Is college-educated white male support for Trump a "paradox"? This analysis ignores what I'd think would be a really important variable; partisanship. Traditionally, college-educated whites have voted majority Republican; only fairly recently have we started to see a shift. After all, if you've been a Republican all your life, you're not going to easily abandon your traditional voting pattern to vote for a party you consider a threat--even if a lot of people regard the GOP candidate as an embarrassment. That's why Paul Ryan is supporting him; Trump will in the end support his priorities, Hillary won't. A comparison to earlier elections would be appropriate here, as would a cross tab on age; perhaps the real story is a relative shift away from the Republicans, especially noticeable among younger voters, but one that's far from complete . Most Republicans I know are supporting Trump simply because he's the Republican. I'd also note by the same token that the Pew survey shows Trump in the lead among those with six-figure household incomes. Maybe they're supporting Trump for the same reason Stephen Moore and Larry Kudlow are--that they figure Republicans are good for rich people?
12
Two thoughts are mixed in this column. First, the college grad white males feel threatened by the "other". Second, their position in the world is declining.
The two are somewhat related but are truly independent. In the "others" are a lot of H1Bs, who get into the US via the immigration laws and replace US citizens. A prominent case is the Disney World using Indian nationals to replace the US workers in the IT realm. This is related to the 1% using the laws for their profit. Attacking Hillary ALONE for this is wrong. The Donald also does this and Pence favors this also.
The second factor is sociological. The women in th US are unwilling to give way to men who have inferior skills for the job they are supposed to do. Here Hillary is (perhaps) rightly blamed as the face of the "uppity" women (and others).
Trump is no solution for this and he has no solutions, except a sneer and a smear.
The two are somewhat related but are truly independent. In the "others" are a lot of H1Bs, who get into the US via the immigration laws and replace US citizens. A prominent case is the Disney World using Indian nationals to replace the US workers in the IT realm. This is related to the 1% using the laws for their profit. Attacking Hillary ALONE for this is wrong. The Donald also does this and Pence favors this also.
The second factor is sociological. The women in th US are unwilling to give way to men who have inferior skills for the job they are supposed to do. Here Hillary is (perhaps) rightly blamed as the face of the "uppity" women (and others).
Trump is no solution for this and he has no solutions, except a sneer and a smear.
15
Just goes to show that higher education, at least in the USA, is nowhere near what it's cracked up to be, and: male chauvinism and racism are still widespread in this country, civics education is a manifest failure, our entertainment "culture" is a fright, and there is some really bad karma floating around (any wonder?).
Personally, I supported Bernie Sanders, whole-heartedly. I do not like Hillary Clinton. But I'll be hogtied if I'm not going to vote for her in November. It's not even close! Reading the polls (and assuming that they understate support from the idiot fringe), I am wondering how many refugees would be allowed into New Zealand (and Canada) from the U.S. Seriously.
If you are even thinking about a "protest vote" for some third party at this point, ask yourself this: can you not find some more effective and less devastating way to register your legitimate concerns about Hillary's (take your pick) neocon/neoliberal learnings? One single right winger on the Court (let alone 2-3 or more) would set civil liberties and progressive justice back for decades. Surely, that's enough to hold your nose on 11/08/16.
Personally, I supported Bernie Sanders, whole-heartedly. I do not like Hillary Clinton. But I'll be hogtied if I'm not going to vote for her in November. It's not even close! Reading the polls (and assuming that they understate support from the idiot fringe), I am wondering how many refugees would be allowed into New Zealand (and Canada) from the U.S. Seriously.
If you are even thinking about a "protest vote" for some third party at this point, ask yourself this: can you not find some more effective and less devastating way to register your legitimate concerns about Hillary's (take your pick) neocon/neoliberal learnings? One single right winger on the Court (let alone 2-3 or more) would set civil liberties and progressive justice back for decades. Surely, that's enough to hold your nose on 11/08/16.
24
These males are not "men." They are males aligning themselves with a coward who speaks what they think and want: a free ride. Yes, they want a handout. They want to make America while male again: no minorities of any type with whom to compete.
Well, if the good and decent white men vote, these wannabe "men" will hopefully learn that in America, we respect those who work hard and earn their way. We respect men who are not easily threatened, and who stand around waiting for someone else to make their day and way easy.
American males who are white and college educated, but are "MEN" will never vote for the coward. And, those males who do vote for a coward are cowards themselves.
Well, if the good and decent white men vote, these wannabe "men" will hopefully learn that in America, we respect those who work hard and earn their way. We respect men who are not easily threatened, and who stand around waiting for someone else to make their day and way easy.
American males who are white and college educated, but are "MEN" will never vote for the coward. And, those males who do vote for a coward are cowards themselves.
30
Or maybe college educated white male voters actually pay attention to the facts of the issues and aren't led wholesale into identify politics like the democrats.
15
In 1964, when Goldwater was nominated for POTUS by the Republicans, I was in college at a top 10 academic institution that did not admit women. A significant number of my fellow students supported Goldwater, and took a somewhat disparaging attitude to those of us that supported LBJ. I can't give a psychological explanation for why that split in opinions occurred, but it was a fact. Given the stringent academic requirements for admission, none of the students were "dummies."
When Election Day finally rolled around and the votes were counted, we who supported LBJ were happy and those others who supported Goldwater were disappointed. By analogy to the situation today, Goldwater was an extremist and LBJ was already becoming saddled with the Vietnam War. I do not recall the LBJ supporters as being so much for him as against Goldwater and what a Goldwtaer presidency would have represented.
I hope that the same sentiments are felt on November 9, 2016 by the people voting for HRC and Trump, respectively, after the votes are counted.
There is nothing new under the sun.
When Election Day finally rolled around and the votes were counted, we who supported LBJ were happy and those others who supported Goldwater were disappointed. By analogy to the situation today, Goldwater was an extremist and LBJ was already becoming saddled with the Vietnam War. I do not recall the LBJ supporters as being so much for him as against Goldwater and what a Goldwtaer presidency would have represented.
I hope that the same sentiments are felt on November 9, 2016 by the people voting for HRC and Trump, respectively, after the votes are counted.
There is nothing new under the sun.
12
There are two classes. Those that have money making money, and wage earners. Wage earners have been losing ground because there is ongoing class war migrating profit from the wage earner, to the money-making-money, profit taking class. In groggy consciousness that something is afoul, the subject white male, college-educated or not, senses he is being cheated, but misplaces the cause.
24
If Condoleezza Rice were running for president, I would be among her staunchest supporters. But since I disapprove of President Obama I'm castigated as a racist, and since I find Hillary simply intolerable, I'm sexist as well. At least according to the left.
19
Hillary Clinton's low poll numbers are largely, not entirely because she is a very unlikable person. They cite one or another thing to justify their discontent, whether it is emails or Wall Street speeches. Whereas Donald Trump is quite charismatic. So he can do just about anything stupid, still they would look for & find some justification to wanting to vote for him. And he might even win in November, despite his choice of a lightweight VP pick.
The best chance for Hillary Clinton to win in November is by picking Bernie Sanders as her running mate; if he is uninterested, plead with him. He would then gladly accept the role, for the sake of the country. This is my reading. I maybe wrong, however. But that has been the way I see it.
The best chance for Hillary Clinton to win in November is by picking Bernie Sanders as her running mate; if he is uninterested, plead with him. He would then gladly accept the role, for the sake of the country. This is my reading. I maybe wrong, however. But that has been the way I see it.
11
You just go to any college and observe the young men after classes (if they even bother to go). It's just drinking and partying for many people. Then when they scrape by and graduate with all C's and an easy but useless major, why would we think that they are any different than the white working class?
21
Trumps's appeal crosses over even into "educated" Canadian males. A colleague who holds two university degrees felt free to defend Trump in conversation with me, a woman who is a visible minority. While I was surprised he would be so candid with me in his political thoughts, I realized that even "educated" people will side along racial lines and are quite ignorant about why whites have lost out. I simply asked this colleague "Who made all the business decisions to move manufacturing overseas to China?" and pointed out, it was business owners like Trump, motivated by greed, to offshore jobs and production to maximize profit. Basically, white men can't ever admit that their "own kind" will stab them in the back for a buck.
13
White men are treated with disrespect by Progressives, and human beings are hardwired to fear being hurt by those who treat them with disrespect. When Ruth Bader Ginsburg stops supplying the answer "nine" (out of nine) for how many female supreme court justices is enough, white men will know that progressives aren't just seeking some sort of turnabout to settle past scores, and that their past voluntary conceding of political power to women and minorities wasn't simply an act of political suckerhood. Until that time, the less intelligent among them will be tempted to vote for candidates like Trump. If you don't want someone to lash out, don't insult them.
9
I believe the redistribution-being-a-threat-to-whites theory is being overblown by both Leftist pundits and most of the NYTimes' commenters. Yes, many whites are worried about their economic futures, but that's a result of technology and globalization making many industries redundant in the United States. (Carriage makers in the early 20th century were also panicked about their futures.)
Rightly or wrongly, the primary driving force of educated and poorer whites supporting Trump is a weariness of the today's PC culture and the problems some demographics have assimilating and integrating into American society, a society that for two centuries has done pretty well despite obvious inconsistencies. These voters do believe that people can pick themselves by the bootstraps--a theory loathed by the Left--as penniless Italians, Irish, Jews and Vietnamese refugees--many of those groups discriminated against earlier---have successfully done. Don't shoot the messenger, but that's the reason educated and poor whites support Trump. Have poor whites picked themselves up by the bootstraps? No, but they're not blaming other demographics for their problems.
Rightly or wrongly, the primary driving force of educated and poorer whites supporting Trump is a weariness of the today's PC culture and the problems some demographics have assimilating and integrating into American society, a society that for two centuries has done pretty well despite obvious inconsistencies. These voters do believe that people can pick themselves by the bootstraps--a theory loathed by the Left--as penniless Italians, Irish, Jews and Vietnamese refugees--many of those groups discriminated against earlier---have successfully done. Don't shoot the messenger, but that's the reason educated and poor whites support Trump. Have poor whites picked themselves up by the bootstraps? No, but they're not blaming other demographics for their problems.
11
Nearly half of college-educated Republicans, men and women, believe immigrants “burden the country by taking jobs, housing and health care,”
It's not a belief it's fact. Illegal immigrants are a big driver of higher housing cost esp. in cities Some illegals go to agricultural areas but most to cities. NY metro area has ~500K illegals. Even if they double and triple up and they do at 10 people per unit that's 50K housing units off the market. That's a big driver of high rents in NY, Boston, San Fran, and other inner cities
It's not a belief it's fact. Illegal immigrants are a big driver of higher housing cost esp. in cities Some illegals go to agricultural areas but most to cities. NY metro area has ~500K illegals. Even if they double and triple up and they do at 10 people per unit that's 50K housing units off the market. That's a big driver of high rents in NY, Boston, San Fran, and other inner cities
11
Trying to justify Trumpism as reaction to so called "redistribution" lazily borrows from GOP talking points.
The rich in this country happily acknowledges the rest of us as members of the American family only when they need to ship us to war! During times of peace and prosperity, the Untied States is their exclusive social club to enjoy! But during times of war, they are eager to make the United States exclusively ours to bleed and die for!
The greedy and self-serving patriotism of the rich in our country stinks!
The rich in this country happily acknowledges the rest of us as members of the American family only when they need to ship us to war! During times of peace and prosperity, the Untied States is their exclusive social club to enjoy! But during times of war, they are eager to make the United States exclusively ours to bleed and die for!
The greedy and self-serving patriotism of the rich in our country stinks!
9
speaks volumes about the success of the republican-led attack on education and the transition of a college education from a true well-rounded education to a home school/charter school/for-profit school/trump university-style meaningless trade school.
12
Nowhere in this article to I find a comparison of Trump's numbers with white college educated males to Romney's or to those of previous Republican candidates for the Presidency. If the trend lines are what I suspect they are, they may tell a rather different story. I think responsible journalism would include this information, even if it shows me to be wrong.
8
Well, you can keep thinking it is race, and firing up Hillary's base, but it is not around here. I'm in a predominantly white state and they dislike Hillary because she lies. Nothing more nothing less. Most guys don't like women who lie.
9
You can count on professors to overanalyze. Young white college graduates support Trump because of testosterone, pure and simple. I don't know why professors don't understand the effects of testosterone. Maybe, if they acknowledged its importance, their dissertations would be two pages long, and no one would consider them serious academics.
8
In my opinion, men in general feel threatened by strong, independent women like Hillary Clinton. They don't always show it but deep down they resent women who may outperform them. Hillary Clinton is a big threat to the Republican Party with its misogynistic views. I think she would be a good President. Sometimes being a woman is advantageous and other times not. So fellow, it is time to become an adult, grow up and use your head not your biases.
13
I'm afraid that this suggests that the value of a college education is not what it is cracked up to be.
14
This country needs a woman's touch.
7
The main cause of the devaluation of college degrees isn't that "lower tier" colleges have expanded their enrollments; it's the virtual abandonment by colleges- even some of the better ones- of their erstwhile commitment to producing graduates who can think critically. Diplomas don't make good citizens, unless they are a symbol of a person's ability to think more clearly and deeply about any idea they are confronted with throughout their lifetime- political or not.
People who can think critically not only are more informed voters, but they model that kind of behavior to others. They spread the values of intellectual honesty and commitment to separating facts from unfounded opinions. Every person who models this behavior when talking to other people helps reinforce this standard of aspiration, whether they have a media platform or not.
Likewise, every college graduate who slipped by without having to learn to think for themselves drags down the rest of society a little bit. Thoughts and behaviors can spread like viruses. They can spread both real knowledge and a constructive approach to political conflict.
Unfortunately, it's a lot easier these days to succumb to the disease of justifying one's own bias and ignorance by merely imitating rationality, and regurgitating assertions masquerading as coherent arguments. When colleges produce graduates who merely appear to think critically, without having to actually do it, they're part of the problem, not progress.
People who can think critically not only are more informed voters, but they model that kind of behavior to others. They spread the values of intellectual honesty and commitment to separating facts from unfounded opinions. Every person who models this behavior when talking to other people helps reinforce this standard of aspiration, whether they have a media platform or not.
Likewise, every college graduate who slipped by without having to learn to think for themselves drags down the rest of society a little bit. Thoughts and behaviors can spread like viruses. They can spread both real knowledge and a constructive approach to political conflict.
Unfortunately, it's a lot easier these days to succumb to the disease of justifying one's own bias and ignorance by merely imitating rationality, and regurgitating assertions masquerading as coherent arguments. When colleges produce graduates who merely appear to think critically, without having to actually do it, they're part of the problem, not progress.
3
As a white progressive who teaches college students, I have seen the appeal of both Trump and Sanders. They have made clear the wars in the Middle East have been a catastrophic waste; NAFTA and other trade agreements have gutted American industry;and college tuition is unaffordable for the average person.Both Trump and Sand have also made clear that politicians can be bought and sold by the one percent. These issues resonate with many students in contrast to important social justice issues, incarceration rates for example. Mix in the usual tribalism that ignores the complex structural maladies of our society, white bias that claims it doesn't exist, a police shooting ,and the results are a perfect formula for another Law and Order white man( not woman).True both candidates are liars and not to be trusted, but the new liar, Trump, seems more appealing to them than the old liar, Hillary. Only the minority students seem to hold Trump to be less honest. But there is time, and I hope that the students spend more time researching their choice,and watch the late night comedians who lampoon the "truthiness" of each candidate, and then vote.
4
Categorizing a group of Trump supporters as "College Men" is entirely relative. We can assume that vast numbers of undergraduate degrees conferred over the past couple of decades indicate no greater level of intellectual accomplishment, context and perspective than a degree from a decent high school indicated in days long gone. Have you noticed that Trump himself and many of his surrogates have little ability for subject/verb agreement, and even less for comprehending even a few tenses of common verbs? Have you noticed the four-syllable maximum of their verbiage. Junior-high vocabularies and inadequate grammar yield the sophistication level of thought you might find in a careless teenager. If you want to know how intelligent, well-educated men are leaning politically, consider those men with post-graduate accomplishments.
4
I've seen two professors commenting about how the male students in their classrooms are boys and not men. I always felt a lot of love and respect from my teachers despite my conservative views. They taught me their side but didn't judge me for choosing a different line of thinking. That's a true teacher.
4
So these white men complain that the "game is rigged" but they want to rig it even more by denying professional opportunities to women and minorities? We live in a competitive society. If you cannot compete, you go under. If you lost your job to a woman or an immigrant (or an immigrant woman), it is because she is better - or cheaper to employ - than you are. And yes, in a global world you do compete against workers in China and India, and the way to win this competition is not to start trade war or to elect a madman but to get better at what you do - the lesson people in Asia understand very well but one, apparently, lost on these overgrown frat boys.
7
So the new strategy of the NYT is to shame educated White voters who support Trump into supporting Hillary because calling them uneducated for the last 10 months hasn't worked.
Got it.
Got it.
16
I was just thinking how stupid college educated white men are when - bingo - here is the proof. Stupid and afraid.
7
So...
You're sexist if you're a college educated white male that doesn't support Hillary.
You're NOT sexist if you're a Sanders supporter against Hillary because you received a "real" college education / Hillary's a reconstructed war-hawk / Sanders led a "political revolution" / you possess a superior intelligence.
Maybe we should take a hint from Obama's recent speeches, specifically about the importance of listening to, and empathizing with, the opposing side to achieve real progress and reform. Dismissing every Trump supporter as a sexist bigot surely won't win any hearts and minds.
You're sexist if you're a college educated white male that doesn't support Hillary.
You're NOT sexist if you're a Sanders supporter against Hillary because you received a "real" college education / Hillary's a reconstructed war-hawk / Sanders led a "political revolution" / you possess a superior intelligence.
Maybe we should take a hint from Obama's recent speeches, specifically about the importance of listening to, and empathizing with, the opposing side to achieve real progress and reform. Dismissing every Trump supporter as a sexist bigot surely won't win any hearts and minds.
10
I am a white male who came here (I admit it) from England,
where my rural accent put me pretty low on the social totem pole.
I admit also that when I came here I immediately noticed that
as a male, I was "higher up" socially than I was used to; even the language
favored males more than in the UK. ("Macho" was a compliment,
whereas it was a horrible insult in the UK. Watch how males are
portrayed on the BBC; you couldn't depict women that way. Not nowadays.)
But is it possible that the people who benefited from bias in
favor of white males were mostly old, rich white men?
Is it possible that the younger ones, and the poorer ones,
are not getting treated so well, and on college campuses being
"hated on" from all sides?
That's how it looks to me, as a long-time professor.
where my rural accent put me pretty low on the social totem pole.
I admit also that when I came here I immediately noticed that
as a male, I was "higher up" socially than I was used to; even the language
favored males more than in the UK. ("Macho" was a compliment,
whereas it was a horrible insult in the UK. Watch how males are
portrayed on the BBC; you couldn't depict women that way. Not nowadays.)
But is it possible that the people who benefited from bias in
favor of white males were mostly old, rich white men?
Is it possible that the younger ones, and the poorer ones,
are not getting treated so well, and on college campuses being
"hated on" from all sides?
That's how it looks to me, as a long-time professor.
11
Well I guess there's nothing to stop a racist snob from going to college.
So, the problem is that the world has shifted hereditary wealth and power away from the kind of people we see in that picture? Taken away some of their unearned priviliges and their sense of being the aristocrats of mankind? Made them prove themselves and compete like everybody else? And why is that a problem?
So, the problem is that the world has shifted hereditary wealth and power away from the kind of people we see in that picture? Taken away some of their unearned priviliges and their sense of being the aristocrats of mankind? Made them prove themselves and compete like everybody else? And why is that a problem?
15
So anyone who opposes Hillary is a racist snob?
7
You forgot misogynist. By the way, doesn't that make Bernie's supporters racist snobs (and misogynists). The demographic is identical.
5
No joke John, you are why we will vote for Donald Trump and we will win.
5
Most men, college educated or not, are thoroughly familiar with what women in general are like. Each sex has strengths and weaknesses, and people will draw conclusions from their actual experiences in life.
Nearly every college-educated man has probably worked for both male and female bosses. Based on their experience, they have adopted ideas of how men and women differ in their approach to leadership and management, and what they would personally prefer.
Nearly every college-educated man has probably worked for both male and female bosses. Based on their experience, they have adopted ideas of how men and women differ in their approach to leadership and management, and what they would personally prefer.
7
Nonetheless, Ms. Clinton is someone with high intelligence, extreme experience in governing, the ability to negotiate, and is connected with thousands of very well-informed people who can advise her.
Trump has mediocre intelligence, no experience in governing, is incapable of negotiating, and is immune to all advice.
So the gender thing doesn't matter at all, when one considers that Ms. Clinton is fairly qualified for the presidency, and Trump should never be allowed such a position of power.
Trump has mediocre intelligence, no experience in governing, is incapable of negotiating, and is immune to all advice.
So the gender thing doesn't matter at all, when one considers that Ms. Clinton is fairly qualified for the presidency, and Trump should never be allowed such a position of power.
14
If young men, or any man, is basing his presidential pick on gender stereotypes of management styles, he is an idiot.
11
i wouid like to hear how the addition of 40 million immigrants and our enormous trade deifict has had no impact upon any aspect of American life. Truely magical thinking is at work.
27
Perhaps you should consult the history books, and find out how mass immigration HAS been shaping America since it was a bunch of British colonies. Some scholars estimate the something like 20% of the colonists in 1776 didn't even speak English. I'm sure you would find that in that period and nearly every other era except 1923-1964 that it was having enormous impacts on the country, in both positive and negative ways.
3
That trade deficit exists because we are cheap and we don't want to spend money. There are immigrants because there are jobs for which we don't want to do or too unskilled to do.
5
The problem of the Twenty-first Century is the problem of the gender-line. It's hardly surprising that "college-educated white men" share the same outlook as "working class white men." If that were not true, the Republican Party would have disappeared decades ago.
23
This term "redistribution" doesn't fully capture what has been going on. It implies, as someone else noted, taking from one group and giving to another, which is pretty much taboo in democratic politics.
But the fact is that a lot of women and minorities have improved their situations and living standards but working hard and out-competing white males with college degrees, and since the sixties a lot of them have simply had an opportunity to compete where none existed before.
White males in this country are all seemingly in love with pro football, which is a sport that in the 1950 was only completely dominated by white players. Today, whites make up something like 35% of all pro-football players, and are even less represented among the starting players. Yet no one talks about this phenomena as "redistribution". And even if sports and the "real world" aren't exactly the same thing, aren't quite a few white males who struggle to maintain the lifestyle of their parents simply being out-competed for the positions they seek? And isn't some of this "redistribution" the product of a more-equal playing field in education and the job market?
But the fact is that a lot of women and minorities have improved their situations and living standards but working hard and out-competing white males with college degrees, and since the sixties a lot of them have simply had an opportunity to compete where none existed before.
White males in this country are all seemingly in love with pro football, which is a sport that in the 1950 was only completely dominated by white players. Today, whites make up something like 35% of all pro-football players, and are even less represented among the starting players. Yet no one talks about this phenomena as "redistribution". And even if sports and the "real world" aren't exactly the same thing, aren't quite a few white males who struggle to maintain the lifestyle of their parents simply being out-competed for the positions they seek? And isn't some of this "redistribution" the product of a more-equal playing field in education and the job market?
24
Many people love sports of all kinds because you still have to be objectively skilled at what you do to succeed. The people who take the court in the NBA finals, dive into the Olympic pools, or stare each other down over the tennis net have all had to prove that they, regardless of any immutable traits about them as people, are skilled enough to be at that level.
You'd have a great point if/when the EOEC brought suit against sports associations for not having the right number the appropriately-colored of jelly beans in their jars.
Spending four plus years (let's call it sixteen from K-12) being told you're a racist, sexist, misogynistic monster who has stolen every accomplishment from someone else was bound to have a backlash.
You'd have a great point if/when the EOEC brought suit against sports associations for not having the right number the appropriately-colored of jelly beans in their jars.
Spending four plus years (let's call it sixteen from K-12) being told you're a racist, sexist, misogynistic monster who has stolen every accomplishment from someone else was bound to have a backlash.
7
Apparently white males(or as they like to call themselves "the silent majority") welcome an America based on the principals and behavior of the Westboro Baptist Church: hatred, bigotry, insults---and a complete lack of intelligent dialogue.
16
As a former academic, I know that the term "college graduate" can mean any number of things.
It can mean that a person with genuine intellectual curiosity took advantage of numerous academic and extracurricular opportunities that the school offered, made friends with many different kinds of people, concentrated on learning and enrichment rather than on grades, thought of professors as resources for advice about their subject areas, and majored in a subject that s/he was interested in.
It can mean that a person with no intellectual interests went to college only because that's what middle-class youth are supposed to do, saw college as nothing more than a path to the executive suite, took strictly career-oriented courses and thought that the liberal arts requirements were "useless," regarded professors as devices for dispensing grades (nothing lower than a B, please), considered fraternity/sorority/athletic team requirements compulsory and academic requirements something to skip or slough off, and claimed that s/he deserved to party three times a week because s/he "worked so hard."
I suspect that Trump supporters are found mostly in the latter group.
They may have gone through college, but did college go through them?
It can mean that a person with genuine intellectual curiosity took advantage of numerous academic and extracurricular opportunities that the school offered, made friends with many different kinds of people, concentrated on learning and enrichment rather than on grades, thought of professors as resources for advice about their subject areas, and majored in a subject that s/he was interested in.
It can mean that a person with no intellectual interests went to college only because that's what middle-class youth are supposed to do, saw college as nothing more than a path to the executive suite, took strictly career-oriented courses and thought that the liberal arts requirements were "useless," regarded professors as devices for dispensing grades (nothing lower than a B, please), considered fraternity/sorority/athletic team requirements compulsory and academic requirements something to skip or slough off, and claimed that s/he deserved to party three times a week because s/he "worked so hard."
I suspect that Trump supporters are found mostly in the latter group.
They may have gone through college, but did college go through them?
147
Pdxtran: You do realize that it is insulting derogatory descriptions such as yours that push us weak, partying, college graduates into Trump's camp.
[PhD, EE (Information Theory, Communications Science), Purdue, self-financed during all my school years, worked my tail off, did not party, no fraternities, oft published, multiple patents, retired owner of a successful ground-breaking software R&D house. Despise academics who are too lofty to teach students truly useful capabilities.]
You just made my decision: Trump.
You like apples? How's them apples!
[PhD, EE (Information Theory, Communications Science), Purdue, self-financed during all my school years, worked my tail off, did not party, no fraternities, oft published, multiple patents, retired owner of a successful ground-breaking software R&D house. Despise academics who are too lofty to teach students truly useful capabilities.]
You just made my decision: Trump.
You like apples? How's them apples!
9
What kind of courses did these guys take ??
16
Equality looks unfair to the privileged.
42
Science, economics and liberal arts courses, the normal courses one usually studies at college and graduate schools.
2
I belong to the white male demographic discussed in this column, and, although there's no way I would vote for Donald Trump, I can certainly understand why many men would support him, even as they acknowledge to some extent his obvious flaws.
Even if they're not xenophobic and don't perceive a threat to "American values," they may perceive a threat to their economic futures from offshoring of their jobs or use of cheaper visa workers. Both political parties and the mainstream media (I refer to you, NY Times) have wholeheartedly endorsed globalization. For the 40-year-old guy in IT who's currently training his replacement in Bangalore as a condition for receiving severance pay, bromides about free trade and prosperity and some vague promises about job retraining don't help. I doubt Trump will help either, but at least he's talking about the problem.
Attribute if you will men's support of Trump to a "sense of entitlement," bigotry, racism, sexism, xenophobia, homophobia, or what have you, it won't change anyone's mind. I get that white guys, at least straight ones, are personnae non grata for much of the left, but if you want to defeat Trump maybe should try to persuade them that electing him isn't in their interest.
Even if they're not xenophobic and don't perceive a threat to "American values," they may perceive a threat to their economic futures from offshoring of their jobs or use of cheaper visa workers. Both political parties and the mainstream media (I refer to you, NY Times) have wholeheartedly endorsed globalization. For the 40-year-old guy in IT who's currently training his replacement in Bangalore as a condition for receiving severance pay, bromides about free trade and prosperity and some vague promises about job retraining don't help. I doubt Trump will help either, but at least he's talking about the problem.
Attribute if you will men's support of Trump to a "sense of entitlement," bigotry, racism, sexism, xenophobia, homophobia, or what have you, it won't change anyone's mind. I get that white guys, at least straight ones, are personnae non grata for much of the left, but if you want to defeat Trump maybe should try to persuade them that electing him isn't in their interest.
40
The best way to deal with the problems caused by globalization and technology is to understand the problems and then find solutions.
Grandstanding about getting one-sided trade agreements, starting currency wars with China a decade after the problem has subsided and blaming immigrants for taking low paid, no benefits, no worker protections jobs is just that - grandstanding.
The solution lies in tax reform that encourages local hiring, intelligent infrastructure spending for the future and educational support for people transferring from industries, like coal, that are dying a slow death due to alternative lower cost energy and technology. In your case perhaps your company should pay higher severance benefits and higher taxes. And yes, an enlightened immigration policy that goes after employers who employ the undocumented as well as going after the undocumented workers.
Grandstanding about getting one-sided trade agreements, starting currency wars with China a decade after the problem has subsided and blaming immigrants for taking low paid, no benefits, no worker protections jobs is just that - grandstanding.
The solution lies in tax reform that encourages local hiring, intelligent infrastructure spending for the future and educational support for people transferring from industries, like coal, that are dying a slow death due to alternative lower cost energy and technology. In your case perhaps your company should pay higher severance benefits and higher taxes. And yes, an enlightened immigration policy that goes after employers who employ the undocumented as well as going after the undocumented workers.
13
"I get that white guys, at least straight ones, are personnae non grata for much of the left."
I'm genuinely curious about this comment. In what way do you think straight white men are being excluded from left?
I mean, the Democratic Vice President is a straight white man. The second-place contender for the Democratic Party elections is a straight, white man. Most of the other candidates like O'Malley were straight white men. The Democratic Senate leader is a straight white man. Bill Clinton and Jimmy Carter, two prominent elder statesmen of the Democratic Party, are straight white men.
For personnae no grata, they seem to be everywhere in left-wing politics. But if there is some area where straight, white men are being unfairly excluded, then we should hear about it.
I'm genuinely curious about this comment. In what way do you think straight white men are being excluded from left?
I mean, the Democratic Vice President is a straight white man. The second-place contender for the Democratic Party elections is a straight, white man. Most of the other candidates like O'Malley were straight white men. The Democratic Senate leader is a straight white man. Bill Clinton and Jimmy Carter, two prominent elder statesmen of the Democratic Party, are straight white men.
For personnae no grata, they seem to be everywhere in left-wing politics. But if there is some area where straight, white men are being unfairly excluded, then we should hear about it.
1
Most people aren't trying to convince these guys of anything; it's pretty obvious this demographic have their minds made up, but that doesn't mean others can't call it the way they see it so there is no hiding behind it.
4
"very substantial redistribution from white males to minorities and women."
"limited economic benefits for white males throughout the income distribution."
That's it, folks. That's the explanation. Edsall should have stopped there.
If you take things from people and give them to other people, the former group becomes angry. Not just white males but all humans. Other mammals feel the same way.
"limited economic benefits for white males throughout the income distribution."
That's it, folks. That's the explanation. Edsall should have stopped there.
If you take things from people and give them to other people, the former group becomes angry. Not just white males but all humans. Other mammals feel the same way.
16
So you would rather live in a world that doesn't share? That would be a dystopian nightmare.
12
I haven't "taken away" a job from any man. I have apparently out-competed a few of them for particular jobs. Nobody gave me the job without my working hard for it, both when applying and then in performing after getting the job. I am also, unfortunately for me, considered to be cheaper labor than a man with an equivalent education and experience.
11
I think you're right, vbering. Plenty of folks have complained in the past that Democracy means "taking it from me and giving it to them."
But another general rule that affects humans and other mammals is competition. In the past fifty years, many women and people of color have begun to compete for the jobs that were previously available mostly to white men. At the same time, the labor market has shifted from manufacturing and agriculture to tech and service jobs (I'm including various kinds of contracting here, too). More people competing for a different set of jobs means that white men, college educated or not, are no longer in an advantaged position. They are now feeling what women and people of color have felt for generations.
But another general rule that affects humans and other mammals is competition. In the past fifty years, many women and people of color have begun to compete for the jobs that were previously available mostly to white men. At the same time, the labor market has shifted from manufacturing and agriculture to tech and service jobs (I'm including various kinds of contracting here, too). More people competing for a different set of jobs means that white men, college educated or not, are no longer in an advantaged position. They are now feeling what women and people of color have felt for generations.
3
Tom,
Excellent column and survey of current politics. As college class of 59 I can definitely agree that the global and US societies have dramatically changed since then. Eisenhower's world was very different from the world of my granddaughters and grandson. Reflecting on the differences makes me think that we may have overcorrected in our efforts at social engineering but no matter how clumsy we were, it would be a mistake for the US and the stability of the World if we follow the gospel according to Mr. Trump.
Our work is cut out for the generations that are coming of age at a time when we must give up the great economic success achieved with fossil fuels and create a new non-fossil energy source for continued prosperity for the 9+ Billion population projected for Mid-century, only 34 years from now. This is a tough problem but we can solve it.
I have written, with Dr. James Powell, a pathway in the recently published, Silent Earth which describes a space solar solution that will supply very cheap electricity to most of the Earth. With this cheap electricity we can make synthetic gasoline, diesel, and jet fuel from air and water. We can also make our overcrowded highways a lot safer by building a 300 mph Maglev network for freight trucks and passenger plus their cars. No emissions. See www.magneticglide.com for the concept. This could be a new industry for the US to export to the World.
Excellent column and survey of current politics. As college class of 59 I can definitely agree that the global and US societies have dramatically changed since then. Eisenhower's world was very different from the world of my granddaughters and grandson. Reflecting on the differences makes me think that we may have overcorrected in our efforts at social engineering but no matter how clumsy we were, it would be a mistake for the US and the stability of the World if we follow the gospel according to Mr. Trump.
Our work is cut out for the generations that are coming of age at a time when we must give up the great economic success achieved with fossil fuels and create a new non-fossil energy source for continued prosperity for the 9+ Billion population projected for Mid-century, only 34 years from now. This is a tough problem but we can solve it.
I have written, with Dr. James Powell, a pathway in the recently published, Silent Earth which describes a space solar solution that will supply very cheap electricity to most of the Earth. With this cheap electricity we can make synthetic gasoline, diesel, and jet fuel from air and water. We can also make our overcrowded highways a lot safer by building a 300 mph Maglev network for freight trucks and passenger plus their cars. No emissions. See www.magneticglide.com for the concept. This could be a new industry for the US to export to the World.
5
American women: time for our Lysistrata moment! Let's (not) do it! On three...
11
I wonder what percentage of "college educated men" who support Trump will get the reference.
5
Great idea (I'm not being sarcastic)! The problem is that everywhere on the planet that one looks, women are often actively complicit in their own oppression and the oppression of their fellow women. For example, in countries where female circumcision is practiced, it's almost always women who take the girls off to have it done and it's women who perform the procedure.
1
Big surprise.
If you make the election mostly about your gender being the better one, then the other gender might be cautious.
If you make the election mostly about your gender being the better one, then the other gender might be cautious.
15
George W. Bush was a Yale and Harvard man. So what's the big deal?
3
He was an example of affirmative action for legacy kids. Neither his GPA nor his SAT scores justified his admission.
3
College men? More like college boys.
16
The key here, which is noted in the article, is that people will vote for Trump even if they don't like him. Similarly, I've noticed that I personally am not friendly with Trump supporters but yet they are out there, in secret in many cases, waiting to cast their vote for someone they don't actually like. How do you vote for someone that you don't like, and who you are ashamed to admit to your friends that you are voting for?
11
First Trump supporters were uneducated.
Now they are.
Make up your mind!
Now they are.
Make up your mind!
18
So basically you can be college educated and still be a bigot.
20
wow. white college guys feel entitled. go figure.
23
Don't discount the changes currently impacting young men in the marriage and sexual marketplace. The Internet is awash in "Manosphere" blogs and forums consisting of young men who are disenfranchised and involuntarily celibate. Demographically there's a shortage of women now, particularly white women, which is a new issue that has led to Pick-Up Artist (PUA) culture and "game."
5
I’m sorry that Justice Ginsburg retreated on her comments about Trump.
She ought to have doubled down on him.
So should everybody else in a position to do so.
She ought to have doubled down on him.
So should everybody else in a position to do so.
28
I completely agree with what Justice Ginsburg said, but I really don't think justices should make political comments either way. And I'm afraid that actually may have helped Trump more than hurt him.
16
I agree with you 100%! I was so sad to see that headline today. The double standard that exists between judging Trump's actions and words and the actions and words of any other person in the political arena esp. Democrats is an abomination. The media has a lot to answer for and may well bring this country to its knees if they continue with their bromance with Trump.
3
Thank goodness I am married to a college educated man who would never vote for Donald Trump. As a man, Trump stands for everything he is NOT.
15
Something tells me these college-educated men have a degree like the one the Scarecrow got at the end of The Wizard of Oz. It's really just a piece of paper, it doesn't promise that you'll actually use your brain.
23
Very thoughtful article. We wonder how Trump can possibly succeed at the rate he's insulting people. But Clinton, her campaign, and her supporters spew coded micro-aggressions based on social class and gender, as this article makes pretty clear, and then expects her targets to vote for her? Even Trump isn't THAT shortsighted!
12
Is encouraging whites citizens to talk to black citizens about all these shootings of young black men, and acknowledging that we as whites may still have biases, really a "coded micro-aggression"?
I'm not familiar with her comments about the deaths of the Dallas police officers, I admit, but it sounds she's trying to talk about these issues AS a white person, rather than targeting white people.
I'm not familiar with her comments about the deaths of the Dallas police officers, I admit, but it sounds she's trying to talk about these issues AS a white person, rather than targeting white people.
8
Agreed, but it's coming from a segment of her supporters, not Hillary. She's been far more understanding of everyone's struggles, regardless of race and socio-economic background.
2
Hillary has two problems that she will never shake: Tone deafness and dishonesty. And maybe "The Death of Men" is, (to paraphrase Mark Twain) greatly exaggerated.
10
Donald Trump has those same qualities. Why does that not matter to you?
2
All of this is so sad. "For Whites Sensing Decline, Trump Has Words of Resistance", reads a headline. For some of us the sense of decline has been in the elevation politically of Trump.
13
You can still be very ignorant with a college degree. Look at our Republican brothers in government. Anti-science, chauvanistic, dogmatic, and ultimately racists. These backward looking memes are hard to shake. They learned these ideas at their family table.
19
Today is the worst time to be a white male in American history. Today is also the best time to be a minority or women in American history.
These trends will continue until the white man is a minority, at which point white men will ask women and today's minorities for help.
Around and around we go.
These trends will continue until the white man is a minority, at which point white men will ask women and today's minorities for help.
Around and around we go.
4
"Today is also the best time to be a minority or women in American history." Sure, if you discount the wage gap, the opportunity gap and the personal safety gap. White men = still on top. They just don't like to share.
20
You're correct that there remain serious societal disadvantages for women and minorities, but I think the previous commentator's point still stands: what time in American history was better to be a minority or woman? That's not the same as saying "it's better today to be a minority or woman than a white man".
6
Really? think this is just a bit of an exaggeration. Who are 90% of the CEOs, for example?
7
I was in the easy going and liberal escape Cape Cod two weeks ago, surrounded by some very bright medical and legal minds and everyone made it very obvious they were Trump supporters. The media is pumping a narrative that all of Trump's supporters are angry toothless rubes in flyover country, but sorry, I haven't found that to be true in real life.
16
Many in the medical and legal world are privileged white bigots: no surprise here.
12
C'mon jgm - that was uncalled for --- not all white people are privileged, and not all are bigots. I know it is hard, I grew up poor, but someone told me, life is what you make it, so don't make yours calling those in the legal and medical field white bigots. The bible says you shouldn't treat a man in fine clothes any different than a man in shoddy clothes. Now c'mon.
5
@ Tom from DC
"After listening to decades of propaganda about the value of diversity; I never hear about meritocracy. Why?"
Diversity simply means that equally qualified women and people of color are now included, along with white men.
In the past, these groups were excluded from consideration, regardless of their merit, solely in favor of (only) white men.
"After listening to decades of propaganda about the value of diversity; I never hear about meritocracy. Why?"
Diversity simply means that equally qualified women and people of color are now included, along with white men.
In the past, these groups were excluded from consideration, regardless of their merit, solely in favor of (only) white men.
11
White male college graduates are the nation's "tax serfs" and "whipping boys". We make too much money to benefit from tax expenditures such as the EITC, child tax credits, Obama Care, or progressive Social Security retirement benefits, but we make too little money for a substantial slice of our labor income to fall under the ceiling for Social Security taxes. We also weren't born with a silver spoon in our mouth so we don't benefit from the preferential treatment of capital gains. As a consequence, we pay a net tax burden way out of proportion to our share of national income. We don't have wealthy or well-connected parents who paved the way for our success. On the contrary, we've seen college admissions, jobs, and promotions go to less qualified individuals so that elites can feel better about America's treatment of women and minorities. It really shouldn't be a surprise that many of us have rebelled against a stacked system by retiring early and giving the finger to establishment politics by throwing our political support behind Trump.
13
Meant to say "ABOVE the ceiling for Social Security taxes."
2
And Trump is supposed to help you how?
He of the wealthy parent and million dollar loan to get started in daddy's business?
He of the wealthy parent and million dollar loan to get started in daddy's business?
12
I think if you're going to claim that all of the women and minorities who have been more successful in college admissions, jobs, and promotions are "less qualified" than white male college graduates, you should provide at least SOME hard evidence for that claim. Anyone can see a successful woman or minority person and grumble that they only got there based on preferential treatment--but what do unbiased authoritative studies have to say? Before voting for someone like Trump based on something that SOUNDS true, I'd urge you to find out if it actually is.
3
I'm not surprised that support for Trump goes beyond "rednecks" and the flock who vote Republican regardless of who is on the ticket. Trump is successfully tapping into the anger and frustration many people feel. They're angry about an economic system of Global Capitalism that enormously enriches a tiny minority at the expense of everyone else. They're frustrated with a political system that responds only to donors and ignores them.
It doesn't matter that Trump is a narcissistic huckster who exploits that anger solely to advance himself. Unlike other politicians, he acknowledges the anger and offers "solutions." No matter that those "solutions" are impractical and will only exacerbate the problem if implemented. For many voters who feel abandoned and hopeless, Trump offers hope of a bright future in a Great America.
Trump's Republican competitors offered only regurgitated Reaganomics, which many now recognize as a major cause of their plight. And at best, Hillary offers only continuation of the current failed system. The likely chaos and destruction of a Trump presidency is attractive to voters who feel they have nothing to lose by lobbing an orange-haired grenade into the White House. The elites of both parties clearly do not appreciate the depth of outrage against them and the system they represent.
Trump's lead may be greater than the numbers show, as I suspect many who plan to vote for him will not admit that to pollsters. Hillary has a lot of work to do.
It doesn't matter that Trump is a narcissistic huckster who exploits that anger solely to advance himself. Unlike other politicians, he acknowledges the anger and offers "solutions." No matter that those "solutions" are impractical and will only exacerbate the problem if implemented. For many voters who feel abandoned and hopeless, Trump offers hope of a bright future in a Great America.
Trump's Republican competitors offered only regurgitated Reaganomics, which many now recognize as a major cause of their plight. And at best, Hillary offers only continuation of the current failed system. The likely chaos and destruction of a Trump presidency is attractive to voters who feel they have nothing to lose by lobbing an orange-haired grenade into the White House. The elites of both parties clearly do not appreciate the depth of outrage against them and the system they represent.
Trump's lead may be greater than the numbers show, as I suspect many who plan to vote for him will not admit that to pollsters. Hillary has a lot of work to do.
55
Overlooked here is the fact that Trump cannot make a coherent statement about the economy, trade, or foreign affairs. Why would anyone with who has actually listened to him speak believe he can lead our nation?
4
You know, I really wonder if its not much simpler than this. What does Trump really offer? He can say any mean, vulgar, or impolite thing he wants publicly and people cheer. His money and his TV show make him appear to have super-human powers. Every third person who supports him thinks he simply "gets things done" while mere mortal politicians cannot. This isn't something that one can see through simply because they have a college degree. This a dream that things will suddenly, completely turn around and life will be easier--brought to us by a "Superman" who cannot be bought. It wouldn't surprise me if a lot of these college-educated whites know little about the political system at all, and care about it even less.
7
So, in a nutshell, Trump appeals to racists and sexists.
28
Howard Rosenthal's reported observations regarding redistribution make sense but bear expanding. First, Hillary Clinton may support redistribution among the middle and working class that has the net effect of reducing opportunity for white makes, college educated or not, but she is completely silent on the redistribution championed by both Republicans and Corporate Democrats over the past thirty years that shifts a trillion dollars annually from those sectors to the top 5%. When she is silent on that while willing to redistribute someone else's share of the pie it seems she is embracing a "protect the elites" stance that largely undercuts any critique of Donald Trump and his tax cuts for the rich policy stance. Second, one can make an argument the biggest beneficiaries of affirmative action have been white women, so not only is Clinton supporting redistribution by social class but also by gender. In effect the argument of the Clintonistas is that redistributive policies that reduce the privileged status middle class white males are acceptable while being rather mealy-mouthed and vague about how to be supportive of those losing status and opportunity. In effect Clinton promotes redistribution to women and minorities, accepts redistribution to elites, tolerates loss of opportunity via trade/investment/technology, and then wonders why a significant portion of the electorate spurns her. It is still the economy, stupid!
6
Why college men for Trump?
How many of these men are attending business schools?
How many of these men are attending business schools?
9
Interesting that Josh Kraushaar's three possible reasons for Hillary "cratering" with white men are all her fault, lol. What's obviously missing from his analysis is white men's misogyny, which Clinton, and the rest of us, can't do much about. Except patiently wait and watch those white men lose in November. Oh Happy Day. :)
23
Why would white men, as a group, hate women? The majority aren't gay - they enjoy the company of women. So why do you believe they hate women (the language you used - misogynistic) ?
Since white women have almost the exact same lack of enthusiasm for Trump as men do for Clinton, why isn't it that white women guilty of misandry? Why isn't it that they don't like Trump because they hate men? (hint: maybe it's not about hate at all)
Since white women have almost the exact same lack of enthusiasm for Trump as men do for Clinton, why isn't it that white women guilty of misandry? Why isn't it that they don't like Trump because they hate men? (hint: maybe it's not about hate at all)
1
"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." H.L. Mencken, 1915
9
Switzerland just recently voted down a referendum that sought to pay all adults an unconditional monthly income as a means of countering globalization and automation taking away jobs; and here in the United States, where GOP politicians are scrambling to cut away what little safety net programs are left to struggling citizens, we are talking about how "redistribution" is fueling Trumpism!
What redistribution are you talking about?! You mean x-slave owners want their slaves back or what?!
15
A 4 year college degree does not mean that one is "educated". Course work involving the use of critical thinking skills is essential to a well rounded education. A degree in business may not entail a healthy does of history, psychology, literature, or other disciplines in the liberal arts which may turn off white GOP males with an authoritarian bent. There is a huge difference between an educated person and a technician.
29
The subtext of the rebellion of primal icons against liberal Western thought of the twentieth century is that nurture over nature becomes a determiner, now with a new freedom, used by the right, for those who cast off the garb of religion. The liberal nurture bias is something that should have been cautioned as: “be careful what you wish for.” Which constructs are assigned with assumption, as nature and which nurture can undergo shifts in presumptive categories over time as to how left and right and even individuals make assignments.
Just because we can’t unpack discrete answers between nature and nurture or between genetic determiners of behavior and learned social constructs doesn’t mean the distinction is unimportant or is vaguely inapplicable and thus should remain not discussed.
The issue cuts both ways. A prime social issue of gender identity, now much more broadly accepted among the middle-right, shows how natural determiners have drifted into popular culture as harmless, while male dominance could be expressed likewise as natural and thus OK. As natural predilections, should males suppress and control instinct toward dominance (if it is assigned this way), while gender identity should be freely expressed?
Just because we can’t unpack discrete answers between nature and nurture or between genetic determiners of behavior and learned social constructs doesn’t mean the distinction is unimportant or is vaguely inapplicable and thus should remain not discussed.
The issue cuts both ways. A prime social issue of gender identity, now much more broadly accepted among the middle-right, shows how natural determiners have drifted into popular culture as harmless, while male dominance could be expressed likewise as natural and thus OK. As natural predilections, should males suppress and control instinct toward dominance (if it is assigned this way), while gender identity should be freely expressed?
1
Do Black people love illegal immigration? All the articles imply that they do, but I've never seen actual data.
3
"There has been a large expansion of the bottom tier, with relatively more students graduating from Cal State Hayward or Cal State Dominguez Hills than from Berkeley or UCLA." Could the Times be any more snobbish? On one hand, you bemoan the lack of social mobility in the US, particularly among the poor and working classes, and on the other hand you sneer at anyone who has the temerity to attend - shock! - a less prestigious university. The more I read of the Times' articles on Trump, the more I understand why people are willing to vote for him. Coastal elites have looked down on the rest of the country for far too long, and the people you constantly condescend to are sick of it.
12
I support Clinton over Trump—I like her and will be so proud to have the first "First Gentleman" in the White House!
16
If this surprises you, then you haven't spent time on a college campus recently. For anyone who questions why minorities on campuses choose to form affinity groups for mutual support, these results should answer your question.
11
This trend of "if you support Trump then you are white and racist" reminds me of Brexit's "you either vote Remain or you are racist". But it's counter-productive. When a large group of voters have concerns it's better to respectfully address them instead of shaming them, while ignoring their concerns. That's how democracy works.
It's a politicians' job (including Mrs. Clinton) to listen to voters and try to appeal to them, or at least to be aware of and respect their concerns. And let's face it, Mrs. Clinton very openly and intentionally ignores whites and, specifically, she ignores white men. Why would they want to vote for her? What did she do for them? Why should they sacrifice their interests for someone who ignores them? This is what's going; and it has very little to do with racism, not matter how much NYT pushes the idea.
OMG
It's a politicians' job (including Mrs. Clinton) to listen to voters and try to appeal to them, or at least to be aware of and respect their concerns. And let's face it, Mrs. Clinton very openly and intentionally ignores whites and, specifically, she ignores white men. Why would they want to vote for her? What did she do for them? Why should they sacrifice their interests for someone who ignores them? This is what's going; and it has very little to do with racism, not matter how much NYT pushes the idea.
OMG
9
Look at the faces in the picture. They're in it for the show. Let's go hate on some people, get drunk afterward, and have ourselves a good time. Not surprised they're in Virginia.
13
"Not surprised they're in Virginia." That's like me saying "not surprised she's from Minnesota" to someone who bases an entire state off of a picture of a Trump rally.
7
So white "bros" with "mommy" issues are for Trump?
Not really surprising. And they account for 100% of the ticket sales for Adam Sandler movies.
Not really surprising. And they account for 100% of the ticket sales for Adam Sandler movies.
16
Bigotry, sexism, racism? It seems a lot of people are wondering what moral flaw underpins the choices of those white male voters. Did anyone consider a simple post-recession, anti-establishment, protest movement? Trump is certainly not establishment and Hillary is. Like him or not, Trump has the unquestionable "you're fired" persona. Perhaps they simply want to see the establishment fired, and Trump is the only one left in the room promising to do it.
9
People who vote for Trump because he is the "you're fired"guy are likely to find themselves fired if he is elected.
2
This college educated white independent male strongly agrees with both of the following statements:
LEGAL Immigrants strengthen the country through hard work, talents.
ILLEGAL Immigrants burden the country by taking jobs, housing and health care.
The fact that Hillary and the rest of the Democratic Party consider me "racist" for making the distinction as a part of their new identity politics platform, is a big part of why after nearly 30 years of voting mostly for Democrats I won't vote for her or any other Democrat this fall.
I work in technology and am literally surrounded by legal immigrants on a daily basis. Most of them don't look anything like me, but all of them are not substantially different from me. We are all a part of what makes America great.
Conversely when I see people, who can't even be bothered to learn English, waving Mexican flags and screaming about how racist this country is, or worse assaulting people for politically disagreeing, I start to think that Trump has a point.
LEGAL Immigrants strengthen the country through hard work, talents.
ILLEGAL Immigrants burden the country by taking jobs, housing and health care.
The fact that Hillary and the rest of the Democratic Party consider me "racist" for making the distinction as a part of their new identity politics platform, is a big part of why after nearly 30 years of voting mostly for Democrats I won't vote for her or any other Democrat this fall.
I work in technology and am literally surrounded by legal immigrants on a daily basis. Most of them don't look anything like me, but all of them are not substantially different from me. We are all a part of what makes America great.
Conversely when I see people, who can't even be bothered to learn English, waving Mexican flags and screaming about how racist this country is, or worse assaulting people for politically disagreeing, I start to think that Trump has a point.
11
If you really do think "Trump has a point," you're not listening very carefully.
4
Depressing. So much for the value of a college education!
9
College educated and dumb at the same time.
To all the women involved with these guys, go out and volunteer for Hillary now— your boyfriends or husbands are willing to trash the United States because ultimately, they just can't vote for a woman President.
Globalism, immigrants, redistribution— phooey. It's all about the gender.
To all the women involved with these guys, go out and volunteer for Hillary now— your boyfriends or husbands are willing to trash the United States because ultimately, they just can't vote for a woman President.
Globalism, immigrants, redistribution— phooey. It's all about the gender.
16
I agree, for many women voting for Hillary Clinton is all about the gender.
7
Not.
I wouldn't vote for an unqualified narcissistic blowhard woman either.
And my guess is you didn't vote for Obama either.
I wouldn't vote for an unqualified narcissistic blowhard woman either.
And my guess is you didn't vote for Obama either.
2
crept she's not a sexist or racist homophobe
2
Has anyone considered that many of these educated white men voting for Trump may be doing so not so much because of loyalty to Trump as strong antipathy towards Mrs. Clinton?
8
this doesnt explain how a friend of mine - - very similar to me in most respects, age, education, family situation, profession - - is a huge Trump supporter. It is mind boggling.
I believe that most of his supporters cannot articulate any position of Herr Trump; they simply like that he sticks his middle finger at everyone who doesn't agree with him. No explanation from the candidate, no knowledge, no justification, just bluster that things are "wrong" "bad" and he, and he alone, can change them. Trust me, he yells, and it is unfortunately, for reasons I can't explain, hitting a nerve.
I don't think there is a rational explanation for his support.
I believe that most of his supporters cannot articulate any position of Herr Trump; they simply like that he sticks his middle finger at everyone who doesn't agree with him. No explanation from the candidate, no knowledge, no justification, just bluster that things are "wrong" "bad" and he, and he alone, can change them. Trust me, he yells, and it is unfortunately, for reasons I can't explain, hitting a nerve.
I don't think there is a rational explanation for his support.
13
The picture looks like the brain trust of Podunk U. Attending college and graduating as an educated, critical-thinking citizen are often two different things. The insecure white males who see the buffoon as their hero and savior will be the first ones to squeal when the true face of Trump and his empty promises get us into a war without any allies. Go back to your civic and government textbooks and read them this time.
15
There is less here than meets the eye. A degree from a second-tier college or university is pretty much what a high school diploma was some decades ago. My guess is that if the data were further refined, a significant majority of white males with degrees from top schools oppose Trump and all he represents. That isn't especially reassuring, as in the end what will count is who votes. If progressives sit on their hands because Hillary isn't good enough for them, Trump has a real chance. And New Zealand will indeed look very good in that event.
68
Alternative headline: "Entitled white men discover that doing the bare minimum no longer guarantees social and economic dominance."
12
So much of this has to do with fear - fear of strangers, of the other, of people not like you. This is a hard-wired human trait and it's common among all mammals and birds. It's a survival trait, and in the past served us well.
Now, though, it can be harmful if not channeled properly - that is, in a civilized way, because civilization, and civil behavior, is also a survival trait.
As a white male, I understand the fear of Trump's white male supporters. But as the article points out, when they lash out at immigrants, their fear is misplaced - immigrants, after all are just other people trying to survive.
It comes down to empathy - another fundamental survival trait. We survived as a species because we took care of each other, knowing we would die trying to go it alone. But empathy is failing now, and that failure begins with the elite who run nations and economies.
Globalism began as a way to help everybody prosper and lessen the chance of war. But the ruling classes of the world have co-opted that idealism for their own purposes. The elite's beloved "restructuring" of the economy has left millions of Americans behind - job security is a thing of the past, except for those at the very top, who not only have become even richer but also have reserved the best schools for themselves while slashing education for everybody else, thus eliminating any chance for those left behind to join the global economy.
Thus angry white males and immigrants are more alike than different.
Now, though, it can be harmful if not channeled properly - that is, in a civilized way, because civilization, and civil behavior, is also a survival trait.
As a white male, I understand the fear of Trump's white male supporters. But as the article points out, when they lash out at immigrants, their fear is misplaced - immigrants, after all are just other people trying to survive.
It comes down to empathy - another fundamental survival trait. We survived as a species because we took care of each other, knowing we would die trying to go it alone. But empathy is failing now, and that failure begins with the elite who run nations and economies.
Globalism began as a way to help everybody prosper and lessen the chance of war. But the ruling classes of the world have co-opted that idealism for their own purposes. The elite's beloved "restructuring" of the economy has left millions of Americans behind - job security is a thing of the past, except for those at the very top, who not only have become even richer but also have reserved the best schools for themselves while slashing education for everybody else, thus eliminating any chance for those left behind to join the global economy.
Thus angry white males and immigrants are more alike than different.
8
Poorly educated white males blame immigrants for overburdening the tax system. Ironically, they don’t realize their taxes are higher because Trump pays zero taxes. They will even support that. It’s almost laughable.
16
Liking Trump is easy. Regardless of what the liberal press says, he is not a misogynist, nor is he a thief or a liar - fortunately, given my education, it's easy to see through the "questionable stories" portrayed as news.
What Trump is, or I hope he will be, is a return to common-sense governance. Dodd-Frank went way beyond what is reasonable (way beyond), so has the EPA, and then there's the expansion of Medicare, Obamacare and Welfare - again, way over the top and failing (badly).
We've never had such a long period of less than 4% growth for our country than Obama's tenure - he's easily beat the previous two-year record recorded during the Great Depression of the 30's. Virtually all of the jobs that have been created have gone to immigrants who have swelled up our country dramatically.
We can see that the Clinton's will keep the "Hidden Depression" going and don't like it, thus we're for the alternative - growth and prosperity and the person offering it - Donald Trump.
What Trump is, or I hope he will be, is a return to common-sense governance. Dodd-Frank went way beyond what is reasonable (way beyond), so has the EPA, and then there's the expansion of Medicare, Obamacare and Welfare - again, way over the top and failing (badly).
We've never had such a long period of less than 4% growth for our country than Obama's tenure - he's easily beat the previous two-year record recorded during the Great Depression of the 30's. Virtually all of the jobs that have been created have gone to immigrants who have swelled up our country dramatically.
We can see that the Clinton's will keep the "Hidden Depression" going and don't like it, thus we're for the alternative - growth and prosperity and the person offering it - Donald Trump.
6
Actually Trump is a misogynist, a thief and a liar. 3,500 lawsuits against him and counting. You are pulling the wool over your own eyes, sorry.
3
Any proof of most jobs going to immigrants? I'll save you the time. There isn't.
There is a TON of proof Trump is a fraud. I guess all the small businesses he never paid are lying, among others.
There is a TON of proof Trump is a fraud. I guess all the small businesses he never paid are lying, among others.
6
Trump can't even govern himself to get through a speech and stay on topic.
How is he going to govern the people?
You can use all the lipstick you want, but he's still a pig.
How is he going to govern the people?
You can use all the lipstick you want, but he's still a pig.
6
This all boils down to economics. Even if you are white and college educated, the fact is that the contract between worker and workplace has been fractured. A good paying lifetime job and a pension is no long a given leading to economic insecurity. College costs have risen significantly beyond the ability of families to pay leading to worry about the future of their children. Even if a family is able to afford housing in a good school system, the stories about equally well off immigrant or AA children being given priority acceptance to colleges rankles. I am definitely not a Trump supporter but I do think that this economic instability needs to be acknowledged. Yes, these white college educated men are better off than the rest of the population but that does not make their worries any less real for them.
8
Young guys coming from "frat boy" culture will follow the alpha male every time!
They are no longer under mom and dad's supervision, so they adopt bold, controversial positions to show off their emerging masculinity. They like to shock.
It's ironic though, since becoming a leader means not being a follower, which is what they are doing. they don't really understand their issues with authority, they just act out. Trump knows this, hence his unflinching "strong man" persona.
They are no longer under mom and dad's supervision, so they adopt bold, controversial positions to show off their emerging masculinity. They like to shock.
It's ironic though, since becoming a leader means not being a follower, which is what they are doing. they don't really understand their issues with authority, they just act out. Trump knows this, hence his unflinching "strong man" persona.
12
As always, a little historical context might go a long way toward easing the fears of these anxious white guys. Ideally, the college grads among them would have gotten some inkling about this during school, but maybe people don't want to hear what they don't like. The hard fact is that the history of civilizations is one of constant ebb and flow, of ongoing flux among peoples and nations, of one group or another riding high in April but being shot down in May, metaphorically speaking. The tragedy would be that America (so young! so full of potential!) fails to grasp this reality. No, aggrieved hordes of blokes, it's not possible to colonize a territory, eradicate the indigenous population of the moment, then take power and hold onto it forever without interference from somebody other than those in your own little fraternity. If this is what white guys (and I'm a white gal) imagine, they are pitifully unaware of the historical moment in which we now find ourselves. What's happening to them isn't unique; it's happened to many millions over many thousands of years. It's just white guys' turn now. Maybe it's a barometer of just how tenaciously the silly notion of "exceptionalism" has taken hold of us in this country that anyone actually believes their momentary dominance is permanent. Suggest that post-colonial America double down on efforts to truly educate its citizens on these broad contextual issues, lest we embarrass ourselves further on the national stage. Vote Clinton!
7
This white, male, college graduate, wants nothing to do with Mr. Trump. I am thankful, however, that he effectively knocked Mike Pence out of my state's governor's office.
14
That one can be stupid and make really, really bad decisions with a four year college degree is nothing new. That being said, voting for Trump after successfully completing a four year degree must mean those individuals graduated from Trump University.
9
After Mr. Trump made his racist views on Muslims and Hispanic people, one can extrapolate and guess he does not like any people of color. So, any vote for Trump is a vote for the continuation of the disastrous path of racism which plagues the U.S. going back to slavery. Racism IMHO fueled by the GOP and their supporters over the years, and by Mr. Trump.
Isn't racism a result of ignorance? I thought so. But if even college graduates vote for Trump in such staggering proportions, we have to ask ourselves if the racism which has flown in the veins of many generations of Americans since slavery, and still do, can ever be suppressed or at least attenuated by the effect of a good education.
Isn't racism a result of ignorance? I thought so. But if even college graduates vote for Trump in such staggering proportions, we have to ask ourselves if the racism which has flown in the veins of many generations of Americans since slavery, and still do, can ever be suppressed or at least attenuated by the effect of a good education.
8
College educated or not, it's critical thinking that matters. And it's impossible to believe that critical thinking is involved in the minds of anyone who believes that despite all the ongoing evidence to the contrary that Donald Trump has the right stuff to be president of the United States, commander in chief of our armed forces, and leader of the free world much less the substantial other stable personal characteristics, depth, and wisdom all that entails and requires.
46
I know several well-educated men who support Trump. The reasons why are complicated, but I get the sense that many of them simply want their tax rate lowered.
I get the feeling that all of them despise the idea of their taxes going to minorities, single mothers, the jobless, the disabled...those people, in other words. It's very easy for them to forget the subsidies and tax breaks they themselves get.
I get the feeling that all of them despise the idea of their taxes going to minorities, single mothers, the jobless, the disabled...those people, in other words. It's very easy for them to forget the subsidies and tax breaks they themselves get.
126
Yet, they have no problem with a billionaire not paying any taxes.
7
The U.S. has the lowest taxes - by far - among OECD nations. And it's laughable for those who insist that corporate taxes here are burdensome, considering the extent to which corporations have gamed the system so as to avoid paying any taxes at all. Deal in facts, not myths, please.
9
You underestimate the importance of other issues on this voter population, including a strong national defense and a vibrant economy with shrinking debt.
1
There's a lot of ink spilled here to try and dress up the truth many of us non-males and non-whites already know: Donald Trump's appeal lies in his one and only policy, which is the advancement of white men to the detriment of everyone else in what they see as a zero-sum game. Degree or no, these white men are voting to maintain their dominance because they can't comprehend sharing. That's all.
136
True. Exploitative politicians like Trump paint a ''zero-sum game'' picture, as if improving access to education, jobs, and services by the poor, by women, people of color, LGBT people, etc., necessarily means less pie for straight white men. If politicians stopped pitting us against each other, and started figuring out how to make the economy function in a sustainable way for all of us, especially the non-wealthy majority (which happens to include plenty of white men), we wouldn't see campaign pictures of people who look like raving animals fighting over fresh kill.
1
Thoughts:
So much for the purported "liberal bias" in higher education...
As for "redistribution", if the pie remains the same size, no one likes getting a smaller slice for someone else to get a larger slice. Or just a slice at all. The idea baking bigger pies to ensure larger slices for others seems to have been either forgotten, ignored or repudiated. See also: Jamie Dimon...
So much for the purported "liberal bias" in higher education...
As for "redistribution", if the pie remains the same size, no one likes getting a smaller slice for someone else to get a larger slice. Or just a slice at all. The idea baking bigger pies to ensure larger slices for others seems to have been either forgotten, ignored or repudiated. See also: Jamie Dimon...
13
The impact of "colleges in name only" on what we mean by a college "education" is mentioned as a factor in this op-ed.Missing from it is the central role of Macho/bro culture,unique amongst Western developed countries and attributable in no small measure to the national religion-team sports.Misogyny is rife but outlets for it are few in our culture,particularly amongst the managerial and professional classes.That misogyny rears it's ugly head in anonymous polling and unfortunately,at the ballot box,is no surprise.
9
So much for a college education, although perhaps it happened earlier. Somewhere along the line, these men did not learn to think clearly or analytically.
Congress has continued the onslaught of educational fund cutting to our obvious detriment, and danger. We're losing ground to the rest of the world in math, science and now, most painfully, civics.
Congress has continued the onslaught of educational fund cutting to our obvious detriment, and danger. We're losing ground to the rest of the world in math, science and now, most painfully, civics.
15
Slann, Funny you should mention civics as I was doing my weekly hour of TV and saw an hysterical series of street interviews where people down by the beach in San Diego were being asked about July 4th and what it signified.
No one had a clue about anything to do with American history. Scary that these folks are granted admission to voting booths!
No one had a clue about anything to do with American history. Scary that these folks are granted admission to voting booths!
5
It's interesting that colleges in the U.S. have failed to proselytize their religion of multi-culturalism and anti-sexism, despite sticking to it since the 1970s, to white men. Call this religion political correctness or simply teaching deceny to people unlike oneself, it hasn't sold well. The right has been accusing the academy of being indoctrination centers for a long time, but the indoctrination hasn't worked. I wish it had.
2
That battle is still raging on campuses across the country, even in Ivy League bastions like Yale where the 'social justice' gangsters intimidated the school into changing the name of one of the 12 residential colleges to make a statement about history by changing it ipso post facto.
Then we have Janet Napalitano, who failed as governor of Arizona and was the worst possible person to head Homeland Insecurity, now heading up the U. of California where everyone is cautioned about "micro-agressions" and now "safe zones" have been established where you can exercise your First Amendment rights.
Seriously, you just can't make up stuff like this!
Then we have Janet Napalitano, who failed as governor of Arizona and was the worst possible person to head Homeland Insecurity, now heading up the U. of California where everyone is cautioned about "micro-agressions" and now "safe zones" have been established where you can exercise your First Amendment rights.
Seriously, you just can't make up stuff like this!
3
A good portion of the support from this demographic stems from the "frat boy" mentality, of which Trump and his lifestyle are the perfect exemplars.
Trump was born into wealth, studied business in college, became ultra-wealthy, owns numerous businesses, has his name all over buildings, clothing lines, etc., and has been married to gorgeous women. That's the white frat boy's dream rolled up into one orange, loud-mouthed package.
Couple that with discontent over immigration and the increased presence of women in fields traditionally dominated by men, and it's no wonder that the xenophobic, misogynistic frat star is polling so well amongst young white men.
Trump was born into wealth, studied business in college, became ultra-wealthy, owns numerous businesses, has his name all over buildings, clothing lines, etc., and has been married to gorgeous women. That's the white frat boy's dream rolled up into one orange, loud-mouthed package.
Couple that with discontent over immigration and the increased presence of women in fields traditionally dominated by men, and it's no wonder that the xenophobic, misogynistic frat star is polling so well amongst young white men.
32
I saw this coming at the very beginning of the affirmative action era when the "sure thing" that privileged white kids counted on: admission to prestigious colleges, a seat on the board at Daddy's business, even starring in sports, were now being "usurped" by deserving Blacks, and now Hispanics. One sign of the anger among these privileged white's was their activism in the Charter School movement--founding them, funding them, promoting them, as a means of focusing education and opportunity on the most "deserving"--read "White" or at least upper crust.
So no wonder they are pulling into a tight protective formation--better the scoundrel who will march them lock-step into power than the uncertainty of leaving it all open to talent! Better to game the system or the next generation won't be enjoying the privileges they deserve!
So no wonder they are pulling into a tight protective formation--better the scoundrel who will march them lock-step into power than the uncertainty of leaving it all open to talent! Better to game the system or the next generation won't be enjoying the privileges they deserve!
9
Try telling that to all the very high achieving Asian students who are turned down for admission to good schools to make room for the slackers admitted in the name of diversity.
That is real prejudice!
That is real prejudice!
6
Let the Asians in instead of the Whites then. Why do the Whites have to be in the majority and what Ivy League college is even close to 1/3 'diverse' (i.e. Black)?
1
Haven't there been enough lawsuits and verdicts about college admissions to show that race (or diversity) being considered as one factor among many is not discrimination? There will never be a perfect world where someone doesn't think a "slacker" took their spot in a good school, but still....
Such a long article on something that is so obvious and intuitive.
If one could summarize Trump’s candidacy, it would be the fear of the other. White males, including college-educated males, grew up with a certain expectation of their place in American society and workplace. Growing up, they mostly saw other while males at the top of the heap, whether in society at large, or in the workforce. But now they face an increasingly changing reality. Asians are flooding top colleges and universities, based on merit and not on ethnicity. Minorities and women are making important inroads into the higher echelons of business and management. So many college-educated men make less money than their better or similarly educated wives. This is hard to swallow for a lot of them. So, when Trump talks about making America great again, it resonates with a lot of them.
If one could summarize Trump’s candidacy, it would be the fear of the other. White males, including college-educated males, grew up with a certain expectation of their place in American society and workplace. Growing up, they mostly saw other while males at the top of the heap, whether in society at large, or in the workforce. But now they face an increasingly changing reality. Asians are flooding top colleges and universities, based on merit and not on ethnicity. Minorities and women are making important inroads into the higher echelons of business and management. So many college-educated men make less money than their better or similarly educated wives. This is hard to swallow for a lot of them. So, when Trump talks about making America great again, it resonates with a lot of them.
10
I'm one of those college educated white men who "plan to vote for Trump without liking him." Rosenthal had it correct - "“The Democratic Party and Hillary Clinton are engaged in identity politics. And the redistribution is not win-win,”
I'm not anti-immigrant (my wife is Hispanic) or anti-trade. But look at the difference between Bill Clinton (who I would vote for) and Hillary. Bill pushed for policies that were at least intended to be "win-win" including Welfare Reform (which reduced the number of children living in poverty by 2.9 million kids) or the Crime Bill (which greatly reduced violent crime in this country). By contrast, Hillary is pushing for a continued expansion of Obama's policies which take money from one pocket and give it to another. That's inherently divisive. It's also fiscally irresponsible since even though Obama increased tax revenue by $530 bn between 2013 and 2015, this still couldn't keep up with his spending. As a result, our debt has almost doubled from $10 tn to $19 tn.
Having said that, Edsall's point about women being attracted to more "communal" professionals is antiquated. This generalization of women as "nurse or homemaker" was true when I was a child. Our pediatrician was a woman but this was unusual. But now, there are more women than men in college, medical school and law school. My wife is a lawyer and it's no longer surprising. In fact, the increase of women into the workforce is one of America's great success stories.
I'm not anti-immigrant (my wife is Hispanic) or anti-trade. But look at the difference between Bill Clinton (who I would vote for) and Hillary. Bill pushed for policies that were at least intended to be "win-win" including Welfare Reform (which reduced the number of children living in poverty by 2.9 million kids) or the Crime Bill (which greatly reduced violent crime in this country). By contrast, Hillary is pushing for a continued expansion of Obama's policies which take money from one pocket and give it to another. That's inherently divisive. It's also fiscally irresponsible since even though Obama increased tax revenue by $530 bn between 2013 and 2015, this still couldn't keep up with his spending. As a result, our debt has almost doubled from $10 tn to $19 tn.
Having said that, Edsall's point about women being attracted to more "communal" professionals is antiquated. This generalization of women as "nurse or homemaker" was true when I was a child. Our pediatrician was a woman but this was unusual. But now, there are more women than men in college, medical school and law school. My wife is a lawyer and it's no longer surprising. In fact, the increase of women into the workforce is one of America's great success stories.
11
Dear Princeton 2015,
Your reasons for voting for a grifter and con man, who is also a racist and xenophobe and who is being supported by David Duke and other white supremicists and anti-semites, do not strike me as persuasive.
How would you have dealt with the problem of inequality without some redistributionist policies, such as the Affordable Care Act? Also, as Paul Krugman has argued in these pages, concern with the deficit is overblown in an era in which money is cheap and inflation is non-existent.
I trust that your political values make you an outlier in your class.
Your reasons for voting for a grifter and con man, who is also a racist and xenophobe and who is being supported by David Duke and other white supremicists and anti-semites, do not strike me as persuasive.
How would you have dealt with the problem of inequality without some redistributionist policies, such as the Affordable Care Act? Also, as Paul Krugman has argued in these pages, concern with the deficit is overblown in an era in which money is cheap and inflation is non-existent.
I trust that your political values make you an outlier in your class.
7
Bull. Obama's policies have better for the wealthy, and you know it. The idea that his policies are redistribution are farcical Fox News nonsense.
8
I suppose, Mike, that you know what I know better than I know.
2
Perhaps this should be read in light of the public rationale given for investment shifting from creating a nation of educated citizens to being a glorified scheme to hand out formal qualifications for employment.
6
Let's just say all colleges are not the same.
7
Trump's make American great again is really code for make America the place for unabashed entitlements for White men where women and minorities know their places and stay in them. Trump knows who he is signaling to and what message he is channeling. Why is it so hard for everyone else to figure this out?
48
You are right on target, and yes, it is so obvious. Trump is separating the wheat from the chaff for me, causing sexist and racist friends and family to come out of their closets, and I'm detaching from them, giving them no more energy, for they belong in the past, not in the now and the future. My Hillary lawn sign has been trashed 5 times since I put it up a week ago, always in the dark of night, by cowards.
125
Gosh, professor, where can I get one of your "secret de-coder rings?" The last one I saw came from a box of Cracker Jacks.
Perhaps, Trump means exactly what he is saying. It is time for America to keep jobs on our own soil, stop the flood of illegal aliens (not undocumented workers), and repair our tattered infrastructure.
Perhaps, Trump means exactly what he is saying. It is time for America to keep jobs on our own soil, stop the flood of illegal aliens (not undocumented workers), and repair our tattered infrastructure.
3
Because this blowhard, conman is not actually going to do anything he claims.
9
A man having a college education only means he has a college education.
It doesn't mean he's not a sexist.
It doesn't mean he's not a racist.
It doesn't mean he's not ignorant about the world.
It doesn't mean he doesn't blame everyone but himself for being a loser.
Obviously, these college-educated men who support Trump agree with all of the above about him.
It doesn't mean he's not a sexist.
It doesn't mean he's not a racist.
It doesn't mean he's not ignorant about the world.
It doesn't mean he doesn't blame everyone but himself for being a loser.
Obviously, these college-educated men who support Trump agree with all of the above about him.
14
Not one face of color in the accompanying photograph. That speaks volumes about the appeal of this candidate.
17
Why on God's green earth would a male, black, white, to in between vote for Hillary Clinton. The mind boggles at the black males who support her. It was Bill's tough on crime bill that saw the mass incarceration of millions of young black males. She is a feminist, and by definition, a misandrist.
12
I am a feminist and proud of it, and any intelligent, fair-minded man is a feminist. Why on earth would any female of any color support Trump? He is a sexist racist pig of the first order, a pathetic excuse for a man.
10
That's fine. We agree to disagree. But understand that what you are seeing in the Trump, Sanders and I suspect Brexit camps is just the beginning. As a male, I've listened to and read some of the top feminists in the world, for almost fifty years. Up until now feminism has had little opposition. That's going to change. I want to see gender convergence as much as you. But I want it applied equally. Presently it is not. I see Hillary as racist and sexist as well, as I do most feminists. This is just the beginning of the other half of the gender revolution. You'd best get used to it.
4
Spot on, Anne!
1
Give me a break! There wouldn't be any "redistribution" if white men hadn't taken it all to begin with.
Just come out and say that all the Trump white men want to go back to when women, minorities (slaves) and everything else were property of white men and cut to the chase.
Just come out and say that all the Trump white men want to go back to when women, minorities (slaves) and everything else were property of white men and cut to the chase.
30
I think the point of this article was to get a bit beyond the long drilled (and for good reason) accusations of racism and sexism that no one reading this paper could possibly have missed. But if you honestly think Trump supporters want to re-institute slavery you'd be better suited reading Salon or the Huffington Post.
Of course there wouldn't be redistribution if the redistribution was even. But the author argues that there IS redistribution and there's to a certain degree natural (not GOOD, but natural) resistance to that. If you're serious about opposing it, you should probably make an attempt at understanding it.
Of course there wouldn't be redistribution if the redistribution was even. But the author argues that there IS redistribution and there's to a certain degree natural (not GOOD, but natural) resistance to that. If you're serious about opposing it, you should probably make an attempt at understanding it.
2
This entire article is based on a Pew Research Center Poll and a Langer Research poll commissioned by the Washington Post and ABC News, which both find no statistically significant difference in the support of college educated white men for Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.
To repeat.... Mr. Edsall has just based his entire article on a premise that is absolutely incorrect.
You know all of that statistics gobbledegook at the bottom of polls? Well, it actually means something. Taking the Langer poll for example, you can note that the margin of error of at least 4% for the cited statistic (registered voters), though the actual margin will inherently be higher because error margins for subsets of data are higher than for the complete set. That means that, best case scenario, at the confidence level of the poll, Mr. Trump's support for the relevant statistic is somewhere between 45% and 54% and Ms. Clinton's is somewhere between 40% and 48% (though, like I mentioned before, the spreads are actually wider than that).
That overlap in possible values means that the poll does not indicate a statistically verifiable difference between support by college educated white males for Clinton or Trump.
Don't believe me? Take a look at the methodology yourself:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/PollVault/abc-news-polling-methodology-standard...
This should be embarrassing institutionally for the Times and personally for Mr. Edsall. Want to bet if we get a correction?
To repeat.... Mr. Edsall has just based his entire article on a premise that is absolutely incorrect.
You know all of that statistics gobbledegook at the bottom of polls? Well, it actually means something. Taking the Langer poll for example, you can note that the margin of error of at least 4% for the cited statistic (registered voters), though the actual margin will inherently be higher because error margins for subsets of data are higher than for the complete set. That means that, best case scenario, at the confidence level of the poll, Mr. Trump's support for the relevant statistic is somewhere between 45% and 54% and Ms. Clinton's is somewhere between 40% and 48% (though, like I mentioned before, the spreads are actually wider than that).
That overlap in possible values means that the poll does not indicate a statistically verifiable difference between support by college educated white males for Clinton or Trump.
Don't believe me? Take a look at the methodology yourself:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/PollVault/abc-news-polling-methodology-standard...
This should be embarrassing institutionally for the Times and personally for Mr. Edsall. Want to bet if we get a correction?
9
Good comment, but Edsall won't be embarrassed and won't offer a correction. That's not how opinion writers work.
Speaking of misrepresenting and misunderstanding basic statistics, it's hilarious that Edsall approvingly quotes Susan T. Fiske, "professor of psychology and public affairs at Princeton." For a recent and damning discussion of the quality of Fiske's "research", see
http://andrewgelman.com/2016/07/05/30596/
Speaking of misrepresenting and misunderstanding basic statistics, it's hilarious that Edsall approvingly quotes Susan T. Fiske, "professor of psychology and public affairs at Princeton." For a recent and damning discussion of the quality of Fiske's "research", see
http://andrewgelman.com/2016/07/05/30596/
4
The reason the police shootings are national news, is because they affect a group that is already financially disadvantaged. In other words, these events adds insult to injury.
If a white guy gets shot by the cops, there is no outrage. Why? Because white people are too distracted spending their money to care.
At the end of the day, all people are selfish - it's biological. Why do blacks leave their hometown ghetto for a nicer suburb after landing a big paycheck? Because they value their personal space and security more then the ambiguous social justice cause, just like every stereotypical white person.
If a white guy gets shot by the cops, there is no outrage. Why? Because white people are too distracted spending their money to care.
At the end of the day, all people are selfish - it's biological. Why do blacks leave their hometown ghetto for a nicer suburb after landing a big paycheck? Because they value their personal space and security more then the ambiguous social justice cause, just like every stereotypical white person.
4
As a U.S. college educated white male, I would say it is 'the frat bro Gordon Gekko go getter attitude' that is appealing to the demographic in question. Finally, someone we can relate to based on the movies we watched in college and attitudes fraternity houses embraced. Blame Hollywood.
6
It still baffles me that after this country duly elected a black man as President and 4 years later comfortably re-elected him that I am still hearing about the endemic racism that permeates the whole US. It's not racism folks--it's fatigue.
9
Just because a black president got 51.1% of the vote, doesn't mean there aren't 48.9 percent of the population that hates him with a passion.
It is racism. If fatigue is setting in it's because some people willfully won't "get it".
It is racism. If fatigue is setting in it's because some people willfully won't "get it".
3
Obama got 51.1% of the popular vote in 2012. That doesn't sound like a very comfortable margin.
1
You are baffled because you don't understand. That's ok. Let me explain: electing a token black man does not make the entire system "not racist." Just like having a "black friend" does not mean you don't discriminate against black people in general.
3
No one ever discusses the structural social damage resulting from dumping several generations of children into warehouses called preschool babysitting as a contributing factor to this massive case of sour grapes among "white college age males."
4
College used to be a place where young people went to expand their minds and learn how to think critically. At some point this became seen as an elitist approach and universities adopted the business model of high-priced training schools where an actual education became a luxury and the only thinking students could do revolved around how they could make enough money to repay the debt they had incurred. The joy of learning for its own sake has been lost and the only relief students seem to have is binge-drinking. Thus the dumbing down of everyone.
16
Yep, Theresa, I am a PhD university prof, and you are so right.
3
In uncertain times, with more information than insight, pursuit of the collective good seems to take a back seat to tribal victory over "others". Maybe we were better off with less information than we are now drowning in partisan "realities". As a white male college educated part of the demographic, I am still voting for Hillary Clinton.
10
That white people, native to the US, stopped voting for democrats after Truman in 1948, and led the democratic party leadership to opt to import huge numbers of poor/illegals rather than change their horrific policies, is significant proof of the cancerous, wretched nature of the modern democratic party. They chose in 1965 that it would be better for their interests - not those of america - to import large numbers of poor, uneducated central/south americans who would need huge amounts of governmental help, which would in turn make them likely democratic voters.
This is the reason white males - and white females of intelligence - have reached their absolute breaking point with the democratic party. This mass invasion of illegals and legal immigrants is NOT in the best interest of the country, and will almost certainly lead to a mass uprising civil war, with associated retribution for the dems' liberal allies like the awful NYT.
This is the reason white males - and white females of intelligence - have reached their absolute breaking point with the democratic party. This mass invasion of illegals and legal immigrants is NOT in the best interest of the country, and will almost certainly lead to a mass uprising civil war, with associated retribution for the dems' liberal allies like the awful NYT.
13
I would rather work with the best of everybody than the best of white men.
Taking a defensive stance against intruders is the worst thing you could do for business. Mexicans, Asians, Middle Easterners have brought us not only competition for jobs, but also access to new markets, new products, new ways of thinking which will bring prosperity to everyone.
That said, I recoil at, say, tv ads which show white men as hopelessly incompetent, until the wife or somebody else comes in to show them how to fold a sheet or do the laundry. It is a cultural joke which is no longer funny -- the "honey do" list because the poor sod can't figure out what needs doing; the "better half" mentality in which the white man voluntarily recedes in competence. This cultural demeaning, sometimes volunteered by white men themselves, is deleterious, and will not be changed by an election.
Taking a defensive stance against intruders is the worst thing you could do for business. Mexicans, Asians, Middle Easterners have brought us not only competition for jobs, but also access to new markets, new products, new ways of thinking which will bring prosperity to everyone.
That said, I recoil at, say, tv ads which show white men as hopelessly incompetent, until the wife or somebody else comes in to show them how to fold a sheet or do the laundry. It is a cultural joke which is no longer funny -- the "honey do" list because the poor sod can't figure out what needs doing; the "better half" mentality in which the white man voluntarily recedes in competence. This cultural demeaning, sometimes volunteered by white men themselves, is deleterious, and will not be changed by an election.
4
These Trump-supporting white males are angry that jobs are scarce and incomes are suppressed. However, they refuse to place the blame on other white males, particularly those in the 1% who told everyone their huge tax breaks over the last 30 years would be spent on job creation here. To get those breaks, they had to crush American public education, destroy supports for health care, and gut other public services(roads, infrastructure, research, disability and elder services). Instead, the wealthy white males controlling corporations and Koch-sponsored political positions took the tax breaks for 30 years, lined their own pockets (see inequality numbers showing facts about that and the huge increases in CEO, corporate, and hedge fund incomes for those whose taxes are nil) and shipped the jobs overseas, and shipped income overseas to avoid corporate taxes here. The Trumpy white men want to blame women, immigrants, and people of color instead, despite factual evidence to the contrary. They simply cannot admit being tricked for 30 years by other white men. That's who they are and that is what the support for Trump and his ilk is about.
301
Don't blame the Trump White Men too much. The 1%ers are very practiced at distracting the Trumpy White Men from the real causes of their economic stagnation.
2
Well said. Well Street and the robber barons who run these institutions are to blame, aided by the well bought members of Congress. I would like to see Lloyd Blankfein, Robert Rubin and their pals in chains. Instead we snuff the life out of poor people selling loose cigarettes.
5
And so white men who are being messed over by the 1% white men should vote for the woman who made millions giving secret speeches to her Wall Street overlords?
4
It should be no surprise that so many male college graduates support Trump. One just has to look around campus: Neanderthals are everywhere, loud, swaggering, muscle-bound in their sporting outfits. Donald Trump shares the same mental/cultural landscape, and promotes (explicitly or not) the same values:
1) Tribalism in its modern forms: nationalism, rooting for sports teams, celebrity culture, etc.
2) Gender stereotyping: obsession with hyper-masculinity (football, baseball); fascination with the most conformists forms of gender identity (the hunk, the super-model).
3) The cult of violence, greed and competition (every man for himself).
Finally and sadly, having a college degree and being educated are two vastly different things: Facebook, yes; books, no way!
1) Tribalism in its modern forms: nationalism, rooting for sports teams, celebrity culture, etc.
2) Gender stereotyping: obsession with hyper-masculinity (football, baseball); fascination with the most conformists forms of gender identity (the hunk, the super-model).
3) The cult of violence, greed and competition (every man for himself).
Finally and sadly, having a college degree and being educated are two vastly different things: Facebook, yes; books, no way!
17
All this rage against women, blacks and immigrants and no mention of who's making out like real bandits? All of us in the working and middle classes are struggling economically to pay for housing, food, transportation and health care and have enough left to send our kids to college. If African-Americans and Hispanic-Americans have inched up from poverty to middle-class, must I (white) consider them a threat? Or should we all be looking at the top 1% who have raked in the lion's share of any/all economic growth in this country over the past 40 years? They have lobbied successfully for tax cuts for themselves, and then insist we must cut budgets for education at all levels. The 0.01% lobby successfully for ever more protection for their "intellectual property rights" (e.g., pharmaceuticals) that take money out of the pockets of the rest of us. Then they lobby successfully to cut funding for anti-trust enforcement. They pour dark money into "issue ads" via "social welfare organizations" and then attack the IRS when they investigate such abuses. I recall the meme on social media, with the plate of dozen cookies, and the fat-cat is grabbing all but one and telling the white worker: "Look out, that immigrant is about to take your cookie!"
16
Maybe if white males weren't so intellectually lazy, they wouldn't be losing so many opportunities to more enterprising women and immigrants.
Talk about a sense of entitlement!
Talk about a sense of entitlement!
24
Indeed. But in their defense, ours is an intellectually lazy culture and becoming ever more so.
4
At least 30 million more people of Mexican origin have become US citizens by naturalization and birth compared to 50 years ago. That is about a tenth of the population of the US. I am not surprised that some Americans aren't too pleased with so many new citizens from a neighboring country which the US went to war with and won over huge swaths of land. The USA has been really transformed by the 1964 immigration act, mainly for the better, I should add. But, it is not entirely surprising that some Americans have a different view.
1
Tom obviously provided this column before the Times reported that Trump had pulled even with Mrs. Clinton, probably on the coattails of the eMailGate disaster.
It may be that the educated see in Trump the same potential that I’ve been flogging in this forum for weeks: while Mrs. Clinton, pulled ever-more-sharply-left in her proposed policies, likely won’t be able to get anything funded with this Congress, even if Democrats take the Senate, Trump likely would – and his positions, for those who bother to look beyond the immigration excess and the reflexive hatred of him, are pretty moderate. While she likely would inaugurate a new four years of frozen politics, he could actually get us moving again, and promulgate policies that would serve BOTH progressive interests (LGBT rights, safeguarding of SS and Medicare, labor protections by toughening trade rules) while ALSO satisfying conservatives (immigration, regulation, taxes) – nobody can predict how he would react on defense, since it’s largely driven by events; but he’d probably stop this wholesale downsizing of our military.
And he’d certainly be a more entertaining president, something everyone associated with college life seeks.
Stand back for a moment: if Trump is appealing to those who may not be doing too well in the current economy, regardless of reason, then what headaches does that bode for The Clinton camp? How many within our middle classes are doing well or have reason to be confident in the future?
It may be that the educated see in Trump the same potential that I’ve been flogging in this forum for weeks: while Mrs. Clinton, pulled ever-more-sharply-left in her proposed policies, likely won’t be able to get anything funded with this Congress, even if Democrats take the Senate, Trump likely would – and his positions, for those who bother to look beyond the immigration excess and the reflexive hatred of him, are pretty moderate. While she likely would inaugurate a new four years of frozen politics, he could actually get us moving again, and promulgate policies that would serve BOTH progressive interests (LGBT rights, safeguarding of SS and Medicare, labor protections by toughening trade rules) while ALSO satisfying conservatives (immigration, regulation, taxes) – nobody can predict how he would react on defense, since it’s largely driven by events; but he’d probably stop this wholesale downsizing of our military.
And he’d certainly be a more entertaining president, something everyone associated with college life seeks.
Stand back for a moment: if Trump is appealing to those who may not be doing too well in the current economy, regardless of reason, then what headaches does that bode for The Clinton camp? How many within our middle classes are doing well or have reason to be confident in the future?
8
Another Times article about the campaign which ignores the fact that Trumpo HAS NOT DISCLOSED HIS TAX RETURNS.
Why the continuing breathless coverage of the demogauge while ignoring the fact that he HAS NOT DISCLOSED HIS TAX RETURNS.
Why the continuing breathless coverage of the demogauge while ignoring the fact that he HAS NOT DISCLOSED HIS TAX RETURNS.
13
It is not clear that college educated white men are doing much better than those who haven't been to college. They--as well as their children-- are also facing the prospect of falling out of the middle class. Moreover, they are anxious about the sizeable changes in demographic composition that are making them a minority. This was described in a controversial book by Professor Samuel Huntington published about ten years ago called Who Are We?
Our political system has not been effective in managing the consequences of these seismic changes.
Our political system has not been effective in managing the consequences of these seismic changes.
3
Maybe. But my totally liberated, fiercely liberal female partner would never vote for Hillary in a million years. Ms. Fiske may not be fully valuing the personal attributes that Hillary brings to this contest. My partner hates Hillary's sense of entitlement, her elitist attitude, and the entire Clintonian drama. I wonder how many of the female partners of those white males who are not voting for Hillary are not voting for her either. Hillary is simply not liked by a whole lot of people. We marvel that the republicans would nominate someone like The Donald, but I have to wonder why the democrats would nominate someone who so many of the voters just don't like. Nasty older white male college educated person that I am, I am going to hold my nose and vote for Hillary. My partner - uh-uh.
7
Ask her if she'd like Roe v. Wade around four years from now.
5
Good for them. They'll still be the ones doing all the work behind the cloak of "diversity".
4
If I voted only on the basis of my male gender, middle class status, and white skin, I would vote for Donald Trump too. But I consider that the key issues of environmental protection and government intervention in the economy "trump" my narrow gender, class, and color interests. And the Democrats are more likely to advance the environmental and economic agendas I endorse than are the Republicans, who are guaranteed to do nothing about them.
13
For me, the key takeaway from Pew was that gender gap in this election survey is unprecedented.
I looked across the demographics and while most male groups stayed about where they were in 2008, women reportedly swung hard to the left. Anecdotally, this is at least in part due to Trump's personality.
I have no idea how it will play out.
I looked across the demographics and while most male groups stayed about where they were in 2008, women reportedly swung hard to the left. Anecdotally, this is at least in part due to Trump's personality.
I have no idea how it will play out.
It's well known that lots of people are educated beyond their intelligence, but this really makes you wonder if all those sheepskins wouldn't be more useful providing wool for sweaters
7
"The past 50 years have witnessed a very substantial redistribution from white males to minorities and women." says Howard Rosenthal.
Let's just stop to marvel at the hypocrisy. In these people's minds, if white men are rich and powerful and everyone else is poor and powerless, this is the natural outcome of meritocracy. It happens because people of color are lazy, impulsive, criminal, and have low IQs and because women are weak-willed, emotional breeders who can't do math. Discrimination has nothing to do with it, in their heads.
But turn it around: let everyone else do SLIGHTLY better - still not better in the aggregate than white guys - and it can only be a horrific outrage and the outcome of discriminatory politics. It can't be that half of all white guys have below-average IQs. Nope. Couldn't be that. And it couldn't possibly be that a lot of white guys were raised with a sense of entitlement that left them lazier than the people who had to work twice as hard to be taken half as seriously. Nope. Couldn't be that either. Must be discrimination against white men and time for a new civil rights movement to put them back on top, where they naturally belong.
Let's just stop to marvel at the hypocrisy. In these people's minds, if white men are rich and powerful and everyone else is poor and powerless, this is the natural outcome of meritocracy. It happens because people of color are lazy, impulsive, criminal, and have low IQs and because women are weak-willed, emotional breeders who can't do math. Discrimination has nothing to do with it, in their heads.
But turn it around: let everyone else do SLIGHTLY better - still not better in the aggregate than white guys - and it can only be a horrific outrage and the outcome of discriminatory politics. It can't be that half of all white guys have below-average IQs. Nope. Couldn't be that. And it couldn't possibly be that a lot of white guys were raised with a sense of entitlement that left them lazier than the people who had to work twice as hard to be taken half as seriously. Nope. Couldn't be that either. Must be discrimination against white men and time for a new civil rights movement to put them back on top, where they naturally belong.
20
It's not such a mystery. College educated men have some measure of achievement. More likely to be employed and hard working. Not on the dole and intolerant of those who are, if they're able bodied and don't really need it. College educated men are tired of being fleeced by the political class because they've excelled. I have two degrees, support my family of four and I'm uninterested in supporting someone else's family of four. That's why college-educated men support Trump.
9
You can somehow rationalize support for a man as manifestly unqualified and temperamentally ill suited to the office of the presidency as Donald Trump? What good is are 2 college degrees if they don't facilitate critical thinking at the most basic level?
10
I too am college educated Sarah. I support Niles 100%. I don't see any real leadership skills in your candidate either. She wants to be the first woman president! That's qualifying.
2
Does it ever occur to you that if all that's true, you kinda have a hard time justifying all your wailing about how you can't find a job and get treated badly because OBAMA!!!???
For that matter, does it ever occur that YOU got a lot of help getting where you are, and other folks might like some of that help too? Oh, I know you think you built it all with your own two hands.
Not unless you went to a private university, paid your own way, and got zip in terms of scholarships or loans or workstudy, you didn't. Not unless you pay for your kids to go to a private school, you don't.
I've been out of grad school working since before you were in high school. Guess what I helped pay for?
A modest "hey, thanks, man," will suffice.
For that matter, does it ever occur that YOU got a lot of help getting where you are, and other folks might like some of that help too? Oh, I know you think you built it all with your own two hands.
Not unless you went to a private university, paid your own way, and got zip in terms of scholarships or loans or workstudy, you didn't. Not unless you pay for your kids to go to a private school, you don't.
I've been out of grad school working since before you were in high school. Guess what I helped pay for?
A modest "hey, thanks, man," will suffice.
3
“White Republican college graduates and white Republicans who do not have a degree generally agree on many political and policy issues,”...
Not a surprise to someone who has spent many years in university classrooms. I suggest that the views of many who acquire a "college education" (the meaning of which is fuzzy) are more a result of their dominant home culture than of "higher learning". Indeed, for many in the hinterland, the liberal arts faculty is perceived more as opposing that which is "right" than as an entity to be admired or emulated.
Along these line I've occasionally experimented by asking a group of self-professed conservative graduates if any "liberal" faculty member succeeded in persuading them to abandon their conservative core views. So far, not a single one has claimed to have been so seduced.
Not a surprise to someone who has spent many years in university classrooms. I suggest that the views of many who acquire a "college education" (the meaning of which is fuzzy) are more a result of their dominant home culture than of "higher learning". Indeed, for many in the hinterland, the liberal arts faculty is perceived more as opposing that which is "right" than as an entity to be admired or emulated.
Along these line I've occasionally experimented by asking a group of self-professed conservative graduates if any "liberal" faculty member succeeded in persuading them to abandon their conservative core views. So far, not a single one has claimed to have been so seduced.
1
This is clear evidence of the failure of the US tertiary education system.
4
It's because they're bigots.
5
Couldn't gender be an issue as well? After Jackie, Mattress Girl, James (don't know his last name) and the Yale basketball player, college men may believe there is no justice for them on their own campuses and think Trump may be of help.
In an unrelated matter, can Hillary Clinton, Michelle Obama and Sarah Palin be lumped together in a paper on gender issues in politics? I don't think so and not for the reasons that many NYT readers would cite. Sarah Palin is not a political wife like Michelle, she did not ride her husband's coattails into office like Hillary, she became the mayor of Wasilla and governor of Alaska on her own merits. I dislike Palin but I do respect her achievements.
In an unrelated matter, can Hillary Clinton, Michelle Obama and Sarah Palin be lumped together in a paper on gender issues in politics? I don't think so and not for the reasons that many NYT readers would cite. Sarah Palin is not a political wife like Michelle, she did not ride her husband's coattails into office like Hillary, she became the mayor of Wasilla and governor of Alaska on her own merits. I dislike Palin but I do respect her achievements.
6
So Secretary Clinton's only credentials are those of political wife? Are you aware that in addition to attorney, children's-rights activist and valedictorian of her college class at Wellesley, she served as previous presidential candidate, secretary of State and as U.S. senator?
4
I would add that Trump's white male support is also geographical. As someone who is in this demographic I don't know of many college aged white males who are voting for Trump. Most, in fact, think he is an insane racist. But this is CA.
I think correlation of Trump's popularity to redistribution is real. Having a college education is not nearly the guarantee that is advertised. The college aged white male is a demographic that is perceiving that it is falling behind, paying high taxes, and getting less and less from society. There is a narrative that this group is giving to redistribution, not receiving. Thus, they are voting to support an angry candidate.
I think this is also a statement of how weak Hillary Clinton is as a candidate. She is not compelling. She maybe the most qualified but she is the least compelling candidate. She has alot of weaknesses as a candidate.
I think correlation of Trump's popularity to redistribution is real. Having a college education is not nearly the guarantee that is advertised. The college aged white male is a demographic that is perceiving that it is falling behind, paying high taxes, and getting less and less from society. There is a narrative that this group is giving to redistribution, not receiving. Thus, they are voting to support an angry candidate.
I think this is also a statement of how weak Hillary Clinton is as a candidate. She is not compelling. She maybe the most qualified but she is the least compelling candidate. She has alot of weaknesses as a candidate.
4
I'm also a white, male, college-educated Clinton supporter. I'm also gay, which means I stepped outside the rigid gender-based expectations of men a long time ago. But growing up white and male in the US, particularly in some regions of the country more than others (I'm from the Deep South), means that you are told from a very young age that you are entitled to basically anything you want, forever. Life will be easy for you. Even if these things aren't told to you explicitly in those words, everything around you sends those signals rather unambiguously. As a white man I still witness all the ways in which other white men conspire together socially and professionally to solidify their privilege and hold on power--even though they probably aren't consciously aware that that's what they're doing. They have not traditionally had to work very hard to succeed (as a class of people--not literally every white male), but now there's competition for that power. Now they have no guarantees that life will be easy--they have to share power and be on equal footing with people they don't know and probably don't trust. When you've spent your whole life believing that your birthright is success and power without apologies, the changes our society has witnessed over the past 20 years are tectonic and destabilizing. The natural response to this is to push back and try to reclaim what they perceive is being taken from them. They probably won't prevail, but they won't concede defeat easily.
18
I too am a post grad university gay male. I find it rather reprehensible and hypocritical for gay men to vote for a candidate (Clinton) who is a feminist and by definition a misandrist. I would never support anyone who held so much contempt for the gender I profess to love. I can no longer support progressive political correct misandrous dogmatists.
Prison, racism, violence, murder, homelessness, homophobia, mental illness, suicide, reproductive rights, workplace injuries and death, military deaths, parental bias, failing our veterans failing education, lack of empathy and compassion, lack of choices, degradation, dehumanization, etc., are all overwhelmingly male experiences of gender injustice. Even sexual assault and domestic violence equally affect men. These are all examples of historical disadvantages that men have endured due to male gender role expectations.
Prison, racism, violence, murder, homelessness, homophobia, mental illness, suicide, reproductive rights, workplace injuries and death, military deaths, parental bias, failing our veterans failing education, lack of empathy and compassion, lack of choices, degradation, dehumanization, etc., are all overwhelmingly male experiences of gender injustice. Even sexual assault and domestic violence equally affect men. These are all examples of historical disadvantages that men have endured due to male gender role expectations.
2
"...who is a feminist and by definition a misandrist."
How utterly ridiculous. It is sad that you apparently have completely misunderstood what feminism is about. The gender "injustices" that you cite are largely due to the normative male gender role conditioning: the views of men and masculinity which feminists have been critiquing for 40 years. Yes, toxic models of masculinity are bad for men too.
How utterly ridiculous. It is sad that you apparently have completely misunderstood what feminism is about. The gender "injustices" that you cite are largely due to the normative male gender role conditioning: the views of men and masculinity which feminists have been critiquing for 40 years. Yes, toxic models of masculinity are bad for men too.
2
I have no misconceptions about what feminism has become.There's a huge male underclass in this society, as compared to those in power, influence and authority. Those in influence, power and authority are chivalrous men who more often than not attain their influence, power and authority at the expense of other mens value, rights, justice, dignity, humanity and compassion. Patriarchy is actually a construct of the male/female dynamic. It is a collective male gender role response to female demands for deference, protection and resource provision. Since the dawn of humanity men have slaughter each other by the billions to fulfill gender role expectations and seek approval from potential mates. Yet feminism still reinforces male gender roles with the help of white knights in power, influence and authority. They continue the oppression of men by their endless screams of victimhood, demands for social resources and deference of privilege and entitlement. It is that patriarchy that feminists love to hate, that has provided women with these at the expense of the common man. Women through feminism have thrown off gender roles that they deem oppresses or victimizes them. Now it's men's turn. And the first ones that must go are the Barack Obama's, Joe Biden's and Justin Trudeau's of the world.
1
This column and the accompanying photograph would seem to indicate that it is YOUNG, white, male college graduates who are supporting Trump. I don't think the polls stratified based on age. I would suspect that much of this is being driven by older college graduates. I can't understand how anyone with the intellectual capacity to have gotten a 4-year degree in the 1960s-90s could honestly support this sociopath and his destructive ideas. Is it loss of "white privilege"? Is it nostalgia for the days before women were discovered to be human beings with intelligence and emotions too? Is it the natural conservatism that accompanies aging? These Baby Boomer college graduates are getting to retirement age now.
Of course, the press has to accept part of the blame, by devoting equal attention to Clinton's very minor snafus (using a private email server like her predecessors? The horror!) and Trump's outrageous, infuriating, violent, and dangerous behavior that empowers the most destructive and primitive elements of male emotional life. Enough with the Clinton bashing! Time to get real and take this seriously.
Of course, the press has to accept part of the blame, by devoting equal attention to Clinton's very minor snafus (using a private email server like her predecessors? The horror!) and Trump's outrageous, infuriating, violent, and dangerous behavior that empowers the most destructive and primitive elements of male emotional life. Enough with the Clinton bashing! Time to get real and take this seriously.
9
Typo alert: "A number of pollsters pointed out to me that hostility to Clinton is more important that the appeal of Trump in the continuing support for Trump among white college men." I'm pretty sure the second 'that' in this sentence should be 'than'.
1
Trump's candidacy is Exhibit A of the profound failure of American leaders to look after the welfare of ordinary American citizens, including the white majority (or plurality). The Democrats seek the creation of a "rainbow nation" while vilifying the white working class, and the Republicans have visions of supply-side economics and deregulation of business dancing around in their heads. Both party establishments have supported damaging trade agreements, and even though Hillary says she will oppose the Trans Pacific Partnership - I wouldn't trust her on that one if she gets into the White House.
Trump may be crazy, but generations of establishment political leaders have lived in their Left or Right Cloud Cuckoo Lands with little concern for American people or their problems.
Trump may be crazy, but generations of establishment political leaders have lived in their Left or Right Cloud Cuckoo Lands with little concern for American people or their problems.
7
It is no secret "why a plurality of college-educated white men backs the Republican Party’s combative soon-to-be nominee." WHITE MALE PRIVILEGE. Just as they took over to control things and get Ronald Reagan elected in 1981 when the harmonic convergence of "white male" greed took over. They were the Young Republicans then, college aged white men running around the country to fraternities to ramp up participation. Today they are the Young Guns - led by Paul Ryan, Kevin McCarthy and Eric Cantor (who was unceremoniously dumped from Congress by Virginia voters to our delight). They are the operatives of the ALEC/Wall Street/u s chamber of commerce/radical religious right/nra/major media BIG democracy-destroying money masters' Corporate Conglomerate and they are desperate to hold onto their white, christian, male privilege. They are the beneficiaries of the spoils of unprecedented wealth inequality we experience today in America. They are the reason to vote for Ms. Hillary Rodham Clinton and other socially conscious women who have the courage to step up and run for public office. Time to put the frat brothers in their rightful place right alongside the rest of us in America.
9
1- The Presidential election you refer to took place in 1980.
2- Women voted 47-46 for Reagan. Very important because, as usual, more women voted than men.
3- The evidence seems to refute your contention that white males took over the country. But, don't let facts get in the way of the wide net you've cast over all these villains .... proceed.
2- Women voted 47-46 for Reagan. Very important because, as usual, more women voted than men.
3- The evidence seems to refute your contention that white males took over the country. But, don't let facts get in the way of the wide net you've cast over all these villains .... proceed.
3
I voted for Ronald Reagan ONCE, Buzzy. Because of the media attention given to him by the white, male, christian privileged class. Then I realized the damage he was doing by dismantling social programs, anti-trust regulations, organized labor and all the ills our society suffers today. Check it out.
3
OK, on to 1984, women voted 58-42 for Reagan and Geraldine Ferraro was Mondale's running mate. Really, case dismissed.
Personally, I've never voted for a Republican for anything but local elections. However, I take serious exception to the made up facts that litter these anti-male comments. The same treatment was accorded the "Bernie Bros". Clinton is a sad excuse for a candidate who struggles to tell the truth - and this is well documented. Fortunately for her election prospects, her opponent is a world class demagogue in a league with Long, McCarthy and the younger Wallace. Not as fortunate for our country as a whole.
Personally, I've never voted for a Republican for anything but local elections. However, I take serious exception to the made up facts that litter these anti-male comments. The same treatment was accorded the "Bernie Bros". Clinton is a sad excuse for a candidate who struggles to tell the truth - and this is well documented. Fortunately for her election prospects, her opponent is a world class demagogue in a league with Long, McCarthy and the younger Wallace. Not as fortunate for our country as a whole.
Rosenthal's remarks are factually incorrect. The redistribution is not between racial groups, but to the top 10% of income earners. However disingenuously, it is Trump who speaks to its economic fallout: stagnant wages and declining standard of living.
Pew stats show that it is white men over 50, “boomer” men, who are most ferociously pro-Trump. Not surprising since they have had most to lose. Post-war America was a great time for white families whose children could look forward to seemingly unlimited possibilities in the professional classes Their children are another story. The bloom fell off the rose in the 80's for those stuck with blue-collar work. For black families starting from so far behind, it has been a consistent upward trajectory. The difference in perspective has enormous political consequences.
Clinton speaks condescendingly from the lofty comforts of the professional class using the sanctimony of inflated social-justice rhetoric to dignify what is otherwise a profoundly contemptuous disdain for ordinary Americans. Trump? The disaffected masses intuit from him their own anger and frustration. The joke is on them. Trump’s resentment is not 'economic', it's social exclusion from the company of his betters born of his own boorishness. Both Clinton and Trump are pitting identity groups against one another, and those who profit are those already taking an ever greater share of national income; leaving the rest of us to squabble for what’s left.
Pew stats show that it is white men over 50, “boomer” men, who are most ferociously pro-Trump. Not surprising since they have had most to lose. Post-war America was a great time for white families whose children could look forward to seemingly unlimited possibilities in the professional classes Their children are another story. The bloom fell off the rose in the 80's for those stuck with blue-collar work. For black families starting from so far behind, it has been a consistent upward trajectory. The difference in perspective has enormous political consequences.
Clinton speaks condescendingly from the lofty comforts of the professional class using the sanctimony of inflated social-justice rhetoric to dignify what is otherwise a profoundly contemptuous disdain for ordinary Americans. Trump? The disaffected masses intuit from him their own anger and frustration. The joke is on them. Trump’s resentment is not 'economic', it's social exclusion from the company of his betters born of his own boorishness. Both Clinton and Trump are pitting identity groups against one another, and those who profit are those already taking an ever greater share of national income; leaving the rest of us to squabble for what’s left.
6
A friend of mine who teaches in a college told me that the only two people not to get tenure in her department were both white males.
She is neither white nor male and she knows their CVs quite well.
She was appalled at the reverse sexism and racism.
She is neither white nor male and she knows their CVs quite well.
She was appalled at the reverse sexism and racism.
22
But unlikely surprised.
2
This trend has eluded the news media for over a year. As a Clinton supporter, I see a strong parallel between educated Brexiteers who essentially want to renegotiate a set of anxiety-producing trade agreements (the EU), and middle class Americans who want to do the same thing with NAFTA and other treaties.
Clinton concedes this election to the issue of race at her peril. Doing so would underscore her deafness to class anxieties, while appearing to confirm that her first term would be Obama's third -- or worse, Bill's. The campaign should be squarely focussed on an important lesson of history that Trump derides -- that democracy and equality cannot exist without each other.
Clinton concedes this election to the issue of race at her peril. Doing so would underscore her deafness to class anxieties, while appearing to confirm that her first term would be Obama's third -- or worse, Bill's. The campaign should be squarely focussed on an important lesson of history that Trump derides -- that democracy and equality cannot exist without each other.
43
Aren't a lot of those educated Brits now sorry they voted for Brexit?
Makes you wonder if there could similar remorse here if Trump were to win.
Makes you wonder if there could similar remorse here if Trump were to win.
1
Hate to tell you Thomas, but every single White Educated Male in my social circle save one, HATES Trump and every single thing he stands for.
10
Thankfully the same is true in my circle as well. Maybe we're just not screaming it loudly enough.
3
I'm not surprised at all to hear that about your friends.
3
Is it a coincidence that Trump uses a baseball cap?
5
My lifetime experience teaching in private and public universities completely supports Edsall's observations; Rosenthal's response is particularly on target. The redistribution takes many forms, including White males being largely forgotten in college and university programs, both academic and administrative.
I don't say that I disagree with the re-distribution, but it has had severe costs for White males.
I don't say that I disagree with the re-distribution, but it has had severe costs for White males.
3
Like the saying goes, "When you're used to having everything, sharing seems like discrimination".
2
The people in that photo from the Trump rally frighten me. And I don't scare easily.
12
They definitely make me reach for my AR-15. Oh wait, I don't have one. Have to fix that, looks like.
2
Given the Republicans' well known antipathy towards higher education, how may voters are we talking about here when we say college educated Republicans? That's got to be one of the smaller cohorts in electoral politics.
4
The article dealt with college-educated white males. You chose to say only Republican ones support the demagogue, but the Pew numbers say otherwise by 49 to 42 and ABC had Clinton a bit closer at 44. Not a great deficit it's true, but clearly a concern for the Clinton camp. Now if a larger percentage of white male college graduates are Republican then that accounts for it, but the article doesn't claim that is so. Your snark is unhelpful to a thoughtful discussion.
2
I know, NYT; the one word answer misogyny doesn't fill pages, but it's the truth.
9
The article is just more racist republican blather about why whites are the way they are.
I'm white born in Montgomery, AL in 1953 into a white racist democratic christian sharia law gun culture. It only got worse after the racist democratic party installed George Wallace. Anyone doubt I call out all racists?
Now all of those "good christians" have been bamboozled by the racist republican theology to conflate racism, religious bigotry, guns, hate.. into a toxic sludge that has completely destroyed our country.
I for one want to take a dump and get all of you into the south and wall you off.
Sorry we made a mistake in 1864. We should have let the crazy white christian racists in the south go.
Dave
I'm white born in Montgomery, AL in 1953 into a white racist democratic christian sharia law gun culture. It only got worse after the racist democratic party installed George Wallace. Anyone doubt I call out all racists?
Now all of those "good christians" have been bamboozled by the racist republican theology to conflate racism, religious bigotry, guns, hate.. into a toxic sludge that has completely destroyed our country.
I for one want to take a dump and get all of you into the south and wall you off.
Sorry we made a mistake in 1864. We should have let the crazy white christian racists in the south go.
Dave
14
This entire column can be summed up in a single sentence -- A plurality of white males don't like the idea that women and minorities are taking jobs that used to exclusively belong to white men.
26
True for many but as the article points out it is more complex. Sen. Sanders touched on many of the concerns about globalization, stagnant wages, outsourced jobs, and rust belt cities left to fester, and he is no right wing capitalist aging frat boy by a long shot.
1
Far be it from me to be a Trump supporter, but I would very much like to know more concrete facts that support or deny their claims.
Could prof. Edsall please clarify to what extent it is true, or not true, or true in some places in the U.S. that immigrants a) take up low-level jobs that Americans can do; b) will take up even more jobs in the future, as their 2nd generation rises in education; c) overburden the public health system; d) overburden the public school system.
Thank you very much in advance. I would like to be more data-driven in my positions and not only lean to the left with my gut feelings.
Could prof. Edsall please clarify to what extent it is true, or not true, or true in some places in the U.S. that immigrants a) take up low-level jobs that Americans can do; b) will take up even more jobs in the future, as their 2nd generation rises in education; c) overburden the public health system; d) overburden the public school system.
Thank you very much in advance. I would like to be more data-driven in my positions and not only lean to the left with my gut feelings.
4
If there were such a TV show as "America's Got White Privilege" trying to find someone most privileged from birth, I think I'd have a good shot of winning. White, male, two highly intelligent college-educated parents, top-notch suburban public education, etc.
That said, it's hard to continually vote against your self-interest and what you think is fair. Trump has made that a little easier this year because he's so crazy, but I really don't like Hilary or Democrat positions.
Is it really not OK for me to simultaneously think that racism/sexism are still major problems, Donald is crazy, and that I don't want my taxes to increase beyond the 40% of my wife's and my income we're already paying? 40%! What are you doing with all my money that democrats want more of it?
Too many people are college educated already, this article points out that the increase in "college-educated" is mostly the lower tier and they aren't finding jobs using their degrees. Hilary is very Hawkish, we'll stay at war a long time. The debt is $20 trillion and counting.
You know where all the money is going to come from? People that are currently earning it, black/white/male/female all the same.
So please, stop labeling me as irrational or afraid of losing my white-privilege for not wanting to vote Democrat. Perhaps people like me think that neither Hilary nor Donald can solve these problems, and Donald will just charge taxpayers less to do nothing.
I still can't vote for him though.
That said, it's hard to continually vote against your self-interest and what you think is fair. Trump has made that a little easier this year because he's so crazy, but I really don't like Hilary or Democrat positions.
Is it really not OK for me to simultaneously think that racism/sexism are still major problems, Donald is crazy, and that I don't want my taxes to increase beyond the 40% of my wife's and my income we're already paying? 40%! What are you doing with all my money that democrats want more of it?
Too many people are college educated already, this article points out that the increase in "college-educated" is mostly the lower tier and they aren't finding jobs using their degrees. Hilary is very Hawkish, we'll stay at war a long time. The debt is $20 trillion and counting.
You know where all the money is going to come from? People that are currently earning it, black/white/male/female all the same.
So please, stop labeling me as irrational or afraid of losing my white-privilege for not wanting to vote Democrat. Perhaps people like me think that neither Hilary nor Donald can solve these problems, and Donald will just charge taxpayers less to do nothing.
I still can't vote for him though.
8
The last 30 years have seen your tax money go to keeping the country in expensive wars and to lining the pockets of the 1%. Look at the facts of CEO income increases and rising inequality. They destroyed the middle class to pay for their own tax breaks and gutted American education, health care, and infrastructure, national fundamentals that would raise the middle class and reduce your taxes. We had a surplus in 1990 when Clinton left office. GW Bush gave it to the 1%, who also took jobs out of the country and pay nothing into the system -- and to fund endless wars that accomplished little except lost lives and more terror. That's where your 40% went -- to those who pay 0%.
3
Also, be sure you understand the difference between average tax rate and marginal tax rate. http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/statistics/historical-average-federal-tax...
Many people don't, leading to misconceptions about how much tax they are paying.
Many people don't, leading to misconceptions about how much tax they are paying.
1
Amen and amen. You speak for many like me who cannot ever vote for the buffoonish, unqualified demagogue. Nevertheless, we are heartsick that the only credible alternative is a very damaged candidate. As to white privilege can someone among the commentariat here please explain how that applies to Appalachian residents with poverty, addiction, bad housing and no prospects? Are they as worthy of our concerns as the underclass of an other race?
2
"What’s less understandable is why a plurality of college-educated white men backs the Republican Party’s combative soon-to-be nominee."
College-educated white men have been systematically victimized by the institutional racism and institutional sexism known as "affirmative action." They have been passed over by less qualified, often much less qualified., affirmative-action beneficiaries in college admissions, graduate and professional school admissions, employment, and promotions. Again and again and again.
Why would they support a candidate who has made it clear she will expand and intensify reverse discrimination?
College-educated white men have been systematically victimized by the institutional racism and institutional sexism known as "affirmative action." They have been passed over by less qualified, often much less qualified., affirmative-action beneficiaries in college admissions, graduate and professional school admissions, employment, and promotions. Again and again and again.
Why would they support a candidate who has made it clear she will expand and intensify reverse discrimination?
12
"Victimized?" That says a lot about your mindset RHE.
3
Yes. Victimized is the correct term for the white male middle class. Affirmative Action has never impaired the 1% in the least! They don't let Section 8 housing into *their* neighborhoods, do they?
3
Edsall operates with his usual thoroughness but I'm not sure his insights in this piece are up to their typical penetrating levels. So we learn that a number of college men belong to the current right and exhibit many of the movement's rebarbative traits, which is to say they are racist in overt or not so overt ways, hugely resentful of much of the social changes carried from the sixties (which repeated Republican administrations have largely failed to quell), and consequently find in the clownish Trump a beacon for their variegated angers (against women, blacks, Mexicans, Muslims, gays, etc, etc, etc). Any college educated adult who refuses to paint her college experience with a very crude brush or obtained her degree from any but a small liberal arts college will find little that is surprising in these findings. But, to the larger point, is it even conceivable that this group voted for a black man with an Islamic middle name in 2008 and again in 2012? I don't think so. So then what's new now that they have a women to run against? Precious little I'd say. It's the aftermath of their likely defeat (probably this November and in time inevitably) that I worry about: the old ones are thankfully a dying breed; it's the young ones that must be folded in the global present if we want to skirt fascism.
1
Apprehending crooked Hillary (Bengazi, emails, Saudi money), and nominating as president Bernie, with his vision of justice for all, is the best way to defeat Trump.
2
One of my close white relatives went to a minority-majority magnet high school. Throughout his childhood and teen years, he has had a wide variety of diverse friends and has been generally supportive of progressive causes. Then during his Freshman year at a college he was required to take an ethnic studies class wherein he learned that he was a clueless white privileged male incapable of true empathy for the plight of the "oppressed". He also has seen the babied social justice warriors taking up the most trivial causes (ie: cultural appropriation whining about whites wearing dreads, feeling micro-aggressed and triggered over reading Mark Twain, Halloween costumes or any form of European History). Also, puzzling over the SJW's constant drone over feeling "marginalized" while also insisting on marginalizing themselves into racially segregated "safe spaces", he has become much more cynical about the left and Democrats in general. He recently said that if it weren't for the influence of the religious right, he would consider registering as a Republican.
11
So he found out he wasn't loved by all?
What a sense in entitlement.
Welcome to my world.
Tell him to get over and just be his own person.
I'm black and I'm female and I am.
What a sense in entitlement.
Welcome to my world.
Tell him to get over and just be his own person.
I'm black and I'm female and I am.
2
Actually, there are 3 people that signed that letter that I do respect, so I will forgive them for signing on to such an arrogant rant. They are Rev. Jackson, The Woz and Jimmy Whales.
This is not the way to talk to people. This is not the way to attract them to your party. You attract them by understanding them rather than condemning them. No politician would ever dare talk to voters this way. Sometimes Hillary gets close to lecturing voters and she needs to stop that.
This is not the way to talk to people. This is not the way to attract them to your party. You attract them by understanding them rather than condemning them. No politician would ever dare talk to voters this way. Sometimes Hillary gets close to lecturing voters and she needs to stop that.
3
Many hard-working (and college educated) people are tired of all of the social programs which seem to always continually expand under the democrats. Many people cannot afford to be democrats. Working people are tired of the pandering and continual hand-outs to whoever. Also many people are not buying into the new socialism being pushed upon us.
7
This just goes to show that having a college degree doesn't make you smart or and doesn't prevent you from being racist. Even if you agree with some of his stances on policy (as vague as they often are), almost everyone agrees that he has said many racist remarks. The establishment (Ryan, McConnell, et al.) position is basically "We know he is a racist, but we are going to support him anyway". Sorry, but that either makes you a racist yourself, or means that you are someone that will tolerate racism in our President. This is a truly sad comment on the state of our nation.
9
I listened to Christine Quinn, the New York chair of the Democratic Party on Anderson 360 a few months back. They were discussing voting demographics. She contorted her face with a contemptuous snarl and hiss out venomously, "White Males". Had any pundit ever used that tone and bigotry towards any other social group in the US, they would have been branded as the sexist, misandrous bigot that the were. That pretty well sums up Hillary's supporters.
4
Is there really any difference between "We know he is a racist, but we are going to support him anyway" and "We know she's corrupt and a liar but we are going to support her anyway"?
4
Witnessing daily manufactured outrage on college campuses against white men as well as their targeted assassination by a hate filled racist in Texas and burying their veteran friends from 15 years of "white privilege" in the Af Pak wars will tend to cause folks to vote for someone who doesn't hate them. Or, hate them except when they run towards hostile gunfire instead of away. Life for African Americans is not constant fear of police. When MSM writers actually ask housing project residents whether they want fewer cops, they find that the residents ask for more. Out of touch DC NY based folks.
12
I first supported Bernie Sanders, and now support Hillary Clinton. The big issue, hence pro-Bernie and pro-Trump support, is that for many Americans the fix is in and the benefits go to the privileged few, including politicians across the board. This is why members of Congress have been able to trade on insider information with no risk, while the rest of us would be put in the pokey for this. I am sick of this, and for me it has nothing to so-called losing status. Losing status is an issue that never spoke to me anyway.
2
If you look a little deeper into this, you will find that Donald Trump has less support from white male college graduates then any Republican candidate in the last 60 years. This is not as big a thing as Edsall is making it out to be.
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/trump-may-become-the-first-republica...
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/trump-may-become-the-first-republica...
2
This is all about class. The facts show a zero-sum redistribution, but gains from growth and productivity over this period went up to the 1%, creating class and gender divisions. Those gains should have been flat across gender and class. It is exactly what Sanders was talking about, and Trump is trying to exploit.
4
Hillary Clinton is sui generis; a Presidency seeking machine that just happens to be a woman. It's a misplaced belief to think that her being a woman will inform any of her decisions as President but millions of women identify with her on this basis and are willing to overlook her superabundance of deficiencies. Perhaps it is a reaction to this blind allegiance to Clinton that steers these college men towards Trump and not anything about Trump OR Clinton for that matter that is the determining factor. They view Clinton's support as frighteningly irrational.
As noted in the article, Clinton was expected to trot out her grandchildren, as a heart-melting backdrop, and Chelsea was expected to play a more visible role but that, apparently, hasn't panned out. I guess they concluded that few struggling mothers would identify with children who are born into such privilege and Chelsea, married to hedge fund boy (surprise, surprise!), is hardly a shining example of a working mom.
As noted in the article, Clinton was expected to trot out her grandchildren, as a heart-melting backdrop, and Chelsea was expected to play a more visible role but that, apparently, hasn't panned out. I guess they concluded that few struggling mothers would identify with children who are born into such privilege and Chelsea, married to hedge fund boy (surprise, surprise!), is hardly a shining example of a working mom.
5
Edsal writes.
"Nearly half of college-educated Republicans, men and women, believe immigrants “burden the country by taking jobs, housing and health care,” a view shared by 62 percent of non-college Republicans."
Yet he never entertains the notion that they might be right.
Consider the statistics. During the period 1980-2010, the US population grew by 82 million or by 36%. The number of positions in medical schools in the US grew at about half that rate.
Other things equal, that would suggest shortages of medical services due to population growth.
And illegal immigration contributes to population growth, not just directly, but legally through chain migration, and through the higher fertility of illegal immigrants whose children are automatically US citizens.
America's liberals pretend that resources are unlimited. As Krugman would say, "it is always inadequate aggregate demand, never inadequate supply."
Yet Americans face the inadequate supply of medical care.
About 27,000 Americans die each year of prostate cancer, about 40,000 of breast cancer. Those numbers are larger than the numbers of blacks in the ghetto killed by police.
Liberals want to make this an election about "black lives matter," when America's poor see all too clearly the shortages of a system rigged for the very wealthy. And some of that rigging comes from population growth.
How do you stop the trend towards lower living standards? Stopping illegal immigration seems to be a necessary step.
"Nearly half of college-educated Republicans, men and women, believe immigrants “burden the country by taking jobs, housing and health care,” a view shared by 62 percent of non-college Republicans."
Yet he never entertains the notion that they might be right.
Consider the statistics. During the period 1980-2010, the US population grew by 82 million or by 36%. The number of positions in medical schools in the US grew at about half that rate.
Other things equal, that would suggest shortages of medical services due to population growth.
And illegal immigration contributes to population growth, not just directly, but legally through chain migration, and through the higher fertility of illegal immigrants whose children are automatically US citizens.
America's liberals pretend that resources are unlimited. As Krugman would say, "it is always inadequate aggregate demand, never inadequate supply."
Yet Americans face the inadequate supply of medical care.
About 27,000 Americans die each year of prostate cancer, about 40,000 of breast cancer. Those numbers are larger than the numbers of blacks in the ghetto killed by police.
Liberals want to make this an election about "black lives matter," when America's poor see all too clearly the shortages of a system rigged for the very wealthy. And some of that rigging comes from population growth.
How do you stop the trend towards lower living standards? Stopping illegal immigration seems to be a necessary step.
28
This is an interesting compilation of random vague statistics that have nothing to do with the oblique point I think Blaise Adams was trying to make.
The U.S. population has grown by 36% over the last thirty years.
The number of doctors trained during this period grew by about half this rate.
Many tens of thousands of people die from cancers.
Undocumented immigrants and their children account for some portion of the population growth over the last 30 years.
Therefore, undocumented immigrants are somehow responsible for the deaths of many people from cancer.
Lesson: Trump voters are justified in resenting immigrants.
With the prevalence of dubious reasoning such as this, I think we need to be worried about what kind of college education all these college educated Trump voters are getting.
The U.S. population has grown by 36% over the last thirty years.
The number of doctors trained during this period grew by about half this rate.
Many tens of thousands of people die from cancers.
Undocumented immigrants and their children account for some portion of the population growth over the last 30 years.
Therefore, undocumented immigrants are somehow responsible for the deaths of many people from cancer.
Lesson: Trump voters are justified in resenting immigrants.
With the prevalence of dubious reasoning such as this, I think we need to be worried about what kind of college education all these college educated Trump voters are getting.
3
Yes, Americans face an inadequate supply of medical care. But not if they have health insurance. It's the non-Whites and immigrants who are suffering, not the privileged minority. Are you seriously trying to blame immigrants for the decline in our health care system? The blame clearly and squarely lies with the Republican Congress, who have fought every initiative that would improve efficiency and egalitarian delivery of medical care. I currently live in Canada, a country with huge immigrant populations, and no shortage of high quality medical care. The difference? A government that recognized the importance of universal health care in a single payer system decades ago.
2
It's risky to blame negative views of people based simply on identity because it creates unnecessary and even harmful backlash. I am a white male with a doctorate and I have a strongly negative view of Sen. Clinton. It has nothing to do with her gender but her poor judgment and lack of integrity. If liberals blame me for sexism and privilege because of my demographics, then they risk eventually pushing me over to Trump. I will never support Trump as president but I do feel the desire to, simply out of spite at being unfairly labeled. Now, consider how others similar to me might feel and therefore behave...
28
I am interested in the use of the word blame: is it possible to acknowledge different perspectives on sexism and privilege without personalizing it as an attack on one's person? Is it that we have so deeply habituated these viewpoints that we believe that they are who we are rather than perspectives we may hold? That seems a bit like a conversation stopper. Doesn't it prevent us from examining the partial truths that may lead to solutions to these ongoing problems? Instead of guilt I find myself asking: how do I throw a wrench into the machine (both external and internal) that perpetuates it.
2
You and others would subject this country to chaos because of your petty and bruised ego? You may not be racist or sexist but the comment is telling of your conscience and maturity.
3
Wow... welcome to the world of minorities, women and people of non-traditional gender identities. Now stop whining and vote responsibly.
1
I think that college men can do the math: at the current pace of "white privileges" erosion they will find themselves soon enough an oppressed minority, especially at the hands of female president. They don't want to become an oppressed minority so they vote Trump. Simple enough.
10
Take a tour of some upstate New York Walmart's in small cities around the country. And take a good look at the white men who shop there. And if you come of those Walmart's still thinking there is something called "white privilege," I have a nice bridge to sell you.
6
Typically when looking at comments such as Bill's what we find is that what is really being lost is being more than equal. Simply being equal is unaccustomed and uncomfortable and thus the push back.
3
I teach these guys.
They are children.
And they don't know it.
They are children.
And they don't know it.
6
I am a white, college-educated male. I will be voting for Clinton. She hit the nail on the head with her comments after the Dallas shooting. For the racial climate to change in this country, it will be up to white people to make the change. We need to acknowledge white privilege. The resistance to acknowledging white privilege seems prevalent even among many of my well-meaning, compassionate peers. I think it comes from a lack of really seeing what life is like for African-Americans.
113
Michael Kunz - I am a college educated 73 yo white male and I totally agree with the notion that whites need to acknowledge our white male privilege. In my lifetime I have seen this. White males definitely received privileged status in many of the trade unions. I reflect back on the times that whites were valued as better candidates than the blacks; and yet, I also worked with black bosses who readily hired blacks and they were as good as the whites. No different.
Our white privilege is racist and sexist. Let`s be honest about that. Ask yourself the questions: Did I hire people of color?; Did I live in integrated areas?; Did I fear a gang of black kids walking and laughing?.
I worked in the ghettos of New York in the 60s and remember getting on the subway with a bunch of black friends and seeing the fear in the eyes of the whites who sat in that car. I saw the young white cops who feared the blacks and Puerto Ricans.
I live in Mexico and see many of the expats wanting to live in segregated compounds because they fear Mexicans.
Some of you won`t like this - but it is RACISM. WE ARE RACISTS. It`s the fear of the unknown, the other. Our values are embedded in this Racist Sexist culture.
Trump stirs up this hatred - this fear - this shame that seems to be so pervasive in our capitalist buy buy mileau.
The first step is acknowledging not only our white privilege but our contribution to our racist sexist society. If we can only listen and feel the pain of Black Lives Matter
Our white privilege is racist and sexist. Let`s be honest about that. Ask yourself the questions: Did I hire people of color?; Did I live in integrated areas?; Did I fear a gang of black kids walking and laughing?.
I worked in the ghettos of New York in the 60s and remember getting on the subway with a bunch of black friends and seeing the fear in the eyes of the whites who sat in that car. I saw the young white cops who feared the blacks and Puerto Ricans.
I live in Mexico and see many of the expats wanting to live in segregated compounds because they fear Mexicans.
Some of you won`t like this - but it is RACISM. WE ARE RACISTS. It`s the fear of the unknown, the other. Our values are embedded in this Racist Sexist culture.
Trump stirs up this hatred - this fear - this shame that seems to be so pervasive in our capitalist buy buy mileau.
The first step is acknowledging not only our white privilege but our contribution to our racist sexist society. If we can only listen and feel the pain of Black Lives Matter
2
The Clintons' policies have jailed more African-Americans in this country than any of the political class before them. It's what they do not what they say.
5
Michael, I agree with you. But, we need to do better than that. We need to acknowledge the suffering of the black community before and after the civil war. We need acknowledge the brutality of what was transpiring.
Our Supreme Court established, condoned, set the standard of "Separate but Equal." We need to acknowledge that "Separate, but NEVER equal" is what really existed. So while white Americans were getting a great education and good jobs, that path was closed off to black Americans.
We need to acknowledge that black Americans were going to die in Vietnam for civil rights which weren't even available to them in this country.
We need to acknowledge that if you were black you could never expect a fair trail south of the Mason Dixon line. And if you were white and a civil rights worker you couldn't expect justice south of the Mason Dixon line either.
Even to today, we've got Luke Walton, who couldn't play first string on an NBA team being over paid to coach the Lakers. Everyone knows that we haven't had a good white basketball player since Larry Bird. Every NBA coach should be black, they know how to play the game.
Everytime I watch the Masters Golf Tournament in Augusta, GA I'm thinking that black Americans probably built course but they couldn't even get a starting time to play golf on any public or private golf course in all of Georgia.
And so on
Our Supreme Court established, condoned, set the standard of "Separate but Equal." We need to acknowledge that "Separate, but NEVER equal" is what really existed. So while white Americans were getting a great education and good jobs, that path was closed off to black Americans.
We need to acknowledge that black Americans were going to die in Vietnam for civil rights which weren't even available to them in this country.
We need to acknowledge that if you were black you could never expect a fair trail south of the Mason Dixon line. And if you were white and a civil rights worker you couldn't expect justice south of the Mason Dixon line either.
Even to today, we've got Luke Walton, who couldn't play first string on an NBA team being over paid to coach the Lakers. Everyone knows that we haven't had a good white basketball player since Larry Bird. Every NBA coach should be black, they know how to play the game.
Everytime I watch the Masters Golf Tournament in Augusta, GA I'm thinking that black Americans probably built course but they couldn't even get a starting time to play golf on any public or private golf course in all of Georgia.
And so on
5
College Men for Trump = Frat Boys
37
Liberal and Progressive antagonism towards even soft Nationalism is a huge source of division and discord in this country and other developed countries. I wonder whether Liberals and Progressives might understand the perspective of Nationalists if they were to frame the situation differently. Imagine you were a Canadian and you were faced with the choice of staying independent or joining a political union similar to the EU with the United States.
From an economic and freedom of movement perspective, a Union would make all the sense in the world. Canada has a small undiversified economy that is highly dependent on natural resources. For the average Canadian, an American Union would probably provide for more stable growth, enhance living standards and improve personal options by giving the motivated and inspired the freedom to easily move to New York City or Silicon Valley.
It is possible that a Liberal/Progressive might object purely on the grounds that the US is less progressive than Canada. However, I would argue that even if your views came close to the average American you might also object just from the perspective of not wanting to be swallowed up by a larger more dominant culture and losing a meaningful level of local control and existing culture. Globalists would tell you that you were being a romantic, irrational and, at the very least, probably imply that you were being racist.
All the same you might just be tempted to choose the "irrational" solution.
From an economic and freedom of movement perspective, a Union would make all the sense in the world. Canada has a small undiversified economy that is highly dependent on natural resources. For the average Canadian, an American Union would probably provide for more stable growth, enhance living standards and improve personal options by giving the motivated and inspired the freedom to easily move to New York City or Silicon Valley.
It is possible that a Liberal/Progressive might object purely on the grounds that the US is less progressive than Canada. However, I would argue that even if your views came close to the average American you might also object just from the perspective of not wanting to be swallowed up by a larger more dominant culture and losing a meaningful level of local control and existing culture. Globalists would tell you that you were being a romantic, irrational and, at the very least, probably imply that you were being racist.
All the same you might just be tempted to choose the "irrational" solution.
4
I think you just made the argument for NAFTA. The benefits of union economically without losing national identity, or healthcare.
2
Larger and more dominant? Try Larger and peasant, and we have to pay for them.
Historical facts speak for themselves. The machinery of the world as we have arbitrarily constructed it - economic arrangements, law and government, and socially useful insider networks have belonged to those who owned them. And that has for time out of mind been men of privilege.
We call these men "white" although that designation is far less a description of actual color than a shifting set of cultural markers that exist without any actual examination of their reasonableness or merit. Much of all this is shifting around, and it should be the least surprising thing that such creates rage and reason-paralyzing resentment and confusion. It is.
Now, it should be objectively apparent to any fair-minded and pragmatic participant that a shift from one power/insider group at the expense of another, zero-sum-game style is counterproductive in the extreme in a broader sense. Simply having a different set of winners and losers does not, cannot produce an optimally productive, integrated, and committed populace over the mid-to-longer term.
In other words, neither party's most cherished goals would lead to a prolonged period of social, legal, or political stability or productive concurrence.
As was shown in the decades long internecine blood-struggle over abortion, mere "winning" is no solution. A society cannot ignore into non-existence a significant part of the population. Everyone (or practically so) must be persuaded to join in to a workable compromise, or it's no go.
We call these men "white" although that designation is far less a description of actual color than a shifting set of cultural markers that exist without any actual examination of their reasonableness or merit. Much of all this is shifting around, and it should be the least surprising thing that such creates rage and reason-paralyzing resentment and confusion. It is.
Now, it should be objectively apparent to any fair-minded and pragmatic participant that a shift from one power/insider group at the expense of another, zero-sum-game style is counterproductive in the extreme in a broader sense. Simply having a different set of winners and losers does not, cannot produce an optimally productive, integrated, and committed populace over the mid-to-longer term.
In other words, neither party's most cherished goals would lead to a prolonged period of social, legal, or political stability or productive concurrence.
As was shown in the decades long internecine blood-struggle over abortion, mere "winning" is no solution. A society cannot ignore into non-existence a significant part of the population. Everyone (or practically so) must be persuaded to join in to a workable compromise, or it's no go.
7
Women of all stripes and colors still have a lot of headway to make up in our society-- from wages, to childcare, to reproductive rights, and more, that is why they are going for Hillary. On the other hand educated white men view themselves as entitled on feel they are on the losing end even though they still dominate most institutions of power in the US. And, even if they are educated, men, that does not necessarily make intelligent or discerning. It baffles me given any measure how they can vote for Trump. If they cannot bring themselves to vote for Hillary Clinton, fair enough, but to vote for Trump is the most ignorant thing they could do. them
6
It is true that no woman has yet been president.
OTOH no female draftee died in Vietnam whereas 58000 men did. Women live several years longer and are less likely to go to prison or be shot by the cops.
But women have mastered the art of complaining and men have mastered the art of saying "yes dear"
OTOH no female draftee died in Vietnam whereas 58000 men did. Women live several years longer and are less likely to go to prison or be shot by the cops.
But women have mastered the art of complaining and men have mastered the art of saying "yes dear"
3
Complaining is a human condition. To some, erectile dysfunction is a legitimate complaint. Others complain when they're giving birth. One of our Presidential candidates has made complaining into an art form. Clearly, even you Rohit are not quite as stoic as as you'd like us to think. At least not in print.
Many, many male kids who were sent to Vietnam would not have gone, if they had had the choice. Women didn't send them there, old men did. Many people of all genders "complained" about the deaths in Vietnam. OTOH, there are some who complain about women in combat. If women had not complained about full access to the military, they would not now have the great privilege of being shot at. Or does that mean they're trying to be men? It's so hard to tell.
Many, many male kids who were sent to Vietnam would not have gone, if they had had the choice. Women didn't send them there, old men did. Many people of all genders "complained" about the deaths in Vietnam. OTOH, there are some who complain about women in combat. If women had not complained about full access to the military, they would not now have the great privilege of being shot at. Or does that mean they're trying to be men? It's so hard to tell.
2
Amazing the white men profiled here don't see themselves as playing 'identity politics'.
12
"Identity politics" like "Globalism" are just made up terms made up by the right wing in order to bash Democrats. And they are deeply disingenuous.
Democrats and Republicans (in the past) recognized that certain groups had been purposely excluded from the American Dream and recognized the importance to domestic tranquility to find ways to include them.
Republicans discovered the political benefit of finding and exploiting wedge issues as a way of peeling off traditional Democratic voters.
So, if terms must be used, Identity Politics is the politics of including previously excluded groups. It is inherently unifying. Wedge Issue politics is the politics of exclusion and is inherently divisive.
Democrats and Republicans (in the past) recognized that certain groups had been purposely excluded from the American Dream and recognized the importance to domestic tranquility to find ways to include them.
Republicans discovered the political benefit of finding and exploiting wedge issues as a way of peeling off traditional Democratic voters.
So, if terms must be used, Identity Politics is the politics of including previously excluded groups. It is inherently unifying. Wedge Issue politics is the politics of exclusion and is inherently divisive.
2
After listening to decades of propaganda about the value of diversity; I never hear about meritocracy. Why?
20
From what I've seen and I've been in the workforce for 45 years, white males always seem to think they merited their positions.
And I've worked with some pretty stupid, lazy white males, who if they were any other color wouldn't have gotten a janitorial position.
I've worked tripley hard just to hit the glass ceiling time and again.
And I've worked with some pretty stupid, lazy white males, who if they were any other color wouldn't have gotten a janitorial position.
I've worked tripley hard just to hit the glass ceiling time and again.
1
This is not surprising, since so many people in college today are neither students or studious. Nor are they much interested in challenges to their pre-existing mindset. They are not there for enlightenment or beauty and truth, but rather for the sticker on their foreheads that says "employable." This is entirely understandable, since we have made college a shibboleth rather than an educational pursuit.
At least this should extinguish the fears of the righties that a leftist professoriat is "brainwashing" our youth. Of course, as was said about Patty Hearst, you can't launder what isn't in the hamper.
At least this should extinguish the fears of the righties that a leftist professoriat is "brainwashing" our youth. Of course, as was said about Patty Hearst, you can't launder what isn't in the hamper.
15
Trump is going to win. Not that I am happy about that, but it does give me great satisfaction that the Clinton's are put out to pasture, and the Democratic Party, which was 100% certain that the election was over last month, will have been made to look very foolish.
12
I am a white college educated male from the midwest and I support Hillary Clinton, enthusiastically but not without an awareness that she is imperfect and human. It seems obvious to me that much of the animus against HC is and has for a long time been the fact that she is a woman, that is, a smart, skillful, politically savvy, sometimes slippery, but remarkably successful (i.e. a politician). She has in common with her presidential predecessor that hatred and distrust of her is inexorably tied up with who she is, not just what she has done. What is surprising is how seldom the gender bias within the anti-Hillary camp is talked about or reported on. But the statistics reported here (and there are many many more) reveal just how sexist our culture is.
52
Someone who helped destabilize Libya and Honduras is a bit more than "imperfect and human."
4
She's not just imperfect, she's corrupt. Criminal. The animosity toward her is utterly unrelated to her gender. It's more related to her status as an attorney, you know, a trained liar, calculator and manipulator. If she were running against an honest woman, her opponent would make minced meat of her.
6
Dear Rohit,
The people who destabilized Libya and Honduras were the people living there, as is always the case. Don't buy into the Trump lies.
The people who destabilized Libya and Honduras were the people living there, as is always the case. Don't buy into the Trump lies.
2
The people who have signed that letter from the tech industry should really be embarrassed. If your name is on that list, I do not respect you. These people talk to Americans like their heads are in the stratosphere. They're arrogant, condescending and they seem to lack empathy.
Tech leaders are not the people we want leading a nation of people.
Tech leaders are not the people we want leading a nation of people.
14
Dave -- they are business leaders. What "empathy" do you want from them and why? And are you going to tell me, sincerely now, that Mr. Trump has "empathy?"
Oh, that's so very touching -- you are convinced Mr. Trump has empathy for you?
Oh, that's so very touching -- you are convinced Mr. Trump has empathy for you?
3
For many college men the culture is steeped in beer fueled machismo. How many if these men for Trump are influenced by a boys club group-think. Is there some absurd ridicule factor at play if a beer-pong playing spring breaker breaks ranks and speaks up for Hillary? Are our colleges creating courageous thinkers, or mob-mentality drinkers?
16
The future of America...
Seems dreadfully complex. It seems the only thing really Americans can discuss and make progress on are law, business, economics. In the modern world it seems we must not argue along superior/inferior people lines--meaning nationalism, religion, racial and ethnic difference are played down and I suppose ideally dissolved.
But this just leaves a pure economic playing field, a capitalism/socialism argument with less and less possible retreat to unifying constructs or mathematical sets called nation, religion, race, ethnic group, etc. So what does that mean? People not allegiant to much of anything except workplace, what pays hard cash in a world where economic crises do not occur WITHIN systems such as nation, etc. but are waves OF THE ONLY SYSTEM WE KNOW, a dynamic swim for your life ocean/economic system?
Worse, a pure economic system with no superior/inferior people along national, religious, racial, ethnic lines is still not a system purified of a superior/inferior people argument. Obviously even today one asks why EXACTLY it is one man is called "The General" and he directs "Soldiers" who are the ones who go and die, and why EXACTLY one person is "CEO" and the others "Scrubs".
We seem to be dissolving human identities such as nation, religion, race, ethnic group etc. because they cause conflict--and they do cause conflict--but this just means we move to an uncertain pure capitalism/socialism dialectic and who knows how that will turn out.
Seems dreadfully complex. It seems the only thing really Americans can discuss and make progress on are law, business, economics. In the modern world it seems we must not argue along superior/inferior people lines--meaning nationalism, religion, racial and ethnic difference are played down and I suppose ideally dissolved.
But this just leaves a pure economic playing field, a capitalism/socialism argument with less and less possible retreat to unifying constructs or mathematical sets called nation, religion, race, ethnic group, etc. So what does that mean? People not allegiant to much of anything except workplace, what pays hard cash in a world where economic crises do not occur WITHIN systems such as nation, etc. but are waves OF THE ONLY SYSTEM WE KNOW, a dynamic swim for your life ocean/economic system?
Worse, a pure economic system with no superior/inferior people along national, religious, racial, ethnic lines is still not a system purified of a superior/inferior people argument. Obviously even today one asks why EXACTLY it is one man is called "The General" and he directs "Soldiers" who are the ones who go and die, and why EXACTLY one person is "CEO" and the others "Scrubs".
We seem to be dissolving human identities such as nation, religion, race, ethnic group etc. because they cause conflict--and they do cause conflict--but this just means we move to an uncertain pure capitalism/socialism dialectic and who knows how that will turn out.
1
This is a very perceptive article and I thank you for it.
2
It seems to me that Hillary has the support of the 'rainbow' which is now the majority in this country. Trump can only count on white men. Seems like a landslide and hopefully so. I am confused by the current polls but hope the competition will cause the DNC and Hillary to present a better economic proposal.
If they could find the words it is likely that the Democrats could take back this government, both at the federal and state levels. And why not, the Republican's won't make life better for anyone other than the wealthy.
If they could find the words it is likely that the Democrats could take back this government, both at the federal and state levels. And why not, the Republican's won't make life better for anyone other than the wealthy.
5
I'm as far from white as one can get, yet I support Trump. What words could Democrats utter to take back every state and the federal government? Both parties are the bane of our existence. The political class has wrought the likes of Donald Trump as a Republican nominee and a more and more likely president. This country is undergoing a bloodless revolution. Can you not see that?
2
I would be interested in the geographical make up of the sample and the colleges of the Trump supporters. Bigotry is learned. I can only guess which schools would have the most Trump supporters but that would be bigoted of me.
6
Tell us, which are the bigoted universities in the United States? We'll take your guess.
Why college men are leaning towards Trump, as much of a bloviated blowhard as he is:
We know Clinton is bought and paid for by Wall Street and Big Pharma. She is untrustworthy, unprincipled, and will trim her sails to whatever wind seems most advantageous to her quest.
Trump is out there. His more radical proposals will never see the light of passage into law. As comical as he seems: He is open, tells it like he sees it, ignoring political pressures. That's refreshing.
For demographic purposes: My PhD in EE is from Purdue.
We know Clinton is bought and paid for by Wall Street and Big Pharma. She is untrustworthy, unprincipled, and will trim her sails to whatever wind seems most advantageous to her quest.
Trump is out there. His more radical proposals will never see the light of passage into law. As comical as he seems: He is open, tells it like he sees it, ignoring political pressures. That's refreshing.
For demographic purposes: My PhD in EE is from Purdue.
7
After years of being told they are the force of evil in our society, straight white men are finding their voice and fighting back. The fact that the left seems continually surprised by this is remarkable to me.
14
Get over it! When did "straight white men" ever loose their "voice" and who or what are they fighting against to regain it? Maybe if the whining stops and the reality of a Trump presidency sinks in, they will put the beers down come to their senses.
4
The Trump fans pictured are not all going to vote for him. (One is a young boy with a smiley face tee-shirt.) At the center of the photo is a handsome dude shouting, dressed like Trump with a long, long red tie, white shirt and black jacket--he is just raising hell. The others look like guys at a football game, having fun cheering on Trump's stupid remarks, "and Mexico will pay for the wall!" They aren't serious voters; they think Trump is a joker who reminds them of the late, crazy John Belushi.
4
This narrative is becoming laborious and tiresome. Which great jobs did the illegals and not-illegals abscond with leaving these poor, castrated males unemployed and in poor health? And exactly how will this whiny man with small hands get them back? Will he send all our white -faced babies to Mexico to make Trump suits? Or maybe he'll ship the cry-babies to China to make his ties?
Or dig for that clean coal we've all heard about but have never seen or smelled.
Trump supporters have settled for the lowest and cheapest manifestation of a leader. He demands nothing of them intellectually, feeds their innate insecurities while celebrating their refusal to reason. One might rightfully wonder why any would think Mr. Trump shares some connection with them. Or how they can continue to ignore the many falsehoods from self-funding to being outside the system with Gingrich by his side. They may have college degrees but that don't mean they can think. Maybe they graduated from Trump University.
Or dig for that clean coal we've all heard about but have never seen or smelled.
Trump supporters have settled for the lowest and cheapest manifestation of a leader. He demands nothing of them intellectually, feeds their innate insecurities while celebrating their refusal to reason. One might rightfully wonder why any would think Mr. Trump shares some connection with them. Or how they can continue to ignore the many falsehoods from self-funding to being outside the system with Gingrich by his side. They may have college degrees but that don't mean they can think. Maybe they graduated from Trump University.
7
I'm an educated, upper income woman, and like most of my friends, I support Trump. As my bumper sticker says, "She's worse."
11
Then I would say do more research.
4
Then you probably don't know anything about him, no offense. He knows absolutely nothing about governing, the Constitution, foreign policy, military affairs, the economy, or anything else a president must know. He's not very bright, none of his policy proposals make any sense, and many of his businesses rely on ripping off the unintelligent. He's worse than Clinton in every single way, so think again.
6
When you are hurting and your self-esteem is in the gutter all you want to do is strike out in anger and "punish," -who? Well, somebody must be responsible!
Our media today teaches us that you have to be rich, beautiful, have a luxurious lifestyle and sexy as all get out - or you are a nobody! From an ethical point of view that is a very big lie. Rather than playing sports, we watch Big Sports where everyone is a pro and makes millions.
These young guys turn to Trump who is a "winner". Oddly enough, he would be the first one to call them "losers" rather than do anything to make anyone but Himself feel like a winner.
Our media today teaches us that you have to be rich, beautiful, have a luxurious lifestyle and sexy as all get out - or you are a nobody! From an ethical point of view that is a very big lie. Rather than playing sports, we watch Big Sports where everyone is a pro and makes millions.
These young guys turn to Trump who is a "winner". Oddly enough, he would be the first one to call them "losers" rather than do anything to make anyone but Himself feel like a winner.
6
The college-educated white men who now are willing to vote for Trump over Clinton should probably think twice about this choice. If you think that your options in the current economy are lacking, just wait until Trump gets into office, implements his and the GOP's plans to restrict trade and destabilize the current world trade agreements and the global economy. Jobs will disappear and what had been a slow economic recovery, due in no small part to the GOP's actions (or lack thereof) over the past 8 years, will turn into an economic catastrophe that will make the Great Recession, let alone the Great Depression, look like a cakewalk. For an immediate example of what to expect from acting from an ill-informed perspective, simply look at the the consequences of the Brexit vote for the UK. While this monumental development still has a long time to play out, the future looks stark indeed for the populace of that country. You are college educated, use the skills you should have acquired to become informed of what we can expect with the policies Trump seeks to implement. With Trump, as in other forms of business dealings, the best approach is caveat emptor.
6
Just because you have a college degree doesn't mean you don't make bad choices. It just means you're less likely to. And, by the way, many educated people supported Europe's fascist regimes in the 1930s. The outcome, as we all know, was not good.
6
I think you'll find most Trump supporters are doing okay economically. The mythology that it's the white working class disaffected unemployed male is just that. Mythology. I saw the same thing when the leave Brexit voters were interviewed. They all looked quite prosperous.
At least where I live the people supporting Trump have one single thing in common. They are unreasonably angry over something. Some of them don't even know what. They just are. Some have an idea ISIS is coming for them. I live in a town of roughly 4000 people, many of them farmers who have never even been outside their county let alone their country. So they support a demagogue with a loud mouth and an orange face that they've watched scream on network TV, "YOUR FIRED!".
And just because a person has attended college doesn't mean they've learned anything about society or their role in it. I'd bet a lot of those young white males imagine themselves as "Masters of the Universe" one day. Their choice of Donald Trump shows how little they understand of that role.
At least where I live the people supporting Trump have one single thing in common. They are unreasonably angry over something. Some of them don't even know what. They just are. Some have an idea ISIS is coming for them. I live in a town of roughly 4000 people, many of them farmers who have never even been outside their county let alone their country. So they support a demagogue with a loud mouth and an orange face that they've watched scream on network TV, "YOUR FIRED!".
And just because a person has attended college doesn't mean they've learned anything about society or their role in it. I'd bet a lot of those young white males imagine themselves as "Masters of the Universe" one day. Their choice of Donald Trump shows how little they understand of that role.
5
How can Americans ever have a civil, serious political discussion if those on the left continue to define those on the right as being somehow psychologically or emotionally disturbed? This article is full of people who insist on diagnosing their opponents rather than enter into a dialogue with them. People who support a conservative agenda are not necessarily animated by pathological thinking.
14
Trump is not conservative.
5
Indeed Trump is not conservative, and he is very clearly disturbed and pathological.
Were there a sane conservative running ... the election would be very different.
Were there a sane conservative running ... the election would be very different.
3
Whether male or female, a college education should make the individual capable of determining competence when making a judgement for the office of President of these United States of America.
2
The elites are putting their ignorance on display:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/an-open-letter-technology-leaders-do...
The problem is not that these are bad people, rather the problem is that they think this is all about Trump. They do not realize that a large portion of the population cannot afford to think in such idealistic and unrealistic terms as these tech 'leaders' can do.
They might as well have written the letter to themselves. Nobody is going to hear it or care about it, because clearly these leaders do not care about workers. They care only about themselves, their paychecks and their idealism. They don't live in the real world nor do they understand how things really work.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/an-open-letter-technology-leaders-do...
The problem is not that these are bad people, rather the problem is that they think this is all about Trump. They do not realize that a large portion of the population cannot afford to think in such idealistic and unrealistic terms as these tech 'leaders' can do.
They might as well have written the letter to themselves. Nobody is going to hear it or care about it, because clearly these leaders do not care about workers. They care only about themselves, their paychecks and their idealism. They don't live in the real world nor do they understand how things really work.
3
It appears that most of the people commenting on this analysis are (surprise!) male.
I'm quite fond of my husband, grown sons, and I miss my dad terribly. But we're always aliens ... men, women.
Men think women are weird. And we old girls think you are weird (and occasionally dangerous).
Go, gender gap. Let's bring it out into the open. Go Hillary.
Sorry guys. Luv ya.
I'm quite fond of my husband, grown sons, and I miss my dad terribly. But we're always aliens ... men, women.
Men think women are weird. And we old girls think you are weird (and occasionally dangerous).
Go, gender gap. Let's bring it out into the open. Go Hillary.
Sorry guys. Luv ya.
5
Sorry gals, sisterhood is irrational and something of which you ought to be embarrassed. Remember Madeleine Albright?
3
The article dances around the central core of why college-educated white men say they would vote for Trump--even though they don't like him. The dance tune is obscured by asserting that the distrust of HRC is economically based about women in positions of professional responsibility.
Since I am one of those college-educated white males, having spent a lifetime surrounded by them, often in essentially all-male environments, the real reason is simple--rarely even conflicted. Misogyny. Men, gay and straight (I have male friends and acquaintances in both flavors) really don't trust females to do anything as well as a man. Nothing. Except cook, clean, have babies and raise them, and provide sexual relief (preferably on demand) for their "superior being" male partners.
The vulgar names men use for HRC among themselves are no different than the ones they use for all women--their wives/girl friends, mothers, sometimes excluded--though wives are not often excepted.
Face it America, if you haven't already, misogyny is as deeply ingrained in our culture as racism. I'd guess American males (of all colors) more often assault and brutalize women than they do racial minorities.
Are we ready for a female president? Given our successes with male-only presidents l think we can safely assume women can do no worse than the men already have. Will privileged redneck-leaning collage "educated" white male see the light? When have they ever?
Since I am one of those college-educated white males, having spent a lifetime surrounded by them, often in essentially all-male environments, the real reason is simple--rarely even conflicted. Misogyny. Men, gay and straight (I have male friends and acquaintances in both flavors) really don't trust females to do anything as well as a man. Nothing. Except cook, clean, have babies and raise them, and provide sexual relief (preferably on demand) for their "superior being" male partners.
The vulgar names men use for HRC among themselves are no different than the ones they use for all women--their wives/girl friends, mothers, sometimes excluded--though wives are not often excepted.
Face it America, if you haven't already, misogyny is as deeply ingrained in our culture as racism. I'd guess American males (of all colors) more often assault and brutalize women than they do racial minorities.
Are we ready for a female president? Given our successes with male-only presidents l think we can safely assume women can do no worse than the men already have. Will privileged redneck-leaning collage "educated" white male see the light? When have they ever?
7
The support isn't for Trump, he is actually doing worse with this group than any other Republican candidate has historically. it is simply a matter of pulling for the home team. White males of any stripe overwhelmingly vote Republican. They aren't all just going to stop because they don't like the new quarterback.
4
These days a bare majority of white males vote Republican nationally, and it's extremely geographically dependent. Outside the south, the majority of white males vote Democrat.
1
64% isn't a bare majority. But, yes, it is even higher in the South--but the South is part of America, no? http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2014/11/05/midterms_2014_64_percent...
2
The 800 lb gorilla in the room is the fact that the "college students" who go to "lower tier" institutions are often NOT getting a college education. They are getting vocational training. That training is very valuable, but it is NOT something that compares to an education in a top tier institution (although, even many of these are not ideal!!).
3
Many of them are NOT getting vocational training either, as valuable as that would be. Apprenticeship program, as in Germany, do that MUCH better than our collection of watered-down undergraduate institutions. Moreover, German apprenticeships, which are supported by businesses and indirectly by the government, pay people, rather than sticking them with usurious loans.
4
But, can we consider that perhaps the folks going to "lower tier institutions"
(which I, admittedly, didn't) got less left-wing brainwashing and took up
more useful things like nursing or computer science? This can be considered
a good thing.
(which I, admittedly, didn't) got less left-wing brainwashing and took up
more useful things like nursing or computer science? This can be considered
a good thing.
Are you including Oregon State in the "lower tier"? It is never mentioned in the short list of "top tier" schools. For goodness sake, it doesn't even make the top tier in the Pac Ten.
"Globalists, including elites in the Democratic Party,.."
Framing the definition of a "globalist" in this way wherein only elites in the Democratic party are named, is disingenuous at best, and overtly biased at worst. Globalist policies have historically (and currently) been largely espoused by capitalist, Milt Friedman, Republican policy makers. To leave them out of that equation makes it appear as though Democrat elites make up the bulk of these folks when in fact globalist policies are supported mostly by free-market Republicans. Support for global economic policies and free-market trade—while inhibiting the flow of labor—have been part and parcel of Republican elite polices for more than 20 years, yet Edsall chooses to obfuscate this fact with irresponsible writing. Bill Clinton may have signed NAFTA into law, but it was the realization of decades of Republican efforts. Those white males, however educated, who support Trump and/or other Republicans because they don't have jobs are basically sticking their votes/hands back into the mouths that bit them in the first place. Fools.
Framing the definition of a "globalist" in this way wherein only elites in the Democratic party are named, is disingenuous at best, and overtly biased at worst. Globalist policies have historically (and currently) been largely espoused by capitalist, Milt Friedman, Republican policy makers. To leave them out of that equation makes it appear as though Democrat elites make up the bulk of these folks when in fact globalist policies are supported mostly by free-market Republicans. Support for global economic policies and free-market trade—while inhibiting the flow of labor—have been part and parcel of Republican elite polices for more than 20 years, yet Edsall chooses to obfuscate this fact with irresponsible writing. Bill Clinton may have signed NAFTA into law, but it was the realization of decades of Republican efforts. Those white males, however educated, who support Trump and/or other Republicans because they don't have jobs are basically sticking their votes/hands back into the mouths that bit them in the first place. Fools.
7
Perhaps Redistribution should be renamed Fair and Equal.
7
Fair and Equal never did exist, never will exist and never should exist. It's about self reliance. Hard working people, even those from meager beginnings, don't have to give up their hard earned affluence to the gimme socialist underbelly of our society.
In addition to Trumps tax returns, can we also get his Wharton School transcript out into the public? With the intellect Trump has shown thus far, I do not believe he graduated, even at the bottom of his class, and would like to know how he could possibly have gotten into Wharton without his daddy's assistance.
Hey, conspiracy theories are fair play against Mr. Birther himself!
Trump and the conservative regressive party long for the return to sexism and racism to replace "gooey social justice" with "slime justice" to make America Great Again, ... for themselves. With compassionate conservatism a sincere empathy for guns and their owners and no one else. So sad.
Hey, conspiracy theories are fair play against Mr. Birther himself!
Trump and the conservative regressive party long for the return to sexism and racism to replace "gooey social justice" with "slime justice" to make America Great Again, ... for themselves. With compassionate conservatism a sincere empathy for guns and their owners and no one else. So sad.
8
49% of whites perceive immigrants as "a threat to American values".
Unbelievable. Half of whites believe this in the US? Who are these people?
If a country's way of life can be threatened by 14% of its population, the huge majority of which are on the margins struggling to make a liviing in the US, then that way of life is weak, sick, and needs reconstruction.
I am a 'white' American, of Irish, German , and Swiss ancestry.
Immigrants making a better life for themselves in the United States *IS* the American way of life.
I bet the fact of economic inequality and that children today will do worse than their parents has an inordinate amount to do with these attitudes among whites. But they are hypnotized by a media bubble that serves the interests of the superrich.
People better wake up to this, this is the cauldron of fascism.
%49 percent of whites!? It boggles my mind.
Unbelievable. Half of whites believe this in the US? Who are these people?
If a country's way of life can be threatened by 14% of its population, the huge majority of which are on the margins struggling to make a liviing in the US, then that way of life is weak, sick, and needs reconstruction.
I am a 'white' American, of Irish, German , and Swiss ancestry.
Immigrants making a better life for themselves in the United States *IS* the American way of life.
I bet the fact of economic inequality and that children today will do worse than their parents has an inordinate amount to do with these attitudes among whites. But they are hypnotized by a media bubble that serves the interests of the superrich.
People better wake up to this, this is the cauldron of fascism.
%49 percent of whites!? It boggles my mind.
28
Over the past several months I have employed some landscapers and other services whose employees appear to be immigrants from south of the border. Legal, illegal, I have no idea.
But I did notice they were far more bilingual than the average white frat boy college student and harder workers by orders of magnitude to the young, white American males I know and observe in our nearby college town.
The skill sets (ability to build, fix, design, knowledge of carpentry, masonry, horticulture) and work ethics of these probably uneducated young men are unbelievable and I consider that "American values" far more upheld by that than by some paunchy middle-class teen video game player who can barely speak coherently in his native language let alone a second or third one. But who feels entitled to his American citizenship and thinks he has a birthright of superiority over others whose shoe he doesn't deserve to lick.
In fact I hired another service made up of varsity hockey players from the nearby affluent high school and they pooped out after about the 10th shovelful of dirt and whined nonstop about the heat and humidity. Give me an "immigrant" any day over that.
But I did notice they were far more bilingual than the average white frat boy college student and harder workers by orders of magnitude to the young, white American males I know and observe in our nearby college town.
The skill sets (ability to build, fix, design, knowledge of carpentry, masonry, horticulture) and work ethics of these probably uneducated young men are unbelievable and I consider that "American values" far more upheld by that than by some paunchy middle-class teen video game player who can barely speak coherently in his native language let alone a second or third one. But who feels entitled to his American citizenship and thinks he has a birthright of superiority over others whose shoe he doesn't deserve to lick.
In fact I hired another service made up of varsity hockey players from the nearby affluent high school and they pooped out after about the 10th shovelful of dirt and whined nonstop about the heat and humidity. Give me an "immigrant" any day over that.
5
If you want to speak in a different language, move to a country where they speak that language.
3
I feel that the support of college educated white men for Trump is a backlash against Obama just as much as it shows their distrust of Clinton. Conservative white men especially can't believe Obama was elected twice without their consensus. That shows more than anything that they don't have absolute power as a voting block anymore and most likely never will again.
28
We'll just wait for them to die out. Eventually, they will be just a really bad memory. I love that they are nervous.
1
That will never happen. Almost everything you touch, live in, drive, drive on, fly, eat on a daily basis was deigned, built, or produced by a white man.
3
These polls, and the mere presence of Trump as the GOP nominee, tell us a great deal about the American voter. Sure, it's fun to poke holes in Trump's ignorance and bombast, but that's the shadow.
The reality is an electorate that is way out of touch with the modern world and is willing to be conned into thinking that we can go back to a time when mom stayed home, dad had a job that would last a lifetime, and his income was good enough to send two kids to college.
Simple minded nostalgic appeals to "morning in America" coupled with racism will get many voters salivating.
They don't ask themselves if that worked from them in the 1980 election. If they did, they would see that is where they fell off the cliff.
The reality is an electorate that is way out of touch with the modern world and is willing to be conned into thinking that we can go back to a time when mom stayed home, dad had a job that would last a lifetime, and his income was good enough to send two kids to college.
Simple minded nostalgic appeals to "morning in America" coupled with racism will get many voters salivating.
They don't ask themselves if that worked from them in the 1980 election. If they did, they would see that is where they fell off the cliff.
8
We would still have that time if the radical feminists of the 60's and 70's, instead of just working for equal opportunity, hadn't made mothers who wanted to stay home and raise kids to be brain dead, bored and miserable.
2
Spot on!
1
Oh, but you are so in touch with everything.
1
Seriously, the whole Trump phenomenon is proving the following things to me:
1) Too many Americans are ignorant.
2) Too many Americans are racist.
3) Too many Americans are sexist.
4) Democracy cannot really work with so many voters so unintelligent.
5) The days of America's greatness are over and it cannot exist much longer, due to its foolishness and ineptitude. Rome crumbled and so will we.
1) Too many Americans are ignorant.
2) Too many Americans are racist.
3) Too many Americans are sexist.
4) Democracy cannot really work with so many voters so unintelligent.
5) The days of America's greatness are over and it cannot exist much longer, due to its foolishness and ineptitude. Rome crumbled and so will we.
17
What is with all the name calling defeatists in NYC today?
Ignorant, racist, sexist, unintelligent? Why not pack up and move to Paris?
I am so certain that you will just love it there.
Ignorant, racist, sexist, unintelligent? Why not pack up and move to Paris?
I am so certain that you will just love it there.
8
Dear Phil Z.,
I only call Trump ignorant, racist, sexist and unintelligent because he is ignorant, racist, sexist and unintelligent. It's his own statements that make this clear. And I'm not going to Paris, I'll go down with the ship, perhaps in the aftermath of America's fall I can help restore civilization from the ashes.
I only call Trump ignorant, racist, sexist and unintelligent because he is ignorant, racist, sexist and unintelligent. It's his own statements that make this clear. And I'm not going to Paris, I'll go down with the ship, perhaps in the aftermath of America's fall I can help restore civilization from the ashes.
3
Believe it or not there are left leaning white men who believe global free trade to be bad for a giant swath of America. I am one of those people. I was in my 20s when Nafta happened so I am old enough to remember the past and to compare things today. But, equating that with racism is disingenuous and insulting.
Moreover, your quoted comment using Cal State Dominguez Hills as an example of a lower tier school is factually accurate. But, being a campus with a 95% minority student population that is 84% black with less than 2% white male population as well as the lowest overall graduation rate in the entire Cal State system indicts it in a way I am sure you did not intend, but the cat is out of the bag now. I should know, being a former and recent student there who ultimately transferred to Cal State Los Angeles: in austerity measures the State was redirecting funds away from Dominguez Hills campus and handing it to the lighter complected Los Angeles campus. Dominguez Hills got a library and a for-profit sports stadium while Cal State Los Angeles got an entire academic campus. Domiguez Hills had to cut programs and reduce course offerings, while Cal State LA expanded programs and added courses. This happened simultaneously despite massive student protests in 2012-2013.
So, in a nutshell, you made a better case for structural racism in California state colleges than you did about how terrible Trump supporters (of whom I am not) are.
Heckuva job Edsall...
Moreover, your quoted comment using Cal State Dominguez Hills as an example of a lower tier school is factually accurate. But, being a campus with a 95% minority student population that is 84% black with less than 2% white male population as well as the lowest overall graduation rate in the entire Cal State system indicts it in a way I am sure you did not intend, but the cat is out of the bag now. I should know, being a former and recent student there who ultimately transferred to Cal State Los Angeles: in austerity measures the State was redirecting funds away from Dominguez Hills campus and handing it to the lighter complected Los Angeles campus. Dominguez Hills got a library and a for-profit sports stadium while Cal State Los Angeles got an entire academic campus. Domiguez Hills had to cut programs and reduce course offerings, while Cal State LA expanded programs and added courses. This happened simultaneously despite massive student protests in 2012-2013.
So, in a nutshell, you made a better case for structural racism in California state colleges than you did about how terrible Trump supporters (of whom I am not) are.
Heckuva job Edsall...
15
I am one college educated white male who will proudly vote for Hillary Clinton. I won't even have to hold my nose when I push the button. I guess that makes me an anomaly.
31
Well, quite simply, all of those men are racist, sexist bigots. Make sure to keep telling them that and I'm sure they'll vote for Hillary in droves.
86
No, most are voting based on emotion, not out of prejudice.
1
You are voting for Trump anyhow, no matter what facts are pointed out to you. That's the beauty of voting for Trump.
This is your answer, NYT. They feel attacked and lampooned. There is a narrative that the DNC especially under HRC thinks of white men as contemptible.
For all the bias studies and data showing the deep inequities in American life, when every official has looked like you until recent memory you're going to lash out when you feel replaced.
For all the bias studies and data showing the deep inequities in American life, when every official has looked like you until recent memory you're going to lash out when you feel replaced.
1
Stereotypes and prejudices are ingrained from birth and in our very patriarchal society we know how that work. As well white men are feeling the pinch as both women and minorities are now competing with them where before they had the entitled position where these other groups were not even considered or allowed. Also many of the good paying low education Union jobs which were almost exclusively reserved for white men have disappeared. It's no surprise that white men don't like the competition and would vote to get back their entitled position. This election will be won by minorities, but mostly by women.
5
I'm a Bernie Sanders Democrat. If Trump were sticking to positions he espoused prior to this election (pro-choice, pro-single payer, etc), and if he weren't a sociopath (as demonstrated by the Trump U scandal), I'd be supporting him because of TOO MUCH immigration.
TOO MUCH immigration IS taking jobs from Americans, and costing money to the taxpayers (about half of all immigrants get some sort of entitlements, and schools in high immigrant areas are busting at the seams).
What worries me even more is the Democratic party's de facto espousal of open borders, and total irresponsibility in not addressing the question of how much immigration is optimal and how much is too much. That much lamented Senate "immigration reform" bill (read open borders) would have tripled legal immigration, to the equivalent of 1.5 NY States/decade while doing nothing to stop illegal immigration. (E-Verify would have been pushed five years into the future, and left vulnerable to suspension if legally challenged, and you know La Raza & ACLU would have challenged it.) But every Democratic senator voted for S744 except one of the Udalls.
Too much immigration is also an environmental problem. The average immigrant's GH emissions rise fourfold after arrival in the US.
A couple of hundred thousand immigrants per year is reasonable and sustainable. 2.75 million (as per S744) is crazy stuff.
TOO MUCH immigration IS taking jobs from Americans, and costing money to the taxpayers (about half of all immigrants get some sort of entitlements, and schools in high immigrant areas are busting at the seams).
What worries me even more is the Democratic party's de facto espousal of open borders, and total irresponsibility in not addressing the question of how much immigration is optimal and how much is too much. That much lamented Senate "immigration reform" bill (read open borders) would have tripled legal immigration, to the equivalent of 1.5 NY States/decade while doing nothing to stop illegal immigration. (E-Verify would have been pushed five years into the future, and left vulnerable to suspension if legally challenged, and you know La Raza & ACLU would have challenged it.) But every Democratic senator voted for S744 except one of the Udalls.
Too much immigration is also an environmental problem. The average immigrant's GH emissions rise fourfold after arrival in the US.
A couple of hundred thousand immigrants per year is reasonable and sustainable. 2.75 million (as per S744) is crazy stuff.
19
Let's see most illegal and some legal immigrates move into this work sectors
Picking fruit & vegetables - other agriculture work
Produce Packing
Meat Packing Plants - gotta love the smell
Landscaping
Cooking - Dish Washing - Cleaning Tables
Hotel Roof Cleaning
Construction - typically roofing and carpentry
None of these jobs require a college education - most are low pay - very hard work with long hours. Most Americans refuse doing this work for these reasons.
We actually need more people to move here. My baby boomer generation is dying off - we have a aging workforce - we need more people to grow the economy and to pay into Social Security to support us old folks.
Picking fruit & vegetables - other agriculture work
Produce Packing
Meat Packing Plants - gotta love the smell
Landscaping
Cooking - Dish Washing - Cleaning Tables
Hotel Roof Cleaning
Construction - typically roofing and carpentry
None of these jobs require a college education - most are low pay - very hard work with long hours. Most Americans refuse doing this work for these reasons.
We actually need more people to move here. My baby boomer generation is dying off - we have a aging workforce - we need more people to grow the economy and to pay into Social Security to support us old folks.
1
I guess white men are feeling a bit scared as they see their privilege diminishing. Yes, we women, especially older women, are used to the insults that certain men have employed to keep us down, and having a women running as president is really pushing their buttons. As one example, student Republican clubs have been sponsoring a right-wing creep to come to campuses to speak to primarily white men audiences with a lecture titled "Feminism is Cancer".
I can see how Trump represents everything they want to hear. Sad that so little has changed after all these years.
I can see how Trump represents everything they want to hear. Sad that so little has changed after all these years.
14
Whites and males on Trump's side, minorities and women on Clinton's; affirmative action's losers against affirmative action's winners. Affirmative action is the butterfly's wing that has helped cause this racial hurricane. Now we have to hear a Supreme Court justice complaining about Trump when her rulings helped create him.
8
Fascinating. Thank you Mr. Edsall. Please now clarify whether we are talking about tier one or tier three college graduates so we can get a proper fix on whether these mindless white graduates also have it in for elites. And can we please bury the litany about liberal professors dominating the university landscape and doing irreparable damage to young minds. Apparently it is mostly white male professors (who predominate on university campuses) that are subverting female students. More proof if it was even needed that girls are smarter and do better in school.
Ladies. Please have a heartfelt discussion with your university educated date/lover/companion and if he shows any signs of voting for Trump cut him off at the knees. No more dates, no nothing until he reforms. Of course we cant know who he votes for because that's confidential and many Trump supporters are probably too cowardly to tell the truth, but you can add up all of the $$ he has not spent on you during his period of penance and have him send a check to Hillary's campaign. Trial by check.
Ladies. Please have a heartfelt discussion with your university educated date/lover/companion and if he shows any signs of voting for Trump cut him off at the knees. No more dates, no nothing until he reforms. Of course we cant know who he votes for because that's confidential and many Trump supporters are probably too cowardly to tell the truth, but you can add up all of the $$ he has not spent on you during his period of penance and have him send a check to Hillary's campaign. Trial by check.
2
White, highly educated males, being Republicans? Not a surprise. Isn't that the definition of Ivy League Schools, white, rich and protestant (and also your grandfather and father went here, too.).
George W. Bush, the worst president in the history of the United States, still finds white, highly educated, born on 3rd base (born with a silver spoon in their mouths), as his biggest apologists and supporters, still.
George W. Bush, the worst president in the history of the United States, still finds white, highly educated, born on 3rd base (born with a silver spoon in their mouths), as his biggest apologists and supporters, still.
6
While not disputing the points brought up in this piece I can't help but wonder what excessive collage loan debt & the unrealistic expectations of what a collage degree can do for your job prospects plays in these individuals choices. While the democratic elite of which Secretary Clinton is a part of were pushing through NAFTA & jettisoned the working class in favor of the socially liberal & conservatively fiscal professional class as documented in Thomas Frank's book Listen Liberal they were also preaching the mantra of higher education as a solution to the loss of blue collar & now white collar jobs to globalization. Yet the high paying technical jobs failed to appear in the numbers sighted as justification for NAFTA & other "free trade" globalization orientated deals. The consequences of these policies also play's a role in Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders places in this political cycle.
8
Why, in all these lofty papers, is there no category for "willful ignorance"?
8
Why are equality measures defined as "redistributive?"
Am I correct in assuming, then, that there is an inherent white male bias to the United States of America and you believe that to be a good thing?
Am I correct in assuming, then, that there is an inherent white male bias to the United States of America and you believe that to be a good thing?
3
It is "redistributive" because it was coerced, not freely shared.
2
Gee, not much is "freely shared" in this world.
2
When the college educated is not split by gender, Clinton leads by six points. But when gender is taken into account, Clinton loses males in a plurality.
But this still does not clearly identify the role of college education. As Rosenthal points out, there has been an expansion in the lower tier college education over the past fifty years. He notes that there are "relatively more students graduating from Cal State Hayward or Cal State Dominguez Hills than from Berkeley or UCLA." This is not bad, but if the college educated males were to be split along the lines of the type of college they graduated from, I suspect there will be a significant difference.
This is mainly because a basic college education from any college or university has pretty much become the default just like a high school diploma was fifty years back.
But this still does not clearly identify the role of college education. As Rosenthal points out, there has been an expansion in the lower tier college education over the past fifty years. He notes that there are "relatively more students graduating from Cal State Hayward or Cal State Dominguez Hills than from Berkeley or UCLA." This is not bad, but if the college educated males were to be split along the lines of the type of college they graduated from, I suspect there will be a significant difference.
This is mainly because a basic college education from any college or university has pretty much become the default just like a high school diploma was fifty years back.
9
I know why, and several of the other posters know it too -- these are the C- whites who don't have a family name like "Bush" or Kennedy." They are the scrape-by college grads, and it's relevant to ask what their major was and how much debt they are now trying to pay off, in what kind of job.
A "college degree" doesn't mean much any more.
All you need to understand this demographic is to see that Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck channel them perfectly, have biographies that resonate:
Rush Limbaugh is the black-sheep of a family that is often called "the Kennedys of Missouri." He flunked out of a southern Missouri JC -- his mother gave a radio interview in which she said ruefully: "He flunked everything -- he got an F in ballroom dancing." Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity ... the angry white radio-personalities are college drop-outs. They also all have histories of alcohol abuse. Rush was convicted of passing forged opioid prescriptions, was an addict.
The constellation of problems go together and are so commonly ascribed to poor blacks: intellectual laziness, unwillingness to study, anger issues, alcohol and substance abuse ... and blaming every body else for your problems!
It's interesting that the right-wing females are almost always a step up: Sarah Palin, Michele Bachmann, Ann Coulter -- they all at least got through college; Ann Coulter graduated from Cornell cum laude in history and then made it through law school.
A "college degree" doesn't mean much any more.
All you need to understand this demographic is to see that Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck channel them perfectly, have biographies that resonate:
Rush Limbaugh is the black-sheep of a family that is often called "the Kennedys of Missouri." He flunked out of a southern Missouri JC -- his mother gave a radio interview in which she said ruefully: "He flunked everything -- he got an F in ballroom dancing." Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity ... the angry white radio-personalities are college drop-outs. They also all have histories of alcohol abuse. Rush was convicted of passing forged opioid prescriptions, was an addict.
The constellation of problems go together and are so commonly ascribed to poor blacks: intellectual laziness, unwillingness to study, anger issues, alcohol and substance abuse ... and blaming every body else for your problems!
It's interesting that the right-wing females are almost always a step up: Sarah Palin, Michele Bachmann, Ann Coulter -- they all at least got through college; Ann Coulter graduated from Cornell cum laude in history and then made it through law school.
6
In case you didn't read the article 'we' run the vast majority of business in America and we form the vast majority of the bullpen for those businesses.
We also get the engineering degrees necessary to perpetuate those stats.
We also get the engineering degrees necessary to perpetuate those stats.
4
Uh, Steve ... what 'we" are you talking about? College drop-outs? C- college grads?
Just to make a point clear -- i graduated from a UC university in 1972 with a batchelor's in engineering (effectively aeronautical engineering), was a rated commercial pilot with nearly 1000 hrs of experience then, and had two years part-time work experience at Edwards AFB on fighter stability and control, super recommendations.
The aviation business (both civilian and military) was in the tank post Viet Nam, the airlines weren't hiring, and the last thing in the world i wanted to be then (or now) is an airline pilot.
I went through 3 years of totally-ridiculous effort to make it in an industry after "Will the last person leaving SEATTLE -- Turn out the lights" -- two companies didn't pay me my last paychecks because they went bankrupt.
I went back to graduate schoo in '75, got a PhD (in engineering) -- that was very hard, took 7 years, came at a very high personal price, but frankly i have had a really great professional life since, and i am now near retirement.
What bugs me about your apparent perspective is that you blame black and brown Americans and illegal immigrants for your situation. Wow, that never crossed my mind about mine!
And even weirder you support Trump -- explain to me what Trump is really going to do for you? Really?
Just to make a point clear -- i graduated from a UC university in 1972 with a batchelor's in engineering (effectively aeronautical engineering), was a rated commercial pilot with nearly 1000 hrs of experience then, and had two years part-time work experience at Edwards AFB on fighter stability and control, super recommendations.
The aviation business (both civilian and military) was in the tank post Viet Nam, the airlines weren't hiring, and the last thing in the world i wanted to be then (or now) is an airline pilot.
I went through 3 years of totally-ridiculous effort to make it in an industry after "Will the last person leaving SEATTLE -- Turn out the lights" -- two companies didn't pay me my last paychecks because they went bankrupt.
I went back to graduate schoo in '75, got a PhD (in engineering) -- that was very hard, took 7 years, came at a very high personal price, but frankly i have had a really great professional life since, and i am now near retirement.
What bugs me about your apparent perspective is that you blame black and brown Americans and illegal immigrants for your situation. Wow, that never crossed my mind about mine!
And even weirder you support Trump -- explain to me what Trump is really going to do for you? Really?
5
Just shows that edumacation, in 'Merica, is circling the drain.
6
As a white, college-educated man, I guess I can feel comfortable following the "norm" of being able to speak for the entire USA.
- Women of America: you are 53% of the electorate. Unfortunately, it's up to you to stop Trump; we "ruling class" white men are too busy trying to keep what we have taken since Jamestown and the Mayflower to be concerned what should all-American (i.e., not just for whites) values. Please turn out and vote in November.
- Women of America: you are 53% of the electorate. Unfortunately, it's up to you to stop Trump; we "ruling class" white men are too busy trying to keep what we have taken since Jamestown and the Mayflower to be concerned what should all-American (i.e., not just for whites) values. Please turn out and vote in November.
7
It is very telling to me why people in the press and elites have such a hard time understanding the appeal of Trump. The press and the elite classes have been denying all of the problems of the working class for a long time, and they have outright caused the problems with very bad economic policies and trade policies.
The problem is real, and it is unfortunate that the manifestation of that problem in politics has turned racial. I'm not sure which is worse, the blind allegiance to a maniac or the outright denial by the elite class that they are wrong about how the world works. The elites just don't care because they're rich.
This is a total non-conversation. Nobody is talking about the same things. The divide on this is immense, and elites are the ones that need to wake up. Don't expect working people to get more articulate about their gripes because it probably won't happen. Understanding these problems is what elites are supposed to be capable of, but our rich leaders are just not very smart.
When Bush II became president, the conversation among my friends was largely to the effect that we weren't sure the country would survive. I'm still not sure we have survived it given the direction it is going. Trump could well put the final nail in the coffin. What comes next? I don't want to find out.
Something is wrong when the entire world hangs in the balance based on a single person. I'm not sure this is a smart way to run a country.
The problem is real, and it is unfortunate that the manifestation of that problem in politics has turned racial. I'm not sure which is worse, the blind allegiance to a maniac or the outright denial by the elite class that they are wrong about how the world works. The elites just don't care because they're rich.
This is a total non-conversation. Nobody is talking about the same things. The divide on this is immense, and elites are the ones that need to wake up. Don't expect working people to get more articulate about their gripes because it probably won't happen. Understanding these problems is what elites are supposed to be capable of, but our rich leaders are just not very smart.
When Bush II became president, the conversation among my friends was largely to the effect that we weren't sure the country would survive. I'm still not sure we have survived it given the direction it is going. Trump could well put the final nail in the coffin. What comes next? I don't want to find out.
Something is wrong when the entire world hangs in the balance based on a single person. I'm not sure this is a smart way to run a country.
12
The methodology of these polls needs scrutinizing.
I am a white, college educated, small business owner who is appalled to be associated with this "majority" white male voter group.
And yes, it is not because I am a big fan of Secretary Clinton (a clear hawk in grandma's clothing) it is because the republicans are about to nominate a psychopath for their candidate for POTUS!
I am a white, college educated, small business owner who is appalled to be associated with this "majority" white male voter group.
And yes, it is not because I am a big fan of Secretary Clinton (a clear hawk in grandma's clothing) it is because the republicans are about to nominate a psychopath for their candidate for POTUS!
233
And Hillary is part and parcel of the corrupt political class that brought us the Trump phenomenon. He will make America great by repudiating the Washington parasites.
3
White males are tired of feeling like scapegoats, Trump makes them feel like they don't have to apologize for who they are. I heard a a female commentator on Bill Maher going off on white men a few weeks ago and just thought this would never fly speaking about any other group. Yet, I'd have to imagine a white male had a hand in supporting her as a child, possibly paying for her education, or if not maybe that's what she was so bitter about.
59
"Yet, I'd have to imagine a white male had a hand in supporting her as a child, possibly paying for her education, or if not maybe that's what she was so bitter about."
I'd have to imagine she does not hate all white males. Not to mention unless you are absolutely sure of her upbringing it is recommended you keep those assumptions to yourself.
I'd have to imagine she does not hate all white males. Not to mention unless you are absolutely sure of her upbringing it is recommended you keep those assumptions to yourself.
4
Not all white women are bitter towards white men. I've been married to one happily for 40 years. And my Dad promoted my success in life, whether it was education, coaching sports, or being a parent. So please don't form your opinion of us based on a guest on a TV show.
2
'Yet, I'd have to imagine a white male had a hand in supporting her as a child, possibly paying for her education, or if not maybe that's what she was so bitter about."
If you don't like being scapegoated, losing this mentality will help you.
If you don't like being scapegoated, losing this mentality will help you.
4
It seems that college educated white males have finally realized they are the group with the target on their backs. All things being equal in terms of qualifications and job experience, a white male is at a disadvantage to a woman or minority simply because of their gender and skin color. This is supposed to represent progress to the rest of the world, but if you are a college educated white male, it doesn't sound so great.
6
Your statement is incorrect. With education and experience being equal, white women make less than white males. This not only doesn't sound so great, it doesn't sound so fair. None of the white men I know feel like they have targets on their backs.
Guess the aggrieved white males you know are now experiencing what it's been like to be a women or a minority all these years. But instead of it opening their eyes and learning from it, they whine that they want a return to privilege.
Guess the aggrieved white males you know are now experiencing what it's been like to be a women or a minority all these years. But instead of it opening their eyes and learning from it, they whine that they want a return to privilege.
7
"All things being equal in terms of qualifications and job experience, a white male is at a disadvantage to a woman or minority simply because of their gender and skin color. "
Especially at a disadvantage to a minority woman because she counts for twice as much on the government minority quota list.
Especially at a disadvantage to a minority woman because she counts for twice as much on the government minority quota list.
5
Sheesh. To answer the question why any group would support Trump you only have to look at the alternative. Clinton is 100% corrupt. I can't listen to more than 5 words before turning her off. Every word is fake and dishonest. Really funny that Ginsburg would call Trump a fake when her preferred candidate is undoubtedly fake.
JD
JD
10
Actually Ms. Clinton is not that corrupt, but since you've been brainwashed by the constant stream of Trump lies, I guess there's no point in trying to convince you.
6
You are another Clinton denier. Just think about her putting emails on a private server. Forget the legalities. What she is doing is putting military people and intelligence people at risk (through hacks to her email, which would be easy for sophisticated hackers) solely for her own political purposes. For all we know, she could have killed 10 or 20 people. (Adversaries of the US would not announce that they hacked her server and have secret information used to kill people allied with the US.)
Also, her commodity trades from the 70s stink to high heavens. (She is really a genius and stopped cold turkey after turning $1,000 into $100,000?) On top of that she didn't report the $100,000 of income, which makes her a felonious tax cheat. (unconvicted) I could go on and on, but many Democrats are in denial and choose to put their heads in the sand. With Clinton every time you turn over a rock, more cockroaches come out.
JD
Also, her commodity trades from the 70s stink to high heavens. (She is really a genius and stopped cold turkey after turning $1,000 into $100,000?) On top of that she didn't report the $100,000 of income, which makes her a felonious tax cheat. (unconvicted) I could go on and on, but many Democrats are in denial and choose to put their heads in the sand. With Clinton every time you turn over a rock, more cockroaches come out.
JD
3
Dear JD,
As to the email thing, Ms. Clinton was doing what every previous Sec. of State had also done, since the adoption of email. Every single one, bar none. So no, that doesn't indicate corruption. Nobody has died for it, this is just more Trump nonsense made up out of nothing. I note you have no proof nor cites for anything. The commodity thing you mention also seems to be a lie.
As to the email thing, Ms. Clinton was doing what every previous Sec. of State had also done, since the adoption of email. Every single one, bar none. So no, that doesn't indicate corruption. Nobody has died for it, this is just more Trump nonsense made up out of nothing. I note you have no proof nor cites for anything. The commodity thing you mention also seems to be a lie.
5
You're confusing college with being educated. It's just a place where young adults go to socialize, education is rarely the point of college. It's an entitlement.
6
This white, college-educated, California native, former news media professional who is also an age- and gender-cohort of Hillary's -- cannot today and never have been able to stomach the sight or sound of her, let alone her ideas. Have lots of friends in this demographic who feel the same way. Don't like either of the supposed candidates, but despise Trump less.
9
A valid argument can be made that the animus against Hillary Clinton is largely sexist. This rather lengthy but cogent argument went viral on FaceBook: https://thepolicy.us/thinking-about-hillary-a-plea-for-reason-308fce6d18...
A follow-up by the author may be found here: https://medium.com/@michaelarnovitz/thinking-about-hillary-a-follow-up-2...
I do not know the author but I found these articles to be enlightening about Mrs. Clinton's lengthy career and the obstacles she has confronted. I'm older than Mrs. Clinton and certainly less talented and public, but our experiences are similar. In my career in traditionally male-dominated workplaces I often met with disapproval for my ambitions and successes. And the sexism came from both genders!
I hope these links work here. The articles are really worth reading.
A follow-up by the author may be found here: https://medium.com/@michaelarnovitz/thinking-about-hillary-a-follow-up-2...
I do not know the author but I found these articles to be enlightening about Mrs. Clinton's lengthy career and the obstacles she has confronted. I'm older than Mrs. Clinton and certainly less talented and public, but our experiences are similar. In my career in traditionally male-dominated workplaces I often met with disapproval for my ambitions and successes. And the sexism came from both genders!
I hope these links work here. The articles are really worth reading.
14
Certainly in my industries (construction, facility management, engineering consulting) there is virtually non-stop ridicule of any sort of Clinton support. There is also an insinuation that one must be feminine to support her. And so Trump carries the day by a wide margin.
I think in a sense, Clinton is harmed by following the first black president. Obama engendered a lot of hostility, and I think there is a certain segment of the population that does not want another non-white-male in the oval office. They want a guy who looks and acts like they want them to look and act.
Nonetheless, I am a little surprised by the depth of support I see for Trump. The man, after all, is obviously not competent.
I think in a sense, Clinton is harmed by following the first black president. Obama engendered a lot of hostility, and I think there is a certain segment of the population that does not want another non-white-male in the oval office. They want a guy who looks and acts like they want them to look and act.
Nonetheless, I am a little surprised by the depth of support I see for Trump. The man, after all, is obviously not competent.
49
Perhaps for these men Trump represents a return to the fifties where the ideal woman is one with an hour glass figure, blond hair and an unquestioning loyalty to her man. In America, access to tertiary education is rather more widespread than in other countries and it sweeps in youths who are and who remain unsophisticated despite their "education".
217
It clearly shows that the term "education" needs to be changed.
1
Yep. Well-said.
And you just KNOW Hillary Clinton reminds some of these guys of their ex-wives, or their mothers-in-law...
And you just KNOW Hillary Clinton reminds some of these guys of their ex-wives, or their mothers-in-law...
1
And you wonder why the despise Hillary...
1
Being a college educated white man, the thought of either clinton or trump in the white house makes me want to puke.
17
Facts and truth mean nothing to Trump supporters. These people are deluded and misguided by right wing hate and propaganda.
41
This is tribal. It is primal racism in which belief trumps logic every time. This election is a referendum on whether racism will continue to dominate our culture and economy, and facts are irrelevant.
1
What a country. Get me outta here!
10
If you want to understand why people support Mr. Trump, you have to consider the ways in which we now talk about politics. We discuss issues almost solely in terms of interests groups, demographics and marketing strategy. People identify with their group and see attention to other groups as pandering, either to privilege or to victimhood. Politicians are, at most, ''fact-checked;'' they are never engaged and challenged in complex or persistent ways by reporters. We read 10 times more about whether Clinton's email practices will hurt her polling than we do about those actual practices, whether they were irresponsible, or whether the scrutiny inflicted on them was honest. We read more about whether Mr. Trump is a racist than about the lives of undocumented workers, or the economics of the industries that illegally employ them, or of the purpose and cost of building and policing 2000-mile walls. Politics should be about making informed choices. The more informed people are, the more the media offers them models for practial, intelligent discussion of problems and their solutions, the less likely they are to vote for crackpots like Mr. Trump (or, perhaps, for professional self-marketers like Ms Clinton), whatever their race, gender or education level.
17
Racism sees no boundaries whether rich or poor, educated or not.
7
"An ABC News/Washington Post survey in June gave Trump a 49-44 lead among white men who have completed four years of college."
The narrative from the media was that Trump's primary support was from uneducated white males. It was implied that white educated males were discerning enough to see him as the racist con man he really was. Having worked in corporate America for 30 years and having attended all white male mangers' meetings, I have witnessed conversations regarding women and minorities in that group become indistinguishable from jock locker room banter for a high school sports team. It is also noticeable among Trump's stable of celebrities, how many come from the sports' world.
The narrative from the media was that Trump's primary support was from uneducated white males. It was implied that white educated males were discerning enough to see him as the racist con man he really was. Having worked in corporate America for 30 years and having attended all white male mangers' meetings, I have witnessed conversations regarding women and minorities in that group become indistinguishable from jock locker room banter for a high school sports team. It is also noticeable among Trump's stable of celebrities, how many come from the sports' world.
15
As a college educated white, middle-class male in America it is glaringly obvious to me what's driving much of this churning anxiety: White male privilege is rapidly crumbling. I'm certainly not the first to note this, of course. The upshot is that the initiatives and programs Mr. Rosenthal refers to--the redistributions etc.--are erasing that white male assumption of preference, and my white male colleagues don't like it one bit. Movement toward equality feels like oppression to those who once had privilege. The obvious irony is that this movement toward equality, the real meaning of 'America,' is precisely what my white, male colleagues seem to be fearful of.
83
Hilary Clinton and her followers have done a good job of excluding males, and have implied that males are the enemy ("fighting for women and children"). Why wouldn't males be pushed away by this and the "us girls have to stick together" nature of the primary campaign? Hilary and her followers were the first to play the gender card. It had to have consequences. At this point, like many college-educated white men, I will vote for Hilary, but with a distinct lack of enthusiasm, and only because Trump is such an obviously bad candidate.
2
White college men's animus against Clinton, who happens to be a woman, is a red herring. Why don't you also poll us non-white legal immigrants of both sexes with skills from developing countries and see how we feel about her policies to remake America into the countries that we left behind?
19
The headline suggests that white graduates of Harvard, Stanford, Duke, MIT, Columbia, Kenyon, UNC, et al, favor Trump, which is counter-intuitive if you believe that a quality college education makes you smarter politically, or at least more resistant to demagoguery.
It turns out that the headline is inaccurate, as Edsall points out that the data mostly involves white graduates of what used to be called "directional universities" like East Texas State or Northwest Idaho, etc. Campuses that were not known for their academic prowess.
Yet alma mater or level of education turns out to be a red herring for a much more alarming finding: white men still have misogynist attitudes towards the opposite sex. Shouldn't that be the headline, and the main point of the article? If true, then the Clinton-Trump contest takes on a much different tone, as one pitting the sexes against each other for control of the Supreme Court, the Oval Office, and the future direction of the nation. Education, apparently, is trumped by 19th Century attitudes of men towards women.
It turns out that the headline is inaccurate, as Edsall points out that the data mostly involves white graduates of what used to be called "directional universities" like East Texas State or Northwest Idaho, etc. Campuses that were not known for their academic prowess.
Yet alma mater or level of education turns out to be a red herring for a much more alarming finding: white men still have misogynist attitudes towards the opposite sex. Shouldn't that be the headline, and the main point of the article? If true, then the Clinton-Trump contest takes on a much different tone, as one pitting the sexes against each other for control of the Supreme Court, the Oval Office, and the future direction of the nation. Education, apparently, is trumped by 19th Century attitudes of men towards women.
81
I went to MIT and I don't support Trump. However, my high quality super education (cost me $186000) has shown me that Hillary is not the answer either. Jill Stein 2016.
1
The message from these sociologists and academics seems to be that gender and racial stereotypes prevail over rational thinking--even among college-educated men. And the fact that so many are inclined to support Donald Trump, despite his glaring lack of qualifications and presidential temperament, shows just how deep that resentment and bigotry is. But before we give up all hope, let's remember that this country elected an African American president, and then re-elected him by a wide margin.
35
Obama was not re-elected by a wide margin. He won 51.1% of the vote. There is plenty of people, I'm sure, in the 48.9% remaining that hates him because he's black.
No other US President EVER had to deal with disrespect at the level Obama does.
No other US President EVER had to deal with disrespect at the level Obama does.
2
"There has been a large expansion of the bottom tier, with relatively more students graduating from Cal State Hayward or Cal State Dominguez Hills than from Berkeley or UCLA. And those graduating from lower tier schools may not be doing all that well in the economy."
"Cal State Hayward"
Cal State Hayward doesn't exist. Cal State East Bay does exist. You can spot New Yorkers a mile away.
"Cal State Hayward"
Cal State Hayward doesn't exist. Cal State East Bay does exist. You can spot New Yorkers a mile away.
7
Doesn't speak well of our colleges, does it?
125
The Trump phenomenon doesn't speak well of America as a whole. If he wins, America should be destroyed, as we will have proven to be unfit to survive.
8
Just a moment. We keep up with politics, but don't answer the phone when it rings (unless we recognize the phone number.)
Too much is assumed by cold call polling, and which we feel is an invasion of our privacy.
We have NoMoRobo so when either party calls, we let it ring once and then the NoMoRobo kicks in.
It's one way to keep our sanity and also vote our preference when the time comes.
Too much is assumed by cold call polling, and which we feel is an invasion of our privacy.
We have NoMoRobo so when either party calls, we let it ring once and then the NoMoRobo kicks in.
It's one way to keep our sanity and also vote our preference when the time comes.
8
Oh, it's not surprising that college-educated white males would back Trump. I am stunned at some of the otherwise-smart, educated people I know who support this man.
They fear their loss of white privilege. They think minorities will steal their fortunes if Democratic or liberal politicians raise their taxes and appropriate the money to benefit those in need. They look with disdain upon people who cut their lawns or clean their toilets. They think minorities will grab an excess share of career and other opportunities from their children and grandchildren. They have no interest in seeing brown or black Americans make their mark in society beyond entertainment or sports. If you mention the idea that Republicans obstruct President Obama at least partly because of his race, they react with outrage or disbelief. But they know it's true and they secretly support that idea.
Even as we thought we were making progress against these sentiments up to, and including, the election of a black President, all of these feelings were still bubbling below the surface. Now, Trump has brought them out into the open and has made them "acceptable."
I would just caution my fellow white male college graduates to read about Germany in the early 1930s and see if you find any similarities with America in 2016. After President Trump is finished with minorities, he just might come after you. What will you tell your grandchildren about this period? That you did nothing?
They fear their loss of white privilege. They think minorities will steal their fortunes if Democratic or liberal politicians raise their taxes and appropriate the money to benefit those in need. They look with disdain upon people who cut their lawns or clean their toilets. They think minorities will grab an excess share of career and other opportunities from their children and grandchildren. They have no interest in seeing brown or black Americans make their mark in society beyond entertainment or sports. If you mention the idea that Republicans obstruct President Obama at least partly because of his race, they react with outrage or disbelief. But they know it's true and they secretly support that idea.
Even as we thought we were making progress against these sentiments up to, and including, the election of a black President, all of these feelings were still bubbling below the surface. Now, Trump has brought them out into the open and has made them "acceptable."
I would just caution my fellow white male college graduates to read about Germany in the early 1930s and see if you find any similarities with America in 2016. After President Trump is finished with minorities, he just might come after you. What will you tell your grandchildren about this period? That you did nothing?
297
um...just no. I don't look on with disdain at anyone who is working for a living - maybe because my parents did these same jobs and their hard work afforded me a great opportunity to take advantage of all that is offered in this country. Those who engage in identity politics on both sides (DeBlasio, Clinton, Guiliani) just don't get is that we want are country to work for everyone regardless of color. I am genuinely happy for my babysitter who came from central america (legally), works hard and along with her husband have created a great life here. More importantly her dedication to her 4 kids - that she can afford to clothe, educate and feed as well as nourish with love will make our country stronger. She did not come for a hand out. I despise a lot of Trump's rhetoric but I really resent is that there is a class of people both white, black and all colors in between who just feel entitled...free housing, free healthcare, free education and they still won't do the necessary work to raise their kids or look for work or contribute in any way meaningfully to society - they are on drugs (always money for that), wreak havoc on their kids and cry foul when they break the laws that keep society civil. Meanwhile we taxpayers...we're just busy trying to work everyday for ourselves and our families....I deeply resent being told that I need to check my privilege by the leading Dems who both are multi millionaires after a career in politics.
8
NR - If I could, I would recommend you comment 100 times. You hit the nail on the head, and the privileged brat LIChef just doesn't get it.
3
That's kind of superficial, I think. Globalization has not been kind to middle-class people in the West. Brexit is an example, but interviews with those of the middle class in just about every country in Europe from Greece to France and including Germany would reveal similar sentiments. The globalists dismiss them as ignorant, or racists, or both.
3
White college guys might indeed favor The Donald over Hillary, but look at the lead photo. What white father would want any of these guys dating their daughters? Let me guess. Not many. OK, OK, they probably would be discomfited by their sons dating Hillary Clinton, too, but that's not my point.
Besides the massaging of their testosterone-laden sense of real American macho, what do they think they'll get from a Trump presidency? We may -- or may not -- have overestimated the catastrophic consequences of Brexit, but we cannot for a minute exaggerate the disaster of Donald Trump in the Oval Office.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
Besides the massaging of their testosterone-laden sense of real American macho, what do they think they'll get from a Trump presidency? We may -- or may not -- have overestimated the catastrophic consequences of Brexit, but we cannot for a minute exaggerate the disaster of Donald Trump in the Oval Office.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
45
Sorry but this is not hard to understand at all. Most white (angry & unenlightened - seems to go together) men simply cannot stand the thought of a woman at the helm. Period. Done. And who said in college or college educated men are so smart....?
130
Nor could they stand a black man at the helm. Obama derangement syndrome is going to transition smoothly to Hillary derangement syndrome, only with a Trump headache the morning after.
1
Just because people have gotten a college education doesn't mean they can't be racist, sexist, and abysmally unintelligent. Plenty of colleges are degree mills that do nothing to open up their students' minds, or improve their ability to think. Particularly the religious ones, like Regent University (by Pat Robertson) which actually increase their students' closed-mindedness and ignorance.
So these white males are going for Trump because they're racist, or sexist, or fools. If anyone believes a fence along our border would do the slightest amount of good, they must be an idiot, and thus I figure everyone supporting Trump is an idiot. All this poll proves is that colleges can't always cure idiocy.
So these white males are going for Trump because they're racist, or sexist, or fools. If anyone believes a fence along our border would do the slightest amount of good, they must be an idiot, and thus I figure everyone supporting Trump is an idiot. All this poll proves is that colleges can't always cure idiocy.
142
White males might think that trump will restore all entitlements that feel they have lost due to equal opportunities for women, immigrants, jobs outsourced, etc.
Care to bet on that? It won't happen. You think because your white you are owed something? Get off your backside and work for it like the rest of us.
When brain functionality is controlled at crotch level and fueled with testosterone we see animal control instincts and hate for anyone or thing that gets in their way.
These boys/men will be trumps 'brown shirts' if trump is elected. Their hate and actions will be condoned.
Keep this in mind when you vote in November!
Care to bet on that? It won't happen. You think because your white you are owed something? Get off your backside and work for it like the rest of us.
When brain functionality is controlled at crotch level and fueled with testosterone we see animal control instincts and hate for anyone or thing that gets in their way.
These boys/men will be trumps 'brown shirts' if trump is elected. Their hate and actions will be condoned.
Keep this in mind when you vote in November!
84
A college education does not make you smart. It's supposed to give you the tools to reason out wise decisions, but- you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
17
All things considered, shouldn't the quote be changed to read, "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it think"?
3
inflation adjusted value of imports...
shouldn't that be *net* imports ? (although our exports may be from less labor intensive industries then exports)
How many of these college educated trump supporters are angry cause they got taken by a scam like Trump U ?
shouldn't that be *net* imports ? (although our exports may be from less labor intensive industries then exports)
How many of these college educated trump supporters are angry cause they got taken by a scam like Trump U ?
4
100%
The usual well-thought-out analysis from Edsall. But the question of why we should wonder about the data is mentioned only in passing: "The meaning of a college degree.. has changed over the years: There has been a large expansion of the bottom tier, with relatively more students graduating from Cal State Hayward or Cal State Dominguez Hills than from Berkeley or UCLA." "college educated" today doesn't denote people who are particularly bright, or sophisticated, or even very well educated. Unlike the children in Lake Woebegone, we are not all above average. There are plenty of college-educated yahoos, and as the article points out, plenty of them aren't doing all that well.
Like it or not, agree with it or not, Hillary has done more to promote vicious identity politics that are ripping the country apart. She has gotten way ahead of groups, especially white males, that should have been included in her base. "College educated white males" are not the white-wine-and-brie folks of 1960s liberalism.
What a shame, and how ironic, if all this leads to putting Trump in the White House. Talk about "unintended consequences!"
Like it or not, agree with it or not, Hillary has done more to promote vicious identity politics that are ripping the country apart. She has gotten way ahead of groups, especially white males, that should have been included in her base. "College educated white males" are not the white-wine-and-brie folks of 1960s liberalism.
What a shame, and how ironic, if all this leads to putting Trump in the White House. Talk about "unintended consequences!"
13
The consequences of not voting for Hillary on some sort of principle may be unintended, but they are not unforeseeable. When the inevitable happens under President Trump, I will hold those who refused to vote for Hillary as accountable as those who came out for Trump.
3
Ladies! We've got this.
190
How many of you have husbands or significant others who have been screwed over by free trade and globalization? I'm guessing the majority.
4
I hope you do! Those of us who see women as partners and not as competition will support.
3
Possibly, for now. But don't forget, you declared the war. The male half of the gender revolution is still to come. Be careful what you wish for?
4
As has been established before, Trump is supported by the George Wallace demographic, which is different than the blue collar demographic the media has turned into a trope:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/earl-ofari-hutchinson/trumps-support-isnt-...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/earl-ofari-hutchinson/trumps-support-isnt-...
12
It seems to me nationalism is not loyalty TO a country but possession OF a country. "We have to take OUR country back." "Get out of MY country." And from the looks of Trump's proposals, what this country has always stood for and its reputation in the world don't as matter as much as the face that "we" have it and "they" don't.
(And if we can't have it, nobody can?)
But if what this country stands for means anything, then we can't throw them away. And that is why I am a college-educated white man who DOESN'T support Trump.
(And if we can't have it, nobody can?)
But if what this country stands for means anything, then we can't throw them away. And that is why I am a college-educated white man who DOESN'T support Trump.
195
Identity politics is toxic and distracts the real issues. If the Democratic party solidifies its image as the party of women and minorities , then this becomes an election all about race and gender. Economic issues get swept under the table and the oligarchs win.
28
So it's identity politics when it's women and minorities? What is it when it's men and white, or is that some sort of natural order?
And societal inclusion is not mutually exclusive to economic issues (and what about the environment?). We live in a complex time and place with many issues that are critically important to many different constituencies and they all need to be dealt with in parallel - otherwise we're not being honest with ourselves about what this country is trying to stand for.
And societal inclusion is not mutually exclusive to economic issues (and what about the environment?). We live in a complex time and place with many issues that are critically important to many different constituencies and they all need to be dealt with in parallel - otherwise we're not being honest with ourselves about what this country is trying to stand for.
8
I find this to be true, even usually dependable democrats have started to spew hate for Hillary.usually rational people are unable to explain their views and repeat the trump mantra. corrupt,hillary.
9
I would expect the frat boys to go for Mr. Trump big time.
Did either survey ask about fraternity membership?
Did either survey ask about fraternity membership?
149
you meant "bigly", believe me
1
What a shameless load of partisan tripe. Meanwhile, in the real world, there's this from yesterday's Bloomberg/Purple poll: "Hillary Clinton is crushing Donald Trump among college-educated white voters, a group Mitt Romney easily won in 2012 and one his Republican Party has carried in presidential contests for decades. White voters with at least a college degree—a group that represented more than a third of the 2012 electorate—back Clinton over Trump 48 percent to 37 percent, the latest Purple Slice online poll for Bloomberg Politics shows." Romney won that group by 14 percentage points, according to exit polls."
12
The point is that that 48% for Clinton is actually about 67% women for Clinton and only about 25% men.
10
Read it again. Edsall writes about males, you quote polls that include both sexes.
6
Just what is surprising -- white college men choosing Trump. Hardly.
Hillary Clinton is the poster girl for the elite dominating the political landscape. That just doesn't resonate with young white men from the poster GIRL part to the elite part.
We Democrats must recognize that the gender gap is likely to determine this election. I don't mean the traditional notion of female voters supporting Democrats. I mean finding the right voice to attract 40% of white male voters.
Hillary Clinton is the poster girl for the elite dominating the political landscape. That just doesn't resonate with young white men from the poster GIRL part to the elite part.
We Democrats must recognize that the gender gap is likely to determine this election. I don't mean the traditional notion of female voters supporting Democrats. I mean finding the right voice to attract 40% of white male voters.
6
Trump is a slow train wreck.
It was amazing to see Trump refer to Ginsburg as a judge rather than a justice. It was shocking to see Speaker of the House Paul Ryan refer to Ginsburg as a judge rather than a justice. Apparently stupidity is contagious.
It was amazing to see Trump refer to Ginsburg as a judge rather than a justice. It was shocking to see Speaker of the House Paul Ryan refer to Ginsburg as a judge rather than a justice. Apparently stupidity is contagious.
183
Picking nits, eh?
6
No, they're not being stupid. What they're doing is diminishing her by not referring to her by her proper role. They do know she should be referred to as a 'justice' but they don't want to give proper credit on her achievement as being a member of our highest court.
8
As an appellate lawyer, I don't see that as a big deal. The words are pretty much synonymous.
5
Redistribution works when a rising tide lifts all boats. When the tide ebbs, everybody worries about the boat sinking. That is the essence of the problem. I well remember when the "globalists" were selling the transformation of the American economy - that we would ship the relatively low tech, low pay jobs overseas and replace those jobs with high tech-- biotech, computers, etc. - and train up the employment force -- to fill them. Turns out, not so easy or fast. What we need immediately is a massive infrastructure program to refloat the bottom of the economy while making the globalist transition. Whoever gets elected, I predict, that is what we are going to do. That will alleviate much of the stress we are now feeling as a society.
103
"Redistribution works when a rising tide lifts all boats."
What the Capital-class with the yachts have done is to take away the little boats from the rest of us and gave life savers to the cheapest workforce they could find overseas - thereby allowing them keep the difference to supersize their yachts. Those who lost their dingy are now drowning in the rising tide.
What these industrial/business "leaders" have effectively done is - instead of helping the Chinese and others develop (teaching them how to fish) they transferred the factories in addition to the know how (they gave away our own fishing rod too) so now we depend on them (to eat fish). All for short term gain - initial gain - for these supposed "leaders."
What the Capital-class with the yachts have done is to take away the little boats from the rest of us and gave life savers to the cheapest workforce they could find overseas - thereby allowing them keep the difference to supersize their yachts. Those who lost their dingy are now drowning in the rising tide.
What these industrial/business "leaders" have effectively done is - instead of helping the Chinese and others develop (teaching them how to fish) they transferred the factories in addition to the know how (they gave away our own fishing rod too) so now we depend on them (to eat fish). All for short term gain - initial gain - for these supposed "leaders."
7
OK. Good points you are making there. But which of the candidates from the two major parties has announced a plan to do what you say you desire. So far as I can tell, only one: Hillary Clinton. I may not love her, but she does seem to be coming into this campaign prepared. Whereas Mr. Trump seems not to be at all.
3
If these guys only knew that it's private equity that is creating the redistribution.
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Hear! Hear!
They do, Crandell. They are the lucky recipients at the top of the pyramid.
3
Clinton's got herself into a bind. She doesn't want to base her campaign on that because she wants the support of private equity, for her campaign, as well as for the family Foundation. If she makes the issue central in her campaign, she'd be hard-pressed to ignore it once in office - an indication, I think, of what we could expect if she is elected. Her focus is instead on social issues, hoping that enough women and minorities will propel her into office.
2
Pray tell, what are these men studying in college?
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Good question. I'm guessing finance, econ, history, IT, marketing, business, chemistry, geology, etc. What would you guess?
8
Certainly not african or gender studies.
5
From the looks of them in the photo, they're studying the seven gentlemen: DonQ, Johnny Walker, Jim Beam, Captain Morgan, Jose Cuervo, Jack Daniel and Remy Martin.
9
These men have been the scapegoat of the Democrats for the last 20 years, and every social change forced upon the American population has been at their expense.
Of course they're for Trump. They do have brains you know.
Of course they're for Trump. They do have brains you know.
23
"Scapegoat" refers to someone who is blamed without good reason. For generations in this country women and minorities were crushed by a system designed by, and for, white men. The first female Supreme Court justice, Sandra Day O'Connor, graduated at the top of her class at Stanford Law. But the only job offer she received from a law firm was a job as a secretary. These days a woman graduating with high marks from Stanford Law will get plenty of lucrative offers from major law firms. Which means those firms will extend fewer offers to male graduates. See the issue?
70
You are 100% correct. That is what it all comes down too. When things are re-distributed instead of earned, someone is a loser by force and not merit. That's a pretty hard pill to swallow when it happens to you simply because of your race and gender.
No one questions an African American when they say to other races that they'll never know what it's like to be them under certain circumstances, but if you were a college educated white male who is passed over for jobs multiple times because a female or minority was given more consideration based solely on their gender or race, you have been discriminated against.
As with most of the Democratic Party stances, it is OK to openly discriminate against those perceived to be in power. That is why subjects like "White Privilege" are being taught in schools now. What better way to combat any opposition to this treatment than to indoctrinate the group being targeted from a young age that they deserve what they're getting based on their race and gender?
If you are a white male in America not only are you supposed to feel fine with being discriminated against in employment because for generations people like you always got the benefit, but you're also supposed to feel bad that people who looked like you owned slaves 152 years ago in one of the 15 states in which slavery was legal during the first 89 years of this nation's existence.
No one questions an African American when they say to other races that they'll never know what it's like to be them under certain circumstances, but if you were a college educated white male who is passed over for jobs multiple times because a female or minority was given more consideration based solely on their gender or race, you have been discriminated against.
As with most of the Democratic Party stances, it is OK to openly discriminate against those perceived to be in power. That is why subjects like "White Privilege" are being taught in schools now. What better way to combat any opposition to this treatment than to indoctrinate the group being targeted from a young age that they deserve what they're getting based on their race and gender?
If you are a white male in America not only are you supposed to feel fine with being discriminated against in employment because for generations people like you always got the benefit, but you're also supposed to feel bad that people who looked like you owned slaves 152 years ago in one of the 15 states in which slavery was legal during the first 89 years of this nation's existence.
8
Frankly, white men still ARE in power. They make up the vast majority of CEOs of Fortune 500 companies, major law firms, major universities, federal and state agencies, members of both houses of Congress, governors, members of state legislatures . . . the list goes on. Given that women are half or more than half the population of this country, someone visiting from another world might wonder why, if they truly have equal political and economic rights, they are so underrepresented in positions of power in both the public and private sectors. One can disagree about the reasons, but there can be no disagreement about the fact that they are VERY underrepresented. Which makes it hard to feel sorry for white guys.
16
Its actually pretty simple - Hillary Clinton is much more detestable than Donald Trump, who has his own problems.
12
If you broke down any white male voting bloc (whether via education, income level or religion) by age, you'd find that support for the GOP steadily increases along with the age of the male. Older white males want their country back and not even Trump can make that happen for them.
The GOP is doubling-down on white male voters this year. Trump hasn't expanded the Republican Party, he's exposed it.
The GOP is doubling-down on white male voters this year. Trump hasn't expanded the Republican Party, he's exposed it.
103
You'd have to prove it.
In the older demographic, Medicare and Social Security are the major issues.
In the older demographic, Medicare and Social Security are the major issues.
2
Thank you for the Op-Ed piece.
I've been wondering why people who are proud to be college graduates could support someone for President who has no coherent policies, changes his positions frequently, is ill-informed on foreign affairs, has a history as an unethical businessman on top of his business failures, brags about friendship with people like job-destroyer, Carl Icahn, gives disjointed rants that suggest mental instability and is narcissistic.
The Op-Ed explains why they support this walking disaster: It is based on emotion and prejudice and not reason. On this matter, their college education has been sadly wasted.
Take immigration: what Party has been in the White House for the majority of the period from 1970 to present, when immigration grew? What party had control of Congress for a large chunk of that time? What party has been in control of Congress since 2010 and has been deaf to the President's plea for immigration reform? Which President gave amnesty to millions? Which President has deported the most "illegals"? Which Presidential candidate proposes solutions which even he knows won't happen? Yet, the Democratic "Elites" are responsible for the fashionably new meme of "globalism"?
But those who brag about being college educated while supporting a national embarrassment can be cut a little slack because they have been instructed by professors like Haidt who cherry pick facts to support politically constructed narratives like "globalism".
I've been wondering why people who are proud to be college graduates could support someone for President who has no coherent policies, changes his positions frequently, is ill-informed on foreign affairs, has a history as an unethical businessman on top of his business failures, brags about friendship with people like job-destroyer, Carl Icahn, gives disjointed rants that suggest mental instability and is narcissistic.
The Op-Ed explains why they support this walking disaster: It is based on emotion and prejudice and not reason. On this matter, their college education has been sadly wasted.
Take immigration: what Party has been in the White House for the majority of the period from 1970 to present, when immigration grew? What party had control of Congress for a large chunk of that time? What party has been in control of Congress since 2010 and has been deaf to the President's plea for immigration reform? Which President gave amnesty to millions? Which President has deported the most "illegals"? Which Presidential candidate proposes solutions which even he knows won't happen? Yet, the Democratic "Elites" are responsible for the fashionably new meme of "globalism"?
But those who brag about being college educated while supporting a national embarrassment can be cut a little slack because they have been instructed by professors like Haidt who cherry pick facts to support politically constructed narratives like "globalism".
171
It's easier to be like Hillary and say you're for everything even though you have no plan to deliver or pay for all the freebies.
5
Which party seems to thin that national boundaries don't matter? Which party is trying to delivery extrajudicial amnesty to illegals here in the country? Which party failed to uphold its end of the bargain in 1986 and deliver comprehensive immigration reform? Which party is busy trying to fragment American society with political correctness and an extreme interpretation of multiculturalism?
Oh, and the Democrats held the House from the 1970 through 1994, while the Republicans held it from 1995-2016 (today). Last I checked, 24 years is a greater number that 21 years, but obviously I am not concerned with facts being a Republican and all.
Trump would probably be a mediocre President. We have survived those. He would definitely, however, rip apart the status quo and power structures in DC. We are in dire need of that.
Oh, and the Democrats held the House from the 1970 through 1994, while the Republicans held it from 1995-2016 (today). Last I checked, 24 years is a greater number that 21 years, but obviously I am not concerned with facts being a Republican and all.
Trump would probably be a mediocre President. We have survived those. He would definitely, however, rip apart the status quo and power structures in DC. We are in dire need of that.
7
But Republican voters have rejected the Republican establishment candidates, hoping Trump will undo much of what they've done.
4