If we had not interfered in Libya in our eagerness for Regime Change. we should not now have this mess in Libya. Stay out of Libya. Anytime the US meddles in the Middle East we only make the situation worse = not better. We become the proverbial bull in a china shop.
Just remember that you are dealing with the Arab world where governance normally consists of brutal dictators like Assad and the House of Saud for starters. Oh I left out Khaddify and Saddam Hussein, both of whom would be happily chopping heads off of anyone even considering joining ISIS.
You may notice that the Middle East is a tad unstable with rumors of the Russian Air Force now planning up to 300 missions each day which is more than NATO can muster. Lets begin by defining the problem, which I summarized above. How many millions of refugees now want to become Swedes and Germans? The actual number exceeds the populations of those two naive nations. And yes our Ambassador died in Benghazi. Visit Benghazi and you will also die within 30 days or less.
You may notice that the Middle East is a tad unstable with rumors of the Russian Air Force now planning up to 300 missions each day which is more than NATO can muster. Lets begin by defining the problem, which I summarized above. How many millions of refugees now want to become Swedes and Germans? The actual number exceeds the populations of those two naive nations. And yes our Ambassador died in Benghazi. Visit Benghazi and you will also die within 30 days or less.
5
''You enter a place and you feel like they would eat you with their eyes,” he said.''
The dismemberment of Libya ranks up there with the 'Charge of the Fools Brigade" in terms of waste, stupidity, and lack of foresight.
No Americans in body bags, not so for Libyans.
If the Benghazi hearings were about the cost of the war to the U.S., Europe, and Libya I'd be in favor of them.
That would require a congress full of adults. Not owned by the Military Industrial Complex.
Not likely in the near future.
The dismemberment of Libya ranks up there with the 'Charge of the Fools Brigade" in terms of waste, stupidity, and lack of foresight.
No Americans in body bags, not so for Libyans.
If the Benghazi hearings were about the cost of the war to the U.S., Europe, and Libya I'd be in favor of them.
That would require a congress full of adults. Not owned by the Military Industrial Complex.
Not likely in the near future.
4
Hillary strongly advocated for the military assault on Libya that led to the overthrow of Qaddafi but she never bothered to put any post attack plan into motion for the war-torn country. The results: 9,400 killed, 4,000 missing, and 50,000 injured and Libya is still in chaos. But that isn't "the scandal".
The scandal is that she didn't do enough to protect American lives. And we wonder why they hate us.
The scandal is that she didn't do enough to protect American lives. And we wonder why they hate us.
8
I didn't really see anything on Hilary in this but her infamous quote, "We came, we saw he died" is telling as to the US involvement in Libya and how we have created another destabilized part of the Middle East.
The videos and stills of the trail of empty boxes from Khaddafi's armory of shoulder held rockets and RPGs along the roads out of Libya has armed who knows how many Al Quaeda, Taliban and ISIL fighters?
The videos and stills of the trail of empty boxes from Khaddafi's armory of shoulder held rockets and RPGs along the roads out of Libya has armed who knows how many Al Quaeda, Taliban and ISIL fighters?
3
Shameful farce today, the inquisition of Hillary Clinton on the Benghazi attacks of 2012, during which 4 US State department personnel including the Ambassador to Libya were killed. This whole Congressional Hearing has been a terrible "select committee" witch-hunt against Mrs. Clinton. Bless Congressman Elijah Cummings of Maryland for rising to her defense and pointing out how foolish the Republicans look as they try to pillory her for wrongdoing when the Republicans threw the United States into two gruesome and still ongoing senseless wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. Truth has been the victim of the Congressional Republicans today. The last attack on American territory was in 2001, by Saudi terrorists demolishing the World Trade Towers in Manhattan's heart. And all those Republicans responsible for the two wars initiated by President Bush in retaliation for 9/11/01 have not been brought to justice. There is no justice available for Mrs. Clinton, who is being raked over the coals today like some hapless victim of the Spanish Inquisition or the Salem Witch Trials. Today we witnessed a Republican auto-da-fe, the beginning of the twelvemonth Republican Putsch toward the Presidency, led by such unelectable POTUS contenders as Donald Trump and Ben Carson, who have never held elective office, and JEB Bush, who didn't know FDR was alive on 7 December 1941 during the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor and on 8 December declared the US in a state of war against the Empire of Japan!
4
I listened only to see why the Ambassador stationed in Tripoli on the far eastern portion of Libya, was sent as an envoy to Benghazi on the far western edge of Libya, which was the most dangerous port city.
In between "reports" I see it was to deal with weapons exchanges at the time dealing I believe with an envoy from Turkey to get heavier weapons stolen during the war by rebels to Syrian "freedom fighters".
Time and history will show the entire story, as it has for all conflicts.
In between "reports" I see it was to deal with weapons exchanges at the time dealing I believe with an envoy from Turkey to get heavier weapons stolen during the war by rebels to Syrian "freedom fighters".
Time and history will show the entire story, as it has for all conflicts.
2
The lesson of Libya is that we keep poking our noses into places they should not be. You would think we would have learned after Iraq, but, we couldn't resist and we did it again. HRC was even using Libya as a positive example in the recent debate. When will we ever learn?
5
The lesson in Libya, Egypt, Iraq, Iran, and many others "allies" is before the U.S. replaces existing governments "in good faith" to replace them with U.S. styled "democracies" they should think about what may replace them, knowing the record shows to work out very well.
Libya has shown law, order, and tolerance of citizens/sects/tribes for each other, is impossible in the Sunni Arab Middle East without an all powerful military dictatorship. Any less repressive form of governance like democracy is bound to fail, or be rapidly usurped by fundamentalist Islamic radicals funded by soul-mates in the oil rich kingdoms/emirates of the Persian Gulf.
2
As opposed to Shi'a, Kurds, Turks and the others? Or are they all the same, and should we let the best or most powerful rule over their "citizens".
Yes we should, but we should make up our minds.
The US supplies the bombs the Turks drop on the Kurds, and then supplies the Kurds with weapons to carry the fight on the ground.
We go bomb ISIS in the name of the war on terror, then airdrop weapons to Nusra, alQueda and Co.
Seems like we are the most powerful, and are ruling over their citizens.
The US supplies the bombs the Turks drop on the Kurds, and then supplies the Kurds with weapons to carry the fight on the ground.
We go bomb ISIS in the name of the war on terror, then airdrop weapons to Nusra, alQueda and Co.
Seems like we are the most powerful, and are ruling over their citizens.
It is nothing short of absurdity on the worldwide stage to repeatedly over analyze the facts of Benghazi, while ignoring the acts and incidents of 9/11 which took us into the 14 years wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, costing trillions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of lives.
Do the House Republicans somehow not see how ridiculous they look, all these years, never once questioning the engineering science behind the fact that Republicans claim WTC 1, 2, and 7 collapsed without controlled demolitions.
This would make these three structures the ONLY steel reinforced structures on Earth, ever to have collapsed without controlled demolitions.
A thinking person, can not look at the Benghazi hearings, in front of the backdrop of the uninvestigated, unprosecuted crimes of 9/11 and not think:
You must be joking.
Do the House Republicans somehow not see how ridiculous they look, all these years, never once questioning the engineering science behind the fact that Republicans claim WTC 1, 2, and 7 collapsed without controlled demolitions.
This would make these three structures the ONLY steel reinforced structures on Earth, ever to have collapsed without controlled demolitions.
A thinking person, can not look at the Benghazi hearings, in front of the backdrop of the uninvestigated, unprosecuted crimes of 9/11 and not think:
You must be joking.
8
I's hard to believe that even in the NY Times we get to see the conspiracy whack jobs posting their nonsense. Those of us who worked in the WTC towers and watched the unique design that eliminated most of the space stealing center columns that were a part of buildings in the past like the Empire State Building, The old METLIFE and NEW YORK LIFE buildings readily understood the the engineering reports on why they fell. My son, a Civil Engineer had called me after the second tower was struck and had studied the design told me they were going to fall an hour before they did. The structural design that was so unique was also the towers' weak spot.
3
The legacy of the past decade is chaos, failed states and the march of Islamo-fascism. Secretary Clinton certainly bears responsibility, but the NYT and other media refuse to call her on it.
5
The legacy of the past decade is the damage done by Texas to the rest of the US.
Texas, that gave us the unelected Shrub/Cheney gang, that produced 9/11.
Texas, who gave the Saudi, who sent more hijackers on 9/11 than any other nation, the largest refinery in the US, Saudi Motiva of Texas, which overcharged Americans by triple for 10 years after 9/11, then double for five years, prolonging the longest economic recession in US history.
Texas who welcomed Turner/Hochtief engineers to der Fuhrer, to their new Dallas headquarters, after their headquarters at the WTC got decimated in the WTC buildings where Turner, demolition experts who had brought down Shea Stadium and the Kingdome in Seattle, in their capacity as demolition experts, had just finished ”retrofitting“ the central support columns of the WTC.
Texas, that executes more people each year than any other state in the Union, and has done unending damage to the US, including trillions in debt we will be paying for the rest of your lives, and the rest of our children's and grandchildren's lives.......is the unfortunate legacy of the last 10-15 years.
Makes you wish we had lost the Mexican-American War.
Texas, that gave us the unelected Shrub/Cheney gang, that produced 9/11.
Texas, who gave the Saudi, who sent more hijackers on 9/11 than any other nation, the largest refinery in the US, Saudi Motiva of Texas, which overcharged Americans by triple for 10 years after 9/11, then double for five years, prolonging the longest economic recession in US history.
Texas who welcomed Turner/Hochtief engineers to der Fuhrer, to their new Dallas headquarters, after their headquarters at the WTC got decimated in the WTC buildings where Turner, demolition experts who had brought down Shea Stadium and the Kingdome in Seattle, in their capacity as demolition experts, had just finished ”retrofitting“ the central support columns of the WTC.
Texas, that executes more people each year than any other state in the Union, and has done unending damage to the US, including trillions in debt we will be paying for the rest of your lives, and the rest of our children's and grandchildren's lives.......is the unfortunate legacy of the last 10-15 years.
Makes you wish we had lost the Mexican-American War.
9
There was a much worse attack by terrorists on American soil on 9/11. The President and Secretary of state were not subjected to this level of scrutiny after wards by a Congressional panel. We can surmise that if a Democrat had been President there would have been an attempt to discredit or impeach him for not keeping Americans safe.
11
Agreed; the solution is to give Texas back to Mexico, and then build a big wall around the new border.
Meanwhile, back to Benghazi: Besides the "9-11" attacks, there have been far greater losses incurred in attacks on our embassies and consulates, and our military installations, under previous Republican administrations. Beirut is the most salient example: In 1983, under Ronald Reagan's leadership, we lost 63+ people when our embassy was bombed. Our Marine barracks were also bombed, killing 299. Why didn't Reagan keep our people safe -- and why is he so revered by Republicans?
Meanwhile, back to Benghazi: Besides the "9-11" attacks, there have been far greater losses incurred in attacks on our embassies and consulates, and our military installations, under previous Republican administrations. Beirut is the most salient example: In 1983, under Ronald Reagan's leadership, we lost 63+ people when our embassy was bombed. Our Marine barracks were also bombed, killing 299. Why didn't Reagan keep our people safe -- and why is he so revered by Republicans?
5
Last week protesters who support the "internationally recognized government" in the far eastern town of Tobruk, took to the streets in Benghazi to protest a unity government with the rival Islamist-led authority based in Tripoli. The UN aimed to propose a power-sharing arrangement, but it did not exclude amendments added by the Islamist government. The Islamists also opposed a unity government if their terms weren't met.
What angered the Tobruk lawmakers was that the amendments would have given the unity government the power to fire all senior Libyan officials not approved by its members. The Tobruk government saw this as an attempt to remove their anti-Islamist "strongman", Gen. Khalifa Hifter, whose forces have been battling Islamists for over a year.
It just shows how difficult it is to bring stability to Libya. The longer the fighting drags on the more likely it would be that the country broke up.
What angered the Tobruk lawmakers was that the amendments would have given the unity government the power to fire all senior Libyan officials not approved by its members. The Tobruk government saw this as an attempt to remove their anti-Islamist "strongman", Gen. Khalifa Hifter, whose forces have been battling Islamists for over a year.
It just shows how difficult it is to bring stability to Libya. The longer the fighting drags on the more likely it would be that the country broke up.
6
It just shows that we should have left it alone to begin with.
The current administration messed up the whole thing with it's Arab Spring initiative.
The current administration messed up the whole thing with it's Arab Spring initiative.