The US is obsessed with its own navel while China is building an empire. Too bad.
1
If you're not reading this in Mandarin, the fate of your grandchildren is already sealed. And every US politician of the past fifty years is aware of and complicit in the surrender of the US to the this 21st-Century juggernaut, predatory short-term cowards every one.
1
Far flung projects to secure such an appetite for energy tend to be more vulnerable than home grown.
3
China today is America 2.0 of the 19th century in economic steroids. The 21st century is being built and shaped by the Middle Kingdom.
The US empire was built on the Manifest Destiny ideology of economic, religious, military, trade and political domination. China ideology is built on economic, financial, trade power and no intervention on domestic affairs.
In the 21st century, China has an excellent chance to shape up politics and economics of developing economies of Russia, Latin America, Africa and Asia. In today's world, the US/Europe are the past. China is the future.
The US empire was built on the Manifest Destiny ideology of economic, religious, military, trade and political domination. China ideology is built on economic, financial, trade power and no intervention on domestic affairs.
In the 21st century, China has an excellent chance to shape up politics and economics of developing economies of Russia, Latin America, Africa and Asia. In today's world, the US/Europe are the past. China is the future.
4
Maybe the GREAT US of A could learn one thing from China.
Maybe the US Gov't could decrease their defense budget by 1/4 and spend that like the Chinese and garner some international supports and rapports that we are increasingly losing.
Maybe the US Gov't could decrease their defense budget by 1/4 again and spend that to invest in crumbling infra and education system in the US.
BOY! We still have half of the defense budget left, and we are still the number ONE (EL NUMERO UNO) military spender in the world!
Maybe the US Gov't could decrease their defense budget by 1/4 and spend that like the Chinese and garner some international supports and rapports that we are increasingly losing.
Maybe the US Gov't could decrease their defense budget by 1/4 again and spend that to invest in crumbling infra and education system in the US.
BOY! We still have half of the defense budget left, and we are still the number ONE (EL NUMERO UNO) military spender in the world!
4
China is doing what the US, Britain, Spain, Rome have done for hundreds of years. Colonialism and exploitation will bring short-term benefits to a handful of collaborators and businesses.
The biggest danger: Not only Chines companies, also US companies have wreaked havoc on the environment in developing countries, exploiting a lack of regulations. When the damage is done they walk away and claim they followed all (of those non-existing) rules.
Your graphic shows the scope of investment in Myanmar. Mandalay, in northern Myanmar is full of Chinese hotels, trucks, businesses interested in extracting resources and cutting down valuable Teak trees. Just as Ecuador, they give the country business - but by destroying it.
The biggest danger: Not only Chines companies, also US companies have wreaked havoc on the environment in developing countries, exploiting a lack of regulations. When the damage is done they walk away and claim they followed all (of those non-existing) rules.
Your graphic shows the scope of investment in Myanmar. Mandalay, in northern Myanmar is full of Chinese hotels, trucks, businesses interested in extracting resources and cutting down valuable Teak trees. Just as Ecuador, they give the country business - but by destroying it.
9
The renowned historian, Toynbee, prophesied years ago that the 21 century would belong to China
3
As China has invested in acquiring resources through building economic ties, the U.S., with the undue influence of the military-industrial complex, grown to the dangerous, harmful outcomes warned and predicted by President Eisenhower in 1956, has sought to do the same with weapons sales, military alliances, and the global sprawl of its military bases.
Since most of the debt and deficit goes through China, China, to its benefit, is also funding America’s wayward path.
Time to change the pattern and uncoil the constrictive hold of the military-industrial complex, before too late becomes any later.
Since most of the debt and deficit goes through China, China, to its benefit, is also funding America’s wayward path.
Time to change the pattern and uncoil the constrictive hold of the military-industrial complex, before too late becomes any later.
5
No surprise here. While the U.S. Is stuck with an arrogant, ego driven, incompetent, divisive, inept, ideological failure for a President who is damaging our economy, running up record Debts, gutting our military, and weakening our position around the world China is taking full advantage. Putin, Iran, ISIS, and China all see the U.S. is stuck with a weak fool and they are all playing him for all they can get. They are getting a lot because Obama is the worst President in history.
2
Since the US sold out to China decades ago when we started having everything we wear, build with and MORE made over there rather than HERE, it's kind of the other way around, I think. How many Americans are ASHAMED at this turnaround in balance of power? I certainly am, but I'm a Democrat and more a lefty than a righty.
4
Following the western template for unsustainable life on Earth will not work. Hopefully all will work for a better template particularly not using shock and awe as a nation building technique or rather region building technique. Some of our delusions of superiority once manifested in a Rock Springs massacre of Chinese worker left over from railroad building then railroaded out of the country.
3
Charade: something fake, a mimicry that is lacking in substance.
Like Greece and Argentina, China relies on external flows of credit, mostly dollars and euros. So far, NYC- and Frankfurt bankers have embraced the 'China growth narrative' (myth) and have continued to lend ... to China's American and European customers. Borrowed dollars and euros flow to China.
Foreign exchange becomes collateral for RMB loans within China, the forex reserves are then lent overseas to countries such as Ecuador and Australia. This means China's credit is largely unsecured, at the same time it owes $3+ trillions in dollars and euros. China's customers in Europe are being cut off from credit, Americans are bankrupting themselves with excess leverage.
The result is China faces a margin call.
Maybe not tomorrow but once it is clear that China is in a balance sheet recession there will be no more dollars and that will be the end of the China charade.
Like Greece and Argentina, China relies on external flows of credit, mostly dollars and euros. So far, NYC- and Frankfurt bankers have embraced the 'China growth narrative' (myth) and have continued to lend ... to China's American and European customers. Borrowed dollars and euros flow to China.
Foreign exchange becomes collateral for RMB loans within China, the forex reserves are then lent overseas to countries such as Ecuador and Australia. This means China's credit is largely unsecured, at the same time it owes $3+ trillions in dollars and euros. China's customers in Europe are being cut off from credit, Americans are bankrupting themselves with excess leverage.
The result is China faces a margin call.
Maybe not tomorrow but once it is clear that China is in a balance sheet recession there will be no more dollars and that will be the end of the China charade.
5
These countries will learn quickly that when you sleep with street curs you get up with fleas.
1
I live for several months out of each year in Jamaica and have witnessed with great dismay the ever increasing size of the footprint China is leaving on the island.
The Chinese have built highways where there were none, improved roads, and mined bauxite in areas of the country that provided homes and small farms to local people. Because Jamaica is a 3rd world country despite its massive tourist industry, the government is understandably lured into various financial agreements and the development to the infrastructure that the Chinese have brought. But there is no free ride, and I am just waiting to see the after effects to the pristine countryside once the minerals have been mined and the country is left once again to fend for itself but minus vast swaths of the natural beauty that, at least for now, is still its greatest asset.
The Chinese have built highways where there were none, improved roads, and mined bauxite in areas of the country that provided homes and small farms to local people. Because Jamaica is a 3rd world country despite its massive tourist industry, the government is understandably lured into various financial agreements and the development to the infrastructure that the Chinese have brought. But there is no free ride, and I am just waiting to see the after effects to the pristine countryside once the minerals have been mined and the country is left once again to fend for itself but minus vast swaths of the natural beauty that, at least for now, is still its greatest asset.
12
Can we expect China to be a stabilizing factor in the world?
In general, peace is better for the economy than war.
The U.S. would not have gone into its Great Recession if it had stayed out of Iraq.
China may be getting ahead because it knows that war is bad for business and economic growth in general.
One can only hope that their leaders are so wise.
In general, peace is better for the economy than war.
The U.S. would not have gone into its Great Recession if it had stayed out of Iraq.
China may be getting ahead because it knows that war is bad for business and economic growth in general.
One can only hope that their leaders are so wise.
1
A thoughtful and substantial report. Thanks!
1
They might teach them planning, organization, and control of local corruption.
I read an article a week or two ago about the likelihood of war when a rising power is overtaking a "status quo" power. According to the article, looking at history, war is more likely than not. I hope not.
2
This all comes down to one big difference in the US business wants to make a quick buck so the next quarter looks good, China is looking at not the next quarter, but the next decade and century. I call the American approach crass and short-sighted, the Chinese smart
4
If the US doesn't get spooked with media help about China's global moves, it will be only a matter of time before China's beneficiaries get fed up with all the strings.
So the smart move would be to give China enough time to become really obnoxiously imperialist, and let its bought friends tell China to get lost--one way or another.
So the smart move would be to give China enough time to become really obnoxiously imperialist, and let its bought friends tell China to get lost--one way or another.
4
Let the Chinese have these countries. Their assets will be expropriated just like American companies. The countries will then try to get others to invest and buy their oil. It is a never ending cycle.
3
China's model for international aid and development is simply different from the US model long used. It does seem less exploitative, more of a partnership with benefits, and a win-win.
After all, what did Ecuador gain or get from the US in all these years of living in close proximity? Compare that to what a closer association with China has brought, so far?
We don't need more war machines and American military bases and American one-hour, 15 minute strike abilities in the world. We need economic development of poorer countries--the third world. China can do what others have not done. Give them credit, not to detract.
After all, what did Ecuador gain or get from the US in all these years of living in close proximity? Compare that to what a closer association with China has brought, so far?
We don't need more war machines and American military bases and American one-hour, 15 minute strike abilities in the world. We need economic development of poorer countries--the third world. China can do what others have not done. Give them credit, not to detract.
13
First come interests. Then comes the need to protect those interests. After that arises the need to defend those interests with military might. As China invests heavily around the globe, the political leaderships in these countries will perhaps change over time and begin reneging on those one sided commercial arrangements. China will initially walk away from those losses but eventually will decide not to. That is what we all should be fearful of - a Chinese military-industrial complex mirroring our own.
4
I am not so sure if Chinese have actually acquired a lot of Kyrgyzstan's oil fields. There aren't (m)any oil fields in Kyrgyzstan anyways. And if they did, they may as well be Chinese companies registered offshore. If the Chinese and Western companies are both registered offshore and are operating in Kyrgyzstan, does the final pocket really matter to a man who would have otherwise gone to Moscow thousands of miles away? Moscow streets are full of immigrants from Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, and Tajikistan. All these countries, however, are now benefiting hugely from Chinese investments in one way or another. Take Tajikistan. What the Soviets could not do with mountain passes and electrification in decades the Chinese handled in a couple of years. People are now talking about Chinese engineers with wonder and respect. The Chinese may not be creating fancy apps and gadgets for the young, but they are definitely ensuring that there is light and heat and road in the middle of nowhere. Are they bringing their own people to work on these projects? Fine. It is not like we have the Chinese work discipline.
4
Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss.
Poor countries with little negotiating leverage are still compelled to cut deals with economically stronger countries on disadvantageous terms.
Poor countries with little negotiating leverage are still compelled to cut deals with economically stronger countries on disadvantageous terms.
4
For most of the past 2200 years China has been a socioeconomic political educational technological scientific superpower primarily by avoiding any entangling economic or military alliances or costly imperial colonial adventures. An ancient isolated ethnic Han majority in a confined geographic area gives China a much different perspective and context from other nations and ethnic groups. By focusing on commerce and diplomacy Chinese firms have no interest nor reason nor incentive to change the culture or the politics or the economy of any nation that they are investing in. Obtaining access to foreign natural resources and markets is their goal. The fact that China is the #1 trading partner of Sub-Saharan Africa should be instructive and embarrassing for America. China is not driven by the cynical hypocritical political "concerns" about nation building human rights supporting a military-industrial complex that defines America.
6
It's time we realize we are not exceptional, invincible, strong, king of all we survey, the only super-power in the world. Sadly, we are not!! We have lost traction with our smugness and sense of superiority and invincibility. Even though we have the most sophisticated weapons we are far from winning. We are squandering our wealth on Defense ( sorry Offense! ) instead of spending it on the well-being of our people and fixing and modernizing our infrastructure. It's high time we stepped down from our arrogant perch and take a page, sorry, all pages from China's playbook titled, " Conquering without wasting bullets ". Like the British colonialist in the past, the Chinese MO is entering countries in the guise of trading and aiding them, they take control of them taking real estate and buying off the country's valuable resources into the future. Unlike us, they don't disrupt and interfere in a country's political process. Let's humbly learn from our costly mistakes and cut our losses. Let's be smart. Let's help other countries improving their economy, creating jobs abroad for our people, become competitive and with our own economy thriving. modernize our crumbling infrastructure, schools in short, improving our own citizens' lives. China has no real friends but they don't have enemies either. That game plan should work for us too. Currently we are fighting too many wars supposedly for our so called allies. Supposedly? Because we cannot discern between friends or foes, anymore.
7
The picture of that Chinese restaurant indicates how wrong the people, even for a Chinese-Ecuadorean, can be when think about China. Expatriates from China probably miss their homemade food desperately, but they are willing to pay for better food and better service even without the relocation allowance. The decoration of the restaurant reveals that the owner did not visit China recently or follow the Chinese blog, face book or twitters. He did not realize that his restaurant would be considered as a low-end local fast food store in today's China. Another observation, historically, the majority of Chinese immigrants were from Far South China, such as Fujian, which is thousands miles away from Beijing, and they did not speak Mandarin and often had no decent education. Those expatriates are working for giant companies as management officials or engineering experts, probably with overseas working or education background. Treating them as someone lives in Chinatown or Flushing will be a huge mistake, at least, for his restaurant business.
How old is China and what lessons has it learned compared to the US? Yet, Americans are supposed to have a problem with China exerting its influence and wealth in other parts of the world? I don't have a problem with China or its people or its spending. Didn't Nixon go and visit China in order to establish relationships with it back in the 70s? Forty+ years later, China has evolved, in some aspects and particularly financially in many respects due to its trade policies with the US. But, if China is besting the US by working with other nations and providing them tangible benefits that are improvements to their infrastructure (and those nations are grateful) while it meets its objectives-- how is it that the NYT via its influence brings up the "strings attached" attack? Why? When does the US with its corporate greed not have strings attached to whatever it does? Yes, there will be issues with resources in the future for everyone! So, China beat the US to Africa and has been welcomed there. China does not have a history with Africa that the US and by association its allies e.g., Britain and other European countries have-- so China's in. Indeed, China has clout! Where did they get it from? US corporations and their eager exploitation of Chinese people to manufacture everything Americans used to; when "American made" was our strength. If the objective now is for Americans to be angry: we need only look in the mirror. Obama is in Africa for a reason in his final months. Be hopeful.
6
Mitt Romney was right. Obama has ceded the world to the Chinese. Let us hope that Obama has made the right decision to put the lives of our children and grandchildren in the hands of the Chinese leadership. Let us hope that the Chinese government treats our children better than they treat their own citizens and take care of our environment better than they take care of their own. I know understand why all liberals have their children learn Chinese. They subconsciously know the next generation will have to speak Chinese if the want to be more than just assembly line workers for the Chinese military industrial complex.
Well, let's hope all the liberals and america haters are happy now that their anti-american, anti-Western, anti-Israeli dreams are coming true and enemies/dictatorships like russia, china and iran are starting to take over whole regions, perhaps even continents.
When china has de facto control over most of africa, south america and se asia, will these same liberals who embraced and extolled the horrendous government of china, crushing millions of people under its boot, finally admit that the US, while imperfect, was a far better option to engage and police the world?
Will these dreadful liberals and this "publication's" horrific editorial board, whose advocacy for such lunatic policies as open borders to the poor of the 3rd world into the US, come clean and admit that the idiotic policies they demanded were not in the best interest of anyone? Not likely.
When china has de facto control over most of africa, south america and se asia, will these same liberals who embraced and extolled the horrendous government of china, crushing millions of people under its boot, finally admit that the US, while imperfect, was a far better option to engage and police the world?
Will these dreadful liberals and this "publication's" horrific editorial board, whose advocacy for such lunatic policies as open borders to the poor of the 3rd world into the US, come clean and admit that the idiotic policies they demanded were not in the best interest of anyone? Not likely.
1
China's wealth couldn't come at a better time for them to buy up and pollute the world. By emulating America's industrial success, making shrewd trade agreements, stealing military and industrial secrets, and staying out of war in the MId-East, China has the money, resources, and moral authority to do pretty much what they please. Now that America, the world's #2 polluter, has awakened to climate change, the world's only hope is that the Chinese emulate that too.
3
I guess everyone is forgetting about the third contender (India). I would rather do business with India which is a free country and wants to be our friend and not our foe. We should be supporting India to become the largest democracy in the world.
4
China as foe is the American perception and designation, not the Chinese designation. China wants America as friend, but America sees China as foe, because America always needs a hypothetical for to justify its vast MIC.
4
Democratic countries rarely go to war with each other. It is in the best interest of the free nations of the world to rely on India to be the next great democratic country of the 21st Century not a Communist country that has been threatening to change the status quo of Freedom of Navigation around the world.
1
They might invest in the people of these countries instead of the oligarchy making billions for friends and family, practicing crony capitalism. The current system is not based on the smartest getting ahead but the dumbest stumbling over his feet. If they can get their kids out of the drivers seats of expensive sports cars and concentrate on solving difficult engineering problems, maybe they can do it.
Why is China's business community investing so heavily in developing economies worldwide? Part of the answer is that there is nothing worth investing in back in China. The country's economy is so heavily regulated by a government with a self-defeating long-term "plan" that opportunity there has hit a dead end.
1
The Chinese don't come close to meeting the West's standards of ethics or morality, which thanks to the corrupting influence of wealth consolidation have been marching backwards.
This is not going to end well. The question is when, as well as how much damage will be done to the commons and commoners. It does not look good.
This is not going to end well. The question is when, as well as how much damage will be done to the commons and commoners. It does not look good.
3
You mean ethics like overthrowing the governments of Iran, Chile, Guatemala, invading Iraq based on lies..if that is good ethics who needs
3
The article doesn't discuss the role of corruption. On world rankings of corruption (http://www.transparency.org/country) Ecuador is the 110th least corrupt country on earth out of 175 nations ranked, i.e. the 65th most corrupt, and China the 100th least corrupt. By comparison, Kenya is the 145th least corrupt, the US the 17th least corrupt Canada the 10th, and Switzerland the 4th. On the other hand, on world rankings of how likely it is that a wealthy country's companies will give bribes to public officials in other countries, China is the 27th least likely country (out of only 28 wealthy countries) to bribe officials in other countries, i.e. the second most likely to bribe. On the other hand, the US is the 10th least likely of 28 wealthy countries to offer bribes to officials of other countries, Canada is the 6th least likely, and Switzerland the least likely in the world to offer bribes to other countries. The conclusions to draw are fairly obvious. Chinese involvement in developing countries fits in well with the culture of corruption in those countries and will be more attractive and lucrative to officials in those countries.
1
FYI transparency int'l polls a "small group of experts and business people" in order to do their ranking, why they don't take a poll on let's say taxi drivers in Ecuador?
Poll common people not executives, I bet the results will be different.
Poll common people not executives, I bet the results will be different.
2
The article concerns international business and international development---companies and business people and public officials--not taxi drivers. In any case, are you really suggesting that there is less bribery in the every day life of common citizens in Canada or Switzerland than Ecuador or Kenya?
Pardon the typo. I meant "In any case, are you really suggesting that there is more bribery in the every day life of common citizens in Canada or Switzerland than Ecuador or Kenya??
China's global undertakings (especially when they bring their own countrymen to staff projects) are aimed at more than just financial and resource domination. They are setting excuses for reasons to invade when the time is right just like Japanese did prior to second world war.
1
I've watched the scenario develop for the past 35 years, ever since Reagan became president and turned the US economy and political system over to the multinational corporations and banks. The US has spent its investment monies on military adventures and its role as a global policeman. The Chinese are not making that mistake. As a result, they are developing relationships even in the back yard of the US (Latin America) while the US ignored it. Sad to watch. But that is the history of the rise and fall of empires.
7
Regardless of whether it's the West or China colonizing the developing world, the question is whether it's sustainable from a resource and climate standpoint.
The real enemy is human ego and hedonism, not whether the face is Asian, Caucasian, Middle Eastern, African, or Hispanic. I've seen the enemy, and it is us, or some such...
The real enemy is human ego and hedonism, not whether the face is Asian, Caucasian, Middle Eastern, African, or Hispanic. I've seen the enemy, and it is us, or some such...
2
China builds roads, airports, ports, energy infrastructure, in foreign countries using Chinese companies.
We build military bases and send arms.
Which is wiser?
We build military bases and send arms.
Which is wiser?
13
Wrong info provided by the authors:
Americans expelled from US Base.
Mr. Correa's Government did not expelled anybody from Manta. The U.S Govt had a 10 year lease on the base which Correa did not renew the contract.
Ecuador in trouble, oil revenue low and no resources to pay loans.-
Gross lie, Ecuador is not in arrears of any current debt. Credit ratings are at the highest of recent memory, back in 8/2014 Standard & Poors raised Ecuador's rating to "stable" B- plus.
Wages earned by Ecuadorian workers in Chinese projects.-
Started at $600/month, raised to $914/month, be advised that Ecuador's minimum wage is $354/month
Chinese loans
Previous Governments issued bonds at 12%, 7.25% from the Chinese does not sound bad at all.
Refinery-White Elephant
Enemies of Correa detest the fact this refinery will be built because if done Ecuador will change for the better. Simply mathematics, Ecuador oil exports on average roughly $8 billion/ year but due to lack of refinery capacity imports $3 billion/year in finished products. New refinery needs $7 billion in financing, does this makes sense as a great deal?
Ecuador has enough reserves, countries with no oil resources have built petrochemical complexes like Chile and Uruguay, are they nuts? This is good business, haters of Correa can't stand the thought of his Govt having an extra $3 billion/ year to build more infrastructure and investing in public education and health services.
Americans expelled from US Base.
Mr. Correa's Government did not expelled anybody from Manta. The U.S Govt had a 10 year lease on the base which Correa did not renew the contract.
Ecuador in trouble, oil revenue low and no resources to pay loans.-
Gross lie, Ecuador is not in arrears of any current debt. Credit ratings are at the highest of recent memory, back in 8/2014 Standard & Poors raised Ecuador's rating to "stable" B- plus.
Wages earned by Ecuadorian workers in Chinese projects.-
Started at $600/month, raised to $914/month, be advised that Ecuador's minimum wage is $354/month
Chinese loans
Previous Governments issued bonds at 12%, 7.25% from the Chinese does not sound bad at all.
Refinery-White Elephant
Enemies of Correa detest the fact this refinery will be built because if done Ecuador will change for the better. Simply mathematics, Ecuador oil exports on average roughly $8 billion/ year but due to lack of refinery capacity imports $3 billion/year in finished products. New refinery needs $7 billion in financing, does this makes sense as a great deal?
Ecuador has enough reserves, countries with no oil resources have built petrochemical complexes like Chile and Uruguay, are they nuts? This is good business, haters of Correa can't stand the thought of his Govt having an extra $3 billion/ year to build more infrastructure and investing in public education and health services.
7
Let's face it. We are in serious competition for world domination that we have not experienced since World War II. The question we need to answer is whether China will be friend or foe
The Chinese have been around from 500 years before Christ. They think of themselves as a civilization. The United States has been around for only 240 years. The citizens of both countries are proud of their heritage.
For thousands of years China called themselves the “Middle Kingdom”, meaning they were the center of civilization and all other countries and cultures were inferior to theirs. For much of China’s history they did not pay close attention to the rest of the world. They believed that non-Chinese were barbarians and they had nothing to learn from them.
Up until the mid 18th century China had no interest in conquering other lands. When they visited other parts of the world China was not out to conquer. They accepted gifts from the barbarians and had no interest in ruling them. Often they would invite the barbarians to visit China and provide gifts, called tribute, to the Emperor of China. The Chinese explorers would leave in peace believing they had nothing to learn from others. This attitude was costly for China.
http://lstrn.us/1HpPRPl
The Chinese have been around from 500 years before Christ. They think of themselves as a civilization. The United States has been around for only 240 years. The citizens of both countries are proud of their heritage.
For thousands of years China called themselves the “Middle Kingdom”, meaning they were the center of civilization and all other countries and cultures were inferior to theirs. For much of China’s history they did not pay close attention to the rest of the world. They believed that non-Chinese were barbarians and they had nothing to learn from them.
Up until the mid 18th century China had no interest in conquering other lands. When they visited other parts of the world China was not out to conquer. They accepted gifts from the barbarians and had no interest in ruling them. Often they would invite the barbarians to visit China and provide gifts, called tribute, to the Emperor of China. The Chinese explorers would leave in peace believing they had nothing to learn from others. This attitude was costly for China.
http://lstrn.us/1HpPRPl
5
China is doing with Ecuador, which did not EE.UU.China, Pay anticipated purchases of oil production. Not like the IMF and World Bank that they were exploiters with their high interest rates, choking the economy, Ecuador can now have a thriving economy, and are not operators with high interest, such as loans from the IMF
3
I'd like to see a map with those purple circles where the US has military bases--little circles for small ones and big circles for big ones. China uses its economic power to extend its sphere of influence, and the US uses its military clout, spending no less, I suppose, to endeavor to do by force and threat what China is doing by business means. I wonder which is more sustainable in the end.
5
Good point. What US spends on military approach could be substituted for an economic approach.
Guns versus Butter is the eternal argument. US chose guns for itself, and its approach to the world. China chose butter.
Guns versus Butter is the eternal argument. US chose guns for itself, and its approach to the world. China chose butter.
3
The Chinese are Eusocial (like Ants and Bees)
They protect the Queen (China) and do not get distracted by Bronze Age doctrine and pipe dreams like spreading democracy and exceptionalism.
Learning Mandarin would be a good idea!
They protect the Queen (China) and do not get distracted by Bronze Age doctrine and pipe dreams like spreading democracy and exceptionalism.
Learning Mandarin would be a good idea!
2
Do you really think that spreading democracy is the goal of the men here who want to control the ME and all that? I don't think that's what they're after at all.
1
All of this has happened before and all of this will happen again.
Extending power and influence is a natural corollary to financial might. Look at any major economic power since the dawn of civilization... they looked to expand their reach to acquire resources and capture markets. This worked for a few tens to a few hundred years and then these empires deflated. Every one of them. Perhaps it is a natural cycle. Each empire comes with its dangers though. While the US used its financial clout to expand its influence, it was (and is) far less coercive and selfish compared with the Chinese communist regime. US aid programs have benefited hundreds of millions around the world. But Chinese aid programs in Africa and South America employ predominantly Chinese workers and so the financial "aid" they provide for projects comes right back to them. How is that aid?
Don't be fooled. With $4 trillion in foreign exchange, China is buying loyalty and erasing history. Just ask anyone in Tibet or Xinjiang. The real danger, as with all of those empires that are long gone, is that when the regime collapses, the power vacuum left behind will lead to a period of instability and strife.
If we learned from history, we could avoid polarization by adopting a global approach to governance and conflict resolution. But as long as there is national pride and arrogance, anywhere, this cycle will not break.
All of this has happened before and all of this will happen again.
Extending power and influence is a natural corollary to financial might. Look at any major economic power since the dawn of civilization... they looked to expand their reach to acquire resources and capture markets. This worked for a few tens to a few hundred years and then these empires deflated. Every one of them. Perhaps it is a natural cycle. Each empire comes with its dangers though. While the US used its financial clout to expand its influence, it was (and is) far less coercive and selfish compared with the Chinese communist regime. US aid programs have benefited hundreds of millions around the world. But Chinese aid programs in Africa and South America employ predominantly Chinese workers and so the financial "aid" they provide for projects comes right back to them. How is that aid?
Don't be fooled. With $4 trillion in foreign exchange, China is buying loyalty and erasing history. Just ask anyone in Tibet or Xinjiang. The real danger, as with all of those empires that are long gone, is that when the regime collapses, the power vacuum left behind will lead to a period of instability and strife.
If we learned from history, we could avoid polarization by adopting a global approach to governance and conflict resolution. But as long as there is national pride and arrogance, anywhere, this cycle will not break.
All of this has happened before and all of this will happen again.
3
China will make different but no less huge mistakes in their quest for resources. A difference between the U.S. version of this endless nightmare and the Chinese version is that the chinese do not even employ locals for a short time. They bring over chinese workers to Angola and other countries, no skills are passed on to local workers, and sometimes even start enterprises to undercut locals.
It is the same thing being done to these people in developing countries over and over.
It is the same thing being done to these people in developing countries over and over.
1
There is no historical precedent for a country like China to succeed. The political systems in place do not support longevity, but eventually mean an economic and political crisis. China is growth is attributable to borrowing money and consuming borrowed funds at an historically unprecedented pace. Like a household that owned a house without a mortgage and with no financial discipline; they're making terrible investment decisions with those borrowed monies, which will not provide long-term economic efficiencies. Their environment is abused and terribly polluted, and their freedoms are non-existent. China is a slow motion train wreck. As Americans, we should continue to be extremely confident about our futures and our global leadership in the world. Let's not get too over anxious about the neighbor who just borrowed a lot of money to buy the shiny new car they can ill afford.
If China and Japan were to combine together and form a more powerful China, then China would have a much easier time taking over any variety of smaller countries. Of course, this may certainly need at least 10 more years, especially to combine military at the same time as technology advancement. Eventually, this more powerful China will become an overwhelming threat to America. This is exactly what happens in my screenplay titled; "The Last President"" by Douglas Paige and asking only $1.7 million.
If people like Dr. Krugman says that globalism is bad, I would like to ask whether power and wealth were more fairly distributed when it was less globalized. Was it?
In order to say that we should prevent globalism, we should show that without globalism the economic and political unfairness would be lessened.
But the fact of the matter is just the opposite: wealth and power were even more unfairly distributed when it was less globalized.
The world was just poorly designed in the first place (if it was ever designed). If the world was evenly distributed in terms of natural resources, people would have been less eager to globalize it; they would have been more content with what they had. But even the climate is not evenly distributed, which gave rise to the unevenness of natural resources.
So, unless you are as naive as Rousseu about the natural state, you cannot say that the world would be fair if it were not globalized.
Therefore, what an economist like Krugman should do is not to say "No globalism" but to find a way to globalize in a fairer way. That's why there should be globalized economic policies and laws. To deny globalism is just unscientific. But then politicians and economists should find a way to make it work. That seems to be what real progressivism is all about.
The world started to globalize the moment it came into existence. There was not a single moment that the world was not in the process of being globalized.
In order to say that we should prevent globalism, we should show that without globalism the economic and political unfairness would be lessened.
But the fact of the matter is just the opposite: wealth and power were even more unfairly distributed when it was less globalized.
The world was just poorly designed in the first place (if it was ever designed). If the world was evenly distributed in terms of natural resources, people would have been less eager to globalize it; they would have been more content with what they had. But even the climate is not evenly distributed, which gave rise to the unevenness of natural resources.
So, unless you are as naive as Rousseu about the natural state, you cannot say that the world would be fair if it were not globalized.
Therefore, what an economist like Krugman should do is not to say "No globalism" but to find a way to globalize in a fairer way. That's why there should be globalized economic policies and laws. To deny globalism is just unscientific. But then politicians and economists should find a way to make it work. That seems to be what real progressivism is all about.
The world started to globalize the moment it came into existence. There was not a single moment that the world was not in the process of being globalized.
The correct way to explore out the Chinese expansion scenario is to assume everything they are doing will work out, that they will be able to get a stranglehold on the commodities, they will lead in the area of controlling technology and developing superior ones.
Based on how this portrays, then to do scenario planning around it. Absent timely strategic actions and moves, I think its game over.
Based on how this portrays, then to do scenario planning around it. Absent timely strategic actions and moves, I think its game over.
"Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of a cancer cell." Edward Abbey
And this truism applies to all political groups, including the communists.
However, during most of the 20th century the U.S. invaded and occupied many Central American and Caribbean nations, or armed genocidal dictators, some of whom were "elected presidents", to maintain our control of banana republics.
The Chinese won't do better than the U.S.
But the Chinese certainly can't do any worse than the U.S.
And this truism applies to all political groups, including the communists.
However, during most of the 20th century the U.S. invaded and occupied many Central American and Caribbean nations, or armed genocidal dictators, some of whom were "elected presidents", to maintain our control of banana republics.
The Chinese won't do better than the U.S.
But the Chinese certainly can't do any worse than the U.S.
2
We should graciously hand the leadership baton to China, and feel gratitude that we were once world leaders. Eventually all world empires self-destruct. Now it is our turn. Anger and denial will not serve us well. Quiet acceptance is what is best.
2
I think I would rather pass the leadership baton to a Democratic country like India rather than a Communist ruled country like China.
Big US Business created this "monster" called China by investing there to make huge profits and keep expenses low. You have nowhere to look but in a mirror to see what has happened. Now look again in the mirror to see the monster that you created at home - poverty, racial divide, Republican discord with the president and Democrats at every opportunity, and of course lost jobs.
The US is almost bankrupt with all of the money it's printed in the last 30 hers to fight lost watts all over the world.
It's time to return to the basics and ironically to one of your more respected presidents - Abe Lincoln - ironically- a Republican who once said at Gettysburg:
"government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."
I'm Canadian, a mere 66 years old, and I have seen your country fall badly from grace from where it once was - it is now time for all political parties to stop playing politics and get back to Bringing America back to where she once was - you, the people deserve this, and so does She!
The US is almost bankrupt with all of the money it's printed in the last 30 hers to fight lost watts all over the world.
It's time to return to the basics and ironically to one of your more respected presidents - Abe Lincoln - ironically- a Republican who once said at Gettysburg:
"government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."
I'm Canadian, a mere 66 years old, and I have seen your country fall badly from grace from where it once was - it is now time for all political parties to stop playing politics and get back to Bringing America back to where she once was - you, the people deserve this, and so does She!
2
It takes others to see us as we should see ourselves.
The USA was once great, but lost its way some time in the 60's, and it has been cycling down ever since, but not apparent to many. Now it is plenty obvious, but perhaps, if not most likely, cannot be arrested, because the powers at be, and other self-interests, seek to perpetuate themselves, to profit from this downward spiral, which they spin into a positive.
Just look at the current slate of sorry candidates for presidency of both parties? Where is the Abe Lincolnesque character? Donald Trump? Chillary Hillary? There is more interest in the Kardashians than other matters.
The American people would seem to deserve better, and to have a future, but they are content to relegate their future to media manipulation, and reacting like sheep. The American people no longer stand up for their country's founding principles and for justice and rights. Thus, they will get exact what they deserve, their own demise.
You as a Canadian can shed a tear, but would it not be a wasted tear when the Americans themselves don't even care?
The USA was once great, but lost its way some time in the 60's, and it has been cycling down ever since, but not apparent to many. Now it is plenty obvious, but perhaps, if not most likely, cannot be arrested, because the powers at be, and other self-interests, seek to perpetuate themselves, to profit from this downward spiral, which they spin into a positive.
Just look at the current slate of sorry candidates for presidency of both parties? Where is the Abe Lincolnesque character? Donald Trump? Chillary Hillary? There is more interest in the Kardashians than other matters.
The American people would seem to deserve better, and to have a future, but they are content to relegate their future to media manipulation, and reacting like sheep. The American people no longer stand up for their country's founding principles and for justice and rights. Thus, they will get exact what they deserve, their own demise.
You as a Canadian can shed a tear, but would it not be a wasted tear when the Americans themselves don't even care?
1
Chinese government values centralized government power and conformity. Our government was "conceived in liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal." In other words, the values underlying our Republic are the exact opposite of those that guide China - limiting government power and protecting the individual, e.g., freedom of speech, right to privacy, due process of law, right to counsel, etc. China is a fascist state and it's primary goal is economic and military domination. At some point in the future those values and goals will likely clash and the outcome of that battle will determine whether "government of the people, by the people and for the people" can long endure in a world of shrinking resources.
1
You have a very rosy (not to say naïve) view of the US, if you think that there's no will to domination on the parts of those who actually do control the acts of the nation. Hint: it's not you and I, and not an informed citizenry, or an idealized land of equality who are steering this boat.
1
You need to do more widespread reading and education.
Which country has the largest military and expenditures therefor and is seeking or practicing military dominance? Which country is continuously at war, and war mongering?
Please double-check.
Which country has the largest military and expenditures therefor and is seeking or practicing military dominance? Which country is continuously at war, and war mongering?
Please double-check.
1
Naïve you say and the need for more education you say.. It's about the values that guide a nation and the possibilities and ideals... I've read state department reports on China.. Maybe you should read them too... Then you'll understand why millions are trying to get in to the United States... I'm afraid your political correct views are nothing more than groupthink.. The kind of groupthink that created the shortsighted policies we now have on China... Yes China is a fascist state... The kind of free speech you enjoy criticizing the United States is the kind of speech that would land you in jail in China... You would be held in administrative detention without any kind of due process of law. Perhaps it's you that should do more reading an education..
China has been buying much of sub-Saharan Africa, Latin America, and the Pacific Island and Caribbean island nations. They are providing a drug far more potent and dangerous than cocaine or meth -- billions of dollarsin loans on terms that make repayment impossible. They are securing massive mineral, timber, and land resources, while maintaining the impoverished conditions of the workers in the "beneficiary" countries. Environmental concerns are largely absent while megaprojects roar ahead. And, of course, these countries will vote in the United Nations the way their Chinese benefactors demand. Why else would China be providing development assistance grants and soft loans to small island nations that lack natural resources? For their votes, of course. This is very, very scary.
1
There is a nation right off our coast called the Bahamas that is in the midst of what can go horribly wrong when you put all your eggs in a Chinese basket. It is the $3.5 billion luxury resort called Baha Mar. Did I mention it is in bankruptcy in Deleware and at the same time being taken over by the Bahamian government. The thousands of Chinese that built it sit idle. The thousands of local workers and companies are shut out waiting to get paid for over six months. The owners, Bahamian government, Chinese contractors and the Chinese ex-im bank are stuck in a chess match for who will ultimately take control of this giant project. While it is 97% complete under a closer look it is proving to show the inexperience and lack of quality standards the Chinese have been rumored to allow in order to grab these projects at below market rates.
It is said to beware of the high cost of low prices.
Stay tuned.
It is said to beware of the high cost of low prices.
Stay tuned.
3
The Chinese financed our war on Iraq and look what we did with it. They have roads and bridges and high speed trains while ours are falling apart. It almost makes you think they're smarter than we are. It could even be that American exceptionalism means exceptionally stupid.
6
Its quite clear how the Chinese government attempts to change the culture and economy in Nepal, which for some strange reason is not included on the graphic, though it receives a very big investment from China. The Chinese government pressures the Nepalese government into stopping Tibetans who are trying to flee Tibet over passes in the Himalaya and returning them to Tibet. They also pressure the Nepalese government, via the Nepalese Maoist Party and the UPN/CML (Communist Parties) into stopping any protests in favor of Tibet and Tibetans, and stopping any demonstrations against the Chinese government.
Chinese companies are also openly looting the Nepalese government. There is an ongoing hydro/electric project to bring water to the Kathmandu Valley from the Kosi river to the east. A Chinese firm had been awarded the project and was a couple of years behind schedule and many crore over budget, millions of dollars. They walked off the job, admitting that they were in over their heads, but pocketed the proceeds anyway. The Nepalese government awarded completion of the project to an Italian firm.
Bottom line - doing business with China? Expect a lot of corruption, government pressure, and pollution, not to mention a lack of human rights. Does the US do the same thing? Arguably, but upon closer inspection, with far less coercion and human rights abuses, and now, at least, more concern for the environment.
Chinese companies are also openly looting the Nepalese government. There is an ongoing hydro/electric project to bring water to the Kathmandu Valley from the Kosi river to the east. A Chinese firm had been awarded the project and was a couple of years behind schedule and many crore over budget, millions of dollars. They walked off the job, admitting that they were in over their heads, but pocketed the proceeds anyway. The Nepalese government awarded completion of the project to an Italian firm.
Bottom line - doing business with China? Expect a lot of corruption, government pressure, and pollution, not to mention a lack of human rights. Does the US do the same thing? Arguably, but upon closer inspection, with far less coercion and human rights abuses, and now, at least, more concern for the environment.
1
At least China is not overthrowing governments and killing leaders to keep them from meeting the needs of their populations. These authors seem to ignore the history of domination and oppression of the West. I'll take a China over any Western country 100 times over.
2
Sounds as though China should be awarded the Nobel Peace Prize for its open society and defense of human rights. I am certain that the level of discourse and freedom to speak one's mind is at a higher level in China .than say. London
Colonialism ain't good for the colonies, no matter what the language or customs. We have only to look back at our own history to see that. And world history pretty much backs that up. Yep, clever these Chinese, but then again they've been at this thing called civilization a lot longer than we of the West. Having been exploited extensively by that very same West they've also no doubt learned an additional thing or two along the way. But it's the same old game. And the house always wins. And the house is Momma Nature, Gaia that is.
2
We have only to look at China's own abysmal environmental record to know what will happen to the environment of those nations where it invests.
http://io9.com/5927112/chinas-worst-self-inflicted-disaster-the-campaign...
http://www.weather.com/science/environment/news/green-algae-swamping-lak...
Ecuador has nearly 20 million acres (8.1 hectares) of Amazonian rainforest. The Amazon rainforest is the lungs of the planet.
http://www.businessinsider.com/ecuador-selling-its-rainforest-to-china-2...
Ecuador will make money in the short term, but, in the long term, it will be environmentally looted.
1 of every 5 humans on the planet is Chinese. 1 of every 20 humans on the planet is American. We need to come up with a new way of working together to create clean and sustainable industry, or we will both simply build until we destroy the foundations of our respective civilizations and are left with money but without air to breath, water to drink, food to eat or habitable climates.
http://io9.com/5927112/chinas-worst-self-inflicted-disaster-the-campaign...
http://www.weather.com/science/environment/news/green-algae-swamping-lak...
Ecuador has nearly 20 million acres (8.1 hectares) of Amazonian rainforest. The Amazon rainforest is the lungs of the planet.
http://www.businessinsider.com/ecuador-selling-its-rainforest-to-china-2...
Ecuador will make money in the short term, but, in the long term, it will be environmentally looted.
1 of every 5 humans on the planet is Chinese. 1 of every 20 humans on the planet is American. We need to come up with a new way of working together to create clean and sustainable industry, or we will both simply build until we destroy the foundations of our respective civilizations and are left with money but without air to breath, water to drink, food to eat or habitable climates.
3
Your first sentence is a wake up call — a bulls eye!
3
But Heather, most of that pollution in China is a result of making products for the West. So, when you buy something made in China, you turn a blind eye to the pollution in exchange for the cheaper price. Don't blame the Chinese for giving you what you want. China has been willing to accept the pollution to rise out of poverty. China does seem to be changing as it gets richer, and is more concerned about its environment. So, as we have done, it is beginning to look for exporting pollution. It is just a shame that we can't figure out how to bypass the pollution part. But China isn't doing anything different than we are, we need to look in the mirror before we cast stones at China.
3
To Dan,
1. If you can, do not buy 'Made in China,' poor manufacture, lack of quality control, do not last long — a vicious cycle of pollution. Made in the USA, Japan, Germany, etc., may initially cost more but is financially and ethically a better investment.
2. 'Exporting pollution' is an ethically and at the end practically unsustainable strategy. No need to cast stones, change manufacturing and consumption habits; pay for cleaner practices, sooner rather than later, we will have to foot the bill.
1. If you can, do not buy 'Made in China,' poor manufacture, lack of quality control, do not last long — a vicious cycle of pollution. Made in the USA, Japan, Germany, etc., may initially cost more but is financially and ethically a better investment.
2. 'Exporting pollution' is an ethically and at the end practically unsustainable strategy. No need to cast stones, change manufacturing and consumption habits; pay for cleaner practices, sooner rather than later, we will have to foot the bill.
The U.S. and Europe made the mold and China is running with it. No surprise there. Any complaints from the West ring with hypocrisy and irony.
But this is what interests me: China's "effort to create an internationally funded institution to finance transportation and other infrastructure..."
Why oppose that? With Republicans ensuring that our infrastructure will continue to deteriorate and perform at a third-world level - with certain and predictable consequences for our economy - an international infrastructure bank sounds like something we need to tap into.
But this is what interests me: China's "effort to create an internationally funded institution to finance transportation and other infrastructure..."
Why oppose that? With Republicans ensuring that our infrastructure will continue to deteriorate and perform at a third-world level - with certain and predictable consequences for our economy - an international infrastructure bank sounds like something we need to tap into.
8
Add in our lack of protection for buying real estate. The Chinese are buying up the Bay Area, and leaving houses empty, for the day, years off, when they expect their children to go to Stanford. Or else, as the NY Times recently pointed out, using real estate as a safe place to park cash.
Many countries protect their real estate from foreign investment. We invite it. Most Americans simply can't compete with Russian and Chinese cash. Buyers purchase expensive properties sight unseen at housing fairs. Chinese real estate consortiums of over 3000 realtors are active in the Bay Area, and likely elsewhere too.
Vancouver BC is now 60% Chinese, though that initially had to do with Hong Kong reverting to Chinese rule. Walk down the street in Berkeley and you see primarily Chinese students.
The US has to stop giving free admission to millionaires, and protect it's citizenry and property. Mexico - though not as strict as it used to be - still has legislation keeping some areas off limits. The US should restrict all purchases of real estate within 100 miles of a border. That would protect nearly every major American city other than Denver.
I will work for any legislator that writes such legislation.
Many countries protect their real estate from foreign investment. We invite it. Most Americans simply can't compete with Russian and Chinese cash. Buyers purchase expensive properties sight unseen at housing fairs. Chinese real estate consortiums of over 3000 realtors are active in the Bay Area, and likely elsewhere too.
Vancouver BC is now 60% Chinese, though that initially had to do with Hong Kong reverting to Chinese rule. Walk down the street in Berkeley and you see primarily Chinese students.
The US has to stop giving free admission to millionaires, and protect it's citizenry and property. Mexico - though not as strict as it used to be - still has legislation keeping some areas off limits. The US should restrict all purchases of real estate within 100 miles of a border. That would protect nearly every major American city other than Denver.
I will work for any legislator that writes such legislation.
4
The map shows sizable investment in west Africa, notably Sierra Leone. And yet where was China during the Ebola outbreak? Yeah, <1% of all country aide.
When I was living in Zambia, the Chinese were importing prisoners to work in the mines alongside Zambians whom they were paying a pittance at best. The stories I heard make my stomach turn.
Make no bones about it, these people are in it for themselves. In the development world, it's what's we refer to as an "extractive" approach.
When I was living in Zambia, the Chinese were importing prisoners to work in the mines alongside Zambians whom they were paying a pittance at best. The stories I heard make my stomach turn.
Make no bones about it, these people are in it for themselves. In the development world, it's what's we refer to as an "extractive" approach.
3
Chinese did send doctors to SL during Ebola, extensively. Be fair.
1
Traveling the world I find huge new airports, new road networks and skyscrapers in cities where 20 years ago, only dust reigned. Last month an article in a local paper that all citizens in that nation would have access to national healthcare at minimal or no cost, within 60 days. No debate, no death panel distortions. Just the notice and where to sign up - apparently a 10 minute process.
It takes only a moment to realize that the money to do these things comes directly out of the West, as it de-industrializes in favour of imports, and continues to spend trillions on energy imports.
Arriving in the US, it was equally amazing to find an internet too slow to stream, a tatty airport, the roads home pockmarked and traffic lines eroded away.
It is impossible to not imagine what we could have accomplished in the same time frame with our industries healthy, energy independence and the money spent at home.
So much for the "leadership" that stood by as the future of Europe and the USA was packed for export and sent overseas. If the Chinese and others use what our political and business leaders deliberately sent them, so be it.
A'murca tolerates the leadership we've got - and will now live by the results.
It takes only a moment to realize that the money to do these things comes directly out of the West, as it de-industrializes in favour of imports, and continues to spend trillions on energy imports.
Arriving in the US, it was equally amazing to find an internet too slow to stream, a tatty airport, the roads home pockmarked and traffic lines eroded away.
It is impossible to not imagine what we could have accomplished in the same time frame with our industries healthy, energy independence and the money spent at home.
So much for the "leadership" that stood by as the future of Europe and the USA was packed for export and sent overseas. If the Chinese and others use what our political and business leaders deliberately sent them, so be it.
A'murca tolerates the leadership we've got - and will now live by the results.
6
With the amount absorbed by the MIC what is left for infrastructure? Those weapons cost money, a F-35 pilot helmet costs $400K.
Don't complain. More of the same coming up. Watch the upcoming election extravaganza, without puking.
Don't complain. More of the same coming up. Watch the upcoming election extravaganza, without puking.
a picture here can be worth a thousand words. Look at the incredible development inside china. Whole cities being built with the transportation infrastructure around them. Compare this with your article today on trains here in the N.E. corridor. We're not even maintaining what we already have. The politics of race trumps everything here--red state vs blue state including guns.
in your graphic you show heavy investment in Afghanistan. please explain what this is. for example, is it lithium? If the Chinese can do for lithium batteries what they have done with solar panels, it would help us all. in trade agreements the manufacture of cheap solar/renewables should trump other concerns. This is the one product the world desperately needs.
If governments--the U.S. and China--cannot effect policies to do this, perhaps the market can. If it's cheaper--gasoline and electricity is a big expense--people may make the switch on their own. In terms of saving the planet the use of renewables and protecting biodiversity (not the greed of extraction technologies) is already incredibly cheaper. When people see their own personal benefit in this, it will happen. At present, in the U.S. our divisive racist politics, financed in large part by the fossil fuel industry, prevents this.
in your graphic you show heavy investment in Afghanistan. please explain what this is. for example, is it lithium? If the Chinese can do for lithium batteries what they have done with solar panels, it would help us all. in trade agreements the manufacture of cheap solar/renewables should trump other concerns. This is the one product the world desperately needs.
If governments--the U.S. and China--cannot effect policies to do this, perhaps the market can. If it's cheaper--gasoline and electricity is a big expense--people may make the switch on their own. In terms of saving the planet the use of renewables and protecting biodiversity (not the greed of extraction technologies) is already incredibly cheaper. When people see their own personal benefit in this, it will happen. At present, in the U.S. our divisive racist politics, financed in large part by the fossil fuel industry, prevents this.
3
The Chinese do everything right in managing their balance sheet. They spend less than they earn. They strategically invest their surplus.
They are the dealer, we are the addict. We love their cheap goods, we go ever more in debt to buy everything that is made there, including the Apple computer this is being typed on.
Net result: They have a handsome financial position, we are on our way to becoming Greece.
The inability to control spending is turning out to be the fatal flaw of democracy
They are the dealer, we are the addict. We love their cheap goods, we go ever more in debt to buy everything that is made there, including the Apple computer this is being typed on.
Net result: They have a handsome financial position, we are on our way to becoming Greece.
The inability to control spending is turning out to be the fatal flaw of democracy
5
I think China's budget deficit is larger than ours. They are is serious debt trouble. They have a lot of money on hand ~$4 trillion. but they have over $20 trillion in debt. This is why everyone is predicting a collapse of the Chinese economy.
heir debt has been created by an over-investment in infrastructure.
Ours has been created via programs to subsidize health care and retirement plans, this in the absence of our own population's ability to save any money during their whole lifetime
Which do you think will pay off in the long term?
Ours has been created via programs to subsidize health care and retirement plans, this in the absence of our own population's ability to save any money during their whole lifetime
Which do you think will pay off in the long term?
1
Financing for development projects by the United States also comes with strings attached (e.g. need to consultants, US-made projects, hire US workers and consumers, fly on US carriers etc). Therefore, to think that we're not also employing this strategy for more geo-political control, access to natural resources and seeking financial gain is disingenuous and naive. Basically, China is beating us at our own game. And, based on the state of their environment, and that in the counties where they operate, we can look forward to a world stripped bare to satisfy their voracious and insatiable appetites.
4
I have to laugh at belligerent right-wing Americans bemoaning the loss of national strength relative to China. This is because China, with its lax/nonexistent environmental regulations and extreme hostility to the rights of working people, is pretty much paradise on earth for a typical right-wing American who hates unions and clean air as well, apparently.
If so-called "right-to-work" states in the USA secede from the union and apply to become provinces of China, that will make total sense.
If so-called "right-to-work" states in the USA secede from the union and apply to become provinces of China, that will make total sense.
6
While we waste time and energy obsessing about partisan politics and Islamic radicals, China is quietly outmaneuvering the U.S. all over the world. I predict that the 21st century will be remembered as the Chinese Century.
4
One must acknowledge Chinese Slave Labor in in Union Pacific Railway being built that connected US East with the US West. That made Pullman Company Rich, and eventually that gave you Stanford University, and the Silicon Valley.
5
Re: China's Economic and Cultural impact on countries it aids.
The article mentions total lack of interaction between Chinese officials and workers and Ecuadorians. So we can rule out a foreign culture making unwelcome inroads into a centuries-old Ecuadorian/Spanish way of life.
However, the economic impact of Beijing-initiated development projects
might lead Ecuador's becoming China's ally in America's backyard. Closer relationship between the two countries might result in China's asking to have a military base in Ecuador. That will exacerbate the existing tensions
between the U. S. and China.
It's time the leading countries of the world organized a global conference to
discuss collective help for developing countries in place of super powers
bearing that burden or grabbing that privilege, colonial fashion.
The article mentions total lack of interaction between Chinese officials and workers and Ecuadorians. So we can rule out a foreign culture making unwelcome inroads into a centuries-old Ecuadorian/Spanish way of life.
However, the economic impact of Beijing-initiated development projects
might lead Ecuador's becoming China's ally in America's backyard. Closer relationship between the two countries might result in China's asking to have a military base in Ecuador. That will exacerbate the existing tensions
between the U. S. and China.
It's time the leading countries of the world organized a global conference to
discuss collective help for developing countries in place of super powers
bearing that burden or grabbing that privilege, colonial fashion.
4
The major differences between China and US is prioritize their national resources. The U.S seeks world domination by military might and China by way of economic might. With its long history of civil wars, famine, foreign dominations, China has realized that to win friends and influence people, it is not through the barrel of a gun.
5
China buys friendships like everybody else and in the long term will not make great partner. Banana republic models of the West are being duplicated by China. There is very little difference.
2
At least China does not use her resources to invade nations based on lies.
Contrast China's role in the rest of the globe with that of America. The number 1 foreign policy goal of the GOP is to try and get the US into another war of aggression on behalf of Israel, this time against Iran. As if previous wars of aggression didn't squander enough American blood and treasure. Furthermore, when the massive retaliation in kind inevitably hits American shores as many of us predicted prior to 9/11, we will be told that it was because of our "freedom" and not because of our Neo-Con foreign policies.
6
Just read about the activities of Chevron in Ecuador and then you'll realize why people in Ecuador--despite some misgivings--are more positive about China's role in their nation's economy than continuing dominance by the USA as the main outside player.
Everything is relative, and the Chinese have been very clever in emphasizing to South Americans and Africans that "their faces are not white." In other words, they play the race card very well and to their advantage. And unlike the Japanese, there is no history of Chinese leaders seeking to win recognition as an equal by leaders of imperialistic white-majority nations.
Everything is relative, and the Chinese have been very clever in emphasizing to South Americans and Africans that "their faces are not white." In other words, they play the race card very well and to their advantage. And unlike the Japanese, there is no history of Chinese leaders seeking to win recognition as an equal by leaders of imperialistic white-majority nations.
I'm not a fan of this alarmist tone about China. Providing economic loans and assistance doesn't have to be competitive.
The US has military bases all over the world - Japan, S Korea, Germany, Cuba, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan - that help protect and project American influence. The US also has FBI (multiple offices on 6 continents) and DEA operations (86 operations in 67 countries) all over the world. The US is not "losing" its place in the world.
Lastly, unlike China, America has concentrated its investment over the last 10+ years. Instead of spreading its influence "thinly" across the world, the US has focused its trillions of dollars into Iraq and Afghanistan. The question of who is getting a better ROI is up for disucssion.
The US has military bases all over the world - Japan, S Korea, Germany, Cuba, UAE, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan - that help protect and project American influence. The US also has FBI (multiple offices on 6 continents) and DEA operations (86 operations in 67 countries) all over the world. The US is not "losing" its place in the world.
Lastly, unlike China, America has concentrated its investment over the last 10+ years. Instead of spreading its influence "thinly" across the world, the US has focused its trillions of dollars into Iraq and Afghanistan. The question of who is getting a better ROI is up for disucssion.
11
Under the last several administrations, both Republican and Democratic, America has withdrawn from the world stage. The most egregious of these is the current administration in which economic, military and diplomatic relations have been left wanting. There are gaps and power vacuums and each time there is a new gap then Russia, North Korea, Syria, Sudan, Iraq, Egypt and now Iran, take immediate advantage of the American withdrawal. America is no longer a player with credibility on the world stage. We can no longer be trusted. We no longer provide leadership. Our military is shrinking and withdrawing from bases as the size of each branch of the armed forces is reduced in size, quality and equipment. The world has noticed and acted.
Now the Chinese are not only making their presence known economically but militarily as well. China is expanding her global reach. She is building military island bases, increasing the size and technology of her navy including looking forward to aircraft carriers, submarines and expanded and technologically advanced aircraft and missiles. American is blind, indifferent and paralyzed. We exported our manufacturing to China and made her rich. We created unemployment here and destroyed our industrial base. The current administration is hopelessly engaged in trying to negotiate nuclear agreements with Iran. It is hopelessly "pivoting" to Asia without a navy or other forces. And it is offering "The Audacity of Hope" with a faith based initiative.
Now the Chinese are not only making their presence known economically but militarily as well. China is expanding her global reach. She is building military island bases, increasing the size and technology of her navy including looking forward to aircraft carriers, submarines and expanded and technologically advanced aircraft and missiles. American is blind, indifferent and paralyzed. We exported our manufacturing to China and made her rich. We created unemployment here and destroyed our industrial base. The current administration is hopelessly engaged in trying to negotiate nuclear agreements with Iran. It is hopelessly "pivoting" to Asia without a navy or other forces. And it is offering "The Audacity of Hope" with a faith based initiative.
1
Republicans and democrats alike support a global economy (for different reasons). But what they did not explain, and what Americans do not understand is that a global economy means a global wage - American's wages have to go down to meet the rising wages of China or Bangladesh. That also means that the power of individual nations will be reduced as international economic policies and rules become the laws under which all nations, including America, must bow. Globalization is good, but we do have to give up American dominance to achieve its benefits for the world. After all, why should an American laborer have a better standard of living than a Somali laborer. A hard day's work should give the same standard of living anywhere in the world. Globalization can do that.
Only if you allow it, support it and disregard national needs and national sovereignty. America and other nations need not commit economic suicide. We do not have to export technology, expertise and intellectual property at our expense. We do not have to export jobs. We do not have to participate in anything that diminishes us as an economic, political or military power. We can sustain ourselves. Just as we did until NAFTA and other free trade and fair trade agreements were signed. We do not have to sign any agreements. We do not owe the rest of the world anything.
1
China must know something that we don't. Here they are investing their treasure gaining economic clout, investing in countries that can provide natural resources, etc.
China simply doesn't understand the essence of power. You need guns, you need fabricated wars........... coupled with a huge military industrial complex and a giant dose of arrogance.
The true joke is that we rant and rail against Iran who is not nearly the threat to us as is China. See you in the future. Who do you think will be the last man standing?
China simply doesn't understand the essence of power. You need guns, you need fabricated wars........... coupled with a huge military industrial complex and a giant dose of arrogance.
The true joke is that we rant and rail against Iran who is not nearly the threat to us as is China. See you in the future. Who do you think will be the last man standing?
3
Instead of sending in the CIA and military to effect regime change in order to exploit Latin American countries, China simply "buys " the country and avoids
bloodshed!
bloodshed!
5
Did you hear of Standard Oil, Aramoco, or United Fruit.
Its all about feeding alligators.
Its all about feeding alligators.
I am not sure how Chinese firms will change the culture of a country. It seems to me that changing a culture would require interaction between Chinese workers and the native population. What aspects of a culture would the Chinese change? Religion, language, and social customs, would be so entrenched in a country that cultural change, sans intimate interaction, is unlikely in the host country. It is more likely that the Chinese workers are prone to change and aspects of the host country's culture would be exported to China. ( I have no research to back that up). In some ways the old adage " familiarity breeds contempt" may come into play.
Obviously the economy of the host country will be affected tremendously--positively or negatively. If, as the article states, China imposes stringent loan terms on a country and the economy is booming, then there won't be any problems. However, it the economy tanks China will be left holding the bag. If the jobs become scarce or environmental and safety issues arise, given the capaciousness of human nature, the Chinese will be blamed. What goes round comes round.
Obviously the economy of the host country will be affected tremendously--positively or negatively. If, as the article states, China imposes stringent loan terms on a country and the economy is booming, then there won't be any problems. However, it the economy tanks China will be left holding the bag. If the jobs become scarce or environmental and safety issues arise, given the capaciousness of human nature, the Chinese will be blamed. What goes round comes round.
2
I hope the Chinese spend a couple of Trillion dollars, that we sent them, into the development of Nuclear Fusion. We are too stupid to do it, let alone even have a conversation about taking up the challenge. Then the Chinese will have to create a bunch of PhD's along with all the jobs that go with the creation of such PhD's. But hey, let's invade Iran, that will be fun.
4
This article discusses many of the actions around the world that China has done. President Obama is trying to pivot focus from the Middle East to the Far East. The Iran negotiations are part of that pivot. Opening up diplomacy with Cuba has been noted favorably from Middle America to south America. Now the President is visiting Africa where China has been active. President Obama and his administration are doing their part. I cannot say that Congress is done anything that shows they understand what our nation needs to do in the world.
8
I have to recall that part of the infamous Romney videotape where he bragged to rich donors about the benefits of cheap labor in China for American manufacturers, He was basically describing Chinese slave labor.He mentioned fenced housing facitlities and dormitories of workers. This is the bargain we made with the devil starting under Reagan. The Chinese helped sucker us into invading Iraq on credit given by them so that they became the main recipient of Iraqi oil. One has to wonder if they do not have similar objectives with lifting Iranian embargoes. Now US debt hangs out there as a top national security threat when the Saudis lose all patience with US- Iranian collaboration. What if the Suadis and Chinese cal all those T-bills due and payable on demand? What if foreign companies do not desire to do business in US dollars but rather the Chinese Yuan?
3
I wonder whether China will be tempted to deal with the Islamic State, assuming the latter is able to maintain a degree of stability in Iraq and Syria. And with the Taliban, once they have effective control over their country's $1T mineral trove. There's no telling where things will stand in 10 years time, but I won't be surprised if the Chinese continue to engage and influence solely through investment (and bribery) rather than military action.
The bribery strategy is used to enormous success by lobbyists to buy favorable laws in Congress. The Chinese look at the corruption of the theoretical "democratic principles" of America and simply follow our example. There is remarkably little difference between China and America, except their leaders have to prove their competence in governing in order to rise to power.
1
China's budget for foreign investment comes from its huge trade surplus. The fuel for this foreign policy is our purchases of Chinese goods. Given that China maintains a $300+ billion trade deficit with the US, they have plenty more fuel to continue their policies. If we want to do something about this, it starts with buying less Chinese stuff or selling China more of our stuff.
1
China copied decades old US Foreign policy strategy of Carrot and political conditions. They modified it to focus more on business and influencing development in contrast with the failed special interest political ideology that dominated US Foreign Policies. If anything the Chinese were more successful capitalists than the US on this. Also, both engage in the two biggest State Sponsored Spying and Hacking activities in the world which the public hears of only the Tip of The Iceberg stories. So who should call the kettle Black? You decide! Isn't it time we stop assuming we have a higher moral ground than everyone.? no one is buying it anymore. Time we deliver what we claim we stand for, not what we have been delivering.
3
The Chinese have the benefit of a long term approach and having everything backed through their central government. Compared to the US or any other western country it is not a fair fight.
We have seen "liberals" (I have other words to describe them) berate Western investors in Third World countries for trying to make a profit. Any photogenic group of protestors gets a sympathetic hearing. Correa of Ecuador has been especially good at blackening Western investors (Texaco come to mind).
One day one of these Third World dictators will treat China as they treat US and Canadian investors. When China reacts in Teddy Roosevelt fashion I will cheer. Capital has rights, too.
One day one of these Third World dictators will treat China as they treat US and Canadian investors. When China reacts in Teddy Roosevelt fashion I will cheer. Capital has rights, too.
Please provide an example (a true fact not hearsay) of Ecuador's President Mr. Correa of "blackening Western inverstors", by the way the Chevron Texaco trial is a problem within privates, the Government of Ecuador never sued the oil company rather private citizens from a province in the amazon basin back in 2003. Looking forward to your response.
1
Who do you think backed the "private citizens"? My understanding is that originally Texaco was exonerated by the courts of Ecuador, but that Government of Ecuador (now controlled by Correa) had the verdict overturned and then proceeded a second time to try Texaco. The second time the protestors won--in Ecuador. Ecuador then attempted to enforce the decision in the US, and in US courts--beyond Correa's reach--Texaco showed that the decision of the Ecuador court had been written by Ecuador's US attorneys and that the Ecuador judge simply did not understand the verdict he was supposed to have written. Collusion between the Ecuador courts and the US attorneys for the Government of Ecuador could--to my mind--only have happened with the involvement of the Government of Ecuador.
Ecuador and the rest of South America are probably thrilled. When the US goes into an area we overthrow the government, kill the citizens and then simply install our corporate owners onto the land and steal the natural resources. Gee, I think we already did that in South America.
Personally I think many of us here in Arizona would welcome us some China-love.
Personally I think many of us here in Arizona would welcome us some China-love.
8
I won't be around to see it, but China will dominate the world's economy and will be the Superpower of the latter half of the 21st century. This will occur unless the U.S. challenges China (and Russia and the rest of the world) and if so, then we can expect to see some kind of new World War. Empires eventually die slowly or else they commit suicide and decide to take others with them. Would that American officials abandon Obama's "Pivot toward Asia" and begin to cooperate with Chinese officials for the benefit of humanity. One would hope that ordinary citizens around the world would force these "officials" to abandon war as an instrument of foreign policy and finally recognize the propaganda and distortions and half-truths dispensed by media to entice us to see our "enemies" as the "other." Our planet is slowly dying and cooperation with other nations is imperative if we humans are to survive as a species. Such cooperation, dare I say it, would be based on democratic socialism, not the current dog-eat-dog capitalistic system. Only time will tell and we don't have much of that left.
4
America is the richest nation on Earth, surely the majority of our people can take a holiday in China to investigate the culture and learn about the peopl to decide if they are our enemy or our friend. Given the number of Chinese who would be thrilled to permanently move to the US if given the chance (I estimate 400 million) that tells you that the Chinese people like America quite a lot. This is why we need to stop illegal immigration from out Southern border, so that we can have more legal immigrants from Mexico, China, and elsewhere.
Imagine that our foreign aid to other nations was considered imperialism, while China's obvious efforts are based clearly in the profit motive and imperialistic ideals: land, labor and human capital. Sounds like they are overextended and will likely not be able to sustain all these projects simultaneously into the future. Economic and political forces will determine the fate of their new strategy of "throwing money around" to unstable corrupt governments. The superiority and global dominance China seeks will not go as smoothly as they are anticipating, because nations are not as willing to undergo the obvious communist transformation. Much like past dictators who attempted to infuse capital and change on needy nations, ultimately votes will not be cast to Xi Jinping's subversive communist campaign.
Unfortunately, installing corrupt dictators is an American specialty!
1
I don't think China wants to change any governments, they just want resources. China will not overthrow dictators, and dictators appreciate that. When a country refuses to pay China, it remains to be seen what China will do to retaliate. But they will certainly not use military action directly against a non-neighboring country.
I think you misunderstand Chinese culture. It is not like ours. Where we give aid while lecturing on why the country receiving aid should become more like us - capitalist with democracy, China has no such lecture. China believes Chinese-style communism works for them, but may not be possible anywhere else in the world. So, they have no interest what form of government a country has, or any interest in changing it, as long as they can pay their bills.
The U.S. better watch out. Our electoral and social dysfunction is shoving U.S. interests aside, and China is ready to fill the void. One commenter talked about a constituent assembly; perhaps that's needed.
3
As if we see this for the first time in human history.
In the past, it was done in a more ruthless way, in the name of physical (as opposed to abstract, economical) imperialism.
Some people ask (all of sudden) why "governments" and "politics" cannot do anything when the private sector is playing this frenzy monetary game.
Yes, of course, for centuries, governments had played even dirtier and bloodier games in the name of physical imperialism with the guise of nationalism or whatever.
Why do you think we went through the 1st and 2nd World Wars?
Do you think humans killed each other because they were all serial killers?
It was exactly for the same reason that China is now encraching economic boundaries of other nations.
And why do you think Americans are better off than Chinese and Africans?
Even in the early 1990s, Americans without college degree could get decent jobs. In China and many other countries? Are you kidding?
What alternative do you have? Instead of singing the old hackned song, what solution do you have?
Americans in a sense are dwellers in a wall. It is your turn, in a sense. Globalism was started by the U.S. and will hit the U.S.
In the past, it was done in a more ruthless way, in the name of physical (as opposed to abstract, economical) imperialism.
Some people ask (all of sudden) why "governments" and "politics" cannot do anything when the private sector is playing this frenzy monetary game.
Yes, of course, for centuries, governments had played even dirtier and bloodier games in the name of physical imperialism with the guise of nationalism or whatever.
Why do you think we went through the 1st and 2nd World Wars?
Do you think humans killed each other because they were all serial killers?
It was exactly for the same reason that China is now encraching economic boundaries of other nations.
And why do you think Americans are better off than Chinese and Africans?
Even in the early 1990s, Americans without college degree could get decent jobs. In China and many other countries? Are you kidding?
What alternative do you have? Instead of singing the old hackned song, what solution do you have?
Americans in a sense are dwellers in a wall. It is your turn, in a sense. Globalism was started by the U.S. and will hit the U.S.
1
Not much different than what the USA has done for many many years....and continues to do...
1
It is much different and on a much larger economic scale than anything we ever attempted. These project are being financed by a centralized government with a multi-trillion dollar surplus
7.5% money? If the money is spent wisely it is probably a great deal for everyone involved. But, the Greek debacle does cross my mind.
If China can monitor where and how the money is spent the comparisons to Spain, Italy, Portuguese economies will be manifest. Countries won't mind what I assume are tight controls.
Only time will tell, but China has quite an opportunity. The West, especially America, has treated Ecuador very poorly in the past. They really deserve no sympathy as China becomes a world player.
If China can monitor where and how the money is spent the comparisons to Spain, Italy, Portuguese economies will be manifest. Countries won't mind what I assume are tight controls.
Only time will tell, but China has quite an opportunity. The West, especially America, has treated Ecuador very poorly in the past. They really deserve no sympathy as China becomes a world player.
Totally different that Greece's problem. Greece debt is 175% of their GNP.
Ecuador's current total debt (public-private) stands at 30% of GNP, by Ecuadorian law (set by the Correa Government) the ceiling is 40% of GNP.
Correa took office in 1/2007; Debt Service: 2006, 24% of GNP. In 2015 is 8% of GNP.
Greece is borrowing to pay old debt, Ecuador is borrowing to built infrastructure.
Everything is possible but not likely Ecuador is going to default in the near future.
Ecuador's current total debt (public-private) stands at 30% of GNP, by Ecuadorian law (set by the Correa Government) the ceiling is 40% of GNP.
Correa took office in 1/2007; Debt Service: 2006, 24% of GNP. In 2015 is 8% of GNP.
Greece is borrowing to pay old debt, Ecuador is borrowing to built infrastructure.
Everything is possible but not likely Ecuador is going to default in the near future.
Our presence in Latin and Central America is related to the war on drugs and importing coffee and bananas. As a frequent visitor to Costa Rica an occasionally to Nicaragua I am puzzled that we have little interest or presence. Yet the Chinese are building a canal in Nicaragua, stadium, roads and river projects in Costa Rica in return for mineral and fishing rights. There is little environmental or safety concern. Sharks are being fished out of the Pacific, their fins removed and then tossed overboard. We have created a vacuum and countries have turned to China.
3
Nothing ever happens for the first time. Lenin posited that imperialism is the highest stage of capitalism, but perhaps it's the other way around. Perhaps the Ecuadorans got tired of the U.S. gardening effort and is trying to find a better deal. The gods know we've been acting as if all of Latin America is our backyard for the last 200 years or so. I find it telling that this whole article barely mentions other Chinese projects, such as her acquisition of the Greek port of Piraeus. But then again, perhaps I'm too European....
2
China will be the downfall for the global economy. We need more aggressive measures to save ourselves a recession much worse than what we saw in 2008.
4
If this article were written 60 years ago everywhere you see the name "China" you substituted that with "United States" and change the names of the countries getting the "aid" the story would also work. This is what nations with means have been doing for centuries. Time will tell whether the countries receiving the aid are giving up too much of themselves in return for these investments. It seems the more important question in the near term is will these countries maximize the economic value of these investments by reinvesting in their local economies in ways that enhance the public's well being.
2
Chinese imperialism will prove to be worse than western.
The air and water will be poisoned, much like at home in China.
Give it twenty years and the nations will nationalize the assets.
Surprise, the Chinese will have designed it for a 15 year life.
The air and water will be poisoned, much like at home in China.
Give it twenty years and the nations will nationalize the assets.
Surprise, the Chinese will have designed it for a 15 year life.
2
You know all that air and water pollution in China itself? 70% of it is a result of producing goods to export to the West. So, every time you buy a Chinese product that is cheaper than the US counterpart, the money you saved wasn't just from cheaper labor, it was the savings you received by not having to pay for pollution prevention. Every product you buy from China leads to more pollution in China and hurts the health of someone in China.
The Chinese aren't complaining, they are willing to give up a long and healthy life if it allows their kids to get ahead. They are grateful for the opportunity to rise out of poverty. And so on for the countries China will work with. Yes, those countries will suffer environmental damage, but they will be far more concerned about economic growth then then some far-off consequence of pollution that may ultimately destroy their way of life. You know, it's like Americans and climate change.
The Chinese aren't complaining, they are willing to give up a long and healthy life if it allows their kids to get ahead. They are grateful for the opportunity to rise out of poverty. And so on for the countries China will work with. Yes, those countries will suffer environmental damage, but they will be far more concerned about economic growth then then some far-off consequence of pollution that may ultimately destroy their way of life. You know, it's like Americans and climate change.
Same old, same old. How exactly do you think this is different from what we wreaked on the rest of the developing countries after Britain had opened the door.
The only difference I can see is that we're grumbling because we made ourselves the rich ugly Americans and now that the sheep's clothing is off we're not rich and it's the ugly that the last 3 or 4 administrations have spewn around the world.
The complaint from the brilliant Directors of NSA and NI that the Chinese hacking of the Personnel records could require us to bring home all of our overseas CIA spies may be the best news for decades. They are the very incompetents who have misinformed and misdirected America for decades. Our wars have been political and oil oriented. The failures of every one of these adventures has been due to the misunderstandings and misjudgements of our intelligence ignoramuses.
The fuse was lit long ago. It's just that the Bush clan and the ObamaHillary starlets forgot to throw the bomb so it has gone off in their hands. China will be picking up the pieces for a long time.
The only difference I can see is that we're grumbling because we made ourselves the rich ugly Americans and now that the sheep's clothing is off we're not rich and it's the ugly that the last 3 or 4 administrations have spewn around the world.
The complaint from the brilliant Directors of NSA and NI that the Chinese hacking of the Personnel records could require us to bring home all of our overseas CIA spies may be the best news for decades. They are the very incompetents who have misinformed and misdirected America for decades. Our wars have been political and oil oriented. The failures of every one of these adventures has been due to the misunderstandings and misjudgements of our intelligence ignoramuses.
The fuse was lit long ago. It's just that the Bush clan and the ObamaHillary starlets forgot to throw the bomb so it has gone off in their hands. China will be picking up the pieces for a long time.
3
Would this article have read as it did, had it been written by a journalist from a different country? Perhaps, a newspaper and country that doesnt subscribe to the line of the US govt, as does the NYT? There are few serious discussions, comments and quotes from those supporting the Chines efforts. I suspect that many South American nations are more than happy to fall into the arms of the Chinese govt after the bullwhipping they took from US imperialism in the form of coercion and violence.
8
Imagine the Chinese having ulterior motives!
What did the USA do to get access to Turkish air bases?
Kurds may well be better off with the Chinese, they build up their 'middle classes' rather than gradually starve or sell them to vast businees.
What did the USA do to get access to Turkish air bases?
Kurds may well be better off with the Chinese, they build up their 'middle classes' rather than gradually starve or sell them to vast businees.
3
The difference between China and most other so-called advanced economies is the Chinese government is not adverse to building and owning things.
Other countries including America, England and Australia have transferred billions of dollars of public revenue and profit to the private sector via the treachery of privatisation.
Where would global capitalism be without communist China?
Other countries including America, England and Australia have transferred billions of dollars of public revenue and profit to the private sector via the treachery of privatisation.
Where would global capitalism be without communist China?
4
While China has been sending a flood of investment money and engineers to the developing world, America is best know for its Neo-Cons sending a flood of bombs and soldiers, particularly in the vast Muslim world. What this means is that once the despotic client regimes the US has long propped up like the Saudi family are overthrown, vast areas of this part of the globe will be quite justifiably closed to significant American goods and services.
4
I noticed several years ago that the Chinese were buying the natural resources around the world, lithium in Bolivia, forests in Ecuador and Brazil and I'm guessing oil, water etc. wherever it's for sale. The Chinese look at the big picture, 100 years or so down the road....they will have it all and the rest of the world will have sold out the necessities of life. I'm glad someone is finally writing about this. Glad I won't be around when it all hits the fan.
3
China will destroy the natural environment of the Amazon basin throughout South America.
3
China is the world's rising super power exceeding the combined Russian and the US retracting presence
3
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss:
“The problem is we are trying to replace American imperialism with Chinese imperialism,” said Alberto Acosta, who served as President Correa’s energy minister during his first term. "
"China also has a shaky record when it comes to worker safety, environmental standards and corporate governance."
"Chinese mining and manufacturing operations, like many American and European companies in previous decades, have been accused of abusing workers overseas. China’s coal-fired power plants and industrial factories are adding to pollution problems in developing nations."
Why don't they just call their development bank IMF-China?
“The problem is we are trying to replace American imperialism with Chinese imperialism,” said Alberto Acosta, who served as President Correa’s energy minister during his first term. "
"China also has a shaky record when it comes to worker safety, environmental standards and corporate governance."
"Chinese mining and manufacturing operations, like many American and European companies in previous decades, have been accused of abusing workers overseas. China’s coal-fired power plants and industrial factories are adding to pollution problems in developing nations."
Why don't they just call their development bank IMF-China?
1
China, like any nation that invests in a nation's infrastructure will be accepted and well received. I don't give any thought that a taste for food and culture will develop, but a trust of the Chinese people and their government will find favor.
Certainly seems that our biggest investments are of a military nature which as proven through a study of military history will only engender fear, eventual disrespect and ultimate failure.
If we as a nation don't blow the world up in a fit of political pique the Chinese strategy will succeed and ours will fail. Our foreign policy is a reflection of a people who have found success through the adolescent if not infantile notion that the since the unbridled use of force as an arbiter to our social problems has worked to quell internal dissent we can as we have in the past solve all the world's problems with a closed fist.
We are mentally still at the stage of the Mongol hordes and the Chinese know better than to think military might makes right.
Certainly seems that our biggest investments are of a military nature which as proven through a study of military history will only engender fear, eventual disrespect and ultimate failure.
If we as a nation don't blow the world up in a fit of political pique the Chinese strategy will succeed and ours will fail. Our foreign policy is a reflection of a people who have found success through the adolescent if not infantile notion that the since the unbridled use of force as an arbiter to our social problems has worked to quell internal dissent we can as we have in the past solve all the world's problems with a closed fist.
We are mentally still at the stage of the Mongol hordes and the Chinese know better than to think military might makes right.
6
You make some salient points here, but don't be fooled by the Chinese. I once heard an axiom that suggests that one should not invite ants or the Chinese into your "house" as they are impossible to get rid of... And yes, I am aware that may seem racist - yet I can assure you from what I have witnessed, from the hordes of Chinese people invading my small town, they are as racist as any of the old Apartheid twits, that still wander around in our beautiful country.
Look at the shambolic Tibetan situation.
My hope is that America does not just walk away and abandon Africa to the Chinese and Russians!
The mistrust for the States is promoted by African "leader" that really don't want to be held responsible for atrocities committed by them. All having their schooling in the those really "successful" commie countries of the cold war days. Go figure!!!
Look at the shambolic Tibetan situation.
My hope is that America does not just walk away and abandon Africa to the Chinese and Russians!
The mistrust for the States is promoted by African "leader" that really don't want to be held responsible for atrocities committed by them. All having their schooling in the those really "successful" commie countries of the cold war days. Go figure!!!
2
I have little doubt you are right about the clannishness of the Chinese or for that matter any of us, but all my thoughts focus on the outlook of men who suppress women in every culture. I don't think women of any ethnic group have the same inherent insecurities of their male counterparts and when I think of Asian, European and African people I must consider, however fruitless, the potential impact the women of these cultures could have on the obdurate ways of their men.
I won't live to see it, but as long as women exist there is hope they may actually take control and run this show in a reasonable fashion and your continent along with the rest of our beautiful world will survive.
The Chinese mind is rooted in an ancient and learned culture which I trust will overcome our brash approach using military force as the arbiter of human problems. Hope springs eternal however short that concept is for each of us.
I won't live to see it, but as long as women exist there is hope they may actually take control and run this show in a reasonable fashion and your continent along with the rest of our beautiful world will survive.
The Chinese mind is rooted in an ancient and learned culture which I trust will overcome our brash approach using military force as the arbiter of human problems. Hope springs eternal however short that concept is for each of us.
I think the article's critique of China's foreign economic policy should be dovetailed by a critique, or at least a comparison, of the Western/IMF neoliberal model. Neoliberalism has served to increase dependency of the Global South upon the Global North (specifically Western powers), strengthen multinational corporations whose globalized actions are becoming harder and harder for the nation-state to control, and sacrifice social development policy (infrastructure, healthcare, education) at the cost of moving the economy out of the public sector...I'd say this is more 'neocolonial' than what China is doing. The Chinese may not care about working conditions/environment/etc., but Ecuadorians do. The Chinese are not tampering with the political alarm bells that Ecuadorians can pull to raise their social concerns, nor the social safety nets to catch them if they fall.
9
The foreign policy of the US is in a shambles, if it exists at all. In the meantime, the US is losing its power, prestige, and influence to China and the pace of the loss is increasing daily. Once we reach a tipping point, the US will likely find that China starts introducing military force as an important element of its foreign policy further pushing the US into the background.
4
What China is doing is good for us in the U.S. The last time we had freedom in the U.S. was the fear of the Soviet Union. With the collapse of the Soviet Union, our peace dividend became working 2 jobs and a police state. We should welcome competition.
5
China actually is doing a good thing to awaken us as to what is more important to a country's future. That, unfortunately, we forgot some time ago. May be our politicians have the wisdom to relearn what we forgot, or just our citizens dumb enough repeatedly electing selfish politicians again and again under the name of democracy. NY Times should bear the responsibility and have the wisdom not just for dolling out propaganda but teach our citizens what is important and what is not. Current story is a good example of the former.
3
Many developing countries, in exchange for loans, pay steep interest rates and give up the rights to their natural resources for years -- Wow typical western hypocrisy...
2
This article on China's investment in almost any South American or African country could and should have been written many times over the past 15 years. China doesn't have the GOP's budget hysteria. We cannot even spend money on highways, trains, and bridges. Of course the Chinese are going after ownership in natural resources but their program is much bigger than that and very long term--the kind of long term our multi-national corporations and certainly our gov't can't do because of the myth of "gov't takeover" under a black president.
Chinese companies even took over the big Greek port of Piraeus a few years ago. They make money and do good for the poor countries. Call it Colonialism, if you want, but it's much more sound economic policy than the adolescent, short-sighted silliness that the US calls foreign OR economic policy. You can't fault Americans for being asleep and ignorant when our best newspapers are asleep to what's been going on in the world. NYT & Wash Post can't afford serious foreign reporters? That's the free market and the digital entertainment age, guys, nothing to be done about it. So one of your stringers went to Ecuador? Congratulations!
Chinese companies even took over the big Greek port of Piraeus a few years ago. They make money and do good for the poor countries. Call it Colonialism, if you want, but it's much more sound economic policy than the adolescent, short-sighted silliness that the US calls foreign OR economic policy. You can't fault Americans for being asleep and ignorant when our best newspapers are asleep to what's been going on in the world. NYT & Wash Post can't afford serious foreign reporters? That's the free market and the digital entertainment age, guys, nothing to be done about it. So one of your stringers went to Ecuador? Congratulations!
8
The issue faced by China is that the nuanced conversations that happen behind closed doors and in 100+ page academic publications is immediately lost on the ground. A few thoughts on Chinese investments:
1) Their investments are actual stimulus packages for their own country as well. Chinese factories manufacture the materials and machines, and Chinese workers move to project sites to execute. They do not generally integrate themselves into the local economy and culture. Host country business people and workers start to realize this and start to resent the Chinese presence.
2) China feels unable to comment on the internal politics or policies of an external nation least it open the doors to criticism of its self. Unfortunately the US tried to do this for decades and now is feeling the backlash of hypocrisy. China is thus often seen by locals and internationals as "endorsing" the policies when private they may actually disagree and want them to change.
3) They are looking at the long game when it comes to resources and influence. The West particularly the US has sometimes given the impression (true or false) that there is world wide race to capture resources and influence for its citizens. China feels it cannot afford to be left behind.
4) Western embassies regularly help and promote their business and economic interests in country. Since most of these investments come from state owned companies in China - the line between diplomacy and business get badly blurred.
1) Their investments are actual stimulus packages for their own country as well. Chinese factories manufacture the materials and machines, and Chinese workers move to project sites to execute. They do not generally integrate themselves into the local economy and culture. Host country business people and workers start to realize this and start to resent the Chinese presence.
2) China feels unable to comment on the internal politics or policies of an external nation least it open the doors to criticism of its self. Unfortunately the US tried to do this for decades and now is feeling the backlash of hypocrisy. China is thus often seen by locals and internationals as "endorsing" the policies when private they may actually disagree and want them to change.
3) They are looking at the long game when it comes to resources and influence. The West particularly the US has sometimes given the impression (true or false) that there is world wide race to capture resources and influence for its citizens. China feels it cannot afford to be left behind.
4) Western embassies regularly help and promote their business and economic interests in country. Since most of these investments come from state owned companies in China - the line between diplomacy and business get badly blurred.
3
Spot on.
And one wonders why the price crash in oil and commodities? China is securing most of this through trade agreements, a sophisticated form of bartering, in which constructions projects are a quid pro quo--oil, commodities in exchange for construction, engineering,, equipment and materials for construction from the Chinese. China gets its commodities by entering into agreements for trade because of their prowess in so many countries like Ecuador as a captive market. But we can sell them some hamburger franchises.
2
And man can these special bartering agreements come and bite one in the rear.
Many years ago SA had surplus of cheap electricity (for a mired of reasons), and the Apartheid regime set up special price for the mining house BH Billington to set up aluminium smelters in SA and the fools then entered into a never ending contract to supply this company with cheap electricity for eternity it would seem. Now we have a shortage of electricity (because the new regime - ANC) forgot to build power stations and spent money on arms and other non-essentials. And we still have to honor the contract to Billington while we have blackouts for up to 6 hours a day.
I must add we don't even mine the bauxite required to manufacture aluminium.
Clever "Trevor's" - huh?
Of course, the reason they did this is because some peoples hands were greased - to be sure!!!
Many years ago SA had surplus of cheap electricity (for a mired of reasons), and the Apartheid regime set up special price for the mining house BH Billington to set up aluminium smelters in SA and the fools then entered into a never ending contract to supply this company with cheap electricity for eternity it would seem. Now we have a shortage of electricity (because the new regime - ANC) forgot to build power stations and spent money on arms and other non-essentials. And we still have to honor the contract to Billington while we have blackouts for up to 6 hours a day.
I must add we don't even mine the bauxite required to manufacture aluminium.
Clever "Trevor's" - huh?
Of course, the reason they did this is because some peoples hands were greased - to be sure!!!
As an underwriter for all these third-world projects, the Chinese are receiving a "F" grade from a financial prospective. The one of the key reasons why Wall Street money has rarely gone to these projects is due to the enormous financial risk these projects pose. In most situation, each of these projects is more tailored to the financial needs of the dictator and his lackeys. The projected returns are always too optimistic. At the end, the only benefactors for this type of projects are usually a small minority in power. Expect all other participants to be in tears at the end.
4
We see these impacts in Ecuador on our annual Learning Tours there. Yes, it's true that China is only doing what other colonial powers have done and are doing--that still doesn't make it right or keep it from being frightening. We pass by that large dam every year and have been to the great falls it will drain when completed. We've seen Andes Petroleum "mistakenly" bulldoze land that our nonprofit--in cooperation with a local NGO and native groups--purchased to preserve. Their aim was to dig yet another toxic waste pit--one of hundreds that surround the remaining protected areas of the rainforest. Of course we have a role in this--here in the US, we import 200,000 barrels of Ecuadorian crude every day. So our hands aren't clean. Our group (New Community Project) works to raise awareness of this violence against nature and native communities, and while calling for changes in our own consumption patterns, our nation's unwillingness to confront its addition to fossil fuels, and in an international economic system that tolerates this kind of behavior.
6
If you think American Imperialism is bad; just wait until you get a dose of the Chinese variety. Ecuador has cast its lot with a foreign government that could care less about workers much less the environment. Eventually, they will own Ecuador…lock, stock and barrel. When that happens, Ecuador will default and the race will be on to see who picks up the pieces. By that time, Correa will be living a life of luxury in Miami!!!
7
See my post as a concerned South African.
I don't think the U.S. will be granting any visas for Correa and/or his family for an extended U.S. stay. LOL
Ecuador's current total debt (public-private) stands at 30% of GNP, by Ecuadorian law (set by the Correa Government) the ceiling is 40% of GNP.
Correa took office in 1/2007; Debt Service: 2006, 24% of GNP. In 2015 is 8% of GNP. Do you honestly think Ecuador is going to default?
By the way if Correa has to "hide" my bet is that he will never do so in Miami, FL rather in Belgium, the wife is from there and most likely Correa has dual citizenship by now.
Correa took office in 1/2007; Debt Service: 2006, 24% of GNP. In 2015 is 8% of GNP. Do you honestly think Ecuador is going to default?
By the way if Correa has to "hide" my bet is that he will never do so in Miami, FL rather in Belgium, the wife is from there and most likely Correa has dual citizenship by now.
Unfortunately Ecuador had no refuge left but to turn from the financial and political oppression of the USA and the IMF to the ruthless ambitions of China — a Faustian bargain that may probe worse at the end.
The US must do its own housecleaning and set its own house in order, not simply continue to deploy the Trojan horse of 'democracy' as a pretext that allows its multinational corporation to plunder the resources of other countries.
The hungry beast of China is in the meantime happy to spread its voracious appetite for resources all over the world, cynically and openly. Happy to grease the pig in Ecuador and turn it into the 'Greece' of Latin America.
The US must do its own housecleaning and set its own house in order, not simply continue to deploy the Trojan horse of 'democracy' as a pretext that allows its multinational corporation to plunder the resources of other countries.
The hungry beast of China is in the meantime happy to spread its voracious appetite for resources all over the world, cynically and openly. Happy to grease the pig in Ecuador and turn it into the 'Greece' of Latin America.
11
I see you're posting from Arizona. China needs long-term partners for upwards of 150+ years, if they mess things up in Ecuador or Greece it will harm them in the long run. They understand this.
The US doesn't seem to care, on the other hand, that its deliberate destruction of Iraq and Syria has earned it disapproval the world over.
The US doesn't seem to care, on the other hand, that its deliberate destruction of Iraq and Syria has earned it disapproval the world over.
7
Not a good comparison, Greece debt stands at 175% of their GDP and Ecuador's is 30% of their GDP and by Ecuadorian law the ceiling is 40% of GDP.
Greece keeps borrowing to pay debt, Ecuador borrows to build infrastructure such as roads, hydroelectric dams, hospitals, schools. Big difference.........
Greece keeps borrowing to pay debt, Ecuador borrows to build infrastructure such as roads, hydroelectric dams, hospitals, schools. Big difference.........
4
To KC:
Actually an architect, native of Ecuador. Migrated voluntarily to the US 40 years ago, a US citizen for half my life — return for short visits periodically. Intimately familiar and actively critical of political culture, or lack of, here and there.
To S.O:
Valid distinctions. I used hyperbole to express fear of the ruthless colonizing tendencies of China. As for the laws, they are promulgated and broken periodically, particularly true of Ecuador. Correa has done much good, but now seems inebriated with power — beware, "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely."
Actually an architect, native of Ecuador. Migrated voluntarily to the US 40 years ago, a US citizen for half my life — return for short visits periodically. Intimately familiar and actively critical of political culture, or lack of, here and there.
To S.O:
Valid distinctions. I used hyperbole to express fear of the ruthless colonizing tendencies of China. As for the laws, they are promulgated and broken periodically, particularly true of Ecuador. Correa has done much good, but now seems inebriated with power — beware, "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely."
7
The Chines buy influence with money the US used to extend influence through wars and coupes of states
4
China is doing only what any nation would be expected to do, investing its wealth in productive ventures, and seeking the raw materials it needs. Other countries go to it because going to it pays off. China has the money and will use it.
Other countries are affected exactly as they were when it was British money before WW1, and US money after WW2. It depends on the country what it makes of its opportunities. China is certainly no more abusive in terms than were Britain or the US. Since the US was reacting to Cold War pressures, it is probably easier to deal with than was the US.
The angst here is an internal issue for the US. The US leadership has been self indulgent. Our leaders have acted as if we are so powerful it does not matter how irresponsible they act. They can get away with it. They act as if they can serve domestic politics without regard to outside concerns, in safety, because we are just too powerful for it to matter.
That was true. Now it isn't. China is the largest case of it isn't true anymore. The EU is another. In some places even Russia has the money and interest to challenge.
Our leaders have not shaped up. They just complain. That is how "Chinese firms will change the culture and economy of the countries they are investing in." They give alternatives to the self indulgent US behavior.
Other countries are affected exactly as they were when it was British money before WW1, and US money after WW2. It depends on the country what it makes of its opportunities. China is certainly no more abusive in terms than were Britain or the US. Since the US was reacting to Cold War pressures, it is probably easier to deal with than was the US.
The angst here is an internal issue for the US. The US leadership has been self indulgent. Our leaders have acted as if we are so powerful it does not matter how irresponsible they act. They can get away with it. They act as if they can serve domestic politics without regard to outside concerns, in safety, because we are just too powerful for it to matter.
That was true. Now it isn't. China is the largest case of it isn't true anymore. The EU is another. In some places even Russia has the money and interest to challenge.
Our leaders have not shaped up. They just complain. That is how "Chinese firms will change the culture and economy of the countries they are investing in." They give alternatives to the self indulgent US behavior.
22
The Chinese will open up their economies because they are building basics, like roads, bridges, water systems. Culturally, the Chinese demand nothing and share little. They are workers there, little else.
It's a shame that the US has relinquished its role as a global player. In their horror at our recent wars, Americans elected a president with little global know-how and a mandate to shut off our expansion and pull us back.
Sure, President Obama likes being a global player insofar as it involves his own ambitions, but his strategic deals, including TPP and Iran, have little credibility among his own citizens.
It's a shame that the US has relinquished its role as a global player. In their horror at our recent wars, Americans elected a president with little global know-how and a mandate to shut off our expansion and pull us back.
Sure, President Obama likes being a global player insofar as it involves his own ambitions, but his strategic deals, including TPP and Iran, have little credibility among his own citizens.
8
I guess you did not hear about of the pivot to Asia. While the past administrations focused most of our efforts in the Middle East, the Obama administration had the strategic vision to pivot to Asia. I for one as nan American citizen who is concerned about our positioned am glad I voted President Obama twice.
Chinese and their firms mainly deal with the politicians; and they don't really deal with the people. This is what they offer that the US did not so much. They let the politicians, no matter how corrupt, do what they do, politics. The perception of "The US changing the culture" was mostly the result of groups getting in between those in power and the people; banks asking for reform, NGOS: human rights groups and environmentalist. The local politicians convinced the people, through media etc, that the US was effecting and changing their culture, easy thing to do turn against a foreign place. So now you have Chinese companies that are very involved in politics,economics and decision making; the locals, in this case Ecuadorians are getting a much worse deal, but the politicians have a tighter grip on power.
2
For the last half millennium or so when the Corporate Capitalist West held sway across the globe, de-industrialization and depopulation followed guns - in India, Africa, China, Latin America.
Any subsequent “investment” that went to the local 1percenters swiftly flowed back to the banks it flowed out of, leaving the target societies further impoverished and divided in our image. We forced others to buy our worthless military hardware at inflated prices, generating further hostility of the masses abroad: Al-Quaeda, ISIL/IS et al.
A hundred years ago not a square inch of the globe breathed without our writ. Today, a full 9/10 of the globe is out of bounds for a Westerner where he is neither safe nor welcome.
Now, for a change, by the sweat of its brow, a Civilization is raising itself and the rest of the world out of poverty created by the West. Investment is following trade as it should. All success to the East Asia, and let us hope they have learned a lesson from our debacle and will not squander the goodwill and eschew our arrogance by not following trade with guns.
Any subsequent “investment” that went to the local 1percenters swiftly flowed back to the banks it flowed out of, leaving the target societies further impoverished and divided in our image. We forced others to buy our worthless military hardware at inflated prices, generating further hostility of the masses abroad: Al-Quaeda, ISIL/IS et al.
A hundred years ago not a square inch of the globe breathed without our writ. Today, a full 9/10 of the globe is out of bounds for a Westerner where he is neither safe nor welcome.
Now, for a change, by the sweat of its brow, a Civilization is raising itself and the rest of the world out of poverty created by the West. Investment is following trade as it should. All success to the East Asia, and let us hope they have learned a lesson from our debacle and will not squander the goodwill and eschew our arrogance by not following trade with guns.
4
The U.S. will not invest in her own infrastructure, let alone assist other countries in developing their's. BRICS and the Eurasian Development Bank will soon walk away from us economically while we threaten Russia, China , Iran and others militarily. This is how empires come to an end. It looks like the American century will last 70 years at the most.
8
Wasn't this whole China thing Nixon's idea? I am not trying to be partisan but.... If you think about it, Nixon opened China, Reagan enacted the tax policy that encouraged the offshoring of jobs to China, Clinton was too dumb to realize what was going on and continued to support it and so on and so on. US (and others') corporations built the Chinese economy; for decades we funneled billions to China instead of investing in US schools, roads, and people. Our China policy was the biggest political failure in American history and we have no one to blame but ourselves.
7
easy to blame everyone but your own self...let the americans look at their own backyard to see what is wrong..with your educational policies..with your social stabiilty(eg ferguson shooting,with your income gap etc etc and you will realise soon that it is better there be a competitor
I think the sense of foreboding that many in the US thinks about China is often misplaced and poorly analyzed.
First, infrastructure projects do not necessarily mean that the West will not benefit from it. These developing countries, which previously had little or difficult access to capital, now get the opportunity to develop their economies. As they become more developed there will be greater stake in maintaining stability and order in their own countries, which the US and other countries will benefit.
Second, although influence may be gained from partnerships China makes with many developing countries, and ties developed, occasionally at the expense of the US, it does not mean that these countries will completely lose their autonomy. They are still governed by their own leaders and have a great deal to say about how their countries ought to be. As they grow and develop they will have more clout if they use the benefits of these projects wisely.
Third, relations between countries is not a trade-off such that one country's gain is at the expense of another, especially as regards trade and the economy.
The fact of the matter is that such development projects are often meant to deal with domestic resource constraints, and to secure them, now that China is striving to aim for a 'middle-class' life, and so as for the communist party to maintain its legitimacy.
First, infrastructure projects do not necessarily mean that the West will not benefit from it. These developing countries, which previously had little or difficult access to capital, now get the opportunity to develop their economies. As they become more developed there will be greater stake in maintaining stability and order in their own countries, which the US and other countries will benefit.
Second, although influence may be gained from partnerships China makes with many developing countries, and ties developed, occasionally at the expense of the US, it does not mean that these countries will completely lose their autonomy. They are still governed by their own leaders and have a great deal to say about how their countries ought to be. As they grow and develop they will have more clout if they use the benefits of these projects wisely.
Third, relations between countries is not a trade-off such that one country's gain is at the expense of another, especially as regards trade and the economy.
The fact of the matter is that such development projects are often meant to deal with domestic resource constraints, and to secure them, now that China is striving to aim for a 'middle-class' life, and so as for the communist party to maintain its legitimacy.
2
Traveling through Bolivia and Ecuador I saw entire hillsides deforested for Chinese companies, pollution from Chinese-controlled mines.
These countries appear to be making deals that are bad for their citizen, their environment and their long-term future.
These countries appear to be making deals that are bad for their citizen, their environment and their long-term future.
3
Overall, I think the Chinese are not behaving any differently than the US used to do, providing loans to developing countries tied to the use of the creditor's companies and machinery. The need for infrastructure across Africa, Asia and Latin America is enormous, and the Chinese provide what these countries need. There is a point to be made that the US main tool in foreign policy seems to be the military; establishing bases, military cooperation, arms sales, and direct military engagements. China on the other hand seems to to use their checkbook and diplomacy to expand its influence. Not only does this help Chinese businesses, but it also provides tangible benefits to the populace in the receiving countries, - power, roads, ports -, rather than drones, military advisers and arms. The Chinese formula for expanding access and influence was one the US used itself in the postwar years, with great success it seemed, while now our foreign policy basically seems militarized and countries turn to China for economic assistance. Part of the reason is that China has the funds and we have the debt, - and most people know the difference between a creditor and a debtor -, another reason is the lamentable shortsightedness that looks for quick military solutions with mostly disastrous results, while shunning the much longer and more painstaking work of diplomacy to win friends and influence.
8
Well havent they already changed the culture and economy by bribing our elected officials into selling our cities to them, thereby creating a housing shortage and surging prices? Thats how. I dont mind a country acting in its self interest. I do mind my country acting in the interest of none of its citizens beyond that of a few wealthy oligarchs.
2
The most recent foreign investment in Ecuador is a $30 million commitment to the country’s expanding aquaculture sector announced by the U.S. multinational Cargill earlier this week. As an American who is visiting Ecuador at the moment, I can confirm that the U.S. influence stills reigns supreme on the streets of the largest city Guayaquil. The official national currency? The U.S. dollar! Most popular car brand? Chevy! Most popular cable TV channels? 100% Fox! Most popular smart phone? iPhone 6! Most popular overseas flight destinations? Miami and New York! Most fashionable brand of jeans? Levi’s! Most popular clothing shops in the malls? The Gap and Polo! There are almost as many American fast-food chains present here as in SoCal !
China is exerting a huge influence at the level of the national economy, however the clout of the American private sector is still strong.
Even his opponents admit that President Correa has done a great job of organizing and cleaning up the country’s public sector, improving national infrastructure, and in polishing Ecuador’s international image. And, among the leaders of the OPEC countries that have suffered most from the drop in the oil price most, Correa is credited with being the most savvy and alert in successfully controlling the impact on his nation’s economy.
Things could be a lot worse than they actually are in this generally very happy, proud and beautiful country !
China is exerting a huge influence at the level of the national economy, however the clout of the American private sector is still strong.
Even his opponents admit that President Correa has done a great job of organizing and cleaning up the country’s public sector, improving national infrastructure, and in polishing Ecuador’s international image. And, among the leaders of the OPEC countries that have suffered most from the drop in the oil price most, Correa is credited with being the most savvy and alert in successfully controlling the impact on his nation’s economy.
Things could be a lot worse than they actually are in this generally very happy, proud and beautiful country !
2
Many commenters critical of China need to ask these questions. Did the West, including the US, have an enlightened and successful records in bank lending and development assistance to the poor countries? Has the West in the last couple of decades been willing to lend and fund infrastructure projects in poor countries? The answers are obviously no. The US, Western countries and the World Bank have clinged to a long list of unrealistic criterias and political conditions so as not to provide enough loans to meet the huge and growing demand of infrastructure and economic development needs of poor countries. The West has had more than 50 years after WW II as a monopoly in development lending. The records speak for itself. It's time for the West to step aside for China to do what the West has failed. Of course, China is no angel as the West was no angel when it comes to development lending. China has tied its development lending to its strategic needs of resources and global ambition. China is lax in environmental and labor protections. But until the West matches the scale of Chinese development lending, it should not and cannot criticize China for filling the void.
11
Investment in China's rise, American style? Sounds like it was a good plan, drawn up before science told us that we were killing the planet, but China doesn't appear to have gotten the message. So, will someone please tell the Emperor that ha has no clothes on.
3
We need to remember that its easy for a centralised state like China to throw it's weight around. But that state is not answerable to the people, and those people are not the ones with the wealth. The big difference is both the US and Europe have trillions and trillions of private wealth tied up in various global financial assets. China is so far behind in this regard it's not even in the same ball park. We're seeing the actions of an insecure developing country.
4
China's rapid global rise is not a new phenomena; rather, it closely resembles the growth cycles of many other post-industrialized powers, including America. Consider the United States' position post bellum - an incredible array of natural resources, complete hemispheric dominance, unexploited domestic and foreign markets ripe for innovation and growth. Over the next 80 years, American companies and firms provided the exact type of investments that China is making today, elevating American firms and the dollar to unprecedented power in the global market. What changed? Well, for one, growing pains. During an initial growth cycle, it is easy for citizens and states to put aside domestic needs in the name of national prosperity. However, once citizens have reached a certain baseline of prosperity, once tangential concerns become necessities. In the US, the mid-1900s emerging middle class demanded safer products, cleaner ecosystems, civil rights along with economic prosperity and success. As America moved from ambitious global upstart to established hegemony, its concerns necessarily turned inward. The same was true for the USSR and ultimately led to its collapse. Secondly, costly foreign policy mistakes reduced the US' ability to maintain the one-sided economic relationships it had created in the developing world. It shouldn't surprise anyone China is making the moves they are making today; the real question is whether it can avoid the US' errors moving forward and, if so, how.
4
Lowering our standards to China's is a dangerous game and we can hope that eventually recipient countries of their aid will seek their old alternatives. This will be hard because China's lower standards are closer to world standards, and what Europe and North America try to impose can seem unrealistically utopian. However, their are ways more civilized nations that respect human dignity can better compete. First, we must make far more foreign development loans available since China is often the only option. Next, we must lower our standards where is does not corrupt our most important values. For example, the Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank controlled by China does not have real restrictions against forcing loan recipients to use Chinese suppliers. If more developed nations dropped this restriction there would be more internal political support to make funds available since it would more directly mean also helping our own economies. This move would risk corruption, which is why the rules are in place, but that is far batter than the damage and deaths that China is causing with its lax standards. Those trying to shut down the USA's Export-Import Bank may also cause more damage and death than they realize.
3
China is doing that Europe and the US did.
6
I will be doubly careful of Chinese investments, at least after looking what has happened in to Sri Lanka with its spate of Chinese deals. The new government is struggling to cope with the Chinese-financed and built projects it has inherited from the earlier Rajapaksa administration.
Colombo Port City with an investment of $1.35 bn coming from the China Communications Construction Company halted since the new government came to power earlier this year — is spread over 575 acres, part of which is to be reclaimed from the sea off Colombo’s shore making it a popular destination for tourists. Chinese took short cuts, ignoring important environmental requirements, cancelling will mean loss millions.
Many Sri Lankan projects by the Chinese are now lying virtually abandoned. Hambontota Port is a case study. A huge boulder was discovered that made navigation impossible. This obstruction was dynamited over months. It took a government directive to force car-carrying ships to dock there after transporting 250 KM to Colombo by road!
Other Chinese project an international airport and a cricket stadium. Both are unused. The Southern Expressway connecting Colombo to Galle, financed by the ADB cost $7 million per KM. By contrast, the Outer Circular Highway connecting the airport to the Galle Expressway, financed by a Chinese loan and awarded without competition to a Chinese firm, is going to cost $72m per KM!
Colombo Port City with an investment of $1.35 bn coming from the China Communications Construction Company halted since the new government came to power earlier this year — is spread over 575 acres, part of which is to be reclaimed from the sea off Colombo’s shore making it a popular destination for tourists. Chinese took short cuts, ignoring important environmental requirements, cancelling will mean loss millions.
Many Sri Lankan projects by the Chinese are now lying virtually abandoned. Hambontota Port is a case study. A huge boulder was discovered that made navigation impossible. This obstruction was dynamited over months. It took a government directive to force car-carrying ships to dock there after transporting 250 KM to Colombo by road!
Other Chinese project an international airport and a cricket stadium. Both are unused. The Southern Expressway connecting Colombo to Galle, financed by the ADB cost $7 million per KM. By contrast, the Outer Circular Highway connecting the airport to the Galle Expressway, financed by a Chinese loan and awarded without competition to a Chinese firm, is going to cost $72m per KM!
7
Lots of very thoughtful comments...
What I would like to add are some aspects of the Chinese strategy that we will do well to emulate. An important aspect is the long term outlook of the Chinese. Unlike the enterprises in the US which live and die by the quarterly status, the Chinese government can afford to wait out the long term and present an image of stability that the US companies cannot. Thus, if Ecuador cannot pay now, the Chinese government will be happy to have a lock on Ecuador's natural resources for as long as it takes, and keep the investments flowing. This is actually more profitable in the long term as the value of most natural resources only increases with passing time.
Another important aspect is the non-involvement in local politics and ideological issues. The only driving force is business, and the needs of the Chinese state. The cooperation on various projects between China and Pakistan should serve as an example. In my view, no two countries could be more ideologically opposed, yet they manage to work together for mutual gain. Eventually, the US should also adopt such an approach, where there are no costly and destructive wars and unsuccessful country (re)building.
What I would like to add are some aspects of the Chinese strategy that we will do well to emulate. An important aspect is the long term outlook of the Chinese. Unlike the enterprises in the US which live and die by the quarterly status, the Chinese government can afford to wait out the long term and present an image of stability that the US companies cannot. Thus, if Ecuador cannot pay now, the Chinese government will be happy to have a lock on Ecuador's natural resources for as long as it takes, and keep the investments flowing. This is actually more profitable in the long term as the value of most natural resources only increases with passing time.
Another important aspect is the non-involvement in local politics and ideological issues. The only driving force is business, and the needs of the Chinese state. The cooperation on various projects between China and Pakistan should serve as an example. In my view, no two countries could be more ideologically opposed, yet they manage to work together for mutual gain. Eventually, the US should also adopt such an approach, where there are no costly and destructive wars and unsuccessful country (re)building.
7
As Henry Kissinger said about 10-12 years ago, we should keep an eye on China. As of being risky investing in Ecuador, I think the Chinese are shrewd enough to take calculated risks.
2
I am not sure why, but many in developing nations do not seem to understand that as bad as many of their historical experiences with liberal and American and European nations have been, it is simply illogical, suicidal to believe that nations like China that deny even their own citizens fundamental human rights, abuse and imprison their own people by the millions, will treat them with respect or hesitate to destroy their societies for profit or power. At least at this point in history liberal democracies have many citizens descended from immigrants from 3rd world countries, admit past wrong doing, have groups that are on the look out for further abuses. Not so in China! Even ethnic Han in China who advocate for simple human rights for racially/culturally pure Chinese people are murdered & thrown into black site jails! What for instance do readers think China would do with its new big military, expanding fleet and its 1.4 billion people it can draft into an immense army ... if Ecuador said "Screw you! We're not going to repay our loan, just like we did with the Gringos"? China would steamroller over Ecuador just like it did Tibet, take over all the good land and businesses, & shove Ecuadorians into a Tibetan like slave underclass. Except for the perhaps the corrupt descendants of Cortez. The murderous elites responsible for how dysfunctional Ecuador is, who have brought the Chinese in, & would predictably commit treason against their own people and help the Chinese overlords.
6
one's eyes ' :
'suicidal to believe that nations like China that deny even their own citizens fundamental human rights, abuse and imprison their own people by the millions'
I'm not going to contest the first half of this debatable remark (with respect to the US) but the second half is simply factually incorrect. The US incarcerates more people per capita, and absolutely, than any other nation on earth.
'throwing stones at glass houses', 'dust/timber in
'suicidal to believe that nations like China that deny even their own citizens fundamental human rights, abuse and imprison their own people by the millions'
I'm not going to contest the first half of this debatable remark (with respect to the US) but the second half is simply factually incorrect. The US incarcerates more people per capita, and absolutely, than any other nation on earth.
'throwing stones at glass houses', 'dust/timber in
2
Winthrop, you don't think this is going on in the USA too? We incarcerate more of our citizens than any other country in the world. It's a human rights abuse that growing numbers of our own citizens lack basics like food, housing, and health care. We too have a slave underclass, working for slave wages at unfulfilling jobs that keep people poor and ignorant. Sadly, our corporations and politicians have not hesitated to destroy our society for power and profit. We have steamrolled so many developing countries worldwide with little regard for the consequences. This article is a huge wake-up call, but when we point a finger at China, (as simplistic as it may sound) we have 4 fingers pointing back at us.
DSS:
I think you are painting a distorted picture. It is true the Chinese always bring their own workers, because (1) they are well trained having learned the ropes in the last decades at home, and (2) there is language problem with local work force which could unnecessarily prolong the project time frame and hamper the quality of work. With their own workers , equipment and gears, they are spared of the adjustment period.
While it is true that there is no stimulating the local economy while the work is in progress, once it is completed, the economic return would undoubtedly
be evident, the success of this model has been repeatedly demonstrated in Africa.
To your summary: "Chinese firms have little impact on the culture or economy of the countries they are investing in", my observations are that (1)
the Chinese in general do not intend to assert impact on a foreign country's culture, and (2) you are short changing the intelligence of leaders of these countries if they would enter a deal from which there would be no economic benefit to their own countries.
I think you are painting a distorted picture. It is true the Chinese always bring their own workers, because (1) they are well trained having learned the ropes in the last decades at home, and (2) there is language problem with local work force which could unnecessarily prolong the project time frame and hamper the quality of work. With their own workers , equipment and gears, they are spared of the adjustment period.
While it is true that there is no stimulating the local economy while the work is in progress, once it is completed, the economic return would undoubtedly
be evident, the success of this model has been repeatedly demonstrated in Africa.
To your summary: "Chinese firms have little impact on the culture or economy of the countries they are investing in", my observations are that (1)
the Chinese in general do not intend to assert impact on a foreign country's culture, and (2) you are short changing the intelligence of leaders of these countries if they would enter a deal from which there would be no economic benefit to their own countries.
9
"(2) you are short changing the intelligence of leaders of these countries if they would enter a deal from which there would be no economic benefit to their own countries."
This is the oldest fallacy in the book. How many examples in history are there of leaders cutting deals that benefit themselves more than the people they purport to represent, or who cut deals that are attractive in the short term but disastrous in the future, after such wise leaders have disappeared into a luxurious retirement. This is familiar territory.
This is the oldest fallacy in the book. How many examples in history are there of leaders cutting deals that benefit themselves more than the people they purport to represent, or who cut deals that are attractive in the short term but disastrous in the future, after such wise leaders have disappeared into a luxurious retirement. This is familiar territory.
2
On your point #2, leaders of any country, including this one, csn have personal economic interests that vary from the public economic interests they're supposed to represent. If China keeps getting richer, meaning the state juggernaut, that combined with our pay to play system will turn us into another manipulated economic colony of the latest global hegemon.
1
A BC (Canada) coal mine operation owned by Chinese capital required Mandarin language competency for 400 recruits . In Canada! Don't try to sell me the 'ropes'. The Chinese we're simply attempting to exploit lack or non existent labour laws for a situation that wasn't anticipated.
2
"Chinese money is going to build roads, highways, bridges, hospitals,..." Before President Correa and the Citizens' Revolution, the monies from foreign loans would have gone to the pockets of corrupt public servants, to pay commissions, to pay interest on those same loans, which had even higher interest rates, and very little would have been left to benefit Ecuador. Some of the most important indicators on how much Ecuador is improving are the decreases in poverty from 34.97% in 2007 to 22.01% in June 2015 (a 37.05% decrease) and extreme poverty from 15.49% in 2007 to 7.36% (a 47.50% decrease, yes an incredible forty per cent decrease in eight years).
I believe that President Correa respects and admires the United States and is grateful for the opportunity that he had to get a doctorate in Economy from the University of Illinois.
I believe that President Correa respects and admires the United States and is grateful for the opportunity that he had to get a doctorate in Economy from the University of Illinois.
5
Welcome developments. As resentment of Chinese overlordship grows it will be nice to hear the world's populists direct their rhetoric at someone else for a change. Meanwhile in the U.S. we have plenty of domestic energy resources to hold us as long as we don't procrastinate too badly on decarbonization.
5
The big difference in our imperialism and China's is, at the end of the day we believe in freedom and human rights. I shudder to think how all of these American America haters would respond if Their posts were under the watchful eye of Communist China. Oh well, people of Equador, you'll feel it before we do?
12
Absolutely!
1
Hmmm... You must have changed your spots. USA support for freedom and human rights was in very short supply during the 70s, 80s and 90s in Latin America, the decades when these countries were your "backyard".
All imperialisms are wrong and yours is (was?) not better than anyone else's
All imperialisms are wrong and yours is (was?) not better than anyone else's
When we provide economic assistance, we make our own rules which come with economic as well as political strings attached, and we do not hesitate to interfere in other countries' political affairs. China's economic ties are purely economic and It does not pass judgement or interfere in other countries's political affairs. China's economic ties come with less political and cultural influence as compared to West's economic ties. West's economic ties also come with military ties and military alignment as compared to China which pursues only economic ties. West does not spare even one of its own to force its own rules. Look at Greece, EU has taken away its sovereignty and brought it to its heel to dictate their own terms.
5
I Don't think investing in Ecuador is a great idea -too risky. Even investing in China, as shown by their presumed opaque stock market and severe sell-off of bubble stocks. And, Africa - even worse; a new revolution every six months; really too risky.
But, this is a wake-up call, if one is needed, to change our own business practices. Government must lead. We must bring manufacturing back to America for all the hollowed out industries that have left. We are now the underdeveloped country. Encourage new industries. Mandate plants in America for foreign corporations that sell here. Punish the hacking and stealing of our patents. We must stop smothering businesses with more and more rules, taxes, and other burdens, lower business taxes. We must have big practical long-term infrastructure projects. We must balance the economy: less spent on medical, more on true infrastructure as an example. Better worker training, with more apprenticeships. Be practical, not political. Be firm on achieving goals.
That is, think America first. Think American strength. Don't worry about Ecuador.
But, this is a wake-up call, if one is needed, to change our own business practices. Government must lead. We must bring manufacturing back to America for all the hollowed out industries that have left. We are now the underdeveloped country. Encourage new industries. Mandate plants in America for foreign corporations that sell here. Punish the hacking and stealing of our patents. We must stop smothering businesses with more and more rules, taxes, and other burdens, lower business taxes. We must have big practical long-term infrastructure projects. We must balance the economy: less spent on medical, more on true infrastructure as an example. Better worker training, with more apprenticeships. Be practical, not political. Be firm on achieving goals.
That is, think America first. Think American strength. Don't worry about Ecuador.
5
My wife and I just spent two weeks in Ecuador. We were struck by the upbeat spirit of the people, owing in good measure to the country's dynamic young president, Rafael Correa, and his progressive programs. Infrastructure improvements are everywhere to be seen, including Quito's brand-new airport, upgraded highways, municipal services, etc. This infusion of Chinese money is indeed being put to good use!
But as the article suggests, there may be a price to pay in the long term, esp. considering the high interest rate being exacted by the Chinese. Correa has a PhD in international economics and must know what he's doing, but I'm still concerned. His term in office ends in two years and many Ecuadorians are already wondering who can take his place.
But as the article suggests, there may be a price to pay in the long term, esp. considering the high interest rate being exacted by the Chinese. Correa has a PhD in international economics and must know what he's doing, but I'm still concerned. His term in office ends in two years and many Ecuadorians are already wondering who can take his place.
5
The biggest problem with Chinese govt. expansion, anywhere, will prove to be extreme environmental degradation that effects whole regions. Much Chinese engineering and construction have ended diastrously in lives lost, but to developing 3rd world nations these may be small prices to pay
6
The biggest ecological disaster in Ecuador was caused by Chevron some 30 years ago which devastated a huge part of the Ecuadorian rainforest and, to this day, it has not been remedied or the country compensated. Likewise in Bhopal, India where thousands of lives were lost and a city rendered uninhabitable thanks to Union Carbide which caused the world's greatest industrial disaster
So when countries such as Ecuador consider their options I'm sure they realize that the Chinese can't do much worse than the Americans already have
So when countries such as Ecuador consider their options I'm sure they realize that the Chinese can't do much worse than the Americans already have
4
In some sense we are similar to Ecuador in that we are dependent on the Chinese supply chain. We have the world's most powerful military, but we allow our consumers and executives to benefit directly from the Chinese industrial complex. At the same time, China expands into the South China Sea and attacks our networks.
Our voters are oblivious to this situation. China is not on any presidential primary candidate's radar screen. Even in 2008 Sarah Palin famously exclaimed that she could see Russia... China was of no concern to her or her Republicans.
And Ecuador is poor, so it looks for a totalitarian deal, just as in the past when some Latin American countries turned to the Soviet Union. Our dependence on China really gives us no sway in these conversations. And our involvement in the Middle East is deleterious.
Something is brewing on the horizon. Capitalism gets us into these entanglements. In the past is was war, but today we really cannot brook a solution like that. Even the Right Wing, that cannot tolerate atheism or totalitarianism, is dependent on China for wealth and cheap goods. We have stumbled into this delicate dance with China. Ecuador is doing the same thing.
Our voters are oblivious to this situation. China is not on any presidential primary candidate's radar screen. Even in 2008 Sarah Palin famously exclaimed that she could see Russia... China was of no concern to her or her Republicans.
And Ecuador is poor, so it looks for a totalitarian deal, just as in the past when some Latin American countries turned to the Soviet Union. Our dependence on China really gives us no sway in these conversations. And our involvement in the Middle East is deleterious.
Something is brewing on the horizon. Capitalism gets us into these entanglements. In the past is was war, but today we really cannot brook a solution like that. Even the Right Wing, that cannot tolerate atheism or totalitarianism, is dependent on China for wealth and cheap goods. We have stumbled into this delicate dance with China. Ecuador is doing the same thing.
13
I know, right. The world's largest military and we would probably need to ask China to manufacture mess kits for us if we got into a war with them.
We could repatriate and automate many of the jobs in China. It would not create lots of jobs here, but it would resolve the issue above. However, what if Apple-biggest corp. in USA- said NO & moved their headquarters to Asia.
I wonder if China hasn't come to dominate this game only as it begins to lose relevance. Global resources monopolies, global trade and finance, ports and docks and infrastructure: they're going to be less important in an era where global climate change increasingly stresses global civilization. What's gettable, or makeable, close to home will be more important. and frankly more possible.
Meanwhile, China bribes its way along, as we did, and doesn't even offer employment on the projects to the locals; they have their own people to keep busy -- or risk unrest.
Meanwhile, China bribes its way along, as we did, and doesn't even offer employment on the projects to the locals; they have their own people to keep busy -- or risk unrest.
1
Regarding the chart with China's overseas investments: Chinese insurer Anbang invested 1.3 billion euro in Dutch insurer Reaal (february 2015).
Chinese firms are as reckless as their Western counterparts. The only difference is that the Chinese government is keen on securing the supply of natural resources abroad, while Western companies are only interested in making profits.
China's growth had led to a commodity boom over the past decade in Africa and South America, lifting millions out of poverty. The scramble for natural resources had taken a toll on the environment - especially the deforestation in the Amazon.
Winning the hearts and minds of autocrats, China is gaining access into South America's vast resources. Thanks to "oil-backed loans" that boost social spending and develop infrastructure, populist leaders remain in power, allowing them to take greater control of national industries.
Rafael Correa is not alone to have pegged his ambitious development plans to Ecuador's oil, only to feel the squeeze as the oil price falls. The loss of income is likely to leave his country deeply indebted to resource-hungry China for decades. But the Correa administration seems to have no choice by drilling more oil, destroying pristine rainforest in the Amazon.
It's so sad to see short-sighted leaders, who want to gain power by means of myopic policies.
China's growth had led to a commodity boom over the past decade in Africa and South America, lifting millions out of poverty. The scramble for natural resources had taken a toll on the environment - especially the deforestation in the Amazon.
Winning the hearts and minds of autocrats, China is gaining access into South America's vast resources. Thanks to "oil-backed loans" that boost social spending and develop infrastructure, populist leaders remain in power, allowing them to take greater control of national industries.
Rafael Correa is not alone to have pegged his ambitious development plans to Ecuador's oil, only to feel the squeeze as the oil price falls. The loss of income is likely to leave his country deeply indebted to resource-hungry China for decades. But the Correa administration seems to have no choice by drilling more oil, destroying pristine rainforest in the Amazon.
It's so sad to see short-sighted leaders, who want to gain power by means of myopic policies.
18
I enjoyed reading the comments from Latin America and China.
One fact to bear in mind is that Ecuador uses the U.S. dollar (it's where all our dollar coins go) for its currency. So, this will increase China's exposure to U.S. currency fluctuations. For better or worse, this will more closely bind the U.S. and China economically.
One fact to bear in mind is that Ecuador uses the U.S. dollar (it's where all our dollar coins go) for its currency. So, this will increase China's exposure to U.S. currency fluctuations. For better or worse, this will more closely bind the U.S. and China economically.
2
We'll know China is as strong as the US as soon when Equadorians start migrating in numbers there instead of here.
3
Dan - no - it's too far
Good article. No surprise here. While America dithers in political battles and loses focus in its national/international priorities, China moves ahead with its plans, for better or worse for the rest of the world.
18
Political scientists, particularly in the West, predicted that capitalism would bring democracy to China. Well, guess what, it didn't. Now China has forged a new kind of capitalism and is forging a new kind of imperialism. Chinese leaders don't care about the environment, workers' rights, or a state's politics. They just want to know what kind of return on investment they are going to get. It is great for Chinese investors, but in the long run the investments will spell disaster for many of these countries.
7
I'm just sorry about what is happening to the beautiful Coca River. In ecological terms the Chinese are a scourge what with encouraging traffic in rare animal parts and general global destruction. Poor Ecuador. The end of another beautiful country.
16
Interestingly enough the times refers to "Chinese firms" instead of the Chinese government. There continues to be a coordinated attempt to legitimize Chinese investments by mislabeling them as Chinese business. Some of us are well enough informed to note this consistent discrepancy in coverage. These projects are 100% driven by the Chinese government, and they are not altruistic in nature. The goal of the Chinese government is and will continue to be world domination. They have demonstrated a willingness to do whatever they need to in order to accomplish this goal. From stealing trade secrets to polluting the environment and plundering the earths resources they appear unstoppable. They will assimilate the needy countries they invest in.
8
It's always better to bring investment than war to a nation. I failed to see why we, our government and corporations, can't do the same or rather better at this than China.
5
Clearly you don't know your own history with the World Bank and IMF.
China is using the same methods the United States used to dominate the world.
Up to now China has been unable to compete militarily with the United States, but this is set to change. China is building up its military capabilities at breakneck speed, so they will soon be able to use the two most tried and true forms of international domination in tandem: violence and debt.
The big question is whether China's own internal debt catches up with it before it can begin true global hegemony ala the USA.
China is using the same methods the United States used to dominate the world.
Up to now China has been unable to compete militarily with the United States, but this is set to change. China is building up its military capabilities at breakneck speed, so they will soon be able to use the two most tried and true forms of international domination in tandem: violence and debt.
The big question is whether China's own internal debt catches up with it before it can begin true global hegemony ala the USA.
1
The only reason why I didn’t throw up while reading this article was that I care way too much for the integrity of my keyboard. Truly a monument to the US hypocrisy, unfairness and double standards.
Just to sum up the basic fact:
Developing countries, China included, screamed for years not only to get better conditions for their Western backed loans, but also to get more respect and a broader role within Bretton Woods’ international lending institutions. To no avail. Countries like Ecuador turned to China precisely because the latter’s terms were NOT as intrusive and hindering as the IMF’s or the World Bank’s. Also, the authors ludicrously represent technology agreements only as a one-way trick to benefit Chinese tech companies, while those agreements, in due time, will provide the host countries with essential tools to foster their own development even further. Western sanctioned aid, by contrast, always prevented this, by keeping poorest countries in a condition of raw material exporters-finished goods importers, i.e. a status eternal dependency. China is certainly pursuing its national interests. But it’s doing so under conditions that are clearly more desirable to developing countries. When was last time you heard about such cordial meetings between Latin American leaders and their American counterparts, as the meetings which took place with the Chinese, that the NYT seeks so shamelessly to deride? There is a reason for that.
Just to sum up the basic fact:
Developing countries, China included, screamed for years not only to get better conditions for their Western backed loans, but also to get more respect and a broader role within Bretton Woods’ international lending institutions. To no avail. Countries like Ecuador turned to China precisely because the latter’s terms were NOT as intrusive and hindering as the IMF’s or the World Bank’s. Also, the authors ludicrously represent technology agreements only as a one-way trick to benefit Chinese tech companies, while those agreements, in due time, will provide the host countries with essential tools to foster their own development even further. Western sanctioned aid, by contrast, always prevented this, by keeping poorest countries in a condition of raw material exporters-finished goods importers, i.e. a status eternal dependency. China is certainly pursuing its national interests. But it’s doing so under conditions that are clearly more desirable to developing countries. When was last time you heard about such cordial meetings between Latin American leaders and their American counterparts, as the meetings which took place with the Chinese, that the NYT seeks so shamelessly to deride? There is a reason for that.
27
I don't understand the comments lamenting the "multi-colored junk" and "trinkets" from China. We buy our televisions, computers, iphones, for example, from China. I would hardly call those trinkets.
8
Not all of us. I bought a Sony, made in Japan. My HP hard drive is not made in China. My clothes are not made in China, unless the label is misleading. And, perhaps the Times might want to cover the disaster that was the Chinese rivets used on the Bay Bridge in SF. The rivets were cheap, and they failed. The cost of redoing all of that with American steel rivets is big. China has no history of industrial manufacturing; they are flying by the seat of their pants. We have an old steel industry and a long history of industrial development and building. I would not buy a car made in China; the Chinese do not buy them; they buy American cars if they can afford them. Pollution from coal plants in Beijing has destroyed tourism to the Great Wall and the museums where the clay soldiers are. Foreign investors who locate headquarters in Beijing have to pay hardship wages to get employees to go there. Children in Beijing schools cannot go out and play due to the extreme air pollution. When I visited Beijing and the Wall, the air was clear and the skies were blue. I visited a friend in Nantong who teaches in the factory schools; his students want to learn English so they can go to America and work. Let's not go nuts on admiring the spurt in Chinese growth; it has produced wealth for the elite and factory slaves who commit suicide for the poor. What will happen to those agricultural farmers who are being herded into large polluted cities to work for low wages?
1
The main takeaway here is that we should not send money and negotiate fragile political strings with corrupt leaders, but rather send resource and experts and negotiate economic strings. The former helps only those corrupt leaders, the latter helps everyone.
China did not just start doing this. They did this since Mao era.
China did not just start doing this. They did this since Mao era.
Only time will tell how much Rafael Correa took as kickbacks accepted extremely high interest rate at the expense of Ecuador's economic and environmental sustainability. If he took some, he is corrupt. If he took none he's just a bad negotiator. Either way, Ecuador will suffer.
3
Rates before were even higher. Some went as high as 12%. Bad negotiator, not for Ecuador. President Correa is an outstanding leader, incorruptible, competent, visionary. Among his achievements: decent minimum wage adjusted to CPI annually, "free" tertiary education paid by taxpayers, health care, massive expenditure in infraestructure: roads, schools, preschools, universities, hospitals, polices stations, hydroelectric plants, thriving business, sustainable economic growth, etc. etc. and all administering public monies with transparency. Ecuador was a poor and hopeless, but not anymore. It still has a long way to go and its future looks bright.
As far as kickbacks, please give us proofs.
As far as kickbacks, please give us proofs.
1
As bad as the strings attached due to China's trade deals can be, for sure they won't mean colonization, or fostering civil wars or imposition of Chinese cultural standards as other powerhouses have deliberately done.
17
There is a real conceptual problem with this article; it consistently confuses investment with loans. The ones who are investing are government officials in Ecuador, using taxpayers' money of the present and future generations to fund pharaonic projects, many of which won't provide the expected returns. The Chinese have simply been handing out loans with no questions asked except for their own earnings. The Chinese oil companies in the Amazon, which arrived before Correa won power, are the only examples of investment, with the exception of the Mirador mine. This is why the refinery, which would be an investment, is only a mirage on which $1.2 billion has been wasted. This is what happens when you marry an oil boom with corruption.
4
The article has a whiff of sour grapes. The fact is that US got kicked out of Ecuador after a long history of exploitation and meddling into their internal affairs. If Chinese investments and politics around it are not that great, why don't we offer a better deal?
9
For anyone that has studied Chinese history, its imperialism has differed from that of Western countries, in one fundamental respect - China has always been a proponent of the tributary system rather than outright colonization (notwithstanding Tibet and and some other territories it contends is a part of the Chinese mainland). The tributary system, unlike colonization, is more generally a "lighter touch" and more "practical" form of colonization. It leaves the indigenous population with more of a sense of control over their destiny and avoids the overt obligation of China to outright govern and defend the colony, like the standard Western European models, but allows the Chinese to extract the required resources. As such, the Chinese form generally leaves less of imprint of Chinese culture on the local populations, but the end result is generally the same - it strips whatever is valuable from the local lands and resources without any lasting real benefits to the local peoples.
28
Australia beware! Or is it already too late?
3
I'd be less worried about first world countries with sustainable economies of their own. It's the third world countries that have inherently little leverage against resource hungry super economies looking to basically strip mine them.
This article, like many others, points towards a behind-the-scenes rise of China's status as the world's second superpower. In the West, and elsewhere, the focus has been too much on China's rigid security apparatus, it's aggression on the South China Sea, and other border areas. The truth is, with billions of investments in Asia, Africa, and South America, China has asserted itself as the dominant power in many countries. Countries that project power economically- through investments and loans, are in a far stronger footing than those that hope to project their military might. During the 20th century, the United States was able to do that with the Marshall Plan, and billions in investment around the world in what were at the time, 'high-risk' countries. But the US understood then that the potential economic loss was far lesser than the potential political gain. The Chinese are playing the same game today.
16
Not quite. We did not strip Europe of the resources it needed to rebuild. China strips resources she needs and does not have. We developed democratic governments and supported them. We did not enslave European workers in American factories. China strips resources, i.e. The Amazon rain forests. China is not a democracy and has no interest in fostering freedom in the countries she exploits. She does not "interfere" in local cultures, because she has no interest in interacting with them; she does not respect those cultures; she just wants the resources. This is the old American Fruit form of exploitation. I admire the Chinese people; their government, not so much.
U.S. Global Ambitions, "also" with loans and strings attached. In the end, there's no such thing as a free lunch. This is how the world has been operating since the very beginning of times.
5
Admit it or not, China is doing better than IMF or the West in helping developing nations. Most of those targeted countries are rife with corruption. IMF loans would stay in the pockets of dictators, or powerful corrupt ruling elite (such as Greece). Then common people would have to pay back those loans. Chinese investment, on the other hand, is being used to build infrastructure, create jobs, and help low and middle income people in developing nations.
I assume China's success is caused by its political and military non-interference policy. Their investment is to fund business projects, no strings attached. They don't fund the opposition, they don't build military bases, and they don't care or talk much about democracy. All they care is stability in a country so that they can keep doing business. That's a very attractive deal for ruling elites. As a result, Chinese investors, ruling elites, and local communities gain from those projects. For starving families there, democracy is not a priority, but economy is.
US and Western countries are selectively addressing developing nations based on their geopolitical locations. They don't care about democracy neither (Saudi, Bahrain). However, they do want politically influence the rulers, and build military bases there. Siding with the rulers has short-term benefits, since whoever comes next to power might re-consider alliance strategies. Moreover, by protecting a corrupt elite, US is distancing itself from local people there.
I assume China's success is caused by its political and military non-interference policy. Their investment is to fund business projects, no strings attached. They don't fund the opposition, they don't build military bases, and they don't care or talk much about democracy. All they care is stability in a country so that they can keep doing business. That's a very attractive deal for ruling elites. As a result, Chinese investors, ruling elites, and local communities gain from those projects. For starving families there, democracy is not a priority, but economy is.
US and Western countries are selectively addressing developing nations based on their geopolitical locations. They don't care about democracy neither (Saudi, Bahrain). However, they do want politically influence the rulers, and build military bases there. Siding with the rulers has short-term benefits, since whoever comes next to power might re-consider alliance strategies. Moreover, by protecting a corrupt elite, US is distancing itself from local people there.
23
And of course the U.S. has never done the same, have they? No, no ...
5
I think it is highly ironic that China, a communist state, is winning influence through trade and investment. Whereas America, a democratic state, is seen by many (though often unfairly) as asserting influence through military dominance. Just look at the current discussion over Iran. A large number, including some senators, are basically calling for a total capitulation by Iran.
10
Iran has an educated population; they don't want a nuclear war; they want relief from our endless sanctions. They want to enter the world market and trade in goods. If Iran does not totally trust us, it might be because we and BP Oil overthrew Mossadegh and put in the corrupt Shah. They had to have a revolution to get rid of him. Iran does not need Israel armed with nukes pointing at its borders; Israel is not afraid of attack, she wants to stifle the possible entry of Iran into the world's markets. We need to negotiate with Iran. We need to have access to the Straits of Hormuz which Iran controls. This is called diplomacy, not war. Our current Congress is beholden to the MIC, so we can't expect them to support a rational foreign policy.
1
While we go bludgeoning into wars with bottomless pits, wasting our wealth and lives, with nothing of real consequence to show for it, earning the wrath of the lndigent populations and loss of credibility and our moral standing in the world, China is stealthily moving expanding and gaining absolute control of the world and it's resources - without firing a single shot. They thrive to the exclusion of everyone else. They are playing the old British MO wherein they enter as traders only to become conquerors, annexing every country they enter, establishing colonies. The only difference is, China is gaining ascendency by addressing a country's needs for the short term, leaving them charred and scarred long term. If Beijing is an example of China's rapid growth, killing their environment, then why would they bother with the environment of other countries. Global Politics at it's cruel best.
19
Chinese investment may be well and good for native Ecuadorians. However, word is the AKC (American Kennel Club) is planning to cancel sponsorship for the Ecuadorian version of the Westminster Kennel Club Dog Show. Why, remains a state mystery..
2
This what happens when a country focuses on making things. China has won the cold war by becoming the means of production for most of the world. A big win for communism and a big loss for us. We lost the advantage of having a vibrant free enterprise system to merger mania and those who seek the power of a mandarin.
6
We quit being "Free Enterprise" Capitalist when we merged govt. into industry.
We can blame Nixon for opening China to the world. In 1972 the year of his visit, China was poorer than India, everybody dressed alike and had to read the book of Chairman Mao. Of course, Nixon had to nix Brezhnev's idea to jointly nuke China and instead decided to play the China card as leverage against the Soviet Union. Talk about opening a pandora's box. We are now witnesses to what this country has become. Maybe this will all fizzle out or maybe this is only the beginning. What was it that Napoleon had said about China? "Let her sleep, when she awakes she will move the world."
1
wow...aren't we talking about how China is helping out developing nations here? I guess that could only be a pandora's box in the view of pure evil.
1
The EU aka Germany's ridiculous handling of the Greek debt crisis certainly makes China look less frightening as a lender. Even Ukraine is being very careful with their once dream partner the EU. Certainly Russia's deal to Ukraine before their foolish coup seems better than originally thought. The USs stupid neo con boondoogle in Ukraine has pushed Russia into China's lending orbit. The end of the Breton Woods international lending regime has a lot to do with the West's economic free market imperialism and shook therapy which they hold up as the only type of policy that they will accept in order to lend. This has been shown to cause instability and hardship rather than recovery.
8
The investor class that runs the US decided over 40 years ago to cash out of the US and put their money and technology where it would produce the highest return for them, which turned out to be East Asia and, since the 90s China, China, China. So the manufacturing base, including technical know-how and supply chain was transferred to China, lock stock and barrel. The result? Well, the said investors certainly got rich, while everyone else here paid the price in a shrunken middle class, starved public services and infrastructure, and the Chinese are now becoming the dominant economic power in the world, but not our friends as was promised by all the 'free traders' (corrupt politicians and media hacks bought and paid by said investors). While China's oligarchs try to build up their country our oligarchs liquidate ours with an eye only on their own balance sheets, with the help of and collusion with the Chinese and our corrupt politcians.
I would reccommend that the US re
I would reccommend that the US re
14
So China is taking the lead and making economic progress while we are fighting useless wars, depriving our citizens from good education, underfunding our infrastructural needs, crowding our jails, and engaging in religious and racial bigotry. This is perhaps the new American exceptionalism.
73
You talk like you have never lived anywhere else. The Chinese have more bigotry in one finger than most Americans have in their entire body. Though I agree with some of your other points.
China isn't the problem in the story. Ecuador is the problem. The article states that President Correa holds the US responsible for the jailing and death of his father. So the entire country of Ecuador will suffer because its president has a personal rift against the US. That's much like Venezuela, and much like the reason W invaded Iraq.
In Venezuela, Ecuador the presidents were elected under shady conditions and retained power through rigged election. In the US, we (Americans) were stupid enough to elect W twice, although some claim W's first election was rigged.
In Venezuela, Ecuador the presidents were elected under shady conditions and retained power through rigged election. In the US, we (Americans) were stupid enough to elect W twice, although some claim W's first election was rigged.
4
Correa was democratically elected. The election was not rigged- nobody has ever said this, so presumably you have information that we have not heard before. Please do share it with us all.
Correa has provided stability to Ecuador. He is arrogant and aggressive, but he is also very intelligent. I don't know if he blames the USA for his father's death or not- he did get one of his degrees from Chicago, so we presume that he does not hate your country.
And Ecuador is not "suffering", at least not yet. If you read the comments of your compatriots that have visited the country recently, they all speak of progress, optimism and in general, an upbeat country.
Correa has provided stability to Ecuador. He is arrogant and aggressive, but he is also very intelligent. I don't know if he blames the USA for his father's death or not- he did get one of his degrees from Chicago, so we presume that he does not hate your country.
And Ecuador is not "suffering", at least not yet. If you read the comments of your compatriots that have visited the country recently, they all speak of progress, optimism and in general, an upbeat country.
What upsets me most about this story, is the environmental aspects. One of the great Amazon and water environments in the world will be sacrificed for an electrical dam and and an oil refinery. The US and the world desperately need a hefty carbon tax, to slow these environmentally lethal projects, and help the growth of more sustainable forms of energy and growth.
The US also should put through a pollution and trash tax, and tax all items sold and carried into the US that are not 100% recyclable.This would force all manufacturers, domestic or from the developing world that sells into our large, consumerist economy, to make their products recyclable, or pay for removal to landfills. We also need such a penalty tax, to help start cleaning up our oceans and waterways, that are getting filled with plastic trash, that is endangering all kinds of wildlife.
The carbon tax would help incentivize the Chinese, the US, and everyone else, to work hard to do less harm to the environment, while creating economic development. Paul Krugman has reported that a major study by economists suggests that moving to sustainable energies will not stop growth, and its negative effects might be less than 1% of growth without the change to sustainable energy sources.
from LindsayOnVietnam.wordpress.com
The US also should put through a pollution and trash tax, and tax all items sold and carried into the US that are not 100% recyclable.This would force all manufacturers, domestic or from the developing world that sells into our large, consumerist economy, to make their products recyclable, or pay for removal to landfills. We also need such a penalty tax, to help start cleaning up our oceans and waterways, that are getting filled with plastic trash, that is endangering all kinds of wildlife.
The carbon tax would help incentivize the Chinese, the US, and everyone else, to work hard to do less harm to the environment, while creating economic development. Paul Krugman has reported that a major study by economists suggests that moving to sustainable energies will not stop growth, and its negative effects might be less than 1% of growth without the change to sustainable energy sources.
from LindsayOnVietnam.wordpress.com
14
This "world tax" exists when countries go to the World Bank for a loan. The World Bank does its environmental analysis, for good or bad, and gives the money if the project meets environmental requirements.
When a country goes to China for the money, it knows it will be subject to the lending practices of the Chinese bank, which carries a hefty interest rate and doesn't care about the environment. It's Ecuador's choice to be subject to WB or China. They chose China, and there's nothing we can do about it.
When a country goes to China for the money, it knows it will be subject to the lending practices of the Chinese bank, which carries a hefty interest rate and doesn't care about the environment. It's Ecuador's choice to be subject to WB or China. They chose China, and there's nothing we can do about it.
3
Guess what? China is experimenting with carbon tax to curb its own pollution. China is also investing far more on renewable energy than the US.
2
From what I see - China is paying in kind or fair market value. That's a FAR cry from the imperial aspirations of Europe and even this country. No threats - no murder/genocide - no seizing of resources. Sorry - but I'm not alarmed by this.
15
If China does introduce the means for these countries to develop economies that offer more prosperity for their people, they can create markets for Chinese manufacturing beyond the U.S., Europe, Korea and Japan. The willingness of the Chinese government to allow long term debt to be used to assure exclusive access to these countries' resources and markets for Chinese products might not be such a poor business decision over the long run.
13
We don't know what China will do if these countries don't pay back the debt or, like many Latin American countries have done in the past, nationalize the Chinese refineries and oil production fields, in the name of national interest and against "imperialism".
2
"The $2.2 billion project will feed river water to eight giant Chinese turbines designed to produce enough electricity to light more than a third of Ecuador."
Need to say more?
The author is very fancied by mentioning Chinese workers like to sit separately in lunch, and ...brothel. To be honest, in US we also sit by ourselves. We just like to sit by ourselves, okay? It's not in college people mix and talk about their culture and philosophy, jeez.
Need to say more?
The author is very fancied by mentioning Chinese workers like to sit separately in lunch, and ...brothel. To be honest, in US we also sit by ourselves. We just like to sit by ourselves, okay? It's not in college people mix and talk about their culture and philosophy, jeez.
15
If the U.S. wants to successfully compete with China we need to take a page out of their book and educate our children for free and especially encourage disciplines our country needs. Instead our children either drop out of high school in record numbers or are saddled with enormous debt.
4
Not sure what you mean. China does not educate its children for free.
Yale's Paul Kennedy wrote an influential book in the late 80s called the Decline and Fall of the Great Powers. The declinists literature of the 1980s has finally come to fruition. China has returned in the 21st century as a great power. By 2030, according to a study by the World Bank, the country will have a staggering domestic investment rate of 9 trillion dollars per year. This will be more than double that of the United States. 30 percent of the world's gross investment will originate with China versus 11 percent in the United States and 5 percent in Japan. The developing world, including China and India will be making 62 percent of the aggregate value of the world's investments. What does this signal? The real end of American dominance and the real end of both Eurocentric and U.S. centric global thought. Welcome to the new global age.
14
And a return to the historic norm, I might add.
A Chinese lady once said to me in the end the Han over populate the rest.
China will steadily replace the rest of the world with China.
Just go for a walk in Little Italy.
China will steadily replace the rest of the world with China.
Just go for a walk in Little Italy.
1
My guess is you've never been to Little Italy (not very italian) or Italy. Or even know more than the odd Chinese lady spewing nonsense. Upwardly mobile immigrants don't linger in ethnic enclaves for eternity. As hard as it is for you to believe, they prefer assimilation.
1
Yes, it is a quiet conquest. China is taking over the world, thanks to the billions of dollars we gave them by offshoring all of our manufacturing to them. The Waltons and others who thought they were so smart destroying the middle class in this country have a nasty surprise coming their way when they find out who's really in charge. who really pulls the strings. And it's not just happening "over there." I've watched the Bay Area, mainly SF, transform gradually into one giant Chinatown- most stores and restaurants are now owned by Chinese., signs in Chinese are everywhere, most residential real estate is owned by Chinese who are able to pay over the asking price, in cash. And everyone seems okay with it.
23
And wealthy Chinese women come to the US to give birth -- thus ensuring an 'anchor baby' with US citizenship -- which, as the child grows, can be leveraged into all sorts of education freebies/discounts, housing, etc., etc. (NY Times has covered this).
We MUST change the 14th Amendment -- no other Western countries give automatic citizenship to persons who are born to non-citizens. It's crazy!
We MUST change the 14th Amendment -- no other Western countries give automatic citizenship to persons who are born to non-citizens. It's crazy!
If the Chinese really do take over California this way (which I seriously doubt), it would be orders of magnitudes more peaceful than how white Europeans took over North America.
1
@Little Cabagge, when I immigrated to the U.S. I had the opportunity to go to the UK as well. Both were great opportunities and my decision to come to the U.S. rested solely on the fact that my children would be American by birth, with all the rights to vote and have a voice in the direction this country is going. With businesses that me and my children have created over the last 30 years we employ hundreds of people, all with college and many with graduate degrees.
Give me one reason why my children should've denied citizenship? Is it because you got here earlier?
Give me one reason why my children should've denied citizenship? Is it because you got here earlier?
1
How sad that only a few sentences could be spared on this ecological disaster, and the foreign minister, who obviously has no expertise in environmental matters, gets to speak for the environment. NYT, with the many ecological experts and environmental advocates in Ecuador, you couldn't get someone to give us the real story on the environmental impact of this and other Chinese-supported projects?
11
In the mess that is Global Politics and, in turn, Global Domination, China excells by sheer brute force. They will "buy" governmental leaders; using their "economic clout to win diplomatic allies". Then, while the local citizens understandably complain about working conditions on dams that will ruin the Country's watershed, China will then build "surveillance cameras stretching to the Galapgos Islands". President Xi Jinping makes Hitler look good.
I fear for Ecuador. Their Leaders will get fat on bribes. The People will work like SLAVES. The Environment will be ruined. And the World will be worse off with another Communist Party stronghold, and choke hold.
I hope that the Ecuadorian People who are getting mistreated already will rise up against this dominance. Truly, this might create another Tiannamen Square down there, but - that WILL happen eventually. The Ecuadorian People should rally, and demand equality NOW. Looking at history, past and very recent, we all know this will never happen. Still, they must rise up and try, or lose even more ground.
Seeing how China has ruined any Country they have touched, over-using natural rescources, prisoning dissenters, keeping workers under the government's boot heel, I see little reason for hope. The World will take note that one more irreplaceable part of it has fallen to dominance and greed.
I fear for Ecuador. Their Leaders will get fat on bribes. The People will work like SLAVES. The Environment will be ruined. And the World will be worse off with another Communist Party stronghold, and choke hold.
I hope that the Ecuadorian People who are getting mistreated already will rise up against this dominance. Truly, this might create another Tiannamen Square down there, but - that WILL happen eventually. The Ecuadorian People should rally, and demand equality NOW. Looking at history, past and very recent, we all know this will never happen. Still, they must rise up and try, or lose even more ground.
Seeing how China has ruined any Country they have touched, over-using natural rescources, prisoning dissenters, keeping workers under the government's boot heel, I see little reason for hope. The World will take note that one more irreplaceable part of it has fallen to dominance and greed.
8
China pours billions into useful developments and making friends while Bush and Obama pour billions down the drain of military ineffectiveness and waste as we find our enemies becoming more numerous day by day. It sure looks as if the Chinese leaders have a secret ingredient in their strategy that could be labeled common sense while as we bankrupt our social safety nets we have a secret ingredient in our strategy that could hardly be called anything close to common sense.
2016 should give us an opportunity to clean out the Bush/Obama hawks and elect a new Bernie Sanders strategic outlook that gets us back on the right track.
2016 should give us an opportunity to clean out the Bush/Obama hawks and elect a new Bernie Sanders strategic outlook that gets us back on the right track.
14
We should interpret this as world good will... and naturally the Chinese
are legend noted for display of hearted humanity in all of the modern era...
Mao ... a prince among men... China (along with India) are wholly irresponsible entities -- peculiar and led to the time - whose future shall settle in so much dust after implosion...
are legend noted for display of hearted humanity in all of the modern era...
Mao ... a prince among men... China (along with India) are wholly irresponsible entities -- peculiar and led to the time - whose future shall settle in so much dust after implosion...
Implosion? For much of history China was the most advanced civilization in the world. They just didn't desire to conquer the world like others did. Go look at the history of human inventions - I think you would be astonished at how much came from China an its 5000 year history.
2
When the Chinese build things they bring their own workers, equipment and materials to the job site. There is no such thing as stimulating the local economy of the country they are investing in. However, as for strings attached, it is only in terms of what the host country can do for China, not visa versa. In other words, we can build a docking facility for you if you allow access to our fishing fleets. To summarize, Chinese firms have little impact on the culture or economy of the countries they are investing in.
43
And after the workers leave you are suggesting that the roads. bridges or powerplants won't directly benefit the economy or the people of the country the Chinese lent money to? (And in case you weren't aware, when the U.S. companies get a contract to build overseas they bring in their engineers, technicians and many of the workforce members, along with private security firms such as are used by the U.S. government as mercenaries in countries it invests in by invading or occupying them or putting in their chosen military junta to give U.S. corporations favorable contract terms e.g. the Ecuadorean Junta and EXXON/TEXACO back in the seventies.
The roads, bridges and power plants need to be maintained. Most developing countries do not have the infrastructure for maintenance and although these facilities do make things easier, it is short lived, but a big assist for the Chinese removal of natural resources, which was the point of the infrastructure improvement in the first place. The difference between the US and Chinese is that the US will seek local involvement, the Chinese just build it and go away.
Didn't you happen to notice that the dam the Chinese is building will supply one-third of the nations electricity with no fuel costs? It worked pretty well for quite a few decades in the Tennessee Valley and that investment is still being repaid.
America (at least its politicians) only see the world through the military lens. If it were not for Hollywood, and Silicon valley , the rest of the world would only look at America as the biggest military in the world. When Ebola hit West Africa , America sent doctors but most of them military personnel.
Yes China is not perfect, but at least each third world country I know of has a Chinese Hospital. China builds Roads, bridges, etc... America bombs them( at least that is what people think)
The Exim Bank that has been helping US companies builds infrastructure in developing countries has become a Republican target. They want to get rid of it.
If asked most people around the World would rather immigrate to the US than to China. That will not change anytime soon. That means the US still has time to counter China expansion . But do Politicians in Washington actually care ? I don't think so. They are too busy fundraising for the next election, discussing abortion rights, etc...
Yes China is not perfect, but at least each third world country I know of has a Chinese Hospital. China builds Roads, bridges, etc... America bombs them( at least that is what people think)
The Exim Bank that has been helping US companies builds infrastructure in developing countries has become a Republican target. They want to get rid of it.
If asked most people around the World would rather immigrate to the US than to China. That will not change anytime soon. That means the US still has time to counter China expansion . But do Politicians in Washington actually care ? I don't think so. They are too busy fundraising for the next election, discussing abortion rights, etc...
13
The Chinese are fast learners and learned from the US; the US showed no interest in Africa before; so they left it to anybody else. Now the USers are whining.
2
Gee what a surprise while we send guns and the military to fight the "War on Drugs". While we spent billions of dollars over several decades to depose democratically elected leaders and institute strongmen. The chinese say "nah let's loan them some money to build stuff". And then we're supposed to be surprised that Latin America wants nothing to do with us. What a short sighted vision our countries leaders have.
17
The difference between the US and China is that the US won't flee from their allies when times get tough. China has not been known to stick its neck out for anyone. In the last century we have saved every country on the planet, including China, with our own blood and resources. Yes, we've made mistakes but we are at least not fair weather friends.
2
What planet do you live in? ask VietNam, we were allies of the south, and ran when it was impossible to win. How many Latin American countries we embroiled in cold war proxy wars, and left soon as we said we won, leaving them to foot the bill to rebuild destroyed countries?
Look at the mess in Iraq and Afghanistan. Our allies, and we left them with a mess that will last probably half a century to clean.
Look at the mess in Iraq and Afghanistan. Our allies, and we left them with a mess that will last probably half a century to clean.
12
this one made me laugh
“The problem is we are trying to replace American imperialism with Chinese imperialism" - in the long run it will be interesting to observe which "imperialism" is better - from the client perspective.
At this stage, it looks like Ecuador is in the position of sex workers who can never escape from slavery - they can never pay back the initial borrowed $$ - and the interest rate cumulates.
At this stage, it looks like Ecuador is in the position of sex workers who can never escape from slavery - they can never pay back the initial borrowed $$ - and the interest rate cumulates.
1
I'm shocked, shocked I say, that a wealthy world power dares to act in its own self-interests.
The US won't be able to act as an effective alternative to China for developing countries, until we stop pretending government has no role that can't be better met by the private sector, and until we stop looking at our fellow Americans as our enemies because their skin is a different color, their parents came from the wrong place or the subscribe to the wrong spiritual beliefs.
After that, we can work on the fact that the well-being of everyone on Earth is important to our own.
The US won't be able to act as an effective alternative to China for developing countries, until we stop pretending government has no role that can't be better met by the private sector, and until we stop looking at our fellow Americans as our enemies because their skin is a different color, their parents came from the wrong place or the subscribe to the wrong spiritual beliefs.
After that, we can work on the fact that the well-being of everyone on Earth is important to our own.
102
RS - "...and until we stop looking at our fellow Americans as our enemies because their skin is a different color, their parents came from the wrong place or the subscribe to the wrong spiritual beliefs."
And most importantly until we stop looking at our fellow Americans as our enemies because of their POLITICAL outlook. Are all Republicans and Conservatives REALLY our enemies?
And most importantly until we stop looking at our fellow Americans as our enemies because of their POLITICAL outlook. Are all Republicans and Conservatives REALLY our enemies?
The Sleeping Giant has finally awaken!
12
While the US invades other countries and sticks its nose where it does not belong, China is quietly taking over the world.
47
The U.S. invaded every Latin American country that bordered on a sea, and supported its ruling elites and military, thereby gaining control of precious resources. And of course, there were strings attached, along with the threat of military power. It is entertaining to watch a new superpower begin to accomplish the same thing through diplomacy.
7
Our government has been doing everything to influence events in the world for more than 100 years. So why not China There are more than 5 time the number of people in China than in our country. The Chinese have every right trying to impact events in the world in their favour. Our government may not like it but that is the way it is.
79
Sure they do but we should not help them pay for it. Especially since they are hardly a friendly adversary.
Good to see you're waving the American flag !
Why not? Because they have 1.3 billion people(just over 4 times). If they take all the resources they "need" there will be no planet left worth living on.
In addition to an exercise of hard power or financial muscle a nation with ambitions to emerge the global super power has to have a convincing pool of soft power at its command which might not only help it influence the world opinion on major global issues but also set the global agenda.
2
I love the current administration lack of aggressive actions against China. One only has to look at the "rare earth "minerals issue ... this administration has done nothing.
2
This Administration yesterday said that it held back from publicly accusing China for the most recent cyber attack incident. It is afraid of China. This president's foreign policy is a disaster.
3
We attacked Afghanistan to get Bin Laden; he just walked over into Pakistan and left us with the corrupt war lords in Afghanistan. Then we left Afghanistan; we could have stayed and improved their living conditions; we could have stayed and supported education for all. We left them, as had other Western powers. Now rare earth minerals have been discovered up on the border with the 'Stans; these minerals are used in cell phones. China invested in their natural gas and oil, built pipelines for them. Now China owns those rare earth minerals. All without firing a shot.
power is cyclical, and fleeting. what goes around comes around. history repeats itself.
1
China rushing in where angels fear to tread as a lender of last resort exporting their command communist culture of shoddy workmanship under a veneer of high finance their way.
Long term I do not see the harm to the Western Alliance brand. The value as always is in the difference. Customers will still have the choice. Diaspora of the world's nations living in America is a good indicator.
Long term I do not see the harm to the Western Alliance brand. The value as always is in the difference. Customers will still have the choice. Diaspora of the world's nations living in America is a good indicator.
Seems to me that a lot of people don't realize that the Chinese investment strategy is similar to the one the US deployed in the post WWII era.
As the US became a global industrial powerhouse, its resources needs increased dramatically requiring major investments abroad. Tactics like government backed financing (see: IFC, EXIM, IADB, etc..) in conjunction with US banks for large projects were deployed in exchange for large construction and resource procurement contracts for US firms. Consultants were used to convince foreign governments of the virtues of the projects for which they would receive said financing.
Then, as it turns out, many of these projects failed to produce what was hoped for which led to default and a cycle of debt that kept many of these countries economically destitute. Negative perceptions of the US arose in many of these places (Latin America in particular) where hence the concept of US Imperialism was born which is exactly what guys like Chavez used as an emotional catalyst within his people to achieve power. Now, countries like Venezuela and Ecuador have chosen China to be their white knight. Good luck to them, history tends to repeat itself!
As the US became a global industrial powerhouse, its resources needs increased dramatically requiring major investments abroad. Tactics like government backed financing (see: IFC, EXIM, IADB, etc..) in conjunction with US banks for large projects were deployed in exchange for large construction and resource procurement contracts for US firms. Consultants were used to convince foreign governments of the virtues of the projects for which they would receive said financing.
Then, as it turns out, many of these projects failed to produce what was hoped for which led to default and a cycle of debt that kept many of these countries economically destitute. Negative perceptions of the US arose in many of these places (Latin America in particular) where hence the concept of US Imperialism was born which is exactly what guys like Chavez used as an emotional catalyst within his people to achieve power. Now, countries like Venezuela and Ecuador have chosen China to be their white knight. Good luck to them, history tends to repeat itself!
5
The way that the "communists" are out-capitalizing the "capitalists" is amazing. The Chinese not only have their own rules for dealing with anybody they also posses a long view that westerners sorely lack. While western business and banks fret about the next quarter, the Chinese are looking at the next quarter CENTURY!
22
Profiting off the despoiling of our natural environment...
Using humans as disposable machines to make worthless products...
Buying up luxury apartments they never use in NYC to get citizenship, displacing working- and middle class- residents...
Wastefully getting Mazeratis and Rolls-Royces for the sole purpose of "face" enhancement...
And then coming back to lecture Americans about OUR values (seriously!)
No, I'm not sanguine about Chinese ambitions.
Using humans as disposable machines to make worthless products...
Buying up luxury apartments they never use in NYC to get citizenship, displacing working- and middle class- residents...
Wastefully getting Mazeratis and Rolls-Royces for the sole purpose of "face" enhancement...
And then coming back to lecture Americans about OUR values (seriously!)
No, I'm not sanguine about Chinese ambitions.
8
Chinese "culture " has never been anything but aggressive hence the hatred in all parts of Asia soon to be throughout the world.
2
Win gate- what are you talking about? Go look at all the "neighbors" that invaded China. From the Huns to the Mongols to the Japanese. If you also knew history most Asian countries went to China willingly to learn from them.
Apparently you do not have a clue in Asia history. All Chinese wanted in history is the face. As long as other countries called him the big brother, that would settle down most issues.
Last time Chinese "invaded" somebody else was like 8th century. You need to do more research in foreign history.
Last time Chinese "invaded" somebody else was like 8th century. You need to do more research in foreign history.
1
Let's put things in perspective. Chinese put the money so they put their conditions. Securing loans with oil is a very bad idea, and paying high interests rates is even worst (for Ecuador). Now Ecuador needs more financing and they also need money to keep big projects going. If the Chinese won't provide those resources they situation in Ecuador may get more complicated. The refinery is just one the projects that may not make much sense. There is also another for gas and several airports that are of little use. Bottom line, if it was not China there would be someone else, so the focus should be on why countries are depending to much on this Asian giant and not on Western nations? Maybe just all lenders are the same or it could be that politicians are to fault as always.
In 1961, a quarter million Cubans, mostly women, mostly young (a boy as young as eight) joined Castro's "literacy brigades," and traversed the island teaching rural Cubans to read and write. By day living, and working, with those families, by night teaching -- using lanterns donated by China.
The Chinese have been doing this for a long long time.
Two months ago, I visited a very small town in Cuba, there was a music/dance/stage recital put on for us by some of the locals. I talked to one of the performers afterward, a young woman. She said she was in the local orchestra! (Small, rural town.) She played the oboe, she said. Plastic. Donated by the Chinese.
The Chinese have been doing this for a long long time.
Two months ago, I visited a very small town in Cuba, there was a music/dance/stage recital put on for us by some of the locals. I talked to one of the performers afterward, a young woman. She said she was in the local orchestra! (Small, rural town.) She played the oboe, she said. Plastic. Donated by the Chinese.
6
"In what ways do you think Chinese firms will change the culture and economy of the countries they are investing in?"
Pretty much in the same ways as the Americans and the British did during their incursions at expanding economic markets, purchasing political influence and bribing for allies, making them better in some aspects and worse in other aspects...but without, of course, the ridiculously stupid conditions and limits only American conservatives insist on attaching to all foreign aid packages.
Pretty much in the same ways as the Americans and the British did during their incursions at expanding economic markets, purchasing political influence and bribing for allies, making them better in some aspects and worse in other aspects...but without, of course, the ridiculously stupid conditions and limits only American conservatives insist on attaching to all foreign aid packages.
5
In all of human history, has any major super power ever paved the way, with diplomatic, economic and legal blessings, the rise of a rival power which is now replacing it? Congratulations "free-traders," you have raised tens of millions of Chinese peasants out of poverty, as the US industrial base and its blue collar workers descended.
MIT, U of Chicago, Milton Friedman, Harvard, Princeton, additional kudos. You left the story of "power" out of the trading equations.
When William Greider pointed out in 1997, in "One World Ready or Not," that no nation had ever given up a manufacturing base without disastrous consequences - Spain, Holland and Great Britain - he was mocked by people like Paul Krugman for not having the proper mathematical models - only interviews, mere "journalism." (Kevin Phillips made similar points; where are you now Kevin?)
May we thank you all; we can only hope the Chinese treat us well, and I have my doubts after reading this.
This, not Mr. Trump's bombastic comments, should be the central discussion (and for the Clinton campaign too, since Bill rolled out the "red" carpet.) although I believe Mr. Trump is reaping, in an indirect way by targeting immigration, the anger that has risen over the decades of industrial decline here, and I include the black urban ghetto as part of that terrible process.
American citizens, the bottom 60% at least, should be angry. It's another variation on what the "best and brightest" brought us.
MIT, U of Chicago, Milton Friedman, Harvard, Princeton, additional kudos. You left the story of "power" out of the trading equations.
When William Greider pointed out in 1997, in "One World Ready or Not," that no nation had ever given up a manufacturing base without disastrous consequences - Spain, Holland and Great Britain - he was mocked by people like Paul Krugman for not having the proper mathematical models - only interviews, mere "journalism." (Kevin Phillips made similar points; where are you now Kevin?)
May we thank you all; we can only hope the Chinese treat us well, and I have my doubts after reading this.
This, not Mr. Trump's bombastic comments, should be the central discussion (and for the Clinton campaign too, since Bill rolled out the "red" carpet.) although I believe Mr. Trump is reaping, in an indirect way by targeting immigration, the anger that has risen over the decades of industrial decline here, and I include the black urban ghetto as part of that terrible process.
American citizens, the bottom 60% at least, should be angry. It's another variation on what the "best and brightest" brought us.
9
"The Cultural Revolution, beginning in 1966, unleashed a decade of violence and economic stagnation."
This is a misrepresentation of the facts. While the Cultural Revolution disrupted production in various areas and even saw a contraction of the economy in 1967 and 1968, overall economic growth was still very high by world standards with average GDP growth from 1966 to 1970 at 8.2%. GDP growth slowed to a still very respectable average of 4.7% from 1971 to 1976.
The Cultural Revolution is often criticized for disrupting education in China. It is true that the turmoil saw campuses closed and classes cancelled. But the proposition that it produced a "lost generation" is belied by the fact that it actually saw a dramatic expansion of access to education which had previously been a privilege reserved for a small minority of the population. Primary, secondary, and higher education were all expanded during this period.
The Cultural Revolution was experienced as very traumatic by those who benefited from the old arrangements. They have written many memoirs that sell very well in the US. But for the tens of millions of children of peasants and workers who gained access to higher education and who were lifted out of poverty and ignorance because of the new educational policies implemented in this period the effects were much more positive. Mobo Gao's book, "Gao Village" is a good introduction to the other side of the story.
This is a misrepresentation of the facts. While the Cultural Revolution disrupted production in various areas and even saw a contraction of the economy in 1967 and 1968, overall economic growth was still very high by world standards with average GDP growth from 1966 to 1970 at 8.2%. GDP growth slowed to a still very respectable average of 4.7% from 1971 to 1976.
The Cultural Revolution is often criticized for disrupting education in China. It is true that the turmoil saw campuses closed and classes cancelled. But the proposition that it produced a "lost generation" is belied by the fact that it actually saw a dramatic expansion of access to education which had previously been a privilege reserved for a small minority of the population. Primary, secondary, and higher education were all expanded during this period.
The Cultural Revolution was experienced as very traumatic by those who benefited from the old arrangements. They have written many memoirs that sell very well in the US. But for the tens of millions of children of peasants and workers who gained access to higher education and who were lifted out of poverty and ignorance because of the new educational policies implemented in this period the effects were much more positive. Mobo Gao's book, "Gao Village" is a good introduction to the other side of the story.
1
"The Cultural Revolution was experienced as very traumatic by those who benefited from the old arrangements."
I'm not sure where even to start in countering such obsequious propaganda, but perhaps a Wikipedia 101 primer could help you out:
"Millions of people were persecuted in the violent struggles that ensued across the country, and suffered a wide range of abuses including public humiliation, arbitrary imprisonment, torture, sustained harassment, and seizure of property."
I'm not sure where even to start in countering such obsequious propaganda, but perhaps a Wikipedia 101 primer could help you out:
"Millions of people were persecuted in the violent struggles that ensued across the country, and suffered a wide range of abuses including public humiliation, arbitrary imprisonment, torture, sustained harassment, and seizure of property."
2
the cultural revolution and great leap forward resulted in the deaths of millions, either by starvation or violence. Educators were, in the main, persecuted.
This is something you need to remember, Chris, before apologizing for Mao's degenerecy during this period.
This is something you need to remember, Chris, before apologizing for Mao's degenerecy during this period.
3
China's economy was mostly that of an underdeveloped third world country since the Opium Wars. Mao's Communist state simply did not create an industrialized economy, it remained mostly rural and underdeveloped right through the 1970's. To compare China's G.D.P. with any industrialized country until the 1990's was simply meaningless.
The Cultural Revolution was a crime against humanity characterized by a systematic indifference to the most basic rights of all human beings. It was the product of a state under a total dictator who believed that to achieve a Communist state, China must be kept in continuous Revolution, which consists in his mind of erasing all influences from the past, everything and by focusing upon certain ideal principles bring about a cultural transformation of true Communism. It lead to a systematic exclusion of every living person from all basic rights, so that even those who acted on behalf of Mao ended up believing that they were all alone in the world.
The Cultural Revolution was a crime against humanity characterized by a systematic indifference to the most basic rights of all human beings. It was the product of a state under a total dictator who believed that to achieve a Communist state, China must be kept in continuous Revolution, which consists in his mind of erasing all influences from the past, everything and by focusing upon certain ideal principles bring about a cultural transformation of true Communism. It lead to a systematic exclusion of every living person from all basic rights, so that even those who acted on behalf of Mao ended up believing that they were all alone in the world.
1
While we waste billions in the black hole that is the Middle East, China invests billions around the world. Guess who will profit the most?
23
Great Job to improve lives from other developing countries, China!
5
Militarily, China exerts its global influence by insisting on control over a few measly uninhabited islands in its immediate neighborhood. Versus the United States, which attacks, bombs, and occupies a huge nation of millions on the complete opposite side of the world. Won't that be the day when China REALLY emulates us !
8
Maybe you should ask the Philipinos, vietnamese, japanese and malaysians who they consider to be the greater threat, the US or China?
2
Hey Yoda, how about asking the Middle East, Latin America, who they fear, China's one carrier, or the US many fleets?
Realize that an annoyance over local fishing rights, is not the same as the fear that your town will be bombed over night in the name of the US National Security.
Realize that an annoyance over local fishing rights, is not the same as the fear that your town will be bombed over night in the name of the US National Security.
1
Edward Abbey thought he was describing Capitalism when he wrote, "Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of a cancer cell." However, communist China as adopted this ideology as well. Thus, the only war that really matters is the war that almost no one is talking about and which many deny, Man's war on the environment.
8
Access to the vast mineral riches in Afghanistan are undoubtedly part of China’s long-range planning. With China’s railway now extended as far west as Kashi, we should expect they would undertake the challenging task of engineering and constructing a rail and road link through the mountains to adjacent, landlocked Afghanistan.
3
don't worry, when the Taliban (or some sort of similar stooges) once again govern Afganistan after the US leaves these Chinese investments will become worthless.
The ability to engineer and manufacture in one's own home country has been the recipe for national strength around the world. To our own detriment, we examine these kinds of events in monetary terms only, thus allowing the oligarchs to profit at the nation's and working class expense.
So now we wonder why the collapse in commodity prices. China, as this article has demonstrated, has made their own commodity agreements bilaterally with countries like Ecuador and purchases fewer commodities and oil through conventional energy markets.
And when the yuan becomes a reserve currency, one can make a pretty good guess which currencies will rise or fall based mainly on net export. Commodities, interest rates will skyrocket. equity markets collapse in the West, including the U.S. but hey, we've got Facebook and cellphones.
So now we wonder why the collapse in commodity prices. China, as this article has demonstrated, has made their own commodity agreements bilaterally with countries like Ecuador and purchases fewer commodities and oil through conventional energy markets.
And when the yuan becomes a reserve currency, one can make a pretty good guess which currencies will rise or fall based mainly on net export. Commodities, interest rates will skyrocket. equity markets collapse in the West, including the U.S. but hey, we've got Facebook and cellphones.
62
tennvol30736,
yes, your logic explains well why the Chinese stock market has been crashing the past few months.
yes, your logic explains well why the Chinese stock market has been crashing the past few months.
They did. And their country did not go on a recession, and their economy will not take years to recover. In fact, they are well on their way to make up the lost ground, and just in a few weeks.
If any market in the west had taken a blood bath like China did, we'd be talking about the end of the world as we know it. For them, it was a crash, followed immediately by a boom.
China is here to stay, whether you approve or not.
If any market in the west had taken a blood bath like China did, we'd be talking about the end of the world as we know it. For them, it was a crash, followed immediately by a boom.
China is here to stay, whether you approve or not.
2
What you describe cannot and will not happen overnight. China remains a developing nation with its own internal troubles and the last thing it wants is a rising yuan destroying its export market and economy.
And yeah, we have FB and cellphones, and so do the Chinese. What we do not have, unlike the Chinese, is a government that understands why infrastructure investment is key to the future. Americans used to understand this, but evidently we forgot.
And yeah, we have FB and cellphones, and so do the Chinese. What we do not have, unlike the Chinese, is a government that understands why infrastructure investment is key to the future. Americans used to understand this, but evidently we forgot.
".....China’s Global Ambitions, With Loans and Strings Attached...."
NYT, are you aware of what you print? How is this different from what the USA has been doing in Latin America for the last 120 years?
You cannot claim the monopoly of imperialism. I mean, you can try and claim it, but it does not mean that others need to go along with it, if they can help it.
NYT, are you aware of what you print? How is this different from what the USA has been doing in Latin America for the last 120 years?
You cannot claim the monopoly of imperialism. I mean, you can try and claim it, but it does not mean that others need to go along with it, if they can help it.
18
This is what America gets for their shortsightedness. China has been making friends while we fiddle away. It is like this Rome is burning. Wake up Americans one day we are going to wake up to a new man in charge and it won't be us at all.
6
"China has been making friends while we fiddle away."
how many of these 3rd world autocrats like Mugabe do you mean? What will happen to Chinese relations with these nations after these autocrats, proped up by China, collapse. Do you suppose by any chance their peoples will not blame China to a large degree (in the same way that Iranians blamed the US for the Shah, for example)?
how many of these 3rd world autocrats like Mugabe do you mean? What will happen to Chinese relations with these nations after these autocrats, proped up by China, collapse. Do you suppose by any chance their peoples will not blame China to a large degree (in the same way that Iranians blamed the US for the Shah, for example)?
China has been building schools in the Caribbean; we could have done that, but we never did. We are watching an ancient mercantile culture operate with money, not guns. We are still operating with guns, e.g. Iraq. And, we didn't even get control over the oil fields. We did destroy infrastructure and allow looting of ancient artifacts from Iraq's museums, said artifacts are now being sold on the black market all over the world. But, didn't Rumsfeld, the military genius say that "stuff happens". It does.
The US gets the fighting,
europe get the refugees,
china the resources.
europe get the refugees,
china the resources.
25
Amazing reporting.
What goes deeper, is that this is the China-Ecuador experience. Then there is the China-(insert country here) that is happening in many other countries just now, at the same time. Wonder if we could get a list of their ongoing projects all over.
And China asking countries to pay with natural resources? Well, what else do those countries have? If they had cash, they would be paying with cash, they don’t so they pay with resources. This is nothing new.
Yes the rates might be steep, but I am sure the countries that signed up, saw a better deal than the IMF, World Bank, or US or European banks. There was something in the China proposal that had more benefits than dealing with the West. It would be interesting to know what that was.
As far as workers not mingling. Same with foreign workers abroad, they keep to themselves, and rarely mix in. It could be Chinese or US or Europeans, same story. As far as drunken people shoving other drunks, ok tell me what is new about that?
Saddens me to know that not too long ago, it could have read USA instead of China.
It could have been us. It used to be us.
What goes deeper, is that this is the China-Ecuador experience. Then there is the China-(insert country here) that is happening in many other countries just now, at the same time. Wonder if we could get a list of their ongoing projects all over.
And China asking countries to pay with natural resources? Well, what else do those countries have? If they had cash, they would be paying with cash, they don’t so they pay with resources. This is nothing new.
Yes the rates might be steep, but I am sure the countries that signed up, saw a better deal than the IMF, World Bank, or US or European banks. There was something in the China proposal that had more benefits than dealing with the West. It would be interesting to know what that was.
As far as workers not mingling. Same with foreign workers abroad, they keep to themselves, and rarely mix in. It could be Chinese or US or Europeans, same story. As far as drunken people shoving other drunks, ok tell me what is new about that?
Saddens me to know that not too long ago, it could have read USA instead of China.
It could have been us. It used to be us.
13
It's called Global Hegemony, something the US fully mastered over the past 50 years along with the art of economic warfare. We wrote the book on how to conquer a developing country without firing a bullet a long time ago and China is doing nothing more than following our lead by granting loans that are set up to default. The ruling class in the country gets paid, the lending country loses money on the default but gains ownership of the country's natural resources.
You may be a big fan of that imperialistic behavior but I am not. What goes around comes around.
You may be a big fan of that imperialistic behavior but I am not. What goes around comes around.
2
The Chinese are only interested in doing what is best for the Chinese without regard or respect for the environment or the people they encounter along the way. They are not going to make the world a better place.
8
So unlike the US. In China, they run roughshod over the environment and they eat dogs. We run roughshod over other countries with tanks, drones and bombs. And our "Justice" system treats our citizens like dogs(actually, if you tried some of that stuff with dogs you'd be arrested). So, yes, we try to limit the suffering that we inflict to humans as much as possible.
1
Cannot comment on culture. Most of the countries as stated are politically unstable and corruption already exists. Chinese firms thrive on this so my opinion is there will be no improvement in ordinary people's living standards. You will see a lot of wealth for a few.
1
China is a growing power and is starting to feel its mite. Some think China wants Australia. Have your children learn Chinese.
China is exerting it's power to gain more control of the South China Sea and it's neighbors who rely on that body of water for it's livelihood and conduct of commerce.
The above 25 minute interview was by Munk Debates with Robert D. Kaplan, author of several books on foreign affairs discusses the future of this region....
http://lstrn.us/1g9ppE3
China is exerting it's power to gain more control of the South China Sea and it's neighbors who rely on that body of water for it's livelihood and conduct of commerce.
The above 25 minute interview was by Munk Debates with Robert D. Kaplan, author of several books on foreign affairs discusses the future of this region....
http://lstrn.us/1g9ppE3
1
Before getting all enoumered with China. They do deserve respect in turning our financial rules on us but hold up.
They are as human as we are.
Gambling. Whether it is the stock market or FIFA soccer just can't get away from trying to rig the outcome.
They are as human as we are.
Gambling. Whether it is the stock market or FIFA soccer just can't get away from trying to rig the outcome.
Two different models are in competition. American
model is based on militaty might backed with the
slogan of democracy and human rights. We are even
ready to go to war on a disputed rock in the sea.China
on the other hand is using investment and finance to
win influence without firing a shot. Our business model
has failed for most Americans and most of the world.Not
only it enriches a small segment of the population and
uses the rest to serve their interest but it is also used
as a tool of foreign policy to block investment and trade
making others wary of doing business with USA.
Foreigners are not too impressed with America's
human rights records with much publicized cases of
police brutality with blacks, torture at Gitmo and
Abu Gharaib prisions. It gives us no advantage over
China. The world is in favor of peace and prosperity
and invasion and bombings are unlikely to win hearts
and minds. We need to rethink our strategy by not
only de-emphasizing military action but curbing gun
violence at home,reduce political corruption and
inequality otherwise we will end up like Rome, Britain
and France.
model is based on militaty might backed with the
slogan of democracy and human rights. We are even
ready to go to war on a disputed rock in the sea.China
on the other hand is using investment and finance to
win influence without firing a shot. Our business model
has failed for most Americans and most of the world.Not
only it enriches a small segment of the population and
uses the rest to serve their interest but it is also used
as a tool of foreign policy to block investment and trade
making others wary of doing business with USA.
Foreigners are not too impressed with America's
human rights records with much publicized cases of
police brutality with blacks, torture at Gitmo and
Abu Gharaib prisions. It gives us no advantage over
China. The world is in favor of peace and prosperity
and invasion and bombings are unlikely to win hearts
and minds. We need to rethink our strategy by not
only de-emphasizing military action but curbing gun
violence at home,reduce political corruption and
inequality otherwise we will end up like Rome, Britain
and France.
13
Excellent comment and your points are well received. I would like to agree with your assessment and regarding the behavior of the Unites States. However I believe you are dangerously misinformed if you believe that China will behave differently or better. In fact I suspect they will behave much worse because they have no checks and balances what so ever in their government to prevent unethical practices and imperialism is practiced without restraint or regard for human or environmental welfare. Certainly, a lot of the United States laws that were once a shining beacon for the word to see have been eroded by decades of runaway corporate lobbying and extortion, but at least we have the inherent principals and rule of law to provide a platform for change. China needs to be stopped, and we need to clean up our act and become the country the rest of the world would PREFER to do business with. That point we can agree on.
1
China is nothing to admire, respect or look up to. It's who our politicians have been selling us down to the river to for the past 40 years now. They are no friend of the planet or humanity. They have no respect or regard for safe environmental practices, will happily build and destroy anything on the planet to make a nickel and are even more imperialistic than America if anyone can believe that is possible.
They have no standards for ethical treatment of humans or animals and will sell or do business with anyone on the planet regardless of their record of abuse. Once they have a powerful military it's over. We need to go to war now and put an end to them while we can.
They have no standards for ethical treatment of humans or animals and will sell or do business with anyone on the planet regardless of their record of abuse. Once they have a powerful military it's over. We need to go to war now and put an end to them while we can.
1
While I'm not war hawk, it's true that this is our last chance to put China down. Our military and nuclear arsenal is by far the largest but won't be for many more years.
O.K., a wee bit over the top.
May I remind you who built the original railway lines over North America?
Those tunnels in Moose Jaw Saskatchewan where a notorious Chicago gangster kept his hooch during prohibition were built by the Chinese. They finally became Canadian citizens after sacrificing their sons in World War One but that is going back to far.
Guess I am saying, no society needs to be smoked. Its been tried.
May I remind you who built the original railway lines over North America?
Those tunnels in Moose Jaw Saskatchewan where a notorious Chicago gangster kept his hooch during prohibition were built by the Chinese. They finally became Canadian citizens after sacrificing their sons in World War One but that is going back to far.
Guess I am saying, no society needs to be smoked. Its been tried.
'We need to go to war now and put an end to them while we can.'
How about NO!!!!!!!!!!
How about NO!!!!!!!!!!
Oh oh. Watch out for our politicians, especially Republicans. They're try to create cold war between us and China.
China is employing the same strategy the United States has used for decades. Expanding their influence economically in regions where if and when necessary they may put a choke hold on the United States and her allies. This should not come as a surprise to anyone. Too be in their sphere of influence countries subject themselves economic dominance. China takes the long view seriously while developed western nations including the United States focus on the near term bottom line. China owns the emerging markets and will tolerate the market volatility as the cost of gaining world dominance. This was similar to the strategy employed by the former USSR which spent itself politically and militarily to the point of collapse. Is the United states next?
1
>
You should stop being surprised about anything China does, they will dominate the world soon just due to their size. They will be bigger and better at just about everything. America will answer to a stronger power, and that is going to be a tough one for many to swallow. It does not end like you thought it would now did it?
It is called cunning reason.
You should stop being surprised about anything China does, they will dominate the world soon just due to their size. They will be bigger and better at just about everything. America will answer to a stronger power, and that is going to be a tough one for many to swallow. It does not end like you thought it would now did it?
It is called cunning reason.
2
or the economic bubble in their nation could burst and they will be in far worse shape! With respect to the future, one can never know. But that bubble really looks like it is going to pop.
I think you mean the "cunning of history." Don't worry, it applies to China, too.
Don't forget the $1.5 TRILLION that China has loaned (invested) in USA
6
if the US people were not so addicted to credit cards and the govt actually raised taxes so as not to borrow this would not be the case.
I have visited China to oversee the manufacturing operations of the company I work for. I cannot tell you how happy I was to be home to breath clean air. This is a place where you can look directly at the sun due to the pollution and won't see blue sky for weeks. The water-ways were polluted as well. All because we want to enrich ourselves by an increased profit margin. It's sad really. With such a huge problem looming it can feel hopeless at times; this is when I realize that I can be part of the problem, or part of the solution and that choice starts with me. I won't buy Chinese manufactured goods.
5
oh yes, you will.
China has improved upon the 20th Century model of imperialism by rebranding it as kindler and gentler. Chinese firms are focused on extracting as much natural resources including fossil fuels and minerals, especially rare types needed for high technology manufacturing, from third world countries. They offer many incentives including improved infrastructure, good jobs and cultural exchange opportunities for the government officials and managers from the courted countries including free trips to China with free lodging at five star hotels and the finest wining and dining opportunities to woo their foreign counterparts. What is admirable is that China respects the foreign countries enough not to interfere in domestic affairs although is still guilty of creating environmental devastation which could interrupt the lives of many in Africa and South America for decades to come. While building large scale projects they damage the delicate ecosystems in which village people have lived in harmony for many centuries. How are the majority of people in Sudan, Iraq, Ecuador, etc. benefiting from the exploitation of resources slowly being extricated from their nation? If these countries are like the US, the majority of people are being left behind while the 1 percent enjoy the fruits of foreign investment. The US will eventually be next in the Chinese investment of infrastructure that Congress refuses to fund as they are so busy creating new tax loopholes for billion/millionaires.
8
Very well said Carla, but I have to say we have different views on this " What is admirable is that China respects the foreign countries enough not to interfere in domestic affairs although is still guilty of creating environmental devastation which could interrupt the lives of many in Africa and South America for decades to come.".
China may well be staying out of domestic affairs FOR NOW while the loans are being repaid and business is good, but lets reserve judgement for the day that the country can't make good on those loans. Let's see if the result is similar to the Argentina collapse in the 2000's due to the hostile take over by the IMF when we repossessed their key infrastructure for defaulting.
Also of note, it's not necessarily a good thing to completely stay out of their domestic affairs when you do business with countries rife with human trafficking and slavery, environmental abuses and poor internal government infrastructure. We will agree that the US has NOT done a very good job managing that level and method of intervention in the past, but China is much likely to behave very much the same once the terms are not met.
China may well be staying out of domestic affairs FOR NOW while the loans are being repaid and business is good, but lets reserve judgement for the day that the country can't make good on those loans. Let's see if the result is similar to the Argentina collapse in the 2000's due to the hostile take over by the IMF when we repossessed their key infrastructure for defaulting.
Also of note, it's not necessarily a good thing to completely stay out of their domestic affairs when you do business with countries rife with human trafficking and slavery, environmental abuses and poor internal government infrastructure. We will agree that the US has NOT done a very good job managing that level and method of intervention in the past, but China is much likely to behave very much the same once the terms are not met.
This article offers a capsule account of the first decades following the Chinese Revolution that is rich with misconceptions:
"While China made some economic progress under Mao Zedong, his policies left the country turbulent and isolated."
China didn't just make "some progress" under Mao. It went from being the poorest country in the world with an average standard of living on par with Ethiopia plagued by famine to a steadily industrializing country with a highly educated workforce. It was the most dramatic improvement in living conditions, in both absolute and relative terms, anywhere in human history.
"Famine killed tens of millions starting in the late 1950s."
China was plagued by famine for over a century before the revolution. Following the revolution agrarian reform dramatically improved food access and increased lifespans. For two years following the Great Leap Forward this trend was reversed. But mortality rates never rose to the pre-revolutionary rates and were considerably lower than neighboring India which. The claim that "tens of millions" died of famine rests on very dubious statistical methods. (See: http://monthlyreview.org/commentary/did-mao-really-kill-millions-in-the-... )
"While China made some economic progress under Mao Zedong, his policies left the country turbulent and isolated."
China didn't just make "some progress" under Mao. It went from being the poorest country in the world with an average standard of living on par with Ethiopia plagued by famine to a steadily industrializing country with a highly educated workforce. It was the most dramatic improvement in living conditions, in both absolute and relative terms, anywhere in human history.
"Famine killed tens of millions starting in the late 1950s."
China was plagued by famine for over a century before the revolution. Following the revolution agrarian reform dramatically improved food access and increased lifespans. For two years following the Great Leap Forward this trend was reversed. But mortality rates never rose to the pre-revolutionary rates and were considerably lower than neighboring India which. The claim that "tens of millions" died of famine rests on very dubious statistical methods. (See: http://monthlyreview.org/commentary/did-mao-really-kill-millions-in-the-... )
Chris, the famines and violence during the great leap forward and cultural revolution were not some natural event. They were policy induced. Policies by Mao and the Party. Policies that resulted in the deaths of tens of millions. You need to stop apologizing for these crimes against humanity.
"Other countries use so much of their tax revenue to improve the people’s lives." I can see this quote earning it's place here.
Give it enough time. China and all its good people will eventually land in the world of the Shias, Sunnis and Shiites and their dreams of a reasonable world order will drown to.
And you just know there is going to be one Chinese General who will say they can take what looks like a moons scape Afghanistan - no problem. Therefore starting their demise.
And you just know there is going to be one Chinese General who will say they can take what looks like a moons scape Afghanistan - no problem. Therefore starting their demise.
>
The U.S. is currently doing and has done the same.
The U.S. is currently doing and has done the same.
1
America has been hoist on its own petard. A pox on all our houses.
1
...and we could have a conversation about where all the money they are using came from, but that's water over our transom, isn't it? Our great country is the greatest enabler of all sorts of things that threaten us in all sorts of ways. From random shootings of our citizens to random sectarian and religious wars both domestic and worldwide, to needless environmental destruction to - well now - to China hegemony. We have great freedoms and are at liberty to do many things. Unfortunately, our notions of freedom and liberty result in a considerable amount of death and destruction, including very self destructive activities. What we have accomplished is the freedom to be outrageously stupid and the liberty to dance with death (dragging others into the pit with us) any old time. Is this a great country, or what?
2
China earns more than it spends and invests the profits to secure its future.
America spends more than it earns on losing wars against poverty, drugs, ignorance, and middle eastern love of servitude while borrowing against its children.
How do you think that is going to work out?
America spends more than it earns on losing wars against poverty, drugs, ignorance, and middle eastern love of servitude while borrowing against its children.
How do you think that is going to work out?
21
the Chinese know how to deal with some of these problems. The penalty for drug dealing, for example, is death. The penalty for drug use long-term incarceration. Are you saying the US can learn from these policies?
This is what the US did too in its rise to power in the 20th century. Lots of this kind of stuff in Latin America (with Gunboat diplomacy) in the early years of the 20th century too. And with money, investment, competition against Britain in those earlier days of the century, until the Depression Then changes of model and even more global reach.
Same history, different players. Those are the rules by which capitalism, global capitalism now, plays. We, them. Nasty games with surplus capital. No double standards, please.
Same history, different players. Those are the rules by which capitalism, global capitalism now, plays. We, them. Nasty games with surplus capital. No double standards, please.
so much for "saving the rainforest" ... or anything else on the planet. this will not end well for the environment.
2
I don't care for the fear-mongering tone of this article, with its constant "The West is fading into obsolescence!" alarmist rhetoric, so common to NYTimes China coverage, and for me, the article doesn't really begin until it shifts to a focused discussion on the binding, quasi-legal rules China hands down from on high, sitting on the trillions it has made inundating the USA with cheap exports, raising our purchasing power while indirectly lowering our wages and general standards of living (cheap thermoses, shirts, and keyboards does not immediately equate to prosperity or happiness, especially with widening inequality and the social dysmonia that generates).
I am sure we will see articles in a few years time on the break-down of these infrastructure projects, and many if not most of these nations will be no better off, but will have forfeited much of their resource wealth to Chinese loan sharks.
I am sure we will see articles in a few years time on the break-down of these infrastructure projects, and many if not most of these nations will be no better off, but will have forfeited much of their resource wealth to Chinese loan sharks.
1
I think that Chinese investment in third world countries will do little to change the culture and economy of those countries. First of all, when the Chinese take on a construction project, they bring with them their own workers and engineers who live in camps that employ their own cooks. They also bring with them the equipment needed as well as the cement and other construction materials. To summarize, the teams stick to themselves and do little to stimulate the local economy. Where they do make a difference is that the loans usually have stings attached that require engaging the Chinese. For example in the Pacific the construction of a new docking facility may require rights for Chinese fishing fleets, or guaranteed sale of tuna to China, or some other advantage. The Chinese have been playing this game for awhile and unfortunately someday we will wake up and find most of the world is owned or controlled by China.
1
For all of you wishing the U.S. dump Puerto Rico, they should, China would gladly take over! lol
1
In the same manner that most colonialists do: exploiting natural resources and labor, polluting the environment, and buying off politicians. Nothing new in this playbook.
1
The investor class that runs the US decided over 40 years ago to cash out of the US and put their money and technoligy where it would produce the highest return for them, which turned out to be East Asia and, since the 90s China, China, China. So the manufacturing base, including technical know-how and supply chain was transferred to China, lock stock and barrel. The result? Well, the said investors certainly got rich, while everyone else here paid the price, in a shrunken middle class, starved public services and infrastructure, and the Chinese e
10
Yes, China is a super power and acting like one. They have long term interests and goals to pursue, as do we. Get used to the idea, America, and quickly.
So they should retain the status of a developing country and play by their own set of rules? I'm not getting used to anything, I want war while we can still win it.
"I want war while we can still win it."
The US is a liberterian nation where the "individual" not society reigns supreme. Such a society could not even win, in the long term in Iraq or Afganistan, as not enough people "volunteered". COnsidering this, why would you think enough people would volunter to fight China, a nation of with 60X the population of Iraq and Afganistan?
The US is a liberterian nation where the "individual" not society reigns supreme. Such a society could not even win, in the long term in Iraq or Afganistan, as not enough people "volunteered". COnsidering this, why would you think enough people would volunter to fight China, a nation of with 60X the population of Iraq and Afganistan?
Wanting war and a policy of containment only validates China's fear and suspicion of us. We must -- and will -- find a better way.
While we pour trillions on military misadventures and the war on drugs, the Chinese invest in global partnership, leverage and influence.
60
You are so correct....while the US was flushing hundreds of billions and more into misguided ventures in Iraq (and belatedly Afghanistan) China was investing in a growth strategy...Foreign Aid (that not carried in the Defense Dept. Budget) is about 1% of the US budget and you still hear people say we send too much money overseas....America seems to have a really bad case of ADHD....Ritalin and Adderal won't help us but some leadership (from either party) would be a plus
For the past 70 years, American or European investment in the developing countries of Africa, Latin America and the Middle East have been denounced widely as "neo-colonialism" and "imperislism." Tons of ink has been spilled by journals (including the Times) investigating and exposing the various supposedly nefarious results of US-based companies "exploiting" the people and resources of places like Ecuador and Zimbabwe. Two generations of leftists of various stripes have grown old shouting slogans like "Yanqui go home" and demonstrating solidarity with "anti-imperialist" politicians and rebels. Now, it turns out that developing countries simply need foreign investment capital -- to develop.
3
"While China has been important to the world economy for decades, the country is now wielding its financial heft with the confidence and purpose of a global superpower."
Meanwhile, our Congress and state legislatures fritter away advantage after advantage, chip away at our physical and educational infrastructure, and spend their days repeatedly re-litigating the culture wars and focusing on mindless trivialities. Utterly stupid. Nero may or may not have fiddled while Rome burned, but there is really no question about what our political class is doing as the U.S. slowly gives ground to China and others.
Meanwhile, our Congress and state legislatures fritter away advantage after advantage, chip away at our physical and educational infrastructure, and spend their days repeatedly re-litigating the culture wars and focusing on mindless trivialities. Utterly stupid. Nero may or may not have fiddled while Rome burned, but there is really no question about what our political class is doing as the U.S. slowly gives ground to China and others.
17
Politicians are elected by the majority which in this case is the lowest common denominator. So what does one expect? The electorate is far too preoccupied to be concerned about governance. They might miss the next episode of Duck Dynasty.
I'm not the brightest bulb on the tree but, when all of our corporations have gone to China to farm the cheapest labor for these last 30 years, (we make very little here anymore), we have empowered them, they have lots of money they can spend, we on the other hand have a dwindling tax base, where the corporations that have made money off of this scheme, can hide there monies off shore, and now with this horrible "Citizen United" ruling can buy our nutty politicians, and try and make us all believe that this whole crazy mess of a nation is because of social benefits, immigrants, and our dysfunctional government that doesn't work (but it used to!) When in reality it's the corporations stupid! If we don't like these results we only have ourselves to blame!! Very sad indeed!!
4
I think China will change the economy, but not the culture, of its investing partners. They may become dependent on Chinese investment. However, I don't see many of them aspiring to adopt China's form of government. I don't see their people deciding to emigrate to China. This is contrast to the US, where our democracy has, at least in the past, been something to which citizens in our investing-partner countries aspire.
2
Hopefully, President Obama will review this insightful article as he embarks on his visit to Kenya. The facts are stark: China's investment in sub-Sahara Africa has come at a terrible price to endangered wildlife, in particular elephants and rhinos. According to Julius Kipng’etich, director of the Kenya Wildlife Service (KWS), "the growing appetite for ivory in Asia, coupled with the increasing influence of China in countries across central and southern parts of Africa, has led to more elephants being killed for their ivory tusks. Ninety percent of all the people who pass through our airports and are apprehended with illegal wildlife trophies are Chinese."
In addition to the being the main driver of demand for ivory, China's infrastructure investments, and the attendant influx of Chines workers, is tied directly to the destruction of wildlife and natural habitat. As Alex Shoumatoff reported in Vanity Fair, "There had been almost no poaching around Amboseli for 30 years before a Chinese company got the contract to build a 70-mile-long highway just above the park. Since the road crews arrived, in 2009, four of Amboseli’s magnificent big-tusked bulls have been killed, and the latest word is that the poachers are now going after the matriarchs—a social and genetic disaster, because elephants live in matriarchies, and removing the best breeders of both sexes from the gene pool could funnel the Amboseli population into what is known as an “extinction vortex.”
In addition to the being the main driver of demand for ivory, China's infrastructure investments, and the attendant influx of Chines workers, is tied directly to the destruction of wildlife and natural habitat. As Alex Shoumatoff reported in Vanity Fair, "There had been almost no poaching around Amboseli for 30 years before a Chinese company got the contract to build a 70-mile-long highway just above the park. Since the road crews arrived, in 2009, four of Amboseli’s magnificent big-tusked bulls have been killed, and the latest word is that the poachers are now going after the matriarchs—a social and genetic disaster, because elephants live in matriarchies, and removing the best breeders of both sexes from the gene pool could funnel the Amboseli population into what is known as an “extinction vortex.”
3
I wish this comment by Dennis was a Times pick, as it needs to be widely seen and understood. Along with destroying wildlife, China, literally, is destroying the nature that sustains life on this planet.
1
Thanks Mr Magoo. I was in the Tsavo region of Kenya last year for a long walking safari that was breathtakingly beautiful and sad. 96 elephants are killed EACH DAY (source https://www.96elephants.org/) and the rhino is all but gone. Studies by leading elephant scientists such as Dr. Joyce Poole, Dr. Dame Daphne Sheldrick and G.A Bradshaw prove that mass poaching of key family members, especially matriarchs and old bulls, can cause irreversible harm to an elephant herd (females breed only every 5-10 years due to their gestation period of 24 months and the 3-5 years needed to wean and raise a calf). African leaders have shown little interest in addressing these challenges. Hopefully, they wake up, before it's too late.
a great article. everything you need to know about something you know little or nothing about in one sitting. the 7.25 interest seems steep. anything over 5% in a government loan would seem to be predatory in today's world. On oil, China is the beggar. An easy way around this for both China and the U.S. is to take saving the planet seriously (And Now, when it matters the most) and switch to renewables, especially solar. Investment here is mostly people--energy from the sun is free--and China and the U.S. have the engineers and scientists to make this happen. It just takes a little political will along with full recognition of the problem.
2
China is competing as a natin state.
The US aint.
So? Actions have consequences, inactions too. Empire as clueless narcissism is so fun.
It is like the republicans vs. the democrats in the US. One competes ferociously without a shred of decency or principle, the other talks and evades competition in favor of blather and gaming the system to avoid direct competition.
Want the fruit of competition? Shut up and compete.
The US aint.
So? Actions have consequences, inactions too. Empire as clueless narcissism is so fun.
It is like the republicans vs. the democrats in the US. One competes ferociously without a shred of decency or principle, the other talks and evades competition in favor of blather and gaming the system to avoid direct competition.
Want the fruit of competition? Shut up and compete.
3
American supremacy in military has to be matched with american supremacy economically. Somehow we lost that balance. Global peace has its downside. It puts increased emphasis on economic supremacy and our elected leaders don't seem to understand that well. It can start with corporate tax reform to bring back American profits stashed abroad. I am all in favor of reducing corporate tax to almost zero and balance it with dividend tax and capital gains tax. Redefine long term capital gains to mean 10 years or more to grant a reduced rate of 10%. On the spending side, we don't need to be a global policeman using our money. Time to cut unwanted military overseas spending and use it for educating and retraining our workforce.
7
Debt slavery as an imperial tool! China *has* been learning from the West!
9
I'm surprised nobody picked up the risk of the resource huger policy that China is pursuing in foreign investment. With a drastic slow down in population growth, resources can be the last problem the world will have in the next 100 years. Those investments by China could well be terrible when the cost of resources tanks.
Well maybe economics is not in the minds of NYT readers, just ideologies.
Well maybe economics is not in the minds of NYT readers, just ideologies.
2
What drastic slow down in population growth are you talking about sir/madam? Even if the rate of reproduction of China (and India, among others) declines below "population maintenance" numbers, there are still over a billion people each in China and India, tens or hundreds of millions more in numerous other Asian countries (Pakistan, Indonesia, Thailand, Philippines, Korea, Bangladesh, Japan, etc.). There are billions more living elsewhere in the world too. It'll be a long, long time before "the cost of resources" will tank. As a matter of fact, I'd bet on us humans making the planet unlivable or borderline unlivable long before the human populations decline to sustainable levels.
My take-away from the graphic is an enterprising entity could destroy China with the sweep of a hand if they had a mind to do so. So much of what China has chosen as an investment is risky and large.
Interesting article.
Interesting article.
15
The economic development projects initiated by China in exchange for resources make more sense for Latin American countries. This is a far superior way of exerting international influence than that of United States in the last centuries. US had use her military might and covert operations for most countries in Latin America - Guatemala, Dominican Republic, Brazil , Chile, Argentina, Nicaragua, Venezuela, Bolivia, Granada and etc.
3
Can we see a comparative map of our "Global Ambitions, With Loans and Strings Attached"?
10
The culture of the countries that China is investing will change everything; including, their political influence, way of thinking, bilateral relations, tourism and even dependence. The Chinese know what they are doing; first they gaining, trust and admiration, contrary at what the United States with their arrogance and narrow minded thinking of some leaders who they are ruling out to this small and undeveloped countries having them as allies for a long haul. They may be small today, but with the help of Chinese will become a powerful nations who will play a big role in the world sooner than later.
3
This is how you conquer the world without gun or bombs, We are being left out of the future. Its good to be older so Ill get the miss the collapse of the United States.
13
Those guns and bombs didn't do much good in Iraq, Afghanistan nor Vietnam. Maybe we need to look around and see what works.
1
China is cleaning our clock economically while Obama capitulates on one sided nuclear agreements with Iran. This is the same China that Obama allows by treaty to continue polluting more and more each year until 2030, while the United States is obligated to cut emissions annually. In short order China will be the leading economic power on the planet, and the U.S will be left in the dust thanks to our feckless president.
2
Economic growth in China was happening long before Obama came into office.
Every decade since I was a boy in the 1950s, new forms of xenophobic worries fill articles such as this one about the new foreign competitor who is eating our lunch, and laughing in our faces. And every one of these foreign menaces has turned out to be paper tigers which vanish once their economies head south. In the 1950s, it was the Soviets who were encroaching with their space program. In the 1960s, it was the Vietnamese domino which occupied our concern if it fell to the Communists. In the 1970s, it was the Saudis, who owned all the oil and caused two oil crises which raised prices and concerns about our independence. In the 1980s, it was a booming Japan, buying all our prized real estate. In the 1990s, it was the specter of a free Russia becoming a mighty capitalist rival, and in the 00's, it was the rise of the Chinese superpower.
Ten years from now, when the Chinese economy has ground to a halt, and many of its foreign investments have soured, we will invent another foreign colossus which is about to devour us. Let's guess: Indonesia!
7
As they say in law, past performance is no guarantee or indicator of future performance. Complacency and arrogance has been the downfall of many an empire.
2
Just wondering if you ever lived (not just read about) under Soviet, Russian, any Communist system, ISIS, etc. ruling at all. If not, try it (you have plenty to choose from in this world) and then talk, my friend! This applies to all those that comment without having the slightest clue about what they are talking about. Live it for at least 5 years, feel it in your body and soul, and then if you still enjoy it, go and live there forever, leaving people that want to have values and ethical standards, respect for nature and other people, live separately...
2
However, this threat is very serious! Buy gold and guns and run for the hills!
China's expenditures in Afghanistan will yield benefits for the Chinese people for decades. The US spending there makes enemies and gives Americans nothing more than pictures of rusty tanks.
48
China is doing business with many countries and is not at war with any country. How could this possibly work? We are at war with several countries and in a trade deficit other countries. This must be the way to go or we would not be doing it. Right?
21
Apples and oranges. China's at war with their own people every day by strong-arming and suppressing human rights and grass-roots organizations. They also have slave labor using prisoners (who let's face it, could be guilty of anything from daring to suggest regime change to theft) for their labor. So can we please avoid reductive comparisons?
9
What will we do when China puts a military base there to protect its interest? Will we still be focusing on what our gender is,battling healthcare, discussing trumps hair? As a commenter noted, we don't understand how bad things are thus we fail to focus on what we really need to do.
7
I don't mind your expected tilt in history by implying Spratly Islands belong to Philippines, but at least get the geography right. Spratly Islands are located North not south of Philippines, just to avoid using South China Sea. You also blame China for the high interest rate charged without telling us what is the rate, and what Wall Street consider prudent rate, meanwhile you are implying China was making risky loans with doubtful return which Wall Street will not do, which contradict your original premise. At the end of the article you did mention a 2 years loan for 7.25% which is pretty in line with normal business practice, certainly not the pay day loan in U.S. which is really usury.
3
'Tilt in history'?.. who are you kidding. The Spratlys are squarely in philippine EEZ and have been part of their economy/culture for millennia. The Chinese activities there are piracy defined.
Don't worry, however. Obama is just the man to do absolutely nothing about this clear act of war by the chinese government.
Don't worry, however. Obama is just the man to do absolutely nothing about this clear act of war by the chinese government.
1
I agree the article lacks crucial data, but the basic point is correct. What the article should have said is that China loans at commercial interest rates for these huge projects and pretends it is assisting these countries. In reality, Its practices differ significantly from OECD standards for economic aid, which stipulate concessional lending at lower interest rates, sometimes with grace periods and long payouts. Moreover, their projects in developing countries often require importing Chinese labor to build them, rather than providing jobs to local workers in places with high unemployment.
Beijing had become the environmental bull in a China shop. In Costa Rica, they persuaded RECOPE, the national public monopoly for importation and wholesaling of petroleum products, to want a high cost refinery with a guaranteed annual return of 18% to the Chinese company, which at least one study said was unlikely, requiring consumers to make up the difference. The project runs counter to Costa Rica's highly praised environmental policy, which aims for carbon neutral, early 2020s. There is considerable opposition in Costa Rica but this white elephant hasn't been killed, yet.
Throughout the developing world, China appears to imitate America's early 1900s"dollar diplomacy" towards Latin America, which caused great resentment there. Apparently, nobody learns from others' mistakes.
Beijing had become the environmental bull in a China shop. In Costa Rica, they persuaded RECOPE, the national public monopoly for importation and wholesaling of petroleum products, to want a high cost refinery with a guaranteed annual return of 18% to the Chinese company, which at least one study said was unlikely, requiring consumers to make up the difference. The project runs counter to Costa Rica's highly praised environmental policy, which aims for carbon neutral, early 2020s. There is considerable opposition in Costa Rica but this white elephant hasn't been killed, yet.
Throughout the developing world, China appears to imitate America's early 1900s"dollar diplomacy" towards Latin America, which caused great resentment there. Apparently, nobody learns from others' mistakes.
China vs the US is the classic ant and the grasshopper story. I'd like to see the chart showing Chinese investment/ownership, including treasuries, in the US. China works while we fiddle. Time to encourage your kiddies to learn the language.
13
Sorry but you have it backwards. Any Chinese national with resources send their kids abroad to learn English. Chinese kids born abroad forget Chinese within a generation. They know the future is smoggy back home. It's time everyone take a breather and look at numbers that involve regular folk.
7
We'll see...
Side note, even inadequately educated Chinese adults don't know the language very well. I suspect you'll flunk out in your first week trying to learn the language, it's incredibly hard. Maybe you should try talking to actual Chinese Americans instead of repeating the 'I for one bow to our overlords' cliche.
China is playing a long game to win what it feels is its proper place on the world stage. They are not bothered by small things like the reputation of the country's rulers, worker safety or environmental laws. Their aim is to secure the resources they will need as the world's largest economy. They are also looking to build political influence around the world. They are doing both by moving into areas and countries ignored or shunned by the West: Africa, South America, Russia.
China is able to do a lot of this because we, the United States, are financing their expansion. The Billions we are spending on trade with China are not gaining us a global ally, we are financing a competitor and possibly a foe.
At a minimum, we should move our business to someone who wants to be our friend. Doing so will not stop China's long term plans, but it will restrict their ability to cause trouble around the world.
China is able to do a lot of this because we, the United States, are financing their expansion. The Billions we are spending on trade with China are not gaining us a global ally, we are financing a competitor and possibly a foe.
At a minimum, we should move our business to someone who wants to be our friend. Doing so will not stop China's long term plans, but it will restrict their ability to cause trouble around the world.
137
Our business went to China because the labor was cheap and there was economic incentive for manufacturers to open shops in China. Add to this the government incentives to undercut the rest of the world and there you have it. The money being in vested in resource extraction around the globe by China is not private equity, it is government money in one form or another. I would love to see what would happen if the US government gave a private mining operation millions to set up a competitive deal in Africa. I am sure congress would be thrilled to support that.
[Nations] DO NOT have friends only interests - Charles de Gaulle
4
You are misinterpreting the concept of "trading" and "financing." Trading is a mutual activity, there is no one-way financing about it. Trading is never a guarantee of allies, and the word "ally" is also a broader concept in modern politics. Financing is investment, loans, etc., the US has never been a big investor to China. These two concepts are not inter-changeable.
The exact reason we "financing" a competitor/foe is sending troops all around the world, building military bases to lock every of its interests, while seeing them as a trouble maker, limiting their long term development, and restricting their ability.
NYT should've not picked this comment, this is clearly a one-side perspective and narrow minded.
The exact reason we "financing" a competitor/foe is sending troops all around the world, building military bases to lock every of its interests, while seeing them as a trouble maker, limiting their long term development, and restricting their ability.
NYT should've not picked this comment, this is clearly a one-side perspective and narrow minded.
1
In many third-world nations, strongmen were paid-off by the west to get fantastically rich, while the rest of the peasant classes bled try - happened in India, Iran, several South American countries etc. Wealth was systemically transferred from the ruled to the Western countries, through these henchmen.
Now the Chinese are doing this to the US - except we dont have identifiable strongmen in the US - we have corporate chiefs,bankers, politicians (eventually becoming lobbyists) who get fantastically rich by selling of american technology, intellectual capital, means of livelihood, in the name of global trade, while the peasant classes are sinking deeper into the hole.
Perhaps never in history has one country simply sold its intellectual soul and might in the matter of 3 decades to another for a pittance. Some people (the 1%) got super rich, the rest, not so much.
Those who think nationalism is old - the Chinese dont seem to think so. The US talks about New World Order, China thinks about Chinese World Order.
Now the Chinese are doing this to the US - except we dont have identifiable strongmen in the US - we have corporate chiefs,bankers, politicians (eventually becoming lobbyists) who get fantastically rich by selling of american technology, intellectual capital, means of livelihood, in the name of global trade, while the peasant classes are sinking deeper into the hole.
Perhaps never in history has one country simply sold its intellectual soul and might in the matter of 3 decades to another for a pittance. Some people (the 1%) got super rich, the rest, not so much.
Those who think nationalism is old - the Chinese dont seem to think so. The US talks about New World Order, China thinks about Chinese World Order.
24
And we argue and are divided down the middle abortion and race and taxes and spending and gay rights and police abuse and on and on and on, never mind the fact that the nation's infrastructure is falling apart.
The result of all this? Within 25 to 50 years the Chinese, who are busy creating an alternative international financial and fiscal model and alternate international financial and economic institutions, will call the tune all over the world -- and when the world gets the chance to call our bluff it will show arrogant America the door.
The Chinese aren't the greatest threat to us and our power and place in the world. We are.
The result of all this? Within 25 to 50 years the Chinese, who are busy creating an alternative international financial and fiscal model and alternate international financial and economic institutions, will call the tune all over the world -- and when the world gets the chance to call our bluff it will show arrogant America the door.
The Chinese aren't the greatest threat to us and our power and place in the world. We are.
338
Do I correctly recall that Greater SF/Oakland decision makers opted to have China manufacture - and tow across the Pacific Ocean - the main span of the new Oakland Bay Area Bridge, as opposed to having a U.S. firm do it? if it is OK for China to do that, then it is OK for China to make investment overtures anywhere on the planet - just like the United States has done in times past. If we don't like how China operates, then prevent U.S. companies from outsourcing jobs/subbing out manufacturing there. What do we buy from American companies not stamped with Made in China?
No the Chinese are NOT divided down the middle. Anyone who dissents is arrested and put to a kangaroo court and sentenced to death.
Wait until you live under Chinese rule - see what you think then!
Wait until you live under Chinese rule - see what you think then!
Imagine what happens when the yuan is a reserve currency and they begin selling off our national debt.
The Chinese have been A+ students of the West. The rise of China on the global scene was made possible by greedy American and western businessmen (and politicians) who wanted to lower their cost of production and amass profit they didn't need. The West banked on the disciplined Chinese workforce guaranteed by an oppressive regime. After all, world powers have always been powered by cheap labor or slavery.
2
This article was reported, literally, just down the road from where my Brooklyn-based non-profit is currently running an environmental education program for US high school students. We visit the Coca Codo Sinclair dam project and Cascada San Rafael (and also the smaller Quijos-Papallacta dam project). The Quijos-Coca valley has primo hydro-electric potential and there are other projects being planned. China is the world's biggest dam building nation, with over 20,000 dams taller than 15 meters (accounting for more than 50% of the "large dams" globally), so it's no wonder that one of their biggest exports is dam financing and construction. I've personally been visiting this area of Ecuador since 2008 and the changes, both physically and culturally, are astounding. Initially, I traveled to the Quijos Vally for the whitewater kayaking. Several miles of world-class whitewater have been essentially closed off to paddlers with the development in the region, which bring tourism revenue to the rural communities. Many sections still have good access. It's a trade-off and this is still one of my favorite spots in Ecuador, if not the world. I have a lot of concerns about the future of development in Ecuador, but the issue, especially because Ecuador's future is so tied to China, makes for great discussion. Shameless plug: Here is some additional information on the environmental education program my organization runs in the Ecuadorian Amazon: http://sustainablesummer.org/programs/amazon/
1
The Chinese learned the lesson of how to turn a blind eye from various odious regimes from us, the US, EU, and Japan. After all, when they slaughtered their own citizens in Tiananmen Square for merely wanting democracy, we rewarded them with 100% of developing market FDI over the next 25 years!
As far as contentions in the article about the "center of financial gravity shifting" and "the renminbi is expected to be anointed soon as a global reserve currency", I think the authors are woefully premature.
As far as contentions in the article about the "center of financial gravity shifting" and "the renminbi is expected to be anointed soon as a global reserve currency", I think the authors are woefully premature.
1
The writing has been on the wall for a long time. While we spend time, money - lots of money, and people (read: Military 'workers') in the World's sandbox, the Chinese are bowing and smiling all the way to creating new 'strategic interests' across the globe. Who would think that the Ecuadoran president would behave the way he is, partly because of his father's death in a U. S. prison? Most of us in the U. S. have no clue about what is going on in the geopolitical and geoeconomic spheres that are re-shaping our World and our country.
16
True. US has been bogged down in the ME because of oil and Israel, while China plots its global takeover. And the US has been willing accomplices for four decades, shipping jobs to, and buying products from, China, sparking its industrial growth. All in the name of corporate profits and government loans. Precisely what Marx meant when he said capitalists would hang themselves with rope sold by other capitalists.
China and the other BRICS countries could become a real counterweight to the neoliberal monetary, financial, economic and commercial systems that enrich the few, impoverish the many and imperil people, species and planet. With its new riches and technology China could lead the world to a new order if it had the moral vision to do so.
Such moral vision is presented in Verhagen 2012 “The Tierra Solution: Resolving the climate crisis through monetary transformation” (www.timun.net) where a new world order is proposed that would combat the looming climate catastrophe and advance low-carbon, climate resilient development by basing the present unjust, unsustainable, and therefore, unstable international monetary system on a monetary standard of a specific tonnage of CO2e per person.
Such moral vision is presented in Verhagen 2012 “The Tierra Solution: Resolving the climate crisis through monetary transformation” (www.timun.net) where a new world order is proposed that would combat the looming climate catastrophe and advance low-carbon, climate resilient development by basing the present unjust, unsustainable, and therefore, unstable international monetary system on a monetary standard of a specific tonnage of CO2e per person.
1
China is a power unto itself, not really a BRIC. Competition is nearly impossible. Can I interest anyone in shares of Caterpillar?
1
A new moral vision from China? The country that brought it's people Tiananmen Square? That has ravaged Tibet? Presidente-por-vida Correa, while distracting his people by vilifying the USA and IMF, has mortgaged his country's resources and future to the Chinese at junk bond rates. The Chinese don't give a fig about corruption, pollution, or environmental disaster, and neither does Correa.
Having brutalized it's own people and wrecked it's own environment, it's now proceeding to do the same to Ecuador, etc., etc. Ecuador has some shiny new infrastructure that it will be paying for for decades, along with shiny new debt and environmental destruction on a vast scale. Pity the Ecuatorianos.
Having brutalized it's own people and wrecked it's own environment, it's now proceeding to do the same to Ecuador, etc., etc. Ecuador has some shiny new infrastructure that it will be paying for for decades, along with shiny new debt and environmental destruction on a vast scale. Pity the Ecuatorianos.
1
Firstly, it would be appropriate to show a comparative graph with US economic influence across the globe including our investments in China itself.
Secondly, the US has higher education all wrong. If there is any place we should be looking to model in that regard its Germany where tuition is free. Students don't worry about student loan debt. Families, educators, business leaders and political leaders see higher education as a public good. Instead our tech companies lobby the US government to allow work visas for bright minds from everywhere else instead of investing in our own kids.
Secondly, the US has higher education all wrong. If there is any place we should be looking to model in that regard its Germany where tuition is free. Students don't worry about student loan debt. Families, educators, business leaders and political leaders see higher education as a public good. Instead our tech companies lobby the US government to allow work visas for bright minds from everywhere else instead of investing in our own kids.
2
I'm waiting for an analysis of how China's lending practices differ from the World Bank's or the International Monetary Fund's. The only differences I see is that they advance China's national interests rather than the US's and Europe's and that they appear to be a bit more enlightened.
3
Now that we have encouraged a billion Chinese to value consumerism, compound growth and expansionism, one wonders how many trees, forests, drinkable water supplies and natural creatures will be left on the planet.
6
These are, actually AMERICAN billions... We were foolish enough to sell our middle class off to China in exchange for the privilege of buying cheap plastic toys and allowing the Chinese to finance our entitlement society.
15% on food stamps. By 1930's standards, 19% unemployment (down from that 19% recently) and a pervasive and destructive malaise that has settled over this nation. Who feels secure in their job, their future?? There are effectively no defined retirement benefit plans any longer. Through the 1980's, these were the rule.
After each and every recession, the recovery is less robust and the jobs created are of lower effective salary. And our debt balloons all the more.
Something is going to break and I fear it will be us.
15% on food stamps. By 1930's standards, 19% unemployment (down from that 19% recently) and a pervasive and destructive malaise that has settled over this nation. Who feels secure in their job, their future?? There are effectively no defined retirement benefit plans any longer. Through the 1980's, these were the rule.
After each and every recession, the recovery is less robust and the jobs created are of lower effective salary. And our debt balloons all the more.
Something is going to break and I fear it will be us.
8
Some good points, but 15% of the federal budget does not go toward food stamps. SNAP accounts for roughly half of total safety net spending, which itself is only 11% of the budget.
I look at the stunning success of the 2nd Avenue subway, and I can't help but wonder why developing countries would choose to partner with China.
5
Ouch.
It's just all so depressing.....why can't we just get some common sense into it all, the world is growing with people, we need to figure other ways out to sustain us all (and there are many ways, probably not as much money to be made), this grabbing of all the world's natural resources will doom us all! There is nowhere to run or hide in this world, where is the leadership to move forward with thoughtfulness?
3
Where the US raped and pillaged, forced coups and military takeovers so it could steal the wealth of South America using its puppet heads of state and military thugs, the Chinese offer cash.
Whilst the US might be seen as a better credit rating than China, its endless abuse of the continent is shameless and unforgivable. Even now it denies access to technicians and technologies for the national exploitation of natural resources, instead trying to impose US owned corporate stealing and to keep the people impoverished. Anyone from the US who visits South America should expect to be charged for the 400 years of violence against the people and for the theft of billions of dollars of mineral wealth.
The US could have a contribution to make to South America but not until it stops claiming that it is 'a sphere of influence' South America is a continent with independent rights that the US must respect or keep out.
Whilst the US might be seen as a better credit rating than China, its endless abuse of the continent is shameless and unforgivable. Even now it denies access to technicians and technologies for the national exploitation of natural resources, instead trying to impose US owned corporate stealing and to keep the people impoverished. Anyone from the US who visits South America should expect to be charged for the 400 years of violence against the people and for the theft of billions of dollars of mineral wealth.
The US could have a contribution to make to South America but not until it stops claiming that it is 'a sphere of influence' South America is a continent with independent rights that the US must respect or keep out.
3
If you want to see how this kind of deal can go sideways, just read about the mega resort Bahamar. This 2 billion dollar project in Nassau was built (not finished yet) and financed by the Chinese Gov.
Plagued by deficient work (leaking pipes and collapsing toilets) and delays, the developer made the cardinal error of publicly shaming the Chinese over the work. Instantly the project was shelved and the thousands of Chinese workers were pulled. Now there is a 3 way battle for control including the Bahamian government as they try to protect the 2500 employees already hired.
Repeated trips to Beijing to try and solve the problem have been fruitless as the Chinese have dug in their heels. 2 Billion is nothing to them and they don't care if Bahamar becomes a 'white elephant" and the Bahamian people suffer.
Good luck Ecuador with the quality of the construction and trying to find a solution after the inevitable issues arise.
Plagued by deficient work (leaking pipes and collapsing toilets) and delays, the developer made the cardinal error of publicly shaming the Chinese over the work. Instantly the project was shelved and the thousands of Chinese workers were pulled. Now there is a 3 way battle for control including the Bahamian government as they try to protect the 2500 employees already hired.
Repeated trips to Beijing to try and solve the problem have been fruitless as the Chinese have dug in their heels. 2 Billion is nothing to them and they don't care if Bahamar becomes a 'white elephant" and the Bahamian people suffer.
Good luck Ecuador with the quality of the construction and trying to find a solution after the inevitable issues arise.
13
Good article; but I swear that I've read similar ones like this before. Prior articles on Chinas' economic might in Ethiopia and Rhodesia (Zimbabwe, excuse me) have been written. However if memory serves me right I think I've read similar articles in the past that described western imperialism doing quite the same thing the Chinese are doing. Only thing lacking in this article was that the author didn't detail any precedent: had that occurred I would've been eager to google specifics of how the west applied their techniques of yesteryear and presented my personal comparison.
2
Enlightening article. Having lived in China drinking is a way to close deals. Chinese hold liquor well so get deals closed. I've seen this.The article states China is developing county and can avoid trade rules. I have always wondered why this is so. Will Chinese companies vest billions in security in Afghanistan when the US pulls out? These Chinese companies are state owned so they have access to Chinese reserves. State control of economic conditions has been shaky in the past. Only time will tell whether these diverse worldwide investments will yield dividends but for now Chinese manufacturing looks weak and China could and will abandon economic expansionism leaving a lot of people in worse conditions than previously and governments in turmoil.
1
"China’s Global Ambitions, With Loans and Strings Attached"At least the US does not attach strings, only steel cable.
2
Countries making deals with China do so because Russia's run out of extra cash and the US isn't as needy as China. It's the devil's bargain; first Japan and now China are merely gutting other countries for what they can (cheaply) get, and then will depart, leaving toxic lands and a collapsed economy behind. The Chinese aren't interested in merging their culture with anyone else's. That's the biggest blind spot in the West; they don't see that this is nothing but business to China.
The Chinese invest abroad not out of confidence; they invest abroad out of fear. Even the wealthiest of Chinese don't trust the food supplies, don't buy Chinese goods, don't want to breathe that air or drink the water. The Chinese government is running scared (hence the increasingly vicious crackdowns on rising ethnic unrest). It is hoping to fully revamp its society from rural to urban (look at how many US farmers it takes to feed our country vs China's farmers-to-consumers ratio) before China runs out of water, soil, food, cheap labor, and resources.
The only thing Chinese admire about the West is the ability to make money and munitions, which translate to power. They do not admire the Hispanics or Africans in any way, shape or form, and will make no attempts to cultivate or pander to those local cultures. They give these countries money to exploit the resources they need to keep their military and its supporting industries strong.
The Chinese invest abroad not out of confidence; they invest abroad out of fear. Even the wealthiest of Chinese don't trust the food supplies, don't buy Chinese goods, don't want to breathe that air or drink the water. The Chinese government is running scared (hence the increasingly vicious crackdowns on rising ethnic unrest). It is hoping to fully revamp its society from rural to urban (look at how many US farmers it takes to feed our country vs China's farmers-to-consumers ratio) before China runs out of water, soil, food, cheap labor, and resources.
The only thing Chinese admire about the West is the ability to make money and munitions, which translate to power. They do not admire the Hispanics or Africans in any way, shape or form, and will make no attempts to cultivate or pander to those local cultures. They give these countries money to exploit the resources they need to keep their military and its supporting industries strong.
3
As usual the leftists and globalists want to blame the U.S. and Europe and the White folks in general for all the world's troubles while praising the Chinese Tiger which is slowly devouring everything in sight. Yes we all know the Whites went out and conquered the world and have now retreated to their homelands and can't even seem to maintain those. Having said that does this make China's gross exploitation of the "Third World's" resources any better? No. In fact much, much worse. Scientists have warned for years that Red China with a minimum of 1.3 billion hungry mouths to feed cannot possibly ever attain Western standards of living. These experts have warned it would take the natural resources of 6 planet earths to bring China up to American or European living standards. Also China is one of the most oppressive and corrupt dictatorships in the world. Combine this with an army, navy, and air force that they have been steadily modernizing and expanding for decades and we are looking at major troubles eventually. Since obviously no country is going to commit aggression against a nation as large and strong as China, the mandarins in Beijing have their own "long term" plans for world domination, either by military or economic means or both. This does not bode well for any other nation because the Chinese are mostly racist and xenophobic and view foreigners as "barbarians", to either be held at bay or brought under Chinese suzerainty. The sleeping tiger is awake and hungry!
27
Meanwhile back here in the United states, we are trying to determine our gender and fighting health care for all.
Transparency International scored China as 100/175 countries - the lower the score the worse for doing business. Ecuador comes in at 110. The US is 17 and Canada 10. http://www.transparency.org/country#ECU
I been to Ecuador and traveled its beautiful country in 2000. We went to Cuenca, third largest city and arts capital and found a nice old Inn converted from a Spanish colonial estate. Stayed there one night and the invoice appeared excessive - about twice the posted going rate. I inquired at the front desk. I asked, "you post your room rates at your desk and on the room doors in English and Spanish, but you charged me twice the rate, why?" The answer? "Those are rates for Ecuadorians, we charge Americans more." Since they already took the charge from my credit card and the total charge was less than a similar place in Europe I chalked it up to learning.
I been to Ecuador and traveled its beautiful country in 2000. We went to Cuenca, third largest city and arts capital and found a nice old Inn converted from a Spanish colonial estate. Stayed there one night and the invoice appeared excessive - about twice the posted going rate. I inquired at the front desk. I asked, "you post your room rates at your desk and on the room doors in English and Spanish, but you charged me twice the rate, why?" The answer? "Those are rates for Ecuadorians, we charge Americans more." Since they already took the charge from my credit card and the total charge was less than a similar place in Europe I chalked it up to learning.
"Washington is worried that China will create its own rules, with lower expectations for transparency, governance and the environment."
Thanks for the Friday morning belly laugh. A brief review of Washington policy in, say, Haiti, will expose the hypocrisy in that statement: decades of support for a ruthless dictator who followed Washington's dictates; volumes have been written about the environmental destruction wrought by Washington's plantation mentality - virgin forests that covered 98% of the land area in 1925 have been reduced to 4% of the total land area; when the people finally shed that yoke and elected a president who showed concern for the masses and the environment, Washington supported a series of coups, finally kidnapping the president and dumping him in Africa.
Fortunately for the developing world, there is now an alternative to Washington's thinly veiled colonialism.
Thanks for the Friday morning belly laugh. A brief review of Washington policy in, say, Haiti, will expose the hypocrisy in that statement: decades of support for a ruthless dictator who followed Washington's dictates; volumes have been written about the environmental destruction wrought by Washington's plantation mentality - virgin forests that covered 98% of the land area in 1925 have been reduced to 4% of the total land area; when the people finally shed that yoke and elected a president who showed concern for the masses and the environment, Washington supported a series of coups, finally kidnapping the president and dumping him in Africa.
Fortunately for the developing world, there is now an alternative to Washington's thinly veiled colonialism.
57
Over the last three decades, the Chinese have been able to amass this level of wealth from the selling of cheap and disposable goods to the US and the rest of the world. We get landfills full of plastic and high consumer debt, they get the environmental pollution, manufacturing jobs and the money to invest in global scale to further their national interests.
As Americans, we should be more mindful of the cheap useless trinkets and cheaply made garments we buy on plastic that end up being garage sale or landfill fodder. It appears we have made a Faustian bargain without fully understanding the long term economic consequences to our personal and national well-being.
As Americans, we should be more mindful of the cheap useless trinkets and cheaply made garments we buy on plastic that end up being garage sale or landfill fodder. It appears we have made a Faustian bargain without fully understanding the long term economic consequences to our personal and national well-being.
231
a concerted conscious decision to buy MADE IN USA will shock the consumer.
although not impossible, it will certainly whittle your shopping to very few items.
and i agree wholeheartedly with N. above. do we need to fill our landfills with worthless plastic crapola? christmas costumes for pets? single use plastic everything?
faustian bargain, indeed!
although not impossible, it will certainly whittle your shopping to very few items.
and i agree wholeheartedly with N. above. do we need to fill our landfills with worthless plastic crapola? christmas costumes for pets? single use plastic everything?
faustian bargain, indeed!
1
Chinese goods, on the whole, greatly surpass American junk in quality. Remember "planned obsolescence"? It's with us, hearty and hale, still.
This is all well and good ... assuming we the consumers (as well as we, the voters) ever have a say in where anything is produced that is sold here. It used to be that you "got what you paid for." Now you simply get disposable garbage for the price of durable goods because that's all the corporate interests choose to offer you. Want change? Take it up with your lobbyist-paid-for representative. You won't actually get change, but you'll get a nice (form letter) email to pass on to your grandkids.
1
So what is America doing to counter the Chinese? Obama is so obsessed with the Middle East that China has had a free hand to do as it pleased. The Chinese have made big moves all around the world -- with the aggressive push to claim the Spratly Islands as perhaps their most provocative action -- and America just pretends that everything is as it should be. What will it take to get Americans to see that Syria is not a threat to America's interests but that China has the potential to supplant America as a world power?
People like Paul Krugman like to say that America's debt is not an issue. But look at the things the Chinese are doing with the dollars they have earned. With a purse like that, the Chinese have no need to fight, they can just buy their way into global influence. Without firing a single shot or putting any of their citizens' life at risk, the Chinese can often get others to do as they command. All they have to do is dangle those dollars.
People like Paul Krugman like to say that America's debt is not an issue. But look at the things the Chinese are doing with the dollars they have earned. With a purse like that, the Chinese have no need to fight, they can just buy their way into global influence. Without firing a single shot or putting any of their citizens' life at risk, the Chinese can often get others to do as they command. All they have to do is dangle those dollars.
It's not Obama who is obsessed with the ME. He's trying to get us out. But the most powerful interests in our country (military, defense contractors, Big Oil, Israeli lobbyists) keep pulling us back in.
At least they are spending the money on infrastructure projects - roads, bridges, hospitals, ports, not giving money to juntas to buy guns and bombs to feed the military-industrial complex.
338
Sorry, but arms are one of their major exports. They take the natural resources and send back weapons.
2
BK, the form of investment you describe is different in kind, not effect. Roads, ports and bridges are most certainly tools of the "military-industrial complex" and, indeed, are essential to maintaining the power of the governments China has chosen to support.
May I introduce you to North Korea...
3
Sounds like USA over the past 40 years. Ironic eh?
9
We play world policeman, others get a free security ride. We bomb, so they can build.
1
"...Beijing surges forward and Washington gradually loses ground."
That's because Washington chooses to sink billions into an ungrateful arrogant nation that opposes our policies at every turn instead of focusing on what's in US and global interest. The Iran deal is the perfect example of how Washington is hostage to our money lords.
That's because Washington chooses to sink billions into an ungrateful arrogant nation that opposes our policies at every turn instead of focusing on what's in US and global interest. The Iran deal is the perfect example of how Washington is hostage to our money lords.
4
China lending to "troubled regimes" in Yemen, Syria, Sierra Leone, and Zimbabwe is much more than just a risky bet. It is an example of a corrupt country owning the debt of another corrupt country, in the hopes that there will be a default and the sharks can come in and own the country. Bribery runs rampant in these deals because neither country follows or cares about our Foreign Corrupt Practices Act, nor are they concerned with the will of their own people. China has been doing this kind of lending for centuries, and it is why the richest people in Southeast Asian countries are almost all descended from China.
4
Everyone knows that you can catch more flies with honey than with a fly-swatter. Sending troops and fighting as the global policeman can only go so far; but a little investment in education, infrastructure and such can go much farther.
13
China is investing in China at large. Their world dominance strategy has not changed. Chinese are patient and methodical. They are investing where they expect to exert control via increasing dependence on China. You have a restaurant in Manhattan. You need money. The local loan shark helps you out. Soon he is intimately involved in your business. No difference, just using global structures to effect the same result. Want to see how dependent we are? Assume that China stopped all exports. What would you not be able to get? Does China have the reserves to pull that off. Yes. That commercial was a reality show.
58
China is doing its thing, while our Congress is busy disavowing Obama's Legacy in Foreign and Domestic Policies. China need not be seeking overall dominance, but its influence will be felt all over our World and in the Developing Countries in particular. Ecuador would be foolhardy in refusing the advancement China is willing to finance for the benefit of its people. No matter how alarming that be to Ecuadorean capitalists and our own.
Take a quick read of "Confessions of an Economic Hit Man" to see how our current set of International Institutions has manipulated affairs to the benefit of "Western" International Capitalism.
1
Instead of focusing on China, focus on how the U.S. allowed this state of affairs to evolve in the first place. Decades of greed and mismanagement and a Democracy that simply doesn't work for middle class Americans. Indeed, as a prior commentator suggested, China is simply playing our own game better and with a ruthless efficiency that makes me cringe with embarrassment at being an American. We don't need more of Obama's hillbilly liberal naivete or his predecessor's one dimensional cowboy hillbilly pproach. It's unfortunate that we no longer have a viable election process in this country. Time for a constituent assembly to save the country? Me thinks the average American has no idea about how bad things are here.
159
John Q Public is clueless and it therefor elects ignorant bloviaters to Congress who about to get us into another war.
1
"'The problem is we are trying to replace American imperialism with Chinese imperialism,' said Alberto Acosta, who served as President Correa’s energy minister during his first term."
If I were Ecuador, given a choice, I would choose the imperialism where Christianity is growing more than the criminalization of Christianity. It just could be Christianity's growth coincides with China's expansion. As it once did Europe's, then America's. That is what God promised; if you believe in that sort of thing.
"The Chinese money, though, comes with its own conditions. Along with steep interest payments, Ecuador is largely required to use Chinese companies and technologies on the projects."
For now, China does not require swimming in a Progressive / American cesspool. Which by its own (Progressive / American) admission, through audible proclamation, it wants to require as conditions of commerce.
If I were Ecuador, given a choice, I would choose the imperialism where Christianity is growing more than the criminalization of Christianity. It just could be Christianity's growth coincides with China's expansion. As it once did Europe's, then America's. That is what God promised; if you believe in that sort of thing.
"The Chinese money, though, comes with its own conditions. Along with steep interest payments, Ecuador is largely required to use Chinese companies and technologies on the projects."
For now, China does not require swimming in a Progressive / American cesspool. Which by its own (Progressive / American) admission, through audible proclamation, it wants to require as conditions of commerce.
Of course we must also thank the GOP as well for the mess we are in. If we continue to elect these two gangs, DEM&GOP, the biggest blame should be on the voters. If there,s no third party on the ballot in 2016 election, we should boycott it.
Well, seems the infrastructure of the US could use this same kind of help and initiative................I guess our (USA) needs are not our Government's priority.
Campaign dollars are plentiful but road, bridge repair, to say nothing of poverty, hungry children and racism are not worthy of American investment or concern. I guess this is status of the American Dream with out the mythology.
China seems to be "on the job" and globally.
Campaign dollars are plentiful but road, bridge repair, to say nothing of poverty, hungry children and racism are not worthy of American investment or concern. I guess this is status of the American Dream with out the mythology.
China seems to be "on the job" and globally.
5
I don't think so. Where is the Chinese presence in the UN relief programs, where are the Chinese doctors or engineers after disasters, where are the Chinese vaccination programs. As for the infrastructure projects, they have a presence, but at what price?
3
Give the Chinese credit for taking a global view of their future, while here in the U.S., politicians are too busy preventing abortions, the spread of decent healthcare and anything Obama-related to realize the rest of the world is being sold out from under them.
Meanwhile, our citizens are too busy studying the Kardashians to understand what is happening. Surveys say less than 50% of Americans have traveled outside the country (one claims as few as 13% have engaged in foreign travel) and it shows. Out of ignorance, we reject the best ideas developed by other nations (i.e., national health systems) and many of us have no clue what we're talking about when we claim the U.S. is "the greatest nation in the world" or talk about "American exceptionalism."
While we're out there chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A," the Chinese are buying the world's resources lock, stock and barrel. Note to American parents: better have your kids study Mandarin if they want to be able to communicate with their future bosses.
Meanwhile, our citizens are too busy studying the Kardashians to understand what is happening. Surveys say less than 50% of Americans have traveled outside the country (one claims as few as 13% have engaged in foreign travel) and it shows. Out of ignorance, we reject the best ideas developed by other nations (i.e., national health systems) and many of us have no clue what we're talking about when we claim the U.S. is "the greatest nation in the world" or talk about "American exceptionalism."
While we're out there chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A," the Chinese are buying the world's resources lock, stock and barrel. Note to American parents: better have your kids study Mandarin if they want to be able to communicate with their future bosses.
166
Maybe Americans are not traveling much because they can't afford the costs and they are not given vacation time, taking time off could mean loosing your job.
1
Modern China (and the CCP) value prosperity and political stability. China also values and rewards meritocracy in government and its workforce. As in the case of workers in Ecuador who make nearly $1000/month we can be sure that they earn their pay to the satisfaction of their Chinese bosses. (As did the Chinese laborers who built the western part of the US continental railroad in the 1860s for their American bosses.)
China's influence, I believe, will loosen the European colonialism that has held Latin American back from prosperity and political stability.
China's influence, I believe, will loosen the European colonialism that has held Latin American back from prosperity and political stability.
8
This article is written with negative undertones of China's impact on developing countries. What China is actually doing is providing an alternative option to the IMF / World Bank programmes that have miserably failed the worlds' poor and the governments that have been cash strapped to implement large infrastructural projects of the kind mentioned in the article.
The agency rests with the host governments. If indeed they are opting for Chinese investment, then it shows a blatant slap against Western financial institutions and governments, and their corporations that have experimented on the worlds poor for decades with structural adjustment and financial / governance reforms - the scoreboard of such interventions have been abysmal.
So yes, we should all be praising China actually for offering an alternative to the values - oriented nonsense coming out of Washington and Western capitals.
The agency rests with the host governments. If indeed they are opting for Chinese investment, then it shows a blatant slap against Western financial institutions and governments, and their corporations that have experimented on the worlds poor for decades with structural adjustment and financial / governance reforms - the scoreboard of such interventions have been abysmal.
So yes, we should all be praising China actually for offering an alternative to the values - oriented nonsense coming out of Washington and Western capitals.
62
Unfortunately, these are probably bad deals for Ecuador and other countries. I am no fan of the world bank or IMF, but these are basically the same mistakes with a new lender.
7,5% interest per year on $11 billion, in a country where people make $600/ month, for projects that create jobs for the Chinese, and let them take the country's resources for decades. The IMF couldn't be worse, and that's saying something.
7,5% interest per year on $11 billion, in a country where people make $600/ month, for projects that create jobs for the Chinese, and let them take the country's resources for decades. The IMF couldn't be worse, and that's saying something.
1
The Ecuadorian elites and cronies of Correa are the only ones benefiting of the money poured by the Chinese imperialists.
The contractors receive orders from Petroecuador with oversized costs and then in return they deposit a percentage to the bank accounts of Petroecuador directors and decision makers.
Letters of credits are being expedited to these local members of the Quito' olygarquies in exchange for deposits of funds in banks in Cayman Islands
The contractors receive orders from Petroecuador with oversized costs and then in return they deposit a percentage to the bank accounts of Petroecuador directors and decision makers.
Letters of credits are being expedited to these local members of the Quito' olygarquies in exchange for deposits of funds in banks in Cayman Islands
2
Chinese technology is built on counterfeiting and copying, and this is the culture they are spreading to the world. It is bad news for human progress, but it is good news, at least temporarily for the countries receiving the money.
2
Counterfeiting and copying is how it starts. Once they have acquired the processes, they will then make it better and cheaper - like Japan. They are not fools. And by the way, they have no desire to spread their culture around the world, their presence yes, but culture, no.
Imagine, a country focused on long tern needs and plans to meet those needs.
91
The chinese invest in the chinese and nothing else. I live and work in Asia. I see it and it's pernicious.
Today, most countries and corporations start drooling the moment that they have a chance to do any kind of business with the heinous Chinese Communist Party. Of course, totally ignoring the millions of human rights atrocities that have been and are still being committed by the brutal CCP. The weak U.N even appointed the CCP a seat on its Human Rights Council last year. Interesting, considering the fact that there are no human rights whatsoever in Red China. Shameful ! Right now the CCP is attempting the genocide of the tens of millions of Falun Gong practitioners who live in Mainland China. This genocide consists of torture, slavery, organ harvesting and murder.
1
In contrast, we are waging multiple wars fighting the so-called global war on terror, dedicating resources to a decades old and fruitless war on drugs, allowing our infrastructure to crumble, etc., etc.
92
While we cannot argue against the economic benefits to these countries the environmental destruction will be huge. Chinese engineers rarely cared for the environment - their argument always was people over environment. The Chinese refrain from meddling into local politics is both a boon and a curse - If you have despot they may strengthen them.
The Right wing Republicans will finally read the New York Times as this article gives them ample fodder for them to argue that the President has weakened the US and as result the Chinese are stepping to fill the void.
The Right wing Republicans will finally read the New York Times as this article gives them ample fodder for them to argue that the President has weakened the US and as result the Chinese are stepping to fill the void.
3
Richard Nixon is responsible for opening the door to PRC, not President Obama, so the GOP must take responsibility for their foolish and anti-American positions regarding our economy and manufacturing base….they did this to us. The Chinese do not seem to realize that all people live within the context of the environment, we are all part of that and there is no separation ….as they continue to destroy their own land and deplete their resources their voracious greed grows…they will destroy Ecuador's environment and any other place they occupy. The world clearly does not need more cheap plastic toxic garbage from China. Buy quality products made in countries that respect human rights…which is not China.
1
What made China the economic power it is? Free Trade, multi national corporations from US and West.
China is and has been a communist government and set the rules for exploitation and allowed our companies to exploit in ruinous ways degrading humans and our environment.
Is it going to come back and bite big business from the West? the rest of civilization? Greed tramples as does communism.
China is and has been a communist government and set the rules for exploitation and allowed our companies to exploit in ruinous ways degrading humans and our environment.
Is it going to come back and bite big business from the West? the rest of civilization? Greed tramples as does communism.
On my medical mission to Ecuador, my American coworkers (doctors, nurses, and college students) and I didn't ask for anything in exchange for our services. We did receive many smiles and some outstanding ceviche.
Once the Ecuadorean environment is despoiled and its natural resources exported to Beijing, will the Chinese overlords be as generous?
Once the Ecuadorean environment is despoiled and its natural resources exported to Beijing, will the Chinese overlords be as generous?
5
While China spends billions to develop the world and create allies, Washington under a republican led congress is dedicated to spending billions to destroy lives and relationships. We need to have a deep conversation about how special interests have ruined our country.
4
There is a kind of "gee whiz" tone to this interesting article that doesn't seem aware of the histories of the Dutch East India Company, its British counterpart, the Arabian-American Oil Company... and many others. Nor of the significant US direct foreign investment in China.
One major difference is that much FDI from the US and other western countries was aimed at the domestic markets of the host country, whereas almost all of Chinese FDI is aimed at exporting commodities based on the natural resources of the host country. But the main difference is that western FDI was made by privately-owned companies, seeking only profit, whereas Chinese FDI decisions are made, or heavily influenced, by the Chinese government, which puts strategic considerations of assuring the supply of resources that China does not itself have. Because of this, we can expect a higher percentage of economic failures -- like the "white elephant" danger mentioned in the article -- from Chinese FDI.
But basically it's nothing new; just coming from a new player in the game.
One major difference is that much FDI from the US and other western countries was aimed at the domestic markets of the host country, whereas almost all of Chinese FDI is aimed at exporting commodities based on the natural resources of the host country. But the main difference is that western FDI was made by privately-owned companies, seeking only profit, whereas Chinese FDI decisions are made, or heavily influenced, by the Chinese government, which puts strategic considerations of assuring the supply of resources that China does not itself have. Because of this, we can expect a higher percentage of economic failures -- like the "white elephant" danger mentioned in the article -- from Chinese FDI.
But basically it's nothing new; just coming from a new player in the game.
2
American businesses from the U.S. have treated the people and countries of Latin America poorly for a couple of centuries, so the resentments towards the U.S. make perfect sense, but what made them think that the Chinese businesses would be any better than the Americans? Worse, businesses across the world have had a fun time in China helping them create facilities and systems that were deliberately designed to produce higher profit margins by excluding systems to minimize pollution and perilous working conditions. Now China is spreading the gifts with even worse practices than the Americans. China needs the resources but the price everyone on Earth will pay is going to be steep. Given the history of the development of China and the role of multinational corporations, the blame falls equally upon the dictatorship of the proletariat in China and the board rooms of multinational corporations from all the countries of the so called free world.
3
In WE are busy, shutting boarders, waging war and building hatred all around the globe ...
Again the rise of the ugly american
Again the rise of the ugly american
2
The recent Russian Approval of the Iran Nuclear accord had Chinese fingerprints all over it!
Much as Putin would love to see the U.S. twisting in the wind, (oddly not unlike the blockhead Republican Congress) the recent Russian deal to sell natural gas to the Chinese, stretches Russian over a barrel considering the dicte of the agreement. While initially described as economic and not political, Russia serving its major trading partner China's economic agenda has deeper political impact beyond the conditions to deliver billions of cubic feet of natural gas over 30 years. China enjoys a close relationship with Iran and will benefit from a larger flow of oil once sanctions are withdrawn. As much as Putin might relish Iran-U.S. conflict, the Chinese know a peaceful southern Asian tier will make regional hegemony and developing a supportive energy infrastructure easier to accommodate. Thus Putin's comment that "The world sleeps easier tonight," is ironic in that his ability to accommodate the deescalation of Iran's nuclear process gives comfort to his Chinese clients and directs more energy to flow east rather than west. And if the U.S. fails to uphold its part of the bargain, the rest of the treaty group will honor its terms and Iran will see sanctions lifted without any U.S. oversight, making the region far more dangerous for Israel. So, Republican resistance to Obama on this treaty, if it scuttles U.S. ties to the treaty, will hurt Israel, embolden Russia and help the Chinese.
Much as Putin would love to see the U.S. twisting in the wind, (oddly not unlike the blockhead Republican Congress) the recent Russian deal to sell natural gas to the Chinese, stretches Russian over a barrel considering the dicte of the agreement. While initially described as economic and not political, Russia serving its major trading partner China's economic agenda has deeper political impact beyond the conditions to deliver billions of cubic feet of natural gas over 30 years. China enjoys a close relationship with Iran and will benefit from a larger flow of oil once sanctions are withdrawn. As much as Putin might relish Iran-U.S. conflict, the Chinese know a peaceful southern Asian tier will make regional hegemony and developing a supportive energy infrastructure easier to accommodate. Thus Putin's comment that "The world sleeps easier tonight," is ironic in that his ability to accommodate the deescalation of Iran's nuclear process gives comfort to his Chinese clients and directs more energy to flow east rather than west. And if the U.S. fails to uphold its part of the bargain, the rest of the treaty group will honor its terms and Iran will see sanctions lifted without any U.S. oversight, making the region far more dangerous for Israel. So, Republican resistance to Obama on this treaty, if it scuttles U.S. ties to the treaty, will hurt Israel, embolden Russia and help the Chinese.
3
Huh, did they even bomb first? What newbies!! Real super powers, like America, destroy the country of interest's infrastructure before investing in rebuilding it... double the corporate profits, am I right?!?
87
No, they played smart. They loaned us the money to take care of the messy invading and destroying of a country's infrastructure, then took those yuan on the dollar and are going to reap the monetray and political rewards of rebuilding.
1
They pretty much murdered 80 million of their own during the cultural revolution. They prefer milk powder, foodstuffs and luxury items manufactured abroad. It's predictable and sad how quickly the self-flagellating liberals here are ignorant of other country's problems and quickly adopt a doomed attitude.
11
China killled 80 million in the Cultural Revolution? Really? Do you have a source for that ludicrous figure? Of course you don't, because its non-sense.
Such figures have been thrown around in reference to so-called "excess deaths" resulting from the two years of famines that followed the Great Leap Forward, but they don't sustain close scrutiny.
Excess deaths refers to the number of people who died in excess of the normal death rate. The death rate in China dropped precipitously between 1949, when the Communists came to power, and 1958 when the Great Leap Forward was attempted. This was followed by two years of poor harvests that, combined with the disruptions caused by the Great Leap, resulted in famine. Government census data indicates that the death rate went up resulting in 15 million "excess deaths" compared to the low death of the immediately previous years. Of course, if the death rates are compared to the pre-1949 norms or to India at the same time, there were no "excess deaths" at all.
A number of Western scholars have claimed that the excess death figures are even higher, (between 20 and 45 million) but their grounds for doing so are highly speculative. Some then heap on the decline in birth rates during this period to include "babies not born" as supposed additional deaths to come to a figure of 76 million.
All of this is a perverse use of statistics to create the false impression that China under Mao was an especially murderous regime. It wasn't.
Such figures have been thrown around in reference to so-called "excess deaths" resulting from the two years of famines that followed the Great Leap Forward, but they don't sustain close scrutiny.
Excess deaths refers to the number of people who died in excess of the normal death rate. The death rate in China dropped precipitously between 1949, when the Communists came to power, and 1958 when the Great Leap Forward was attempted. This was followed by two years of poor harvests that, combined with the disruptions caused by the Great Leap, resulted in famine. Government census data indicates that the death rate went up resulting in 15 million "excess deaths" compared to the low death of the immediately previous years. Of course, if the death rates are compared to the pre-1949 norms or to India at the same time, there were no "excess deaths" at all.
A number of Western scholars have claimed that the excess death figures are even higher, (between 20 and 45 million) but their grounds for doing so are highly speculative. Some then heap on the decline in birth rates during this period to include "babies not born" as supposed additional deaths to come to a figure of 76 million.
All of this is a perverse use of statistics to create the false impression that China under Mao was an especially murderous regime. It wasn't.
All countries do this, the US included. So what is so special about China?
12
China's growth as a World Power is more of a lesson than a threat, whether ,we like it or not, China has used our weaknesses to surpass us.They are not burdened by religious dogma..Most of all, they are not burdened by two incompetent political parties whose bickering for power is the laughing stock of the world,They are not burdened by an apathetic prejudiced electorate that votes on emotion, rather than reason.Would I rather live in China than in the United States, of course not, but we must be vigilant about Chinese influence & power throughout the world & prepare ourselves for the eventual confrontation with China that is closer than we think.
2
China is an economic superpower, but it will need to have a more attractive political and cultural model before it becomes a true superpower.
2
If Correa thinks the Americans were bad, he is in for an interesting ride with the Chinese. That country, with it's near-xenophobic history of putting itself at the center of the universe, will treat Ecuadorians considerably less as equals than the USA ever has.
Essentially, Correa has done what he has to do to alleviate Western terms and conditions in doing business, playing one source of capital off against another.
I don't see this new found love match between China and Latin America as resulting in a long term marriage.
Essentially, Correa has done what he has to do to alleviate Western terms and conditions in doing business, playing one source of capital off against another.
I don't see this new found love match between China and Latin America as resulting in a long term marriage.
19
Who said the Chinese are out to "marry" the Latin Americans? They are there to make a win-win business relationship. As capitalists, I thought Americans know something about that?
"If Correa thinks the Americans were bad, he is in for an interesting ride with the Chinese. "
Correa is not stupid. He knows what the Chinese are doing. His calculation probably is that China lacks aircraft carriers and is very far away. Once they build Ecuador's infrastructure and the debt to China builds up he will just stiff them like he did with the Americans and will leave them with no option but to go home and count their loses.
Correa is not stupid. He knows what the Chinese are doing. His calculation probably is that China lacks aircraft carriers and is very far away. Once they build Ecuador's infrastructure and the debt to China builds up he will just stiff them like he did with the Americans and will leave them with no option but to go home and count their loses.
1
The assumption is that a globally engaged China is a bad thing. Really? This is exactly what Nixon-Kissinger aimed to accomplish. Why are we so hot and bothered that we succeeded insanely? The article has a sense of foreboding; that China is doing something terrible, that the recipients of aid and investment are defenseless victims.
First off, it beats the European model (military takeover, complete exhaustion of local resources, slavery, destruction of local industry, exploitation of market, use of colonial resources to engage in endless wars). Dutch and English money went to S. Africa, produced apartheid. Chinese money went into Zambia . . . well, it did not produce slavery.
Second, Chinese behavior seems remarkably close to our own. Except for the fact that we have a fascination with dictators in Latin America and Arab Middle East, and a total disregard for human life in these places. I think we perfected the "destroy the village to save it," construct. There is no evidence yet of Chinese directly or indirectly coddling dictators, or killing people in Africa or Latin America. Of course they have tried to deal with shaky regimes in Africa (Sierra Leone), Asia (Iran) and Middle East (Yemen); the stronger ones are on our pocket.
Don't the Ecuadorean people need refineries, roads, dams, hydroelectric power, credit? Is Chinese money really that bad if it improves the lot of common people (our money usually went straight into some tough's pocket).
Kalidan
First off, it beats the European model (military takeover, complete exhaustion of local resources, slavery, destruction of local industry, exploitation of market, use of colonial resources to engage in endless wars). Dutch and English money went to S. Africa, produced apartheid. Chinese money went into Zambia . . . well, it did not produce slavery.
Second, Chinese behavior seems remarkably close to our own. Except for the fact that we have a fascination with dictators in Latin America and Arab Middle East, and a total disregard for human life in these places. I think we perfected the "destroy the village to save it," construct. There is no evidence yet of Chinese directly or indirectly coddling dictators, or killing people in Africa or Latin America. Of course they have tried to deal with shaky regimes in Africa (Sierra Leone), Asia (Iran) and Middle East (Yemen); the stronger ones are on our pocket.
Don't the Ecuadorean people need refineries, roads, dams, hydroelectric power, credit? Is Chinese money really that bad if it improves the lot of common people (our money usually went straight into some tough's pocket).
Kalidan
159
Everyone deserves a civilized life. While China is helping the world, we are losing ground at home and abroad. Those two issues are separate and both need our attention. Now. The only person talking about it is Bernie.
2
The thing that doesn't square with your "bad AMERICA" argument is immigration (illegal if you choose). Why do people from around the world, including Equidor, all try to get to the U.S. (Or other freedom, democratic, "rule of law" countries and not China, Russia, Iran, Noth Korea, et al? Could it be that as fractured as our political divide seems to be, that being able to speak your mind, think your thoughts and practice you spiritual principles perhaps trumps the concept of "bad AMERICA"?
4
I dont' think that Nixon and Kissinger were honorable men and they clearly did not help US manufacturing when they sold out American manufacturing labor to China…so how was/is that good for the USA? Richard Nixon the corrupt criminal who got off easy?
Re the needs of Ecuador: China is not helping them to be helpful, they are exploiting that country for their own purposes and care nothing about that country or the people, they only seek raw materials, land, resources and cheap labor. China is all about China and they seek to dominate as they did for centuries in Asia.
Re the needs of Ecuador: China is not helping them to be helpful, they are exploiting that country for their own purposes and care nothing about that country or the people, they only seek raw materials, land, resources and cheap labor. China is all about China and they seek to dominate as they did for centuries in Asia.
2
V.I. Lenin said it all, "The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them."
Except the "us" are Chinese, not Russians.
And today American companies, backed by Wall Street, design the rope and then ship all the jobs to China, which then tells us the rope.
Although Capitalism produces more material wealth than Communism, the inherent problem with Capitalism, the leading religion of our time, is that the adoration of Money as the one true God means that no Capitalist is ever loyal to anything else.
Except the "us" are Chinese, not Russians.
And today American companies, backed by Wall Street, design the rope and then ship all the jobs to China, which then tells us the rope.
Although Capitalism produces more material wealth than Communism, the inherent problem with Capitalism, the leading religion of our time, is that the adoration of Money as the one true God means that no Capitalist is ever loyal to anything else.
103
"V.I. Lenin said it all, "The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them."
Except the "us" are Chinese, not Russians."
And "Capitalists" are liberal democracies, as today's China is more capitalist than America ever was.
Except the "us" are Chinese, not Russians."
And "Capitalists" are liberal democracies, as today's China is more capitalist than America ever was.
You clearly have never been to China. They are the most money hungry capitalists on the planet. And they will destroy whats left of this planet if that's what it takes to get all the wealth.
The Chinese are coming... and not just to Ecuador. I
In major US cities, they buy off prime real estate with waddles of cash, pushing up prices and effectively muscling the middle class out of nice neighborhoods. A new form of colonialism?
In major US cities, they buy off prime real estate with waddles of cash, pushing up prices and effectively muscling the middle class out of nice neighborhoods. A new form of colonialism?
71
Seems some of our hedge funds are doing the same thing....buying up single family homes and pushing up prices effectively driving up prices so middle class can no longer afford a home.
and all the investment money is made possible by us and our addiction to china's multi-colored plastic stuff that has put our own workforce on the unemployment lines. what's wrong with us? do we not see what out consumption addiction is doing to all of humanity and the earth itself?
51
The new world order: the U.S. sends troops all over the world to make it safe for China to make money. Can't we at least get a service-discount on the crap we import from them?
219
How about us not importing even more cheap toxic stuff that we don't need from China, buy US products and support our economy. China will simply continue to buy land and resources from poor countries and take it for themselves….since they are destroying their own environment at home they will need to emigrate and continue their search for materials & resources to feed their endless needs. Let's look at the Chinese human right's record too.
As far as the dream of Nixon-Kissinger goes, did they really do the USA a favor by opening up trade w/ China? it seems to have hurt our manufacturing base tremendously, nearly destroying it….Nixon & Kissinger are no American heroes, more like criminals then men to be respected & honored.
As far as the dream of Nixon-Kissinger goes, did they really do the USA a favor by opening up trade w/ China? it seems to have hurt our manufacturing base tremendously, nearly destroying it….Nixon & Kissinger are no American heroes, more like criminals then men to be respected & honored.
3
And that is what Washington doesn't understand. China, has been ridding on the coattail of this country for ages. Thanks for such an insightful comment, Stu.
1
You mean American firms don't make any money out of those armed interventions? Why! the nerve!
What is the "lending-takeover" procedure in China? Does the government give BIG loans to their BIG companies who then exploit/own the natural resources in Ecuador and other countries they are taking over with economic strangulation? Sounds like the western "financial market" model to me where average taxpayers around the world pay for the exploits and power struggles of the financial elite. Sounds like Germany/Greece. Sounds like history and like we had all better learn to speak Chinese.
27
Sounds like the good ol' USA to me! Economic hegemony.
1
In the 80s , we were told we'd better learn to speak Japanese, and I know some people who did learn the language. I wonder how they're doing now?
2
I think that becoming fluent in a second language (or third) is an excellent idea for anyone. I'm sure that the 300 million Chinese who already speak English with at least some fluency would agree.
Nonetheless, Hitler's conquest of most European capitals in 1940s was followed by dire warnings that everyone had "better learn to speak German." After Sputnik in the 1950s, the chorus became that we'd "better learn to speak Russian." (I'm reminded of the top scientist who was asked at a press conference in the 1950s what he expected to find on the moon. "Russians," was his laconic reply.)
In the 1980s, the refrain was that we'd "better learn to speak Japanese." Yet the in the 1990s, after decades of a breakneck expansion, the Japanese economy slowed considerably. Manufacturing moved out of the country, as the percentage of retirees began to rise sharply due to a greying population, limiting growth.
There are strong indications the same thing is happening in China. A recent WSJ article noted the country is posting its slowest growth in 24 years, and most economists agree that this reduction in growth capacity is permanent, as it was for Japan and the United States.
I don't think that relative decline is such a bad thing. In 1860, the UK bestrode the world amid dire poverty and high rates of illiteracy in its cities. It's a middling power now, but I'll take LED TVs, air conditioning, and anti-cancer treatments over raw national power anytime.
Nonetheless, Hitler's conquest of most European capitals in 1940s was followed by dire warnings that everyone had "better learn to speak German." After Sputnik in the 1950s, the chorus became that we'd "better learn to speak Russian." (I'm reminded of the top scientist who was asked at a press conference in the 1950s what he expected to find on the moon. "Russians," was his laconic reply.)
In the 1980s, the refrain was that we'd "better learn to speak Japanese." Yet the in the 1990s, after decades of a breakneck expansion, the Japanese economy slowed considerably. Manufacturing moved out of the country, as the percentage of retirees began to rise sharply due to a greying population, limiting growth.
There are strong indications the same thing is happening in China. A recent WSJ article noted the country is posting its slowest growth in 24 years, and most economists agree that this reduction in growth capacity is permanent, as it was for Japan and the United States.
I don't think that relative decline is such a bad thing. In 1860, the UK bestrode the world amid dire poverty and high rates of illiteracy in its cities. It's a middling power now, but I'll take LED TVs, air conditioning, and anti-cancer treatments over raw national power anytime.
6