Many of the comments to this article -- to the effect of "why single out the poor Russians, everyone does it" are ignorant. The Russians are one of the few countries where a pervasive STATE-RUN system of doping has been in place for decades. This doesn't mean that doping can't or doesn't happen elsewhere, but it does mean that it has been proven that the Russians are, by far, the most accomplished practitioners of doping. The Russians are too often liars and cheaters in international sports, good riddance to them.
2
Well looking at the atmosphere of Brasil now with tainted water, Zika and rampant crime, if I were on the Russian side I would not feel at odds nor defeated. Resilience is the ability to fall, pick ourselves up from the floor quickly, learn and continue with our journey.
Not a fan of Russia. As a Cold War baby, I'm not surprised they've been caught cheating. Little has changed in that country. Talk about a one percent!
But, so long as not all of the Russian athletes use/ used PEDs, I hate this decision. It's an indication of an unacceptable trend - one increasingly subscribed to by the Left here at home. Social justice is replacing individual justice. ("What do we want? Dead cops.") indeed, Donald Trump and his proposed solutions, which condemn all Muslims, is social justice-based. (Donald Trump is no Burkean Conservative. He's more like the Left in this regard.)
Individual Justice is one of the things that has made America exceptional. Social justice is the hallmark of totalitarian regimes - whether they be socialist or fascist.
The bad guys are winning.
But, so long as not all of the Russian athletes use/ used PEDs, I hate this decision. It's an indication of an unacceptable trend - one increasingly subscribed to by the Left here at home. Social justice is replacing individual justice. ("What do we want? Dead cops.") indeed, Donald Trump and his proposed solutions, which condemn all Muslims, is social justice-based. (Donald Trump is no Burkean Conservative. He's more like the Left in this regard.)
Individual Justice is one of the things that has made America exceptional. Social justice is the hallmark of totalitarian regimes - whether they be socialist or fascist.
The bad guys are winning.
1
Dear IOC:
If it please the court: do two things......
[1] Ban the US Olympic Team so our athletes need not be forced to make the choice between representing our country at the paramount risk to their own health and that of their future offspring.
-and-
[2] Vote yourself out of existence, pending a surgical removal of your hypocracy and a revival of anything so much as resembling the original spirit of the Olympics.
If it please the court: do two things......
[1] Ban the US Olympic Team so our athletes need not be forced to make the choice between representing our country at the paramount risk to their own health and that of their future offspring.
-and-
[2] Vote yourself out of existence, pending a surgical removal of your hypocracy and a revival of anything so much as resembling the original spirit of the Olympics.
No one is forcing the US athletes to go to Rio. And the Zika threat is way overstated. So stop being an alarmist.
And if you think that eliminating the IOC's or the "hypocrasy", will bring back the "sprit of the games" (whatever that means), think again. Sport is a business; has been since the time of the Greeks, and will always be.
And if you think that eliminating the IOC's or the "hypocrasy", will bring back the "sprit of the games" (whatever that means), think again. Sport is a business; has been since the time of the Greeks, and will always be.
2
1. If you have any knowledge of other countries, I am sure that WADA would be interested in hearing about it.
2. Yes, the punishment is seeking change in the way the Russian association operates. Russian athletes were banned from international events last year and their officials promised to change the way their program is run. A report released last week showed that nothing changed. Therefore, they are given more time to fix the doping issues.
3. Russia had its own anti-doping agency, RUSADA.
Banning the Russians from the Olympic games is the only thing that might change anything in Russian sports. At least for a while.
2. Yes, the punishment is seeking change in the way the Russian association operates. Russian athletes were banned from international events last year and their officials promised to change the way their program is run. A report released last week showed that nothing changed. Therefore, they are given more time to fix the doping issues.
3. Russia had its own anti-doping agency, RUSADA.
Banning the Russians from the Olympic games is the only thing that might change anything in Russian sports. At least for a while.
1
Wonder if the Russian people thought it also highly unfair to the innocent Russian athletes when the Russian government boycotted the 1984 olympics?
1
It was reported that ALL 25 members of the IAAF voted in favor of the ban. I suggest the Russian member immediately request asylum, hire a food tester, and get a polonium geiger tester ASAP.
let's punish all of them without any exception.
making them take a collective responsibility is making me feel more sorry to them than any other punishment. sympathy isn't needed here at this time. let's show that there is always punishment to criminals as Dostoevsky said.
making them take a collective responsibility is making me feel more sorry to them than any other punishment. sympathy isn't needed here at this time. let's show that there is always punishment to criminals as Dostoevsky said.
1
Wow! The IAAF's got spine! As with Lance Armstrong, cheating on a systemic and long-term basis suggests total denial of wrongdoing and a mindset of "beating the system." This gotcha moment may be transitory. The underlying culture of deception will not readily disappear. On-going vigilance is paramount.
This is what the Russians do. Why is anyone surprised.
I don't recall seeing any explanation as to why the ban is only for track and field team. Were other Russian sports teams deemed to be clean? Would expect the cheating might cover more than one sport if it was state sponsored.
1
The other Russian sports teams just haven't been caught (yet).
President Obama declared we can trust and befriend them, and swore to build bridges. Meanwhile they hack every system here they can, and even cheat at sports. Talk about bad judge of character.
1
That's right, blame our president for doping in Russia. That's about as far-fetched as they come. Try again.
2
You have say that. It's called diplomacy. Bush 43 did that too - famously.
1
Having witnessed the petty corruption firsthand in US youth sports, I can't be surprised about greater corruption at higher levels. How common is embezzlement?
3
Doping is now a sad fact in amateur and professional sports, as is corruption and fraud. The reasons are rooted in unhealthy desires for fame, fortune and power at any moral cost. The Russian ban from the Rio Olympics sends a strong message and is a good step in the right direction. But cleaning up competitive sports will sadly be a marathon.
2
As a boomer, the 1960's to me were the golden age of the Olympic games with the thrill of defeating the evil Communist USSR and satellites during the height of the Cold War. We knew the Russians and East Germans were somehow cheating when they won gold medals as were heavily subsidized Europeans masquerading as "amateurs". Track and field events reigned supreme as intended by the ancient Greeks. Professional golf and tennis as Olympic Sports? Meh.
Please explain how that was the "Golden Age", when cheating, doping, and other funny business was rampant? Who says the US didn't dope then?
I guess you have been watching Rocky IV far too many times....
I guess you have been watching Rocky IV far too many times....
Since the Olympics and FIFA is basically about money . . . I say stop testing completely. Let these athletes do what every it takes to be the strongest and toughest person they can be.
Let's stop taking these "games" as some form of national pride. It's just a front where we use the concept of natural talent to make millions of dollars.
Juice away guys..........
Let's stop taking these "games" as some form of national pride. It's just a front where we use the concept of natural talent to make millions of dollars.
Juice away guys..........
1
Hypocritical witch hunt - shameful.
Ah, so Putin's fake 50 Billon PR show at Sochi has backfired on him. When you have poor values, narrow vision, and terrible leadership, this is what you always end up with. Don't let Russia's problems destroy the rest of our world. Well done the Olympic Advisory Board. And yet Putin still barefaced lies to the world. What a sense of entitlement. What an alternate universe he lives in, while he profits from ours.
How can the people on this site possibly support such systemic, government supported cheating. Trying to compare this to that of individual athletes is ludicrous or simply disingenuous. It goes on and on.
How can the people on this site possibly support such systemic, government supported cheating. Trying to compare this to that of individual athletes is ludicrous or simply disingenuous. It goes on and on.
2
agreeing with JASON, I must add that these UNCONTROLLED instances are punishing athletes, without anyproof on each INDIVIDUAL athlete.
they are continuing on the political momentum of RUSSIA BASHING, adding to the drama started with FIFA, they killed sport...period...
they have to proove athletes guilty, NOT the other way around....
olypics without RUSSIA would be a farce in anycase...for sport s sake.
they are continuing on the political momentum of RUSSIA BASHING, adding to the drama started with FIFA, they killed sport...period...
they have to proove athletes guilty, NOT the other way around....
olypics without RUSSIA would be a farce in anycase...for sport s sake.
"..the Olympics themselves will be diminished by their absence."
No, the games will actually be elevated by eliminating the participation of a country that has long been involved in cheating.
No, the games will actually be elevated by eliminating the participation of a country that has long been involved in cheating.
1
Undoubtedly another Washington inspired "international sanction" that's means NATO a few 3rd world nation. Within the last 2 years there has been a lot more "coverage" of Brazil, Russia, India and China, the BRIC nations and all negative of course.
All the coverages are about stalled growth, corruption, failed economy to drive investment funds to the US.
All the coverages are about stalled growth, corruption, failed economy to drive investment funds to the US.
2
So for the first time actual "crimes against the sport" - doping - are getting some, a select team of athletes banned. Huh...its not politics, or social injustices, losing a war, etc...but something actually related to the actual sporting endeavors. Doping.
Why'd it take so long? Sounds to me like too little too late, and a shot that falls way short of the bigger target - all teams, all athletes everywhere.
Its absurd to think and wholly believe that ONLY these Russian athletes are the guiltiest of parties. Absurd! I find it hard to believe that just these Russian track athletes are the only ones worthy of barring, nor should be for past events, basically committed by their coaches and doctors. How much control over their own bodies do such athletes truly have? Lets face it, most athletes who have managed to rise in such State sponsored settings, are not running their lives like say an American or UK athlete. And even those are often being "handled", (mis)managed by profit seeking management and PR teams, sending them to "cutting edge" doctors and trainers who are always on the look-out for the next big thing in PED's or other questionable modalities.
Of course some penalties should be handed out, but it reeks of spot targeting that the one time actual sports related "crimes" are committed and so widely reported, that ONLY a select few get punished.
The whole of the Olympic System reeks of corruption and nasty business.
But I sure do love those athletes!
Why'd it take so long? Sounds to me like too little too late, and a shot that falls way short of the bigger target - all teams, all athletes everywhere.
Its absurd to think and wholly believe that ONLY these Russian athletes are the guiltiest of parties. Absurd! I find it hard to believe that just these Russian track athletes are the only ones worthy of barring, nor should be for past events, basically committed by their coaches and doctors. How much control over their own bodies do such athletes truly have? Lets face it, most athletes who have managed to rise in such State sponsored settings, are not running their lives like say an American or UK athlete. And even those are often being "handled", (mis)managed by profit seeking management and PR teams, sending them to "cutting edge" doctors and trainers who are always on the look-out for the next big thing in PED's or other questionable modalities.
Of course some penalties should be handed out, but it reeks of spot targeting that the one time actual sports related "crimes" are committed and so widely reported, that ONLY a select few get punished.
The whole of the Olympic System reeks of corruption and nasty business.
But I sure do love those athletes!
Russia and China are totalitarian societies. Like monarchies (Arab et al), they should not be allowed to compete in a democratic world. In short, they should not be allowed an semblance of acceptance until their own people are allowed to vote, and run for office, freely, not mention have freedom of speech, movement, employment, language, religion and housing.
Great news.... Now when will thieves, robbers, and cheaters be banned from Wall Street?
1
"The International Association of Athletics Federations, the governing body for track and field, announced the decision Friday, ruling in a unanimous vote that Russia had..."
Can NYTimes provides a list of voting directors and their nationality? Thanks.
Can NYTimes provides a list of voting directors and their nationality? Thanks.
2
Russian authorities have vehemently disputed Dr. Rodchenkov’s account, calling it the “slander of a turncoat.”
"If one can't attack the message...attack the credibility of the messenger." (believe a fundamental truism of propaganda perpetuation and control)
"If one can't attack the message...attack the credibility of the messenger." (believe a fundamental truism of propaganda perpetuation and control)
The problem is not just doping in Russia, its the attitude of Russia in general that they can get away with anything they want on the world stage, with no consequences. The need to get over the fact they're a second rate country, with a second rate leader, with no allies, and with nothing anybody really wants or needs...the "bully" just got cut down to size...
1
"...that Russia had inherited a doping culture from the Soviet Union."
"...say hello to the new boss...same as the old boss..." Right! Like that's really an excuse. It doesn't require serendipity to discover Russia and the USSR differ in name and square miles governed...but not in psychic and not in methodologies, its always been, since long before the "October Revolution"...Russian.
"...say hello to the new boss...same as the old boss..." Right! Like that's really an excuse. It doesn't require serendipity to discover Russia and the USSR differ in name and square miles governed...but not in psychic and not in methodologies, its always been, since long before the "October Revolution"...Russian.
The Russian athletes barred from these Olympics may turn out to be the lucky ones.
It is extremely unfair to punish all for the sins of the few. While the IAAF condemns a whole nation, we go out of our way to indicate a small section of a particular religion do not represent the whole religion. We got it correct there, we should get it correct here. At the very least the IAAF should allow the other clean athletes to compete under a different federation but still under the country's banner. That will set as an example to the young russians that the world does not condemn them as a country and give them hope.
The Olympics would be diminished by allowing confirmed cheaters to compete.
“Russia fully supports fighting doping,” Mr. Mutko wrote, citing independent drug testing of Russian athletes...and a new law that would make it a criminal offense “for an athlete’s coach and entourage to support doping.”
Empty, hollow platitudes, systemic and systematic cheating and bribing has created a long and worthless history of passed drug tests making that platitude hollow indeed...and one has to first enforce a law to make it meaningful and Russia actually enforcing this law is unbelievable.
Empty, hollow platitudes, systemic and systematic cheating and bribing has created a long and worthless history of passed drug tests making that platitude hollow indeed...and one has to first enforce a law to make it meaningful and Russia actually enforcing this law is unbelievable.
1
“We do not believe that every Russian athlete cheated,” said Stephanie Hightower, the president of USA Track & Field..."
Really? That buggers belief a bit...
Really? That buggers belief a bit...
1
Reading this story and the other story about the possible Saudi Arabia involvement in 9/11 makes me wonder about the cultural differences with regard to integrity and honesty. Americans will joke about rules and how they are made to be broken, but, other cultures seem to have rule-breaking and lying about it as part of their culture. It expected. Of course, this culture may derive from the notoriously harsh penalties meted out by their respective governments....
“We now appeal to the members of the International Olympic Committee to not only consider the impact that our athletes’ exclusion will have on their dreams and the people of Russia, but also that the Olympics themselves will be diminished by their absence,”
Oh brother, what a load...
Oh brother, what a load...
1
Good to see this major action actually enforcing the rules. When institutions are involved, institutional sanctions are needed. That's a shame for the innocent (if there are any), but it incentivizes the innocent to refuse to join or stay in a corrupt organization.
By analogy, our DOJ should actually enforce laws that ban from the marketplace entities that commit serial fraud. That is, the uber banks and investment banks that commit serial fraud, such as UBS, HSBC, B of A, and of course the vampire squid formally known as Goldman Sachs. The failure to actually punish and reign in financial fraudsters will be the asterisk forever associated with President Obama's otherwise strong performance.
By analogy, our DOJ should actually enforce laws that ban from the marketplace entities that commit serial fraud. That is, the uber banks and investment banks that commit serial fraud, such as UBS, HSBC, B of A, and of course the vampire squid formally known as Goldman Sachs. The failure to actually punish and reign in financial fraudsters will be the asterisk forever associated with President Obama's otherwise strong performance.
1
You wonder if people are so willing to cheat and corrupt something as trivial as the Olympics, they are willing to cheat and corrupt anything. Humans have the natural inclination to lie and cheat. You see it sometimes in very small children going through a phase when they are toddlers. From there on we learn to hide the lying and cheating better rationalizing the cheating in perverse ways, often lying to ourselves. Then somebody brings the hammer down, but the cheaters will be right back. I am sure the current Russian athletes feel cheated out of the Olympics, and some of them will retaliate by cheating even more drastically.
Obviously, a state control problem. Russia is still a centrally planned economy . Everything from business to sports is directed by corrupt government officials .
2
The Saudis use slave labor to prepare for the world cup-- no problem. But Russians take illegal drugs, so ban them all. I'm not a fan of Putin, but he's right. This decision is political.
1
Enough already... the Olympics are a farce. National pride, billions of (put any currency type here) for entertainment.
1
Haven't watched this elite Ponzi scheme in over a decade, and won't watch in the decades to come. What a massive waste of time and resources.
1
The only way to "save the Olympics" (don't hold your breath) is to do away with flags, national anthems, medal counts by country, and "team uniforms by country."
Have the opening ceremony parade by sport rather than by country. Have all skaters come in together. Skiers, hockey players, etc. Its fine to still have the medal ceremony and even mention which country each athlete is from, but do away with the flag raising and national anthems.
Its not supposed to be about politics yet the propaganda is "if my country wins all these medal then naturally our form or government and way of life is the best!"
Alas, stop the politics and all that government money to, ahem, "train (and/or drug)" the athletes will dry up. No money means no games and no TV money. Which means a lot of fat cats getting the cash will be upset. So, it'll never happen.
A pity!
Have the opening ceremony parade by sport rather than by country. Have all skaters come in together. Skiers, hockey players, etc. Its fine to still have the medal ceremony and even mention which country each athlete is from, but do away with the flag raising and national anthems.
Its not supposed to be about politics yet the propaganda is "if my country wins all these medal then naturally our form or government and way of life is the best!"
Alas, stop the politics and all that government money to, ahem, "train (and/or drug)" the athletes will dry up. No money means no games and no TV money. Which means a lot of fat cats getting the cash will be upset. So, it'll never happen.
A pity!
Why just track and field, if the Russian government was this brazen in one sport, why not others? Maybe it's a race thing. Since blacks tend to win t&f and Russia is too racist to allow actual black immigrants, they justify doping to offset the "obvious" physical disparity?
Why is the IOC just banning the Russian Track & Field Team? The rampant use of performance enhancing drugs is systemic in the whole of ALL Russian sports. Russia should be banned from ALL athletic competitions, including the upcoming World Cup that it is hosting, until it submits to International testing of ALL of its athletes in neutral sites. It is obvious that Russia cannot be trusted at all with the allegations that have come to light recently. What about all the athletes that stayed clean and competed against these cheats who would have earned medals? They have lost hundreds of thousands and possibly millions of dollars in endorsements. Russia needs to be penalized financially as well to compensate those athletes. Presently the penalties for athletes that use PED’s are a joke. From now on any athlete that uses PED’s and is caught is banned for life, PERIOD. No six month, 1 year, 2 year bans. You are done for LIFE!
7
Agreed. And it is also rampant in the former SSRs. Look at the recent scandal involving the women weightlifting athletes from Kazakhstan. At least 3 of the 2012 London gold medalists have been found to have taken banned substances, prior to the competition.
I do not condone doping. However, Jamaicians will compete despite the largely unresolved doping scandal that revealed lax and conveninent doping control measures. Half the athletes retested from 2008 were not Russian and little followup with these respective nations has occured. None of the nations, America included, have paid a price this harsh for their respective bribery programs to secure a games, (just another form of cheating), and now the fans will be denied watching some of the greats, like Darya Klishina in the long jump perform. Oh well, there is a silver lining for the Russian paddlers who will not be required to compete in what is essentially a sewer, an oversight allowed in the interests of commerce. The five rings of the Olympics now symbolize the five rings of corruption.
5
I agree. There is no consistency in these decisions. We're still mad about Syria.
Let us hope dopers like Maria Sharapova is not allowed to compete either. She sickens me.
4
Russia is a corrupt, mafia styled 3rd world nation. Their athletes really, and truly, are not welcomed in international competition.
The entire under 18 Russian national hocket team was pulled and completely replaced at the last minute, prior to this years world championship. Professional hockey players in the Russian KHL league dope, too. Every player on the Russian women's hockey team at the Sochi olympics was doping...
Today the track and field team was officially banned from thecsummer games, and for good reason.... The various individual sport governing bodies had suspended Russian athletes for some time slready.
But think of the under 18 team national mens hockey team I mentioned.... State sponsored steriods for top national athletes aged 15 to 18... Players, who are still growing kids... It is revolting.
From international politics to sport doping, there is no honor in Russian policy. Justly, Russian athletes will stay home.
The entire under 18 Russian national hocket team was pulled and completely replaced at the last minute, prior to this years world championship. Professional hockey players in the Russian KHL league dope, too. Every player on the Russian women's hockey team at the Sochi olympics was doping...
Today the track and field team was officially banned from thecsummer games, and for good reason.... The various individual sport governing bodies had suspended Russian athletes for some time slready.
But think of the under 18 team national mens hockey team I mentioned.... State sponsored steriods for top national athletes aged 15 to 18... Players, who are still growing kids... It is revolting.
From international politics to sport doping, there is no honor in Russian policy. Justly, Russian athletes will stay home.
8
"corrupt, mafia styled 3rd world nation"
Er, has Mr. Gordon ever spent an extended period of time in Russia and gotten to know a range of Russians there? Does Mr. Gordon speak Russian well or does he know anything about Russian history, culture, government, ethnicity and so on? I doubt all.
Er, has Mr. Gordon ever spent an extended period of time in Russia and gotten to know a range of Russians there? Does Mr. Gordon speak Russian well or does he know anything about Russian history, culture, government, ethnicity and so on? I doubt all.
1
Ban the ENTIRE Russian Olympic Team. Along with those from some of the former SSRs. The doping in those countries is of industrial proportions.
It seems like the real villains in this piece are the Olympic sports leaders within Russia who were the masterminds of such a system. The young people were just doing what they requested. So now the full weight of these government decisions comes down with a crushing blow on them and their fellow athletes who were innocent. The real penalties should be for a lifetime ban from the Olympics for all those officials identified of participating in the scheme. The only solution is for the Olympic committee to hire some of the best experts in the world who are capable of keeping up with all the new performance enhancers being created and then developing a rigorous testing system with iron clad penalties. Expensive yes, but vital to trying in keeping integrity in the games.
5
There are some interesting arguments here. One I like most is that everyone is doping so why blame one country. It sounds like this argument rests on the evidence that tests have been carried out in each and every country, and as such results show the prevalence of cheaters in sports. This is not true. WADA cannot carry out these massive tests so it depends on the goodwill of the national affiliates. This is where the problem lies. If these affiliates are governed by corrupt officials who are picked to lead by their governments, then of course you are going to see cheaters go through as this happened in a certain African country.
There is no way we can know if doping is a phenomenon not only found in Russia or Kenya or the US for that matter.
Knowing rests upon the clearmindesness of the officials guiding the sports organizations in their countries to come out clean. But we do not know if this is a fact. There is a huge shroud about doping and the magnitudes are unknown to us.
There is no way we can know if doping is a phenomenon not only found in Russia or Kenya or the US for that matter.
Knowing rests upon the clearmindesness of the officials guiding the sports organizations in their countries to come out clean. But we do not know if this is a fact. There is a huge shroud about doping and the magnitudes are unknown to us.
4
The Russians have a systemic issue with cheating in it's athletic culture. In fact it seems that Putin himself a throwback to Soviet day, encourages this in all aspects of Russian society. Sports is one area that a spectator is appreciating the skill and strength of an individual that is naturally gifted and physically special. Drug enhanced performance drugs destroy that competitiveness and perhaps the Russians need to succeed in this manner because there are no naturally gifted athletes in Russia.
2
It's Tom Brady all over again. Cheat. Appeal. Get reinstated. Have your nationalistic tribe claim you were the greatest.
1
Yes. But all the scientists agree that Brady did not cheat. He was right. Doh
The doping problem is so widespread it is probably impossible to solve. Still, the flagrant nature of the Russian transgression is insulting to anyone invested in the results of the Olympics.
It seems like this ruling was intended more to punish Russia than to solve the doping problem. I am fine with that, but would like to see how the authorities handle future scandals after establishing a precedent with this decision.
It seems like this ruling was intended more to punish Russia than to solve the doping problem. I am fine with that, but would like to see how the authorities handle future scandals after establishing a precedent with this decision.
1
A couple of years ago, I attended the US track and field championships in Eugene. This year I'll be at the Olympic trials, also in Eugene. Track fans are a small but fanatic lot. The celebrities racers, like Allyson Felix and Justin Gatllin (a drug user but a favorite of some because he is believed to have paid his dues) are exciting to watch. Lolo Jones is a great self-promoter. Vashti Cunningham is 18 and already well known. Distance runners have become better known because of the marathon. Simpson, Rowbury, Centrowitz and maybe Meb will be favorites. But then there is the steeplechase, the heptathlon, race walking, and the discus which are far more obscure. Nonetheless, the folks in Eugene know who to look for. In the triple jump there's always someone looking for a boost who pumps their arms to get the crowd going, which it always does. And, oh by the way, anyone who ran track for Oregon gets a boost without asking. Track and field is a special sport, with special competitors and special fans. It's a lot like family. It must find answers to doping because it just has to survive.
1
One of the last sports that does not require total commitment at age 10. If you can throw run or jump you are in. Mom and dad don't have to shell out thousands of dollars to help their child keep up with the competition. No subjective decisions by parents picking teams. If the kid ran fast, threw far or jumped high you don't have to politic your way on to the team. The greatest sport out there. Pure sport.
P.S. I really feel for the athletes who were beat out by the dopers. Too late to cash in on their prowess.
P.S. I really feel for the athletes who were beat out by the dopers. Too late to cash in on their prowess.
If the Olympics is too incompetent to set up a secure testing method, then it should be on them, not the innocent Russians who have trained years to compete. As if the Olympic isn't already seriously undermined, an Olympic committee analyzes their own failures and decides.... let's collectively punish some innocent Russian athletes for because of the deplorable and, yes, systematic actions of other Russians.
(How unAmerican!)
There may not be a perfect resolution or punishment, but by banishing an entire nation's Track and Field team, the myopic Olympic committee members are overreacting and seriously undermining their brand and our enjoyment of international competition.
Even though I always root for the USA to defeat the Russians, in sport, I will definitely enjoy the Olympics a less without the Russians around. I think most Americans will admit that. Can you even imagine an Olympics without the Soviets? 1980 for example and all those memories. I'm sure many were systematically doping then too.
Test them in Brazil and throw out the bad apples. If you cannot test properly because Russian spies outwit you, carve holes in walls, and various almost comic activities to foil the testing, then it's on you.
(How unAmerican!)
There may not be a perfect resolution or punishment, but by banishing an entire nation's Track and Field team, the myopic Olympic committee members are overreacting and seriously undermining their brand and our enjoyment of international competition.
Even though I always root for the USA to defeat the Russians, in sport, I will definitely enjoy the Olympics a less without the Russians around. I think most Americans will admit that. Can you even imagine an Olympics without the Soviets? 1980 for example and all those memories. I'm sure many were systematically doping then too.
Test them in Brazil and throw out the bad apples. If you cannot test properly because Russian spies outwit you, carve holes in walls, and various almost comic activities to foil the testing, then it's on you.
3
Get your facts straight. The IOC did NOT ban the athletes. IAAF, the Athletic Federation did it. The Russians have said that they will probably appeal to the IOC.
Maybe it's time to stop hosting enormous and wasteful international sports festivals. Actually, many sport stadiums and the events cause way too much overcrowding and unhealthy competition and it's sad. I thought Stephen Curry was a cool basketball star until he threw a mouthguard and hit a fan in the stand today for getting annoyed at the fouls he received. Sports can foster team work and benefit many from exercise, but I'm not sure if it's worth the spectacle that the Olympic advertises these days. Sports is now a big show business and I don't want to watch hypercompetitive and stressed athletes get injured anymore.
2
This might be justified... if we knew for sure all the athletes they would have been competing against had never used steroids, If fact, we know the opposite is true. The reeks of hypocrisy.
5
The Olympics have seemingly deteriorated into a huge money making scheme of drug-stimulated commercialized competition that is sought by hotels, restaurants, bars, and politicians as a means of temporarily pulling in and spending billions on one-time-use facilities that would have been better spent on housing and health care. The competition and winners apparently are determined by which countries have the cleverest medical people to conceal the use of performance-enhancing drugs. It would seem that there is a large measure of hypocrisy splashed over the whole affair.
2
IOC = FIFA both equally corrupt.
4
Perhaps you should substitute IOC for ROC (Russian Olympic Committee)
Absolutely love Sebastian Coe (IAAF president, 1:41.73 previous 800M World record time, Olympic 1500M Champion, etc). It's ironic however, that the Russian sports federation sent their Olympic ban appeal letter to Sebastian Coe. For anyone intimately involved at the top level in the middle distances races in track and field, knows that a time of 1:41.73 for 800 meters is a dope time. A supremely talented and conditioned athlete at the peak of his life can put together two 52 second quarter miles for a time of 1:44, mid to high 1:43 (*possibly*). So there is a lot of hypocrisy in banning the Russian team outright. The 800M mens race at this Olympics will be one in a time well below 1:44, Russia or no Russia.
1
Who knows about Mr. Coe, but this assessment of his best time as athlete may well be indicative of his own doping. Athletes who compete at a very high level likely know physical limitations intimately, plus statistical analysis, if well-done, can be indicative.
Otherwise this is a purely political decision furthering the reprehensible cause of rabid neo-conservatives, mostly USA-based, who have been attacking Russia, Russians and more recently Mr. Putin since the dissolution of the CCCP in 1991.
Otherwise this is a purely political decision furthering the reprehensible cause of rabid neo-conservatives, mostly USA-based, who have been attacking Russia, Russians and more recently Mr. Putin since the dissolution of the CCCP in 1991.
I competed in track and field at the NCAA national level, clean. I can tell you even at the amateur level, with only grandma in the stands, there is tremendous pressure to succumb to cheating in the championships. In the 800M (my event) there was something as simple as bicarbonate drink (similar to "milshaking" that horse trainers do illegally) and it goes all the way up to human growth hormones, blood doping and exotic things we have not uncovered.
Looking at the USA track and field team and there performances, it is just as dirty as Russia's team.
You would be astonished to know that if the world's best talented sprinters were absolutely prevented from cheating, Olympic 100 Meter races would be won by men looking as lean as greyhounds with times like 10.08, 10.12 etc etc. A true 10.00 100 Meter runner comes along once a generation.
Summary: the U.S. team is doped to the gills too. One cannot make the US Olympic track and field team without being doped.
Looking at the USA track and field team and there performances, it is just as dirty as Russia's team.
You would be astonished to know that if the world's best talented sprinters were absolutely prevented from cheating, Olympic 100 Meter races would be won by men looking as lean as greyhounds with times like 10.08, 10.12 etc etc. A true 10.00 100 Meter runner comes along once a generation.
Summary: the U.S. team is doped to the gills too. One cannot make the US Olympic track and field team without being doped.
Putin 2014: There’s no Russian soldiers in #Ukraine.
Putin 2016: There's no govt supported doping in #Russia's sports.
Putin 2016: There's no govt supported doping in #Russia's sports.
9
You've nailed the reason for the decision. It's idiotic to ban all Russian athletes, but we want to punish Russia for saving Syria from ISIS. Not exactly why we're mad about that, but we need to punish Putin somehow, so let's so athletes from participating.
That'll show those evil Ruskies whose boss.
That'll show those evil Ruskies whose boss.
What about the swimmers? All the other sports. RUssia had indulged in widespread, systematic, intnetional cheating. Why should any of their athletes be allowd to cheat at another Olympics?
2
WADA did not provide any proof of full-scale clinical trials, which would confirm that meldonium improves sport results. And in these circumstances, they are in fact violated its own rules, which means that their decision is meaningless and deeply wrong.
In this case, we are talking not only about doping. It's about rules. And these rules are violated by the judges and the jury.
In this case, we are talking not only about doping. It's about rules. And these rules are violated by the judges and the jury.
3
You've outlined the problem perfectly. You're expecting rational people to believe that a world-class athlete, surrounded by a cadre of nutritionists, trainers, physicians and handlers, all of whom are aware of the highly regulated sport in which their charge participates, and are responsible for that person's activities, was NOT AWARE of the list of banned substances, and the expected repercussions if those substances were found during routine testing.
It's seems "rules are made to be broken" is the standard operating procedure of your state's athletic philosophy.
It's seems "rules are made to be broken" is the standard operating procedure of your state's athletic philosophy.
Why not permit Russian athletes to compete under the condition that they be monitored comprehensively? If the tests are not good enough to permit the athletes to compete under that rule, then they are not good enough to result in a ban.
4
I have to agree with Jason. Now it is becoming fairly stupid. Soccer, Tennis, Beach Volleyball? They all have their own venues and events.
As for the Russians? The Federation was found to be organising cheating. Putin claims to have been in direct overarching authority of this. I guess that is why it has happened. Russians are not all guilty of this. However, Putin is corrupt. Ethically and personally corrupt. Let the atheletes blame the one responsible.
As for the Russians? The Federation was found to be organising cheating. Putin claims to have been in direct overarching authority of this. I guess that is why it has happened. Russians are not all guilty of this. However, Putin is corrupt. Ethically and personally corrupt. Let the atheletes blame the one responsible.
4
This is ridiculous. First, I find it hard to believe that the RF was the only country involved in doping. Secondly, does this punishment seek to do anything constructive, like prevent such things in the future, or is it just there to sanction the Russians? And thirdly, how was it possible for the Russians to have such an influence on the testing process?
Banning the Russians from the Rio Games does nothing to address the actual issue at hand, which is broader control over the games.
Banning the Russians from the Rio Games does nothing to address the actual issue at hand, which is broader control over the games.
5
Unless the penalties are stiff enough, there is no incentive not to cheat. `
7
While this is understandable, it emphasizes the politics of the Olympics and diminishes them. It's too bad for the Russian athletes who are innocent and the competition is hurt. Besides, it's always fun to beat them because they tend to be tough opponents.
1
When in basic training some in an army unit makes a mistake, those that are made to do the extra pushups are not the ones who committed the mistake, but rather those that did not.
Perhaps, this will be a lesson learned for ALL athletes.
Perhaps, this will be a lesson learned for ALL athletes.
This must have carried over into other sports in Russia.
5
Representatives of the German journalist Zeppelt and ARD declared in court that they con sidered the statements contained in the films about doping in Russia as mismatching the validity. Sport ad_voc_ate Artem Patsev said. His quoted, "R-Sport".
Unless there is high confidence that all athletes on the team were involved is it fair to bar them all from competition? I think not. Where there is strong enough evidence, invalidate the medals previously won, and ban the athletes known to have been doped in any of the qualifying events or in any competition in any previous Olympics. Let the rest compete. The Olympics is supposed to be for the athletes more than for the countries who send them.
3
Politics as usual, its sad to say, but who can believe anything we or institutions we control say. The general theme for sixty plus years has been Russia bad, America good, be very afraid, increase defense spending. Oh, by the way, all this while we lie our way to war(Iraq most recently), coups(Egypt, Ukraine), assassinations(numerous), strangling economies that don't believe in our free market, winner take all system ( recently and repeatedly in Central and South America). By virtue of our own rhetoric were the same rules applied to us, as to say the former Yugoslavia or East Germany, our own athletes would never be allowed to compete. Very sad indeed.
3
I am not surprised that Russia was involved in a doping scandal. Anything they do or say under Putin is suspect. For example, they make a treaty for a cease fire in Syria, then break it. Anyone who believes what Putin says is true is a fool. And yes, that includes Donald Trump. But maybe he respects Putin because they are both cut from the same cloth.
9
On and on we, the US goes. They have tried to ruin the 1980 olympics, in Moscow , the last winter Olympics in Sochi, the Chinese Olympics by claiming the air stunk, and now they want to harm the Brazil Olympics. Next the US will try to sabotage the next World Cup in Russia. Let it go for once, The US is so tiring. Making enemies everywhere is their raison d etre
3
What? These people(the Russians), are cheaters! They were caught. Now they have to suffer the consequences!
2
Correct.
Oh, we are back to the paranoid and tired "the USA/CIA did it" argument, aren't we? How puerile.
Just so sad.....
3
Russians are second class people when we compare them to Europe or the US.
And Russians feel that way now and they have for the last 50 years.
In their eyes any trick or cheating that will even the plain field is totally justified. And this attitude prevails all the way from Putin.
Poor Russians, they cannot help themselves.
The problem is that they may try to get even with the west in a political or a strategic way like invading Slovenia or something like that. And that would not be fun at all.
And Russians feel that way now and they have for the last 50 years.
In their eyes any trick or cheating that will even the plain field is totally justified. And this attitude prevails all the way from Putin.
Poor Russians, they cannot help themselves.
The problem is that they may try to get even with the west in a political or a strategic way like invading Slovenia or something like that. And that would not be fun at all.
5
The Olympics should be about individual athletes, not countries. If an athlete tests clean, let him/her participate. Forget all the flag waving.
Track is mostly an individual competition. The results of each event are listed in the order of finish, name by name. The world championships and the Olympics are different, though. They are listed by nationality, as if track were a team sport. The pressure on a number of national sports federations relates to this nationalization of track once every year. The best way to address this problem is to reduce or eliminate this intermittent nationalization. When the runners in the 100 take off from the blocks, they should be wearing whatever uniforms they want. The winners are the fastest man and woman in the world. Who cares where they come from?
1
“Politics was not playing a part in that room today,” said Coe. Anytime a blanket statement like this is made by someone in a position of authority, it is precisely the opposite of what actually happened - otherwise, why say it? Can we not keep politics out of sport?
1
I guess Tom Brady kind of took the wind out of the argument about whether the athletes should keep their medals.
2
Perhaps the Russian should consider it good luck in that they will be spared getting the ZIKA Virus from the fast spreading epidemic. The Olympic is nothing more then one big commercial facade. Along with current political corruption, the Rio Olympics will a future curse of economic loss and disaster.
2
Big Deal, There will be more than that bailing on the Olympics the closer they get to opening. Zika Virus would count me out.
2
it's not sport, just more US controlled demolition. Sports rules are just US war by another means.
1
Good now take away the 2018 World Cup.
7
And the 2022 from Qatar.
Pardon me if no crocodile tears are shed for Czar Vladimir I and his corrupt government. Too bad, so sad.
6
It's about time.
5
And... get ready for the Kremlin-paid Russian trolls out there to flood the comments section on how unfair it is, how the West is picking on poor Russia, so forth and so on, ad nauseam.
Congrats to the International Association of Athletics Federations for having the bravery to do this.
Congrats to the International Association of Athletics Federations for having the bravery to do this.
13
Cheaters banning cheaters.
5
A nation of athlete cheaters, a corrupt government complicit in promoting them for propaganda purposes, a leader who is reminiscent of Stalin... Hey! What's not to like?
5
The thing about cheating is that it makes you a liar and a thief. You have stolen something of great value from a fellow human being and because you know you are a thief, it can't really have much value to you. I think all those Russian medals should be rescinded and given in a special ceremony to the runner ups.
4
Let'em use their drugs...they're killing themselves for a few minutes of fleeting glory.
No one will remember their names a week after the events.
And for the clean Russians who wished to fairly compete, this is just an unfair and unneeded penalty that hurts no one except the honest and upright.
But like everything else about the Olympics, nationalism prevails...it never was about the individual athlete after all.
No one will remember their names a week after the events.
And for the clean Russians who wished to fairly compete, this is just an unfair and unneeded penalty that hurts no one except the honest and upright.
But like everything else about the Olympics, nationalism prevails...it never was about the individual athlete after all.
2
Let's be real. This isn't just limited to track and field.
3
"“What does it even mean to ban Russia?” she said. “Is sending them to their room or putting them in a timeout going to solve the problem?”"
Yes.
Yes.
Olympics has lost its significance to me after IOC decided to do away with Wrestling before reinstating it for 2020. The oldest sport in the world replaced, with sports like beach volleyball still remaining. Can you believe that ?
3
Well done!
3
Thank goodness, the completely clean Jamaican track team will in Rio. And of course, for 50 years the center of sprinting in America has been in Westwood, CA, right next to Muscle Beach, so America has nothing to feel guilty about!
4
Oh, now we are even politicizing the olympics, what a joke!
1
Guess what?
No one cares.
Olympics are over, new generation doesn't give it a second thought, it will be completely dead in a decade
No one cares.
Olympics are over, new generation doesn't give it a second thought, it will be completely dead in a decade
1
Russia is so well known for cheating that, world wide, when Russians win major competitions, athletes don't really take it seriously. Nobody respects cheaters.
5
Like FIFA and the NFL, the Olympics are corrupt, far beyond the Russian doping revelations. When I lived in Atlanta, the stories and gossip about what was done in order for the city to win the games ran the gamut from hilarious to deeply offensive. It's all about money, power, control and societal manipulation and distraction. May Rio be the last.
2
It's a blessing in disguise. The athletes have an official reason for not having to go to Brazil for the Olympics, and potential exposure to the Zika virus, and political and civil unrest. With so many poor Brazilians who live in shacks cobbled together with cardboard and metal being displaced all in the name of building stadiums for athletes (most of whom will be professional athletes) to play games, the entire Olympics is a travesty.
4
I love the summer Olympics.
I love all the national pride.
And the global pride.
I suggest drug testing be stopped.
What's the use?
The cheaters always figure out a way around the testing, anyway.
Let's just make the Olympics a free for all.
Onward!
I love all the national pride.
And the global pride.
I suggest drug testing be stopped.
What's the use?
The cheaters always figure out a way around the testing, anyway.
Let's just make the Olympics a free for all.
Onward!
What about rowers, wrestlers, weightlifters, and other athletes in sports where extra muscle is an advantage? Surely it wasn't only the Russian track and field athletes who cheated.
8
Would that all cheating (in sports or in politics) meet the same fate.
1
Perhaps we should have two Olympics!
One will be a "Purity" Olympics, for only those who keep their bodies pure and wholesome, as the good Lord intended, when he created Mankind in his image, sans PEDS...
The second will be "Love of Sport" Olympics, in which those motivated by true love of the sport, and the thrill of competition, and vanquishing one's enemies, and conquering whatever the cost compete to the best, rather than purest of body...
Hear, hear!
One will be a "Purity" Olympics, for only those who keep their bodies pure and wholesome, as the good Lord intended, when he created Mankind in his image, sans PEDS...
The second will be "Love of Sport" Olympics, in which those motivated by true love of the sport, and the thrill of competition, and vanquishing one's enemies, and conquering whatever the cost compete to the best, rather than purest of body...
Hear, hear!
2
I'm sorry but this is just so stupid……
We really need to postpone the Olympics for a decade or so and come back with some akin to the original idea- amateur competition. The whole thing has turned into a joke.
10
At last, something Chicagoans can be thankful for; we will not be hosting this madness in the foreseeable future. Our pols told us all the usual lies, and the city got excited, and then, glory be, we got shot down. We the taxpayers thank you, IOC!
6
With the Us everything is politics. Remember when the olympics where for amateurs ? Why do professional people play basketball, tennis, basketball
if they have their own world tournaments, championships, etc etc.have to be in the olympics ? The days when real amateurs were in the olympics were over when professionals , like the "dream team " in basketball, started to appear in the Cold War games of who was the most successful system in world sports. disregarding completely the rest of the world and the olympics principle.
if they have their own world tournaments, championships, etc etc.have to be in the olympics ? The days when real amateurs were in the olympics were over when professionals , like the "dream team " in basketball, started to appear in the Cold War games of who was the most successful system in world sports. disregarding completely the rest of the world and the olympics principle.
4
Please, do you really think it started with the Dream Team? From the beginning of the former Soviet Union participation in the Olympics, their athletes were payed to train full time, given "jobs" that they only showed up to on payday or officer sinecure in the armed services.
1
Just end the Olympics already! We did not have them for 1500 odd years, we no longer need them in the modern era. Television tries to make these people into heroes in order to gain more eyeballs, but the fact is it is about pure ego. The hollowness of gold medal victory resounding.
1
Pierre de Coubertin revived the Olympics for the purity of sport. I am sure he is turning in his grave observing what they have become over the last 75 years. It's time to end this nonsense. The Olympics are a charade.
4
Let's bring back tug of war (once an Olympic sport), and then add street corner sign twirling. Naked bowling would certainly add a new twist along with hog calling.
There is a difference between individual cheaters (e.g. Lance Armstrong) and State-run cheating what has been found here.
1
It was never fair to start with. There are states where the "athlete" is subsidized, trained and prepared for the Olympics. Then there are other states where the athlete is a true amateur who has to find their own way to the games. It's never been a true contest. I can remember the East Germans and their doping. Though I believe it is more widespread than just Russia. It's just not come out yet. It's never been about fairness and competition. It's always been about wining at whatever cost. I do not care for it.
The relevancy of the Olympics is questionable. Both the Summer and Winter games have had problems with behaviours (judging bias, doping, etc.) that have led to my losing interest. Besides those problems, the costs are prohibitive. If the Olympics are to continue there should be one site, one administration, and athletes apply to compete individually. Then perhaps the Olympics will be able to stay true to athletics and humouring the best.
1
The comments here are predictably rife with accusations about the US undoubtedly from some who turn every international accusation about anything into a reason to blame the US, no matter how remote this country may be from the event. One commenter even blamed the US for being good, saying that our "elite " status forced other countries to engage in doping so they could compete against us. There must be a sub species bred with the uncontrollable urge to criticize this Country for any reason in any situation relevant or not with the ultimate goal of placing every problem existing in the world as the cause of the US. I'll bet that some reading this feel exactly that way.
4
Well at least the Olympic committee is willing to stand up to Russian corruption and aggression. The rest of Europe and Obama seem to think invading Crimea and the Urkraine is not worthy of a real response.
1
Russian culture is full of fraud and cheating. Even in Brighton Beach, many Russian cannot shake their criminal-minded, communistic thuggery. I suppose that coming from a godless, peasant culture, it is more convenient to lie, steal and cheat than to tell the truth. As some wise person once said, "Communism spreads the misery evenly among everyone." With communist Russians, even the wins are really losses.
I am not a New Yorker but I think you are confusing Brighton Beach with Wall Street.
3
"But...but..but...
They're harming their health!"
Who says they're harming their health? That isn't proven in the case of most performance enhancing drugs. In most cases, it's simply the performance enhancement that's being objected to, without any knowledge or concern if it has effects on health. It's quite possible, in fact, that many things that enhance athletic performance (though surely not all) would be beneficial for health (increasing, say, oxygenation, blood cells, excercise recovery are presumably not bad things for the body.)
They're harming their health!"
Who says they're harming their health? That isn't proven in the case of most performance enhancing drugs. In most cases, it's simply the performance enhancement that's being objected to, without any knowledge or concern if it has effects on health. It's quite possible, in fact, that many things that enhance athletic performance (though surely not all) would be beneficial for health (increasing, say, oxygenation, blood cells, excercise recovery are presumably not bad things for the body.)
Why should we care that the Russians cheated.
We put too much emphasis on winning. not enough about playing the game.
The Olympic should not be about which country has more medals.
It should be about having fun and how people from different countries can get along.
So I really don't care if the Russian gets gold at every event they are in.
I do care that they are not there because our athletes will miss an experience
that is more important then winning.
They will miss the experience not of competing to see who is best but of just getting together and having some fun.
We put too much emphasis on winning. not enough about playing the game.
The Olympic should not be about which country has more medals.
It should be about having fun and how people from different countries can get along.
So I really don't care if the Russian gets gold at every event they are in.
I do care that they are not there because our athletes will miss an experience
that is more important then winning.
They will miss the experience not of competing to see who is best but of just getting together and having some fun.
The difference between Russian athletes and the rest of the world doping is Russia is state sponsored doping i.e. The government has been financing and supplying the drugs.
1
While I feel sorry for those Russian Athletes that want to compete "clean" this was the only response that the Russian Government understands. Despite repeated warnings, they continued to flaunt the rules, and the latest in this saga has the government intimidating ftesting authorities tasked with seeking compliance.
2
The U.S.S.R. offered the equivalent of professional athletes when all Olympic athletes were supposed to be amateurs, they doped their athletes in every way imaginable to maximize their performance, and Russia has confidently continued doing everything that was done by the U.S.S.R. They rarely received any medals that were not from twisting the rules or just breaking them. These things were known or suspected for many decades and later soundly established as fact. So why now does the Olympic Committee take this action? If even one of them wins without cheating, it means more to Russians who have self respect than all of the medals won by the cheaters.
In sports, as in most other aspects of international relations, the Russians have decided to go rogue and dare the rest of the world to call them on it. Of course some "innocent" athletes will suffer, but how many Russian 'innocent" Russian athletes have been forced to cheat, taking drugs that may harm their health and shorten their lives? This rogue athletic regime must be brought to heel.
1
The Olympics were instituted as a way for people to compete as individuals but it has become a competition between governments and nations, instead. During the long Cold War, performance in the Olympics was an instrument of propaganda between the political adversaries. When the U.S. pulled out of the Olympics held in the U.S.S.R. because the U.S.S.R. had invaded Afghanistan, it was an indication that the Olympics no longer was a competition of athletes across the planet but a competition between governments across the planet.
Even before I became a Buddhist I always valued honesty and integrity. It seems that the majority of human beings, however, dont really care about honesty; so many just want to get ahead, at any cost, even to their teammates around the world. The Russians are a disgrace, plain and simple, and they are a wart on the Olympics themselves, past, present, and future.
3
Sadly this event is dying a slow death. Used to be wonderful watching amateur athletes compete but it turned the corner when it became a venue for professionals to ply their trade. I don't want to see a dream team compete. There is no entertainment value in watching some large country crush some small underfunded country in basketball, soccer, baseball etc. Give each country a fixed amount according to number of competitors. Dont let people represent a country they don't live in more than 6 months a year. Go back to amateur competitions and rotate the event to each continent every 4 years at a fixed site and the incentive to juice will be reduced, costs will be moderated and ethical behavior may change.
1
There are athletic competitions, and then there are technology competitions. I have no problem with either, but let us not confuse the two. Drugs, as well as composite tennis rackets, golf clubs, and baseball bats belong in the latter category. Myself, I prefer athletic competition but, hey, if you like tech competitions, go for it. Just keep it out of the realm of athletics.
Meanwhile, with professional, corporate sports, including the Olympics, it is quite simple: follow the money. Which country gets the Olympics or the World Cup, which cities N.F.L. teams move to, post facto suspension of Draymond Green, Ichiro "passing" Pete Rose in hits, what public money is used to build stadiums for private teams, etc., these are all largely a function of sports corporations, politicians, TV stations, and developers all juggling image and big bucks, as well as cutting corners for their own financial ends, including bribes, doping, selective rule enforcement, and anything else at hand. In this case, the Russians are temporarily being tossed overboard to keep the boat from sinking under the weight of bad publicity. After all, they are not being punished for doping but for organizational incompetency i.e. getting caught at it.
A high school in Texas is building a $63 million stadium. At that price the athletes, parents, coaches, administrators, and general community fully intend to win, honesty, fairness, and the welfare of the athletes be damned, a "role model" for future athletes.
Meanwhile, with professional, corporate sports, including the Olympics, it is quite simple: follow the money. Which country gets the Olympics or the World Cup, which cities N.F.L. teams move to, post facto suspension of Draymond Green, Ichiro "passing" Pete Rose in hits, what public money is used to build stadiums for private teams, etc., these are all largely a function of sports corporations, politicians, TV stations, and developers all juggling image and big bucks, as well as cutting corners for their own financial ends, including bribes, doping, selective rule enforcement, and anything else at hand. In this case, the Russians are temporarily being tossed overboard to keep the boat from sinking under the weight of bad publicity. After all, they are not being punished for doping but for organizational incompetency i.e. getting caught at it.
A high school in Texas is building a $63 million stadium. At that price the athletes, parents, coaches, administrators, and general community fully intend to win, honesty, fairness, and the welfare of the athletes be damned, a "role model" for future athletes.
3
Somehow most commentators have missed the point that this was a Russian State sponsored program in which the government forced the athletes to take the drugs, then swapped out their urine for other peoples'. The women involved in the program ratted the government out. How can you (so many of you) blame the athletes? They gave up their own chances to compete in order to stop the practice, and should be commended, not excoriated like this.
4
Thank you for restoring a smatter of dignity to the sport. Of course, Russia's next line will be the Lance Armstrong defense--everyone else is doing it, so why pick on us. The Russians are cunning but in the brave new internet world, the wolves get spotted and counted much faster than ever before. They don't understand, much less appreciate the collateral damage they are inflicting by systematically cheating the other athletes of the world with their heavy-handed theivery.
4
Good, at last some justice. My daughter came in fourth in a marathon behind three Russian women, they came in 1, 2, and 3. It was an obvious doping scam. What's the downside? It never stops as long as athletes use drug to make them better than they are. My daughter ran her heart out and may have won had three doped females from Russia been tested and found out. Lots of doping went on and this was an obvious example. So, the Russian ministry says: "Not true!" Yes, we have had cases, etc. etc. What a farce. Why can't they say, "Yes, we doped our athletes, we withdraw because what competes is not a natural drug free athlete, but a drugged manipulation of sport. That is the outrage, & I hope they are banned now and be put through a gristmill of tests forevermore since the moment gristmill testing ceases, this gang of outlaws will be right back to the same behavior, for what? National prestige based on a lie? How sick is that. My son wanted to be a pro-cyclist but unfortunately he was racing in Madrid when Lance Armstrong was playing his corrupt and cruel game and getting accolades, money, fame & all of it a lie. Ban such creatures for life, they'll never change but if they do they'll be sorry examples of athleticism, and play the sour grapes card. No sympathy but the real culprits is the Russian government who will do anything to look better than they'll ever be, lest of course they drink less vodka, eat real food, get good sleep and live like healthy animals in thought & manner
2
I read so many nasty comments about the olympics and sports! First, people are not cheating more today than they were in the past. There have been cheating scandals in every era. Second, the olympics are not some evil conspiracy by the 1% to enrich themselves. They can do that quite easily without the Olympics. NY Times readers really seem to be such a bunch of grumps!
5
What are the TV ratings for the summer (and winter) Olympics? Who can remember who won what event and what medal he or she won?
How much of our federal, state, and local taxes go into the construction, advertising, and other costs?
The fact that the upcoming games are in Rio where ingesting several teaspoons of the bay water where sailing competitions are held leads to severe viral and bacterial infections.
The country is conducting a presidential impeachment during the games.
The road leading into the Olympic Village is still unpaved.
The housing for athletes is only 50% completed.
What a joke.
The Olympics are purchased by governments who want to showcase how modern they are. The rest is just lip service to the nobility of athletics.
Bag it.
How much of our federal, state, and local taxes go into the construction, advertising, and other costs?
The fact that the upcoming games are in Rio where ingesting several teaspoons of the bay water where sailing competitions are held leads to severe viral and bacterial infections.
The country is conducting a presidential impeachment during the games.
The road leading into the Olympic Village is still unpaved.
The housing for athletes is only 50% completed.
What a joke.
The Olympics are purchased by governments who want to showcase how modern they are. The rest is just lip service to the nobility of athletics.
Bag it.
4
Why the furor over enhancement by chemical or other modern means? If it is unfairly advantageous to the enhanced, give the unenhanced a handicap or have separate divisions. The current situation is like the war on drugs. Not successful and not likely to be. All this churning and castigating is like a chronic infection, it weakens the entire endeavor and robs people who could feel inspired and elevated of that possibility. We don't need more reasons to feel dirty and hopeless. Imagine banning anyone taller than 5 feet 9 inches from playing basketball because it would be an unfair advantage.
I love sports, but let's not pretend that at the corporate level of the Olympics, FIFA, the NCAA etc. it is run any differently than the corporations of Wall Street.
The Russians are not being punished for doping. They are being punished for organizational incompetency i.e. getting caught at it.
With professional, corporate sports, including the Olympics, it is quite simple: follow the money. Which country gets the Olympics or the World Cup, which cities N.F.L. teams move to, post facto suspension of Draymond Green, Ichiro "passing" Pete Rose in hits, what public money is used to build stadiums for private teams, etc. are all largely a function of sports corporations, politicians, TV stations, and developers all juggling image and big bucks, as well as cutting corners for their own financial ends, including bribes, doping, selective rule enforcement, and anything else at hand. In this case, the Russians are temporarily being tossed overboard to keep the boat from sinking.
I love sports both as a participant and as a fan. However, when high school stadiums costing over $60 million are built -- as recently occurred in Texas -- one can make book that even at the young, allegedly amateur levels, athletes, parents, teachers, coaches, administrators, and the community at large fully intend to win, regardless of the cost to honesty, fairness, and the long-term welfare of the athletes. And those attitudes work their way up and down the athletic food chain.
The Russians are not being punished for doping. They are being punished for organizational incompetency i.e. getting caught at it.
With professional, corporate sports, including the Olympics, it is quite simple: follow the money. Which country gets the Olympics or the World Cup, which cities N.F.L. teams move to, post facto suspension of Draymond Green, Ichiro "passing" Pete Rose in hits, what public money is used to build stadiums for private teams, etc. are all largely a function of sports corporations, politicians, TV stations, and developers all juggling image and big bucks, as well as cutting corners for their own financial ends, including bribes, doping, selective rule enforcement, and anything else at hand. In this case, the Russians are temporarily being tossed overboard to keep the boat from sinking.
I love sports both as a participant and as a fan. However, when high school stadiums costing over $60 million are built -- as recently occurred in Texas -- one can make book that even at the young, allegedly amateur levels, athletes, parents, teachers, coaches, administrators, and the community at large fully intend to win, regardless of the cost to honesty, fairness, and the long-term welfare of the athletes. And those attitudes work their way up and down the athletic food chain.
1
Either they should bar the rich or developed nations from the Olympics so only the poor nations can participate, not because they're honest but because they can't afford doping or they should change the name from Olympics to Pharmalympics.
6
Rarely are athletes in poor countries from the poor. It takes leisure time to train for the Olympics and poor people never have leisure time in poor countries.
Frankly, I"m too tired right now to calculate the percentage of rich vs. poor nations participating - but if you look at this list you'll see that MOST of the participating nations are poor. Third world, many of them, and still manage to support athletes. Many of whom do not use drugs (that we know of.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Summer_Olympics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Summer_Olympics
This is some dumb. Beyond. Now we'll for sure go back and forth, the old revenge tactics. She said, she said.
Go for performance enhancing drugs, who really cares? Soon we'll have genetically designed humans for the Olympics, what next, ban all humans?
If we can invent a drug that can improve performance, why not? That sounds like science we should ALL be looking at.
Go for performance enhancing drugs, who really cares? Soon we'll have genetically designed humans for the Olympics, what next, ban all humans?
If we can invent a drug that can improve performance, why not? That sounds like science we should ALL be looking at.
3
These Russians can't play fair and clean at all, look Maria Sharapova, top paying athlete, can't help herself, had to take drugs.
Performance enhancing drugs have been pervasive since the 1970s. In the early years they had no tests in which to catch cheaters. As time went on the tests improved greatly. As a result more are caught. For the past number of years they have been keeping samples which may later be tested, in some cases many years later.
Track and Field has always been stricter than other sports. The penalties are more severe as well. Certain countries do a better job than others when it comes to testing. It's the nature of things. I enjoy watching track and field as much as I ever did.
Track and Field has always been stricter than other sports. The penalties are more severe as well. Certain countries do a better job than others when it comes to testing. It's the nature of things. I enjoy watching track and field as much as I ever did.
4
I was done with the Olympics before the doping. Endless commercialization killed it for me. Please cancel them indefinitely.
20
The attitude that 'they all do it' is cynical. This was not a case of individual athletes working with 'medical experts' to beat the tests, as was the case of cycling. In information the whistelblowers brought forward indicated that the entire Russian sports system from the national level down was involved in doping selected athletes. This top down effort apparently involved not only the 'watchdogs' in Russia, but the sports federations themselves. It was also reported that the nation's intelligence agencies were involved as well. To top it off, when the scandal broke, of the three officials most directly involved, one fled the country and the two that didn't died under suspecious circumstances. This goes beyond your run of the mill doping scandal and harkens back to the days of state sponsored doping in the communist block.
20
Thank goodness for Sebastian Coe, probably the only honest person ever to be in charge of the IAAF. Bravo, sir!
If, and only if, Russia's track and field team is banned from the Olympics is there even the slightest chance that the Russian athletes and the Russian sports federation will be chastened enough to think twice about cheating and lying their way to the medal stand in the future. So far however, it looks like the Russians haven't shown any real remorse for their breathtaking doping transgressions. (Gee, what a surprise, with that vile thug Putin at the top of their heap.)
Now we need to demand that the Russian medal winners be stripped of their ill-gotten medals. That is just as important as banning the current Russian track and field team from Rio in terms of deterrence.
One more thing: given the Russians' IAAF scandal, does anyone really think the rest of their Olympic team isn't guilty of doping? The IOC needs to do a top-to-bottom examination of doping by the Russian Olympic team. And while we're at it, the IOC should do a top-to-bottom examination of every single Olympic team that's had any of its members found guilty of doping. If the IOC can't clean this up, then I sure as heck see no justification for any future Olympic Games.
If, and only if, Russia's track and field team is banned from the Olympics is there even the slightest chance that the Russian athletes and the Russian sports federation will be chastened enough to think twice about cheating and lying their way to the medal stand in the future. So far however, it looks like the Russians haven't shown any real remorse for their breathtaking doping transgressions. (Gee, what a surprise, with that vile thug Putin at the top of their heap.)
Now we need to demand that the Russian medal winners be stripped of their ill-gotten medals. That is just as important as banning the current Russian track and field team from Rio in terms of deterrence.
One more thing: given the Russians' IAAF scandal, does anyone really think the rest of their Olympic team isn't guilty of doping? The IOC needs to do a top-to-bottom examination of doping by the Russian Olympic team. And while we're at it, the IOC should do a top-to-bottom examination of every single Olympic team that's had any of its members found guilty of doping. If the IOC can't clean this up, then I sure as heck see no justification for any future Olympic Games.
12
Let's hope Stepanova gets to compete. Whistleblowers need to be supported, not punished.
4
Funny how we should point the finger at Russia when we are the country which promotes football with 300 lbs athletes, athletes that have never been tested for steroids (that's one Pandora's box no one wants to open), we are the country of Lance Armstrong, we are the country of baseball (steroids anyone?) - as long as there are competitions, people will find ways to cheat, gain an edge, outmaneuver the adversary - banning Russia will only punish those athletes who have nothing to do with this scandal - let's do better testing instead, and not make the issue political
4
lose the national flags and the suits, judge the athletes one by one...and let them control the games (tennis associations a better model).
3
I recently read the mafia helped the pro golfers break away form their corrupted handlers to profit better from their own mishandling. Russel Bufalino's cousin William was their rep until they found a less obvious case cracker to take cover for them.
Cheating in sports is one thing but perhaps more serious is that it is indicative of Russian MO in politics, business and war. There is this idea that you can hear and bluster your way out of everything, as we could see by Putin's denial that Russia had anything to do with the occupation of Crimea or invasion of East Ukraine. Or bombing of Syrian hospitals.
Russia has, in essence, become a rogue state. The sooner the world realizes this, the better.
Russia has, in essence, become a rogue state. The sooner the world realizes this, the better.
17
Anyone who believes that International politics between the U.S. and Russia has no bearing on the 2016 Olympics (Ukraine and Crimea, Syria) is also a doper.
7
Paul, that's a pretty craven statement. You don't even remotely suggest exactly what "bearing" you think politics has on this result, much less do you offer any kind of evidence that you are correct. Russia's athletes either did or didn't take illegal drugs to get an unfair advantage over their rivals. They did, the facts are clear. So they deserve punishment. Are you suggesting that one can't punish any murderer until ever single other murderer has also been caught and punished, and that until then any murder prosecution is "political"? That would simply be anarchy, and only a criminal could endorse such a position.
2
This is a farce. Hopefully the Russians withdraw the entire Russian contingent and other countries follow in suit. Why bother viewing when the competition has been wiped out in one fell swipe. There has to be a monetary reason behind this. Why do something like this if this act cannot be monetized.
2
I hope the rest of the Russian team withdraws also. Most likely they are involved in cheating too. I seriously doubt that the Russian sports ministry is only helping the track and field athletes' cheat.
9
The Olympics exist because of $$. They are all about $$. Sports are an excuse to make $$.
2
Unfortunately, cheating is ALWAYS rampant in sports in every possible way. And it's at every level. I remember playing in an after-work softball league...a team from a law firm (or a justice dept group--I forgot). They spent the ENTIRE game griping about pitches being too hard to hit, and wanted ALL the rules relaxed for their team. But when one of our base runners stepped 6 inches out of the base line, they DEMANDED he be called out...One set of lax rules for their, another strict set for ours.
Is it any wonder people cheat at games at every level, up to one of the greatest quarterbacks, cyclists, baseball players, and official government sports organizations?
I'm sorry for the individual Russian athletes. They may or may not have known, but I doubt they had much choice. But when an organized system of drugging, complete with planned ways to defeat tests, is it any different than Volkswagen writing software that allows engines to beat pollution tests while still illegally polluting in real life? When people in power cheat the consequences impact the entire organization. The Russian sports federation knowingly cheated. Now the poor athletes must pay the price.
Is it any wonder people cheat at games at every level, up to one of the greatest quarterbacks, cyclists, baseball players, and official government sports organizations?
I'm sorry for the individual Russian athletes. They may or may not have known, but I doubt they had much choice. But when an organized system of drugging, complete with planned ways to defeat tests, is it any different than Volkswagen writing software that allows engines to beat pollution tests while still illegally polluting in real life? When people in power cheat the consequences impact the entire organization. The Russian sports federation knowingly cheated. Now the poor athletes must pay the price.
4
When my kid was in 6th grade, parents conspired to change scoring sheets, during the game! Ethics and morality are at question here. for all of us, in everything we do.
1
I'm only interested in the tennis..that said, Sharapova should be banned from playing too.
3
Many of the comments reflect a nostalgic longing for the restoration of amateurism in the Olympic Games, as if amateurism would somehow restore a sense of purity. Well, the Olympics bid farewell to amateurism in 1992, when NBA professionals were allowed to compete. Why were they allowed to compete? Was it because the USA could not send its best players to play against teams that had caught up with them in skill and ability? No, it was because other national teams could not send their best players as many of them were playing in the NBA! In 1992 professional track and field athlete competed in the Olympic Games. These were not a different bunch of athletes who had been prohibited from participating in previous OGs, but the same ones, who had been competing for decades; de facto professionals, receiving hundreds of thousands of dollars under the table. In the amateur era, athletes from the West competed at a great disadvantage against their Eastern counterparts. The USSR and its satellites, namely the GDR, fielded teams of athletes supported by state resources. Athletes representing the USA, unless still in college, had to hold down real jobs, which left little time for the training required to compete at the world class level. Restoring amateurism would not solve the current doping problem, as it resembles the state sponsored doping conducted by the GDR under the amateur regime. Doping has nothing to do being an amateur or a professional but only a desire to win at all costs.
4
Why stop at "Can we just cancel this olympics already?"
Let's cancel ALL organized pro-sports, college sports and any sports that's featured on TV so we can end this billionaire control enterprise. Most stadiums are build on tax payers back to support billionaire! Enough!
Let's cancel ALL organized pro-sports, college sports and any sports that's featured on TV so we can end this billionaire control enterprise. Most stadiums are build on tax payers back to support billionaire! Enough!
11
Athletes put their life to one day be in the Olympics. The whole Russian team shouldn't be paying for the faults of a few athletes. How is that fair? It is like banning the US because of Armstrong's case and claiming the the whole American Athletic federation should pay for it. Those who came to be clean should be allowed, those who were caught using doping should be banned for years. That's the right thing to do. I am an ex-tennis player and I would just die inside if I had to pay for something stupid like this if I had nothing to do with it.
You can't crash law abiding athletes who love what they do just to Russia pays, because most people think that the whole country should pay. It is not diplomatic and it isn't right. You want to teach Russians a lesson? Deserve to give that lesson first.
You can't crash law abiding athletes who love what they do just to Russia pays, because most people think that the whole country should pay. It is not diplomatic and it isn't right. You want to teach Russians a lesson? Deserve to give that lesson first.
4
These are only the ones who have been caught. There are others who haven't.
1
The Olympics has long felt more like a cold war than a global goodwill sports competition. The medal count boasting for each country often overshadows the magnificence of the individual athlete(s) & the competition. Lone athletes cheating in any sport is nothing new but when a government enables this cheating, it's time to reassess the meaning of the Olympics, re-calibrate & possibly even retreat altogether from this global competition. Politics, scandal and big money have long tainted the very organization overseeing the Olympics.
The vast majority of Olympics-caliber athletes devote their hearts, souls & bodies training to be the best in their sport, not to mention the enormous sacrifices made in their respective lives in the time taken away from friends, family members and a life outside their sport. It's heartbreaking to see this passion. devotion and honesty lose to dishonest cheats. Sports competitions everywhere, not just the Olympics, will always be one step behind the latest advances in performance enhancing drugs. While the discovery of performance enhancing drugs in athletic competitors alone is certainly not justification to eliminate the competitions, the penalties for the offenders and their enablers must be stricter. For example, an enforced ban of an entire country's participation across all sports in the next Olympics competition might be the sort of deterrent needed to discourage most Olympic athletes from taking any performance enhancing drugs.
The vast majority of Olympics-caliber athletes devote their hearts, souls & bodies training to be the best in their sport, not to mention the enormous sacrifices made in their respective lives in the time taken away from friends, family members and a life outside their sport. It's heartbreaking to see this passion. devotion and honesty lose to dishonest cheats. Sports competitions everywhere, not just the Olympics, will always be one step behind the latest advances in performance enhancing drugs. While the discovery of performance enhancing drugs in athletic competitors alone is certainly not justification to eliminate the competitions, the penalties for the offenders and their enablers must be stricter. For example, an enforced ban of an entire country's participation across all sports in the next Olympics competition might be the sort of deterrent needed to discourage most Olympic athletes from taking any performance enhancing drugs.
6
These are extraordinarily dark days for Russian sport. First Maria Sharapova, Russia's highest-profile athlete, is banned for two years for doping, and now the entire Russian track team. It's clear that Russia is guilty of systematic cheating and that many clean athletes have had their dreams stolen from them by these cheating Russians. And it is equally clear that this is state-sponsored cheating, designed to generate false national glory. It is one of the greatest outrages in the history of sports, and the authorities are to be commended for, at long last, taking decisive action to punish it.
20
Well done, but I sure hope this wasn't just an expression political disapproval. Turn up the heat on all suspect athletes. And be consistent.
2
Corruption is EVERYWHERE in modern human un-civilization. And isn't going to revert to any sense of fairness until we four, current generations are dead and gone.
Sorry to spoil everyone's delusional state. But just look around your life and recognize the cruelty among us. There's no hiding from it anymore.
I'm imagining the innovative stone-cutter Neanderthal who pulled the first arrow intended for hunting game from his backside, a "Why me?" glare upon his errant fellow sportsman - Dick C, the 1st - and realizing, "Oops, yourself!!! ...'wish I didn't know now what I hadn't considered then'." And so it began.
Resigned to fate, please join me, collectively, in Howard Beale's second verse refrain (it's in the Director's Cut): "I wish I didn't know now..." LOUDER!!!
Sorry to spoil everyone's delusional state. But just look around your life and recognize the cruelty among us. There's no hiding from it anymore.
I'm imagining the innovative stone-cutter Neanderthal who pulled the first arrow intended for hunting game from his backside, a "Why me?" glare upon his errant fellow sportsman - Dick C, the 1st - and realizing, "Oops, yourself!!! ...'wish I didn't know now what I hadn't considered then'." And so it began.
Resigned to fate, please join me, collectively, in Howard Beale's second verse refrain (it's in the Director's Cut): "I wish I didn't know now..." LOUDER!!!
2
To think only the Russians are doping is hilarious. This is just a witch hunt. Dont get how their track team get cut but not their lifting team...Testing should be done within 30 minutes of before and after an event at the very least. They all avoid testers throughout the year.
3
If Trump was President, this would not happen. He would be sure Russia is in the games and that all athletes have equal access to enhancing preforming drugs.
12
Only their track and field team?
7
Cancel the summer Olympics. Give things time to rest. Let cool heads think long and hard to devise a way to keep drug-using athletes out of the games. What we have in place now is not working.
3
Next to tobacco lobbyists (Gold medal) and climate deniers (Silver medal) Russia is undoubtedly a Bronze medalist in triangulating and dissembling information (who shot Buk at MH-17, Litvinenko poisoning).
It will be interesting to see the streams of information/disinformation Russia responds with if the IOC bans them.
Still, they are correct that the Olympics are diminished by this, and it invites us all to take a look at our own obsession for winning at any cost. Perhaps Lance Armstrong can comment?
It will be interesting to see the streams of information/disinformation Russia responds with if the IOC bans them.
Still, they are correct that the Olympics are diminished by this, and it invites us all to take a look at our own obsession for winning at any cost. Perhaps Lance Armstrong can comment?
6
It would be easier to applaud this decision if the organization in charge (IAAF) hadn't been led until recently by a kleptocrat (Lamine Diack), who with his son took large sums of money to hush up Russia's widespread doping program. Sebastian Coe, the current IAAF head, claims he knew nothing about the endemic corruption, though Coe did once praise Diack as his "spiritual" advisor.
4
Drugged athletes who ruin the reputation of honest ones, corrupt state athletic programs, money changing hands under the table, the site country in political and ecological ruin. What else could you add? actually, plenty.
6
These people must be suffering from some serious confidence/identity issues if in this day and age they feel the need to dope their national teams. Somebody needs to tell them what my grandmother used to tell me- "It's not whether you win or lose- it's how well you play the game."
5
".. and have fun at it" :)
2
I don't recall the last time the Olympics (or the IOC) wasn't shrouded in scandal. It seems the notion of what the Olympics originally signified and exemplified has been lost and forgotten forever. That's the real tragedy.
10
Right, pick two permanent sites for the Olympics and upgrade them, when necessary, paid for by all participating countries. Knock off the bribery and financial hardship that often accompanies the Olympic bidding process.
6
Is the "Olympics" even pertinent any more? I don't know anybody that ever watches the "Olympics."
5
This will not be the first time. They deserve it. There is no excuse and the athletes themselves should be ashamed. You can't plead ignorance. Russia is not the victim here.
6
My pick-up soccer game on Sunday is probably the best, most true sporting event going these days.
6
This action will encourage governments to cover up and punish whistle blowers even more. Ironic the Russians cannot compete, yet, the committee chose a country rampant with corruption to host the event.
6
Finally.
These people have been abusing athletes for decades. Finally. Their entire team should be barred from the Olympics.
These people have been abusing athletes for decades. Finally. Their entire team should be barred from the Olympics.
10
There is no hope when a nation and its people decide that cheating is an acceptable means to victory. When a nation loses its pride, integrity, shame and a genuine commitment to fair play, it is no longer a nation in itself but a mirage that does not exist. For me as well as for others, I'm sure, we will never feel comfortable when and where a Russian wins any event in the future. Their decision and bad reputation has brought this upon themselves.
6
It's simple: ban all professionals again. Limit how much a country can spend on its teams. Bar them all from doing endorsements.
Oh, well. Never going to happen.
Oh, well. Never going to happen.
5
A disgrace to the US and the Olympics.
You cant really say youre the best if you haven't beaten the best.
So all the winners at this Olympics will never know.
And if we are real honest Americans cheat too...just ask Lance.
You cant really say youre the best if you haven't beaten the best.
So all the winners at this Olympics will never know.
And if we are real honest Americans cheat too...just ask Lance.
4
"Lance" has been stripped of all his Tour de France victories and banned from the sport, hasn't he? He's in lifelong disgrace in his own country, isn't he? He didn't dope with the top-down approval and participation of the US government and sports authorities, did he?
Anyway, it's not the USA banning the Russian track and field team, which we couldn't even do, it is (belatedly) the international authority for that sport, through delegates from a number of countries, and an English boss.
Anyway, it's not the USA banning the Russian track and field team, which we couldn't even do, it is (belatedly) the international authority for that sport, through delegates from a number of countries, and an English boss.
1
Would it not be fair, if feasible, to rescind the Russian Sochi awards and issue them to their rightful competitors?
8
Name one medal winning athlete who was caught (not hearsay)cheating in Sochi and was not punished..Please!
According to an NPR story, at Sochi tamper-proof containers were opened and urine samples from Russian athletes were switched. This allowed cheaters who otherwise would have been caught to walk away with medals and, of course, let Russia win the overall medal count. How the determination of cheating can be made now is beyond my competence to say. That is why I used the words if feasible.
1
I think it is inappropriate to bar Russian athletes from the Olympics who have not tested positive for doping. While it is clear that there was a concerted effort on the part of Russian athletic officials to promote and hide large scale doping, it is unfair to ban individual athletes who have not tested positive and may not ever have been involved in taking banned substances. I think the appropriate action is to bar Russian participation as a team, but to allow individual Russian athletes to participate.
6
I actually don't understand the logic. The Russians are not in charge of the drug testing in Rio. Is the idea that the Rio testing won't be able to detect their cheating? If not why suppose it will detect the cheating of athletes from other countries? And if the Rio testing is sufficient to detect the cheating what's the problem? Why ban the Russians beforehand except to make a political point by pretending one is doing something for sport?
4
in a word, consequences.
the uncovered blatant cheating that occurred with governmental acquiescence, encouragement and even culpable involvement demanded a harsh response.
it warrants a demand for complete transparency into russian athletics before allowing the return of their athletes to international competition.
the uncovered blatant cheating that occurred with governmental acquiescence, encouragement and even culpable involvement demanded a harsh response.
it warrants a demand for complete transparency into russian athletics before allowing the return of their athletes to international competition.
4
Abo, the ban is for past bad deeds. There is a word for that: punishment.
2
I'm trying to imagine the Olympics with individual people competing, and countries not in the picture. How does it really matter where an athlete is from?
2
Coe colluded with one 'Pappa' Massata to secure African 'votes' for his current position at IAAF. 'Pappa' is now on the run from Interpol. FIFA, IAAF, IOC--all crooked as the old hound dog's leg. In the world of international sports, the only winner is greed. Every time.
4
I wonder about the outraged indignation coming from so many countries. My guess is that nobody is squeaky clean - certainly not the United States. Remember Lance Armstrong? Remember Marion Jones? Not to cast aspersions on those who are competing on natural talent enhanced by legitimate training and healthy diet, but how many of the athletes who remain competitive with those who use steroids or some form of doping can actually keep up without resorting to those same tactics?
2
Remember the Press "sisters?" Remember the East German women swimmers in 1976? Remember the Nazis using a male as a female high jumper in 1936? If you don't, spare us your thoughts.
3
"nobody" is a very large number cathleen
1
The modern Olympics started out as competition among amateur athletes who loved the sport and played for the thrill of competition. Although cheating is nothing new, read "The Boys in the Boat," to find out how much Hitler and the Nazis cheated to try, unsuccessfully, to keep the American crew team from winning. Now, though, there is so much wealth and petty nationalism tainting the games, they've become little more than larger versions of the common cheating we see at Little League games, and in college and professional sports where winning at all costs is the only thing that is encouraged, where cheating is made into a joke (deflation gate?) and sportsmanship or love of the game are not just a distant memory, it's irrelevant.
12
It is certainly unfortunate that some clean Russian athletes will not be able to compete. Russian pole vaulter Yelena Isinbayeva recently wrote a NYT op-ed arguing that since she was clean, she should be allowed to compete. But how do we know that she's clean? Are we to take her word for it? She claimed that she'd been tested repeatedly "over the course of nearly 20 years of competition," but Rodchenkov showed that you could pass those tests by stopping taking drugs before each competition. Therefore, we need out-of-competition testing to verify that athletes are clean. Unfortunately, many of Russian athletes' out-of-competition tests are conducted by RUSADA, which we know can't be trusted. It's perhaps unfortunate that international bodies like the IOC and WADA have largely left drug-testing to national authorities, but that's the current system, for better or worse. If we can't trust a national anti-doping authority, then we can't necessarily trust its athletes.
8
This is called jumping the gun.
1
This is a step in the right direction, although I'm concerned about the loopholes mentioned for "clean" Russian athletes. It is impossible for me to believe that, at the very least, every Russian athlete was not aware of the huge, offical, coordinated doping program in Russia. They they said nothing hardly exonerates them. We will now be subjected to special pleading--and crocodile tears--from many Russian athletes, like the statements recently published in the Times (with no comments allowed, for some reason).
Sorry, but if you choose to compete for a corrupt regime, you accept the consequences.
Sorry, but if you choose to compete for a corrupt regime, you accept the consequences.
3
Since it is apparently government supported, then it taints all their athletes because of the obvious pressure to go along. My heart goes out to all of those dedicated and talented Russian track stars who have spent years preparing for this, only to be sunk by a corrupt government athletic organization. It affects everyone who watches the Olympics; the Russians will be sorely missed.
5
Jeez, finally, real penalties.
Unfortunately even if the CAS allows the ban to stand I believe the IOC will overturn it. The IOC head is a friend of Putin.
This long ago left the arena of sport and entered the political arena.
Unfortunately even if the CAS allows the ban to stand I believe the IOC will overturn it. The IOC head is a friend of Putin.
This long ago left the arena of sport and entered the political arena.
5
The Olympics haven't been about fair amateur competition in decades. It's an IOC and corporate money grab that puts tremendous financial burdens on the host country and from which most of them will never recover (see Greece). The introduction of professional athletes has made things even worse. It's time to ditch this mess and stop pretending that there's a noble purpose here - because there isn't.
4
Keeping Russia out of the Rio Olympics sounds to me like rewarding them. By denying them the opportunity to swim in raw sewage are they really being punished? I know the Russian athletes must have mixed emotions, but I doubt that their mothers do.
5
It is not that the Russians just cheat - it is the astounding brazenness with which they cheat. This brazenness extends FAR beyond Track and Field. Almost certainly it covers ANY and ALL kinds of sports where doping will help.
Maria Sharapova anyone?
If there is the slightest possibility that doping will help, Russians will adopt it. They will also enforce it ANY way they can and as the article pointed out,
"... testing authorities from the United Kingdom, in collecting urine samples, had been threatened by members of Russia’s Federal Security Service..."
Actually this whole sad episode is reflective of Russian society in general. Whether it is Russian soccer fan behaviors (and English is no slouch here) in France or Russian tourists in Asia (this commentator happens to have bad experiences) or even in politics (such as annexation of Crimea), Russians seems to be considered as thugs and bullies.
The ONLY things they seemingly understand are STRONG response and retribution.
Maria Sharapova anyone?
If there is the slightest possibility that doping will help, Russians will adopt it. They will also enforce it ANY way they can and as the article pointed out,
"... testing authorities from the United Kingdom, in collecting urine samples, had been threatened by members of Russia’s Federal Security Service..."
Actually this whole sad episode is reflective of Russian society in general. Whether it is Russian soccer fan behaviors (and English is no slouch here) in France or Russian tourists in Asia (this commentator happens to have bad experiences) or even in politics (such as annexation of Crimea), Russians seems to be considered as thugs and bullies.
The ONLY things they seemingly understand are STRONG response and retribution.
6
Fear not sport's fans V Putin has confirmed that he will compete in all Track & Field events for Mother Russia!
We can all sleep well tonight...
We can all sleep well tonight...
5
For those who have been following what has been happening with WADA and IAAF, know that Kenya has going through a doping scandal similar to Russia's, but they instead sort to make real changes that had an impact, not wasting time on rhetoric and bullying officials and now these changes have been approved by WADA. If a small country like Kenya, and lets not forget Kenya is a powerhouse in the distance races, so they have just as much to lose as Russia, why couldn't a powerful "first world" country to the same thing.
4
I agree with the comments about the whole Olympic movement being devalued
Time for Olympics 2.0. Smaller, with drug-free testing
Time for Olympics 2.0. Smaller, with drug-free testing
We have Putin's crack down on dissidents, "Russian volunteers" invading Eastern Ukraine, Russian "ultras" attacking English soccer fans in France, and Russian state sponsored doping in sports and the Olympic Games, the thuggish KGB mentality of Putin seems to be permeating Russian sport. A ban from international sports competition for Russia. in all sports for a significant period of time, is appropriate. The ban should not be for a specific time period, but tied to it's reversal of thuggish behavior in all categories.
7
It's bad enough that Russia's track and field team is being barred from the 2016 Summer Olympics, however, what I truly find sad and more disturbing is that it appears so professional sports have had one or more members involved in or suspicion of doping or other illegal drugs. Since when has doping become the new norm and why is the notion of doping embraced by teammates until caught? This overall issue is the bigger disappointment and problem across the entire sports board. It's gotten to the point of whenever an athlete's performance is outstanding, the first question that comes to mind is "was that performance pure or enhanced?"
2
Everyone cheats. However, there are degrees of fraud, and what the Russians did is, if not unique in word history, certainly noteworthy for its nefariousness.
Hopefully they learn a lesson from this.
Hopefully they learn a lesson from this.
4
I am against Russians being excluded.
Excluding Russia diminishes the Olympics to the point of being irrelevant.
Moreover, the dope-testing policy makes no sense with respect to the major international events. Rather than being tested at the events, athletes, who wish to compete at those levels, should be randomly tested while in training, with the testing personnel should be randomly assigned, etc. The reality is that everyone knows how to properly test for doping to ensure compliance. Why they don't is anyone's guess.
Excluding Russia diminishes the Olympics to the point of being irrelevant.
Moreover, the dope-testing policy makes no sense with respect to the major international events. Rather than being tested at the events, athletes, who wish to compete at those levels, should be randomly tested while in training, with the testing personnel should be randomly assigned, etc. The reality is that everyone knows how to properly test for doping to ensure compliance. Why they don't is anyone's guess.
1
I will watch paint dry instead of the Olympics. At least you will know there is no cheating.
5
While I understand that IAAF only has jurisdiction over track and field, the ban should be extended to all Russian athletes. The cheating of an individual athlete bans the athlete, the cheating sponsored by a specific sport federation should ban all athletes in the sport. However, when the cheating is state sponsored, than all athletes for that country should be banned. The IOC should extend the IAAF ruling to all Russian athletes and revoke all Sochi Olympic medals from Russian athletes, regardless of the athlete's individual involvement in cheating.
4
This is well deserved punishment. It sends a strong signal to other countries and athletes that cheating will not be tolerated.
7
OUTASTANDING. These CHEATS have been allowed to get away with it for far too long.
3
This is not just any anti-doping ruling, it will be taken as a national affront by Vladimir Putin & Co. Yes, the Olympics are susceptible to onslaughts of jingoism, but sports jingoism in Russia is state sponsored and an arm of the national propaganda machine.
I would advise Lord Coe not to take tea in the company of fake-friendly Russian emissaries and I don't say that in jest.
To those of you who say let the "clean" Russian athletes compete, you are naive softies. Remember that Lance Armstong never tested positive, that most known dopers also didn't, and that it was only when cycling, for example, switched to the biological passport that the UCI became able to detect anomalies pointing to doping, even when the urine sample was void of residuals.
I recently served as an anti-doping volunteer at the IAAF World Indoor Championships in Portland. An individual in the know, responsible for coordinating the logistics of anti-doping at the Sochi games, regaled us with a tale about how the Russians would not allow for testing at the mountainside venue, necessitating the need to hire and trick out an anti-doping trailer to ferry the athletes down to sea level for the medals ceremonies, watched over by anti-doping "volunteers" who were also members of the military, read foxes guarding the hen house.
Who knows what went on between the end of the event and the beginning of the ceremony, and as it turns out, documented skullduggery also occurred at the lab in the dark of night.
I would advise Lord Coe not to take tea in the company of fake-friendly Russian emissaries and I don't say that in jest.
To those of you who say let the "clean" Russian athletes compete, you are naive softies. Remember that Lance Armstong never tested positive, that most known dopers also didn't, and that it was only when cycling, for example, switched to the biological passport that the UCI became able to detect anomalies pointing to doping, even when the urine sample was void of residuals.
I recently served as an anti-doping volunteer at the IAAF World Indoor Championships in Portland. An individual in the know, responsible for coordinating the logistics of anti-doping at the Sochi games, regaled us with a tale about how the Russians would not allow for testing at the mountainside venue, necessitating the need to hire and trick out an anti-doping trailer to ferry the athletes down to sea level for the medals ceremonies, watched over by anti-doping "volunteers" who were also members of the military, read foxes guarding the hen house.
Who knows what went on between the end of the event and the beginning of the ceremony, and as it turns out, documented skullduggery also occurred at the lab in the dark of night.
4
The Olympics lost their glamour long ago, tarnished by politics and drugs. The last truly beautiful Olympics was in Lillehammer where the Norwegians cheered every athlete regardless of color, creed, nationality.
5
So many of these comments show a basic lack of knowledge about this issue.
All countries, including the U.S., have athletes that dope. But only Russia has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt to have a large scale program that encourages if not facilitates the doping. There are now three independent people from the inside who have testified about the wide spread ORGANIZED doping within Russia. Furthermore, in the most recent report from WADA, it was reported that even after the first report in November WADA officials continue to be misled by Russian officials. WADA officials are even prevented - by Russian authorities - from testing athletes who have agreed to the testing protocol.
People who say that the Russian case is like all others are just poorly informed. If you disagree, please provide any credible evidence of organized doping by other countries.
All countries, including the U.S., have athletes that dope. But only Russia has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt to have a large scale program that encourages if not facilitates the doping. There are now three independent people from the inside who have testified about the wide spread ORGANIZED doping within Russia. Furthermore, in the most recent report from WADA, it was reported that even after the first report in November WADA officials continue to be misled by Russian officials. WADA officials are even prevented - by Russian authorities - from testing athletes who have agreed to the testing protocol.
People who say that the Russian case is like all others are just poorly informed. If you disagree, please provide any credible evidence of organized doping by other countries.
20
FIFA, the IOC, etc. all the same.
A bunch of highly paid bureaucrats profiting on athletic competition among nations. Cities and countries seem willing to bankrupt themselves for the chance to "host" the games.
Old Juan Samaranch (former president of the IOC) used to insist on being addressed as "Your Excellency." Then came the Salt Lake City bribery scandal. Nothing has changed. Sepp Blatter and his soccer buddies (FIFA) acted as though he was heaven sent.
The agencies all look the other way—until they can't. We'd all be better off without international competition. Or at least DIS-orgianize it.
A bunch of highly paid bureaucrats profiting on athletic competition among nations. Cities and countries seem willing to bankrupt themselves for the chance to "host" the games.
Old Juan Samaranch (former president of the IOC) used to insist on being addressed as "Your Excellency." Then came the Salt Lake City bribery scandal. Nothing has changed. Sepp Blatter and his soccer buddies (FIFA) acted as though he was heaven sent.
The agencies all look the other way—until they can't. We'd all be better off without international competition. Or at least DIS-orgianize it.
3
Let us hope the IOC has the backbone and integrity to follow through.
5
They'll have to find it before Tuesday.
2
This is a step backward. Why can't the IAAF focus attention on individuals>
I feel badly for the Russian athletes who will be unfairly excluded.
The Russians always make the Olympics more competitive, exciting, and fun; I'd like to see them perform. The 1980 and 1984 Olympic Games were diminished by American and Soviet boycotts respectively. The Rio games will be similarly tainted. Its really unfortunate that such a broad brush approach to excluding cheaters is being taken. Many world class athletes that aren't cheaters will be hurt. It's sad.
I feel badly for the Russian athletes who will be unfairly excluded.
The Russians always make the Olympics more competitive, exciting, and fun; I'd like to see them perform. The 1980 and 1984 Olympic Games were diminished by American and Soviet boycotts respectively. The Rio games will be similarly tainted. Its really unfortunate that such a broad brush approach to excluding cheaters is being taken. Many world class athletes that aren't cheaters will be hurt. It's sad.
1
The Russians and the old Eastern Bloc countries have been cheating by doping in EVERY sport for as least as long as I've been alive (58). Every world record they have set and every gold medal they have ever won in the Olympics are in doubt.
This is widespread state sponsored doping not individual athletes trying to get a leg up.
The Russians have schemed and tried to intimidate the IAAF. Just read the European papers to get a flavour of how unsavoury they have been. So glad they have been kicked out.
This is widespread state sponsored doping not individual athletes trying to get a leg up.
The Russians have schemed and tried to intimidate the IAAF. Just read the European papers to get a flavour of how unsavoury they have been. So glad they have been kicked out.
7
For me, the Olympics has been a farce since around 1980, when politics infested it again. (I wasn't alive in the 40s). This is just another example of why the entire system should be ignored by thinking people everywhere.
Athletes, use your strengths, convictions, and grace under pressure to do some good in this world instead of supporting this corrupt, exploitative system.
Athletes, use your strengths, convictions, and grace under pressure to do some good in this world instead of supporting this corrupt, exploitative system.
3
Even this punishment is a scandal. The evidence of systematic state-sponsored doping also included the Sochi Winter Olympics team. Why single out the track and field athletes when many more sports appears to be involved? The entire Russian Federation team should have been banned from the games. While billed as historic, the punishment is still quite meek.
16
Brace yourselves for a backlash. Russia has sustained a number of hits to its pride in the last couple decades and is like an angry, resentful child. We should assume that the country will lash out somewhere, somehow, in order to try to salve its weak and fragile ego. Hard to know if it will be political, economic, military, or something else.
The fear of a backlash is not a reason to withhold a suspension, but we just need to be aware that it will be coming.
The fear of a backlash is not a reason to withhold a suspension, but we just need to be aware that it will be coming.
18
One of my kids is a D1 track athlete so I'm familiar with the time and effort those kids put into a sport where the differences between winning and finishing down the ranks is razor thin. It's no wonder that the athletes are adamant that the Russians be banned.
Putin has turned Russia into an outlaw country and, for the most part, the Obama administration has allowed it to happen without inflicting a cost. Knowing how much stock Russians place on sports success, perhaps this will promote some change.
Putin has turned Russia into an outlaw country and, for the most part, the Obama administration has allowed it to happen without inflicting a cost. Knowing how much stock Russians place on sports success, perhaps this will promote some change.
3
Stunning. You manage to turn this into Obama's fault. Republicans have truly lost their minds, and the party is falling to pieces because of people like you.
6
The modern Olympics have often served as surrogates for a country's ambitions and self-image.
But economic cheating appears to be happening as well with countries "doping" their regulatory agencies to gain an unfair advantage for their teams or companies. Where is the IAAF to give some penalty to let business teams get an honest showing?
But economic cheating appears to be happening as well with countries "doping" their regulatory agencies to gain an unfair advantage for their teams or companies. Where is the IAAF to give some penalty to let business teams get an honest showing?
Despite all the hoopla and complaining, don't get scared, Russia is used to it; in fact, Russia is the nation that set it all in motion in the hope they might pull it off.
I am surprised Russia is still at it, but they never seem to give up. "Give me vodka enough for the judges, and we'll take our chances.
It's a shame. Some of the Russian athletes are really outstanding. - The Colonel
I am surprised Russia is still at it, but they never seem to give up. "Give me vodka enough for the judges, and we'll take our chances.
It's a shame. Some of the Russian athletes are really outstanding. - The Colonel
Yay and good riddance! Excellent reporting on this issue by the NYT helps lead to a correct outcome! Russian society epitomizes a corrupt and thus inherently cheating system and not confronting this makes a mockery of Olympic ideals of honest and fair international competition. Let's hope other countries that use athletic achievement to propagandize their corrupt systems and societies are similarly called out and banned. If they organize their own Corrupted Games they can explore how much fully doped/chemically assisted athletes outperform clean athletes.
Super job, Rebecca and colleagues!
Super job, Rebecca and colleagues!
4
I'm completely clueless about the biology, and that includes steroids. Why does combining PEDs and liquor make the PEDs harder to detect?
Google it.
1
The Olympics ceased to be what they were intended for when they changed the rules to allow professional athletes to compete. The Olympic now are just the springboard for financial gain or bragging rights for the pros.The financial difference between a gold and silver medal is so enormous that the incentive to cheat is always there. I say change the rules back to only amateurs and continue to strictly enforce the no doping rules.
85
If you recall, the rule change allowing professionals to compete was made to level the playing field for our Olympic teams.
The US was fielding teams of actual amatuers. They were competing against State sponsored teams from other countries. While US team members were prohibited from accepting any compensation, (food, housing, etc.), the State sponsored teams provided all of that to their athletes.
It put the US teams at a serious disadvantage. That was why the decision was made to change the rules.
The rule change may have generated more medals, but nothing could match the thrill of watching true amateurs compete.
That was what made the 1980 Olympics in Lake Placcid so special. The United States hockey team (amateur and college players), defeated the Soviet Union national team, a team that won the gold in six of the seven previous Olympics.
So yes, changing the rules back to “amateurs only” would bring back the thrill of amateur sports; nevertheless, unless all of the teams agree to the definition of what constitutes an amateur athlete, the playing field would once again be tilted against us.
The US was fielding teams of actual amatuers. They were competing against State sponsored teams from other countries. While US team members were prohibited from accepting any compensation, (food, housing, etc.), the State sponsored teams provided all of that to their athletes.
It put the US teams at a serious disadvantage. That was why the decision was made to change the rules.
The rule change may have generated more medals, but nothing could match the thrill of watching true amateurs compete.
That was what made the 1980 Olympics in Lake Placcid so special. The United States hockey team (amateur and college players), defeated the Soviet Union national team, a team that won the gold in six of the seven previous Olympics.
So yes, changing the rules back to “amateurs only” would bring back the thrill of amateur sports; nevertheless, unless all of the teams agree to the definition of what constitutes an amateur athlete, the playing field would once again be tilted against us.
How ironic - the Russian Track and Field Team is barred from traveling to Rio de Janeiro, sparing it from exposure to the toxins endemic to that city's massively compromised environment. Clearly, the most fitting punishment for PED abusers would be to make them compete against each other in Rio, while the rest of the world goes somewhere else.
4
For me, the whole concept of the modern Olympics is not only absurd in today's world, but also an anachronism. It's time we moved beyond political borders in sport for the Olympics. This event is supposed to be about sport, but instead what do we hear but chants that encourage the worst sort of nationalism. I am interested in the best athlete, and don't much care for where they came from. This would also mean a reinvention of the funding model used to encourage talented athletes. It's time this nationalism is removed from sports.
5
Even with all that cheating, the Russians still couldn't beat Usain Bolt.
1
From FIFA to the Olympics the love of money and quest for power has ruined sports beyond all recognition and consequence. The President of Brazil has been impeached and faces a political coup while Vladimir Putin reigns and rules. Who cares?
4
My twisted way of looking at the disaster that sports has become is that the field is leveled out by the extent of the use of steroids.
I ask: If everyone's doing it and we all know about it, is it cheating or something even more insidious?
I ask: If everyone's doing it and we all know about it, is it cheating or something even more insidious?
1
It's about time. Russia (and, formerly, the Soviet Union) has been engaging in athletic doping with seeming impugnity.
4
Congratulations to IAAF for making his decision; I thought they would cave in to the big-money and political pressures to do otherwise. Watch out for the IOC, however, keeping in mind that the Russian swimmers, boaters and others not covered by the IAAF are still in the Olympics. The IOC has a long history of bending to the big money and national politics (e.g., Berlin, Beijing, Sochi).
3
Amending Lord Acton's take on corruption slightly, I would say, when corruption becomes an established part of the social-political order, then everything in society becomes corrupt!
2
Only guilty athletes should be barred. This is collective punishment and not at all fair, which is the point of the games, fairness, sportsmanship. The clean athletes have no choice but to go under their country's Olympic federation. The RIO Olympics, with the Zika virus with athletes already pulling out, the Coup against their democratically elected leader, and completion of facilities is showing that RIO could be a big disaster.
@Independent: How do you propose the IOC and the IAAF ensure that Russia's "clean" athletes are clean. This doping scandal in Russia is orchestrated by top sports officials. If it is anything like the doping dine by the GDR, it is a government run program. The Russian government encourages its athletes to dope and probably provides the PEDs in order to win medals. International medals in sports contributes significantly to Russian prestige. For that reason, the entire track and field team must suffer the consequences. In fact, the entire Russian Olympic Team, including gymnasts, swimmers, boxers, cyclist, oarsman, etc., should all be expelled. Thank you.
2
this Olympics could have been in Chicago. just saying. maybe the Rio Olympics sho I ld have happened in 2020? That would've given them more time to prepare.
Site selections are always done within the same time frame - there is always the same amount of time for a city to prepare.
It has been said that Russia is Putin's gas station trying to be a country. Now we know how reckless that gas station is. Every bit of news coming out of Russia, whether it is military action against its neighbors, support for the most hideous dictator in the world (Syria's Assad) that is resulting in a worldwide humanitarian disaster, assassinations of people who criticize Putin, and now massive state-sponsored athletic cheating.
4
“We now appeal to the members of the International Olympic Committee to not only consider the impact that our athletes’ exclusion will have on their dreams and the people of Russia, but also that the Olympics themselves will be diminished by their absence.”
The Russians might have wanted to think about this themselves, before they built a doping industry involving all levels of Russian athletics. The Russians are rotten at every level.
The Russians might have wanted to think about this themselves, before they built a doping industry involving all levels of Russian athletics. The Russians are rotten at every level.
6
Russian hooligans in Marseilles. Russian doping in London, in Sochi and elsewhere. Russian troops in Ukraine and Crimea. Russian fighters violating sovereign airspace and buzzing NATO ships and aircraft. Russian backing of Assad. Russian shell companies in Panama. Vladimir, you are not setting a good example for your people. You are not being a good global citizen. You are not respecting international law and I think you would welcome larger open conflict to divert the attention of your own people away from your growing domestic problems. The escalation of your bad behavior cannot end well. Thank you to the IAAF for taking the right action. Bullies respect strength and decisiveness. Leaders of the free world, take note.
33
This is a late and drastic intervention by the powers from Olympus, who have had evidence for a long time of widespread doping in many places. It is too bad that selective sanctions could not have been imposed earlier and more selectively. They wimped around for years and now use a sledge hammer. Too little and too much.
I say too late and too little.
Now if only the former USSR and the former East German "athletes" who doped/blew up on steroids for prior games had to return their bogus medals and have them awarded to the clean athletes who "lost" to them for many years.
7
The former USSR and East Germany both relied on chemical enhancements in their win at all costs form of diplomacy. It is obvious this tradition continues in Russia today and once caught denials will attempt to obfuscate reality.
Why are we not surprised?
Why are we not surprised?
6
Good riddance.
Now, if we can just get rid of the rest of the cheating athletes and coaches from all the other countries, the corrupt officials from international sports governing bodies who award Olympic games and other sports tournaments to countries who have no business holding them, the corrupt national and local officials who divert tax monies from their less privileged compatriots to line their own pockets ...
Now, if we can just get rid of the rest of the cheating athletes and coaches from all the other countries, the corrupt officials from international sports governing bodies who award Olympic games and other sports tournaments to countries who have no business holding them, the corrupt national and local officials who divert tax monies from their less privileged compatriots to line their own pockets ...
8
That is why you can't watch this seriously. The IOC is a privately operated NGO. This is their show. You don't like it, don't watch it. This doesn't rise to the level of outrage.
The more Putin's Russia is exposed as a criminal state the better for the world and the Russian people.
12
Really? Was it Russia who invaded or bombed seven different nations unprovoked in the past decade? Was it Russia who armed and funded radical jihadis to overthrow a sovereign Syrian government that never threatened it, with said jihadis now committing mass murder all over the world? Was it Russia who sponsored an coup against a democratically elected government in Ukraine to install a puppet regime right on Russia's doorstep? Who is the "criminal state" here?
1
America is not a criminal state.
1
I personally believe that all countries should REQUIRE doping of it's athletes. Sacrifice the health of the few for thy joy of millions.
'Did you see that dude throw the disc to the moon?' Not going to get there until we are on full steroids or robots can enter. Right now physically impossible for a human.
'Did you see that dude throw the disc to the moon?' Not going to get there until we are on full steroids or robots can enter. Right now physically impossible for a human.
3
I would prefer they focused on the individuals, not the country as a whole. So ban any athlete who participated in the Sochi scheme, or who has otherwise tested positive for doping. The problem with banning an entire country from the Olympics is that you punish clean athletes and delegitimize the event.
Considering that nothing in Russia is beyond his control, does anyone doubt that Putin had a hand in this? He has shown himself to be obsessive with Russian superiority, whether it's propping up Assad in Syria, building the world's largest nuclear ice-breaker or ensuring Russian dominance in the Olympics.
Putin is a 21st Century reincarnation of Josef Stalin, and his reach, and his narcissism, have no bounds.
Putin is a 21st Century reincarnation of Josef Stalin, and his reach, and his narcissism, have no bounds.
25
@Jim in Tucson
Putin is a nasty piece of work, but he is light-years removed from Stalin's level of evil. Stalin murdered millions and created one of the most horrifying police state empires in human history.
Putin? He's a retail small time gangster in comparison.
No reason to punish the Russian athletes that aren't cheating.
Putin is a nasty piece of work, but he is light-years removed from Stalin's level of evil. Stalin murdered millions and created one of the most horrifying police state empires in human history.
Putin? He's a retail small time gangster in comparison.
No reason to punish the Russian athletes that aren't cheating.
In the USA we used to have a law that you were innocent until proven guilty. I guess its been abandoned elsewhere also.
What ARE you talking about? The Russians HAVE been proved guilty. Read up on this before commenting.
2
Yeah - that would be criminal law - civil law and most other punitive systems operate on the Preponderance of the Evidence model.
My intention is not to defend doping in any way, because it *is* cheating, but I also think we need to look at how the World Anti-Doping Agency levels sanctions. In some cases, like Russia, they also ban athletes who have never had a positive test--is that fair? Bans are also imposed ex post facto: a particular drug was *not* on the banned list in 2008 or 2012, but is in 2016...athletes whose samples from 2008/2012 that test positive for the now-banned substance can be suspended. That doesn't seem right.
3
You suggest that athletes have been punished specifically for taking substances that were not prohibited at the time. Do you have any actual examples of that?
1
Maria Sharapova
Maria Sharapova was suspended for taking a newly-banned drug. Problem is, she stopped using it last year, and when the ban went into effect, traces of the drug were still detectable because it is cleared from the body slowly.
Once again ,a broad brush is being used to address a problem and innocent athletes are denied a chance to participate . The Olympic movement is damaging itself. The individual athletes and their coaches should be sanctioned.
3
I think you are missing the scope of the doping problem in Russia. But it's really hard to compete in a system that is rife with doping without doping yourself.
1
If the speed limit is 65 and you drive by at 72 or 75, you might be okay. Russia went whizzing by at 150 and now they are whining that they were unfairly singled out, and everybody else cheats too, etc., etc., obnoxious etc.
This is like a lot of other situations. If you cheat a little and you're careful, even if you get caught, you might get another chance. If you cheat flagrantly, time after time after time and get caught and you rub it in everybody's face by winning or making a ton of money at cheating, that's different. You couldn't cheat just a little, could you? No. You had to have the whooooole thing. Well now we're dumping all of you, and that's what you deserve for being a big time in-your-face cheat instead of a little cheat like everybody else.
This is like a lot of other situations. If you cheat a little and you're careful, even if you get caught, you might get another chance. If you cheat flagrantly, time after time after time and get caught and you rub it in everybody's face by winning or making a ton of money at cheating, that's different. You couldn't cheat just a little, could you? No. You had to have the whooooole thing. Well now we're dumping all of you, and that's what you deserve for being a big time in-your-face cheat instead of a little cheat like everybody else.
27
Does anyone seriously believe Russian athletes are the only ones doping? They are the ones that got caught. You think Americans are not doping? or Germans or Italians? Wake up and smell the music. Everyone's doping, it's just some are better at hiding it than others. You're going to say well in Russia the government was behind it. That's only because the government is behind everything in Russia. US cheating is just less centralized, but no less prevalent. Lance Armstrong anyone?
132
>> Wake up and smell the music.
When I can smell the music, that's when I'll know that my years of doping have finally paid off.
When I can smell the music, that's when I'll know that my years of doping have finally paid off.
2
You don't seem to understand the difference between individuals cheating and a systematic countrywide conspiracy to cheat.
1
RE your evidence that other countries have widespread doping: I think you don't have any.
Not being an expert on the subject of doping, I fear my suggestion might appear absurd, but it seems to me that Russia makes an easy target; I'm not suggesting their athletes are innocent, I am saying that if Russia were small, and lacking in geo-political power , a different solution might have been tried. Doping appears incredibly difficult to detect with each passing year. If athletes are so desperate to use them, legalize doping for all, and may the best drugged team win. For those athletes not using drugs, give them a ten yard head start as compensation. In any case, the modern Olympic movement is as absurd as my argument.
89
I feel your pain, @Wiseman, but legalization has an enormous difficulty. With legalization comes control, because if PED substances are not controlled, dosages among athletes could reach fatal levels. Of course such deaths would probably put an end to the use of PEDs, but also the end to many organized sports.
It would be difficult to control the dosages of legal PEDs just as it is difficult to prevent their use when they are illegal. The playing field would be "re-leveled" to include the use of PEDs, which would encourage athletes to increase their dosages. Dosages that are beyond the legal dose would be handled in the way that Russia has handled PEDs today... surreptitiously.
We have to remove PEDs from sports entirely.
It would be difficult to control the dosages of legal PEDs just as it is difficult to prevent their use when they are illegal. The playing field would be "re-leveled" to include the use of PEDs, which would encourage athletes to increase their dosages. Dosages that are beyond the legal dose would be handled in the way that Russia has handled PEDs today... surreptitiously.
We have to remove PEDs from sports entirely.
18
Russia has consistently Cheated every year for the History of the Olympics, there are Documentaries detailing how they turned almost 120 People into freaks from loading them up with steroids and caused vast numbers of their athletes to die of liver cancer and other diseases due to what they forced on their athletes. At this point Russia cannot be trusted to do anything on the level, Honest and with Integrity and it will actually save the athletes from being forced to take the next wave of undetectable Steroids destroying their bodies.
Russia should be banned from every Organization on the planet Including China because they feel they are entitled to cheat at everything. They have no Integrity as a Nation and should not be included.
Russia should be banned from every Organization on the planet Including China because they feel they are entitled to cheat at everything. They have no Integrity as a Nation and should not be included.
2
Yes, you're absolutely right. Your suggestion is absurd.
1
I wonder if it's possible for clean Russian athletes to compete somehow without representing Russia. For example, would it be possible for YELENA ISINBAEVA to compete under a different flag, perhaps as a representative of the United Nations instead of for Russia? This would have to be set up in a way such that no medal she wins would be counted in the number of medals that Russia can claim.
I recognize that this might not be a legitamate solution for athletes that were born and raised in Russia and who were financed throughout their athletic career by the Russian government. I really would like to see the hardworking clean athletes have a chance to compete. But if they do not compete, it's Russia's fault, not the IOC or IAAF's.
I recognize that this might not be a legitamate solution for athletes that were born and raised in Russia and who were financed throughout their athletic career by the Russian government. I really would like to see the hardworking clean athletes have a chance to compete. But if they do not compete, it's Russia's fault, not the IOC or IAAF's.
3
Intersting idea, Tarek. I could be facetious and say that they could compete for Ukraine. But your idea emphasizes a positive response to the use of illegal drugs by rewarding clean athletes in addition to punishing nation states that encourage their use.
2
Ms. Isinbaeva is a good example of an athlete being barred for guilt by association. She probably could compete under a neutral flag, but she has also stated she does not want to do that. The Olympic are partly (ok, mostly) about national pride, and Ms. Isinbaeva is a proud Russian...if she competes and wins, she should get to hear her national anthem played.
Sadly, there's no way to force Russia to quit doping except by penalising them as a nation.
And under the circumstances it's very difficult to work out which athletes are "clean" anyway.
And under the circumstances it's very difficult to work out which athletes are "clean" anyway.
2
Huge. I feel bad for the athletes who have done their best to both train and avoid pressure to dope. Having read quite a bit about the doping problem in cycling, and how many athletes resort to doping due to the pressures they face, and because this is their life and they have nothing to fall back on, I know this is more complicated that just cheating at the personal or national level.
28
It is a pity that athletes who have trained their entire lives for this moment and done so legitimately wind up being excluded from their live's dreams by the "win at any cost" cynicism of coaches and administrators whose bread is buttered by the wins medals they obtain for their countries. This took a whistle blower to bring into the world's eye and that whistle blower should get a medal. But, given how the science of evading detection (as well as the non scientific chicanery) has so advanced, is this helping? Or is it the best way to end this dishonesty after all. The athletes of honest teams deserve to compete on a level playing field. They all have dreams.
1
Headed towards being a failed state, like it's philosophical sister Venezuala, Brazil should not host these Olympics and put all these atheletes at risk.
Disburse the events to 10 major prior-Olympics cities.
3
If doping is so important, why doesn't the governing body do its own testing? Surely, if they know what the problem is, they can formulate their own test regime and ban individuals as needed. This seems more like politics to me.
7
"Individuals" aren't really the problem. A state-sponsored doping campaign is the problem.
2
I hope the IOC and IAAF make it clear that any more suspicious deaths will be monitored and may impact future actions. Given the couple likely assasinations which have already occurred, sooner or later the KGB/FSB will go after Dr Rodchenkov and other whistle blowers.
15
An Olympics organization finally does something right. Russian is corrupt to the bone. So are the Olympics, nothing more than a huge made for TV event that enriches big corporations and IOC fat cats who like their 5-star lifestyle. What's more, you never see many traditional track events anymore--NBC would rather show us BMX bike racing (now an Olympic sport) (and, during the winter games, a lot of bogus snowboarding events) in its desperate quest to attract young TV viewers. A gold medal for skateboarding? It's coming.
35
The Olympics is always adding or eliminating events or sports, to reflect the most popular sports world-wide. I'm not much a fan of Olympic golf, but I sure am happy they brought Rugby back!
1
As bizarre as this may sound, I'm waiting to see how the Chinese athletes fare at the games. Why? Because I've been following a program they've been working on pertaining to gene research. Over 20 years ago, they were able to genetically analyze and manipulate animals to markedly increase their athletic abilities. There's been quite enough time to breed a new generation of athletes that are totally "untestable". It may sound like science fiction, but "we have the technology". Let's see.
22
Good lord. This is bizarre. I know a woman, who, with her twin sister, came up through the Chinese system, for lack of a better word. Nothing of that sort is going on.
1
I am now waiting for the sport of cycling to be banned from the Olympics. If that doesn't happen, then the odds are that the Russia decision is partly political. Because, as pretty much everyone knows, cycling is a dope-riddled sport.
75
Banning a sport would be throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Put the focus where it belongs: on organizations, teams, and individuals that dope.
1
Availability heuristic. Of course cycling is rife with PEDs. But more so than track and field? Wrestling? Equestrian? Archery? If we're in the business of banning tainted sports from the Olympics, we'll effectively be abolishing the Olympics altogether. And if you think ping-pong would be the last sport standing, take a look into paddle doping.
Cycling is no more drug-riddled than Track and Field, Weight Lifting, and Cross-Country skiing, to list the first three that come to mind. You might remember the East German swimming team, another example of state-sponsored doping. Any sport where money can be made by winning (either via professional contracts or endorsements) is likely to attract doping.
1
Russian authorities, coaches and athletes are guilty of past doping, as are many others from other nations. But to ban the whole current Russian team for Rio is not fair punishment, but ugly politics. Russian athletes are getting punished because the coup in Kiev backfired and Russia dared to draw her own red lines in Syria. My message to competing athletes: Your Rio medal will always have an asterisk. My message to advertisers. I am not interested in watching an Olympics Games that has been loaded in this way.
6
Russia is being banned because it engaged in institutional doping fraud on a national level - something that is unprecedented in modern times. Your attempts to link this to long-debunked Russian neo-fascist conspiracy theories do not and will not obscure this simple fact.
2
It's not unprecedented in modern times - the East Germans perfected it in the 70s and 80s.
1
If I was a clean world class Russian athlete I would be very, very angry at my fellow countrymen.
20
What with Zika and who knows what else, it might be a blessing in disguise for them.
8
I've loved Olympic gymnastics since I was in high school and am sad to see how widespread doping has become in sports; it's dulled my enthusiasm because I don't know what the actual skill of an athlete is. On another matter, I wonder what effect this decision will have on political matters involving Russia, Europe, and the U.S.
5
Just one more arrow for Putin's 'Western conspiracy' quiver.
I know. My colleague a Russianist noted a relationship between this (then up and coming) decision and the violence in Lille.
While we blame the Russians, appropriately so, for drug use, we ignore our own complicity in making this possible and inevitable. Our professional sports routinely feature athletes who have been suspended for drug use multiple times, either for performance enhancing or illegal drugs, yet they continue to play their sport. We have superior training facilities and funding - this is our advantage. As a result, other nations can only compete through use of performance enhancing drugs. When winning a medal can be worth millions of dollars, do we really expect that no one will try to use any means possible to win? The upside is significant and, in general, there is only a downside if you are caught and that can be years later. Before you blame any athlete, can you honestly say that, for millions of dollars, you would not bend the rules? I would not want to answer this question.
53
The IAAF was not blaming any one athlete in particular. They were blaming an entire State-supported institutionalized program of systemic doping and coverups It may be politically correct to say that we as Americans are "complicit" in that plot, but it's not really true.
1
I can honestly say that for millions of dollars I would not bend the rules. I'm sure I'm not alone.
2
DickH,
Yes, I can honestly say I would not bend the rules for any amount of money or fame. But then again, I take pride in my integrity not in my bank account. It's not that hard to do, it's just different than the majority. The majority are wrong.
Yes, I can honestly say I would not bend the rules for any amount of money or fame. But then again, I take pride in my integrity not in my bank account. It's not that hard to do, it's just different than the majority. The majority are wrong.
1
The Russians have been cheating at the Olympics and other international sporting events for a long, long time. And they have been caught cheating many times. it is only because the old Soviet Union has been split into multiple pieces that the International Olympic Committee has the courage to finally punish them now. Watch for Putin's reaction. He'll probably annex another ex-Soviet satellite state as retribution.
5
From what I have read the Russian system is corrupt to the core. Their athletes should be banned from the Olympics. Their drug testing system should be replaced by one operated by independent international officials for at least 5 years.
8
What about Russian cyclists? Swimmers? Archers? Sailors? You're telling me that this enormous state-sanction apparatus was in place to influence *only* track and field events?
15
If the investigation was thorough and fair, this is great. If you take fairness out of sports, what do you have? Nothing. LESS than nothing, you have something similar to an SAT test with some students using Google, and others only using their brains.
If the Russians are guilty, its unfortunate for those athletes from Russian who are clean, but they have only their government to blame.
If the Russians are guilty, its unfortunate for those athletes from Russian who are clean, but they have only their government to blame.
4
With any luck at all, this will be the beginning of the end of the Olympic Games as we now know them. i have little doubt that Russia will retaliate in some manner and that could be the first domino to fall. So much corruption so deeply seeded at every level from athletic to administrative does not make for a very compelling argument in favor of their survival.
158
Bring back the 1984 Soviet Friendship Games as a testing-free event. Let the best science win! At least that would be honest, and who knows, might even advance medical research.
Perhaps Russia will invade Brazil. Not sure why they would want it anyway.
I am not defending Russia, but that is not the only guilty country. The Olympic is rife with cheating. They may not be caught at the time but the athletes are still doping. How many American athletes have denied it for years and then appeared at a press conference in tears admitting they did in fact take banned drugs. There are three types of athletes, those who don't take drugs and are seen on the podium less frequently than other athletes. Those who cheat and are caught, and the biggest group, those who cheat and haven't been caught yet.
The Olympics is a farce filled with fake nationalistic posturing. Athletes compete for countries they have never lived in because their parents emigrated from there, this year there will be a team of refugees from who knows where. They should suspend all the rules about doping and let athletes cheat where they may. Instead of billing the Olympics as an athletic contest, let it be billed as entertainment. The other option is suspend the Olympics completely, which is what the Greeks did in olden times. This year is a good year to start. Brazil is in turmoil, they are not ready, there is the Zika virus and the water venues are polluted with anti-biotic resistant pathogens. Stop the Olympic and stop the farce.
The Olympics is a farce filled with fake nationalistic posturing. Athletes compete for countries they have never lived in because their parents emigrated from there, this year there will be a team of refugees from who knows where. They should suspend all the rules about doping and let athletes cheat where they may. Instead of billing the Olympics as an athletic contest, let it be billed as entertainment. The other option is suspend the Olympics completely, which is what the Greeks did in olden times. This year is a good year to start. Brazil is in turmoil, they are not ready, there is the Zika virus and the water venues are polluted with anti-biotic resistant pathogens. Stop the Olympic and stop the farce.
190
I admire al the points you made on this issue. I agree with everything you said and your solution is perfect. Thanks.
2
Yes, you are defending Russia. If they did it and got caught, they should be punished. What others did or do doesn't excuse you.
I know right? The west may feel good about banning Russia, but people who live in glass houses....
1
In my opinion , this is an¨invisible war¨. American government must have known about this.
2
The difference between previous drug scandals in recent times is that that they have not been purposively promoted by a government. In the absence of any other sources of proven prowess, Putin's government actively sponsors sport, success in it being trumpeted as a vindication of the new Tsarist-like state.
12
The genie is out of the bottle for me. The last summer games I followed was in Montreal, which was a terrible tragedy. Our country did not participate in the 1980 games because of the USSR's invasion of Afghanistan, which precipitated the 1984 Soviet boycott of the summer games in Los Angeles. By 1988, the use of performance-enhancing drugs was widespread. So, I haven't watched a single live summer games event since 1976 and as I'll never be convinced that I'll be watching the equivalent of Paavo Nurmi, Jim Thorpe, or Jesse Owens, instead of a chemically-altered psuedo-athlete, I don't intend to start now. The Olympic ideal is dead, replaced by the pursuit of money, and watching an Olympic competition, for me, is equivalent to watching the floor of the New York Stock Exchange -- only without the PEDs.
242
I'm right there with you, D, give me Franz Klammer's winning run in the Winter O's of that year. I did get pretty excited about Bruce J's performance but he (she) has sort of let me down lately.
That's because we didn't have tests back in "the good ol' days." Tons of elite athletes used PEDs such as amphetamines, blood thinners, and steroids. We just will never know which ones because in the post-East Germany world, every athlete has to pee in a cup. You really feel the Olympic ideal is more dead now than when a gargantuan, East German woman could out toss everyone in the hammer throw? This reminds me of people freaking out over GMOs. Everything has always been a GMO, and there's a good chance that a lot of your favorite athletes, even Paavo Nurmi, Jim Thorpe, and Jesse Owens, found a bottle or syringe that made them great.
2
Pardon my ignorance, but how was Montreal "a terrible tragedy"? Are you thinking of Munich?
After watching four seasons of "The Americans" my mind reels imagining how all this went down...
6
Unfortunate! Ban Nations! - instead of participants on the day of participation if found tainted - and now a priori total ban of Nations based on allegations. Other Nations also can follow suit as per their influence and soft power in the future - the field is open to have international intimidation in sports. The only parties who won are the sports medicine companies in the advanced Nations and not the athletes.
1
There needs to be a blood / urine passport built of random drug tests by an impartial unbiased body. Simply testing on the day of participation does it work as it seems Russia has figured out how to use alcohol to speed up the process of getting the drugs out of the body in time for testing. With a two week window, it seems that testing should be done on a randomized schedule at least twice every four weeks. This would be a massive undertaking to get the samples, secure them, ship them, test them and then retest in cases of positive results.
1
Post after post after post from people like you who one can only imagine lack the intellectual fortitude to grasp the simple fact that Russia is not being banned because its athletes were doping; Russia is being banned because, uniquely in modern times, it has been caught with a government-sponsored institutional cheating program. Seriously, who are you people who over and over again fail to grasp this basic and fundamental aspect of this case?
2
Putin.
'nuff said?
Or should we go one step further and ask whether he, too, has been taking steroids. This is not a joke. Remember those photos of the bare-chested, muscular President of Russia that graced the walls of hotel bedrooms in Sochi?
'nuff said?
Or should we go one step further and ask whether he, too, has been taking steroids. This is not a joke. Remember those photos of the bare-chested, muscular President of Russia that graced the walls of hotel bedrooms in Sochi?
10
Guilt by association doesn't increase my confidence in IOC. Why not let athletes who have never been found to have used PEDs compete. Despite the flags, national anthems etc., isn't Olympics supposed to be about the brotherhood of athletics?
45
Brotherhood of athletics? You must be kidding. Brotherhood ends at pick-up games between friends and acquaintances. Olympic athletes are people driven to be the best - beat everyone. The entire idea of giving one medal for the winner goes against the "brotherhood". Does anyone remember any sliver medalist? How many people remember who the Broncos beat in this year's Super Bowl? They all want to be like Muhammad Ali - on top of the world, king of the world.
1
NO, Its never been about that. It has always been about competition as national blocks. Which might have meant something 100 years ago. Travel was slow, news traveled slow, neighboring nations hated each other.
Today it is simply redundant as there are nationals and internationals in nearly every sport every year. The IOC exists merely to enrich the IOC while selling a nostalgic romantic yesteryear.
Today it is simply redundant as there are nationals and internationals in nearly every sport every year. The IOC exists merely to enrich the IOC while selling a nostalgic romantic yesteryear.
1
It's not guilt by association-- it's the fact that it is impossible find out who cheated and who didn't because they had system-wide apparatus for cheating in place.
2
Maybe the Olympics have outlived their idealistic start?
The idea that corporations, and NBC, make millions, if not billions, off the backs of athletes who have devoted years and decades to a sport and will do anything to win, seems distasteful, to say the least.
And then there's the cheating. How tragic that athletes in the quest to win will destroy their bodies when the very idea of sport used to be that you would be healthier if you exercised.
Then there are the bribes given to the officials who choose the sites. We have Winter Olympics where there is no snow and we have a venue in Brazil where the athletes participating in water sports are warned not to go into the water.
Stop this madness.
The idea that corporations, and NBC, make millions, if not billions, off the backs of athletes who have devoted years and decades to a sport and will do anything to win, seems distasteful, to say the least.
And then there's the cheating. How tragic that athletes in the quest to win will destroy their bodies when the very idea of sport used to be that you would be healthier if you exercised.
Then there are the bribes given to the officials who choose the sites. We have Winter Olympics where there is no snow and we have a venue in Brazil where the athletes participating in water sports are warned not to go into the water.
Stop this madness.
11
Considering how much money is involved, good luck with that. Maybe someone ought to be looking at the IOC. I suspect they're the flip-side of the FIFA coin.
7
Not so fast my friends. The USOC, child of the IOC, banned American Indian athlete, Jim Thorpe, from future competition and rescended his gold medals from the 1912 Olympics. In 1936, Avery Brundage and the USOC reduced participation of Jewish runners in order not to offend Adolph Hitler. The IOC has been among the most corrupt of international organizations, subject to payoffs and bribery. If the payoff is right, the Russians will compete.
5
In geopolitical terms, this is likely to evoke some Russian show of force. This is particularly true because there is a similar investigation of Russian bribery used to win the hosting of the 2018 World Cup. FIFA officials are falling all over each other to disclose bribes, especially from Russia, in an effort to avoid jail time.
7
It's about time.
2
The Olympic games are bloated, wasteful, corrupt, and exist to enrich the elite. They displace and abuse local populations and destroy farmland and natural habitat. Their blatant nationalism separates the world further. The Olympic games need to be dissolved. Honest young athletes must find a better way to compete.
491
This is as cogent a summary as you can get. Agree 100%.
5
l look at the number of "recommends" you get and it makes me wonder how it can be that something so initially traditional and now shared by humanity like nothing else, something so joyful and inspirational and which brings people from around the world together in friendly competition rather than war and enmity - is seen negatively by some people. If mankind prevails rather than flounders in this world, it will have more to do with the Olympic spirit than the demand for some unattainable utopia. Thankfully, you are largely outvoted and I get to watch. You don't have to, you know.
Though far from perfect, the Olympics are a tradition that reaches back thousands of years. In a world rife with war and destruction, nations come together in peace. Have you ever seen the Torch, carried by thousands, to light the Olympic Flame?
Russia has been banned for its blatant, cynical abuse. It has forever tainted its finest athletes and no doubt there will always be those who try to cheat. But let the games continue so we can forget the madness for a few brief moments.
Russia has been banned for its blatant, cynical abuse. It has forever tainted its finest athletes and no doubt there will always be those who try to cheat. But let the games continue so we can forget the madness for a few brief moments.
1
This is the inevitable result of hundreds of millions of couch-bound humans avidly watching sport instead of energetically playing it.
4
My money is on the IOC reaching some sort of "agreement" with Russia before the games. This may be a "sound and fury" move.
3
Sadly, you are most likely correct.
2
The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice...
Is the US pure? No, but to use US misdeeds to make the case about how, "everyone dopes," is a false equivalency and flies in the face of what we know about the systematic doping done by the Eastern Bloc before the wall fell.
Is the US pure? No, but to use US misdeeds to make the case about how, "everyone dopes," is a false equivalency and flies in the face of what we know about the systematic doping done by the Eastern Bloc before the wall fell.
6
Fair enough. But I doubt Russia was the only one who practiced institutional and nation-sanctioned doping. But the only country that was so vigorously investigates was Russia, omitting other obvious offenders. So my conclusion that all this scandal was politically motivated, and, in reality, nothing will change. This anti-doping investigation is just a part of anti-Russian sanctions rather than a real urgency for sport integrity.
54
You've GOT to be kidding me. I'm sure Russia is not the only violator, I grant you that. But why cannot Russians just admit that you failed your best and most talented athletes, you dishonored their life-long efforts to compete for their nation, and you also soiled your own reputation as a great nation? Don't blame your moral and bureaucratic failures on "political motivation." It's unbecoming, comrade. You completely failed your athletes and the Russian people all by yourselves. You may not believe it from inside your Russia Times alternate universe-bubble, but there are a great many people in the US who appreciate Russia, and wish to see it achieve the greatness it deserves. It seems, however, that the Russian people are still--after all these decades--fighting for their own integrity in the face of a totalitarian government that would insist on achieving "greatness" (or maybe it's the "socialist revolution"?) in ways that do not reflect its dignified and hallowed centuries-old heritage.
7
Which are the other obvious offenders?
You're missing the point. Other athletes may well cheat, but I know of no other government heavily committed to doping, manipulation and deceit.
3
When will it come out that the Chinese are in it, but better at it, and without any (living) whistleblowers.
Lance Armstrong was not alone.
FIFA, Olympics, and anything with serious $'s attached.
When will we find NBA, NFL teams that dope all the time?
Take the $'s out of sports, especially Olympics and College.
Do not allow TV to PAY anyone (except camera/production crew), or run any Ads during events.
If the moneys gone, attending a game will become more fun, Players will not have as much opportunity to cheat.
FCC as part of TV charter for use of public airwaves could possibly enforce this. Possibly FTC as its interstate and they don't seem to be paying any taxes.
Lance Armstrong was not alone.
FIFA, Olympics, and anything with serious $'s attached.
When will we find NBA, NFL teams that dope all the time?
Take the $'s out of sports, especially Olympics and College.
Do not allow TV to PAY anyone (except camera/production crew), or run any Ads during events.
If the moneys gone, attending a game will become more fun, Players will not have as much opportunity to cheat.
FCC as part of TV charter for use of public airwaves could possibly enforce this. Possibly FTC as its interstate and they don't seem to be paying any taxes.
4
Their are probably over a hundred Olympic events besides track and field. I"m sure many if not all require urine samples
What's going with those?
What's going with those?
3
THE IOC who is guilty of payoffs putting countries in dire debt, and the people never see of get the money the crooks do. And they ALL CHEAT including us- give me a break. No defending Russia- but come on- I at least am not that gullible.
2
Bravo. It's time for competitive sport that is utterly and completely REAL, especially the Olympics. May the cheaters be banned at every turn, and may it not ever again be "unprecendented" to scrutinize their programs, kick them out, and humiliate them.
If I want fiction, I'll watch Netflix.
If I want fiction, I'll watch Netflix.
2
Although it is sad that new athletes would lose out because of past sins, the role of the government in the doping merits this punishment. It also seems likely that the potential 2016 Olympians were already part of the doping scheme.
The Olympics also needs to be much more rigorous in testing--cheating is widespread (including American athletes) and as the Times has reported, some top track countries in Africa do virtually none of the supposedly required testing.
The Olympics also needs to be much more rigorous in testing--cheating is widespread (including American athletes) and as the Times has reported, some top track countries in Africa do virtually none of the supposedly required testing.
4
I feel very sorry for the young, innocent Russian athletes who have trained for years to participate in the Olympics. It's unfair to punish them for the transgressions of the Russian government.
61
I feel sorry for non-Russian athletes who don't get medals because a Russian athlete doped and evaded detection. When the country as a whole is involved in running the doping scheme, how can you trust any Russian athletes?
9
It is likely that none of the Russian track and field athletes are "innocent".
4
Nonsense! They know how the system works and if they want to participate in athletics and other sports they can emigrate to a country where cheating and corruption are not the fundamental culture. If they're good athletes they can get a scholarship to an American university.
Great news, and the side effect is that it emphasizes the chicanery that goes on with the use of illegal, and perhaps harmful, performance enhancing drugs. The world has to put an end to the use of these substances.
2
Faster, stronger, higher. A new meaning.
1
Sorry, this all seems like a joke to me. The Olympics and all major sports and sports events are simply taxpayer-funded playgrounds for the top 1% global financial elite who got their money from cheating. The only thing the Russians did was get caught - like Lance Armstrong.
99
Lance Armstrong was one man acting on behalf of himself. This is an entire government apparatus acting to cheat in multiple sports across multiple years. The only connection is that they are all cheaters. Like Armstrong, they deserve to be punished to send a message to future/current governments.
5
One man vs virtually the entire Russian national team?
2
The Russians have a massive inferiority complex about their position in the world...their aggression, their military growth, people's world view, their execution of political enemies and the approval rating of Putin all attest to it....this is just another example of it.
Bravo to the Olympics for doing this.
Bravo to the Olympics for doing this.
156
Long over due. Now, how about tennis, baseball, football, coaching and all the rest.
49
More to the point, how about cycling and the Jamaica athletic team?
Won't happen - cycling has no villain government to punish, and banning Jamaica would not be racially politically correct. So, it's Russia.
Won't happen - cycling has no villain government to punish, and banning Jamaica would not be racially politically correct. So, it's Russia.
1
Athletes in major league baseball and football and on the tennis tour are regularly tested. How do you think Maria Sharapova's doping was discovered? Are you aware that Mets pitcher Jeremy Mejia received a lifetime ban from Major League Baseball? Why do you think the Jets' defensive end Calvin Pace was banned for the first four games of the 2009-10 season?
2
A ban on Russian track and field teams is appropriate because it was state sponsored doping. I would even support a ban on all Russian athletes. Russia must admit what it did before we should even consider admitting Russian athletes to the Olympic games.
If innocent athletes are excluded, they must resist their government. They may have known about the doping even if they didn't do it themselves. Why didn't they complain or report athletes who did dope?
If innocent athletes are excluded, they must resist their government. They may have known about the doping even if they didn't do it themselves. Why didn't they complain or report athletes who did dope?
7
resisting the government in Russia is a good way to die
2
There is no way to know if ANY Russian athletes are clean. Regardless, when a country SYSTEMATICALLY conspires to dope its athletes there can be no allegedly clean ones. Those athletes who may have resisted should compete for another country or protest their own country betraying them.
This is an effort of such magnitude it goes off the Richter scale.
This is an effort of such magnitude it goes off the Richter scale.
25
This is welcome news. There may well be Russian athletes who did not dope, but as long as their government refuses to come clean, unfortunately all are suspect. Maybe this wake-up call will give Russia the kick in its complacency it sorely needs.
11
I feel like the whole Olympic movement has lost its purpose. In fact, sports in general has lost its integrity everywhere you turn, from organized cheating in professional sports, the academic hypocrisy of US collegiate sports, Little League age and residency cheating; even true amateurs cheating in marathons and triathalons (by cutting the course) and cycling (with hidden motors in bikes).
I love sports - played and watched my whole life, and I have a young daughter who is into sports as well, but I can't keep defending the poor choices the athletes she sees in the news, and asks about, are making.
I love sports - played and watched my whole life, and I have a young daughter who is into sports as well, but I can't keep defending the poor choices the athletes she sees in the news, and asks about, are making.
525
I don't know. If people are getting caught, that shows that there's some integrity to the sport. If every thing looks happy and perfect, you never know.
1
It does seem like some integrity is being lost, but my guess is it's more a factor of access and media than it is a factor of actual integrity.
All the stuff we hear about now was probably happening back in the good ole days as well, we just didn't hear about it then.
All the stuff we hear about now was probably happening back in the good ole days as well, we just didn't hear about it then.
2
When it's all about winning, the pure joy of competitive sport gets short schrift. The Olympic Games are simply professional sport on a global scale clothed in "amateur" disguise.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
www.endthemadnessnow.org
2
The horse is out of the barn, let's close the door. No, I am no doping apologist, much less Russia's; but the governing bodies are doing this after people caught them sleeping on the job at best - or worse. The truth is that it would be more embarrassing if the excused underperform during this competing cycle. If they win, then maybe they wasted the energy previously
2
So let's kick them out and replace them and not settle for letting everyone just dope!
While only tangentially related to the Olympics, the attacks perpetrated by Russian "hooligans" at the Euro Cup now taking place in France may have been the last straw to finally bar the Russians from Rio.
52
Makes you wonder what the Russian state hopes to gain by all this. They're painting themselves into a self-constructed corner. And for what?
1
That immediately came to my mind too. Interesting timing.
Cyclist,
Agreed, only there's no need to put the word hooligans in quotation marks, as if it's some sort of inaccurate or overwrought description. Hooligans -- and thugs -- are precisely what they are.
Agreed, only there's no need to put the word hooligans in quotation marks, as if it's some sort of inaccurate or overwrought description. Hooligans -- and thugs -- are precisely what they are.
It looks as if the I.A.A.F. tossed the hammer at the Russian track and field team.
5
Finally the I.O.C. acts to stem the collapse of confidence in the integrity of the Olympic games.
It never should have taken this long. If proven, for individual athletes, it should be ONE strike and you're out.
It never should have taken this long. If proven, for individual athletes, it should be ONE strike and you're out.
9
It is a step in the right direction, but the whole point of this is that it is state-sponsored doping. I question whether ONE strike and you are out for individual athletes is a meaningful or appropriate response to that. If you are part of their system (and it isn't just track & field), the athlete has the least control of any part of the system. They are pretty much told what to do and take, questioning it will lead to them losing competition assignments, etc. - I believe the "powers that be," that are supposed to be the gatekeepers against doping should do MORE to protect the athletes from their own federation doctors/coaches/system and to protect those who fight to stay clean and report doping.
1
Maybe they could still be allowed to participate but just not allowed to win.
5
No. Russia was clearly getting in the way of fair play then, and would be quite literally getting in the way of fair players if they run for fun among them.
They can watch from the seats, thankyouverymuch. Maybe take up knitting as they sit if the boredom that stems from not being able to make an exciting attack on sportsmanship gets to them. Not that WADA and friends have been sharp tools against dopery, but that's a whole other judgment.
They can watch from the seats, thankyouverymuch. Maybe take up knitting as they sit if the boredom that stems from not being able to make an exciting attack on sportsmanship gets to them. Not that WADA and friends have been sharp tools against dopery, but that's a whole other judgment.
3
The Russian mindset is still waging the Cold War--and this is another ploy in their playbook
I would not be surprised to see the IOCC reverse and allow them in. That body is more motivated by profit, greed, and TV ratings. They threw integrity, honesty, and amateurism under the bus over a decade ago. A chicken can't change it's stripes.
I would not be surprised to see the IOCC reverse and allow them in. That body is more motivated by profit, greed, and TV ratings. They threw integrity, honesty, and amateurism under the bus over a decade ago. A chicken can't change it's stripes.
55
I've got to give you a recommendation for "a chicken can't change its stripes". That's wonderful, I'm going to start using that!
1
As a former NCAA All American 800M runner, I can tell you that at the Olympic level today, the vast majority of athletes are cheating, particularly from countries that send the maximum amount of qualifiers (3) to each event. This means, yes good old fashioned American as apple pie USA track team is just as guilty. The only difference is that USA cheating is individual - U.S. Athletes are left to their own devices and resources to get the job done.
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How much "apple pie" did you eat to be able to compete?
3
So, how do they do it? Please, be specific...
6
And where is your evidence for this? If there is any, let us know and I think you would find that Americans would be amongst the first to call for those athletes to be banned.
4
I am delighted we're reading this story, as opposed to one detailing Dr. Rodchenkov's demise. May he and his family stay safe.
In Putin's world that is no mean feat.
In Putin's world that is no mean feat.
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As someone who abhors bullies and war criminas I must confess to s smidgen of smugness about this decision. I am not proud of this feeling but cannot shake it. I am sad for the clean Russian athletes believing, surely, that there must be a few, somewhere.
I also believe that the Russian State has been made into a Mafia-like criminal enterprise by a thuggish regime presided over by a murderous hooligan-in-chief. This being so, it is hard to shed tears for a situation of Russia's own home-grown corruption. The State deserves this ban even if some of its individual athletes do not.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
I also believe that the Russian State has been made into a Mafia-like criminal enterprise by a thuggish regime presided over by a murderous hooligan-in-chief. This being so, it is hard to shed tears for a situation of Russia's own home-grown corruption. The State deserves this ban even if some of its individual athletes do not.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
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Wow. Sounds about right, but I'm surprised they're playing hardball. Between this, Zika, Brazilian politics and everything else, this promises to be the weirdest Olympics ever. Then of course, Trump's numbers will be in the toilet by this time, the Republicans will be trampling each other as they run screaming in the other direction, just saying all sorts of funny stuff. That will be good.
Yes indeed, this Summer will be one for the books.
Yes indeed, this Summer will be one for the books.
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Thanks for injecting your political preferences into the discussion!
4
With the decision to bar Russia's Track and Field team from the Rio olympics the Olympic motto should now read. Faster. Higher. Stronger. Justice (at last!)
11
Actually it should read:
Faster. Higher. Stronger. (Doping). Justice.....
Faster. Higher. Stronger. (Doping). Justice.....
Good. Cheating and doping needs to have some penalties. Russia feels like it can flaunt the rules, now it can see the consequences.
14
Of course, this is all just a West-conspiracy....Vladimir will not be pleased.
12
The Olympics took a two-thousand year hiatus before resuming in 1896. They are so tainted now, and have been for many years, that another two-thousand year hiatus will be needed to remove the stain and stink. Come join us in Athens for the 4016 summer games!
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They can hold them in Wayward Pines.
4
Sorry, but it's just too little, too late. The IOC and WADA lost all credibility quite awhile ago, and the Olympic "movement" did as well. The farce of the Sochi Olympics will be topped by the vast incompetence and reckless disregard for both athletes and spectators in the upcoming Rio games. There is a sense of utter contempt for the aquatic athletes who will be forced to compete in untreated sewage. There are literally millions living in dire poverty who will be displaced and basically set aside while the games take place. Does anyone think for a second that NBC will make any reference to them, acting as though they don't exist. And let's not even get into the issue of the Zika virus, because I'm sure NBC won't.
The Olympics once meant something for amateur athletics....but those days, and the amateurs in competition, are long over. I'd rather go running myself.
The Olympics once meant something for amateur athletics....but those days, and the amateurs in competition, are long over. I'd rather go running myself.
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The ancient festival had no "amateur" requirement. When the Olympics were revived in 1896, it excluded professional athletes to keep the lower classes out. The athletes were meant to be models of sport AND upper-class, university-educated virtue.
The ancient games had their own merchandising and vendors, as well as cheaters, just as we do, but it helped that the festival was always held in the same city, and naturally, not televised.
The ancient games had their own merchandising and vendors, as well as cheaters, just as we do, but it helped that the festival was always held in the same city, and naturally, not televised.
5
I'm trying to understand why this is so important. It's games. They're fun, but not important.
3
Unless of course, its your job and you get paid for it. When people get paid on the basis of their results, the games are no longer games; they are business.
11
This is good news and well overdue. It is high time serious action was taken against doping in sport and Russia was obviously guilty of perpetrating a massive conspiracy to commit fraud that was both corrupt and cynical. What with the recent behaviour at Euro 2016 it seems Russians as a nation are descending further and further into a dark hole of criminality, no doubt encouraged by their government. The popularity of their leader makes more and more sense all the time.
21
It's not just Russia, although arguably they may be the worst offenders. From all that I have read, many countries are involved in doping of athletes. A question that begs to be answered is the extent of the involvement of Big Pharma, they have much to gain in all this, it always boils down to business, greed and money.
12
The Horn of The Grand Conspirators has just blown! Quick on your reptilian steeds and defend the flattened Earth and the movie set where the moon landing took place!
4
And where in all you have read did you find out about the many other countries?
1
Kazakhstan, Belorussia to name a few. The IWF (International Weightlifting Federation) just announced that several 2012 gold medalists from from those countries were doping.
This is wrong. They shouldn't ban the entire nation's cadre of athletes. Since they know what to look for in a test, let them come. Just test them every day and right before their competition. Disqualify them if they turn up positive.
8
Well, that may not work either. Because if they have been taking anabolic steroids to build strength and endurance, and quite 2 weeks before the competition, they will test negative, but still have the advantage from the doping.
3
1) Because, as the article spells out, there are many ways to get around the kind of testing you still think is foolproof.
2) Because people don't compete individually but as part of a national squad. The Olympics is about nations. That's why the winner's national anthem is played. Russia flagrantly and consistently violated the rules so RUSSIA is banned. End of story.
2) Because people don't compete individually but as part of a national squad. The Olympics is about nations. That's why the winner's national anthem is played. Russia flagrantly and consistently violated the rules so RUSSIA is banned. End of story.
5
And how does this catch the people who have been using steriods for years who stop 2 weeks before the competition, as documented in the article?
3
Bravo I.A.A.F stating up to doping. Now if we can only get the NFL to stand up to its own greed.
31
Finally. It's about time!
27
This makes me wonder how many other countries or individuals, maybe not to the same extent as the Russian team perhaps, are duping anti-doping officials, and what can be done about it.
31
This appears to be the first time organized state-sponsored doping has been charged. Previously, it had been individuals, or individual event teams. Now we're on a new level.
5
The olympics, having become a steroid-infused freak show, has lately been more about business than sport. Maybe this is a first glimmer of hope that the whole operation, including the IOC and drug monitoring, will clean up and restore its reputation. Would be nice for my children to witness real athleticism and "Olympic spirit". Not optimistic, but maybe a start.
19
Can we just cancel this olympics already?
426
Dream on sb
Coca Cola, Samsung, the IOCC, Sepp Blatter, NBC, Ralph Lauren, Nike, Gatorade, BMW, Mercedes--and so many other "supporters' have way too much at stake than little ol' us.
The Olympics has not been about amateur athletics for over 2 decades. Do what I do---watch woman's softball--a game that isn't tied into $ signs.
Coca Cola, Samsung, the IOCC, Sepp Blatter, NBC, Ralph Lauren, Nike, Gatorade, BMW, Mercedes--and so many other "supporters' have way too much at stake than little ol' us.
The Olympics has not been about amateur athletics for over 2 decades. Do what I do---watch woman's softball--a game that isn't tied into $ signs.
6
Lisa: here's a partial list of "supporters" of women's softball:
United Airlines, Nike, Hilton, Mizuno, Wilson, Sports Authority and Liberty Mutual.
Every sport is tied into $ signs. They couldn't exist without them. Women's softball is no more pure than the Olympics. The sponsors are just smaller because almost no one watches women's softball.
United Airlines, Nike, Hilton, Mizuno, Wilson, Sports Authority and Liberty Mutual.
Every sport is tied into $ signs. They couldn't exist without them. Women's softball is no more pure than the Olympics. The sponsors are just smaller because almost no one watches women's softball.
5
I agree.
Why is winning so important.
I thought just being there would be what is really important and not about world records.
I admire all the athletes, not just the winners.
In fact I admire an athlete more who has trained with the knowledge they have no chance on winning but do it because they love the sport.
Why is winning so important.
I thought just being there would be what is really important and not about world records.
I admire all the athletes, not just the winners.
In fact I admire an athlete more who has trained with the knowledge they have no chance on winning but do it because they love the sport.
Russia has become an entirely criminal state. So sad for the Russian people.
346
Yes. But why has it happened, and why do most citizens and permanent residents of the Russian Federation worship their new Tsar? We all get the leaders we deserve.
5
"Criminal state" "sad for the Russian people"?
Putin's popularity > 80%.
Putin's popularity > 80%.
3
whatever the Russians are doing the Americans are already doing as well if not better; only a foll would believe otherwise.
1
Don't believe anything you hear or read - until the Russian government denies it!
....and hats of to NYT for beating CNN to the news, guess they couldn't find enough spin doctors in time.
....and hats of to NYT for beating CNN to the news, guess they couldn't find enough spin doctors in time.
71
Any other decision would have been an injustice. This was blatant, institutional, nation-sanctioned cheating.
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