The voice of reason! Please compare/contrast with Roger Cohen's saber rattling piece.
5
The number of Muslins that have been recruited in Europe is miniscule compared to the Muslin population of Europe. The notion that this problem is driven by poverty in European cities is beyond simplistic and has a strong blame the victim bent to it. Europe is not a melting pot and never has been. There is no tradition of assimilation or integration. Quite the opposite, many of the last 1,000 years of European wars have been fought to resist being assimilated or integrated into another. There is no cultural understanding of accommodation. In the United States our national ethos is built around assimilating, working hard, following the rules and getting ahead. Anyone’s child can be President, anyone can get rich. Europeans work hard to maintain their national and regional identities most all of which are more ancient than muslin culture. For the last 25 years or so the veneer of Multiculturalism has papered over the lack of assimilation but all that was window dressing on the part of Europeans, not the Muslin immigrants.
12
Why are Europeans of any descent who go to fight with foreign forces allowed back in Europe? Their passports should be seizied on their attempt to return. And should American policy be any different?
American citizens who fight for any foreign force, including Israel's, should forfeit US citizenship.
And citizens who travel to support ISIS, even as "Innocent wives" should pay a price for their actions.
American citizens who fight for any foreign force, including Israel's, should forfeit US citizenship.
And citizens who travel to support ISIS, even as "Innocent wives" should pay a price for their actions.
34
This article makes the good point that more attacks in Europe are inevitable and impossible to prevent. The prevalence of Muslims who cannot apparently be integrated creates a constant pool of recruits, and terrorist attacks on civilian, random targets are easy to accomplish.
So since the Muslim community in Europe will be no help, I think the only answer is to remove the source. Find and eliminate all Islamist terrorists in the Mideast and Africa, don't take prisoners and don't hold back. Eradicate them and they will cease to recruit; fail to do that and these attacks will never stop.
So since the Muslim community in Europe will be no help, I think the only answer is to remove the source. Find and eliminate all Islamist terrorists in the Mideast and Africa, don't take prisoners and don't hold back. Eradicate them and they will cease to recruit; fail to do that and these attacks will never stop.
5
I am coming to the conclusion, that one should not force together what does not belong together. The differences between the free world and islamic societies are just too big. To only name a few: individualism versus collectivism (family clans, wrongly understood pride), equality of the sexes versus oppression of women, saecularism versus fundamentalism.
Integration is not a one way street and I believe that western societies have to make too important compromises, against their values, to accomodate religious moslems. Even with those compromises, many moslems will still feel that they are not treated fairly. I also have a problem accepting the "no future" of young moslems in Europe; several of the terrorists, now dead, held a job but did not feel like showing up there every day. Some of the Belgian terrorists went to good schools, unfortunately they decided to not put their (free) education to good use.
It will probably not be possible, but we should help those people who feel excluded and overwhelmed in a free country to move to the country of their parents, grand-parents. For France and Belgium this will be mainly the Maghreb countries.
People fleeing war should be helped as close to their home countries as possible, with financial assistance from all wealthy countries. If this is not possible, those countries will give them a temporary home, schooling for their children and allow them to work and save money so that they can restart in their country once the war is over
Integration is not a one way street and I believe that western societies have to make too important compromises, against their values, to accomodate religious moslems. Even with those compromises, many moslems will still feel that they are not treated fairly. I also have a problem accepting the "no future" of young moslems in Europe; several of the terrorists, now dead, held a job but did not feel like showing up there every day. Some of the Belgian terrorists went to good schools, unfortunately they decided to not put their (free) education to good use.
It will probably not be possible, but we should help those people who feel excluded and overwhelmed in a free country to move to the country of their parents, grand-parents. For France and Belgium this will be mainly the Maghreb countries.
People fleeing war should be helped as close to their home countries as possible, with financial assistance from all wealthy countries. If this is not possible, those countries will give them a temporary home, schooling for their children and allow them to work and save money so that they can restart in their country once the war is over
39
We have reluctance to use the word that applies to th terrorist situations: WAR. The only way to stop terrorism is to make the cost too high for its perpetrators. No other tactic will result. If we identify a terrorist, kill him, . destroy his home and town, imprison his family, in their own home. Make the cost off their attacks personally so costly that they will consider stopping them.
History tells us that no other procedure will avail.
Alan Weck
History tells us that no other procedure will avail.
Alan Weck
6
The three most explanatory words in any terrorism story are these, "unemployed young men."
11
March 23, 2016
Realistically the condition for peaceful resolution for the Islamic global mindset is as much is " less straightforward and harder to achieve." The ideological war manifest everywhere - and the counter-argument for living with tolerance is the only path towards hope. What was once the Palestine Israel existential blooding is now leading to Islam at war with everyone, everywhere - and that includes the diaspora of all Muslims - as Donald Trump is confronting on the presidential election circuit.
jja Manhattan, N. Y.
Realistically the condition for peaceful resolution for the Islamic global mindset is as much is " less straightforward and harder to achieve." The ideological war manifest everywhere - and the counter-argument for living with tolerance is the only path towards hope. What was once the Palestine Israel existential blooding is now leading to Islam at war with everyone, everywhere - and that includes the diaspora of all Muslims - as Donald Trump is confronting on the presidential election circuit.
jja Manhattan, N. Y.
4
I believe the key to ending the Islamic States' success lies within Islam itself. Peace-loving Muslims should be teaching peace and should be exposing and opposing jihadists.
8
I just read in The Daily Mail UK that one of the suicide bombers was sent back from Turkey and the authorities were warned about him being a danger. Sounds like they just ignored the Turkish authorities like the USA authorities ignored the Russian authories when the Russians said the same thing about the Boston Marathon bombers. Russia and Turkey are not your enemies and you need to listen to their authorities and act on it. Donald Trump is right about getting tougher on these known radicalised citizens. You need to contain the problem by closing borders to illegal immigrants and refugees.
5
America, be sure that if someone goes to Syria, Turkey, Libya, etc., that can never re-enter the USA.
9
Muslims often feel alienated from the broader population? You mean, when they go to pray at one of the tens of thousands of mosques across the continent? Or do you mean Muslim men feel alienated when they are asked to work with women, to respect them and even shake their hand?
Or, maybe you're referring towhen Muslim women are asked to respect the laws of laicité and not wear a headscarf to work? Yes, how alienating, for everyone involved.
Or do they feel alienated when a terrorist is hiding among them, in their self-isolated communities, and nobody alerts the authorities?
But, wait, even though there exists this expansive track record of marginalized Muslims in Europe-- who may be a petri dish for terrorism-- the EU is still being asked to take them in by the millions... and make sure they feel comfortable and at home.
Wow! Just wow!
Or, maybe you're referring towhen Muslim women are asked to respect the laws of laicité and not wear a headscarf to work? Yes, how alienating, for everyone involved.
Or do they feel alienated when a terrorist is hiding among them, in their self-isolated communities, and nobody alerts the authorities?
But, wait, even though there exists this expansive track record of marginalized Muslims in Europe-- who may be a petri dish for terrorism-- the EU is still being asked to take them in by the millions... and make sure they feel comfortable and at home.
Wow! Just wow!
62
@Lola
You have certainly hit several nails on the head!! --- Wow! indeed.
You have certainly hit several nails on the head!! --- Wow! indeed.
14
Islam is a religion of conquest. If not by force then by numbers. In every conflict they initiate they are the victims and in the end there are more of them than anyone else.
33
It's pretty clear that one of the goals ISIS has in its European attacks, is to frighten people into shutting out refugees. They want those refugees to stay in the middle east as part of their new "Islamic State".
And it seems to be working pretty well with some groups -- like the Republican Party. I'm pretty sure that dumping our values overboard in the face of coercion isn't a very brave thing to do. Come on America, let's try to be as brave as the Europeans have and at least as brave as they are in Boston
And it seems to be working pretty well with some groups -- like the Republican Party. I'm pretty sure that dumping our values overboard in the face of coercion isn't a very brave thing to do. Come on America, let's try to be as brave as the Europeans have and at least as brave as they are in Boston
5
Interpol has long lamented europes open borders and has cited them as reasons for the free flow of arms, illegal goods, and human trafficking. The cost on human lives with human trafficking has been staggering - but big bussiness has been the most vocal - esp. in Germany- about keeping the borders open. They have managed to pitch this with an eu ideal of the free movement of people and GOODs. It is now time to take this away from these special interests and close the borders once and for all. The free flow - back and forth of fighters/terrorists is one of the most ansurd things i have ever read about. They need to do what we do -stop them and throw them on jail - all 5k of them.
7
Interpol has long lamented europes open borders and has cited them as reasons for the free flow of arms, illegal goods, and human trafficking. The cost on human lives with human trafficking has been staggering - but big bussiness has been the most vocal - esp. in Germany- about keeping the borders open. They have managed to pitch this with an eu ideal of the free movement of people and GOODs. It is now time to take this away from these special interests and close the borders once and for all. The free flow - back and forth of fighters/terrorists is one of the most ansurd things i have ever read about. They need to do what we do -stop them and throw them in jail - all 5k of them.
1
The so-called Middle East or Terror policy "experts" that have advised and/or served in the Obama and Bush Administrations are also the majority of voices influencing those who would be President as well as Congressional leadership. Make no mistake, political actions taken by the US & it's coalition in the aftermath of 9/11 to this day birthed ISIL/ISIS/Daesh. The current policies of the Obama Administration have sustained it.
Insanity has been defined as doing the same thing over & over while expecting different results. The United States & Allies have been meddling in the internal political affairs of Middle East, SW Asia & Saharan Africa for a very long time up to and including invasion, proxy wars & bombing campaigns designed to cause regime change.
At the same time, within Europe there has been a ever growing population of poorly assimilated peoples from the same areas of the world. As children who have grown up within the cultures of Western Europe they can move freely & have knowledge greatly beneficial to one who intends harm. Add in radical factions that openly teach subversion of the liberal democratic societies of Europe. Now add millions of new migrants unscreened for criminal background or involvement with terrorism coming from the war zones of the Islamic world.
Ms Clinton needs to be very sharply questioned about her involvement in these affairs as both a Senator and as Secretary of State. The same is true for the Republican advisors that enabled this mess.
Insanity has been defined as doing the same thing over & over while expecting different results. The United States & Allies have been meddling in the internal political affairs of Middle East, SW Asia & Saharan Africa for a very long time up to and including invasion, proxy wars & bombing campaigns designed to cause regime change.
At the same time, within Europe there has been a ever growing population of poorly assimilated peoples from the same areas of the world. As children who have grown up within the cultures of Western Europe they can move freely & have knowledge greatly beneficial to one who intends harm. Add in radical factions that openly teach subversion of the liberal democratic societies of Europe. Now add millions of new migrants unscreened for criminal background or involvement with terrorism coming from the war zones of the Islamic world.
Ms Clinton needs to be very sharply questioned about her involvement in these affairs as both a Senator and as Secretary of State. The same is true for the Republican advisors that enabled this mess.
7
@Gregory
I'm curious as to why you think that Mrs Clinton, as the Senator from the State of New York, should be questioned. And if such is the case, then why not question Senator Bernie Sanders from the State of Vermont?
Granted, Clinton's actions as Secretary of State might be more relevant to any involvement in international affairs. But then again, one must take the chain of command into consideration. Which means all questions should start at the top.
I'm curious as to why you think that Mrs Clinton, as the Senator from the State of New York, should be questioned. And if such is the case, then why not question Senator Bernie Sanders from the State of Vermont?
Granted, Clinton's actions as Secretary of State might be more relevant to any involvement in international affairs. But then again, one must take the chain of command into consideration. Which means all questions should start at the top.
3
The Bush admin certainly deserves a lot of blame, but it is important to recognize that the US has tried many, many, many different strategies for bringing "peace to the middle east" ever since the fall of the Ottoman Empire (which itself was really just a copy of the original Caliphate that ISIS wants to restore).
All presidents in the past century have tried, and all have failed. And yet, at this point in history, pulling out completely won't work either. It's a mighty big mess and you can bet the US will take a slightly new approach in the near future...and that won't work either.
All presidents in the past century have tried, and all have failed. And yet, at this point in history, pulling out completely won't work either. It's a mighty big mess and you can bet the US will take a slightly new approach in the near future...and that won't work either.
2
Those stating or arguing that the influx of refugees are somehow responsible for these attacked are creating a narrative the facts do not support. It is now clear that the Paris and Belgium attacks were carried out by local residents having nothing to do with the refugees . Now if the communities where the refugees end up settling do not do a good job of assimilation, they could become a problem. However, it is irresponsible to make such claims now.
1
Some of the Muslim migrants of today are the terrorists of tomorrow.
Living on the fringes of society, unemployed, some will surely be manipulated by radical imams blaming Westerners for all of their problems.
Their children will grow up disillusioned with European societies, and will begin to despise these societies.
This is a perfect breeding ground for future radicalization.
Muslim integration has failed in Europe, and it is time to stop pretending it has not.
The worst thing we can do is to massively add to the problem by adding millions of more Muslims to Europe. People's lives depend upon it.
Living on the fringes of society, unemployed, some will surely be manipulated by radical imams blaming Westerners for all of their problems.
Their children will grow up disillusioned with European societies, and will begin to despise these societies.
This is a perfect breeding ground for future radicalization.
Muslim integration has failed in Europe, and it is time to stop pretending it has not.
The worst thing we can do is to massively add to the problem by adding millions of more Muslims to Europe. People's lives depend upon it.
14
If you take a wider look at the picture, you will see how it's all connected. The fact that 'local residents' were behind these attacks is only part of what is going on now in Europe with the influx of (Muslim) refugees. Because in the end, it will only mean more people having to compete for less resources. And with fights already breaking out in refugee camps over food, water, accommodations, etc. -- just imagine how this would only intensify were this influx were allowed to continue unabated.
8
The golden thread that run through the "war on terror" the continuation with the same policies that have not worked for the past fifteen years. Bombing in the Middle East brought nothing but more deaths, more misery, less stability and more important, great increase in terrorism.
That tune - we are "winning" - has been played to us all since the infamous invasion of Iraq (actually since Vietnam). Many years later we are facing with a disaster both for us and for the people of the Middle East, many of whom flood Europe looking for a refuge from our endless wars.
Just like austerities for the economy so is bombing and invading brought nothing but misery but are still administered to us by people who know better, year after year decade after decade. Of course our leaders take no risk, they are in no danger of suffering the consequences of their actions; their jobs and safety are secured by us.
That tune - we are "winning" - has been played to us all since the infamous invasion of Iraq (actually since Vietnam). Many years later we are facing with a disaster both for us and for the people of the Middle East, many of whom flood Europe looking for a refuge from our endless wars.
Just like austerities for the economy so is bombing and invading brought nothing but misery but are still administered to us by people who know better, year after year decade after decade. Of course our leaders take no risk, they are in no danger of suffering the consequences of their actions; their jobs and safety are secured by us.
3
The problem of Muslim integration in Europe is the root of much terrorism in Europe, just look at whose the terrorists are. Muslim communities have failed to integrate, whose fault is that. Liberal commentators are quick to blame European governments which were led by some of the worlds most liberal governments over the last decades. What should they have done differently? How do you integrate people whose religious cultures and values are so different from Europeans? People say Islam is not the problem, but Islam is central to rejecting European culture.
There is no easy solution now, but the backlash against the new wave of migrants is easy to understand and it is foolhardy to accuse those opposed to Muslim migration as racist. Most, if not all migrants are not terrorists, they are running away from terror. However, integration has already failed, unemployment is a serious problem, particularly among youth from ethnic minorities. They might not be terrorists now, but wait until they stew in ghetto, being wooed by radical preachers and dissillusioned by their low status in society. In ten years, twenty years, how many more terrorists will come.
Again, what is the solution?
I feel really bad for migrants, they have a terrible life. But I am equally worried for the future of Europe as a ever growing Muslim population erodes the social safety network and sets off conflict between the Middle East and the west. Just wait until global warming creates a billion more migrants!
There is no easy solution now, but the backlash against the new wave of migrants is easy to understand and it is foolhardy to accuse those opposed to Muslim migration as racist. Most, if not all migrants are not terrorists, they are running away from terror. However, integration has already failed, unemployment is a serious problem, particularly among youth from ethnic minorities. They might not be terrorists now, but wait until they stew in ghetto, being wooed by radical preachers and dissillusioned by their low status in society. In ten years, twenty years, how many more terrorists will come.
Again, what is the solution?
I feel really bad for migrants, they have a terrible life. But I am equally worried for the future of Europe as a ever growing Muslim population erodes the social safety network and sets off conflict between the Middle East and the west. Just wait until global warming creates a billion more migrants!
33
@Brian
Most Americans take the "Liberal" view, because they aren't familiar with the situation in Europe 'up close and personal'. It's very easy to sit in judgement from 3,000 miles away, never having ever set foot in the 'Banlieues' of France, or the slums in Belgium, Germany or any other European country.
So when they say "those poor immigrants aren't given a chance", they don't realize some of them are actually content to stay in their closed cultural communities, where life is usually better than anything found in their home countries. Of course, there's prejudice and racism to be reckoned with, but that is not the ONLY thing preventing their assimilation.
Most Americans take the "Liberal" view, because they aren't familiar with the situation in Europe 'up close and personal'. It's very easy to sit in judgement from 3,000 miles away, never having ever set foot in the 'Banlieues' of France, or the slums in Belgium, Germany or any other European country.
So when they say "those poor immigrants aren't given a chance", they don't realize some of them are actually content to stay in their closed cultural communities, where life is usually better than anything found in their home countries. Of course, there's prejudice and racism to be reckoned with, but that is not the ONLY thing preventing their assimilation.
12
Whatever the reasons for it may be -- the goodness of his heart, the purity of his soul, the way he was brought up, his education, his skepticism about military solutions, his
community organization days in Chicago, his sympathy for downtrodden people -- President Obama is not a war president. Would he ever have utilized massive scorch-the-earth tactics like those employed by Lincoln, FDR and Truman? I believe the answer is no. Yes, the wars they fought were fought in times and under circumstances very different from the present day, but not so different as the differences in temperment and outlook between President Obama and those presidents. Our next President must be a man or woman built for war.
community organization days in Chicago, his sympathy for downtrodden people -- President Obama is not a war president. Would he ever have utilized massive scorch-the-earth tactics like those employed by Lincoln, FDR and Truman? I believe the answer is no. Yes, the wars they fought were fought in times and under circumstances very different from the present day, but not so different as the differences in temperment and outlook between President Obama and those presidents. Our next President must be a man or woman built for war.
4
Unfortunately, there is truth to what you say. But I nevertheless hope that you don't mean Donald Trump, who would probably build more wars, than just being built for one.
It's costing USA and NZ taxpayers money to send soldier to train Iraqis to upskill their fighting skills to win back territories. I don't think NZ and the USA should help them unless they sign a contract saying they are going to give us some oil as payment or lots or preferential trade deals. They use all our skills and give us nothing back. There's NZers going without stuff because we are helping the Iraqis win back territories.
4
Let us not forget that 9-11 was hatched in Germany.
5
If you are going to bring this point up, the let us also not forget that they weren't German. Pointing fingers serves no purpose, not does it solve any problems.
3
It certainly appears that whatever territorial losses ISIS has, or continues, to endure in either Iraq and Syria - it has more than compensated for, in the world of public fear, opinion, and ideological ground. The very fact of ISIS defined as a 'state' has struck a powerful chord across the industrialized world; as likely it knew it would. Despite their fluctuating terroritial battle in the Middle East, their primary fight remains one of public perception in the West.
These are murderous terrorists, with no regard for civil law or human life, who must be stopped, for the good of all people. It's up to the best media minds and journalists to start combatting them more strategically and effectively, with the word as sword.
These are murderous terrorists, with no regard for civil law or human life, who must be stopped, for the good of all people. It's up to the best media minds and journalists to start combatting them more strategically and effectively, with the word as sword.
13
What happens in Europe could soon happen in the US.
Europe began receiving Muslim immigrants when their colonies vanished after WWII. Both France and Brussels had colonies in the Maghreb which gave them European citizenship. Many came and settled in Europe
Most never integrated into the Local society but formed Ghettoes. They clung to their language, way of dress etc. Few were employed in the large society. The French Banlieus remained hotbeds of Muslim crime, car burning etc.
What changed everything was the rise of ISIS and the Schengen rule. ISIS recruiters easily camt to countries with large Muslim population and indoctrinated many young men into ISIS. This happened in the US as well. Eventually young men were persuaded to go Iraq and Syria to fight for the new Caliphate which sprang up in Raqqa.
There are large number of fighters from both the EU and US fighting for ISIS. Those young men who survived the war in the Syria and Iraq came home where they trained and created fighters to commit terrorist acts on their home soil
This graph shows the number of foreign fighters per country.
http://www.rferl.org/contentinfographics/foreign-fighters-syria-iraq-is-...
German intelligence says ISIS fighters are among the Refugees
http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/europe/item/22493-german-intell...
Europe began receiving Muslim immigrants when their colonies vanished after WWII. Both France and Brussels had colonies in the Maghreb which gave them European citizenship. Many came and settled in Europe
Most never integrated into the Local society but formed Ghettoes. They clung to their language, way of dress etc. Few were employed in the large society. The French Banlieus remained hotbeds of Muslim crime, car burning etc.
What changed everything was the rise of ISIS and the Schengen rule. ISIS recruiters easily camt to countries with large Muslim population and indoctrinated many young men into ISIS. This happened in the US as well. Eventually young men were persuaded to go Iraq and Syria to fight for the new Caliphate which sprang up in Raqqa.
There are large number of fighters from both the EU and US fighting for ISIS. Those young men who survived the war in the Syria and Iraq came home where they trained and created fighters to commit terrorist acts on their home soil
This graph shows the number of foreign fighters per country.
http://www.rferl.org/contentinfographics/foreign-fighters-syria-iraq-is-...
German intelligence says ISIS fighters are among the Refugees
http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/europe/item/22493-german-intell...
27
None of this nonsense is true, you know.
2
The sudden realization that all those 18-35 unaccompanied males that Greece let it, might not have been there with clean intentions.
Hungary tried to document them, and the world cried. Well, now you know where ISIS was moving to when thy were leaving their bases in the Middle East.
Good luck to Europe. You have been infiltrated.
Hungary tried to document them, and the world cried. Well, now you know where ISIS was moving to when thy were leaving their bases in the Middle East.
Good luck to Europe. You have been infiltrated.
54
These criminals are the children of immigrants - not recently immigrated people. They were raised in the countries that they attacked.
5
Many, indeed most, of the terrorists in the European attacks that we've seen in recent times -- from Charlie Hebdo forward -- have been native born French or Belgian men. They have not been new immigrants for the most part. I thought that this was common knowledge. Did you not know it? Or, are you just not letting the facts get in the way of your prejudices?
4
Maybe. But they all had connections to their countries of origin.
4
Thank you for a rational discussion of what's happening.
2
Xenophobia is being overused in the discussions about the recent terrorist attacks in Europe and elsewhere. Why is it xenophobic to dislike people who want to kill you? Isn't it common sense not only to dislike such persons but also to take steps to protect yourself from them?
Most people, except, perhaps, those who are hopelessly politically correct, would qualify xenophobia as being a bigoted or an irrational dislike. Where there is a rational basis for the dislike, which would certainly be the case where the dislike is because the disliked person is trying to kill you, xenophobia should be eschewed.
We should also keep in mind that ISIS instructs its followers to avoid standing out in the places where they intend to commit terrorism and to do their best to fit in with the people they want to kill. So, it is also logical to be suspicious of people who are potentially Islamic radicals, but it is not necessarily xenophobic.
Most people, except, perhaps, those who are hopelessly politically correct, would qualify xenophobia as being a bigoted or an irrational dislike. Where there is a rational basis for the dislike, which would certainly be the case where the dislike is because the disliked person is trying to kill you, xenophobia should be eschewed.
We should also keep in mind that ISIS instructs its followers to avoid standing out in the places where they intend to commit terrorism and to do their best to fit in with the people they want to kill. So, it is also logical to be suspicious of people who are potentially Islamic radicals, but it is not necessarily xenophobic.
35
It is not xenophobic to dislike people who want to kill you,
but it is xenophobic to dislike a whole race of people by
assuming they all have the same intentions.
but it is xenophobic to dislike a whole race of people by
assuming they all have the same intentions.
1
It will be a frightening spectacle should it ever come to confrontations between IS fighters, and right-wing neo-Nazis in Germany. Having family there, I dread to imagine that scenario as much as I dread reading the headlines every morning. Because it's inevitable. Sooner or later, we'll be next.
Like in the U.S. and other European cities with sizable Muslim populations, there are many disaffected 'home-grown' Islamic fundamentalist types who pine for the destruction of civilization as we know it. They need no reasoning. It makes no difference to them that IS is being run out of Iraq and Syria. All they need are "soft targets" where people gather like, airports, train stations, shopping malls, etc. -- and Europe has plenty of them.
Of course, the recent mass migrations of refugees from Muslim countries has exacerbated the problem of them ever being integrated into European society as much as the recent attacks in Brussels and Paris has. It's a zero-sum game.
War-weary Europe never wanted another war. But they've got one now.
Like in the U.S. and other European cities with sizable Muslim populations, there are many disaffected 'home-grown' Islamic fundamentalist types who pine for the destruction of civilization as we know it. They need no reasoning. It makes no difference to them that IS is being run out of Iraq and Syria. All they need are "soft targets" where people gather like, airports, train stations, shopping malls, etc. -- and Europe has plenty of them.
Of course, the recent mass migrations of refugees from Muslim countries has exacerbated the problem of them ever being integrated into European society as much as the recent attacks in Brussels and Paris has. It's a zero-sum game.
War-weary Europe never wanted another war. But they've got one now.
6
In the past, immigrants had no choice but to assimilate as fully and as quickly as possible. While the parents may not have learned the new language and culture to the near-native level, they insisted that their children did. They left the old world behind, and in some measure left the old world religion behind too. They adapted life and religion to their new home. But these days with satellite TV, the Internet, and all manner of electronic connection to the old world, they have no need to adapt and soon refuse to. They demand the new country adapt to them! Therein is the issue. Race and poverty certainly play some role, but most fault these days is with the immigrants themselves. And it is the same in Europe and here in the USA.
52
That isn't true. Western European cities are ringed with substandard housing into which the great majority of African and middle eastern immigrants are crammed, with crummy schools and zero opportunity. We don't have that situation in US cities. Part of it may be that we don't have the relatively high numbers of immigrants that European capitals do. You're in Virginia. Do you see "banlieus" around DC in which impoverished immigrants are burning cars at night? How are the Somalis doing in Minnesota? I can tell you the Pakistanis, Indians and Afghans who now seem to make up the majority of the population of Fremont California seem to doing at least as well as the Jews and Irish were doing in New York at the turn of the 20th century. We are, for all of our current atavism and politically drummed up fear of foreigners, utterly unlike (and hugely better off) than our western European friends. This fact doesn't necessarily dictate our policy responses to violent, expansionist Jihadi Islam, but we are certainly not in the same position as the Europeans are.
11
There is some truth in both your position and the one you criticise. In the UK at least immigrant communities choose to live in areas where they form a local majority, and can support shops, places of worship, cinemas and schools that suit them. This seems true for most of the different immigrant groups. Statistics show that their economic advancement proceeds with each generation, but there is a significant difference by religion. South Asians from India progress much more rapidly than those from Pakistan or Bangladesh. They are indistinguishable in terms of race, so this is not the difference. The difference is religion. It has the effect that second and subsequent generations of Muslim ex-Pakistanis do not progress as rapidly and do not integrate as much.
3
Western European cities are ringed with substandard housing into which the great majority of African and middle eastern immigrants are crammed, with crummy schools and zero opportunity. We don't have that situation in US cities.
Ever been to Detroit of Baltimore?
Ever been to Detroit of Baltimore?
2
Daniel Byman is absolutely right ! The only way to solve the problem is to finally work seriously for Muslim integration. I hope the European leaders will finally adopt an effective policy to reach that end!
11
Many Jihadists have been found to be well integrated and successful
6
I don't understand why people who go to Syria are allowed to return. If we are war with Isis, can't you make travel to its territory a crime? We must make it clear to young people that if they go to Isis, they loose their citizenship here and become the enemy.
There is a problem in Europe of an underclass of people who cannot vote. Many families who have been there for generations are not able to become citizens and vote. You cannot expect people to have a stake in society if they are excluded from the participation in the state.
There is a problem in Europe of an underclass of people who cannot vote. Many families who have been there for generations are not able to become citizens and vote. You cannot expect people to have a stake in society if they are excluded from the participation in the state.
24
And just where do you think the Islamic State is getting money to pay soldier's salaries, lodging, AK47's, food, cell phones and etc.? The father of all this is Wahhabism which was conceived by and nurtured by Saudi Arabia in the 18 century. It's no secret it has been heavily financed by the Saudis since the 60's. Its not only the Saudis, its every small oil producing sheikdom of the mid east who wants to move the radicals out of his domain or else increase his status by generous donations to terrorist causes. Like any crime "follow the money". Best way to ameliorate it : 1. sell all our fracted LPG to western Europe at basement prices, 2. mandate E-85 for all cars by 2017, 3. get back on the solar path by subsidizing utility company purchases of solar panels and devices.
46
A key reason that islamic terrorists have been unsuccessful in the US is that American Muslims report islamic terrorist activities to authorities. This is because America Muslims feel American. Fascist politicians such as Trump and Cruz, when they call for isolating Muslims and treating Islam differently from other religions, rob American Muslims of trust in American authorities, which will eventually backfire on all of us.
125
You are absolutely right! Europeans failed to integrate Muslims that live in Europe. Actually, they just exist and hang on to survive for many are unemployed, live in enclaves and hence barely interact with Europeans.
Of course this situation gave ISIS a perfect opportunity for recruiting young Muslims and their radicalization.
Of course this situation gave ISIS a perfect opportunity for recruiting young Muslims and their radicalization.
3
In your analysis who is beating back IS, you seem to leave out the Kurds, who seem to mount the bulk of hard-nosed resistance to Daesh. On the other hand, success of the Kurds will destabilize Turkey - or at least the Turkish government sees it that way at this point (and they may well be right). So Erdögan is busy putting Kurdish resistance and IS into the same 'terrorist' category that has been so graciously offered by the US and that serves to group all kinds of movements together whose underlying identity, strategies, and goals are quite different.
16
You forgot Hezbollah, Iran and Assad's troops, all fighting quite well. Even in Iraq, their troops are starting to stand and fight.
Our great allies, Turkey, Saudi Arabia and even Israel have been aiding ISIS in various ways.
Our great allies, Turkey, Saudi Arabia and even Israel have been aiding ISIS in various ways.
3
@keko
Mr. Erdogan puts the Kurds (and the free press, and anti-government demonstrators, etc.) in the same IS "terrorist" camp, because he views them all as an outright threat to his increasingly autocratic rule. Turkey's fight against the Kurds is nothing new and if anything, not dissimilar to what happened to the Armenians.
But at present, Turkey also holds the winning hand of being indispensable to both the EU, by taking back more refugees; and NATO by providing a strategic base for its operations. And this makes it "untouchable".
Mr. Erdogan puts the Kurds (and the free press, and anti-government demonstrators, etc.) in the same IS "terrorist" camp, because he views them all as an outright threat to his increasingly autocratic rule. Turkey's fight against the Kurds is nothing new and if anything, not dissimilar to what happened to the Armenians.
But at present, Turkey also holds the winning hand of being indispensable to both the EU, by taking back more refugees; and NATO by providing a strategic base for its operations. And this makes it "untouchable".
6
Not a issue from this article but a observation I wish to make.
Who is going to be helped by this act of terrorism in Brussels.
The answer is Trump.
I do not like Trump and wish he would go away.
I however understand why some like him and am scared this will give people a reason to support him.
This is not a reason that should be considered when Obama decides what he should do but it still has to be said.
Who is going to be helped by this act of terrorism in Brussels.
The answer is Trump.
I do not like Trump and wish he would go away.
I however understand why some like him and am scared this will give people a reason to support him.
This is not a reason that should be considered when Obama decides what he should do but it still has to be said.
5
You can rest assured that those who will be voting for Donald Trump don't need this terrorist act as an incentive to do so. They made up their minds a long time ago.
1
1) Why are the European people who defend their cultures and security are labeled xenofobic or extremist? There's nothing extremist about this. The only extremist thing I see is to migrate to a different continent on your own will and then hate the host culture and try to change it to be like the one you escaped.
2) The Muslims with European passports (They are not European in my view) who go to fight for ISIS should be stripped of the EU citizenship and never allowed to return.
3) There is nothing MODERATE about a Muslim who sends his or her kids to a religious school.
2) The Muslims with European passports (They are not European in my view) who go to fight for ISIS should be stripped of the EU citizenship and never allowed to return.
3) There is nothing MODERATE about a Muslim who sends his or her kids to a religious school.
89
You may have a point (or points) on 1) and 2) but not 3). Some of us can remember when the same kind of thing was suggested about Catholics (including the idea that Kennedy shouldn't be president because he'd be under the control of the Pope). And some of the "Christian" schools in this country are far less "moderate" in their politics than many Muslim schools.
9
I have noticed that if you look at the majority of muslim school (k-12) websites in the US- they usually list as their primary first goal - ahead of academic achievement etc. - as establishing a Muslim identity. Even other faiths with schools - don't put this as number one. I find this odd and a stumbling block to integration.
8
Retreat, OK, maybe - but more likely a rethinking of their strategy. True, they have lost ground and resources, but we waited way too long. In terms of strategy and then actually doing something our focus was way off and our scale of commitment was way too small. They had time to solidify their base, gather resources and recruits and had time to plan. Their ultimate goal was never to engage the West in a "tank battle in the desert", but to terrorize and destabilize Western culture. Had the West mobilized and overwhelmingly confronted the "JV" team from the start, we might be in a better position now. We didn't do enough when we should have and now we will have to do a good deal more because we have to.
5
GMHK- You simply have it wrong. If we had mobilized when ISIS first started, we would find our troops bogged in the middle of a Syrian civil war. How many times do we need to make the same mistakes before we learn the lesson? We have no business placing our troops in harms way in another countries civil war. It cost the US in lives and treasure every time we do. The fact is we do not solve these problems, but just become part of the problem. People complain that we should have kept a force in Iraq. First, this ignores that the removal of all of our forces was agreed to by the Bush Administration. Obama did not make the deal or decision. Second, it would had made little, if any, difference. ISIS would have grown from inside Syria's civil war. There is no way any outside force can "fix" the middle east. The tribes have been fighting for 1000's of years. The only people who can make a meaningful difference in this part of the world are the countries and tribes themselves. We claim Saudi Arabia as an ally, yet their government funnels money to several of the extremist groups. They do this to keep peace in Saudi Arabia which is ruled by a very small faction of one of the smallest tribes. Their interest in survival of their rule will always be more important to them than supporting our efforts for peace in the region. Pick a country and you will easily find the same or similar issues. America can not "fix" the middle east. We need to keep our troops and $ here.
8
Islamic state in retreat, or consolidating their gains?
The creation of more Muslim ghettos in the west will have consequences for generations.
This will fuel the fire of a British exit from the economic union.
The creation of more Muslim ghettos in the west will have consequences for generations.
This will fuel the fire of a British exit from the economic union.
7
Defeating ISIS in the Middle East is not a solution for the problems Europe is facing . The core problem is that like virtually all First World countries, the EU nations have inner cities populated in part by a disaffected underclass.
In Chicago, these people join gangs selling drugs or whatever and using guns to defend turf. In 2015, Chicago had about 3,000 shootings, So far this year, Chicago has seen 160 deaths from gun violence and over 3 times that many wounded. And we are not talking about great marksmen here-many of the dead and wounded are as much collateral damage as are the people in Paris or Brussels-people in the wrong place at the wrong time. And legalizing drugs is not an answer-nor is gun control. Even if dope was free, these people would still be disaffected. Without guns, they would still be violent. Why? Because the underclass knows what they lack-not just material goods, but status and respect-and see no other way to get it.
The same is true in Brussels. These kids are finding what they perceive to be a way out of a hopeless situation by joining ISIS, as much of an alternate society as the gangs in Chicago. Wipe out ISIS-does everybody honestly think that these kids will just go back to their rundown neighborhoods and cheerfully live out their lives on the dole, looked down on by all.
We need to drain the swamps here and in Europe by creating opportunity. We will have peace when everybody in our countries perceive that they have a place and a chance.
In Chicago, these people join gangs selling drugs or whatever and using guns to defend turf. In 2015, Chicago had about 3,000 shootings, So far this year, Chicago has seen 160 deaths from gun violence and over 3 times that many wounded. And we are not talking about great marksmen here-many of the dead and wounded are as much collateral damage as are the people in Paris or Brussels-people in the wrong place at the wrong time. And legalizing drugs is not an answer-nor is gun control. Even if dope was free, these people would still be disaffected. Without guns, they would still be violent. Why? Because the underclass knows what they lack-not just material goods, but status and respect-and see no other way to get it.
The same is true in Brussels. These kids are finding what they perceive to be a way out of a hopeless situation by joining ISIS, as much of an alternate society as the gangs in Chicago. Wipe out ISIS-does everybody honestly think that these kids will just go back to their rundown neighborhoods and cheerfully live out their lives on the dole, looked down on by all.
We need to drain the swamps here and in Europe by creating opportunity. We will have peace when everybody in our countries perceive that they have a place and a chance.
19
Exactly. But nobody will even begin this process while the greedy, selfish super rich reap 99% of the value of the world's production, control the political process in the US, and avoid paying taxes. There are a lot of dangerous problems in the world, but while the Wall Street banks, the Koch brothers, et al., are controlling our policy and refusing to fund the government (including but not limited to the military), nothing will change.
13
All the ranting against Wall Street and the "super rich" doesn't change a thing when you're standing face-to-face with a suicide bomber.
1
When will the religious and political leaders of Islam rise up to denounce ISIS in unison and send their own soldiers to take ISIS down? When will they take responsibility for the fanatics that have hijacked their self proclaimed religion of peace?
31
When they do, things may begin to change. This is the only way I see out of the problem. If Saudi Arabia and other respected Arab/Muslim leaders would join to denounce the violence in the name of the Muslim faith, it would do more good than all of our bombs and troops. This must happen and the world must call upon them to make the denunciations!
2
"The United States and its Western allies are hitting the Islamic State hard in its bases in Iraq and Syria. The jihadist group may finally be on the defensive."?
I'm surprised that the Times didn't also add that "there's "light at the end of the tunnel," a la Westmoreland!
"But meantime, it is lashing out, taking its fight — and its struggle for supremacy among jihadists — global. Europe has emerged as a key battleground."
Why does the Times, echoing American policy, continue to talk about this conflict as if it's some traditional warfare with clear "fronts," overall strategy and a symmetrical macro-coordinated approaches? Many, many analysts have pointed out the fundamentally different, asymmetrical approach of ISIS and others like them. How about acknowledging that--and explaining how the new reality works--instead of relying on old, dated, and now misleading terminology?
I'm surprised that the Times didn't also add that "there's "light at the end of the tunnel," a la Westmoreland!
"But meantime, it is lashing out, taking its fight — and its struggle for supremacy among jihadists — global. Europe has emerged as a key battleground."
Why does the Times, echoing American policy, continue to talk about this conflict as if it's some traditional warfare with clear "fronts," overall strategy and a symmetrical macro-coordinated approaches? Many, many analysts have pointed out the fundamentally different, asymmetrical approach of ISIS and others like them. How about acknowledging that--and explaining how the new reality works--instead of relying on old, dated, and now misleading terminology?
9
ISIS knows that Europeans and Americans are fundamentally no different from them. The only thing separating us is the political system which promotes intelligent debate on issues, and which provides restraint on the totalitarian ambitions of politicians.
ISIS uses terror to elevate the simple-minded, and authoritarian rhetoric of Donald Trump, Ted Cruz and Marine La Pen to centre stage, thereby bringing the west down to the level of third world failed states.
AI continue to hope for the best, but when politicians give legitimacy to false statements, when they divide society into "us" and "them", and when they propose naive solutions to complex problems, then we are not well served.
ISIS uses terror to elevate the simple-minded, and authoritarian rhetoric of Donald Trump, Ted Cruz and Marine La Pen to centre stage, thereby bringing the west down to the level of third world failed states.
AI continue to hope for the best, but when politicians give legitimacy to false statements, when they divide society into "us" and "them", and when they propose naive solutions to complex problems, then we are not well served.
19
What do you propose.
2
John,
It would be nice if all of us, and especially politicians, would:
1. Think before they talk, and speak out of knowledge not anger and fear.
2. Listen to opposing views.
3. Disagree respectfully without feeling the need to vilify people of opposing views.
4. Distinguish anecdotes from statistics.
5. Stop being fearful of our neighbours. We are in this together.
Do you think this is unreasonable?
It would be nice if all of us, and especially politicians, would:
1. Think before they talk, and speak out of knowledge not anger and fear.
2. Listen to opposing views.
3. Disagree respectfully without feeling the need to vilify people of opposing views.
4. Distinguish anecdotes from statistics.
5. Stop being fearful of our neighbours. We are in this together.
Do you think this is unreasonable?
2
"More moderate conservatives feel the pinch, too: David Cameron, the prime minister of Britain, has promised to crack down on Muslim religious schools"
It would be good if ALL citizens were required to get at least part - perhaps even a lion's share - of education from public schools or at least from schools which are clearly secular.
There is nothing wrong per se with religious education. But it should be administered in moderate doses.
It would be good if ALL citizens were required to get at least part - perhaps even a lion's share - of education from public schools or at least from schools which are clearly secular.
There is nothing wrong per se with religious education. But it should be administered in moderate doses.
7
Excellent comment.
I don't think Americans understand what these slums are like - imagine the Robert Taylor homes from Chicago stretching on for miles and miles. It's a fertile ground for recruitment. These young men really know nothing of their ancestral homes, and their marginalization in Europe makes them idealize a movement like ISIS.
We can make moral points and argue about how illustrating flaws in European society is victim-blaming - or we can take the practical steps needed to better integrate these young men into society to prevent these massacres.
I don't think Americans understand what these slums are like - imagine the Robert Taylor homes from Chicago stretching on for miles and miles. It's a fertile ground for recruitment. These young men really know nothing of their ancestral homes, and their marginalization in Europe makes them idealize a movement like ISIS.
We can make moral points and argue about how illustrating flaws in European society is victim-blaming - or we can take the practical steps needed to better integrate these young men into society to prevent these massacres.
16
Those young men know plenty about their ancestral homes because they are surrounded by new and recent arrivals, they have family there, and many have in visited, trained, and/or fought there. Maalenbeek is indeed fertile recruiting ground because it is so poor, but don't pretend this problem was swawned in Belgium. An ideology drove those brothers to detonate their suicide bombs, and that ideology was not born in Maalenbeek.
1
Both in Paris attack and in Brussels, the perpetrators were under crosshairs of authorities, but somehow slipped though the cracks. All bombers, in attacks in both cities had prior criminal records, and as of reports now, Brussels attackers should have been in jail serving time for prior crimes for which they were convicted. Perhaps they were released on parole, but that itself is a system failure.
EU is a mess and ill-equipped to deal with ISIS style terrorists. Imagine free movement across states like in the US, except there is no central law enforcement agency like FBI, and also where most states speak different languages. Add to that the complication that law enforcement agencies don't share information with others. Oh, the Arabic names that run into 100 letters and four or five words which can easily fool any computer system with slight variation in spelling. This is just heaven for terrorists. EU needs to tighten its laws and completely revamp its policies like Shengen treaty of free movement across borders to fight these animals.
EU is a mess and ill-equipped to deal with ISIS style terrorists. Imagine free movement across states like in the US, except there is no central law enforcement agency like FBI, and also where most states speak different languages. Add to that the complication that law enforcement agencies don't share information with others. Oh, the Arabic names that run into 100 letters and four or five words which can easily fool any computer system with slight variation in spelling. This is just heaven for terrorists. EU needs to tighten its laws and completely revamp its policies like Shengen treaty of free movement across borders to fight these animals.
6
Despite the cynacism of the author on the ability of the EU to handle this INTERNAL threat, this mayhem may be just what the doctor ordered for this shaky Union. To provide for the common defense and security is a strong motivational force for efficient and purposeful government. Whether its internal border controls, more efficient policing, domestic surveillance , uniform judicial activism, their troops on the ground in taking it to the enemies stronghold ; they need to get it together and make their union work-like now. It's crunch time .
1
This is just more gassy, fluff commentary that will do nothing whatsoever to solve the problem of radical Islam in Europe.
"Europe also faces another difficulty: Muslim integration. Across the Continent, Muslims often feel alienated from the broader population."
Why aren't other immigrant groups- Hindus, Vietnamese, Chinese, Christian Africans, Eastern Europeans, etc- feeling this same degree of alienation? Why aren't they radicalizing in scores and committing acts of terrorism?
The time to stop blaming European societies for failed Muslim integration is NOW. It is up to Muslims themselves to integrate- or to get lost. Simple as that.
"The rise of far-right, xenophobic political forces, like the National Front in France or Alternative for Germany, will do little to improve relations between European Muslims and their governments."
Sorry, but decades of patience, calm, and liberal immigration policies from Muslim-majority countries has done nothing to improve relations with European Muslims either. During Merkel's "welcome" of migrants, we have seen ISIS attacks in Europe..... INCREASE! And it has resulted in the mass sexual assault of European women!
Perhaps Muslims would feel more pressure to reform their own societies if we temporarily shut off immigration from Muslim-majority countries. Because at the moment, they have no incentive to do so.
The Front National and the AfD actually propose this as a *solution*.
Dear Daniel Byman- what is *your solution* ???
"Europe also faces another difficulty: Muslim integration. Across the Continent, Muslims often feel alienated from the broader population."
Why aren't other immigrant groups- Hindus, Vietnamese, Chinese, Christian Africans, Eastern Europeans, etc- feeling this same degree of alienation? Why aren't they radicalizing in scores and committing acts of terrorism?
The time to stop blaming European societies for failed Muslim integration is NOW. It is up to Muslims themselves to integrate- or to get lost. Simple as that.
"The rise of far-right, xenophobic political forces, like the National Front in France or Alternative for Germany, will do little to improve relations between European Muslims and their governments."
Sorry, but decades of patience, calm, and liberal immigration policies from Muslim-majority countries has done nothing to improve relations with European Muslims either. During Merkel's "welcome" of migrants, we have seen ISIS attacks in Europe..... INCREASE! And it has resulted in the mass sexual assault of European women!
Perhaps Muslims would feel more pressure to reform their own societies if we temporarily shut off immigration from Muslim-majority countries. Because at the moment, they have no incentive to do so.
The Front National and the AfD actually propose this as a *solution*.
Dear Daniel Byman- what is *your solution* ???
62
What seems to be lost on Islam is the notion that adherence to a religion is an exercise of free will: belief systems are not, in western societies (at least now), imposed on us.
We are, therefore, not required to comply with Islamic mores, be they with respect to diet, to sexuality, or to the role of women. Indeed, if they want to participate in our society, some of their mores will have to be attenuated.
We should not, for example, tolerate the treatment of women that characterizes fundamentalist Islam or other traditional societies.
If that offends them, so be it. Unless they can prove to us that their way is better (and violence, if anything, contradicts that idea), it's them, not us, that must change. Or they can stay in their desert.
We are, therefore, not required to comply with Islamic mores, be they with respect to diet, to sexuality, or to the role of women. Indeed, if they want to participate in our society, some of their mores will have to be attenuated.
We should not, for example, tolerate the treatment of women that characterizes fundamentalist Islam or other traditional societies.
If that offends them, so be it. Unless they can prove to us that their way is better (and violence, if anything, contradicts that idea), it's them, not us, that must change. Or they can stay in their desert.
8
This would seem to be a lose-lose situation when even if you win, you really lose. "Win" in Syria and/or Iraq and then lose in Europe.
Bearing in mind the counter-terrorism situation in Europe, there would not seem to be a way to win. The terrorists are embedded in European society with freedom of movement, infrastructure etc.
This might have been avoided somewhat if the military campaigns in Syria and/or Iraq had been a little more strident and the military success might have been quicker and greater, but that was not the policy of the Obama administration.
However, the situation in Europe is also independent of Iraq and Syria. The local Muslim population can produce terrorists for a variety of reasons, many of which are connected more to Europe than to the Middle East. It is hard to imagine any way in which Europe can be successful and indeed Prof. Byman does not provide such a solution. They will be there even after ISIS is gone.
Bearing in mind the counter-terrorism situation in Europe, there would not seem to be a way to win. The terrorists are embedded in European society with freedom of movement, infrastructure etc.
This might have been avoided somewhat if the military campaigns in Syria and/or Iraq had been a little more strident and the military success might have been quicker and greater, but that was not the policy of the Obama administration.
However, the situation in Europe is also independent of Iraq and Syria. The local Muslim population can produce terrorists for a variety of reasons, many of which are connected more to Europe than to the Middle East. It is hard to imagine any way in which Europe can be successful and indeed Prof. Byman does not provide such a solution. They will be there even after ISIS is gone.
3
Obama has done a pretty decent job, all EU has done is sat on themselves and laughed at US and labeled this as US-Middle east conflict....go figure now EU. this also exposes the fact although there is a union, they are so self centred and into themselves. Francoise Hollande said this war for Europe, belgium etc said nothing that time.
1
Alienation and conversion to terrorism in prison has been a common m.o. of these murderers. The anti immigration xenophobic voices of the likes of Trump will make the situation worse. Trump is now calling for legalized water boarding. One thing that can be done in the US is to increase gun controls. In Europe there needs to a major effort in integrate ethic groups. In Belgium in particular there has been an isolation of Muslins. The Belgians have the highest per capita amount of jihadists in the world. France has a similar problem of disaffected Muslim petty criminals who have gone off to Syria.
4
Yes, and Europe must share intelligence information. There is little border control since they formed the European Union but law enforcement has not followed suit. I wonder how active Interpol is in these investigations. It seems they would be an effective solution.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interpol
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interpol
1
I absolutely agree with you on the gun control part: No guns to terrorists, but keep the law-abiding citizens armed, trained and ready to respond to any terror threat in the bud.
If we do that, then terrorists will have no prayer in this country.
If we do that, then terrorists will have no prayer in this country.
2
Thank you for a right-on article, Mr. Byman. Yes, we will surely see more attacks around the world as these common criminal terrorists realize they are being defeated in their supposed quest for a "state" so take their sick ideology and set out to create as much chaos, fear, anger and hate as possible. We must not let their sick agenda work. The world will never be totally safe and WE must stay alert and vigilant but not fearful. That is how WE will defeat them.
3
The Islamic State may have declare war on Europe, but it won't be able to prevail, because our continent had fought many, many wars and battles in history and had always survived.
The "Muslim integration" is a problem not only for the Mulim migrants coming to Europe, but also for their host countries. Language is the first barrier. We speak dozens of languages. If the migrants arrive, their first step of integration must be to learn the language and the customs of their host countries. It is not always easy, depending on their literacy rates. Very often they aren't happy and want to move to another European country, where there is a bigger diaspora of expats, on whom they rely and in whom they more trust than in authorities of their host countries. They don't feel themselves at home, but returning is no option.
The "transliterating of Arabic names" does pose a problem, because of the phonetic spellings in different languages, making it hard for cross-border communications between countries in Europe.
The "Muslim integration" is a problem not only for the Mulim migrants coming to Europe, but also for their host countries. Language is the first barrier. We speak dozens of languages. If the migrants arrive, their first step of integration must be to learn the language and the customs of their host countries. It is not always easy, depending on their literacy rates. Very often they aren't happy and want to move to another European country, where there is a bigger diaspora of expats, on whom they rely and in whom they more trust than in authorities of their host countries. They don't feel themselves at home, but returning is no option.
The "transliterating of Arabic names" does pose a problem, because of the phonetic spellings in different languages, making it hard for cross-border communications between countries in Europe.
7
America being too far, Europe has become the proxy target of Isis that is being bombed by America and sees its leaders killed by American drones
The US , having destabilized the entire Mideast by invading Iraq, watches with horror.
The US , having destabilized the entire Mideast by invading Iraq, watches with horror.
38
How is fighting a force that is destabilizing the Mideast wrong and what evidence do you have that what happenned in Brussels is somehow was done because Isis's leaders are being killed by American drones.
1
In fact there is a coalition fighting Daesh which includes British and French air forces and some ground forces for training and advising the Iraqi army. What's more the seeds of a Sunni-Shia conflict were planted before our invasion of Iraq (with Britain by the way as a major ally) albeit there is no question the 2003 invasion accelerated the descent into chaos and gave rise to al-Qaida in Iraq thence Daesh. The point is Europe's involvement was inevitable no matter what.
1
Interestingly enough European nations piggy back on the fruits of this labor and no doubt have provided other means of assistance to perform said strikes.
You say France and Belgium contribute fighters. This is not correct. France and Belgium are not contributing fighters.
Those European natives who left their home countries were enticed by the propaganda of a beautiful new world offered in the so called Islamic State. They were shown a higher purpose, enticed by some illusion. These Belgian and French, second and third generation, nationals grew up in slums and were disillusioned by the country their parents and grand parents immigrated to.
The root of the problem is not a religion it is marginalization.
There are ghettos in many European cities, like the Northern outskirts of Paris, where life is a catch 22. Sure, people can break the chains of their sad lives in these places. They can try to go to the university, can try to support their families for minimum wage. There is no easy way out.
These ghettos surrounding European cities are fertile ground for recruiting kids who grew up making do via crime. Kids who see no future where they are.
Give them a purpose to live.
How do you give them a purpose to live? ISIS has found a solution. What does the rest of the world propose? Keep all the money for the 1%? Build a wall?
Those European natives who left their home countries were enticed by the propaganda of a beautiful new world offered in the so called Islamic State. They were shown a higher purpose, enticed by some illusion. These Belgian and French, second and third generation, nationals grew up in slums and were disillusioned by the country their parents and grand parents immigrated to.
The root of the problem is not a religion it is marginalization.
There are ghettos in many European cities, like the Northern outskirts of Paris, where life is a catch 22. Sure, people can break the chains of their sad lives in these places. They can try to go to the university, can try to support their families for minimum wage. There is no easy way out.
These ghettos surrounding European cities are fertile ground for recruiting kids who grew up making do via crime. Kids who see no future where they are.
Give them a purpose to live.
How do you give them a purpose to live? ISIS has found a solution. What does the rest of the world propose? Keep all the money for the 1%? Build a wall?
77
People who want to integrate take an apt. outside a ghetto.
People who don't want to integrate huddle in ghettos,never learn the language, live, dress and think like in the countries they escaped. One may ask, what for?
NOBODY PUTS MUSLIMS IN GHETTOS IN EUROPE.
They go there by choice.
People who don't want to integrate huddle in ghettos,never learn the language, live, dress and think like in the countries they escaped. One may ask, what for?
NOBODY PUTS MUSLIMS IN GHETTOS IN EUROPE.
They go there by choice.
6
I don't think marginalization is the main reason for radicalism. That's a little bit of an excuse because:
- Some jihadists come from middle or upper class families, some are White converts from the countryside etc… It's probably more an identity issue.
- American ghettos are far more segregated and yet they don't really have this issue with islamism.
- Look in France, many other communities are under privileged (Caribbean's, Central Africans, South East Asians, gypsies…) and yet they aren't tempted by radicalism like North and West Africans.
I think education is one of the reason for radicalization, especially the hatred you can find in these families against "France" and Jews, plus their victimhood mood.
- Some jihadists come from middle or upper class families, some are White converts from the countryside etc… It's probably more an identity issue.
- American ghettos are far more segregated and yet they don't really have this issue with islamism.
- Look in France, many other communities are under privileged (Caribbean's, Central Africans, South East Asians, gypsies…) and yet they aren't tempted by radicalism like North and West Africans.
I think education is one of the reason for radicalization, especially the hatred you can find in these families against "France" and Jews, plus their victimhood mood.
3
If the problem is not religion but not marginalization , then why are not marginalized christians and hindu's blowing themselves up in the name of Christ and etc? Surely there are marginalized individuals who are not Muslim?
11
"In the United States, many plots are disrupted because the American Muslim community reports them to the police and the F.B.I."
What is your source for that claim? The total number of those arrested for pro-terrorist activities or intent, using information from all sources, is far fewer than "many".
What is your source for that claim? The total number of those arrested for pro-terrorist activities or intent, using information from all sources, is far fewer than "many".
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Actually, the Times ran an interesting graphic recently showing Americans who have been identified as having some tie to ISIS. Many have indeed been apprehended before they acted, if you consider "many" to be several dozen. I would say that is definitely "many" when you consider what just one of those offenders might have been able to do.
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why is that pristine looking isis base not bombed into cinders ?
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So far America and the Western powers refuse to play into ISIS prophetic ideology and bring it's entire military apparatus to the great desert. But if these powers don't find a way to decisively undermine and neutralize ISIS, these horrific acts of terror will never end. Unfortunately, the next attack could happen on American soil, and it's hard to tell if cooler heads will still be able to prevail.
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Terrorism is not a war that can be won with military strength. It is a war of supposed "religious" ideology. Individuals who become radicalized must be ferreted out and destroyed - not entire societies.
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