You've outdone yourself, Ross. Even though you mention, extremely quickly, that economics MAY have something to do with the rise in middle-aged white death rates rising, IF one accepts a certain "liberal" line of thought, you don't linger. No, no, it is obviously that the poor schlubs have gotten used to "dependence", aka decent-paying work, reasonable time off, and enough work where they live to foster family and community connections. Good God! What lousy takers! They need, in your Very Religious Opinion, to realize that, no, they don't deserve any of that; their place is down with the historically beaten-down blacks and Hispanics, who are used to not having decent jobs, education, health care, housing, or security. The desperate whites have only to look to them as a guide for how to manage in what is now their proper place: at the bottom. Well, except for the unfortunate tendency in the black community to have strong women. Can't have that, can we? Religions disapprove of strong women.
I don't think I've ever read a column of yours in which you expose your intent so completely. Get used to serfdom, you little people: your masters will tell you when you have enough, and when you should die.
Stop telling other people to pray harder, Ross. You need Divine help more than they do.
I don't think I've ever read a column of yours in which you expose your intent so completely. Get used to serfdom, you little people: your masters will tell you when you have enough, and when you should die.
Stop telling other people to pray harder, Ross. You need Divine help more than they do.
12
These poor whites are realizing what other groups have realized a long time ago- they do not figure anywhere in the narrative for this country created by the politicians and the plutocrats in their endless search for unlimited power and wealth. They realize that things will only get worse as they grow older. They see their American dreams turning into nightmares. The well of America has been poisoned by the politicians and their super rich cronies. We are all drinking from that well. And then some of us are injecting drugs into our veins or putting a gun to our heads. Should we really be surprised?
8
It seems to me that modern America is much less forgiving than it once was for a variety of reasons. I don't necessarily mean individuals are less forgiving although that may be possible. Mostly, I mean that institutions and systems are less forgiving. I don't think it should surprise us that someone who has done a drug like heroin should have trouble coming back from it. First, there's the drug itself from which is it easier to form a habit and then harder to break that habit. Then, there's the potential for arrest which, if it happens, generally dooms you into permanent underclass status. If you are lucky enough to have not been arrested, then you probably need clinical help to break your habit which is easier to root out now thanks to the internet. Even if you get this clinical help, major and mid-size employers are certainly not going to hire you, so you are left with the good graces of local employers that you know. But, notice some of the comments here, a lot of heroin users are likely to burn these bridges by relapsing. Finally, on top of all this, you have a culture that emulates "pull yourself up" religiously regardless of circumstance, so people generally are more likely to not help you because they inherently think you should do it yourself. And, finally, you have government abandoning (de-funding) programs that are trying to help. Our society offers basically nothing to an ex-user beyond life-saving drugs and treatments if paramedics get there in time.
24
"Maybe sustained growth, full employment and a welfare state that’s friendlier to work and family can help revive that nexus. Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally."
Oh. Maybe fighting Douthat's party's commitment to crushing workers and killing any "welfare state" at all could help. Or maybe the poor could simply smile and "adapt culturally". We can all hold hands and sing gospel hymns while the chariots of the wealth class mow us down. That's Douthat's plan, anyway. (For us, not himself, of course.)
Oh. Maybe fighting Douthat's party's commitment to crushing workers and killing any "welfare state" at all could help. Or maybe the poor could simply smile and "adapt culturally". We can all hold hands and sing gospel hymns while the chariots of the wealth class mow us down. That's Douthat's plan, anyway. (For us, not himself, of course.)
37
My question: If the US devoted the necessary funds to implement social justice and equal oportunity, by this I mean proper education for everyone, free healthcare, adequate social services for the needy, adequate living and working conditions for all Americans, would America be able to financially sustain the world's largest military and how would that impact on it's status in the world. Joining in the social standards of most Western countries would obviously carry a price. Investing in people would dissolve the 0.1% class and would mean some loss of influence around the world. That would bring up a need for more power sharing among Western democracies who are now having a relatively free ride by letting the US carry the burden it so wishes to assume, my country included. Not a bad thought.
19
It's easy to blame victims when access to decent and affordable health care hobbles the middle class. Health insurance companies continue their charade that we're better off letting them pool us in small, paltry networks that enrich them and leave us destitute. According to the American Cancer Society, cancer will bankrupt more than half the American families it strikes, a statistic that appalls people in more civilized societies that created Medicare or highly regulated Medicare Advantage type programs to ensure their people people aren't thrown on the trash heap like wrinkled rinds.
22
I agree that strong natural support systems are indispensable in tough times. What measures should be taken to nurture and protect them?
4
Yes, a bit of both and more. The metaphorical promise of upward mobility has crashed on the shores of globalization. We can pretend it's not happening. We can pretend that we can withdraw and everything will be all right within our closed borders. Or we can face the reality that the world is a massive fluid economy and that we need the training and positioning and tools and infrastructure and re-education and policies to compete.
13
I agree that one of the biggest problems precipitating the premature deaths of the victims Ross writes about is the feeling of dispossession, but we must be careful to not think it only exists among the uneducated. I work with students who have the idea that their lives will follow a path that leads to wealth, prosperity, and happiness once they do “all the right things.” That may happen, but it takes work to accomplish it and a host of strategies to deal with adversities once they appear. Many of the students I see daily don’t know how to deal with adversity or are reluctant to work above the minimum requirements. This feeling of dispossession will affect the current generation of the educated, as well. The difference is that they may have a stronger support system than the poor and uneducated.
Religion, with its hypocrisy, judgment, parameters and most importantly, its insistence on separation of God from the self, will not solve the problem for everyone. People will not stop hurting themselves until they truly start to love themselves.
Religion, with its hypocrisy, judgment, parameters and most importantly, its insistence on separation of God from the self, will not solve the problem for everyone. People will not stop hurting themselves until they truly start to love themselves.
12
If conservatives truly believe middle-aged white males turn to drugs simply because they can get disability payments from the government or because someone else has inferred they need not attend church, then that reveals what they actually think of their base. After all this is the same group that listens to conservative talk radio all day and watches Fox News. They are constantly being told they are under siege from minorities, liberals and the rest of us that comprise the dreaded "other."
The dearth of opportunity the workplace is blamed on immigrants and women with no mention of how middle-class wages have been stagnant for decades while executive pay has sky rocketed. More and more our lives are influenced not by big government but by big business. The money is concentrated at the top and if you are left out of the party it is very easy to start seeing yourself as a failure.
The inability to provide for your family and retirement no matter how hard you work is not a symptom of a permissive culture but rather an economic system that increasingly favors the very few over the many. Fix that and the rest of these problems will subside.
The dearth of opportunity the workplace is blamed on immigrants and women with no mention of how middle-class wages have been stagnant for decades while executive pay has sky rocketed. More and more our lives are influenced not by big government but by big business. The money is concentrated at the top and if you are left out of the party it is very easy to start seeing yourself as a failure.
The inability to provide for your family and retirement no matter how hard you work is not a symptom of a permissive culture but rather an economic system that increasingly favors the very few over the many. Fix that and the rest of these problems will subside.
50
Another example of Mr. Douthat's inattention to important detail. One of the interesting features of the Case-Deaton paper is that they stratified mortality rates among middle-aged whites by educational attainment. Those with college-level educations exhibit continuing decline in mortality rates. Its likely that this group exhibits even greater decline in religious participation than working class whites, which would put paid to Mr. Douthat's "cultural" argument. A reasonable prediction is that a geographic analysis will find the stagnation of mortality rates is concentrated in certain states, notably Appalachian and Southern states with poor welfare provisions, resistance to the Affordable Care Act, and open shop labor laws.
This column is also a nice piece of unintended irony. After two generations of conservative "intellectuals" writing about the "pathologies" of African-American families, here we have Douthat writing about the advantages of African-American family structure.
This column is also a nice piece of unintended irony. After two generations of conservative "intellectuals" writing about the "pathologies" of African-American families, here we have Douthat writing about the advantages of African-American family structure.
39
As Gore Vidal once pointed out: "What ails us is not cyclic, but systemic".
Religion, despair and inaction are *never* the answer. Instead, some practical proposals:
1. The encouragement of domestic manufacturing jobs through massive infrastructure spending, subsidy for things OTHER than Sports, Oil and Meat and policy change at the highest levels to encourage domestic job growth.
One possibility would be the creation of a state-of-the-art high speed rail system connecting the nation's larger cities. The upshot being wins for workers *and* the environment.
2. A return to progressive taxation. It served us well for generations, helped build and maintain our infrastructure, funded a critical social safety net and compelled those who enriched themselves by gaming our system feel they had more of a stake in the general welfare of our country.
3. A total boycott of all things right wing and (currently) Republican for reasons too numerous and palpable to list.
All simple, achievable proposals. No more hand-wringing. Time for change and action.
Religion, despair and inaction are *never* the answer. Instead, some practical proposals:
1. The encouragement of domestic manufacturing jobs through massive infrastructure spending, subsidy for things OTHER than Sports, Oil and Meat and policy change at the highest levels to encourage domestic job growth.
One possibility would be the creation of a state-of-the-art high speed rail system connecting the nation's larger cities. The upshot being wins for workers *and* the environment.
2. A return to progressive taxation. It served us well for generations, helped build and maintain our infrastructure, funded a critical social safety net and compelled those who enriched themselves by gaming our system feel they had more of a stake in the general welfare of our country.
3. A total boycott of all things right wing and (currently) Republican for reasons too numerous and palpable to list.
All simple, achievable proposals. No more hand-wringing. Time for change and action.
26
Ordinary Joe, having always survived from the detritus of white supremacy, is now doing worse than the black and brown people he derided who learned long ago how to live off the scraps. He can no longer be blatantly racist without losing his menial job, and has no one to lord it over, so he no longer has a reason to live.
12
Really, they don't go to church enough? Go out to working class small town white America and you'll see what happens to a generation of undereducated men who were raised to think that these things don't happen to white people. That sort of sad entitlement is what fuels support for someone like Trump whose underlying message is one of blaming "those people" for their problems. Church isn't the answer for everything no matter how much it seems to be central to Mr. Douthat's opinions.
16
I got a rather morbid chuckle out of the lefty proposition that these middle class whites are so finely attuned to the economy that a redistribution of wealth upwards could result in their premature demise. The reality is much more complicated than that. Certainly the growing abuse of opiates, meth, and alcohol is partly to blame, and that growth is no doubt tied to unemployment (not the silly figure how used by Administrations of both parties, but the chronically unemployed no longer counted). A culture that glorifies hedonism of all sorts can't help those who feel they are being left out. But let's get real: most people in this country can't even identify the Vice President, much less get agitated to death over Republican and Democrat economic policy.
14
This is the demographic that manned the ramparts during the epic struggle of our age, The Cold War. They embraced religion as a bulwark against atheism, individualism as bulwark against the collective. Then they won. Already on top of the ladder racially, they expected to reap the benefits due to victors. But their fealty to and faith in what sustained them during the Cold War has failed them. Economic stagnation is not enough to explain this spike in deaths. Don't discount the bitterness of "what you were supposed to have has been denied to you".
5
This reminds me of some black comedian's stand-up routine from a number of years ago:
"Notice how whenever somebody loses his job and then goes back to the plant with a gun and shoots everybody, it's nearly always a white guy? Black guys, Latino guys, they've all been laid off a dozen times before, they're used to it."
"Notice how whenever somebody loses his job and then goes back to the plant with a gun and shoots everybody, it's nearly always a white guy? Black guys, Latino guys, they've all been laid off a dozen times before, they're used to it."
28
Good for Mr. Douthat to acknowledge that the causes and solutions for this problem go beyond the standard Left/Right divide... But he also demonstrates that he refuses to understand what the "liberal" or progressive approach really means by reducing it to "transfer payments." Funding programs and initiatives that support an economically crushed class isn't just handing out cash, it is meant to support and strengthen the "nexus of work, faith and family" that he agrees is so key.
For example, funding child care would go a long way towards helping to solve this problem. The devastating American Prospect article about uneducated white women which Mr. Douthat linked to concludes that poor women who work have better health outcomes than those who don't and acknowledges that the main reason poor women don't work is because they can't pay for child care. To fund such programs wouldn't further the dreaded "culture of dependency" conservatives rail against. Rather it would help women and families become more financially independent by supporting their ability to join the work force and reap all the benefits thus associated including friends, community, money, and perhaps health care.
If Mr. Douthat is going to make a living denoucning a particular political point of view, perhaps he should make sure he understands it first.
For example, funding child care would go a long way towards helping to solve this problem. The devastating American Prospect article about uneducated white women which Mr. Douthat linked to concludes that poor women who work have better health outcomes than those who don't and acknowledges that the main reason poor women don't work is because they can't pay for child care. To fund such programs wouldn't further the dreaded "culture of dependency" conservatives rail against. Rather it would help women and families become more financially independent by supporting their ability to join the work force and reap all the benefits thus associated including friends, community, money, and perhaps health care.
If Mr. Douthat is going to make a living denoucning a particular political point of view, perhaps he should make sure he understands it first.
14
I just had to put down my newspaper and join this conversation.
The Southern Strategy that Nixon began and Reagan perfected told these poor white guys that their troubles came from those darker skinned people over there. By my reading of this news, many of the men taking their own lives are poor, rural, and southern. The very men (and women) the republican party told that the republican party would protect from the encroaching gains of the darker skinned Americans. "Vote republican and we will fight against the rights of those poor black and brown people so you can continue to feel superior."
Well, the republican party failed to keep that promise. One reason; they lied and never intended to, the other reason was they couldn't stop the wheel of history.
So these under educated men now have nowhere and nothing to turn to. Because of republican economic policies, and obstruction, there are not enough jobs. Because there are not enough jobs the marriages these people are in are in trouble. And because these people have been brain washed so thoroughly they can't see the help that exists for poor struggling people as anything other than evil; they turn to heroin and suicide, instead of voting for a party that could help them.
35 years after that damn socialist FDR's New Deal America was humming along.
35 years after Reagan we are circling the drain.
That should answer Douthat's question, if he really wants an answer.
The Southern Strategy that Nixon began and Reagan perfected told these poor white guys that their troubles came from those darker skinned people over there. By my reading of this news, many of the men taking their own lives are poor, rural, and southern. The very men (and women) the republican party told that the republican party would protect from the encroaching gains of the darker skinned Americans. "Vote republican and we will fight against the rights of those poor black and brown people so you can continue to feel superior."
Well, the republican party failed to keep that promise. One reason; they lied and never intended to, the other reason was they couldn't stop the wheel of history.
So these under educated men now have nowhere and nothing to turn to. Because of republican economic policies, and obstruction, there are not enough jobs. Because there are not enough jobs the marriages these people are in are in trouble. And because these people have been brain washed so thoroughly they can't see the help that exists for poor struggling people as anything other than evil; they turn to heroin and suicide, instead of voting for a party that could help them.
35 years after that damn socialist FDR's New Deal America was humming along.
35 years after Reagan we are circling the drain.
That should answer Douthat's question, if he really wants an answer.
201
Politicians and the media have spent the last 30 years painting White men as evil.
What did you think would happen.
What did you think would happen.
6
I do wonder how much this trend may be driven by the insane & counterproductive/destructive governmental War on Drugs.
As the government as ramped up its restrictions on pain meds like oxycodone, more are turning to heroin as a cheap alternative. With predictably dire results.
As the government as ramped up its restrictions on pain meds like oxycodone, more are turning to heroin as a cheap alternative. With predictably dire results.
7
For a change, Mr. Douthat is only partly wrong here. And, he deserves credit for being the only commentator (to my knowledge) to bring in the factor of " family breakdown" that occurs in periods of economic distress. Formerly good marriages break up under the financial and psychological pressures of high and chronic unemployment followed by wage stagnation and deterioration. Not just the uneducated, but many college educated middle manager types who lack specific professional skills e.g. all manner of salaried sales and customer relationship managers, have found themselves unemployed at age 45-50, unable to afford (financially or by reason of age) extensive retraining, and blocked off as overqualified from minimum wage jobs that they would take in desperation but don't really want. The consequences on family stability are enormous as they were unexpected.
17
Good heavens! Can this be true: Ross Douthat wrote the words, "If this possibility has policy implications, it suggests that liberals are right..."? If America has not crumbled in to the sea by Monday morning, I will greet it as the dawning of a new, more promising day!
6
Mr Douthat alludes to the sense of entitlement as a driver of the difference (of suicide rates) between lower income whites and their Black and Hispanic brethren. I would extend that hypothesis further to note that all minorities, and immigrants, don't tend to share that sense of entitlement that seems to be endemic to middle class whites in this country. I don't know if it's an attitude that has been bred only since the post WWII period, or if it was always like that. But I think it's unrealistic and poses a disservice to this society (an example being the Trump campaign's success).
4
Amazing the number of responses to Mr. Douthat that bash traditional religion and social cohesion. And often involve blaming the victim for e.g. voting Republican, i.e. against class interest. And apparently, according to this view, Democratic state-driven policies are the solution to the tragedy of the white working class.
I would suggest that these views (more government intervention, social control and control of labor markets) are in fact part of the problem to begin with.
"When the ruling class gets a cold, the working class catches pneumonia".
When you have little social capital, misadventure with drugs or divorce means you likely fail; middle class families can recover. And the process feeds on itself.
From this perspective I see that the century-long attack on traditional working class religion, in favour of "self-expression" and self-indulgence, to be a kind of social imperialism of a liberal elite.
This view is too difficult for most liberals to process: it basically says that whatever the achievements of liberalism, that its most significant achievement is the colonization and destruction of working class culture and institutions.
F. Scott Fitzgerald, from the Great Gatsby: "It was all very careless and confused. They were careless people, Tom and Daisy—they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness, or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made.”
I would suggest that these views (more government intervention, social control and control of labor markets) are in fact part of the problem to begin with.
"When the ruling class gets a cold, the working class catches pneumonia".
When you have little social capital, misadventure with drugs or divorce means you likely fail; middle class families can recover. And the process feeds on itself.
From this perspective I see that the century-long attack on traditional working class religion, in favour of "self-expression" and self-indulgence, to be a kind of social imperialism of a liberal elite.
This view is too difficult for most liberals to process: it basically says that whatever the achievements of liberalism, that its most significant achievement is the colonization and destruction of working class culture and institutions.
F. Scott Fitzgerald, from the Great Gatsby: "It was all very careless and confused. They were careless people, Tom and Daisy—they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness, or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made.”
5
I wish the author had included a comparison of the position of white and black mortality rates. Suppose the mortality rate of blacks is extremely high but falling while the mortality rate for whites is low but climbing? The question would then be different.
5
I disagree with much of the analysis here, but I applaud Douthat for giving some credence to the role of economic inequality. It would be great if Republican policy makers could actually look at these facts and try to address the devastation occurring to their own base.
Democrats will work with you to find enough common ground to try *something,* anything.
Democrats will work with you to find enough common ground to try *something,* anything.
6
The, “longstanding liberal argument that the ... working class has ... fallen victim ... to a punishing economic climate — stagnant wages, a fraying safety net, and Republican economic policies that redistribute wealth upward” describes the problem that has destroyed the “the nexus of work, faith and family”. The poorer 50 percent have lost 70% of their family net wealth and survives on just 1% of U.S. assets. The 15.3% combined payroll taxes (not applied to investment income) harms most workers to the point where they cannot get ahead and form new stable families. Young adults are given free contraception but not decent jobs.
Douthat is thinking in terms of failed polices when he considers that more, “transfer payments can substitute for the sense of meaning and purpose that blue-collar … Americans” need. Skip the welfare and replace the payroll taxes so workers can keep more of their earnings. A 4% VAT and business tax expenditure reform could bring in more reliable tax revenue and give workers a 7.65% raise.
Next guarantee a transitional job (at a little below private sector rates) with non-profits. Millions of jobs could be funded by simply limiting the charitable deduction to charities that agree to provide transitional jobs. This kind of real full employment would drive up wages for all workers and eliminate the historical “minority-white/male-female” economic distinctions that drive the Democratic political base.
It’s time for conservatives to think out of the box.
Douthat is thinking in terms of failed polices when he considers that more, “transfer payments can substitute for the sense of meaning and purpose that blue-collar … Americans” need. Skip the welfare and replace the payroll taxes so workers can keep more of their earnings. A 4% VAT and business tax expenditure reform could bring in more reliable tax revenue and give workers a 7.65% raise.
Next guarantee a transitional job (at a little below private sector rates) with non-profits. Millions of jobs could be funded by simply limiting the charitable deduction to charities that agree to provide transitional jobs. This kind of real full employment would drive up wages for all workers and eliminate the historical “minority-white/male-female” economic distinctions that drive the Democratic political base.
It’s time for conservatives to think out of the box.
3
Maybe the cause is that they never received a good enough realist education They have been condition to believe that they are special and they cannot deal with crisis and failure. The African Americans and Latinos understand how society is rigged against them and have much better coping mechanisms. I read that the most optimistic class was the single mother African American women. Hard to believe that.
3
I think some of the ennui is based on the fact that to be upwardly mobile in our corporate-centric society and economy -- from taking a new job to getting a college or advanced degree -- more and more people have to relocate geographically.
And so more and more people find themselves displaced. And more and more communities find themselves left behind.
Not to mention it's harder to raise a family nowadays--you need dual incomes in today's world to keep afloat and still have to raise the kids.
We are richer than ever, but it doesn't feel like it because we have sacrificed so much to get here.
And so more and more people find themselves displaced. And more and more communities find themselves left behind.
Not to mention it's harder to raise a family nowadays--you need dual incomes in today's world to keep afloat and still have to raise the kids.
We are richer than ever, but it doesn't feel like it because we have sacrificed so much to get here.
5
As a white middle-aged American, I can see where some of this white angst is coming from although I'm not in such dire circumstances myself. I would suggest that the GOP should find this study alarming as the victims are quite likely their voting base, embracing policies that are actually making their lives worse. Ironic and tragic.
12
I don't think there are easy answers anywhere here but I want to point what a clear and even-handed approach this article takes to the opinions from the right and left about this problem. If more of our public discourse took this tone and approach, maybe fewer of us would feel the hopelessness and frustration bred by bitter ideological squabbling in the face of changing times and difficult problems. Thanks Ross.
4
It is ironic that the victims of this new phenomenon are mostly conservative white middle-aged males. Having voted in politicians that have done their level best to oppose any policies by President Obama that would have actually put Americans back to work - massive infrastructure upgrading comes immediately to mind - these men have lost the sense of purpose that is provided by a job, as well as the ability to support their families that is so essential to virtually every American male's sense of manhood.
How sad that the answer for so many is alcoholism, drug use, despair, and suicide rather than thoughtful examination of their beliefs. This is cognitive dissonance with a very sharp edge. Mr. Douhat is on to something here.
How sad that the answer for so many is alcoholism, drug use, despair, and suicide rather than thoughtful examination of their beliefs. This is cognitive dissonance with a very sharp edge. Mr. Douhat is on to something here.
9
Decades of off-shoring, out-sourcing, down-sizing and union-busting have destroyed the prospects for much of America. The rot is spreading, with only the professional classes and the oligarchs that need them, surviving the onslaught.
10
The era of white privilege remains alive and well but the particular demographics that this recent study highlights suggest we often forget even recent history in the attempt to say the "good ol' days" were all about men making their own way in the world.
The post-WWII decades that saw significant increases in wages, home ownership, and the numbers in the middle class in the US were also the era of high unionization and related wages, significant increase in 2-income households, and the GI Bill. The GI Bill is indeed a "government program." Yet many white Americans seem to think that the "good ol' days" of that era were all about men dominating the work force, singularly lifting oneself up by bootstraps (forgetting many don't have boots), and "stable families" that supposedly correspond to women not working outside the home.
That mythological scenario then supports the idea that white men, especially those without a college education, now have it worse BECAUSE they are white and male and are harshly discriminated against. While evidence doesn't support that view, plenty of politicians, right-leaning media folks, and others work that scenario to a certain advantage. If folks want to resist higher wages (unionized or otherwise), government benefits (like the GI Bill), and creating a workplace that encourages women's participation--including access to birth control--then many of those same people will continue to see themselves as "victims" of some sort of conspiracy.
The post-WWII decades that saw significant increases in wages, home ownership, and the numbers in the middle class in the US were also the era of high unionization and related wages, significant increase in 2-income households, and the GI Bill. The GI Bill is indeed a "government program." Yet many white Americans seem to think that the "good ol' days" of that era were all about men dominating the work force, singularly lifting oneself up by bootstraps (forgetting many don't have boots), and "stable families" that supposedly correspond to women not working outside the home.
That mythological scenario then supports the idea that white men, especially those without a college education, now have it worse BECAUSE they are white and male and are harshly discriminated against. While evidence doesn't support that view, plenty of politicians, right-leaning media folks, and others work that scenario to a certain advantage. If folks want to resist higher wages (unionized or otherwise), government benefits (like the GI Bill), and creating a workplace that encourages women's participation--including access to birth control--then many of those same people will continue to see themselves as "victims" of some sort of conspiracy.
6
It's not just lower class whites and whites without diplomas who are getting addicted to prescription painkillers. I witnessed the tragic death of a close white female friend who had a family, an upper middle class life, a PhD, and an amazing job as a professor at an Ivy League. Never interested in drugs in her life. Didn't even drink. The doctors put her on Vicodin for a chronic pain issue. Fast forward 6 months: totally hooked, physically dependent and unable to function without them. Fast forward: dead with a needle in her arm. Addiction is progressive, fatal disease, and it is brutally democratic: it will take down rich and poor alike.
8
Yes, let's just adapt ourselves to "elite neglect," shall we? Let's have the white working class join blacks and Hispanics in a permanent underclass, while the elite one-percent takes its rightful place as lords and masters of the New America.
Working-class people should stop committing suicide and adapt to the new reality, says Ross. "Maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
In other words, the 99% -- blacks, Hispanics, and the white working class -- should just give up on the American dream. The American Dream is for the 1% now, says Ross. It was never really intended for ordinary people like you. But you should still be proud and happy to live in a country where one percent of the citizens can achieve a lifestyle of glorious brilliance. It is right and good and natural that political power should be concentrated in their hands, and that they should pay a lower tax rate than you. For they are the glory of our nation, and it is your place and privilege to support them.
Is this elitism or defeatism? Maybe it's both. Ross' vision seems to be that elites should inherit the American dream, while the disinherited middle class should accept defeat. But Americans were never elitist, nor defeatist, and Ross' vision is not consistent with our history. We can and will do better.
Working-class people should stop committing suicide and adapt to the new reality, says Ross. "Maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
In other words, the 99% -- blacks, Hispanics, and the white working class -- should just give up on the American dream. The American Dream is for the 1% now, says Ross. It was never really intended for ordinary people like you. But you should still be proud and happy to live in a country where one percent of the citizens can achieve a lifestyle of glorious brilliance. It is right and good and natural that political power should be concentrated in their hands, and that they should pay a lower tax rate than you. For they are the glory of our nation, and it is your place and privilege to support them.
Is this elitism or defeatism? Maybe it's both. Ross' vision seems to be that elites should inherit the American dream, while the disinherited middle class should accept defeat. But Americans were never elitist, nor defeatist, and Ross' vision is not consistent with our history. We can and will do better.
13
I kept looking for one word in this analysis: LOVE.
If it's true that Blacks and Hispanics are coping better with the adversities of American capitalism, maybe it's because they belong to communities which, to a greater extent due to historical and cultural reasons, are able to nurture more loving, affective, protective and dare I say spiritual relationships.
The triumph of reason, science and technology has driven the American capitalist society to great heights of material achievement. But it has drained it of soul, of love.
This is why many countries in Africa, even in their utter material "underdevelopment", often rank higher than the US countries in happiness metrics.
Put your arm around a suffering brother, show him love, and see what wonders it will accomplish.
If it's true that Blacks and Hispanics are coping better with the adversities of American capitalism, maybe it's because they belong to communities which, to a greater extent due to historical and cultural reasons, are able to nurture more loving, affective, protective and dare I say spiritual relationships.
The triumph of reason, science and technology has driven the American capitalist society to great heights of material achievement. But it has drained it of soul, of love.
This is why many countries in Africa, even in their utter material "underdevelopment", often rank higher than the US countries in happiness metrics.
Put your arm around a suffering brother, show him love, and see what wonders it will accomplish.
5
Before we look too deeply at underlying social ills, let us consider Occam's razor and look for the simplest possible solutions. Most of the proximate causes of early death in this population can be linked to two things: a diet of high-fat, high-sugar processed foods, leading to early diabetes and cardiovascular disease; and prescription drug (especially opiates) overdose deaths. And the latter lead directly to the Heroin epidemic now rampaging through the white working class. We don't see the recent and relative increase in these factors in the black (and to some extent Hispanic) communities because they rates were already relatively high before the Great Recession. That is, the recession hit those hardest who had just enough to lose.
4
Of course lower middle class whites are more depressed by their decreased social status than Hispanics and blacks both of whom, despite the stagnation of wages, are experiencing an increase in social status, coming from, as they have, a much lower starting point. Both groups are doing better than their parents, whites are doing worse (far worse if you factor in rocketing healthcare costs) than similarly aged parents raised in the post WWII years. To suggest, as Douthat does, that whites lower their expectations is unrealistic, at lease in the short term, and also rather sad, indicating that white Americans should give up, rather than extend, on the notion of the American dream. If that, and acquiescence based on religious subservience, is the conservative solution to wealth inequality count me out.
7
GOP economic policies from Reagen to W has long term effects on middle class lives. Too many Americans do not understand basic economics and vote against their own interest. The GOP Is only interested in the keeping the wealth protected, they are not interested in middle class families.
Give this reality another ten years and Americans will begin to vote in more social programs that ensure health care for all, better salaries and increased SS benefits. And yes, we all pay more taxes.
The GOP economic policies do not work for average Americans...when their base finally wakes up to this fact, we will become more like Europe in certain areas.
Give this reality another ten years and Americans will begin to vote in more social programs that ensure health care for all, better salaries and increased SS benefits. And yes, we all pay more taxes.
The GOP economic policies do not work for average Americans...when their base finally wakes up to this fact, we will become more like Europe in certain areas.
11
In a broader view, consider that those killing themselves overtly or slowly with alcohol and drug dependence no longer feel their worth is validated in our American society. Such validation seems essential for desire and effort to preserve one's life.
7
The nexus of right wing economics and propaganda, fundamentalist religion, and a cowed educational system is what underlies our societal pathologies. What will counter this triad of ills is schools that inculcate healthy doubt at a young age; doubt that fuels scientific inquiry; doubt that dispels magical thinking; doubt that challenges mendacious political speech; doubt that demands veracity rather than blind belief Mr. Douthat. Advocating faith over secularity as a counter to addiction is like substituting wine for whiskey.
12
Old psychological theory of suicide (I recall the name Menninger in connection). The intention to actually kill yourself requires BOTH the intention to die and the intention to kill someone. The latter is encouraged by the free-floating anger that Right-wing talk radio creates.
7
Thirty some years of Reaganism, tax policy that rewards wealth and corporatism while demonizing the poor and devastating the middle class through offshoring, downsizing, rightsizing, etc, have finally come home to roost. Through "Conservatism" in this country, the GOP has managed to start killing off their most faithful voting base. The old are dying, the middle-aged men are killing themselves.
7
Finally, an opinion column from Mr. Douthat that I concur with.
1
The death spiral of the labor unions cannot be overlooked as an important piece of this sad puzzle. Unions weren't just a way to collectively bargain higher wages and benefits, they provided a source of solidarity and community as well. We need workers' unions again. Perhaps a Wage Earners Union of some sort? I don't know. But, I do know that the best job I ever had was under a union - the WGA - and I look forward to a pension because of it. Time to organize labor again. It has to look different than in our industrial past, but it must be done.
7
Forgetting all the finger-pointing and 'scientific' evidence for a moment, this problem certainly does seem to have some karmic coincidences to it.
This is not to say that former working class minimally educated middle-aged-whites deserve to die by their own hands, but it does seem a bit ironic, if not a bit eerie that the same part of society that once enjoyed the "American Dream', and quite often at the expense of the "minorities" who were under any pretext kept at the gates, are now experiencing this radical phenomenon. Perhaps all of the suffering that communities of color have had to endure; the poverty, substandard housing , heroin and crack epidemics, and general lack of life's most basic necessities, have hardened them to the point of being able to survive almost every hardship. And how to "keep the faith", as Dr. King would say, in order to rise above it. So in a sense, it seems that maybe the shoe really is on the other foot this time.
This is not to say that former working class minimally educated middle-aged-whites deserve to die by their own hands, but it does seem a bit ironic, if not a bit eerie that the same part of society that once enjoyed the "American Dream', and quite often at the expense of the "minorities" who were under any pretext kept at the gates, are now experiencing this radical phenomenon. Perhaps all of the suffering that communities of color have had to endure; the poverty, substandard housing , heroin and crack epidemics, and general lack of life's most basic necessities, have hardened them to the point of being able to survive almost every hardship. And how to "keep the faith", as Dr. King would say, in order to rise above it. So in a sense, it seems that maybe the shoe really is on the other foot this time.
3
I think the emphasis on culture is well-placed. People might feel bad because their economic state is deteriorating, but they tend to feel that life is meaningless because the culture isn't providing the kinds of options it could and used to for finding meaning. One of the contrasts with Europe is that in many of those societies, there is a much livelier tradition of community events with things like music, dancing, arts, crafts, and of course, drinking way too much in a more or less comfortable setting where one feels accepted. Here, things keep gravitating toward a sort of consumer society where a few "creatives" provide "content" that the rest of us tune into through channels that provide revenue streams for commercial entities. Although these are sometimes packaged as folksy, they aren't; the fact that the successful purveyors of this stuff are way more wealthy than most of us have any hope of becoming only intensifies the contrast between winners and losers that, Don Trump notwithstanding, is the opposite of a vital, nurturing and creative culture.
5
Religion is nothing but empty promises. Under real life experience it crumbles.
10
First of all, thank you, Mr. Douthat, for introducing me to the word "Quietus".
Now, if Mr. Douthat is trying to argue that economic issues aren't the root-causes of the recent phenomenon of _increasing_ middle-class white mortality, I don't think he really succeeded. Previously, persons falling into drug addiction, failing marriages, out-of-wedlock childbearing, etc., were thought to be victims of their own character flaws. Now we see persons who were previously never so afflicted, descending into drug abuse, suicide, etc., and the only discernible difference is economic, will that be enough to convince us that the problem isn't only character deficiencies?
I doubt it. We will hold on to our delusions, and do nothing about the problem. I'm not a white man, but how many bodies need to go into the ground before they begin to count?
We really need to skip all the ideology and deal with the economy. That, I believe, would be the action with the highest payoff.
Now, if Mr. Douthat is trying to argue that economic issues aren't the root-causes of the recent phenomenon of _increasing_ middle-class white mortality, I don't think he really succeeded. Previously, persons falling into drug addiction, failing marriages, out-of-wedlock childbearing, etc., were thought to be victims of their own character flaws. Now we see persons who were previously never so afflicted, descending into drug abuse, suicide, etc., and the only discernible difference is economic, will that be enough to convince us that the problem isn't only character deficiencies?
I doubt it. We will hold on to our delusions, and do nothing about the problem. I'm not a white man, but how many bodies need to go into the ground before they begin to count?
We really need to skip all the ideology and deal with the economy. That, I believe, would be the action with the highest payoff.
5
Let me try a different starting point, that we are living through a post civil rights period of anger. Lower class white men, in particular, have for generations been sustained by an innate sense of superiority; to all black and brown people, women and, finally, to the lowly homosexual. All of this has been stripped away from a population who, had little else to sustain itself. This population is a backbone of the tea party movement. It is also, in a strange twist, hugely opposed to receiving health care from Obamacare, as long as it prevents those "Others". From getting more free stuff from the government which has abandoned them.
8
American has always gone through eras in which alcoholism, with its increased morality rates, surged. declined. According to the New York Times (“Actually, Prohibition Was a Success”) “alcohol consumption declined dramatically during Prohibition. Cirrhosis death rates for men were 29.5 per 100,000 in 1911 and 10.7 in 1929. Admissions to state mental hospitals for alcoholic psychosis declined from 10.1 per 100,000 in 1919 to 4.7 in 1928.
http://www.nytimes.com/1989/10/16/opinion/actually-prohibition-was-a-suc...
http://www.nytimes.com/1989/10/16/opinion/actually-prohibition-was-a-suc...
1
Given his world-view, naturally Ross tries to inch religion back to its place in the nexus of factors that preserve a positive attitude. In this telling, the decline of religion among European working class whites may not harm them, because their parents were already becoming secular and thus they didn't emerge recently and in shock from an environment that included strong religious belief. But despite his wishful thinking, you can't re-inculcate religion when the reason for its decline is still in effect -- when science has eroded so much of its underpinning.
3
One only has to read one of a raft of 'rural noir' crime novels, to appreciate the extent of the suffering of the people who live in the 'double-wide' trailers along the backroads.
3
The effects of inequality on every quality of life measure is not news to anyone who has read "The Spirit Level" by Wilkinson and Pickett. They document with tons of hard data that inequality corrodes nearly every element of life, from the bottom of the top of society in developed countries.
There is another factor that should be considered on top of this. Funny how Mr. Douthat makes no mention of 4 decades of conservative thought dominating and sometimes even strangling our political process. Nor does he reference the deliberate tactics of the right wing to seize on Whites as "their" base - and keep them in thrall by constantly making them angry and afraid.
Drinking, drugs, suicide? What would else would you expect from people constantly being told the country is going to hell, our enemies are everywhere and are ready to strike without warning, that our leaders are liars and totally corrupt (Even the supposedly Republican ones in Washington!)
It's the Other PTSD - Perennial Traumatic Stress Disorder. Recovery begins by turning off FOX, Rush, Hannity, and recognizing that the Republican Party is little more than a dying snake oil cult scam operation wholly owned by the 1%.
There is another factor that should be considered on top of this. Funny how Mr. Douthat makes no mention of 4 decades of conservative thought dominating and sometimes even strangling our political process. Nor does he reference the deliberate tactics of the right wing to seize on Whites as "their" base - and keep them in thrall by constantly making them angry and afraid.
Drinking, drugs, suicide? What would else would you expect from people constantly being told the country is going to hell, our enemies are everywhere and are ready to strike without warning, that our leaders are liars and totally corrupt (Even the supposedly Republican ones in Washington!)
It's the Other PTSD - Perennial Traumatic Stress Disorder. Recovery begins by turning off FOX, Rush, Hannity, and recognizing that the Republican Party is little more than a dying snake oil cult scam operation wholly owned by the 1%.
8
If the answer is "sustained growth, full employment and a welfare state that’s friendlier to work and family" as you suggest then might I suggest these low information voters get just a tiny bit more information and realize which party is depriving them of a living wage. Its the people they have been voting for. Until they realize this and start voting for their wallets instead of their prejudices life is going to be a series of McJobs and they won't get what think they are entitled to. And some of the more unstable and desperate among them will continue to kill themselves to escape this.
4
Ross, for God's sake man, how you dance around on the heads of pins looking to not see the Devils! How is it you never find the corporate "invisible hand" that has in the past fifty years squeezed and smothered everyday people, demanding more and more time and fealty from those it considers minions. Look at how people, terrified of losing their wobbly perch in the "middle class" give up vacations, don't take leaves for family, come to work sick, and on and on to show the data crunchers in the corporations they understand the "right" priorities. Week after week you appear blind to the lives of the ordinary citizens.
8
The problem is moral permissiveness and welfare-state paternalism?? The people drugging and killing themselves are in conservative, church-going communities and aren't exactly living off the fat of government largesse. They are immersed in a culture of every man and his gun for himself, anyone not making it is a loser, the few lavishly rewarded winners are expected to view them and any taxed contribution to their welfare with disdain, and they are expected to share this humiliating view of themselves and any pittance of help that they might accept. There is no society. No art, no childcare, no collective endeavor of any kind for any reason at any time. You're on your own. My wife is Hispanic. Like any group, plenty of its members have plenty of problems, but isolation is rarely among them. They live within a society. Ironically, it's the culture of white American rugged individualism, not Hispanic or black communities with their much greater emphasis on community, that devalues the individual and abandons the loser to drugs and depression.
5
"a feeling that what you were supposed to have has been denied to you." YES. This is precisely what I wake up with every day. And go to sleep with every night. The psychiatrist that reviewed my case for Social Security, however, thinks this is perfectly normal?! I do belong to the exact demographics - white male 45-54 with a high school degree. However, there is a little twist to my case. Because I am also an Eastern-European immigrant. And I already figured it out that I am far better educated than what my highest achieved degree would suggest. Also, I never susbscribes to the US white male "bourgeois moral logic". Quite the opposite! I always despised it. I am a Sanders voter (I was actually a sole volunteer in my rather conservative little town in Vermont during his 2012 Senate run). So it seems Karl Marx was right: the present material circumstances of my life - which are roughly the same like those of many other similarly aged white males with a lack of formal education around me - determine the setup of my consciousness. That despite the 'baggage' of liberal education, journalistic writing, and unfinished political activism of my earlier life somewhere else. Or maybe the two resentments play into each other in my case?
5
I think Mr Douthat has something here. White, blue-collar men face a world completely different in which they grew up. Good paying union jobs and a steady marriage afforded a life with a house, two cars and a boat, maybe even a cabin and a pension at retirement. All of that is GONE. Hard work does not pay unless it is in the right area. Women are free to walk out of a marriage without concerns. The future looks dark without a pension, college tuitions and legal fees and no family to care for.
4
I'd like to see a study that investigates what media are most used by the working-class whites who are at risk. Despair is pushed by the right-wing media--no hope for the country or for individual lives as long as lefties are in control. There are other contributing factors, of course, but a continuing diet of talk radio could drive almost anyone to self-destructive behavior. Add to this the apocalyptic rhetoric of some Republican presidential candidates, and we have a recipe for despair. More realistic views of the economy and the state of the nation, let alone hopeful and positive news, are simply denied. Maybe Trump's appeal is just his more positive message, however simplistic it actually is.
3
Summary: Middle-aged white mortality rates are up because those people are now getting the shaft in America. Rates are not up among blacks and Hispanics because they've always gotten the shaft. Sounds about right to me.
8
Apparently whites in totally secular European states have no problem finding meaning in life outside the church. So do a billion or so of Chinese who, while not technically "white" (nor would they want to be), have a very strong work ethics and tight family structure, still influenced by Confucianism, which is a philosophy rather than a religion. Mr. Douthat mourns the passing of a particular American phenomenon: the small-town parochial mentality of church, beer, and guns, close-minded, intolerant and anti-intellectual. I would say: good riddance!
9
Why does Douthat and the right always and inevitably equate a decent salary for decent employment with "transfer payments", "handouts", "subsidies" and other equally demeaning and insulting terms?
Could it be that the holy whites of this article are too fat and too ill-educated to succeed and the often vulgar and bloated culture have contributed to obesity and bad jobs? It is class warfare, with the lowest being fed a lethal junk diet by the better off, and the lowest, either not voting at all, being deprived of voting, or voting against their own self interest.
Could it be that the holy whites of this article are too fat and too ill-educated to succeed and the often vulgar and bloated culture have contributed to obesity and bad jobs? It is class warfare, with the lowest being fed a lethal junk diet by the better off, and the lowest, either not voting at all, being deprived of voting, or voting against their own self interest.
5
Republicans are dying off! Heavens forfend! Look, the death rate among minorities has been far higher than for whites forever. Of course, there are factors in play here, but let's worry about the public health issue and not the political spectre of all those red states turning.
3
" The new boss is the same as the old boss: we won't get fooled again".
Pete Townsend/ The Who. Of course the song knew that we 'WOULD' be fooled again, and we have. Time and time again, not necessarily by any one political view (conservative) but by a society that has forgotten to PUT PEOPLE FIRST. It's as simple as that. We prioritize an economic system that perpetuates itself. Now we have popular media ( reality TV) that in no way reflects life in America today. Name one show that would be like Roseanne
for example ( I never watched it myself). So... people do not see themselves reflected in Television or music (no topics in 'Country' music, while Rap seems to praise the capitalistic ethos). And people sink deeper into personal despair.
Pete Townsend/ The Who. Of course the song knew that we 'WOULD' be fooled again, and we have. Time and time again, not necessarily by any one political view (conservative) but by a society that has forgotten to PUT PEOPLE FIRST. It's as simple as that. We prioritize an economic system that perpetuates itself. Now we have popular media ( reality TV) that in no way reflects life in America today. Name one show that would be like Roseanne
for example ( I never watched it myself). So... people do not see themselves reflected in Television or music (no topics in 'Country' music, while Rap seems to praise the capitalistic ethos). And people sink deeper into personal despair.
4
So... a Conservative is advising his core constituents to follow the lead of the minority population in having lowered expectations and a resiliency in the face of life's hardships. Incredibly ironic!!!! Conservative have been telling these now endangered White people that these same minorities are to blame for all of Americas problems.
Maybe it's 30+ years of voting Republican and against their own interests and in favor of policies that favor the uber wealthy? Maybe it's a steady diet of Fox News telling them that they are endangered and that it's "open season" on White men.
Race has always been used to keep poor whites and minorities from realizing they have more in common than not.
I hope they take Mr, Douthat's suggestion and learn from their brown brothers and sisters—and then take the next step — join them in the voting for policies and candidates who are working to make our country better for all people instead of turning it into a playground for the .01%
Maybe it's 30+ years of voting Republican and against their own interests and in favor of policies that favor the uber wealthy? Maybe it's a steady diet of Fox News telling them that they are endangered and that it's "open season" on White men.
Race has always been used to keep poor whites and minorities from realizing they have more in common than not.
I hope they take Mr, Douthat's suggestion and learn from their brown brothers and sisters—and then take the next step — join them in the voting for policies and candidates who are working to make our country better for all people instead of turning it into a playground for the .01%
7
Doutha is a mouth-piece for right-wing causes dressed up to sound convincing to the exact people who are so despondent they have given up. These middle-aged white men and women who bought into the Republican triad of guns, hate and trickle down economic ruin found themselves at the bottom with no one to blame but themselves and with few (if any) options. To conservatives who are true believers, like Russ, someone has to shoulder the blame and of course it liberals and the "welfare state". In reality they were used by conservatives and their lives were ruined due to their ignorance and adherence to conservative economic and social dogma.
5
It's about jobs, full-time jobs. Everyone can't be white-collar. Don't we need blue-collar employees: caregivers, plumbers, builders, fixers? PLEASE elected officials, do whatever it takes to get people employed. There was a civilian conservation corps once, let's have something similar, let's throw the rulebook out, let's just make work for these people!!
4
I'll bet the problem is worse, like divorce and obesity, in the red states. Hope there is research into this.
3
From what I've read in the Times, access to guns leads to vastly increased success in suicide attempts. So I wonder how many of these people are killing themselves with the guns they keep insisting that the rest of us have to live in fear of.
3
Please do not blame the Republicans for the distribution of upwards wealth. There are plenty of diner owners in Manhattan who are multi-millionaires. A person makes choices in life. It is America and one can be or become as ambitious as one desires. And a person can earn (or figure out how to earn) as much money as he or she determines. If a person wants to stay in the victim mentality of "woe is me and life is so unfair" that is their decision. The turn-of-the-century work ethic and determination seems to have vanished. Too bad as the latter is quite depressing and could explain the mortality rates described in the article.
"Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
You mean like serfs?
You mean like serfs?
10
Another easy to understand problem blurred by conservatives double talk.
The effects of the relentless march of Movement Conservatism over the past 40 years are finally being seen.
It is what fuels the candidacies of the GOP outsiders and chokes the candidacies of mainstream politicians.
White working class males have not voted in the majority for the democrat for president since 1964. The old New Deal coalition who became Reagan Democrats are STILL waiting for their free lunch courtesy of supply side economics, trickle down theory and upward income redistribution.
They feel it in their bones; the only reason they are not rich like Trump or Perot or Gates is because the government won't get out of their way.
Even on the one thing they've hung their hate since WWII, America's military strength, is no longer there, and it was a Republican president and Congress that wrecked it.
They have no where to turn. As they near their so called golden years and realize they will be more dependent than ever on government programs just to survive, and that many of them are not prepared because, well, who needed government?, the dissonance and alienation is too great.
In true conservative form, they blame liberals and government, unable to accept personal responsibility right to the bottom of a shot glass or a prescription bottle, or worse.
Conservatives: Reap. Sow. And, Good-bye.
The effects of the relentless march of Movement Conservatism over the past 40 years are finally being seen.
It is what fuels the candidacies of the GOP outsiders and chokes the candidacies of mainstream politicians.
White working class males have not voted in the majority for the democrat for president since 1964. The old New Deal coalition who became Reagan Democrats are STILL waiting for their free lunch courtesy of supply side economics, trickle down theory and upward income redistribution.
They feel it in their bones; the only reason they are not rich like Trump or Perot or Gates is because the government won't get out of their way.
Even on the one thing they've hung their hate since WWII, America's military strength, is no longer there, and it was a Republican president and Congress that wrecked it.
They have no where to turn. As they near their so called golden years and realize they will be more dependent than ever on government programs just to survive, and that many of them are not prepared because, well, who needed government?, the dissonance and alienation is too great.
In true conservative form, they blame liberals and government, unable to accept personal responsibility right to the bottom of a shot glass or a prescription bottle, or worse.
Conservatives: Reap. Sow. And, Good-bye.
5
The turn of the century seems to be right around the time that technology started to really impact employment,that home prices went through the roof as well as the cost of healthcare (esp insurance) and suddenly everyone needed a 40,000 suv. Lawn services manicures Coach bags. At the same time that opportnunities and wealth were drying up ( i forgot to include tuition costs) people were emulating the rich and taking out home equity loans for nonsense items and pools. I think while you're in the midst of an historical event akin to the great depression--combined with the upheaval of the economy due to globalization and technology--youve never been through it so you dont have the tools to cope.Our expectation all during the 20th century was that things would just continue to get exponentially better.Middle aged whites saw their parents do ok and they lived most of their own lives doing ok but then the rug was pulled out and suddenly they have to learn how to CODE? At 50? Their kids can adapt to the changes because it's all they know. The elderly parents have SocialSecurity, pensions and paid off homes. The middle aged suffer and succumb to depression because the obstacles feel insurmountable.
5
In addition to the economic and social challenges faced by poorly educated whites, there is another cause for their despair. Many watch or listen to hour-upon-hour of terrifying, paranoiac right wing media rants provided by the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Fox News and local talk radio shows. In reaction, many vote for angry, far right politicians who promise to fix things by upending government at the state and federal level. But when they see that the activities of these elected demagogues either have no positive effect on their lives or in fact make their situation worse (see Kansas), this coupled with the continued braying of right wing media can only drive them into deeper despair.
6
Doubt That: Conservative focus on war and profit is more likely the reason, while robbing the underclasses of their jobs, education, health care, shelter, and security. Less than half of our country's population is getting what they truly need from government, and it's not "welfare." The only real welfare in this nation is what goes to corporations and the wealthy, if not to members of Congress, themselves. Nobel prize, my fat a**.
8
". . . maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation"
It is remarkable and telling that whites and Germans are the only groups who can be stereotyped in this newspaper without protest or, indeed, objection by anyone.
Illegal aliens have no need to "adapt culturally"? Black Americans already have so adapted? H-1B visa holders, living ten to an apartment and receiving third-world wages, represent this new culture to which white America must adapt?
And what aspects of the culture should white America focus on? Employers of H-1B visa holders have dishonestly collaborated with major companies for the past 15 years to drive down the wages of white America. Do you suggest that white America cease being honest and forthright as well?
Oh, wait a minute . . . I didn't stereotype, did I?
It is remarkable and telling that whites and Germans are the only groups who can be stereotyped in this newspaper without protest or, indeed, objection by anyone.
Illegal aliens have no need to "adapt culturally"? Black Americans already have so adapted? H-1B visa holders, living ten to an apartment and receiving third-world wages, represent this new culture to which white America must adapt?
And what aspects of the culture should white America focus on? Employers of H-1B visa holders have dishonestly collaborated with major companies for the past 15 years to drive down the wages of white America. Do you suggest that white America cease being honest and forthright as well?
Oh, wait a minute . . . I didn't stereotype, did I?
7
It seems that the children of the so called "Greatest Generation" are meeting fate in a way no one can or should expect. How far we have fallen as a country.
If there is any lesson here, it is that ideological stances and subsequent policy decisions have real outcomes. A failed ideology will result in failed lives. This is a health record of an ideology which does not work.
Imagine a working class American who is now 55 years old, dying in a hospital bed. Where would America be if it had the same tax rates now as America did back in 1960, back when this person who is now dying was just an infant, back when the Greatest Generation was taking off in a booming economy?
I keep thinking of a businessman who doesn't understand that the success of his business is nothing but the success of those he hires. And so he doesn't invest in their success, he pays them poorly, he subjects them to unfair and dangerous working conditions, and yet he scratches his head as to why his employees are exhausted and sick, work 2 jobs, call in so much to take care of sick children, and quit so often. He tells himself, "They're just lazy, they don't have the right values..." Really?
But this is exactly how the ideological stances and subsequent policies of the Republican Party have left the working class of America. Spent, worked to the bone, with no income to show for it. And all the while, the rich deriding them as lazy and Mr. Douthat suggesting they should "adapt".
If there is any lesson here, it is that ideological stances and subsequent policy decisions have real outcomes. A failed ideology will result in failed lives. This is a health record of an ideology which does not work.
Imagine a working class American who is now 55 years old, dying in a hospital bed. Where would America be if it had the same tax rates now as America did back in 1960, back when this person who is now dying was just an infant, back when the Greatest Generation was taking off in a booming economy?
I keep thinking of a businessman who doesn't understand that the success of his business is nothing but the success of those he hires. And so he doesn't invest in their success, he pays them poorly, he subjects them to unfair and dangerous working conditions, and yet he scratches his head as to why his employees are exhausted and sick, work 2 jobs, call in so much to take care of sick children, and quit so often. He tells himself, "They're just lazy, they don't have the right values..." Really?
But this is exactly how the ideological stances and subsequent policies of the Republican Party have left the working class of America. Spent, worked to the bone, with no income to show for it. And all the while, the rich deriding them as lazy and Mr. Douthat suggesting they should "adapt".
7
If whites can't find jobs, how are they affording so many drugs and guns?
We put people of color in jail for most of their lives for using drugs and sob-sisters like Douthat try to find the deep psychological reasons why poor whites are using more drugs. The answer is, they never stopped!
We put people of color in jail for most of their lives for using drugs and sob-sisters like Douthat try to find the deep psychological reasons why poor whites are using more drugs. The answer is, they never stopped!
3
Oh, sure, it's all the fault of liberals and progressives. What tripe. Why, it couldn't possibly be the fault of 30 years of republican policies of trickle-down economics, two unpaid-for wars, outsourcing once-plentiful good paying jobs, ripping the heart out of the economy with Wall Street gambles, driving the cost of higher education out of reach of the working class, all of which operate to now put the working class white men into the same predicament as working class minorities who have been struggling with lack of education, poor job prospects and deprivation of hope for decades if not centuries. Where previously despair drove men to drink, it now also drives them to drugs -- not because of liberal/progressive "permissiveness" but because the drugs are now just as available as booze ever was, and more deadly. Liberals haven't been importing drugs -- criminal gangs have been. As for the decline of religion -- can't blame that on liberals. Blame it on the growing realization that religion is an empty suit; focus on the imaginary hereafter doesn't nothing to put food on the table in the here and now. Working class whites, along with their children, are awakening to the fact that Marx was right -- religion is the opiate of the masses. What is truly amazing is that, despite their utter despair, those who commit suicide haven't pointed the pistols in the direction of the likes of Douthat instead.
5
This brings to mind the disastrous increase in mortality among Russian men toward the end of the Soviet period and continuing into the post-Soviet period. That also was consistent with alcoholism, abandonment of family, and a loss of a sense of direction and potency.
4
Mr Douthat,
Please note the number of times the respondents to your column mention capitalism - and take that seriously. As with the letter writers, no need to jump to some redemptive alternative system like socialism - but think about exploring ways revise, modify, democratize,or just begin to critiques and honestly debate how US capitalism operates in relation to other models in the world.
Please note the number of times the respondents to your column mention capitalism - and take that seriously. As with the letter writers, no need to jump to some redemptive alternative system like socialism - but think about exploring ways revise, modify, democratize,or just begin to critiques and honestly debate how US capitalism operates in relation to other models in the world.
4
Case and Deaton have identified a major problem, but I believe we need more research before trying to fix it. At this time, the root cause of the increasing death rate is just speculation. Hypotheses are great, but they need to be tested.
Chronic pain? Drug/alcohol abuse? Loss of community and/or values? Poor diet? Poverty? Family breakups? All of these need to be investigated.
One clue is that the death rate for middle-aged whites started rising in the late 1990s. What changed for them around that time?
Also, how do the death rates compare regionally? Higher in the north or the south? In cities, suburbia or rural areas?
Chronic pain? Drug/alcohol abuse? Loss of community and/or values? Poor diet? Poverty? Family breakups? All of these need to be investigated.
One clue is that the death rate for middle-aged whites started rising in the late 1990s. What changed for them around that time?
Also, how do the death rates compare regionally? Higher in the north or the south? In cities, suburbia or rural areas?
4
Mr. Douthat is partially correct but misses the reality of what is actually happening within the middle-class white community. It's not the Republican policies that are driving this elevated are of suicide and drug overdoses, it is a combination of things.
The loss of manufacturing jobs available is the first piece. The lack of employment has left a void that is being filled with depression, drug addiction and a need to earn money any way they can (often this means becoming involved in drugs). Second, the liberalization of our schools have sought these men that they are "bad" human beings. The evil white people are the source of all the world ills. The middle-class white man has no place in society today.
We have elevated others at the cost of the middle-class white male. We empowered women at the cost of creating real men. (Then women complain that there are no good men)
If we, as a society, wish to correct this injustice, we must return jobs back to this country that middle-class men (of all races) can do and earn enough money to care for their family. Men need to take care of their own. Without that purpose they descend into a life not worth living.
We must bring back purpose to all people of this country.
The loss of manufacturing jobs available is the first piece. The lack of employment has left a void that is being filled with depression, drug addiction and a need to earn money any way they can (often this means becoming involved in drugs). Second, the liberalization of our schools have sought these men that they are "bad" human beings. The evil white people are the source of all the world ills. The middle-class white man has no place in society today.
We have elevated others at the cost of the middle-class white male. We empowered women at the cost of creating real men. (Then women complain that there are no good men)
If we, as a society, wish to correct this injustice, we must return jobs back to this country that middle-class men (of all races) can do and earn enough money to care for their family. Men need to take care of their own. Without that purpose they descend into a life not worth living.
We must bring back purpose to all people of this country.
4
The elephant in the room is the elephant. The one that has spread doom and gloom, fear and discouragement and hatred.
7
Ross Douthat says, "if economic stress were all, you would expect the mortality crisis to manifest itself more sharply among black and Hispanic Americans — who have consistently higher unemployment rates than their white neighbors, and lag whites in wealth by far." First, this particular group of white Americans may not be experiencing as high, or higher, unemployment rates than black or Hispanic counterparts. The overall data don't tell us. Second, he glosses over the fact that the mortality rate for black Americans is still much higher than for white Americans. Perhaps the health impact of economic stress was always there for black Americans and therefore we don't see the same change of course in recent decades as we do for whites. Perhaps there actually is an increased impact of drug, alcohol, and suicide deaths among black Americans that is masked by an even bigger improvement in access to health care and treatment for illnesses such as cancer and heart disease, over the same time period. From the data Ross cites, we can't know. So I'm skeptical of his use of this data to shore up his points.
3
Instead of minority resignation and resilience and white adaptation and acquiescence to the indifference and hostility of gluttonous plutocrats and their political handmaidens, perhaps it would be better to aggressively challenge the structural issues in America’s economy and society that are causing income and wealth inequality and their negative social and emotional consequences. Capitalism need not be rapacious, driven by short-term speculation in the casino that is Wall Street. Rather, the culture of capitalism can to inspire business and finance to do well by doing good, to consider not only the wealth of stockholders, but also the wellbeing of customers, employees, and community. Equity as well as efficiency is the business of business.
5
Douthat: "Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
You mean, just get used to it? Nice.
You mean, just get used to it? Nice.
6
What Mr. Douthat fails to mention, since it does not fit his narrative, is the fact that those secular socialist European countries have much higher divorce and single parent rates than the populations mentioned, and still, they are not dying at record rates. I guess, since the formula for happiness is Reality - Expectation / Perception, it is so much easier to lower expectations or change perception than to change reality. It's been the conservatives' playbook for ever.
3
It's not just middle-aged whites who are suffering. Out of the world's 20 richest countries, the US has the lowest *overall* life expectancy.
But what do you expect when it also has the highest wealth inequality, the lowest share of GDP going to the poor via government assistance, and is the only rich country without guaranteed healthcare?
(Douthat's argument in favor of religion is silly; the US is also the most religious of first-world countries -- although heaven knows this doesn't translate into any kind of help for the sick, old and poor.)
But what do you expect when it also has the highest wealth inequality, the lowest share of GDP going to the poor via government assistance, and is the only rich country without guaranteed healthcare?
(Douthat's argument in favor of religion is silly; the US is also the most religious of first-world countries -- although heaven knows this doesn't translate into any kind of help for the sick, old and poor.)
8
The mystery of why this particular segment of the US population is suddenly declining since the mid-90's is summed up by Ross Douthat's title of today's op-ed, "The Dying of the Whites". Just like Tchaikovsky's "Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy" is a dance for the ballerina dressed in white in the third movement of "The Nutcracker" pas de deux (step of two), the whites, just like the principal ballerina in Nutcracker, were used to being the center of a fantasy. Similar to Snow White & the Seven Dwarfs or Walt Disney's Fantasia, the Whites who are dying an early, self inflicted death, have discovered that their American dream that was sold to them through color TVs, Disneyland, advertising, politicians' broken promises & worshiping the Boy Scout motto of "On my honor I will do my best. To do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law; To help other people at all times" was all a fantasy. Somehow when their good paying manufacturing jobs were shipped overseas by politicians who made trade deals designed to benefit the wealthy, they continued to hold on to the broken promise that their country was as important as God & their countrymen. Now with a global society in which one's country is no longer important, only money & technology hold court. The dying of the whites is the result of the unraveling of the American dream fabric, one thread at a time. Now they know that this wondrous woven magic in bits of red, white, blue & gold, was impossible to hold.
4
They need to stop watching Fox News, which plays on and magnifies their anxieties, leading to excessive stress and, ultimately, heart failure or self-obliteration. They'll live longer, happier and better-informed lives if they switch back to the reviled MSM.
1
While mortality rates are rising among poor and working class whites they are still higher among Blacks and Latinos. Douthat is likely correct in acknowledging that the rising rates among whites are a consequence of both economic dislocation and the breakdown of a sense of community. While it it is also true that Black and Latino communities can draw on a deeper pool of experience with these conditions, whatever strategies they have developed haven't saved them from higher mortality rates than their increasingly unhappy white neighbors.
Is the trend toward secularization part of all this? Perhaps. But people aren't going to start going to churches that preach things they don't believe just because social scientists say it would be good for them. Religion, and the community that it offers, may indeed be comforting. But it is built on a foundation of lies and that is why it has been in slow decline since the beginnings of the scientific revolution several hundred years ago.
We need to build new kinds of communities that don't rest on medeival nonsense nor on the atomization of capitalism. That is our challenge.
Is the trend toward secularization part of all this? Perhaps. But people aren't going to start going to churches that preach things they don't believe just because social scientists say it would be good for them. Religion, and the community that it offers, may indeed be comforting. But it is built on a foundation of lies and that is why it has been in slow decline since the beginnings of the scientific revolution several hundred years ago.
We need to build new kinds of communities that don't rest on medeival nonsense nor on the atomization of capitalism. That is our challenge.
4
Mr. Douthat to cannot distinguish between trends and absolute rates. This distinction is most salient in his statement "Yet here, too, Deaton and Case’s data is somewhat confounding, because if economic stress were all, you would expect the mortality crisis to manifest itself more sharply among black and Hispanic Americans — who have consistently higher unemployment rates than their white neighbors, and lag whites in wealth by far." What he fails to understand from the Deaton-Chase paper is that their analysis shows that the absolute rates of mortality are consistently HIGHER among Blacks and Hispanics even if the trends in these rates are opposite those of late, middle-aged whites. The former groups are not doing all that great either, but appear to be improving just as some political and social power trends their way - trends that the white, middle-aged males clearly resent. And this resentment manifests as political support for policies and candidates who clearly undermine the personal interests of this group. It would be a worthwhile experiment to at least try, in some places, the liberal democracy solution of "a welfare state that’s friendlier to work and family can help revive that nexus." With this latter statement Mr. Douthat has just acknowledged that his kindred idealogue's proposals of religion, personal responsibility, and very short bootstraps as solutions to these problems are actually undermining work and family. Does he even realize what he is saying?
3
The study doesn't show geographic distribution of this increase in mortality. This would be an interesting factor to consider. I don't have the link, but a similar study focused only on white women done a few years ago showed that the increases all occurred in rural and small city areas--especially in the South, upper mid-west, plains and mountain states--whereas mortality for white women continued to decrease in urban and suburban areas throughout the country. There may be a lot of answers there, not limited to the fact that rural economies have been declining since the 1920s.
When this report first came out, I read a comment that said prescription opiates became widely available in the mid-to-late 1990s at the same time that wide-spread advertising for pharmaceuticals was also legalized. Again, there might be some interesting studies in this area.
Does anyone remember Rush Limbaugh's addiction problems? Certainly lack of wealth and diminished conservative cultural values didn't lead to his addiction, but special legal treatment and a lot of money for rehab treatment undoubtedly may have forestalled any rush to end it all.
I read Rod Dreher regularly, generally but not always in disagreement. Poor and poorly educated whites in my age and racial cohort were told for generations by their economic "betters" their their whiteness made them special, regardless of how poor they were. It they feel dispossessed, there may lie one reason.
When this report first came out, I read a comment that said prescription opiates became widely available in the mid-to-late 1990s at the same time that wide-spread advertising for pharmaceuticals was also legalized. Again, there might be some interesting studies in this area.
Does anyone remember Rush Limbaugh's addiction problems? Certainly lack of wealth and diminished conservative cultural values didn't lead to his addiction, but special legal treatment and a lot of money for rehab treatment undoubtedly may have forestalled any rush to end it all.
I read Rod Dreher regularly, generally but not always in disagreement. Poor and poorly educated whites in my age and racial cohort were told for generations by their economic "betters" their their whiteness made them special, regardless of how poor they were. It they feel dispossessed, there may lie one reason.
2
Pre-industrial age our economy was heavily agriculture. It's easy to have a purpose when you work a farm. When industry is steady it is also easy to have a purpose. Our middle class population has shifted to work in industry over the past century but it is very undependable. Men especially feel this lack of purpose when they cannot work.
Cutting to the core of the issue our uneducated middle class have been exposed to a world economy with no tools to engage.
Cutting to the core of the issue our uneducated middle class have been exposed to a world economy with no tools to engage.
2
I want to quote Julie from Atlanta GA in a new comment string here because I think it is important to emphasize her point, which to me demonstrates Dothan's innately skewed thinking:
Julie Atlanta, GA 1 hour ago
Note the subtle sexism :
"...a new paper from the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton and his wife, Anne Case."
Given that Ms. Case is the first author of the paper, a more accurate description would be "a new paper from Anne Case and her husband, the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton. "
Julie Atlanta, GA 1 hour ago
Note the subtle sexism :
"...a new paper from the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton and his wife, Anne Case."
Given that Ms. Case is the first author of the paper, a more accurate description would be "a new paper from Anne Case and her husband, the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton. "
8
These people like to work for a living -- maybe that's why they're called "working class -- and that has been denied them for the past 10 years. Jobs to China and India (I see it every day in high tech). How much simpler can an explanation get? No need for the pretzel logic on display here, attributing it to dark psychological forces that only white people are prey to. Unless you mean the psychological need to work for a living. How utterly predictable.
7
Financial despondency a known cause of depression and suicide. It is surely not responsible for every suicide, nor is it the only reason people turn to addictive painkillers to anesthetize themselves. But it is surely one driver, and a very important one.
Next to the trends in mortality among high school educated whites ages 45-54, plot the percentage who become jobless and/or become deeply underwater and fall behind in their mortgage or rent payments, or fall hopelessly behind with growing large credit card debt balances. Note the point of inflection in that statistic, coinciding almost precisely with the change in the suicide and drug related death rates. Now plot the change in churchgoing over time, and note the must smoother and more modest trend, without any point of inflection.
If you are honest, Ross, you will discover the true driver of this disturbing trend and report on it. If you prefer to cloud the issue, write another column along these lines.
Next to the trends in mortality among high school educated whites ages 45-54, plot the percentage who become jobless and/or become deeply underwater and fall behind in their mortgage or rent payments, or fall hopelessly behind with growing large credit card debt balances. Note the point of inflection in that statistic, coinciding almost precisely with the change in the suicide and drug related death rates. Now plot the change in churchgoing over time, and note the must smoother and more modest trend, without any point of inflection.
If you are honest, Ross, you will discover the true driver of this disturbing trend and report on it. If you prefer to cloud the issue, write another column along these lines.
3
Deaton and Case's findings have occasioned much musing among the commentariat, and Douthat's turn, like most, lacks the appropriate edge.
First, the news is late: "This just in! Nobel Laureate confirms: ocean wet! 'We were collecting data on fish, and the conclusion caught us by surprise."
Second, the obvious fact must be expressed with moral rage: "Another nail hammered into the lid our cultural coffin: our society sanctifies cannibalism."
First, the news is late: "This just in! Nobel Laureate confirms: ocean wet! 'We were collecting data on fish, and the conclusion caught us by surprise."
Second, the obvious fact must be expressed with moral rage: "Another nail hammered into the lid our cultural coffin: our society sanctifies cannibalism."
1
There's idealism that looks to root causes and a more natural and holistic cure, and then there's realism, which takes into consideration the poor odds that the ideal is achievable without some sort of divine intervention or astrological harmonic conversion. Mr. Douthat's position is commendably realistic, yet I think he strays so far from the ideal platitudes so commonly lacking in the liberal narrative.
I live out in Amish country where many of my neighbors ride by in horse and buggy, with broad smiles and hearty waves. Theirs is not a utopian existence, but I greatly enjoy the sociological comparisons that repeatedly come to mind. Family and extended family support, lifestyles more simplified, less materialistic, less hedonistic, more sustainable, a healthy transcendent sense of purpose and moral/ethical guidance, and deep connectedness to village/community (actual people-to-people contact, not the screen-to-screen version), needs to be considered in the cure mix despite how far most of us are from this sort of existence.
I live out in Amish country where many of my neighbors ride by in horse and buggy, with broad smiles and hearty waves. Theirs is not a utopian existence, but I greatly enjoy the sociological comparisons that repeatedly come to mind. Family and extended family support, lifestyles more simplified, less materialistic, less hedonistic, more sustainable, a healthy transcendent sense of purpose and moral/ethical guidance, and deep connectedness to village/community (actual people-to-people contact, not the screen-to-screen version), needs to be considered in the cure mix despite how far most of us are from this sort of existence.
4
Ross.... great article on a topic needing much thought as to resolution. This malaise of the working class should be the main topic of discussion during the Presidential debates and in our news papers.
I guess, as always, the answer is to slash taxes for the One Percenters and to deregulate Wall Street.
5
To me, this all began in the 1970s when trade surpluses became trade deficits. Then along came St. Reagan with working class whites voting against their own economic interests. As I've said before, it's not a coincidence that factories began leaving the US en mass in the 1980s. Bush 41 and the corporate Clintons followed and we got NAFTA and MFN with China. We know what followed the Clintons. The manufacturing base continued to diminish and we got 9/11, two wars, Katrina, and the financial crisis. My question is where the hell were the Democrats and any effective counters to these horrid policy decisions? Either signing off on them or becoming immersed in liberal culture wars. Sure, gays can marry now but the jobs for the working class have left. Is that really a good trade off?
6
My knee-jerk liberal response is, of course this is about economic stagnation affecting most of us since 1980. But Ross Douthat also looks toward the decline of religiosity as a significant contributing factor. In this he is almost right, but stops there because that's the drum he likes to bang on. But let's look around a little further. If religious practice leads us to look inward and reflect, what's does the opposite? I would argue that it's our overwhelmingly dominant commercial culture.
3
The sin of the white middle class is its failure to get bigger and richer. Economic stagnation or decline becomes a mortal sin. Remember " Death of a Salesman" and Willy Loman? We've been down this road before and eventually we'll get past it.
1
"Maybe sustained growth, full employment and a welfare state that’s friendlier to work and family can help revive that nexus. Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
Or maybe they need to take to the streets.
Or maybe they need to take to the streets.
6
Gee, Ross, it's as simple for middle class whites to halt this flood of substance abuse and suicide by just accepting --"adapt[ing] culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect," in your words-- that things are the way they are. Just like the Blacks on the plantation, knowing they were better off in slavery than struggling to make a go of it as a free man. And expecting and receiving no respect or opportunity from your former "owner."
8
Is this not "American Exceptionalism" writ large. That hackneyed phrase always had a below the surface tinge of racism.
We white people were always, in Trumps parlance, the best, richest, smartest of the species, too bad we believed it, now the slow descent is gaining speed. The next group to suffer will be college educated white men as their jobs get decimated by the continuing IT revolution. Since they've felt even more entitled than the blue collar populace, as in most things they will far surpass us high school educated workers in the downward spiral.
We white people were always, in Trumps parlance, the best, richest, smartest of the species, too bad we believed it, now the slow descent is gaining speed. The next group to suffer will be college educated white men as their jobs get decimated by the continuing IT revolution. Since they've felt even more entitled than the blue collar populace, as in most things they will far surpass us high school educated workers in the downward spiral.
5
Look at life on the lower rungs today- legalized loan sharks on every corner preying on people who cannot make it paycheck to paycheck, young people reluctant to marry until they have the means to support a family (which may never happen). I’m not sure if your church is like my church, but although we reach out to the poor through soup kitchens, we really do not encourage them to attend OUR churches. We see minimum wage workers who are simultaneously on food stamps. The people in distress almost self-identify themselves through their dress, appearance and street savvy, trying to create a society within a society to which they can relate. And these identification markers make it all the harder to escape their circumstances.
Unlike the culture following WW2, where sharing a foxhole made brothers of us all, today’s culture indeed encourages us to reject the “lass thans” and to socialize with “decent” people.
I do not know that escapism to a different culture would lead to a life of drugs. However, I can easily see how it would lead to severe despondency and suicide.
Unlike the culture following WW2, where sharing a foxhole made brothers of us all, today’s culture indeed encourages us to reject the “lass thans” and to socialize with “decent” people.
I do not know that escapism to a different culture would lead to a life of drugs. However, I can easily see how it would lead to severe despondency and suicide.
4
It's the internet, we spend too much time reading about the negative and commenting about our misery and little time doing something about it...if what we see is even true. Ignorance was bliss.
What a great column. It is nice to hear some concern for the struggles of poor white people. Clearly "white privilege" has not served them well. (Nor the rest of us.)
The rich like to promote racism as the cause of all our strife in life. It's an easy thing to blame. The truth is that income inequality is our biggest concern. The rich try to avoid any conversation about easy wealth though. They would prefer the easy pickings of racist dribble... not the hard scrabble lot of fighting between the classes.
Real estate owners in NYC (NYT board included) have recently seen a huge surge in property values. They are now part of the nouveau riche. Lets hope that they continue to use a good conscience to focus on the one issue that will help America to address its problems going into the future, income inequality.
The rich like to promote racism as the cause of all our strife in life. It's an easy thing to blame. The truth is that income inequality is our biggest concern. The rich try to avoid any conversation about easy wealth though. They would prefer the easy pickings of racist dribble... not the hard scrabble lot of fighting between the classes.
Real estate owners in NYC (NYT board included) have recently seen a huge surge in property values. They are now part of the nouveau riche. Lets hope that they continue to use a good conscience to focus on the one issue that will help America to address its problems going into the future, income inequality.
4
It is telling that no commenters recall Ross Perot, who warned us of the"giant sucking sound" of lost jobs, hopes, dreams, community that runaway international trade (cheap toasters and sandals for manufacturing jobs) would create. Instead, people trot out their favorite whipping post to beat and blame their opponents. Pace Pogo, "We have met the enemy and he is us."
7
So, whites should learn from blacks.
You see, blacks are used to suffering, that's why they are doing so well in these tough times.
If only those whites whiners stopped moping about working like dogs in lousy jobs that leave them in poverty and feeling like losers;
and if they stopped feeling guilty for the children they can't bring to a doctor when they are sick because they don't have the money;
and if they just accepted the fact that their life is never going to get better;
that they will die younger than their richer white fellows;
if they just dropped all those delusional and frankly unreasonable expectations of living a decent life, they would feel immediately better.
True, they would still die at the same rate, but with much less anguish.
Isn't that a much better way of living and dying?
You see, blacks are used to suffering, that's why they are doing so well in these tough times.
If only those whites whiners stopped moping about working like dogs in lousy jobs that leave them in poverty and feeling like losers;
and if they stopped feeling guilty for the children they can't bring to a doctor when they are sick because they don't have the money;
and if they just accepted the fact that their life is never going to get better;
that they will die younger than their richer white fellows;
if they just dropped all those delusional and frankly unreasonable expectations of living a decent life, they would feel immediately better.
True, they would still die at the same rate, but with much less anguish.
Isn't that a much better way of living and dying?
7
Look at the community of Millinocket, Maine. It once was a thriving mill town. People (white) graduated from high school and went to work for wages that could support the buying of a home and starting a family. Now what do they have? Nothing. The mills are closed. People in their fifties are supposed to do what? Try to sell a house that now has little value and move to Southern Maine or Massachusetts? Go back to school when your own kids are graduating from high school and can't afford to go to college? Where are those kids going to work? Somewhere else.
So what are these people to do? NOT go on Social Security Disability (if they are approved - a long and arduous process here in Maine)? How are they to feed their family after the unemployment checks have stopped?
Of course it's economic. No jobs, no self-respect, too much time to drink and abuse drugs to block out the constant worry. No hope. What are they to do?
So what are these people to do? NOT go on Social Security Disability (if they are approved - a long and arduous process here in Maine)? How are they to feed their family after the unemployment checks have stopped?
Of course it's economic. No jobs, no self-respect, too much time to drink and abuse drugs to block out the constant worry. No hope. What are they to do?
11
Whites generally, have always felt a sense of entitlement based upon their whiteness. Blacks and Hispanics, educated or not, have no such expectation, and in fact expect to be treated less favorably by whites in most, if not all aspects of life. They have adapted. Whites, less educated, nevertheless have supported policies that are against their interests, I.e. Obamacare, and to the point of this article, free trade agreements that send jobs overseas, because they are Republican policies, and Republican equals white; equals us (and against them). Unfortunately reality sets in at some point. There is no job. The only health insurance affordable is Obamacare, and that's a no no. Life has let them down, and no one has prepared them for this reality.
The solution: a rising tide lifts all boats. The obstacle: racism.
The solution: a rising tide lifts all boats. The obstacle: racism.
Well, if this segment of the population continues to vote against their best interests they will not move this needle one bit.
8
A recent study of a native American tribe, by the National Bureau of Economic Research offers a stunning insight to the real problem. The study showed that a moderate increase in income for the members of the tribe resulted in improved outcomes for children. They found, astonishingly, that the income helped make the children more conscientious. The effects to the families as a whole were equally striking. Conservatives believe that personal effort makes success. I believe that a safe economically secure childhood promotes success.
9
Mr. Douthat:
It's only become a "problem" because it involves white people.
It's only become a "problem" because it involves white people.
7
This is about rising (whites) and falling (non-whites) mortality rates, and in no way shows any comparison of actual rates among whites, blacks and latinos. For example, assume that in 1990 the mortality rate among non affluent blacks was much higher than non affluent whites (due to issues of health, drugs, and crime). Since then, this gap has narrowed. It is assumed that the gap is still significant, but it is not addressed here. Even worse, one could read into this article that minorities lives have improved, at the expense of the white working class, and that would be a dangerous misconception. What it does show is that whites are having a very hard time living on minimum wage or no wage, which is no surprise.
3
On one page of the NY Times I read that 400,000 people with chronic pain have died in misery and despair as they age.
On another page I read that researchers are proud that tightening up Social Security rules has allowed fewer people than expected onto disability benefits (thus saving the wealthy the unbearable hassle of re-arranging their tax shelters).
Later on I read that a large number of people seem to be missing entirely from the workforce - and also from the disability rolls.
We have a public policy disaster that is killing people who have been forced out of the workforce by age and infirmity.
On another page I read that researchers are proud that tightening up Social Security rules has allowed fewer people than expected onto disability benefits (thus saving the wealthy the unbearable hassle of re-arranging their tax shelters).
Later on I read that a large number of people seem to be missing entirely from the workforce - and also from the disability rolls.
We have a public policy disaster that is killing people who have been forced out of the workforce by age and infirmity.
6
It is tragic to see middle-aged white people lined up at the supermarket to exchange their "disability" payments for cigarettes (both are handled by the same cashier at many rural locations).
Sadly, these are also the people you see holding the "Obama is a muslin [sic]" signs.
Sadly, these are also the people you see holding the "Obama is a muslin [sic]" signs.
3
The loss of Whie Privilege is the root cause.
2
Rural America is overwhelmingly white, thus white people are disproportionately affected by the loss of jobs and lack of services, particularly health care services, in rural areas. I suspect there's been little or no decline in health and life expectancy in poor, middle-aged URBAN whites. Why the report's authors didn't control for the rural/urban demographic mystifies me.
2
This is the second NYT article I've read this week about the suicide problem among poor white men and neither has mentioned the elephant in the room - access to guns. A man who is in the depths of despair with a gun in his nightstand drawer is a hell of a lot likelier to succeed at suicide than one with a bottle of pills. With a gun, once the decision is made, there can be no turning back.
4
Unlike every other demographic is America, when a white male fails, he is
a failure. Everyone else in the same boat is a victim.
a failure. Everyone else in the same boat is a victim.
4
There's a reason most whites, especially the poor working class, vote Republican; it's abundantly clear that the liberal political elites and the control they wield over popular opinion, absolutely hate them. Forget for a moment that these people are the majority of the country who's forefathers built it from the ground up; they're constantly referred to as racists, bigots, homophobes, rednecks, idiots etc.
Their lack of education and employment opportunities are what's really doing the damage to be sure (and booze and drugs), but constantly hearing about massive government efforts to protect this victim class and that victim class and this other victim class over here...from them, takes a toll.
When's the last time there was an initiative focuses on helping "white people"? The circus of advocacy groups would descend like locusts to destroy it. President Obama can't even propose an initiative to help boys (another politically hated class) without immediate protests from the "only girls get help" groups.
These people feel alone and despised, with their country, jobs and sense of community pride being taken and given to others in exchange for votes. Is it any wonder their despondent? They can't even watch Bo and Luke anymore.
I'm frankly surprised this study got any attention at all, maybe BlackLivesMatters can release another video about "drinking white tears". That pretty much sums up our nations sympathy for these people's plight.
Their lack of education and employment opportunities are what's really doing the damage to be sure (and booze and drugs), but constantly hearing about massive government efforts to protect this victim class and that victim class and this other victim class over here...from them, takes a toll.
When's the last time there was an initiative focuses on helping "white people"? The circus of advocacy groups would descend like locusts to destroy it. President Obama can't even propose an initiative to help boys (another politically hated class) without immediate protests from the "only girls get help" groups.
These people feel alone and despised, with their country, jobs and sense of community pride being taken and given to others in exchange for votes. Is it any wonder their despondent? They can't even watch Bo and Luke anymore.
I'm frankly surprised this study got any attention at all, maybe BlackLivesMatters can release another video about "drinking white tears". That pretty much sums up our nations sympathy for these people's plight.
5
Here is a predictable irony. As soon as this story has enough traction to be taken up by right-wing radio and by the Republican presidential candidates it will be cited as "evidence" that progressive social policy is a failure. And then more lower-middle class whites will vote for Republican candidates, and then their mortality rate will continue to rise. Then there's this other irony: by signing their own death-warrants lower-middle class whites will hasten the demographic shift that could lead to greater support for Democrats and thus for more progressive social policy.
4
There's another addiction that feeds the more traditional ones discussed. I suspect people in this demographic are big consumers of right wing media which explain that they are not the problem, and that anger and angst are justified. Right wing media are a gateway drug, a story we won't hear about on Fox News.
7
I believe the uptick in middle aged white mortality was found to be greatest in the South and Midwest rural and exurban areas. These areas also tend to be the most socially and politically conservative, as well as the most church going by far. Would it surprise anyone that the white middle aged working class rural male population in Georgia has a much, much higher suicide rate than their counterparts in say, Vermont?
4
Not to put to fine a point on it, but the physical decline of this white, male, middle aged, under-educated, often under or unemployed demographic is beginning to resemble that dispossessed population--the American Indian--who these same whites often treat with moral and racial contempt. The Native American was the first more or less homogenous demographic that had to be discarded because it was not useful to the personal and national aggrandizement of wealth. Now we are seeing our mode of economic aggrandizement casting aside what we all thought was its own people. (Habits are hard to break.) The emptying of economic value from heretofore useful human vessels is not over and neither is the concomitant 'moral decline' of these 'has-beens'. It will be edifying to monitor the continuing decline of the Indian as they fail to properly rise to the occasion and 'compete', because it isn't their race that weakens them, its their uselessness to the American enterprise, as these new demographic revelations about middle-aged white men seem to teach us. Where will the collateral damage of the American enterprise end for those deemed useless? On Pine Ridge reservation the epidemic of suicide now rears its ugly head among the children, the future bearers of their people's hopelessness. Take heed all you formerly useful white guys! You have seen the reviled Indian and he is you.
85
I wonder, men generally commit suicide by guns. In 2013 there were 21,175 suicides by guns what if we did lock them up in homes, make them not so available & we shared warning signs. What about our troops what if they got the care psychologically they're entitled to, the food, the housing? Maybe our politicians could turn down the rhetoric of hate, there's an idea. And what about domestic violence, this isn't new stuff. There are many murder/suicides across this country all you have to do is google. I agree with much of the article too and with the education, education, education statement but there's more and that is we are citizens afloat. We have the left doing not much and the right working against the working class, they're beholden to ALEC, KOCH's and others. You become desperate, hopeless, helpless.
4
And republicans have tried to repeal ObamaCare dozens of time! Accees to health care that is, help before the emergency ward. Do you understand prevention mr. Douthat?
6
The white middle class in America remains the most naive group of people in the world, and now they are beginning to pay for it, even though they won't believe it's happening to them. The European white, and the dark people of America, Europe and the third world have always believed Marxist ideology that the Bourgeoisie exist for one reason-to exploit the Proletariat. In America, white folks have bought into the baloney that there is no Proletariat. That there is a middle class, and they belong to it. That was true when unions were powerful enough to force the Bourgeoisie to share, but thanks to Reagan, patriotism, the religious right, the Tea Party, homophobia, anti-abortion fanatics etc., the middle class believed unions were evil. Socialistic, Communistic, criminal even! So the unions are gone, progressive politics is of the devil, and the middle class is given way to the Proletariat, which historically has poor health due to stress, worry, lack of education affordability and low wages, benefits and miserable working conditions. Ain't it great to be an American? Hey, but we have the best military and police in the world. Take comfort in our ability to impose our will on most countries of the world. Just don't get too uppity. Those police officers can make an example of you too now that you are beginning to slide into the "sub" class with the "others".
12
Face it, Mr. Douthat, whites have become blacks: social isolation, lack of family and community support, poverty, unemployment, obstacles to professional retraining and geographical mobility, poor health due to poor nutrition, depression, and inevitably the slip toward alcohol and drugs.
OK, now that even you know about it, what are you going to do? Egg on the rest of the white tribe against the moochers, the users, the immoral, the lazy among them? Are you going to make them the only culprit of their misery? Are you going to make them the new blacks in your political-electoral agenda?
OK, now that even you know about it, what are you going to do? Egg on the rest of the white tribe against the moochers, the users, the immoral, the lazy among them? Are you going to make them the only culprit of their misery? Are you going to make them the new blacks in your political-electoral agenda?
4
(I see that for once Mr. Dothan is sane and agrees with Mr. Krugman.) What I get out of all this is that listening to Limbaugh and watching the likes of O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck, and (worst of all) taking any of them seriously is not only bad for your brain cells but bad for your health. To cite just one of many instances -- I believe Mr. Obama has been a truly great president -classy, intelligent, and as effective as possible, given the corruption, hostility, racism, and mediocrity of the white Caucasian culture we see in the Congress. His treaty with Iran is a triumph for civilized diplomacy, not the failure that Limbaugh would have you see. The only regret I have is that George W. Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Wolfowitz are still alive and thriving, whereas they should all have been tried and convicted a long time ago as the war criminals that they are. (And, by the way, who dispatched BinLaden with surgical precision and effectiveness? Not, you may be sure, anyone in the team I just listed! And the follow-up question is, Who is best suited to be Commander-in-Chief of our military?) I recall, years ago, I worked for Dean, in the days he was inveighing against the Imbecilic Iraq invasion. I canvassed, in the morning hours, at a New Hampshire trailer park, and there I encountered numerous Caucasian voters several sheets to the wind at 10AM. Some of them may well have liver issues by now and would, I am sure, be Trump, Palin, or Carson supporters.
7
gemli ° Boston has covered the important foundation in this issue, and I'll add a contributing factor.
There are over 300,000,000 guns in the U.S. 41% of Whites report owning a gun, 19% of Blacks, and 20% of Hispanics.
For 2012, the most recent year for which reliable data is available, 64% of gun fatalities were suicides. According to the CDC there were over 33,000 gun deaths, 21,120 of those suicides.
Women attempt suicide at a higher rate than men but are far less successful given that they typically choose means less likely to guarantee success. Men overwhelmingly choose guns.
Mix socially oppressive Conservative policies with wage, wealth, income and opportunity inequality, add alcohol, drugs, depression, and, or, isolation, add a firearm, and a tragic consequence is death by suicide.
Ironically, 49% of Republicans as opposed to 22% of Democrats and 37% of Independents report gun ownership. Without digging deeper into the statistics, to some extent because an NRA controlled government isn't allowed to, and one wonders if perhaps the overwhelming number of gun and general suicides in the U.S. are Conservative.
.
There are over 300,000,000 guns in the U.S. 41% of Whites report owning a gun, 19% of Blacks, and 20% of Hispanics.
For 2012, the most recent year for which reliable data is available, 64% of gun fatalities were suicides. According to the CDC there were over 33,000 gun deaths, 21,120 of those suicides.
Women attempt suicide at a higher rate than men but are far less successful given that they typically choose means less likely to guarantee success. Men overwhelmingly choose guns.
Mix socially oppressive Conservative policies with wage, wealth, income and opportunity inequality, add alcohol, drugs, depression, and, or, isolation, add a firearm, and a tragic consequence is death by suicide.
Ironically, 49% of Republicans as opposed to 22% of Democrats and 37% of Independents report gun ownership. Without digging deeper into the statistics, to some extent because an NRA controlled government isn't allowed to, and one wonders if perhaps the overwhelming number of gun and general suicides in the U.S. are Conservative.
.
6
New Yorker writer George Packer, writing recently about they whys of economic inequality, pointed out that in the U.S., unlike any other western nation, there is a heartlessness to our social fabric. Anyone who isn't at the top of whatever ladder is a "loser," and deserves not sympathy or even empathy, but thinly disguised enmity.
White males who lack college degrees and a certain savoir faire are among the most despised segments of our society. Truck drivers, repairmen, shop foreman, mid-level bureaucrats, et al do not arise from well organized and respected trades, but from what's perceived as laziness, stupidity and an insufficient appreciation of the finer things of life such as good wine, golf or tennis, and vacations in Belize or Bali. Football is their sport, how pathetic, we say.
They are shunned, as were Irish and Italian immigrants of another era; but these are dyed-in-the-wool Americans who volunteer, who join and serve the in the military, and who are (sometimes excessively) uber-patriots. They are everywhere in our midst, but nowhere in their own minds and hearts, with only bitterness and jealousy as motivations.
White males who lack college degrees and a certain savoir faire are among the most despised segments of our society. Truck drivers, repairmen, shop foreman, mid-level bureaucrats, et al do not arise from well organized and respected trades, but from what's perceived as laziness, stupidity and an insufficient appreciation of the finer things of life such as good wine, golf or tennis, and vacations in Belize or Bali. Football is their sport, how pathetic, we say.
They are shunned, as were Irish and Italian immigrants of another era; but these are dyed-in-the-wool Americans who volunteer, who join and serve the in the military, and who are (sometimes excessively) uber-patriots. They are everywhere in our midst, but nowhere in their own minds and hearts, with only bitterness and jealousy as motivations.
11
White working class people were also the largest beneficiaries of the labor movement. They were also the hardest hit by Reaganism's destruction of unions and the full speed ahead rush to globalization. Those "right to work" States that aggressively courted jobs away from the unionized States were themselves hit by the rush to move factories offshore to the the extremely low wage nations like Bangladesh and China. Of course they're despondent and stressed, who wouldn't be. The future that they were told was theirs and what they saw their parents had was taken away by what amounts to multinational corporations. Entities that really have no functional allegiances to one nation or another - just their shareholders. Given that, the current kneejerk response to unions is laughable - even Volkswagen was surprised since their entire manufacturing model is based on worker participation based on union representation. Desperation makes people cling to Huckabee's notions of God, Guns and Grits - because they feel powerless elsewhere. They've been sold a bill of goods that is largely comprised of mis-information and is designed to blame some "other". The factory worker who made $25.00 an hour in 1980 should, based on inflation, be making about $70.00 an hour in 2016. They don't, not even close. We wonder why people are despondent and have the corresponding increases in mortality? Just take hope away, kill dreams, kill aspirations, then make them desperate for any scrap they can get.
12
By creating and maintaining these conditions, our owners can squeeze consent from the distressed and desperate for another war. If they fail to do so, they eventually have a revolt that threatens their privilege and power. It is unfathomable that the top would consider the other option which would be a just society.
As Napoleon said: " If it was not for religion, the rich would be murdered."
As Napoleon said: " If it was not for religion, the rich would be murdered."
11
In another article I read on this data, they mentioned that many that committed suicide were in physical pain, unable to climb stairs, etc. I was in that place for two years. My sedentary lifestyle had weakened my middle aged muscles to the point that my back was no longer properly supported. Luckily, I went to good doctors who send me to physical therapy, and eventually a wonderful physical therapist send me to yoga. I was thinking of suicide when my life was so painful, but now I'm fine.
In Europe, people walk more and have healthier diets. They live in cities that are walkable, not isolated in suburbs and semi-rural areas. In the past, white working class people walked more.
While the things Douthat mentioned definitely contribute, I would not discount the impact of pain.
In Europe, people walk more and have healthier diets. They live in cities that are walkable, not isolated in suburbs and semi-rural areas. In the past, white working class people walked more.
While the things Douthat mentioned definitely contribute, I would not discount the impact of pain.
9
Savaging unions, outsourcing overseas, setting up trade deals that threaten American workers, among other forces since the eighties, have combined to leave white blue collar workers feeling abandoned and without hope, left to drink themselves to death. Latino and black workers don't react the same way across the board, and you speculate why that might be? Maybe they don't feel abandoned because they were never embraced in the first place.
9
The toxic nature of right wing talk radio and Fox news should not be overlooked. Constant, unrelenting messages of anger, hatred and victimhood are neither healthy nor sustainable.
13
What? Being White in modern America is Not a vaccine against joblessness, drug and alcohol addiction and decreases health and increases suicide? Shocking! If ever there was an example of the equality of people, Mr. Douthat has backhandedly illustrated it here. In the last 60 minutes piece of heroin addiction among Whites, one young woman went thru addiction and recovery 17 times and almost died if not for the latest new anti-overdose drug. Why did she use heroin? She was bored. What are the chances she will relapse for the 18th time? Anybody?
3
"Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
The smugness and insensitivity of this sentence is stunning. What does "adapt culturally" mean to Douthat? One might see the turn to despair, drugs and alcohol as a cultural adaptation, however undesirable. We have historically-proven ways of addressing this "relative stagnation." Our government will have none of them. We should be countering the neglect of the elite, not adapting to it. But I guess Douthat accepts this situation as part of God's natural order.
The smugness and insensitivity of this sentence is stunning. What does "adapt culturally" mean to Douthat? One might see the turn to despair, drugs and alcohol as a cultural adaptation, however undesirable. We have historically-proven ways of addressing this "relative stagnation." Our government will have none of them. We should be countering the neglect of the elite, not adapting to it. But I guess Douthat accepts this situation as part of God's natural order.
8
"To many conservatives, the mortality rate shock is the latest indictment of modern liberalism’s mix of moral permissiveness and welfare-state paternalism"
Ross, to the conservatives, since nothing is ever their fault, everything is because of liberals. You demonstrates this in every column.
The problem is the one the Tea Party was going to solve in 2010: jobs, jobs, jobs. They did nothing about this once in office, it is worth noting.
People - older white ones! you know, the GOP base - are living in despair as their old jobs dry up and their houses are foreclosed. If I were you, I would be worried. These are the rural whites who vote Republican. Your party just can't afford to lose any more of them. Time to start thinking about how to keep them from killing themselves. There is a national election on the horizon. You have already tried entertaining them to death with your presidential sideshow. Surely, there is something to be done!
For starters, they are not going appreciate being denigrated further by telling these good Christian souls they are moochers, lazy, shiftless, addicted bums. Loosing your job in this economy is no shame. Accepting it as inevitable may be. Why don't you try stimulating the economy and helping them get back on their feet instead? Otherwise, they may hear Bernie and get their hope back again. They could, heaven forbid, vote Democratic.
Ross, to the conservatives, since nothing is ever their fault, everything is because of liberals. You demonstrates this in every column.
The problem is the one the Tea Party was going to solve in 2010: jobs, jobs, jobs. They did nothing about this once in office, it is worth noting.
People - older white ones! you know, the GOP base - are living in despair as their old jobs dry up and their houses are foreclosed. If I were you, I would be worried. These are the rural whites who vote Republican. Your party just can't afford to lose any more of them. Time to start thinking about how to keep them from killing themselves. There is a national election on the horizon. You have already tried entertaining them to death with your presidential sideshow. Surely, there is something to be done!
For starters, they are not going appreciate being denigrated further by telling these good Christian souls they are moochers, lazy, shiftless, addicted bums. Loosing your job in this economy is no shame. Accepting it as inevitable may be. Why don't you try stimulating the economy and helping them get back on their feet instead? Otherwise, they may hear Bernie and get their hope back again. They could, heaven forbid, vote Democratic.
8
I put forward another hypothesis - majority members are reeling from the influences you cite - but they are exacerbated by the right's insistence on adding to the characterization of "others" as threatening - criminal immigrants, gays threatening "traditional" marriage, our "Muslim" president. By pitting Americans against each other instead of correctly pointing out that we are in this mess together, conservatives have effectively scared their base and undermined confidence in government - which are their true goals - adding to rather than solving our contemporary problems.
9
Defining white America as one amoebae makes it hard to isolate the subgroups that are being negatively impacted by social change. Self-destructive behavior associated with white privilege would have affected white Americans regardless of class... it didn't. The groups who were not served by the promise of a better education suffered. The groups that was already suffering is suffering more. We need to quit viewing this group as white and treat it as an isolated minority in its own class.
Trickle Down? Or "Trick and drown?"
All of the wonderful things that Ronald Reagan "promised" them have failed to materialize. The tide rose but those without boats drowned.
All of the wonderful things that Ronald Reagan "promised" them have failed to materialize. The tide rose but those without boats drowned.
10
Who are working class whites supposed to vote for?
The Dems seem completely obsessed about a handful of ludicrous issues (allowing transexuals to get naked in front of teenaged girls, telling us all the supposed wonders of Muslims, letting us know we need to finance the bizarre belief that every single Latino should be allowed to settle here even if they literally lack the means to function in our society without massive access to our taxes) that are basically utterly irrelevant.
The Dems seem completely obsessed about a handful of ludicrous issues (allowing transexuals to get naked in front of teenaged girls, telling us all the supposed wonders of Muslims, letting us know we need to finance the bizarre belief that every single Latino should be allowed to settle here even if they literally lack the means to function in our society without massive access to our taxes) that are basically utterly irrelevant.
3
And there you have time: the view from Douthat's 'victim.'
2
A key finding of that study which was not emphasized in this article is that most of these trends are concentrated in rural, predominantly red states. Clearly the values held by whites living in these areas is not serving them well.
9
Welcome to reality, RD, and please get closer to it. Expectations disappointed? Who has been spreading that message? Who challenges the Whites who keep on demanding: We want our country back? Who elected Freedom Party members to Congress? Who formed the Freedom Caucus?
The Right-wing distraction and disinformation machine unleashed a torrent of propaganda, screaming 24/7 that Obama has taken their country away, is coming for their guns, is giving their jobs to "others," is destroying American greatness?
You reap what you sow. Sow the wind...
The Right-wing distraction and disinformation machine unleashed a torrent of propaganda, screaming 24/7 that Obama has taken their country away, is coming for their guns, is giving their jobs to "others," is destroying American greatness?
You reap what you sow. Sow the wind...
8
Douthat makes some interesting comments, but ignores the impact of the opiate pain killers responsible for the largest share of these excess deaths, and the healthcare system from which they came.
Just as the crack epidemic focused on inner city blacks, painkiller abuse focuses on whites who are active consumers of a healthcare system that has recklessly overprescribed these drugs.
Further, the increasing numbers of whites who reported debilitating pain are likely the result of the healthcare industry's aggressive marketing tactics. If you hear about conditions like "fibromyalgia" and "restless leg syndrome" every time you turn on the TV, it's no surprise a certain percentage of the population will believe they have these conditions. Chances are, the less educated and more unhappy the person, the more likely they are to believe.
Just as the crack epidemic focused on inner city blacks, painkiller abuse focuses on whites who are active consumers of a healthcare system that has recklessly overprescribed these drugs.
Further, the increasing numbers of whites who reported debilitating pain are likely the result of the healthcare industry's aggressive marketing tactics. If you hear about conditions like "fibromyalgia" and "restless leg syndrome" every time you turn on the TV, it's no surprise a certain percentage of the population will believe they have these conditions. Chances are, the less educated and more unhappy the person, the more likely they are to believe.
3
Our largest "American" corporations, which used to be our largest employers, no longer take any pride in being America (though they'd be foolish to admit this publicly). Managements of these entities can hide behind the dual excuses of "mega competition" and "shareholder value" to justify any behavior; union busting, off-shoring, inversions, etc. All while enjoying copyright and patent protection afforded them by our system of jurisprudence and ironclad contract laws. Yet, when given any publis forum, all CEOs can manage to do is complain about regulation and, boo-hoo, lack of clarity!
Everything's backwards and upside down...
Everything's backwards and upside down...
5
I have lived and worked in multicultural communities for a long time. Black and hispanic people have markedly lower expectations in all areas. They don't expect marriage, they don't expect their children to be successes, they don't expect wealth, they don't expect a long life span. This is what I have seen in two and a half decades in New York City and previous years elsewhere. In a world that is increasingly desperate, unequal and exploitative, of course black and hispanic people are better "adapted."
8
If we want to start somewhere to deal with this problem, we need a living wage.
Minorities in the United States have always gotten the short end of the stick, so as you say, they have different expectations and are perhaps not as affected by the despair that has hit working class whites. I don't know.
But imagine what it's like to work day after day at Walmart and still need to go through the added burden of applying for and obeying the strictures of food stamps and Medicaid, because one cannot support a family on what one is paid to work full-time. Add to that the disapproval of clueless well-to-do Americans who talk as though they think that anyone who ever needs support of any kind is a moocher. (Think Mitt Romney and his 47%.)
There's really no need to address other "moral" issues. It's immoral to not pay employees a wage they can live on, and it's immoral to let taxpayers subsidize businesses while pretending that no one helped the business owners get where they are. Employers may not like the idea of having to pay workers a living wage, but as a society, we should tell them "tough luck." They can't have their cake and eat it, too. It's time for that nonsense to end.
A living wage might not completely solve this problem, but it will go a lot farther than lectures on morality and resilience.
Minorities in the United States have always gotten the short end of the stick, so as you say, they have different expectations and are perhaps not as affected by the despair that has hit working class whites. I don't know.
But imagine what it's like to work day after day at Walmart and still need to go through the added burden of applying for and obeying the strictures of food stamps and Medicaid, because one cannot support a family on what one is paid to work full-time. Add to that the disapproval of clueless well-to-do Americans who talk as though they think that anyone who ever needs support of any kind is a moocher. (Think Mitt Romney and his 47%.)
There's really no need to address other "moral" issues. It's immoral to not pay employees a wage they can live on, and it's immoral to let taxpayers subsidize businesses while pretending that no one helped the business owners get where they are. Employers may not like the idea of having to pay workers a living wage, but as a society, we should tell them "tough luck." They can't have their cake and eat it, too. It's time for that nonsense to end.
A living wage might not completely solve this problem, but it will go a lot farther than lectures on morality and resilience.
10
"Jobs programs" appears to be one solution, at least at the local level.
Hopefully, middle-aged whites, with an ability to have an "open mind", could enroll at a good community college, for instance. Moreover, anyone would hope that this current trend has a solution that makes sense.
Hopefully, middle-aged whites, with an ability to have an "open mind", could enroll at a good community college, for instance. Moreover, anyone would hope that this current trend has a solution that makes sense.
1
Also, the number of bad Robert DeNiro movies has increased dramatically, so if we can only get him to stop making movies, the mortality rate should decrease.
3
I saw my father fall victim to the scams and the lies about him being a "loser" because he couldn't compete in an impossible game. Here was a very decent man, devoted to his family and liked by everyone he met, but was perfect prey for those peddling get rich quick schemes and "wealth management" programs claiming to "make him richer". Would that he actually had wealth to manage! If only he had been rich to enrich him further! What happened, like so many people out there, is that he couldn't make the game work and became reckless financially. My mother begged him to stop with the wealth seminars and subscriptions to money-making publications. In the end, it wore him out. And because of all of this desperation to be a "winner", his retirement resources were squandered and depleted and he now lives in a sub-par facility where he suffers from Alzheimer's. And the burden of care is largely on my mother and the rest of the family.
He always believed the words of politicians that the government was out to get him, increase his "tax burden" and prevent him from being a millionaire like so many of the fear-mongering predators we see in various political office and on the stump. "These liberals want to take my money," he would rant. The sad truth is that he never had money and being a hard working, well-liked family guy just wasn't enough. The grim reality is that if he were not suffering from dementia he would probably be swallowing the same nonsense today.
He always believed the words of politicians that the government was out to get him, increase his "tax burden" and prevent him from being a millionaire like so many of the fear-mongering predators we see in various political office and on the stump. "These liberals want to take my money," he would rant. The sad truth is that he never had money and being a hard working, well-liked family guy just wasn't enough. The grim reality is that if he were not suffering from dementia he would probably be swallowing the same nonsense today.
192
The American labor force was once largely high school educated white American men. Now, thanks to the new plutocrats, and their labor as a commodity philosophy, their ranks have tons of white, middle aged, high school educated, men who have no job. Many of them will never have another job that will support their family. Gosh, whatever could be the cause of their depression. These men have another name, "the republican base". In the race to make the rich even richer the party of no is cannibalizing itself. Bring on the robots and we'll soon all be in that same fix. I wonder, will those robots make great customers.
As and addendum, the right always thinks that a little religion would fix all this, after all it is working so well in the middle east.
As and addendum, the right always thinks that a little religion would fix all this, after all it is working so well in the middle east.
10
Maybe, just maybe "elite neglect" has to be (likely) re-regulated ... ?
Marx said the same thing - Religion is the opiate of the masses.
6
Now that Mr. Douthat has carefully examined the tail of the elephant, he might be advised the rest of the animal holds more answers. White men dying at a higher rate than previously is an effect, and by itself holds no answers of what to do. What Mr. Douthat doesn't tune into larger causes. Poverty in general that affects blacks, whites, and whoever similarly. Non participation in the political life of this country to the point that the wealthy control our elected officials. Recognition of certain necessities of decent living: affordable comprehensive health insurance for all, affordable child care, decent pensions, family/sick leave. Mr. Douthat has to broaden his education.
8
"Work, faith, and family" do not exist in a bubble. They are very much related to the economic times.
I know many working class or educated middle class whites who are not having families because they feel with low wages and job instability, it would be economically and morally irresponsible to have children. I know people in their twenties who are or wish to be engaged, with both living at home, wondering if they get their own place if their parents will be able to manage the bills without them. And, believe it or not, I know many people who feel that time spent on Church is now a luxury, as is giving money to the church. Let me add that my own Church, Catholicism, has always been more catered to the families who put the envelope in the basket every month and have kids who need sacraments.
I, like many middle class people, did everything right, got educated, started a career, and worked hard. And I am now facing the fact that children and home ownership may be out of the picture for me, because my generation knows the effects from this recession will be felt even when we're old.
Do I feel cheated? - yes, especially when I see so many poor people around me have children they can't afford, because they are less "moral" and "responsible" than I.
I know many working class or educated middle class whites who are not having families because they feel with low wages and job instability, it would be economically and morally irresponsible to have children. I know people in their twenties who are or wish to be engaged, with both living at home, wondering if they get their own place if their parents will be able to manage the bills without them. And, believe it or not, I know many people who feel that time spent on Church is now a luxury, as is giving money to the church. Let me add that my own Church, Catholicism, has always been more catered to the families who put the envelope in the basket every month and have kids who need sacraments.
I, like many middle class people, did everything right, got educated, started a career, and worked hard. And I am now facing the fact that children and home ownership may be out of the picture for me, because my generation knows the effects from this recession will be felt even when we're old.
Do I feel cheated? - yes, especially when I see so many poor people around me have children they can't afford, because they are less "moral" and "responsible" than I.
56
The US sure sets itself up for ignoramuses to triumph.
With the relentless focus on youth and achievement, it is no wonder that many white people, historically expecting to succeed, are disappointed when they don't get ahead, lose there jobs or fail to get good ones, have failing marriages, and then turn to drugs and alcohol. White people are programmed from birth to be better than others, that is just the way it is and has been for years.
2
I have been a careful listener and mentally catalogued a lot of information about, admittedly, a relatively low number of people as opposed to professional research. My information tells me that these problems have simply changed in form over the years. From what I can tell there was a lot of family disruption in the history I have gotten going back to the 1880's, alcohol use has been a constant but other drugs came along, were legal, and usually introduced as medicines. Addiction seems the same. Poverty has generally decreased with periods of deep economic downturns until the 1940's. Work was more available in some places and times that others. Churches have always had families affected. At the height of the opium and cocaine use periods no particular group failed to be affected. When the leaders of a city became concerned ordinances passed but access then came from backroom doctors and shady pharmacies and the substances remained in many ordinary remedies for all that ailed the populace. Was it the rapid industrial and economic growth of the 20th century that brought about stable church families, better job opportunities, and strengthened the family? Was this aided my rapid advancement in medical treatment? I think we may have too rosy a view of the "good old days" and too many wanting them to come back.
3
White working classs people who can't get jobs and support their families lose respect for themselves, and turn to unhealthy habits and despair. What's so hard to understand about that, Ross?
9
Perhaps a steady diet of Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, and other conservative propaganda is the toxic mix here. It's pretty grim, if you think about it. There's no real hope, its nihilism rages, and it offers no alternative. That is, an alternative that works for the people in despair. It's been said that Kansas was/is voting against its economic interests. Perhaps if you believe all that stuff, elect people like George W. Bush, Sam Brownback, or Scott Walker and expect to be rewarded with a better life, that when it doesn't and it gets so bad then the only alternative to admitting you were wrong, since you'd never agree that a Black President was right, is death. As some others have pointed out here, since you also believe in your gun rights, the solution is at hand.
I would like to see further analysis of this by state and by political affiliation.
I would like to see further analysis of this by state and by political affiliation.
10
Ross, let me put it to you simply. The American dream died in that same period of time as jobs were outsourced or just disappeared and banks and Wall Street nearly caved in the economy. Lives were permanently ruined. Many people saw their retirement savings disappear or lost their jobs well short of retirement. Understanding what is happening doesn't require your navel-gazing forensic analysis. Out here in the country, we already know what happened.
Now we wait for a new generation to rise up, a generation who will not remember that we once had a middle class and the union movement that helped build that. And in not knowing, they'll be more accepting that theirs will be the first generation in many generations that'll have less to look forward to than their parents. Thank God I got mine and retired and soon will be dead so I don't have to be around to watch it all happen.
There was a time when we -- imperfect as we are -- were so much better than this.
Now we wait for a new generation to rise up, a generation who will not remember that we once had a middle class and the union movement that helped build that. And in not knowing, they'll be more accepting that theirs will be the first generation in many generations that'll have less to look forward to than their parents. Thank God I got mine and retired and soon will be dead so I don't have to be around to watch it all happen.
There was a time when we -- imperfect as we are -- were so much better than this.
9
Sustained, cultivated anger and aggrievement from too much Rush and too much Fox News eventually leads to total exhaustion and capitulation.
6
Businesses that have outsourced American jobs in their pursuit of profits at any human cost bear the brunt of the blame for the economic disaster that hit at the end of the Bush/Cheney administration.
The social contract should not be written solely for the benefit of the rich and the so-called job creators (and destroyers).
Therefore, the GOP, which has duped exactly the people who have suffered the most from this death wave, is also to blame.
A corporate and/or religious government, like that espoused by Huckabee and Cruz, would further devastate the people who are most likely to vote for it.
The social contract should not be written solely for the benefit of the rich and the so-called job creators (and destroyers).
Therefore, the GOP, which has duped exactly the people who have suffered the most from this death wave, is also to blame.
A corporate and/or religious government, like that espoused by Huckabee and Cruz, would further devastate the people who are most likely to vote for it.
5
The GOP denies that there is a social contract in the US.
"...and his wife, Anne Case." ??? Mr. Douthat I was so surprised to read your description of Dr. Anne Case which refers to her private life (wife of) and ignores her impressive professional accomplishments which I paste here from the Princeton University website: Anne Case is the Alexander Stewart 1886 Professor of Economics and Public Affairs and a Professor of Economics and Public Affairs at the Woodrow Wilson School of Public and International Affairs and the Economics Department at Princeton University.
She is also the Director of the Research Program in Development Studies and a Faculty Fellow in two research centers sponsored by the Woodrow Wilson School, the Center for Health and Wellbeing, and the Office of Population Research.
Dr. Case is also listed as the first author on paper though "her husband" submitted the paper. I imagine Dr. Case reading that sentence and thinking, "somethings just don't change."
She is also the Director of the Research Program in Development Studies and a Faculty Fellow in two research centers sponsored by the Woodrow Wilson School, the Center for Health and Wellbeing, and the Office of Population Research.
Dr. Case is also listed as the first author on paper though "her husband" submitted the paper. I imagine Dr. Case reading that sentence and thinking, "somethings just don't change."
11
Is it just me or is there a recurring strain in the comments that "whites deserve it?"
4
Absolutely yes -- and it is hateful and excusable.
Faced with a dire social situation, and lefty liberals can only whinge that "they deserve it, because they refused to vote for Obama!"
Faced with a dire social situation, and lefty liberals can only whinge that "they deserve it, because they refused to vote for Obama!"
3
I have not read the works mentioned in the article but wonder what the variance is by state (red vs. blue) and rural/urban? I suspect that it is greater in deeply red states and in rural areas. This has nothing to do with religion or values. This has to do with money and has impacted whites disproportionately because they have been relatively privleged in terms of collecting the spoils of the post WW II economic boom that inevitably faded. Values do not trump (pardon the pun) having one experience a standard of living decrease while the wealthy continue to do better and better and are put on the pedestal as the conspicuous consumers in our fair land.
2
This study shows how effective 35 years of Reaganomics have been! The people who are the focus of this study were the ones who were most deceived by Reagan and his cast of GOP merry men . They switched parties and voted for him in droves. They listened and believed in him and his brand of Voodoo economics and what they received for their loyalty and admiration was devastation and loss of hope. Of course a true disciple of Reagan would say they are losers and got exactly what they deserved but would some how blame it on the liberals, the blacks or the " alternate lifestyles " and breakdown of the family. People need hope and they need to understand and believe that the fruits of their labor will be rewarded and acknowledged.
7
"Learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling"
Wow! A summation that manages to insult everyone but especially "the struggling". Death rates are comparatively down to earlier death rates of Hispanics and African Americans. If you compare the per capita levels, you will still find that both minority groups still have shorter life spans over all they are just doing better than they used to.
This fact is going utterly ignored when it's finally whites who suffer from what these minorities have been suffering all along. When you ignore their misery and pain it's a lot easier to also condemn others to the same fate.
Your prescription is a disgrace committed on African Americans, Hispanics and Caucasians.
Wow! A summation that manages to insult everyone but especially "the struggling". Death rates are comparatively down to earlier death rates of Hispanics and African Americans. If you compare the per capita levels, you will still find that both minority groups still have shorter life spans over all they are just doing better than they used to.
This fact is going utterly ignored when it's finally whites who suffer from what these minorities have been suffering all along. When you ignore their misery and pain it's a lot easier to also condemn others to the same fate.
Your prescription is a disgrace committed on African Americans, Hispanics and Caucasians.
6
In our highly polarized and partisan environment, we could use more writing and thinking like this column. Notice the structure: Having posed the situation of rising death rates among middle-aged whites, Douthat sketches the standard conservative framing and suggests why it is inadequate to account for the situation, sketches the standard liberal framing and suggests why it’s inadequate to account for the situation, adds something (“dispossession”) to the interpretation of a complex situation, and concludes by offering a tentative combination of possibilities that might help us to address the situation (note the use of “maybe” in the close).
I can and do disagree with the conclusion. Like some other commenters, I doubt that getting “used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect”—that’s a mild description of what’s been happening—will be either just or productive. But I do value the column’s attempt to reject the habitual framing both from the right and from the left, and I suggest that the column deserves comments cast in its own even tone.
I can and do disagree with the conclusion. Like some other commenters, I doubt that getting “used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect”—that’s a mild description of what’s been happening—will be either just or productive. But I do value the column’s attempt to reject the habitual framing both from the right and from the left, and I suggest that the column deserves comments cast in its own even tone.
1
There isn't a single religion in this country that is not stuck in the past. 21st century people need 21st century religion, not to mention national health care and jobs at a livable wage.
5
Here is a lethal part of the rampaging elephant:
Meth is apparently considered as wreaking devastation on the lives of white rural America.
Because the marijuana smell is such a easy clue, and because the plants
are detectable from the sky.
Meth making smells too, though seemingly is less detectible.
I suppose that if marijuana were de-criminalized, then meth would not be the problem it is, though that's only my hypothesis/guess/assumption/cynicism.
Meth is apparently considered as wreaking devastation on the lives of white rural America.
Because the marijuana smell is such a easy clue, and because the plants
are detectable from the sky.
Meth making smells too, though seemingly is less detectible.
I suppose that if marijuana were de-criminalized, then meth would not be the problem it is, though that's only my hypothesis/guess/assumption/cynicism.
1
Many types of work are no longer considered to merit a living wage. Not living means dead.
8
Liberals do not by and large want increased "transfer payments" to the poor and the working class. Conservatives deliberately misrepresent this. It seems to me that liberals want to end terrible trade deals that increase job outsourcing to foreign countries. Liberals want better collective bargaining rights to ensure proper wages and working conditions for workers. Liberals want a Medicare for all system that would provide good quality care at much lower prices. Liberals want a return to free or low cost public higher education. This is not an exhaustive list by any means, but these things are not "transfer payments" to individuals. They're changes in policies and social investments that benefit the entire society.
11
People who understand the economics of automation want broader distribution of ownership of the means of production.
Maybe union wages and a higher minimum wage would help.
12
Lived in "Whiteland" all my life. My observation from sustained reading of obits is that folk are are dying younger and living less well. This state is a GOP stronghold and prides itself on it's reactionary conservatism. High smoking rates obesity, that has to be seen to be believed, and loads of anger and envy toward you NEW YORK DC liberal (fill in the expletive) elites. These left behind small town and rural people are also exceptionally ( and deludedly ) well armed.
I blame the Democratic party here in Indiana, and nationally for writing off the folk trapped in Red States, the QUOTE red states. Obama turned Indiana blue his first term and then chicken Demos ran away from him when bigots got to crowing socialist. Change and progress needs to come to poor marginalized whites as it must to all poor and economically neglected. If we continue on this path, this United States, is going to fracture along racial and social lines and honey it aint gonna be pretty.
I blame the Democratic party here in Indiana, and nationally for writing off the folk trapped in Red States, the QUOTE red states. Obama turned Indiana blue his first term and then chicken Demos ran away from him when bigots got to crowing socialist. Change and progress needs to come to poor marginalized whites as it must to all poor and economically neglected. If we continue on this path, this United States, is going to fracture along racial and social lines and honey it aint gonna be pretty.
9
I noticed Mr. Douthat's subtle dig at the Black Lives Matter movement in the last sentence. White working class Southerners, in particular, have always felt that no matter how little they had, at least they weren't the N-word. But that was when black people as a rule had less than them. Now, they see black millionaire entertainers and professional sports players on TV, and plenty of black middle-class professionals and skilled tradesmen and managers driving new SUVs and pickups and living in suburbia. And, yes, a half-black president and his all-black wife in the White House and another running for president. If the white working class ever gets the courage to organize and stand up to demand good-paying jobs, their alcohol, drug and suicide rates will go down. They might even find allies in working class blacks. As long as they keep voting against their own interests and going it alone, they will continue to sink into despair.
8
"This shift was caused, not by some dreadful new disease, but by drugs and alcohol and suicide"
Leave cannabis out of it. It's the absence of cannabis that is causing catastrophes. There's very strong statistical evidence that the availability of medicinal cannabis significantly reduces prescription opiate deaths. Cannabis is far, far safer than alcohol or tobacco, it is quite insane that the law says exactly the opposite.
Leave cannabis out of it. It's the absence of cannabis that is causing catastrophes. There's very strong statistical evidence that the availability of medicinal cannabis significantly reduces prescription opiate deaths. Cannabis is far, far safer than alcohol or tobacco, it is quite insane that the law says exactly the opposite.
Cannabis is an aid to harmless time-killing for discards of the underemployment economy.
2
Maybe people, after losing a union job, have realized that their skills are not competitive with the rest of society? Too many people have been told for years that they deserve $80,000+ per year to do a job that can easily be done by someone else with a little bit of training. Because of this, they missed noticing that the world was changing around them. They did not noticed that others were working to retrain themselves and make themselves more marketable. Now when their job and union is gone, they do not understand why the rest of the world does not value their skills.
2
I have seen the same sense of dislocation and loss among college-degree professionals who lost jobs when their companies went under, or overseas.
Job loss is devastating no matter WHO YOU ARE. Nobody finds it easy to go out and find a new job at 45 or 55 or later. Few companies wish to hire aging workers with their high health care costs.
Job loss is devastating no matter WHO YOU ARE. Nobody finds it easy to go out and find a new job at 45 or 55 or later. Few companies wish to hire aging workers with their high health care costs.
3
If you continue through ignorance or just plain stupidity to vote against your own interests, then it is inevitable that your own interests will suffer.
And that's what we're seeing here.
And that's what we're seeing here.
18
Let's simplify this...you're a middle=aged white guy in Kentucky struggling to make ends meet for your family and the new Republican governor promises to take away your health care. Does this cause you to feel:
A) Less despair?
B) More despair?
A) Less despair?
B) More despair?
18
Your solution to every problem under the sun is for everyone to be more conservative. Well, ISIS agrees with you, but I do not. The cause of nearly every problem is conservativism--especially religious conservativism--and the solution is to be less religious and less conservative.
16
The choices we make in life determine our destiny and the destiny of our offspring. The economics are actually very simple. Right now, 90% of the new wealth go to the top 5 %. If you vote for Rubio, Trump, and even Bush, they are promising tax cuts even more skewed to the top 5% while throwing a few crumbs to the working man.That mean you vote for one of these characters, you are voting for more of the national income to go to the top 5%. The 10% of the new wealth then has to be distributed to those not in that 5%. It's well known that instead of spending the new wealth here, creating more jobs, the top 5 % engage in a pattern of hoarding the wealth or spending it overseas to avoid taxes. Some good jobs are created but in Dubai, the Cayman Islands and Switzerland. The white working class by voting for these characters are choosing their destiny.
8
Recently there were 23 openings in the Oakland Fire Dept and you had to go to an auditorium to fill out applications and do some pre-screening. Over 10000 people showed up, some camped for 3 days, and it turned out on investigative news that fire officials showed up and pulled their own kids out of line to move them into some kind of privileged job status. Such is the desire of (mostly) whites to keep white privilege going; what is more nepotistic than the fire department. The other 9977 will have to fend for themselves in this increasing cruel world
6
That makes no sense. They were there for SCREENING. They could easily screen out the applicants who have relatives in the Fire Department. Pulling them out of line would just draw attention to what otherwise would be very subtle nepotism.
You are also assuming that in mostly black Oakland, CA, the fire department is majority white. There is no proof of that here, and no proof the nepotism did not extend to the black relatives of black firefighters.
You are also assuming that in mostly black Oakland, CA, the fire department is majority white. There is no proof of that here, and no proof the nepotism did not extend to the black relatives of black firefighters.
2
Which group of people in the US has seen the greatest change in their likelihood of success compared to that of their fathers'? It is the high-school educated male, who has less access to manufacturing jobs and must, increasingly, compete with minorities and females for what service jobs are left to them.
The reason why no similar mortality effect has been observed in other countries is because it was the US that was the manufacturing engine for the world throughout the 50's, 60's and even into the 70's.
It's time to recognize that there is a burning need to create vocational school training programs so that these men can attain skills that will allow them to support their families and regain their self-respect. And we need to recognize that even this kind of program will be doomed to failure unless we also recognize that the economic recovery after 2008 has been anemic at best, and that new measures are necessary to stimulate job growth.
The reason why no similar mortality effect has been observed in other countries is because it was the US that was the manufacturing engine for the world throughout the 50's, 60's and even into the 70's.
It's time to recognize that there is a burning need to create vocational school training programs so that these men can attain skills that will allow them to support their families and regain their self-respect. And we need to recognize that even this kind of program will be doomed to failure unless we also recognize that the economic recovery after 2008 has been anemic at best, and that new measures are necessary to stimulate job growth.
8
Mr. Douthat,
Perhaps, in this case the 'god that failed' is not the God of Abraham and Issac, but the god of Reagan, the Koch Brothers, and Arthur Laffer. The god that promised tax cuts for the rich would help the working class. And when that god failed, the white working class, unable to give up the catechism, did not believe that the god of Reagan had failed, but that they, in significant numbers, and not Reagan's god, were the failures. Hence the repair to drugs, alcohol, and suicide. Congratulations: you have met the enemy, and he is you.
Perhaps, in this case the 'god that failed' is not the God of Abraham and Issac, but the god of Reagan, the Koch Brothers, and Arthur Laffer. The god that promised tax cuts for the rich would help the working class. And when that god failed, the white working class, unable to give up the catechism, did not believe that the god of Reagan had failed, but that they, in significant numbers, and not Reagan's god, were the failures. Hence the repair to drugs, alcohol, and suicide. Congratulations: you have met the enemy, and he is you.
17
Boom!
2
this times a million. thanks, dj!
2
My understanding of the results is that the increased deaths were due to drug addiction, alcohol abuse, and suicide.
There was no discussion here about improving mental health services and addiction rehab that works.
There was no discussion here about improving mental health services and addiction rehab that works.
3
"Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
So the answer is...just suck it up, poor whites, like everyone else at the bottom of the ladder with you? Even though this is the wealthiest country in the world? How about...to the ramparts?
So the answer is...just suck it up, poor whites, like everyone else at the bottom of the ladder with you? Even though this is the wealthiest country in the world? How about...to the ramparts?
15
Maybe praying for a change in tax and import policies to bring back factories and jobs will sustain the po' whites; uneducated, unemployed and, until recently, unsung. Fourteen million U.S. jobs lost to deindustrialization of our economy in the name of share holder value under the guise of globalization in just twenty years. The next twenty will lead to further disengagement of more Americans, but, the creep will extend to those with merely a bachelors or masters degree. Already we see out-sourcing of engineering, medical and administrative work. Big companies move their headquarters and trade marks to low tax countries. The labels of so-called American brands all read "Made - in - Where Ever"; see Apple, Ralph Lauren, What Ever WalMart sells. Notice the increase in telemarketing calls? That's a direct indicator of nowhere else to work. Notice the bale out of big banks that killed the free market? Notice the rapacious interest on un-payable student debt? Notice the oligarchs and free loaders running for president? Notice America becoming a third world country? The dying whites are the canaries in the coal mine.
17
The only thing more shocking that the finding of higher mortality is how no other economist, sociologist, or academic in the country was able to detect such a massive increase in mortality. Liberal academia is so entrenched with cognitive bias that literally no researcher considered the question that white males might have a problem. Their research is so focused on minority and gender issues that they were incapable of perceiving the deaths that were in front of them.
Meanwhile, the finding show the result of:
1) loss of structured employment,
2) breakdown of social order, including the marginalization of religion,
3) increased drug use,
4) over-emphasis on special interests at the expense of the majority.
Every politician should step back and realize how they contributed to this problem. Sadly, the democratic party cares nothing about white males, so it is not only understandable that this condition worsened under President Obama, but I expect it to worsen if Hillary Clinton becomes President. After all, why care about the deaths of white men when there is a "war on women" to fight?
Meanwhile, the finding show the result of:
1) loss of structured employment,
2) breakdown of social order, including the marginalization of religion,
3) increased drug use,
4) over-emphasis on special interests at the expense of the majority.
Every politician should step back and realize how they contributed to this problem. Sadly, the democratic party cares nothing about white males, so it is not only understandable that this condition worsened under President Obama, but I expect it to worsen if Hillary Clinton becomes President. After all, why care about the deaths of white men when there is a "war on women" to fight?
3
Surgres, it is inaccurate and unfair to say the Democratic Party cares nothing about white males. If anything, the rejection is the other way around. The Party offers policy solutions that it believes can help all who are struggling economically, but white males reject the Democrats because of Democratic positions on hot-button social issues (God, Guns, Gays).
3
I'm willing to bet that the less-educated whites are disproportionately concentrated in red states that deny their people health care and live in the closed media loop of Fox News, which feeds them a steady diet of white victimization at the hands of Obama and Affirmative Action. Try to have a rational, evidence-based conversation on the issues with a conservative. They're all seething and uncivil. They blame Those People and Obana for America's problems. Douthat also peddles the same old canard that all we liberals want are transfer payments. No, we want government to stop outsourcing good-paying manufacturing jobs to low-wage countries while protecting high-wage professions, like doctors and lawyers, from competition. William Julius Wilson was right in the late 1960s. Social breakdown is the result of economic stagnation, not the other way around.
19
I believe your observation about expectations is a major factor in the mood of middle age whites who have been affected by the transfer of manufacturing jobs to countries with low cost labor. Part of the expectation is a sense of entitlement that some have had due to their upbringing and the constant drum beat that each generation should do better than the last. In the 1950-1980 period the U.S. was dominant economically as the rest of the world rebuilt after WWII. There were many good paying jobs in part due to union representation and the fact that companies could afford to acquiesce to union demands for better deals for the workers. That is no longer true. Unfortunately, rather than help people understand the cause of their problem, conservative politicians, Fox News, and talk radio have fanned this frustration into hatred, fear and a feeling of hopelessness. The election of black president and the presence of immigrants who are willing to work for relatively low wages coupled with the Republican assault on unions has created a nasty brew which has destroyed the entitlement deal that many thought existed. Further exacerbating the problem is the Republican resistance to public spending on areas of the economy, like infrastructure, that would create well paying jobs. The irony of this is that hatred and fear has created the feeling of hopelessness which is acted out by voting for candidates who are against the various policies that would make things better.
8
Profound suffering and no other alternatives polished the religious responses of the black community, and they were able to use this also to great effect in the civil rights movement to appeal to whites.
Do we really want to punish the white working class into a moral desperation in which religion is the only response for resilience? People must choose their own spiritual options, and it's never easy for anyone. But those who, like Ross Douthat, are convinced that religious commitment and discipline is the answer, should examine their own religious commitment and tap the response of generosity and compassion for suffering fellow humans, and assist them, instead of judging their moral compasses and find them wanting. There is a contradiction in the recommendation of religious morality to others by those with resources who stand judgmentally on the sidelines withholding from others for those others' own good.
Do we really want to punish the white working class into a moral desperation in which religion is the only response for resilience? People must choose their own spiritual options, and it's never easy for anyone. But those who, like Ross Douthat, are convinced that religious commitment and discipline is the answer, should examine their own religious commitment and tap the response of generosity and compassion for suffering fellow humans, and assist them, instead of judging their moral compasses and find them wanting. There is a contradiction in the recommendation of religious morality to others by those with resources who stand judgmentally on the sidelines withholding from others for those others' own good.
10
It appears that nothing is mentioned about the long-termed unemployed or under-employed; those that have given up! They are further met with a political system that wants them to believe that help equals being a dead beat. People in this country appear to have lost their humanity when it comes to helping their fellow man. We have a system that wants to punish anyone in need. Judging one's fellow man is the mode of operation today. The GOP wants to drug test anyone that needs help and the Democrats seem to be mostly voiceless these last few years. No social network, people don't even know their neighbors, and under-employed of unemployed are not a good mix. Until this nation can stop it's fear mongering and fighting wars elsewhere rather then solving it's own problems, I don't see the statistics getting any better.
4
When you couple our society's response to being unemployed with a fierce independence that translates to many as self-blame for one's difficulties in providing for oneself or family, it is easy to see why so many turn to drugs, alcohol or death when they cannot improve their circumstances. Sometimes those who qualify for help are too proud to ask for it, and at other times, our society says no to their cries for help. I think that's why this downturn in longevity has occurred primarily among whites with less education. They weren't supposed to have to struggle, and now that some do, they see only themselves to blame.
2
Ross said: "Yet here, too, Deaton and Case’s data is somewhat confounding, because if economic stress were all, you would expect the mortality crisis to manifest itself more sharply among black and Hispanic Americans"
That does not necessarily follow. Black and Hispanic Americans already had mortality rates in middle age that greatly exceeded whites and they still do. The fact that middle age mortality rates for these groups have not gone up while those of whites have might very well mean that things have gotten a bit better for these groups, even though they are still bad.
A better explanation of this situation is that more middle aged whites are suffering the same sorts of economic problems that middle aged African American and Hispanic Americans dealing with all along. As this trend continues, I would expect the mortality rates for all three groups to become about the same. It is getting tougher to be a middle aged white man. It has been pretty tough on the Hispanics and Blacks all along.
That does not necessarily follow. Black and Hispanic Americans already had mortality rates in middle age that greatly exceeded whites and they still do. The fact that middle age mortality rates for these groups have not gone up while those of whites have might very well mean that things have gotten a bit better for these groups, even though they are still bad.
A better explanation of this situation is that more middle aged whites are suffering the same sorts of economic problems that middle aged African American and Hispanic Americans dealing with all along. As this trend continues, I would expect the mortality rates for all three groups to become about the same. It is getting tougher to be a middle aged white man. It has been pretty tough on the Hispanics and Blacks all along.
8
The mortality rates for Black and Hispanic Americans decreased during 1999-2013, they did not hold steady. That makes the increase among White Americans so alarming. No one is suggesting that this is about only being alarmed that whites are dying earlier. Clearly, health policies have resulted in mortality improvements in other groups.
1
"Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation" Yeah, let them "eat cake" and "adapt culturally".
8
THIS IS THE REALITY.
The jobs crisis is PERMANENT, and will NOT end with better economic times.
A 2012 Independent Publisher Book Award winner, giving a fresh view on what is happening with American jobs, will tell you all about it. Work’s New Age: The End of Full Employment and What It Means to You is a resource for all of us. It explains what we are experiencing in terms of numbers, trends, and social patterns, and what we can – and cannot – do about it. Work’s New Age is the first full-length book in years to address this massive national concern. It shows why the gap between workers and jobs will get ever larger, and which possible solutions will only harm. It is well documented and thoughtful but easy to understand. The book even provides hope, by demonstrating how we have the potential to transform this crisis into a new American golden age.
Work's New Age is available on amazon.com, barnesandnoble.com, and worksnewage.com, and either on the shelves or by special order at your local bookstore. For much more information on what is really happening with jobs in America, see http://worksnewage.blogspot.com/.
The jobs crisis is PERMANENT, and will NOT end with better economic times.
A 2012 Independent Publisher Book Award winner, giving a fresh view on what is happening with American jobs, will tell you all about it. Work’s New Age: The End of Full Employment and What It Means to You is a resource for all of us. It explains what we are experiencing in terms of numbers, trends, and social patterns, and what we can – and cannot – do about it. Work’s New Age is the first full-length book in years to address this massive national concern. It shows why the gap between workers and jobs will get ever larger, and which possible solutions will only harm. It is well documented and thoughtful but easy to understand. The book even provides hope, by demonstrating how we have the potential to transform this crisis into a new American golden age.
Work's New Age is available on amazon.com, barnesandnoble.com, and worksnewage.com, and either on the shelves or by special order at your local bookstore. For much more information on what is really happening with jobs in America, see http://worksnewage.blogspot.com/.
1
There is a WORLD WIDE structural problem with jobs. It is not just the US and not just red states.
It is everywhere. There are now so many people that there are not enough jobs to go around. Technology means that we do not require as many workers anymore -- we can produce all the goods and services we consume with fewer and fewer workers.
It's not just "blue collar" workers either. Look at all the unemployed LAWYERS.
This is even truer in Europe, where every nation but Germany has higher unemployment numbers than in the US.
It is everywhere. There are now so many people that there are not enough jobs to go around. Technology means that we do not require as many workers anymore -- we can produce all the goods and services we consume with fewer and fewer workers.
It's not just "blue collar" workers either. Look at all the unemployed LAWYERS.
This is even truer in Europe, where every nation but Germany has higher unemployment numbers than in the US.
3
We cannot export capital making industries and expect that some miracle will produce impossible results never seen before. Wall Street paper pushers work only for themselves and little care about anything but their own personal bottom line. We are only now finding the results of Over the Counter drugs have had a devastating effect on our American public.
6
Many of these dead white men probably voted republican. They felt betrayed and hopeless. Government is not the problem unless people that hate the government are running it. Our middle class is disappearing at an alarming rate. Poverty is up, suicide and overdoses are up. Reaganomics doesn't work.
A successful business would not hire a CEO that promised to destroy the company unless it wanted to go bankrupt. Why do people hire republican politicians to destroy the country/government and seem surprised that the carnage trickles down while the money stays at the top with the plutocrats?
A successful business would not hire a CEO that promised to destroy the company unless it wanted to go bankrupt. Why do people hire republican politicians to destroy the country/government and seem surprised that the carnage trickles down while the money stays at the top with the plutocrats?
12
Is it just me or does it seem like Ross Douthat's solution for every social ill is old-time religion? Your wages will continue to decline and living off the welfare state won't make you feel good, but there's good news: religion can help stave off your suicidal despair. It that your solution for the working-class, Ross?
11
There is an element missing from this discussion and others I have read regarding the important Case and Deaton findings, and that is the geographical component. It might be informative to see how these findings play out across the country, in one of those digital color-coded maps showing a intensity of misery, county by county. I have a strong suspicion that this pain is not spread evenly, like peanut butter, across America. It might surprisingly turn out that it is happening most intensely in the whitest parts of the country - West Virginia's mountain communities, southern Indiana's farmlands, etc. It has nothing to do with how white people compare themselves to non-whites. It has everything to do with total lack of opportunity and economic despair, which is what I see in my little rural corner of the world on the edge of Appalachia. It isn't simply manufacturing jobs going overseas, either. The industrialization of modern farming has a lot to do with it. Agricultural communities have been hollowed out due to job loss to machines. Furthermore, there has been much powerful testimony and excellent reporting since Ferguson on how our criminal justice system abuses black communities. Believe me, the same injustice is cannabalizing poor whites in the same way, just not as visibly.
9
Lefty liberals would rather make this an "us vs. THEM" dialog -- or claim it is just desserts to punish whites for slavery and Jim Crow.
In fact, we are all affected....and not just the working classes. Jobs are disappearing for college-degreed people today, too -- look at what has happened with LAWYERS for gods sake. It used to be a guarantee of an upper middle class life....now you are lucky if 3 years of law school even get you an entry level job.
In fact, we are all affected....and not just the working classes. Jobs are disappearing for college-degreed people today, too -- look at what has happened with LAWYERS for gods sake. It used to be a guarantee of an upper middle class life....now you are lucky if 3 years of law school even get you an entry level job.
3
There is a far more striking trend that emerged during the same time period as this study: the rise of fundamentalist religion.
When a formerly-upwardly-mobile demographic finds itself on the wane, it isn't just guns and alcohol they reach for as remedies.
Before implicating the absence of religion, one ought to rule out the possibility that religion itself became as lethal as those other addictions.
When a formerly-upwardly-mobile demographic finds itself on the wane, it isn't just guns and alcohol they reach for as remedies.
Before implicating the absence of religion, one ought to rule out the possibility that religion itself became as lethal as those other addictions.
13
Religious people often say that the dead have gone to a better place.
3
I hate to blame the media, but I believe right wing media plays a significant part in this situation.
Who is the audience for right wing media? Yes, the very population dying at accelerating rates. During the 90s, the message was fairly inclusive of all middle aged whites of that political persuasion. As the Great Recession set in, the message started to change, since our finacial problems struck after years of Republican Party rule. Since right wing media grew to be an arm of the Republican Party, the message was designed to deflect that blame, and blame the victims of the recession.
Who was bringing down America? The takers! The lazy people on unemployment were becoming the cause of their own unemployment. Who else? Any public employee became a target, especially those lazy school teachers, raking in our tax money, and getting the summer off! And to make matters worse, many teachers are (gasp!) union members.
So if you happened to be a working class consumer of right wing media who lost his job, your own were turning against you. Unemployment compensation was cut in Republican controlled states. Having no job increases isolation, and the message drummed into people's heads are that they are to blame for their miserable condition.
The constant drumbeat of doom and gloom from the right plus blaming victims of the economy for its failure SHOULD drive people to the edge. Maybe there is a price to pay for fanning the flames of discord?
Who is the audience for right wing media? Yes, the very population dying at accelerating rates. During the 90s, the message was fairly inclusive of all middle aged whites of that political persuasion. As the Great Recession set in, the message started to change, since our finacial problems struck after years of Republican Party rule. Since right wing media grew to be an arm of the Republican Party, the message was designed to deflect that blame, and blame the victims of the recession.
Who was bringing down America? The takers! The lazy people on unemployment were becoming the cause of their own unemployment. Who else? Any public employee became a target, especially those lazy school teachers, raking in our tax money, and getting the summer off! And to make matters worse, many teachers are (gasp!) union members.
So if you happened to be a working class consumer of right wing media who lost his job, your own were turning against you. Unemployment compensation was cut in Republican controlled states. Having no job increases isolation, and the message drummed into people's heads are that they are to blame for their miserable condition.
The constant drumbeat of doom and gloom from the right plus blaming victims of the economy for its failure SHOULD drive people to the edge. Maybe there is a price to pay for fanning the flames of discord?
212
IU ALL BEGAN AROUND WITH REAGAN . . .
...when the age of more wealth was good .... greed! After the Second World War until about 1980 the wealth did trickle down and a new middle class was developed. But beginning with President Reagan ... a new Gilded Age began ... under the rubric of Conservative ideology as we somehow convinced the electorate that unions were bad ... And somehow Christianity was now compatible with Ayn Rand ... without mentioning her name.
Yes, "greed was good" and brought status to those who achieved because it was they who accomplished their goal.
Many in the ministry stopped emphasizing the Judeo-Christian ideology in favor of the accumulation of the material aspects of life and this was good a perversion of Calvinism.
The public educational system deteriorated as the college degree became the equivalent of the high school diploma as basic civics and history became ignored. The goal of obtaining B.A. became morphed from a preparation for a fulfilling life and learning to learn and obtaining curiosity to simply, in the main a vocational tool.
A half century ago obtaining a secondary diploma was sufficient to get a high paying job as now it portends nothing.
Now each generation does not even match their parents' success ... so? Their are many variables including far more decedent values. but, as even college grads can't obtain jobs part of the variance which causes an increase in suicide in this demo is obvious.
Bernie is right!
...when the age of more wealth was good .... greed! After the Second World War until about 1980 the wealth did trickle down and a new middle class was developed. But beginning with President Reagan ... a new Gilded Age began ... under the rubric of Conservative ideology as we somehow convinced the electorate that unions were bad ... And somehow Christianity was now compatible with Ayn Rand ... without mentioning her name.
Yes, "greed was good" and brought status to those who achieved because it was they who accomplished their goal.
Many in the ministry stopped emphasizing the Judeo-Christian ideology in favor of the accumulation of the material aspects of life and this was good a perversion of Calvinism.
The public educational system deteriorated as the college degree became the equivalent of the high school diploma as basic civics and history became ignored. The goal of obtaining B.A. became morphed from a preparation for a fulfilling life and learning to learn and obtaining curiosity to simply, in the main a vocational tool.
A half century ago obtaining a secondary diploma was sufficient to get a high paying job as now it portends nothing.
Now each generation does not even match their parents' success ... so? Their are many variables including far more decedent values. but, as even college grads can't obtain jobs part of the variance which causes an increase in suicide in this demo is obvious.
Bernie is right!
5
Let's paraphrase Douthat's penultimate paragraph. 'Maybe we should trust that a few conservative tweaks to our brand of crushing capitalism will work to ameliorate the misery, or maybe you should simply learn to deal with it.'
He and his ilk had better hope that the poor whites continue to self medicate and don't open their eyes to the common cause with black and Hispanic Americans. Marx, in the shadow, is laughing.
He and his ilk had better hope that the poor whites continue to self medicate and don't open their eyes to the common cause with black and Hispanic Americans. Marx, in the shadow, is laughing.
12
arrjay,
Yes, indeed! Douthat and the myriad right wing bloviators in think tanks that produce these studies that Republicans cite proving that "really, our greed and
crushing your family is good for you" wouldn't do so well if the tables turned.
That is why the Right detests education so much.
Yes, indeed! Douthat and the myriad right wing bloviators in think tanks that produce these studies that Republicans cite proving that "really, our greed and
crushing your family is good for you" wouldn't do so well if the tables turned.
That is why the Right detests education so much.
3
I think Douthat hit the nail on the head at the end. It's the increasing gap between white expectations and declining economic fortunes and political/social power brought on by shifting demographics. And the loyalty of this demographic to right-wing politics and policies is ever the more confounding but consistent with their lower educational levels.
5
'Rage, rage against the dying of the whites...' Ross may as well rage against the dying of the Right. We have been seeing one attack after another against the middle class and the American Dream, aspirations mostly of whites, now turning to myth as we watch helplessly. The disaffected folks in the precariate, many having turned against their own best interests to veer Right and to elect those who are bent on making the middle class disappear, are dying quicker than formerly. Nothing much to do with increased secularism, as secular Europe is not seeing such an effect, but economic straits and loss of hope. At some point these right wing voters will either see their mistakes and change or simply die out, leaving their more sensible progeny in place to pick up the pieces.
5
Once in a while, denial strikes back and this is the one. The rich and powerful inculcating the poorest of our states and counties have struck again, and, rather than looking for ways to limit precious resources that provide health care for poor women, have hit the hearts of middle-aged whites. Let's not forget that their sons and daughters have fought in endless wars, and the nation is not better off; no one is more free and no one is more safe. The platitudes of the Republican Party are wearing thin, Mr. Douthat. The daily reports of the Wall Street thirty something billionaires coinciding with the demonization of fifty year old workers with less pay and no benefits, to "work harder," in the words of our Speaker Ryan, leaves all aging men and women no way out, no faith, and no control. They are not their Dads of World War II, and that is a profound and heartbreaking place to be in the land of plenty for the 1%.
12
Perhaps whites are dying from hatred. Both popular and academic culture suggest (scream?) that whites are responsible for all the evils of this world--racism, colonialism, consumerism, global warming, etc. ... . We are being told that it would be better that we should never have been born, and the best way that we can atone for our sins is to die as soon as possible. With a constant drumbeat of negativity, is it any wonder that the suggestion influences behavior? Anyone prone to discount this possibility should consider that this newspaper and almost all media are supported by advertising and that the power of suggestion works.
7
a pathetic discourse
folks need help
our collective response is to ignore them
simple
go die and don't bother us.
Tea Party GOP response- cut all services available- give the 1% everything- and then say morals are lacking.
Wow - do you really buy that non sense.
Ok Joe- you Reagan democrats come back to the fold.
folks need help
our collective response is to ignore them
simple
go die and don't bother us.
Tea Party GOP response- cut all services available- give the 1% everything- and then say morals are lacking.
Wow - do you really buy that non sense.
Ok Joe- you Reagan democrats come back to the fold.
9
ADDICTION. We are dying of ADDICTION. America is an addicted society.
We use alchohol, prescription meds, illegal drugs, junk food, TV, gaming and gambling to avoid thinking, feeling and interacting. We are disconnected from ourselves, nature and one another. We use fuel our anxieties and fears as we isolate with our addictions. We need to go outside. Walk. Talk to one another in person. Stare at trees. Eat fresh vegetables. Forgive ourselves and one another. Accept ourselves and one another. Experience life rather than substances. Pursue challenges rather than things. Help one another.
We use alchohol, prescription meds, illegal drugs, junk food, TV, gaming and gambling to avoid thinking, feeling and interacting. We are disconnected from ourselves, nature and one another. We use fuel our anxieties and fears as we isolate with our addictions. We need to go outside. Walk. Talk to one another in person. Stare at trees. Eat fresh vegetables. Forgive ourselves and one another. Accept ourselves and one another. Experience life rather than substances. Pursue challenges rather than things. Help one another.
8
I suspect part of the problem is increasing alienation between men and women. This increasing alienation may very well be having more of a negative impact on working class whites than any other group. I have no idea what can be done to turn this situation around.
Lowest common denominator. That's Douthat's solution?
So Americans have completely given up on actually trying to solve its problems. It would rather sit here and let the mud slide down the hill.
So Americans have completely given up on actually trying to solve its problems. It would rather sit here and let the mud slide down the hill.
8
A massive and I mean massive, infrastructure rebuilding program might be one way to breath life into the middle class while at the same time bringing our infrastructure into the 21st century. Unless some way is found to create decently paying jobs for the working class and not just for techies, this syndrome will continue. It would be expensive but we can't afford not to do it.
17
Amen to Lou Candell. MASSIVE. It's what we need to get our infrastructure up to grade and what we need to employee tons of people in jobs with real worth (and decent pay/benefits). Add to that a layer of the CCC (Civilian Conservation Core) and a healthy dose of the WPA (Works Progress Administration) for the rest of the un- and under-employed. "Socialism?" you ask, but hold that. The whole plan would benefit America and its citizens immensely. After that's done, we can take up the ideological battles again if we must.
3
Most of the deaths are directly or indirectly attributable to addiction to prescription opioids such as oxycontin. A large component of the initial use seems to be recreational rather than therapeutic - in other word another drug fad. Sweeping sociological or political implications are totally unwarranted at this stage.
1
I come a lot closer to agreeing with Douthat in this column than I usually do.
"What you were supposed to have has been denied you" says it all. And what is that? In other places it is called "white privilege" ... the unspoken, unconscious sense that the world was made for your benefit, that even if you are poor you are still not "one of them": you're still "respectable," you stand on your own two feet, with God and your own two hands to support you, the kind of person who might give help, but never has to take it, never has to ask for it.
To the privileged, the loss of privilege feels like oppression, especially when one isn't aware the privilege even existed. To be treated "no better than anyone else" (including the people you grew up looking down upon as your inferiors) is a painful thing. You may find yourself at the mercy of forces beyond your control in ways you never expected, which cannot be met by the "hard work and self-reliance" model alone.
Perhaps some white people for the first time are facing conditions that people of color have had to face (and adapt to) for a long time.
I notice that Douthat says middle-age black mortality is falling while white mortality is rising. What he does NOT say is that a black man is still 40% more likely to die between ages 45 and 54 than a white man is. Mortality rates for these two groups are becoming more equal. (Though interestingly, the 45-54 rate for Hispanics is well under that of whites.)
"What you were supposed to have has been denied you" says it all. And what is that? In other places it is called "white privilege" ... the unspoken, unconscious sense that the world was made for your benefit, that even if you are poor you are still not "one of them": you're still "respectable," you stand on your own two feet, with God and your own two hands to support you, the kind of person who might give help, but never has to take it, never has to ask for it.
To the privileged, the loss of privilege feels like oppression, especially when one isn't aware the privilege even existed. To be treated "no better than anyone else" (including the people you grew up looking down upon as your inferiors) is a painful thing. You may find yourself at the mercy of forces beyond your control in ways you never expected, which cannot be met by the "hard work and self-reliance" model alone.
Perhaps some white people for the first time are facing conditions that people of color have had to face (and adapt to) for a long time.
I notice that Douthat says middle-age black mortality is falling while white mortality is rising. What he does NOT say is that a black man is still 40% more likely to die between ages 45 and 54 than a white man is. Mortality rates for these two groups are becoming more equal. (Though interestingly, the 45-54 rate for Hispanics is well under that of whites.)
198
Good analysis, Bejay.
And, admittedly, this looks a lot like "I'm not getting what was supposed to be my birthright, my white privilege, anymore--all these people are asking me to share, and I don't wanna, so I'm gonna just blow it and myself up--that'll show 'em".
Probably not only explains a lot of addiction and suicide, but mass homicide/clinging to firearms, too. "Happiness is a warm gun".
And, admittedly, this looks a lot like "I'm not getting what was supposed to be my birthright, my white privilege, anymore--all these people are asking me to share, and I don't wanna, so I'm gonna just blow it and myself up--that'll show 'em".
Probably not only explains a lot of addiction and suicide, but mass homicide/clinging to firearms, too. "Happiness is a warm gun".
4
You hit the nail on the head. The loss of white privilege feels like oppression which can result in depression and fear. Many respond to that by suicide, addiction and the development of chronic pain issues. Thus the death rate rises. The media's response to this has been interesting. As Bejay notes, black men of the same age are nearly half again as likely to die, and no one is paying attention to that! Only that the white death rate is approaching the rate for blacks. This difference in media coverage still implies that white people are more important than others. And the response, that this is a huge problem because it effects whites, implies that the rest of us are still clinging to a belief in white privilege.
2
I moved from a red state that did not advertise the medicaid extension to a blue state that did, and Obamacare cut $650 a month of costs to my medical expenses - - I am a diabetic. That really cheered me up a heck of a lot right there, let me tell ya. Programs designed to aid poor people can produce a vast quantity of hope where there was little before. It's been my experience, anyway. Those of you complaining about your premium cost raises have a beef, but as long as US citizens pay more to providers of health care than any other country, and these costs continue to go up faster than any other type of inflation, the system, whatever system they have, will drive people nuts. Obamacare, however, is a lot nicer to me than the old system was - - speaking as a poor person.
35
Obamacare did not cut the cost of your care. It obviously cut your cost but total cost likely went up because Obamacare is simply another unwieldy mismanaged government social program. To cut cost we probably have to rebalance program selection and delivery to include a far greater private sector share for the total effort. Since the onset of the New Deal America has swung far into an increasingly ineffective socialism. We are now instituting programs that we probably haven't the wealth to operate even if they were well managed. We certainly haven't the wealth for the current circus.
1
I'm so tired of the phrase: "in the richest nation in the world". Okay, so in aggregate, we may hold that distinction. But on a median basis, we are far from the richest and are seemingly sliding fast. Because the median income is a much better description of how the average person lives, we should focus on that metric. And given that the median person, and particularly the median white male, has seen his standard of living fall for the past fifteen years, it's really not that surprising that more of them are essentially committing suicide directly or indirectly.
21
It takes a special brand of pious gall to write nonsense like this.
Mr Douthat actually admits to the possibility that expansion of the welfare state may have merit. He didn't think so while African-Americans and Latinos were "adapting," but it's a different story when white Americans face the loss of they were "supposed to have."
But this can only be taken so far, of course. Rather than urging "less educated" whites to overcome their prejudices and seek common ground with African-Americans and Latinos, Mr Douthat recommends that they find a "new path" of "resilience" -- i.e., go to church and accept their lot in life rather than take steps that might threaten Mr Douthat's conception of "work, faith and family."
After all, a healthy society can only take so much suicide prevention.
Mr Douthat actually admits to the possibility that expansion of the welfare state may have merit. He didn't think so while African-Americans and Latinos were "adapting," but it's a different story when white Americans face the loss of they were "supposed to have."
But this can only be taken so far, of course. Rather than urging "less educated" whites to overcome their prejudices and seek common ground with African-Americans and Latinos, Mr Douthat recommends that they find a "new path" of "resilience" -- i.e., go to church and accept their lot in life rather than take steps that might threaten Mr Douthat's conception of "work, faith and family."
After all, a healthy society can only take so much suicide prevention.
51
So let's help the fastest dying among us lower their expectations (kill their desire) so they can sublimate their anger away from sciatica, suicide and cirrhosis over to broken homes (matriarchy) and fatherless children. Lets give them some welfare to equalize poverty among the races so it looks like an inverse rainbow arcing to the bottom or a place where future social geologists will find a curious mixture of intermingling black, white, red and brown strata overlaid by an incredibly thin, bright, white line. And let's not forget to keep blaming those pesky immigrants and the lassitude of those unnamable others as being the chief cause of their misery. Then we'll scold them for their character defects in our elite columns by David Brooks and in our scholarly tomes by Charles Murray, which never fail to blame their demise on a laxity of morals or confuse symptom with cause.
For conservative elites, the fall of the white working class is a curious conundrum because it defies any notion of white superiority. But its not really a problem, because they'll just stick them in the blender of grinding poverty and malt them all into a "smoothier" version e pluribus unum.
For conservative elites, the fall of the white working class is a curious conundrum because it defies any notion of white superiority. But its not really a problem, because they'll just stick them in the blender of grinding poverty and malt them all into a "smoothier" version e pluribus unum.
21
Clues as to what is going wrong may be found by looking at the characteristics of those global communities who have the longest life span:
1. Tight and permanent social bonding to family and friends
2. Non-industrialized
3. Clean environment
4. Constant need to perform manual chores
5. Mostly vegetarian, unrefined diet which includes legumes
See "The Blue Zones: Lessons for Living Longer from the People Who Have Lived the Longest" by Dan Beuttner.
Then we need to ask ourselves how healthy a society is who need to place a weeks-old child in daycare during the period of their lives when they are forming their model of family? When we use TV as a baby sitter and when they are not allowed to play with friends outside for safety considerations? Where there is no time, money or desire for religious community?
We have created a generation whose only remaining values revolve around work and consumption. Take away that last thread of self-respect and purpose away and you have emotional disaster.
1. Tight and permanent social bonding to family and friends
2. Non-industrialized
3. Clean environment
4. Constant need to perform manual chores
5. Mostly vegetarian, unrefined diet which includes legumes
See "The Blue Zones: Lessons for Living Longer from the People Who Have Lived the Longest" by Dan Beuttner.
Then we need to ask ourselves how healthy a society is who need to place a weeks-old child in daycare during the period of their lives when they are forming their model of family? When we use TV as a baby sitter and when they are not allowed to play with friends outside for safety considerations? Where there is no time, money or desire for religious community?
We have created a generation whose only remaining values revolve around work and consumption. Take away that last thread of self-respect and purpose away and you have emotional disaster.
21
Better headline: Republican Base Commits Suicide. Sure I know that these uneducated white men are not the 1%, but they have been the numerical back-bone of the Republican electorate who consistently vote against their own interests in support of anti-government, racist, xenophobic, misogynist, anti-science, genital christian morality.
No Ross. It is not a "come to Jesus" moment. It is not Pope Francis' fault either. These guys are deeply religious. It's just that their religion is a fraud that is anti-government, racist, xenophobic, misogynist, anti-science, genital christian morality, and it's lies and contradictions do not hold water. As inequality becomes more a fact of their lives, these angry white men recognize that their allegiance to rich white men has ruined their lives, destroyed their future, and made them look stupider than they are.
No Ross. It is not a "come to Jesus" moment. It is not Pope Francis' fault either. These guys are deeply religious. It's just that their religion is a fraud that is anti-government, racist, xenophobic, misogynist, anti-science, genital christian morality, and it's lies and contradictions do not hold water. As inequality becomes more a fact of their lives, these angry white men recognize that their allegiance to rich white men has ruined their lives, destroyed their future, and made them look stupider than they are.
66
But alas Mr Huben ... couldn't we say much the same about other racial groups; e.g. wedded to a single political party ( the Democratic one in this case ), gripped in a spiral of internecine homicide, abused and abandoned single mothers, stupefied with various intoxicants, self destructive attempts to imitate the life styles of uber rich hip - hop purveyors? Rather than mutual finger pointing and " gotcha " point scoring certainly a more productive outlet would be study of the underlying causes, both economic and psychological. How and why do some groups and individuals within the effected demographics avoid and overcome these patterns of destruction; e.g. why is the Asian - American community so much more successful in terms of both economics and social cohesion?
It's ALL about the economics, and nothing else, anything else is a straw man argument.
12
After 2000, We had the Dot.COM bust, and, the housing bust. Who remembers the tent cities that sprung up housing whole families? The whole world changed as it now became very apparent that just a high school diploma wasn't going to get it anymore. There is a surplus of people in this category, so, trying to build a life is difficult at best. The work force today requires much more, combined with ability to change. So, what do we do? Drown ourselves with alcohol and drugs. Both become addictive, and, we ultimately destroy ourselves, and, view our lives as no longer worth living. Self esteem has been dashed.
4
This group has supported the policies that are killing it.
41
No need to overthink here.... The bastion of white employment for non-college grads (manufacturing )is gone, replaced by minimum wage jobs. Big Pharma eases the pain via Oxy, anti-depressants, ect....tobacco and cheap beer help kill time, and guns are easier to purchase than any time or place in history.....and we wonder why white working class folks have a rising death rate in middle age with no difference in black and Hispanic communities?
17
What Mr. Douthat would appear to overlook is that the deep distress of the less educated white American male was caused by G.O.P. economic policies that systematically gutted the country of the steady, reasonably well paying work that once sustained these people. The story is sadly best told by all of the sound-bite slogans that have piloted this long economic misstep since Reagan was elected: "Greed is Good," "Maximizing shareholder returns," "Union Busting," and a tax code that favors private equity asset stripping over long term investing. The G.O.P., long the party of business, lost the plot with Reagan and never found its way economically again--since the American economy now is more about making money, whatever the means, than making things--and this badly wounded and angry demographic is the one that has suffered most piteously from these misguided policies.
37
"....,. in the richest nation in the world."
Wrong, or it depends on how you count. There is a joke:
Bill Gates walks into a working class bar. Everybody gets up and starts cheering. Bill asks the barkeep "Why is everybody cheering?" THe barkeep answers "Because our average income just went up 10000%"
But the median income did not move at all.
Perhaps the US has the richest "average" income in the world. But the median is lower and lower every year while costs are higher and higher.
Medical care increases are several times the increase in income and while Bill Gates is unaffected by it - the 99% are adversely affected in the extreme.
It is long about time we toss out the worn mantra of "the richest nation in the world."
We are not.
Wrong, or it depends on how you count. There is a joke:
Bill Gates walks into a working class bar. Everybody gets up and starts cheering. Bill asks the barkeep "Why is everybody cheering?" THe barkeep answers "Because our average income just went up 10000%"
But the median income did not move at all.
Perhaps the US has the richest "average" income in the world. But the median is lower and lower every year while costs are higher and higher.
Medical care increases are several times the increase in income and while Bill Gates is unaffected by it - the 99% are adversely affected in the extreme.
It is long about time we toss out the worn mantra of "the richest nation in the world."
We are not.
34
Well,
no surprise here. As the conservatives despise science, that does include math.
No surprise.
no surprise here. As the conservatives despise science, that does include math.
No surprise.
2
My work provides me a good awareness of unemployment compensation policy. One problem is that when people lose their jobs the government provides relatively poor support. Unemployment policies are set by individual states, not the federal government, and in 41 of the 50 states the maximum weekly benefit is less than $450. In 26 states the maximum benefit is less than $400, and in six (6) states the maximum benefit is set at less than $300. A number of states (not many, but a few, including some of the larger states) have also significantly reduced the maximum duration of benefits from the long-term historical normal standard of 26 weeks. The states with lower levels of unemployment compensation benefits tend to be concentrated in the southern half of the country. I believe that the level of despair and the poor health conditions discussed in this column and the related research studies citied would be greatly alleviated if the government provided more support for people when they are experiencing periods of economic dislocation. In fact, one of the basic purposes of unemployment compensation is to function as an economic stabilizer in times of economic dislocation by providing temporary financial assistance to unemployed workers. Perhaps unemployment compensation should be a federal program and not set by the individual states. See http://fileunemployment.org/unemployment-benefits-comparison-by-state and http://workforcesecurity.doleta.gov/unemploy/uifactsheet.asp.
8
Douthat missed his own point. The clue is in the term "less educated". Perhaps the reason there is no increase in mortality among people in the European welfare states is that they all offer free college/trades education. Perhaps the problem lies in the "less educated" part.
There was a time in this country where a person could earn a decent living with a high school education. Those jobs are all but gone; exported or automated. How about we concentrate on the "less educated" part of the equation and see how that works out.
Correction; poor black people have been committing slow suicide with drugs and alcohol for a long time. Black life expectancy has always been lower than whites, especially black men.
There was a time in this country where a person could earn a decent living with a high school education. Those jobs are all but gone; exported or automated. How about we concentrate on the "less educated" part of the equation and see how that works out.
Correction; poor black people have been committing slow suicide with drugs and alcohol for a long time. Black life expectancy has always been lower than whites, especially black men.
17
Many interdependent factors are at work here. There's apparently a consequence of moving from a relatively privileged position over a couple generations that differs from having been in a disadvantaged position for many generations. There also seems to be a difference between European nations that are relatively homogeneous and the US where "the Other" can be readily blamed for the misfortune of losing a previously privileged position. And this all may be harder to take when your world view is rooted in an exceptionalism model that has moved beyond a sound foundation to become an excuse for some people's greed and arrogance.
13
In most of America work defines a person. What do you do? Where do you work? Those are usually questions Americans ask someone whom they've just met. Unemployed people cannot answer these questions with any sense of dignity. Sending these unemployed people to church or to marriage counselors is not going give them an answer to those two questions.
17
I was braced for some partisan slant but was pleased by this surprisingly balanced, thoughtful article. Journalism that doesn't push an ideological agenda is the most respectful and considerate of the people who read the articles and those whose problems the article addresses. You can learn the most from these articles because then you can focus on the information and not filtering for partisanship. I wish there were more columnists who cover socioeconomic issues the way Douthat has.
5
I think the crux of this despair is not that white working-class people feel that "what you were supposed to have has been denied," but that "you failed in the game you wanted and now you're one of them."
Think about it -- this cohort voted (and continues to vote) in angry and punitive ways on others, at least in part because those others have "failed" and made themselves lesser "moochers" and "malingerers" and "losers." Now imagine if, due to any number of reasons -- most beyond his control -- an angry and punitive white voter "fails" as well. The anger directed at others cannot help but be directed at himself too, because it's somehow an American truism that if you work hard you cannot fail.
He didn't work hard enough, so he's become someone he hates. That self-hatred is lethal.
Think about it -- this cohort voted (and continues to vote) in angry and punitive ways on others, at least in part because those others have "failed" and made themselves lesser "moochers" and "malingerers" and "losers." Now imagine if, due to any number of reasons -- most beyond his control -- an angry and punitive white voter "fails" as well. The anger directed at others cannot help but be directed at himself too, because it's somehow an American truism that if you work hard you cannot fail.
He didn't work hard enough, so he's become someone he hates. That self-hatred is lethal.
23
Insofar as the malaise can be attributed to unmet expectations, which I believe is a large factor, one might single out the failure of the promised land of white hegemony that the Republicans have been preaching since 1980. That certainly jives with not "recognizing their country anymore" with a black president, with the ridiculous notion that there is some war on Christianity, with the brain-dead inability to perceive the reasons behind Black Lives Matter, and with anti-immigrant sentiments. So perhaps the fact that being a white male is less and less an automatic meal ticket, no longer with women and minorities pressed into that service, is what has these folks in despair. In this regard, hard to feel any sympathy at all, frankly.
Indeed, the huge shift from Conservative Democrats to Republicans following the Civil Rights era is what has these folks consistently voting against their economic interests, out of racism. Wages of sin, and all that.
Indeed, the huge shift from Conservative Democrats to Republicans following the Civil Rights era is what has these folks consistently voting against their economic interests, out of racism. Wages of sin, and all that.
22
The great and unresolved American paradox is, ultimately, the core of the problem. The fact is that rapacious capitalism and democracy are antithetical to one another. One ideology trumpets Darwinian triumphalism where the game is to win and dominate all by diminishing the majority of citizens. One ideology seeks equality, e.g., one person, one vote, and domestic policies which seek to increase access to a panoply of opportunities of the commonwealth, for the benefit of the many. The weak, the sick, the old, the unemployed, the underemployed, the disabled, the working poor, are unworthy throw aways: useless drags on the economy, and easily replaceable.
What I see in this country is a titanic struggle between the two ideologies with Darwinian capitalism ascendent. Until this struggle is resolved there will be a continued disease upon this land whose consequences will be a continual slow death in every possible form and place imaginable and unimaginable.
What I see in this country is a titanic struggle between the two ideologies with Darwinian capitalism ascendent. Until this struggle is resolved there will be a continued disease upon this land whose consequences will be a continual slow death in every possible form and place imaginable and unimaginable.
220
What a load of nonsense. White working class Americans enjoy a standard of living that is unheard of anywhere else in the world.
They live in large houses, with more bedrooms than occupants, more televisions than rooms, more cars than drivers.
They enjoy food, fuel and travel that is priced far cheaper than their counterparts in any other developed country.
They can afford to trade-in their large gas-guzzling vehicles every few years. They can afford to own large arsenals of weapons.
They can afford to spend their disposable income on abusing alcohol, drugs and prescription medications.
And they have the highest resource consumption levels and generate the largest per-capita carbon footprint of any people.
The real problem is behavioral dysregulation in the context of weakened social fabric.
This cohort has deliberately and willfully put themselves into a socio-cultural dead-end, consistently supporting policies that have undermined their own communities, and counter to their own interests.
They have behaved like obstinate, oppositional teenagers for decades -- embracing and celebrating a know-nothing belief system that denies simple and obvious realities.
They have been living in their own mirrored bubble for too long. They have squandered away opportunities that no other people enjoy.
Let them fix their own problems.
They live in large houses, with more bedrooms than occupants, more televisions than rooms, more cars than drivers.
They enjoy food, fuel and travel that is priced far cheaper than their counterparts in any other developed country.
They can afford to trade-in their large gas-guzzling vehicles every few years. They can afford to own large arsenals of weapons.
They can afford to spend their disposable income on abusing alcohol, drugs and prescription medications.
And they have the highest resource consumption levels and generate the largest per-capita carbon footprint of any people.
The real problem is behavioral dysregulation in the context of weakened social fabric.
This cohort has deliberately and willfully put themselves into a socio-cultural dead-end, consistently supporting policies that have undermined their own communities, and counter to their own interests.
They have behaved like obstinate, oppositional teenagers for decades -- embracing and celebrating a know-nothing belief system that denies simple and obvious realities.
They have been living in their own mirrored bubble for too long. They have squandered away opportunities that no other people enjoy.
Let them fix their own problems.
24
Who is this "they?" You are obviously someone with some psychological training ("oppositional" "behavioral dysregulation"), but too little common sense to know that you cannot blame a "cohort" for anything. Certainly some "white working class Americans" make choices you do not approve of. Is this to blame for their increasing death rates? Perhaps partly, but there is also the over-prescription of pain meds, which -- sorry to remind you --comes from your end of the socio-economic ladder. Should I blame you, because you are part of the same "cohort" that includes physicians and drug marketers?
2
There is also a rise in "zombie" literature's popularity which has been correlated to feelings of helplessness and being in events beyond everyman's control. It doesn't surprise me white middle class are dying. Suicide and depression are symptoms of helplessness; we feel we have few if any choices left so go to the final ones. Blacks, Hispanics and other minorities have been here a lot longer and may never have had any illusions of control or opportunity. White people buy into the myth, they are totally responsible for all their "failures" when contending with forces beyond their control.
Today we have economic forces which are only concerned with draining the coffers of the middle class for their own elite benefit. People see their chances for a decent good life being stolen under a Randian rationale and have just given up.l
Today we have economic forces which are only concerned with draining the coffers of the middle class for their own elite benefit. People see their chances for a decent good life being stolen under a Randian rationale and have just given up.l
11
"eases people into a life of dependence and disability payments"? To equate being disabled as being "easy" is idiotic and outrageous! I became disabled ten years ago and had to leave highly satisfying career behind. Being disabled is the toughest job I've ever had! The pay is low, there's no "status", and my income is lower than ever while my costs of living (or rather, surviving) have risen beyond my means to pay for them due to my increased use of medical providers, medications, household help, etc. And then there's the isolation and a host of other challenges. btw, I am while and middle-aged. When it comes to thoughts of suicide, I can relate.
Speaking for myself, and I can only imagine others like me, you sound like a nasty bully.
Speaking for myself, and I can only imagine others like me, you sound like a nasty bully.
26
Uh oh, you should sue Ross for failing to issue a trigger warning!
Oh yes Ross, if only we would promote more beliefs in sky gods, let the rich get a little bit richer then all these troubles would go away.
25
The largest factor with regard to increased mortality rates is the matter of fathers and children. With the massive rise in births to single mothers came a commensurate rise in unmarried fathers. These are men who have no real, enforceable rights when it comes to establishing healthy, consistent relationships with their children. They are routinely at most part-time fathers with little input and whose relationships with their children exists at the whim of the mother. In no state can an unmarried father compel court-ordered visitation against the mother’s wishes without tearing the child apart and racking up enormous legal fees. Paying child support in full is also zero guarantee of visitation (that was uncoupled decades ago even as leverage of last resort), but getting behind even a little means prison is in the offing. We‘ve created a new underclass of fathers with prison records, whose only crime was the inability to pay court-ordered child support (with poverty by far the likeliest reason), who cannot see their children and cannot get good jobs. On any given day there are 50,000 men in prison on that charge.
If you see an aging alcoholic or addict or suicide, look first to the question of children. A man with a working relationship with his kids only very rarely commits suicide. Men overwhelmingly would prefer to die before letting their children down, but many men also prefer death to living without their children in their lives. There is no pain more devastating.
If you see an aging alcoholic or addict or suicide, look first to the question of children. A man with a working relationship with his kids only very rarely commits suicide. Men overwhelmingly would prefer to die before letting their children down, but many men also prefer death to living without their children in their lives. There is no pain more devastating.
4
That is simply untrue. The courts really do not recognize MARRIAGE anymore when it comes to child custody rights, so you are wrong. No matter if you are married OR NOT, you have the same rights to your biological child, including visitation.
In most states, they have done away with "custody" and refer instead to "the residential parent vs. the non-residential parent". The most common arrangement today is JOINT CUSTODY.
BTW: that you think it is fair to use child support to force the child's mother to comply with visitation is deeply troubling. That was the "excuse" millions of men used to avoid paying child support, often while fathering OTHER children with new girlfriends. It is unconscionable. Your child has no agency to compel visitation. To deny a child support to get even with his/her mother is gross abuse and that is why the courts no longer permit it.
In most states, they have done away with "custody" and refer instead to "the residential parent vs. the non-residential parent". The most common arrangement today is JOINT CUSTODY.
BTW: that you think it is fair to use child support to force the child's mother to comply with visitation is deeply troubling. That was the "excuse" millions of men used to avoid paying child support, often while fathering OTHER children with new girlfriends. It is unconscionable. Your child has no agency to compel visitation. To deny a child support to get even with his/her mother is gross abuse and that is why the courts no longer permit it.
3
Showing up is no longer enough. It once was for those with White privilege. Now a white skin, a high school diploma and a C average gets you, not much, Dubya notwithstanding. And it seems, with affirmative action, that even effort does not accomplish much.
17
Or maybe the radical individualism and radical egalitarianism endless promoted by the LeftLiberalProgressives (modern liberalism) are beginning to take their toll.
Ref Europe and "protected from immiseration and despair" -- guess you haven't been to Europe lately! Ethic Europeans have a birthrate somewhat south of 1.2 and their childless society will ultimately cause them die out.
Ref Europe and "protected from immiseration and despair" -- guess you haven't been to Europe lately! Ethic Europeans have a birthrate somewhat south of 1.2 and their childless society will ultimately cause them die out.
3
Die out? Not with all the refugees pouring in, and if they pull it off it will be time to send the Statue of Liberty back to Europe cause we don`t deserve it anymore.
1
Interesting you post this from the UK.
To American lefty liberals, Europe (including the UK) is absolute paradise on earth. Read a post a few above yours about Germany -- where even poor divorcees live in luxury, in gorgeous apartments with no need to work full time hours and get free vacations and repairs to the apartment to boot!
They are absolutely deaf to problems in Europe, like low birth rates or high taxes, or the far higher unemployment rates (*everywhere but Germany). There are whole generations of Europeans who have never worked, because there are no jobs. In some nations, the youth unemployment rate is over 25%!!!! yet to American lefties, this is paradise -- because you can just "go and live on the dole" and get free apartments, free health care, free food. Why work! it's paradise on earth, I tell you.
To American lefty liberals, Europe (including the UK) is absolute paradise on earth. Read a post a few above yours about Germany -- where even poor divorcees live in luxury, in gorgeous apartments with no need to work full time hours and get free vacations and repairs to the apartment to boot!
They are absolutely deaf to problems in Europe, like low birth rates or high taxes, or the far higher unemployment rates (*everywhere but Germany). There are whole generations of Europeans who have never worked, because there are no jobs. In some nations, the youth unemployment rate is over 25%!!!! yet to American lefties, this is paradise -- because you can just "go and live on the dole" and get free apartments, free health care, free food. Why work! it's paradise on earth, I tell you.
1
It's good of Ross to take note the work of Deaton and Case and cautiously note that the "liberal argument" about working Americans may actually have merit, but his silence on the damage that Republican politicians have inflicted on this group is telling. Conservative claims about the damaging effects of our modest social safety net to our morals and independence were never very convincing, but it's taking Douthat and David Brooks an awfully long time to criticize the GOP for its destructive policies and temper-tantrum politics.
This column should stop musing vaguely on the ghostly bogeyman of liberalism and start focusing on the concrete steps that we can take to strengthen our country. Then, I think, Ross Douthat will realize that the Republican party has become a real danger to us all.
This column should stop musing vaguely on the ghostly bogeyman of liberalism and start focusing on the concrete steps that we can take to strengthen our country. Then, I think, Ross Douthat will realize that the Republican party has become a real danger to us all.
30
The writer is perhaps the only NYT columnist who doesn't think that more dead white males is good news.
13
More importantly he's the only one who completely leaves out any reference to the policies of Reagan bush, and bush as contributing to this morass. magical thinking? yeah, that's what conservatives do.
3
This comment is racist and sexist.
1
Well, given the posts here, apparently quite a few lefty liberals are cackling with GLEE that "the awful evil redneck red state conservatives are killing themselves!" and think it is just revenge, because they refused to vote for the man/god messiah/savior Obama.
1
Or as non-whites might put it, "Welcome to our world. Pull up a chair, get comfy."
38
No thanks, we'd rather work.
1
So would they. What's your point?
2
Okay so you are talking about me. Yes I have the alcohol and the drugs and the suicidal thoughts. A college drop out now a 51 year old carpenter. I don't blame anyone but myself for not making it to the goal line. Its just that the rules have been changed so many times I can't figure out which direction to go.
43
If you enjoy carpentry, I hope you follow this path. it is incredibly difficult for homeowners to find people who care about their craft, who will do work for your home as if it was their own, who will help you figure out better solutions for what you want to create. Those who do this and who also show up on time and are respectful of working in someone else's personal space are worth a premium price.
4
b. early: Please hang in there. You have my best wishes. You live in a beautiful place. I hope you get out in nature to help you ease your worries and find peace.
3
I applaud you, Mr. Douthat, for not responding to this crisis with the usual knee-jerk party line about the need for smaller government and lower taxes on the rich.
Since you laid bare your soul (in a sense) I will tell you what really happened.
You are right that the lack of good jobs was a key component, and that blacks and Latinos handled this better since they had lower expectations. Remember, the best blue collar jobs were never as available to them as to whites.
The ideology of "free trade" caused the loss of millions of good jobs, and continues even today. This has made the elites richer and the rest poorer. Also, relatively low taxes on the rich (recall that in the 1950s the top rate was 92%) aided the distribution of income from the rest to the rich.
In sum, voluntary economic policy changes vastly increased the misery of whites, causing increased social problems for whites. Aging never comes alone, and is not pleasant. So when this unfortunate group aged, for them it was like the straw which broke the camel's back.
Since you laid bare your soul (in a sense) I will tell you what really happened.
You are right that the lack of good jobs was a key component, and that blacks and Latinos handled this better since they had lower expectations. Remember, the best blue collar jobs were never as available to them as to whites.
The ideology of "free trade" caused the loss of millions of good jobs, and continues even today. This has made the elites richer and the rest poorer. Also, relatively low taxes on the rich (recall that in the 1950s the top rate was 92%) aided the distribution of income from the rest to the rich.
In sum, voluntary economic policy changes vastly increased the misery of whites, causing increased social problems for whites. Aging never comes alone, and is not pleasant. So when this unfortunate group aged, for them it was like the straw which broke the camel's back.
39
Well said, I agree that the advent of global trade deals under Bill Clinton's presidency (NAFTA) was the beginning of the ultimate downfall of the high school educated, working class blue collar men & women who used to their hands & manpower to provide for their family & establish a middle class lifestyle. President Bush expanded & enforced global trade Agreements to open new markets for American products which resulted in a loss of over 1.9 million good paying jobs. Between 2000 & June 2008, the US lost 3.4 million manufacturing jobs & China overtook the US as the world’s largest producer of manufactured goods. Bush initiated the fast track negotiating authority for trade agreements including the Trade Act of 2002 also referred to as TPA. President Obama has followed in Bush's footsteps in 2012, authorizing renewal of the authority. Obama has supported the TPP trade deal & TPA reauthorization which was passed in June, 2015. President Obama was granted "enhanced power to negotiate major trade agreements with Asia & Europe which was a boom for Wall St. although continues to wreak havoc with disintegration of union workers across our rusting manufacturing towns across the entire US. It's too late to reverse this process as Trump continues to promise since he's part of the ruling elite that profit from international trade & he uses illegal workers to build his Trump hotels for less than minimum wage, thus exploiting labor just as the trade deals have done since NAFTA.
4
Many of the "less-educated , late-middle-aged whites " that Ross refers to are the very ones who continue to give their votes to candidates based on how much they support a God and guns agenda. Affordable health care, a living minimum wage, less income disparity, a cleaner environment, and a broader safety net never seem high on their political "wish list". When they get what they wish for with biblethumping, gun-toting politicians like Ted Cruz and their quality of life does not improve they seem clueless and despairing as to why. Prayer and a closet full of guns may bring some solace, but it doesn't put food on the table or pay the rent,
86
"Affordable health care, a living minimum wage, less income disparity, a cleaner environment, and a broader safety net".
Hmmmm, I seem to remember some unknown community organizer saying he was going to provide all of the above in, what? 2008?????
Wonder whatever happened to that guy....
Hmmmm, I seem to remember some unknown community organizer saying he was going to provide all of the above in, what? 2008?????
Wonder whatever happened to that guy....
Clearly, we need to commit this country to extending white privilege to ALL white people, regardless of income level.
11
...but only if they are in heterosexual, monogamous, conservative christian marriages.
I live in Germany and work at a professional, well paid job, but must soon return to live in one of the most expensive cities in the world. Although at home I can expect high quality healthcare, I can also expect poor quality rental accommodation, no hope of ever owning and no chance to accumulate retirement savings. I need to accumulate my entire life's wealth before the age of 50, because from that point I will be unemployable.
I worry all the time about what I'm going to do, having missed the chance to buy property when it was still affordable.
My German neighbour is a divorced woman who works part time, and who is paid very poorly. Yet she never worries about her future - she doesn't have to. She can live in high quality rental accommodation, where she has rights as a tenant, including the right to have important repairs done swiftly. Food and transport are high quality and affordable, while her health care needs are taken care of. She will have a dignified old age, because she can rely on good housing, health care and food. Hers is a balanced life where she has time for friends and family, and where she can go on vacation a couple of times a year.
Which of us is better off? Me, with my professional salary, or her, with her high quality of life? And to top it all off, Germany is not some slacker welfare state that saps initiative from its citizens. It's a dynamic economy full of well paid blue collar manufacturing jobs, and plenty of entrepreneurialism and innovation.
I worry all the time about what I'm going to do, having missed the chance to buy property when it was still affordable.
My German neighbour is a divorced woman who works part time, and who is paid very poorly. Yet she never worries about her future - she doesn't have to. She can live in high quality rental accommodation, where she has rights as a tenant, including the right to have important repairs done swiftly. Food and transport are high quality and affordable, while her health care needs are taken care of. She will have a dignified old age, because she can rely on good housing, health care and food. Hers is a balanced life where she has time for friends and family, and where she can go on vacation a couple of times a year.
Which of us is better off? Me, with my professional salary, or her, with her high quality of life? And to top it all off, Germany is not some slacker welfare state that saps initiative from its citizens. It's a dynamic economy full of well paid blue collar manufacturing jobs, and plenty of entrepreneurialism and innovation.
198
To ask the question is to answer it. At the end of the day, no one with peace of mind is going to complain that they really wished to have spent more time at the office churning out their six figure salary.
2
Nobody is forcing you to return to New York City, which is ghastly expensive and has a horrible housing situation, with rents the highest in the nation.
If you can work in GERMANY, you could also work anywhere in the USA. Look around for one of the many, many places that offer wonderful housing stock, affordable prices, much better commute times and more access to parks & nature than NYC.
A lot of Germans would probably love to own their own home, but will never get the opportunity. Also, I would not be so fast to assume every German is doing as well on social welfare as your neighbor. She may have a unique situation.
Food is more affordable in the US than almost anywhere -- we have food stamps for anyone who can't afford it even at those low prices -- we certainly have plentiful apartments and homes (outside of NYC, of course).
Lastly: the idea that "nobody in the US employed over 50" is simply ridiculous and easily debunked.
If you can work in GERMANY, you could also work anywhere in the USA. Look around for one of the many, many places that offer wonderful housing stock, affordable prices, much better commute times and more access to parks & nature than NYC.
A lot of Germans would probably love to own their own home, but will never get the opportunity. Also, I would not be so fast to assume every German is doing as well on social welfare as your neighbor. She may have a unique situation.
Food is more affordable in the US than almost anywhere -- we have food stamps for anyone who can't afford it even at those low prices -- we certainly have plentiful apartments and homes (outside of NYC, of course).
Lastly: the idea that "nobody in the US employed over 50" is simply ridiculous and easily debunked.
2
Frankly, I think that there are three reasons: Education; Education; Education. Our system has failed the working class segment of all races in not preparing them for the radical shifts in our economy. It used to be that anyone could head to the local factory for non-skilled employment. No more. In a greater sense, our system may have further failed by not properly communicating these facts of life as well as not making the training facilities available for mid-life career changes.
The jobs are there. The problem is that they are not prepared for them.
The jobs are there. The problem is that they are not prepared for them.
12
Centrist,
Nonsense. You are talking about a time when new college graduates are having a very hard time getting jobs and where young people with PHDs work as adjunct "professors" at poverty level wages which entitle them to food stamps.
Nonsense. You are talking about a time when new college graduates are having a very hard time getting jobs and where young people with PHDs work as adjunct "professors" at poverty level wages which entitle them to food stamps.
2
My thoughts after reading this: Nothing has ever "trickled down", unions are essential, cheap stuff from China has fed our dysfunction, robots are not people, mortgages and rents don't match income, junk food is a byproduct of capitalism and it kills and causes liver disease and depression too, religious institutions are money-making entities before they are shelters for the down and out, change the tax laws, fund libraries not television, talk to your neighbors
People are dying young because the elite class is hoarding billions in the face of desperation, depression, poverty, no access. A second enlightenment is needed to over throw the corrupt financial machine.
People are dying young because the elite class is hoarding billions in the face of desperation, depression, poverty, no access. A second enlightenment is needed to over throw the corrupt financial machine.
62
The less educated white class is also one that consumes high levels of processed food. This promotes poor health and obesity and earlier death. Maybe they are dying from all the subsidies the GOP tosses to industrial farming.
There has been a steep rise in homelessness in most American cities, which seems a consequence of growing mental health problems and a stark economic environment. It seems the more we self-medicate as a country, with drugs and alcohol, the deeper we sink. And there's much greater uncertainty about employment, as every sector of the economy is either disrupted or automated or off-shored.
Having strong family ties is hugely important, providing comfort and resilience. But there's no denying the American middle class is angry. The only presidential candidate who seriously understands this anger is Bernie Sanders. Not a surprise that the anti-science Republican party is totally blind.
Having strong family ties is hugely important, providing comfort and resilience. But there's no denying the American middle class is angry. The only presidential candidate who seriously understands this anger is Bernie Sanders. Not a surprise that the anti-science Republican party is totally blind.
28
The main social institution that less educated Whites have lost is a political party. The Republican Party does nothing but exploit their fears, and the Democratic Party pays much too little attention to the people on whose votes the party originally was founded. Uneducated Whites may increasingly be killing themselves, but the rate of murders by poor Whites still does not match the rate of murders by poor African Americans. What uneducated Whites need are jobs and a feeling of pride.
9
The closing paragraph is so typical of the elite mentality: Maybe A, or maybe B - or maybe some of A and some of B. Never are questions raised about the continued usefulness of capitalism in the 21st century, even though, for a thousand different reasons, that should be the first question asked in any rational discussion of contemporary socioeconomic problems.
16
Not that I know what to do about it. But I do think the working class, white or not, is the part of society that government should be most concerned about and most eager to help. I write off the lower class as comparatively hopeless. I assume the middle class can take care of itself. I think the working class, keeping it healthy, is the fulcrum for trying to improve the lives of our citizens.
I find it difficult to pin hopes on strengthening their support from religion. Government can't and shouldn't meddle there. It is impossible to try to 'engineer morality', in ay way, although perhaps policies that support families with children might be useful.
What government can do, is try to develop a jobs program, and put policies in place that provide medium skilled jobs. A job stabilizes lives in predictable ways. Infrastructure repair and development could provide jobs. Jobs would work better than transfer payments to support the working class and cost the same. That's the way to go.
I find it difficult to pin hopes on strengthening their support from religion. Government can't and shouldn't meddle there. It is impossible to try to 'engineer morality', in ay way, although perhaps policies that support families with children might be useful.
What government can do, is try to develop a jobs program, and put policies in place that provide medium skilled jobs. A job stabilizes lives in predictable ways. Infrastructure repair and development could provide jobs. Jobs would work better than transfer payments to support the working class and cost the same. That's the way to go.
9
Only the 1% are not in the "working class". Mistake number one is thinking a white collar/professional job means you are not part of the working class. If your lifestyle - no matter the level - would change for the worse were you to lose your job, you ARE a member of the working class.
3
I think that the data are quite clear: white Americans with only high school educations are foundering, and the results have been deadly. My guess is that the cause lies in an economy that has rapidly shed blue collar jobs and economic security. As for the specter of moral collapse posited by Douthat, my response would be that economic privation undercuts family values. Family cohesion is enhanced by economic stability.
25
Bravo for reading correctly! You avoided the mistake that many commenters here made: The study talked about MIDDLE AGED white Americans with HS degrees or less, not "Middle Class."
2
That is a reasonable theory -- but just a theory. The study shows just results. It can't show what people are thinking in their own minds, and it does not do personal stories showing which of the people in the study are dying because they killed themselves when their job was off-shored -- vs. the people who are just druggies and drinkers, no matter what.
1
I'll bet the largest chunk of those new deaths are suicides, namely suicides with guns. Other attempts as suicide usually fail, while suicide by gun is almost always successful. The proliferation of guns in the homes makes a big difference.
26
Ross,
This is depressing stuff. Unfortunately middle aged men were hit very hard by the Great Contraction. It was not just the men alone but men with teenage and college age children who were terminated as the job hemorrhaging economy. Once laid off, not many of the millions were able to regain the same compensation or position in the economy and their communities. I know because I have sons with families, who lost jobs and homes in their late 40's never to recover. This is the lost generation that Paul Krugman has called out. The tepid recovery has been in lower wage, part-time employment in the service sectors. The big one as this latest set of stats show was the healthcare service sector and at my age of 78 and still working (I am lucky because I feel responsible for my wife and refuse to give up and daily try to put in my 2 cents in comments to the Times on policy. Our system failed our formed households putting most of them under intolerable stress. Meanwhile wages have been stagnant and new elites don't appear to give a damned about this lost generation. No decent society would have allowed mortgage foreclosures on primary dwellings during the Great Contraction. At a minimum, every man with family should have been given a government job, in uniform, law enforcement, teaching, public health and VA clinics. We have been and continue to be stupid, short-sighted, and self-absorbed about how to distribute work and income and make life better FOR ALL.
This is depressing stuff. Unfortunately middle aged men were hit very hard by the Great Contraction. It was not just the men alone but men with teenage and college age children who were terminated as the job hemorrhaging economy. Once laid off, not many of the millions were able to regain the same compensation or position in the economy and their communities. I know because I have sons with families, who lost jobs and homes in their late 40's never to recover. This is the lost generation that Paul Krugman has called out. The tepid recovery has been in lower wage, part-time employment in the service sectors. The big one as this latest set of stats show was the healthcare service sector and at my age of 78 and still working (I am lucky because I feel responsible for my wife and refuse to give up and daily try to put in my 2 cents in comments to the Times on policy. Our system failed our formed households putting most of them under intolerable stress. Meanwhile wages have been stagnant and new elites don't appear to give a damned about this lost generation. No decent society would have allowed mortgage foreclosures on primary dwellings during the Great Contraction. At a minimum, every man with family should have been given a government job, in uniform, law enforcement, teaching, public health and VA clinics. We have been and continue to be stupid, short-sighted, and self-absorbed about how to distribute work and income and make life better FOR ALL.
71
Beware of Nobel laureates. Linus Pauling told us that massive quantities of Vitamin C would cure the common cold. Tim Hunt told us that the problem with women scientists was that they cried too much when criticized. And António Egas Moniz received the Nobel Prize for his development of the prefrontal lobotomy. The research here is ground breaking. It is based on a set of data that was not collected by Mr. Deaton. All sources note Mr. Deaton is a Nobel laureate, suggesting that his conclusions are beyond question. Not true. Not true.
7
"The Dying of the Whites"
The problem is much bigger. All capitalist countries have diminishing native populations. Economic growth is maintained by imported third world workers.
Men and women do not want to have babies in capitalist countries. Within a generation, immigrants also stop having babies.
Capitalism is a genocide machine.
The problem is much bigger. All capitalist countries have diminishing native populations. Economic growth is maintained by imported third world workers.
Men and women do not want to have babies in capitalist countries. Within a generation, immigrants also stop having babies.
Capitalism is a genocide machine.
17
Sir,,,,, with a statement like that you are the problem in your way of thinking.... look objectively at issues you have and try and accept what made this country great...... it sure was not the ideology of the far left.... or the thinking of our current WH whose social stripes have brought us into and I am sorry to say this, economic chaos, along with distortion, deceit, divisiveness and last but not least A DELUSIONAL surrounding that by far exceeds the realm of REALITY
Thanks for this write up Ross. It is studies like these, that confound you, the public and researchers themselves, that require "qualitative research, accompanying quantitative data". This is something I have been screaming about for the last twenty years. It is especially needed in "health care, public health, sociology and social work" research. Without the context in which the quantitative data is emerging or acting we would not know the accurate or trustworthy reasons behind such hidden mortality statistics.
I wish one of you guys would do some education for your readers on "the importance of funding qualitative studies in medical research, social research and exploratory and explanatory studies, where reasons-for-a-problem help us figure out the best course of interventions to improve conditions or eliminate the problem itself".
So few understand the importance of qualitative research on these kinds of studies which would provide an accurate context for quantitative data.
Dr.MS
I wish one of you guys would do some education for your readers on "the importance of funding qualitative studies in medical research, social research and exploratory and explanatory studies, where reasons-for-a-problem help us figure out the best course of interventions to improve conditions or eliminate the problem itself".
So few understand the importance of qualitative research on these kinds of studies which would provide an accurate context for quantitative data.
Dr.MS
10
You nailed it Dr. Schaeffer.
Cut away all the socio speak and apparently Douhat's conclusion is that working and lower middle class whites are cry babies who once the prop of religion has been removed lapse into self destructive behavior. Since the trend first appeared in the late 90's which was a time of considerable economic expansion and optimism one has to be a bit skeptical that the causes are purely economic. They probably have much more to do with deeply embedded aspects of American social behavior and structures. The obsession with guns and violence, dietary choices (American obesity levels are three times those of France), the absence of universal healthcare, the prevalence of divorce, available disposable income for opiates, the ubiquity of litigation, the well known American predilection for narcissism, etc.
23
Among your other fallacies here: the obesity rate in France is 42% (among adults)....and rising! In the US, it is 66% and peaked a decade ago. There is evidence it is falling slightly. It has fallen a great deal among minor children in the US.
How you got 300% out of a 24% gap is a mystery to me. Also, the French smoke in much higher numbers -- when Americans all smoked, they were also thinner. Quel Surprise!
BTW: this study controlled for obesity rates, and they are NOT CORRELATED with the death rates at all. It would help if you actually READ the article before jumping to your lefty liberal conclusions.
How you got 300% out of a 24% gap is a mystery to me. Also, the French smoke in much higher numbers -- when Americans all smoked, they were also thinner. Quel Surprise!
BTW: this study controlled for obesity rates, and they are NOT CORRELATED with the death rates at all. It would help if you actually READ the article before jumping to your lefty liberal conclusions.
1
One explanatory factor might be gun ownership. While I don't have statistics in hand, I'm guessing white working class males own more guns than blacks, hispanics, or Europeans. And while the rough economy (and frayed social net) might cause these met to attempt suicide, guns make that attempt much more likely to be successful.
15
Poor whites are doing worse than before. They have turned to drugs and even suicide. Why? Let me suggest some additional reasons for this that are not being mentioned enough.
We now live in a global economy. Competition from poorer nations means that jobs requiring few skills are being done by poor people around the world who now compete directly with poor Americans. This is not the fault of either party.
Wages have been held down in the US by the presence of millions of immigrants who are willing to work hard for less money. This is the fault of both parties.
Poor white parents have provided their children less family stability, less religious training, and even less help with their education than better educated white parents. This is not the fault of either party.
For years and years less intelligent white persons have had more children than the more intelligent white persons. This is not the fault of either party.
Economies evolve, nations evolve, cultures evolve. There is no one solution for all this. We need to try whatever we can to give families stability, purpose, and the knowledge that education is terribly important.
We now live in a global economy. Competition from poorer nations means that jobs requiring few skills are being done by poor people around the world who now compete directly with poor Americans. This is not the fault of either party.
Wages have been held down in the US by the presence of millions of immigrants who are willing to work hard for less money. This is the fault of both parties.
Poor white parents have provided their children less family stability, less religious training, and even less help with their education than better educated white parents. This is not the fault of either party.
For years and years less intelligent white persons have had more children than the more intelligent white persons. This is not the fault of either party.
Economies evolve, nations evolve, cultures evolve. There is no one solution for all this. We need to try whatever we can to give families stability, purpose, and the knowledge that education is terribly important.
11
Perhaps we should stop trying to prepare our children for the "jobs of tomorrow" and instead prepare them on how to be the jobless of tomorrow. Teaching and testing for jobs that won't exist just creates unnecessary expectations among the hoi polloi.
15
Mr. Douthat, you can analyze this ad nauseam, but the answer is cosmic in nature and it lies at the feet of the winner of the 2008 presidential election. In that most unlikely instant, the Universe sent Lady Justice to present a due-bill to racist white America, based on the accumulated crimes committed, since slavery to the present day, on the black race. It is straight out of Poe's The Masque of the Red Death, or the slaying of Egypt's first born in Exodus. That is why it is only affecting less-educated whites in this country.
Don't scoff. Less-educated whites thought the sight of a black president in their lifetime's was an impossibility. But it heralded their demise. Less-educated whites, with much help from the Republican Party, tried their best to remove the usurper, to wear him down, to embarrass him, to block his every move, but Lady Justice said this is the beginning of your end. The only statistics that carry relevance are of the atrocities traced back to the Original Sin of slavery. A grim tally sheet that has to be redressed.
I'm an older white guy who has heard downtrodden black Americans say many times, "What goes around, comes around." That's Lady Justice coming around, carrying a Louisville Slugger. She always bats last. And she bats a thousand.
Don't scoff. Less-educated whites thought the sight of a black president in their lifetime's was an impossibility. But it heralded their demise. Less-educated whites, with much help from the Republican Party, tried their best to remove the usurper, to wear him down, to embarrass him, to block his every move, but Lady Justice said this is the beginning of your end. The only statistics that carry relevance are of the atrocities traced back to the Original Sin of slavery. A grim tally sheet that has to be redressed.
I'm an older white guy who has heard downtrodden black Americans say many times, "What goes around, comes around." That's Lady Justice coming around, carrying a Louisville Slugger. She always bats last. And she bats a thousand.
65
That is psycho talk. I am white and I carry no guilt over what people who may look somewhat like me, but whom I never met and am not related to, may have done to others decades ago. I don't like Obama, never have and never will, and for good reason. But his election doesn't disturb me, or make me feel like I am "losing", or matter much to me in the end, because the destruction he brought to the country will be reversed and repaired. I am happy who I am, who my ancestors were, and who my descendants will be. Your comment seems to suggest you believe in collective guilt based on race and that cosmic forces will punish sons for the sins of their fathers. Life doesn't work that way.
This has a lot more to do with fostering policies that do not help those lower on the totem pole, and then ultimately being shaken down by the capitalist system, erosion of jobs, health, lack of a step up/support for further education or re-education, and yes, along with lower incomes, health, disappointment, and discouragement, how difficult it is to find religions, institutions, and people saying "yes, we must have a cultural revolution, for the people and the environment, and you can be part of that." We also need to see how the whole current set-up is profiting the 1% at the expense of everything and everyone else.
2
That is borderline insane.
First off, the study goes back YEARS. The increase in death rates begins to spike dramatically in 1997 and 1998 -- we need to be asking "what happened in the late 90s that may be related to this rise?"
It did not start when Obama was elected, so it has nothing to do with him or his Presidency, let alone his race.
BTW: blacks have a much higher overall death rate at younger ages than whites, even with this surge. Are they also paying some karmic price to Lady Justice????
Probably the craziest and most disturbing thing in your post: that you do not believe it is possible to oppose a POTUS on his policies and his results, if he is black, because a black POTUS is ENTITLED to a complete pass on everything -- or you are a racist for mentioning his failures.
First off, the study goes back YEARS. The increase in death rates begins to spike dramatically in 1997 and 1998 -- we need to be asking "what happened in the late 90s that may be related to this rise?"
It did not start when Obama was elected, so it has nothing to do with him or his Presidency, let alone his race.
BTW: blacks have a much higher overall death rate at younger ages than whites, even with this surge. Are they also paying some karmic price to Lady Justice????
Probably the craziest and most disturbing thing in your post: that you do not believe it is possible to oppose a POTUS on his policies and his results, if he is black, because a black POTUS is ENTITLED to a complete pass on everything -- or you are a racist for mentioning his failures.
2
Note the subtle sexism :
"...a new paper from the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton and his wife, Anne Case."
Given that Ms. Case is the first author of the paper, a more accurate description would be "a new paper from Anne Case and her husband, the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton. "
"...a new paper from the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton and his wife, Anne Case."
Given that Ms. Case is the first author of the paper, a more accurate description would be "a new paper from Anne Case and her husband, the Nobel laureate Angus Deaton. "
156
wow!!!, thanks for pointing that out, i totally missed that
3
Julie,
I just submitted a similar comment. If we say it enough maybe something will change. Thanks
I just submitted a similar comment. If we say it enough maybe something will change. Thanks
2
You are absolutely correct! I hope you don't mind if I quote you (with credit, of course).
2
I look forward to reading more studies of the causes of this tragedy.
I wonder if its because we white males never expected to be amongst societies "losers". More so than any other nation, the US seems to break people down into un-worthy "losers" to be scorned and worthy "winners" to be celebrated. Losers are losers because they lack the right stuff. Reagan said this pretty simply. Some of us are losers finding the world covered with manure. Others are winners believing they've found the seam that leads to the pony of gold. Some of my fellow middle aged whites are looking back - never having been able to afford a house - never having had a steady job - never having had the kind of stability that families would need - and realizing that they seem to fit their own definition of nothing having losers.
In Europe, every French man, Pole, or German is celebrated as a valuable French-man, Pole, or German. No one is "unworthy". Some are unlucky. But, the unlucky being valued and worthy, are supported.
Or, maybe Charles Murray is right. Losers wouldn't be losers if winners lived on the same block, showing the losers how to behave.
I wonder if its because we white males never expected to be amongst societies "losers". More so than any other nation, the US seems to break people down into un-worthy "losers" to be scorned and worthy "winners" to be celebrated. Losers are losers because they lack the right stuff. Reagan said this pretty simply. Some of us are losers finding the world covered with manure. Others are winners believing they've found the seam that leads to the pony of gold. Some of my fellow middle aged whites are looking back - never having been able to afford a house - never having had a steady job - never having had the kind of stability that families would need - and realizing that they seem to fit their own definition of nothing having losers.
In Europe, every French man, Pole, or German is celebrated as a valuable French-man, Pole, or German. No one is "unworthy". Some are unlucky. But, the unlucky being valued and worthy, are supported.
Or, maybe Charles Murray is right. Losers wouldn't be losers if winners lived on the same block, showing the losers how to behave.
213
Well, at least we know how YOU feel about working class white people who are your fellow citizens -- LOSERS.
However, nothing in the study said that these people were losers -- that they were unemployed -- or that they were on disability. It just said they had high rates of death, and the 3 top causes were drugs, alcohol and suicide.
For all we know, those people were working at good paying jobs with health insurance, and had stable families, but were simply depressed.
However, nothing in the study said that these people were losers -- that they were unemployed -- or that they were on disability. It just said they had high rates of death, and the 3 top causes were drugs, alcohol and suicide.
For all we know, those people were working at good paying jobs with health insurance, and had stable families, but were simply depressed.
1
Whites never believed that they could end up like "those people". And so they voted against their own best self interest. They voted for those who destroyed the protections of good paying labor. And reality, just like in Election Night 2012, came knocking. This is ultimately the malignant, insidious and pernicious legacy of Ronald Reagan and his heirs. Rather ironic, is it not?
169
Agreed! But this well precedes Ronnie Reagan and goes back to the "discovery" of this great land and the "laws" enacted by our "founding fathers." The bitter truth is biting America in the butt. Ouch! All lives do matter and to achieve real change, we must enact fair and equitable laws/policies that benefit all living in this country -- not just a select few.
I just wish Ross would live the life of an unfortunate struggling for one day. If that would not correct his sense of reality, then I do not know what.
Folks, look, the ivory tower, visible at the NYT at the courtesy of Mr. Douthat and Mr. Brooks.
Enjoy.
Folks, look, the ivory tower, visible at the NYT at the courtesy of Mr. Douthat and Mr. Brooks.
Enjoy.
19
Both disgusting Republican apologists who look for any explanation for our nations problems but the obvious one: 40 years of Republican policies designed to transfer money from the poor and middle classes to the GOP's one percent puppet masters. Getting rid of the Republican Party and its obstructionist, seditionist, and treasonous leadership is the first prerequisite to repairing and restoring what's left, if anything is left, of the American Dream.
3
What happened to " white privilege "? Does this mean that whites have it just as difficult as everyone else and that their well being matters just as much as everyone else? Charles Blow ... any comments?
13
Ooops... I thought this was a Ross Douthat article? Besides, the article is about poor whites. Who said they had it easy?
1
The "privilege" no longer extends to a good paying, stable job. To corporations, labor is simply another resource that can be gotten cheaper somewhere else. Even the tech industry - the savior - look at H1B visas. Those "good" jobs that were around - even in the vaunted "right to work" states are pretty much gone now. Those that come back want you to work at $15/20 per hour about $7.00/hour in 1980. We're all in this together. White privilege is real, but it doesn't make the mortgage payments.
1
"dependence and disability payments that only encourage drug abuse"
It has been shown that welfare recipients actually use drugs at the same or lower rates than the general population. Why is this lie being published in the New York Times?
It has been shown that welfare recipients actually use drugs at the same or lower rates than the general population. Why is this lie being published in the New York Times?
69
He was stating it as a viewpoint, not a fact. Being a conservative viewpoint it is, unsurprisingly, fact-free.
3
"But in an era of stagnating wages, family breakdown, and social dislocation, this logic no longer seems to make as much sense. The result is a mounting feeling of what the American Conservative’s Rod Dreher calls white “dispossession” — a sense of promises broken, a feeling that what you were supposed to have has been denied to you. (The Donald Trump phenomenon, Dreher notes, feeds off precisely this anxiety.)"
Allow me to restate more concisely:
"And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
Allow me to restate more concisely:
"And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
34
".....to make some of the unhappiest white lives feel like they matter once again."
It's good to see that we have fast come full circle on the argument that all lives matter - not just black or white lives.
It's good to see that we have fast come full circle on the argument that all lives matter - not just black or white lives.
6
So the poor whites die from drug use and suicide not because they can't get the decent jobs their fathers had at decent wages but because they're not religious enough or conservative enough. Oy, god spare me this nonsense. If they just went to church and railed against the government, they'd be fine, I guess.
52
Well, religion usually stirs hatreds, which starts wars, which fund the economy and promotes jobs. You see, religion is the answer.
2
You have utterly misrepresented what Douthat has said here.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to misstating someone's words.
He said that having religion and strong families would be a strength that people could rely on to get them through "hard times". Without those strong ties, people are alone and isolated. It is not about any one religion, but the lack of COMMUNITY.
BTW: there is not one decent idea on THE LEFT or THE RIGHT about how to bring back our lost manufacturing jobs. NOT ONE IDEA.
You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to misstating someone's words.
He said that having religion and strong families would be a strength that people could rely on to get them through "hard times". Without those strong ties, people are alone and isolated. It is not about any one religion, but the lack of COMMUNITY.
BTW: there is not one decent idea on THE LEFT or THE RIGHT about how to bring back our lost manufacturing jobs. NOT ONE IDEA.
As a black person in america all i can say to whites is don't let anyone convince you that disfunction is something that you could or should ever settle with becuse it will eat at your very soul. There is i feel a concerted effort being made to convince us that the disfunction that haunts our lives is somehow tolerable even some new standard of a normal and acceptable life. This is psychological poison, if you are broken emotionally, you are broken! it is not ok you can't go on the with pain you should not accept it as normal. Acceptance of disfunction as normality is one of the primary factors perpetuating a vicious ghetto culture that has brought terrible devestation to black, hispanic and aboriginal communities all across america and overseas.
I've seen it every day of my life, I live in the "hood" most people are striving even against difficult odds here but there are many who have lost there minds to ignorance and self hate they tear apart there own communites with over the top nihilism. The powers that perpetuate this social crises be they economic or political must be confronted not coped with coping is death.
I've seen it every day of my life, I live in the "hood" most people are striving even against difficult odds here but there are many who have lost there minds to ignorance and self hate they tear apart there own communites with over the top nihilism. The powers that perpetuate this social crises be they economic or political must be confronted not coped with coping is death.
75
Thank you!
2
The factor not mentioned that contributes to White despair and mortality by suicide and drugs is loss of White male privilege. Until recently no matter how bad things were at least a White man would be better off than Blacks and Hispanics and women. That's not gone yet, but it is progressing and continued loss of advantage is inevitable. Very depressing for many.
The solution is to address the economic issues (minimum wage, unions, health care, family leave, day care, education, retirement security...) and to make common cause with those currently resented. Don't fall for divide and conquer. Focus on the real oppressors. Prescribing religion, faith, family and community instead is a diversion and, in effect, blaming the victim.
The solution is to address the economic issues (minimum wage, unions, health care, family leave, day care, education, retirement security...) and to make common cause with those currently resented. Don't fall for divide and conquer. Focus on the real oppressors. Prescribing religion, faith, family and community instead is a diversion and, in effect, blaming the victim.
33
Uh, except the study shows identical rates among women. And blacks and hispanics have higher overall rates, just not rising as fast (they have probably just topped out).
EPIC FAIL.
EPIC FAIL.
Less-educated, late-middle-aged whites are dying at higher rates now because they not only have all the economic stresses, but they have the added pain of having conservative hate-mongers telling them that they're losing their privileged position of control in American society.
If you're a less-well-educated, aging white person, and you know you really haven't got much to show for yourself - and now you don't even have anything to lord over the black and the brown people you used to feel superior to-----then what's left to live for?
If you're a less-well-educated, aging white person, and you know you really haven't got much to show for yourself - and now you don't even have anything to lord over the black and the brown people you used to feel superior to-----then what's left to live for?
24
Seriously? You interpret increased white mortality rate with liberalism? How about trying to get out of your demagoguery for just a moment and realize that in those years and entire class of people lost jobs that were shipped overseas because of deregulatory policies; that in those years pensions were dropped beginning with Reagan and replaced with the riskier 401K -- forcing people to put their retirements in the unethical and immoral stock market -- a gambler's sandbox; that in those years the refusal to regulate the healthcare industry bankrupted thousands, killed others, and has now made healthcare nearly an impossible thing... (hint: the mortality rate will keep rising unless costs are regulated by law); that as jobs go to far away lands, and money is deposited in foreign accounts, neither the money or the sense of purpose that the middle class depended on has left for good... and you think it's about marriage and family? The facts don't really support it. You sacrifice complexity for the simple answer... something that fits your ideology instead of the facts.
The original story accompanying the release of this report was way more factual than yours will ever be.
In every other developed country, by the way, the mortality rate among all people have decreased... nice of you to keep that point out but make it seem like its only decreasing for non-white folks. Your racism escaped a little there.
Thanks for your opinion, though.
The original story accompanying the release of this report was way more factual than yours will ever be.
In every other developed country, by the way, the mortality rate among all people have decreased... nice of you to keep that point out but make it seem like its only decreasing for non-white folks. Your racism escaped a little there.
Thanks for your opinion, though.
64
I think both the Democrats and Republicans are responsible for the rotten country we live in. Both support globalization, both supported the idea that this was becoming a service economy and that the factories could close. That is certainly a death knell for less educated white men.
I see nothing from either party by hand-wringing and lies.
I see nothing from either party by hand-wringing and lies.
13
I have traveled some "rotten" countries-- Ecuador, Dominican Republic, Yemen.
If you , Jerry, find Minnesota "rotten," you may be just too precious for this world.
If you , Jerry, find Minnesota "rotten," you may be just too precious for this world.
1
Sorry, this new study is not "the latest ideological Rorschach test". Unless you want it to be that. Unless, that is, you want to force it, like everything else, Mr. Douthat, into that airless, stifling world in which everything that comes along proves, once again, you and your buddies are right while, maybe, the rest of society has some vague, largely unprovable points, too.
The study in question is too new, too groundbreaking to use to draw big conclusions, especially crass political ones. We can, however, look at some things that have changed over the last generation:
1. Lack of real wage increases.
2. High stress brought about the the "credit card" society where people expect to get anything they want, worry about payments later. Almost HALF of the people in the southern states have at least one account in debt collection.
3. Changing roles of men and women, creating adjustment problems for both, leading to many divorces. Plus, the idea of divorce as the "easy way out".
4. The freezing out of the non-college educated from rising to higher pay and responsibilities. If the degree is the only entry point, millions are confined to lower paying jobs for life.
5. Increased mobility across the nation, separating people from family, childhood friends and support systems. People who are alone often feel more overwhelmed by problems.
6. Decreasing social interaction while people devote more time to computers and smartphones. No one needs anyone in the connected world.
The study in question is too new, too groundbreaking to use to draw big conclusions, especially crass political ones. We can, however, look at some things that have changed over the last generation:
1. Lack of real wage increases.
2. High stress brought about the the "credit card" society where people expect to get anything they want, worry about payments later. Almost HALF of the people in the southern states have at least one account in debt collection.
3. Changing roles of men and women, creating adjustment problems for both, leading to many divorces. Plus, the idea of divorce as the "easy way out".
4. The freezing out of the non-college educated from rising to higher pay and responsibilities. If the degree is the only entry point, millions are confined to lower paying jobs for life.
5. Increased mobility across the nation, separating people from family, childhood friends and support systems. People who are alone often feel more overwhelmed by problems.
6. Decreasing social interaction while people devote more time to computers and smartphones. No one needs anyone in the connected world.
18
I agree with most of these, Doug -- but these things also apply to middle class households. And even the upper middle class. Only the very wealthiest 4% of population really has gotten "escape velocity" to not suffer from the effects of things like zero interest on savings, no real raises for years, off-shoring of good jobs and so on.
Especially No.3 and No.4 are superb points, ignored by most. "No-Fault" divorce laws have been a ghastly failure for society (though some INDIVIDUALS have benefited). It has plunged tens of millions of women and their children into poverty. Yet these laws were promoted and enacted by lefty-liberals, with the promise that it would result in greater personal happiness!!! Instead, it has resulted in misery, poverty and broken families.
No.4 -- absolutely true. Tens of millions of skilled mature workers are locked out of the economy because they can't produce a "degree" -- never mind 20+ years of real, hands-on experience in their field. This is a devastating tragedy for people who worked their way up, often from poor or lower-class families, for several decades until the economic crisis of 2008-now. Even worse, companies who have 300 applicants for every lousy job, can be insanely picky -- they can demand a degree for even a menial job.
This has forced millions into those awful for-profit colleges that drive many into debt, with no degree at the end or a worthless piece of paper. They constantly show insidious commercials on late night TV, too.
Especially No.3 and No.4 are superb points, ignored by most. "No-Fault" divorce laws have been a ghastly failure for society (though some INDIVIDUALS have benefited). It has plunged tens of millions of women and their children into poverty. Yet these laws were promoted and enacted by lefty-liberals, with the promise that it would result in greater personal happiness!!! Instead, it has resulted in misery, poverty and broken families.
No.4 -- absolutely true. Tens of millions of skilled mature workers are locked out of the economy because they can't produce a "degree" -- never mind 20+ years of real, hands-on experience in their field. This is a devastating tragedy for people who worked their way up, often from poor or lower-class families, for several decades until the economic crisis of 2008-now. Even worse, companies who have 300 applicants for every lousy job, can be insanely picky -- they can demand a degree for even a menial job.
This has forced millions into those awful for-profit colleges that drive many into debt, with no degree at the end or a worthless piece of paper. They constantly show insidious commercials on late night TV, too.
3
Not an explicit (or even barely an implicit) acknowledgement here by Mr. Douthat that the rush by corporate America, aided and abetted by both political parties, to offshore thousands of good-paying factory jobs that blue collar whites used to depend upon could have anything to do with this rise in mortality is striking, though not unexpected. Douthat's class has long argued that the free, unrestricted movement of capital to cheap labor places like China and India would benefit Americans in the long run, but, as John Maynard Keynes once famously pointed out, in the long run we are all dead. The tragedy here is that many of us are now actually dying in the short run as well.
33
social network and relevance is absent in the USA. neighbors avoid eye contact and no communication, not even a simple hello. default state of mind for most americans as they step out of their homes is to be on guard, defensive, even cold to others living right next doors. contrast this with many asian countries, especially india, where there are people on the streets, an evening walk outside brings you in close quarters with other living breathing humans, neighbors are bound to knock on your door and invite you on certain annual occasions, friendships are formed, and overall people feel a sense of belonging, and less depressed.
9
I think this hits the nail on the head.
1
Mr. Douthat seems to believe that in America blacks and hispanics have white neighbors. Maybe they do on the planet that he inhabits, but on this, at least in the infinitely stratified place between Mexico and Canada it´s a distinct rarity.
9
"Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
In this passage, Douthat commits an intellectual fallacy that is common in our country. He thinks about burgeoning but insidious threats as if they were chronic problems. Inequality is not an unchanging burden to which communities become accustomed. Inequality is growing; its effects are getting worse. If the trend is not reversed, the "resilience" of our working class communities will matter less and less as the ranks of the poor continue to swell.
The same passage also reflects a moral fallacy, namely the notion that it is somehow acceptable for the working class to struggle in the shadow of an ever worsening elite neglect.
In this passage, Douthat commits an intellectual fallacy that is common in our country. He thinks about burgeoning but insidious threats as if they were chronic problems. Inequality is not an unchanging burden to which communities become accustomed. Inequality is growing; its effects are getting worse. If the trend is not reversed, the "resilience" of our working class communities will matter less and less as the ranks of the poor continue to swell.
The same passage also reflects a moral fallacy, namely the notion that it is somehow acceptable for the working class to struggle in the shadow of an ever worsening elite neglect.
24
The results of inequality aren't going to be pretty for the 1%, either. But they (like Douthat) always think they'll be immune.
3
On the wage stagnation driving mortality rates premise, and on wage stagnation in general - is no one making the connection between the Flat and sometimes declining wage scale (1/1/09 median income is higher than today) and the waves of humanity crossing the southern border (very often illegally) who are willing to work for a few dollars an hour? Often under the table? It was bound to spread it's impact over all wage earners eventually. The massive spike in illegal entry since 2012 will only exacerbate this crisis even further.
I would also add that the mortality rates will only worsen as we move forward... this will be an unintended side effect of Obamacare... policies on the exchanges have not only absird high premiums, but even more absird high deductibles. A working age person of mode re ate means will hold off on seeking treatment of any kind, knowing full well that he will come no where near meeting his several thousand dollar deductible. I'm doing alright, but as a 33 year old man on one of the accursed exchanges I know I will not meet my personal $2900 deductible unless I have some catastrophic problem. While obamacare may provide "top notch comprehensive health insurance", it also has the unfortunate unintended consequence of depriving the newly insured of any and all professional healthcare they had been accustomed to receiving... How many stage 1 cancers will be missed because of this I cannot say
I would also add that the mortality rates will only worsen as we move forward... this will be an unintended side effect of Obamacare... policies on the exchanges have not only absird high premiums, but even more absird high deductibles. A working age person of mode re ate means will hold off on seeking treatment of any kind, knowing full well that he will come no where near meeting his several thousand dollar deductible. I'm doing alright, but as a 33 year old man on one of the accursed exchanges I know I will not meet my personal $2900 deductible unless I have some catastrophic problem. While obamacare may provide "top notch comprehensive health insurance", it also has the unfortunate unintended consequence of depriving the newly insured of any and all professional healthcare they had been accustomed to receiving... How many stage 1 cancers will be missed because of this I cannot say
6
If 'Obamacare' is so bad then vote Republican and you'll have really expensive 'private health insurance or, more likely, no insurance (just a 'healthcare savings account') and all your problems will be solved.
2
Thank you for saying that Obamacare is a horrible failure, whose shortcomings fall the most on the least affluent working class Americans.
However: it only started in 2014. And this study ENDS in 2014. So it cannot be including Obamacare.
Will the failures of Obamacare make this situation (higher death rates for the working class) WORSE? yes it will.
However: it only started in 2014. And this study ENDS in 2014. So it cannot be including Obamacare.
Will the failures of Obamacare make this situation (higher death rates for the working class) WORSE? yes it will.
It would be interesting to learn what radio programs and what TV stations and what bogs, if any, those who commit suicide listen to, view and read.
18
Undoubtedly it is the NYT, PBS, NPR and MSNBC.com.
blah, blah, blah. Poverty kills, are whites just finding that out? It has been killing African-Americans and Latinos for years. College graduates who happen to be people of color continue to not get hired because the jobs have to go to whites first, even if they are not as qualified. Look at the people repairing the roads, almost all are white men. These road jobs are good jobs that require very little education and have replaced the manufacturing jobs. If you look at the people with these excellent road jobs, you won't even see many white women. The road repair jobs are all going to white males. Whites may not have manufacturing jobs, but they do have the road repair jobs, which are now year round. The problem is, we are all paying our taxes to keep these white, non-degree men working. If whites are just learning that they never had a right to the best jobs, they need to get over it. Whites must now compete for jobs. There have been attempts to hide the facts, but there have always been more white homes without fathers because there have always been more whites. In the 60s, more whites received welfare. Those whites who chose drugs, alcohol or suicide, have made a life choice. The answer might be get a job on road repair or work more than one job.
7
Anecdotal observations do make for statistics. In my area, where the infrastructure is crumbling (versus 'make-work for white men'), the number women and minorities visible working on roads is representative of the population.
Your arguments re: white homes without fathers & whites receiving welfare may be correct by number but not proportion.
Your arguments re: white homes without fathers & whites receiving welfare may be correct by number but not proportion.
The road crews I see are almost all Latino. Are you conflating Latino with White?
3
Some people can't just up and choose faith, as if they were picking out a new suit. Some see no evidence whatsoever for this "God," and sees churches and churchgoers acting badly -- even with evil -- in whom they judge, whom they exclude, whom they hate, whom they molest. Some people want no part of any of that, and this isn't a trend likely to reverse anytime soon.
17
Here in WV, one of the whitest states in the country, we have seen dramatic increases in the prevalence of usage oof amphetamines, prescription opiates and eventually heroin addiction.
Two major factors are the intense marketing and black market availability of these drugs (this is where oxycontin comes from) and drug company incentivation of, and incredibly lax regulation of, physicians' prescribing practices.
I also wonder if perhaps the racial disparities in this new epidemic are a function of physicians' greater unwillingness to prescribe some of these addictive substances to Blacks, who are generally regarded as more likely to be "drug seeking" as opposed to Whites.
One thing I do know is that while the relatively recent term "pain clinic" has become popular the term "Appalachia", which had almost disappeared from common usage, seems to be re-emerging.
Two major factors are the intense marketing and black market availability of these drugs (this is where oxycontin comes from) and drug company incentivation of, and incredibly lax regulation of, physicians' prescribing practices.
I also wonder if perhaps the racial disparities in this new epidemic are a function of physicians' greater unwillingness to prescribe some of these addictive substances to Blacks, who are generally regarded as more likely to be "drug seeking" as opposed to Whites.
One thing I do know is that while the relatively recent term "pain clinic" has become popular the term "Appalachia", which had almost disappeared from common usage, seems to be re-emerging.
13
brilliant
1
Hard times & decline are relative to what you are used to. Many long term street people for instance disdain shelters, while I have read that when the stock market crashed in the 20s some rich men jumped out of windows of tall buildings, landing sometimes (and ironically) no doubt near the career homeless. The educated young supplant the less educated middle aged, minorities have improved their lot in America.
We've all noticed a lot of complaining out of middle aged whites since Obama was elected and rights for women & others continually expanded. How you react change is largely a matter of attitude.
We've all noticed a lot of complaining out of middle aged whites since Obama was elected and rights for women & others continually expanded. How you react change is largely a matter of attitude.
2
The Straight Dope and Snopes.com may have something to tell you about people jumping out of windows in the 1920's. More fiction than fact. Using these urban legends to illustrate a point calls your entire argument into question.
" ... I have read that when the stock market crashed in the 20s some rich men jumped out of windows of tall buildings ... "
We've all read this, just as we've all read that soldiers returning from Vietnam were spit on. There is no evidence to support these myths - none.
We've all read this, just as we've all read that soldiers returning from Vietnam were spit on. There is no evidence to support these myths - none.
4
LOL, what rights for women has Obama "expanded"? I'm a woman, and I've seen absolutely nothing.
Also: you are inferring the death rates are only among white lower-class MEN. In fact the study shows higher death rates for both sexes.
Also: you are inferring the death rates are only among white lower-class MEN. In fact the study shows higher death rates for both sexes.
1
Mr. Douthat reaches a new low with the suggestion of, in effect, 'if you expect less, you will not be disappointed.' I can understand why Mr. Douthat is concerned; as the tobacco companies learned, it appears that Republicans are now learning that it is inconvenient when your constituents are killed by your policies. I think it would be a safe predication that most of increase in mortality probably occurred in the states of the old Confederacy + Wyoming and Utah, while mortality in the rest of the states was stable or improved.
9
That's hilarious. Wyoming has like 700,000 residents. If EVERY ONE OF THEM between 45 and 54 killed themselves, it would barely tilt the results. Utah is also a small state population-wise.
No, the number for such things has to come from the BIG states -- California and New York at the head of the pack.
BTW: the poorest state in the union is....California. More than Mississippi by a landslide. Maybe you should focus on lefty-liberal, ALL DEMOCRAT California first?
No, the number for such things has to come from the BIG states -- California and New York at the head of the pack.
BTW: the poorest state in the union is....California. More than Mississippi by a landslide. Maybe you should focus on lefty-liberal, ALL DEMOCRAT California first?
One factor being missed - the huge rates of
***GUN***
ownership and
***GUN culture***
among working class whites who are in their middle ages.
Combine poor wages, lack of security and health insurance, depression etc. and you would get a social malaise.
Add
***GUNS***
and the social malaise translates into actual physical suicides and plunging life expectancy.
Harvard study: http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/magazine/guns-and-suicide/
“Studies show that most attempters act on impulse, in moments of panic or despair. Once the acute feelings ease, 90 percent do not go on to die by suicide.”
A GUN changes that.
People *do* kill themselves during those acute moments.
Data shows:
"... in states where guns were prevalent—as in Wyoming, where 63 percent of households reported owning guns—rates of suicide were higher. The inverse was also true: where gun ownership was less common, suicide rates were also lower."
And that is the real tragedy of GUN rights.
It mows down the demography that most espouses it.
***GUN***
ownership and
***GUN culture***
among working class whites who are in their middle ages.
Combine poor wages, lack of security and health insurance, depression etc. and you would get a social malaise.
Add
***GUNS***
and the social malaise translates into actual physical suicides and plunging life expectancy.
Harvard study: http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/magazine/guns-and-suicide/
“Studies show that most attempters act on impulse, in moments of panic or despair. Once the acute feelings ease, 90 percent do not go on to die by suicide.”
A GUN changes that.
People *do* kill themselves during those acute moments.
Data shows:
"... in states where guns were prevalent—as in Wyoming, where 63 percent of households reported owning guns—rates of suicide were higher. The inverse was also true: where gun ownership was less common, suicide rates were also lower."
And that is the real tragedy of GUN rights.
It mows down the demography that most espouses it.
32
Interesting thought.
1
A really smart woman once said "It Takes a Village".
Until Americans start acting like those words mean something, we are bound for the tragic consequences of purely self-interested behavior,
Until Americans start acting like those words mean something, we are bound for the tragic consequences of purely self-interested behavior,
20
Yeah, Hillary was so smart that she co-opted that African phrase without understanding it. You don't either.
It isn't about Adults. It's about children. It says "It takes a village to raise a child".
That doesn't mean taxes, or more schooling, or free day care.
It means every adult "in the village" has the absolute right to discipline your child -- to spank them if they are misbehaving, or to reprimand them.
In the US, that would result in you being arrested or sued for "child abuse".
It isn't about Adults. It's about children. It says "It takes a village to raise a child".
That doesn't mean taxes, or more schooling, or free day care.
It means every adult "in the village" has the absolute right to discipline your child -- to spank them if they are misbehaving, or to reprimand them.
In the US, that would result in you being arrested or sued for "child abuse".
As Angus Deaton the co-author of that is the subject of this column notes in this article on Vox http://www.vox.com/2015/11/7/9684928/angus-deaton-white-mortality "Deaths from drugs, alcohol, and suicides have risen for all education groups, not just those at the bottom. Deaton calls that 'the blockbuster finding.'"
Specifically death rates from suicide and poisoning with drugs and alcohol (i.e. primarily overdoses) have increased for middle aged blacks, hispanics and whites non hispanics of all educations levels. It is only in whites with a high school education or lower that this increase was large enough to increase the all cause mortality.
We have a serious public heath crisis - which is killing thousands of americans every year. we need the kind of response we normally mobilize for other conditions including harm reduction efforts and enhanced mental health and addiction services.
Specifically death rates from suicide and poisoning with drugs and alcohol (i.e. primarily overdoses) have increased for middle aged blacks, hispanics and whites non hispanics of all educations levels. It is only in whites with a high school education or lower that this increase was large enough to increase the all cause mortality.
We have a serious public heath crisis - which is killing thousands of americans every year. we need the kind of response we normally mobilize for other conditions including harm reduction efforts and enhanced mental health and addiction services.
12
So why do people turn to drugs, alcohol and, ultimately, to suicide?
Well, that's pretty simple, isn't it? Because they are not "happy."
And what makes people "happy?"
Well, that's pretty simple too.
First and foremost, everyone needs to feel safe, secure.
'Course, in the millennia before the modern era, being "safe" meant little more than surviving. Nowadays, in the era of the nanny state, surviving is pretty much guaranteed. So what, given the guaranteed food in our bellies and roof overhead, causes such despair that life isn't worth living, at least not without copious amounts of self-medication (which, itself, leads to premature death)?
Hhmm, maybe it's because the sense of purpose, which use to consist of that simple struggle to survive and to have a family, has been replaced by ... well, what? More of this, more of that, more of the other thing?
So I guess that those who have more of this, more of that and more of the other thing won't end up in the statistics underlying this column. But if that more of everything is now the purpose of life, I wonder just what kind of life that is.
Welcome, I guess, to the world of Donald Trump.
Well, that's pretty simple, isn't it? Because they are not "happy."
And what makes people "happy?"
Well, that's pretty simple too.
First and foremost, everyone needs to feel safe, secure.
'Course, in the millennia before the modern era, being "safe" meant little more than surviving. Nowadays, in the era of the nanny state, surviving is pretty much guaranteed. So what, given the guaranteed food in our bellies and roof overhead, causes such despair that life isn't worth living, at least not without copious amounts of self-medication (which, itself, leads to premature death)?
Hhmm, maybe it's because the sense of purpose, which use to consist of that simple struggle to survive and to have a family, has been replaced by ... well, what? More of this, more of that, more of the other thing?
So I guess that those who have more of this, more of that and more of the other thing won't end up in the statistics underlying this column. But if that more of everything is now the purpose of life, I wonder just what kind of life that is.
Welcome, I guess, to the world of Donald Trump.
7
Some research indicates that a sense of community, of belonging to something greater than oneself, helps lead to contentment. In its scary incarnation, this community can be racial/racist, but in other forms it can be constructive. The challenge to leaders (in all realms) is to appeal to "the better angels of [human] nature" and build constructive communities. Sadly, we are not seeing much, if any, of such appeals coming from the political and media leaders on the right.
1
Lots of folks here going crazy making assumptions.
All the people I have sadly known to end their lives, had college degrees and excellent jobs. It is not a given that being poor or struggling will lead to suicide. Nor drugs or alcohol. Many wealthy people are addicts; perhaps they can hide it better with money and access. But it isn't that they are "happier" necessarily.
The study is fascinating, and I hope to see more intense research into the "whys" behind these rising death rates -- but if you make up your mind IN ADVANCE that it is "all political", you won't really search for the true causes (nor a solution).
All the people I have sadly known to end their lives, had college degrees and excellent jobs. It is not a given that being poor or struggling will lead to suicide. Nor drugs or alcohol. Many wealthy people are addicts; perhaps they can hide it better with money and access. But it isn't that they are "happier" necessarily.
The study is fascinating, and I hope to see more intense research into the "whys" behind these rising death rates -- but if you make up your mind IN ADVANCE that it is "all political", you won't really search for the true causes (nor a solution).
Actually, the paper is more depressing than what's been reported in the press. It says:
"The focus of this paper is on changes in mortality and morbidity for those aged 45–54. However, as Fig. 4 makes clear, all 5-y age groups between 30–34 and 60–64 have witnessed marked and similar increases in mortality from the sum of drug and alcohol poisoning, suicide, and chronic liver disease and cirrhosis over the period 1999–2013; the midlife group is different only in that the sum of these deaths is large enough that the common growth rate changes the direction of all-cause mortality.
The figure referenced in this paragraph shows that the 45-54 age bracket has the highest mortality/morbidity rate, but the only reason it appears to be higher is because that group's mortality/morbidity rate was already high in 2000. The rates for other age brackets increased just as dramatically, but they began at a lower starting point.
"The focus of this paper is on changes in mortality and morbidity for those aged 45–54. However, as Fig. 4 makes clear, all 5-y age groups between 30–34 and 60–64 have witnessed marked and similar increases in mortality from the sum of drug and alcohol poisoning, suicide, and chronic liver disease and cirrhosis over the period 1999–2013; the midlife group is different only in that the sum of these deaths is large enough that the common growth rate changes the direction of all-cause mortality.
The figure referenced in this paragraph shows that the 45-54 age bracket has the highest mortality/morbidity rate, but the only reason it appears to be higher is because that group's mortality/morbidity rate was already high in 2000. The rates for other age brackets increased just as dramatically, but they began at a lower starting point.
7
This argument makes little sense. Maybe the problem is that people are obsessed with possessions and status. Capitalism and religion are culprits.
10
Religion? I suppose you may be right, if that religion you speak of makes a fetish of economic success or an "us versus them" mentality. But from what I can see, the teachings of most religious sages eschew the seeking of "status and stuff."
The increased mortality rates for middle-aged white Americans are largely a rural phenomenon. Gun ownership in rural areas about 50%, double what it is in the urban areas of the country. Easy access to firearms plays large in the increased mortality rate. Those who attempt suicide by gun rarely survive.
In addition, rural areas of the country have little or no mental health services available. So, people suffering from depression or addiction or mental disorders cannot get help, but they can get guns.
Douthat, once again, is coming from some alternative epistemological universe.
In addition, rural areas of the country have little or no mental health services available. So, people suffering from depression or addiction or mental disorders cannot get help, but they can get guns.
Douthat, once again, is coming from some alternative epistemological universe.
16
The suicide rate stated does not break down according to "method used".
Again, you are ASSUMING that these redneck hillbillies who dared to vote GOP must be shooting themselves. But you do not know that.
They could just as easily be committing suicide by taking those Oxycontin pills. Or a dozen other methods, including single car crashes.
Again, you are ASSUMING that these redneck hillbillies who dared to vote GOP must be shooting themselves. But you do not know that.
They could just as easily be committing suicide by taking those Oxycontin pills. Or a dozen other methods, including single car crashes.
Let's face facts first. Tons of jobs that men would commonly do are gone and never coming back. Technology and outsourcing has had a devastating effect on our people. I said to my friend once that at least the garbage men would always have a job, even if it meant hanging off those stinky trucks. But of course I was wrong. The new garbage cans now get picked up by a truck device and are hoisted up into the truck and then placed back down. No need for people. Secondly, talking about trash, some of these awful right wing pundits are out there targeting mainly white males, telling them over and over ad nauseam, that Obama and Hillary and Pelosi are destroying their lives. Oh, those terrible liberals. They sit back for a few hours demeaning good hard working people while they are rolling in millions, and laughing all the way to the bank. Between alcohol, street drugs, prescription drugs, and the breakdown of our families, and all the negative conversations and hate out there, it should be worse than it is. Gun violence, children being shot at their desks, no problem. War's, no problem. Refugees, no problem. No wonder people are depressed.
21
In most areas (though not the parts of Florida I have lived in), trash collectors are government employees, who get great pay and pensions from the state or county.
It is not the crap job that most people think of. Yes, it involves smelly garbage. But they can earn $80K a year in my hometown. That's good money for a completely unskilled job.
That the cans get picked up by a machine just shows you what happens when you have a greedy union, and the union demands $40 an hour for unskilled labor (garbage men in my area). The city can't afford it, so they automate. Jobs are lost and never come back.
What happens in a few years, when a self-driving robotic truck can come down the street, and pick up the cans? NO JOBS, that's what!
The triumph of lefty liberalism. Let the whinging commence.
It is not the crap job that most people think of. Yes, it involves smelly garbage. But they can earn $80K a year in my hometown. That's good money for a completely unskilled job.
That the cans get picked up by a machine just shows you what happens when you have a greedy union, and the union demands $40 an hour for unskilled labor (garbage men in my area). The city can't afford it, so they automate. Jobs are lost and never come back.
What happens in a few years, when a self-driving robotic truck can come down the street, and pick up the cans? NO JOBS, that's what!
The triumph of lefty liberalism. Let the whinging commence.
So now we have documented proof that there is actually something wrong with the angry white low educated white man that fuels the modern Republican party.
It is easy to feel contempt for a group that is depressed because they gave their votes to support the plutocrats wish list and got the shaft in return, just as it is easy for Douthat to give a Gallic shrug and suggest they get used to it, like immiserated minorities. It is rather delicious after years of sanctimonious lectures from Douthat et al on how blacks just need to act more like rich white folks to get ahead that they are suddenly paragons of resilience. Ok, that felt good, but the bigger point here is that despite agreeing with the liberal assessment of the problem Douthat remains blind to the responsibility of his class to it. Of the considerable new wealth generated in the US the last 30 years 70% went to the 1% and 90% to the 10%. By the time you get to low educated whites they are lucky to be standing still. The GOP basically considers their voters convenient idiots: give us your votes and we promise to be mean and and angry in ways you find amusing while we set the rules of the game so our donor class picks up trillions. And we lower their taxes. One can sympathize with the difficulty in saying no to votes sold so cheaply, but they are still deeply, morally wrong not to do so. Once upon a time Democrats gave up their racists in the south for the sake of doing the right thing. Now it is your turn.
It is easy to feel contempt for a group that is depressed because they gave their votes to support the plutocrats wish list and got the shaft in return, just as it is easy for Douthat to give a Gallic shrug and suggest they get used to it, like immiserated minorities. It is rather delicious after years of sanctimonious lectures from Douthat et al on how blacks just need to act more like rich white folks to get ahead that they are suddenly paragons of resilience. Ok, that felt good, but the bigger point here is that despite agreeing with the liberal assessment of the problem Douthat remains blind to the responsibility of his class to it. Of the considerable new wealth generated in the US the last 30 years 70% went to the 1% and 90% to the 10%. By the time you get to low educated whites they are lucky to be standing still. The GOP basically considers their voters convenient idiots: give us your votes and we promise to be mean and and angry in ways you find amusing while we set the rules of the game so our donor class picks up trillions. And we lower their taxes. One can sympathize with the difficulty in saying no to votes sold so cheaply, but they are still deeply, morally wrong not to do so. Once upon a time Democrats gave up their racists in the south for the sake of doing the right thing. Now it is your turn.
38
Preach!
2
Douthat did not say that, and the study does not support it. Blacks and hispanics die at higher rates from these causes. But their rates did not spike. This is likely because they have "maxed out"; they have reached the approximate maximum of people who have a tendency to turn to drugs and alcohol and suicide. White people clearly had some room to increase their numbers. Obviously such numbers cannot go indefinitely, or in a short time, everyone would be dead.
1
I'm 53 years old, economically conservative but socially liberal, I consider myself libertarian and I've seen a number of folks a little younger and a little older than me die from alcoholism, drugs, poor health and despair. I work and have worked for years so I count myself lucky. I also have a work ethic that won't let me feel sorry for myself either, I also take responsibility for my health. I'm white and see that whites must compete more instead of feeling sorry for themselves because the world is changing. I don't think government handouts are a help it just promotes despair, instead of promoting self reliance.
6
" I work and have worked for years so I count myself lucky" Well..... what about those folks who have been laid off and have been "lucky" to work at minimum wage jobs?
And this also from you, "I also take responsibility for my health." Well.... again, clearly you aren't a doctor. So, how do you do that in the face of huge increases in health care, without ACA, medicaid and dissability programs, that are a safety net for those who don't get employer paid health insurance?
Take your steady work and health care out of your life, and you'll be just like those in despair.
And this also from you, "I also take responsibility for my health." Well.... again, clearly you aren't a doctor. So, how do you do that in the face of huge increases in health care, without ACA, medicaid and dissability programs, that are a safety net for those who don't get employer paid health insurance?
Take your steady work and health care out of your life, and you'll be just like those in despair.
5
Having food and a roof over ones head promote despair. How exactly does that work ? A little, just a little thinking would debunk that. Being hungry and homeless is worse by any measure. Libertarians, always with the same answer for everything, less government. So simple, and so wrong.
2
Used to be: uneducated white people could go to work at a place that paid enough to raise a family, by a house, maybe send your kids to college. This allowed the "ordinary Joe" to be respected in society and most importantly, by himself.
Many forces ( automation, off shoring, dismantling of unions for starters) have diminished or eliminated those opportunities. These forces would have pulled on us regardless of who controlled the government. It's time both parties recognized these facts and tried to address them instead of looking for proof that they are right and the opposition wrong. I don't have a solution, but recognizing the facts of the problem is the start of finding it.
Many forces ( automation, off shoring, dismantling of unions for starters) have diminished or eliminated those opportunities. These forces would have pulled on us regardless of who controlled the government. It's time both parties recognized these facts and tried to address them instead of looking for proof that they are right and the opposition wrong. I don't have a solution, but recognizing the facts of the problem is the start of finding it.
17
What conservatives refuse to recognize is that their policies have been consistently against work amongst the lower class. They have been consistently opposed to unions. But unions allow workers to defer some of their wages for pensions, allow them to accept some of their wages as health insurance and to accept lower wages in exchange for more employment stability. All of these things allow worker to invest more in maintaining their employment and increasing their skills.
At the same time conservatives have pushed to tie welfare payments to be dependent upon employment which discourages workers from withholding their labor for higher wages and better working conditions. The worst of these forms of market distortions in the Earned Income Tax Credit which actually pays workers to work at wages below which they would not otherwise be able to maintain their employment. Thus middle income Kroger workers are forced through their taxes to to pay Walmart workers to take their jobs.
By discouraging workers from maintaining their health by negotiating for safer working conditions and taking a portion of their wages in health care conservatives encourage workers to let their health deteriorate to the point where they need to go on disability. Because they discourage workers from deferring part of their pay in pensions, older less efficient workers deny jobs to younger and more efficient workers, lowering life long earnings of the younger workers and reducing nations productivity.
At the same time conservatives have pushed to tie welfare payments to be dependent upon employment which discourages workers from withholding their labor for higher wages and better working conditions. The worst of these forms of market distortions in the Earned Income Tax Credit which actually pays workers to work at wages below which they would not otherwise be able to maintain their employment. Thus middle income Kroger workers are forced through their taxes to to pay Walmart workers to take their jobs.
By discouraging workers from maintaining their health by negotiating for safer working conditions and taking a portion of their wages in health care conservatives encourage workers to let their health deteriorate to the point where they need to go on disability. Because they discourage workers from deferring part of their pay in pensions, older less efficient workers deny jobs to younger and more efficient workers, lowering life long earnings of the younger workers and reducing nations productivity.
16
If you smoke, that is your decision. If you drug, same. Overeat, same. Yes economic opportunity has been cut from under them, through mass 3rd world immigration and shipping jobs out of the country, but they could have reacted by exercising more, or eating more apples. I don't think we need a sweeping cultural theory to explain peoples' bad choices.
2
Jack: And your perspective perfectly reflects the comment of "..and elite indifference or hostility" to the situation. In effect "your situation is entirely your fault get over it because I'm not helping you" commentary.
So it goes in the land of the Free.
Highlow
American Net'Zen
So it goes in the land of the Free.
Highlow
American Net'Zen
3
I always love the phrase "bad choices" to justify and excuse systemic failure and exploitation. That's like saying some Cherokees made the "bad choice" to forcibly leave Georgia and march toward Arkansas in the winter and died while others left their homeland voluntarily earlier and survived. Never mind that both groups were robbed of their way of life and their land by white governments and greedy white "neighbors." "Bad choices" are all some people have in the way of choices.
3
NO -- the study does not say this. It says the opposite. Obesity is NOT correlated with the death rates here. Only drugs, alcohol and suicide. And the rates increased for men and women about the same.
Eating more apples or dieting would not have made any difference, if you are a meth addict or drinking 1/5th of Jack Daniels each night.
Eating more apples or dieting would not have made any difference, if you are a meth addict or drinking 1/5th of Jack Daniels each night.
Something not mentioned in this article, but which is mentioned in the paper, is that poor whites have much better access to powerful prescription painkillers, which often lead to opiate addiction, than minorities do. Doctors are more cautious about prescribing such drugs to blacks and Hispanics than they are for whites.
10
You are making a very serious accusation, with nothing to back it up. I have personally been refused pain medication for serious medical conditions, and I am a white middle-aged woman in the suburbs. ALL doctors are today very cautious about pain meds.
The study covers 1990s through today, with the spike starting in 1997, but it is not clear what the causation is.
The study covers 1990s through today, with the spike starting in 1997, but it is not clear what the causation is.
1
It isn't merely that "middle age" whites had an increase in death rate, but that the greatest increase was among whites with a high school degree or less. Even forgetting that this is perhaps a more self-selected group of whites than what a high school diploma would have conferred in the 1960s or 70s, persons in this age group are now facing the prospect of poverty in old age, after a mid-life characterized by stagnant wages, underemployment or unemployment. Broke both financially and physically, with each condition becoming worse with each passing year, while chronic pain and poor general health make independence and autonomy that much further out of reach, it can begin to seem quite rational why some of these people might not want to make it out of middle age.
16
The column might the the ultimate example of "correlation is not causation".
8
See book by Steven Hill "Raw Deal: How the 'Uber Economy' and Runaway Capitalism Are Screwing American Workers". His interview with NYT Eduardo Porter will be on cspan.
This is health damage from unregulated capitalism. The rw keep blaming the victims, black and now white. After the fall of communism and privatization in Russia, alcoholism, death and suicide increased. Privatization is really the repudiation of democracy.
Our past secure employment with benefits, periodic raises, health care and pension is abandoned, leaving millions exposed to economic, health and mental stresses. They are ‘Free’, on their own. Congratulations.
Millions of jobs were offshored with govt approval and congress benefited by the excess profits turned into campaign donations. The corporations and our lawmakers shared in the loot derived from depriving Americans of their livelihoods—the ugly truth.
Compounding the damage were years of medical and drug costs allowed to soar beyond reach, leading to millions of medical bankruptcies. Plus they cut education funding and let tuition soar burdening the younger generation in debt, so whole families are in a downward spiral, unable to help each other. The destruction is compounded.
Plus the 08 crash did its damage to home values, with the recovery going to the top elites who caused it. Douthat and his Gop rw excuse makers can’t face reality, so they spin these columns out of thin air. We see right through it, Ross.
This is health damage from unregulated capitalism. The rw keep blaming the victims, black and now white. After the fall of communism and privatization in Russia, alcoholism, death and suicide increased. Privatization is really the repudiation of democracy.
Our past secure employment with benefits, periodic raises, health care and pension is abandoned, leaving millions exposed to economic, health and mental stresses. They are ‘Free’, on their own. Congratulations.
Millions of jobs were offshored with govt approval and congress benefited by the excess profits turned into campaign donations. The corporations and our lawmakers shared in the loot derived from depriving Americans of their livelihoods—the ugly truth.
Compounding the damage were years of medical and drug costs allowed to soar beyond reach, leading to millions of medical bankruptcies. Plus they cut education funding and let tuition soar burdening the younger generation in debt, so whole families are in a downward spiral, unable to help each other. The destruction is compounded.
Plus the 08 crash did its damage to home values, with the recovery going to the top elites who caused it. Douthat and his Gop rw excuse makers can’t face reality, so they spin these columns out of thin air. We see right through it, Ross.
28
The answer is pretty simple. In the immediate post WWII world being a white male was the ticket to success regardless of education or real skills. Women and minorities were excluded from the competition for good jobs and strong unions passed jobs down from fathers to sons. That world is gone and poorly educated white males with few modern skills are unable to compete for good jobs. Politicians like Trump tell them it isn't their fault. It's THEM. Rather than doing anything about their deficiencies, they take to drugs and alcohol. It is simply natural selection.
5
^ Brilliant. Douthat needs to read this reply and keep reading as it is vastly more coherent than his article.
You just told him what he needs to know, as opposed to what he wants to hear.
You just told him what he needs to know, as opposed to what he wants to hear.
ONCE AGAIN -- the study does not say it is white MEN who are dying young. It is working class white PEOPLE. Women, too.
Therefore, your theory does not hold true for women. And minorities die at even higher rates, so it is not true for them either.
Therefore, your theory does not hold true for women. And minorities die at even higher rates, so it is not true for them either.
Mr Douthat,
You touch upon a real and important connection between economic and social sources of oppression and their toll on the individual psyche. It's just too bad that you miss the broader point to your own piece. Everyone experiences stress in life. But oppression stems from the structure of society itself. It is unyielding, omnipresent, and the individual can feel overwhelmed by it. The antidote is a collective understanding of the sources of oppression that intersects with a collective response to those same sources. Most African-American and Latino/a folks that I know and speak with have no problem understanding the racial/ethnic sources of oppression they face. Their resilience in the face of oppression is NOT a matter of accepting what is but fighting individually and collectively against racial and ethnic discrimination. Thus, they fight collectively for ends to racial and ethnic oppression. That builds a community of resistance and sustains the individual. The absence in our popular culture and arenas of public discourse of any clearly articulated understanding of how the system operates to the disadvantage of the working class in general (including the white working class, leaves the white segment of the working class feeling isolated and adrift. Is it any wonder that they may wind up feeling hopeless and blaming themselves for what ultimately is a social system that oppresses all elements of the working class?
You touch upon a real and important connection between economic and social sources of oppression and their toll on the individual psyche. It's just too bad that you miss the broader point to your own piece. Everyone experiences stress in life. But oppression stems from the structure of society itself. It is unyielding, omnipresent, and the individual can feel overwhelmed by it. The antidote is a collective understanding of the sources of oppression that intersects with a collective response to those same sources. Most African-American and Latino/a folks that I know and speak with have no problem understanding the racial/ethnic sources of oppression they face. Their resilience in the face of oppression is NOT a matter of accepting what is but fighting individually and collectively against racial and ethnic discrimination. Thus, they fight collectively for ends to racial and ethnic oppression. That builds a community of resistance and sustains the individual. The absence in our popular culture and arenas of public discourse of any clearly articulated understanding of how the system operates to the disadvantage of the working class in general (including the white working class, leaves the white segment of the working class feeling isolated and adrift. Is it any wonder that they may wind up feeling hopeless and blaming themselves for what ultimately is a social system that oppresses all elements of the working class?
283
"Or maybe it will take a little bit of both, more money and new paths to resilience alike, to make some of the unhappiest white lives feel like they matter once again."
OR maybe it will take some discipline and personal responsibility of the kind they always accuse the poor of lacking?
OR maybe it will take some discipline and personal responsibility of the kind they always accuse the poor of lacking?
4
So people are supposed to adjust to this "era of relative stagnation?" This sounds like learned helplessness to me, when those at the top are sucking up all the resources. I have read a number of times in the comments to this paper that those at the top think that if the have to share a little, they will renounce their citizenship and go elsewhere. Well go. Obviously, with this kind of news of people dropping like flies, you're not helping. And as for the claim that if only people had that old time religion, everything would be ok. People need a good job and something to look forward to.
23
The rich people who you so despise also own things like companies and businesses. If they go, so do their companies. (They have already shown a willingness to move manufacturing to the third world.)
You seem to think you can just "get rid of" everyone you deem "rich" (i.e., that always means "richer than YOU" but not necessarily rich in the larger sense of the word), and they will leave behind all the businesses and corporations they run. They won't. Then where will you get all your jobs? From Uncle Sam?
You seem to think you can just "get rid of" everyone you deem "rich" (i.e., that always means "richer than YOU" but not necessarily rich in the larger sense of the word), and they will leave behind all the businesses and corporations they run. They won't. Then where will you get all your jobs? From Uncle Sam?
"You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing’s replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. So it’s not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren’t like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." Barack Hussein Obama, April, 2008
71
The "Ragin Cajun," James Carville, characterized Pennsylvania as Mississippi with Pittsburgh at one end and Philadelphia at the other!
2
Well, that is DEFINITELY what affluent, white professional lefty-liberals think (note: Obama is half-white) -- it is their paradigm -- but that does not make it true.
Mr. Obama never knew one single working class white person from the Midwest or anywhere else. He lived in an affluent ivory tower bubble, as a wealthy college professor and "community organizer".
Mr. Obama never knew one single working class white person from the Midwest or anywhere else. He lived in an affluent ivory tower bubble, as a wealthy college professor and "community organizer".
1
Douthat sets the bait and waits for the public commentary. He wants white people to get a grip and be more religious, using the resilience of the darker races religious and familia habits as justification. He sticks it in the face of white liberalism in a challenging way, highlighting his own self righteous, judgemental and unempathetic views. Douthat ought to read "Stiffed", which is getting to be a rather old read, or perhaps another older one, "Nickel and Dimed". He might also consider the corruption in many religious organizations, which skim the money and good will of desperate people giving them false hope in magical solutions. The truth is, all races are suffering and have been. It's just that now, it is catching up with white men as well. It's what you get when you have an oligarchy like we have now in America.
131
Thank you. My thoughts exactly. I could not have said it as well as you did.
3
ReCAROLYNEGELI: Several points to be made about your well written remarks. First, you employ the word,"race." But this is a word and a concept that has no validity, rejected by anthropologists as too vague to have any meaning. We can talk about cultural and linguistic differences, about differences in skin pigmentation, but race is a term than no social scientist would use today. Second, r not all countries, to one degree or another, ruled by oligarchies? In France, just one example virtually every President, with the exception of De Gaulle,who came out of from Saint Cyr, is a graduate of one of the "grandes ecoles," most likely the Ecole Normale d'Administration."or ENA.In the United States, every president , with the exception of JC who went to ANNAPOLIS,or LBJ, went to an ivy league school. These are the people who have always governed us, and populist rhetoric notwithstanding, have made sure that the interests of the one percent are not disturbed. The malaise of "little whites,' or whites in general, including wasps, is their refusal of combat. What I mean by that is that we are not procreating at a sufficiently high enough rate and r being submerged by other ethnic groups, immigrants from the developing world with large families. We "whites" have the mindset of the besieged. It is a form of philo suicide,and accounts for our languor and our weakness.. . .
1
Alcohol, tobacco and prescription opiates, all heavily linked to premature mortality. Cannabis, no such link. Which one is illegal? Is this some kind of a joke?
23
The Republican party has reaped a political windfall from the generational decay of the white middle and lower classes. What it hasn't done is lift one finger to actually help them. When's the last time you heard of Republicans fighting for mental health centers or substance abuse programs? Or, for that matter, social services of any kind . . . unless, maybe, you count protecting gun dealers and forcing miserable pregnant women to watch ultrasounds of their unborn fetuses.
145
And the white middle and lower class men represent the majority of the Republican base. Go figure.
2
How rich. Middle aged white men without college educations are dying earlier, the very demographic group most closely aligned to right wing/Tea Party policies including opposition to Obamacare, gun control, safety nets and liberalized treatment of addiction are now reaping what they have sown. They have been left behind by a modern digital economy, globalization and an exploitative and cynical GOP which needs their votes every 2 years and provides nothing in return. Perhaps they will now see how our environment shapes us and the despair and devastation that results when hope and opportunity disappear. Yes Ross there is less religious affiliation and practice, but its a result not a cause, its what happens when people lose a sense of the future and fill it instead with alcohol and drugs. You want to fix it ? Stop preaching and start advocating for policies which help those at the bottom.
185
Guess what? A good paying job, like the one you once had, is a major source of self esteem among American men.
48
Church attendance in Europe's social democracies is much lower than in the United States.
40
The fact of mortality rates growing for some suggest the cruelty of Republicans endlessly proposing the increase in the age of Social Security and Medicare.
59
As so often Mr. Douthat, you're struggling to find a way not to acknowledge the obvious. This spiral began with Reagan and found its natural end point with the rise of the Tea Party, the very folks who are caught in this demographic mess. More analysis here: http://arthurreber.com/home/middle-aged-white-folks-are-dying-at-unprece...
48
These first bunch of comments have been simply brilliant. Thank you.
20
@KarenGarcia - as usual, nailed it.
Whites are dying. Time to appoint a commission, get some air time. The suicide rate for middle aged whites goes hand in hand with nice white teens Using all kinds of drugs and either dying or being desperately addicted. The rationale for the retreat and admission the War On Drugs has been a colossal failure is widespread addiction found in the white community. The height of hypocrisy
Whites are dying. Time to appoint a commission, get some air time. The suicide rate for middle aged whites goes hand in hand with nice white teens Using all kinds of drugs and either dying or being desperately addicted. The rationale for the retreat and admission the War On Drugs has been a colossal failure is widespread addiction found in the white community. The height of hypocrisy
18
It's the availability of guns! That's what distinguishes us from other "civilized" countries, especially in the states with the highest rates of suicide.
How do People Most Commonly Complete Suicide?
According to Harvard researchers, "more use a firearm (52%) than every other method combined. Suffocation (mostly hanging) accounts for 23%, poisoning/overdose for 18%, jumps 2%, cuts 2%, and other 4%.
Most nonfatal self-harm treated in the emergency department results from poisoning/overdose (64%), followed by cutting (19%). Less than 1% of nonfatal attempts are with a gun."
When guns are nearby, the impulse to commit suicide is too often facilitated by easy access to firearms followed by an irrevocable action that all too often ends in death.
How do People Most Commonly Complete Suicide?
According to Harvard researchers, "more use a firearm (52%) than every other method combined. Suffocation (mostly hanging) accounts for 23%, poisoning/overdose for 18%, jumps 2%, cuts 2%, and other 4%.
Most nonfatal self-harm treated in the emergency department results from poisoning/overdose (64%), followed by cutting (19%). Less than 1% of nonfatal attempts are with a gun."
When guns are nearby, the impulse to commit suicide is too often facilitated by easy access to firearms followed by an irrevocable action that all too often ends in death.
11
Actually, about 1/3 of the increase can be explained by the demographics of the baby boom generation. The 45-54 year old cohort got on average progressively older during the researchers time span (the peak year for baby boom births was 1957).
This is not rocket science. What would you expect from thirty years of a rightwing war against workers (actually, the rightwing war against workers has been going on for generations).
58
Some 35 years ago, I spent a couple of years as a volunteer on a crisis intervention/suicide prevention phone line. As part of our training, we were informed that middle aged men, 45-55 years old, had the highest suicide rate. Although there was no definitive explanation, the working theory among sociologists (paraphrased) was that that was when men realized that this was a good as it was going to get. The dreams of their youth were not going to be realized, they were not going to be President, or foreman of their crew, or whatever.
We were also informed that many suicides were not recorded as such, to prevent stigma from attaching to the families. Which implies that some of the current estimates are the result of better record keeping,
How much worse has it gotten for this demographic in the ensuing decades? They have seen less qualified women and minorities get promoted over them to meet corporate quotas, and now are deemed too old to be promoted. The economy has contracted, leading to demotions, stagnant wages, layoffs and job insecurity.
If that is the dynamic that results in an additional 134 out of 100,000 of the middle aged committing suicide, it kind of makes sense.
It's interesting that in the front page article, the numbers are presented for low education whites, but the absolute statistics are not broken out between men and women or for the races or ethnic groups.
Douthat has it right in that an economy that offers opportunity for all would benefit all.
We were also informed that many suicides were not recorded as such, to prevent stigma from attaching to the families. Which implies that some of the current estimates are the result of better record keeping,
How much worse has it gotten for this demographic in the ensuing decades? They have seen less qualified women and minorities get promoted over them to meet corporate quotas, and now are deemed too old to be promoted. The economy has contracted, leading to demotions, stagnant wages, layoffs and job insecurity.
If that is the dynamic that results in an additional 134 out of 100,000 of the middle aged committing suicide, it kind of makes sense.
It's interesting that in the front page article, the numbers are presented for low education whites, but the absolute statistics are not broken out between men and women or for the races or ethnic groups.
Douthat has it right in that an economy that offers opportunity for all would benefit all.
8
But an upper middle class educated white man, who suddenly realizes he won't become partner in his law firm, or won't get the top management job in his office -- that guy WILL NOT do drugs, drink or kill himself. But the working class guy who does not make it to the very top WILL kill himself.
Since 2010, more than 4.7 million homeowners have faced foreclosure. The loss of a home can be devastating to a family, and the emotional toll can add to their financial stress. The resulting depression can leave them feeling hopeless. In fact, research by Janet Currie of Princeton University and Erdal Tekin of Georgia State University concludes that there is a link between foreclosure rates and suicide attempts. The Wall Street Journal reported that the research showed that there were 43% more suicide attempts for homeowners facing foreclosure than those who are not. I sincerely hope
the title of homeower would not trigger waves of suicide in this nation.
the title of homeower would not trigger waves of suicide in this nation.
6
I spell resilience like this: e-d-u-c-a-t-i-o -n.
9
Sadly, you should see the number of good liberal arts graduates who are underemployed, without any health or retirement benefits. At one time they would have trekked toward a solid middle class existence. Not any more. One wonders what happened to social and economic mobility these days ?
2
So do you agree with Stephanie Kelton, Bernie's economic advisor, that the federal government should guarantee a decent federal job to all those who need one or paid training for such a job? They could fix roads and bridges, help teach small classes, etc.. This would allow the government to eliminate most present forms of welfare.
25
Direction seems correct. Our society - a combination of [sorta] free market and [sorta] democratic government could adjust the set points around a livable-wage model. Sure, there would shifts in income, wealth, taxes and well-being for individuals and families. But perhaps we could stop the babble about "redistribution" ... It would just be a different distribution than the current interplay of market and government has fallen into.
It doesn't seem likely that our current politics would consider investing more in infrastructure and education if it requires more debt or higher taxes. Rather, the members of the FreeDumb Caucus and Tea Party want to babble about burdening our grand-children with more debt. Seems they would prefer to burden them with crumbling roads, bridges, schools, an antiquated air traffic control system and an electric grid that can't move solar energy from where it is efficiently produced to where it wants to be consumed. So, our grand-children will have to borrow to meet those needs when they can no longer be ignored ... probably at higher interest rates.
It doesn't seem likely that our current politics would consider investing more in infrastructure and education if it requires more debt or higher taxes. Rather, the members of the FreeDumb Caucus and Tea Party want to babble about burdening our grand-children with more debt. Seems they would prefer to burden them with crumbling roads, bridges, schools, an antiquated air traffic control system and an electric grid that can't move solar energy from where it is efficiently produced to where it wants to be consumed. So, our grand-children will have to borrow to meet those needs when they can no longer be ignored ... probably at higher interest rates.
Another way of looking at this is that we're talking about the Republican base: poorly-educated whites, people in dire need of help. Who happen to vote for people that refuse to expand Medicare. Who live in states that cut taxes, only to see their tax base and services decimated, because supply side economics gives money to the wealthy and doesn't really get anything back. Who vote for people who are convinced against all evidence that austerity, not stimulus, stimulates a moribund economy. And who listen to a Republican media that screams at them that they are in mortal danger from a tyrant who has usurped their country, so that they're constantly both fearful and enraged. So should we see voting Republican for these folks as a self-inflicted cause of their misery or one more stress-induced unhealthy choice, along with the opiates and alcohol?
43
To quote Douthat, "Maybe sustained growth, full employment and a welfare state that’s friendlier to work and family can help revive that nexus. Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect." To me that means: vote Democrat; support unions and a living wage; regulate banks and financial institution; create a progressive and fair tax structure for individuals and corporations; keep jobs in America; end racism and segregation in your personal and community lives; fully fund and support schools. Instead the cohort that Douthat describes chooses drugs and death.
28
There was a time not so long ago that a blue collar worker, a tradesman, a craftsman, with no more than a high school education could have his share of the "American Dream", a home for his family and a shot at a college education for his kids. And then came Reagan's morning in America for the wealthiest and low and behold the slippery slope came with it.
63
The target population of this study is ages 45-54. Whites at those ages are not only experiencing an increased death rate, they are also experiencing an increased poverty rate. The number of poor middle aged whites has increased by some 20% since 2000. I have family that has always been poor and I don't find them particularly morose. Alcohol, smoking and pain killers are definitely in use. But none of these relatives have died before age 54. This is anecdotal, of course. But I think it suggests an important omission. It's a lot harder to become poor in middle age than to live in poverty all your life. I think if the statistics were reviewed we'd find that the high mortality rate is concentrated among the newly poor.
17
In my job as a trauma nurse, and in my avocation as a person in long term recovery from alcoholism, working with addicts and alcoholics, all the white people I know had disability packages from decent jobs, at first, that financed the drug habit that started when they were injured on or off the job and a doctor began prescribing the kind of narcotics that used to be reserved for the terminally ill. White people populate the pain clinics, brought there in droves by the "pain is whatever the patient says it is" philosophy that started more than 30 years ago. Somebody is making big bucks medicating your every ache and pain--and then selling you some Suboxone, the prescription drug ordered for those of us addicted to prescription medication.
My patients this weekend included the 40 something yr. old with a 10 year long methadone habit, the 72 year old man with a history of alcoholism who's been retired from the NYPD since the age of 49, a 40 year old heroin addict--with two children she never sees--who was shooting up in the bathroom, and two guys in their forties involved in motor vehicle accidents, who demanded and received something for pain every hour on the hour, all night long--if they were aware of their surroundings, they perceived that as pain. The biggest risks for traumatic injury are mental illness and drug or alcohol addiction. Save yourself--and me--a lot of trouble: don't be crazy, and don't be a drunk or an addict.
My patients this weekend included the 40 something yr. old with a 10 year long methadone habit, the 72 year old man with a history of alcoholism who's been retired from the NYPD since the age of 49, a 40 year old heroin addict--with two children she never sees--who was shooting up in the bathroom, and two guys in their forties involved in motor vehicle accidents, who demanded and received something for pain every hour on the hour, all night long--if they were aware of their surroundings, they perceived that as pain. The biggest risks for traumatic injury are mental illness and drug or alcohol addiction. Save yourself--and me--a lot of trouble: don't be crazy, and don't be a drunk or an addict.
13
THANK YOU SO MUCH. My experience is the same as yours. The problem is the overuse of drugs to medicate even the slightest unhappiness. This study goes back to the mid 90s when this was first starting.
Also drugs have "trickled up" through our culture, from the ghettos and the poor to where middle and working class people think it is A-OK to get stoned all the time.
You are also dead-on in identifying SSDI as a contributor. 2 out of 3 recipients of SSDI are fakers -- with no real problem OR a minor problem, who exaggerate and get doctors to rubber stamp applications. Then they get to "retire" with full SS as young as their 20s.
That sounds "sweet" until you find yourself in your most productive years, with nothing to do. If you work, you lose "your benefits". So it is in your self-interest to make sure you DO NOT work. Taking drugs or drinking fills up empty days.
Also drugs have "trickled up" through our culture, from the ghettos and the poor to where middle and working class people think it is A-OK to get stoned all the time.
You are also dead-on in identifying SSDI as a contributor. 2 out of 3 recipients of SSDI are fakers -- with no real problem OR a minor problem, who exaggerate and get doctors to rubber stamp applications. Then they get to "retire" with full SS as young as their 20s.
That sounds "sweet" until you find yourself in your most productive years, with nothing to do. If you work, you lose "your benefits". So it is in your self-interest to make sure you DO NOT work. Taking drugs or drinking fills up empty days.
"As the twig is bent so grows the tree."
Pope
Before we engage in deciding who or what is responsible for decreased life expectancy in working class whites there is one factor that is measurable and can be shown to be a factor or a non factor. Diet.
The white lower working class diet is what separates it from blacks, Hispanics and similar genetic groups in different countries.
If you want to know who is gong to live long and prosper go to the proper educated middle class supermarket. We are what we eat and looking at shopping carts might be the best forecaster of future health and well-being.
When Jonathan Swift wrote his Modest Proposal in 1729 the poor people of Ireland were intellectually and physically handicapped from living on a diet of potatoes and more potatoes followed by more potatoes. They lived short brutal lives and demonstrated many of the pathologies of America's working class. They would continue to express these pathologies until their mothers were benefited by North American diets.
When every problem is looked through the lens of politics sometimes real solutions are hard to come by.
Pope
Before we engage in deciding who or what is responsible for decreased life expectancy in working class whites there is one factor that is measurable and can be shown to be a factor or a non factor. Diet.
The white lower working class diet is what separates it from blacks, Hispanics and similar genetic groups in different countries.
If you want to know who is gong to live long and prosper go to the proper educated middle class supermarket. We are what we eat and looking at shopping carts might be the best forecaster of future health and well-being.
When Jonathan Swift wrote his Modest Proposal in 1729 the poor people of Ireland were intellectually and physically handicapped from living on a diet of potatoes and more potatoes followed by more potatoes. They lived short brutal lives and demonstrated many of the pathologies of America's working class. They would continue to express these pathologies until their mothers were benefited by North American diets.
When every problem is looked through the lens of politics sometimes real solutions are hard to come by.
5
Are you suggesting that the Hispanic and African American diets are superior to the diets of the lower class white population? I think not.
2
And the potato famine wasn't political?
2
What's deceptive in this argument is the very use of the term 'working class'.
Most people are working class, aside from a few upper middle class, a few rich and a few poor who don't work.
What's more relevant is the 'thinking class' and the 'non-thinking' class.
The right-wing of America has carefully cultivated a 'non-thinking' class by catering to fear, anger, spite, 'God', guns and patriotism and short-changing thought, nuance, complexity, intellect and education.
The right-wing champions the underfunding of public education itself, doing its political best to ensure that critical thinking never sees the light of day via a well-funded public education.
When you're in a bad situation, it's a lot worse when your intelligence has been handicapped by Grand Old Propaganda guiding you through a thousand points of deception while they secretly remove your wages, your vacation, your pension, your healthcare and your entire future from your kitchen table.
It's hard to cope with reality when you cling to conservative nonsense while cursing the very liberal bias of reality.
"Working class' whites were encouraged to watch the waving American flag, listen to the thumping Bible, love their guns, chant 'Whites R Us' and to not think too hard as they were robbed blind by trickle-down fraudonomics and right-wing intellectual fraud.
Fraud victims are usually depressed.
It's no surprise that depressed fraud victims of the Party of Stupid are killing themselves in record numbers.
Most people are working class, aside from a few upper middle class, a few rich and a few poor who don't work.
What's more relevant is the 'thinking class' and the 'non-thinking' class.
The right-wing of America has carefully cultivated a 'non-thinking' class by catering to fear, anger, spite, 'God', guns and patriotism and short-changing thought, nuance, complexity, intellect and education.
The right-wing champions the underfunding of public education itself, doing its political best to ensure that critical thinking never sees the light of day via a well-funded public education.
When you're in a bad situation, it's a lot worse when your intelligence has been handicapped by Grand Old Propaganda guiding you through a thousand points of deception while they secretly remove your wages, your vacation, your pension, your healthcare and your entire future from your kitchen table.
It's hard to cope with reality when you cling to conservative nonsense while cursing the very liberal bias of reality.
"Working class' whites were encouraged to watch the waving American flag, listen to the thumping Bible, love their guns, chant 'Whites R Us' and to not think too hard as they were robbed blind by trickle-down fraudonomics and right-wing intellectual fraud.
Fraud victims are usually depressed.
It's no surprise that depressed fraud victims of the Party of Stupid are killing themselves in record numbers.
258
I believe the study defines "working class" here as a person who does not have a college degree, and is doing some form of blue collar work.
My son has no college degree. He served 7 years in the Navy, and was honorably discharged. As a trained nuclear technician, he was courted by a half dozen nuclear power plants until he choose one, and was hired on at $87,000 a year, with a real defined-benefit pension and fantastic health insurance and other benefits.
Under the terms this study uses, my son is a "working class white man".
My son has no college degree. He served 7 years in the Navy, and was honorably discharged. As a trained nuclear technician, he was courted by a half dozen nuclear power plants until he choose one, and was hired on at $87,000 a year, with a real defined-benefit pension and fantastic health insurance and other benefits.
Under the terms this study uses, my son is a "working class white man".
Not much nuance here.
Of all the comments here, yours is the only one that got it right. Spot on.
3
While taking classes on demographics in my master's program years ago we were asked to predict what would happen as the generation between 1946-64 aged. I predicted that suicide would become the leading cause of death. I believe that the epidemic has just started and it will not be limited by race.
9
The generation you write about is beyond the ages of the people that this article suggests. Born at the upper limits of a person born in 64, that person would already be 51 years old. The article addresses 45 to 55 years old. The person born in 46 would be approaching 70 years old.
Actually, it's whites born after 1964 who are experiencing the higher death rates. The boomer generation still has a safety net, frayed as it is, of pensions, social security and Medicare.
3
Or maybe all our survivals are intertwined? Maybe we all need a country that owns its own history and purpose, faces past realities, from when the first European migrants arrived in 1492 to and through the still largely white, male led power elite of today and into a new vision for the country, inclusive, life and environmentally self-sustaining, legitimate rule of good laws, diverse and with basic human rights affirmed for all? Then all Americans can start sharing a new future vision with the world, one not dominated by religions(notice lately any worldwide, recognized woman faith leaders, anywhere?), one that values human life and human rights for all and one that recognizes we all need to take responsibility for the things we have individually done badly, benefitted from unequally and supports everyone in their efforts to do so. In my experience most people, not all but most, do the best they can, evrery day, with what they have and know, even when their best is imperfect. But the human condition is not perfect. Happily people can and do change but Mr. Douthat has too small a vision for a country with far greater possibilities. We Americans, all of us, are better than his narrow perspective. We also can demand our leaders actually lead. That could be a solid start.
2
"Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect."
What exactly are you advocating Mr Douthat? That this country cannot provide for its citizens in spite of the extravagant wealth of it 5% of its citizens and most of its large corporations? And that therefore all the rest of us learn to live like paupers? Can you please share with us the logic behind this bizarre and nasty proposition?
What exactly are you advocating Mr Douthat? That this country cannot provide for its citizens in spite of the extravagant wealth of it 5% of its citizens and most of its large corporations? And that therefore all the rest of us learn to live like paupers? Can you please share with us the logic behind this bizarre and nasty proposition?
19
I believe it is called "Neo-Antoinettism."
5
And it is also because of the constant shaming of anyone SIMPLY because they are white.
This is especially painful for lower and working class whites.....to be told they are 'privileged' because they are white when they have no money, no future, and are told they have no right to complain about it because they are privileged or because of what people who looked like them did centuries and decades ago.
RACISM pure and simple
This is especially painful for lower and working class whites.....to be told they are 'privileged' because they are white when they have no money, no future, and are told they have no right to complain about it because they are privileged or because of what people who looked like them did centuries and decades ago.
RACISM pure and simple
5
Funny I've never heard anyone being shamed as you've suggested.
1
You're 50, unions are busted, you've fallen from working class to working poor. You've got $1,700 a month for your family and your only prospects are bleak and bleaker.
Your entire sense of pride is based on your independence, I'm a working man. You turn to booze. Your latest offer is $8/hour, half of what you earned 20 years ago, never mind the inflation.
You're angry and you yell at your family. Maybe you hit them. And drink more in remorse.
All your life you've despised "welfare" and the layabouts who live off it. If you acknowledge you need help and go look for it, you discover there's none about. Some food stamps. And you know what Rush says about food stamps.
You've got no idea that your great U.S., wealthiest country in the world, also has the wealthy world's most sadistic income transfers. The social hammock you've hated is a headfirst dive into an empty pool. You're poor, a loser, and nobody cares. You drink more and you've got nothing. Rather than sink into homelessness with your kids it's better to end it all.
You've got a gun, and you use it. Or maybe you die of a disease you can't afford to use it.
Plutocracy demands human sacrifice. In his Montgomery "how long" speech, Martin Luther King spoke about how the aristocracy pits poor whites against poor blacks. In his last policy proposal King endorsed the guaranteed income to abolish poverty. It's time for Bernie to save a humiliated and desperate white working class become working poor.
Your entire sense of pride is based on your independence, I'm a working man. You turn to booze. Your latest offer is $8/hour, half of what you earned 20 years ago, never mind the inflation.
You're angry and you yell at your family. Maybe you hit them. And drink more in remorse.
All your life you've despised "welfare" and the layabouts who live off it. If you acknowledge you need help and go look for it, you discover there's none about. Some food stamps. And you know what Rush says about food stamps.
You've got no idea that your great U.S., wealthiest country in the world, also has the wealthy world's most sadistic income transfers. The social hammock you've hated is a headfirst dive into an empty pool. You're poor, a loser, and nobody cares. You drink more and you've got nothing. Rather than sink into homelessness with your kids it's better to end it all.
You've got a gun, and you use it. Or maybe you die of a disease you can't afford to use it.
Plutocracy demands human sacrifice. In his Montgomery "how long" speech, Martin Luther King spoke about how the aristocracy pits poor whites against poor blacks. In his last policy proposal King endorsed the guaranteed income to abolish poverty. It's time for Bernie to save a humiliated and desperate white working class become working poor.
50
It's just not possible to conclude from the data produced by Drs. Deaton and Case that political ideology--liberal, conservative, or nihilistic--caused the spike in white male, working class suicides. One could argue that easier and less expensive access to medical and mental health services could have contained the increase in these causes of death, but that conclusion, too, does not find support in the data or in the study which governed the data collection.
Reckoning subjects' ages discloses that some subjects were born as early as the mid-1940s, so we know that perhaps the longer white males lived the greater risk they bear, but once again correlation does not necessarily demonstrate causation.
Douthat's conclusions that liberal policies probably explain these causes of death exemplify much of what is wrong with how we go about finding serious solutions to complex health, legal, educational, environmental, and scientific issues in the very nuanced and complex world we live in. It's just as easy to gin up a conclusion from polling data combined with this study to conclude that Republican policies cause a serious increase in deaths of white workers but alas, the study didn't appear to ask any question from which such a conclusion could be contrived.
Douthat's article presents pointedly the problems caused in pontificating about what data,influenced by political ideology or causes, actually show. The study should be permitted to speak for itself.
Reckoning subjects' ages discloses that some subjects were born as early as the mid-1940s, so we know that perhaps the longer white males lived the greater risk they bear, but once again correlation does not necessarily demonstrate causation.
Douthat's conclusions that liberal policies probably explain these causes of death exemplify much of what is wrong with how we go about finding serious solutions to complex health, legal, educational, environmental, and scientific issues in the very nuanced and complex world we live in. It's just as easy to gin up a conclusion from polling data combined with this study to conclude that Republican policies cause a serious increase in deaths of white workers but alas, the study didn't appear to ask any question from which such a conclusion could be contrived.
Douthat's article presents pointedly the problems caused in pontificating about what data,influenced by political ideology or causes, actually show. The study should be permitted to speak for itself.
2
Meanwhile Congressional Reputlicans want to cut even more out of what safety net still remains. In this economy add one more group that is learning the meaning of "breaking point."
9
What we need are jobs, plain and simple. Ban outsourcing, strictly limit H1B visas, bring back manufacturing and increase tariffs. And let's make it illegal to offshore profits made off the backs of American workers. And limit the size of those profits in general.
10
Yeah, Mimi -- and when we ask for secure borders, enforcement of existing immigration laws, and the end of illegal immigration -- we are called "mean" and "haters" and "xenophobes".
Personally, my take on this study is that it is a clear reflection of the growth of illegal immigration, and the toll illegals have taken on working class jobs.
Personally, my take on this study is that it is a clear reflection of the growth of illegal immigration, and the toll illegals have taken on working class jobs.
1
When the white working class voted mostly Democratic their fortunes steadily rose till they could afford homes, college for their kids and secure retirement. Once the white working class became a loyal Republican voting bloc in the Reagan years their fortunes sputtered, stalled and then declined.
Thanks to the Southern Strategy the Republican Party wooed, won and control poorer whites the way Southern patricians controlled poor Southern whites since before the Civil War - with flattery, lies, disinformation, fear and hate.
The plutocrats butter them up to their faces with how superior they are to "those people" and then whip them up with fear and hate based on nonsense. It's an old formula that keeps coming back.
Thanks to the Southern Strategy the Republican Party wooed, won and control poorer whites the way Southern patricians controlled poor Southern whites since before the Civil War - with flattery, lies, disinformation, fear and hate.
The plutocrats butter them up to their faces with how superior they are to "those people" and then whip them up with fear and hate based on nonsense. It's an old formula that keeps coming back.
25
Why do you write, "the richest nation in the world"? We are, as John Dos Passos wrote in his U.S.A. trilogy, "two nations." Only one of them is rich.
19
"The result is a mounting feeling of what the American Conservative’s Rod Dreher calls white “dispossession” — _a sense of promises broken, a feeling that what you were supposed to have has been denied to you_."
Is this not the quintessential definition of a feeling heretofore attributed only to the non-white and especially to the black: a sense of *entitlement*? Why is the feeling of entitlement called "dispossession" when we're discussing white people? Why must our hearts go out to white people who, according to no less an authority than Rod Dreher of the American Conservative, feel a sense of entitlement, whereas we must despise black people who, according to the same conservative sources, likewise supposedly feel a sense of entitlement? Because it's the racist thing to do, to differentiate, through the use of Orwellian doublespeak, between the _sense of dispossession_ of white people and the _sense of entitlement_ of non-white people.
-- that black people and white people are inherently of the same nature and have the same feelings about the same worries and problems of ordinary life
Is this not the quintessential definition of a feeling heretofore attributed only to the non-white and especially to the black: a sense of *entitlement*? Why is the feeling of entitlement called "dispossession" when we're discussing white people? Why must our hearts go out to white people who, according to no less an authority than Rod Dreher of the American Conservative, feel a sense of entitlement, whereas we must despise black people who, according to the same conservative sources, likewise supposedly feel a sense of entitlement? Because it's the racist thing to do, to differentiate, through the use of Orwellian doublespeak, between the _sense of dispossession_ of white people and the _sense of entitlement_ of non-white people.
-- that black people and white people are inherently of the same nature and have the same feelings about the same worries and problems of ordinary life
8
I think most agree that it's the steady and massive loss of blue collar jobs over the last 40 years that's brought about this deep-seated depression, exacerbated by women and minorities getting a larger share of the pie, and recently by the epidemic of pain killers which lead so often to heroin.
Blaming Republicans any more than Democrats is absurd: it was Clinton who pushed for NAFTA. We are all to blame for insisting with our wallets on cheap goods from abroad.
Personally I thought Ross Perot was right when he said that a little protectionism wouldn't be such a bad thing. The answer isn't socialism, it's not about expanding entitlements, or sending people to college to learn new jobs in the "creative" economy. These won't cut it.
I think we need to somehow ween ourselves off cheap imports and bring back manufacturing jobs.
Blaming Republicans any more than Democrats is absurd: it was Clinton who pushed for NAFTA. We are all to blame for insisting with our wallets on cheap goods from abroad.
Personally I thought Ross Perot was right when he said that a little protectionism wouldn't be such a bad thing. The answer isn't socialism, it's not about expanding entitlements, or sending people to college to learn new jobs in the "creative" economy. These won't cut it.
I think we need to somehow ween ourselves off cheap imports and bring back manufacturing jobs.
6
The arrogance is sublime. The more people kill themselves, the more “many Conservatives” will feel vindicated that their social theories are just too good for people to live up to, and they’re dying of unworthiness. They weren’t good enough to uphold Ross’s smug insistence that marriage actually ever supplied rootedness, discipline and purpose. They’re so corrupted and enfeebled that not even the paternalism of the Nanny State with its dependence and disability payments tempted them with drug abuse and suicidal thoughts.
I’ve never seen someone so callow and supercilious presume so often to unearned authority, and to sit like this with such toxic unmerited certainty in judgment of people’s lives and deaths.
I’ve never seen someone so callow and supercilious presume so often to unearned authority, and to sit like this with such toxic unmerited certainty in judgment of people’s lives and deaths.
14
It's trying to keep up with neighbours that makes many American ill. Americans in middle and low incomes are more prone to ill health due to the stress associated with 'keeping up with the Joneses' rather than their lack of money, according to Yale researchers.
The research team found that simply having low pay or not enough wealth wasn't enough to explain poor health.
What they found to be more important was how much their income or wealth inferred about their social ranking compared with those in their neighborhood.
I have a neighbor on food stamps for more than 15 years, both he and his wife receive unemployment benefits, yet they still pretending middle Class!
What A Fraud!
There millions those sort of Fake Middle Class in our society. And Eventually everyone know their are total fraud!
The research team found that simply having low pay or not enough wealth wasn't enough to explain poor health.
What they found to be more important was how much their income or wealth inferred about their social ranking compared with those in their neighborhood.
I have a neighbor on food stamps for more than 15 years, both he and his wife receive unemployment benefits, yet they still pretending middle Class!
What A Fraud!
There millions those sort of Fake Middle Class in our society. And Eventually everyone know their are total fraud!
I’m an old white guy. I made it through the age of despair by staying aware of the rest of the world, ignoring things that I can’t control and trying – trying to not get angry about the political right in the country. However I can’t say if that is what the guys offing themselves or dying through drug abuse are doing. We don’t really know what drives them. What we can look at are macro trends. What we do know is that in 1996 Fox News launched in the US. At that precise moment when white people started dying with more regularity than in other parts of the world Fox news came on our scene. Hosts of angry white men yelling that they are tired of all the handouts to people that weren’t white started appearing and stories about how white “normal” people were getting left out of the conversation…. I would like to see the WW rate of interest in Fox. Maybe now we can assess the real damage these guys are doing to our society.
13
“There’s class warfare, all right, but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning.” - Warren Buffett.
GOP politicians, particularly in 'red' states are determined to undercut access to publicly funded health care and that could not possibly lead to despair and ill health, could it? How about stagnating wages and millions of manufacturing jobs shipped to China, leaving ghost towns littered across the American landscape that were formerly thriving? How about the GOP non-stop vilification of education, not to mention hostility to any reality-based solutions to serious problems that accelerate the downward spiral of the entire American infrastructure?
To paraphrase Elizabeth Barret Browning, "How do I destroy thee? Let me count the ways…"
GOP politicians, particularly in 'red' states are determined to undercut access to publicly funded health care and that could not possibly lead to despair and ill health, could it? How about stagnating wages and millions of manufacturing jobs shipped to China, leaving ghost towns littered across the American landscape that were formerly thriving? How about the GOP non-stop vilification of education, not to mention hostility to any reality-based solutions to serious problems that accelerate the downward spiral of the entire American infrastructure?
To paraphrase Elizabeth Barret Browning, "How do I destroy thee? Let me count the ways…"
16
The problem is laying the blame for the apparent increased deaths at the foot alcohol, drugs and suicide and using that to direct public policy. These things can be part of the downward spiral from any cause. Also the stigma that keeps alcohol, drug use and suicide hidden varies over time. Let's keep an open mind and do some more research.
1
"Or maybe working-class white America needs to adapt culturally, in various ways, to this era of relative stagnation, and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elit[ist] neglect."
Amen. Because familiarity breeds comprehension, which breeds empathy, which breeds reconciliation, which breeds unity, which breeds collaboration, which — finally — breeds real, viable, basic, substantial, synergistic, lasting solutions.
Amen. Because familiarity breeds comprehension, which breeds empathy, which breeds reconciliation, which breeds unity, which breeds collaboration, which — finally — breeds real, viable, basic, substantial, synergistic, lasting solutions.
1
Well, given that white males are the only group of people who aren't allowed blame their situation on societal discrimination, it's no wonder that when they fail, they feel like failures and not the failed.
4
For those who wanted Reagan, free markets and "freedom", this is what you get. Misery, insecurity and poverty for most; great riches for a few.
In a little more than a generation, we replaced the New Deal framework that provided the greatest broadly shared prosperity in human history with the Gilded Age, Part II.
People can deal with adversity; the Great Depression proved that. What people cannot deal with is adversity that is not shared, the kind of adversity that comes from feeling that someone else's gains are coming at one's own expense. Corporate profits are at record levels, yet many Americans are being left behind.
The task at hand is to ensure that today's prosperity is shared by all. Call it "redistribution" if you want, but with productivity higher than ever and wages stagnant, some might just call it "fair".
In a little more than a generation, we replaced the New Deal framework that provided the greatest broadly shared prosperity in human history with the Gilded Age, Part II.
People can deal with adversity; the Great Depression proved that. What people cannot deal with is adversity that is not shared, the kind of adversity that comes from feeling that someone else's gains are coming at one's own expense. Corporate profits are at record levels, yet many Americans are being left behind.
The task at hand is to ensure that today's prosperity is shared by all. Call it "redistribution" if you want, but with productivity higher than ever and wages stagnant, some might just call it "fair".
23
The jobs are gone, Ross. They were shipped out. Black folk and Latino folk are just a bit more used to the despair, yes, and are more urban in their enclave. The Whites you describe are those in the deeply rural areas, from which the Blacks fled for their own safety, and where there is no customers for the low-paying tasks Latinos mostly perform.
This despair has been building since the 60s, when the jobs worth having for working folk started to be sent overseas. Steel, shipbuilding, etc. But the era of the Big Farm had set the rot in the countryside 20 years and more before.
Americans are proud folk. But these people, if they've survived at all, have done so in 1 horse and shack-post-office burgs, hundreds of which I've driven through, crisscrossing the country. Out there all you get is Talk Radio and Religious Air, both apocalyptic in tone.
Picture being stranded on the plains, hopeless, and that poison in your ear.
If they weren't reliable Republican votes you wouldn't even be writing about them.
This despair has been building since the 60s, when the jobs worth having for working folk started to be sent overseas. Steel, shipbuilding, etc. But the era of the Big Farm had set the rot in the countryside 20 years and more before.
Americans are proud folk. But these people, if they've survived at all, have done so in 1 horse and shack-post-office burgs, hundreds of which I've driven through, crisscrossing the country. Out there all you get is Talk Radio and Religious Air, both apocalyptic in tone.
Picture being stranded on the plains, hopeless, and that poison in your ear.
If they weren't reliable Republican votes you wouldn't even be writing about them.
20
"Middle-aged blacks still have a higher mortality rate than whites — 581 per 100,000, compared with 415 for whites.."
Somewhere in all these discussions of what is happening to middle aged whites, the horrible statistic above in the original NY Times article seems to get lost completely. We should all be sympathetic if anybody dies unnecessarily and the rising rates for middle aged whites is very regrettable indeed but I find the glossing over of the fact that even with this increase, middle aged blacks are dying at a rate 40%, (note 40%!) higher than whites should, one would think, be of concern to somebody. Apparently not. Maybe black people need to start a movement to emphasize the fact that "Black Lives also Matter". Oh, I forgot. That would amount to black racism.
And perhaps, just perhaps, if when we first noticed that middle aged blacks were dying at these high rates and had put in the necessary effort to find out why, we might have been in a position to prevent this "disease" migrating to the white middle age group before it got to this point. Maybe now we will.
Somewhere in all these discussions of what is happening to middle aged whites, the horrible statistic above in the original NY Times article seems to get lost completely. We should all be sympathetic if anybody dies unnecessarily and the rising rates for middle aged whites is very regrettable indeed but I find the glossing over of the fact that even with this increase, middle aged blacks are dying at a rate 40%, (note 40%!) higher than whites should, one would think, be of concern to somebody. Apparently not. Maybe black people need to start a movement to emphasize the fact that "Black Lives also Matter". Oh, I forgot. That would amount to black racism.
And perhaps, just perhaps, if when we first noticed that middle aged blacks were dying at these high rates and had put in the necessary effort to find out why, we might have been in a position to prevent this "disease" migrating to the white middle age group before it got to this point. Maybe now we will.
9
We aging white males have controlled the Power Elite long enough. We did the best we could in most cases, though we fell far short from what the ironically titled "Best and The Brightest" should have done.
"We're humans, we're supposed to make mistakes", sang Billy Joel. And indeed we have. We've been called The Greatest Generation, but that was simply a cute title used by Tom Brokaw's publisher to peddle his book, a very successful one at that. Yes, we won World War II, but the reason we had to fight it in the first place was due to our lack of foresight in seeing the rise of the Axis Powers quest for world domination, thus forcing us to ally with Stalin to stop Hitler.
Nazi concentration camps, persecution of the Jews, the bombing blitz of London didn't provoke us one iota into joining the fight. No, our "Wake Up Call" came on Sunday morning of December 7th, 1941. It was a combination of fortitude, American arsenal production, and sheer luck that six months later culminated in victory at the Battle of Midway. Our lack of preparedness costs us an untold number of lives. The sacrifice we made back before 24/7 media and the social network existed would not be possible today. Our blunders on the battlefield, of which they were many, were not broadcast on the news that evening. It wasn't until our debacle in Vietnam, when the US "Police Action" over a non-event in the Gulf of Tonkin did America begin to see the fruitlessness of war. We wish you fare better.
DD
Manhattan
"We're humans, we're supposed to make mistakes", sang Billy Joel. And indeed we have. We've been called The Greatest Generation, but that was simply a cute title used by Tom Brokaw's publisher to peddle his book, a very successful one at that. Yes, we won World War II, but the reason we had to fight it in the first place was due to our lack of foresight in seeing the rise of the Axis Powers quest for world domination, thus forcing us to ally with Stalin to stop Hitler.
Nazi concentration camps, persecution of the Jews, the bombing blitz of London didn't provoke us one iota into joining the fight. No, our "Wake Up Call" came on Sunday morning of December 7th, 1941. It was a combination of fortitude, American arsenal production, and sheer luck that six months later culminated in victory at the Battle of Midway. Our lack of preparedness costs us an untold number of lives. The sacrifice we made back before 24/7 media and the social network existed would not be possible today. Our blunders on the battlefield, of which they were many, were not broadcast on the news that evening. It wasn't until our debacle in Vietnam, when the US "Police Action" over a non-event in the Gulf of Tonkin did America begin to see the fruitlessness of war. We wish you fare better.
DD
Manhattan
158
Bravo! What a compelling argument that it isn't ability but lack of will and feckless excuses that we hold ourselves from any number of problems we currently face from poverty and unemployment to the environment, energy sources. Thank you.
1
CS Lewis said it well. If you aim for truth, you will get both truth and comfort. If you aim for comfort, you will get neither comfort or truth and in the end, despair. This is the toxicity of our current society. That, plus identity politics. Politicians promise solutions to economic or societal problems, but they always fall short.
Now the death rate is skyrocketing among middle aged whites, especially those with less education. Can it be that our identity politics has left behind the white race and now, in the absence of truth or comfort, they are choosing either suicide or death by drug abuse over participation on our society? We should have a long discussion about this phenomenon.
Ask yourself this question. If this spike in deaths occurred in any pther group, would the outcry be more intense instead of muted? This is a ticking time bomb and it is driving the candidacy of both Trump and Carson. There is the issue.
Now the death rate is skyrocketing among middle aged whites, especially those with less education. Can it be that our identity politics has left behind the white race and now, in the absence of truth or comfort, they are choosing either suicide or death by drug abuse over participation on our society? We should have a long discussion about this phenomenon.
Ask yourself this question. If this spike in deaths occurred in any pther group, would the outcry be more intense instead of muted? This is a ticking time bomb and it is driving the candidacy of both Trump and Carson. There is the issue.
7
As Mr. Rothstein wrote in reader picks, it's the loss of union jobs and union strength. In addition it's the loss of jobs due to lower wage outsourcing. There needs to be a committee formed by, say Ms. Clinton, which brings education to match current jobs to those still in school and those who are out of school, their knowledge must be enhanced by renewed education. Unions must gain strength to help and organize workers AND overseas jobs for American companies MUST be limited and regulated by law. At the end of the day, jobs are job one. And for the current workers and those up and coming, education is also job 1!
13
This is liberal nonsense at its finest, after having sawed off the legs from under it, they wonder why society isn't up and about. It is outrageous that black and hispanic societies are also mentioned when they are suffering from their own malaise due to a total disintegration of family life.
Families make up the fabric of the society, religion is what sanctions and nurtures families. After spending the last 40 years destroying both, the geniuses can't figure out what happened to civil society.
There is hope yet, humans are innately social creatures. Every human society in every part of the ancient world, no matter how isolated from the rest, was fundamentally made up of families which found sanction by whatever God they prayed to. After all the convoluted leftist ideas have been tried and discarded, that is essentially where we will end up again.
Families make up the fabric of the society, religion is what sanctions and nurtures families. After spending the last 40 years destroying both, the geniuses can't figure out what happened to civil society.
There is hope yet, humans are innately social creatures. Every human society in every part of the ancient world, no matter how isolated from the rest, was fundamentally made up of families which found sanction by whatever God they prayed to. After all the convoluted leftist ideas have been tried and discarded, that is essentially where we will end up again.
1
I think Dispossession is an accurate term to describe the plight of low-income whites. Not only has the working class been crushed by outsourcing jobs and the financializaiton of the economy, but their identity and place in America has been erased. No longer does America respect the traditional virtues of white America, instead the culture openly ridicules whites as the problem in America.
Whites are no longer able to advocate for their own interests and desires in society; instead they are attacked for wanting to retain their white culture and traditions. In their place, every other ethnic group is able feel pride in their identity and to advocate for greater acceptance of their cultural norms, it is only whites and their cultural norms that are constantly under assault.
As a result, uneducated whites have lost both their place in the workforce and their culture; they have become homeless wanderers adrift in the land of their forefathers. It should come as no surprise then that Trump's anti-immigration stance is resonating so strongly with this group. Finally, a man is standing up for whites and their interests to keep their communities and towns from being replaced by foreign immigrants. Whites were once 85% of the population and are now 60%, most uneducated whites have experienced firsthand the ill effects of immigration and the resulting displacement of their towns. They also realize that once whites fall to 40%, the nation they built will no longer belong to them.
Whites are no longer able to advocate for their own interests and desires in society; instead they are attacked for wanting to retain their white culture and traditions. In their place, every other ethnic group is able feel pride in their identity and to advocate for greater acceptance of their cultural norms, it is only whites and their cultural norms that are constantly under assault.
As a result, uneducated whites have lost both their place in the workforce and their culture; they have become homeless wanderers adrift in the land of their forefathers. It should come as no surprise then that Trump's anti-immigration stance is resonating so strongly with this group. Finally, a man is standing up for whites and their interests to keep their communities and towns from being replaced by foreign immigrants. Whites were once 85% of the population and are now 60%, most uneducated whites have experienced firsthand the ill effects of immigration and the resulting displacement of their towns. They also realize that once whites fall to 40%, the nation they built will no longer belong to them.
3
Wait several more years and we should have enough data to compare mortality rate among these whites in states that embraced ACA and in states that ignored or tried to push it back. Then we will really know whether voting GOP is good for the working class.
5
Watching Fox News would certainly drive me to drugs, drink and, maybe, suicide.
19
White middle aged men are dying because they have been disrespected and devalued by conventional wisdom and the liberal main stream media. The current economy values transactionalists (wall street traders, bankers, technology mobsters) over craftsmen, laborers, small business owners and farmers. The politicians pay lip service to helping the middle class but the net effect of their policies is to favor the top 1% and bottom 5%. Big government favors big business -strangling those in the middle with over regulation and taxes. Those in the bottom 5% have no incentive to earn more as they lose benefits faster then they gain wages. This gives the illusion of income redistribution while actually favoring the already rich.
4
READ THE STUDY ARTICLE AGAIN. This is not just men dying. The sexes are both considered. White working class women are dying at the same high rates, and of the same drugs, alcohol and suicide.
There is no fixing this issue until American Whites reverse their trends to vote for republicans. In fact, things will only get worse if current voting patterns stay the same. Voting republicans into power have far more effects on the economic well being of everyone than we care to admit. Simple policies such as raising the gasoline tax to pay for crumbling roads and infrastucture is frowned on by the new Republican Party. America the beautiful is becoming America the blighted at least as far as infrastructure is concerned. Problems are not solved but are diverted, maybe for the next generation to solve. Life saving prescription drugs are becoming more unaffordable for the middle class sometimes costing many thousands of dollars monthly while these same drugs are available in Canada and Mexico for pennies on the dollar here. The difference? Their government have a huge hand in regulating their drug cost. The cost of republicanism is a small percentage of winners (10-20%) while the vast majority are losers in this economy. Radical changes are needed to reverse this but it ain't coming. Good luck.
11
So, Ross, suck it up and soldier on, eh?
7
Well, at least it wasn't the Vatican Times cub reporter filing his weekly submission. But as a pseudo sociological/economics analyst he is even worse. Might I suggest he read George Packages The Unwinding. The money men and power brokers cashed their ticket on the under educated/underclass poor long ago. They live in Vietnam now. Money could care less about the ravages of poverty they leave behind. It is just one big resource ball of dirt to be exploited. So Ross, welcome to our world. No easy answers, just difficult questions, and god is not the answer, not this time, it never was.
8
I blame the destruction of unions and the extreme avarice that characterizes US working class life.
11
My theory: Rise is suicide rates parallels rise in use of antidepressants. Suicide is a known side effect. Whites and middle aged people are far more likely than others to be taking them. Belief in "chemical imbalance" has taken over the modern imagination about why depression exists. People who accept this idea, and the solution it implies (antidepressants) are not only made vulnerable by potential side effects, but may be diverted from investigating or resolving behavioral, spiritual, moral and, yes, material reasons for depression.
2
Ross lacks cross-cultural perspectives. In the former USSR middle-aged men, also cut off from previous economic system, started to have an unexpected rise in their mortality rates also. Implying that in the United States poorly-employed white men need to find religion to sustain them as factory jobs go abroad, is simply silly. Russia has the same problems we do, and for the same reasons, unless you believe with the right-wing that deaths of the economic underclass are just fine.
6
What if the root of the problem lies in the doctrine of personal responsibility? When people can't fulfill expectations to control their lives through "good choices," there is a crisis of confidence that produces stress. Sometimes people get sick from stress. Other times, they turn to drugs and alcohol.
I also suspect that the lower impact on poor blacks and Hispanics comes from the fact that they are used to struggling to achieve the American dream. Their rates of disease and drug abuse are already high. Poor whites are just catching up.
If religion helps people, I think that's a good thing, but it's not the answer. Blaming people for their poor morals is also not helpful.
Personally, I don't think that liberal attitudes actually undermine morality. As a liberal, I'm plenty moral, but I don't accept all the rules and regulations that some people want to use to govern morality.
I also suspect that the lower impact on poor blacks and Hispanics comes from the fact that they are used to struggling to achieve the American dream. Their rates of disease and drug abuse are already high. Poor whites are just catching up.
If religion helps people, I think that's a good thing, but it's not the answer. Blaming people for their poor morals is also not helpful.
Personally, I don't think that liberal attitudes actually undermine morality. As a liberal, I'm plenty moral, but I don't accept all the rules and regulations that some people want to use to govern morality.
7
"But in an era of stagnating wages, family breakdown, and social dislocation, this logic no longer seems to make as much sense."
Another possibility is that the white middle and lower class are big Tobacco's best customers.
Another possibility is that the white middle and lower class are big Tobacco's best customers.
1
"..the discipline and purpose that marriage and religion once supplied" Actually several recent surveys have shown that divorce rates among non believers tend to be lower than for believers, even Catholics who despite the statements of the Pope, can't divorce. They can only hope for a cleric to find a fault in their marriage that could grant them an annulment. So don't play us non-believers, we're not the cause of the strife.
2
Hey Russ:
Let's assess the impact of the illegitimate wars that your ilk have catalyzed and implemented over the last half century....and voila.
The answer is we send them (lower class americans) to inferno, but there is no treatment on the reentry.
Every urban american nonprofit food center/cafeteria for the "homeless" is 60% veterans.
Let's assess the impact of the illegitimate wars that your ilk have catalyzed and implemented over the last half century....and voila.
The answer is we send them (lower class americans) to inferno, but there is no treatment on the reentry.
Every urban american nonprofit food center/cafeteria for the "homeless" is 60% veterans.
5
STRESS & LOSS best explain why the white blue collar middle class are shrinking due to a drop in longevity. During earlier liberal eras, that demographic enjoyed a privileged status due to their hard-won advancement in wages, benefits and pensions.
Then along came monsters like Chain Saw Al, whose specialties were destroying the jobs of union members out of sheer greed and psychopathy. And here's Ross Douthat, the inveterate moral scold, who's blaming the prime victims of rapacious capitalism.
His mean-spirited approach of blaming the moral terpitude of the middle class for its demise ignore completely the cataclysmic greed of the 1% in consuming what was previously shared by the 99%. Such arguments are, I believe, unconscionable. The notion that Douthat is claiming the moral high ground would be laughable if it weren't so tragic and downright nasty.
Gee, I sure wish he'd stand as a presidential hopeful for the GOP! I believe the only reason he does not is because he has some experience that might prepare him for the job!
Then along came monsters like Chain Saw Al, whose specialties were destroying the jobs of union members out of sheer greed and psychopathy. And here's Ross Douthat, the inveterate moral scold, who's blaming the prime victims of rapacious capitalism.
His mean-spirited approach of blaming the moral terpitude of the middle class for its demise ignore completely the cataclysmic greed of the 1% in consuming what was previously shared by the 99%. Such arguments are, I believe, unconscionable. The notion that Douthat is claiming the moral high ground would be laughable if it weren't so tragic and downright nasty.
Gee, I sure wish he'd stand as a presidential hopeful for the GOP! I believe the only reason he does not is because he has some experience that might prepare him for the job!
6
I doubt many who read this will get your reference to Chainsaw Al but anyone, like me, who worked in a decent-paying working class job in that era will cringe at the very mention of his name. We have ignorance of history to blame for some of our current decline and some of it is very recent history so there's really no excuse for such ignorance. Don't know who Chainsaw Al is? Google Albert Dunlap. And then Google Neutron Jack, who left the factory buildings standing but evaporated all of the people. I was a victim of Neutron Jack, as were tens of thousand of my co-workers, including one who returned to the parking lot of our former plant to shoot himself. Neutron Jack went on to become a business "star" and Fox News contributor. I doubt he ever even knew about my suicidal co-worker and if he did, he didn't care.
6
30 years of Republican attacks on social programs, Income tax cuts have increasing the middle class' payroll taxes, suppressed wages, cuts to unemployment benefits, and a despicable war on women's health have devastated middle-class households.
Made to feel increasingly hopeless and economically desperate since the Great 2008 Rape of our economy by the haves and have-mores; have life for the Middle-Class and Working Poor serf-like in the face of exploding wealth for the Rich and Powerful.
The only salvation for the middle-class can be found in 2016's voting booths!
Made to feel increasingly hopeless and economically desperate since the Great 2008 Rape of our economy by the haves and have-mores; have life for the Middle-Class and Working Poor serf-like in the face of exploding wealth for the Rich and Powerful.
The only salvation for the middle-class can be found in 2016's voting booths!
8
It will never be enough for the sociopaths that bought the GOP: they are now taking away the table scraps from those that for decades were told that they are the "Real America" and needed to be protected from "Those People".
These non-college whites are the largest Republican voting bloc. Is it any wonder that they turn to substance abuse and exercising their cherished 2nd Amendment rights on themselves, now that it is patently clear that they've been fed a bunch of lies?
The moral superiority this group derived from religion and "family values" turned out to be a very thin veneer as soon as it became obvious that they too were on the wrong side of rampant cronyism and inequality.
This was never an issue as long as it was non-whites who were on the receiving end of these GOP policies that literally kill people. Now that it's whites, the conservatives take notice - shame on you.
These non-college whites are the largest Republican voting bloc. Is it any wonder that they turn to substance abuse and exercising their cherished 2nd Amendment rights on themselves, now that it is patently clear that they've been fed a bunch of lies?
The moral superiority this group derived from religion and "family values" turned out to be a very thin veneer as soon as it became obvious that they too were on the wrong side of rampant cronyism and inequality.
This was never an issue as long as it was non-whites who were on the receiving end of these GOP policies that literally kill people. Now that it's whites, the conservatives take notice - shame on you.
15
If working-class white Americans "adapt culturally . . . and learn from the resilience of communities that are used to struggling in the shadow of elite neglect", they will learn about the power of unified political action from minorities who have been waiting for generations for white folks to wake up. Black-white unity was always the nightmare of the Confederate elite, and they used racism to prevent or disrupt it; the Republican Party has taken these tactics national.
If full employment and a strong safety net do not materialize soon, white Americans will continue to see their lifespans shorten and their lives not matter, or they will create again the sort of resiliency they last found in the labor movement. Or white Americans might decide to push for more segregation, since it reserved for whites most of the better jobs. So we have paths of anomie, social democracy (socialism, some call it), or fascism.
If full employment and a strong safety net do not materialize soon, white Americans will continue to see their lifespans shorten and their lives not matter, or they will create again the sort of resiliency they last found in the labor movement. Or white Americans might decide to push for more segregation, since it reserved for whites most of the better jobs. So we have paths of anomie, social democracy (socialism, some call it), or fascism.
16
Thank you for making that distinction between social democracy and socialism - the first being a strong social safety net and the second being state ownership of the means of production for the benefit of the masses. Most people even Bernie Sanders, who to my knowledge has never advocated the latter, seems oblivious to the difference. I can't believe that's by accident.
1
We're now seeing the consequences of "trickle down" economics and "the government is the problem" ideology reaching the white working class. Blaming it on the social safety net is ridiculous.
Everything (except Defense spending and tax cuts) have to be offset or underfunded. Take the infrastructure legislation that just passed the House. It's a six-year bill to support the Highway Trust Fund but it's only funded for three years and at just enough to scrape by.
Democrats have been begging for funding to address our crumbling, deficient infrastructure for years but Republicans are adamantly opposed. Decay surrounds us, from third world airports, rail transportation and our power grid to unsafe roads and bridges that have become both disgraceful dangerous.
This lack of investment prevented millions of good jobs from being created that would have given greater economic security to those who have lost all hope of ever getting ahead.
Years of Republican refusal to invest in America is destroying Americans.
The suggestion of the author that struggling whites should follow the example of African Americans and Latinos and find strategies to cope with living off the few scraps thrown their way is demeaning and so off the mark of what needs to be done, it would be laughable if it wasn't so tragically insufficient and mean-spirited.
The ACA provides mental health services and red states refuse to expand Medicaid. No job, no counseling, no help - the Reagan Legacy on steroids.
Everything (except Defense spending and tax cuts) have to be offset or underfunded. Take the infrastructure legislation that just passed the House. It's a six-year bill to support the Highway Trust Fund but it's only funded for three years and at just enough to scrape by.
Democrats have been begging for funding to address our crumbling, deficient infrastructure for years but Republicans are adamantly opposed. Decay surrounds us, from third world airports, rail transportation and our power grid to unsafe roads and bridges that have become both disgraceful dangerous.
This lack of investment prevented millions of good jobs from being created that would have given greater economic security to those who have lost all hope of ever getting ahead.
Years of Republican refusal to invest in America is destroying Americans.
The suggestion of the author that struggling whites should follow the example of African Americans and Latinos and find strategies to cope with living off the few scraps thrown their way is demeaning and so off the mark of what needs to be done, it would be laughable if it wasn't so tragically insufficient and mean-spirited.
The ACA provides mental health services and red states refuse to expand Medicaid. No job, no counseling, no help - the Reagan Legacy on steroids.
98
If you bought a car and the manufacturer actually paid its workers and paid its parts suppliers, you contributed to trickle-down economics working AGAIN.
When you go to a brick-and-mortar store or Amazon-style retailers, you make trickle-down work out for dozens of people. Whoever's trying to train you to hate capitalism is fooling a lot of people. But why do they need you angry?
Why did half the state-level cooperatives go broke including true-blue Dem states? And Why did Mr. Obama change his mind on shovel-ready jobs?
When you go to a brick-and-mortar store or Amazon-style retailers, you make trickle-down work out for dozens of people. Whoever's trying to train you to hate capitalism is fooling a lot of people. But why do they need you angry?
Why did half the state-level cooperatives go broke including true-blue Dem states? And Why did Mr. Obama change his mind on shovel-ready jobs?
It is alarming to see the increasing mortality rates among less-educated, middle-aged whites as revealed by Dr. Deaton and Dr. Case . It was surprising because this was happening among whites. As usual you attribute it to modern liberalism with it's mix of moral permissiveness and welfare-state paternalism. And that was the reason attributed to increased mortality rates among Blacks. But with what is being revealed, that idea is debunked. The crux of the matter is rising inequality. Stagnant wages, lost jobs, jobs outsourced the middle-class has been battered. Breakdown of family and family structures with ever increasing difficulty to get societal help is resulting in all this dangerous mayhem. The symptoms appeared first among Blacks ( whose mortality rates are still the highest )because they had a historical disadvantage and the factor of race. But it is now becoming evident among Whites because inequality has taken a while longer to manifest having been relatively protected by societal norms. So the answer would be to decrease inequality so that all ships are raised, maybe, some more than others.
22
So your argument is that, if these working class white men could only "adapt" to having no jobs and no money, if they can get used to being unable to support their families, the problem would be solved. Get used to it, that's your prescription?
This is disgusting.
This is disgusting.
107
You are hopelessly naive. Adults must accept their limitations and simply pass on their hopes to the following generation by encouraging their self-discipline to pursue practical higher studies. The time of 'free stuff' is over.
Whites, even poor ones, have much better access to doctors and to narcotic prescriptions. Black patients are less likely to have their pain treated aggressively, and are less likely to be demanding for narcotics or doctor shop to get them.
White males with low skills cannot make a decent living, which is a cultural shift for whites. This would argue that raising the minimum wage sharply, and supplementing the incomes of the working poor with a much more expansive EITC program, would allow a sense of dignity and purpose to many who can't get it making 7.50 an hour at WalMart. If a married couple both worked, and minimum wage was 12 dollars per hour, household income would be 50k per year putting them in the middle class almost everywhere but the most expensive cities in the nation. Having affordable child care for the working poor would also make work much more rewarding. If a mom has to pay 1200 a month for child care plus transportation meals and wardrobe for work, and only makes minimum wage, there is little to nothing left, so why bother?
White males with low skills cannot make a decent living, which is a cultural shift for whites. This would argue that raising the minimum wage sharply, and supplementing the incomes of the working poor with a much more expansive EITC program, would allow a sense of dignity and purpose to many who can't get it making 7.50 an hour at WalMart. If a married couple both worked, and minimum wage was 12 dollars per hour, household income would be 50k per year putting them in the middle class almost everywhere but the most expensive cities in the nation. Having affordable child care for the working poor would also make work much more rewarding. If a mom has to pay 1200 a month for child care plus transportation meals and wardrobe for work, and only makes minimum wage, there is little to nothing left, so why bother?
11
Do you have ANY data that black people aren't getting to the doctor or are you going on more superstition?
Nayer,
That's one hypothesis. Another might be working class whites are now getting the same treatment blacks and Latinos got all along.
-dlj.
3
If minimum rose that quickly to 50% higher (or 100% higher, as some call for), the Walmarts and McDs of the world would cut hours and automate.
Your example assumes that a married couple with such low-skill jobs would get 40 hours of work! and that is pure fiction. Today, they might get 30 hours. Double minimum wage, and they will get 20 hours or less.
NOTE: you are describing the working poor. This article was about the working class, or maybe more accurately, lower middle class.
Your example assumes that a married couple with such low-skill jobs would get 40 hours of work! and that is pure fiction. Today, they might get 30 hours. Double minimum wage, and they will get 20 hours or less.
NOTE: you are describing the working poor. This article was about the working class, or maybe more accurately, lower middle class.
1
This column ignores, as do most of the media analyses of this news, that "the dying of the whites" occurred only among the 45-54 age cohort of non-college educated white Americans. Apparently whatever political, cultural or economic factors are at play, they did not affect the same group of people who were older or younger.
Maybe we need to focus a little more on the special needs and particular situation of the 45-54 age group to understand this phenomenon more clearly before making generalization supporting either conservative or liberal viewpoints.
Maybe we need to focus a little more on the special needs and particular situation of the 45-54 age group to understand this phenomenon more clearly before making generalization supporting either conservative or liberal viewpoints.
10
Is the 45-54 age cohort when mid-life crises occur?
3
Republicans are to blame for this because they have convinced a lot of suffering white people that they stand with them. This is a cynical hoax, but one must admit that it has largely been successful.
26
The distinguishing feature of the white working class is a hatred of education, intelligence, and reason, and a love of the stupid and oversimplified. They cannot see that their rich white brethren are cleaning them out. Poor Hispanics and blacks are also being cleaned out, but at least they can see where their interests lie. They are therefore not as bewildered as the whites and less likely to shoot themselves in the foot, by, for example, opposing Obamacare.
Liberals have known for some time what is wrong with Kansas. Now it is showing up in the hard numbers. I don't expect anything to change though, because the effect isn't big enough to convince the poor blighters. Truly, being stupid is the worst curse of all.
Liberals have known for some time what is wrong with Kansas. Now it is showing up in the hard numbers. I don't expect anything to change though, because the effect isn't big enough to convince the poor blighters. Truly, being stupid is the worst curse of all.
60
Didn't the working class in the red states and some of the mid-west vote for Bush? They lost their jobs because Bush/Cheney outsourced their jobs to India and then to China. This is now Obama's fault? The taxes paid by those on both coasts shore up medicaid for the South. As far as creating jobs, perhaps the red states might consider voting for Democratic members of the House where the budget is controlled. Infrastructure, health care, education etc. Nixon's Southern Strategy fooled a lot Southern voters, and the foolishness lingers on.
5
Exactly. The American Scene has always been rife with strident anti-intellectualism which pours disdain on cautious thinkers. The sole exception to this permanent feature of American society involves an oddball like Steve Jobs because he made a 'killing' out of his computing for the masses breakthrough. If there is no money to be made out of an intellectual endeavor, it's worthless to most Americans.
5
Condescend much?
1
As Reagan/Bush began class war on behalf of the privileged. blacks and hispanics started (in general) less well off than whites. 2015 still looks like "up" to many of them. "Up" compared to where their parents were.
In 1981, middle-class whites were (in general) more privileged. Ditto in 2001 and in 2008, when the crash came. As inequality widened throughout this time, middle-class whites perceive their situation (rightly) as "down." Down compared to hedge-fund managers, successful entertainers, the 1+%, Mitt Romney.
In 1981, middle-class whites were (in general) more privileged. Ditto in 2001 and in 2008, when the crash came. As inequality widened throughout this time, middle-class whites perceive their situation (rightly) as "down." Down compared to hedge-fund managers, successful entertainers, the 1+%, Mitt Romney.
8
Ross Douthat's column should be a wake-up call to working class citizens that no one on the left or right has a clue about the plight this new underclass of American society.
Because, if elitists like Ross Douthat left their ivory tower for five minutes they might notice a common theme throughout America, from Flint to upstate new York to rural communities throughout the south and urban slums everywhere.
Jobs that provided financial and emotional stability for working class Americans have eroded in droves for more than a generation.
So Mr. Douthat, what is your answer when a working class stiff can't find a job to keep a roof over one's head and food on the table?
More old time religion, a lecture about intestinal fortitude and the "dangers" of a "nanny" government?
Hogwash!
Working class Americans need jobs!
Because, jobs provide stability and hope.
Or, is that concept also too obtuse for people on the political right, Mr. Douthat?
Because, if elitists like Ross Douthat left their ivory tower for five minutes they might notice a common theme throughout America, from Flint to upstate new York to rural communities throughout the south and urban slums everywhere.
Jobs that provided financial and emotional stability for working class Americans have eroded in droves for more than a generation.
So Mr. Douthat, what is your answer when a working class stiff can't find a job to keep a roof over one's head and food on the table?
More old time religion, a lecture about intestinal fortitude and the "dangers" of a "nanny" government?
Hogwash!
Working class Americans need jobs!
Because, jobs provide stability and hope.
Or, is that concept also too obtuse for people on the political right, Mr. Douthat?
39
Some union members voted against their interests, especially in 1980, then doubled down again in 1984.
The Bush family completed the damage.
The laws of cause and effect cannot be rescinded.
The Bush family completed the damage.
The laws of cause and effect cannot be rescinded.
18
What's most incredible in all of this, is how poor whites tend to vote against their own economic interests in favor of cultural issues, believing the republican lies about gay marriage, abortion, immigration and climate change.
These folks could be most helped by democrats but somehow, they never got the message and continue to support the GOP.
These folks could be most helped by democrats but somehow, they never got the message and continue to support the GOP.
28
The people in the study are not "poor" -- working class does not translate as "poor". There is no evidence here they were unemployed, or in greater numbers than the general population. There is evidence they had no health insurance or health care. There is no evidence how any of these people felt about gay marriage or abortion -- for all you know, they were in favor of those things.
No more raises, no jobs after 50, feeling lied to about the "dream," the end of American exceptionalism, personal bankruptcies due to health care costs, religions that encourage bigotry, excessive psychotherapy costs.
21
Fregan just described Cuba. You go ahead and make the move but include me out.
Mr. Douthat, you are wrong on all counts, though only a little off about the religion issue. The problem over all, is the disillusionment in White People losing their religion, that is, the State Religion of Capitalism. And Republicans "leaders" are the droning priestly class on that count. It was a little crude, the wailing and gnashing of teeth when these same "leaders" carried on about the loss of the Keystone oil pipeline, as if it was a national sin that will bring the wrath of God down to smite us all in our ignorance. But this death rate uptick, by suicide, liver disease and substance abuse and addiction is simply the realization of the futility. All of the companies our brand loyalties financed into multinational world powers, turned their back on us all. But the blame lies in the stock holders, and if you want to rebel, withdraw your dwindling retirement accounts and put that money to work rebuilding local community, rather than letting Wall Street add it to their balance sheets to finance the global market manipulations.
7
I think the minority communities have support systems in place, either government or community to try to move those communities forward, and they should, but the poor white community may need some attention as well, there are plenty of underpriveleged poor whites and perhaps programs should focus on helping all who are in need of help. There is an expectation if you are white, that you will automatically be successful, and if that doesn't happen it may be very difficult to accept, emotionally and in every way, which could account for the suicide rate, probably there are not enough support systems in white communities to help people who are unsuccessful, and so the place to turn might be drugs, and ultimately suicide. Very sad, more research and attention is needed here, all should be lifted up and cared for. I do know that education today may have contributed, there are literally no programs in schools any more for anyone who is not academically inclined, unlike days of old, it is fast track to college or nothing, and highschool can be superchallenging for someone not academically inclined, and there are plenty who are not, and plenty that are white, so when they drop out or don't go to college, they have no marketable skills. Have to change the schools so they address all kinds of kids, there should not be one track to college and nothing else offered.
5
Ross, I think you are on to something. Blacks and Latinos have had far worse hands to play than blue collar whites, but show better health outcomes in this study. Perhaps they have adapted to misfortune better because they know it better.
There was a Navy study during WW II that found Protestant sailors and airmen survived crashes and shipwrecks at a higher rate than Catholics. When they tried to identify the reason, they found that the Catholics frequently accepted their fate and focused on prayer. The Protestants focused on obtaining potable water and avoiding the enemy.
Magical thinking is fine, but I'll place my wager on survival instinct and grit.
There was a Navy study during WW II that found Protestant sailors and airmen survived crashes and shipwrecks at a higher rate than Catholics. When they tried to identify the reason, they found that the Catholics frequently accepted their fate and focused on prayer. The Protestants focused on obtaining potable water and avoiding the enemy.
Magical thinking is fine, but I'll place my wager on survival instinct and grit.
18
My uncles left law school to become captains on a destroyer and an aircraft carrier. They were both Jesuit educated Catholics. So what is your point about Catholics? Do you think they didn't enlist and fight? Do you think only Methodists, Baptists and Episcopalians joined and fought? Why don't you find that old Martin Luther writ and nail it to St. Paul's cathedral?
1
I have read neither the article nor the four comments that currently exist. But I would bet my next (working class, therefore very tiny) paycheck that at some point in the piece Douthat is going to say that lack of marriage and lack of religion is to blame. Never mind that lack of decent jobs and wages leading to lack of hope is the real issue. Nope, the white working class' problems could be solved by going to church and getting married.
Am I right?
Am I right?
37
Pedigrees, you have him pegged perfectly.
5
you are right!!!
5
Deaths due to drugs, alcohol, and suicide you say!
I never would have imagined it in a country with no universal healthcare, low wages, and rampant underemployment, and no real hope for change on the horizon.
I never would have imagined it in a country with no universal healthcare, low wages, and rampant underemployment, and no real hope for change on the horizon.
41
Even the worst health care situation imaginable does not compel someone to use drugs, drink or kill themselves.
BTW: rich people with fantastic employer-paid health insurance still do drugs, drink and kill themselves.
BTW: rich people with fantastic employer-paid health insurance still do drugs, drink and kill themselves.
If indeed the mortality phenomena analyzed by Deaton and Case are caused by a sense among less-educated, late-middle-aged whites of “dispossession”, then, as hard as it sounds it could be self-correcting: soon enough, we’d have a less-pale America of better-motivated survivors.
But I’m not so sure. I’d be interested in knowing the composition of the long-term unemployed, those who have dropped out, causing our labor participation rate to plummet. I suspect that these aging people who no longer can find jobs that match the skills they have or had … are overwhelmingly white since the advent of The Great Recession, and before that since offshoring and automation began to displace middle-class jobs. If so, the permanent reduction in living standards and in assumptions about the future occasioned not directly by “dispossession” but by employment factors could be causing a large part of that higher mortality rate. Again, though, as hard as it is, it could be self-correcting, except that the survivors may not be as “less-pale” as under the other conclusion, particularly as EVERY demographic likely will be challenged soon by a dearth of jobs owing to advancing automation that supplants human labor.
But, in the end, external and artificial means of making ANY people feel like they matter probably can’t be effective without the internal grittiness that sustains such a feeling even with a little help. Moral: the world perhaps remains more Darwinian than we think.
But I’m not so sure. I’d be interested in knowing the composition of the long-term unemployed, those who have dropped out, causing our labor participation rate to plummet. I suspect that these aging people who no longer can find jobs that match the skills they have or had … are overwhelmingly white since the advent of The Great Recession, and before that since offshoring and automation began to displace middle-class jobs. If so, the permanent reduction in living standards and in assumptions about the future occasioned not directly by “dispossession” but by employment factors could be causing a large part of that higher mortality rate. Again, though, as hard as it is, it could be self-correcting, except that the survivors may not be as “less-pale” as under the other conclusion, particularly as EVERY demographic likely will be challenged soon by a dearth of jobs owing to advancing automation that supplants human labor.
But, in the end, external and artificial means of making ANY people feel like they matter probably can’t be effective without the internal grittiness that sustains such a feeling even with a little help. Moral: the world perhaps remains more Darwinian than we think.
5
The paper referenced on middle aged death was refused publication by the prestigious journals JAMA and the NEJM, presumably for the quality of the research.
Did Ross Douthat know this?
Did Ross Douthat know this?
8
Thank you for including that. This is sensationalist journalism at its finest. This is right up there with killer bacon and deadly aspartame. While there is a lack of representation in the middle aged white community, that alone doesn't cause mass depression. Perhaps it's realizing that jobs are never coming back that has driven middle aged males to take their lives. For a long time now they were the breadwinners and now there are no jobs to sustain them. While the White House chortles over job numbers (ignoring many are part time and seasonal) they ignore that white males over 50 are being laid off in drastic numbers. My husband worked in communications for 30 years. In our circle of friends every single couple has experienced long term unemployment. It is not for lack of trying. I know my husband has sent out resumes, applications and talked to headhunters galore as have his friends. It is rather than white males over 50 are viewed as expendable. Rather than trying to train them, companies shed them like old skin. If you look at the unemployment or premature retirement in this category you will find it is growing. What should alarm the White House is this is the period when American workers should be earning the most, saving the most and paying the most in taxes. None of those things are happening. Our income was slashed by 60%. We tread water thanks to my teaching job-one from which I will never be able to retire. Grim stats indeed.
4
Ross, the comments of K. Garcia, ScottW, and gemli deal quite well with most of the basic flaws in your argument that whites should learn to adapt culturally following patterns of other ethnicities in America so I can focus on the basic facts presented in figure 1 of Case and Deaton, a PNAS report freely available on line through PNAS Open Access. Have you studied that figure, Ross?
That figure does show the upswing in All Cause mortality (ACM) among "white" Americans (USW) age 45-54. That is a fact. But there is a far more important fact shown in figure 1. The approximate average ACM for USW 1990-2010 is 415/100,000 "whites"-
Compare that with the TOTAL population curves for UK, CAN, AUS, and SWE - total population, "förstår du?", do you understand, Ross? ACM 45-54 y in 2010 ranges from 275 (UK) to 215 (SWE).
The total population of Sweden, from where I write, does not have that low value because it goes to church or learns from less fortunate such as American "blacks". Key factor no. 1 is almost certainly universal health care, and no. 2 very likely comprises various support programs.
Garcia, ScottW, and gemli all point to those factors so Ross, it is time for your to really learn about other countries, really learn-facts.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Dual citizen-USA-SE
That figure does show the upswing in All Cause mortality (ACM) among "white" Americans (USW) age 45-54. That is a fact. But there is a far more important fact shown in figure 1. The approximate average ACM for USW 1990-2010 is 415/100,000 "whites"-
Compare that with the TOTAL population curves for UK, CAN, AUS, and SWE - total population, "förstår du?", do you understand, Ross? ACM 45-54 y in 2010 ranges from 275 (UK) to 215 (SWE).
The total population of Sweden, from where I write, does not have that low value because it goes to church or learns from less fortunate such as American "blacks". Key factor no. 1 is almost certainly universal health care, and no. 2 very likely comprises various support programs.
Garcia, ScottW, and gemli all point to those factors so Ross, it is time for your to really learn about other countries, really learn-facts.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Dual citizen-USA-SE
28
Hunter S. Thompson epitomizes the deeply disaffected Caucasian American Male today. Morally bankrupt, feckless and hollow as a result of radical feminism, atheism, post modernism etc.
The Caucasian Male American is under the gun financially, emotionally and spiritually in the land that his forefathers settled and fought to defend. It should be made clear that suicide and alcoholism are dead-ends and that they do not solve anything for anyone.
Suicide and alcohol create far deeper and more profound problems than they resolve.
The Caucasian Male American is under the gun financially, emotionally and spiritually in the land that his forefathers settled and fought to defend. It should be made clear that suicide and alcoholism are dead-ends and that they do not solve anything for anyone.
Suicide and alcohol create far deeper and more profound problems than they resolve.
5
Truer words have never been spoken than Ross arrives at in the fourth paragraph here. Every devout liberal will have to denounce the whole thing but will have no historical truth to go on.
This is why the socialist experiments always fail. Mankind inwardly REQUIRES the chance to improve his or her one life and those of their dependents by the their own labor and whenever elites demand Power by growing a government that they control, the flame in the human hear dies.
The political Right is thoroughly in FAVOR of having a government but it MUST be kept within strictly prescribed limits, else it becomes a wild, raging river sweeping all good things away in its path. The Founders look either smarter or Divinely inspired every year now.
This is why the socialist experiments always fail. Mankind inwardly REQUIRES the chance to improve his or her one life and those of their dependents by the their own labor and whenever elites demand Power by growing a government that they control, the flame in the human hear dies.
The political Right is thoroughly in FAVOR of having a government but it MUST be kept within strictly prescribed limits, else it becomes a wild, raging river sweeping all good things away in its path. The Founders look either smarter or Divinely inspired every year now.
2
Here's a very unpopular thought--Democratic presidents and lawmakers have been very apathetic when it came to helping the aging white Baby Boom generation grapple deal with our problems. For example when it was announced that there would be no Social Security cost of living increase in 2016 there wasn't a peep out of the Obama White House. Where was Barack Obama? How come our first black president didn't express any concern that Senior Citizens were being left to twist in the wind? Unfortunately white Americans usually lack the strong family ties that blacks and Hispanics enjoy. Our families just don't stick together anymore. It didn't help that for decades White Americans have been unfairly demonized as being responsible for every evil that befell America from 1492 to the present day. Whites were scapegoated as unrepentant racists who were determined to keep downtrodden minorities in their place. Early retirement is becoming harder and harder to get--62 is now the new 55. Therefore is it any wonder that suicide among whites over 50 is on the rise?? But then again who cares????
8
@ Sharon - Sharon, you are masterful at generalizing. How can you possibly generalize about family ties among white Americans? One of the first things I noticed when I came to Sweden long ago after living in Brighton and Rochester, New York was that the first families I knew here - one Kurd (Sunni muslim) and one Assyrian (Christian) were exactly like the Jewish families I knew in Brighton, Rochester, and the Village - tight like that, at least 3 generations.
And since my reply to you did not make it 2 days ago, please note that in the Case and Deaton study, the group they studied was, to use your phrase, "lily white", while the groups they compare in 6 countries are the total populations of those countries (in age group 45-64) definitely not lily white.
Keep commenting but fewer generalizations, please.
Larry
And since my reply to you did not make it 2 days ago, please note that in the Case and Deaton study, the group they studied was, to use your phrase, "lily white", while the groups they compare in 6 countries are the total populations of those countries (in age group 45-64) definitely not lily white.
Keep commenting but fewer generalizations, please.
Larry
2
The president doesn't determine COLA increases, Congress does. Please put the blame where it lies, at the feet of the REPUBLICAN controlled government.
6
It all started during the largely criminal reign of Eureka College guy cheerleader, WW II dodger Reagan.
Tax credits for sending jobs abroad, gutting and weakening unions, wild deficit spending devoted to perpetual war, tax free billions for the plutocracy, demonization of the poor and the theft and diversion of public education and social services money. The whites who are succumbing grew up in the richest nation in world history and in their lifetime have experienced massive change. If they won't work for a Chinese wage, well, the jobs are going to China.
Of course blacks and Latino's are doing better. They've been down so long everything looks up to them.
Tax credits for sending jobs abroad, gutting and weakening unions, wild deficit spending devoted to perpetual war, tax free billions for the plutocracy, demonization of the poor and the theft and diversion of public education and social services money. The whites who are succumbing grew up in the richest nation in world history and in their lifetime have experienced massive change. If they won't work for a Chinese wage, well, the jobs are going to China.
Of course blacks and Latino's are doing better. They've been down so long everything looks up to them.
599
For what its worth, Craig, Reagan did serve in the Army Air Force during World War II making training films. His daddy didn't pull strings to get him into the Texas Air National Guard, which another political heavyweight got his son into to avoid the Vietnam draft. Boy Geiorge never fulfilled his ANG obligations, yet still got an Honorable, which supposed was "fixed" by his daddy too. One of our more respected Presidents, Bill Clinton, manipulated ROTC the college admissions process to get into law school without incurring any military obligation, and the nation prospered during his administration despite his "bimbo eruptions."
As a fellow 'Nam vet (USN, Yankee Station 1969-1970), if I had the means to do what "Slick Willie" did to avoid the war, I would have done so, but in the end I went to college and law school on the G.I. Bill and led a productive life, although not in politics. Yes, some lawyers do have ethics!
As a fellow 'Nam vet (USN, Yankee Station 1969-1970), if I had the means to do what "Slick Willie" did to avoid the war, I would have done so, but in the end I went to college and law school on the G.I. Bill and led a productive life, although not in politics. Yes, some lawyers do have ethics!
2
@craig geary
If you only blame republicans, you are missing other factors that contribute to the problem.
If you only blame republicans, you are missing other factors that contribute to the problem.
If white people truly believed in their intellectual moral hard working supremacy then they would not have had to cheat by enslavement and Jim Crow and mass incarceration. In the normal course of things blacks would have lost to those whites with more merit and qualifications. Ali and Air won their plaudits fair and square. But white people historically won in America in every field of socioeconomic political educational endeavor primarily, if not entirely, by not being colored African yellow, brown and black.
3
And maybe just maybe the answer to white male Malaise is the fact there are no jobs, the safety net is being eroded to pay for even more tax breaks for the wealthy, jobs are being off shored or disappearing altogether, retirement savings being used to pay bills, and the GOP is threatening to privatize Social Security.
It wasn't supposed to be this way was it Ross, the dignity of work? But corporate greed and globalism have conspired to create a new underclass .
So please do not blame it on the corruption of liberal values. As James Carville famously said, it's the economy stupid. Men who cannot bring home the bacon, are not going to find much solace in the fact that all they need is a good dose of self-reliance and family values when what they really need and want is a paycheck.
It wasn't supposed to be this way was it Ross, the dignity of work? But corporate greed and globalism have conspired to create a new underclass .
So please do not blame it on the corruption of liberal values. As James Carville famously said, it's the economy stupid. Men who cannot bring home the bacon, are not going to find much solace in the fact that all they need is a good dose of self-reliance and family values when what they really need and want is a paycheck.
63
Ms. McMorrow,
Well stated. If I may add:
I believe that the cause of this malaise is economic. It is far too common for middle aged men to lose their jobs to younger men who will work harder and for less money. Also when the economy shed blue collar and factory jobs that could support the families of the non-college educated, where were these men to turn? It is hardly a surprise that they would become despondent and turn to drugs and alcohol (and let's not forgot horrible diet choices and smoking).
This country needs full employment, and American workers deserve the loyalty they have earned from their employers. Steel, textiles, and electronics including computers and cell phones are not made in this country, yet are imported daily from overseas (mainly China). It's time for an economic nationalism. It's time for our Government to help American businesses that produce and sell here. The Government should incentivize production here. It's shameful that Apple produces its phone and watch for pennies and sells it here for hundreds of dollars. Free trade cannot work when American companies betray American workers. It's time to rethink trade policy. The Government needs to bring back protectionism and the tariff, not to stifle competition and guarantee corporate profits, but to protect American workers. Give these men jobs and decent livelihood and they'll healthier and happier lives.
Well stated. If I may add:
I believe that the cause of this malaise is economic. It is far too common for middle aged men to lose their jobs to younger men who will work harder and for less money. Also when the economy shed blue collar and factory jobs that could support the families of the non-college educated, where were these men to turn? It is hardly a surprise that they would become despondent and turn to drugs and alcohol (and let's not forgot horrible diet choices and smoking).
This country needs full employment, and American workers deserve the loyalty they have earned from their employers. Steel, textiles, and electronics including computers and cell phones are not made in this country, yet are imported daily from overseas (mainly China). It's time for an economic nationalism. It's time for our Government to help American businesses that produce and sell here. The Government should incentivize production here. It's shameful that Apple produces its phone and watch for pennies and sells it here for hundreds of dollars. Free trade cannot work when American companies betray American workers. It's time to rethink trade policy. The Government needs to bring back protectionism and the tariff, not to stifle competition and guarantee corporate profits, but to protect American workers. Give these men jobs and decent livelihood and they'll healthier and happier lives.
7
"a kind of resilience, a capacity for dealing with stagnation and disappointment (and elite indifference or hostility), which many working-class white Americans did not necessarily expect to ever need." Therein, Mr. Douthat, lies the rub. Working-class whites have long considered themselves exempt from the "immiseration" that you sneeringly refer to as the safety net of the "welfare state" that seem particularly [racially? culturally?] to appeal only to African-Amerians and Latinos. Working-class whites have always [it seems to me] to have relished their role as the soldier ants for the white aristocracy, the buffers between their betters and the undesirables. That the Right has kept hacking away at the safety net and working-class whites are falling through it must come as a great surprise. They seem to ask, "we did all of this for you. Is poverty our reward?" Also, Mr. Douthat, the increasing death rate of whites between the ages of 45-54 beg the question: in Republican-dominated states, where antipathy to President Obama's ACA is the life's blood, could Medicaid expansion have led to earlier diagnosis and treatment of these social and physical pathologies? Just asking.
11
The statistics in the study cover the entire US. It is not limited to red states, nor to the South or Midwest.
Or do you imagine that there are no working class white people in Massachusetts -- because YOU are wealthy and live in a hipster enclave of other wealthy white professionals? If you think that, you need to get out more. MA has a large population of working class people.
Or do you imagine that there are no working class white people in Massachusetts -- because YOU are wealthy and live in a hipster enclave of other wealthy white professionals? If you think that, you need to get out more. MA has a large population of working class people.
1
@ Concerned-Concerned I agree with you that it appears that a great many thought the articles - all of them - were about men. However, the Abstract of the research paper by Case and Deaton opens with this line:
"This paper documents a marked increase in all-cause mortality of middle-aged white non-Hispanic men and women in the United States..."
The authors point this out but do not provide separate data for men and women and I do not see any place where they comment on possible differences between men and women.
Larry
"This paper documents a marked increase in all-cause mortality of middle-aged white non-Hispanic men and women in the United States..."
The authors point this out but do not provide separate data for men and women and I do not see any place where they comment on possible differences between men and women.
Larry
1
whites are loosing 'white privilege' status and any meaningful safety net. the social compact which allowed them to prosper has been broken.
4
The difference is the sense of entitlement that the white working class, males in particular, have assumed. When I was growing up it was a given that white males, whatever their educational attainment or skills, could get middle class jobs and that women, whatever happened, would never have to clean other people's houses. Labor force segregation was a safety net for the white working class: black people were locked out of good blue collar jobs so white men didn't have competition and there were always decent employment options for them. And women were locked out of all but non-pink-collar jobs so women weren't competing.
Now that's changed and white working class males, who assumed that they were entitled to good, secure jobs at decent pay because that's what they were accustomed to, can't get good jobs because, in a fairer job market, they don't have the skills or qualifications to compete effectively. Given their sense of entitlement, they see fairness as unfairness disadvantaging them. This is not hard to understand. But the solution, if any, is another thing.
Now that's changed and white working class males, who assumed that they were entitled to good, secure jobs at decent pay because that's what they were accustomed to, can't get good jobs because, in a fairer job market, they don't have the skills or qualifications to compete effectively. Given their sense of entitlement, they see fairness as unfairness disadvantaging them. This is not hard to understand. But the solution, if any, is another thing.
9
Except the study is about BOTH MEN AND WOMEN. The women are also dying at rising rates, of alcoholism, drugs and suicide.
Since those women were "liberated" from that pink collar ghetto, to go get those fantastic male-only jobs -- why wouldn't they be happy? and affluent? Why are they doing drugs, drinking and killing themselves?
NOTE: many people misread the study headline to say "White working class MALES". It does not say that. The study showed high rates of both men AND WOMEN.
Since those women were "liberated" from that pink collar ghetto, to go get those fantastic male-only jobs -- why wouldn't they be happy? and affluent? Why are they doing drugs, drinking and killing themselves?
NOTE: many people misread the study headline to say "White working class MALES". It does not say that. The study showed high rates of both men AND WOMEN.
1
I don't mean to channel a nightmare for Douthat, but I am reminded of a book title that received a great deal of derisive comment: It Takes a Village.
At the end of his column, Douthat tentatively raises a point I, and several liberals (gasp) have said for some time: there is a need for systemic investment in the lives of our fellow citizens. Expand government services and funding so that education, childcare and family counseling services are easily and directly accessible - and free. Implement massive stimulus programs to grow jobs and raise wages. Provide real funding for job training, including a living wage during that training (BTW, "W" proposed, as part of his compassionate conservatism, a job training plan that would have provided somewhat less than $5000 per person; at the time, the corporation I worked had hard calculations that said it cost us near $10,000, on top of the salaries). Other needs are present; these are only a few.
I remember Dickens' Micawber: (paraphrasing) Income, $500; expense, $495. Result, happiness. Income, $500; expense, $505. Result, misery.
I volunteer at a food pantry. Our clients aren't deadbeats. They just need help, in a systematic, consistent, long-term application.
At the end of his column, Douthat tentatively raises a point I, and several liberals (gasp) have said for some time: there is a need for systemic investment in the lives of our fellow citizens. Expand government services and funding so that education, childcare and family counseling services are easily and directly accessible - and free. Implement massive stimulus programs to grow jobs and raise wages. Provide real funding for job training, including a living wage during that training (BTW, "W" proposed, as part of his compassionate conservatism, a job training plan that would have provided somewhat less than $5000 per person; at the time, the corporation I worked had hard calculations that said it cost us near $10,000, on top of the salaries). Other needs are present; these are only a few.
I remember Dickens' Micawber: (paraphrasing) Income, $500; expense, $495. Result, happiness. Income, $500; expense, $505. Result, misery.
I volunteer at a food pantry. Our clients aren't deadbeats. They just need help, in a systematic, consistent, long-term application.
377
What you are saying is that your clients at the food pantry need a nanny state -- the state as a parent -- to give them "free everything" from food and clothing, to spending money and education, day care for their kids, and oh yeah -- a job, no matter how untalented, incompetent, lazy or shiftless they are.
All courtesy of some magical pixie fairy dust you will conjure out of your magician's hat.
Is there some part of "we are 18 TRILLION DOLLARS IN DEBT" that you do not hear or acknowledge?
All courtesy of some magical pixie fairy dust you will conjure out of your magician's hat.
Is there some part of "we are 18 TRILLION DOLLARS IN DEBT" that you do not hear or acknowledge?
1
The finding about the white middle class and its rates of drug use, suicide and death do not actually invite interpretation from the right or left. It is the beginning of a conversation that invites more data and more analysis. What happened to suicide and drug use rates among the compared populations? How has the marketing or price of legal and illicit drugs changed in the compared populations over the time periods of interest? How has the attitude toward trying and using drugs changed? Etc, etc and etc until something with explanatory power emerges.
But Douthat is paid to render the world in ideological colors. And so the irrelevant perspective of Liberal vs Conservative is offered up as being informative. Conversations are not enriched by ideological claims. Rather they pollute the waters by substituting shadow explanations for actual understanding of mechanisms, causes and correlations. Ideology is a crutch used by those unable to deal with data. The Douthats of this world deal with data exactly as long as it strengthens the political argument that they want to make and then they discard it like a poop bag on the dog walk. Watch the so-called conservatives talk about climate.
Professor Frankfurt's description of BS in his book On Bullsh*t describes ideological discourse. A pox........
Regards,
Chuck
But Douthat is paid to render the world in ideological colors. And so the irrelevant perspective of Liberal vs Conservative is offered up as being informative. Conversations are not enriched by ideological claims. Rather they pollute the waters by substituting shadow explanations for actual understanding of mechanisms, causes and correlations. Ideology is a crutch used by those unable to deal with data. The Douthats of this world deal with data exactly as long as it strengthens the political argument that they want to make and then they discard it like a poop bag on the dog walk. Watch the so-called conservatives talk about climate.
Professor Frankfurt's description of BS in his book On Bullsh*t describes ideological discourse. A pox........
Regards,
Chuck
30
@ James Wilson AKA Chuck - Chuck you as a V get to put in print an important point I make endlessly in submissions including one on this column. The point is that a study cited here Case-Deaton could be used by columnists and commenters as the basis for arguing why such a study is simply a first step that must be followed by more analysis, preferably without fixation on "race" based medicine.
Instead, as you note, all we get is columnist analysis in terms of ideology. Thanks for trying.
Larry
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Instead, as you note, all we get is columnist analysis in terms of ideology. Thanks for trying.
Larry
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Black and Hispanic death rates are not rising because they were already high, and for all of these same reasons. As whites now fall into the same abyss, they suffer the same harms.
If it gets bad enough, eventually white too would bottom out. After they hit bottom, they too might even start to have some slight improvements. I suppose Douthat would call that success for the policies that drove them down.
If it gets bad enough, eventually white too would bottom out. After they hit bottom, they too might even start to have some slight improvements. I suppose Douthat would call that success for the policies that drove them down.
158
No, Mexican death rates have always been strikingly low, even in Mexico. Life expectancy in Mexico (77.1 years) has almost caught up with life expectancy in America (78.4 years) even though Mexico recently overtook America for the title of most obese large country.
1
And having hit bottom willl they continue voting against their own interests and for feudalist oligarchic Republicans???
4
It isn't politics or economics that is causing this rise in mortality it's the basic fact that men generally do not look after themselves as well as women. Besides men have often been taught to "tough it out". If we want to change the statistics we have to teach our boys to be aware of themselves and the damage they can do by neglecting themselves.
13
Men are often toughing it out because their new Obamacare deductibles are in the $2,500-$4,000 range. Mine is $3100. On top of monthly premiums that jumped by over 50%, (just been informed via mail that my premiums are jumping another 18% for 2016). In the most disgusting of ironies, the spread of Obamacare insurance.plans have ultimately destroyed access to non emergent healthcare services for the very people it claimed to be "helping". Depressing, really. (I would go get some depression meds, but again , the deductible looms large overhead ))
1
I made this mistake initially myself. I thought the study said "white working-class MEN".
It does not. The numbers of men and women in the study are roughly equal. Women are dying at the same rates as men, and for the same reasons.
It does not. The numbers of men and women in the study are roughly equal. Women are dying at the same rates as men, and for the same reasons.
2
Jerry-EVERYTHING is OBAMA'S fault!!! Will this myth ever die? Here's a news flash for you: the states with the highest suicide rates are the states that don't OFFER Obamacare!! I have friends who have deductibles in the thousands with their employer provided health insurance and they have also not gone do the doctor in years so again how do you blame Obamacare? At least because of Obamacare their yearly physicals and some diagnostic screenings are now copay free. So what is their excuse for not going to the doctor? My husband's employer provided health insurance has gone up EVERY year since he's been working (1975), long before Obama came on the scene. But yeah it's all Obama's fault!
7
Mr. Douthat, let me summarize: the death rate among African Americans and Hispanics is not increasing because they have long learned to accept their place in our society. If only poorly educated whites learned to accept their lot, they too will starting living longer.
Have I got that right?
Have I got that right?
448
"This is a healthy attitude readjustment on the part of the plebes"
- ---- the Oligarchs
- ---- the Oligarchs
10
The unhappiest white lives are unhappy because those who live them have been deliberately persuaded to worry so much about about God, gays and guns that they are distracted from the economic scam of trickle-down economics. This is class warfare waged by those whose only interest in them is their angry votes, never mind that they are financially impoverished in order to enrich the super-haves.
A welfare state that’s friendlier to work and family would, for one thing, refuse to exalt through its tax laws income made from capital as opposed to earned from labor.
A welfare state that’s friendlier to work and family would, for one thing, refuse to exalt through its tax laws income made from capital as opposed to earned from labor.
295
So only republicans are poor and dying younger? Where did I miss that?
I once read, in a very different context, that misery is not a competitive sport, but I'd like to forward that suggestion here.
40
Funnycomment , and relevant. :))
And journalists have to understand social research better before they start spewing out their very bad "probability possibilities" as reasons for a problem, and recommendations for interventions :))
Do journalists learn Research 101?
And journalists have to understand social research better before they start spewing out their very bad "probability possibilities" as reasons for a problem, and recommendations for interventions :))
Do journalists learn Research 101?
Looking for today's Douthat False Premise winner, I could not find a premise, or a thesis, in his column. Usually many are scattered.
There was a sleight of hand:
"If this possibility has policy implications, it suggests that liberals are right to emphasize the economic component to the working class’s crisis. But it cautions against the idea that transfer payments can substitute for the sense of meaning and purpose that blue-collar white Americans derived from the nexus of work, faith and family until very recently."
There we go.
Unstated premise/thesis: increased white male death rate is the result in part of lost faith (by "faith" Douthat means religion, doesn't know the difference, for example, Pat Tillman, who like Douthat had the opportunity to enlist after 9.11, though an atheist, had faith, so, unlike Douthat, Tillman enlisted, was killed by his own, the shameless lies and cover up justified in part by "christians" as Tillman was a known atheist so they desecrated his faith in his country), because the dirty dirty MONEY the losers are stealing from oligarchs via disability payments (?) doesn't save their SOULS.
Let us be clear, Douthat pulls the causal chain out of what can charitably be described as thin air. But he consistently rides his faith hobby horse. Other days he defines who has faith--not the Pope-- and who does, He and his phony conservative bros. He must have a duly bought and paid for faith franchise. Good for him. But reading him risks losing faith.
There was a sleight of hand:
"If this possibility has policy implications, it suggests that liberals are right to emphasize the economic component to the working class’s crisis. But it cautions against the idea that transfer payments can substitute for the sense of meaning and purpose that blue-collar white Americans derived from the nexus of work, faith and family until very recently."
There we go.
Unstated premise/thesis: increased white male death rate is the result in part of lost faith (by "faith" Douthat means religion, doesn't know the difference, for example, Pat Tillman, who like Douthat had the opportunity to enlist after 9.11, though an atheist, had faith, so, unlike Douthat, Tillman enlisted, was killed by his own, the shameless lies and cover up justified in part by "christians" as Tillman was a known atheist so they desecrated his faith in his country), because the dirty dirty MONEY the losers are stealing from oligarchs via disability payments (?) doesn't save their SOULS.
Let us be clear, Douthat pulls the causal chain out of what can charitably be described as thin air. But he consistently rides his faith hobby horse. Other days he defines who has faith--not the Pope-- and who does, He and his phony conservative bros. He must have a duly bought and paid for faith franchise. Good for him. But reading him risks losing faith.
100
The cause is modern liberalism??
I imagine a great deal of the despair is a result of moving manufacturing jobs overseas, which began under Reagan, and has been promoted as good for shareholders, even as factory towns were decimated, with no regard for how our fellow Americans wood be able to make their way. No amount of service sector employment is ever going to pay what manufacturing pays.
I imagine a great deal of the despair is a result of moving manufacturing jobs overseas, which began under Reagan, and has been promoted as good for shareholders, even as factory towns were decimated, with no regard for how our fellow Americans wood be able to make their way. No amount of service sector employment is ever going to pay what manufacturing pays.
229
But the uptick in death rates begins in 1997, under Clinton. Reagan was long out of office by then.
What I love is if things are bleak, it is the fault of some long-gone GOP POTUS. It is never the fault of the guy in the White House....if he's a Democrat.
However, if things are going great -- high stock market, low unemployment numbers -- then it is TOTALLY do the brilliance of the current Democratic POTUS and he owes NOTHING to his predecessors.
Heads I win. Tails you lose.
What I love is if things are bleak, it is the fault of some long-gone GOP POTUS. It is never the fault of the guy in the White House....if he's a Democrat.
However, if things are going great -- high stock market, low unemployment numbers -- then it is TOTALLY do the brilliance of the current Democratic POTUS and he owes NOTHING to his predecessors.
Heads I win. Tails you lose.
1
Ross, here are 2 pieces that tell you much more eloquently than we can what the problems are:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-01-28/fired-hired-how-corporations-ri...
and from NYTimes own pages in 1997, showing what was coming:
http://www.nytimes.com/1997/11/20/opinion/in-america-the-game-is-rigged....
and what has indeed materialized.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-01-28/fired-hired-how-corporations-ri...
and from NYTimes own pages in 1997, showing what was coming:
http://www.nytimes.com/1997/11/20/opinion/in-america-the-game-is-rigged....
and what has indeed materialized.
35
This is not surprising at all. If you work in the healthcare field, it is blindingly obvious. First there is no way in this country to get good mental health care. Unless you are extremely wealthy and can afford private care. The average Joe and Josephine are treated and streeted. Stress is rampant. So medicating with alcohol and drugs are the only ways that people cope. Suicides are up because of this and heroin is cheap and easy to obtain, so some of the suicides may just be accidental drug overdoses.
As for your assumption that religion is a factor, that may be somewhat true. People exist without a stable social foundation, but the church has not been a safe harbor for decades, so not sure that is true. Here in Utah, where the Mormons reign supreme, there is a very high suicide rate. So that does not seem protective.
I see a lot of stressed out middle class folks. They work several jobs without good healthcare insurance. They make just over poverty level, so they cannot apply for Medicaid. They cannot afford to go the the MD so they often have uncontrolled chronic illnesses. Only a crisis brings them to the hospital. Often by then things are very much out of control and they are very ill. And depressed. They cannot work, so they lose their jobs. They have no social safety net. They fall into the abyss. Funding is constantly cut in social programs. It is so unfair and all of us in healthcare struggle to help. It is very sad and depressing.
As for your assumption that religion is a factor, that may be somewhat true. People exist without a stable social foundation, but the church has not been a safe harbor for decades, so not sure that is true. Here in Utah, where the Mormons reign supreme, there is a very high suicide rate. So that does not seem protective.
I see a lot of stressed out middle class folks. They work several jobs without good healthcare insurance. They make just over poverty level, so they cannot apply for Medicaid. They cannot afford to go the the MD so they often have uncontrolled chronic illnesses. Only a crisis brings them to the hospital. Often by then things are very much out of control and they are very ill. And depressed. They cannot work, so they lose their jobs. They have no social safety net. They fall into the abyss. Funding is constantly cut in social programs. It is so unfair and all of us in healthcare struggle to help. It is very sad and depressing.
978
@Janice Badger Nelson
Mental health is not well covered in this country, and the Affordable Care Act (aka Obamacare) actually makes the situation worse.
I work in the public hospitals, and I can attest that de Blasio has made the situation worse as well. He considers anti-social behavior to be a "psychiatric illness," so he wants those criminals treated in the same units as patients with treatable mental illness. The result is increased bullying, increased violence, and more abuse of people with real mental health problems.
If you want to help people with mental illness, it requires more funding (that Obamacare did not provide), and recognizing that some people belong in prison and not in a hospital ward!
Mental health is not well covered in this country, and the Affordable Care Act (aka Obamacare) actually makes the situation worse.
I work in the public hospitals, and I can attest that de Blasio has made the situation worse as well. He considers anti-social behavior to be a "psychiatric illness," so he wants those criminals treated in the same units as patients with treatable mental illness. The result is increased bullying, increased violence, and more abuse of people with real mental health problems.
If you want to help people with mental illness, it requires more funding (that Obamacare did not provide), and recognizing that some people belong in prison and not in a hospital ward!
1
I too work in Healthcare and commiserate regularly with my fellow overworked, underpaid, highly stressed co-horts. Here is what I see: Lots of ladies, some with a partner, some without, most with kids, making it work. Struggling, juggling, busting their chops, and making it work. They are not addicted to drugs,they are not choosing tragic paths; they are committed to providing a decent life and hope for their kids. Many take advantage of whatever social programs they can qualify for, and they have given me good tips. I was once married to a professional man; probably I was a white privileged spouse for a brief span, having originally come from a family of teachers. My husband traded me in for a younger model, and I fell into the all too common near poverty trap of many former homemakers turned discarded goods. I work full time, and I am benefitting from Medicaid, and the camaraderie of my fellow workers. I am pro-liberal everything.
Why do my fellow workers, the majority of them female, succeed, when the demographic examined in this study is failing/falling? Some of my friends are from the Carribbean, some have roots in Latin America, some are 3-4th generation German-English-Irish- Polish- Italian. I think they are succeeding and not collapsing into despair, despite serious consequences to their own health, their own well being, because they no they have no choice, they remain openminded to all help, and they are among the bravest people I know.
Why do my fellow workers, the majority of them female, succeed, when the demographic examined in this study is failing/falling? Some of my friends are from the Carribbean, some have roots in Latin America, some are 3-4th generation German-English-Irish- Polish- Italian. I think they are succeeding and not collapsing into despair, despite serious consequences to their own health, their own well being, because they no they have no choice, they remain openminded to all help, and they are among the bravest people I know.
6
Excellent comment! I worked until recently in acute care as a NP and concur with your assessment. Serious healthcare problems can wipe out a family financially in one foul sweep. As we all know this also happens to middle class families however, it is much more prevelant among late middle aged whites with less education. Just as you stated, the result of this study should not come as a surprise. What is astounding to me is that the Republicans on the whole are adamantly against healthcare for all and refusing to provide a safety net for the poor and disadvantaged. The money that is spent on the US elections could certainly go along way to help to alleviate some of the aforementioned problems. Of course I do realize that this money comes from very wealthy donors however, if they can spent that kind of money on the politicians why not raise their taxes and limit the amount of money they can give to these elections and the politicians.
5
"......to make some of the unhappiest white lives feel like they matter once again."
There are a great many of those white people who won't feel like they matter until they feel like they are "better" than all those "other" people who used to take a back seat to white people. They want their country back. But what they really want is not to have to compete with everyone else. Used to be that even the worst off of the white people could constantly remind themselves that they were better than even the best off of black people. Then came Nixon, with his 'southern strategy' and Reagan with his 'welfare queens" and GHW Bush with Willie Horton, all of them reinforcing - subtly - their concept of white superiority. Except that they still had to compete, and often as not, found that supposed superiority might work to garner votes, but it turned out they were voting against their own best interests. They still do. Stagnating wages and outsourced jobs and the demise of unions haven't been at the hand of the the opposition. They still blame the Kenyan Muslim socialist and they haven't been discouraged, either from the pulpits or the podiums of their conservative heroes. Constantly being told what they want to hear all the while butting heads with reality isn't conducive to success.
There are a great many of those white people who won't feel like they matter until they feel like they are "better" than all those "other" people who used to take a back seat to white people. They want their country back. But what they really want is not to have to compete with everyone else. Used to be that even the worst off of the white people could constantly remind themselves that they were better than even the best off of black people. Then came Nixon, with his 'southern strategy' and Reagan with his 'welfare queens" and GHW Bush with Willie Horton, all of them reinforcing - subtly - their concept of white superiority. Except that they still had to compete, and often as not, found that supposed superiority might work to garner votes, but it turned out they were voting against their own best interests. They still do. Stagnating wages and outsourced jobs and the demise of unions haven't been at the hand of the the opposition. They still blame the Kenyan Muslim socialist and they haven't been discouraged, either from the pulpits or the podiums of their conservative heroes. Constantly being told what they want to hear all the while butting heads with reality isn't conducive to success.
325
Great moment, Vanessa!
The psychology of bigotry has been demonstrating its own perverse sense of self-exalted masochism ever since President Obama took office. Ironic humor may be passé, but it certainly isn't dead.
The psychology of bigotry has been demonstrating its own perverse sense of self-exalted masochism ever since President Obama took office. Ironic humor may be passé, but it certainly isn't dead.
2
Apparently (and I'm going by a statistic mentioned on Bill Maher, so take it with a grain of salt) these statistics cut across the ideological spectrum: liberal middle aged working class white people have had their life expectancy lowered just as much as their conservative counterparts. But even if I were to grant that all this only applies to people who "had it coming", by their support of (say) racist institutions or their opposition to social services (which I do not grant), it's still a little horrible, and juvenile, to say, "Ha, Ha, now it's YOUR life expectancy that's gone down". How about, when hearing news that a particular group of people has recently seen an upsurge of (say) suicide and addictive tendencies, we don't react by making them feel worse about it.
2
Perhaps a lot of uneducated whites can't cut it, even with white privilege.
Part of the problem is the modern corporate economy. I'm not disparaging the modern corporate economy, I'm just saying it's different. The NY Times had an article a few years ago that basically said the 'Main Street' economy of the past was made up of the local banker, the family-owned pharmacy, the local sports emporium (hunting, fishing, football, etc), clothing stores, & doctors with family practices. In each of these cases, the children would follow in their father's footsteps, taking over the family business. Walmart & Target & Home Depot took those jobs away & took away the certainty that went with them.
I ran into an old Nevada ranch family awhile ago at a wedding. Among the wedding guests was also a wealthy Indian (S. Asian) family founded by the patriarch who came as an immigrant 20 years ago with nothing. Like many poor Indian immigrants, he got a job in a small-town motel (along I-80 in eastern Nevada) . It was a hard life, but now he owns many motels & his sons & daughters & relatives are doctors & lawyers & IT professionals.
The ranch family matriarch looked at the Indian family with envy & blamed her family's circumstances on immigrants. Unlike her poor extended family, she thought the poor young motel man achieved the American dream because his poor extended Indian family had bankrolled him. If they did, it was just enough to get to America. He worked hard, she whines.
Part of the problem is the modern corporate economy. I'm not disparaging the modern corporate economy, I'm just saying it's different. The NY Times had an article a few years ago that basically said the 'Main Street' economy of the past was made up of the local banker, the family-owned pharmacy, the local sports emporium (hunting, fishing, football, etc), clothing stores, & doctors with family practices. In each of these cases, the children would follow in their father's footsteps, taking over the family business. Walmart & Target & Home Depot took those jobs away & took away the certainty that went with them.
I ran into an old Nevada ranch family awhile ago at a wedding. Among the wedding guests was also a wealthy Indian (S. Asian) family founded by the patriarch who came as an immigrant 20 years ago with nothing. Like many poor Indian immigrants, he got a job in a small-town motel (along I-80 in eastern Nevada) . It was a hard life, but now he owns many motels & his sons & daughters & relatives are doctors & lawyers & IT professionals.
The ranch family matriarch looked at the Indian family with envy & blamed her family's circumstances on immigrants. Unlike her poor extended family, she thought the poor young motel man achieved the American dream because his poor extended Indian family had bankrolled him. If they did, it was just enough to get to America. He worked hard, she whines.
6
Allow me to explain bigotry. I'll keep it simple because I want people to get it.
You see someone do something stupid or despicable. If that person is the same color as you, you say they did it because they're stupid or despicable. If the person is a different color and you're a racist, you say they did it because they're black or whatever.
You see someone do something stupid or despicable. If that person is the same color as you, you say they did it because they're stupid or despicable. If the person is a different color and you're a racist, you say they did it because they're black or whatever.
69
This is confirmation bias. It could not be described better.
3
1
Ross, let me applaud you for being willing to acknowledge the economic component of this unhappy trend - an acknowledgment that one is unlikely to hear at the next GOP circus event.
Moreover, let me acknowledge that there is no question that the traditional matrix of religion, family, and work that you cite was largely a cohesive force throughout much of the 20th century; however, I need to point out that this matrix does not represent the only feasible combination, particularly in an era in which the existence of God is not taken for granted.
Viewed in its totality, this study suggests to me that human beings crave community, purpose, and some sense of belonging to a greater whole. However, the lionization of vampire capitalism in the late 20th and early 21st century has instead encouraged the severing of ties between people, and the aggressive promotion of an ethos of every man out for himself, community and Union be damned. This will not end well - not for the middle-aged white males increasingly marginalized by this relentless, soulless, rapacious form of capitalism, and not for our once great Union.
As Arthur Miller once wrote, "attention must be paid".
Moreover, let me acknowledge that there is no question that the traditional matrix of religion, family, and work that you cite was largely a cohesive force throughout much of the 20th century; however, I need to point out that this matrix does not represent the only feasible combination, particularly in an era in which the existence of God is not taken for granted.
Viewed in its totality, this study suggests to me that human beings crave community, purpose, and some sense of belonging to a greater whole. However, the lionization of vampire capitalism in the late 20th and early 21st century has instead encouraged the severing of ties between people, and the aggressive promotion of an ethos of every man out for himself, community and Union be damned. This will not end well - not for the middle-aged white males increasingly marginalized by this relentless, soulless, rapacious form of capitalism, and not for our once great Union.
As Arthur Miller once wrote, "attention must be paid".
469
Sure social liberalism in the US is killing white people, Mr. Douthat. Of course healthcare for all, social security, medicare, medicaid, Planned Parenthood, gay marriage and all the rest of liberal's progressive policies must be killing white people.
It couldn't possibly be that people have to work harder and longer hours for less money. Or that the 1% miraculously seem to be making and raking in more and more money while the middle class continues to see their wages stagnating (thank god the Republicans want to cut taxes of the 1% because that will fix everything, for sure). Or that people can't get paid leave or vacation and have less paid leave or vacation than any other workers in similar western economies. Or that people can't save money for retirement. Or that people can't afford childcare. Or that people can't afford college and go into massive debt in order to pay for college. Or that people are beyond stressed with the crumbs trickled down to them by the 1%.
Yes, what a brilliant analysis, Mr. Douthat. It definitely is modern liberalism’s mix of moral permissiveness and welfare-state paternalism that's killing off white people.
It couldn't possibly be that people have to work harder and longer hours for less money. Or that the 1% miraculously seem to be making and raking in more and more money while the middle class continues to see their wages stagnating (thank god the Republicans want to cut taxes of the 1% because that will fix everything, for sure). Or that people can't get paid leave or vacation and have less paid leave or vacation than any other workers in similar western economies. Or that people can't save money for retirement. Or that people can't afford childcare. Or that people can't afford college and go into massive debt in order to pay for college. Or that people are beyond stressed with the crumbs trickled down to them by the 1%.
Yes, what a brilliant analysis, Mr. Douthat. It definitely is modern liberalism’s mix of moral permissiveness and welfare-state paternalism that's killing off white people.
598
To @V's excellent list of causes, I would add the scourge of "workforce optimization", the algorithmic techniques used by large service-oriented companies (mostly fast food and retail businesses) to determine, on relatively short notice, the number of hours that an employee will work in the coming week and the timing of those hours. It's typically something like 3 hours 2 mornings (no break required), 3 hours on 2 different afternoons, and 3 hours a couple of evenings, with some room left for "on call" fill-ins. That keeps the weekly total under the 30 hours that would trigger the requirement for providing health insurance.
This instability and unpredictability is highly stressful, since the work assignment is at the employer's will and since employees who miss their assigned shifts are at risk of losing their jobs. These schedules don't leave any room for scheduling your own life, let alone responding to family emergencies or staying home when sick. Low salaries, lack of benefits, inability to support your family, and loss of personal autonomy all lead to increased mental and physical health problems, as well as substance abuse. It's no surprise that a growing number of people are dying younger, either from drugs, poor health, or their own hand.
This instability and unpredictability is highly stressful, since the work assignment is at the employer's will and since employees who miss their assigned shifts are at risk of losing their jobs. These schedules don't leave any room for scheduling your own life, let alone responding to family emergencies or staying home when sick. Low salaries, lack of benefits, inability to support your family, and loss of personal autonomy all lead to increased mental and physical health problems, as well as substance abuse. It's no surprise that a growing number of people are dying younger, either from drugs, poor health, or their own hand.
26
Did we read the same article? He use the arguments of both progressives and conservatives and poked holes in both. And tried to put together what he thought might help the problem.
I have four siblings. Three definitely fit the pattern (two brothers and one sister) of less educated white middle age whites and they are all or were addicted to oxycodone, smoke and drink heavily. One was dead at 53 years old. I am seriously concern with the other two making it to age 60. Myself and one sister do not fit. But we have family incomes in the upper 20%, my sister the upper 1% and are much better educated. Income is what I think made the difference. If we want to reverse this we must some how make fairer the distribution of income and wealth. Which is part of what the author suggested as well as adapting some of the Black and Hispanic culture which seems to make them more resilient.
I have four siblings. Three definitely fit the pattern (two brothers and one sister) of less educated white middle age whites and they are all or were addicted to oxycodone, smoke and drink heavily. One was dead at 53 years old. I am seriously concern with the other two making it to age 60. Myself and one sister do not fit. But we have family incomes in the upper 20%, my sister the upper 1% and are much better educated. Income is what I think made the difference. If we want to reverse this we must some how make fairer the distribution of income and wealth. Which is part of what the author suggested as well as adapting some of the Black and Hispanic culture which seems to make them more resilient.
5
An article in Smithsonian magazine outlines a study that sarcastic people are more intelligent and cut to the chase in poignant ways. This post upholds this premise beautifully. Right on.
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/the-science-of-sarcasm-yeah...
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/the-science-of-sarcasm-yeah...
1
It's not the death of the American working class, it is the white middle class slipping into the precariat and, unlike the inkblots of a Rorschach test, this new(ish) class, one Paul Krugman used to write about and call the lost generation, is a known quantity. We know where the precariat came from and when their numbers exploded, and why. We know who is responsible.
Millions of people lost their jobs as a part of the start of the Great Recession. Nearly a million jobs were being lost each month for quite some time. As President Obama took over and the bleeding of jobs finally ended and we all began to witness the beginnings of what would be a weak recovery, we heard of the rampant discrimination against the 99ers. 99ers are the long-term unemployed whose benefits were extended and whom the Republicans in the Senate and Congress kept calling moochers, lazy, etc. After years of forcing austerity, Paul Ryan's 2013 budget finally accomplished the goal and ended unemployment insurance for the 99ers, many of whom still have no full-time work.
Those are the whites we see flocking to Bernie Sanders' rallies. Those are also the whites who are dying as their savings run dry.
What you call dependence, Ross, the rest of us call having jobs here in America. You, and those who think like you, are guilty of pushing these people to their deaths.
It is no wonder you criticize Pope Francis. How else could you live with yourself?
---
What is the Precariat? http://tinyurl.com/ofjjz9y
Millions of people lost their jobs as a part of the start of the Great Recession. Nearly a million jobs were being lost each month for quite some time. As President Obama took over and the bleeding of jobs finally ended and we all began to witness the beginnings of what would be a weak recovery, we heard of the rampant discrimination against the 99ers. 99ers are the long-term unemployed whose benefits were extended and whom the Republicans in the Senate and Congress kept calling moochers, lazy, etc. After years of forcing austerity, Paul Ryan's 2013 budget finally accomplished the goal and ended unemployment insurance for the 99ers, many of whom still have no full-time work.
Those are the whites we see flocking to Bernie Sanders' rallies. Those are also the whites who are dying as their savings run dry.
What you call dependence, Ross, the rest of us call having jobs here in America. You, and those who think like you, are guilty of pushing these people to their deaths.
It is no wonder you criticize Pope Francis. How else could you live with yourself?
---
What is the Precariat? http://tinyurl.com/ofjjz9y
430
The antidote isn't what Douthat supposes, but what legal philosopher and thinker Ronald Dworkin called "Justice for Hedgehogs." In it, he lays out his theory of equality. A video of his presentation of the ideas in his book is included. What he lays out and the work of Professor Joseph Stiglitz should be the basis of the political revolution Bernie Sanders has been calling for or, in other words, a re-calibration of capitalism.
Read about Ronald Dworkin's theory here: http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/08/ronald-dworkin-theory-of-equality-philo...
Read about Joseph Stiglitz, Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders' approaches to "Rewriting the Rules" of capitalism:
http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/06/hillary-clinton-and-joseph-stiglitz-rew...
Read about Ronald Dworkin's theory here: http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/08/ronald-dworkin-theory-of-equality-philo...
Read about Joseph Stiglitz, Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders' approaches to "Rewriting the Rules" of capitalism:
http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/06/hillary-clinton-and-joseph-stiglitz-rew...
60
Whites are "flocking" to Bernie Sanders' rallies?
I have to wonder why.
Because in his sixteen years in Congress and nearly two terms as U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders has not been an author on any piece of major legislation that would have helped working class families.
Like Russ Douthat, Bernie Sanders is the other side of the coin in displaying a basic lack of understanding on how to address the challenges that affect working class families in our country.
Because, thinking that spewing fiery rhetoric about "class inequality" on the campaign trail or the senate floor doesn't help a working class stiff find a job or put food on the table for his/her family, does it?
I have to wonder why.
Because in his sixteen years in Congress and nearly two terms as U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders has not been an author on any piece of major legislation that would have helped working class families.
Like Russ Douthat, Bernie Sanders is the other side of the coin in displaying a basic lack of understanding on how to address the challenges that affect working class families in our country.
Because, thinking that spewing fiery rhetoric about "class inequality" on the campaign trail or the senate floor doesn't help a working class stiff find a job or put food on the table for his/her family, does it?
4
Thank you, Rima Regas, because I was losing heart in reading what Ross Douthat had to say, and my thoughts were drifting off to the powerful play 'Death of A Salesman'. An elderly working-class man and I were sharing lunch today, he is a staunch Republican, but more important he reminds me of a true American.
Both of us are feeling slightly depressed and anxious about our Country and its future. The movie 'Save The Tiger' with Jack Lennon also comes to mind about moral bankruptcy in America, and I watched it with a friend in the 70s who died of poverty in 2000.
But it was your commentary of The Great Recession that summed it up best for this reader, because I am now walking among people, who were brought up with The American Dream. It is gone, and tomorrow is not another day, it is the same for many of us, who are struggling to live.
Both of us are feeling slightly depressed and anxious about our Country and its future. The movie 'Save The Tiger' with Jack Lennon also comes to mind about moral bankruptcy in America, and I watched it with a friend in the 70s who died of poverty in 2000.
But it was your commentary of The Great Recession that summed it up best for this reader, because I am now walking among people, who were brought up with The American Dream. It is gone, and tomorrow is not another day, it is the same for many of us, who are struggling to live.
8
It's capitalism, Ross.
It's the loss of union jobs. It's the outsourcing of America.
And believing in an imaginary sky-deity just does not cut it anymore.
It's the loss of union jobs. It's the outsourcing of America.
And believing in an imaginary sky-deity just does not cut it anymore.
832
"It's the loss of union jobs. It's the outsourcing of America."
You forgot to include imports in your list of perps.
Now take the inventory of what vehicles your family, friends and neighbors drive. But then you would have to include all those liberal folks in your list.
You forgot to include imports in your list of perps.
Now take the inventory of what vehicles your family, friends and neighbors drive. But then you would have to include all those liberal folks in your list.
2
Your simple focus on capitalism and the outsourcing of America seemed spot on.
The arrogance of your second point, however, proved the very point Irshad Manji made in her brilliant opening paragraph, reviewing "Islam and the Future of Tolerance" in Sunday's Book Review by Sam Harris and Maajid Nawaz. Her closing sentence: "Defending the value of doubt through crude certitude is a sign of our times."
The arrogance of your second point, however, proved the very point Irshad Manji made in her brilliant opening paragraph, reviewing "Islam and the Future of Tolerance" in Sunday's Book Review by Sam Harris and Maajid Nawaz. Her closing sentence: "Defending the value of doubt through crude certitude is a sign of our times."
And the failure to realize they have been had by the 1% by cultural smokescreens such as abortion and gay marriage
13
It's the class war, stupid.
Ross blithely supposes that since black death rates haven't been increasing as sharply as those for poor whites, the suicide epidemic must be a cultural, religious thing as well as an economic thing. The fact is that black mortality still surpasses white mortality. It's just that in this age of record wealth inequality, whites are finally gaining parity in the race to the misery mountaintop. Or, to be more accurate, the plummet to the depths of a hell created just for us by a de facto pathocracy.
Douthat's suggestion that blacks and Latinos have developed some sort of "resiliency" to oppression that should be emulated by whites smacks of both classism and racism. In other words, his prescription is to just get used to the new feudal order, and pray a lot. Indulge in the opiate of the masses instead of Oxycontin, and all will be well in your pathetic little worlds.
Here's my prescription: instead of voting against their own economic interests and keeping the Republican Simon Legrees in power, desperate white people should join in solidarity with their brown and black brothers and sisters and fight back against the oppression and inequality.
Thanks to the presidential campaign of Bernie Sanders. the idea of democratic socialism is starting to sound mighty appealing to the dispossessed of all races, colors and creeds.
Let's follow his advice and automatically register all people to vote on their 18th birthdays. Let the revolution begin.
Ross blithely supposes that since black death rates haven't been increasing as sharply as those for poor whites, the suicide epidemic must be a cultural, religious thing as well as an economic thing. The fact is that black mortality still surpasses white mortality. It's just that in this age of record wealth inequality, whites are finally gaining parity in the race to the misery mountaintop. Or, to be more accurate, the plummet to the depths of a hell created just for us by a de facto pathocracy.
Douthat's suggestion that blacks and Latinos have developed some sort of "resiliency" to oppression that should be emulated by whites smacks of both classism and racism. In other words, his prescription is to just get used to the new feudal order, and pray a lot. Indulge in the opiate of the masses instead of Oxycontin, and all will be well in your pathetic little worlds.
Here's my prescription: instead of voting against their own economic interests and keeping the Republican Simon Legrees in power, desperate white people should join in solidarity with their brown and black brothers and sisters and fight back against the oppression and inequality.
Thanks to the presidential campaign of Bernie Sanders. the idea of democratic socialism is starting to sound mighty appealing to the dispossessed of all races, colors and creeds.
Let's follow his advice and automatically register all people to vote on their 18th birthdays. Let the revolution begin.
1234
Perfect diversion, K.G. This is too deep for you to have copied it from Soros' bloggers. The late Nikita Khrushchev is right there with you, always reminding us that the class war always comes first.
As long as you forbid mentioning the human heart and what positive motives control human behavior, it's all too easy to buy into the gray dependency of socialism. But humans won't produce even half under this dorm of slavery that they do as free men and women, or else the Soviet Experiment would have survived us.
The dark reality is that whatever the outsides of people look like never matters - but the elites always resort to imprisoning their worker/slaves when the workers realize that they are actually the house in the novel Animal Farm.
Then, when all power rests in the central gov't, a Stalin WILL eventually come along and keep the whole bunch terrorized and beaten down. The same story played out in the Book of Judges.
But when Karen designs a nation of robots, her ideas might just work out. But never with people. Mankind has to be motivated by freedom and liberty. Don't insist we try try here what ALWAYS failed anywhere else.
As long as you forbid mentioning the human heart and what positive motives control human behavior, it's all too easy to buy into the gray dependency of socialism. But humans won't produce even half under this dorm of slavery that they do as free men and women, or else the Soviet Experiment would have survived us.
The dark reality is that whatever the outsides of people look like never matters - but the elites always resort to imprisoning their worker/slaves when the workers realize that they are actually the house in the novel Animal Farm.
Then, when all power rests in the central gov't, a Stalin WILL eventually come along and keep the whole bunch terrorized and beaten down. The same story played out in the Book of Judges.
But when Karen designs a nation of robots, her ideas might just work out. But never with people. Mankind has to be motivated by freedom and liberty. Don't insist we try try here what ALWAYS failed anywhere else.
4
I studied philosophy at college. Apart from being entertaining and not a bad means of impressing impressionable young women, it exposed me more than I would have been otherwise to the polemics of collectivist societies, such as the U.S.S.R. and China.
In reading Karen's response today to Ross, I'm carried back forty years and more to those days when sometimes I felt buried in what less-educated white people commonly forked out of barnyard hay.
In reading Karen's response today to Ross, I'm carried back forty years and more to those days when sometimes I felt buried in what less-educated white people commonly forked out of barnyard hay.
3
And it's racism. White people shamed over and over and over again because of what people who looked like them did in the past.
Very difficult to tell poor people with no future that they are privileged because of their skin and to NEVER complain because of it.
Very difficult to tell poor people with no future that they are privileged because of their skin and to NEVER complain because of it.
8
Ross, you always point to religion and family as the savior of American society. You are wrong. Most religions are divisive and there are so many stories of "true believers" who were ousted because they divorced, used contraception, had an abortion or acknowledged their gay sexuality. Religion may give solace to individuals, but it tears apart societies and families as each professes it is "the way of the Lord."
What we really lack in our Country is a society--a family of biologically unrelated individuals who believe they are all in it together. A real society supports every member of that society with affordable/accessible healthcare, debt free education, a living wage, nice public spaces, good public transportation and a belief that this life is really all we have so lets make the most of it. No after life that is used by so many war mongers as an excuse to send their children off to die for the cause of the elite.
Life is pretty simple. We are born and eventually we all die. Individually we are all pretty powerless, but as a collective great things can happen. And it has nothing to do with God, unless you believe God is you and me and everyone else.
What we really lack in our Country is a society--a family of biologically unrelated individuals who believe they are all in it together. A real society supports every member of that society with affordable/accessible healthcare, debt free education, a living wage, nice public spaces, good public transportation and a belief that this life is really all we have so lets make the most of it. No after life that is used by so many war mongers as an excuse to send their children off to die for the cause of the elite.
Life is pretty simple. We are born and eventually we all die. Individually we are all pretty powerless, but as a collective great things can happen. And it has nothing to do with God, unless you believe God is you and me and everyone else.
671
Liberalism has, in fact, taken on a religious role. What Ross says makes perfect sense when you understand that.
You are invoking your (and lefty liberal) hatred of the Roman Catholic Church. But though Mr. Douthat is Catholic, I do not believe he is saying you have to a Catholic in order to have a religious set of values to your life, or the comfort of faith. He is saying ANY RELIGION. The US is very diverse. The Catholic Church is just one of hundreds of Christian faiths, and that isn't even counting all the Jews, Muslims, Hindus, etc.
None of those other Christian faiths, or non-Christian faiths, excludes people for abortions, birth control or gay sex. Some actually embrace those things. Others ignore it. But none except Catholics outright ban them.
None of those other Christian faiths, or non-Christian faiths, excludes people for abortions, birth control or gay sex. Some actually embrace those things. Others ignore it. But none except Catholics outright ban them.
Well said!
Maybe it's just a coincidence that the decline and despair of the white middle class began at the start of W's Reign of Error, but there's something tragically poetic about the sinking of the ordinary Joe while the conservatives rose to power. The two trends may not be causally connected, but I don't think it's a coincidence that the destruction of the economy, the endless war, the devaluation of intellect and the resurgence of religious fundamentalism accompanied the rise of despair.
Douthat often blames everything on the decline of morals and religion, but during this time religion was in the driver's seat, validating W's rush to war, lashing out against the long-overdue rise of gay rights and attacking long-legalized abortion.
When Obama became president, conservatives doubled down on attacks against progressive advances that were the hallmark of the 20th century. Affordable health care was treated as an abomination. Older people would have to work until 70 to receive Social Security benefits. Trickle-down economics made a resurgence, as funds were begrudged to those in need in order to support so-called "job creators," who created nothing.
No one needs transfer payments if we have good jobs that earn a living wage. This is what creates hope, ensures a future and keeps families together. We need a return to democratic governance, not a reliance on conservative paternalism and religious nonsense. Let the rich feel a little despair for a change.
Douthat often blames everything on the decline of morals and religion, but during this time religion was in the driver's seat, validating W's rush to war, lashing out against the long-overdue rise of gay rights and attacking long-legalized abortion.
When Obama became president, conservatives doubled down on attacks against progressive advances that were the hallmark of the 20th century. Affordable health care was treated as an abomination. Older people would have to work until 70 to receive Social Security benefits. Trickle-down economics made a resurgence, as funds were begrudged to those in need in order to support so-called "job creators," who created nothing.
No one needs transfer payments if we have good jobs that earn a living wage. This is what creates hope, ensures a future and keeps families together. We need a return to democratic governance, not a reliance on conservative paternalism and religious nonsense. Let the rich feel a little despair for a change.
1391
Oops! My memo says that you were supposed to blame it all on Reagan. Chk w/ G.S.
2
re: gemli from Boston
Blaming this phenomena on Bush is not only intellectually dishonest, but lazy.
Try looking to cities in your own backyard, like Worcester, Lowell and Fall River - all lost their manufacturing base that gave stability to working class families, including our aforementioned whites.
All of that didn't just happen during the term of Bush II, did it?
Blaming this phenomena on Bush is not only intellectually dishonest, but lazy.
Try looking to cities in your own backyard, like Worcester, Lowell and Fall River - all lost their manufacturing base that gave stability to working class families, including our aforementioned whites.
All of that didn't just happen during the term of Bush II, did it?
8
While I agree with the vast majority of your assessment, I'd argue that the decline and fall of the American working and middle classes, and the American Dream along with them, began with Reagan. Or perhaps even sooner -- in 1971 with the Powell Memo.
22
http://andrewgelman.com/2015/11/06/what-happened-to-mortality-among-45-5...
What strikes me as fascinating is how pretty much nobody noticed this immense disaster for an entire decade. Why not?
A major reason is because there are practically no institutions in America that have as part of their mission looking out for the welfare of whites qua whites. We have countless highly respectable organizations that scan statistics for disparities regarding blacks, immigrants, Asians, women, transgenders, Jews, and so forth. But to pay attention to the problems of white people is a good way to get listed as a Hate Group by the SPLC, so, evidently, very few do it.