers of illegal aliens entering our country. The jobs they hold might otherwise be held by citizens or legal immigrants. The public service they use impose burdens on our taxpayers." "We are a nation of immigrants. But we are also a nation of laws. It is wrong and ultimately self-defeating for a nation of immigrants to permit the kind of abuse of our immigration laws we have seen in recent years, and we must do more to stop it."
Bill Clinton - 1995 SOTU "All Americans, not only in the states most heavily affected but in every place in this country, are rightly disturbed by the large numbers of illegal aliens entering our country. The jobs they hold might otherwise be held by citizens or legal immigrants. The public service they use impose burdens on our taxpayers." "We are a nation of immigrants. But we are also a nation of laws. It is wrong and ultimately self-defeating for a nation of immigrants to permit the kind of abuse of our immigration laws we have seen in recent years, and we must do more to stop it."
64
"Dreamers" = the latest PC word to cover up what is actually happening. Dreamer = illegal. The U.S. is extremely generous when it comes to immigration policies compared to most countries, but you need to immigrate legally. What part of the law does the NY Times not understand? Allowing "dreamers" will only caused other people to come to America illegally and have kids here.
P.S. NY Times, we really know what this is all really about dont we? Dreamers are future Democratic voters right? Without "Dreamers" the Democratic party would fade into obscurity.
P.S. NY Times, we really know what this is all really about dont we? Dreamers are future Democratic voters right? Without "Dreamers" the Democratic party would fade into obscurity.
79
This article is about the children of people who came to the U.S. How is it that as childen they "should have" immigrated legally?
6
No one with a conscience could blame children who were brought here illegally at a young age. Force them to return to a country they never knew? We are a country of immigrants, many whose families stole land from native Americans, owned slaves and committed other atrocities. Don't be so smug about your status, have some compassion for others.
10
So children should be held accountable for the illegal actions of their parents? And is it so wrong for parents to want a better life for their children by any means necessary? Withholding educational financial aid for undocumented students is a barbaric and irrational practice. America is lucky to have such brilliant children that have found ways to succeed and persevere against all odds. Against the toxic, lethargic, conservative masses that are so inconsequential to the success of our country - and they seek to claim ownership over our nation's successes to hide an insecurity over their upcoming extinction. Good riddance.
7
Some people complain about college students and their helicopter parents. But read about these amazing students, wise beyond their years, waking at 4:30 to work in fields, cleaning offices with their mother in grade school, concerned about their parents, religious and faithful and filial. As a college professor where most of my students come from very privileged backgrounds--and they are impressive in every way, building on what they were given at birth--I am in awe of the tenacity and (to overuse a word) grit that these students show. The heart of Janet Napolitano in setting up this program is moving.....but also a smart investment. Look at these extraordinary people who want nothing more than to inch up from the shadows and contribute their talents to the rest of us. Thank you, New York Times, for this detailed reporting. We need to know all the effects of the new regime's erratic policies. I count on you and other journalists to give solid stories about people I can't meet myself.
32
I applaud their commitment, but they are still illegally here due to their parents. Their are many deserving young citizens who are also poor that deserve this chance and are not being afforded that right, because monies are donated to support an influx of people who are flouting the law. I do not agree with the way in which DT wishes to handle illegals, but there needs to be a path for documentation and potential citizenship.
This is just a pure case of enabling--if you want to stem the flow of illegal immigrants coming to this country: stop providing services, disallow people who are born here and whose parents are not legally here from being automatic citizens, and heavily fine the people who hire them.
This is just a pure case of enabling--if you want to stem the flow of illegal immigrants coming to this country: stop providing services, disallow people who are born here and whose parents are not legally here from being automatic citizens, and heavily fine the people who hire them.
52
"these amazing students, wise beyond their years" - Susan Blum
...and cherry-picked by the NYT to further its agenda. There are thousands, nay millions, of illegal immigrants using US taxpayers' resources to get ahead. They are not profiled in this newspaper because their stories are not as heartwarming and they are not photogenic enough to gain the sympathy of intelligent readers.
If the commenter wants to support these "dreamers" please do so, but don't put the onus of this expense on the US taxpayer; legitimate citizens should get priority over the students profiled here.
...and cherry-picked by the NYT to further its agenda. There are thousands, nay millions, of illegal immigrants using US taxpayers' resources to get ahead. They are not profiled in this newspaper because their stories are not as heartwarming and they are not photogenic enough to gain the sympathy of intelligent readers.
If the commenter wants to support these "dreamers" please do so, but don't put the onus of this expense on the US taxpayer; legitimate citizens should get priority over the students profiled here.
8
"the new regime's erratic policies" are nothing more than an attempt, however imperfect, to return America to its own citizens. Obviously there are millions of immigrants who would come over and impress us with their work ethic - they are desperate not to go back to their own dysfunctional countries. But go back they must. These people are always portrayed as victims. The fact is, they are citizens of another country. They need to get involved in the political process there and improve things. America cannot be the only solution to their problems.
Has anyone bothered to ask, in detail, WHY America functions and Mexico doesn't? The answer to that question would be of great interest.
Has anyone bothered to ask, in detail, WHY America functions and Mexico doesn't? The answer to that question would be of great interest.
6