A couple of years ago, I had the opportunity to visit a plant where fabrics, including very high end upholstery fabrics, are manufactured here in the Scranton Wilkes Barre area.
Loom after loom occupied the vast factory floor without a single human being in attendance. Every single one of those looms was being run by a computer.
Donald Trump cannot 'bring back' jobs that no longer exist, and his faithful are going to be mighty disappointed, if he does get elected, only to discover that they had been lured in by empty promises, just like the deluded men and women who fell for Trump University and The Trump Institute.
This known scammer is selling more snake oil, and Hillary Clinton is the one who gets pilloried for being 'not honest and trustworthy'.
People, wake up!
Loom after loom occupied the vast factory floor without a single human being in attendance. Every single one of those looms was being run by a computer.
Donald Trump cannot 'bring back' jobs that no longer exist, and his faithful are going to be mighty disappointed, if he does get elected, only to discover that they had been lured in by empty promises, just like the deluded men and women who fell for Trump University and The Trump Institute.
This known scammer is selling more snake oil, and Hillary Clinton is the one who gets pilloried for being 'not honest and trustworthy'.
People, wake up!
4
Professor Baldino could have provided an in-state example of successful public-private-philanthropic partnerships working to reinvent local economies: the Pittsburgh economic resurgence was based on just such a partnership formed after the steel industry collapse.
First class reporting on how our economy has very little use for older unskilled workers. However, I wish the article had addressed the following two issues:
1. How many low tech manufacturers left town for the non-union deep South even before import competition became a significant problem for them?
2. The impact of 12 million illegals (let's have the courage to use this term) on the working class is more severe than the author believes.
--Modern warehouses are so automated with forklifts that I doubt if physical strength and youth are that relevant. Instead, the fact that illegals are difficult to unionise may be an attraction for employers.
--Here in Washington DC just about all office construction jobs have been taken by Hispanic men. Many of these jobs pay well.
-- Similarly black women have been largely displaced by Latin women as hotel chambermaids. Again, these jobs are often unionised and pay well.
1. How many low tech manufacturers left town for the non-union deep South even before import competition became a significant problem for them?
2. The impact of 12 million illegals (let's have the courage to use this term) on the working class is more severe than the author believes.
--Modern warehouses are so automated with forklifts that I doubt if physical strength and youth are that relevant. Instead, the fact that illegals are difficult to unionise may be an attraction for employers.
--Here in Washington DC just about all office construction jobs have been taken by Hispanic men. Many of these jobs pay well.
-- Similarly black women have been largely displaced by Latin women as hotel chambermaids. Again, these jobs are often unionised and pay well.
I could see the coming shifts in the world economy when I was a high school student in the early 60's in Youngstown, Ohio. I knew steel was doomed; and I went off to college graduating in 1968. The Youngstown I knew is gone. The population went from 150,000 to about 65,000 today. And that population is either immigrants from Spanish speaking countries or people leaving West Virginia hoping for better but not finding it. When my dad passed about 20 years now, I sold the house and it is worth less then it was back then. Still this is Trump country. Holdouts my age are still waiting for the comeback of steel; and praying that the Lordstown Assembly Plant doesn't close. There are a few tech startups but not enough to power back the long dead economy. To be honest, I never understood the narrow thinking of the town back when; I certainly don't understand it now.
2
The problem, as this article points out, is not free trade, or immigration, it's tax law and local economic policy, dictated by politicians. Both Democrats and Republicans in Congress passed tax laws that allowed companies to easily move overseas. The Republicans had almost all of the last decade, and much of this one to fix that problem. Instead people blame trade deals, which obviously benefitted Willkes-Barre in the past. If anyone thinks that electing Trump is going to magically fix our tax laws, or that stopping the very trade that puts low cost goods into Walmart so these same people that want to elect him can buy them, is, well to be kind, misguided.
Trump is a modern day snake oil salesman who thrives in telling people what they want and need to hear without having any plan for actually making it happen. How sad.
I still don't believe Trump really opposes the trade agreements. Or for that matter liberalized immigration. He knows these are hot-button items that can be used to pull the wool over unthinking voters' (i.e. most of us) eyes . He is first and foremost a businessman, if a failed one, and would never really support trade and immigration restrictions, these being antithetical to business interests.
As a youth I spent many summers in Elk Co, PA and am very familiar with the mind set in the rural communities. By and large you are looking at a generation that would prefer time stood still in 1970.
They live by and large in a very insular world where they came to their majority thinking their lives would go on as their parents had.
The jobs their parents had are gone and like the harness maker who became unemployed once Model T's became affordable they refuse to wrap their mind around the fact that the jobs they are qualified for have evaporated. The world moves on and you move with it or get left behind. No life isn't fair so get on with it
They live by and large in a very insular world where they came to their majority thinking their lives would go on as their parents had.
The jobs their parents had are gone and like the harness maker who became unemployed once Model T's became affordable they refuse to wrap their mind around the fact that the jobs they are qualified for have evaporated. The world moves on and you move with it or get left behind. No life isn't fair so get on with it
1
The reality of wage differences between the US and countries with developing economies will continue to drive 'high labor content' products off-shore. Trump's bluster on trade won't stem that tide. In turn, we need a national policies to enhance the skills and education of our youth and workforce to move our county forward with solid income, middle class jobs.
Trump is correct, though, that some countries don't play fair: ie. China with currency manipulations, and Brazil & Japan with tariffs. I think he will do better than H in addressing this.
On immigration, we need a comprehensive plan! A wall needs to be part of that plan to keep out drug smugglers and illegals. We also need a path to citizenship for the 11M illegals already here that are a productive part of our society. That said, we need to root out the 'bad' illegals and send them back. And, we need to keep "undesirable" refugees out of the country. I wouldn't want them as my neighbors ... or yours. That's not prejudice or racism, it common sense!
I'm an independent and don't like Trump's bombastic, self promotion; but he's at least partially correct on issues that reverberate with the general population. H, in the meantime, continues to reinforce her image of 'lack of trustworthiness' ... despite her attempts to define herself as "steady".
Trump is correct, though, that some countries don't play fair: ie. China with currency manipulations, and Brazil & Japan with tariffs. I think he will do better than H in addressing this.
On immigration, we need a comprehensive plan! A wall needs to be part of that plan to keep out drug smugglers and illegals. We also need a path to citizenship for the 11M illegals already here that are a productive part of our society. That said, we need to root out the 'bad' illegals and send them back. And, we need to keep "undesirable" refugees out of the country. I wouldn't want them as my neighbors ... or yours. That's not prejudice or racism, it common sense!
I'm an independent and don't like Trump's bombastic, self promotion; but he's at least partially correct on issues that reverberate with the general population. H, in the meantime, continues to reinforce her image of 'lack of trustworthiness' ... despite her attempts to define herself as "steady".
Mr. Davidson: thank you for your article. I found it thought provoking and focused on the root causes of what people want to hear, that there's a politician out there directly addressing their concerns. Before the Brexit vote I decided to see research how trade and immigration affected the UK from 2000-'16. The population grew by 10% and GDP increased by 75%. The populace may wish to blame trade and immigration for their economic downturn but, if anything, they were a boon for the UK. I extended my research to the USA and found the virtually identical results. The population at large was laying blame to a fast evolving marketplace while social policy and politics were becoming ever more ossified. Sure, loose jobs, blame the immigrants and NAFTA. The immigrants are working for less or foreign plants stole our jobs. Needless to say there's a bit of truth in what the populace says but NAFTA, China and immigration aren't the root problems. Social policies aren't addressing laid off workers lack of education and nor the lack of investment in new technologies and startups. What I find so disconcerting is that Trump's business success is based on screwing anybody and everybody he can. He bankrupted not 1, not 2, not 3 but 4 casinos. He screwed employees, tradespeople, suppliers, bondholders and shareholders alike while pulling millions $$ in salary and benefits and writing off god knows how much personal debt on the failed businesses. Is this type of man we wish for President?
Trump: Make Our Old LaSalle Run Great Again.
1
As many others have noted, the US Gov't did NOT ship the middle-class manufacturing jobs overseas - the CEO's & CFO's of these firms did so to fulfill the Number 1 Goal taught in all MBA programs - maximize shareholder value. Capitalism in the late 20th & 21st century is not based on keeping low-skilled jobs located in areas with high labor costs - in fact, its just the polar opposite. Globalization of manufacturing was the first domino to fall to outsourcing to lower labor cost countries, with technical / engineering services quickly following. Erecting trade barriers and adding tariffs to overseas manufactured goods will not bring these jobs back - rather it will only increase the cost to the consumer.
I lost my job 4x's over the past 30 years as my company moved overseas or the marketplace just didn't need what the company was offering. I didn't like losing my job and each time (age primarily) it became more difficult to find a new employer, the last time it took me almost 3 years and I took a 68% pay cut. Here is what i didn't do; I didn't stay in a community where my skills weren't needed, I moved from the midwest to the west and then back to Chicago 3x's for a new career. I didn't allow lacking a college degree stand in my way, I went back to school and got my degree and I paid for it out of my own pocket and kept working, it was hard for my family but we did it together. Technology changed radically while I worked, I trained myself on MS Office, I still take classes and I became proficient, probably more proficient than 90% of my co workers who are 20-30 years younger. Twice I faced the distinct possibility of personal bankruptcy and dodged it just barely. The long and short of it is I knew no one had a greater interest in me than myself, no one was going to walk up to my door and give me anything. I knew if I quit it would be even worse. I continued to work for a losing companies, gave them a full days work everyday until the day they released me and I didn't blame the world for what happened, I blamed myself because I freely made the choices for my future.
2
We will never be able to wall ourselves off from the outside world. We live in the age of jet travel, not the clipper ship or the steamer. We place manufacturing orders over the internet, which doesn't have borders.
Trade barriers are a two-way street. You won't buy from them, they won't buy from you. And China is a much, much larger market they we are. So we need to figure out how to sell things they want to buy, using technology here to make those items more efficiently to bring down unit costs. For many heavy items that means automation. Let's teach skilled workers how to run those machines, not lament the fact that they don't manufacture goods the old-fashioned way (which, by the way, was very dangerous and injurious to long-term health). Florida's Republican governor didn't want high-speed rail and rejected a federal grant to bring it to the state, and so the trains being built for the FECRR's service between Miami and Orlando are being built in California. If we fail to modernize, we have only ourselves to blame. Let's quite crying about the old days and figure out how to make the future better.
As for Trump, he'd have a lot more credibility if he employed US workers on his properties. Instead, he employs Hispanics and Eastern Europeans. That says it all.
Trade barriers are a two-way street. You won't buy from them, they won't buy from you. And China is a much, much larger market they we are. So we need to figure out how to sell things they want to buy, using technology here to make those items more efficiently to bring down unit costs. For many heavy items that means automation. Let's teach skilled workers how to run those machines, not lament the fact that they don't manufacture goods the old-fashioned way (which, by the way, was very dangerous and injurious to long-term health). Florida's Republican governor didn't want high-speed rail and rejected a federal grant to bring it to the state, and so the trains being built for the FECRR's service between Miami and Orlando are being built in California. If we fail to modernize, we have only ourselves to blame. Let's quite crying about the old days and figure out how to make the future better.
As for Trump, he'd have a lot more credibility if he employed US workers on his properties. Instead, he employs Hispanics and Eastern Europeans. That says it all.
Many an economic soothsayer has announced that all of us must adjust to the new "reality" of work: that we must be prepared for constant change, that we will switch jobs and even change trades and professions multiple times over our working liftetimes, that we must all keep up with (or better, ahead of) continuous changes in economic trends and ever-evolving technology. Oh, and with the decline of collective bargaining of any kind, it's up to each of us to do this individually. We must always be ready to repackage and market ourselves anew to the next economic opportunity, which may by the way mean picking up and moving to a new city or state.
What that means is that people over the age of 50 are, quite simply, screwed. Their physical and mental capacities are passing their peak. It's harder for them to learn new skills and master new technologies (let alone do strenuous physical labor), and their commitments to family and personal property can make it much more difficult for them to relocate. This brave new economic world doesn't just pass them by -- it discards them like used Kleenex.
If the economy of continuous reinvention is really inevitable, then perhaps we need to start talking about a guaranteed minimum income for those without the capacities to keep morphing themselves to fit the latest big thing.
What that means is that people over the age of 50 are, quite simply, screwed. Their physical and mental capacities are passing their peak. It's harder for them to learn new skills and master new technologies (let alone do strenuous physical labor), and their commitments to family and personal property can make it much more difficult for them to relocate. This brave new economic world doesn't just pass them by -- it discards them like used Kleenex.
If the economy of continuous reinvention is really inevitable, then perhaps we need to start talking about a guaranteed minimum income for those without the capacities to keep morphing themselves to fit the latest big thing.
Everyone crows about the sanctity of the free markets until they don't correct in our favor. Socialism is recognized as valuable for competetive balance in sports. Ironic that we Americans demonize it in real life. What caused the decline of the American middle class?
Corporate executives and owners. Greed destroyed unions. Outsourcing of jobs in order to concentrate wealth.
Pure and simple.
Corporate executives and owners. Greed destroyed unions. Outsourcing of jobs in order to concentrate wealth.
Pure and simple.
1
Voters complain about loss of manufacturing jobs but I have yet to see massive boycotts of Walmarts and other stores that sell imported goods. I also haven’t seen people expressing their eagerness to spend more money for expensive American-made products. Companies who move overseas are following the public demand for the cheapest price. Despite all that we hear about loss of jobs, when given the choice between saving money or saving American jobs, American consumers have clearly chosen in favor of saving money.
My father was a tool-and-die maker, when I was a young boy, I wanted to be one too. I still love the tools and the precision required by the trade. However, 45 years ago, my father knew better, he said it wasn't going to be a good lont-term trade.
He was partially right, however, my skills of precision, like his, and my analytical/technical skills would have proven a perfect match to today's requirements to run computerized tools. In other words, I think I would not only have survived, but thrived if I had followed him. Who knows, I followed his advice and went another direction.
No wishing, hoping, or Trumpeting around is going to bring back the old days of machine shops manually making dies for manufacturing.
He was partially right, however, my skills of precision, like his, and my analytical/technical skills would have proven a perfect match to today's requirements to run computerized tools. In other words, I think I would not only have survived, but thrived if I had followed him. Who knows, I followed his advice and went another direction.
No wishing, hoping, or Trumpeting around is going to bring back the old days of machine shops manually making dies for manufacturing.
22
Mr. Sabin: you were a lucky guy by having a father who provided you with the opportunity to learn technical and analytical skills that could be transferred to other fields. I'm sure you had a keen interest and, like most kids, have a mind that's malleable and soaked up new info like a sponge. But, there's a group of laid off coal miners out there who feel the country forsook them. They provided the energy citizens and businesses required to light, heat and warm their homes and plants. A group of laid off steelworkers that made the steel used in the construction of our wonderful hi-rises, ships, cars, trucks, tanks, planes, etc. The root cause of our economic problems is that politics and social policies haven't evolved. I'm no lover of unions. The flip side of the coin is that the unions demanded rights for the people who worked behind closed doors or in the underground darkness or who shoveled coal to keep the smelters and ovens fired up. Generations of American workers feel like they've been cast aside, overlooked and haven't been given the respect they've been due. It's a sorry state of affairs that as our country became more successful it overlooked those whose hard work and efforts laid the foundation of our future success. These topics of concern were and are the threads that hold our society together. Politicians need to focus their efforts on education, new start-ups and technologies but must provide as much help as possible for workers who truly made America great.
Absolutely true Joe. My younger son is making very good money being a welder. He just is in the process of buying his first house. Those skills have come full circle, but I don't know how well you would have faired in the last 40. Maybe at Boeing, but many of my machinist friends saw their jobs exported to China. However we need to remember that most Japanese automakers build here in the States. Why? Because tax law gave them good reasons to do so.
It sure sounds like the writer is . . . blaming Pennsylvanians. Hmmm. . . .
12
blaming or just listing the facts?
Trump offers a simplistic solution based on a misperception. The US Government didn't ship/send jobs to other nations - business leaders, like Trump, did, and still do. What Davidson shows is that there is a skills mismatch along with a deep desire to return to that way things were.
The reality is that there is work to be done everywhere. No, it isn't the job you had and maybe not the job you want but there is a lot of good old fashioned labor required to repair and rebuild our national infrastructure if we only have the political will to fund it.
Platitudes like those given by Trump may get him votes but they will never solve the underlying problems.
The reality is that there is work to be done everywhere. No, it isn't the job you had and maybe not the job you want but there is a lot of good old fashioned labor required to repair and rebuild our national infrastructure if we only have the political will to fund it.
Platitudes like those given by Trump may get him votes but they will never solve the underlying problems.
27
This is a great article talking about problems in a particular region that I know to some extent could see or show the 'mirror image' in other areas with core industries as well. In my comment for another article in NYT last week, I simply invoked the idea of measuring 'trade surplus' -- even after imposing a barrier-tariff in a limited manner, as no trade pact wants such blockage. Here, I am merely suggesting a regional calculation of imports (and their effect) on their local industries (non-hi-tech). For the sad case of the glass company, they could be easily encouraged to go for "flat-screen" glass products that are extensively made in China and Japan for cell phones, flat-screen TVs and many other display items. It could not only save those 2000 odd jobs, but also create a few more in the region fr some anciliaries. It appears that there must have been some plans, but not implemented.
It is beyond all reason to believe that 12 million illegal immigrants have not decimated the wages and jobs of our lower amd middle class workers.
The trades were once a way for less educated citizens to make a decent wage and take a place in our middle class. Today, those jobs are lost to untrained illegals. Similar stories apply to lost manufacturing and warehousing jobs.
The elites propose retraining as a solution for our displaced workers. They will all become computer programmers or welders ! Get real, it tough for a 50 year old to learn a new skill and they lack the mobility to go where these jobs might exist.
While Trump is clearly a dangerous narcissist, it is no wonder that he appeals to the lost souls of our rust belts.
The trades were once a way for less educated citizens to make a decent wage and take a place in our middle class. Today, those jobs are lost to untrained illegals. Similar stories apply to lost manufacturing and warehousing jobs.
The elites propose retraining as a solution for our displaced workers. They will all become computer programmers or welders ! Get real, it tough for a 50 year old to learn a new skill and they lack the mobility to go where these jobs might exist.
While Trump is clearly a dangerous narcissist, it is no wonder that he appeals to the lost souls of our rust belts.
14
"It is beyond all reason to believe that 12 million illegal immigrants have not decimated the wages and jobs of our lower amd middle class workers."
Beyonder still to ignore the people who hire them. Republicans talk a good game on economics, but they don't understand supply-and-demand any better than they understand risk-and-reward.
Beyonder still to ignore the people who hire them. Republicans talk a good game on economics, but they don't understand supply-and-demand any better than they understand risk-and-reward.
The immigrants without papers are not taking those jobs. They work picking food, in slaughterhouses, in the restaurant industry, the health care field and in vast, vast numbers in hotels and in landscaping. If you deport half of them the food supply chain will collapse, the hospitality industries will implode. The rust belt died, and the jobs weren't taken by immigrants. The jobs just disappeared. In the case of steel it moved to smaller, robotic plants. More efficient and job killers. Trump is an ignorant opportunist.
They're voting for Trump because he says he's going to TRY to help these people; the author of this article has already given up on them.
19
I'm sure Trump will create jobs for these workers, paying pennies on the dollar compared to their old salaries. In order to be competitive with the Chinese, he'll say, American workers need to earn less. Meanwhile, he'll stuff huge profits into his own pockets and those of his kids while US workers file for food stamps and wonder when the "Make America Great Again" thingee will kick in for them.
11
Makes one wonder why the choice for these folks was not Sanders. I predict that one day soon( but after the next financial calamity), we will finally wake up and recognize the deniable: We are all in this together. Only when we embrace the social democracy models of Scandanavia will we eliminate the poverty and despair. Yes, it will take higher taxes, especially on the rich. Perhaps it will take electing Trump and the calamity that surely follows, in order to arrive at that point. I hope not.
18
Let's consider only one industry as an example. Shoes. If we put a tariff on all imported shoes over some period of time jobs would be made to make shoes domestically. These shoes would be more expensive than the imported ones and that would effect how many people could afford in some cases to only one or giving up something else. There would be some jobs, the wages of these jobs would be spent here rather than there thus increasing the velocity of money. Repeat with as many industries as needed until we either are self sufficient or have equal trade. Now Trump wants to use leverage not what I have proposed, it might work or might need to be used.
4
Sure, but what you propose is by no means new. It is a closed economy, and it's just simple math for an economist to show that it makes everyone worse off. The pie is shrunk, and maybe you get a slice.
Your model does not allow you to take advantage of:
- differentiation
- regional advantages (different resources)
- comparative advantage
- economies of scale
The result is that, while we all may have a job, EVERYTHING is more expensive, and there is less from which to choose.
Your model does not allow you to take advantage of:
- differentiation
- regional advantages (different resources)
- comparative advantage
- economies of scale
The result is that, while we all may have a job, EVERYTHING is more expensive, and there is less from which to choose.
4
Investing in yester-year, low skill, low margin industries like shoes might not be a great way to keep our economy healthy.
Many of the manufacturing jobs that went overseas can't come back. Why? Because they do not even exist any more. Even in China, robots are increasingly taking over manufacturing jobs.
We need leaders who can plan for the future, not ones who promise to take us back to a past that has vanished forever.
Many of the manufacturing jobs that went overseas can't come back. Why? Because they do not even exist any more. Even in China, robots are increasingly taking over manufacturing jobs.
We need leaders who can plan for the future, not ones who promise to take us back to a past that has vanished forever.
12
"If we put a tariff on all imported shoes over some period of time jobs would be made to make shoes domestically."
Let's forget "we" for a second. Let's talk about you. Who made your last pair of shoes? Do you even know?
Show me your Red Wings, lex, and then I'll know you're serious. Simple!
Let's forget "we" for a second. Let's talk about you. Who made your last pair of shoes? Do you even know?
Show me your Red Wings, lex, and then I'll know you're serious. Simple!
Clearly, Trump has certainly spoken out against free trade.
So did Bernie. Hillary reversed her support for proposed TPP free trade agreement. I could be wrong, but it seems like a substantial number, if not the majority, of apparently progressive NYT reader comments have also been against free trade over the years.
On the trade issue, the difference between the candidates and their supporters doesn't seem to be that significant.
The big difference is on immigration.
So did Bernie. Hillary reversed her support for proposed TPP free trade agreement. I could be wrong, but it seems like a substantial number, if not the majority, of apparently progressive NYT reader comments have also been against free trade over the years.
On the trade issue, the difference between the candidates and their supporters doesn't seem to be that significant.
The big difference is on immigration.
3
Quick note: I like Free Trade, but hate the TPP.
The TPP is not mainly about Free Trade. That is a disguise to fool people like me or the conservatives to vote for it. It is about corporate control of trade, and disempowering governments (and thus the people) from choice.
The industries that lobbied for it included ample rules that benefit themselves at the expense of people here and abroad.
It should be hated by people like me who like Free Trade, and REALLY hated by those who don't.
Think about it - is trade currently so restricted with New Zealand, or Canada that we need a new TPP trade deal to enable trade? Nope. We already have fairly free trade - the deal is a lie.
The TPP is not mainly about Free Trade. That is a disguise to fool people like me or the conservatives to vote for it. It is about corporate control of trade, and disempowering governments (and thus the people) from choice.
The industries that lobbied for it included ample rules that benefit themselves at the expense of people here and abroad.
It should be hated by people like me who like Free Trade, and REALLY hated by those who don't.
Think about it - is trade currently so restricted with New Zealand, or Canada that we need a new TPP trade deal to enable trade? Nope. We already have fairly free trade - the deal is a lie.
11
fine, don't adopt tpp. I'm sure when China signs their trade agreements with asia they will have the USA best interests in mind.
Largely ignored in the discussion about job losses due to trade and immigration are two awkward truths. First, the shift in income away from lower and middle income workers to the top 1 - 5% amounts to $1 trillion dollars annually, the equivalent of 12- 15 million middle class jobs in places like Wilkes-Barre. The departure of jobs to Mexico, China, or elsewhere may be a factor in reduced prospects for former employees of Rust Belt manufacturing jobs, but the stagnation/decline of middle class incomes means depressed consumption in the direction of low-skill and low-wage possibilities. Recover that trillion dollars annually from the top of the income ladder, return it to the middle class, and we will see pent-up demand for goods and services have a positive effect on employment and incomes. Second, for too long the American public has bought into the "they take our jobs" refrain spun from the business class. With more than 50 years in the work force, much of it in blue collar and semi-skilled employment, I have never seen an immigrant, undocumented or not, TAKE a job from someone. I have, however, seen many employers replace American workers with the undocumented, H-1b visa holders, and other abuses. We need to stop screwing around "educating" employers and start jailing them wholesale, whether they are people in Orange County hiring yardcare workers or IT human resource department managers thumbing their noses at H-1b visa rules by using labor contractors. Some hard time.
34
Or we could get the government out of the business of choosing winners and losers and allow a truly free job market by eliminating wage and labor laws. Capitalism would determine the actual value of a positions labor and price it accordingly. If it is only worth $2, then so be it. Should it require substantial skills, experience and/or education, it might pay ten or twenty times that.
1
The idea of a tariff slapped on their goods is a good idea if it will force the manufacturer to bring back their factories. Just why was the air conditioning company so quick to dump the plant and its American work force Trump was talking about a few months ago? Our trade deals do need to be changed for the betterment of the U.S worker. Nafta put thousands of workers out of jobs with the promise that there will be retraining for all, well that never happened.
The U.S. has become a service driven country instead of one that manufactured most of our goods here which employed thousands and thousands of U.S. workers. Go to any store and try to find one item that was made here you can't. We made our own bedding, sheets, pillow slips, towels, shoes you name it including lawn mowers I bet you would have a hard time finding a law mower made in this country. Renegotiation of our trade deals will put the country on the right track. TPP is bad news for the U.S. worker there are parts in that none of us have seen you wonder why the secrecy???
What is not being told to us are we supposed to pass it to find out what is in it????
The U.S. has become a service driven country instead of one that manufactured most of our goods here which employed thousands and thousands of U.S. workers. Go to any store and try to find one item that was made here you can't. We made our own bedding, sheets, pillow slips, towels, shoes you name it including lawn mowers I bet you would have a hard time finding a law mower made in this country. Renegotiation of our trade deals will put the country on the right track. TPP is bad news for the U.S. worker there are parts in that none of us have seen you wonder why the secrecy???
What is not being told to us are we supposed to pass it to find out what is in it????
12
Just slapping tariffs on imports will raise prices to unsupportable levels, driving our consumer-oriented economy over the cliff. America's gotten used to Walmart prices on everyday products that, if made in USA, would stop shoppers at the shelf. Simplistic, dumbed - down slogans are just like free eats at Dukey's: bait to keep you drinking Trump's Kool-Aid.
10
Retraining is great but if there are no jobs then it does not work and a person who can work in simple manufacturing is not going to be writing computer apps in general. We have a lot of low skilled people who need jobs. I know we made a lot of lawn mowers here in West Tn. They might have moved as well.
2
Carrier is a for profit business that has an obligation to its shareholders. When those US workers are making north of twenty dollars an hour plus benefits while someone in Mexico will perform the same tasks for a flat $3, the fact is the US workers chased Carrier away. The company had been up front with the union and said that if the total labor cost could be brought down to around $13, the never would have considered the move. You cannot blame the company here. It's all on the employees and their union.
4
This is not "trade." If we have a 32 Billion balance of trade deficit in favor of China what are we trading? It would be even larger if not for parts shipped to China to be assembled into products to be shipped back the U.S. market. NAFTA, CAFTA, PNTR with China have been a disaster for the American worker. A lot of companies that shut down here move abroad. Working people understand that after NAFTA, CAFTA, PNTR with China we have lost 3-6 million decent paying jobs. Since 2001, 60,000 factories in America have been shut down. We're in a race to the bottom, where our wages are going down (not just in manufacturing). Is all of that attributable to trade? No. Is a lot of it? Yes. Trade agreements are written by corporate America and the pharmaceutical industry and Wall Street. That's what this trade agreements are about. American workers have to competing against people in Vietnam who make 56 cents an hour for a minimum wage. American trade policy should place the needs of American workers and small businesses first. We should have a trade policy which represents the working families of this country, that rebuilds our manufacturing base, not than just representing the CEOs of large multinational corporations.
11
Our economy is, more and more, becoming a duality, with successes occurring in non-value-adding commodity trade (ag products to China and Europe) and high-tech, with middle-tier industries being lost to foreign competitions (ie parts suppliers, leading manufacturers of capital goods). As we lose the middle-tier industries, the support industries (retail, personal services, business services) that exist around high-tech manufacturing, middle-tier manufacturing, and ag-commodities, also lessen, as these support industries are a function of the industrial base industries, reducing opportunities even more for not just service workers in retail or personal services but also white collar, well-educated workers in business and professional services. An interested dynamic that we're pursuing in my city is low-scale, artisinal manufacturing (niche manufacturing), that I think offers a immediate- to medium-term pathways toward re-building our industrial base.
1
Yes, let's assume that Davidson is right about there being less demand for less-educated workers. So why, pray tell, is this country continuing to import hundreds of thousands of them every year?
11
The unemployed people in Wilkes-Barre don't want to move to Houston to roof houses, cut grass in Florida, slaughter cows in Omaha, pick vegetables in California or wash cars anywhere but uneducated immigrants see those jobs as a way ahead and DO want to move to get them.
8
If you read more closely, you'll see she says younger and strong uneducated workers—for manual labor— who can the work that old white guys in their 50s can't.
3
Read where he says that those workers wouldn't be physically able to do the jobs that are available for less educated people.
3
Families in this country used to have stable lives. To imply that those days are gone is completely false. We can renegotiate trade deals so our workers can be protected from having to compete with starving peasants. It isn't greedy to want a family, a home, health care and a retirent. I'm not saying Trump will deliver those things, but the Democratic party has a documented record of NOT delivering them. If you want Trump as president, continue insulting people who just want some stability in their lives.
14
It actually IS GREEDY to demand a family, home, healthcare and retirement if your value to your employer doesn't rise to the level that justifies such costs. Should a CSR at your bank be able to afford those things? How about the guy in the pit at JiffyLube? Or the greeter at Walmart?
3
"Should a CSR at your bank be able to afford those things?"
Any CSR who has to handle your money certainly deserves to. Bless your heart.
Any CSR who has to handle your money certainly deserves to. Bless your heart.
You're right. And why indulge their foolish desire for food and air? Let's face it, lower skilled people don't deserve anything. Anything at all. I'm not even sure they have ordinary emotions or feel physical pain. If, in a free market, they can't generate high wages then we should probably just get rid of them.
If a President Trump were able to renegotiate NAFTA, there would be one major result: It would raise prices for American consumers (without bringing back any jobs).
19
Republicans have been squeezing the life out of working people and blaming it on immigrants. The media have assisted with this deception, just as the British media deceived British workers into blaming immigrants for their problems. While the ignorant are beating up on immigrants, the one percent continue laughing all the way to their tax-free offshore bank accounts as they fleece both sides while using the media (which they own) to continue confusing the issues.
43
See http://www.pewhispanic.org/2009/04/14/a-portrait-of-unauthorized-immigra... for a "data based" analysis of the role of typically less-educated illegal immigrants in depriving similarly less-educated citizens of job opportunity.
7
Very dismissive of American workers who are now at a point in their dismal flat-wage earning years that they need any job.
NAFTA was a disaster, one million legal work authorized immigrants a year plus 750,000 guest workers and three decades of outsourcing have combined to hammer American workers.
NAFTA was a disaster, one million legal work authorized immigrants a year plus 750,000 guest workers and three decades of outsourcing have combined to hammer American workers.
14
You, Mr. Davidson, are using one tiny corner of one state to claim that too much immigration is not putting Americans out of jobs. But look at the numbers. Since the millennium, there are an additional 9.3 million jobs in the US, an additional 18 million immigrants, and an additional 16.5 million working age Americans. Do the math.
6
"Trump is the only public figure who’s directly addressing her concerns and promising a solution."
What solution? All I see is grandiose verbiage. What about the details about what Trump actually wants to do? Lower taxes on the rich. Drop government spending. What do you think will happen to the "older, less-educated workers who are flocking to support him"? They'll be kicked to the side, as Trump brands them "losers".
What solution? All I see is grandiose verbiage. What about the details about what Trump actually wants to do? Lower taxes on the rich. Drop government spending. What do you think will happen to the "older, less-educated workers who are flocking to support him"? They'll be kicked to the side, as Trump brands them "losers".
31
The solutions of improving our trade relations, influencing illegals to leave, and generally caring for citizens of the US more than say China trade. Pretty simple. And of course many of these things can't be done without congress unless your name is Obama, who tries.
2
Right. Trump is promising results. He is not promising a "solution" which would involve the how and the steps to get to the results. He avoids doing this because his solution would then face reasonable criticisms.
I take Trump's promises at his word, but not his word in the promises, but rather his word from his books where he clearly state that he exaggerates and tells white lies to get what he wants.
I take Trump's promises at his word, but not his word in the promises, but rather his word from his books where he clearly state that he exaggerates and tells white lies to get what he wants.
1
The first lesson I was taught in my first sales job:
"Show them what they want to see, tell them what they want to hear"
The person teaching me was the top sales person in the office, who was later fired for all the fake orders and unhappy clients he generated.
Vapor-ware only lasts so long.
"Show them what they want to see, tell them what they want to hear"
The person teaching me was the top sales person in the office, who was later fired for all the fake orders and unhappy clients he generated.
Vapor-ware only lasts so long.
19
In other words, Where's the Beef?
Yes Obama / Hillary/ Progressives promises/ are all in this category. Shovel ready projects, The ACA, keeping your insurance / doctor. I could go on but why bother.
2
All this article emphasizes is the need to do more for unemployed citizens. The more that needs doing is job retraining, high quality for jobs that will pay a living wage, offer opportunities to advance, and provide solid base for people to plan a future. From my personal experience with unemployment in New York the barriers to receiving funds to retrain are very high. The monetary limits are unrealistic (way too low), and some of the retraining offered wouldn't lead to a decent job no matter how talented the person was.
I was able to take advantage of a retraining program and have worked in the field ever since. The money the NY State Department of Labor spent on me in 1997 has been paid back in taxes many times over. The same is probably true for other states and people who were able to use the programs that offered retraining in fields that paid. But I was lucky in ways that some people aren't: I had a college degree, I was able to retrain in an area that used skills I had while adding new ones, I had no family obligations, and someone, not the DOL people, told me about the program before the barriers became so high.
One of the biggest reasons people are supporting Trump isn't because he's the best. He's giving voice to their feelings that they've been forgotten about. The truth is that our country is not investing in its citizens in ways that help them when they are unemployed. Combine that how business treats people and you can understand why Trump is popular.
I was able to take advantage of a retraining program and have worked in the field ever since. The money the NY State Department of Labor spent on me in 1997 has been paid back in taxes many times over. The same is probably true for other states and people who were able to use the programs that offered retraining in fields that paid. But I was lucky in ways that some people aren't: I had a college degree, I was able to retrain in an area that used skills I had while adding new ones, I had no family obligations, and someone, not the DOL people, told me about the program before the barriers became so high.
One of the biggest reasons people are supporting Trump isn't because he's the best. He's giving voice to their feelings that they've been forgotten about. The truth is that our country is not investing in its citizens in ways that help them when they are unemployed. Combine that how business treats people and you can understand why Trump is popular.
24
Good for you, but many are not capable of being trained as you are and there are not sufficient jobs for our citizens. Pretty simple problems with only painful solutions.
4
How many of the lost job were unionized? Mr. Trump feel wages are too high and is against labor organizations. Indeed, the inevitable war/draft resulting from his election will act as a job stimulant - like WWII - but at what price, both in lives and morality? "Green" jobs - such as solar panel production, installation and maintinance - are an increasing reality. We are only as limited as our imaginations to create alternatives. Trump retrogression is not the answer.
13
Well Gee we have laws about unions, they are basically not needed any more since most of the valuable services are now assured by the government. Now they are extortion and keeping the union bosses in power.
2
Immigration increases the supply of labor, while free trade with 3rd world countries decreases the demand for labor.... Trump is wrong on so many levels, but a broken clock is right twice a day.
8
Having spent nearly five decades in manufacturing, in virtually every state of the US and lots of other places, I find the simplistic ideas expressed by Trump to be alarming in their appeal to voters like the Dukey's crew.
The fastest path to ruin for the next generation of Americans is neatly packed into a Trump stump speech. Protectionism, trade wars, anti-immigration, low-education, state sponsored religion and business by bankruptcy would throw into reverse the most dynamic economy in the world.
The world has been involved in an economic competition since the British Empire managed to crush the two largest economies in the world, India and China, into abject poverty as the Industrial Revolution unfolded. Now that these and other countries have re-emerged with expanding populations of educated workers and consumers, it's no time to hide under the covers and yell "go away".
Economic integration produced by NAFTA makes possible the Asians and European automotive plants that have sprung up in the US, not to mention the very survival of the US automakers. GM competes with VW and others in the huge Chinese car market.
The tech and medical industries rely on attracting educated workers from across the US and the world.
And the ability of 195 countries to come together to address climate change depends on global economic, social, educational and scientific cooperation.
The fastest path to ruin for the next generation of Americans is neatly packed into a Trump stump speech. Protectionism, trade wars, anti-immigration, low-education, state sponsored religion and business by bankruptcy would throw into reverse the most dynamic economy in the world.
The world has been involved in an economic competition since the British Empire managed to crush the two largest economies in the world, India and China, into abject poverty as the Industrial Revolution unfolded. Now that these and other countries have re-emerged with expanding populations of educated workers and consumers, it's no time to hide under the covers and yell "go away".
Economic integration produced by NAFTA makes possible the Asians and European automotive plants that have sprung up in the US, not to mention the very survival of the US automakers. GM competes with VW and others in the huge Chinese car market.
The tech and medical industries rely on attracting educated workers from across the US and the world.
And the ability of 195 countries to come together to address climate change depends on global economic, social, educational and scientific cooperation.
44
Well said but I think you lost the Dukey's crowd when you actually explained it. Some people just want a simple slogan that doesn't get in the way of their pint glass. Trump obliges.
6
Come now you must be kidding? Cooperation with say China? We have the demand for goods that means we are the customers. Crash the China economy and what happens? They might give us a better deal, they might start a local war? Nothing too bad. Now Trump does not think we need to crash them just as when you buy a car be somewhat aggressive in getting a good deal. Not like say True car where you pay what the dealer wants, but rather you get the best deal ever given.
2
", the plant wound up prospering for well over a decade — because of trade. A Japanese company, Nippon Electric Glass, entered into a joint venture with Owens in 1988 "
Is it a coincidence that was the same year the Congress passed the protectionist Trade Act of 1988 directed at Japan? It seems far from being saved by "trade", the plane was saved by Japanese concerns over growing support in the US for protectionism.
Is it a coincidence that was the same year the Congress passed the protectionist Trade Act of 1988 directed at Japan? It seems far from being saved by "trade", the plane was saved by Japanese concerns over growing support in the US for protectionism.
9
"The economy has simply shifted, and older, less-educated workers are less in demand. "
There is no real evidence for this, it is really just based on abstract ideological belief.
What has happened is that a narrow group of financial elite seized control of the capital created by American workers. That money could have been used creating jobs and improving the productivity of American workers. Instead it was hijacked to create jobs and increase the productivity of workers in China and elsewhere. With a huge cut for the money managers in the financial industry who controlled the investments.
But assume Davidson is right, that there is nothing to be done that will improve the lives of these American workers. What exactly do they lose by voting for any crackpot or crackpot idea that promises them help? And why should they listen to people who have no more interest in helping them than they do in the welfare of workers in China?
There is no real evidence for this, it is really just based on abstract ideological belief.
What has happened is that a narrow group of financial elite seized control of the capital created by American workers. That money could have been used creating jobs and improving the productivity of American workers. Instead it was hijacked to create jobs and increase the productivity of workers in China and elsewhere. With a huge cut for the money managers in the financial industry who controlled the investments.
But assume Davidson is right, that there is nothing to be done that will improve the lives of these American workers. What exactly do they lose by voting for any crackpot or crackpot idea that promises them help? And why should they listen to people who have no more interest in helping them than they do in the welfare of workers in China?
34
Oh - one other thing. The iron mines here in Northern Minnesota shut down as Chinese steel flooded into the United States. The claim was that they were dumping steel at below their costs. Based on that, we put tariffs on Chinese steel. The iron mines here have almost all announced they are reopening, the miners are going back to work and other businesses are hiring. That is an objective reality, not an abstract theory about the benefits of free trade.
24
This is misreading the entire article to promote "an abstract ideological belief" as it launches into a tirade about financial elites the next paragraph. If you're making cathode ray tubes, this is literally the story of buggy whip manufacturers set in the 1990s, with a different cast. I'm typing this message on my LCD monitor. My TV is a plasma set. Neither of those are going to be made in a cathode ray factory. If what replaces it is a tech startup, it's not unreasonable to say there's a skill mismatch at work.
The point of the article is to figure out what can be done. Pointing out that the choice of poison and getting shot are very bad things for the patient isn't some nefarious plot by the "elites." It's saying that there need to be more than an act that involves self-immolation.
The point of the article is to figure out what can be done. Pointing out that the choice of poison and getting shot are very bad things for the patient isn't some nefarious plot by the "elites." It's saying that there need to be more than an act that involves self-immolation.
11
Free trade implies fair trade. Dumping is not fair. So it may be objective reality, but the example doesn't address any of the potential issues of free trade discussed in this article.
4
The media is depressing enough without having to read, see, or listen to his gibberish! Get with the program that we've had long before Trump came along. That media allows The Trump Follies to continuously go on is simply not worth picking a newspaper or watching the news!
Thank goodness for things like Netflix!
Adam I like you article but enough of Trump! Too bad we can't say "Dint blame me I'm from Massachusetts." Remember that? Even you've gone nuts.