This article in the DAPL does not discuss the range of real environmental impacts at play with oil pipelines, e.g. Frequent leaks, and minimizes all the issue of desecrating sacred land of Native Americans. Looks like the editor is beholden to oil companies, no?
It is appalling that Americans are so brain dead when it comes to seeing the danger that lies ahead. It is amazing that during this entire campaign people believed and endorsed all his blatant lies, laughed about it and crowed about the jerk. The younger generation is going to pay a very huge price for the way they approached this last election. It makes me very sad to know that my grandchildren will have such a dark future.
There is another large issue at stake in this argument that has not been getting any attention in the media lately. That is the extraction of oil out of the ground known as fracking at the source.
Everyone knows about the increase of earthquakes, and it remains a highly debated subject. After researching fracking in more depth, there is no regulation or requirement to disclose the chemicals pumped into the ground in place of the oil extracted. Also, there is no regulation or requirement to measure or disclose the naturally ocurring radioactivity from uranium, which can be extracted, or distributed to artisian water systems when chemical 'cocktails' are forced back underground.
A lot of attention is being directed at the political argument, and the pro-pipeline advocates will cite eminent domain and blame the Sioux for wanting more money. Aside from that rhetoric, there is a major environmental disaster that will happen over the next 30 years as chemicals are passed underground into drinking water. In the short term, the financial gains will be enormous. Long term, it will be the greatest disaster on American soil.
Everyone knows about the increase of earthquakes, and it remains a highly debated subject. After researching fracking in more depth, there is no regulation or requirement to disclose the chemicals pumped into the ground in place of the oil extracted. Also, there is no regulation or requirement to measure or disclose the naturally ocurring radioactivity from uranium, which can be extracted, or distributed to artisian water systems when chemical 'cocktails' are forced back underground.
A lot of attention is being directed at the political argument, and the pro-pipeline advocates will cite eminent domain and blame the Sioux for wanting more money. Aside from that rhetoric, there is a major environmental disaster that will happen over the next 30 years as chemicals are passed underground into drinking water. In the short term, the financial gains will be enormous. Long term, it will be the greatest disaster on American soil.
2
The pipeline is to make Trumps and Cronies rich and rest of America sick. Trumps will continue live in their pent houses far, far from damaged, ravaged polluted sites. While the f temporary job holders suffer myriad llnesses.
2
Today's Democrats would oppose the Hoover dam and the Panama canal. People have to understand that today's liberals oppose everything useful
i think the Native Americans I have known and lived by showed no signs of spiritual qualities to me or society so i dont tyhink the puipeline is a legitimate reason to not do what is good for the whole Nation. i saw no evidence of any spiritual qualities in the Lakota Indians in the 1960s 1970s thru today but rather a get everything i can. not the same mindset as man y previous devoted Lakota Indians. my favorite poem bu Longfellow says "You will hear of Hiawatha and his prayer and fasting in the desert not for greater reknown among the people but for THE GOOD OF ALL THE PEOPLE.
While Canada's oil interests (and of course those of American barons who have invested in Keystone) tread on America's soil, Mr Trump continues thumping on "America First". As it has been explained, over and over, this project benefits Canada not America. A few jobs here and there during construction, then, bust out. Leave a mess behind, hurting the environment and disturbing cultural heritage. $ is treading over the America First promise. Trump will soon find out that destroying is easier than building. Shame on Nebraska for not standing against this shameful project! Do Nebraskans have a say? Where is the governor?
1
Who do you believe? https://daplpipelinefacts.com
Or the Native Americans- - can the NY Times please do a complete investigative report?
I am a true environmentalist- unlike the "FAKE" ones like trump- the greasy oil fingers digging for $$- of which only a few of the people will really reap the direct benefits of jobs. They do claim the consumers will also benefit??? The rich only do things that benefit them in the short term and leave the rest of us to clean up their mess! As Charlie from England said and reports from environmentalists on abandoned coal mines, etc
The risk of and potential damage from environmental disasters are just too high and far reaching. In spite of the facts and/ or lies trump and his gang are pedaling- there is conflict of interest and total greed , not to mention the pure disrespect to native American's concerns as well as all of our environmental concerns.
Or the Native Americans- - can the NY Times please do a complete investigative report?
I am a true environmentalist- unlike the "FAKE" ones like trump- the greasy oil fingers digging for $$- of which only a few of the people will really reap the direct benefits of jobs. They do claim the consumers will also benefit??? The rich only do things that benefit them in the short term and leave the rest of us to clean up their mess! As Charlie from England said and reports from environmentalists on abandoned coal mines, etc
The risk of and potential damage from environmental disasters are just too high and far reaching. In spite of the facts and/ or lies trump and his gang are pedaling- there is conflict of interest and total greed , not to mention the pure disrespect to native American's concerns as well as all of our environmental concerns.
3
There seem to be at bottom two kinds of old men:
1. Those who don't care what happens in the near future, after they die
2. Those who do care about their family, friends, loved ones, and all the billions of others who will survive them
“I am, to a large extent, an environmentalist, I believe in it,” Mr. Trump: the ME, ME, ME MAN.
1. Those who don't care what happens in the near future, after they die
2. Those who do care about their family, friends, loved ones, and all the billions of others who will survive them
“I am, to a large extent, an environmentalist, I believe in it,” Mr. Trump: the ME, ME, ME MAN.
5
President Obama is a Neo-Liberal. He supports corporate Free-Trade. He supports endless wars (We're bombing 8 countries right now). He made the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy permanent.
President Obama didn't stop the Dakota Access pipeline. He allowed it to go through and put in a "temporary stop". You'll notice the company was allowed to build the drilling platforms on both sides of the river before the "temporary stop". Do you really think he was serious about stopping the pipeline?
For his additional Free Trade Agreements and opening the arctic to drilling, Obama will get high speaking fees for life just like the Clintons do. Corporate payouts are lavish for those who sell us out.
President Obama didn't stop the Dakota Access pipeline. He allowed it to go through and put in a "temporary stop". You'll notice the company was allowed to build the drilling platforms on both sides of the river before the "temporary stop". Do you really think he was serious about stopping the pipeline?
For his additional Free Trade Agreements and opening the arctic to drilling, Obama will get high speaking fees for life just like the Clintons do. Corporate payouts are lavish for those who sell us out.
2
Trump's action signals a critical turning point in the fight for our communities, for our planet, for Indigenous rights and for our future against the very real threat of climate change. This is the fight for our nation against the denial of science, the denial of human rights, and environmental destruction in the name of rampant corporate greed.
Millions of people are mobilized against Trump's dangerous and disrespectful agenda and there should be mass acts of peaceful civil disobedience to stop the construction and financing of these dangerous, polluting pipeline projects.
Resistance: All-out, Full-blown!
Millions of people are mobilized against Trump's dangerous and disrespectful agenda and there should be mass acts of peaceful civil disobedience to stop the construction and financing of these dangerous, polluting pipeline projects.
Resistance: All-out, Full-blown!
7
"“Keystone has never been a significant issue from an environmental point of view in substance, only in symbol,” said David L. Goldwyn, an energy market analyst and a former head of the State Department’s energy bureau in the Obama administration."
So this is where the Times is getting its environmental impact reports from - an oil industry consultant? It is difficult to say which is more disappointing: the Democrats response to climate change or the NY Times reporting on climate change.
Suffice it to say that for the purpose of protecting the earth for future generations, both the Democratic Party and the Times are nearly useless.
So this is where the Times is getting its environmental impact reports from - an oil industry consultant? It is difficult to say which is more disappointing: the Democrats response to climate change or the NY Times reporting on climate change.
Suffice it to say that for the purpose of protecting the earth for future generations, both the Democratic Party and the Times are nearly useless.
5
Most are not surprised to hear that Donald J Trump has begun to undo the work of the Obama administration. This is a very short term view and shows no vision of a future for the children of your America. Signing off Keystone and Dakota pipelines show this.
The North Dakota Pipeline is a classic example. The Army Corps has already agreed to review the route, not only for environmental reasons but also because the First Nations of what is now the United States live on the land which is under treaty, theirs.
Of course we should not overlook DJT has his own agenda, as do nominees for his team, a number of who are directly or indirectly connected with the oil industry or have interests in companies such as Energy Transfer Partners, it not just about Obama bashing. ETP stated that Obama had used the Army to delay the inevitable, of course this is by their standards.
North Dakota had a 176,000 gallon crude "spill" on the 5th of December 2016 in to Ash Coulee Creek, an environmental disaster that out side of the United States has been widely reported, has be come so common place that it barely gets a headline in the U.S. The 2013 Tesoro spill near Bismarck has still not been cleared up and no final date can yet be given for it's completion.
Please take a long hard look at Donald J Trump and what he wants to do with your future.
The First Nations have a phrase, in English it is "We Are All Related". Think on it a while before you say Trump is looking after your America.....
The North Dakota Pipeline is a classic example. The Army Corps has already agreed to review the route, not only for environmental reasons but also because the First Nations of what is now the United States live on the land which is under treaty, theirs.
Of course we should not overlook DJT has his own agenda, as do nominees for his team, a number of who are directly or indirectly connected with the oil industry or have interests in companies such as Energy Transfer Partners, it not just about Obama bashing. ETP stated that Obama had used the Army to delay the inevitable, of course this is by their standards.
North Dakota had a 176,000 gallon crude "spill" on the 5th of December 2016 in to Ash Coulee Creek, an environmental disaster that out side of the United States has been widely reported, has be come so common place that it barely gets a headline in the U.S. The 2013 Tesoro spill near Bismarck has still not been cleared up and no final date can yet be given for it's completion.
Please take a long hard look at Donald J Trump and what he wants to do with your future.
The First Nations have a phrase, in English it is "We Are All Related". Think on it a while before you say Trump is looking after your America.....
8
I worked at a company that was in discussions to purchase various assets in Canada that would benefit from increased output from the Alberta tar sands oil producers.
It is absolutely imperative that the NY Times point out that ExxonMobil is a majority owner of Imperial Oil, the largest producer in the Alberta tar sands. The entire purpose of the Keystone XL pipeline is to transport the tar sands oil to the Gulf Coast for refining. The oil extracted from the tar sands is of immensely lower quality from other types of crude oil. Therefore it sells at a massive discount to other more conventional types of crude. The heavier tar sands oil also requires refineries with specialized crackers most of which are located on the Gulf Coast.
Companies operating in the Alberta tar sands have been hammered by the collapse in crude oil prices. The only way to make these projects cost effective at current prices is to reduce transportation costs. Exxon has billions of dollars invested in the tar sands via Imperial Oil. Trump is pushing through projects that will primarily benefit the company that his Secretary of State headed until his nomination.
It is absolutely imperative that the NY Times point out that ExxonMobil is a majority owner of Imperial Oil, the largest producer in the Alberta tar sands. The entire purpose of the Keystone XL pipeline is to transport the tar sands oil to the Gulf Coast for refining. The oil extracted from the tar sands is of immensely lower quality from other types of crude oil. Therefore it sells at a massive discount to other more conventional types of crude. The heavier tar sands oil also requires refineries with specialized crackers most of which are located on the Gulf Coast.
Companies operating in the Alberta tar sands have been hammered by the collapse in crude oil prices. The only way to make these projects cost effective at current prices is to reduce transportation costs. Exxon has billions of dollars invested in the tar sands via Imperial Oil. Trump is pushing through projects that will primarily benefit the company that his Secretary of State headed until his nomination.
13
I think it is a darn disgrace that in this 21st. century the USA is still abusing its native population by trespassing on their lands and subjecting them to the prospects of polluted waters. This is a gross abuse of power. If there is a God above I'm hoping that He will visit His wrath on this nation that has over the years subjected its native population to severe hardships. Leave native lands alone.
4
This is nothing more than payback to the Koch Brothers. Dig deeper America, and find out who the real power behind this ego maniac puppet is.
2
This is nothing more than payback to the Koch Brothers.
==============
Koch Industries isn't involved in either project
==============
Koch Industries isn't involved in either project
1
The Clinton/Obama state dept did an exhaustive 5 year study that found the Keystone Pipeline would have no adverse environmental impact. In fact, shipping the oil by rail car would generate 28% more green house gases than the pipeline
2
Even if that were true, the oil itself, when used, more than makes up for the greenhouse gases saved by transportation, significantly. And one bad spill in the wrong place quashes the hope of "no adverse environmental impact."
3
The oil will be used in either case so moving it by rail cars still generates 28% more green house gases than the pipe line. Do the math.......
1
There is a critically important reason why the Dakota Access pipeline and the Keystone XL pipeline must not go forward. According to the Carbon Tracker Initiative’s 2011 report humans burned 2000 billion tons of carbon since 1850 increasing the average planetary temperature by 1.2 degrees Celsius increasing the number and intensity of weather events, ice melt and sea level rise. Scientists say we dare not increase the planetary average temperature beyond 1.5 degrees Celsius or we face dire consequences. That’s not much wiggle room.
To stay within this boundary, we can only burn around 473 billion tons more carbon but the world has 2,795 billion tons of carbon in inventory permitted to burn. That’s six times more carbon than we can burn which would raise the average planetary temperature by 6 degrees Celsius (eleven degrees Fahrenheit) which would devastate life on this planet. We’re well on our way to surpassing the 1.5 limit within the next few years and scientists give us ten to fifteen years to keep carbon consumption under 473 billion tons or we pass the point of no return. We must leave carbon in the ground or jobs and the economy will be a moot point.
To stay within this boundary, we can only burn around 473 billion tons more carbon but the world has 2,795 billion tons of carbon in inventory permitted to burn. That’s six times more carbon than we can burn which would raise the average planetary temperature by 6 degrees Celsius (eleven degrees Fahrenheit) which would devastate life on this planet. We’re well on our way to surpassing the 1.5 limit within the next few years and scientists give us ten to fifteen years to keep carbon consumption under 473 billion tons or we pass the point of no return. We must leave carbon in the ground or jobs and the economy will be a moot point.
5
Why does the mere mention of OIL deracinate so many Democrats so reliably?
2
Unless and until My President embarks on a global apology tour, we can never be "Stronger Together." To "act presidential," based on the prior iteration, one must truckle in front of adoring crowds in 3rd-world countries. As Obama did during his 2008-10 Victory Lap(s), getting less than nothing accomplished. Mahalo!
Before 1900, people would rarely travel farther than they could go on foot or horseback.
In the early 1900’s fossil fuels were the foundation of industrialization of civilization from the development of machinery and products for: transportation systems, transportation fuels for automobiles (gasoline), trucks (diesel) and airlines (jet fuel), sewage treatment, sanitation systems, water purification systems, irrigation, synthetic fertilizers and pesticides, genetically improved crops, agricultural productivity, dams, seawalls, heating, air conditioning, sturdy homes, drained swamps, vaccinations, pharmaceuticals, medications, eradication of most diseases, improvements in manufacturing productivity and electronics.
Today, from those “chemical ingredients” contributed by fossil fuels has emerged the personal computers, cell phones and fiber optic phone lines, to the rise of the World Wide Web and the explosion of e-commerce, and the Information Age that is giving Americans more opportunities and more control over their lives than ever before.
Without those “chemical ingredients” contributed by fossil fuels we would be reverting back to the pre 1900 horse and buggy days for our transportation systems, and the “snake oil” pitchmen for our healthcare system, and no medications, no cosmetics, no fertilizers, and no computers nor IPhones.
The environmental crusaders avoid the facts that wind and solar are only able to provide intermittent electricity to the grid.
In the early 1900’s fossil fuels were the foundation of industrialization of civilization from the development of machinery and products for: transportation systems, transportation fuels for automobiles (gasoline), trucks (diesel) and airlines (jet fuel), sewage treatment, sanitation systems, water purification systems, irrigation, synthetic fertilizers and pesticides, genetically improved crops, agricultural productivity, dams, seawalls, heating, air conditioning, sturdy homes, drained swamps, vaccinations, pharmaceuticals, medications, eradication of most diseases, improvements in manufacturing productivity and electronics.
Today, from those “chemical ingredients” contributed by fossil fuels has emerged the personal computers, cell phones and fiber optic phone lines, to the rise of the World Wide Web and the explosion of e-commerce, and the Information Age that is giving Americans more opportunities and more control over their lives than ever before.
Without those “chemical ingredients” contributed by fossil fuels we would be reverting back to the pre 1900 horse and buggy days for our transportation systems, and the “snake oil” pitchmen for our healthcare system, and no medications, no cosmetics, no fertilizers, and no computers nor IPhones.
The environmental crusaders avoid the facts that wind and solar are only able to provide intermittent electricity to the grid.
1
Yes. And perhaps it's time to make the next leap in technology? Or do we stagnate on fossil fuels until they dry up, and then try to do something else? After the ecosphere is toast.
4
Oh, and Ron? All energy sources are intermittent. That doesn't stop Iowa from getting > 31% of their electricity from wind. Texas is up to 10% of their considerable consumption from wind, and we're just scratching the surface.
A few well-located HVDC interconnects can link the offshore and Plains sources of wind to various points in the country. The wind is NEVER calm all over, so you just need to build a fraction of extra capacity compared to spare capacity for, say, a big coal plant. An emergency shutdown of one of those requires that the entire capacity rating be available right away.
So you might have an oil well on your lawn, but really, we have to stop
And don't forget, Iowa got to 31.3% in 2015 from less than 1% in 2000. And during all that time, the costs for wind generation, solar generation have plummeted.
Storage technology is going through the same rapid price declines as a variety of technologies are scaling into production deployments and efficiencies of market scale.
So you might have an oil well on your lawn, but we really don't need to develop any new fossil resources. Time to grow up and stop burning stuff for energy. We'll be healthier for it, too.
Last bit - Norway's Statoil just won the bid for exploratory offshore energy lease - for a wind farm parcel off Long Island. $42 million was the winning bid after over 30 rounds.
Too bad OUR oil companies don't see the writing on the wall.
A few well-located HVDC interconnects can link the offshore and Plains sources of wind to various points in the country. The wind is NEVER calm all over, so you just need to build a fraction of extra capacity compared to spare capacity for, say, a big coal plant. An emergency shutdown of one of those requires that the entire capacity rating be available right away.
So you might have an oil well on your lawn, but really, we have to stop
And don't forget, Iowa got to 31.3% in 2015 from less than 1% in 2000. And during all that time, the costs for wind generation, solar generation have plummeted.
Storage technology is going through the same rapid price declines as a variety of technologies are scaling into production deployments and efficiencies of market scale.
So you might have an oil well on your lawn, but we really don't need to develop any new fossil resources. Time to grow up and stop burning stuff for energy. We'll be healthier for it, too.
Last bit - Norway's Statoil just won the bid for exploratory offshore energy lease - for a wind farm parcel off Long Island. $42 million was the winning bid after over 30 rounds.
Too bad OUR oil companies don't see the writing on the wall.
1
Ron, please explain how the glass in fiber optics and the silicon for computer chips are somehow carbon-fuel based?
Sewage treatment, sanitation systems, water purification systems are all sited at low points, so are particularly vulnerable to flooding and rises in sea level.
So we need to stop the warming caused by fossil fuel use.
Irrigation was driven by wind and water power before it was by fossil fuel, but need for it might increase from warming-based increase in drought and rainfall pattern shifts.
Synthetic fertilizers now are over-used and runoff adds to algal blooms, toxic tides and eutrophication destroying the quality of rivers, lakes and coastal oceans. Pesticides are putting pollinators at risk.
Seawalls will need raising and expansion as seas rise.
Draining swamps also lead to increased flood damage for two reasons: less ability to absorb and buffer floodwaters; the buildup of costly infrastructure in flood zones. Sea level rise will exacerbate those risks.
So fossil was great, yeah, yeah, but time to move on as Barry suggests.
Sewage treatment, sanitation systems, water purification systems are all sited at low points, so are particularly vulnerable to flooding and rises in sea level.
So we need to stop the warming caused by fossil fuel use.
Irrigation was driven by wind and water power before it was by fossil fuel, but need for it might increase from warming-based increase in drought and rainfall pattern shifts.
Synthetic fertilizers now are over-used and runoff adds to algal blooms, toxic tides and eutrophication destroying the quality of rivers, lakes and coastal oceans. Pesticides are putting pollinators at risk.
Seawalls will need raising and expansion as seas rise.
Draining swamps also lead to increased flood damage for two reasons: less ability to absorb and buffer floodwaters; the buildup of costly infrastructure in flood zones. Sea level rise will exacerbate those risks.
So fossil was great, yeah, yeah, but time to move on as Barry suggests.
2
With all the latest trump anoucements in the last twelve hours, it seems that Obamas remarks back in 2011 at the Press roast,really burnt trumps backsides~
Who's laughing now?
I bet that goes down as one of Obama's greatest regrets
I bet that goes down as one of Obama's greatest regrets
1
If you think Climate Change ends at the water level in your basement, consider Bernie Sanders' reply to the debate question on the biggest security risk for the USA. The Pentagon seems to agree + I am waiting for them to speak out.
Filmmaker Jared Scott has a new film out this week on just this topic. Here are info + showtimes: http://theageofconsequences.com/synopsis/
Filmmaker Jared Scott has a new film out this week on just this topic. Here are info + showtimes: http://theageofconsequences.com/synopsis/
2
Well, those living in eastern Nebraska may want to ask themselves each morning when they wake up - "Is the Ogallala still ok today?"
Think heavy metal contamination that you won't know you're drinking and won't be told. Think Flint.
Think heavy metal contamination that you won't know you're drinking and won't be told. Think Flint.
1
Well, those living in eastern Nebraska may want to ask themselves each morning when they wake up - "Is the Ogallala still ok today?"
====================
There are thousands of miles of existing pipeline criss-crossing the Ogallala today. Do you really think one more will make any difference
====================
There are thousands of miles of existing pipeline criss-crossing the Ogallala today. Do you really think one more will make any difference
1
You're right. And I don't get my water from the Ogallala. I get it from a 250' deep pure water, nearly impervious, limestone basin in the mountains of WV where the mountains have been turned into tabletops, the decades old abandoned mine tunnels still leaks streams of noxious, yellow sulfur and metal laden water into the creeks and rivers, a good 4 point buck is little bigger than a large dog, chemical companies get away with siting highly dangerous liquids with inadequate containment and inspection beside the rivers that provide drinking water for hundreds of thousands of citizens (Remember Charleston?), and some folks can actually light their tap water on fire with a butane lighter.
I wish the fine citizens of the Ogallala a great future. But if it all goes bad; if you have to buy your drinking water in 5 gallon containers - geez, I'm sorry - but thanks for the oil - which wasn't extracted from your ground, wasn't refined on your ground and ends up in Texas to be refined and sent overseas. Your sacrifice is as admirable as all the black lung miners who get their health benefits 4 months at a time from a Congress that could care less if they never get them.
Thank you Nebraska. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
I wish the fine citizens of the Ogallala a great future. But if it all goes bad; if you have to buy your drinking water in 5 gallon containers - geez, I'm sorry - but thanks for the oil - which wasn't extracted from your ground, wasn't refined on your ground and ends up in Texas to be refined and sent overseas. Your sacrifice is as admirable as all the black lung miners who get their health benefits 4 months at a time from a Congress that could care less if they never get them.
Thank you Nebraska. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
3
There are thousands of miles of pipelines already crisscrossing the country, so what's one more? How did this one get to be a political issue and blown way out of proportion anyway?
And to all the environmentalists, the same nonsense was spouted about the Trans-Alaska pipeline 50 years ago and there has been no negative impact. In fact the opposite has happened.
And to all the environmentalists, the same nonsense was spouted about the Trans-Alaska pipeline 50 years ago and there has been no negative impact. In fact the opposite has happened.
Trump's claim of creating jobs and building the pipes here in the US is a hoax.
The fact, or alternate fact is that although it may be built here, the pipes will probably be built by robots.
NOW, maybe we should ask Trump why he and his daughter Ivanka why they are still producing their products in China, Mexico, Vietnam, etc. They should be setting an example for other producers and manufacture all of their products here in the USA.
The fact, or alternate fact is that although it may be built here, the pipes will probably be built by robots.
NOW, maybe we should ask Trump why he and his daughter Ivanka why they are still producing their products in China, Mexico, Vietnam, etc. They should be setting an example for other producers and manufacture all of their products here in the USA.
2
I am glad Mr. Ruthless Brazen Defiance is showing his POWER over the world. The more he does that, the faster he goes down.
As for Keystone, that is, as British Columbia's government called it back in 2004, "a disaster waiting to happen." Imagine a 2500 mile long pipeline through from Hardisty Alberta CAN to Galveston TX. Through the wildfire prone northern region of MT, the tornado prone region of Nebraska and then the potential for pipeline leaks.
Maybe this is the only way the hicks get it. They seem to love to wallow in pollution if it means jobs. The reality is that under the Constitution, Dem states will stand on their states rights to sue any state whose pollution goes past their state lines.
As for Keystone, that is, as British Columbia's government called it back in 2004, "a disaster waiting to happen." Imagine a 2500 mile long pipeline through from Hardisty Alberta CAN to Galveston TX. Through the wildfire prone northern region of MT, the tornado prone region of Nebraska and then the potential for pipeline leaks.
Maybe this is the only way the hicks get it. They seem to love to wallow in pollution if it means jobs. The reality is that under the Constitution, Dem states will stand on their states rights to sue any state whose pollution goes past their state lines.
7
Unfortunately for "them coastal liberal elites", any time some system like Keystone blows up one way or another in those Red states they pass through, the coastal states (who contribute money disproportionately more to the country even while their votes count disproportionately less in the Electoral College) end up paying for the disasters. That's why it's okay with the "hicks".
I like the "hicks" comment.
Thank you for helping to confirm my vote for Trump.
Steve
Thank you for helping to confirm my vote for Trump.
Steve
2
As a native Garden Stater new to Silicon Valley years ago, I was often asked at HP, "Why are all the toxic waste sites in New Jersey, but all the market-research firms are in nearby Connecticut?"
"Why? Because New Jersey got to pick first."
"Why? Because New Jersey got to pick first."
So, we should all leave our cars idling. It sells gas, accelerates the wear on our cars and forces us to replace them sooner. It's good for the economy and employs more people!
The really sad thing is that even if Trump is impeached/resigns, Pence would never reverse these decisions or the damage they will do.
Sigh.
The really sad thing is that even if Trump is impeached/resigns, Pence would never reverse these decisions or the damage they will do.
Sigh.
6
You missed the national news story of the man in Roseville, CA who came out to his warmed-up car about 2 weeks ago to find a traffic ticket on it for leaving a running vehicle unattended. Many cars are stolen that way.
What will we tell our grandchildren when we have exhausted all our resources while clinging to soon-to-be-obsolete technology and abdicated scientific progress in renewable sources of energy to China? This will not make America great, it will make us a third world poverty giant run by warlords as China was a hundred years ago.
4
This might help America "be great again" temporarily. But, you know, the right is always painfully short sighted. Mainly because it all about making the most money you can this quarter, this year, maybe occasionally the next five years.
We should impose a flat percent tax on profits of companies extracting non-renewable energy resources that also pollute the ecosystem. That revenue then goes directly towards research into developing renewable energy systems and developing anti-pollution technologies. If we wait until we've drained the Earth of its non-renewable resources, it may be too late to transition to renewable without catastrophic - and possibly unsuccessful - effort.
We should impose a flat percent tax on profits of companies extracting non-renewable energy resources that also pollute the ecosystem. That revenue then goes directly towards research into developing renewable energy systems and developing anti-pollution technologies. If we wait until we've drained the Earth of its non-renewable resources, it may be too late to transition to renewable without catastrophic - and possibly unsuccessful - effort.
1
Opponents of the pipeline need to drop the argument that the jobs created are temporary and the pipeline will create only a handful of permanent jobs. Construction work, by its very nature, is always temporary work. The jobs created by rebuilding the infrastructure will also be temporary. There are better arguments against the pipeline than this old saw.
4
Arguments about the jobs being temporary are themselves arguments against proponents of the pipeline touting the creation of jobs. There are better arguments for the pipeline than this old saw.
Landlords don't care if it's temporary, they want their tenants EMPLOYED. Democrats will do anything to avoid an honest day's work, choosing instead to beaver away on another Class-Action suit at the ACLU. Someday my ship will come in...
Fact remains, even better than creating thousands of temporary jobs would be creating thousands of permanent jobs.
And if it's people who do an honest day's work that you favor, why throw out all those undocumented immigrants toiling away at jobs for pay and working conditions most Americans won't accept?
And if it's people who do an honest day's work that you favor, why throw out all those undocumented immigrants toiling away at jobs for pay and working conditions most Americans won't accept?
"But" is the new operative word. I believe in the environment "BUT"… I believe in good health care "BUT"… and on and on and on. Start looking for it in EVERY ONE of his speeches.
3
Until we know if Trump, or members of his team, illegally collaborated with the Russians (Treason) to influence the election, all these edicts and side investigations are propaganda to falsely promote his legitimacy to be President.
3
Treason, the dog that don't hunt. Or else Mister Bradley Manning would be on Death Row at Leavenworth.
I just don't understand how the creation of 28,000 jobs trumps protecting the water and land of an Indian tribe and ultimately the environment (for long term). Yes, it's great to want to create manufacturing jobs and to help steel workers, but I can't believe that there are not alternatives or at least the desire to study the issues. It is disheartening to watch someone sign into law so many controversial issues without at least debating them, hearing other's opinions and then making a decision after weighing the facts. Pray for our president America!
1
@Malia
In 1975, 28,000 workers were directly involved in building the Alaska pipeline, which was longer and much more difficult to build as it had to be suspended above the permafrost. That's where Trump's 28,000 job estimate comes from. No one knows how many jobs Keystone will create but it's unlikely it'll involve anywhere near 28,000. Once it's built the actual number of permanent jobs to maintain, monitor and service the pipeline will be in the low hundreds.
If you want to create good jobs with real benefits, you'd invest in our rail and road infrastructure because between railroads and trucks, you have two of the largest employment sectors in the US with 1.5 million trucking jobs and 215,000 rail freight jobs. The entire pipeline industry has less than 50,000 jobs. If oil were shipped by rail or truck you would create more new high quality jobs than the total now working in pipelines.
But aren't pipelines safer than trucks and rails? No, according to the US Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration and the International Energy Agency, pipelines spilled three times as much oil as rail despite there being a lot more rail freight mishaps. Pipeline spills are catastrophic in scale and remediation takes years whereas rail and truck accidents are generally much smaller in scope and more quickly cleaned up.
In terms of jobs and safety, invest in rail and truck freight infrastructure instead of a pipeline that puts the Ogalala Aquifer at risk.
In 1975, 28,000 workers were directly involved in building the Alaska pipeline, which was longer and much more difficult to build as it had to be suspended above the permafrost. That's where Trump's 28,000 job estimate comes from. No one knows how many jobs Keystone will create but it's unlikely it'll involve anywhere near 28,000. Once it's built the actual number of permanent jobs to maintain, monitor and service the pipeline will be in the low hundreds.
If you want to create good jobs with real benefits, you'd invest in our rail and road infrastructure because between railroads and trucks, you have two of the largest employment sectors in the US with 1.5 million trucking jobs and 215,000 rail freight jobs. The entire pipeline industry has less than 50,000 jobs. If oil were shipped by rail or truck you would create more new high quality jobs than the total now working in pipelines.
But aren't pipelines safer than trucks and rails? No, according to the US Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration and the International Energy Agency, pipelines spilled three times as much oil as rail despite there being a lot more rail freight mishaps. Pipeline spills are catastrophic in scale and remediation takes years whereas rail and truck accidents are generally much smaller in scope and more quickly cleaned up.
In terms of jobs and safety, invest in rail and truck freight infrastructure instead of a pipeline that puts the Ogalala Aquifer at risk.
4
Trump must show proof he has sold his stock or he is in the midst of a conflict of interest.
Congress: You're okay with a Pres. ruling by fiat? He's bypassing you also.
It takes a big man to admit he was wrong and change course. It will take a big Congress to do their mandated duty and protect us from an unfit President.
Congress: the Womens March was a mirror image of the dissatisfaction across the country shown with the vote for Trump— with YOU. Will you be a big Congress?--or a craven one.
Congress: You're okay with a Pres. ruling by fiat? He's bypassing you also.
It takes a big man to admit he was wrong and change course. It will take a big Congress to do their mandated duty and protect us from an unfit President.
Congress: the Womens March was a mirror image of the dissatisfaction across the country shown with the vote for Trump— with YOU. Will you be a big Congress?--or a craven one.
4
Trump is just giving McConnell and Cantor a thank you for their dog whistles back in 2009
Wait until Trump lifts sanctions against Russia that prevent the massive oil deal with Exxon Mobil from taking effect. The deal that, coincidentally, the new Sec of State brokered and which will undoubtedly result in a fat, fat bonus check in he mail once the deal proceeds to action. Tillerson's Exxon Mobil pals will also throw him a party.
My President must keep USN frigates sliding down the ways at Bath Iron Works before the East Coast's poorest state has to rely solely on clothespins and lobsters to survive. BTW, have you bankrupted LL Bean yet for supporting My President?
The 70 year old child in the Oval Office is playing King of the Hill issuing edicts from his throne behind his desk while his courtiers stand silently by. It's shameful that leaders in the Republican Party stand silently by. Don't they realize that he doesn't understand the long term consequences of his pronouncements; that he's just spouting off for attention?
His continuing focus and complaints about the size of the crowds at the inauguration and the number of people who voted for him is troubling and indicative of psychological issues.
His continuing focus and complaints about the size of the crowds at the inauguration and the number of people who voted for him is troubling and indicative of psychological issues.
6
If he could threaten and cajole feeble old ladies to give up their properties and get out of his way, do you seriously think he gives a hoot about Native Americans?
Time to call all First NAtion peoples together and go on the War Path !!!!
Time to call all First NAtion peoples together and go on the War Path !!!!
3
Shell oil walked away from a multi billion dollar oil rig investment in the Artic as uneconomic. Now that Trump has released the legal impediment let's see if Transcanada pipeline company has the intelligence to cancel the Keystone XL because oil from tar sands is an even bigger money loser. As an investor I will be watching
1
"Next stop, Dairy Ann," where 1% investors are on tenterhooks just now.
Trump's executive orders must be ruining Obamas golf game. His legacy wiped away in two days.
3
"This insubstantial pageant.... strut and fret your hour upon the stage and then, no more. The rest is silence." Michelle will go back to being Always Unhappy again.
Yes he is the very model of a modern major general;
His thoughts now can have the force of law, and each is seminal.
He continues to say as he pleases, the poor he squeezes;
Friends are his foil and we'll see the oil,
On land, in pipes, in water, and in the emergency rooms.
He'll close the EPA by strangulation, his will shall be law,
Wrong will be right, at least in his mind.
Less is more and more is less as long as it is in his favor;
this taste of Trump is daily palaver.
His thoughts now can have the force of law, and each is seminal.
He continues to say as he pleases, the poor he squeezes;
Friends are his foil and we'll see the oil,
On land, in pipes, in water, and in the emergency rooms.
He'll close the EPA by strangulation, his will shall be law,
Wrong will be right, at least in his mind.
Less is more and more is less as long as it is in his favor;
this taste of Trump is daily palaver.
3
As I see it, the problem is not so much Trump as our system of what our government has become: the presidency has unfortunately become an imperial presidency with our other branches of government ineffective. One person should not wield such power. We did not elect a dictator.
3
Then why didn't Obama's nominee to the Supreme Court become a Justice?
6
That's what the majority of the country was saying for the last eight years. He was doing any thing he wanted and nobody was willing to confront him or stop him, especially since the media had him on a pedestal or be labeled a racist just for disagreeing with him.
3
Dictator = Elizabeth Warren (D-Shrewsville).
Any rejected lousy idea will be embraced by our ignorant president; any good idea will be rejected.
That's what the know-nothings desire: to harm as many as possible.
That's what the know-nothings desire: to harm as many as possible.
6
David's fresh out of Nuance, it appears.
Looming disaster run amok---
Thank you Trump voters for your short sighted
solutions that will only garner wealth for the oligarchs
and many nails in nature's coffin;
Yahoo!'s united in self destruction!
Thank you Trump voters for your short sighted
solutions that will only garner wealth for the oligarchs
and many nails in nature's coffin;
Yahoo!'s united in self destruction!
6
Funny. More environment caused health problems coming up, now, to blow up healthcare premiums - Obamacare or not. With millions on the cheap, inadequate healthcare plans the least wealthy will have to make do with in a for-profit system. If they can afford a plan at all, since the Republicans won't want to pay for the amount of government subsidies and/or tax incentives it would take to make sure EVERYONE is actually covered in their "access to" healthcare schemes.
He seems to blame the environment for massive oil spills that pollute the drinking water and ruin homes and businesses.
3
Those are not homes, they're the teepee's of the protesters.
It sounds like pipelines are symbolic and have very little practical bearing on the climate and even less on the economy.
However one problem I have with them is the issue of eminent domain. If one owns private land in the path of one of these major pipelines, I feel one has very little recourse if any to prevent the pipeline to pass through one's property.
I forget whether property rights are a conservative or liberal notion, but they seem fundamental to true freedom.
However one problem I have with them is the issue of eminent domain. If one owns private land in the path of one of these major pipelines, I feel one has very little recourse if any to prevent the pipeline to pass through one's property.
I forget whether property rights are a conservative or liberal notion, but they seem fundamental to true freedom.
He is only making good on his promise to support massive infrastructure projects. Forget the replacement of deteriorating water lines those would only benefit the small people.
3
If the statement that he sold his stocks in participating pipeline companies is untrue--he's profiteering, yes. He has refused to offer proof of sales, along with his tax records and signed documents turning his businesses over to his sons.
Congress: Do your job and provide oversight over this unfit Pres.
Congress: Do your job and provide oversight over this unfit Pres.
3
Well all those idiots who voted for trump should be happy to see the environment destroyed. Here we go.
Please tell me he'll be impeached soon, very soon.
Please tell me he'll be impeached soon, very soon.
2
As Trump rolls back environmental regulations and the U.S. ends up contributing even more to climate change, I wouldn't be surprised if other countries start to treat this as an act of war.
It appears that these two pipelines could follow the same route with a small change and could possibly be combined.
You wouldn't want to foul sweet Baaken crude with liquefied bitumen from tar sands.
Isn't this an area where Trump has a conflict of interest? Isn't he an investor in the pipeline? Forbes has a story out about it. Forbes endorsed Trump.
This promises to be a deadly fight. Sad!
This promises to be a deadly fight. Sad!
2
Trump's petulant provocations are going to incite violence. I seriously believe he's mentally unfit. How does the process deal with a looney in the white house.
3
As a native New Jerseyan, it was always difficult for me to discern who was mentally unfit, and who was just "Jersey." Mine? Exit 36 GSP.
Not surprising.
Please support https://www.nrdc.org/ if you're hoping to keep these things from progressing, comments and hashtags only go so far.
Republicans willing to destroy eco systems over this? Makes sense as long as we can get votes doesn't matter how we create jobs, good plan guys.
Please support https://www.nrdc.org/ if you're hoping to keep these things from progressing, comments and hashtags only go so far.
Republicans willing to destroy eco systems over this? Makes sense as long as we can get votes doesn't matter how we create jobs, good plan guys.
Ardent protests will follow from Americans who truly love their country.
I fear this is a set up for Trump to start his "law and order" exercises.
I fear he would gladly call on martial law to have opposition
bend to his will.
I fear this is a set up for Trump to start his "law and order" exercises.
I fear he would gladly call on martial law to have opposition
bend to his will.
1
No legacy for Obama. Never was and never will be. We need these pipelines and they will create jobs and a safety net in case OPEC decides to cut the flow of petro to the USA. In the long run we will be glad that we allowed these projects to go forward.
1
Let's not forget that fracking in North Dakota as well as the threat of oil spills can occur in close proximity to missile silos buried in the ground. The potential for earth quakes and/or explosions is real and a threat to safety beyond the state's borders. If we can't convince oil companies and state legislatures to have regard for the environment, clean water, and Native America rights, maybe some discussion of a nuclear accident will get someone's attention.
1
If you drive a car, then you're using oil. No matter where oil comes from there is a risk of pollution. The only solution to saving the Earth is birth control. Time to think again about Zero Population Growth.
1
Promises made, promises kept. How refreshing.
3
And no environmental impact statements required to make the promises.
And no environmental impact statements required to make the promises.
====================
Environmental reviews were done for both pipelines and recommended construction. Obama ignored these to stop them
====================
Environmental reviews were done for both pipelines and recommended construction. Obama ignored these to stop them
"Trumpy Python's Lying Circus ".
(apologies to John Clease et al. )
(apologies to John Clease et al. )
5
Trump says 30,000 jobs but full time? 2 dozen is how many new full time jobs in maintaining the pipelines officially. Big difference there. Alternate facts?
3
That's not what he said.......30,000 construction jobs to built the pipeline, 30/50 permanent jobs.
Ask the unions what they think
Ask the unions what they think
1
Trump says 30,000 jobs but full time? 2 dozen is how many new full time jobs in maintaining the pipelines officially. Big difference there. Alternate facts?
=====================
That is in the nature of infrastructure projects. Obama and Democrats spent years clamoring for infrastructure projects. Are you saying we shouldn't build bridges because they don't result in permanent jobs?
And these are bonuses as they are being built with private money
=====================
That is in the nature of infrastructure projects. Obama and Democrats spent years clamoring for infrastructure projects. Are you saying we shouldn't build bridges because they don't result in permanent jobs?
And these are bonuses as they are being built with private money
1
After ALL of the Public outcry about Climate Change and It's REAL dangers - after all of the true and bona-fide evidence that burning fossil fuels (especially the ugliest, lowest-grade "Oil Sands" crud up in Canada) is most definitely killing this Planet, and thus; Ourselves ~ we get this absurdity from the Oval Office.
Shipping tar Sands Oil from Canada, via a pipe line, is beyond absurd. Pipelines leak. They always have, they always will. They leak into your Water Table, and into the Natural Environment. They leak into the Air that you breathe. It leaks onto your skin. It leaks onto the food growing in fields, that you eat.
After dangerously crossing Our Continent with this absurd Pipeline, where an Earthquake, or a Flood, or a Bomb, or a Terrorist Action could destroy it easily, the final Processing Terminal in Texas to refine this "Tar Sands" crud is 75% owned by Saudi Arabians (!!!) . So, so much for "American jobs". What garbage, and lies.
As an anti War activist from the 1960's, I was beyond impressed with the response, and Boots-on-the-Ground activism that this Year's Women's Day March brought forth. I fully supported the Activism at Standing Rock Reservation, and the response, and turn out there. THAT is Democracy. What the Women's Day turn out created was even more amazing, and beyond Historic.
We have much work to do to turn this around. Don't quit now.
Shipping tar Sands Oil from Canada, via a pipe line, is beyond absurd. Pipelines leak. They always have, they always will. They leak into your Water Table, and into the Natural Environment. They leak into the Air that you breathe. It leaks onto your skin. It leaks onto the food growing in fields, that you eat.
After dangerously crossing Our Continent with this absurd Pipeline, where an Earthquake, or a Flood, or a Bomb, or a Terrorist Action could destroy it easily, the final Processing Terminal in Texas to refine this "Tar Sands" crud is 75% owned by Saudi Arabians (!!!) . So, so much for "American jobs". What garbage, and lies.
As an anti War activist from the 1960's, I was beyond impressed with the response, and Boots-on-the-Ground activism that this Year's Women's Day March brought forth. I fully supported the Activism at Standing Rock Reservation, and the response, and turn out there. THAT is Democracy. What the Women's Day turn out created was even more amazing, and beyond Historic.
We have much work to do to turn this around. Don't quit now.
4
I once dreamed of a planet filled with alien life forms pleading for water while in its death throes. When do we reach the point of no return, when our desperation is so great that our cries for help are heard across the universe? If only we would start voting in unison for candidates who care about the sustainability of life on earth then perhaps we will avoid biting the dust before our time also.
Be careful with dismissive statements like "the government concluded that Keystone’s carbon emissions would equal less than 1 percent of the total greenhouse gas emissions in the United States".
1 percent of the total US emissions is still equivalent to the total emissions of coal-powered Hungary, and more than Sweden's or Denmark's. That project would make an incredible dent in the world's remaining carbon budget.
Quick reminder: all the world's coral reefs are dead or dying. That's irreversible. All the corals. Are we're at 1.1°C of warming. Do we really want to know what dies next? It's too late for any kind of complacency.
1 percent of the total US emissions is still equivalent to the total emissions of coal-powered Hungary, and more than Sweden's or Denmark's. That project would make an incredible dent in the world's remaining carbon budget.
Quick reminder: all the world's coral reefs are dead or dying. That's irreversible. All the corals. Are we're at 1.1°C of warming. Do we really want to know what dies next? It's too late for any kind of complacency.
2
The president was elected to make these kind of in the now decisions. The electoral college had numerous opportunities to do its job, and it was in the now. Maybe America spends to much time thinking about its future. The electoral college voted for change now, change tomorrow, and America first.
There aren't any oils spills in Washington. The water has low lead levels. Marijuana is legal. Congress is generally ineffective except for making the most of a work free thought place. The Supreme Court is becoming politicized. All health care is affordable on Capitol Hill.
This is really not the America the founders had in mind anyway. Why worry, be happy, for the lucky few In Washington; Home of alternative facts, political science, and a warming fuzzy climate.
There aren't any oils spills in Washington. The water has low lead levels. Marijuana is legal. Congress is generally ineffective except for making the most of a work free thought place. The Supreme Court is becoming politicized. All health care is affordable on Capitol Hill.
This is really not the America the founders had in mind anyway. Why worry, be happy, for the lucky few In Washington; Home of alternative facts, political science, and a warming fuzzy climate.
3
Trump is moving fast. I'm loving it.
3
Moving fast toward what? What do you see as the end game here?
1
These pipelines will be made with American steel and it is about time jobs for Americans will be initiated. Long live capitalism.
1
We cannot switch to renewable resources soon enough.
It seems to be too late for the people along the pipeline corridor ( native Americans and farmers ), I hope and pray that millions of peoples' drinking water will not be affected from a pipeline spill.
It seems to be too late for the people along the pipeline corridor ( native Americans and farmers ), I hope and pray that millions of peoples' drinking water will not be affected from a pipeline spill.
3
Made my day to see My President high-fiving James Comey at the walkabout today. "Well played, sir." James blushed a bit.
Probably too much to hope he blushed from shame.
"Freeze! We're from the FBI! Show us your hands, and do not blush!"
Trump has with these executive orders upstaged the stupidity of Reagan ordering the removal of solar panels from the White House. Both actions were motivated by spite for their predecessors and not an iota of thought. We did not learn then, we will not learn now.
4
Trump's attitude on saving the environment: on a net discounted cash flow basis the earth is simply not worth saving.
9
These pipelines break and spill all the time. the back end costs far outweigh the profit of those involved. the pipelines are not built for the earth movement caused by fraking nor natural earth movement. Who wants to shower in oil polluted water? Are people really wanting to truck in water and face 20 million in oil spill clean ups that never work? : Husky Oil spill continues to affect cities' drinking water http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatoon/husky-energy-oil-spill-drinking-...
39
"These pipelines break and spill all the time" Do they? Post some times and places and the amounts spilled. NYT archive is nearby.
4
2
Muskegon, MI, the Kalamazoo River
1
I hope that all those people who voted for that Nobel Prize winner Dr. Jill Stein take note of this development. The Green Party is always telling us that there is really no difference between the Democratic and Republican candidates...
36
The Green Party did not change the election. Blaming others for their own mistakes use to be a Republican trait. Please decease this nonsense.
2
Johnson did far more harm to Hillary than the Green Party.
In Michigan alone, which Trump won by only 10,000 votes, Johnson got 172,000 votes.
In Michigan alone, which Trump won by only 10,000 votes, Johnson got 172,000 votes.
2
Carlson, you are incorrect. Trump won by only 80,000 votes in Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pa., which gave Trump victory.
There were over 600,000 third party votes .
There were over 600,000 third party votes .
Long overdue, and now reversed as promised. Thank you Mr. President. It shouldn't take a "No, you can't" president to reverse the ideal-blind "Yes, you can" one, especially when his "can" meant stymie, regulate, more stymie. But it did. Thank goodness can got canned and can't's on a roll before the damage got any worse.
Kudos to the president for stepping up to the plate promptly, unhesitatingly, and getting the buzz back in growth and production. Watch lips, greatest prez since FDR, just like May, greatest PM since Churchill. Who would have thought.
Kudos to the president for stepping up to the plate promptly, unhesitatingly, and getting the buzz back in growth and production. Watch lips, greatest prez since FDR, just like May, greatest PM since Churchill. Who would have thought.
13
Sorry but I appreciate a new Little Big Horn The american Indian and our environment wil now pay for the stupidity of a President who also has interest in the company who is building the pipeline. Teddy Roosevelt a Republican President who was an early defender of our nations Gifts must be turning over in his grave
1
Shall we wait for the economy to do an 1893, a 1929 or a 2007? Those shocks were what came right after the GOP had, as they now do, the White House and both the House and Senate and passed business-friendly laws that got followed by deep recessions and the Great Depression.
Wait for it. If all the trade deals get thrown on the fire and the 1% gets to vacuum up even more money from the economy as a whole, as is clearly on the agenda, a return to making the economy choke again is likely what's going to happen. If it does, I'll get to lean back and smile because, well, I told you so.
Sadly, many people, especially the poor, retirees, and the sick will suffer unnecessarily. This is the GOP's world and there are no excuses. Obama didn't do this one.
Wait for it. If all the trade deals get thrown on the fire and the 1% gets to vacuum up even more money from the economy as a whole, as is clearly on the agenda, a return to making the economy choke again is likely what's going to happen. If it does, I'll get to lean back and smile because, well, I told you so.
Sadly, many people, especially the poor, retirees, and the sick will suffer unnecessarily. This is the GOP's world and there are no excuses. Obama didn't do this one.
Bit early for either of those declarations but then again Trumpers create their own reality.
Put a skypecam in the Press Briefing room in the White House. Have an intern at the NY Times office take down everything the official mouthpiece says. Print it if it is an obvious lie, while distributing the info to other journalists/newspapers electronically.
Then, all of you journalists are free to do what you really should do -actually start digging into the various departments, gag orders, develop internal sources, or dig deeper into what his connections are to the Russians. Investigate really - instead of sitting in those chairs in the White House to be fed a bunch of malarkey and lies.
Then, all of you journalists are free to do what you really should do -actually start digging into the various departments, gag orders, develop internal sources, or dig deeper into what his connections are to the Russians. Investigate really - instead of sitting in those chairs in the White House to be fed a bunch of malarkey and lies.
35
Yay! Yes, only the brave investigative journalists can save us now, and y'all gotta be really, really loud and insistent to get the attention of Republicans whose brains obviously cannot be penetrated by reason or the truth. I'm waiting for the Heroes to step up to the plate, and NOW! Please save our country.
1
trump has made a career of cheating business associates
why people continued to to business w him in light of his history is somewhat mystifying
but mow he has a captive audience, who dont have the option of refusing his deals
and that would be you, folks
you are now trumps 'partner' in all his future ventures, and if history is any in indication, you will get the royal shaft
24
Congress: you are mandated to oversee the Exec Branch--do your job!
News from outside The Bubble: Stock market continues its record ascent since November 8.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled Doomfest.
We now return you to your regularly scheduled Doomfest.
13
"Thank you, Jeremiah. Now, Cassandra from the Capitol will take us to the break with dire news that the President has threatened to reduce America's unemployment rates dramatically."
The oil robber-barons will get their wish to bake the planet for truckfuls of dollars and pay their peons fistfuls of them, by bringing up petroleum and "safer" natural gas that we can't safely extract ANY further and must be kept in the ground to prevent runaway global warming. The people will get paid off with "jobs" while their homes get flooded off the map and the street they then have to live in becomes toxic smog-soup.
But yay the Dow's up, woo!
Where do I even start with such ignorance...
But yay the Dow's up, woo!
Where do I even start with such ignorance...
4
Great. The two biggest stock rises were immediately before 1929 and 2007. We "doomsayers" all know how that ended. Better check your 401K plan and your health insurance policy while it still exists. Have a happy retirement.
2
Trump is an absolute disaster and danger to our country. To our environment. To our education. To our foreign relations. To our economy.
The only genuine subject now is our failure.
The only genuine subject now is our failure.
30
A disaster for New Mexico, you mean.
2
A disaster for the United States. A disaster for the world.
California is included in both.
California is included in both.
1
Horrible. We are in for a dodgy time, because the planet doesn't give a hoot for politics and big fossil. It is about the teach us that the longer we ignore its lessons, the more obvious those lessons will get.
By the way, just for the record. That Flint water thing Republicans are now pretending was the fault of the victims? It wasn't.
A Republican manager was put in, and the cheapskates were too busy looting to continue to provide clean water to people they'd just as soon were dead anyway.
Death panels for the poor and disenfranchised, pennies for billionaires!
By the way, just for the record. That Flint water thing Republicans are now pretending was the fault of the victims? It wasn't.
A Republican manager was put in, and the cheapskates were too busy looting to continue to provide clean water to people they'd just as soon were dead anyway.
Death panels for the poor and disenfranchised, pennies for billionaires!
26
Both Obama and Hillary supported Keystone XL before they opposed it, and they opposed it because the environmental movement has become nothing more than rabid Luddites. Keystone and Dakota are more than 90 percent complete, and to oppose the completion of either is the triumph of ideology over common sense.
11
trump was never able to best obama w his birth certificate nonsense
despite the team of 'expert investigators' he dispatched to Hawaii to get the scoop on the b/c
(say, don, whatever became of that' investigation' ? did you misplace it perhaps in the same place as your tax records, old stick ?)
so now he furiously destroys all things obama like a vengeful child might do to right a perceived wrong
kind of like this guy did
The railway carriage in which Germany surrendered to France, at the end of World War I, had been housed in a French museum. Hitler ordered his engineers to retrieve the train car—and deliver it to the exact spot where Germany had surrendered 21½ years before.
Hitler, waiting for the French delegation at a place about fifty miles northeast of Paris, had a special plan in place for this special railway car.
The arriving Frenchmen, set to surrender their country to Nazi control on the 22nd of June, in 1940, recognized the railway carriage and instantly realized Hitler’s objectives.
Hitler would make France surrender in the very train car, at the very place, where Germany had surrendered to France at the end of World War One.
Hitler, in short, would have his revenge for Germany's WWI surrender humiliation.
15
trump doesnt care what kind of economic carnage he wreaks on america bc he wont be around to face its consequences
but you will
35
The Dakota pipleline is just upstream from the reservation. In addition to being a source of water for the tribes, the Missouri River is extremely important to the Central Flyway of many species of migrating waterfowl.
32
The Dakota pipleline is just upstream from the reservation. In addition to being a source of water for the tribes, the Missouri River is extremely important to the Central Flyway of many species of migrating waterfowl.
=================
The DAP follows the route of an existing pipeline under the river. The existing pipeline has been there since the 1980s.
=================
The DAP follows the route of an existing pipeline under the river. The existing pipeline has been there since the 1980s.
1
It is odd that over 8,000 miles of oil and gas pipelines were built throughout the US during Obama's 8 year tenure, but KXL and Dakota Access are the problems? We know why Obama nixed Keystone over the approval of HIS State Dept - his buddy Warren Buffet owns BNSF Railroad and BNSF brings the majority of the hundreds of thousands of barrels of crude down from Canada everyday. KXL would be competition and ya can't have that. Look for Obama to be on the Board of Berkshire Hathaway, at $1M per year, in the near future. Dakota Access' new regulation requirement by Obama was just to stick it in Trump's face.
13
Look Canada, we don't want your pollution. You like to think your country is holier than thou. Meanwhile BC pollutes the Columbia River and Alberta wastes precious water in your pitiful tar sands -- which are an abomination. You also love your clearcuts. So Keep them and your dirty oil.
21
Your claim isn't even physically possible, given the rail capacity of BNSF.
https://katusaresearch.com/oil-wars-canada-vs-us/
https://www.truthorfiction.com/burlington-rail-road/
https://katusaresearch.com/oil-wars-canada-vs-us/
https://www.truthorfiction.com/burlington-rail-road/
6
To Helen:
For god's sake don't put all Canadians in the same basket .Many agree with you about the tar sands.
Starkman's writing from Calgary,Alberta : Probably would have voted Trump.
For god's sake don't put all Canadians in the same basket .Many agree with you about the tar sands.
Starkman's writing from Calgary,Alberta : Probably would have voted Trump.
1
Ms. Davenport and Mr. Baker,
I appreciate the article but I don't think it clearly pointed out the truth about what it means for Canada to continue to process its "oilsands" natural resource with current technology. The current process emits considerably more greenhouse gases than the processing of petroleum or natural gas. There are plenty of expert chemical engineers in practice and teaching at our engineering schools that will be able to give you accurate measures per volume of useful product. In my view this stuff should not be touched until we develop much better technology for processing it.
Moreover, the XL decision is not about fabricating and constructing pipelines. Everyone knows that the greenhouse gasses are increasing in the atmosphere and it is causing the Earth to warm. In fact, we are risking the "triggering" of an uncontrollable release of greenhouse gasses currently trapped in the frozen Arctic permafrost and methane deposits on the ocean floor. If these frozen deposits are triggered by thawing, the consequences are catastrophic. The Earth will become iceless, oceans will rise, and the oceans will become too acidic to support the food web. Many species will become extinct and I doubt that our own species can adapt.
Write carefully & completely about these fossil fuels, you have a lot of newly elected policymakers to educate. The best economic decision will be to evolve to a non-fossil fuel global economy. Read "Silent Earth", Dr. James Powell.
I appreciate the article but I don't think it clearly pointed out the truth about what it means for Canada to continue to process its "oilsands" natural resource with current technology. The current process emits considerably more greenhouse gases than the processing of petroleum or natural gas. There are plenty of expert chemical engineers in practice and teaching at our engineering schools that will be able to give you accurate measures per volume of useful product. In my view this stuff should not be touched until we develop much better technology for processing it.
Moreover, the XL decision is not about fabricating and constructing pipelines. Everyone knows that the greenhouse gasses are increasing in the atmosphere and it is causing the Earth to warm. In fact, we are risking the "triggering" of an uncontrollable release of greenhouse gasses currently trapped in the frozen Arctic permafrost and methane deposits on the ocean floor. If these frozen deposits are triggered by thawing, the consequences are catastrophic. The Earth will become iceless, oceans will rise, and the oceans will become too acidic to support the food web. Many species will become extinct and I doubt that our own species can adapt.
Write carefully & completely about these fossil fuels, you have a lot of newly elected policymakers to educate. The best economic decision will be to evolve to a non-fossil fuel global economy. Read "Silent Earth", Dr. James Powell.
34
Here here! Bravo. You are spot on! Tar sands are a huge environmental disaster.
15
Alas, Trump talking about immigrants and wall building while approving key stone pipe line that will ulrimately ravage native americans' lands.
This man can not possibly bring anything positive or constructive. He is so full of hatred, incapable of loving, forgiving and bringing people together. I do not know how he can say he is Christian.
This man can not possibly bring anything positive or constructive. He is so full of hatred, incapable of loving, forgiving and bringing people together. I do not know how he can say he is Christian.
28
He says a lot of things you might not want to hold him to ---- the sooner you get that, the sooner you will understand the situation.
9
Trump lies every single day, that's how he can say he is a Christian. However, when asked who were his heroes, he did not even name Jesus, or anybody else. HE is the only Hero he knows. How can anybody respect such a big fat Liar, here or abroad? Wake up, Republicans, this is gonna take every one of you down before you can say, "Jack Robinson."
1
It should be pretty clear by now the only thing Trump worships is his image in a mirror. Where is Snow White when we need her?
For a few thousand jobs for a couple of years we are prepared to sacrifice our future and our planet.
A better solution for our energy independence compatible with sensible policies to slow climate change is renewable energy
Why not an executive order to accelerate solar and wind power using equipment manufactured in the USA.
This will create far more jobs, greater innovation and technology for many many years.
And Conservatives should consider maybe God gave us the sun and the wind to light and power our lives night and day and that we have a duty to keep the water pure and clean to sustain our lives.
Another reason to march
A better solution for our energy independence compatible with sensible policies to slow climate change is renewable energy
Why not an executive order to accelerate solar and wind power using equipment manufactured in the USA.
This will create far more jobs, greater innovation and technology for many many years.
And Conservatives should consider maybe God gave us the sun and the wind to light and power our lives night and day and that we have a duty to keep the water pure and clean to sustain our lives.
Another reason to march
34
The reason is clear: you cannot own the sun or the wind, so it is of no interest to capitalists! Once the equipment is in place, it will produce energy at almost no cost and make it impossible to gain large profits from energy.
The society, on the other hand, will thrive. Who would want that to happen?
The society, on the other hand, will thrive. Who would want that to happen?
7
For a few thousand jobs for a couple of years we are prepared to sacrifice our future and our planet.
-----------------
A California state of mind -- hysteria. Joan Didion knew it well. We can't even get a desalination plant here after years of drought. 1100 miles of coastline = 1 desalination plant in parched San Diego county. All the nuts roll to the coast but must bring their own water. Salmon fry catch a ride from upper Sacramento River to the Delta, not enuff water to carry them downstream. No app for that.
-----------------
A California state of mind -- hysteria. Joan Didion knew it well. We can't even get a desalination plant here after years of drought. 1100 miles of coastline = 1 desalination plant in parched San Diego county. All the nuts roll to the coast but must bring their own water. Salmon fry catch a ride from upper Sacramento River to the Delta, not enuff water to carry them downstream. No app for that.
3
Here's the real answer, Steff:
-- Solyndra crashed and burned big time after the White House gave it $535,000,000 after just one (1) meeting. It's now a Seagate disk factory.
-- California cancelled its solar rebate program last year for being ineffective. No longer do dodgy men ring our doorbell offering us solar panel installations.
Over all govt parking lots, schools, etc. in this area are arrays of solar panels, providing needed shade. I think they're recycled from Solyndra in Fremont.
-- Solyndra crashed and burned big time after the White House gave it $535,000,000 after just one (1) meeting. It's now a Seagate disk factory.
-- California cancelled its solar rebate program last year for being ineffective. No longer do dodgy men ring our doorbell offering us solar panel installations.
Over all govt parking lots, schools, etc. in this area are arrays of solar panels, providing needed shade. I think they're recycled from Solyndra in Fremont.
3
Maybe being President isn't as hard as everyone thought. You just reverse everything the last guy did.
30
These pipelines will create thousands of skilled union jobs. Who wouldn't want to support that idea?
7
1000s ?
have a citation for that, old top ?
5
Me for one. The environment is equally important. The future for our children is even more important.
Industry always brings out the jobs card when they think it will help them rake in profits. But they don't give a rip about jobs when it will help them rake in profits. Get the commonality? It's always about corporate profit. Nothing more.
Industry always brings out the jobs card when they think it will help them rake in profits. But they don't give a rip about jobs when it will help them rake in profits. Get the commonality? It's always about corporate profit. Nothing more.
2
Those who want to keep unpolluted the Central Flyway of many species of migrating waterfowl.
He jobs will not be temporary and not worth the environmental risk.
He jobs will not be temporary and not worth the environmental risk.
10
He has put a gag order on the EPA and other agencies concerned with environment. He has stopped grants. What are the scientists caught in the middle doing?
27
Looking for new jobs/funding most likely, so much for Trump's pledge to increase American jobs.
3
They're making a Study of it, KM, longitudinally.
The dictatorship has started and President Trump has already proved that one of his main goals is to steal. First he wants to steal oil from Iraq and other Middle East countries and the next day he steals land from American Indians to help his corporate greed friends. Is this the President of the USA, a thief, does he really represent what we stand for, do we really want to be an imperial power and demand from all our allies, that WE will come first, no matter that all Americans originally came from there?
Do we really want to be recognized as an elite Super
Power? Is this what the people who voted for Teump had in mind, a President who rules by the principles of the mafia?
Our President is insane, maybe even criminally insane. We can and should improve our country so everyone can enjoy their lives as is written in the Constitution, but do we want to be presided by a man who rules with revenge in mind.
If you do you, then you and the cowardly Republican Party will be held responsible.
Do we really want to be recognized as an elite Super
Power? Is this what the people who voted for Teump had in mind, a President who rules by the principles of the mafia?
Our President is insane, maybe even criminally insane. We can and should improve our country so everyone can enjoy their lives as is written in the Constitution, but do we want to be presided by a man who rules with revenge in mind.
If you do you, then you and the cowardly Republican Party will be held responsible.
19
Thank you,Johan , for "saying it like it is ,no political correctness anymore .
He is, indeed, insane, of unsound mind.
He is ill and cannot be president of the United States of America, or of any other country.
He is going to create chaos around him and it will be traumatic for his aides.
He is, indeed, insane, of unsound mind.
He is ill and cannot be president of the United States of America, or of any other country.
He is going to create chaos around him and it will be traumatic for his aides.
2
It's a populist, as simple as that. Same thing as lots of Latin American presidents. History has shown that nothing good comes out of a populist, never.
1
Do they have 50-minute hours, eh, on the couch in Canada? Will be sorely needed once Chelsea and Amy and Lena and Cher and Ashley arrive in Toronto. Bonne chance!
NYTimes PLEASE report that he has investments in the companies. FOR GOD'S SAKES PLEASE!! Put that up FIRST. DON'T LET THIS SLIME BALL PLAY YOU AND US.
He is also playfully threatening martial law in Chicago. PLEASE MOVE FASTER.
" If Chicago doesn't fix the horrible "carnage" going on, 228 shootings in 2017 with 42 killings (up 24% from 2016), I will send in the Feds! — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) January 25, 2017 "
He is also playfully threatening martial law in Chicago. PLEASE MOVE FASTER.
" If Chicago doesn't fix the horrible "carnage" going on, 228 shootings in 2017 with 42 killings (up 24% from 2016), I will send in the Feds! — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) January 25, 2017 "
22
playfully ?
what makes you say that ?
2
Trump-l'œil (French for "deceive the eye", is a technique that uses realistic imagery to create the optical illusion that Donald Trump is overqualified to be the 45th President of the United States.
trompe-l'oeil .
1
Good people, we are in for some rough times.
And as far as the pipelines go, it's time for Edward Abbey's monkey wrench gang.
Call your representatives, first, though...but if that doesn't work...
And as far as the pipelines go, it's time for Edward Abbey's monkey wrench gang.
Call your representatives, first, though...but if that doesn't work...
24
Call until the cows come home, there aren't enuff Democrats left to do anything but Obstruct. Little pyrrhic victories, and marches, is your lot.
4
since it appears the epa is now defunct it will become necessary for people to become their own epa or suffer the consequences.
6
Toxic admiration for this petty man will be the
greatest challenge for decent Americans, but it
appears from the 5 million marchers world wide,
we are ready.
greatest challenge for decent Americans, but it
appears from the 5 million marchers world wide,
we are ready.
Wow...green-lighting pipelines, building the southern wall, revoking Obamacare, curtaining immigration. Like him or not, he is doing EXACTLY what he said he would do. And quickly. Has any President ever started this fast?
16
fast track to another republican debacle
2
The pipelines are a long way from built, and given the past year he'll probably have to draw blood to stop the protests and then he's toast. The wall is nowhere near being so much as a sketch on a napkin. If he can get illegal immigration down below Obama's levels that will be an accident, and as of today's presser he will not be deporting the number of people he promised to. Obamacare will not change by the midterms, so either a lot of GOP will be out based on the majority of Americans who want it or they will rebuke him just to keep their jobs. Only remaining question is will his supporters respond to his lies sooner and stronger than his opponents? Or maybe congress will finally read the transcript from Friday and realize he just threw all of them under the bus. If they do their response to Trump will make Jimmy Carter look like a prodigy with congress.
1
Of course not. Because all other Presidents would at least attempt to work with the other side or pay attention to what the population wants before forging ahead. But Trump really isn't a President, he wants to be a dictator to the extent that our system allows him to be. Trump doesn't care what anyone thinks because he doesn't care about anyone but himself. Why even consider others and what their wants and needs might be?
15
Why this potential leak/ demise of our water system? Wells Fargo. Who is our new Secretary of defense? How much does trump have invested/ profited from the same? How rich does one man have to be? Wouldnt this be a conflict of interest? Im not a hater of capitalism. Im a mother wanting posterity to have a chance to live in a non toxic environment.
5
Actually, the person that benefitted most from the shutdown of the pipeline was Obama's friend Warren Buffet. He owns the railroad that will ship the oil that won't go through the pipeline. Interesting article on their relationship and how much (about double) Buffet has made on the railroad investment.
4
@Katie
I hope Buffett makes a lot of money with his railroad investment for one reason: the rail sector is one of largest employers in the US, with good pay and benefits. The oil sector, particularly refining, is tiny by comparison. And to be accurate (facts are such a nuisance) Buffett doesn't own a railroad. He's a major shareholder in his investment company Berkshire-Hathaway, which also has tens of thousands of other investors. Whatever profit Berkshire-Hathaway made off rail investment was distributed to tens of thousands of investors and didn't all end up in Buffett's personal bank account.
Trump is a fraud in every sense, including taking office while thumbing his nose at an iceberg of ethical and financial conflicts. Trying to tar Obama with corrupt motives for canceling Keystone is just like one of your president's diversionary tweets.
Soon enough your buyer's remorse will set in and you'll have to live with defending Trump on his way to being one of history's most hated and despicable or you sink deeper into Trump's reality of alternative facts and accept denial as your path through life.
Cut your losses.
I hope Buffett makes a lot of money with his railroad investment for one reason: the rail sector is one of largest employers in the US, with good pay and benefits. The oil sector, particularly refining, is tiny by comparison. And to be accurate (facts are such a nuisance) Buffett doesn't own a railroad. He's a major shareholder in his investment company Berkshire-Hathaway, which also has tens of thousands of other investors. Whatever profit Berkshire-Hathaway made off rail investment was distributed to tens of thousands of investors and didn't all end up in Buffett's personal bank account.
Trump is a fraud in every sense, including taking office while thumbing his nose at an iceberg of ethical and financial conflicts. Trying to tar Obama with corrupt motives for canceling Keystone is just like one of your president's diversionary tweets.
Soon enough your buyer's remorse will set in and you'll have to live with defending Trump on his way to being one of history's most hated and despicable or you sink deeper into Trump's reality of alternative facts and accept denial as your path through life.
Cut your losses.
2
So much for draining the swamp. Trump received more than $100,000 in donations from Energy Transfer Partners during his campaign, and only very recently divested from the stock he owned in the company and in Phillips 66, which holds a major stake in DAPL. ETP has donated over $7M to GOP coffers in recent years, and Energy nominee Rick Perry sits on its board.
10
I was so proud of Obama when he stood up and shut down the Dakota Access pipeline for an environmental review (finally).
I figured Trump would do something insidious like this. I hope the protesters keep up the fight, and all of us do what we can to protect our future.
I figured Trump would do something insidious like this. I hope the protesters keep up the fight, and all of us do what we can to protect our future.
14
I was so proud of Obama when he stood up and shut down the Dakota Access pipeline for an environmental review (finally).
==================
An environmental review in compliance with the National Environmental Policy Act had already been completed for DAP and a permit issued for it and 90% of the pipeline already built when Obama interfered in the process to stop it. It was political grandstanding intended to help Clinton and it failed
==================
An environmental review in compliance with the National Environmental Policy Act had already been completed for DAP and a permit issued for it and 90% of the pipeline already built when Obama interfered in the process to stop it. It was political grandstanding intended to help Clinton and it failed
1
The Keystone pipeline....could ruin the water supply for hundreds of US
Citizens....and violate the territory of Native American sacred lands as well.
I hope that Republicans have the sense to vote against this potential long
term disaster....
Even today there has been another horrendous North American oil spill .
The Exxon Valdez taught us that we cannot afford to take risks to our
water supply and to the danger to the livelihoods of those who must endure
the effects of an oil spill....
There are other ways that are safe to export crude oil and natural gas....other
than traversing land that holds a huge supply of fresh potable water.
Citizens....and violate the territory of Native American sacred lands as well.
I hope that Republicans have the sense to vote against this potential long
term disaster....
Even today there has been another horrendous North American oil spill .
The Exxon Valdez taught us that we cannot afford to take risks to our
water supply and to the danger to the livelihoods of those who must endure
the effects of an oil spill....
There are other ways that are safe to export crude oil and natural gas....other
than traversing land that holds a huge supply of fresh potable water.
10
Donald seems hellbent to take actions that will confirm all the fears of the millions that marched on Saturday, and cement his reputation as one of the most unpopular Presidents ever.
10
Madonna & Michael Moore, oyvey!
1
Trump is neither a politician nor a ideologue. But he is trapped and surrounded by the extreme right wing politicians and pundits. As he is ignorant about policy matters, his advisers are pushing the right wing agenda. Election has consequences. The Democrats, liberals, African-Americans and Bernie supporters did not understand. The Middle class low income Trump voters will realize very soon that the moon and stars promised by Trump were just get their votes. Unfortunately, their economic condition will not change either.
6
I agree, Ashraf .The man has various personality disorders and is being used by the extreme right.
Trump is not the President. He is a puppet_president and Bannon is pulling the strings.
Trump is not the President. He is a puppet_president and Bannon is pulling the strings.
2
Contrary to the rage expressed by the other readers, I found the former administration's actions to be inexplicable and mere pandering to President Obama's supporters.
Though one might argue that the oil sands would be best left untouched, our canadian neighbors felt differently. They choose to develop them and to export them to and through the US largely using our preexisting pipeline system. The pipeline passed the environmental, historical, State Department reviews etc. Only at the last moment after slow walking the approval for 7 years did the president act as was his prerogative . Of course, only 40 plus canadians we incinerated during a derailment of a oil carrying train. Now a president disagrees and reverses. What is the problem?
Likewise, the Dakota access pipeline brings american oil (much from the Madden's Reservation (the tribe that the Standing Rock Tribe displaced) If one reads the opinion authored by Obama appointee James Boasberg and affirmed by the DC Circuit Court, one would find that the water supply was not under threat, the pipeline would not interfere with any cultural objects since it was off thje Standing Rock Reservation and used the same right of way that an existing pipeline to which the Tribe raised no objection.
Though one might argue that the oil sands would be best left untouched, our canadian neighbors felt differently. They choose to develop them and to export them to and through the US largely using our preexisting pipeline system. The pipeline passed the environmental, historical, State Department reviews etc. Only at the last moment after slow walking the approval for 7 years did the president act as was his prerogative . Of course, only 40 plus canadians we incinerated during a derailment of a oil carrying train. Now a president disagrees and reverses. What is the problem?
Likewise, the Dakota access pipeline brings american oil (much from the Madden's Reservation (the tribe that the Standing Rock Tribe displaced) If one reads the opinion authored by Obama appointee James Boasberg and affirmed by the DC Circuit Court, one would find that the water supply was not under threat, the pipeline would not interfere with any cultural objects since it was off thje Standing Rock Reservation and used the same right of way that an existing pipeline to which the Tribe raised no objection.
14
Please, John, don't put all Canadians in the same basket. MANY do not like the tar-sands ,believe me.
( Oh god, I can't even write "Believe me " any more for fear of sounding like Trump !)
( Oh god, I can't even write "Believe me " any more for fear of sounding like Trump !)
2
We should build the pipeline because it will help Canadian energy producers? So much for 'America First.'
We should build the pipeline because it will help Canadian energy producers? So much for 'America First.'
==============
We should build the pipeline because Canadian companies will pay Americans to build it, because Canadian companies will pay property tax to American counties where the pipeline is located and Canadian companies will pay American refineries to refine the oil
So yeah, America first.
==============
We should build the pipeline because Canadian companies will pay Americans to build it, because Canadian companies will pay property tax to American counties where the pipeline is located and Canadian companies will pay American refineries to refine the oil
So yeah, America first.
This pipeline is controversial for sure. However, I much prefer that we here in the United States supply our own oil needs as much as possible as opposed to the Middle East.
Take care of the surrounding environment as best as possible while at the same time make us energy independent as much as possible. Crude/gasoline is still very much in the cards for a number of unknown years as of this writing. Better we here in the USA supply it.
Take care of the surrounding environment as best as possible while at the same time make us energy independent as much as possible. Crude/gasoline is still very much in the cards for a number of unknown years as of this writing. Better we here in the USA supply it.
5
Why? Tired reasoning. Gas is too cheap.
2
Please note that "he we here in the United States supply our own oil needs as much as possible" means, with respect to the Keystone Pipeline Canadian oil and not all Canadians, myself included, are inclined to want to supp;y your needs at our environmental expense.
3
But Billy, the XL pipeline will not carry American oil.
And the oil it does carry will be sold around the world, not in the US.
And nobody is going to be 'taking care' of the environment, unless you mean in a mob hit sort of way.
And the oil it does carry will be sold around the world, not in the US.
And nobody is going to be 'taking care' of the environment, unless you mean in a mob hit sort of way.
2
The Dakota Access Pipeline protestors aren’t representative of Native America. For every Native American protesting the pipeline, thousands of Native Americans are accepting oil and gas leases and drawing oil and gas royalties. The pipeline protestors aren’t even representative of North Dakota’s tribal people. North Dakota’s Fort Berthold Reservation has more than 1,700 oil and gas leases. Since drilling began in the Bakken Formation a few year ago, these leases have generated more than $80 million in Indian Bureau bonus payments to the Mandan, Hidatsa, and Arikara, the tribes the Sioux pushed off their land in the mid-1700s. Today, they are known as the Three Affiliated Tribes. Unsatisfied with lease and royalty revenue, the three tribes recently formed their own oil and gas production company named Missouri River Resources. It began drilling wells in 2015 and is now producing 1,000 barrels per day. It recently brought up leases on 3,000 acres alongside the Missouri River.
7
This could be true. But the people of Standing Rock do not want a pipeline underneath their water supply and near their heritage sites. The people of Bismarck objected to having the same pipeline in their back yard and it was rerouted. It's only fair that the people of Standing Rock can do the same. Reroute the pipeline elsewhere.
5
I wonder if Canada will require that the Kinder Morgan pipeline, a similar sized pipeline that has been approved by the federal government to be built in Canada by an American company must have all its steel fabricated in Canada?
3
They could make it out of wood from all their clearcuts.
1
The pipelines will deliver oil to refineries in the Gulf, and the gasoline will then be exported. Being able to more efficiently deliver gasoline to the global market (pipelines are the cheapest way to move oil) will increase profits for the oil companies. This means that more fuel will leave the United States. The result will be a greater dependency—not less—on oil imports and higher gasoline prices in the U.S. In simplistic terms think of North America as a giant bathtub full of oil. When the plug, the pipeline, is pulled, the oil will drain into the global market.
6
I'm so done with this kind of tired reasoning. It just sickens me.
2
Even though the fuel will be exported, it would add suppy to the global market, and Economics 101 teaches that increased supply lowers prices.
2
So wind and solar projects do not create jobs? I bet they would need more American steel and skilled labor to build the infrastructure that this country needs, and it is an investment for the future. But instead, we pick the easier one, the one that makes a bigger splash at the cost of our planet.
Trump doesn't have any original ideas. He is going to play by the book of Republicans to put on a show of getting things done. Unfortunately, this and freezing the communications from EPA/NPS are going to be bad news for nature. It is unprecedented and unpresidential at the same time. US is one of the biggest emitters of greenhouse gases. It is sad and scary that this guy gets to decide the future of the entire planet.
Trump doesn't have any original ideas. He is going to play by the book of Republicans to put on a show of getting things done. Unfortunately, this and freezing the communications from EPA/NPS are going to be bad news for nature. It is unprecedented and unpresidential at the same time. US is one of the biggest emitters of greenhouse gases. It is sad and scary that this guy gets to decide the future of the entire planet.
21
Thank you New York Times for informed discussion of this latest controversy. In the age of drones, chem trails, fracking & hacking it is challenging for theater artists to begin to stage works about these issues. Constructive creativity must address the problems in an objective, yet unorthodox way. The atectonic slant perceives the mythology of Native Americans being defied. Protesters allege the rapes of both Mother Earth & Mother Nature. Now is the time for all the stand up for values whether pro or con with Trump. We are assaulted by imagery. Deafened by sound bites. Blinded by tweets. A new language & new modes of expression are needed to imaginatively compose works about the complex issues--territorial & environmental. Artists must challenge forces, recognize permutations of accelerated change & weave through labyrinthine feedback loops. Theater arts must create nuanced inclusive considerations. Our work has just begun.
2
Here's what I don't get: DJT says he's a negotiator, and he says he's the president for all Americans. So where's the deal here? He could have sat down with both sides and worked out a compromise if he's such a great dealmaker. So, it's clear that he's in the pocket of his oil and gas buddies. They're getting a great deal here.
17
Here's what I don't get: DJT says he's a negotiator, and he says he's the president for all Americans. So where's the deal here? He could have sat down with both sides and worked out a compromise if he's such a great dealmaker.
==============
The "deal" here is the rule of law. On both DAP and Keystone, environmental reviews in accordance with NEPA had been completed and these recommended the construction of the pipelines. In the case of DAP a permit had even been issued and 90% of the pipeline built.
Obama inserted himself in the process to cancel Keystone and disrupt the mostly built DAP.
You can't expect companies to follow all the environmental rules and spend billions of dollars on investments when a president can stop their projects on a whim
==============
The "deal" here is the rule of law. On both DAP and Keystone, environmental reviews in accordance with NEPA had been completed and these recommended the construction of the pipelines. In the case of DAP a permit had even been issued and 90% of the pipeline built.
Obama inserted himself in the process to cancel Keystone and disrupt the mostly built DAP.
You can't expect companies to follow all the environmental rules and spend billions of dollars on investments when a president can stop their projects on a whim
1
Trump has no idea what he is in for on this.
12
he hasnt much idea of anything except how to enrich himself at others expense
until now, those others were business associates
now, its the american public
and he has total power
have a nice day
1
First thing I thought .Big trouble. UN.
1
These pipelines these pipelines run through poor communities and impact Native Americans. This is a crime and we must protect all and protest this disregard for human life. After republicans poisoned Flint, I fear them more than ISIS. It's crazy to bring back coal fired plants. It's crazy to go back to the past.
13
"Mr. Trump owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners, the company that is building the Dakota Access pipeline", you guys just wont give up will you? Do you understand that Obama was invested in Index Funds which possess the largest companies in America? His free trade deals heavily encourage profit margins, which than leads to an increase in stock price, the biggest companies in the USA are the ones that benefit and those who own their stock do as well. Can we please stop with the trivial games?
3
I didn't know the global climate and basic journalism were trivial.
If you're talking about the TPP and TTIP and their friends, though, then yeah, we can all agree they were worse than trash, which at least can be incinerated into an extra source of energy or rummaged for historical value.
I don't see how the new not-my-President improves on that though.
If you're talking about the TPP and TTIP and their friends, though, then yeah, we can all agree they were worse than trash, which at least can be incinerated into an extra source of energy or rummaged for historical value.
I don't see how the new not-my-President improves on that though.
1
Index funds are not the same as direct stock ownership. Plenty of elected officials have investments in index funds. The are encouraged to do that because you can't predict what effect your actions as a legislator might specifically have any any one entity within that fund.
5
My dad always said that if you really want to know about something, follow the money. A lot of talk about the environment, but I did not read any in-depth reporting on who will profit. I can read and hear the arguments on TV and elsewhere. I am hoping that the NYTimes starts investing in some real investigational reporting.
22
Rich environmentalists and democrats against jobs. No wonder the democrats have lost power.
10
Yeah, those native Americans are filthy rich.
4
Noit at all. You'll notice that President Obama cut the unemployment rate in half and created hundred of thousands more jobs than when he took over from eight disastrous years of Bush.
Real fact, not "alternative" fact: While building the pipline will create 10,000 temporary jobs, it will create only 50 permanent ones. It will leave a degraded environment for us, our kids and generations to come. I'd rather see those 10,000 temporary jobs in construction of infrastructure: modernized airports, rehabilitated railroads and roads, alternative and far-less-destructive energy sources. Trump's move seems calculated to do nothing more than appease his oil buddies and get into the face of anyone who doesn't support him. Seriously, how can a US president get away with calling the majority of patriotic American voters and others who aren't to the hard right "the enemy"?!?
As to why Democrats lost power - gerrymandered districts, interference by James Comey and selective hacking by Russia. And Hillary Clinton, flawed candidate that she was, STILL got almost 3,000,000 more votes than Trump.
PS - Most environmentalists I know who don't head large organizations are far, far away from "the 1%." Just a little fact check for you.
Real fact, not "alternative" fact: While building the pipline will create 10,000 temporary jobs, it will create only 50 permanent ones. It will leave a degraded environment for us, our kids and generations to come. I'd rather see those 10,000 temporary jobs in construction of infrastructure: modernized airports, rehabilitated railroads and roads, alternative and far-less-destructive energy sources. Trump's move seems calculated to do nothing more than appease his oil buddies and get into the face of anyone who doesn't support him. Seriously, how can a US president get away with calling the majority of patriotic American voters and others who aren't to the hard right "the enemy"?!?
As to why Democrats lost power - gerrymandered districts, interference by James Comey and selective hacking by Russia. And Hillary Clinton, flawed candidate that she was, STILL got almost 3,000,000 more votes than Trump.
PS - Most environmentalists I know who don't head large organizations are far, far away from "the 1%." Just a little fact check for you.
20
Claiming that Obama cut the unemployment rate is akin to giving a rooster credit for the sun rise.
5
All I can say is that I would rather have our boys building a pipeline in North America than fighting in the Middle East. The faster we get to where we export large quantities of oil/natural gas, the more we put Putin in a box.
10
May I respectfully suggest a rewrite of your comments? "...I would rather have our boys building needed infrastructure like roads, railroads, bridges, tunnels and new electric and sewer systems in North America than fighting in the Middle East. The faster we get to where we become self-sufficient with alternative energy like wind and solar which is non-invasive to the earth, the more we put Putin in a box and the cleaner the air is for us and our families and those who'll inherit the earth after we're gone."
There - that answers your concern. Better, isn't it?
There - that answers your concern. Better, isn't it?
15
Just because she doesn't see things the way you do, that doesn't mean she "should" rewrite her comment.
And they say conservatives are arrogant. Wow.
And they say conservatives are arrogant. Wow.
7
Sally, why not have our boys (and girls, my niece made Captain) built HVDC transmission lines from the Plains to the markets east and west, and electrify our vehicles with wind and solar.
The faster we get to where no societies are addicted to any fossil fuels, the sooner all the governments that rule through fossil addiction will be forced to change. Putting more oil into the market won't stop Saudi Arabia's dominance enough to change any petro-politics. Putting more natural gas onto ships won't negate Russia's lower costs to Europe.
But if people just stop needing the fuels, multiple nations get energy independence. Multiple bad actors lose their funding. Water and air gets cleaner. Sea level won't rise as much, and ocean chemistry won't change as much as if we let this addiction linger a moment more than barest necessity.
The faster we get to where no societies are addicted to any fossil fuels, the sooner all the governments that rule through fossil addiction will be forced to change. Putting more oil into the market won't stop Saudi Arabia's dominance enough to change any petro-politics. Putting more natural gas onto ships won't negate Russia's lower costs to Europe.
But if people just stop needing the fuels, multiple nations get energy independence. Multiple bad actors lose their funding. Water and air gets cleaner. Sea level won't rise as much, and ocean chemistry won't change as much as if we let this addiction linger a moment more than barest necessity.
4
This is all about wiping out anything that says OBAMA. It is not about what is best for the country; a witch hunt if there was ever one. He never got him on the birther issue but now he has another way.
31
Interesting you mention Obama, the president who did more things against the US Constitution and the will of the people (as vested in elected members of Congress) than any president in memory.
1
This guy is in a great big hurry to destroy our planet. He thinks he's smarter than the world's climate scientists.Once the Arctic melts, all bets are off. If we want a stable climate, we need action immediately. Waiting 4 years will be too late.
Trump is a climate criminal.
Trump is a climate criminal.
28
Is that you Al?
2
Trump probably thinks he's smarter than my cat. Period.
How can we expect a person, Trump, or a group of people, GOP, who have no regard for human beings other than themselves give a hoot about the environment?
Studies have shown that the number of jobs created by completing this pipeline are transient at best and once it is completed only a handful of jobs will remain to maintain the pipeline. If there is a massive leak or breech of the pipeline that may create a few more temporary jobs.
Studies have shown that the number of jobs created by completing this pipeline are transient at best and once it is completed only a handful of jobs will remain to maintain the pipeline. If there is a massive leak or breech of the pipeline that may create a few more temporary jobs.
14
Studies have shown that the number of jobs created by completing this pipeline are transient at best and once it is completed only a handful of jobs will remain to maintain the pipeline.
====================
All infrastructure projects are like that. Are you saying we shouldn't build bridges because they don't result in permanent jobs?
====================
All infrastructure projects are like that. Are you saying we shouldn't build bridges because they don't result in permanent jobs?
Not sure you've thought this through:
"By the way the oil companies don't want the pipeline, we currently have a glut. And there's a YUGE surplus of natural gas."
True, because oil prices have been low, oil companies haven't been chafing at the bit to get the pipeline built. They've focused more on efforts to jack up the price they can get for their oil-- such as their successful effort to persuade Obama and the US Congress to do away with that long-standing and annoying prohibition on exports of US petroleum products. After all, when you have a surplus of oil and natural gas, and you can only sell it in the US, prices probably will be much lower than you like. It will be a "buyer's market" -- supply far in excess of demand. But if you can sell your oil in Europe, or Japan, or wherever you like – because Obama and the US Congress have helped you out by doing away with that silly prohibition against exporting US petroleum products -- prices are likely to rise.
That's a great result if you're an oil company -- not so great if you're a US consumer that now has to pay higher prices because the oil companies will sell to the Europeans and Japanese if US consumers won't pay up.
"By the way the oil companies don't want the pipeline, we currently have a glut. And there's a YUGE surplus of natural gas."
True, because oil prices have been low, oil companies haven't been chafing at the bit to get the pipeline built. They've focused more on efforts to jack up the price they can get for their oil-- such as their successful effort to persuade Obama and the US Congress to do away with that long-standing and annoying prohibition on exports of US petroleum products. After all, when you have a surplus of oil and natural gas, and you can only sell it in the US, prices probably will be much lower than you like. It will be a "buyer's market" -- supply far in excess of demand. But if you can sell your oil in Europe, or Japan, or wherever you like – because Obama and the US Congress have helped you out by doing away with that silly prohibition against exporting US petroleum products -- prices are likely to rise.
That's a great result if you're an oil company -- not so great if you're a US consumer that now has to pay higher prices because the oil companies will sell to the Europeans and Japanese if US consumers won't pay up.
3
The Keystone pipeline will pass through Republican states, let them deal with the spills!
6
"Republican" rivers also flow into "Democratic" states. I agree with your frustration, not your remedy.
2
The Republicans should rename themselves the anti-Obama party, or perhaps the anti-liberal party. They have no positive ideas themselves.
13
What, like creating jobs ?
6
Piotr
No. Like mindlessly supporting the corporations that send jobs overseas, cut payrolls ruthlessly, automate wherever possible, and renege on health and retirement commitments at the drop of a hat while also cutting social supports and and taxes on the ungodly rich.
Poland, indeed.
No. Like mindlessly supporting the corporations that send jobs overseas, cut payrolls ruthlessly, automate wherever possible, and renege on health and retirement commitments at the drop of a hat while also cutting social supports and and taxes on the ungodly rich.
Poland, indeed.
3
Piotr,
Obama saved and created hundreds of thousands of jobs, with unemployment down from nearly 10% when he started to less than 5% now. Trump creating jobs in manufacturing and mining? Seeing is believing...
Obama saved and created hundreds of thousands of jobs, with unemployment down from nearly 10% when he started to less than 5% now. Trump creating jobs in manufacturing and mining? Seeing is believing...
Oil is safer if shipped by pipeline than it is by rail. It's going to go to the international market anyway. The real point is presidential edicts. I don't want presidents making rules on a whim or in false economic or ecological values. There is an oil glut it affects many countries economic health. Why we are harvesting oil in Canada rather than Mexico might make a good investigatIive assignment. Many offshore rigs are sitting idle in the Gulf. So it follows oil won't be drilled off the east coast or artic but don't you think it should be available? Or do you think punishing people who use petroleum make economic sense. Unless oil drops to five dollars a barrel build it.
12
Canada sends its filthy tar sand across the United States because they don't want to take a chance on polluting their land and water. The Republican mantra of drill and dig only sees the short term profit. Non renewable resources need to be reserved not exploited. Once they are gone, and they WILL be gone, there will be no substitute for their unique properties.
Renewable energy offers the promise of good, clean jobs and clean energy. If our policy keeps looking backward, trying to recreate an era that is gone, we will lose our place in the world. We and the world will be poorer for it.
Renewable energy offers the promise of good, clean jobs and clean energy. If our policy keeps looking backward, trying to recreate an era that is gone, we will lose our place in the world. We and the world will be poorer for it.
6
The real point is presidential edicts. I don't want presidents making rules on a whim or in false economic or ecological values.
==============
Frankly both these projects had completed environmental review and had been recommended for construction. DAP had already been issued a permit and started construction.
The only one operating on a whim was Obama, when he refused to approve Keystone and stopped DAP
==============
Frankly both these projects had completed environmental review and had been recommended for construction. DAP had already been issued a permit and started construction.
The only one operating on a whim was Obama, when he refused to approve Keystone and stopped DAP
1
People who continue to advocate extracting, refining, and burning fossil fuels fail to notice that, just as important as climate change which they deny, fossil fuel uses are toxic to humans. Breathing particulates causes disease and death. Mining runoff and plastics in our waterways and the sea are poisoning and degrading that most important resource that provides us with oxygen and nutrition. Continuing this practice when better ways are now available is just plain madness supporting self-destructive greed. Ignoring these truths is inexcusable at all levels.
Would DJT have approved this pipeline if it was running by Mar a Lago? or one of golf courses? DJT, You are treading on native Americans's protected lands! And destroying environment for ever. I challenge DJT to build a golf course or a Trump palace next to one of oil slicked, ravaged wrecked places. What a hypocrite.
SHAME ON YOU, DJT!
YOU ARE NOT MY PRESIDENT, NEVER WILL BE!
SHAME ON YOU, DJT!
YOU ARE NOT MY PRESIDENT, NEVER WILL BE!
22
And what about this from The Guardian US. Is it unlawful?
"Jan Hasselman, a lawyer representing the tribe, said that Trump had “unlawfully and arbitrarily sidestepped” the findings of the previous administration."
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/24/standing-rock-resistance...
"Jan Hasselman, a lawyer representing the tribe, said that Trump had “unlawfully and arbitrarily sidestepped” the findings of the previous administration."
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/24/standing-rock-resistance...
10
And what about this from The Guardian US. Is it unlawful?
"Jan Hasselman, a lawyer representing the tribe, said that Trump had “unlawfully and arbitrarily sidestepped” the findings of the previous administration."
===================
It's completely legal. Frankly Obama sidestepped the findings of the USACE that had approved DAP and issued the permit. The tribe sued to stop it and had already lost in court.
"Jan Hasselman, a lawyer representing the tribe, said that Trump had “unlawfully and arbitrarily sidestepped” the findings of the previous administration."
===================
It's completely legal. Frankly Obama sidestepped the findings of the USACE that had approved DAP and issued the permit. The tribe sued to stop it and had already lost in court.
1
Oil supplies are high and projected to remain so for some time:
https://www.eia.gov/outlooks/steo/report/global_oil.cfm
Revenues are relatively low.
Why build a pipeline for extremely expensive (I will not mention destructive) tar sands oil when there is a surplus and prices are low.
Today a pipeline burst in Saskatchewan, spilling over 200 thousand gallons.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/stoughton-oil-spill-cleanup-1...
In July, a spill in Saskatchewan left cities still without clean drinking water.https://www.thestar.com/business/2016/10/27/husky-says-response-to-saska...
Pipelines are not safe for water supplies. We don't need this expensive method right now.
Invest in renewables, as China is doing. Fund new industries in the old coal counties.
Solar. Now.. #sevengeneraations
https://www.eia.gov/outlooks/steo/report/global_oil.cfm
Revenues are relatively low.
Why build a pipeline for extremely expensive (I will not mention destructive) tar sands oil when there is a surplus and prices are low.
Today a pipeline burst in Saskatchewan, spilling over 200 thousand gallons.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/stoughton-oil-spill-cleanup-1...
In July, a spill in Saskatchewan left cities still without clean drinking water.https://www.thestar.com/business/2016/10/27/husky-says-response-to-saska...
Pipelines are not safe for water supplies. We don't need this expensive method right now.
Invest in renewables, as China is doing. Fund new industries in the old coal counties.
Solar. Now.. #sevengeneraations
12
...and hydro where available, too. And wind. We don't need to hurt the earth to live on it.
6
And so it begins. Trump has a financial interest in the Keystone Pipeline. How great we do not know because his taxes and financial dealings remain shady and hidden. Welcome to the kakistocracy. Government of, for and by the rich man, seeking to line his own pockets. How is anyone to know when his actions are mere self-interest or taken in the interest of his so called "people". Kellyanne says we'll never see his taxes so we're left to guess. I'm guessing Trump is only interested in himself, as history suggests.
16
This man is doing what ever e pleases. He follows no rules, and he is dismantling the country. It is rumored that he owes china $500M along with some other people. If so will we know when it is US interest vs his personal interest. Why cant we see his tax returns.
5
Kakistocracy = government by the worst possible people .
1
And so it begins. Trump has a financial interest in the Keystone Pipeline.
=================
If you own any mutual funds you probably have a financial interest too
=================
If you own any mutual funds you probably have a financial interest too
1
Make Canadia Great Again!
6
If that means allowing Canadian companies to spend billions of dollars in the US economy for their projects, well yes!
1
To all those who voted for the Green Party......see what it got you? When will you learn?
14
That's ridiculous blaming the green party for Hillary's. She's responsible. Could n't bother to campaign.
7
Fact check: except in very few instances, either "third party" this year did not swing the election.
5
He's just being spiteful and is getting even with all his enemies. Remember, all those demonstrators last Saturday are his enemies, as are all the people who didn't vote for him; he hasn't gotten to them yet.
Maybe he has? Maybe he wants to pollute the environment more to spite them and in his pettiness he'll take everyone down with them? What is in this man's brain? He is literally toppling any positive gain we achieved in the last eight years. These is not carefully thought out solutions to our problems, this is just willful destruction to gratify the Cheeze Doodles' ego.
Pretty soon he won't need the artificial skin color he applies to his face because we'll all turn orange from the chemicals in our environment.
Will someone tell him to think of his grandchildren?
Maybe he has? Maybe he wants to pollute the environment more to spite them and in his pettiness he'll take everyone down with them? What is in this man's brain? He is literally toppling any positive gain we achieved in the last eight years. These is not carefully thought out solutions to our problems, this is just willful destruction to gratify the Cheeze Doodles' ego.
Pretty soon he won't need the artificial skin color he applies to his face because we'll all turn orange from the chemicals in our environment.
Will someone tell him to think of his grandchildren?
6
Trump has a direct conflict of interest with owning stocks in one of the companies operating on the Keystone Pipeline. I hope to hear another lawsuit filed in Federal Court regarding this. Folks, if we need something to march about this is it. There is presently a glut of oil and natural gas, these pipelines are not needed, and thirdly, didn't the brave native americans and others just spend months drawing the line on the pipeline potentially threatening their water supply to their reservation? I guess Trump needs to see how many of the 324 million of us will need to mobilize to stop these injustices. Just wait for the Supreme Court nominees; especially if Merrick B Garland doesn't receive his Constitutionally mandated hearing.
9
This was still an issue and concern?
Oh look at you, tough guy. Yes, it was still a concern. Read the paper once in a while.
1
Naive?
"Pipelines are not used to transport [tar sands] oil to the East Coast [of Canada], it is mostly transported by rail. Opposition to construction of pipelines to the West Coast by First Nations groups have effectively blocked that route."
True, pipelines aren't used to transport tar sands oil to the East Coast (of Canada) because it's been unclear whether the main pipeline would be built through Canada or the US. In the meantime, tar sands oil is being transported by truck and rail to the Canadian coasts (where reside most of the people who use that oil).
It's easy for Canadian politicians to claim their opposition to pipelines reflects their support of "First Nations groups." But if oil prices suddenly double and oil companies start leaning on Canadian politicians, support for Native Americans will disappear in a New York minute. Just as Obama knuckled under to US oil producers who pushed him (and Congress) to end the long-standing prohibition of US petroleum exports, so would Canadian politicians quickly find a way to approve a pipeline through Canada – east, west, or both ways. In fact, now that Trump has revived the Keystone XL pipeline, it's all but certain that the business people behind the proposed Canada pipelines will be pushing very hard for those pipelines to be approved. Low oil prices have sufficed to make that unnecessary, but now it is. And when that happens, rest assured that Canadian politicians won't pay much attention to Native Americans.
"Pipelines are not used to transport [tar sands] oil to the East Coast [of Canada], it is mostly transported by rail. Opposition to construction of pipelines to the West Coast by First Nations groups have effectively blocked that route."
True, pipelines aren't used to transport tar sands oil to the East Coast (of Canada) because it's been unclear whether the main pipeline would be built through Canada or the US. In the meantime, tar sands oil is being transported by truck and rail to the Canadian coasts (where reside most of the people who use that oil).
It's easy for Canadian politicians to claim their opposition to pipelines reflects their support of "First Nations groups." But if oil prices suddenly double and oil companies start leaning on Canadian politicians, support for Native Americans will disappear in a New York minute. Just as Obama knuckled under to US oil producers who pushed him (and Congress) to end the long-standing prohibition of US petroleum exports, so would Canadian politicians quickly find a way to approve a pipeline through Canada – east, west, or both ways. In fact, now that Trump has revived the Keystone XL pipeline, it's all but certain that the business people behind the proposed Canada pipelines will be pushing very hard for those pipelines to be approved. Low oil prices have sufficed to make that unnecessary, but now it is. And when that happens, rest assured that Canadian politicians won't pay much attention to Native Americans.
a significant portion of First Nations groups support responsible resource development including both oil sands and pipelines - a 'fact' - not a narrative - easily demonstrable. The First Nations groups are not monolithic - and benefit from resource development and are fully supportive.
4
Elections have consequences.
2
Oooh, thanks, tough guy! Sorry but your little quip doesn't mean much outside Trump's little realm of sycophants. The rest of us have to deal with the consequences of this clown's idiocy.
2
He alone can fix it.
Now...where did I put my valium?
Now...where did I put my valium?
4
All you folks that didn't vote for him, isn't it about time for another march? Gee, it looks like he is actually doing what he said he would during the campaign. Oh the horror!
6
It's time for another lawsuit. It's time to get our elected representatives lined up against him - or recall them. Yes, he is doing what he said he'd do and what those of us who voted against him warned people about. Shame on the Trump voters who should have known better.
2
I don't see any jobs yet and I don't see any coming. Oh wait, unless it's at the sake of environmental regulation, which any President without a soul or a concern for future generations could produce. I also don't see a wall paid for by Mexico. I do a see a projected 10 trillion dollar increase in the debt. Keep celebrating though.
4
I like what Madonna said. Period.
Trump campaigned almost like an independent--promising to go against the Republican Party and stand on his own two feet. As you can see thus far he is an autocratic puppet for the right wing conservative agenda.
What's up next? Failed promises on Medicare, Social Security and Medicaid? Who would have thought this proud autocrat would have so little backbone. So much for Mr. Tough Guy!!
What's up next? Failed promises on Medicare, Social Security and Medicaid? Who would have thought this proud autocrat would have so little backbone. So much for Mr. Tough Guy!!
9
Ken
Look at the man. There's not much room for a backbone, is there? Be nice.
Look at the man. There's not much room for a backbone, is there? Be nice.
3
Next week he's reviving buggy whip production.
13
Democrats--who hold themselves out to be protectors of the Middle Class--will of course oppose these pipelines--and the jobs middle class workers will gain from their construction.
4
Having light sweet crude and kerosene in your family's drinking water is a great trade-off for a job lasting 18 months. "Freedom" means killing your family and neighbors slowly for a temporary, ephemeral profit.
16
Jesse, 10,000 TEMPORARY jobs and 50 permanent ones? Think of how much desperately-needed infrastructure could be build by those 10,000 workers - the new roads, railways, bridges, tunnels, more efficient energy transmission systems, sewers that aren't 100+ yars old and crumbling...
We can be energy independent integrating solar, wind and water power into our mix - and we don't hurt the earth or the atmosphere. To me, THAT is true conservatism.
We can be energy independent integrating solar, wind and water power into our mix - and we don't hurt the earth or the atmosphere. To me, THAT is true conservatism.
3
esse, 10,000 TEMPORARY jobs and 50 permanent ones? Think of how much desperately-needed infrastructure could be build by those 10,000 workers - the new roads, railways, bridges, tunnels, more efficient energy transmission systems, sewers that aren't 100+ yars old and crumbling..
===================
Your roads, railways, bridges etc don't result in permanent jobs, either. Not to mention the fact that the pipelines are built with private money and your project examples are built with taxes
===================
Your roads, railways, bridges etc don't result in permanent jobs, either. Not to mention the fact that the pipelines are built with private money and your project examples are built with taxes
1
President Trump has not made a single decision of which I would approve. That said, Keystone has always been a political football. As the Democratic analyst said, any impact it would have would be more symbolic that substantive, either positive or negative. Energy security is a goal worth pursuing, especially when the proceeds of the pipeline would benefit a neighboring democracy with shared values and beliefs.
The oil will be sold to China if we refuse it, so where is the environmental gain? We would burn it in devices that would be far cleaner and efficient than theirs. Build the pipeline, and allow us continue to wean ourselves off of oil from despotic regimes.
The oil will be sold to China if we refuse it, so where is the environmental gain? We would burn it in devices that would be far cleaner and efficient than theirs. Build the pipeline, and allow us continue to wean ourselves off of oil from despotic regimes.
1
The New York Times should really set up a Trump Corner: Tweets 'n Lies 'n Gotcha's
7
"The Lies of Donald Trump" could be one of the weekly inserts in the Sunday paper.
Or just report if he EVER tells the truth, that would save a lot of ink.
10
You miss the key point:
"Ultimately, we are going to need to keep a significant fraction of our fossil fuel reserves in the ground to avoid catastrophic climate change..."
Many oil companies would happily leave their oil in the ground -- if someone would reimburse them for the high prices they paid for that ground. If "we" want them to leave the oil in the ground, "we" are going to have to pay them to do so. It's not going to work simply to say the oil companies are evil fat cats and so they should bear that cost.
I'm all for some gradual -- gradual -- increase in extraction costs, including through some tax that very gradually increases. If owners of oil reserves understand that it will cost them more and more and more to extract their oil, they'll pay less for oil-producing lands. But until that happens, simply to decree suddenly that oil companies are evil fat cats and thus should bear the cost of "our" decision that less oil should be used, is not only unfair but will never happen. If "we" want less oil to be used, "we" must be prepared to bear the cost of that -- or else shift that cost to others very, very gradually.
"Ultimately, we are going to need to keep a significant fraction of our fossil fuel reserves in the ground to avoid catastrophic climate change..."
Many oil companies would happily leave their oil in the ground -- if someone would reimburse them for the high prices they paid for that ground. If "we" want them to leave the oil in the ground, "we" are going to have to pay them to do so. It's not going to work simply to say the oil companies are evil fat cats and so they should bear that cost.
I'm all for some gradual -- gradual -- increase in extraction costs, including through some tax that very gradually increases. If owners of oil reserves understand that it will cost them more and more and more to extract their oil, they'll pay less for oil-producing lands. But until that happens, simply to decree suddenly that oil companies are evil fat cats and thus should bear the cost of "our" decision that less oil should be used, is not only unfair but will never happen. If "we" want less oil to be used, "we" must be prepared to bear the cost of that -- or else shift that cost to others very, very gradually.
2
Finally, "evidence based decisions", not based on goofy political views, or innacurate claims by environmental wackos. Keeping oil from being transported by unsafe tanker trucks and railroads to avoid spills and terrible accidents.
9
We have an oil glut. Half of Texas oil field workers or more were let go. Have the pipeline in your water supply before you volunteer it for a rural area. Good God.
7
What evidence?
9
What evidence? What goofy political views? Please explain.
2
How long are congressional Republicans going to be willing participants in Trump's profiting from executive orders? Trump has a vested interest in the Keystone pipeline. What does this president have to do to cross the line of the constitutional emoluments clause? We know that Trump's mission is to test the limits of his power. Let's hope his own party stops him before his presidency becomes a sham.
15
Take a look at how many Republicans cowered in the background or twisted and turned in the foul wind of his tweets but held on tightly to his coat tails for their careers and themselves. That should give you the measure. It's not good. The few good Republicans who put Country and civic responsibility first will have a fierce uphill battle.
1
My wife and I just watched the video where el -presidente announced the pipeline signing. Honest to God he sounded just like Alec Baldwin. We didn’t know whether to laugh or cry!.
This is a Sarah Palin in a man's suit. God help us all.
By the way the oil companies don't want the pipeline, we currently have a glut. And there's a YUGE surplus of natural gas. And, and the renewable resources i.e. solar are just chugging along building plants all over the southwest, California, and the world.
This is a Sarah Palin in a man's suit. God help us all.
By the way the oil companies don't want the pipeline, we currently have a glut. And there's a YUGE surplus of natural gas. And, and the renewable resources i.e. solar are just chugging along building plants all over the southwest, California, and the world.
38
Somebody needs a lesson in demand and supply.
2
I'm sure that trumps secretary of state is happy that he has revived these disgusting pipelines. This is just one more issue that trump is trying to reverse. Many people will be joining protests against his actions. It is if we are turning back the clock to times when cronyism was more alive and well. Trump does not care on iota about the American people he only cares about himself and his wealthy associates. Trump is out to make America terrible.
10
The Canadians are anxious to send us their boiled tar sands through the Keystone pipeline and make millions, so they're not worried.
The Standing Rock Sioux Tribe is protected by the Army Corps of Engineers from having the pipeline go through the Missouri River near their reservation, so they're not worried.
As the pipeline traverses southward through the heart of America to the Gulf of Mexico, we'll probably have a new EPA chief to protect the rest of us.
Keep in mind: If you like very dirty water, you'll love Scott Pruitt.
The Standing Rock Sioux Tribe is protected by the Army Corps of Engineers from having the pipeline go through the Missouri River near their reservation, so they're not worried.
As the pipeline traverses southward through the heart of America to the Gulf of Mexico, we'll probably have a new EPA chief to protect the rest of us.
Keep in mind: If you like very dirty water, you'll love Scott Pruitt.
14
Any senator that votes for Scott Pruitt should be immediately subjected to a recall vote. It would be like voting to poison yourself.
6
President Trump's energy plan is "all of the above". I believe that his intentions are broad and long term.
A megalomaniac would think not only in terms of reelection in 4 years. He's thinking in terms of a modern family dynasty that may endure for generations. Eight years of Donald. 8 of Ivanna. 8 years of Jared and so on...
For this, he will have to be wildly successful to gain sustainable popularity by achieving demonstrable results. The kind of results that will be required to achieve a dynasty will require bold action and would have to lead to undeniable success. For those reasons I believe President Trump is earnest in his intentions but broadly misunderstood due to the unorthodox methods he uses to achieve his objectives.
1
How is destroying the country misunderstood? How is destroying the democratic process of government and lying about it misunderstood? How does encouraging foreign intervention on his own behalf in elections misunderstood? How is muzzling vital federal agencies misunderstood? How is potentially packing the Supreme Court misunderstood? How is denying women's rights misunderstood? Sorry, Billy, I and millions of others understand all too well.
Far from destroying Obama's legacy Trump is just making him look better and better with every stroke of his pen.
38
Recent News Stories from Europe : Wind Power now runs all electric Trains in the Netherlands, new Facebook data center in Denmark to run on renewable energy, and Sweden is noted for its trash burning system which creates energy. Meanwhile - Stateside- thanks to the "alternative facts" of Donald Trump - we are sliding back into the 19th century complete with the annihilation of Native/First Americans, a focus on Coal - and the continued dependence on dirty fossil fuels like Oil. With the recent major expansion of the crack in the Larsen C ice shelf, I am not sure we can survive this - the polar bears certainly won't.
28
canada may wait until trump renegotiates nafta before shipping a drop.
5
What would you expect from a man whose "daily normal" is dodging dog droppings and sniffing bus fumes his entire 70 years? If his DNA has made him adapt and even thrive in one of the densest, most polluted places on earth, it's scant wonder he sees any value in clean air and water. Perhaps if someone injected 2,000 barrels of crude into the water supplies of Trump Tower and Mar-a-Largo, he might get clue, but perhaps he haves devolved into a new evolutionary form, the 'greed human', where Trump and his Toxic Avengers will join the cockroaches as the last living things on planet Earth.
We can test this theory by throwing him into the Hudson to see if he floats like a duck. That would explain the hair, n'est pas?
We can test this theory by throwing him into the Hudson to see if he floats like a duck. That would explain the hair, n'est pas?
9
Steve, before you slag New York, a very liberal city that might be inclined to agree with you if you stopped throwing mud in its face, please note that the city is cleaner than it has been in decades, as is the Hudson River and the entire estuary area. Perfect? Heck, no, but it didn't get that way overnight. And we in NJ (I'm here, too) have our own issues with The Absentee Governor...but that's a subject for another time....
1
Not very many jobs involved, most may be in Canada. In the past years noticed an interesting feature of "jobs" involved in companies mining fracking sand. While there may be a couple of salaried engineering jobs, the other jobs were all "contractors" with no guarantee of wages, hours or benefits. Now I know all Republicans think none of those things are important, and we should all work ar Arby's, why would we want to foul up our environment for a bunch of Canadian sludge that nobody here will make any money off of other than Trump and his gang? Know the answer to that one.
13
What could be more patriotic than allowing a company named TransCanada to use eminent domain to take the land of American farmers?
20
I really do find our farmers heroic for standing up against the abuse of eminent domain.
6
There are thousands of miles of natural gas, oil, gasoline pipelines...crisscrossing America. A few more will not make any difference--this is just noise. The real challenge is for the US to reduce the 18 million barrels of oil used every day. And Washington is doing nothing to transition to alternate fuels fast enough completely independent of the climate issues associated with fossil fuels. Trump certainly won't alter that equation.
That said, this pipeline may not get built for a long time. The oil companies essentially bypassed the need for the Keystone line a few years ago. With oil prices low, the capital cost is likely prohibitive near term. Plus, refineries in Texas are more equipped to handle heavier oil.
http://www.pipeline101.com/where-are-pipelines-located
That said, this pipeline may not get built for a long time. The oil companies essentially bypassed the need for the Keystone line a few years ago. With oil prices low, the capital cost is likely prohibitive near term. Plus, refineries in Texas are more equipped to handle heavier oil.
http://www.pipeline101.com/where-are-pipelines-located
6
What a shame. The tragedy deepens.
8
The two parties have always had differences, but it is notable that Trump's actions so far have been defined by destruction rather than construction. He is tearing down instead of building up and there is undoubtedly a sniff of vindictiveness in everything he has done so far.
13
Uh....just a reminder for ya, SNA. Building a pipeline is not "tearing down" a pipeline. It will mean jobs--not only for those who will construct the pipeline--but those mining the steel, those turning the steel into pipe, and those transporting the pipe to the job site--as well as those refining the oil. Yeah...I know...that's what Progressives call "trickle down economics"...but it just so happens to be how our country was built.
2
@Jesse tge conservative: And what do we need that oil for? Who will buy it? At what price?
2
Jesse, those jobs are better put into infrastructure construction. It takes steel to build bridges, too. And building a pipeline is tearing down the quality of the one and only earth that we (and our progeny) have to live on.
The Keystone pipeline will pass through Republican states. If they are OK with their new leader's directive, where's the harm?
7
Here's the harm: pollution flows from Republican states into Democratic ones, too. (And by the way, aren't we supposed to be UNITED states?)
This is just the beginning of a wholesale dismantling of the existing protections for our environment. It demonstrates either ignorance of or just ignoring science.
The Trump administration has already removed from whitehouse.gov all web pages pertaining to ANYTHING regarding environmental science & policy.
In it's place you will find the following statements;
"For too long, we’ve been held back by burdensome regulations on our energy industry. President Trump is committed to eliminating harmful and unnecessary policies such as the Climate Action Plan and the Waters of the U.S. rule."
"We must take advantage of the estimated $50 trillion in untapped shale, oil, and natural gas reserves, especially those on federal lands that the American people own."
"The Trump Administration is also committed to clean coal technology, and to reviving America’s coal industry..."
They do provide the obligatory disclaimers at the bottom of this web page;
"Protecting clean air and clean water, conserving our natural habitats, and preserving our natural reserves and resources will remain a high priority."
The promise of protecting the environment is Trump Speak, it actually translates to we're going to remove existing regulations meant to be preventative and when the oils spills happen, or the unchecked fracking pollutes ground water and generates hundreds of earthquakes or we reach critical mass of carbon pollution...well we'll give "high" priority in cleaning all that up some how.
The Trump administration has already removed from whitehouse.gov all web pages pertaining to ANYTHING regarding environmental science & policy.
In it's place you will find the following statements;
"For too long, we’ve been held back by burdensome regulations on our energy industry. President Trump is committed to eliminating harmful and unnecessary policies such as the Climate Action Plan and the Waters of the U.S. rule."
"We must take advantage of the estimated $50 trillion in untapped shale, oil, and natural gas reserves, especially those on federal lands that the American people own."
"The Trump Administration is also committed to clean coal technology, and to reviving America’s coal industry..."
They do provide the obligatory disclaimers at the bottom of this web page;
"Protecting clean air and clean water, conserving our natural habitats, and preserving our natural reserves and resources will remain a high priority."
The promise of protecting the environment is Trump Speak, it actually translates to we're going to remove existing regulations meant to be preventative and when the oils spills happen, or the unchecked fracking pollutes ground water and generates hundreds of earthquakes or we reach critical mass of carbon pollution...well we'll give "high" priority in cleaning all that up some how.
8
Decades ago, Congress outlawed the export of US petroleum, reasoning that we'd be less vulnerable to pressure from foreign oil producers. Congress didn't prohibit the sale of oil products produced here, just their export (and even then, a few exceptions existed).
Recently, though, with fracking having driven down oil prices, many oil companies leaned on Obama and Congress to eliminate this prohibition, and they did, thus enabling US oil companies to sell low-cost fracked oil overseas. No longer were they limited to selling their oil here, thus driving down prices because of the glut. By expanding the market for fracked oil from "US only" to world-wide, they naturally boosted its price -- and their profits.
Great for oil companies. Not so great for US consumers, of course, who now had to pay higher prices or else the oil companies would just ship their oil to Europe.
Let's not forget that all this happened while Obama was President. Trump may or may not be a bad person for reviving the Keystone XL pipeline, but his predecessor did other bad things that hurt many people. He was just more discreet about it.
Recently, though, with fracking having driven down oil prices, many oil companies leaned on Obama and Congress to eliminate this prohibition, and they did, thus enabling US oil companies to sell low-cost fracked oil overseas. No longer were they limited to selling their oil here, thus driving down prices because of the glut. By expanding the market for fracked oil from "US only" to world-wide, they naturally boosted its price -- and their profits.
Great for oil companies. Not so great for US consumers, of course, who now had to pay higher prices or else the oil companies would just ship their oil to Europe.
Let's not forget that all this happened while Obama was President. Trump may or may not be a bad person for reviving the Keystone XL pipeline, but his predecessor did other bad things that hurt many people. He was just more discreet about it.
4
Pipelines have been a fact of life for years and the reason why most of us can live how and where we do. Everyone's railing against this like it's the first one ever. If that conviction is honest, then I should expect the same would be demanding that the ones serving their houses be ripped out too.
6
I pose a serious question; If we export the fuel of our economy, how will America become great?
5
"Forbes is reporting that Trump has a financial interest in the pipeline."
A few years back, it was reported (and turned out to be true) that the best-known Keystone XL pipeline opponent had a large personal investment in Kinder Morgan, which was expected to build a pipeline from the Alberta tar sands to the Canadian Pacific coast if the Keystone XL pipeline were disapproved. He promptly sold that investment, and I always suspected he hadn't even known he owned Kinder Morgan stock.
I have no idea whether Trump "has a financial interest in the pipeline." If he does, I suspect that he -- just like that prominent opponent of the Keystone XL pipeline -- isn't even aware that he has it. Perhaps he owns shares in some mutual fund that, in turn, owns shares of some company that stands to benefit from the Keystone XL pipeline. If so, time to sell that mutual fund, to be sure, but not reason to suspect that Trump supports the Keystone XL pipeline for personal financial reasons.
A few years back, it was reported (and turned out to be true) that the best-known Keystone XL pipeline opponent had a large personal investment in Kinder Morgan, which was expected to build a pipeline from the Alberta tar sands to the Canadian Pacific coast if the Keystone XL pipeline were disapproved. He promptly sold that investment, and I always suspected he hadn't even known he owned Kinder Morgan stock.
I have no idea whether Trump "has a financial interest in the pipeline." If he does, I suspect that he -- just like that prominent opponent of the Keystone XL pipeline -- isn't even aware that he has it. Perhaps he owns shares in some mutual fund that, in turn, owns shares of some company that stands to benefit from the Keystone XL pipeline. If so, time to sell that mutual fund, to be sure, but not reason to suspect that Trump supports the Keystone XL pipeline for personal financial reasons.
1
The freeze on federal hiring will cost many times more jobs than the construction of the pipeline will create. Trump is terrible at math, terrible at making deals, horrible at leadership, makes all the wrong decisions. That is why his companies went banckrupt. That is why he will be the worst president in our history.
17
...and he's just getting started. Where is the God that's going to save America? We need an intervention - now!
1
The freeze on federal hiring will cost many times more jobs than the construction of the pipeline will create.
====================
If true, that means a decrease in jobs that you and I pay for with tax money and an increase in jobs paid for by private money
====================
If true, that means a decrease in jobs that you and I pay for with tax money and an increase in jobs paid for by private money
1
Ignore this, if you dare, but:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/02/opinion/drilling-in-britain.html
Trump will need to subsidize the price of these fuels due to falling crude prices or pray that oil rises above $90 a barrel for low grade crude . . .
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/02/opinion/drilling-in-britain.html
Trump will need to subsidize the price of these fuels due to falling crude prices or pray that oil rises above $90 a barrel for low grade crude . . .
4
Market place on npr reported that DJT own stocks and received compaign contribution from company is responsible pipeline
18
Market place on npr reported that DJT own stocks and received compaign contribution from company is responsible pipeline
================
OMG!
Obama got campaign contributions from the people who owned Solyndra. He then gave them $500 million in grants and loan guarantees that they squandered. Your money and my money.
All Trump has done is to re-approve projects that had already passed environmental review and been recommended for construction and had been arbitrarily stopped by Obama. The companies then get to spend their own money to build them - no tax money
================
OMG!
Obama got campaign contributions from the people who owned Solyndra. He then gave them $500 million in grants and loan guarantees that they squandered. Your money and my money.
All Trump has done is to re-approve projects that had already passed environmental review and been recommended for construction and had been arbitrarily stopped by Obama. The companies then get to spend their own money to build them - no tax money
1
As our esteemed former president has said, elections have consequences. Now we are paying the price for not enough of us showing up at the polls or not wanting to vote for a flawed candidate or for status quo. I'd happily take status quo about now.
If we don't take back congress in 2018, then we will be at the point of no return,
If we don't take back congress in 2018, then we will be at the point of no return,
40
Wondering how many shares his sons, daughters, sons-in-law, daughters-in-law, grandchildren, other in-laws, cousins, siblings, and/or close associates have in the companies that will be building the Keystone pipeline.
42
In his inaugural speech, Trump stated, "This American carnage stops right here and stops right now". I'm afraid the carnage is just beginning.
39
Trump has been very clear about what he's doing. His cabinet is comprised of anti-enviro’s and the military.
This is what’s in store for us: WhiteHouse.gov - https://www.whitehouse.gov/america-first-energy
"For too long, we’ve been held back by burdensome regulations...committed to ELIMINATING HARMFUL AND UNNECESSARY POLICIES...Climate Action Plan and the Waters of the U.S. rule. Lifting these restrictions will greatly help American workers, increasing wages by more than $30 billion...”
Geez, those pesky regulations so we can breathe clean air and drink non-poisoned water.
Increasing Wages/Jobs? Few jobs will be created. The same crews travel from site to site. Once the jobs are done, oil/gas infrastructure is mostly self-sustaining.
The Energy Plan further states, "We must take advantage of the estimated $50 trillion in untapped shale, oil, and natural gas reserves, ESPECIALLY THOSE on federal lands that THE AMERICAN PEOPLE OWN. We will use the revenues… to rebuild…”
Fracking Unleashed!!!
$50 Trillion to be made? Sounds like it’s ‘ours' for the taking. NOT! It belongs to the oil/gas industry. They own the pipelines, wells and fuel. We pay for the Federal property while private industry uses it for a pittance.
Rebuilding of public infrastructure? It'll be privatized. ‘We' will bear the cost of doing business. We’ll have more outlay of our income but taxes won't go down proportionately.
'Our’ land and water will be the casualty.
Seems like a scam to me!
This is what’s in store for us: WhiteHouse.gov - https://www.whitehouse.gov/america-first-energy
"For too long, we’ve been held back by burdensome regulations...committed to ELIMINATING HARMFUL AND UNNECESSARY POLICIES...Climate Action Plan and the Waters of the U.S. rule. Lifting these restrictions will greatly help American workers, increasing wages by more than $30 billion...”
Geez, those pesky regulations so we can breathe clean air and drink non-poisoned water.
Increasing Wages/Jobs? Few jobs will be created. The same crews travel from site to site. Once the jobs are done, oil/gas infrastructure is mostly self-sustaining.
The Energy Plan further states, "We must take advantage of the estimated $50 trillion in untapped shale, oil, and natural gas reserves, ESPECIALLY THOSE on federal lands that THE AMERICAN PEOPLE OWN. We will use the revenues… to rebuild…”
Fracking Unleashed!!!
$50 Trillion to be made? Sounds like it’s ‘ours' for the taking. NOT! It belongs to the oil/gas industry. They own the pipelines, wells and fuel. We pay for the Federal property while private industry uses it for a pittance.
Rebuilding of public infrastructure? It'll be privatized. ‘We' will bear the cost of doing business. We’ll have more outlay of our income but taxes won't go down proportionately.
'Our’ land and water will be the casualty.
Seems like a scam to me!
12
Yes--and he has a plan to divert and distract Americans from these very issues with trivialities--such whining about the crowds during his inauguration--and serious issues he thinks are a joke--such as his lies about vote fraud.
What an awful nightmare!
What an awful nightmare!
8
This man is not a radical. He is not a strong brave individual who is showing Washington and the liberals.
No he is a conformist right wing shock jock. He cares nothing for the citizenry. He just falls in line with his GOP masters.
No he is a conformist right wing shock jock. He cares nothing for the citizenry. He just falls in line with his GOP masters.
6
Oil sands from Keystone will bring oil prices significantly down to consumer's advantage at the expense of 12% increase emission than conventional oil. Choose wisely.
3
OK, Uly, you can be 12% sicker if you wish. I choose not to be. So do most wise people.
1
Enough of your Trump vs Obama headlines. Trump must be accountable for his actions alone in the end. While we see the tit for tat, his decisions have consequences for the American people far beyond his own personal ego and apparent vendetta.
7
Every move Trump is making is to spite Obama, the Democrats and liberals. He could not care less if any of it makes sense or is good the country. Oil prices could drop to ten cents a gallon and he'd still blather on about creating jobs to meet the demands for fossil fuels. This is no different than his absurd pandering to families in coal country, saying he's going to bring back the coal industry, even though that's as likely as him bringing back the use of medicinal leeches.If it angers the left, and please his supporters, he'll do it. That's his only conviction.
I don't know how the far right in this country is to be stopped, but they need to be stopped, by any means necessary.
I don't know how the far right in this country is to be stopped, but they need to be stopped, by any means necessary.
24
The Keystone Pipeline is exhibit A why the Democrats lost the 2016 elections. Obama was not about growing the productive parts of the economy. Keystone was a no-brainer to put people back to work in shovel-ready jobs. At the end of the day, solar and wind are not a substitute for fossil fuels. And the more energy we produce from the North American continent, the less dependent we are on the Middle East and Russia.
9
Generally I agree with you...however in this case, I think Obama paid back Warren Buffett for his support by allowing his BNSF railroad to be the only alternative in the absence of a pipeline. Of course, with the pipeline, those jobs are at risk as well, so it's a balancing act.
construction jobs are temporary, only during construction. You want to see growth from shovel ready jobs you need to see thirty or forty years of planned paid for (notice paid for) construction to change the economy. Oil pipeline maybe 500 to 1000 workers for a year or two and then out of work with 40 or 50 people left to run the pipeline. Keystone is a no brainer in getting people to believe in thousands of jobs that will "make America great again."
2
We're not real dependent on foreign oil:
http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=32&t=6
I think you can put that rationale to bed and find something else to justify environmental trashing AND it isn't like the U.S. taxpayer gains anything. But Big Oil? You betcha!
http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=32&t=6
I think you can put that rationale to bed and find something else to justify environmental trashing AND it isn't like the U.S. taxpayer gains anything. But Big Oil? You betcha!
2
The Environment has just declared war on the Trump administration.
LET THE PIPELINE PROTESTS BEGIN ANEW!
LET THE PIPELINE PROTESTS BEGIN ANEW!
9
Something tells me you won't like how Trump responds to protestors. He's not bound by the same worldview as Obama. Be careful...
1
Remember the 2000 veterans who were protecting the demonstators? Let's see how Trump responds.
2
Excluding the many environmental issues, why should American land owners be forced to allow right of way access for oil pipelines across their property? This is an especially relevant question when you consider these are foreign corporations who want the pipelines so they can reap higher profits from their Alberta tar sands oil. Trump's new Energy Secretary, Rick Perry, is reviled in Texas because he believed in the government's right to seize private land to line the pockets of his friends. Not sure if Trump could be any more vilified than he already is, but this is a good effort.
18
why should American land owners be forced to allow right of way access for oil pipelines across their property? This is an especially relevant question when you consider these are foreign corporations
=====================
Because the pipeline companies, whether US or foreign, pay property taxes on the pipeline to the counties that they cross. They help support schools.
=====================
Because the pipeline companies, whether US or foreign, pay property taxes on the pipeline to the counties that they cross. They help support schools.
1
you omitted "...for no good reason other than wealthy progressive potential and or actual contributors." must have been an oversight, right?
9
Excellent, keep up the great work Donald.
10
On one hand, the new Administration is making our air and water dirtier, our climate more dangerous (excessive heat and destructive storms)--and on the other hand , the new Administration is set on a path to limit medical coverage --so that as we get sicker from exposure to the dirtier air and dirtier water , and struggle to survive the blows delivered by strong winds and raging flood (more asthma, lung cancer, injuries )--we will be denied --unless we are part of the billionaire class that now governs--denied doctors to treat us.
18
There is a little irony in Trump's idea of draining the swamp.
1. What is a common swamp dweller? An Alligator that is all mouth and no ears.
2. most oil and gas started as swamp detritus millions or billions of years ago.
Indeed, he is draining the swamp. Except for the Alligator.
There was a reason that there were three times more demonstrators than Inauguration attendees. After the shock of the emergence of the ignorants of America on election day, I'm heartened to see the smart people emerging.
1. What is a common swamp dweller? An Alligator that is all mouth and no ears.
2. most oil and gas started as swamp detritus millions or billions of years ago.
Indeed, he is draining the swamp. Except for the Alligator.
There was a reason that there were three times more demonstrators than Inauguration attendees. After the shock of the emergence of the ignorants of America on election day, I'm heartened to see the smart people emerging.
15
Our reliance on oil is a self-fulfilling prophecy. We tell ourselves green energy is too far away and oil is the only option for now, and so that's the way it is. The irony is oil companies have themselves tried to move off oil, thinking it would only be logical that the world would move to greener sources of energy. Even though their current business is mostly oil, like smart businesses, they try to stay ahead of the seemingly inevitable.
Royal Dutch Shell, for example, attached $1.7 billion to New Energies, a subsidiary that functions as Shell's green energy division in 2016. Total (of France) already purchased SunPower, the second largest solar company, in 2011 for 800 million pounds.
If there is no money in green energy, if there is no future in green energy, what are these corporations doing? They chase money like sharks chase blood. That is the sole reasoning for being. They are not putting money in green energy because they are run by bleeding heart environmentalists. They are doing it because they see it as the inevitable future.
Energy companies are constantly surprised by how successful their oil-related lobbying efforts are in the United States. They keep planning for change they thought they would be forced to to adapt to. But it never seems to come.
Royal Dutch Shell, for example, attached $1.7 billion to New Energies, a subsidiary that functions as Shell's green energy division in 2016. Total (of France) already purchased SunPower, the second largest solar company, in 2011 for 800 million pounds.
If there is no money in green energy, if there is no future in green energy, what are these corporations doing? They chase money like sharks chase blood. That is the sole reasoning for being. They are not putting money in green energy because they are run by bleeding heart environmentalists. They are doing it because they see it as the inevitable future.
Energy companies are constantly surprised by how successful their oil-related lobbying efforts are in the United States. They keep planning for change they thought they would be forced to to adapt to. But it never seems to come.
7
BP is a big player in the US wind energy industry
1
I've long thought the "jobs" justification for the Keystone XL pipeline was overstated.
But...
While the pipeline itself would produce very few long-term jobs, what happens if thousands of refinery workers in Texas and Louisiana lose their jobs because the refineries run out of crude oil to refine? Retrain them to make turquoise necklaces in New Mexico? Or would they simply be supported by the rest of us? Would they want that? Would we?
The Gulf Coast refineries were built to handle viscous crude, and they had a steady supply of it for decades, from Venezuela and Mexico. For various reasons, those two sources won't be there much longer.
Can those refineries just switch to "lighter" crude, such as that produced by Saudi Arabia? So one would think, but apparently it's difficult or impossible -- and extremely expensive when it's possible. A refinery is generally built to handle a certain type of crude oil, and it can't just switch to some other type. That's why refineries much prefer -- or even need -- to process crude of the sort they were built for. Besides, does it really make sense to switch them over to "lighter" crude, at great expense, and then have even more tanker ships bringing Saudi Arabian oil across the Atlantic to US refineries?
In short, if those Gulf Coast refineries run out of crude, unemployment in Texas and Louisiana probably will skyrocket. That "jobs" argument is rarely made, but it strikes me as worth thinking about.
But...
While the pipeline itself would produce very few long-term jobs, what happens if thousands of refinery workers in Texas and Louisiana lose their jobs because the refineries run out of crude oil to refine? Retrain them to make turquoise necklaces in New Mexico? Or would they simply be supported by the rest of us? Would they want that? Would we?
The Gulf Coast refineries were built to handle viscous crude, and they had a steady supply of it for decades, from Venezuela and Mexico. For various reasons, those two sources won't be there much longer.
Can those refineries just switch to "lighter" crude, such as that produced by Saudi Arabia? So one would think, but apparently it's difficult or impossible -- and extremely expensive when it's possible. A refinery is generally built to handle a certain type of crude oil, and it can't just switch to some other type. That's why refineries much prefer -- or even need -- to process crude of the sort they were built for. Besides, does it really make sense to switch them over to "lighter" crude, at great expense, and then have even more tanker ships bringing Saudi Arabian oil across the Atlantic to US refineries?
In short, if those Gulf Coast refineries run out of crude, unemployment in Texas and Louisiana probably will skyrocket. That "jobs" argument is rarely made, but it strikes me as worth thinking about.
18
Maybe I don't know enough about exports and manufacturing, but I don't see how President Trump dictating (and he IS dictating) that US companies must hire and buy in America is going to help either exporting US companies or Americans looking for jobs.
Two significant advantages of globalization are savings for companies and consumers due to wage and price differentials among nations. If President Trump takes that advantage away from American companies, and forces them to pay US prices and wages for everything they produce, surely US exporting companies will be placed at a severe disadvantage compared with their globalized competitors. US goods will appear overpriced on foreign markets, and while President Trump can create financial hurdles for foreign companies exporting to the US, he can't force foreigners to pay more for US-made cars and brooms.
This disadvantage will lower US exporters' revenues and profits, and put downward pressure not just on their ability to create the promised new jobs, but even on their ability to stay in business at all.
This approach seems terribly unwise, but that has always been the problem with simplistic sloganeering: it is always confounded by contact with reality.
Two significant advantages of globalization are savings for companies and consumers due to wage and price differentials among nations. If President Trump takes that advantage away from American companies, and forces them to pay US prices and wages for everything they produce, surely US exporting companies will be placed at a severe disadvantage compared with their globalized competitors. US goods will appear overpriced on foreign markets, and while President Trump can create financial hurdles for foreign companies exporting to the US, he can't force foreigners to pay more for US-made cars and brooms.
This disadvantage will lower US exporters' revenues and profits, and put downward pressure not just on their ability to create the promised new jobs, but even on their ability to stay in business at all.
This approach seems terribly unwise, but that has always been the problem with simplistic sloganeering: it is always confounded by contact with reality.
8
Why is the following paragraph buried? THIS is a story of its own.
"Mr. Trump owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners, the company that is building the Dakota Access pipeline ... Last month, a spokesman for Mr. Trump said he sold all of his stock in June, but there is no way of verifying that sale, and Mr. Trump has not provided documentation of it."
"Mr. Trump owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners, the company that is building the Dakota Access pipeline ... Last month, a spokesman for Mr. Trump said he sold all of his stock in June, but there is no way of verifying that sale, and Mr. Trump has not provided documentation of it."
62
I can't imagine the stock for a dead project was worth that much.
How did he get an investor to buy the worthless shares, if they did?
How did he get an investor to buy the worthless shares, if they did?
1
thank you, mary.
1
Yes. Why isn't that a front page headline?
1
Well, the Canadian oil mogul who once was the leading proponent of oil sands development, Murray Edwards, picked up and relocated from Calgary to London last May. One reason for the move, he said, was that low oil prices was the "new normal," implying that further development of tar sands would result in prohibitively high costs per barrel, pricing it out of the market.
But let's not let inconvenient facts get in the way of building an entirely superfluous pipeline.
But let's not let inconvenient facts get in the way of building an entirely superfluous pipeline.
11
Forbes is reporting that Trump has a financial interest in the pipeline.
53
Good, the chances of it being a smashing success are virtually guaranteed, then.
5
Executives of Keystone XL pipeline and others in the fossil fuel industrial complex, pipeline, fracking, coal and gas companies, are careless people.They smash up the environment and its creatures and always retreat back into their money and vast profiteering.... letting other people clean up and pay for the suffering, death and destruction they create. They even arrange to turn loose law enforcement on those who courageously protest their wanton destruction.
Some Keystone XL pipeline supporters are also climate change deniers, who, by asserting that all we have to do is "agree that climate change is a crock", facilitate more pillage and plunder by this toxic industry. These people are apparently unaware of the severe climate damage caused by the fossil fuel industry. This industry for decades has been aware of , yet disregarded and hid, the devastating consequences of an industrial policy based on coal, oil and gas.
The executives of Keystone XL, Exxon-Mobil and all other fossil fuel entities are not stupid, but rather selfishly dedicated to a specific ideology of the maximization of profits and stock prices. Everything else is of insignificant value compared to this.
They disregard all boundaries, whether sacred or secular, destabilize every hallowed hierarchy, whether of ruler and ruled, man and woman or parent and child, and turn fuel resources into immense profit for themselves.
Some Keystone XL pipeline supporters are also climate change deniers, who, by asserting that all we have to do is "agree that climate change is a crock", facilitate more pillage and plunder by this toxic industry. These people are apparently unaware of the severe climate damage caused by the fossil fuel industry. This industry for decades has been aware of , yet disregarded and hid, the devastating consequences of an industrial policy based on coal, oil and gas.
The executives of Keystone XL, Exxon-Mobil and all other fossil fuel entities are not stupid, but rather selfishly dedicated to a specific ideology of the maximization of profits and stock prices. Everything else is of insignificant value compared to this.
They disregard all boundaries, whether sacred or secular, destabilize every hallowed hierarchy, whether of ruler and ruled, man and woman or parent and child, and turn fuel resources into immense profit for themselves.
20
28,000 jobs? Is he using facts or 'alternative facts'?
31
Don the con likes his zero's. Fact is in reality a few always go missing along the way. Trump Golf course. 6,000 jobs promised 200 delivered.
2
Trump has declared war on the environment, as evidenced by his concerted attempts to silence the EPA. Castration of the agency is clearly on his agenda. At this point, Trump is like a cartoon villain - except, unlike most such villains, he is just venal and not at all intelligent. This effort to make the US the most hated and reviled country in the world - following in the footsteps of George W. Bush- will probably succeed. Climate change is the single most important issue facing the world today, not the grossly exaggerated "threat" of Islamic terrorism (or terrorism of any kind). Trump has made himself and his country the primary villains and obstacles in the fight to do something effective about it. However, this also means that the field has now been cleared for China to take over global leadership on this file as well as the free trade file. Much like Bush before him, Trump is rapidly undermining American power in the world. The rest of the world should start considering sanctions against American products that are produced through the subsidy of environmental pollution.
34
Trump has declared war on the environment, as evidenced by his concerted attempts to silence the EPA.
================
You mean the EPA that massively polluted the Animas River here in Colorado and poisoned the water supply on the Navajo Reservation and then the Obama appointed director said they wouldn't pay any damages for. That EPA?
Or the EPA that sat and twiddled its thumbs while the water supply in Flint was polluted? That EPA?
================
You mean the EPA that massively polluted the Animas River here in Colorado and poisoned the water supply on the Navajo Reservation and then the Obama appointed director said they wouldn't pay any damages for. That EPA?
Or the EPA that sat and twiddled its thumbs while the water supply in Flint was polluted? That EPA?
1
So much for the environment. After all, when you're rich you can live where there's clean air to breathe, clean water to drink, clean soil to plant in, and all those other things that the rich deserve just because they're rich. And if anyone has to suffer why not the 99% who aren't rich, have no place to run, and who don't, in the eyes of the GOP, deserve anything better.
17
Ah, but hen3ry, his grandchildren will suffer. He doesn't even care about them.
1
I firmly believe that the proposed Keystone pipeline dangerously imperils the environment of several states through which it would pass, including the water flowing beneath them. That potential for terrible pollution and destruction, awful as it is, pales next to the fantastic (as in fantasy) lies that Trump and his spokesmen/spokeswomen are spewing through their rhetorical pipes. They claim that about 5 million mythical, phantom voters had their ballots purposely, deviously, mysteriously buried, shredded, hidden away. Something. Zero evidence. The claim is rejected by expert witnesses, official and otherwise. How do we proceed with a president this estranged from truth and reality?
12
Probably best to seek refuge in a small Nordic country, awful as it is.
well, first of all, do you think about him often...?
well, first of all, do you think about him often...?
3
Are they red states? Then I have compassion fatigue. I need to reserve my compassion for those who didnt ask for this.
I firmly believe that the proposed Keystone pipeline dangerously imperils the environment of several states through which it would pass, including the water flowing beneath them.
====================
So you are ignoring the environmental analysis on the projects by the State Department and the USACE that said there would be minimal impact and recommended construction. Don't you believe in science?
====================
So you are ignoring the environmental analysis on the projects by the State Department and the USACE that said there would be minimal impact and recommended construction. Don't you believe in science?
The pipeline would move Canadian oil to a Gulf port, for export to overseas refineries. Not a drop would go toward U.S. energy independence. A few hundred jobs, lasting for a year or two, will go into building it. I was about to ask how Trump will justify this, but then I realized the obvious: he'll lie about it.
The NYT is going to need a weekly column just to keep readers up to date on the endless task of fact-checking this administration.
The NYT is going to need a weekly column just to keep readers up to date on the endless task of fact-checking this administration.
65
Weekly or daily? Y'all better subscribe to pay for all the fact-checkers who are going to be needed.
1
This is no real surprise of course. We knew trump would put oil company profits and continued use of dirty carbon fuels over the health and well being of people and the planet.
Virtually all climate scientists and the vast majority of science academies from around the world have confirmed the planet's warming and humans are the primary driver today. But the science denier is omniscient and doesn't need to listen.
At current prod. rates and per USGS estimates there isn't going to be much oil left in the Bakken formation in South Dakota in 10-15 years. So the Dakota Pipeline is really a waste, not a long term solution to our energy needs...and leaks will inevitably contaminate surface and ground water.
Investing in solar or wind far wiser.
The tar sand reserves in Alberta are composed of solid bitumen that must be melted into a dirty slurry of water and carbon, and finally separated into a thick fluid akin to heavy crude that will be piped via the Keystone xl to refineries in the US. The extraction process scars the earth and severely pollutes the environment.
And studies independent of oil companies indicate that (well to wheels) processing tar sand oil generates about 22% more CO2 than conventional crude. Conventional carbon fuels are bad enough, tar sand oil is significantly worse.
Many reasons to fight the egomaniac on this and other injurious policies. We should write our congress person to strongly oppose this action. Renewables should be the focus, not carbon.
Virtually all climate scientists and the vast majority of science academies from around the world have confirmed the planet's warming and humans are the primary driver today. But the science denier is omniscient and doesn't need to listen.
At current prod. rates and per USGS estimates there isn't going to be much oil left in the Bakken formation in South Dakota in 10-15 years. So the Dakota Pipeline is really a waste, not a long term solution to our energy needs...and leaks will inevitably contaminate surface and ground water.
Investing in solar or wind far wiser.
The tar sand reserves in Alberta are composed of solid bitumen that must be melted into a dirty slurry of water and carbon, and finally separated into a thick fluid akin to heavy crude that will be piped via the Keystone xl to refineries in the US. The extraction process scars the earth and severely pollutes the environment.
And studies independent of oil companies indicate that (well to wheels) processing tar sand oil generates about 22% more CO2 than conventional crude. Conventional carbon fuels are bad enough, tar sand oil is significantly worse.
Many reasons to fight the egomaniac on this and other injurious policies. We should write our congress person to strongly oppose this action. Renewables should be the focus, not carbon.
24
The Times ran a story a few years back that showed commuters stalled on a freeway into some big city, less than 100 feet from a long train of rail cars filled with gasoline.
The point was obvious -- and would have been even more obvious if that traffic jam had included a few tank trucks loaded with gasoline: transporting petroleum products by rail or truck is more dangerous than transporting them by pipeline.
If the tar sands were simply going to be left in the ground, there might be very good reasons to oppose the Keystone XL pipeline. But that's for the Canadians to decide, not the US, and the Canadians have made clear that they intend to extract oil from those tar sands. That narrows the choices: What is the best way to transport that oil? Rail or truck? A pipeline through Canada plus ocean-going tankers? Or the Keystone XL pipeline?
The answer strikes me as obvious.
The point was obvious -- and would have been even more obvious if that traffic jam had included a few tank trucks loaded with gasoline: transporting petroleum products by rail or truck is more dangerous than transporting them by pipeline.
If the tar sands were simply going to be left in the ground, there might be very good reasons to oppose the Keystone XL pipeline. But that's for the Canadians to decide, not the US, and the Canadians have made clear that they intend to extract oil from those tar sands. That narrows the choices: What is the best way to transport that oil? Rail or truck? A pipeline through Canada plus ocean-going tankers? Or the Keystone XL pipeline?
The answer strikes me as obvious.
9
Excuse me, but the more obvious answer is for them to build their own refineries at the point of extraction if they feel the compelling need to dig this sludge from the ground and sell it. Economic analysis has shown that the U.S will not reap any benefits from this pipeline but will most certainly bear the burden of the environmental degradation that will follow. My respect for Canadians has now reached a new low. I used to think that those people were enlightened and progressive in thought and action, but I have come to view them as as shallow opportunists.
8
The federal Canadian government welcomes Enbridge, as do people in places like Alberta who cannot get their heads around the idea that the world is changed and they do not have a God-given right to work in oil extraction for the rest of their lives. However, it is opposed by many, many others. Today is disappointing day, on both sides of the border.
6
Then I guess you haven't had a pipeline leak in your backyard. It all sounds good until you realize these companies historically defer maintenance on these pipelines until there is a spill! And spills come often.
3
The King has spoken and written. Farewell Native American drinking water and burial grounds. You matter not.
What an embarrassing country.
What an embarrassing country.
59
Don't cry.l It will be OK.
For example, ALL of the surrounding native tribes signed a CONTRACT with Keystone to permit the pipeline route. The gang at the protests takes the minority position.
It might then be a much drama for anyone to lament "drinking water" or "burial grounds" since the pipeline was also approved by every government agency with full native consultation at every phase.
No, this was a political Obama decision, and had little to do with climate change.
For example, Obama's own agencies concluded that NOT building the pipeline would cause even more carbon emissions because the SAME oil and gas would have to be trucked in from Canada, or by rail.
Surely you will soon read about the above in the paper of record.
In the meantime, we will have something which even the NYT cannot long ignore: more JOBS for people of color, of no color.
For example, ALL of the surrounding native tribes signed a CONTRACT with Keystone to permit the pipeline route. The gang at the protests takes the minority position.
It might then be a much drama for anyone to lament "drinking water" or "burial grounds" since the pipeline was also approved by every government agency with full native consultation at every phase.
No, this was a political Obama decision, and had little to do with climate change.
For example, Obama's own agencies concluded that NOT building the pipeline would cause even more carbon emissions because the SAME oil and gas would have to be trucked in from Canada, or by rail.
Surely you will soon read about the above in the paper of record.
In the meantime, we will have something which even the NYT cannot long ignore: more JOBS for people of color, of no color.
4
There is still some dignity in royalty. Donald should be addressed as General Trump. But I get you. Good Post!
1
It is like Obama was never there at all and so ineffectual
Don't underestimate the value of symbols or of symbolic actions. The protests at Standing Rock made a deep impression on the country, and the water protectors do not intend to leave. Despite "official" reports to the contrary, this is an entirely peaceful demonstration, supported not just by native people from many tribes, but by people from all walks of life, including veterans. The value of this struggle is entirely symbolic. This is hard for people who consider themselves pragmatic or responsible fail to understand. It doesn't matter that some indigenous people are making money from oil leases, it doesn't matter that there are already pipelines crisscrossing the country. What matters is at this time and at this place people concerned with the environment are saying "no!" If they are removed or suppressed, particularly by violent means, that too will have a symbolic meaning that may become a teaching moment for all of us.
148
Yes, many people were disgusted by the protests at Standing Rock and their total lack of basis in facts.
3
I hope you mean that many people were disgusted with the reporting of the protest at Standing Rock, not of the protest itself.
Despite "official" reports to the contrary, this is an entirely peaceful demonstration, supported not just by native people from many tribes, but by people from all walks of life, including veterans.
=================
So all of those pictures and videos of destroyed construction equipment and burning barricades put up by the demonstrators weren't real
=================
So all of those pictures and videos of destroyed construction equipment and burning barricades put up by the demonstrators weren't real
Follow the money. Somehow it is all connected:
Promotion and continued reliance on oil and fossil fuels in the US
Rex Tillerson and ExxonMobil
The Koch Brothers
Putin and Arctic Oil
How Putin made his billions in the oil industry
Trump's tax returns
Promotion and continued reliance on oil and fossil fuels in the US
Rex Tillerson and ExxonMobil
The Koch Brothers
Putin and Arctic Oil
How Putin made his billions in the oil industry
Trump's tax returns
18
The world is much too overpopulated. Climate change will correct this. So sorry I won't be around to witness this blessing to the rest of God's creation.
2
We already have a pipeline. We need a new pipeline to increase capacity.
Why not lay a second pipe next to the existing one ?
Was there a reason the original pipeline take the shorter route ?
Why take an environmental risk with this new route ?
I see how increasing the capacity can help us :
- we'll need more energy if the $1 trillion is approved for construction projects around the country
- it'll undercut oil prices and geopolitical influence of Iran and Saudi Arabia
- it'll dry up oil rigs and weaken Russian and Chinese contracts in the Middle East
- we will get oil quicker and cheaper than China and India do from the Middle East
- it creates an economic dependency on us for Canada
- It gives us greater geopolitical leverage over these countries.
We can benefit from this pipeline -- if we do not let the symbolism of undoing Obama's legacy determine our need for it.
Why not lay a second pipe next to the existing one ?
Was there a reason the original pipeline take the shorter route ?
Why take an environmental risk with this new route ?
I see how increasing the capacity can help us :
- we'll need more energy if the $1 trillion is approved for construction projects around the country
- it'll undercut oil prices and geopolitical influence of Iran and Saudi Arabia
- it'll dry up oil rigs and weaken Russian and Chinese contracts in the Middle East
- we will get oil quicker and cheaper than China and India do from the Middle East
- it creates an economic dependency on us for Canada
- It gives us greater geopolitical leverage over these countries.
We can benefit from this pipeline -- if we do not let the symbolism of undoing Obama's legacy determine our need for it.
1
Correction:
Was there a reason the original pipeline did not take the shorter route ?
Was there a reason the original pipeline did not take the shorter route ?
A couple of problems with your claim here:
(1) China has actually be purchasing US oil. Increase in supply lowers prices. This does not really hurt China.
(2) China's oil demand is starting to level off due to other economic problems that are developing, like it's unsustainable development and currency depression.
(3) Russian is a net energy exporter. I guess you can say driving energy prices down hurts Russia. So are Iran and Saudi Arabia. But oil prices are already low. What kind of long-term environmental and moral costs are you willing to pay to stick it to them just a little more?
(4) Yes, more domestic oil will drive down domestic energy costs. But oil prices are low. Contrary to what Trump believes, market forces are complicated things. Those jobs this is supposed to create might not be created in an environment of depressed demand and abundant supply. Drilling is already down in the Gulf of Mexico.
(5) China just committed $360 billion in state funds to green energy development and subsidies. If geopolitics is a game of chess, China is actually thinking about it's next move. The idea "pipeline will help us leverage China" is like trying to play the game as thought it were two moves ago.
(1) China has actually be purchasing US oil. Increase in supply lowers prices. This does not really hurt China.
(2) China's oil demand is starting to level off due to other economic problems that are developing, like it's unsustainable development and currency depression.
(3) Russian is a net energy exporter. I guess you can say driving energy prices down hurts Russia. So are Iran and Saudi Arabia. But oil prices are already low. What kind of long-term environmental and moral costs are you willing to pay to stick it to them just a little more?
(4) Yes, more domestic oil will drive down domestic energy costs. But oil prices are low. Contrary to what Trump believes, market forces are complicated things. Those jobs this is supposed to create might not be created in an environment of depressed demand and abundant supply. Drilling is already down in the Gulf of Mexico.
(5) China just committed $360 billion in state funds to green energy development and subsidies. If geopolitics is a game of chess, China is actually thinking about it's next move. The idea "pipeline will help us leverage China" is like trying to play the game as thought it were two moves ago.
5
Really if we wanted leverage over China then we should have stayed in the TPP. Too late now.
"Established in the midst of another and a superior race, and without appreciating the causes of their inferiority or seeking to control them, they must necessarily yield to the force of circumstances and ere long disappear."
- Andrew Jackson, December 3, 1833, on the removal of Georgian Cherokees in the name of American progress.
Time again for a tribe to yield to the "force of circumstances"? Except this time, not so much for American progress but American regress and nostalgia.
- Andrew Jackson, December 3, 1833, on the removal of Georgian Cherokees in the name of American progress.
Time again for a tribe to yield to the "force of circumstances"? Except this time, not so much for American progress but American regress and nostalgia.
2
The oil is destined for offshore. It won't be consumed in the former USA until it is sold back to us from/by offshore countries & companies. That's why the ill-advised pipeline is going to the gulf; for the sludge to be processed ("refined" maybe) & put on tankers. Nonsense.
8
Nothing says "America First" more than transporting another country's product through the heart of it on the way to the sea.
31
Didn't the pipe line from Louisiana to the North East have a few leaks recently. Supplies were disrupted and prices went up. Doesn't gulf coast oil find its way up north? In Case Iran or the Saudis decide to cut oil as in a all out jihad we can get oil from somewhere? What if countries unfriendly with the USA like Argentina decided to join in?
Nothing says "America First" like allowing Canadian companies to pay Americans to build a pipeline, like allowing Canadian companies to pay property tax to American counties crossed by the pipeline, or like allowing Canadian companies to pay American refineries to refine their oil.
So yeah, America First
So yeah, America First
Well ( a pun ), it looks like the ignorant thug Trump and his Congress are going to allow the export of American oil, our vital strategic natural resource and the feedstock and fuel of our economy. I'm awe struck at the depths of ignorance.
If you had a long trip ahead of you and a full gas tank to go with, would you sell off your gas in that tank? Big duh huh?
Trump is truly ignorant. So is the Republican Congress selling out America, literally.
If you had a long trip ahead of you and a full gas tank to go with, would you sell off your gas in that tank? Big duh huh?
Trump is truly ignorant. So is the Republican Congress selling out America, literally.
5
Well ( a pun ), it looks like the ignorant thug Trump and his Congress are going to allow the export of American oil, our vital strategic natural resource and the feedstock and fuel of our economy. I'm awe struck at the depths of ignorance.
==================
Um, I hate to break this to you, but Obama signed a bill to allow oil exports back in 2015.
==================
Um, I hate to break this to you, but Obama signed a bill to allow oil exports back in 2015.
I don't necessarily agree with a lot of President Trump's ideology but I will say this much: He made promises to his constituency and he's carrying out a lot of those promises.
9
Is he? What has he done really? He just signed a piece of paper. It ain't done until it's done.
Trump is acting like a CEO, but he is not. This honeymoon is not going to last. Even if he brings jobs back, gets rid of those pesky regulations, it is going to take a toll on this country. We are in a no win situation until we start really thinking about what we want for our future.
Trump is acting like a CEO, but he is not. This honeymoon is not going to last. Even if he brings jobs back, gets rid of those pesky regulations, it is going to take a toll on this country. We are in a no win situation until we start really thinking about what we want for our future.
4
But he didn't win the popular vote.
So he's preaching to the minority.
Angry white men.
So he's preaching to the minority.
Angry white men.
5
He's been in office three days. You're not thinking straight...
4
People who continue to advocate extracting, refining, and burning fossil fuels fail to notice that, just as important as climate change which they deny, fossil fuel uses are toxic to humans. Breathing particulates causes disease and death. Mining runoff and plastics in our waterways and the sea are poisoning and degrading that most important resource that provides us with oxygen and nutrition. Continuing this practice when better ways are now available is just plain madness supporting self-destructive greed. Ignoring these truths is inexcusable at all levels.
115
Of course, this doesn't concern Trump, who lives in his gold-plated aerie high in Trump Tower. Whatever mishaps the pipeline will incur, the little people will clean it up. He has a polluting private jet to get around and has no idea how the average person lives. As far as native American's rights, please, they don't count.
His feel good promises to the little people are meant to stall for time while his cronies reap in millions and his sycophants confirm his "greatness."
Instead of explaining to the desperate know-nothings why coal will not come back and working to help these people transition to new means of employment, he prolongs their agony.
He is starting to dismantle the ACA without a hint of what he will replace it with, expecting people to put off getting sick until he figures out the best deal to reward the insurance companies.
He is everything despicable a human being is capable of being, selfish, greedy and incapable of any compassion.
His feel good promises to the little people are meant to stall for time while his cronies reap in millions and his sycophants confirm his "greatness."
Instead of explaining to the desperate know-nothings why coal will not come back and working to help these people transition to new means of employment, he prolongs their agony.
He is starting to dismantle the ACA without a hint of what he will replace it with, expecting people to put off getting sick until he figures out the best deal to reward the insurance companies.
He is everything despicable a human being is capable of being, selfish, greedy and incapable of any compassion.
3
Trump is a native American as are most the 350 million Americans. Most of us were born here. If you're talking about American Indians they dont deserve any special treatment.
2
I've never bought the "more jobs" argument. Building the Keystone XL pipeline would require workers, of course, but once it's built, then what? A few workers to watch for leaks? To maintain the re-heating stations along the way?
The real reason to build the Keystone XL pipeline is that the alternatives are even worse – truck, railroad, or a pipeline through Canada plus ocean tankers. True, leaving the tar sands in the ground would be environmentally ideal, but that's Canada's decision, not ours, and it appears that Canada has already decided the tar sands can be developed. Only low oil prices blocks that development, and that will remain true unless and until oil prices rise. But if and when oil prices do rise, the oil companies will develop those tar sands whether we want that or not.
There is only one sound argument against the Keystone XL pipeline:
Because the Keystone XL pipeline would be the cheapest way of transporting tar sands oil to refineries (i.e. the US Gulf Coast refineries, where it will end up one way or another), the least rise in oil prices would be necessary for oil companies to decide the time had come to extract it. If, say, $60 a barrel is too low to warrant extraction if rail or truck must be used to transport the oil, but $60 a barrel is high enough to warrant extraction if the Keystone XL pipeline will be used, obviously there may be a range of oil prices within which extraction makes sense if and only if the Keystone XL pipeline is in place.
The real reason to build the Keystone XL pipeline is that the alternatives are even worse – truck, railroad, or a pipeline through Canada plus ocean tankers. True, leaving the tar sands in the ground would be environmentally ideal, but that's Canada's decision, not ours, and it appears that Canada has already decided the tar sands can be developed. Only low oil prices blocks that development, and that will remain true unless and until oil prices rise. But if and when oil prices do rise, the oil companies will develop those tar sands whether we want that or not.
There is only one sound argument against the Keystone XL pipeline:
Because the Keystone XL pipeline would be the cheapest way of transporting tar sands oil to refineries (i.e. the US Gulf Coast refineries, where it will end up one way or another), the least rise in oil prices would be necessary for oil companies to decide the time had come to extract it. If, say, $60 a barrel is too low to warrant extraction if rail or truck must be used to transport the oil, but $60 a barrel is high enough to warrant extraction if the Keystone XL pipeline will be used, obviously there may be a range of oil prices within which extraction makes sense if and only if the Keystone XL pipeline is in place.
1
It's NOT going to end up in the Gulf Coast refineries.
Haven't you been reading the proposal?
The oil shipped through the Keystone Pipeline will be shipped to the GULF COAST, then shipped off to be refined to foreign countries.
The United States will not see a drop of that oil, unless it is sold to us by those countries.
Of course, that is what Trump wants.
A few temporary jobs to build that stupid pipeline and when it's built, those jobs dry up... right about the time Trump is kicked out of office in 4 years.
Unless he is impeached.
Haven't you been reading the proposal?
The oil shipped through the Keystone Pipeline will be shipped to the GULF COAST, then shipped off to be refined to foreign countries.
The United States will not see a drop of that oil, unless it is sold to us by those countries.
Of course, that is what Trump wants.
A few temporary jobs to build that stupid pipeline and when it's built, those jobs dry up... right about the time Trump is kicked out of office in 4 years.
Unless he is impeached.
4
I think the Canadians should build their own refineries at the point of extraction. If they don't have the expertise and finance to do that then should just leave that sludge in the ground. Besides which it's only 818 miles from Hardisty to Vancouver.
3
Trump doesn't know a thing about the Keystone Pipeline. All he knows is that Obama quashed it so he has to resurrect it. It's all about revenge.
24
Glad to see energy developed and moved around here on the North American continent, rather than purchased from those who hate us in the middle east, then shipped in our oceans by Tanker-ship, or moving oil here by rail.
The Obama administration went too far in his hatred for fossil fuels at the expense of our economy. All he accomplished was moving jobs overseas where they have fewer environmental rules and produced more carbon emissions as a result. Moving jobs to China is a net minus for the global environment.
The Obama administration went too far in his hatred for fossil fuels at the expense of our economy. All he accomplished was moving jobs overseas where they have fewer environmental rules and produced more carbon emissions as a result. Moving jobs to China is a net minus for the global environment.
14
Hey, great news if you don't need to breathe.
24
Maybe his son will develop breathing problems because of him. Certainly his grandchildren will, as will all the rest of us.
3
Several things
1. The Keystone Pipeline is not a single pipeline. Its a series of lines that interconnects from North Dakota to the Gulf of Mexico.
2. Its almost complete. The only thing that POTUS has any say so on is rather or not it crosses the border.
3. Ever wonder why the price of oil per bbl and gas at the pump don't correlate much anymore? Here is one reason of many 100's of 1000's of BBLs of that North Dakota come to our refineries in Louisiana by rail.
1. The Keystone Pipeline is not a single pipeline. Its a series of lines that interconnects from North Dakota to the Gulf of Mexico.
2. Its almost complete. The only thing that POTUS has any say so on is rather or not it crosses the border.
3. Ever wonder why the price of oil per bbl and gas at the pump don't correlate much anymore? Here is one reason of many 100's of 1000's of BBLs of that North Dakota come to our refineries in Louisiana by rail.
4
The oil in the pipeline will be exported, it's not for domestic use. Pipeline's not for the people, except when it leaks into the drinking water.
From Newark, NJ, "Dioxin City"
From Newark, NJ, "Dioxin City"
10
The Canadian oil will displace the dirty oil we currently buy from Venezuela. No effect on the US market.
It has always been in the best interests of the environment to build the pipeline. The only people who objected were Warren Buffett, who raised his rates on his RR because of increased demand and the anti-science extremists for whom symbolism outweighed the environment. For the scientifically and environmentally thoughtful, it has always been a symbol of how ignorant and partisan Obama is.
It has always been in the best interests of the environment to build the pipeline. The only people who objected were Warren Buffett, who raised his rates on his RR because of increased demand and the anti-science extremists for whom symbolism outweighed the environment. For the scientifically and environmentally thoughtful, it has always been a symbol of how ignorant and partisan Obama is.
3
When Trump attempts to read "normal" presidential lines, as in the video, he seems uninterested, removed.
Bored.
Bored.
6
Still coming thru the Indian territory then right?
Still coming thru the Indian territory then right?
==============
If you mean an Indian reservation, no. Neither crosses any reservations
==============
If you mean an Indian reservation, no. Neither crosses any reservations
Trump made a ludicrous claim during the campaign that Americans should get a slice of the Keystone XL Pipeline's revenue. Let's watch closely when he unveils his great plan to make that happen. But remember not to hold your breath while you wait for the big reveal.
4
Trump made a ludicrous claim during the campaign that Americans should get a slice of the Keystone XL Pipeline's revenue.
=====================
We will. The pipeline operator will pay property tax to the jurisdictions it crosses
=====================
We will. The pipeline operator will pay property tax to the jurisdictions it crosses
This is only the beginning of the demise of every environmental right that has happened over the past 50 years. I envision the Indian with the tear in his eye.
11
but I bet you use petroleum products anyway.
8
There are no "environmental rights"; however, there is power. Right now, the person in charge doesn't much care about the environment. During the election, young women said, "I don't like," Hillary. After he lost, Burnie supporters couldn't transfer the burn to Hillary. Now, here you are, whining about the environment. Good luck with that. Personally, I don't think they care.
1
This is only the beginning of the demise of every environmental right that has happened over the past 50 years.
=================
Um, EISs were performed for both of these pipelines and they recommended their construction. All in compliance with state and federal law
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Um, EISs were performed for both of these pipelines and they recommended their construction. All in compliance with state and federal law
I think it unlikely Trump will give much weight to Native American claims. His practice as developer was to run over families by using eminent domain. No difference here except it is even easier to damage low-income families for "energy security" than it is for a casino.
173
Developers can't use eminent domain. Only governments can do that, and it is usually Democratic governments that do.
Fact check here.
I agree with the spirit of your comment, but I think are wrong on the law. Eminent domain taking of private property under the 5th amendment require a "public purpose" . Apart from the fact that the pipeline is not on private property (so takings law does not apply at all), there must also be a "public purpose" for the taking. (ex: a highway). Takings are often litigated, with the issue being the value of the private property. I am unaware of any case involving a 5th amendment "taking" for purposes of a casino. (My guess is somebody sold DT the land upon which the bank could then fund the building of the casino)
I agree with the spirit of your comment, but I think are wrong on the law. Eminent domain taking of private property under the 5th amendment require a "public purpose" . Apart from the fact that the pipeline is not on private property (so takings law does not apply at all), there must also be a "public purpose" for the taking. (ex: a highway). Takings are often litigated, with the issue being the value of the private property. I am unaware of any case involving a 5th amendment "taking" for purposes of a casino. (My guess is somebody sold DT the land upon which the bank could then fund the building of the casino)
Now that Trump and the GOP has chosen to ignore and in fact stop all activities in dealing with global warming, how long will it take the rest of the nations of this world to choose to go to war with the United States just for the sake of survival? The world will turn on the United States.
5
President Trump reviving the Keystone XL Pipeline from TransCanada down through the Dakotas to the Gulf of Mexico - which was successfully stopped by the Standing Rock Lakota Sioux and their tribes - would be an environmental catastrophe if President Trump reinstates that pipeline, discarding President Obama's rejectionof the pipeline through Native America tribal territories. We're looking at another Custer's last stand and we the people know who Custer is this time.
How easy for terrorists to sabotage the pipeline within our homeland. And strange that our new President owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners, the company that is building the Dakota Access pipeline. And also odd that Mr. Trump has not provided documentation of his sale of pipeline stock. The Canadians are planning to have part of their pipeline cutting through the Vancouver BC hinterlands (Burnaby) not far from that great Pacific Rim city. May the Keystone XL pipeline plan be permanently disabled, and may the Trump ashcanned Trans Pacific Partnership not make enemies of our Pacific trading partners. Clean energy instead of ancient fossil fuels and tar sands, as obsolete as the Electoral College, should be a Manhattan Project for our new President. But then the Manhattan Project and atomic power, the CCC and WPA and recovery from the Great Depression were created under the aegis of Franklin Delano Roosevelt in his four Presidential terms. Too bad we didn't have a third term for President Obama.
How easy for terrorists to sabotage the pipeline within our homeland. And strange that our new President owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners, the company that is building the Dakota Access pipeline. And also odd that Mr. Trump has not provided documentation of his sale of pipeline stock. The Canadians are planning to have part of their pipeline cutting through the Vancouver BC hinterlands (Burnaby) not far from that great Pacific Rim city. May the Keystone XL pipeline plan be permanently disabled, and may the Trump ashcanned Trans Pacific Partnership not make enemies of our Pacific trading partners. Clean energy instead of ancient fossil fuels and tar sands, as obsolete as the Electoral College, should be a Manhattan Project for our new President. But then the Manhattan Project and atomic power, the CCC and WPA and recovery from the Great Depression were created under the aegis of Franklin Delano Roosevelt in his four Presidential terms. Too bad we didn't have a third term for President Obama.
5
Several commenters point out that tar-sands oil is expensive to produce and transport, and that current oil prices don't justify anything but leaving it in the ground.
True, for the same reason that many gold mines were shut down when gold had a fixed price of $35 an ounce but were re-opened when gold prices rose to well over $1,000 an ounce.
Producing tar sands oil makes economic sense (or not) at different market prices for oil, depending on how it will be transported. Higher prices are necessary if it's going to be transported by rail or truck, since those methods are more expensive. A lower price is required if pipelines plus ocean-going ships will be used, and an even lower price is required if the Keystone XL pipeline will be used.
So, yes, many of those who favor the Keystone XL pipeline do so because they understand it will be the cheapest transport method. And, yes, that makes it more likely that tar sands oil will be developed than if producers had to wait until oil prices rose enough to justify rail or truck transport (the highest-cost methods). But the difference between the two most likely modes of transport -- pipeline through Canada plus ocean-going ships v. the Keystone XL pipeline -- isn't great. While a slight uptick in oil prices might warrant developing the tar sands if the Keystone XL pipeline were in place, an only slightly greater uptick would justify building a pipeline across Canada.
And that's what the Canadians would do -- they've said so.
True, for the same reason that many gold mines were shut down when gold had a fixed price of $35 an ounce but were re-opened when gold prices rose to well over $1,000 an ounce.
Producing tar sands oil makes economic sense (or not) at different market prices for oil, depending on how it will be transported. Higher prices are necessary if it's going to be transported by rail or truck, since those methods are more expensive. A lower price is required if pipelines plus ocean-going ships will be used, and an even lower price is required if the Keystone XL pipeline will be used.
So, yes, many of those who favor the Keystone XL pipeline do so because they understand it will be the cheapest transport method. And, yes, that makes it more likely that tar sands oil will be developed than if producers had to wait until oil prices rose enough to justify rail or truck transport (the highest-cost methods). But the difference between the two most likely modes of transport -- pipeline through Canada plus ocean-going ships v. the Keystone XL pipeline -- isn't great. While a slight uptick in oil prices might warrant developing the tar sands if the Keystone XL pipeline were in place, an only slightly greater uptick would justify building a pipeline across Canada.
And that's what the Canadians would do -- they've said so.
9
@MyThreeCents
One: Canada subsidizes oil production to the tune of $3 billion a year.
Two: The opposition to a pipeline between Alberta and British Columbia is overwhelming, which is why TransCanada needs to route it through the US.
Three: The oil market is expected to be supply heavy for the next decade with major producers needing to pump even more to make up for lost income due to current low prices. Also, the US has become a net oil exporter and is for the foreseeable future energy-independent. Venezuela, which has the largest reserve in the world, is producing below capacity because of political instability. If it were producing at previous levels, an already saturated oil market would see oil prices drop even further, which makes Canada's oilsands a massive economic liability.
Four: According to the U.S. Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration (PHMSA), and data from the International Energy Agency, "U.S. pipelines spilled three times as much crude oil as trains... even though incidents happened much less frequently." And [data over an] eight-year period was dominated by large pipeline spills, including 800,000 gallons of Canadian tar sands crude spill in and around the Kalamazoo River, and a 63,000 gallon pipeline spill into the Yellowstone River.
Five: The rail industry is one of biggest employers in the US.
With Trump spewing disinformation and lies nonstop it's not helpful to post comments that are similarly cavalier with the truth.
One: Canada subsidizes oil production to the tune of $3 billion a year.
Two: The opposition to a pipeline between Alberta and British Columbia is overwhelming, which is why TransCanada needs to route it through the US.
Three: The oil market is expected to be supply heavy for the next decade with major producers needing to pump even more to make up for lost income due to current low prices. Also, the US has become a net oil exporter and is for the foreseeable future energy-independent. Venezuela, which has the largest reserve in the world, is producing below capacity because of political instability. If it were producing at previous levels, an already saturated oil market would see oil prices drop even further, which makes Canada's oilsands a massive economic liability.
Four: According to the U.S. Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration (PHMSA), and data from the International Energy Agency, "U.S. pipelines spilled three times as much crude oil as trains... even though incidents happened much less frequently." And [data over an] eight-year period was dominated by large pipeline spills, including 800,000 gallons of Canadian tar sands crude spill in and around the Kalamazoo River, and a 63,000 gallon pipeline spill into the Yellowstone River.
Five: The rail industry is one of biggest employers in the US.
With Trump spewing disinformation and lies nonstop it's not helpful to post comments that are similarly cavalier with the truth.
1
Cheapest transport method? Since 2000, there's been at least 10,696,612 gallons of oil, gas, butane, diesel, ammonia, propane, and other toxic leaked, burned, and exploded on U.S. soils and spilled into our waterways. Some leaking pipelines have gone undetected for as long as two years. These events happen regularly and have led to more than 300 deaths and injuries, lives altered and then further insulted when companies shed their responsibilities. Homes have burned down, businesses destroyed, schools, communities, entire towns evacuated. Incidents that have done permanent damage to land (making it unusable) and water--killing millions of wildlife and contaminating surrounds. And don't get me started on tar sands destruction
1
How long do you believe it will be before Donald Trump, his hand-picked generals or one of the Red State governors send out the military under their control to attack "the citizens" (in Trump's words)? He didn't say the "People". Citizen being defined as : a legally recognized subject or national of a state or commonwealth, either native or naturalized. Citizens can be "legally" pushed out of being "American Citizens". People being defined as: human beings in general or considered collectively. Authoritarians, dictators, will use force...they won't care who or what Non-Citizens they harm, man, woman or child, white/black/red/yellow, old or young, gay or straight...it will only be when not if.
7
I admired some of the projects and policies that President Obama tried to pursue however, this was not one of them. We will be using petroleum products, to some extent, for the foreseeable future and the current method of moving crude oil by truck and rail is expensive and dangerous. This pipeline will be state of the art and, if other existing pipelines are a guide, safe.
Mr Obama expended a tremendous amount of political capital (capital he did not have) fighting this project based on uncertain data projecting its effect on the climate and, frankly, an almost obsessive insistence on its demise. Despite allowing considerable drilling and fracking thus otherwise boosting production and lowering energy costs, with his pipeline decisions, however, he garnered the unwarranted perception of being the President of "No" with regard to the oil industry. Trump's election and subsequent dismantling of this regulation (and, perhaps, the EPA) being one of the unfortunate and reactionary results of his efforts.
Rather than "piecemeal" efforts and constant bickering, it is also unfortunate that we, as a nation, do not have a comprehensive long term energy plan including reasonable and consistent policies (not ones that change with each administration) encouraging renewable energy production going forth.
Mr Obama expended a tremendous amount of political capital (capital he did not have) fighting this project based on uncertain data projecting its effect on the climate and, frankly, an almost obsessive insistence on its demise. Despite allowing considerable drilling and fracking thus otherwise boosting production and lowering energy costs, with his pipeline decisions, however, he garnered the unwarranted perception of being the President of "No" with regard to the oil industry. Trump's election and subsequent dismantling of this regulation (and, perhaps, the EPA) being one of the unfortunate and reactionary results of his efforts.
Rather than "piecemeal" efforts and constant bickering, it is also unfortunate that we, as a nation, do not have a comprehensive long term energy plan including reasonable and consistent policies (not ones that change with each administration) encouraging renewable energy production going forth.
3
So he waited for his fourth full day in office to do this? I'm disappointed.
A few hundred jobs here, a few thousand there, pretty soon we're talking about a real American middle-class again.
The environment? Nothing like an action like this to telegraph to India and China, as if their unbreathable cities weren't enough, that taking the environment seriously means THEY must sacrifice, as well as the American middle-class -- instead of talking a big game to get wealthier countries to act unilaterally, signing international pacts then doing practically nothing that causes any REAL economic sacrifice to their own.
That Canadian crude almost certainly soon will pass through Keystone II to OUR Gulf oil refineries, keeping OUR workers employed, instead of going to China. That this is a bad thing to so many liberals speaks volumes in explaining their general, NATIONAL electoral woes. President Obama delayed the decision on Keystone until he was safely re-elected, because killing it might have tipped the election to Romney. And Trump is called cynical.
Next liberal support to be attacked: nuclear, perhaps enough to make an environmental difference, and certainly enough to massively ruffle feathers at joint Streisand/Baldwin jumbo-shrimp fests.
DRILL, BABY, DRILL! And spend some of the taxes from strong ExxonMobil revenues on figuring out how to better manage climate change WITHOUT destroying jobs.
A few hundred jobs here, a few thousand there, pretty soon we're talking about a real American middle-class again.
The environment? Nothing like an action like this to telegraph to India and China, as if their unbreathable cities weren't enough, that taking the environment seriously means THEY must sacrifice, as well as the American middle-class -- instead of talking a big game to get wealthier countries to act unilaterally, signing international pacts then doing practically nothing that causes any REAL economic sacrifice to their own.
That Canadian crude almost certainly soon will pass through Keystone II to OUR Gulf oil refineries, keeping OUR workers employed, instead of going to China. That this is a bad thing to so many liberals speaks volumes in explaining their general, NATIONAL electoral woes. President Obama delayed the decision on Keystone until he was safely re-elected, because killing it might have tipped the election to Romney. And Trump is called cynical.
Next liberal support to be attacked: nuclear, perhaps enough to make an environmental difference, and certainly enough to massively ruffle feathers at joint Streisand/Baldwin jumbo-shrimp fests.
DRILL, BABY, DRILL! And spend some of the taxes from strong ExxonMobil revenues on figuring out how to better manage climate change WITHOUT destroying jobs.
6
"DRILL, BABY, DRILL! And spend some of the taxes from strong ExxonMobil revenues on figuring out how to better manage climate change WITHOUT destroying jobs."
What tax revenue? I thought Trump was also promising cutting corporate taxes to "create jobs."
"Create jobs" may be a worthy goal, but it has been an excuse to justify a lot of dangerous, irresponsible, stupid, and/or morally dubious things.
What tax revenue? I thought Trump was also promising cutting corporate taxes to "create jobs."
"Create jobs" may be a worthy goal, but it has been an excuse to justify a lot of dangerous, irresponsible, stupid, and/or morally dubious things.
4
RL, daily Trump apologist, explains how 50 long term jobs after the construction ends, builds the middle class.
It's good satire.
It's good satire.
35
Which Baldwin? Not Steven.
3
Good move!
They are going to produce and ship this oil anyway. Does it make sense to continue to ship it by rail? Are we aware that farmers are having a hard time shipping their produce because the rails are clogged with oil tanker cars?
Remember the Lac-Mégantic rail disaster in Quebec when a runaway train with 74 oil tanker cars destroyed a town, the train, and killed 47 people? 5 people are still missing. How many people have been killed by runaway pipelines?
Then there's the oil train disaster in Alabama which resulted in a spill of 750,000 gallons. That's more oil than was spilled in the preceding 37 years. In West Virginia a 100-car oil train derailed sending one tanker car into a river.
In New York City we have pipes over 100 years old carrying water, gas and other substances. Leaks are minimal and when they do leak we shut them down and fix them promptly . Keystone can be done in a safe and environmentally responsible way.
Once they put guys up on the moon you can't tell me that something as simple as this cannot be done.
They are going to produce and ship this oil anyway. Does it make sense to continue to ship it by rail? Are we aware that farmers are having a hard time shipping their produce because the rails are clogged with oil tanker cars?
Remember the Lac-Mégantic rail disaster in Quebec when a runaway train with 74 oil tanker cars destroyed a town, the train, and killed 47 people? 5 people are still missing. How many people have been killed by runaway pipelines?
Then there's the oil train disaster in Alabama which resulted in a spill of 750,000 gallons. That's more oil than was spilled in the preceding 37 years. In West Virginia a 100-car oil train derailed sending one tanker car into a river.
In New York City we have pipes over 100 years old carrying water, gas and other substances. Leaks are minimal and when they do leak we shut them down and fix them promptly . Keystone can be done in a safe and environmentally responsible way.
Once they put guys up on the moon you can't tell me that something as simple as this cannot be done.
27
In the time it took to build the new SF - Oakland Bay Bridge they could've built 3 XL Pipelines. But you can't commute via a pipeline. Still, my point obtains.
This country is covered with pipelines. Many of the hysterics who post on stories about pipelines have no idea just how many there are, how long they have been operating. Here is a map of the pipelines carrying oil and products refined from oil in the US.
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=us+oil+pipeline+map&view=detail...
There is an equally ubiquitous network of pipelines carrying carrying natural gas.
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=us+oil+pipeline+map&view=detail...
There is an equally ubiquitous network of pipelines carrying carrying natural gas.
6
I speak as a Canadian. The Lac-Megantic tragedy still singes the Canadian soul.
I thank you Mike for your reminder that oil on wheels is not the way to go.
My one true wish, however, is that we find a better way to fuel our engines.
I thank you Mike for your reminder that oil on wheels is not the way to go.
My one true wish, however, is that we find a better way to fuel our engines.
4
This man is going to destroy this country and our environment one way or another. All for an almighty dollar! I have lived 73 years only to watch us going right back where we were before the environmental movement began and before the civil rights battle. We will be back to the 30's with every nation for itself with closed borders. Are your papers in order?
25
Do you use petroleum products?
Do you own anything made using petroleum products?
If yes, how can you complain?
Do you own anything made using petroleum products?
If yes, how can you complain?
8
I don't know about you but I'm encouraging the next generations in my family to emigrate.
5
australia or nz or the best places to escape
The so called jobs tump is talking about are temporary and they will be reduced drastically upon completion. The press need to hold his feet to the fire on this claim.
The environment will be damaged and at one cost?
The environment will be damaged and at one cost?
8
The so called press is a useless entity though in the past try safeguarded democracy. No longer.
4
Well Meagen Pickens, there is always hope. Perhaps Orwell's 1984 should now become mandatory reading in our schools. Trump et al should also study its contents and they may learn(?) a thing or two, although I doubt it.
Not just the press, the people too.
Check out ProPublica, great investigative journalism.
Check out ProPublica, great investigative journalism.
Maybe the pipeline will be used to drain the swamp?
7
May be to fill it-up!
If Elon Musk, Al Gore and Leonardo diCaprio can't persuade Trump of the financial, environmental and humanitarian (respectively ) dangers of expanding the use of fossil fuel then perhaps the other countries in the world can. Or perhaps its will take the brave Sioux and other Indigenous Americans to take a stand again. We may need to see North Dakota gunslinging police face off in direct conflict with America's veterans before Donald Trump realizes that there are 63 million people, at minimum, in this country that care more about the important issues than just money. We are not all motived by greed Donald. Only those that you surround yourself with.
3
Al Gore and Leonardo DiCaprio? Are you kidding??
One is a professional, permanent politician and the other is someone who recites memorized lines in front of a camera.
Indigenous Americans who use petroleum products (I'm guessing you've never been on an actual reservation in the West) have no room to complain.
One is a professional, permanent politician and the other is someone who recites memorized lines in front of a camera.
Indigenous Americans who use petroleum products (I'm guessing you've never been on an actual reservation in the West) have no room to complain.
3
"Studies showed that the pipeline would not have a momentous impact on jobs or the environment."
Excuse me, but the Keystone XL Pipeline will not only trash the environment or provide the U.S. with greater energy independence, but all reliable studies have shown that after it's built, the pipeline will produce a total of 35 permanent jobs.
Since Trump fancies himself the big jobs creator, why wasn't the jobs number even mentioned in this article?
It's time for the NYT to keep a chart, published every single day (like stock market results) that reports on the number of permanent jobs Trump is actually creating or saving. As of January 24, 2017, it's probably less than 1,000 (if that).
Excuse me, but the Keystone XL Pipeline will not only trash the environment or provide the U.S. with greater energy independence, but all reliable studies have shown that after it's built, the pipeline will produce a total of 35 permanent jobs.
Since Trump fancies himself the big jobs creator, why wasn't the jobs number even mentioned in this article?
It's time for the NYT to keep a chart, published every single day (like stock market results) that reports on the number of permanent jobs Trump is actually creating or saving. As of January 24, 2017, it's probably less than 1,000 (if that).
8
"Studies showed that the pipeline would not have a momentous impact on jobs or the environment."
================
The scientific studies done in the environmental reviews performed by the State Department and USACE showed the projects would have minimal impacts and recommended construction. Are you denying the science?.
================
The scientific studies done in the environmental reviews performed by the State Department and USACE showed the projects would have minimal impacts and recommended construction. Are you denying the science?.
I wish the NYT did not feel the need to assert, in every article about the Keystone XL, that its significance in relation to climate change is primarily symbolic, rather than of real environmental harm. The vast expanses of boreal forests which encircle the globe's northern latitudes play a a critical role in mitigating atmospheric CO2 pollution and in sequestering carbon, equal to that of the equatorial rainforests. Extracting, refining and transporting the oil derived from tar sands produces three times as much carbon pollution as conventional oil. Contamination of the Ogallala aquifer would jeopardize what remains of an already diminishing water supply for millions of farmers in America's breadbasket. Going to greater and greater lengths to extract evermore carbon-intensive forms of fossil energy is poor energy policy, for very consequential and concrete reasons.
5
I worry about what kind of history will be written about this Trump era. Will schools preach a slanted "alternative history" that obscures the deliberate destruction that has begun in earnest? I hope that some objective chronicling of events, INCLUDING the names of their key players, is written by those skilled in documenting history as it occurs. These records should be kept in secure cyber time capsules, so the truth can be known by future generations about what happened to the USA.
43
There will be histories written . . . and then there will be Texas schoolbooks.
2
We should thank President Trump for providing the next mass protest march with an excellent focal point: Stop the Keystone and Dakota Pipelines.
Take significant and immediate measures to protect our environment and to slow the progress of climate change. Take the energy of last week's Women's March and channel it into March #2: Protect the environment and stop the Pipelines. Have a march on the same day in every major American city. This could be a much bigger march than what we saw on Jan 21st. The administration is lying about the real number of jobs involved in those pipelines......And March #3 could be: Show us Your Tax Returns, Trump. Yes, America does care, Kellyanne.
Take significant and immediate measures to protect our environment and to slow the progress of climate change. Take the energy of last week's Women's March and channel it into March #2: Protect the environment and stop the Pipelines. Have a march on the same day in every major American city. This could be a much bigger march than what we saw on Jan 21st. The administration is lying about the real number of jobs involved in those pipelines......And March #3 could be: Show us Your Tax Returns, Trump. Yes, America does care, Kellyanne.
40
Show us you tax returns.
8
April 29, Washington DC, 350.0rg
1
Just don't drive or fly to the march.
1
Ya it was probably a bad idea for democrats to sit home on election day.
- Jill Stein supporter
- Jill Stein supporter
11
This action proves how shortsighted this administration is. President Trump and his minions don't seem to care about the long term consequences and environmental impact of building the Keystone Pipeline.
4
With oil near $50 per barrel the pipeline likely is not economically feasible.
However, a pipeline is a much safer way to ship oil than tanker cars on a train dragged through multiple small towns.
However, a pipeline is a much safer way to ship oil than tanker cars on a train dragged through multiple small towns.
4
So, let's see: the first few things Trump has done have been the opposite of what President Obama's policies and actions were.
Move forward to repeal healthcare
Scrap the TPP
Revive the Keystone pipeline
Meet with Kanye...
It's very easy to predict how things will go on from here.
Where are the Republicans who've asked Democrats to give Trump a chance? They might as well do stand-up comedy instead of sanctimonious blather...
Move forward to repeal healthcare
Scrap the TPP
Revive the Keystone pipeline
Meet with Kanye...
It's very easy to predict how things will go on from here.
Where are the Republicans who've asked Democrats to give Trump a chance? They might as well do stand-up comedy instead of sanctimonious blather...
4
What I don't get is if they want to create jobs why make them pipelines? Gas companies love pipelines because they make gas cheaper to transport by involving as few people as possible. Transporting the same quantity of gas via train would create more jobs because you'd need to hire engineers to drive and maintain the trains, as well as workers to pack and unpack the gasoline and maintain the railroad.
Aside from that the Dakota Access pipeline is the wrong thing to support because it sends the message that he doesn't care about the concerns of indigenous people. Also if the indigens own the land the pipeline is going over they should have the right to say they don't want the pipeline there, certainly I wouldn't want the government putting a pipeline through my backyard without permission.
Aside from that the Dakota Access pipeline is the wrong thing to support because it sends the message that he doesn't care about the concerns of indigenous people. Also if the indigens own the land the pipeline is going over they should have the right to say they don't want the pipeline there, certainly I wouldn't want the government putting a pipeline through my backyard without permission.
38
It requires 6 trains of a mile each and every day to equal the capacity of the XL pipeline.
Eventually, another Lac-Megantic (Quebec Canada) disaster will occur killing 47 people and incinerating a city.
Pipelines are far safer and cleaner and cheaper to operate. That is why there are 185,000 miles of petroleum pipelines, 320,000 miles of gas transmission pipelines and more than 2 million miles of gas distribution pipelines in the US.
This was never about the pipeline. It was about the idle hope that Canada would not exploit the tar sands in Alberta (which is nonsensical - Canada has the third largest reserves on the planet after Venezuela and Saudi Arabia).
Eventually, another Lac-Megantic (Quebec Canada) disaster will occur killing 47 people and incinerating a city.
Pipelines are far safer and cleaner and cheaper to operate. That is why there are 185,000 miles of petroleum pipelines, 320,000 miles of gas transmission pipelines and more than 2 million miles of gas distribution pipelines in the US.
This was never about the pipeline. It was about the idle hope that Canada would not exploit the tar sands in Alberta (which is nonsensical - Canada has the third largest reserves on the planet after Venezuela and Saudi Arabia).
3
This is a NYT pick?
First, the pipelines in question do not transport "gas". And trains never transport significant quantities of natural gas, that moves by pipeline, even in your neighborhood.. Gasoline can move by train or truck, but usually only for local distribution. Most long distance transport of gasoline and other refined products is also by pipeline. In all cases, the frequency of spills with sometimes deadly consequences is MUCH greater by train or truck, but I guess explosions and environmental contamination will put more people to work, too.
And the Dakota Access Pipeline goes near Indian land holdings--all the routes in question do not cross land owned by the Standing Rock Sioux.
First, the pipelines in question do not transport "gas". And trains never transport significant quantities of natural gas, that moves by pipeline, even in your neighborhood.. Gasoline can move by train or truck, but usually only for local distribution. Most long distance transport of gasoline and other refined products is also by pipeline. In all cases, the frequency of spills with sometimes deadly consequences is MUCH greater by train or truck, but I guess explosions and environmental contamination will put more people to work, too.
And the Dakota Access Pipeline goes near Indian land holdings--all the routes in question do not cross land owned by the Standing Rock Sioux.
2
Why must you THINK about things? Why can you not blindly accept the word of Trump and his alternative facts?
2
Anything to do with Obama will be fair game from Trump.
4
I hope the next 4 years are not going to be simply an exercise in undoing everything the guy before me did. I hope that actions will be preceded by thoughtful analysis of the reasons for taking them, and their short and long-term consequences for all affected parties.
7
Another "executive" action just done to placate the "base" and make sure all those people who actually think he has some good ideas have something to crow about. Again, anything Obama championed is to be undone without consideration of ramifications or need.
Basically, unless it's built with tax money, there is no reason to build it. We have plenty of oil in this country and at today's low oil prices, there are other methods of moving oil including other pipelines, and it's not economic. Of course, for someone who uses bankruptcy as a business strategy, and is morally and ethically bankrupt, this makes sense.
Basically, unless it's built with tax money, there is no reason to build it. We have plenty of oil in this country and at today's low oil prices, there are other methods of moving oil including other pipelines, and it's not economic. Of course, for someone who uses bankruptcy as a business strategy, and is morally and ethically bankrupt, this makes sense.
8
Where in the world do people come up with these ideas?
"Secondarily, since Trump is an investor in this pipeline..."
It's beginning to seem true: Just repeat some lie over and over and over again, and eventually everyone will assume it must be true.
"Secondarily, since Trump is an investor in this pipeline..."
It's beginning to seem true: Just repeat some lie over and over and over again, and eventually everyone will assume it must be true.
3
I owned some silver stock last year and I sold gladly and made a bundle. Trump did the same.
Yeah, it worked for Trump didn't it?
XL is a complete no brainer. Canada is going to extract this crude regardless. It is very much in our national interest for this crude to go South rather than West and eventually to Asia. Pipelines are the safest and cleanest way to move crude. Clinton's state department and the EPA both acknowledged this fact.
And you are looking at thousands of high paying construction and material generation jobs.
The only reason Obama stopped XL was to throw a bone to his environmentalist funders and to put a stick in the eye of his detractors. Yes, he is really that petulant.
And you are looking at thousands of high paying construction and material generation jobs.
The only reason Obama stopped XL was to throw a bone to his environmentalist funders and to put a stick in the eye of his detractors. Yes, he is really that petulant.
6
"And you are looking at thousands of high paying construction and material generation jobs"
The pipeline creates 35 full-time jobs and thousands of part-time ones that will last an average of 19.5 weeks a piece. The entire construction process of the pipeline is expected to last 1.5 to 2 years. So this is gonna help the economy how?
The pipeline creates 35 full-time jobs and thousands of part-time ones that will last an average of 19.5 weeks a piece. The entire construction process of the pipeline is expected to last 1.5 to 2 years. So this is gonna help the economy how?
8
The pipeline creates 35 full-time jobs and thousands of part-time ones that will last an average of 19.5 weeks a piece. The entire construction process of the pipeline is expected to last 1.5 to 2 years. So this is gonna help the economy how?
====================
It will cost several billion dollars to build the pipeline. Are you saying injected billions of Canadian dollars into the US economy over a couple of years is nothing?
This is the nature of infrastructure projects. Are you saying we shouldn't build bridges because they don't result in permanent jobs
====================
It will cost several billion dollars to build the pipeline. Are you saying injected billions of Canadian dollars into the US economy over a couple of years is nothing?
This is the nature of infrastructure projects. Are you saying we shouldn't build bridges because they don't result in permanent jobs
Of course this was done. The rule of law has been re-established.
This pipeline was duly permitted, all rights of way secured, was substantially completed and lacked only a short leg under US Army Corps of Engineers property, when it was held up by the Sioux and all manner of anti-fossil fuel zealots.
The time for the Sioux to have gotten fired up about the Army Corps of Engineers having jurisdiction over their purported sacred lands was back in 1962 when Lake Oahe was created. Now, it's way too late. And, given that the pipeline passes north of their reservation boundary, they are a concerned party whose views have been heard and are known, but they have no veto, especially at the 59th minute of the 11th hour.
This pipeline was duly permitted, all rights of way secured, was substantially completed and lacked only a short leg under US Army Corps of Engineers property, when it was held up by the Sioux and all manner of anti-fossil fuel zealots.
The time for the Sioux to have gotten fired up about the Army Corps of Engineers having jurisdiction over their purported sacred lands was back in 1962 when Lake Oahe was created. Now, it's way too late. And, given that the pipeline passes north of their reservation boundary, they are a concerned party whose views have been heard and are known, but they have no veto, especially at the 59th minute of the 11th hour.
9
The rule of law has different meaning to people who have a signed treaty guaranteeing their rights. The rule of law has a different meaning to people whose drinking water is in danger of pollution. The rule of law is more than "We'll give him a fair trial, and then we'll hang him." It certainly means getting one's purported facts straight.
10
Every body of water in this country is "in danger of pollution". We have never stopped projects in the past for what might possibly happen and we won't in the future either. Risk is for assessing, minimizing, engineering around, not for avoiding by doing nothing,
3
You are correct. Every body of water in this country is indeed in danger of pollution. People are waking up to this, and drawing a line. This particular project is of note, because it was originally intended to cross the river north of Bismark, and was rerouted through the tribal lands because of the danger of polluting Bismark's water. This is not what might possibly happen. This is what will almost certainly happen, as it has happened so often in the past. Risk is for the people who depend on the water. The past is prologue. What we do in the future remains to be seen.
1
My family is from western Kansas. I absolutely love the prairie (and the endless sky above it). I prefer it to all other ecosystems and want to see it restored and managed and protected.
That said, unless we (and the Native Americans who live in that area) are willing to give up EVERYTHING made or fueled by petroleum products, a pipeline across the prairie is the least ecologically damaging option.
We cannot have it both ways. We cannot bewail environmental damage AND use petroleum products. It's hypocritical. The prairie is vast and stable compared to other options.
You can always cut all petroleum usage out of your life; when there is no more demand, the pipeline can be dismantled and recycled.
That said, unless we (and the Native Americans who live in that area) are willing to give up EVERYTHING made or fueled by petroleum products, a pipeline across the prairie is the least ecologically damaging option.
We cannot have it both ways. We cannot bewail environmental damage AND use petroleum products. It's hypocritical. The prairie is vast and stable compared to other options.
You can always cut all petroleum usage out of your life; when there is no more demand, the pipeline can be dismantled and recycled.
2
An argument without any substance, critical thinking or nuance. It's all one thing or another, eh?
1
If there is no global warming that is affected by man's generation of carbon gases, then aside from the environmental concerns from a leaky line the effect upon carbon gas emissions would be no reason to not allow the pipeline. Simple propositional logic thus makes Obama's stated concern, irrelevant. Trump Tower when Barron is running things might have to erect a big wall to keep the Hudson River outside, I think.
Making ANY sizeable investment in the petroleum industry is ultimately short sighted and it works against any serious effort to curb global warming. Not to mention the obvious assault against the rights and wishes of the native people in the region. This is a total loser.
2
Making ANY sizeable investment in the petroleum industry is ultimately short sighted and it works against any serious effort to curb global warming.
=================
That's up to the judgement of the investors. The US government isn't investing anything in this project
=================
That's up to the judgement of the investors. The US government isn't investing anything in this project
If the oil can't get to refineries by pipeline, it will get there by rail (which is less safe and more expensive). For those worried about Obama's legacy, just recall that he approved the southern leg of the Keystone XL pipeline, which was completed shortly thereafter, and successfully worked with Congress to end the ban on oil exports. I think it's safe to say those accomplishments are secure for decades to come.
1
If -- if-- there were a realistic possibility that rejecting the Keystone XL pipeline would mean that Canada would just leave the tar sands alone, it would make sense to oppose the pipeline. But it's long been clear that Canada was going to develop the tar sands, as PM Justin Trudeau made clear.
The only choices to be made were in how that tar-sands oil would be transported to its likely customers (the Gulf Coast refineries – which, unlike most other refineries, were built to handle viscous crude (such as they'd long been receiving from Venezuela and Mexico – indeed, it was the imminent cut-off of those two sources that got the GC refinery companies interested in the tar sands in the first place).
Would that tar-sands oil be transported by rail? By truck? Both are more dangerous and expensive than pipelines; I hope there's no dispute about that. Or would that tar-sands oil be transported by pipeline across Canada to a seacoast and then carried by tanker to the buyers (i.e. to the Gulf Coast refineries)?
Or would it be transported via the Keystone XL pipeline?
Seems like a no-brainer to me UNLESS one makes the entirely baseless assumption that a fifth option was practically available: leave the tar-sands oil in the ground. That was NOT an option. The Canadians long ago had decided that question, and they weren't about to let the US (or anyone else) overrule their decision.
The only choices to be made were in how that tar-sands oil would be transported to its likely customers (the Gulf Coast refineries – which, unlike most other refineries, were built to handle viscous crude (such as they'd long been receiving from Venezuela and Mexico – indeed, it was the imminent cut-off of those two sources that got the GC refinery companies interested in the tar sands in the first place).
Would that tar-sands oil be transported by rail? By truck? Both are more dangerous and expensive than pipelines; I hope there's no dispute about that. Or would that tar-sands oil be transported by pipeline across Canada to a seacoast and then carried by tanker to the buyers (i.e. to the Gulf Coast refineries)?
Or would it be transported via the Keystone XL pipeline?
Seems like a no-brainer to me UNLESS one makes the entirely baseless assumption that a fifth option was practically available: leave the tar-sands oil in the ground. That was NOT an option. The Canadians long ago had decided that question, and they weren't about to let the US (or anyone else) overrule their decision.
6
Oil is a valuable commodity and wants to get into oil marketplaces. that is economics. Canada has already approved getting that oil out of the ground. The stopping of the Keystone was a typical "feel-good" action by Obama that in the real world meant nothing! Nothing! If it would not move through the USA, it would have been routed to the Great Lakes or through the Rockies to Canada's Pacific coast. That oil was headed for market, no matter what. It is naive to believe that stopping Keystone was going to actually have an impact on climate change.
12
Exactly. And it's much better to move that oil across land than by ship if there is a leak.
2
Really? I think it means something to anyone who cares about the environment, which obviously you don't. As Obama said when he rejected it, "America is now a global leader when it comes to taking serious action to fight climate change, and frankly, approving this project would have undercut that leadership,". The fight has to be led by someone.
Get it?
Get it?
5
@RedRat
So why hasn't it gone forward outside the US since Obama nixed it?
Answer: there's no need for it and it does no good. Canada has tremendous excess pipeline capacity that will take years to fill.
So why hasn't it gone forward outside the US since Obama nixed it?
Answer: there's no need for it and it does no good. Canada has tremendous excess pipeline capacity that will take years to fill.
4
I think Trump's method of of governance is brilliant. Fail at looking or being remotely presidential, then throw a tantrum about something irrelevant to distract everyone from whatever he's really up to.
6
Big mistake.
There aren't a lot of line-in-the-sand fights around climate change that people who don't live in denial can engage directly.
The Keystone pipeline is one of them. TransCanada can't reach a deepwater port through Canada because of strong opposition. The only option is to pipe it to the Gulf Coast. Oil sand extraction is probably the most inefficient and most polluting form of carbon energy production there is. It makes no sense. And it was a settled issue.
But if Trump wants a fight that will become a baseline, defining confrontation over priorities, including global warming, and would like to throw red meat at a re-emergent environmental activism, then let's have at it.
A line in the sand. A bad decision by a polarizing provocateur who is already on the thin ice of political illegitimacy, lacking the majority support of the governed.
A good jump start to four years of resistance.
There aren't a lot of line-in-the-sand fights around climate change that people who don't live in denial can engage directly.
The Keystone pipeline is one of them. TransCanada can't reach a deepwater port through Canada because of strong opposition. The only option is to pipe it to the Gulf Coast. Oil sand extraction is probably the most inefficient and most polluting form of carbon energy production there is. It makes no sense. And it was a settled issue.
But if Trump wants a fight that will become a baseline, defining confrontation over priorities, including global warming, and would like to throw red meat at a re-emergent environmental activism, then let's have at it.
A line in the sand. A bad decision by a polarizing provocateur who is already on the thin ice of political illegitimacy, lacking the majority support of the governed.
A good jump start to four years of resistance.
31
There will be no discussion of any possible physical limitations to how much carbon can be burned how fast to preclude mass cannibalism in a global collapse.
4
It's hard to see the need for more pipelines when gasoline, in my city at least, is at $2.18 a gallon and fell as low as $1.35 a gallon last year. Spite is what this is really about.
8
@Mark Lebow
Don't discount stupidity. And more than a dollop of cynicism. Trump doesn't live by spite alone.
Don't discount stupidity. And more than a dollop of cynicism. Trump doesn't live by spite alone.
1
So much for that "open mind" on the environment Trump spoke of to the NYT. He is showing only openness to more destructive things to do to our earth.
19
Unemployment is far more destructive, and not decades in the future, when it might be a few degrees warmer... melting the snowflakes. It's harmful today.
1
At the current crude oil price, producing oil from tar sands is not an economical proposition. When crude oil prices were hovering around $100 a barrel five years ago, the tar sands industry could realize attractive returns on investment in extracting and transporting the oil to market by rail or pipeline. But with the fracking-driven energy glut of recent years, the price of tar sands crude has plunged to $20 a barrel, obliterating the economic calculations that launched the industry. Trump's approval of the pipeline may be a Pyrrhic victory for the industry.
66
With the volatility of a Trump presidency coming I have no doubt the world will again see $100 a barrel oil. In fact, that's likely all part of the plan.
1
Are you in the oil business? I would think the oil companies can decide what they think will bring a profit.
"Trump's approval of the pipeline may be a Pyrrhic victory for the industry."
Unless, of course, oil prices rise. I wonder whether that will happen, don't you?
Unless, of course, oil prices rise. I wonder whether that will happen, don't you?
As I have said before, the only way Obama could have stopped the Dakota Pipeline was to declare the 'Northern Plains National Monument'. There could be no challenge to such a designation. My fear is what will happen to what is left of the great Native Americans. They will make a final stand. I fear this could be their last stand, as Trump will bring out the troops, and they will not have kid gloves on.
9
The Sioux owe no loyalty to the US and no fealty to the Leader. Actually , none of us owe anything to the Leader and any resistance we provide or support is a step in the right direction. If I were Sioux I would be torn between outright war or protecting myself and my family from annihilation. If they want to, they could seek asylum in Canada for the vulnerable and continue to resist here.
2
The Democrats are quick to accept the word and signatures of our enemies Russia and China on climate change.
I really don't think they are going to abide by the climate protocols they put their name to and either are some of the other signatories.
I really don't think they are going to abide by the climate protocols they put their name to and either are some of the other signatories.
My father used to ask "If your friends jump off the Brooklyn Bridge, would you jump too?" Either we do the right thing or we don't. What others do doesn't change this equation. (And the Russians and Chinese are not even our friends.)
7
trump voters accepted the word of a lifelong grifter and liar. The sooner we can be out from under trump, his seed, and his entourage the better. Better for the country to dissolve than continue as a russian-style state.
3
Short-sighted. China has no choice but to abide by and escalate their move to green energy, they're choking on coal. They've just committed $300 billion to developing green technology. Climate denier or not, investing in the drilling of oil, oil, oil, is a losing proposition. Soon enough you'll be forced to buy technology from China (and Canada for that matter) as we promote and develop that sector. Obviously, Russia's position will depend on whether Tillerson/trump remove the economic sanctions so Exxon and Putin can make billions in drilling the Arctic dry. Even the Saudis are investing mega-bucks into green technology...how to turn sand into solar panels, for example.
2
I have done a lot of reading on these issues and they were the wrong ones for the Democrats to stake any amount of energy on. They provide easy "points" for Republicans to (falsely) claim that Democrats are "anti-industry," are "hurting jobs" or "putting the needs of the few above the many." Donald Trump has expertly exploited such sentiments in many, regardless of the merits, and is now sitting in the Oval Office by the closest of margins.
1
Dear David Sillers,
Sure but this doesn't help American industry, only provides about 50 jobs in the long run, and the pipeline puts the needs of the few above the needs of the many. It'll enrich some oil companies and degrade everyone's environment. So we just have to keep pointing out that the Republiecans are lying.
Sure but this doesn't help American industry, only provides about 50 jobs in the long run, and the pipeline puts the needs of the few above the needs of the many. It'll enrich some oil companies and degrade everyone's environment. So we just have to keep pointing out that the Republiecans are lying.
4
Yes you are right. The Democrats have not been very smart about just anything for the past two decades. They have, in effect, become Republican Lites. The problem is exacerbated by Democrats actually abandoning their traditional blue collar work force. They did very little to stem the off-shoring of jobs. While I don't think that Trump will be able to bring back jobs, hopefully he might be able to create some jobs--perhaps, building and maintaining the pipeline.
Am I wrong to be on the verge of tears? I hope the destruction is reparable at the time the Republicans lose all their seats.
51
No, you're not wrong.
1
It's only wrong to be on the verge of tears if you use petroleum products.
4
No, any sensitive being with minimal awareness has grounds to be distraught.
1
Even worse than the damage to President Obama's political legacy is the threat to our earth and all who will be harmed by such actions.
Please don't bury the lead!
Please don't bury the lead!
12
Do you use petroleum products?
If so, it's hypocritical to complain.
Stop the use of fossil fuels by obliterating demand for them. Galvanize all of your friends and neighbors to stop using them. Consider the buggy whip: there are very few manufacturers of buggy whips because there is close to 0 demand for them.
Start a movement to do the same for fossil fuels.
If so, it's hypocritical to complain.
Stop the use of fossil fuels by obliterating demand for them. Galvanize all of your friends and neighbors to stop using them. Consider the buggy whip: there are very few manufacturers of buggy whips because there is close to 0 demand for them.
Start a movement to do the same for fossil fuels.
2
Mr. Trump manufactures alternative facts, (Orwellian Doublespeak for lies.) For citizens to understand and comment intelligently on the machinations of the Trump government, we will need to know facts about our government agencies and statistics about economic and ecological conditions. If we are going to consider a reasonable cost benefit analyses of the Keystone pipeline, we will need access to the facts. Accordingly, I ask the New York Times to join with other serious news outlets to file a joint Freedom of Information act to stop the President from ordering gag orders on agencies. We should be able to hear what our scientists are learning, not just what Mr. Trump wants us to hear. Please file an FOI and protect our right to vital information about our own government.
18
This is not our government anymore. the sycophantic republicans are completely willing to back the maximum leader no matter what he does, short of purging them. Any FOI request will be simply ignored. It can happen here? It just did and it won't be reversed without revolt.
3
Will we still have any scientists when the EPA is restructured?
1
And this is just the beginning of policy for oil companies and the otherwise environmentally destructive. The earth is in for a thrashing when Rex Tllerson and Scott Pruitt get started.
28
Trump's primary campaign strategy was flipping liberals the bird. He is now governing in that same way, tossing bloody steaks to his ecstatic mob. In a short time, the consequences of this will hit his people as reality (physics, other nations) asserts itself. How far can propaganda take him? Stay tuned.
63
"document ... expediting the Dakota Access pipeline"
Are these documents secret? How does it expedite the pipeline? Tell the army corps to skip the EIS? Tell them to find no significant impact? Tell them to start it now?
Secondarily, since Trump is an investor in this pipeline, does that conflict enter into the Army Corps process?
Are these documents secret? How does it expedite the pipeline? Tell the army corps to skip the EIS? Tell them to find no significant impact? Tell them to start it now?
Secondarily, since Trump is an investor in this pipeline, does that conflict enter into the Army Corps process?
125
I really hope the Corps takes advantage of his new Federal hiring freeze, by resigning en masse. He can then go build his own walls and pipes, thank you very much.
"document ... expediting the Dakota Access pipeline"
Are these documents secret? How does it expedite the pipeline? Tell the army corps to skip the EIS? Tell them to find no significant impact? Tell them to start it now?
====================
The USACE had already completed its environmental analysis that resulted in a finding of no significant impact and issued a permit to build DAP. Construction had already begun.
Then Obama intervened to stop the project.
Looks like Trump just turned the switch to reissue the permit
Are these documents secret? How does it expedite the pipeline? Tell the army corps to skip the EIS? Tell them to find no significant impact? Tell them to start it now?
====================
The USACE had already completed its environmental analysis that resulted in a finding of no significant impact and issued a permit to build DAP. Construction had already begun.
Then Obama intervened to stop the project.
Looks like Trump just turned the switch to reissue the permit
Donald is not only a loser, he is totally retrograde. He apparently doesn't give a damn about the world the little Kushners and Barron will struggle to breathe in when they are Donald's age. While Rex is negotiating to drop sanctions against rich Russians in exchange for allowing Exxon to proceed with drilling on millions of acres in the Arctic, we will have pollution from the pipeline right here at home. Certainly, coal is next. These aren't Donald's ideas or his agenda: he's a sick man who hungers for praise and approval, and he's getting it from all the myopic, malevolent sources. Maybe we should say, "You're right, Donald. Five million votes came from those dirty illegal aliens. Keep funding Planned Parenthood. You're already making America great again, Donald. Don't walk away from the Paris environmental agreement. Yes, Donald, it's going to be wonderful, beautiful, you're so right. Don't deport anyone." It's a new twist: Flattery will get you everywhere. It's just coming from the most poisonous people.
83
Well except all the steps he's taking to make gas cheap are going to price coal out of the energy market. Coal's already too expensive to extract, which is why all those PA coal miners voted for Trump to get their jobs back, and this is only going to make that worse.
2
How about focusing on clean energy solutions that would actually create quality, long-term jobs for thousands and wouldn't trample on sacred tribal lands or cause irrevocable damage to the environment?
331
Don't be silly, that would be smart, and Trump isn't smart.
9
He seems to be against anything that benefits anyone other than the obscenely wealthy and large corporations.
9
how about it, pipe dream.
1
So much for "America first." Trump has now endangered our environment for a Canadian company.
130
Love thy neighbor.
2
The Majority of the Company is owned by
Americans and
THEY ARE NOT NATIVE AMERICANS!
Americans and
THEY ARE NOT NATIVE AMERICANS!
4
Most of the oil produced in Alberta is by multi-nationals based in the US or US firms; shipped for processing in US refineries at discounted prices; the pipeline will displace current shipments by rail and truck - but don't let the facts get in the way of your political narrative. TransCanada actually probably has more assets, employees and assets in the US than Canada (think Columbia Pipeline). These are not alternative facts - but the real situation that should be takne onto account. Canada and US are a mostly fully integrated energy market (like the auto sector).
1
"Mr. Trump owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners, the company that is building the Dakota Access pipeline"..."Last month, a spokesman for Mr. Trump said he sold all of his stock in June, but there is no way of verifying that sale, and Mr. Trump has not provided documentation of it."
Just imagine the outrage from the right wing if a Democratic President tried to pull a stunt like that.
Just imagine the outrage from the right wing if a Democratic President tried to pull a stunt like that.
302
My Bennett wrote "The Death of Outrage". There is no more outrage. We are a nation of helpless people who will consume lots of beer watching the Super Bowl.
1
He owns stock in other companies involved in the pipeline too. This is as bad as it gets, folks. Putin is his role model for kleptocracy. Putin is likely the richest man in the world. And irresistible challenge for Trump.
2
Ricky:
At the press conference today Spicer was asked about this. He said that trump still owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners - but then minimized the implication of that by saying it was only a "couple of thousands of dollars" that he owned - and that was nothing for a "billionaire".
And you're exactly right - we have no idea what if anything trump sold. Personally I don't think he truly felt he was going to win the election and that coupled with his refusal to divest himself now - I find it not believable that he sold his stock holdings in June.
If he did sell all his stocks - why is his press secretary now stating he owns some shares in ETP. Since we have no information, it's impossible to know just how large an investment he does have in ETP.
At the press conference today Spicer was asked about this. He said that trump still owned stock in Energy Transfer Partners - but then minimized the implication of that by saying it was only a "couple of thousands of dollars" that he owned - and that was nothing for a "billionaire".
And you're exactly right - we have no idea what if anything trump sold. Personally I don't think he truly felt he was going to win the election and that coupled with his refusal to divest himself now - I find it not believable that he sold his stock holdings in June.
If he did sell all his stocks - why is his press secretary now stating he owns some shares in ETP. Since we have no information, it's impossible to know just how large an investment he does have in ETP.
2
Trump's decisions seem motivated by nothing greater than hatred for President Obama and love for money. Entirely absent of consideration for broader implications.
Closing one's mind to climate science and environmental impact may be en vogue, but it will cost us dearly.
Closing one's mind to climate science and environmental impact may be en vogue, but it will cost us dearly.
145
Leaving aside the plagiarized speech, and the Lincoln Memorial concert (which hadn't been done before, he says (The Obamas?)), and the plagiarized Inaugural cake...Donald seems weirdly obsessed with President Obama. It's really weird and makes me think that MI6 spy's report of Donald's doings in that Russian hotel were true.
15
not me, I'm 70, I don't care about myself, I just care about the decent people with a children, the deplorables, not so much.
4
Also the article should have mentioned that the number of American jobs created by this pipeline would be about 2,000 jobs during its construction, and after it's built, about 50 jobs in the long term. So it'd be easier to create 50 long term jobs by just building five car wash establishments anywhere in the U.S., which wouldn't cost anywhere near the billions the pipeline will.
Thus the only reasons Trump is trumpeting the benefits of this pipeline are, unsurprisingly, lies. Here's the source for those who'd like the facts:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/jan/09/3-key-keysto...
Thus the only reasons Trump is trumpeting the benefits of this pipeline are, unsurprisingly, lies. Here's the source for those who'd like the facts:
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/jan/09/3-key-keysto...
207
Ok thanks. But I would appreciate the link to the alternative facts.
1
A pattern in the making.
Scotland Trump Gold Course - 6000 jobs promised 200 delivered.
Residents bullied and browbeaten. Environmental concerns ignored.
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/25/world/europe/donald-trump-scotland-wa...
Scotland Trump Gold Course - 6000 jobs promised 200 delivered.
Residents bullied and browbeaten. Environmental concerns ignored.
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/25/world/europe/donald-trump-scotland-wa...
3
Also the article should have mentioned that the number of American jobs created by this pipeline would be about 2,000 jobs during its construction, and after it's built, about 50 jobs in the long term. So it'd be easier to create 50 long term jobs by just building five car wash establishments anywhere in the U.S., which wouldn't cost anywhere near the billions the pipeline will.
====================
Some problems with your analysis. It is n the nature of infrastructure projects that they don't yield lots of long term jobs. But you know, we still build roads, bridges and transmission lines, don't we?
The other issue is the pipeline is being built with private money, not tax money. So with Keystone we are actually getting a lot of jobs paid for with Canadian money
====================
Some problems with your analysis. It is n the nature of infrastructure projects that they don't yield lots of long term jobs. But you know, we still build roads, bridges and transmission lines, don't we?
The other issue is the pipeline is being built with private money, not tax money. So with Keystone we are actually getting a lot of jobs paid for with Canadian money
Is this lookin' for a fight?, yeah, I think he's lookin' for a fight.
17
I guess all good left-thinking environmentalists will threaten to move to Canada now. Oh wait...they support the pipeline too!
4
My understanding is that Canada is sending the oil our way because British Columbia didn't want it sent through their environment to the Pacific Coast. So, dumping potential problems on us.
17
Chris the thing about environmentalists is they are not so much left wing these days but are mainstream. In fact if you were to travel outside of America you would find whole countries of them. Most of Scandinavia will be powered by renewable energy within several years with many others following. But that won't matter to you because you and your future generations in Florida will all be underwater by 2050.
9
Oh no! If Florida is underwater, then all of the New Yawkas here will have to live in...New York!
Go ahead and build the pipeline. Build 20 of them.
Go ahead and build the pipeline. Build 20 of them.
When white Americans yell about Making America Great Again - they never once thought about the irony of this statement from the people who are the beneficiaries of stealing this land, the genocide against Native Americans and those that managed to survive the death and destruction that Europeans brought were banished to the worst land reserves possible to live out there days. Except now the white man has deemed this land valuable - so Native Americans will suffer more. As Trump supporters endlessly demand that their "voices and needs" are not hurt - I challenge them to show a little humility and decency to the original owners of this land - and listen to their more than justified demands - after all white America are not the only people who have suffered grievances - and I am sure Native Americans have a different recollection of when this land was "great."
385
Dear Dana,
Unfortunately asking Trump or his supporters to show humility or decency is a lost cause. They're basically irredeemably evil. I'm afraid non-violent protests and strongly worded letters are not going to accomplish anything with this sort of person. The only thing they will pay attention to is probably violence.
Unfortunately asking Trump or his supporters to show humility or decency is a lost cause. They're basically irredeemably evil. I'm afraid non-violent protests and strongly worded letters are not going to accomplish anything with this sort of person. The only thing they will pay attention to is probably violence.
11
Someone can check my facts but I believe Native Americans is not a acceptable term for American Indians. It was wording created by Congress that included many nationalities.
Fear mongering. There are 1000s of pipelines and they cause zero problems. This is good for a lot people. It will get us further away from middle east oil and will help keep energy prices low which helps the poor.
1
Calling all climate scientists and environmental health experts hidden in the EPA, USDA, Dept. Of Energy, et al.
If you find our president and his administration obfuscating the truth and presenting "alternative facts" concerning environmental degradation, I know it's a lot to ask, but consider staying put, collecting data and becoming a whistle blower.
To not be transparent about these realities is a threat to national security, rather than the act of whistle blowing itself.
If you find our president and his administration obfuscating the truth and presenting "alternative facts" concerning environmental degradation, I know it's a lot to ask, but consider staying put, collecting data and becoming a whistle blower.
To not be transparent about these realities is a threat to national security, rather than the act of whistle blowing itself.
177
Calling all climate scientists and environmental health experts hidden in the EPA, USDA, Dept. Of Energy, et al.
If you find our president and his administration obfuscating the truth and presenting "alternative facts" concerning environmental degradation, I know it's a lot to ask, but consider staying put, collecting data and becoming a whistle blower.
=======================
Um, climate scientists and environmental health experts at USACE and the State Department conducted environmental review of these two pipelines and recommended that they be built
If you find our president and his administration obfuscating the truth and presenting "alternative facts" concerning environmental degradation, I know it's a lot to ask, but consider staying put, collecting data and becoming a whistle blower.
=======================
Um, climate scientists and environmental health experts at USACE and the State Department conducted environmental review of these two pipelines and recommended that they be built
How is all of this not considered a coup of the US?
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Well, there's that election, for one thing
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Didn't take long for Trump to alienate Native Americans. Missed them during the campaign so why not do some catching up.
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His opposition to tribal sovereignty is probably his longest held political position, he didn't even need to bring it up during the campaign.
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APS salutes the flag.
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From what I understand, Trump was also envious and resentful of Native/First Americans and their casinos - which offered competition to his own failed empire. There is a lot of payback in this action...as well as greed.
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Naturally, Trump seeks to destroy the environment as much as he can, to profit thereby. Of course, since this is moving Canadian oil, I'm not sure how much the U.S. will profit, but at least some billionaires stand to get richer from despoiling the environment, even if they're Canadian.
The bright side in this is that if Trump manages to cause more rapid damage to the environment, the effects will be stronger and harder to ignore. With any luck, the death toll will start rising, and that's really the only way to get humans to pay attention, when they're dying.
Another silver lining is that the source of all the problems on Earth is overpopulation. Increased oil consumption, resulting in higher temperatures and higher sea levels, could easily eliminate hundreds of millions of humans worldwide, which would be a good start in undoing the damage of humanity.
So Trump's greedy idiocy might result in better things down the road, if it manages to trim humanity's numbers enough. It's tough to find the upside to his demented decisions, so this is the best I can come up with.
The bright side in this is that if Trump manages to cause more rapid damage to the environment, the effects will be stronger and harder to ignore. With any luck, the death toll will start rising, and that's really the only way to get humans to pay attention, when they're dying.
Another silver lining is that the source of all the problems on Earth is overpopulation. Increased oil consumption, resulting in higher temperatures and higher sea levels, could easily eliminate hundreds of millions of humans worldwide, which would be a good start in undoing the damage of humanity.
So Trump's greedy idiocy might result in better things down the road, if it manages to trim humanity's numbers enough. It's tough to find the upside to his demented decisions, so this is the best I can come up with.
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There are already 1000s of pipelines. Educate yourself. This will create jobs and get us one step closer to getting away from oil in the Middle East. Keeping energy prices down helps the poor. Green energy will come in time, we can't rush it.
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Dear Billy F.,
The thousands of pipelines are already a problem, building more just adds to the problem. We don't rely on Middle Eastern oil in the slightest; we export oil. And we had better rush getting energy from something renewable, like solar, wind, tidal, geothermal, etc., because global warming is only accelerating. So as you can see, I am already educated.
The thousands of pipelines are already a problem, building more just adds to the problem. We don't rely on Middle Eastern oil in the slightest; we export oil. And we had better rush getting energy from something renewable, like solar, wind, tidal, geothermal, etc., because global warming is only accelerating. So as you can see, I am already educated.
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You said THE WORD Dan, overpopulation. In my 90 years I'v er never figured out why humanity exempts itself from the rules governing all other animals. Long history us replete with examples of populations which outgrew their resources and died out, Lemmings are the best example. Repeatedly they breed until they outgrow their resources and then 90% of them rush over the nearest cliff and the survivors start to repopulate so they can do it again.Now we are onr world we are one population. This die-out should be a doozy, we already have war, pestilence and famine (yes, the Biblical trio) rife all over the less developed areas. Just giver it another couple of hundred years and the survivors can repopulate so in another 20,000-30,000 years we, too, can do it all over again.
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NYT -- Please cover what is happening on the ground in N. Dakota and Canada and Florida. Cover what the people are doing, not just what Trump is doing. Let the nation know the quality and depth of the courage that Native peoples are showing as they defend their rights and deeply-loved lands.
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Yes, Barbara makes an important point. The resistance to these disastrous environmental policies is now largely in the hands of the local folk, everywhere. Please, NYT, cover what the people are doing and saying on these issues (or cover the coherent ones, at least). Thoughtful coverage may provide us with hope for the present, and a more accurate historic record for the future.
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If you want to know what's happening on the ground and the investigations into safety, the real value or not of these projects.
Democracy Now who have been in the forefront of reporting this and ProPublica for in depth investigative journalism.
https://www.democracynow.org/ https://www.propublica.org
Democracy Now who have been in the forefront of reporting this and ProPublica for in depth investigative journalism.
https://www.democracynow.org/ https://www.propublica.org
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America is drowning and the NYTimes is describing the water.
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Surprise, Not even a week in his office and we run up against a conflict of interest with our new President! Trump is making an Exec. decision that as far as we know will be profitable to him through his stocks. (We were told that last month that he sold all his stocks 6 months ago--but no evidence.) Putting this into context: Trump also said there were more people attending his Inauguration than Obama's--a lie, and he would have won the popular vote except for those 3-5 million illegal voters--another lie. Turn it around, is there anything Trump has told us that we can prove is true?
It takes a big man to admit he was wrong and change course. It will take a big Congress to do their Constitutionally mandated duty and protect us from an unfit President.
Congress: the Womens March was a mirror image of the dissatisfaction across the country shown with the vote for Trump— with YOU. Will you be a big Congress?--or a craven one.
It takes a big man to admit he was wrong and change course. It will take a big Congress to do their Constitutionally mandated duty and protect us from an unfit President.
Congress: the Womens March was a mirror image of the dissatisfaction across the country shown with the vote for Trump— with YOU. Will you be a big Congress?--or a craven one.
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It sure looks to me that all the little fractured districts of the world's most preposterously named nation only elect people who refuse to do the most basic diligence on anything to represent them in Washington.
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This is the most energy intensive petroleum to produce and it is located in a region certain to be permanently scarred by producing it.
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actually it's not - check out the GHG intensity research - certain oils produced in California are almost double those of the Cold Lake region in AB - http://www.ibtimes.com/us-shale-oil-boom-when-it-comes-co2-emissions-not....
The oils sands are quickly developing new technologies reducing intensity while the US imports much higher intensities from VZ and Nigeria in addition to their new sources of production internally.
The oils sands are quickly developing new technologies reducing intensity while the US imports much higher intensities from VZ and Nigeria in addition to their new sources of production internally.
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everybody meets at the new intersection of hubris and hucksterism
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The odds that Canada wouldn't extract oil from these tar sands were virtually nil. The odds were about the same that the extracted oil wouldn't be transported by pipeline.
The only question was whether the pipeline would run through Canada or through the US. If it had run through Canada, the oil would have been loaded onto ships when it reached the East Coast and then transported -- guess where? -- to Gulf Coast refineries.
That may be why both Obama and Clinton were "for" the Keystone XL pipeline before they were "against" it. It was always unclear to me whether Clinton would have flip-flopped yet again, finally OKing the Keystone XL pipeline to keep the Canadians from building it. Guess we'll never find out.
In any case, a pipeline is less dangerous than the alternatives -- rail or truck. Leaving the tar sands in the ground would be least dangerous, of course, but that was never really a possibility.
The only question was whether the pipeline would run through Canada or through the US. If it had run through Canada, the oil would have been loaded onto ships when it reached the East Coast and then transported -- guess where? -- to Gulf Coast refineries.
That may be why both Obama and Clinton were "for" the Keystone XL pipeline before they were "against" it. It was always unclear to me whether Clinton would have flip-flopped yet again, finally OKing the Keystone XL pipeline to keep the Canadians from building it. Guess we'll never find out.
In any case, a pipeline is less dangerous than the alternatives -- rail or truck. Leaving the tar sands in the ground would be least dangerous, of course, but that was never really a possibility.
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Finally a well thought out response. As a Canadian living in the US, it always struck me as hypocritical for liberals in a country that's 40%+ powered by coal to focus on the tar sands, especially via objecting the method of transport that is cleaner and safer...
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Pipelines are not used to transport this oil to the East Coast, it is mostly transported by rail. Opposition to construction of pipelines to the West Coast by First Nations groups have effectively blocked that route. When you add the cost of transportation to the cost of production at a time of relatively low oil prices, blocking the KSXL pipeline will prevent a significant amount of this tar sands oil from making it to market for the near future. Ultimately, we are going to need to keep a significant fraction of our fossil fuel reserves in the ground to avoid catastrophic climate change since it is clear that we have several times more reserves than is necessary to warm the planet by 2.0C above preindustrial levels. Why not start by making the dirtiest sources the hardest to use?
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There is nothing hypocritical about focusing on preventing extraction of tar sands oil because of our unfortunate reliance on coal. Tar sands oil is significantly dirtier than coal, in terms of environmental damage and CO2 emissions during production. Transporting it by pipelines is far from safe. In order to transport bitumin it must be mixed with highly volatile natural gas condensate to create a suspension that allows it to be pumped. During spills such as the one that leaked into the Kalamazoo river the volatiles quickly separate and evaporate while the bitumin, which is denser than water quickly sinks. creating a cleanup scenario that is significantly more challenging than a spill of regular crude. Further, the planned path of the pipeline passes over the Ogallala Aquifer which is the source of 30% of the ground water used for irrigation in the US. If a spill contaminated this aquifer, the effects would be devastating for agriculture and people of the Great Plains. The response is not as well thought out as you believe.
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I think that's a positive move!
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Because?
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Anything that gets us away from oil from the middle east. We need to keep our options open to keep energy prices down. Green energy will come in time, stop trying to rush it.
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Seriously? Stop trying to rush green energy development? Hey, how about you stop trying to jam this environmental disaster as well as an economicboondoggle down our throats!
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