All of this should be no surprise. The Republican Party has been accommodating bigots and haters since the day of Reagan and Atwater. Fox News and Talk Radio have been whipping up the anger of the ignorant for two decades. Trump is not an aberration, but a logical conclusion. Decent Americans must stop this--even if they must (gasp) reach across party lines to do so.
1
G.O.P. to America's young Trump worshippers:
"Yes, come. Our new apprentice. Your training will finally be complete."
"Yes, come. Our new apprentice. Your training will finally be complete."
4
In Canada Trump could and would be charged with hate crimes
15
Saddam Hussein used to remind reporters that he really couldn't stop his followers from putting up statues of him. It gave them so much pleasure. How could the Donald refuse the crowd's desire to do the pledge? After all they want so badly to do it.
6
It worked with Willie Horton's Ronald Reagan, why wouldn't it work for Trump. The constant "surprise" of this Republican's attitude is always a "surprise" to me.
It didn't take a Cassandra to see what was coming.
There are none so blind (Republicans) as those who will not see (Republicans).
Quote from a fictional book called "Little Donnie Dark" from the film "Butterflies Are Free" - except the word Republican, of course.
It didn't take a Cassandra to see what was coming.
There are none so blind (Republicans) as those who will not see (Republicans).
Quote from a fictional book called "Little Donnie Dark" from the film "Butterflies Are Free" - except the word Republican, of course.
3
Canada sounds more and more appealing. Nice people, real democracy, and now, with climate change, not even all that cold, and getting warmer. Besides, I'm a skiier, so there's that attaction. There's hope after all.
5
Inciting to violence by expression of emotion (in words) is almost a thought crime, if no actual crime need follow for the charge to stick.
1
On Sunday's Meet the Press, Mr Trump had a perfect opportunity to act presidential and denounce violence in his campaign. He chose instead to defend it. Clearly, he lacks the maturity and temperament to be president.
11
We are a very diverse society, and we usually attempt to get along by using a set of civic and civilized behaviors. Here in Vermont it is "live and let live", and "help your neighbors out, if they need help". Even the Republican party with its dog whistles played the game: they were, after all "Christians" and they mostly played by the rules, although often up to the very edge (cf. the Senate regarding Obama's SC nominees). So, while all of the country's fault lines remained in place, they were (mostly) papered over, most of the time.
Along comes Trump and the way the game is being played changes. The paper is being ripped off those fault lines, and the veneer of politeness is peeling. It is hard to know which metaphor to use: the snowball is rolling down the mountainside, gathering mass, or the last straw is breaking the camel's back, or the genie is out of the bottle, and so on. Incitement of violence is definitely happening, with no ambiguity save Trump's denials. And unfortunately many diverse Americans are not happily going to allow themselves to be dissed by Trump or his followers without reacting, because a line has been crossed.
All of this is playing with fire and needs to be stopped. The veneer is really thin at best. Republicans need to put country over Party, and do it now. Legal action against incitement needs to be filed, now. Ministers should be making clear statements in their sermons, now.
Along comes Trump and the way the game is being played changes. The paper is being ripped off those fault lines, and the veneer of politeness is peeling. It is hard to know which metaphor to use: the snowball is rolling down the mountainside, gathering mass, or the last straw is breaking the camel's back, or the genie is out of the bottle, and so on. Incitement of violence is definitely happening, with no ambiguity save Trump's denials. And unfortunately many diverse Americans are not happily going to allow themselves to be dissed by Trump or his followers without reacting, because a line has been crossed.
All of this is playing with fire and needs to be stopped. The veneer is really thin at best. Republicans need to put country over Party, and do it now. Legal action against incitement needs to be filed, now. Ministers should be making clear statements in their sermons, now.
6
I think Times is missing the point of democracy. There is a place for peaceful protest in a democracy. As much as I loath Trump for inciting violence and vitriol at this conferences, I think there is a path forward - make a deal with the devil.
The media, which has the power to have conversation with DT, should suggest to him that Trump lets in "peaceful protesters" at his rally (people who hold signs, but do not interrupt and disrupt). The protesters have a right to speak, but it should not infringe on the right of others to speak and be heard. I am against everything Trump stands for, but the protesters have to concede that a large number of disappointed Americans are at DT's rallies, wanting to be heard. The candidate says little of substance, but essentially echoes the words that his supporters want to say. He is giving them a voice, with a evil twist may be.
So, as long as the protesters stick to the said decorum, I think Trump should start his rallies by reminding his supporters that they are not to assault protesters. Deal with the devil. Obstructionism & polarizing partisanship has turned American democracy into war of overlords, rather than common people willing to agree how to govern themselves. Protesters could be the big brother in this fight and invent rules under which game can still run.
The media, which has the power to have conversation with DT, should suggest to him that Trump lets in "peaceful protesters" at his rally (people who hold signs, but do not interrupt and disrupt). The protesters have a right to speak, but it should not infringe on the right of others to speak and be heard. I am against everything Trump stands for, but the protesters have to concede that a large number of disappointed Americans are at DT's rallies, wanting to be heard. The candidate says little of substance, but essentially echoes the words that his supporters want to say. He is giving them a voice, with a evil twist may be.
So, as long as the protesters stick to the said decorum, I think Trump should start his rallies by reminding his supporters that they are not to assault protesters. Deal with the devil. Obstructionism & polarizing partisanship has turned American democracy into war of overlords, rather than common people willing to agree how to govern themselves. Protesters could be the big brother in this fight and invent rules under which game can still run.
3
I'm a Gen X'er. I am wondering if some of the older readers can help. It's a straightforward question.
Is this what it was like watching George Wallace?
Is this what it was like watching George Wallace?
15
Yes and no.........Wallace and Trump are birds of a feather......but, the difference, as I recall, is that no one thought Wallace was a viable candidate. He was fringe. A southern racist. No chance of winning the nomination. But now.........
2
I attended a Wallace rally in Kalamazoo, Michigan in 1972 just days before he was shot. Later photographs showed the Laurel, Maryland shooter, Arthur Bremer, was at the Kalamazoo rally too. However, even as a 22-year-old college student I did not feel endangered by the motorcycle gang members or other attendees at that rally. The audience respected others present, whether they supported Wallace or just wanted to hear him for themselves like me. What Wallace had to say did not connect with me. I cast my first presidential vote for George McGovern.
3
Yes. It is eerily similar. All that is missing is the Southern accent. The appeal to xenophobia, intolerance, racism and more is the same as well as the anti-intellectualism, the pride in ignorance.
1
“I’d like to punch him in the face, I’ll tell you.”
That quote is from a future president of this country, he keeps denying that he has bee promoting hate and violence all along this is not anything new from him, this has been going on for sometime. Just last November in Alabama, one protester was kicked and beaten by a crowd and Trump said afterward: "May be he should have been roughed up".
Enough evidence Donald Trump does condone violence but the good , compassionate thing is he would pay the legal fees and so no problem.
" In a democracy people get the leaders they deserve".
That quote is from a future president of this country, he keeps denying that he has bee promoting hate and violence all along this is not anything new from him, this has been going on for sometime. Just last November in Alabama, one protester was kicked and beaten by a crowd and Trump said afterward: "May be he should have been roughed up".
Enough evidence Donald Trump does condone violence but the good , compassionate thing is he would pay the legal fees and so no problem.
" In a democracy people get the leaders they deserve".
13
"Some day I hope to meet you. When that happens you'll need a new nose, a lot of beefsteak for black eyes, and perhaps a supporter below!"
That's from President Harry Truman's letter to a music critic who had written an unfavorable review of Magaret Truman's singing.
That's from President Harry Truman's letter to a music critic who had written an unfavorable review of Magaret Truman's singing.
10
Republicans have been very successful for over 35 years because they use a dog whistle. The rules were clear, the dog whistle always provides plausible deniability and yet the dogs hear the message clearly.
Trump threw away the dog whistle and is saying exactly what the base has wanted to hear all along: "In America, white conservatives (aka patriots) rule! The rest need to know their place or suffer the consequences."
Trump threw away the dog whistle and is saying exactly what the base has wanted to hear all along: "In America, white conservatives (aka patriots) rule! The rest need to know their place or suffer the consequences."
24
By and large, this editorial is on the mark. Mr. Trump's frequent inflammatory statements are all too often grossly inappropriate, and the very antithesis of presidential. Many moderate Republicans will not vote for the man if he becomes the party's nominee. A large fraction, probably the majority, of Republican leadership likely agrees with this sentiment.
That said, the Editorial Board should catch its collective breath, take a step back, and read its own words. All too often, with their overwrought, overdone, exaggerated, and frequently gratuitous Republican bashing, many of the ediorials that appear here sound like a left-of-center version of Mr. Trump.
Here's hoping that with the upcoming change in leadership, Mr. Bennet may bring a level of civility to these pages that has long been missing.
That said, the Editorial Board should catch its collective breath, take a step back, and read its own words. All too often, with their overwrought, overdone, exaggerated, and frequently gratuitous Republican bashing, many of the ediorials that appear here sound like a left-of-center version of Mr. Trump.
Here's hoping that with the upcoming change in leadership, Mr. Bennet may bring a level of civility to these pages that has long been missing.
6
Donald Trump's life sounds exhausting to me. He requires and needs so much attention! His days seem to be a non-ending effort to be noticed and talked about. He must be a very insecure person.
28
Has "Moveon.org" every done anything other than inflame pasions, stage violence and racism. You apparently don't see it either in the race baiting of Obama (if i had a son he would look like Travon...or his rush to criticize law enforcement), Hillary or Sharpton. Every other sentence out of Hillary's mouth panders to gender or race, two criterion that the Progressives pledged to eliminate almost 50 years ago with civil rights legislation. Now how about Bernie. His TV commercial down here in Florida begins with "During the past years all of the income gains has gone to the top 1%". Well, that number, GDP, is an aggregate of individual incomes, not the fruit of some collective effort that is pilfered by the "rich". The fact is all of the income gains have "come from" the top 1%, which is a different story altogether and not nearly as useful to creating hatred and envy between Americans. He is unequivocal in hsi support for a woman's right to her own body (her "property" is the most fundamental sense), but he has no regard for anyone else's property, their bodies or the fruit of their labor.
The attorney general recently testified concerning the investigation into pursuing "climate deniers" (they have a label now for dissidents so they can ignore their arguments and stereotype them all...ever seen that in our history) under RICO. Why doesn't the justice department investigate Moveon and Soros for their systematic interference with civil rights?
The attorney general recently testified concerning the investigation into pursuing "climate deniers" (they have a label now for dissidents so they can ignore their arguments and stereotype them all...ever seen that in our history) under RICO. Why doesn't the justice department investigate Moveon and Soros for their systematic interference with civil rights?
12
The top 1% has certainly not done all of the work that leads to their profits. That is the issue. They can earn their money and gather their wealth, but it is done on the backs of the rest of us, who are benefitting far too little from their labor.
MoveOn is a member-led organization who, by my lights, have not abridged anyone's civil rights. They do advocate for certain beliefs, and are funded by others who agree. They ask their members to vote on whether to support (or oppose) certain positions and candidates. How is that abridging anyone's rights?
MoveOn is a member-led organization who, by my lights, have not abridged anyone's civil rights. They do advocate for certain beliefs, and are funded by others who agree. They ask their members to vote on whether to support (or oppose) certain positions and candidates. How is that abridging anyone's rights?
10
How long will it be before we see the American equivalent of Kristalnacht, and brown-shirted hooligans marching through the streets of American cities?
I would be willing to bet three months. Any takers?
I would be willing to bet three months. Any takers?
24
There's one thing about Trump and his stupid rants and speeches, he's gaining ground. By late evening we shall know won't we? If Florida and Ohio go to Trump he's on his way to the nomination for POTUS.
The good thing is is that the Koch Brothers and others of their ilk will be sweating and shivering in fear. They will have lost control. What then? A rogue nation out of control? What exactly will happen? Who knows? Nobody. We can all bet it will be negative, but we don't know the degree.
Canada is a stone's throw from where i live. I find myself eyeing it more and more.
The good thing is is that the Koch Brothers and others of their ilk will be sweating and shivering in fear. They will have lost control. What then? A rogue nation out of control? What exactly will happen? Who knows? Nobody. We can all bet it will be negative, but we don't know the degree.
Canada is a stone's throw from where i live. I find myself eyeing it more and more.
15
Those citing the guarantee of free speech do not understand that freedom of expression does not include extending that to assaulting someone whose views you don't like. Of course Trump's supporters have the right to assemble and support him. Those who disagree with him also have the right express their views. However in the public market of ideas there are ideas that the majority in a democratic society find abhorrent including racism, sexism, xenophobia, and anti-Semitism. Trump has fanned these flames and taken no responsibility for the chaos that engendered. He has revelled in dancing not just close to but over the line of demagoguery inciting people irresponsibly, remembering the old days when people would be carried out on stretchers. Trump has appealed to the very worst in people, an alchemist who has transformed patriotism into intolerance and has yet to categorically reject the KKK and David Duke. I saw video of someone at his rally in Cleveland the other day shouting "Go back to Auchwitz" presumably at Sanders supporters. No one should want that kind of support. Will he address this anti-Semitism with a wink if Bernie Sanders is the Democratic nominee? Donald Trump has a lot to answer for. The people he appeals to so as well despite what the Times has noted as their demographics. You do not have to be a university graduate to be a decent human being.
23
I suspect it's just a matter of time before armed groups of Donald's supporters / open carry proponents begin mixing their interests and show up at Bernie's rally to intimidate others. And at some point they'll start using those weapons.
Just as we've seen his supporters heed the call to punch dissenters in the face, all it will take is a few select words from him and some armed nutball will crack.
This is going to get worse before it gets better.
To those who are placing the blame on the protestors and not Donald, I agree that the protesters are asking for trouble. But the reason that this is news is because the candidate is calling for this violence. The man behind the podium should be held to a higher standard than the ordinary angry voter.
Just as we've seen his supporters heed the call to punch dissenters in the face, all it will take is a few select words from him and some armed nutball will crack.
This is going to get worse before it gets better.
To those who are placing the blame on the protestors and not Donald, I agree that the protesters are asking for trouble. But the reason that this is news is because the candidate is calling for this violence. The man behind the podium should be held to a higher standard than the ordinary angry voter.
20
There is no question that many people have been badly buffeted by forces beyond their control. But Trump offers not one credible solution to the problems facing us. Even worse, he is harnessing people's wishes to be rescued by some powerful person who can fix their problems and raise them above their personal disappointments, failures, and flaws. No politician can, or should, do this. The way to empowerment is not through some infantile wish to be taken care of.
If Trump were really a truth-teller he would say that, yes, things are hard, but we can't return to the past. We can move forward, and things can get better. It will take courage and vision. And it will take personal responsibility too.
If Trump were really a truth-teller he would say that, yes, things are hard, but we can't return to the past. We can move forward, and things can get better. It will take courage and vision. And it will take personal responsibility too.
21
Given that, according to Politifact, 77% of what Trump tells supporters at his rallies is "false, mostly false, or pants on fire false" , calling them "low information voters" is giving them too much credit! They would be better informed if they stayed home, locked in a room with no TV. If you placed a rock and a Trump supporter side by side, at rally's end, the rock, being a "No information" supporter, would know more than the Trump supporter, who was a minus, or "BELOW information voter."
23
He's either waiting to be bribed to end his campaign or, if he does win it all, quit once he doesn't get his way a few times.
Quit pro quo. C'mon Koch bros. and Sheldon, pony up the $$!
Quit pro quo. C'mon Koch bros. and Sheldon, pony up the $$!
3
Trump reminds me of Benito Mussolini, who was an grimacing ape-like man, the fascist dictator of Italy, who made the trains run on time but never lost an opportunity to swagger, brag, and lie and incite his brown-shirted minions to violence at mass rallies. He ultimately turned out to be a cowardly failure - another pint-sized man with a ten gallon head.
Mr. Trump, your future is in the past.
Mr. Trump, your future is in the past.
19
Trump is not a con man. His audience is looking for a leader. The problem is that American politics have reached the stage where confrontation is inevitable. Bigoted angry xenophobes v. anti Wall Street/Free Trade steal the country blind finance capital. Neither support their party's establishments.
5
One person attempts to get onstage and we now have "agetatorS". How typical of a Trump supporter to greatly enhance the usurpation of Trump's First Amendment rights when the country has been denied their right to an honest answer from Drumpf on any subject of importance that doesn't involve walls, Muslims, refugees or any other topic that might be fearful to those paranoid racist, violent bigots.
He's a tough guy up on stage, taking about wanting to punch someone, or get them out of here. But when one gets on stage he can be seen cowering bewteen to burly Secret Service agents, with his hand holding on to one shoulder. Good thing there wasn't a full-length mirror handy then.
He's a tough guy up on stage, taking about wanting to punch someone, or get them out of here. But when one gets on stage he can be seen cowering bewteen to burly Secret Service agents, with his hand holding on to one shoulder. Good thing there wasn't a full-length mirror handy then.
10
@NSTAN3500:
It takes only person to hurt or kill a candidate while he is giving his speech.
Why do you take the side of the attacker? Why do you look for any little movement in Trump to claim he is a coward? Every candidate, including Obama years ago, would have been scared seeing a large, strong body suddently lunging at him.
Is this what liberals condone: physical violence against people you disagree with? I read many articles how bad Trump is. I read none how bad the attacker is. Can you now understand why Trump supporters are so much against the liberal press?
It takes only person to hurt or kill a candidate while he is giving his speech.
Why do you take the side of the attacker? Why do you look for any little movement in Trump to claim he is a coward? Every candidate, including Obama years ago, would have been scared seeing a large, strong body suddently lunging at him.
Is this what liberals condone: physical violence against people you disagree with? I read many articles how bad Trump is. I read none how bad the attacker is. Can you now understand why Trump supporters are so much against the liberal press?
15
Thanks to Mr. Trump and the Editorial Board for pulling back the thin veil from the Republican Party. Trump has actually done us a big favor.
No wonder the rest of the party is in a panic to see that the face unveiled is that of the grim reaper instead of compassionate conservatism and family values.
The Ed. Boards warning that Trump's call to violence at his rallies is sick couldn't be more timely, but i submit to you that "the sickest part of the con" are not his recent calls to violence at his mob rallies, but the cons he has already promised on denial of basic health care, irresponsible use of military force, gargantuan transfer of wealth from workers to the 1% and unbridled bigotry aimed at all with whom he might disagree.
What terrifies me is that Bush brought us the identical con before and though Bush lost the majority vote in 2000, there were still enough forces in America to crown him prince for 8 years.
The Times can't write enough about the Trump cons.
No wonder the rest of the party is in a panic to see that the face unveiled is that of the grim reaper instead of compassionate conservatism and family values.
The Ed. Boards warning that Trump's call to violence at his rallies is sick couldn't be more timely, but i submit to you that "the sickest part of the con" are not his recent calls to violence at his mob rallies, but the cons he has already promised on denial of basic health care, irresponsible use of military force, gargantuan transfer of wealth from workers to the 1% and unbridled bigotry aimed at all with whom he might disagree.
What terrifies me is that Bush brought us the identical con before and though Bush lost the majority vote in 2000, there were still enough forces in America to crown him prince for 8 years.
The Times can't write enough about the Trump cons.
26
The behavior of Donald Trump and his supporters is absolutely reprehensible and intolerable. It may very well lead to the destruction of our country. However, the protesters need to reflect on the effects of their own behavior. They are playing into Trump's hands. They are strengthening them. They are strengthening the hatred of Trump's supporters. When I have broached this with Sanders supporters, the replies refer to the need for a revolution. This is not in the best interests of the nation and the causes and people they support. Yes, they have a legal right to peaceful protest. But their effect is worsening the situation. As I used to tell my children when young, "Do you want to want to express your feelings or do you want to be effective?" If you really care about the rights of the oppressed, use tactics that will improve matters, not instigate more brutal oppression.
9
Your words in conclusion are not without wisdom, but those who have shown up and raised their voices at the love Trump events have revealed important things about Trump and those who support him. The supporters have shown themselves to be violent prone thugs. That's important. Trump has shown himself to be jerk by encouraging them.
A couple of weeks ago a young woman opened a banner not far from where Hilliary Clinton was standing. They appeared to be less than ten ft. apart. It was a real opportunity for Mrs. Clinton to demonstrate inclusion in her campaign. She could have turned the microphone over to the protester for a couple of minutes. Instead, she muddled something non-responsive to the woman's point and then the woman was escorted out. What a waste of a moment.
Disruption is not a great thing, but it is within the tradition of American politics. Further, if the "little people" don't speak up at public events, where will they speak?
A couple of weeks ago a young woman opened a banner not far from where Hilliary Clinton was standing. They appeared to be less than ten ft. apart. It was a real opportunity for Mrs. Clinton to demonstrate inclusion in her campaign. She could have turned the microphone over to the protester for a couple of minutes. Instead, she muddled something non-responsive to the woman's point and then the woman was escorted out. What a waste of a moment.
Disruption is not a great thing, but it is within the tradition of American politics. Further, if the "little people" don't speak up at public events, where will they speak?
7
People:
This is not a tactical thing. The right of even the most ignorant reprehensible speech is critical to a free society. If that right is not universally perceived as absolute-ending only at the cry of "fire" in a crowded theater or the equivalent-then anybody can be shut up. People opposed to Trumps ideas should be the first to make sure he is heard-it is not like he is saying anything all that convincing. Embrace, do not fear free speech.
This is not a tactical thing. The right of even the most ignorant reprehensible speech is critical to a free society. If that right is not universally perceived as absolute-ending only at the cry of "fire" in a crowded theater or the equivalent-then anybody can be shut up. People opposed to Trumps ideas should be the first to make sure he is heard-it is not like he is saying anything all that convincing. Embrace, do not fear free speech.
5
As near as I can tell, people stand in line for hours for Trump's "Show."
It consists of him bragging about something, polls, body parts, something he sells. When protesters start up, the show really begins. Trump yells, threatens, lies about who the protesters are, talks about the old days, stretchers etc. Then he blathers about the country being great again and talks about how much love there is (for him) and that's it.
He feels no need to talk policy, plans, things you might expect from a candidate. The show, him being a tough guy, talking torture, killing families of terrorists, and most of all promoting violence. His crowd expects it, and he delivers. They cheer lustily and Trump feels loved.
This guy being President, the most powerful man on Earth? That is something that cannot happen.
It consists of him bragging about something, polls, body parts, something he sells. When protesters start up, the show really begins. Trump yells, threatens, lies about who the protesters are, talks about the old days, stretchers etc. Then he blathers about the country being great again and talks about how much love there is (for him) and that's it.
He feels no need to talk policy, plans, things you might expect from a candidate. The show, him being a tough guy, talking torture, killing families of terrorists, and most of all promoting violence. His crowd expects it, and he delivers. They cheer lustily and Trump feels loved.
This guy being President, the most powerful man on Earth? That is something that cannot happen.
31
A free society distinguishes between speech and deeds. Trying to make your views heard outside the rally of a political opponent is an exercise of free speech. Trying to DISRUPT the rally of a political opponent is NOT and exercise of free speech, but an attempt to deny your opponent a speaking platform. Arguing that your opponent is inciting thinking citizens to violence does not dignify such undemocratic behavior.
Unfortunately, since the 1980s "liberals" have made it seem respectable to keep people they disapprove of from speaking, and today we have reached the point where college's and student groups are forced to cancel speakers because someone in the community doesn't like them. And when speakers cannot be cancelled, offended groups sometimes go further, trying to disrupt their talks. That is censorious.
There is something pre- or anti-political in the anti-Trump protestors' attempts to provoke people at Trump rallies. Rather than engage their opponents in real dialogue based on sound arguments, their goal seems to be to show that they are victims of Trump's "fascist" supporters.
Unfortunately, since the 1980s "liberals" have made it seem respectable to keep people they disapprove of from speaking, and today we have reached the point where college's and student groups are forced to cancel speakers because someone in the community doesn't like them. And when speakers cannot be cancelled, offended groups sometimes go further, trying to disrupt their talks. That is censorious.
There is something pre- or anti-political in the anti-Trump protestors' attempts to provoke people at Trump rallies. Rather than engage their opponents in real dialogue based on sound arguments, their goal seems to be to show that they are victims of Trump's "fascist" supporters.
14
One may only agree that suppressing free speech is wrong, no matter who does it.
Of course there is the minor technical point would be that the lefts and the libs (they're different, you know) pretty much just scream, yell and holler--and your guys pretty much launch witch hunts, throw punches and threaten.
And that's before we get to the other minor technical detail: nearly all the political violence in this country has been carried out by the Right.
So, you know, let everybody speak, I say. Let's just not lie to ourselves about where the problem is.
Of course there is the minor technical point would be that the lefts and the libs (they're different, you know) pretty much just scream, yell and holler--and your guys pretty much launch witch hunts, throw punches and threaten.
And that's before we get to the other minor technical detail: nearly all the political violence in this country has been carried out by the Right.
So, you know, let everybody speak, I say. Let's just not lie to ourselves about where the problem is.
8
I'd like to ask the 78 year-old guy who punched a restrained black protestor what he's "upset" or angry about. And, why he thinks "Making American Great Again" would improve his life. Whatever hand he was dealt that leaves him angry was done so when ironically, America was "great". And after seeing the scuffles in Chicago, featuring young white guys screaming at young black guys, I'd like to ask them the same questions. These guys have no reason to be angry or nostalgic for America's glory days. Let's not kid ourselves and make excuses for Trump supporters. A wide swath of Trump rally participants must enjoy the racial animus, being part of a mob that is glorified by a man who mocks the diversified and racially balanced society that America has become.
36
I was in high school when the Cuban Missle Crisis, Khruschev pounding his shoe at the UN, Kent State, the assassinations and always Vietnam, Vietnam, Vietnam took place. I was terrified then and wondered what kind of world would my classmates and I have to live in.
Never thought I'd see what's happening now and I feel the same creeping fear for my granddaughters as I felt for myself then.
When I read yesterday Russia was leaving Syria - a mission accomplished moment, driven by falling oil prices perhaps - I thought how lucky our country is to have Pres Obama who would not go full bore into Syria for if he had, we would be stuck there.
So basically we learned nothing from the miseries of the twentieth century and are now at risk of losing it all.
Never thought I'd see what's happening now and I feel the same creeping fear for my granddaughters as I felt for myself then.
When I read yesterday Russia was leaving Syria - a mission accomplished moment, driven by falling oil prices perhaps - I thought how lucky our country is to have Pres Obama who would not go full bore into Syria for if he had, we would be stuck there.
So basically we learned nothing from the miseries of the twentieth century and are now at risk of losing it all.
31
You mean after years, if not decades, of having the far left and its media allies demanding the american taxpayer support illegal aliens shoving them down our throats, while responding with juvenile "you're a racist!" responses did not initiate this hostility? That the far left and its media allies refusal to accept any possible differentiating opinions on this matter for so long did not contribute to an environment of such anger?
The persistent dismissiveness of the far left to the legitimate complaints and concerns amongst a large swath of america, many of whom have lost their livlihoods to china, H1Bs, and illegal aliens - while having thousands of illegals being foisted upon them by obama and clinton - 1 million illegals given citizenship overnight so as to vote for him in 1996! - is unconscionable, and this despicable "publication" is just as responsible.
Horrific agitprop like this serving to dismiss the responsbility for fomenting this anger, alongside its media partners condoning of intimidation and violence as witnessed by questionable, marginable groups like black lives matter, have driven a countering anger in the general public that was inevitable, and obvious to anyone with their eyes open not sitting in a ivory tower.
It is a bygone conclusion that the most delusional NYT reader drones will not accept their beloved "pubication's" fundamental responsbility for this situation, but the rest of us know better.
The persistent dismissiveness of the far left to the legitimate complaints and concerns amongst a large swath of america, many of whom have lost their livlihoods to china, H1Bs, and illegal aliens - while having thousands of illegals being foisted upon them by obama and clinton - 1 million illegals given citizenship overnight so as to vote for him in 1996! - is unconscionable, and this despicable "publication" is just as responsible.
Horrific agitprop like this serving to dismiss the responsbility for fomenting this anger, alongside its media partners condoning of intimidation and violence as witnessed by questionable, marginable groups like black lives matter, have driven a countering anger in the general public that was inevitable, and obvious to anyone with their eyes open not sitting in a ivory tower.
It is a bygone conclusion that the most delusional NYT reader drones will not accept their beloved "pubication's" fundamental responsbility for this situation, but the rest of us know better.
16
reply to bob rivers: Do you really believe all that you just wrote? There is so much name calling in your commentary; do you also believe it? You speak of illegals, and foreign workers coming here on H1B Visas; who do you suppose brings them here except American Corporations; who exports our jobs to the lowest International Bidder- American Corporations; who closes factories; American Corporations- and you are angry at The Left?
18
I find it interesting that the excuse "it's just politics" is thrown at me if I voice alarm over Donald Trump and the hatred he is intentionally cultivating as a ride to more power, for himself, not the country. He is undoubtedly has a narcissistic personality disorder that is teetering on derangement. The Republicans created this monster and they're scared. Yet, the left has a hand in this too. Too often they created a culture of intolerance for any idea or feeling that doesn't fit into their own crazy definitions of civility and progress. Progress isn't silencing any opinion you disagree with., Progress isn't branding every opposing opinion as "hatred" or racist. Every male as "predatory". Vernacular like Trigger Points hasn't helped matters as it's a coded language easily understood for anti-white male. Believe it or not, there are many disenfranchised white males who are sick of being "the enemy" and they have a point. Both parties helped this craziness along. The right isn't nearly as intolerant as the left. The death of intellect and debate was born on college campuses not in a church where one wouldn't expect a lean toward open minds and alternate opinions. Occupy Wall Street started as a high minded protest against corruption, and quickly turned into a roving gang of whack jobs. Black Lives Matter is on the same path. Quit the blame game, we each had a hand in this.
6
It is fair to blame the Republicans for their habit of appealing to ignorance, but it is also fair to blame the Democrats for their hypocrisy. People are tired of being conned from every side, so some of them will go for a political outsider who pretends to offer simple solutions.
4
While every columnist, pundit and commenter conjures up new and inventive ways to stick it to Donald Trump, Bernie Sanders has been enjoying a free ride. Has anyone else noticed a very distinct change in Sanders lately? Sanders hasn't been railing against Wall Street the way he once did. Isn't he also using hateful rhetoric as he tries to incite a political revolution at his campaign events? Sanders has become the unofficial fifth Republican candidate as he now shrieks on and on against Hillary Clinton. Yet, Bernie Sanders is benefitting from his attacks as his supporters do everything they can to derail Hillary Clinton and incite riots at Trump events. What goes around comes around.
At the end of the day it doesn't matter who wins. We deserve whatever we get this November.
At the end of the day it doesn't matter who wins. We deserve whatever we get this November.
14
There is absolutely no evidence that Bernie Saunders is inciting anything at all at Trump events. Where's your evidence, other than hysterical rants by Trump and Palin? Hateful rhetoric? Example, please.
Do facts matter to you people at all ever? Do you know the difference between facts and opinions? We don't deserve Trump; not now, not ever.
Do facts matter to you people at all ever? Do you know the difference between facts and opinions? We don't deserve Trump; not now, not ever.
1
Trump is riding the wave of fear and anger he stirred up all the way to the nomination. Like any good demagogue, he is gaining popularity by stoking the negative impulses of a healthy portion of the American populace. Riding the crest of this wave has got him this far - don't expect him to stop his verbal taunts and bullying any time soon, regardless of consequences.
3
I've had one president during my lifetime, and I measure all others by him: JFK. JFK would have the GOP's slate of candidates, using that term loosely, picking up trash on the highways. Trump is giving a safe harbor for all the Lee Harvey Oswalds running around this nation ... but they have better armament than Oswald's $21.45 (incl. postage) piece of junk Carcano rifle. Trump knows exactly what he's doing in stirring up his "followers." All it takes is one nut with a gun ... and we're up to our necks in those ... to set a new departure for American history. I fear a tragic denouement.
7
Approximately 24% of Americans watch "professional" wrestling. Mr. Trump currently enjoys approximately 24% approval by the American public judging by the primary results thus far. He has won Republican parties by less than 50% of the votes because the other 50%+ is split. Therefore, in a rough calculation, he has 24% of Republicans and 0% of Democrats thus far.
The point is that Mr. Trump knows his audience. He wrestled in a televised battle of the billionaires for WWE. What is scary is that everyone knows "professional" wrestling is not real. The violence at Trump rallies is real. Despite Mr. Trump's absurd denials, people are getting hurt. And every day the majority of Americans and the rest of the world watch in horror.
I admire the sheriff in North Carolina who is considering bringing charges of inciting rioting against Mr. Trump. If Mr. Trump is arrested, it would probably be the first time in American history that a presidential candidate is arrested while campaigning. Mr. Trump also provided the world with the first time a presidential candidate discussed his male parts during a televised debate.
The point is that Mr. Trump knows his audience. He wrestled in a televised battle of the billionaires for WWE. What is scary is that everyone knows "professional" wrestling is not real. The violence at Trump rallies is real. Despite Mr. Trump's absurd denials, people are getting hurt. And every day the majority of Americans and the rest of the world watch in horror.
I admire the sheriff in North Carolina who is considering bringing charges of inciting rioting against Mr. Trump. If Mr. Trump is arrested, it would probably be the first time in American history that a presidential candidate is arrested while campaigning. Mr. Trump also provided the world with the first time a presidential candidate discussed his male parts during a televised debate.
5
Trump boils down to this--Make America Great Again--by punching protesters in the face.
Kristallnacht is around the corner. Gas chambers too. And Inquisitions--excuses to seize property and art for his hotels unless people believe in Trump.
Kristallnacht is around the corner. Gas chambers too. And Inquisitions--excuses to seize property and art for his hotels unless people believe in Trump.
12
License to violence? What about the slaughter on Chicago's streets last weekend unrelated to the Trump event? How many people were murdered, shot, stabbed, raped, beaten and robbed while America's corporate news/entertainment industry gave us hyped coverage of "violence" at the Trump event?
Trump's power resides in the belief, the correct belief, that no one in power has this nation's interest at heart and our corporate media lies to them and talks down to them every day and fails to objectively cover and analyze events. This nation and the world are in a mess, an increasingly dangerous mess. The people consciously or unconsciously know that. What do we get from the establishment news entertainment industry? Trump, Trump, Trump evil, Republicans evil, sports, entertainment sports, Trump, Trump evil...No recognition by our establishment and media that business as usual just won't do and almost no one is buying it except the dumbest and most dependent.
Our inbred, corrupt establishment and our corrupt incompetent and lazy media will make Trump not president but king if they do not wake up. The little pink bubble has burst and the people are awake in the same sense as the mobs of the French Revolution. It is 1859 again in America. This nation is a time bomb and our establishment and corporate media are pushing Hillary and the clod Kasich. All that is missing is Nero, Obama or Romney playing violins.
"Let them eat cake..."
Trump's power resides in the belief, the correct belief, that no one in power has this nation's interest at heart and our corporate media lies to them and talks down to them every day and fails to objectively cover and analyze events. This nation and the world are in a mess, an increasingly dangerous mess. The people consciously or unconsciously know that. What do we get from the establishment news entertainment industry? Trump, Trump, Trump evil, Republicans evil, sports, entertainment sports, Trump, Trump evil...No recognition by our establishment and media that business as usual just won't do and almost no one is buying it except the dumbest and most dependent.
Our inbred, corrupt establishment and our corrupt incompetent and lazy media will make Trump not president but king if they do not wake up. The little pink bubble has burst and the people are awake in the same sense as the mobs of the French Revolution. It is 1859 again in America. This nation is a time bomb and our establishment and corporate media are pushing Hillary and the clod Kasich. All that is missing is Nero, Obama or Romney playing violins.
"Let them eat cake..."
15
exactly.
The prowls on both sides have been whipped up by their masters blowing their respective dog whistles and the proles go at each others' throats.
Which is exactly what both side's oligarchs want: distract the mobs so that they don't actually unify against them
The prowls on both sides have been whipped up by their masters blowing their respective dog whistles and the proles go at each others' throats.
Which is exactly what both side's oligarchs want: distract the mobs so that they don't actually unify against them
4
The zealots in both political parties have been peddling intolerance against their opposition for many decades. It has degraded our public discourse down to a naked power struggle as political leaders are only too happy to ramrod changes over the dead bodies of their opponents and the SCOTUS battles are a very visible example. It's all one big funny game of backstabbing and subterfuge until we reach the point we are at now where 10's of millions of people who feel disenfranchised are striking out.
The country needs to be brought together and the political parties and their zealots are incapable of doing so because they are built for divisiveness, intolerance and looting the people while they are distracted by the bad guys in the other party. Trump is not the problem rather he is the manifestation of the problem.
The country needs to be brought together and the political parties and their zealots are incapable of doing so because they are built for divisiveness, intolerance and looting the people while they are distracted by the bad guys in the other party. Trump is not the problem rather he is the manifestation of the problem.
12
Trump demonstrates on a daily basis a particular sort of mental illness, which is what explains his tendency to lie in the face of video taped truth. His poisonous rhetoric resonates with those who, in the good old days, would have been wearing either white sheets or brown shirts. Alas, it is not politically correct to wear such items, so lets disguise the fascist message as a "love fest" and the messengers as "passionate" people who only want to "make America great again."
Considering the fact that most of Trump's followers have less than a high school education, it's no wonder that they don't care that he has not offered one solid policy proposal to address any of our issues. What they care about is "winning" just like in the old days, when they could lynch those who were different or who disagreed with them. These folks are not interested in a democratic process, or even democracy. They are interested in violence, in guns, in killing, in Christianity (!), and in keeping women in the kitchen where they belong.
This is what they want, this is what the GOP wants (sub-rosa) and if you don't like it, they'll send you to a concentration camp.
Considering the fact that most of Trump's followers have less than a high school education, it's no wonder that they don't care that he has not offered one solid policy proposal to address any of our issues. What they care about is "winning" just like in the old days, when they could lynch those who were different or who disagreed with them. These folks are not interested in a democratic process, or even democracy. They are interested in violence, in guns, in killing, in Christianity (!), and in keeping women in the kitchen where they belong.
This is what they want, this is what the GOP wants (sub-rosa) and if you don't like it, they'll send you to a concentration camp.
7
Many people have already observed the disturbing parallels between the rise of Donald Trump and the rise of Hitler. Clearly the comparison is approximate, and even Trump's demagoguery doesn't approach the intensity of Hitler's. What's really disturbing though, is that the comparison has become more fitting over time, and is becoming moreso with every day of Trump's progress towards presidential power.
In particular, the violent Trump supporters "defending" his speeches at his rallies alarmingly echo Hitler's Sturmabteilung, or Brown Shirts. The incidents cited in this editorial illustrate how he rouses the violent rabble. More alarming are the threats that Trump has made to Bernie Sanders, to begin orchestrating his troublemakers specifically to disrupt Sanders' rallies. It was the Brown Shirts that used paramilitary tactics to intimidate Hitler's real and imagined foes, before and after he became the German Chancellor.
Starting around 2008, Republicans injected a powerful wave of negative energy into American politics. Trump is the Hitler-like result, the leader of the dark forces of the new Republican Party.
Even if he loses in November, the negativity will not end. We can expect further political assaults on our statehouses and Congress, our laws and our lives. The situation is now URGENT: all non-Republicans have got to get out in force, to vote against anyone who identifies as Republican.
In particular, the violent Trump supporters "defending" his speeches at his rallies alarmingly echo Hitler's Sturmabteilung, or Brown Shirts. The incidents cited in this editorial illustrate how he rouses the violent rabble. More alarming are the threats that Trump has made to Bernie Sanders, to begin orchestrating his troublemakers specifically to disrupt Sanders' rallies. It was the Brown Shirts that used paramilitary tactics to intimidate Hitler's real and imagined foes, before and after he became the German Chancellor.
Starting around 2008, Republicans injected a powerful wave of negative energy into American politics. Trump is the Hitler-like result, the leader of the dark forces of the new Republican Party.
Even if he loses in November, the negativity will not end. We can expect further political assaults on our statehouses and Congress, our laws and our lives. The situation is now URGENT: all non-Republicans have got to get out in force, to vote against anyone who identifies as Republican.
11
Donald Trump is the most bizarre man ever to run for President of the USA . He is the equivalent of Libya`s Gaddafi or Kim Jung-un from North Korea . He is the 21st Century Emperor Caligula .
12
Enjoy your welfare while it lasts. As of January 2017, we're cutting your gravy train off.
11
“Oh Lion in a peculiar guise,
Sharp Roman road to Paradise,
Come eat me up, I'll pay thy toll
With all my flesh, and keep my soul.”
-Stevie Smith
I support free speech, but protestors and followers alike should realize what they're forsaking in their rants, rages, and punches thrown. Even in the climate of anti-establishment, going to these lengths is really only pandering to the whims of the crowd.
Sharp Roman road to Paradise,
Come eat me up, I'll pay thy toll
With all my flesh, and keep my soul.”
-Stevie Smith
I support free speech, but protestors and followers alike should realize what they're forsaking in their rants, rages, and punches thrown. Even in the climate of anti-establishment, going to these lengths is really only pandering to the whims of the crowd.
4
The Trump Campaign Gives License to Violence Uh, no. But there sure are plenty of agitators storming the stage and starting fights. Get your perps right.
21
Protestors have always been a part of the American political process. Rather than respecting the rights of others to express their opinions, Trump can't handle the least bit of dissent. This man is not fit to hold any public office, let alone be President of the US. Apparently some constitutional rights (2nd Amendment?) are more important than others (freedom of speech?!).
2
The point of the editorial is that Trump encourages a violent response to protesters. Assuming some of the protesters were vocally disrupting the rallies, they should have been ejected by trained security and not punished by those attending the rally. No one has the right to beat up protesters at a political rally. That Trump egged on the attackers is disgusting. Many pin the Nazi label on those they disagree with politically. But by urging or at least excusing violence, the label fits this self-proclaimed great man.
2
Uh, actually, guys getting up on the stage to attack the speaker has not ever been considered a"good" thing. At least I the US ("we have nothing to fear but the guy behind me with a crowbar").
3
His whole "trumped up" candidacy has always been about him and only him. I can say this since I am quite familiar this narcissistic personality, having been raised by one. Thankfully, I was able to maintain a rational perspective and not be taken in my this duplicity as so many have been right now. I mourn for this country if he should be elected President. It would be extremely damaging if he could not be kept in check.
4
Donald Trump is a nativist buffoon. We all know that. And it would be easy to label his campaign a national embarrassment. But that would require a very narrow reading of the phenomena that is Trump. If Trump ended his campaign tomorrow, the millions of Americans who share his intolerant and hate-filled view of the world would only look for a suitable alternative. They wouldn't disappear. They wouldn't cease to revel in the hate. They would live among us, seething at the loss of their latest savior. Trump alone is not a national embarrassment. The national embarrassment is the fact that millions of Americans worship the latest incarnation of McCarthy, Walker, Wallace and on and on. American as `apple pie' has been replaced by American as `school shooting'. And the end of Trump's momentary stardom is not going to make that go away. The sickness is deeper than a single clown.
10
The GOP machine didn't blink an eye removing Gingrich and Bohner from power when they didn't tow the party line. The more I think about it, the more unlikely it is that they will hand Trump the keys to be their official candidate for president, whether he has earned or not. That means there will be a brokered convention and several million angry disenfranchised voters. It won't be pretty, but it just may be what's best for the GOP and the rest of the country.
3
If, on the school grounds, a child with the mouth of Trump were to treat your child or grandchild the same way Trump treats critics and dissenters and legal protesters, and VETERANS, would you, fellow citizens, voters, Americans, go to the aid of the abuser? Would you agree with the abuser that your child or grandchild was at fault for the abuse he or she just received? I think not. So, why is Trump getting a pass on his insults, lies, slanders, character assassination, fear mongering, bigotry, and yelling 'FIRE!' in a crowded theater?
13
Instead of taking advantage of the circus that is the Trump campaign for the sake of ratings, the media should have been exposing his lies and hate from the beginning. Now I only hope it's not too late to stop this destructive runaway train.
3
It looks to me that the NYT editorial board are the ones so "seething with anger" that they are incapable of writing a fair-balanced editorial about Trump.
16
This was pretty fair and moderate, as is their wont. Be glad it wasn't me doing the writing: I'd have started with something like:
When we look at this tin-whistle Mussolini, it's nice to think that we've never seen this before in American politics. But as Twain's "The Gilded Age," ought to remind us, we've had born-rich guys fleecing the suckers since two centuries back, and as Twain's "To the Person Sitting In Darkness," also reminds us, we've had cheerleading for murder and torture and theft for quite a while too....
After that, it'd get ugly.
When we look at this tin-whistle Mussolini, it's nice to think that we've never seen this before in American politics. But as Twain's "The Gilded Age," ought to remind us, we've had born-rich guys fleecing the suckers since two centuries back, and as Twain's "To the Person Sitting In Darkness," also reminds us, we've had cheerleading for murder and torture and theft for quite a while too....
After that, it'd get ugly.
7
So, are you saying that the editorial misrepresented the incendiary remarks Trump has made condoning violence at his rallies?
3
How can anyone say they go with Trump because they do not trust Hillary.
6
It's easy, try it! Hillary is a liar and has no core values.
10
Why cant you think about the really important thing?
Guns.
Can you imagine any of this, in Chicago or elsewhere , with people armed to the teeth, people standing their ground with AK 47s?
What sort of America do you envision?
Guns.
Can you imagine any of this, in Chicago or elsewhere , with people armed to the teeth, people standing their ground with AK 47s?
What sort of America do you envision?
3
From http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/15/world/asia/china-labor-strike-protest....
"President Xi Jinping, concerned about challenges to the ruling Communist Party, has responded with a methodical crackdown, quashing protests, dismantling labor rights organizations and imprisoning activists.
Hmmm....
Insert Donald Trump and the GOP in the appropriate names category and tell me how far off we are if this man gets elected?
"President Xi Jinping, concerned about challenges to the ruling Communist Party, has responded with a methodical crackdown, quashing protests, dismantling labor rights organizations and imprisoning activists.
Hmmm....
Insert Donald Trump and the GOP in the appropriate names category and tell me how far off we are if this man gets elected?
5
There is a cry in these responses to not to give Trump free publicity in the press. But it is important to cover his hate rallies because it is news, important news; the coverage is exposing the rise of a possible dictator.
There is something that is gnawing at me and no one had brought it up. If Trump becomes president, he will campaign to end term limits. I bet he will want to be president for life.
What is dangerous is that his base has no clue what he is doing to our Democracy - and to them. So many think wealth is a sign of wisdom and gravitas; they do not see the vileness that lurks behind his facade of his money.
The November election will be more important than we think, it will not be Democrats vs. Republicans so much, as it will be a battle over the legitimization of Joseph Conrad's the "Heart of Darkness." The perfect situation for a dictatorship to emerge.
The GOP unleashed Trump, in turn, Trump is opening up wider the flood gates for the legitimization of the reptilian side of his base's brain, a goal the GOP has silently been striving for. Trump is now loudly and rapaciously trumpeting it's legitimacy.
There is something that is gnawing at me and no one had brought it up. If Trump becomes president, he will campaign to end term limits. I bet he will want to be president for life.
What is dangerous is that his base has no clue what he is doing to our Democracy - and to them. So many think wealth is a sign of wisdom and gravitas; they do not see the vileness that lurks behind his facade of his money.
The November election will be more important than we think, it will not be Democrats vs. Republicans so much, as it will be a battle over the legitimization of Joseph Conrad's the "Heart of Darkness." The perfect situation for a dictatorship to emerge.
The GOP unleashed Trump, in turn, Trump is opening up wider the flood gates for the legitimization of the reptilian side of his base's brain, a goal the GOP has silently been striving for. Trump is now loudly and rapaciously trumpeting it's legitimacy.
8
I don't blame Trump for flinching when a protestor rushed the stage behind him. Trump (in his lingo) "knows better than anyone, believe me", how easy it is for unstable people to get guns and create mayhem.
Also the media tends to create alarmist headlines and narratives, to pump readership and ratings, and the coverage of Trump illustrates the point.
Lastly, protest and violence at rallies is nothing new. I remember President Reagan came to Hackensack, NJ to campaign in 1984. He arrived on-time, but the press bus was delayed 45 minutes, so the crowd was obliged to wait for the press to show up.
The introductory speaker prepping the crowd starting talking, but forgot his talking points and got tangled up in his words. He then said in frustration, "the things that were supposed to go up, went up, and the things that were supposed to go down, went down". And the crowd roared its approval.
I saw a middle aged lady well back from the stage in the middle of the large crowd. She was carrying a Mondale sign. At some point in the speech I heard paper tearing & sounds of a scuffle. I looked over and her sign had been torn down, and a group of tall plainclothes rough men surrounded her, but all facing the stage. She looked scared. She had been vocal in her protest, but was now cowed into silence.
Trump is no worse than Ronald Reagan, and far more perceptive, rational and engaged then Reagan ever was. We survived Reagan, we can survive Trump too. But why put ourselves through it?
Also the media tends to create alarmist headlines and narratives, to pump readership and ratings, and the coverage of Trump illustrates the point.
Lastly, protest and violence at rallies is nothing new. I remember President Reagan came to Hackensack, NJ to campaign in 1984. He arrived on-time, but the press bus was delayed 45 minutes, so the crowd was obliged to wait for the press to show up.
The introductory speaker prepping the crowd starting talking, but forgot his talking points and got tangled up in his words. He then said in frustration, "the things that were supposed to go up, went up, and the things that were supposed to go down, went down". And the crowd roared its approval.
I saw a middle aged lady well back from the stage in the middle of the large crowd. She was carrying a Mondale sign. At some point in the speech I heard paper tearing & sounds of a scuffle. I looked over and her sign had been torn down, and a group of tall plainclothes rough men surrounded her, but all facing the stage. She looked scared. She had been vocal in her protest, but was now cowed into silence.
Trump is no worse than Ronald Reagan, and far more perceptive, rational and engaged then Reagan ever was. We survived Reagan, we can survive Trump too. But why put ourselves through it?
18
@oh:
We also survived Obama. But why put ourselves through it? You must know by now that Hillary will be Obama's third term.
We also survived Obama. But why put ourselves through it? You must know by now that Hillary will be Obama's third term.
9
I'd ask what exactly the Black President did to you, but I bet it's findable somewhere in the phrase "Black President."
3
@Robert:
Why don't ask the same what Reagan did to you? Perhaps you can't answer, so you resort to the typial liberal ruse: racism.
Why don't ask the same what Reagan did to you? Perhaps you can't answer, so you resort to the typial liberal ruse: racism.
6
I am surprised to see so many negative comments about this column. I don't know how factual it is, but I do know Trump is not suitable for President of a free country. It's frightening to think what our country might be like when my grandchildren grow old. I have been very lucky to live through our best years.
6
I only refer to him as "Trumpolini", which is a shame, really, because he is so much moreso Hitleresque rather than Mussolinian, from whence Trumpolini's name is derived.
2
The media's lead role in the violence is being whitewashed or blamed entirely on Mr. Trump. We've seen this movie before. The news media, desperate for ratings, internet clickbait and page views, sensationalized the Michael Brown death, portraying it as the act of a rogue cop gunning down a small child who had his hands up.
When the grand jury could not return ANY criminal indictments, and the US Department of Justice cleared the officer of ANY wrong doing, and we learned Michael Brown was a towering, fully grown man charging at and assaulting an officer in an attempt to get the officer's gun, and that Brown was not shot with his hands up--an impossibility according to the autopsy, the news media didn't even print or broadcast a retraction.
Meanwhile cities burned, three cops including 2 NYPD were shot execution style by assailants angered by what they heard on the news about Michael Brown.
It's the media that throws raw meat to the rabid mob, and they sit back and watch the chaos.
It's happening with Donald Trump.
When the grand jury could not return ANY criminal indictments, and the US Department of Justice cleared the officer of ANY wrong doing, and we learned Michael Brown was a towering, fully grown man charging at and assaulting an officer in an attempt to get the officer's gun, and that Brown was not shot with his hands up--an impossibility according to the autopsy, the news media didn't even print or broadcast a retraction.
Meanwhile cities burned, three cops including 2 NYPD were shot execution style by assailants angered by what they heard on the news about Michael Brown.
It's the media that throws raw meat to the rabid mob, and they sit back and watch the chaos.
It's happening with Donald Trump.
17
Another great one, DCBarrister.
9
Beyond noting that you'd have to be about the dumbest cop on the planet to let a big guy you believed had just committed an armed robbery waltz up to your squad car window while you're by yourself and belted in, i see we're still trying the "attack the media for quoting the guy correctly," tactic.
By the way, your President--and he is, sorry--gave a good speech on politics and violence this morning.
By the way, your President--and he is, sorry--gave a good speech on politics and violence this morning.
3
Barack Obama isn't my anything.
And America will make that official this November. All Obama does is give speeches. All talk, no action, hence Trump leading in national polls.
And America will make that official this November. All Obama does is give speeches. All talk, no action, hence Trump leading in national polls.
7
That's Trump. That's the GOP. That's politics. It is the way we do things......
As a native New Yorker (NYC) it is obvious to me that Trump is a typical blustering coward! He talks a good game but at the first sign of personal physical engagement he cowers like a whimpering child. He may want to "punch a guy in the face" but probably never has in his life, unless he paid some one to let him.
His bluster grows is direct relation to the cheers of the adoring crowds as they perform to his every word. He is a legend in his own mind, but he is truly Oz.
His bluster grows is direct relation to the cheers of the adoring crowds as they perform to his every word. He is a legend in his own mind, but he is truly Oz.
3
These people who want to blame the world for what's gone wrong in their life need to look inward at the decisions they have made regarding education, jobs, relationships and family, debt and spending. Few external factors will have impacted their lives as much as a few key decisions have. And no matter how bad they think things are for them or their family, right now they're still better off than a significant portion of the world's population.
8
I went to college. I majored in the sciences. I found jobs. I have no debt. I didn't spend money on vacations, houses, or things I couldn't afford. I've survived 2 prolonged bouts of unemployment. I retrained to work in IT. I'm unemployed again at the age of 57. I have serious doubts about ever finding another job. And things here are not good. I don't care about the rest of the world because I have to survive here in America, a country that does not have a decent social safety net. My mistake was being born after 1955, being part of the latter part of the baby boom generation, not being born to rich parents, not going into finance (because I had no interest or ability), being female, not marrying, being a lesbian, and being stupid enough to think that hard work would carry the day.
In other words, AW, I did what I was supposed to do. I kept my end of the bargain. People like you are telling me I didn't. Walk a few miles in my shoes and feel my frustration over the fact that no matter how many resumes I send out I get nothing. I've looked for jobs all over the country. When I was in my 20s I looked all over and the only offers I got were in the New York area. Before you say we did something wrong, look at who you voted into office: if it was the GOP, you did something wrong.
In other words, AW, I did what I was supposed to do. I kept my end of the bargain. People like you are telling me I didn't. Walk a few miles in my shoes and feel my frustration over the fact that no matter how many resumes I send out I get nothing. I've looked for jobs all over the country. When I was in my 20s I looked all over and the only offers I got were in the New York area. Before you say we did something wrong, look at who you voted into office: if it was the GOP, you did something wrong.
5
Batting Trump around has become almost as popular as spring training baseball.
But it ignores the obvious.
Trump doesn't personally invite every person to his campaign events. They go of their own volition.
The Times has done some good reporting about who these folks are that support Trump.
That's what we should be talking about. Not him. He's just managed to find a political chord that lower income disaffected white folks can hear and respond to.
Trump supporters are screaming at us about what's wrong with the country from their perspective. While Senator Sanders if offering them both explanations and options forward, they can't or won't hear that.
These folks need a single payer health care system so they're healthy. They need affordable college so their kids can get an education. They need a jobs.
No, wait. Senator Sanders has already said all that stuff.
Who knew?
But it ignores the obvious.
Trump doesn't personally invite every person to his campaign events. They go of their own volition.
The Times has done some good reporting about who these folks are that support Trump.
That's what we should be talking about. Not him. He's just managed to find a political chord that lower income disaffected white folks can hear and respond to.
Trump supporters are screaming at us about what's wrong with the country from their perspective. While Senator Sanders if offering them both explanations and options forward, they can't or won't hear that.
These folks need a single payer health care system so they're healthy. They need affordable college so their kids can get an education. They need a jobs.
No, wait. Senator Sanders has already said all that stuff.
Who knew?
5
Mob rule.
3
I also hope hate will propel him to be the republican nominee. But for different reasons.
I think the most amazing thing about the Trump phenomenon is how he denies things he's said even after he's been presented the video evidence AND IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE TO HIS SUPPORTERS! It's like he's saying to them, 'Who are you going to believe, me, or your lying eyes?'
5
The recent violence reminds me of 1968, only 1968 was a lot more violent. Before the anti-war protest marches in 1968, the organizers, frequently SDS members, would instruct us protesters to incite the police and even better if a TV camera was nearby, The same tactics are now being used at the DT rallies. Yes, DT should not advocate violence against the protesters but the protesters should also not disrupt the rallies. If you are looking for a fight you will most likely find one, especially in this political climate.
23
One big difference between Trump rallies and '68. In '68, the protestors had the courage and respect to stay out of the auditorium, to protest in the streets. They did not agree with or acquiesce to what was being said by Humphrey, et al, but they did not try to prevent it from being said or heard. Instead, they tried to lawfully protest it.
2
As Dylan sang, "One should never be where one does not belong.... " Like an Outlaw going to a Hells Angels barbeque -- there can only be a bad ending.
Who do the rioting Democrats think they are fooling?
Who do the rioting Democrats think they are fooling?
1
I was AT the event in Boca. It was peaceful. It was over-policed, if anything. I am not a Trump fan, but this editorial only got to a real, verifiable fact 3/4 of the way through it when it said: "Sunday's rally was peaceful." It was a space rented for the night and telling protesters with anti-Trump signs was probably good pro-active crowd control. Trump and the media wished there was violence because it would have justified the 24-7 Breaking News!! treatment by the media and would have driven a bigger audience to Trump. Instead it was just same old Trump rant abut America for Americans and win, win, win, win. Attack Trump for being wrong, which he is. But the editorial has the story 100% backward: the Trump rally was peaceful because it was made peaceful.
Peter Sage, a political tourist and observer
www.peterwsage.blogspot.com
Peter Sage, a political tourist and observer
www.peterwsage.blogspot.com
13
Several people who I deal with in my business and social life are using the Hitler comparison to describe the Trump phenomena...others have used an American comparison such as Huey Long or George Wallace to describe the technique and the environment that is aiding Trump in his growth.
The similarities are obvious: white working class, economic restructuring, and significant social change, and last but not least fear and paranoia about ethnic minorities whether they be Jews or African Americans or Muslims or fill in the blank.
This election has turned into less of a political competition and more of a social one. The demography of the country is changing, the country must adapt or not exist as one country. We are partially living that way right now anyway.
The Leadership of this country can facilitate that change or aid in in fighting it and damaging the nation for the foreseeable future.
I am normally hopeful about the country....I am holding my breath.
The similarities are obvious: white working class, economic restructuring, and significant social change, and last but not least fear and paranoia about ethnic minorities whether they be Jews or African Americans or Muslims or fill in the blank.
This election has turned into less of a political competition and more of a social one. The demography of the country is changing, the country must adapt or not exist as one country. We are partially living that way right now anyway.
The Leadership of this country can facilitate that change or aid in in fighting it and damaging the nation for the foreseeable future.
I am normally hopeful about the country....I am holding my breath.
4
In my wilder, freer, younger years, I was very politically engaged and would sometimes attend competitors' rallies as opposition. I also attended a slew of political events where the opposition would send folks to protest. In general, everyone was treated with respect (if not a little eye-rolling). For the most part, you do your little chant, and hope that maybe you get to get a little clip at the end of the local news story: "There were also some local folks who came out today that disagreed with Senator Dole..."
I even got to attend the 2000 DNC convention, where there was a huge protest set up outside the Staples Center complete with bands and semi-celebrities. (Thanks a lot, Rage Against the Machine.) Again, everyone was treated with respect and, to my knowledge, no violence or law-breaking except for maybe a couple of drunk protesters having a little too much fun.
I have to say that this violence with Trump rallies is new within my lifetime. We have had a slew of candidates that the other side has violently disliked (GWB, Clinton, Obama to name a few) and have had to deal with plenty of protesters looking to cause headaches. What we haven't seen is this kind of violence and rioting with any of them. So what is different about Trump?
A lot of his supporters would like to blame the protesters, but they have always been there. The unique factor in his campaign is his blustery incitements and encouragement to resort to violence as a first reaction.
I even got to attend the 2000 DNC convention, where there was a huge protest set up outside the Staples Center complete with bands and semi-celebrities. (Thanks a lot, Rage Against the Machine.) Again, everyone was treated with respect and, to my knowledge, no violence or law-breaking except for maybe a couple of drunk protesters having a little too much fun.
I have to say that this violence with Trump rallies is new within my lifetime. We have had a slew of candidates that the other side has violently disliked (GWB, Clinton, Obama to name a few) and have had to deal with plenty of protesters looking to cause headaches. What we haven't seen is this kind of violence and rioting with any of them. So what is different about Trump?
A lot of his supporters would like to blame the protesters, but they have always been there. The unique factor in his campaign is his blustery incitements and encouragement to resort to violence as a first reaction.
4
Now we have political rallies where thugs can disrupt your right to free speech if it does not agree with their political agenda. Thereafter, the media pundits ask why did you provoke the incident - nothing at all is said about you right of assembly and free speech to express your beliefs. Of course, in today's world, free speech is only to be tolerated if you agree with the left wing media and mouth their mantra.
The media is part of the liberal cabal. They will twist and warp everything, to tear down the virtues and principles that built this country, including your right to free speech and the right to bear arms. Up until now the media has waged a stealth campaign, but now with the probability of a Trumph victory they have stripped their veneer of even-handedness and have waged a full assault on you and your values.
In some circles Clinton, Sanders, socialists masquerading as democrats, and the liberal media are viewed as the 21st century version of Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. They are out to weaken the Constitution and the rule of law, by pandering to special interests and pushing political correctness while eliminating individual rights. Many are beginning to believe their onslaught will never cease and they must be vanquished if the republic is to be saved. This perception has grown exponentially in 2016. Hence, the arrival of Donald Trump.
The media is part of the liberal cabal. They will twist and warp everything, to tear down the virtues and principles that built this country, including your right to free speech and the right to bear arms. Up until now the media has waged a stealth campaign, but now with the probability of a Trumph victory they have stripped their veneer of even-handedness and have waged a full assault on you and your values.
In some circles Clinton, Sanders, socialists masquerading as democrats, and the liberal media are viewed as the 21st century version of Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. They are out to weaken the Constitution and the rule of law, by pandering to special interests and pushing political correctness while eliminating individual rights. Many are beginning to believe their onslaught will never cease and they must be vanquished if the republic is to be saved. This perception has grown exponentially in 2016. Hence, the arrival of Donald Trump.
9
I suggest you look up the meaning of "Free Speech". Free Speech means you get to say whatever you want and not be arrested by the government. It doesn't mean that if you make incendiary remarks about Hispanics, Muslims, or Black Lives matter, that you have legal immunity from them showing up at your rallies to protest you. It also means that if your company doesn't like what you say you can't be fired. If the KKK shows up in a town to demonstrate, you can bet there will be a counter demonstration. Look it up, I promise you will find what I said is true.
4
Yes, they have a right to protest. Some might say that they have a moral imperative to do so. But not in your home, or office-or a private, rented venue. Their right to speak ends where it begins to infringe on another's right to speak. And yes, this would also mean that Trump supporters should not go into Black Lives Matter events at private venues, unless they want to listen to what is being said. But to disrupt-no.
2
As much as I agree wholeheartedly with this editorial, I also was dismayed that a large group of protesters, organized with the expressed intention to "shut it down" in Chicago, succeeded in cancelling Trump's rally there. Trump's message is unquestionably vile, but how would the Editorial Board feel if Trump supporters succeeded in shutting down a Clinton (or any other candidate's) rally? We need to speak out against all forms of intimidation of free speech -- vile or not. We are strong enough as a nation.
8
If you send BLM and other violent organizations to a Trump rally, you have to expect blowback. The agitators at Trump rallies are deliberately provoking Trump supporters and the press only reports half the story.
At a recent Hillary rally, a Marine asked a question of her husband concerning Libya and her security forces ejected him and a couple others for simply asking uncomfortable questions.
Trump is being set up by his opponents who fund these protestors whose only purpose is to make the Donald look bad. The press exploits the confusion with inaccurate and incomplete reporting and the crusade against Trump continues.
There are many educated folks who see through this charade and the blatancy of the bullying against Trump is beginning to turn fence sitters, independents, and defenders of the Democratic election process into Trump supporters.
It's as if the media, desperate and angry about Trump's half truths are combating it with non truths and exaggerations of their own.
At a recent Hillary rally, a Marine asked a question of her husband concerning Libya and her security forces ejected him and a couple others for simply asking uncomfortable questions.
Trump is being set up by his opponents who fund these protestors whose only purpose is to make the Donald look bad. The press exploits the confusion with inaccurate and incomplete reporting and the crusade against Trump continues.
There are many educated folks who see through this charade and the blatancy of the bullying against Trump is beginning to turn fence sitters, independents, and defenders of the Democratic election process into Trump supporters.
It's as if the media, desperate and angry about Trump's half truths are combating it with non truths and exaggerations of their own.
12
Everyone knows the scam the Sanders and Clinton supporters are managing there with 1000s of professional "student" activists who boast that "we've been protesting every day for four months now!!" Poor Rahm, Obama's water boy, more tortured than a Ted Bundy captive. As if Protesting-for-Protest's sake is a worthwhile endeavor for that mistake by the lake where 500 citizens with broad shoulders are murdered annually. I suspect the lake has leached lead into their drinking water, to judge by the atavism.
4
This country does not need Donald Trump to "make it great again". America is great, and the fact that a Donald Trump can spew hate, and incite people to riot, speaks volumes as to just how great we are. Donald Trump walks our streets freely, neither jailed nor fined, he is free to speak to his minions as he does. Our freedoms are what set us apart from other countries, and our only fear should be that a Donald Trump could take those freedoms away.
4
I am horrified at the beast that is being unleashed in many U.S. citizens by Trump. If you look at events in the Bosnian war, in Rwanda, and in India during the Partition, to name a few recent examples other than Nazi Germany, people who had lived amicably for generations with those of different ethnic backgrounds and different religions, suddenly found themselves attacked, tortured, raped, and murdered by those they had thought of as friends and neighbors. This is dangerous territory for this country, where everyone except native Americans has come from somewhere else. The way to make this country great again is not to succumb to irrational fear and resentment of the Other, but to resist the violence and hatred that is being stirred up by Trump's campaign.
6
Trump is a coward. His old man helped him to avoid the draft. My first indication that Trump was a coward was when he put down Senator McCain by saying he was not a war hero. How ironic is it that people like Trump and Cruz talk all that tough yin and yang, but can't back it up. It shows he's scared and erroneously thinks that if he incites his supporters, it will prove what a man he is. He's a wimp. A coward. And a charlatan.
11
It is a fact, widely reported on except, of course, in the NY Times and the rest of the Liberal MSM, that the Chicago violence was a direct result of Moveon.org, Blacklivesmatter and other radical groups spreading the word on social media for every pinhead Bernie supporter and the gamut of black, latino and muslim thugs to show up at the Trump rally and prevent him from speaking. But of course the Times and the rest of the Liberal media tried to spin it by blaming Trump. All the more reason for all concerned to show up on election day in November and send a very, loud and clear message that normal, working and wanting-to-work Americans are sick and tired of the politics as usual and the obedient water carriers of all things Politically Correct, the mostly Liberal MSM.
11
somebody is going to get killed. while this could be very damaging to trump's campaign, consider this . . . .
a trump supporter is murdered by a "sanders supporter/blm supporter/'liberal' " at a trump rally. can you imagine how this would energize his supporters and his campaign? it is not that scripted events like that have not occured in recent history to strengthen the grip of aspiring despots. i realize i am wading into pretty far out conspiratorial waters here but this is a political climate that none of us has ever experienced.
a trump supporter is murdered by a "sanders supporter/blm supporter/'liberal' " at a trump rally. can you imagine how this would energize his supporters and his campaign? it is not that scripted events like that have not occured in recent history to strengthen the grip of aspiring despots. i realize i am wading into pretty far out conspiratorial waters here but this is a political climate that none of us has ever experienced.
1
It is remarkable how the Times has things upside down. Topics such as immigration policy should be open topics in the political process even though they are unacceptable in politically correct discourse. All countries have laws that include deportation of those who enter illegally. Broad-brush charges of hate, racism and xenophobia toward those who feel such laws should be enforced to protect American workers serve only to block legitimate discussion and encourage hate and even violence. It is concerning for free discussion required in a democracy that Bernie Sanders has not denounced his supporters who have attempted to block the expression ideas at Trump rallies. The language used by Trump can be offensive, but the language used by the TImes that encourages violence and violations of fee speech.
29
it is a citizen duty to block hate speech. All this poor me rhetoric by Trump screamers is comical.
2
Reporting on violence at the rallies is easy. Reporting on why it is happening is harder, and that question has not just been ignored, but avoided by the media. First, why do Trump rallies attract so many protestors? And why are Trump supporters not disrupting other rallies? Why do his exhortations to his supporters incite his detractors, and by what logic does Trump have responsibility for that? Who are these protestors and who is organizing them? The evidence I see indicates that the persons responsible for this violence are the persons who oppose Trump. But that is not a story the media wants to tell. And that is a story in itself.
12
Looking through the NYT, there are no less than about 6 articles about Trump, including a slide show of his lavish home. There's lots of blame to go around, but the attention the media has lavished on his campaign from the beginning has fueled the outrageousness from the start. As Trump himself put it, watching protesters get thrown out of his rallies is much more fun to watch than hearing a "boring policy speech." He's a con artist all right. And he's really good at it.
4
Whatever Trump is.....what is the NEW YORK TIMES if they keep promoting and pushing his name out there, while also demonizing and crying about how evil & awful Trump is?
Why didn't they give the same attention to Hillary or Bernie? Where are the photo spreads on Hillary's lavish homes or $50K a week Hampton's rentals?
Why didn't they give the same attention to Hillary or Bernie? Where are the photo spreads on Hillary's lavish homes or $50K a week Hampton's rentals?
8
People need to know what a thug and dangerous man Tump is. Keeping silent is wrong.
2
Has Bernie told the protesters not to show up at Trumps rallies? Bernie needs riots to prove victimhood. They can't have a revolution without victims.
Solution to the violence stay away from Trump rallies and staged violence.
Solution to the violence stay away from Trump rallies and staged violence.
10
Only after seeing on TV and newspapers the Trump followers did I realize that America has become an absolute disaster with millions of people hating each other, absolute poverty, insane religious believes, and being totally incompetent to figure out how to make it in life. Why that is - who knows. Perhaps too big a country with only hot-dogs and hamburgers from sea to shining sea or being brought up by teachers who always give you a passing grade or constantly using credit cards without money in the bank. Whatever, but reality is that America has fallen down the cliff and won't recover or be further destroyed by a guy like Trump. The country is sick and dying which started way back before these elections got started. Trump is just a smart guy making an extra buck.
1
Footage of Friday's violence in Chicago reveals TWO lies by Trump;the first being his claim that violence was avoided,when in fact it was up until then the most violence between people assembled for a Trump rally,being more than an isolated scuffle-if not quite a full out riot-yet; Trump's second lie is that he cancelled his Friday event AFTER things started to get violent: in fact the footage shows Trump supporters and anti-Trump protesters peacefully waiting together for the rally to begin:then the cancellation of the rally is announced,after which immediately can be heard an angry murmor,and Trump supporters start pushing and punching protesters.
And comparing footage of Trump rallies with those of the rest of the campaigns reveals (1) Trump is the only one expressing the wish for violence against anyone protesting him,and (2) his are the only rallies at which there is any violence between a candidate's supporters and anyone protesting the candidate.
Via The violence at by Trump supporters against others we're getting a preview of the fascist characteristics likely to be common features of a Trump administration,if he's elected President.
And comparing footage of Trump rallies with those of the rest of the campaigns reveals (1) Trump is the only one expressing the wish for violence against anyone protesting him,and (2) his are the only rallies at which there is any violence between a candidate's supporters and anyone protesting the candidate.
Via The violence at by Trump supporters against others we're getting a preview of the fascist characteristics likely to be common features of a Trump administration,if he's elected President.
2
"He is basking in the energy created by turning one American against another, hoping hatred will propel him to the Republican nomination."
Are you talking about Trump or the Republican Party? They laid the groundwork for everything that is being Trumpeted about these days. They did nothing to stop the vile comments and false beliefs spouted about against Obama. How can a political party of "conservatives" and christian evangelicals do nothing to disabuse 34% of their base of their conviction that the President is a Muslim from Kenya whose goal is to destroy America?
If you see racism and hatred in the Trump campaign, the one thing you can not be is surprised.
Are you talking about Trump or the Republican Party? They laid the groundwork for everything that is being Trumpeted about these days. They did nothing to stop the vile comments and false beliefs spouted about against Obama. How can a political party of "conservatives" and christian evangelicals do nothing to disabuse 34% of their base of their conviction that the President is a Muslim from Kenya whose goal is to destroy America?
If you see racism and hatred in the Trump campaign, the one thing you can not be is surprised.
2
I'm not so sure Trump doesn't "plant" protestors at his Bund rallies. The fire at the Reichstag was done by a hired hand of the Führer. Designed purely to stir the basest instincts of the base.
4
This is typical NYT propoganda. It is the radical left who organizes and incites violence, and the liberal press condones it. The Chicago incident was planned well before, for the sole purpose of shutting Trump's rally. The disrupters came there to prevent the Trump supporters from listening to their candidate. Peacefull demonstrators don't do that.
Can you blame the innocent supporter, who took time to travel to the rally site to participate in democracy, for getting angry when someone forcefully interferes with his right to listen to what Trump is saying? Given the provocation by the disruptors, it is amazing so few attendees lost their cool. You can't go on inciting thousands of people by denying their basic rights and expect all to stand there quiet like sheep. A few will get violent.
And you can't blame the Trump campaign for it. Rather, you can blame those who purposely came there to start this violence.
Can you blame the innocent supporter, who took time to travel to the rally site to participate in democracy, for getting angry when someone forcefully interferes with his right to listen to what Trump is saying? Given the provocation by the disruptors, it is amazing so few attendees lost their cool. You can't go on inciting thousands of people by denying their basic rights and expect all to stand there quiet like sheep. A few will get violent.
And you can't blame the Trump campaign for it. Rather, you can blame those who purposely came there to start this violence.
11
Did you not see the photo of the Trump supported that punched a protester in the face as the protester was being led out of the auditorium?
1
If Trump and his supports got a permit from local government and had their rally in a public park, then it is a public event and they have to put up with anti-Trump people screaming in the crowd.
However, if the Trump supporters paid for a hall to hold a rally then they have every right to eject those who are not supporters. If those people resist, then yes, they have a right to physically escort them off the venue.
However, if the Trump supporters paid for a hall to hold a rally then they have every right to eject those who are not supporters. If those people resist, then yes, they have a right to physically escort them off the venue.
5
Trump's ability to whip up fervor and violence certifies him as a top-level product of human evolution. Such men in the past have led tribes to thousands of wars.
In earlier centuries, he would have been Napoleon, Ghengins Khan, Timulan. In more recent history, Idi Amin and many African strongmen display these features. Narcisism and the ability to grab assets are important advantages. We all descend from such people, so somehow we recognize these 'good' qualities and respect them.
The higher-income countries have calmed down since WWII and decided they would avoid large-scale wars. Education has made people look for arguments rather than alpha males brandishing swords.
So why is this type of a man winning these days? Many people offer world events as a reason. But could the daily violence on TV and videogames be more relevant? This is something to consider.
In earlier centuries, he would have been Napoleon, Ghengins Khan, Timulan. In more recent history, Idi Amin and many African strongmen display these features. Narcisism and the ability to grab assets are important advantages. We all descend from such people, so somehow we recognize these 'good' qualities and respect them.
The higher-income countries have calmed down since WWII and decided they would avoid large-scale wars. Education has made people look for arguments rather than alpha males brandishing swords.
So why is this type of a man winning these days? Many people offer world events as a reason. But could the daily violence on TV and videogames be more relevant? This is something to consider.
Many have advocated for background checks for gun purchases, in an effort to keep weapons out of the hands of people with serious mental illnesses.
Can we please run background checks before someone is allowed to run for president?
Can we please run background checks before someone is allowed to run for president?
3
This is one of the most appalling editorials the Times has ever published. A paper that panders to its readers to survive shouldn't survive.
I am not a Trump supporter and I am not a Republicans, but I have eyes and I saw protesters intentionally disrupting Trump's rally in Chicago and inciting and committing violence. I saw protestors tearing signs out of people’s hands and throwing the first punch on several occasions. To blame only Trump supporters is just wrong. The Times just chooses to ignore Chicago and wants us to believe the protestors at Trump rallies are just little old ladies.
The Times is correct that Trump encourages violence but this editorial doesn’t give a complete picture. There is anger and violence among protestors and the Times by completely ignoring it is guilty of encouraging violence too. The Left has been using the same style of protest it used in Chicago to stifle speech all across this country and the Times apparently approves. But all violence deserves condemnation and anyone participating in violence deserves to be condemned, anything short of this is the worst sort of moral relativism.
No matter how strongly the Times disapproves of Trump they must defend his right to speak and protestors trying to shut him up need to be told to cut it out too. By not calling out the side its readers always take, the Time has lost its moral legitimacy and is helping to make this election the angry right versus the angry left. Then we all lose.
I am not a Trump supporter and I am not a Republicans, but I have eyes and I saw protesters intentionally disrupting Trump's rally in Chicago and inciting and committing violence. I saw protestors tearing signs out of people’s hands and throwing the first punch on several occasions. To blame only Trump supporters is just wrong. The Times just chooses to ignore Chicago and wants us to believe the protestors at Trump rallies are just little old ladies.
The Times is correct that Trump encourages violence but this editorial doesn’t give a complete picture. There is anger and violence among protestors and the Times by completely ignoring it is guilty of encouraging violence too. The Left has been using the same style of protest it used in Chicago to stifle speech all across this country and the Times apparently approves. But all violence deserves condemnation and anyone participating in violence deserves to be condemned, anything short of this is the worst sort of moral relativism.
No matter how strongly the Times disapproves of Trump they must defend his right to speak and protestors trying to shut him up need to be told to cut it out too. By not calling out the side its readers always take, the Time has lost its moral legitimacy and is helping to make this election the angry right versus the angry left. Then we all lose.
14
I can't stand Trump and won't vote for him. But the NY Times is disingenuous in not pointing out that this "license to violence" seems completely defensive in nature. Trump supporters never go to Clinton or Sanders rallies to try to disrupt them. Trump only talks tough about people who come to disrupt his rallies.
8
A heartfelt thank you, NY Times, for this editorial.
If Trump gets this hysterical when someone criticizes him now, what would he do--what would he not do--if he could use the powers of a president to shut down critics?
He's too cowardly to commit violence himself (we saw that when he cringed as that protester rushed the stage), but as president, he would do as he does now: ask others to cause harm on his behalf.
Because there are two things Trump can't do: he can't handle criticism, and he can't take responsibility for his words and actions. He'll pervert reality itself, label black as white, to avoid that; when someone punches a protester because of Trump's hate speech, Trump claims it was an act of love...the mark of a sadist and sociopath.
That's how out of touch with reality Trump already is, and the more he's criticized, the worse he'll get. He would do everything he could to stifle the media and the truth if he were elected. If you doubt that, consider that he has already said he wants to make the libel laws tougher.
Trump has no internal checks on the lengths he will go to so that he never, ever has to admit he was wrong. It's up to us to stop him, because he can't stop himself.
Trump is one of the most insecure people on the planet, operating from a frail, fragile sense of self that wobbles like a jelly at a harsh word. If he were president, he would stop at nothing to present people from disagreeing with him--because he has to. If he can't s
If Trump gets this hysterical when someone criticizes him now, what would he do--what would he not do--if he could use the powers of a president to shut down critics?
He's too cowardly to commit violence himself (we saw that when he cringed as that protester rushed the stage), but as president, he would do as he does now: ask others to cause harm on his behalf.
Because there are two things Trump can't do: he can't handle criticism, and he can't take responsibility for his words and actions. He'll pervert reality itself, label black as white, to avoid that; when someone punches a protester because of Trump's hate speech, Trump claims it was an act of love...the mark of a sadist and sociopath.
That's how out of touch with reality Trump already is, and the more he's criticized, the worse he'll get. He would do everything he could to stifle the media and the truth if he were elected. If you doubt that, consider that he has already said he wants to make the libel laws tougher.
Trump has no internal checks on the lengths he will go to so that he never, ever has to admit he was wrong. It's up to us to stop him, because he can't stop himself.
Trump is one of the most insecure people on the planet, operating from a frail, fragile sense of self that wobbles like a jelly at a harsh word. If he were president, he would stop at nothing to present people from disagreeing with him--because he has to. If he can't s
2
I repeat this simply to cure some typos.
Why is it always Trump supporters did this, Trump said that? Did my eyes deceive me when I watched on national TV what took place in Chicago when a mob of leftist loonies prevented American citizens from peacefully assembling to hear what a candidate for the presidency had to say? There can be no justification for such conduct. None. Not in the United States...
Does the Times' editorial board actually believe that people who truly love this country and believe in the principles enshrined by and in the words of the Constitution, and written in the blood of the those who have given of themselves in our country's name, are so naïve -- so "uninformed" -- as to be unable to recognize who it was that trashed the laws of our land and spit in the eyes of the Republic that night in Chicago?
How sad it is to find that Nikita Khrushchev was right when he called the press the radical left's chief ideological weapon...
Why is it always Trump supporters did this, Trump said that? Did my eyes deceive me when I watched on national TV what took place in Chicago when a mob of leftist loonies prevented American citizens from peacefully assembling to hear what a candidate for the presidency had to say? There can be no justification for such conduct. None. Not in the United States...
Does the Times' editorial board actually believe that people who truly love this country and believe in the principles enshrined by and in the words of the Constitution, and written in the blood of the those who have given of themselves in our country's name, are so naïve -- so "uninformed" -- as to be unable to recognize who it was that trashed the laws of our land and spit in the eyes of the Republic that night in Chicago?
How sad it is to find that Nikita Khrushchev was right when he called the press the radical left's chief ideological weapon...
9
SERIOUSLY! Who's organizing this group to incited at Trump's rally inside a room which he rented! Obviously Trump is putting fear in the hearts of the establishment! This comment is coming from a moderate who is frankly tired of reading one sided views! THERE IS ABSOLUTE NO OBJECTIVITY!
9
I don't believe articles about how awful Trump is bothers him one bit. I think what would bother him is to ignore him. He craves attention. The media should deny him what he wants -- even for one 24 hour period. I tell you, he'll go nuts. But, unfortunately, the media won't do that because Trump is great for their bottom line.
2
We never believed Trump was serious; Trump just had to condemn someone and he had word-to-word coverage. He was never vetted; his past was never investigated; his claims that he was successful, etc. never challenged. Well now the genie is out of the bottle and Trump says what he wants to stir up the audience and capture it on live media. Truly a danger. The media should get together and have one stationary recording but not cover Trump's rallies live. How will he react without an audience? The stationary camera will be there for reference.
1
For days on end, without ceasing, the NYT, CNN, MSNBC and the rest of the news media televised and broadcast a narrative that Michael Brown, initially a small, innocent child, was gunned down by a police officer in Ferguson MO, who stalked him. Mr. Brown was, according to the press, shot while his hands were up and defenseless.
This narrative got 3 police officers murdered, execution style by gunmen who were incensed at what they heard on the "news" about what happened to Michael Brown.
We would later learn, the officer did nothing wrong, and the accounts blasted across the airwaves and on the pages of the NYT didn't happen. At the Academy Awards, hands up don't shoot. At the Oscars, hands up don't shoot. On CNN, a broadcast was stopped so that all of the people on the air could strike the hands up don't shoot pose.
Here. We. Go. Again.
Wild misquotes, out and out lies and media driven suggestions that Donald Trump is a racist have triggered attempts on his life, and according to media reports, Mr. Trump wears a bullet proof vest at all events and his family has received over 100,000 death threats. Visit Twitter and read the thousands of people threatening to assassinate Mr. Trump.
Yet here we are on the pages of the NYT, inciting violence towards Mr. Trump, lighting the fuse for something this country may not be able to contain if some crazy liberal lunatic, spurned on by the press, decides to be a hero and save us from Trump.
An utter disgrace.
This narrative got 3 police officers murdered, execution style by gunmen who were incensed at what they heard on the "news" about what happened to Michael Brown.
We would later learn, the officer did nothing wrong, and the accounts blasted across the airwaves and on the pages of the NYT didn't happen. At the Academy Awards, hands up don't shoot. At the Oscars, hands up don't shoot. On CNN, a broadcast was stopped so that all of the people on the air could strike the hands up don't shoot pose.
Here. We. Go. Again.
Wild misquotes, out and out lies and media driven suggestions that Donald Trump is a racist have triggered attempts on his life, and according to media reports, Mr. Trump wears a bullet proof vest at all events and his family has received over 100,000 death threats. Visit Twitter and read the thousands of people threatening to assassinate Mr. Trump.
Yet here we are on the pages of the NYT, inciting violence towards Mr. Trump, lighting the fuse for something this country may not be able to contain if some crazy liberal lunatic, spurned on by the press, decides to be a hero and save us from Trump.
An utter disgrace.
16
I hope you keep posting, DC Barrister, I always look forward to your posts.
10
Yes. Everyone needs a good laugh.
6
I understand the appeal of Trump. I wish I didn't, but I do. Family members who support him are good people who have watched the cost of living rise while their wages for service & industry jobs have not. They seem to watch a lot of TV (CNN, Fox) & fear that if immigrants don't take their jobs, terrorists will get to them first. They have American-made cars, flat screen TVs, & fenced-in yards for dogs that are there to protect private property. Their children are christened & they go to mass on holidays. Life is a lot about having, not having, & wanting to have - to have what our forebears came to this country for: a solid, stable, middle class life. For some of my family members, a number of whom opted out of higher education, that dream has passed them by. They are white, working class, middle-aged, & resentful. Donald Trump is a kind of political Dr. Phil. He gives them the opportunity to vent deep disappointment, frustration, & resentment. His candidacy is a collective catharsis. His rallies are not about policy; they're about being heard: The supporters I know simply don't feel heard, not by me, not by our leaders. And unfortunately they don't engage in civil discourse or civic life because the work of life - houses, jobs, kids, health - is enormously weighty. I loathe Mr. Trump & I am terrified of his candidacy. But he has helped me to see that a "silent" if not "majority" at least portion of his supporters are ordinary working people who feel left behind.
46
Yes, the "ordinary working people" have been left behind, and especially by the GOP. Promise them anything, but feed them lies and legitimize hate, has been the program of the GOP since 1965 (the Civil Rights Act) and even earlier (the Dies Committee of 1938 and its successor, McCarthy, were right-wing antisemitism in action, posting as anticommunism).
1
These people who want to blame the world for what's gone wrong in their life need to look inward at the decisions they have made regarding education, jobs, relationships and family, debt and spending. Few external factors will have impacted their lives as much as a few key decisions have. And no matter how bad they think things are for them or their family, right now they're still better off than a significant portion of the world's population.
2
It's a bit difficult to appreciate that a working class person in the U.S. is "better off than a significant portion of the world's population" when the cost of living in this country is ever-increasing. (And I am referring to the basics of housing, education and transportation)
Although I do agree that personal choices in life can significantly impact your quality of living, I would also argue that macroeconomic forces have much more significantly impacted the lives of U.S. citizens such as free trade agreements that have devastated manufacturing jobs, increased immigration that affects both blue collar and, increasing, white collar occupations.
How does one counter these macroeconomic forces - i.e. if your job is outsourced, does putting off having children, make a difference if that job is never coming back to the U.S.?
I believe the rise of Trump and Sanders is in response to the political elites and their addiction to free trade agreements, increased amounts of immigration - which corporate interests are also in favor of. The political elites have chosen to ignore these concerns of working people and are now dismayed and indignant that candidates who question these are garnering support.
Although I do agree that personal choices in life can significantly impact your quality of living, I would also argue that macroeconomic forces have much more significantly impacted the lives of U.S. citizens such as free trade agreements that have devastated manufacturing jobs, increased immigration that affects both blue collar and, increasing, white collar occupations.
How does one counter these macroeconomic forces - i.e. if your job is outsourced, does putting off having children, make a difference if that job is never coming back to the U.S.?
I believe the rise of Trump and Sanders is in response to the political elites and their addiction to free trade agreements, increased amounts of immigration - which corporate interests are also in favor of. The political elites have chosen to ignore these concerns of working people and are now dismayed and indignant that candidates who question these are garnering support.
1
Republicans have used fear and hatred to win elections for decades. They have carefully nurtured it and used it to push their agenda. Now Trump has come a tapped their power source and the Establishment is angry, afraid that it will be turned against them.
6
And Obama and his supporters haven't used hatred to win elections?
Are you out of your mind?
Are you out of your mind?
7
I volunteered on the 2008 and 2012 local campaigns for Democrats, knocking on doors and making phone calls in both. So I testify that in neither did I see the hated you accuse us of. I follow public affairs rather closely. I deny ANY instance of Obama preaching hatred, nor has his administration done so,
As a democrat and a proud American, I am insulted by what you say.
If there is any disconnection from reality here, it looks our of your mirror.
As a democrat and a proud American, I am insulted by what you say.
If there is any disconnection from reality here, it looks our of your mirror.
2
Thank goodness the NYT Board is condemning these actions by this idiot as dangerous in a democracy. Why are other news outlets also not condemning this and where are the so-called Christian leaders in their condemnation. This is something we have never seen in an election year before. We have come close in the days of protests against the vile Vietnam war but not this. It is pitiful how far we have sunk.
4
When will the Republican leadership finally disavow and condemn this fool? He has done nothing but bring shame to the many decent members of the party. There must be some way to boot him from the party and prevent him from using the word "Republican" in his campaign. I am not a Republican, but I have many friends who are, and I am embarrassed for them. Most of them cringe when they hear Trump's blather. Quite a few are questioning the so-called "leadership" of their party.
2
the most astonishing thing about many of the comments is that all they can do is trumpet their disdain for Trump -- ignoring completely his right to speak, his right to run, and the right of his supporters to support him.
9
Nobody is ignoring or opposing Trump's right to run, speak, or be supported by individuals. It's what he says and does that is condemned here One can condemn the content of speech without denying the right to say it. To quote one university president: "Everyone has a right to his or her opinion, no matter how ignorant, bigoted, or stupid it may be." There are limits to free speech, however, and exhorting people to do violence or shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theater are speech that the Supreme Court has specified as non-permitted. Whether Mr. Trump has engaged in such speech is open for debate, and this editorial is making the case that he did, without denying him his right to free speech or to run for office. The editorial board has every right a right to do so,
1
Watching footage of Trump at his rallies asking supporters to raise their hands in a salute, inciting his supporters to attack demonstrators, and reveling in the chaos he has created, saying over and over again how much fun his rallies are, and how the disruptions make the rallies more exciting, I fear for our country. Panem et circenses anyone?
3
Why is it always Trump supporters did this, Trump said that? Did my eyes deceive me when I watched on national TV what took place in Chicago when a mob of leftist loonies prevented American citizens from peacefully assembling to hear what a candidate for the presidency had to say? There can be no justification for such conduct. None. Not in the United States...
Does the Times' editorial board actually believe that people who truly love this country and believe in the principles enshrined by and in the words of the Constitution, and written in the blood of the those who given of themselves in our country's name, are so naïve -- so "uninformed" -- as to be unable to recognize who it was that trashed the laws of our land and spit in the eyes of the Republic that night in Chicago?
How sad it is to find that Nikita Khrushchev was right when called the press the radical left's chief ideological weapon...
Does the Times' editorial board actually believe that people who truly love this country and believe in the principles enshrined by and in the words of the Constitution, and written in the blood of the those who given of themselves in our country's name, are so naïve -- so "uninformed" -- as to be unable to recognize who it was that trashed the laws of our land and spit in the eyes of the Republic that night in Chicago?
How sad it is to find that Nikita Khrushchev was right when called the press the radical left's chief ideological weapon...
9
A gang of violent protesters invade a peaceful political rally and the story is about the victim's violence and not about his First Anendment right to speak being infringed upon? Typical NY Times pretzel logic.
9
With this quote "It’s instructive to watch the video of Mr. Trump cowering as a protester stormed the stage in Ohio..." it seems to this reader that the NYT is giving license to rush US presidential candidates.
Please try to see what you giving rise to across this country.
It's been happening at police stations, cities in the midst of riot, and colleges too - outside paid agitators tearing at the seams of this country.
You may hate Trump, but no one is allowed to violently rush a presidential candidate, and for very good reasons.
Please try to see what you giving rise to across this country.
It's been happening at police stations, cities in the midst of riot, and colleges too - outside paid agitators tearing at the seams of this country.
You may hate Trump, but no one is allowed to violently rush a presidential candidate, and for very good reasons.
6
It was all laughs and cutesy when Donald Trump was leading the racist Birther efforts. If I recall Romney happily accepted his endorsement. Now, all of sudden, there is concern.
The Nixon strategy has served the Republican Party well over the last several decades, now it is time to pay the toupee wearing piper
The Nixon strategy has served the Republican Party well over the last several decades, now it is time to pay the toupee wearing piper
1
It's a disgrace how the New York Times is doing everything in its power to help Donald Trump win the Republican nomination. Everybody knows that the more you hit Trump the stronger he gets. Especially when the Times is doing the hitting. You are not creating more Trump haters with your endless demonizing coverage. You are creating more Trump supporters and motivating his base even more. Other than the far left. most people do not trust or are at least very suspicious of the opinions of the Times. The Times is no longer the objective, trusted source it once was.
Is this your strategy? Do you want Trump in the general election because you think he can be defeated? If so, my apologies. Or are you just stupid?
Is this your strategy? Do you want Trump in the general election because you think he can be defeated? If so, my apologies. Or are you just stupid?
3
The Trump campaign reminds me of Black Lives Matter - only your point of view matters, and when someone disagrees with it, violence.
4
The American Psychiatric Association in 2013, lists both sociopathy and psychopathy under the heading of Antisocial Personality Disorders (ASPD). These disorders share many common behavioral traits which lead to the confusion between them. Key traits that sociopaths and psychopaths share include:
A disregard for laws and social mores
A disregard for the rights of others
A failure to feel remorse or guilt
A tendency to display violent behavior
If Donald Trump were so clever he would be better a hiding the fact that he fjts the bill for one or the other.
A disregard for laws and social mores
A disregard for the rights of others
A failure to feel remorse or guilt
A tendency to display violent behavior
If Donald Trump were so clever he would be better a hiding the fact that he fjts the bill for one or the other.
3
Supporters of Trump make a spurious argument: "They do not go to other candidates' rally and disrupt". The reason that is not happening is because other candidates are not insulting and disparaging any ethnic group, nor are they a threat to any of them. Trump is viciously attacking several minority groups and he poses a grave danger to their safety and survival. As such, neither he nor his supporters can complain about the violent disruptions occurring in their rallies. They asked for it.
33
"Trump is viciously attacking several minority groups."
And this was a NYT Pick?
Okay, it's my lunch break so I'll play along.
Ending undocumented illegals flooding into the USA is an attack on a minority group? Or an aspiration to follow the immigration laws already on the books? Study after study shows the damage undocumented illegals are doing to the Black community in terms of jobs, crime and poverty.
Placing a freeze on Syrian migrants entering the USA until we have some idea who these people are and whether they are ISIS operatives is an attack on a minority group?
The irresponsible rhetoric of the Obama left is frightening.
You talk of a spurious argument by using fallacies and fakery to develop yours? Maybe it's just the Black Washington lawyer (and Trump supporter) in me but that dog won't hunt.
And this was a NYT Pick?
Okay, it's my lunch break so I'll play along.
Ending undocumented illegals flooding into the USA is an attack on a minority group? Or an aspiration to follow the immigration laws already on the books? Study after study shows the damage undocumented illegals are doing to the Black community in terms of jobs, crime and poverty.
Placing a freeze on Syrian migrants entering the USA until we have some idea who these people are and whether they are ISIS operatives is an attack on a minority group?
The irresponsible rhetoric of the Obama left is frightening.
You talk of a spurious argument by using fallacies and fakery to develop yours? Maybe it's just the Black Washington lawyer (and Trump supporter) in me but that dog won't hunt.
9
Everybody needs to take a breath and relax.
This is just the latest news media attempt to force Trump out of the 2016 race.
The "wall" scandal didn't work.
The "McCain" scandal didn't work.
The "Ban on Muslims" scandal didn't work.
Jeb Bush didn't work.
Carly Fiorina didn't work.
Ben Carson didn't work.
Ted Cruz didn't work.
Marco Rubio didn't work.
Mitt Romney didn't work.
Now it's time for fearmongering.
Tonight's big wins by Trump will end this tactic and send the NYT back to the drawing board.
This is just the latest news media attempt to force Trump out of the 2016 race.
The "wall" scandal didn't work.
The "McCain" scandal didn't work.
The "Ban on Muslims" scandal didn't work.
Jeb Bush didn't work.
Carly Fiorina didn't work.
Ben Carson didn't work.
Ted Cruz didn't work.
Marco Rubio didn't work.
Mitt Romney didn't work.
Now it's time for fearmongering.
Tonight's big wins by Trump will end this tactic and send the NYT back to the drawing board.
9
It would be funnier if it was not so sad.
In most elections, editorials beg people to "get involved" and "go to the polls". When they do, they are excoriated because they chose the "politically incorrect candidate".
The left has wanted for 75 years to have a grassroots group, with 1/10th the power and influence of Trump's supporters (or even the Tea Party for that matter). Yet they totally failed to do this. McCarthy, McGovern, Nader all went down in flames. Bernie's future is very uncertain.
So basically they are enraged that the conservatives beat them at their own game.
In most elections, editorials beg people to "get involved" and "go to the polls". When they do, they are excoriated because they chose the "politically incorrect candidate".
The left has wanted for 75 years to have a grassroots group, with 1/10th the power and influence of Trump's supporters (or even the Tea Party for that matter). Yet they totally failed to do this. McCarthy, McGovern, Nader all went down in flames. Bernie's future is very uncertain.
So basically they are enraged that the conservatives beat them at their own game.
5
DCBarrister
You list attempts by patriotic Americans, more qualified than Trump, to win the presidency. And of course the ridiculous wall, insults to John McCain, and insults to Muslims, many of whom have fought for this country.
Fear mongering? Yes, the demagogue, Donald Trump, is very good at creating fear in his followers.
Drawing board? Perhaps predicting the danger of a Trump presidency. And the possibility of very necessary impeachment.
You list attempts by patriotic Americans, more qualified than Trump, to win the presidency. And of course the ridiculous wall, insults to John McCain, and insults to Muslims, many of whom have fought for this country.
Fear mongering? Yes, the demagogue, Donald Trump, is very good at creating fear in his followers.
Drawing board? Perhaps predicting the danger of a Trump presidency. And the possibility of very necessary impeachment.
2
Does anyone really think this is the first time violence or aggressive behavior has ever been incited inside the political process in the US?
Read some history, best being Howard Zinn's, 'A People's History of the United States'. We have always been a nation of bullies and have responded even more crazily in political elections. For starters, candidate gun shoot-outs anyone?
At least within our halls of Congress there aren't regular fist fights, not yet.
Read some history, best being Howard Zinn's, 'A People's History of the United States'. We have always been a nation of bullies and have responded even more crazily in political elections. For starters, candidate gun shoot-outs anyone?
At least within our halls of Congress there aren't regular fist fights, not yet.
2
There's something Trump has a corner on. Something he brazenly does which none of the other candidates do (or would ever do). He maligns immigrants/immigration and Muslims. Sadly, I believe that's the hook that stridently binds his supporters to him.
Before Trump, that group was most likely already blaming people who weren't born here and Muslims for their ills. Then comes Trump who just happens upon this narrow-minded feast which he brings to the surface and now sinisterly exploits on his reckless climb to the Oval Office.
As a result, other saner candidates who attempt to show the Trump groupies that they can do a better job meeting their economic or job needs are simply barking up the wrong tree. Nothing else except being anti immigrants/Muslims gets through to them. If it's not being vehemently anti those groups it just won't sell. And Trump deviously knows that. He knows he's hit on something that only he would have the nerve to do. And that's the dark side of the art of this Trump deal. And it's scary.
Before Trump, that group was most likely already blaming people who weren't born here and Muslims for their ills. Then comes Trump who just happens upon this narrow-minded feast which he brings to the surface and now sinisterly exploits on his reckless climb to the Oval Office.
As a result, other saner candidates who attempt to show the Trump groupies that they can do a better job meeting their economic or job needs are simply barking up the wrong tree. Nothing else except being anti immigrants/Muslims gets through to them. If it's not being vehemently anti those groups it just won't sell. And Trump deviously knows that. He knows he's hit on something that only he would have the nerve to do. And that's the dark side of the art of this Trump deal. And it's scary.
1
Mr. Trump is not anti-immigrant. His own ancestors were LEGAL immigrants, as were my own 4 grandparents.
LEGAL. Not illegal.
The problem is you don't know or acknowledge the difference, but thank god, when Trump is elected, you will have to do so. Legal immigrants are always welcomed and the equal of anyone. ILLEGAL aliens are not, and must be deported back to their native homeland.
The same with Muslims. Mr. Trump has no animosity towards Muslims; his words were about vetting immigrants from Islamic states, which are sworn to terrorism. Look what happened in San Bernardino!
LEGAL. Not illegal.
The problem is you don't know or acknowledge the difference, but thank god, when Trump is elected, you will have to do so. Legal immigrants are always welcomed and the equal of anyone. ILLEGAL aliens are not, and must be deported back to their native homeland.
The same with Muslims. Mr. Trump has no animosity towards Muslims; his words were about vetting immigrants from Islamic states, which are sworn to terrorism. Look what happened in San Bernardino!
3
Why is disrupting a Trump rally considered a Free Speech Act? I would not vote for Trump but it seems to me that the war being wage by liberals on Trump is the real source of potential violences. The arrogance displayed by these self righteous hypocrites trumps even Trump! Yea, we get it, you don't like Trump, but if you want to protest use a ballot box instead of a bull horn.
11
Maybe you haven't noticed that the war is being waged by the GOP establishment.
1
Disruption is a form of expression. The police have escorted disrupters from rallies out of fear of violence. So although we have freedom of speech, there are also limits.
Every word in this editorial rings true.
But there's a different form of hate: fermented with far more subtlety by Ted Cruz. He demonizes Planned Parenthood and calls for overturning Roe V. Wade (among his policy planks that call for eviscerating most any law, policy or regulation supported by a liberals or moderates). His rallies may be peaceful, but the vitriol in his tone is unmistakable. Less than four months ago, a nut-job massacred a Planned Parenthood clinic in Colorado. People DID get killed there. Could more of those attacks happen if Cruz wins the nomination and spews his own form of hate into November?
The media, especially the NY Times Op-Ed columnists and Editorial Board have been so focused on Trump's antics, they've neglected to examine the consequences of his equally scary opponent winning the Republican nomination.
But there's a different form of hate: fermented with far more subtlety by Ted Cruz. He demonizes Planned Parenthood and calls for overturning Roe V. Wade (among his policy planks that call for eviscerating most any law, policy or regulation supported by a liberals or moderates). His rallies may be peaceful, but the vitriol in his tone is unmistakable. Less than four months ago, a nut-job massacred a Planned Parenthood clinic in Colorado. People DID get killed there. Could more of those attacks happen if Cruz wins the nomination and spews his own form of hate into November?
The media, especially the NY Times Op-Ed columnists and Editorial Board have been so focused on Trump's antics, they've neglected to examine the consequences of his equally scary opponent winning the Republican nomination.
4
The question at hand is whether or not Trump's language incites violence both from his supporters or his opponents. Given the evidence (assaults during his speeches, the events in Chicago, etc.) it's obvious that it does. It hard to imagine, judging by the quotes taken from Trump's appearances, how anyone could conclude otherwise. While this certainly does not excuse the violence, the lion's share of the blame is Mr. Trump's. He certainly knows the power of words.
2
Inciting violence is something very specific. This would never meet the test of any court. Inciting violence is clearly stating "go kill or shoot or harm XYZ people". Trump has obviously not done this.
To defend yourself or your candidate or a LEGITIMATE political event on the cusp of an election from disrupters -- that is NOT inciting violence. The violence was incited when these protesters decided to try and ruin Trump rallies, and get attention for themselves and THEIR candidate, using shoddy cheap tactics like throwing tomatoes.
To defend yourself or your candidate or a LEGITIMATE political event on the cusp of an election from disrupters -- that is NOT inciting violence. The violence was incited when these protesters decided to try and ruin Trump rallies, and get attention for themselves and THEIR candidate, using shoddy cheap tactics like throwing tomatoes.
3
"Yes, some of those people are bigots."
What a cowardly statement. By downplaying the racial animosity that is fueling the Trump campaign and basically the Republican Party, we are now in this situation today
It was all laughs and cutesy when Donald Trump was leading the racist Birther efforts. If I recall Romney happily accepted his endorsement. Now, all of sudden, there is concern.
The Nixon strategy has served the Republican Party well over the last several decades, now it is time to pay the toupee wearing piper.
What a cowardly statement. By downplaying the racial animosity that is fueling the Trump campaign and basically the Republican Party, we are now in this situation today
It was all laughs and cutesy when Donald Trump was leading the racist Birther efforts. If I recall Romney happily accepted his endorsement. Now, all of sudden, there is concern.
The Nixon strategy has served the Republican Party well over the last several decades, now it is time to pay the toupee wearing piper.
4
I lived in New Hampshire for several years and was there in September 2011 when Sarah Palin led the "Tea Party Express" and held numerous rallies.
The rallies quickly became infamous for the weaponry that was openly carried (legal in NH) by Palin supporters, including - but not limited to - AK 47 assault rifles.
I have not and will not attend Trump rallies (I doubt he'd have them here in Manhattan) but I see the same, frightening trend.
As others have commented, I envision the prospect of someone getting seriously hurt....or killed by over-enthusiastic Trump acolytes.
After all, their Fuhrer has boasted that he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and his ratings wouldn't suffer.
Far from it...
The rallies quickly became infamous for the weaponry that was openly carried (legal in NH) by Palin supporters, including - but not limited to - AK 47 assault rifles.
I have not and will not attend Trump rallies (I doubt he'd have them here in Manhattan) but I see the same, frightening trend.
As others have commented, I envision the prospect of someone getting seriously hurt....or killed by over-enthusiastic Trump acolytes.
After all, their Fuhrer has boasted that he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and his ratings wouldn't suffer.
Far from it...
3
Obama meets with leaders of BLM; but won't meet or acknowledge families of victims murdered by illegal aliens...most of whom have had several violent, felony convictions, yet released by law enforcement officials who are supposed to be protecting Americans. Moveon.org....an extreme hate group. Illegal alien immigrant groups, who close down highways, storm political offices and the private homes of politicians who are against giving fast-track amnesty to illegal aliens; democrat politicians who refuse to defund sanctuary cities and states, and who voted "nay" to Kate's law; two sets of justice...one for the 1% ruling class, and one for the other 99%. No wonder Americans are fed up. Violent confrontations happened long before Trump entered the scene..blame all of our government (non) leaders for ignoring those who put them in office.
10
I have too much faith in our country to believe that this aberrant behavior is the new norm. As a citizenry, we have always discarded the Long's and the Wallaces. What is troubling, are conditions in a country that spawn this strain of behavior. So many pundits have offered the variable they believe creates this behavior ---which, is present in every nationality. Whatever the cause of this behavior, we citizens, should make every effort to support candidates and initiatives that in small ways address those conditions that bring on levels of alienation that places portions of our population into such a violent place.
2
I really think the media, including the Times, is feeding the Trump frenzy. For example the story, with portrait, about him according to his butler was outrageously out of place in the center front page of today's Times on line. Enough already.
6
To Ann-Marie Hislop;
Your comment is right on. I've seen a disturbing situation that has been growing for years, especially on the left: a tendency to restrict freedom of speech. From college protests against invited speakers, to the professor in Missouri (?) who asked for "some muscle" to prevent a student photographer from a school newspaper from covering an event.
And now we see the violent, in your face, protesters at Trump rallies, encouraged by left wing groups like Move-on.org.
Our culture is to blame: look at the TV programs, (except for PBS) , where in your face "communication" is rampant, making it seem normal. Is this a symptom of why US college graduates know less than their foreign rivals?
This has been going on for a long time.
It seems we're in a growing tinderbox, with both sides thinking the other is to blame.
Your comment is right on. I've seen a disturbing situation that has been growing for years, especially on the left: a tendency to restrict freedom of speech. From college protests against invited speakers, to the professor in Missouri (?) who asked for "some muscle" to prevent a student photographer from a school newspaper from covering an event.
And now we see the violent, in your face, protesters at Trump rallies, encouraged by left wing groups like Move-on.org.
Our culture is to blame: look at the TV programs, (except for PBS) , where in your face "communication" is rampant, making it seem normal. Is this a symptom of why US college graduates know less than their foreign rivals?
This has been going on for a long time.
It seems we're in a growing tinderbox, with both sides thinking the other is to blame.
7
If you want to put an end to the senseless violence, the answer is very simple -- have Bernie tell his supporters not to attend Trump rallies. It takes two to tango.
6
It only takes one to throw a punch.
4
I tried leaving this thought on Roger Cohen's piece (14 March), but as the comments section hasn't been updated in some time, I fear it may soon close. I want a tee shirt or hat that reads:
Make America Trump-free again!
Make America Trump-free again!
3
When I hear the Republican "leaders" say that they will support whoever wins the nomination no matter what, it reminds me of the infamous chant "Deutchland Uber Alles".
Remember how that worked out?
Go Bernie
Remember how that worked out?
Go Bernie
6
@buttercup: Does "Deutchland Uber Alles" also remind you of Goebbels? The Reich Minister of Propaganda, who used the media to destroy any dissent? And doesn't this remind you of today's liberal media in USA, such as NYT and WashPost, who repeatedly attack those who dare disagree with our liberal government? Do you want to shut down Trump's dissent and wait for the repeat of Deutchland Uber Alles?
4
Those of us old enough to remember Richard Nixon see a familiar campaign strategy at work here, the "strongman" tactic, as old as politics itself.
In this scenario, the politician encourages confrontation and anger at his rallies (in Nixon's case, he actually hired his provocateurs, while Trump, typically, gets his for nothing, simply by showing up somewhere). He then points out the protesters as an example of a lawless, chaotic society and brags that he is the only one with the strength and the power to clean up the mess. This has long been a successful GOP strategy in rallying its base.
Of course, as other commenters have pointed out on here, none of this would be possible without the active cooperation of our reality-TV cable "news" networks, who are drawn to these confrontational spectacles like moths to a flame, creating an endless TV feedback loop.
In this scenario, the politician encourages confrontation and anger at his rallies (in Nixon's case, he actually hired his provocateurs, while Trump, typically, gets his for nothing, simply by showing up somewhere). He then points out the protesters as an example of a lawless, chaotic society and brags that he is the only one with the strength and the power to clean up the mess. This has long been a successful GOP strategy in rallying its base.
Of course, as other commenters have pointed out on here, none of this would be possible without the active cooperation of our reality-TV cable "news" networks, who are drawn to these confrontational spectacles like moths to a flame, creating an endless TV feedback loop.
6
Mr. Trump has been making chumps out of the media for a long time.
Wouldn't it be great to have investigative reporting on the dirty tricks aspect of the various campaigns?
Wouldn't it be great to have investigative reporting on the dirty tricks aspect of the various campaigns?
1
Oh, now, the NYT is worried about Trump. After how much uncritical coverage? How much more coverage than Bernie Sanders or any other person running for office except perhaps Hillary Clinton?
The media and politician hand-wringing about Trump's violent rhetoric didn't start until after the Breitbart reporter was bruised by one of Trump's people. A white female reporter, one of "us", had to get hurt before we heard any backlash against it. For shame.
The media and politician hand-wringing about Trump's violent rhetoric didn't start until after the Breitbart reporter was bruised by one of Trump's people. A white female reporter, one of "us", had to get hurt before we heard any backlash against it. For shame.
3
Well, the coverage was all negative. But the Grey Lady overplayed her hand; she drew more attention (negative that it was) to Trump, and anyhow, his supporters probably don't read this publication, which is hard-left wing and pro-illegal immigration.
Still and all, I wonder if they are regretting their lame-o strategy.
Still and all, I wonder if they are regretting their lame-o strategy.
2
“The very first essential for success is a perpetually constant and regular employment of violence.” Adolph Hitler
"Make up a lie, keep it simple, repeat it over and over again and the people wll believe it. Adolph Hitler.
"I will make America great again." Donald Trump.
"Make up a lie, keep it simple, repeat it over and over again and the people wll believe it. Adolph Hitler.
"I will make America great again." Donald Trump.
4
Cowering? I have absolutely loved watching that video being replayed again and again. It shows what a scaredy-cat Trump is when he grabs the Secret Service agent by the arm looking for protection (kinda feminine, eh?). He certainly would not know what to do if anyone threw a punch his way.
2
Pretty insulting to women. How about cowering like a man of no substance?
1
The acid test is tonight, if Trump sweeps all five states, he will have pretty much been given a license to say and do as he pleases. He will not only take the low road to the White House, he will litter it with pieces of the Constitution that he has so nonchalantly shred along the way. Mr. Trump has already threatened the First Amendment - right to free speech, right to protest, etc. Once he gets into the Oval Office, for all practical purposes, the Second Amendment will move up a notch. Ben Franklin's famous words upon exiting the Constitutional Convention at the time of our nation's founding, "A Republic, if you can keep it" will come back to haunt us all, if Trump is elected to the highest office in the land!
4
It also appears that Trump's hate speech has emboldened the rest of the hate filled crowd. I just returned from voting, and while I was filling out my ballot, a "gentleman" came in and promptly began railing against the fact that the signs were in Spanish as well as English. It seems such people, who once kept their feelings in a closet, feel empowered to act out now that they see such a high profile candidate doing the same.
If Trump's candidacy has done nothing else, it has shown us how many nut jobs we have in our society at large, and in our own neighborhoods.
If Trump's candidacy has done nothing else, it has shown us how many nut jobs we have in our society at large, and in our own neighborhoods.
3
I would like to see the Southern Poverty Law Center weigh in on this issue. I think the Trump campaign can reasonably be classified as a hate group.
4
I am one of the lucky Americans who loves her country but has the pragmatic viewpoint (and skill set) to get herself to Canada (or Ireland, or wherever) should we hand over our once great nation to a dictatorship.
I won't make comparisons to Hitler. Hitler was smarter and that would be giving Trump too much credit. However, pick your favorite tinpot dictator - Mugabe, Papa Doc, Museveni, Amin, Marcos. Greedy, over-sized egos who saw the populace as dupes. Trump's "respect" for his followers rings about as true as Bashar al-Assad's "love" for his own people.
What has Trump ever done for the "working class"? What public service has he done, ever, in his life? I doubt he's picked up an errant piece of trash from the lawn at MiraLago.
A friend who is a stalwart conservative Republican said she couldn't vote for Trump because she didn't trust him to be conservative enough. I wanted to (gently) shake her and say "That should be the absolutely LEAST of the reasons not to vote for him!!"
My future vision of a country under El Presidente Trump would include a confiscation of all guns, a muzzled press, statues and murals made to the glory of our great leader, and long, long lines at the soup kitchen.
I won't make comparisons to Hitler. Hitler was smarter and that would be giving Trump too much credit. However, pick your favorite tinpot dictator - Mugabe, Papa Doc, Museveni, Amin, Marcos. Greedy, over-sized egos who saw the populace as dupes. Trump's "respect" for his followers rings about as true as Bashar al-Assad's "love" for his own people.
What has Trump ever done for the "working class"? What public service has he done, ever, in his life? I doubt he's picked up an errant piece of trash from the lawn at MiraLago.
A friend who is a stalwart conservative Republican said she couldn't vote for Trump because she didn't trust him to be conservative enough. I wanted to (gently) shake her and say "That should be the absolutely LEAST of the reasons not to vote for him!!"
My future vision of a country under El Presidente Trump would include a confiscation of all guns, a muzzled press, statues and murals made to the glory of our great leader, and long, long lines at the soup kitchen.
4
"It’s instructive to watch the video of Mr. Trump cowering as a protester stormed the stage in Ohio.."
It's possible that the editors of the NYT have lost their minds.
Protesters aren't allowed to "storm" anything!
The secret service detail rallied around Trump for a reason. Was it instructive to watch them!
Is the NYT suggesting that rushing a US presidential candidate anywhere is a sound way to protest?
It's possible that the editors of the NYT have lost their minds.
Protesters aren't allowed to "storm" anything!
The secret service detail rallied around Trump for a reason. Was it instructive to watch them!
Is the NYT suggesting that rushing a US presidential candidate anywhere is a sound way to protest?
8
While there may be similarities between Trump and dictators/despots of the past, I think he represents a new branch of that tree. The world has never really had such a leader from the US and never in a time where news travels instantly around the world, preserved in video for posterity!
One has to seriously wonder about his mental health. I'm certainly not qualified to diagnose him. But, those who are are held hostage by an ethic to which an exception should be made. That ethic is that psychologists/psychiatrists are prohibited from publicly diagnosing someone they have never personally evaluated. I think this stems from a situation about Goldwater in the 1964 election cycle. The difference is that at that time we didn't have the wealth of video coverage we do today. Practically everything this man does outside of his home and other personal spaces is taped.
I knew that racism, sexism, ableism, ageism and the rest of the isms were firmly entrenched in the beliefs of some people, in our institutions and the culture at large. I am astounded at the reality of how widespread these poisons are in our society, as evidenced by Trumps millions of followers.
I don't buy it for a second that not everyone who supports him is racist or sexist, etc. Of course they are! No one in this day and age gets a pass for not knowing that these things are wrong. They, of course, have a right to believe whatever they want as protected by our constitution. But, it doesn't make it right or sane.
One has to seriously wonder about his mental health. I'm certainly not qualified to diagnose him. But, those who are are held hostage by an ethic to which an exception should be made. That ethic is that psychologists/psychiatrists are prohibited from publicly diagnosing someone they have never personally evaluated. I think this stems from a situation about Goldwater in the 1964 election cycle. The difference is that at that time we didn't have the wealth of video coverage we do today. Practically everything this man does outside of his home and other personal spaces is taped.
I knew that racism, sexism, ableism, ageism and the rest of the isms were firmly entrenched in the beliefs of some people, in our institutions and the culture at large. I am astounded at the reality of how widespread these poisons are in our society, as evidenced by Trumps millions of followers.
I don't buy it for a second that not everyone who supports him is racist or sexist, etc. Of course they are! No one in this day and age gets a pass for not knowing that these things are wrong. They, of course, have a right to believe whatever they want as protected by our constitution. But, it doesn't make it right or sane.
3
"Winning," that's Charlie Sheen's, he should sue the Donald. Trump would understand.
How is it Trump's fault that rabble rousers are causing violence at his rallies? These events are paid for by the Trump campaign and held for the Trump supporters. This is not a city council meeting where all sides should be heard. Campaign events should not be attacked by supporters of other candidates!
3
Well, the Good News is that Hillary has hardly any protesters at her events, which clearly indicates that she's by far the best candidate. Take a googol on the term "protesters at hillary's rallies". Well, yeah, there's the BLM protesters, but we don't have to pay attention to that, because, you know, well... you just don't.
About the only thing I could find on the first googol page (you don't have to go further than that) about Hillary protesters was this:
"Man Holding Protest Sign Removed From Clinton Event In Dallas"
http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2015/11/17/man-holding-protest-sign-removed-from...
[Full disclosure: The googol reported "About 20,800,000 results (0.48 seconds)" Of completely relevant results, as we all know. Which to the uninformed sounds like a lot until you remember that you don't have to pay attention to this statistic if it conflicts with your pre-conceived notions.]
Anyhow. Look at the size of that guy's sign. It has to be what, three, or even four inches tall? And gosh, at least seven or eight inches wide? That is SOOOO disruptive! I have no idea how Hillary managed to keep on keepin' on after such a disruption. She's brave! Very brave.
So yeah! Vote for Hillary! At this point, what does it matter?
About the only thing I could find on the first googol page (you don't have to go further than that) about Hillary protesters was this:
"Man Holding Protest Sign Removed From Clinton Event In Dallas"
http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2015/11/17/man-holding-protest-sign-removed-from...
[Full disclosure: The googol reported "About 20,800,000 results (0.48 seconds)" Of completely relevant results, as we all know. Which to the uninformed sounds like a lot until you remember that you don't have to pay attention to this statistic if it conflicts with your pre-conceived notions.]
Anyhow. Look at the size of that guy's sign. It has to be what, three, or even four inches tall? And gosh, at least seven or eight inches wide? That is SOOOO disruptive! I have no idea how Hillary managed to keep on keepin' on after such a disruption. She's brave! Very brave.
So yeah! Vote for Hillary! At this point, what does it matter?
1
Protests and heckling have long been part of American politics. A group known as Code Pink has created headaches for the President Obama during speaking engagements, as well as the convention speech of VP nominee Paul Ryan to name a few. The difference is that those provocations were dealt with responsibly and peacefully by everyone concerned. The situation at Trump rallies seems unprecedented in modern American campaigning.
3
Trump is starting to be like a KKK rally, and we are starting to hear the same arguments: that the KKK has a right to free speech, a right to peaceable assembly, a right to the free speech for unpopular views.
It's a thin line as to where the protection for hate-speech stops. Trump's people don't seem to be coming to hear any sort of "political views" in any ordinary meaning -- it's increasingly looking like the attraction is intimidation and violence. Surrogates like Ann Coulter are stoking it with calls for more.
Trump is becoming a white-power goon candidate, peddling a neo-fascist personality-cult. It is scary that this is attracting the degree of support that it is, and hardly surprising that major opposition is rising too.
Those who are "for" Trump must think about what is it that you are for? There doesn't appear to be much "for" here ... only "against" and "burn it down" and "I want to hurt somebody."
It's a thin line as to where the protection for hate-speech stops. Trump's people don't seem to be coming to hear any sort of "political views" in any ordinary meaning -- it's increasingly looking like the attraction is intimidation and violence. Surrogates like Ann Coulter are stoking it with calls for more.
Trump is becoming a white-power goon candidate, peddling a neo-fascist personality-cult. It is scary that this is attracting the degree of support that it is, and hardly surprising that major opposition is rising too.
Those who are "for" Trump must think about what is it that you are for? There doesn't appear to be much "for" here ... only "against" and "burn it down" and "I want to hurt somebody."
48
The KKK does have a right to free speech. But that right also protects the protest against it. I only disagree with you in your assessment that Trump is becoming a white-power goon candidate. He IS, from the day he announced his candidacy and demonized Mexican people.
The problem with righteous liberals is that they think they have the right to eliminate others freedom of speech.
By shutting down the meeting in Chicago, protestors displayed that they are fascists when it suits them.
By shutting down the meeting in Chicago, protestors displayed that they are fascists when it suits them.
5
Protestors didn't shut down the meeting. The Donnie did because he didn't thave the guts to face them. He then lied about the situation, claiming the police recommended he not appear. The police themselves say thet were not consulted, not did they recommend Trump not appear. The violence began occuring AFTER The Donnie turned tail and fled.
The trouble with righteous cons is they can't tell fact from fiction.
The trouble with righteous cons is they can't tell fact from fiction.
3
Bill--
No one that supports the first amendment would be involved in trying to prevent free speech, regardless of their views on the content. No liberal organizations, or the ACLU. I'm a member of the liberal party, and the recent e-mail messages to the membership have been about the attempts to halt free speech, and contacting our local representatives to halt the attempts. in this instance, political views are of little or no interest.
Righteous liberals? I'm not sure if trying to support constitutional rights for everyone is righteous.
No one that supports the first amendment would be involved in trying to prevent free speech, regardless of their views on the content. No liberal organizations, or the ACLU. I'm a member of the liberal party, and the recent e-mail messages to the membership have been about the attempts to halt free speech, and contacting our local representatives to halt the attempts. in this instance, political views are of little or no interest.
Righteous liberals? I'm not sure if trying to support constitutional rights for everyone is righteous.
Jerry Springer Nation is shamefully alive and well and taking over the presidential race. Ludicrous! I am glad that my son is too young to witness any of this hate mongering but worry about what this means for his future and the future of our country.
3
My hope has always been that this election would allow people to come out of the shadows and into the light. That has happened, but it's been the wrong people taking advantage of the chance. The problem is, despite there being very little chance Trump will be elected president, these people recently coming out of the shadows will still be with us and unafraid to lash out. One thing about which Hillary and I agree, it's not unlike the lynch mobs of our past.
There is only one thing to hate, hate itself. It isn't just the Republican Party that is tearing itself apart, it's the country too.
There is only one thing to hate, hate itself. It isn't just the Republican Party that is tearing itself apart, it's the country too.
3
Your editorial will surely be applauded by your readers. There is little to like about Donald Trump. What concerns this reader is your predisposition for the alternative. I am not the only reader (I read their daily remarks in your blogs) who has noticed a pronounced trend in which you give more coverage and deference to Secretary Clinton while often slighting Senator Sanders. This is not the standard that your great newspaper has set for generations. I have been reading The Times for 45 years (my late father before me read it throughout his life) and never have I seen such bias in your reportage. Are you so immune to honest criticism by your readership that our words fall on deaf ears? I worry about the decline of newspapers and their role as the nation's watchdogs. You of all newspapers have a sacred trust to defend. I still believe in your noble legacy and hope you will come to your senses about the quiet revolution underway below your radar. I may be wrong, but when the polls close today in the key primary states we will all be watching, it will be a wake up call from the mass media myopia that has blinded too many of our citizens of late.
8
It seems to me that most of the trouble, by far, is instigated by Trump opponents.
10
I hate to say this about any politician in this country, but I'm reading a book on the early days of Naziism, and Trump's rhetoric strikes me as somewhat similar to Hitler's during the early days. I'm not saying that the U.S. will turn into the Nazi regime - just that Trump's tactics (scapegoating ethnic groups, using language that encourages violence against anyone who disagrees with him, meeting any kind of criticism with violent speech and PERSONAL, not POLITICAL, over-sensitivity, to a "make America great again" and "America is the greatest country on earth" mentality, lying continually, and exploiting and fanning the flames of economic discontent among people who feel wronged rather than building a positive vision for the future. Really, really familiar language. Disturbing. Not saying it would go any further than this in this country (we have a lot of checks and balances in place), but the rhetoric itself is eerily similar.
5
Someone should probably point out that it is democrats trolling republican rallies, shouting down speakers, causing trouble, rioting to get Trump's rally cancelled in Chicago, and finally literally charging the stage in Dayton and having to be tackled by the secret service.
Republicans have done none of these things at democratic rallies. So the "violence" seems 100 percent one-sided.
Republicans have done none of these things at democratic rallies. So the "violence" seems 100 percent one-sided.
5
That's an inconvenient truth. Their tactics are straight out of Alinsky's Rules For Radicals: agitate, using physical and psychological taunting; provoke a violent response; redefine the reality to make the aggressors the victims. The Sanders camp is obviously behind this maneuver.
3
America's reputation around the world has nose dived as a result of Donald Trump's campaign.
The election of Senator Bernie Sanders as president in November could single handedly raise America's reputation to a level not seen for years!
The election of Senator Bernie Sanders as president in November could single handedly raise America's reputation to a level not seen for years!
4
Oh come now! His call to stop Muslims from entering the U.S. without closer examination and stopping illegal immigration from our southern border that has already brought in over 11,000,000 illegal aliens sounds a lot like the kind of strenuous debate taking place in your country right now. Let me tell you what I care about. I care about a safe America. And our reputation around the world isn't giving us any bragging rights anyway these days.
3
I think it is worth noting that the source of the security concern of violence at Trump rallies is NOT THE PROTESTORS. His followeres are the instigators and uniformly the protestors are the targets. And Trump's cancellation of his rallies are not really out of a deep sense of concern and responsibility for the welfare of all attending. It is about bad press. In a campaign that is more performance art than a substantial addressing of issues appearances are everything.
5
When you're rich as nearly the whole of Manhattan is, it is easy to be genteel. You've got armies of police to protect you from the riff raff. Your social institutions lift you from the common folk, the white trash you despise and the blacks and latinos you fear. You are the people who rely on the rough men ready to do violence so you can sleep at night (Orwell). You are Trump. You just don't like looking in the mirror and seeing his ugly orange scowl.
3
I'm amazed at all this nonsense in the comments about the "tyranny of political correctness," and how the protesters at Trump rallies (and in editorial pages) are "undermining the democratic process," denying Trump and his supporters their constitutional free speech rights. Protest is a fundamental part of the democratic process. The First Amendment protects the speech rights of protesters just as much as those of political candidates. And exercising the right to protest is an essential way that Americans defend ourselves against threats like Trump's racist, facist, authoritarian, and pro-violence movement.
6
This is a poor analysis. Protest outside private halls is protected speech. Persons protesting outside have every right, and should not be interfered with. Persons protesting inside are interfering with the free speech rights of others. Would it be ok for 10,000 Trump supporters to descend on every Sanders (or Clinton, or Cruz) rally, making it impossible for the event to continue? You may think so, but those were the sorts of tactics used by fascists everywhere. You should try especially to protect speech you disagree with.
1
This editorial would have a lot more resonance if it wasn't directly next to the article "How Trump Lives, as Told by His Butler."
1
They love the violence, Trump, the republican party, the press, they all derive their relevence from the violence. Relevance is something all of the aforementioned have lost as the body of American society starts to reject the virus of a rigged political system and the parasite that is the sociopath Trump.
How I can't wait for the fever to break.
How I can't wait for the fever to break.
3
The GOP doesn't really care that The Donnie encourages violence, uses offensive language, insults women and minorities, lies with stunning regularity or has a long history of businesses failures and fraud. (His hateful rhetoric echoes what many GOP have long insinuated through dog whistles or by complicit silence.) They only care that he is a wild card who may not fall into step with their agenda.
5
NYTimes coverage of Trump is more biased than Fox coverage of Obama.
Trump's rally venues are private property. There is no First Amendment right against private parties on private property, The protesters are trespassers and the law prescribes an ever escalating series of lawful steps - terminating in deadly force - to remove them.
They are allowed to protest outside the venue and and that right ends at the entrance.
Trump's rally venues are private property. There is no First Amendment right against private parties on private property, The protesters are trespassers and the law prescribes an ever escalating series of lawful steps - terminating in deadly force - to remove them.
They are allowed to protest outside the venue and and that right ends at the entrance.
4
deadly force? for protesting??
3
Three hurrahs to the North Carolina sheriff who wants to charge Trump with inciting a riot.
4
Trump seems to make-up things as he goes along. So, of course he doesn't use a tele-prompter: they are generally used to present coherent, rational thought. Prima Donald, on the other hand, seems to be all over the place!
When he is forced to address his complete lack of knowledge regarding foreign affairs, he claims to be: "...the most militaristic person." And it shows! He seems to lead with sue, sue, sue. But then, he claims to be a "Unifier", and says that he doesn't like violence. So, which is it, Donald?
http://thetruthoncommonsense.com
When he is forced to address his complete lack of knowledge regarding foreign affairs, he claims to be: "...the most militaristic person." And it shows! He seems to lead with sue, sue, sue. But then, he claims to be a "Unifier", and says that he doesn't like violence. So, which is it, Donald?
http://thetruthoncommonsense.com
2
Funny, I read in a Matt Taibbi Rolling Stone piece couple of weeks ago, how at the rallies he (MT) attended, Trump repeatedly hammered the fact that Congress had written Medicare Part D so as to deny the program the ability to negotiate drug prices. So how does that translate into not having "a single solid, truthful idea about how to address the roots of this seething anger"?
2
You guys don't get it. No matter how bad you try to make Trump look he is going to win. The people feel the establishment has taken advantage of them long enough and Trump is their revenge on Washington.
If the media would do there job it would not be necessary to have a Trump.
If the media would do there job it would not be necessary to have a Trump.
3
Art, I agree the corporate media has failed in their role as the Fourth Estate. But voting for The Donnie to get "even" with DC is like getting back at the bully who punched you in the right eye by punhcng yourself in the left eye.
1
“It’s all about standing up for freedom of speech for us,” Ms. Versalie said. “Nobody should be running a campaign on fear and bigotry.”
Silencing others in the name, of all things, free speech. Good luck with that.
Silencing others in the name, of all things, free speech. Good luck with that.
4
In Texas, showing up to protest against vile odious and irrational discourse may be regarded as trying to " silence...free speech."
In the America I grew up in, peaceful protest was regarded as profoundly democratic; in fact is is exactly what is meant by freedom of speech and assembly.
Freedom of speech allows one to say vicious and stupid stuff; it does not protect from the contempt and opprobrium generated in response.
In the America I grew up in, peaceful protest was regarded as profoundly democratic; in fact is is exactly what is meant by freedom of speech and assembly.
Freedom of speech allows one to say vicious and stupid stuff; it does not protect from the contempt and opprobrium generated in response.
1
It takes self confidence to be a businessman/promoter. What does it take to make promises that a beyond the realm of possibility? Donald Trump. That's where the Republicans are headed. It is easy to see this from his business record, which is one of spectacular success and dismal failures based on lies and assumptions that had nothing to do with reality.
4
What is missing from this editorial is any recognition of the apparent desire of some protestors to stir up trouble at Trump rallies, and to get on the news. "Disruption" seems to be becoming an acceptable form of (or substitute for) political discourse. No, it doesn't justify violence, nor should violence be encouraged. But neither should people go looking for trouble, under the guise of free speech. How about you have your rally, your opponents will have their rally, and we'll all decide in November, at the ballot box?
6
I knew this was going to be an awful election season. Look at how many more months we've got to endure it. How hateful and riled up can people become until it all boils over? And with people armed to the teeth in this country, when will the first shots be fired?
I guess maybe we can rest knowing the Repubs will not try to throw the election to Trumps' favor - like they did for G.W.
Vote responsibly in November!
I guess maybe we can rest knowing the Repubs will not try to throw the election to Trumps' favor - like they did for G.W.
Vote responsibly in November!
11
How utterly stupid and self-revealing this editorial is! Mr. Trump's "vile" campaign? Let us blame the editors of this paper for the current horrific problems America faces -- for not vetting Mr. Obama the way conservatives are scrutinized. Perhaps all of this comes from Mr. Trump so honestly assessing you and your paper as "the worst."
6
It has been a mystery to me why we don’t hear of the similarity between the Trump phenomenon and the Weimar of the thirties. The National Socialists were ranting against foreigners, local enemies such as the Jews and the communists (“Bolsheviks”) and their own Government; and they were promising a “Great Third Reich”. Yet never got more than thirty odd percent of the popular vote and still ended up with the Chancellorship and power. Incitement to power was part and parcel f the Nazi propaganda. Does that sound familiar?
Your editorial implies that the people who support Trump may not been as red necks as the diatribes they listen to, but are “simply upset with .. the bad hand” they’ve been dealt. To the extent that there are many aggrieved Americans, they’re not obvious among the Trump people who all seem fell-fed, well-shod and overwhelmingly White.
Your editorial implies that the people who support Trump may not been as red necks as the diatribes they listen to, but are “simply upset with .. the bad hand” they’ve been dealt. To the extent that there are many aggrieved Americans, they’re not obvious among the Trump people who all seem fell-fed, well-shod and overwhelmingly White.
3
Another ironic editorial from the paper that allowed a convicted terrorist to incite MORE violence on the US Government on September 11, 2001. So what next, blame Trump for 9/11 because Trump sometime before "provoked" the attackers ?
I have news, it's actually back firing on you.
I have news, it's actually back firing on you.
3
Does no one study history? It seems we are doomed to repeat again the horrors of the past.
5
Sadly, few even bother to study the present, much less the past. And that is a tragedy.
Megalomaniac mental instability is turning into the apt description of Donald Trump's capacity for leadership.
He's more like a William Randolph Hearst, than any thoughtful public servant. It seems the more this campaign goes on his mental instability becomes more evident and more of an issue.
Does the American voter actually think this guy that acts like a spoiled child who has always gotten his way can not only bully the voting public, but the world?
Donald Trump is the personification of what used to be known as the Ugly American.
He's more like a William Randolph Hearst, than any thoughtful public servant. It seems the more this campaign goes on his mental instability becomes more evident and more of an issue.
Does the American voter actually think this guy that acts like a spoiled child who has always gotten his way can not only bully the voting public, but the world?
Donald Trump is the personification of what used to be known as the Ugly American.
10
Simple, ban the media from Trump events and the violence instigated by protesters aka attention-seekers stops. As a famous person asked, does it happen if the cameras aren't there to record it?
2
Laws are not just "for the little people." Trump should be arrested for incitement to riot. Here is the federal statute.
(a) Whoever travels in interstate or foreign commerce or uses any facility of interstate or foreign commerce, including, but not limited to, the mail, telegraph, telephone, radio, or television, with intent - (1) to incite a riot; or (2) to organize, promote, encourage, participate in, or carry on a riot; or (3) to commit any act of violence in furtherance of a riot; or (4) to aid or abet any person in inciting or participating in or carrying on a riot or committing any act of violence in furtherance of a riot; and who either during the course of any such travel or use or thereafter performs or attempts to perform any other overt act for any purpose specified in subparagraph (A), (B), (C), or (D) of this paragraph - (!1) Shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.
(a) Whoever travels in interstate or foreign commerce or uses any facility of interstate or foreign commerce, including, but not limited to, the mail, telegraph, telephone, radio, or television, with intent - (1) to incite a riot; or (2) to organize, promote, encourage, participate in, or carry on a riot; or (3) to commit any act of violence in furtherance of a riot; or (4) to aid or abet any person in inciting or participating in or carrying on a riot or committing any act of violence in furtherance of a riot; and who either during the course of any such travel or use or thereafter performs or attempts to perform any other overt act for any purpose specified in subparagraph (A), (B), (C), or (D) of this paragraph - (!1) Shall be fined under this title, or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.
6
The Trump campaign gives license to the idea that both parties in power have been working at cross-purposes to their own people for 25 years. Populists are not created in a vacuum. They come when government fails large swaths of the electorate as it has with foreign trade. The jig is up. The establishment fears Trump, not for his antics, vulgarity or bigotry, but rather because they realize that Trump has made a strong case that on some very important issues, the very people we elected to office sold us down the river.
1
After reading the article in today's NYT piece about Mr. Trump's butler, I am convinced that we are now seeing the culmination of a lifetime of corporate abuse. I'm not talking about finances, I am referring to the psychological effects that money has on those that are fortunate (or in the end, unfortunate) enough to have more than can be imagined. Mr. Senecal speaks of the many ways that he panders to Mr. Trump and has for 30 years. He speaks of the lies that Mr. Trump sows on a daily basis and how he has learned to simply "play along." The crass nature of Trump isn't new....his narcissistic mental dysfunction is borne of a lifetime of coddling, money paving the way for softening lies and illegal criminal activities. Trump has never had to be truthful nor accountable. By surrounding himself with people that will literally bow to him as he passes, he is accustomed to being treated like royalty even tho his idea of royalty is equivalent to being an almighty dictator.
Trump is rollicking in this mess he has created. His slogan is no longer applicable. He is definitely not making America Great Again. He is defaming her, minimizing her and shaming her all in the name of his grand game of phony intelligence and persuasive charm. (it hurts to use that word in regard to a man so revolting)
Hail to Cesar only works in a casino where the players are duped by the House. Trump's out-sized mental incompetence is only matched by his sick, pathological need to feed the monster.
Trump is rollicking in this mess he has created. His slogan is no longer applicable. He is definitely not making America Great Again. He is defaming her, minimizing her and shaming her all in the name of his grand game of phony intelligence and persuasive charm. (it hurts to use that word in regard to a man so revolting)
Hail to Cesar only works in a casino where the players are duped by the House. Trump's out-sized mental incompetence is only matched by his sick, pathological need to feed the monster.
71
What's truly amazing isn't Trump, but his grassroots supporters who believe he's the cure of what ails this country. These aren't necessarily the stereotypical disenfranchised mouth breather, these are educated people who live in relative comfort, who were spared financial disaster brought on by the likes of crooked business leaders like Trump. Trump is the ultimate symbol of everything that is wrong with American business and culture. He symbolizes the lack of accountability. His entire business life is strife with never being held accountable for poor decision making, his myriad bankruptcies and failings have come at the cost of his investors, employees and the tax payers. Now he is chasing after a job that will have power of life and death over hundreds of thousands of our soldiers, the health and well being of millions of citizens, and ability to wage war on foreign countries.
Trump has repeatedly said he was unaware of the decisions that his management made in his failed businesses, he has said he is not responsible for the violence that he incites at his appearances, he is not responsible for his infidelities in his personal life. Trump is a liar, cheater and a shrewd crook. Exactly what are the values that his supporters are voting for? Plain talking? Hyperbole aside, we must remember it was the average citizen who voted in the cults of personality in the Hitler's, Mussolini's and the Stalin's. What has happened to this country?
Trump has repeatedly said he was unaware of the decisions that his management made in his failed businesses, he has said he is not responsible for the violence that he incites at his appearances, he is not responsible for his infidelities in his personal life. Trump is a liar, cheater and a shrewd crook. Exactly what are the values that his supporters are voting for? Plain talking? Hyperbole aside, we must remember it was the average citizen who voted in the cults of personality in the Hitler's, Mussolini's and the Stalin's. What has happened to this country?
7
Just watched a video of the Chicago protestors. Quite an angry crowd. It took a police line to hold them back. They kept shoving the police and had to be restrained.
Also read a report by a Chicago police officer that there were protestors running through a parking lot breaking the windows of cars with Trump stickers.
Soros and MoveOn.Org are planning more of these protests. Why not hold them responsible for the violence of the protesters?
Also read a report by a Chicago police officer that there were protestors running through a parking lot breaking the windows of cars with Trump stickers.
Soros and MoveOn.Org are planning more of these protests. Why not hold them responsible for the violence of the protesters?
9
The video showed protesters blocking an ambulance trying to get through the crowd.
4
We've arrived at the moment where the reality tv/entertainment complex is about to launch a hostile takeover of the White House, and it's no joke.
This isn't about people being "fed up" with the "Washington Status Quo".
That's what Trump's supporters are telling you it's about, and the punditocracy breathlessly relays their stupidity like Moses presenting the ten commandments.
This is about ignorant and stupid people who have been brainwashed by FoX, reality television and one dimensional action movies and are now demanding to be entertained 24/7.
They think this is funny, but it's clearly not. It's sick.
The GOP machine nurtured this proudly ignorant "constituency" for two generations plus and now it is threatening to take this country over a cliff.
The "distraction" has become the "reality".
I hope they're happy.
This isn't about people being "fed up" with the "Washington Status Quo".
That's what Trump's supporters are telling you it's about, and the punditocracy breathlessly relays their stupidity like Moses presenting the ten commandments.
This is about ignorant and stupid people who have been brainwashed by FoX, reality television and one dimensional action movies and are now demanding to be entertained 24/7.
They think this is funny, but it's clearly not. It's sick.
The GOP machine nurtured this proudly ignorant "constituency" for two generations plus and now it is threatening to take this country over a cliff.
The "distraction" has become the "reality".
I hope they're happy.
5
I'm not a Trump supporter, but I feel that kind of hostile takeover is preferable to the one launched by the guy who sat in Reverend Wright's church for twenty years.
We've seen the results of that hostile takeover and one of those results is Donald Trump himself.
We've seen the results of that hostile takeover and one of those results is Donald Trump himself.
3
"This is about ignorant and stupid people who have been brainwashed by FoX, reality television and one dimensional action movies and are now demanding to be entertained 24/7"
I rest my case.
I rest my case.
1
When my kids were toddlers and I said something or told them to do something they didn't like they would sit down and yell at me, sometimes having a tantrum. sometimes striking out at me or each other, and blame each other for their misbehavior's. My older son caught in this age by autism never did learn to totally curb these behaviors when confronted. My younger son did learn to curb his behavior and even to listen to explanations on why his behavior was unacceptable. He no longer sits downs, screams or strikes out when confronted. He learned to express his beliefs in proper English and to give reasons for what he did or wants to do. He has also learned to take blame and consequences for any incorrect actions.
We have a candidate that seems to not have matured. He appeals to that inner child in those people who seem to be caught in the "Its their fault" age of childhood and cannot admit that they might have been wrong. It is easier to listen to someone say what you want to hear and that they have all the solutions, though they tell you none, than to read, study and analyse problems for yourself and develop your own ideas on issues, then make a choice as to the person you think will best institute those ideas.
Trump and many of his followers, cannot bear someone telling them they might be wrong. They cannot properly express themselves with thoughts, ideas, and plans to execute those ideas and so childishly they yell and strike out at those that challenge them.
We have a candidate that seems to not have matured. He appeals to that inner child in those people who seem to be caught in the "Its their fault" age of childhood and cannot admit that they might have been wrong. It is easier to listen to someone say what you want to hear and that they have all the solutions, though they tell you none, than to read, study and analyse problems for yourself and develop your own ideas on issues, then make a choice as to the person you think will best institute those ideas.
Trump and many of his followers, cannot bear someone telling them they might be wrong. They cannot properly express themselves with thoughts, ideas, and plans to execute those ideas and so childishly they yell and strike out at those that challenge them.
4
The rise of Trump is due to the 3 card monte scheme Republicans have run for years. They promise fiscal sanity and deliver deficits and debt. Trump appeals to angry voters whose lives the political establishment have eroded with corporate and investor skewed trade deals. People can see their bought politicians have sold them out for campaign cash and it doesn't take much of a provocation to push the fringe element over the edge into violence. Since Fox "News" came into being, in the world of the Republican rank and file, facts don't matter so you can do all the explaining to them that you want and they will disregard any rationality. Obama's birth certificate is just one example of this. The convention in Cleveland will rival Chicago of 68.
2
I just have a bad feeling about all of this, a foreboding. Like, an innocent(s) will be paying the price and not the one who should, Mr Trump.
3
Back in Germany of the late 20s, it was brown shirts & Communists brawling in the streets and beer halls.
I fear it's only a matter of time before Trump fans and Bernie Bros go down that path, literally street fighting. Thanks to exceedingly flexible gun laws, it could escalate very easily.
I fear it's only a matter of time before Trump fans and Bernie Bros go down that path, literally street fighting. Thanks to exceedingly flexible gun laws, it could escalate very easily.
2
A gang of violent protesters Invade a peaceful political rally and the story is about the victim's violence and not about his First Anendment right to speak being infringed upon? Typical NY Times pretzel logic.
5
today in the Times is an interview with Donald's Butler. I think it is telling in the extreme that if one desires a window on the Trump soul, one can interview employees, sycophants, campaign staff, ex-mistresses offspring perhaps...this guy has NO friends.
3
The art of the deal is to lie, cheat, steal and incite hate, fear and violence. Good Job DT - you win.
1
If a group of white men, those who are blamed for every social ill in the United States, shouted down, Hillary or Bernie at one of their rallies because they didn't like being blamed for everything, whose fault would that be? If this same group of white men wore T-shirts that said if you are for Hillary or Bernie "you get thumped" whose fault would that be? If they tore up signs, shot guns into the air, pushed and shoved anyone who looked like a Hillary or Bernie supporter whose fault would that be?
Yellow journalism at its finest. Keep lying it only helps Trump.
Yellow journalism at its finest. Keep lying it only helps Trump.
5
C'mon, "Fourth Estate" and "Fifth Estate", stop writing about him (he who shall not be named, at least not by me).
1
There is one factor in Donald Trump's life, long into the past and currently, that we need to all grasp: he has no understanding of the concept called "truth". He thinks truth is what he says it is, what he can get people to believe. If they believe it, accept it and act on it, he's had his great victory.
His Taj Mahal casino in Atlantic City was built on an enormous lie, the promise that it could turn 1 million dollars a day in take from the gamblers. Didn't come close. Over and over again, Trump has promised investors and banks that he can do miracles, turning pig's ears into gold. Because of his overblown self confidence, because of the publicity he attracted in his early days, because his projects were always seen as over the top extravaganzas, he got away with it, again and again, failing repeatedly, succeeding occasionally. What is so different between Trump's methods and a Ponzi scheme? One difference, he says, is that he always comes out on top. The bankers, investors, employees and suppliers? Not so much.
Truth is the most important element in critical decision making, the kind presidents face daily. Knowing it, finding it and speaking it are fundamental concepts of leadership. Since Trump knows no truth beyond that which spews from his wide mouth, he would try to carry out the same con game on the American public. We, and our country, would be in great danger, all the time.
His Taj Mahal casino in Atlantic City was built on an enormous lie, the promise that it could turn 1 million dollars a day in take from the gamblers. Didn't come close. Over and over again, Trump has promised investors and banks that he can do miracles, turning pig's ears into gold. Because of his overblown self confidence, because of the publicity he attracted in his early days, because his projects were always seen as over the top extravaganzas, he got away with it, again and again, failing repeatedly, succeeding occasionally. What is so different between Trump's methods and a Ponzi scheme? One difference, he says, is that he always comes out on top. The bankers, investors, employees and suppliers? Not so much.
Truth is the most important element in critical decision making, the kind presidents face daily. Knowing it, finding it and speaking it are fundamental concepts of leadership. Since Trump knows no truth beyond that which spews from his wide mouth, he would try to carry out the same con game on the American public. We, and our country, would be in great danger, all the time.
4
Donald Trump is exactly what happens when you have political agenda that works on lies and fear and a media that refuses to properly cover it. Why hasn't "fox news" been properly refuted by the NYT. Why hasn't the propaganda that the republican party been spouting for decades been properly unmasked by the NYT. Nixon was a solid politician but a deranged alcoholic. Reagan was an actor, and bad one at that, that acted as a president but was a bigot, homophobe, and war monger. What about W. A former coke addict and alcoholic but he came from the elite so he gets a pass? Dan Rather loses his job because he uncovers the truth about W's service record. Where was the NYT?
As you can tell, I've been reading your newspaper for close to 50 years and the last three decades have been disappointing in the lack proper calibration towards truth and civility.
So, you keep blasting Donald Trump, but remember, it's mainly because you helped create him.
As you can tell, I've been reading your newspaper for close to 50 years and the last three decades have been disappointing in the lack proper calibration towards truth and civility.
So, you keep blasting Donald Trump, but remember, it's mainly because you helped create him.
How can anyone actually trust Donald Trump? He is shown on video saying that "I don't condone violence" and then we see him saying "In the old days this guy (a protester) would go out in a stretcher." Followed by suggestions to punch protesters along with Trumps promises to pay the legal fees of anybody that assaults a protester at one of his rallies. He is either a blatant liar, or just can't remember what he says from day to day.
3
Oh please. You go somewhere with the intent to start trouble, then blame Trump's supporters for reacting?
I know you are totally in the tank for Hillary but try to at least maintain the pretense of objectivity.
I know you are totally in the tank for Hillary but try to at least maintain the pretense of objectivity.
6
Violent protesters invade Trump rallies and refuse to let him speak and the story is about Trump being violent and not about his first amendment rights being infringed? Typical NY Times pretzel logic
6
While Trump certainly has to own the rhetoric which cranks his supporters up it takes two to tango. These protesters are showing up hoping to make a scene and become the story. Violence has no place in our political system but if you show up to make trouble and you find trouble it is on you as well.
7
Democrats have used the tactic of inciting racial animosity to motivate more Black voters.These include
Political ads resurrecting film footage of Selma Alabama in 50 years ago
Political rhetoric victimizing Blacks
Cries of "racially slanted mass incarceration" while ignoring racially slanted crime rates.
Focusing on a handful of serious police abuses while disregarding the epidemic of violent crime including a shooting every 4 hours in Chicago alone and over 400 homicides in Baltimore alone.
Angry rhetoric begets violence whether from Trump or Democrats.
Political ads resurrecting film footage of Selma Alabama in 50 years ago
Political rhetoric victimizing Blacks
Cries of "racially slanted mass incarceration" while ignoring racially slanted crime rates.
Focusing on a handful of serious police abuses while disregarding the epidemic of violent crime including a shooting every 4 hours in Chicago alone and over 400 homicides in Baltimore alone.
Angry rhetoric begets violence whether from Trump or Democrats.
5
When the democrats start telling their base to assault their opponents so much so that they are carried out on a stretcher (like the "good old days"), get back to me. When Democrats mention closing churches and barring Christians from entering the country, get back to me. When Democrats advocate torture of suspected terrorists and killing families of terrorists, get back to me.
Until then take your dishonest false equivalencies somewhere where they will be appreciated, like a KKK rally. Or, the near equivalent: A Trump rally.
Until then take your dishonest false equivalencies somewhere where they will be appreciated, like a KKK rally. Or, the near equivalent: A Trump rally.
1
And what about racially-slanted poverty?
2
I can see how "motivating Black voters" would definitely justify encouraging violence, I assume by White Trump fans.
I get lost at the "disregarding the epidemic of violent crime". I might be mistaken, but I seem to see articles on violent crime everywhere.
I think the cause of all the attention on the "serious police abuses" is in spite of the fact they are allowed to use deadly force, in all its variants, due to their public safety duties. Not sure where that leaves the judiciary in that equation though. I thought it was the duty of the police to apprehend suspects and the judiciary to determine guilt and punishment. Thanks for clearing that up.
I get lost at the "disregarding the epidemic of violent crime". I might be mistaken, but I seem to see articles on violent crime everywhere.
I think the cause of all the attention on the "serious police abuses" is in spite of the fact they are allowed to use deadly force, in all its variants, due to their public safety duties. Not sure where that leaves the judiciary in that equation though. I thought it was the duty of the police to apprehend suspects and the judiciary to determine guilt and punishment. Thanks for clearing that up.
2
OK, fine, everybody agrees that Trump is a disaster waiting to happen. The question arises of who to replace him with. Cruz is even scarier than Trump.
1
Any disagreement drives violence in the hands of demagogues like Donald Trump. They live in the confidence that they will be protected and the media headlines will fire up their supporters.
Last Sunday, more than 3 million Brazilians filled the streets of the country's main cities calling (loudly) for the impeachment of President Dilma and the conviction for corruption of her mentor, former President Lula.
What is truly amazing and a valuable lesson is that despite the passionate feelings of the crowds, there was no violence. It was a peaceful demonstration of unrestricted free expression.
The contrast between this and the pugnacious atmosphere surrounding the Trump surreality circus is enormous.
Perhaps we have something to learn from the Brazilians about civility and free speech.
Last Sunday, more than 3 million Brazilians filled the streets of the country's main cities calling (loudly) for the impeachment of President Dilma and the conviction for corruption of her mentor, former President Lula.
What is truly amazing and a valuable lesson is that despite the passionate feelings of the crowds, there was no violence. It was a peaceful demonstration of unrestricted free expression.
The contrast between this and the pugnacious atmosphere surrounding the Trump surreality circus is enormous.
Perhaps we have something to learn from the Brazilians about civility and free speech.
1
The "editorial" bored me. There is no who, what, when and why just propaganda worthy of Stalin or Gobbles. The NYT staff rants about Trump's hate while vilifying the man in it's own hate filled screed. The language of violence and hatred of perceived ideological opponents permeates the editorial and opinion pages of this once great newspaper every day while the same "editors" wring their bloody hands in anguish at the polarization and death of healthy political discourse. The great H.L. Mencken, who is turning over in his grave at this point, once said " A newspaper is a device for making the ignorant more ignorant and the crazy more crazier". Mencken loved newspapers, journalism, and the English language. However he knew some organizations, mostly tabloids in his time, would descend into intolerant partisan bullies occasionally and needed to be called to account. The Times he knew would never have lowered itself to this level because it had editors to which the ethics and tenets of journalism were sacred. This is not true today and you should be ashamed.
9
God bless you Winston.
I was just in Rome, Italy and flew through London to get there. As I always do during the Obama presidency when I travel overseas, I felt ashamed by my country. The rest of the world sees the ridiculousness of the American press and laughs at us every day.
I was just in Rome, Italy and flew through London to get there. As I always do during the Obama presidency when I travel overseas, I felt ashamed by my country. The rest of the world sees the ridiculousness of the American press and laughs at us every day.
2
As someone said on NPR .. he just took off the "dog whistle" that the other 3 are still wearing and using... they are all frightening.........
2
Trump "cowered"? He turned around as a crazed ISIS acolyte jumped the barrier and rushed the stage.
The rhetoric of the New York Times and other left-leaning outlets have put Trump supporters and the candidate himself in great danger.
They've encouraged their most radical and anarchist elements—from the kind who have shut down college campuses with calls for "muscle" against free speech, to the Black Lives Matter crowd who loot and burn cities like Ferguson and Baltimore.
Many "jokes" have been made in past months as to the assassination of Mr. Trump. Yet this receives nary a peep from the mainstream press. Sarah Silverman, other "comedians," and the press grossly compare Trump to Adolf Hitler. This kind of rhetoric is a green light for crazies.
Building a wall, adopting Israeli-style immigration policies, and being concerned about our citizens' welfare actually benefits the poor and minorities in this country—just not the Third World masses whom the intellectual class wants to dump on its fractured and struggling lower- and working-classes.
Democrats and the press should take care with their charged and slanderous rhetoric, which has actually been proven to have caused violence (urban riots and attacks on Trump supporters in Chicago).
The rhetoric of the New York Times and other left-leaning outlets have put Trump supporters and the candidate himself in great danger.
They've encouraged their most radical and anarchist elements—from the kind who have shut down college campuses with calls for "muscle" against free speech, to the Black Lives Matter crowd who loot and burn cities like Ferguson and Baltimore.
Many "jokes" have been made in past months as to the assassination of Mr. Trump. Yet this receives nary a peep from the mainstream press. Sarah Silverman, other "comedians," and the press grossly compare Trump to Adolf Hitler. This kind of rhetoric is a green light for crazies.
Building a wall, adopting Israeli-style immigration policies, and being concerned about our citizens' welfare actually benefits the poor and minorities in this country—just not the Third World masses whom the intellectual class wants to dump on its fractured and struggling lower- and working-classes.
Democrats and the press should take care with their charged and slanderous rhetoric, which has actually been proven to have caused violence (urban riots and attacks on Trump supporters in Chicago).
6
Donald Trump is a lot smarter than all the carping pundits combined. The Donald knows what he's doing -- and he's changing the face and future of American politics. Going into the launch of his campaign, Trump was given virtually no chance of lasting more than a couple weeks. He's not only lasted but is on the cusp of seizing the nomination. More important, he's showed us how to get American voters to wake up, attend rallies, register and vote. What's more disgraceful than anything Trump has said or done? The fact that politicians at all levels are elected by 10%-20% of the potential electorate.
Sure, there are plenty of people who are repelled by Trump's tactics. But those folks wouldn't vote for Trump anyhow. What we could be seeing now is the start of a political revolution -- which Bernie is his own inimitable style is also advocating -- in which candidates have to win the votes of most of the people whose lives their actions will affect.
Sure, there are plenty of people who are repelled by Trump's tactics. But those folks wouldn't vote for Trump anyhow. What we could be seeing now is the start of a political revolution -- which Bernie is his own inimitable style is also advocating -- in which candidates have to win the votes of most of the people whose lives their actions will affect.
1
Trump is riling up the mob. They are already angry, they want to be surrounded by other angry people, be given a target to hurt, to destroy.
If you aren't with them, you are that target. This is not going to end well, there are only various degrees of bad. Trump does not understand how perilous his own situation is, how quickly this anger will turn against him when the angry people realize that he is using them too.
If you aren't with them, you are that target. This is not going to end well, there are only various degrees of bad. Trump does not understand how perilous his own situation is, how quickly this anger will turn against him when the angry people realize that he is using them too.
2
Moveon.org, Al Sharpton's National Action Network, Occupy Wall Street and Obama's PAC have paid thugs on the ground sent to shut down Trump campaign events.
Let me repeat that.
Paid thugs sent to shut down Trump events.
If you aren't with them, you are the target indeed.
Let me repeat that.
Paid thugs sent to shut down Trump events.
If you aren't with them, you are the target indeed.
2
The video of Trump's response when a protester charged the stage belies the braggadocio of this paper lion. He was shaken, sweating, and panicked. But his bluster survived intact: "I was ready for him!" declared the man who would be king.
Check your Depends, Donald.
Check your Depends, Donald.
1
The Donald is one of the 1%. He can say whatever he wants amd whenever he wants and there are no consequences. I wonder if any one person of the 99% said the same things would be prosecuted for inciting violence. First amendment my eye! Class is a problem in America and should be adressed sooner than later.
2
Then stop doing puff pieces on him! The Times talks out of both sides of its mouth. It is disgusting what has happened to a once great newspaper. Sacrificed on the altar of the Great God Access!
2
Agreed. A story about Trump's Butler- highlighted with a photo of his portrait?
If anyone remembers history, they will recall that in Germany, those who raised the red flags about Hitler waited too long and were too late to stop him. He has already gained the momentum to rise to power - democratically! Let's just hope the US doesn't suffer the same, disasterous fate.
3
I am a Democrat but I disdain its pandering to the likes of Sharpton, etc. who think it is acceptable to be a hoodlum, destructive and break the law if one is African American.
7
And what, exactly, does Al Sharpton have to do with Donald Trump? Do you think that every African American is part of the same conspiracy?
Indeed, I am not alone in feeling that the Times is behaving like a group of sharks,( killer whales are too far up the developmental ladder to denigrate them by comparison with the primitive Times writers and execs), and they are only seeing the blood in the water. As a result they , the News, the Post and papers or similar yellow sheets, are posting the nastiest and bloodiest scenes of political vileness on the front page, just to suck in it's LCD readers-it is click bait meant for lesser readers. I have reduced my deliveries of the paper and am thinking seriously, if the paper does not render these shenanigans to the inside pages, that I will simply end my relationship with the paper, entirely. They have no one to blame but their own sense that blood and violence alone sell papers. That's been obvious since the 1890's but the Times has, historically held back on presentation of gore and meanness for their own sake.
No more is it merely publishing news.
Alas. So goes the once superb and inimitable paper that dared to consider itself all but indispensable.
I would not pollute fish guts with it's used pages anymore.
No more is it merely publishing news.
Alas. So goes the once superb and inimitable paper that dared to consider itself all but indispensable.
I would not pollute fish guts with it's used pages anymore.
1
Well then, why are you (NYTimes), writing about him (he who shall not be named, at least not by me) so frequently ?
Silly is as silly does.
Silly is as silly does.
1
His tactics are built from experiences with reality TV audiences. Serious standards of evidence never enter the mix. He can incite to riot during his rallies and on twitter, then say he decries violence during a personal news interview covered by major media. Then his supporters can cite the media interview as evidence that he does not incite violence.
Along these lines one wonders whom he might select for a VP running mate. Maybe he'd go bipartisan--Jerry Springer? We might get to find out.
Along these lines one wonders whom he might select for a VP running mate. Maybe he'd go bipartisan--Jerry Springer? We might get to find out.
So this is the rhetoric we can anticipate from you when A republican assumes the presidential office? After years of suggesting any criticism of the current inhabitant is racially inspired you immediately jump to the worst kinds of inflammatory criticisms. As you well know, neither democrat candidate allows conservative critics to remain at campaign events. And you can choose to see the "black lives matter" take overs of Hillary and Bernie events events as inspiring. I just see two cowering lefties proving that they lack the guts to make any real change in the society
4
Trump is not violent. All the violence was outside the rally perpetuated by organized 'protestors'. Today (super Tuesday no. 3). Trump will win period.
Trump is ready for America, but are Americans ready for him? Yes.... Trump supporters are as evidenced by their growing numbers. He will win the nomination, will defeat the Dems sending Hilary and Bernie and Obama into eternal exile from Washington.
Trump is ready for America, but are Americans ready for him? Yes.... Trump supporters are as evidenced by their growing numbers. He will win the nomination, will defeat the Dems sending Hilary and Bernie and Obama into eternal exile from Washington.
6
"I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters"
"I'd like to punch him in the face…"
"Knock the hell out of them. I promise you I will pay for the legal fees. I promise."
Donald Trump foments violence.
Hateful rhetoric + one-armed salutes. What does this remind you of?
He's a demagogue. And worse.
"I'd like to punch him in the face…"
"Knock the hell out of them. I promise you I will pay for the legal fees. I promise."
Donald Trump foments violence.
Hateful rhetoric + one-armed salutes. What does this remind you of?
He's a demagogue. And worse.
1
So, now, Trump is blaming Sanders for the violence at Trump rallies which Trump himself is so obviously inciting. The Trump parallels to Mussolini continue to build. Scapegoat the Jew for violence that you yourself incite. #trumpismussolini
You people are outrageous. I certainly have no problem with people protesting at political rallies -- peacefully and respectfully without disrupting the people who are holding the rally, who have paid for the facility, and taken the time to attend.
But that's not what's happening, is it? Many of these so-called protesters are deliberately attempting to stop Trump from speaking. That is in fact what happened in Chicago. You seem to be completely ignoring the fact that these people are attempting to destroy free speech. Where is your outrage about that?
But like most good progressives, it seems like you think free speech is fine fro your side, but not for those with whom you disagree. Should Trump supporters hit these people? No. But the fact is, they are there uninvited, unwanted and they are trying to interrupt the political process. Should these people be throwing tomatoes? Is that free speech? Would I be upset if someone threw a tomato at Trump and the person next to them hit them? Probably. But the police should arrest those who step over the line.
Go ahead, blame the victim. But your tone would be entirely different if protesters had disrupted an Obama rally in 2008 or 2012. And if a bunch of tea party members tried to keep HRC from speaking, I bet the outrage would ooze from your paper.
But that's not what's happening, is it? Many of these so-called protesters are deliberately attempting to stop Trump from speaking. That is in fact what happened in Chicago. You seem to be completely ignoring the fact that these people are attempting to destroy free speech. Where is your outrage about that?
But like most good progressives, it seems like you think free speech is fine fro your side, but not for those with whom you disagree. Should Trump supporters hit these people? No. But the fact is, they are there uninvited, unwanted and they are trying to interrupt the political process. Should these people be throwing tomatoes? Is that free speech? Would I be upset if someone threw a tomato at Trump and the person next to them hit them? Probably. But the police should arrest those who step over the line.
Go ahead, blame the victim. But your tone would be entirely different if protesters had disrupted an Obama rally in 2008 or 2012. And if a bunch of tea party members tried to keep HRC from speaking, I bet the outrage would ooze from your paper.
3
There is a quaint notion among some Trump supporters that he is just saying outrageous things to get our attention. There are many voters who support Trump because he has said something that has resonated with their fear, anger, and resentment. For instance, many of us hate the propaganda that Republican Bushophiles have sold: "Bush protected us after 9/11." Trump's response: "But he did not protect us on 9/11." was very welcomed from any politician. But, it does not excuse the provocations to violence, to torture and murder of entire families. Exciting a crowd with talk of "punching in the face", deportation of 11 million, "fat pig", and familicide may be a tactic but who does it attract and what are the consequences?
Violence is always against mothers, children, the helpless, the elderly, and the sick. Violence cannot be confined to able bodied men who can defend themselves. This is the sick story behind "gun rights" that "equalize" victims of violence who can own a gun. It is irresponsible to advocate violence ever and persons who do must be held accountable, arrested and tried for inciting violence. Civilization demands that violence is never employed in anger.
Violence is always against mothers, children, the helpless, the elderly, and the sick. Violence cannot be confined to able bodied men who can defend themselves. This is the sick story behind "gun rights" that "equalize" victims of violence who can own a gun. It is irresponsible to advocate violence ever and persons who do must be held accountable, arrested and tried for inciting violence. Civilization demands that violence is never employed in anger.
The omnipresent violence just proves it, yes the US is the most ignorant country in history, unless of course the electorate proves me incorrect.
I don't have an answer for any of this, but I do know if I were part of the 1%, I'd be shaking in my boots.
Right now all of this anger is pointed in various directions but all that needs to happen is for the right voice to come along to unite the followers of Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump, who whether they understand it or not, are railing against the same evil, and we'll have a revolution.
That's the real story here. So many, so furious at the inequality in this country. So many without decent jobs. So many left behind.
I've never been happier not to be rich.
Right now all of this anger is pointed in various directions but all that needs to happen is for the right voice to come along to unite the followers of Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump, who whether they understand it or not, are railing against the same evil, and we'll have a revolution.
That's the real story here. So many, so furious at the inequality in this country. So many without decent jobs. So many left behind.
I've never been happier not to be rich.
1
Where is your criticism of the disrupters who've crashed Donald Trump's rallies, screamed obscenities and anti-American invectives and are doing everything else they can to provoke a violent reaction from the attendees? One disrupter with a long history of violent protests and American flag stomping and burning even tried to rush the stage with the possible objective of physically attacking Mr. Trump. Bernie Sanders, MoveOn.org and others whose supporters are fomenting this discord are not as innocent as they would have us believe.
5
Here is a historian commenting on Trump:
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/interrogation/2016/02/is...
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/interrogation/2016/02/is...
Moveover.org. paid for the promotion to mob the rally and incited the crowd to disrupt the rally. Please, try and get a little balance in your statements.
5
Welcome to the 2016 performances of the Ides of March! Tonight Julius Caesar will be portrayed by Marco Rubio in the 7:00 PM performance, and John Kasich in the 7:30 PM performance. Brutus will be portrayed by Donald J. Trump in both instances.
Sit back, put your feet up and enjoy the end of Western civilization!
Sit back, put your feet up and enjoy the end of Western civilization!
1
Since Cain slew Abel and responded with "Am I my brother's keeper?" to God's inquiry about his brother our evolutionary DNA genetic biological human nature has given "license to violence.
Trump had nothing to do with the death of Caesar nor Lincoln nor Garfield nor McKinley nor Archduke Franz Ferdinand nor John Kennedy nor Martin King nor Robert Kennedy. Trump had nothing to do with the shootings of George Wallace and Ronald Reagan.
George Washington, Andrew Jackson, John Brown, James Buchanan, Jefferson Davis, Woodrow Wilson, Huey Long, Joe McCarthy, Jim Jones, David Koresh, Randy Weaver, Tim McVeigh, Eric Rudolph, Eric Frein, Jared Loughner, Cliven Bundy, George Wallace, Barry Goldwater, Lyndon Johnson, Ronald Reagan, Newt Gingrich, Rudy Giuliani, Mtich McConnell, Sarah Palin Bill Clinton, George W. Bush and Barack Obama gave license to violence.
I lived through and remember Chicago circa 1968. What happened in Chicago last Friday may be a mere preview of what is to come. Trump is simply "the canary" in the dark deep smoldering cave mine that is America circa 2016. Shooting the messenger is futile. Looking in a mirror and listening to ourselves is the route to enlightenment.
"Beware the Ides of March!"
Trump had nothing to do with the death of Caesar nor Lincoln nor Garfield nor McKinley nor Archduke Franz Ferdinand nor John Kennedy nor Martin King nor Robert Kennedy. Trump had nothing to do with the shootings of George Wallace and Ronald Reagan.
George Washington, Andrew Jackson, John Brown, James Buchanan, Jefferson Davis, Woodrow Wilson, Huey Long, Joe McCarthy, Jim Jones, David Koresh, Randy Weaver, Tim McVeigh, Eric Rudolph, Eric Frein, Jared Loughner, Cliven Bundy, George Wallace, Barry Goldwater, Lyndon Johnson, Ronald Reagan, Newt Gingrich, Rudy Giuliani, Mtich McConnell, Sarah Palin Bill Clinton, George W. Bush and Barack Obama gave license to violence.
I lived through and remember Chicago circa 1968. What happened in Chicago last Friday may be a mere preview of what is to come. Trump is simply "the canary" in the dark deep smoldering cave mine that is America circa 2016. Shooting the messenger is futile. Looking in a mirror and listening to ourselves is the route to enlightenment.
"Beware the Ides of March!"
2
Trump is a provocateur of the worst sort, extolling violence while standing behind a cordon of security, which marks him as a coward. Many of us watch from afar--in my younger days I might have gone to his gatherings as I went to George Wallaces on several occasions to protest and enjoy the show. Now at 72 I am to old and slow to duck and take punch, and indeed I suppose to throw one if need be. So most of us who absolutely loathe this Incubus watch and wait knowing full well at some point someone is going to get killed. What then ? It saddens me beyond words seeing what this once great nation has fallen too. I wish I could feel some optimism, but I can't....
4
I recently read Ken Follett's book "Winter of the World", the second in a trilogy, in which the reader is taken back in time to the rise of Hitler and Fascism in Germany, Spain, Italy, and England. The techniques used back then to silence criticism and control power are ominously similar to what Mr. Trump is saying, and having his supporters (henchmen?) doing. The Nazis quickly took over control of the police, played the blame game on non-supporters, who had, in their view, caused pain and suffering for the whole (substitute immigrants (especially those crossing our southern boarder) for Jews and Communists), and you have Trump's hate campaign. It is sad and scary that he has gotten this far. And I have to believe our Allies around the Globe are shocked and even more scared. But at least Mr. Trump is buddies with Mr. Putin.....
2
Isn't it accurate to say that the violence is largely instigated by Trump opponents?
6
Nope, it's not accurate. Pay attention.
1
This is not about Trump. It's about the First Amendment. The KKK has a right to speak and to freely associate. Trump and his people have the same right. Now think MLK. They disrupted the racist associations of their time, but they made it a point never to get into street fights. Should people who hate Muslims have the right to interrupt Muslim prayer services? Should people be allowed to protest inside synagogues? There are only two possible proper ways to protest a gathering you don't like. If it's public and they let everyone in, you can go in with your message shirt and then leave when you are requested to do so, without resistance. The norm in my community is you have to maintain a buffer zone between the protesters and the event. The present mainstream liberal response to Trump is un-American. Trump is serving an important purpose in our democracy. He is giving voice to a large segment of the population. Instead of the left deciding what our reaction should be in terms of solving this white anxiety and anger, a huge media voice has risen, in order to patronize young people, telling Trump and his followers they are not protected by the US Constitution. This is our real modern problem. We all know what the Framers left us. The Senate has decided to suspend its sworn Constitutional duties because the GOP hates Obama. The New York Times has decided to stand against free speech because you don't like Donald Trump. Both of you are violating our founding principles.
34
Protests are freedom of speech also. And your fancy flawed arguments are also simply veiled attempts to confuse confound and obscure the fact that the constitution does sets a limit on freedom of speech when is incites riots makes threats to assault and harm others and calls upon his audience to do so. You know this but choose to ignore this crucial difference.
Trump is deliberately lighting a bonfire and then like all authoritarian strongmen setting himself up as the savior to protect us from the things he has created hatred xenophobia racism sexism, religious intolerance and discrimination.
Trump is deliberately lighting a bonfire and then like all authoritarian strongmen setting himself up as the savior to protect us from the things he has created hatred xenophobia racism sexism, religious intolerance and discrimination.
So, Trumpism is a religion now? No, I don't think anti-Muslims should disrupt prayer services, nor should people protest in synagogues or any PRAYER service. But Trump isn't a religious leader. He's not conducting a religious service.
You say people should go in with their t-shirts and leave when asked. Ok. Fair enough. But Trump's egging his followers to make protesters sorry. To push people by saying if they hurt the protester, he'll pay the legal bills? To allow someone to sucker punch someone? (Is Trump paying that guy's legal bill?) I don't think you can apply your logic.
You say people should go in with their t-shirts and leave when asked. Ok. Fair enough. But Trump's egging his followers to make protesters sorry. To push people by saying if they hurt the protester, he'll pay the legal bills? To allow someone to sucker punch someone? (Is Trump paying that guy's legal bill?) I don't think you can apply your logic.
Freedom of speech means the government cannot stop you from speaking. It does not grant anyone the right to not be protested against.
By comparing him to George Wallace, the NYT editorial board inches ever closer to a fully accurate description of Donald Trump - fascist, bund-style rallies and all.
2
By fully accurate you mean 100% historically inaccurate?
I am a Black attorney in Washington DC with a degree in American History.
I have more in common with George Wallace than Donald Trump does.
Call me a cynic, but it helps to pass a course in American History before you make historical comparisons.
I am a Black attorney in Washington DC with a degree in American History.
I have more in common with George Wallace than Donald Trump does.
Call me a cynic, but it helps to pass a course in American History before you make historical comparisons.
1
To DC Barrister:
Yes, accurate, but not 100%. Nothing is 100% consisent historically. (A degree in American History is helpful, but on his topic one in 20th century European history/politics would be a better foundation.)
Twentieth century fascism extends beyond Germany and Italy. It encompasses Salazar in Portugal, Franco in Spain, Kuhn in Hungary and fascist leaders and movements in what is now Croatia, Romania, Ukraine and other places. The Bathist parties of Syria and Iraq were/are also fascist.
At their core they embrace certain common aspects. Briefly:
1. Our country was once great, but is in decline. The establishment and its political parties, due to their callow stupidity, are responsible for this.
2. We have foreign enemies who are outsmarting us, draining our wealth and humiliating us on the world stage. The establishment has collaborated in this.
3. There are those living among us who are somehow "alien" and partially responsible for our ills and, therefore, should be removed/suppressed/contained.
4. There are those outside our country who must be kept out, since they will further subvert our civilization and way of life.
5. "I", and only "I" can fix/reverse all of this - trust me.
6. Don't worry about the details of how "I" will do this, that's secondary to getting things back to the way they should be.
Now - this sounds like ....?
Yes, accurate, but not 100%. Nothing is 100% consisent historically. (A degree in American History is helpful, but on his topic one in 20th century European history/politics would be a better foundation.)
Twentieth century fascism extends beyond Germany and Italy. It encompasses Salazar in Portugal, Franco in Spain, Kuhn in Hungary and fascist leaders and movements in what is now Croatia, Romania, Ukraine and other places. The Bathist parties of Syria and Iraq were/are also fascist.
At their core they embrace certain common aspects. Briefly:
1. Our country was once great, but is in decline. The establishment and its political parties, due to their callow stupidity, are responsible for this.
2. We have foreign enemies who are outsmarting us, draining our wealth and humiliating us on the world stage. The establishment has collaborated in this.
3. There are those living among us who are somehow "alien" and partially responsible for our ills and, therefore, should be removed/suppressed/contained.
4. There are those outside our country who must be kept out, since they will further subvert our civilization and way of life.
5. "I", and only "I" can fix/reverse all of this - trust me.
6. Don't worry about the details of how "I" will do this, that's secondary to getting things back to the way they should be.
Now - this sounds like ....?
1
When George Bush and Dick Cheney were running for re-election in 2004 my daughter was given two tickets to their big rally at an airport hanger by her art teacher. We stood in line, two progressives, and listened to the conversations around us. Torture was discussed as mere fraternity 'pranks'. I pushed back at that and we were then targeted as being the 'other'. We got up to the ticket taker and were told we were not on the 'final list' and so were not allowed entry. This was cheered mightily by the others in line.
They controlled their rallies. Why can't Trump? I actually don't agree with having closed rallies, only for your supporters (seems a mite cowardly and living in that 'bubble'), but if the Prince of Darkness Cheney could do it, why can't Trump? Or should he? It would certainly tamp down the violence that feeds on itself and grows stronger. And that violence is something America does not need. We've seen it too many times. I do not want to relive the horror of billy clubs slamming into protesters' heads as in 1968.
They controlled their rallies. Why can't Trump? I actually don't agree with having closed rallies, only for your supporters (seems a mite cowardly and living in that 'bubble'), but if the Prince of Darkness Cheney could do it, why can't Trump? Or should he? It would certainly tamp down the violence that feeds on itself and grows stronger. And that violence is something America does not need. We've seen it too many times. I do not want to relive the horror of billy clubs slamming into protesters' heads as in 1968.
2
Does anybody else find it a little suspicious that Donnie talks about the good OLD days, when protesters were beaten, in the PRESENT tense?
Just a little odd?
Just a little odd?
1
Mr. Birther Trump was conceived and raised by the tea party element of the American primary voters. He managed to throw several of his nest mates out of the nest for the ants to feed on.
He and Mussolini will share a sad paragraph in the history books.
He and Mussolini will share a sad paragraph in the history books.
Wow I did not witness such a media backlash or a NYT editorial denouncing protesters acting violently towards the police last year. No one called out protest leaders who started chants of death to cops . Bill De Blasio on CNN yesterday critical of Trump for his part in it really? The mayor who stood by while the vitriol lead to the murder of 2 police officers. I guess the violence is only deplorable to the NYT editorial board when the cause is in line with your beliefs.
5
I find it amazing that the NYT Editorial Board gets it wrong more than 90% of the time. First of all there hasn't been much violence. Most of the violence was created or caused or incited by so called "Protesters" who are really disruptors who have as their sole purpose to prevent Donald Trump from speaking to his supporters in a private space that he rented for that purpose. The only "violence" that was reported that I recall is that a 78 year old man threw a very weak punch at a 26 year old intruder at a Trump rally for his supporters. The intruder was trying to "shut down" Trump so he could not exercise his right to freedom of assembly and free speech as is the case with all "protestors" who enter Trump's private space. If anyone is inciting violence it is the people who intentionally disrupt private political meetings. They were not invited. Rallies are for supporters and when held in a privately rented space people who invade that space uninvited are the wrong doers. Why don't you understand that?
3
To all those who feel Trump's free speech and the free speech of his followers are being restricted in any way- Trump is getting plenty of opportunity to express himself in newspapers, TV and radio. Oh yeah. And the internet. The same for his supporters. As far as the actions of these "vile" protesters; They are using their right to free speech also. The news' job is to report things for our observation. Now, opinion and editorial pieces express opinions, aaaaah "free speech." These protesters did not pop up out of thin air. They come from Trump's words, he is beckoning them. The are a response to his words, his actions. These brave individuals are standing up and expressing their dissension, which is their right. These rallies are not some private membership club. Trump can barely handle one dissenting voice and has proven he can't handle the possibility of hundreds or thousands. So, you all have your right to free speech, which many of us use behind the cloak of the internet and the disguise of a pseudo name. But what you don't get is blanket agreement or respect when Trump or anyone else is disrespectful to one person or a group. So use your free speech while you still can, because Trump, as he has already proposed (libel laws), will be leading the movement to quash all that disagree with him. I have to think that Trump supporters are good people and good citizens. In many cases these good people are letting latent hate get the better of them.
If you disagree with what Trump is saying, say so-don't try to disrupt his meeting. The concept of having free speech in a democracy is that as long as ideas can be freely expressed, the best ideas will triumph in the end. What is the point of going into a Trump rally to protest, anyway? Do these protestors think that they will convert the audience? This would be funny, if the protestors did not run the risk of harming democracy itself. Consider, when this sort of "protesting" becomes accepted, won't it be easy to drown out the minority views? Some guy, say Martin Luther King in the early 50's, is having meetings, starting to popularize unpopular ideas. Just send 5,000 klansmen to the next meeting.
Now, that stuff happened. And aren't today's protestors proud to be following in the footsteps of the Grand Wizard?
Now, that stuff happened. And aren't today's protestors proud to be following in the footsteps of the Grand Wizard?
Oh how the media is now all in for negativity for trump. But you STILL give hime space and time and free exposure to voters. 4 articles on this digital from pager were about Trump. And here in opinions at least 3 are.
What a bunch of hypocrites you are. Keep telling us how bad you think Trump is so you can keep using his 'coverage' to rake in the money.
The once-great Grey lady is in rags, buring her head in shame.
What a bunch of hypocrites you are. Keep telling us how bad you think Trump is so you can keep using his 'coverage' to rake in the money.
The once-great Grey lady is in rags, buring her head in shame.
1
Still, you don't see groups of Trump supporters trying to deliberately disrupt Bernie rallies, even though he talks of "revolution". We haven't seen this kind of aggressive behavior since the Tea Party started disrupting town meetings over ACA. It's as unacceptable now as it was then.
4
Trump is simply telling the Republican "base" what they want to hear. Give the man this: he has no ideology. If he gets the nomination, he will morph into something else.
1
It is no surprise that the NYT would attack Trump because he is gong to beat the Democrat candidates and the left wing NYT is having a fit. 25% of Democrat voters are going to vote for Trump and not for a Communist or a cackling criminal. The NYT is running afraid because it knows Trump owes nothing to others and is going to be the socialist's worse nightmare.
2
On a recent trip to Germany, we wandered through a peaceful town that looked like it belonged on a postcard. The people were polite and peacefully going about their business. Grand parents cooed at babies in strollers.
I could not grasp how this town was just down the road from a concentration camp where the same populace 2 generations earlier had been complicit to unimaginable horrors.
I shudder, not so much at Mr Trump, but at the side of human behavior he is eliciting in the heartland of America
I could not grasp how this town was just down the road from a concentration camp where the same populace 2 generations earlier had been complicit to unimaginable horrors.
I shudder, not so much at Mr Trump, but at the side of human behavior he is eliciting in the heartland of America
2
Oh nonsense. The violence is non-existent if not for a bunch of rowdy dissenters looking to make trouble.
My parents, retired and in their seventies, support Trump. So far your newspaper has called them stupid, brown shirts, fascists, racists, sexists, and now violent extremists.
Please tell me, what about a Trump presidency threatens your newspaper so much?
My parents, retired and in their seventies, support Trump. So far your newspaper has called them stupid, brown shirts, fascists, racists, sexists, and now violent extremists.
Please tell me, what about a Trump presidency threatens your newspaper so much?
4
The United States of America was the last place on earth that I imagined could have a presidential candidate behave as a thug, and still lead in the race for the country's presidency.
1
Trump is the face of the GOP now. What difference is there between his rallies and the aides to Tom Delay posing as protesters who disrupted polling booths in Florida during the recount? What difference is there between the violence Trump calls for and when the Republicans whipped people into a fury over the ACA and urged them to attend and disrupt town halls that Democrats had in their home states? Trump is no different than every elected Republican except that he doesn't use code to whip the base into a froth.
But what happens if [God Forbid] Trump is elected and can deliver nothing of what he promised, indeed things get worse because we would have a delusional, bumbling, psychopath for a president.
1
You don't like the person, don't support them. This misguided idea of protesting yields nothing but trouble. Stay home and be safe, putting yourself in harms way is foolish and in the end, you reap what you sow.
I have no compassion for any involved in such stupid behavior, no matter what side they take.
I have no compassion for any involved in such stupid behavior, no matter what side they take.
5
Here in this Times editorial and elsewhere in print and TV media, John McGraw, the man who assaulted Rakeem Jones at a NC Trump rally, is reported as having said "Next time I might have to kill him." That's not what he said. He said, "Next time WE might have to kill him." That's a important difference. In the first case, he's a single man who might have to murder a protester to silence him. In the latter, he sees himself as part of a movement that might have to murder protesters to silence them. I'm not scared of John McGraw. I am frightened by the movement Trump's rhetoric is catalyzing.
3
The same country that elected Barack Obama 7 years ago will not elect Donald Trump. That would be implausible schizophrenic even for America. And when that happens the hard right who support him will again insist that the country is being stolen from them. Their response will be to double down and go looking for someone even more "forceful" than Trump. With Trump they've gotten a sense of power that will not readily dissipate. They will not go quietly into the dark night of political irrelevance. They see themselves as warriors in a cause. And warriors fight on.
Trump is not the end of this. Trump is the beginning.
Trump is not the end of this. Trump is the beginning.
59
@Bounarotti
I believe you are wrong.
The people who voted for Obama voted for change. They are now looking at Sanders and perhaps Trump to drive even more change. There are enough crossover votes happening now it's impossible to tell how this will sort out but if a status quo politician wins expect 10's of millions of voters to be very unhappy on both the left and the right.
The 1% is happy but scared especially of Sanders. The rest of the population has varying degrees of unhappiness but many have lost their fear of change which has the 1% and their cronies in media on the run.
I believe you are wrong.
The people who voted for Obama voted for change. They are now looking at Sanders and perhaps Trump to drive even more change. There are enough crossover votes happening now it's impossible to tell how this will sort out but if a status quo politician wins expect 10's of millions of voters to be very unhappy on both the left and the right.
The 1% is happy but scared especially of Sanders. The rest of the population has varying degrees of unhappiness but many have lost their fear of change which has the 1% and their cronies in media on the run.
Trump uses incendiary language but his ideas on trade, health care, taxes sort of, address the increasing economic inequality in this country which was started with the Reagan and made worse with Bush tax cuts. So I think that if the GOP is to win the White House, Trump would be better than Cruz, Rubio or Kasich. These guys parrot the same ol low tax, big military, religious swill that has dominated the GOP's rhetoric for decades. Freedom in this country cannot include being forced to hew to the religious guidelines of the GOP and Tea Party.
3
Lots of comments about the speech disrupters.
Mr. Trump's freedom of speech is protected by police who remove disrupters. No need for the violence encouraged by Mr. Trump.
Protest is also free speech.
Mr. Trump's freedom of speech is protected by police who remove disrupters. No need for the violence encouraged by Mr. Trump.
Protest is also free speech.
1
No, Sir! NOT when it is conducted in a place and manner that denies another their right of free speech.
1
Agree that protest is free speech, but not in a space PAID for by a candidate.
(If you hired a hall for a wedding, e.g., would you be happy if Old Bernie's supporters invaded the hall to protest? Would you expect the police to remove the disrupters?)
President Trump will make America great again!
(If you hired a hall for a wedding, e.g., would you be happy if Old Bernie's supporters invaded the hall to protest? Would you expect the police to remove the disrupters?)
President Trump will make America great again!
1
at first I was going to "recommend" your statement, then my eye was caught by your use of the word "disrupters." Trump has protesters removed and calls them disrupters. that is not the same thing at all. the disruptions are usually caused by his supporters taking physical action against the protesters. that is not free speech; that is violence. I believe it is important to use words correctly.
Donald Trump reminds me of some of the abusive parents I've read about. They never did anything bad to their children that they didn't deserve. If those children then grew up to be violent or bad it was the children's fault: they'd done their best. They'd beaten the living daylights out of them for being bad. They'd told them how rotten they were, how they deserved to be tossed into the garbage.
The parallel here is that Trump isn't lifting a finger to hurt protesters. No one has to listen to what he says even if he is fanning the flames. And sure, he'll pay the legal fees because those people didn't mean to hurt the protesters. Besides, the protesters deserve it. They are disrupting his speeches, heckling him, and they are all a bunch of malcontents who don't know how good they have it in America. But Trump is innocent. All he's doing is saying what "used to be done" and, by implication, ought still to be done.
Trump is what the GOP gets after being so bigoted, intolerant, churlish, childish, uncompromising, and lying for so many years to the American public who voted for them. Rather than being adults the GOP has behaved like a group of fractious toddlers in need of a nap. The only difference is that the nap will help the toddlers and toddlers do grow up: the GOP is fixated on childish attitudes that are hindering the functioning of our government, not helping us economically, and threatening the well being of the middle and working classes.
The parallel here is that Trump isn't lifting a finger to hurt protesters. No one has to listen to what he says even if he is fanning the flames. And sure, he'll pay the legal fees because those people didn't mean to hurt the protesters. Besides, the protesters deserve it. They are disrupting his speeches, heckling him, and they are all a bunch of malcontents who don't know how good they have it in America. But Trump is innocent. All he's doing is saying what "used to be done" and, by implication, ought still to be done.
Trump is what the GOP gets after being so bigoted, intolerant, churlish, childish, uncompromising, and lying for so many years to the American public who voted for them. Rather than being adults the GOP has behaved like a group of fractious toddlers in need of a nap. The only difference is that the nap will help the toddlers and toddlers do grow up: the GOP is fixated on childish attitudes that are hindering the functioning of our government, not helping us economically, and threatening the well being of the middle and working classes.
11
Trump's children are hard-working, intelligent, responsible, etc.
(It's odd that you would insinuate otherwise.)
(It's odd that you would insinuate otherwise.)
Pecan,I wasn't talking about his children. I was talking about his behavior and it's quite reminiscent of abusive parents or, better yet, tyrants. Even tyrants can raise good kids.
Hitler was a better orator than Trump, as he stirred up class and racial hatred, and constructed events to prove that his brand of national socialism was the path to salvation. It is fortunate for the american public that Trump's MBA never taught him to Engage Brain Before Opening Mouth.
The truth will out.
The truth will out.
1
Not a single word about Soros sponsored groups deliberately sent to disrupt and instigate at the Trump rally in Chicago NYT? No reportage of anti Trump protesters yelling ''f*** the police'' at the cops outside the arena? A 78 year old man throws a sucker punch and all the Trump supporters are labeled frothing at the mouth violent racists,but an anti Trump protestor rushes the podium in an attempt to attack Trump and the only problem the NYT has is that he was incorrectly identified as an isis member.
Do tea party members or Trump supporters ever try do disrupt or shut down Democrat events? People are booed and shouted down for asking the candidates tough questions.I am not a Trump fan but the NYT complete lack of objectivity and deliberate omission of facts is a disgrace.
Do tea party members or Trump supporters ever try do disrupt or shut down Democrat events? People are booed and shouted down for asking the candidates tough questions.I am not a Trump fan but the NYT complete lack of objectivity and deliberate omission of facts is a disgrace.
9
Today is the Ides of March. Death of Caesar. At the hands of fellow conspirators, Brutus & Cassius among them. A turning point in Roman history. There followed a civil war and much carnage.
Beware the Ides of March, Caesar was told...
Today our nation too stands at a threshold. Will it be violence and carnage? Or will we somehow pull back from the brink? Will senators do the right thing? Or lead us down dark paths?
History holds the fall of many empires, many despots. Denounce despotism. Shun violence.
Beware the Ides of March, Caesar was told...
Today our nation too stands at a threshold. Will it be violence and carnage? Or will we somehow pull back from the brink? Will senators do the right thing? Or lead us down dark paths?
History holds the fall of many empires, many despots. Denounce despotism. Shun violence.
4
Trump supporters may be scary, but at least they don't come in and disrupt Democratic events.
7
QUOTATION OF THE DAY
"It's getting harder every day."
MARCO RUBIO, a United States senator from Florida, on whether he would support Donald J. Trump as the Republican nominee for president.
Trump belongs in Jail and Rubio is complicit in his own previous words. Maybe Rubio should join him in jail.
"It's getting harder every day."
MARCO RUBIO, a United States senator from Florida, on whether he would support Donald J. Trump as the Republican nominee for president.
Trump belongs in Jail and Rubio is complicit in his own previous words. Maybe Rubio should join him in jail.
2
Trump is the most dangerous thing America has ever seen. Voters may have legitimate grievances, but we can only hope that Republican primary voters will reconsider and go for an alternative. I think people just do not realize how scary this guy is.
1
Freedom of speech is a right in our country. With that freedom comes the responsibility to use it properly. Using speech to agitate a large crowd of people is an inappropriate use of that right. Especially for someone running for POTUS. The protesters are not right in their exercising of the rights either. Why would anyone reason that people will listen to your message when they are clearly there to hear a candidate entertain them? Protest outside the room, that way the chance of escalation into violence is greatly reduced. A few may even "hear" what you have to say. Freedom of speech often means we will have to listen to ideas and attitudes we do not agree with. So be it. This situation is very messy at the moment, this could get to be very bad possibly lethal. Let's not let it go there.
1
Is it the right-wingers causing the violence at these rallies? Are they dragging in those who are on the left and physically attacking them? You may not like it and neither do I but Trump gets to say what he wants, don't vote for him if you don't like his politics. I don't like the slogans of the BLM organization any better, "What do we want? Dead Cops..." but it seems that is ok and the number of police officers shot this year is up over 300%. So if Trumps rhetoric is disgusting who exactly has he killed lately?
We have freedom of speech in this country. We allow the Pastor Wright's, the Louis Farrahkans, Charles Barrones, David Duke and countless others to use horrible language, but it is protected. And the NYT's will say they aren't running for president, and that is correct but they are free to say what they have been saying for decades!
How this will play out as to who gets elected I don't know. I voted for Obama twice! And what did I find out he had no interest in the middle class and what is happening to us. It's about illegal immigrants, BLM and the fringe. Well, the fringe don't pay this country's bills and neither does big business. And please don't say Bernie Sanders. No experience in life never mind running a country.
The NYT's as I have said before will always excuse the left even if they are the ones causing the violence.
We have freedom of speech in this country. We allow the Pastor Wright's, the Louis Farrahkans, Charles Barrones, David Duke and countless others to use horrible language, but it is protected. And the NYT's will say they aren't running for president, and that is correct but they are free to say what they have been saying for decades!
How this will play out as to who gets elected I don't know. I voted for Obama twice! And what did I find out he had no interest in the middle class and what is happening to us. It's about illegal immigrants, BLM and the fringe. Well, the fringe don't pay this country's bills and neither does big business. And please don't say Bernie Sanders. No experience in life never mind running a country.
The NYT's as I have said before will always excuse the left even if they are the ones causing the violence.
6
Seems this is backwards. Sure, the anti-Trump protesters are taking a chance, but they are also exercising their freedom of speech. They are speaking, not being violent. You seem to miss that part of it all. Would you be better off if Romney would have won? Since he cares only about the 1%, how would you be doing? Be honest with yourself at least.
"They are speaking, not being violent."
- I'm sorry, were you busy this weekend?
"Romney ...Since he cares only about the 1%"
- Romney? Bing "Romney acts of kindness"
"Be honest with yourself at least."
- I'm sorry, were you busy this weekend?
"Romney ...Since he cares only about the 1%"
- Romney? Bing "Romney acts of kindness"
"Be honest with yourself at least."
I believe that Trump is now a hostage of his own campaign. Just as on his TV "reality" show he has adopted a campaign persona and cannot break free into a more rational version of a political candidate. While this may be true of many candidates (see Ted Cruz) Trump, more than any other, has become a caricature of himself. Long ago he realized his value was in the Trump "brand" meaning perception IS the reality and so there is nothing Trump will react more negatively to is an attack on his brand. While Trump has been brilliant in marketing himself to the Republican "base" which is a narrowly targeted audience for the general election we are talking mass marketing, not Donald Trump's strength.
The word "trump" is a term used in card games but will soon if it already isn't be known in political circles as a call to arms for hate mongers, paranoid schizoids and violently prone white rednecks who have found in Trump everything that expresses their frustrations and fulfills their propensity to solve any argument with violence.
With the White majority rapidly fading and losing their potency they are grasping at straws, looking for anyone to come to their rescue. In that desperation they have picked the most inflammable of straw men, someone so highly volatile who might at any moment ignite the electorate with fiery rhetoric he cannot control.
To "Trump" or be "Trumped" will in modern political parlance become known as an updated version of McCarthyism, the Fifties Commie conspiracy-filled red scare menace which afflicted this nation for decades. It was a terrible period in our history, as this current age of Trump will be looked upon for years to come. Talk about being on the wrong side of history. George Wallace anyone?
DD
Manhattan
With the White majority rapidly fading and losing their potency they are grasping at straws, looking for anyone to come to their rescue. In that desperation they have picked the most inflammable of straw men, someone so highly volatile who might at any moment ignite the electorate with fiery rhetoric he cannot control.
To "Trump" or be "Trumped" will in modern political parlance become known as an updated version of McCarthyism, the Fifties Commie conspiracy-filled red scare menace which afflicted this nation for decades. It was a terrible period in our history, as this current age of Trump will be looked upon for years to come. Talk about being on the wrong side of history. George Wallace anyone?
DD
Manhattan
2
How much lower can we go? Even if Trump loses, and pray to God he does, he's opened a door that gives legitimacy to sick and destructive campaigning. I thought Sarah Palin was bad with her divisive rhetoric, but she doesn't even compare. This is the kind of rhetoric that gave rise to Hitler. Trump comes across as practically deranged, yet his supporters are loving it.
1
Palin was ignored. Now we have Sanders and Trump.
Trump (while no Hitler, Godwinite fantasies aside) is less genteel than past Republicans. In the same way, America, while not yet Weimar, inches ever closer.
Trump (while no Hitler, Godwinite fantasies aside) is less genteel than past Republicans. In the same way, America, while not yet Weimar, inches ever closer.
Trump is nothing more than a Rabble Rouser Pandering to the scum of the Republican Party. His strongest supporters are the media, that give him far too much attention, that includes this News Paper.The best way to rid our country of this evil man is to ignore him, without attention, he will wither & die.
1
America haters finally found a "real" leader. I guess people show up to see him for the same reason they watch boxing and other violent sports and shout "Kill em". An emotional outlet for them. Pretty sad they find it in a Presidential election. The press created a monster and too many people bought into it. America and the world can be grateful Ms. Hillary Rodham Clinton will be our next President of the United States of America.
3
1. Hillary may be in jail by November.
2. Nothing quite like the "love" from Al Sharpton, Barack Obama, The New Black Panther Party, MoveOn org and Occupy Wall Street thugs.
2. Nothing quite like the "love" from Al Sharpton, Barack Obama, The New Black Panther Party, MoveOn org and Occupy Wall Street thugs.
3
Donald Trump's comments are definitely out of bounds. I detect little balance in this Editorial which should also note that protesters and organizations, like Move-On. Org,, share the blame. The first amendment protects free speech but it has been held to mean it ends when your fist meets my nose and I see protesters, along with Trump supporters, throwing fists or yelling "fire! in a crowded theater. Pro-Lifers are not allowed into abortion clinics (thank goodness) to get in the face of women seeking abortions.
9
agreeing with every word written here I don't agree anymore with the - now widespread comparisons to Drumpf as being a 'Fascists' like Mussolini or 'Hitler'.
Faced with the fact, that in the beginning of Drumpfs rise he wasn't taken very seriously -(also by myself) I thought it was funny when comedian like Maher or - Sarah Silverman mocked Drumpf in comparing him to Hiler but then I was more and more reominded that in my homeland so many different people or politicians are compared to 'Hitler that it is as pointless and useless as these videos on U-Tube where 'Hitler orders a Pizza' or now 'Reacts to Drumpf'.
And as somebody who never had thought that comparisons to 'history' or hysterical characters were very helpful - as we have to face a completly different and much more complex and confusing 'sitwation' as ever before there only can be one conclusion that Drumpf is 'unique' - a completely uncomparable... character which definetely 'Gives License to Violence'!
Faced with the fact, that in the beginning of Drumpfs rise he wasn't taken very seriously -(also by myself) I thought it was funny when comedian like Maher or - Sarah Silverman mocked Drumpf in comparing him to Hiler but then I was more and more reominded that in my homeland so many different people or politicians are compared to 'Hitler that it is as pointless and useless as these videos on U-Tube where 'Hitler orders a Pizza' or now 'Reacts to Drumpf'.
And as somebody who never had thought that comparisons to 'history' or hysterical characters were very helpful - as we have to face a completly different and much more complex and confusing 'sitwation' as ever before there only can be one conclusion that Drumpf is 'unique' - a completely uncomparable... character which definetely 'Gives License to Violence'!
1
Hmm, read in Matt Taibbi's piece on Trump a few weeks ago that at a campaign event he hammered the fact that Medicare Part D had been written such that the program can't negotiate prices. I guess in the NYT's world pointing out this blatant example of legislation written with special intrests in mind doesn't qualify as a "single solid idea".
3
No offense Glenn, but that issue has been brought up many a time by NYT ever since Part D was passed during the Bush years by the GOP and its Big Pharma lobbyists.
Congratulations to the New York Times Editorial Board for taking a stand on the deplorable attitude and actions of this Republican candidate for President.
1
Trump's "What, me? What did I do" routine isn't working with non-gullible voters...i.e. those of us with an ounce of brains.
To his "supporters"? He can do no wrong.
Thank God we out number them...
To his "supporters"? He can do no wrong.
Thank God we out number them...
I hope we do. Not so sure, now.
No matter who we elect in the end, the rest of the world has seen the ugly side of America rising in triumph and it will be remembered.
4
I agree with CB from Michigan that the anti-T crowd who is finally awakening should start thinking different tactics to counter the rise of the Biggest Fraud on Earth. MLK all over again, please. Otherwise Der Fuhrious wins if a protester gets hurt or, God forbid it is seriously injured or killed, for that will feed the feral instincts of his followers. But he also wins if any of the latter gets the reverse, for he will blame the usual suspects, the "liberal media" and the "Kenyan despot".
1
Only the voters can stop him and the GOP. As egotistical as Trump is Ted Cruz is worse, Marco Rubio is weak and John Kaisch is in the wrong place at the wrong time.
This is what 20 years of the following lies by the GOP has gotten us:
* Tax breaks for the rich help the middle class and poor
* There is no climate change the billionaire Koch brothers say so
* Universal healthcare is bad (for billionaire not for ordinary people)
* War is good even though it has caused death and destruction with no benefit in the middle east.
And still they get elected in state after state. If we are going to have a middle class which is the bedrock of every democracy we must VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE.
Trump is just the latest chapter is destructive play book.
This is what 20 years of the following lies by the GOP has gotten us:
* Tax breaks for the rich help the middle class and poor
* There is no climate change the billionaire Koch brothers say so
* Universal healthcare is bad (for billionaire not for ordinary people)
* War is good even though it has caused death and destruction with no benefit in the middle east.
And still they get elected in state after state. If we are going to have a middle class which is the bedrock of every democracy we must VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE.
Trump is just the latest chapter is destructive play book.
1
The American media used to hold public figures accountable for their actions. Remember Richard Nixon? Or even Bill Clinton? But nowadays, anything goes. The media has little power to shape events or influence reasonable consequences for misbehavior. Much like Florida Governor Rick Scott frequently stares into the cameras and tells utter lies, Donald Trump could care less what the media makes of what he says or does. That makes him unstoppable. I would take this opportunity during America's dark night of the soul to stare deeply into yours, New York Times, and figure out how to build the pillar of democracy that was the 4th Estate, because it appears to have toppled over.
2
Trump invites violence. Imagine him with access to the bomb!
1
The sub-text of the Trump campaign is: "Make America white again".
When 38% of those interviewed in the south say that they were unhappy with the outcome of the civil war, it's no wonder that Trump has been a magnet for fear and hatred of minorities.
Phillip Roth's "The Plot Against America" is a work of fiction which is becoming shockingly closer to fact as Trump moves closer to the White House.
When 38% of those interviewed in the south say that they were unhappy with the outcome of the civil war, it's no wonder that Trump has been a magnet for fear and hatred of minorities.
Phillip Roth's "The Plot Against America" is a work of fiction which is becoming shockingly closer to fact as Trump moves closer to the White House.
1
Trump did not turn peaceful crowds attending his rallies into violent mobs. The Republican Party and its media outlets, FOX and hate-radio have for decades stirred up fear, hatred and rage in its listening audience. Trump takes the stage and unleashes the rage that has been cultivated by the Republican Party. I wonder, when will Trump be charged for inciting violence? Will it take a riot with blood on the floor?
54
Trump doesn't have "supporters," he has "followers."
47
Is everyone intentionally disregarding the fact that the protestors, intentionally attending and trying to prevent freedom of speech, are the direct cause of any violence. The article offers two protestors at a Trump rally stating that they felt they "had to do something" as almost heroic.
Yes, most of us to not support Trump or his views on society or foreign policy. But most of us also defend his right to hold a political rally without demonstrators trying to silence a candidate.
Why isn't the NYT or its readers more concerned with first amendment rights? If this was the tea party trying to disrupt a Democratic party political rally, you know darn well that the issue wouldn't be the reaction of the rally attendees. Shame on you that turn a blind eye to the first amendment protections when it is a candidate you do not support who is being denied his rights.
Yes, most of us to not support Trump or his views on society or foreign policy. But most of us also defend his right to hold a political rally without demonstrators trying to silence a candidate.
Why isn't the NYT or its readers more concerned with first amendment rights? If this was the tea party trying to disrupt a Democratic party political rally, you know darn well that the issue wouldn't be the reaction of the rally attendees. Shame on you that turn a blind eye to the first amendment protections when it is a candidate you do not support who is being denied his rights.
40
"[T]he protestors, intentionally attending and trying to prevent freedom of speech, are the direct cause of any violence." Really? No way to deal with the situation except by excessive, vigilante, violence? I guess the protesters were "just asking for it."
Haven't GOP candidates and office holders used the same screening tactics for decades? Trump takes it to an extreme, but for 'fellow' Republicans to damn his culling an audience of potential dissenters to to further damn themselves. It is GOP SOP.
2
All these incidents are simply indicators - what Trump has done so far pales in comparison with what is likely to happen as the steam roller gains momentum. It is not clear that Trump actually has considered where the logical conclusion will be but it's not going to make America great,
4
No one can say he didn't know about the man. Dorian Gray for president!
1
Mr. Schrauwen certainly captured Trump's mouth perfectly.
Trump's a real tough guy. He bravely snarls at these protesters behind the protection of a thousand rabid supporters and a cordon of Secret Service.
2
I think Trump showed restraint.
I saw the guy who rushed Trump onstage on CNN a few days ago. If that was me, I would have thrown that protester into the 5th row.
I saw the guy who rushed Trump onstage on CNN a few days ago. If that was me, I would have thrown that protester into the 5th row.
3
The similarities between Trump's campaign tactics and the way fascist Mussolini ascended to power in Italy in the 1920s are simply scary: both rely on inciting violence against anyone who dares opposing their undemocratic views, all the while screaming that the people opposing their views are unpatriotic traitors. I do hope and pray that history does not repeat itself in a different country, different time. Finally, it simply galls me to see some (too many, sadly) self-proclaimed Christians support such a violent candidate: they are disavowing Jesus' message and betraying the best history and cultural tradition of the United States. They should be ashamed of themselves.
11
By all means, have the Attorney General charge Mr. Trump with incitement to riot while crossing State lines. A Federal offense.
Meanwhile, the Justice Department can also end the FBI investigation into Hillary's e-mail and Foundation matters. Put an end to any threats to her candidacy.
Justice for all, Democratic Party style.
Then we can get on with the coronation of you know who, the banning of guns, the increasing of taxes, the promotion of free trade, and the enrichment of the 2% ( up from the 1%). Not to mention a groundbreaking Clinton Foundation partnership with the US Government.
Meanwhile, the Justice Department can also end the FBI investigation into Hillary's e-mail and Foundation matters. Put an end to any threats to her candidacy.
Justice for all, Democratic Party style.
Then we can get on with the coronation of you know who, the banning of guns, the increasing of taxes, the promotion of free trade, and the enrichment of the 2% ( up from the 1%). Not to mention a groundbreaking Clinton Foundation partnership with the US Government.
2
I don't quite understand. I won't vote for Trump. He's an idiot. However, it seems like the violence in not rampaging Trump supporters, but outsiders disrupting Trump rallies and hindering the political process, no? Anti-Trump violence seems more prevalent than pro.
6
Every candidate has hecklers and disrupters and have since at least the time of Lincoln. Cruz, Clinton, Sanders, Rubio - they ALL have disrupters in their audience, as did Obama and Bush and Reagan and Harry Truman - but they DO NOT RESORT TO VIOLENCE. That ONLY happens at Trump rallies, because Trump encourages, no, demands it. He is a vile and sickening man, and instead of dealing with protesters - protest is not yet illegal in America as it is in North Korea or Syria! - in a calm and reasoned way, he encourages more and more hatred and violence.
If you do not understand this, Hunt, you are as damaged as Trump is.
If you do not understand this, Hunt, you are as damaged as Trump is.
1
Violence at political rallies has traditionally come from the left. Disrupters at DT's "rassemblements" are aficionados of Sanders and BLM.Purpose is to shut down free speech. Disruptiveness of the '60's was attributable to left wing groups, including dangerous ones -- SDS and the Weathermen, pretend left wing revolutionaries. Result of the political chaos engendered by the left in 1968 was the election of a law and order candidate, Richard Nixon. Attempts to disrupt DT's assemblages will bolster his support among his followers and independents..Ironical that DT, no doctrinaire conservative, who has offered an endorsement of Planned Parenthood and is even handed re the Israeli Palestinian issue, should be the object of ur contumely. Finally,with due respect, refrain from rendering judgement on Wallace.I doubt whether anyone at EB is old enough to have known him or understood the south in which he was raised,a south of "rusty gas pumps and faded RC COLA signs.". You have in your minds a caricature of GW, based on what you have read, or told by left wing professors at posh universities which you no doubt attended. When I lived in Alabama in the 1950's, GW was considered a liberal and a genuine populist, admired by both little whites and African Americans.He demagogued the race issue only once in order to win an election against Patterson, following which he was re elected in a landslide, gaining votes from both white and black Alabamians, who considered him "one of us.".
3
"...turning one American against another, hoping hatred will propel him to the Republican nomination." This ploy has been successful before - let us not forget 'Willie Horton' or the inner-city 'welfare queen' - one before nomination (Bush) the latter after ascendance (Reagan). Divisiveness sells - racial divisiveness propels.
Trump is the new nightmare with tremendous potential to destroy.
Trump is the new nightmare with tremendous potential to destroy.
5
When a protester gets seriously hurt or killed at a Trump rally in which Trump himself said something like "Just punch his face in", will he be arrested for inciting a riot?
1
So, it's possible to conspire with others to deny a candidate for the highest office in the land the right to address his supporters and deny them their right to hear from the candidate, shout obscenities, scream in people's faces, call them racists, physically intimidate and bully people who have never done anything to you, disrespect the American flag, make obscene gestures, disobey lawful instructions from the police, and even attempt to break through U.S. Secret Service officers to get to the candidate with god knows what intention, and the New York Times will still refer to you as a "peaceful protester". Who knew?
8
I'm no fan of Mr Trump but I wouldn't describe his startled response to "a protester" who jumped a security fence to "storm the stage" from behind as "cowering". Plenty to criticize w/o the hyperbole.
7
In 2004, when George Bush ran for reelection, Karl Roves put into effect his so-called 'fear, faith and fags' campaign, whipping up the evangelical vote with anti-gay marriage ballot measures. I was so disgusted that an 'establishment' Republican would demonize a group of law-abiding Americans, I joined the Democratic party after spending most of my adult life as an independent, even through Watergate. I found it ironic to hear Jeb Bush call for civility and tolerance in the current hostile political environment his brother helped create. While we can look to George Wallace for historical examples of demagoguery, there are far more recent culprits among the very group of GOP leaders now wringing their hands over Trump.
7
This editorial reflects the same anti Trump position the Times has taken all along. In fact the Times is, to my way of thinking, at the center of the notion that Trump is the racist candidate as well. But there is absolutely no balance at all in the Times' reporting about what these "protests" look like. In many instances they go beyond people holding up signs in protest. There are many who are actively trying to prevent the Trump rallies from taking place. They are screaming over Trump so that those who want to hear him at the rallies can't. These same people who would argue they are all for free speech are, in fact, trying to prevent it. And a lot of that is driven by the race bias - the notion that since Trump wants to deal with immigration in ways the Times doesn't, it has painted him with racism. I credit the media for some of the violence we are seeing. It's a long time before we are in the voting booth ready to pull the lever. I'll render my own opinions about the candidates then and without this everyday drum beat in favor of Clinton.
5
There is no way for this powder keg to break bad for Trump. If some protesters are killed, and maybe even some supporters, the story will simply continue that the killing was done out of love for country. If nobody dies, he'll take credit for "handling" the situation. No matter what occurs, Trump will become stronger. This is a positive feedback loop for him. It's front page forever!
1
Congratulations NYT Editorial Board. You collectively were naive enough to allow DJT to play you like a fiddle. By writing such a deliberate and negative article on him essentially promotes him more. You see, this article is so negative it is clear you are trying to persuade people to not vote for DJT and the result is for people instead to ask why is this article so negative? What is the NYTs Editorial Boards motivation? Who owns the NYT? Are the owners of the NYTs trying to create propaganda to promote a preferred Pesidential candidate? The editorial Board would have been better off simply reporting the facts. The American people are smart enough to see what is happening.
5
Shame on the NYT. You should defend free speech not villainize it.
Trump was the victim last week in Chicago, he had to cancel his rally. People waited hours to hear what he had to say. Instead organized left-wing radical groups that could not be peaceful interrupted the safety of the event.
Those are the people who should be condemned. What has happened to the media? It has been hijacked by left wing moonbats who only allow speech they agree with.
The progressives have become bullies, and it is shameful.
Trump was the victim last week in Chicago, he had to cancel his rally. People waited hours to hear what he had to say. Instead organized left-wing radical groups that could not be peaceful interrupted the safety of the event.
Those are the people who should be condemned. What has happened to the media? It has been hijacked by left wing moonbats who only allow speech they agree with.
The progressives have become bullies, and it is shameful.
9
No. Watch the video. The figures and and arguments start only after the rally is cancelled. It is Trump who will not allow citizens to exercise their right to free speech.
This morning I chased my cat off the kitchen counter. He doesn't know he's not supposed to go on the counter, he only knows he's not supposed to be CAUGHT going on the counter. Like my cat, Trump only knows what he's not supposed to be caught doing.
The Cumberland County Sheriff's office has announced it won't press charges against Donald Trump for inciting a riot after that supporter sucker-punched a supporter. The spokesman said there wasn't sufficient evidence that it violated the relevant North Carolina statues. But what is interesting and enlightening is that the CC Sheriff's office was investigating the events, including whether there was sufficient cause to charge Donald Trump with incitement. They didn't just brush it off.
I suspect there will be more and more of that. Since, like my cat, Trump only recognizes enforced limits, sooner or later he will go too far and someone will be severely hurt, permanently injured or killed and then investigations of incitement could get very serious.
Two things, though: The description of Trump "cowering" is actually what any public figure would do if the Secret Service started moving and surrounding them. Second, the "tomato" comment implies that a protester intended to assault Trump or anyone which hasn't happened.
The Cumberland County Sheriff's office has announced it won't press charges against Donald Trump for inciting a riot after that supporter sucker-punched a supporter. The spokesman said there wasn't sufficient evidence that it violated the relevant North Carolina statues. But what is interesting and enlightening is that the CC Sheriff's office was investigating the events, including whether there was sufficient cause to charge Donald Trump with incitement. They didn't just brush it off.
I suspect there will be more and more of that. Since, like my cat, Trump only recognizes enforced limits, sooner or later he will go too far and someone will be severely hurt, permanently injured or killed and then investigations of incitement could get very serious.
Two things, though: The description of Trump "cowering" is actually what any public figure would do if the Secret Service started moving and surrounding them. Second, the "tomato" comment implies that a protester intended to assault Trump or anyone which hasn't happened.
1
I will only ask one thing of Trump fans: Ask yourself how you would feel if you heard President Obama say the exact same things to a crowd of his supporters. Then tell me exactly why that would be any different.
3
With respect to Rodney Dangerfield, I went to a Trump rally and a hockey game broke out.
4
The real lesson from the disruption of the Trump rallies is the glimpse it gives us of Leftist rule. Leftists and "progressives" are so dangerously self-righteous in their ideology that they truly believe that an alternative view has no right to be heard. We've seen this effect on college campuses for several years now, where free speech is routinely denied even to those in the political mainstream if they don't serve the Left's political aims. Woe betide us if American Leftists ever gained power in this country.
8
Actually, the real lesson, it's the pathetic racism that America is rejecting. Sorry, but you'll have to cite this so called wave of suppression of free speech. As always conservative rhetoric fails against facts.
The simple math is that more GOP voters are against Trump, he's just winning a split vote, and even better? Trump loses in head to head polling to both Hillary and the lovely socialist, Sanders by even more margins. Trump is both a fascist and a racist, the closest he's coming to the White House would be if he took the nickel tour.
The simple math is that more GOP voters are against Trump, he's just winning a split vote, and even better? Trump loses in head to head polling to both Hillary and the lovely socialist, Sanders by even more margins. Trump is both a fascist and a racist, the closest he's coming to the White House would be if he took the nickel tour.
Nobody will "win" here. This will get worse.
Here's a brilliant solution that will make both parties' establishments happy. Let the Republican and Democrat party establishments unite. This way everybody wins! Hillary loves war (voted for Iraq, Afghanistan, Liberia, and Syria) and winning elections She'll say whatever it takes to get elected. Go RepubliDemocrats!
2
Is there a difference between what Trump is doing at his rallies and shouting "fire" in a crowded theater? Why hasn't legal action being taken against the Trump campaign by the man how was punched? How difficult is it to make the argument that the man who sucker punched the "protester" committed a hate crime and that he did so knowing that Trump's long record of hateful histrionics had emboldened him to act violently. After the protester was out of the arena the man continued to justify his actions and even threatened more violence. Was that not a glimps into what the tenor of what a Trump presidency would look and sound like?
I wish a civil law suit was leveled against Mr Trump by the protester. If nothing else, it would give the Republican Party, a chance to "hit pause" on Trumps campaign.
I wish a civil law suit was leveled against Mr Trump by the protester. If nothing else, it would give the Republican Party, a chance to "hit pause" on Trumps campaign.
At his rally in Fayetteville, North Carolina, Trump urged the crowd to confront protesters "Knock the crap out of them -- I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise". So John McGraw did just that ... he punched a black protester in the face as he was being escorted out with a group of protesters by a half-dozen police officers. McGraw was eventually arrested and charged with assault, disorderly conduct and making threats. His bond was set at $2,500 secured, and a court date set for April 6. Is Trump paying the legal fees as promised or is this yet another Trump lie?
33
Trump might pay the legal fees, but the defendant bought a record that will ruin their life.
Ironic point of view, NY Times. It is the Sanders and moveon.org people who are going to Trump rallies as agitators and provocateurs, but the Times blames Trump. Where are the Trump supporters acting as agitators at the Sanders or Clinton rallies? Answer: There aren't any. Trump supporters and their rallies are extremely good-humored and joyful - or were until the Left tried to silence them.
7
Rallies are held for the faithful as well as the undecided. If you come to the rally with a tee shirt or sign that is defamatory or designed to incite violence or disrupt the speaker there's no need to admit you. You are free to stand outside and do what ever makes you happy.
It is disrespectful to your fellow citizens to not allow them hear someone speak. This has been the method of censorship by the Left since the 1960's.
What are you afraid of?
It is disrespectful to your fellow citizens to not allow them hear someone speak. This has been the method of censorship by the Left since the 1960's.
What are you afraid of?
5
“You can always tell when the king is here,” reads a line from an article that doesn't support comments.
Yeah, he's just "one of us."
Yeah, he's just "one of us."
2
Demonizing opposing views is part of how we now find ourselves with Trump as a viable candidate.
They are taking a page from Prof. Click et al and 'getting some muscle'.
They are taking a page from Prof. Click et al and 'getting some muscle'.
3
This article seems like rage profiteering and lots of the comments here like virtue signaling.
"stir up racially charged viciousness and attacks"
Unless Trump called for violence (or e.g. refuses to reject it), he can't be blamed for fights breaking out among his protesters. Violence is not "incited", people are not animals, they act in their own responsibility. And the anti-camp has as much blame to take for the fights as the pro-Trump camp.
While Trump would do well to reject the violence and keep his campaigners in check, the sanctimonious moral outrage about his campaign is not helping. Quite the contrary, see for example the last Spiked article on Trump.
"stir up racially charged viciousness and attacks"
Unless Trump called for violence (or e.g. refuses to reject it), he can't be blamed for fights breaking out among his protesters. Violence is not "incited", people are not animals, they act in their own responsibility. And the anti-camp has as much blame to take for the fights as the pro-Trump camp.
While Trump would do well to reject the violence and keep his campaigners in check, the sanctimonious moral outrage about his campaign is not helping. Quite the contrary, see for example the last Spiked article on Trump.
3
When I read these stories it sounds like a description of a mega wrestling match, not a rally for a candidate for the job of President. For some reason Trump appeals to these people however the more of this that goes on the slimmer his chance of winning a general election IMO. The politicians in this country should really take this to heart and start doing their job, especially the GOP as this shows that many Americans are so desperate and mad they will align with a mad man.
1
Yes, Il Trumpolini is terrible.
But Rafael "Ted" Cruz, is far, far worse, when one compares their aims.
Trump is a naked opportunist, out for himself and only himself.
Cruz is a Dominionist, a particularly toxic brand of evangelical Christianity that seeks "dominion", monetarily, politically, and theologically, over every aspect of life. It is profoundly anti American, and the thought of the nuclear codes in the hands of this man makes me realize there isn't anywhere on the planet far enough away...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/religion/ted-cruzs-campaign-is-f...
But Rafael "Ted" Cruz, is far, far worse, when one compares their aims.
Trump is a naked opportunist, out for himself and only himself.
Cruz is a Dominionist, a particularly toxic brand of evangelical Christianity that seeks "dominion", monetarily, politically, and theologically, over every aspect of life. It is profoundly anti American, and the thought of the nuclear codes in the hands of this man makes me realize there isn't anywhere on the planet far enough away...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/religion/ted-cruzs-campaign-is-f...
6
There is a need for a super PAC to fund TV commercials that has images of he-who-must-not-be-named spouting the quotes in the editorial. Maybe, just maybe, once people hear him in his own words, over and over, his con man act will lose its luster.
3
The problem is that it is basically about "my home is my castle". All general approaches die. As the idea to connect the question of illegal Immigration with racism. There is only one question. What is our law? Do we take ourselves serious or not and what do we want to do anyway? Trump has made this QUESTION one of his main topics. The other one is foreign policy. All is about PROBLEMSOLVING and change.
I see; the crowds of violent anti-Trump "demonstrators" in Chicago were all Trump's fault. Got it.
Today, failure to bow to the threats of opposition constitutes encouraging violence, right?
What an interesting looking glass world you live in.
Today, failure to bow to the threats of opposition constitutes encouraging violence, right?
What an interesting looking glass world you live in.
9
Finally, there's an adult in the room and their name is "Independent."
We all know that the dreadful NYT and its far left allies never bear any responsibility for these situations, I know that because its highly informed and capable editorial board told me so...
We all know that the dreadful NYT and its far left allies never bear any responsibility for these situations, I know that because its highly informed and capable editorial board told me so...
2
Over and over again liberals do not take responsibility for their actions.
7
Since when is protesting a form of campaigning. I thought in a democracy you vote against the candidate you oppose. And in favor of the one you like. Then we tally up the votes and decide see who won. Oh, unless of course he is not politically correct, then you go to his rallies and look for trouble.
Where is the media outrage over an organized group hell bent on stopping a candidate by some other means than the vote?
If right wing groups went to Hillary rallies and the exact same thing took place these editorials and media coverage would be very different. This kind of hypocracy is what's getting Trump votes.
Where is the media outrage over an organized group hell bent on stopping a candidate by some other means than the vote?
If right wing groups went to Hillary rallies and the exact same thing took place these editorials and media coverage would be very different. This kind of hypocracy is what's getting Trump votes.
7
Yes Tom, very well stated. This is why a fundamental re-structuring of the news media is desperately needed, so that this lunatic far left bias is once and for all eradicated.
The american public are not being served well by a media such as the NYT whose sole function is either to protect Carlos Slim's mexican telecom/banking monopoly or serve as the PR flack for the national democratic party.
The american public are not being served well by a media such as the NYT whose sole function is either to protect Carlos Slim's mexican telecom/banking monopoly or serve as the PR flack for the national democratic party.
1
Trump has told us more than once what a smart guy he is, went to Wharton, made a fortune out of a measly million from Daddy, blah/blah/blah.
But what if the 'I'm so smart' meme is just another Trump lie? He has so often denied - straight-faced - inciting violence at his rallies, it occurs to me he may not know what the word 'incite' means.
But what if the 'I'm so smart' meme is just another Trump lie? He has so often denied - straight-faced - inciting violence at his rallies, it occurs to me he may not know what the word 'incite' means.
3
I agree with you, J Burkett. I'm actually stunned by his limited vocabulary. Someone needs to hand him a thesaurus, so that we don't have to hear the same four adjectives (HUGE, TERRIFIC, GREAT, AMAZING), usually to describe himself.
As someone once said about W, "the guy was born on third base, yet he thinks he hit a triple."
As someone once said about W, "the guy was born on third base, yet he thinks he hit a triple."
The times is now stooping to personal insult. Let me give you a clue, as you need one: Trump is better at it and has more money and a bigger platform than the New York times.
Expect libel insurance rates to go up faster than health insurance under Obama.
Expect libel insurance rates to go up faster than health insurance under Obama.
2
Who decides who gets to speak and who decides who should be "shut down"? Trump has behaved like a buffoon, and worse, and should only see the White House out the windows of a tour bus. But are we going to allow free speech to be arbitrated by who ever yells the loudest? Will we tolerate intimidation as part of the political process?
8
Shades of the 30's, that being the new Trump arm bands that are being handed out at Trump rallies. I've seen this movie before and it does not have a happy ending. Do we have an American Nazi on our hands?
4
Does the NYT's not know that MoveOn.org ,G. Sorus and Bill Ayers were also represented at Trump's rallies? Free speech is not only for the left. It seems when the left wants to speak it is fine but let someone disagree then it is we have to shut down free speech. This article blames the victim. I guess the writers would also say a woman is assaulted because she wore the wrong outfit?
6
Please.
Mr. Trump is not the victim.
The "victim", Mr. Trump, has peaceful alternatives to deal with disrupters. Violence should be condemned, not excused. Period.
People who encourage violence against citizens are not fit to run for political office. Period.
Of course, Civil discourse is vital. But civil disobedience has a noble place in our history. Disrupters should face the lawful consequences of their actions. Violence is not lawful. This applies to the left as well as to the Tea Party.
Mr. Trump is not the victim.
The "victim", Mr. Trump, has peaceful alternatives to deal with disrupters. Violence should be condemned, not excused. Period.
People who encourage violence against citizens are not fit to run for political office. Period.
Of course, Civil discourse is vital. But civil disobedience has a noble place in our history. Disrupters should face the lawful consequences of their actions. Violence is not lawful. This applies to the left as well as to the Tea Party.
As I have pointed out before, I am not a Trump fan, but this constant need to exaggerate the truth, conveniently highlight only part of his statements, and misplace blame by so many media outlets is getting out of hand.
Yes, Trump has made many inflammatory statements, and yes, he tends to push the envelope, but for so many media outlets to decide to place the blame for problems occurring during his rallies has got to be the most outlandish thing I have heard. Move On planned the protest in which the protesters gained entry into the rally. In my opinion, a political rally is for those that support a candidate or want to learn more about a candidate. If you feel the need to protest, do so outside the rally, or even better, protest by not voting for Trump. A protest is a last effort to have your voice be heard. Unfortunately these protesters forgot that their voice is going to be heard, on election day. I have no problem with those that disagree with Trump, I disagree with many if not most of what he says, but I will show my disapproval through democracy and choose not to vote for him.
Yes, Trump has made many inflammatory statements, and yes, he tends to push the envelope, but for so many media outlets to decide to place the blame for problems occurring during his rallies has got to be the most outlandish thing I have heard. Move On planned the protest in which the protesters gained entry into the rally. In my opinion, a political rally is for those that support a candidate or want to learn more about a candidate. If you feel the need to protest, do so outside the rally, or even better, protest by not voting for Trump. A protest is a last effort to have your voice be heard. Unfortunately these protesters forgot that their voice is going to be heard, on election day. I have no problem with those that disagree with Trump, I disagree with many if not most of what he says, but I will show my disapproval through democracy and choose not to vote for him.
5
You guys are so biased it's disgusting. The near riot is Chicago was organized and paid for by far left groups and George Soros that only believes in 'Free Speech" for themselves. Where were your comments when Black Lives Matter to support Hillary Clinton disrupted Bernie Sanders ? Did you report on the Mo. riots when the rioters admitted they were paid $1000 each to riot and then the rioters ended up rioting because they didn't get paid. The hypocrisy that continues to spill out of your mouths is disgusting and biased. If it was up to me I would fire every one of you for dishonesty.
6
Republican candidates have played on the fears of White people for a generation. Trump's campaign tactics are the result of years of racist, misogynist hate filled actions and speech by all levels of Republican right wing politician to limit the powers of the "others"; the powerless.
The election of Barack Obama didn't bring us together; it tore us apart unlike any other political action since Nixon's resignation. It terrified millions and raised their fear of all of those black and brown, foreign speaking, unchristian others banging at the door. It made them arm and ready themselves for the coming race war.
Trump is a symptom; another step on the path. America and its political leaders had better get their actions in order, or this high minded idea called the United States may collapse just because we weren't paying attention. Politics is not a game; not anymore. This is getting serious.
The election of Barack Obama didn't bring us together; it tore us apart unlike any other political action since Nixon's resignation. It terrified millions and raised their fear of all of those black and brown, foreign speaking, unchristian others banging at the door. It made them arm and ready themselves for the coming race war.
Trump is a symptom; another step on the path. America and its political leaders had better get their actions in order, or this high minded idea called the United States may collapse just because we weren't paying attention. Politics is not a game; not anymore. This is getting serious.
2
Amazing. Not a single word about the young fascists who succeeded in shutting down the rights of a candidate to speak, and his supporters to hear him. Instead, this quote from one of the violent visiting mob: “It’s all about standing up for freedom of speech for us,” Ms. Versalie said.
8
The police remove disrupters from the rallies.
The mob behavior associated with Trump's campaign does bring to mind the novel "Lord of the Flies", by William Golding. Beelzebub, the lord of the flies--is it a person, or a spirit?
2
Don Trump is a creation of the multi media that dominates our culture. Face it, we got here on our own.
2
Then don't vote for him, it's your right, what is not your right is to trespass on private property under false premise and incite violence to suppress the free speech you disagree with.
7
On the contrary, freedom of speech only means the government can suppress your right to speak your mind. It doesn't mean protestors cannot voice their disapproval of a candidates message and do it in a non-violent manner - even in a private venue. They may get ejected but it's not a violation of freedom of speech.
Meant to write "government cannot suppress" ...
So are you saying it is okay for Trump to encourage his followers to behave violently toward the "trespassers"? Isn't Trump also inciting violence to suppress the free speech he disagrees with?
This would be a more powerful editorial if it investigates the protestors who infiltrate private property under false pretenses and then incite violence and try to muzzle the free speech rights of Trump and endanger the lives of peaceful rally goers. Have you seen Trump supporters infiltrate other candidates events.
5
Ofcourse, chiraq, I mean Chicago has been the Fountainhead of political corruption for decades, no wonder they will be proud of thug like takeover of private property and free speech.
3
The Editoral Board is working at full tilt against a tide of unfettered white trash, women haters and low-life nobodies assembling and worshiping a demigod. I fear your fodder will be amassed by the truck load as Trump appears more rabid everyday fed by the madding of the crowd. Crowd behavior led by inciting white nationalism is especially dangerous and unpredictable. The National Guard will soon be required as electioneering is now a dangerous, blood sport activity.
Wow, appeal to emperor. In case you didn't notice, unlike UK this is still a democracy with private property rights. Trump events are at private property. Paid agent prvocateurs infiltrate the events. The incursions at private property are illegally organized via social media very much like the flash mob looting of malls by diverse youth in summer. The media having exhausted all attempts to stop Trump now tries this ridiculous attempt to portray the victim as the bully.
2
Trump said the Chicago protest was a planned attack. Hillary said it was a spontaneous reaction to an Internet video.
2
There is a difference between protest and disruption.
Let's say a big rap star books Madison Square Garden for a concert. People who believe rap music supports violence against women, law enforcement, whomever get 3% of the tickets and start chanting, blowing aerosol air horns, and singing "Amazing Grace" when the star appears on stage. No different than what happened to Sanders in Seattle and is happening to Trump now.
One word description - uncivilized.
Why don't the disrupters try advocating their thoughts and positions rather than protesting those of another?
Let's say a big rap star books Madison Square Garden for a concert. People who believe rap music supports violence against women, law enforcement, whomever get 3% of the tickets and start chanting, blowing aerosol air horns, and singing "Amazing Grace" when the star appears on stage. No different than what happened to Sanders in Seattle and is happening to Trump now.
One word description - uncivilized.
Why don't the disrupters try advocating their thoughts and positions rather than protesting those of another?
2
The trouble with The Times is that you don't have enough coverage about Donald Trump. And what did become of that penny the butler dug out of the Mar a Lago driveway at Fred trump's insistence 30 years ago?
1
From the beginning of this presidential campaign, the bevy of Republican candidates looked sophomoric. Not one statesmanlike contender. Where are the Colin Powell types? or Eisenhower types. Are there any Republican statesmen ( or stateswomen) left?
This reminds me of Nelson Mandela' s ANC party in South Africa. The presidents following this noble leader in South Africa so quickly have gone downhill , first with Mbeki, and now has hit bottom with Jacob Zuma. Maybe political science thinkers could explain to me this situation of how good leadership can so quickly progress down the tubes. Some type of devilish phenomena???
This reminds me of Nelson Mandela' s ANC party in South Africa. The presidents following this noble leader in South Africa so quickly have gone downhill , first with Mbeki, and now has hit bottom with Jacob Zuma. Maybe political science thinkers could explain to me this situation of how good leadership can so quickly progress down the tubes. Some type of devilish phenomena???
3
In the historical democratic annals of our planet you would have to go back to the chaos of the late Roman Republic to find mob violence like this. That violence led to the rise of a dictator, his assassination, a civil war and finally rule by emperors. What does Trump have in mind for us.
2
What a dishonest and shameful editorial. While not a fan of Trump by any means, it is quite clear that the violence is instigated by paid activists supported by liberal organizations and encouraged by media.
5
Rape victims used to be criticized if their dress or demeanor was deemed provocative. Then we decided to adjust that paradigm to exonerate the victim. Most, if not all, would say that this was right. Now comes the NY Times and other liberal media (and some conservative media, too) and wants to have us believe that a victim can indeed provoke the violence visited upon him or her (although so far it's only been OK'd for the hims). Bizarrely hypocritical!
4
The "protestors" in Chicago entered the hall looking for a fight; their intention was never for a peaceful event. They goaded Trump supporters, cursed, shoved, punched, spit and threatened. And they successfully shut down the event. How can the NYT give them a pass? This column is a blatant hatchet job with sole purpose to attache "violence" to the Trump campaign while ignoring the actual passion that this campaign has tapped into.
There are real issues of giant importance to a significant part of the population that has been belittled by the elites of both the Democrat and GOP parties. These are the 'chickens which have come home to roost.' Until Trump appeared - nobody cared. It was business as usual. Well - the chickens have awaken and united; and if it's Trump who has been first to manage this event then who really deserves the blame?
There are real issues of giant importance to a significant part of the population that has been belittled by the elites of both the Democrat and GOP parties. These are the 'chickens which have come home to roost.' Until Trump appeared - nobody cared. It was business as usual. Well - the chickens have awaken and united; and if it's Trump who has been first to manage this event then who really deserves the blame?
7
Yes, Trump is irresponsible and offensive, and unfit to be president.
But the NYT editorial board yet again demonstrates how polarized we are in this country by not taking a single sentence to criticize moveon.org and the black lives matter movement, or is the NYT okay with their disruptions of Trump's rallies?
Is there no one willing to say that both sides are wrong here?
But the NYT editorial board yet again demonstrates how polarized we are in this country by not taking a single sentence to criticize moveon.org and the black lives matter movement, or is the NYT okay with their disruptions of Trump's rallies?
Is there no one willing to say that both sides are wrong here?
5
A nation that worships guns and enshrines their ownership and use as a quasi-divine right by means of the Second Amendment is a nation that will experience civil disorders and wars in sporadic episodes. We're about due for another civil war whose pretext will be race and entitlement based but which will really be class based, according to my calculations, because once the 1% squashes the remnants of the middle class, that group will explode. It's an infallible formula seen countless times throughout history, most notably in France and Russia. The supersaturation of violent entertainments and news in the media will only exacerbate this. The dogs of [civil] war are ready to let slip their chains and lunge mindlessly. And we'll all be sorry.
1
I cannot imagine someone with the likes of Donald Trump to lead this great nation of ours. He continuously reminds me of the PBS documentary years ago " The making of a Sociopath".
3
Lately all Bernie Sanders ever seems to do is shriek about a political revolution at the top of his lungs. Isn't that also an incitement for his supporters to go on a rampage? They're the ones wrecking havoc at Trump events. So why is Bernie allowed to fly under the radar and get a free pass? How come Bernie Sanders isn't held accountable for anything?
3
"They're the ones wrecking (sic) havoc at Trump events." How do you know this? Have you spoken with them? Do you have to be a Bernie-supporter to be made furious over The Donald's bigotry?
1
In order for there to be unification of the followers of any particularly sordid creed, there needs to be "the other" who has caused the discomfort, and the constant fanning of the idea that if you're not like us, you're the problem. Trump has escalated those elements of fascism to its current edge in a democracy, just as Hitler and Mussolini did in their time. The Times boots its opportunity to go that far in its description of Trump's behavior, perhaps because in this country people are given 2nd and 3rd chances, and opportunities to atone. Europeans are warning us now - get out.
But so far, Trump has not apologized for any of the hate that he's sown, nor has he made any statements that might put off those who would show up at his rallies with ugliness in their hearts. That's the weakness of Trump - propping people up to believe that their condition has been caused by "the other" is a construct that he can't escape now. Since it's a false premise in large part, the fallacy will eventually circle back to him.
Should something worse happen during this campaign, his followers might stop to think something other than the protesters had it coming, which is what many of them apparently believe. If that occurs, and probably only then, some people will abandon him. But the brazenness of the law breaking will be with us for some time now with respect to those who will follow his advice on how to treat "the other."
But so far, Trump has not apologized for any of the hate that he's sown, nor has he made any statements that might put off those who would show up at his rallies with ugliness in their hearts. That's the weakness of Trump - propping people up to believe that their condition has been caused by "the other" is a construct that he can't escape now. Since it's a false premise in large part, the fallacy will eventually circle back to him.
Should something worse happen during this campaign, his followers might stop to think something other than the protesters had it coming, which is what many of them apparently believe. If that occurs, and probably only then, some people will abandon him. But the brazenness of the law breaking will be with us for some time now with respect to those who will follow his advice on how to treat "the other."
1
America deserves much better than Trump. I mean what next? Should we expect Vince McMahon running in future presidential races?
Trump's campaign style is now rally du jour. His games are on and the anticipation of free, hands-on, shouting match spectacles for masses of adults and their children is guaranteed to last till November. Violence is condoned and sought. There will be blood shed. What will happen when a protester or spectator is seriously injured? What will the Republican Party do then? Nothing. It's their politics du jour.
Trump should change his slogan from Make America Great Again to Make America Hate Again.
2
I attended rallies when Reagan ran for president. If you said anything out of line, you were immediately removed from the building. If you said boo, the CIA came and there you out. What's different?
2
Trump incites violence. So does Bill O'Reilley (who railed against Dr. Tiller), Hannity, and all the other fools on Fox news.
2
Mix violence with politics and you end up with a kind of fascism. After all fascism was named after the party militias of Mussolini.
In that context I would love to see it when the Times kept a very close check on the legality of what is happening on the Trump rallies. Is beating people up there really legally allowed?
In that context I would love to see it when the Times kept a very close check on the legality of what is happening on the Trump rallies. Is beating people up there really legally allowed?
1
Instead of raucous demonstrations, anti-Trump signs and t-shirts to disrupt Trump 'rallies,' isn't there a better and far more effective way to oppose his demagoguery?
Hundreds, if not thousands of people dressed in ordinary clothing, who look for all the world like potential Trump sympathizers, regular Young Republicans, should attend each of his public appearances. And as Trump struts to the podium and begins to speak, every last one of them should silently stand and turn their backs to the stage.
Because the one thing that Trump cannot possibly stand is to be ignored. He wants the attention of the crowd more than life itself.
And if his 'Trumpeteers' and security forces should attempt to remove people from the venue -- or attempt to do these silent people harm -- for the mere peaceful act of turning 180 degrees to show Trump the backs of their heads, then there can be no more question of Trump and his mob merely playing a game of tit for tat, no question that violence is merely being done in response to "violent protesters" or to protect Trump's 'right to free speech.'
This would be the most powerful form of protest imaginable. Shun the man, and shun his mob, with introspective silence. Because silence, and introspection, are the two things Trump cannot possibly tolerate.
Hundreds, if not thousands of people dressed in ordinary clothing, who look for all the world like potential Trump sympathizers, regular Young Republicans, should attend each of his public appearances. And as Trump struts to the podium and begins to speak, every last one of them should silently stand and turn their backs to the stage.
Because the one thing that Trump cannot possibly stand is to be ignored. He wants the attention of the crowd more than life itself.
And if his 'Trumpeteers' and security forces should attempt to remove people from the venue -- or attempt to do these silent people harm -- for the mere peaceful act of turning 180 degrees to show Trump the backs of their heads, then there can be no more question of Trump and his mob merely playing a game of tit for tat, no question that violence is merely being done in response to "violent protesters" or to protect Trump's 'right to free speech.'
This would be the most powerful form of protest imaginable. Shun the man, and shun his mob, with introspective silence. Because silence, and introspection, are the two things Trump cannot possibly tolerate.
5
Right, so Sanders supporters can organize on social media, coordinate an attack on a Trump rally in Chicago, mix with the crowd, throw punches at Trump supporters (don't tell me you didn't see the black punch the guy with the American flag, it was shown on cable hundreds of times), rush the stage to try to speak at the lectern (ditto), spread a banner with hostile language and walk in front of Trump supporters who were cordoned off by barricades (double ditto--shown hundreds of times) etc. etc. Sanders supporters can incite all they like and all this is Trumps fault? You are living in liberal fantasyland if you believe any of this editorial.
4
I am not a supporter of Trump. However, violent crimes by any illegal immigrant is a valid political issue and should be part of this presidential campaign. If the illegal immigrant was not allowed in the United States, an American would not have been a victim of the immigrant's crime. Trump is correct to vilify this type of illegal immigrant, and the crimes they commit.
14
Don't know how to break this to you: almost all of the violent crimes committed in the U.S. are committed by American citizens. Some of those crimes are committed BY American citizens TO undocumented aliens, and there's going to be a good deal more of that happening if The Donald keeps exhorting his supporters to express themselves through acts of violence. And, by the way, if undocumented aliens weren't being hired by people like Mr. Trump there wouldn't be so many of them here in the U.S.
4
Following that line of thought then had a criminal born in the US "not being born", then an innocent person would not have been a victim.
I think the theme should be crime in general, not zooming in on a specific group of people. Criminals are criminals, whether they are legally here or not.
I think the theme should be crime in general, not zooming in on a specific group of people. Criminals are criminals, whether they are legally here or not.
The vast majority of immigrants in this country are law abiding. They don't want to make waves they are here and do whatever is necessary to stay under the radar for fear of deportation. Most all want to find any type of job to support their families back home. You would too if you were in the same situation.
Trump is lying when he implies and sometimes he says all immigrants commit the crimes. That is so not true.
While I admired Trump during his "Celebrity Apprentice" show which displayed his even temper and sensible business skills, he has morphed into something so unrecognizable that it's insulting to watch.
I cannot imagine his family is supporting this behavior because he acts and looks like a complete buffoon.
Trump is lying when he implies and sometimes he says all immigrants commit the crimes. That is so not true.
While I admired Trump during his "Celebrity Apprentice" show which displayed his even temper and sensible business skills, he has morphed into something so unrecognizable that it's insulting to watch.
I cannot imagine his family is supporting this behavior because he acts and looks like a complete buffoon.
After 35 years of the Republican party running people with the skills of your average rip-off, con artist, it should be no surprise that we see Donald Trump front and center.
Ronald Reagan's "make America Great again" planted the seeds for both the S&L crisis of the late 80's, a debacle and bailout, and the subsequent "Great Recession" of 2008. How? "Get Government off of our backs" by deregulation.
Deregulation is a funny word for "make everything legal so nobody goes to jail" when the entire world's economy collapses because of 7 Wall Street banks selling junk that SHOULD be illegal to sell. Let's give them treasury money for bonuses after that OK?
Daddy Bush' "read my lips, no new taxes" chant, which, he then backed down on, raised taxes and let the next Con Artist into the white house.
Bill Clinton. Who, when the Republicans in 1999, paid off by Wall Street, passed a repeal of the Glass Steagall act in both houses was so burdened by a blue dress, and, so well paid off by wall street, that he SIGNED that legislation and opened the door for "derivatives" (junk mortgage securities) to be sold to the world.
Finally, we have "W" on the stage whose only constituent was Haliburton and military contractors who had been a long time without a war to fatten profits with no bid contracts. So, now we have endless war.
Ladies and Gentlemen, Donald Trump is refreshing! Perhaps he is so "cracked up" that the normal routes of nutty will be blocked off?
Ronald Reagan's "make America Great again" planted the seeds for both the S&L crisis of the late 80's, a debacle and bailout, and the subsequent "Great Recession" of 2008. How? "Get Government off of our backs" by deregulation.
Deregulation is a funny word for "make everything legal so nobody goes to jail" when the entire world's economy collapses because of 7 Wall Street banks selling junk that SHOULD be illegal to sell. Let's give them treasury money for bonuses after that OK?
Daddy Bush' "read my lips, no new taxes" chant, which, he then backed down on, raised taxes and let the next Con Artist into the white house.
Bill Clinton. Who, when the Republicans in 1999, paid off by Wall Street, passed a repeal of the Glass Steagall act in both houses was so burdened by a blue dress, and, so well paid off by wall street, that he SIGNED that legislation and opened the door for "derivatives" (junk mortgage securities) to be sold to the world.
Finally, we have "W" on the stage whose only constituent was Haliburton and military contractors who had been a long time without a war to fatten profits with no bid contracts. So, now we have endless war.
Ladies and Gentlemen, Donald Trump is refreshing! Perhaps he is so "cracked up" that the normal routes of nutty will be blocked off?
6
By the end of April 2016, the Republican establishment (national GOP, RNC PACs) will have spent twice as much money trying to destroy Trump with attack ads and candidates like Jeb Bush than the Republican Party spent trying to defeat Barack Obama in 2008.
Let me repeat that.
The GOP establishment has spent more money trying to destroy Trump in 7 months than the GOP establishment spent trying to keep Barack Obama out of the White House in 2008.
Yet somehow Obama liberals, continue to make statements that are literally 180 degrees from the facts on the ground.
How do you do that?
Let me repeat that.
The GOP establishment has spent more money trying to destroy Trump in 7 months than the GOP establishment spent trying to keep Barack Obama out of the White House in 2008.
Yet somehow Obama liberals, continue to make statements that are literally 180 degrees from the facts on the ground.
How do you do that?
1
The video that is included with this article is undeniable proof that Donald Trump is not always honest. Bluntness and refraining from political correctness is not the same as integrity.
7
As a young (non-Jewish) American who had the misfortune of living in the Axis-controlled Areas of Europe (Hungary and Germany), I frighteningly often witnessed raised hands in the Nazi Salute. The first image that came to my mind when I saw the Trump tape, was hordes of Brown-shirted fanatics saluting every hate-inspired utterance of some foul-mouthed Nazi "dignitary". Could this turn into a repeat Performance leading to similar results?
18
What caused the Trump phenomenon is no longer the urgent question. The urgent question is what to do about it now. This editorial is a start, but much more is needed and has been needed for months. An unthinking press has played an astonishing, complicit role in this horrifying development. Apparently Les Moonves has actually come out with a blunt statement that while the Trump phenomenon has been bad for America, it's good for TV profits. Could there be a more shamelessly amoral comment? The use of reality-tv techniques and softball horse-race questions in the so-called 'debates' of the Republican party has fed this candidacy, legitimized Trump and affected voters. Too many analyses and commentaries in mainstream newspapers have been lazy and superficial, and, again, focused on the horserace aspects. The press has allowed reality-tv techniques to set the agenda of what gets reported and when and how. Tough, substantive questions are not being asked. A man is about to be nominated to run for president and he has not even released his tax returns. That should be on the front page every day. Outrageous race-baiting has been allowed to happen and the first press response was a chuckle: 'oh, he will never get elected.' Too little space has been given to hard factual investigative journalism and too much space given to predictable commentaries. Result: distrust of media. I hope the message of this editorial gets through to those thinking of casting a vote for Trump.
18
The GOP leadership in the forms of Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell among others stand exposed as cowards and morally bankrupt individuals. That they are not appearing nightly on television and in print denouncing the campaigns of Trump and Cruz is a breathtaking abdication of responsibility on their part. I am with Barack Obama in that ultimately the good sense of the vast majority of decent American's will ensure that Trump will never see the inside of the White House but in the meantime this is an unedifying time for the USA internationally and unnerving for the rest of the world which, whether we like it or not, is affected greatly by whoever does become President.
12
Isn't Barak Obama the one who suggested his Hispanic audience should bring a gun if the other guy brings a knife? Isn't he also the one who stated elections have consequences and thus did not entertain Republican leadership for nigh 18 months into his tenure? And isn't he also the guy who jumped to conclusions about an incident in Ferguson when his excitement was founded on flagrant lies? I think so. As for Trump's campaign persona and flaming tongue ... they are awful!!
"[Trump] defended the supporter who punched a young protester in the face in North Carolina last week and who said afterward that maybe he’d have to “kill him” next time, saying, "He obviously loves this country and maybe he doesn’t like seeing what’s happening to the country.”
Indeed, the link between patriotism and pointless violence has never been clearer.
In the minds of reactionaries and authoritarians the world over, "the country" is that alchemical substance that transforms brute force into the highest virtue. Obviously!
Indeed, the link between patriotism and pointless violence has never been clearer.
In the minds of reactionaries and authoritarians the world over, "the country" is that alchemical substance that transforms brute force into the highest virtue. Obviously!
9
Um, every candidate is in this for themselves.
And, these protesters are the ones starting the violence.
And, these protesters are the ones starting the violence.
11
of course and perhaps. but when one is encouraged to drop civility and be commended for his or her vile actions then yes, its trumps fault. period.
Watch some footage. The protesters hold up signs or shout something like stop the hate. The Trump supporters are throwing the punches.
Well no actually. If you are walking by and some old man decks you in the face, then he is the one charged with assault, which is what happened. But only in reality.
Donald Trump is the embodiment of outrageous. He has learned that he can garner media coverage by outrageous behavior. First, he taunted his opponents as losers and proclaimed himself the only enduring winner. Then he stooped to sexist and racist statements. Now he has moved on to inciting violence at his rallies. And the media coverage grows. Trump basks in the limelight while his opponents struggle to get any coverage whatsoever.
The media cover Trump because they love the ratings Trump produces. For the media, covering Trump's latest outrage is a win-win proposition. Readers, viewers and mouse-clickers are eager for the next story that reveals Trump's latest outrage. The media can criticize and even condemn Trump. And the readers, viewer and mouse-clickers can join in. If Trump wins, the media can look forward to four years of covering Trump in the White House. And if Trump loses, the media can claim that their coverage revealed the truth. Nice work, when you can get it.
The media cover Trump because they love the ratings Trump produces. For the media, covering Trump's latest outrage is a win-win proposition. Readers, viewers and mouse-clickers are eager for the next story that reveals Trump's latest outrage. The media can criticize and even condemn Trump. And the readers, viewer and mouse-clickers can join in. If Trump wins, the media can look forward to four years of covering Trump in the White House. And if Trump loses, the media can claim that their coverage revealed the truth. Nice work, when you can get it.
10
I can't abide Mr. Drumpf or anything he stands for, but don't sink to his level by distorting facts in your editorial. After reviewing the video, he did not "cower", he flinched, as anyone would if somebody suddenly came at them. And political operatives on both sides do their best to ensure that rally crowds are packed with supporters only. There is plenty of truly appalling material to rail at here, please stop with the cheap shots.
10
The editorial board at the NYTimes should bear the title " the propaganda board". It would be the adequate description.
16
why? explain? this is a non comment. tell us exactly what your issue is? are they wrong? did they publish lies or rumors? or were there direct quotes, videos and descriptions?
@JohnF.McBride Mr. Trump is not Hitler by your own quote. Hitler was actually a socialist as per your quote, he believed that Americans only cared about money. I think there are other more valid comparisons online to other populists who happen to be rich. My analysis points to the long list of horrible crooked misconduct of the Democrats over the years. Take Hillary Clinton, who abused power while Secretary of State. Per the watchdog group Judicial Watch, who recently obtained copies of the emails she broke her own agreement and was actively communicating with Syd Bloomenthal throughout the Lybian Crises and he was engaged in making arm's deals to make money. It's quite clear from the email she took steps to make this easier for favored companies Why was she communicating with her own employee when she said she would not work with her foundation? Her abuses were also documented in the New York Times, regarding the Russian Uranium deal and how this resulted in direct deposits of 100 million into her foundation. I think people are tired of business as usual, and stealing our future. A 19 trillion dollar debt is unprecedented. Middle America does not spend $5.00 on a latte, live in 300 square foot high rise apartments, and look down their noses condescendly at regular folk. They are fed up of paying taxes to feed the thieves. Unless you begin to understand their pain, and accept the abuses, you will never figure out why Trump is gaining popularity.
6
Look, When Trump has a choice to manufacture his clothing in the US or in China, he picked Chinese workers.
Trump forgets which foot got him out of military service, thinks McCain is a "loser" for being a POW. That should fly in the South.
When he needs workers for his fancy outfit in Florida he goes and gets immigrants from Romania to work there.
Is that "making America great"??
Trump forgets which foot got him out of military service, thinks McCain is a "loser" for being a POW. That should fly in the South.
When he needs workers for his fancy outfit in Florida he goes and gets immigrants from Romania to work there.
Is that "making America great"??
"Socialism" does not have a clear definition, as for some it seems to mean no private ownership of the means of production, and others only state/public ownership of large universally used utilities like electric, telephone, maybe the healthcare system, and other such vital services.
But your mistaken assumption that socialism and capitalism are fundamentally conflicting, non-overlapping models is completely false; take contemporary China, and nazi Germany: both had/have capitalist business economies. The hallmark of a socialist capitalism would be an authoritarian subordination of most experiences, relationships and decisions to an authoritarian culture centered around business and its priorities, exigencies and values and norms, reducing most or all to economic cogs.
But your mistaken assumption that socialism and capitalism are fundamentally conflicting, non-overlapping models is completely false; take contemporary China, and nazi Germany: both had/have capitalist business economies. The hallmark of a socialist capitalism would be an authoritarian subordination of most experiences, relationships and decisions to an authoritarian culture centered around business and its priorities, exigencies and values and norms, reducing most or all to economic cogs.
Just stop with the distortion that Nazis were socialists. They were fascists.
In a democracy governed by the rule of law, there should be no such thing as "license to violence." One should forcefully condemn the anti-Trump protesters in the auditorium who made it impossible for him to speak at a campaign event in Chicago last Friday.
Political rallies should be peaceful. Why should it be so extraordinary "to be in a political gathering of several thousand people and not see one banner nor hear one uninterrupted voice of dissent"?
Trump has been compared to Hitler. But if there be an analogy with the Nazi era, it would be a comparison of the anti-Trump protesters in Chicago with the Brownshirts or Storm Troopers (Sturmabteilung) whom the Nazis sent to disrupt the meetings of their political opponents.
Political rallies should be peaceful. Why should it be so extraordinary "to be in a political gathering of several thousand people and not see one banner nor hear one uninterrupted voice of dissent"?
Trump has been compared to Hitler. But if there be an analogy with the Nazi era, it would be a comparison of the anti-Trump protesters in Chicago with the Brownshirts or Storm Troopers (Sturmabteilung) whom the Nazis sent to disrupt the meetings of their political opponents.
10
Sure, Trump propagates violence, that's what fascists do. The only thing missing from a Trump rally are his supporters wearing black shirts as they attack his opposition.
13
@zDUde
"Trump propagates violence, that's what fascists do." How about this?
“If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun,” then Senator Barack Obama said at a fund raiser in Philadelphia on June 13, 2008, “because from what I understand, folks in Philly like a good brawl. I’ve seen Eagles fans.”
According to the Times in its June 14, 2008, report of the event, "Obama made the comment in the context of warning donors that the general election campaign against McCain could get ugly. 'They’re going to try to scare people. They’re going to try to say that ‘that Obama is a scary guy,’ he said. A supporter yelled out a deep accented 'Don’t give in!'” Obama's rhetoric was characterized by the reporter as talking "the Chicago way."
A shoe on other foot often pinches...
"Trump propagates violence, that's what fascists do." How about this?
“If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun,” then Senator Barack Obama said at a fund raiser in Philadelphia on June 13, 2008, “because from what I understand, folks in Philly like a good brawl. I’ve seen Eagles fans.”
According to the Times in its June 14, 2008, report of the event, "Obama made the comment in the context of warning donors that the general election campaign against McCain could get ugly. 'They’re going to try to scare people. They’re going to try to say that ‘that Obama is a scary guy,’ he said. A supporter yelled out a deep accented 'Don’t give in!'” Obama's rhetoric was characterized by the reporter as talking "the Chicago way."
A shoe on other foot often pinches...
First let me say to Socrates, thank you for your work. You never fail to inspire me.
Now, the lesson that is provided by the emergence of Donald Trump is that WE have produced this result. In every aspect of humanity during my seventy years WE have declined. Not that WE haven't had the occasional upward motion. Unfortunately WE continue to fall short of OUR evolutionary imperative to fundamentally change or be the cause of OUR own extinction.
Now, the lesson that is provided by the emergence of Donald Trump is that WE have produced this result. In every aspect of humanity during my seventy years WE have declined. Not that WE haven't had the occasional upward motion. Unfortunately WE continue to fall short of OUR evolutionary imperative to fundamentally change or be the cause of OUR own extinction.
15
At this rate, I believe there will be violent confrontations. Worse than Chicago in 1968. People will be seriously hurt. Riots are likely. All this feeds Trump's story, his ego, and his fans.
Trump has purposely unleashed the fears, anger, anxiety and hatred that have been the noise in this country for several hundred years. He knows that the Civil War isn't over, and he's cheering on the partisans.
We've seen that party's leaders attack foreigners and foreign countries, Mexicans, Moslems, immigrants, women, war veterans, blacks, Latinos, the Pope, scientists, environmentalists, and more - I think that the Jews are next.
This is terrible for all of us - and we now have millions of Americans led to believe that it's all perfectly American to act on those feelings with violence and hatred.
And what is the Republican Party - including their other presidential candidates and "establishment" - doing? Not much. "I'll support whoever the Party nominates" seems to be the message du jour.
I guess we'll have to do their work for them, which, ironically, Trump will love. Thanks for nothing.
Trump has purposely unleashed the fears, anger, anxiety and hatred that have been the noise in this country for several hundred years. He knows that the Civil War isn't over, and he's cheering on the partisans.
We've seen that party's leaders attack foreigners and foreign countries, Mexicans, Moslems, immigrants, women, war veterans, blacks, Latinos, the Pope, scientists, environmentalists, and more - I think that the Jews are next.
This is terrible for all of us - and we now have millions of Americans led to believe that it's all perfectly American to act on those feelings with violence and hatred.
And what is the Republican Party - including their other presidential candidates and "establishment" - doing? Not much. "I'll support whoever the Party nominates" seems to be the message du jour.
I guess we'll have to do their work for them, which, ironically, Trump will love. Thanks for nothing.
12
"We've seen that party's leaders attack foreigners and foreign countries, Mexicans, Moslems, immigrants, women, war veterans, blacks, Latinos, the Pope, scientists, environmentalists, and more - I think that the Jews are next."
You do of course realize that Trump's daughter, Ivanka, her husband and their two children are Jewish.
You do of course realize that Trump's daughter, Ivanka, her husband and their two children are Jewish.
2
Thanks for the note -
However, Trump has recently had a pastor opening for him, calling on Sanders as a 'nonbeliever' to 'come to Jesus.'
Surely not the most sensitive or aware intro for Trump.
Nevertheless, while not necessarily emanating from the Trump campaign itself, virtually all of the other Republican candidates have proclaimed their personal faith in Jesus as part of their platforms. Given Bernie's role in this campaign, I am fully expecting anti-Semitism to show itself forcefully.
However, Trump has recently had a pastor opening for him, calling on Sanders as a 'nonbeliever' to 'come to Jesus.'
Surely not the most sensitive or aware intro for Trump.
Nevertheless, while not necessarily emanating from the Trump campaign itself, virtually all of the other Republican candidates have proclaimed their personal faith in Jesus as part of their platforms. Given Bernie's role in this campaign, I am fully expecting anti-Semitism to show itself forcefully.
1
Each new episode of Trumposity proves that the monster isn't under the bed, and it isn't imaginary. It has a name and it has managed to turn a fair share of Americans into monsters eager to do his bidding.
Forgive me for taking this opportunity to scold the Editorial Board. Living far from American shores, and without a television (for most of my 55+ years in the States I didn't have one, and anyone who knows anything about Italian television will understand why I don't watch here), I rely on various print and online sources (American, Italian, and British) for news. I'm astounded how often I learn something of vital importance about the U.S. from a source on this side of the pond well before I read about it in the NYTimes. I suspect I speak for other subscribers: I expect more from this newspaper.
Forgive me for taking this opportunity to scold the Editorial Board. Living far from American shores, and without a television (for most of my 55+ years in the States I didn't have one, and anyone who knows anything about Italian television will understand why I don't watch here), I rely on various print and online sources (American, Italian, and British) for news. I'm astounded how often I learn something of vital importance about the U.S. from a source on this side of the pond well before I read about it in the NYTimes. I suspect I speak for other subscribers: I expect more from this newspaper.
8
You are spot on. My husband is from Germany. He reads several German papers daily and the NY Times. He alway discovers something important from European papers first.
1
Trump, like all the right wing populists that paved his way, is a punk. Punks tear things down. They make a loud noise. They feed on outrage and condemnation. They are unable to build anything. We will have to wait for the post-Punks, the Wire, Gang of Four, Joy Divisions of the right, before we see anything like policy and responsibility. In the end, Johnny Rotten was just a clever bomb-thrower, not a musician.
6
Excellent.
Please keep writing about this.
Please keep writing about this.
7
To our fears of how dangerous it would be if Donald Trump were to become president has been added our recognition of how dangerous he already is as a candidate for the Republican nomination. Whatever happened to our nation's laws against hate speech?
10
"Whatever happened to our nation's laws against hate speech?"
If they were enforced the Times would have a problem...
If they were enforced the Times would have a problem...
1
Why in the world didn't the media simply stop covering Trump a few months ago? Imagine what would happen if Trump held a rally and no cameras covered it. None. Imagine if every newspaper and broadcast outlet in the country had the courage to band together and reflect the courage and legacy of someone like Edward R. Murrow by simply refusing to publish anything about Trump. Nothing. No news stories, no editorials, no columns, no photos, no videos. The man is a narcissist who lives for the publicity. He has played every media outlet for a fool and the barons who own each conglomerate can't quite sacrifice the money the spectacle is bringing. Once again, corporations rule the country. Real courage would have been to effectively shut his campaign down months ago by not playing right into his hands.
8
This is the Jerry Springer Show on steroids -- to coIn a hackneyed idea.
When I heard Trump say, with a face so hard and a voice so astonishingly serious, that the protesters want to steal the right to speak, to override the first amendment, I completely didn't know what to make of it. I didn't know how to describe it, as an animal. I have never seen such dementedness.
Each morning lately I wake up and think 'was it a nightmare? ' But no. This big sucking baby's mouth with the tightly-squinted tantrummy baby's eyes is really inspiring votes as well as all the worst human garbage cheers and blows one can imagine in one place. It's unbelievable! It's unbelievable!
When I heard Trump say, with a face so hard and a voice so astonishingly serious, that the protesters want to steal the right to speak, to override the first amendment, I completely didn't know what to make of it. I didn't know how to describe it, as an animal. I have never seen such dementedness.
Each morning lately I wake up and think 'was it a nightmare? ' But no. This big sucking baby's mouth with the tightly-squinted tantrummy baby's eyes is really inspiring votes as well as all the worst human garbage cheers and blows one can imagine in one place. It's unbelievable! It's unbelievable!
10
I surely will not vote for Trump, even though I once considered it. Trump emerged in the context of maddening political gridlock and initially brought the hope that goes with a maverick who changes the dialogue. But Trump is the wrong kind of maverick. He inspires divisiveness, not consensus. There is too much good guys and bad guys about his rhetoric. I think the Editorial Board goes too far in condemning campaign violence. Good causes, most notably Rev. King's non-violent resistance movement, were met with a violent response which merely confirmed they were in the right. But Trump has little, if anything, to offer this country to move it forward, and that's what matters. Calling for his supporters to rough up tomato throwers is just not a big deal. The Board has sensibilities that are too genteel for a political campaign. What matters is that Trump doesn't have any notable ideas to make this country better. A little rowdiness in the political sphere is not a big problem. The bankruptcy of Trump's campaign, its lack of a positive message, is a very big deal.
5
What about the Democrats playing race and identity politics all the time? What about their slavish pandering to illegal aliens' amnesty and rights? What about the Democrats support of Obama's trade policies and foreign policies that have ended up being disastrous for the nation?
If you want to see why Donald Trump became popular look no further than the divisiveness and lack of leadership embodied by our current president and his enablers.
If you want to see why Donald Trump became popular look no further than the divisiveness and lack of leadership embodied by our current president and his enablers.
2
The Super Tuesday Rally in Louisville looms over the trump campaign. The ejection of a young black woman who was assaulted by the mob was the direct result of Trump calling her out from the podium. Get Out! Out! Out! Out! then as she is being abused he starts talking about the good ole days and adds another get em outta here. The guy looks and sounds like a mad man, you got people chanting for walls, and trade wars, yet the media keeps him at the top of the heap with constant coverage while ignoring his opponents. Cruz is less than 100 delegates behind, yet receives zero coverage, this is practically insuring a Trump nomination.
9
I see. Excoriate someone you don't agree with, like Trump, because he wants to eject people who come to harrass him..
...but give a free pass to people you do agree with, like protesters who physically take over university buildings and yell obscenities in the ears of students in libraries for not feeling guilty enough about their privilege. Even when their victims had no intention to hurt them and are not bothering them.
Your thinking must be convincing to someone, but it isn't to me.
...but give a free pass to people you do agree with, like protesters who physically take over university buildings and yell obscenities in the ears of students in libraries for not feeling guilty enough about their privilege. Even when their victims had no intention to hurt them and are not bothering them.
Your thinking must be convincing to someone, but it isn't to me.
9
reply to A.Rice: No different than the good Christians from the Westboro Baptist Church shouting obscenities at mourners at funerals for fallen American Service men: Have you ever written into the NYT comment pages to vent your spleen about them or pro-lifers who have murdered a Doctor, all in the name of being Pro-Life? It is not excoriating Trump- it is holding him responsible for inciting violence at HIS rallies. If he wants to hold private events- fine, but when they are held in public venues- then we here in America have the right to exercise our Constitutional Right to voice a dissent; perhaps that would be good for your nation too.
1
This is the Palestinian model, correct?
A form of Orwellian Newspeak is the official language of the radical left.
1
What I don’t understand is why when the bullying first erupted in the debates, the moderators didn’t say, “Excuse me, Mr. Trump. But we are not 7 years old. That kind of behavior is inappropriate here.”
Somebody has to call this guy out, and it appears that the moderators and the Republicans themselves are too cowed by this massive bluster, which has now exploded into the rallies.
(Someone else here cited the protests in 1968. Those people were protesting against the war in Viet Nam. That was different.)
Somebody has to call this guy out, and it appears that the moderators and the Republicans themselves are too cowed by this massive bluster, which has now exploded into the rallies.
(Someone else here cited the protests in 1968. Those people were protesting against the war in Viet Nam. That was different.)
7
The NY Times Editorial Board is one-sided in its analysis. Mr. Trump has a choice: #1, he can cave to the intimidation of the radical left groups and be passive or #2 he can refuse to cave to it and be assertive.
He has opted for Choice #2.
The radical groups can also choose. They can choose to #1, hold their own rallies and attract people with their message - and be positive or #2, attend Mr. Trump's rallies - and be negative.
They have opted for #2.
It takes 2 for this dance. To place all the blame on Mr. Trump for the dance occurring is not correct.
He has opted for Choice #2.
The radical groups can also choose. They can choose to #1, hold their own rallies and attract people with their message - and be positive or #2, attend Mr. Trump's rallies - and be negative.
They have opted for #2.
It takes 2 for this dance. To place all the blame on Mr. Trump for the dance occurring is not correct.
5
Oh, dear. "Assertive", is it? Encouraging crowds to punch people out or put them on stretchers is now what we call "assertiv"e - we used to call it inciting violence, but what the heck. But in any case, you have curiously overlooked a third way: simply tell the crowd to let a protester have a few words, as, for example, Barack Obama will often do. If an individual or group continues to make noise and disrupt the event, ask them to quiet down or depart, and if no cooperation is forthcoming, have them escorted from the premises without the knocking down, the strangleholds or the punching. Why would it be impossible, or undesirable, for Mr. Trump to maintain order and keep the microphone without calling for a violent response? All major presidential candidates in my lifetime have been able to do that. When is Trump going to show any sign of leadership?
So you think it is wrong to immediately denounce David Duke? You think is would be wrong for Trump to to tell his supporters not to be violent against the protesters? That he would be giving in to the left wing by telling a guy he was wrong to sucker punch a protester who was being led away by police in the face?
Why are people protesting at Trumps rallies? They aren't doing it to Rubio, they are doing to to Cruz. Must be that he says things that people not only don't like, but hate so much that they are moved to act. Of course as the article says that would require Trump and his supporters to take some personal responsibility, something apparently they are unwilling to do.
Why are people protesting at Trumps rallies? They aren't doing it to Rubio, they are doing to to Cruz. Must be that he says things that people not only don't like, but hate so much that they are moved to act. Of course as the article says that would require Trump and his supporters to take some personal responsibility, something apparently they are unwilling to do.
Those protesting Trump are creating disruption and causing violence that prevented him from speaking in Chicago. He has a right to speak. Not everyone who supports Trump is in love with this man; they are angry working class and middle class workers who feel cheated by the 1% who sent their jobs to other countries, denied them wage increases, imported workers from other countries at lower salaries and then fired them, and paid illegal immigrants to supposedly do work that Americans wouldn't do. And these illegals have destroyed their neighborhoods with the crime and drugs that they have brought in while costing American tax payers for all of their government hand-outs.
The Black Lives Matter movement added fuel to this fire as Americans watch our police officers under attack by those who need the police the most.
I only wish we had a better candidate to represent these Americans.
The Black Lives Matter movement added fuel to this fire as Americans watch our police officers under attack by those who need the police the most.
I only wish we had a better candidate to represent these Americans.
7
In the United States, protesters also have a right to speak, although not unendingly. Why does Mr. Trump not simply tell the crowd to let a protester have a few words, as, for example, Barack Obama will often do. If an individual or group continues to make noise and disrupt the event, ask them to quiet down or depart, and if no cooperation is forthcoming, have them escorted from the premises without the knocking down, the strangleholds or the punching. Why would it be impossible, or undesirable, for Mr. Trump to maintain order and keep the microphone without calling for a violent response (if you have not seen the numerous film montages of this man inciting violence from his own podium, you should)? All major presidential candidates in my lifetime have been able to do that. When is Trump going to show any sign of leadership?
Adolf Hitler was appalled at how Germany was humbled after World War I.
Didn't he promise to make Germany Great Again?
Didn't he promise to make Germany Great Again?
5
Donald Trump is one of the most insecure people on the planet.
5
Truly a despot in the making. Rob us of our first amendment rights to free speech, close the curtain on truth, revel in the energy of hatred and pitch American against American. This cannot and must not be America.
5
One of my concerns should Trump advance to the general election, is the potential on election day for voter oppression through violence or intimidation by a paranoid and incited fringe of his supporters.
Though I have faith in the majority of Americans to see him for what he really is, I don't think we should pretend for a second that his clan will simply go away quietly or react rationally when Trump looses the election.
Though I have faith in the majority of Americans to see him for what he really is, I don't think we should pretend for a second that his clan will simply go away quietly or react rationally when Trump looses the election.
6
It is important to remember that Trump supporters love guns. They are armed. They have "rights" to carry their guns anywhere and everywhere. How much imagination does it take to picture a scenario where some of them will start shooting into a crowd at a political rally during this presidential campaign?
5
Do people bring guns to Drumpf rallies?
To Sandy Maliga...
Great question. I would say no. I'm sure they are all patted down and go through screening for metal, etc. But...what about the bully guards?
Great question. I would say no. I'm sure they are all patted down and go through screening for metal, etc. But...what about the bully guards?
What is terrifying is that he has lent a legitimacy to those eager for violence, but who may held themselves back until now - now they feel justified, condoned. While I had been worried that such a time would come in this country, I never dreamed it would arise from a leading presidential contender! Add the preponderance of guns (other countries may be racist but not everyone is armed) and for the first time in my life, I may consider moving abroad for my own safety.
3
So I as an individual am not responsible for my behavior? So one lese is. Really!
2
This editorial definitely insists that individuals take responsibility for their own behavior. Starting with those individuals who would be President.
As you have covered the disturbances that have been breaking out at these Trump rallies, disturbances so serious that they have on at least one occasion resulted in the rally itself being cancelled, nowhere has your coverage indicated that there might be something wrong in having a bunch of noisy “protestors” trying to make a disturbance and otherwise interfering with the rights of people with whom they disagree to hold a peaceful rally. You apparently will not say it, so I will-this is thuggish behavior. It was thuggish when Hitler’s Brownshirts did it at the meetings of Social Democrats, It is thuggish when KKK goons try to disrupt meetings of the SCLC or the Urban League (or the Black Panthers, for that matter). And it is thuggish when whoever tries to disrupt Trump rallies. Trump has a right to speak. Apparently, the Times, does not feel that he has the right, as among the many judgement calls you have made in your editorial pages, nowhere have you suggested that those who make a disturbance at these events, attempting to interfere with the right of right of Trump and his supporters to peacefully assemble are acting contrary to the best traditions of this country. One wonders how the Times would react if Trump supporters started to disrupt Sanders rallies,
One of our founding fathers said; “I disagree with what you say, but will defend to the death your right to say it”. That statement is as admirable as your coverage of this campaign has been deplorable.
One of our founding fathers said; “I disagree with what you say, but will defend to the death your right to say it”. That statement is as admirable as your coverage of this campaign has been deplorable.
2
seems to me that it's the protesters who are being forcibly deprived of their right to speak...
Back in 2013 at the National Prayer Breakfast, Ben Carson said the reason education was so important is "because the people who founded this nation said that our system of government was designed for a well informed and educated populace and when they become less informed, they become vulnerable. Think about that."
Yes, let's think about that.
Trump supporters think he can keep us safe from terrorism.
This reveals two things about his supporters--
1)they are vulnerable to exploitation and have an unrealistic, irrational level of fear of terrorism and/or hatred of immigrants, Syrians, Mexicans, etc. etc.
2)they are vulnerable to manipulation and have an unrealistic, irrationally inflated idea of how much power a single man has to eliminate or prevent all threats.
But Trump is just the natural outgrowth of a deliberate misinformation and xenophobic and fear-mongering machine called the Republican Party. In 2015, Germany accepted nearly one million refugees. Meanwhile, in the U.S., 30 Republican governors protested potential admission of all Syrian refugees to their states. The states that didn't expand Medicaid are all led by Republican governors.
What Trump supporters don't realize is that he and the Republican Party have become our biggest threat--to rationality, restraint, our credibility and standing in the world, to our capacity to have a national conversation about what our problems are and how we can solve them together.
Yes, let's think about that.
Trump supporters think he can keep us safe from terrorism.
This reveals two things about his supporters--
1)they are vulnerable to exploitation and have an unrealistic, irrational level of fear of terrorism and/or hatred of immigrants, Syrians, Mexicans, etc. etc.
2)they are vulnerable to manipulation and have an unrealistic, irrationally inflated idea of how much power a single man has to eliminate or prevent all threats.
But Trump is just the natural outgrowth of a deliberate misinformation and xenophobic and fear-mongering machine called the Republican Party. In 2015, Germany accepted nearly one million refugees. Meanwhile, in the U.S., 30 Republican governors protested potential admission of all Syrian refugees to their states. The states that didn't expand Medicaid are all led by Republican governors.
What Trump supporters don't realize is that he and the Republican Party have become our biggest threat--to rationality, restraint, our credibility and standing in the world, to our capacity to have a national conversation about what our problems are and how we can solve them together.
5
Republicans do not condone words like togetherness, cooperation and compromise.
Trump gives his followers license to publicly express their bigotry and hatred. He validates their feelings of rage, encourages them to strike out in violence, then denies any culpability for their actions. He is a twisted individual totally lacking in introspection. He is incapable of acknowledging fault or offering even the mildest of apologies. He lashes out viciously at the slightest rebuke. His skill lies in stirring the pot, yet he is totally devoid of any practical ideas or solutions to address the nation's problems. The President called Trump a carnival barker, but he is proving to be something far more sinister than that. We make light of him at our own peril.
8
When you point the finger it points at you. Free political speech isn't guaranteed by Trump, it's called the Constitution. What your masters call Bigotry and Hatred will be used against you when you realize your mistake and try to get rid of them when its too late.
He should promise not to run for a second term if he doesn't get done what he brags about doing. Put your money where your mouth is, Mr. Trump.
like Obama closing Gitmo. Or having the most transparent admin ever...
Politicians lie. We believe.
Politicians lie. We believe.
1
How can anyone with a Christian bone in their body support and condone Mr. Trump's behavior?
8
Trump has insulted everyone but when some turn up to insult him back he acts like that is off limits. Bravo to the few real Americans who've had the courage to stand up for their views and their rights to express them in the midst of hostile crowds. What irony that the most disgruntled should feel a kinship to a man whose fortune has nothing in common with them. Who amongst them will be guests at Mar a Lago, reside at a Trump Tower, or play golf with his cronies? Why has the economy he rails against treated him so well, but forgotten them? Do they really think a man who never did anything for them will champion their cause as president?
5
310 days until a Republican assumes the office of president.
3
May I ask who is bankrolling these protests? Who are these protesters? Are they Democrats or Republicans or Independent ? The way I see, a political rally in the primaries is an internal affair to a party. The protesters should wait till Trump is the eventual nominee of his party.
1
Why do you presume the protests are "bankrolled"? Surely, if Mr. Trump were coming to my town I might show up to protest or at least listen until compelled to react. No one need pay a citizen to do their duty.
Let's hope we've seen the last of biased diatribes like this one when the new page editor arrives.
2
It should be noted that the leader of Don Trumps security is a former NYPD detective and it appears he influences Trump. The NYPD protected the rich, like Trump, by tormenting the "Occupy Wall Street" demonstrators years back. Another rich guy was mayor who called the NYPD his "Army".
Just like the wealthy Andrew Carnegie sent his Pinkerton guards after striking employees, some of which were killed, Bloomberg sought to quell dissent and freedom of assembly and expression. Now it's Trump.
There are many thugs in New York and unfortunately they rule it now. The NYPD have become a bigger threat than the criminals. The rich are protected by the C.I.A. and F.B.I. coached NYPD. Now Trump has adopted thuggish practices.
Who are the goods guys and bad guys anymore? Certainly Not the Democrat Obama who hired on Lynch and Comey to top posts. They both hail from the NY area.
Who is running Trump? Is it the NYPD go between from the federal government, the shadow government, or is it the Television industry with all their decades of service to cops and feds that trained him to act before cameras?
It's just a fact of life that the strongest and most dangerous animals lead the pack but this is real thuggery now, a trip down to hell they brought us. There is little dignity left in this election cycle, only thugs.
Just like the wealthy Andrew Carnegie sent his Pinkerton guards after striking employees, some of which were killed, Bloomberg sought to quell dissent and freedom of assembly and expression. Now it's Trump.
There are many thugs in New York and unfortunately they rule it now. The NYPD have become a bigger threat than the criminals. The rich are protected by the C.I.A. and F.B.I. coached NYPD. Now Trump has adopted thuggish practices.
Who are the goods guys and bad guys anymore? Certainly Not the Democrat Obama who hired on Lynch and Comey to top posts. They both hail from the NY area.
Who is running Trump? Is it the NYPD go between from the federal government, the shadow government, or is it the Television industry with all their decades of service to cops and feds that trained him to act before cameras?
It's just a fact of life that the strongest and most dangerous animals lead the pack but this is real thuggery now, a trip down to hell they brought us. There is little dignity left in this election cycle, only thugs.
2
"After a weekend of violence at his rallies, Donald Trump arrived in Florida . . ."
It was a weekend of violence planned, coordinated and executed by left-wing neo-fascists.
Deal with it like adults. The fact is that a leading candidate for president of the United States, whom I do not support, had his right to address an assembly of his supporters taken from him by a left-wing neo-fascist mob.
Trump is not inciting violence. The left is committing violence and intimidating those who are attending Trump rallies.
It was a weekend of violence planned, coordinated and executed by left-wing neo-fascists.
Deal with it like adults. The fact is that a leading candidate for president of the United States, whom I do not support, had his right to address an assembly of his supporters taken from him by a left-wing neo-fascist mob.
Trump is not inciting violence. The left is committing violence and intimidating those who are attending Trump rallies.
10
Trump decided not to go through with the event in Chicago. His campaign decided not to have it because he was afraid. It was only after he backed out that clashes between protesters and supporters broke out. Because the Trump campaigns pays for the venues and the rally's they are private events from which he can remove anyone he wants. Up until Chicago that is what had been happening.
People like you claim that the protesters are the ones bringing violence to these rally's, but where is your evidence? There are thousands of people at these events filming everything, where is the video of the protesters initiating the violence? What we do have is plentiful evidence of Trump encouraging violence and violence directed at protesters by Trump supporters.
When Hitler was making his bid for power in Germany there were many Germans who helped him, many Germans who cheered, many Germans made excuses for his actions and language, and many Germans who did nothing, but all Germans regretted his rise to power and the nightmare he created. Do you really want to be counted as one of those kinds of people in Trump's rise to power.
America and American's are great and we deserve better than a lying, fraud named Donald Trump.
People like you claim that the protesters are the ones bringing violence to these rally's, but where is your evidence? There are thousands of people at these events filming everything, where is the video of the protesters initiating the violence? What we do have is plentiful evidence of Trump encouraging violence and violence directed at protesters by Trump supporters.
When Hitler was making his bid for power in Germany there were many Germans who helped him, many Germans who cheered, many Germans made excuses for his actions and language, and many Germans who did nothing, but all Germans regretted his rise to power and the nightmare he created. Do you really want to be counted as one of those kinds of people in Trump's rise to power.
America and American's are great and we deserve better than a lying, fraud named Donald Trump.
Trump says that there is no violence at his rallies. In fact, they are a love-fest.
Then again, this is a man who lies every 5 minutes, as per detailed analysis carried out by Politico.
I'm not sure why the media has been so reticent thus far in challenging Trump on his inability to tell the truth. I mean, the man lies every 5 minutes. That fact alone should define his campaign.
Also, not sure why the editorial describes his crowds as affable before his campaign stirs up emotions. Obviously one shouldn't paint with a broad brush, for there are likely many people in the crowd who are good and decent and are possibly there only out of curiosity or entertainment, but then, there are also ugly videos of his supporters telling people to "go back to Africa", or "go back to Auschwitz"... Let's not forget that there are polls documenting that 60% of Trump supporters believe that President Obama was born in Kenya, or is a Muslim. There is anger in his crowds and Trump stokes it like a petty demagogue.
Then again, this is a man who lies every 5 minutes, as per detailed analysis carried out by Politico.
I'm not sure why the media has been so reticent thus far in challenging Trump on his inability to tell the truth. I mean, the man lies every 5 minutes. That fact alone should define his campaign.
Also, not sure why the editorial describes his crowds as affable before his campaign stirs up emotions. Obviously one shouldn't paint with a broad brush, for there are likely many people in the crowd who are good and decent and are possibly there only out of curiosity or entertainment, but then, there are also ugly videos of his supporters telling people to "go back to Africa", or "go back to Auschwitz"... Let's not forget that there are polls documenting that 60% of Trump supporters believe that President Obama was born in Kenya, or is a Muslim. There is anger in his crowds and Trump stokes it like a petty demagogue.
5
"... several times he repeated the lie ..."
Hallelujah! This space is calling a lie a lie!
Hallelujah! This space is calling a lie a lie!
3
"others are simply upset with a nation, or a life, that’s dealt them a bad hand."
The question to be asked is, "Why are there enough of these types in America to possibly get this guy elected POTUS?" Right there's yer problem, bubba. Let's get down to "root cause analysis", eh?
The question to be asked is, "Why are there enough of these types in America to possibly get this guy elected POTUS?" Right there's yer problem, bubba. Let's get down to "root cause analysis", eh?
1
People should stop going to Trump's rallies to protest or stir it up. They are just giving him more news time. And the networks are eating it up. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the news organizations are actually hiring people to go to the rallies to protest so they have something they can show over & over. You want to stop Trump, stop giving him attention. Don't pay him any mind.
Most of the people who support Trump are the same people who watched his TV show and reality TV in general. I'm sorry but they are just not very smart. Often times the only answer they have is violent. What do expect from a man who curses on the campaign trail and changes what he says often in the same interview? In a way Mr Trump is just what we, the citizens of this country deserve. Most of the mainstream artwork and media for the past 20 or so years has just been pure garbage. Movies that make no sense and are one violent scene after another. The 30 second promos for them are often shooting, punching, sheer nonsense in your face again & again. Hit music is pieced together confusion with the singer using auto tune. The news .. oh forget it, I could use up a book going into that. It's no wonder Trump has the following. Political correctness run amok. Politicians who do nothing but raise money and get us into wars. Insurance commercials every second acting like they are giving us money. Prescription drugs that have more side effects than what they are supposed to do. Honestly it's scary & sad
Most of the people who support Trump are the same people who watched his TV show and reality TV in general. I'm sorry but they are just not very smart. Often times the only answer they have is violent. What do expect from a man who curses on the campaign trail and changes what he says often in the same interview? In a way Mr Trump is just what we, the citizens of this country deserve. Most of the mainstream artwork and media for the past 20 or so years has just been pure garbage. Movies that make no sense and are one violent scene after another. The 30 second promos for them are often shooting, punching, sheer nonsense in your face again & again. Hit music is pieced together confusion with the singer using auto tune. The news .. oh forget it, I could use up a book going into that. It's no wonder Trump has the following. Political correctness run amok. Politicians who do nothing but raise money and get us into wars. Insurance commercials every second acting like they are giving us money. Prescription drugs that have more side effects than what they are supposed to do. Honestly it's scary & sad
1
In a Nov. 2015 Vanity Fair article entitled "Donald Trump a Narcissist? Therapists Weigh In," journalist Henry Alford collects observations made about Donald Trump by a collection of psychology experts. Alford writes that the therapists' concern about Trump's behavior in the first few months of his ongoing presidential campaign must have led them to feel compelled to break "the Goldwater rule,' which, Alford explains, "declares it unethical for psychiatrists to comment on an individual’s mental state without examining him personally and having the patient’s consent to make such comments.
"Remarkably narcissistic," Harvard Graduate School of Education professor Howard Garner is quoted as saying about Trump.
“He’s so classic that I’m archiving video clips of him to use in workshops because there’s no better example of his (Narcissistic Personality Disorder)," clinical psychologist George Simon says. "He's a dream come true."
A nightmare come true is more like it. Writer Maria Konnikova lists NPD characteristics: exaggerated sense of self importance, need for excessive admiration, sense of entitlement, lacking empathy, believing others to be envious of themselves, and arrogant, haughty, contemptuous behavior or attitude.
“He’s applying for the greatest job in the land, the greatest task of which is to serve," another clinical psychologist says about "The Donald," "but there’s nothing about the man that is service-oriented. He’s only serving himself.”
Heaven help us.
"Remarkably narcissistic," Harvard Graduate School of Education professor Howard Garner is quoted as saying about Trump.
“He’s so classic that I’m archiving video clips of him to use in workshops because there’s no better example of his (Narcissistic Personality Disorder)," clinical psychologist George Simon says. "He's a dream come true."
A nightmare come true is more like it. Writer Maria Konnikova lists NPD characteristics: exaggerated sense of self importance, need for excessive admiration, sense of entitlement, lacking empathy, believing others to be envious of themselves, and arrogant, haughty, contemptuous behavior or attitude.
“He’s applying for the greatest job in the land, the greatest task of which is to serve," another clinical psychologist says about "The Donald," "but there’s nothing about the man that is service-oriented. He’s only serving himself.”
Heaven help us.
4
Mr. Trump, with multiple deferments, multiple wives, gutsy talk, yelling and screaming saying he'll punch someone in the face and take someone out in a stretcher, is in reality a coward of a magnitude that's hard to fathom. And that was on full view for anyone who observed his body language when that man jumped the barricades, even with armed agents surrounding him.
Pathetic does not begin to describe the man, and revulsion at what he has wrought doesn't begin to describe how I feel.
Pathetic does not begin to describe the man, and revulsion at what he has wrought doesn't begin to describe how I feel.
17
Remember his cowering when the symbol of America, the Bald Eagle, attacked him too.
2
I have just one question. Why do people assume that working class Americans are racist bigots. Where is the proof? All of this criticism of Trump is premised on us thinking very bad things about his supporters. But, what have they done to deserve such bad assumptions. One 78-year-old guy suckered punched a protestor, OK. What else? Maybe there were a few other instances where obnoxious protestors were treated more harshly than necessary, but I haven't seen any reports of people actually being physically harmed. People claim the moral high road, then absolutely trash decent working class people without any real evidence. Tell me, what type of pathology is that?
4
You may be right but people are attributing the Donald's "racist" attitudes to the people who seem to agree as they are supporting him. If you do not want people to think you are a racist do not support a candidate who lumps people in groups and then says awful things about them.
There are many things that one can and should dislike about Trump, but what really gets me riled up is his claim that his supporters “love this country”. Apparently anyone who supports Trump “loves this country.” True patriots who have fought in wars for what the US stand for but do not support Trump, by inference, do not love this country. And this coward man has audacity to call Senator John McCain, a decorated and truly brave solider a “loser”. Trump has no shame. His penchant for wrapping himself in a flag to hide the nakedness of his deceit is pathetic. He does not need a flag for that, a fig leaf smaller than his hand would do.
5
As sickening as it is to watch footage from Trump rallies, it is almost as sickening to watch cable news coverage of same. The Trump phenomenon is a byproduct not only of a Republican party who has been laden with racist, mysogynist, homophobic, etc dog whistles for four decades but, perhaps equally, a mainstream media, which has spawned this madness. This is what Paddy Chayefsky predicted in his seminal work, Network, only the 2016 reality is substantially more idiotic and perverse, by a factor of a hundred.
4
It is sad to see millennials supporting Trump (some 18% now, and some 25% in case he runs against Hillary or Bernie). Besides being "tech savvy", is critical thinking another feature of this demographic? Not a single statement at Trump rallies (either from him, of any supporter) resists a systematic analysis. Yet, too many young people see him favorably. That is just sad.
5
Imagine a Trump Presidency. He has made all these insane promises, most of which no President could keep.
The Wall. OK, well that idea, insane as it is, will not necessarily cause a crisis. Teams of builders working on a pharaonic project in the southwestern desert aren't going to cause the republic to fail. Whatever else happens, the Wall is going up.
But what about the forced deportation of 12 million people?
What about the plan for a registry of Muslims?
What about restricting Muslims from entering the country?
The threatened trade wars with China?
The insane economic plan he submitted almost in jest?
Can any of us say, honestly, that we know which of these things were seriously meant? Personally, I don't think Trump believes in many of the things he says. He is interested in his own power and he says whatever he needs to say to get more of it. I am willing to believe he would just choose to forget most of what he said during the campaign.
What most scares me about the idea of a Trump presidency is this: he is utterly incapable of taking responsibility for his own actions. If a terrorist attack were to happen on American soil, and people began pointing fingers at Trump, I truly believe he would be capable of hatching a proposal to bring back WW2 internment camps for American Muslims. Trump would throw anyone under the bus to excuse his own mistakes. He is that vain. He cares about nothing but himself.
The Wall. OK, well that idea, insane as it is, will not necessarily cause a crisis. Teams of builders working on a pharaonic project in the southwestern desert aren't going to cause the republic to fail. Whatever else happens, the Wall is going up.
But what about the forced deportation of 12 million people?
What about the plan for a registry of Muslims?
What about restricting Muslims from entering the country?
The threatened trade wars with China?
The insane economic plan he submitted almost in jest?
Can any of us say, honestly, that we know which of these things were seriously meant? Personally, I don't think Trump believes in many of the things he says. He is interested in his own power and he says whatever he needs to say to get more of it. I am willing to believe he would just choose to forget most of what he said during the campaign.
What most scares me about the idea of a Trump presidency is this: he is utterly incapable of taking responsibility for his own actions. If a terrorist attack were to happen on American soil, and people began pointing fingers at Trump, I truly believe he would be capable of hatching a proposal to bring back WW2 internment camps for American Muslims. Trump would throw anyone under the bus to excuse his own mistakes. He is that vain. He cares about nothing but himself.
4
Wow! This editorial is unhinged. Who have you got in your newsroom these days? A bunch of hyperventilating HuffPo wannabes? Buzzfeeders? I read the NYT to get levelheaded news coverage and commentary, not this sort of DailyKos-type guff.
8
To you unhinged but every word back by video
Strange thing about the Trump mob: Call one a liar to his face and watch him go ballistic. But lie to him incessantly and he'll vote to make you president of the USA.
8
In light of all this, what more can be said?
If Trump is elected, our democracy's dead.
If Trump is elected, our democracy's dead.
7
When thugs break up opposition political rallies and newspapers urge them on as "freedom fighters" its already dead.
But better dead than Red.
Right?
But better dead than Red.
Right?
1
It is so incredibly sad for me to see how Political Correctness has taken over our nation, and that is why I, as a progressive support Mr. Trump.
Trump is not about hate, that is our PC-Establishment's sick projection.
The PC-Establishment keeps trying to paint Mr. Trump as a racist, but Ben Carson, and millions of other black people aren't buying this smear, apparently the evidence here is this "David Duke" thing, Trump has denounced Mr. Duke for years, he did so 2 days before the CNN interview, and did repeatedly after the interview. You guys can't take Yes for an answer.
Mr. Trump doesn't hate Mexicans or immigrants, he simply wants to follow the law and deport all of them that are currently here illegally. It can be done, and should be done, otherwise, we are signalling that we're not serious about enforcing our borders, and more illegal immigrants will flood in, while the people back in their home countries who follow our laws, and sit on waiting lists are penalized.
Mr. Trump is not a religious bigot, he is acknowledging the fact that Islam is an ideological construct based on violence against infidels, and oppression of women. There is simply no way to know which Muslims are following the teachings of the Koran and the Prophet and waging jihad, and which ones have rejected those despicable 'revelations'.
BostonBomber, Maj Hasan, SanBernidino-Killers, All those folks 'seemed' peaceful. Screening= didn't catch the SanBeridino wife
Violence @Rallies, is due to rioters
Trump is not about hate, that is our PC-Establishment's sick projection.
The PC-Establishment keeps trying to paint Mr. Trump as a racist, but Ben Carson, and millions of other black people aren't buying this smear, apparently the evidence here is this "David Duke" thing, Trump has denounced Mr. Duke for years, he did so 2 days before the CNN interview, and did repeatedly after the interview. You guys can't take Yes for an answer.
Mr. Trump doesn't hate Mexicans or immigrants, he simply wants to follow the law and deport all of them that are currently here illegally. It can be done, and should be done, otherwise, we are signalling that we're not serious about enforcing our borders, and more illegal immigrants will flood in, while the people back in their home countries who follow our laws, and sit on waiting lists are penalized.
Mr. Trump is not a religious bigot, he is acknowledging the fact that Islam is an ideological construct based on violence against infidels, and oppression of women. There is simply no way to know which Muslims are following the teachings of the Koran and the Prophet and waging jihad, and which ones have rejected those despicable 'revelations'.
BostonBomber, Maj Hasan, SanBernidino-Killers, All those folks 'seemed' peaceful. Screening= didn't catch the SanBeridino wife
Violence @Rallies, is due to rioters
7
People holding signs do not equal rioters in the civilized world. Time and again Trump supporters have acted in the most vile manner. Not being politically correct doesn't give a person license to spit at, hit beat, or yell at another human, unless of course you are less than human. I cannot believe it when I see Adolf Hitler's 1930's campaign for chancellor being run so successfully in the US.
and how would you excuse one of his warm up people saying that Bernie needs a "come to Jesus" moment since he does not believe in God?
Thank You for still being able to think clearly. Destroy PC/Cultural Marxism before it destroys our freedom.
2
It should be noted that the violence so far is against Trump. It is supported (and probably bankrolled) by groups associated with both Sanders and Clinton. (The protesters, themselves, have associated themselves with Sanders.) I'm not aware of any Trump supporters (let alone Cruz or Rubio supporters) disrupting Clinton events.
Trump's rhetoric is no stronger than Obama's with his talk of "pitchforks", "getting in their faces", "punching back twice as hard", and referring to opposing politicians as "terrorists".
Political violence in America remains a left-wing phenomenon.
Trump's rhetoric is no stronger than Obama's with his talk of "pitchforks", "getting in their faces", "punching back twice as hard", and referring to opposing politicians as "terrorists".
Political violence in America remains a left-wing phenomenon.
8
Once again, Trump had a golden opportunity over the weekend to raise his game and act more "presidential". Once again, he proved beyond any doubt that he has absolutely no capacity to do so. This is him. This it it. This is all he's got. The likely 2016 republican nominee has all the tact and oratory skills of a rejected announcer from wrestle mania. He will likely be the crudest and most narcissistic person ever to become a major party's nominee in the history of the United States.
6
The root of this hatred is fear. Anger is a primary coping mechanism for the fearful. Rather than facing our fears people choose to express anger. It's basic flight and fight. The fear must be dealt with to eliminate the anger that seethes into unmitigated hatred. For everyone's sake, we must find the means of soothing our collective fears.
Heartfelt education is one means.
Heartfelt education is one means.
2
Donald Trump is the personification of the cowardly bully. He uses his "bully's pulpit" and despicable cynicism to make any protestor a campaign prop and allow his boorish sycophants their Orwellian two minutes of hate. His loathsome stream of consciousness repetitions of the usual banalities, degrades the Republican brand with every word. It is absolutely ignominious for the other 3 candidates to slice and dice Trump's character, ethics, and honesty, and then in an separate acts of sordid hypocrisy, say they will support him if he's the nominee. Ted Cruz even says that he is being consistent with his "word". I'm surprised that he has forgotten the aphorism of his fellow Harvard alum, Ralph Waldo Emerson, "a foolish consistency is hobgoblin of little minds". Especially with the addition of Trump inspired weekend violence, everyday that Cruz fails to reject a Donald Trump candidacy his mind and political future shrink.
4
Groups of left wing thugs attack those attending a peaceful rally and it is the fault of the speakers? I have never heard of such convoluted thinking in my life. As another writer pointed out Obama has generated some violence in both the Trayvon Martin and Ferguson situation but somehow that is different. Why?
1
The men who signed the Declaration of Independence and Constitution knew and used political violence. It was a Revolution that killed a lot of people. The Founders in particular were expert in it. They'd won.
"Four score and seven years later" we fought a civil war that had brewed as political violence since the Kansas-Nebraska fiasco and Bloody Kansas, a full decade of political violence.
Our labor movement went through many years of private detectives and state troops shooting workers who tried to unionize. That too was political violence.
The riots of the 1960's were political violence.
Americans are quite capable of political violence.
We have been quite some time without it. We've forgotten. We take for granted our peace. Well, that's wrong. Political violence is entirely possible right here. Common enough to be no surprise to anyone willing to see it.
And we are heavily armed. Disarming us would be impossible. That too is a political fact. The Founders meant it to be. They were experts in this remember.
Trump right now is like a kid playing with a loaded gun. The Founders meant to put that price on fooling with violence against Americans.
Either Trump stops this, or it will get really ugly, really fast, as it was in truth meant to.
"Four score and seven years later" we fought a civil war that had brewed as political violence since the Kansas-Nebraska fiasco and Bloody Kansas, a full decade of political violence.
Our labor movement went through many years of private detectives and state troops shooting workers who tried to unionize. That too was political violence.
The riots of the 1960's were political violence.
Americans are quite capable of political violence.
We have been quite some time without it. We've forgotten. We take for granted our peace. Well, that's wrong. Political violence is entirely possible right here. Common enough to be no surprise to anyone willing to see it.
And we are heavily armed. Disarming us would be impossible. That too is a political fact. The Founders meant it to be. They were experts in this remember.
Trump right now is like a kid playing with a loaded gun. The Founders meant to put that price on fooling with violence against Americans.
Either Trump stops this, or it will get really ugly, really fast, as it was in truth meant to.
7
The media is far more responsible for any violence that ensues than is Donald Trump. You may have noticed, or not, that it has been the anti-Trump left wing thugs that have started the trouble. Another master of double speak!
1
"I'll pay the legal bills for someone to punch that man" for what he says is not the man speaking "starting the trouble." The trouble in question is violence, not heckling or protest signs.
Trump is a bully, a thug, a coward, a provocateur and a great big putz.
Above all, he is a raging lunatic who is a danger to this amazing nation of ours.
Above all, he is a raging lunatic who is a danger to this amazing nation of ours.
2
And the thugs that bring violence to his meetings are what? It has been the left wing thugs that have created any and all violent situations and not the Trump following. This is precisely what the population is tired of and why Trump gains followers with every event!
1
Two points: In the context of Trump's campaign, "telling it like it is" not only means being able to freely express --without the filters of polite niceties -- racism, sexism, xenophobia and other forms of hate; it also means being able to express through physical force a desire to exclude the Other from the nation's collective regard (why, btw, aren't we talking about the supporter who "punched a young protester" [i.e., African American] as someone who should be charged with a hate crime?). In this way,Trump and the violence he incites are object lessons on how 1st Amendment protection of hate speech literally and figuratively collides with the spirit and purpose of the 14th Amendment. Indeed, these lessons should force us to admit that it's high time we catch up with other western nations (like Germany) and ban hate speech altogether.
Second, though much has been written about Trump's narcissism, greed, ego, etc., maybe we should also talk about his profound unhappiness. He's a billionaire, he's white, he's male -- he's incredibly privileged, in other words, and yet he chooses to hate, to bask in hate, and to feed the hate of those who will never have what he's obtained. Viewed in this light, "making America great again" is ultimately an invitation to keep company with misery.
Second, though much has been written about Trump's narcissism, greed, ego, etc., maybe we should also talk about his profound unhappiness. He's a billionaire, he's white, he's male -- he's incredibly privileged, in other words, and yet he chooses to hate, to bask in hate, and to feed the hate of those who will never have what he's obtained. Viewed in this light, "making America great again" is ultimately an invitation to keep company with misery.
3
WHO does he hate? What is wrong with you people? Trump has the right to speak out, freedom of speech. WE have the right to hear him, freedom of assembly....................
1
In Art of the Deal, Trump said people who speak negatively about him are "losers" because they got nothing nice to say about themselves (or, in this case, about any of the other candidates.) If journalists wrote more about Cruz, Rubio, Sander, Hillary, etc, and put Trump only into the footnote were he belongs, maybe we wouldn't find ourselves in this scary situation which he may actually win. Media be like Trump Trump Trump 24/7, and now scratching their heads why he's winning.
1
America is a violent country.
Even something as simple as the second amendment which refers to the right of a nation to maintain a profession military has been distorted to mean something completely different.
The Dictionary of Samuel Johnson is online. The definition of Militia is a government controlled military. The definition of arms are military weapons of offense and defense there are no other credible 18th century definitions.
Each and every GOP candidate wraps themselves in a false definition of the second amendment. That to me says Donald Trump is not the disease he is just a symptom.
Even something as simple as the second amendment which refers to the right of a nation to maintain a profession military has been distorted to mean something completely different.
The Dictionary of Samuel Johnson is online. The definition of Militia is a government controlled military. The definition of arms are military weapons of offense and defense there are no other credible 18th century definitions.
Each and every GOP candidate wraps themselves in a false definition of the second amendment. That to me says Donald Trump is not the disease he is just a symptom.
4
I have a hard time believing that a campaign (Trump's) based on the personality of its candidate has much investment in the behavior of its followers - it would seem that his followers that are causing this trouble would have done the same if given only the choices of a Rubio or Cruz candidacy through which to express their extreme point of view - Trump seems to manage it better than his competitors
I have a hard time also that Trump imagines himself a Mussolini, Perón, or other Fascist leader - the rush to ascribe that to him is kind of amusing from the distance of a foreign country (especially the one who thinks will pay for building his "wall")
seems that the real fear Americans (or Liberal ones at least, of which I'm a member, and certain Editorial boards) have at the moment is that a popular real estate developer, reality star and casino owner has made fools of the earnest, or probably more, intolerant, on both sides of the aisle
I have a hard time also that Trump imagines himself a Mussolini, Perón, or other Fascist leader - the rush to ascribe that to him is kind of amusing from the distance of a foreign country (especially the one who thinks will pay for building his "wall")
seems that the real fear Americans (or Liberal ones at least, of which I'm a member, and certain Editorial boards) have at the moment is that a popular real estate developer, reality star and casino owner has made fools of the earnest, or probably more, intolerant, on both sides of the aisle
Mr. Trump, with multiple deferments, multiple wives, gutsy talk, yelling and screaming saying he'll punch someone in the face and take someone out in a stretcher, is in reality a coward of a magnitude that's hard to fathom. And that was on full view for anyone who observed his body language when that man jumped the barricades, even with armed agents surrounding him.
Pathetic does not begin to describe the man, and revulsion at what he has wrought doesn't begin to describe how I feel.
Pathetic does not begin to describe the man, and revulsion at what he has wrought doesn't begin to describe how I feel.
4
Oh boo hoo
Like to have seen you on that stage, you would have reacted exactly the same way
Like to have seen you on that stage, you would have reacted exactly the same way
I find it loathsome that you think a presidential candidate's reaction while being rushed is a measure of his courage.
What are you, and the NYT hoping to see happen?
What are you, and the NYT hoping to see happen?
1
Trump is blamed for inciting the violence, but many of the so-called victims just so happened to be Sanders supporters. They were surely there looking for trouble, like the people that put on the Draw Mohamed rally in Dallas. Wouldn't that mean that BS is also to blame for the violence? After all, his dog whistle message of blaming the "rich" for all the problems in America is tantamount to calling for a class war. Which is just as bad as calling for a race war.
4
Trump's message is the embodiment of Nixon's run to the right in the primary, then to the center in the general. The rhetoric that Trump uses will turn on a dime when he gets the nomination. The saddest part of the whole charade is not the man sending the ugly message, it's the audience that craves it. While Trump deserves all the scorn that he gets, it's our American soul that needs redemption.
7
Trump through his skinhead-packed political rallies, has now defaced democracy itself, and given it the image of something far more sinister-Nuremberg 1936-all that is missing is the flaming torches and Leni Riefenstahl directing the camera angles.
As the loathsome & odious individual he is, he rants against the protestors who often quietly register their aversion to him and his ideology of hate by doing nothing more than rightly calling him un_american or simply wearing a hijab (as one Muslim woman recently did), Yet Trump and his fascist ilk cannot even tolerate that-I guess that their version of free speech does not allow it-only they are entitled to exercise their first amendment rights-heaven forbid anyone else should.
Trump's ability to whip his minions into an orgy of hate is on full display for the entire world to see and he illustrates what this country has become in a very ugly way. To me, the ultimate irony is that there was once a time, when the "Greatest Generation" fought to cleanse the world of a great evil (Nazism), and countless Americans died in an international struggle to purge humanity of Fascism-the very movement that Trump and the Republican party have foisted upon the American people. Unfortunately, my generation does not have an FDR
As the loathsome & odious individual he is, he rants against the protestors who often quietly register their aversion to him and his ideology of hate by doing nothing more than rightly calling him un_american or simply wearing a hijab (as one Muslim woman recently did), Yet Trump and his fascist ilk cannot even tolerate that-I guess that their version of free speech does not allow it-only they are entitled to exercise their first amendment rights-heaven forbid anyone else should.
Trump's ability to whip his minions into an orgy of hate is on full display for the entire world to see and he illustrates what this country has become in a very ugly way. To me, the ultimate irony is that there was once a time, when the "Greatest Generation" fought to cleanse the world of a great evil (Nazism), and countless Americans died in an international struggle to purge humanity of Fascism-the very movement that Trump and the Republican party have foisted upon the American people. Unfortunately, my generation does not have an FDR
122
Wake up Trump worshippers; we have a new Mussolini in the making
"an orgy of hate?" are you kidding me?
1
I stand by my comments. Trump is HUUUUGE for the Nationalist Socialist Workers Party and their endeavor to ethnically cleanse America in order to "Make America great again." David Duke and his White Supremacist vermin said so-I guess that testament is like something from the burning bush!!
What seemed obvious to everyone for a long time is now becoming clearer to the press. Why does the press seem to be the last to know these terrible things? What is coming is not normal, not pretty, not good for business, and not American. There is no silver lining in pointed white sheets.
6
The mighty NYT and mainstream media have yet another meltdown. Yawn.
The professional protestors go INSIDE a Trump rally, with an agenda and an attitude that they will do what they do at their liberal institutions, spit, harass and create a climate of fear and intimidation. And of course, they are rewarded with media coverage non-stop. All the while, knowing that the media will be blaming Trump for the result of this agitation.
This is not surprising to anyone who knows politics. What is surprising is that nobody likes underhanded tactics, and Trump supporters are not fooled, nor is the candidate willing to back down and be shamed for something that is not his responsibility.
Give me a break. From racist to xenophobe, to fascist, to Hitler to violence inciting. The ever increasing shrill criticism of Trump is now indicative more of the accusers than it is of the candidate. They want him out, no matter what.
The only conclusion a sane person could make is that big money and entrenched interests are getting nervous. Good.
The professional protestors go INSIDE a Trump rally, with an agenda and an attitude that they will do what they do at their liberal institutions, spit, harass and create a climate of fear and intimidation. And of course, they are rewarded with media coverage non-stop. All the while, knowing that the media will be blaming Trump for the result of this agitation.
This is not surprising to anyone who knows politics. What is surprising is that nobody likes underhanded tactics, and Trump supporters are not fooled, nor is the candidate willing to back down and be shamed for something that is not his responsibility.
Give me a break. From racist to xenophobe, to fascist, to Hitler to violence inciting. The ever increasing shrill criticism of Trump is now indicative more of the accusers than it is of the candidate. They want him out, no matter what.
The only conclusion a sane person could make is that big money and entrenched interests are getting nervous. Good.
5
Excuse me? Who has been more representative of "Big Money" and Entrenched Interests" than Mr. Trump, himself: the self-proclaimed billionaire who glories in having used the tax code rules (written by himself and his ilk) and the visa program (ditto) to enrich himself at the expense of...his supporters?
Who?
Who?
1
Trump is big money and preying on the gullible, can you not understand that? You must be gullible!
1
How well said! Your comments contain so much more truth than the august editorial board of this paper could ever write!
2
The protests launched by militant leftists who shut down Donald Trump’s Chicago rally were far more aggressive and destructive than reported, says a Chicago Police officer (Breitbert News)
“It seems the [media] aren’t broadcasting footage of the debris being thrown across Harrison by Sanders/Hillary supporters at Trump fans,” the officer wrote shortly after the canceled Trump event.
The officer, who posed anonymously on the Second City Cop blog, also noted the media didn’t report that protesters were running through parking lots and breaking windows of cars with Trump stickers on them, or that the department called out emergency Incident Teams to cope with the anti-Trump riot at the University of Illinois in Chicago.
“It seems the [media] aren’t broadcasting footage of the debris being thrown across Harrison by Sanders/Hillary supporters at Trump fans,” the officer wrote shortly after the canceled Trump event.
The officer, who posed anonymously on the Second City Cop blog, also noted the media didn’t report that protesters were running through parking lots and breaking windows of cars with Trump stickers on them, or that the department called out emergency Incident Teams to cope with the anti-Trump riot at the University of Illinois in Chicago.
4
Unsubstantiated claims from an anonymous source posted on a notoriously partisan website, prove nothing. That said, the idea that your opponent's bad behavior justifies your own is morally bankrupt.
I watched Rachel Maddow's show tonight. She showed clips, endless clips, of Trump talking about how "exciting" it is to see the violence that goes on at this rallies. He used that word over and over again: "exciting"...over and over again. I believe that Trump is actually getting turned on, physically turned on, by what is happening. He's a disgusting, vile, perverted man who makes George Wallace look like a mainstream candidate.
8
RE "...stir up racially charged viciousness and attacks, then talk about how it symbolizes 'LOVE' from people who 'want to see America be made great again' .”
In George Orwell's "1984" dystopian novel,
"The Ministry of LOVE (or Miniluv in Newspeak) serves as Oceania's interior ministry. It enforces loyalty to Big Brother through fear, buttressed through a massive apparatus of security and repression, as well as systematic brainwashing." (Source: Wikipedia)
That's the kind of love Mr. Trump is getting ready to provide us with.
In George Orwell's "1984" dystopian novel,
"The Ministry of LOVE (or Miniluv in Newspeak) serves as Oceania's interior ministry. It enforces loyalty to Big Brother through fear, buttressed through a massive apparatus of security and repression, as well as systematic brainwashing." (Source: Wikipedia)
That's the kind of love Mr. Trump is getting ready to provide us with.
2
Basking in the energy of turning one person on another is the heart of the Democratic Party operation. Hey get angry and blame other groups whether it be whites, men, Christians, the rich or anyone else outside the voting block. This irony is bizarre it it obviousness.
4
you have to give it to Trump, he is the perfect demagogue. Bullying is another 'perfect' sign of insecurities brewing inside, a hallmark of cowardice and arrogant posture, a mask for his ignorance and prejudices, now in full display.
3
As a Sanders supporter, I am disgusted by what happened with Trump.
Trump has the right to express himself at an event his campaign scheduled. One is able to protest the event, but peacefully and outside. However, lets put the shoe on the other foot: what is Trump protesters started invading Sanders' rallies? The Times' tone would be different.
To Trump supporters, seeing organized liberal protesters invade their rally solidifies the idea which this country is too PC, one which you cannot express yourself without being labeled a misogynist or racist.
The Times has not bothered to comment on the education level of African American Hillary voters in the South, but we all know Trump supports are 'uneducated' and 'white', even though his appeal is broad. This is an example of the too PC culture peddled by The Times and other media outlets. This feeds the Trump phenomenon. The blame does not lie solely with Republicans.
I love Sanders, but when I walk by hundreds of minorities in my downtown residence, or drive through some of the hardest areas of Cincinnati, I see a lot of people who just don't care. Sanders will essentially provide people who have nothing a lot of free stuff, and even though I might vote for him, it has been eye opening living in mixed residential communities, and my support for Sanders wanes each passing day I wake up and go to work, but see the same people doing nothing.
Trump has the right to express himself at an event his campaign scheduled. One is able to protest the event, but peacefully and outside. However, lets put the shoe on the other foot: what is Trump protesters started invading Sanders' rallies? The Times' tone would be different.
To Trump supporters, seeing organized liberal protesters invade their rally solidifies the idea which this country is too PC, one which you cannot express yourself without being labeled a misogynist or racist.
The Times has not bothered to comment on the education level of African American Hillary voters in the South, but we all know Trump supports are 'uneducated' and 'white', even though his appeal is broad. This is an example of the too PC culture peddled by The Times and other media outlets. This feeds the Trump phenomenon. The blame does not lie solely with Republicans.
I love Sanders, but when I walk by hundreds of minorities in my downtown residence, or drive through some of the hardest areas of Cincinnati, I see a lot of people who just don't care. Sanders will essentially provide people who have nothing a lot of free stuff, and even though I might vote for him, it has been eye opening living in mixed residential communities, and my support for Sanders wanes each passing day I wake up and go to work, but see the same people doing nothing.
7
Thank you for being open minded enough to see the truth. I feel sorry for the people of Chicago that simply wanted to hear Trump speak. The thugs that invaded the rally, attacked cops, ripped signs, and broke the windows of cars with Trump bumper stickers - I don't understand how anyone can defend that. And the fact that the media has turned it into criticism against Trump - it boggles my mind.
1
What frightens me the most is what will these people do if Trump is denied the nomination? He has unleashed many people who now feel that their hate is justified. He has unleashed many people who just want to see the world burn. They want blood. And all of the "those people" Trump is aiming them at are us. Whether he wins the nomination or not, there will be violence. If he, God help us, becomes POTUS, we are all in danger of becoming a target.
American politics, journalism and entertainment glorify violence, in spite of violence failing to bring the results its instigators promise. This cult of violence feeds on the fear it generates, and with so many weapons in hands itching to use them, The Times is right to condemn Trump. Unfortunately, it may be too late to stop the madness.
1
A socialist, a snake oil salesman and a victim of sniper fire on the tarmac in Bosnia (oh, wait)...this is the best America has? Think about it, if Hillary is indicted, Sanders may be the Democratic nominee, likely leaving us with Trump and Sanders? Ouuufff.
2
While I agree wholeheartedly with the belated attention that Trump is receiving, it is unfortunately counterproductive. It only affirms the belief of his supporters that the media are out to get him, and stiffens their resolve and anger with the "Establishment".
He knows full well what he's doing, and the critics are playing into his hands.
Back off people, let him win the nomination, I have complete faith that he is unelectable and would never survive. Hopefully the backlash will turn out enough voters to gut the current Republican party and the radical right that has so effectively hijacked the Congress.
Tone the harsh rhetoric and attacks down, don't worry,
this is the country that elected a person of color, not just once, but twice. Let's all just fade away, untill the real race begins. He feeds on the anger he generates, on both sides. Without it he will flounder and doom himself.
He knows full well what he's doing, and the critics are playing into his hands.
Back off people, let him win the nomination, I have complete faith that he is unelectable and would never survive. Hopefully the backlash will turn out enough voters to gut the current Republican party and the radical right that has so effectively hijacked the Congress.
Tone the harsh rhetoric and attacks down, don't worry,
this is the country that elected a person of color, not just once, but twice. Let's all just fade away, untill the real race begins. He feeds on the anger he generates, on both sides. Without it he will flounder and doom himself.
Hmmm...20 comments so far and they all attack Trump..Do you think that reflects America or that the moderators are acting objectively? Of course not. This is the Times "All the news we think you should know and nothing else"
6
I am not a Trump supporter. But the nytimes one sided reporting is shameful. Let *me* make a decision - but present the facts, not just the tidbits you feel like reporting. The latest example is: Trump halted his rally due to protesters infiltrating it. Now all we see on Nytimes front page is how Trump is the cause of that violence. This is intentionally misleading. Not five years ago nytimes would have cared more for balanced (/accurate) reporting instead of grinding the axe of the viewpoint of its more recent editorial board.
6
By encouraging his supporters to be physically violent toward even the non-violent protestors, Donald Trump obviously is actively encouraging his supporters to commit a violent crime.
If Trump becomes president, I'm afraid that his violent rhetoric will have some unintentional consequences, such as encouraging children and teenagers to react with physical violence if another kid calls them a bad name, etc.
If Trump becomes president, I'm afraid that his violent rhetoric will have some unintentional consequences, such as encouraging children and teenagers to react with physical violence if another kid calls them a bad name, etc.
Gee...So Trump is the new Hitler.
And all of this time I thought it was a President evading and denigrating the Constitution and our traditions. The guy who derided the American people, ignored their will and the will of their elected representatives. The President who attacked the SCOTUS, stoked racial and class division and promoted attacks on the police and civil society and who lied to and spoke down to the people every day while doing Mussolini on the balcony impressions. You know...that Saul Alinsky community organizer guy. Geeez how wrong could I be...Trump...who knew...
And all of this time I thought it was a President evading and denigrating the Constitution and our traditions. The guy who derided the American people, ignored their will and the will of their elected representatives. The President who attacked the SCOTUS, stoked racial and class division and promoted attacks on the police and civil society and who lied to and spoke down to the people every day while doing Mussolini on the balcony impressions. You know...that Saul Alinsky community organizer guy. Geeez how wrong could I be...Trump...who knew...
6
Please provide facts Maxine? I know that will be difficult as Fox does not provide facts. Hitler is quite the stretch- but if you listen to Trump, and compare it to the hatred, and blaming others, for the challenges that we face- you hear Hitler in his early days.
Hello, Maxine--
It's pointless, I guess, but you should know that not one single thing in your comment is accurate, except maybe your name and city. None of that stuff you talk about happened, which is why our guy Barack got elected twice. And get this--if it weren't for the 22nd Amendment he could run again, and if he did, he'd win.
Of course Trump is no Hitler; he lacks the tenacity and organizational skill. He's more of a banana republic despot--Trujillo, say, or Batista. Anyway, thanks for reading and enjoy Chicago. I miss it.
It's pointless, I guess, but you should know that not one single thing in your comment is accurate, except maybe your name and city. None of that stuff you talk about happened, which is why our guy Barack got elected twice. And get this--if it weren't for the 22nd Amendment he could run again, and if he did, he'd win.
Of course Trump is no Hitler; he lacks the tenacity and organizational skill. He's more of a banana republic despot--Trujillo, say, or Batista. Anyway, thanks for reading and enjoy Chicago. I miss it.
Protesters or organized anarchists? The vote will answer the question.
6
It took a lot of cultivation over years to make this Frankenstein. As Brandon Stanton of Humans of New York said, it's not a political decision to oppose Trump. It's a moral one. Congratulations right wing media and politicians for transforming legitimate conservative values of fiscal restraint and self reliance into a movement of rabid hatred and fear. Who benefits?
2
Can't anyone at the NYT see the irony of using fascist tactics- shouting down speakers, storming the stage, etc.- to protest against a politician you accuse of 'giving a license to violence'? All it does is strengthen his message that American institutions are under attack by 'others'.
http://www.newyorker.com/news/john-cassidy/the-chicago-anti-trump-protes...
The best way to treat a political candidate with which you disagree is to vote against him, or her. Blaming him or her for your violent protests is self-defeating.
http://www.newyorker.com/news/john-cassidy/the-chicago-anti-trump-protes...
The best way to treat a political candidate with which you disagree is to vote against him, or her. Blaming him or her for your violent protests is self-defeating.
6
I do fine it interesting how you deride Trump, but place no blame on MoveOn.org, George Soros, or the Bernie Sanders campaign. Many of these protest were planned with the intent of causing violence, just you would cover ot as you are right now. Trump is no saint and I'm not a fan, but anytime free speech is denied we must look at all parties..not just Trump.
7
Other than Trump bleating that from the stage- where are the facts? Trump is a pathological liar and yet it is truth to his followers
Stop blaming the Bernie Sanders campaign. In no way was Bernie's campaign a part of any of this. Trump's own words and actions have brought karma to call.
Again, what are the laws pertaining to "Yelling Fire in a crowded theater"?
Or, "Inciting a Riot"?
Or, trying to start ethnic cleansing?
The Don is so quick to offer legal help for those committing violence.
Perhaps a diversion from the really villainy.
Or, "Inciting a Riot"?
Or, trying to start ethnic cleansing?
The Don is so quick to offer legal help for those committing violence.
Perhaps a diversion from the really villainy.
1
It is pretty annoying to see a distorted and one-sided editorial.
I am not a Trump supporter, at all, but the violence that I have seen comes from the Left. One old guy punched someone on camera and that is your justification for putting all of the blame for a small amount of violence on Trump.
What we saw in Chicago was a clear blow against the first amendment rights of thousands of people going to a political event by an organized group of protesters intent on blocking access to the auditorium and preventing a speaker from being heard.
Do you condone that?? That is the story.
I am not a Trump supporter, at all, but the violence that I have seen comes from the Left. One old guy punched someone on camera and that is your justification for putting all of the blame for a small amount of violence on Trump.
What we saw in Chicago was a clear blow against the first amendment rights of thousands of people going to a political event by an organized group of protesters intent on blocking access to the auditorium and preventing a speaker from being heard.
Do you condone that?? That is the story.
6
The protesters were exercising their First Amendment rights. Peaceful protest, no matter how loud, have always been core part of our democracy.
That Donald refused to show up at his own rally had more to do with the fear of violence form his own followers -- who did and have at other rallies inflicted harm on protestors.
So there was no "blow" to the Amendment. The only "blows" have been punches and tackles from Trump followers, and verbal ones from the "punch-him-in-the-face" Donald himself.
That Donald refused to show up at his own rally had more to do with the fear of violence form his own followers -- who did and have at other rallies inflicted harm on protestors.
So there was no "blow" to the Amendment. The only "blows" have been punches and tackles from Trump followers, and verbal ones from the "punch-him-in-the-face" Donald himself.
1
This is great! I've looked at The Five on Fox News and although, in reality they hate The Donald, they are going out of their way to defend him! Incite to violence? No way! Is The Donald ever wrong? Not according to him and now he has plenty of sycophants because he's a WINNER.
Donald has a type of dishonesty that is very appealing. Here's a recording of what you said -- I never said that. Case CLOSED!
You want to see an economic disaster? You want to see the Dow down 50%? Elect The Donald!!
Donald has a type of dishonesty that is very appealing. Here's a recording of what you said -- I never said that. Case CLOSED!
You want to see an economic disaster? You want to see the Dow down 50%? Elect The Donald!!
13
The events that I saw were not of Trump supporters going to a Sanders or Clinton rally. They were the other way around. Protest is one thing. Trying to disrupt is quite another. If these confrontations had occurred where Trump supporters went the other's rallies to disrupt, this story would probably be written with an entirely different slant. That's discouraging from The NYT that they don't even mention the possibility of mutual blame.
8
That's because there is no mutual blame, HRM. The only candidates condoning violence are the Republicans, where both Trump and Chris Christie have declared that they want to punch people in the face. None of the Democratic candidates have said anything close to this, and in fact have condemned the violent talk, as every candidate should be doing.
If people come to Trump's rallies to protest his bigotry and misogyny, it's because his words and his alone drew them there - to object.
If people come to Trump's rallies to protest his bigotry and misogyny, it's because his words and his alone drew them there - to object.
1
The point is that opponents can show up at Sanders, Clinton, Cruz and Rubio rallies if they wish, and the candidates will not encourage the audience to punch them!
1
On the other hand, neither the Sanders or the Clinton campaigns have demonized Mexicans, Muslims or African Americans. Neither have they invited their supporters to "punch in the face", "carry out on stretchers", or "beat the --- out of" anyone who speaks back to them. In other words, they haven't incited the hatred that Trump has so skillfully sowed. What you saw in Chicago was the natural consequences of running a neo-fascist campaign in a multi ethnic, democratic republic.
1
Oh, spare us, please. This was instigated by Sanders supporters, moveon.org and student radicals who were already juiced up by anti-Rahm protests. I am no friend of Trump, but he has a right to say what he wants. Moveon.org has already admitted to providing posters and organizing venues for these Bolsheviks. Student organizers were quoted by NBC (but, strangely, not by the Times) as being excited by the outcome and applauding their colleagues efforts at denying Trump his First Amendment rights. The Left continues its descent into complete radicalization.
12
This is the new spin from Trump - he is to be protected from dissent, especially if the protests are organized. Well, organized protests are not illegal, and they can be quite effective. You can't expect to run on a platform of hate and division and NOT attract organized opposition. As long as its not violent, the Donald should be strong enough to handle opposition, but he's too thin skinned and my respond with simultaneous whining and bullying.
I can't (or am afraid to) think there are enough angry, embittered and deluded Americans to actually make Donald Trump our president. Especially considering a majority voted for Barack Obama twice.
10
What happens if Hillary or Sanders wins the election? What will all of these raving Trump fans do then? If we all think it's bad now just wait to see what happens if Trump loses.
3
Ann,
You don't mention what will happen if he WINS. If this madness he is concocting is not contained by some means or other before the Republican convention, we will be looking at far worse trouble than we're looking at now. The point is that this is what he WANTS. He has no intention of trying to stop it. Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. If you think it's bad now...
You don't mention what will happen if he WINS. If this madness he is concocting is not contained by some means or other before the Republican convention, we will be looking at far worse trouble than we're looking at now. The point is that this is what he WANTS. He has no intention of trying to stop it. Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. If you think it's bad now...
Trump is a master at marketing, The demonstration at the Chicago rally was staged. The Trump campaign claims the Chicago Police Dept cautioned them to cancel. The Police Dept said they did not make the suggestion. Is there a great investigative reporter still on the New York Times payroll who could break this story? It could put Trump out of the race! Sickem, boys!
7
The Times is absolutely right. But the media isn't helping.
They have given him far too much attention and free media. If it weren't for their indulgences, he'd have had to spend millions of dollars on ads to get attention. When he delivers a stupid speech (And his speeches are monumental mice -- long, drawn-out rabid monologues of hate and invective), both CNN and MSNBC immediately give him coverage and there's no political news on TV with the exception of Der Fuhrer Trump.
Imagine that lunatic on the nuclear button.
They have given him far too much attention and free media. If it weren't for their indulgences, he'd have had to spend millions of dollars on ads to get attention. When he delivers a stupid speech (And his speeches are monumental mice -- long, drawn-out rabid monologues of hate and invective), both CNN and MSNBC immediately give him coverage and there's no political news on TV with the exception of Der Fuhrer Trump.
Imagine that lunatic on the nuclear button.
8
Trump is a lying, bullying, tough guy and people love him. Why? Because all the "closet" racists in this country now have a leader that is saying all the things that these crazies think, but have not been allowed to say because it was not politically correct. Trump admits to not being PC, and this is what you get. A foul mouthed hater that is dividing this country.
I don't understand how his supporters can stomach his lies and limited knowledge of world politics and US policy. He constantly repeats himself on the 4 or 5 general talking points that he stands for, but he has no plans that go deeper than his thick skin.
Wake up America! This isn't a reality show.
I don't understand how his supporters can stomach his lies and limited knowledge of world politics and US policy. He constantly repeats himself on the 4 or 5 general talking points that he stands for, but he has no plans that go deeper than his thick skin.
Wake up America! This isn't a reality show.
190
Blaming Donald Trump even in part for the violence that has broken out at his rallies is nonsense. This is the same left-wing agitation that has plagued the nation for decades now, a rage that fixes on one target of opportunity after another.
In the ’90s, the same kind of radicals besieged meetings of the World Trade Organization — with blood on the streets of Seattle in 1999. New York City got a taste of it at the 2004 Republican convention; most of Boston was shut down to prevent the same at that year’s Democratic convention.
America saw it in the lawlessness and riots of the Occupy Wall Street movement. The folks in Ferguson, Mo., blamed outside agitators for turning their legitimate protests into riots that devastated the city.
In the ’90s, the same kind of radicals besieged meetings of the World Trade Organization — with blood on the streets of Seattle in 1999. New York City got a taste of it at the 2004 Republican convention; most of Boston was shut down to prevent the same at that year’s Democratic convention.
America saw it in the lawlessness and riots of the Occupy Wall Street movement. The folks in Ferguson, Mo., blamed outside agitators for turning their legitimate protests into riots that devastated the city.
1
People are angry Slacky.... And dissillusioned as well.
The american dream is a sham.
People are barely able to survive.
Do you understand that part?
The american dream is a sham.
People are barely able to survive.
Do you understand that part?
1
No. It is much worse. It is The Donald reality. America still sleeps...
When he had his supporters chanting USA! USA! USA! at a recent rally, after once again yelling about how "great" everything is going to be when he is President, Trump eerily reminded me of a fascist dictator.
9
there is an interesting article in Slate about that
Immediately cancel his bid for office. Remove him from the Republican party.
6
Not that simple.... Nor would ot be democratic.
Just dont vote for him!
Just dont vote for him!
How? This is America. Anyone can run for president. There is no mechanizum "canceling" a bid office. And the Republican party (and the Democratic party as well) doesn't have a membership requirement other than just saying "I'm a Republican".
Sorry Editorial Board, the public isn't swayed by your or CNN's or Fox News's or MSNBC's or WaPo's false narratives. People that think for themselves can all see clear as day both the "violence" and overt racist displays by Trump "supporters" are being orchestrated by far-left groups and Trump's status quo Establishment challengers. Both sides DESPERATELY want the billionaire donors can't control gone.
Is it any wonder why American's trust in the media is at an all-time low?
Is it any wonder why American's trust in the media is at an all-time low?
13
@Erica
Wow, you sure drank the Trump Kool-aid. Have you even actually READ anything or watched a news program all the way through that is NOT Fox News or similar fascist media source??
Wow, you sure drank the Trump Kool-aid. Have you even actually READ anything or watched a news program all the way through that is NOT Fox News or similar fascist media source??
You're right. I saw it. That protester definitley hit that poor Trump supporter by smacking his elbow with his face! And that was a Moveon.org operative making Trump say things like "I'd like to punch him the face, I'll tell you." Or was it really his voice?
You don't have to be a fan of Trump to see that the New York Times has foolishly aligned itself with the "Anyone But Trump" forces, not only in its ceaseless editorials (as if anyone who would conceivably vote for Trump would ever read a New York Times editorial) but, more disturbingly, in its reporting and news analysis. This week we've been treated to nearly a dozen editorials and News articles going after Trump, his internal angst, his propagating violence, his boorishness etc.,,,. In this respect, the New York Times seems to have made common cause with the Koch Brothers, and other Republicans who see their chances and long term plans to eliminate estate tax, fight income equalization, control the congress, fight off a more liberal Supreme Court and more, go up in smoke, as they see him to be a losing candidate (they are so right there) who will not follow the Republican orthodoxy.
So, where are the articles about Ted Cruz. After all, he is far more dangerous than Trump, after all, as he actually might win, appointing far right judges and developing an evangelist based plan for government.
Lay off of Trump already. Let him get the nomination with the blessings of all Democrats who will be able to feel more secure about what a. might happen to the Republican Party long term and b. might happen to its presidential aspirations in 2016. And maybe the New York Times will regain some respectability regarding its reporting.
So, where are the articles about Ted Cruz. After all, he is far more dangerous than Trump, after all, as he actually might win, appointing far right judges and developing an evangelist based plan for government.
Lay off of Trump already. Let him get the nomination with the blessings of all Democrats who will be able to feel more secure about what a. might happen to the Republican Party long term and b. might happen to its presidential aspirations in 2016. And maybe the New York Times will regain some respectability regarding its reporting.
9
I am inalterably opposed to Mr. Trump's candidacy, but I have come to understand why his dishonest campaign is resonating with so many Americans, and it is rooted in the dishonesty of the “establishment,” with the NY Times and other acolytes of President Obama as the primary culprits. Given the choice between Trump’s lies and the lies of the “establishment,” people are choosing Trump. The “establishment” wants us to believe that happy days are here again, and that is the most important lie that people are rejecting. Is the unemployment rate 40 percent? Of course, not, but it is at least as big of a lie to say that only five percent of the people can’t find full-time, meaningful work. And which lie appeals more to people’s genuine concerns? It is pernicious lie to imply, as Trump does, that all Muslims are bad, but it is a foolish lie to suggest that Islam has nothing to do with the threat of terrorism facing America and the world. Which lie does a better job of addressing Americans’ genuine concerns? Trump exaggerates the problems with Obamacare, but the “establishment” tries to ignore the real costs of Obamacare to millions of Americans and exaggerate its benefits. For example, my family’s health insurance deductible has more than doubled in two years, and yet, we still have 29 million people without insurance. In short, Trump will probably be our next president, because his lies speak to the reality facing most Americans better than Obama’s lies do.
19
Excellent analysis.
Excellent comment. If Americans are to be lied to at least give us a fresh set of lies to replace the stale old lies promulgated by the "establishment" of both parties.
The fact is that by their silence the Republican party is condoning all this, just as they condoned Trump's bigotry towards President Obama with his birther nonsense.
Let’s dispel with the notion that Trump does not reflect the racism and bigotry of the Republican party. He does. If he did not they would speak up and he would never be allowed to be the standard-bearer of their party. They know exactly what they’re doing.
By their actions so far the Republicans are prepared to have a liar and a bigot as a leader of their party and perhaps of this great country.
Let’s dispel with the notion that Trump does not reflect the racism and bigotry of the Republican party. He does. If he did not they would speak up and he would never be allowed to be the standard-bearer of their party. They know exactly what they’re doing.
By their actions so far the Republicans are prepared to have a liar and a bigot as a leader of their party and perhaps of this great country.
11
But Mr. Trump, who blathered on about “winning” on Sunday, has not a single solid, truthful idea about how to address the roots of this seething anger.
---------------------
Wrong.
He said he'd make it costly for US companies to leave for offshore sites.
He said he wants US to stop subsidizing the military in several foreign countries - same thing Obama echoed about "free riders" last week.
He said he wants the US Dept of Education dismantled since it's an anachronism.
He said he wants to build a border wall and extract subsidies from Mexico to pay for it via tariffs, or whatever Mexico finds most palatable.
All of those issues resonate with the American voter, NYT, west of the Hudson.
---------------------
Wrong.
He said he'd make it costly for US companies to leave for offshore sites.
He said he wants US to stop subsidizing the military in several foreign countries - same thing Obama echoed about "free riders" last week.
He said he wants the US Dept of Education dismantled since it's an anachronism.
He said he wants to build a border wall and extract subsidies from Mexico to pay for it via tariffs, or whatever Mexico finds most palatable.
All of those issues resonate with the American voter, NYT, west of the Hudson.
7
Trump is a typically coddled upper class white man, baiting others with fear and anger, happy (like most Republican hawks who didn't serve in the military themselves--cf. Dick Cheney) to send others to commit the violence while he cowers in the corner until the coast is clear and he can spout off once again. What is so shocking to me is that someone can have so much money and so little class. That he flaunts his classlessness so flagrantly, is adored by those with far less money and probably even less intelligence, and gets away with it, speaks volumes about America's coarsened public life and popular culture. He really is the Republican Party's Frankenstein monster--and he is doing to the party what the original monster did to the not-so-good Dr. F.
141
So when the president said "get in people's faces and challenge them" you all said the same thing, right? When this administration sicced the IRS on their "enemies" everyone was up in arms at the horror and the hatred, right? How about everyone stop pointing fingers and start taking some stock of their own leftist privilege. I am not a trump fan, but people exercising their free amendment rights only seems to upset the left when it's an opinion they don't like.
6
You can't be serious!
Yeah we have trump and unfortunately clinton, mainly because of the dnc, nyt and other establishment product placement organizations. Hold your nose and vote is the new american ideal.
2
In no way do I condone violence against protestors. However I do believe in the right of people who wish to attend a Trump event to have a chance to hear him speak. The goal of these protestors (which seem organized) is to deny Trump the right to speak and the audience the right to listen. This behavior does nothing but reinforce the resentment felt by many of Trump supporters and further polarizes the political process. These disruptive "protests" need to be condemned as well by the media. If the protestors were a bunch of 2nd Amendment advocates disrupting and stopping Clinton or Sanders rallies I am pretty sure the press coverage would focus on the protestors. Always a double standard with the main stream liberal media.
9
No doubt, if protesters are disruptive, they should be escorted out. That is standard operating procedure. But Trumps wants to prohibit even orderly behavior like sign holding. He is a world class whiner.
License to violence? Who then has given license to the violence on the streets of Democrat run Chicago and our other major cities? How many people were murdered, shot, stabbed, clubbed, raped, beaten and robbed in Democrat Chicago this weekend unrelated to Trump? An average night in Chicago makes a Trump rally look like a prayer service. Do Black lives matter to the left and the Times? One also has to ask too why is it bad when ordinary Americans defend their 1st Amendment rights against left wing thugs and paid stooges? Why is it not bad when extreme left wing crazies across the country deny Americans their 1st Amendment rights on campuses and other venues across the nation daily? Can the Times editorial board explain that?
7
Trump is no longer amusing.
Neither is Cruz, but he never was.
Rubio and Kasich don't count.
Neither is Cruz, but he never was.
Rubio and Kasich don't count.
2
I thought there were laws in the United States that protected us from hate speech. When I see videos of Donald Trump inciting the crowd to hit and punch the people he calls "protesters" I have to wonder why he is legally allowed to speak in this way. I understand that many of the people who support Trump for president also seem to support his right to say anything he wants in his rallies.
As a trained social worker, this does not surprise me. We all know about the power of mob violence. But what about the law of the land? It almost seems as though the laws against hate speech and inciting violence do not apply to Donald Trump. Do we have to wait for someone to be critically injured or even killed before this man is stopped?
So many of us have been worried about the danger that would come to our country and the world if Donald Trump were to become president. Now we see that he is a danger before he even becomes the Republican nominee.
As a trained social worker, this does not surprise me. We all know about the power of mob violence. But what about the law of the land? It almost seems as though the laws against hate speech and inciting violence do not apply to Donald Trump. Do we have to wait for someone to be critically injured or even killed before this man is stopped?
So many of us have been worried about the danger that would come to our country and the world if Donald Trump were to become president. Now we see that he is a danger before he even becomes the Republican nominee.
158
hate speech is legal. hate is free. speech is free. hate speech is free.
so hate speech by the protestors is ok in your mind because you agree with them...there was a shooting in chicago yesterday and 3 policemen were shot and the perpetrator was killed..where are the liberal protestors...from what i have seen and heard the protestors , not all of them but maybe the ones hired by move on.org, were trying to cause a confrontation and the press was more than a willing accomplice in the reporting...if you disagree with trump protest with your vote, do not instigate confrontations...many voters despise hillary clinton, many voters are scared of bernie sanders, an avowed socialist, bankrupting the country...yet you don't see these people violently confronting them...history shows that most or even all violent political confrontations have been perpetrated by politically left leaning people and organizations...
1
@ Patricia: '...I thought there were laws in the United States that protected us from hate speech...'
It is frightening that so many Americans do not understand that our First Amendment guarantees every one of us the right to free speech (with few limitations), not just those who speak words they agree.
It is frightening that so many Americans do not understand that our First Amendment guarantees every one of us the right to free speech (with few limitations), not just those who speak words they agree.
1
We the People are very confused..... copied.....Fred Swartz--- Barack Hussain Obama
In his own words
“They Bring a Knife…We Bring a Gun” – Barack Obama
“I want you to argue with them and get in their face!” – Barack Obama
“I don’t want to quell anger. I think people are right to be angry! I’m angry!” – Barack Obama
“Hit Back Twice As Hard” – Barack Obama
“We talk to these folks… so I know who’s a** to kick“– Barack Obama
Republican victory would mean “hand to hand combat” – – Barack Obama
“Punish your enemies.” – Barack Obama
“I’m itching for a fight.” – Barack Obama
Was OBAMA INCITING VIOLENCE ?? or there is a double standard ??
SHAME ON THE PRESS !!!
In his own words
“They Bring a Knife…We Bring a Gun” – Barack Obama
“I want you to argue with them and get in their face!” – Barack Obama
“I don’t want to quell anger. I think people are right to be angry! I’m angry!” – Barack Obama
“Hit Back Twice As Hard” – Barack Obama
“We talk to these folks… so I know who’s a** to kick“– Barack Obama
Republican victory would mean “hand to hand combat” – – Barack Obama
“Punish your enemies.” – Barack Obama
“I’m itching for a fight.” – Barack Obama
Was OBAMA INCITING VIOLENCE ?? or there is a double standard ??
SHAME ON THE PRESS !!!
9
Oh silly Eva, its all about context.
Eva, Please! It doesn't matter what Obama says. It only matters what Trump says! That's why people want to vote for Hillary. At this point, what does it matter?
Thank you for doing the editors job Eva, he was at a BLM/Move On rally.
2
Trump is frightening, whether or not one subscribes to the analysis that he is the inevitable final result of the Republican swing to the demonizing right (I do). He eerily repeats visual scenes and verbal tirades that evoke memories of the worst human transgressions of the 20th century. But as many have mentioned, the opprobrium of citizens who see him for the unclothed emperor he is only emboldens his raging devotees. How can we unite and mobilize all those Americans who see the danger? Bullies crumble without passive or enabling bystanders. Is there no way to address the many sideliners who, feeling disadvantaged or disappointed by their country, are Trump's targets, but who might just as easily be called to behave with an upstanding sense of decency and community -- given leadership that spoke to (or for) them? There must be some group of people with enough of a public profile to gather together, address the sense of alienation that Trump co-opts, and shout, 'this is not the way.' Those of us who already see the danger can mobilize, and speak up, and refuse to be passive, but we also need to persuade fellow citizens who can rise above these basest of attitudes.
7
I want to correct the record on something that was mentioned in the article. My friend and I were not denied entry by security guards. We got inside the gate and then when we held up our signs we were ordered by Trump personnel to leave or be arrested for trespass. So I have to ask: What does it say about the Trump campaign that they are opposed to a benign, silent protest asking to stop the hate?
20
Thank you for posting this! And how can someone call your presence "trespass"?
Very annoying!
But God bless you for your courage and convictions!
Very annoying!
But God bless you for your courage and convictions!
It is a private event. If the host doesn't like the guests for any reason, he has the right to ask them to leave.
Let's make America gr...hate again.
Eventually the peyote will wear off. Wait until the comedians get hold of him and take the gassy wind out of his sails. Glad it's only March, and not November.
Eventually the peyote will wear off. Wait until the comedians get hold of him and take the gassy wind out of his sails. Glad it's only March, and not November.
5
The media coverage is fueling the fire here. Maybe if we gave Trump a lot less attention, he would be a lot less successful. Every article you publish about him, just fuel his fire. That hasn't worked, so if you really want to stop him, why don't you try the opposite? Suffocate the fire by taking away the fuel.
4
Monmouth University poll just cited on CNN's Don Lemon show said Trump got a huge boost from the Chicago riot. The other panelist said 6 different polls today show him up to 20 pts. ahead of anyone else.
5
Germany. 1930s.
Chicago. 1968.
1
The Times is not accurately reporting this story. I an not a Trump supporter but there was an orchestrated large scale action in Chicago to stifle his right to seek and to incite a dangerous confrontational situation. Should Trump do more to distance himself from thuggery - yes. But the left engaged in large scale thuggery and the Times painted it as Trumps own doing. Its very chilling and it is not honest. MoveOn.Org sitting down speech they don't agree with is just as bad as anything Trump has done - actually worse because it doesn't own up to it.
11
As a native of Ohio, it pains me that Cleveland has spent decades rebuilding and rehabilitating its image, only to 'win' the 2016 Republican convention. Images of Chicago 1968's chaos flash before my eyes.
A proud and great city, through no fault of its own, may be fated to serving as a punchline for yet another generation.
A proud and great city, through no fault of its own, may be fated to serving as a punchline for yet another generation.
2
Trump has campaigned for president before, and never got traction. Even after Obama's first term. What has changed? I have never been so scared.
4
Aw don't be scared it's just a trick. When Trump became a front runner the Times had to give him the full treatment just like they do to every Republican or anyone daring to oppose their anointed candidate. They know when your scared you're more likely to fall into line.
1
America is not a hateful nation and the only thing Trump has “stirred up” is a new belief that we can take our country back from a corrupt, intrusive and suffocating government and return it to everyman Americans. His success in identifying the resonant national critical issues and offering common sense solutions has sparked the political revolution we are all witnessing by engaging the great silent majority in a way that no American political leader has done in the last 100 years.
Fearful of his success and possible ascendance to the Oval Office, a desperate liberal establishment has sent their anti-free speech goons to stir up trouble and incite the violence being reported here. Please note that there are no Trumpists invading Hillary or Bernie rallies; they have too much respect for the process, and know that such strong arm tactics always backfire on the aggressor.
Fearful of his success and possible ascendance to the Oval Office, a desperate liberal establishment has sent their anti-free speech goons to stir up trouble and incite the violence being reported here. Please note that there are no Trumpists invading Hillary or Bernie rallies; they have too much respect for the process, and know that such strong arm tactics always backfire on the aggressor.
18
Thank You! Awaken fellow Americans to where the REAL hate speech comes from. Destroy decadent political correct subversive cultural Marxism wherever it tries to strangle free speech and expression. Kudos Bear Boy
2
If you need a job, Comedy Central may be hiring new writers.
Return it to :everyman Americans"? To whom are you referring? Certainly not black Americans, Muslim Americans, or Latino Americans, Perhaps not even women. His "everyman" is a white middle aged male who is experiencing a shift in power.
I can see it already - should Trump win, the NEW Secret Service will be simply referred to as the "SS." If you dare protest prez Trump, you will be kicked out - kicked out of the country.
7
LOL
If you dare protest... He's in favorof torture!
What nonsense.
Yes Trump has been strident, but he doesn't have thugs in front of the venues with sticks as occurred during the last election.
Indeed, the Tea Party and the Right have been quite pleasant - it is the Left that has carried sticks and pursued violence.
Article after article in the "media" espousing that Trump is inciting violence, when actually he is not - it's the media that is pushing that he's inciting violence because it suits their purpose to tar and feather the opposition and incite violence.
Yes Trump has been strident, but he doesn't have thugs in front of the venues with sticks as occurred during the last election.
Indeed, the Tea Party and the Right have been quite pleasant - it is the Left that has carried sticks and pursued violence.
Article after article in the "media" espousing that Trump is inciting violence, when actually he is not - it's the media that is pushing that he's inciting violence because it suits their purpose to tar and feather the opposition and incite violence.
11
Denial will do no good.
No doubt, just look at the BLM and Occupy demonstrations, which always devolve into violence.
Trump loves a dust up--
Appeals to his base.
Then he can mop-up
And relish disgrace
That to a mere mortal
Would prove to be fatal.
Appeals to his base.
Then he can mop-up
And relish disgrace
That to a mere mortal
Would prove to be fatal.
Appeals to eveybody's base, this maniac. It's amazing how much his talkie teen le WWF events, the ultimate caveman id extravaganza. If such a candidate could win, I hate to say it, but not only will our country have gone down the tubes (a point as obvious as it is tragic), but it would be the ultimate indictment of our educational system that could so dumb down our electorate as to excise any wisdom or intellectual standard from its deliberation.
Although the "standards and accountabilty" movement (with its soul-purging technology of economic carrots and sticks as main motivational component) has come under fire lately (including over not just inadequate learning but the countless cheating scandals it bred), Trump's potential election is its most damning scandal.
Although the "standards and accountabilty" movement (with its soul-purging technology of economic carrots and sticks as main motivational component) has come under fire lately (including over not just inadequate learning but the countless cheating scandals it bred), Trump's potential election is its most damning scandal.
If Trump has any capacity for reflection (admittedly, a dubious proposition), he must wonder whether his strategy risks a severe backlash. The notion of some observers that he can say or do anything he pleases, without consequences, implies a deep contempt for the electorate.
Trump certainly attracts an alienated segment of the electorate which appears to regard civilized behavior as a form of discredited political correctness. But, in the states that have voted so far, that support rarely exceeds 38% of the GOP faithful. These results provide the only reliable measure we have of the man's popularity. While hardly conclusive, they do not herald a tidal wave of support even within the GOP.
The violence that has begun to inject an additional level of ugliness into Trump's campaign may not cool the ardor of his core supporters, but it will certainly make uncommitted voters think twice before they tie their hopes for the country to the political chariot of such a volatile man. Trump cannot change who he is, which confers an enormous advantage on the Democrats.
Whether Clinton or Sanders wins the nomination, the Democratic candidate should shine, in comparison to Trump, as a disciplined adult with a serious agenda for the future well-being of the country. Clinton's Wall Street baggage and Sanders's foolish fondness for the socialist label will not save a Trump whose lack of ideas and self-control brand him as unsuitable for high office.
Trump certainly attracts an alienated segment of the electorate which appears to regard civilized behavior as a form of discredited political correctness. But, in the states that have voted so far, that support rarely exceeds 38% of the GOP faithful. These results provide the only reliable measure we have of the man's popularity. While hardly conclusive, they do not herald a tidal wave of support even within the GOP.
The violence that has begun to inject an additional level of ugliness into Trump's campaign may not cool the ardor of his core supporters, but it will certainly make uncommitted voters think twice before they tie their hopes for the country to the political chariot of such a volatile man. Trump cannot change who he is, which confers an enormous advantage on the Democrats.
Whether Clinton or Sanders wins the nomination, the Democratic candidate should shine, in comparison to Trump, as a disciplined adult with a serious agenda for the future well-being of the country. Clinton's Wall Street baggage and Sanders's foolish fondness for the socialist label will not save a Trump whose lack of ideas and self-control brand him as unsuitable for high office.
2
I wonder how peaceful aBernie or Hillary rally would be if a gang of protesters showed up? Of course it would be the protesters fault in that case. You are very myopic in your analysis of all things Trump.
10
Well, it certainly is easy to imagine a situation for Hillary or Bernie, then imagine their imaginary response, than act superior based on your imagining of their imaginary response.
Sanders actually let a couple of protesters take the mike a talk for a few minutes. Does that answer your question?
Protesters show up all the time at Hillary's events, have for years. Black Lives Matter protesters interrupted Hillary last month at a paid fund-raiser. No violence was threatened, no violence happened.
This is deja (1967/68) vu all over again (with credit to Yogi Berra).
This election is beginning to feel a lot like 1967/68 - angry people - riots - and the aftermath in 1970 of the murders at Kent State and the hard hat riot. The Republicans loved it. Nixon, Agnew, Mitchell, Kissinger....war criminals all and just plain ole criminals.
2015/16 is NOT analogous to 1967/68. The roles are not the same; the roles are not even reversed.
What is the same is angry people - left and right. We have both demagogues and principled candidates. Especially interesting, we have similar issues: civil rights, health care, and the role of the US military in world affairs.
What we don't have is ..... well we don't have Big Brother and the Holding Co.; we don't have Janis Joplin; we don't have Jimi Hendrix; and we don't have Country Joe and the Fish .....but may that is a generational issue? Green Day?
BUT....... by god .......we have students ....just like in 67/68....like those at Illinois that shut Trump down and out.
The students are not going to let Donald Trump or any other demagogue hold sway in the United States.
And neither is this grey haired old man. I may not be Bertrand Russell but I never met a protest against right wing thugs that I didn't like.
Not then ... not now ... not ever.
This election is beginning to feel a lot like 1967/68 - angry people - riots - and the aftermath in 1970 of the murders at Kent State and the hard hat riot. The Republicans loved it. Nixon, Agnew, Mitchell, Kissinger....war criminals all and just plain ole criminals.
2015/16 is NOT analogous to 1967/68. The roles are not the same; the roles are not even reversed.
What is the same is angry people - left and right. We have both demagogues and principled candidates. Especially interesting, we have similar issues: civil rights, health care, and the role of the US military in world affairs.
What we don't have is ..... well we don't have Big Brother and the Holding Co.; we don't have Janis Joplin; we don't have Jimi Hendrix; and we don't have Country Joe and the Fish .....but may that is a generational issue? Green Day?
BUT....... by god .......we have students ....just like in 67/68....like those at Illinois that shut Trump down and out.
The students are not going to let Donald Trump or any other demagogue hold sway in the United States.
And neither is this grey haired old man. I may not be Bertrand Russell but I never met a protest against right wing thugs that I didn't like.
Not then ... not now ... not ever.
17
And you're not being divisive?
My goodness.
My goodness.
1
How can Donald Trump govern this country if he cannot govern his emotions?
11
Funny how the Editorial Board doesn't seem to mention George Soros or MoveON.org as instigators for confrontation. When you have both organizations funding and organizing groups for the sole purpose of disrupting peaceful Trump rallies one wonders why the NY Times cannot condemn them.
If anything, Trump supporters are defending their constitutional rights when confronted by obscenity screeching lunatics who call themselves "protesters" by physically removing this riff-raff from their rallies.
If anything, Trump supporters are defending their constitutional rights when confronted by obscenity screeching lunatics who call themselves "protesters" by physically removing this riff-raff from their rallies.
15
How about some real evidence, other then the same old tired right-winhg conspiracy theories? George Soros isn't running for President, and you don't see any actual videos of him, unlike Trump, suggesting that his followers assault peaceful protesters.
You have to understand, only those The Times deems worthy have constitutional rights--it makes you wonder if the Editorial board thinks it has the only copy of the Bill of Rights.
2
What proof do you have that Soros and Moveon stirred up these "organized" protests?
Oh, I know! many Twitter followers attested to that, so it must be true!
Oh, I know! many Twitter followers attested to that, so it must be true!
Either Board members have short memory spans, or r ignorant of history. Most violence in political campaigns has come from the left. I can still see Hubert Humphey's chagrined visage at the 1968 Dem. Party convention as it exploded into chaos. Meanwhile outside,far left leaders like Tom Hayden, John Froines, Bill AYRES,0bama's friend, Rennie Davis were battling the police. Humphey saw his chance to become President slipping away before his very eyes.Add to that revolutionary groups like the Weathermen and SDS with terrorist agendas. And you take Trump to task for causing violence? Wallace was not the man he is portrayed to be. GW was considered a young liberal in 1950's Alabama, and after that one election against the openly racist John Patterson,,returned to his roots..GW was a populist in the tradition of WJ Bryan and Robert Lafollette, but has not received credit for all he did for the people of Alabama. Recall GW was married to daughter of Jim(Kissing Jim) Folsom,, an outspoken liberal governor. Would Folsom have tolerated a son in law openly racist?Unlikely. Nota bene:2 veterans of '60's left wing hate groups, David Gilbert and Judith Clark, r serving 75 year prison sentences for having killed police officers.And you r blaming DT for treating violent protesters at his rallies rough?Before writing historically inaccurate and tendentious jeremiads against Mr. Trump, EB should do more careful research.
9
And on the right you have Hitler and his thugs and a score of individuals who do not like people who protest. You want to have it your way but it does not work that way. The right to protest in a peaceful manner is a RIGHT. Get used to it because if your candidate makes it to the final, violence will certainly occur. How can it not happen?
GW? Are you writing here about George Wallace or G.W. Bush?
Well, both are beloved in America, aren't they, for their pure hearts and good deeds.
Sure
Well, both are beloved in America, aren't they, for their pure hearts and good deeds.
Sure
One analysis of Trump's speeches placed them at barely the 4th grade level, which surely fits with his bluster. Not just his ever-present bluster and calls to violence against "others" but everything else he says too has all the sophistication of an unsupervised K-3 playground.
Trump is living proof that wealth has nothing whatsoever to do with intelligence, common sense, empathy, higher purpose, integrity, or any of the other qualities we should expect our politicians to both possess and employ.
But Trump is not the most worrisome character in this drama even if he fancies himself their conductor. His rabid supporters are the ones who truly give me pause. Is his the kind of behavior anyone would want to encourage in their children? His campaign events have all the character of an orchestrated mob scene, and the real question is: who are the participants and what will we become if they manage to take over? That is my real waking nightmare.
Trump is living proof that wealth has nothing whatsoever to do with intelligence, common sense, empathy, higher purpose, integrity, or any of the other qualities we should expect our politicians to both possess and employ.
But Trump is not the most worrisome character in this drama even if he fancies himself their conductor. His rabid supporters are the ones who truly give me pause. Is his the kind of behavior anyone would want to encourage in their children? His campaign events have all the character of an orchestrated mob scene, and the real question is: who are the participants and what will we become if they manage to take over? That is my real waking nightmare.
17
The Trump phenom is his willingness to jerk the proverbial rag off the bush. Exposing the hypocrisy and the fraud of the process and the carrier politicians. The owners of this country with their well healed carrier professional politicians are gobsmacked and befuddled as what to do about the exposure. Great capitalist theater. The Roman's would be jealous.
5
Trump's speech is inflammatory and often wrong, but it is legal. The actions of people who trespass and engage in public disorder in an effort to deny him the opportunity to speak to his supporters and to deny his supporters the opportunity to hear him speak are not simply wrong, they are illegal. Yes, all in the public arena have a civic and a moral responsibility to treat all people with respect, and Trump can fairly be held to account for his failure to do so. However, the constant demonization of the man and the rationalization of the undemocratic and illegal behavior of his opponents is incendiary. We are one step away from a violent act that will be catastrophic for the country. The Times, by licensing intimidation and coercion as forms of "peaceful protest" in our streets, on our campuses, and now in our civic events, and has helped bring us to this precipice.
12
spot on.
Yes, Trump has the right to speak. But citizens have the right (in fact the moral and patriotic duty) to speak back.
1
@SM
1) Yes, Trump's speech is inflammatory, often wrong but legal. So are the actions of people who go to his events to protest his very inflammatory and vile language.
2) Protest is also a right of free speech, covered by law in the First Amendment.
3) The protesters are not trespassing, since the 'Trump shows are open to the public.
4) Not the Times, but Il Duce Trumpolini is licensing intimidation and coercions by talking of the good ol' times were protesters would have been carried out on stretchers, and telling his adoring crowd he would love to punch them in the face.
1) Yes, Trump's speech is inflammatory, often wrong but legal. So are the actions of people who go to his events to protest his very inflammatory and vile language.
2) Protest is also a right of free speech, covered by law in the First Amendment.
3) The protesters are not trespassing, since the 'Trump shows are open to the public.
4) Not the Times, but Il Duce Trumpolini is licensing intimidation and coercions by talking of the good ol' times were protesters would have been carried out on stretchers, and telling his adoring crowd he would love to punch them in the face.
1
Wait a moment -- so a speaker is fiery and that justifies folks to come out intend to spread violence to others? Seriously?
So, when Bernie calls for revolution we should flip over cars and that would be HIS fault?
If the BLM leaders weren't to blame for all the rioting why is Trump?
Oh, that's right - duh! This is the NYT.
So, when Bernie calls for revolution we should flip over cars and that would be HIS fault?
If the BLM leaders weren't to blame for all the rioting why is Trump?
Oh, that's right - duh! This is the NYT.
21
I agree with you. The people who come to Trump's rallies are angry whites, but they are not incited to violence by Trump. Imagine if you sat in your home and someone come to your time to spend with those close to you and then someone else thought it their duty to come and get into ugly confrontations. The people who do not like Trump are the instigators of the violence. Rushing the stage of an event you don't like is free speech. It's denying others their rights under the Constitution. I am a lefty and this helps the right. It's Bernie's people. Their guy is not even in and already we have a communist program to control what everyone thinks and says out of their group, with this being the clearest manifestation.
Trump is more than fiery. He has told his supporters that certain people should be punched in the face and carried out on a stretcher. Bernie Sanders calling for a revolution does not equate to violence (and please note--his supporters are not, in fact, out there turning over cars). The BLM movement is not calling for violence.
I also do not understand how you think that just because a person comes out to protest that they are intending to spread violence to others. Holding up signs and shouting something is not the same as an intent to spread violence. Protestors are always nearby when President Obama appears, yet I do not see this melee occurring there (and I'm betting that you would not blame the protesters if it did). There have been protesters at other candidates' rallies, and I do not see violence there. Why is this only happening at the rallies for a candidate that repeatedly says that people who voice disagreement with him should be attacked?
I also do not understand how you think that just because a person comes out to protest that they are intending to spread violence to others. Holding up signs and shouting something is not the same as an intent to spread violence. Protestors are always nearby when President Obama appears, yet I do not see this melee occurring there (and I'm betting that you would not blame the protesters if it did). There have been protesters at other candidates' rallies, and I do not see violence there. Why is this only happening at the rallies for a candidate that repeatedly says that people who voice disagreement with him should be attacked?
2
Even while beating the tar out of people and hauling them out after bouncing their heads off chairs, the GOP mantra is still to play the victim. Our bigoted, racist, misogynistic candidate don't get no respect!
Gee, I wonder why.
Gee, I wonder why.
It's pretty obvious who the disruptors were;
it's pretty obvious who the people were who were determined to deny the candidate his 1st Amendment rights to freedom of speech;
it's pretty obvious that if this sort of aggressive disruption happened at a Clinton or Sanders or Cruz rally, the NYT would pillory the protesters.
Trump scares the mainstream media. Trump scares the political establishment. Both of which are entities that feed off each other. Megyn Kelly filming her adoring masses of fans at the Rubio interview....as one reporter observed, "We have entered into the Hall of Mirrors."
No kidding. The media &the pols feed off one another. The result? We the taxpayer get the same old garbage in a different shiny wrapper every election season. With the difference being that we the sheeple are losing more & more of our civil rights every election season.
The NYT is demeaning itself by flogging so hard & heavy for Clinton that the NYT has completely lost its ability to objectively report news.
There are millions upon millions of people voting for Trump. Despite the coordinated onslaught from the mainstream media & the terrified professional politicians that their feeding time at the public trough of no accountability may be at an end.
Better pay attention to the American sheeple on this one, folks.
it's pretty obvious who the people were who were determined to deny the candidate his 1st Amendment rights to freedom of speech;
it's pretty obvious that if this sort of aggressive disruption happened at a Clinton or Sanders or Cruz rally, the NYT would pillory the protesters.
Trump scares the mainstream media. Trump scares the political establishment. Both of which are entities that feed off each other. Megyn Kelly filming her adoring masses of fans at the Rubio interview....as one reporter observed, "We have entered into the Hall of Mirrors."
No kidding. The media &the pols feed off one another. The result? We the taxpayer get the same old garbage in a different shiny wrapper every election season. With the difference being that we the sheeple are losing more & more of our civil rights every election season.
The NYT is demeaning itself by flogging so hard & heavy for Clinton that the NYT has completely lost its ability to objectively report news.
There are millions upon millions of people voting for Trump. Despite the coordinated onslaught from the mainstream media & the terrified professional politicians that their feeding time at the public trough of no accountability may be at an end.
Better pay attention to the American sheeple on this one, folks.
23
From an outsider’s point of view and observation, it would appear that not only the establishment (GOP) but the most opposed to seeing Donald Trump winning the candidacy of the Republican Party, seem to be doing everything possible to undermine the democratic process. I would not be surprised if some of the agitators at the campaign rallies are not organized / paid stooges for disgruntled republicans. Frankly speaking, whilst he may only be a one term president, the worlds largest democracy could do with a bit of a shake up, we (in Australia) are seeing the same one-way street on political correctness and monotone politicians who appear deep down only to really care about their next term and not what matters, the good of the people and the country.
6
Who in the world is acting out their violence here? These persons want to forcefully shut up a person from expressing his views. This is one the things Americans are furious about: this out of control "political correctness" that wants to shut up other persons' views, either by automatically labeling persons as "haters," "racists," or now through disrupting their right to speak. What's next? Preachers at conservative church services, local political events? What are we supposed to do? Agree to be silenced?
19
Does "the right to speak" imply a right to violence when someone interrupts? Apparently in the mind of "in disbelief" above, it does.
There was a time, before Nixon, when presidential campaign gatherings were held in public places. Anyone who wanted to shout out something from the back of the crowd was free to do so. Then, Nixon's henchmen realized that if they moved the rallies into a private space, they could eject people and keep control of the situation, presenting a crowd that would be subservient and adoring to the candidate. Looks so much better on television.
Yelling or holding up a counter sign is not a violent act. It is well within the tradition of the give and take of American politics. Generally, people who yell out something quiet down in a few moments and the speaking goes right on.
There was a time, before Nixon, when presidential campaign gatherings were held in public places. Anyone who wanted to shout out something from the back of the crowd was free to do so. Then, Nixon's henchmen realized that if they moved the rallies into a private space, they could eject people and keep control of the situation, presenting a crowd that would be subservient and adoring to the candidate. Looks so much better on television.
Yelling or holding up a counter sign is not a violent act. It is well within the tradition of the give and take of American politics. Generally, people who yell out something quiet down in a few moments and the speaking goes right on.
1
Funny how if someone is protesting your views with a sign or even by shouting out a slogan, they're trying to shut you up, while your shouting at them is merely expressing your First Amendment rights. Those who disagree with you don't have the same rights?
Have you not already agreed to be silenced? After all, for several years now, any view you might express that differed from the media's canon of proper thought meant you would be silenced by an accusation of one "-ism" or another. There was a time in which it was said that a free press was the cornerstone of democracy. Presently, this principle is in doubt. The media are hand in glove with their chosen candidates, to the detriment of all.
1
Why are not prominent Democrats talking vocally to the American people who are frustrated---talking about how the atmosphere of hatred has been deliberately created by the Republican Party, talking about how the Republicans and the Republican Congress have dissed President Obama because he is African American, talking about how their obstructionism has damaged our country, our economy, and in fact, badly hurt all Americans?
21
Michael Richter - Calling all Republicans and the Republican Congress RACISTS because they don't agree with the President's policies will certainly solve all the problems of America, right Michael?
2
I am disappointed with the NY Times' coverage of Mr. Trump. There is a surprising lack of meaningful coverage of issues such as illegal immigration, cumulative US debt, vetting of refugees and ISIS.
(PS: Possible terrorist attack in Toronto today. 2 people stabbed at an army recruiting centre. Details regarding the assailant have not been published.)
(PS: Possible terrorist attack in Toronto today. 2 people stabbed at an army recruiting centre. Details regarding the assailant have not been published.)
11
Agree - Trump offers no meaningful dialogue of issues such as illegal immigration, cumulative US debt (largely caused by The Bush Administration), vetting of refugees and ISIS".
It is a real shame that Trump has these issues. He actually has interesting ideas very worth discussing. Because they come from Trump, they are dismissed. Because of him, I have spent the last week reading about free trade when I can. It seems trade is used a lot to keep peace, and not because we would benefit. So fragile peace is kept on the backs of our former prosperity, but only taken from those on the bottom of our economic ladder, and no one is honest about it.
Can we keep shining a spotlight on this?
Can we keep shining a spotlight on this?
1
Earlier this week in the Times, we were informed that Trump has always wanted to be taken seriously, He has always wanted what he saw as deserved respect and an affirmation of his accomplishments. His hometown press rarely, if ever, reported about him anything but his latest coarse act or speech. I can't help wondering if the violent and frightening events at his rallies is his idea of what he wanted to achieve, Yes, there are signs with his name on it, just as there are gaudy buildings in NYC with his gilded name adorning them, There are people shouting his name and obscenities at his rallies, in the same breath. He asks his riled up crowds if there is anything more fun than a Trump rally, after the crowds have Third Reich saluted their oath to him. Rarely have I seen a more awkward moment in a campaign than when Mitt Romney kowtowed to Trump in 2012 and now we wonder why no one heeded Romney's urging to dump Trump. Why was any serious candidate seeking the benediction of this impolite buffoon who had no political power or experience in the first place. Those of us who through the years have witnessed Trump's exploits--from his infidelities, the boasting of his sexual prowess, his abysmal failure with the storied Plaza Hotel, his crude remarks about women, could not for a second take him seriously as anything but a barker at a carnival. What we overestimated was the intelligence of much of the electorate and underestimated its anger
58
H L Menken: Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public.
people are okay with denying Trump and his people their Constitutionally protected speech because we don't like them. It's liberal racism. It's wrong. Trump is not inciting. The people who show up at his rally and fight are wrong. That old white guy who slugged the kid was wrong and I think he is being prosecuted, but when these Bernie people go to Trump rallies and get into street fights, it's they who are violating our founding principles. The left, instead of figuring out the solution to the white anxiety and hate are trying to get Trump and his people to shut up. I would rather their hate is out in the open until we truly fix it.
If you actually believe what you wrote, I have a bridge I would like to sell you.
The problem with inciting violence is that it always needs a fresh target, and when there are no more protesters to beat up or it becomes boring, innocent people who have nothing to do with the rally become targets. I think more Americans should learn the word "pogrom" and what it means.
79
Relax.
Old, fat white men with high school educations and type 2 diabetes lose interest in stuff pretty quickly.
Sure the Donald can manipulate them now but when NASCAR gets rolling and McDonald brings back the McRib they'll let their unused minds wander again and they'll fade back into the background.
Old, fat white men with high school educations and type 2 diabetes lose interest in stuff pretty quickly.
Sure the Donald can manipulate them now but when NASCAR gets rolling and McDonald brings back the McRib they'll let their unused minds wander again and they'll fade back into the background.
With 15,000 or so murders in the US each year - none of which have been attributed to Trump - you need more evidence to suggest that Trump supporters will attack those not attending Trump rallies and add to that number.
I think Trump has too many issues to be president, and he should never say "punch 'em in the face". But I think these comments mischaracterized what is going on. I've watched a number of rallies, and they aren't angry. People are laughing and smiling, Trump is very funny, self depreciating to some extent, and never angry. He's entertaining, because he's quite a comedian. I don't see angry crowds, just excited people.
These comments would have you think that up to a quarter of our population is violent racist angry people. I honestly don't see it. The crowd has attracted a small number of ugly people. If you look at the videos of the rally "violence" it's the same three or four incidents, featuring ten or so people, on both sides. If Trump came to my state, I might be quite interested to see him speak, since he is an interesting figure. I would say the same about Bernie Sanders. Both are leading very interesting movements.
These comments would have you think that up to a quarter of our population is violent racist angry people. I honestly don't see it. The crowd has attracted a small number of ugly people. If you look at the videos of the rally "violence" it's the same three or four incidents, featuring ten or so people, on both sides. If Trump came to my state, I might be quite interested to see him speak, since he is an interesting figure. I would say the same about Bernie Sanders. Both are leading very interesting movements.
1
Those who have allowed themselves to morph into perpetrators of hate crimes and genocide soon discovered their acts made things worse, not better. They've recognized only too late the folly of letting their better self stand aside while their worse self was manipulated into acting heinously.
Countless studies of genocide point to an unhappy truth: even normal people can be manipulated into committing atrocities willingly and even with enthusiasm. No one in a society turned genocidal recovers from this downhill slide. You have to stop the slide before it starts. So, my fellow Americans, please, step away from the donald. He is selling hate. He is not a good man.
Muslims are like you. Most are actually nice, gracious, kind people. Only propaganda presents violence against Muslims as reasonable, and it must cease. When hate speech trumps reason, it bodes ill for us all. Let's get a grip, my people: on ourselves, not on our neighbors' throats.