Jews were not the indigenous population of the land , they came into Palestine from Egypt and Iraq,and ruled, interruptedly only parts of Palestine some two hundred years versus Arab population and cultural, majority of 1400 years and ruled all of Palestine.If you thing that thr elapse of some fifteen centuries and the change of human standard and mores is insignificant in human affairs that would be not only retrogressive but would be in denial of human progress .
3
She's terrific.
6
Just what our planet needs: yet another culturally-aggrieved right-winger with a racial chip on her shoulder and growing power...and in Israel, of all places! Don't these people get the irony of what they're doing?
Sure, spread the money around a bit more fairly and expand the definition of culture but going after people who think differently or are descended from a different lineage seems so 1933...
Sure, spread the money around a bit more fairly and expand the definition of culture but going after people who think differently or are descended from a different lineage seems so 1933...
10
http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2016/10/ultra-right-wing-mk-supports-ar... The bias in the article is clear, but this episode in the article blows apart the idea that Israel's right is anti-Arab: write "1 evening, I joined Regev for a Ramadan visit to her Arab supporters..Regev was the guest of honor, and a line of men with their young sons formed to greet her and her aides...one of the town’s deputy mayors, a genial lawyer named Ayman Shanati, spoke. “I’m not a man of Likud,” he said. But with Regev, “we are seeing real change and a lot of new projects in the Arab sector. He praised Regev’s reallocation of funds, which has benefited Arab towns ...(Arab municipalities are used to such double speak from government ministers but often decide to swallow the insult in order to maintain working relations... Regev says Whoever is loyal to the state, we’ll bring him the moon.” Regev is not being hypocritical - she is being entirely consistent. Arab-Israelis deserve to be treated better and she is working to do so. Arabs&Jews - who are disloyal do not deserve automatic funding for anti-Israel arts. It isn't a "right" and refusing to fund such art is not censorship. Israel doesn't have the responsibility to support art that tries to undermine its very foundation, whether it is from the Arab or Jewish sectors.There is no anti-Arab bias whatsoever, but Margalit is so wedded to the idea that Regev is a racist that she cannot see the distinction that she herself reports.
12
Miri Regev should learn a few thing from Obama. She is right about her fight for justice, a lot of people are frustrated and angry in Israel. We, the Mizrahim, had to hide our culture for years because our culture is considered to be less than the western culture, however, the way she does it is wrong. She is antagonizing so many people. She should learn from Obama, he changed many of the blacks lives, many of them have health insurance, he took from the whites and gave free health care to many of the blacks. But he did it without the whites feeling that he is doing anything for the blacks. Miri Regev, should continue all she does, but without the drama and without antagonizing the elite!
7
This is some funny stuff. No one thinks "Chekhov is more important than Maimondes."
3
Allow me to give you some real time perspective here. The Eshkenazi/ Mizrachi complex of Miri Regev, represents a minority headed by Regev. It is a personal complex that Regev . 90% of the Israeli people, are well integrated anf live in peace with each other. Miri Regev uses this old school complex, to veil her real political agenda: controlling the Israeli artists freedom of speech and the freedom of expression, and in that manner, overseeing that all the artistic expressions serves her party. In that sense, if PINK was Israeli, publishing "Mr. President", under the current Regev Regime, she'd be hitting jail otherwise loosing her citizenship.
It is enough to open Regev facebook and read hundred of testimonies of "Mizrachi" Artists and citizens, calling and begging her to cease and desist to understand, Regev does not serve the Artists or the Arts, she is promoting discrimination and separation of anyone opposing her party.
Right at the beginning of her career, Regev initiated public 'Artist Hunting" , making clear that any Artist who will dare speak out opposing views, be silenced and called upon a Traitor.
With all due respect, this whole "PR FOR CULTUR WAR" is infact a PR to a gradual Israeli Artists HUMAN RIGHTS depravation, that many Artists in Israel cray out against as it endangers the Israeli Democracy.
Regev have no clue of whatsoever in the field of art, nor she showed any interest progressing in the area.
It is enough to open Regev facebook and read hundred of testimonies of "Mizrachi" Artists and citizens, calling and begging her to cease and desist to understand, Regev does not serve the Artists or the Arts, she is promoting discrimination and separation of anyone opposing her party.
Right at the beginning of her career, Regev initiated public 'Artist Hunting" , making clear that any Artist who will dare speak out opposing views, be silenced and called upon a Traitor.
With all due respect, this whole "PR FOR CULTUR WAR" is infact a PR to a gradual Israeli Artists HUMAN RIGHTS depravation, that many Artists in Israel cray out against as it endangers the Israeli Democracy.
Regev have no clue of whatsoever in the field of art, nor she showed any interest progressing in the area.
3
Mizrachi artists in Israel are often in the peace camp, promoting cultural arts that are shared across religious and ethnic lines. Her criticism of Ashkenazi racism is accurate as far as that goes. Her desire to bring the arts into line with her particular politics is ridiculous and has nothing to do with being Mizrachi. Art in the service of a government-imposed ideology is not going to be good, regardless of who produces it.
1
This article presents Minister Regev as passionately certain about the righteousness of her beliefs, their derived implications and consequences, socio-geographically, reinforced by a revised history of coming from a victimized segment of a two group Jewish-Israeli population; the “Mizrachim.” But THEY represent a diverse population using a broad range of criteria.Just as the Ashkanazim do. Unscientific, non-God constructed, unchanging to fluid labels, used and misused, by influential individual and systemic stakeholders. Important criteria, often overlooked, are the needs of the labeler as well as a built in, but misleading constraint; an either/or categorizing. This semantic and cognitive shortcut blinds us from the ever present reality of interacting, dynamic, multi dimensional, continuums with their nuanced levels, qualities, known, currently unknown and even unknowable parameters which operate, adapt,and function within uncertainties and unpredictabilities. The myth of a binary either/or is to be challenged by a reality of “ and, in addition, and, in addition, etc.” Diverse, Minister R. is also female,heterosexual,a daughter, grand daughter, sister, wife, mother,neighbor, friend, former soldier,student, graduate, smart, politician,stakeholder, of Mizrachi self-identity, “and, in addition...” She chooses to use/misuse, either/or; as have many of the Comment contributors.In addition to being willful blindness, what else can her modus operandi represent?
1
Regev's regime is pretty much what one would expect when a member of an underclass is given the power to advance her class's interests when put in a powerful position.
One problem is that the Ashkenazi Jews, by virtue of their residence in the West became heirs to the traditions of Greece and Rome, the Renaissance, The Enlightenment, and Modernism. The Mizrahi...well, not so much. I doubt that Regev would ever admit it, but Western influences on Jewish culture were by and large beneficial, whereas growing up as a Jew in, say, Iraq did not expose Jews to Western ideas that would come to reshape the world.
One problem is that the Ashkenazi Jews, by virtue of their residence in the West became heirs to the traditions of Greece and Rome, the Renaissance, The Enlightenment, and Modernism. The Mizrahi...well, not so much. I doubt that Regev would ever admit it, but Western influences on Jewish culture were by and large beneficial, whereas growing up as a Jew in, say, Iraq did not expose Jews to Western ideas that would come to reshape the world.
7
Western culture is beautiful and valuable -- it has also been cruel and vicious. I'm not sure that more of Western culture is what Israel needs to integrate into the MIddle East. Most Israelis are proud that their culture is a mix of East and West. Hopefully, they will take the best of both worlds and not the worst.
All of the peoples of the Levant, Iraq, Iran, Turkey and North Africa have always prided themselves on the same thing. There was no wall dividing the Middle East from Western culture until the 19th or 20th centuries. Ideas, values, music, dress, philosophies, and religious movements have flowed back and forth between Europe and the Middle East since Roman times. The fact that Europeans know their own history but not Middle Eastern history does not mean that the reverse is true.
I think the example you were looking for may have been Yemini or Ethiopian Jews who were more isolated from Western intellectual movements until their immigration to Israel. Iraq was a poor example and show that you, like most Americans, know very little about the actual history of exchange between East and West in modern Middle Eastern history.
All of the peoples of the Levant, Iraq, Iran, Turkey and North Africa have always prided themselves on the same thing. There was no wall dividing the Middle East from Western culture until the 19th or 20th centuries. Ideas, values, music, dress, philosophies, and religious movements have flowed back and forth between Europe and the Middle East since Roman times. The fact that Europeans know their own history but not Middle Eastern history does not mean that the reverse is true.
I think the example you were looking for may have been Yemini or Ethiopian Jews who were more isolated from Western intellectual movements until their immigration to Israel. Iraq was a poor example and show that you, like most Americans, know very little about the actual history of exchange between East and West in modern Middle Eastern history.
7
Many of those "western influences" were filtered through/heavily edited by the Islamic civilizations of Spain and other places. Maimonides, a great influence on Acquinas, was "Mizrahi."
8
In an article describing Ms. Regev's advocacy for the Mizrahi Jews, it seems shameful that they are described simply as "immigrants" from Muslim countries. Aside from those who had already been living in the land before the rebirth of the Israeli state, the majority of the Mizrahi community fled their ancient communities in Muslim/Arab countries to escape from increasing persecution or were forcibly expelled as vengeance for the Arab failure to destroy the Israeli state in the war of 1948-49. Many left with little more than they could carry on their backs, and, unlike the Arabs who fled Israel, were absorbed (however imperfectly) as citizens by the new and struggling state. This is a story that has been poorly acknowledged, even by Israel, but which is nonetheless an important historical fact and should not be so glibly overlooked.
It is also worth stating that while there may have been an Islamic Waqf or council overseeing the Al Aqsa/Temple Mount Plaza since the 12th century, the one currently in place was created by the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan after their seizure of the Old City in 1949, and which was allowed to remain in place after Israel regained control of the site in 1967. It is not the same Islamic Council "that has administered the site since the 12th century." To imply such continuity is to ignore the historical reality of the region.
Given the complexity of the situation, one would hope for more accurate information on the context of the region.
It is also worth stating that while there may have been an Islamic Waqf or council overseeing the Al Aqsa/Temple Mount Plaza since the 12th century, the one currently in place was created by the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan after their seizure of the Old City in 1949, and which was allowed to remain in place after Israel regained control of the site in 1967. It is not the same Islamic Council "that has administered the site since the 12th century." To imply such continuity is to ignore the historical reality of the region.
Given the complexity of the situation, one would hope for more accurate information on the context of the region.
20
A. Poor Miri Regev. Attempting to reset the agenda of the state's monetary support for Ashkenzai, left-wing elite's cultural dominating forces. Who does she think she is, representing the democratically-elected government? Representing all tax-payers? Representing all sections of Israel's populace?
(that was satirical if some thin otherwise. one never knows)
B. As for Mahmoud Darwish being "pre-eminent", well someone who calls for Israelis to be taken out of their graves, among other calls of elimination, physical and otherwise, including his membership in the PLO Executive already in 1987 (before it supposedly accepted a 'two-state solution', would seem, except in Ms. Margalit's eyes, to be too eminent as an enemy of Zionism. Israel need not fund or grant recognition to those seeking its disappearance.
(that definitely was not satirical)
(that was satirical if some thin otherwise. one never knows)
B. As for Mahmoud Darwish being "pre-eminent", well someone who calls for Israelis to be taken out of their graves, among other calls of elimination, physical and otherwise, including his membership in the PLO Executive already in 1987 (before it supposedly accepted a 'two-state solution', would seem, except in Ms. Margalit's eyes, to be too eminent as an enemy of Zionism. Israel need not fund or grant recognition to those seeking its disappearance.
(that definitely was not satirical)
17
I am a rare sabra hybrid of Ashkenazi/Sephardic/Ethiopian/Catholic roots - And yet, had to leave Israel years ago to avoid the typical nightmare characteristics Regev embodies that are unfortunately typical in that small patch of the world. No news here.
Both Palestinians and Jewish communities in the region are warm, funny, kind, brave beautiful people. This is painfully tragic for folks like me who continue to pray for the peace of Jerusalem, my hometown. One day, Inshallah!
Both Palestinians and Jewish communities in the region are warm, funny, kind, brave beautiful people. This is painfully tragic for folks like me who continue to pray for the peace of Jerusalem, my hometown. One day, Inshallah!
5
I don't know Regev, but some of the featured uncivilized remarks seem awfully like Trump's, with the sole aim to provoke. One has to wonder how she could ever get anything done?
6
i'm with voyageur, i learned a lot about the social/political landscape of israel from this article. the nyt should get ms margalit to write more about the economic/political/social underpinnings and goings on in israel. ms regev sounds like a comer and a combo trump/clinton that bibi would do well to watch. i do think that being a politician in israel is the big leagues and tough. all your constituents are, active, smart as whips, well educated, highly verbal, outspoken, strongly opinionated, have healthy egos, are verbal as all get out and suffer fools not even a little. oy, can you imagine? i do believe that the israeli's would have blown a mendacious, dangerous, uninformed, incompetent, buffoon like trump out of the water well before he even tried to enter national level politics.
1
The standard and universal definition of colonialism involves forced entry and domination by by Aliens of the indigenous population of a land.
That unequivocally applies to the establishment of Israel I'm Palestine.
As a colony Israel is bound to be liberated by the legetimate population of the land it colonized........as with all colonies all over the world!
That unequivocally applies to the establishment of Israel I'm Palestine.
As a colony Israel is bound to be liberated by the legetimate population of the land it colonized........as with all colonies all over the world!
3
The existence of Jewish communities in the land pressuring the Arab invasion of the 7th century makes Israeli Jews a returning presence, not colonizers. Jewish children ask over the world can read the 2,000 year old Dead Sea Scrolls in the same language that their ancestors used.
10
Exactly, Omar. That's why the Arab conquest of historical Jewish land in the 7th Century, the willful construction of a mosque on top of the holiest site in Judaism and the imposition of a jizya tax on Jews for not converting to Islam could be construed as a war crime. Not to mention Jordan's Arab Legion expelling every Jew, destroying every synagogue, and desecrating every Jewish cemetery in any territory that came under its control in 1948.
16
So the Jews from Arab countries who were forced out of expelled from their lands are colonizers? Wow
5
All the justice in the world for the Mizrahis and no justice for the Palestinians. Right on. She's an opportunist. It's as simple as that.
5
One has to be suspect of anti-establishment authoritarian politicians. It is good Miri Regev challenges to status quo, but to what end? It cannot be just to reshape Israel in her own image to satisfy her own ego.
1
The greatest danger to Israel is from Miri and those of her ilk. Her ultimate motivation is an almost pathological hatred of Ashkenazi Jews, who she, and other militant Mizrahim sometimes refer to as Ashke-Nazis. The foundation of Israel's legitimacy is that it is the "National Homeland of the Jewish Nation". which has the same right to self determination in the form of an independent sovereign state as every other nation does. She and her cohorts want to transform Israel into the Orthodox Jewish Homeland. Since at least half of world Jewry is not Orthodox, this means such an Israel would no longer be the national home for all Jews, but only for some of them. At that point, bye bye whatever legitimacy it still has, and hello sanctions. From there to its final demise is a short journey.
Mizrahi grievances are justified. The Ashkenazi establishment which ran the country as its private fief for thirty years, and is still over-represented in academia, the judicial system, the financial industry, the media, and other power centers. Vehemently secular, they insisted Mizrahi Jews shed their traditional cultural identities and become secular Ashkenazim, albeit ones of a darker hue. The establishment was not shy about using its total control of the country and its economy to bully them into shedding their traditional cultural identity. Regev and her allies have to decide what's more important, revenge on the Ashkenazim for past wrongs, or the future of the country.
Mizrahi grievances are justified. The Ashkenazi establishment which ran the country as its private fief for thirty years, and is still over-represented in academia, the judicial system, the financial industry, the media, and other power centers. Vehemently secular, they insisted Mizrahi Jews shed their traditional cultural identities and become secular Ashkenazim, albeit ones of a darker hue. The establishment was not shy about using its total control of the country and its economy to bully them into shedding their traditional cultural identity. Regev and her allies have to decide what's more important, revenge on the Ashkenazim for past wrongs, or the future of the country.
7
Too emotive with too much hyperbole and exaggeration to be of any help to the debate.
6
Miri Regev is an embarassment to an Israeli society that holds cultural expression, creative achievements in high esteem. A young country that has made amazing strides in the field of music, art, dance, movie-making in a relative short while. The cultural minister has insisted on stirring up ethnic differences and in short, is doing her best to cause internal strife in a people who have come to terms with their cultural differences and made remarkable strides in this regard. No doubt that the distribution of public funds needs to be fair and giving precedence to the weaker groups , but to inflame and act aggressively has defeated the purpose.
3
Times: 'To do so, she [Regev] has issued new criteria for the allocation of state funds for cultural institutions. These include a clause that gives the government the power to punish acts of “delegitimization of the state” — burning the Israeli flag during a play, for example ...'
What play and what punishment? Readers should not be forced to do their own research to compensate for the Times's vagueness.
2016-10-21 17:02:01 UTC
What play and what punishment? Readers should not be forced to do their own research to compensate for the Times's vagueness.
2016-10-21 17:02:01 UTC
3
Regev's big mistake is trying to fix something that shouldn't be in existence to begin with. I'm surprised that an American newspaper didn't ask a simple question, that leads to a simple conclusion:
1. Who is the American Secretary of Culture?
2. How do all the poor artists in Hollywood and Broadway support themselves without government agency?
3. How do they even know what's "culture" and what is not?
4. Israel must've had a good reason to create a government ministry that manages and polices "culture".
5. Here are my suggestions:
a. Israel, like other western countries, had a failing experiment with state socialism. You like socialism? Here's a good example for what it means. Someone needs to decide what shows and movies poor people should get to see. There you go.
b. Seeing the demographic changes in Israeli society, the old elites needed to fortify their status by ensuring there's one "official" culture.
Simple as that, two reasons to create this redundant ministry and the same two to abolish it and get rid of ALL government interference and taxpayer funding of anything deemed "culture" by government technocrats.
Lets hope Miri Regev is the last minister of culture and sport (yes, someone needs to decide what's sport too).
1. Who is the American Secretary of Culture?
2. How do all the poor artists in Hollywood and Broadway support themselves without government agency?
3. How do they even know what's "culture" and what is not?
4. Israel must've had a good reason to create a government ministry that manages and polices "culture".
5. Here are my suggestions:
a. Israel, like other western countries, had a failing experiment with state socialism. You like socialism? Here's a good example for what it means. Someone needs to decide what shows and movies poor people should get to see. There you go.
b. Seeing the demographic changes in Israeli society, the old elites needed to fortify their status by ensuring there's one "official" culture.
Simple as that, two reasons to create this redundant ministry and the same two to abolish it and get rid of ALL government interference and taxpayer funding of anything deemed "culture" by government technocrats.
Lets hope Miri Regev is the last minister of culture and sport (yes, someone needs to decide what's sport too).
2
"1. Who is the American Secretary of Culture?"
The US has TWO government agencies devoted to "culture":
* National Endowment for the Arts
* National Endowment for the Humanities
They were both established in 1965, they both have a "Chairman", and they both give away money.
The US has TWO government agencies devoted to "culture":
* National Endowment for the Arts
* National Endowment for the Humanities
They were both established in 1965, they both have a "Chairman", and they both give away money.
8
I hate to break it to you, but the Smithsonian is not self financed. Nor are many other cultural institutions. I will grant you that they have all had to get a lot more creative about financing. Both Reagan in the US and Thatcher in Britain have started applying tremendous pressure on these institutions on self financing.
Moreover in a small country like Israel these films would never get made. I don't think the films you referenced glorified violence. But rather help us all have greater insight as to how these decisions transpire.
The question you should be asking is not about whether socialism works as a system of government; but rather, do theocracies work as a basis for statehood?
Moreover in a small country like Israel these films would never get made. I don't think the films you referenced glorified violence. But rather help us all have greater insight as to how these decisions transpire.
The question you should be asking is not about whether socialism works as a system of government; but rather, do theocracies work as a basis for statehood?
1
I'm Canadian. We have a publicly funded state broadcaster, a Minister of Heritage and provincial ministers of culture. We have an Arts council that decides funding. So I imagine do most states. The U S does not because you are the imperial Western culture, overtaking others and not fending off cultural intrusion. You also are a large country and your cultural products are all over the world so your arts don't need financial support. Canada does not fund productions which go against its core values - the difference is, as a Liberal, you would approve these. For example, Canadians would be outraged if a television series was funded denigrating First Nations. A minister who pulled funding would be applauded. But the principle is indentical. People should think about that
3
There is no censorship of art, media or expression in Israel. Regev and most Israelis object to provide government funds to institutions that call for the elimination of Israel and support terrorism. For example, the average American will object to the Voice of America being used for anti US propaganda. On the other hand, the voice of the Israeli Army, Galei-Zahal, is programmatically independent and broadcasts predominantly Leftist anti-government programs. This station is financed by the Defense Ministry. Many in Israel would like the station to leave the patronage of the government and get its funding as a commercial station. In the recent decades, the phenomena of the government financing movies and shows that portray terrorists as sensitive freedom fighters became overwhelming. Hopefully, Regev will bring some sanity to this misuse of public funds.
7
The major cause of tension and extremism, not only in the Middle East region but in the whole world, is Israeli Palestinian conflict.
Solving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict would take away much of the motivation for terrorism and the radicalization of Muslims in the World. Everyone's been saying that for years. We should start sending security bills to Tel-Aviv.
The mother of all terrorism in the World is the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. There was no ISIS, Al Qaeda, Taliban, Hezbollah, or even Hamas before the invention of Israel. Israel was created by Irgun and Gangstern Zionist terrorists, led by Manahem Begin who later became Israel’s P.M.
Solving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict would take away much of the motivation for terrorism and the radicalization of Muslims in the World. Everyone's been saying that for years. We should start sending security bills to Tel-Aviv.
The mother of all terrorism in the World is the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. There was no ISIS, Al Qaeda, Taliban, Hezbollah, or even Hamas before the invention of Israel. Israel was created by Irgun and Gangstern Zionist terrorists, led by Manahem Begin who later became Israel’s P.M.
2
The foundation of Israel had nothing to do with religious strife in the Balkans, or the postwar European betrayal of the Arabs, or the ongoing Turkish slaughter of their own ethnic and religious minorities. Israel was founded as a reaction to hate and murder, not as some colonial venture. The disgusting anti-Semitism we're witnessing in the UK, France and Scandinavia is driving Israeli nationalism and will necessarily result in a larger Israeli footprint and a poorer Europe.
8
Sorry Tony, while I agree that the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is a contributing cause to Islamic extremism, the claim that there would be no Islamic terrorist groups like ISIS, al Qaeda and Taliban but for that conflict is reductionist nonsense. For implicit in such a claim is the belief that the violence on the part of those groups would disappear if Israels acceded to all of the demands of Palestinians. If you believe such groups would abandon terrorism if Israel suddenly decided to recognize the legal and moral rights of Palestinians or Israel ceased to exist as a Jewish state, you probably also believe in the tooth fairy.
You might want to take a look at the actual words and deeds of groups like ISIS, al Qaeda and the Taliban. They actual attention the Israeli-Palestinian conflict receives by them might best be characterized as lip service. Instead, the alleged decadence and imperialism of the infidel West, sins of apostate Shia Muslims, and the corruption and misrule of Arab leaders serve much more as the motives for and targets of their hate-filled violence.
Your argument seems more reasonable when limited to groups like Hezbollah and Hamas, particularly the latter for which the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is the sine qua non of its existence. It is simple-minded to attribute all Middle Eastern terrorism to that conflict. Sadly, we will likely never know how much of the terrorism is driven by the conflict because Israelis have no serious interest in ending it.
You might want to take a look at the actual words and deeds of groups like ISIS, al Qaeda and the Taliban. They actual attention the Israeli-Palestinian conflict receives by them might best be characterized as lip service. Instead, the alleged decadence and imperialism of the infidel West, sins of apostate Shia Muslims, and the corruption and misrule of Arab leaders serve much more as the motives for and targets of their hate-filled violence.
Your argument seems more reasonable when limited to groups like Hezbollah and Hamas, particularly the latter for which the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is the sine qua non of its existence. It is simple-minded to attribute all Middle Eastern terrorism to that conflict. Sadly, we will likely never know how much of the terrorism is driven by the conflict because Israelis have no serious interest in ending it.
4
The Israeli NGO B'Tselem recently spoke at the United Nations on settlements and the Israeli Ambassador in New York called it "diplomatic terror." This is one of the organizations targeted by the group Im Tirtzu mentioned in the article. Netanyahu later approved having the NGO pulled off a list of groups that Israelis can serve with when performing national duties and the Israeli Ambassador, speaking Wednesday at the Security Council tried to lump the group into the broadly defined UN bias inflicting the international organization -- he did not mention settlements once in his remarks.
I get it, Israel is in a tough neighborhood and the Palestinians are a frustrated people many Israelis feel they cannot trust. However, the Palestinians are clearly the weaker party and it is beginning to look like any sort of negotiated peace plan was never the sincere intention of Israel. I'm not quite sure where along the way we gave up the moral high ground in favor of taking more ground.
I get it, Israel is in a tough neighborhood and the Palestinians are a frustrated people many Israelis feel they cannot trust. However, the Palestinians are clearly the weaker party and it is beginning to look like any sort of negotiated peace plan was never the sincere intention of Israel. I'm not quite sure where along the way we gave up the moral high ground in favor of taking more ground.
1
The Palestinian Arabs have purposefully made themselves the "weaker party". For example, when Yasir Arafat took control of the PLO he sent out any foreign medical clinics from the West Bank but did not build any domestic ones to fill the people's need. Thus he suddenly made the people there dependent upon Israel and set the stage for humanitarian crises when they could not get to treatment quickly enough. This willingness to let the Arab people suffer so as to create pressure on Israel has also been a component of the policy of requiring them to live in refugee camps for 7 decades.
The P.A. is physically weaker but politically stronger. Israel is always making concessions and proposals, the P.A. has always been the veto. The end to the conflict lies in their hands.
Even if Israel gave them the "1967 lines" there is no reason to believe that the conflict would end. Both Arafat and Mahmoud Abbas have said so. We also have to wonder why, if Arabs can live alongside Jews in Haifa and Tel Aviv, why can't they live with Jews in towns in the West Bank? Why do we accept the ethnic cleansing of an Arab state as being normal?
The P.A. is physically weaker but politically stronger. Israel is always making concessions and proposals, the P.A. has always been the veto. The end to the conflict lies in their hands.
Even if Israel gave them the "1967 lines" there is no reason to believe that the conflict would end. Both Arafat and Mahmoud Abbas have said so. We also have to wonder why, if Arabs can live alongside Jews in Haifa and Tel Aviv, why can't they live with Jews in towns in the West Bank? Why do we accept the ethnic cleansing of an Arab state as being normal?
7
Miri Regev is work in progress. She is passionate and is capable of quite diverse views. I am by lineage Ashkenaz but emotionally Misrachi and also a lover of Sefarad, Spain. I also have long believed that the future of Israel can only be a a Middle Eastern not as an European or North American "outpost". We must return to our true roots and spurn the shame of the diaspora and its assimilationist tendencies. We must accept that our future lies in goof relations with our Arab cousins, no matter how long it takes and it will take time but we must achieve this goal. The Sephardic Chief Rabbi hit the nail on the head when he said a few days ago that although they have not been our friends we must help and pray for our long suffering Syrian cousins in their desperate struggle to live in peace and freedom. The Middle East and Maghreb was made into a nightmare region by European and later American colonial interference and which also stirred up the enmity between Jew and Arab. Miri Regev embodies all the conflicting feelings of an emerging younger generation of leaders who passionately defend the State while at the same time desiring a community of interest with out Arab cousins both in and outside Israel. There will be no progress and true independence for Jew and Arab until all realise that united they are indestructible but divided they will be exploited and vulnerable for ever.
7
Having visited Israel two years ago, I can't claim that I know everything about it but I always felt that there was a certain under current rift. This was especially true between secular and religious Jews. This article exposes that rift to a certain degree. What with all the regional fights between Sunni and Shia, I sincerely hope that these differences in Judaism, don't escalate to the same level as those in Islam. That would be catastrophic for Israel and the Jewish people. I must add that I enjoyed my visit to Israel.
2
"Ashkenazi" means German, and Yiddish is a partly German language. It is no surprise to me that the musical Ashkenazi with their operas and symphonies are treating themselves as the cultural elite in Israel. It's been the same here in the U.S. since the huge waves of German immigration in the 1840s. Who founded all of the symphony orchestras in the U.S.? The Germans. Who founded the conservatories in Russia? The Germans. Who founded the discipline of musicology? The Germans. The result of all this activity is that Germanic composers like Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven, Schubert, Schumann, Mendlessohn, Brahms, etc. are revered in this country over American composers. It is no surprise that Regev, whatever her faults, is trying to promote home-grown Jewish music and culture. Similarly, since for the last half-century Americans have been turning from classical Germanic music towards jazz, rock, country, and bluegrass.
5
This has nothing to do with American Jews, with the occupation or with Syria. This is about people living in a country that 'eats its citizens', pitting them against each other. Jews against Muslims, Ashkenazi against Mizrahi, secular against religious. But on the ground we all know that we have to live together and, difficult as it is, we are still living together. So now its the season of the Mizrahi, fine. After that it will be someone else's season. And then, finally, everyone's. After all, we are all Israelis, we enjoy a good fight.
7
So sad to see a democratic state that Israel was founded to be is lurching ever closer to an authoritarian theocracy that a lot of its founders escaped from
5
Minister Regev is, in "real life", married to an Ashkenazi aerospace engineer. Their three grown "mixed" children represent the next generation of Israelis. Her political positions, however, represent those of her supporters - as much as I personally may repute them - and are what helped her party get re-elected the last time.
7
I fail to see why politics dictates what culture is one way or the other.
How one feels and expresses those feelings through art should not be repressed by ideological or political extremes.
I find it ironic that the country that receives the most financial aid from the US does not respect the 1st amendment in the same way.
How one feels and expresses those feelings through art should not be repressed by ideological or political extremes.
I find it ironic that the country that receives the most financial aid from the US does not respect the 1st amendment in the same way.
1
They respect freedom of speech - and of everything else - a whole lot more than it's respected in Egypt, or Lebanon or Jordan or Turkey. Any rational, unethical government would have simply seized the Temple Mount and expelled all of the Arabs from jerusalem altogether.
7
Although rough around the edges, Ms. Regev is redressing wrongs and asserting sovereignty, both of which are long overdue. Despite the lack of sophistication, she challenges those subtle and sometimes overt efforts to delegitimize the existence of Israel and Jewish tradition, both of which are an anathema to the Israeli and Western Left. Sometimes windows need to be broken in order to let in the fresh air.
2
You take every opportunity to paint Regev as an extremist but sugarcoat the views of the Odeh and Zoabi. Only Jews can be considered "maximalist" for wanting not to be forbidden to pray on their holy site; they're not even asking for equality!
8
She didn't seem to talk much about culture or art itself. Just another politician. But you would think her outsider status or understanding of Mizrahi culture/history would make her more open to a two-state solution.
1
To all the Mizrahim who are contemptuous of the Ashkenazim:
Were it not for Ashkenazi Jews (e.g., Theodore Herzl, Chaim Weizmann), there would be no Israel. The Zionist movement started in Europe at a time when the Mizrahim could see no further than the Arab countries they lived in.
Think about that when you demonize your fellow Jews.
Were it not for Ashkenazi Jews (e.g., Theodore Herzl, Chaim Weizmann), there would be no Israel. The Zionist movement started in Europe at a time when the Mizrahim could see no further than the Arab countries they lived in.
Think about that when you demonize your fellow Jews.
3
Cultural fascism is alive and well in Israel of all places and in the form of a pretty lady who wears the jackboots of funding to cut off or allow artistic production. Strength is in the diversity of opinions and views, not suppression and demonizing. Democratic and free? Sounds more totalitarian to me.
7
In a country with freedom of speech, unpleasant views circulate openly. Despite the fact that Israel is the most hated country on earth, free speech thrives there.
6
This put me in a quandary.
I was perfectly happy hating the Donald, but she is strong competition.
I was perfectly happy hating the Donald, but she is strong competition.
3
There is an amazing amount of venom, much of which doesn't even mention Mrs. Regev, in many of these comments. This article turned over a rock, and look what crawled out: Anti-Semitism very thinly disguised as criticism of Israeli government policy.
Somehow these commenters never think about the illegal Chinese occupation of Tibet, the millions of Han Chinese settled there to Sinicise a country with an entirely different culture and language. The Chinese government doesn't have the justification of self-defense: no Tibetan has ever been a terrorist, nor did Tibet, when it was independent, ever threaten to invade or promise to destroy China. Nor does any Chinese who opposes this policy have the right to speak, write, or vote against the government that carries it out, unlike the vigorous dissent in Israel (look at the B'Tsalem web site). China is only one of dozens of countries occupying chunks of their neighbors and settling their citizens there, But somehow only Israel is criticized, and in intemperate language.
What would you call this?
Somehow these commenters never think about the illegal Chinese occupation of Tibet, the millions of Han Chinese settled there to Sinicise a country with an entirely different culture and language. The Chinese government doesn't have the justification of self-defense: no Tibetan has ever been a terrorist, nor did Tibet, when it was independent, ever threaten to invade or promise to destroy China. Nor does any Chinese who opposes this policy have the right to speak, write, or vote against the government that carries it out, unlike the vigorous dissent in Israel (look at the B'Tsalem web site). China is only one of dozens of countries occupying chunks of their neighbors and settling their citizens there, But somehow only Israel is criticized, and in intemperate language.
What would you call this?
23
I'd call it "confusion on your part".
Commenters in this thread aren't discussing the Chinese occupation of Tibet because the thread follows an article about a leader in ISRAEL who enthusiastically embraces the Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory.
I was part of a demonstration in Los Angeles that called for Tibetan independence nearly a decade and a half before I even really clued in to the fact that Israel was doing the same thing to Palestinians. I've actively supported the Dalai Lama's mission. I assertively questioned academics WHILE I WAS IN CHINA about Tibet (they couldn't really give me a satisfactory answer as it was clearly above their pay grade and party affiliation).
Perhaps a reread of the article for content and relevance is in order before you make assumptions that I or anyone else here is pro-Chinese and anti-Israeli just because we don't bash China in a thread about ISRAEL.
Commenters in this thread aren't discussing the Chinese occupation of Tibet because the thread follows an article about a leader in ISRAEL who enthusiastically embraces the Israeli occupation of Palestinian territory.
I was part of a demonstration in Los Angeles that called for Tibetan independence nearly a decade and a half before I even really clued in to the fact that Israel was doing the same thing to Palestinians. I've actively supported the Dalai Lama's mission. I assertively questioned academics WHILE I WAS IN CHINA about Tibet (they couldn't really give me a satisfactory answer as it was clearly above their pay grade and party affiliation).
Perhaps a reread of the article for content and relevance is in order before you make assumptions that I or anyone else here is pro-Chinese and anti-Israeli just because we don't bash China in a thread about ISRAEL.
1
You gotta love the old false equivalence argument. The last time I checked, the U.S. was not giving 3-4 billion dollars a year to to China in order to maintain their occupation of Tibet.
3
I would call it "whataboutery."
While the history of Ashkenazi elitism in Israel is real, Ms. Regev takes advantage of it for her own purposes. Her motives are not simply to rebalance the allocation of cultural funds, but to prioritize those outlets which she sees as ideologically incorrect. While the left in Israel is typically identified with the secular Ashkenazi elite, that's also a convenient target. She applies political litmus tests for funding, and uses her own contempt for culture (including such figures as Bialik) as a weapon.
6
Israelis are very lucky to have women like Miri Regev - powerful, intelligent, and courageous.
12
At it's most basic level, this is an issue of "corrective discrimination".
Regev speaks for specific ethnic groups in Israeli society who are traditionally outside of the mainstream and "elite" cultural context. It comes down to how well you execute on so called affirmative action. Done right, it is corrective. Beneficial. But as most Americans know, it can become a blunt, shattering tool.
Regev is not about subtleties. She's first and foremost a calculating politician and only then a reformer. She limits her "corrective" measures to a narrow group of constituents that could have otherwise benefited from her methods (e.g. Jews of North African descent but not Israeli Arabs).
What's especially troubling is that Regev couldn't cares less about a well balanced cultural and arts supporting strategy. One that takes into account a tapestry of styles, ethnicities, social geographies. One that should also include internationally recognized arts and culture fore thinkers, many of whom are a distinctly urban "creative class" whom she likes to call the "Elites".
Regev is throwing the baby with the bathwater.
Regev speaks for specific ethnic groups in Israeli society who are traditionally outside of the mainstream and "elite" cultural context. It comes down to how well you execute on so called affirmative action. Done right, it is corrective. Beneficial. But as most Americans know, it can become a blunt, shattering tool.
Regev is not about subtleties. She's first and foremost a calculating politician and only then a reformer. She limits her "corrective" measures to a narrow group of constituents that could have otherwise benefited from her methods (e.g. Jews of North African descent but not Israeli Arabs).
What's especially troubling is that Regev couldn't cares less about a well balanced cultural and arts supporting strategy. One that takes into account a tapestry of styles, ethnicities, social geographies. One that should also include internationally recognized arts and culture fore thinkers, many of whom are a distinctly urban "creative class" whom she likes to call the "Elites".
Regev is throwing the baby with the bathwater.
2
Appears to be a detailed and thoughtful biographical portrait of a significant figure in Israeli politics. Also a compelling argument for ending American assistance until Israel returns to the 1948 borders established by the United Nations. Channel the funds we give to Israel to fund aggressive military hardware and healthcare for its population instead to human and capital investment in the occupied territories. Frankly I could care less whether different cultural groups within Israel want to fight with each other over spicy soup, music, and whose poet reads poetry where. That is Israeli business. I do care when the ambitions and fantasies of Israelis put regional peace and security at risk, especially if they seek to use my tax dollars to pay for it. The biggest mistake the United Nations has ever made was to establish the nation of Israel in Palestine; it should have been established in Europe. OK, that is a done deal as far as the 1948 boundaries are concerned but we should not be paying for Israeli cultural imperialism outside the original boundaries. Worse still when we support an anti-democratic system while we tell others in the Middle East they should embrace democracy.
18
There hasn't been a major invasion of Israel since 1973 because Israel is strong thanks to our aid. We've saved thousands of people from being killed, wounded or displaced.
7
No 1948 borders exist. The arabs rejected the partition plan and what remained after the war was a cease-fire line that did not resemble the partition lines. Best you can say is that Israel and Egypt and Israel and Jordan have agreed to peace treaties that included defined borders between the countries. And in Jordan's case it the border between Jordan and Israel was demarcated by the Jordan river and in Egypt's case the border was demarcated by the western side of Gaza. So if you want to go back to the post-1948 war and pre-1967 war lines, then Jordan gets the west bank back and Egypt gets Gaza back as those countries ruled the west bank and Gaza respectively. It gets very tiresome having to repeat over and over that there were no agreed upon boarders after 1948 until well into the 1980s/1990s and at that time it was clear that Egypt and Jordan wanted nothing to do with the palestinians living in the west bank and Gaza. BTW, the PLO was formed in 1964, a number of years before the 1967 war. Since Jordan ruled over the west bank and Egypt ruled over Gaza what land exactly was the Palestine Liberation Organization attempting to liberate in 1964? Not the west bank nor Gaza. The PLO agreed that those two land areas were off the table. It's not a question of supporting Israel here, it's a question of a false narrative.
12
What 1948 borders are you referring to? The 1947 UN Partition Plan that was rejected by the Arab peoples? The 1949 Armistice Line that was rejected as a border by the Arab League in both 1949 and 1965, when Israeli P.M. Levi Eshkol once again offered to have it established as the border of Israel? Bear in mind the facts no one was talking about a Palestinian State at that time, and that there had not been any such entity prior to that.
The location of the State of Israel was based on the historical ties of the Jewish people to the land, along with the presence of ancient Jewish communities there. The fact that nearly half of the Jews living in Israel are from the Middle East does not seem to shake the remarkably inappropriate belief that somehow the Jews are native to Europe or belong there more than in their historic homeland. The Jewish community has managed to maintain a cultural identity despite being scattered all over the world, and Jewish schoolchildren from any country can recognize the letters used to write the Dead Sea Scrolls from over 2,000 years ago.
Compared to the despotic governments of the surrounding Arab countries, Israel is a beacon of democracy. While no democracy is perfect, none faces the constant and shrill criticism of Israel. Even within America there have been voices against burning the American flag, and the government cut funding to the NEA when they did not like the art. Only Israel is accused of fascism for doing so.
The location of the State of Israel was based on the historical ties of the Jewish people to the land, along with the presence of ancient Jewish communities there. The fact that nearly half of the Jews living in Israel are from the Middle East does not seem to shake the remarkably inappropriate belief that somehow the Jews are native to Europe or belong there more than in their historic homeland. The Jewish community has managed to maintain a cultural identity despite being scattered all over the world, and Jewish schoolchildren from any country can recognize the letters used to write the Dead Sea Scrolls from over 2,000 years ago.
Compared to the despotic governments of the surrounding Arab countries, Israel is a beacon of democracy. While no democracy is perfect, none faces the constant and shrill criticism of Israel. Even within America there have been voices against burning the American flag, and the government cut funding to the NEA when they did not like the art. Only Israel is accused of fascism for doing so.
9
Opposes freedom of speech if the opinion is contrary to current public policy? Using her office to further her political career? No intention to compromise and govern fairly.
Just what the world needs. Another awful person in a position of authority.
Just what the world needs. Another awful person in a position of authority.
93
Spoken by someone who does not live in a neighborhood that is surrounded by maniacal juntas intent on slaughtering every man, woman and child in that neighborhood.
4
You got it just right Bily. That's the exact situation. And I would like to make it clear that the Israeli Artists are suffering under Miri Regev Regime- Both freedom of speech and expression are in a great danger for Israeli Artists.
Further more, many of them fear to speak out after Regev made sure they be hunted by the public. thus, anyone who dare speak out his mind, is being hunted.
I call on Bibi Netanyahu to remove this woman from the chair.
Further more, many of them fear to speak out after Regev made sure they be hunted by the public. thus, anyone who dare speak out his mind, is being hunted.
I call on Bibi Netanyahu to remove this woman from the chair.
Over and above the portrait of M. Regev, this article provides an excellent insight on Israelis current social and political cultures.
32
It gives you a perhaps a political insight but not a cultural insight but for the fact the both freedom of expression and speech are now facing a great danger. Mrii Regev is using all her power to deprive Artists Human Rights, unless one serves her political agenda.
As of the "Eshkenazi"/"Mizrachi"/"Arb" complex- its just a veil to the real threat- Human Rights Depravation of any artist opposing her political agenda.
This Article does not reflect the Israeli culture, it reflects a culture under the threats of a "General" and why this should never happen.
As of the "Eshkenazi"/"Mizrachi"/"Arb" complex- its just a veil to the real threat- Human Rights Depravation of any artist opposing her political agenda.
This Article does not reflect the Israeli culture, it reflects a culture under the threats of a "General" and why this should never happen.
2
Miri is so proud of her country. What an amazing country and what tough Jews.
32
Yes we are tough, and more so surviving such as militant depriving out freedom of speech and freedom of expression. Would you agree to that ? Can you imagine US Artists are allowed to say only what the Gov. allows them to say, otherwise they may not participate cultural life? That's a human right violation!!!
5
This is the picture of Israel today
One day very soon, the world (with or without the USA) will show Israel what is the unacceptable face of the Zionist entity.
Israeli meddling in affairs of foreign states, unacceptable Israeli violations of international law and Geneva Conventions through apartheid and illegal settlement construction in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, unacceptable. Israeli violation of the UN Charter, unacceptable violation of existing peace agreements Israel has ALREADY SIGNED like Oslo and the Road Map, unacceptable disrespect of the UN and UN resolutions, the USA, the EU, and the Quartet, and finally, unacceptable disrespect of rulings of it's own High Court related to settlements constructed on privately owned Palestinian land. There will be a cost imposed for these sins, and it will be high.
One day very soon, the world (with or without the USA) will show Israel what is the unacceptable face of the Zionist entity.
Israeli meddling in affairs of foreign states, unacceptable Israeli violations of international law and Geneva Conventions through apartheid and illegal settlement construction in the West Bank and East Jerusalem, unacceptable. Israeli violation of the UN Charter, unacceptable violation of existing peace agreements Israel has ALREADY SIGNED like Oslo and the Road Map, unacceptable disrespect of the UN and UN resolutions, the USA, the EU, and the Quartet, and finally, unacceptable disrespect of rulings of it's own High Court related to settlements constructed on privately owned Palestinian land. There will be a cost imposed for these sins, and it will be high.
1
Israel is a sovereign state and will continue to elect the governments it wants or thinks it needs. On the other hand, characters like Regev do Israel no favors internationally, especially among American Jews, the world’s largest (and most diverse) Jewish community. Whether or not she cares, Regev’s ultra right wing nationalism, pro-military, pro-religious fundamentalism, and pro-settler attitudes are divisive and just don’t play very well here. The reality is that in much less than a century all the oil will be drained from the Middle East, thus making Israel less strategically significant for the U.S. (read: “less foreign military aid”), and making groups like AIPAC much less powerful. Within that same time period, all Holocaust survivors, their children, and many of their grandchildren will be gone, thus further attenuating the “Israel connection.” At the same time American Jews are continuing to intermarry and are not affiliating with synagogues or other Jewish organizations at anything close to the rates of older generations. What all this means is that Diaspora connections with Israel will not only continue to weaken, but may dissipate altogether if angry and divisive people like Regev remain in control, thus leaving Israel even more isolated internationally.
100
Israel is a sovereign state but one where a large minority, approaching half, of the population that is subject to the state's authority is barred from any voice in determining how the state should be run. So, sovereign but structurally undemocratic. That this fundamental political reality should increasingly be reflected in authoritarian and culturtal norms should surprise no one.
1
And Israel abandoned the "peace" process for a "creeping annexation"
process by refusing the 2002 Arab League Peace initiative . No other way to peace. Just to perfection, generous to a fault, an offer Israel has not been able to afford to refuse, and now the chickens are coming home to roost. Israel is not able to hide its grand larceny any longer under its sham cloak of "security", in reality armed robbery, while America stands by holding Israel's coat
process by refusing the 2002 Arab League Peace initiative . No other way to peace. Just to perfection, generous to a fault, an offer Israel has not been able to afford to refuse, and now the chickens are coming home to roost. Israel is not able to hide its grand larceny any longer under its sham cloak of "security", in reality armed robbery, while America stands by holding Israel's coat
2
Jason. Israel's Jewish population is 6,400 000 people.
American jews consist in less then 6 million.
If you say that American Jews are a more diverse population
then the Israeli Jewish one my conclusion is one:
You have never visited Israel.
American jews consist in less then 6 million.
If you say that American Jews are a more diverse population
then the Israeli Jewish one my conclusion is one:
You have never visited Israel.
4
In some ways the political drama in Israel is a preview on a smaller scale of what might happen here were a Trump to be elected. Jingoistic, nationalistic, setting the entitlement and "rights" of the Likud's own special basket of deplorables (hilltop youth, aggressive settlers, ultra-Orthodox sects, etc) ahead of those of more middle-of-the-road Israelis. It says much that Sheldon Adelson finds Netanyahu and Trump both to be to his liking. Regev is Israel's answer to Ann Coulter, or something close to it.
115
When will Israelis love their children more than they love Palestinian land?
And the world continues to wait for the answer...
And the world continues to wait for the answer...
2
How much of Israeli ultra-nationalism is a response to the trauma of the Holocaust? Does this amount to giving Hitler a posthumous voctory?
If not for Miri Regev's military and academic credentials, I would be tempted to characterize her as a female Donald Trump. The Likud has already become an Israeli equivalent of the Tea Party.
If not for Miri Regev's military and academic credentials, I would be tempted to characterize her as a female Donald Trump. The Likud has already become an Israeli equivalent of the Tea Party.
72
Not even close. Israelis simply are tired of Palestinian terror and rejectionism (having rejected EVERY peace proposal ever offered including statehood), continued incitment and vows to one day push the Jews into the sea, and their enablers and people like you who are always ready to make excuses for them. If given the choice between surviving and risking offending the delicate sensitivities of the Left who have convinced themselves they are the bearers of the absolute truth -- and whose nostrums towards Israel so far have proven to be disastrous -- the choice is easy to make.
66
That's not true. Palestine was very close to signing a peace accord in 2009. Guess what happened?
Right. More provocative settlements.
Right. More provocative settlements.
Israelis are subject to much criticism. Why should they have to pay their critics?
3
I love Miri.
28
Yet, Ruth misses the irony here. It's the Ashkenazi wealthy elite -- the arbiters of culture and what should be considered proper politics and thought -- that are the ones who are most contemptuous of the poorer Mizrachim, but the same sector who is always so ready to excuse Palestinian behavior and terror while blaming their own country for everything and anything, and exercise in Left self-flagellation. Just before they go back to their expensive high-rise Tel Aviv condos.
Not much different than the elite in this country who scoff at the racism and ignorance of Trump's so-called deplorables (and who are the market for all the over-priced luxury goods, real estate and art that make up the NY Times advertising base), just before they go off to their lily-white beach house area in the Hamptons.
Perhaps Ruth should also ask why is it the Jewish refugees -- not immigrants -- and their descendants from Muslim countries are the most hawkish when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. Do they know something their rich Ashkenazi countrymen who can hole up in high security condos in Tel Aviv don't?
Not much different than the elite in this country who scoff at the racism and ignorance of Trump's so-called deplorables (and who are the market for all the over-priced luxury goods, real estate and art that make up the NY Times advertising base), just before they go off to their lily-white beach house area in the Hamptons.
Perhaps Ruth should also ask why is it the Jewish refugees -- not immigrants -- and their descendants from Muslim countries are the most hawkish when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. Do they know something their rich Ashkenazi countrymen who can hole up in high security condos in Tel Aviv don't?
59
It's Ms. Margalit to you--unless you are friends.
23
Really appreciate your comment. Formality, roundly frowned upon or ignored in all manner of electronic communication, creates at least a modicum of respect between people. That's something in short supply these days, even in the relative civility of these pages.
JW, don't be alarmed. The residents of Tel Aviv are not warm toward Palestinians and their rights. Tel Aviv hardly knows they exist.
2
"These communities immigrated to Israel in mass waves after its founding in 1948 and into the early 1950s, upending its demographic makeup..."
"Immigrated"? You mean 800,000 Jewish refugees fleeing Arab countries giving up their possessions and in some cases fleeing for their lives due to the intense antisemitic hate generated by Israel's victory in 1948, that is. (so much for anti-Zionism is not antisemitism) Jewish families who had lived in these Muslim lands for centuries including those who descended from Jews ethnically cleansed by the Romans from the Land of Israel, and some even tracing back to the Babylonian exile.
Why can't you describe this accurately, Ruth? Or is it the Palestinian narrative of 750,000 hapless Arabs, I mean Palestinians, uh I mean indigenous descendants of the Canaanites all fleeing the big bad Jews, uh I mean Zionists the only narrative the NY Times will allow because it's too complicated and diluting of a good story, otherwise?
"Immigrated"? You mean 800,000 Jewish refugees fleeing Arab countries giving up their possessions and in some cases fleeing for their lives due to the intense antisemitic hate generated by Israel's victory in 1948, that is. (so much for anti-Zionism is not antisemitism) Jewish families who had lived in these Muslim lands for centuries including those who descended from Jews ethnically cleansed by the Romans from the Land of Israel, and some even tracing back to the Babylonian exile.
Why can't you describe this accurately, Ruth? Or is it the Palestinian narrative of 750,000 hapless Arabs, I mean Palestinians, uh I mean indigenous descendants of the Canaanites all fleeing the big bad Jews, uh I mean Zionists the only narrative the NY Times will allow because it's too complicated and diluting of a good story, otherwise?
125
A French philosopher once opined that a nation was simply any group of people with a common set of prejudices and a shared misunderstanding of their history.
Sounds about right.
Sounds about right.
1
Theres always antisemitism behind every word isnt there? It must get tiring always being on the defensive.
Since France still controlled Morocco, Algeria, and Tunisia in the early 1950s, Jews immigrating from there to Israel could hardly be called "fleeing." In Iraq and Egypt the Jewish Agency was instrumental in using terrorist acts against these states that would be blamed on the indigenous Jewish population, thus causing these ancient communities to flee. Israel in the 1940s-50s needed more Jews.
Moreover, the Israeli government of the 1950s employed Mizrahi Jews as a cheap labor force for many years, until they were replaced by Palestinians after 1967.
Moreover, the Israeli government of the 1950s employed Mizrahi Jews as a cheap labor force for many years, until they were replaced by Palestinians after 1967.
Both major Jewish denominations seem to be at odds with each other slightly less than they are with the indigenous legetimate population of the land they colonized in 1948 an,d 1967,
For aliens and colons only one thing brings them together : their common triumphalism cum their common racism against the indigenous population, some,very few, regretting their common predicament of having to live as colons both in Palestine and in the region
Region wide and particularly in Palestine this situation reflects in a certain way the predicament of French colons in Algeria pre independence with the Israeli Cuture minister replicating the manoeuvresof the piends noirs in Algeria!
Jews in the Levant and in Palestine can only ,historically, survive as an alien community should they reject assimilation but never as a sovereign state as it inevitably will come to be ..
For aliens and colons only one thing brings them together : their common triumphalism cum their common racism against the indigenous population, some,very few, regretting their common predicament of having to live as colons both in Palestine and in the region
Region wide and particularly in Palestine this situation reflects in a certain way the predicament of French colons in Algeria pre independence with the Israeli Cuture minister replicating the manoeuvresof the piends noirs in Algeria!
Jews in the Levant and in Palestine can only ,historically, survive as an alien community should they reject assimilation but never as a sovereign state as it inevitably will come to be ..
12
Sure, Omar. Why can't the Jews learn to live with each other like the Arabs do. Just look at how well Sunnis and Shiites get along. Why can't the Jews do the same? And what a pleasure that restores your faith in the human race seeing how great things are in Syria, Iraq, Yemen, Sudan, Egypt, Algeria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia ...
113
Not only a twisted view of Jews living in the "Promised Land" as colonialists, but a perfect example demonstrating a lack of the slimmest prospect for peace.
It’s not the “occupation”, neither the “settlements”.
It is nothing but the bare existence of a Jewish nation state in its ancient homeland.
When will the New York Times realize it?
It’s not the “occupation”, neither the “settlements”.
It is nothing but the bare existence of a Jewish nation state in its ancient homeland.
When will the New York Times realize it?
59
Actually, let me correct this. Regev is an extremist right wing, and represents a minority of people who have a "Mizrachi" complex. She is trying to oppose her complex on the Israeli society and the majority opposes her. The Majority of the Israeli do not have this Mizrachi/Ashkenazi complex and reject he strong projection over the society. Perhaps she needs some healing.
As of your "indigenous population" claims, let me remind you that Jews were the always part of the indigenous population in Israel. Its time both sides take some responsibility, stop with the finger pointing and see how to resolve this conflict. Both sides should take a step forward to resolve the situation.
Israel is a solid fact, so is palestine. None can deny the other. Respect and be respected is a good start.
As of your "indigenous population" claims, let me remind you that Jews were the always part of the indigenous population in Israel. Its time both sides take some responsibility, stop with the finger pointing and see how to resolve this conflict. Both sides should take a step forward to resolve the situation.
Israel is a solid fact, so is palestine. None can deny the other. Respect and be respected is a good start.
2
As a strong supporter of Israel, I'm tempted to see her as a Josephine McCarthy and wonder if she can see Hezbollah from her front porch. But she clearly is a complex person who should not be so easily pigeonholed. Let's give her a chance. awe always can rip on her later.
14
If she can't, all she has to do is drive north for two hours and she'll certainly be able to see Hezbollah -- who filled in southern Lebanon after another unilateral Israeli withdrawal from the security zone it had there. Another bust courtesy of so-called international opinion and Left ideology.
3
If you support Israel, then you should support the Israeli Artist who are crying out "Help!!!" from her discriminating policies. Be advised, she has been Artist Hunting in Israel and things came to point, many Artists fear to speak out-
I lived in the US, and I can assure you one thing, if you had to confront such a militant oppression over your freedom of speech and expression, both Hollywood and NY would rebel.
I lived in the US, and I can assure you one thing, if you had to confront such a militant oppression over your freedom of speech and expression, both Hollywood and NY would rebel.
We already gave her a chance. It turns she is violating Artist Human Rights further more, her office assist robbing copyrights. If you love Israel, you best support the Israeli Artists who now go through the darkest period ever.
Miri Regev is absolutely correct.
The cultural elite in Tel-Aviv suffers from a sense of entitlement. They claim to be the true representatives of culture in all forms. Maybe, but probably not to the extent that they think so and maybe not at all. But the struggle is not about culture; it is about money and that money is government money, tax-payers money.
If the "elite" want to raise their own money and go their own way and do whatever they want, then fine. Let them, but amazingly they are not able to survive raising their own money. If the government and the tax-payer foot the bill, then the allocations should be a lot more democratic and indeed there should be greater support of the periphery and their cultural institutions as well as Sephardi culture.
I am all for the opera or Ha-Bimah, but let them raise their own money. Let them fund raise. Government support should not be for the strong, even if they need more then they can raise. They should try harder.
And as for her interference in freedom of expression, defecating on an Israeli flag does not seem like art to me so why should I pay. Arab art and culture should be supported but why should the government pay for those who deny the legitimacy of the existence of government or state.
The cultural elite tend to look down at Ms. Regev, relate to her like a buffoon. She holds an MA and is a reserve IDF Brigadier general.
She knows exactly what she is doing and does it well.
Good luck to her.
The cultural elite in Tel-Aviv suffers from a sense of entitlement. They claim to be the true representatives of culture in all forms. Maybe, but probably not to the extent that they think so and maybe not at all. But the struggle is not about culture; it is about money and that money is government money, tax-payers money.
If the "elite" want to raise their own money and go their own way and do whatever they want, then fine. Let them, but amazingly they are not able to survive raising their own money. If the government and the tax-payer foot the bill, then the allocations should be a lot more democratic and indeed there should be greater support of the periphery and their cultural institutions as well as Sephardi culture.
I am all for the opera or Ha-Bimah, but let them raise their own money. Let them fund raise. Government support should not be for the strong, even if they need more then they can raise. They should try harder.
And as for her interference in freedom of expression, defecating on an Israeli flag does not seem like art to me so why should I pay. Arab art and culture should be supported but why should the government pay for those who deny the legitimacy of the existence of government or state.
The cultural elite tend to look down at Ms. Regev, relate to her like a buffoon. She holds an MA and is a reserve IDF Brigadier general.
She knows exactly what she is doing and does it well.
Good luck to her.
36
A reserve brigadier general, so now the Israeli militia actually has, like, military ranks? Here is an idea for the American presidential election: why put Americans in peril in Syria? Call in our $48,000,000,000 in "military aid" to Israel and demand they go into Syria, actually they are already in Syria in the Golan Heights, and save Aleppo and fight ISIL alongside Iran.
As a kid I grew up reading the New York Herald Tribune and the cry to "Unleash Chiang shi Check", Why not unleash Israel?
As a kid I grew up reading the New York Herald Tribune and the cry to "Unleash Chiang shi Check", Why not unleash Israel?
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Better yet, in case of war make you a hostage.
8
Your post makes no sense whatsoever. "Israeli militia"? What are you talking about. It's the Israeli Army. And why should it be sent to Syria? To what end? Ironic that when the United States does not even let Israel fight its own enemies you complain that it should be fighting as an American proxy (which would only inflame the situation). Also, the Golan has been under Israeli control longer than it was under Syrian control.
3