The fact that your article and your paper call people without a college education "uneducated" illustrates the liberal elitism that turned people to Trump. About 86% of whites graduate high school and additional ones earn a GED. Many of those go on to some college, perhaps an associates degree even if they don't graduate. These people may have less education than those with bachelors degrees but they are hardly "uneducated."
Biases on both extremes. Ignorance and blind neglect on the hard right; on the left, there's many in higher ed., to use the article example, who are accustomed to a steady, predictable paycheck. Not many have had to make payroll, deal with regulators, etc.
Religion is faith-founded. Critical thinking is Fact-founded. Many times they do not meet.
2
Consider also the media options (and entertainment options, period) for rural vs urban voters. In the countryside watch television. Often it's tuned to Fox News. In a city they offer outdoor concerts, a variety of ethnic foods, more 'family friendly' alcohol options (vs drinking at "the bar"), etc.
Those types of social, pro-family experiences put you in contact with folks of other racial and cultural backgrounds, even the homeless. You have to get comfortable with it. That pushes you left.
When you watch Fox News all the time it reinforces previously held beliefs.
Those types of social, pro-family experiences put you in contact with folks of other racial and cultural backgrounds, even the homeless. You have to get comfortable with it. That pushes you left.
When you watch Fox News all the time it reinforces previously held beliefs.
2
You missed a very important reason for the college-educated class's tilt away from Trump. Your analysis was cerebral, as befits the college educated! The closest you came was about "class." In addition to learning about differential calculus and the Italian Renaissance, high school students who enter college get four years of learning how to behave. Deportment, appropriateness, having ethical values, being responsible, considerate, and able to chat superficially at cocktail parties. None of this is on the curriculum. Why do you think corporations want to hire college graduates, although they know zilch about their business? They can teach them about business; they can't teach them how to behave with customers and colleagues. The whole "finishing school" part of college no one ever discusses. Donald Trump raised three of our country's most urgent problems: infrastructure, immigration, and the depletion of jobs by creeping automation. Intellectuals should have jumped on these, argued about his solutions, offered others.
Hillary did a poor job of defining problems, let alone solutions. She wasn't running on solutions. Her motto was "I'm with her." What did she attack? Trump's STYLE, his vulgarity. She did a lot of eye-rolling. He makes the college-educated crowd cringe. Remember her comment about the "deplorables?" That was a pure class put-down. She knew where which side her baguette was buttered on.
now let us remember Hillary Clinton's att
Hillary did a poor job of defining problems, let alone solutions. She wasn't running on solutions. Her motto was "I'm with her." What did she attack? Trump's STYLE, his vulgarity. She did a lot of eye-rolling. He makes the college-educated crowd cringe. Remember her comment about the "deplorables?" That was a pure class put-down. She knew where which side her baguette was buttered on.
now let us remember Hillary Clinton's att
4
“It takes more than intelligence to act intelligently” – Dostoyevsky
I know 2 college graduates who are Trump supporters, both in their eighties. One was an engineer, and an engineering degree is short on required courses in the humanities. The other person was a business major; another area not known for an emphasis on the humanities. I would also add that interactions with diversity – other races, other religions, other cultures, etc. – are not prominent. Although both have travelled, I believe they didn’t stray too far from their own like-thinking groups. Travel by itself does not necessarily broaden the mind. Finally, reading habits by both are short on books but lean towards conservative publications, mostly newspapers.
Possibly 6 months into this new administration might have altered a bit of the rigidity, but I know that I must tread carefully in talking politics.
I know 2 college graduates who are Trump supporters, both in their eighties. One was an engineer, and an engineering degree is short on required courses in the humanities. The other person was a business major; another area not known for an emphasis on the humanities. I would also add that interactions with diversity – other races, other religions, other cultures, etc. – are not prominent. Although both have travelled, I believe they didn’t stray too far from their own like-thinking groups. Travel by itself does not necessarily broaden the mind. Finally, reading habits by both are short on books but lean towards conservative publications, mostly newspapers.
Possibly 6 months into this new administration might have altered a bit of the rigidity, but I know that I must tread carefully in talking politics.
"As a white male without a college degree, I think maybe you shouldn’t make such sweeping generalizations about an entire group of people. This is why we liberals have a hard time making inroads with this group. — Brett Hudgins of Seattle"
There are multiple problems with this claim. (1) liberals don't say "The white working class is stupid or racist", they say "Trump supporters are stupid or racist". (2) If Trump supporters care so much about what progressives think, why did they vote for Trump? (3) Trump supporters were perfectly happy to support a man who insulted hispanics, women, and muslims, but suddenly get upset when they are insulted? (4) There is evidence that Trump supporters are stupid or racist: they support Trump.
There are multiple problems with this claim. (1) liberals don't say "The white working class is stupid or racist", they say "Trump supporters are stupid or racist". (2) If Trump supporters care so much about what progressives think, why did they vote for Trump? (3) Trump supporters were perfectly happy to support a man who insulted hispanics, women, and muslims, but suddenly get upset when they are insulted? (4) There is evidence that Trump supporters are stupid or racist: they support Trump.
10
The democrats have stereotyped a class of people stupid, unintelligent, and non thinkers just because they lacked advanced degrees. Not very smart of the liberals to suggest or even think those lacking a degree are less smart, very stupid on the democrats part. We have many fine outstanding smart women and men who enlist in our military after high school. I dont believe the likes of Jay Z, Bruce Springsteen, John Bon Jovi, and other elitists who support democratic rule are highly educated..... Not sure what the media hype over this topic is??? The democrats have themselves to blame, allowing liberals and arrogant progressives to infiltrate the once great working class democratic party.
College does not guarantee a better job or more success in life. What it does do is expose students to a variety of people, ideas, and opinions, and expands their view of the world. Having to write papers and book reports, forces students to evaluate material and think critically. This experience generally influences how they see the world and life around them after they graduate. While they may make important decisions based on intuition and a gut feeling, they are more apt to base their decisions on critical evaluations of a situation or a person. They are less likely to be moved by racist or bigoted talk, appeals to prejudices, denigration of ethnic,or religious groups, or to sexism, and fear mongering. Trump used these tactics throughout the campaign. While it may have appealed to some college educated men and women, it alienated most of them. That doesn't mean that people without a college education accept everything that Trump says. But many of them are more likely to respond emotionally and favorably to him. Those attending his rallies reflect this. Throughout history, demagogues have been successful in influencing wide numbers of people. It appears that many Americans are also susceptible to this.
11
A college education does guarantee a better job or more success in life. Over the course of a 30 year career, collage grads earn almost $1Million more than a high school grad. They are laid off later and go back to work sooner. Having a better chance at prosperity and less fear of economic failure, tends to make folks more sanguine about immigration and free trade and more optimistic generally.
1
The absolute basic requirement is the ability to think critically. It also helps to have enough psych background to evaluate the person (or situation) first.
1
"Perhaps uneducated whites would be more open to the policies of the Democratic Party if they were approached with greater respect from the Left. Is anyone surprised that uneducated whites are unreceptive to individuals who castigate them as being inherently racist and incompetent? Would any reasonable person expect Latinos to view Trump favorably after he stereotyped them all as being rapists and criminals? — Addy, U.S."
I don't think respect is the answer. Donald Trump calls Americans "stupid," brags about grabbing women, calls Hispanics rapists and criminals, vows to deport immigrants, tries to block Muslims, says he knows more than our military generals, makes fun of disabled people, claims Clinton is meeting secretly with Jewish bankers..... He has no respect for anything or anyone but himself - a subject that totally fascinates him. When ignorant mobs chant "Lock her up!" based on no evidence whatsoever -- they deserve no respect.
I don't think respect is the answer. Donald Trump calls Americans "stupid," brags about grabbing women, calls Hispanics rapists and criminals, vows to deport immigrants, tries to block Muslims, says he knows more than our military generals, makes fun of disabled people, claims Clinton is meeting secretly with Jewish bankers..... He has no respect for anything or anyone but himself - a subject that totally fascinates him. When ignorant mobs chant "Lock her up!" based on no evidence whatsoever -- they deserve no respect.
16
See my comment re: evaluate the person himself, psychologically, re: mental balance, stability, dependability, etc. before you even listen to what he says. Evaluate behavior.
1
I have a doctorate in mathematics from Princeton and I am voting for Trump.
Public education in most American cities is terrible. The post moderns inculcate
anti-logic for 12 years causing permanent damage to the logic system. Thus,
we have a young population largely deprived of skills which would make them
productive and well balanced. The most damaging thing for America is not
Putin or militant Islam. though these are dangerous indeed. Rather it is the departments of education which turn out teachers who tell students that
Public education in most American cities is terrible. The post moderns inculcate
anti-logic for 12 years causing permanent damage to the logic system. Thus,
we have a young population largely deprived of skills which would make them
productive and well balanced. The most damaging thing for America is not
Putin or militant Islam. though these are dangerous indeed. Rather it is the departments of education which turn out teachers who tell students that
6
and of course, Trump is going to improve it by appointing DeVos.
2
I think when you characterize the Trump voters as uneducated, I would include travel exposure. The whites who have traveled and who are not fearful of meeting new people 10 to vote for Hillary. The Trump voters who may be white and college-educated tend to be fearful. They may have gone to college, but they sheltered themselves from meeting new people outside of their Circle. I would track the differences in travel between the Trump supporters and the Clinton supporters. The white educated conservatives in Houston tend to live in suburbs or in white neighborhoods. The white liberals live in more integrated neighborhoods and closer to downtown Houston. I would track where they live how much they have traveled, and how diverse their church is. In sum, fear of the other is the biggest difference.
11
My theory has nothing to do with IQ or Maslow's Heirarchy of Needs, or universities as hotbeds of Liberal propaganda. I believe the explanation has somewhat more to do with the effect that higher education has on One's understanding of problems and solutions in general. The less you know about a topic the less likely you are to understand all the complexities of that topic. Therefore simplistic "solutions" to seemingly simple (yet actually complex) problems may have more appeal.
One thing a University student quickly realises is the general rule that problems are a lot more complex than they may appear on the surface and that the more you study a subject the more complex it reveals itself to be. This experience of realising that problems have hidden levels of complexity quite plausibly serves to cause a person to question "simplistic" solutions to problems because of a realisation that in factvall problems have hidden levels of complexity that only people who have specialised in those areas can hope to fully understand.
A person who has had no opportunity to learn this lesson through pursuing higher studies is more likely to be drawn to a candidate like Trump who proposes simplistic solutions ("we're gonna build a wall to keep the Mexicans out!") to complex problems. Meanwhile a person who is not trained to study issues to the level of depth required in higher education is more likely to "switch off" when confronted with complex solutions.
One thing a University student quickly realises is the general rule that problems are a lot more complex than they may appear on the surface and that the more you study a subject the more complex it reveals itself to be. This experience of realising that problems have hidden levels of complexity quite plausibly serves to cause a person to question "simplistic" solutions to problems because of a realisation that in factvall problems have hidden levels of complexity that only people who have specialised in those areas can hope to fully understand.
A person who has had no opportunity to learn this lesson through pursuing higher studies is more likely to be drawn to a candidate like Trump who proposes simplistic solutions ("we're gonna build a wall to keep the Mexicans out!") to complex problems. Meanwhile a person who is not trained to study issues to the level of depth required in higher education is more likely to "switch off" when confronted with complex solutions.
12
I have a theory, not about the white working class who support the likes of Trump in the USA, or Nigel Farage in the UK, but about the commentators who enthuse and inflame them.
Without mentioning any particular names, because they are easily found, almost without exception, these right wing commentators have huge personality flaws which seem to find their best expression in provocation. Contrarianism is their stock in trade, and it is lucrative. Patriots they are not. Self aggrandising, self-enrichers, they certainly are. Almost universally narcissistic to a pathological degree, the outrage their provocations elicit serve only to stoke the narcissistic fire within, so they can't stop themselves being even more outrageous. Surprisingly thin skinned, however, when confronted by an assertive voice of reason from the left or centre, they become shrill, either escalating the irrational rhetoric, or crying " foul" on being called out for what they are. My hunch is that we are into personality disorder territory here, from Trump right down to his most strident apologists. We see the worst result of their efforts at just about every Trump rally. As in post-Brexit Britain, a great deal of healing needs to happen soon, and that takes leadership. Hillary, you're needed.
Without mentioning any particular names, because they are easily found, almost without exception, these right wing commentators have huge personality flaws which seem to find their best expression in provocation. Contrarianism is their stock in trade, and it is lucrative. Patriots they are not. Self aggrandising, self-enrichers, they certainly are. Almost universally narcissistic to a pathological degree, the outrage their provocations elicit serve only to stoke the narcissistic fire within, so they can't stop themselves being even more outrageous. Surprisingly thin skinned, however, when confronted by an assertive voice of reason from the left or centre, they become shrill, either escalating the irrational rhetoric, or crying " foul" on being called out for what they are. My hunch is that we are into personality disorder territory here, from Trump right down to his most strident apologists. We see the worst result of their efforts at just about every Trump rally. As in post-Brexit Britain, a great deal of healing needs to happen soon, and that takes leadership. Hillary, you're needed.
17
See my comment re: evaluate the individual themselves for stability, history of interaction with others, personality disorders, etc. Had a lot of the DJT voters done that, they would not have voted the way that they did.
1
Here's one anecdote: I have an acquaintance in TX who is my age -- she's the kid sister of my sister's friend from high school. She got pregnant her senior year of high school, dropped out, had 2 kids with first husband who was not a great guy, then married a somewhat better guy and had a third kid. She is middle-aged (51) but looks at least a decade older and she has 3 grandkids. Due to poor health, she doesn't work and is on disability. Never got an education. Fervent Tea Party supporter voting for Trump. Lots and lots of complaining about immigrants, illegal aliens, Hispanics, Muslims, any 'other' who is 'taking' from her. She is convinced the government is lavishing money on all these foreigners. She doesn't think the government is doing enough for her. She denigrates her daughter-in-law, a teacher, because she is 'too strict' with her daughters (this woman's granddaughters) -- so she feeds them all the candy they want, in defiance of their mother's wishes.
In other words, this woman is an overgrown child. Undisciplined, complaining, self-entitled. Her love of someone like Donald Trump is all about white privilege, he says all of the racist and xenophobic things she wants to hear. The corrosive effect of racism, needing to feel superior, maybe because a little voice inside your head is hinting at your actual inferiority. And that stings.
In other words, this woman is an overgrown child. Undisciplined, complaining, self-entitled. Her love of someone like Donald Trump is all about white privilege, he says all of the racist and xenophobic things she wants to hear. The corrosive effect of racism, needing to feel superior, maybe because a little voice inside your head is hinting at your actual inferiority. And that stings.
20
To think that all trump supporters are white trailer trash racists, is white washing over the history of racists lawyers on our scotus , congress and potus, or the scientists , theologians, doctors and other professionals of america who were plainly just bigots .
2
I find your comment very ironic. Your statement might lead one to believe you are characteristically the very things you accuse your opposition of being. I personally don't feel stereotyping a group of people and being derogatory ever helped anyone or anything. I think individuals like yourself that reside on either side are a problem. People can agree to disagree about things. Just for the record I am bi-racial and grew up in a multi cultural family. Was raised poor in a TRAILER but worked my way through college and am educated and work in a hospital helping save lives in an OR. Oh yeah did I say I am a woman. All of the people like yourself stereotyping citizens like myself as racist uneducated trash is unbelievable. I am ready for something new. Something different. I don't care about personality flaws at this point, it feels like our beautiful country is about to implode. Doing something the same way over and over again and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity.
The more education you have the less likely it is that global trade pacts, mass immigration, and environmental regulations have been harmful to your livelihood.
6
"The more education you have the less likely it is that global trade pacts, mass immigration, and environmental regulations have been harmful to your livelihood."
I agree with you. Which is why we need to improve the reach and breadth of education.
I agree with you. Which is why we need to improve the reach and breadth of education.
3
Never make "all" nor "none" statements without complete study. One of the first things learned in "Basic Logic" C-41, U.of Fla.
1
2/2
Economic stress of the recession & the following years has made it harder for people to meet their basic needs, which has had a negative impact on self-actualization. When jobs & income are lacking, food & shelter become more of a worry. Self-actualization is not possible if you have to worry about where your next meal will come from.
It's no surprise than that those struggling economically are more apt to vote for Trump. They are too worried about their own survival to think about improving the lives of others through social government programs. They see helping others as a threat to their own survival, & Trump plays on these fears beautifully.
To truly change the world our goal should be to help as many people as possible meet their basic needs, so more people will be motivated to achieve self-actualization. This would create a world where people want to help each other, instead of the Republican way of acting like its every person for themselves. After all, we really are #bettertogether
Economic stress of the recession & the following years has made it harder for people to meet their basic needs, which has had a negative impact on self-actualization. When jobs & income are lacking, food & shelter become more of a worry. Self-actualization is not possible if you have to worry about where your next meal will come from.
It's no surprise than that those struggling economically are more apt to vote for Trump. They are too worried about their own survival to think about improving the lives of others through social government programs. They see helping others as a threat to their own survival, & Trump plays on these fears beautifully.
To truly change the world our goal should be to help as many people as possible meet their basic needs, so more people will be motivated to achieve self-actualization. This would create a world where people want to help each other, instead of the Republican way of acting like its every person for themselves. After all, we really are #bettertogether
2
1/2
The divide between Clinton & Trump voters is more pervasive than just educated vs non-educated individuals. It speaks more to our core levels of psychological health & what motivates our behavior.
According to Abraham Maslow's theory, we all have needs, from the most basic survival needs (food, safety, shelter) to higher level needs (love, self-esteem, etc.). Meeting these needs is what motivates our behavior. Once lower level needs are met, we are motivated to achieve the higher level needs.
Self-actualization, defined as the realization & fulfillment of one's full potential, is the apex of his hierarchy. The desire for self-actualization often motivates people to focus on the greater good, help others in need, & leave the world a better place.
Achieving self-actualization can be directly related to exposure to transformational experiences. These can be many things, from volunteer work, to traveling abroad. College can be one of the most common transformational experiences, but higher education is not a requirement to be self-actualized. Those who participate in programs like the Peace Corps also score high on measures of self-actualization, regardless of education level.
The important thing about these experiences is that they expose a person to different people, surroundings, & situations. This fosters empathy, critical thinking skills, an appreciation for different ways of understanding the world, & a strong sense of responsibility to help each other.
The divide between Clinton & Trump voters is more pervasive than just educated vs non-educated individuals. It speaks more to our core levels of psychological health & what motivates our behavior.
According to Abraham Maslow's theory, we all have needs, from the most basic survival needs (food, safety, shelter) to higher level needs (love, self-esteem, etc.). Meeting these needs is what motivates our behavior. Once lower level needs are met, we are motivated to achieve the higher level needs.
Self-actualization, defined as the realization & fulfillment of one's full potential, is the apex of his hierarchy. The desire for self-actualization often motivates people to focus on the greater good, help others in need, & leave the world a better place.
Achieving self-actualization can be directly related to exposure to transformational experiences. These can be many things, from volunteer work, to traveling abroad. College can be one of the most common transformational experiences, but higher education is not a requirement to be self-actualized. Those who participate in programs like the Peace Corps also score high on measures of self-actualization, regardless of education level.
The important thing about these experiences is that they expose a person to different people, surroundings, & situations. This fosters empathy, critical thinking skills, an appreciation for different ways of understanding the world, & a strong sense of responsibility to help each other.
5
A good education (which I have) will put a high premium on the TRUTH. Trump has lied all year--"Crime is WAY UP! it's a war zone out there." is but one of his heinous and obvious lies.
Is he a psychopath? Does he even know he is lying? I think the former is true. Trump is THE WORST candidate EVER in USA presidential history! His racism--his utter lack of any plan for anything( but building a wall and putting women in jail for abortions) shows what a "potemkin" candidate he is.
Trump is certainly "full of sound and fury--signifying nothing." His supporters are voting against "the big bad wolf" HRC. a more dimwitted crew I have never seen. I was physically attacked by a trumper when i called him a racist (turns out to be true, according to his friends). If anyine called me that i would laugh--because I am NOT one! these trumpers are dangerous and shallow people.
Is he a psychopath? Does he even know he is lying? I think the former is true. Trump is THE WORST candidate EVER in USA presidential history! His racism--his utter lack of any plan for anything( but building a wall and putting women in jail for abortions) shows what a "potemkin" candidate he is.
Trump is certainly "full of sound and fury--signifying nothing." His supporters are voting against "the big bad wolf" HRC. a more dimwitted crew I have never seen. I was physically attacked by a trumper when i called him a racist (turns out to be true, according to his friends). If anyine called me that i would laugh--because I am NOT one! these trumpers are dangerous and shallow people.
6
How about the psychology of the different voting groups? For instance conservatives having an external locus of control vs. liberals having an internal locus of control? Also concrete thinkers vs. abstract thinkers. And more black and white moral reasoning vs. more variance in moral reasoning. And then there is the competitive mind vs. the cooperating mind. All this ties into why so many of the American people are gullible to propaganda, military aggression, pitting one group against another, having to be number one, thinking their group or country is exceptional and that others are inferior. It is more than liberal vs. conservative. Both presidential candidates are not worthy of being great leaders of a large and diverse country and those who might be better suited cannot get past the bad propaganda from the main stream media. Most people do not do much research about the people they vote for or the people who are cabinet members and congressional committee leaders. So many of these politicians are flawed and corrupt, but they are favored by the democrats and republicans to hold office. Its complicated but this article touches on a lot of the factors that may really be about ignorance regardless of education, class, or wealth.
5
I disagree re:" both candidates" comment, but the rest of the comment is on target.
Republicans are finding it harder and harder to hang on to a majority base. People with more developed critical reasoning skills aren't buying what they're selling, what with tax plans that have been favoring the very rich and the business world supporting profits over people with reorgs, merges, layoffs, and globalization. I believe they have seen this coming for a long time. I've been watching presidential politics for about 50 years and believe it started when Reagan started de-emphasizing education. You have evidence of this in the current article with Santorum calling President Obama a snob because he encouraged people to go to college. Unfortunately, there are two other tactics Republican leadership must rely on: 1) making people hate or fear whole groups of others, and 2) disseminating and managing misinformation. Perhaps the best example of this is the right's continuing to paint Clinton as a liar when fact check websites such as PolitiFact consistently show Trump lied at a fantastically higher rate.
11
I think education is coincidental here, not causal. There are people who didn't complete high school who are able to reason and are not guilible. And there are highly educated individuals who believe Fox News is acutal news, that climate change is a fluke, that more guns will solve the gun problem, and so on.
12
Darned right that “the I.Q. connection is purely speculative”; nearly everything about I.Q. is speculative in my view. What higher education provides, or should provide (speaking as an ex-university faculty member) is reinforcement for the desire to inquire into the nature of things, and hopefully some intellectual tools for this inquiry, plus, also hopefully, a push to keep inquiring after the student graduates.
Thus, higher education, if it is effective, produces citizens who are less apt to swallow what D. J. Trump has been spewing out, because they can understand why they should reject it.
Of course, the contrast of big city residents vs. everybody else also has something to do with it. Throughout the history of cities over the world, living in cities has encouraged a broader view of the world, which would also make one very skeptical of Mr. Trump’s claims.
Thus, higher education, if it is effective, produces citizens who are less apt to swallow what D. J. Trump has been spewing out, because they can understand why they should reject it.
Of course, the contrast of big city residents vs. everybody else also has something to do with it. Throughout the history of cities over the world, living in cities has encouraged a broader view of the world, which would also make one very skeptical of Mr. Trump’s claims.
11
I think it's difficult to apply any traditional analysis to the particular presidential campaign. This match-up is so unique that I'm not sure if a "textbook" political evaluation should be applied.
First, I believe these are the two most well-known (non-incumbent) candidates we've ever had, and they're facing each other. Both are national and international personalities so many have had long-formed opinions of each candidate well before the election cycle began.
Second, the celebrity nature of this race has really made the typical election issues take a backseat to discussions boiling down to who do you hate the least.
First, I believe these are the two most well-known (non-incumbent) candidates we've ever had, and they're facing each other. Both are national and international personalities so many have had long-formed opinions of each candidate well before the election cycle began.
Second, the celebrity nature of this race has really made the typical election issues take a backseat to discussions boiling down to who do you hate the least.
3
You can't simultaneously dismantle the manufacturing and farming economies that were the mainstay of so many thousands of American communities, while revving up social issues on multiple fronts that are anathema to segments of these very white communities' religious beliefs, and expect support. Add to that mix a good helping of seemingly educated whites in these areas who are simply just white power racists, as Mary from Los Banos suggested below. Bingo!
I can't believe that neoliberals and Republicans didn't see the fallout that globalization would have on so many of our communities, so it must be assumed they felt these people were expendible. Let's not kid ourselves - mainstream Dems and Republicans are on the same Wall St. page - they just manipulated voters differently via social agendas.
I can't believe that neoliberals and Republicans didn't see the fallout that globalization would have on so many of our communities, so it must be assumed they felt these people were expendible. Let's not kid ourselves - mainstream Dems and Republicans are on the same Wall St. page - they just manipulated voters differently via social agendas.
7
I guess anyone, being educated, can be tarred with the brush of "elitism" and called names like "smug" or worse -- as has always been the case. That is the price those who started out in disadvantaged or uneducated circles but who become educated have always paid for being "uppity" or aspiring to improve themselves and rise from their origins.
Why do people tend to become liberal as they become more educated? Is it indoctrination by some evil force? Or maybe it is because they know more about the world? Because they have an enhanced ability to recognize fact from fiction, and to respect and value fact? These are now "liberal" attributes, it seems. Is it because the educated have developed higher-order critical thinking abilities? An understanding of scientific method? A distrust of "conspiracy theory" rhetoric and a deep suspicion of factoids spread like infections across the Internet? Because they have learned in the classroom how to have civil conversations about issues, and to recognize the difference between honest mistakes or differences of opinion, and intentional misinformation and reckless disregard for the truth?
There was a reason Thomas Jefferson wanted the electorate to be as educated as possible. He believed in a meritocracy of education, an elite composed not of inherited wealth and privilege, but of knowledge and achievement. In those days "elite" was not a term of abuse, and neither was "liberal."
Why do people tend to become liberal as they become more educated? Is it indoctrination by some evil force? Or maybe it is because they know more about the world? Because they have an enhanced ability to recognize fact from fiction, and to respect and value fact? These are now "liberal" attributes, it seems. Is it because the educated have developed higher-order critical thinking abilities? An understanding of scientific method? A distrust of "conspiracy theory" rhetoric and a deep suspicion of factoids spread like infections across the Internet? Because they have learned in the classroom how to have civil conversations about issues, and to recognize the difference between honest mistakes or differences of opinion, and intentional misinformation and reckless disregard for the truth?
There was a reason Thomas Jefferson wanted the electorate to be as educated as possible. He believed in a meritocracy of education, an elite composed not of inherited wealth and privilege, but of knowledge and achievement. In those days "elite" was not a term of abuse, and neither was "liberal."
12
While I agree that getting a higher education can help us understand the world and develop critical thinking skills, I disagree with some of what you and others are arguing. We had many very uncivil conversations in my law school classes. There are racist and misogynistic lawyers, doctors, clergy members, lawmakers, etc. All of Congress (very nearly), the MSM, and the vast majority of Americans were fooled by President GW Bush into believing we were invading Iraq because of their WMDs, etc. We are kidding ourselves, in my opinion, if we believe that our education (and the higher intelligence level some assume this implies) protect us against all propaganda. The Democrats and Replicans alike use all sorts of propaganda and rhetoric to persuade us. Both use culture issues to bind us together in our opposition of the other. On some issues, I agree it is easier to fool those with less formal education on some issues, like climate change. So education is important, like Jefferson said. (The quality of 1-12 education and the politics of the same are important, too. Why do so many of our textbooks come out of Texas?). But I fear some of us sees ourselves as too bright and well educated to be duped, and I think that's dangerous, too. An important part of what I've learned from 20 years of formal education is, particularly with my Philosophy degree is just how little I'll ever know. Humility will serve us well here.
6
If you think evolution is "just a theory"...
If you think you are getting informed by watching Fox "News" (sic)...
If you think anything in the Times is liberal propaganda...
then you will almost certainly support Republican candidates.
If you think you are getting informed by watching Fox "News" (sic)...
If you think anything in the Times is liberal propaganda...
then you will almost certainly support Republican candidates.
10
Interesting article. Trump was once quoted saying "If I were to run for President it would be as a Republican because they are the dumbest voters." It seems to be true.
11
I am a white male, earned a B.A. and a JD, and an have an IQ of 131. I, however, am still stuck in the cultural war. I have no problem voting for a crusty non-politician, when the alternative choice is an immoral, greedy, self-aggrandizing, corrupt globalist.
1
You did not look too loosely at DJT's past history, did you? His own district voted heavily against him--they knew him.
Educated people tend to be among the smug elites who have a stake in globalization and disdain the working class.Hillary is a perfect example of a camp follower of Wall Street and so are an army of lawyers, accountants and even owner of expense account restaurants.
This distaste for the majority of ordinary Americans may stem from class insecurity as most of our elites are a generation or so removed from the working class themselves. Nevertheless the fact that so many Americans feel alienated from our elites and these people vote indicates there is a big flaw in the economic theories behind neoliberalism and globalization.
This distaste for the majority of ordinary Americans may stem from class insecurity as most of our elites are a generation or so removed from the working class themselves. Nevertheless the fact that so many Americans feel alienated from our elites and these people vote indicates there is a big flaw in the economic theories behind neoliberalism and globalization.
1
You seem to equate "educated" with wealth and "working class" with ignorance. In my world there is little relation between the two. Donald Trump is a good example. He is one the "east coast elite," if anyone is, yet he is one of the most ignorant and uneducated individuals who has ever run for a major public office. Being successful financially is not necessarily correlated with education, either. There are many working-class people, and poor people too, in my community, who are either highly educated themselves, or respect and value education and will sacrifice almost anything to get it. By the same token, there are lots of wealthy people who have little education and got wealthy through land speculation or other means that did not require advanced degrees. They are the ones who figure that if they did ok without it, why does anyone else need it?
13
Research shows that Clinton's lack of appeal in the group classified as "less educated voters" may stem from an IQ gap, and the instinctive way that it is perceived, even in groups of children. (see below) Trump can access, and appeal to, this group because he is no where near as smart as Clinton.
According to Leta Hollingworth’s research, to be a leader of his contemporaries a child must be more intelligent but not too much more intelligent than them. A discrepancy of more than about 30 points of IQ does not allow for leadership, or even respect or effective communication.
Hollingworth notes: A lesson which many gifted persons never learn as long as they live is that human beings in general are inherently very different from themselves in thought, in action, in general intention, and in interests. Many a reformer has died at the hands of a mob which he was trying to improve in the belief that other human beings can and should enjoy what he enjoys.
According to Leta Hollingworth’s research, to be a leader of his contemporaries a child must be more intelligent but not too much more intelligent than them. A discrepancy of more than about 30 points of IQ does not allow for leadership, or even respect or effective communication.
Hollingworth notes: A lesson which many gifted persons never learn as long as they live is that human beings in general are inherently very different from themselves in thought, in action, in general intention, and in interests. Many a reformer has died at the hands of a mob which he was trying to improve in the belief that other human beings can and should enjoy what he enjoys.
9
It's safe to say the Republican party does not covet these uneducated voters. They generally are not capital C conservatives when it comes to expensive entitlement programs, they do not support free trade and as a group and it's been proven they will reject minorities, the only demographic currently expanding in the United States. I don't believe the Republican party considers them ignorant, but they sure as hell don't want them. Welcome to Donald's realignment of the body politic where the Republicans are at immediate odds with Republican voters because it dooms the party to an era gone by.
5
It's true in a sense that the Party as such doesn't see them as "one of us," but they have historically courted these voters because the core agenda of the Republican Party - the tax cutting big business agenda - doesn't truly appeal to that many people. It doesn't benefit most people; given income and wealth distribution in the United States, it's always only going to benefit a minority. Appeals to the uneducated voters are a longtime informal coalition strategy of the Republican Party.
4
Once upon a time --- before cable TV news, before online blogs and other special interest sites --- all Americans shared the news of the day in the same way. Families would watch Walter Cronkite or another authoritative news anchor at 6 p.m.; we never had reason to know that anchor's personal political leanings. Our choice of newspaper might have varied but print news was not nearly as biased by the political point of view of the publisher as it is today. But now we all reside in a news bubble of our own choosing. We subscribe to "news' that we agree with. We spout "facts" that are not facts at all but opinions that bolster our political leanings, often these are 'facts' offered by bloggers whose sole qualification is the ability to use Word Press to become a so-called citizen journalist. Is it any wonder then that half of Americans look at the other half wondering how it's possible that the opposing half could believe what they're saying, could support the candidate they're supporting? Simply put, we're now not all citizens of the same nation, citizens who share a common experience of the day's "news."
9
A higher education doesn't guarantee anything in the way of objectivity regarding voting preferences. Don't let anyone convince you otherwise. Human nature hasn't progressed much from the stone age Neanderthals- despite protestations to the contrary.
Except they're now Neanderthals with cellphones and technology.
Bias and fear are the chief motivators whatever the political affiliation. Add mass propaganda, manipulation and mind control to the recipe and you literally have a recipe for disaster, on both sides.
Modern universities are bastions of political correctness to the point where they threaten academic freedoms. Hello humanities faculties everywhere -I'm talking mainly to you- with these institutions now nothing but brain washing centers churning out post-modern automatons devoid of the intellectual vigour these disciplines possessed in the past.
Except they're now Neanderthals with cellphones and technology.
Bias and fear are the chief motivators whatever the political affiliation. Add mass propaganda, manipulation and mind control to the recipe and you literally have a recipe for disaster, on both sides.
Modern universities are bastions of political correctness to the point where they threaten academic freedoms. Hello humanities faculties everywhere -I'm talking mainly to you- with these institutions now nothing but brain washing centers churning out post-modern automatons devoid of the intellectual vigour these disciplines possessed in the past.
2
My parents could barely read, being black and from the deep South, but I am a person who cannot tolerate most of TV and spend many hours reading daily. I read only the verifiable sources and not too much from blogs and new net media.
I was gifted with a very high IQ so I did learn to love stuff in print early. When I did a reality check on Trump years ago, I dispensed with him as a source of anything that I could possibly want.. As for Mrs. Clinton, I was with them through Paula Jones and Monica as I watched things improve for all people during their stay at the WH. I will be here for them during the next stay, I hope. Mr. Trump is a vegetable in an entre calling only for meat. When anyone tells me that they do not read, whether they realize it or not, what they are telling me is all dialogue is over. I have better use for my time.
I was gifted with a very high IQ so I did learn to love stuff in print early. When I did a reality check on Trump years ago, I dispensed with him as a source of anything that I could possibly want.. As for Mrs. Clinton, I was with them through Paula Jones and Monica as I watched things improve for all people during their stay at the WH. I will be here for them during the next stay, I hope. Mr. Trump is a vegetable in an entre calling only for meat. When anyone tells me that they do not read, whether they realize it or not, what they are telling me is all dialogue is over. I have better use for my time.
10
You go , girl! I was in a similar, but not exact boat. I came along when you had only books and newspapers--I even pre-dated TV. So I started at "A: in our small town library and read everything through the end of "Z". I paid very close attention in high school, and learned every single thing I could. I used what I had learned in high school to make it possible to work my way through college, and used that to work my way through medical school. Is anyone able to do that any more? No one who did it that way would EVER vote for Trump.
I'm having a hard time putting on all the square pegs into one round hole. I'm actually just baffled. I know college-educated (one with a PhD in theology) women who support Trump and/or hate Obama and Hillary and I know some less educated (barely high school degreed) women who are staunch Hillary supporters. It's easier with the men. Those I know who deep down are racist and misogynist are definitely for Trump. And of course, they are, to a man, white. Some have college degrees; some don't.
I am fearful of the deep underlying hatred of our government and rejection of the rule of law by so many of its citizens and I think this can be directly traced to the rise of the Tea Party, a racist movement if ever there was one.
It's always been about God (my white Christian religion, not yours), guns (the more the better) and gays (it's my way or the highway and that includes keeping your women at home, carrying as many children as I want you to have). The Republican Party just successfully tapped into that and voila! Donald Trump was produced.
I am fearful of the deep underlying hatred of our government and rejection of the rule of law by so many of its citizens and I think this can be directly traced to the rise of the Tea Party, a racist movement if ever there was one.
It's always been about God (my white Christian religion, not yours), guns (the more the better) and gays (it's my way or the highway and that includes keeping your women at home, carrying as many children as I want you to have). The Republican Party just successfully tapped into that and voila! Donald Trump was produced.
10
I am literally surrounded by people, mostly retired, mostly from the mid-west, but a sizable number from upstate N.Y., mostly collecting social security and on medicare, who would fare better under a Clinton administration but who are voting for Trump. They are united in their abject hatred of Hillary Clinton. Of maybe 50 Trump voters in the groups I move around in, about 5 are wealthy enough that they would probably make out better financially under a Trump administration. About 5 are 2nd amendment people. I just don't understand how these people, some of them quite smart, can be fooled by Trump into believing a word he says. If he ever spoke the truth his teeth would fall out. He has no intention of doing anything he's spoken about. His sole intention is to make money. That's how he gauges success. And since he's largely a fraud, leveraged up to his eyeballs, and has little money, to date he's not a success in his own eyes, and tries to hide this fact from the public. Hence his refusal to release his taxes and his thin skin.
10
My only argument would be that $$ may not be his only motivator. That man needs a LOT of attention. He needs that EGO stroked.
7
Thank you Jim for reminding me never to retire to Florida.
I find being surrounded by wilfully ignorant people a very frustrating experience. I don't know how you can put up with it.
I find being surrounded by wilfully ignorant people a very frustrating experience. I don't know how you can put up with it.
5
Higher education is a correlate for valuing institutional norms. The people who seek an education also have values that support normal candidates like HRC over DT. Not specific to actual activity that takes place on campus since political affiliation is not about specific policies or ideas.
2
Part of a good education is the opening of the mind to ideas that are very different from the ideas one grows up with. Another important part of education, especially in schools that require students live in multi-ethnic dorms for at least their freshman year, is the realization that with all those people who may appear and on the surface act very differently than what you are accustomed to, finding your shared humanity with them helps lessen the racial bias you grew up with.
I believe that the reason people who never leave their small towns and see the world, or at least the microcosm of the world that is college, tend to be closed-minded is that they haven't learned how wrong stereotypes are through personal experience and empathizing with people who are "different" (a different race, religion, sexuality, gender identification, etc.). If you stay in a small town, your mind stays small and closed because there is nothing there to open it. There is only white Christian "us" and everyone else is forever "other."
I believe that the reason people who never leave their small towns and see the world, or at least the microcosm of the world that is college, tend to be closed-minded is that they haven't learned how wrong stereotypes are through personal experience and empathizing with people who are "different" (a different race, religion, sexuality, gender identification, etc.). If you stay in a small town, your mind stays small and closed because there is nothing there to open it. There is only white Christian "us" and everyone else is forever "other."
7
"Addy" writes... "Is anyone surprised that uneducated whites are unreceptive to individuals who castigate them as being inherently racist and incompetent?"
Um, might that be because 'uneducated whites' often seem so 'receptive' to inherently racist and incompetent candidates (like for example, you-know-who)?!
Um, might that be because 'uneducated whites' often seem so 'receptive' to inherently racist and incompetent candidates (like for example, you-know-who)?!
8
To be educated is to know how little you know, and how to work with that.
8
The policy of affirmative action which liberal Democrats all seem to like is something that less than college educated whites resent. The thinking behind this policy is to give a leg up to those discriminated in the past. But if less than college educated whites, did not really participate in the past of being favored for being white, they just can not see why liberal Democrats are defending this policy over 48 years since Lyndon Johnson initiated it.
Add to this, the liberal Democrats and really most all Democrats favoring liberal and high immigration levels. That policy of 1,000,000 legal immigrants moving to the USA each year puts pressure on the less educated to compete for jobs.
So it is no wonder that the white working class resents the liberal educated class. The well educated are just above the fray for the most part. Too qualified to be affected by affirmative action for the most part, and not having to compete with the high level of foreigners arriving here.
Add to this, the liberal Democrats and really most all Democrats favoring liberal and high immigration levels. That policy of 1,000,000 legal immigrants moving to the USA each year puts pressure on the less educated to compete for jobs.
So it is no wonder that the white working class resents the liberal educated class. The well educated are just above the fray for the most part. Too qualified to be affected by affirmative action for the most part, and not having to compete with the high level of foreigners arriving here.
5
I lived through the last Republican governor of Washington State, John Spellman, calling the far-right nuts who were ruining his governorship and re-election chances in 1984, "troglodytes." and they were. Republicans have not held the governor's office since. I was living in Seattle in 1988 when a Republican lawyer staggered into an event for Bill Gate's father, shocked at being overwhelmed in his local caucus as part of the wave of newbies who nominated Pat Robertson for President in 1988.
I moved back to Eastern Washington shortly thereafter, and (actual) political correctness, Andrea-Dworkin-style feminism, and hyper-affirmative action on the campus where I taught had me ready to try to revive moderate Republicanism in Washington. Instead, Newt Gingrich, right-wing media, and 1994 all hit, knocking Tom Foley out of the Speakership of the House, changing what had been a 50/50 split among legislators east of the Cascades into more and more of a Republican stronghold (now holding all offices outside of central Spokane, east of the western slopes of the Cascades).
Right-wing media is misinformation for the ignorant, and it is political pornography for those who should know better, but just love to hear it.
The Snopes and the Ewells of the world were once shamed into silence by the local Republican elites. Now, cynical plutocrats have given us political pornography that has captured the Republican Party, by controlling the primaries through nut-job media. A real mess.
I moved back to Eastern Washington shortly thereafter, and (actual) political correctness, Andrea-Dworkin-style feminism, and hyper-affirmative action on the campus where I taught had me ready to try to revive moderate Republicanism in Washington. Instead, Newt Gingrich, right-wing media, and 1994 all hit, knocking Tom Foley out of the Speakership of the House, changing what had been a 50/50 split among legislators east of the Cascades into more and more of a Republican stronghold (now holding all offices outside of central Spokane, east of the western slopes of the Cascades).
Right-wing media is misinformation for the ignorant, and it is political pornography for those who should know better, but just love to hear it.
The Snopes and the Ewells of the world were once shamed into silence by the local Republican elites. Now, cynical plutocrats have given us political pornography that has captured the Republican Party, by controlling the primaries through nut-job media. A real mess.
5
Why isn't anyone noticing that sexism is playing a huge role among the 'uneducated' men that form Trump's base? Both implicit and explicit sexism seem to be at play here. I haven't seen a single poll or opinion piece that mentions that many of these men would never vote for a woman, and hold any woman candidate to an unattainable double standard.
6
This election is not a true test. Misogyny weighs heavily on it. There are sections of the electorate that do not want a woman president just as there are sections that hated Barack Obama for the color of his skin. Bigotry has no boundaries of education, intellect or locale. It may have a boundary of age but if you look at Trump rallies you see an a lot of young men pounding the gavel for Trump. But we must ask ourselves how many of those young men are carrying forth the opinions of their fathers or older male role models?
It's been said if HRC were a man there would be no contest. And I believe this. I also believe that the media made Donald Trump with their obsessive coverage. Had they covered him like a normal candidate he would have fizzled away never getting the nomination. But greed propelled them and like substance abusers they couldn't turn away.
Additionally, I think the GOP did something wonderful for themselves destroying labor unions. My grandfather was a member of the UAW and never graduated from high school. The UAW told it's membership what was in their best interest and who they should consider choosing at the polls. What we are really seeing today is a selection of the population adrift. They are not capable of making an educated decision about who they should choose and baring any sensible advice they vote for the candidate who screams the loudest. They are simply not equipped to recognize the swindler.
It's been said if HRC were a man there would be no contest. And I believe this. I also believe that the media made Donald Trump with their obsessive coverage. Had they covered him like a normal candidate he would have fizzled away never getting the nomination. But greed propelled them and like substance abusers they couldn't turn away.
Additionally, I think the GOP did something wonderful for themselves destroying labor unions. My grandfather was a member of the UAW and never graduated from high school. The UAW told it's membership what was in their best interest and who they should consider choosing at the polls. What we are really seeing today is a selection of the population adrift. They are not capable of making an educated decision about who they should choose and baring any sensible advice they vote for the candidate who screams the loudest. They are simply not equipped to recognize the swindler.
10
Educated does not mean wise, learned, or informed. It's a myth that Trump's mob is somehow justified in feeling neglected, abandoned, cheated, alienated, frightened, and generally ticked off by their lives,
It's hard to discover that being white and male wasn't enough to become rich and famous. That cheeky women and minorities could sneak in and steal your country right out from under you.
What nonsense. Trump's mob is ferociously racist, misogynist, homophobic, and sentimental for a time that simply did not exist except in their made-in-Disneyland fantasies or in 50's and 60's sitcoms, before all hell broke loose and civil rights, equal rights and disabled rights and forgodssake LGBTQ rights came on the scene.
There are lots of poor, abandoned, neglected, alienated neighborhoods in this country, and they are filled with people who would never in their worst nightmare join Trump's mob. They are called blacks and Latinos and 'others'.
There are gradations or layers of hate, starting with the alt-right and KKK-skinhead factions through the NRA and militia types, to the Tea Bag Party and the current Trump mob. We grieve that they are our neighbors, family members, casual friends or co-workers. We would never know such people if we weren't born into them or forced by job or house location to live and work beside them. They;re scary and would report you in a minute if, say, it came to civil disruption as in Sarajevo, Kosovo, Hitler's Germany or other once-civilized places.
It's hard to discover that being white and male wasn't enough to become rich and famous. That cheeky women and minorities could sneak in and steal your country right out from under you.
What nonsense. Trump's mob is ferociously racist, misogynist, homophobic, and sentimental for a time that simply did not exist except in their made-in-Disneyland fantasies or in 50's and 60's sitcoms, before all hell broke loose and civil rights, equal rights and disabled rights and forgodssake LGBTQ rights came on the scene.
There are lots of poor, abandoned, neglected, alienated neighborhoods in this country, and they are filled with people who would never in their worst nightmare join Trump's mob. They are called blacks and Latinos and 'others'.
There are gradations or layers of hate, starting with the alt-right and KKK-skinhead factions through the NRA and militia types, to the Tea Bag Party and the current Trump mob. We grieve that they are our neighbors, family members, casual friends or co-workers. We would never know such people if we weren't born into them or forced by job or house location to live and work beside them. They;re scary and would report you in a minute if, say, it came to civil disruption as in Sarajevo, Kosovo, Hitler's Germany or other once-civilized places.
15
While I did recommend your reply, I want a world where all boats rise. The white middle class has had trouble, but those supporting Trump miss something: it's not the fault of blacks, Latinos, and women.
The white men turning the screws at the corporations, the largely white male Congress, and other wealthy folk have so royally screwed the less-than-rich since 1970.
We need to go back to an earlier vision of progress for all that, with many violent setbacks, prevailed for a quarter century after 1945.
The white men turning the screws at the corporations, the largely white male Congress, and other wealthy folk have so royally screwed the less-than-rich since 1970.
We need to go back to an earlier vision of progress for all that, with many violent setbacks, prevailed for a quarter century after 1945.
2
The reason they wouldn't join Trump is because they themselves are racist. Tribalism and social benefits are their main motivations to vote.
I do think education does play a part in how one chooses to vote. An exposure to liberal arts, oops, there's that word liberal, gives a person a much wider understanding about a variety of ideas and various art forms than just a high school education does. Although what high school you attend can make a difference. I still remember a speech class I took there that emphasized backing up your statements with facts.
I took a logic class in college, and that's where I grasped how to evaluate ideas. Of course learning about western civilization, reading Dickens, learning another language and doing class readings of Shakespeare broadened how I viewed the world. I went to a large, diverse university where I met many people who were learning the same things.
Was it me or college that encouraged me to read widely on a variety of issues after graduation? I don't know. But I do know that at almost 75 most of my friends are Democrats. One dear Republican friend just left his party with the rise of Trump. We read books, talk about them, are active in local politics and social institutions, and share many values.
But then I live on the central coast of CA, a blue state. Here's a thought from out of the blue I had today. I just looked at a map of the states Hillary would or could win to become President. They are almost all close to water. I think there is a real explanation for this, but there isn't room to go into it with a limited number of characters.
I took a logic class in college, and that's where I grasped how to evaluate ideas. Of course learning about western civilization, reading Dickens, learning another language and doing class readings of Shakespeare broadened how I viewed the world. I went to a large, diverse university where I met many people who were learning the same things.
Was it me or college that encouraged me to read widely on a variety of issues after graduation? I don't know. But I do know that at almost 75 most of my friends are Democrats. One dear Republican friend just left his party with the rise of Trump. We read books, talk about them, are active in local politics and social institutions, and share many values.
But then I live on the central coast of CA, a blue state. Here's a thought from out of the blue I had today. I just looked at a map of the states Hillary would or could win to become President. They are almost all close to water. I think there is a real explanation for this, but there isn't room to go into it with a limited number of characters.
7
I read a story today in the Boston Globe about a level of mass hysteria in West Virginia, of what seem to be largely uneducated people convinced that a win by Hillary Clinton will spell the apocalypse. Remember FDR's famous speech, saying we as a nation had nothing to fear but fear itself? Here I am writing an online column, but I am convinced that our 24/7 exposure to online news, tv news, radio, and social media has ratcheted up the level of fear, paranoia and anxiety.
People with more education have perhaps more critical thinking tools at their disposal to combat false tropes and outright lies, but I am still sad and dispirited at the lack of even basic knowledge out there, about basic facts of government, of life. I wonder how many books, newspapers, magazines are in the homes of some of these fervent Trump supporters. My guess is, not many at all. Another subset are probably quite well-educated, and fully realize Trump's mendacity, but they are voting for the person who promises to lower their taxes. They are in it for the money, plain as that.
But another aspect at play is a kind of nativist tribalism. If you live in a very red pocket (or even blue, for that matter) it takes an almost superhuman level of resolve to stay confident in your opposing beliefs. You would need to keep your opinions masked to not be tormented by your friends, relatives, coworkers, neighbors. To openly broadcast your support for the 'enemy' would be to risk being shunned, and shamed.
People with more education have perhaps more critical thinking tools at their disposal to combat false tropes and outright lies, but I am still sad and dispirited at the lack of even basic knowledge out there, about basic facts of government, of life. I wonder how many books, newspapers, magazines are in the homes of some of these fervent Trump supporters. My guess is, not many at all. Another subset are probably quite well-educated, and fully realize Trump's mendacity, but they are voting for the person who promises to lower their taxes. They are in it for the money, plain as that.
But another aspect at play is a kind of nativist tribalism. If you live in a very red pocket (or even blue, for that matter) it takes an almost superhuman level of resolve to stay confident in your opposing beliefs. You would need to keep your opinions masked to not be tormented by your friends, relatives, coworkers, neighbors. To openly broadcast your support for the 'enemy' would be to risk being shunned, and shamed.
4
If you have a liberal arts education then you have studied history. If so, you know that the most horrendous, expansionary and vicious evil of the 20th century was from the Axis powers on the right. Of course, it was pretty much matched by horrors of the far left in Russia and China. However, both of those tended to be as much or more against their own citizens as against invaded lands. In any case offensive machismo sets warning bells ringing in the ears of most educated folks (especially in a nuclear age) while carefully reasoned foreign policy moves are far more accepted, Churchill's warnings prior to WWII notwithstanding.
3
Though addressed in the article using different terms, I would add that Americans with college degrees are less likely to support Mr. Trump because they find their intelligence insulted by BS artists. Liars are perhaps more universally recognized and rejected.
6
There has to be genuine access to information after any educational level. This means access to news that takes more than three seconds to elicit an emotional response. Neither of my parents were well educated but they subscribed to a news paper and they were readers who encouraged me to do the same.
What all of us who comment share is reading the NYT. We are interested in and engage with the issues. I hope we all pay for a subscription to this newspaper. Trump is afraid of this kind of media because it digs out the issues for people who take the time to think.
No matter what your level of education you need thorough and valid information to make decisions in a democracy. We need to support the media that does this and shun the media that does not.
What all of us who comment share is reading the NYT. We are interested in and engage with the issues. I hope we all pay for a subscription to this newspaper. Trump is afraid of this kind of media because it digs out the issues for people who take the time to think.
No matter what your level of education you need thorough and valid information to make decisions in a democracy. We need to support the media that does this and shun the media that does not.
32
I think it has something to do with having learned to think for yourself and to evaluate sources rather than blindly accepting what you are told as truth. I am firmly on the left, but I check facts and analyze conclusions, innuendo, and word choice, even from news sources that agree with me. I can generally rely on the NYT, for instance, but reject a lot of what Occupy Democrats says -- even when I agree with their point of view. I think Trump supporters are much more likely to accept and repeat the views and "facts" fed them by those they rely on for their news, and I think this is a function of education, and not of economic status.
5
Perhaps there is also a kind of intangible emotional intelligence and sophistication that may have nothing to do with race or religion or education or class--a kind of human savvy that allows some people to see through a Trump, in spite of having had no educational or other advantages growing up. I know a few people who certainly fit into this category.
5
I'm not so sure it's necessarily having higher education per se, but the kind of college education that dictates political preference. I did both under-grad and graduate degrees at good state schools (Auburn University and University of Tennessee). I was taught to appreciate the past and derive lessons from it, but more importantly, I was taught to read and sift through material and determine relevance based on numerous factors and draw my own conclusions and write about it. Some of my classmates in grad school went to small, conservative religious colleges or other colleges that were less demanding. They arrived unprepared for doing graduate level work, and probably left with the same degree I carried only due to grade inflation and the preponderance of "group projects" in which we all received the same grade. I suspect a number of them are Trumpites. I decidedly am not. Training the population from grade school on to read critically, recognize lies and propaganda, understand basic civics and law and logic will ensure election of better candidates, and frankly, I think that for now they will be Democrats because the underlying platform makes for a better America, and they'll be able to recognize that fact.
5
Liberal-Arts work does not make one a Liberal, but it does help make one able to think systematically and with perspective.
I know thinking Conservatives and unthinking Liberals. I just wish everyone who went to college had broader educations.
I know thinking Conservatives and unthinking Liberals. I just wish everyone who went to college had broader educations.
1
Back in the 'Jim Crow' days of the South, leading Democratic politicians maintained their hold on power by appealing to the resentments of working class whites. The result was Deep South states had the worst rankings in education, quality of life, health care, life expectancy, and income levels. Those white voters didn't vote for their self interest, instead against a whole class of blacks.
The origins of the 'income gap' began in the Deep South. As the Republican Party embraced the Southern Strategy and flipped Southern Blue States to Red, those policies of the South were adopted. Tax cuts skewed to the rich, cuts in Education and other Social programs, ideological rigidness, and a healthy dose of class resentment along racial and class lines.
Add in a wariness of 'outsiders', and you see the outlines of not only the Trump voter, but the GOP as a whole.
The origins of the 'income gap' began in the Deep South. As the Republican Party embraced the Southern Strategy and flipped Southern Blue States to Red, those policies of the South were adopted. Tax cuts skewed to the rich, cuts in Education and other Social programs, ideological rigidness, and a healthy dose of class resentment along racial and class lines.
Add in a wariness of 'outsiders', and you see the outlines of not only the Trump voter, but the GOP as a whole.
3
If professors are more liberal, that hardly means they are brainwashing their students with liberal perspective. Does anyone think that, when a history professor teaches the rise of Naziism, he or she is arguing FOR Naziism? Professors, both liberal and conservative, teach the historical conditions that enabled Naziism to emerge. They do this because their job is to teach academic history and provide evaluative tools so that students will be better prepared to grapple with future ideas they encounter. When you aren't trained to do this, you are limited to reacting emotionally, not evaluatively. Reminds you of one of our two political parties--the one that's exploding in front of our eyes.
5
For decades now, white working class voters have consistently and increasingly voted against their own economic interests. See "What's wrong with Kansas" IMHO, the only explanation for this is racial animosity. Education is the antidote to racism. Finally, the Republican party has tracked backward.
Could/would a Republican President today:
Pass major Environmental Legislation like Clean Water and Air Acts and the Endangered Species Act?
Cut a deal with a Major Geo-Political foe like Nixon did with China or Reagon did with Russian Nukes?
Remove us from the Gold Standard?
I could go on but its clear that the Rs today are irrational.
Could/would a Republican President today:
Pass major Environmental Legislation like Clean Water and Air Acts and the Endangered Species Act?
Cut a deal with a Major Geo-Political foe like Nixon did with China or Reagon did with Russian Nukes?
Remove us from the Gold Standard?
I could go on but its clear that the Rs today are irrational.
8
If you follow Trump's rhetoric and the rhetoric of Trump supporters (easy enough in the social media age,) you will see the kind of civic ignorance Justice Souter talked about in 2012. People do not know how the government can and should function, and so embrace bunk ideas and conspiracy theories. In Souter's words:
"What I worry about is that when problems are not addressed, people will not know who is responsible. And when the problems get bad enough, as they might do, for example, with another serious terrorist attack, as they might do with another financial meltdown, some one person will come forward and say, 'Give me total power and I will solve this problem.'"
"What I worry about is that when problems are not addressed, people will not know who is responsible. And when the problems get bad enough, as they might do, for example, with another serious terrorist attack, as they might do with another financial meltdown, some one person will come forward and say, 'Give me total power and I will solve this problem.'"
12
The "liberal elite" narrative is absolutely mind-blowing. My family and I are immigrants with humble roots. My parents and their siblings were the first people in their families to go to college. My cousins and I are the first to have post-graduate degrees. My grandfathers were a mechanic and a cloth merchant. My grandmothers are illiterate. So the idea that my education makes me some kind of fancy snob is very bizarre to me. Yet, that seems to be the narrative this year: liberal elites vs. salt-of-the-earth conservatives.
Behind this is a vague yet strong notion that being educated makes you some kind of villain here in America. Nobody in my family can grasp this logic. In fact, the idea that lack of education makes you inherently more intelligent and "filled with common sense" seems downright insane. But that seems to be a dominant narrative in the Trump camp.
Behind this is a vague yet strong notion that being educated makes you some kind of villain here in America. Nobody in my family can grasp this logic. In fact, the idea that lack of education makes you inherently more intelligent and "filled with common sense" seems downright insane. But that seems to be a dominant narrative in the Trump camp.
10
It is just pandering to the uneducated voter base to make them feel superior because of their lack of education to get their votes. It is not rational...it is just silly political manipulation....
3
Perhaps there's more of a dumbing down of high school education than we e taken notice of. A person who doesn't know anything about government, who asks "What's a senator?" may be ignorant but not stupid. And the media in general isn't providing much of the basic knowledge needed for democratic government.
A revival of high school civics classes might provide a lot more of the educated population that Thomas Jefferson believed necessary for a democracy to thrive.
A revival of high school civics classes might provide a lot more of the educated population that Thomas Jefferson believed necessary for a democracy to thrive.
10
My daughter in law grew up in a small western town. Her education was completed when she graduated high school. She believes Trump would make a better President because he looks more Presidential than Clinton. Issues on things like taxes and immigration get no consideration. She is proudly uninformed about politics of any sort, and will not vote. She thinks its a waste of time. I'm not doing anything to change her mind. I believe people like her have no business voting.
14
I'm an educator who does not bring politics into the classroom. But I teach my students critical thinking. That means weighing multiple ideas that conflict and seeing what the best evidence supports.
You no longer appear to learn that in most high schools, and sadly, nearly anywhere in mass media today. Everything is slanted but rarely does one read opposite slants.
America needs a new "Sputnik" moment to unite us in providing the sort of K-12 education nationally that can be found in the best public and private schools. It can be done.
You no longer appear to learn that in most high schools, and sadly, nearly anywhere in mass media today. Everything is slanted but rarely does one read opposite slants.
America needs a new "Sputnik" moment to unite us in providing the sort of K-12 education nationally that can be found in the best public and private schools. It can be done.
7
Excellent overview. In a very liberal enclave of the Berkshires in Massachusetts I hear an enormous amount of "knee-jerk" snobbism about Trump voters while always aking why would anyone support Trump. A similarity between some at the top of the heap who will vote for Trump -- old money or new -- and those without those advantages or as much education, is how much people read, especially newspapers (not skimming), magazines, non-fiction, to the variables in candidate support.
In order to support Trump entirely it is really essential that the voter get their facts directly from Trump. A solid clue to solving the mystery.
In order to support Trump entirely it is really essential that the voter get their facts directly from Trump. A solid clue to solving the mystery.
2
Higher education, and enough of an IQ to be able to absorb and analyze knowledge acquired, leads to being open to more points of view, to critical thinking and to a curiosity about the way the world operates. Of course there are too many instances of a blinkered education: a brilliant engineer who has no interest about the sweep of history or who Trump's VP nominee is and what he stands for. If you have no curiosity about the world beyond the confines of your farm, car production line or how much tax this or that candidate promises to lower then you are not aware of every demagogue charlatan history has spewed up and how disastrous things turned out. You are not aware of the well trodden path of racism to African-Americans, Irish, Italians, Native-Americans,Catholics, Mexicans, Jews and now, the latest bogeyman, Muslims. If you are not aware that the US has doubled its manufacturing capacity since 1984 with one third fewer workers due to the computer and microchip revolution then you are unable to filter out BS from a rascal who tells you the Mexican and Chinese stole your job. And if they did it's because you want to buy $12 pants from Walmart as you watch your mill job closing.
6
I saw the photos of the militia men with big guns - puffing up because they think Hillary will take their gun away. The photos of people at the Trump rallies. I don't want to get to know them, listen to their point of view anymore. I know what unites them. I.e., fear, loathing, hate, misogyny, prejudice, anger, resentment, the desire to scapegoat and lash out, and cheer while the boxcars of undesirables roll toward barbed wire and smoke stacks.
Listening would be a validation I have no interest in providing anymore.
The fires were lit by republicans; Trump poured a mix of napalm and agent orange. Their echo chamber is big, seductive, well-funded, and well organized (a mix of radio, TV, church). They are no longer a fringe, they are mainstream. I can live in denial of the rift, sing Kumbaya, wear t-shirts with 'coexist.'
Would I sit on the same table with a uniformed militia dude with a big gun, the religious bigot, the white supremacist, the big business cynic, and others of the attractive Fox ilk? Not willingly. If I found myself there, I know I would be shackled, and listening intently to these good people as they negotiate with each other about my right to live and breathe free, and look for clues into their decision to allow me the right to live in a country they so seem to fully and solely own.
I am glad they are underestimating the anger of the people who do not agree with them. Angry smart people can do more harm than angry dumb people.
Listening would be a validation I have no interest in providing anymore.
The fires were lit by republicans; Trump poured a mix of napalm and agent orange. Their echo chamber is big, seductive, well-funded, and well organized (a mix of radio, TV, church). They are no longer a fringe, they are mainstream. I can live in denial of the rift, sing Kumbaya, wear t-shirts with 'coexist.'
Would I sit on the same table with a uniformed militia dude with a big gun, the religious bigot, the white supremacist, the big business cynic, and others of the attractive Fox ilk? Not willingly. If I found myself there, I know I would be shackled, and listening intently to these good people as they negotiate with each other about my right to live and breathe free, and look for clues into their decision to allow me the right to live in a country they so seem to fully and solely own.
I am glad they are underestimating the anger of the people who do not agree with them. Angry smart people can do more harm than angry dumb people.
8
I link many of these comments together. White males have recently had to give up the monopoly on political power that they had since the nation's origin. The disappearance of manufacturing jobs (and lack of meaningful work), and the disastrous concentration of wealth add to their feeling of powerlessness. White males' life expectancy has actually declined in recent years (see drugs replacing meaningful work). The resulting anger Trump taps into, and voices, is deep and visceral.
The uneducated are relieved to have it voiced, and believe, since he's a rich man, he must know what he's talking about. The Trump-leaning women are in the networks of angry white men. I don't think you can find a Trump-voting women who hangs with a Hillary-supporting male. They want a simpler time. The educated know Trump does not have the answers, and find his spurning of expertise truly scary.
The uneducated are relieved to have it voiced, and believe, since he's a rich man, he must know what he's talking about. The Trump-leaning women are in the networks of angry white men. I don't think you can find a Trump-voting women who hangs with a Hillary-supporting male. They want a simpler time. The educated know Trump does not have the answers, and find his spurning of expertise truly scary.
12
You think the saying "Barbarians are at the gate of Rome" is old? But here they are.
We learned how to lie on live TV (and fanatically believe those lies), how to kill more efficiently (and argue that we need to have more weapons for self-defence) and how to tweet in our sleep...
Even though our civilization underwent significant evolution the average human brain remains at the stimulus-response level of a Pavlov's dog. Are we really THAT dumb? Just ask Trump and his supporters about it.
Without PROPER education and guidance from the early childhood we are just as dumb as they come. I cannot emphasize this strong enough but proper education is crucial, and I mean crucial - not just to our success but to our survival.
Earlier in the Presidential race Jeb Bush was asked whether he would kill baby Hitler? “Hell yeah, I would!” said Bush. But does it really matter? If after the most atrocious and despicable war in human history we cannot learn a lesson (could we ever!) something must be wrong with our heads.
I would love to see what America could become with Bernie as a President. Idealist vs Pragmatist vs Demagogue (or to say it another way: Mr. Nice Guy vs Bada$$ vs ... just A$$$$). After 8 years of Republican obstructionism, witch hunt, bigotry and other "stuff", which cannot be described in dry language, did we learn our History lesson? ...What lesson?
We learned how to lie on live TV (and fanatically believe those lies), how to kill more efficiently (and argue that we need to have more weapons for self-defence) and how to tweet in our sleep...
Even though our civilization underwent significant evolution the average human brain remains at the stimulus-response level of a Pavlov's dog. Are we really THAT dumb? Just ask Trump and his supporters about it.
Without PROPER education and guidance from the early childhood we are just as dumb as they come. I cannot emphasize this strong enough but proper education is crucial, and I mean crucial - not just to our success but to our survival.
Earlier in the Presidential race Jeb Bush was asked whether he would kill baby Hitler? “Hell yeah, I would!” said Bush. But does it really matter? If after the most atrocious and despicable war in human history we cannot learn a lesson (could we ever!) something must be wrong with our heads.
I would love to see what America could become with Bernie as a President. Idealist vs Pragmatist vs Demagogue (or to say it another way: Mr. Nice Guy vs Bada$$ vs ... just A$$$$). After 8 years of Republican obstructionism, witch hunt, bigotry and other "stuff", which cannot be described in dry language, did we learn our History lesson? ...What lesson?
3
We are not Canada, nor Denmark. We are a capitalist country founded on property ownership. We have progressed from that beginning; however, we have not changed the fundamentals. Bernie was an Independent Socialist until he became a come to Jesus Democrat. Hillary has been a Democrat for decades; she has served, worked hard for families, women and children. She has never stopped fighting for what she believes in: public service. I don't know where Bernie thought he was going to get funding for his platform. And, his rants got repetitive. He will now support Clinton and campaign for her. She will become the next President, and she will work hard as she always does. She is a policy wonk, and I think that is a good thing. No surprises, just a steady hand at the helm. As far as what she can do with a corrupt, gerrymandered Congress, not much. She will do her best, as she always has done.
7
Writing as an overeducated (Harvard MBA) of a certain age, I can recall a time in the 50s when straight, white, mainline Protestant males ruled the roost, If you were Catholic or Baptist or a person of color, even a slight amount of color, or gay, you were openly jeered, you were dirt. Then Kennedy, and things changed for Catholics. Then Johnson and things began to change for people of color and so on and so forth. It's better now, overall. But it is absolutely stupid to forget that every improvement for the disenfranchised came at the cost of income and status of white males. People vote with their minds and their guts. And if you lack an analytical, educated mind, it's all gut, and that means resentment will be foremost. Uneducated white males need our help, and sympathy and attention, too, even though they are proud and hard to reach and just don't like us.
15
There is a misconception that making opportunities for the disenfranchised results in disenfranchising another group. First, demographics and geographical distribution for these groups are quite different. That doesn't stop the mythology of a "zero sum game" - one in which if YOU gain something I have to lose something - from being touted, and used to create an US versus THEM mentality. Certain disreputable groups over the world have used this incorrect but fear-inducing tactic to push their own agenda for ... well as long as recorded history. The separate set of issues that the disenfranchised non-college-educated white males confront has been warped by similar tactics. It's cynical manipulation and capitalizes on the gut reaction over the intellect. So it would be somewhat irresponsible to put the blame on those who actually saw advances since the fifties and sixties... that just perpetuates that zero-sum myth.
7
They voted for the man who shipped their jobs overseas, Mr. Mission Accomplished. He gave away their manufacturing jobs to pay China for the Iraq war loans. They should have paid attention to the character of the man, rather than his "like to have a beer with" fake good old boy charm. He was never a good old boy; he was always a Bush, descendant of Prescott Bush, rich and spoiled. His father was the decent Bush who fought in WWII. He raised a coward who ran from one guard unit to another to avoid Vietnam. Maybe the working men will now vote for a woman who actually has their interests at heart. If they vote for the man who stiffed his employees, contractors and investors, they will just repeat the Bush fiasco.
5
You're not accounting for white women--the biggest group that benefited from the changes in society the last 50ish years. They're not going to stay home and push out babies even if you could get rid of the other groups referenced (Blacks, and racial or ethnic foreigners with 2 extra points for muslims).
After a great start at education in one state, my family moved and I spent the last 3 years of high school in a small declining-farm-town high school where the policies were pretty much dictated by the local church (no dances, strict dress codes, putting girls in math for homemakers, no art or music classes, etc. and providing what I believe was an inferior curriculum that taught no critical thinking skills) I have seen two sides of American K-12 education. One leaves folks wanting - and makes them suspicious of diversity, tolerance, and knowledge in general. We hear about inner-city schools being bad - but not that much about small-town schools; When you come from a poor small-town school you have to work that much harder to succeed. Whether it's the states and counties and townships neglecting educational funding for agricultural (and mining) communities or just ignoring that there's a problem, I think we're reaping the effects of failing education for these communities in our country in this election. While I can't agree with many of their views, I can see many of the circumstances that left them alienated. Figuring out how to solve the rifts in our society and improve the quality of life and education for that alienated "middle" is essential work for the next administration or the problems will only get worse.
20
I am a 78-year-old white male with an advanced scientific degree. I cannot conceive of voting for Trump or any Republican, as they are anti-science and anti-intellectual. All of my professional friends have similar backgrounds and are also elderly white males with advanced degrees who have similar attitudes toward Trump and other Republicans. The so-called Red States are populated by the less-educated and less informed, and they understandably are attracted to the Republican Party.
12
James, I'm an 84 year-old retired professor of medicine now analyzing policy creation, hoping that in times to come we will show an optimal way of creating policies (and thus laws) with improved outcomes. My friends, even those without a scientific bent but with education and intelligence will also agree with you.
7
Unappealing to me about Donald Trump, is how he generalizes everything, like when he said "I have the most respect for women" or "I know more than ISIS than the generals" or "all Mexicans are rapists". Basically, the way he talks insults my intelligence (whatever level I am). He's the type of manager that needs ass kissers working for him always, people who, smart or not, will say yes to everything he wants to do. Anybody with analytical skills, who thinks independently, with certain level of intelligence, and who disagrees could never work for Trump. Anybody who will do all he says for money, can work for Trump. His rhetoric doesn't value intellect, doesn't value diplomacy, doesn't value intelligence, doesn't value politeness, doesn't value peace, and is disrespectful even to the poorly educated, even though they don't seem to see it.
21
Trump once said that a boss should never hire people who are smarter than him! So Trump either usually hires people dumber than himself or he always believes that he's the smartest guy in the room!
2
This article ignored the network effect, how people tend to have opinions, habits and behaviors similar to others in their network. Liberals support "liberal" ideas like overriding Citizens United even though the position could be seen as opposing free speech. Conservatives support lower taxes which undermine fiscal stability, a conservative mainstay. It's not that different from the fact that you are more/less likely to be obese if folks in your social network tend to be obese/thin. It's one more reason why some of us zone out when we hear talking points.
5
Trump is a wannabe demagogue; he will lose, and Putin will never sleep in the White House. We are not the Weimar Republic suffering from a bad peace treaty and a deep Depression. We have to elect honest Congress people to repeal the terrible Scalia Citizens United Decision which defined corporations as "individuals". Now, General Electric is no different than your neighbor out there mowing his lawn. Congress is the venue where this Decision gets repealed. Congress is also the venue where we reclaim the jobs lost when "W" moved corporate headquarters off shore and allowed those corporations to ship manufacturing off to China. The key to an honest Congress is to elect honest Governors and State legislators who will undo the gerrymandered Congressional safe seats. We can take back Congress. If we do that, we will be a democracy again. We are now a plutocracy pretending to be otherwise. Bernie was not the answer; Clinton has put much of his platform into hers. There was no "rigged" primary; Bernie's supporters did not register as Democrats in time to vote in the primary. We have a strong candidate who will win. We need a new Congress to support her policies. "All politics is local" is still true.
3
I agree that religion is a dominant and divisive factor. People flock to Trump for numerous reasons- and sometimes for only a single one of these reasons. For example, they're opposed to abortion, or are worried that immigration will increase the proportion of non-Christian/Catholic/Mormon people.
Remember that mainstream media is secular. Politics supposedly is divided between state and religion. Hence believers generally don't see themselves and their beliefs strongly represented by mainstream media. In fact, when push comes to shove, many believers would accept the views of their pastor or religious authorities over the ruling of a court of law. When one believes in a 'higher' spiritual court, that effectively renders the 'earthly' one moot. Societal norms, human rights, etc are irrelevant in the face of this godly authority. When it comes to religion, people can be easily led into irrational beliefs- climate change denial, the end times, the sacred rights of a fetus. While Christianity preaches love and compassion for others, it still promotes the belief that there are fundamental differences between believers and non-believers. Jewish people are thought of as the 'people of God.' Many believers anticipate a final 'showdown' in the Middle East region, between those of JudeoChristian backgrounds and Muslims, which will precipitate the end of days. This inevitably leads to an us-vs-them mentality that is open to instability and war- potentially a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Remember that mainstream media is secular. Politics supposedly is divided between state and religion. Hence believers generally don't see themselves and their beliefs strongly represented by mainstream media. In fact, when push comes to shove, many believers would accept the views of their pastor or religious authorities over the ruling of a court of law. When one believes in a 'higher' spiritual court, that effectively renders the 'earthly' one moot. Societal norms, human rights, etc are irrelevant in the face of this godly authority. When it comes to religion, people can be easily led into irrational beliefs- climate change denial, the end times, the sacred rights of a fetus. While Christianity preaches love and compassion for others, it still promotes the belief that there are fundamental differences between believers and non-believers. Jewish people are thought of as the 'people of God.' Many believers anticipate a final 'showdown' in the Middle East region, between those of JudeoChristian backgrounds and Muslims, which will precipitate the end of days. This inevitably leads to an us-vs-them mentality that is open to instability and war- potentially a self-fulfilling prophecy.
9
I would group Trump voters on the side of less educated, but also those who have had exposure to other cultures, acceptance of them as well, from an early age would create a more open-minded person than the profile for his supporters. White suburbia and rural areas of heavily Trump-inclined, and those folks stay close to their kind. Remember too, that white-flight began over 60 years ago, which implies there are three generations who have lived in exclusively white neighborhoods, limiting their level of experience considerably.
These folks would tend to oppose globalization, because of their fears of different kinds of people, and can easily attach to a bigot like Trump, who is their ideal success story in a way.
These folks would tend to oppose globalization, because of their fears of different kinds of people, and can easily attach to a bigot like Trump, who is their ideal success story in a way.
6
I have to question the methods to which they say higher-educated are Hillary supporters. If that's the truth, then I can tell our education system is in dire straits! Yes, college life is very liberal with the vast majority of college professors being liberal, teaching liberalism in class and of course the college life is very idealistic. It isn't until you start working on a career that reality sets in. You pay more taxes in one year than you did in total before that.
What exactly has 30 years of Hillary really done for us? Nothing. It hasn't provided anymore than a Republican, yet that is why I am voting for Trump - he is anti-establishment. Need any further proof - both parties are fighting him because they know if he is elected and does well enough, it would spell the end of one or both of the parties as they stand now. I'm tired of the decades-long squabbling these 2 parties have wrought upon themselves. Why is it all of them earn millions by the time they leave office, if ever?
Sadly, too many people are so entrenched into their party affiliations that they can't see they are responsible for these 2-headed monsters they have helped to create.
What exactly has 30 years of Hillary really done for us? Nothing. It hasn't provided anymore than a Republican, yet that is why I am voting for Trump - he is anti-establishment. Need any further proof - both parties are fighting him because they know if he is elected and does well enough, it would spell the end of one or both of the parties as they stand now. I'm tired of the decades-long squabbling these 2 parties have wrought upon themselves. Why is it all of them earn millions by the time they leave office, if ever?
Sadly, too many people are so entrenched into their party affiliations that they can't see they are responsible for these 2-headed monsters they have helped to create.
Similarly, I wonder what the correlation is between Americans who have spent any time outside of the US vs. those who never have in regards to their Presidential pick.
12
People are way more complicated than we all want them to be. Case in point: My father-in-law has a college degree and will be voting for Trump. My mother-in-law and him befriended a Honduran couple who had entered the US illegally. The couple still had two young children in Honduras, so my in-laws took two weeks vacation to drive to Honduras, got the kids, drive them back up to the Mexico side border, handed them over to and paid the same coyote that got the parents across, and then met the coyote in Texas to drive the kids back to NC, reunifying them with their parents. And this guy is voting for a guy who wants to build a wall. Go figure.
13
No kidding.
1
Perhaps your father-in-law has the same disregard for the laws and responsibilities of citizenship as Trump has. I have a Chinese friend who spent 10 years preparing to become a citizen, and engineer. She worked here, took classes, studied and finally passed her citizenship exam. She now owns a condo in Queens and runs a consulting business. She didn't steal across the border; she didn't break any laws. I do not admire your father-in-law for what he did.
7
It might just be that education does what it is supposed to do -- teach people how to think critically.
For example, when Trump appears at a rally with a man whose daughter was raped by an illegal immigrant, he is engaging in demagogy in its purest form, implying, but not saying, that illegal immigrants are all rapists.
An educated person is likely to see that Trump might just as well have used the same technique to prove that all left-handed bricklayers, or all tax accountants named Larry, are rapists. The less educated voter is less likely to detect the ruse.
An educated person is more likely to have an adequate command of the facts. Who will benefit from Trump's tax proposal? To find an answer takes some digging and analysis. Educated people have been trained to do this sort of thing. Less educated people do not have these skills to the same degree, and a more likely to be taken in by the sales pitch.
And educated voters are more likely to have a sense of history, and to see that Trump is radically unlike our greatest leaders -- Lincoln, FDR, Martin Luther King, and so on. He is cheap, ill-informed, and dishonest, while our greatest leaders have conducted themselves with dignity and spoken truthfully about the issues of the day.
There have been times when I've thought that education is over-valued. This election has shown me that it is not. Our democracy depends on the mental skills that education fosters.
For example, when Trump appears at a rally with a man whose daughter was raped by an illegal immigrant, he is engaging in demagogy in its purest form, implying, but not saying, that illegal immigrants are all rapists.
An educated person is likely to see that Trump might just as well have used the same technique to prove that all left-handed bricklayers, or all tax accountants named Larry, are rapists. The less educated voter is less likely to detect the ruse.
An educated person is more likely to have an adequate command of the facts. Who will benefit from Trump's tax proposal? To find an answer takes some digging and analysis. Educated people have been trained to do this sort of thing. Less educated people do not have these skills to the same degree, and a more likely to be taken in by the sales pitch.
And educated voters are more likely to have a sense of history, and to see that Trump is radically unlike our greatest leaders -- Lincoln, FDR, Martin Luther King, and so on. He is cheap, ill-informed, and dishonest, while our greatest leaders have conducted themselves with dignity and spoken truthfully about the issues of the day.
There have been times when I've thought that education is over-valued. This election has shown me that it is not. Our democracy depends on the mental skills that education fosters.
20
Thomas Jefferson was correct. A democracy will depend on educated voters to be successful.
9
Perhaps less educated watch more reality Tv and do not believe in anything unless it is entertaining evidence based or not, as long as one gets their two second chuckle .....stated in jest...
4
I'm a Canadian citizen, so I won't be voting in this election or any other that I can foresee south of the border. As far as elections in Canada are concerned that's a different matter. Political parties are not necessarily the same whether you vote at the municipal, provincial or federal level. In many cases they aren't, and while some people WILL vote for the same party their family has voted for from one generation the next, I don't consider myself so bound. I vote for a party whose platform attracts me, and whose leader seems competent to take the reins of power.
3
In my view and experience, women are sick and tired of men's egos...especially the ego of Donald Trump. Smart women do not let Donald Trump get within three feet of them and never do they "hang on his words or his arm" Every time he opens his mouth he demonstrates how self-centered and unintelligent he is. Some men wonder why women avoid them like the plaque . A tip: Respect and kindness and less ego goes a long way.
13
"Education", if you can call a 4 year degree education, has zero correlation with intelligence if you sample people over 100 IQ. Also, you're learning about one thing. Someone with a degree in Biology or Gender Studies is no more inherently informed on global politics or economic theory than anyone else. Last I checked economics isn't even a required class for any art or hard science degree. You also left out that conservatives make more money. That's median income, not average.
I think if you sampled IQ you would get a much different story. Regardless, the entire discussion undermines democracy. I love watching "progressives" go into a cognitive dissonant seizure while they strongly consider eugenics to achieve their political agenda.
I think a lot of people also assume that conservatives don't know some policies could result in a recession, but refuse to consider that they may not be a bad thing in the long run.
I think if you sampled IQ you would get a much different story. Regardless, the entire discussion undermines democracy. I love watching "progressives" go into a cognitive dissonant seizure while they strongly consider eugenics to achieve their political agenda.
I think a lot of people also assume that conservatives don't know some policies could result in a recession, but refuse to consider that they may not be a bad thing in the long run.
How about some facts to start with rather than a sweeping statement unsupported by any? Check this article out: http://ije.oxfordjournals.org/content/39/5/1362.full
The correlation between education attainment and IQ is there, though part of it may be that having a lot of education raises cognitive ability.
And the fact, if it is a fact (you give no evidence) that "conservatives make more money" is easily understood by considering that minorities underrepresented in higher education and therefore less like to make more money, like Africa Americans and Hispanics, are very much less likely to be conservative.
So all in all, a very poorly reasoned and presented argument.
The correlation between education attainment and IQ is there, though part of it may be that having a lot of education raises cognitive ability.
And the fact, if it is a fact (you give no evidence) that "conservatives make more money" is easily understood by considering that minorities underrepresented in higher education and therefore less like to make more money, like Africa Americans and Hispanics, are very much less likely to be conservative.
So all in all, a very poorly reasoned and presented argument.
11
I don't think the article tried to push a correlation - or even a causation - between intelligence and education, although common sense tells one that it's probably there. It is probably easier to learn a lot beyond what is required to do your job if you avail yourself of higher education (for at least 2 years, if the lower limit is a community college degree, you spend a significant amount of time learning things that may not be directly applicable to a specific job). You also learn from a much broader range of people, which means it's more likely at least one of them will teach you to think critically, if you haven't learned it already.
"A" recession may not be a bad thing, actually. Deep recessions and depressions, however, are another story. You really don't want to create swings between deep busts and high booms, and that happens when we only concern ourselves with short term gains and eschew the long view. The result of big swings is that the peaks and valleys tend to get bigger unless great effort is made to prevent it, and when politics gets as lockjawed as it is these days, that effort doesn't happen.
Ideal democracy requires an informed electorate. Getting your information from breitbart.com doesn't qualify. Being surprised when an interviewer tells you, contrary to your belief, that President Obama did indeed publish his birth certificate long ago, doesn't qualify. Not doingyour own fact checking doesn't qualify.
"A" recession may not be a bad thing, actually. Deep recessions and depressions, however, are another story. You really don't want to create swings between deep busts and high booms, and that happens when we only concern ourselves with short term gains and eschew the long view. The result of big swings is that the peaks and valleys tend to get bigger unless great effort is made to prevent it, and when politics gets as lockjawed as it is these days, that effort doesn't happen.
Ideal democracy requires an informed electorate. Getting your information from breitbart.com doesn't qualify. Being surprised when an interviewer tells you, contrary to your belief, that President Obama did indeed publish his birth certificate long ago, doesn't qualify. Not doingyour own fact checking doesn't qualify.
6
If the data truly supports this link between education or intelligence, and how people vote, then that is a consequence, but not a cause. If people voted based on a rational, methodological, and objective analysis of the party platforms or the specific plans of their candidates -- that would involve the exercise of their education and intellect. Unfortunately, they do not. People tend to vote their 'affiliations'. They tend to vote as their parents did, as their friends and neighbors do, or as their coworkers do. And these days, those affiliations extend to include how their Facebook friends vote (or whatever social media poison one imbibes in). So, if one is from a poor white, middle-class white, or rural white community, one is likely to vote like those with whom one affiliates. If one works in a blue collar job, in a region or community left behind in the times, one is likely to vote with their community. These are tendencies, not causes. People vote emotionally, not rationally. It would be unfair, and even discriminatory, to suggest that people who vote for Trump are ignorant and "unsophisticated". People tend to vote with the group that with which they feel most connected. So if the people in one's affiliation happen to be less educated, that doesn't mean that they are less intelligent, it just tells you who their trusted friends are. One need only look at one's social circle to see the truth. People tend to surround themselves with like-minded people.
1
It is a false premise to conclude that more intelligent but less educated people are as capable of voting rationally as less intelligent but more educated people. That's because we are still subject to the impulses of our reptilian brains. Education makes us more likely to learn how to put those impulses in their proper place, mere intelligence is not enough.
As for voting according to how friends, parents, neighbors, etc. vote - well, yes, that's succumbing to the reptilian brain (our humanity makes the result a kind of herd instinct when expressed among groups). However, charisma is an even more powerful element, and is probably the reason why Trump gets as much benefit of the doubt as he does, even when people know he's a liar and a cheat and a sex abuser - and why Hillary Clinton gets little or no benefit of the doubt.
Don't forget the effect of religion, which teaches even the intelligent to disregard facts in favor of faith from an early age. I am not knocking faith per se, but it gives me pause when I see Evangelicals putting aside their morals for he sake of "worldly" issues, or putting their faith in a faithless man to fight righteously for moral issues like pro-life.
As for voting according to how friends, parents, neighbors, etc. vote - well, yes, that's succumbing to the reptilian brain (our humanity makes the result a kind of herd instinct when expressed among groups). However, charisma is an even more powerful element, and is probably the reason why Trump gets as much benefit of the doubt as he does, even when people know he's a liar and a cheat and a sex abuser - and why Hillary Clinton gets little or no benefit of the doubt.
Don't forget the effect of religion, which teaches even the intelligent to disregard facts in favor of faith from an early age. I am not knocking faith per se, but it gives me pause when I see Evangelicals putting aside their morals for he sake of "worldly" issues, or putting their faith in a faithless man to fight righteously for moral issues like pro-life.
5
I think the comments about scholarship and losing faith are overrated. I got two B.A.s while retaining my faith. University is not necessarily the graveyard of faith. Unless you allow it to be. Too many students enter college without having prepared spiritually for the challenges they will encounter there. Either they assume that they can enter heaven on their parents' coattails, or they think Christianity is only about being nice. Or whatever. Then they meet a professor who is an atheist with an agenda, and they're completely befuddled.
Then too you have people--and they're probably the majority--who enter college straight from high school and who still think like teenagers for whom the freedom fo college compared to the near-constant supervision of their high-school years seems like an unending opportunity to party, and they spend an inordinate amount of time getting drunk rather than studying. When I started my first B.A. I was 26. A mature student. I was there to learn stuff. I knew about booze already, and it was not my reason for attending classes. Unfortunately health reasons, or the lack thereof, affected my average and prevented me from getting references from some professors, but I still graduated having got an education, and I do believe it is a rampart against conspiracy theories.
Then too you have people--and they're probably the majority--who enter college straight from high school and who still think like teenagers for whom the freedom fo college compared to the near-constant supervision of their high-school years seems like an unending opportunity to party, and they spend an inordinate amount of time getting drunk rather than studying. When I started my first B.A. I was 26. A mature student. I was there to learn stuff. I knew about booze already, and it was not my reason for attending classes. Unfortunately health reasons, or the lack thereof, affected my average and prevented me from getting references from some professors, but I still graduated having got an education, and I do believe it is a rampart against conspiracy theories.
If a person gets to college and gets "turned out" by a professor with an agenda, or goes to a religious community or church and gets similarly turned out, it is because we don't do a good job in K-12 of teaching our children how to think. We teach them how to memorize facts from authority figures.
And if one atheist with an agenda can befuddle you, it means you were probably already befuddled and didn't know it.
And if one atheist with an agenda can befuddle you, it means you were probably already befuddled and didn't know it.
3
Religious persecution was the reason the founding fathers fled Europe to start a new world where there was separation of Church and State. They did that; it has worked for 240 years. Go to church and practice religion on your own time. Atheists will practice their secular belief systems on their own time. We have a secular government, and it works.
3
Instead of looking at it as loyalty to a particular party. look at it as the polices of the candidates and the implications and self interests of the two groups of people (college educated and less than college educated whites).
One group is harmed my manufacturing jobs being moved overseas. To that group it means loss of jobs, not us on an individual level, but on a level that has completely devastated whole communities. To the other group, moving manufacturing overseas makes the things they buy from amazon and Target cheaper.
To one group, massive illegal immigration means competition for the types of jobs they work. Visit a housing construction site - how many house framers are white Americans versus Latino immigrants and their offspring. To this group, immigration means fewer available jobs and lower wages. To the other group, it means the restaurants they frequent are able to keep their prices lower by employing legal and legal immigrants in the kitchen. Visit a trendy restaurant in DC or LA. White servers and Hispanic kitchen staff. This other group can also now afford to have a maid. They know they couldn't afford a maid if they had to pay them wages that a native white person would require to live on - but for someone who has come from a third world country the low wages are an improvement upon their previously impoverished life. For one group immigration means economic depression and for the other it means more luxury goods.
One group is harmed my manufacturing jobs being moved overseas. To that group it means loss of jobs, not us on an individual level, but on a level that has completely devastated whole communities. To the other group, moving manufacturing overseas makes the things they buy from amazon and Target cheaper.
To one group, massive illegal immigration means competition for the types of jobs they work. Visit a housing construction site - how many house framers are white Americans versus Latino immigrants and their offspring. To this group, immigration means fewer available jobs and lower wages. To the other group, it means the restaurants they frequent are able to keep their prices lower by employing legal and legal immigrants in the kitchen. Visit a trendy restaurant in DC or LA. White servers and Hispanic kitchen staff. This other group can also now afford to have a maid. They know they couldn't afford a maid if they had to pay them wages that a native white person would require to live on - but for someone who has come from a third world country the low wages are an improvement upon their previously impoverished life. For one group immigration means economic depression and for the other it means more luxury goods.
2
First, I have to point out that there are white immigrants from poorer regions that will also work for lower wages than most born Americans, and lots of non-white native people that require higher wages. Not to mention the undocumented - there are white ones, you know.
Now, that being said: Why don't people talk more about why certain jobs disappear? It's not always about them moving overseas. Many companies in the US have not moved jobs overseas and they are making bigger profits than ever - however, they employ significantly fewer workers because of automation. So, are we going to pass a bill to limit automation in order to basically create make-work for people who can't learn to fill other jobs? If we deem coal to be dangerous to the environment, do we ignore that to keep coal miners employed and eat the price down the road (which could cost more than we are able to pay)?
Instead of trying to dumb down America to keep outdated jobs available, and incidentally losing our technology advantage over the rest of the world more and more, how about we value intellect and learning here and retake that initiative? That's how we would make America great again. It's not an accident that our greatest period of technological superiority was when we were working to send men to the Moon. All the innovation fallout from such endeavors is what kept us out front in industry.
Now, that being said: Why don't people talk more about why certain jobs disappear? It's not always about them moving overseas. Many companies in the US have not moved jobs overseas and they are making bigger profits than ever - however, they employ significantly fewer workers because of automation. So, are we going to pass a bill to limit automation in order to basically create make-work for people who can't learn to fill other jobs? If we deem coal to be dangerous to the environment, do we ignore that to keep coal miners employed and eat the price down the road (which could cost more than we are able to pay)?
Instead of trying to dumb down America to keep outdated jobs available, and incidentally losing our technology advantage over the rest of the world more and more, how about we value intellect and learning here and retake that initiative? That's how we would make America great again. It's not an accident that our greatest period of technological superiority was when we were working to send men to the Moon. All the innovation fallout from such endeavors is what kept us out front in industry.
6
I grew up in the sticks in Hawai'i during the 60s and 70s where critical thinking revolved around the availability of toilet paper during frequent longshoremen strikes. I left that frame of reference behind by going to Punahou, a wonderful source of awareness and learning, then made stops in Boston and LA for higher education opportunities. I'm fortunate to be able to critically analyze the "policies" put forth by Trump to know that a trade war with China could result in a serious recession here in the US, that manufacturing jobs have actually returned to this country partially due to the bailout of the auto industry, that coal mines have been shut down mostly due to the lower cost of fossil fuels and the massive availability of natural gas domestically, that a massive tax cut for the top 1% of income earners could add trillions of dollars to our deficit . . . the list is long.
In my view, Trump voters either don't understand these issues and how many of Trump's positions will make life WORSE for them or these voters just don't care but somehow want to change for change sake. As a group they seem to not realize that Trump, if he reaches the White House (God forbid) will represent only himself and his close circle of family and business connections. that he couldn't care less about the plight of his supporters.
I guess one also needs education to see that Trump is a con man ripping his voters off in a manner worse than they can fathom.
In my view, Trump voters either don't understand these issues and how many of Trump's positions will make life WORSE for them or these voters just don't care but somehow want to change for change sake. As a group they seem to not realize that Trump, if he reaches the White House (God forbid) will represent only himself and his close circle of family and business connections. that he couldn't care less about the plight of his supporters.
I guess one also needs education to see that Trump is a con man ripping his voters off in a manner worse than they can fathom.
8
Yes, it would be one thing if Trump had come out of the blue with no past history to judge by except the fact of his current business success. However, there is so much documented bad stuff to see with this guy, that it has to be change for change's sake or utter disregard for reality for the sake of faith that makes people support him. You can't even reliably say it will be okay, he will find good advisors and the right things will get done. Has he shown that during his campaign? Look at the shady group of advisors he has collected - and he doesn't even listen to them most of the time.
You can't even trust that he actually wants to apply some of the policies he espouses for his base, given all the people who know him privately that come out and say he doesn't actually believe those things.
You can't even trust that he actually wants to apply some of the policies he espouses for his base, given all the people who know him privately that come out and say he doesn't actually believe those things.
9
I can't wait for this election to be over- personally, it has been quite depressing. There are so many questions I have been struggling with. Critically, I have also come to a shocking realization of the inability of most electorate, especially, Trump supporters, to think critically. My conclusion is that education is the critical divide and a big one for that matter. The provenciailness of the people. The lack of intellectual curiosity and their ultra myopic view of the world, and lack of knowledge about how the world operate, in addition to lack of self-awareness - all factor into our current debacle and makes us a current laughing stock of the world. As for professing to be a Christian country, this campaign season has also brought that to question. The choice of who becomes our president can't be so clear--if only only logic and the ability to think critically can be brought to play. The "real" educated (and note that I qualify the word) have the tools to make informed and factual decisions. They can easily decipher real leaders from the likes who say: I don't endorse him but I just voted for him. What? Paul Ryan. How do explain Ted Cruz and Rubio? And Pence and the evangelical leaders who carry the banner of "Christianity"? Television hasn't been helpful either-- it's all about ratings and entertainment. Bottom line, education, and here, I mean real education is the numero uno prerequisite to practicing and preserving democracy.
8
All we know from a degree is 1) someone managed to at least barely pass enough courses to fulfill the qualifications for graduation, and 2) at most places where one can get a degree, one is likely to have experienced a higher degree of diversity than those who don't have a degree. There are highly intelligent people, some of them highly successful, who don't get the degree (Bill Gates anyone?). Intelligence makes it more likely that one has managed to learn how to learn and how to make rational decisions based on a cogent analysis of facts, degree or not.
Also, there are intelligent people who have belief systems that push them towards Trump, despite his flaws, due to policy differences with the Democrats that are make or break - mainly coming down to We Need To Get The Right Justices On That Supreme Court, or I Want That Tax Cut. Then it becomes a difference of opinion on whether or not it is worth the risk of having a Donald trump as President just to achieve those one or two goals.
Folks like Evangelicals who support Trump should be careful, though. Accepting someone to lead who is immoral by ones beliefs, merely because one of their aims seems to align with yours is, basically, making a deal with the Devil.
Also, there are intelligent people who have belief systems that push them towards Trump, despite his flaws, due to policy differences with the Democrats that are make or break - mainly coming down to We Need To Get The Right Justices On That Supreme Court, or I Want That Tax Cut. Then it becomes a difference of opinion on whether or not it is worth the risk of having a Donald trump as President just to achieve those one or two goals.
Folks like Evangelicals who support Trump should be careful, though. Accepting someone to lead who is immoral by ones beliefs, merely because one of their aims seems to align with yours is, basically, making a deal with the Devil.
3
Evangelicals actually support Pence who believes that a woman who aborts a fetus, miscarriage or otherwise, must provide a funeral for that fetus, regardless of her financial situation. Pence is a wingnut who will never be re-elected Governor after he loses the election with the feckless demagogue Trump.
4
Bill Gates has a high school diploma from one of the best prep schools in America and dropped out of YALE.
Fundamentally, a two-party election is about status quo vs. some kind of change. In my parent's day, the Republicans represented status quo and the Democrats represented change--especially for minorities and women. If you are doing pretty well with the status quo, that's how you vote. If you aren't, you vote for things to change.
The success of the civil rights and women's movements, combined with structural changes in the economy, mean that the new status quo is benefiting different people. Educated white women have made great strides and are well-positioned to succeed in today's economy; white men without degrees are not (in part because the very discrimination that kept women out of manufacturing, construction, etc. has meant that the decline of those jobs has hurt men disproportionately). Indeed, their prospects and status have dropped the most.
As such, the Democratic party and its progressive platform are perceived as the new status quo. A Clinton presidency is widely regarded as simply an extension of the Obama presidency. Trump voters are not stupid, or simply uneducated. They are voting against the new establishment because it hasn't served them. (This is why they supported Trump vs. establishment GOP candidates, too.)
Income inequality is hurting the GOP from within, and the Democrats from without. Neither party is addressing it, and both need to.
The success of the civil rights and women's movements, combined with structural changes in the economy, mean that the new status quo is benefiting different people. Educated white women have made great strides and are well-positioned to succeed in today's economy; white men without degrees are not (in part because the very discrimination that kept women out of manufacturing, construction, etc. has meant that the decline of those jobs has hurt men disproportionately). Indeed, their prospects and status have dropped the most.
As such, the Democratic party and its progressive platform are perceived as the new status quo. A Clinton presidency is widely regarded as simply an extension of the Obama presidency. Trump voters are not stupid, or simply uneducated. They are voting against the new establishment because it hasn't served them. (This is why they supported Trump vs. establishment GOP candidates, too.)
Income inequality is hurting the GOP from within, and the Democrats from without. Neither party is addressing it, and both need to.
1
There is a strong anti-intellectual current in this country. We see it when people post and re-post crazy stories and conspiracy theories. There seems to be a belief that, maybe because we are a democracy, "my ignorance has the same value as your knowledge". This can be found in college educated people, tho less often than in the less educated. Maybe people don't want to be left out of the conversation that determines their future, or their children's future. Maybe people believe the best and brightest led us to war and economic disaster and cannot be trusted. But, rather than inform themselves by reading a book or a newspaper (maybe the intellectuals are still not to be trusted) or even searching the internet they seem to turn to Fox News and Breitbart for their information. If they see doom and gloom because they lost their job and their home and the only place warning of doom and gloom is Breitbart or Fox - then maybe those are the sources to be trusted.
College does a few things for those engaged. It teaches critical thinking and challenges beliefs and assumptions constantly. College also exposes students to people, cultures, beliefs, thinking, and ideas that most students never had any contact with previously. Students are able to learn that just because someone is different does not mean they are wrong or bad or to be feared. Ideas can be discussed and changing your ideas is a sign of growth, not weakness.
Trump supporters do not appear to understand this.
College does a few things for those engaged. It teaches critical thinking and challenges beliefs and assumptions constantly. College also exposes students to people, cultures, beliefs, thinking, and ideas that most students never had any contact with previously. Students are able to learn that just because someone is different does not mean they are wrong or bad or to be feared. Ideas can be discussed and changing your ideas is a sign of growth, not weakness.
Trump supporters do not appear to understand this.
8
I don't think you've been to a university recently if you believe any of what you just wrote. University is very un-challenging from an ideological perspective. There is an inherent bias.. one needs not look further than the partisan identity of the professors to see that. If ones ideas become more radical in university would you still consider that growth?
A B.A. has zero correlation with high IQ and critical thinking or ability to abstract outside of physics, math, and problem solving degrees like certain engineering fields. Everything else is white collar vocational training as far as I'm concerned.
A B.A. has zero correlation with high IQ and critical thinking or ability to abstract outside of physics, math, and problem solving degrees like certain engineering fields. Everything else is white collar vocational training as far as I'm concerned.
maybe it depends on the university and the degree to which any student engages in the experience. I have not been a student for a long time but I have worked at a university for the past 30 years. Some students leave with the same limited view of the world they had when they began, but I do not find that generally true. Part of the problem is that we no longer show much respect for intelligence and learning that we once did.
As for the "partisan identity of the professors" I cannot address your experience. Certainly we all have our ideas and opinions. But, the universities do not only hire liberals. They do require scholarship. They do require critical thinking and an ability to teach. The idea of tenure - that many conservatives I have heard complain about - is that professors cannot be fired because of their beliefs whether liberal or conservative.
As for the "partisan identity of the professors" I cannot address your experience. Certainly we all have our ideas and opinions. But, the universities do not only hire liberals. They do require scholarship. They do require critical thinking and an ability to teach. The idea of tenure - that many conservatives I have heard complain about - is that professors cannot be fired because of their beliefs whether liberal or conservative.
4
When one combines critical thinking with an almost unlimited availability of information, it is almost inevitable that one becomes more liberal. That's because change in yourself becomes inevitable, and seeing other points of view become inevitable. The very definition of conservatism includes resistance to change and a refusal to value other points of view.
5
“This is why Donald Trump— and the G.O.P. by extension — ‘love the poorly educated.’ ”
And this is why in 2012 the platform of the Texas GOP included a plank condemning critical thinking. They know that that sort of exercise leads to asking those in authority or their betters uncomfortable questions.
It's a reason the right is still trying to roll back the the 1960s (and make America great again). Too many first-in-family-to-college, middle class white kids never stopped asking those uncomfortable questions about Vietnam and minority and women's rights. With unsatisfactory answers the questions kept coming and coming louder.
Now it's learn a trade but don't educate yourself beyond that. After all, you're not paid to think.
And this is why in 2012 the platform of the Texas GOP included a plank condemning critical thinking. They know that that sort of exercise leads to asking those in authority or their betters uncomfortable questions.
It's a reason the right is still trying to roll back the the 1960s (and make America great again). Too many first-in-family-to-college, middle class white kids never stopped asking those uncomfortable questions about Vietnam and minority and women's rights. With unsatisfactory answers the questions kept coming and coming louder.
Now it's learn a trade but don't educate yourself beyond that. After all, you're not paid to think.
4
Worse than that. If your trade is becoming extinct, try to artificially keep it alive instead of learning a new, more viable trade.
4
I can't speak for all educated white women but I can tell you why I do not like Trump. My MS in CS enabled me to get a good job in a large multi-national company. It was dominated by white men. Too many of them remind me of Trump. These men were white, well educated and male and they assumed that that made them a lot better than anyone missing any of those traits. They ignored, looked down on, and in some cases sexually harassed these :different" people. We do not need that as the leader of our country.
8
It seems pretty likely no one is all that more brilliant or stupid than anyone else, but rather that it is simply a case that people without college degrees have different political priorities. They, like everyone, feel their candidates represent their interests more closely. The Democrats best represent the American professional class, not the middle class or working class.
1
Unfortunately for your view, most human characteristics can be plotted on bell curves. that includes intelligence. That is, yes, some people are indeed more brilliant or stupid than anyone else. This is besides the point. Most people have enough intelligence to adequately apply critical thinking and tolerance for others if they are taught to do so; the higher your intelligence, the more likely you are to figure those things out yourself. Humans have an emotional component, such that if they are taught from an early age to not trust their intellectual capacities, their ability to think critically and be tolerant gets crippled. Again, the higher your intelligence, the more likely you are to escape that trap.
With Trump, the problem is not agreeing with his proposed policies. It is trusting that he could actually achieve them, or achieve them without so much damage to America that it wouldn't be worth it.
With Trump, the problem is not agreeing with his proposed policies. It is trusting that he could actually achieve them, or achieve them without so much damage to America that it wouldn't be worth it.
5
Read the history of FDR if you believe that Democrats do not represent the working class. Read the history of Truman. Or, LBJ, another Democrat who brought voting rights to black citizens in the South. Look at Clinton who came from a working class environment. Look at the Obamas: one was a community organizer for the working poor; one was a woman whose parents were working class. The working class would be serfs in the corporate world without the union struggles supported by Democrats. My father was a manager of a plant; he supported the unions in that plant. He was a Democrat who came from a wealthy family in Oregon. I grew up in the Central Valley when the Dust Bowl created the large migration of poor whites to California. They found jobs during WWII, and succeeded in moving into the working class and then into the middle class. The working class will eventually become the entrepeneurs who open small businesses. The working class, by definition, work.
5
People who have spent years learning learning how to think, who see the benefit of rationality, require the burden of proof, know how to listen to an argument and differentiate between fact and opinion, seem to be less vulnerable to cries of "Make America great again" or statements like "I have a plan to fix this. It's a great plan. It will be so great." When I hear Trump supporters explain their support there is often a lack of logic. Someone interviewed on NPR yesterday said that he was going to vote for Trump because otherwise it would be "more of the same, although things are going pretty well for me right now, no complaints." And someone else who said that they didn't like his ideas or his policies, but thought that it was time for an outsider. There seems to be a disconnect between feeling/relating to someone, being grateful for their professed sympathy for your pain, and being able to parse their argument for viability or even truth. Trump is clearly racist, misogynist, xenophobic; he has stiffed employees and contractors and driven small businesses out of work; he was born in a silver spoon in his mouth and takes pride in the fact that he has avoided financially supporting the country he claims to hope to lead. My opinion is that he's "just" a narcissist, who wants to be President because he wants to be President, and not because he wants to serve the American people. Frankly, I can't understand how everyone can't see that the emporer has no clothes.
19
In my circle, one female relative and one female friend are avid Trump supporters. Both are definitely intelligent, with one having a BA. Neither woman knows the other. Here is what they have in common: both of their husbands work in the fracking industry, both feel that their livelihoods have already been impacted by federal regulations, both fear additional negative impacts with a Clinton administration and both are convinced that Trump will save that industry and save them.
My brother, a man of true high morals, including in his interactions with women, is a long-time, staunch Republican who finds it literally impossible to vote for Trump. He has an MBA. I have a PhD and have been repulsed by Trump from Day One.
My brother, a man of true high morals, including in his interactions with women, is a long-time, staunch Republican who finds it literally impossible to vote for Trump. He has an MBA. I have a PhD and have been repulsed by Trump from Day One.
14
Here is a probable hidden subtext: Both husbands probably would resist retraining to an industry with better options, and these women either wouldn't or don't think they can (successfully) try to convince their husbands to do so.
1
Interestingly, the two situations are rather different. Husband #1 (husband of friend) is the one without a college education. I do not hear any mention of retraining. Rather, he now leaves the family for extended periods to work in locations far removed from home. Husband #2 (husband of relative) possesses a higher education. He is the owner of significant natural resource reserves that have been in the family for a very long time. Both husbands have done very well in the industry (sure, the owner has done juuuuuuust a bit better than the worker) and there is no effort by either wife in redirecting their spouses.
3
Trump is a grifter. Trump University is a perfect example of the shoddy stuff he sells. Educated people are more likely to see through Trump's sales pitches. Trump is an out and out racist who appeals to the like minded. Perhaps it can be shown that more education in general translates to increased tolerance for other peoples.
8
More education allows you better see how much people are more the same than different. With attending a college, especially outside of you geographical home environment, you encounter greater diversity up close and personal and see how much we are all alike with deeper significance.
4
What is primarily missing in the present debate is the significant absence of the glaring fact of angry American supporters of Trump refusing to recognize the world has changed since post World War II filled with powerful notions of national exceptionalism and the infinite unipolar world with U.S. in driver seat.
They can be forgiven for great number of Americans does not know that history never ends, that change is always inevitable, that nations and civilizations rise and fall, that no era can last forever. History, as always, is moving forward.
"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge" Isaac Asimov.
Bedrock of conservativism has reached new extremes, leading to following statistics: 18% of Americans believe the sun revolves around the earth, 74% of Republicans deny climate change, 50% of young feel it unnecessary to know the location of other countries. 42% of Americans believe God created human beings less than 10,000 years ago, 25% of public school biology students believe that humans and dinosaurs lived on earth at the same time.
No wonder that Trump's campaign highlights like few others could that Americans are in a race for the bottom, in which the candidate who best embraces ignorance and hate wins.
They can be forgiven for great number of Americans does not know that history never ends, that change is always inevitable, that nations and civilizations rise and fall, that no era can last forever. History, as always, is moving forward.
"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge" Isaac Asimov.
Bedrock of conservativism has reached new extremes, leading to following statistics: 18% of Americans believe the sun revolves around the earth, 74% of Republicans deny climate change, 50% of young feel it unnecessary to know the location of other countries. 42% of Americans believe God created human beings less than 10,000 years ago, 25% of public school biology students believe that humans and dinosaurs lived on earth at the same time.
No wonder that Trump's campaign highlights like few others could that Americans are in a race for the bottom, in which the candidate who best embraces ignorance and hate wins.
16
But even though Trump may now claim that he wants to "Make America Great Again," he doesn't really believe in the concept of American exceptionalism. A few years ago, Trump's man-crush Putin wrote an Op-Ed that naturally criticized the concept of American exceptionalism. And Trump did a cable news interview in which he actually said that he agreed with Putin's criticism of American exceptionalism! So Trump doesn't really want to "Make America Great Again." He only want to make Trump Great Again! lol Trump probably think that if Trump is great again, then America would also be great again. However, since Trump is a fraud and a con man, America would not be great again under his "leadership" or lack thereof!
2
Trump discarded women by negotiating our right to choose away with the selection of Mike Pence and his list of evangelical approved justices with a nod to Mike Lee and Peter Thiel.
Perhaps 10,000 helpless zika babies with microcephaly will show these christians that personal choice is private and personal and not the governments business since they do a poor job supporting our weakest citizens.
Perhaps 10,000 helpless zika babies with microcephaly will show these christians that personal choice is private and personal and not the governments business since they do a poor job supporting our weakest citizens.
5
Perhaps those who are more liberal are simply those who are more willing and able to accept the change that is coming in the future, while conservatives fear that uncertainty and wish to keep or go back to what they already know. Those who are more educated, more traveled, and already part of a minority are usually more prepared for, comfortable with, and aware of the inevitable societal changes that are already barreling down the turnpike.
8
People with college degrees, even those who live in Middle America away from the more cosmopolitan coasts, tend to be more sophisticated than people who don't have degrees. So whites with college degrees are too sophisticated to support Trump! Whites with college degrees who oppose Trump (as well as other opponents of Trump) believe that he is a totally unserious man who is auditioning for the most serious job in the entire wold! Trump has made a mockery of our political process for his entire campaign! On the campaign trail, he behaves as if he is still hosting a reality TV show. And due to our modern infotainment culture where celebrity news and serious political news easily mix, millions of low information voters are attracted to Trump, because they don't know the difference between a reality TV star and a statesman! Trump is actually the ultimate fulfillment of our unsophisticated and unserious infotainment culture. Whites with college degrees who oppose Trump are as entertained as anybody, but we much prefer substance over style. Style is important for a politician, but the most important and serious political office in the world requires much substance, which Trump does not have and never will!
15
I'm surprised that not one reader has brought up Biology. People's brain scans show a certain structure that determines ones predisposition to character traits like empathy, sympathy, charity and being either introverted or extroverted. Is it locked in over time? Probably not as the cellular structure can change as we age. Some never do regardless. And the brain plays a role in the Party one chooses also. Which explains why people raised in a home that has Democratic roots and values can become Republicans after they leave the nest. It may be nature's way of balancing out reasoning to help survival of the species during certain natural cycles or catastrophes. Who can say but the certainty is that variety really is the spice of life.
1
There are plenty of people raised in a home with roots in one party that support a different party - some of them children still in the nest.
We sometimes assume that we are the pinnacle of evolution and completely evolved beyond the animal. The truth is we haven't evolved that far from our animal brethren, so it takes the luck of a genetic quirk of personality or the luck of being taught by the right teachers to be able to significantly temper our reptilian brains. 80% of the time, we act on instinct; being human, we have often layered on new instincts atop the ones we're born with. The more educated we become, the more we are able to recognize our instincts and contradict them when necessary based on critical thinking and the swelling base of knowledge being collected by the human race.
We sometimes assume that we are the pinnacle of evolution and completely evolved beyond the animal. The truth is we haven't evolved that far from our animal brethren, so it takes the luck of a genetic quirk of personality or the luck of being taught by the right teachers to be able to significantly temper our reptilian brains. 80% of the time, we act on instinct; being human, we have often layered on new instincts atop the ones we're born with. The more educated we become, the more we are able to recognize our instincts and contradict them when necessary based on critical thinking and the swelling base of knowledge being collected by the human race.
4
the luck of being taught by the right teachers to be able to significantly temper our reptilian brains
The right teacher to a liberal is not the same as the right one to a Conservative. Therein lies the rub.
The right teacher to a liberal is not the same as the right one to a Conservative. Therein lies the rub.
1
I think this election is simply between those who read and learn versus those who don't.
What is on the bookshelf of those who support Trump?
What is on the bookshelf who support Hillary?
It is sad but our country is split along lines of ignorance versus those who read and try to know and make an informed decision.
Some used to say it was the poor white middle class who supported Trump but lo and behold the majority of Trump supporters average out at 72,000 a year.
However, the surprise is not in the salary. It is that so many bad people make so much money.
It goes to show you that racists can thrive and are not all originating from the depths of despair.
They are doing well and full of bile.
What is on the bookshelf of those who support Trump?
What is on the bookshelf who support Hillary?
It is sad but our country is split along lines of ignorance versus those who read and try to know and make an informed decision.
Some used to say it was the poor white middle class who supported Trump but lo and behold the majority of Trump supporters average out at 72,000 a year.
However, the surprise is not in the salary. It is that so many bad people make so much money.
It goes to show you that racists can thrive and are not all originating from the depths of despair.
They are doing well and full of bile.
23
I grew up in a household with parents from different political parties. I have BBQs with my neighbors who have very different political views than I do. Anyone on my street would drop everything and help a neighbor if they needed it, regardless of political leanings. This is the America I value and that most of us know. Because we know and respect each other we tend to avoid conversations about politics, especially right now.
I know people across every demographic that are voting for Trump. As a very religious Christian that puzzles me for a number of reasons, as I believe that many of his actions and platform points are inconsistent with my values. What is even more puzzling to me is that a range of people I know and respect have equally uneasy feelings about Hillary.
I believe my like for Hillary and dislike of Trump are based on rational ideas. Trump supporters believe the same thing. Who is "Right" and who is "Wrong?" Life and the government are too complex to reduce to those notions.
What I am sure of is that me, my family, and my neighbors live in the REAL America. What we see all too often in government, in political races, and in political coverage IS NOT THE REAL America. This false dichotomy of me v. you that gets set up is not reflective of how most of us live. The lack of respect, willingness to get along, and to cooperate in government is largely due to that false dichotomy and is the source of our frustration with government.
I know people across every demographic that are voting for Trump. As a very religious Christian that puzzles me for a number of reasons, as I believe that many of his actions and platform points are inconsistent with my values. What is even more puzzling to me is that a range of people I know and respect have equally uneasy feelings about Hillary.
I believe my like for Hillary and dislike of Trump are based on rational ideas. Trump supporters believe the same thing. Who is "Right" and who is "Wrong?" Life and the government are too complex to reduce to those notions.
What I am sure of is that me, my family, and my neighbors live in the REAL America. What we see all too often in government, in political races, and in political coverage IS NOT THE REAL America. This false dichotomy of me v. you that gets set up is not reflective of how most of us live. The lack of respect, willingness to get along, and to cooperate in government is largely due to that false dichotomy and is the source of our frustration with government.
42
You've been confronted by the phenomenon of sociopolitical optics. The Clintons seem to skirt the edge of criminality for the sake of convenience, but with the ultimate aim of doing good in the world. Unfortunately, that results in two effects: 1) Sometimes they'll miss the edge and accidentally dip into criminality - but that will rarely be a significant dip, unless one is predisposed to view any dip as significant; 2) If you look at what they do with a jaundiced eye, lots will look suspicious, even perfectly innocent things, and if they - as they do - have a lot of influential people gunning for them, there will be a continual drumbeat of "crook" and "liar" that will soon drown out any other tune.
My guess is that the Clintons decided early on in their political careers that to get good done they had to play the game, and play it better than their foes. In other words, become expert insiders. I think they honestly try not to be corrupt, but unfortunately there are too many in the game who are, and if you're navigating that mud stream you will get mud on you. Then there is that streak of arrogance in them that compounds their troubles, but it's a kind of righteous arrogance - not the kind of petty, childish arrogance that Donald trump personifies.
My guess is that the Clintons decided early on in their political careers that to get good done they had to play the game, and play it better than their foes. In other words, become expert insiders. I think they honestly try not to be corrupt, but unfortunately there are too many in the game who are, and if you're navigating that mud stream you will get mud on you. Then there is that streak of arrogance in them that compounds their troubles, but it's a kind of righteous arrogance - not the kind of petty, childish arrogance that Donald trump personifies.
2
I appreciate your sensible view of Clinton and Trunp. However, I want to point out that one of those two candidate is campaigning on a message of unity: "Stronger Together" as it were. The other is talking about deporting people, building walls, and putting his opponent in prison.
If the rhetoric is dividing America, the blame does not lie equally between the two camps.
If the rhetoric is dividing America, the blame does not lie equally between the two camps.
2
Another example might be the person who graduates from high school and goes to college to be a teacher, and attends the local college. Then, upon graduation, goes back to teach at the high school from which he graduated. Then, marries his high school girlfriend and buys a house in the same neighborhood in which he was raised He might have higher education, but has not really experienced the world. Also, this person probably did not really interact with people different from himself. This is one of the reasons why so many teachers are so conservative and have a narrow view of life. This is also why actually becoming involved in the college experience, engaging with people from different cultures, and looking beyond one's own hometown is so important.
6
You're right. Just because a person went to college, or even graduated from college, does not mean he/she learned to analyze anything. And just because a person has a teaching degree (knows HOW to teach), does not mean he/she has acquired sufficient subject content (WHAT to teach.) It recalls my son's 7th grade history teacher confirming a student's statement that Columbus was in attendance at the first Thanksgiving. Yes, I personally witnessed this on back-to-school night. I don't have a teaching degree, but at least I learned a great deal of subject content in my bachelor's, including more math, more science and more literature than both my roommates who spent their senior years in practice teaching instead.
My relative who attended college, but made rotten grades, is voting for Trump. My point is that just because one has attended college doesn't mean he/she learned anything from it.
Maybe we need to compare college GPAs of people who voted for Trump, with GPAs of people who voted for Clinton. Now THAT would be revealing!
Or how about combining a test of math skills with a poll of how the person voted. That might reveal too that a mind trained in analysis is better able to sort out lies from fact.
My relative who attended college, but made rotten grades, is voting for Trump. My point is that just because one has attended college doesn't mean he/she learned anything from it.
Maybe we need to compare college GPAs of people who voted for Trump, with GPAs of people who voted for Clinton. Now THAT would be revealing!
Or how about combining a test of math skills with a poll of how the person voted. That might reveal too that a mind trained in analysis is better able to sort out lies from fact.
1
This may be a chicken or the egg question:
Does college make one less liklely to support Trump or are those who support Trump inherently less likely to go to college in the first place due to their close mindedness, fear of unknown and/or lack of critical thinking skills?
If you poll people on weather 1. they enjoy learning and 2. weather they think they still have a lot to learn in order to have a better understanding of the decisions a President must make and if compare that to which candidate they are supporting, I think that would be more enlightening than their level of education.
I believe that those who are close minded, who are more likely to suffer Dunning Kruger effect (not knowing what they don't know), and/or those who lack critical thinking skills are less likely to seek a college degree in the first place.
The undereducated Trump voters probably don't think they have anything to gain by a college degree. They are also more likely to fear what they don't know. A college education, which certainly opens you up to unfamiliar circumstances, people and ideas and helps improve your critical thinking skills, could be very threatening to these people.
Does college make one less liklely to support Trump or are those who support Trump inherently less likely to go to college in the first place due to their close mindedness, fear of unknown and/or lack of critical thinking skills?
If you poll people on weather 1. they enjoy learning and 2. weather they think they still have a lot to learn in order to have a better understanding of the decisions a President must make and if compare that to which candidate they are supporting, I think that would be more enlightening than their level of education.
I believe that those who are close minded, who are more likely to suffer Dunning Kruger effect (not knowing what they don't know), and/or those who lack critical thinking skills are less likely to seek a college degree in the first place.
The undereducated Trump voters probably don't think they have anything to gain by a college degree. They are also more likely to fear what they don't know. A college education, which certainly opens you up to unfamiliar circumstances, people and ideas and helps improve your critical thinking skills, could be very threatening to these people.
10
That's a good point, too! I have a relative who is a Jehova's witness. I feel safe in writing this because his mind is so closed that he would NEVER read the NYT. He had brilliant children, but never sent a single one to college, nor did he attend, because he/they might learn something that conflicted with the bible. God forbid that they should take Biology 101, much less a course in ecology, cytology, microbiology, or (gasp) evolution! Oh, my stars, that would be HORRIBLE!
And I feel quite certain he is voting for Trump. I don't even need to ask. Of course, he'll gloss over the fact that Trump doesn't feel that adultery is a sin. Maybe he needs to reread the Old Testament. You know, the part where the Ten Commandments is laid out.
And I feel quite certain he is voting for Trump. I don't even need to ask. Of course, he'll gloss over the fact that Trump doesn't feel that adultery is a sin. Maybe he needs to reread the Old Testament. You know, the part where the Ten Commandments is laid out.
I grew up hearing that my grandfather liked to say the value of higher education is in its proof--& thus support--of educability; a virtuous circle, perhaps? I find myself thinking that insularity breeds fear, & hoping that increased educational opportunity supports clear-eyed progress.
3
Education gives a person confidence in their own judgement. Whether it's the scientist with a lab notebook or the English major buried in a stack of references and citations, the experience is one of finding facts and making arguments.
Just as importantly, a good education confronts a person with the limits of their knowledge: the mathematician's conjecture that lasts a century, the historian's accepted knowledge and revision, the speculation about who wrote Shakespeare's plays or what Beethoven really thought about his "fortresses" and his Immortal Beloved. Or that Galileo and his contemporaries once thought of Saturn as having "ears" rather than rings.
And these are simply Western references, universal only because their subject matter occurs in every litererate culture. Yet who among us can look at the ancient astronomical observatories in Africa or Central America, and not wonder how much those people might have been like ourselves, and what archaeology might still have to teach us? Or what might make our own fate different from theirs.
Given all this, why would any intelligent and thinking person support the "party of stupid", described as such even by its own elected leaders? It would be a disgusting act, like smashing a scientific instrument or burning a rare manuscript. And that's before the rationales and "policies" have even been considered - where evidence and reason lead to supporting the party where they still maintain a small foothold.
Just as importantly, a good education confronts a person with the limits of their knowledge: the mathematician's conjecture that lasts a century, the historian's accepted knowledge and revision, the speculation about who wrote Shakespeare's plays or what Beethoven really thought about his "fortresses" and his Immortal Beloved. Or that Galileo and his contemporaries once thought of Saturn as having "ears" rather than rings.
And these are simply Western references, universal only because their subject matter occurs in every litererate culture. Yet who among us can look at the ancient astronomical observatories in Africa or Central America, and not wonder how much those people might have been like ourselves, and what archaeology might still have to teach us? Or what might make our own fate different from theirs.
Given all this, why would any intelligent and thinking person support the "party of stupid", described as such even by its own elected leaders? It would be a disgusting act, like smashing a scientific instrument or burning a rare manuscript. And that's before the rationales and "policies" have even been considered - where evidence and reason lead to supporting the party where they still maintain a small foothold.
12
You've missed a major theory - selfishness.
Liberal policy is to expand services for the poor and middle class. More education, healthcare, welfare. Paid for by the rich.
Conservative policy is "small government" aka cut education, environmental protection, healthcare, etc., especially for minorities they don't relate with. And of course deregulate rich businesses and cut taxes on the 1% (though they seem to genuinely think this helps them).
There are important value distinctions, not just fact distinctions. Conservatives don't want their tax money going to help some 'lazy minority' or 'welfare queen.' Liberals think entrenched poverty is not because of some moral failure of the poor, but systemic in nature, and even racist.
These differences, about who we care about, and what they deserve are arguably the critical difference between liberals and conservatives. Despite the oddity of Trump's campaign, this remains true. How did we forget about this?
Liberal policy is to expand services for the poor and middle class. More education, healthcare, welfare. Paid for by the rich.
Conservative policy is "small government" aka cut education, environmental protection, healthcare, etc., especially for minorities they don't relate with. And of course deregulate rich businesses and cut taxes on the 1% (though they seem to genuinely think this helps them).
There are important value distinctions, not just fact distinctions. Conservatives don't want their tax money going to help some 'lazy minority' or 'welfare queen.' Liberals think entrenched poverty is not because of some moral failure of the poor, but systemic in nature, and even racist.
These differences, about who we care about, and what they deserve are arguably the critical difference between liberals and conservatives. Despite the oddity of Trump's campaign, this remains true. How did we forget about this?
28
As a conservative, I reject your definition of why we want small government. It's not based in selfishness, but in a belief that in a free market system all people have the opportunity to succeed if released from the bonds of government dependency and regulation. Your assumption that minorities and the poor are not capable of economic mobility, but must subsist on crumbs handed out by the government, belies "the soft bigotry of low expectations".
Bonnie, the "free market" only works when carefully regulated. Otherwise, it is based on greed and selfishness i.e. "I've got mine, too bad for you" and "health to only those who can pay for it", etc.
3
No, Bonnie, conservatives rationalize selfishness by wrapping it in platitudes, often the very one you cite. Unfortunately you don't grasp that individual capacity has to be developed in a nurturing environment. conservatives with your point of view tend to feel, for example, that poor communities deserve poor schools, and rich ones deserve well funded schools.
It's all part of the fiction that wealthy (white) people don't enjoy any special advantage over poorer people in the free market, and that rich people are entirely responsible for their success and vice-a-versa.
Your platitude about releasing poor people from the "bonds of government dependency..." is the modern equivalent of "let them eat cake."
To be clear - Nowhere did Dan suggest that poor people are not capable. Those are words you heard from someone on Fox News, regurgitated from the days of "compassionate conservatism," that you're putting in Dan's mouth. Dan is suggesting that fantasies about small government are actually rationalization rooted in selfishness. He was addressing your attitude, not your naive socio-economic premises.
It's all part of the fiction that wealthy (white) people don't enjoy any special advantage over poorer people in the free market, and that rich people are entirely responsible for their success and vice-a-versa.
Your platitude about releasing poor people from the "bonds of government dependency..." is the modern equivalent of "let them eat cake."
To be clear - Nowhere did Dan suggest that poor people are not capable. Those are words you heard from someone on Fox News, regurgitated from the days of "compassionate conservatism," that you're putting in Dan's mouth. Dan is suggesting that fantasies about small government are actually rationalization rooted in selfishness. He was addressing your attitude, not your naive socio-economic premises.
4
I happen to have two bachelors and a masters. I also own my own business. I know literally thousands of people who are educated - doctors, lawyers, accountants, scientists, professors, I can keep the list going on and on - all are voting for Trump. I am amused by the rhetoric which the main media continues to lambaste the uneducated or uninformed with regarding who is voting for Trump. Frankly, EVERYONE is voting for him save for those who truly have not done their research or due diligence into the state of things.
5
Of course there are highly educated people voting for Trump, just like there are less educated people voting for HIllary. That being said the majority of educated people are voting for Hillary just like the majority of less educated whites are voting for Trump. I am amused when people voting for Trump talk about the media being "uninformed" about Trump Voters. The fact that you think EVERYONE is voting for him shows how uninformed you are about Hillary voters. Growing up in NJ I am fully informed about Trump's corrupt business practices and hostility towards minorities and women. If you had done your due diligence you wouldn't be able to vote for this corrupt narcissistic fraud.
33
State of things? General concepts are subjective traps for the ill-informed. In the absence of specific 'things' to consider we can only speculate what you may be referring.
Globalism is not going to stop whomever wins the POTUS vote. If global trade policies are restricted in the U.S., foreign and U.S. owned companies will relocate from the U.S. to other trade-friendly jurisdictions.
Consider the impact of tax havens that had operated 'tax laundering' services off-shore for wealthy clients employing illicit tax planning. The U.S. Congress continues to be incapable of ending U.S. tax base erosion and profit shifting planning by U.S. and other major global corporations operating within the U.S.
Trump reveled in aggressive tax policies and claims he will lower taxes if elected. He hasn't released full tax returns as did Clinton. What are the chances that Trump will follow-through and penalize U.S. entities that use tax planning to lower U.S. income tax and terminate jobs in the U.S. to relocate off-shore?
If you are serious about U.S. economic stability and continued recovery you may find it difficult to argue the U.S. has been doing badly. In fact, the U.S. is the best performing economy with one of the lowest unemployment rates among G7 nations. http://www.theglobaleconomy.com/compare-countries/ .
[Select time period and nations to compare.]
Globalism is not going to stop whomever wins the POTUS vote. If global trade policies are restricted in the U.S., foreign and U.S. owned companies will relocate from the U.S. to other trade-friendly jurisdictions.
Consider the impact of tax havens that had operated 'tax laundering' services off-shore for wealthy clients employing illicit tax planning. The U.S. Congress continues to be incapable of ending U.S. tax base erosion and profit shifting planning by U.S. and other major global corporations operating within the U.S.
Trump reveled in aggressive tax policies and claims he will lower taxes if elected. He hasn't released full tax returns as did Clinton. What are the chances that Trump will follow-through and penalize U.S. entities that use tax planning to lower U.S. income tax and terminate jobs in the U.S. to relocate off-shore?
If you are serious about U.S. economic stability and continued recovery you may find it difficult to argue the U.S. has been doing badly. In fact, the U.S. is the best performing economy with one of the lowest unemployment rates among G7 nations. http://www.theglobaleconomy.com/compare-countries/ .
[Select time period and nations to compare.]
10
You and "EVERYONE" you know couldn't possibly have done your research and due diligence! Otherwise you all would NOT be voting for Trump! If you don't like Hillary, that's great! I don't like her either. Instead, you all can vote for a third-party candidate like Gary Johnson or Evan McMullin, whom I proudly voted for! Unlike Trump-- who dodged the draft during the Vietnam War and only risked his life to fight STDs (lol)--McMullin actually risked his life for our country as a CIA operations officer!
1
A big part of the issue in this election is the sexism by under educated men.
We are seeing this obviously with the Trump crowd. But do not miss the apathy of African-American men also and their historically low expected turnout and lack of enthusiasm for Hillary.
This is the "NFL crowd" that likes their women in cheerleader outfits and subservient and the idea of a woman in charge is not easily accepted.
We are seeing this obviously with the Trump crowd. But do not miss the apathy of African-American men also and their historically low expected turnout and lack of enthusiasm for Hillary.
This is the "NFL crowd" that likes their women in cheerleader outfits and subservient and the idea of a woman in charge is not easily accepted.
15
I think it's less educational attainment than it is world view but the two are tied. Getting an education broadens your world view and helps you to grasp that everyone doesn't conduct their lives as you do.
I know many Trump supporters and many are very intelligent, but what most have in common is a very narrow idea of how the world works and a very simplistic view of how government, religion, race relations, and culture should be. Many, for example, do not see religion in terms of spiritual exercise but as a set of doctrines you sign on to and once you do, you have happy admittance to the afterlife. No need to wrestle with the bigger questions of life. Government should benefit them, not people whose lives they can't comprehend. Race relations are theory only because they rarely encounter other races.
It's very telling to me that in my rural Indiana area, when young people get a college level education, they rarely return to the area. Some of that has to do with job opportunities, but mostly, their world has grown too big for them to feel comfortable here. The question of "how you going to keep 'em down on the farm once they've seen Paree?" still rings true.
I know many Trump supporters and many are very intelligent, but what most have in common is a very narrow idea of how the world works and a very simplistic view of how government, religion, race relations, and culture should be. Many, for example, do not see religion in terms of spiritual exercise but as a set of doctrines you sign on to and once you do, you have happy admittance to the afterlife. No need to wrestle with the bigger questions of life. Government should benefit them, not people whose lives they can't comprehend. Race relations are theory only because they rarely encounter other races.
It's very telling to me that in my rural Indiana area, when young people get a college level education, they rarely return to the area. Some of that has to do with job opportunities, but mostly, their world has grown too big for them to feel comfortable here. The question of "how you going to keep 'em down on the farm once they've seen Paree?" still rings true.
83
The title of this piece is rankling. It implies causation: more education translates to less support for Trump. While the rest of it is relatively solid (like most NYT pieces are), as usual during this election season the blaring headline insults Trump supporters and confirms their opinions regarding the journalistic integrity of the NYT. While there are all sorts of implications submerged beneath this sort of headline, in my experience there are similar numbers of uncouth, unsavory folks in both parties. Like Trump, you are appealing to your base rather than reaching out to a broader audience.
Association, of course, does not imply causation. As in many countries, there is a culture divide in the US that is reflected in its political parties. Trump supporters are more likely to live in rural America, which forms the bedrock of today's Republican party. These areas are more conservative values (why they support Trump), and they also happen to have adults that tend to have less years of schooling (not why they support Trump). Number of years of education has always corresponded with opportunity rather than intelligence.
While rural America may be waning, our fellow countrymen certainly have the right to express their opinions and vote their values without this form of subtle (what Trump supporters would probably term 'elitist') denigration.
Association, of course, does not imply causation. As in many countries, there is a culture divide in the US that is reflected in its political parties. Trump supporters are more likely to live in rural America, which forms the bedrock of today's Republican party. These areas are more conservative values (why they support Trump), and they also happen to have adults that tend to have less years of schooling (not why they support Trump). Number of years of education has always corresponded with opportunity rather than intelligence.
While rural America may be waning, our fellow countrymen certainly have the right to express their opinions and vote their values without this form of subtle (what Trump supporters would probably term 'elitist') denigration.
5
Speaking way too simplistically about education, I'd suggest the better one learns how to learn (THE core requirement as one proceeds "higher and higher" in "education" in my opinion), i.e. learning how to logically, consistently and repeatedly poke around in mazes of often conflicting facts, data, writings, opinions, arguments, etc. to try to figure out, test, and re-test "truths" - to base one's outlook over time less on external "givens", and more and more on one's own internal findings, abilities and (re)sources - I'd further suggest one tends to be, and to be considered, "more liberal". Maybe a stretch, but usually more open, more curious, more welcoming, more appreciative in general about new "stuff". Whereas one who "finishes school" (at whatever level, but perhaps more as a state of mind than as determined by a specific number of years) might henceforth be more likely to automatically accept what one is given by external sources to be a "truth" - having less personal time (or incentive? or inclination?) to do (as) much personal digging/learning anymore - maybe in many cases simply because the job and money and a family and life in general gets in the way. This person tending, in the little just-made-up world I've created here, to become "more conservative". Not stupid. Not lazy. Just more set in one's ways. And so perhaps sometimes more likely to accept what "they" say to be true without the same level of questioning our liberal friend up above might offer.
3
I am a closet PhD liberal RANCHER in Montana. If urban liberals don't recognize that rural America is still the heartbeat of America, they are failing to acknowledge where food comes from, where hard workers work hard every day 12 to 14 hours a day, and where your word is still your bond. I trust my neighbors and friends, all conservatives to a man, just as I trust my liberal compatriots in far away places. Kindness, hard work, and honor are attributes that we all should share as we thread our way, in our own way, through this distressing vale of tears we call life.
Lend a hand, have compassion! Do your part to dial down ugly rhetoric that serves no one in the end. And don't forget to spend 14 hours a day working your tail off, like the farmers and ranchers i know.
Lend a hand, have compassion! Do your part to dial down ugly rhetoric that serves no one in the end. And don't forget to spend 14 hours a day working your tail off, like the farmers and ranchers i know.
67
Hi, Mickey Steward -
Right now in this country, what used to be a nation of family farms has more and more fallen prey to agribusiness, which is a great shame. Most of our meat is now raised under horrible conditions in giant factory farms. The poultry industry is notorious for its mistreatment of both chickens and immigrant workers. Your "rural America" is not nearly so pristine as you would have us believe.
As for working 12 -14 hours a day, what makes you think people in urban areas don't do that? Public school teachers, for example, get paid only for the hours during which they are at school. They usually, however, arrive early, stay late, and take work home.
The "real America" is everywhere and all of us. Right now, we've got big problems. How we fix them, or even if we fix them, will define our country over the next decade or two. I know I'll do my part, and from your post, I know you'll do yours.
Cheers.
Right now in this country, what used to be a nation of family farms has more and more fallen prey to agribusiness, which is a great shame. Most of our meat is now raised under horrible conditions in giant factory farms. The poultry industry is notorious for its mistreatment of both chickens and immigrant workers. Your "rural America" is not nearly so pristine as you would have us believe.
As for working 12 -14 hours a day, what makes you think people in urban areas don't do that? Public school teachers, for example, get paid only for the hours during which they are at school. They usually, however, arrive early, stay late, and take work home.
The "real America" is everywhere and all of us. Right now, we've got big problems. How we fix them, or even if we fix them, will define our country over the next decade or two. I know I'll do my part, and from your post, I know you'll do yours.
Cheers.
2
I think you raise a key point - in early times (and still in communities like ours) people actually depended on each other. When it's -5 and the power has gone out, and there's a tree down across your driveway, and your neighbor shows up unannounced with his chainsaw and front loader, it makes whatever political differences you may share with him seem really trivial. For folks living more suburban lives, pressures tend to be more internal - job and family struggles. It's easy to develop an island mentality and start blaming the "other" for our problems.
1
As someone who has lived in conservative, rural Central California, where the top industries were agriculture and oil, I want to point out that state and local level politics affect the quality of life of most Americans more than federal government. People seem forget our federal, de-centralized form of government whenever it suits them.
A lot of the problems of Republican heartlands have to do with the Republican state and local politicians that run those places and the policies they implement, not machinations or neglect of "liberal elites" hundreds of miles away.
A lot of the problems of Republican heartlands have to do with the Republican state and local politicians that run those places and the policies they implement, not machinations or neglect of "liberal elites" hundreds of miles away.
2
As the late academic and Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan said, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not entitled to their own facts. This is an adage the apparently Trump and some of his supporters disagree with.
24
Education provides a context of interdependence, collaboration, and compassion. Lack of education and poor education creates alienation, fear, prejudice, and distrust of the "others". Uneducated people and those traumatized by economic dislocation are susceptible to emotionally charged appeals that relieve them of blame, guilt and responsibility for their plight and give them the capacity to ignore those distasteful aspects of their candidate so long as their issue continues to resonate. Atrocities are overlooked by people who can think: " candidates all do it.... they all lie....the other candidate said something racist....Benghazi etc..."
Sexual assault, promiscuity, harassment, tax evasion, bankruptcy, death threats, threats of incarceration are all unimportant because Trump "is not a politician....will make America great again(like I was great once), will revenge our loss of jobs,,,,will build a wall"
Sexual assault, promiscuity, harassment, tax evasion, bankruptcy, death threats, threats of incarceration are all unimportant because Trump "is not a politician....will make America great again(like I was great once), will revenge our loss of jobs,,,,will build a wall"
5
The average Trump supporter makes some 70K. To make that kind of money requires an education of some kind...it may not be academic. Unless your doing something illegal, to make 70K, that equates to approximately $35 dollars an hour assuming a 40 hour week. The discussion then becomes liberal (more open emotionally) vs authoritarian (closed emotionally) not necessarily conservative. Conservative by definition is generally cautious about change, not necessarily opposed to it.
From a national poll conducted at the end of December 2015, it was found that the most significant factor in who votes for Trump is “authoritarianism” followed by fear of terrorism, though the former was far more significant than the latter.”
“Authoritarians OBEY. They rally to and follow to at least the appearance of strong leaders. And they respond aggressively to outsiders, especially when they feel threatened.”
In the poll “a set of four simple survey questions that political scientists have employed since 1992 to measure inclination toward authoritarianism. These questions pertain to child-rearing: whether it is more important for the voter to have a child who is respectful or independent; obedient or self-reliant; well-behaved or considerate; and well-mannered or curious. Respondents who pick the first option in each of these questions are strongly authoritarian.” (Politico)
Fear is the driving force, control is the chosen method of dealing with the environment...in an attempt to feel safe.
From a national poll conducted at the end of December 2015, it was found that the most significant factor in who votes for Trump is “authoritarianism” followed by fear of terrorism, though the former was far more significant than the latter.”
“Authoritarians OBEY. They rally to and follow to at least the appearance of strong leaders. And they respond aggressively to outsiders, especially when they feel threatened.”
In the poll “a set of four simple survey questions that political scientists have employed since 1992 to measure inclination toward authoritarianism. These questions pertain to child-rearing: whether it is more important for the voter to have a child who is respectful or independent; obedient or self-reliant; well-behaved or considerate; and well-mannered or curious. Respondents who pick the first option in each of these questions are strongly authoritarian.” (Politico)
Fear is the driving force, control is the chosen method of dealing with the environment...in an attempt to feel safe.
9
IQ. Is a number representing a person's “reasoning ability” but we know that from the works of neuroscientist, Dr. Antonio Damasio, that “Emotionally impaired people have problems with social behavior and emotions play a role in making decisions and choices in a normal way… they may normally do well on intelligence tests but they no longer make choices, prioritize tasks or manage time well.”…so emotional impairment impedes reasoning. Emotional intelligence (EQ) is more important than (IQ). “Your EQ is the level of your ability to understand other people, what motivates them and how to work cooperatively with them,” (Howard Gardner, Harvard) EQ is comprised of- Self-awareness. The ability to recognize an emotion as it “happens”, Self-regulation: Ability to feel emotions for the proper amount of time. Empathy: The ability to recognize how people feel is important. Social intelligence (SQ) is the capability to effectively navigate and negotiate complex social relationships and environments. The problem is that all of these IQ, EQ and SQ can all be impaired by both physical impairments (like brain damage & biochemical disorders) and emotional impairments (mental illness). So, whatever interferes with a person’s emotions, it then interferes with their reasoning which all interferes with their SQ.
Trump being an obvious grandiose narcissist shows a complete breakdown of EQ which impairs his SQ and in turn his followers.
Trump being an obvious grandiose narcissist shows a complete breakdown of EQ which impairs his SQ and in turn his followers.
7
The polarization of political parties and my perplextion and desire to understand how we can think so differently keeps me up at night... like tonight. And here is the conclusion I came to that has allowed me to put it to bed (pun intended).
By filling your mind, body and soul with knowledge of and from only this world, and neglecting to feast your mind on the powers beyond the physical, you alienate yourself from God and the realm beyond time, earth and life - all of which eventually die.
By feeding you soul with knowledge and guidance from the eternal, and combining it with the knowledge of man and this world, your mind is humbled and you are given a gift of understand beyond what those confined to the earth can see.
By filling your mind, body and soul with knowledge of and from only this world, and neglecting to feast your mind on the powers beyond the physical, you alienate yourself from God and the realm beyond time, earth and life - all of which eventually die.
By feeding you soul with knowledge and guidance from the eternal, and combining it with the knowledge of man and this world, your mind is humbled and you are given a gift of understand beyond what those confined to the earth can see.
3
God gave us a brain to use. Denying science, picking on women, pretending racism doesn't exist, portraying our own President as a foreigner to the delight of white nationalists who support Mr Trump is not mysterious- it is a willful distortion of democratic values to get power. There are people who do not want to deal with finding themselves in a pluralistic secular society and solving problems creatively. Fear is cheap.
Religious folk who made the error of thinking Christianity has anything to do with being synonymous with political institutions like the Republican Party did not pay attention to their own teachings and traded off cultural credibility. Trying to make a predator like Trump represent anything higher than his own diseased egomania is deluded. He does not meet the behavioral requirements of even the average American teen with a working conscience much less the required mature mind of a grown man to function as a leader not a demagogue. No way but through on this one.
Religious folk who made the error of thinking Christianity has anything to do with being synonymous with political institutions like the Republican Party did not pay attention to their own teachings and traded off cultural credibility. Trying to make a predator like Trump represent anything higher than his own diseased egomania is deluded. He does not meet the behavioral requirements of even the average American teen with a working conscience much less the required mature mind of a grown man to function as a leader not a demagogue. No way but through on this one.
9
It seems to me Americans were becoming more worldly and open post-WW2 up through the 70's. It was natural and gradual. But for some with economic and political power this was eroding their power base. The rise of the Christian right, talk radio, Fox News, etc was the response, pushing a large portion of the population farther right and away from openness and critical thinking. And repeating their screeds against the "liberal media" and "liberal higher education" made it true for many, steering their followers away from inconvenient information, exchanges and analysis. Facts no longer matter. Manipulation to see objectivity as liberal manipulation.
College education offers another view of the world that many never get a chance to experience.
College education offers another view of the world that many never get a chance to experience.
14
I engage on a daily basis with political commentary from all politic viewpoints. Sadly, the liberal side is continuously one of emotion rather than logic. That is not to say Democratic. I have several good friends who are Democrat which engage in lively discussions and debates on current events without resorting to name calling or emotional outbursts. Perhaps if the liberal mindset were to alter to actually engage in logic versus feeling it would be more accepted.
1
And the same phenomenon seems to be happening in Europe too with the far-right parties and Brexit. Brexit may have been the right thing for Britain to do, but it has been accompanied by anti-immigration and isolationism sentiment.
2
These days the facts don't matter to people. Everyone is voting on their feelings. That's why Trump supporters don't care how racist he is. Hillary supporters could care less about emails. Everyone wants the person they feel will best secure their ideal of what America should be. That is why education is so important because it exposes us to alternative viewpoints. Education is a very useful tool for religious groups out of the mainstream. When you only allow information that reinforces what you believe and discourage higher education you have more control of what members think and believe. Justification of this behavior is easy when you are "protecting" your family from evil influences.
11
I really m trying to grasp how wanting to remove illegal aliens form every country no matter what race it is makes the man a racist. Perhaps it was when he sued and won the rights of the Jewish and black community to be giving access and memberships to elite clubs back in the days prior to acceptance by others? Maybe it was when he Demanded illegals follow the process to become citizens as many others have, and has won the support of millions of true immigrants here?
I am also trying to figure out how, when he has demanded and pushed for equal pay and rights for females and has several highly successful women who advocate for him due to his direct hand in their push through the glass ceiling he is misogynist.
It appears you are correct...the average American now does not want to do research..they want the information handed to them and will accept anything at face value.
I am also trying to figure out how, when he has demanded and pushed for equal pay and rights for females and has several highly successful women who advocate for him due to his direct hand in their push through the glass ceiling he is misogynist.
It appears you are correct...the average American now does not want to do research..they want the information handed to them and will accept anything at face value.
While some people might be voting based on feelings, I disagree that everyone is. Clinton is qualified while Trump is not. Her mistakes regarding emails pale in comparison with the horror that is Trump. A vote for him is incredibly risky, while a vote for Clinton is not. Clinton will do more to combat climate change than Trump will and she will protect the health insurance set up we have currently which, while flawed, gives coverage to many people and their pre-existing conditions. These are not feelings. These are facts.
7
The Lie that constantly feeding our fears instead of educating our minds will ever lead us someplace terrific will have to be shelved along with the other crackpipe idea that we get to Great via delusions that navigating in a democracy is easy. Or is even possible from the LazyBoy with just a heavy rotation of scapegoatery for other Americans.
Getting the culture separated from critical thinking and common sense and courage and plain old manners is the work of demagogues and has fed the lie that the actual skills required of Americans for self governance can be avoided or traded off for some fakey bakey that our only choice is which undeveloped childish screamer to blindly follow. It's costing us plenty.
Getting the culture separated from critical thinking and common sense and courage and plain old manners is the work of demagogues and has fed the lie that the actual skills required of Americans for self governance can be avoided or traded off for some fakey bakey that our only choice is which undeveloped childish screamer to blindly follow. It's costing us plenty.
11
Well, duh.
1
Am an Independent and Trump simply lacks the needed temperament to be President. Look at the last debate as an example. He started out saner than in past debates and then WHAM within 30 minutes told wild crazy Trump emerged. So he cannot stay sane and semi focused for more than 30-45 minutes.
Then there is FACT that he needs millennials, minority, college educated, professional women to win yet he is doing NOTHING to attract them. Instead he goes out and talks to the same types who have supported him from the get go.
He is running for President of the United States. Leader of a super power nation. NOT for the most famous person who can Tweet the most Tweets on Twitter, or out obnoxious a Kardashian on Twitter.
This is a SEVENTY year old man who hasn't progressed past his obnoxious twenties in social skills and civility. If he hasn't changed by now, trust me he NEVER will!!
I also will wager that those who support him have never attended city/county/school board meetings. Or even know who their House member is or their two Senators, much less met them or written or called them on issues that concern them. Instead the complain and complain. Whereas progressives tend to be more hands on and involved in local, state and federal political concerns.
Then there is FACT that he needs millennials, minority, college educated, professional women to win yet he is doing NOTHING to attract them. Instead he goes out and talks to the same types who have supported him from the get go.
He is running for President of the United States. Leader of a super power nation. NOT for the most famous person who can Tweet the most Tweets on Twitter, or out obnoxious a Kardashian on Twitter.
This is a SEVENTY year old man who hasn't progressed past his obnoxious twenties in social skills and civility. If he hasn't changed by now, trust me he NEVER will!!
I also will wager that those who support him have never attended city/county/school board meetings. Or even know who their House member is or their two Senators, much less met them or written or called them on issues that concern them. Instead the complain and complain. Whereas progressives tend to be more hands on and involved in local, state and federal political concerns.
18
"Men would not live long in society were they not the dupes of each other."
"As it is the mark of great minds to say many things in a few words, so it is that of little minds to use many words to say nothing."
by François de La Rochefoucauld (1665)
Who among the 2016 presidential candidates most reflects the above maxims?
"As it is the mark of great minds to say many things in a few words, so it is that of little minds to use many words to say nothing."
by François de La Rochefoucauld (1665)
Who among the 2016 presidential candidates most reflects the above maxims?
5
Here's an example of the second maxim from Trump, lol:
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/781251501947748352
https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/781251501947748352
1
When you go to college, even if you are an English major as I was, you will probably take some science classes and be exposed to the scientific method. Your thinking will become more rigorous because you will see that theories must be tested against evidence before they can be accepted. If you are lucky you might study rhetoric or classical debate and learn that name-calling and ad hominem arguments are unacceptable because they are not based on logic or provable facts. You tend to become deeply skeptical of people like Trump who are given to wild exaggerations and simplistic thinking (our country is broken "and only I can fix it"). While you may be able to see his appeal -- he appears to be strong, decisive and self-confident -- you just can't believe that he would have the judgment needed to lead a complex and diverse society such as ours.
13
Why Does Education Translate to Less Support for Donald Trump?
..college-educated people can see through Mr. Trump because they’re smart.
Dunning–Kruger effect?
....incompetent people by lack the skills they’d need in order to be able to distinguish good performers from bad performers:
…people who lack the knowledge or wisdom to perform well are often unaware of this fact. We attribute this lack of awareness to a deficit in metacognitive skill. That is, the same incompetence that leads them to make wrong choices also deprives them of the savvy necessary to recognize competence, be it their own or anyone else’s.
Dunning–Kruger effect John Cleese on Stupidity
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvVPdyYeaQU
..college-educated people can see through Mr. Trump because they’re smart.
Dunning–Kruger effect?
....incompetent people by lack the skills they’d need in order to be able to distinguish good performers from bad performers:
…people who lack the knowledge or wisdom to perform well are often unaware of this fact. We attribute this lack of awareness to a deficit in metacognitive skill. That is, the same incompetence that leads them to make wrong choices also deprives them of the savvy necessary to recognize competence, be it their own or anyone else’s.
Dunning–Kruger effect John Cleese on Stupidity
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvVPdyYeaQU
4
Gut instinct. This is all the election is about. Starting with Bill Clinton democrats have failed the voters over and over again. People with higher education levels also know this, but they can see through the parade of peroxide blonds in the Trump camp, they can see behind his brand name fame. Gut instinct tells everyone with a college education that a hoard of fake blonds does not stand for a high level of individual achievement. Education tells everyone shopping for apparel to stay clear of the Ivanka brand. It is a gut reaction that tells people that the Trumps are a horrible oversell, overprized worthless goods. People with less education are less likely to see this because the world of signs of success is much reduced in their inventory. Education tells people to look for other signs as well. If you have never been asked to look for signs and question images, how can you be able to analyze data in any way other than the way it is presented to you?!
5
Donald provides us with so many examples of bad character, basic dishonesty, lies for the sake of lying, lack of ethics, lack of morals, lack of empathy, it is hard to choose a strong example likely to resonate with an undecided voter. And Donald has demonstrated the ability to capture the hearts of the mob by showing he is unafraid to say anything about anybody - stunning them with his viciousness. Now people attend his rally's not to better understand his positions on policies, but rather to be there when Donald blows away yet another rule for polite society. Donald keeps them entertained and right now, that's enough to buy their loyalty and vote!
21
Forget about IQ, it's meaning free.
What's important is the amount of RELIGIOUS FAITH.
Faithful are just that, they have faith in "higher powers"
Trump, being a billionaire, fits that bill.
They are also far more interested in personal testimony (especially from someone in authority), and Trump is nothing if a running stream of personal testimony.
What's important is the amount of RELIGIOUS FAITH.
Faithful are just that, they have faith in "higher powers"
Trump, being a billionaire, fits that bill.
They are also far more interested in personal testimony (especially from someone in authority), and Trump is nothing if a running stream of personal testimony.
9
I don't know if it is because I am a lawyer (1980) and therefore supposedly educated, or other factors, but it is difficult for me to take Trump seriously and so I don't dislike him all that much. But I know very good lawyers who are voting for Trump. As for Clinton, I just can't stand her--it is that simple. What is the saying: familiarity breeds contempt? And I am just too familiar with her and her ways. So, taking the reverse-psychology of the NYT's columnists, I voted for sweet Gary.
3
There is real beauty in the fact that one 'Squidge Bailey' presents astringent obsevations on, yes, class. Oh, Salinger, oh, Dickens: You just can't make this stuff up.
15
Here's an odd demographic for you... I'm a 35 yr old white married female with children, in the arts industry, with post graduate education that's a... Republican. By all stats (other than race) I should be a Democrat and on some issues I do lean that way.
In other words, I think demographics can be grossly generalistic... especially when you are singling out a particular group as stupid and attributing their ignorance, close mindedness, and political affiliation, to their lack of education, religion and lack of exposure to the world.
And I think it's rediculous to point out that the highly educated vote Democratic implying that only the stupid vote Republican. And from my experience... the highly educated are also among the most arrogant, egotistical, and more than likely... non-religious - none of which I think is a good thing.
In other words, I think demographics can be grossly generalistic... especially when you are singling out a particular group as stupid and attributing their ignorance, close mindedness, and political affiliation, to their lack of education, religion and lack of exposure to the world.
And I think it's rediculous to point out that the highly educated vote Democratic implying that only the stupid vote Republican. And from my experience... the highly educated are also among the most arrogant, egotistical, and more than likely... non-religious - none of which I think is a good thing.
2
And the fact that you believe being non-religious is a bad thing is the fork in the road that can always be counted on to divide rather than unite--unless one surrenders and conforms. No thank you. Praise the Quantum Foam that our founders saw the dangers inherent in shackling government to religion.
11
No arrogance in that comment, is there? Or is it all a put-on? What the writer fails to explain is why she is a Republican when she sometimes leans towards liberal points of view on particular issues. Is it because she doesn't like the personalities of Democrats? My neighbor is snooty. My neighbor votes Democratic. Therefore, I will vote Republican. Is that what our politics has descended to? I certainly do agree that it is dangerous to over-generalize and stereotype any group. It is also dangerous to produce anecdotal evidence about oneself and make too much out of it. The fact that an individual doesn't fit the generalization is a very good reason for not, for example, assuming Mexicans are in large numbers criminals or rapists or, as one Trump supporter, Rep.. King of IA, insisted, have massive calves from schlepping (how I'd love to hear Rep.. King use the word "schlepping") 70-pound bags of drugs across the border. We should notice how often we read articles from Trump supporters headlined "I am a _______________ (fill in your favorite stereotype of a Democratic voter) and I support Trump." Well, that's nice, but it wouldn't be too difficult to find someone else from the same group who supports Clinton, so what's the point? No stats show that _all_ who have lots of or little formal education do anything all the same, much less vote for the same candidate. Mr. Monkovic doesn't claim that no people with more formal education support Trump, just that fewer do.
1
Quantum Foam sounds a lot like God if you ask me...
1
The point of a college education, or at least of educating undergraduate college students, is, or ought to be, to teach future citizens to recognize humbug. Although the right wing, ever since the Reagan administration, has decided to make higher education as unaffordable as possible and turn it into profitized career training, apparently our colleges and universities have somehow managed to continue in their true mission nonetheless. And then there are also those of us who simply have our common sense. Either way, Donald Trump is the greatest humbug ever to have set foot on the national stage of American politics, with Sarah Palin a close second, and critical thought and common sense have apparently spread widely enough across the land for at least half of the population to recognize it.
17
In my small sample of high educated (masters+) acquaintance from the New York NJ area, the Republicans who supported McCain and Romney are supporting Trump and the Democrats who supported Obama are supporting Hillary. These highly educated people are supporting the candidates that reflect their long standing views of government responsibility, economic policy and culture. White Non Hispanic Christians from well to do families support Trump. The rest of us support Hillary.
3
And this is sad. They know what team they are on, never mind the GOP went with someone so unhinged and incompetent in temperament and experience as to worry many old guard Republicans that he is unfit to handle nuclear codes.
They openly support Clinton who successfully served as Secretary of State without blowing up the world.
You might point that out to them.
They openly support Clinton who successfully served as Secretary of State without blowing up the world.
You might point that out to them.
3
Just as those of us educated people who are NOT white or NOT Christian and NOT raised in families with significant wealth to preserve are voting for Hillary to defend ourselves from danger and economic and social discrimination, the White Christians from wealthy families are voting to preserve their wealth and power. Some of my acquaintance told me as early as 2010 pre-Romney that my dead parents were moochers off Social Security, unlike their richer dead parents. When i noted that both my parents worked & paid the maximum into SS from 1935-1980, they said my parents were moochers off Medicare. There's a group of wealthy educated people who hold educated white middle class people who work in CONTEMPT because they are not wealthy. The wealthy will always vote Republican because no matter who is president, their interests will be paramount.
People are now learning things in college that they sometimes used to learn in high school and may no longer due to the degradation of our educational system. Regardless, as one commenter in the article said, critical thinking is emphasized in college. I can't think of a more useful life skill.
11
I think it's a combination of things rather than any single factor.
For starters, if you look at the red/blue map of the US, the red states are in areas not particularly known for their rates of change. They strongly want things to stay the same.
This flows into my next theory, which is that highly educated people are more prone to recognize that things change and adapt to it. We may all wish for the good old days (or believe they never existed), but -- a sub-theory - we tend to be in jobs where we're paid to solve the challenges of change on a daily basis. We may not like it, but it's a fundamental part of our work lives.
As some have pointed out, it's also partly an urban/rural split. Better jobs tend to be in more urban areas. Urban areas are always in flux. More change woven into our lives.
It could be better discernment skills. In college you're taught how to analyze and review facts, literature, what have you, make your case, and have your assumptions and thinking challenged.
Part of what has surprised me about Trump's huge support is that I've always thought anyone west of the Delaware less likely to take a wooden nickel. I've always believed them able to sniff out a phony -- and yet here they are, believing with all their heart that Trump is genuine.
Or perhaps their egos are so severely battered that they're easy prey for a master manipulator like him.
Whatever. I feel for them They're in for a rough time regardless of whether he wins or loses.
For starters, if you look at the red/blue map of the US, the red states are in areas not particularly known for their rates of change. They strongly want things to stay the same.
This flows into my next theory, which is that highly educated people are more prone to recognize that things change and adapt to it. We may all wish for the good old days (or believe they never existed), but -- a sub-theory - we tend to be in jobs where we're paid to solve the challenges of change on a daily basis. We may not like it, but it's a fundamental part of our work lives.
As some have pointed out, it's also partly an urban/rural split. Better jobs tend to be in more urban areas. Urban areas are always in flux. More change woven into our lives.
It could be better discernment skills. In college you're taught how to analyze and review facts, literature, what have you, make your case, and have your assumptions and thinking challenged.
Part of what has surprised me about Trump's huge support is that I've always thought anyone west of the Delaware less likely to take a wooden nickel. I've always believed them able to sniff out a phony -- and yet here they are, believing with all their heart that Trump is genuine.
Or perhaps their egos are so severely battered that they're easy prey for a master manipulator like him.
Whatever. I feel for them They're in for a rough time regardless of whether he wins or loses.
8
I've had a GED, a BS, an MS, and I'm working on my PhD. I've spent at 20 years on campus, counting part time at nights. I was a deplorable, and now I'm almost a doctor. Let me simplify this for you.
It's the racism. The GOP is still using the Southern Strategy, only they've expanded from blacks into Mexicans and Muslims. It's the sexism; all Bernie-or-Busters aren't Democrat mysogynists - but all Democrat mysogynists are Bernie-or-Busters. It's the homophobia. ...Importantly, these are all things that you cannot egregiously display on most campuses without considerable peer and eventually administrative censure. We won't tolerate it.
Throw in the fact that we can actually do math and read complicated political analyses, and there's a reason Republicans want to kill higher education. When you get one, you stop voting for them.
It's the racism. The GOP is still using the Southern Strategy, only they've expanded from blacks into Mexicans and Muslims. It's the sexism; all Bernie-or-Busters aren't Democrat mysogynists - but all Democrat mysogynists are Bernie-or-Busters. It's the homophobia. ...Importantly, these are all things that you cannot egregiously display on most campuses without considerable peer and eventually administrative censure. We won't tolerate it.
Throw in the fact that we can actually do math and read complicated political analyses, and there's a reason Republicans want to kill higher education. When you get one, you stop voting for them.
11
This is exactly what "polls" should be researching. It isn't at all about left, right or party. It is can a particular voter "allow" a woman, a black man, a Muslim or a gay be his/her leader?
The discussions and articles use every possible "work around" without ever checking to see if these unmentionable prejudices are at the root of the angry emotions in this election.
The discussions and articles use every possible "work around" without ever checking to see if these unmentionable prejudices are at the root of the angry emotions in this election.
2
As a #NeverTrump conservative who voted for Evan McMullin, I want to point out that this discussion really isn't Democrat vs. Republican but Trump vs. Anti-Trump. During the Republican primaries, voters without a college degree were much more likely to vote for Trump than voters with a college degree, like me. I would also guess that #NeverTrump conservatives are much more educated on average than Trump Republicans.
Whites with a college degree are less likely to support Trump than whites without a college degree because people with a college degree are more likely to use logic and reason in their thinking. Aaron from Phoenix already implied this in his comment when he said that college develops critical thinking. However, there are people with a degree who don’t use logic and reason and people without a degree who do.
Critical thinking, logic, and reason are all tied closely together. And there is absolutely no way that somebody who uses critical thinking, logic, and reason could possibly vote for Donald Trump! lol Support for Trump is based almost entirely on irrational emotion and passion! Conservatism has long been stereotyped as being based on reason, while liberalism has been stereotyped as being based on emotion. So it’s ironic that with Trump, most conservatives are doing what we have often accused liberals of doing! And Trump himself confirms this. When he responds to critics, he doesn’t do it in a thoughtful and intelligent way. He responds with ad hominems.
Whites with a college degree are less likely to support Trump than whites without a college degree because people with a college degree are more likely to use logic and reason in their thinking. Aaron from Phoenix already implied this in his comment when he said that college develops critical thinking. However, there are people with a degree who don’t use logic and reason and people without a degree who do.
Critical thinking, logic, and reason are all tied closely together. And there is absolutely no way that somebody who uses critical thinking, logic, and reason could possibly vote for Donald Trump! lol Support for Trump is based almost entirely on irrational emotion and passion! Conservatism has long been stereotyped as being based on reason, while liberalism has been stereotyped as being based on emotion. So it’s ironic that with Trump, most conservatives are doing what we have often accused liberals of doing! And Trump himself confirms this. When he responds to critics, he doesn’t do it in a thoughtful and intelligent way. He responds with ad hominems.
4
Voting is a practice in practicality not a doctrinal matter. Critical thinking tells us that a third party who is a symbolic vote in a close election exactly enables someone like Trump - who is a sexual predator - to have at political policy in the lives of other people's daughters- holding the door open for a bully isn't exactly a brave act.
2
Well, even though I hate Trump more than I hate Hillary, I'm still both #NeverTrump and #NeverHillary. However, even though the polls are tightening in Trump's direction, I still think Hillary will be elected. And I live in Texas, which will probably be carried by Trump anyway. If by some miracle, Hillary does carry Texas, it'll be because of greatly increased turnout by Hispanics--which has already been happening during early voting--and Trump dramatically underperforming Romney among white voters--white voters like me. So my vote for Evan McMullin helps Hillary a lot more than it helps Trump!
People who are educated believe that education is important, and are going to align themselves with the party that focuses on education, whether it's helping teachers earn a better salary, public school funding, or providing more opportunities for children to pursue higher education; some traditionally liberal cornerstones.
11
Some of the most important words I ever heard in my life were from a high school teacher, and these many decades later I can still quote them: "reading gives you an opportunity to look at different worlds from different people's perspective; there are millions of books because there are millions of people". What concerns me today, however, is the acceptance of "feelings" as a replacement for facts. You cannot bridge divides or entertain differing views, if there is no agreement of a factual foundation. Trump is the embodiment of this fear that keeps me up at night.
15
Its pretty simple. Any party or person who will believe untruths simply because a religious authority yells about them or their preferred politician says "I am right, there is no climate change" without any objective analysis or research is a rube, a dupe, an idiot. These are people who line up to be victimized by false businessmen or conmen.
9
People uncertain about their economic futures and reluctant to embrace social changes that originate far away are conservative. Not the Party. They have conservative personalities. They prefer yesterday to tomorrow. They often feel marginalized and mocked by elites, who seem to judge everything they do as politically incorrect.
One of the reasons a person may feel this way is having less education. That is not the most important reason, but it is the one highlighted in the title of the article. The title is not very probing.
Now, connecting the less-well educated conservatives to Donald Trump is easy. He wants to be president, and he is a chameleon who knows instinctively what he has to do to appeal to disaffected conservatives. He thrills them with the feeling of being right and understood, and excites in them the hope of finally prevailing. He says what they would like to have said, but were afraid.
At other times, Mr. Trump is a chameleon who appeals to nouveau rich people looking for a place to live, and at other times to investors who want to take a ride to the moon with a self-proclaimed billionaire.
Hey ... that could be your next column! "Why have rich white people been giving their money to Donald Trump for the past 30 years?" Since it is not a lack of education, perhaps it is their deep-seated insecurities that caused them to buy respectability and social acceptance from a man who has neither to sell.
One of the reasons a person may feel this way is having less education. That is not the most important reason, but it is the one highlighted in the title of the article. The title is not very probing.
Now, connecting the less-well educated conservatives to Donald Trump is easy. He wants to be president, and he is a chameleon who knows instinctively what he has to do to appeal to disaffected conservatives. He thrills them with the feeling of being right and understood, and excites in them the hope of finally prevailing. He says what they would like to have said, but were afraid.
At other times, Mr. Trump is a chameleon who appeals to nouveau rich people looking for a place to live, and at other times to investors who want to take a ride to the moon with a self-proclaimed billionaire.
Hey ... that could be your next column! "Why have rich white people been giving their money to Donald Trump for the past 30 years?" Since it is not a lack of education, perhaps it is their deep-seated insecurities that caused them to buy respectability and social acceptance from a man who has neither to sell.
3
This is the biggest lie among many spouted by conservatives about college:
L’Osservatore, put it, “the unquestioned control of collectivists and socialists on 95 percent of college campuses.”
The vast majority of professors, particularly in the humanities, and even if 'left liberal,' offer nuanced, opposing and varied perspectives on all issues.
I'm not sure too many economics or business professors have spent the past 40 years questioning the inhuman assumptions that underly their field. Yet I never hear complaints about this.
As others noted, facts tend to be liberal. We can't help that.
L’Osservatore, put it, “the unquestioned control of collectivists and socialists on 95 percent of college campuses.”
The vast majority of professors, particularly in the humanities, and even if 'left liberal,' offer nuanced, opposing and varied perspectives on all issues.
I'm not sure too many economics or business professors have spent the past 40 years questioning the inhuman assumptions that underly their field. Yet I never hear complaints about this.
As others noted, facts tend to be liberal. We can't help that.
6
I think it would be a mistake to say that it is only one factor that has driven the divide in education. Certainly, economics is a major contributing factor. The winners from free trade and globalization have been the educated elite while many rural blue-collar workers have been left behind. I think it's harder to maintain strictly ideological worldviews when you're constantly forced to interact with people of a different religion, race, or another country like you do in large cities or diverse states.
Age is obviously another important factor because many of the ideals that Trump is espousing are fundamentally different from millennial culture. Correspondingly, younger people are more likely to get a degree and pursue more education partly because that's what's required now to succeed.
There is probably also merit to the argument that the Republican Party not conservatives in general but Republicans have embraced a very anti-intellectual strain. It is difficult to support policies that you know have no basis in fact. the economy is improving, crime rate nationally is down to its lowest level since like 1970, global warming is real and pressing. Educated people know these things but all we're allowed to talk about is email, Benghazi and abortion because you know liberal bias.
Age is obviously another important factor because many of the ideals that Trump is espousing are fundamentally different from millennial culture. Correspondingly, younger people are more likely to get a degree and pursue more education partly because that's what's required now to succeed.
There is probably also merit to the argument that the Republican Party not conservatives in general but Republicans have embraced a very anti-intellectual strain. It is difficult to support policies that you know have no basis in fact. the economy is improving, crime rate nationally is down to its lowest level since like 1970, global warming is real and pressing. Educated people know these things but all we're allowed to talk about is email, Benghazi and abortion because you know liberal bias.
4
Are you serious, this is the article one week before the election. Could this possibly be a surprise to the NYT. I think i need to cancel my subscription, at least the Financial Times is covering real issues like Donald Trump's links to Russia.
1
I still can't understand why so many old people are Republican...They are the demographic with the greatest reliance on Social Welfare programs. They don't pay taxes on Social Security income, so why do they clamor for tax cutters?Cutting taxes doesn't mean property and sales tax people! In fact, this group would undoubtedly benefit from increased taxation of able bodied workers because their social benefits would improve...I just can't reconcile this contradiction! Someone help me out...
9
To begin with, you have to reconcile yourself with the fact that there are a great many "old people" who have managed to accrue a certain amount of wealth within the course of their lives -- Not all are without means in their decrepitude, as you seem to think.
And seeing as old money is often found by those who are fiscally conservative, it's no small wonder that they are often Republicans as well.
Hope this helps out a bit.
And seeing as old money is often found by those who are fiscally conservative, it's no small wonder that they are often Republicans as well.
Hope this helps out a bit.
1
I'd like to point out that the average Baby Boomer has saved $127K for retirement. that same individual says that they will need $36K/yr to maintain cost of living. This means that the average retiree has saved enough to support themselves for 4 years. People who have properly saved for retirement are the rare exception. The overwhelmingly vast majority are 100% unaffected by taxes and are 100% reliant on welfare programs to survive. That is fact.
4
You are incorrect regarding not paying taxes on Social Security.
It used to be possible to get a good return on CDs and other extremely secure vehicles, but that's no longer true. Taxes on different types of income are going to impact seniors more because it cuts into an income that's already too small...
It used to be possible to get a good return on CDs and other extremely secure vehicles, but that's no longer true. Taxes on different types of income are going to impact seniors more because it cuts into an income that's already too small...
1
Studies show that people will view scientific findings on whether they think the evidence is desirable from their political point of view. The study appeared in the November 2014 issue of Journal of Personality and Social Psychology. Using 3 issues, climate change, air pollution, and crime they wanted to see if a persons political beliefs determined their conclusions to the scientific facts. The answers were , yes it does.
Republicans reacted to the climate change by associating it with increased government regulations. If the proposed danger of Global Warming included more carbon tax (government intervention) they only had 22% agreement. If the statement was read to include expansion of the free market to control this 55% agreed. For Democrats there was no change in their position regardless of the proposed solution. If the solution effects the persons political beliefs they will reject the science. Democrats reacted against the evidence that showed home break ins may be lessened by looser gun laws.
Republicans reacted to the climate change by associating it with increased government regulations. If the proposed danger of Global Warming included more carbon tax (government intervention) they only had 22% agreement. If the statement was read to include expansion of the free market to control this 55% agreed. For Democrats there was no change in their position regardless of the proposed solution. If the solution effects the persons political beliefs they will reject the science. Democrats reacted against the evidence that showed home break ins may be lessened by looser gun laws.
2
Wow, didn't realize that only one-third of citizens had college degrees, thought it was higher. In any event, the division is strictly between low IQ and higher IQ. Aside from a few exceptions, most people with any intelligence at all go to college, those who are stupid don't. Those who are stupid listen to simplistic lies and con jobs from people like trump while those who have some smarts know a lot more about the scams because they know a lot more, period. Too bad we can't have elections where a BA is required to vote. Our country would be much better off then.
I've read about the erosion of white privilege as a reason for Trump's support. The long-held economic stratification by race is breaking down and there are some people who are really angry about that. I believe the same logic applies to male privilege. Hillary has been vilified since she was First Lady of Arkansas and didn't quit her job. As women have pursued education and been successful in the workplace, resentment of that success and the perception that it displaces some men, makes them furious.
11
Measures like income and education level seem like blunt instruments that may tell us less than we think. How much income is "less" and how much is "more"? The major one selects in college can also have a significant impact on income and world view. It would not be hard to believe that those who have MBAs are more likely Republicans and those who have MFAs are more likely Democrats. It would be interesting to see if there has been any research linking political party preference to a more nuanced measure of personality like Myers-Briggs.
Its no coincidence that Trump supporters are among the less educated, and heavily represented in the Confederate states as well as virtually all rural areas of the country. Trump receives similar support from rural western NY as he does in the rural areas of Maine, which mirror their counterparts in the South and midwest. In those areas of the country, life is quiet , simple and lack many job opportunities.
People who receive educations gravitate to cities where jobs are relatively plentiful. The educated benefit then, from both the informational perspective of their coursework, and the opportunities in the job market provided by the education. They enjoy a relatively better economic life than rural dwellers, and have developed mental abilities to reason through irrational ideas like the ones Trump proposes.
Rural dwellers and the less educated, consistent republican supporters, despite having virtually every social support which might benefit them attacked by the very politicians they put into office , now resentfully want to bring down everyone else. The republican 1% have been able to manipulate the less educated for years,especially by utilizing racial, and religious themes ,otherwise of no consequence to the economic survival of the current Trump supporters.
Its a question of emotion over rational thinking. In cutting their nose to spite their face, the Trump supporters have essentially thrown in the proverbial towel on their economic lives. The worst is yet to come.
People who receive educations gravitate to cities where jobs are relatively plentiful. The educated benefit then, from both the informational perspective of their coursework, and the opportunities in the job market provided by the education. They enjoy a relatively better economic life than rural dwellers, and have developed mental abilities to reason through irrational ideas like the ones Trump proposes.
Rural dwellers and the less educated, consistent republican supporters, despite having virtually every social support which might benefit them attacked by the very politicians they put into office , now resentfully want to bring down everyone else. The republican 1% have been able to manipulate the less educated for years,especially by utilizing racial, and religious themes ,otherwise of no consequence to the economic survival of the current Trump supporters.
Its a question of emotion over rational thinking. In cutting their nose to spite their face, the Trump supporters have essentially thrown in the proverbial towel on their economic lives. The worst is yet to come.
7
There is a considerable difference between an educated person and a person who has obtained a credential that makes wealth possible, and an even bigger difference between those two people and someone who is aware of little beyond what is available to the senses. An educated person is one who recognizes and respects the value both of the sciences and the humanities, the importance of inquiry no matter where it might lead, and above all, the goal of living humanely in the world. This is a self-evident conclusion; it is not the result of indoctrination or party affiliation, and it has no ulterior motive other than a faithfulness to epistemological honesty. The insidious “liberal bias” that conservatives and the self-interested see everywhere is nothing more than the threat they perceive in the concern for the future expressed by educated people who understand that sometimes the present is not tenable. Those who apprehend nothing but the personal in the present are ill-equipped to resist the person who promises to fix all that is wrong in exchange for power.
3
I am somewhat amazed by the facile answers offered by the self-proclaimed:
"Brighter/Better Educated/Progressive/Tolerant/Cosmopolitan".
Why would anyone vote for someone who calls you "deplorable" ?
The Elites may think their jobs are immune to being sent Overseas or
being replaced by Immigrants - Documented or Un-Documented but they
are fooling themselves.
The 1% have no loyalty to any Country and certainly have none to you.
If they decide to move your company/division Overseas and leave you behind
won't your self-satisfied smug selves be surprised.
Hillary is paid $ 225,000 for a speech by Wall Street.
What in the world did she tell them - 'How she turned $ 10,000 on
the Chicago Futures Market into $ 100,000 even though she knew/knows
nothing about the Stock Market' ?!?
Yet her supporters find nothing odd about Hillary making in one Speech
what people have to work 5/6/7/8 years to make.
The Answer to your question:
College Educated but not very wise, yet overpaid people vote for Hillary.
Overworked, wiser than given credit for, yet underpaid people vote for Trump.
Why ?
The 1% already ruined their lives - they know Hillary sides with the Rich.
The 'Upper Class' are blind to what the 1% will do to them in due time
and so delude themselves into thinking if they vote for Hillary it will guarantee
them Upper Class membership for life.
It does no such thing.
It only guarantees that Hillary will studiously guard the interest of the 1%
once she becomes President.
"Brighter/Better Educated/Progressive/Tolerant/Cosmopolitan".
Why would anyone vote for someone who calls you "deplorable" ?
The Elites may think their jobs are immune to being sent Overseas or
being replaced by Immigrants - Documented or Un-Documented but they
are fooling themselves.
The 1% have no loyalty to any Country and certainly have none to you.
If they decide to move your company/division Overseas and leave you behind
won't your self-satisfied smug selves be surprised.
Hillary is paid $ 225,000 for a speech by Wall Street.
What in the world did she tell them - 'How she turned $ 10,000 on
the Chicago Futures Market into $ 100,000 even though she knew/knows
nothing about the Stock Market' ?!?
Yet her supporters find nothing odd about Hillary making in one Speech
what people have to work 5/6/7/8 years to make.
The Answer to your question:
College Educated but not very wise, yet overpaid people vote for Hillary.
Overworked, wiser than given credit for, yet underpaid people vote for Trump.
Why ?
The 1% already ruined their lives - they know Hillary sides with the Rich.
The 'Upper Class' are blind to what the 1% will do to them in due time
and so delude themselves into thinking if they vote for Hillary it will guarantee
them Upper Class membership for life.
It does no such thing.
It only guarantees that Hillary will studiously guard the interest of the 1%
once she becomes President.
2
Would you not expect that Trump is a fully invested one percenter? Why will he make changes that would hurt his privilege?
1
Education is more a marker for class than intelligence since an academically superior kid from a poor family is less likely to get a degree than a mediocre student from a rich family.
Though the wealthy nation with the deepest and broadest child poverty, the U.S. trails in social programs for the alleviation of poverty and the bottom 40 per cent of the people constitute an underclass undergoing real suffering now and all the time.
They perceive society and the economy as rigged and see no way out of their suffering. They know the system is rigged and they want to destroy it. The polarization of society is also spatial as well as socio-economic so affluent white educated liberals haven't a clue about life at the bottom, and the Ivy League is almost bereft of students from the bottom 40 per cent.
What surprises me is that a Trump has not emerged earlier as a conduit of underclass anger. There are social democratic alternatives, of course, but when Bernie Sanders tried to suggest some his substance was largely ignored by establishment media.
So the only way for the underclass to escape its prison of privation is to wage war against the insufferable elites and smash the establishment. The defeat of Goldman Sachs Clinton would be salutary for the Dems.
Though the wealthy nation with the deepest and broadest child poverty, the U.S. trails in social programs for the alleviation of poverty and the bottom 40 per cent of the people constitute an underclass undergoing real suffering now and all the time.
They perceive society and the economy as rigged and see no way out of their suffering. They know the system is rigged and they want to destroy it. The polarization of society is also spatial as well as socio-economic so affluent white educated liberals haven't a clue about life at the bottom, and the Ivy League is almost bereft of students from the bottom 40 per cent.
What surprises me is that a Trump has not emerged earlier as a conduit of underclass anger. There are social democratic alternatives, of course, but when Bernie Sanders tried to suggest some his substance was largely ignored by establishment media.
So the only way for the underclass to escape its prison of privation is to wage war against the insufferable elites and smash the establishment. The defeat of Goldman Sachs Clinton would be salutary for the Dems.
3
Disclosure: I don't like today's Democratic Party and I loathe today's Republcan Party. I'm 80 years old.
When George W. Bush was re-elected, I had an epiphany -- a very unpleasant one. I realized that many, many American voters were insane. Insane in the sense that they did not take actions that offered the best assurance of attaining their goals. Now come the Trump stalwarts, many of whom are in that grouping because they (a) have finally realized that both parties have been swindling them for decades, and (b) have a candidate who expresses their resentment of the elites of all kinds. What they evidently do not realize is that Trump is the biggest swindler of all -- he is not going to "bring back coal" or seal the borders or... you name it.
So imho these fellow citizens of mine are not only insane but also stupid. Sorry to be so un-P.C. but just take a look at it. Whatever else they may be, anybody who votes for Trump thinking he will bring back some kind of "good old days" is stupid. Sorry...
When George W. Bush was re-elected, I had an epiphany -- a very unpleasant one. I realized that many, many American voters were insane. Insane in the sense that they did not take actions that offered the best assurance of attaining their goals. Now come the Trump stalwarts, many of whom are in that grouping because they (a) have finally realized that both parties have been swindling them for decades, and (b) have a candidate who expresses their resentment of the elites of all kinds. What they evidently do not realize is that Trump is the biggest swindler of all -- he is not going to "bring back coal" or seal the borders or... you name it.
So imho these fellow citizens of mine are not only insane but also stupid. Sorry to be so un-P.C. but just take a look at it. Whatever else they may be, anybody who votes for Trump thinking he will bring back some kind of "good old days" is stupid. Sorry...
9
Congratulations on your longevity and thank you for your insight.
2
College educated people are completely elitist. They are not "smarter" than other people whose parents didnt pay for a 4 year adult daycare. They look down at the "uneducated" as rural rubes.
The reason they vote for globalization and multiculturalism is because they are insulated from the effects of thousands of unskilled workers lowering wages and competing for jobs.
The educated, with their jobs that are mostly performed on computers and can be done anywhere in the world, do not fear unskilled immigrants. In fact, they love them. I mean, who wouldnt want the people putting up the drywall and mowing the lawn to be cheaper. They can assuage their liberal guilt, and they dont experience any negative consequences. They also tend to marry, live near, and socialise with other educated elities, so the echo chamber reinforces their feeling if righteousness.
I went to MIT, but my wife is a master electrician who never went to college. I see the problems that unfettered globalism and a focus on college as the only way to prosperity. You go to any job site, and the jobs that require licenses (plumber, electrician, ect) are good paying. However, the jobs that dont (drywall, carpentry, ect) pay less than $10 an hour, and are filled with non-skilled immigrants. Drywalling uses to pay $20- $30 and hour, but you ask for that now and they will laugh at you and take their van down to the home depot parking lot.
The uneducated are not rubes, and shouldnt be treated as such
The reason they vote for globalization and multiculturalism is because they are insulated from the effects of thousands of unskilled workers lowering wages and competing for jobs.
The educated, with their jobs that are mostly performed on computers and can be done anywhere in the world, do not fear unskilled immigrants. In fact, they love them. I mean, who wouldnt want the people putting up the drywall and mowing the lawn to be cheaper. They can assuage their liberal guilt, and they dont experience any negative consequences. They also tend to marry, live near, and socialise with other educated elities, so the echo chamber reinforces their feeling if righteousness.
I went to MIT, but my wife is a master electrician who never went to college. I see the problems that unfettered globalism and a focus on college as the only way to prosperity. You go to any job site, and the jobs that require licenses (plumber, electrician, ect) are good paying. However, the jobs that dont (drywall, carpentry, ect) pay less than $10 an hour, and are filled with non-skilled immigrants. Drywalling uses to pay $20- $30 and hour, but you ask for that now and they will laugh at you and take their van down to the home depot parking lot.
The uneducated are not rubes, and shouldnt be treated as such
4
"College educated people are completely elitist" .... Really?
You might this hard to believe, but in this day and age a college education is necessary for a higher-paying job in most places.
Another thing.
People who work long and hard to get a college degree shouldn't be denigrated any more than those who choose not to -- and that's something that anyone who went to MIT should know.
You might this hard to believe, but in this day and age a college education is necessary for a higher-paying job in most places.
Another thing.
People who work long and hard to get a college degree shouldn't be denigrated any more than those who choose not to -- and that's something that anyone who went to MIT should know.
10
You need to join a Union. I spackle/sand/prime & paint for good wages, health ins., a pension AND a 401k. God bless the Union.
3
Gorgian vs. Socratic culture. In the non-academic environment, especially among men, people prize strength and bullishness; they take pride in tenacity, being hard-headed, and sticking to one's guns. In the academic context, such strategies do not work. The gatekeepers (teachers) use various methods (primarily questions, but also hypotheses, imagined scenarios, analogies, and sometimes just mockery) to induce students to find arguments for their positions, principles for their beliefs, justifications for their attitudes.
It is not, therefore, a matter of intelligence but of training. The academy trains us to use the forces of rational argument; wider society habituates us to use the forces of demagogic argument. We've all seen arguments between very bookish types and very townie types - they never come to any form of understanding because they are working on two completely different levels. The same is true of the debates between Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Trump, but in this case the differences are so extreme that *almost* all of America can see them.
It is not, therefore, a matter of intelligence but of training. The academy trains us to use the forces of rational argument; wider society habituates us to use the forces of demagogic argument. We've all seen arguments between very bookish types and very townie types - they never come to any form of understanding because they are working on two completely different levels. The same is true of the debates between Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Trump, but in this case the differences are so extreme that *almost* all of America can see them.
9
What about the money culture? The extremes of money spent on a campaign?
What of the business vs the politician cultures?
What of the business vs the politician cultures?
1
Curious people educate themselves in many ways, books, school, travel, friendships, vounteering: opening their horizons to diversity, looking beyond their backyards. The curious seek out and embrace the unknown and the wonders of the wider world. College-educated or not, truly curious people are open to and understand the fact-based realities of important issues like climate change, discrimination, sex education, sexual assault, misogyny, homophobia, poverty. They vote accordingly.
8
I don't think it's any one aspect, it's more like all of the above. The reasons are as individual as individuals are different. As for this corn-fed girl of the heartland, the difference between me and so many of my Trump supporting cohort (I'm 73yo) is that I got away from white bread Indiana, and spent nearly all my working years in the Chicago and Portland Oregon areas. My exposure to diverse populations changed how I viewed and experienced life. I think it also has helped me that I'm a voracious reader--NYT, WaPo, the Atlantic, etc., and of historical & political non-fiction.
8
I would say that too many Americans are undereducated. This is the fault of the education system, which is so American centric. And even witting this, there is far too little learning about the way things actually work here. No person should leave school without knowing something of their political system, and yet I've read how many people don't even know the three branches of government. I also fault the media, who have done an excellent job of not only teaching Americans a whole lot about nothing important, but a way to be rude to each other. I give Nickelodeon as an example, which teaches children some lessons in life, whilst at the same time being really impolite and rude to. We sow what we reap.
5
Agree with most of your points, but I think you meant to say "we reap what we sow" ?
1
You are so right. Our basic educational system is a disgrace. No where do they teach anything about money, real estate or sex. The real stuff of life.
2
Seems like anyone with half an education would be embarrassed to be associated with Republicans given their "knowledge" that the earth is 5,000 years old, Global Warming is a hoax, evolution doesn't exist, violence can be solved with more guns, voodoo economic theories, etc. etc. And that's the Republican mainstream, not counting the fringe.
10
You're missing the largest underlying structural factor there is: different constructive-developmental levels of voters, what sometimes are called stages of consciousness or cognitive maturity.
Cognitive "tribalists" are conformist to in-groups, more adherent to orthodox religion, and generally more ethnocentric in their reasoning; oh, and their reasoning is also only concretely-rational, meaning they trust visceral witnessing more than the large-scale abstract reasoning that they're often not capable of.
Stages of development are the hidden story of this election, and completely missed by the media so far. But we all better wise up, there's more in store as globalization continues to lay bare the "great divide" between globalists and tribalists.
Cognitive "tribalists" are conformist to in-groups, more adherent to orthodox religion, and generally more ethnocentric in their reasoning; oh, and their reasoning is also only concretely-rational, meaning they trust visceral witnessing more than the large-scale abstract reasoning that they're often not capable of.
Stages of development are the hidden story of this election, and completely missed by the media so far. But we all better wise up, there's more in store as globalization continues to lay bare the "great divide" between globalists and tribalists.
3
These comments sicken me. As an MIT educated person, I am more educated than almost anyone in the world.
However, that doesnt mean that I am smarter, or better, or more able to understanf complex and nuaced thought. My wife is an uneducated master electrician, and I have learned more from her than I ever did at MIT.
College is just a priviledged mechanism to create elitist who believe they are better than people who didnt go to adult day care and get a piece of paper certifying their status at the end of it.
The uneducated have skills and smarts that a coddled little white college boy would never have. We educated elitists need to step off our ivory tower and stop talking down to people who didnt go to university. We need to stop creating a world where college is the only path to not living off food stamps. We need to stop considering the non-educated as rubes not worthy of our trust and attention.
Elitist commenters recently have been making fun of the grammer and syntax of uneducated commenters. That is wrong. You dont need an 800 on you reading SAT in order to be taken seriously. We dont need to disregard a person who didnt use perfect sentence structure.
However, that doesnt mean that I am smarter, or better, or more able to understanf complex and nuaced thought. My wife is an uneducated master electrician, and I have learned more from her than I ever did at MIT.
College is just a priviledged mechanism to create elitist who believe they are better than people who didnt go to adult day care and get a piece of paper certifying their status at the end of it.
The uneducated have skills and smarts that a coddled little white college boy would never have. We educated elitists need to step off our ivory tower and stop talking down to people who didnt go to university. We need to stop creating a world where college is the only path to not living off food stamps. We need to stop considering the non-educated as rubes not worthy of our trust and attention.
Elitist commenters recently have been making fun of the grammer and syntax of uneducated commenters. That is wrong. You dont need an 800 on you reading SAT in order to be taken seriously. We dont need to disregard a person who didnt use perfect sentence structure.
3
Skills can be learned anywhere. Including college.
1
More educated people also tend to be less religious, and much less likely to be part of the Religious Right who are supporting Trump in order to fill Supreme Court vacancies with justices who oppose women's reproductive rights and marriage equality. (My apologies to the many Christians who ARE appalled by Trump - this is on the average.)
More educated people are more likely to be feminists or at least not anti-feminist. They are therefore more likely to be appalled by Trump's treatment of women. Please don't underestimate the role misogyny plays in leading some people to mistrust Hillary and be completely comfortable with Trump.
More educated people are more likely to be feminists or at least not anti-feminist. They are therefore more likely to be appalled by Trump's treatment of women. Please don't underestimate the role misogyny plays in leading some people to mistrust Hillary and be completely comfortable with Trump.
17
Trump almost never seems to say WHY he thinks his ideas are true--something college students supposedly are still required to do.
15
It's objective vs subjective, or more directly, fact vs belief. The less education one has the more likely he or she will take offense when a cold hard fact interferes with a belief system. People who choose their beliefs over cold hard facts are much more likely to view Trump as refreshing. He, too refuses to allow cold hard facts to interfere with his mindset.
7
Of course, there are many elephants in the room with such a discussion, but one of the largest also, and invariably, comes down to race.
Not so much because of education (or the lack thereof), but because Donald Trump has made it such a lightning rod topic in his presidential campaign, that it can't be ignored.
That said. At this point, regardless of all last-minute attempts to make it appear otherwise, it's fairly safe to say that across the board, Donald Trump does not have the Black vote -- this would be as much the case with college-educated Blacks, as with those without a higher education.
And unfortunately for Mr. Trump, the same can be said about every other race, ethnicity, religion, or gender that he has maligned over the course of his campaign.
Not so much because of education (or the lack thereof), but because Donald Trump has made it such a lightning rod topic in his presidential campaign, that it can't be ignored.
That said. At this point, regardless of all last-minute attempts to make it appear otherwise, it's fairly safe to say that across the board, Donald Trump does not have the Black vote -- this would be as much the case with college-educated Blacks, as with those without a higher education.
And unfortunately for Mr. Trump, the same can be said about every other race, ethnicity, religion, or gender that he has maligned over the course of his campaign.
7
OMG. I can't believe you brought race into this. Higher education is a right AND a privilege.
Formal education occurs in secondary schools and colleges but the mindset, tools and ethics that you bring to that education comes from the home before it begins.
For most good and bad, you have to be carefully taught.
For most good and bad, you have to be carefully taught.
8
Trump has done nothing for anyone other than himself. One does not need much education to understand this truth.
10
I'm afraid that the reasons here cannot be separated from the question of why the college-educated (and particularly the professoriate) are so "liberal?"
The observation is not new: George Wallace spoke about "Pointy headed liberals who cannot park a bicycle straight." William Safire coined "Nattering Nabobs of Negativism" for Spiro Agnew.
The answer to any college faculty person is plain, and particularly sharp to me, having experienced the great shift in this matter among engineers, in my lifetime: conservatism has become irrational. Today to be a conservative one must believe things that are simply, provably wrong. That wasn't so evidently true when I was young -- the majority of the buzz-cut white-shirt and skinny-black-tie pocket-protector guys who trained me as an aeronautical engineer were Republicans.
Today you are really hard-pressed to find any faculty in engineering who are Republicans ... except perhaps for petroleum-related fields.
Bobby Jindal said: "party of stupid;" unfortunately that was shorthand for "party of willfully, truculently, ignorant anti-intellectual group-think."
The observation is not new: George Wallace spoke about "Pointy headed liberals who cannot park a bicycle straight." William Safire coined "Nattering Nabobs of Negativism" for Spiro Agnew.
The answer to any college faculty person is plain, and particularly sharp to me, having experienced the great shift in this matter among engineers, in my lifetime: conservatism has become irrational. Today to be a conservative one must believe things that are simply, provably wrong. That wasn't so evidently true when I was young -- the majority of the buzz-cut white-shirt and skinny-black-tie pocket-protector guys who trained me as an aeronautical engineer were Republicans.
Today you are really hard-pressed to find any faculty in engineering who are Republicans ... except perhaps for petroleum-related fields.
Bobby Jindal said: "party of stupid;" unfortunately that was shorthand for "party of willfully, truculently, ignorant anti-intellectual group-think."
35
Another aspect is the affect of talk radio, whose growth has paralleled the trend towards GOP extremism. Once, political views were shaped by revered columnists and intelligent, dignified news anchors like Brinkley and Cronkite, who were guided by standards of truth and decency regardless of what side of the aisle they were on. The advent of talk radio changed the rules of the game. Its audience is retired folks and stay-at-home moms, taxi and bus drivers, or store owners/employees who can listen to them for hours at a time, and who are primarily interested in venting against those in power for everything they don't like, rather than seeking solutions. Since the hosts only represent themselves, and their product is judged purely by ratings, accuracy and decency are no longer important. Moreover, painting everything black and white, creating scapegoats, ridiculing intellectuals, and spreading anger, hatred and divisiveness, is the easiest route to large audiences. This created superstars like Grant, Limbaugh, Hannity, O'Reilly et al., whose anti-government venom and factually-challenged extremist views caused GOP politicians to fear moderation and compromise, lest they be blacklisted. By peddling subtle or blatant racism and painting all Democrats as treacherous villains, they also eliminated most blacks and hispanics from their ranks. This audience also overwhelmingly supports the extremist politicians whom they helped create, with Donald Trump their new hero.
55
Another reason as the less educated have little experience with critical thinking, and conservative talk radio plays into that mindset. It's amazing how many times Trump says, "Believe me." No Mr. Trump, I don't, and there's too many fact checkers who don't either.
In addition, the less educated have likely spent less time reading history and political science to realize what a threat to our democracy and the world a demagogue like Trump is. But then maybe all they care about is making refrigerators in the US and making sure they can still mine coal for another generation or two until their coastal communities are inundated with sea water.
In addition, the less educated have likely spent less time reading history and political science to realize what a threat to our democracy and the world a demagogue like Trump is. But then maybe all they care about is making refrigerators in the US and making sure they can still mine coal for another generation or two until their coastal communities are inundated with sea water.
7
I think we cannot overstate the importance of this. My father-in-law told me this past summer that he gets all of his news from country radio. It isn't entirely true - my mother-in-law watches the news shows so I'm sure he sees some of that, and they take the local paper (which, having read it, isn't much better than a country radio news show), but still. Kind of boggling. And he of course, with this very limited information (which he even realizes is very limited!) has very strong opinions. Thankfully, he still views Trump as too indecent of a human being to vote for him. It's nice to see that some people's values are sincere.
4
Part of Trump's message is that the college educated (labeled "elites") think they are better than those who are not, but they're just condescending jerks. Therefore when "they" say not to vote for him, it proves that "you" should.
How do you expect the voting demographics to turn out?
How do you expect the voting demographics to turn out?
8
He is also supporting the canard that you can't trust smart people.
1
"Make America great again" alone would probably turn away most educated people, because that's not even the name of our country. "America" is a continent, not a country. It is the name of the giant landmass that is home to Canada, the U.S., Mexico, and then all of the South American countries. Our country's name is: The United States -- those united states are IN America, but they do not encompass ALL of America. Meaning that a Canadian, a Mexican, and anyone from Central or South America could validly call themselves "American" if they were talking about the continent. This is the same way that someone from Japan, China, or India could be called "Asian" -- they are from the continent of Asia.
There are plenty of other things that Trump has gotten wrong along the way, but many of them require an investment in time to look up or the education to already know. All the educated people I know are invested in their education -- they enjoy growing their knowledge base and would consider looking things up important. The people I know who aren't educated usually believe what they hear from other people and don't make a point of looking things up. Such people may never know how wrong some of Trump's claims really are. Couple that with the fact that there are a lot of gray areas in this election and people are really being pushed to the limits in terms of not thinking in black and white (something a lot of people do, unfortunately), and what you end up with is a huge divide.
There are plenty of other things that Trump has gotten wrong along the way, but many of them require an investment in time to look up or the education to already know. All the educated people I know are invested in their education -- they enjoy growing their knowledge base and would consider looking things up important. The people I know who aren't educated usually believe what they hear from other people and don't make a point of looking things up. Such people may never know how wrong some of Trump's claims really are. Couple that with the fact that there are a lot of gray areas in this election and people are really being pushed to the limits in terms of not thinking in black and white (something a lot of people do, unfortunately), and what you end up with is a huge divide.
11
There is another word for some of those with less education.. taxpayers. They graduate from High School and get a job. Used to be a good paying one maybe a bit of overtime. Some of their friends went off to college, paid their own way, got a small loan or Mom and Dad helped out. Now they see their "peers" staying in college for 5-8 years, borrowing untold amounts for tuition and demanding the loans be forgiven. They follow the huge rallies on campuses, the main theme... free tuition. All the while, they are paying the taxes that subsidies the universities and the student loans.
5
And how is Mr. Trump going to fix this dilemma?
2
Lots of people go through college without loans. They work their way through or their parents or grandparents pay. My grandmother paid for my first college degree. I paid for the next three and most of the cost of the graduate degree of one of my brothers. I have also paid most for my daughters and my granddaughter tuition, room and board. My husbands tuition was paid for by going into the military right after high school. And, unlike Trump, we have paid and paid lots of taxes over the years as well as donating to church, charity etc. Non college educated people may pay taxes or may not have high enough income. It all depends on the individual's situation.
2
And why are these taxpayers lining up to support a conman who brags about never paying taxes? They really make no sense, no way to explain dumb.
1
You could stop at "these days the educated tend to be liberal". That's true, because kids are brainwashed from elementary all the way through higher education. It wasn't like that when I went to college. Granted that the college environment had always been liberal, but never before had it been this bad and intolerant of different view points. My 9 year old son just told me that it's racist to name the White House "White" House. Wake up folks, before it's too late, or the US could be a communist power while Russia and China not. Trump is the needed antidose, no matter how distasteful, to this madness. I rest my case.
4
I guarantee your son was not told by a college professor about naming the White House. (And if he got the idea from an elementary teacher, remember that in some states elementary teachers are not highly educated.)
More likely, your son has heard talk in the media about racism and is wondering what is and is not racist.
More likely, your son has heard talk in the media about racism and is wondering what is and is not racist.
3
Did you ask your son where he heard that it was racist?...because I saw that ridiculous anti-liberal statement on a facebook meme from a Trump-supporting site!
1
It may very well be that he got it from the internet. But on an earlier occasion, my daughter had come home saying that her teacher told them that Trump is a bully. There is no doubt in my mind our entire education system has veered more and more to the left over the years.
The Trump supporters I know are well educated. But I will observe that they are still people who make poor choices, and always blame others for the poor outcomes. For them he's proof they're right.
17
It's a constant source of amazement that so many people can vote against their own self-interest.
1
If an educational split is replacing the culture wars, this is good. That we can address, with every conversation and bubble of ignorance burst.
The cultural wars were (are) insurmountable; heels dig in before the first fresh sentence of new information is transmitted, minds closed to the possibility of new evidence, anger rising and stalemate.
The cultural wars were (are) insurmountable; heels dig in before the first fresh sentence of new information is transmitted, minds closed to the possibility of new evidence, anger rising and stalemate.
2
On thing that often gets overlooked is the emasculation of men, of all races, but specifically white men in this case. With blue collar jobs on the decline, white men without a degree do not have as many options as they once did when blue collar jobs were plentiful. Because of their inability to be a stereotypical man/provider/head of household, they feel emasculated. What results is the idolatry of a misogynist candidate like Trump, who is basically promising these men their manhood back. Other races have dealt with this kind of disparity and lack of opportunity in the past and present - but this is relatively new to white male "uneducated" voters - who perhaps haven't had the secondary education that promotes critical thinking and connection-making in the same way as primary education, and therefore see things in black and white terms rather than the nuanced reality that actually exists.
33
Perhaps it's biological? It seems to me that the desire to acquire an education is related to your desire to explore the world of ideas, the physical world, and to learn from people from other cultures.
Is it possible that some people are inherently more open to exploring,
and others are simply less flexible?
Is it possible that some people are inherently more open to exploring,
and others are simply less flexible?
10
A possible neuro-bioological basis to political orientation has been looked at a bit.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/conservative-and-...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/conservative-and-...
I grew up in a household that was moderately Republican. However, as a voracious reader of books and newspapers, I quickly began to form opinions of my own. I'm an international relations major. I've been fortunate enough to study abroad. I've been exposed to people of all different faiths, ethnicities, and political leanings.
I don't think education -- at least in the black-and-white IQ sense -- matters. But worldview does. Understanding issues. Consuming factual information. Having experiences that are out of your norm. Seeing things. How would I go about telling the proprietors of my small Moroccan riad, the ones who served me nightly mint tea and laughed at my touristy photos, that I despise their culture and their way of life?
It is easy to indiscriminately spew hatred. It is harder to say it when you must first look someone in the eyes.
I don't think education -- at least in the black-and-white IQ sense -- matters. But worldview does. Understanding issues. Consuming factual information. Having experiences that are out of your norm. Seeing things. How would I go about telling the proprietors of my small Moroccan riad, the ones who served me nightly mint tea and laughed at my touristy photos, that I despise their culture and their way of life?
It is easy to indiscriminately spew hatred. It is harder to say it when you must first look someone in the eyes.
29
Education matter less than personality. My father was far from stupid and got good grades when he took some business courses for a promotion, but he was very rigid in his approach to everything. If he came back from lunch to find 5 telephone messages on his desk, he methodically answered them from the top down, and if the first one required asking someone to find some records, he refused to go on to the second message until those records had been found.
He would work until he was sick, trying to finish a repair job, rather than take a break to cool off and eat something, saying, "I need to get this finished."
He approached political problems the same way--a certain candidate was correct and never mind what was going to happen down the way or that one solution would harm someone else. He simply never learned to look at anything from other than one viewpoint.
He would work until he was sick, trying to finish a repair job, rather than take a break to cool off and eat something, saying, "I need to get this finished."
He approached political problems the same way--a certain candidate was correct and never mind what was going to happen down the way or that one solution would harm someone else. He simply never learned to look at anything from other than one viewpoint.
I'm originally from GA. It's about race and the percieved transfer of power from working class whites to people of color. This is what American politics have been about since 1964. http://www.vox.com/2016/9/19/12933072/far-right-white-riot-trump-brexit
15
Aren't black uneducate people voting massively for democrats? Weren't these white uneducated voters referred to as blue collar workers when they were voting democrat?
1
Guess what??... Not only are Black uneducated people voting massively for Democrats -- Educated Black people are voting massively for Democrats.
Know why?
Listen to what Donald Trump is saying....the rest you can Google.
Know why?
Listen to what Donald Trump is saying....the rest you can Google.
28
My grandparents didn't go to college but always wanted that for my parents and my parents expected me to go to college. My grandfather worked in factories. My grandparents choose for my father to be in "English only" classes because the bilingual education was subpar. My grandfather also noted, if you use your brain, you can work a hell of a lot longer than wearing down your knees and back.
11
I think educated people are the ones who listen to NPR or watch PBS and for the most part get unbiased reporting and analysis of the two candidates. Less educated people tend to watch FOX news where its very slanted and/or made up news.
11
The less educated have also had less experience or training in evaluating sources. Until recently, critical evaluation was never taught in most el-hi schools; you didn't learn it until you got to college.
So the less educated honestly don't understand how two reporters can see a story in different ways or realize that a reporter who until a week ago worked for a particular candidate may not be the most unbiased source.
So the less educated honestly don't understand how two reporters can see a story in different ways or realize that a reporter who until a week ago worked for a particular candidate may not be the most unbiased source.
1
I think there's a strong motivation for evangelical and other conservative religious groups to support Trump because of fears relating to Supreme Court nominations. As a sidebar to the election itself, I think that's also playing out pretty clearly as Senators are just now talking about how the Supreme Court is 'functioning just fine' with only eight judges. In other words, support Trump, hope he gets elected, and wait for more conservative judicial picks; or if Clinton is elected, stonewall indefinitely against her more liberal Supreme Court justice selections.
Just look at how the narrative has changed - it's gone from "let the voters decide," right after Scalia died, now to "we don't need any more justices," because it looks more likely that Clinton will win.
Just look at how the narrative has changed - it's gone from "let the voters decide," right after Scalia died, now to "we don't need any more justices," because it looks more likely that Clinton will win.
18
If we are honest, political choices are NOT about issues and facts.
They have been, and always will be about emotion, and what you are emotionally attached to, and what you emotionally reject.
Most people who are educated leave home and are exposed to IDEALS and become emotionally attached to them. 'Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness', 'freedom and justice for all', 'that each man should be judged by the content of his character and not by the color of his skin", "this fundamental truth, that all men are created equal" and find these ideals have merit and to be worth defending.
Most people who do not pursue higher education do not venture as far from home and are exposed to the LIFE OF THEIR COMMUNITY in a profound way. Family, friends, work ethic, occupation, trade, religious life, community organizations and home life are explored and found to be wothwhile and worth defending.
Your political choices don't boil down to how the candidate stands on the issues -- they boil down to who you think will defend the things you are emotionally invested in. Nobody believes that candidates will ACTUALLY do what they say, so facts matter little. It has always been a character judgement.
Liberal vs conservative may boil down to something very simple -- how far away from your parents physically and occupationally were you from ages 19-25? Far away -- liberal. Close -- conservative. And since higher education usually involves moving and NOT working, it produces liberals
They have been, and always will be about emotion, and what you are emotionally attached to, and what you emotionally reject.
Most people who are educated leave home and are exposed to IDEALS and become emotionally attached to them. 'Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness', 'freedom and justice for all', 'that each man should be judged by the content of his character and not by the color of his skin", "this fundamental truth, that all men are created equal" and find these ideals have merit and to be worth defending.
Most people who do not pursue higher education do not venture as far from home and are exposed to the LIFE OF THEIR COMMUNITY in a profound way. Family, friends, work ethic, occupation, trade, religious life, community organizations and home life are explored and found to be wothwhile and worth defending.
Your political choices don't boil down to how the candidate stands on the issues -- they boil down to who you think will defend the things you are emotionally invested in. Nobody believes that candidates will ACTUALLY do what they say, so facts matter little. It has always been a character judgement.
Liberal vs conservative may boil down to something very simple -- how far away from your parents physically and occupationally were you from ages 19-25? Far away -- liberal. Close -- conservative. And since higher education usually involves moving and NOT working, it produces liberals
14
In addition, many of the less education really have no idea how narrow their frame of reference is. I knew people who were shocked to learn that there were different translation of the Bible and apparently assumed that Christ and Moses spoke Elizabethan English. Obviously, they also had no idea of the politics involved in the translation of the King James Bible, let alone the differing views of Jefferson and Hamilton or the way Trump's and Clinton's experiences shaped their views.
With little exposure to foreign languages they don't understand how different translations of a document can both be accurate. With less facility with English syntax or figurative language, they can't understand hyperbole or metaphor.
They lack any knowledge of what intellectual work entails. My brother, a high-school dropout who read poorly, once protested that a friend of his shouldn't have had to split the profits of his auto repair business in his divorce, "since he did all the work and his wife only kept the books."
With little exposure to foreign languages they don't understand how different translations of a document can both be accurate. With less facility with English syntax or figurative language, they can't understand hyperbole or metaphor.
They lack any knowledge of what intellectual work entails. My brother, a high-school dropout who read poorly, once protested that a friend of his shouldn't have had to split the profits of his auto repair business in his divorce, "since he did all the work and his wife only kept the books."
2
I'm 29, college educated, and make over $100k a year. I am voting for Trump because of the eye opening collusion revealed by recent Wikileaks of the Democrat party. I am educated enough to understand that unbridled single party government is not good for the long run.
4
Are you also educated enough to understand Wikileaks isn't exactly a reliable source, and Julian Assange has a highly publicized personal vendetta againt Clinton??? --- which makes its releases hardly objective.
Another thing.
Voting for Trump isn't indicative of a good college education.
Another thing.
Voting for Trump isn't indicative of a good college education.
20
Have you ever wondered why WikiLeaks is only leaking emails harmful to the Democrats?
Also you may want to consider what would happen to your life if every email and phone call you and your friends ever made were placed in the public eye.
IBM used to have a great motto - THINK.
Also you may want to consider what would happen to your life if every email and phone call you and your friends ever made were placed in the public eye.
IBM used to have a great motto - THINK.
25
And "I am educated enough" to believe that his comment reads like a plant from the Trump campaign, as there is nothing in the WikiLeaks/DNC leaks to contradict what we have always known about insider discussions in politics, government, industry, the workplace and even within families. Then again, maybe I should cut the commenter some slack, considering the fact that back when I was 29, I too lacked that knowledge.
21
Being “liberal” is about flexible openness, which is more tolerant, more oriented to the needs and interests of others. Credentials are not about social class; they’re about competence to understand in a given area. But special competence imparts general competences that are employed in special ways. Greater competence to understand is better suited to understanding the complexities of social life (and politics—and election). Citizens should have policity prefences that are rational. Education improves appreciation of what is truly rational, distinct from rationalistic. Giving GOOD reasons for action is better recognized by better ability to understand.
12
Has there been any effort to correlate geographic mobility (the ability/willingness to move from place to place) among whites with college education and Trump support?
Those who are less mobile are presumably less likely to go to college, which typically requires moving away from your childhood home for several years. Likewise, workers who are more mobile are more able to take advantage of shifts in the economy that occur because of international trade or advancements in technology.
Those who lack mobility are at the mercy of whatever economic fortunes the town they are currently in experiences. Folks in that position know their only hope for a good job is if the local industry does well. Any politician who promises to prioritize that industry's well being will be greeted with open arms.
For example, one of the major recurring themes that you hear in places like rural Appalachia, is that they want more coal jobs. That's presumably because they are unable / unwilling to move to find work and they absolutely NEED the local coal mine to do well. Trump promises to make it so and they follow his lead.
By contrast, someone who has demonstrated mobility by going to college, is not likely to be dependent on the well being of one particular town or industry. They know that as long as the whole economy does well, there will be jobs somewhere. For them, Trump's volatility outweighs his call to "Make coal great again" or the like.
Those who are less mobile are presumably less likely to go to college, which typically requires moving away from your childhood home for several years. Likewise, workers who are more mobile are more able to take advantage of shifts in the economy that occur because of international trade or advancements in technology.
Those who lack mobility are at the mercy of whatever economic fortunes the town they are currently in experiences. Folks in that position know their only hope for a good job is if the local industry does well. Any politician who promises to prioritize that industry's well being will be greeted with open arms.
For example, one of the major recurring themes that you hear in places like rural Appalachia, is that they want more coal jobs. That's presumably because they are unable / unwilling to move to find work and they absolutely NEED the local coal mine to do well. Trump promises to make it so and they follow his lead.
By contrast, someone who has demonstrated mobility by going to college, is not likely to be dependent on the well being of one particular town or industry. They know that as long as the whole economy does well, there will be jobs somewhere. For them, Trump's volatility outweighs his call to "Make coal great again" or the like.
14
Don't be too hard on those in Appalachia for not moving around to find jobs. Back in the 1970s or 1980s, when the mines in the West were folding, a school board in a mining town in a Western state decided it would have to start offering college prep courses so its young people had a chance to get into college. Until then, the assumption would be that most of the students would either be miners or wives of miners.
It's hard to move to a new place to find a job if you know nothing about life outside your town and your school has not prepared you to do anything else.
During WWII, my father trained and supervised defense workers at the air base near us. Many of them were from Appalachia--companies literally ran buses into the hills on Friday, promised the workers a specific salary, and returned on Monday with a load of workers. My father said they were honest, hard workers, but in many cases he first had to show them how to use flush toilets, as they had never in their lives seen indoor plumbing. Imagine the courage it took for them to come to a place with wide streets, indoor plumbing, traffic lights, and a culture that expected you to be able to use those things.
It's hard to move to a new place to find a job if you know nothing about life outside your town and your school has not prepared you to do anything else.
During WWII, my father trained and supervised defense workers at the air base near us. Many of them were from Appalachia--companies literally ran buses into the hills on Friday, promised the workers a specific salary, and returned on Monday with a load of workers. My father said they were honest, hard workers, but in many cases he first had to show them how to use flush toilets, as they had never in their lives seen indoor plumbing. Imagine the courage it took for them to come to a place with wide streets, indoor plumbing, traffic lights, and a culture that expected you to be able to use those things.
1
The biggest change that occurs when a person obtains education is the realization that one's own instincts ought to be examined and evaluated, rather than simply applied uncritically. An educated person tends to look past the gut-level appeal of an idea and control for his or her fallibilities -- bias, faulty logic, incomplete data, and so forth.
People who lack education (the exposure to well-argued ideas in literature as well as to people who argue well in person) tend to think of their own instincts as being the last word -- it's "common sense" -- and use their powers of reason simply to justify those instincts.
Unfortunately the current media culture, with its multiplicity of echo-chambers, provides lots of ammunition for people who only want to defend their instinctual views rather than examine them honestly.
People who lack education (the exposure to well-argued ideas in literature as well as to people who argue well in person) tend to think of their own instincts as being the last word -- it's "common sense" -- and use their powers of reason simply to justify those instincts.
Unfortunately the current media culture, with its multiplicity of echo-chambers, provides lots of ammunition for people who only want to defend their instinctual views rather than examine them honestly.
17
Civility could also play a role. People with college degrees, professionals or individuals who work for large corporations are expected to comport themselves in a certain manner just like they are expected to dress in a certain manner. We are expected to treat people with a certain amount of dignity and respect diversity so we don't alienate our co-workers and our clients/customers. Collegiality is important so we can accomplish tasks together. Donald Trump appears to be the polar opposite of this creed. His 'tell it like it is' tweets or rants would not be tolerated in most professional settings. His denigration of whole groups of people, like women and minorities, just invites lawsuits. Crassness is not a virtue in the workplace. It is destructive. Who would want to work with this man, let alone work for him? I think this is one of the key reasons why college educated people find Trump repugnant.
57
Thank you for articulating this. I have been thinking the same thing for some time now. Having worked in corporate America for decades, I understand why we all do not and should not "tell it like it is." Sometimes I wish we could be more direct, but the reasons you describe make for a better workplace environment -- both more respectful and productive. I find Trump horribly crass, and I don't think we would be a "great" country by legitimizing and embracing that type of behavior.
19
Doesn't Trump have the lead among college-educated White men?
It's closer but I think Clinton has a small lead among college educated white males.
1
I think "men" is the key word here.
Indeed James Bunty is right, and it is the first time in a very long time that any Democrat has done that; and of course HRC is female.
Romney had the more typical 12 - 20% margin in college-educated white males .. .though the Republican advantage in this group has been dropping with time.
This is a measure of how utterly disastrous a Republican candidate Trump is. I don't think any Democratic operative expects a Democrat to do so well among white college-educated males in the next election -- presuming the Republicans run a better candidate than Trump.
Romney had the more typical 12 - 20% margin in college-educated white males .. .though the Republican advantage in this group has been dropping with time.
This is a measure of how utterly disastrous a Republican candidate Trump is. I don't think any Democratic operative expects a Democrat to do so well among white college-educated males in the next election -- presuming the Republicans run a better candidate than Trump.
1
Why does education translate to less support for Trump??--That's essentially a no-brainer.
But it has less to do with one's being more left, or liberal, than with the fact that an education usually allows one the ability to form a rational thought process that leads to presenting a cogent argument.
The reason why Trump appeals more to those with less education may lie in the fact that he has sculpted his platform around a sensationalist jargon that wouldn't pass muster to those who know better.
This is most certainly true of those ethnic & racial groups whom he has disparaged within the course of his presidential campaign -- either with and without a college degree.
And while Trump's White supporters have by-and-large been able to get by without the benefit of a higher education, they are now realizing that's no longer good enough -- which is why more non-Whites are achieving advanced degrees....It's also part of the double-standard they've known all along.
But it has less to do with one's being more left, or liberal, than with the fact that an education usually allows one the ability to form a rational thought process that leads to presenting a cogent argument.
The reason why Trump appeals more to those with less education may lie in the fact that he has sculpted his platform around a sensationalist jargon that wouldn't pass muster to those who know better.
This is most certainly true of those ethnic & racial groups whom he has disparaged within the course of his presidential campaign -- either with and without a college degree.
And while Trump's White supporters have by-and-large been able to get by without the benefit of a higher education, they are now realizing that's no longer good enough -- which is why more non-Whites are achieving advanced degrees....It's also part of the double-standard they've known all along.
13
It is also a very rural/urban divide.
4
On climate change, evolution, crime rates, tax cuts, immigration, government spending, education, social programs, the list goes on.... it seems reality does indeed have a liberal bias.
21
Easier to turn that question around: "Why do the uneducated support Trump?"
I support "thesis #2" in the article -- "No, It's About Credentials and Social Class." Here are my words on that:
Lack of education puts people in a predicament that generally prevents them from gaining "things." (There are some exceptions.) This causes a lot of "envious resentment" towards those who do have those things..
That is, the uneducated would like to have things (envy), and resent others for having them. (Some call that "jealousy," but it's really envy and resentment.)
Trump "speaks" to that frustration of the uneducated voter. He's challenging all the "elites," and the "intelligentsia," and "the Establishment" in this campaign. These are people who have those things that the uneducated would like to have -- power, money, prestige, happiness, etc.
Ergo...they support him. They would like: 1). for those educated people to not have those things, and 2). they would like to have them, instead.
Or, at a minimum...the uneducated would at least like to have some kind of "sharing" of things. Getting their "piece of the pie," so to speak. Not at all an unreasonable perspective.
And,whoever wins this elections would do well to work hard at achieving such "fairness" in our society. Else -- "pitchforks and broomsticks," eventually...at the ballot box, and maybe even physically.
I support "thesis #2" in the article -- "No, It's About Credentials and Social Class." Here are my words on that:
Lack of education puts people in a predicament that generally prevents them from gaining "things." (There are some exceptions.) This causes a lot of "envious resentment" towards those who do have those things..
That is, the uneducated would like to have things (envy), and resent others for having them. (Some call that "jealousy," but it's really envy and resentment.)
Trump "speaks" to that frustration of the uneducated voter. He's challenging all the "elites," and the "intelligentsia," and "the Establishment" in this campaign. These are people who have those things that the uneducated would like to have -- power, money, prestige, happiness, etc.
Ergo...they support him. They would like: 1). for those educated people to not have those things, and 2). they would like to have them, instead.
Or, at a minimum...the uneducated would at least like to have some kind of "sharing" of things. Getting their "piece of the pie," so to speak. Not at all an unreasonable perspective.
And,whoever wins this elections would do well to work hard at achieving such "fairness" in our society. Else -- "pitchforks and broomsticks," eventually...at the ballot box, and maybe even physically.
5
Umm, this is exactly what Democrats do with blacks and other minorities.
3
Not exactly. And just for the record -- Democrats have a much better record with Blacks and "Minorities" than the Republicans do.
5
Could it be an "aspirational" vote. They want to be like him, live as he does, and express their id as he does?
When Trump says that climate change is a hoax, as he has more than once, that is direct insult to all scientists. More importantly, it demonstrates his ignorance and his utter disregard for science. Above all, it unquestionably demonstrates he is completely unqualified to be President.
Its hardly surprising that a scientist, such as myself, or anyone else who knows something of science will not be voting for him.
Its hardly surprising that a scientist, such as myself, or anyone else who knows something of science will not be voting for him.
25
I think working class people, fly over state folks, are invisible or risible to the educated class. But I find people in the hinterlands are often more honest, even keeled, and less anxious. I think they do feel under attack — by politicians whose kids all go to Princeton, and who wear rolexes and vacation in Nantucket.
The old time Democrats — the farmers, the workers — sort of gone. And for some reason, that this hurts people in the hinterlands — who are lied to repeatedly about their futures — is seen as an annoyance to the “educated class.”
I do worry about a Trump presidency, but I get that regular folks feel under siege. And I tell them (as a highly educated, wealthy NYer myself, with very liberal friends): you are right to feel how you feel, and never let my kind shame you out of your feelings.
The old time Democrats — the farmers, the workers — sort of gone. And for some reason, that this hurts people in the hinterlands — who are lied to repeatedly about their futures — is seen as an annoyance to the “educated class.”
I do worry about a Trump presidency, but I get that regular folks feel under siege. And I tell them (as a highly educated, wealthy NYer myself, with very liberal friends): you are right to feel how you feel, and never let my kind shame you out of your feelings.
5
I was rewatching Ivan Reitman's movie Dave this weekend, and it surprisingly gave me a closer glimpse at what Trump supporters are talking about when they say they want an outsider who takes a simpler look at the issues of the day. Alas, the real world is not a movie where a temp agent and his accountant buddy can balance the budget overnight on a whim.
Trump's oversimplification of issues is appealing to people who never took the time to understand. The economy, scientific polling, global warming, and everything else that is supposedly fake actually take time to understand. Trump gives his supporters a shortcut to reach a decision on issues without understanding a thing about them. This rationale is always accompanied by blame, usually towards people who aren't working class males, giving a target for their anger and frustration, making it "Us against them."
Ignorance is no longer bliss, it's blind rage.
Trump's oversimplification of issues is appealing to people who never took the time to understand. The economy, scientific polling, global warming, and everything else that is supposedly fake actually take time to understand. Trump gives his supporters a shortcut to reach a decision on issues without understanding a thing about them. This rationale is always accompanied by blame, usually towards people who aren't working class males, giving a target for their anger and frustration, making it "Us against them."
Ignorance is no longer bliss, it's blind rage.
48
There is a widely-reported correlation between higher levels of education and economic success. So while it is not so much the case that Trump supporters are all poor (they're not), it seems likely to me that better-off people with higher levels of education have been less influenced by the incessant trash-talking of America and specifically the economy by the GOP. Remember, this is not a new development. The GOP has been down on America since before Obama took office. All news has been bad news to them. But if you have a job, or better still, a career, and if you have confidence in the future, why would you listen to the incessant drumbeat of negativity from the GOP?
Trump has taken that theme and amplified it, going straight to racist, xenophobic, misogynist and homophobic themes. If you are surrounded by successful and positive people of different racial and ethnic backgrounds, men and women, gay and straight, cis and trans, who in many cases were helped by their relatively higher levels of education, you are probably less easily persuaded by the Trump Make America Hate Again machine. Or even offended by it.
And last, I think better educated people are offended by the naked anti-intellectualism of the GOP in general and Trump in specific. If you believe in the value of intellectual pursuit as a means to develop knowledge and ascertain facts to help the world make better decisions, it's pretty hard to support anti-rationality as a positive trait in people or governments.
Trump has taken that theme and amplified it, going straight to racist, xenophobic, misogynist and homophobic themes. If you are surrounded by successful and positive people of different racial and ethnic backgrounds, men and women, gay and straight, cis and trans, who in many cases were helped by their relatively higher levels of education, you are probably less easily persuaded by the Trump Make America Hate Again machine. Or even offended by it.
And last, I think better educated people are offended by the naked anti-intellectualism of the GOP in general and Trump in specific. If you believe in the value of intellectual pursuit as a means to develop knowledge and ascertain facts to help the world make better decisions, it's pretty hard to support anti-rationality as a positive trait in people or governments.
17
There are a large multiplicity of factors either attracting people to Trump or, among those who are lukewarm to him, preventing them from still voting for Hillary. A few:
1.They are white supremacists or moderate racists.
2.They are easily conned and not heavy into reasoning or data.
3.They care more about vague stuff about classified emails than real stuff about groping women because they secretly wish they could get away with what he has gotten away with as they all have cheerleader and model fantasies.
4.They don't know very much economics and to be quite fair the last 30 years of economic momentum has been very unfavorable to them with much of the cause structural rather than individual. So they buy his anti-trade message just like Bernie supporters did, even though both groups are completely wrong on this.
5. They are somewhere between hard-core sexists and mild misogynists who can't see a woman as CIC regardless of how much experience she has.
There are a lot more that won't fit in this box.
My main point is that college tends be a cure for every single one of these traits which I view as flaws.
1.They are white supremacists or moderate racists.
2.They are easily conned and not heavy into reasoning or data.
3.They care more about vague stuff about classified emails than real stuff about groping women because they secretly wish they could get away with what he has gotten away with as they all have cheerleader and model fantasies.
4.They don't know very much economics and to be quite fair the last 30 years of economic momentum has been very unfavorable to them with much of the cause structural rather than individual. So they buy his anti-trade message just like Bernie supporters did, even though both groups are completely wrong on this.
5. They are somewhere between hard-core sexists and mild misogynists who can't see a woman as CIC regardless of how much experience she has.
There are a lot more that won't fit in this box.
My main point is that college tends be a cure for every single one of these traits which I view as flaws.
7
Quite possibly the most insulting response I have seen on the comment page. Typical to label people and place them into categories that fit your beliefs. You are no better than the people you wanted to classify. How about this add a category of people who felt ripped off the ACA and broken promises of lower the national debt.
7
If the label fits, wear it.
1
In addition to outright racists and sexist, also people who are apologists for these groups. Or at the very least those who are not directly and negatively affected by either racism or sexist. I don't see how this is such a controversial comment.
2
C-SPAN should do a call-in for whites with college degrees telling who their preferred candidate is. Of course allow them to expound as to why they hold their position(s).
3
I think part of the divide lies in exposure, which education can provide. However, my personal experience is that it wasn't the classroom activities, that provided the most exposure. When I think of my mindset as a white 18 year old in suburban western PA, I cringe. My exposure to black people was minimal (2400 students in my high school, 10 black kids), I had never (knowingly) met a gay person, and had never heard anyone speak anything other than English. This ignorance did, sadly, breed contempt. Then I went to college, a small liberal arts school in Ohio. Sure, I learned some critical thinking, but I also lived among people from all backgrounds, with a vast array of life experiences and opinions. The collective knowledge provided by this exposure to many different views was, in and of itself, an education. As my ignorance was resolved, my contempt dissolved. So, yes, without my education I might still be closed minded, and possibly a bigot and a Trump supporter. But it wasn't intelligence, or degree, that opened my eyes. It was showing up and (eventually) allowing myself to see people for who they really are, and listening to (and sorting out) what they have to say.
36
Too keep this short, the education divide is a surrogate for many other lifestyle and economic factors. Urbanization, economic opportunity, access to information, exposure to other cultures or people and different ways of thinking.
In the Brexit vote in the UK the withdrawal from the EU carried in rural, small town, and economically depressed Britain. Remain carried in greater London, Manchester, and big college towns, etc. Northern Ireland and Scotland voted to remain in the EU. They feel ethnically separate from being 'English.' I lived in Ireland. The Irish have many life style referendums. The results always show an urban vs. rural divide - while it might be education or income the clear urban vs. rural split easiest to spot.
We know that the states with the highest incomes track closely with better education and are 'blue;' and usually highly urban. States with the lowest incomes have the poorest educations and track 'red.' This urban vs rural and education gap is worldwide. Putin is not a popular in Russia's big cities as in rural & small towns. Educated people have a future of opportunity - uneducated people often fear change and the future. Some of Nate Cohen's data confirm this split.
In the Brexit vote in the UK the withdrawal from the EU carried in rural, small town, and economically depressed Britain. Remain carried in greater London, Manchester, and big college towns, etc. Northern Ireland and Scotland voted to remain in the EU. They feel ethnically separate from being 'English.' I lived in Ireland. The Irish have many life style referendums. The results always show an urban vs. rural divide - while it might be education or income the clear urban vs. rural split easiest to spot.
We know that the states with the highest incomes track closely with better education and are 'blue;' and usually highly urban. States with the lowest incomes have the poorest educations and track 'red.' This urban vs rural and education gap is worldwide. Putin is not a popular in Russia's big cities as in rural & small towns. Educated people have a future of opportunity - uneducated people often fear change and the future. Some of Nate Cohen's data confirm this split.
10
Would think those who are college educated are also more likely to have moved and/or lived more than 50 miles from their hometowns. Isn't that another predictor of Trump supporters? Those who never left their hometowns? Also, are college educated more likely to hold passports and travel abroad, affording them the opportunity to experience different cultures, people, (often better infrastructure!) and what it's like to be an outsider when visiting an unfamiliar land?
6
There is a vast difference between education and having a degree, between being able to evaluate and buying into propaganda. Some of today's university curricula are unworthy of the name. We once said it was "Basketweaving 101," but then discovered much easier ways to turn out students who know nothing of history, literature, science, math, statistics, or the arts, but know everything about how to claim victimhood.
Plenty of Trump voters are well-educated, both in the sense of advanced degrees and in that magic element, ability to evaluate. They don't read the NYTimes, however, because it has become a westernized cross between China Central and Pravda.
Plenty of Trump voters are well-educated, both in the sense of advanced degrees and in that magic element, ability to evaluate. They don't read the NYTimes, however, because it has become a westernized cross between China Central and Pravda.
1
One factor not mentioned here is the impact of over-the-top celebrity culture - where people are revered for simply being well known, no matter what they have done (or not done) to achieve this status. Think: the Kardashians, or for those of us old enough to remember, those "famous" people who, back in the day, played on "Hollywood Squares." As a kid I knew they were celebrities, but had no idea why - aside from their appearance on a game show. It was a special kind of tautology.
In my experience, less educated people tend to take dubiously famous people, along with all the inevitable glitz and hype, much more more seriously. Of course, this is not universal. And more educated people can surely fall for it all too. But a lot of what drives Trump's popularity is his longtime status as a celebrity. He brings a carefully cultivated persona as a rich power broker. It is a fiction, of course. A character. I see that the less-educated people in my own family are utterly fascinated by the spectacle of such a famous TV personality running for president. It seems to have overridden any good sense they possess. It is like they are drunk on it.
In my experience, less educated people tend to take dubiously famous people, along with all the inevitable glitz and hype, much more more seriously. Of course, this is not universal. And more educated people can surely fall for it all too. But a lot of what drives Trump's popularity is his longtime status as a celebrity. He brings a carefully cultivated persona as a rich power broker. It is a fiction, of course. A character. I see that the less-educated people in my own family are utterly fascinated by the spectacle of such a famous TV personality running for president. It seems to have overridden any good sense they possess. It is like they are drunk on it.
9
All of the above should be a choice if this article were a multiple choice exam. My aversion to Mr. Trump has to do with both his character and the content of his speech. He insults and castigates opponents and makes grandiose unsubstantiated claims about himself and his capacity to lead. Recognition of a fat-head requires no education, simply insight into how speech reflects character. So he lost me well before I heard him tell a story about a child who became autistic following a vaccination. Recognition of that fallacy would require education, yet the anti-vaxxer stand is so false and destructive as to represent gratuitous ignorance. It happens with other obvious factual issues, such as his birtherism and climate change denial. I think Mr. Trump takes a stand purposely in opposition to fact, because I cannot point to anything he claims as fact-based. If education is a quest for factual knowledge, Mr. Trump rejects it. What is so jarring about this election is not Mr. Trump, but the 60 million or so people who are about to vote for him. Voting for him is not a rejection of Ms. Clinton, it is a rejection of the individual right and responsibility to recognize character and fact.
16
So you have the Right claiming that the Left is out to get them. I suppose that has a sense of realism to it. I mean who wouldn't want to eradicate intolerance, bigotry and exclusivism. Seems like a no-brainer, but obviously it is not. With the exception of Native-Americans every individual in the U.S. has benefitted from immigration.
Continue to teach your children but stay away from the curriculum that DJT's basket (however small or large) encourages because without their combined intelligence, who will question those that seemingly place themselves above all others.
Now you can see why when a dictator or junta comes into power that the first set of imprisoned or executed voices belong to the academics and media. The more educated voices there are the harder it is for a demagogue to eradicate them.
Continue to teach your children but stay away from the curriculum that DJT's basket (however small or large) encourages because without their combined intelligence, who will question those that seemingly place themselves above all others.
Now you can see why when a dictator or junta comes into power that the first set of imprisoned or executed voices belong to the academics and media. The more educated voices there are the harder it is for a demagogue to eradicate them.
4
As someone who is educated it is very obvious while reading an article whether it's an opinion piece or a fact-based article just explaining the event. It seems a lot of the uneducated cannot make that distinction. I've been exposed to Rush Limbaugh via my family for the past 25 years and regularly pay attention to Breitbart/Drudge, etc. Most of the stuff coming through those channels uses very manipulative language to phrase events in terms of a right wing world view. (If you are liberal and aren't aware of the language these people use to describe you and me, visit the Drudge site and read the comments on any article. It's scary how they view us.) On the other hand, I grew up in Missouri and have always been "liberal" although I did not know the label or the political party, etc. While I am not currently religious I once was a true believer Catholic, I actually believed the words of Jesus and the Bible like "love your neighbor", "thou shalt not steal, lie, covet they neighbor's wife", etc. And I still believe that stuff but while growing up in Missouri everybody was Christian but the majority of people threw out those ideas as soon as it was convenient for them. They supported war and violence, lying, etc. It drove me nuts!
7
So do education and age act independently? Are old college-educated voters likely to be Trump supporters, along with young high-school-educated voters?
1
Yet, Libertarian atheists have the highest group IQ.
Who are they voting for this year?
Who are they voting for this year?
Have you got any proof of that? -- Please state your sources.
6
One of many links one can find with Google:
http://reason.com/archives/2014/06/13/are-conservatives-dumber-than-libe...
http://reason.com/archives/2014/06/13/are-conservatives-dumber-than-libe...
Interesting article. Thanks for the tip -- but it mentioned nothing about atheists.
In any case, it's hardly surprising that Liberals are percieived to be more "intelligent" than conservative Republicans, as it requires having a mind that's open to aquiring knowlwedge.
Another thing.
You do know there's a difference bewteen being liberal and being a Libertarian, don't you?
In any case, it's hardly surprising that Liberals are percieived to be more "intelligent" than conservative Republicans, as it requires having a mind that's open to aquiring knowlwedge.
Another thing.
You do know there's a difference bewteen being liberal and being a Libertarian, don't you?
2
One difference I’ve noted between college-educated and non-college-educated is that the former tend to believe that the individual is the basic unit of society whereas the latter tend to believe that the family is the basic unit of society.
1
Interesting reply. I have worked/lived 12 yrs in México, a country which prides itself on family and indeed families dominate many decisions. With recent great advances in education, female independence, gay rights - there is a huge emergence of more individualistic thinking, though the family groups at least in urban areas remain strong. And new groups become family. Before 2007 when there was migration from MX to USA I saw many cases in which the desire to leave the bounds of family expectation was the motivating factor among young Mexicans to migrate. Its very constricting to be limited in small towns to the expectations of families who know little about the modern world.
The problem I see is that less-educated white males do not want to change and learn new skills to keep up with the rapidly changing world economy. They insist that the economy stay the same and that their old jobs will magically reappear. That's why Trump's bait-and-switch strategy is working so well with them.
10
You have to understand that these people have little experience in learning new skills and are genuinely afraid to try something new, assuming they will fail. My father insisted that he "was too old" to learn all sorts of things and would go hungry rather than risk asking a waiter what was in an unfamiliar dish or how to eat a lobster.
I have a little understanding of this, despite my college education, I had two years of high school math with a teacher who told us if we didn't understand his first explanation he didn't have time to bother going over it again, and after two years of this, I not only lacked the background to do higher math but assumed I really was too stupid to learn it. I carefully picked a college and a major that allowed me to avoid taking any math. Recently, a retired teacher from my high school told me the other math teachers had urged the administration to get rid of this teacher; his refusal to try a different explanation to a problem was due to HIS lack of understanding.)
I have a little understanding of this, despite my college education, I had two years of high school math with a teacher who told us if we didn't understand his first explanation he didn't have time to bother going over it again, and after two years of this, I not only lacked the background to do higher math but assumed I really was too stupid to learn it. I carefully picked a college and a major that allowed me to avoid taking any math. Recently, a retired teacher from my high school told me the other math teachers had urged the administration to get rid of this teacher; his refusal to try a different explanation to a problem was due to HIS lack of understanding.)
1
You did miss one telling statistic on educational attainment, namely the percentage of women college graduates has doubled, the number of women with post graduate degrees has tripled and the number of african american women college graduates has tripled since 1980. No wonder the Republican party has lost the educated women's vote.
19
Men also suffered greater unemployment over the past decade.
3
There is also the question of self-respect, not so much professed as felt. Trump says: "Stop voting for puppets in the pocket of puppet masters -- Vote for a puppet master"… and all the sycophants and ring kissers came running to the sound of their master's call.
Like obsequious Renfields serving Dracula.
Like obsequious Renfields serving Dracula.
5
His campaign is specifically geared to influencing the uneducated.
Build walls, eliminate taxes, get rid of regulations, call opponents crooked, threaten to put opponents in jail - anyone with a nominal knowledge of the constitution, the rule of law, the environment and american history knows all those ideas are downright silly and maybe dangerous..
Build walls, eliminate taxes, get rid of regulations, call opponents crooked, threaten to put opponents in jail - anyone with a nominal knowledge of the constitution, the rule of law, the environment and american history knows all those ideas are downright silly and maybe dangerous..
28
"MAYBE dangerous..?" Let's please drop the qualifier and look reality directly in the face.
Respectfully,
Respectfully,
1
I've always felt that Republican policy solutions have a knee-jerk appeal, while Democratic policies have a much more nuanced, long-term appeal. Donald Trump's solution to ISIS -- be tough, bomb them to oblivion -- sounds simple and easy. Deficit? Cut government spending, like you'd cut your household budget to pay off your credit cards. Abortion? Killing babies is wrong; no need to think about why the need might be there or the consequences to society of not allowing it. Climate change? Hey, we just had a string of nice, 75-degree days in October and I don't want to lose my job. On the other hand, the more educated you are, the less you have to deal with the short-term effects of war, globalization, immigration, etc. It's easy to take the long view and be tolerant of immigrants when you're a white, white-collar worker living comfortably in a neighborhood full of other people exactly like you in D.C. or Cambridge or Seattle or Boulder.
8
I've read so many of these comments...and I have to ask.. What ever happened to balance? Education is: cultivating hopeful environments and relationships for learning • respect and wisdom • acting so all may share in life.
It amazes me how many "educated" people; those who have spent 4-7 years acquire a degree, then re-starting a new course of study, because they got bored with the 1st one...racking up a monumental debt....Or those who have so much book knowledge but not enough practical knowledge to cross the street.
Don't get me wrong. Education is a wonderful thing. Knowledge comes in many ways. If you look back into America's history, you will find people like Abraham Lincoln who studied by lamplight to learn everything he could. His wisdom led him to become one of our great presidents!
We need people who learn by observing their world around them; by working with their hands, their heads, and their hearts. People who are tolerant to relate to those less fortunate than they are. Lets face it, there will always be some among us who are less fortunate, not because they are stupid. We are all vulnerable to life's misfortunes. It's what we make of them that counts.
We were each one created with certain skills, and talents; by applying our inherent values to every advantage we have available; then add the multitude of brilliant scholars who have shared their knowledge; we have together as a people contributed to the richness of our world.
It amazes me how many "educated" people; those who have spent 4-7 years acquire a degree, then re-starting a new course of study, because they got bored with the 1st one...racking up a monumental debt....Or those who have so much book knowledge but not enough practical knowledge to cross the street.
Don't get me wrong. Education is a wonderful thing. Knowledge comes in many ways. If you look back into America's history, you will find people like Abraham Lincoln who studied by lamplight to learn everything he could. His wisdom led him to become one of our great presidents!
We need people who learn by observing their world around them; by working with their hands, their heads, and their hearts. People who are tolerant to relate to those less fortunate than they are. Lets face it, there will always be some among us who are less fortunate, not because they are stupid. We are all vulnerable to life's misfortunes. It's what we make of them that counts.
We were each one created with certain skills, and talents; by applying our inherent values to every advantage we have available; then add the multitude of brilliant scholars who have shared their knowledge; we have together as a people contributed to the richness of our world.
1
You did not mention white resentment at being the victims of affirmative action, a policy that hits the least-educated hardest.
5
Just to be clear. White resentment isn't aimed at Affirmative Action, it's aimed at those whom Affirmative Action is supposed to help -- namely, non-Whites.
11
Those who resent affirmative action don't realize how much they have benefitted from affirmative action. I remember looking through college catalogues in the 1960s and learning that the boys in my high school class would be admitted to colleges in larger numbers and with lower SAT scores. (I don't know if the lower scores were the result of higher numbers of males or if more males qualified because of lower standards for admission.) The colleges at the time favored a gender imbalance on the assumption that women would either get married or contribute to their husbands' alma maters (almi mater? I never took Latin), while the male students would become successful businessmen who would contribute to their colleges. And this doesn't even take into account the fact that in those days a male athlete could get a full scholarship and often money under the table while a talented female athlete was lucky to have a team to play on or that many law and medical schools had strict quotas.
But the fact remains, a system had been created that made it easier for men to get a college education.
But the fact remains, a system had been created that made it easier for men to get a college education.
2
I grew up in a Republican family. When I started grad school. I realized life isn't as easy for all people as my Republican upbringing taught. With more education, I began to question because I was exposed to differing viewpoints and listened to them to make my own choices. I now read Time magazine, the NY Times and my local newspaper. I watch MSNBC and the national news on CBS and ABC. I feel this helps me study and measure my opinions. SOME voters with less education choose to believe a point of view that AGREES with their beliefs instead of questioning. SOME want an authoritarian figure to tell them what to believe or that what they do believe is right. I don't include all voters with less education but when I watch a Trump rally or listen to a Trump voter talk, I'm amazed by how little they know and how much they believe what FOX and the Right tell them to believe. I mean, really, birtherism? Climate change as a plot by China to destroy us? Obama (and Hillary) taking our guns away? Death panels?
34
On the other hand, our family of graduates of multiple graduate schools are an anomaly in our deeply red state out here in rural America. It is very interesting to see a child go away to college and the subsequent reunions with family. The child usually is exposed to a much broader set of viewpoints and questioning the steady diet of conservative pablum they received for indoctrination since birth. The one redeeming feature of living here is everyone checks their political ideology and political party at the door when a civic event is being held. The fall banquets, suppers and community volunteer events are devoid of political discussion.
11
I think it's relevant that conservatives are by and large more religious, certainly more fundamentally religious, than liberals. But religious SCHOLARS are not so religious. They know that historians of the time (say the time of Christ) did not report any of the supposed happenings and miracles that are believed by the religious masses. They know that the Bible has been changed dramatically by human editors since the time that it was originally written (because they can and do read the earliest versions). They are generally not believers. The true believers are not interested in scholarship. This is completely different from other fields. Richard Dawkins is a scholar of the highest order in the field of evolution. He is also among the staunchest "believers" of the fact and theory of evolution (it is a different kind of belief, based on scholarship and an open mind). But in religion, the open mind and love of scholarship leads one away from the path of the true believer. The desire to cling to tradition (and, I would say, superstition) leads these conservatives to be less likely to pursue education and scholarship.
21
I recently read in the Times, maybe, about 40 percent of Americans do not know that there are three branches of US government, and do not understand the balance of powers that go with the branches of government. How can Americans who do not understand the basic principles of our government make any kind of coherent decisions regarding candidates for any office. Basic government organization is usually taught in middle school, so this is not a college-educated vs. non college educated. The US needs to buff up its K-12 education so that no one graduates from high school without the basic knowledge of our government structure.
80
You said it, Denise. There seem to be members of Congress who don't understand the Constitution.
6
Most modern conservative ideas don't actually solve the problems they are purported to address, and conservatives are not interested in exploring new ways to solve problems. The current GOP platform is 90% about returning to an idealized version of the past. Anyone who doesn't look like them is automatically dismissed.
More education generally means more openness to new ideas and different kinds of people. It also gives greater ability to cut through rhetoric to substance.
More education generally means more openness to new ideas and different kinds of people. It also gives greater ability to cut through rhetoric to substance.
24
Almost by definition, an education teaches of the complexities of systems and that simple solutions to complex problems are nearly always inadequate. Trump offers only the simplest proposals, devoid of details: "it'll be great, fantastic, phenomenal, the best". Few educated people buy into this simplicity.
86
don't forget he uses the word "disaster" quite a bit too
3
Look at this as a demographic problem. In our system of government, electability has always trumped intelligence with regard to candidate selection in both parties. And since at least WWII, and maybe before that, Republicanism has been a minority (mainly corporate) pursuit, and to remain competitive the Party has looked to shore up its sagging demographics by embracing some rather outsized personalities as their standard-bearers (Goldwater, Reagan, Bush2, and now Trump). The main risk of this strategy is that you often end up with some marginally qualified candidates at the top of the ticket, which can become a real problem if you don’t have competent Congressional delegations to carry more of the load for their lightweight figureheads at the top. And I can’t remember a less qualified Republican caucus coinciding with a less qualified Presidential candidate in my lifetime.
13
"electability has always trumped intelligence with regard to candidate selection in both parties."
What?! Can you think of a candidate in American politics less electable than a black man named Barak Obama? And lets don't forget about the dismal education of Jimmy Carter or that of Al Gore.
What?! Can you think of a candidate in American politics less electable than a black man named Barak Obama? And lets don't forget about the dismal education of Jimmy Carter or that of Al Gore.
From my personal observations on family members, the Trump supporters seem to be content with what they have- never wanted to move away from home for college, never wanted to go above and beyond to achieve more---never wanted to Progress. The Clinton/Democratic supporters were the ones who wanted something better, different, more, i.e. wanted to Progress. It might be a difference between being content with a conservative, status quo situation (although with Trump back to a previous status quo!) vs. a progressive yearning for more. Not so much the "intelligence" gained with a degree, but the personality type who wants a degree.
17
Trump is the male Palin--tabloid superstars. Some say Trump is a "Penthouse"superstar; others say he is "penthouse trash"--a play on "trailer-park trash"--the intellectually and ethically degenerate live on all "floors" of life.
Both disregard the standards of cognitive discourse--truth--or at least rational--evidence based--belief. Their forte is marketing--the "science" --i.e. techniques--of separating fools from their money or votes.
Those most vulnerable to marketing ploys are those least versed in techniques of critical thinking, including self-critical thinking--standards of proof (rational belief), definitional care, logical implication vs innuendo and dialectical discourse--idea--logical interpretation/critique--better idea--on and on.
These are the standards of science--and all academia--as well as the courts--institutions depending on due process and due diligence before cutting off discourse with a vote.
Religions are the paradigm "faith based" institutions; 'faith" is dogmatic belief regardless of logic--definition argument and evidence. They assume infallibility-- beyond criticism--an absurd standard of proof for humans.
But most religious fanatics can't state the tenets of their religions--it's mere brand loyalty. So too the "party faithful" cannot state the tenets of their candidates. "Believe me, believe me, believe me"--the marketers preach--and the party faithful do.
The US tradition of denigrating government as "unfreedom" is also a problem.
Both disregard the standards of cognitive discourse--truth--or at least rational--evidence based--belief. Their forte is marketing--the "science" --i.e. techniques--of separating fools from their money or votes.
Those most vulnerable to marketing ploys are those least versed in techniques of critical thinking, including self-critical thinking--standards of proof (rational belief), definitional care, logical implication vs innuendo and dialectical discourse--idea--logical interpretation/critique--better idea--on and on.
These are the standards of science--and all academia--as well as the courts--institutions depending on due process and due diligence before cutting off discourse with a vote.
Religions are the paradigm "faith based" institutions; 'faith" is dogmatic belief regardless of logic--definition argument and evidence. They assume infallibility-- beyond criticism--an absurd standard of proof for humans.
But most religious fanatics can't state the tenets of their religions--it's mere brand loyalty. So too the "party faithful" cannot state the tenets of their candidates. "Believe me, believe me, believe me"--the marketers preach--and the party faithful do.
The US tradition of denigrating government as "unfreedom" is also a problem.
17
Curious if you heard On the Media's piece about this topic and what you think: http://www.wnyc.org/story/truth-trump-supporters. "...Trump's popularity has been too conveniently pinned on the white working class, which is far more complex and politically diverse than the media would make it seem."
3
I think is is more about how you see our society. Those who support Trump are more likely feel that they are at the bottom looking up. Deindustrialization, Globalization, Immigration and the expansion of civil rghts are viewed as negative things that have been "forced down thier throats" by a liberal elite. The book, Rainbow Pie by Joe Begeant captures this idea quite well. Trump has been able to appeal those who feel they have been left behind, those that feel "their" country has changed in ways they do not like. Trump has rung the changes of the issues that have been used to appeal to rural whites since Andrew Jackson.
I grew up in the NYC area and now live in Southwest Ohio. I have gained some insight into this "bottom up" view that motivate many white voters, some poor, some more afluent, to support Trump. The liberal wing of the Democratic Party has pushed many of these voters away from the party with the dismissive, judgemental statements that have come out of this campaign. The feeling of many of the less educated whites in this area of the country can be captured in a phrase I have heard many times, "you think you are better than me?". I can see how they might feel that, and with some justification.
Trump will win Ohio, not because he is seen as some savior of the working poor, because the democrats are seen as agents of a brave new world that is being forced down thier throats. I guess it is who you feel is on your side even if the reality is that neither is.
I grew up in the NYC area and now live in Southwest Ohio. I have gained some insight into this "bottom up" view that motivate many white voters, some poor, some more afluent, to support Trump. The liberal wing of the Democratic Party has pushed many of these voters away from the party with the dismissive, judgemental statements that have come out of this campaign. The feeling of many of the less educated whites in this area of the country can be captured in a phrase I have heard many times, "you think you are better than me?". I can see how they might feel that, and with some justification.
Trump will win Ohio, not because he is seen as some savior of the working poor, because the democrats are seen as agents of a brave new world that is being forced down thier throats. I guess it is who you feel is on your side even if the reality is that neither is.
6
Agree with the sentiment. In our deeply red state, one of the worst social faux pas for many years and still in force in much of rural America was for a girl to go away to college, particularly a major university. The words most often muttered by the less educated behind the girl's back were uppity, too good for us, and you think you are better than me ad infinitum. No wonder many of them leave and never come back.
9
I fail to see how wanting to get a good education equates to "thinking you are better" than others. In fact, it has been my experience that the more educated one becomes, the more one is open to understanding a broader picture, and to accepting that diversity of all kinds as a good thing. I do not agree with the proposition that accepting differences is somehow forcing anything "down their throats." To the contrary, it seems to me that it is the Republican Party that is trying to force their very narrow, and I might add, dark view of the world down our collective throats. I can only hope that, when voters go to the polls, they strongly reject this ugly view of things.
4
I am a middle class older white woman who grew up in a very small town and did not attend college . I add this simply for context. While I have not had more than some junior college, I don't consider myself uneducated. From my perspective Trump supporters tend to be people who want someone to tell them what they want to hear. To reinforce their 'belief' systems, if you will. Whether this is due to their education/intelligence level, their geographic location, lack of exposure to people of other cultures or races, they want someone to make them feel good, just and correct. I know I am definitely over simplifying this but to me they are living in a world they do not fully understand nor are comfortable with so they will believe someone who says we can go back to a time when the world made sense to them. They don't consider whether that was a time that others looked back on in the same way. So who they are, I think, can be any and all of the things listed in the article. Just my two cents.
110
This is one of the most intelligent, well thought out and cogent statements and analyses of the Trump phenomenon and the appeal of this "person" I've read, to date. A clear and concise view. Bravo, Debra.
1
increased exposure to critical thinking decreases likelihood of brainwashing via fact-free, highly partisan media
16
I'm 71 with a college degree and some graduate work. Retired, i read the NYT, Washington Post, and at times the Guardian and now I've subscribed to the electronic Seattle Times. I already disliked Trump after he shouted down a young man on the Apprentice for asking a question Trump couldn't or didn't want to answer. "Oh, a smarty!" Trump snarled, never answering the question. That was it for me. Never watched him again. But I read all the news about his shoddy business deals in Atlantic City--things ordinary people would go to jail for, but by failing in a big way and being famous, Trump was able to take a failing gambling enterprise public and rip off investors. $35 a share stock went to 17 cents. That seems criminal to me and Trump ought to be in jail. This insight came from reading journalism. I don't recall seeing the talking heads on TV take us through this story or others in detail. People can be smart about their trade or craft or profession without reading good journalism, but they can be ignorant about the things the journalists have discovered. So readers verses TV viewers is another possible division that leads people to see more deeply into a candidate.
96
The same people that listen to Rush Limbaugh, watch televangelists, misunderstand the nature of science and are unable to parse a logical argument are the quickest to huddle behind and cheer on a demagogue such as Trump and feel the power of aggressive group think.
M L Carr
M L Carr
18
I'm 63 and subscribe to everything you just mentioned...interesting.
2
THE M L Carr, of the Celtics? A perfect example of intelligence & heart!
(excellent comment either way
(excellent comment either way
1
You might have a different attitude toward illegal immigration if you are the person doing the work, instead of the person hiring someone to do the work. When you can exploit people with low wages and no benefits and they can't ask for more or you will rat them out to ICE or just hire some other illegal alien, you enjoy being the boss and making good money.
5
It seems clear to me that Trump's basic message is that men with fame and money are therefore entitled to act as though they have power over everyone in their vicinity.
How ridiculous is that assumption? Every American voter should ponder that!
How ridiculous is that assumption? Every American voter should ponder that!
13
I believe choices, liberal vs conservative, HRC vs DJT may be connected to our "brains", that is left brain vs right brain! It is my own experience that more creative people tend to lean liberal, thus so many artists, singers, writers, even scientists etc. are more liberal and HRC supporters. I also think that creative people are more open to different things, life styles, cultures, etc. Conservatives just want the "status quo"...thus DJT's invitation to return to previous times!
5
The difference between my high school days and college is one word ---- indoctrination. So much of my school class time, church time and dinner table time was based on indoctrinating me on what was 'right'. The most stark example was US history. In high school, It was a very simple story --- America is always good, great, and right; in college, it got messy, complicated and contradictory. We Americans weren't always in the right. College challenges indoctrination. It also encourages you to learn how to hold complexity. The inability to tolerate complexity and contradictions makes Trump's message and language attractive.
204
The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in the mind at the same time, and still retain the ability to function. F. Scott Fitzgerald
2
The conviction that Education=Intelligence is false on many different levels, especially in a 21st Century America where College is now nothing more than a step up from High School and trade/blue collar jobs are considered 'unworthy' and looked down upon.
College certainly was a challenge in the 60s and 70s before they began to be overrun with meaningless liberal arts degrees where the prime directive is to teach you how to behave and think, not learn. Dissent is not only unwelcome, it is often dismissed or attacked. It doesn't matter how controversial an opinion is, in academia all lines of thought should be welcome and discussed, no?
Having spent my time in a Liberal institution in Chicago, I can guarantee there was no exposure to conservative ideals. So much so that people attack conservative opinions as wrong and immoral, despite them being valid. Socialists and communist sympathizers have taken over campuses, it's undeniable. Being indoctrinated to believe in only one opinion doesn't make you educated, it makes you a tool.
College certainly was a challenge in the 60s and 70s before they began to be overrun with meaningless liberal arts degrees where the prime directive is to teach you how to behave and think, not learn. Dissent is not only unwelcome, it is often dismissed or attacked. It doesn't matter how controversial an opinion is, in academia all lines of thought should be welcome and discussed, no?
Having spent my time in a Liberal institution in Chicago, I can guarantee there was no exposure to conservative ideals. So much so that people attack conservative opinions as wrong and immoral, despite them being valid. Socialists and communist sympathizers have taken over campuses, it's undeniable. Being indoctrinated to believe in only one opinion doesn't make you educated, it makes you a tool.
5
I have a theory that wasn't discussed: the belief in salvation.
Some number of people believe that salvation from an uncertain future is something that can only be delivered by faith in something other than yourself, something bigger. Judging by the polls, that number is roughly 40% of the population. Almost the exact same number of people who claim to go to church on a weekly basis. And who better to deliver that salvation than a demagogue who makes sweeping promises and has a larger than life reputation?
If I'm right, then the people who are most likely to go to church (older people) are also the most likely to support Donald Trump. And - interestingly - the people who need to look outside of themselves for deliverance from an insecure future (people who didn't graduate from college, for example) will also be more likely to support Trump. Which is exactly what we see.
I honestly don't think intelligence has a lot to do with Trump support. I know several guys who are quite quick-witted and smart who love Trump. But they all have a lack of faith in themselves. Which makes them easy pickings for Trump's brand of "salvation".
Some number of people believe that salvation from an uncertain future is something that can only be delivered by faith in something other than yourself, something bigger. Judging by the polls, that number is roughly 40% of the population. Almost the exact same number of people who claim to go to church on a weekly basis. And who better to deliver that salvation than a demagogue who makes sweeping promises and has a larger than life reputation?
If I'm right, then the people who are most likely to go to church (older people) are also the most likely to support Donald Trump. And - interestingly - the people who need to look outside of themselves for deliverance from an insecure future (people who didn't graduate from college, for example) will also be more likely to support Trump. Which is exactly what we see.
I honestly don't think intelligence has a lot to do with Trump support. I know several guys who are quite quick-witted and smart who love Trump. But they all have a lack of faith in themselves. Which makes them easy pickings for Trump's brand of "salvation".
35
Trump gets by with his fans because he is wealthy and tasteless enough to say whatever comes out of his mouth.
His followers would say similar things if they dared.
Why aren't people simply ignoring his pronouncements?
His followers would say similar things if they dared.
Why aren't people simply ignoring his pronouncements?
8
Perhaps in your neck of the woods that 'Salvation' theory holds -- but I don't think it could be said of all of Trump's supporters, and most definitely those living outside of the so-called 'Bible-belt'.
I also believe that intelligence (and education) is a KEY factor in this equation, as most people in that group have the ability to see through Trump's railings.
Being "quick-witted" has nothing to do with it.
I also believe that intelligence (and education) is a KEY factor in this equation, as most people in that group have the ability to see through Trump's railings.
Being "quick-witted" has nothing to do with it.
2
It can't be that simple, Smitty...I know tons of Trump supporters and they aren't all uneducated. Not by a long shot. Some of them are small business owners, doctors, an attorney, an engineer, etc.
And I'd also just like to point out that - in my experience - most people who are quick-witted are quite intelligent.
And I'd also just like to point out that - in my experience - most people who are quick-witted are quite intelligent.
It has become clear that Americans with degrees are not as patriotic and intelligent as the rest of us. We love America. We know that America is the greatest nation on Earth and blessed by God. We know that Americans are the greatest people on Earth and deserve to live life better than the rest of the world. All these facts and more are why we vote for freedom and liberty and Donald J. Trump will be the best President in history.
4
Is this satire?
9
But doesn't Trump believe that America is no longer "great"? That seems unpatriotic.
2
Lester, interesting comment at the start of your comment. "...Americans with degrees are not as patriotic and intelligent as the rest of us." What? What is your source for this information and where is the data that support such a comment. I am college educated, 65 yr old woman, from working class parents. How can you know in your heart the degree of my patriotism and my intelligence? My parents, non-college educated, were both FDR democrats, and would have been appalled at the Trump candidacy.
8
My father who was a college professor and the first in his family to go to college always told me to never confuse education with intelligence.
So I do not think that people with less education are less intelligent than I am with my PhD. But our k-12 education system does not train people to think critically. People with lower educations have less economical security and therefore have not benefited from the global economy. They also do not have the knowledge and skills to figure it why. This is why they are easily fooled by people like Trump.
So I do not think that people with less education are less intelligent than I am with my PhD. But our k-12 education system does not train people to think critically. People with lower educations have less economical security and therefore have not benefited from the global economy. They also do not have the knowledge and skills to figure it why. This is why they are easily fooled by people like Trump.
18
It's not the subject, level, location or instructors that makes the 'educated' less likely to support Trump but rather the values that further education instills. A college education encourages a viewpoint that is open-minded and inquisitive, looking to make decisions based on facts.
A non-educated individual is more likely to be closed-minded and makes decisions based on input that reaffirms previously held beliefs (regardless of whether the input can be backed up by fact).
Trumps rhetoric and own values clearly strike a chord with those who favor a closed mindset while alienating those who favor an open viewpoint.
A non-educated individual is more likely to be closed-minded and makes decisions based on input that reaffirms previously held beliefs (regardless of whether the input can be backed up by fact).
Trumps rhetoric and own values clearly strike a chord with those who favor a closed mindset while alienating those who favor an open viewpoint.
6
In Central NY I am surrounded by passionate white Trump supporters. I notice most how deeply they refuse to take in information, how strongly they support "the confederacy" despite the fact that so many I meet have never been south of Binghamton, and how firmly they have absolutely no interest in traveling, reading, or education. Their biggest problem, however, is not ignorance or lack of education. Their problem is their desperate love of white supremacy, the only thing that seems to provide self-esteem. They feel insecure about so many aspects of their lives--the men tend to love guns and the women express admiration for Sarah Palin. They passionately believe America should never have accepted black people as equal to white people and want America to become so-called great again like in the 1950s. Their choice certainly would be to indefinitely prolong segregation and every form of inequality that favors whites. Trump's overture about Mexicans as rapists thrilled them! We can pretend to be egalitarian, fearing the snob moniker, and see the complaints of these particular CNY Trump lovers as worthy but their rabid racism is troubling at best.
This election is about whether you understand that from 1619 when we brought slaves into our fragile experiment with democracy until 1954 with the overturning of "separate but equal" we had been terribly, horribly wrong all along. It take mature, educated minds to accept that we needed to change.
This election is about whether you understand that from 1619 when we brought slaves into our fragile experiment with democracy until 1954 with the overturning of "separate but equal" we had been terribly, horribly wrong all along. It take mature, educated minds to accept that we needed to change.
217
It was not at all clear to me that he was making a statement about all Trump supporters. The subject of his post was central NY passionate white Trump supporters "around" him. He might be referring to about 300 people. So his statements could easily be quite accurate, and he might not be a fool at all.
5
Spot on assessment, AMAS.
2
My father grew up during the depression. He had to leave school after his sophomore year of high school to go to work. He voted for FDR, Truman and every other democratic presidential candidate including Kennedy and Johnson. I remember his disgust at Regan when he was elected governor of California. He saw right through Nixon. I have no doubt he would have voted for Obama and would vote for Hilary Clinton if he were still alive.
He did not have an opportunity to continue school, but he kept himself informed. He used critical thinking skills to analyze the political scene and avoid "herd thinking". Even more important, he recognized a con-artist when he saw him.
He did not have an opportunity to continue school, but he kept himself informed. He used critical thinking skills to analyze the political scene and avoid "herd thinking". Even more important, he recognized a con-artist when he saw him.
218
My mother did not go beyond 8th grade. But she was an avid reader, she had common sense and she was a good judge of people. She read the newspaper everyday, kept up with what was going on in politics and we discussed current events around the dinner table. She was a lifelong democrat and voted for democrats including President Obama. She encouraged all six of her children to pursue higher education and we did. I m grateful for that education but also for what my mother taught me. We shouldn't sell people short because they don't have college degree. You can be intelligent, sensible and a good judge of people without a college degree. Some of our friends who are doctors and lawyers and business owners support Trump. I just don't understand it.
2
thanks. That was my Dad too.
I have wondered this for a long time. For me, the important parts of education were critical thinking and having to defend my statements. My reaction to statements like "Hillary's the most corrupt individual ever to live" is "cite your source, let's examine it." All I can think of is that educated people prefer to have evidence because when they had to write papers in college, they needed to have arguments and citations to back their theses up.
Obviously, that doesn't mean that college-educated people aren't prone to bias, or visceral reactions. But to say that one detests and despises Trump, and to back up their views to critics, takes only as long as needed to compile the near-infinite resources compiling Trump's lies, the stiffing of workers, the racism, the sexual assault habits, etc. Those are facts.
I've heard "facts are liberal-biased." I tend to think that "liberals are fact-biased."
Obviously this doesn't apply to all Trump fans or to all less-educated voters. Just the ones who hang black effigies from trees, chant Jew-S-A, are ready to commit violence if Hillary wins, and the like.
Obviously, that doesn't mean that college-educated people aren't prone to bias, or visceral reactions. But to say that one detests and despises Trump, and to back up their views to critics, takes only as long as needed to compile the near-infinite resources compiling Trump's lies, the stiffing of workers, the racism, the sexual assault habits, etc. Those are facts.
I've heard "facts are liberal-biased." I tend to think that "liberals are fact-biased."
Obviously this doesn't apply to all Trump fans or to all less-educated voters. Just the ones who hang black effigies from trees, chant Jew-S-A, are ready to commit violence if Hillary wins, and the like.
120
From experience in my own circle, a major factor driving older male voters to Donald Trump is their antipathy to Hillary Clinton. The venom I hear astonishes me. Somehow Donald Trump is seen as more "honest" because he "tells it like it is", while Hillary Clinton is "manipulative" and "deceitful". People are prepared to overlook or justify anything Trump says or does because he's better than the alternative.
Why am I hearing this primarily from less educated men? I believe some of it stems from personal circumstances. Not one of these men that I associate with appears to be happily married. They project onto Hillary Clinton their own frustrations and unhappiness with the women in their own lives.
Why am I hearing this primarily from less educated men? I believe some of it stems from personal circumstances. Not one of these men that I associate with appears to be happily married. They project onto Hillary Clinton their own frustrations and unhappiness with the women in their own lives.
168
Clinton defenders do the same. When I call them out with facts they all act like they are not supporters.
I believe that's called male chauvinism, and many women suffer from it as well. Rather ironic when a woman tells you how Clinton would not be up to the job. These people are totally unable to see the truth of their prejudices. Despite Trump's boorishness and outright nastiness, not to mention his lack of intelligence, there are still many people who look at this fat old man with the comb-over and say, "what a man!" You could tell these people about Clinton's brilliance, her education, etc., and you would be knocking your head against the wall. I'm hoping for enough intelligent people to show up on November 8. Remember that Jefferson claimed that an educated electorate was necessary for democracy to succeed.
1
I know a few Trump supporters. I can't call them friends, but we have interacted as colleagues and neighbors in a small rural community. The Trump supporters I know are well-to-do owners of small and large businesses. They are public school teachers and administrators, several dentists, a pharmacist, a rancher, a horse trainer, a successful large scale farmer, an irrigation engineer, a lawyer, my doctor, the school nurse....I could go on. These Trump supporters are educated professional people. They have a few other shared traits. They are all white. They are openly racist when in their own company. They dispise President Obama. They elect Tea party representatives to Congress. They mistrust the federal government to such a degree they actually advocate its overthrow. They are not poor. They are not working class. They are not uneducated. They are white power racists. We need to start admitting we have a problem here.
377
Unfortunately, the election of a black president has not opened these peoples eyes to the equality of all races, but has hardened their hatred of the Federal Government. Racial predudice is of course not limited to the uneducated, but is in the DNA of many whites who ought to know better.
9
You're stating the obvious. If you're bothered by your well-off racist friends, then you do something about it.
3
You should, at least, find another doctor.
5
Trump's campaign is classic populism, down to his explicit invocation of the xenophibic, racist "America First" campaign of the 1940s. We've seen this show before. I think it's less about class and income, strictly, than about a perceived conflict between the powerless (uneducated whites) and the powerful (the elites or, in today's parlance, the establishment). Thanks to the GOP's decades-long efforts to paint the Clintons as the epitome of the Washington elite, this election has been populism in overdrive. I truly hope the modern age at least helps to reshape cultural identities enough in this country that we can drop the myth that white America represents some "real" America (as if it ever has) forever, but it's proving disturbingly resilient.
33
Notably missing from this analysis is the issue of Mr. Trump's misogyny. His supporters fail to recognize the serious impropriety of his words and his conduct towards women, and that these alone are disqualifying. Is that failure the result of their lack of education, or of their upbringing?
We can discuss Mr. Trump's character and conduct from the perspective of a variety of considerations that may run counter to university indoctrinated liberal ideals. But what really disqualifies him from the office of the presidency is that he simply is not a gentleman. His supporters should have learned that at home.
We can discuss Mr. Trump's character and conduct from the perspective of a variety of considerations that may run counter to university indoctrinated liberal ideals. But what really disqualifies him from the office of the presidency is that he simply is not a gentleman. His supporters should have learned that at home.
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His parents tried to teach him but his willful ignorance was of a particularly virulent strain. In desperation they sent him to a military college, to no avail.
2
@ferlin
If you truly knew ANYTHING about Trump's father Fred, you wouldn't come out with such a statement --- But you got the part about the military school correct.
If you truly knew ANYTHING about Trump's father Fred, you wouldn't come out with such a statement --- But you got the part about the military school correct.
3
Less educated voters simply lack critical thinking skills. That is what makes the difference. Most of the less educated voters will accept anything Donald Trump and Rush Limbaugh say without question. I tend to watch Chris Matthews and Rachel Maddow. While I often agree with them, I am always on the lookout for things they might say that don't seem to add up. And they often do say things that shade the truth or leave out pertinent facts. If I think something they say sounds too good to be true or is off base, I will look into it further, if it is something I really care to know more about. Otherwise, I will just take it with a grain of salt. James Comey's letter last week is another good example. Trump's supporters jump to the conclusion that the newly discovered emails must be evidence of a crime, even though there is no support for that conclusion other than Trump's allegations. A more thoughtful and educated person, regardless of political affiliation will understand that a determination of the emails' significance can only be made after they are reviewed. Maybe the emails do contain evidence of crime. But they could also be completely irrelevant. Likewise, Trump's alleged ties to Russia are in the news today because of internet traffic between Trump's server and a Russian bank with know Putin ties. Rather than jumping to the conclusion that this is proof of collusion, an educated voter with critical thinking skills will want to see more evidence.
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"Less educated voters simply lack critical thinking skills."
A critical thinker would find holes in that generalization.
For what it's worth on the evidentiary side, there are plenty of highly educated people whose cognitive biases leave them no less vulnerable to all manner of snake oil salesfolk. Our economy, in a sense, is based on that reality (that education often doesn't overcome cognitive bias).
A critical thinker would find holes in that generalization.
For what it's worth on the evidentiary side, there are plenty of highly educated people whose cognitive biases leave them no less vulnerable to all manner of snake oil salesfolk. Our economy, in a sense, is based on that reality (that education often doesn't overcome cognitive bias).
14
There are two groups of people, those who seek out and respect facts; those who ascribe to the credo "Facts, I don't need no stinking facts" These two groups exist in every segment of society. There is however a preponderance of those who tend to disregard facts in the GOP. This is why the large majority of the GOP deny Global Warming
15
Wow, this is seriously ivory tower thinking. There plenty of smart blue collar workers who would rather work with their hands than get fat sitting behind a desk all day.
4
Not really mentioned here was the fear the GOP has for education and how the GOP keeps trying to limit or destroy education. Cutting education budgets, turning public schools into private ones, denigrating education in general, etc.
The Republican party wants dumb, easily misled voters, not educated, thinking voters. If you start looking at what they advocate and try to get enacted you'll see what I mean.
The Republican party wants dumb, easily misled voters, not educated, thinking voters. If you start looking at what they advocate and try to get enacted you'll see what I mean.
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All I ever had to understand about funding and education came from Illinois. Highest paid teachers by far making six figures and they still fail miserably at their jobs.
The 'GOP' or conservatives don't hate education, they dislike government funded education with such programs as Common Core being a complete disaster. Just as you believe they want 'easily misled' voters, Democrats want re-educated and indoctrinated youthful idiots who gathered their political voice from their professor's rather than through their own life experiences.
The 'GOP' or conservatives don't hate education, they dislike government funded education with such programs as Common Core being a complete disaster. Just as you believe they want 'easily misled' voters, Democrats want re-educated and indoctrinated youthful idiots who gathered their political voice from their professor's rather than through their own life experiences.
So what is your solution? To deny public education to those who cannot afford it? I am very suspicious of any person who wants to destroy the right to a public education under the guise of trying to "save" it!
7
Please read about the Kansas City school district and see how much difference it made to pump billions of dollars (judge enforced) into public schools. Then see if what you said makes any sense.
14
I'm sure it comes down to myriad factors, but in my personal experience it isn't so much education as exposure. It would be incorrect to paint all of Trump's supporters as uneducated hive-mind plebs, just as it would be unfair to call any liberal a socialist. In my opinion, the more one is exposed to people, cultures, and worldviews that contradict or challenge their own, the better off they are. Constraining your work and social circles to strictly like-minded individuals does one no favors, but people will voluntarily do this because they want their views affirmed. Class, age, education, location...it all comes together to paint your experiences.
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When we talk among ourselves, all we get back are echoes.
But when we talk with others of a different mind, we are made to think.
And it is in thinking that we learn, and in learning that we grow.
Romeo LeBlanc, Governor General of Canada
But when we talk with others of a different mind, we are made to think.
And it is in thinking that we learn, and in learning that we grow.
Romeo LeBlanc, Governor General of Canada
14
You're implying that those experiences make one a Hillary voter.
Why Does Education Translate to Less Support for Trump? Excellent question. Let’s start by state the indisputable consensus: The poor and working class is generally favoring Democrats.
Let’s look into what today’s college graduates and or college students interacting with on daily basis for years: Adjunct professors.
Adjunct professors make up more than 58 percent of all faculties at colleges/universities in US, across all levels. The difference between an adjunct and a tenured professor is that adjuncts are hired by course; they are considered sub-contractors, paid by the course they teach and have no job security. They also tend to make $28,000 or less a year.
Tenured professorship is a slowly dying occupation. Adjuncts are the new Uber of higher learning. Adjuncts deliver the same level of instruction for half the price and there is no commitment by the college or university to pay benefits. The truth is adjuncts are struggling to meet their own needs. About 28 percent of adjunct professors live BELOW the poverty line. With a 40 hour work week preparing curriculums, grading papers, and writing lectures, their pay generally averages out to about $12.90 an hour.
Over 137,000 adjunct professors nationwide are on government assistance.
To answer your question: Do you expect millions college graduates and or college students who were taught by the hidden working poor for years, the adjunct professors, to support a Billionaire?! Not Likely to say the least.
Let’s look into what today’s college graduates and or college students interacting with on daily basis for years: Adjunct professors.
Adjunct professors make up more than 58 percent of all faculties at colleges/universities in US, across all levels. The difference between an adjunct and a tenured professor is that adjuncts are hired by course; they are considered sub-contractors, paid by the course they teach and have no job security. They also tend to make $28,000 or less a year.
Tenured professorship is a slowly dying occupation. Adjuncts are the new Uber of higher learning. Adjuncts deliver the same level of instruction for half the price and there is no commitment by the college or university to pay benefits. The truth is adjuncts are struggling to meet their own needs. About 28 percent of adjunct professors live BELOW the poverty line. With a 40 hour work week preparing curriculums, grading papers, and writing lectures, their pay generally averages out to about $12.90 an hour.
Over 137,000 adjunct professors nationwide are on government assistance.
To answer your question: Do you expect millions college graduates and or college students who were taught by the hidden working poor for years, the adjunct professors, to support a Billionaire?! Not Likely to say the least.
68
An excellent point, that I, as a university student, failed to account into attempting to assimilate the education factor into voting demographics. Two of my favorite history professors are Adjuncts; one is blatantly conservative, and the other is fiercely independent who doesn't display his own political views in the classroom. I've managed to learn much from both of them.
In my southern university, I have failed to see any overt display of support for Trump; however, at the community college I attended, there is much support for him.
On the other hand, those who care passionately on one issue, e.g., Abortion, tend to vote for any GOP candidate, and they take Trump at his word on pro-life issues. Those who tend to see the multifaceted nature of issues, tend to vote Democrat. That's my subjective view.
In my southern university, I have failed to see any overt display of support for Trump; however, at the community college I attended, there is much support for him.
On the other hand, those who care passionately on one issue, e.g., Abortion, tend to vote for any GOP candidate, and they take Trump at his word on pro-life issues. Those who tend to see the multifaceted nature of issues, tend to vote Democrat. That's my subjective view.
44
Or could it be that "tenured" professors have milked the system to the point where there is little left for the adjuncts? Like him or not the "billionaire" is not the reason for the "plight of the poor". What about the "poor" graduates who are footing the bill just so they can work at Starbucks.
17
Well reasoned, I totally agree.
apple does not fall far from the tree......
apple does not fall far from the tree......
32
Re my earlier comment, these are the toe of college-educated people I think more likely to vote for Trump:
"What if you mostly goof off at college — beer pong at the fraternity instead of bearing down at the library — but manage to get a degree? You may not be thoroughly “educated” but..."
I'm not sure how you would capture in data the difference between college students who learn about evidence and those who don't, but if someone could, it would make a great dissertation!
"What if you mostly goof off at college — beer pong at the fraternity instead of bearing down at the library — but manage to get a degree? You may not be thoroughly “educated” but..."
I'm not sure how you would capture in data the difference between college students who learn about evidence and those who don't, but if someone could, it would make a great dissertation!
7
I think you have to look at the birtherism issue - why would someone believe or reject this theory? In college, evidence-based reasoning is taught and promoted. Not to say everyone there "gets it." But it is, at least, the culture of an academic environment.
58
Hmm, and I thought colleges taught that Obama was born in Hawaii and not his true birthplace in Africa.
You are the reason i dislike Trump supporters. If you truly believe Obama wasn't born in this country, despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary, you are not interested in the truth. I guess you believe the Earth is flat,too.
8
More and better education translates into better critical thinking skills, and better judgement. This is why red states have pretty much destroyed their own public education systems, particularly in non-white communities. Also, segregation, throughout the country, is way up over the past 20 years, a sure equal education killer. We have a tremendous problem on our hands, if we want to remain a global power.
50
Mitt Romney's remarks about sum up why educated people will not vote for Trump. Educated people have greater comprehension what the office of the Presidency requires. But Trump recognizes very disturbing trends that if not addressed will lead to a form of anarchy/revolution within a few decades. Neither party nor the electorate recognize the systemic dysfunctions associated with the broader spectrums of "trickle down", the built in systemic bent toward politics and corruption. Electorate is frustrated but can't grip the root causes because of the shouting of the alt right.
10
Trump supporters "believe" and "feel" things. Hillary supporters "understand" and "distinguish".
128
You couldn't be more correct, Mitch. I don't have a college degree, but I know which way the wind blows. I believe that we badly need a change from the Democratic platform. I feel that our current president and the Democratic choice for the next president have failed us miserably on so many fronts that they can't be listed. But the highlights would be Nuclear Iran and the lies our President told thereafter, the email server and its vast content of unsavory, backhanded dealings which almost always had some kind of payment to the Clinton Foundation attached, and the Benghazi cover-up.
I also believe and feel that the media coverage we see as Americans is broadcasted through the rosy lenses of the DNC, and that they might, despite their very best collective efforts, have a surprise coming on November 8th. But what do I know, I'm just an average Joe.
I also believe and feel that the media coverage we see as Americans is broadcasted through the rosy lenses of the DNC, and that they might, despite their very best collective efforts, have a surprise coming on November 8th. But what do I know, I'm just an average Joe.
7
Colin - I sincerely understand and share your concerns about the Democratic nominee but I distinguish between a honed statesperson that I would want sitting in the White House representing our nation (for better or worse), and the truly unqualified and unstable TV sad-clown the GOP has put forward.
Colin - all of his success comes from convincing people he's successful. He's a Kardashian before the Kardashians...famous for being famous.
A race between Hillary and Kasich, Romney, Cruz, or even Rubio would be looking a lot different right now.
Colin - all of his success comes from convincing people he's successful. He's a Kardashian before the Kardashians...famous for being famous.
A race between Hillary and Kasich, Romney, Cruz, or even Rubio would be looking a lot different right now.
23
I agree it would be a lot different with another GOP candidate in the race. I am not sure if that were the case of the democratic side. I think if it were Sanders versus Trump that Sanders would be in very much the same position Clinton is in and polls would be very much the same. Unfortunately the Republicans that I could have aligned with on the GOP side never seem to do well like Huntsman or Kasich which would be essentially moderates as opposed to the extremes like Cruz or batty like Carson (take your pick).
Which came first: the chicken or the egg? One writer complains that he was the only conservative in a college department of 22, so of course the students develop a liberal bias. But how did the 22 faculty members become liberal? By thinking, maybe? By applying what they learned in their own education? By adopting the point of view of their own teachers and professors? Who became liberal how? It seems that educated people somehow develop a liberal point of view...........
101
mary,
Your argument omits the hiring and promotion practices in higher education. Tenured (voting) faculty may simply choose to hire candidates that think just like they do. They then scrutinize their assistant professors for five years and award tenure only to those that they have thoroughly vetted to meet their standards of ideological purity, Once established, the tyranny of the majority can never be overthrown. Bias is as bias does, all the while pretending to be unbiased, even-handed, and pure of heart.
Your argument omits the hiring and promotion practices in higher education. Tenured (voting) faculty may simply choose to hire candidates that think just like they do. They then scrutinize their assistant professors for five years and award tenure only to those that they have thoroughly vetted to meet their standards of ideological purity, Once established, the tyranny of the majority can never be overthrown. Bias is as bias does, all the while pretending to be unbiased, even-handed, and pure of heart.
3
I am the "complaining writer" to whom you refer,Mary. Why do academics become liberal--two reasons:
1)Like chooses like. To get job teaching a conservative has to keep his mouth shut,at least until he gets tenure, and beyond if he ever wants promotion.
2) Resentment---Typically liberal professors resent the fact that successful people in the "real world" do not heed their advice or particularly respect their exalted vision of themselves--not to mention the fact that liberals aren't as economically well rewarded as their intellectual inferiors. They come to hate what the common man values--patriotism,family, God. Living in a self-selected environment with little or no opposition from students(those who do resist are dismissed as having various varieties of "phobia"),these worthies do their best to clone their captive audiences and have had signal success in so doing. Thanks for your comment.
1)Like chooses like. To get job teaching a conservative has to keep his mouth shut,at least until he gets tenure, and beyond if he ever wants promotion.
2) Resentment---Typically liberal professors resent the fact that successful people in the "real world" do not heed their advice or particularly respect their exalted vision of themselves--not to mention the fact that liberals aren't as economically well rewarded as their intellectual inferiors. They come to hate what the common man values--patriotism,family, God. Living in a self-selected environment with little or no opposition from students(those who do resist are dismissed as having various varieties of "phobia"),these worthies do their best to clone their captive audiences and have had signal success in so doing. Thanks for your comment.
5
It sounds, Rob, that it is you who resents the academics.
Visit any college where professors are busy teaching and researching and writing. Learn that they do it for the joy of recognition for their achievements. They don't resent you -- they never think about you. Or your patriotism or your family or your god -- or any other mundane things the common man values.
Visit any college where professors are busy teaching and researching and writing. Learn that they do it for the joy of recognition for their achievements. They don't resent you -- they never think about you. Or your patriotism or your family or your god -- or any other mundane things the common man values.
7