A shameful situation deserving the scorn of tourists. The MTA has received billions of dollars in the last 10 years, an amount far superior to the budgets of subway systems of many other cities around the world, where excellent service, modern facilities and cleanliness are the norm
2
For a nation that will spend all sorts of cash on an under utilized interstate system in sparsely populated areas, finding cash for the New York City subway system should be a no-brainier.
The subways are NYC's Interstate and need to be funded accordingly. Funding discrimination against those who choose not to drive needs to stop.
The subways are NYC's Interstate and need to be funded accordingly. Funding discrimination against those who choose not to drive needs to stop.
5
Someone from MTA should study the Tokyo subway system and learn from it.
I resided in Tokyo for over 10 years and always marveled at the superiority of their system compared to the 3rd world subway system in NYC. Sure it gets incredibly overcrowded during the rush hours on the Ginza Line and the Yamanote in Central Tokyo, but the efficiency and clock work precision of the Tokyo system is all in all a work of brilliance. In a city scape that boasts over the double the population of NYC, it's amazing how clean, safe, on time, and well run the Japanese keep their subway and entire train system operating. If Tokyo can create an excellent system for its society, why can't New York City, USA ??
I resided in Tokyo for over 10 years and always marveled at the superiority of their system compared to the 3rd world subway system in NYC. Sure it gets incredibly overcrowded during the rush hours on the Ginza Line and the Yamanote in Central Tokyo, but the efficiency and clock work precision of the Tokyo system is all in all a work of brilliance. In a city scape that boasts over the double the population of NYC, it's amazing how clean, safe, on time, and well run the Japanese keep their subway and entire train system operating. If Tokyo can create an excellent system for its society, why can't New York City, USA ??
6
Trump will fix this, it's easy, like everything else will be. Right.
1
Three words: Ride Your Bicycle!
4
Stop building apartments.
2
Residents of the San Francisco Bay Area be warned: this untenable situation is barreling toward our communities.
Already riders of BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) trains to and from San Francisco from the east and south are crushed into cars during commute hours like the proverbial sardines. Jammed against hard-edged backpacks, persons who apparently have not bathed in years and bicycles whose owners ignore the "no bikes in crowded cars" rule, rush hour rides are already miserable. And many women can testify to multiple experiences of being in effect sexually abused by male riders who press their bodies against them in the crush or use their hands to fondle female bodies when it is impossible to move away.
Last year a survey showed BART riders have increased to 420,000 a day, 100,000 more than five years ago.
Yet now as Bay Area rents soar, investors and developers are raising large apartment buildings all along the BART transit corridor. These huge structures are proliferating like mushrooms.
It will be difficult and costly to expand the system's capacity because of an outmoded control system and an insufficient number of crossover tracks that could allow more trains to be sent to crowded stations.
There are plans make some changes. The current 669 aging train cars will be replaced by 775 new ones in the next few years. More crossover tracks are planned.
Yet greed is fueling a building boom with no end in sight.
We can see our future in this article. It's not pretty.
Already riders of BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) trains to and from San Francisco from the east and south are crushed into cars during commute hours like the proverbial sardines. Jammed against hard-edged backpacks, persons who apparently have not bathed in years and bicycles whose owners ignore the "no bikes in crowded cars" rule, rush hour rides are already miserable. And many women can testify to multiple experiences of being in effect sexually abused by male riders who press their bodies against them in the crush or use their hands to fondle female bodies when it is impossible to move away.
Last year a survey showed BART riders have increased to 420,000 a day, 100,000 more than five years ago.
Yet now as Bay Area rents soar, investors and developers are raising large apartment buildings all along the BART transit corridor. These huge structures are proliferating like mushrooms.
It will be difficult and costly to expand the system's capacity because of an outmoded control system and an insufficient number of crossover tracks that could allow more trains to be sent to crowded stations.
There are plans make some changes. The current 669 aging train cars will be replaced by 775 new ones in the next few years. More crossover tracks are planned.
Yet greed is fueling a building boom with no end in sight.
We can see our future in this article. It's not pretty.
2
America has lost its way.
Why bother with science, with research, with infrastructures, with public transit, with high-speed rail, we are already number one, aren't we?
Why bother with science, with research, with infrastructures, with public transit, with high-speed rail, we are already number one, aren't we?
4
I'm sure some of the work these people do can be done from home. Last year I had to take the F from Brooklyn then the 6 train to Union Square. It was a nightmare. The trains are too packed. At times I had to wait for another train. So that meant missing two F and two 6 trains. This year I got an assignment working from home. I felt blessed. Just boot up the company's computer and I'm all ready for work.
2
Many lines have been overcrowded for years. Staggered work hours was the solution in the 70's
2
I saw a documentary aired on PBS, "Taken for a ride" which showed the de facto corporate collusion and take over of above-ground trolleys all across the country. GoodYear tires, Greyhound -- and other corporations who wanted full owndership and profits generated by commuters -- ripped up miles of above-ground rails and infrastructure. All I am saying is the country was headed in the right direction -- full and diverse mass transit -- when private corporations destroyed what was working. So here we are. @johannaclear
9
There are a number of interesting books written on this topic, including The Geography of Nowhere. The auto industry's singular minded march towards a better world (that just so happened to coincide with their own fortunes). GM, being the largest and best connected, is referenced as the main culprit though no doubt they were all culpable, systematically paying towards removing rail, tram systems and even bus routes around the US and encouraging the growth of highways in the fifties and sixties.
2
We talk about overcrowded subway platforms and climate change. The common denominator? Overpopulation. Why aren't we talking more about that?
10
I don't disagree with your concerns. But the article states that today's overcrowding is only now approaching that of the 1940s, so overcrowding is not really the issue to hand here. The same is true in London, where only now the population is regaining numbers not seen since the 1960s.
1
The only effective answer to a problem caused by too many people is of course, fewer people. Unfortunately that's a solution that people are incapable of even seeing, let alone acting upon. So nature will take action, and we will not like the results.
Robert Reich said 'Patriotic Americans stop at two.' (kids) and he is the only major political figure I can think of to have ever said such a thing. The constant 'planning' we hear about to deal with the 'inevitable' 10 billion people who will be here soon is idiotic - when you find yourself in a hole the only sensible thing to do is to stop digging, planning how to dig the hole ever deeper is just going to leave you in an even deeper hole.
Robert Reich said 'Patriotic Americans stop at two.' (kids) and he is the only major political figure I can think of to have ever said such a thing. The constant 'planning' we hear about to deal with the 'inevitable' 10 billion people who will be here soon is idiotic - when you find yourself in a hole the only sensible thing to do is to stop digging, planning how to dig the hole ever deeper is just going to leave you in an even deeper hole.
2
We may get the picture our traffic infrastructure is not keeping pace with our growth in transportation need or we may not.
Governor Christie, among other so called "conservative" Governors and Representatives, stopped construction of who knows how many needed projects in favor of lowering tax rates on the truly wealthy.
Want to create jobs? Stop building prisons and fix our roads, bridges, railways and airports. Put the people who are locked up to work and pay them a fair wage so when their time is up they have skilled jobs, money and an ethic which makes those rewards possible.
Crises such as this may bring needed eyes, ears and voices to problems that are simply not being solved. Chrome plated weapons systems do nothing, that is zero, for us as a nation and less for the average citizen.
Bring the money back home and get on with rebuilding our country before we pay another dime to destroy anything else in the world.
Governor Christie, among other so called "conservative" Governors and Representatives, stopped construction of who knows how many needed projects in favor of lowering tax rates on the truly wealthy.
Want to create jobs? Stop building prisons and fix our roads, bridges, railways and airports. Put the people who are locked up to work and pay them a fair wage so when their time is up they have skilled jobs, money and an ethic which makes those rewards possible.
Crises such as this may bring needed eyes, ears and voices to problems that are simply not being solved. Chrome plated weapons systems do nothing, that is zero, for us as a nation and less for the average citizen.
Bring the money back home and get on with rebuilding our country before we pay another dime to destroy anything else in the world.
8
You are correct - but you left out the reason the cycle continues. Both political parties are a part of it. Yes - you destroy - but then you "rebuild". Then when you rebuild there infrastructure you get a new "trading partner". So the money flows in 3 ways. It's disgusting yes - but lucrative to the "powers". That's why there is no change.
The members of the MBA Board and senior management should read all the comments posted to this article and come up with smart solutions without putting their hands out for more money.
I remember learning how to fold the nytimes properly on IRT. I commuted for over twenty years until the late eighties. About 10 to 12 thousand hours spent on NYC Transit. I have to confess, commuting into Manhattan had to have been some of the most miserable time I spent in my life. Now it's worse? Glad I got away. Going thru life numb and detached takes it's toll.
Okay before you start shouting how great NYC is compared to Houston is. There's other places. One thing you can't take away from me, i don't have to take the subway any more.
Okay before you start shouting how great NYC is compared to Houston is. There's other places. One thing you can't take away from me, i don't have to take the subway any more.
7
In other cities, where cars are how people get around, mostly, developers are required to build a certain number of parking spots per new unit of housing, so that total parking keeps pace wih the population.
In NYC, where public transit is how people get around, mostly, shouldn't developers be required to contribute to public transit infrastructure expansion, so it can keep pace with new housing?
If an extra however many units of development in one corridor added up to the cost of a signal upgrade on the relevant subway line (so that trains could run more often), that would seem to make a lot of sense.
This is a problem of political will and accountability, not lack of potential funding or engineering.
In NYC, where public transit is how people get around, mostly, shouldn't developers be required to contribute to public transit infrastructure expansion, so it can keep pace with new housing?
If an extra however many units of development in one corridor added up to the cost of a signal upgrade on the relevant subway line (so that trains could run more often), that would seem to make a lot of sense.
This is a problem of political will and accountability, not lack of potential funding or engineering.
16
Real estate transactions directly contribute to the MTA
2
As a Boston resident, you all have my sympathies. Is it the East Coast, the subway system, or the East Coast subway system? Our transit problems here are very bad and just as filled with monetary waste and corruption, and it seems like DC's Metro is not far behind both of us.
For those that don't have an option of commuter boats or even driving in (which here isn't much more expensive than the transit option, and the extra cost is worth it for the peace of mind), these tales are very discouraging.
For those that don't have an option of commuter boats or even driving in (which here isn't much more expensive than the transit option, and the extra cost is worth it for the peace of mind), these tales are very discouraging.
5
May be. But that subway allowed me (little more than a young expatriate) to get to St Luke's (Amsterdam Av. West 110th ),starting from Bay Ridge 95th and Fourth ,six in the morning ,to complete my medical training and education.
I was on the best underground in all the world ,so happy and proud to be there. So,do not treat it so badly. It is still a part of a dream and a hope. And , frankly , I don't feel better at all, now that I make my trip in a very comfortable car.
I was on the best underground in all the world ,so happy and proud to be there. So,do not treat it so badly. It is still a part of a dream and a hope. And , frankly , I don't feel better at all, now that I make my trip in a very comfortable car.
12
When I was a child in the very early 1960s, my white-gloved mother, a child of the Depression, Brooklyn-born, and no stranger to crowded subway cars in the 1940s as she commuted to her job as an usherette (and saw "Mrs. Miniver" perhaps 50 times), would calmly step from the platform across the chasm to the small ledges between the cars, hoist me up, and then make her and my way into one of the cars. One couldn't get on the usual way -- too many people.
When I was old enough to ride the subways to school alone in the mid-1960s, I too would step onto the area between the cars. Eventually the Transit Authority got wise and blocked it with a chain. Besides, guys would smoke cigarettes there.
And now that I am old, I would not dare.
When I was old enough to ride the subways to school alone in the mid-1960s, I too would step onto the area between the cars. Eventually the Transit Authority got wise and blocked it with a chain. Besides, guys would smoke cigarettes there.
And now that I am old, I would not dare.
5
Getting onto a subway car that is either packed like sardines, crowded, or comfortable, has, and always will be a matter of luck. And they are dependent on many possible variables. Such as is the train in front of it overly packed, is your train extra packed because it pulled into a station at the same time of an express or local on the opposite tracks.
The clear fact of the matter is that no matter the time of day some trains, and certainly some cars are more crowded than others on the same line. How crowded, or not, any given train or car is is not based on its fraction of the total number of riders riding that line during that same approximate time.
In addition despite the fact that 2 subway cars can be occupied by the exact number of people, the type of experience of riding along with that number of people can range from peaceful to awful.
Therefore whether one gets to ride in a packed car or one with room, whether one gets to ride among a pleasant crowd or not still comes to down to luck. And the total number of riders does not have a direct enough effect on all the different variables that set one train or car apart from another to say that people are less likely to get lucky with the train or car they got onto..
The clear fact of the matter is that no matter the time of day some trains, and certainly some cars are more crowded than others on the same line. How crowded, or not, any given train or car is is not based on its fraction of the total number of riders riding that line during that same approximate time.
In addition despite the fact that 2 subway cars can be occupied by the exact number of people, the type of experience of riding along with that number of people can range from peaceful to awful.
Therefore whether one gets to ride in a packed car or one with room, whether one gets to ride among a pleasant crowd or not still comes to down to luck. And the total number of riders does not have a direct enough effect on all the different variables that set one train or car apart from another to say that people are less likely to get lucky with the train or car they got onto..
1
Until Albany comes up with a serious plan to expand rail service, reclaim surface street space from the private auto and run express buses all over the city. This should've been done yesterday.
2
First, more and more people are riding the subways because the cabs have become ridiculously expensive at the time when gas is the cheapest. Cheap cabs had been a way to alleviate the city transit; not anymore.
Second, the subway itself is a disgrace. Each time I take it I feel like in a third world country. Where are all the millions going from the daily transit? High salaries for the top brass? Useless initiatives? Inept management? Corruption? Who is auditing MTA and who is holding it accountable? Looks like a bunch of officials who never get of their chauffeured limos.
Third, the price of the ugliest, most unkept, busiest subway in the world, are 3 times more expensive than the clean, modern subways in Germany. Why? who can explain this? Perhaps we need a German MTA President or CEO to make NYC subway clean, modern and affordable.
Taxable 7.25 minimum hourly wage and 5.50 a round trip by bus or subway?
Would love the NYT to make an in-depth investigation of the above. Why is everything here way more expensive than in Europe and way less good?
Second, the subway itself is a disgrace. Each time I take it I feel like in a third world country. Where are all the millions going from the daily transit? High salaries for the top brass? Useless initiatives? Inept management? Corruption? Who is auditing MTA and who is holding it accountable? Looks like a bunch of officials who never get of their chauffeured limos.
Third, the price of the ugliest, most unkept, busiest subway in the world, are 3 times more expensive than the clean, modern subways in Germany. Why? who can explain this? Perhaps we need a German MTA President or CEO to make NYC subway clean, modern and affordable.
Taxable 7.25 minimum hourly wage and 5.50 a round trip by bus or subway?
Would love the NYT to make an in-depth investigation of the above. Why is everything here way more expensive than in Europe and way less good?
24
And yet, here in CA we have constant calls for more housing of greater density with more transit; even though this is the obviously inevitable result. To have a public transit entity like this be managed well is a virtual impossibility, it is nearly miraculous that NYC's transit works as well as it does. And look at the SF Bay Area's BART - creaking along at far greater expense than ought to be the case after less than half a century; I hate to even think of its wretched twin, the DC Metro.
Apparently in other countries, they somehow manage to manage their transit reasonably well. Maybe we should halt all new immigration other than Transit staff from Tokyo, Berlin, Paris and London.
Apparently in other countries, they somehow manage to manage their transit reasonably well. Maybe we should halt all new immigration other than Transit staff from Tokyo, Berlin, Paris and London.
6
The intense use of the subways ought to be seen as a feature not a bug, and the catalyst for a massive upgrade in the subway's infrastructure. The Times should commission a major investigative project on why it takes seemingly forever to produce capacity upgrades that would seem to increase the system's revenues and that are, in any event, essential to realizing the value of new residential and office construction. The Bloomberg administration made important capital investments in the City, but the failure to add the additional station on the Hudson Yards extension of the No. 7 line was genuine short-termism, as was the failure to expedite the 2d Ave Subway and the signals upgrade. Cuomo's obsession with a multi-billion dollar upgrade at LGA, which will not improve urban life one whit, instead of finding additional resources for the MTA is a mark against his legacy.
8
I lived in Manhattan for 19 years (1972-1991) before moving to the SF Bay Area (which is experiencing its own mass transit challenges) and from the start had a fascination with the NYC Subway System.
I remember during the 70's "Travis Bickle" period a British wag wrote, "The secret to a safe ride on the New York City Subway is to look like the one hiding the meat axe."
Back then, trains would be switched from one line to another without anyone bothering to change the sign. So a train on the AA line might display a D sign as it pulled into Columbus Circle. As such, my 1st six months entailed being taken on many trips into train limbo until I had enough experience to shrewdly evaluate whether a train's label matched the track it was on. My heart went out NYC visitors.
Well, in spite of its problems, the system today is way better than back then. I try to visit NYC at least once a year and I still get a kick out of the sensory overload you experience for $2.75.
It's the greatest entertainment bargain in NYC.
I remember during the 70's "Travis Bickle" period a British wag wrote, "The secret to a safe ride on the New York City Subway is to look like the one hiding the meat axe."
Back then, trains would be switched from one line to another without anyone bothering to change the sign. So a train on the AA line might display a D sign as it pulled into Columbus Circle. As such, my 1st six months entailed being taken on many trips into train limbo until I had enough experience to shrewdly evaluate whether a train's label matched the track it was on. My heart went out NYC visitors.
Well, in spite of its problems, the system today is way better than back then. I try to visit NYC at least once a year and I still get a kick out of the sensory overload you experience for $2.75.
It's the greatest entertainment bargain in NYC.
16
Is this the Hillary Factor? Everyone wants to ride now that HRC made it look so cool!
1
Thank you for publishing my earlier comments! After reading a large number of the comments, I realize that many, many people are edgy (scared) of the crowded platforms. Dear MTA, please send some of your engineers to Shanghai (a city with far more people than NYC). Every station has "platform safety doors". This was done within one month. I know. I was there. Send some of your "experts" to Shanghai (pronounced "shahng hai"). Ask them how they did it. It won't hurt you. We can all learn from others, although some of us don't want to.
6
We are all sheep being herded into broken system! The condition, schedules & personnel is on par with a third world country.....
Oh, that would explain all the delays I've been experiencing lately on the F, which are the bane of my existence. The 4,5 and 6 between Brooklyn Bridge-City Hall and 42nd Street I swear is the most efficient stretch of subway I've ever experienced in the years I've been riding it--trains almost always run on time and they're very plentiful and quick. The other lines in the subway system pale in comparison to this efficiency.
Crowded conditions are par for the course, and I don't tend to mind them once I'm in the car. What I do mind are the people who make it crystal clear to everyone within earshot they're very unhappy with being forced into such crowded conditions--they scream, are really pushy and just generally give off bad vibes that infect the rest of the riders. If we take those people out of the equation--who are thankfully a small but irate minority--then the crowding is tolerable.
Crowded conditions are par for the course, and I don't tend to mind them once I'm in the car. What I do mind are the people who make it crystal clear to everyone within earshot they're very unhappy with being forced into such crowded conditions--they scream, are really pushy and just generally give off bad vibes that infect the rest of the riders. If we take those people out of the equation--who are thankfully a small but irate minority--then the crowding is tolerable.
4
I was reading this article as I was waiting for the G train in Greenpoint. It was a suffocatingly crowded ride this morning. One passenger who got on in Bed Stuy asked: why can't they just add two more cars to this train? With all these rapidly gentrifying neighborhoods-- it was a very good question. Sometimes I try and do the math -- what would two more cars cost?
5
It's interesting. You seem to imply that crowding only became a concern when gentrifiers moved in.
2
It's an international (and domestic) embarrassment.
We really let the car boom of the 20th Century decimate our most essential systems, and doing so has served everyone, including car users, very poorly.
Time to reverse that insanity.
One *small* step in the right direction would be the adoption of the Move NY Plan...
We really let the car boom of the 20th Century decimate our most essential systems, and doing so has served everyone, including car users, very poorly.
Time to reverse that insanity.
One *small* step in the right direction would be the adoption of the Move NY Plan...
2
It's beyond insane. There used to be a time when you could actually find a seat on the train.....at 1:00 or 3:00 AM!! -- not any more.
Practically EVERY train is filled to capacity no matter when you travel.
And all those signs and nerving announcements reminding everyone how to be polite, and "Have a Safe Trip"? --Forget about it. No one is listening, and even fewer care.
And tourists. Don't they ever go home??
If the MTA doesn't want to lend itself to a catastrophic rise in crime, they had better think of a Plan B fast, because it won't get any better when summer settles in.
Practically EVERY train is filled to capacity no matter when you travel.
And all those signs and nerving announcements reminding everyone how to be polite, and "Have a Safe Trip"? --Forget about it. No one is listening, and even fewer care.
And tourists. Don't they ever go home??
If the MTA doesn't want to lend itself to a catastrophic rise in crime, they had better think of a Plan B fast, because it won't get any better when summer settles in.
4
I'm off the E. 86th St. station, and, yeah, it's a busy subway line. Even if you're riding an express train at 1am, you're hard-pressed to find a seat. The 4/5/6 line is not at crisis-level, but it's definitely unpleasant at times. I think the overwhelming majority of passengers display a lot patience and courtesy, making do with what we have, but an ugrade will be nice some day.
4
No money for upgrades or enlarging the system,but hey we are building more jet fighters and aircraft carriers.
12
So, NYC has the nation's only infrastructure needs? And by the way, defense is written into the Constitution. Mass transit (and healthcare, free college and food stamps, for that matter) are not.
2
Leave Capitalism Alone , you may want to brush up on constitutional law. Specifically that part about the "General Welfare":
https://www.law.cornell.edu/anncon/html/art1frag29_user.html
https://www.law.cornell.edu/anncon/html/art1frag29_user.html
2
I have to marvel at the efficiency of the Hong Kong's MTR system: it serves nearly the passenger load of NYC, but with clean, spacious platforms, effective crowd management, and rush hour trains that arrive with almost dizzying frequency. What gives? The problem can’t be overpopulation, too many skyscrapers, or urban density—Hong Kong deals with plenty of that.
The NYC system is more than capable of serving the city’s population. Problems arise with terrible mismanagement of billions upon billions in revenue and subsidies, a patchwork fix-it mentality, and general ignorance to infrastructure projects by any and all municipal bureaucrats.
I have little faith in American cities to accomplish any rail improvements without a catastrophic accident, smoke-filled platforms and numerous people suffocating. (see: my hometown, Washington, DC). Unfortunately, even with such occurrences, the outlook for us seems bleak.
The NYC system is more than capable of serving the city’s population. Problems arise with terrible mismanagement of billions upon billions in revenue and subsidies, a patchwork fix-it mentality, and general ignorance to infrastructure projects by any and all municipal bureaucrats.
I have little faith in American cities to accomplish any rail improvements without a catastrophic accident, smoke-filled platforms and numerous people suffocating. (see: my hometown, Washington, DC). Unfortunately, even with such occurrences, the outlook for us seems bleak.
9
After so many years in New York City, the subways are the most crowded I have seen. But buildings keep going up, and the developers contribute nothing to the crowded subway situation except more crowds. Those who continue to build large apartment buildings should, it seems to me, be required to foot more of the bill for the services everyone else must live with.
And why is it, that with the costs of transit consistently rising for riders, the service is so crowded?
The L train is a nightmare every day. On weekends, the Lexington Line is probably more crowded than on weekdays. Why? For one thing, I think they run less trains. Why? I think a part of the problem must be that a large segment of MTA income gets directed towards health and retirement benefits for MTA workers instead of increasing the numbers of trains for riders. So somehow NYC must push for more money from the state and the federal government, and make more trains available. It is simply unfair to require riders to cope with these crowds.
And why is it, that with the costs of transit consistently rising for riders, the service is so crowded?
The L train is a nightmare every day. On weekends, the Lexington Line is probably more crowded than on weekdays. Why? For one thing, I think they run less trains. Why? I think a part of the problem must be that a large segment of MTA income gets directed towards health and retirement benefits for MTA workers instead of increasing the numbers of trains for riders. So somehow NYC must push for more money from the state and the federal government, and make more trains available. It is simply unfair to require riders to cope with these crowds.
5
More misinformed voters. A large chunk of MTA money actually comes from real estate development and transactions. The MTA doesn't lack money - it lacks efficiency in using the money.
4
Some thoughts: Where does all the money go? A hefty chunk of it is used to pay off decades-old bond issues. The MTA is deep in debt. And as we all know, debt doesn't go away. The cash also flows directly to the top. At last count, the MTA had 27 vice presidents. Enough said. One more: Does the MTA really have to spend another 400 million on a new fare collection system? There doesn't seem to be any problem at all in getting them onto the platforms which would seem to indicate that there's nothing much wrong with the Metro Card. A new, very expensive (do you really imagine the cost will stay at 400million?) gee-whiz-golly-look-at-what-my-smartphone-can-do contactless system will not do one damned thing to improve the deteriorating conditions we all face. All it will probably do is to increase the debt since they'll probably have to float a new bond issue to pay for it. Same thing goes for the new information kiosks. What earthly good does knowing the arrival time do if you can't get on the thing? These last two items are things you do when you have a decently functioning railroad. They would be grace notes. We don't need them right now.
11
Those 27 Vp's don't cost much in the grand scheme. And yes - Metrocard does need to be replaced and should have been a few years ago. New systems are cheaper to operate in the long run. Lastly - if you can't see the value in knowing when the next train is coming - I doubt you use it often.
2
I'm not buying the MTA claim that they are running more trains. In my experience, the wait between trains on the lines I take -- even at rush hour -- has grown noticeably over the past five or so years. I grew up on the UWS, and the there used to be a 1 train every 3 or 4 minutes during rush hour. I now wait up to 10 minutes for a souhtbound A or a C in Manhattan at 6:30 pm and similar amounts of time for the R at Atlantic in Brooklyn. I can't believe they can't add back the trains that were taken out of the schedule when they cut the MTA budget around 2010. (Which eliminated some of the useful bus lines that probably added to subway ridership.)
8
The article states: "Installing a modern signal system, which would allow more trains to run, is many years away for most lines."
1. How much would it cost to install the signals?
2. How long would it take if the money were budgeted?
3. How much capacity would it add?
4. Why isn't this being done ASAP?
This seems like one of the least difficult remedies to the situation as it does not require acquiring land or digging up neighborhoods, but just improving equipment in the existing system.
Finally, this is a GREAT problem to have. Most cities (including NY just a few decades ago) have the problem of trying to get enough people to use transit. That said, people will stop using it if conditions do not improve.
1. How much would it cost to install the signals?
2. How long would it take if the money were budgeted?
3. How much capacity would it add?
4. Why isn't this being done ASAP?
This seems like one of the least difficult remedies to the situation as it does not require acquiring land or digging up neighborhoods, but just improving equipment in the existing system.
Finally, this is a GREAT problem to have. Most cities (including NY just a few decades ago) have the problem of trying to get enough people to use transit. That said, people will stop using it if conditions do not improve.
7
Agreed, but what is the alternative? Drive? Frying pan. Fire.
The daily misery of the subways -- a reason why I left the city -- is an effect of austerity. Asking the politicians to do something ignores that they -- unfortunately for us -- already are.
4
Just tell me where all the money goes. The MTA and New Jersey Transit have raised their fares on a regular basis over the past two years and NOTHING CHANGES. Both are a mess. Delays due to infrastructure issues occur daily and we are packed into subway and train cars like sardines. It's ever bit as bad as flying coach now and it's EVERY DAY for commuters.
Everything about it stinks - politically, figuratively and literally. Try standing on the Uptown #1 platform at Penn Station and not gag from the smell of vomit, garbage, and human and creature excrement.
It is getting harder and harder to be civil in this city of mostly self-absorbed hairballs. The rich don't ride. The rest of us have to.
Everything about it stinks - politically, figuratively and literally. Try standing on the Uptown #1 platform at Penn Station and not gag from the smell of vomit, garbage, and human and creature excrement.
It is getting harder and harder to be civil in this city of mostly self-absorbed hairballs. The rich don't ride. The rest of us have to.
6
Leave early? Walk?
3
The rich people in NYC do not care - they do not take the subway - all the rest of you can go scratch.
12
"The rich people in NYC do not care - they do not take the subway - all the rest of you can go scratch."
It's a hazardous proposition to say what people in New York City are "rich."
Those you might think of as rich -- who, true, would be rich in other municipalities in which they in fact do not live -- are just making do. Yes, they're making do in their East 83rd Street apartments, in their apartments on Riverside Drive or on West End Avenue -- they work constantly to pay their bills, which are considerable. They try to save money for their kids' college tuitions, and they'd like to save money for their retirements, which they're putting off longer and longer. You might sneer, but it isn't easy.
Oh, obviously there are poor people and middle-class people who struggle to pay their rent -- which are lower than other people's.
To each his own.
But your so-called rich, too, take the subways. I see them on my own, middle-class, way into and out of the city.
It's a hazardous proposition to say what people in New York City are "rich."
Those you might think of as rich -- who, true, would be rich in other municipalities in which they in fact do not live -- are just making do. Yes, they're making do in their East 83rd Street apartments, in their apartments on Riverside Drive or on West End Avenue -- they work constantly to pay their bills, which are considerable. They try to save money for their kids' college tuitions, and they'd like to save money for their retirements, which they're putting off longer and longer. You might sneer, but it isn't easy.
Oh, obviously there are poor people and middle-class people who struggle to pay their rent -- which are lower than other people's.
To each his own.
But your so-called rich, too, take the subways. I see them on my own, middle-class, way into and out of the city.
3
The NYC subway system is unique or close to it in the world - it never closes. It never shuts down. Ever. Other major global cities? Trains stop running during the night...midning - 5 a.m. in some cities, 2 a.m. - 5 a.m. in others. Not so in NYC, the city that never sleeps.
That convenience comes at a cost though - regular/routine maintenance, repairs, and cleaning is an afterthought.
In a way though this article gives me joy - not for the suffering of millions each day, but that our city is so vibrant that the system is being used to the brim and then some.
That convenience comes at a cost though - regular/routine maintenance, repairs, and cleaning is an afterthought.
In a way though this article gives me joy - not for the suffering of millions each day, but that our city is so vibrant that the system is being used to the brim and then some.
8
Have to take the subway into Manhattan tomorrow from the Bronx, and this article is giving me a panic attack!
1
The NYC Planning Dept. estimates the City's population at 8,550,405.
Has anyone at the MTA, the Mayor's office, et al, given thought to the plethora of newly constructed residential high-rise towers as part of the subway problem? Adding more housing without the related transportation infrastructure is illogical and insane.
I think the MTA does a rather good job with the stresses they face especially those that aren't necessarily their creation. City officials need to stop adding new apartments buildings without considering if the related infrastructure can actually sustain it.
Has anyone at the MTA, the Mayor's office, et al, given thought to the plethora of newly constructed residential high-rise towers as part of the subway problem? Adding more housing without the related transportation infrastructure is illogical and insane.
I think the MTA does a rather good job with the stresses they face especially those that aren't necessarily their creation. City officials need to stop adding new apartments buildings without considering if the related infrastructure can actually sustain it.
9
Chicken or the egg? Without those new units - housing prices would be even higher because demand would be under more pressure. It's not easy either way.
3
Andre - I don't know if that would be true but either way, it's sure not easy, as you say!
At the very least, developers - if they're not doing so already - should be contributing some of the millions they pocket in tax abatements, revenue, etc. towards mass transit. Maybe a "transit fee"? And where are the city planners saying STOP?!
At the very least, developers - if they're not doing so already - should be contributing some of the millions they pocket in tax abatements, revenue, etc. towards mass transit. Maybe a "transit fee"? And where are the city planners saying STOP?!
1
Sara - in most cases those tax abatements are to pay for "affordable housing". Apart from that - a lot of the MTA money comes from real estate.
A couple of things to consider: the Amtrak tunnels to NJ will soon have to be shut down for repairs. This will significantly reduce the number of Jerseyites riding the system. Also the Williamsburg tubes will need repair (making the scene in the photo a quaint reminder), reducing the number of Brooklynites. It's a hell of a way to run a transit system, but at least you'll be able to get a seat on the Q more often.
2
Please, for the love of sanity, take off your backpacks and purses and move to the center of the car. These two small courtesies would improve everyone's ride considerably.
18
Fellow New Yorkers, give the MTA a break. None of us can possibly imagine just how large and complex that system is.
I did, however, give up on the L train as a means to get to/from the East Village after waves upon waves of conformist youngsters all gentrified one tiny neighborhood on the L line (you know who and you know where). I don't pity them. You made your choice, and you ruined a convenient subway line.
As for me, I have to admit the subway is now a winter-only method of travel. My bike never lets me down and never tells me "We are stopped because of bike traffic ahead. Sorry for any inconvenience."
I did, however, give up on the L train as a means to get to/from the East Village after waves upon waves of conformist youngsters all gentrified one tiny neighborhood on the L line (you know who and you know where). I don't pity them. You made your choice, and you ruined a convenient subway line.
As for me, I have to admit the subway is now a winter-only method of travel. My bike never lets me down and never tells me "We are stopped because of bike traffic ahead. Sorry for any inconvenience."
4
I am often puzzled as to why media organizations like the Times don't investigate the corruption rampant in transit agencies like the MTA, and the state politicians and construction interests associated with it.
Why is it that every upgrade to our infrastructure (even routine maintenance) costs more and takes significantly longer than anywhere else - including third world countries? Why is it that even on such absurdly long timelines and expensive budgets, projects almost always run over budget and several years behind schedule? There's talk of shutting down the L train for 3 years (3 years!) to repair the tunnel. The 2nd avenue subway was supposed to be completed in 2013, and I bet the farm 2016 will end without the line being in operation. The new station at Hudson Yards is already leaky and falling apart due to shoddy construction, and it's been open less than a year.
Yes, increased ridership is an issue, but neither the MTA nor the state government are equipped to deal with this on a timely basis. New York likes to call itself the Greatest City in the World, but our crumbling infrastructure and our mediocre agencies give lie to such a claim. It's second-rate.
Would be great for the Times to engage in an old fashioned investigation that shows why it is that it takes years - sometimes decades - and billions of dollars to get anything done here - and even when it's done, it's mediocre in execution. It's disgusting.
Why is it that every upgrade to our infrastructure (even routine maintenance) costs more and takes significantly longer than anywhere else - including third world countries? Why is it that even on such absurdly long timelines and expensive budgets, projects almost always run over budget and several years behind schedule? There's talk of shutting down the L train for 3 years (3 years!) to repair the tunnel. The 2nd avenue subway was supposed to be completed in 2013, and I bet the farm 2016 will end without the line being in operation. The new station at Hudson Yards is already leaky and falling apart due to shoddy construction, and it's been open less than a year.
Yes, increased ridership is an issue, but neither the MTA nor the state government are equipped to deal with this on a timely basis. New York likes to call itself the Greatest City in the World, but our crumbling infrastructure and our mediocre agencies give lie to such a claim. It's second-rate.
Would be great for the Times to engage in an old fashioned investigation that shows why it is that it takes years - sometimes decades - and billions of dollars to get anything done here - and even when it's done, it's mediocre in execution. It's disgusting.
21
Nothing like starting your day packing it in on the 2/3, defending yourself against the NJ onslaught at Penn Station, exiting at 42nd Street, hustling up to become a human guinea pig while queueing up for the S, only to avoid getting run down by *up walkers*, cell phone junkies, or running over a tourist while attempting to criss-cross GCT, then dodging wrong way bound delivery guys on silent electric bikes, cars, cabs, and trucks, and dB levels near takeoff levels...
All of this just to sit in your cube for 8-10 hours...
Ah New York, best city on Earth.
All of this just to sit in your cube for 8-10 hours...
Ah New York, best city on Earth.
14
That being said, nothing like making it from downtown to the Natural History Museum - door-to-door - in 20 minutes with your 3 and 5 year olds on a Saturday morning...
Ah, New York, best city in Earth.
Ah, New York, best city in Earth.
5
There aren't enough poles and/or bars for people to hold on to on all trains. It is not uncommon to find a bunch of people crowding a specific area of the train because that is where they can get a spot with a pole/bar. I like those handles that swivel and are placed on the horizontal bars. They are the only way I can ride in those areas. There should be more of those, strategically placed all around the cars. I am a short person and I can't reach the horizontal bar if a person with long legs is sitting in front of me--I avoid those areas of the train. Also, has anyone seen the newer models? There are no poles or bars at the end of each car! I am not saying these minor cosmetic changes will solve the problem, but they can help.
4
There is no easy way to fix the problem, New York subway is kind of NYC landmark as well as essential transportation tools. As a frequent visitor, I suggest:
1.Eliminate monthly pass, all metrocard loaded with cash with 10% to 20% bonus. Subway is for long distance ride, but some use for a short ride, that is kind of abuse the pass.
2. Increase subway fare to $3.50, and decrease bus fare to $2.00, most crowded lines are in Manhattan region, but Manhattan buses are pretty empty, plus bus riders are mostly seniors and poor people. Manhattan is small island and easy walk, for health and environment ,it is strongly recommended people to walk.
3. Increase express bus or select bus at peak hours. It proves an efficient ways to move around. Even bus only lanes open at 3rd/Lexington and 6th/7th ave.
1.Eliminate monthly pass, all metrocard loaded with cash with 10% to 20% bonus. Subway is for long distance ride, but some use for a short ride, that is kind of abuse the pass.
2. Increase subway fare to $3.50, and decrease bus fare to $2.00, most crowded lines are in Manhattan region, but Manhattan buses are pretty empty, plus bus riders are mostly seniors and poor people. Manhattan is small island and easy walk, for health and environment ,it is strongly recommended people to walk.
3. Increase express bus or select bus at peak hours. It proves an efficient ways to move around. Even bus only lanes open at 3rd/Lexington and 6th/7th ave.
Completely wrong on so many levels. Thank you come again.
5
Just wait until all that affordable housing gets built.
1
Commuting on the subway is the worst part of my daily life. Not only is it crowded but construction and delays are endless. One of the most frustrating experiences, after weekends of construction, supposedly to improve service, is enduring delays on a Monday morning. Has anyone noticed how service also gets worse on Friday afternoons or before a holiday? It's as if the rank and file starts winding down early!
Crowded, expensive and lousy subways to boot, New York living is now way overrated. I've lived here my entire life, and if it weren't for work and family responsibilities, I'd be out of here so fast your head would spin.
Crowded, expensive and lousy subways to boot, New York living is now way overrated. I've lived here my entire life, and if it weren't for work and family responsibilities, I'd be out of here so fast your head would spin.
7
To whom is this news? What did the Bloomberg administration do for the existing subway lines? Zero to not much. The subways show a blatant disregard for the lives of the city's working people, the people who do much to make this city what it is.
6
Bloomberg didn't run the MTA. What is your point? Part of the problem is misinformed voters.
Are you serious, Andre? Who are you calling misinformed? The mayor's office sets priorities. And subways and especially subway riders were not on the Bloomberg's must do list. Here in W'sburg Brooklyn the population has increased significantly and there was no effort -- none -- to widen the subway entrances, or require the developers to widen them. Why not? And there's no need to answer.
2
Amen to that - Ameticans should be embarrassed by the subway in NYC (and I tell them so every time it's brought up- they tend to agree) . It's s relic from the seedy dark eighties and it needs to be sorted out if you want to compete with likes of London.
3
Been to London. Feels like a toy. An I feel I have to duck to get into the car and I am only line 5.6.
2
There's a whole new city being built where the Lincoln Tunnel surfaces in Manhattan that should have been planned with an entirely separate level for pedestrians who now snarl tunnel traffic at street crossings. Does anyone plan or think here?
12
Instead of investing in accelerating construction and expanding the 2nd Avenue Subway and installing a modern, computerized signal system which would allow more trains to run, the MTA has decided to waste $12 Billion getting a couple'a thousand LIRR riders a few blocks east in Midtown with what is called the East Side Access Capital Project "boondoggle."
The misplaced Capital Budget priorities of the MTA are obscene.
The misplaced Capital Budget priorities of the MTA are obscene.
8
East Side Access is a very needed project fr more than just people on Long Island. It in actuality will end up connecting the Tri State Area at both Penn Station (where Metro North will begin running) and Grand Central. It's 6 billion dollars too expensive and 6 years late - but that doesn't negate the merits of the project. The problem is they can't do things on time and within budget.
2
@Andre. I'm sure there are merits to East Side Access, but I'm talking about prioritizing capital expenditures. For $12 Billion the more essential 2nd Avenue Subway and system-wide upgrades could have been accomplished with money left over. And how much of the $12 Billion East Side Access funds were borrowed adding interest payments that will be a burden on the MTA for a long long time. Let's see the cost/benefit analysis for East Side Access.
Did you miss where I said it was over budget? Guess what else is over budget? The Second Ave Subway... That's the problem. They don't do capital projects efficiently.
Seems to me Rush Hour could contain a up charge which would discourage those not needing to get someplace during those hours. Lets say between 7am and 10:am it would be 4.00 to ride and the same for 4:00pm thru 7:00pm in the evening. Why is this rocket science. Mid day and after rush hour eves can go back down to the 2.75 per swipe. Where else can you pay 2.75 and ride from the Northern Bronx to Southern Brooklyn and get a transfer for free to the Bus.
2
You must not be from here. Do you believe all the students and adults squeezing into the train during rush hour are just bored? If they had better things to do, they wouldn't be getting on the train playing hold your breath.
13
Surge pricing only works if there are other options. For the vast majority of us, we're going to keep taking the train during rush hour because that's all there is, and our jobs demand we arrive before 10am. Charging more would only hurt the people who are least able to afford alternatives, if they exist.
14
So you want to stick it to working people who punch a clock every day and give a discount to tourists, unemployed trust-fund babies, and high-salaried people with the privilege of setting their own hours? Great plan!
4
All transportation concerns are local, much like each of our individual state's political woos.
We need a transportation bill passed in Congress. Transportation Secretary Fox has a plan of action for all modes of transportation, yet without Congress's approval bridges will continue to crumble, roads won't get build, railways suffer and we citizens will smell our closest, new public transportation riding buddy for some time to come.
Nationally, we have become a patchwork transportation system made up of smaller spending construction projects on road repairs and other public transportation modalities. Annually local and state governments know what their state's transportation needs are and State transportation departments end up taking much needed transportation projects set to serve local citizens off the to-do table because of the lack of longterm transportation bill funding.
These projects are slated to add services and would create crafts-jobs and small business development in many of our communities.
We are not getting much transportation usage out of our tax dollars. Nationally we are barely sustaining in transportation. The baby is ugly!
An individual with a small natural resources footprint this is only part of what is needed today, we needed yesterday for Congress to stop kicking the can down the street and get us a longterm, approved transportation bill.
We need a transportation bill passed in Congress. Transportation Secretary Fox has a plan of action for all modes of transportation, yet without Congress's approval bridges will continue to crumble, roads won't get build, railways suffer and we citizens will smell our closest, new public transportation riding buddy for some time to come.
Nationally, we have become a patchwork transportation system made up of smaller spending construction projects on road repairs and other public transportation modalities. Annually local and state governments know what their state's transportation needs are and State transportation departments end up taking much needed transportation projects set to serve local citizens off the to-do table because of the lack of longterm transportation bill funding.
These projects are slated to add services and would create crafts-jobs and small business development in many of our communities.
We are not getting much transportation usage out of our tax dollars. Nationally we are barely sustaining in transportation. The baby is ugly!
An individual with a small natural resources footprint this is only part of what is needed today, we needed yesterday for Congress to stop kicking the can down the street and get us a longterm, approved transportation bill.
5
My pet peeve - on the way home I take the A to Jay Street to switch for the F. There is a station manager at that station, yet I wait 10 minutes before I hear the announcement "due to an earlier incident there are delays on the F train and the next one is 5 stops away". Really - they didn't know there were delays 10 minutes ago. Not even sure why they bother having a station manager when s/he can't even make announcements in a timely manner.
4
The subway system also rents out an enormous amount of advertising space and considerable retail space. This must generate a great deal of income that doesn't seem to go toward improving service. Who's skimming that money?
12
The retirement benefits of former MTA workers living like princes down in Florida.
3
Dr. Zizmor
5
Learn from the Asia cities:
1. More trains, during rush hours train every 1 to 2 minutes
2. Safety gates/doors on all stations
3. Open pathway between train to carry extra passengers.
This is all being done in Asia, what's the big deal?
1. More trains, during rush hours train every 1 to 2 minutes
2. Safety gates/doors on all stations
3. Open pathway between train to carry extra passengers.
This is all being done in Asia, what's the big deal?
8
Those subways in asia are not a century old
While 1 and three could be done
I dont know why they picked the l train for modernizing the signals instead of the six train
While 1 and three could be done
I dont know why they picked the l train for modernizing the signals instead of the six train
6
The big deal is the price tag. Number 1 requires a upgrade to the signalling system. Numbers 2 and 3 require replacement of current train cars as well as platform construction at hundreds of stations. The cost and level of disruption is massive.
2
Perhaps all the developers of the mega-towers should be forced to ride the local mass transit before they are allowed to build more housing there. People should not have to suffer to get from home to work.
13
I suddenly don't feel so aggravated about our Los Angeles freeway traffic.
Staggered work hours and tele-commuting might help! Not everyone needs to be at their desk at 9am.
Staggered work hours and tele-commuting might help! Not everyone needs to be at their desk at 9am.
4
This is the quality of life people pay 40%+ of their income in rent for.... I did 15 years and got out only to wonder why I didn't do it before.
8
It would help if dolts would take off their backpacks. Day after day while trying to walk to the center of the train I get smacked in the face and they don't care at all.
12
You tap them on their shoulder. If they refuse, hang onto it for dear life. They will likely not do it again for a long while.
5
Not another Deblasio victory, but I take the subway every day into the city, and truth is that it's much more predictable and reliable than New Jersey transit.
4
Cuomo, Andrew Cuomo oversees the MTA and Subway system.
1
To all that ask why don't we build more lines - where exactly should they go? Every time you build a skyscraper you have to anchor it somewhere, so there is less room for subway stations. And with development of subway stations must come the partial shutdown of the subway which will create more overcrowding before it creates less. This is the classic case of what happens when politicians kick the can down the road until the problem is too large to fix.
9
Just wait until they close down the L train for three years. You think things are bad now, wait until all of Williamsburg is trying to board the J at Marcy. It's going to be ugly, folks.
9
Before I even got to the reference to London in the article, this article had reminded me of my recent trip to London.
The Tube stations were PACKED! Some stations even had long lines just to swipe your card.
However, they had a lot more crowd control. The layout and signage ensures that crowd flow is only in one direction which is a huge help. There were platform controllers and announcers on every platform during rush hour and they kept everything in order. Also, at the entrance there are multiple people to help you – noticeably they were all helpful and spoke English well.
As mentioned in the article, when I went to take the tube from Victoria Station to get to Heathrow for my flight, the tube station was so crowded that they CLOSED the entrance! I didn’t know what to do and worried that I might miss my flight! Fortunately, it reopened fairly quickly but I had never seen anything like the hordes of people surging out of the station.
Finally, every station has signage BEFORE you go in stating what the current status is and if there are any problems. This is not the countdown to the next arrival (that is at the platform level), but rather just signs that list every line at that station and that says either “good service” or “delays”. That way, you can consider alternatives BEFORE going down into the station. This is low tech (signs are just printed and can slide in and out) and low cost but very useful.
The Tube stations were PACKED! Some stations even had long lines just to swipe your card.
However, they had a lot more crowd control. The layout and signage ensures that crowd flow is only in one direction which is a huge help. There were platform controllers and announcers on every platform during rush hour and they kept everything in order. Also, at the entrance there are multiple people to help you – noticeably they were all helpful and spoke English well.
As mentioned in the article, when I went to take the tube from Victoria Station to get to Heathrow for my flight, the tube station was so crowded that they CLOSED the entrance! I didn’t know what to do and worried that I might miss my flight! Fortunately, it reopened fairly quickly but I had never seen anything like the hordes of people surging out of the station.
Finally, every station has signage BEFORE you go in stating what the current status is and if there are any problems. This is not the countdown to the next arrival (that is at the platform level), but rather just signs that list every line at that station and that says either “good service” or “delays”. That way, you can consider alternatives BEFORE going down into the station. This is low tech (signs are just printed and can slide in and out) and low cost but very useful.
11
Somehow the political leadership both in Albany and Washington seem to have forgotten what the word 'public' means in public transportation. It's not just that the public is using this mode of transportation, but that the entire system serves the public good. Business, industry, education, government, none of our institutions can function in New York without a well running and well funded public transportation system.
While we're all annoyed with the crowds and the delays, the truth is that the MTA's budgeting system has been a version of robbing Peter to pay Paul. Maintenance on one line is deferred to service another one. Then that one breaks down and the round robin starts all over.
In todays economic order we foolishly pursue tax cuts as a solution to every problem, as if ones $100 tax refund could pay for a new subway car. There is enough money in our state and city economy to solve this problem. But too much of it remains in private hands at the expense of the public good. There's no better example of that than our old, broken down subway system.
While we're all annoyed with the crowds and the delays, the truth is that the MTA's budgeting system has been a version of robbing Peter to pay Paul. Maintenance on one line is deferred to service another one. Then that one breaks down and the round robin starts all over.
In todays economic order we foolishly pursue tax cuts as a solution to every problem, as if ones $100 tax refund could pay for a new subway car. There is enough money in our state and city economy to solve this problem. But too much of it remains in private hands at the expense of the public good. There's no better example of that than our old, broken down subway system.
11
Embrace the free market theory. Drastically increase the fares during rush hour to say $25. Sell an elite pass for $5,000/Month that guarantys the club member a reserved seat in a car with sofas and recliners separated from the commoners cars. Use the increased revenues to give to administrators so their salaries can be held at 100 times the median salaries of the people in operations. When service satisfaction declines to unacceptable levels pay the top administrator a minimum bonus of $25 million to go away.
6
Why no mention of the bands - including some very good ones - who play in the subway stations? Many times, I have been feeling grim - only to come across a musician/band who paints a smile on my face. One of my regrets is hustling onward after only a minute or two - and missing out on interesting performances. The MTA is to be commended for these underground, acoustically resonant music halls. As to the performers - thank-you for the great energy you provide!
11
Another victory for Socialized transportation. Just as with Socialized Medicine; high prices, low supply, and nothing but failure.
NY'ers have NO ONE TO BLAME but themselves.
NY'ers have NO ONE TO BLAME but themselves.
Stay in Texas, you don't have a clue! I have a clue, I emigrated from Texas to live in NYC and never looked back.
14
Say, Mark, how about that socialized money that Texas gets from the federal taxes we pay in New York? You know, the federal dollars your state takes much more of than it gives back.
14
As an ex New Yorker and presently in Texas you have to wonder sometimes. I can't say if all Americans should be embarased (?) but my fellow Texans need an education in civics. Highways wear out like subways. Your taxes pay for highways. Can't get there in Texas without a car and a road to drive on? It's like that in in NYC except they need alot of mass transit.
To recap thank your gov mint for your roads and pray for more gov mint money for schools. Your children need it.
To recap thank your gov mint for your roads and pray for more gov mint money for schools. Your children need it.
4
One-third of Bay Area residents hope to leave soon, poll finds
San Jose Mercury News, May 2, 2016
Two of the US's premier tech/industry hubs are decades behind in transportation and infrastructure which pretty much tells the story of US exceptionalism and leadership. Luckily we have IPhones to track this mess.
San Jose Mercury News, May 2, 2016
Two of the US's premier tech/industry hubs are decades behind in transportation and infrastructure which pretty much tells the story of US exceptionalism and leadership. Luckily we have IPhones to track this mess.
6
Double or triple the fare and have surge pricing. Let the market solve the problem.
2
And if the working poor can't affford bread, let them eat cake.
16
DRS,
Sure, let's use your clearly thought out solution. Make sure you're on duty to clean toilets, serve coffee, make deliveries, answer phones, tidy the streets and a few other things the rest of us have in mind. If we have a few hundred of you, we won't need the other millions who get in the way during rush hour.
Sure, let's use your clearly thought out solution. Make sure you're on duty to clean toilets, serve coffee, make deliveries, answer phones, tidy the streets and a few other things the rest of us have in mind. If we have a few hundred of you, we won't need the other millions who get in the way during rush hour.
5
This story makes me glad to be living in a (primarily) rural state where waiting at an intersection, or traffic light, is (at most) a matter of a minute or two. From an outsiders perspective this doesn't make much sense. The richest, largest city in the US and we have a third rate transportation system?
4
The solution is obvious, reduce taxes on the 1%. That solves all of society's ills.
12
Brilliant sarcasm! From a Snodgras!
5
Very, very few know the true ins and outs of subway reliability and capacity. Yet here all the people come out of the woodwork, claiming this or that solution. One person blames the MTA board, another blames lack of performance metrics, another says open gangway cars will solve the problem. The reality is that all of the real issues are known, but nothing can be done about it, ultimately due to the stranglehold of the unions. It is as simple as that.
There is little about the subway's reliability and capacity issues that cannot be solved, up to a point, with low cost. There is nothing about increasing reliability or capacity that isn't known (at least, by the few people whose job it is to know). But that isn't even the point.
The labor costs at all American transit systems are through the roof. The Unions in public transportation and professional extortionists who are exploiting 1960s legislation to feed the wallets of their members at the expense of the riders.
For the amount of money that is spent on the rank-and-file employees, the public should be seeing 1.5x as much service. As for service delays, these can be reduced when you have more manpower resources to work with.
There is little about the subway's reliability and capacity issues that cannot be solved, up to a point, with low cost. There is nothing about increasing reliability or capacity that isn't known (at least, by the few people whose job it is to know). But that isn't even the point.
The labor costs at all American transit systems are through the roof. The Unions in public transportation and professional extortionists who are exploiting 1960s legislation to feed the wallets of their members at the expense of the riders.
For the amount of money that is spent on the rank-and-file employees, the public should be seeing 1.5x as much service. As for service delays, these can be reduced when you have more manpower resources to work with.
24
In Japan, public education to coordinate behavior to increase the capacities of public systems actually works!
1
I hope you recognize the irony when you criticize people coming out of the woodwork to find that one, magical solution to the problem and then you come out of the woodwork to add your own solution of blaming unions.
5
And what is the pay scale between tank and file MTA workers and signor management?
2
Which is why I no longer take the subway. It's the bus or walking for me.
4
An answer could be ferries. Take some pressure off the subway and run high-speed ferry service up and down the Hudson and East Rivers. Get to the ferries by foot or bike or cross-town bus. Get a fleet of super zippy high speed ferries, not the plodding ones in service now. Some could be "local", some "express". Manhattan is tailor-made for this with navigable waterways surrounding the whole island.
5
Excellent idea...I would definitely take it!
Of course, no mention of immigration and population growth, and whether this is desirable, for the country as a whole, or for specific metropolitan areas.
3
Now now, you know how those pro-immigration people get when anyone mentions such topics. Illegal immigration is one of our many problems which contributes to our daily nightmare of a commute.
3
This makes me love my car even more.
Sorry, greenies. This suburban boy wouldn't live like that.
Sorry, greenies. This suburban boy wouldn't live like that.
3
"a resurgence almost unimaginable in the 1970s..." Who else remembers the free-return coupons (which looked like the old newsprint-weight bus transfers) given out on Sundays to encourage off-peak ridership by offering effectively a half-off fare?
3
In an unfortunate layout juxtaposition, an article about frayed tempers on the subway appears right above one for "Basic Knife Skills".
5
My personal solution to subway overcrowding is to avoid the subway as much as possible (and I also do my best to avoid taxi/uber because I don't want to contribute to street vehicular traffic). I know it’s not realistic for everyone, but I walk and bike to work and to almost everywhere else I go. I happen to live reasonably close to work and also Citibike (despite their own problems with reliability) has been a gamechanger for many destinations that are too far to walk, especially those that aren’t well connected by the subway.
Somehow I must just have bad luck with the subway though — I end up taking it a few times per week and over half the rides I end up standing there on the platform waiting well over 10 minutes for the next train to come. Which of course discourages me even more from using the subway. Oh and don't get me started on the ridiculously embarrassing physical condition of our stations -- one need only visit London or Berlin or Hong Kong or Tokyo to see that something is incredibly, incredibly wrong in New York.
Somehow I must just have bad luck with the subway though — I end up taking it a few times per week and over half the rides I end up standing there on the platform waiting well over 10 minutes for the next train to come. Which of course discourages me even more from using the subway. Oh and don't get me started on the ridiculously embarrassing physical condition of our stations -- one need only visit London or Berlin or Hong Kong or Tokyo to see that something is incredibly, incredibly wrong in New York.
6
I love New York City and think it’s the greatest city in the country. When I lived there in the early ‘70s I used the subway exclusively for there is no other way to travel in the Big Apple. Even though the subways were crowded like sardines in a can at the AM and PM rush hours back then, I didn’t care - it was New York and loved being there.
Since then, I have visited London numerous times and I have to admit, their transit system is by far the most sophisticated, superior and cleanest in the world. With all of the latest security and high tech aspects to their system, I feel safer there than any city in the US.
The major difference between London's transit and New York City's or any other U.S. city rail system for that matter, is that London’s transportation system is backed by government monies. The majority of people in London take public transportation because the cost of gas (petro) is outrageous coupled with the added taxes of entering the city during peak business hours. The UK and all of Europe has always prioritized and valued public transportation. Most Americans prefer their cars to transit and unfortunately, the Federal Government does not subsidize transit nearly as heavily as Europe. Until the attitude about public transportation changes at the Federal level, American rail and bus riders will continue to be considered second class citizens.
7
London's system is nowhere near the size and extent of NYC. Also does not run entirely 24/7 (although I heard they are introducing a night tube)
1
The NYC metro area governments (NY, NJ and CT) and the MTA rarely coordinate public transportation infrastructure to the degree done, successfully, in European cities. And we commuters pay the price.
London is building out even more suburban rail lines interesting with its subway lines facilitating public transit options.
We get: Chris Christie, Andrew Cuomo, Bill DeBlasio - unable to agree on anything but their corruption, and bike lanes that help few commuters.
London is building out even more suburban rail lines interesting with its subway lines facilitating public transit options.
We get: Chris Christie, Andrew Cuomo, Bill DeBlasio - unable to agree on anything but their corruption, and bike lanes that help few commuters.
5
I realize that London does not have anywhere near the volume of riders like NYC, but the point was that London's transit and of Europe's transit are heavily government funded and subsidized whereas NO US city can come close to that percentage of funding. As a matter of fact, transportation subsidies usually gets cut. Automobiles are the main mode of transportation in the States whereas in London and through Europe, public transportation is paramount. I truly do feel for the folks in NYC when there are more riders than track, trains and train operators combined.
1
Why not start some 4 5 and 6 trains in Manhattan during the rush hour and turn them around in the Financial District. Surely some operations research algorithm can help here. I don't miss the humiliation of being a subway rider in New York but I certainly admit it is one of the best systems in the world in terms of schedule and availability.
2
I actually live and work in the same area of Chelsea. When and if I take the train, I never have an issue. So I cannot relate to majority of the problems here.
1
Congratulations.
8
So glad you felt compelled to comment, then!
9
Chelsea is in Bronx? When did it move?
6
I don't buy the nonsense about increased ridership causing delays and overcrowding. I try to avoid taking the subway because service seems to have gotten much worse under de Blasio. After rush hours it's not unusual to wait 20 minutes for a train. By then a platform is packed. I think the solution is obvious.....more trains!
8
You understand de Blasio has no more control over how the subways are run than you or I do, right? MTA is a creature of New York State.
9
The mayor has zero control over the MTA.
5
When I lived in Jersey City 20 years ago and commuted to work through the disgraceful PABT, I always avoided the E train that would take me near my office for all these same reasons: overcrowding, stations that were filthy, smelly, sous vide in the summer and cryogenic in the winter, unreliable wait times, ick.
Unless it was pouring down rain, I walked over to Park Avenue. I like to walk and even in the dead of winter, it beat waiting on the E train.
Unsurprisingly, things have only gotten worse.
Which leads me to ask: why are you still living this way?
Unless it was pouring down rain, I walked over to Park Avenue. I like to walk and even in the dead of winter, it beat waiting on the E train.
Unsurprisingly, things have only gotten worse.
Which leads me to ask: why are you still living this way?
4
Corrupt public officials. Organized crime. These are the primary reasons our city's infrastructure, particularly the subway system, is crumbling before our eyes — yet neither is mentioned in this article (or most NYT stories of this nature.)
Of course, the .01% don't ride the subways, so it's not really important.
Of course, the .01% don't ride the subways, so it's not really important.
15
New York City has always been indifferent to its denizens and visitors. This is underscored most severely with its mass transportation system. The MTA, politicians, and those who can afford alternative means of transportation have no reason to care about the working class people who depend on the subway trains and buses. Inconsistent stops, backups between subway cars, overcrowding, and poor communication have long been a problem for commuters.
The commuting experience has been made worse lately with beggars asking for money inside the cars and free swipes as you cross the turnstiles. At $2.75 a pop and no cost of living adjustments to working class wages, it has become harder to be generous to beggars. For a so-called world class city like New York, it is a shame that its public services have become worse than many third world countries. Few places in the United States so clearly demonstrate the harshest consequences of the class divide than the MTA.
The commuting experience has been made worse lately with beggars asking for money inside the cars and free swipes as you cross the turnstiles. At $2.75 a pop and no cost of living adjustments to working class wages, it has become harder to be generous to beggars. For a so-called world class city like New York, it is a shame that its public services have become worse than many third world countries. Few places in the United States so clearly demonstrate the harshest consequences of the class divide than the MTA.
15
The real problem is the boom in real estate development. More buildings=more people. Instead of giving companies huge tax incentives to build (do they really need this in a city where everyone wants to be?), we should charge them a certan dollar amount to have the right to build, and put that money towards improvements in the subway line.
18
It feels insane to say it, but I miss the NYC subway (I was straphanger for 10 years). I moved to the Bay Area two years ago, and public transit here is terrible. I'm lucky in that I take the ferry across the Bay, but it's $9.75 a day for a round-trip! I then have to walk 2 miles to my office (or pay an additional $2.50 to ride MUNI -- adding another $5 a day to the commute is not an option, so I am taking up rollerskating). I never come into the city on the weekends, primarily because figuring out how to get around gives me the vapors (plus it costs $10 just to get here and home again). Forget driving to work. I had to drive to work once, and it took 2 hours to get through the tolls at the Bay Bridge (plus $5 to get across, plus gas, plus $15 to park for the day). I braced for it, but it was a nightmare. I am trying to find a new job, but my prospects are limited because of geography and the lack of public transit to get me around. I never once worried about that sort of thing in NYC.
19
Please, feel free to go back to NY. We could use fewer people here in the Bay Area also.
1
Robert,
Don't be a hater. Kate makes a very real point about SF's lack of real transportation options and ridiculous costs.
Don't be a hater. Kate makes a very real point about SF's lack of real transportation options and ridiculous costs.
7
When I lived in NYC, the subway was truly the fastest way to get around although dirty and crowded. Before I moved in 1996, I switched from the subway to the Express bus. It cost a lot but it was clean, fast and comfortable. I don't know he solution but it's a shame that more NYC residents can't afford the Express buses.
6
Actually, it probably a good thing that more people do not take the bus. Traffic above ground would be even more horrendous, and your fast trip would slow down to a crawl. Not to mention all of the added pollution.
3
The buses use the Express lanes for the most part so there was little congestion.
Our political system is almost perfectly designed not to address this problem. The governor controls the MTA, but has no political incentive to make improvements: devoting state resources to NYC infrastructure will win him few additional votes and potentially lose him many. The mayor has no control, not even leverage on the governor. Neither really wants to elevate the issue because they can't even effectively smack each other with it.
And while a system this big obviously captures an economically diverse ridership, we know who's not there: the political donor class. So the folks writing the checks aren't pushing progress here either.
I hate to say it, but I don't think this problem gets better until there's a tragedy--or a series of system failures that actually hurts the city's economy. It's almost enough to make one wish we had to go without the subway for, say, 24 hours; that would focus attention.
And while a system this big obviously captures an economically diverse ridership, we know who's not there: the political donor class. So the folks writing the checks aren't pushing progress here either.
I hate to say it, but I don't think this problem gets better until there's a tragedy--or a series of system failures that actually hurts the city's economy. It's almost enough to make one wish we had to go without the subway for, say, 24 hours; that would focus attention.
15
Did you not notice that nothing changed with the system after Hurricane Sandy? How much more 'attention' do you need or speak of? It's been mentioned before, the U.S.A. as a whole does not value public transportation as a public good. In fact, I'm beginning to wonder what in fact the U.S.A. values as a public good except cheap labor (imported or not) and endless wars.
5
Just telling us NY subway has problems is not good journalism, we all know it has.
Follow the money! How it is spend? What salaries have the people on MTA board? These ones, each of them:
http://web.mta.info/mta/leadership/board.htm
Why are they paid so well when MTA doesn't satisfies the needs of its customers?
Follow the money! How it is spend? What salaries have the people on MTA board? These ones, each of them:
http://web.mta.info/mta/leadership/board.htm
Why are they paid so well when MTA doesn't satisfies the needs of its customers?
29
How much money did we the US Taxpayer waste on fruitless wars in Iraq and Afghanistan?
There is one reason why we can't afford to fix anything in America. Wars, weapons systems, and profits are priority, people are a total afterthought. Besides, most rich people don't ride the subway, they are for the 'little people.' Does anyone care about 'Patriotism' if it doesn't relate to some ill gotten war?
There is one reason why we can't afford to fix anything in America. Wars, weapons systems, and profits are priority, people are a total afterthought. Besides, most rich people don't ride the subway, they are for the 'little people.' Does anyone care about 'Patriotism' if it doesn't relate to some ill gotten war?
16
Here's another big factor - why in the world do cabs go off duty at 4:30? Lots of people who can afford cabs will reluctantly take the subway because there are no taxis at rush hour. No wonder they're getting their butts kicked by Uber!
16
Excellent points raised by the other commentators. Here's my take as an LIRR commuter - we need a stored value card or key fob that can be scanned by the conductor and allow us to get a discounted number of rides, like a Metrocard. This would be a huge benefit to those of us who don't commute in every day during a week.
3
Several years ago Subway & bus service was cut by about a1/3 ( remember the W train? ). Why doesn't the MTA restore service to what it was before the cuts?
11
Very very often, people try to crowd into one door, when they could easily move a few feet down the platform to the next door. Very often, people step into the train, and then stand still, even if there are seats a few feet away. Very often people stand or sit on the steps when a train that is not theirs is entering or leaving the station. Very often people walk up to the turnstile, and to their great surprise, discover that they have to pay their fare, and only then, start looking for their Metrocard.
Then there are the out-of-towners, who don't have a clue (Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinyton anyone?).
Maybe if people could figure out how to ride the train, it would be more bearable.
Then there are the out-of-towners, who don't have a clue (Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinyton anyone?).
Maybe if people could figure out how to ride the train, it would be more bearable.
12
Seven brand new 16 story plus residential buildings have been built or are still under construction in my UWS neighborhood, and the nearby Museum of Natural History plans an expansion it expects will add 500,000 more visitors per year. Soon our west side subway lines will be as choked as the trains running on the east side.
15
With record ridership must come record revenues in the form of paid fares. How is it that changes to the system have not kept up? Where is all the extra money going? Sure, they're building a new line, but that plan has been in the works for decades.
15
Have to keep the union pension and benefits well oiled and keep the executive salaries high, you know....there are priorities!
6
Evidence please. I'd look it up myself but you raised the point so back up your assertion. Thank you.
1
The subway problems are symptomatic of the larger, systemic problems of a failing infrastructure around NYC: run-down airports, slow Amtrak, and etc. World-class cities have founds ways to make theirs the envy of the world. Beneath the shine is a run-down city.
27
I solved my Boston commuting woes by moving 45 minutes closer to work, buying a road bike, and negotiating a higher salary to offset ridiculous urban housing costs.
Net benefit to my personal happiness, fitness, and connection to community is profound! Costs include putting my dreams of affording graduate school, my own home or a family of happy bike commuters on indefinite hold.
Net benefit to my personal happiness, fitness, and connection to community is profound! Costs include putting my dreams of affording graduate school, my own home or a family of happy bike commuters on indefinite hold.
9
Cool. I'll simply sell my $400,000 apartment in Queens and buy a smaller, three million dollar apartment five miles from work. Problem solved!
14
Honestly, the fare is too low. If we doubled it a lot of people would choose rationally to ride less and the system would operate within its natural limits.
Great idea! That way, working-class people who can't afford $11 in subway fares every weekday can commute to and from their jobs via convenient, affordable unicorns!
24
We are looking at you, Governor Cuomo.
22
I have been traveling the world for 18 months now. The subways in Seoul, Busan, Tokyo, Kyoto, Osaka, Taipei, HK, Singapore, Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur, Madrid, Barcelona, Santo Domingo and Santiago de Chile are all in way much better condition, much cleaner, with modern trains always arriving and departing on time in spite of being just as packed as NYC trains during rush hour. The MTA needs to emulate the operational efficiency of these cities, instead of concentrating on doing cosmetic upgrades that in a few years start decaying.
15
All of the subway systems you mentioned have newer foundations and less ridership, two of the fundamental issues with upgrading the MTA trains.
4
Too many people in this city. The problem is the influx of immigrants in the last twenty years in Queens.. I have nothing against them, but the city never prepared for them. There's also multiple housing where there used to be one family homes so it's crowded. It's a matter of poor planning. On the other hand, the food is great and these people make the city more interesting.
4
@S. Maeve: About that "influx of immigrants in the last twenty years in Queens" - I'd like to know which Native American tribe you belong to, because otherwise YOU and YOUR FAMILY have been part of that "influx of immigrants" which has been going on for, oh, a few hundred years now in NYC. You think it's just Queens?!
9
The 2nd avenue subway extension took how long ? - 20 years or so ... A surface rail connection would have been done much quicker ... Surface level trains and / or busses on designated routes NOT shared with private autos would be much more convenient, riders get on/of quicker, and the construction process is relatively simple ... SPACE PROBLEM ? ... Sorry car drivers ... I know you feel you are being marginalized but the idea that using a car in a crowded city has been treated as rational and acceptable way beyond it's natural life so please be thankful for the indulgence you have received for too many decades ...
5
A few simple solutions that these oh-so-disgruntled patrons might try:
1. Walk - if you're waiting on 4 or 5 trains, that's on average 30-40 minutes... how far might you get if you were using your legs for movement, as opposed to standing idly on a congested platform? On average it takes me 15-20 minutes to walk 20-30 blocks (depending on time of day and weather). Think about it...
3. Invest in some roller skates/blades - read the first explanation and think about it some more...
2. Invest in a bicycle - reread the first explanation, and think about it some more...
3. Change your commute time - ever consider getting to work early? Talk to you boss, is there a way you can arrive/stay an hour or so later? Seems simple enough to me.
So simple, and all three would cost very little if anything. Yet if we did these things, who would have time to complain? Yeah... can't give that up, because complaining is really what we New Yorkers do best, isn't it?
1. Walk - if you're waiting on 4 or 5 trains, that's on average 30-40 minutes... how far might you get if you were using your legs for movement, as opposed to standing idly on a congested platform? On average it takes me 15-20 minutes to walk 20-30 blocks (depending on time of day and weather). Think about it...
3. Invest in some roller skates/blades - read the first explanation and think about it some more...
2. Invest in a bicycle - reread the first explanation, and think about it some more...
3. Change your commute time - ever consider getting to work early? Talk to you boss, is there a way you can arrive/stay an hour or so later? Seems simple enough to me.
So simple, and all three would cost very little if anything. Yet if we did these things, who would have time to complain? Yeah... can't give that up, because complaining is really what we New Yorkers do best, isn't it?
3
Make Citibike free. duh.
3
Citi bank would disagree with you, they are in it for the $$
1
And people miss NYC because of something like THIS?
People don't realize that the more things change, the more stay the same. If you're a New Yorker, three things should take notice:
1-Adapt on the fly. Even in the trains, you see a crowded area, either find a seat, room, or somewhere comfortable as fast as you can. It's a daily high risk/reward battle, and every day is another puzzle to solve.
2-Option your traveling. You find delays on the trains? Exit early, find different routes, and always carry something cold to drink. It lowers your stress during the time.
3-Common sense. If a subway car smells, move to the next one, and adjacent to the doors. Avoid conflicts, and just be aware of your surroundings. Last thing you want is the cops involved.
And people miss NYC because of things like this. I guess they're missing out the foods, sights, and sounds that make this place worth living.
...Hey, a hell of a lot better living up north, that's for sure...
People don't realize that the more things change, the more stay the same. If you're a New Yorker, three things should take notice:
1-Adapt on the fly. Even in the trains, you see a crowded area, either find a seat, room, or somewhere comfortable as fast as you can. It's a daily high risk/reward battle, and every day is another puzzle to solve.
2-Option your traveling. You find delays on the trains? Exit early, find different routes, and always carry something cold to drink. It lowers your stress during the time.
3-Common sense. If a subway car smells, move to the next one, and adjacent to the doors. Avoid conflicts, and just be aware of your surroundings. Last thing you want is the cops involved.
And people miss NYC because of things like this. I guess they're missing out the foods, sights, and sounds that make this place worth living.
...Hey, a hell of a lot better living up north, that's for sure...
It's not just subway gets overcrowded. The sidewalks , stores, schools, etc., everything is overcrowded. You are always in a crowd. The second avenue subway would not help. There is only one solution to stop the madness.
Stop the constructions. However, NY is the most friendly city to real estate developers and they rule the city.
Therefore, expect more crowds, until people stat to suffocate,
Stop the constructions. However, NY is the most friendly city to real estate developers and they rule the city.
Therefore, expect more crowds, until people stat to suffocate,
49
China has had fast, clean subways with "open pathways between cars" and "platform safety doors" for many years. In addition, most of their platforms are much wider than those in N.Y.C. Finally, almost all subway and train entrances have had baggage screening devices (which take about 5 seconds to get through) for many years.
Why don't we ever look to other places to see what already works? Hubris??
Why don't we ever look to other places to see what already works? Hubris??
10
The C line as it runs through Bed Stuy, Fort Greene, and downtown Bkln is also a mess. With all the development going on around Atlantic Yards, you'd think someone would realize that all these concertgoers, basketball and hockey fans, and new residents would require more trains. The developers basically stole land (bought for a song via eminent domain) AND managed to ruin quality of life for the remaining residents in one move. PROGRESS!
21
Kafka
2
My brother lives in Queens and commutes to Manhattan. He grew up in suburb of NYC. I take the train to Grand Central to visit him but infrequently. There have been a couple occasions where he just kinda shouted at me "Get on" when a crowded subway stopped and I initially thought it was too crowded.....my brother has turned into a real New Yorker..
4
It's mostly a problem of space. MTA could probably make some upgrades to alleviate the crowding, but only to a point. Soon you face the fact that there are only so many tracks, and they can only fit so many trains.
Next step is to replace cars with trams/streetcars on surface streets. It took what, 50 years to dig the 2nd avenue line? Surface tracks and waiting areas can be installed in months. Automobiles are an incomprehensibly inefficient use of precious space as a means of moving people around a crowded city - stop subsidizing them with free public land and put the space to better use.
Next step is to replace cars with trams/streetcars on surface streets. It took what, 50 years to dig the 2nd avenue line? Surface tracks and waiting areas can be installed in months. Automobiles are an incomprehensibly inefficient use of precious space as a means of moving people around a crowded city - stop subsidizing them with free public land and put the space to better use.
6
A victim of its own success. This combines population growth and the fact that the subway is perceived as safe and reliable by both residents and tourists alike. Manhattan is still the employment center for the metro region, so there are huge numbers of commuters. This contrasts to D.C's Metro system, which is in a downward spiral due to fatal accidents, constant delays, and crime. Ridership is down as a result so you can usually get a seat!
4
Too bad, we wasted trillion$ on cars and now there is too little for transit.
Decades have been lost, the time to increase subway capacity was during the 1940s and 50s. Can anyone here imagine construction of a new four-track mainline subway today? The disruption and cost would be impossible to bear. Where would it run? Would the city risk building such a line under Fifth Avenue?
Most likely is a surge pricing regime like that of Uber or the airlines.
Decades have been lost, the time to increase subway capacity was during the 1940s and 50s. Can anyone here imagine construction of a new four-track mainline subway today? The disruption and cost would be impossible to bear. Where would it run? Would the city risk building such a line under Fifth Avenue?
Most likely is a surge pricing regime like that of Uber or the airlines.
1
Welp, seems NYC should raise taxes to provide and maintain the clean and dependable transit system the peasants deserve
3
The fact that more and more can't afford to live in Manhattan makes it a commuter city. The numbers are only going to go up!
9
A question: is your rising rent going to infrastructure or to the landlord's pocket?
3
I've just spent 3 weeks in NYC. First thought about the subway system is that it must be truly appalling trying to ride it if you are disabled.
NYC infrastructure is bursting at the seams and needs rapid investment.
Go to Singapore and see how an MRT system should be operated.
Why don't you have box junctions on your roads such that unless the exit is clear you cannot enter the junction? Seems to work everywhere else, all too often I saw gridlock at junctions.
NYC infrastructure is bursting at the seams and needs rapid investment.
Go to Singapore and see how an MRT system should be operated.
Why don't you have box junctions on your roads such that unless the exit is clear you cannot enter the junction? Seems to work everywhere else, all too often I saw gridlock at junctions.
10
I've taken the Underground in London and Paris and I will say this, some of the people that use the NYC subway should be ashamed of themselves for the filth in the NYC subway system. Paris and London have clean stations, no garbage in the stations and on the tracks. It seems that some of the people that use our subway system are filthy pigs. Tourists who come here should be given free haz-mat suits to wear before they board a subway train in NYC. Thankfully I can walk to and from work if I choose to do so.
9
The blame falls squarely on Bloomberg, whose vision was of a super-wealthy city - but who didn't seem to understand (or care!) that infrastructure has to keep pace with development.
Somebody should tally how many "luxury" buildings have gone up in the last 12 years, and how many people are living in those buildings. I'd love to know how much more packed NYC has become.
I guess Bloomberg thought all the additional people would just get around by bike. WE ordinary New Yorkers live with the consequences of his lousy decisions, but hey, Bloomberg doesn't care, because mass transit doesn't exist in his billionaire bubble.
Bloomberg was absolutely one of the worst mayors we have ever had, from the POV of making NYC livable for the average working New Yorker.
Somebody should tally how many "luxury" buildings have gone up in the last 12 years, and how many people are living in those buildings. I'd love to know how much more packed NYC has become.
I guess Bloomberg thought all the additional people would just get around by bike. WE ordinary New Yorkers live with the consequences of his lousy decisions, but hey, Bloomberg doesn't care, because mass transit doesn't exist in his billionaire bubble.
Bloomberg was absolutely one of the worst mayors we have ever had, from the POV of making NYC livable for the average working New Yorker.
13
Last I checked, the MTA debt is at $34.1 billion! We need a Preet Bahara to look int what the heck is going in this organization! Revenue is at an all time high, yet they can't keep their books in check! They increase fares without improving service. And there is an absolute disproportionate use of money use of money. Ever seen the Wall street train station? It has PALM TREES! Meanwhile the train I took to get there was filthy and had a broken speaker so I couldn't understand a thing the conductor was saying. Other stations have leaking ceiling, and broken paint. Hey MTA how about investing in ALL train stations. Why must some riders know when the next train is arriving while others don't.
12
You do not need any investigator to tell you what's going on. I can tell you. The money which should be going into providing service is going into the pockets of the retired subway and bus drivers and maintenance workers, to give them lush health plans and pensions, many who had just a high school diploma and worked 25 years. How did they get away with this? Because of congressional law from 1964 which only affects transit workers, plus decades of legalized extortion. It is as simple as that.
4
Granted the TA has a lot of work to do on this but, my fellow commuters, there's one simple thing we can do to help each other out with the crowding issue, and that's to move into the center of the car. All too often in my daily commute, a train will pull into the station where there is ample room in the center of the car but the people by the doors just stand there like statues blocking the way. When I politely ask them to move into the car so that other people can board, all too often I either get grudging annoyance or dirty looks, as if the subway was their private ride. My wife who commutes with me is convinced that I'm going to get killed some day for doing this but it's really just common courtesy to let people board. Another thing that commuters need to remember is to take off your backpack if you're wearing one when it's crowded. You're taking up twice the space and, really, it sometimes seems as if some people have their entire worldly possessions crammed into those things. We all just have to remember that a little consideration can go a long way in making life easier for all of us.
18
The question is and always will be our own priorities as a voting public.
If we really wanted better public infrastructure and transit systems then we would elect leaders who aren't afraid to raise taxes to pay for it.
Because in the end, you always get what you pay for and we aren't paying much.
Please allow for a momentary pause while most economically disenfranchised voters called the republicans will blame the old lady down the block who gets food stamps.
If we really wanted better public infrastructure and transit systems then we would elect leaders who aren't afraid to raise taxes to pay for it.
Because in the end, you always get what you pay for and we aren't paying much.
Please allow for a momentary pause while most economically disenfranchised voters called the republicans will blame the old lady down the block who gets food stamps.
7
The New York subway system is an international embarrassment. Every single other first-world country has infrastructure vastly superior to ours. It is a perfect symbol for the decline of American exceptionalism. We are a nation in decay. It is time to stop kidding ourselves.
76
And many "developing" countries have better systems.
You talk about the lex and 7 and the L train,but everyone forgets about the Jolly J and its siblings the M and the Z. What's going to happen to these lines when the L train tunnel shuts down? They're already crowded even at 8pm. Everyone knows pm rush hour really starts at 2 pm when schools start letting out and all the people working the evening start going to work. What's the solution? More trains and track, of course. But subways take so long to build. That's why elevated tracks are the solution. Yeah they block some light and the ones we have ain't pretty but I'm sure someone can create something nice like the train to the plane over Atlantic avenue,Woodhaven boulevard.The real problem is the east river. Either jobs have to be pushed to Brooklyn Queens and Nassua or we need more bridges and tunnels. Time for some intense social engineering to get jobs out of Manhattan and shared throughout the city.
2
Back in the 60's and 70's, there was more frequent rush hour service (more trains), with the same technology that exists today. In fact, almost every trunk line had 30 trains per hours (and more, on the E/F and 7 lines). That isn't done today for three reasons:
(1) A number of operator-caused accidents caused the MTA to end the practice of train operators "keying-by" red signals and thus moving their trains closer together; this enabled trains to enter stations more quickly and permitted shorter headways. In fact, if you go back to the early days of the IRT, I believe there were 1 1/2 minute headways.
(2) These incidents also resulted in the creation of more "slow zones" which also prevent the operation of as many trains during peak hours. (Just remember the 14th Street-Union Square crash where a motorman crossed over a switch too fast.)
So sloppy behavior by a few train operators has resulted in slower service.
(3) Rider behavior: there was certainly a time when people knew that once the doors were closing, forcing your way in would not automatically result in the doors being opened again. Today, the amount of time it takes for a train to get its doors closed is ridiculous; on the other hand, when more trains were operated, passengers were more willing to let doors close and wait for the following train. We need to change passenger behavior.
More trains CAN be run outside of rush hour, but this takes money.
(1) A number of operator-caused accidents caused the MTA to end the practice of train operators "keying-by" red signals and thus moving their trains closer together; this enabled trains to enter stations more quickly and permitted shorter headways. In fact, if you go back to the early days of the IRT, I believe there were 1 1/2 minute headways.
(2) These incidents also resulted in the creation of more "slow zones" which also prevent the operation of as many trains during peak hours. (Just remember the 14th Street-Union Square crash where a motorman crossed over a switch too fast.)
So sloppy behavior by a few train operators has resulted in slower service.
(3) Rider behavior: there was certainly a time when people knew that once the doors were closing, forcing your way in would not automatically result in the doors being opened again. Today, the amount of time it takes for a train to get its doors closed is ridiculous; on the other hand, when more trains were operated, passengers were more willing to let doors close and wait for the following train. We need to change passenger behavior.
More trains CAN be run outside of rush hour, but this takes money.
8
'Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free'
Applicable to more than one New York island.
Applicable to more than one New York island.
Your article fails to note that there were more miles of track in the subway system in 1948. The Third Avenue El ran from Chinatown to the Bronx back then.
7
The graffiti never bothered me and the kind of people that complained about it weren't real New Yorkers anyway. As long as the trains run on time, and the express trains run express and the locals run local (especially at night), writing on the wall doesn't bother me. Those advertisements though, especially the full car ones, I could really do without them. I don't care how much money comes into the system through advertising, because we all know it doesn't go to contributing towards better service or faster trains.
2
In the face of this daily misery, one of many all throughout the country, you continue to support foreign policies that would put the needs of other nations consistently above our own and disparage and denigrate any one whose aim would be to put our own needs first.
How much longer can you maintain your fairytale worldview for the 1%? I'm thinking until hell freezes over and from the looks of these photographs that could be pretty soon.
How much longer can you maintain your fairytale worldview for the 1%? I'm thinking until hell freezes over and from the looks of these photographs that could be pretty soon.
9
"Installing a modern signal system, which would allow more trains to run, is many years away for most lines."
clearly, this needs to be moved to the top of the priority list.
clearly, this needs to be moved to the top of the priority list.
9
It is not necessary and would cost $100s of billions. Age of signalling does not always correlate with capacity.
That so many are riding the subways should be a good thing for the city. More customers means more revenue. More people using mass transit is what we all want.
How is it that this is treated as a problem? Why isn't the MTA using that extra income to run more trains and for general upkeep?
How is it that this is treated as a problem? Why isn't the MTA using that extra income to run more trains and for general upkeep?
28
Because extra riders does not mean extra income - it means extra deficit! Where is the money going? To the union membership - generally high school level education but receiving upper middle class pay, enormous pension and health care benefits. Tens of thousands of them sucking the poor unsuspecting riding public dry. They like to keep quiet about this. When they retire they laugh all the way to the bank. If you make them contribute 4% more to their health care they cry like babies and strike.
3
Because the MTA workers illegally strike if they are asked to contribute *anything* their lifetimes of free medical care for them and their families *and* their insanely generous pensions *or* to give up lifetime free subway rides for their entire family.
That's where all the money goes, just as with our school systems.
That's where all the money goes, just as with our school systems.
1
"Why isn't the MTA using that extra income to run more trains and for general upkeep?" Didn't you read the article? On most lines during rush hour, the system is maxed out. No additional trains can be run; the old signaling system can't handle it. Putting in new signals is one of the most difficult, expensive, and time-consuming things a system can do; it can take months or years of painstaking work and involves lengthy shutdowns. Although the MTA is a problematic organization in which everything is much more expensive and drawn-out than it should be, let's be fair: They're dealing with 469 antique subway stations, very old infrastructure, and not enough funding from Albany. Nobody else has a system this old and unwieldy; even London's is smaller. D.C.'s system is much smaller and it's in much worse shape and has had much less vital maintenance. So, it could be worse.
Nobody wants to bring up the 800 pound gorilla in the room. MTA is a poorly managed organization, less a service provider and more a socialist employment agency. It doesn't know how to fund itself, spends most of its revenues of paying its employees and places its employees interests far above the interests of commuters - its customers. Simply put - MTA cares zilch about its customers. Don't blame Bloomberg, he probably realized quickly there wasn't much he could have done. He is a smart man, and he was smart to walk away rather than fall into the MTA quagmire. Unfortunately, seems like MTA is not fixable - so we New Yorkers have to simply prepare for worse. In 2016 this organization is incapable of telling its customers when the next train will arrive, enough said.
20
I agree - except preparing for the worst. Tokyo is more crowded and is better run. We need to demand change and accountability.
1
The "musicians" who camp out on the northbound express platform at Penn Station create a lot of congestion as do the acrobats who perform in subway cars. The subway should not be used as an entertainment venue.
11
The construction boom in Manhattan, Downtown Brooklyn, Williamsburg and Long Island City means that
- infrastructure, transportation and parking needs must follow (if not precede)
- NY City's Dept of Education needs to plan beyond using trailers as classrooms in local schools on a "band-aid" basis.
- young adults need to vote consistently and advocate for these things to happen.
- infrastructure, transportation and parking needs must follow (if not precede)
- NY City's Dept of Education needs to plan beyond using trailers as classrooms in local schools on a "band-aid" basis.
- young adults need to vote consistently and advocate for these things to happen.
8
There will never be enough money to fix the Subway system, as long as all the billions of dollars in fares and subsidies are spent on Fat Pensions for Union employees.
BTW, these employees will never held accountable for their lousy work or overspending either. That's what the Unions are for...
BTW, these employees will never held accountable for their lousy work or overspending either. That's what the Unions are for...
10
Transportation is overcrowded for there is no real control over-building in New York City. There is to much building going on in NYC. there are cranes all over the city, and transportation is not being expanded. So in effect there are bicycle lanes, and cars have less space to drive around. Bus transportation is slow due to traffic. It can take an hour to go five miles on NYC buses. Politicians are owned by the real estate industry. There is a record number of homelessness in NYC with many living on the subway, So for the future start building more in outer boroughs if you are a city planner. Slow down construction in New York City or it is going to get much worse. Mayor DeBlasio seems stressed out by the real estate industry in new York City. As the Mayor he needs tone more oriented to all income brackets and he needs to control luxury building in New York City due to density.
10
By the time the MTA gets their house in order electricity will be obsolete.
2
"...The long-awaited opening of the Second Avenue subway on the Upper East Side this year will ease congestion on the Lexington Avenue line..."
No. It will not, because the vast majority of riders are coming from midtown to downtown for their jobs and the first stage of the project foolishly covers 96th St to 63rd St - at which point the riders change trains and the crowding continues - rather than 63rd to Hanover Square.
But, hey, it has only taken the city 95 years to get this one section of the line almost up and running, so the rest of it will surely be ready for riders by the year 2106.
No. It will not, because the vast majority of riders are coming from midtown to downtown for their jobs and the first stage of the project foolishly covers 96th St to 63rd St - at which point the riders change trains and the crowding continues - rather than 63rd to Hanover Square.
But, hey, it has only taken the city 95 years to get this one section of the line almost up and running, so the rest of it will surely be ready for riders by the year 2106.
6
Here in Rio the city bought 19 new Chinese trains with open pathways between cars, and they do make some difference, since on every connection between cars about 8-10 passengers can stand. These cars are also more modern looking, with better air conditioning, and have seats only sideways, freeing more space in the middle for people to stand.
3
The second avenue subway started construction when I was in college at Hunter. I am now a grandmother in my 60's! What else is new? After a few decades commuting on the subways since college, it is the same olds story: too many people. When I worked in the city, companies were leaving for suburban
pastures because, they said, New York City's infrastructure was falling apart and people could not get to work on time. How many times I was late for work and it was the same old story. I took the #7 in from Queens after a long bus ride. When I moved, I was a regular E and F train rider. Horrible. Glad to see all is status quo!
pastures because, they said, New York City's infrastructure was falling apart and people could not get to work on time. How many times I was late for work and it was the same old story. I took the #7 in from Queens after a long bus ride. When I moved, I was a regular E and F train rider. Horrible. Glad to see all is status quo!
5
After decades of companies leaving the city, the city is now completely empty. What's the problem?
1
I moved to London from NYC five years ago. The "tube" has padded seats with fabric seat covers. Enough said.
4
I visit London often and the tube constantly gets shut down. They make an announcement that the line is not running right now. That happens in NYC too, but with more more frequency in London. They can keep their seats.
3
Improved communication would go a long way towards easing tension on the subway/platform.
Last night at Broad Street, on the J train, they had us move to the downtown track to go uptown, once we got settled, a train left from the uptown track going... uptown. When we moved back to the uptown track, a train headed uptown from the downtown track! I waited 30 minutes at that station along with many other commuters.
No apology, no explanation, and no warning from MTA workers...
Last night at Broad Street, on the J train, they had us move to the downtown track to go uptown, once we got settled, a train left from the uptown track going... uptown. When we moved back to the uptown track, a train headed uptown from the downtown track! I waited 30 minutes at that station along with many other commuters.
No apology, no explanation, and no warning from MTA workers...
11
1.8 billion people multiplied by approximately $2.75 each, equals, well let's just say a lot of money! That should be a year round figure because tourists use mass transit and they are here every month, not just during the holidays or the summertime. Where is all of this money? Everyday, 7 days a week, on the 6th Avenue, 8th Avenue and Broadway lines there are signal, switch, track and mechanical problems. Whose pockets need to be emptied - besides every politician, MTA board member and officer of the MTA?
10
The streets work and they are free. Let's just charge the same amount to use the subway as we charge to use the street.
In actuality - if you shook out the pockets you named - that wouldn't even pay for one station rehab - nor a free fare for one day. The money goes to employees past and present - debt - contractors.
You CAN have a more enjoyable commute while helping others to less crowded trains. Just get off the train #OneStopEarly. Find us on Facebook join us in walking a few extra blocks.
11
Guess, you never heard of express trains...
2
Unless I want to tack on an additional 20-25 minutes to my already hour long commute, getting off one stop early on my express train to work isn't an option. There's a lot of difference in getting off at 14th street and walking up hill to 40th.
1
Mass transit is for convenience and speed. Walking that last stop defeats the purpose of mass transit.
1
The last time NYC started work on a NEW subway line was almost 100 years ago (in the 1920s)...
The last time a new regional train line was brought into service in the New York metropolitan area was when? The 1890s...
...Might that have something to do with this?
And, if we could afford to build the A,B,C,D,E and F subway lines in the depths of the Great Depression (along with the George Washington Bridge, the Triboro Bridge, Jones Beach, etc etc etc), why can't we afford that kind of investment now?
The last time a new regional train line was brought into service in the New York metropolitan area was when? The 1890s...
...Might that have something to do with this?
And, if we could afford to build the A,B,C,D,E and F subway lines in the depths of the Great Depression (along with the George Washington Bridge, the Triboro Bridge, Jones Beach, etc etc etc), why can't we afford that kind of investment now?
119
Labor was significantly cheaper, safety regulations were less onerous, and construction was easier because land was less developed.
http://www.nypl.org/blog/2015/05/04/subway-construction-then-now
http://www.nypl.org/blog/2015/05/04/subway-construction-then-now
Because nowadays 65% of every MTA budget dollar goes immediately out the backdoor for labor/pension/healthcare costs...back in the 1920's you had blue collar people doing blue collar work and getting paid blue collar wages.
Now, you have to run the TWU gauntlet - have to keep paying those LIRR conductors and maintenance people $250K (once they are through spinning the overtime roulette wheel and seeing "The Doc" for the bogus disability payout in perpetuity)
Good luck finding the necessary money to fund anything substantial once the administrators and employees get their hands out of the kettle.
Now, you have to run the TWU gauntlet - have to keep paying those LIRR conductors and maintenance people $250K (once they are through spinning the overtime roulette wheel and seeing "The Doc" for the bogus disability payout in perpetuity)
Good luck finding the necessary money to fund anything substantial once the administrators and employees get their hands out of the kettle.
2
Because taxes are bad. Ask any republican.
5
How many more units of housing does Mayor de Blasio want to build in East New York? Let's pile 10,000 more people onto the already overcrowded subways. Couple that with all the new housing going up in Williamsburgh and other parts of Brooklyn, and it is a recipe for a total disaster.
17
Governor Cuomo controls the MTA (nobody else), and yet there is not one mention or quote from him in this article. His promises of funding are just an IOU, so expect more of this crowding in the future. Until NY transit riders realize that Cuomo alone holds the power, nothing will get done.
43
You might want to add the Republican- (suburban-dominated) controlled State Senate.
2
No free lunch!
I am not saying this to riders, It is for MTA and NYS government.
No way you must invest in this system. If they think that it doesn't pays off, watch the misery and mutiny.
New york entire infrastructure looks like one step away from crumbling crush.
Roads are awful, simply awful. Subway is over whelmed, tunnels and bridges literally repellant.
This city needs huge investments to improve its transportation.
No free lunch MTA and government.
I am not saying this to riders, It is for MTA and NYS government.
No way you must invest in this system. If they think that it doesn't pays off, watch the misery and mutiny.
New york entire infrastructure looks like one step away from crumbling crush.
Roads are awful, simply awful. Subway is over whelmed, tunnels and bridges literally repellant.
This city needs huge investments to improve its transportation.
No free lunch MTA and government.
18
I recently started taking the NYC trains from Brooklyn to Midtown and it's very scary to stand on a platform filled with people and having an incoming train into the platform. Sometimes there is not enough space for you to move and you don't know who Is standing in back of you that could push you or get pushed etc, then of course you have to push in to be able to get in the train just like sardines. I used to ride the metro north while l lived in Morris heights and it was never like this. Always had seats available and plenty of space everywhere.
I still love NYC no matter what.
I still love NYC no matter what.
8
Finally, an article about the enormous problem with the subway, and not a single mention of the Governor, who controls the MTA.
73
Just one of the reasons I don't miss NYC.
6
We down here subsidize you up in Rochester - with a lower crime rate at that. Feel free to send some of our money back down here so we can expand the system.
10
suit yourself. i grew up where you live now, and i'd take nyc any day of the week, subway congestion or no subway congestion.
8
Then it's a good thing you moved. Why live in a place that makes you unhappy?
3
I lived in NYC for 17 years. None of these problems are new.
8
Imagine what Peter Minuit or the Lenape Indians who sold Manhattan Island to him would say, though.
"the subway infrastructure has not kept pace, and that has left the system with a litany of needs, many of them essential to maintaining current service or accommodating the increased ridership."
New York City has the highest tax rates in the United States. Does anybody wonder where the money goes?
New York City has the highest tax rates in the United States. Does anybody wonder where the money goes?
27
you would have to ask the governor, who usually raids the m.t.a. budget to prop up the rest of the state's finances.
2
>>>>New York City has the highest tax rates in the United States<<<<
What are you basing that on? This list from USA Today doesn't even put NYC in the top 10:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/personalfinance/2014/02/16/top-10-ci...
What are you basing that on? This list from USA Today doesn't even put NYC in the top 10:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/personalfinance/2014/02/16/top-10-ci...
2
It goes to the overly generous benefits for well-paid public union employees like the MTA workers, who average well over $100K in total compensation.
When liberals applaud $15/hour salaries for unskilled labor such as burger flippers in McDonald's, don't get angry when the prices go up all around you.
When liberals applaud $15/hour salaries for unskilled labor such as burger flippers in McDonald's, don't get angry when the prices go up all around you.
1
The city's now so proud of the annual tourist numbers. Millions. Remember when the tourists wouldn't even dream of taking the subway?
14
I used to live in NYC 2000-2001 and subway was horrendous back then. I can't imagine the chaos now just trying to get to and from work. I would prefer to walk under such stressful and dangerous conditions. It's not healthy being close to so many strangers like in a sardine can.
1
One question as a non-New Yorker but as a person interested in public transit:
*Why* is ridership at historic levels? Am I right in thinking that city population does not account for it?
*Why* is ridership at historic levels? Am I right in thinking that city population does not account for it?
10
No. The city population is also at a record high.
3
Would the fact that taxis and UBER are ridiculously expensive to use for a daily commute? Many people used to take taxis to work. The ride share option hasn't been tested, but then again, who wants to sit in traffic with strangers? :(
2
With all of these subway riders and their fares, you would thin that the MTA would be swimming in money and would not require that 90 cents of every dollar collected from the bridge and tunnel tolls be redirected to subsidize subway and bus rider fares.
6
Paul, the subsidy from Bridges & Tunnels is more like 14 cents on $1 of toll revenue. The FY16 adopted budget expects toll revenue of $1.832 billion vs. a transfer of $260 million to NYC Transit.
2
One would think you'd differentiate between PA bridges and tunnels, and MTA bridges and tunnels, and provide a source for your claims. PA funds have nothing to do with subways or city buses, unless you want to count the PA's own buses and the PATH subway--a subway that used to cost about a 1/4 of the MTA's price. PA bridges and tunnels sure are expensive though.
More and better subways and buses mean fewer cars and trucks on the road, so it's easier, on average, for the cars and trucks using roads and streets.
More and better subways and buses mean fewer cars and trucks on the road, so it's easier, on average, for the cars and trucks using roads and streets.
3
Kelly, what Paul means is that he wants to lower the cost of commuting by car so that there will be thousands of extra cars on the road during rush hour.
1
I agree with many of the suggestions above. In particular, institute peak pricing so that the retired and unemployed don't feel the need to run their non-time sensitive errands at 8:30 am and 5:30 pm. Also, foot traffic on platforms and stairs would move a lot more efficiently if everyone wasn't looking down at their phones so they are walking slowly and not in a straight line. Backpacks and large backs should be off at all times. And on a crowded train you do not have a God-given right to hold your coffee cup (which should not be allowed on trains) or magazine/ newspaper/ iphone with your arm stretched out in front of you - that is a luxury, not a right.
Finally, when things get backed up due to a sick passenger or whatever else, full trains should more liberally skip stops to get things back closer to schedule - this is done sometimes but not enough.
Finally, when things get backed up due to a sick passenger or whatever else, full trains should more liberally skip stops to get things back closer to schedule - this is done sometimes but not enough.
12
Actually, just skip the financial district and Midtown. That would speed up things a lot.
Charging those that work for a living a higher price won't solve over-crowding.
2
The only solution--more people working from home.
5
This is why I bike in NYC.
There are new secure bike lanes everywhere, and drivers - in my 10-year experience - are very mindful of bicyclists (but you must follow the rules yourself!).
Often my bike ride takes the same time as by subway. With the proper equipment you can bike by all weather except maybe snow and ice. I change clothes at work if needed.
Also, I have a foldable bike, so that I can bike one way and take the subway home the other way when it's less crowded. It's a very versatile solution for areas where the Citibikes haven't arrived yet.
Seriously, bike in NYC, it's all good!
There are new secure bike lanes everywhere, and drivers - in my 10-year experience - are very mindful of bicyclists (but you must follow the rules yourself!).
Often my bike ride takes the same time as by subway. With the proper equipment you can bike by all weather except maybe snow and ice. I change clothes at work if needed.
Also, I have a foldable bike, so that I can bike one way and take the subway home the other way when it's less crowded. It's a very versatile solution for areas where the Citibikes haven't arrived yet.
Seriously, bike in NYC, it's all good!
13
Biking is not a solution for most commuters. And bike lanes make street traffic worse. And bikers largely lawless behavior is not the way to act in such a crowded city. Fix the subway and PUBLIC transportation.
3
Actually, for me, it's about 8-9 minutes on a Citibike, vs. nearly 20 on subway (station not too close to office), and 15-25 by bus. (Would be ~30 walking). Problem is unless I leave home by 7-7:30am, or work by 4:30pm, there are no Citibikes available.
1
Minh Z, nobody is forcing you to ride a bike. But if 5% of subway riders switched to bikes, the difference for the other 95% would be noticeable. Solution for most commuters? Yes it is.
2
Why did the put the older cars with the orange seats on the most crowded 6 line? People never want to move into the middle of these cars, because the center poles block free passage, and if you do move in, you may be stuck and unable to get out when you need to. Or you need to quite literally climb over people to move in and out. The trains with the purple benches seem much better in this regard; it's a little easier to move in and out. Are you listening, MTA?!
Yesterday during my evening rush-hour commute on the uptown 6, they took my entire packed train out of service at 59th Street without any explanation. If it was due to malfunctioning doors, the only reason I could think of, an announcement to that effect might have eased tensions and confusion.
Yesterday during my evening rush-hour commute on the uptown 6, they took my entire packed train out of service at 59th Street without any explanation. If it was due to malfunctioning doors, the only reason I could think of, an announcement to that effect might have eased tensions and confusion.
4
I'm currently traveling through Asia and every single city I've been to on this trip--Bangkok, HK, Seoul and Taipei--has a much nicer, cleaner, newer and safer passenger rail system. In HK, the touch-based Octopus card also works as a payment method in many stores, such as the countless 7-11s. Granted, the NY system is large, but it really makes you wonder where all the billions and billions go. We are so far behind in terms of providing a really great customer experience. It's a serious blemish on the city that leaves us less competitive. When you visit NY in the summer and you're used to a smooth ride, using the subway is not quaint or NY-authentic, it's just disgusting. I'd rather bike in the sun that wait on a platform in stifling air reeking of urine.
100
This comparison is often made. Guess what - something built 20 years ago is going to be nicer and newer than something built 120 years ago. What do you propose, we tear out the entire NYC subway system and replace it with a brand new one, because other cities have brand new ones?
1
I have biked all winter, even when the temperature is in the teens, rather than take the subway.
The Beijing subway is wonderful: clean, fast, comfortable, lots of trains, and cheap.
As the lead article this morning, Resettling the First American ‘Climate Refugees’ illustrates, we still heavily subsidize the fossil fuel industries (I mean, are we really going to pay to move people out of areas impacted by climate change? Do we have enough money to move, say, everyone out of NYC, Boston, Miami, etc?), but refuse to find money for basic infrastructure. DC and Boston subway systems are literally on their last legs too...
2
No problem. Just raise the prices on a one-bedroom with a view of a wall to a median $1.5 million. Hey! Where else in the world can you get such a broad selection of Asian Fusion restaurants with chill music playing in the background? A $million half for a cheese box seems worth it.
Oh, and by the way: It took me an hour and 35 minutes to go from Astoria to 8th and Broadway by subway yesterday during early afternoon due to signal problems on a line the MTA seems to be working on every three months.
Kaifeng in China once was the greatest and most powerful city in the world 1000 years ago, with the largest population of any city in ancient times -- over a million. Today it is a village. Perhaps the Yogi Berra principle will once again prove itself: "No one goes there anymore; it's too crowded."
Oh, and by the way: It took me an hour and 35 minutes to go from Astoria to 8th and Broadway by subway yesterday during early afternoon due to signal problems on a line the MTA seems to be working on every three months.
Kaifeng in China once was the greatest and most powerful city in the world 1000 years ago, with the largest population of any city in ancient times -- over a million. Today it is a village. Perhaps the Yogi Berra principle will once again prove itself: "No one goes there anymore; it's too crowded."
4
Now China has dozens of cities with millions of population - including FOUR larger than NYC (soon to be more). Wrong analogy.
1
No, just expect Sharpsburg, South Carolina, Louisville Kentucky and Wichita, Kansas to be among the giant mega-metropolises of the US (or its successor) 1000 years from now, with tales of an ancient buried city somewhere near the east coast around the 47th latitude.
2
Nobody is going to like this, but in the absence of new construction or increased capacity, the only solution is to raise the fare at overcrowded stations during rush hours.
Raising the fare at stations in Manhattan on the 2/3, 4/5, and L lines would encourage more people to either walk, bike, take a bus, or travel outside of peak hours.
This would save hours of delays for people already on the trains, and would provide revenue to update the signals.
Raising the fare at stations in Manhattan on the 2/3, 4/5, and L lines would encourage more people to either walk, bike, take a bus, or travel outside of peak hours.
This would save hours of delays for people already on the trains, and would provide revenue to update the signals.
1
So people are supposed to walk miles and miles to get to work because they can't afford the high fares...how does this help matters?
5
Seeing a lot of blame being attributed to Bloomberg's pro-development (and density) policies. Please help me connect the dots. The article says, "Subway use, now at nearly 1.8 billion rides a year, has not been this high since 1948..." In other words, there was a time when ridership was equally heavy long before Bloomberg's rise to the mayorship. Beyond that, it looks like the population in 1948 was about 7.9 million as opposed to todays 8.4 million - so the density doesn't seem to have actually increased that significantly overall. There may be a connection to Bloomberg's policies but development doesn't seem to be it.
5
They ran many more rush hour trains then. They can't run as many today because they have tightened up on safety measures.
2
Here's a guess: the rise in rents has forced many people to live further away from their jobs, so they have to take the subway, and they have to take it for longer distances.
2
I have lived in Manhattan for 10 years now and take the 6 train to work everyday. My commute is only 3 minutes but those 3 minutes are the worst 3 minutes of my day. Add in sick passenger or signal malfunction then you are in for the worst experience of your life.
I cannot walk two blocks in Manhattan without seeing a construction of a new sky scrapper. Everyday new buildings raise and new jobs open up and new guys come in to the city but our subway system is not changing at the same phase. It is not just the subway system but also the rent in Manhattan and surrounding Queens are going through the roof yet they get taken right away.
I love NYC. There isn't any other place in the world I want to live. Having said that, I have had enough and I am moving on to west coast. Hopefully this will help create one additional space for my fellow New Yorkers in the 6 train or will my company bring in 2 guys to replace me!?
I cannot walk two blocks in Manhattan without seeing a construction of a new sky scrapper. Everyday new buildings raise and new jobs open up and new guys come in to the city but our subway system is not changing at the same phase. It is not just the subway system but also the rent in Manhattan and surrounding Queens are going through the roof yet they get taken right away.
I love NYC. There isn't any other place in the world I want to live. Having said that, I have had enough and I am moving on to west coast. Hopefully this will help create one additional space for my fellow New Yorkers in the 6 train or will my company bring in 2 guys to replace me!?
12
Hope you're not moving to the Bay Area. If you are, you're definitely going from bad to worse. Our transit system is completely overrun for many of the same reasons the NYC system is overrun. Construction is everywhere without any effort to expand infrastructure to keep pace with growth. More and more people coming here for work, especially in the tech industry, and rents/COL are reportedly worse here than in NYC now. I have heard that similar problems are now being experienced in other West Coast cities. I really think the problems you all are writing about in NYC are very similar if not identical in most of the large US cities now. Moving away may not be the right answer if the motive for doing so is to escape overcrowding and failing infrastructure.
1
Subway use grows because our politicians are unable to get their act together and maintain alternatives. And the public transportation choices in the NYC metro area is hampered by stupidity in traffic planning.
When the past and present city administrations prioritize and place bike lanes in the most congested places in NYC, for people who basically have other transport options, and live within 3-5 miles of their place of employment, you know we are in trouble.
When the MTA can't finish a project, or build a station without things going wrong and over budget, it indicates that the politicians and management are incompetent and corrupt.
Compare the transit buildout in London, Paris, Rio, Tokyo, etc. etc. that while understanding the traffic problem builds and improves the public transit options for their residents. And they approach it from a regional to city level, integrating the areas.
And the traffic in Manhattan gets worse. Because the subways are overcrowded and get less safe and less reliable, and the same annoying crowd that want bike lanes and no cars (or buses or trucks or any traffic on city streets) uses Uber to get around town.
The elites who live in their bubbles have never lived in an outer borough, and can't understand the problems of the average person commuting to work. And it shows in how our politicians respond to the issue of subway growth, population growth and traffic problems.
When the past and present city administrations prioritize and place bike lanes in the most congested places in NYC, for people who basically have other transport options, and live within 3-5 miles of their place of employment, you know we are in trouble.
When the MTA can't finish a project, or build a station without things going wrong and over budget, it indicates that the politicians and management are incompetent and corrupt.
Compare the transit buildout in London, Paris, Rio, Tokyo, etc. etc. that while understanding the traffic problem builds and improves the public transit options for their residents. And they approach it from a regional to city level, integrating the areas.
And the traffic in Manhattan gets worse. Because the subways are overcrowded and get less safe and less reliable, and the same annoying crowd that want bike lanes and no cars (or buses or trucks or any traffic on city streets) uses Uber to get around town.
The elites who live in their bubbles have never lived in an outer borough, and can't understand the problems of the average person commuting to work. And it shows in how our politicians respond to the issue of subway growth, population growth and traffic problems.
8
The bottom line is that the current system can only accommodate a certain number of people. With so many commuters now living in the outer boroughs or uptown but trying to get to midtown or downtown for jobs or entertainment, the overcrowding is inevitable. Upgrading the subway system will cost billions and require years of disruption. There is no easy way around it in a system that runs 24/7. While the MTA certainly has much room for improvement, I don't believe they are the primary culprits here. The non-stop residential construction is what is straining the system.
17
NYC is a mega city. All mega cities in the world have crowded subways. It's part of the hustle and bustle that makes them the economic power houses that they are. There are a few things NYC needs to do though in comparison with other mega cities in Europe and Asia. 1) update the signal system to CBTC... Apart from increasing capacity - it also will increase reliability. How many times per week do I hear "there is a delay due to signal problems"...? That backs things up even more! 2) platform doors. Aside from the fact that it is just the right thing to do in order to protect people from being hit by trains - it has the effect of reducing delay from injuries and death by persons getting hit by trains or falling on tracks. It also would prevent another cause of delay - track fires from trash on the tracks. 3) open gangway cars. Those things need to be dealt with NOW... Not in 20 years.
11
Link real estate development with mandates to fund development of the subway system. It is incredibly dangerous, hundreds of people packed on a platform and shoved into train cars, and irresponsible of our government leaders to allow this situation to fester. Update the system so more trains can run, not just rush hour--all day and night. As it is, every hour is now rush hour. People are pushed to the max, so of course violence is on the uptick. Put rats in a crowded cage and they will turn on each other. We're not so different. If there were an emergency, such as, perish the though, some kind of attack, the cars are so crowded that no safe evacuation would be possible. Fix it. This is a disaster in the making, and it makes living in the city next to intolerable.
30
There's a point in time for every city where the size of the population overwhelms even the best efforts to get people from place A to place B.
What is described in this article is no different than what anyone in Beijing experiences, and traffic jams in cities like New Dehli are legendary.
Given that a significant amount of travel is a result of the need to go to/from work, a simple solution to a lot of these problem would be to get employers to allow more people to telecommute. My guess would be the if everyone was allowed to telecommute ONE day a week (thus potentially reducing passenger loads by up to 20%), a lot of these problems would disappear.
What is described in this article is no different than what anyone in Beijing experiences, and traffic jams in cities like New Dehli are legendary.
Given that a significant amount of travel is a result of the need to go to/from work, a simple solution to a lot of these problem would be to get employers to allow more people to telecommute. My guess would be the if everyone was allowed to telecommute ONE day a week (thus potentially reducing passenger loads by up to 20%), a lot of these problems would disappear.
7
As a subway commuter, I think all the talk about "affordable housing," more building, and adding a million residents to NYC, is insane. The subways, schools, sewers, roads, etc., are all packed to the gills. We need to be talking about limiting the growth of NYC and having a sustainable maintenance plan for infrastructure. Otherwise, we will kill the golden goose.
9
Where is any discussion of money? Two key items: employee compensation (and benefits) and the fairness of subway fares vs. other MTA trains. The amount of employee costs (salaries, benefits and retirement compensation) directly impacts other operating costs. Higher compensation means dirtier stations and trains! And where is debate of distance-based subway fares? Every other MTA train (Metro-North as an example) charges by distance. Only in the city can you get unlimited travel from a set fare. The Metrocard is designed for distance pricing! Just add swipe terminals when you exit the station as in DC!
2
Making the subway unaffordable for people who really need it doesn't seem like a very good idea.
2
Make no mistake, this is not just about increased ridership, it's also, even more so, about fewer trains, a lot more holding trains in the tunnels for random reasons, more sporadic service and less keeping the trains tightly on schedule, more service disruptions due to work being done at inopportune times, and similar problems. It's all due to lower transit budget and to bad management. Things on the subways (like in the rest of the city) are slowly returning to the way things were in the 70s and 80s, thanks to our new mayor and the new group of people in city hall.
3
The mayor and the rest of City Hall have very control over subway/bus operation.
2
Like somany problems with our country's infrastructure you need look no farther than the party that thinks tax cuts for the wealthy are more important than improvements to safety and quality of life that would come from updating our roads, bridges, and public transit and from building a world-class information superhighway as well.
I guess that would create too many good paying jobs for them -- jobs that could not be out-sourced.
I guess that would create too many good paying jobs for them -- jobs that could not be out-sourced.
16
London was mentioned as another large city with an overcrowded subway. It now has a signficant bicycle commute share. Apparently, bicycles may soon outnumber cars in the center of the city.
New York has also built some great bicycle infrastructure in the past decade. I know... I commute 15 miles by electric bicycle, and thankfully never have to endure the overcrowded subway or parkways; instead, I pass through beautiful, uncrowded parks. Come on out, New York has some great bikeways and they're (comparatively) still empty. In the meantime, another round of bikeway construction might be needed if we want to get serious about subway overcrowding.
New York has also built some great bicycle infrastructure in the past decade. I know... I commute 15 miles by electric bicycle, and thankfully never have to endure the overcrowded subway or parkways; instead, I pass through beautiful, uncrowded parks. Come on out, New York has some great bikeways and they're (comparatively) still empty. In the meantime, another round of bikeway construction might be needed if we want to get serious about subway overcrowding.
5
Biking is seasonal and largely for people who live close to their jobs. It is NOT a good solution for regional and average commuting within and to NYC.
To give you your bike lanes, the rest of the city has to deal with slower traffic and increased costs for time wasted and increased costs for deliveries. And many people are now turning to Uber. And the same people complain about the expanded hours for sanitation collection and deliveries and traffic noise (from horns from slow or stopped traffic).
Stop trying to push bike lanes as a reasonable transportation alternative - for anyone living more than 3-5 miles from work it's not practical.
Add in the consequence-free, lawless behavior of many riders and the sense of entitlement that they deserve bike lanes, free of any blockage. There is a "bike lane commute Pt. 2" video on Gothamist that cites an AMBULANCE and COP CARS as illegally blocking bike lanes on this person's commute to work. Unbelievable hubris and out-of-touch elitism.
The biking community need to get licensed, insured and registered, and join the rest of the streetscape users as equal partners, rather than thinking they ride above them and that they are a really integral part of transportation.
To give you your bike lanes, the rest of the city has to deal with slower traffic and increased costs for time wasted and increased costs for deliveries. And many people are now turning to Uber. And the same people complain about the expanded hours for sanitation collection and deliveries and traffic noise (from horns from slow or stopped traffic).
Stop trying to push bike lanes as a reasonable transportation alternative - for anyone living more than 3-5 miles from work it's not practical.
Add in the consequence-free, lawless behavior of many riders and the sense of entitlement that they deserve bike lanes, free of any blockage. There is a "bike lane commute Pt. 2" video on Gothamist that cites an AMBULANCE and COP CARS as illegally blocking bike lanes on this person's commute to work. Unbelievable hubris and out-of-touch elitism.
The biking community need to get licensed, insured and registered, and join the rest of the streetscape users as equal partners, rather than thinking they ride above them and that they are a really integral part of transportation.
6
"Planned Service Changes" were recently posted at my 7 Train station. They required two large (4'x3') posters, each with four columns of dense text, covering virtually every line. It looked like blowups from a super-sized King James Bible.
Fortunately the decreased train frequency left plenty of time to read it.
Fortunately the decreased train frequency left plenty of time to read it.
7
Case in point. Last Tuesday I transferred from the 2 to the 1 at 96th street around evening rush hours. I was able to get on the subway without much difficulty but other people wanted in and some people already on board were not too keen on making an effort to let them in. One in fact was quite obnoxiously pushing back, not to avoid being crushed, but to keep a nice open space for himself. I leaned onto him and he turned around and punched me in the face 3 times, splitting my upper lip, but fortunately not causing any other apparent damage (still painful though). I was too dumbfounded to do anything about it. Fighting back was not an option. Dodging was made impossible by the crowds around me. One man stopped in between and offered me wipes to help control the bleeding. Everyone else kind of looked away. Had I managed to pull the alarm to get the police everyone would likely have cursed me. A bad day in the city...
11
So, so much of the entire U.S. economy depends on these rickety little trains. If only the first primary in the country were held in New York rather than Iowa—then we'd be talking about nationwide infrastructural problems like this one instead of soy subsidies for Big Agra.
25
In Manhattam the 2/3 Fulton St platform is tony and gets full in minutes.Amazing no one has been pushed into the platform.
And yet the Bloomberg Administration allowed zoning changes paving the way for high rise residential buildings, luxury of course.
Small buildings torn down and replaced by high rise.
There is no room for more people on the platform or train.And hardly room for people on some sidewalks around Nassau/Fulton/John/William St.
Development without infrastructure
And yet the Bloomberg Administration allowed zoning changes paving the way for high rise residential buildings, luxury of course.
Small buildings torn down and replaced by high rise.
There is no room for more people on the platform or train.And hardly room for people on some sidewalks around Nassau/Fulton/John/William St.
Development without infrastructure
7
The MTA needs to make sure that instead of engaging in projects to deliver new lines, that it makes sure the existing system is up to scratch. They haven't even been able to install next train indicators on many lines or automate announcements in stations. Lines like the F are in decline, no train for 20 minutes or more then 4 at once, no wonder there is overcrowding. The system is not being run well at a basic level and that needs to be addressed asap.
3
I really, really wish that we could collectively find a solution to what I truly think is a huge factor contributing to congestion and slowing down throughout the system: entitled, rude, oblivious jerks blocking the doorways of the trains, forcing everyone to file in and out of the train single-file. I just can't fathom how people can be so selfish and pig-headed. Move inside the car, you lumps!
81
Behavior of passengers is not a huge factor in slowing the system down, sorry to disappoint you. It may be annoying but there are other causes at play. See my other responses if you really want to know.
Thanks for mentioning this! The Lexington line now has its own sardine packers who yell at the people on the platform and let the doorway hogs remain in place. It drives me nuts every day.
1
I work in Midtown with the closest subway stop to the office being 53rd and Lex E/M. I've had to stop using that station because of constant overcrowding and the fear that I'll fall on to the tracks. I'm actually surprised this hasn't happened yet as the platform is extremely narrow with poorly placed exits and escalators that funnel commuters underground who have absolutely nowhere to go. The situation is terrifying, claustrophobic and really dangerous.
56
How about a complete re-think of how trains operate, especially during rush hours. First off, do all trains need to stop at all stops? What if trains picked up passengers at a group of stops and then headed downtown, stopping at only major stations. This is how MetroNorth is run during rush hours. The old 1/9 trains ran this way, but the MTA bowed to pressure from riders who complained that trains passed them by. Also, there are express tracks that are not being utilized -- on the F in Brooklyn for example. There is a single track on the 1 line that was used in rush hours in the 70s, and occasionally during delays to this day. Even Philadelphia uses a skip-stop system in the rush hour on the Market St. line. And yes, remove the poles in the cars that keep people from moving in to the center! A terrible problem on the 1 and 6 trains.
33
Skip-stop doesn't let you run more trains, just reduce service at what are supposed to be under-utilized stations (which is why it makes sense on the J line). The 1/9 operation probably saved 2-3 minutes at the most and doubled waiting times for most passengers. Using the middle track on the 1 will not permit more trains to be run, just provide a 5-minute saving north of 145th Street and increase wait times below. And the F had express service starting in August 1968 which was essentially dismantled because passengers at skipped stations didn't like having to change from the GG local and pressured their politicians to have the old service patterns restored.
The real solution is to restore the capability of running 30+ trains per hour.
The real solution is to restore the capability of running 30+ trains per hour.
1
they do use skip stop in parts of the system. I live on the J and it runs skip stop/express into manhattan in the morning
Commenter AMK, your suggestions for a "re-think of how trains operate" are logistically improbable for the NYC subway system, especially with regards to F express service. The F line was built before Carroll Gardens, Red Hook, Gowanus, and Park Slope became especially crowded and popular neighborhoods; thus its express tracks skip most stops in those areas, but those are some of the most popular stops on the F. With its current signal system, the F can't accommodate more trains per hour during rush hour. So if you want express service on that line, some of the existing trains would have to skip very busy stops like Carroll St., 4th Av.-9th St. (where there's an R transfer), and 15 St.-Prospect Park. This doesn't make sense. And for what? So that smaller numbers of people at Church Ave. and points south can save about three minutes each way? That's not a logical trade-off. You note there are other express tracks not in use, but in most cases putting them back into service would be counterproductive. This is why no L express tracks were ever constructed: The most popular stops are the ones closer to Manhattan. Express tracks only make sense in cases like the 7, for which Flushing is one of the busiest stops.
Why is there zero discussion in the article of why the obvious solution -- increasing frequency of service -- is not even considered an option? Why is there no investigation of who is to blame for our not having a first-world subway service in one of the richest cities in the world?
80
Many lines are already at capacity - they can't physically run more trains on some lines. The L train needs a new power substation in Manhattan to support more trains per hour and the turn-around at 8th Ave is a bottleneck because the tracks end in the station, further limiting trains per hour.
1
There used to be more rush hour service (30+ trains per hour). A number of motorman-caused accidents resulted in restrictions on speed and spacing between trains that prevents that number of trains from being operated. Add to that bad passenger behavior which increases dwell time in stations and you have today's problems.
4
Indeed, before Giuliani cut city money from the MTA in 1995 there was definitely greater frequency of trains.
2
In 1939, Henry Miller returned from Europe to the US, and him and a friend bought a car and went on one of the first epic road trips, to see what was up with his native country. He titled the resultant travelogue "The Air-Conditioned Nightmare," his description for what "modern America" was like.
From what I understand, in places like the NYC subway system, we decided to go lean and mean, and just leave out the "air-conditioned" part.
From what I understand, in places like the NYC subway system, we decided to go lean and mean, and just leave out the "air-conditioned" part.
The picture exemplifies everyone's commute during rush hours (even as late as 7PM) including mine. I work 5 miles from my office and it takes me an hour each way. This is insane, yet this city continues to let traffic tie up for ungodly above ground commutes as well as below ground. The subway commute is one of the worst experiences I have ever had. It's inhumane.
32
At a certain point, the overcrowding of our city runs into the wall of logistics. Case in point- the Lexington Avenue/59th Street station on the N/Q/R line. This has to be one of the most narrow stations in the system, relative to the capacity of the ridership during rush hour. Often, this platform is jam-packed. Making your way from one end to the other is a dangerous, tightrope walk of death, trying not to get knocked on to the tracks.
Outside of getting less people to move to New York (good luck) the only thing I can think of is increasing the frequency of the trains, and repairing the signals that always seem to be having problems. The MTA could use a lesson in money management, and certainly needs an audit. My suspicion is, there are areas of leakage in that budget. I don't mind paying for service, but I want service. I don't want my fare to increase, only to see the money be used for the re-decoration of stations, and cutesy, self-congratulatory posters on the trains.
Outside of getting less people to move to New York (good luck) the only thing I can think of is increasing the frequency of the trains, and repairing the signals that always seem to be having problems. The MTA could use a lesson in money management, and certainly needs an audit. My suspicion is, there are areas of leakage in that budget. I don't mind paying for service, but I want service. I don't want my fare to increase, only to see the money be used for the re-decoration of stations, and cutesy, self-congratulatory posters on the trains.
71
Why is it that everyone calls for investigation? You think nobody knows what is going on inside the organization? It is well known. The "leakage" you speak of is entirely sanctioned by 1964 congressional law, which puts (through the legally extortionate behavior of the union lawyers over the decades) transit workers' union privileges on an untouchable pedestal. The only way out is Chapter 11 and no person in their right mind wants to be head of NYC Transit for that. Drivers who strike when they're asked to pay 4% more of their health care costs, want to face down 30,000 of them while you take away their baby milk bottle from them?
1
Elected officials who authorize funding don't ride the subway. They also don't fly commercial airlines so they don't have to worry about long TSA lines either.
11
In Business 101 we learn that when a company has enormous fixed costs relative to variable costs, the key to bringing the unit price down is utilization.
In other words, you have to pay nearly the same amount to maintain the tunnels and tracks and for the pensions of workers and the CEO whether you have 1 rider or 100 million riders. The cost to the MTA of each incremental rider is negligible. Yes, more riders mean more subways and cleaning and such, but that gets divided among many.
So why are costs going up and service levels down?
In other words, you have to pay nearly the same amount to maintain the tunnels and tracks and for the pensions of workers and the CEO whether you have 1 rider or 100 million riders. The cost to the MTA of each incremental rider is negligible. Yes, more riders mean more subways and cleaning and such, but that gets divided among many.
So why are costs going up and service levels down?
9
Pension - healthcare - debt service goes up every year.
2
I am less concerned about Upper East Siders who can take a tab than about poor people in the Bronx who have no option but the subway.
The Second Avenue Subway: another handout to the billionaires.
The Second Avenue Subway: another handout to the billionaires.
7
Tell that to the folks in Harlem will benefit from SAS Phase II which is now fully funded.
1
While I agree that further subway expansion needs to be funded and on the table, especially in places like the Bronx and Brooklyn, just how many billionaires are out riding the subway? The demand is there and the East Side needs another line. Plain and simple.
2
This is a direct result of Bloomberg's Plan2030 which calls for a million more people living in the city. The resulted increase in density was not accompanied by a plan to move those people, and for many living further out actually got decreased service(increasing vehicle traffic as a necessity). It is a pyramid scheme to raise revenue with little thought given to reality. The deBlasio administration has doubled down on this scheme looking to increase density deeper into the city, with no real transportation plan. Sorry his dopey street car isn't going to help. This is only going to get worse.
6
No you misdeed the 2030 plan. In fact the population has outpaced those projections. The fact is NYC is in demand. The people are coming whether you plan for it or not.. They are coming - transit expansion or not.
2
When will the famous Yogi Berraism finally apply to NYC - the place is so crowded nobody goes there any more?
There are lots of other very livable cities around the country where you don't get jammed into an overcrowded subway to get home to your million dollar one bedroom apartment.
There are lots of other very livable cities around the country where you don't get jammed into an overcrowded subway to get home to your million dollar one bedroom apartment.
8
Add another car on the always forgotten G train. Seriously, how much would it cost to make it 5 cars instead of 4? Given the over-development of Williamsburg, Greenpoint, and Long Island City, Brooklyn and Queens residents deserve more than a toy train.
14
The MTA doesn't care about ridership, clean stations or subway cars. It just want to make sure its executives can be paid a lot of money!
6
The subway is a victim of its success - clean and fast (for NYC travel) and cheap. Fairly safe.
But yes, the platforms and stairway exists feel dangerously narrow. Most stations are not ADA compliant, by a long shot. And the reduction of services in both trains and that came in 2010 is a factor in the headache.
It is ridiculous that we are years away from a system upgrade that would allow more trains to run. The subways are a great system. I use them, I love them. But they need to run more frequently, at all times of day.
But yes, the platforms and stairway exists feel dangerously narrow. Most stations are not ADA compliant, by a long shot. And the reduction of services in both trains and that came in 2010 is a factor in the headache.
It is ridiculous that we are years away from a system upgrade that would allow more trains to run. The subways are a great system. I use them, I love them. But they need to run more frequently, at all times of day.
7
As long as the city continues to allow rampant, uncontrolled development of housing in Manhattan, Brooklyn, and Queens to accommodate all those who move here year after year, WITHOUT upgrading the infrastructure needed to accommodate and support the thousands/millions of new inhabitants, this problem will continue to get worse. Everyday I see new developments going up, and I am very cognizant of the fact that the trains, sidewalks, sewer lines, and roads et al. are not maintained with equal zeal. I am not anti-development, I'm anti-DUMB development!
22
another one of the many benefits of living in NY!
1
The platforms are definitely more dangerous now at rush hour because of the increased crowds.
On the bright side, at least the subway cars have A/C these days!
On the bright side, at least the subway cars have A/C these days!
4
NYC subways are ok compared to their worldwide competitors.
Crowded, maybe, maybe not.
Try Tokyo, where they are truly crowded in like sardines with their transit cops helping push people onto the trains to close the doors.
Nope, that could never happen in NY, but it good to have perspective.
American transit in general just isn't at the same level as its European and Asian competitors. Subways can be close, but our trains pale in comparison. We certainly could do better if there was political will and voter interest other than whining about it. Uber Anyone....
Crowded, maybe, maybe not.
Try Tokyo, where they are truly crowded in like sardines with their transit cops helping push people onto the trains to close the doors.
Nope, that could never happen in NY, but it good to have perspective.
American transit in general just isn't at the same level as its European and Asian competitors. Subways can be close, but our trains pale in comparison. We certainly could do better if there was political will and voter interest other than whining about it. Uber Anyone....
3
So on the other side of the scale, just a few facts worth weighing:
1. It's not the elected officials (Mayor or Governor) who are responsible for running the NYC subway system, it's the Transit Authority and its parent the MTA.
2. The MTA is also responsible for the LIRR and Metro North systems, and while they're at it the tolled inter-borough bridges and tunnels (like the VZB, Triborough Bridge, Midtown Tunnel).
3. All-in, it's the busiest and largest regional transportation entity in the Western Hemisphere, moving over 11 million people every weekday.
So, cut them some slack. That they manage this mutli-ring circus daily, 24/7, with as few problems and hiccups as they do is not cause for criticism but frankly awe and applause. The MTA literally leads the World in nearly every aspect of regional transportation expertise and innovation, and it keeps the shine on the Big Apple. Thanks MTA, and keep up the great work!
1. It's not the elected officials (Mayor or Governor) who are responsible for running the NYC subway system, it's the Transit Authority and its parent the MTA.
2. The MTA is also responsible for the LIRR and Metro North systems, and while they're at it the tolled inter-borough bridges and tunnels (like the VZB, Triborough Bridge, Midtown Tunnel).
3. All-in, it's the busiest and largest regional transportation entity in the Western Hemisphere, moving over 11 million people every weekday.
So, cut them some slack. That they manage this mutli-ring circus daily, 24/7, with as few problems and hiccups as they do is not cause for criticism but frankly awe and applause. The MTA literally leads the World in nearly every aspect of regional transportation expertise and innovation, and it keeps the shine on the Big Apple. Thanks MTA, and keep up the great work!
59
...multi-ring circus....
Yes, that pretty much states the obvious: A city of NYC's (supposed) world-class status has a transportation system that literally is a circus and that's the problem. With all the uber-wealth concentrated in NYC, why is it that its subway system looks, feels and smells like a sewer? The last time I was in NYC several years ago there were some huge rats wandering around the platforms and the whole system looked like hell. The subway isn't the apple, it's the worm hole.
I don't blame the MTA itself for the shabby and crowded conditions. The blame lies firmly at the feet of all those who refuse to invest in these types of infrastructures: the public. If people don't want to pay for services, well, they fall apart, they become unsafe and they look terrible.
Yes, that pretty much states the obvious: A city of NYC's (supposed) world-class status has a transportation system that literally is a circus and that's the problem. With all the uber-wealth concentrated in NYC, why is it that its subway system looks, feels and smells like a sewer? The last time I was in NYC several years ago there were some huge rats wandering around the platforms and the whole system looked like hell. The subway isn't the apple, it's the worm hole.
I don't blame the MTA itself for the shabby and crowded conditions. The blame lies firmly at the feet of all those who refuse to invest in these types of infrastructures: the public. If people don't want to pay for services, well, they fall apart, they become unsafe and they look terrible.
3
I agree - except for the part about innovation.... Other systems in Asia and Europe are more innovative. That said it is an immensely complex system. Just as they say being mayor of NYC is the 2nd hardest job a fret being president.
1
1. It's not the elected officials (Mayor or Governor) who are responsible for running the NYC subway system, it's the Transit Authority and its parent the MTA.
The governor of New York State and the mayor of NYC appoint the members of the transit authority. Also most of the funding comes from the state where non NYC legislators do not support money for NYC transit. So course it is the elected officials!!
The governor of New York State and the mayor of NYC appoint the members of the transit authority. Also most of the funding comes from the state where non NYC legislators do not support money for NYC transit. So course it is the elected officials!!
2
How about two types of cars--the middle, front and back cars configured for those with strollers, packages, bikes, etc., allowing the other cars to be freer of such things?
Then--for giggles, esprit de corps, and maybe even some instruction--I have this fever dream of cheer leading squads entertaining and encouraging people on the platforms and in emptier cars.
"“Standing in the doorway,
like some tree from Norway,
except that you’re a human,
lacking in acumen"
“Get in the car!
It’s not that far!
You’re not that thin!
but you’ll fit in!”
“GO SUBWAYS”
Or celebrating subway diversity:
“The L’s pell-mell with Brooklyn yokels
and hipsters down to dub their vocals,
and that guy’s still high on four Four Locos,
it’s both classic and rococo!”
GO-O-O SUBWAYS!
They could even cheer the train as it enters the station:
"Slow it down, slow it down, slow it WAAAAY down!"
Cautionary:
"Stay away from the edge when the train’s comin’ in,
Make a lane and don’t crowd the platform.
Go to the gym if you want to get slim,
But no one wants to see you get a flat form. "
GO SUBWAYS!
They could even taunt the opposing "team".
‘You think your taxi will be swift
but seats are sticky, now you’re miffed,
stuck in traffic, take a whiff--
the perfume of a 12 hour shift.”
I love New York!
Then--for giggles, esprit de corps, and maybe even some instruction--I have this fever dream of cheer leading squads entertaining and encouraging people on the platforms and in emptier cars.
"“Standing in the doorway,
like some tree from Norway,
except that you’re a human,
lacking in acumen"
“Get in the car!
It’s not that far!
You’re not that thin!
but you’ll fit in!”
“GO SUBWAYS”
Or celebrating subway diversity:
“The L’s pell-mell with Brooklyn yokels
and hipsters down to dub their vocals,
and that guy’s still high on four Four Locos,
it’s both classic and rococo!”
GO-O-O SUBWAYS!
They could even cheer the train as it enters the station:
"Slow it down, slow it down, slow it WAAAAY down!"
Cautionary:
"Stay away from the edge when the train’s comin’ in,
Make a lane and don’t crowd the platform.
Go to the gym if you want to get slim,
But no one wants to see you get a flat form. "
GO SUBWAYS!
They could even taunt the opposing "team".
‘You think your taxi will be swift
but seats are sticky, now you’re miffed,
stuck in traffic, take a whiff--
the perfume of a 12 hour shift.”
I love New York!
1
I've taken to commuting at slight off hours, when I can get into an unpacked subway car. I'm lucky to be able to do this.
I'm not surprised to hear that the Q is one of the most crowded lines, those cars are full at almost all times of the day.
I'm lucky to live in a part of NYC where I can pretty easily access all the major avenue lines, so if there's a problem on one, it's not a big deal to walk over to another line. Still beats car commuting, but, c'mon MTA, figure it out!
I'm not surprised to hear that the Q is one of the most crowded lines, those cars are full at almost all times of the day.
I'm lucky to live in a part of NYC where I can pretty easily access all the major avenue lines, so if there's a problem on one, it's not a big deal to walk over to another line. Still beats car commuting, but, c'mon MTA, figure it out!
19
So, the city is over populated-and still growing, minimum wage will always be at a "Minimum", and the fare is $3.00! Not to mention that the consecutive fare increases have done nothing to fix the subway's infestation and deterioration problems. For a second I thought I was looking at a picture of the transit systems in India and China.
I normally don't state a problem without a solution, but, for the first time I don't have a solution; other than inner-city population control; and that will never happen. This situation is not only unhealthy, but it's really dangerous. Those people in the picture are basically sitting ducks.
I normally don't state a problem without a solution, but, for the first time I don't have a solution; other than inner-city population control; and that will never happen. This situation is not only unhealthy, but it's really dangerous. Those people in the picture are basically sitting ducks.
4
Try riding the subway in the Summertime!
Do everything possible to facilitate bicycle commuting - to relieve pressure on the mass transit system. Bikes work great in NY - easy, practical, safe, quick.
3
That's not an option for most people that commute in or around the city. Bike lanes constrict and take away a lane for traffic for minimal or no benefit. And until bikers have a consequence for their largely lawless behavior it is not a good idea to expand use.
2
I agree a) it's not an option for many & maybe most commuters, and b) most NYkers really DON'T like cyclists. but the impact of every 1 % conversion of subway rider to cyclist has huge potential impact. Cars can't relieve the stress on underground transit, but buses and bicycles can. I believe you can see that the city has very limited ability to expand subway capacity - so - consider the alternatives!
Trains with open pathways between cars is nothing new. The BMT did it in 1926 with the D units and again in 1936 with the Multi-Units, but this forward thinking died in 1940 when The City recovered the subways and squashed any thinking but their own backward looking planning.
2
"You can wait four or five subways to get on...."
Six two and even....not a native.
Six two and even....not a native.
Two things I notice in that film from 1949 is that the Second Avenue subway line was being planned way back in the late 1940's but finally, in the early 2000's they finally got around to working on it, and that basically nothing has changed for the folks behind the scenes that make the subways run except for the guy who had to manually write down in a notebook why trains are delayed, today you just log it into a computer. But if you think about it, if if took 60 years to get around to constructing the 2nd Ave line, maybe you still do have to use the ol' pen and paper to log the delays.
Could this be considered a shovel ready project?
3
I am utterly amazed that anyone still sees benefits to population growth. There is no exemption from the law of diminution at the margin that makes each unit of something worth less when there is more of it.
5
I'm always baffled by comments like yours that just offer a complaint but no solution. What do you propose--forced sterilization?
5
One more piece of NYC infrastructure that is inadequate for the population density which is increasing every year. While real estate developers get a green light to build more and more luxury residential and office space (just look at the huge development over the Penn RR yards), congestion on and below the streets just gets worse.
And to this list of inadequate infrastructure we can add sewers and sewage treatment, schools, hospitals, nursing homes, century old water mains, etc. However, NYC is not alone. Almost every major city in the US faces the same situation where lack of investment in public transportation has led to clogged highways and many lost hours in long commutes.
Americans just need to go to Berlin, Munich, Amsterdam or Paris to see what modern marvels of transportation can mean for the average citizen. Instead of wasting their money on huge needless SUVs, most Europeans can ride trains, trams, subways, etc. to almost every location - and it is also very affordable.
And to this list of inadequate infrastructure we can add sewers and sewage treatment, schools, hospitals, nursing homes, century old water mains, etc. However, NYC is not alone. Almost every major city in the US faces the same situation where lack of investment in public transportation has led to clogged highways and many lost hours in long commutes.
Americans just need to go to Berlin, Munich, Amsterdam or Paris to see what modern marvels of transportation can mean for the average citizen. Instead of wasting their money on huge needless SUVs, most Europeans can ride trains, trams, subways, etc. to almost every location - and it is also very affordable.
29
In your haste to criticize America and its transportation choices, you make several false statements. I have been in Paris on a couple of dozen occasions, and have travelled by both taxi and metro. I like their metro system better than ones in NYC or London, but during rush hour, trains are jam packed. They are every bit as crowded as NYC trains at rush hour. And traffic on the highways during rush hour? Also a parking lot. I think the same can be said for London, also a large city.
3
The problem is in Albany, with Andrew Cuomo who is nearly incompetent in performing his role as governor. The governor promised billions of dollars in funding from the state (obviously paid for by New York City residents in taxes), but in a political decision, to maintain an utterly absurd sense of "balance" the governor is equally dividing transportation funds between New York City and sparsely populated upstate regions, which under Cuomo's plans will receive more in benefits than they paid into the state in taxes. Meanwhile an economic engine of this state and the country is being starved of much needed funds to maintain and expand our public transportation system.
The governor also fails New Yorkers by not maintaining the necessary level of oversight of the MTA Capital Construction, which expends far more money to construct subway lines than any other public transportation operator in the world.
The governor also fails New Yorkers by not maintaining the necessary level of oversight of the MTA Capital Construction, which expends far more money to construct subway lines than any other public transportation operator in the world.
11
Any New Yorker who lived through Bloomberg's 12 years of rampant pro-development policy could have seen this coming. Indeed there were voices of dissent but they were generally swept aside. Instead of developing prudently, we saw billionaire developers given permission to add tens of thousands of units in areas where the transportation infrastructure was already at full capacity, with no viable civic plan to address the needs such a glut of new humanity would bring, and no onus upon developers themselves to remediate the burden either. Instead of local politicians standing up to the tide, we saw them bought and paid for with campaign contributions and weak promises to provide an insignificant percentage of affordable housing units in the mix.
Now more than any other time in my 20+ years as a New Yorker I'm hearing people talk about density as detrimental to the quality of life. Everyone loves the vibrancy that comes from a certain level of density, but there is a tipping point and we are feeling it now. Forced to compete for every little scrap of comfort and decency, from the homes we live in to a place to stand on the subway platform, suddenly density is upon us like never before--and it's no fun at all. Everything is cyclical. It's fair to day that today's boom will one day be bust. Looking around this shiny new Developers' New York, I can't help but feel the relentless acceleration of population density is now hastening that eventual reversal of our city's fortune.
Now more than any other time in my 20+ years as a New Yorker I'm hearing people talk about density as detrimental to the quality of life. Everyone loves the vibrancy that comes from a certain level of density, but there is a tipping point and we are feeling it now. Forced to compete for every little scrap of comfort and decency, from the homes we live in to a place to stand on the subway platform, suddenly density is upon us like never before--and it's no fun at all. Everything is cyclical. It's fair to day that today's boom will one day be bust. Looking around this shiny new Developers' New York, I can't help but feel the relentless acceleration of population density is now hastening that eventual reversal of our city's fortune.
46
I was about to write a comment and you took the words right out of my mouth. I have been saying the same thing FOR YEARS. Thank you for your thoughtful words.
1
And anyone who dares bring up these legitimate issues is branded with the dreaded "NIMBY" epithet-- including by deBlasio, whose vision of urban planning is "build more, build bigger, build everywhere". And then we have a City Council that keeps deferring to development as well, and not just more condo highrises--- the rezoning of Midtown East will create even more hellish commutes for that area.
3
Except all of the major economic powerhouses in Asia are more dense. Their clout is growing even further.
The biggest issue of all is that NYC has been designed as a place where Manhattan is the commercial and job center - everyone has to get there in the morning, and leave from there in the evening. That makes no sense.
Once we wise up - and this process has already started, but is moving slowly - and create office and business centers in Brooklyn, Queens, The Bronx and SI... and one employers grow more comfortable with more localized space, things will ease up. Add in the ability to work virtually... I can easily see people having terrific careers, living in great spaces in all the non-Manhattan boroughs, and barely coming into Manhattan at all.
Once we wise up - and this process has already started, but is moving slowly - and create office and business centers in Brooklyn, Queens, The Bronx and SI... and one employers grow more comfortable with more localized space, things will ease up. Add in the ability to work virtually... I can easily see people having terrific careers, living in great spaces in all the non-Manhattan boroughs, and barely coming into Manhattan at all.
13
The problem with your theory is that when you move jobs out of the center of the very large metro area you make for grotesquely long commutes for workers living in other peripheries. I personally know people whose families were settled into downtown Brooklyn and mid-Harlem whose jobs moved to Connecticut. Also Long Island residents whose jobs went to Jersey and vice versa. Right now my husband is working as a consultant (fancy term for an executive level temp) with another consultant who is commuting from Connecticut to Long Island City; via Grand Central, of course.
3
I said into the outer boroughs. So someone in Queens could work in Queens, etc...
1
This is a good point. You see it starting to happen already in places like Dumbo and Long Island City, but part of the issue is that there is very little good inter-borough transportation that doesn't run through Manhattan.
When the cheapest, most efficient way to get from Brooklyn to Queens is by taking a subway through Manhattan, you know there is a problem.
A "Super-Express" line might be a great solution.
Think about the opportunities that would be created by a subway that ran from maybe the South Bronx all the way to somewhere like Coney Island, but it does it in just 30 minutes because it only has four major stops -- no local stops.
Put it through Astoria (N/Q), Long Island City (7/G), Williamsburg (L/G/J/M/Z), and Flatbush (2/5/B/Q) to provide access to the rest of the main outer-borough subways.
The key would be making the train a dedicated express line solely for fast inter-borough transportation.
Living, working, and commuting in, between, and around these major areas would become extremely easy and you'd significantly reduce dependency on the Manhattan subway lines because people would no longer journey through Manhattan to travel between the Bronx/Queens/Brooklyn.
When the cheapest, most efficient way to get from Brooklyn to Queens is by taking a subway through Manhattan, you know there is a problem.
A "Super-Express" line might be a great solution.
Think about the opportunities that would be created by a subway that ran from maybe the South Bronx all the way to somewhere like Coney Island, but it does it in just 30 minutes because it only has four major stops -- no local stops.
Put it through Astoria (N/Q), Long Island City (7/G), Williamsburg (L/G/J/M/Z), and Flatbush (2/5/B/Q) to provide access to the rest of the main outer-borough subways.
The key would be making the train a dedicated express line solely for fast inter-borough transportation.
Living, working, and commuting in, between, and around these major areas would become extremely easy and you'd significantly reduce dependency on the Manhattan subway lines because people would no longer journey through Manhattan to travel between the Bronx/Queens/Brooklyn.
4
I found the description of the platform controller as a sardine packer completely humorous!!!! The NYC subway is the best way around NYC. I would rather walk through the crowds of Grand Central Terminal to get to 6, than be trapped on the FDR in traffic.
9
Got that right!
1
NYC is well past it's prime -
Which is a worse experience - having to ride the subway every day or having to fly in and out of LaGuardia every week?
Which is a worse experience - having to ride the subway every day or having to fly in and out of LaGuardia every week?
9
Answer- having to live in Texas is worse.
4
I guess all the people moving to NYC have not heard it's past it's prime. The city's population continues to grow which is one reason for the crowded subway.
7
The world is past its prime.
2
Welcome to 'Luxury City'. Well, at least that was Bloomberg's vision for it. More and more people, but no expansion of subway service to match the growth in population. The old New York Central freight tracks along Tenth Avenue? They might have made a nice addition to the subway system, but instead they're now the High Line, where you can walk and watch yuppies work out in glass-walled seven-figure priced condos. The Second Avenue subway (TWO tracks instead of four, like the traditional express and local service on the other lines? Seriously?), which was supposed to have been built in the 1930s? 'Nuff said. And then, of course, there was Robert Moses (I call him 'Moses In Reverse', for his very negative 'contributions' to traffic and his general disdain for mass transit), who made sure that an expressway that was obsolete while still in the planning stages (The LIE, of course; how do you like those initials, irony fans?) would be built instead of the subway that was originally planned - a story that would be repeated with a number of other parkways and 'express'(This is a laugh)-ways as well. (It's all there on the original transit master plans of 1927-29).
Perhaps the last word ought to go to 'Popeye the Sailor' (Remember those cartoons?): "Ya buttered yer bread, now you're gonna lie in it."
Perhaps the last word ought to go to 'Popeye the Sailor' (Remember those cartoons?): "Ya buttered yer bread, now you're gonna lie in it."
43
Bloomberg oversaw the first subway expansion in decades yet he is the problem. He helped make NYC a place where everyone wants to be and thats a problem?
2
"They might have made a nice addition to the subway system, but instead they're now the High Line". Uh...nope. Wouldn't have helped. Those old freight tracks only go from Gansevoort to 34th and above-ground trains in Manhattan would be awful (all the old ones are long gone).
1
Bloomberg also saw to it that over 700,000 innocent New Yorkers were frisked and had their civil rights violated while pushing officers at the same to turn against each other in a quota race for promotions/overtime. Some Mayor he turned out to be.
1
When is the MTA going to consider peak pricing?
Yes - the trains are at capacity during the rush, but encouraging riders into trains outside of the rush would alleviate congestion on the trains during peak times.
The MTA should also provide better service after the rush. A quick look at the subway time table will show time gaps between trains widening as the so called rush "hour" expires.
Running more trains after the rush and encouraging ridership during these times is much cheaper that building new tunnels.
Yes - the trains are at capacity during the rush, but encouraging riders into trains outside of the rush would alleviate congestion on the trains during peak times.
The MTA should also provide better service after the rush. A quick look at the subway time table will show time gaps between trains widening as the so called rush "hour" expires.
Running more trains after the rush and encouraging ridership during these times is much cheaper that building new tunnels.
2
I don't think that would alleviate congestion.
Rush hour demand is highly price inelastic. People need to be at work at a certain time or they face repercussions. If they had the option of waiting a half hour and going on a less crowded train then they would already be taking it. Nobody wants to be on a rush hour train -- they have to be.
"Surge pricing" would just be the MTA extorting the average citizens. I say "extorting" because, as outlined above, people would be forced to take the hit and, therefore, it would have minimal effect on capacity or overcrowding.
I agree that taxes are a must, but there are other ways. I would tax drivers:
1. Least efficient means of transportation in terms of density.
2. Numerous negative externalities (pollution, accidents, congestion, etc.).
3. Drivers hardly pay for the roads they use (land is valuable) or said externalities.
Aside from raising revenue (amount would depend on the tax, of course), this tax would be beneficial in a number of ways:
1. Less pollution, fewer accidents, & decreased congestion.
2. Decreased congestion --> more room to expand bus/bike infrastructure.
3. Expanded bus/bike infrastructure --> decreased usage of subways.
4. Tax is mostly spread across businesses (UPS/FedEx, taxis, tour buses, etc.), not individuals.
5. Less wear & tear on roads --> decreased maintenance costs.
6. Less noise pollution --> happier citizens :D
Rush hour demand is highly price inelastic. People need to be at work at a certain time or they face repercussions. If they had the option of waiting a half hour and going on a less crowded train then they would already be taking it. Nobody wants to be on a rush hour train -- they have to be.
"Surge pricing" would just be the MTA extorting the average citizens. I say "extorting" because, as outlined above, people would be forced to take the hit and, therefore, it would have minimal effect on capacity or overcrowding.
I agree that taxes are a must, but there are other ways. I would tax drivers:
1. Least efficient means of transportation in terms of density.
2. Numerous negative externalities (pollution, accidents, congestion, etc.).
3. Drivers hardly pay for the roads they use (land is valuable) or said externalities.
Aside from raising revenue (amount would depend on the tax, of course), this tax would be beneficial in a number of ways:
1. Less pollution, fewer accidents, & decreased congestion.
2. Decreased congestion --> more room to expand bus/bike infrastructure.
3. Expanded bus/bike infrastructure --> decreased usage of subways.
4. Tax is mostly spread across businesses (UPS/FedEx, taxis, tour buses, etc.), not individuals.
5. Less wear & tear on roads --> decreased maintenance costs.
6. Less noise pollution --> happier citizens :D
9
Peak pricing would penalize people with lower incomes.
13
So we should pay more at rush hours before they improve service?
Wow, thanks a lot.
Wow, thanks a lot.
1
Gee, that looks dangerous! Tokyo didn't look that crowded....
Whenever I travel abroad and then return to NYC, I immediately notice the transportation system here -- particularly the subways -- as a sign of the overall deterioration of our nation's infrastructure. It feels like it's crumbling beneath my feet every time I walk into a subway station. My home station has been slated for an upgrade since I moved to this spot in 2007. Part of it has been repainted and they've added the emergency call boxes ... and that's it. It still looks and feels decrepit (it's a raised, outdoor platform). The MTA needs better fiscal oversight, and some more federal funding would help a lot. As it is, I'm planning on leaving the city by the end of the year, sad to say. I love NYC, but I've had enough of the grime and hazards of the public transportation here. I suppose I'll be one less person crowding the train ...
152
I couldn't agree with you more. The subways in Budapest, with apologies to Bidapest, are better maintained. And the subways in Germany.....fantastic. And it's not just the new ones. They actually clean and maintain their stations and their cars. We don't maintain anything.
3
As long as Republicans keep trying to ram in to the citizens head that taxes and government are evil, this is the result, no surprises here. Abroad, more money is spent on these infrastructure projects, hence, generally, overall, tax levels, although not unreasonable, are higher. Two summers ago I, personally spent time in primarily, Oklahoma and Northern Texas, that, at the time because of their connection to the energy business, were not quite as affected by the 2008 financial meltdown as the rest of the country.
Yet despite all that, Oklahoma City, in particular, both streets and highways, were about the WORST roads that I have ever traveled on in my life, public transit was virtually non-existent. Northern Texas wasnt much better.
Before 1980, corporations paid 35 percent of the overall tax revenue, they now pay less than 10 percent while everyone else has to pick up the difference. Yes America, keep allowing corporations and very wealthy people to evade taxes while claiming you pay too much, this is what you have. For starters, Flint, Detroit and the NYC subway system and it will get much worse.
Yet despite all that, Oklahoma City, in particular, both streets and highways, were about the WORST roads that I have ever traveled on in my life, public transit was virtually non-existent. Northern Texas wasnt much better.
Before 1980, corporations paid 35 percent of the overall tax revenue, they now pay less than 10 percent while everyone else has to pick up the difference. Yes America, keep allowing corporations and very wealthy people to evade taxes while claiming you pay too much, this is what you have. For starters, Flint, Detroit and the NYC subway system and it will get much worse.
8
I hear you, Mary. Almost every day my commute is fouled up by something or other, and having to stand in a crowded car from 145-Chambers street is not how I want to start my day. I, too, love NYC and have lived here over 20 years, but if one thing kicks me out of this city, it will the the hobbled and decrepit transportation system.
3
As Martin Luther King said, "Plenty of money for war." By the way, compare the budget of the MTA and all the capital spending programs they are putting in place with the $100 billion we've wasted in Afghanistan! Don't even mention Iraq. That's another story.
126
Nothing, including the subway, was built with unlimited capacity, or the infinite ability to adapt to increased volumes. At some point you max out. It's called math.
13
This article is chock full of Transit Authority propaganda. Riders in southern Brooklyn have been asking for express F train service and seven day B train service to no avail. All this talk about open pathways and platform safety doors is a diversion and distraction from simple improvements in service. What a con job.
61
As for the B weekend service, you know how it would go. With all the weekend track work around the system, it probably wouldn't even run on the weekend half the time, or would run local along the Q train. How many weekends does one direction of the Q run express, or not at all with shuttle buses in its place? The B on weekends would be nice, bit I can't see it happening.
1
You make a good point! Ironically, back in the day, when many commenters say things were awful, like in the 1970's and 1980's (and this is not to ridicule anyone who did have bad subway experiences then) I rode the "F" train up to The City from southern Brooklyn! And one line was Express from legendary Kings Highway. ( And the girls were still prettier, and complained a lot less!)
1
The sad part is NYC has become a hipster paradise where people are paying ridiculous rents in what used to be slums, we have 50 million dollar apartments and all this building of high end housing, but there is seemingly no money for transit. Back in the 1960's and 1970's, there was the mentality that the city was going under, but for the last 25 years we have a city that has surged, but transit has been nowhere to be found. The state loves all the extra tax revenue from tourists and people living here, but doesn't pass it back, and the MTA seems to focus more on its suburban lines.
Politicians on the left tend to seem to find other things that are more important, even though the subway is the lifeblood of working people, and the well off see transit as just another example of government waste, that it should be run like a business, which is one of the reason transit is always in trouble (problem is, the ROI on transit is huge, but no right winger can understand how much of a multiplier there is for every dollar spent, or the cost of not having transit).
Politicians on the left tend to seem to find other things that are more important, even though the subway is the lifeblood of working people, and the well off see transit as just another example of government waste, that it should be run like a business, which is one of the reason transit is always in trouble (problem is, the ROI on transit is huge, but no right winger can understand how much of a multiplier there is for every dollar spent, or the cost of not having transit).
207
I agree overall but it's not a spending problem- but a cost problem. Billions are spent every year - but we can't keep up.
As to running it like a business - well it works in Hong Kong - but the left won't break the stranglehold of the unions. Nor would they want them owning so much property as happens in Hong Kong. So it wouldn't work here.
As to running it like a business - well it works in Hong Kong - but the left won't break the stranglehold of the unions. Nor would they want them owning so much property as happens in Hong Kong. So it wouldn't work here.
1
"Politicians on the left tend to seem to find other things that are more important, even though the subway is the lifeblood of working people"
since the m.t.a. is controlled by the state, the liberal politicians elected by the city's voters can't solve the problem on their own, and state-level elected officials are too conservative and sketchy to care.
since the m.t.a. is controlled by the state, the liberal politicians elected by the city's voters can't solve the problem on their own, and state-level elected officials are too conservative and sketchy to care.
1
Politicians on the left? which ones are you talking about? and what republicans have improved the system? Bloomberg? Giuliani? What happened for 20 years? and now the so called left wing mayor has to clean up the mess immediately? laughable.
1
Since controlling for subway users will be hard given population dynamics, why not focus on safety measures. London has one or two stations where they have glass doors / platform screen doors at the edge of the platform that remain closed till the train arrives and open up once the train arrives and has come to a stand still. I lived at 86th St and you literally walk on knives by trying to stand as close to the edge as possible to get in and hoping you won't have an aggressive crowd behind you that could tip you over.
1
but is that not an intricate part of the commuting experience? Does it not add to the adventure and excitement? Does it not make one happy to have gotten to work without being maimed or killed (and thus contributing to greater happiness at work)?
Come take a ride on the PATH line from Jersey to Christopher Street and home again.
Watch 4 or 5 cars pass you, adding 30 minutes to your commute, because of how packed they are.
The idiots in NJ have let developers run amok, overcrowding every single PATH station. And the developers do nothing to improve transit conditions.
Watch 4 or 5 cars pass you, adding 30 minutes to your commute, because of how packed they are.
The idiots in NJ have let developers run amok, overcrowding every single PATH station. And the developers do nothing to improve transit conditions.
19
Oh, NYT, people are already getting hurt: boarding a 6 train, I was pushed so hard by the people behind me that I fell between the train and the platform. My right leg was wedged into the gap between the subway and the platform, and my left leg was up on the train, in the doorway. The worst part was that no one stopped to help me. Luckily I had no serious injuries, just cuts and bruises, but it was still awful. No matter how much of a hurry we're in, we all have to practice mindfulness and compassion on the train. You never know when it's going to be you, or your loved one, who's in need of help.
38
The growing threat to life and limb is obvious and ever present.
In dangerously overcrowded situations, with an open platform on one side, the danger wll only grow.
In dangerously overcrowded situations, with an open platform on one side, the danger wll only grow.
1
I am so sorry that happened to you! It sounds like a very frightening experience, and unusual that no one stopped to help you.
People in big cities get tunnel vision, always avoiding looking a stranger in the eye, not seeing what they either don't want to see or are afraid to see, or what they are not supposed to see, or that someone else does not want them to see. So people rush by. It's good you were not hurt badly.
People in big cities get tunnel vision, always avoiding looking a stranger in the eye, not seeing what they either don't want to see or are afraid to see, or what they are not supposed to see, or that someone else does not want them to see. So people rush by. It's good you were not hurt badly.
1
They should be removing all the vertical poles between doorways, so that people are forced to go further into the train to get a hold on.
People on the L train act ATROCIOUSLY - super inconsiderate, rude, entitled. Don't like to move in further, stand in the doorways immobile...
I wish the MTA would be more aggressive in campaigning about better subway behavior. We have such limited space in general, more and more people flooding into the city—as well as massive streams of tourists—and we just really need to work together and consider one another more. Really aggravating.
For all these reasons I tend to bike wherever I can. But I live near a bridge, so its kind of a luxury for me.
People on the L train act ATROCIOUSLY - super inconsiderate, rude, entitled. Don't like to move in further, stand in the doorways immobile...
I wish the MTA would be more aggressive in campaigning about better subway behavior. We have such limited space in general, more and more people flooding into the city—as well as massive streams of tourists—and we just really need to work together and consider one another more. Really aggravating.
For all these reasons I tend to bike wherever I can. But I live near a bridge, so its kind of a luxury for me.
12
Only a tall man could think that removing the poles would be a good idea. Without poles, what are young people supposed to hold on to? What are the women (remember that half of them are under 5'4") supposed to hold on to? The air? You?
8
So true. The "straps" are so high if you can grab one it would tear your arm out of its socket if the train jerks.
1
1.8 billion riders x $2.75 per ride = $4,950,000,000. (rough estimate, given monthly passes, etc.) That's on par with Dole Food and Levi Strauss companies. Add to that all the subsidies from government, and the NYC subway system would seem awash in funds!
Why is it run so poorly? Why is there no vision for the system?
Why is it run so poorly? Why is there no vision for the system?
88
The cost of a subway ride only covers about 40% of the actual cost of the fare.
The rest of the money comes from Taxes on Gas, cab rides, a special hidden mortgage tax of .25 of every mortgage closed downstate, a surcharge on taxes that corporations pay plus a payroll tax that every employer pays in downstate NY.
The rest of the money comes from Taxes on Gas, cab rides, a special hidden mortgage tax of .25 of every mortgage closed downstate, a surcharge on taxes that corporations pay plus a payroll tax that every employer pays in downstate NY.
1
The MTA makes money off of bridges and tunnels. Most of its revenue comes from bus and subway fares (which also depend on subsidies). But not all of the money collects here stays here. The MTA also runs transportation to/from Long Island, New Jersey, and upstate New York which are subsidized - meaning they don't pay for themselves.
2
There will never be enough money, as long as it's all spent on Fat Pensions for the Union employees.
BTW, these employees will never held accountable for their lousy work or overspending either. That's what the Unions are for...
BTW, these employees will never held accountable for their lousy work or overspending either. That's what the Unions are for...
And yet the City Council keeps approving more and more high-density residential building in Long Island City and Astoria. A few boats won't come close to solving this problem. Ridiculous.
22
and rezoning Midtown East to bring even more thousands of workers to GCT every day. But SL Green agreed to "amenities", so problem solved (not).
1
Much of the problem has to do with the conduct of passengers. Move into the middle of the car. Don't assume that you are entitled to have enough space to hold your phone out to read e mails and play Candy Crush. Tourists have to learn that the trains are crowded, not meeting places to plan your next adventure. The rules about folding strollers must be enforced. And why do bicycle riders insist on riding with their bikes during rush hour? PATH bans them from 4p to 7p. The subways are public conveyance systems for the masses not taxis or private vehicles. It's not meant to be a joyous experience, just an efficient one.
21
FREQUENCY: one of the problems has always been the amount of waiting, especially during off hours. Now there is a need of greater frequency during rush hour.
DOORS: especially during rush hour, when the conductor attempts to close the doors and a few are blocked, the conductor opens all the doors in that half section of the subway, creating opportunity for other passengers to enter & block other doors and.....wearing out the motors that operate the doors.
The door design of the metro in Paris, Mexico (made in France), and now the new cars in Buenos Aires, all require passengers to lift a handle to open the subway car door. This means that when the conductor closes the doors and one or several are blocked by passengers, only the blocked doors remain open until unblocked, then close. This saves much time and wear and tear on the equipment.
DOORS: especially during rush hour, when the conductor attempts to close the doors and a few are blocked, the conductor opens all the doors in that half section of the subway, creating opportunity for other passengers to enter & block other doors and.....wearing out the motors that operate the doors.
The door design of the metro in Paris, Mexico (made in France), and now the new cars in Buenos Aires, all require passengers to lift a handle to open the subway car door. This means that when the conductor closes the doors and one or several are blocked by passengers, only the blocked doors remain open until unblocked, then close. This saves much time and wear and tear on the equipment.
8
Obviously, the only solution for all this overcrowding is Soylent Green....
Seriously, beyond obvious weekday commuting problems, your article mentions that "Crowds are appearing on nights and weekends, too, and the authority is adding more trains at those times."
It's not enough! The MTA treats its weekend riders atrociously: making it a challenge to use our precious leisure time to go shopping, or visit relatives or restaurants, or accessing any of the fine leisure opportunities in this great city. Not only are the train schedules reduced to bare minimums on weekends, but maintence is always making any subway travel often nearly impossible for many weekend riders. The NYC economy would benefit greatly if weekend service were improved --as would the MTA's cash inflow.
Seriously, beyond obvious weekday commuting problems, your article mentions that "Crowds are appearing on nights and weekends, too, and the authority is adding more trains at those times."
It's not enough! The MTA treats its weekend riders atrociously: making it a challenge to use our precious leisure time to go shopping, or visit relatives or restaurants, or accessing any of the fine leisure opportunities in this great city. Not only are the train schedules reduced to bare minimums on weekends, but maintence is always making any subway travel often nearly impossible for many weekend riders. The NYC economy would benefit greatly if weekend service were improved --as would the MTA's cash inflow.
9
Again, nowhere else is 24/7/365. So sometimes we have to have maintenance pauses.
5
but will soylent green be fed to subway riders or be wasted on the 1%?
People boast of the subways being 24 hour, 7 day system, yet the reality is quite different.
"...officials say the agency is already running as many trains as it can..."
Balderdash.
I ride the L in the morning. 6 deep into Manhattan, waiting for packed trains that are 5 to 8 (sometimes 10!) minutes apart; while, on the Canarsie-bound side, zero people waiting for empty trains that arrive every 2 to 3 minutes.
Note to dispatchers: figure it out.
Balderdash.
I ride the L in the morning. 6 deep into Manhattan, waiting for packed trains that are 5 to 8 (sometimes 10!) minutes apart; while, on the Canarsie-bound side, zero people waiting for empty trains that arrive every 2 to 3 minutes.
Note to dispatchers: figure it out.
14
The fact that the subway system even has dispatchers is part of the problem.
It should be entirely automated. Cheaper in the long run and far more efficient, but the Transit Workers Union wouldn't be too pleased with that.
It should be entirely automated. Cheaper in the long run and far more efficient, but the Transit Workers Union wouldn't be too pleased with that.
1
The problem with running more trains in only one direction on the L is that the 8th Ave. stop is a terminal stop. It takes at least 6 minutes for the conductor to exit the trains and re-set it for the return trip. If both tracks at 8th Ave. are full, another train cannot enter until one heads back to Brooklyn. It is a structural issue. You cannot run more trains into Manhattan or speed them up because you end up with a back-log that will clog the entire system all the way to East NY. Also, the tracks used by the L that run under the East River are the deepest, (that's why your ears pop half-way through) and subject to particular problems because of that.
3
This is the case of the free market needing to work -- if you have record demand, and the system needs more money to expand, it's time to raise prices. 10% or so should help; keep the half-off reduced fares, but those should be raised in tandem.
Just like gas taxes should be raised to help fix our terrible roads, as long as that extra money from the higher subway fares goes to improvements in the system, I don't see why the riders shouldn't pay more of their own way.
Just like gas taxes should be raised to help fix our terrible roads, as long as that extra money from the higher subway fares goes to improvements in the system, I don't see why the riders shouldn't pay more of their own way.
7
Unfortunately this is the inevitable result of extremely high (legal) immigration that sees approximately 850,000 - one million newcomers every year in the US. The population of the country has doubled in the past forty years and overcrowding is the inevitable result as more and more people attempt to share the same amount of space.
The only practicable solution for this is a moratorium on most immigration until the nations leaders decide what is a sustainable amount of immigration. So far, however there is little awareness of this issue.
If you are concerned, contact your congress person or check out an interest group such as the Federation on American Immigration Reform.
The only practicable solution for this is a moratorium on most immigration until the nations leaders decide what is a sustainable amount of immigration. So far, however there is little awareness of this issue.
If you are concerned, contact your congress person or check out an interest group such as the Federation on American Immigration Reform.
8
It's amazing how people can so effortlessly draw parallels between whatever topic is at hand and whatever topic they feel like discussing regardless of how unrelated the two topics are.
One simple question for you:
Given that the subway system is already overcrowded, how would a "moratorium on most immigration" fix anything?
(Hint: It wouldn't.)
One simple question for you:
Given that the subway system is already overcrowded, how would a "moratorium on most immigration" fix anything?
(Hint: It wouldn't.)
6
And where are your statistics that would prove that immigration is responsible for crowding on the NYC subways??? Yes we need a commonsense immigration policy. Both George W. Bush and Barack Obama tried to develop one, but the far right slammed it down by taking a "my way or the highway" attitude. This country, more than any other nation, benefited from the ethnic mix brought on by its waves of immigrants. Not every immigrant wants to be a burden. The majority are hard-working and want to gain and be good citizens. I agree--the criminals and those seeking admission only to engage in illicit activities should be kept out. But those are a minority of our legal and illegal immigrants. Do your homework and don't rely on sources that only have an agenda.
2
I recently rode on open pathway cars on the London underground. Not only could they accommodate more passengers, they felt far less claustrophobic. This would be a reasonable and reasonably economic way to address overcrowding.
2
This story and the accompanying photos show the danger of disastrous thoughtless urban planning and careless rezoning. Developers have pressed politicians to allow ever taller buildings in various neighborhoods. But there is no thought to the quality of life in those neighborhoods and how the additional population will cause such overcrowding on mass transit. What is Grand Central going to look like once The LIRR is connected, and then new towers being build on East 42nd and on Vanderbilt. It is already crowded at rush hour with commuters, and with tourists who stop dead in the middle of the Concourse to take selfies. What will happen to its capacity when those towers are completed and filled? I am on the A train line and there are already no seats by the 3rd station from the beginning of the line at rush hour. All the uptown stations need maintenance. When is that going to happen?
164
Why should taller buildings be stopped when there's a housing crisis in the city?
Looks to me like the MTA should work alongside developers to make sure public transit is expanded as taller buildings are built. It's a win/win.
Looks to me like the MTA should work alongside developers to make sure public transit is expanded as taller buildings are built. It's a win/win.
1
@Ramon
The MTA does work alongside developers (somewhat). The NYC zoning code offers FAR bonuses to developers that choose to improve subway stations near their developments.
The MTA does work alongside developers (somewhat). The NYC zoning code offers FAR bonuses to developers that choose to improve subway stations near their developments.
1
But how else will Russian oligarchs, Arab sheiks, and Chinese Communist Party members be able to buy multimillion dollar apartments in NYC for all cash if our political leaders do not allow them to launder their ill gotten gains!?
Have a heart!
Have a heart!
3
The politician allowed it to be built above ground. I saw Koch stride down 2nd Ave. Needed then. Not really done since then. Close 2nd ave totally, get the 2nd ave. finished. Lets see a little political will. Also my Dad, remembers when they ran more trains closer together, with the old single system. HA!!!
2
my most vivid image of subways is gene hackman chasing frog 1 in th french connection
1
Nobody is riding the subway because people are fleeing the Dinkins / deBlasio city in droves.
Do not fall for the NY Times mainstream media lie that NY is working. It has fallen apart and nobody is left here because of deBlasio
Do not fall for the NY Times mainstream media lie that NY is working. It has fallen apart and nobody is left here because of deBlasio
2
fran, I am confused by your comments. If "nobody is left here", why is it still so crowded (which was the point of the article)?
4
Hmm, I hope that you feel better about writing a comment to express something that is astonishingly inaccurate, just to get a dig in against Dinkins and De Blasio. Seriously?
5
Dinkins was a good mayor who put tons of cops back on the streets that Giuliani later took credit for. You're just mad that De Blasio put the police back in their place and their sensitive feelings have been hurt ever since. Too bad.
1
Please don't stand in the doorway! Common sense please. Backpacks should be outlawed. Along with giant purses.
7
The responses to this article will be invariably negative, but one does have to give kudos to the MTA for a remarkably high safety record on its subways. It's hard to remember the last time passengers were injured/killed due to mechanical/system errors.
Now, Metro North is another matter altogether...
Now, Metro North is another matter altogether...
7
Ed, Metro North is part of the MTA.
2
With 2+ million rider fares per year more than 1990, we might wonder where that money is going. In addition, the article could have addressed what has changed over the past decades (especially during Pataki admin) about state funding for the MTA. The subway system provides the lifeblood for the entire region's economy. That's three states & about 20 million people. More money from the state (& in a saner nation, the Feds) isn't a gift but a rational necessity.
41
Might be more money to actually fix the infrastructure if the motorman wasn't bringing home more than 90% of the riders, including OT stuffing, pension and Cadillac benefits. MTA graft has been well-documented over the years (LIRR, NYC Transit and MNRR all included)
It's not a revenue problem; with all-time high ridership comes all-time high fare collection. $30B over five years that is the current capital plan is a LOT of money.
It's an expense problem. You keep skimping on the infrastructure to pad the wallets of the administrators and employees, it's going to catch up to you at some point.
It's not a revenue problem; with all-time high ridership comes all-time high fare collection. $30B over five years that is the current capital plan is a LOT of money.
It's an expense problem. You keep skimping on the infrastructure to pad the wallets of the administrators and employees, it's going to catch up to you at some point.
11
So where is Albany in all of this? Is Cuomo still wringing his hands and not giving New York City the funding it needs to keep the MTA up to date? Funny how decades ago Albandy decided to stop funding for the city's subways yet is still happy to take all of its tax revenue, making up 60% of the money collected from the entire state.
People like to complain about local intransigence but really this could all be assuaged at least a bit if the State loosened its purse strings and helped to fund the public transportation system of its biggest money-making city.
People like to complain about local intransigence but really this could all be assuaged at least a bit if the State loosened its purse strings and helped to fund the public transportation system of its biggest money-making city.
19
Ramon, Not much help expected from Albany. Most of them are in jail, or should be.
4
Systemic entropy. If one doesn't maintain their house, car, systems, etc., it won't last indefinitely.
Big problem in DC where they have performed little or no preventive maintenance other than upgrading cars while riders are frequently attacked by roving bands of teenagers the system does little about.
Big problem in DC where they have performed little or no preventive maintenance other than upgrading cars while riders are frequently attacked by roving bands of teenagers the system does little about.
3
This is all true. It is coupled with the fact that bus service has deteriorated even more. The crazy pace of new construction in Manhattan has made traffic a nightmare. And one of your writers (Paul Krugman) has advocated building even more tall buildings!! Associated with this is that our last Mayor created new bike lanes by removing lanes from automobile lanes, thus increasing traffic jams. The only way out of this is to start charging tolls on our current toll-free bridges and (like London) have the courage to charge for cars driving in crowded parts of Manhattan during busy periods.
12
Is there any definitive proof that bike lanes worsened traffic? Far as I can tell, there isn't.
Ramon, I live in Manhattan and see it every day in all parts of town. I have nothing against bikes. It works quite well in cities like Amsterdam but Manhattan was not built for this. The numbers of people who use bike lanes is relatively rare, compared to the huge numbers of people who ride buses or use cars. I have watched traffic becoming snarled in areas with new bike lanes. It is also something not difficult to predict. If you take an area where there is already gridlock, it is not shocking to see what happens when a traffic lane is taken out of service.
5
Guess you have no comprehension of what First Avenue was like pre-bike lane and post-bike lane. And you probably don't realize that the number of cyclists who utilize the bike lanes are minimal, but the number of people who are inconvenienced by the bike lanes is astronomical.
1
Overpopulation isn't the problem. But everyone on the same work schedule is. Employers shouldn't require all workers to arrive at the same time. The NYC subways are amazingly efficient and comfortable in off-peak hours - and much better than they were in the 1980's, when all the trains stopped between stations for hours and they never told you why. Now they even apologize for the delays.
16
It is staggering the amount of people who ride the subway each day and one has wonder why the fare keeps increasing (increased ridership = increased money to the MTA). Where is the money actually going? It is obvious that (1) change moves at a snails pace, (2) every job is a patch job, (3) the employees doing these jobs are the laziest people and take forever and (4) the system was not designed to accommodate this many people as well as the fact that over the years, there has been nothing done to anticipate growth in ridership. The MTA asks residences outside the city to pay a tax even if they do not use the trains but have to bc trains run through certain parts of upstate - the whole system is beyond ridiculous.
5
Do you have any comprehension how amazing a 24 hour a day, 365 day a year transportation system that handles millions of riders everyday actually is to run ?
Stop complaining. It is a marvel of urban society. What have you done ?
Stop complaining. It is a marvel of urban society. What have you done ?
3
Anybody who's witnessed the overbuilding in Manhattan and outer boroughs under three terms of Mayor Bloomberg (2002-2013), who rezoned 40% of NYC for taller buildings, could foresee overcrowding of the subway system was coming. How Bloomberg could get away with approving extensive building and not be required to correspondingly expand the transportation system in NYC is beyond me.
102
A board of very wealthy people who do not need to use public transportation have an inordinately large voice in making the decisions.
Realistically, this job should held by Gene Russianoff and his team.
Realistically, this job should held by Gene Russianoff and his team.
10
maybe he was planning for the inevitable bust or rent/living expenses getting so high that there would be a massive migration of people out of the city?
1
Don't forget the complicit Council, even now, under deBlasio. There's no true city/urban planning-- just more building.
3
Get people off the train #OneStopEarly. Ease congestion, promote exercise, discover local mom and pops. It's a win win win idea.
2
lovely thought... would not improve my commute one iota
3
Do city and community planners never consider the impact of yet another high-rise building upon the capacity of the subways and other shared transport and facilities? Not to mention quality of life. Can we not actually say NO to a developer even if they otherwise meet the required standards and limits?
43
Living in the NYC cesspool is a very poor choice...
3
Actually it can be a very good choice if you prefer not to rely on your continuing ability to drive, keep up the maintenance on a single family residence, etc. as you age.
In our Queens neighborhood I can walk a few blocks to a wonderful Chinese grocery store with all manner of really fresh produce, meat and fish, restaurants in various price ranges, chain and independent drug stores, a small park and a Macy's and a Target. I can take the subway to other parts of the city to cultural events. The subway and ferry take me to the baseball park with the best beyond the fence view in the world - the home of the Staten Island Yankees. And so on.
In our Queens neighborhood I can walk a few blocks to a wonderful Chinese grocery store with all manner of really fresh produce, meat and fish, restaurants in various price ranges, chain and independent drug stores, a small park and a Macy's and a Target. I can take the subway to other parts of the city to cultural events. The subway and ferry take me to the baseball park with the best beyond the fence view in the world - the home of the Staten Island Yankees. And so on.
15
Thank you for this highly insightful comment. You would know about NYC life, seeing as how you live somewhere called Maple Valley on the other side of the country.
10
Could someone please wake up the MTA and the NYC Department of Transportation. Put more than one bus per 30 minutes going over the Williamsburg Bridge. Make a bus only lane on the bridge. Why hasn't this been done already Mayor?
5
Mayor has no control over the MTA
1
Why is there no mention of the massive overdevelopment of neighborhoods? I live on the East Side. I have lost count of the new buildings (all towering) and blocks clearly being slowly dismantled for redevelopment. Doesn't anyone think about the lack of infrastructure to move all the resulting new residents?
23
Rode the uptown number 6 at 1:10 am last night from 59th. All seats were full with people standing even at that hour. Few people got off on the East Side stops, 96th and below. Yes, tall buildings with increased populations on the Upper East Side are a problem but I suspect the biggest populations are from the high percentage of multiple people living in single units in other boroughs reported by the Times a while ago. I doubt if the Census has any idea how many people are really living in NYC now (or riding the subways). The huge ridership increase in the past 10 years should mean very increased income for the MTA...why the last fare increase? Why not more frequent trains, cleaner stations, more frequent buses obliged to comply with posted schedules, more accountability to the public?
56
The city that is home to Wall Street and financial services industry and well as many other lucrative businesses, tourism and VERY rich people can't afford to maintain its infrastructure. What's wrong with this picture?
73
The problem is exacerbated by the fact that many (most?) of those Wall Street, financial services industry and other well paid workers who work in NYC do not live in NYC or even NYS. Moreover, if you look carefully you will find that many large banks and other financial industry businesses already have most of their employees in other locations. (See, for example, Charlotte, N.C.)
2
You forgot 'very poor people' who we not only pay to live in one of the most expensive cities in the world, but we give them free parking spots, when no one but the .01% can afford cars.
It always takes the worst of Conservatives and Liberals to make a real mess of things.
It always takes the worst of Conservatives and Liberals to make a real mess of things.
Love the film (and it is a film, not a video). Amazing to see the style of everyday dress. Now, were three really 6 million ridess a day in 1940? That many people back then?
1
1.8 billion rides, $2.75 per ride. I'm no Einstein but that would be $4.95 billion dollars in revenue. So where is it all going? All I hear is how broke the MTA is.
Would someone with an accounting education do a real audit please.
Would someone with an accounting education do a real audit please.
37
That isn't really a lot of money compared, say, with the cost of USAF planes.
2
Last year in July the NY Post reported that 25% of MTA workers earned $100K or more. MTA chairman and CEO Thomas Prendergast, earned $346,707 according to the article:
http://nypost.com/2015/07/16/heres-why-your-subway-fare-keeps-going-up/
http://nypost.com/2015/07/16/heres-why-your-subway-fare-keeps-going-up/
3
First of all, not all rides come in at $2.75, not by a long shot, considering the bonus $$ you get with a Metrocard pay per ride, or the number of rides you can get on an unlimited.
But secondly - there's regular operations/maintenance of the subway, and then there's capital projects, like new stations and new lines. They both require billions of dollars.
But secondly - there's regular operations/maintenance of the subway, and then there's capital projects, like new stations and new lines. They both require billions of dollars.
3
Do you think that part of the problem may be that the population of the four boroughs is exceeding any rational point of the space people need to live like civilized human beings and not like the rats in John Calhoun's overpopulation experiments? Just keep putting up ever taller buildings and crowd more people into New York City, then stand a good distance away and watch as the fun really begins.
152
th people who live in those bog tall bldgs dont use th subway
4
Megacities in East Asia are far more dense, but they have the transportation infrastructure to match. MTA incompetence and lack of investment is more to blame.
6
Agree 100%. Have been saying it for years. Where do the money changers-- ahem -- "urban planners" think all these people are going to go once all these new high rises are filled? Manhattan is not gaining any land area.
4
No need to remind us that the New York subway remains, despite the familiar mess, a pioneering marvel in modern transportation; yet all other subways I have ever seen, London, Paris, Madrid, Rome, Mexico, Montreal, despite sometimes modest surroundings, show evidence of regular maintenance and updated equipment. Look up at the ceilings of many NY stations and you see something closer to the nasty archaeological remains of another era than to a space used by millions of riders in one of the world's wealthiest cities. Politicians come and go; and the subway gets expensive, often useless updates, but the enduring grunge and ancient technology of our NY subway seem to be here to stay.
273
Partly that is because ours is the only one that runs 24/7/365. It's much harder - and more costly - to do regular maintenance with trains wising through. Now there are a lot of weekend, night and very occasionally more extensive shutdowns of various line segments for maintenance and the complaints about that are also manifold. Hard to have it both ways.
37
When comparing other subway systems with ours, you have to consider the fact that our system operates 24/7, the enormous size of the system itself and the intensity of use. No other system comes close, not even the one in London. Others are far more esthetic (and sanitary), but nothing comes close to the workhorse that is NYC Transit.
170
And the other part of that is 50 years of mass transit funding neglect perpetrated by the Big Oil/Auto cartel lobbyists.
11
I guess what I experienced riding the subway trains in Manhattan during the 1970s was a pleasure compared to what I see in the photographs. Maybe all these people are probably scaring the big subway rats from entering the trains.
1
The trains ran way better in the 70's. There was still federal money in mass transit. The city's financial problems didn't really manifest until the late 70's. Then with Reaganomic cuts in the 80's and the city on life support things started getting bad. I'd love to compare the train schedules then to now. I feel like there was much better scheduled service, even if trains did breakdown more frequently and there was lots of graffiti.
2
Almost every single problem always boils down to the one thing we refuse to talk about - human over-population.
156
Or just neglecting to maintain and expand infrastructure to keep pace with local population growth...
9
perhaps you should go to the mid-west or west and drive around for an hour at 60mph and not see a human.
3
Yet we subsidize the rich and the poor to live in Manhattan.
But not the middle class, of course.
But not the middle class, of course.
2
There is no money to massively expand the subway system. The MTA takes forever to complete even the simplest projects and mismanages the billions upon billions of dollars it has now.
86
Here is the problem with this kind of reporting. You delink the causality of the rampant development that has been going on with the effect, which is the overcrowding. Nobody is asking or answering the question of how or if we can continue to build so heavily along subway corridors without actually rebuilding or adding lines. This is the fundemental problem with these articles.
247
My first thought when I started reading was "and yet development continues unabated."
6
Exactly.. look at the rampant development in Williamsburg, for just one example among many, and the tens of thousands of people who were brought into the neighborhood already (not counting the tens of thousands more for the New Domino development) with NO increase at all in public transportation, nor even an elevator for the L.. the ferry does not count, it connects with only the 34th Street bus, and not that conveniently.
6
and also delinked the issue from the governor, who controls the m.t.a., raids its budget every year, and is to blame for its failure to keep up with demand and modernize ahead of it. we should already have c.b.t.c. and platform doors, and now be moving on to expanding the system, but the state is too cheap to invest in these transit priorities.
Used to live in NYC. The subway system rivals the Post Office for most poorly run company in the world.
21
I think it's amazing that the Post Office can do what it does for no more money than it takes; and am getting tired of smear campaigns on public services that private companies want to take over and start gouging us for.
30
Ah yes, the ole conservative battle cry: We need to privatize everything (and skim the resulting profits off the hides of consumers --- instead of improving the existing institutions).
24
The NYC subway systems is not a "company". It is a public good which is being starved by a Congress which is seeking to unravel civilized society.
16
Subways in Moscow can also be frighteningly crowded, but the trains come at two-minute intervals. The city keeps adding more lines and new equipment. We in America know what is needed -- don't we? Our economy can afford it better than the battered Russian economy. More trains? More subway workers? Investment in decaying infrastructure? Federal supports for public transportation comparable to the supports for highways? A new New Deal? It did surprise me that New Yorkers voted in such large numbers for Clinton. Did she get you these sorts of structural investments and re-investments when she was your senator? If she did, that explains things a little better for me.
60
pstewart, The simple answer is NO. She seemed to have spent most of her time as Senator positioning herself to run for the presidency.
8
This is my daily reality commuting on the 6 train. I'm tired of hearing "Step all the way in" when there is no where to go, "another train behind this one" which will also be too packed, and "this train is delayed due to train traffic ahead of it" like the MTA's schedule never took into account a NYC commute. And the summer commute? Misery. Where is the leadership on this issue that affects 6 million people a day? And with 2 million more riders a day, where's all that additional revenue going? Additional staff telling you to step aside is not the answer. Enough is enough. Public officials, figure it out.
281
It looks as if NYC will be getting like the Tokyo subway with pushers and packers of cars. The sardines analogy is good.
1
Yes, we are pitted against each other. Where is the leadership.
1
Q. Where is the leadership on this issue that affects 6 million people a day?
A. In Albany, 150 miles away.
Q. And with 2 million more riders a day, where's all that additional revenue going?
A. Pensions the likes of which you can only dream of.
A. In Albany, 150 miles away.
Q. And with 2 million more riders a day, where's all that additional revenue going?
A. Pensions the likes of which you can only dream of.
1
As a former city resident and an occasional visitor, I am really shocked at how the city has let the subways deteriorate. Once the jewel amongst public transportation systems, the subways are in need of repair. Many of the entrances need to be rebuilt. The beautiful tile work needs repair or replacement and, as everybody already knows, the whole system needs to be upgraded.
Everytime I get on the subway at the stop I use, in a stylish section of Brooklyn, I just have the feeling that in the greatest city in the world, the public needs to use a transportation system that doesn't look and feel quite so shabby.
Everytime I get on the subway at the stop I use, in a stylish section of Brooklyn, I just have the feeling that in the greatest city in the world, the public needs to use a transportation system that doesn't look and feel quite so shabby.
57
I always wonder about the comment " ... the greatest City in the world..." What are the metrics used to determine that lofty prize? This article appears to challenge that statement with some documented problems.
2
The MTA, including NYC Transit, is a STATE agency....not City. The blame starts in Albany.
30
Apparently you have no awareness of how bad it was in the 1970s, when subway cars routinely broke down, derailments happened on a regular basis, the cars were always filthy, both cars and stations were covered with graffiti, and you literally risked your life if you dared to take a train after 9pm. Yes, the system needs constant investment and is always being shafted by Albany. But to call the system as it is today a disaster is to have no awareness of history.
7
Rule #1: Tourists cannot be allowed to ride the subway during rush hour unless they complete a one hour course on NY Subway etiquette (moving into the car fully, taking off their backpacks, waiting to get on while others get off, etc...)
Rule #2: No bikes on the subway... ever. You have a bike - use it
Rule #3: No strollers during rush hour. I'm not anti-family/kids on the train during rush hour, but the stroller space belies its usefulness.
Rule #4: If the platform is crowded, please stop pushing your way onto it down the stairs.
Rule #5: if you can't get on this train, stay out and wait for the next one, YOU are causing the whole subway line to be delayed wedging your way half in. You aren't that small and your rear is sticking out of the doors before it closes, how perceivable is it that you'll magically get in when the doors do close?
Rule #2: No bikes on the subway... ever. You have a bike - use it
Rule #3: No strollers during rush hour. I'm not anti-family/kids on the train during rush hour, but the stroller space belies its usefulness.
Rule #4: If the platform is crowded, please stop pushing your way onto it down the stairs.
Rule #5: if you can't get on this train, stay out and wait for the next one, YOU are causing the whole subway line to be delayed wedging your way half in. You aren't that small and your rear is sticking out of the doors before it closes, how perceivable is it that you'll magically get in when the doors do close?
323
Carl, So it is all the fault of the people riding the subways??
8
Totally agree with Carl. One more point: stop sitting with legs crossed outward during crowded rush hour for the sake of humanity! It's not going to kill you to sit with your legs crossed under like ladies were taught to do in yesteryear etiquette classes for a couple of stops. And stop leaning on the darn poles during rush hour! Short people & people with deterioration of shoulder joints can't reach up the poles above their heads. And let's just stop the nonsense of suitcases during rush hour. Real nice you're using mass transit to get to the airport and taking up space where humans need to stand to get to their jobs to earn their bread and butter while you take up space for your vacation. Nice! /s
6
Add this: to the folks that insist on jamming their bikes onto a rush-hour car. Yeah - you have a "right" to bring the thing on, but here's a news flash for you: You DON'T HAVE THE RIGHT TO TOUCH ANYONE with it! Get out your camera phones and start filing assault charges.
5