As Long as You Love Me So

Aug 27, 2016 · 54 comments
Jimbo57 (Oceanside NY)
Add me to the relatively easy but most enjoyable camp. LETITSNOW and SEXPISTOLS were welcome gimmes for starters, along with shorter ones like ENO, RONCO (again), and BATPOLE. With KIDDO in place, I confidently entered OIUJA for "means of forecasting" at 23A but it didn't stay there long. Now somebody get me a CREAMSICLE.

SHEB Wooley was on "Rawhide" and did his own recording of the theme song, but he's better known for his huge novelty smash "Purple People Eater," which spent 6 weeks at #1 in 1958. He also recorded comedy records under the name Ben Colder.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DL1ZH0Ke92A
fschoem44 (Somers NY)
ACEE for "18 Fabric finish?" spoiled my NE. GRAB instead of GLOM didn't help either. Thought of POPEIL, but had to look up RONCO. Coming from about 30 deg So. Latitude, "Let it Snow" was not imprinted despite 59 yrs in the US.
Robert Michael Panoff (Durham, NC)
"Wait, there's more..." anyone who does the frequency chart thingy know how often RONCO appeared twice so close together?
Rich in Atlanta (Decatur, Georgia)
RMP, it's only appeared 11 times - 7 times in the Shortz era. Pre-Shortz it was always clued as a type of fish and the answer never appeared twice in the same decade. (1942, 1961, 1970, 1987).

In the Shortz era, it appeared in April and December of 2011; otherwise this is the first time for two appearances in the same year. Will always clues it to the company.
David Connell (Weston CT)
I don't think it can be coincidental that so often one word of fill, sometimes quite a peculiar one, is repeated from the day before. It has been happening very regularly, and to my eye more this year than before. But considering the flow of puzzles through the week, it's hard to imagine how it might be contrived.
Craig (Washington, DC)
Finally getting around to the puzzle - way too tired to start it last night - and I'm glad I waited. This was my fastest Saturday since ACPT, although I had a few quicker ones last year. I agree with whoever said this was breezy. It was a nice smooth fun puzzle.

Incidentally, Deb, regarding the slow-to-load comments on the old blog entries, I find if I add &action=click to the URL, they're immediately available. I don't know if that's the intended behavior, but it gets the job done for me. Maybe that should be added to the links?
Deadline (New York City)
Well, here goes. I hope I manage to get past the emus today.

So. Everyone else got KARAOKE BAR right away, huh? Actually, I got the idea, more or less, right away from the clue. But I was thinking about those piano bars where the customers sing along. Do they still have those? Even after looking at the Ds, all I had was the odd AO in the middle, so I went elsewhere to start my solve.

That elsewhere was NE, which was pretty smooth. I just had to dig out of the memory hole my "God of Carnage"/Shah of Iran mental connection. GLOM was a gimme, and I thought of OZONE HOLE right away. Remembering "LET IT SNOW" was a bonus, and I loved the clue for MARS ROVER.

That gave me the -WER ending, and I was able to remember EISENHOWER's speech (that he gave it, not the speech itself). Some pause deciding between URSA and ASIA, since the STANS didn't occur to me for a very long time.

Really liked SE. Great longies, and I'll forgive the reappearance of RONCO.

SW a bit harder, since I blanked on ETHOS and SWATHE. But getting SPACE CADET and taking a chance on TOTES opened it up. Loved the longies, although I kept trying to remember the parts of the ear for the hammer clue.

I'm guessing a Terrain is a make of car. Ugh.

Which brought me back to NW. Luckily DANA Perino was a gimme, which made me think of REUNE (great clue), and the rest of the sector was putty in my paws. (Didn't know Etta KETT was a teen; I could only think of Archie and company.)

Thanks all.
Barry Ancona (New York, NY)
And the CiC got through!
Rick Box (Glenview, IL)
I liked today's a bunch - STANS was a great one.

Could someone explain how 'GIVES A GLOSS' is ANNOTATES?
Barry Ancona (New York, NY)
Rick Box (Glenview, IL)
Thanks. Completely unfamiliar with that meaning.
John (Chicago)
One of the treats you can get in Maine but hardly anywhere else is lobster stew. You know, milk, cream, lots of melted butter, some seasoning and lots of chunks of lobster. I first tasted it at Portland's Cumberland Club where we hosted the rehearsal dinner for Son # 2's wedding. I thought I had been lucky enough to arrive at Heaven while still alive.
Barry Ancona (New York, NY)
John,
You can find lobster stew at the Oyster Bar at Grand Central Terminal, but I'd much rather have it -- or the whole lobster -- in Maine. I went to the Lobster Festival in Rockland with my parents "a few years ago;" the steamed lobster dinner (with clams, corn, etc.) was two dollars a head. I've enjoyed the oyster stew at the Oyster Bar for over 50 years.
https://www.oysterbarny.com/pdf/dailymenu.pdf
John (Chicago)
Barry, during my NYC commuting days I always found the food at the Oyster Bar in GC to be very good. The thing I won't deny about NYC is that if you ain't good you won't be in business very long.
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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Can't disagree with Barry A. about preferring the seafood in Maine, nor with JFC about the quality of the seafood at the Oyster Bar. It's actually an excellent restaurant in a lot of ways.

I had a couple of co-workers who married each other and moved to the suburbs. SOmetimes that means commuting via Grand Central Terminal (other times they have worked in Westchester, which has a lot of corporate headquarters). So it's convenient, and a treat, to meet for a meal at the Oyster Bar.

The Wife of the couple will have a selection of oysters for dinner; nothing else. She is the person who taught me how to eat raw oysters; I had previously had them steamed.

Barry A., is Rockland not one of the first towns one reaches in Maine after leaving NH? Or is it about an hour north? In any event, my best recollection was that the harbor at Rockland had 2 ships that had run up on rocks and were just left out there to decompose naturally. Kind of an eerie sight.
Mean Old Lady (Conway, Arkansas)
Busy days make me late to the party! This actually went very smoothly, though it was difficult for me to accept GLOM in the puzzle, and I wanted 'fabricATES'....

Then on to the Saturday Stumper, where I have most of it done, but two trouble spots (NW and SE) have me...well, you know. Brad Wilber strikes icy fear into my heart when his name is on the byline.... I may have to resort to Google
John (Chicago)
Tom Corbett is the main character in a series of Tom Corbett — SPACE CADET stories that were depicted in television, radio, books, comic books, comic strips, and other media in the 1950s.

The stories followed the adventures of Corbett and other cadets at the Space Academy as they train to become members of the Solar Guard.

Joseph Lawrence Greene of Grosset & Dunlap developed Tom Corbett, Space Cadet, inspired by the Robert A. Heinlein novel Space Cadet (1948) but based on his own prior work. Greene had submitted a radio script for "Tom Ranger" and the "Space Cadets" on January 16, 1946, but it remained unperformed when Heinlein's novel was published. Greene then reworked his radio script into a script for a daily newspaper adventure strip, which was never produced.

Tom Corbett is one of only six TV series to appear on all four networks of the time (ABC, CBS, NBC and DuMont) along with The Arthur Murray Party, Down You Go, The Ernie Kovacs Show, Pantomime Quiz, and The Original Amateur Hour.

The final broadcast was on June 25, 1955.

The actor who played Tom Corbett was Frankie Thomas, Jr. He beat out Jack Lemmon for the part. He played the mayor in Boys’ Town (1938) with Spencer Tracy and Mickey Rooney but wasn’t asked back for the sequel. That was his last A movie. He was more notable because both his parents lived to 100. Never watched the show.
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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OMG, the reveal makes no sense of my preveal!

The guy's wife was named Virginia; in addition to being an actor, he was a bridge expert. Hence my references to Virginia and "no-trump", which is a variety of bridge contract. (The Wife of JFC plays bridge.)

I had to go that route because Martin had already used the role the guy is known for. I couldn't tell if Bru was prevealing or just socializing.
archaeoprof (Jupiter, FL)
Not easy for me, either, but that could be due to the fact that we hosted a faculty party until after midnight last night. A good time was had by all ...
Lewis (Asheville, NC)
Like others here, I found some clues (KARAOKEBAR, DRUMSTICK, SITINS, PIANOWIRE) and answers (GLOM, SWATHE, CREAMSICLE, and SWEETSPOT) quite pleasurable. I also like the backward NAIVE crossing I_BELIEVE_SO.

There were some quick-to-fill zones and some trudge swaths. The overall experience was of a nice workout, the work of not a Saturday sadist, but of one who, after throwing some significant flak in the way, happily lets the solver win.
Blue Moon (Where Nenes Fly)
These last two puzzles had me googling like a crazed pygmy marmoset. By the way, do you like the new shadowed Google search box? It must have seemed like a good idea, but frankly I am just not getting used to the look.

Sleeping on this one helped a lot, but only up to a point, then the brick wall hit again. Had to think about/look up a number of fill words even after eventually finishing. Sticky, though not gluey, in the SE at the end.

A reapparition of the SNL Jeopardy 40th anniversary skit! (That didn't take long.) The local art house shows "White Christmas" during the holidays, and the theater is filled with white plastic confetti at the end since it gets thrown in the air every time "snow" is mentioned.

"For me, politeness is a sine qua non of civilization." (Hint: MARS)
Deadline (New York City)
Talk about looking it up, you in essence made me Google Google to see this new search box of which you speak.

Mine looks just the same as it always did.
Blue Moon (Where Nenes Fly)
Maybe it's just me.
Johanna (Hamilton, OH)
Great write-up, Deb. And you're right, KARAOKEBAR starts us off with a fun upbeat -- and surprisingly easy -- entry. No complaints here! There was lots of clever misdirection throughout. I was sailing along until I hit that NE corner. I spent most of my time struggling through that tough section. Like others here, GRill before GRATE was not great for my solve. Loved the aha moment at getting MARSROVER.

Very nice Saturday puzzle, thank you, Jim Page!
suejean (Harrogate)
Slightly depressing to find how easy everyone found this. In spite of starting with KARAOKE BAR, I found it quite difficult. Quite a lot of unknowns or couldn't think of. I tried to look up the Lux one, read a couple of pages, but never saw the answer which still means nothing to me. I didn't know the Spanish ¿Qué tal? . I hate missing the language clues. At least I knew SUR.

CREAMSICLE?

Not a total loss. I liked LET IT SNOW, which I got because of the W in EISENHOWER. I thought the clue for OZONE HOLE was very clever, and that I was clever to get that.
Beejay (San Francisco)
SPACE CADET pretty much sums up my solving experience, suejean. This was a toughie for me. I got the idea, but didn't think of KARAOKE. Instead was fixated on the Opera Plaza where servers sing arias. EISENHOWER didn't come to me even with the EI to start. The SQMI must be square miles. Did know REsA, but had it spelled wrong. Did have GRATE, but Grab before GLOM. It didn't SNOW for a long time, but I remembered SHEB Wooley right away. Go figure.
suejean (Harrogate)
Opera Plaza sounds like fun.
dk (Wisconsin)
Space shot! Groan d'jour was ICIER. Smile of the morn was MARSROVER.

IHS along with INRI (Iesus Nazarenus, Rex Iudaeorum) are two of many short x-word fill ins that are ever present except when I need them. As with Deb I only got IHS in the crosses.

I suggest that we replace MBZ for all three letter car clues. My 300D will be out of the spa in 2 weeks. Now I will have a nearly perfect version of an early 80s European taxi. As my son aptly put it: Perfect old fart car. No radio, roll up windows, 4 speed and 0-60 MPH in 3 or 4 days… who could ask for less.
Although, squirreled away in the glove box is a device to power my iPod along with a headphone jack under the dash…. for those trips across Colorado living a teenage daydream of legal…. Gonna load up some Johnny Rotten and SEXPISTOLS for NOV's trip to Moab. And, OREOs!

Snide trick of the day was BATPOLE instead of cave. It was a good one.

Thank you Mr. Page -- Note I have Led Zeppelin (first album) on my iPod -- your best work IMHO
Rich in Atlanta (Decatur, Georgia)
I can't remember a puzzle with so many great long entries. Yes, there were a few gluey bits, but I thought it was well worth it. After reading Jeff's comments, I did what I rarely do - went and read Rex and Amy. Amy was lukewarm; Rex gave this puzzle a C. Evidently they are all in the 'squeaky clean, but dull' camp.

Yes, easier than most Saturdays, with KARAOKEBAR and LETISNOW helping me get going quickly in the top half. A little tougher in the south, but multiple 'aha' moments as an answer dawned on me. SINEQUANON was the last long entry I filled in (and it gave me the couple of remaining down crosses immediately). What a great way to finish. Also loved the clue for 14d.

OT with a puzzle connection. We are about to hit 70 consecutive days here with the temperature never dropping below 70. We broke the old record a couple of weeks ago. We are also well above twice the average number of days with highs in the 90's and there is no end in sight. Puzzle connection - IHS and ATOLL, which reminded me of a story from WW II about the commander of a detachment on a sleepy ATOLL in the south Pacific. He was required to submit a weekly status report, and after many months finally sent one that just said: "Hebrews 13:8." When his commander pulled out his bible to find out what that could possibly mean, he found this: "Jesus Christ, the same yesterday today and forever."
Deadline (New York City)
I'm with you on Jeff's continuum (didn't/don't check Rex or Amy).

Give me the fun of lively entries and clever cluing (and misdirection, please!). If it takes a bit of glue, so be it!
surfertom007 (newport, ri)
My favorite puzzle in quite a while...you've got to love a puzzle with Space Cadet, the Batpole, and the Sex Pistols
John (Chicago)
Martin, I watched Goldfinger again and periodically switched to the Cubs – Dodgers game. I forgot that Honor Blackman was billed over Gert Frobe. Amazing. Does BECLOUD work for Goldfinger?

Well, both ended well, as the Cubs did help your Giants after all and Bond wound up with Galore. I maintain that Goldfinger was the best Bond film ever.

My thanks to you, and Brutus, and Barry and MTF and Leapy and whoever else wished the Wife and me a good week in Maine. Lobster, clams and eggs benedict every morning….

I taped the game after the Cubs tied it in the 9th and now I will go watch how they won it in the 10th.
Barry Ancona (New York, NY)
"Lobster, clams and eggs benedict every morning…."

John,
Wow! What do you do for lunch and dinner?
John (Chicago)
Barry, the rest of the day I have mussels, cod, shrimp and more lobster aand vodka
Brutus (Berkeley, NJ)
As you might suspect I ran out of 44d. As a result, I'm reveling in the afterglow of a pretty darn good go at the Saturday. Youse guys will all comment about the lack of this puzzle's difficulty, judging from MTF's and other critiques...I had one look-up, Yasmina's surname...When I was ringing those Good Humor Bells, 66a was a Humorette; orange ice with vanilla ice cream embedded and on a stick. It was a big seller...I reckon the SEX PISTOLS have to be commended for not selling out and staying true to their arrogant, punk oriented persona. Regardless, that style of music doesn't do a whole helluva lot for me...The temperature and humidity levels have not been unlike NBA final scores. Today they both made it well up into the 90's. I'm blaming it on the OZONE HOLE. Actually humidity won out, hitting 100 as we had some trace rain early Fri. morning...Join me if you care and chill with Tony Bennett; watch some "SNOWfall." This clip works on me like SOMINEX, sans toxic side effects.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmHk_-Be8TU
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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There was a lot of fun cluing in the Timesian fashion, interesting entries, knowledge, and etc., as Deb said.

But when KARAOKE BAR and GLOM pretty much type themselves; then KIDDO and OZONEHOLE require perhaps one more supporting letter; the grid is pretty well framed. Toss in an EISENHOWER (not easy to get, but useful for Down entries once entered), and you have a puzzle that took me 2/3 as long to solve as Thursday's (which was just about precisely the difficulty level of a Thursday puzzle, especially as there was one rebus only and a diagonal bonus phrase instead of oddly-placed circles).

I mean, the Crossword today took me less than 7 times as long to solve as Joel Fagliano's MIdI Puzzle took. [I really want MINIs everyday. Or nothing. Please. Thank you.]

Someone typed the other day that the early Shortz-era puzzles in the Archive are a lot easier for given days of the week than 2016 NYT Crosswords. If we're going back to that degree of difficulty for the 15x15s, fantastic. I'm not Rex or Jeff - no snark here. But as it stands, with no general expectation that the Crosswords will now be more accessible to more people, this themeless belonged on a Wednesday. In fact, I would love if Fridays had a challenging themeless, Saturdays had a punishing themeless, and Wednesdays occasionally had a far-easier themeless.

If NYT is NOT changing difficulty levels, and if this had to run on a Saturday, it should run in a publication not reputed for grueling Saturday crosswords.
RY (Forgotten Borough)
Please, sir, may we have some more gruel?
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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I see, RY!

You've added a little Twist to my suggestion. Nicely done.
Leapfinger (Durham, NC)
Chopped (O)liver

;-D
John (Chicago)
Martin, Goldfinger was on TV tonight - STZ. The Cubs aren't helping your Giants tonight. And the Wife is talking a SQMI a minute.
Martin (California)
Have a great time with the family. Yes, the governor is more than a bit of a space cadet, but no person can ruin such a beautiful place. It's a lot like Washington.
Brutus (Berkeley, NJ)
Crack open a few claws while you're Down East. No spiny crustaceans where you're headed, just the ones with the big succulent mitts. Enjoy your family.
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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Martin: More than a bit of a SPACE CADET? This is no Governor Moonbeam. I mean, this guy left an obscene voicemail for a state legislator, and ended it by asking the legislator to make the recording public! It's on YouTube; NSFW.

JFC: Are you and The Wife driving? If so, either get used to it or buy some SOMINEX. She only cares that you get the PITH of what she's saying.

As for your guy, I could have written a letter to his wife saying, "Yes, Virginia, your husband can bid no-trump." And I'm not being political by saying that! It's a straight-up preveal.

As for you in Maine with the family, Martin's right. I have previously given you the link to the guest cottages on Boothbay operated by friends of mine. I realize that was inapt because you don't like people. But if you do need someone to talk to besides the family, Portland has a terrific culture of brew pubs with inventive microbrews. Sit at the bar with some kids who were fired from the Sanders campaign, and listen to them talk about what *they* are going to do next with *their* Revolution. (Now I am being political! My preveal ended way back.)

[Re brewpubs: Maine's a lot like Washington, but they haven't legalized the same intoxicants.]

Come back and tell me how to bet on Maine's Electoral Votes; it's harder than most states with bicameral legislatures because the statewide winner gets 2 Electors, but each House District awards one Elector to its own winner. Ask my school chum, their GOP Chair. Mention Stu & Tara.
Paul (Virginia)
Like Liz, the NE slowed me down as I stubbornly GLOMmed onto grill and allowed it to GRATE on my nerves. REZA was also an unknown and it took far too many repetitions of "as long as you love me so" before LET IT SNOW came out of my mouth.

Well worth the effort.
Alan J (Durham, NC)
This one fell pretty readily for a Saturday, but was entertaining the whole way.

Obligatory Gilbert and Sullivan clip:
"I Am a Maiden," from Princess IDA
(from the Brent Walker TV production)

I don't recall seeing the whole performance from which the above clip is taken. In the stage version, Prince Hilarion and his companions Cyril and Florian are onstage alone, as they are sneaking into a women's university in womanly disguise, and are practicing their "drag" personas during this trio. I expect the Walker production has framed the medieval setting with a more modern context, alluding I suspect to the Tennyson original ("The Princess") in which several young people act out the story for their fellow guests during a weekend country holiday. Thus we see the spectators in more modern attire. Gilbert's adaptation excludes that frame setting.

@LizB, here I am! You're speaking of Lee Galbreath, no doubt? She was our IDA in 2010. (Took me a while to vet a clip and write up the foregoing.)
Alan J (Durham, NC)
Oops! Here's the link:
https://youtu.be/mJsl5l91K4A
Liz B (Durham, NC)
Yup, it was Lee I was thinking of.

Cyril and Florian and Hilarion better be careful which restrooms they use.
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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"Florian"?

I had hoped it would be FlorEAN.
Kiki Rijkstra (Arizona)
A breezy puzzle. Is this really a Saturday? It didn't seem so with just a few do-overs and nothing approaching a Natick.
David Connell (Weston CT)
Here is the comment I am not posting about misleading folk interpretations of the simple abbreviation of the Greek name "IHCOYC".
Kiki Rijkstra (Arizona)
Did you mean [ Ιησούς ]? The modern mixed-case Greek is spot on as to the letters used.
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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I had a lovely paEAN to this puzzle, which my computer ate; that has happened to me more in the Column Era than would have been the case in a typical month of the BlogOIS years.

Anyway, at the end, I prevealed my reaction to anyone who might come along and question Deb's explanation of that particular entry. The preveal was quite piquant. It's a shame I don't save my Comments while I'm working on eliminating extra characters. I BELIEVE Deb's job on entries like that is to try to let the uninformed get a grasp of why the entry ended up with a clue like that, and to give them a way to remember the answer when they need it again a few hundred puzzles from now.

Did she succeed? That's the only question we need to ask. The woman's been very busy seducing handsome younger journalists, so I think her shocking lack of attention to the *Greek* aspect of the entries can be forgiven. Your 26-mileage* may vary.

* - Cue debates as to whether the Greeks ran a 26-mile race or a 26.2-mile race.
MTF Tobin (Manhattanville)
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Kiki, I should have awaited your reply before entering the fray.

Your presentation makes the whole thing look fairly innocuous.
Liz B (Durham, NC)
It's fun to be in the zone on a Saturday puzzle! Started out with KARAOKE BAR and GLOM and built down from them with the Downs, so I BELIEVE SO and DRUMSTICKS came quickly. I was really hoping 6D would be a more current comic than KETT but couldn't think of any with 4-letter last names.

I flirted briefly with baseball-related phrases like BATS BIG or HITS BIG for what turned out to be WINS BIG. Other answers I didn't know filled in easily from the crosses (EISENHOWER, SEX PISTOLS). GLOM notwithstanding, the NE was my last fill, as Ms. REZA was a complete unknown to me and I had GRILL for GRATE for a long time. A friend played Princess IDA in a fairly recent production of that operetta--Alan J, where are you?