Krugman: "Why is that scary? I would argue that all of the G.O.P. candidates are calling for policies that would be deeply destructive at home, abroad, or both."
Dr. Krugman, I have always found your op-ed pieces to be persuasive; however, I really did not need this op-ed to persuade me that these candidates are "scary."
When reading through their responses to questions -- cannot stand to watch this on TV --- I determined that the rational discourse quotient for political debates must be at an all-time low; none of us have reason to be optimistic about the future, should any of them be elected as president and assume the responsibility as commander-in-chief.
Hope others are sleeping peacefully these days, but this is one tax-payer that is not.
Dr. Krugman, I have always found your op-ed pieces to be persuasive; however, I really did not need this op-ed to persuade me that these candidates are "scary."
When reading through their responses to questions -- cannot stand to watch this on TV --- I determined that the rational discourse quotient for political debates must be at an all-time low; none of us have reason to be optimistic about the future, should any of them be elected as president and assume the responsibility as commander-in-chief.
Hope others are sleeping peacefully these days, but this is one tax-payer that is not.
49
A very disturbing thought - our press is owned by the right wing establishment. That is the real reason that "even handed" reporting is lacking in substance when confronted with right wing lies.
58
When Donald Trump failed to challenge the deranged man in New Hampshire who charged that President Obama is a Muslim and then nattered on about Muslim training camps in this country, we saw Mr. Trump's true character. He dodged the crazed assertion much as he dodged the draft in the Vietnam War, allegedly because of a bone spur in his foot. Many a bully is a coward deep down.
72
Excellent points, Dr. Krugman. I lay the whole mess at the feet of the media. It started even before the 2000 election. The national press is no longer about presenting the truth; its about entertainment and ratings. Back when I was a young man a candidate would have been excoriated for using obvious lies. It makes me wonder just how shallow the American culture has become.
79
It's clear that Fiorina is all about fear rhetoric pitching a beefed up the military and stressing the the "baby parts" story. This appeals to very base of the base.
Rubio and Cruz play the same game, trying out-GOP the other with scare tactics, disgust, and head-shaking on the heals of saying this is the greatest country. It's a weird coin flip. On one side, uber-patriotism; on the other side complete disgust with our decaying values. Get them scared while waving a flag for future dominance. Romney tried and failed at this. Let's hope the electorate sees through the ruse.
Rubio and Cruz play the same game, trying out-GOP the other with scare tactics, disgust, and head-shaking on the heals of saying this is the greatest country. It's a weird coin flip. On one side, uber-patriotism; on the other side complete disgust with our decaying values. Get them scared while waving a flag for future dominance. Romney tried and failed at this. Let's hope the electorate sees through the ruse.
41
"You’re probably tired of hearing this, but modern G.O.P. economic discourse is completely dominated by an economic doctrine — the sovereign importance of low taxes on the rich — that has failed completely and utterly in practice over the past generation."
Yes, Mr. Krugman, some of us are tired of hearing it, probably because that's the only note (besides the evil "austerity" hype) you care to play. In actuality, both the Democrats and the Republicans believe in big government. Because of that, both parties have a huge spending problem. It's just that the Republicans tend to tax a little less. And there are other issues in the economy that need to be addressed, but no matter what they are, in your world, Paul, only the Republicans are to blame.
Yes, Mr. Krugman, some of us are tired of hearing it, probably because that's the only note (besides the evil "austerity" hype) you care to play. In actuality, both the Democrats and the Republicans believe in big government. Because of that, both parties have a huge spending problem. It's just that the Republicans tend to tax a little less. And there are other issues in the economy that need to be addressed, but no matter what they are, in your world, Paul, only the Republicans are to blame.
7
Clinton cut capital gains taxes - that's when the boom occurred. He also reformed Welfare and expanded NAFTA to Mexico despite protests of Democrats. Notice Krugman leaves out Reaganomics.
13
You could have an important college course on politics, philosophy and ethics where each day the students compare and contrast Mr. Brooks more spin oriented columns with Mr. Krugman's more just the facts, ma'am take. The NYTimes is an amazing and important world resource, and continues my education in and of itself.
17
Where are the Republican problem-solvers? It is stunning to consider that in the GOP of today, Bob Dole would be a radical left-wing extremist. His policies may not have been great, but people like Dole at least knew how to make government work to enact policies that could achieve some kind of consensus. The Republican party now looks like some kind of giant clown car out of which who knows what will emerge next? I weep for my country...
45
It's very sad that anyone takes these megalomaniacal reality TV wannabes seriously at all.
30
Well intentioned as your message is, you cast pearls before swine. Not that your readers resemble the porcine but in general, the message misses the target. The question we really need to ask is... how to reach the people that re-elect these morons... and why would they not elect one of them to be president? If many of these potential presidents serve our government as representatives of the masses... we should be very concerned about the masses they represent. If the constituency electing them finds them worthy, we either need a new definition of worthy or a new constituency... Maybe our standards are too high, and maybe the system that allows these presidential hopefuls to lead is badly broken... Not matter - Like you the future frightens me.
28
An excellent article. I appreciated your pointing out the lies that were so prevalent throughout this debate. I wish you had commented on Christie's insistence that Social Security is insolvent. Another falsehood or something we need to address?
26
What is truly horrifying is that these candidates, most of whom are probably too intelligent to believe the nonsense they spout, think that the electorate cannot see through them. Even more horrifying is that they may be right.
58
Relax. Most of the crazy stuff is in the same category as Obama's promise to renegotiate NAFTA or Bush #1's "Read my lips" promise. If they get into office, they will ignore their promises, since without exception they are all smart people. Take Huckabee for example. When he was Governor of Arkansas what wild and crazy things did he do? Oh, yeah, he tried to get schools to give more emphasis to art and music.
Climate change may be different. There, some of them may have drunk the Kool-Aid.
Climate change may be different. There, some of them may have drunk the Kool-Aid.
3
An underlying tenet of conservative Capitalism is the Darwinian concept of 'survival of the fittest.' Ironically, this is one reason why the Guns & Oil Party is looking so desperate. Their ability to lie overshadows any level of rational thought or adaptive skills in a changing world.
29
Talk about a "fantasy." Krugman is still claiming "socialism works" even though one in four Americans isn't working! That we've lost 5% of the American "Middle Class" even as the "wage gap" has tripled as has the national debt by the time he leaves office, under Obama.
Paul, socialism STILL doesn't work at any time in history or in any country where it's been attempted.
Paul, socialism STILL doesn't work at any time in history or in any country where it's been attempted.
18
Is it complete insanity to champion the dogma of low taxes and smaller government, given all the evidence that it doesn’t work? It’s not insanity if you know what these code words mean and who stands to benefit.
Hint: it’s not about taxes or economics. The 1% of 1% who stand to benefit from promoting the dogma are actually working toward a different agenda entirely. They disguise it as voodoo economics so we’ll take it in like a Trojan horse. Once the federal government is so small “you could drown it in a bathtub,” it will be too small and ineffective to regulate anything. If you think billionaires get away with flaunting rules and regulations now, just wait until they drown the rest of our government.
They are constantly making a case that government doesn’t work. And they’re right… when you cut funding, staff and resources, government doesn’t work as well as it should. They’ve moved the political center on this issue far to the right of where it was in the Reagan era, and the effect has been a self-fulfilling prophecy.
The issue isn’t about saving a few bucks in taxes, it’s about getting rid of any and all impediments to whatever scheme they plan to cook up in the future.
Hint: it’s not about taxes or economics. The 1% of 1% who stand to benefit from promoting the dogma are actually working toward a different agenda entirely. They disguise it as voodoo economics so we’ll take it in like a Trojan horse. Once the federal government is so small “you could drown it in a bathtub,” it will be too small and ineffective to regulate anything. If you think billionaires get away with flaunting rules and regulations now, just wait until they drown the rest of our government.
They are constantly making a case that government doesn’t work. And they’re right… when you cut funding, staff and resources, government doesn’t work as well as it should. They’ve moved the political center on this issue far to the right of where it was in the Reagan era, and the effect has been a self-fulfilling prophecy.
The issue isn’t about saving a few bucks in taxes, it’s about getting rid of any and all impediments to whatever scheme they plan to cook up in the future.
64
And, the most disturbing thing about these "facts" peddled out there, is that folks believe that minutia. Shame on us and shame on the networks for allowing this idiocy.
40
For the most part, the media is interested in one thing - money, and lots of it.
The good of the country takes a back seat.
When greed outweighs the good of the country, we are in big trouble.
The good of the country takes a back seat.
When greed outweighs the good of the country, we are in big trouble.
28
"...then-candidate George W. Bush to make clearly false assertions — about his tax cuts, about Social Security — without paying any price. " Ah-ha, so this then explains your penchant, Dr. Krugman, for distorting reality until it yelps in pain. By the way, your opinions (and that is largely what they are as opposed to being based in fact) might be believable if you toned down your extremity. What's even worse is, I suspect, even you know that your written opinions are bordering on loony, but that is what you believe motivates your readers to continue reading you.
You may have gotten away with only making the biased and untrue remark about only lowering taxes for the rich, but you go more extreme by advocating for more taxes to promote prosperity. Ergo, the higher the tax rates, the more prosperous the populous. Do you really believe that? Perhaps you also believe that the higher the minimum wage, the greater our prosperity. Perhaps you should be advocating for 90% tax rates and a minimum wage of $50 an hour.
You may have gotten away with only making the biased and untrue remark about only lowering taxes for the rich, but you go more extreme by advocating for more taxes to promote prosperity. Ergo, the higher the tax rates, the more prosperous the populous. Do you really believe that? Perhaps you also believe that the higher the minimum wage, the greater our prosperity. Perhaps you should be advocating for 90% tax rates and a minimum wage of $50 an hour.
9
The North Carolina legislature just voted to privatize Medicaid:
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article35635551.html
Anyone who wants to know the specifics about the Republican presidential candidates' goals needs to look no further than McCrory's North Carolina or Brownback's Kansas.
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article35635551.html
Anyone who wants to know the specifics about the Republican presidential candidates' goals needs to look no further than McCrory's North Carolina or Brownback's Kansas.
18
The crop of GOP presidential wannabes is a manifestation of Citizen's United coming to roost.... to become a presidential candidate, all you have to have is some monied backing- no intelligence whatsoever- just the backing of the monied people regardless of how much of an idiot you are. At least in the case of Trump, he has his own money- but of course, still an idiot.
39
Does repeating lies makes them true?
Clinton's "huge economic boom" followed massive tax cuts, aimed primarily at the rich, and occurred during a time when federal spending fell to 18% of GDP. Tax cuts on the rich, low spending, produce boom and surplus. Who could have predicted that? Certainly not you.
W's cuts were puny; worse, they were temporary. Even worse, he and the GOP hugely expanded the size, scope and expense of government. Still, the economy did OK until "affordable housing" policies, championed by the left, produced disaster. No Fannie, no Freddie, No CRA, no problem.
Now, BHO raises taxes, and we see labor force participation rates at 40 year lows. We see companies lining up at the border to vamoose. What little progress we've made came only after the GOP "obstructed" extending unemployment benefits (in the teeth of wholly false predictions that it would increase unemployment), another fraudulent "stimulus", etc.
And you compare CA to KS? Really, truly? How about comparing it to TX? Or NC? And if the market burp gets worse, and revenues crash? Goombye "growing fast".
And Jeb -- channeling Bill Bradley -- favors "voodoo"? Heck, if we adopted the tax and spend policies of two sainted Dems -- Bradley and Clinton -- we'd see a top rate of 28% and spending at 18% of GDP. Where are the Dems supporting the policies of their heroes? (Meanwhile, Trump proposes a top rate of 20%, and you're HAPPY?!?!)
Only at the Times is repeated error so munificently rewarded.
Clinton's "huge economic boom" followed massive tax cuts, aimed primarily at the rich, and occurred during a time when federal spending fell to 18% of GDP. Tax cuts on the rich, low spending, produce boom and surplus. Who could have predicted that? Certainly not you.
W's cuts were puny; worse, they were temporary. Even worse, he and the GOP hugely expanded the size, scope and expense of government. Still, the economy did OK until "affordable housing" policies, championed by the left, produced disaster. No Fannie, no Freddie, No CRA, no problem.
Now, BHO raises taxes, and we see labor force participation rates at 40 year lows. We see companies lining up at the border to vamoose. What little progress we've made came only after the GOP "obstructed" extending unemployment benefits (in the teeth of wholly false predictions that it would increase unemployment), another fraudulent "stimulus", etc.
And you compare CA to KS? Really, truly? How about comparing it to TX? Or NC? And if the market burp gets worse, and revenues crash? Goombye "growing fast".
And Jeb -- channeling Bill Bradley -- favors "voodoo"? Heck, if we adopted the tax and spend policies of two sainted Dems -- Bradley and Clinton -- we'd see a top rate of 28% and spending at 18% of GDP. Where are the Dems supporting the policies of their heroes? (Meanwhile, Trump proposes a top rate of 20%, and you're HAPPY?!?!)
Only at the Times is repeated error so munificently rewarded.
11
The country is under the spell of propagandists who are pandering to the existential fear and anger that became the focal point of our society on 9-11, when the country transitioned from the optimism of the fall of communism and our economic prosperity. Nature abhors a vacuum and the propagandists with their own cynical agendas have Rushed in (no pun intended) to fill the void. Willfully ignorant, fearful and angry people are easily controlled. Germany in 1936 teaches us something about this. I fear that we might have forgotten the lesson.
27
One does not simply be a Republican and live in a world of reality and truths.
9
Considering all the outright lies Paul Ryan said during his GOP convention speech the last go around (even Fox News called him out on those), I wonder if the candidates really believe this nonsense they spew
8
I am glad you noted Carly Fiorina's wild misstatements about Planned Parenthood. Sometimes I think the press has gone collectively mad. How could front-page articles in respectable papers be devoted to her "top-rated" performance in the debates? Doesn't the nonsense she speaks count?
38
So honesty matters Paul? If so, does the number, magnitude or content of the lies also matter? Because I have a feeling that Carly is going to come out a lot better than Hillary on those counts. If that's the best you've got, you are in trouble.
6
Paul, were you terrified by what was said in the Republican debate because you believe one of those Republicans will be the next president? If you thought the Democratic candidate will win, you wouldn't be so terrified by the Republicans. But you haven't written a column on the Democratic Party candidates and their "proposals." I wonder why.
6
I wish someone would tell me how many trials Chris Christie actually prosecuted or sat on. I was told by a lawyer that he never sat on trial but only did realtor closings. And the only way he was made US Attorney was because his brother raised alot of money for George W Bush
16
The truly sad part of the rise of Republican conservatism is that it is only made possible by the American electorate. Americans are truly exceptional people -- exceptionally stupid!!!
26
Ben Franklin may have help negotiate a republic, but the US sure did neglect dispelling the belief in magic that was the spirit of the Enlightenment and the energy that drove Franklin.
3
And the media meme, supported in no small measure by the NYT's dismal reporting about the made-up scandal related to her e-mails, is that Hillary lies! Such irony.
13
The sorry fact about Mr. Krugman's revelations is that the people willing to put these monsters in office do not care for the truth. They are as deluded as the people they vote for, give it up Mr. Krugman, the cause is lost!
3
How about having Dr. Krugman be one of the moderators asking the questions?
24
There was one great misstatement of fact that I have not seen any comment on, though I haven't been paying the closest attention to analysis of the debate. The debate itself was bad enough.
I believe the subject under discussion was gun control. Jeb Bush stated that efforts to keep guns out of the hands of the wrong people end up punishing the 99.999% (that is the number in the WaPo transcript) of the public who are law-abiding citizens.
Well, Jeb, the latest statistics indicate that 0.72% of the US population is in prison. That suggests to me that either a whole lot of people should be let out of jail, or that keeping guns out of the wrong hands is a bigger problem than you suggest, or both.
It also suggests that Jeb is unaware of the problem of excessive incarceration in this country, or just doesn't care about it. Somehow, his brother has stayed out of jail, and that is the important thing.
I believe the subject under discussion was gun control. Jeb Bush stated that efforts to keep guns out of the hands of the wrong people end up punishing the 99.999% (that is the number in the WaPo transcript) of the public who are law-abiding citizens.
Well, Jeb, the latest statistics indicate that 0.72% of the US population is in prison. That suggests to me that either a whole lot of people should be let out of jail, or that keeping guns out of the wrong hands is a bigger problem than you suggest, or both.
It also suggests that Jeb is unaware of the problem of excessive incarceration in this country, or just doesn't care about it. Somehow, his brother has stayed out of jail, and that is the important thing.
14
Nailed it today
Lets start an online petition to the Times: replace M Dowd or one of the political reporters with a second weekly dose of Krugman
Lets start an online petition to the Times: replace M Dowd or one of the political reporters with a second weekly dose of Krugman
14
No one ever lost an election by overestimating the ignorance of the American voter.
14
During the debate Donald Trump said that George W Bush's poor performance as President lead to the election of Barack Obama. Jeb Bush's response to Trump was to defend his brother by saying "As it relates to my brother there is one thing I know for sure. He kept us safe." Since George W Bush was President for 9 months when 911 occurred how can Jeb's statement possibly be true? No one participating in the debate corrected Jeb.
16
Republicans emphasize "faith" over "facts" as often as they can. The recent GOP debates make that abundantly clear. It is a depressing fact that democracy can lead to rule by the lowest common denominator.
When idiots vote for Huckabee because they hate gays, or other idiots vote for Trump because they don't know the difference between legal and illegal immigrants, one becomes convinced that there is no God who blesses America.
When idiots vote for Huckabee because they hate gays, or other idiots vote for Trump because they don't know the difference between legal and illegal immigrants, one becomes convinced that there is no God who blesses America.
7
Thank you Prof. Krugman for tirelessly and quite emphatically denouncing the views of Republican candidates who share no rational plans attach to their histrionics. I am deeply disturbed that the media (written and film) fail to challenge much the candidates say. And even, go so far as to suggest positive outcomes for some candidates. Indeed, the Times notes that Carly Fiorna is a positive force for bringing women into the GOP. "With a debate performance that was steely and at times deeply personal, Carly Fiorina appears to have improved her standing in the race to be the Republican nominee. But even if she falls short, she took a big stride toward filling a role her party badly needs: a credible antidote to the gender gap and the Democrats’ claims of a Republican “war on women.” She attempted to crush/dismantle Planned Parenthood. Millions of women rely on PP. The Prolife crowd is already in the Republican camp. Among other women's organizations exactly who does this reporter think will be attracted to a woman denying health resources to women? Why not title the report, "Fiorina attacks Planned Parenthood" or ... rather than suggesting any women not already in the GOP would want to join the anti-government, anti-national health care, anti-climate change, anti-Cuba, anti-student loan fixes, anti-infrastructure, anti-gun legislation, ... party Fiorina associates with?
20
Jeb's.. W, my brother, kept us safe.... and then applause. The GOP actually believes their rationalizations. They are very often delusional. It appears that they went down a rabbit hole and entered a GOP biosphere.
GOP defintion of Safe: We watched our neighbors jump off the WTC and listened to the bagpipes play for months as we buried our dead. We were lied to about a War of Mistakes Were Made in Iraq that has caused countless people to die or be injured, cost trillions of dollars, and has plagued the region with violence and mass migrations. Mother Nature hit Mississippi and New Orleans but incompetence killed hundreds of people.
They applauded all of the above...
GOP defintion of Safe: We watched our neighbors jump off the WTC and listened to the bagpipes play for months as we buried our dead. We were lied to about a War of Mistakes Were Made in Iraq that has caused countless people to die or be injured, cost trillions of dollars, and has plagued the region with violence and mass migrations. Mother Nature hit Mississippi and New Orleans but incompetence killed hundreds of people.
They applauded all of the above...
35
Has the great Dr. Krugman parsed Hillary Clinton's statements and speeches?
Want to talk about fantasies and fictions, Clinton's remarks are up there with the best of them...
...And nothing form Dr. K....Absolutely nothing.
Want to talk about fantasies and fictions, Clinton's remarks are up there with the best of them...
...And nothing form Dr. K....Absolutely nothing.
7
These contenders are smart. They do "know the difference between facts and agitprop". And it does matter. In my book, people who are deliberate liars and who use their intelligence to manipulate are far worse and more dangerous than unintelligent people.
19
The scariest thought is that there are enough dumb voters out there who would gleefully put one of these clowns in the White House. This is not a liberal vs conservative argument, it is simply sane/moderate vs. insane/dangerous. Anyone not recognizing this is not living on this planet.
18
Fiorina the winner? Why would ant sane person think this women can be President? She brought HP to its knees and its taken nearly 10 years to build itself up to where they will be laying off another 10% of its global work force of this year thanks to the business acumen of this idiot. What makes anyone outside of the Republican Party think they can lie about her qualifications enough to get rational people to vote for her......other than she's the token women up there.
16
Perhaps we should keep in mind this axiom:
"What matters is not what is true or false, but exclusively what is believed."
General Nagel
"What matters is not what is true or false, but exclusively what is believed."
General Nagel
10
Where is the media? Instead of reporting on who came out ahead, should they not be reporting on the facts that were misrepresented? Did CNN ask questions to enlighten voters, or simply entertain? (I think we know the answer.) And where is the NYT in fact-checking this fiasco?
16
Just goes to show how important the critical situation the GOP finds itself has become. Seems like even the sane, intellectual, economist Dr. Krugman feels it imperative to talk about the GOP - even though there was a very important announcement by the Fed Chairwoman yesterday about keeping interest rates where they are. Just goes to show the catastrophe we are faced with!!
3
"Now we have presidential candidates who make Mr. Bush look like Abe Lincoln. But who will tell the people?"
You just did, Mr. Krugman, but that will make no difference in the world of corporate media simply because the truth no longer matters there.
You just did, Mr. Krugman, but that will make no difference in the world of corporate media simply because the truth no longer matters there.
14
Considering their positions on public health, industrial regulation and the environment the GOP should also be recognized as the pro-cancer party.
11
One gigantic lie told by Jab Bush was that with all the grumbling about the invasion of Iraq being disastrous, one thing stands out as George's great accomplishment. "He kept us safe," said Jab to great applause. Safe? Who was president of September 11th, 2001? Who was president in 2003 and to 2008 when so many of our American military died in Iraq? Are the rest of the GOP candidates as fuzzy headed as those running the show who allowed Bush to get away with such a lie? With all their faults. If I didn't know better I would say the GOP is purposely handing the presidency to Hillary, and if not her then to Vice President Biden.
8
Who wll tell the people? Thankfully, you just did.
Please continue to point out the small minded thinking of these people. It's working for them now because the Republican base is full of uneducated people, angry at the world and at people who don't look like them, or speak a different language. Keep being a journalist and point out their lies, distortions and outright stupidity.
Please continue to point out the small minded thinking of these people. It's working for them now because the Republican base is full of uneducated people, angry at the world and at people who don't look like them, or speak a different language. Keep being a journalist and point out their lies, distortions and outright stupidity.
9
"But who will tell the people?"
Why... Rush Limbaugh of course!
Why... Rush Limbaugh of course!
5
It's disturbing. The manner in which Ms. Fiorina tried to manipulate your visceral emotions about the video went too far. She will stab you with knives and tear you to shreds to reach her goals. I would not be surprised if having her as a stepmother contributed to her stepdaughter's need for drugs. There, I said it.
13
So it's 17 months before a new President takes office and the nation is consumed with a group of buffoons making promises they can't keep, to people they don't care about. How about actually doing some of our country's business now, as in 2015? Sound too much like work?
5
Thank you Krugman for always shining a light into the dark, ossified creases known as the modern right-wing mindset. (Because these folks are no longer Republicans). The media are just lazy, and as long as we live in self-selecting news channels, I fear sanity won't break through. (I had a liberal friend ask me why I was following David Frum on Twitter! Um ... different viewpoints, perhaps?) And I always try to follow the more reasonable folks with whom I disagree. But then you look at CNN's breathless reporting on "that guy" (I won't name him, he's gotten enough ink already), and it leaves me feeling discouraged. Reagan (who I despised at the time) looks downright reasonable by comparison.
5
Can you please talk to David Brooks? He seems to have no problem stating the Fiorina is a plausible candidate! What is wrong with him? He knows she lied and that the republicans are out to lunch. However, he still suggests that they have plausible candidates. Does he really want to live in a country where one of them govern? Wake him up will you Paul?!
14
The whole GOP race is a complete setup at this point.
They obviously want Jeb to win, and have Rubio or Carly to round out the ticket.
They keep Trump around to boost ratings and draw people in
They pump up Rubio, Carly, and Carson to appeal to gain traction in low polling demographic segments
Cruz is the "legitimate" fire and brimstone candidate
Huckabee reminds the old-school GOP that they're still wanted.
Kasich is the backup plan to Bush
No matter what happens, those people will stick around until February, playing their part. And the surrogates will use the pres to maintain that hierarchy, pushing any of them in the press if they seem to be losing steam.
Carson, Huckabee, and Cruz will be the first of those to go, then Trump, then Kasich or Bush, leaving Carly and Rubio as the silver medalist / VP.
They obviously want Jeb to win, and have Rubio or Carly to round out the ticket.
They keep Trump around to boost ratings and draw people in
They pump up Rubio, Carly, and Carson to appeal to gain traction in low polling demographic segments
Cruz is the "legitimate" fire and brimstone candidate
Huckabee reminds the old-school GOP that they're still wanted.
Kasich is the backup plan to Bush
No matter what happens, those people will stick around until February, playing their part. And the surrogates will use the pres to maintain that hierarchy, pushing any of them in the press if they seem to be losing steam.
Carson, Huckabee, and Cruz will be the first of those to go, then Trump, then Kasich or Bush, leaving Carly and Rubio as the silver medalist / VP.
5
A final though on the latest epsideo of "presidential Idol".
Trump reminds me of the mean drunk Uncle at Thanksgiving that won't let anyone speak, Christie the Uncle who eats all the turkey so there's no leftovers, Kasich the sober one, Fiorina the Uncle's new wife who was his family's babysitter, Walker the gym teacher who got caught flashing, Bush the smart Uncle in a really dumb bloodline, Carson the Veterinarian that cross breeds sheep with coyotes, Cruz the used car salesman that sells you a car with a dead body in the trunk, Rubio the choir boy step brother that likes to borrow your brother's underwear, Huckabee the stepfather that wants to read you the bible in his underwear, Paul the high school school bus driver that sells you weed and... a gun!
Whew, got through that.
Trump reminds me of the mean drunk Uncle at Thanksgiving that won't let anyone speak, Christie the Uncle who eats all the turkey so there's no leftovers, Kasich the sober one, Fiorina the Uncle's new wife who was his family's babysitter, Walker the gym teacher who got caught flashing, Bush the smart Uncle in a really dumb bloodline, Carson the Veterinarian that cross breeds sheep with coyotes, Cruz the used car salesman that sells you a car with a dead body in the trunk, Rubio the choir boy step brother that likes to borrow your brother's underwear, Huckabee the stepfather that wants to read you the bible in his underwear, Paul the high school school bus driver that sells you weed and... a gun!
Whew, got through that.
13
The Republicans in general and Ms Fiorina in particular seem to have taken Josef Goebbels teachings to heart: it works!
14
Clowns Nullify News on CNN.
5
Who will tell the people? You will. Thanks.
6
Thank you for that. Between the Republican Sideshow and the Democrat Coronation the rest of the world must think we've all gone off our meds.
3
"But who will tell the people?" The people don't care. They support their tribe.
6
Raise taxes to promote growth because belt-tightening works? I didn't know that.
Jeb Bush would put Margaret Thatcher on our money. Ms Fiorina would make Margaret Thatcher look like a conservative piker as she dismantles Medicare, Social Security and women's rights to control of their own bodies. Would she support the shut down of our government to make a point about Planned Parenthood which has done so much to protect the health of her sex? She may use her gender as a campaign issue when fighting off statements by the Donald, but she is really only the female face of her anti people party.
13
None of the people participating in the Republican debate are qualified to be President. None of them will be President.
Good government is one of America's best realities. Every one of those candidates asserted that government is the problem. In fact, government has been the solution since the Constitution was written. In the United States we have a professional civil service, non-corrupt government with integrity and fairness, open courts and the rule of law. Our economy needs more government, to administer the immigration system, for example, so that people don't wait in line for years.
None of those candidates have ever uttered the phrase "civil service".
The federal government needs to hire more people to protect the environment, build public infrastructure, defend the nation, administer justice, and administer the immigration system. Instead of building a wall we should be speeding up immigration applications so no one waits in line for more than 90 days.
Immigration helps the economy and creates growth. Who does Mr. Trump think cooks the meals, washes the dishes, landscapes the property, harvests the crops, and does the construction work? Immigration has grown the economy since before the United States was founded.
None of those candidates had an explanation of how 300 million people got here, nor how the economy has grown to trillions of dollars.
They are Republicans. They are idiots. None of them are qualified.
Good government is one of America's best realities. Every one of those candidates asserted that government is the problem. In fact, government has been the solution since the Constitution was written. In the United States we have a professional civil service, non-corrupt government with integrity and fairness, open courts and the rule of law. Our economy needs more government, to administer the immigration system, for example, so that people don't wait in line for years.
None of those candidates have ever uttered the phrase "civil service".
The federal government needs to hire more people to protect the environment, build public infrastructure, defend the nation, administer justice, and administer the immigration system. Instead of building a wall we should be speeding up immigration applications so no one waits in line for more than 90 days.
Immigration helps the economy and creates growth. Who does Mr. Trump think cooks the meals, washes the dishes, landscapes the property, harvests the crops, and does the construction work? Immigration has grown the economy since before the United States was founded.
None of those candidates had an explanation of how 300 million people got here, nor how the economy has grown to trillions of dollars.
They are Republicans. They are idiots. None of them are qualified.
16
The truth is that a substantial minority of American voters believe these lies, so the politicians are only telling these voters what they think they already know.
12
Krugman should not be the only person writing this story. As he mentioned, the "fair and balanced" media (of which I was a part for many years) does not have the spine to call a lie a lie. I'll let you in on my wildest fantasy: That every media outlet, no matter how small, start making note of each lie and half-truth and rewritten history that any politician or candidate spews. They should never stoop to print or broadcast something they know is not true just because someone famous said it. If they need to quote the person, the line following every mis-statement should set the record straight. Every time. Without fail. The words, "That is not true," should be the new mantra of the news media.
I'm also hoping for a unicorn for Christmas.
I'm also hoping for a unicorn for Christmas.
10
"... I’m terrified. You should be, too."
Yes, I am but not only of the Republican candidates, but of Hillary Clinton and those riding on the hem of her skirt too. At the time of Carter's election I was thinking of exiling myself until hopefully better times, but I did not do so. Now the same thought, but more strongly, penetrates my mind again.
Can the US voters be so deeply nearsighted and unthinking as to elect a like of Trump or Clinton? Well, perhaps yes: there was the vote for the abolition of the constitutional monarchy in France in 1792, the votes fro the regime in the Bolshevist controlled Russia, the vote for the Nazi Party in German elections of 1933, and the periodic protest votes for Labour in the UK.
Gold help these United States!
Yes, I am but not only of the Republican candidates, but of Hillary Clinton and those riding on the hem of her skirt too. At the time of Carter's election I was thinking of exiling myself until hopefully better times, but I did not do so. Now the same thought, but more strongly, penetrates my mind again.
Can the US voters be so deeply nearsighted and unthinking as to elect a like of Trump or Clinton? Well, perhaps yes: there was the vote for the abolition of the constitutional monarchy in France in 1792, the votes fro the regime in the Bolshevist controlled Russia, the vote for the Nazi Party in German elections of 1933, and the periodic protest votes for Labour in the UK.
Gold help these United States!
3
What's interesting is the hand picked audience made up of Republican invitees and their reaction to the "debate". If the Republican electorate settles for bottom of the barrel candidates, I have to wonder about their agenda.
6
An old saw tells us: There are lies, damned lies, and statistics.
In the current context: There are lies, damned lies, and Fiorina's."
And, yes, that can be enlarged to embrace statements of virtually all the Republican candidates. The disregard of commonly-known facts and the history behind them reflects either failure of education, awareness, or comprehension - or simply intentional mendacity.
We have published analyses of policy statements by most of the candidates, Republican and Democrat alike, employing our scientific, objective, proprietary Integrative Propositional Analysis suite in evaluating the probability of each to achieve its stated goals .
Suffice it to say here that all those we have evaluated are more likely to result in unintended consequences than to fulfill their objectives. The results are published at http://wwww.scipolicy.org/potus-candidates-policies.html.
Address inquiries to [email protected].
In the current context: There are lies, damned lies, and Fiorina's."
And, yes, that can be enlarged to embrace statements of virtually all the Republican candidates. The disregard of commonly-known facts and the history behind them reflects either failure of education, awareness, or comprehension - or simply intentional mendacity.
We have published analyses of policy statements by most of the candidates, Republican and Democrat alike, employing our scientific, objective, proprietary Integrative Propositional Analysis suite in evaluating the probability of each to achieve its stated goals .
Suffice it to say here that all those we have evaluated are more likely to result in unintended consequences than to fulfill their objectives. The results are published at http://wwww.scipolicy.org/potus-candidates-policies.html.
Address inquiries to [email protected].
4
I wanted to throw my remote when Jeb Bush said "W Bush kept us safe". Wait a minute, didn't 9/11 happen during W's presidency? Did I wake up in an alternate world or something? The only terrorist attach on American soil happened during W's presidency but Jeb is saying that "at least he kept us safe"? Wow. Just Wow.
18
Who will tell the people? We need Jon Stewart
8
For all those who believe Kasich is a moderate: he signed into law a bill prohibiting a woman from having an abortion if her fetus tests positive for Downs Syndrome. This is not moderate. All the Republican candidates believe that a pregnant woman's body belongs to the government until she gives birth, at which time she—and her baby—are on their own.
26
I grew up in an era where Walter Cronkite appeared on the CBS evening news for half an hour a day. He would relate the important news of the day in his distinctive baritone, a rational discussion and clear presentation ending with his signature line, "And that's the way it is..." The world seemed calmer, more rationale, predictable, and stable even as Cold War tensions evoked threats of nuclear holocaust.
Today, we have 24/7 news coverage on CNN, MSNBC, FOX, and other channels where the talking heads are desperate to keep talking and find things to talk about. With media attention, insignificant events or comments are seized upon and endlessly regurgitated by polished and poised television journalists, apparently unaware or uncaring that their serious coverage and delivery of trivia is wasting their time and ours.
The results are the idiotic spectacles we see today, politicians bloviating ad nauseum simply to gain air time in a crowded media spectrum. Why don't we all just unplug, switch off, and disconnect and go read a good book instead? There may be intelligent life out there in TV land, but we won't find it on CNN or FOX.
Today, we have 24/7 news coverage on CNN, MSNBC, FOX, and other channels where the talking heads are desperate to keep talking and find things to talk about. With media attention, insignificant events or comments are seized upon and endlessly regurgitated by polished and poised television journalists, apparently unaware or uncaring that their serious coverage and delivery of trivia is wasting their time and ours.
The results are the idiotic spectacles we see today, politicians bloviating ad nauseum simply to gain air time in a crowded media spectrum. Why don't we all just unplug, switch off, and disconnect and go read a good book instead? There may be intelligent life out there in TV land, but we won't find it on CNN or FOX.
11
Much of the press is largely an infotainment group now.
We'll get no help from them.
America, nice while it lasted.
We'll get no help from them.
America, nice while it lasted.
13
The remarks made by the Republican candidates ridiculing and degrading this country and its "stupid" leaders gives great joy to our enemies abroad.For the harm they do this country, their destructive statements are near treasonous. What a horrible bunch they are.
14
Yes Paul, and while you're at it what about the claims of Scott Walker that he's created a economic miracle in Wisconsin rather than the disaster The Donald alleged? Like you I am "terrified" by the jingoist "red bait" and war flags being waved by clearly inept, little men and one woman, with, as you note only Rand Paul, who later committed medical malpractice regarding Dr. Trump's advice about vaccines causing autism, sounding sane. Perhaps it is my Jewish Holocaust roots that made me think I was in some nightmare watching a rally in 1930's Nuremberg rather than 21st century America to which my father and grandfathers had fled to avoid the strident religious repression, only now to discover spewing from the mouths of all the candidates the equally racist belief in the primacy of Christian Sharia law over that of the Supreme Court, and that all brown-skinned skin Hispanic immigrants should be deported . As a psychologist, I hope the voters will realize that when candidates live in world of such dark and dangerous "fantasies" that they lack the mental stability for any elected office, especially one where you have access to nuclear weapons.
8
Krugman pontificating on fantasy and fictions... when did the NYT become The Onion?
3
I was struck by the repeated assertions that "Washington" (meaning the Obama Administration) is wracked by "corruption." Huh? What are they talking about? I don't recall any prosecutions of high-level or even much middle level corruption in the federal government. The corruption is all over on Capitol Hill where Congressmen and Senators are bought and paid for by special interests to do their bidding and then often rewarded with cushy jobs with lobbying firms or private companies that like to use their faces to advance their special interests. This cuts across party lines, with Democrats and Republicans both involved in this tawdry racket. When you look at the so-called candidates on the stage the other night, you see quite a few people who have benefited big-time by selling their insider status to special interests.
13
Who will tell them indeed? I can't find a straight account of what was said at the debate in the online version of NYT, and only a couple of fact checking articles on tangential matters like Carly Fiorina's record at HP and vaccinations. (Although the fact that none of them, including the doctor or the dentist, have the knowledge or courage to tell people that they need to vaccinate their children on the scientifically based CDC schedule does say a great deal.) All horse race, one liners, perceptions, ,,, Nothing to help someone really evaluate a candidate (or let people see how frightening the GOP consensus is). PK had to go to the Washington Post for a transcript.
4
"The real revelation on Wednesday, however, was the way some of the candidates went beyond expounding bad analysis and peddling bad history to making outright false assertions, and probably doing so knowingly, which turns those false assertions into what are technically known as “lies.”"
There it is, our worst enemy, worse than ISIS, the one that will bring down the greatness, the present and the future of this country. When reason and truths no longer matter, when we are dominated and controlled by only our desires and ego, we cannot talk to each other, we cannot work together, and we cannot even within oneself begin to think and act honestly and therefore creatively and constructively to deal with the many problems facing us.
I have such trepidation for this country and my children. This country, despite all its flaws, is still the beacon of freedom and humanity and protector for the world. And we are ruining it, we ourselves are ruining it.
There it is, our worst enemy, worse than ISIS, the one that will bring down the greatness, the present and the future of this country. When reason and truths no longer matter, when we are dominated and controlled by only our desires and ego, we cannot talk to each other, we cannot work together, and we cannot even within oneself begin to think and act honestly and therefore creatively and constructively to deal with the many problems facing us.
I have such trepidation for this country and my children. This country, despite all its flaws, is still the beacon of freedom and humanity and protector for the world. And we are ruining it, we ourselves are ruining it.
8
There you go again, Paul shooting down political narratives with the facts. Facts? We are not interesting in facts! Unlike fantasies and stories, facts do not warm our heart -- when was the last time a policy wonk got elected?
5
Americans watching this second GOP debate saw a wretched example of incompetent candidates being interviewed by an incompetent interrogator. Not a single one of these small potato people is fit to tie the shoelaces of Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, or Martin O'Malley. Like most true conservatives, I'm voting Democrat in 2016.
18
Thank you for calling out the "conventions of 'even-handed' reporting." It's a travesty and accounts for our country being alone among Western nations to still be debating whether climate change is human-caused.
12
The best minds in the business put together CNN's first Republican debate, so maybe we should speculate about why it looked and sounded the way it did.
First, and most important, the debate was primarily about eyeballs. Ratings broke records and by this measure it was the most successful debate in TV history. Struggling CNN badly needed a big win and they got one. It was a win for the candidates too. It doesn't matter what people say about you, as long as they are talking about you.
Second, the American public wants to be entertained, not informed. The debate followed the reality-TV format of "Apprentice", "Batchelor", "Survivor" and their ilk. Viewers of those shows know on some level that it's not real, but they willfully set aside their disbelief and pretend that it is. News merged with entertainment so long ago that most Americans don't remember when it was otherwise. Truth has given way to amusement.
There is a danger to this. When someone offers you something "for free", you're the product. The debate was free entertainment, but the viewers vote is what they will pay for being entertained.
First, and most important, the debate was primarily about eyeballs. Ratings broke records and by this measure it was the most successful debate in TV history. Struggling CNN badly needed a big win and they got one. It was a win for the candidates too. It doesn't matter what people say about you, as long as they are talking about you.
Second, the American public wants to be entertained, not informed. The debate followed the reality-TV format of "Apprentice", "Batchelor", "Survivor" and their ilk. Viewers of those shows know on some level that it's not real, but they willfully set aside their disbelief and pretend that it is. News merged with entertainment so long ago that most Americans don't remember when it was otherwise. Truth has given way to amusement.
There is a danger to this. When someone offers you something "for free", you're the product. The debate was free entertainment, but the viewers vote is what they will pay for being entertained.
8
Even Krugman has been conditioned to pull his punches. What's a "technical" lie, sir?
2
I eagerly await Mr. Krugman's analysis of Hilary Clinton's "fibs". Dead broke? Start there sir.
2
These debates should be held at Google, that does an instant fact check in real time with a gong or loud air horn to blast lies & misstatements at every turn.The media is seriously failing us in this regard & it leads directly to a misinformed public (The misinformation age)
12
What is worse than the lies that these lame, ignorant characters espouse, is that Republicans - and others - are so willing to believe them! - and so unwilling to question them! "Who will tell the people?" is a great question - but will the Republican-loving, gullible people who lap this stuff up believe that truth-teller?! Undoubtedly not. And that is truly scary. And deeply depressing.
I do worry for my country - I worry Big Time! - as they say...
I do worry for my country - I worry Big Time! - as they say...
5
The answer to your closing question has to be, "You, and the rest of the media." That it remains, though, only you, Mr. Krugman, and a handful of others leaves me perplexed. Is the failure of the media to aggressively challenge such outrageous behaviors in our leaders and would-be leaders laziness? Is it an unwillingness to challenge people for fear of consequences? And if so, what consequences, and brought by whom? Whatever the reason, the public deserves, and more importantly, needs better from the news media. Please?
3
It seems that Krugman is bothered by liars. I hope this means that he won't be a hypocrite and support Hillary, who makes every Republican look like Honest Abe.
1
Thank you, Paul Krugman, for telling the people. I hope some on that side will listen, will read.
3
Great article Dr. K. I would however like to point out that Clintons presidency coincided with the first dot com /real estate bubble that turned into a disaster for us non banker type investors; also just a minor quip, Bush didn't say the earth was flat, however your fellow columnist Mr. Friedman did say "the world is flat", as an early promoter of globalization , and every working class American and European knows only too well what an unmitigated disaster that has been when the good paying factory and increasingly white collar jobs went to China as the C.E.O.s work their way down the list of nations they can exploit for cheap labor. I digress, thank you again for a good column and for pointing out the continuing saga of Hewlett Packard as a metaphor for American values and greed as one inept c.e.o. after another drags the best of Americas companies down the proverbial toilet attempting to elevate stock prices through financial engineering and mergers and acquisitions with resulting "cost cutting"{firing people and reducing benefits in plain English] rather than creating something of value as did David Packard and Mr. Hewlett who did so while giving their employees a fair shake, not a pink slip. Oh wait one last thing Dr. K. isn't it about time for a reprint of your most prescient column on "they are selling each other condos down in Florida" the same bubble is forming now in housing and stocks thanks to the fed. Have a good day.
2
"I began writing for The Times during the 2000 election campaign, and what I remember above all from that campaign is the way the conventions of “evenhanded” reporting allowed then-candidate George W. Bush to make clearly false assertions — about his tax cuts, about Social Security — without paying any price."
This.
Your colleagues in the media are determined to offer the "both sides do it" or "both sides are just as bad" nonsense, when clearly only one of the two political parties we allow ourselves has went off the rails in matters of science, in matters of economics, in matters of foreign policy.
Donald Trump gets a lot of attention for being a ridiculous blowhard. Are the other GOP candidates, even the so-called sensible ones, much better? Jeb Bush casually says, "My brother kept us safe," and even Tweets out a picture of his brother standing on the rubble of the WTC, and the media shrugs.
This.
Your colleagues in the media are determined to offer the "both sides do it" or "both sides are just as bad" nonsense, when clearly only one of the two political parties we allow ourselves has went off the rails in matters of science, in matters of economics, in matters of foreign policy.
Donald Trump gets a lot of attention for being a ridiculous blowhard. Are the other GOP candidates, even the so-called sensible ones, much better? Jeb Bush casually says, "My brother kept us safe," and even Tweets out a picture of his brother standing on the rubble of the WTC, and the media shrugs.
7
I am deeply ashamed for the people who were on stage, the moderators and overall - this country. If what we can muster to lead us is this band of liars, hypocrites and holy rollers we come across as a country of morons. Yup, all of us...... Tell me that having people lie -outright and with no thought of consequences, and moderators who - instead of saying, sir or ma'am, that is false - doesn't make you sick. Did it to me.
9
Paul Krugman asks ... "Who will tell the people?” A wild guess –Bernie Sanders?
Bernie Sanders is running a radical campaign. He has promised to "tell the truth."
The New Times, and other less coherent media, don't want to admit to the "truth" (see today's NYT's Op-Ed, which after seven years still believes that zero interest rates will solve our economic problems).
Insanity has been defined as doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results. The Fed has used monetary policy and zero interest rates to suckle along a sick business model for SEVEN YEARS.
Wall Street loves zero interest rates. Big Business loves zero interest rates. Consumers get some break on home mortgages, but continue to get screwed on credit card debt at rates of 25% and more.
Banks, and corporate America are making billions from the Fed’s policy, while they paying starvation wages to 50 % of the population.
We need a New New Deal with the attendant “Relief, Reform and Recovery” agenda, not the Fed zero rate interest policy which has addicted the financial markets and created trillions in inflated stock and other asset prices.
How’s that for truth, Paul?
Bernie Sanders is running a radical campaign. He has promised to "tell the truth."
The New Times, and other less coherent media, don't want to admit to the "truth" (see today's NYT's Op-Ed, which after seven years still believes that zero interest rates will solve our economic problems).
Insanity has been defined as doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results. The Fed has used monetary policy and zero interest rates to suckle along a sick business model for SEVEN YEARS.
Wall Street loves zero interest rates. Big Business loves zero interest rates. Consumers get some break on home mortgages, but continue to get screwed on credit card debt at rates of 25% and more.
Banks, and corporate America are making billions from the Fed’s policy, while they paying starvation wages to 50 % of the population.
We need a New New Deal with the attendant “Relief, Reform and Recovery” agenda, not the Fed zero rate interest policy which has addicted the financial markets and created trillions in inflated stock and other asset prices.
How’s that for truth, Paul?
3
Yes Ran Paul looking like the sane one. Now that's insane!
3
Well, alright: We can't trust lunatics on the Right as this article suggests. But what about the lunatics on the Left? The opinion pages of the NYTs have their own slant, some of which are tainted with the lunacy of propaganda (e.g., "I'm terrified. You should be too"). We've gone from "evenhanded" reporting during the conception of George W Bush's malignant presidency to tribes of lunatics struggling forever to thrown each other into the void. Perhaps we should revisit our notes on creative non-fiction.
2
What does Krugman hope to accomplish with these columns? Here's my theory: He knows that the Republican base has been inoculated against actual facts and rational argument and probably won't read the columns. He knows that the majority of his readers already have a clue that the GOP candidates are selling snake oil. So he is writing for an imagined middle group of readers who don't appreciate fully the utter vacuousness — some of it vicious — of what the candidates are pushing, and he therefore is performing the public service of bringing the idiocy to the attention of this middle group. Whatever.
3
Have we forgotten what happened four years ago? Booing an Iraq War veteran? Cheering high execution rates? Let's hope the rhetoric comes back down to earth soon. We definitely need to restrict the political campaign industry which feeds this insanity and use the British and Canadian systems of only 60 days.
9
Do people still read newspapers in Republican land where it is all FOX and hate radio? Republican politicians like Mitt Romney can look you straight in the eye and lie to your face while he knows that you know he is lying and if you challenge him he deals you another lie. Remember “Etch a Sketch.?” He ultimately learned that after you flush the toilet that does not mean people will drink the water.
The Republican party is giving the American public the unprecedented opportunity to destroy this country and you can pick your own poison. Each of these Republican candidates are damaged goods and by and large a nasty bunch who have not seen fit to address the issues that are important to the people.
They insult the intelligence of people who value good government. There is a Latin term which lawyers use: “Ipsi Dixit,” which means that “it is so, because I say it.” So Trump went to a military prep school so he really had served in the military. I was a boy scout at 12 so I must have served in the military too? Trump has tapped into something in America which he neither understands or can control.
America has some really crazy people. Bigots and paranoids abound. We have anarchists and neo confederates and neo Nazis and militias who threaten government and this Republican platter of anti government, pro billionaire, anti people, anti woman, is a feast for these people a real chance to destroy because they can create nothing of value just like the Republicans.
The Republican party is giving the American public the unprecedented opportunity to destroy this country and you can pick your own poison. Each of these Republican candidates are damaged goods and by and large a nasty bunch who have not seen fit to address the issues that are important to the people.
They insult the intelligence of people who value good government. There is a Latin term which lawyers use: “Ipsi Dixit,” which means that “it is so, because I say it.” So Trump went to a military prep school so he really had served in the military. I was a boy scout at 12 so I must have served in the military too? Trump has tapped into something in America which he neither understands or can control.
America has some really crazy people. Bigots and paranoids abound. We have anarchists and neo confederates and neo Nazis and militias who threaten government and this Republican platter of anti government, pro billionaire, anti people, anti woman, is a feast for these people a real chance to destroy because they can create nothing of value just like the Republicans.
8
There is no correlation between Bush's tiny tax cuts and financial meltdown five years later.
BOTH parties are responsible for that by deciding that everyone needs to own a house whether they could afford it or not.
BOTH parties are responsible for that by deciding that everyone needs to own a house whether they could afford it or not.
2
Why not include a fact checking session following each debate? A half hour follow up session hosted by journalists checking the candidates' assertions against PolitiFact or FactCheck might cut down on the outright lies and distortions -- or at least expose them for what they are.
19
The media is to blame for all this 'even-handling' of news when blatant lies appear as 'truths' and swallowed by the general public who has a short attention span and cannot separate truth from fantasy and fiction. The one thing that matters : the utter failure of the Fox news to convince republicans that they are capable of deciding the Presidential Candidates for them. Trump destroyed their pompous republicanism and for that he deserves credit. The 'talking heads' must stop polling and focus on every lies uttered by the candidates and expose their meanness to make this nation great again by allowing reasonable and intellectuals to run for this great job. The media manipulation must stop. This nation deserves some great people as presidential candidates not a bunch of megalomaniacs who destroy their state's economy to espouse their conservative principles to get accolades from the tea-party faithfuls.
12
Thanks for sharing the information about false statements by the candidates. I usually assume their opinions are slanted, but I am reluctant to acknowledge that they actually lie, except in the case perhaps of Ted Cruz.
5
I actually like the spirit of Donald Trump's tax plan. It's probably too low to work: should be 5/15/30/45 instead of 5/10/15/20. But it's simple. It's aggressive. And it makes sense. I also like that he wants to do a one-time tax on the rich. We should use one time taxes on the rich to pay for wars and natural disaster recovery too. Fair is fair. The poor fight wars. The rich should have to pay for those wars.
.
Of course, once the Republican base stops going gaga over Trump's crazy immigration ideas long enough to realize what his tax plan is, they'll eat him alive. So really this is all hypothetical.
.
Of course, once the Republican base stops going gaga over Trump's crazy immigration ideas long enough to realize what his tax plan is, they'll eat him alive. So really this is all hypothetical.
7
And they haven't seen Mrs. Trump and heard about the 4 children by 3 different wives. That could make some heads explode.
1
Where to start.. well lets take the Obama tax hike. Note to Krugman, the Fed looked at the state of the economy and determined it cannot raise interest rates even a quarter of a point. If this economy slows anymore there are no tools left for the Fed, they cannot lower interest rates anymore than they already are. So there was hope by the Fed that the economy would at least be strong enough to support such a minimum increase. Using the professors simple one-follows-the-other analysis, the fact is a truly weak economy has followed the Obama tax hike. Also let's not ignore Prof. Krugman's construct regarding the Iran agreement. He claims no deal means resorting to force. Pre deal Iran was hurting because of the sanctions, no deal simplly means continuation of the sanctions. A deal means dropping the sanctions in return for Iran's willingness to let us inspect some of their facilities after 3 weeks notice while military sites remain off limits or subject to inspections by Iran itself. It is Krugman who lives on fantasy island and he is eerily similar to the character that announced " the plane, the plane".
1
Tax increases that took effect at the beginning of 2013 were enacted through the passage of the American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012, a compromise bill pushed through Congress as a partial resolution to the then-looming "fiscal cliff" crisis.
* The top marginal federal income tax rate increased from 35% to 39.6%
* Top marginal tax rates on long-term capital gains increased: 15% to 20%
* Top marginal tax rates on dividends increased: 15% to 20%
* Estate taxes increased:
- 35% of value over $5,120,000 to 40% of value above $5,340,000
Increases in marginal tax rates for federal income tax, capital gains, and dividends affected only those persons with taxable incomes over a $400,000 (single)/$450,000 (married).
An estate tax filing is required only for estates with gross assets in excess of $5 million.
The only adjustment to payroll-related taxes resulting from the American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012 was that a two-year old cut to payroll taxes which had previously reduced the rate from 6.2% to 4.2% for 2011 and 2012 was not extended.
The American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012 passed Congress by a margin of 89-8 in the Senate. 40 Republican voted in favor.
It passed in the House by a margin of 257-167. 85 Republican voted in favor.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/taxes/whathappened.asp#jBBi2k5VSW4ffmq5.99
* The top marginal federal income tax rate increased from 35% to 39.6%
* Top marginal tax rates on long-term capital gains increased: 15% to 20%
* Top marginal tax rates on dividends increased: 15% to 20%
* Estate taxes increased:
- 35% of value over $5,120,000 to 40% of value above $5,340,000
Increases in marginal tax rates for federal income tax, capital gains, and dividends affected only those persons with taxable incomes over a $400,000 (single)/$450,000 (married).
An estate tax filing is required only for estates with gross assets in excess of $5 million.
The only adjustment to payroll-related taxes resulting from the American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012 was that a two-year old cut to payroll taxes which had previously reduced the rate from 6.2% to 4.2% for 2011 and 2012 was not extended.
The American Taxpayer Relief Act of 2012 passed Congress by a margin of 89-8 in the Senate. 40 Republican voted in favor.
It passed in the House by a margin of 257-167. 85 Republican voted in favor.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/taxes/whathappened.asp#jBBi2k5VSW4ffmq5.99
5
I see we didn't bother to read Krugman's article before coming up with a whole slew of weird claims.
4
MOst of Iran's Trade had been with other countries, principally China, Russia, & Germany. ALL the other countries in the agreement made it blindingly clear, that if we walked away from it, they would NOT continue sanction.
You are the one, Eric, who is living on Fantasy Island.
Also the weak economy followed on the many stupid actions of the Bush administration. The crash happened before Obama took office.
You are the one, Eric, who is living on Fantasy Island.
Also the weak economy followed on the many stupid actions of the Bush administration. The crash happened before Obama took office.
4
Mr. Krugman has brought some truth to his readers. Most of those on stage at the debate did not. As a true conservative I was offended that Tea Party members hid behind Ronald Reagan's supposed success. He left office under a cloud called the Iran Contra-Scandal. His defense made him look like a doddering old man, at best.
Krugman rightly points us to focus on the lies told. I appreciate his efforts even though he ultimately believes in the chewy goodness of a market economy. He does a great job in reflecting voter disapproval for our bought and paid for government. The needs of the many overweighs the needs of the wealthiest amongst us. Both parties are leaning away from those who take PAC money. I personally do not think that money is, by itself, free speech or that a corporation should have the rights of a citizen.
Mr. Krugman reminds us that some of these candidates are hectoring us into conflicts that can only be resolved in war. China and Russia are not our enemies, but we do have some conflicting interests that need to be handled with an open mind. Only the most extreme right wing reactionary would want to close off communications with either one of them. Heck, China manufactures most of our bullets. I wonder how the NRA will react if that supply is threatened by these war mongers.
Krugman rightly points us to focus on the lies told. I appreciate his efforts even though he ultimately believes in the chewy goodness of a market economy. He does a great job in reflecting voter disapproval for our bought and paid for government. The needs of the many overweighs the needs of the wealthiest amongst us. Both parties are leaning away from those who take PAC money. I personally do not think that money is, by itself, free speech or that a corporation should have the rights of a citizen.
Mr. Krugman reminds us that some of these candidates are hectoring us into conflicts that can only be resolved in war. China and Russia are not our enemies, but we do have some conflicting interests that need to be handled with an open mind. Only the most extreme right wing reactionary would want to close off communications with either one of them. Heck, China manufactures most of our bullets. I wonder how the NRA will react if that supply is threatened by these war mongers.
13
A son of the man who pardoned all the Iran Contra conspirators to end the investigation of what they actually did was right there on the stage taking questions.
5
Mr. Krugman, you say, "But even if you like the broad thrust of modern Republican policies, it should worry you that the men and woman on that stage are clearly living in a world of fantasies and fictions. And some seem willing to advance their ambitions with outright lies."
But Americans have always lived "fantasies and fictions," always saw the world through rose colored glasses. Most of the population is gullible, naive and provincial, susceptible to any snake-oil huckster that comes to town. We are manipulated by corporations and venal, oily politicians, not to mention believing anything said on TV as the truth. We are addicted to fast food, shopping and gadgets. American Exceptionalism was always bogus, and now it is turning toxic as we wallow in its stagnant, foul bathwater.
The lineup at the last "debate" was a shocking reminder of the Republicans and its base's power over so much of the country, a country where so many believe lies spewed from parasites via a TV screen.
We are still a country of naive adolescents, afraid to face the truth and finally grow up. How else can you describe the interest generated by the current "debates" sideshow and the media frenzy surrounding it? Fast food bread and broadcast circuses for a clueless, uneducated and in-denial population, oblivious to its manipulation by a shadow government of oligarchs and corporations is what this all is.
But Americans have always lived "fantasies and fictions," always saw the world through rose colored glasses. Most of the population is gullible, naive and provincial, susceptible to any snake-oil huckster that comes to town. We are manipulated by corporations and venal, oily politicians, not to mention believing anything said on TV as the truth. We are addicted to fast food, shopping and gadgets. American Exceptionalism was always bogus, and now it is turning toxic as we wallow in its stagnant, foul bathwater.
The lineup at the last "debate" was a shocking reminder of the Republicans and its base's power over so much of the country, a country where so many believe lies spewed from parasites via a TV screen.
We are still a country of naive adolescents, afraid to face the truth and finally grow up. How else can you describe the interest generated by the current "debates" sideshow and the media frenzy surrounding it? Fast food bread and broadcast circuses for a clueless, uneducated and in-denial population, oblivious to its manipulation by a shadow government of oligarchs and corporations is what this all is.
17
I doubt any if these "candidates" (and I use that term as loosely as it is humanly possible to use it) would be taken seriously in a mayoral election in a small city (excepting John Kasich). I think the time has come to honestly admit that some portion of the country has been licking lead paint, and now, its simply too late to do anything about it. The country is at such odds I cannot envision a scenario where we meet on some plausible middle ground. Where is the compromise between psychosis and reasoned thought? If someone made up this story, we'd dismiss it as too far fetched to even be funny. And it's not funny. Because I can't imagine living in a country with a President Trump, Fiorina, Jindal, et al.
20
Is the the same John Kasich, the failed bankster, who headed investment banking at Lehman Bros from 2001 to 2008 when they went belly up?
3
The GOP cannot deny climate change because the big oil companies knew about the effects of fossil fuel emissions in the atmosphere would lead to global warming back in 1977. After WWII Eisenhower raised taxes on the rich to 95% and that got the economy booming. This economy will never get moving until income inequality is leveled out through the wealthy paying their fair share in taxes.
What was more frightening than the Wednesday GOP debate was the town hall meeting that Donald Trump had afterwards. Birth certificate, Obama being a Muslim and not being able to graze cattle on federal lands for free were just some of the topics that cropped up.
What was more frightening than the Wednesday GOP debate was the town hall meeting that Donald Trump had afterwards. Birth certificate, Obama being a Muslim and not being able to graze cattle on federal lands for free were just some of the topics that cropped up.
10
The issue of global warming was badly questioned. And poor answers unchallenged with the authority of the science. There is not a single earth science institution in the world that supports the Republican position. Yet they can hold it with impunity. The worst kind of denial and misdirection were expressed to the audience. And the questioner promptly dropped the question that is of huge importance to the nation and the world.
We have fires from Alaska to Argentina, loss of snow pack, and water shortages. In my county alone we are losing wells at a rate of one a day. Hundreds of homes have burned down. The watersheds are turning to ash. As valley farmers endlessly drill deeper for water, pumping water at the highest rate in our state's history. And like a driver with a broken gas gauge driving through the desert; farmers have no idea how much water there is in the aquifers much less it's quality. As the valley floor drops an inch a month in many places. And many cities and towns relying on aquifer water and pretend all is well. And that is from our corner of the world, in many places it's much worse.
The debaters deny what is getting worse every year like a spreading disease. The only way they can avoid what is happening is that the fossil fuels industry buys the media to void the natural connections the public would make with the terrible reality that is unfolding in the world. None belong in office they lack the integrity to insist on the truth.
18
Nature is the great equalizer. I stand dumbfounded by pols, from both sides, with a few exceptions, who simply will not, who refuse to mention the words "climate change".
Well, nature will win out. Climate change will kill us. And it's happening faster than even Al Gore said it would.
These Republican candidates have hit an all-time low.
Well, nature will win out. Climate change will kill us. And it's happening faster than even Al Gore said it would.
These Republican candidates have hit an all-time low.
16
As an academic, Dr K should know the difference between correlation and causation, re: taxes and the near term GDP growth.
1
It's probabably why he wrote "associated with," rather than "caused by."
4
Mr. Krugman, how can you expect anyone to read an essay that starts out with a lie. The person currently leading the Republican polls has called for a tax INCREASE on those who aren't paying their share. NYT has sunken to a new low.
4
It's a minimal tax increase the T is proposing. Plus, tax CUTS are the go-to position of the vast, vast majority of Rs, in government and out, as an answer to every perceived economic challenge.
How can you expect anyone to believe a comment that denies the PARTY position on taxes?
How can you expect anyone to believe a comment that denies the PARTY position on taxes?
2
I take some solace in the fact that the election is a little over a year away.
I hope that the media will take the advice and follow the example of Mr. Krugman and start telling the truth, and point out the outright lies all the candidates tell.
A good deal will happen in the next 13 months and the truth telling should begin NOW!
I hope that the media will take the advice and follow the example of Mr. Krugman and start telling the truth, and point out the outright lies all the candidates tell.
A good deal will happen in the next 13 months and the truth telling should begin NOW!
10
Contrast Paul Krugman's essay today with (conservative) Josh Barro's. Barro manages to concede that some past claims of conservative economists about the miracles of tax cuts haven't quite lived up to the promise — http://nyti.ms/1UPdEVI
6
Someone commented that the Times is out to destroy the Republican brand. The Republican party doesn't need the Times to do that. As evidenced in Wednesday's debate, the party has no trouble doing it itself to itself.
22
From what I can tell since the Reagan era is that there's an 800# that GOP politicians and their media propagandists call each morning to get the "Ten Lies of the Day" so that they're all in synch. What's really sad is that because of greed and love of mammon, apparently even the tens of thousands of Ivy grads on Wall Street, in DC, and around the nation who know better, don't have the intellectual integrity and decency of character to stand up to the lies, anti-science ignorance, bigotry, and war-mongering.
14
Thank you for a column based on what people are actually proposing and an analyses of the reality and/or consequences of such proposals. Much appreciated! (Somebody at the NYT please point this column out to Frank Bruni. All we got from poor old Frank yesterday was an admission of his inchoate nausea.)
6
And Scott Walker, when challenged by Trump dismissing Wisconsin's 2 billion dollar budget deficit as a Democratic talking point. So that makes it untrue?
8
"Or is she deliberately spreading a lie?"
yes she is deliberately spreading a lie
her delusion is that that is just peachy
yes she is deliberately spreading a lie
her delusion is that that is just peachy
13
Don't understand all the Fiorina worship by the media. No substance to her comments. It was all aggression and accusation. She is a better educated and literate Donald.
18
And the beat goes on, more Republican trickle down voodoo economics, blame the immigrants for jobs losses caused by corporate off shoring and advanced mechanized labor...and Wall Street profiteering at middle America's expense. Meanwhile Europe seems about to explode with real immigration issues, and a meltdown in China's faked up economy, which is tied to ours, makes it look like trouble ahead, trouble behind, and the only real candidate with solutions just crossed my mind, Bernie Sanders.
14
Excellent column, as usual, Dr. Krugman, we all know, (people that read the NYT), full well, the miserable state of affairs of political discourse in America.
Solutions please?
Solutions please?
8
It's ironic that the NYT moderators would choose this plea for solutions when the NYT holds the key to the solution: report that the political right is nothing but a bunch of calculated lies perpetrated by liars for the plutocrats and social conservatives.
1
The corporate media's complicity with the Republicans' bald-faced lying is merely a result of how that media (and ITS stable of politicians) get funded.
Why would CNN or Fox or any of them do any actual fact-checking of politicians' assertions if to do so guarantees a loss of massive ad revenue down the line? It is a financial conflict of interest, pure and simple.
We should stop calling these trot-outs "debates" because that is a misuse of the word. These so-called debates are charades, parades of candidate beauty queens in the "talent" portion of their pageant, or of candidates trying for homecoming queen/king; this was not a slate of serious political candidates capable of steering the most powerful nation on earth.
When a politician's positions are outsourced to focus group unanimity and are completely unrelated to truth and reality, we get what we saw on Wednesday night. Complete and utter tripe. But it appears that tripe is what sells these days, and far be it from mercenary media to stand in its way.
All of the above accounts for why Bernie Sanders is still not considered to be a "real" candidate by the media--he is the stuff of their nightmares, financially speaking.
When media has no use for truth, all we will get from them are the circuses they're giving us. If we can't reverse from this new reality, our democracy does not have a chance, and for this we will pay a heavy price indeed.
Why would CNN or Fox or any of them do any actual fact-checking of politicians' assertions if to do so guarantees a loss of massive ad revenue down the line? It is a financial conflict of interest, pure and simple.
We should stop calling these trot-outs "debates" because that is a misuse of the word. These so-called debates are charades, parades of candidate beauty queens in the "talent" portion of their pageant, or of candidates trying for homecoming queen/king; this was not a slate of serious political candidates capable of steering the most powerful nation on earth.
When a politician's positions are outsourced to focus group unanimity and are completely unrelated to truth and reality, we get what we saw on Wednesday night. Complete and utter tripe. But it appears that tripe is what sells these days, and far be it from mercenary media to stand in its way.
All of the above accounts for why Bernie Sanders is still not considered to be a "real" candidate by the media--he is the stuff of their nightmares, financially speaking.
When media has no use for truth, all we will get from them are the circuses they're giving us. If we can't reverse from this new reality, our democracy does not have a chance, and for this we will pay a heavy price indeed.
15
Tax cuts for the exceedingly rich have worked exceptionally well. The statistics confirm concentration of both income and wealth in the top 1 percent above any forecast published at the time of the legislation passing in 2001. No seer forecast so many gold coins being stacked up in one tiny corner of the temple.
Meanwhile, the Times published yesterday that median family income is today 7.5 percent lower than it was at years ago. One more good go and we'll truly have them pining for a restoration of feudalism by wealth.
Probably no campaign contributions in history have paid off dollar-for-dollar so spectacularly as contributions to George W. Bush's 2000 campaign. Undoubtedly that success will lead to many repeats as the red-in-claw circle the next hapless woolly mammoth.
Meanwhile, the Times published yesterday that median family income is today 7.5 percent lower than it was at years ago. One more good go and we'll truly have them pining for a restoration of feudalism by wealth.
Probably no campaign contributions in history have paid off dollar-for-dollar so spectacularly as contributions to George W. Bush's 2000 campaign. Undoubtedly that success will lead to many repeats as the red-in-claw circle the next hapless woolly mammoth.
21
Those tax cuts are paying for this very peep show. Those blessed by the corporation with high income are expected to "give back" some of the largesse to keep the scam going.
3
Perhaps Mr. Krugman should read the opinion piece of another Times Opinion Writer, - David Brooks who while somewhat disenamoured over the Republican Debate picked Marco Rubio as the shining light. "America is not a Planet, we need to do NOTHING about Climate Change". Mr Brooks also failed to mention that Mr. Rubio is now, and for a long time been owned by a Florida Real Estate Developer. He made sure that Mr. Rubio got a $65K job teaching at a College in Florida, - when Mr. Rubio was found to be using Campaign Election Funds for personal travel, the Developer made sure that the Traveling Expenses were paid back. He hired Mr. Rubios Wife and put her in charge of a Foundation he had funded even though she had never held any Job!
Rubio, once a moderate on Immigration is now the guy wanting to Line up the Trains and Trucks, build a Trump type Wall and Deport 11+ Million people back to Mexico. The only Republican I saw on the debates who actually offered a moderate approach to Governing our Nation was John Kasich, - Governor of Ohio. Of course he doesn't stand a chance of being nominated as his views would never meet the Litmus Test of the TEA PARTY TYPES who preach Greed and Fear and only are in Office to protect the Elitists and threaten Government Shutdowns to get their way!
The Debate was a Circus with only one making a case for himself and our Nation!
Rubio, once a moderate on Immigration is now the guy wanting to Line up the Trains and Trucks, build a Trump type Wall and Deport 11+ Million people back to Mexico. The only Republican I saw on the debates who actually offered a moderate approach to Governing our Nation was John Kasich, - Governor of Ohio. Of course he doesn't stand a chance of being nominated as his views would never meet the Litmus Test of the TEA PARTY TYPES who preach Greed and Fear and only are in Office to protect the Elitists and threaten Government Shutdowns to get their way!
The Debate was a Circus with only one making a case for himself and our Nation!
6
Is this John Kasich the failed bankster, who headed investment banking for Lehman Bros from 2001 to 1008 when they went belly up?
2
Speaking of Abe Lincoln, the current political climate verifies his assertion that "you can fool some of the people all the time." Given the manner in which so many people lap up the lies propounded by this clown car of candidates, it becomes increasingly apparent that the "wisdom of the electorate" is an oxymoron.
6
Abe amended. You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, and that should get you through quite comfortably.
1
What? Say it isn't so. You don't like the "A team?"
1
The Clown Car disgorged and they had another episode of the #GOP_MORONATHON !
The funniest part was watching the people, who should know better, declare it a "serious" event.
SNL should be so lucky mining current events for serious tragi-comic humor.
The funniest part was watching the people, who should know better, declare it a "serious" event.
SNL should be so lucky mining current events for serious tragi-comic humor.
9
How do you think US government tax loopholes, tax exemptions, tax exempt foundations, environmental damage liability limits, free trade agreements, most favored nation designations, pharmaceutical liability limits, product liability limits, tax exemption loopholes, agricultural subsidies, PAY TO PLAY Solyndra type government money loan guarantees, PAY TO PLAY CGI Federal government ACA no-bid contracts paying many times as much as other firms would charge for the same product, TOP SECRET Hughes Aircraft Missile Guidance Military Technology export to Communist China (Chinagate), presidential pardons for federally convicted felons, other “Pay to Play” contracts and other laws benefiting only a few people (or a few foreign nations) were created by our elected US Congress and US Senate, and then enforced by our elected presidents and their appointed bureaucrat administrators?
1
Do you think people who can't grasp basic climate science get any of that technological whizbang stuff?
1
Don't knock the wall. Just think what a trillion dollars worth of stimulus could do for the economy. Add in the hundred thousand guards you'd have to hire to patrol it an its the best plan for economic recovery the Republicans have had in decades...
1
Mr Krugman, Thank you for naming, in print, lies as just that - "lies." Such honest descriptions, when dealing with the GOP circus and parade of clowns and court fools, are far too rare in the mainstream media including, sadly, the NYT.
7
Three drones for every Krugman or Bruni, eh?
Getting off a good one-liner (or several) during a debate does not necessarily a great president make.
9
The actor Reagan practiced this skill in front of a mirror like Michael Jackson did his moonwalk.
5
Really? It is ok to say anything in the Primaries? Isn't lying - lying? Hilary lied about Benghazi and her phones??? Benghazi was an accident that no one saw coming and who cares about her phones. I care about idiots that believe in a mythical wall and economics that don't work. Who discount all scientific evidence about climate change and vaccination and continue to think they should have any say in women's choice. Even Ronald Reagan would be upset by this bunch! I must have missed the Mother Teresa comment, but I think JEB wanted Margaret Thatcher. How would these "guys" feel about putting foreign men on our money? And yes I know Carly is a woman - or is she? I would have to see the blood test.
3
How rich. Krugman dissing Florin for HP. How about Mr. Krugman and Enron. Mr. Krugman thinks raising taxes makes the economy grow, really? If you tax everyone 100% there is no money in the economy. If you tax everyone 0% the economy is fully funded. Oh I guess logic is not not operative.
As for Planned Parenthood and abortion. Abortion kills babies, do you really question this? The reason Abortion is legal is that a selfish, person has the power to take the life of an innocent.
I think we should call Krugman the human smoke screen, lots of accusations and not much clarity.
As for Planned Parenthood and abortion. Abortion kills babies, do you really question this? The reason Abortion is legal is that a selfish, person has the power to take the life of an innocent.
I think we should call Krugman the human smoke screen, lots of accusations and not much clarity.
1
Likewise if you allow one person to have 100% of the money there is no demand left in the economy.
Legality has little to do with real abortion rates. The highest abortion rates in the world are in Latin America where it is largely illegal. The lowest abortion rate in the world is the Netherlands where it is largely legal and largely free. The reason abortion rates are so low in the Netherlands is they have fewer unplaned pregnancies. The reason for that is they have strong sexual education and distribution of contraceptions. Planned Parenthood is mostly about sex education and avoiding unwanted pregnancies altogether first i.e. it is a primary agency for reducing the number of abortions. If its abortion you loathe you've chosen the wrong target. Get rid of Planned Parenthood and watch the abortion rate in this country go through the roof.
Given this it is quite obvious that Republicans and anti-choice advocates are just using abortion as a political tool to try to manipulate socially conservative voters. And once again the weakest person, the poor young women will be forced to take the brunt of GOP favored policies, that is, to be forced to have her rapists babies and the GOP will have, in the mean time cut all aid to help her upon having given birth. What follows after that gets only worse.
Whether its the economy or abortion, clearly you haven't thought things through.
Legality has little to do with real abortion rates. The highest abortion rates in the world are in Latin America where it is largely illegal. The lowest abortion rate in the world is the Netherlands where it is largely legal and largely free. The reason abortion rates are so low in the Netherlands is they have fewer unplaned pregnancies. The reason for that is they have strong sexual education and distribution of contraceptions. Planned Parenthood is mostly about sex education and avoiding unwanted pregnancies altogether first i.e. it is a primary agency for reducing the number of abortions. If its abortion you loathe you've chosen the wrong target. Get rid of Planned Parenthood and watch the abortion rate in this country go through the roof.
Given this it is quite obvious that Republicans and anti-choice advocates are just using abortion as a political tool to try to manipulate socially conservative voters. And once again the weakest person, the poor young women will be forced to take the brunt of GOP favored policies, that is, to be forced to have her rapists babies and the GOP will have, in the mean time cut all aid to help her upon having given birth. What follows after that gets only worse.
Whether its the economy or abortion, clearly you haven't thought things through.
4
"If you tax everyone 100% there is no money in the economy." - Straw man alert, no one is contemplating taxing everyone 100%
If you tax everyone 0% the economy is fully funded." - So, how do you propose to pay for the armed forces to fight all the wars the republicans want to fight? or build the 2k mile double wall?
"Abortion kills babies, do you really question this?" - You are absolutely incorrect, abortion does not kill babies. As a civilization, we do not act as if life begins at conception, but at birth. So, believe what you want, but don't impose it on the rest of us for no reason.
If you tax everyone 0% the economy is fully funded." - So, how do you propose to pay for the armed forces to fight all the wars the republicans want to fight? or build the 2k mile double wall?
"Abortion kills babies, do you really question this?" - You are absolutely incorrect, abortion does not kill babies. As a civilization, we do not act as if life begins at conception, but at birth. So, believe what you want, but don't impose it on the rest of us for no reason.
2
Gee, I didn't know Paul Krugman was CEO of Enron. Live and learn.
3
"Think about it. Bill Clinton’s tax hike was followed by a huge economic boom,"
...called the Internet bubble
"the George W. Bush tax cuts by a weak recovery that ended in financial collapse."
...called the debt crisis
"The tax increase of 2013 and the coming of Obamacare in 2014 were associated with the best job growth since the 1990s."
...with no causative relationship and you know it.
...called the Internet bubble
"the George W. Bush tax cuts by a weak recovery that ended in financial collapse."
...called the debt crisis
"The tax increase of 2013 and the coming of Obamacare in 2014 were associated with the best job growth since the 1990s."
...with no causative relationship and you know it.
3
Only low-info people cal it the debt crisis. It was the housing bubble.
PS The public debt as a percentage of GDP was 47% higher in 1946, and that was followed by 27 years of Great Prosperity.
PS The public debt as a percentage of GDP was 47% higher in 1946, and that was followed by 27 years of Great Prosperity.
2
Look at the productivity stats on FRED. The tech revolution during Clinton's term did a lot more for the economy than trigger a Wall Street feeding frenzy by speculators.
And if higher taxes hobble the economy, then Obamacare and effective rate increases are certainly relevant. You can deny they caused the recovery, but you can't argue they destroyed it.
And if higher taxes hobble the economy, then Obamacare and effective rate increases are certainly relevant. You can deny they caused the recovery, but you can't argue they destroyed it.
1
The only thing missing from the Republican Debate was a cream pie!
7
If it were a pillow fight they'd all put horseshoes in their pillows and then we could watch the next round of clowns aspiring to the presidency do the same.
1
I think you mean: "from mailman to nobel prize winner"
3
I appreciate Dr. Krugman's reporting of Republicans' lies, especially since the NYTimes has apparently decided to only cover the Republican race in this election today. I'm happy to report that the Washington Post did decide to publish a story about Senator Bernie Sanders receiving more than one million dollars in small donations as a response to smears by a superpac supporting Hillary Clinton (see http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2015/09/17/sanders-s... ).
3
This from a supporter of the woman that well be the biggest liar, fantasy filled politician of our era. Get real Paul!
How could it be otherwise with people who distrust science.
4
Lies and the lying liars. That's the GOP credo and it was on full display during the debate just as it's on full display 24/7 anytime a Republican opens his or her mouth to speak.
2
Well, Dr. Krugman, YOU are telling the people, but the people aren't listening, given our fact-free, fantasy-filled opiate called "the media." This campaign is being covered as a mutant, moderator-baited bullfight (yup, I'm talking about you, Jake Tapper and Dana Bash) rather than as a substantive debate about pressing issues, which are legion.
Since July, beyond his mild disapproval of the carried interest break for billionaires, The Donald has declared not a single serious utterance about policy, unless we accept empty superlatives and ad hominems like "huge," "unbelievable," "incredible," "nice person," "loser," "gutless" and "head spinning" as serious policy discourse. Meanwhile, voters haven't an inkling of the oft-expressed policy positions of Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders because they aren't considered newsworthy.
The rest of the sorry GOP debating team simply succumbs to serial lying while the "debaters" and their attack dogs routinely call Hillary a liar. These are sorry, depressing days for democracy. Our ostensibly independent media carries much of the responsibility.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
Since July, beyond his mild disapproval of the carried interest break for billionaires, The Donald has declared not a single serious utterance about policy, unless we accept empty superlatives and ad hominems like "huge," "unbelievable," "incredible," "nice person," "loser," "gutless" and "head spinning" as serious policy discourse. Meanwhile, voters haven't an inkling of the oft-expressed policy positions of Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders because they aren't considered newsworthy.
The rest of the sorry GOP debating team simply succumbs to serial lying while the "debaters" and their attack dogs routinely call Hillary a liar. These are sorry, depressing days for democracy. Our ostensibly independent media carries much of the responsibility.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
8
It would be nice if the front page reporters also were fact checking the lies of candidates. If they don't call out the lies of candidates, are they even trying to do their job?
5
The greatest fiction: "My brother kept us safe".
7
I turned off the "Jerry Springer Show" the second time the moderator said "candidate X said this about you, would you like to respond?"
128
The candidate who unnerved me was Carly Fiorina
She who wants to be the next War President.
Her "schtick" is to demonstrate her ability to be one of the boys.
Note what she said at the debate.
“What I would do, immediately, is begin rebuilding the Sixth Fleet, I would begin rebuilding the missile defense program in Poland, I would conduct regular, aggressive military exercises in the Baltic States. I’d probably send a few thousand more troops into Germany. Vladimir Putin would get the message.”
She has more than just illusions of grandeur.
She is power hungary and dangerously so.
She is very good at flexing her muscles.
She wants to go toe to toe with Putin. (She will lose.)
She would be very good at trampling on the rights of other nations.
She has a large corporate-rejection chip on her shoulder.
She has never held a political office.
She is an atomic bomb waiting to explode.
This menace has to disappear from the political stage and the sooner the better.
She who wants to be the next War President.
Her "schtick" is to demonstrate her ability to be one of the boys.
Note what she said at the debate.
“What I would do, immediately, is begin rebuilding the Sixth Fleet, I would begin rebuilding the missile defense program in Poland, I would conduct regular, aggressive military exercises in the Baltic States. I’d probably send a few thousand more troops into Germany. Vladimir Putin would get the message.”
She has more than just illusions of grandeur.
She is power hungary and dangerously so.
She is very good at flexing her muscles.
She wants to go toe to toe with Putin. (She will lose.)
She would be very good at trampling on the rights of other nations.
She has a large corporate-rejection chip on her shoulder.
She has never held a political office.
She is an atomic bomb waiting to explode.
This menace has to disappear from the political stage and the sooner the better.
303
Did she serve at military school with the Trump?
2
Thank you very much for writing this piece: it is clear and succinct and very much needed. Some of the GOP candidates are approaching delusional, and you have called that out very neatly, but clearly. Would be interesting to hear what a leading psychologist might say about personality disorders among the candidates. Thanks again for your important piece - especially pointing out past actions which ignored telltales signs of trouble.
3
Paul, this is the 21st century. A while back somebody invented something called the internet. There are a million different sources for information beyond the front page of the NYT. There is no single authoritative news site. There are no end of places to find out who lied where and when. Go sit on the porch and let the sun warm those creaky bones, old man.
1
US public schools fail utterly to teach students how to distinguish fact from fantasy. And that is a real shame, because you enjoy fantasy much more when you know that is what it is.
1
The "people", unfortunately, are the crux of the problem. Oddly enough, the evidence suggests that the average Republican-leaning voter in the US is less informed about - well, everything, than the average person in pretty much every other country in the world. Otherwise, how do you explain the modern GOP?
5
One of the main reasons I still get a fair sense of rationality from the NY Times is the voice of Paul Krugman. Even he has to squirm somewhat at having to live with the uncomfortable omissions in this venerable venue that once claimed coverage of "all the news that's fit to print."
5
The NYT has done a poor job of exposing lies. Like most media they seem obsessed with personality, gotcha moments and sensationalism. They seem almost afraid to call a lie for what it is.
8
But it was at least more enlightening than the Democrats debate with Mrs. Clinton.
Another example of how the ratings race to the bottom - Fox v. CNN - has caused CNN to completely self-destruct. Never thought I'd say it but the Fox moderators, Megyn Kelly in particular, were far better at controlling the Republican "candidates" than the CNN folks. Fiorina's fever dreams about Rosemary's Baby type attacks on smiling newborns would not have been allowed to stand on Fox (or on CNN 20 years ago).
1
Why did the US government create the legislation that caused the relocation of our US industries that previously gave jobs to US citizens to foreign nations?
Those manufacturing jobs allowed US workers to earn wealth so that they could support their families!
US workers need those jobs that the last three US Presidents off-shored when they signed those FREE TRADE AGREEMENT laws and also granted "Permanent Normal Trade Relation" Status to China, plus other similar laws that economically required US businesses to relocate the higher paying US jobs to foreign nations or go bankrupt!
Republicans and Democrats created these laws!
Those manufacturing jobs allowed US workers to earn wealth so that they could support their families!
US workers need those jobs that the last three US Presidents off-shored when they signed those FREE TRADE AGREEMENT laws and also granted "Permanent Normal Trade Relation" Status to China, plus other similar laws that economically required US businesses to relocate the higher paying US jobs to foreign nations or go bankrupt!
Republicans and Democrats created these laws!
3
The 16(?) candidates who came piling out of the Republican Clown Car this year present a mosaic reflection of the vast demographic they pander to and who support them. Alas, at the end of the day we will get the kind of government, and idiots, that We the People so richly deserve.
1
I hope they have gone too far for a majority of those that will vote. I've been appalled since Bush v. Gore. Republicans don't do reality at all!
2
Perhaps the best option from this unbelievable, bizarre happenings would be a Trump/Paul ticket for the GOP. At least, that's my take on it. As my die-hard Republican colleague succinctly put it - she was totally ashamed to be a Republican!
The people on the stage didn't just wake up one day and choose to run for office.
They did, however, have long, secret meetings with dark-money donors who have bribed them into running and who will be calling all the shots once he/she is elected.
I would hope that in the future whenever a candidate's name appears in print that their overlord's name is put in parentheses next to it.
You can skip this with Trump and Sanders.
They did, however, have long, secret meetings with dark-money donors who have bribed them into running and who will be calling all the shots once he/she is elected.
I would hope that in the future whenever a candidate's name appears in print that their overlord's name is put in parentheses next to it.
You can skip this with Trump and Sanders.
5
The American Revolutionaries who signed the Declaration of Independence on July 4, 1776 and then created this great nation were political activists committing criminal acts of high treason.
These men committed their fortunes and their lives to the creation of the USA. They would have all been hanged by the English Government if the American Revolution military forces had failed.
Today, politicians are only in the game for their own personal financial gain with bribes and cash in paper sacks for their congressional votes and no-bid contracts from the Public Treasury awarded to their political campaign contributors!
Only those politicians that accept sufficient campaign contributions in return for political favors and no-bid contract awards can collect enough campaign money can get themselves elected to public office.
Maybe Donald Trump is the sole person seeking the Republican Party nomination for the office of POTUS that has not taken donations from people in exchange for new legislation or some new PAY TO PLAY government contract!
And maybe Bernie Sanders for the Democrats!
These men committed their fortunes and their lives to the creation of the USA. They would have all been hanged by the English Government if the American Revolution military forces had failed.
Today, politicians are only in the game for their own personal financial gain with bribes and cash in paper sacks for their congressional votes and no-bid contracts from the Public Treasury awarded to their political campaign contributors!
Only those politicians that accept sufficient campaign contributions in return for political favors and no-bid contract awards can collect enough campaign money can get themselves elected to public office.
Maybe Donald Trump is the sole person seeking the Republican Party nomination for the office of POTUS that has not taken donations from people in exchange for new legislation or some new PAY TO PLAY government contract!
And maybe Bernie Sanders for the Democrats!
2
Dear Paul,
This is a brilliant analysis of that debate and those candidates; I am so sorry that this is what our politics have come to-- Reagan, whom they idolize, couldn't be a candidate for today's Republicans if his name were changed and he had to run on his actual real-world record (raising taxes, making compromises, granting amnesty, commending the need for a "safety net"). Thanks for your astute observations once again.
This is a brilliant analysis of that debate and those candidates; I am so sorry that this is what our politics have come to-- Reagan, whom they idolize, couldn't be a candidate for today's Republicans if his name were changed and he had to run on his actual real-world record (raising taxes, making compromises, granting amnesty, commending the need for a "safety net"). Thanks for your astute observations once again.
5
"But who will tell the people?"
It won't be Fox News and that is where the GOP constituency gets most of its "facts." These details are embellished by the likes of WND and Breitbart. Candidates who stray far from the Fox narratives are then "corrected" by thousands of voices in the right-wing blogosphere. It is self-reinforcing lunacy ... and it is very scary.
It won't be Fox News and that is where the GOP constituency gets most of its "facts." These details are embellished by the likes of WND and Breitbart. Candidates who stray far from the Fox narratives are then "corrected" by thousands of voices in the right-wing blogosphere. It is self-reinforcing lunacy ... and it is very scary.
3
Not all of us are stupid all of the time, but a pandemic of stupidity does seem to have swept the nation and the word. The "fair & balanced" policies of the news media has enabled the spread of this disease.
Trump has it half-right when he blames our problems on stupid leadership, but the other half of the problem is that voters seem to have elected those people to office.
Trump has it half-right when he blames our problems on stupid leadership, but the other half of the problem is that voters seem to have elected those people to office.
3
The best line of the night was from Jeb Bush about how his brother protected America while he was president - funny, but didn't 3,000 people get killed on 9/11?
10
There is no other nation in the world in which the leading presidential candidates publically and proudly make no distinction between their own country and other foreign entity.
Usually the people who want to be the presidents explain publically what they are going to do for their homeland.
Only in America the presidential candidates have very detailed plan what they are going to do for Israel and how many foreign wars they are willing to wage on behalf of the foreign country.
The worst part is that our free press has no problem with such a practice that has been conventional wisdom for at least a quarter of century…
No wonder that we are involved in waging the endless foreign wars, that we have the defense budget equal to the combined military spending of all other nations and that our national debt is $18 trillion and counting…
Instead of endlessly fighting the entire Arab and the Muslim world it would be much faster and cheaper to get Israel to honor the UN Charter, the right of refugees to return to their homes, the fundamental human right to the regain their private property or finally withdraw from the occupied territories.
It’s hard to imagine how Washington D.C. would react if Iran were guilty of any of those illegalities…
Usually the people who want to be the presidents explain publically what they are going to do for their homeland.
Only in America the presidential candidates have very detailed plan what they are going to do for Israel and how many foreign wars they are willing to wage on behalf of the foreign country.
The worst part is that our free press has no problem with such a practice that has been conventional wisdom for at least a quarter of century…
No wonder that we are involved in waging the endless foreign wars, that we have the defense budget equal to the combined military spending of all other nations and that our national debt is $18 trillion and counting…
Instead of endlessly fighting the entire Arab and the Muslim world it would be much faster and cheaper to get Israel to honor the UN Charter, the right of refugees to return to their homes, the fundamental human right to the regain their private property or finally withdraw from the occupied territories.
It’s hard to imagine how Washington D.C. would react if Iran were guilty of any of those illegalities…
2
You will learn more about life by watching "professional wrestling" than you will watching a G.O.P. "debate."
And magical realist novels like "100 Years of Solitude" have been popular because so many people are unable to separate "magic" from "reality."
In a political context though, the U.S. debates between the members of both parties is more like Salman Rushdie's second or third novel "Shame" (before the next one "The Satanic Verses" altered his life forever).
And magical realist novels like "100 Years of Solitude" have been popular because so many people are unable to separate "magic" from "reality."
In a political context though, the U.S. debates between the members of both parties is more like Salman Rushdie's second or third novel "Shame" (before the next one "The Satanic Verses" altered his life forever).
1
The media (plural noun) are like judges at a figure skating competition where the majority of athletes are oozing dope and a few are clean.
The judges know perfectly well who did what but they pretend to be fair and neutral by evaluating everyone just by the "performance."
The judges know perfectly well who did what but they pretend to be fair and neutral by evaluating everyone just by the "performance."
3
The vast majority of Donald Trump supporters don't care that he's a total sleazebag, they prefer him that way.
When he drops out of the race, where are they going to go? My bet is Ted Cruz.
When he drops out of the race, where are they going to go? My bet is Ted Cruz.
2
I'm glad the Republicans had a female candidate on the stage, and I am glad they had an African-American candidate. Now in the interest of diversity, they should try a sane candidate.
10
The people may not need to be told that a politician says stupid things. They can see for themselves.
1
You could point the Hubble Space Telescope at a Republican debate and still it would be unable to detect any sign of intelligent life.
5
Republican politicians will continue to urge low taxes for the rich and American military interventions because of a 100% allegiance to their corporate sponsors which includes those in The-Military-Industrial-Complex.
5
We are still dealing with effects. All of the mendacity, and manipulation of statistics to prove that the mendacity is true are age old tools of the retrogressive forces who are in control and want to maintain control, not jut of the U.S. but of the Planet, which they see as their Private Property. They have been using these tools forever.
As long as we allow the basic lies concerning the nature of reality to go unchallenged this will continue. This system is not broken. It works perfectly for those who wish to maintain this obviously, as you so well point out, Paul, insane course. This system does not need to be fixed. It needs to be totally replaced with systems that understand the basic facts of Cosmic Physics. We live in a multidimensional Universe that functions on the basic laws of physics. Nothing including individual human beings stands as a separated self made independent. Everything is connected and dependent on other aspects of the whole. Notions like competition, private ownership, of property, superiority, "job providers" are simply aspects of ignorance, that is a lack of understanding of how Cosmos works.
As long as we allow the basic lies concerning the nature of reality to go unchallenged this will continue. This system is not broken. It works perfectly for those who wish to maintain this obviously, as you so well point out, Paul, insane course. This system does not need to be fixed. It needs to be totally replaced with systems that understand the basic facts of Cosmic Physics. We live in a multidimensional Universe that functions on the basic laws of physics. Nothing including individual human beings stands as a separated self made independent. Everything is connected and dependent on other aspects of the whole. Notions like competition, private ownership, of property, superiority, "job providers" are simply aspects of ignorance, that is a lack of understanding of how Cosmos works.
1
Who will tell the people?
Senator Bernie Sanders.
Senator Bernie Sanders.
4
After watching the spectacle/rasslin' match dubbed as a "debate" broadcast from the hangar-like mezzanine of the Reagan Presidential Library/Jetport by CNN, an atrocious presentation sinking to new lows of any sense of journalistic integrity, I can clearly see why Hillary was yucking and yacking it up with Jimmy Fallon later that night.
Once Hillary stops lovable but eventually losing Bernie's campaign with her Southern strategy firewall, she'll be cruising all the way to the convention and the election. Unless the GOP can pull some new/old Romney(?) Rabbit out of their hat, they're all competing right now to be the one who will lose to Hillary.
As for the nonsense spouting from those out to get Hillary, with a constant barrage of "scandals" none of which amount to a hill of beans in this crazy world, well, looking over the present line-up of Republicans vying to go toe to toe with Hillary, I see Hillary, even she were indicted, convicted, and serving time in the gray-bar hotel, still beating her Republican opponent handily.
DD
Manhattan
Once Hillary stops lovable but eventually losing Bernie's campaign with her Southern strategy firewall, she'll be cruising all the way to the convention and the election. Unless the GOP can pull some new/old Romney(?) Rabbit out of their hat, they're all competing right now to be the one who will lose to Hillary.
As for the nonsense spouting from those out to get Hillary, with a constant barrage of "scandals" none of which amount to a hill of beans in this crazy world, well, looking over the present line-up of Republicans vying to go toe to toe with Hillary, I see Hillary, even she were indicted, convicted, and serving time in the gray-bar hotel, still beating her Republican opponent handily.
DD
Manhattan
2
This just in: Mr. Bush will henceforth be referred to as "D'oh!" I'm sure you will articulate this new moniker with the appropriate vocal intonation.
2
Secretary is not a menial job. It just pays like one.
1
Got that right
But, perhaps worst of all was Jeb's comment that his brother kept this country safe. According to former Secretary of State Colin Powell and former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill, discussion about 'what are we going to do about Iraq?' occurred in one of the earliest cabinet meetings of the administration. In the transition from the Clinton administration, Bush and his people were warned that their main security concern should be a terrorist attack on the United States. They did not heed that warning, and instead focused on their pet peeve. We all know the result. 9/11. Between that lie and Fiorina's lie about Planned Parenthood, that debate was pathetic and worrisome, and that's a serious understatement.
5
Krugman is comical, to suggest that high taxes lead to job growth is utter incompetence from a Nobel winner. I wonder if the Organization rethinking the Obama award is also reconsidering on Krugman.
1
Perhaps you would do well to reconsider your views of recent history. Most of the populace has figured out by now that supply side economics was a dog and pony show to keep them amused while the top layer of the economic food chain got very fat indeed. Comforting the comfortable and afflicting the afflicted; after all these years it's still the GOP's prime directive.
2
The only one being comical here is you JP. Krugman did not make that claim here at all. He simply pointed out that republican economic dogma has been proven conclusively wrong by real life experiments. That fact is unequivocally true.
Good job knocking down a straw man though.
Good job knocking down a straw man though.
2
I admire your writing, Professor Krugman, but please do not use the word voodoo unless you are referring to the religion practiced in Haiti (often in overlay with Christianity). The way you use the term as a pejorative relies on unexamined prejudice.
Thank you Paul Krugman for always speaking the truth and for being the voice of reason in a crazy world of demented Republican candidates. The phenomenon of false equivalencies seems to have taken over in the media, giving these shysters a credibility they don't deserve. Are TV talking heads afraid to call out the lies because they fear losing their jobs--or are they just intimidated by the hubris of the candidates?
When a crazed audience member asked Trump a question, while claiming that Pres. Obama wasn't a citizen of the United States and was a Muslim who was trying to kill Christians--no one, including Trump and the moderators--said a word. These candidates are disgusting and an embarrassment to America.
When a crazed audience member asked Trump a question, while claiming that Pres. Obama wasn't a citizen of the United States and was a Muslim who was trying to kill Christians--no one, including Trump and the moderators--said a word. These candidates are disgusting and an embarrassment to America.
7
Of course look crazy, but they are not. Republicans only REALLY represent the 1%. They have to drag together all the disparate crazies in this big crazy country to get to 51%. Their act is to bellow a song about abortion,while jumping up and down about guns-guns-GUNS, while twirling in a circle about immigrants, all the while blowing racist dog whistles for, well, the racists. It is quite an act. Takes real talent. Occasionally they throw some meat to one group or another, but in the end, all they are really committed to is the 1%. Thank goodness there is no swim suit competition.
3
I’m wondering if Bernie can overcome the big money against him,,,Is it too late.
The election seems to be all about who has the biggest donors; not the best ideas.
Spreading the word through Social Media and voting will be huge factors
this time around.
The election seems to be all about who has the biggest donors; not the best ideas.
Spreading the word through Social Media and voting will be huge factors
this time around.
2
While I agree with Prof. Krugman about the futility of the economic doctrine embraced by the GOP, I absolutely disagree with the dismissive, patronizing tone of the article. The New York Times very often looks like the mirror image of the Wall Street Journal. The same contempt for any opinion that is different from the one being proselytized. the same attempts to demean the opponent, the same lack of respect for fellow Americans. If you want to know what is wrong with this country, read this article, then go read anything written by Peggy Noonan, and you will have all you need to know.
2
Even handed reporting is what is killing today's newspapers and why the media in general is held in such low esteem.
1
I largely blame the press for this problem. For a long time now the press has failed to challenge such outrigt lies as we heard Wednesday night. And in the debate in particular- why did the moderators fail to challenge these lies? Were they on a script and told not to deviate?
I agree the worst of the worst was Fiorina, not only with her lies about PP, but with the saber rattling.
And Cruz? What is wrong with Texans that they inflicted this jack ___ on the rest of us? Not unlike McCain thrusting Palin down our throats.
I agree the worst of the worst was Fiorina, not only with her lies about PP, but with the saber rattling.
And Cruz? What is wrong with Texans that they inflicted this jack ___ on the rest of us? Not unlike McCain thrusting Palin down our throats.
4
Bless you, Paul Krugman, for cutting through the lies and revealing the dreadful people these politicians are.
5
Paul I'm confused when someone is "hailed as a winner in the debate." Who decides who is the winner? The blogger, the author, the observer who happen to have a column? Was their a poll to recognize who gets to be the winner at the end of the debate? I hope there is a system, something like a Facebook "LIKE" button to find out who gets to be the winner...my five cents.
"Now we have presidential candidates who make Mr. Bush look like Abe Lincoln. But who will tell the people?"
Well, it sure won't be the NYT. Here was what the NYT offered its readers as coverage of the myth-fest that was the 2nd GOP "presidential" "debate":
"Carly Fiorina Offers Republicans a Pathway to Reach Women" -- Jeremy Peters
"Candidates Use Second G.O.P. Debate to Taunt Donald Trump" -- Jonathon Martin, Patrice Healy
Under "News Analysis":
"A New Stage but a Familiar Donald Trump: The Brawler" -- Adam Nagourney
"Focus on Donald Trump at ‘Undercard’ Debate Irks Low-Polling Candidates" -- Trip Gabriel and Matt Flagenheimer
"G.O.P. Focus on World Affairs Reveals a Divide Among the Contenders" -- David Sanger
Not one of these -- NOT ONE -- made mention that every one of these clowns are unmoored from reality and contemptuous of evidence and serious analysis. Not one. It was nothing but horse race coverage, who intimidated who with serious stares. These articles were under the heading "analysis." Unbelievable.
The question is this: What does the NYT think its societal responsibility is? Seriously, what? Because the stenography, false equivalence, horserace focus act has been and has become even more nauseating as the GOP finds it completely free to live in the Rabbit Hole. They know they can just make it up as they go along, and nobody will call them on it.
Well, it sure won't be the NYT. Here was what the NYT offered its readers as coverage of the myth-fest that was the 2nd GOP "presidential" "debate":
"Carly Fiorina Offers Republicans a Pathway to Reach Women" -- Jeremy Peters
"Candidates Use Second G.O.P. Debate to Taunt Donald Trump" -- Jonathon Martin, Patrice Healy
Under "News Analysis":
"A New Stage but a Familiar Donald Trump: The Brawler" -- Adam Nagourney
"Focus on Donald Trump at ‘Undercard’ Debate Irks Low-Polling Candidates" -- Trip Gabriel and Matt Flagenheimer
"G.O.P. Focus on World Affairs Reveals a Divide Among the Contenders" -- David Sanger
Not one of these -- NOT ONE -- made mention that every one of these clowns are unmoored from reality and contemptuous of evidence and serious analysis. Not one. It was nothing but horse race coverage, who intimidated who with serious stares. These articles were under the heading "analysis." Unbelievable.
The question is this: What does the NYT think its societal responsibility is? Seriously, what? Because the stenography, false equivalence, horserace focus act has been and has become even more nauseating as the GOP finds it completely free to live in the Rabbit Hole. They know they can just make it up as they go along, and nobody will call them on it.
8
We know Republicans haven't had a discernible relationship with the truth for some time.
3
At times this most recent debate took on a surreal, SNL-like feel. I'm attributing the sensation to now having witnessed candidates so transparently phony that, before SNL could spoof them, they'd already morphed into caricatures of themselves.
2
I watched the entire debate and waited for someone in the audience to say, "You lie!"
3
Many, if not all, of the Republican myths of economic growth can be debunked by an awareness of the formula for calculating GDP. It's GDP=C+G+I+(X-M). Neither taxes nor tax cuts appear in the formula. Tax cuts might possibly raise consumption (C) or business investment (I) or exports (X), but then again maybe not. The ONLY sure, reliable, predictable way to raise the GDP is to raise government spending (G).
The question I would ask Republican presidential candidates: "Do you know the formula for calculating GDP?" I'm guessing the number able to answer the question correctly would range somewhere between zero and none.
The question I would ask Republican presidential candidates: "Do you know the formula for calculating GDP?" I'm guessing the number able to answer the question correctly would range somewhere between zero and none.
1
The fact that Trump is doing so well is a reflection of the fact that Americans are sick and tired of Obama, the worst economic recovery in history, 94 million out of the work force, and 50 million in poverty.
Meanwhile, we have Hillary - a corrupt old white woman who continues to tank. When you hear serious talk of Jerry Brown running for president - not only the bottom of the barrel, but the bottom of the mariana trench - it becomes evident just how out of touch with reality is the Democratic party.
Meanwhile, we have Hillary - a corrupt old white woman who continues to tank. When you hear serious talk of Jerry Brown running for president - not only the bottom of the barrel, but the bottom of the mariana trench - it becomes evident just how out of touch with reality is the Democratic party.
Harlod,
You mean the Jerry Brown who has overseen leading job creation and a massive budget surplus in a 40 million person state?
Since when are more jobs and budget surpluses a bad thing?
You mean the Jerry Brown who has overseen leading job creation and a massive budget surplus in a 40 million person state?
Since when are more jobs and budget surpluses a bad thing?
1
"But who will tell the people?" The people know. These candidates accurately represent their large constituencies.
1
Perhaps Mr. Krugman suffers from amnesia. Didn't Obama lie about you can keep your doctor/plan? Didn't Obama lie when he said there's no tax associated with PPACA, and then all of sudden when a tax is uncovered it becomes a "fine?" Didn't Obama lie when he said he ended the war in Iraq but really all he did was perpetuate the withdrawal initiated by Bush? You speak of tax breaks for the rich; what exactly do you call bailing out a multi-billion dollar car company? What do you call failed tax dollar investments in Solyndra?
And of course, in full disclosure (cough cough) Mr. Krugman fails to mention many of the good ideas shared by these conservatives. Why not race for cures to cancer and other deadly diseases instead of treatments like we raced to the moon? Why not allow inspections of Iran's nuclear facilities rather than trusting Iran to inspect themselves? Krugman and other liberals like to boast about their intellect. Tell what intellect negotiates with a known sponsor of terrorism, where the U.S. and the rest of the world gets nothing, and the terrorist state gets to develop nuclear technology and lifted sanctions? Oh, wait. Iran did release 5 Al Qaeda leaders back into the wild, so at least we got something from them. Hillary flew around the world, spreading liberal intellect, on our dime, and what do we have to show for it? Russia flexing muscle, radical Islam spreading out of control, millions of fleeing migrants, Europe unable to handle the influx of calamity.
And of course, in full disclosure (cough cough) Mr. Krugman fails to mention many of the good ideas shared by these conservatives. Why not race for cures to cancer and other deadly diseases instead of treatments like we raced to the moon? Why not allow inspections of Iran's nuclear facilities rather than trusting Iran to inspect themselves? Krugman and other liberals like to boast about their intellect. Tell what intellect negotiates with a known sponsor of terrorism, where the U.S. and the rest of the world gets nothing, and the terrorist state gets to develop nuclear technology and lifted sanctions? Oh, wait. Iran did release 5 Al Qaeda leaders back into the wild, so at least we got something from them. Hillary flew around the world, spreading liberal intellect, on our dime, and what do we have to show for it? Russia flexing muscle, radical Islam spreading out of control, millions of fleeing migrants, Europe unable to handle the influx of calamity.
"Failed tax dollar investments in Solyndra"
Since when is a 30 million dollar profit for the taxpayers a "failure"?
http://www.npr.org/2014/11/13/363572151/after-solyndra-loss-u-s-energy-l...
Since when is a 30 million dollar profit for the taxpayers a "failure"?
http://www.npr.org/2014/11/13/363572151/after-solyndra-loss-u-s-energy-l...
When you have a society that can read, chooses not to read depth fully, and whatever limited reading they do engage in takes place in a freewheeling Internet where there is no quality control----you get presidential candidates that spew dangerous nonsense.
3
"Since it's foolish to expect moderators to know everything on every issue, or everything a candidate has said in the past, why in the world aren't there fact-checkers who can communicate through the moderators' earpieces? Hard to believe the networks haven't made this mandatory. "
I like this idea. I also think the moderator should turn off any candidate’s microphone if they don’t clearly begin to address the question asked within 10 seconds.
I like this idea. I also think the moderator should turn off any candidate’s microphone if they don’t clearly begin to address the question asked within 10 seconds.
2
In that case, Hillary Clinton will have very little microphone on time in the Democratic debates.
Felt like cheering at your challenge to "evenhanded" reporting. When the PBS NewsHour started inviting republican crazies to present their views as having the same merit as the other side, I stopped watching the NewsHour.
Evenhanded reporting is dangerous as proven by the really scary and hateful lies and fictions that have taken over one of only two political parties that Americans have to choose between.
Evenhanded reporting is dangerous as proven by the really scary and hateful lies and fictions that have taken over one of only two political parties that Americans have to choose between.
2
When will we ever be able to stop watching the news - be it local or foreign - as if it were some kind of reality show, and realize that this is the real world going down the drain? When will the human race finally grow up? When willl those guys who go around preaching personal responsibility ever learn what empathy is really all about? When will we stop, as Neil Postman put it so well, "amusing opurselves to death"?
1
Mr. Krugman you don't need to worry about a Republican being elected anymore than you have over the last 30 years. The GOP will never allow a candidate that the 1% can't manipulate. After all it was Mr. Norquist who said something along the lines of--We don't need them to be smart; we just need them to sign what we tell them to.
And that's what we'll get if one of them is elected. More rule by the 1%. SOP.
Ultimately it isn't about who gets elected on the Republican side of the fence. It's who is pulling their strings and who are the answerable to.
And that's what we'll get if one of them is elected. More rule by the 1%. SOP.
Ultimately it isn't about who gets elected on the Republican side of the fence. It's who is pulling their strings and who are the answerable to.
2
So, Paul, if as you assert
"The tax increase of 2013 and the coming of Obamacare in 2014 were associated with the best job growth since the 1990s"
are you now ready to talk spending cuts to address long-term debt? Given the low, low unemployment rates (don't trouble yourself with that pesky labor participation statistic) - isn't it time for good Keynesians to advocate turning off the spigot?
"The tax increase of 2013 and the coming of Obamacare in 2014 were associated with the best job growth since the 1990s"
are you now ready to talk spending cuts to address long-term debt? Given the low, low unemployment rates (don't trouble yourself with that pesky labor participation statistic) - isn't it time for good Keynesians to advocate turning off the spigot?
RJ,
You mean like the more than 60% reduction in the deficit during Obama's tenure, from the record high 1.5 trillion that Bush left behind?
Considering republicans ran up all that debt under Reagan and Bush, perhaps they should be the ones to pay for it out of pocket. The cost of the two Bush wars alone was over 8 trillion dollars.
You mean like the more than 60% reduction in the deficit during Obama's tenure, from the record high 1.5 trillion that Bush left behind?
Considering republicans ran up all that debt under Reagan and Bush, perhaps they should be the ones to pay for it out of pocket. The cost of the two Bush wars alone was over 8 trillion dollars.
1
Nobody really cares. The game is fixed, the players are all the same, and nothing will be done that is in any way good for this nation.
It stumps me how the .01% believes it can ignore the rest of us, but they have the money to do whatever they want, so the rest of us really don't count at all. In about 50 years when Americans are all dumb and poor we will have the nation they want. I can't figure out why, but I guess they know. After all, if the rest of us are so smart, why ain't we rich, right?
It stumps me how the .01% believes it can ignore the rest of us, but they have the money to do whatever they want, so the rest of us really don't count at all. In about 50 years when Americans are all dumb and poor we will have the nation they want. I can't figure out why, but I guess they know. After all, if the rest of us are so smart, why ain't we rich, right?
1
It's not hard to understand why candidates bought and paid for by the wealthy, or who are themselves wealthy, favor policies that benefit the wealthy. Thus, taxing the middle and lower income populations to enable tax cuts for the higher income population is a tenet of GOP policy. What's so hard to understand is why a significant fraction of the very people harmed by this agenda continue to vote for the GOP. In fact, many policies espoused and enacted by the GOP harm the people who keep them in office. What am I missing?
1
Of course you can just about say anything when all the CNN moderators are doing is fetching for the sound bites over substance. Best moment: Trumps rejection of Jeb's Elmer Fuddian demand that he apologize to his wife.
3
And the fact that any of these jokesters feels qualified for the Presidency is stranger than fiction.
3
So my question is: Who among our Fourth Estate will stay on the Fiorino lie and confront her with it? How will the 24 million people who watched the debate get the word that it's a lie? I hope someone takes what Paul and others have said today - that this is a bald-faced lie. I really hope she doesn't get away with it. I hope it tanks her. Trump was right and shouldn't have apologized. Her face IS scary when she lets the spittle fly, which she does quite often. Do we want Ann Coulter as president? That's who Carly reminds me of. That level of hate. It makes her face very scary. I really hope she is confronted on this.
6
Thanks Prof Krugman for your observations/evaluations. Long may you write wryly and wisely for the likes of me, out of town but not out of touch - at least, trying to stay that way. But I still have one lament - if only we could bring back the late, much-missed Molly Ivins. What a fix she'd do on Fiorina or the Don.
3
The failure of the Republican debate participants to offer realistic solutions to climate deterioration is scary. Is this head -in-the sand attitude really necessary for them to win the Republican nomination?
What has become of the country for which my father fought in WWII? What has become of the democracy in which I was raised? I seriously must consider that if certain of these candidates were to occupy the White House, I might need to move to another country that matches the democratic ideals I cherish as an American.
3
Republicans don't care about truth; they care about virtue - punishment for your failures of virtue, and forgiveness for theirs.
2
My first job was a dishwasher at a restaurant and now I regularly eat in restaurants. And then I started working for my aunt and uncle, who had a janitorial service, cleaning banks branches at night (I cleaned the bathrooms) and now I keep my money in banks. Oh how far I've come!
1
Not one of the Republican candidates lies as well and as often as Hillary Clinton - not by a long shot! Christie's "lie" about the date of his appointment (which may well have been disclosed to him before any announcement) is of no consequence whatsoever. Lying about classified national security information stored in an unsecured server in a residence is far more significant unless, of course, you are Paul Krugman.
2
I would say it is a toss up between her and the 11 to 15 or however many remain in the republican field today.
Sanders or Stein this time.
Sanders or Stein this time.
Nice one! Claiming that "being named," doesn't have anything to do with "public announcement," is right up there with Donald Trump suddenly developing hearing problems.
Thank you for emphasizing the lies that were told at the Republican debate to great applause and no skepticism by the almost exclusively white audience.
All the candidate lies were egregious, but the Planned Parenthood one and the vaccine link to autism could result in great harm to people. The military war mongering, the lack of statesmanship, and yes, the lack of basic recognition of financial realities were mind boggling also.
I am afraid also that one of these narcissistic lunatics will become president. George W. Bush was a catastrophe for this country; the next Republican candidate could practically destroy it - or at least most of the 99%.
All the candidate lies were egregious, but the Planned Parenthood one and the vaccine link to autism could result in great harm to people. The military war mongering, the lack of statesmanship, and yes, the lack of basic recognition of financial realities were mind boggling also.
I am afraid also that one of these narcissistic lunatics will become president. George W. Bush was a catastrophe for this country; the next Republican candidate could practically destroy it - or at least most of the 99%.
10
Ha! Krugman should do stand up.
2
This is why so many people are turned off by politics and politicians. It takes too much work for the average voter to sift through the LIES. Carly Fiorina is the most strident of them all. And with a Botoxed face, she can muster a fury out of thin air without a clue that she's lying. Very scary.
6
So what, 'Bush declines casinos for Florida. What does he agree to with the 120 million donations.
2
All of the Republican and Democratic Politicians have promised political favors, laws, no-bid contracts, US military secrets, and other favors to each one of their political campaign contributors!
15 GOP candidates and they ALL need to embrace the same fringe ideas to get elected? Not one can embrace a rational platform that is not anti-abortion, anti-science, anti-gay, anti-immigration? Only the crazies and uneducated vote in a primary?
5
The comments at last night's New Hampshire Trump rally are really scary. A questioner (real? an actor?) claiming to be from White Plains asked what should be done about the nation's Muslims. Trump's response was what was truly scary--and it scared Trump as well. If you change the name of the victim group from Muslims to Jews, we're back in Germany in 1933-45.
We've already followed Hitler's playbook from 1933-41 under CheneyBush, starting with 9/11 as the pretext for enacting legislation in fear and haste to trash the Constitution and invading another nation (a former ally) based on lies to seize control of its oil. For those who didn't learn 20th-century European history--or conveniently forgot--that scenario, developed by the Project for the New American Century from 1997-2000--paralleled the Reichstag Fire, the enabling laws that set up a dictatorship, the attack on Poland in 1939 which started World War II, and the attack on the USSR (which had joined Germany in dividing up Poland and the Baltic States) in 1941.
Along the way the Germans enacted the Nuremberg Race Laws, which ultimately developed into the Final Solution. Is that what Trump and his team will propose for American Muslims?
We've already followed Hitler's playbook from 1933-41 under CheneyBush, starting with 9/11 as the pretext for enacting legislation in fear and haste to trash the Constitution and invading another nation (a former ally) based on lies to seize control of its oil. For those who didn't learn 20th-century European history--or conveniently forgot--that scenario, developed by the Project for the New American Century from 1997-2000--paralleled the Reichstag Fire, the enabling laws that set up a dictatorship, the attack on Poland in 1939 which started World War II, and the attack on the USSR (which had joined Germany in dividing up Poland and the Baltic States) in 1941.
Along the way the Germans enacted the Nuremberg Race Laws, which ultimately developed into the Final Solution. Is that what Trump and his team will propose for American Muslims?
7
"But who will tell the people?"
I kept wondering what Jon Stewart was would have said. He probably realized that both of those debates provided enough material for 2 or 3 weeks of the old Daily Show, at least. And all he would have to do is show clips, give that incredulous stare and explode with a "&%*?!! Its almost too easy...
Well, that is now your job, Professor.
I kept wondering what Jon Stewart was would have said. He probably realized that both of those debates provided enough material for 2 or 3 weeks of the old Daily Show, at least. And all he would have to do is show clips, give that incredulous stare and explode with a "&%*?!! Its almost too easy...
Well, that is now your job, Professor.
7
Thank you for this excellent piece- the horror of having one of these characters as president is indeed an terrible thought, and I agree that it could happen. I hope that you keep writing pieces like this to help us in our uphill battle for a fair and reasonable government.
1
Oh what fools these candidates be. Reaching that jet was like climbing tree.
2
Who will tell the people? That question ought to be, will the people pay attention when they learn the truth? Will they even believe it? Recent evidence indicates that somewhere around 45% will not believe it, even if slaps them in the face and calls them names.
2
I agree with everything you said with exception of your characterization of secretary and mailman as menial jobs. That sort of elitism is not becoming.
2
Why weren't the candidates challenged on the idea that the U.S. military is pitifully weak, when we spend more on it than the next seven countries combined (and 5 of those are our allies)? And that we should increase defense spending "so we don't get pushed around anymore"? Who is pushing us around--or is it just that the candidates get offended when any country pushes back against us?
They presented a picture to their base that "entitlements" are the main budget buster, ignoring that we're entitled to those benefits because we've paid for them our whole lives through payroll taxes, which we pay on the very first dollar we make. The Social Security surplus has been used to pay for things like the war in Iraq and the $400 billion F-35 fighter program. What, you mean that even though we're going to have over 2,400 of these jets, and nuclear submarines, and everything else, Iran is catching up to us?
They presented a picture to their base that "entitlements" are the main budget buster, ignoring that we're entitled to those benefits because we've paid for them our whole lives through payroll taxes, which we pay on the very first dollar we make. The Social Security surplus has been used to pay for things like the war in Iraq and the $400 billion F-35 fighter program. What, you mean that even though we're going to have over 2,400 of these jets, and nuclear submarines, and everything else, Iran is catching up to us?
6
Trump has admitted to lying. He feels it's just business fluffery.
In the words of George Costanza, "it's not a lie if you believe it".
I feel there should be a million dollar fine for any candidate that lies.
It's only when they feel it will they stop.
In the words of George Costanza, "it's not a lie if you believe it".
I feel there should be a million dollar fine for any candidate that lies.
It's only when they feel it will they stop.
1
Thanks for the trip down memory lane. Not exactly "Glory Days" though. The extent to which people will only hear what they want to hear seems to have reached epic proportions.
One other takeaway from the "debate" which you didn't mention is that Rand Paul is as small as Michael Dukakis.
One other takeaway from the "debate" which you didn't mention is that Rand Paul is as small as Michael Dukakis.
I totally agree about "evenhanded" reporting. Reporting is not what it used to be during the Vietnam war and Watergate. Reporting enabled GW. And the NY Times hired David Brooks for "evenhanded" reporting.
3
Calm down, Paul. Go over to the next desk and check on the Rubio Fiorina option with David Brooks, someone who can offer you a little counsel on American politics.
Sgt. Joe Fridays most famous line was "JUst the facts M'am.
When I hear Ronald Reagan my mind sees a whole bunch of facts and tries to connect them creating pictures I really don't care for.
Koch Industries was a big player in Stalin's Soviet Union and Fred Chase Koch's dealings with the Stalin regime prompted Koch to create the John Birch Society.
In 1945 Walter Elias Disney became apoplectic when his animators attempted to unionize. Disney accused them of being communist fifth column member a spurious accusation with no substance. Many if not all of the organizers shared a common heritage with today's leading neocons leading charges that Disney was an anti-Semite.
Ronald Wilson Reagan was a very liberal head of the Screen Actors Guild whose claim to fame was as a co-star with a chimp in movie matinees.When the House unAmerican Activities and the FBI asked Mr Reagan to name names Mr Reagan complied.
Mr Reagan subsequently found a niche in television as a tobacco pitchman and a hosting role similar to that of Mr Disney.
On July 17, 1955 Ronald Reagan hosted the opening of Disneyland.
I would like to say America has been in Fantasyland ever since and Wednesday night was conclusive proof but just the facts say little.
They may have some connection, they may not but today's neocons had only one defense in the days of Disney, McCarthy, Buckley Sr and the John Birch Society and Wednesday night made believe the debacle was not an accident.
When I hear Ronald Reagan my mind sees a whole bunch of facts and tries to connect them creating pictures I really don't care for.
Koch Industries was a big player in Stalin's Soviet Union and Fred Chase Koch's dealings with the Stalin regime prompted Koch to create the John Birch Society.
In 1945 Walter Elias Disney became apoplectic when his animators attempted to unionize. Disney accused them of being communist fifth column member a spurious accusation with no substance. Many if not all of the organizers shared a common heritage with today's leading neocons leading charges that Disney was an anti-Semite.
Ronald Wilson Reagan was a very liberal head of the Screen Actors Guild whose claim to fame was as a co-star with a chimp in movie matinees.When the House unAmerican Activities and the FBI asked Mr Reagan to name names Mr Reagan complied.
Mr Reagan subsequently found a niche in television as a tobacco pitchman and a hosting role similar to that of Mr Disney.
On July 17, 1955 Ronald Reagan hosted the opening of Disneyland.
I would like to say America has been in Fantasyland ever since and Wednesday night was conclusive proof but just the facts say little.
They may have some connection, they may not but today's neocons had only one defense in the days of Disney, McCarthy, Buckley Sr and the John Birch Society and Wednesday night made believe the debacle was not an accident.
3
I have been missing the Chad Mitchell Trio
Vox populi. Voice of the people is drowned by vox corporate media, vox special interest groups, vox incendiary rabble rousing, vox venal self-serving politicians who get away with murder, vox big money and bigger mouths. This semi-permeable membrane that encourages the one-sided flow of lies and untruths strikes felling blows at the very foundation of meaningful and nuanced discourse; even dulls indignation into resigned acceptance of standards that have fallen so low that it seems pointless even to display outrage at the outrageous.
Huckabee demands that importance be due to finding cures for cancer and Alzheimer's, and yet the ridicule that this warrants in the face of his animosity towards stem-cell research is tame; PP pittance of a budget over the laudable good it does (arguments against it notwithstanding) gets beaten over the head with ignoble cudgels of willful malice, but its demise seems all too imminent; 9/11 responders are now gadflies, major irritants to those who can and do try to swat them off with demonstrable success; the vox the world outside us is relegated to plaintive remonstrations from a milieu that waxes mystified at how we look at them - with scorn, irreverence and irrelevance.
How in such a poisonous cauldron can the people's voice look for and find anything edifying?
Huckabee demands that importance be due to finding cures for cancer and Alzheimer's, and yet the ridicule that this warrants in the face of his animosity towards stem-cell research is tame; PP pittance of a budget over the laudable good it does (arguments against it notwithstanding) gets beaten over the head with ignoble cudgels of willful malice, but its demise seems all too imminent; 9/11 responders are now gadflies, major irritants to those who can and do try to swat them off with demonstrable success; the vox the world outside us is relegated to plaintive remonstrations from a milieu that waxes mystified at how we look at them - with scorn, irreverence and irrelevance.
How in such a poisonous cauldron can the people's voice look for and find anything edifying?
2
"modern G.O.P. economic discourse is completely dominated by an economic doctrine — the sovereign importance of low taxes on the rich — that has failed completely and utterly in practice over the past generat."
Once again, the Republican Party is only a business, and they see gaining control of the government as the ultimate business opportunity. They are not interested in solving any of the problems that the country or it's people face.
Since the time of St. Ronnie, their goal has been to transform America from "We the People" to "Every Man for Himself- Winner Takes All", and too many have accepted it.
Once again, the Republican Party is only a business, and they see gaining control of the government as the ultimate business opportunity. They are not interested in solving any of the problems that the country or it's people face.
Since the time of St. Ronnie, their goal has been to transform America from "We the People" to "Every Man for Himself- Winner Takes All", and too many have accepted it.
5
Clinton's economic success had little to do with anything he did. George Bush's economic failures had everything to do with his poor management of his office.
The 1990's were boom years for much of the economy because new technology, the PC, allowed corporations to reduce staff. When I started in engineering in 1979, it took 4-5 engineers to do my job today. That's a significant drop in labor.
George Bush, perhaps the smarter brother, was the architech of a major collapse in the economy. He fought an unfunded war, just like Kennedy and Johnson, which drained government coffers. He allowed a bubble in housing to grow unattended. I could go on but you get my point.
The 1990's were boom years for much of the economy because new technology, the PC, allowed corporations to reduce staff. When I started in engineering in 1979, it took 4-5 engineers to do my job today. That's a significant drop in labor.
George Bush, perhaps the smarter brother, was the architech of a major collapse in the economy. He fought an unfunded war, just like Kennedy and Johnson, which drained government coffers. He allowed a bubble in housing to grow unattended. I could go on but you get my point.
3
There were surtaxes imposed to pay for Vietnam.
I remember one that was added on to everyone's phone bill at the time! Can you imagine a Republican proposing such a thing to pay for the Iraq war?
Johnson did it. You wanna fight, you gotta pay.
The total debt for 204 years of our republic in 1980 was $900 billion. With all the wars fought in all that time.
It was about $2.5 trillion only eight years later when Reagan departed. Almost triple in a time of no war.
Look it up people.
Bad policies have real world consequences.
Let the trickle begin!
I remember one that was added on to everyone's phone bill at the time! Can you imagine a Republican proposing such a thing to pay for the Iraq war?
Johnson did it. You wanna fight, you gotta pay.
The total debt for 204 years of our republic in 1980 was $900 billion. With all the wars fought in all that time.
It was about $2.5 trillion only eight years later when Reagan departed. Almost triple in a time of no war.
Look it up people.
Bad policies have real world consequences.
Let the trickle begin!
Feeling uncharacteristically optimistic I watched the second debate hoping for a glimpse of future greatness. Instead, it was three hours of anger and vitriol with Republican candidates telling the world how they will carry that anger into office and face this country, and the rest of the world, with tough words and emotional outbursts.
You cannot lead this nation (and be the leader of the free world) without transcending your emotions and striving for greatness - it is no longer a caretaker position. What I witnessed, to paraphrase Rand Paul, was a trip back to middle school with the candidates being as immature as my former classmates at that young age. All these folks running for the nation's highest office and the Republican Party is empty-suiting it.
You cannot lead this nation (and be the leader of the free world) without transcending your emotions and striving for greatness - it is no longer a caretaker position. What I witnessed, to paraphrase Rand Paul, was a trip back to middle school with the candidates being as immature as my former classmates at that young age. All these folks running for the nation's highest office and the Republican Party is empty-suiting it.
7
Thanks again Dr. Krugman for another excellent article. I am worried that one
of these candidates could win the election. Every one of them would be a
disaster to our foreign policy with the possibility of starting a war in the
middle east. Their economic policies would hurt the poor and middle class.
Although it is difficult for me to tolerate the egotistic and bombastic Trump
the rest of them are not that much better. Let us hope theta Hilary or Bernie
will defeat whomever comes out as the Republican candidate.
of these candidates could win the election. Every one of them would be a
disaster to our foreign policy with the possibility of starting a war in the
middle east. Their economic policies would hurt the poor and middle class.
Although it is difficult for me to tolerate the egotistic and bombastic Trump
the rest of them are not that much better. Let us hope theta Hilary or Bernie
will defeat whomever comes out as the Republican candidate.
7
It's early days yet, so let's not freak out. I'm guessing a lot of voters are not paying much attention to campaigns or debates at this point. Let's remember that the polls that we read about in the Times an other media outlets are conducted with a miniscule sampling of the population--typically around 1200 people.
My guess is by next summer we will be seeing a very different electoral landscape. The primaries will have culled all the extremists and we will have a much clearer picture of the candidates coupled with increased scrutiny by both media and voters.
If it turns out that Krugman is right, it might be a good idea to have a bailout plan to relocate to Europe or South America until the craziness is over.
My guess is by next summer we will be seeing a very different electoral landscape. The primaries will have culled all the extremists and we will have a much clearer picture of the candidates coupled with increased scrutiny by both media and voters.
If it turns out that Krugman is right, it might be a good idea to have a bailout plan to relocate to Europe or South America until the craziness is over.
3
Krugman is saying it like it is. Our media is so sick and demented that it cannot distinguish alie from truth. The Republican litany of cutting taxes to promote growth has been proven wrong, period. Sending our young people to be killed in wars (except for WWII) hasn't worked. Letting the Supreme Couurt give the richest 1% control over our government has begun to destroy our country. Letting the military-industrial complex drain our existing tax dollars only weakens our country with more and more expensive gadgetry. Yes, it's scary and Mr. Krugman is right that few speak truth to power.
5
You find the Republican debate scary. I find the Democrat lack of debate much more frightening.
You can debate the truthfulness and worthiness of the Republican candidate positions, but at least there is a debate to debate.
I have never seen anything like the overt effort to silence any coverage of any candidate other than Hillary. Column after column, in this paper and other main-stream media outlets, refuse to even mention the word "Sanders," let alone give proportional coverage to his positions.
I am a Republican, hard-core. Let me be clear: This is sickening. You should be embarrassed.
Not because I secretly hope that Sanders has less chances than Hillary, (he doesn't,) but because it represents all that is wrong with American politics today. How much did her supporters spend to buy you guys off? How much ad space did her super-packs promise to buy?
At least we Republicans are proudly vomiting out our establishment candidates, even if our best current option to make the point is someone pretty close to vomit with a toupee.
Look in the mirror and don't lecture us about honesty and transparency.
You can debate the truthfulness and worthiness of the Republican candidate positions, but at least there is a debate to debate.
I have never seen anything like the overt effort to silence any coverage of any candidate other than Hillary. Column after column, in this paper and other main-stream media outlets, refuse to even mention the word "Sanders," let alone give proportional coverage to his positions.
I am a Republican, hard-core. Let me be clear: This is sickening. You should be embarrassed.
Not because I secretly hope that Sanders has less chances than Hillary, (he doesn't,) but because it represents all that is wrong with American politics today. How much did her supporters spend to buy you guys off? How much ad space did her super-packs promise to buy?
At least we Republicans are proudly vomiting out our establishment candidates, even if our best current option to make the point is someone pretty close to vomit with a toupee.
Look in the mirror and don't lecture us about honesty and transparency.
126
One wonders if the NY Times will bother to cover Bernie Sanders' inaugeration.
3
Actually, you can't "debate the truthfulness" of the Republican candidates. The Republican candidates, like most of the Republican Party, are liars. End of story.
Some time ago when I asked my brother-in-law whether he was bothered by GW Bush's documented lies, and fratboy bullying rhetoric he said no. Meh.
It is refreshing to see the right wing's commitment to bullying and lying in service to well, the very rich remains consistent these ten plus years.
It is refreshing to see the right wing's commitment to bullying and lying in service to well, the very rich remains consistent these ten plus years.
It is hard to understand why any of these GOP candidates have gained traction in this election cycle. Every one of them has espoused views that are contrary to fact. Virtually no policy strategies have been put forward, except tearing down the legislation enacted during the Obama administration--including legislation that has been tested all the way to the Supreme Court. How can the nation move forward in any fashion if one of these inadequate individuals is elected.
Carly Fiorina seems to have made an impression--but not because of her ideas or her wretched experience. It was almost laughable for her to call out Hilary Clinton for having "activities" vs. "accomplishments" given Ms. Fiorina's disastrous accomplishments in the business world. And then she flat lied about a Planned Parenthood video--the better to pander to the extreme right-wing.
The fact that Donald Trump is right on one issue--stopping the reign of the oligarchs in campaign "financing" and in the tax system--is obliterated by his rampant appeal to racists, xenophobes and bigots.
Rand Paul's sensible (but outlier) views on foreign policy are countered by his flip-flopping movement to the right, the better to pander.
Even vaguely sensible candidates with some experience in government like Chris Christie, Bobby Jindal and Scott Walker have miserable track records.
But the most disturbing aspect of this crowd was the flat lies they all told. We shouldn't trust any of them.
Carly Fiorina seems to have made an impression--but not because of her ideas or her wretched experience. It was almost laughable for her to call out Hilary Clinton for having "activities" vs. "accomplishments" given Ms. Fiorina's disastrous accomplishments in the business world. And then she flat lied about a Planned Parenthood video--the better to pander to the extreme right-wing.
The fact that Donald Trump is right on one issue--stopping the reign of the oligarchs in campaign "financing" and in the tax system--is obliterated by his rampant appeal to racists, xenophobes and bigots.
Rand Paul's sensible (but outlier) views on foreign policy are countered by his flip-flopping movement to the right, the better to pander.
Even vaguely sensible candidates with some experience in government like Chris Christie, Bobby Jindal and Scott Walker have miserable track records.
But the most disturbing aspect of this crowd was the flat lies they all told. We shouldn't trust any of them.
8
"Virtually no policy strategies have been put forward..."
It's tough to do when the format of the debates centers on personality disputes and character assassination rather than questions about issues and policy.
It's tough to do when the format of the debates centers on personality disputes and character assassination rather than questions about issues and policy.
1
"Bill Clinton’s tax hike was followed by a huge economic boom, the George W. Bush tax cuts by a weak recovery that ended in financial collapse."
And the rooster's crowing made the sun come up. Please, Mr. Krugman. When operating as a political shill against all things Republican, your observations would carry more weight if you didn't completely abandon intellectual rigor in order that you might feed raw meat to the NY Times anti-Republican lions. You fully well know that a) correlation is not causation, and b) that a causative link between Clinton's tax hike and Bush's tax cut and economic performance is utterly impossible to make. And especially so for you, considering as you continually attribute economic outcomes in this country to the actions of the Fed.
As for me, I don't think it makes a nickel's worth of difference who is elected President. The republic has survived and prospered under good presidents, bad presidents, and everything in between. And every last one of them lied to get elected. It's what politicians do. Are your political bias blinders so firmly affixed that you can't see that lying to get elected is a bipartisan affair?
And the rooster's crowing made the sun come up. Please, Mr. Krugman. When operating as a political shill against all things Republican, your observations would carry more weight if you didn't completely abandon intellectual rigor in order that you might feed raw meat to the NY Times anti-Republican lions. You fully well know that a) correlation is not causation, and b) that a causative link between Clinton's tax hike and Bush's tax cut and economic performance is utterly impossible to make. And especially so for you, considering as you continually attribute economic outcomes in this country to the actions of the Fed.
As for me, I don't think it makes a nickel's worth of difference who is elected President. The republic has survived and prospered under good presidents, bad presidents, and everything in between. And every last one of them lied to get elected. It's what politicians do. Are your political bias blinders so firmly affixed that you can't see that lying to get elected is a bipartisan affair?
2
Krugman is well aware of this. I know he truly believes the Republicans are bad for the country, and I happen to agree, so he engages in partisan polemics that he thinks will resonate with a broader audience. Polemics in this platform don't leave room for nuance or complexities, but his polemics and authority are weakened when he takes it a step too far, like in this case.
Not only did Fiorina lie about the Planned Parenthood videos, she doubled down on her lie the day after the debate in a TV interview, claiming she did see it on video. Maybe she's merely delusional? Shades of Rumsfeld, Cheney, Wolfowitz and others?
10
Not a single leader among these folks. Leaders do the right thing even when it might be politically wrong. This notion is lost on every single one of these gentle people.
If this is the best we can do we're in bad shape...
If this is the best we can do we're in bad shape...
6
I'm actually short of comment beacuse of prof. Krugman statement that Trump economy does make sense.
Well, it makes sense unless... it doesn't make it anymore for mr. Trump.
in fact, he spoke in the first debate and in the second last one about its "terrific" ( i'm quoting him ) timing in leave Atlantic city.
More about it, it brags he used filed bankruptcy, left investor blank spacing each other about their money.
More and more about it: he repeated it!
Sure, for a businessman, this isn't heretical practice, but as Krugman happily stated for years, running a state is not the same of running a family.
I'm expect nothing less than chapter 2: "why running a business is not like running a state".
Well, it makes sense unless... it doesn't make it anymore for mr. Trump.
in fact, he spoke in the first debate and in the second last one about its "terrific" ( i'm quoting him ) timing in leave Atlantic city.
More about it, it brags he used filed bankruptcy, left investor blank spacing each other about their money.
More and more about it: he repeated it!
Sure, for a businessman, this isn't heretical practice, but as Krugman happily stated for years, running a state is not the same of running a family.
I'm expect nothing less than chapter 2: "why running a business is not like running a state".
1
I was terrified also. I tuned it off,after a while it,was so,disturbing. I hope the 23 million people who watched were also terrified.
2
Let's not make an assumption that there are enough people who really care to hear to make a difference.
I'm no lawyer, but can Fiorina be sued for defaming Planned Parenthood?
1
I'm confused. It's on video...PP has admitted the are real just edited to shorten. How did she defame them? Honestly curious?
The answer to your question is no one will tell the truth. That isn't even the worst part of it, apparently no one cares. Not journalists, the voting public nor the candidates.That is a real problem. After the debate a reporter was featured on the news explaining the vaccine "debate" Mr. Trump cited. THERE IS NO DEBATE ON VACCINES. None. The truth is in on vaccine but the reporter did not even have the integrity to explain that the real story was Mr. Trump's vaccine lies or vaccine crazies. The continued lies about fetal tissue research and Planned Parenthood are not only dishonest but nuts. None of the questions serious challenge the statements that a competent moderator should have asked. Any of the candidates name the diseases cured or stopped because of fetal tissue research? When Republicans or JEB! says that the Bush administration kept America "safe" the audience gave a large round of applause. Who or what administration was in charge on 9-10 the day before the largest attack on American soil? Ms. Fiorina's lying about her HP administration should have resulted an immediate corporate tweeting of the truth. Corporate America was silent and the next day and Ms. Fiorina was declared one of winners of the debate! American's have gotten so use to lying that we now have political party dedicated to lying. This acceptance of lying by the voting public, journalists and candidates is changing America's destiny not to an idolized past but by creating frightening future.
5
I voted for Obama in 2008 and have subsequently watched that Administration's actions fail on a number of fronts. I have therefore formed a healthy skepticism about all presidential candidates. There are no doubt some crazy things happening with the candidates on the right. But there are also some crazy things happening with the candidates on the left.
I listen and I keep an open mind. And I will stop reading op-ed writers from either on the Times or the Journal who foment fear as Krugman and Rove do routinely...All that does is shut down broad based thought and contribute to the hate game from which we already suffer.
I listen and I keep an open mind. And I will stop reading op-ed writers from either on the Times or the Journal who foment fear as Krugman and Rove do routinely...All that does is shut down broad based thought and contribute to the hate game from which we already suffer.
Since the so-called Gingrich Revolution, Republicans have abandoned facts and real-world policy in favor of propaganda and pandering. The Republicans know that deception is the only tactic that will keep them politically competitive.
The rubes in the Republican base are too dumb to understand they're being scammed.
The rubes in the Republican base are too dumb to understand they're being scammed.
5
Krugman, does it not in the least bother you that you have become a shill, not an analyst? Reasonable analysts could disagree over whether Fiorina got it precisely right in her description of organ harvesting by PP. However, they would not ever say what you say - that no such harvesting from a living baby ever occurred except as claimed by "anti-abortion activists." In the disputed video, a woman who was NOT an activist, who was THERE and participating, testifies quite specifically as to seeing exactly this horror. Personally, I do not care if PP made profit from it or not. What I and millions are recoiling from is the callous indifference you and so many others, as well as PP itself, show to the very idea of it. The idea of abortion as an absolute right is corrosive morally and these videos have made that terrifyingly clear. Your indifference, or better, your hatred of Republicans, blinds you to this. Too bad.
yup, john b, krugman is a shill all right. shilling for accountability, nuance, and reason.
as a former fact-checker, i can assure you, ferreting out truth from lies, half-truths, and bombast, isn't difficult. but the will to do so--in newsrooms, advertising, even in everyday discourse--seems to be absent.
as others have noted, democracy and an uninformed electorate are mutually exclusive.
independent, user-supported news sources do exist: democracy now! real news network, freespeech tv, truthout, truthdig, pro publica...
and that's just off the top of my head.
so many of the comments here are proof to me, however, that despite media conglomerates, citizens united, and the creeping pandemic of stupidization, despite all that, critical thinkers abound.
as a former fact-checker, i can assure you, ferreting out truth from lies, half-truths, and bombast, isn't difficult. but the will to do so--in newsrooms, advertising, even in everyday discourse--seems to be absent.
as others have noted, democracy and an uninformed electorate are mutually exclusive.
independent, user-supported news sources do exist: democracy now! real news network, freespeech tv, truthout, truthdig, pro publica...
and that's just off the top of my head.
so many of the comments here are proof to me, however, that despite media conglomerates, citizens united, and the creeping pandemic of stupidization, despite all that, critical thinkers abound.
Why not have, as part of the framework of Republican or Democrat presidential debate a group fact checkers that can call the candidates out during a debate?
5
Fiorina also lied about Syria and Putin. She claimed Gen Sulemani of the Qud forces recently visited Moscow and "convinced Putin to prop up Assad." She claims this lie as proof that Obama has made America less safe. Yet she clearly does not understand what we in the real world call facts. #1Assad has been and his father before him a close ally of Russia and formerly the USSR. Not a recent development that occurred on Obama's watch but rather a long standing alliance. None of the GOP candidates recognize that if the US removes Assad we are provoking a fight with Putin over a country that is his long standing ally and long standing customer and has zero importance to the USA's national interest. Rubio actually claimed that Putin's incursion into Ukraine is an attempt to destroy NATO. Yet he doesn't even know that Ukraine was part of the former Soviet Union and that it carries significant priority to the Russians and not significant priority to US national interest. Rubio wants to have wars in Cuba, South China Sea, Ukraine, Korea, Syria, Iran,Iraq and Gaza just so he can stand on a podium and tell his base that America is leading again. Jeb! defended W! by saying he kept us safe "do you remember the rubble?" We remember it and unlike Jeb! we remember how it got there too. If, as Carly Fiorina claims, she doubled the revenue of HP then why did she have to fire 30,000 employees? They couldn't afford to keep the employees and pay her the $ 20 million she got.
5
Note the penultimate paragraph. The media must not let lies, errors, and poisonous nonsense pass unremarked and uncorrected. Call them out in news reportage, not merely in opinion pieces which other may dismiss. As the national paper of record we need the New York Times to show the way.
4
Birthers; zygote and fetus obsessive paranoid hysterics; xenophobes; racists; Hey, Paul, relax, it's a 'big tent.' It's the Republican Party circa 2015. Only the 'big tent' is now surrounded by ''the biggest most beautiful wall.''
4
Thank you Mr. Krugman for your sober analysis of the inebriated Republican clan of wolves in the lion's den of the Ronnie Reagan library (lol ... that's an oxymoron) I would be intrigued to venture into the ultra White community of Simi Valley just to casually browse what passes for books in his library. Perhaps they contain a compendium of Hollywood screenplays and an assortment of comic books revolving around saving the world from evil villains and kryptonite.
It amazes me that Rand Paul receives the "rational man of the debate" award because he warned against military intervention in Iran as well as has the audacity of hope to bring up the statistics regarding the over-representation of people of color held within the prison industrial complex which is a strictly Republican invention to make a profit off of unequal laws for the poor vs. wealthy children like Jeb!, Dubbya & Teddy Kennedy. Just to counter his somewhat wimpy image in the eyes of red blooded Conservatives, it was critical for the Rand Paul media team to advertise him blowing an IRS tax code to pieces with an automatic rifle to show his support for guns & ammo lovers. Never mind that he supports eliminating the IRS, EPA, US Securities and Exchange Commission, Financial Stability Oversight Council, FINRA, Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, FDA, Federal Housing Finance Agency as well as being opposed to the meager Dodd-Frank legislation let alone Glass Steagall's attempt to regulate Wall Street.
It amazes me that Rand Paul receives the "rational man of the debate" award because he warned against military intervention in Iran as well as has the audacity of hope to bring up the statistics regarding the over-representation of people of color held within the prison industrial complex which is a strictly Republican invention to make a profit off of unequal laws for the poor vs. wealthy children like Jeb!, Dubbya & Teddy Kennedy. Just to counter his somewhat wimpy image in the eyes of red blooded Conservatives, it was critical for the Rand Paul media team to advertise him blowing an IRS tax code to pieces with an automatic rifle to show his support for guns & ammo lovers. Never mind that he supports eliminating the IRS, EPA, US Securities and Exchange Commission, Financial Stability Oversight Council, FINRA, Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, FDA, Federal Housing Finance Agency as well as being opposed to the meager Dodd-Frank legislation let alone Glass Steagall's attempt to regulate Wall Street.
3
Actually, I don't think there can be any mature, reasonable and intelligent Republican candidates because that's not the kind of candidates the Republican base respond to. Sometimes, we do get what we ask for.
Besides, the Republican elites, those really in control and controlling the whole Republican messaging/propaganda machinery, do not want reasonable, intelligent and mature candidates or voters, because then they would think for themselves and be hard to manipulate and control.
It is really a very incredible method, divide and conquer and watch people eat their young.
Besides, the Republican elites, those really in control and controlling the whole Republican messaging/propaganda machinery, do not want reasonable, intelligent and mature candidates or voters, because then they would think for themselves and be hard to manipulate and control.
It is really a very incredible method, divide and conquer and watch people eat their young.
2
Virtually all countries are divided in half: half that relies on logic, evidence, and knowledge (or those that use all three) and the half that relies on incantation, fantasy, racial theories (a Game of Thrones approach). Change occurs when the balance tips. The US may be at the tipping point. If Republicans get their hands on all three branches of government, we will know that the moment has come.
What if I formed a corporation, built a Casino, financed the construction with a mortgage, bled off all of the operating assets with large salaries to me and my friends, sold all of my shares in the Casino to investors, failed to make the mortgage payments, and then had the Casino declare bankruptcy!
My friends and I might have owned most of the outstanding stock, but the net worth of the Casino Corporation might be negative (if you deduct the value of the Goodwill from the assets), so the value of these shares in the Casino at the bankruptcy will be very minimal.
What if I then re-purchased sufficient shares of the Casino to regain operating control of the Casino after the bankruptcy is final, and repeated the whole process over and over forever (as a career)!
The US Federal Bankruptcy laws allow this. It is very much legal. This is a very good and viable business plan!
Creditors who loan money to these people should discriminate and be very careful.
Creditors should not be protected by the taxpayers via F.I.C.A. and etc.!
Maybe federal Bankruptcy laws should be repealed, or at least modified.
My friends and I might have owned most of the outstanding stock, but the net worth of the Casino Corporation might be negative (if you deduct the value of the Goodwill from the assets), so the value of these shares in the Casino at the bankruptcy will be very minimal.
What if I then re-purchased sufficient shares of the Casino to regain operating control of the Casino after the bankruptcy is final, and repeated the whole process over and over forever (as a career)!
The US Federal Bankruptcy laws allow this. It is very much legal. This is a very good and viable business plan!
Creditors who loan money to these people should discriminate and be very careful.
Creditors should not be protected by the taxpayers via F.I.C.A. and etc.!
Maybe federal Bankruptcy laws should be repealed, or at least modified.
5
You are so right about the problems with the doctrine of "evenhanded" reporting as practiced. It opens the door to propaganda being presented as factual without critical comment, a clear corruption of First Amendment rights. Presenting false information or intentionally deceiving with intent to profit is still FRAUD, whether the liar is hoping to harvest money or votes.
When PBS began to program news under this doctrine it was a great loss, as they lost their status as the most objective (least partisan) reporting agency, instead giving bland coverage of contradictory points of view just as the for profit broadcasters do (fundamentally a violation of their charter).
I think that acceptance of casual lies as a way of life degrades life itself and casts a wariness over the people who can no longer trust their institutions to serve their needs. To enable liars only encourages more lies and liars. To place liars near positions of power encourages displays of hubris in telling lies, if such is the path to authority. The clown car tour has become a screening process for finding the best liar based on relative popularity. "...does it matter?". It does.
When PBS began to program news under this doctrine it was a great loss, as they lost their status as the most objective (least partisan) reporting agency, instead giving bland coverage of contradictory points of view just as the for profit broadcasters do (fundamentally a violation of their charter).
I think that acceptance of casual lies as a way of life degrades life itself and casts a wariness over the people who can no longer trust their institutions to serve their needs. To enable liars only encourages more lies and liars. To place liars near positions of power encourages displays of hubris in telling lies, if such is the path to authority. The clown car tour has become a screening process for finding the best liar based on relative popularity. "...does it matter?". It does.
6
If I wanted to sabotage a democracy, I would run it like Roger Ailes runs Fox News.
The Bush tax cuts were totally undermined by 9-11 only 3 months later. Was Paul in Europe at the time? He must have missed the collapse of he economy that followed the destruction of the World Trade Center.
Goodness. Who knew the computer/housing/banking bubble was part of al Qaeda's secret plan?
The debate reminded me of a rerun of the old 70s TV show "Lancelot Link - Secret Chimp" (starring Donald Trump as Lance). It was like someone dressed a bunch of chimpanzees up as humans and overdubbed voices of them saying ridiculous things. Pretty funny, unless you do consider that one of these chimps might end up in the White House, in which case, yes, it's very scary.
4
Let's not overlook Scott Walker's "let them eat cake" take on falling wages.
When asked if he would support a national increase in the minimum wage - long overdue, and one of the most obvious steps towards addressing the inequality that has millions of wage-earners lining up at food banks while Fiorina, Trump, Kasich et al pay themselves millions for furthering this inequality - Scott Walker said that he would not want the minimum wage raised because if people got more education for job skills and training they could all go into careers that pay way better.
Wait... according to Walker, we'll keep half the jobs paying poverty-level wages, but everyone will just shift (using education paid for through a plan he does not have) to careers as doctors, lawyers, CEOs, maybe state governors, eh... Problem solved!
Except for the fact that all those low-paid jobs flipping burgers, mowing lawns, cleaning offices and hotel rooms, teaching preschool, picking vegetables, packing meat, etc., etc., etc., will still be there.
I guess that's where Dr. Ben Carson's proposal comes in, that all those in the country illegally be allowed to stay so long as they are confined to jobs on farms. Like picking cotton, perhaps?
Walker is no smarter than Marie Antoinette, and just as blithely ignorant of reality. Carson is even more disturbingly ignorant with his apparent willingness to endorse a special form of slavery for hispanic people.
This is beyond voodoo economics! Please address.
When asked if he would support a national increase in the minimum wage - long overdue, and one of the most obvious steps towards addressing the inequality that has millions of wage-earners lining up at food banks while Fiorina, Trump, Kasich et al pay themselves millions for furthering this inequality - Scott Walker said that he would not want the minimum wage raised because if people got more education for job skills and training they could all go into careers that pay way better.
Wait... according to Walker, we'll keep half the jobs paying poverty-level wages, but everyone will just shift (using education paid for through a plan he does not have) to careers as doctors, lawyers, CEOs, maybe state governors, eh... Problem solved!
Except for the fact that all those low-paid jobs flipping burgers, mowing lawns, cleaning offices and hotel rooms, teaching preschool, picking vegetables, packing meat, etc., etc., etc., will still be there.
I guess that's where Dr. Ben Carson's proposal comes in, that all those in the country illegally be allowed to stay so long as they are confined to jobs on farms. Like picking cotton, perhaps?
Walker is no smarter than Marie Antoinette, and just as blithely ignorant of reality. Carson is even more disturbingly ignorant with his apparent willingness to endorse a special form of slavery for hispanic people.
This is beyond voodoo economics! Please address.
4
Why is "the base" so crazy? Doesn't "base" mean the foundation of the party? Crazy, ignorant people shouldn't have this much sway, unless they are being exploited by cynical, corporate forces.
I know that some people have fears, anxieties, and even delusions; they are suffering, and they are being used.
The complicated issues we need to debate cannot be addressed in this environment. I hope that everyone who isn't crazy or a greedy corporate force, will simply turn away from this madness. Don't watch it, listen to it, or pay for this conversation. And, consider a serious boycott of advertisers of madness.
I know that some people have fears, anxieties, and even delusions; they are suffering, and they are being used.
The complicated issues we need to debate cannot be addressed in this environment. I hope that everyone who isn't crazy or a greedy corporate force, will simply turn away from this madness. Don't watch it, listen to it, or pay for this conversation. And, consider a serious boycott of advertisers of madness.
2
Kudos to PK again. But he seems to be ignored by the NYTimes' own editorial board when it comes to calling out Mrs. Fiorina as a failed CEO and a failed senate candidate in California.
One could rant infinitum about the rest of the intellectual futility of the other GOP primary gas bags on the stage. Not even a backdrop using Reagan's Air Force One could provide cover for so many empty heads. . But with the major media outlets and their esteemed Capitol Hill reporters falling all over themselves to praise the empty suit, Carly Fiorina, one can't help but wonder why they get hired, let along get paid for failures of observation. The major networks' news departments can't separate themselves from Fox anymore as they ramble on endlessly about how Mrs. Fiorina bested the lot last Wednesday night.
When The Donald confronted Carly about her costly failures as Hewlett-Packard's CEO, she simply and quickly shifted the focus on The Donald's casino and resort bankruptcies. This is how the entire field of candidates and the party they represent operate.Ignore the disastrous policies of the libertarian former Fed Chairman, Alan Greenspan; ignore the thrice-failed concept and hideous consequences of the Trickle-Down economic theories; ignore the permanent damage done by promoters of competition-killing mergers, acquisitions and hostile takeovers launched by the Reagan/Greenspan and still in wide existance.
Nearly a sit-com, the CNN debate format was a cruel hoax.
One could rant infinitum about the rest of the intellectual futility of the other GOP primary gas bags on the stage. Not even a backdrop using Reagan's Air Force One could provide cover for so many empty heads. . But with the major media outlets and their esteemed Capitol Hill reporters falling all over themselves to praise the empty suit, Carly Fiorina, one can't help but wonder why they get hired, let along get paid for failures of observation. The major networks' news departments can't separate themselves from Fox anymore as they ramble on endlessly about how Mrs. Fiorina bested the lot last Wednesday night.
When The Donald confronted Carly about her costly failures as Hewlett-Packard's CEO, she simply and quickly shifted the focus on The Donald's casino and resort bankruptcies. This is how the entire field of candidates and the party they represent operate.Ignore the disastrous policies of the libertarian former Fed Chairman, Alan Greenspan; ignore the thrice-failed concept and hideous consequences of the Trickle-Down economic theories; ignore the permanent damage done by promoters of competition-killing mergers, acquisitions and hostile takeovers launched by the Reagan/Greenspan and still in wide existance.
Nearly a sit-com, the CNN debate format was a cruel hoax.
4
Where does one find sanctuary? Has it always been this way or has the political class itself evolved into a sort of amoral species which, ala Huxley and Orwell, regards the polity as drones and truth as contingent? Although logically absurd, it seems each party is worse than the other.
Among the stunning debate statements, for me, Dr. Carson's immigration related proposal-- allow immigrants who are here illegally, but with no criminal records, a chance to work, primarily in Agriculture, because those are not jobs Americans want to do. What is that? Slavery? Indentured servitude?
3
During 2004 my wife heard a pundit say to another one, "What if our telling his lies as facts throws the election to him?" He was speaking of Bush.
I could imagine one of Bush's aides saying to one of Kerry's "We'll stop lying about your guy if you stop telling the truth about ours."
Last night on Rachel Maddow's show Bernie Sanders said, "I doubt a majority of Americans could tell you which party was in control of the Senate or the House."
And that was true in 2014, 60% of voters didn't know which party controlled congress so they sent the party that has said No NO NO to everything back to say No NO NO some more.
I have two hopes for this election cycle: #1- that enough evangelical voters will have tired of the republican party playing them for suckers by promising to win the 'culture wars' and then not even trying when they controlled the government (2002-2006); #2- that enough journalists get tired of the republican party playing them for suckers by allowing their lies to get traction as fact or opinion.
Republicans have been winning elections for almost 50 years by lying and getting low information voters to buy into those lies. And by getting the 4th Estate to play the personality game instead of reporting on facts and reality.
Those "vagaries of elections" wouldn't happen with such regularity if the American Press and Media was doing its job.
Democracy depends on an informed electorate and a free and vigorous press....Thomas Jefferson.
I could imagine one of Bush's aides saying to one of Kerry's "We'll stop lying about your guy if you stop telling the truth about ours."
Last night on Rachel Maddow's show Bernie Sanders said, "I doubt a majority of Americans could tell you which party was in control of the Senate or the House."
And that was true in 2014, 60% of voters didn't know which party controlled congress so they sent the party that has said No NO NO to everything back to say No NO NO some more.
I have two hopes for this election cycle: #1- that enough evangelical voters will have tired of the republican party playing them for suckers by promising to win the 'culture wars' and then not even trying when they controlled the government (2002-2006); #2- that enough journalists get tired of the republican party playing them for suckers by allowing their lies to get traction as fact or opinion.
Republicans have been winning elections for almost 50 years by lying and getting low information voters to buy into those lies. And by getting the 4th Estate to play the personality game instead of reporting on facts and reality.
Those "vagaries of elections" wouldn't happen with such regularity if the American Press and Media was doing its job.
Democracy depends on an informed electorate and a free and vigorous press....Thomas Jefferson.
3
The problem is the American public no longer practices due diligence when voting.
The information is out there, but the public is too lazy to look for it, let alone vote.
The largest voting block in 2016 will be the "I didn't bother " bloc.
And those being shafted the most have the worst rates of participation.
Its like the idiots who get killed by trains, and the people who wonder "How did they do that"?
They tried. Trains, like elections don't really sneak up on you out of the dark.
The information is out there, but the public is too lazy to look for it, let alone vote.
The largest voting block in 2016 will be the "I didn't bother " bloc.
And those being shafted the most have the worst rates of participation.
Its like the idiots who get killed by trains, and the people who wonder "How did they do that"?
They tried. Trains, like elections don't really sneak up on you out of the dark.
2
One of the problems with these so-called debates is the overly wide range of topics they aspire to cover. When you have so many candidates and you are trying to rush through so many topics, you invite thoughtless answers, spin and outright lies.
The moderators themselves barely listen to the answers, as they are already rushing out the next question. So it's almost impossible for them to offer a meaningful retort. The politicians know you won't pause to call them on their lies.
You don't have to cover everything in one debate. Choose a few topics and go deep. Force the politicians to offer details and evidence for their statements and claims.
The media has a duty to help rehabilitate American democracy. This country goes round trying to promote democracy in the world. We should provide a good example.
The moderators themselves barely listen to the answers, as they are already rushing out the next question. So it's almost impossible for them to offer a meaningful retort. The politicians know you won't pause to call them on their lies.
You don't have to cover everything in one debate. Choose a few topics and go deep. Force the politicians to offer details and evidence for their statements and claims.
The media has a duty to help rehabilitate American democracy. This country goes round trying to promote democracy in the world. We should provide a good example.
2
The car is crowded as it speeds down an interstate somewhere in Iowa. Everyone inside is fighting for control of the steering wheel. Sean Hannitty is blasting on the radio . There are empty bags of chips and crushed soda cups on the floor and dash. If someone is actually steering the car it's impossible to see the road. The passengers talk over each other proclaiming the end of the world.
When the car runs out of gas and coasts to a stop in the middle of the highway, no one gets out. Inside you can see the silhouettes of grown men and women elbowing and punching each other. Cars swerve around them not slowing down.
Will someone emerge from car ready to lead them to a gas station? Will they ask for help from a farmer down the road? Will someone dust the chips off their suit coat and say, "enough with this bullcrap already!
Have they lost their minds? Have 7 years of steady, calm and courageous leadership driven them to this place of delusion? It's much better than it was 8 years ago, come on! Get out of the car and smell the fresh air!
When the car runs out of gas and coasts to a stop in the middle of the highway, no one gets out. Inside you can see the silhouettes of grown men and women elbowing and punching each other. Cars swerve around them not slowing down.
Will someone emerge from car ready to lead them to a gas station? Will they ask for help from a farmer down the road? Will someone dust the chips off their suit coat and say, "enough with this bullcrap already!
Have they lost their minds? Have 7 years of steady, calm and courageous leadership driven them to this place of delusion? It's much better than it was 8 years ago, come on! Get out of the car and smell the fresh air!
2
'...But the truly awesome moment came when she asserted that the videos being used to attack Planned Parenthood show “a fully formed fetus on the table, its heart beating, its legs kicking while someone says we have to keep it alive to harvest its brain.”'
lots of old ideas that have not proved useful as asserted by the politicians who have proposed them election cycle after election cycle but this probably was one of the silliest things anybody has ever said in all seriousness. Since when can humans transplant the brain from one body into another? Secondly, conceptually, if it were possible would it not represent a life preserving procedure rather than the cold blooding killing it was supposed to represent.
lots of old ideas that have not proved useful as asserted by the politicians who have proposed them election cycle after election cycle but this probably was one of the silliest things anybody has ever said in all seriousness. Since when can humans transplant the brain from one body into another? Secondly, conceptually, if it were possible would it not represent a life preserving procedure rather than the cold blooding killing it was supposed to represent.
1
Well, Dr. Krugman, you do have a point there. Where do these peple come from, and what makes them that way? And why do enough Americans agree with them to take over a major party? More importantly, why do the moneyed interests who are paying for all this continue to do so? Are the Republicans still the party of big business?
One of the recent commenters said she would leave the country if any of the candidates in the most recent clown show win the White House. But what we used to call "big business" has already left the country. Big business doesn't really need American labor or American consumers. So why pay for public health, education, or to support the elderly? Who needs any of those people? War? It's good for business, win or lose doesn't matter. And the base loves it. It's a whole new world out there, and it couldn't have come into being without the collaboration of the establishment press and news media.
One of the recent commenters said she would leave the country if any of the candidates in the most recent clown show win the White House. But what we used to call "big business" has already left the country. Big business doesn't really need American labor or American consumers. So why pay for public health, education, or to support the elderly? Who needs any of those people? War? It's good for business, win or lose doesn't matter. And the base loves it. It's a whole new world out there, and it couldn't have come into being without the collaboration of the establishment press and news media.
3
Krugman is a master of taking unrelated facts and somehow arguing that there is a cause and effect. Bill Clinton raised taxes and the economy boomed. Maybe the economy boomed because the Republicans became the majority party in both the House and the Senate in 1995. Or maybe the economy boomed because Bill Clinton signed the job-killing NAFTA, CAFTA and GATT trade agreements, enabling consumers to buy less expensive goods from overseas and giving them more purchasing power.
George Bush cut taxes and and that led to financial collapse. Or maybe the fact that the Democratic Party became the majority party in both the House and the Senate in 2007 is what led to the financial collapse in 2008. Or maybe it was the low interest rate policy of the Fed after 9/11 that led to the financial collapse.
Honest analysis from Krugman? I'm not holding my breath.
Meanwhile, the Times' editorial acknowledges that the job market is still weak, almost seven years into the Obama presidency. What does Krugman say? All is great?
George Bush cut taxes and and that led to financial collapse. Or maybe the fact that the Democratic Party became the majority party in both the House and the Senate in 2007 is what led to the financial collapse in 2008. Or maybe it was the low interest rate policy of the Fed after 9/11 that led to the financial collapse.
Honest analysis from Krugman? I'm not holding my breath.
Meanwhile, the Times' editorial acknowledges that the job market is still weak, almost seven years into the Obama presidency. What does Krugman say? All is great?
1
I've spent the last 40 years asking myself how low the republican party can go and they keep going lower and lower. They claim to be solving problems that don't exist. They are hysterical about phony crises while actively covering up the most critical problems that we face. They make up fake wars and base their reasons on lies. They waste time and the taxpayers money fighting battles they already lost. They align themselves with a foreign country against the interests of the US. Now they are running a TV celebrity who appeals to the most vile and ignorant people in the most vile and ignorant ways he can find. And instead of standing up to the windbag/bully the GOP is bowing down to him. The Republican party has no credibility anymore and truthfully is an anti-American organization at this point.
3
Upside/Downside Analysis implies here that until a candidate endures a negative consequence for lying, we'll get more of it. A media (mainstream or otherwise) that can't or won't separate fact from fiction is helping to drive this runaway car.
The Republican party's donor class will never let their politicians (read puppets) change economic policy - more tax cuts to the donor class.
1
Interesting that Fiorina, who was guilty of one of the most hyperbolic whoppers of the evening (Planned Parenthood video), used part of her debate time to brand Ms. Clinton a liar. She lost me in that moment. For good.
318
Of course the GOP is holding ever more tightly to their failed theory. And of course the Club for Low Taxes (er, "Growth") is attacking Trump bigtime for his tax apostasy.
Your one paragraph completely dismantles the GOP tax argument. If any Republican goes off message on low taxes for the rich, the game will be over, the evidence is huge that they are wrong. Once even a handful of noted conservatives cry uncle to the facts, their whole faith-based belief in low taxes starts to crumble.
This faith, this belief contra evidence requires that no questions be asked, no dissent be brooked. The desire to sin is great. (In this case, having sane economic policies has become sin to the GOP.)
Your one paragraph completely dismantles the GOP tax argument. If any Republican goes off message on low taxes for the rich, the game will be over, the evidence is huge that they are wrong. Once even a handful of noted conservatives cry uncle to the facts, their whole faith-based belief in low taxes starts to crumble.
This faith, this belief contra evidence requires that no questions be asked, no dissent be brooked. The desire to sin is great. (In this case, having sane economic policies has become sin to the GOP.)
2
<>
It would be more accurate for this sentence to end with "which turns those false assertions into what, in any other field but political reporting and Republican Party politics, would be called 'lies'."
It would be more accurate for this sentence to end with "which turns those false assertions into what, in any other field but political reporting and Republican Party politics, would be called 'lies'."
1
The GOP debates are truly frightening. What is even more frightening is the media reactions. As Paul Krugman said: " If Mr. Bush said the earth was flat we'd see headlines along the lines: "Shape of the Planets; both sides have t Hitler has a point".point"". For years I've thought that if we'd had our current media crop in the thirties we would read articles saying: "Jews are being persecuted but Hitler has a point". We no longer have anyone in the media that might ask :"Sir, have you no shame?"
1
Another Florina lie: marijuana killed her stepdaughter.
3
Mr. Krugman, thank you for giving credit to Donald Trump in terms of his understanding of the economy. Mr Trump is his own worst enemy with his sophomoric comments that belittle his fellow candidates, but beneath these attacks is a man who has substance. He understands the economy, seems to understand that pointless wars are a drain on a countries resources. He is not trigger happy or God fearing. He actually is a quite reasonable man, let's hope he stays reasonable.
1
"Who will tell the people?"
Unfortunately not the NYT. Yesterday Jeremy Peters told us she was "Steely" "self assured" had "startling candor" and that her "detailed answers will help to steer away from personality and celebrity back toward substance".
Unfortunately, Mr. Peters cannot tell the difference between substance and lies.
Unfortunately not the NYT. Yesterday Jeremy Peters told us she was "Steely" "self assured" had "startling candor" and that her "detailed answers will help to steer away from personality and celebrity back toward substance".
Unfortunately, Mr. Peters cannot tell the difference between substance and lies.
2
Krugman: As I wrote at the time, if Mr. Bush said the earth was flat, we’d see headlines along the lines of "Shape of the Planet: Both Sides Have a Point."
Yes, this is scary! We have a news media, and have had one for some time, that routinely provides us with little more than a recording of what the candidates say, passing it along to the public as rational political discourse without challenging any of the fact-free assertions.
Am confident that membership in the "Flat Earth Society" must be growing.
Yes, this is scary! We have a news media, and have had one for some time, that routinely provides us with little more than a recording of what the candidates say, passing it along to the public as rational political discourse without challenging any of the fact-free assertions.
Am confident that membership in the "Flat Earth Society" must be growing.
2
'....But who will tell the people?'
You just did, professor. Problem is 'the people' just aren't listening, or are too stupid to understand. Either way, America loses.
Its especially bad here in Texas, and gets worse, the farther East you go. (and North ain't so hot, either)
You just did, professor. Problem is 'the people' just aren't listening, or are too stupid to understand. Either way, America loses.
Its especially bad here in Texas, and gets worse, the farther East you go. (and North ain't so hot, either)
3
The GOP handlers are starting to get desperate, needing to control the White House. Not only do they need more, more, and more money, they need to start another war of choice. That is their proven way to find the next generations GOP leaders, from the dead beats that don't want to serve in our military.
2
Just look at the NY Times story about Carly Fiorina today. Look at the headline, "Fiorina Exaggerates Anti-Abortion Footage". Does that describe what she did? If the NY Times is going to soften a misrepresentation to an exaggeration, who will tell the people?
3
Dr. Paul, you're doing a fine job of enlightening the people (who read) about the fantasies, fictions, mendacity and agitprop that the 15 Republican wannabe candidates for POTUS are exhibiting in their reality show which is a remake of "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest" in 1975. And yes, we - who read and believe what you are saying - are terrified that the goblins of the Tea Party will get us, as the chief Goblin, JEB!'s brother GWBush got us and buried us in this deep hole from 2000 - 2008. No facts, just lies,tripped off the tongues of the ranting declared candidates. All of them were sowing fantasies as Big Agro and Big Chem and Big Food sow fertilizer to genetically manage the foods we eat. Vile. No need to pick apart the ball of worms that were the false assertions of all of the candidates in The Gipper's Simi Valley Library, in front of old Air Force One. Tier One and in the dismissed "second tier" of the GOP "under" debate an hour preceding the real CNN Dance With The Stars Event. Are the holi polloi rich enough today to be able to afford Cable-TV? - and what about the millions of the poor unmentioned victims of racial and income inequality who inhabit our country in the millions and who don't have the dough to buy Cable TV and watch the terrifying goings-on presented by CNN and the Conservative Republican party? Mendacity is the key to understanding these Looney Tunes GOP debaters. Woe is all of us if any of the Republicans vying for the Presidency is elected.
Dear Mr. Krugman, as long as people like yourself continue to address these issues, people like myself will continue to get educated on them and pass on the light. Think you Sir, for your great contribution to the public discourse and the truth.
3
This is Gameshow TV of the worst kind: Jersey Shores meets the Kardashians. No one, least of all the media, cares about truth and merit. It's just pandering to the lowest level on inane viewer, which are, apparently especially Republicans, in the majority.
1
I briefly listened while driving to Sirius Radio's MSNBC channel and heard Joe Scarborough basically doing campaign commercials for Jeb Bush and Carly Fiorina about how "wonderful" they are and "what strong, tough leaders they would be." To think his show is being expanded for him to this for 4 hours Monday through Friday every week for the next 14 months. So much for the "liberal" MSNBC telling folks that the Republicans are a bunch of lying grifters.
As for why Republicans remain passionately committed to tax cuts for the rich, well, that is who they are and identify with. The Koch brothers have a net worth of near $80 billion and annual incomes in the billions. A radical tax cut would pay back all their campaign contributions in one year; after that, it is all profit. Getting rid of the estate tax means that a savings of tens of billions and helps them advance their agenda of "neo-feudalism" (we might as well name Charles, Duke of Kansas, and David as the Marquess of the Hampshires.)
As for why Republicans remain passionately committed to tax cuts for the rich, well, that is who they are and identify with. The Koch brothers have a net worth of near $80 billion and annual incomes in the billions. A radical tax cut would pay back all their campaign contributions in one year; after that, it is all profit. Getting rid of the estate tax means that a savings of tens of billions and helps them advance their agenda of "neo-feudalism" (we might as well name Charles, Duke of Kansas, and David as the Marquess of the Hampshires.)
3
Do not count on cable "news networks" to correct the candidates. They are more interested in running a political version of the Jerry Springer Show because that is what drives up ratings and produces higher rates for ads run on their network.
1
We have to remember that these Republican candidates are following, not leading when they make their assertions. Each one is attempting to snag a Republican base that is (or at least they assume it is) not only more conservative than the rest of the nation, but more wedded to ill-informed and often ridiculous notions about all sorts of things: that our military is weak (when it remains the largest and best funded in the world), that we are still being overrun by a massive wave of illigal Mexican immigrants (when ingress and egress of new illegal immigrants became balanced at net zero back in 2011), that China is our new "enemy" and any cooperation with them is capitulation, that the president is a Muslim, that our Founding Fathers meant for the U.S. to be run on Bible principles, that our economy is failing and that the reason we don't have enough jobs and better pay for workers is the fault of socialistic unions and government spending and the cure for it is to tax the rich less so they spend and invest more. These candidates are not only pandering to this right-wing mythology, I'm afraid that those candidates who have made the cut so far are the ones who actually buy into it (Trump may be the least so, since he will obviously say whatever he thinks will play best with the crowd, whether he believes it or not).
1
The people want the lies because the lies are consistent with their beliefs, which is why Fox News does so well. There always needs to be an enemy. If there were no lies, then Obama isn't the enemy. And they really need Obama and the Federal Government to be the enemy.
We also never learn from the past. Which is why all of these neocons once again want to fight more wars and claim they can lower taxes and deficits at the same time. And people believe them even though we've been through this before.
They make the case that we're far worse off than we were at the end of Bush's term. The Dow was 8776 on 12/31/2008 and even with recent losses, it's 16,500 today. Unemployment is lower. American troops aren't dying in Afghanistan and Iraq. Millions have health care who didn't have it then. But people don't care about facts. They care only about their preconceived notions and view of the world.
Unfortunately, politics has become such an incredibly disgusting enterprise in which there are no winners, because even if one wins office, the press will rip you apart for every triviality, that no one decent wants to run for office. How is it that we think it's okay that the frontrunner for the highest office in the land has never held elective office. You don't jump from the mailroom to the CEO's office in business and you shouldn't jump from having absolutely no experience to the POTUS without being in Congress or having been a governor or mayor first.
We also never learn from the past. Which is why all of these neocons once again want to fight more wars and claim they can lower taxes and deficits at the same time. And people believe them even though we've been through this before.
They make the case that we're far worse off than we were at the end of Bush's term. The Dow was 8776 on 12/31/2008 and even with recent losses, it's 16,500 today. Unemployment is lower. American troops aren't dying in Afghanistan and Iraq. Millions have health care who didn't have it then. But people don't care about facts. They care only about their preconceived notions and view of the world.
Unfortunately, politics has become such an incredibly disgusting enterprise in which there are no winners, because even if one wins office, the press will rip you apart for every triviality, that no one decent wants to run for office. How is it that we think it's okay that the frontrunner for the highest office in the land has never held elective office. You don't jump from the mailroom to the CEO's office in business and you shouldn't jump from having absolutely no experience to the POTUS without being in Congress or having been a governor or mayor first.
2
"Think about it. Bill Clinton’s tax hike was followed by a huge economic boom, the George W. Bush tax cuts by a weak recovery that ended in financial collapse."
Selective memories. Reagan's tax cuts created the 80s boom and Clinton's tax 1993 increases, which he later regretted, were not enough to kill it. Obama's doubling of the national debt has contributed much to today's moribund economy. So much for "Hope and Change."
Selective memories. Reagan's tax cuts created the 80s boom and Clinton's tax 1993 increases, which he later regretted, were not enough to kill it. Obama's doubling of the national debt has contributed much to today's moribund economy. So much for "Hope and Change."
When you start from a bust that you created (unlike Pres. Obama, who didn't) it is easy to create a boom. Taking credit for it, however, takes big dollops of chutzpah. Pres. Reagan managed to get the unemployment rate up nearly to the teens after two years in the White House. Things were bad when Pres. Carter left office, but they just got worse under Mr. Reagan. That must have been fun for all those millions who became unemployed. From that point almost anything would have been better than what had come before and Americans swallowed that recovery nonsense hook, line and sinker and gave the president a resounding victory in 1984. That reconfirmation of support for Mr. Reagan's Hollywood fantasy world of economics (over an admittedly incompetent candidacy of Walter Mondale) has led to this mess of a Republican Party on economics today. Anyone who has ever owned stock whose price was tanking for several years, resulting in, say, a 70% loss on one's investment, is hardly impressed when management gloats about how it increased the price of the stock by 30% from its low. How 'bout preventing the 70% drop in the first place if you're so valuable to the company, if you have such special skills, as you claim? Ms. Fiorina? How 'bout it?
I am worried that we are about to become some kind of evangelical theocracy, fueled by big business interests. While the Republicans grab all the media attention, where are the Democrats? The news media ignores Bernie Sanders, and Hillary Clinton is keeping a low profile because of "servergate". The Democrats need to start generating some positive noise that garners media attention. They need to go on the offensive. Call the Republicans on the lies, and tell the truth - loudly. Hillary should stop apologizing and assert that her private server was not unusual for a Secretary of State and that emails were not classified at the time she sent them and repeat it at every opportunity.
Bernie Sanders needs to somehow educate the public that the term socialist Democrat does not equal some kind of evil communistic intent. It is that one adjective that is holding him back. He is the candidate I most admire, and truly wish could win the Democratic nomination, and the election. However, in practicality unless there is a miracle, that one adjective will defeat Bernie. The thought of one of the Republican contenders actually winning the Presidency is one too awful to contemplate, so in the end, I think Hillary Clinton will be the one I will have to support. She has brains, she has political clout, and she has experience on the world stage. Could she bring Sanders on board as VP? Don't know at this point. It could be a bridge for him to attain the Presidency later.
Bernie Sanders needs to somehow educate the public that the term socialist Democrat does not equal some kind of evil communistic intent. It is that one adjective that is holding him back. He is the candidate I most admire, and truly wish could win the Democratic nomination, and the election. However, in practicality unless there is a miracle, that one adjective will defeat Bernie. The thought of one of the Republican contenders actually winning the Presidency is one too awful to contemplate, so in the end, I think Hillary Clinton will be the one I will have to support. She has brains, she has political clout, and she has experience on the world stage. Could she bring Sanders on board as VP? Don't know at this point. It could be a bridge for him to attain the Presidency later.
4
Yes. Talk about "the elephant in the room". Where are the donkeys? I know they are out there campaigning in front of 5,000 people at a time, but these Republicans were out there last night campaigning in front of 23,000,000 at a time. It almost seems at this point like this election is about who will become the Republican nominee, and by default, president. Let this go on much longer and that seemingly ridiculous scenario could come to pass. It's true the campaign is insanely long, but that needs to be dealt with at another time. You don't unilaterally cede all the attention to the other party for months on end and let the other side determine the issues and direction of the debate all by itself.
Everyone concurs that this situation is incurable within the United States, especially now that the Supreme Court is so indebted to the ultra-Right, and not just in campaign regulatory law. Hence the infuriating genius of Obama's resort to the rest of the world, to delimit domestic insanity. That model is one which Mrs Clinton promises to flout, still battling her rejection in 2008; but the rest of the world can be a vital counterweight to this nation's gruesome stupidities. We need a successor to Obama who's invested in this model, and there is one. Biden.
2
It doesn't matter what they're motivations/delusions are. No sane, rational person would say, much less double down on these fantasy stories that support their fantasy histories and fantasy values.
The biggest question I have is who could seriously support the candidacies of these demented people? That's got to be a special brand of crazy thinking.
The biggest question I have is who could seriously support the candidacies of these demented people? That's got to be a special brand of crazy thinking.
4
"Think about it. Bill Clinton’s tax hike was followed by a huge economic boom, the George W. Bush tax cuts by a weak recovery that ended in financial collapse. The tax increase of 2013 and the coming of Obamacare in 2014 were associated with the best job growth since the 1990s."
Complete and utter revisionist mythology.
The last prosperity began in 1983 after the Reagan tax and regulatory reforms and starting the trend of deunionization by firing the illegally striking air traffic controllers, and lasted until 2007.
Economic growth slowed for a time after the Clinton tax increases and the amount of revenue was half that projected by CBO. The economy took off again when Clinton and Gingrich agreed to cut the growth of government spending below that of GDP growth and cut the size of government as a percentage of GDP to its smallest level in a generation.
The economy slowed again after the dot.com bubble burst in 2000. Bush was finally able to enact a cut in income tax rates in 2003, the economy surged through 2007 and we returned to close to full employment.
The 2008 recession was caused by the mass default of the government directed and subsidized subprime home mortgage market in 2007.
The Obama taxing, borrowing, spending, money printing and mass regulating policies turned what should have been a normal business cycle recovery into an economic depression with GDP growth lower than the Great Depression and a falling percentage of Americans in the work force.
Complete and utter revisionist mythology.
The last prosperity began in 1983 after the Reagan tax and regulatory reforms and starting the trend of deunionization by firing the illegally striking air traffic controllers, and lasted until 2007.
Economic growth slowed for a time after the Clinton tax increases and the amount of revenue was half that projected by CBO. The economy took off again when Clinton and Gingrich agreed to cut the growth of government spending below that of GDP growth and cut the size of government as a percentage of GDP to its smallest level in a generation.
The economy slowed again after the dot.com bubble burst in 2000. Bush was finally able to enact a cut in income tax rates in 2003, the economy surged through 2007 and we returned to close to full employment.
The 2008 recession was caused by the mass default of the government directed and subsidized subprime home mortgage market in 2007.
The Obama taxing, borrowing, spending, money printing and mass regulating policies turned what should have been a normal business cycle recovery into an economic depression with GDP growth lower than the Great Depression and a falling percentage of Americans in the work force.
2
Talk about revisionist fantasy, sheesh. And I notice how the California vs. Kansas comparison is glossed over as well.
As for the St. Reagan nonsense, just look at how he exploded the debt and he totally benefited from the fact the Soviet Bloc was already crumbling, he just had the luck of timing.
As a simple reading of the chart below, Reagan and both Bushes left office with higher unemployment then Clinton and what Obama is on trend for.
As for the St. Reagan nonsense, just look at how he exploded the debt and he totally benefited from the fact the Soviet Bloc was already crumbling, he just had the luck of timing.
As a simple reading of the chart below, Reagan and both Bushes left office with higher unemployment then Clinton and what Obama is on trend for.
here is the chart --http://historyinpieces.com/research/us-unemployment-rates-president
Dr. Krugman well knows that it takes 8-10 years for economic policies of a government to show the effects of the change.
How is it that he ignores the history of economics in his attempt to paint all of those with whom he disagrees in an unfavorable light?
Seems to me that he is picking the wrong cherries with his efforts to condemn his opposition...
I wonder why?
How is it that he ignores the history of economics in his attempt to paint all of those with whom he disagrees in an unfavorable light?
Seems to me that he is picking the wrong cherries with his efforts to condemn his opposition...
I wonder why?
These people aren't interested in facts or good policies. They are interested in winning power, pure and simple, and then using that power for their own (and their financial supporters) benefit. They will say anything to be elected. Unfortunately, the public does not hold politicians responsible for factually wrong statements, or at least not enough of them do. Consequently, these Republican politicians see no disincentive to lying or making facts up (which is an extreme form of lying).
Is it really any different than what most advertisers 'promise' in their ads? Many Americans love to be conned. They would rather be told a fanciful lie that uplifts them for a moment than be told the truth about a situation (or the economy). Every politician learns that quickly in their career. It's like going to circus when you were a child or watching a magician. You know it's not true, but you are entertained for a moment. Sadly, that's politics.
Is it really any different than what most advertisers 'promise' in their ads? Many Americans love to be conned. They would rather be told a fanciful lie that uplifts them for a moment than be told the truth about a situation (or the economy). Every politician learns that quickly in their career. It's like going to circus when you were a child or watching a magician. You know it's not true, but you are entertained for a moment. Sadly, that's politics.
4
I agree and disagree on pols being held accountable. Trump's rise is fueled fundamentally by people upset at no one in Washington seeming to come through with their promises, and frankly, particularly the Republican Party establishment, which, if we look at Sen. Graham's level of support, for example, is being held accountable. Anyone know a grassroots Republican who loves Speaker Boehner? After decades of making empty promises, Republican leadership continues to promise constitutional amendments on flag burning, abortion, same-sex marriage, plus repeal of the ACA, among others, that it knows it can't succeed in achieving today or in 2017 and beyond. The odd thing is that Mr. Trump makes promises even more unrealistic than those and is getting so much support, mainly because no one else in the GOP wants to expose his promises as pipe dreams (pipe nightmares, I would argue) for fear that their own will be exposed as such. When will the rank and file supporters of the Republican Party learn that there is apparently no leader in the party willing to talk facts and logic to them, to promise them not their dreams, but something achievable? I fear the answer is never, That is bad not just for those people being misled but for the whole country.
Actually i was until about 2 years ago a republican since 1964 supporting goldwater and chartering YAF at Lehigh University I ran for the US congress in 1978 as a Republican endorsed by the conservative party in NY after which I consulted on about 100 political campaings and was the Republican on air commentator for cablevision news 12 Westchester for over 20 years On seeing the rise of the tea party and the continued harang by Republicans of supply side economics ( which was a policy even I embraced in 1978 along with an endorsement from Jack Kemp)I realized that unlike 1978 where there had only been a theory of what would happen if taxes were cut experience since has demonstrated that even if cuttin tax rates from 90 to 60 and then from 60 to 38 produced growth there comes a point in time where lowering rates even further does not increase revenue nor does it stimulate the economy to grow.All it does is enhance the amount the super rich can save and it deprives govt of the very basic revenues that allow it to do things like national defense and infrastructure repair and that is unacceptable as a national economic policy.But Republicans keep trying to convince us that Art Laffer was right. he was not. And so this Republican left the Party voted for Obama because Palin was dangerous moved to florida where my vote will count in 2016 and where I will not vote for voodoo economic policy (see the Kansas experiment and the Bush depression)
6
What the GOP candidates say does not need to reflect reality. It needs to reflect and reinforce what their base voters 'know'. There is no climate change, Planned Parenthood kills babies and sells their parts, with a big military we can force countries to submit to our demands, Christians are under attack, illegal immigrants are over running the country, tax breaks for the wealthy increases jobs, ... The GOP candidates most likely really don't care or even want to know if what they are saying is true, they just needed to say it to get votes. Truth or fiction, I can assure you that what the GOP candidates say will be taken as fact if it conforms to what their voters 'know'.
3
The Republicans are crazy. Hillary, while she would probably be a safe and competent President, is a flawed candidate with baggage. In the end, an admitted socialist cannot be elected. All this has been well known for some time. Yet internet betting odds give the Republicans 44% implied probability of winning. As a country, we shouldn't be essentially flipping a coin when the stakes are this high. The Dems could/should have done better. Perhaps they still can?
3
"In the end, an admitted socialist cannot be elected."
See Britain.
See Britain.
You will tell the people, Mr. Krugman. Your columns are a beacon of reason. They're a good counterpoint to the candidates' fantasies, if people will take a moment to review the evidence.
3
The candidates won't stop lying until the media, all of it, start doing their job to call them out on their lies and follow through with aggressive questioning when they refuse to acknowledge their dissembling. I am waiting for the Dems to jump in the fray. There is much material from the debates to exploit. I wish Hillary would ( and I am a Bernie Supporter but I know he does not believe in attacking other candidates) would answer Jeb!'s outrageous assertion that his brother kept us safe with this salvo: " If your brother had kept us safe he wouldn't have been standing on a pile of rubble"
2
Maybe it's time to reconsider the two-term limit...
Speaking for the falsehoods spouting from the twisted minds of the GOP candidates, Prof. Krugman didn't mention Trump's absurd anti-vaccine claim that they cause autism.
2
Facts and truth from a GOP debate? Anyone watching these media circus's is hoping for a few laughs at best. There is no truth in today's government and certainly nothing to be learned from trailers of the next bank and wall street production of "America Bought and Sold As They All Watched TV."
3
What a scene! A row of identical blue suits & one dress lined up to tell as many lies as they could, each one bigger & better than the last; and the prize goes to the white guy behind door number three! (Ok Carson was wearing a grey suit) Absolutely the best moment was Fiorina telling the dt that every woman in America knew what he was "saying" when he put down her looks. Then jb confessed to smoking pot...omg what will mom think! Shame on CNN for their shallow questions & for not calling out or challenging what the "moderators" should've known were lies...especially when dt said the expulsion of 11m people would be done humanely. I'm trying to maintain my sense of humor, but really how dumb do those suits think we are?
2
If you like your health insurance policy, you can keep your health insurance policy. If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. Oh, and the $800 billion stimulus plan will create millions of shovel-ready jobs. And the attack in Benghazi was the result of an anti-Muslim video.
If they are simply shallow opportunists who say what they are coached, who don't know what they're saying is wrong...that's bad enough. If they are smart enough to know what they're saying is wrong and just plunge ahead to say it anyway to wind up the audience, that's horrifying. Fiorina preparing military exercises on Russia's border? Christie insisting Social Security has been cheating and lying to Americans? Jeb saying his brother's policies kept the country safe? Rubio reminding the audience that America is not a planet?
3
Yes, Pres. Bush kept us safe. (Personally did that all by himself, really? Then so has Pres. Obama, of course. I'm waiting to hear your cheers for Mr. Obama's accomplishment in that area, Republican candidates. Still waiting.) Funny, how that applies AFTER 9/11 only, not before or on 9/11. Somehow Brother Bush forgot to mention all that hadn't been done to protect the country from January 20, 2001 to September 11. His brother also did a great job protecting the thousands of American servicemen and women died while he was playing Risk with their lives in a military command center in the White House during his war of choice. I'll admit I can't say Pres. Bush was out there churning up the Gulf of Mexico before Hurricane Katrina, of course, but boy what a job he did protecting American lives in that situation! Wow! If we could only have eight more years of leadership like that!
>>>Oh, and if her life is a story of going from “secretary to C.E.O.,” mine is one of going from mailman to columnist and economist.
I went to Gunn High School in Palo Alto when Fiorina, then known as Carleton Sneed, was there. Her father was a well respected judge on the 9th Circuit, so I doubt she ever suffered any privations.
I went to Gunn High School in Palo Alto when Fiorina, then known as Carleton Sneed, was there. Her father was a well respected judge on the 9th Circuit, so I doubt she ever suffered any privations.
5
Has she claimed otherwise?
Did you ever understand how difficult it was for Fiorina to rise to the rank if CEO of a world-scale technology company?
Not an easy road, I assure you.
Did you ever understand how difficult it was for Fiorina to rise to the rank if CEO of a world-scale technology company?
Not an easy road, I assure you.
None of the 17 GOP candidates are fit for any office, let alone POTUS. And shame on CNN for allowing glaring lies to be uttered with no follow ups to ask why the need to lie.
2
Yes, and today our illustrious "conservative" lawmakers are once again wasting our money by threatening to shut down OUR government over funding of Planned Parenthood and trying to pass more anti-abortion legislation. Who do these fools represent? Not the vast majority of Americans - men and women - who believe government should not be allowed to interfere in a woman's right to choose what she does with her own body and life. The cavemen have taken over OUR governments at all levels and WE must send them back to their caves in every election for the next 100 years to purge their ideas from OUR society. Their caves are probably in taliban country.
2
The majority of Americans are pro-life now, and it is trending towards the pro-life position in the US.
Lies play an essential role in politics, because the truth is hard to ferret out and is often unpalatable to accept - who WANTS to believe that our current consumption of fossil fuels will lead to the flooding of our costal cities, and massive forest fires inland? In a democracy, lies are disseminated via the channels of mass communication. The voting public is kept so busy trying to keep their jobs and do their work that they have little time to educate themselves on complex issues, and they are not sufficiently educated to do so in any case. The most disturbing allegation I heard recently is that the Trilateral Commission - a club for corporate leaders and high-level government officials - decided in the 1970's that the U.S. population was "overeducated" and needed to be trained in a more vocational direction. If true, this helps explain why our schools have declined and become more aimed at producing docile workers for the labor force, while college has been made outlandishly expensive. These aren't simply the result of the stupidity of the American voter, but the CAUSE of popular support for political policies based on lies, and contrary to the voters' own interests - as for instance in tax policy. There really IS a plot to subvert democratic equality in our great nation. Only truth-telling like Trump's and Bernie Sanders' can help us see through the smoke-screen of lies that our leaders have deliberately laid down.
2
I mainly lived in a college town for most of my life and even though it is in Oklahoma the people were pretty well educated. But then I moved to a town of less than 5,000. Mr. Krugman asks, "Who will tell the people?" Here in small-town land it's Fox News who tells the people. Most of the people here not only never went to college, they're suspicious of people who do. Thirty-three percent of the girls are pregnant before they finish high school and the local newspaper brags that that's lower than the state average. People are too busy with their many kids, and their alcoholism, and their drug use, and their religious fanaticism to pay attention to the news. They vote Republican because their preachers tell them to.
5
Do you have any factual evidence that the people in your community vote Republican because their preachers tell them to do so?
Please, Lina, be very specific in you response.
Otherwise, you might well be considered amongst the elite of the vast, right-wing conspiracy movement.
Please, Lina, be very specific in you response.
Otherwise, you might well be considered amongst the elite of the vast, right-wing conspiracy movement.
Dr. Krugman says "The only candidate talking sense about economics was Donald Trump". Yes, the way I see it, that's because he's the only one not under (or less under) the yoke of the plutocratic oligarchy & forced to say only what they permit. And he can do that because he's so wealthy - he doesn't NEED their money. Ironically, at the other end of the political spectrum, Bernie Sanders is also able to more or less say what he actually thinks because he is similarly not under the yoke of the plutocracy, in his case because he's decided not to take money from the super-rich at the price of being in their debt & under their control.
I believe the reason behind the unexpected, surprising surge in voter approval for these two candidates is because voters sense that Trump & Sanders are the only candidates who are to some degree authentic. In our post-democratic plutocratic form of government, that's the only way candidates can speak their minds -- you have to be very rich or refuse entirely to be paid off.
I believe the reason behind the unexpected, surprising surge in voter approval for these two candidates is because voters sense that Trump & Sanders are the only candidates who are to some degree authentic. In our post-democratic plutocratic form of government, that's the only way candidates can speak their minds -- you have to be very rich or refuse entirely to be paid off.
5
Has there ever been a man or woman running for president who has not stretched the truth whether it be on their own record and or accomplishments? Today we have misinterpretations, exaggerations, and flat out lies on both sides. I've always felt the elected candidate gains an entirely different perspective on the burdens of the office, the country and the world and the problems of each once inside the oval office. Whether this new perspective changes the mind and heart of the new president is quite telling. But the pursuit of the office itself is such an ego driven journey that I doubt it does for most.
1
Actually, Dr. Krugman, it's worse than that. This is not about the economy, immigration, foreign affairs, or healthcare. This is about winning, period. We are witnessing a reality TV show made in the form of a Presidential nomination process. The winner must be ruthless in his or her pursuit of the prize. Pandering to the basest cravings of the audience will keep you from being voted off the island. Personal insults, lies, and general mean-spiritedness, all wrapped in the guise of the feisty iconoclast, plays best to the audience. And the reality show's "producers" (FOX and CNN news so far, with others to follow) will do their best to make sure that everything is arranged to create maximal drama and conflict.
Is it any wonder that the one who is most experienced in the genre is winning?
Is it any wonder that the one who is most experienced in the genre is winning?
3
It is going to be very difficult to become very excited about the upcoming presidential election. As a conservative, I am disappointed that the Republicans have not come up with a better prospect. Quantity does not translate into quality. As for the Democrats, I believe that Hillary has little chance to be elected, not for any lack of qualifications, but because so many people just don't like her. Mr. Sanders is very likeable and is also highly qualified for the office. However, and I can say this because I am the same age as him, at 74 he is too old. I am in excellent health and worked a 10 hour day at the pharmacy yesterday, but now I have to nap all day in order to function properly again. This was not the case just 5 years ago.....We can only hope that a new Teddy Roosevelt or Truman or Reagan will make an appearance soon.
45
Reagan!? God help us all.
How on earth could you get Reagan into the same bag you put Teddy and Harry. You better go back to bed.
Thanks to all those who ave commented on the political agenda of the Republicans during the past depute. They all seemed to be saying pretty much the same thing so no one stood out except for Fiorina because she wore a dress. I liked the dress.
But my issue is with the questions posed to many of the candidates. They encouraged silly and petty conflict when I was looking for policy issues. Questions that started with so and so said this about what you said or how you look detracted from the debate. I wanted to hear about what the candidates thought about serious issues facing our nation. If I wanted to see a "Punch and Judy show" I'd turn on the cartoon network.
But my issue is with the questions posed to many of the candidates. They encouraged silly and petty conflict when I was looking for policy issues. Questions that started with so and so said this about what you said or how you look detracted from the debate. I wanted to hear about what the candidates thought about serious issues facing our nation. If I wanted to see a "Punch and Judy show" I'd turn on the cartoon network.
The policies of Paul Krugman presuppose that more spending is a positive, that government is a good manager and allocator of capital, that government programs have worked on budget, on time and to predicted effect, that more taxes are positive, and that if all of these things occurred, we would be living the life of Riley. Actually, all of these things have happened. Let's review the last generation+, government spending has balloon in both absolute and as a % of GDP from low 30% of GDP to 42% of GDP. Government entitlement spending has massively increased and been consistently wrong from the outset of these programs. Predicted expenditures on wars have been completely wrong. Stimulus has been massive ignoring the trillion $ deficits, the treasury as injected >$2T into the system. Since Reagan, taxes have become MORE not less progressive. Since 1986, tax rates have moved from 28% to 40% for ordinary income. We increased real spending on K12 education by 2x with no increase in outcomes.
To double down on this strategy of more government, more spending, and greater deficits makes no sense.
To double down on this strategy of more government, more spending, and greater deficits makes no sense.
1
You do realize we print money? It's value exists between our ears? We cannot eat drink breathe money? When I learned to drive gas was 29¢ bread 20¢ a loaf brand new shiny car $2,000 first house $14,000. Money is nothing more than a convenience. Adoration of money an obscenity.
Your numbers are wrong.
"government spending has balloon in both absolute and as a % of GDP from low 30% of GDP to 42% of GDP"
US GDP as of end of 2014 was 16.8 billion dollars. US federal spending for fiscal year 2014 was 3.5 billion dollars. So that gives a ratio of roughly 20%. It never reached even 30% of GDP in US history, let alone 42%.
"government spending has balloon in both absolute and as a % of GDP from low 30% of GDP to 42% of GDP"
US GDP as of end of 2014 was 16.8 billion dollars. US federal spending for fiscal year 2014 was 3.5 billion dollars. So that gives a ratio of roughly 20%. It never reached even 30% of GDP in US history, let alone 42%.
State, federal and local
Did you miss the Chris Christie line about standing up for the 55 year-old construction worker?
The same Chris Christie who stopped the ARC tunnel, at the time the largest infrastructure project in the country. He used the funds to shadow finance the NJ highway trust fund (as well as having to pay the Feds back for part of their investment in the tunnel, which was well underway.)
Now Christie teams up with Cuomo to say the two states will ante up (somehow) for half of a new tunnel but the Feds will have to pay the rest.
Leadership at its finest.
The same Chris Christie who stopped the ARC tunnel, at the time the largest infrastructure project in the country. He used the funds to shadow finance the NJ highway trust fund (as well as having to pay the Feds back for part of their investment in the tunnel, which was well underway.)
Now Christie teams up with Cuomo to say the two states will ante up (somehow) for half of a new tunnel but the Feds will have to pay the rest.
Leadership at its finest.
5
Where is the media, say Jake Tapper, calling the candidates out on this
propagation of lies? Why doesn't the media challenge Christie on his lie
and his abysmal record as governor? How about Jindal's awful record
as governor? Let's not forget Huckabee and his claim that refugees are
fleeing Syria because America has cable tv.
The media needs to play it's role as the Fourth Estate, not as profit
centers for their corporate owners.
propagation of lies? Why doesn't the media challenge Christie on his lie
and his abysmal record as governor? How about Jindal's awful record
as governor? Let's not forget Huckabee and his claim that refugees are
fleeing Syria because America has cable tv.
The media needs to play it's role as the Fourth Estate, not as profit
centers for their corporate owners.
3
Somebody has to tell the people or it will just get worse and worse, Dr. Krugman.
But will they listen? Will their attention expand beyond Twitter word bites?
Three hours of the 'debate' seemed like three days in a madhouse.
But will they listen? Will their attention expand beyond Twitter word bites?
Three hours of the 'debate' seemed like three days in a madhouse.
5
It's about time that NYT and Mr. Krugman have become scared.
No, both sides do not have a point and the "evenhanded" reporting policy of 2000 should be history. When possible future leaders of the US spout lies, they must be reported as lies.
No, both sides do not have a point and the "evenhanded" reporting policy of 2000 should be history. When possible future leaders of the US spout lies, they must be reported as lies.
1
When will Paul Krugman report about the fantasies and fictions of the Democrat candidates? Oh wait, he'll never do that, as he's an obedient servant of the left and sees no fault in its stars.
1
Thank you for posting a link to the White House announcement dated December 7, 2001 that states that "the President Intends to nominate" Christie as US Attorney for the District of New Jersey.
I would love to see someome confront Christie on the blatant lie that he stated on televison on Wednesday that he became US Attorney on September 10, 2001, the day before 9/11. When he then argues, a copy of the announcement should be proffered.
This man meeds to be, as Jeb! might have put it, "smoked out."
I would love to see someome confront Christie on the blatant lie that he stated on televison on Wednesday that he became US Attorney on September 10, 2001, the day before 9/11. When he then argues, a copy of the announcement should be proffered.
This man meeds to be, as Jeb! might have put it, "smoked out."
2
Christie stated he was named on Sept. 10th, because he received a call from the White House telling him that. It was not a lie.
I would hope you and others would tell the people. I recall the 2000 election all too well. I guess it got ratings points for the networks and they don't give a damn about the consequences to the country. This nonsense that there are 2 sides to every story made me sick of watching and reading most mainstream. Talk to your brothers and sisters of the press. Or did they do well under W's disasters and, like you said, press has to be even handed even when someone is a liar. That word is in the dictionary for a reason and if a politician is one, time to use it.
Here we go again - the Socialist Democrats who believe we're all better off when the government steals from those of us who earn a living and provide jobs for people so the elitists can redistribute the goodies to those who don't. Look where this idiotic progressive idea has gotten us - 19 trillion in debt and counting. Oh! That's right Mr. Krugman, debt doesn't matter when you can print your way to prosperity. Open your eyes people - the Marxist ideas of equal outcomes are sinking the boat that floats all of us.
Were you attempting to see how many Randian buzz words you could cram into a single paragraph? Well done.
Krugman's being a downer. I was greatly entertained by Donald Trump's reality show. I hope the whole season is available on Netflix.
5
They were all lying, but Carly is the most articulate, assertive, sharp-witted liar. She'll make a good candidate, but a terrifying President.
But is she were to debate Hilary, the contrast would make Clinton look like a combination of Einstein, Lincoln, and Old Mother Hubbard.
But is she were to debate Hilary, the contrast would make Clinton look like a combination of Einstein, Lincoln, and Old Mother Hubbard.
2
Yes Paul, and while you're at it what about the claims of Scott Walker that he's created a economic miracle in Wisconsin rather than the disaster The Donald alleged? Like you I am "terrified" by the jingoist "red bait" and war flags being waved by clearly inept, little men and one woman, with, as you note only Rand Paul, who later committed medical malpractice regarding Dr. Trump's medical advice about vaccines and autism, sounding sane. Perhaps it is my Jewish Holocaust roots that made me think I was watching a rally in 1930's Nuremberg rather than 21st century America to which my father and grandfathers had fled to avoid the strident religious repression, advocating the primacy of Christian Sharia law over that of the Supreme Court, spewing from the mouths of all the candidates. As a psychologist, I hope the voters will realize that when candidates live in world of such dark and dangerous "fantasies" that they lack the mental stability for any elected office, especially one where you have access to nuclear weapons.
5
"Who will tell the people?" A prominent social scientist once remarked most people's thinking going like this: "Makes sense, stop."
Hopefully Red states like Kansas and Mississippi will be pushed far enough to push back like the minimum wage movement. If not they can always pray.
Hopefully Red states like Kansas and Mississippi will be pushed far enough to push back like the minimum wage movement. If not they can always pray.
After the Republican debate, Democrats asked which Republican was "most scary?" I answered it was Carly Fiorina. My reasoning was not because what she said about planned parenthood, which was most persuasive, though false, but because she told John Harwood her tax-cut plan wasn't revenue neutral but revenue "reducing" to force Congress to spend less. She, however, wanted to spend more money on drug treatment (her daughter died of drug-overdose), in addition to the standard Republican line of greatly hiking defense spending.
When Jeb Bush introduced his tax-cut plan earlier, with an estimated reduction in revenue of some $3.4trillion, I was disgusted with John Heilemann's comment that he was giving a "popular tax plan."
These pundits are not calling out on Republicans' tax-cut plans when the very same people were so alarmed by the rising national debt.
As PK says, and as Warren Buffett said, the only Republican plan, which made sense or not scary was that of Donald Trump who said he would raise tax on hedge-funders and cut for middle class.
Yes middle class needs a tax-cut so badly. The best way is by reducing the payroll tax for the first $20K: on the first $10K to 1% & on second $10K to 2%. Then raise the cap at least to make up the shortfall in revenue.
I would also suggest to raise marginal tax on top 0.1% in incomes to 50% & on top 0.01% in incomes to 70%. These are painless but very beneficial and minimal tax-reforms.
When Jeb Bush introduced his tax-cut plan earlier, with an estimated reduction in revenue of some $3.4trillion, I was disgusted with John Heilemann's comment that he was giving a "popular tax plan."
These pundits are not calling out on Republicans' tax-cut plans when the very same people were so alarmed by the rising national debt.
As PK says, and as Warren Buffett said, the only Republican plan, which made sense or not scary was that of Donald Trump who said he would raise tax on hedge-funders and cut for middle class.
Yes middle class needs a tax-cut so badly. The best way is by reducing the payroll tax for the first $20K: on the first $10K to 1% & on second $10K to 2%. Then raise the cap at least to make up the shortfall in revenue.
I would also suggest to raise marginal tax on top 0.1% in incomes to 50% & on top 0.01% in incomes to 70%. These are painless but very beneficial and minimal tax-reforms.
3
Paul Krugman has made many important observations in this column, but, to me, the most significant one is that in the service of "even-handed" reporting, equal weight is often given to fact and fiction. Coupled with the propagandists' tool of using visceral imagery to bypass rational thought and alarm our reptile brains, we have the perfect explanation for Ms, Fiorina's rant.
306
I am in complete agreement with Paul Krugman. The candidates stances on foreign policy scared me more than anything else at the debate.
There are limits to American power--the United States can't always dictate what the rest of the world should do (nor should). If not used with caution, the use of force creates more enemies than allies.
Diplomacy was almost as bad as the candidates eagerness for war. Whether we like it or not, China and Russia are major players in the world and can be avoided--only someone truly inept in the workings of foreign policy would think that we could simply ignore Vlandmir Putin and Xi Jinping.
Scariest of all though may have been the candidates simplicity--the real world does not always cleave into black and white (no shades of gray), good versus evil. Quite the contrary, it's a complicated world: e.g. Iran could would be the most logical an ally against ISIS, and Syria's Assad potentially could be as well. However, do we want to prop up a dictator leader like Assad?
Dilemmas like these are what presidents have to face and the overly-simplistic solutions offered by the candidates make it clear that none of these people--with the possible exception of John Kasich and Rand Paul--is fit to be commander in chief and manage foreign policy.
There are limits to American power--the United States can't always dictate what the rest of the world should do (nor should). If not used with caution, the use of force creates more enemies than allies.
Diplomacy was almost as bad as the candidates eagerness for war. Whether we like it or not, China and Russia are major players in the world and can be avoided--only someone truly inept in the workings of foreign policy would think that we could simply ignore Vlandmir Putin and Xi Jinping.
Scariest of all though may have been the candidates simplicity--the real world does not always cleave into black and white (no shades of gray), good versus evil. Quite the contrary, it's a complicated world: e.g. Iran could would be the most logical an ally against ISIS, and Syria's Assad potentially could be as well. However, do we want to prop up a dictator leader like Assad?
Dilemmas like these are what presidents have to face and the overly-simplistic solutions offered by the candidates make it clear that none of these people--with the possible exception of John Kasich and Rand Paul--is fit to be commander in chief and manage foreign policy.
2
Sad and scary to see that the process of deciding which person is to become, arguably, the single most powerful person on the planet is being presented as entertainment on a level similar to the level I experienced in my high school lunch room.
I was deeply concerned watching both debates of all the candidates. I remain terrified by the thought that any one of them might take the presidency. We had all better vote for sanity because none of the GOP candidates is sane. Our rights are being swept away from us and the agenda is war ahead for our young girls and boys in the military. This is a grave mistake. Sadly, as a female, Carly Florina frightens me as well. She is ferociously angry and unqualified to lead our nation and she more than any of the candidates is bent on going to war. As a woman she does not represent women's healthcare issues and legal right to choose. She blatantly lied to the audience and nation with her vile account of a baby kicking in a PP clinic. She was a terrible CEO and she'd make a catastrophic president. As for the man who is consistently ranking number one, Mr. Trump, we must discount him completely. It is an embarrassment to the position of the presidency to think he might have a chance.
If we want to move progressively forward and work on the issues that are keeping the poor poor and the middle class down we must turn to the Democrats and vote that party line. I am a staunch Bernie Sanders supporter because you know his track record and he has never waivered during his career. He is stable and poses great solutions for the middle class that is fast dwindling. He's plain speak and I like that. There is so much that was deliberately omitted from the last debate that is vital.
If we want to move progressively forward and work on the issues that are keeping the poor poor and the middle class down we must turn to the Democrats and vote that party line. I am a staunch Bernie Sanders supporter because you know his track record and he has never waivered during his career. He is stable and poses great solutions for the middle class that is fast dwindling. He's plain speak and I like that. There is so much that was deliberately omitted from the last debate that is vital.
3
I am so proud of Paul Krugman. I second every point.
Since I could only stand watching an hour, I missed Trump's good points about the economy. In the first few minutes, he mentioned our deficit as a huge problem, which was more crowd pleasing than true.
As an educated environmentalist, the attacks on Planned Parenthood were particularly stomach turning. Krugman offered a hypertext link to his source on this assertion that Carly Fiorina was lying about the footage of moving fetuses, that offered the confirming opinion of Sarah Kliff, at vox.com, who claims she watched all 12 hours.
If the Republicans want to help our country, they should consider bypassing the dirty dozen, and recruit Colin Powell.
David blogs at InvonvenientNews.wordpress.com.
Since I could only stand watching an hour, I missed Trump's good points about the economy. In the first few minutes, he mentioned our deficit as a huge problem, which was more crowd pleasing than true.
As an educated environmentalist, the attacks on Planned Parenthood were particularly stomach turning. Krugman offered a hypertext link to his source on this assertion that Carly Fiorina was lying about the footage of moving fetuses, that offered the confirming opinion of Sarah Kliff, at vox.com, who claims she watched all 12 hours.
If the Republicans want to help our country, they should consider bypassing the dirty dozen, and recruit Colin Powell.
David blogs at InvonvenientNews.wordpress.com.
3
This culture is so immersed in the idea "I can do anything" that it is becoming quite dangerous. Leader of the free world with no governing creeds, no problem. When the comparisons to junior high were made, that wasn't a joke. Adults, people who should pride themselves on serious thought and analysis are bound to 160 characters. Adults posting every minuscule second of their day on social media & acting like the teenager in the picture they falsely portray as a current version of themselves.
Ex football players, child actors, singers and soldiers competing in dance competitions is great entertainment and the hosts promoting them are congenial and this is highly needed nowadays.
But the flip side of the delusional and constant self promotion are TV anchors lying to puff their chest, being caught on camera and insisting that everyone didn't see what they just saw and getting caught in a lie anjust changing the subject. Unfortunately, the media have become carnival barkers and acquiesce. Catch someone in a lie, let them pivot to next topic and never follow up. Journalists are worse than TV hosts because you don't see Tom Bergeron or pat sajak or Ellen pretending to be anything other than entertainers. They just want to look at goofy videos, turn letters and dance with movie stars.
I would love to resurrect Tim Russert or Walter Kronkite and have them call out these people as the dangerous liars they are.
Ex football players, child actors, singers and soldiers competing in dance competitions is great entertainment and the hosts promoting them are congenial and this is highly needed nowadays.
But the flip side of the delusional and constant self promotion are TV anchors lying to puff their chest, being caught on camera and insisting that everyone didn't see what they just saw and getting caught in a lie anjust changing the subject. Unfortunately, the media have become carnival barkers and acquiesce. Catch someone in a lie, let them pivot to next topic and never follow up. Journalists are worse than TV hosts because you don't see Tom Bergeron or pat sajak or Ellen pretending to be anything other than entertainers. They just want to look at goofy videos, turn letters and dance with movie stars.
I would love to resurrect Tim Russert or Walter Kronkite and have them call out these people as the dangerous liars they are.
3
One thing that struck me watching the "debate" was how these candidates appear to believe that they can rely exclusively on money and the use of force to solve America's problems. Trouble with Putin, Iran, or North Korea? No problem. We'll just send another division and maybe a carrier-group, maybe get a few missiles ready if we have to. A national epidemic of cancer, Alzheimers and stroke threatening to destroy our lives and sink us with medical costs? No problem: we'll just declare a "war" on those diseases and throw more money at "research" (read, "the bureaucracies") that are supposed to find solutions. I can't imagine how electing any of these people to office will result in anything but a colossal train wreck.
7
Zen koan: What is the sound of an intellectual void in an echo chamber?
The answer will explain what we witnessed Wednesday evening.
The answer will explain what we witnessed Wednesday evening.
150
Ho, hum. Another NYT writer "terrified" by republicans. Another to engage in more name calling. They are starting to make The Donald look mature in comparison. Talk about liberal agitprop and deep inside the bubble! We're going to need to send in a rescue mission to save The Times's writers soon.
Is "scary" code for something? If not, it sounds downright silly to be frightened to death of people discussing topics at a debate.
Is "scary" code for something? If not, it sounds downright silly to be frightened to death of people discussing topics at a debate.
5
I'm sorry were you watching a different event than I was? There was no discussion or debating in the 3 hours. The moderators were shameful. How can you let for example Ted Cruz rant about the Iran agreement and assert things that were blatantly untrue without anyone calling him out? Why is a question about what Donald said about Carly's face allowed without any extended "discussion" of the refugee crisis? Any self respecting candidate would have refused to participate in this "debate".
1
Who will tell the people? The more important question is will they listen? Many of Trump's supporters claim they are motivated by values that are directly contradicted by his own pronouncements! You can bring a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. Or think.
4
Especially think. Not much thinking going on here.
"But who will tell the people?"
Bernie Sanders will give them the truth!
Bernie Sanders will give them the truth!
5
Mr. Krugman contends that, “modern G.O.P. economic discourse is completely dominated by an economic doctrine — the sovereign importance of low taxes on the rich …” The major candidates, Bush and Trump (and Bernie Sanders), have advocated for the elimination of the worst income tax break known as the carried interest loophole used by Mr. Romney. See http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/carried-interest-tax-break-di...
The estate tax is the main tax that applies in a significant way to all the rich and just the rich. Candidates Bush, Cruz, Gilmore, Huckabee, Jindal, Paul, Rubio and Santarum want the Estate tax to be eliminated. The other G.O.P. candidates have been silent so far. People like Mr. Buffet (and to a lesser extent Mr. Trump) may average up to $3 billion a year in tax free economic income which will completely avoid taxation if the estate tax is eliminated. Note that the income is not taxed because it is not earned and simply represents asset appreciation.
Some believe that the $30 billion a year generated by the estate tax is too small to be concerned about yet this amounts to $600 billion over 20 years. Ironically, the poorer half of the population has lost 70% of their family wealth over the last 20 years and now share about $600 billion. In other words, the family wealth and well being of the poor could be doubled if the government lowered the taxes on the poor by the amount it took in from estate taxes.
The estate tax is the main tax that applies in a significant way to all the rich and just the rich. Candidates Bush, Cruz, Gilmore, Huckabee, Jindal, Paul, Rubio and Santarum want the Estate tax to be eliminated. The other G.O.P. candidates have been silent so far. People like Mr. Buffet (and to a lesser extent Mr. Trump) may average up to $3 billion a year in tax free economic income which will completely avoid taxation if the estate tax is eliminated. Note that the income is not taxed because it is not earned and simply represents asset appreciation.
Some believe that the $30 billion a year generated by the estate tax is too small to be concerned about yet this amounts to $600 billion over 20 years. Ironically, the poorer half of the population has lost 70% of their family wealth over the last 20 years and now share about $600 billion. In other words, the family wealth and well being of the poor could be doubled if the government lowered the taxes on the poor by the amount it took in from estate taxes.
3
Eugene Patrick Devany:
Candidates Bush, Cruz, Gilmore, Huckabee, Jindal, Paul, Rubio and Santarum want the Estate tax to be eliminated.
***
There was more information about the GOP candidates' policies in your single comment than in all of The Times's reviews of the debates thus far, despite the fact that they claim to have based their opinions on positions.
Candidates Bush, Cruz, Gilmore, Huckabee, Jindal, Paul, Rubio and Santarum want the Estate tax to be eliminated.
***
There was more information about the GOP candidates' policies in your single comment than in all of The Times's reviews of the debates thus far, despite the fact that they claim to have based their opinions on positions.
3
'The only candidate talking sense about economics was, yes, Donald Trump, who declared that “we’ve had a graduated tax system for many years, so it’s not a socialistic thing.”'
Well, Trump did talk some sense on that particular thing, but he was only half right.
It IS a socialistic thing, and one under which the United States middle class. prospered the most when it was most progressive.
Socialism the word was hi-jacked and tarnished by totalitarian communists, but it was never been so reviled in other nations as in the United States and later the UK, since Margaret Thatcher said there was no such thing as society. The American Right understands the power of words; now that Bernie Sanders has a national platform (which some of the media are still reluctant to grant him) and people can actually learn what he says, perhaps the word socialism will be restored to mainstream politics.
Well, Trump did talk some sense on that particular thing, but he was only half right.
It IS a socialistic thing, and one under which the United States middle class. prospered the most when it was most progressive.
Socialism the word was hi-jacked and tarnished by totalitarian communists, but it was never been so reviled in other nations as in the United States and later the UK, since Margaret Thatcher said there was no such thing as society. The American Right understands the power of words; now that Bernie Sanders has a national platform (which some of the media are still reluctant to grant him) and people can actually learn what he says, perhaps the word socialism will be restored to mainstream politics.
6
There are "social programs" and there is "socialism". Social Security and Medicare are "social programs"; the ownership of the creation of wealth, i.e. steel plants, etc. by the state is socialism. We need to be clear about what words mean.
1
Grand Old Prevaricators are required to lie... and to lie spectacularly.
The raison d'être of the GOP is to gild the rich, a fundamentally immoral, economically violent and sociopathic concept that most reject because of its disgusting misanthropic nature.
The only way to cover the Greed Over People platform is do it with the most spectacular lies and Grand Old Propaganda.
The Republican voter base is a petri dish of highly cultured ignorance, misinformation and award-winning misinformation: the GOP base in their propagandized fugue somehow thinks the random killing of four Americans in Benghazi during the Obama years is far worse than the 4488 American body count in George Bush's $2 trillion Iraq adventure creating ISIS on a taxpayer credit card.
The GOP voter base is a base that wants to 'keep government hands off their Medicare'.
These are obviously people who have had their neuropathways seriously disrupted by right-wing, propaganda echo chambers.
Hence, the right-wing denial of climate change, science, research, economics, birth control, compromise, democracy, common sense, peace and its propagandized Republican replacement with religion, war, guns, irrationality, flag-waving, voter suppression, moneyed speech, the gerrymander, the filibuster and a continuous stream of Up Is Down poppycock.
The only way to get people to vote for Greed Over People is to lie outrageously.
The Grand Old Pyromaniacs continue to burn down America with fear, fantasy and phoniness.
The raison d'être of the GOP is to gild the rich, a fundamentally immoral, economically violent and sociopathic concept that most reject because of its disgusting misanthropic nature.
The only way to cover the Greed Over People platform is do it with the most spectacular lies and Grand Old Propaganda.
The Republican voter base is a petri dish of highly cultured ignorance, misinformation and award-winning misinformation: the GOP base in their propagandized fugue somehow thinks the random killing of four Americans in Benghazi during the Obama years is far worse than the 4488 American body count in George Bush's $2 trillion Iraq adventure creating ISIS on a taxpayer credit card.
The GOP voter base is a base that wants to 'keep government hands off their Medicare'.
These are obviously people who have had their neuropathways seriously disrupted by right-wing, propaganda echo chambers.
Hence, the right-wing denial of climate change, science, research, economics, birth control, compromise, democracy, common sense, peace and its propagandized Republican replacement with religion, war, guns, irrationality, flag-waving, voter suppression, moneyed speech, the gerrymander, the filibuster and a continuous stream of Up Is Down poppycock.
The only way to get people to vote for Greed Over People is to lie outrageously.
The Grand Old Pyromaniacs continue to burn down America with fear, fantasy and phoniness.
5
I have been saying for many years that Republican politicians are a mixture of mendacity and stupidity: the two attributes always add up to 100 percent.
3
Almost half of Republicans get their news from Fox (check Pew polls). My guess is that such Republicans don't represent the brighter half, and I also guess that Trump's supporters don't score high on educational achievement or general knowledge.
1
Republicans win among college graduates every 4 years. Romney won among college graduates, and so did Bush.
The problem with telling the people is: so many will not listen & have their minds already made up with the distorions & lies that are being told to them! I try to promote voter interest & concern, in my small circle of friends on FB. Only to find that some (not all, thank goodness) just refuse to acknowledge that there is propaganda & misinformation. They are just so angry that they want to "burn down the building", so to speak.
"Who will tell the people?" I think we all have to keep trying to have an open dialogue with everyone we can. You can't have peace & understanding without talking.
"Who will tell the people?" I think we all have to keep trying to have an open dialogue with everyone we can. You can't have peace & understanding without talking.
1
Wow. Just, wow.
We are watching the world collapse around us in real time while the leader of the free world can't be bothered to look up from his putting game, and Paul Krugman is scared of---marginal tax rates that are a little lower than he thinks optimal.
We are watching the world collapse around us in real time while the leader of the free world can't be bothered to look up from his putting game, and Paul Krugman is scared of---marginal tax rates that are a little lower than he thinks optimal.
1
Fox News tells the angry people what they want to hear and creates myths and spews them so often people believe them. The candidates assembled at the lectern were scary, scary because of the lies they told, scary because of the hate they spewed and contempt for the poor, the working class and those who differ with their point of views and " solutions" to make America great again! America was not better or great in the make believe fictitious paradise they have imagined the 1950's were. What's much more frightening and damning is that this motley crew are a mirror into the soul of many of the American electorate.
3
Alas ye of little faith. Have ye forgotten that Saint Ronald Wilson Reagan promised that America can cut taxes and increase spending forever? Because we are Americans and neither deficits nor debt matter. And St. Ronnie also promised that we are all going to capitalist Heaven too. Without the inconvenience of either dying or living a morally accountable life. Hallelujah!
Once upon a time fantasies and fictions won an eight year residency in the White House. And we all lived happily ever after.
Once upon a time fantasies and fictions won an eight year residency in the White House. And we all lived happily ever after.
2
The scary thing is that people tend to be brand loyal to their party regardless and God forbid they should vote for the other party. The more thoughtful and intelligent sooner would rationalize about these candidates needing to appeal to their base.Very scary indeed if any in this line-up make it to the presidency.
1
The reason GOP candidates engage in ludicrous "crazy talk" is because that's what appeals to rank and file Republicans. Democrats have their own strain of crazy talk too, for the same reason. The problem is the American public is largely ignorant, gullible and angry.
1
Anyone who claims there's no difference between the two parties is as delusional as the GOP these days. The crazy was on full display. And it's only going to get worse. Sure, there'll be "a move to the middle" at some point, but no one should forget that what was on display at the debate is what the GOP really is these days: delusional and dangerous.
3
Krugman never fails to deliver the tin foil hat Liberal version of the Republicans are "scary" to NYT readers...and surprisingly most of his followers buy it without question. Here's the reality...the Republican field is very strong and Democrats can only offer their voters and old white Socialist or Hillary Clinton, a candidate with the charm of Nixon, the ethics of Lois Lerner and the greed of Bernie Madoff.
3
And what about Fiorina's response to the Trump statement on her looks? Was the previous sophomoric question to Trump - Bush used to set this one up? Watching this "debate" was worse than being in charge of a Junior High study hall. I agree with Gail Collins, it reminded me of a pack of rabid otters.
4
when i read another op-ed page full of insults for republicans - about their irrationality, primitivism, etc, what i really hear is a non-stop decades-long self-congratulation: i, the columnist, and you, the reader, are so smart so smart so smart; so rational; so decent. i wonder how much more ego-reinforcement through sneering at the other we really need. we must be pretty insecure.
1
I'm worried. I hope to vote for Bernie, but I could be scared into voting for the democrat most likely to keep the crazies out of the Whitehouse.
2
We will not have these fantasies and fictions in the Democrat debates. Because Hillary will not allow it. Will Bernie and O'Malley still be around when Hillary finally comes out of hiding?
2
"But the truly awesome moment came when she asserted that the videos being used to attack Planned Parenthood show “a fully formed fetus on the table, its heart beating, its legs kicking while someone says we have to keep it alive to harvest its brain.” No, they don’t. Anti-abortion activists have claimed that such things happen, but have produced no evidence, just assertions mingled with stock footage of fetuses."
Sorry, but there is proof out there, and letting your readership believe otherwise is the dishonest part. It only takes a thirty second search on youtube to find the video in question.
Sorry, but there is proof out there, and letting your readership believe otherwise is the dishonest part. It only takes a thirty second search on youtube to find the video in question.
2
thank you very much for pointing out the critical fact that while Christie was appointed "officially" on Dec 7 or 8, he was "privately" told on Sep 10.
isn't this point, sort of a waste of "newsprint".
isn't this point, sort of a waste of "newsprint".
1
OK where is the proof of a "private" appointment? If true, it is still private and not open to scrutiny -- could be true, could be a whopper --
Actually not. If he was told on Sept 10 but didn't begin until Dec. he was not officially in office until then. That means he did not have the authority to do anything. So, these facts are not a waste of "newsprint".
1
"And, of course, no deal with Iran, because resorting to force in Iraq went so well."
This 1000 times over. If these guys are so pragmatic and some in theory want to run the government like a business, what pragmatic businessperson would want to repeat what obviously was so disastrous and, worse, futile?
This 1000 times over. If these guys are so pragmatic and some in theory want to run the government like a business, what pragmatic businessperson would want to repeat what obviously was so disastrous and, worse, futile?
2
What these so called debates need is a "Color Annalist"; some one like John Madden in his prime who could take a quick replay and diagram the movement of all the players and point out how they positioned themselves to move right with an occasional dash up the center. She could, with the number of spotters that Networks have at the game, point out the mistakes-lies- and in general keep the game moving for the viewers. And we might learn something about the politics going on.
2
I agree, Dr. Krugman. And it is terrifying that such outrageous lies and ridiculous positions i.e .bussing immigrants over the border - are being presented as reasonable. If any of the Republican candidates actually wins the presidency - with perhaps the exception of Rand Paul - Revelations will be a self-fulfilling prophesy.
In all my years, I've never seen candidates like these. It's truly frightening. It's as if some kind of social madness has taken hold and threatened all decorum and rational, intelligent thought.
In all my years, I've never seen candidates like these. It's truly frightening. It's as if some kind of social madness has taken hold and threatened all decorum and rational, intelligent thought.
3
The 1993 Clinton tax increases predictably led to the slowdown of real GDP of 1.4% in the first 2 quarters of 1995.
It wasn't until John Kasich took over the budget in 1995 that we began to control the budget which ultimately ran surpluses (which Clinton takes credit for). Clinton also agreed to a Cap Gains tax cut in 97 that closed the deal on the 90s courtesy of Kasich and the Republican Congress.
It wasn't until John Kasich took over the budget in 1995 that we began to control the budget which ultimately ran surpluses (which Clinton takes credit for). Clinton also agreed to a Cap Gains tax cut in 97 that closed the deal on the 90s courtesy of Kasich and the Republican Congress.
3
The righteous indignation expressed by Ms. Fiorina in her much acclaimed statement concerning Planned Parenthood shocked me. She bases her anger and fierce opposition on a lie, and then sells that lie to the audience. Who would not anger at the senseless murder of an aborted fetus?
But to suggest the Planned Parenthood does anything like that is a bald faced lie. She ought to be called out by our Democratic candidates or media. Using a dead fetus to promote your candidacy seems to me to be the lowest of blows. Willie Horton on meth.
But to suggest the Planned Parenthood does anything like that is a bald faced lie. She ought to be called out by our Democratic candidates or media. Using a dead fetus to promote your candidacy seems to me to be the lowest of blows. Willie Horton on meth.
4
"Who will tell the people?" But "most important, does it matter?"
The "people" (Republicans) watched and listened to the debate. Prior to and after they supported Trump. They don't care if he vilifies Mexican immigrants, they don't care if he insults women, they don't care that he spouts inflammatory lies. Republicans hear the failed policies proposed by all of the GOP candidates and they don't care that those policies hurt the country and hurt the people.
The problem with the Republican Party lies with the people who call themselves Republican. You can't educate them to the truth of their destructive party. If Trump or anyone of the other candidates said the earth is flat, Republicans would believe the truth is merely a theory of liberals.
The "people" (Republicans) watched and listened to the debate. Prior to and after they supported Trump. They don't care if he vilifies Mexican immigrants, they don't care if he insults women, they don't care that he spouts inflammatory lies. Republicans hear the failed policies proposed by all of the GOP candidates and they don't care that those policies hurt the country and hurt the people.
The problem with the Republican Party lies with the people who call themselves Republican. You can't educate them to the truth of their destructive party. If Trump or anyone of the other candidates said the earth is flat, Republicans would believe the truth is merely a theory of liberals.
2
All these debates show is the Republican mantra is still, "A good Lie is a Terrible Thing to Waste". They get away with their dishonesty because their base does not care all they want id a cheap and easy vindication of their anger. Accuracy is always trumped by Anger. It helps that their major news outlets fully endorse this policy.
3
Normally, I do not care what a politician looks like; however, in the case of Mrs. Fiorina ...
her face is morphing into a hawk. She is truly frightening as she tries to out hawk everyone on the stage.
her face is morphing into a hawk. She is truly frightening as she tries to out hawk everyone on the stage.
1
Who will tell the people, indeed!
Not the vast gulag of conservative controlled local radio, TV and newspapers that has spread across the country.
Not the vast gulag of conservative controlled local radio, TV and newspapers that has spread across the country.
2
Gee, I never knew Paul Krugman was a mailman. I was a farm hand, now I'm a physics professor. Does that qualify me to be president?
1
The primary system in America panders to the hardcore wing of the party to get the nomination – and in a crowded field candidates must be more extreme sounding than the next guy to get noticed. Democrats are as guilty of this as Republicans. Once the nominee is decided, campaig rhetoric shifts toward the majority of Americans who are more moderate, and candidates tack back toward the center.
So treat these debates for what they are – entertainment and not policy prescriptions.
So treat these debates for what they are – entertainment and not policy prescriptions.
2
Krugman confuses correlation with causation when he "associates" Obama tax increases with growth. It is a mistake made by amateur statisticians and economists. Oh well.
2
The falsehoods they say now should be considered within a historical context. The cries that Obama was out to take people's guns away.
Economically, republican senators screaming at Tim Geithner in hearings were proven wrong.
First Iraq is the center of terrorism, now Iran should be invaded. Ever hear of Ronald Reagan's Iran Contra when Sandanistas were the center of terrorism? Historically republicans cannot stop finding a new center of terrorism. Joe McCarthy here in the United States, then the John Birch Society and J.Edgar Hoover amassing files on fellow Americans.
You don't see Syrian refugees running over the border to Russia, yet republicans have historically been consistent that Russia is doing everything in their power to step into the place The United States now and forever has occupied as the world leader. Like people are scrambling to claw their way into Russia for the good life?
Republicans tear into the price of gas. Right in front of some kind of aircraft with Ronald Reagan's name do they talk about Reagan tripling the gas tax on aircraft to pay for infrastructure?
After what Ken Starr did to the Clintons I'd be afraid to be a republican. Be very afraid.
Economically, republican senators screaming at Tim Geithner in hearings were proven wrong.
First Iraq is the center of terrorism, now Iran should be invaded. Ever hear of Ronald Reagan's Iran Contra when Sandanistas were the center of terrorism? Historically republicans cannot stop finding a new center of terrorism. Joe McCarthy here in the United States, then the John Birch Society and J.Edgar Hoover amassing files on fellow Americans.
You don't see Syrian refugees running over the border to Russia, yet republicans have historically been consistent that Russia is doing everything in their power to step into the place The United States now and forever has occupied as the world leader. Like people are scrambling to claw their way into Russia for the good life?
Republicans tear into the price of gas. Right in front of some kind of aircraft with Ronald Reagan's name do they talk about Reagan tripling the gas tax on aircraft to pay for infrastructure?
After what Ken Starr did to the Clintons I'd be afraid to be a republican. Be very afraid.
1
Mr. Krugman has a problem. If he really believes the taunts he throws out regarding Republicans he runs up against the fact half the country is routinely voting for people he characterizes as outright liars living in a fantasy world. He doesn't think much of Republicans, but it appears he thinks even less of half the people you'll meet today.
Of course Republicans say ridiculous things and a lot of their ideas are bad for the country. But do you really want to read a columnist who dismisses half the country and engages in simplistics and name calling? It is ironic the same people who rage against conservative talk radio lionize Mr. Krugman. And therein lies the problem. We are becoming a nation of people who denigrate people they disagree with, talk past each other, and assure themselves complicated problems have simple solutions.
"...who will tell the people?" Mr. Krugman asks in his column. I don't know the answer to that, but I hope it will be someone with more willingness to engage ideas that Paul Krugman.
Of course Republicans say ridiculous things and a lot of their ideas are bad for the country. But do you really want to read a columnist who dismisses half the country and engages in simplistics and name calling? It is ironic the same people who rage against conservative talk radio lionize Mr. Krugman. And therein lies the problem. We are becoming a nation of people who denigrate people they disagree with, talk past each other, and assure themselves complicated problems have simple solutions.
"...who will tell the people?" Mr. Krugman asks in his column. I don't know the answer to that, but I hope it will be someone with more willingness to engage ideas that Paul Krugman.
3
And what "ideas" exactly did they put forth on Wednesday night? I heard no taxes, lies about 9/11, increase military spending, and de-fund Planned Parenthood. The only ideas I see there are a possible discussion about the role of the military in today's world and what are we going to do about cyber-crime. Okay, so let's hear these guys say something about WHY they think the Navy needs new fleets of ships--even when the Navy doesn't think that.
1
Does "engaging ideas" mean that we should be taking false claims seriously?
Your comment leaves me scratching my head because, like you, I'd love to hear earnest debate from the 50% who vote Republican.
And yet I know, for example, that humans cause pollution by driving cars that emit carbon dioxide. The preponderance of asthma and skin cancer are enough to prove it's a problem. But not a single Republican is willing to even admit pollution is a problem and that the EPA is necessary.
How can you "engage ideas" from such people?
Your comment leaves me scratching my head because, like you, I'd love to hear earnest debate from the 50% who vote Republican.
And yet I know, for example, that humans cause pollution by driving cars that emit carbon dioxide. The preponderance of asthma and skin cancer are enough to prove it's a problem. But not a single Republican is willing to even admit pollution is a problem and that the EPA is necessary.
How can you "engage ideas" from such people?
The Repub "debate" was more like a cavalcade of clowns--each trying to out-clown the other. It would have been hilarious without the lingering fear that one of them might actually become president...
2
The absolute disregard of standards, the notion that free speech confers equality of ideas, the triumph of propaganda because it sells news has jeopardized democracy. Government by the people requires an informed people. An informed people relies on a press that reports facts and is intolerant of fallacy. Instead, we have been afflicted by the false equivalence that the press, the news media enforces by leaving it unchallenged. The news media reports false claims routinely, functioning as verification of the proponents of deception.
"the way the conventions of “evenhanded” reporting allowed then-candidate George W. Bush to make clearly false assertions — about his tax cuts, about Social Security — without paying any price. As I wrote at the time, if Mr. Bush said the earth was flat, we’d see headlines along the lines of “Shape of the Planet: Both Sides Have a Point.” is even more insidious as it has blunted our justice system. The crimes committed by the Bush Administration corrode our justice system. That banks that caused the financial collapse, were bailed out. That our courts and jails are not swollen with the perpetrators renders justice tyranny. Tyranny exists when "too big to fail" exist. Too big to fail is a description of the end of democracy.
Of course, the Republican candidates can say anything and be unchallenged is the norm today. As long as lies, deception, and dishonesty are equivalent with facts, evidence, and truth we will be the subjects of tyrants.
"the way the conventions of “evenhanded” reporting allowed then-candidate George W. Bush to make clearly false assertions — about his tax cuts, about Social Security — without paying any price. As I wrote at the time, if Mr. Bush said the earth was flat, we’d see headlines along the lines of “Shape of the Planet: Both Sides Have a Point.” is even more insidious as it has blunted our justice system. The crimes committed by the Bush Administration corrode our justice system. That banks that caused the financial collapse, were bailed out. That our courts and jails are not swollen with the perpetrators renders justice tyranny. Tyranny exists when "too big to fail" exist. Too big to fail is a description of the end of democracy.
Of course, the Republican candidates can say anything and be unchallenged is the norm today. As long as lies, deception, and dishonesty are equivalent with facts, evidence, and truth we will be the subjects of tyrants.
4
I will agree with Paul my side has nuts running for office if he agrees his side has nuts too. Pistachios, walnuts, pecans and almonds they're all nuts. The 18 trillion dollars tax hike proposed by Bernie or the garage sale the White House will become if Hillary is elected is disturbing. What is also disturbing is it seems even Congress is filled with slack intellects. I long for my youth and naivety. Lord help us all.
1
I worked for HP during part of Carly Fiorina's tenure. If she goes anywhere near the White House, even God will not be able to help America.
507
My chin hit the floor, not when Jeb(!) made the patently false claim that his brother "kept us safe", (really, what else could one expect from a member of this family) but rather when the line drew pretty much the loudest applause of the night from the crowd in attendance.
Fact-and-history-denying, jingoistic, plutocratic, nativist, bigoted claptrap. This is what the GOP has been selling for forty-plus years. Pretty much my entire life. Galling, dumbfounding but not unexpected if we're to be at all honest. What truly scares me is that 48 or 49 or, gods save us, 51 per cent of the voting population might be buying.
Fact-and-history-denying, jingoistic, plutocratic, nativist, bigoted claptrap. This is what the GOP has been selling for forty-plus years. Pretty much my entire life. Galling, dumbfounding but not unexpected if we're to be at all honest. What truly scares me is that 48 or 49 or, gods save us, 51 per cent of the voting population might be buying.
538
"Fact-and-history-denying, jingoistic, plutocratic, nativist, bigoted claptrap."
Best line I have seen in awhile to describe the current incarnation of the GOP and its adherents. Well done!
Best line I have seen in awhile to describe the current incarnation of the GOP and its adherents. Well done!
2
I realized after watching this second debate, that is was really a waste of time to see 11 candidates tell us how well they will do in running the country. Lots of empty promises and miss-truths.
I am now going to let things settle down as it is still early in the process. Instead of listening to all of them bloviate, I will start to listen next year, once the candidates are culled and some hopeful sanity ensues, as far as policies.
I find it incredible as a Republican, that the RNC cannot bring them or some people together to develop a rationale, cohesive, and practical solution to the tax situation and all the other woes that have befallen us in the past 7 years. And, the Democrats with the sorry spectacle of Clinton promising to in effect conduct an Obama third term, offers nothing new from them.
What a sorry state the country is in. Can we find anyone, anyone NOT in government, who can lay out a plan to truly move use forward, with evidence of its proposed effects and impact,and then campaign on it.
I am now going to let things settle down as it is still early in the process. Instead of listening to all of them bloviate, I will start to listen next year, once the candidates are culled and some hopeful sanity ensues, as far as policies.
I find it incredible as a Republican, that the RNC cannot bring them or some people together to develop a rationale, cohesive, and practical solution to the tax situation and all the other woes that have befallen us in the past 7 years. And, the Democrats with the sorry spectacle of Clinton promising to in effect conduct an Obama third term, offers nothing new from them.
What a sorry state the country is in. Can we find anyone, anyone NOT in government, who can lay out a plan to truly move use forward, with evidence of its proposed effects and impact,and then campaign on it.
Mr Krugman acts as if the current occupant of the oval office is abe Lincoln and has never told a lie to the public. The current crop of republican candidates are rank ammateurs when it comes to lying compared to Obama. I need not list them here because I know from polls that the liberal mindset thinks it is ok to lie when it is for the public good. The problem That krugman has is not the lying but who the lies are going to benefit as far as California booming I want the readers here to understand which states have the highest rates of income inequality look it up and you will find that with the great liberal polices that California is at the top of the list . (we have had a liberal legislature since the mid 80s)
5
OK, so I looked it up here http://bit.ly/1LmkSdJ, here http://bit.ly/1LmkLyH and here http://bit.ly/1LmkJah.
Whether inequality is measured by the Gini coefficient or other indicators, California never comes close to having the highest rate of income inequality.
California doesn't reach the 2014 rates of growth that oil states Texas and North Dakota did in 2014, but is well ahead of the national average. http://1.usa.gov/1KqFuwg
What are you talking about again?
Whether inequality is measured by the Gini coefficient or other indicators, California never comes close to having the highest rate of income inequality.
California doesn't reach the 2014 rates of growth that oil states Texas and North Dakota did in 2014, but is well ahead of the national average. http://1.usa.gov/1KqFuwg
What are you talking about again?
1
and if we asked for a list of lies? how many would we get out of you?
here's a number: 935 lies from bush cheney just on getting iraq going.
Lies on the economy, 911 and others add to the grand total
go ahead start your list
here's a number: 935 lies from bush cheney just on getting iraq going.
Lies on the economy, 911 and others add to the grand total
go ahead start your list
1
I would argue that no one in our current Congress understands the problems faced by middle and working class Americans. The Democrats don't have their act together and the GOP is living in an alternate universe where reality is suspended. As an American who has worked very hard for over 30 years I have yet to see any action taken on our behalf that doesn't get shot down by corporations, the very rich donors, or some politician who has no understanding of how our lives work.
Universal access single payor health care: shot down by the GOP and associated businesses and professions.
A decent social safety net: shot down because it might help THOSE PEOPLE and we don't want to help THOSE PEOPLE. Those people being code words for blacks, Latinos, the handicapped, or any one else unfortunate enough to be living through unemployment, illness, etc.
Affordable Housing: Shot down for the same reason a a decent social safety net. THOSE PEOPLE don't deserve it. Never mind that THOSE PEOPLE could be your children or other relatives.
We work in America. We try to pay our bills. If we lose our jobs, get sick, experience some other crisis, or were born after 1955 all we can count on is nothing from our government because we voted in people who care about being re-elected more than serving the people that elected them.
Universal access single payor health care: shot down by the GOP and associated businesses and professions.
A decent social safety net: shot down because it might help THOSE PEOPLE and we don't want to help THOSE PEOPLE. Those people being code words for blacks, Latinos, the handicapped, or any one else unfortunate enough to be living through unemployment, illness, etc.
Affordable Housing: Shot down for the same reason a a decent social safety net. THOSE PEOPLE don't deserve it. Never mind that THOSE PEOPLE could be your children or other relatives.
We work in America. We try to pay our bills. If we lose our jobs, get sick, experience some other crisis, or were born after 1955 all we can count on is nothing from our government because we voted in people who care about being re-elected more than serving the people that elected them.
9
And I thought the 2012 Clown Car Follies was too good to be true!
The Republican Party will disappear into the trash heap of American history soon - probably in the next decade or do - and that's good thing. But, goodness gracious, I'm sure gonna miss them when they're gone. All of those unintentional giggles vanished from the American spotlight forever. How ever will I cope?
ne more thing: Is Donald Trump a Democratic plant? He must be. he damage he is doing to that disgusting party is incalculable.
The last time the Democrats succeeded themselves on Inauguration Day was in 1857. It hasn't happened since. It will happen on Inauguration Day 2017. Mark my words, campers.
http://www.tomdegan.blogspot.com
Tom Degan
The Republican Party will disappear into the trash heap of American history soon - probably in the next decade or do - and that's good thing. But, goodness gracious, I'm sure gonna miss them when they're gone. All of those unintentional giggles vanished from the American spotlight forever. How ever will I cope?
ne more thing: Is Donald Trump a Democratic plant? He must be. he damage he is doing to that disgusting party is incalculable.
The last time the Democrats succeeded themselves on Inauguration Day was in 1857. It hasn't happened since. It will happen on Inauguration Day 2017. Mark my words, campers.
http://www.tomdegan.blogspot.com
Tom Degan
1
Its all the usual GOP stuff; more war, tax cuts for the wealthy and boastful ignorance. The most important point in Paul's article is how the press struggles so hard to give a "balanced" view that they give credence to idiocy.
5
Trump has caught the fancy of the conservative right who feel disfranchised by today's so called politicians. He is the voice of the "folk", of the GOP masses, who are the cannon-fodder, the cattle outside the slaughterhouse, serenely chewing the cud ... those to whom things are done, in contrast to those who have executive will and intelligence. His rhetoric is seemingly innocent of politics to which there is a collective responsive sigh of alas! But where the politics crops up is that if we take this eventually to be the typical sentiment of american society at large—and there is no more serious voice that stands higher than Trump's, then we are by the same token saying something very definite about that society.
3
"He is the voice of the "folk", of the GOP masses,"
No he isn't. He's the voice of Donald Trump, the only real person in his universe.
No he isn't. He's the voice of Donald Trump, the only real person in his universe.
Mr. Krugman, you can thank Citizens United and billionaire buying of elections for all the mythical nonsense. Facts and reason are anathema to those who wish to hide while pulling the strings. Better a curtain of media obfuscation, and rhetoric equivalent to bloody red meat to toss out to the willingly rabid. True to form, though, this is American entertainment at its best, meaning its worst.
6
Mr. William Wallace,
Here in the USA we have recently elected the very best congressmen, congresswomen, senators, governors, presidents and other government administrations that money can buy!
These elected and appointed officials do, however, offer their votes for Free Trade Agreements, the MFN and the PNTR trade statuses, Alaskan drilling permits, no-bid PAY TO PLAY government contracts funded from the public treasuries such as the CGI Federal no-bid contract; military weapon system software secrets transferred to Communist China (Hughes Aircraft company Rocket Guidance Software - Google Chinagate); H.1.b. visa increases; more U.S. taxpayer foreign aid to finance the building of more Nuclear Bombs for/in Israel; and their legislative votes for sale to US citizens and to foreigners, at very reasonable prices!
Here in the USA we have recently elected the very best congressmen, congresswomen, senators, governors, presidents and other government administrations that money can buy!
These elected and appointed officials do, however, offer their votes for Free Trade Agreements, the MFN and the PNTR trade statuses, Alaskan drilling permits, no-bid PAY TO PLAY government contracts funded from the public treasuries such as the CGI Federal no-bid contract; military weapon system software secrets transferred to Communist China (Hughes Aircraft company Rocket Guidance Software - Google Chinagate); H.1.b. visa increases; more U.S. taxpayer foreign aid to finance the building of more Nuclear Bombs for/in Israel; and their legislative votes for sale to US citizens and to foreigners, at very reasonable prices!
1
You don't even know what Citizen's United was about, do you? Some people made a movie that was critical of Hillary Clinton, so she decided to use the force of government to prevent the movie from being shown. And Citizen's United came out of that. Are you saying that it should be illegal to make a movie critical of Hillary Clinton?
Why are you so scared of speech? If you're that scared of words, the policies you favor must be pretty bad to be so easily destroyed with words.
Why are you so scared of speech? If you're that scared of words, the policies you favor must be pretty bad to be so easily destroyed with words.
So 24 million Americans watched the so-called debate. I'm with the majority (around 300 million or thereabouts) who had something better to do. But reading about the TV show gives me the sense that the whole thing was set up for the purpose of knocking down D Trump who seems to have upset some of the party establishment. Even the live audience seems to have been carefully selected to go along with the program. I will be curious to see how that worked out. Not that I care very much about who the losers nominate, but it is a study in the exercise of elite authority.
3
Biggest fantasy/fiction of the debate had to be "My brother kept us safe", and the people in the Reagan Library cheered this delusion. I couldn't believe my ears. Did these people in the audience have a faulty memory or have things become so partisan that they can never affix blame when their guy makes a mistake?
Next biggest fiction: the plucky little secretary that worked her way up to CEO and then was crucified by the old boy network. Yes she worked as a secretary while she was still in school at Stanford where upon graduation she went right into a management-track program. Yes she grew Hewlett-Packard by acquiring Compaq which later turned out to be disastrous and resulted in her subsequent firing, but not before firing 30,000 other people and pocketing a multi-million dollar golden parachute. Trump is becoming repetitive so the ever-voracious media machine is more than ready to disgorge stories of the mythic rise of Carly Florina.
Next biggest fiction: the plucky little secretary that worked her way up to CEO and then was crucified by the old boy network. Yes she worked as a secretary while she was still in school at Stanford where upon graduation she went right into a management-track program. Yes she grew Hewlett-Packard by acquiring Compaq which later turned out to be disastrous and resulted in her subsequent firing, but not before firing 30,000 other people and pocketing a multi-million dollar golden parachute. Trump is becoming repetitive so the ever-voracious media machine is more than ready to disgorge stories of the mythic rise of Carly Florina.
15
Thanks for pointing out all these "inconsistencies" which are allowed to circulate because the media clings to it's "evenhanded" reporting. As soon as the debate was over, all we heard from the media was "who won?" Very little fact checking. It's the Emperor's New Clothes all over again. The media are afraid or unwilling to call out the naked lies of the candidates.
11
What an excellent editorial !! It was a scary night listening to such ill informed as well as lying folk. It would be a disaster to elect any of these self-centered idiots to any office except dog-catcher. These people remind me of the months just before the rise of Adolph Hitler and that is truly scary. If they are the best that we have, we are in terrible shape. Thank you for your perceptive observations.
14
What you got against dogs?
1
Paul, the other day I ran across the word "anecdata" in a NYT Comments column. Had to google it since my 2000 vintage American Heritage Dictionary failed to shed any light on this neologism. Anecdotal evidence presented as indisputable fact is the standard used by Republicans in all matters social, financial, religious. When it comes to science, though, they fail to rise to even to the level of anecdata for their arguments. Here, they must resort to fantasy, smoke, mirrors, and, even though they are against their legal use, hallucinogens.
Remarkable, that the party to which I was partial in the 1960's (at least until I found myself in Vietnam on the doorstep of Cambodia listening to Nixon's lies on AFVN radio) has become the home of the Flat Earth Society. Truth be told, all religion, especially those of the Abrahamic variety, are anecdata-based. The Bible, the Koran, and the Torah, are the religious equivalent of hearsay, another form of anecdata.
Remarkable, that the party to which I was partial in the 1960's (at least until I found myself in Vietnam on the doorstep of Cambodia listening to Nixon's lies on AFVN radio) has become the home of the Flat Earth Society. Truth be told, all religion, especially those of the Abrahamic variety, are anecdata-based. The Bible, the Koran, and the Torah, are the religious equivalent of hearsay, another form of anecdata.
10
your article reminds me, once again, that people will say anything to be elected. case in point: hubert humphrey crawling into bed with george wallace...john mc cain growing smarmier and smarmier as he kowtowed to the financiers and george w lying to us about the 'grave threat' posed by sadaam. a tragedy really because of the incredible danger these people pose to the country and the world.
you, at least, have minimally restored my confidence because i often feel that i'm the only one paying attention. lies, distortions and spin are the watchwords. meaningful, intelligent political debate is a lost art. the only thing missing at wednesdays debate was someone to grind the organ
you, at least, have minimally restored my confidence because i often feel that i'm the only one paying attention. lies, distortions and spin are the watchwords. meaningful, intelligent political debate is a lost art. the only thing missing at wednesdays debate was someone to grind the organ
9
I have grown up on and studied on four continents, and hold three university degrees in engineering and two in law. I have traveled to over 80 countries, and have made serious effort during those visits to talk to a wide variety of people. Sadly, based on my exposure to people all around the world, I have concluded that Americans (considering the amount of information readily available to them) are just about the most politically ignorant people in the world.
I can understand a person in Nepal or Malawi not knowing much about the war in Iraq or about fracking in Pennsylvania, but there is no excuse for Americans to not even know where Nepal or Malawi are located on a map of the world. Saddest of all, Republicans emphasize "faith" over "facts" as often as they can. The recent GOP debates make that abundantly clear. It is a depressing fact that democracy can lead to rule by the lowest common denominator. When idiots vote for Huckabee because they hate gays, or other idiots vote for Trump because they don't know the difference between legal and illegal immigrants, one becomes convinced that there is no God who blesses America.
I can understand a person in Nepal or Malawi not knowing much about the war in Iraq or about fracking in Pennsylvania, but there is no excuse for Americans to not even know where Nepal or Malawi are located on a map of the world. Saddest of all, Republicans emphasize "faith" over "facts" as often as they can. The recent GOP debates make that abundantly clear. It is a depressing fact that democracy can lead to rule by the lowest common denominator. When idiots vote for Huckabee because they hate gays, or other idiots vote for Trump because they don't know the difference between legal and illegal immigrants, one becomes convinced that there is no God who blesses America.
37
I sadly believe that a lot of the American people vote based upon looks more than intelligence or policy.
>
If history tells us anything, it proves that politicians, demagogues, and lunatics can do a lot with "Fantasies and Fictions". The social constructs and ideologies are unlimited. And with Trump in the debate the crowds hearing them are bigger than ever.
Fiorina is either a pathological liar or insane, or both. Morning Joe and a majority of the our pathetic press are calling her the clear winner!!!! When instead of the false balance routine, they should be calling her out on her fetus statement, and by calling her out, I mean a relentless and constant stream of criticism until she either produces her hallucination or concedes the point, which is I'm a liar and/or insane.
If history tells us anything, it proves that politicians, demagogues, and lunatics can do a lot with "Fantasies and Fictions". The social constructs and ideologies are unlimited. And with Trump in the debate the crowds hearing them are bigger than ever.
Fiorina is either a pathological liar or insane, or both. Morning Joe and a majority of the our pathetic press are calling her the clear winner!!!! When instead of the false balance routine, they should be calling her out on her fetus statement, and by calling her out, I mean a relentless and constant stream of criticism until she either produces her hallucination or concedes the point, which is I'm a liar and/or insane.
7
"...until she either produces her hallucination or concedes the point, which is I'm a liar and/or insane."
...or both. She could claim that she's not a liar but she played one on TV. But then, that's what all the GOP clowns could say, and even that would be a lie, but who's counting?
Oh, what a tangled web!
...or both. She could claim that she's not a liar but she played one on TV. But then, that's what all the GOP clowns could say, and even that would be a lie, but who's counting?
Oh, what a tangled web!
1
It was shameful that all those who commented on Morning Joe did not even mention Fiorina's lie. That means they are just as guilty as she is.
1
"Now we have presidential candidates who make Mr. Bush look like Abe Lincoln. But who will tell the people?"
The Democrats should along with the media. The Dems should be blasting these lies and very stupid ideas all over the country along with their ideas on how to really solve the problem.
The Democrats should along with the media. The Dems should be blasting these lies and very stupid ideas all over the country along with their ideas on how to really solve the problem.
4
dems fight? since when?
I don't think people remember that HP wasn't the first time that Carly Fiorina helped tank a company. She was in the inner circle at Lucent when it went down the tubes. Of course, she was rewarded with the CEO job at HP because of Lucent's stellar performance.
8
For 15 years people have been joking at barbecues and cocktail parties that we should choose a President the way we choose the "American Idol". It was just a joke, but the producers over at the 24/7 news networks didn't see it that way. They have determined that it was a great idea. They know that the best way to sell advertising time and get ratings for your reality show is to create villains and loonies and good-guy characters for the audience's entertainment. The biggest reality show in the world is called "Election 2016"
2
Professor Krugman asks the good question, who will inform the American people that policies that have utterly failed since the beginning of time and false assertions of fact are not a "point of view" that requires respect and a place at the table of discussion on solutions for the challenges that face our nation? Obviously not the free press that was conceived with just that task. The media wants a "dog fight" as CNN called the debate. Dog fights are good for ratings and having people make wild claims based on non existent facts makes for a "lively" discussion that keeps people engaged, like a car accident. But claiming that you prevent abortions by getting rid of the source of contraceptive services isn't a point of view any more than proclaiming that 2+2=19 is a point of view. Will any reporter ever ask the question of why a candidate is proposing policies that have never worked and compel that candidate to present factual data to support his/her support? The odds of that occurring are shockingly small.
4
Right - the tax policies of the Republicans are terrible for this country; especially the focus on tax cuts for the most wealthy.
This reminds me of a Stevie Wonder song: "When you believe in things you don't understand, you suffer."
Cutting taxes on people that hoard wealth will not stimulate growth. The idea that somehow cutting taxes on people who will not spend those tax cuts in the economy is obviously counterproductive if your goal is to increase employment and income for the middle and working class.
Also, this policy undermines the nations ability to properly fund the federal government. When was the last time Republican tax cuts didn't cause a deficit and increase the debt?
What needs to be focused on, in the way of tax policy, in my opinion, is business taxes. It is outrageous small businesses on main street pay their full rates, without special carve outs, while many corporations pay nothing - how is this fair?
This reminds me of a Stevie Wonder song: "When you believe in things you don't understand, you suffer."
Cutting taxes on people that hoard wealth will not stimulate growth. The idea that somehow cutting taxes on people who will not spend those tax cuts in the economy is obviously counterproductive if your goal is to increase employment and income for the middle and working class.
Also, this policy undermines the nations ability to properly fund the federal government. When was the last time Republican tax cuts didn't cause a deficit and increase the debt?
What needs to be focused on, in the way of tax policy, in my opinion, is business taxes. It is outrageous small businesses on main street pay their full rates, without special carve outs, while many corporations pay nothing - how is this fair?
5
'hoard wealth'?! like stuff under the mattresses?!! or do they take their savings and invest in either stocks or bonds providing capital to businesses to grow (which is how new jobs typically are created). you seem to have an incomplete understanding of that matter at hand.
Long gone are the days when listeners/viewers turned to respected newscasters like Lowell Thomas and Walter Cronkite. Today even the most committed voices are constrained by their bosses’ compelling need to make money in an entertaining way. It may be time to reconsider the Fairness Doctrine, abolished by the Federal Communication Commission in 1987 while Ronald Reagan was President. Since 1949, when NBC, ABC, and CBS were the primary news sources, the FCC had dictated that public broadcast license-holders had a duty to present multiple perspectives on important public issues. (Talk radio has always been free to spout any nonsense it chooses).
Our democracy is not well served by the airing of untruths as facts. We need a more responsible media if citizens are to know the realities of today’s challenges.
Our democracy is not well served by the airing of untruths as facts. We need a more responsible media if citizens are to know the realities of today’s challenges.
3
Another person scared of speech. If you don't like the media voices out there, start your own.
Funny thing, though. You're whining about this on a website for a big time newspaper in response to a widely distributed opinion piece saying the same things you are saying.
Seems like there's plenty of media out there with your point of view.
Funny thing, though. You're whining about this on a website for a big time newspaper in response to a widely distributed opinion piece saying the same things you are saying.
Seems like there's plenty of media out there with your point of view.
Superb column! I keep wondering how future historians--who did not experience this hijacking of America by the super rich, right-wing ideologues, corporate thugs, big polluters, and bigots--will ever be able to sort out, make sense of, and explain why and how the most powerful country in the world went right-wing mad near the end of the 20th and beginning of the 21st centuries
A recording of this most recent GOP fantasy debate should go into the time capsule because, if the impression is that America is an "advanced," democratic country, this debate--like so much in the Republican Party these days--totally twists the mind and proves otherwise.
Then, to help put a perspective on what has been going on in this country after the insurgent rabid right-wing tea party morphed into the so-called "mainstream" Republican Party, today's NY Times' columns by Krugman and Tim Egan ("Loser's Poker") as well as dozens of Gail Collins' columns should go into the time capsule to put some perspective on the institutionalized insanity that now pervades our political system and is endorsed and reinforced by our media.
Besides the cast of crazy, lying politicians and the inept CNN moderators, even the garish set for the debate was bizarre, with GOP Pope Reagan's Air Force One plane in the background in his "Library," which several candidates occasionally turned around to give deference to during the debate when Reagan's name was invoked. Was Reagan was buried in that plane?
A recording of this most recent GOP fantasy debate should go into the time capsule because, if the impression is that America is an "advanced," democratic country, this debate--like so much in the Republican Party these days--totally twists the mind and proves otherwise.
Then, to help put a perspective on what has been going on in this country after the insurgent rabid right-wing tea party morphed into the so-called "mainstream" Republican Party, today's NY Times' columns by Krugman and Tim Egan ("Loser's Poker") as well as dozens of Gail Collins' columns should go into the time capsule to put some perspective on the institutionalized insanity that now pervades our political system and is endorsed and reinforced by our media.
Besides the cast of crazy, lying politicians and the inept CNN moderators, even the garish set for the debate was bizarre, with GOP Pope Reagan's Air Force One plane in the background in his "Library," which several candidates occasionally turned around to give deference to during the debate when Reagan's name was invoked. Was Reagan was buried in that plane?
3
Yes, the Republican pact is full of liars and fools. The solution to this sad situation was offered by Edsall a few days ago: Fund the party, and not individual candidates. We need a few grown-ups in the room to decide who should lead the pact and not allow every narcissist under the sun to grab the microphone. When a great idea like this comes up, don't let it die.
The GOP fantasy world, the GOP world of lies, is the creation of the conservative media. It is the conservative media that has enabled the GOP insanity and given it a platform and the appearance of legitimacy and validity.
Two of the main architects of the conservative media are Rupert Murdoch and Roger Ailes. Murdoch got his start by inheriting tabloids and selling soft porn. He inherited tabloids that reportedly featured a bare top woman on page 3. With the revenue he purchased his way into MSM, a process that required him to fire legitimate, respected, honorable hardworking journalists, people like you and me with BAs or MAs, who were only trying to do their jobs. Their reward is they were fired. Roger Ailes got his start in political journalism by creating and promoting the lie that there was a new Nixon.
The key agenda of today’s conservative political and media leadership is to represent and promote the forces of concentration and oligarchy. Throughout recorded history, all past civilizations have shown the tendencies, the forces, of movement between oligarchy and democracy. (Democracy here means service of the interests of the nation and the public, not necessarily voting by any group.) History shows that power and wealth concentrate over time. (Reportedly a few Roman oligarchs came to own about half of North Africa.)
The tendency toward democracy leads to competent, sustainable management. The tendency toward concentration leads to corruption and collapse.
Two of the main architects of the conservative media are Rupert Murdoch and Roger Ailes. Murdoch got his start by inheriting tabloids and selling soft porn. He inherited tabloids that reportedly featured a bare top woman on page 3. With the revenue he purchased his way into MSM, a process that required him to fire legitimate, respected, honorable hardworking journalists, people like you and me with BAs or MAs, who were only trying to do their jobs. Their reward is they were fired. Roger Ailes got his start in political journalism by creating and promoting the lie that there was a new Nixon.
The key agenda of today’s conservative political and media leadership is to represent and promote the forces of concentration and oligarchy. Throughout recorded history, all past civilizations have shown the tendencies, the forces, of movement between oligarchy and democracy. (Democracy here means service of the interests of the nation and the public, not necessarily voting by any group.) History shows that power and wealth concentrate over time. (Reportedly a few Roman oligarchs came to own about half of North Africa.)
The tendency toward democracy leads to competent, sustainable management. The tendency toward concentration leads to corruption and collapse.
2
"As I wrote at the time, if Mr. Bush said the earth was flat, we’d see headlines along the lines of “Shape of the Planet: Both Sides Have a Point.”
I could not bring myself to watch the debate. The CNN format was for ratings only, strictly commercial. The media generally is failing as Prof K is pointing out. In this atrocious case, the candidates will spend mucho money and air time trying to erase the memory of their performances. They did reveal their characters to some extent so not a total loss.
The NYT publishes the good professor along with others that offer some hope. Cline this morning, for example, tells us that there are actually 18 moderate Republicans in Montana who vote their conscience and represent their constituents best interests as opposed to conforming to the empty ideology of their leaders. That is just awful isn't it? The gall.
Another good article appears recently regarding Alabama's actions to reintroduce science into their schools curriculum in response to the dismal reports of students ignorance in tests on basic science principles. Kind of promising.
On the other hand, a column by a NYT columnist advocating war with Iran was scary. My comment on that column did not get published I think because I called the idiot a fool. I am very sorry. Get carried away with myself sometimes.
My hope is that voters who read and think critically will actually vote in 2016. We will have a chance then.
I could not bring myself to watch the debate. The CNN format was for ratings only, strictly commercial. The media generally is failing as Prof K is pointing out. In this atrocious case, the candidates will spend mucho money and air time trying to erase the memory of their performances. They did reveal their characters to some extent so not a total loss.
The NYT publishes the good professor along with others that offer some hope. Cline this morning, for example, tells us that there are actually 18 moderate Republicans in Montana who vote their conscience and represent their constituents best interests as opposed to conforming to the empty ideology of their leaders. That is just awful isn't it? The gall.
Another good article appears recently regarding Alabama's actions to reintroduce science into their schools curriculum in response to the dismal reports of students ignorance in tests on basic science principles. Kind of promising.
On the other hand, a column by a NYT columnist advocating war with Iran was scary. My comment on that column did not get published I think because I called the idiot a fool. I am very sorry. Get carried away with myself sometimes.
My hope is that voters who read and think critically will actually vote in 2016. We will have a chance then.
3
The Republican "slash & burn" policies will turn us into a slave state in hell as the environment is devastated to provide foreign nations with our resources, more jobs are off-shored, automation is accelerated in the skeletal industrial sector & the social safety net is destroyed. Yet, millions of Americans think they're in the top ten percent & identify with Mit Romney as he assays a reentry into the The Greatest Show on Earth. This is an economy run on oil alright..snake oil.
4
If we want our candidates to tell the truth during these fantasy fiascoes, the participating news channel should run a crawl at the bottom of the screen with the actual facts of the issue. If the candidates were held with their feet to the fire, the flights of fantasy would be shorter and closer to Earth.
2
The only one I remember who revealed the lies and fabrications in past elections was John Stewart. And now he's gone. But how many people did he reach or do you reach? Not enough evidently. I have seen a lot of Presidents and elections come and go and I've never before been terrified. I am now and there is so much more time to live with anxiety about the future of this country. My best friend, an American living in England, kept asking me last night the why question. I couldn't think of one reason for a large group of inadequate individuals being in a race for a presidential nomination and for anyone in his/her right mind supporting them. The state of the Republican party is beyond comprehension and I think they are more dangerous to the well being of this country than any terrorists. The press has got to keep the heat on lies and fabrications and that means papers besides the NYT.
6
I'm wondering if more progressives should plan a trip instead of to some fashionable spot instead should plan a week or two living something approximating real life in a red state. Call it another kind of eco-travel, one of the political rather than environmental kind. A trip that creates opportunities to encounter the "natives" in their natural habitat.
I suggest it because while I agree with most comments made here, they do not have any relevancy or effect on those whose hearts and minds we simply must bring to our side. After living here for several years now having moved here from New York, Yes, they are the religious zealots, rabid Fox made ignorant and unthinking idiots you think they are. But is thinking so and only thinking so going to change their behavior?
No. It's only going to make them dig in their stubborn self destructive heels in deeper. If nothing else, this slate of candidates compared to the last presidential election proves it. If we want change, we are going to have to change too.
I suggest it because while I agree with most comments made here, they do not have any relevancy or effect on those whose hearts and minds we simply must bring to our side. After living here for several years now having moved here from New York, Yes, they are the religious zealots, rabid Fox made ignorant and unthinking idiots you think they are. But is thinking so and only thinking so going to change their behavior?
No. It's only going to make them dig in their stubborn self destructive heels in deeper. If nothing else, this slate of candidates compared to the last presidential election proves it. If we want change, we are going to have to change too.
3
NOTHING is going to change the mindset, beliefs, and behavior of the vast majority of those people. They're gone, and they're not coming back.
1
Criminy Krugman! Are you telling me I need to stop telling people that I rose from being a mere 16 year-old burger squire (it was an oddly monarchy-based fast-food chain) to being a successful, 40 year-old software engineer? I had assumed that this accomplishment, at the very least, qualified me for a shot at the U.S. Senate.
7
The choice for the voter is between propaganda and anarchy. We regarded the Soviet Union's press, Pravda, with contempt because its role was to sell the elite's weltanschauung as truth, no matter what the actual circumstances were. Earlier Joseph Goebbels did his part to bolster the notion that a ruling oligarchy can do more than just shape the truth; it can create it.
We've felt protected in America by our press, that bastion ruled by iconoclasts such as Mencken and Buchwald. However, these days, notwithstanding your contributions to the propagation of reality or those of Greenhouse and Blow, even the New York Times has become a haven for those who have discovered a Special Theory of Relativity in which truth is not absolute but defined no more by its actuality than shaped by the point of view inhabited by its perceiver.
Is it too difficult to state bluntly that there is a direct proportion between the number of firearms in a first-world country and that country's death rate from guns? Is it so upsetting to treat those who believe that the world began with a deity's breath 6000 years ago as the refugees from Bedlam that they are? Can the New York Times report that Jeb Bush said of his brother, "He kept us safe," and point out in 72-point type that
911 happened on GWB's watch
and keep pointing that out until Jeb stops making such a ridiculous claim?
We believed Murrow and Cronkite, and today's press has inherited their aura without sharing their candor and passion.
We've felt protected in America by our press, that bastion ruled by iconoclasts such as Mencken and Buchwald. However, these days, notwithstanding your contributions to the propagation of reality or those of Greenhouse and Blow, even the New York Times has become a haven for those who have discovered a Special Theory of Relativity in which truth is not absolute but defined no more by its actuality than shaped by the point of view inhabited by its perceiver.
Is it too difficult to state bluntly that there is a direct proportion between the number of firearms in a first-world country and that country's death rate from guns? Is it so upsetting to treat those who believe that the world began with a deity's breath 6000 years ago as the refugees from Bedlam that they are? Can the New York Times report that Jeb Bush said of his brother, "He kept us safe," and point out in 72-point type that
911 happened on GWB's watch
and keep pointing that out until Jeb stops making such a ridiculous claim?
We believed Murrow and Cronkite, and today's press has inherited their aura without sharing their candor and passion.
2
I think there is a chunk of the population who might vote Democratic in the face of these idiots but won't ever vote for a Clinton. The Dems are as much a part of the problem since Hillary Clinton is all but anointed, there is no other option. The Democrats can assume voters will see through the ridiculousness, they need to get out and point these fantasies out loud, often and repeatedly.
1
Your view of who "won" the debate largely depends on your party affiliation.
The Right like the hard-line positions of Cruz, Fiorina, Walker, Huckabee and Rubio. Everyone says Fiorino won, but I'm not so sure as the fact checkers are exposing several misstatements.
The Left (the NYT) like no one. To them everything the GOP states are "fantasies and fiction." Maybe, but the Democrats are no better. (Except for Sanders.)
Independents (which I am) like the more moderate thoughtful positions of Kasich, Bush, Carson, Paul and Christie. To me, Christie and Paul had the best debate performances, but I don't see either winning the nomination.
And then there are the people only tuning in for entertainment, and they account for most of the 23 million viewers. They like Trump. At least he's brining them in.
The Right like the hard-line positions of Cruz, Fiorina, Walker, Huckabee and Rubio. Everyone says Fiorino won, but I'm not so sure as the fact checkers are exposing several misstatements.
The Left (the NYT) like no one. To them everything the GOP states are "fantasies and fiction." Maybe, but the Democrats are no better. (Except for Sanders.)
Independents (which I am) like the more moderate thoughtful positions of Kasich, Bush, Carson, Paul and Christie. To me, Christie and Paul had the best debate performances, but I don't see either winning the nomination.
And then there are the people only tuning in for entertainment, and they account for most of the 23 million viewers. They like Trump. At least he's brining them in.
1
The economic problems we face, namely the lack of wage growth and quality job creation, is being felt on a global basis. Believe it or not, it is happening even in France with their socialist President.
So to blame our economic issues on Republcians is an intentional disotrtion of the truth y Krugman, who I am confident is aware of the relevant facts,
So to blame our economic issues on Republcians is an intentional disotrtion of the truth y Krugman, who I am confident is aware of the relevant facts,
"to blame our economic issues on Republcians is an intentional disotrtion of the truth"....Not true. Since 2010 the Republicans have controlled the House where all money bills must originate. The House Republicans have been wedded to austerity and supply side economics. Supply side economics are appropriate when inflation is high and corporate profit margins are modest. The situation today is inflation below 2% and corporate sector profit margins at an all time high. The correct economic policy today is demand side - rebuild our infrastructure, invest in education, and fund basic research. The Republican economic policies, controlled by the House, are ECON 101 stupid in today's environment.
1
"But who will tell the people?"
I share in your despair, Professor, but I think you're only halfway to the problem. You're right; the law of false equivalencies you describe amounts to grading candidates on a curve. Everyone gets a C in the truth department, no matter how far afield they might actually have been.
But my question is "When will the people start listening?" Because even the most cursory glance at the substance of what is being said, rather than the implicit imprimatur granted by the conduiting (as opposed to reporting, which requires critical thinking rather than just passing along whatever sewage is flushed into the pipe) profession, would reveal the disparities anyway. But an incurious public is perfectly happy to read the Cliffs Notes, no matter how deranged they might be, and move on.
I share in your despair, Professor, but I think you're only halfway to the problem. You're right; the law of false equivalencies you describe amounts to grading candidates on a curve. Everyone gets a C in the truth department, no matter how far afield they might actually have been.
But my question is "When will the people start listening?" Because even the most cursory glance at the substance of what is being said, rather than the implicit imprimatur granted by the conduiting (as opposed to reporting, which requires critical thinking rather than just passing along whatever sewage is flushed into the pipe) profession, would reveal the disparities anyway. But an incurious public is perfectly happy to read the Cliffs Notes, no matter how deranged they might be, and move on.
4
Why have the debates gotten record TV ratings? Not because viewers are hoping for well thought out policies or new ideas. Nope. It's because Trump has turned the debates into a political WWF. It's theatre for the low information, angry, extremist wing (duh base) of the Republican Party and like gawking at a car crash for the rest. Expecting anything meaningful to come out of these debates is also a fantasy.
4
To many untruths to correct all at once, but lets start with the economic one. Bill Clinton was president when, guess what, the INTERNET became a vehicle for large corporations and manufacturers to increase their efficiency. That accounted for about 99% of the growth there. Bush came along, had to deal with the 911 terror attacks, and 7.8 years we had great growth. The growth under Obama has been due to artificially low interest rates, which have built the two largest bubbles in US history, in equities and housing, while leaving the middle and lower classes struggling. The action by the Fed, just yesterday, shows this to be true, they are petrified to raise rates, even by 1/4 %!!! Unbelievable. And do not forget that sequestration is now also implemented, and the tremendous growth since 2013 came about with the largest cutting in federal spending in 50 years, which this same opinion writer had claimed would doom the economy.
3
Excellent correction to Krugman's cherry-picked and incorrect "facts."
May I add: In Clinton's last year, the dot.com bubble burst, and the NASDAQ dropped from 5000 to 3000 on its way to 1300. That caused the need for the May 2001 "Bush tax cuts." (Voted for by 11 Dem Senators, including Torricelli, Blanche Lincoln and Mary Landrieu). The Sept 2008 collapse was due to the housing bubble, notably fueled by Bill Clinton and Janet Reno (and an incidental part of that was the Buycks-Roberson vs Citibank Chicago case where one lawyer was Barack Obama) as they forced banks to make loans (subprime) to unqualified buyers. And "the best job growth since the 1990s?" Not true, plus 1) widely seen that this is the slowest recovery from recession/depression on record, and 2) the 94 million Americans now out of work is the shameful record fact.
May I add: In Clinton's last year, the dot.com bubble burst, and the NASDAQ dropped from 5000 to 3000 on its way to 1300. That caused the need for the May 2001 "Bush tax cuts." (Voted for by 11 Dem Senators, including Torricelli, Blanche Lincoln and Mary Landrieu). The Sept 2008 collapse was due to the housing bubble, notably fueled by Bill Clinton and Janet Reno (and an incidental part of that was the Buycks-Roberson vs Citibank Chicago case where one lawyer was Barack Obama) as they forced banks to make loans (subprime) to unqualified buyers. And "the best job growth since the 1990s?" Not true, plus 1) widely seen that this is the slowest recovery from recession/depression on record, and 2) the 94 million Americans now out of work is the shameful record fact.
Whom the gods would destroy, they first make crazy, and it's ok with me if the gods want to destroy Republicans. But darn, I really don't want to be standing near them when it happens!
5
There was a healthy substantive debate of a lot of issues on Wednesday night. If Democrats disagree, they should engage in that discussion rather than just call names from the sidelines.
Here's one: immigration. The Republican candidates have very differing views, but they all agree on one thing: we cannot continue to be a country that does not enforce its immigration laws. They agree that we need to enforce our borders, stop the inflow of illegal immigration, and deport people who overstay their visas, and that we need to do that first before we resolve what to do with all of the people who are already here. Hillary's response appears to be to turn all of the current illegals into Democratic voters at the outset and worry later about border enforcement. Is that a good policy for American workers, American schools, etc.? How can Democrats possible call for a higher minimum wage while doing nothing to crack down on illegal immigrant labor which is always under the table?
And what about Social Security? Crickets from the Democrats. And Medicare? More crickets.
What about a national security policy that does nothing to prevent genocide in the Middle East, but says we have a moral responsibility to open our doors to refugees when they arrive at our doorstep?
The people want these debates. The Republicans are having it. Will the Democrats engage, or just content themselves with calling Republicans morons and no-nothings while eating cake in their ivory towers?
Here's one: immigration. The Republican candidates have very differing views, but they all agree on one thing: we cannot continue to be a country that does not enforce its immigration laws. They agree that we need to enforce our borders, stop the inflow of illegal immigration, and deport people who overstay their visas, and that we need to do that first before we resolve what to do with all of the people who are already here. Hillary's response appears to be to turn all of the current illegals into Democratic voters at the outset and worry later about border enforcement. Is that a good policy for American workers, American schools, etc.? How can Democrats possible call for a higher minimum wage while doing nothing to crack down on illegal immigrant labor which is always under the table?
And what about Social Security? Crickets from the Democrats. And Medicare? More crickets.
What about a national security policy that does nothing to prevent genocide in the Middle East, but says we have a moral responsibility to open our doors to refugees when they arrive at our doorstep?
The people want these debates. The Republicans are having it. Will the Democrats engage, or just content themselves with calling Republicans morons and no-nothings while eating cake in their ivory towers?
38
You can have a debate about anything; even flat out lies.
Besides I didn't notice any Democrats at that debate. I don't think the Democrats have HAD a debate yet. When they do, I am sure they will discuss the country's issues.
Perhaps with not so many lies.
Also, all of the Democratic hopefuls have mentioned border enforcement. Also, it has been suggested that a higher minimum wage actually helps the economy because the people living paycheck to paycheck are spending it all. Which is why large corporations (Walmart) are supporting it and acting to increase the minimum wage.
The only ones hurt - and only temporarily - are small businesses. That's because they would have to shell out the money first, before the spending kicks in. An easy fix would be to exempt small business from increasing their minimum wage for a period of time, until they start seeing more revenue.
This was suggested by the Independent candidate for governor in Kentucky. Makes perfect sense.
Besides I didn't notice any Democrats at that debate. I don't think the Democrats have HAD a debate yet. When they do, I am sure they will discuss the country's issues.
Perhaps with not so many lies.
Also, all of the Democratic hopefuls have mentioned border enforcement. Also, it has been suggested that a higher minimum wage actually helps the economy because the people living paycheck to paycheck are spending it all. Which is why large corporations (Walmart) are supporting it and acting to increase the minimum wage.
The only ones hurt - and only temporarily - are small businesses. That's because they would have to shell out the money first, before the spending kicks in. An easy fix would be to exempt small business from increasing their minimum wage for a period of time, until they start seeing more revenue.
This was suggested by the Independent candidate for governor in Kentucky. Makes perfect sense.
1
"And what about Social Security? Crickets from the Democrats. And Medicare? More crickets."
These two funds have a few decades of solvency as they stand. Careful adjustments over the next 15 years will extend their solvency for a another few decades, and genuine support for a robust economy that includes the most people possible will keep these funds solvent for the rest of the century.
You hear crickets because, like many of the GOP red-herring "issues", it uses up space in the political discussion and it doesn't really matter.
These two funds have a few decades of solvency as they stand. Careful adjustments over the next 15 years will extend their solvency for a another few decades, and genuine support for a robust economy that includes the most people possible will keep these funds solvent for the rest of the century.
You hear crickets because, like many of the GOP red-herring "issues", it uses up space in the political discussion and it doesn't really matter.
Republicans are not having debates. They are having auditions.
1
The False News industry is a threat to our democracy. The continuous spewing of fakery and distortion and manipulation to almost one-half of the populace (the half that is glued to it like it is the last life-raft on a sinking ship) is shaking the foundations of our society. The combination of gullibility and mendaciousness is a potent one.
There was a time when facts were shared by both parties...interpretations and emphasis were different because there are real stylistic and psychologic and values differences among people. But facts were shared.
The "Real News" is also under threat because it is subject now to "market forces", that is non-profit, loss leader, money losing engines of investigative reporting have been abandoned for prettified corporate frontages looking to capture eyeballs to boost advertising revenues. Ideological "owners" of news organizations hold sway too much -- as with False News -- not as bad yet, but discernible.
Fat cats of sincerely held and/or cynically wielded politics have us by the throat and are squeezing hard. The irony of the communication age is that it allows poisons and elixirs, substance and pap, to flow equally freely into boutique world views, sustaining them against reality. The absence of government supports for non-commercial sources of news leaves us without a paddle and up the proverbial creek for non-market-driven sources and tie-breakers.
There was a time when facts were shared by both parties...interpretations and emphasis were different because there are real stylistic and psychologic and values differences among people. But facts were shared.
The "Real News" is also under threat because it is subject now to "market forces", that is non-profit, loss leader, money losing engines of investigative reporting have been abandoned for prettified corporate frontages looking to capture eyeballs to boost advertising revenues. Ideological "owners" of news organizations hold sway too much -- as with False News -- not as bad yet, but discernible.
Fat cats of sincerely held and/or cynically wielded politics have us by the throat and are squeezing hard. The irony of the communication age is that it allows poisons and elixirs, substance and pap, to flow equally freely into boutique world views, sustaining them against reality. The absence of government supports for non-commercial sources of news leaves us without a paddle and up the proverbial creek for non-market-driven sources and tie-breakers.
4
Fetuses-on-the-table is but the beginning. The Republican debate offered America Fools-on-the-table. Paul, between your column and the offering today by Brooks, I have been nearly reduced to tears.
This is a terrible way to enter a weekend.
The Democrats, if they try to present truths and common sense as the foundations of their platform, had better hire an excellent stage producer. Who might that be? Aesop?
This is a terrible way to enter a weekend.
The Democrats, if they try to present truths and common sense as the foundations of their platform, had better hire an excellent stage producer. Who might that be? Aesop?
6
This is just the preliminary round played to a small, unsophisticated audience that think in slogans and one syllable words. Look at the states where this is being played out. Except for the last debate in California ( dead to the Republican cause in every way by their own hand ), New Hampshire, Iowa and the like are limited in every way when compared to other states.
Media is driving this circus, because it is entertaining and no matter what is said, no matter how ridiculous, outrageous, or silly there will always be someone who believes it. P.T. Barnum would be proud, because so far no republican candidate has ever underestimated the gullibility of the American public in the early stages of a campaign. To be credible, the party will have to at some point strap on a pair ( sorry Mrs Fiorina, but you're in the game too )
And talk to the American voter as adults decision makers. If not, then they continue their journey to marginalization.
Media is driving this circus, because it is entertaining and no matter what is said, no matter how ridiculous, outrageous, or silly there will always be someone who believes it. P.T. Barnum would be proud, because so far no republican candidate has ever underestimated the gullibility of the American public in the early stages of a campaign. To be credible, the party will have to at some point strap on a pair ( sorry Mrs Fiorina, but you're in the game too )
And talk to the American voter as adults decision makers. If not, then they continue their journey to marginalization.
3
Krugman keeps pushing this false narrative correlating the Clinton tax increase with the growth of the 90s. That is as false as the claims that tax cuts automatically equal growth. The real stimulus related effects from tax cuts at the federal level were largely wrung out when Reagan made the marginal rates rational in his first budget. The growth of the 90s was largely driven by long term interest rates dropping in half with a dramatic increase coming in the Fall of '93. Mortgages written at 10% (or higher) in the 80s were refinanced to 5% and this freed up a lot of disposable income. The corrosive effects of NAFTA and other free trade deals hadn't happened yet, so when the economy recovered, people actually got work making things. Finally, you had an equity asset bubble fueled by some misguided de-regulation that fed a temporary boom which ended about the minute Clinton left office. His timing in office could not have been more charmed. That, more than any policy of his resulted in the growth. Now we need to undo our terrible trade policies, reform immigration so that new jobs actually go to CITIZENS here, and reset our regulatory priorities. A renewal of something like Glass-Stegall would be good as would reducing delays in development from needless zoning and environmental reviews. Krugman is as off base as some of the people he decries.
1
The point is tha tax cuts have had no other function than to enrich the rich.
1
There more than a little of the spirit of pre World War I Europe in the Republican view of international affairs, and the promise of stalemates and costly but futile military efforts which characterized that war. The great imperial states each thought that their elan and flashing bayonets would cause their enemies to flee in fear if they just acted boldly but nobody did and a great stalemate resulted but the mentality caused both sides to try to brutally force a decision with frontal assaults against machine guns and artillery until none of the empires could endure, and disappeared.
Obama's cautiousness maybe less apparently decisive than Bush's swaggering recklessness but it's more reasonable considerate of reality.
Obama's cautiousness maybe less apparently decisive than Bush's swaggering recklessness but it's more reasonable considerate of reality.
5
This column has far more fantasy and fiction than anything that was said in the debate. To assert that raising taxes is what caused the boom in the 90's is pure fantasy, and easily disproved by the facts. The fastest quarter of growth during the 90's occurred under George H.W. Bush, prior to Clinton taking office. Why did the author not mention that? Clinton's tax increases slowed the economy, but because of the dot com boom, the economy continued to prosper. And no one on the stage called for lowering taxes on the rich, that is completely dishonest. To think that people read these columns and believe them scares me.
4
Krugman never said that raising taxes caused the boom. He's detailed the causes of the boom elsewhere. His point is that the conservative establishment universally said that raising taxes would destroy the economy, and the conservatives were 100% wrong. Under Bush and Brownback, the conservative establishment said that lowering taxes would jumpstart the economy, and the conservative establishment was 100% wrong.
4
Exactly, I have worked in high tech for my entire career, and in 1996 even the companies making the computer chips and modem chips were implementing the internet and Just in Time manufacturing, getting the best prices on products and services and commodities, and overall increasing their efficiency ten fold. Mickey Mouse could have been in charge during that time, and the economy would still have expanded greatly.
1
If one of these candidates becomes president and the GOP controls both the house and senate, I will leave the country. For it is absolutely true that a nation gets the government it deserves.
Luckily I can afford to due this because when my great-grand parents and grand parent came to this country in steerage to begin new lives The United States was a true meritocracy with liberty and justice for all.
If the PACs and corporate donors think they can control these demagods, they has better start reading history.
Luckily I can afford to due this because when my great-grand parents and grand parent came to this country in steerage to begin new lives The United States was a true meritocracy with liberty and justice for all.
If the PACs and corporate donors think they can control these demagods, they has better start reading history.
9
Your comment is baffling. Republicans want to reduce the size of government, but if the most right-leaning of all of them accomplishes every one of his or her goals, the government will still be far more expansive and intrusive than it was 30, 40, 50, 80 years ago when according to you this country was a true meritocracy with liberty and justice for all. So what are you even talking about.
And special interests? Do you know what special interest is the single most harmful to meritocracy in this country? Teachers unions. And which party do they have wrapped around their finger?
And special interests? Do you know what special interest is the single most harmful to meritocracy in this country? Teachers unions. And which party do they have wrapped around their finger?
why wait for the elections? move to Brail now. i have been here one year and it is one of the best decisions i have ever made.
http://brazilforlife.com/
http://brazilforlife.com/
Professor,
Is it not just possible that the system has become so corrupt and unworkable, financing-electoral-media, that the only way the the United States will every come out of the mess we made is via a great calamity?
I think that people will have to starve en-mass and/or a sizable group of Americans will have to decide that violence is what it will take to affect real change. Nothing else seems to be working to deal with the great issues of our day.
Is it not just possible that the system has become so corrupt and unworkable, financing-electoral-media, that the only way the the United States will every come out of the mess we made is via a great calamity?
I think that people will have to starve en-mass and/or a sizable group of Americans will have to decide that violence is what it will take to affect real change. Nothing else seems to be working to deal with the great issues of our day.
3
we have the power to elect Bernie Sanders, the only candidate that is proposing real polices to address these issues.
1
How's Bernie going to fix the economy? Sky-high taxes and free college for everyone? You think it's not an economic fantasy that that will not crush our economy.
The problem with Bernie's ideas is that they've been tried and do not work. I'm not using this label as an insult, but he's a socialist. He wants to tax the rich to provide for the poor through more public assistance. The most practical problem with that is that it requires a growing economy to sustain. In other words, it may work in a world where the rich keep getting richer because there is a bigger and bigger pot of money for the government to draw from in taxes. But in reality, confiscatory taxes depress growth and make the rich poorer. Meanwhile, the poor get richer in some ways (i.e., publically funded services), but at the expense of higher unemployment.
It's ironic that the party who loves to hate the "rich" are absolutely dependent on them to make any of the spending policies work.
The problem with Bernie's ideas is that they've been tried and do not work. I'm not using this label as an insult, but he's a socialist. He wants to tax the rich to provide for the poor through more public assistance. The most practical problem with that is that it requires a growing economy to sustain. In other words, it may work in a world where the rich keep getting richer because there is a bigger and bigger pot of money for the government to draw from in taxes. But in reality, confiscatory taxes depress growth and make the rich poorer. Meanwhile, the poor get richer in some ways (i.e., publically funded services), but at the expense of higher unemployment.
It's ironic that the party who loves to hate the "rich" are absolutely dependent on them to make any of the spending policies work.
The tax rates are too low for the needs of our country, they are not generating enough revenues to avoid having to borrow money just for the budgeted things let alone the costly to address crises. While cutting taxes is supposed to free up money that can be used by private entities to fund economic activities if the government is borrowing money, it's taking capital out of the economy and increasing the demand long with interest rates as it borrows money, and the costs are paid by those who do pay taxes. When this is what happens, tax cuts are not the stimulating activities asserted but a churning activity that actually wastes money even while it redistributes the burden of paying taxes from the more able to pay to those less able to pay.
6
The Federal Government is receiving record sums of money. Reading Krugman every day will keep you very uninformed.
I haven't waded through all of the comments here, much less all of the commentary on the debates available elsewhere, but I have been surprised not to see anyone--not the moderators of the "debate," not the gaggle of candidates on the state, and not any pundits or fact-checkers commenting on the debate--point out that Carly Fiorina states her belief that constitutional amendments require two-thirds of the state to approve them. In fact, of course, as we were all taught in school, but obviously not everyone learned, it requires approval by three-fourths of the states.
11
I noticed that, too. But noticing a falsehood or inaccuracy during that debate doesn't - I'm sorry - rate an award, as Mr. K. demonstrates in this article. Now if some enterprising young reporter wants to (and has the stomach to) compile a compendium of lies, mistakes, proven false assumptions and failed philosophies discussed during this marathon 'debate', it might rightly take its place next to Barlett's or Webster's on the library reference table - and be roughly the same size,
6
Pretty sure she said two thirds of Congress, which is correct, then it needs to go to the state.
Good point, and it must be assumed by now that Carly Fiorina knows absolutely nothing about how our government works. Which makes sense, as she's never held any governing office, and the job she did have, CEO at HP, she did so abysmally that it nearly destroyed the major corporation itself.
Here is the real problem the GOP has: they can't attack the economic and foreign policies of the Obama administration. While 2008 was a change election from a bumbling president; 2016 is an attempt to try to fit his shoes.
Allies don't respect us? Iran deal? They are one in the same. Working in a US-led world wide coalition. Jeb wants to "restore the Obama financial damage over the last 6 and 1/2 years? 66 months of job growth with an unemployment rate 5.1%. And the ex-president's brother makes this claim after leaving the truck in the hole?
Trump on Russia. Sounded like Bush 43 ""I looked the man in the eye. I found him to be very straightforward and trustworthy".
Planned parenthood? No one answered the question of shutting the government down, but they did rant enough to satisfy the Evangelicals.
The debate had no real agenda. In large part because elections have to do with the financial health of the country. That central issue is missing.
The real problem, is both parties don't have (a) a change cause to fight for and (b) any candidate that is remotely close to - a president we will all be longing for in 2017 - President Obama.
Allies don't respect us? Iran deal? They are one in the same. Working in a US-led world wide coalition. Jeb wants to "restore the Obama financial damage over the last 6 and 1/2 years? 66 months of job growth with an unemployment rate 5.1%. And the ex-president's brother makes this claim after leaving the truck in the hole?
Trump on Russia. Sounded like Bush 43 ""I looked the man in the eye. I found him to be very straightforward and trustworthy".
Planned parenthood? No one answered the question of shutting the government down, but they did rant enough to satisfy the Evangelicals.
The debate had no real agenda. In large part because elections have to do with the financial health of the country. That central issue is missing.
The real problem, is both parties don't have (a) a change cause to fight for and (b) any candidate that is remotely close to - a president we will all be longing for in 2017 - President Obama.
7
We will not get out of this hole with Congress neglecting fiscal policy and leaving the gap to the Federal Reserve Bank to attempt to fill with monetary policy.
I agree with much of John's comments, but "both parties" is a bit too "even handed". The Dems do not have anyone remotely as crazy as the GOP/Ters were during the "debate".
I would add that this was no "debate". It was a lot of statements made to gain attention by exaggerations/lies/misrepresentations. CNN did a worse job than Fox, and I am no fan of Fox.
Trump's last statement said it all: much of what you heard you will forget and life will go on. My take is that the Donald told us to ignore the entire evening. Too bad he did not tell us that earlier!
I would add that this was no "debate". It was a lot of statements made to gain attention by exaggerations/lies/misrepresentations. CNN did a worse job than Fox, and I am no fan of Fox.
Trump's last statement said it all: much of what you heard you will forget and life will go on. My take is that the Donald told us to ignore the entire evening. Too bad he did not tell us that earlier!
1
Why do Republicans insist on lying about Planned Parenthood every chance they get? The facts are that only 3 percent of PP's total services are for abortions. The other 97 percent of services are for contraception, treatment and tests for sexually transmitted diseases, cancer screenings, and other women’s health services. And, here's the part the Republicans lie about the most, no federal funds are spent on abortions. Federal law already forbids funding of abortions. Federal funds are spend on other health services. Yes, some, but not all, PP clinics perform abortions. But, they are paid for by the patients themselves, or by funds from private donations.
What Republicans will not tell you is their hatred of PP is really an extension of their contempt for the poor. Why would anyone object to providing health services for poor women? What do Republicans have against screening for cancer? Or, providing mammograms and birth control information?
The Republicans deny they are conducting a war on women, but what else can it be when they tell lies in an effort to stop health services from being available for women? And, for Ms. Fiorina, the only woman in the Republican gaggle of candidates to also perpetuate the PP lies and to also support denying health services for other women is especially obscene.
What Republicans will not tell you is their hatred of PP is really an extension of their contempt for the poor. Why would anyone object to providing health services for poor women? What do Republicans have against screening for cancer? Or, providing mammograms and birth control information?
The Republicans deny they are conducting a war on women, but what else can it be when they tell lies in an effort to stop health services from being available for women? And, for Ms. Fiorina, the only woman in the Republican gaggle of candidates to also perpetuate the PP lies and to also support denying health services for other women is especially obscene.
53
In my state, PP is the single largest performer of abortions. The one in the next town does several hundred a year. What some people seem unable to grasp is that your "war on women" is also seen as a merciless war on the unborn. It is another case of the strong overpowering the weak. If is this PP "health service" that causes it to be an abomination in the eyes of pro-life. Republicans, of course, have taken advantage of this, conning pro-life people into voting for them and their pro-rich, anti-everything else agenda.
2
Sorry, I think Americans are smart, honest and hard working, but they have immediate worries and they mostly hope that reasonable will prevail. unfortunately the pendulum has swung too far. We need to get the word out that this is now beyond the pale. Would the Democratic Party please stand up?
3 percent of PP services are abortions, but more than 50% of abortions are performed by PP. THAT is why. And it is a myth that PP is the only organization capable of performing GYN exams for poor women. The concept of not giving taxpayer dollars to organizations that perform abortions shouldn't be controversial at all.
"Who will tell the people" gets at the essence of the problem. The notion that all statements constitute "sides," and that all "sides" deserve equal treatment in the press, has contributed to boldface lies, bullying, repetition of ridiculous assertions, etc., being treated as serious considerations. No, Planned Parenthood doesn't sell baby parts, and no, Obama is not Muslim, and no, trickle-down economics doesn't work, and no, it's not President Obama's fault...because Obama. The GOP has changed the game of politics competely, so that a few major donors fund campaigns and extremist statements are accepted as reality. It is the job of the press to challenge the false statements and not give them credibility. They aren't real "sides." Real arguments would include plausible differences of opinion on foreign policy, economics, social issues, and the rest of it, not lies and absurdities vs. reality of any sort. The press has helped create this. The extremist right wing Republican party has taken control of the dialogue. They rant on unchallenged, really. That's why the debates are so meaningless. They only serve to shock and dismay. Are we really this? When will we bring the dialogue back to reality?
39
The press is as rotted-out with the excuse that profit justifies suspension of all values as the rest of the interlocked directorship staging this farce.
1
It was quite fitting that the GOP's onward march toward degeneracy was highlighted at an event held at the presidential library of the man who set it all in motion: Ronald Reagan.
Ever since Bush 41, the GOP has been trying to outdo the man who injected bad ideas into the mainstream. The sad spectacle of Jeb! Bush suggesting Maggie Thatcher for the $10 illustrates how far these bad ideas have polluted the GOP establishment.
Unless we make a clean break with the Reagan "legacy", this country is condemned to having these toxic ideas thrust time and again as a solution to all our ills.
Tax cuts, deregulation and privatization with a whiff of veiled racism have done nothing but bring misery and failure unless you are one of those in the top .1% of asset owners who consider someone like Carly Fiorina hired help.
Ever since Bush 41, the GOP has been trying to outdo the man who injected bad ideas into the mainstream. The sad spectacle of Jeb! Bush suggesting Maggie Thatcher for the $10 illustrates how far these bad ideas have polluted the GOP establishment.
Unless we make a clean break with the Reagan "legacy", this country is condemned to having these toxic ideas thrust time and again as a solution to all our ills.
Tax cuts, deregulation and privatization with a whiff of veiled racism have done nothing but bring misery and failure unless you are one of those in the top .1% of asset owners who consider someone like Carly Fiorina hired help.
29
Well, sure, every Republican candidate is clearly either incredibly deluded or lying most of the time, or both. I think some, like John "Jeb!" Bush, are well aware that they're lying, and most others, like Rafael "Ted" Cruz, have no idea that they're lying. But there's very little doubt that when it comes to facts, they're all wrong nearly all of the time, with each one managing to be right about one thing at some point.
But the American people don't care, because most Americans have no idea what facts are. They think the Bible is literally true, they think racism is based on actual differences between ethnicities, they think whatever they want to be true simply is true. They think vaccines cause autism because they aren't scientists and don't understand either vaccines or autism in the slightest. They think lower taxes on the rich will lead to everyone being rich, because they really want to be rich.
In short, a large part of American people are very, very dumb, and easily lied to and manipulated. And if we get any of these total bozos in office, we will suffer as a nation for it, and we will deserve that suffering. Probably it will destroy us, half of these twits seem primed to initiate nuclear war with China and/or Russia, and that will kill us all. And we'll deserve it.
We are living proof that democracy depends on solid educational systems and people having high morals and interest in bettering society. Since we have none of that, our democracy will fail.
But the American people don't care, because most Americans have no idea what facts are. They think the Bible is literally true, they think racism is based on actual differences between ethnicities, they think whatever they want to be true simply is true. They think vaccines cause autism because they aren't scientists and don't understand either vaccines or autism in the slightest. They think lower taxes on the rich will lead to everyone being rich, because they really want to be rich.
In short, a large part of American people are very, very dumb, and easily lied to and manipulated. And if we get any of these total bozos in office, we will suffer as a nation for it, and we will deserve that suffering. Probably it will destroy us, half of these twits seem primed to initiate nuclear war with China and/or Russia, and that will kill us all. And we'll deserve it.
We are living proof that democracy depends on solid educational systems and people having high morals and interest in bettering society. Since we have none of that, our democracy will fail.
57
Krugman would do his readers a better service by picking a single topic and engaging in a substantive point/counterpoint. The debate I watched on Wednesday was full of substance, and substantive disagreement. It would be nice to see the Democrats engage in that debate of ideas as well instead of hiding behind podiums. Then maybe we'll see who's peddling fantasy. Because I'd love to hear Bernie Sanders explain how he's going to raise enough taxes to fund free college for everyone while doing no harm to the economy. Or let Hillary explain how continued disengagement from the Middle East isn't affecting us when hundreds of thousands of war-torn refugees are now fleeing to the West. Or let any of them explain how their constantly growing entitlement state can coexist will open borders.
3
Oh, you watched a different debate? Who was in it?
14
Tell me who is going to pay for this fence along the border running through desserts, over mountains, and through private land. You call this quality debate over quality issues? Really? We are going to spend millions when immigration from Mexico is and has been zero for years. We need debate on how to pay for infastructure needs not, not a "Berlin Wall" for America. We need to admit that global warming has contributed to the western drought, Sandy destruction, food shortages and begin programs of solutions. There was not discussion of any of these present needs.
9
I actually do think we need a wall, a physical barrier that not only keeps people out but deters them from coming. And while most of the net illegal immigrants aren't coming from Mexico, they are coming through Mexico. Along with gangs, drugs, and violence.
And a little known fact is that if they get to our side of the border and get caught, in most cases we give them a bus pass of a plane ticket and send them to the interior of the US to await an immigration hearing that they almost never show up to. If we have a wall, they'll get here and turn back, and soon stop making the perilous trek altogether. So yes, I think we need a wall, and there is plenty of evidence that building the wall will cost us a lot less than what we're paying in public assistance for illegal immigrants and their children.
That's not the only part of the answer, but I do think it makes the other problems easier to solve. Like what to do with the people who are already here. And I agree with Rubio that we will find a compassionate answer to that problem.
In any event, I don't get why Democrats don't love the idea of building a wall. Just think of all the government-funded construction jobs it will create!
And a little known fact is that if they get to our side of the border and get caught, in most cases we give them a bus pass of a plane ticket and send them to the interior of the US to await an immigration hearing that they almost never show up to. If we have a wall, they'll get here and turn back, and soon stop making the perilous trek altogether. So yes, I think we need a wall, and there is plenty of evidence that building the wall will cost us a lot less than what we're paying in public assistance for illegal immigrants and their children.
That's not the only part of the answer, but I do think it makes the other problems easier to solve. Like what to do with the people who are already here. And I agree with Rubio that we will find a compassionate answer to that problem.
In any event, I don't get why Democrats don't love the idea of building a wall. Just think of all the government-funded construction jobs it will create!
The GOP has been co-opted by radical right wing fiscal Republicans like The Koch Brothers, whose father was one of the principles in the founding of the John Birch Society (a paranoid conspiracy group), and Sheldon Adelson who is obsessed with ultra right wing Israeli policies.
They have hired political operatives and wordsmiths to sell their policies to the former Dixiecrats, fundamentalist Christians, and other poor disaffected people, getting them to believe against all salient evidence that somehow their lives will get better when the rich take even more of the financial pie that they presently dominate.
These fallacies include but aren't limited to:
Pollution is OK but environmental protection is bad because it has regulations.
Consumer protection is bad because it requires financial institutions to let people understand financial transactions and that requires more regulations.
Education is bad because it creates more liberal thoughts.
We don't need to worry about Global Climate Change because some scientists connected to polluting energy industries say that it "isn't settled science."
They also attract the bigots and xenophobes by questioning the president's birth certificate and religion (just yesterday at the wild Trump rally) and use the term "States Rights" (the same phrase used by all the desegregationist bigots after the Civil Rights Act was passed in the sixties. They avoid using the "N" word but they achieve the same effect.
They have hired political operatives and wordsmiths to sell their policies to the former Dixiecrats, fundamentalist Christians, and other poor disaffected people, getting them to believe against all salient evidence that somehow their lives will get better when the rich take even more of the financial pie that they presently dominate.
These fallacies include but aren't limited to:
Pollution is OK but environmental protection is bad because it has regulations.
Consumer protection is bad because it requires financial institutions to let people understand financial transactions and that requires more regulations.
Education is bad because it creates more liberal thoughts.
We don't need to worry about Global Climate Change because some scientists connected to polluting energy industries say that it "isn't settled science."
They also attract the bigots and xenophobes by questioning the president's birth certificate and religion (just yesterday at the wild Trump rally) and use the term "States Rights" (the same phrase used by all the desegregationist bigots after the Civil Rights Act was passed in the sixties. They avoid using the "N" word but they achieve the same effect.
44
How sad. Hopefully Hillary can put the email and Benghazi non-issues to rest (hard when that is all the media talks about with her). The fact that these politicians outright lie about most things is very disturbing, but the fact that so many republican followers believe it no matter how many respected journalists call them out on their outright lies and pants-on-fire statements. The Planned Parenthood thing has been so blown out of proportion I cannot believe it. Republicans act like the government is giving the organization millions of dollars to do abortions and then they also get the profits from selling the baby parts. Nobody says its tissues for medical science that may provide important cures for our many diseases. Nobody says its because the government is reimbursing a medical clinic for taking care of poor women's health issues. Carly wants Hillary to view the abortion made up videos - how sick is that. Who keeps watching that stuff?
20
The same people who watch "reality" TV.
1
Most candidates also bragged about "rebuilding" our military and mending our relationship with our allies... When did our military become unfit? The U.S. defense budget is still higher than the combined 12-13 countries behind us. The U.S. is the only country in the world capable of projecting force to 2 or more separate battlefields. Except for PM Netanyahu, I believe we have better relationships with most of our allies compared to the end of the Bush administration. The absence of factual information in the debate was very disturbing; I'm not a liberal but would be more reassured to have Hillary Clinton or Joe Biden as our commander in chief than any of the contenders we saw on the debate stage.
30
Sanders is better then those two "Democrat warriors" you mention.
If we as a people don't register and more importantly vote we will get one of these men in the White House to complement our dysfunctional, but legally elected Congress. I say men because Ms. Fiorina, despite her charm, doesn't have a chance.
While it is good the "fantasies and fictions" are exposed, similar light shown on candidates for various offices throughout our nation have done little to halt the acceptance of the fairy tale of trickle down economics, need for the most costly military in the history of the world and police departments that more closely resemble a reincarnation of the infamous SS than the beat cop of old magazine covers.
For some time we have allowed the delusion of a strong military to overshadow and cloud our thoughts from the reality that other nations exist and might actually question the hegemony our leaders propose.
We as a nation account for less than 5% of the world's population and those on stage represent far less yet propose bending the the rest of the world to their
confused will through the use of force.
As the GOP hero Mr. Reagan pointed out there is no wall that can stop human progress and desire for freedom especially the one the participants in Wednesday's talentless forum wish to erect between them and intelligent thought.
Regardless, the fact remains one of these misled and deluded men has a chance to direct our nation of over 320 million human beings on their path to irrecoverable ruin.
Urge everyone to register and vote.
While it is good the "fantasies and fictions" are exposed, similar light shown on candidates for various offices throughout our nation have done little to halt the acceptance of the fairy tale of trickle down economics, need for the most costly military in the history of the world and police departments that more closely resemble a reincarnation of the infamous SS than the beat cop of old magazine covers.
For some time we have allowed the delusion of a strong military to overshadow and cloud our thoughts from the reality that other nations exist and might actually question the hegemony our leaders propose.
We as a nation account for less than 5% of the world's population and those on stage represent far less yet propose bending the the rest of the world to their
confused will through the use of force.
As the GOP hero Mr. Reagan pointed out there is no wall that can stop human progress and desire for freedom especially the one the participants in Wednesday's talentless forum wish to erect between them and intelligent thought.
Regardless, the fact remains one of these misled and deluded men has a chance to direct our nation of over 320 million human beings on their path to irrecoverable ruin.
Urge everyone to register and vote.
36
@ Ian McFarlane
"Ms. Fiorina, despite her charm,"
Dripping sarcasm -- love it !!
"Ms. Fiorina, despite her charm,"
Dripping sarcasm -- love it !!
1
At least 40% of the people would have believed the earth was flat if George W Bush had said so, Paul, and a disturbingly large number would have had doubts about its shape.
Enough true believers Paul that there are 54 Republican senators and 247 representatives.
They believe that corporations are people too.
They'd rather war with Iran than treaty.
They believe deficits and debt are evil, but taxes are more evil.
They have no problem with 3% of the people controlling 54% of the nation's wealth and 31% of its income.
They believe that Barack Obama is responsible for the nation's ills, not 35 years of Conservative policy and if one can believe that believing the world is flat is possible.
They vote Republican.
.
Enough true believers Paul that there are 54 Republican senators and 247 representatives.
They believe that corporations are people too.
They'd rather war with Iran than treaty.
They believe deficits and debt are evil, but taxes are more evil.
They have no problem with 3% of the people controlling 54% of the nation's wealth and 31% of its income.
They believe that Barack Obama is responsible for the nation's ills, not 35 years of Conservative policy and if one can believe that believing the world is flat is possible.
They vote Republican.
.
59
Charie is right and wrong. He is right about Kasich, but the reason that Krugman and the New York Times will never mention him is that they hope to destroy him by denying him all name recognition. But you can't do that once Iowa and NH come. Bush will be out then. Trump will come to bore, and people will ask what do we need in a foreign policy and economic mess. Who else are they going to vote for other than Christie. Who are they going to put up when they ask how to win.
There is one other candidate whom Krugman never mentions, Carson. He is after all running number two with competence and a reasoned posture. Wouldn't Krugman call the Republicans racist if they never mentioned the number two person in the polls if he were black? But Krugman and the Times are not interested in reporting and analyzing white Republican support for him.
Anything to try to destroy the Republican brand so they are not driven to support a liberal such as Sanders or Warren--or an moderate right-center such as Biden who has consistently opposed the Obama-Hillary-Netanyahu foreign policy for the last seven years.
There is one other candidate whom Krugman never mentions, Carson. He is after all running number two with competence and a reasoned posture. Wouldn't Krugman call the Republicans racist if they never mentioned the number two person in the polls if he were black? But Krugman and the Times are not interested in reporting and analyzing white Republican support for him.
Anything to try to destroy the Republican brand so they are not driven to support a liberal such as Sanders or Warren--or an moderate right-center such as Biden who has consistently opposed the Obama-Hillary-Netanyahu foreign policy for the last seven years.
2
Carson put a dent in that "competence and a reasoned posture" when he let Trump get away with his anti-vaccination conspiracy theory. He stood on that stage and let Trump spout terrible misinformation that will have serious consequences for anyone who takes it seriously (not to mention the communities unlucky enough to house them).
Then Carson started walking his own narrow anti-vaxxer line, trying to find something bad to say about them as well. And he never bothered to call Trump on his scaremongering lies.
It was as disheartening as it was disingenuous. And one more Republican candidate sells his integrity to be liked by the base.
Then Carson started walking his own narrow anti-vaxxer line, trying to find something bad to say about them as well. And he never bothered to call Trump on his scaremongering lies.
It was as disheartening as it was disingenuous. And one more Republican candidate sells his integrity to be liked by the base.
8
Carson has made statements to get attention that make him sound demented, and as a doctor failing to challenge the lie about vaccines and autism, he comes across as spineless. The NYTimes gives him less coverage because he has no shot at representing a party that is racist at its core...as for Kasich, he has had presidential aspirations for decades, and can sound reasonable when he's compared to the other clowns on the debate stage, but he is missing the lunatic gleam in his eye that appeals to the primary voters in the GOP, and his polling is dismal. It's not clear which of these "giants" will emerge as the nominee, but it's a safe bet it won't be Kasich or Carson, because one occasionally tells the truth and the other is unacceptable to the Confederacy, still very much alive in republican politics.
1
I think the Times needs to re-assess on a rolling basis a "history of quality comments." This is, frankly, delusional. Obama-Hillary-Netanyahu indeed.
I've heard many comments lately about the GOP primary playing like "a reality show". In fact, they are completely removed from reality.
In the world I live in, the American people are extremely anxious about their economic future, are fearful about inadequate healthcare, income inequality, an exploding cost in living and education, and desire a return to strong investment in our infrastructure, jobs, and environmental protection. The American people are also sick and tired of war and the huge expenses it entails both physically to our service members, and to our economy.
You would never know any of the above in watching the GOP debate. It was a glimpse into an alternate universe, where Americans care more about destroying Planned Parenthood, and whose most wrenching economic concern is making sure the wealthy get another tax break. And in this bizarro GOP world, we Americans are just itching for another war to fix the apocalyptic world President Obama has somehow personally created.
It would be darkly amusing if it weren't so dangerous and tragic. It underscores the necessity of having a balanced, aggressive, and fact-based mainstream media. We need a full return of the Fairness Doctrine. The crucial, life-altering decisions of our political leaders are not a joke, they are not entertainment, and they are not stages for zingers and tantrums.
As John Lennon once sang, "Gimmie Some Truth!"
In the world I live in, the American people are extremely anxious about their economic future, are fearful about inadequate healthcare, income inequality, an exploding cost in living and education, and desire a return to strong investment in our infrastructure, jobs, and environmental protection. The American people are also sick and tired of war and the huge expenses it entails both physically to our service members, and to our economy.
You would never know any of the above in watching the GOP debate. It was a glimpse into an alternate universe, where Americans care more about destroying Planned Parenthood, and whose most wrenching economic concern is making sure the wealthy get another tax break. And in this bizarro GOP world, we Americans are just itching for another war to fix the apocalyptic world President Obama has somehow personally created.
It would be darkly amusing if it weren't so dangerous and tragic. It underscores the necessity of having a balanced, aggressive, and fact-based mainstream media. We need a full return of the Fairness Doctrine. The crucial, life-altering decisions of our political leaders are not a joke, they are not entertainment, and they are not stages for zingers and tantrums.
As John Lennon once sang, "Gimmie Some Truth!"
68
I believe most of Trump's growing cohort of followers simply don't care what is said by the "mainstream media," so any attempts to influence events by that course is problematic. Indeed, many -- sad to say -- would likely view anything reported in The New York Times as prima facie evidence of its falsity. And the mere mention of laureate Krugman's name is often enough to elicit snorts of derision from that crowd (at least by those that even recognize the name).
1
Closer to Scott Walker's home, too. Minnesota's progressive taxes and targeted investments have resulted in a booming economy with low, low unemployment and almost everyone insured. In contrast, Wisconsin is sinking, sinking, sinking. Congratulations Governor Walker on fooling most of the people some of the time....until someone really talks about your results.
76
Carly Fiorina mishandling of HP has been brought up time and again. However no one seems to have discussed what part, if any, she had at Lucent (the former Bell Labs) when Lucent was caught cooking the books. My memory of it is that she was a VP there and Lucent was booking loans to customers as sales income. What part did she play in that fiasco which ended up with Lucent being bought (merged with) by Alcatel?
43
Mr. Krugman, how's this for terrifying.
In the Obama Era, a child born in a Black community in America has a 75% chance of starving in America for the first 8 years of his or her life.
Under the Obama presidency, the Black community has suffered more poverty, homelessness, violent crime, drug related incarcerations, job loss and extended unemployment than any other racial or ethnic group in this country.
Every economic indicator of quality of life for the Black community has declined every year of the Obama presidency, something that happened ZERO times during either Bush or Clinton presidencies.
During the Obama presidency, there are more Blacks under correctional control than lived as slaves in 1850.
While you fixate on your fictions and fantasies about the GOP, Americans are suffering in record numbers under Barack Obama.
The real fantasy was the Obama presidency sold to us by useless faux intellectual hacks like Krugman. And all of us are paying the price for their folly.
In the Obama Era, a child born in a Black community in America has a 75% chance of starving in America for the first 8 years of his or her life.
Under the Obama presidency, the Black community has suffered more poverty, homelessness, violent crime, drug related incarcerations, job loss and extended unemployment than any other racial or ethnic group in this country.
Every economic indicator of quality of life for the Black community has declined every year of the Obama presidency, something that happened ZERO times during either Bush or Clinton presidencies.
During the Obama presidency, there are more Blacks under correctional control than lived as slaves in 1850.
While you fixate on your fictions and fantasies about the GOP, Americans are suffering in record numbers under Barack Obama.
The real fantasy was the Obama presidency sold to us by useless faux intellectual hacks like Krugman. And all of us are paying the price for their folly.
6
Don't take this the wrong way, but your argument is nuts.
"Under the Obama presidency, the Black community has suffered more poverty, homelessness, violent crime, drug related incarcerations, job loss and extended unemployment than any other racial or ethnic group in this country."
Poverty increase -- yes, across the board for all racial, ethnic groups, the result of a recession launched by a collapse engineered equally by the loosening of regulation and the lack of oversight by Dems under Clinton AND Bush. Obama tried to push for more stimulus, arguably then only thing keeping us from going totally off the cliff, and only when we let the Bush tax cuts for rich people expire did our economy begin sputtering along in a somewhat positive way, while other areas (Europe) that engaged in all-out Republican style austerity are still on the rocks.
As for crime in the Black community.... and all communities for that matter... First since the heights of the crime wave in the late 80s and early 90s, all crime types have gone down. Precipitously. You sound too young to remember those terrible times. I was in NYC and don't want to relive it. Crime decline during Bush, and continued to decline during Obama -- actually hitting an all-time low under Obama.
As for the still higher relative incidence of violent crime in Black communities, why is that Obama's issue? The community needs to partner with local police, stop the "we don't snitch" attitude, and get the bad actors off the street.
"Under the Obama presidency, the Black community has suffered more poverty, homelessness, violent crime, drug related incarcerations, job loss and extended unemployment than any other racial or ethnic group in this country."
Poverty increase -- yes, across the board for all racial, ethnic groups, the result of a recession launched by a collapse engineered equally by the loosening of regulation and the lack of oversight by Dems under Clinton AND Bush. Obama tried to push for more stimulus, arguably then only thing keeping us from going totally off the cliff, and only when we let the Bush tax cuts for rich people expire did our economy begin sputtering along in a somewhat positive way, while other areas (Europe) that engaged in all-out Republican style austerity are still on the rocks.
As for crime in the Black community.... and all communities for that matter... First since the heights of the crime wave in the late 80s and early 90s, all crime types have gone down. Precipitously. You sound too young to remember those terrible times. I was in NYC and don't want to relive it. Crime decline during Bush, and continued to decline during Obama -- actually hitting an all-time low under Obama.
As for the still higher relative incidence of violent crime in Black communities, why is that Obama's issue? The community needs to partner with local police, stop the "we don't snitch" attitude, and get the bad actors off the street.
22
Most of what you cite are the result of the near depression that Obama inherited in 2009. Obama and Democrats would gladly do more to help the poor, including blacks, but Republicans insist on cutting every program that would help from head start to food stamps. Then there's sequestration. All of the above would have been much, much worse under a McCain or Romney presidency. As for incarceration rates, they are due to policies at the federal level enacted in the 90s, as well as state level mandatory sentencing over which no president has any control. And what are the Republican ideas to deal with these things? They have none beyond lowering taxes on wealthy people. Two debates, and NO ideas put forth. Defund Planned Parenthood. Build a wall. Nix the Iran deal and rely on the military option. The fantasy that Republicans even care about poor blacks.
15
Sorry, you lost me at "In the Obama Era, a child born in a Black community in America has a 75% chance of starving in America for the first 8 years of his or her life."
Please do explain what you mean.
Please do explain what you mean.
1
Right on the mark. One of the most disturbing points about the current media "equilibrium" is that it will permit flatly wrong points or lies to be put as just one side of the debate. That is very dangerous indeed. And we are not naive: We know that politics and campaigns involve a fair share of lies, innuendo, and propaganda. The problem is, that in looking at Wednesday's debate, it turns out it's worst than what we expected! Glarinlgy anti-scientific arguments on vaccines, climate change, economics, foreign policy, etc. Really we need to very seriously consider the incentives that our political system establishes for people as Rubio, Cruz, Fiorina, Trump, to be the ones that are willing to undertake the road for the Presidency.
And, yes. When you thought that we had hit bottom (George W), turns out it could be nothing compared to what's in store!
And, yes. When you thought that we had hit bottom (George W), turns out it could be nothing compared to what's in store!
39
Would you categorize the statement you can keep your health plan and your doctor (repeated about 30 times) as lies?
Back after Reagan was elected to his second term, my neighbor and I stood on her front porch wondering how long it would take the nation to get over what Reagan was wreaking on us. Had we only known.
1
Thank you. As a Carolina homeboy, every now and then I think that something must be wrong with me because I am surrounded daily by people shouting nonsense based on comic book or video dystopian fantasies. Tuned into the debates for the second time thinking maybe this one would be different. The difference, alas, is a greater distance from objective reality. Okay, so what's the punchline? Only way to preserve sanity is to disconnect from media and take a walk with a dog.
20
There's truth in the adage that in a democracy "we get the government we deserve." That said, I can't imagine how an anti-immigrant, anti-women, anxious to restart the Cold War party gets elected. I don't believe for a minute we've slid down that far.
I'm a moderate Democrat (progressive on social issues, conservative on fiscal matters) who firmly believes in another adage: that "taxes are the price for living in a civilized society." I'm thinking of registering Republican for this next election cycle. Mix it up with some zealots.
I'm a moderate Democrat (progressive on social issues, conservative on fiscal matters) who firmly believes in another adage: that "taxes are the price for living in a civilized society." I'm thinking of registering Republican for this next election cycle. Mix it up with some zealots.
17
To paraphrase the old Italian saying about Easter and Christmas, we don't care who you spend the primaries with, so long as you come home for the general election.
Please do it - as a fellow moderate, I registered Republican in the hope that people like me can pull the GOP out of the hands of the loony fringe. I wish more would join me.
Fiorina speaks forcefully and articulately, I'll give them that. But the issue is what she says that's non-sense. 1. She insults anyone with a financial background in saying that she doubled revenues at HP. Buying Compaq may have doubled revenues, but that acquisition was a disaster, as the current HP spinoff of the hardware business indicates. 2. She would shut down the government over funding Planned Parenthood, which, regardless of one's views of PP, is total insanity: pushing the US back into recession and taking the world with it. 3. She would not shack hands with, talk to, or negotiate with Putin. Rather she would send the fleet to the Baltic and land Marines in the Baltic Countries. So, we go to war with Putin. 4. She wouldn't raise the national minimum wage because of variations in local economic conditions, but the federal minimum wage hasn't been raised in 6 years and on an inflation-adjusted basis is back at 1985 levels. So, the problem isn't local economic conditions, but whether the middle and lower class can get anything like a living wage. 5. She would have armed the "moderate rebels" in Syria, but no one has ever been able to name who a "moderate rebel" is. (And why didn't Congress pass the Authorization to Use Force in Syria that Obama asked for?)
So, yes Fiorina is a strong presence, but just as at HP, she is a strong presence headed in absolutely the wrong direction.
So, yes Fiorina is a strong presence, but just as at HP, she is a strong presence headed in absolutely the wrong direction.
118
Corporate ownership of the airwaves ushered in the false balance we are cursed with today. Treating two sides of an issue as equal, despit the merits or truth, allows for the unquestioning and sleazy performances of the Republican presidential lineup we are witnessing. Instead of using facts, logic, and policy plans to choose a president, we are bombarded with religious beliefs, tone, appearance, energy and bank balance as the only qualifications that matter.
47
There was one GOP candidate on that stage who showed both maturity and moderation in his outlook: John Kaisich. He may have engaged in some hyperbole but unlike the others, no outright fabrication. He is certainly conservative but practical and pragmatic.
Kasich is electable and in my opinion would be a formidable rival to any Democratic nominee. Unfortunately, lacking a seat in the GOP clown car, he's unlikely to make it past New Hampshire.
Kasich is electable and in my opinion would be a formidable rival to any Democratic nominee. Unfortunately, lacking a seat in the GOP clown car, he's unlikely to make it past New Hampshire.
14
Talk to the folks in Ohio. They have a different opinion of Kashich. He's every bit as extreme as the other candidates, and very anti-woman. He may come off as more polished and dignified, but that's just appearances. Don't be fooled by appearances.
1
Watching the first two Republican debates I came to realize that Trump is right - our Republic is in danger - not from Obama but from Republican Party. Republican Party leaders live in a fantasy world where truth does not exist, logic is replaced by possibilities, fractions replaces facts. Sad part of this fantasy game - Republican voters are equally involved to remain in that fantasy world. Nature is ruthless and reality can not be controlled by story - the force of nature will bring this fantasy players in the grave of death and destruction. Question is what happens after that - Republicans will return to sanity or they will move another degree of fantasy game till all of us are destroyed.
34
YOU tell the people, Dr Krugman - the question is are enough listening. They sow fear that Obama will turn us into Greece - when it's clear for anyone the will open their eyes that the austerity programs helped make 'Greece, Greece' Obama kept us from there.
Above politics, I fear the distrust of science and fact that these candidates have fostered.
Two doctors on stage agree that vaccinations for babies 'might' be a problems, a renown surgeon compares health insurance (which has already made real medical accessible to millions) to slavery and denies the SCIENCE of evolution because of his 'belief' system -as if belief has an equal footing with established scientific methods.
Current 'leaders' in states most threatened by climate change - notably Florida and Louisiana, insist that doing something isn't vital as long as gas remains cheap.
Millionaires contribute to their campaigns and 'regular' folks in the audience cheer. It's downright scary.
Above politics, I fear the distrust of science and fact that these candidates have fostered.
Two doctors on stage agree that vaccinations for babies 'might' be a problems, a renown surgeon compares health insurance (which has already made real medical accessible to millions) to slavery and denies the SCIENCE of evolution because of his 'belief' system -as if belief has an equal footing with established scientific methods.
Current 'leaders' in states most threatened by climate change - notably Florida and Louisiana, insist that doing something isn't vital as long as gas remains cheap.
Millionaires contribute to their campaigns and 'regular' folks in the audience cheer. It's downright scary.
83
Dr Carson was the first neurosurgeon to successfully separate Siamese twins so why don't you save your sarcasm. He's done things you couldn't touch
It wasn't a debate as much reality show - Why in real life realty TV is so popular among TV executive and the public, it is cheep to produce and maximizes sensationalism and sparse on the facts.
15
Nice insight.
If Krugman sees Trump as the better economist, I can't disagree. My concern with him is the rest of the job -- international diplomacy matters. In that regard, he is no Barrack Obama, and considering Obama's stellar economic achievements, I don't see an eclipse in the making.
Trump claims to be the great deal maker, and I believe him, money talks. But so does Guns and Roses, and they sound a lot better.
Threats have been used by all to make military deals, and they usually end up with war of one kind or another. It's a tactic with dangerous ego consequences that lead to violent reactionary results -- domestic dealing, not so much, unless you are the Mafia. Al Capone would not have been a good President.
If Krugman sees Trump as the better economist, I can't disagree. My concern with him is the rest of the job -- international diplomacy matters. In that regard, he is no Barrack Obama, and considering Obama's stellar economic achievements, I don't see an eclipse in the making.
Trump claims to be the great deal maker, and I believe him, money talks. But so does Guns and Roses, and they sound a lot better.
Threats have been used by all to make military deals, and they usually end up with war of one kind or another. It's a tactic with dangerous ego consequences that lead to violent reactionary results -- domestic dealing, not so much, unless you are the Mafia. Al Capone would not have been a good President.
3
Trump's "art of the deal" is to make the other side the loser. Win-win isn't his thing.
As usual, Paul Krugman twists facts to his own let-wing ends. First, the reason we saw some prosperity in the Clinton era is Reagan had broken the military back of the Soviets, and for that reason and others they opened up and we decided to close military bases and cut the budget, which helped the situation (Republicans also worked with President Clinton). Second, Bill Clinton, while getting serviced in the White House, ignored the Internet bubble, Enron (they lobbied for Enron), Tyco, etc and those false, cooked books helped make the economy seem stronger than it was. Even left-wing Frontline had a good TV show on how the Clinton administration suppressed the regulation of derivatives and were in favor of sub-prime loans, both of which contributed to the economic collapse in 2008. After George W Bush got in office, the Internet stocks collapsed, the cooked-book companies failed or did poorly and the 9/11 attack happened, all in his first year. Despite this, during most of his administration, he had a 4.5% unemployment rate with a higher workforce participation rate than we have now. In fact, despite liberal President Obama's policies (including Democrat majorities in both houses of congress his first two years in office), his administration has still not reached 4.5% unemployment rate or close to it despite almost seven years in office. If liberal policies worked, the economy would be flourishing now.
2
"Republicans also worked with President Clinton"
Wait, what?
Yes, they worked with Clinton better than they worked with Obama, but that's because they were devoted to destroying President Obama above anything else, and back in the 1990s they still had some pretense towards being a party capable of governing.
But the viciousness with which he was constantly attacked, the terrible farce that was the impeachment trial bloody-minded House Republicans forced on the Senate, all belie the notion that they "worked with President Clinton", no matter how much they may now want to claim his successes as their own.
Wait, what?
Yes, they worked with Clinton better than they worked with Obama, but that's because they were devoted to destroying President Obama above anything else, and back in the 1990s they still had some pretense towards being a party capable of governing.
But the viciousness with which he was constantly attacked, the terrible farce that was the impeachment trial bloody-minded House Republicans forced on the Senate, all belie the notion that they "worked with President Clinton", no matter how much they may now want to claim his successes as their own.
1
"he had a 4.5% unemployment rate with a higher workforce participation rate than we have now.".....Facts please. Obama inherited from Bush a 10% unemployment rate and an economy in free fall. The Obama administration promptly instituted a stimulus package which saved the country from economic disaster (compare with Europe that didn't even have the housing crash etc.) A Republican House was elected in 2010, which since that time has instituted economic austerity and consistently blocked any further economic stimulus. They won't even approve an inflation adjusted increase in the gas tax to fund badly needed infrastructure repair. The fact is that in the first 2 years the Obama administration saved the economy and since the Republican House was elected in 2010, they have done everything they could to push the economy back over the cliff.
1
Actually voters don't like Obama's policies. That should be apparent enough by now because we're equally upset with our own party leaders for doing nothing to enact conservative policies as we are with Obama.
Republicans didn't work with Clinton because he was white. They worked with Clinton because he sat at the negotiating table with them. They worked together. They would do the same with Obama, and have on the few areas where he has engaged them such as international trade. On other issues, Obama doesn't even bother. He lays out a policy proposal he knows Republicans cannot agree to, then he demagogues and uses Republican non-cooperation as an excuse to do what he wants anyway through some executive action.
Oh, but that's just Republican racism. Give me a break!
Republicans didn't work with Clinton because he was white. They worked with Clinton because he sat at the negotiating table with them. They worked together. They would do the same with Obama, and have on the few areas where he has engaged them such as international trade. On other issues, Obama doesn't even bother. He lays out a policy proposal he knows Republicans cannot agree to, then he demagogues and uses Republican non-cooperation as an excuse to do what he wants anyway through some executive action.
Oh, but that's just Republican racism. Give me a break!
Carly Fiorina has been hailed as the "winner" of the Republican debate. It is difficult for me to understand how someone can receive accolades for telling lies about issues. It will be interesting to see if the media publicizes the fact that , under her watch, HP sold computers to Iran ( worth hundreds of millions of dollars) illegally.
83
We are sitting up here in Canada, not sure whether to laugh at your political choices, or be very afraid. It's sad really.
220
Not only should the media scrutinize her business claims; her life story claims should be given a thorough examination, as well.
3
Be afraid. We're your largest trading partner. If we get a cold, you get pneumonia and there is a chill in the political air.
1
And what's truly disturbing is that these fantasies and fictions are not limited to the debates or even this campaign season. Trickle-down economics, international bombast, demonization of reproductive rights, vilifying healthcare reform - these are party talking points and have been for years. These are falsehoods which we have been hearing from Republican legislators, Republican governors and our previous Presidential Cabinet. Even when this election ends, the myths will remain as part of our political discourse.
19
Where, oh where, has my country gone!
I became a citizen in a when I was 8 years. I vowed to be a good citizen, deny communism & uphold the Constitution.
I remember my heart full as we same the national anthem & feeling my heart's rhythm under our hand as I pledged allegiance.
I remember an unpopular war - torn between supporting the soldiers I had grown up with & demonstrating against an unjust, unwinnable war; ethnic neighborhoods that resonated with exotic languages & scented with exotic food shared by immigrant working hard to achieve the American Dream.
I look now at my lovely country, tattered by economic irresponsibility & greed, children holding supersized sodas, food producers brutalizing livestock fattened on chemicals by corporations instead of farmers, tasteless fruit ripened in trucks that pollutes the air, underpaid teachers buying supplies I see civil servants, skeletons pouring out of closets, rewarded by corporate gold, politicians who lack integrity & respect for laws that are no longer crafted & enforced by the will of the majority, but held hostage by biased courts..
What has happened to our charity? What has happened to our tolerance, our pride, our patriotism, our community working together & the values whose beacon lit our patriotic paths?
We have lost justice, honor, compassion, humility and tolerance and it seems are in danger of losing that which separates us from the animal world as well....reason.
I became a citizen in a when I was 8 years. I vowed to be a good citizen, deny communism & uphold the Constitution.
I remember my heart full as we same the national anthem & feeling my heart's rhythm under our hand as I pledged allegiance.
I remember an unpopular war - torn between supporting the soldiers I had grown up with & demonstrating against an unjust, unwinnable war; ethnic neighborhoods that resonated with exotic languages & scented with exotic food shared by immigrant working hard to achieve the American Dream.
I look now at my lovely country, tattered by economic irresponsibility & greed, children holding supersized sodas, food producers brutalizing livestock fattened on chemicals by corporations instead of farmers, tasteless fruit ripened in trucks that pollutes the air, underpaid teachers buying supplies I see civil servants, skeletons pouring out of closets, rewarded by corporate gold, politicians who lack integrity & respect for laws that are no longer crafted & enforced by the will of the majority, but held hostage by biased courts..
What has happened to our charity? What has happened to our tolerance, our pride, our patriotism, our community working together & the values whose beacon lit our patriotic paths?
We have lost justice, honor, compassion, humility and tolerance and it seems are in danger of losing that which separates us from the animal world as well....reason.
95
Faith has Trumped reason.
2
I was born in the 50's. My grandparents and parents generations grappled with the Depression and WW II which left a large public debt relative to GDP. Through their Reps, they passed the GI Bill, Marshal Plan, integrated our armed forces, created our interstate highway system, maintained a strong military & created a massive stockpile of weaponry, pioneered the exploration of space, met the looming challenges to educate us Boomers by building more schools and staffing them, created the Medicare/Medicaid safety net for the vulnerable, overturned Jim Crow laws pursuant to the Constitution, cleaned up our badly polluted air/water, etc. And, they raised taxes on themselves in support of these endeavors! The percentages of these generations who were willing to elect reps who co-operated and compromised to solve the Nation's problems were large enough for our country to move forward even though there were strong political differences. Mortality among these generations together with our failure to embrace the essential necessity of co-operation and compromise to address problems have undermined our society by undermining the effectiveness of the institutions our government and our Constitution. Although these generations had their shortcomings I honor their memory. But, I abhor what we have done to their legacy for my childrens' and grandchildrens' generations. The virtue of compromise has been turned into a disgrace but the disgrace lies elsewhere.
2
"Think about it. Bill Clinton’s tax hike was followed by a huge economic boom, the George W. Bush tax cuts by a weak recovery that ended in financial collapse."
1. The economic "boom" did not follow Clinton's tax hike. The economic expansion began six quarters before he took office. The economy was going strong when he took office.
2. Clinton's tax hike was small, no larger than the tax hike implemented under George H.W. Bush. In other words, it was inconsequential. Ronald Reagan, on the other hand, radically restructured the tax system, including broad based tax cuts. During the 25 years that followed the Reagan tax revolution we did experience a huge economic boom, with only one mild recession during 1990-1991.
3. George W. Bush came into office as a recession was beginning. Through broad based tax cuts, he quickly brought us out of the recession, even though the economy took a huge hit from 9/11 just as we emerged from recession.
4. The financial collapse had nothing to do with tax policy.
5. Barack Obama tried stimulating the economy through targeted spending and tax cuts, which resulted in the worst recovery in living memory.
1. The economic "boom" did not follow Clinton's tax hike. The economic expansion began six quarters before he took office. The economy was going strong when he took office.
2. Clinton's tax hike was small, no larger than the tax hike implemented under George H.W. Bush. In other words, it was inconsequential. Ronald Reagan, on the other hand, radically restructured the tax system, including broad based tax cuts. During the 25 years that followed the Reagan tax revolution we did experience a huge economic boom, with only one mild recession during 1990-1991.
3. George W. Bush came into office as a recession was beginning. Through broad based tax cuts, he quickly brought us out of the recession, even though the economy took a huge hit from 9/11 just as we emerged from recession.
4. The financial collapse had nothing to do with tax policy.
5. Barack Obama tried stimulating the economy through targeted spending and tax cuts, which resulted in the worst recovery in living memory.
5
"During the 25 years that followed the Reagan tax revolution we did experience a huge economic boom, with only one mild recession during 1990-1991."
You forgot to mention the Reagan tax increases, and the fact that the national debt expanded enormously in his administration. Curiously (based on your assumptions), the "inconsequential" economic policy of the Clinton administration almost eliminated the national debt. Will wonders never cease.
You forgot to mention the Reagan tax increases, and the fact that the national debt expanded enormously in his administration. Curiously (based on your assumptions), the "inconsequential" economic policy of the Clinton administration almost eliminated the national debt. Will wonders never cease.
22
Not only the US, but EVERY country affected by the 2008 financial crisis has had the worst recovery in living memory. President Obama gets the blame only from people who don't know anything about what's happening in other countries. For example, real GDP in Japan and the Eurozone is still below the peak levels before the crash, whereas output in the US is about 9% higher. Are Europe's problems due to President Obama, too? Are the Democrats behind Japan's sluggish recovery?
Oh, and under President Bush, the cumulative increase in nonfarm payrolls for his entire time in office was 3.199mn. Under President Obama it's been 8.311mn so far, or more than twice as much -- and that includes the massive job losses of his first year in office, when he was cleaning up after George Bush's disastrous policies.
If President Obama were to walk on water, people would complain that he can't swim.
Oh, and under President Bush, the cumulative increase in nonfarm payrolls for his entire time in office was 3.199mn. Under President Obama it's been 8.311mn so far, or more than twice as much -- and that includes the massive job losses of his first year in office, when he was cleaning up after George Bush's disastrous policies.
If President Obama were to walk on water, people would complain that he can't swim.
20
Looks like you have made up your mind about the conclusion and you are finding rationalisations. I would change (4) to:
4. After the economy recovered from recession, the Bush administration helped steer it down the drain to give us the Great Recession.
4. After the economy recovered from recession, the Bush administration helped steer it down the drain to give us the Great Recession.
1
In your Fantasies please tell me how America let alone the World is doing so well in the last 7 years? Yes during this administration 6,371,000 jobs were added how many of them are part time?There are nearly 2.8 million people suffering from long-term unemployment — being out of work for 27 weeks or longer, that is 86,000 more added.As of September 2014, the most recent month for which the government has released figures, the total stood at just below 46.5 million people, or about 1 out of 9 Americans are on food stamps.In spite of historically low mortgage rates and an improving economy, the rate of home ownership has slid to its lowest point in nearly 20 years. But the people Obama and his minions are always willing to complain about,business corporations, they are soaring.In the third quarter of 2014, the most recent period for which figures have been released, after-tax corporate profits were running at a seasonally adjusted annual rate of just under $1.9 trillion, the highest ever recorded.Total debt, counting money the government owes to itself, stands at $18.1 trillion, up 70 percent.But your terrified what might be, I and at least 49% are terrified of what is, and what it will take to repair.
3
Harif2
chicago
Apparently you were asleep during what was the worst economic crash since the 30's since you seem totally unaware of its consequences.
chicago
Apparently you were asleep during what was the worst economic crash since the 30's since you seem totally unaware of its consequences.
44
Total debt, counting money the government owes to itself, stands at $18.1 trillion.....Of course the debt has increased enormously under Obama. He inherited an economy in free fall from Bush along with an annual budget deficit of 1350 billion which has now been reduced to about 450 billion. So whose fault is the massive debt increase? Further your correct statement that corporate profits are at an all time high along with the inflation rate below 2% is Econ 101 proof that the Republican supply side economics under the present circumstances is stupid.
4
Perhaps you can't recall the reality of 8 years ago. Go back and do some research. Yes the oligarchy is growing, but that's in spite of the efforts of the President, not because of any of his actions. Things would have been worse. Remember Citizens United? That was made possible by the President's predecessor. Yes corporate profits are soaring, and $$ is being spent in the purchase of legislators........ What should we do about this? Complain about Pres Obama's failures?
It was with dismay and disgust that my wife and I watched the Republican show-and-tell. We couldn't recall when we had been talked down to with such flagrant abandon and we couldn't believe that the eleven people on the stage could muster such inarticulate gibberish, if not outright lies.
Marching to the tune of the CNN hosts, literally walking in single file like a kindergarten class being led to the auditorium, they all looked compliant and nervous.
Next came the throwing of raw meat and the groveling and skirmishing of the contestants, much like school children coerced into fighting against their will.
Ms. Fiorina, initially reserved and well-spoken, was eventually drawn into the fray and did herself no favor by citing a video from Planned Parenthood which was patently not true. Any interest in hearing her out in other matters, dissolved instantly. Just another wanna-be politician testing our intelligence with boldface falsehood.
The "show" lasted three painful hours and the post-show accounting of who did what to whom, will continue until the next faux-debate.
On the Democratic side, while Mr. Sanders (a high schoolmate of mine) continues to rail his ardent populist views, Mrs. Clinton appears to be succumbing to self-inflicted character flaws that only adds a layer of mistrust to a demeanor of arrogance.
By default, and not without merit, that leaves Mr. Biden to step forward and add maturity, a sense of security, and trust, to this shameful masquerade.
Marching to the tune of the CNN hosts, literally walking in single file like a kindergarten class being led to the auditorium, they all looked compliant and nervous.
Next came the throwing of raw meat and the groveling and skirmishing of the contestants, much like school children coerced into fighting against their will.
Ms. Fiorina, initially reserved and well-spoken, was eventually drawn into the fray and did herself no favor by citing a video from Planned Parenthood which was patently not true. Any interest in hearing her out in other matters, dissolved instantly. Just another wanna-be politician testing our intelligence with boldface falsehood.
The "show" lasted three painful hours and the post-show accounting of who did what to whom, will continue until the next faux-debate.
On the Democratic side, while Mr. Sanders (a high schoolmate of mine) continues to rail his ardent populist views, Mrs. Clinton appears to be succumbing to self-inflicted character flaws that only adds a layer of mistrust to a demeanor of arrogance.
By default, and not without merit, that leaves Mr. Biden to step forward and add maturity, a sense of security, and trust, to this shameful masquerade.
20
Biden? Crazy lying Joe? You're kidding right?
Mr Sanders "ardent populist views" are supported by 80% of the people polled on them, regardless pf party. That should mean something even to people like you who dismiss him.
1
If I have to , I'll vote for Biden. However, I recall that he voted for the Iraq invasion just as surely as Hillary. He was also among Anita Hill's persecutors. Bernie Sanders is the best possibility out there.
1
"But who will tell the people?" This low level of candidates and a duped voter response is a natural outcome of a poorly educated populace.
In the past, foreign observers were dumbfounded at how such a successful country could have such dumb citizens.
Now, foreigners can observe that these same dumb citizens have equally dumb candidates in an understandably failing country.
Ascending countries like China place the highest value on education....hence their success. The key to reversing America's descent from greatness is an entirely new approach to education. Successful models are available...try Finland for starters!
In the past, foreign observers were dumbfounded at how such a successful country could have such dumb citizens.
Now, foreigners can observe that these same dumb citizens have equally dumb candidates in an understandably failing country.
Ascending countries like China place the highest value on education....hence their success. The key to reversing America's descent from greatness is an entirely new approach to education. Successful models are available...try Finland for starters!
53
We had a great educational system in the '50s and '60s, then the cons found out that an educated and economically independent populace would protest against their policies (e.g., Vietnam, nuclear testing). That's when the defunding of schools, and the demonization of teachers' unions began. There's a policy to keep the people stupid.
26
One of Scott Walker's successes in Wisconsin is his attempts to defund their well-regarded state university system.
175
The psychosis on display on Wednesday is made made worse by the lack of any
counter whatsoever in the American media.
Colbert and Stewart are SORELY missed.
The right is gaining ground and a new foothold.
From climate change denial to their new brand of racism, the
consequences are dire.
counter whatsoever in the American media.
Colbert and Stewart are SORELY missed.
The right is gaining ground and a new foothold.
From climate change denial to their new brand of racism, the
consequences are dire.
23
I have noticed a disturbing lack of follow up in general in the news media as of late. The pathological credulity of what comes out of politicians' mouths leaves us all questioning what is fact. Sadly, many people seem to prefer easy lies to truths that might conflict with their ideology. Critical thinking skills and follow up analysis need to be applied across the board in media, otherwise what are we getting but more spew to wallow through? That said, Krugman is on the mark as usual.
2
You're right. Carly Fiorina, to me, was the scariest. And I mean scary, as in a horror movie. Her idea of sending American troops everywhere in the world was almost as bad as her macabre abortion story. [I don't even think she's a mom.] To me she sounded like what I think Eva Braun must have been like, or Lucretia Borgia, or to quote Alexander King on the Jack Paar show long ago: "She made lady Macbeth seem like an ingénue."
42
Apparently you did not hear her comment about burying a drug addicted child.
And look at the Times' lead story on the front page. The first two paragraphs are grovelling to Fiorina and the GOP.
1
She and Ted Cruz both must go home and sharpen their jaws every night, without fail.
1
The reason GOP candidates engage in “crazy talk” is because that’s what appeals to rank and file Republican voters. Democrats have their own strain of crazy talk, for the same reason. Fact is, the American public is largely ignorant, gullible and angry.
13
Clinton's economic boom is also known as the dot-com bubble. Funny that you praise his bubble but your criticize the growht under Jeb Bush. Savvy readers know better.
3
Funny how democrats can be counted to have effect on the next president's term but republican presidents effect instantly, magically stop having any effect whatsoever in your world. So, if Bush was not responsible for the crash of 2008 then by the same reckoning Clinton had no effect on the dot.com bubble. Now if you do want to be equal and fair and decide that both Bush and Clinton were responsible for their actions two years before their terms ended, the dot com dip in GDP and unemployment are still the highest seen during this and the decade before it for all but the .01%, not to mention thousands of our soldiers and innocent people maimed and killed boosting Bush's record on GDP and employment with war not real national growth.
The point of mentioning Clinton is that contrary to dire predictions by Republicans, the tax hikes did not kill the economy. Everyone should realize that bubbles are largely a result of inadequate financial regulation. In fact the Clinton administration was fully compliant in the significant deregulation that eventually led to the housing bubble. Deregulation is another mainstay of Republican economic dogma, which unfortunately some Democrats have felt the need to mimic.
1
The dot com bubble bursting had stocks down a bit, but not much else happened. When George Bush told people after 9/11 that the best thing for people to do was take on more debt, they all took out home equity loans that caused the worst financial collapse, the most people losing homes and jobs since the great depression. We still have not recovered, almost ten years on. You really want to compare the two? Go ahead.
My comment is also a reply to the excellent lead editorial today,
Editorial: Crazy Talk at the Republican Debate
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/18/opinion/crazy-talk-at-the-republican-d...
The history of oligarchy and concentration: The Romans sold their votes to the oligarchs, the Russian sold their shares in the former state assets to the oligarchs. In the US, people handed their houses back to the banks. The motivation was explained in Naomi Klein’s “Shock Doctrine.”
Editorial: Crazy Talk at the Republican Debate
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/18/opinion/crazy-talk-at-the-republican-d...
The history of oligarchy and concentration: The Romans sold their votes to the oligarchs, the Russian sold their shares in the former state assets to the oligarchs. In the US, people handed their houses back to the banks. The motivation was explained in Naomi Klein’s “Shock Doctrine.”
8
Shock Doctrine should be required reading, also Thieves of State.
And let's not forget the biggest lie of all: "The thing about my brother is…he kept us safe"! The 9/11 attacks, the fraudulent Iraq War and a massive economic meltdown are not my idea of "safety".
113
Jeb Bush's comment that his brother George W. kept America safe is only part of the picture. Safe for whom...the thousands of men and women who he sent to their deaths in Iraq and the thousands who returned home wounded and damaged? What about attacking the wrong country and unleashing a disaster in the Middle East so that it's hard to find a country not touched by the results?
72
...not to mention he was president during the worst terrorist attack in American history! Now that's safe!
He kept us safe? Sure, if you don't count 9/11. The worst terrorist attack in our nation's history, when he was fully warned by by the CIA that an attack imminent, and did nothing.
1
Lone voice in the wilderness that is the mainstream media! Well said, Dr. Krugman.
I would prefer Mr. Trump, in spite of all his negatives, simply because he CANNOT BE BOUGHT. It is time to remove the influence of money in our democracy by electing either Mr. Trump or Mr. Sanders to be our next president. Every one else has been bought. Most have made pilgrimages to their benefactors, before entering the contest. They did not go there to serve the people! Wake up, America.
I would prefer Mr. Trump, in spite of all his negatives, simply because he CANNOT BE BOUGHT. It is time to remove the influence of money in our democracy by electing either Mr. Trump or Mr. Sanders to be our next president. Every one else has been bought. Most have made pilgrimages to their benefactors, before entering the contest. They did not go there to serve the people! Wake up, America.
109
Like him or not, Trump is the only one with a little sense about business (higher taxes for the rich), about the middle-class (get rid of the insurance companies for health-care) and foreign policy (let's Middle East countries fight themselves). Same with Sanders at a large level. Both are not puppets and both will not be controlled by outsiders including fake americans
88
Let me clue you in buddy. Paul Krugman is hardly a voice of reason. He is a left wing ideologue more often wrong than right that has a phd in economics and yet has no understanding of markets at all.
He's been bought. Look at his support of Birther fiction, climate change fiction, Planned Parenthood lies, etc. He has completely changed his tune from when he supported Democrats. He knows he is telling lies
80
I did not watch the debate. But I listened to NPR, CNN and MSNBC for a recap and not one even mentioned any of these issues. All they care to talk about is Ms. Fiorina's perfect pitch, Trump's use of the word braggadocious and if Jeb Bush is low energy. If NPR fails us for information we have only the print media left to cover the issues. Thank you Mr. Krugman.
96
NPR is controlled now by the right wing. So long to the center.
1
I thought the debate was a disgrace......by CNN. Asking one candidate what they thought of another candidates comments about them. Junior High games. We are in trouble.
848
This is what happens in a country where money dominates. Our love of money keeps us from regulating our industries, and included in that are the media and our elections.
Absolutely this was a "junior high" performance, with reality-TV-show style antics encouraged by the moderators. But this broadcast was the most successful broadcast in CNN's history - they will only seek to repeat it.
Our election cycles, and our media outlets, are progressively dumbing down because reaching out to the lowest common denominator makes big bucks. As long as we, as a culture, refuse to prioritize any principles (informed populace, need for 4th estate, fair elections) above capitalism, we'll continue on our downward spiral.
Absolutely this was a "junior high" performance, with reality-TV-show style antics encouraged by the moderators. But this broadcast was the most successful broadcast in CNN's history - they will only seek to repeat it.
Our election cycles, and our media outlets, are progressively dumbing down because reaching out to the lowest common denominator makes big bucks. As long as we, as a culture, refuse to prioritize any principles (informed populace, need for 4th estate, fair elections) above capitalism, we'll continue on our downward spiral.
1
Steve, I couldn't agree more with your read on the terrible job CNN did. The only thing missing was Michael Buffer and his "Let's get ready to rumble" kickoff
Jake Tapper did a poor job as a moderator. Then again, that's CNN.
They wouldn't miss a chance to mess up things to make it boring or repulsive. I forgot the last time I tuned into HLN - I didn't want to watch Nancy Grace.
They wouldn't miss a chance to mess up things to make it boring or repulsive. I forgot the last time I tuned into HLN - I didn't want to watch Nancy Grace.
1
Most voters have decades of life experience.
Until enough voters use their experience and rational reflection instead of accepting the silly statements of people on television and radio (politicians, their supporters and "news analysts") as "gospel", we will continue to have elections as sport contests, rather than as serious discussiions of government policy.
Sad, unnecessary and dangerous to our welfare.
Until enough voters use their experience and rational reflection instead of accepting the silly statements of people on television and radio (politicians, their supporters and "news analysts") as "gospel", we will continue to have elections as sport contests, rather than as serious discussiions of government policy.
Sad, unnecessary and dangerous to our welfare.
11
I've no doubt whatsoever that no one of the present GOP lineup of shills and charlatans, will get anywhere near being President.
And with respect to Donald Trump, he is a shill for one or another of the loonies, and is there to manage the perception of the discontented, which are legion, and their further hope is the historic inequality will cause people to strike mindlessly at any any all currently in power.
A smart strategy, given the anger and outrage that currently abounds among the electorate.
Along with that thinking, they are also betting that apathy will result in a low turnout, therefore permitting the hard right a real opportunity.
Our job is to destroy their dream, our nightmare, come out in force, and show these destroyers that we are now fully awake, champing at the bit, ready to consign them to the dust heap of history.
Their entire operation should be regarded as a farce, a dangerous farce, that must be exposed and eliminated, once and for all time.
And with respect to Donald Trump, he is a shill for one or another of the loonies, and is there to manage the perception of the discontented, which are legion, and their further hope is the historic inequality will cause people to strike mindlessly at any any all currently in power.
A smart strategy, given the anger and outrage that currently abounds among the electorate.
Along with that thinking, they are also betting that apathy will result in a low turnout, therefore permitting the hard right a real opportunity.
Our job is to destroy their dream, our nightmare, come out in force, and show these destroyers that we are now fully awake, champing at the bit, ready to consign them to the dust heap of history.
Their entire operation should be regarded as a farce, a dangerous farce, that must be exposed and eliminated, once and for all time.
13
You are in for one rude awakening come November 9, 2016.
"I've no doubt whatsoever that no one of the present GOP lineup of shills and charlatans, will get anywhere near being President." You're more optimistic than I.
Obama ran two great campaigns, and had the benefit of running against men who kept tripping over their own feet. One of these days the GOP will nominate someone cunning enough, or lucky enough, to not implode, and any slip by his Democratic opponent will indeed put one of these clowns in the White House.
Obama ran two great campaigns, and had the benefit of running against men who kept tripping over their own feet. One of these days the GOP will nominate someone cunning enough, or lucky enough, to not implode, and any slip by his Democratic opponent will indeed put one of these clowns in the White House.
Speaking as a reporter, I think it's high time we abandon the "evenhanded" reporting style Krugman describes. We shouldn't force readers to rely on opinion columnists or special analysis features - let alone attack ads - to fact check politicians' claims just because we're lazy, pressed for time or, even worse, afraid readers will accuse us of bias. too often, political reporting is reduced to "he said she said" but nothing is analyzed - even today, the story about the budget fight and Planned Parenthood failed to mention that the video discussing medical research using fetuses was heavily edited and has been denounced as a hoax.
We need to not be afraid to report the truth. Otherwise, we're in serious dereliction of our duty.
We need to not be afraid to report the truth. Otherwise, we're in serious dereliction of our duty.
42
Therein lies a major facet of the problem, which of course is ownership of mainstream media by the .01%ters, ownership that manipulates and manages perception, knowing full well how effective it is, in this reality show captured world.
Getting people upset and focused on everything but the real issues, is the stock and trade of these bums and their media mouthpieces.
Getting people upset and focused on everything but the real issues, is the stock and trade of these bums and their media mouthpieces.
1
It's about time reporters stop being afraid to reveal lies or challenge deranged opinions. They are citizens, not servants, and they need to act as such. I also hope Mel Farrell is right when he thinks that the Republicans will not win the White House. Although Democrats irritate me, they don't scare me.
1
Well said. Couldn't agree more.
1
The problem is the GOP doctrine calls for cuts in spending and cuts in taxes. The only one that ever seems to happen is cuts in taxes. That is the root cause of the problem with Republican economic policy. Clinton cut capital gains as much as he raised income taxes. In fact it effectively cut taxes on the rich.
3
I don't know what scares me more: that these people are so willing to pander, that there are Americans whose primary vote is so driven by easily debunked issues, that the candidates might actually believe the things they are saying, or that the rhetoric gets more extreme every election (or so it seems).
14
What is happening with the Republican party, is the dinner/cocktail talk I sometimes experience, has now moved on to the national stage. When I leave these outings with my wife, I spent the ride home asking my wife why I went to the outing and then asking her if she heard what I heard. I do wish the media would being asking the same questions I asked at the end of these debates.
7
Did you just equate "secretary" with "menial jobs"?? Yikes!
123
Krugman is right. Fiorina tried to say that she started at the bottom and worked her way up and that the system worked, that she achieved "the American Dream." Krugman would argue, by contrast, that we have an unequal system, and most people don't enjoy the same access to upward mobility. Krugman is saying that it's false for her to claim that she started at the bottom.
1
Hey, I like doing menial jobs. Like changing my parent's bedpan.
No! Carly Fiorina did. Not Mr. Krugman.
Good column. As long as a majority of the public in many states is swayed by appeals to their prejudices and fears, the classic repub strategy, it seems they'll continue to get elected.
Ignorance is the worst disease of all, and hardest to cure. What else would explain so many people voting for policies that amount to unending welfare for the military-industrial complex, that favor war over economic and diplomatic solutions, and that help the rich get richer and the quality of life for average people continually erode, along with the infrastructure of the entire country.
Not a single, honest candidate among them that exhibits wisdom, good judgment and competence. Unbelievable that the conservative party has fallen this far into the toilet.
Ignorance is the worst disease of all, and hardest to cure. What else would explain so many people voting for policies that amount to unending welfare for the military-industrial complex, that favor war over economic and diplomatic solutions, and that help the rich get richer and the quality of life for average people continually erode, along with the infrastructure of the entire country.
Not a single, honest candidate among them that exhibits wisdom, good judgment and competence. Unbelievable that the conservative party has fallen this far into the toilet.
24
The charade that passes for our political process is reaching its nadir. These folks are not, necessarily, stupid. They are pandering to what they think is their constituency. Perhaps one defined by that paragon of the 4th Estate, Fox News? To my mind this is a strategic error.
Regardless, since I don't hold these candidates as stupid I can only conclude that they are consciously lying about their stance on what they perceive as the important issues our country face. It's a given that all politicians lie and obfuscate truth. They can no more help themselves than I can remove myself from my skin. And I accept this to a degree since in the business of political compromise sometimes the actors must hedge. But in so boldly lying in our faces, at a time when they should be showing us who they are and what they've got, they make an inference I find insulting. They consider the American voter stupid. In this case I would like to think they are dead wrong. We shall see.....
John~
American Net'Zen
Regardless, since I don't hold these candidates as stupid I can only conclude that they are consciously lying about their stance on what they perceive as the important issues our country face. It's a given that all politicians lie and obfuscate truth. They can no more help themselves than I can remove myself from my skin. And I accept this to a degree since in the business of political compromise sometimes the actors must hedge. But in so boldly lying in our faces, at a time when they should be showing us who they are and what they've got, they make an inference I find insulting. They consider the American voter stupid. In this case I would like to think they are dead wrong. We shall see.....
John~
American Net'Zen
7
At this point, the American conservative -- the entire political right of the country -- believes it can make up anything it likes and that as long as it goes against the grain of what they perceive to be their political opponents, that make-up nonsense is indeed, true. Don't believe me? Talk to one. This is what we have come to, and it is the result of the right finding out it can say anything and the societal forces and institutions that are supposed to provide pushback against it do nothing but amplify the lies with cowardice.
1
What can we expect next in the presidential race – and what is the status of the American employment issue? See http://worksnewage.blogspot.com/2015/08/jobs-schmobs-whats-happening-wit....
Krugman probably thinks Hillary Clinton is too far right for the republican nomination.
The "Republican debates" are tragicomedy at it's best! Neither Saturday Night Live, nor The Onion, could be funnier than the antics of these ill-suited candidates. The Republicans have discovered a new genre: "reality parody". The group of candidates make Herman Cain and Sarah Palin look a bit less miscast as electable. This is the best the Republicans have to offer? Mitt Romney has to be waiting by the phone for a call from the RNC to stop this clown car.
13
It's not funny.
1
The clown car is usually a lead up to the star attraction. So when the clown car crashes and burns trying to go thru the flaming hoop what star will come jumping out of the smoke and thru the hoop. None of the clowns, thats for sure.
This is all a media trick orchestrated to keep us in our seats until the Grand Finale. Our Fourth Estate has failed us and the media gives us a reality show instead of reality. It`s all about the money not about the truth.
This is all a media trick orchestrated to keep us in our seats until the Grand Finale. Our Fourth Estate has failed us and the media gives us a reality show instead of reality. It`s all about the money not about the truth.
1
The discussion took place at the Ronald Reagan Library. As history points out Ronald Reagan was the host of Disneyland's grand opening. I still don't know if Reagan hosted the inauguration of Fantasyland because Uncle Walt wanted to reward him for his testimony to the FBI and House UnAmerican Activities Committee about the threats to America from film industry union organizers or if even way back then Ronnie's brain resided in the fantasy theme park.
Maybe Garry Trudeau never could find Reagan's brain because he never visited Sleeping Beauty's Castle.
Maybe Garry Trudeau never could find Reagan's brain because he never visited Sleeping Beauty's Castle.
15
I'm guessing Krugman and Laffer have never met. The biggest tax cut by GW was on the lower rates. Clinton CUT the capital gains rate, and practically eliminated the capital gains tax on primary and secondary homes. Kruggie lives in a dream world where no matter what a Republican says, he opposes. Trump sounds an awful lot like a Democrat. The part the liberals can't stand, is when candidates talk to the people without a script, they respond. Sanders would do better if he stopped looking down at his notes. Clinton? Hopeless. We have a President who was elected with zero experience, and has been talking to us for years like a mindbot. And no, his economic recovery is not very good at all. In fact it has been a disaster.
5
I'm guessing you and David Stockman have never met. There are a fair number of other folks you should meet, including Bill Clinton, who reversed several of Reagan's tax cuts; and Ronald Reagan, who, like Clinton, both cut and raised taxes.
I do agree that the recovery under Obama is not what his most zealous supporters keep insisting it is (they insist on an absolutist perspective, as if any criticism of any action by the first black president completely undermines his entire record - he must be perfect, or a complete failure - and, by extension, any potential future black president).
BTW your post would gain a great deal of intellectual credibility if you abstained from cheap name-calling like 'Kruggie'. Some of us left the middle school playground behind long ago. If you want to sit at the grown-up table this Thanksgiving you must behave like one.
I do agree that the recovery under Obama is not what his most zealous supporters keep insisting it is (they insist on an absolutist perspective, as if any criticism of any action by the first black president completely undermines his entire record - he must be perfect, or a complete failure - and, by extension, any potential future black president).
BTW your post would gain a great deal of intellectual credibility if you abstained from cheap name-calling like 'Kruggie'. Some of us left the middle school playground behind long ago. If you want to sit at the grown-up table this Thanksgiving you must behave like one.
Right on, Hawk.
I wonder if similar misstatements were said during the Democratic debates....oh wait, there have been no Democratic debates. The DNC postponed and limited the number of debates. Could it be because one candidate is under FBI investigation and the other is an open socialist? Dr. Krugman can complain all he wants, but at least the GOP isn't afraid of an open debate.
4
"socialist" is not a perjorative. just being a socialist does not disqualify you from anything. i'm sick of people thinking they can just tag a label on somebody and be done with it.
7
Maybe there isn't a Democratic debate yet because the convention is a year away. Never mind the election itself.
Just as stores now stock their goods in the Perpetual Holiday -- Halloween candy begins appearing just after Independence Day, and Easter goodies clog the aisles right after Thanksgiviing -- campaign season, assuming it ends at all, runs many months ahead of the event.
I confess that instead of watching the 'debates' (which are not real debates, they're group press conferences) live, I've been reading the press coverage. Because, dammit, can't we just get past New Year's? Or if you absolutely can't hold off that long, Thanksgiving, so as to reduce even slightly the number of political disputes at table that end with someone getting a carving knife through the heart?
There's a lot to be said for the English parliamentary system, in which the Prime Minister calls elections as needed (e.g. a vote of no confidence) rather than having them dictated by the calendar.
Just as stores now stock their goods in the Perpetual Holiday -- Halloween candy begins appearing just after Independence Day, and Easter goodies clog the aisles right after Thanksgiviing -- campaign season, assuming it ends at all, runs many months ahead of the event.
I confess that instead of watching the 'debates' (which are not real debates, they're group press conferences) live, I've been reading the press coverage. Because, dammit, can't we just get past New Year's? Or if you absolutely can't hold off that long, Thanksgiving, so as to reduce even slightly the number of political disputes at table that end with someone getting a carving knife through the heart?
There's a lot to be said for the English parliamentary system, in which the Prime Minister calls elections as needed (e.g. a vote of no confidence) rather than having them dictated by the calendar.
Nothing wrong with socialism. All it means is having government act on behalf of all the people, rather than the top 1%. You are in danger of voting against your own interest.
1
Given that President Obama talks like a liberal Democrat, but has run a bank-friendly Administration that has economically been to the right of Reagan, I'd say let's not take anything American politicians say seriously. Certainly let's not be frightened by them.
I think it's quite likely the next President will be a Republican, and will be to the left of the present Administration.
I think it's quite likely the next President will be a Republican, and will be to the left of the present Administration.
Of course it was fantasy and fiction. CNN gave us a reality TV show called "So You Want To Be President" whose format was 11 adults with personality disorders or behavioral disorders or both arguing with each other like children. My guess is the theory is one should start out extreme to garner support from the Republican base and then gradually move toward the center when actually facing off against a Democrat. Hardly any voters really pay attention to content anyway. People either vote for their party or they vote for whomever they find more likable. But on the issue of "evenhanded reporting," why is the media virtually ignoring Bernie Sanders? His ascent in Democratic polls in New Hampshire and the very different and important substance of his campaign is every bit as reflective of Democratic voter disenchantment as Trump's rise is of that of Republicans. I'll offer two reasons. First, the big, mainstream media like the NYT are part of the problem of entrenched corporate influence and power, and they oppose the changes that Sanders espouses. Second, despite offering good ideas and decent human qualities Sanders is not entertaining like Trump; he lacks flamboyance, arrogance, and absurd comments. The media does not want to inform; it wants to entertain because entertainment has become the opiate of the masses. Keep us entertained, and we the people may never wake up to our being manipulated and never try to retake our sovereignty.
16
A third, more realistic reason that the media aren't reporting on Bernie Sanders is that experienced political reporters don't believe he has the breadth of appeal to win the nomination, much less the election. They see that he has full, enthusiastic support from progressives, but that his campaign hasn't spread out to embrace other groups: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/09/upshot/why-bernie-sanderss-momentum-is...
You are telling the people. Thank you!
5
If the unspeakable should happen, and one of them is elected, we will all—Rs and Ds alike—look back one day with longing for the maturity, intelligence and perseverance displayed by our current leader.